Author Topic: Conscious non-mustachian choices?  (Read 11424 times)

Sjalabais

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Conscious non-mustachian choices?
« on: November 02, 2015, 10:02:04 AM »
In Europe, gas stations/oil cartels do a price dance over the course of the week. Whatever the price of oil, refineries and transport or whatever happens geopolitically, gas stations in my neck of the woods are cheapest on monday morning. There's also a minor "price valley" on thursday mornings.

The upside is that everyone with a mustachian inclination knows when to fill gas.

Today, the price jumped from 11.99 NOK/l (5.33 $/gallon) before rebates to 14.06 NOK/l (6.27 $/gallon) around noon. At the same time, there's a local unmanned and unbranded station that has sold gas for 5.78 $/gallon for months now. I am so happy that they break the meaningless cartel price nonsense, that I withstand the temptation to save a somewhat substantial amount of money per filling of ca 50l (13+ gallons).

Do you guys do anything financially stupid out of consciousness, pride or whatever motif?

norabird

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Re: Conscious non-mustachian choices?
« Reply #1 on: November 04, 2015, 11:24:06 AM »
I think choosing not to save money because spending less is unethical (buying something at a low cost clothing retailer which all use sweatshops for instance) is a great place to consciously resist being frugal.

frugalnacho

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Re: Conscious non-mustachian choices?
« Reply #2 on: November 04, 2015, 11:42:15 AM »
Drugs and alcohol.  I could reach FIRE sooner without that expense, but that's not a life I would like to live.

skunkfunk

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Re: Conscious non-mustachian choices?
« Reply #3 on: November 04, 2015, 12:43:33 PM »
I buy brewing supplies locally. I could get much better prices online, but the only thing I really order online are bulk hops.

Kinda dumb, sure, but I like to go and talk with a pleasant shop owner.

Sailor Sam

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Re: Conscious non-mustachian choices?
« Reply #4 on: November 04, 2015, 12:58:54 PM »
Coffee. At Starbucks, no less. The motif is: because I want it. Oh lŠ lŠ.

TrMama

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Re: Conscious non-mustachian choices?
« Reply #5 on: November 04, 2015, 01:07:23 PM »
My local bike shop. The guy who runs it gives fantastic advice, doesn't charge for quick fixes and I know the shop supports him and his small family.

Lately, all attention to grocery prices has gone out the window. My 7yo is dealing with some suspected food intolerances (aka horrid, constant stomach aches). Until I figure out exactly how much, if any, dairy and soy she can handle I don't give a crap about how much getting her safe food costs.

irishbear99

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Re: Conscious non-mustachian choices?
« Reply #6 on: November 05, 2015, 09:35:00 AM »
When REI announced they are going to be closed on Black Friday, I wanted to go out and buy a bunch of stuff I don't need from them. I didn't, but the impulse to reward them for not being assholes was pretty strong.

Hall11235

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Re: Conscious non-mustachian choices?
« Reply #7 on: November 05, 2015, 01:51:22 PM »
I spend a painful amount of money on Magic the Gathering. Willingly. Spent 100$ the other day and only got 4 cards.
My most face-punch worthy offense.

Astatine

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Re: Conscious non-mustachian choices?
« Reply #8 on: November 05, 2015, 02:08:01 PM »
I think choosing not to save money because spending less is unethical (buying something at a low cost clothing retailer which all use sweatshops for instance) is a great place to consciously resist being frugal.

I often don't succeed at making the optimal ethical or environmental choice, but my main reason for buying second hand is to avoid waste, not the financial savings.

But, sometimes spending more aligns with your values. For example, the OP wants to support an independent petrol station. I like to support independent grocers (luckily they're usually cheaper than the main supermarkets so it's often the frugal choice as well). I think of my shopping dollars supporting a local econonmic ecosystem. I value variety and small independent shops, so my spending tries to encourage a varied ecosystem at the various shopping centres we frequent.

