Author Topic: High School Student sues parents for College Tuition  (Read 34865 times)

thepokercab

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jba302

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Re: High School Student sues parents for College Tuition
« Reply #1 on: March 04, 2014, 09:56:08 AM »
It says there's an outstanding balance on her high school tuition. It's reasonable that the parents need to pay that part according to my hand-waving knowledge of contract law. Other than that, holy crap is this child a brat.

Nords

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Re: High School Student sues parents for College Tuition
« Reply #2 on: March 04, 2014, 10:04:28 AM »
It sounds as if she's emancipated now!

This experience should make a great college-application essay.  Maybe she'll be inspired to apply to law school, too.

tariskat

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Re: High School Student sues parents for College Tuition
« Reply #3 on: March 04, 2014, 10:55:20 AM »
She was emancipated the second she turned 18 in the USA.  I don't get how she can say she must still depend on her folks; 18 = adult = go get a job.

MgoSam

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Re: High School Student sues parents for College Tuition
« Reply #4 on: March 04, 2014, 12:01:19 PM »
I suspect there is far more to this story. What I am curious about is how her best friend's family is thinking that it would be wise to front her legal expenses. Other than that I can't think of any reason that the family should be obligated to pay a dime in any college or post-18 living expenses. High school tuition likely is on the family, but I don't know.

No Name Guy

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Re: High School Student sues parents for College Tuition
« Reply #5 on: March 04, 2014, 12:41:14 PM »
In the article I read it said her PRIVATE high school wasn't going to ding her for the remainder of the year.  That said, she could always go to PUBLIC high school to finish off.

Oh....and what's with the continued infantalization of what used to be considered adults in this country?  She's 18 - her parents are perfectly within their rights to put a boot to her ass for what ever reason they choose....or no reason at all.  And there is zero obligation of parents to fund a child's education once they hit 18.  Just like there is zero obligation for a child to care for a parent in their dotage.

I'll add that with her piss poor entitled attitude - she DESERVED to get a boot to her ass.


Gin1984

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Re: High School Student sues parents for College Tuition
« Reply #6 on: March 04, 2014, 01:31:27 PM »
In the article I read it said her PRIVATE high school wasn't going to ding her for the remainder of the year.  That said, she could always go to PUBLIC high school to finish off.

Oh....and what's with the continued infantalization of what used to be considered adults in this country?  She's 18 - her parents are perfectly within their rights to put a boot to her ass for what ever reason they choose....or no reason at all.  And there is zero obligation of parents to fund a child's education once they hit 18.  Just like there is zero obligation for a child to care for a parent in their dotage.

I'll add that with her piss poor entitled attitude - she DESERVED to get a boot to her ass.
The parents signed a contract with the private school for that year and they owe the school over five thousand dollars.

Kriegsspiel

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Re: High School Student sues parents for College Tuition
« Reply #7 on: March 04, 2014, 05:29:36 PM »


Someone, start a kickstarter for this poor girl to get back into a Catholic schoolgirls uniform!

MDM

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Re: High School Student sues parents for College Tuition
« Reply #8 on: March 04, 2014, 05:46:43 PM »
Don't know enough to venture specifics on this particular he-said-she-said, but for those of you who haven't had kids reach 18: colleges very much expect "parental support" in financial aid decisions.  Simultaneously, however, the same college will say "the student is an adult so you as parents have no right to any of their information unless the student allows it."

Part of the situation may not be the college's fault (e.g. HIPAA rules for medical issues - another topic) but as a parent the dichotomy between "you need to pay" vs. "you have no right to information" is striking.

Fortunately our kids have always been pragmatic enough to keep us informed while they were still legally our dependents, so it hasn't been an issue for us.  Doesn't take much imagination though to see how it could be.

Gin1984

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Re: High School Student sues parents for College Tuition
« Reply #9 on: March 04, 2014, 06:21:56 PM »
She was emancipated the second she turned 18 in the USA.  I don't get how she can say she must still depend on her folks; 18 = adult = go get a job.
Not in all states.  Some are 18 AND high school degree/GED.  NJ very well may be among them.  I know there is one state in the south where it is 19, even though, yes you can vote at 18.

sheepstache

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Re: High School Student sues parents for College Tuition
« Reply #10 on: March 04, 2014, 06:41:41 PM »
http://www.finaid.org/otheraid/parentsrefuse.phtml
Wow!  The attitude on this page is really eye-opening.

I particularly like the part about how you should do everything possible to be on good terms with your parents in order to get them to pay for college because deep down you love each other, unless they're tax evaders in which case you should turn them in for the reward.

More info on the independence/dependence qualification:
Quote
Independent Student Status

The Federal requirements for independent student status changed in 1992. Since then, the student must satisfy at least one of the following criteria to be considered independent:

The student is 24 year of age or older by December 31 of the award year.
The student is an orphan or ward of the court or was a ward of the court until the student reached the age of 18.
The student is a veteran of the Armed Forces of the United States.
The student is a graduate or professional student.
The student is married.
The student has legal dependents other than a spouse. (Dependent means receiving more than half the individual's support from the student.)
If the student doesn't satisfy any of these requirements, then the student is automatically a dependent student.

