Author Topic: It took six grueling hours navigating the 30-odd-mile ship channel to dock...  (Read 6243 times)

Rollin

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http://news.yahoo.com/cruise-ship-docks-5-days-without-power-085434960.html

Six grueling hours makes me think of the movie African Queen where Humphrey Bogart litterally pulled the boat through the water, coming out with all those gross leeches all over his body.

"During their journey down the river, Charlie, Rose and the African Queen encounter many obstacles, including the German fort and three sets of rapids. The first set of rapids is rather easy; they get through with minimal flooding in the boat. But Rose and Charlie have to duck down when they pass the fortress and the soldiers begin shooting at them, blowing two bullet holes in the top of the boiler and causing one of the steam pressure hoses to disconnect from the boiler, which in turn, causes the boat's engine to stop running. Luckily, Charlie manages to reattach the hose to the boiler just as they are about to enter the second set of rapids. The boat rolls and pitches crazily as it goes down the rapids, leading to more severe flooding in the boat and also collapsing the stern canopy."

"All appears lost when Charlie and Rose "lose the channel" and the boat becomes mired in the mud amid dense reeds near the mouth of the river. First, they try to tow the boat through the muck, only to have Charlie come out of the water covered with leeches. All their efforts to free the African Queen fail. With no supplies left and short of potable water, Rose and a feverish Charlie turn in, convinced they have no hope of survival. Before going to sleep Rose prays that she and Charlie be admitted into Heaven. As they sleep, exhausted and beaten, heavy rains raise the river's level and float the Queen off of the mud and into the lake which, it turns out, is just a short distance from their location. Once on the lake, they narrowly avoid being spotted by the Louisa."
credit to Wikipedia

I'm still new to this forum and my understanding in each forum is not quite up to speed as yet.  So, this post may not qualify as Anitmustachian, but I think I can relate it to the idea of appreciating the good things in life, using some pretty extreme words and phrases to describe something that doesn't appear to be extreme, etc.

After reading about the ordeal that some of the passengers described it made me wonder if they apprecaiate what they have back at home (onshore).  Do they have a greater appreciation now?  If so, how long might that new appreciation for their normal life last?  Often times it takes hardship for someone to see that what they have in their normal life is pretty darn good.  I suspect that if the passengers can afford a cruise they have it very good at home.  Of course, everything is relative too.

Six days without power sounds like a pretty cool camping trip, but I guess that Ipads, cell phones, smartstuff would eventually die (didn't bring a solar charger) and they wouldn't know what to do with themselves.  (insert sarcasm)

"It was horrible, just horrible"
"I want a hot shower and a daggum Whataburger,"  - sounds like she really appreciates those two simple things.
"I just can't wait to be home," she said. - another note towards appreciation here?
"I'm feeling awesome just to see land and buildings,"  - another.
...some passengers passed the time by forming a Bible study group. "It was awesome," he said. "It lifted up our souls and gave us hope that we would get back." - another way to cope.

So how do you view this event through the eyes of a Mustashian?  Might you see this differently?

GuitarStv

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If I was on the cruise ship, this is what my response would be:

"We got full refunds of our vacation price, and a cool story to tell people!  Sweet!"

Daley

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Personally, I'd be rather hesitant to talk much smack about the people coming off the Triumph. The thing to remember is that they were stranded on that ship five days without power on a vessel that ceases to do anything without power. When the plumbing shut down, it wasn't just the sewage, they lost potable water at the same time. They were thousands in the sub-tropical heat of the Gulf of Mexico in a giant tin can city that couldn't even circulate fresh air to any part of the ship that was enclosed, which was most of it, and most of the food spoiled. Five days trapped.

Could you say something about how wanton consumerism and wasteful spending led them to take what many feel to be a stupid vacation for the money? Yeah. Could you express judgment over people in hopes that they learn to appreciate the simpler things in life? Perhaps, but it's a bit tacky. However, I do think that hidden within this story is something truly worthwhile of the Antimustachian Wall of Shame and Comedy, but it's not the passengers ordeal... it's Carnival Cruise Lines.

Quote
Carnival has canceled a dozen more planned voyages aboard the Triumph and acknowledged the crippled ship had been plagued by other mechanical problems in the weeks before the engine-room blaze. The National Transportation Safety Board has opened an investigation.

Passengers were supposed to get a full refund and discounts on future cruises, and Carnival announced Wednesday they would each get an additional $500 in compensation.

Carnival knew about problems and didn't spend the money necessary to fix it. I also read in an article elsewhere (that I can't cite at the moment as I can't locate it) that they didn't evacuate the ship due to "liability" issues and concerns over litigation, and didn't bother even sending any aide packages onboard during the trip either. They opted to leave these people stranded on the ship in a city-sized porta-potty baking in the sun for five days in an effort to potentially save money by avoiding any potential physical injury situations.

