Author Topic: "Ugly Truths" about Retirement (MSN)  (Read 3943 times)

zephyr911

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"Ugly Truths" about Retirement (MSN)
« on: July 26, 2017, 10:33:47 AM »
http://www.msn.com/en-us/money/retirement/27-ugly-truths-about-retirement/ss-BBvxgTS

Runs the gamut from "useful info" to "sad but true" to "WTF?"

Travis

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Re: "Ugly Truths" about Retirement (MSN)
« Reply #1 on: July 26, 2017, 01:17:15 PM »
Which parts did you "wtf?"  It all seemed like useful advice for the average person.

solon

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Re: "Ugly Truths" about Retirement (MSN)
« Reply #2 on: July 26, 2017, 03:21:57 PM »
28 slides? No thanks!

StockBeard

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Re: "Ugly Truths" about Retirement (MSN)
« Reply #3 on: July 26, 2017, 09:38:28 PM »
I like how it progressively goes into darker topics to end with a coffin in the last slide

zephyr911

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Re: "Ugly Truths" about Retirement (MSN)
« Reply #4 on: July 27, 2017, 08:38:47 AM »
Which parts did you "wtf?"  It all seemed like useful advice for the average person.
Not so much "WTF / bad advice" as "WTF / how are so many people doing this so poorly"

MustachiansWitness

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Re: "Ugly Truths" about Retirement (MSN)
« Reply #5 on: July 27, 2017, 12:34:23 PM »
I'd say #14, #15, and #21 were pretty "wtf". Inflation is taken into account by the 4% rule and most accepted methods of calculating a safe withdrawal rate. And stocks appreciate with inflation, so inflation should not really be a concern for retirement.

#15, even the most antimustachian people I know, debt slaves who are blinded by the darkness of consumerism and waste, and disease ridden with excusitis and complainy pants syndrome, are aware of how much they spend. Maybe trust-fund babies or CEOs who outsource someone to log in to their bank account and make sure the balance is positive are unaware though.

#21 - ha - working by choice is legitimate, but working past 67 by necessity? I would think most anti-mustachians are not in any condition to work at that age, due to illnesses and other health complications resulting from their excessive commuting by car and other poor lifestyle choices.

Travis

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Re: "Ugly Truths" about Retirement (MSN)
« Reply #6 on: July 27, 2017, 01:13:18 PM »
I'd say #14, #15, and #21 were pretty "wtf". Inflation is taken into account by the 4% rule and most accepted methods of calculating a safe withdrawal rate. And stocks appreciate with inflation, so inflation should not really be a concern for retirement.

#15, even the most antimustachian people I know, debt slaves who are blinded by the darkness of consumerism and waste, and disease ridden with excusitis and complainy pants syndrome, are aware of how much they spend. Maybe trust-fund babies or CEOs who outsource someone to log in to their bank account and make sure the balance is positive are unaware though.

#21 - ha - working by choice is legitimate, but working past 67 by necessity? I would think most anti-mustachians are not in any condition to work at that age, due to illnesses and other health complications resulting from their excessive commuting by car and other poor lifestyle choices.

Regarding #15, it's not so much "I have so much money I don't care where it goes," but rather "it didn't occur to me I'm spending $300 on lunch and now I can't afford new tires."  Most of my friends are acutely aware when they're about to run out of money each month, but don't truly understand where they're spending it and when they're spending too much on something.  When I mention that I know to the penny where my money goes each month, they look at me like I have a mental disorder.

MustachiansWitness

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Re: "Ugly Truths" about Retirement (MSN)
« Reply #7 on: July 27, 2017, 03:11:28 PM »
Regarding #15, it's not so much "I have so much money I don't care where it goes," but rather "it didn't occur to me I'm spending $300 on lunch and now I can't afford new tires."  Most of my friends are acutely aware when they're about to run out of money each month, but don't truly understand where they're spending it and when they're spending too much on something.  When I mention that I know to the penny where my money goes each month, they look at me like I have a mental disorder.

Yeah, but the quote "There is a huge difference if you are anticipating to need an additional $20,000 annually from your investments to fill the gap versus actually needing $50,000," suggests that people aren't even remotely aware of their bottom line. I mean that's a ground breaking level of stupidity to me. Sure, it's not news that most unmustachians are extremely wasteful and don't even think about it, which will inevitably delay their retirement to at least the "standard" age, but I thought at least most of these people knew roughly the total dollar amount they were spending.

