Author Topic: Help me, I'm going to buy the Apple Watch!  (Read 49988 times)

sol

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Re: Help me, I'm going to buy the Apple Watch!
« Reply #150 on: April 21, 2015, 11:32:56 PM »
I'd rather have a quad copter drone

I'd rather have $350.

cerebus

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Re: Help me, I'm going to buy the Apple Watch!
« Reply #151 on: April 21, 2015, 11:55:24 PM »
Truthfully, we pretty much only own Apple devices apart from the TV. Two iPhones (5c and 5s) and an iPad Mini2. But like I say, I made it work so it didn't cost us anything except my wife's R300 5c contract which I got pre-mustachian days and now I'm just ticking down the days till her contract expires and I'll drop her down to the lowest price plan and just sell her upgrade and use that to get her a 5s. Staying consistently 1gen behind on Apple products is a quite effective strategy because you can find real bargains on the forums.

I cannot find a good reason to justify owning an Apple Watch though. For me there's some real utility in everything I own and the Watch doesn't have anything that my life needs in order to be more productive and simple. If anything it would just add another layer of digital irritation to my life and I can do without that.

dragoncar

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Re: Help me, I'm going to buy the Apple Watch!
« Reply #152 on: April 22, 2015, 06:30:01 AM »
I'd rather have a quad copter drone

I'd rather have $350.

You can fondle the $350, but it will not respond. 

GoingConcern

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Re: Help me, I'm going to buy the Apple Watch!
« Reply #153 on: April 22, 2015, 07:04:14 AM »
Indexer, AH013 and Zoltani --- Great posts on this thread!


For some reason I have it in my head that Apple and Mustachians are mutually exclusive? 

Pretty sure that unless you have in excess of 500K liquid that you would need to turn in your membership badge if you buy and Apple watch.

Not necessarily.  I like my electronics but I buy them used after they have depreciated 20-50% then resell them at a slight loss.  Last year I bought an iPhone 5 with a cracked screen for under $250.  Fixed it up cheap (maybe $20-$30) and then resold it for around $300 late 2014. 

I have a decent amount of Apple products.  Used Macbook Air from 2011 that I still used to this day, iPad 4 that made cutting my cable much easier via Slingplayer, Macmini for my wife to use as her main desktop and my wife has an iPhone 4s that she still uses to this day.  Sure could I have saved more money by buying non-Apple products used?  Probably, but most of my Apple products have lasted a while and they have good resale value.  It is one of my vices I know. 

As for the OP, I wouldn't buy the watch.  Not too many uses for it and if it ever takes off big it will probably take a few generations to do so. 

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Re: Help me, I'm going to buy the Apple Watch!
« Reply #154 on: April 22, 2015, 07:39:09 AM »
LOLing at the craigslist posts around me that are offering Apple Watches for 2x the retail price, simply because you can have it in 3 days instead of waiting for the backlog to clear.  I've no doubt there are enough suckers who'll pay the $400 premium on a $400 watch simply because they have to have it on release day and didn't want to set an alarm for 3am to pre-order it in time.


Reminds me of a joke.  How do you milk a sheep?

http://www.theverge.com/2015/3/9/8177087/macbook-port-adapter-accessory

That is so gross! $80 to get basic ports on your $1,300 computer! And let's hope you don't have to plug into an old projector your you'll two of those (I do think VGA should die). It's too much to put an extra USB port on it, really?

The worst is that's is purely for looks in the store. I bet most people with these PCs will have dongles and wires hanging off it to connect their stuff. So they removed ports for no other reason than so it would look nice in marketing pictures? This must be the purest case of form over function

dragoncar

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Re: Help me, I'm going to buy the Apple Watch!
« Reply #155 on: April 22, 2015, 08:06:21 AM »
LOLing at the craigslist posts around me that are offering Apple Watches for 2x the retail price, simply because you can have it in 3 days instead of waiting for the backlog to clear.  I've no doubt there are enough suckers who'll pay the $400 premium on a $400 watch simply because they have to have it on release day and didn't want to set an alarm for 3am to pre-order it in time.


Reminds me of a joke.  How do you milk a sheep?

http://www.theverge.com/2015/3/9/8177087/macbook-port-adapter-accessory

That is so gross! $80 to get basic ports on your $1,300 computer! And let's hope you don't have to plug into an old projector your you'll two of those (I do think VGA should die). It's too much to put an extra USB port on it, really?