I mean, I kind of get it?  Like, the difference between how much you're expected to contribute with and without parents is enormous.  Why should families willing to contribute get so much less aid than another family that simply refuses to fill out the fafsa, possibly purely for financial gain?  Most schools have needs-blind admissions and if a lot of people took this option, the schools would have to radically change something.  I mean, I think that would be a good thing in the long run, I'm just saying I see in the short term why the rules against declaring someone independent would be so narrow.  But, again, wow, I had not realized how much this was considered a "right."  How odd that the government considers parents obligated to "children" to enormous lengths if they are college-bound but not otherwise.

Ha ha, this reminds me of an acquaintance who learned in college that her parents were divorced.  They still lived together and everything, they had just figured out that being legally divorced would make college cheaper, so it was purely a matter of paperwork.

Tyler

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Re: High School Student sues parents for College Tuition
« Reply #11 on: March 04, 2014, 08:16:44 PM »
http://www.finaid.org/otheraid/parentsrefuse.phtml
Wow!  The attitude on this page is really eye-opening.

Holy cow.  That's depressing.  A few of my favorite quotes:

Quote
"Sometimes the parents refuse to complete the financial aid application because they don't pay their income taxes or are a tax protester."

"Remind them that even if they hate you, your future is at stake, and not graduating from college will have serious consequences for you. Remind them that one day you hope to get married and have children, and that by refusing to pay for your education, they are not only hurting you, but their future grandchildren."

"If your parents are religious, quote scripture at them."

"Then lay out all your finances in front of them. Show them how much money you have and can earn, demonstrating that you're doing what you can to cover the costs, show them how much it will cost and the size of the gap. Make it clear to them that if they don't help fill that gap, you won't be able to complete your education, no matter how hard you try."


Regarding that last point, I have another idea -- maybe schools can reduce their tuition to rates that students can actually afford.




Gin1984

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Re: High School Student sues parents for College Tuition
« Reply #12 on: March 04, 2014, 08:25:09 PM »
http://www.finaid.org/otheraid/parentsrefuse.phtml
Wow!  The attitude on this page is really eye-opening.

Holy cow.  That's depressing.  A few of my favorite quotes:

Quote
"Sometimes the parents refuse to complete the financial aid application because they don't pay their income taxes or are a tax protester."

"Remind them that even if they hate you, your future is at stake, and not graduating from college will have serious consequences for you. Remind them that one day you hope to get married and have children, and that by refusing to pay for your education, they are not only hurting you, but their future grandchildren."

"If your parents are religious, quote scripture at them."

"Then lay out all your finances in front of them. Show them how much money you have and can earn, demonstrating that you're doing what you can to cover the costs, show them how much it will cost and the size of the gap. Make it clear to them that if they don't help fill that gap, you won't be able to complete your education, no matter how hard you try."


Regarding that last point, I have another idea -- maybe schools can reduce their tuition to rates that students can actually afford.
It used to be that you could not even get merit award, or unsubsidized loans without your parent's signature on the FAFSA.  Oh, unless you could prove abuse.  Do you know how hard it is to prove abuse to financial aid people, you know, people who have no training in it what so ever? 
I lost a full ride because my mother decided that she would not sign the FAFSA if I went away to college (I was 17 at that time), but then the next year she got mad because I "bothered" her too much about it (so I could make the deadline for certain merit awards) and decided not to fill it out that.  Said she would fill it out the next year if I only told her once.  I followed her rules, and guess what she "forgot". 
We don't know what is going on in that house.  Personally, in my state, I was not able to sign up for public high school without a parent's signature.  And, deciding not to pay a contracted bill because your HONOR student is rebelling seems a bit over the top, especially if that means the child losing the AP classes she is in and possibly even the possibility of graduating on time (the schools have different requirements, even if they would let her in without parental consent).  That kind of reaction often comes with other behaviors in the home. 
Keep in mind, this kid has just turned 18, still in high school.  We were all young and dumb once.

SisterX

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Re: High School Student sues parents for College Tuition
« Reply #13 on: March 04, 2014, 08:33:52 PM »
Regarding that last point, I have another idea -- maybe schools can reduce their tuition to rates that students can actually afford.

As someone who works for a U, don't blame the schools please.  It's the state governments who are refusing to fund education.  I know in my state they're blaming falling oil tax revenues.  But the oil taxes are falling because the governor pushed through billions of dollars in tax breaks for the oil companies.  So the U is having to cut costs in every way possible, because the governor is an ass who used to lobby for the oil companies.  Our chancellor is trying really, really hard to raise tuition as little as possible, and our school is still a better deal than most (even for out-of-state students sometimes) but it's sort of inevitable when the state legislature won't fucking pay for education.