JZinCO

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Re: Conscious non-mustachian choices?
« Reply #9 on: November 05, 2015, 02:38:09 PM »
Offroading. I am selling one vehicle, but keeping the other. Call it a sunk cost fallacy but I've already bought alot of parts, swapped axles, etc. Over three years, I've spent about $1500/yr on it, plus the initial purchase of $8k for both vehicles.  It could cost alot more to build offroad capable rigs, and if I took it on trails more often, stuff would break sooner. I also have changed my recreational priority from rock crawling to jack of all trades vehicle which can handle rough trails, camping, expedition, and daily driving activities. That means fewer $ spent.
As long as my financial goals are being met, I'm 'kay with my nonmustachian habit.
« Last Edit: November 05, 2015, 02:46:36 PM by JZinCO »

Sjalabais

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Re: Conscious non-mustachian choices?
« Reply #10 on: November 05, 2015, 02:43:02 PM »
A lot of good reasons for deviation here (and I'm glad not to be an outlier with the occasional stroll away from mustachian principles). I try to use my money like one would vote in an election.

Friends of mine say buying stuff of AliExpress and the like is very wasteful, seeing that it gets send from China. I figure almost everything I buy of batteries, lights, clothes etc comes from China anyway, so what's the difference? A lot of money saved here.

A classic car is also on my wish list, it's a long time ago now that I've had a classic to drive around in...but that's basically burning money. Big decision.

cautiouspessimist

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Re: Conscious non-mustachian choices?
« Reply #11 on: November 06, 2015, 02:06:45 PM »
I spend a painful amount of money on Magic the Gathering. Willingly. Spent 100$ the other day and only got 4 cards.
My most face-punch worthy offense.

The positive side of that is you'll probably be able to sell them for about the same amount. Possibly more! (of course, that depends on you avoiding Standard)

For example, I bought my Force of Wills for about $60 each, but sold them a couple of months ago for $380 for the set.

gimp

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Re: Conscious non-mustachian choices?
« Reply #12 on: November 06, 2015, 03:00:58 PM »
Gas. I drive. Short daily commute, but serious road trips. Vroom vroom, motherfuckers.

Also, camera gear. Goes well with the driving to new awesome places.

SpeedReader

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Re: Conscious non-mustachian choices?
« Reply #13 on: November 06, 2015, 09:13:52 PM »
I spend a painful amount of money on Magic the Gathering. Willingly. Spent 100$ the other day and only got 4 cards.
My most face-punch worthy offense.

The positive side of that is you'll probably be able to sell them for about the same amount. Possibly more! (of course, that depends on you avoiding Standard)

For example, I bought my Force of Wills for about $60 each, but sold them a couple of months ago for $380 for the set.

When my husband ran a gaming store, we referred to that stuff as "paper crack".

MgoSam

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Re: Conscious non-mustachian choices?
« Reply #14 on: November 06, 2015, 10:07:24 PM »
I spend a painful amount of money on Magic the Gathering. Willingly. Spent 100$ the other day and only got 4 cards.
My most face-punch worthy offense.

The positive side of that is you'll probably be able to sell them for about the same amount. Possibly more! (of course, that depends on you avoiding Standard)

For example, I bought my Force of Wills for about $60 each, but sold them a couple of months ago for $380 for the set.

When my husband ran a gaming store, we referred to that stuff as "paper crack".

Yeah, I have a friend that has a side hussle buying and selling Magic cards.

Hey It's Me

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Re: Conscious non-mustachian choices?
« Reply #15 on: November 08, 2015, 08:22:51 AM »
Coffee. Some months coffee makes up ~33% of my food/drinks budget. That said, this is only because that line item is so small to begin with. I've cut drastically where I could to splurge on the things I value. (Like a great cup of coffee.)

o2bfree

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Re: Conscious non-mustachian choices?
« Reply #16 on: November 09, 2015, 03:55:01 PM »
Clown bike. I dropped ~$2000 on a new bike a few years ago. I do use it for commuting, as well as pleasure and fitness riding, but I live close to work so it'd take me some 20 years of biking to work every day to break even on that front.

Homey The Clown

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Re: Conscious non-mustachian choices?
« Reply #17 on: November 09, 2015, 06:24:40 PM »
We spend a bit more than pre-school on a private elementary school for our kindergartener. It is worth every cent. The education is great, and he is excited about going to school every day. He also complains that we pick him up to soon. It's worth every penny.

Hall11235

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Re: Conscious non-mustachian choices?
« Reply #18 on: November 10, 2015, 10:47:11 AM »
I spend a painful amount of money on Magic the Gathering. Willingly. Spent 100$ the other day and only got 4 cards.
My most face-punch worthy offense.

