Author Topic: Can you have antimustacian friends?  (Read 11715 times)

K-ice

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Can you have antimustacian friends?
« on: July 14, 2015, 10:28:22 PM »
Kind of along the line of "relatives who don't get it" or "heard at work" I was wondering what antimustacian things your friends say.

Maybe they are talking about themselves or maybe they comment on something you have done.

I was with an old friend and some of her new friends the other day.

NF "I love your new glasses"
OF " Thanks, my hubby was surprised I got another pair. But you know what I'm like with glasses, bags & oh shoes."
NF "giggle giggle oh yes bags & shoes."
OF "just the other day I wore out a pair of sandles. I can't remember ever wearing something out before I didn't like it. "

Honestly, ever?!

I could hardly participate in any of the conversation. Maybe they all make way more money than me and can afford it all. But I'm honestly worried that is a bad keeping up with The Jones crowd. I would like to spend more time with this old friend again but it may not be healthy. ;)

Can you have antimustacian friends?











ahoy

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Re: Can you have antimustacian friends?
« Reply #1 on: July 15, 2015, 04:10:38 AM »
I just spent a few days with a friend and she was spend, spend, spend.  She spent approx $120 in a morning, she seems to have a fantastic excuse for buying everything.  I spent $6 and regret it.  I'll probably end up throwing away the two things I bought, because surely they will not last.  The point is, I would not have bought $6 worth of junk if I wasn't with her and her comments "it's only money".

forummm

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Re: Can you have antimustacian friends?
« Reply #2 on: July 15, 2015, 06:07:25 AM »
It's irritating to have them at work because they want you to go to lunch with them to the place that has $17 sandwiches. And they make it an "office lunch" so you'll be the only person not going.

neophyte

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Re: Can you have antimustacian friends?
« Reply #3 on: July 15, 2015, 06:44:01 AM »
I don't like wearing things out either :(   I'm of the opinion that things should last forever. Even the sneakers I walk 20+ miles a week in! 

benjenn

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Re: Can you have antimustacian friends?
« Reply #4 on: July 15, 2015, 06:59:55 AM »
DH and I are FIREing in a matter of days (less than 10 work days now!  Woo-hoo!) so I've been going to lunch a lot lately with colleagues (not co-workers but people I work with in hotels, etc.).  Just yesterday I was sitting in a Sales Director's office talking to her and one of her co-workers about our plans after retiring (we're moving to the beach!).  I've worked with the 2 of them for almost 20 years... they're both about 5 years older than I am.  They couldn't believe that we are able to retire... and that we weren't planning to work in any kind of jobs after we retire.  I told them we had made some choices that not everyone makes... but that we were happy and think we can continue to be happy without working.  They just marveled at our plans and exclaimed their envy.

Then two of us left to go to lunch (she was buying... I'm sure it was a business expense).  As we were leaving her office she was telling me she thought her husband would retire as soon as he turns 62 and can collect Social Security.  He's a private pilot and has no other pension or 401K so he'll need Social Security.  She said he has to have his toys...a  motorcycle... a boat.  She told me how happy she was he just downgraded his motorcycle to one much less expensive... the payments are $100 less per month. (But will probably take longer to pay off, of course).  She was proud of that.  And then we climbed into her BMW.  I commented that she'd gotten a new car... because the last time I drove with her, she had a completely DIFFERENT BMW.  She said yes, she changed cars so her payment would be less.  Then she told me how she had LEASED this one because she was so upside down on the last one.  Wow.

So.... I like this woman a lot.  I have always enjoyed working with her.  But I think if I brought up anything MMM related, her head would explode.  LOL.

Mrs.LC

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Re: Can you have antimustacian friends?
« Reply #5 on: July 15, 2015, 07:00:56 AM »
Yes you can have spender friends. Most of our friends are spenders as that is more of the norm. They drive fancy trucks, take frequent trips to the casino, have designer clothes, go out to eat multiple times a week, etc. When we get together it is on mutually agreed terms. Usually it ends up being an evening at our house hanging out at the fire pit, a BS session, game night, etc. all accompanied by homemade wine.

I'm a red panda

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Re: Can you have antimustacian friends?
« Reply #6 on: July 15, 2015, 07:06:55 AM »
Most of my friends are non-mustachian.  Either they get a lot more help from parents than we do, are way higher paid than we are, or are severely in debt (in many cases a combination of all of these).  It is amazing how much money they all spend.