This is driving me crazy right now, sorry.
« Last Edit: March 06, 2014, 10:14:08 AM by Sparafusile »

Jamesqf

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Re: High School Student sues parents for College Tuition
« Reply #14 on: March 04, 2014, 10:19:31 PM »
It used to be that you could not even get merit award, or unsubsidized loans without your parent's signature on the FAFSA.

Been there.  One of the reasons I did time in the military. 

Quote
We don't know what is going on in that house.

Yeah.  From the article, they certainly appear to be rather over-controlling parents at best.  Trying to tell your kid who they can't date, for instance.  All else aside, psychologically it's pretty near certain that trying to forbid a relationship will actually make a teenager hold on to it.

tariskat

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Re: High School Student sues parents for College Tuition
« Reply #15 on: March 04, 2014, 10:27:30 PM »
She was emancipated the second she turned 18 in the USA.  I don't get how she can say she must still depend on her folks; 18 = adult = go get a job.
Not in all states.  Some are 18 AND high school degree/GED.  NJ very well may be among them.  I know there is one state in the south where it is 19, even though, yes you can vote at 18.

No kidding!  Didn't realize it, thanks.  Perhaps that's part of why the kid's friend's family feels comfortable backing her.

JamesAt15

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Re: High School Student sues parents for College Tuition
« Reply #16 on: March 05, 2014, 12:00:25 AM »
This item really troubles me for a number of reasons.

I did a quick google for NJ child emancipation age, and found this link.

http://www.divorcenet.com/states/new_jersey/emancipation_of_a_minor_child_in_nj

Quote
Are Children Automatically Emancipated When They Turn 18?

No. Many people assume that turning 18 results in automatic emancipation. This is not so. There’s no set age that will trigger automatic emancipation in New Jersey.

Reaching the age of 18 provides the court with prima facie (Latin for “at first sight”) or presumptive proof of emancipation; but this presumption can be defeated with evidence that the 18-year-old child has not yet reached a truly independent status. For example, a court may not emancipate a child over the age of 18 if he or she is in still in college and relies on parental support, or if there is proof of a pre-existing disability that prevents a child over the age of 18 from gaining complete independence.

This seems to be why several of the articles suggest the case hinges on whether or not the girl left the house on her own, or was "thrown out". If she was thrown out, then she can claim she is still dependent on her parents and not emancipated. If she left on her own (stormed out after a big fight), it sounds like it will be easy for her parents to say that shows she demonstrated independent status.

I really, really hope her suit gets thrown out and she has to come to terms with the idea that her parents are not required to support her through university in the lifestyle to which she has become accustomed. Unfortunately it looks like the law might be such that it won't happen that way.

Are we really setting up our society (or New Jersey's society, anyways) where children can sue their parents to support them through college, well past 18? That's a scary thought. I'm a parent and my kids are still quite young, but naturally I want to support them and help them with university when they get to that age. That's something quite different from being legally required to, however!

Gin1984

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Re: High School Student sues parents for College Tuition
« Reply #17 on: March 05, 2014, 06:33:07 AM »
This item really troubles me for a number of reasons.

I did a quick google for NJ child emancipation age, and found this link.

http://www.divorcenet.com/states/new_jersey/emancipation_of_a_minor_child_in_nj

Quote
Are Children Automatically Emancipated When They Turn 18?

No. Many people assume that turning 18 results in automatic emancipation. This is not so. There’s no set age that will trigger automatic emancipation in New Jersey.

Reaching the age of 18 provides the court with prima facie (Latin for “at first sight”) or presumptive proof of emancipation; but this presumption can be defeated with evidence that the 18-year-old child has not yet reached a truly independent status. For example, a court may not emancipate a child over the age of 18 if he or she is in still in college and relies on parental support, or if there is proof of a pre-existing disability that prevents a child over the age of 18 from gaining complete independence.

This seems to be why several of the articles suggest the case hinges on whether or not the girl left the house on her own, or was "thrown out". If she was thrown out, then she can claim she is still dependent on her parents and not emancipated. If she left on her own (stormed out after a big fight), it sounds like it will be easy for her parents to say that shows she demonstrated independent status.

I really, really hope her suit gets thrown out and she has to come to terms with the idea that her parents are not required to support her through university in the lifestyle to which she has become accustomed. Unfortunately it looks like the law might be such that it won't happen that way.