The worst is that's is purely for looks in the store. I bet most people with these PCs will have dongles and wires hanging off it to connect their stuff. So they removed ports for no other reason than so it would look nice in marketing pictures? This must be the purest case of form over function

This actually convinced me not to get a new MacBook.  My old Lenovo is finally starting to get intermittent processing errors (haven't determined if it can be fixed by replacing RAM, or a processor/cache issue) and I expect it to bite the dust sooner rather than later.  But it just pisses me off so much that they don't include this dongle that they know everyone will need, and which will cost them $.50 to produce, that I won't buy it.  Maybe once the chinese knockoffs come out.

cerebus

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Re: Help me, I'm going to buy the Apple Watch!
« Reply #156 on: April 22, 2015, 08:34:26 AM »
This actually convinced me not to get a new MacBook.
That plus the incredibly poor value for money it represents? Honestly, I can't imagine how a $1300 laptop with a Core M processor can be anywhere close to Mustachian. It seems like purely a luxury item to me. I have to admit I also crave it with that super thin and light design and the haptic trackpad...mmmmmm. But on a rational level it makes so little sense that I just laugh at my own inner homoncumer (portmanteau of homonculus + consumer = awesome).

dragoncar

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Re: Help me, I'm going to buy the Apple Watch!
« Reply #157 on: April 22, 2015, 08:54:43 AM »
This actually convinced me not to get a new MacBook.
That plus the incredibly poor value for money it represents? Honestly, I can't imagine how a $1300 laptop with a Core M processor can be anywhere close to Mustachian. It seems like purely a luxury item to me. I have to admit I also crave it with that super thin and light design and the haptic trackpad...mmmmmm. But on a rational level it makes so little sense that I just laugh at my own inner homoncumer (portmanteau of homonculus + consumer = awesome).

If all you need is Core M with retina, it's actually a very good value.

Syonyk

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Re: Help me, I'm going to buy the Apple Watch!
« Reply #158 on: April 22, 2015, 10:36:08 AM »
The unibody Apple laptops also take insane abuse compared to many cheap laptops. To get a PC laptop with as strong an internal structure costs about the same. And strength is what determines how a laptop handles being hauled around, in my experience.

I've made very good side money fixing random issues with PC laptop hardware for people. Power jacks, fans, etc. I almost never see an issue with a Mac.

gimp

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Re: Help me, I'm going to buy the Apple Watch!
« Reply #159 on: April 22, 2015, 12:39:12 PM »
When Intel pushed ultrabooks, everyone assumed it'd be easy - after all, all ya gotta do is undercut the apple tax, right?

Turned out that it took years for anyone to approach reasonably similar quality for a reasonably similar cost, by which point the ultrabook thing had sailed. Oops. I guess it's harder than it looks to make the unibody, and the rest of it.

Bob, since you've been so bold as to make a prediction, could you help us out by giving us a timeframe?

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Re: Help me, I'm going to buy the Apple Watch!
« Reply #160 on: April 22, 2015, 12:54:37 PM »
I forgot about that! Yeah, even with millions of dollars from Intel, nobody could come close to the Air for years.

GoingConcern

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Re: Help me, I'm going to buy the Apple Watch!
« Reply #161 on: April 22, 2015, 03:15:05 PM »
The unibody Apple laptops also take insane abuse compared to many cheap laptops. To get a PC laptop with as strong an internal structure costs about the same. And strength is what determines how a laptop handles being hauled around, in my experience.

I've made very good side money fixing random issues with PC laptop hardware for people. Power jacks, fans, etc. I almost never see an issue with a Mac.

I have a 2011 Macbook Air and I have used it for school and work and have traveled all over the United States with it and it and it's still going strong.  The only thing I have replaced is the battery which was an easy and cheap fix and tbh I didn't even have to change it because it still held a decent charge.  Also got a new power adapter on ebay but again it was a cheap fix. 

Before my Mac, I have had 4-5 labtops that have all failed on me.  They lasted around a year or two before something gave out. 

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Re: Help me, I'm going to buy the Apple Watch!
« Reply #162 on: April 22, 2015, 04:22:23 PM »
Before my Mac, I have had 4-5 labtops that have all failed on me.  They lasted around a year or two before something gave out.