Shinplaster

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Re: Can you have antimustacian friends?
« Reply #7 on: July 15, 2015, 07:36:36 AM »
I have one friend that used to be mustachian, because she had to be.  Now, circumstances have changed, and it seems she spends her entire life shopping, or planning to buy something.  We have been friends for over 25 years, but I find it exhausting when we are out together to resist her "you should buy that", and "that would look so good on you" comments.  We are retired, she will not for a few more years, so I've just resorted to saying these things are not in our retirement budget.   Then I get the look of pity that we will not be as well off in retirement as they (but plenty comfortable for us!).   I'm not sure this friendship will survive the constant barrage of consumerism.

Insanity

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Re: Can you have antimustacian friends?
« Reply #8 on: July 15, 2015, 07:56:52 AM »

Most of my friends are non-mustachian.  Either they get a lot more help from parents than we do, are way higher paid than we are, or are severely in debt (in many cases a combination of all of these).  It is amazing how much money they all spend.

This about sums up our situation as well.

Our "help" was a loan from my parents which I am aggressively paying back as I want then to enjoy their retirement (granted, the loan has zero impact on them as they make more in their retirement funds than they spend).

Kitsunegari

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Re: Can you have antimustacian friends?
« Reply #9 on: July 15, 2015, 08:09:03 AM »
In my experience, you can have non-mustache friends if you have some common hobbies. A couple of our best friends can't save money to save their life, but we meet up for bbq or to make jams or for bike rides, so quality time that costs us almost nothing.
Then when they invite us bar hopping, we politely decline and make plans with them for next pic nic.

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Re: Can you have antimustacian friends?
« Reply #10 on: July 15, 2015, 08:13:04 AM »

Most of my friends are non-mustachian.  Either they get a lot more help from parents than we do, are way higher paid than we are, or are severely in debt (in many cases a combination of all of these).  It is amazing how much money they all spend.

This about sums up our situation as well.

Our "help" was a loan from my parents which I am aggressively paying back as I want then to enjoy their retirement (granted, the loan has zero impact on them as they make more in their retirement funds than they spend).

We have a friend who brags about how her house is 60% paid off.  Her parents paid a 50% down payment. Now, the parents had an excellent reason to do so, I don't begrudge her  the money; but it seems an odd thing to brag about when they've only paid 10%.

My parents do gives us a few hundred dollars for christmas and my birthday, but other than family reunion vacations where they pay for the condo, they don't pay for things for us.  And haven't since I graduated college.  (My SIL thought my great-aunt, who is quite rich, bought our first house for us. I have no idea why. She certainly didn't.)


Iron Mike Sharpe

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Re: Can you have antimustacian friends?
« Reply #11 on: July 15, 2015, 08:27:08 AM »
I do not need my friends to have the same philosophical, political, or religious beliefs as I have.  I am secure enough that it does not matter if someone lives their life differently.  It just means they come from a position of different assumptions about the human condition. 

Cookie78

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Re: Can you have antimustacian friends?
« Reply #12 on: July 15, 2015, 08:37:15 AM »
If all my friends had to be mustachian I wouldn't have (m)any friends. There are a few friends who have/desire big houses/trucks/toys and spend money as soon as they can. There are others who have goals that require saving and do not spend as much.

But I don't have any ANTI-mustachian friends, as in friends who would ridicule or sabotage my mustachian efforts.

Erica/NWEdible

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Re: Can you have antimustacian friends?
« Reply #13 on: July 15, 2015, 08:39:46 AM »
I think it depends on what a friend is to you. My close friends - my real friends - tend to share a similar core of values with me, so even if they are not Mustachian they are thoughtful people who use their money as a tool to enhance their own life and take responsibility for their own actions and tend to have a certain environmental awareness. I also feel I can be relatively open and honest with these people about spending and related values, so while finances don't dominate our conversations, there's never a point where I have to outright lie to maintain their comfort.

OTOH, I was having a conversation with an acquaintance the other day. This person almost immediately launched into a woe-is-me tirade about the high cost of everything, and how difficult is was making ends meet, whilst also making it clear that they spent an obscene and totally voluntary amount of money on nearly every aspect of their lives. Outwardly I had to do the "smile sympathetically, murmur about how tough it can be, and nod" thing while inwardly I'm screaming, "someone hand me the clue-by-4." So the entire conversation, basically I lied by omission in order to defer to this acquaintance's belief that it was just really hard to be rich and white in America. While this person is very nice, and we have several things in common, they will never become a close friend because I just can't do that on a routine basis.