Are we really setting up our society (or New Jersey's society, anyways) where children can sue their parents to support them through college, well past 18? That's a scary thought. I'm a parent and my kids are still quite young, but naturally I want to support them and help them with university when they get to that age. That's something quite different from being legally required to, however!
Well, the federal government requires you to get your parent's signature for financial aid and bases that aid off your parent's income, even if you are financially independent and can prove no aid from your parents as well as complete supporting yourself (as opposed to getting aid from some other source), until you are 24.  Many divorce documents require that the parents pay for college and often child support from 18-22 goes to the college student not the custodial parent during the school year (in many states).  We already have set our society this way.

mpbaker22

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Re: High School Student sues parents for College Tuition
« Reply #18 on: March 05, 2014, 07:05:24 AM »


Someone, start a kickstarter for this poor girl to get back into a Catholic schoolgirls uniform!

nothing says classy like sexual innuendo regarding a random 18 year old girl on the internet ...

sheepstache

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Re: High School Student sues parents for College Tuition
« Reply #19 on: March 05, 2014, 08:48:48 AM »
Are we really setting up our society (or New Jersey's society, anyways) where children can sue their parents to support them through college, well past 18? That's a scary thought. I'm a parent and my kids are still quite young, but naturally I want to support them and help them with university when they get to that age. That's something quite different from being legally required to, however!
Well, the federal government requires you to get your parent's signature for financial aid and bases that aid off your parent's income, even if you are financially independent and can prove no aid from your parents as well as complete supporting yourself (as opposed to getting aid from some other source), until you are 24.  Many divorce documents require that the parents pay for college and often child support from 18-22 goes to the college student not the custodial parent during the school year (in many states).  We already have set our society this way.

Well, when I was reading the link I posted I realized the distinction is this: Your parents aren't obligated to support you through college, but if you are going to college, they have to use their resources to help you before the government will help you.   The second thing is what you're saying, but the first thing is what the case is about, I think.

Hunny156

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Re: High School Student sues parents for College Tuition
« Reply #20 on: March 05, 2014, 10:39:15 AM »
Quote
We don't know what is going on in that house.

Yeah.  From the article, they certainly appear to be rather over-controlling parents at best.  Trying to tell your kid who they can't date, for instance.  All else aside, psychologically it's pretty near certain that trying to forbid a relationship will actually make a teenager hold on to it.

+100  It worked out for me in the end, but my parents going through vast efforts to keep me apart from my boyfriend (we were 19), enforced a super strong bond that resulted in marriage.  My parents cut me off financially, bribed me w/a car, bribed him w/$10K, moved further away.  None of it worked.  Almost 20 years later, I sometimes wonder if we would have gone our separate ways had they not been so controlling!

Gin1984

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Re: High School Student sues parents for College Tuition
« Reply #21 on: March 05, 2014, 11:24:33 AM »
Are we really setting up our society (or New Jersey's society, anyways) where children can sue their parents to support them through college, well past 18? That's a scary thought. I'm a parent and my kids are still quite young, but naturally I want to support them and help them with university when they get to that age. That's something quite different from being legally required to, however!
Well, the federal government requires you to get your parent's signature for financial aid and bases that aid off your parent's income, even if you are financially independent and can prove no aid from your parents as well as complete supporting yourself (as opposed to getting aid from some other source), until you are 24.  Many divorce documents require that the parents pay for college and often child support from 18-22 goes to the college student not the custodial parent during the school year (in many states).  We already have set our society this way.

Well, when I was reading the link I posted I realized the distinction is this: Your parents aren't obligated to support you through college, but if you are going to college, they have to use their resources to help you before the government will help you.   The second thing is what you're saying, but the first thing is what the case is about, I think.
Unless, of course, they are divorced (in some states) or (in fewer states) you can prove physical abuse.

CommonCents

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Re: High School Student sues parents for College Tuition
« Reply #22 on: March 05, 2014, 11:43:25 AM »
There's a distinction between supporting an 18 yo and supporting her in the manner she wants.  In my state, divorced parents are obligated to pay child support through age 23 if they are in higher education.  That doesn't mean they need to foot the bill for it, but they do need to keep paying to shelter/feed/clothe the kid. 

sheepstache

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Re: High School Student sues parents for College Tuition
« Reply #23 on: March 05, 2014, 11:55:19 AM »
On the page I read, step-parents are also obligated.

But, yeah, this seems weird that going to college turns you legally into a child.  Because parents, divorced parents, step-parents, etc., aren't expected to give support to a kid who wants to learn a trade or work or start a business right out of high school.  Of course, that might mean a direct transfer of wealth to an individual and not to an institution, so I can see why the government wouldn't be all over that. 

And while I get the reasoning, it seems weird that a divorced parent could be forced to support a kid up to 23, but not a still-married one.

No Name Guy

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Re: High School Student sues parents for College Tuition
« Reply #24 on: March 05, 2014, 01:16:46 PM »
I read another article on this - this woman wanted ~$625....a WEEK from her parents right away.  Ok...doing the math.....625 * 4 1/3 weeks in the average month = holy shit Batman, $2706 a month, or 32,500 / year.  More than what MMM spends on his whole family.