That's pretty consistent with my experience in fixing other people's hardware.  The areas on cheap PC laptops that usually fail:
- Power connector.  This is very, very common.  Someone puts together a high power consumption machine with a cheap crappy power jack that melts the solder out where the center pin interfaces with the board.  I suspect the usual initial cause is a crack caused by repeated jarring of the power pin that just gets worse until it fails to charge entirely.  Not a bad repair, assuming you have the skills to fully dismantle a laptop, resolder the power jack, and reassemble it properly (which is beyond the tech skills of most people).  I've obtained a number of "broken laptops" with something going on power-jack wise.  Apple, since the Macbook era, has used the various magsafe connectors that are utterly indestructible.  The chassis is a structural part of the plug, and they don't transmit force to the laptop because they just pop free.  Brilliant.
- Mainboard flex related issues.  This is often just a total failure of the laptop, or it gets unreliable, or some number of weird things.  It may happen if you flex the laptop initially, then proceed to total failure.  This is usually because on a cheap laptop, the mainboard is a stressed member and takes chassis loads.  PCB does NOT like to flex.  Throw a cheap PCB as a structural member of a flexible 17" laptop, and you have an impending failure.  Apple has always built stiff laptops, and the unibody ones are utterly insane.  They don't bend at all.  The PCB never takes any stress.  You can get a PC laptop with a rigid internal structure that performs similarly, but they're typically business-class laptops and cost almost as much as Apple hardware.
- Memory (RAM) going bad.  This is, in theory, a problem for everyone, but I've seen it a lot more frequently on PCs.  It's almost like if you are building a cheap laptop, you throw in cheap memory...

There are some problems that affect both PC and Apple hardware (the nVidia 8600m chip failures were a plague across the board), but mostly, Apple stuff just keeps working reliably.  The hardware is expensive, but the quality is there to justify the cost. 

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Re: Help me, I'm going to buy the Apple Watch!
« Reply #163 on: April 22, 2015, 09:06:17 PM »
The punch line was the attached link.
Ah. I actually read that, too.
I hate to be an Apple hater (I was raised on their stuff, and own some shares) but who the fuck is dumb enough to fall for this shameless exploitation?
Between EE school and developing financial sense, I went from enthusiastically supporting Apple as a consumer to completely rejecting them because of stuff like that. They invent reasons to change for change's sake, nothing is backward-compatible, and profit margins on inexpensive accessories are in the thousands of percents. It's horribly inelegant from a technical view, and reprehensible from a customer value standpoint.
It works for shareholders though... good lord does it ever work, which is why I keep the stock.

Don't forget to sell before the milk goes dry.      It appears this one is well past it's prime.
Past it's prime? Have you heard of the iPhone 6? Do you know which company holds the world record for most profit generated in a single quarter? Do you know when that record was set?

Seriously. Guess which company. Guess when the record was set.
I give up?   Erickson,  Motorola,  Nokia,  BlackBerry?     I'm pretty sure they were all at their prime as number one cell phone sellers 15 seconds before they weren't.     Yeah,  I know,  its different this time.   Enjoy the run while it lasts.  Hell even Bic lighters still sell at a premium.
It was Apple. They set the world record for most profit in a quarter, of any company in the history of ever. About five minutes ago.

Regardless of if you think the products are a value proposition (they aren't) you should not doubt the strength of the company.

obstinate

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Re: Help me, I'm going to buy the Apple Watch!
« Reply #164 on: April 23, 2015, 12:29:31 AM »
If all you need is Core M with retina, it's actually a very good value.
But since nobody actually needs that, it ain't. There are plenty of Core M devices that are cheaper and as reliable. Maybe none quite so pretty, but eh.

Personally I don't care to bang on Apple products. If you buy them a generation or two back, they can be quite good. iPhone is clearly, in my book, the best phone on the market. I find iPhones two or three generations back to feel just as snappy as the brand new Nexus-line Android I have in my pocket.

Just . . . be reasonable about it. If you're going to get an updated computer every three years, you owe it to your future self to buy used.

dragoncar

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Re: Help me, I'm going to buy the Apple Watch!
« Reply #165 on: April 23, 2015, 07:17:27 AM »
If all you need is Core M with retina, it's actually a very good value.
But since nobody actually needs that, it ain't. There are plenty of Core M devices that are cheaper and as reliable. Maybe none quite so pretty, but eh.

Personally I don't care to bang on Apple products. If you buy them a generation or two back, they can be quite good. iPhone is clearly, in my book, the best phone on the market. I find iPhones two or three generations back to feel just as snappy as the brand new Nexus-line Android I have in my pocket.

Just . . . be reasonable about it. If you're going to get an updated computer every three years, you owe it to your future self to buy used.

