What is Your Primary Goal - FI or ER?

[EscapeVelocity2020]

Maybe it's a slow day, maybe it's the extra day of freedom (given the Memorial Day weekend), but I was struck by a sudden inspiration to see if most Mustachians are here purely for the ER, or if FI is the main goal.  Once again, I have no idea (hence the poll), but I was a little shocked on my last poll how many parents think that modern parenting is harder this go around, so I must admit that I'm curious how this one goes!  Thanks for voting / commenting.

[jalich]

ER all the way! FI is a means to an end for us.

[Sailor Sam]

Good poll idea, EV. It will be interesting to see how it goes.

[Daisy]

Started off with FI. ER is just a byproduct.

I  never wanted to spend my whole life in the tech field so was always planning to get to FI then do something else that doesn't pay as well but is more in line with my interests. And I hate (externally imposed) schedules so eventually corporate America gets to you and you want out.

[Dicey]

Started off with FI. ER is just a byproduct.

I never wanted to spend my whole life in the tech field working so was always planning to get to FI then do something else that doesn't pay as well but is more in line with my interests. And I hate (externally imposed) schedules so eventually corporate America gets to you and you want out.

Daisy's answer is so close to my own, I just personalized it a bit ;-)

[EscapeVelocity2020]

Started off with FI. ER is just a byproduct.

I never wanted to spend my whole life in the tech field working so was always planning to get to FI then do something else that doesn't pay as well but is more in line with my interests. And I hate (externally imposed) schedules so eventually corporate America gets to you and you want out.

Daisy's answer is so close to my own, I just personalized it a bit ;-)

I voted FI myself, but this was before ER was "invented"  :)  Oh yeah, and sorry that the title got cut short one word.  It didn't limit the characters and then cut it off post-posting.  When I tried to fix it, all sorts of things went wrong (being a primary topic and all).  So, I apologize, but such is the state of internet fora.

[sokoloff]

I really, truly love my work, so for me the primary goal is FI.

If we would re-locate to a LCOL area, we're there now, but living in a very HCOL area, we'll still be there before the kids are off to college (and I'll be 58 then, but we'll be FI even here probably 5-7 years before that).

[lemonde]

Loosely FI. I love teaching (the parts that have to do with kids, anyway); I just like us having a buffer. No current plans to leave teaching; all the longevity stuff I've read talks about the importance of purpose and social interaction, and I get both of those handily via the day job. I also really, really like the fact that my working allows us to give lots to charity (again showing that FI isn't the priority). I could easily be happy without the day job; I've got lots of non-work hobbies, but DW thinks work is a good way for me to not just spend all my time at home, and frankly, she's right. I also don't think I could leave work until we've put our kids through college or at least done our best to fund them, and given that our kids aren't yet in elementary school and we plan to have up to 2 more, college is a long way away.

I often talk about how this is a job that I could either leave next year or 50 years from now. I'm hoping to have so much fulfillment from a.) working with the kids and b.) donating oodles of money to still be working in my 80s, but we'll see how things go. Teaching gets more bureaucratic each year.

[birdiegirl]

Goal is definitely FI right now.  I don't mind working but can't stand the corporate world anymore.  Want to get out and have the freedom to do something with more meaning for me....likely for a lot less pay. 

[TheBuddha]

My primary goal is FI so I can quit my job, after which I'll find more enjoyable ways to make money once the passive income takes the pressure off. So I don't know if that's considered "ER" or not.

[Stoic on FIRE]

My goal is primarily FI, retiring early would just be a perk. There are so many things I would like to do, but can't make an outright business case and I'd rather start from a position of strength to fail, than fail and have to start from square one. The financial independence would allow me to make business decisions of what I want to happen versus being beholden to advertisers, affiliates, or bigger players in a field.

[surfhb]

FI

The thought of not doing some kind of daily work that provides for the "greater good"is unthinkable.   


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[arizonawildcats]

Financial Independence

It has allowed me to take more risks with my career and secure a position I really like.   It’s also nice to know that you can pack up your marbles and go home if you are not happy in a work situation.   