Oh....as to those that imply that somehow 18 isn't an adult, I'll observe:

1)  At 18, one signs up to vote without a parent being needed.
2)  At 18, one can buy a rifle or shotgun (and the ammo to go with it) without a parent.  One can also get a huntin' license as well.
3)  At 18, one can sign enlistment papers for the military without notice or permission of the parent and those papers can put said person on the front lines, machine gun in hand in under a year.
4)  At 18, one can get their own passport and travel the world without notice or permission of the parent.
5)  At 18, one can sign a will, power of attorney or other binding contracts or papers without permission of or notice to a parent or guardian.
6)  At 18 (yes, this is a sick one, but I mention it to show one is an adult on their 18th birthday and can do what is, IMO, stupid shit that has enormous, damaging consequences) one can go to "work" in the...ahem, adult entertainment business.
7)  At 18 one can permanently scar their body (tattoo or cosmetic surgery) without permission of or notice to their parent.

She's an adult.  Her parents obligations are done.  I'll say it again - at 18, it's every parents right to put a boot to their kids asses. 

I was smart...nay...I'll rephrase..... I wasn't so foolish as to piss off my parents when I turned 18 and was still living at home getting ready to go to college.  Their home, their money, their rules.  If I didn't like things, I could either suck it up and abide by them or pay my own way and set my own rules.  I chose to suck it up for the things I didn't care too much for (which wasn't all that much since my folks were quite reasonable) since it was, in the calculus, well worth it.

galliver

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Re: High School Student sues parents for College Tuition
« Reply #25 on: March 05, 2014, 01:32:43 PM »
Part of the situation may not be the college's fault (e.g. HIPAA rules for medical issues - another topic) but as a parent the dichotomy between "you need to pay" vs. "you have no right to information" is striking.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Family_Educational_Rights_and_Privacy_Act

mpbaker22

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Re: High School Student sues parents for College Tuition
« Reply #26 on: March 05, 2014, 01:51:46 PM »
On the page I read, step-parents are also obligated.

But, yeah, this seems weird that going to college turns you legally into a child.  Because parents, divorced parents, step-parents, etc., aren't expected to give support to a kid who wants to learn a trade or work or start a business right out of high school.  Of course, that might mean a direct transfer of wealth to an individual and not to an institution, so I can see why the government wouldn't be all over that. 

And while I get the reasoning, it seems weird that a divorced parent could be forced to support a kid up to 23, but not a still-married one.

At least in some states, the 'goal' is to keep the living situation similar to pre-divorce.  If there's legitimate reason to believe the parents would have paid for college before divorce, this is basically in place to prevent one parent from deciding college isn't something they want to pay for.

kyleaaa

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Re: High School Student sues parents for College Tuition
« Reply #27 on: March 05, 2014, 01:57:21 PM »
She was emancipated the second she turned 18 in the USA.  I don't get how she can say she must still depend on her folks; 18 = adult = go get a job.

This is not true. It differs by state, but there's a LOT more to it than that.

Gin1984

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Re: High School Student sues parents for College Tuition
« Reply #28 on: March 05, 2014, 02:49:26 PM »
I read another article on this - this woman wanted ~$625....a WEEK from her parents right away.  Ok...doing the math.....625 * 4 1/3 weeks in the average month = holy shit Batman, $2706 a month, or 32,500 / year.  More than what MMM spends on his whole family.

Oh....as to those that imply that somehow 18 isn't an adult, I'll observe:

1)  At 18, one signs up to vote without a parent being needed.
2)  At 18, one can buy a rifle or shotgun (and the ammo to go with it) without a parent.  One can also get a huntin' license as well.
3)  At 18, one can sign enlistment papers for the military without notice or permission of the parent and those papers can put said person on the front lines, machine gun in hand in under a year.
4)  At 18, one can get their own passport and travel the world without notice or permission of the parent.
5)  At 18, one can sign a will, power of attorney or other binding contracts or papers without permission of or notice to a parent or guardian.
6)  At 18 (yes, this is a sick one, but I mention it to show one is an adult on their 18th birthday and can do what is, IMO, stupid shit that has enormous, damaging consequences) one can go to "work" in the...ahem, adult entertainment business.
7)  At 18 one can permanently scar their body (tattoo or cosmetic surgery) without permission of or notice to their parent.

She's an adult.  Her parents obligations are done.  I'll say it again - at 18, it's every parents right to put a boot to their kids asses. 

I was smart...nay...I'll rephrase..... I wasn't so foolish as to piss off my parents when I turned 18 and was still living at home getting ready to go to college.  Their home, their money, their rules.  If I didn't like things, I could either suck it up and abide by them or pay my own way and set my own rules.  I chose to suck it up for the things I didn't care too much for (which wasn't all that much since my folks were quite reasonable) since it was, in the calculus, well worth it.
You can actually do that at 17, as long as you are graduated prior to leaving for boot camp.  And other than #1 and #4, they are not always true, depending on which state you are in.

MDM

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Re: High School Student sues parents for College Tuition
« Reply #29 on: March 05, 2014, 03:02:22 PM »
Part of the situation may not be the college's fault (e.g. HIPAA rules for medical issues - another topic) but as a parent the dichotomy between "you need to pay" vs. "you have no right to information" is striking.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Family_Educational_Rights_and_Privacy_Act

Good add galliver.  Another discussion that addresses aspects of both HIPAA and FERPA and how they can affect colleges (and students) is http://ispub.com/IJLHE/6/2/3751.