At this point, I do... productivity is tied to usable screen area, which is tied to resolution.  Also, I haven't bought a computer (new or used) in 10 years so I think I have a pretty good track record in picking winners (for myself).

thd7t

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Re: Help me, I'm going to buy the Apple Watch!
« Reply #166 on: April 23, 2015, 07:33:02 AM »
The punch line was the attached link.
Ah. I actually read that, too.
I hate to be an Apple hater (I was raised on their stuff, and own some shares) but who the fuck is dumb enough to fall for this shameless exploitation?
Between EE school and developing financial sense, I went from enthusiastically supporting Apple as a consumer to completely rejecting them because of stuff like that. They invent reasons to change for change's sake, nothing is backward-compatible, and profit margins on inexpensive accessories are in the thousands of percents. It's horribly inelegant from a technical view, and reprehensible from a customer value standpoint.
It works for shareholders though... good lord does it ever work, which is why I keep the stock.

Don't forget to sell before the milk goes dry.      It appears this one is well past it's prime.
Past it's prime? Have you heard of the iPhone 6? Do you know which company holds the world record for most profit generated in a single quarter? Do you know when that record was set?

Seriously. Guess which company. Guess when the record was set.
I give up?   Erickson,  Motorola,  Nokia,  BlackBerry?     I'm pretty sure they were all at their prime as number one cell phone sellers 15 seconds before they weren't.     Yeah,  I know,  its different this time.   Enjoy the run while it lasts.  Hell even Bic lighters still sell at a premium.
It was Apple. They set the world record for most profit in a quarter, of any company in the history of ever. About five minutes ago.

Regardless of if you think the products are a value proposition (they aren't) you should not doubt the strength of the company.
Not to give you too hard a time, but you missed the point, here.  The best example (from Bob W's list) is probably Blackberry.  In the early to mid 2000's, they dominated the business mobile phone market so completely that people thought that the iphone was just going to be a consumer model.  Apple was already a strong company, but people could not (and cannot) see the utility of a product that hadn't been fully introduced and vetted.  The iphone completely usurped the Blackberry, pretty much destroying the company.  No one is saying that this will definitely happen with Apple.  We're just saying that we cannot imagine uses for products that are just over the horizon.  Those are the products that could dismantle any company's dominance.

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Re: Help me, I'm going to buy the Apple Watch!
« Reply #167 on: April 23, 2015, 07:42:17 AM »
Don't forget to sell before the milk goes dry.      It appears this one is well past it's prime.
I'm not much for market timing, but I had considered taking the profit and rolling it into a broad ETF or one of my dividend picks. Still pondering.

That is so gross! $80 to get basic ports on your $1,300 computer! And let's hope you don't have to plug into an old projector your you'll two of those (I do think VGA should die). It's too much to put an extra USB port on it, really?

The worst is that's is purely for looks in the store. I bet most people with these PCs will have dongles and wires hanging off it to connect their stuff. So they removed ports for no other reason than so it would look nice in marketing pictures? This must be the purest case of form over function

Yeah, that summarizes my objections as a consumer. The only question is how long I continue to back the business model as a shareholder.
If the MacBook really is $1300 worth of hardware, as asserted here, and if that's generally true of their products, then most of that record profit is in the "bullshit dongle" market - and I question my hold on the stock even more. Even if they can keep making that business model work, I'm one of those weirdos that prefers to hold things that not only make money but make me feel good about being a shareholder. (ex: HASI, PEGI)
This model is more like the automakers' - get you in the door with an attractive base price, lock you into the product and make most profit in follow-on expenses. More power to 'em, but I can't get excited about owning shares.

cerebus

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Re: Help me, I'm going to buy the Apple Watch!
« Reply #168 on: April 23, 2015, 07:49:24 AM »

Yeah, that summarizes my objections as a consumer. The only question is how long I continue to back the business model as a shareholder.
If the MacBook really is $1300 worth of hardware, as asserted here, and if that's generally true of their products, then most of that record profit is in the "bullshit dongle" market - and I question my hold on the stock even more. Even if they can keep making that business model work, I'm one of those weirdos that prefers to hold things that not only make money but make me feel good about being a shareholder. (ex: HASI, PEGI)
This model is more like the automakers' - get you in the door with an attractive base price, lock you into the product and make most profit in follow-on expenses. More power to 'em, but I can't get excited about owning shares.