The positive side of that is you'll probably be able to sell them for about the same amount. Possibly more! (of course, that depends on you avoiding Standard)

For example, I bought my Force of Wills for about $60 each, but sold them a couple of months ago for $380 for the set.

When my husband ran a gaming store, we referred to that stuff as "paper crack".

Yeah, I have a friend that has a side hussle buying and selling Magic cards.

Well, for what it's worth, they were polluted deltas. I expect those to be worth something in a year or two. Same with my Lorwyn Thoughtseize.

Standard is ridiculous right now.

I draft once a week for $12. We get three packs and about 3 hours of play time for that. I run train at my local LGS (I have gone 3-0 at three of the last 4 drafts) and usually win 3 to 5 booster packs, so that helps support the addiction. without trucking my wallet. 

cautiouspessimist

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Re: Conscious non-mustachian choices?
« Reply #19 on: November 12, 2015, 02:18:25 PM »
I spend a painful amount of money on Magic the Gathering. Willingly. Spent 100$ the other day and only got 4 cards.
My most face-punch worthy offense.

The positive side of that is you'll probably be able to sell them for about the same amount. Possibly more! (of course, that depends on you avoiding Standard)

For example, I bought my Force of Wills for about $60 each, but sold them a couple of months ago for $380 for the set.

When my husband ran a gaming store, we referred to that stuff as "paper crack".

Yeah, I have a friend that has a side hussle buying and selling Magic cards.

Well, for what it's worth, they were polluted deltas. I expect those to be worth something in a year or two. Same with my Lorwyn Thoughtseize.

Standard is ridiculous right now.

I draft once a week for $12. We get three packs and about 3 hours of play time for that. I run train at my local LGS (I have gone 3-0 at three of the last 4 drafts) and usually win 3 to 5 booster packs, so that helps support the addiction. without trucking my wallet.

Yeah, those should see a nice upward trend. If you can manage to win packs/get store credit consistently, then it's actually not a bad little hobby/side hustle.

Britan

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Re: Conscious non-mustachian choices?
« Reply #20 on: November 20, 2015, 08:54:31 AM »
1. Coffee ($20/week). Fresh beans from Whole Foods bulk. At least better than the two of us BUYING 48 oz of coffee every day. (Note: I only drink 8oz/day)

2 Rent ($1520 studio). I fucking love my luxury apartment and the community. We have had 2 building parties in the last 2 months. Free awesome food (sushi! Crab!) and the people are great! I've never been so happy with a place I've lived, and part of me thinks I may never be again once I move!

rockstache

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Re: Conscious non-mustachian choices?
« Reply #21 on: November 20, 2015, 09:01:48 AM »
Clothing. I hate shopping with such passion and wear my clothing out to such a pathetic threadbare state, that when I find something that actually fits well, I don't care how much it is. I look for coupons and wait for deals but I buy it.

Dicey

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Re: Conscious non-mustachian choices?
« Reply #22 on: November 20, 2015, 10:31:25 AM »
Do you guys do anything financially stupid out of consciousness...?
Uh, don't remember. I may be blocking something out unconsciously, though :-).

MgoSam

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Re: Conscious non-mustachian choices?
« Reply #23 on: November 24, 2015, 08:53:44 AM »
I spend a painful amount of money on Magic the Gathering. Willingly. Spent 100$ the other day and only got 4 cards.
My most face-punch worthy offense.

The positive side of that is you'll probably be able to sell them for about the same amount. Possibly more! (of course, that depends on you avoiding Standard)

For example, I bought my Force of Wills for about $60 each, but sold them a couple of months ago for $380 for the set.

When my husband ran a gaming store, we referred to that stuff as "paper crack".

Yeah, I have a friend that has a side hussle buying and selling Magic cards.

Well, for what it's worth, they were polluted deltas. I expect those to be worth something in a year or two. Same with my Lorwyn Thoughtseize.

Standard is ridiculous right now.

I draft once a week for $12. We get three packs and about 3 hours of play time for that. I run train at my local LGS (I have gone 3-0 at three of the last 4 drafts) and usually win 3 to 5 booster packs, so that helps support the addiction. without trucking my wallet.