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Re: High School Student sues parents for College Tuition
« Reply #30 on: March 05, 2014, 05:14:06 PM »


Someone, start a kickstarter for this poor girl to get back into a Catholic schoolgirls uniform!

nothing says classy like sexual innuendo regarding a random 18 year old girl on the internet ...

Consider me schooled.

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Re: High School Student sues parents for College Tuition
« Reply #31 on: March 05, 2014, 06:17:04 PM »
Initial ruling: Parents don't have to pay.

http://gawker.com/parents-wont-have-to-give-allowance-to-the-daughter-wh-1536906243

They're due back in court in April to figure out if she's emancapated or not.
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Re: High School Student sues parents for College Tuition
« Reply #32 on: March 05, 2014, 06:37:28 PM »
It used to be that you could not even get merit award, or unsubsidized loans without your parent's signature on the FAFSA.

Been there.  One of the reasons I did time in the military. 

Quote
We don't know what is going on in that house.

Yeah.  From the article, they certainly appear to be rather over-controlling parents at best.  Trying to tell your kid who they can't date, for instance.  All else aside, psychologically it's pretty near certain that trying to forbid a relationship will actually make a teenager hold on to it.

I don't see them as over controlling. They are great parents in my view. That's why you are a parent; to keep your stupid teenager from making mistakes that could ruin her life.  Any parent that does not monitor and attempt to change their children's bad/destructive decisions, particularly a teenage, does not deserve to be a parent.  I am not suggesting that a parent becomes intrusive; I am, however, suggesting that if an otherwise good parent thinks that a child is going down the wrong part by hanging out with the wrong people, picking an abusive mate, taking drugs, etc, they should take drastic actions if the child refuses to listen to reason.  With the little information we know, I don't think anyone of us knows all the details. Who knows; the daughter may have been dating an abusive drug addict.

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Re: High School Student sues parents for College Tuition
« Reply #33 on: March 05, 2014, 07:06:52 PM »
Quote
We don't know what is going on in that house.

Yeah.  From the article, they certainly appear to be rather over-controlling parents at best.  Trying to tell your kid who they can't date, for instance.  All else aside, psychologically it's pretty near certain that trying to forbid a relationship will actually make a teenager hold on to it.

+100  It worked out for me in the end, but my parents going through vast efforts to keep me apart from my boyfriend (we were 19), enforced a super strong bond that resulted in marriage.  My parents cut me off financially, bribed me w/a car, bribed him w/$10K, moved further away.  None of it worked.  Almost 20 years later, I sometimes wonder if we would have gone our separate ways had they not been so controlling!

Pretty much would happen.

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Re: High School Student sues parents for College Tuition
« Reply #34 on: March 05, 2014, 07:20:48 PM »

And while I get the reasoning, it seems weird that a divorced parent could be forced to support a kid up to 23, but not a still-married one.

At least in some states, the 'goal' is to keep the living situation similar to pre-divorce.  If there's legitimate reason to believe the parents would have paid for college before divorce, this is basically in place to prevent one parent from deciding college isn't something they want to pay for.

Right, like I said, I get the reasoning.  But if the parents are still married, they can suddenly choose not to pay for whatever reason.  So it just seems like an odd result, that the parents have greater liability after divorce than before.

Maybe I'm assuming it's over-simplified.  Maybe if the parent loses their job or their health or something the court decides that's a legitimate reason that might cause them to decide not to pay even without the divorce and let them off the hook.  Or some other chaotic, financially-draining event in their life.  Like, say, divorce.

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Re: High School Student sues parents for College Tuition
« Reply #35 on: March 05, 2014, 09:14:11 PM »
I wonder how much she is being influenced by her friend's father. She is staying with a friend whose father happens to be a lawyer. Who better to know the legalities of emancipation in NJ but a NJ lawyer?  This family is helping fund her case as well.

I just hope she isn't being manipulated here.

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Re: High School Student sues parents for College Tuition
« Reply #36 on: March 06, 2014, 01:22:50 AM »
Initial ruling: Parents don't have to pay.

http://gawker.com/parents-wont-have-to-give-allowance-to-the-daughter-wh-1536906243

They're due back in court in April to figure out if she's emancapated or not.

This seems good so far.

I wonder if the parties involved will sort something out before April 22 (I think it was). Since it seems unlikely the daughter is going to get her allowance/expenses/legal fees, there's really just the question of the college fund, which I believe the parents have said they're not going to try to keep from her.

The daughter's lawyer is probably not going to be too keen to push this much more if his fees aren't going to be covered. And the daughter is probably finding out that she's not coming across in the NATION-WIDE MEDIA COVERAGE as well as she was thinking she would.

I read in one article that the daughter's school is waiving her tuition fees for the rest of the school year, since she's an honor student, cheerleader, etc. They probably figure it's in their PR interest to stay as far away from this trainwreck as possible.

