eight sleep app... wtf

[AlanStache]

Over the last week I got sucked into looking at bed temperature control devices, these use water in tubes running just on top of the mattress to heat and cool you.  This is suppose to keep you at the proper temperature to promote a good night sleep with all the benefits you would expect from that.

Found a "good" option from eightsleep, it is a cover that goes over your current mattress, heats/cools, you can set a bed time to have the bed prepped for your bed time.  It will also monitor your sleep and change the temperature during the night to give you the best rest possible and it can do Heart Rate Variability analyses to tell you how athletically ready you are (I have been looking at getting a Whoop so this could replace that).

Anyway some how I talk myself into spending some 1700$ for this mattress pad (!!!!!), but I get into the checkout section and then I learn to get most of the cool features you have to also pay 18$/month for there app.  A few four letter words crossed my mind at that point.  Like I can sort of see spending 1700$ on a one time thing if it really will help me sleep better and track my recovery - it hurts some but still.  But there is no F-ing way I am spending 18$/mon on a app for my mattress.  Looking around the web I think the app cost is relatively new, so maybe I can hope that others will be like me and abandon the shopping cart when they see this price and the company will change but I am not holding my breath. 

I really hope the future will not just be a bunch of monthly subscriptions.

Edit:
on amazon there are other cheaper options (~1k$... wtf!!!) that I dont think require a paid app but have not looked into them.  They dont have the HRV or automatic temperature adjustment.

[Kris]

OMG that's amazing. I probably saw the same article or ad that you did for that temperature control cover. I talked to my husband about it, and even went so far as to send him the link. There was a lot of info on the website, so we kind of stalled out at that point, and just kind of forgot about it... though that tab is still open on my browser to come back later.

I would have done the exact same thing as you if we had ever gotten around to deciding this would be a good idea. I just went and told DH about your post. His jaw dropped, as mine had. I said to DH, "Well, I guess I can close that tab on my browser!" He laughed and said, "Yeah, me too."

Someone really needs to tell them they are losing a crapload of money on this model with people who drop the purchase at checkout. At least, I hope they are.

[AlanStache]

the only reasonable explanation I could come up with was that they are production limited and this lets them maximize income from a limited customer base while ramping up.  there have to be some people willing to pay the app fee

[Malossi792]

I am also having problems with sleep, went to see a psychiatrist at last - wish I did so way sooner. Got some antidepressants prescribed, that help with so much more than sleep; it's amazing (and sad) how broken I actually am.
100% would recommend.

[JoePublic3.14]

I assume the first month or week was free with the entry of your credit card info? That’s a great model to suck some folks in.

I certainly can understand the cost of the 'thing', since there are some technologies and overhead that are not cheap.

That sucks to be that close and that excited….just to be kneecapped at the end.

[EricEng]

Wow, I didn't know about the app cost.  I had looked at the eight system too along with cheaper options.  I am constantly hot at night while everyone else in the house is cool.  Seemed cheaper to run ac less and just cool me in the long run if it works.  Not going to look at eight sleep option now.

[Morning Glory]

I am also having problems with sleep, went to see a psychiatrist at last - wish I did so way sooner. Got some antidepressants prescribed, that help with so much more than sleep; it's amazing (and sad) how broken I actually am.
100% would recommend.

+1
I did that last year.  Was waking up at 0300 or earlier every night and barely eating before I got help. I still need trazodone if I don't want to wake up for every little noise.

[AlanStache]

To be clear you can use the device without the app but it then would have the same options as the cheaper alternatives.

I do mostly sleep all night, minus a bathroom break and maybe a snack (bad I know) and am I bed 8-9 hr per night, but  still not fully rested when the alarm goes off.  Was just looking for something to help that.  ( Room is 100% dark, mostly no alcohol in the evening, no screens in the bedroom, normally read a bit before turning in, have a white noise app, no basic life stress.). Maybe I just need to go to bed earlier and earlier to see what it takes to feel rested.

[JoePublic3.14]

To be clear you can use the device without the app but it then would have the same options as the cheaper alternatives.

I do mostly sleep all night, minus a bathroom break and maybe a snack (bad I know) and am I bed 8-9 hr per night, but  still not fully rested when the alarm goes off.  Was just looking for something to help that.  ( Room is 100% dark, mostly no alcohol in the evening, no screens in the bedroom, normally read a bit before turning in, have a white noise app, no basic life stress.). Maybe I just need to go to bed earlier and earlier to see what it takes to feel rested.

Exercise routine? Caffeine routine? What about on days where the alarm does not go off?

I would surely look at as many factors as possible before I’d ever consider putting a chemical in.

The snack thing intrigues me, since I have never done it. Maybe a separate thread on that would be interesting.

Also, what about a different type of alarm system? I have always felt one of those light based ones that (supposedly) ramps you slowly out of sleep could be interesting.

If you end up getting the fancy mattress thing, be sure to let us know how it works!

[secondcor521]

To be clear you can use the device without the app but it then would have the same options as the cheaper alternatives.

I do mostly sleep all night, minus a bathroom break and maybe a snack (bad I know) and am I bed 8-9 hr per night, but  still not fully rested when the alarm goes off.  Was just looking for something to help that.  ( Room is 100% dark, mostly no alcohol in the evening, no screens in the bedroom, normally read a bit before turning in, have a white noise app, no basic life stress.). Maybe I just need to go to bed earlier and earlier to see what it takes to feel rested.