TheAnonOne

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Re: Can you have antimustacian friends?
« Reply #14 on: July 15, 2015, 01:35:17 PM »
I can't fathom why it would matter? Are people on this forum so sensitive that they can't get over other people buying things?

I go out with some spendier friends occasionally, have some drinks, and a good time. The added cost yearly is a fraction of a percent. Big deal...

Spiffsome

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Re: Can you have antimustacian friends?
« Reply #15 on: July 15, 2015, 06:11:49 PM »
To me, a difference in spending habits is like any other difference between me and my friends. Religion, politics, sexual orientation, lifestyle - you have to have some things in common to get along, but demanding that all of your friends are exactly like you is unrealistic.

Merrie

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Re: Can you have antimustacian friends?
« Reply #16 on: July 15, 2015, 09:27:40 PM »
We were never big into going out, and shifted more to staying in and cooking after having kid #1, and even more so after having kid #2. Since a lot of our friends also have young kids, it makes complete sense to get together at somebody's house rather than going to a restaurant. Childless friends or those whose babies will still sleep anywhere are particularly easy to have over, and we can have adult conversation after our kid are in bed. And we are pretty much always willing to cook for people. Net effect: decent social life, and we are the hosts a large majority of the time. It works well. If they are being spendypants on their own time it doesn't infringe on us.

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Re: Can you have antimustacian friends?
« Reply #17 on: July 15, 2015, 10:27:06 PM »
Yes, as long as they aren't "Anti-" enough to pull you into the black hole of their inefficient spending habits. More like "Non-Mustachian" friends, I guess.

Many of my friends are your classic "car guys". In my pre-Mustachian days, we used to bond over these kinds of things, whether it was modding/tuning, stereo systems, whatever. Now that I've gone car-free, I've changed the way that I interact with the group, but we still have all that and lots of other things in common. They still do lots of things I'd never consider, like finance new muscle cars with 500HP or have 5 cars at once, but none of these things affect me or compel me to support them. I'm appreciative that they're willing to share their passion for this stuff with me.

Kitsunegari

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Re: Can you have antimustacian friends?
« Reply #18 on: July 16, 2015, 07:09:29 AM »
To me, a difference in spending habits is like any other difference between me and my friends. Religion, politics, sexual orientation, lifestyle - you have to have some things in common to get along, but demanding that all of your friends are exactly like you is unrealistic.

Also, it would made a very boring and static company. You need friends with different values/opinions/priorities/lifestyles to remember that the world is big and diverse and you're not necessarily always right...

sheepstache

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Re: Can you have antimustacian friends?
« Reply #19 on: July 16, 2015, 08:10:39 AM »
I've noticed a lot of people on this forum made unhappy by spendy friends. Often it's friends they made when they themselves were spendy. So while I wouldn't say you should dump friends if you don't have to, it does seem to invite misery.

Often the problem isn't the mismatching spending levels, it's the attitude. The spendy friends think trying to save money is stupid. Whereas plenty of people like to spend all their money to 'live large' but understand others may have different priorities. So, it's sort of like the advice to couples. It's not whether you agree on everything, it's whether you get stressed out when you disagree.

Candace

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Re: Can you have antimustacian friends?
« Reply #20 on: July 16, 2015, 08:25:01 AM »
If all my friends had to be mustachian I wouldn't have (m)any friends. There are a few friends who have/desire big houses/trucks/toys and spend money as soon as they can. There are others who have goals that require saving and do not spend as much.

But I don't have any ANTI-mustachian friends, as in friends who would ridicule or sabotage my mustachian efforts.

Nicely put.

This person almost immediately launched into a woe-is-me tirade about the high cost of everything, and how difficult is was making ends meet, whilst also making it clear that they spent an obscene and totally voluntary amount of money on nearly every aspect of their lives. Outwardly I had to do the "smile sympathetically, murmur about how tough it can be, and nod" thing while inwardly I'm screaming, "someone hand me the clue-by-4." So the entire conversation, basically I lied by omission in order to defer to this acquaintance's belief that it was just really hard to be rich and white in America. While this person is very nice, and we have several things in common, they will never become a close friend because I just can't do that on a routine basis.