Carnival is demonstrating that they care more about their profit margin than they do about the safety and wellbeing of their customers, which is shameful and horribly un-mustachian IMHO. The lesson here is don't be cheap where it counts. Fix and maintain what you own properly, especially if it's a public facing service, and damn the lawyers. If you're at fault, you should do what it takes to do the right thing. Some risk is for the better.

Nords

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So how do you view this event through the eyes of a Mustashian?  Might you see this differently?
I predict two types of responses:
1.  "Hey, I made it through this last week with almost nothing.  I wonder if I could try a few of these tactics at home and see how much money they'd save us?"

2.  "Oh, that was awful, and we haven't had our real vacation yet, but we got our money back so we can spend it on a new vacation!  But first I need to go shopping-- I've had a hard week and I deserve to spend a little more on myself!"

At least when I was having these Carnival-class experiences in the military, I was getting paid to learn the lessons.

the fixer

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I just came over here to look for a thread about this, so I agree it's antimustachian. The real problem is people have such a low threshold for hardship and have a kneejerk, counterproductive reflex for complaining as soon as things get bad.

I have some idea of what they went through. In DC last year we had a derecho come through that knocked out power for most of a week. I was out of town at the time, and by the time we got home most of our food was spoiled. I saw it as an adventure and a challenge to figure out how to get by as best I could each day, and a welcome change from normal routine. After we got power back I appreciated it much more, but also recognized how excessive it is to have too many lights on in the house at once.

Our plumbing was working during the derecho, but I've also been mountaineering where you have to poop in a bag and carry it out with you. It's kinda disgusting but you quickly get used to it.

These people have quite simply forgotten that life is fundamentally about survival, because of a Wall-E-esque world where we can expect all our basic needs to just magically get met for us.

Bill76

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As an engineer, I'm surprised that these ships operate on a single power plant with no significant redundancy.  The engines on cruise ships are essentially just diesel driven electric generators.  The propulsion system converts electricity back to mechanical energy to move the ship.  This is a less efficient means of propulsion, but it makes sense for cruise ships (as opposed to cargo ships), since a large fraction of the energy is used to run the floating-city aspect of the ship, rather than for propulsion.

If I were designing these ships, I'd have (at least) two power plants, physically separated to prevent a single failure from taking down the whole ship.  Either one would independentally capable of propelling the ship (at reduced speed) and maintaining essential functions (lighting, water/sewage treatment, food service).  The casinos, theaters, spas, etc. could go dark if operating on only one power plant, but the ship would at least stay mobile, sanitary, and safe.

Of course, my ship would cost more, so Carnival and the other big cruise operators would never buy it...

Rollin

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Could you say something about how wanton consumerism and wasteful spending led them to take what many feel to be a stupid vacation for the money? Yeah. Could you express judgment over people in hopes that they learn to appreciate the simpler things in life? Perhaps, but it's a bit tacky. However, I do think that hidden within this story is something truly worthwhile of the Antimustachian Wall of Shame and Comedy, but it's not the passengers ordeal... it's Carnival Cruise Lines.

Agreed on the potential for tackyness.  When getting judgemental I often feel like it can be seen as crossing a line, but that does also seem to be the jist of this sub-forum (within reason of course).  Next thing I know is that what I thought was a personal hardship the last time gets one-upped and I'll regret commenting!

You cite Carnival Cruise Lines as the true receiver of judgement.  I would tend to agree and just by looking at the ship I shake my head and wonder how something so hugh and gaudy can travel in what is an extremely harsh and unforgiving environment.

As to fixer I really agree about our low threshold for hardship and quick jump to complaining.  That is propbably a more accurate reason as to why I brought this item to the forum.  I look around and listen - if the office temperature is a few degrees warmer or colder than normal, I hear its "freezing" or "sweltering."  Someone across the hall is talking loader than most and I hear "they are soooo rude."  If someone has to wait 2 minutes and 30 seconds at a traffic signal it's a "horrible waste of time."  Reminds me of this great skit - "Everything is amazing and nobody is happy" :

http://www.dailymotion.com/video/x8m5d0_everything-is-amazing-and-nobody-i_fun

Daley

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As to fixer I really agree about our low threshold for hardship and quick jump to complaining.  That is propbably a more accurate reason as to why I brought this item to the forum.

Oh, I absolutely agree that people in the first world have an incredibly low threshold for hardship, but I think it can kind of pass in this instance.

Let's be honest here, how many of us honestly think we could go through five days completely unflapped locked inside a broken 4000-person porta-potty cooking in the baking sun with barely enough food and drink to keep us alive. There's hardship and then there's FUBAR. This is a situation where I'd think even the "slumdogs" in India would cringe in a bit of horror and sympathy.

I've dealt with real hardship before, and I'll be the first to admit that disgruntled and demoralized would be an understatement for me if I came out of that boat.