That's kind of overlooking the fact that the Macbook 2015 itself is a very innovative laptop and it's being launched alongside another brand new product line - the Watch. The profits they're making on dongles are really miniscule next to these big ticket 'real' items, which are selling gangbusters. Really all this penny-ante stuff does is cost them goodwill, but I doubt it significantly damages their marketshare or reflects on some foreboding inability to innovate. And, in fairness, the quality of the dongles is much higher than most of the 3rd party components you'll get. Even the basic Lightning cable is a very well made cable next to the average micro-usb.

zephyr911

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Re: Help me, I'm going to buy the Apple Watch!
« Reply #169 on: April 23, 2015, 07:59:07 AM »
That's kind of overlooking the fact that the Macbook 2015 itself is a very innovative laptop and it's being launched alongside another brand new product line - the Watch. The profits they're making on dongles are really miniscule next to these big ticket 'real' items, which are selling gangbusters. Really all this penny-ante stuff does is cost them goodwill, but I doubt it significantly damages their marketshare or reflects on some foreboding inability to innovate. And, in fairness, the quality of the dongles is much higher than most of the 3rd party components you'll get. Even the basic Lightning cable is a very well made cable next to the average micro-usb.
That sounds convincing, and just FTR, I'm not so much jumping to conclusions (I forgot my mat) as asking questions and musing upon the logical implications of various assertions. Also, because I'm easily amused, and not because I actually decided this was the case, I made this graphic to stimulate further discussion.
(Comic Sans, because I wanted to make absolutely sure nobody took it seriously)

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Re: Help me, I'm going to buy the Apple Watch!
« Reply #170 on: April 23, 2015, 08:08:45 AM »
You guys are missing the bigger picture. Apple isn't making its money off the dongles, and it understands that people are not happy with them, but it's using them to push the tech forward. The new port is amazing, and while I wish they had a USB port alongside it, Apple has done things like this in the past to move the state of the game forward, and I actually appreciate that, as much as dongles suck.

To think that they are doing it to make an extra few bucks on an adapter is ludicrous.
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Re: Help me, I'm going to buy the Apple Watch!
« Reply #171 on: April 23, 2015, 08:20:44 AM »
You guys are missing the bigger picture. Apple isn't making its money off the dongles, and it understands that people are not happy with them, but it's using them to push the tech forward. The new port is amazing, and while I wish they had a USB port alongside it, Apple has done things like this in the past to move the state of the game forward, and I actually appreciate that, as much as dongles suck.

To think that they are doing it to make an extra few bucks on an adapter is ludicrous.
I agree that Apple is doing this to make "the big leap", but it doesn't mean that this makes the product good, today.  It makes the MacBook more like first generation tech.  Yes, most of it is built on established principles, but this form factor is more a prediction of how things will work than the best way for the product to work today.  (This has worked for Apple before, particularly in removing optical storage from its laptops)

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Re: Help me, I'm going to buy the Apple Watch!
« Reply #172 on: April 23, 2015, 08:33:33 AM »
Yes, that's fine, and I'm fine if you aren't an early adopter and want to wait a generation or two for the tech to catch up, so you have a flash drive that uses the new port, so you have other accessories, so you don't need a dongle.

That's all well and good. When the discussion turns ridiculous about how they're making all their money off of these dongles and that's why they exist, it seemed relevant actually point out the truth. :)
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Re: Help me, I'm going to buy the Apple Watch!
« Reply #173 on: April 23, 2015, 08:54:39 AM »
You guys are missing the bigger picture. Apple isn't making its money off the dongles, and it understands that people are not happy with them, but it's using them to push the tech forward. The new port is amazing, and while I wish they had a USB port alongside it, Apple has done things like this in the past to move the state of the game forward, and I actually appreciate that, as much as dongles suck.

To think that they are doing it to make an extra few bucks on an adapter is ludicrous.
I wouldn't exactly say I've been missing it, Bob... *laugh track*
Seriously though, I know this is getting a bit foamy but that big picture really is what I've been looking for. And FTR, I'd still find it repugnant as a consumer if I could confirm that the markup on proprietary dongles is as high as I think it is - regardless of the actual percentage of total profit that it might represent. I don't deny that they innovate like crazy, I just object to their willful non-participation in developing open standards, which truly benefit the whole market even more than great individual advances.

dragoncar

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Re: Help me, I'm going to buy the Apple Watch!
« Reply #174 on: April 23, 2015, 09:18:08 AM »
Yes, that's fine, and I'm fine if you aren't an early adopter and want to wait a generation or two for the tech to catch up, so you have a flash drive that uses the new port, so you have other accessories, so you don't need a dongle.

That's all well and good. When the discussion turns ridiculous about how they're making all their money off of these dongles and that's why they exist, it seemed relevant actually point out the truth. :)

They're making all their money pushing tech to the bleeding edge, such as when they added "auto save," "document handling," "media device support," and "full screen" to OSX in 2011

« Last Edit: April 23, 2015, 09:20:16 AM by dragoncar »

gimp

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Re: Help me, I'm going to buy the Apple Watch!
« Reply #175 on: April 23, 2015, 02:08:18 PM »
... I just object to their willful non-participation in developing open standards, which truly benefit the whole market even more than great individual advances.