Ha ha. This is great.

ducky19

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Re: Can you have antimustacian friends?
« Reply #21 on: July 16, 2015, 09:05:49 AM »
I consider our neighbors to be friends, and they are most certainly not mustachian. They like to have nice things - I don't begrudge them that. Honestly, if anything, seeing their rate of consumption helps keep my spending in check. Another of our former neighbors recently came by their place to visit - in a brand new, top of the line, $68k Suburban. She (all 5'1" of her) hopped out all by herself and walked in the house. SMH. I can't even begin to imagine the payment she has on that thing!

Davids

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Re: Can you have antimustacian friends?
« Reply #22 on: July 16, 2015, 10:20:18 AM »
You can have antimustachian friends. You can also not be friends with a mustachian. Just because someone shares a different personal finance philosophy than you does not mean you can't be friends.

mm1970

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Re: Can you have antimustacian friends?
« Reply #23 on: July 16, 2015, 10:29:08 AM »
DH and I are FIREing in a matter of days (less than 10 work days now!  Woo-hoo!) so I've been going to lunch a lot lately with colleagues (not co-workers but people I work with in hotels, etc.).  Just yesterday I was sitting in a Sales Director's office talking to her and one of her co-workers about our plans after retiring (we're moving to the beach!).  I've worked with the 2 of them for almost 20 years... they're both about 5 years older than I am.  They couldn't believe that we are able to retire... and that we weren't planning to work in any kind of jobs after we retire.  I told them we had made some choices that not everyone makes... but that we were happy and think we can continue to be happy without working.  They just marveled at our plans and exclaimed their envy.

Then two of us left to go to lunch (she was buying... I'm sure it was a business expense).  As we were leaving her office she was telling me she thought her husband would retire as soon as he turns 62 and can collect Social Security.  He's a private pilot and has no other pension or 401K so he'll need Social Security.  She said he has to have his toys...a  motorcycle... a boat.  She told me how happy she was he just downgraded his motorcycle to one much less expensive... the payments are $100 less per month. (But will probably take longer to pay off, of course).  She was proud of that.  And then we climbed into her BMW.  I commented that she'd gotten a new car... because the last time I drove with her, she had a completely DIFFERENT BMW.  She said yes, she changed cars so her payment would be less.  Then she told me how she had LEASED this one because she was so upside down on the last one.  Wow.

So.... I like this woman a lot.  I have always enjoyed working with her.  But I think if I brought up anything MMM related, her head would explode.  LOL.

Yay, you are getting close!!

Few of my friends are truly mustachian.  It can be isolating.  I have friends that we used to hang out with a lot.  Dinners at each others' houses, go to the park/ beach together, go camping together.  And some other friends that we would do similar things with.

Both sets of friends like to eat out a lot more than we do.  (I simply cannot for money and waistline reasons).  Well, they have found each other.  So now their families hang out together a lot.

Sometimes it's about seeing them less frequently when you can, and then also finding others who are mustachian by need or choice.

LiveLean

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Re: Can you have antimustacian friends?
« Reply #24 on: July 16, 2015, 12:20:09 PM »
Mustachians end up around other mustachians. I spend much of my time around endurance athletes. So we're running, biking, paddling, and swimming together. And while equipment and race entry fees can be expensive, we've not shopping, driving clown cars, and spending a lot of money on eating/drinking (other than high-quality stuff that fuels our performance). And while some colleagues buy what could be called "clown bikes," they ride them hundreds of miles a month, if not a week, and don't need to belong to gyms, hire personal trainers, etc.

My antimustachian friends -- more like acquaintances -- like to go out to eat and drink a lot, see first-run movies at night, acquire all of the latest electronic gadgets, including TVs and accessories they spend a lot of time watching. Not for me.

MgoSam

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Re: Can you have antimustacian friends?
« Reply #25 on: July 16, 2015, 12:27:45 PM »
Depends, but sure. I have a mix of mustachian, near mustachian, not thinking, and antimustacians. It is important to understand a little of the distinction. I consider mustachian to be someone here, someone that is frugal and is intentional about doing it. Near mustachian are in my minds frugal people.