JamesAt15

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Re: High School Student sues parents for College Tuition
« Reply #37 on: March 06, 2014, 01:26:29 AM »
I wonder how much she is being influenced by her friend's father. She is staying with a friend whose father happens to be a lawyer. Who better to know the legalities of emancipation in NJ but a NJ lawyer?  This family is helping fund her case as well.

I just hope she isn't being manipulated here.

It's possible. It's also possible there's some manipulation the other way as well. The lawyer may see her as the pretty, popular, honor student friend of her daughter who showed up with a story of abuse from her parents and getting kicked out. If he had any poor dealings or parenting disagreements with her parents to begin with, it might not take much to convince him to take her case.

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Re: High School Student sues parents for College Tuition
« Reply #38 on: March 06, 2014, 07:25:47 AM »
Oh....as to those that imply that somehow 18 isn't an adult, I'll observe:

I think you're kinda missing the point. I don't think anyone is arguing that she shouldn't be considered an adult, merely that she may not be considered an adult by NJ law. From a legal standpoint you are an adult when the law says you're an adult, not when some random person on the internet thinks your rights / responsibilities add up to adult status.

arebelspy

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Re: High School Student sues parents for College Tuition
« Reply #39 on: March 06, 2014, 07:31:50 AM »
Oh....as to those that imply that somehow 18 isn't an adult, I'll observe:

I think you're kinda missing the point. I don't think anyone is arguing that she shouldn't be considered an adult, merely that she may not be considered an adult by NJ law. From a legal standpoint you are an adult when the law says you're an adult, not when some random person on the internet thinks your rights / responsibilities add up to adult status.

That does make sense...

Still, I'll wait to decide until a random person on the internet agrees with you.
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Re: High School Student sues parents for College Tuition
« Reply #40 on: March 06, 2014, 09:12:40 AM »
I saw the OP's article on my GF's FB and knew it would find its way here!

http://www.finaid.org/otheraid/parentsrefuse.phtml
Wow!  The attitude on this page is really eye-opening.

That page is chock full of emotionally charged and loaded words and is a little quite over the top.  While there is some helpful information, it is surrounded by entitling and guilt inducing language that drowns out the message.

greaper007

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Re: High School Student sues parents for College Tuition
« Reply #41 on: March 06, 2014, 09:19:01 AM »
Honestly, kids shouldn't be considered an adult until 21 at this point.   25 would be best because that's when your brain actually stops developing.     At least 21 though, because it's essentially impossible to get ahead at this point without a college degree.   And if you don't want to pay for your kids to go to college, there's no reason to have them in the first place.     Just like with a divorce, you owe your children or your spouse that made less money a leg up on their single life.   It's just fair.

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Re: High School Student sues parents for College Tuition
« Reply #42 on: March 06, 2014, 09:28:53 AM »
Honestly, kids shouldn't be considered an adult until 21 at this point.   25 would be best because that's when your brain actually stops developing.     At least 21 though, because it's essentially impossible to get ahead at this point without a college degree.   And if you don't want to pay for your kids to go to college, there's no reason to have them in the first place.     Just like with a divorce, you owe your children or your spouse that made less money a leg up on their single life.   It's just fair.
This is the biggest crock of shit I've read in quite a while on these forums.

Gin1984

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Re: High School Student sues parents for College Tuition
« Reply #43 on: March 06, 2014, 09:43:10 AM »
Honestly, kids shouldn't be considered an adult until 21 at this point.   25 would be best because that's when your brain actually stops developing.     At least 21 though, because it's essentially impossible to get ahead at this point without a college degree.   And if you don't want to pay for your kids to go to college, there's no reason to have them in the first place.     Just like with a divorce, you owe your children or your spouse that made less money a leg up on their single life.   It's just fair.
That is not true.  On average the MALE brain stops developing at 25, the female at 21.  However, that is an average and they have seen male brains that have finished as late as 30.

Undecided

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Re: High School Student sues parents for College Tuition
« Reply #44 on: March 06, 2014, 09:52:12 AM »
Honestly, kids shouldn't be considered an adult until 21 at this point.   25 would be best because that's when your brain actually stops developing.     At least 21 though, because it's essentially impossible to get ahead at this point without a college degree.   And if you don't want to pay for your kids to go to college, there's no reason to have them in the first place.     Just like with a divorce, you owe your children or your spouse that made less money a leg up on their single life.   It's just fair.
This is the biggest crock of shit I've read in quite a while on these forums.

Not saying I necessarily agree, but are you disputing the biological assertion, or the legal conclusions? Or are you just a knee-jerk reactionary who thinks calling something a "crock of shit" is convincing?

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Re: High School Student sues parents for College Tuition
« Reply #45 on: March 06, 2014, 10:31:05 AM »
Honestly, kids shouldn't be considered an adult until 21 at this point.   25 would be best because that's when your brain actually stops developing.     At least 21 though, because it's essentially impossible to get ahead at this point without a college degree.   And if you don't want to pay for your kids to go to college, there's no reason to have them in the first place.     Just like with a divorce, you owe your children or your spouse that made less money a leg up on their single life.   It's just fair.