KGZotU

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Could you say something about how wanton consumerism and wasteful spending led them to take what many feel to be a stupid vacation for the money? Yeah. Could you express judgment over people in hopes that they learn to appreciate the simpler things in life? Perhaps, but it's a bit tacky. However, I do think that hidden within this story is something truly worthwhile of the Antimustachian Wall of Shame and Comedy, but it's not the passengers ordeal... it's Carnival Cruise Lines.

Agreed on the potential for tackyness.  When getting judgemental I often feel like it can be seen as crossing a line, but that does also seem to be the jist of this sub-forum (within reason of course).

As I see it there is nothing inherently bad about taking a cruise, and there is nothing inherently bad about complaining about hardship.

It's OK to spend money on luxury. It can be valid for another person to spend money on any particular luxury, whether or not you and I appreciate that luxury.

I don't mind camping. I don't mind pooping in a hole. I lose electricity at home frequently and it's fine. When I lose water supply I start to get nervous, but I can pack snow and things will be OK.

When I lose sewage I begin to get uncomfortable. Now, under the best circumstances, I am operating a honey bucket out of my home. If I have neither sewage nor electricity then I'm either carrying my honey bucket to the sidewalk or having to just guess when enough wiping is enough. I don't think there's anything unusual about complaining about circumstances like those.
« Last Edit: February 15, 2013, 08:03:28 PM by KGZotU »

Rollin

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"It was awesome," he said. "It lifted up our souls and gave us hope that we would get back."

http://news.yahoo.com/cruise-passengers-became-comrades-trip-home-211713112.html

Starting to see this with some meaning (at least as I read on).  If the trip had gone as planned these people may not even talked with each other, but now they are friends and have had a pretty challenging experience that they lived to tell about and have probably benefited from (not being judgmental, but pointing out the possibilities).  Sounds odd, but they may have been blessed by having such an experience.  Might allow them to live a full and more appreciative life.  I know that assumes that they don't already.


Nords

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... but now they are friends and have had a pretty challenging experience that they lived to tell about and have probably benefited from (not being judgmental, but pointing out the possibilities).  Sounds odd, but they may have been blessed by having such an experience.  Might allow them to live a full and more appreciative life.
That could also be described as "shared misery" or even "hostage syndrome".

We have the same experiences in the U.S. military, including the Naval Academy and the submarine force.  It's not always a bad thing, but I doubt that they'll be gathering for reunions.

Jaherman99

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I'm surprised there's only one engine also.  It's so basic to have two for safety reasons that it never occurred to me that they would have only one.  Maybe after you get past 1 gazillion horsepower it gets prohibitively expensive.   

Daley

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I'm surprised there's only one engine also.  It's so basic to have two for safety reasons that it never occurred to me that they would have only one.  Maybe after you get past 1 gazillion horsepower it gets prohibitively expensive.

I'm hardly an expert on maritime law, but this amongst a litany of other reasons is probably why Carnival flags their ships to Panama instead of the United States. Redundancy costs extra money, and likely US law requires as much, amongst other things. Why spend the money to do it right if you can just base your operations out of a country that doesn't have those costly and strict regulations about safety, work conditions, legal accountability, etc. etc. and allows you to cut corners like that?

http://www.cruiseresearch.org/Legal%20Issues%20Relevant%20to%20Cruise%20Ships.html

GuitarStv

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Seriously guys . . . they got their money back.  They got extra money too.  They got a kinda cool story to tell.  They did lose about a week of vacation . . . but they're closer to financial independence with the money they got back.  They have a greater appreciation for what they've already got.  Where is the horror in this story?

Nords

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Seriously guys . . . they got their money back.  They got extra money too.  They got a kinda cool story to tell.  They did lose about a week of vacation . . . but they're closer to financial independence with the money they got back.  They have a greater appreciation for what they've already got.  Where is the horror in this story?
The pictorial version of this comment is currently making its rounds on Facebook's military pages:

venkol

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I'm surprised there's only one engine also.  It's so basic to have two for safety reasons that it never occurred to me that they would have only one.  Maybe after you get past 1 gazillion horsepower it gets prohibitively expensive.

I'm hardly an expert on maritime law, but this amongst a litany of other reasons is probably why Carnival flags their ships to Panama instead of the United States. Redundancy costs extra money, and likely US law requires as much, amongst other things. Why spend the money to do it right if you can just base your operations out of a country that doesn't have those costly and strict regulations about safety, work conditions, legal accountability, etc. etc. and allows you to cut corners like that?

http://www.cruiseresearch.org/Legal%20Issues%20Relevant%20to%20Cruise%20Ships.html

Pardon the pun, but Carnival is a shit company known for cutting basic safety corners and hoping for the best.  If you want to go on a cruise, never go on Carnival.