Not thinking is someone that may or may not spend money without thinking. The antimustacians are the ones that spend money with abandon, either drowning in credit card debt or living paycheck to paycheck. I have several friends that fit this category, and I do hang out with them from time to time, but try to always make it at someone's house or at an event. I won't go bar hopping with them or anything that requires me to pay as much or near as much as they are to keep up. Some of them think little of spending a few hundred on a night out, and so I avoid hanging out with them. If they invite me to go boating with them or over at their house to hang out, I'm more than happy to do so and bring some alcohol to contribute.

It's perfectly ok to be around people that different views than us, in fact I think it is healthy. The key though is a balance, and keeping yourself somewhat disciplined. Else you risk spending way more than you think. I know that if more of my friends were antimustachians I would need to find new friends. Or if my antimustachian friends were the type that would criticize my clothes or car, that would be an entirely different story.


sstants

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Re: Can you have antimustacian friends?
« Reply #26 on: July 20, 2015, 07:55:39 AM »
I can and do have friends with all sorts of different spending patterns, definitely. I'm just noticing more and more now what my friends' spending habits are like. I wasn't so aware of it when we were all in college. I think the huge issue here is that we DON'T TALK ABOUT MONEY and it drives me nuts!!! I remember my parents always telling me that it wasn't polite to talk about money, politics, religion etc (Crazy).

I think about all the other personal things that I trust my friends with and vice versa...the money dialog is just going to take a little more time to open up. I also don't necessarily want my friends to be the exact same as me, financially or otherwise!

Making Cookies

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Re: Can you have antimustacian friends?
« Reply #27 on: July 20, 2015, 08:29:06 AM »
Also, it would made a very boring and static company. You need friends with different values/opinions/priorities/lifestyles to remember that the world is big and diverse and you're not necessarily always right...

Yep - but its a trip to spend Friday evening with your gay friends and Saturday night with your conservative friends. It requires alot of compartmentalization. ;) We do it sometimes though.

Making Cookies

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Re: Can you have antimustacian friends?
« Reply #28 on: July 20, 2015, 08:43:47 AM »

Not thinking is someone that may or may not spend money without thinking. The antimustacians are the ones that spend money with abandon, either drowning in credit card debt or living paycheck to paycheck. I have several friends that fit this category, and I do hang out with them from time to time, but try to always make it at someone's house or at an event. I won't go bar hopping with them or anything that requires me to pay as much or near as much as they are to keep up. Some of them think little of spending a few hundred on a night out, and so I avoid hanging out with them. If they invite me to go boating with them or over at their house to hang out, I'm more than happy to do so and bring some alcohol to contribute.

So MMM folks need to settle near each other in four or five groups across the country so everyone can have a social life with other Mustashians... All these locations would be located in LCOL areas of course. Sort of like the John Galt character in Ann Rynd's book "Atlas Shrugged".

From Wikipedia: "The strikers have created their own secret enclave known as "Galt's Gulch", a town secluded in a Colorado mountain valley, based on Ouray, Colorado." 

We already live in a LCOL area. Almost seems better to base friendships on unimportant topics like "play dates" for the kids or BBQs or shared interests in movies and let the friend broach the topic of frugalism than bring it up.

The tough thing is that friend is struggling along like the (apparently) typical mainstream American and you'd like to share a little insight early so they too can enjoy time for compound interest to benefit them.   

We'll stick with "leading by example" - let our success be the invitation to questions by the regular folks. That was a favorite phrase used by a Navy Admiral I thought alot of when I was in the Navy. "lead by example".

Try to teach Mustachianism and their eyes glaze over. Either it's our presentation or they have no interest in making efforts to adjust to "no debt".

They'd rather worry about what's on TV this week or the topic du jour on the 24 hour news channel.

Making Cookies

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Re: Can you have antimustacian friends?
« Reply #29 on: July 20, 2015, 09:10:38 AM »
I can and do have friends with all sorts of different spending patterns, definitely. I'm just noticing more and more now what my friends' spending habits are like. I wasn't so aware of it when we were all in college. I think the huge issue here is that we DON'T TALK ABOUT MONEY and it drives me nuts!!! I remember my parents always telling me that it wasn't polite to talk about money, politics, religion etc (Crazy).

Yep! MMM has been the *best* education for us. Seeing how some people spend/save - the good and the bad has been SO valuable for me.