This makes me extra glad that I never gotten into Magic the Gathering.

eljefe-speaks

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Re: Conscious non-mustachian choices?
« Reply #24 on: November 24, 2015, 09:38:00 AM »
This thread is saving my life. I have been feeling tremendous guilt and stress deciding whether to buy a rather modestly-priced motorcycle. My finances are in good shape. Also, itís a used bike at such a reasonable price, I can change my mind whenever I want (sell it) and not lose out too much. I just love motorcycles.

I would like to justify by saying it gets better gas mileage than my car, because it does, but factor in valve-adjustments, tires, and superflousness, and this sucker is definitely antimustachian.

Making Cookies

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Re: Conscious non-mustachian choices?
« Reply #25 on: November 24, 2015, 10:25:37 AM »
My conundrums orbits the topic of shopping.

Shopping locally at a somewhat higher cost than shopping online for the lower prices and larger variety. Sometimes want the convenience of online but like having hte shops here to visit when I'm in the mood to shop.

Want to support the local economy and grow our town's retail variety but then my practical side gets involved and I worry about the absolute lowest price again... I don't shop WalMart ever. Amazon and its cousins aren't any different though.

Am also having motivational problems with Christmas again. I like giving more than receiving (would be perfectly happy to not get anything for the holidays) but at the same time its feeling like Christmas is pointless again this year.

Enjoy the food and the time together (love that part) but why buy the gifts for adults in the first place?

Its so often things we wouldn't pick for ourselves or don't need. Its never anything really nice b/c everyone agrees to limit the prices of the gifts b/c we don't all have the same budgets to work with which is okay with me again.

The best part of Christmas is watching the kids opening their gifts.

Watching the adults open something that isn't quite their style isn't really any fun. We are just exchanging gifts that we purchased from a sale rack b/c it might be well received and it was under the spending limit. We as a group generally have everything we need and what we want is often very specific to a hobby.

Gift cards for everyone! Here is your $25 gift card and I thank you for the $25 gift card... ;)

Making Cookies

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Re: Conscious non-mustachian choices?
« Reply #26 on: November 24, 2015, 10:33:05 AM »
This thread is saving my life. I have been feeling tremendous guilt and stress deciding whether to buy a rather modestly-priced motorcycle. My finances are in good shape. Also, itís a used bike at such a reasonable price, I can change my mind whenever I want (sell it) and not lose out too much. I just love motorcycles.

I would like to justify by saying it gets better gas mileage than my car, because it does, but factor in valve-adjustments, tires, and superflousness, and this sucker is definitely antimustachian.

If you can afford it - buy it. Enjoy it. Take care of it and sell it if it's no fun anymore. I've had several motorcycles over the years and enjoyed each and every one. After we had kids, I gave up riding. When they are grown, I'll take up riding again.

Saving money and retiring early is great but you can't put off living for your entire life.

I have these days where I get up, go to work, come home again, sit around and watch TV/do a few chores, and then go to bed again. That's not living. Those are usually days when I had to work longer than usual or the weather is too poor to do much else but sit around. That's how I imagine getting too serious by my measure about FIRE could get.

Need to flavor life a little - music/books, good food (prepped at home), taking the long way home, laughter and companionship, kids and dogs, walks and exercise, etc. A ride on a motorcycle or driving an antique car fits right in there too. I have antique cars that I tinker with.

eljefe-speaks

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Re: Conscious non-mustachian choices?
« Reply #27 on: November 24, 2015, 10:42:49 AM »
This thread is saving my life. I have been feeling tremendous guilt and stress deciding whether to buy a rather modestly-priced motorcycle. My finances are in good shape. Also, itís a used bike at such a reasonable price, I can change my mind whenever I want (sell it) and not lose out too much. I just love motorcycles.

I would like to justify by saying it gets better gas mileage than my car, because it does, but factor in valve-adjustments, tires, and superflousness, and this sucker is definitely antimustachian.

If you can afford it - buy it. Enjoy it. Take care of it and sell it if it's no fun anymore. I've had several motorcycles over the years and enjoyed each and every one. After we had kids, I gave up riding. When they are grown, I'll take up riding again.

Saving money and retiring early is great but you can't put off living for your entire life.

I have these days where I get up, go to work, come home again, sit around and watch TV/do a few chores, and then go to bed again. That's not living. Those are usually days when I had to work longer than usual or the weather is too poor to do much else but sit around. That's how I imagine getting too serious by my measure about FIRE could get.