What level of college degree are you suggesting someone must have in order to 'get ahead' and where is this elusive ahead?  There are many jobs that don't require a 4 year degree or even a college degree at all in order to be successful.  I have an associates degree but am among a small percentage of persons in my field that formally went beyond a high school education. 

Also, I don't see the correlation between having children and the requirement to fund their post secondary education.  If and when I have children, I owe them many things and intend to give them many more.  However, the idea that a child is entitled to a college education is one I can't get on board with. 

Undecided

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Re: High School Student sues parents for College Tuition
« Reply #46 on: March 06, 2014, 10:38:35 AM »
Also, I don't see the correlation between having children and the requirement to fund their post secondary education.  If and when I have children, I owe them many things and intend to give them many more.  However, the idea that a child is entitled to a college education is one I can't get on board with.

At what point, though, do personal beliefs on such issues cease to be relevant if "society" disagrees? We haven't reached this point regarding post-secondary education in the US, but we do set aside parental beliefs for societal beliefs in other matters (e.g., well being and healthcare). I wonder if we'll get there for university education.

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Re: High School Student sues parents for College Tuition
« Reply #47 on: March 06, 2014, 10:57:49 AM »
Honestly, kids shouldn't be considered an adult until 21 at this point.   25 would be best because that's when your brain actually stops developing.     At least 21 though, because it's essentially impossible to get ahead at this point without a college degree.   And if you don't want to pay for your kids to go to college, there's no reason to have them in the first place.     Just like with a divorce, you owe your children or your spouse that made less money a leg up on their single life.   It's just fair.
This is the biggest crock of shit I've read in quite a while on these forums.
Not saying I necessarily agree, but are you disputing the biological assertion, or the legal conclusions? Or are you just a knee-jerk reactionary who thinks calling something a "crock of shit" is convincing?
Even assuming the assertions about brain development are true, that post is full of shit.

Quote
it's essentially impossible to get ahead at this point without a college degree
Seriously? There are plenty of examples, most likely even on these forums, of people who are successful without one.

Quote
And if you don't want to pay for your kids to go to college, there's no reason to have them in the first place
Right, because having kids is a totally worthless endeavor unless they go to college...

Quote
Just like with a divorce, you owe your children or your spouse that made less money a leg up on their single life
Entitlement much?

arebelspy

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Re: High School Student sues parents for College Tuition
« Reply #48 on: March 06, 2014, 12:12:51 PM »
Honestly, kids shouldn't be considered an adult until 21 at this point.   25 would be best because that's when your brain actually stops developing.     At least 21 though, because it's essentially impossible to get ahead at this point without a college degree.   And if you don't want to pay for your kids to go to college, there's no reason to have them in the first place.     Just like with a divorce, you owe your children or your spouse that made less money a leg up on their single life.   It's just fair.
This is the biggest crock of shit I've read in quite a while on these forums.
Not saying I necessarily agree, but are you disputing the biological assertion, or the legal conclusions? Or are you just a knee-jerk reactionary who thinks calling something a "crock of shit" is convincing?
Even assuming the assertions about brain development are true, that post is full of shit.

But why?  Articulate a little.

I mean, I agree with you (based on philosophical implications relating to agency), but what are your reasons for saying it's "a crock of shit"?  Rather than just posting that multiple times, can you try to add to the quality of the conversation, instead of subtracting from it?
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Re: High School Student sues parents for College Tuition
« Reply #49 on: March 06, 2014, 12:46:46 PM »
Oh....as to those that imply that somehow 18 isn't an adult, I'll observe:

I think you're kinda missing the point. I don't think anyone is arguing that she shouldn't be considered an adult, merely that she may not be considered an adult by NJ law. From a legal standpoint you are an adult when the law says you're an adult, not when some random person on the internet thinks your rights / responsibilities add up to adult status.

Actually Sherr, those aren't "random" items - those are all examples of things (some with potentially grave consequences) that a fully independent, ADULT IN THE EYES OF THE LAW person are legally entitled to do and that a child is forbidden from doing (or only doing in certain circumstances with parental / guardian permission).  The collective knowledge of this forum could certainly come up with countless other things* that one can do at 18 years and zero days on their own that is forbidden at 17 years, 364 days without parental permission or just outright forbidden.

She is, in fact, and in law, an adult. 

I'll also point out the 26th Amendment as further proof of legal adulthood at 18, period.

* - other things I can come up with without thinking too hard on the subject.  Sign liability waiver for risky activities such as skydiving and bungee jumping.  Use heavy or power equipment on the job (OHSA forbids use of power tools by minors - this one I know from my volunteer experience where juveniles are forbidden from using brush saws on the trail crew).  At 18, juvenile hour restrictions on work end.