I also came from a family where the money topic has never been discussed enough. I think this is hugely important to discuss with your children at least. Give them some perspective on what it costs to live and what a fair salary amounts to. That can help them (I hope) have a realistic outlook on career choice and spending habits. Otherwise they do what so many of us do - assume that their peers of ordinary means are rich (somehow) when their peers are just in debt up to their eyeballs. Best to figure that out before you emulate your friends' bad choices. Fortunately (or unfortunately) we have had plenty of examples to quietly point out to our children in the privacy of our home.

The best part of my "education" came form the "school of hard knocks" i.e. I learned I did not want to be poor b/c I was poor for a few years while starting my adult life. I had a few people take advantage of me (pay me less than I was worth while trying to make me think I was making top dollar). I had a few people outright lie to me. Etc. We got smarter over time... ;) Always fun to get taken advantage of by a person that quotes scripture...

I see reasons not to discuss these touchy topics with some folks - they have fixed ideas about everything and hold the belief that they are the only right people on earth. They don't want to discuss (exchange ideas) they just want to preach (want an audience).
« Last Edit: July 20, 2015, 09:19:55 AM by Joe Average »

iamlittlehedgehog

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Re: Can you have antimustacian friends?
« Reply #30 on: July 20, 2015, 09:49:48 AM »
I wouldn't say we have Mustachain friends. More like broke friends. They don't spend money because they don't have money to spend.
I was lamenting how isolating it can be when you can't afford to go out and socialize at bars anymore (I know, I know, I snapped out of it pretty quickly). The next day DH found out that one of our friends (a married couple) dropped $200+ at an alternative nightclub that evening. I almost gagged on my food. I can't imagine. This couple just bought a "starter" house on a 30 year loan and have 13k in credit card debt.

MgoSam

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Re: Can you have antimustacian friends?
« Reply #31 on: July 20, 2015, 11:30:17 AM »
I can and do have friends with all sorts of different spending patterns, definitely. I'm just noticing more and more now what my friends' spending habits are like. I wasn't so aware of it when we were all in college. I think the huge issue here is that we DON'T TALK ABOUT MONEY and it drives me nuts!!! I remember my parents always telling me that it wasn't polite to talk about money, politics, religion etc (Crazy).

Yep! MMM has been the *best* education for us. Seeing how some people spend/save - the good and the bad has been SO valuable for me.

I also came from a family where the money topic has never been discussed enough. I think this is hugely important to discuss with your children at least. Give them some perspective on what it costs to live and what a fair salary amounts to. That can help them (I hope) have a realistic outlook on career choice and spending habits. Otherwise they do what so many of us do - assume that their peers of ordinary means are rich (somehow) when their peers are just in debt up to their eyeballs. Best to figure that out before you emulate your friends' bad choices. Fortunately (or unfortunately) we have had plenty of examples to quietly point out to our children in the privacy of our home.

The best part of my "education" came form the "school of hard knocks" i.e. I learned I did not want to be poor b/c I was poor for a few years while starting my adult life. I had a few people take advantage of me (pay me less than I was worth while trying to make me think I was making top dollar). I had a few people outright lie to me. Etc. We got smarter over time... ;) Always fun to get taken advantage of by a person that quotes scripture...

I see reasons not to discuss these touchy topics with some folks - they have fixed ideas about everything and hold the belief that they are the only right people on earth. They don't want to discuss (exchange ideas) they just want to preach (want an audience).

I wasn't entirely serious in my post. What I was trying to say is that I have a variety of friends, a few of which I found out randomly are active readers of MMM. At the end of the day I care more about their personalities and love having a variety of friends.

asiljoy

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Re: Can you have antimustacian friends?
« Reply #32 on: July 20, 2015, 06:25:45 PM »
It's irritating to have them at work because they want you to go to lunch with them to the place that has $17 sandwiches. And they make it an "office lunch" so you'll be the only person not going.
And then comes the side-eye for not participating at work. I've gotten lectures about being a part of the 'team' from more than one boss for this exact scenario.

YoungInvestor

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Re: Can you have antimustacian friends?
« Reply #33 on: July 20, 2015, 10:06:27 PM »
I have friends who are more frugal than me, and some who spend more. Most of them are more frugal in some aspects of their life and more spendy in others. It's a matter of differing opinions.

Frankly, we're all past caring what everyone else is buying.

I think too many people (here and elsewhere) tend to feel like other people who behave differently are trying to pressure them, while they're not. I'm sure that, if we went around and asked those people whom people here complain about, we'd find out that they feel their mustachian friend is pressuring them into the MMM lifestyle.