Like USB 3.1 (USB C), which is an open standard that they helped develop (along with intel et al), which (apart from the headphone jack) is literally the only port on the new macbook?

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Re: Help me, I'm going to buy the Apple Watch!
« Reply #176 on: April 23, 2015, 02:21:52 PM »
... I just object to their willful non-participation in developing open standards, which truly benefit the whole market even more than great individual advances.

Like USB 3.1 (USB C), which is an open standard that they helped develop (along with intel et al), which (apart from the headphone jack) is literally the only port on the new macbook?
It's an interesting exception. ;)

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Re: Help me, I'm going to buy the Apple Watch!
« Reply #177 on: April 23, 2015, 07:03:02 PM »
At this point, I do... productivity is tied to usable screen area, which is tied to resolution.  Also, I haven't bought a computer (new or used) in 10 years so I think I have a pretty good track record in picking winners (for myself).
I'm sorry, but I work on computers all day, and if you genuinely need screen space and resolution, you need a standalone monitor, and the laptop you plug into it is more or less irrelevant. The idea that a macbook is the most price efficient way to accomplish what you're describing is just ridiculous.

Again, I think they're great products, but this ain't no design review forum.

dragoncar

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Re: Help me, I'm going to buy the Apple Watch!
« Reply #178 on: April 23, 2015, 07:13:35 PM »
At this point, I do... productivity is tied to usable screen area, which is tied to resolution.  Also, I haven't bought a computer (new or used) in 10 years so I think I have a pretty good track record in picking winners (for myself).
I'm sorry, but I work on computers all day, and if you genuinely need screen space and resolution, you need a standalone monitor, and the laptop you plug into it is more or less irrelevant. The idea that a macbook is the most price efficient way to accomplish what you're describing is just ridiculous.

Again, I think they're great products, but this ain't no design review forum.

Yeah, the TSA will love me lugging around my standalone monitor.  I'll also tell my clients not to worry about my tattered jeans and t-shirt with holes, because I'm just a lawyer not some kind of fashion designer.

obstinate

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Re: Help me, I'm going to buy the Apple Watch!
« Reply #179 on: April 24, 2015, 01:44:41 AM »
Ah, so you need it as a status symbol. That clears things up immensely. Yep, go ahead and buy a MacBook.

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Re: Help me, I'm going to buy the Apple Watch!
« Reply #180 on: April 24, 2015, 03:44:39 AM »
... Or he reviews legal documents and being able to fit several side by side helps with what he's doing?

The irrational hate for Apple because it's Apple is really absurd.

High resolution Windows laptops aren't cheap either, but at least OSX does something useful with the pixels.

sol

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Re: Help me, I'm going to buy the Apple Watch!
« Reply #181 on: April 24, 2015, 10:37:15 AM »
For all of you considering buying an Apple watch (or anything else for that matter), I propose a new evaluation metric for helping you make such decisions:

How much would I have to pay you to NOT buy it?

Would you commit to not buying the Apple watch for the rest of the day if I offered you $100 in cash?  Are you so keen to have it that you would turn down hard cash to get your grubby little hands on it immediately?

What if I offered you $200?  You can still go get one tomorrow, but would you accept $200 of my money to not buy it today?

What if I offered you $349?

Because that's the same logical choice you face today.  Would you rather have $349, or this thing that you can get by giving up$349? I'm putting each one on a plate in front of you and you get to pick.  If you pick the cash, you can change your mind tomorrow.  If you pick the watch, that money is gone forever.

Maybe you have a raging hard on for this thing and you would turn down $18,000 in order to possess it. From that perspective you're going to get one no matter what and only giving up $349 seems like a steal.  I don't judge, as long as you've made the conscious decision that this thing is worth more to you than my cash offer.

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Re: Help me, I'm going to buy the Apple Watch!
« Reply #182 on: April 24, 2015, 10:46:07 AM »
I've decided to purchase one, after originally saying I was holding out for Gen II. I'll be ordering the aluminium Sport with the rubber wristband, and using it for music and health monitoring while I gym.

I am in a place where I would take the Watch over the 350 on a plate.

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Re: Help me, I'm going to buy the Apple Watch!
« Reply #183 on: April 24, 2015, 10:50:11 AM »
Because that's the same logical choice you face today.  Would you rather have $349, or this thing that you can get by giving up$349? I'm putting each one on a plate in front of you and you get to pick.  If you pick the cash, you can change your mind tomorrow.  If you pick the watch, that money is gone forever.