And that's pretty hardcore, to know "to the penny"! I don't know that, but I have a rough idea what my bottom line is, and the great thing about being a mustachian is that it usually stays surprisingly low without even having to try.

Travis

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Re: "Ugly Truths" about Retirement (MSN)
« Reply #8 on: July 27, 2017, 04:21:40 PM »
Regarding #15, it's not so much "I have so much money I don't care where it goes," but rather "it didn't occur to me I'm spending $300 on lunch and now I can't afford new tires."  Most of my friends are acutely aware when they're about to run out of money each month, but don't truly understand where they're spending it and when they're spending too much on something.  When I mention that I know to the penny where my money goes each month, they look at me like I have a mental disorder.

Yeah, but the quote "There is a huge difference if you are anticipating to need an additional $20,000 annually from your investments to fill the gap versus actually needing $50,000," suggests that people aren't even remotely aware of their bottom line. I mean that's a ground breaking level of stupidity to me. Sure, it's not news that most unmustachians are extremely wasteful and don't even think about it, which will inevitably delay their retirement to at least the "standard" age, but I thought at least most of these people knew roughly the total dollar amount they were spending.

And that's pretty hardcore, to know "to the penny"! I don't know that, but I have a rough idea what my bottom line is, and the great thing about being a mustachian is that it usually stays surprisingly low without even having to try.

Before I found MMM I found YNAB, so tracking my expenses is serious business for me.  As far as what you quoted, we've encountered plenty of folks on this forum who just pay bills with only a minimal understanding of what they're paying for.  Someone posted a story a year or two ago where a woman continued paying for COMCAST for a couple years after she cancelled without realizing it.  I've also read a few stories where a spouse was sheltered from the family finances to the point where the bill-paying spouse died and the survivor had no idea how much things cost. That expense was just magically taken care of.  You would hope people can do enough simple math to project how much they'll need in retirement, but there's just enough ignorance out there to make it a nightmare for some.

TheGrimSqueaker

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Re: "Ugly Truths" about Retirement (MSN)
« Reply #9 on: July 27, 2017, 06:37:17 PM »
Regarding #15, it's not so much "I have so much money I don't care where it goes," but rather "it didn't occur to me I'm spending $300 on lunch and now I can't afford new tires."  Most of my friends are acutely aware when they're about to run out of money each month, but don't truly understand where they're spending it and when they're spending too much on something.  When I mention that I know to the penny where my money goes each month, they look at me like I have a mental disorder.

Yeah, but the quote "There is a huge difference if you are anticipating to need an additional $20,000 annually from your investments to fill the gap versus actually needing $50,000," suggests that people aren't even remotely aware of their bottom line. I mean that's a ground breaking level of stupidity to me. Sure, it's not news that most unmustachians are extremely wasteful and don't even think about it, which will inevitably delay their retirement to at least the "standard" age, but I thought at least most of these people knew roughly the total dollar amount they were spending.

And that's pretty hardcore, to know "to the penny"! I don't know that, but I have a rough idea what my bottom line is, and the great thing about being a mustachian is that it usually stays surprisingly low without even having to try.

Before I found MMM I found YNAB, so tracking my expenses is serious business for me.  As far as what you quoted, we've encountered plenty of folks on this forum who just pay bills with only a minimal understanding of what they're paying for.  Someone posted a story a year or two ago where a woman continued paying for COMCAST for a couple years after she cancelled without realizing it.  I've also read a few stories where a spouse was sheltered from the family finances to the point where the bill-paying spouse died and the survivor had no idea how much things cost. That expense was just magically taken care of.  You would hope people can do enough simple math to project how much they'll need in retirement, but there's just enough ignorance out there to make it a nightmare for some.

Professional dependents have a rough go of it if they lose their means of support. I've seen people who know exactly how much things cost, but who have no idea how much they spend in total. It's like they lose track of their spending after a few days and forget everything, but don't have the desire to do otherwise by, say, writing it down.

sparkytheop

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Re: "Ugly Truths" about Retirement (MSN)
« Reply #10 on: July 27, 2017, 09:32:58 PM »
My WTF is #21:

"Cutting off the kids might be a necessary step if you're looking to retire. In fact, 70 percent of survey respondents said they would consider limiting fiscal support to post-college children in order to retire, according to a recent Wall Street Journal study."

Only 70 percent?  Dude, if I'm at retirement age, I'm not going to put it off because my able-bodied child wants to mooch.  Now, if the child is disabled, I get it.  It doesn't even say "cut them off" it says "limit".