It's all a matter of perspective, with a healthy dose of not caring.

zephyr911

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Re: Can you have antimustacian friends?
« Reply #34 on: July 21, 2015, 10:38:59 AM »
So MMM folks need to settle near each other in four or five groups across the country so everyone can have a social life with other Mustashians... All these locations would be located in LCOL areas of course. Sort of like the John Galt character in Ann Rynd's book "Atlas Shrugged".

From Wikipedia: "The strikers have created their own secret enclave known as "Galt's Gulch", a town secluded in a Colorado mountain valley, based on Ouray, Colorado." 
I hate to rain on the isolationist fantasy parade, but one of the best things about being Mustachian is profiting from the proliferation of humans living the opposite way. Living this way wouldn't be so profitable if everyone around you were doing the same thing - in fact, FIRE would be much more difficult to achieve.

Frugal_NYC

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Re: Can you have antimustacian friends?
« Reply #35 on: July 21, 2015, 12:30:41 PM »
I would hate having only Mustachian friends.  To me, being Mustachian is fun because it's weird....I like being surround by normal (broke) because it's a constant reminder to keep doing what I'm doing

MgoSam

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Re: Can you have antimustacian friends?
« Reply #36 on: July 21, 2015, 02:14:23 PM »
I would hate having only Mustachian friends.  To me, being Mustachian is fun because it's weird....I like being surround by normal (broke) because it's a constant reminder to keep doing what I'm doing

Yeah and I'll admit, I like having friends that spend money because they often have cool toys to play with. A buddy of mine just bought a boat and invited me to go fishing with him. I wouldn't buy a boat for myself, but am happy to use someone else's and bring some money for gas or beer to share.

sstants

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Re: Can you have antimustacian friends?
« Reply #37 on: July 22, 2015, 07:44:22 AM »

I also came from a family where the money topic has never been discussed enough. I think this is hugely important to discuss with your children at least. Give them some perspective on what it costs to live and what a fair salary amounts to. That can help them (I hope) have a realistic outlook on career choice and spending habits. Otherwise they do what so many of us do - assume that their peers of ordinary means are rich (somehow) when their peers are just in debt up to their eyeballs. Best to figure that out before you emulate your friends' bad choices. Fortunately (or unfortunately) we have had plenty of examples to quietly point out to our children in the privacy of our home.

I totally agree, and I'm keeping this in mind for when I have kids. My 90 pound hound dog doesn't really care about money, just as long as there's enough kibble around, so I don't have anyone to discuss with just yet.

Here's something nuts: my parents talked about $$ in such vague ways early on that I had crazy misconceptions for quite a while. I thought that when they referred to making $X per year that you just got one check on December 31st for that amount after working for the year. The concept of a biweekly paycheck was totally foreign to me. My first few jobs were awesome babysitting gigs, so no paychecks there, just cold hard cash. Then I got my first retail job in high school and boy was I surprised!!

Back to the topic of this thread though, something I've definitely noticed about my more non-mustachian friends' financial habits is that they tend to have non-mustachian parents as a rule.

zephyr911

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Re: Can you have antimustacian friends?
« Reply #38 on: July 23, 2015, 08:28:18 AM »
I've noticed a lot of people on this forum made unhappy by spendy friends. Often it's friends they made when they themselves were spendy. So while I wouldn't say you should dump friends if you don't have to, it does seem to invite misery.

Often the problem isn't the mismatching spending levels, it's the attitude. The spendy friends think trying to save money is stupid. Whereas plenty of people like to spend all their money to 'live large' but understand others may have different priorities. So, it's sort of like the advice to couples. It's not whether you agree on everything, it's whether you get stressed out when you disagree.
I have one friend who's broke as shit, spends more on convenience food/items than I do, AND has given me hardcore shit multiple times for not spending more on various things that seemed totally needless to me. It makes me not want to hang out with him.

enb123

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Re: Can you have antimustacian friends?
« Reply #39 on: July 23, 2015, 09:07:56 AM »
I've noticed a lot of people on this forum made unhappy by spendy friends. Often it's friends they made when they themselves were spendy. So while I wouldn't say you should dump friends if you don't have to, it does seem to invite misery.