My BIL the sleep doctor says the biggest thing is a consistent sleep schedule.  Maybe you do already but it's missing from your list.  Also no caffeine at all might help.

[AlanStache]

Exercise routine? Caffeine routine? What about on days where the alarm does not go off?

I workout an hour a day after work, alternating days of indoor rowing and weights and am very good about no caffeine after noon (and am down to one cup of black coffee).  Weekends without an alarm I easily sleep an extra two hours so can sleep 10-11 hours and am still not consistently rested.  Probably the worst sleep habits I have are eating dinner late and practicing bass guitar with an app after dinner - so will stop practicing around 930-945 then into bed 1030-1045.  I dont think I normally have trouble getting to sleep. 

Bed time is fairly consistent - weekends I will stay up an extra 1-1.5hr and maybe have a beer with dinner. 

Most always the phones vibration alarm wakes me up - slight buzz on the night stand, it hardly ever progresses to the audible alarm before I snooze it or get up.  I tried gentle alarms and those with light but I still woke up very easily at its first indication.  Dont remember why I changed back from a light alarm app but it did not last long.  probably worth trying again.

Maybe I just need to RE so I can sleep 11hr/night for a few months to see what happens.  In the interests of science I should quit my job :-)

[Malossi792]

Before meds I could sleep in on the weekend and still not get up on my own or feel rested after 10 hours of ,,sleep".
Down to 8 hours and I'm good to go now.
Just sayin'

[RetiredAt63]

Is there any possibility you have sleep apnea?  Do you snore heavily?  Because with sleep apnea you may have "been asleep" for 8 hours but woke up for a fraction of a second many times, which is not a good sleep.

[AlanStache]

Guests report that I dont snore, or have other notable nocturnal habits :-)

[ExitViaTheCashRamp]

"I learn to get most of the cool features you have to also pay 18$/month for there app."

 Ongoing support ? Will you be charged upgrade fees to make it work with Windows 12 ? Will it still work if the company goes insolvent ? Will it still work if the appstore introduces new constraints ? Will a minor fault on the mattress cover from say a spilt cup of tea break your purchase forever ?

 Long term usage in severe doubt.

[RetiredAt63]

Guests report that I dont snore, or have other notable nocturnal habits :-)

That's good news.  Sleep apnea sucks.

[kina]

It is possible to have sleep apnea without snoring. Not feeling rested after that much sleep should be something you should be discussing with a physician. A sleep study might yield interesting results.

[joemandadman189]

i think the ooler chillipad is a cheaper option

[AlanStache]

I got the ooler a few weeks ago and really like it.  After some time establishing the right temperature I do think I am sleeping better.  Frist night I took the advice of the instruction manual and set it to 65f, way to cold, bumped it put to 80 over night.  Then have been dropping it 1deg every night or two to where it is now in the low 70's.  That feels about right but will try a little cooler.  One of the big things the first first night was the ooler was set to med/high and I think it the flow rate was to high creating cool spots where there was a pressure contact and that was uncomeatable, 65 may be ok for me with with set to low.  My ooler is not quite, as some in the amazon review have noted it might be worth taking apart and installing a silent computer fan vs the stock fan.  I sleep with a white noise app so it not really a problem for me.

I have gone back to eight sleeps site a few times and when checking out the cost of the full featured app keeps dropping, is now 8$/month billed annually.  That is getting into the "maybe" realm.  8$/month for HRV tracking is a lot cheaper and easier than Whoop or Ōura ring.  I do dislike the business model of changing the pricing like this. 

Edit:  On further reading eight sleep now offers HRV tracking in the free app for me, 8$/mon (annually billed) gets me the automatic temperature adjustment.  top tier 15$/month gets all that and some yoga/mediation videos (hello youtube?) and some other metrics and indicators about your sleep. 

[joemandadman189]

I got the ooler a few weeks ago and really like it.  After some time establishing the right temperature I do think I am sleeping better.  Frist night I took the advice of the instruction manual and set it to 65f, way to cold, bumped it put to 80 over night.  Then have been dropping it 1deg every night or two to where it is now in the low 70's.  That feels about right but will try a little cooler.  One of the big things the first first night was the ooler was set to med/high and I think it the flow rate was to high creating cool spots where there was a pressure contact and that was uncomeatable, 65 may be ok for me with with set to low.  My ooler is not quite, as some in the amazon review have noted it might be worth taking apart and installing a silent computer fan vs the stock fan.  I sleep with a white noise app so it not really a problem for me.

I have gone back to eight sleeps site a few times and when checking out the cost of the full featured app keeps dropping, is now 8$/month billed annually.  That is getting into the "maybe" realm.  8$/month for HRV tracking is a lot cheaper and easier than Whoop or Ōura ring.  I do dislike the business model of changing the pricing like this. 

Edit:  On further reading eight sleep now offers HRV tracking in the free app for me, 8$/mon (annually billed) gets me the automatic temperature adjustment.  top tier 15$/month gets all that and some yoga/mediation videos (hello youtube?) and some other metrics and indicators about your sleep.

check out the Oura ring for HRV and sleep tracking