No, it's not.  If I take your offer, I get $349 today from you, and can buy it without having spent any of my own money on it tomorrow.  If I hold off until tomorrow, I'm still spending my own money.

If you make me that offer every day, and I hold off for a year, I've made $127,385 from you.  But by not buying it myself with my own money for a year, I've saved $349.
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Re: Help me, I'm going to buy the Apple Watch!
« Reply #184 on: April 24, 2015, 11:01:07 AM »
Work with me here rebs.  It's the same $349 back on the plate every day, so every day you make the same decision.

It was meant to illustrate that the decision to not buy today is an easy one.  Tomorrow's decision is equally easy, so by induction every day's decision should be equally easy and you never buy the damn thing.

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Re: Help me, I'm going to buy the Apple Watch!
« Reply #185 on: April 24, 2015, 11:21:47 AM »
Work with me here rebs.  It's the same $349 back on the plate every day, so every day you make the same decision.

So you steal back the $349 after I accept it and re-offer the same funds the next day?  If it's the same funds, accepting it day 1 doesn't get me any further ahead than buying it later does, so I might as well buy it today.

It was meant to illustrate that the decision to not buy today is an easy one.  Tomorrow's decision is equally easy, so by induction every day's decision should be equally easy and you never buy the damn thing.

That's true for everything.  For every item I own I'd hold off owning it for a day to get paid the equivalent of its cost.  I can go one day without a car for several thousand dollars, and then buy it tomorrow.

But if I need to buy it anyways at some point, and I'm not being offered that, I might as well buy now.
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Re: Help me, I'm going to buy the Apple Watch!
« Reply #186 on: April 24, 2015, 11:34:27 AM »
You're a party pooper.  The idea was that giving up $349 extra dollars and losing $349 existing dollars are basically equivalent decisions, for a relatively wealthy person with a flat marginal utility curve.  It's not funny when I have to explain the punchline.

As to your other point, I think we're all going to buy wearable computers someday, so you think I might as well go out and buy the Apple watch today?  I'm not digging that logic either.

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Re: Help me, I'm going to buy the Apple Watch!
« Reply #187 on: April 24, 2015, 12:32:16 PM »
You're a party pooper.  The idea was that giving up $349 extra dollars and losing $349 existing dollars are basically equivalent decisions, for a relatively wealthy person with a flat marginal utility curve.  It's not funny when I have to explain the punchline.

As to your other point, I think we're all going to buy wearable computers someday, so you think I might as well go out and buy the Apple watch today?  I'm not digging that logic either.

Not trying to poop in your punchbowl, just pointing out the limitation of the analogy.

As to the other point, it was more like "if I'm going to buy this item [Apple Watch] tomorrow, and don't anticipate a price drop, I might as well buy it today."  If you aren't going to buy the Apple watch, but some future wearable, okay, wait until that's out.  But for someone taking your hypothetical to get the cash, but will still want to buy it tomorrow, they might as well buy it today, since not spending the $349 just means they'll be spending it tomorrow.  I mean, time value of money and all that, sure, but a day isn't much difference.
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dragoncar

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Re: Help me, I'm going to buy the Apple Watch!
« Reply #188 on: April 24, 2015, 12:49:31 PM »
... Or he reviews legal documents and being able to fit several side by side helps with what he's doing?

The irrational hate for Apple because it's Apple is really absurd.

High resolution Windows laptops aren't cheap either, but at least OSX does something useful with the pixels.

Yeah, high resolution Windows laptops are about the same price or more (because they are usually in more powerful machines, which I don't need).  I already told him I need more pixels and he suggested I carry an external monitor with me at all times...

Ah, so you need it as a status symbol. That clears things up immensely. Yep, go ahead and buy a MacBook.

Thank you for your approval.  If you were paying attention, however, you would see that I have no plans to buy a MacBook.  It's just a good value for my needs.

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Re: Help me, I'm going to buy the Apple Watch!
« Reply #189 on: April 29, 2015, 04:08:59 AM »
Someone stop me! I've been reading about the Apple Watch for months, talking myself into it completely. At this point, it's just a matter of how much I'm going to shell out for it

http://www.thedailymash.co.uk/news/science-technology/mans-first-day-of-wearing-apple-watch-to-work-not-going-as-hoped-2015042797777


Quote
Sales manager Tom Logan’s new Apple Watch has been unexpectedly ridiculed by his work colleagues.
 
32-year-old Logan felt confident that his futuristic timepiece would attract admiring glances rather than unflattering Knight Rider comparisons.
 

 
He said: “I had it all planned out – not saying anything about it, but then somebody just notices and goes ‘is that the new Apple Watch?’. I would respond simply with a wry Clooney-esque smile and they would mouth the word ‘awesome’.
 