Often the problem isn't the mismatching spending levels, it's the attitude. The spendy friends think trying to save money is stupid. Whereas plenty of people like to spend all their money to 'live large' but understand others may have different priorities. So, it's sort of like the advice to couples. It's not whether you agree on everything, it's whether you get stressed out when you disagree.
I have one friend who's broke as shit, spends more on convenience food/items than I do, AND has given me hardcore shit multiple times for not spending more on various things that seemed totally needless to me. It makes me not want to hang out with him.
That's basically everyone I know, except for my wife. So I hang out with her mainly!

willow

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Re: Can you have antimustacian friends?
« Reply #40 on: July 25, 2015, 09:58:39 PM »
Most of my friends are non-mustacian, not anti-mustacian.
But sure it goes with the territory.

Mustacians:


I love this. Spot on. I have lots of anti-mustachian buddies, but that's probably more because of numbers than anything else.

I will say, because I'm less willing to spend the extra cash they sometimes go out without me but that's just how it is when you don't want to spend money every weekend on a dinner and movie. We're good friends though. Actually, what's funny is that some of them are starting to "cut back": pay down debts and bring bagged lunches to work. So hopefully, we'll all be mustaches soon.

Albert

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Re: Can you have antimustacian friends?
« Reply #41 on: July 26, 2015, 03:45:58 AM »
If all my friends had to be mustachian I wouldn't have (m)any friends. There are a few friends who have/desire big houses/trucks/toys and spend money as soon as they can. There are others who have goals that require saving and do not spend as much.

But I don't have any ANTI-mustachian friends, as in friends who would ridicule or sabotage my mustachian efforts.

Same here.

Seppia

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Can you have antimustacian friends?
« Reply #42 on: July 26, 2015, 03:19:02 PM »
I am very far from being mustachian, but I don't overspend like 99% of the population, including my friends, does.
I do sometimes miss on a few social gatherings (mostly at restaurants) but it has never been a problem, it's just funny when they go "wow you're going diving? That's too expensive for me", not being able to do the basic math and realizing my overall spending level is about half what theirs is.
Never had any issues though

DeltaBond

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Re: Can you have antimustacian friends?
« Reply #43 on: July 26, 2015, 03:37:04 PM »
I can't fathom why it would matter.  Are people on this forum so sensitive that they can't get over other people buying things?

+1

It just makes me wish I were the one SELLING things to them.  I don't worry about their retirement, they won't be coming to me for anything, since they all seem to think I'm not as affluent.  Besides, they won't retire while they like to spend so much money, lol

libertarian4321

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Re: Can you have antimustacian friends?
« Reply #44 on: July 26, 2015, 06:44:56 PM »
We have plenty of high earning, broke-ass, friends for whom personal finance is just a long, sad misadventure.

It's good to have them around, because every time we see them struggle (largely due to their own stupidity/lack of foresight), it just confirms that we have chosen the better lifestyle.

music lover

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Re: Can you have antimustacian friends?
« Reply #45 on: July 26, 2015, 08:56:47 PM »
One of my friends is as frugal as me...were always telling each other about how much we saved or the good deal we got.

Two other friends of mine own businesses that do very well...they live large with $60k pickup trucks, huge cabins that are really houses, multiple custom Harleys, etc. We're in a band together and the amount of money they spend on gear boggles my mind...the guitar player has 15 or so high end guitars, 7 or 8 amps, all sorts of pedals, etc.

We all get along well...in spite of their high end toys, when we all get together it's never an expensive event. We'll BBQ on someone's deck, play music, or hang out at one of their cabins. They have money, but it's never really about money for them.

mustachepungoeshere

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Re: Can you have antimustacian friends?
« Reply #46 on: July 26, 2015, 09:21:12 PM »
We were never big into going out, and shifted more to staying in and cooking after having kid #1, and even more so after having kid #2. Since a lot of our friends also have young kids, it makes complete sense to get together at somebody's house rather than going to a restaurant. Childless friends or those whose babies will still sleep anywhere are particularly easy to have over, and we can have adult conversation after our kid are in bed. And we are pretty much always willing to cook for people. Net effect: decent social life, and we are the hosts a large majority of the time. It works well. If they are being spendypants on their own time it doesn't infringe on us.

We're the childless friends in this scenario. I used to feel bad that our friends with kids were always hosting us (though we never show up empty handed). But then I realised just how much easier it is for them. They can feed the kids early, do baths and bed-time while the rest of us have a few drinks, then we eat a bit later in the evening. Everyone is happy.