Need to flavor life a little - music/books, good food (prepped at home), taking the long way home, laughter and companionship, kids and dogs, walks and exercise, etc. A ride on a motorcycle or driving an antique car fits right in there too. I have antique cars that I tinker with.
[/

Great post Joe, thank you!

Marus

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Re: Conscious non-mustachian choices?
« Reply #28 on: December 04, 2015, 01:45:45 PM »
I prefer buying fancy local food & coffee when I can.  I spend my free time volunteering instead of developing side hustles or getting a second job.  I pay for an expensive gym membership even though I usually only find time to go there a couple times a week.  I pay $50 a month to meditate in a float tank. 

LifeAtTheLodgeHouse

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Re: Conscious non-mustachian choices?
« Reply #29 on: December 06, 2015, 07:26:57 PM »
Love this! I'll go...

1) My food bag - https://www.myfoodbag.co.nz/ it sends you your recipes and all the ingredients. I love it. Absolutely LOVE IT. Delicious recipes and good quality fresh food that has completely changed our life! Even though it is more expensive than buying the items yourself I think that we actually waste less and spend less as we are not in the shops that often and now only go for the things that we really need. Also my husband and I HATE going to the supermarket, only detested less than meal planning. We both work full time and I feel it has made life "manageable" I'd rather pay this expense, eat awesome food, be happier at working earning more cash to RE. We're also vegetarian and it has just completely changed the way we cook and the quantities are huge!

2) I won't compromise my ethics to save some cash - by that I mean I won't buy products that I know are tested on animals or clothing that is made in sweat shops just because I could get cheaper shampoo or eyeliner or t-shirt. I love Lush. There I said it, I LOVE LUSH. And I love original source shower gels!!! I smell awesome.

3) Good coffee - we buy ground coffee/beans from the local coffee shops who roast beans in house. I didn't notice  before but a year of buying from local roasters has turned me into a coffee snob and now when I buy other coffee I can taste how crap it is :) Same goes for tea aswell. I'm a coffee and tea snob and I don't care who knows it!

4) I get petrol from the petrol station on my way to/from from work. I don't know how much it would save me but I'm sure it's some. I need to work on this one.

primozaj

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Re: Conscious non-mustachian choices?
« Reply #30 on: December 07, 2015, 01:27:50 PM »
1) An expensive gym membership (like Marus) - however I train/compete in Powerlifting and the coaching is excellent and the equipment is in good shape without all of the fitness center fluff that annoys me... I explained it to someone as "just iron and bodies"

2) I used to get Blue Apron (similar to what LifeAtTheLodgeHouse has going in NZ).  It introduced me and my late wife to new ingredients/foods as well as new cooking techniques.  The recipes were laid out well and I enjoyed cooking it (well I just like cooking anyway).  I really like the lack of waste as they send you exact amounts... except for garlic, they always send a full head.  Unfortunately since my wife passed away I have skipped my deliveries for the past 7 weeks or so.  I'm going to try the "meals for two" again this week and see how well each meal keeps for lunch the next day.

So I guess it really comes down to hobbies... I guess I won't limit myself there.
« Last Edit: December 07, 2015, 01:29:24 PM by primozaj »

Travis

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Re: Conscious non-mustachian choices?
« Reply #31 on: December 07, 2015, 02:49:01 PM »
We really haven't done as much research and optimal choice-making regarding our grocery bill.  It's not huge by most measures ($400/mo for 3 people), but we're not making much effort to get it down any smaller.  It doesn't crop up often, but I am terrible at negotiating prices when the opportunity presents itself.  I'd rather just pay for what I want and be on my way.  I bought a used car 4 months ago from a dealership and while some folks here on the forum have playing hardball down to a science, I offered the sticker price minus some of the fees I knew I'd have to pay.  Some serious MMM car buyers would have been ruthless. I just wanted the car and I knew I was getting a decent price for it.