“What actually happened is somebody said ‘what the fuck’s that weird-looking thing?’
 
“I explained that it was the brand new Apple Watch and they went ‘HAHAHA’ in a really deliberately hurtful way. The accounts assistant said it was the opposite of a fanny magnet and everyone cracked up.
 
“Then everyone started pretending to talk into their watches, saying things like ‘come in KITT, I am a massive tosser, please help’.”
 
By 10am Logan had removed the watch. He explained: “It wasn’t because people were being sarcastic, I just had a hot wrist, everyone gets a hot wrist sometimes.

Was this you, IndyPendent? :)
« Last Edit: April 29, 2015, 04:11:31 AM by Bjorn »

dragoncar

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Re: Help me, I'm going to buy the Apple Watch!
« Reply #190 on: April 29, 2015, 04:11:06 AM »
I wish I still had my casio calculator watch right about now

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Re: Help me, I'm going to buy the Apple Watch!
« Reply #191 on: April 29, 2015, 08:29:15 PM »
So, for anyone who actually bought one, how is it?  A magical, revolutionary, life changing experience?

(my LG G watch is currently sitting on the charger... where it's been for a while now - at least I got it as a gift and didn't have to pay for it)

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Re: Help me, I'm going to buy the Apple Watch!
« Reply #192 on: April 29, 2015, 09:03:27 PM »
So, for anyone who actually bought one, how is it?  A magical, revolutionary, life changing experience?

(my LG G watch is currently sitting on the charger... where it's been for a while now - at least I got it as a gift and didn't have to pay for it)
A coworker of mine bought it, and he loves it.

dragoncar

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Re: Help me, I'm going to buy the Apple Watch!
« Reply #193 on: April 29, 2015, 09:12:07 PM »
So, for anyone who actually bought one, how is it?  A magical, revolutionary, life changing experience?

(my LG G watch is currently sitting on the charger... where it's been for a while now - at least I got it as a gift and didn't have to pay for it)
A coworker of mine bought it, and he loves it.

How many members of the opposite sex did the watch attract?

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Re: Help me, I'm going to buy the Apple Watch!
« Reply #194 on: April 30, 2015, 08:55:22 AM »
So, for anyone who actually bought one, how is it?  A magical, revolutionary, life changing experience?

(my LG G watch is currently sitting on the charger... where it's been for a while now - at least I got it as a gift and didn't have to pay for it)
A coworker of mine bought it, and he loves it.

How many members of the opposite sex did the watch attract?

All of them.
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Re: Help me, I'm going to buy the Apple Watch!
« Reply #195 on: May 04, 2015, 02:26:27 PM »
Someone stop me! I've been reading about the Apple Watch for months, talking myself into it completely. At this point, it's just a matter of how much I'm going to shell out for it--the relatively lower-priced entry model, the middle tier, or the crazy high-end gold version. And don't get me started on the bands!

This may sound like sarcasm, but I'm serious. I want one, and I have the means. Anyone else relate?

Buy the gold one. Tell your friends you love it. Get them to buy one. I own AAPL stock. I'll send you a thank you note.

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Re: Help me, I'm going to buy the Apple Watch!
« Reply #196 on: June 02, 2017, 07:52:14 AM »
That's kind of overlooking the fact that the Macbook 2015 itself is a very innovative laptop and it's being launched alongside another brand new product line - the Watch. The profits they're making on dongles are really miniscule next to these big ticket 'real' items, which are selling gangbusters. Really all this penny-ante stuff does is cost them goodwill, but I doubt it significantly damages their marketshare or reflects on some foreboding inability to innovate. And, in fairness, the quality of the dongles is much higher than most of the 3rd party components you'll get. Even the basic Lightning cable is a very well made cable next to the average micro-usb.
That sounds convincing, and just FTR, I'm not so much jumping to conclusions (I forgot my mat) as asking questions and musing upon the logical implications of various assertions. Also, because I'm easily amused, and not because I actually decided this was the case, I made this graphic to stimulate further discussion.
(Comic Sans, because I wanted to make absolutely sure nobody took it seriously)

I realize this is more than 2 years old at this point, but it misses the giant point that Apple is almost always wildly undercut on accessories by a zillion aftermarket suppliers on price, and therefore volume.  That giant green part needs to go to Belkin, SanDisk, Kensington, etc etc etc, not Apple.  In fact, you can buy those brands through Apple (for apparently little or no markup or the same markup as other retailers).  It's not a profit play for Apple, and if they do make a profit, it's a small part of their business.