FI-42

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Re: Conscious non-mustachian choices?
« Reply #32 on: December 07, 2015, 03:36:36 PM »
Offroading. I am selling one vehicle, but keeping the other. Call it a sunk cost fallacy but I've already bought alot of parts, swapped axles, etc. Over three years, I've spent about $1500/yr on it, plus the initial purchase of $8k for both vehicles.  It could cost alot more to build offroad capable rigs, and if I took it on trails more often, stuff would break sooner. I also have changed my recreational priority from rock crawling to jack of all trades vehicle which can handle rough trails, camping, expedition, and daily driving activities. That means fewer $ spent.
As long as my financial goals are being met, I'm 'kay with my nonmustachian habit.
I think motorsport in all it's forms is probably the most anti-mustacian hobby one can have.  I spent $7500 go-karting last year (a team of 4 of us spent $30000 collectively).  It's budgeted for, I have one more year and then I start taking it less seriously (because I want to retire!).  2017 budget will be $1500.   MMM would cry if he knew.

TravelJunkyQC

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Re: Conscious non-mustachian choices?
« Reply #33 on: December 08, 2015, 07:04:29 AM »
Traveling is my vice - although I am careful when picking out my flights and accommodations (VRBO or Airbnb always). However, once at my destination, I don't worry about money because I am careful the rest of the year while I'm home. Also, I don't like eating out, but I love making dinner for people. I am of the generation who is supposed to ask people to contribute for the dinner I make, but I wasn't raised that way - so it can get expensive when I make a meal for my friends. However, these are two things that make me happy. Replacing my 2004 car with a dimple in its side wouldn't. I'm okay with the trade-off.

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Re: Conscious non-mustachian choices?
« Reply #34 on: December 08, 2015, 08:23:40 AM »
I think if you define Mustachianism strictly as a financial approach, not only do you run the risk of becoming a miser, but you've missed a large part of what this guy is trying to teach people.

I care a lot about the humanitarian issues stemming from our current overconsumption and environmental degradation. In practice, this means that I not only look for the money-saving solution that also reduces resource usage, but often deliberately choose to spend more money if it means lower resource consumption. Early LED adopter, early EV driver (though the car will literally pay for itself in time, the up-front cost did reduce investments), etc. Going farther to trading my own money for others' resource efficiency, I even offer two free public chargers (at our home and one rental) to increase freedom of movement for fellow drivers in an EVSE-sparse area. With a "same boat" mentality, this can be framed as uber-Mustachian, but it does cost me money and I personally get nothing for it, so take it as you like.

As far as deliberate anti-Mustachianism... I indulge occasionally. I have a friend who's an artist and I catered his latest opening on my own dime - my way of supporting the scene without adding to the stack of pictures I can't hang because we gave up 40% of our square footage to live efficiently.

I also seem to vacillate between minimal Christmas spending and actively encouraging my sisters and their kids to give me long lists of shit so I can blow $1000 on presents. I felt deprived as a kid and was stuck in overcorrect mode for years - so even when I don't want anything, I get a huge rush from indulging them.

Sjalabais

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Re: Conscious non-mustachian choices?
« Reply #35 on: December 08, 2015, 03:18:41 PM »
You're absolutely right, it's balancing the knife's edge if you incorporate the MMM approach and don't know when to stop thinking money only. I'm a bit sceptical to those tips around here like "don't warm up your house". Would be harsh here in Norway, and everybody should do how it suits them, but I gladly pay for electricity and firewood (which I could produce myself if I've had the surplus time and energy).

The low-consumption-approach is something my wife and I have been living all our lifes, even with our parents. But now that we are parents ourselves, I think it's getting much harder. Other kids can literally swim in plastic crap in their bedrooms, and our kids talk more about their friend's toys than their friends. Again, there's a danger in overdoing it.

MgoSam

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Re: Conscious non-mustachian choices?
« Reply #36 on: December 08, 2015, 05:19:37 PM »
That's a fair point.

saving_dutchman

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Re: Conscious non-mustachian choices?
« Reply #37 on: December 09, 2015, 03:19:15 AM »
I think the big difference between MMM and ERE is making a conscious choice to spent money on anti-mustachian things. In the MMM yearly budget there is a category of bare minimum expenses and a category with stuff that can be avoided if the need for it arises.

That's what makes MMM so damn awesome. You can indulge on stuff that makes you happy all you want as long as you think about the effects. MMM promotes making a conscious decision on these things and reminds you of the long term effects.

I make a conscious decision to spent money on vacations and alcoholic drinks that are way too expensive.