[MonkeyJenga]

I originally started with the goal of ER, even before YMOYL/ERE/MMM. My idea of ER was in my 50's, not 30's, but I always wanted to save enough money to not work. I've never enjoyed a job or been passionate enough about a cause to keep working if there was no monetary need. I spent years looking forward to traveling the world with no responsibilities, visiting friends and meeting new people.

In the last 6 months, I've both become FI and realized that I don't want to stop working entirely. I am going to quit my current job, but will move into politics/political activism instead of being a carefree nomad.

[VolcanicArts]

I started off with the goal of FI which would give me the option to work, rather than being forced to out of necessity. Now that I see my progress and am very close to FI, I'm thinking RE might not be a bad idea. I do enjoy the structure that work brings to your life and the social aspect of it. For me ER would not mean sitting at home watching Netflix all day, but would more likely involve me living in a foreign country part of the year and working on hobbies or creating my own low stress business that I would enjoy and not caring so much about the money it makes.

[Khan]

FI. Like many, I don't and don't ever expect to get access to a traditional pension, so first as an independent self sustaining person I needed to take care of that, but also for the rest of my working life I also want freedom from employers screwing me, as well as the ability to take multi week, month, or possibly year long employment breaks. Fly to Hawaii for a week and have a spendy vacation that costs like 2k? But... I could live in an apartment there for a month for that cost...

[Villanelle]

FI.

A part of me expects the DH will probably want to work in some form long past when we are able to live a pretty lavish retirement (lavish by MMM standards, at least).  My father followed a similar path.  At 73, he's still working a consulting gig, and has had a paying gig of some kind since he started working, other than a few 6-8 month gaps here and there.  He does it because he enjoys it, mostly.  My parents certainly don't need the money.  In their 70s, I believe they still have positive cash flow (due to two very nice pensions, carrying the mortgage on two and now only 1 home owned by someone else, dad's pay check, and probably some other things, too). 

His current boss is about to retire, and that may be the end of his consulting gig, and I think he's a bit sad about that.  He only works a few hours a week, plus a 3-4 day business trip every few months.

Anyway, I can see DH being like that.  So the goal is really to get us to the point where he can be choosy about what work he takes and so that we don't have to worry if he leaves or loses a gig.  Or so that if he changes his mind and decides to devote himself to being a Master Gardener (or whatever), that option is available to him. I, OTOH, may already be RE, as it turns out.  We'll see where life takes us, but it's somewhat possible I may never work full time again.

[Dicey]

FI
The thought of not doing some kind of daily work that provides for the "greater good"is unthinkable.   

Let's see, I sit on two library boards, and a community art group board. I co-chair an annual community-wide volunteer event, and usher at our Regional  Theater, just off the top of my head. My MIL and her pal Al Z. Heimer live with us. I think I'm contributing to the "greater good", to the point that I wouldn't have time to work.

[Sydneystache]

ER/RE

I FI'ed a couple of years ago. I have a sometime mentally stimulating job and I am in it until a more meaningful job comes by. I am trying to stave off mental boredom but I know my skills will be useful when volunteering. But I also know if I ER now, I would be losing my influence to make meaningful change. However, if push comes to shove, I will be able to leave, see you later alligator and spend more time with family etc.

I just want to make a positive difference to the world and I can do it in my current job. I am giving myself some milestones first: what am I up to at 40, 45 then 50. Either I would be in a great role at 50 making my part of the world a better place or I'd be pottering about building sophisticated sandcastles somewhere and making that beach a better place. 🙂

[Linea_Norway]

Other: We have just always been frugal and saved a lot of money each year without having any plans for it. Only after having saved 50% of our net income many years in a row and paid down our mortgage, my DH suggested that for each year of saving from now we could stop working 1 year earlier. Many years later, we discovered MMM and found out that early retirement actually is a reality.

Now: my main goal is ER: not having to work.

[Laura33]

FI.  A/k/a "never be poor again."  It really hit me in my second year on the job, when my firm laid off 50 people; I didn't have a family to support, but I still had a mortgage to pay, gas/insurance, food, etc.  I thought about ER, but in the context of 55-60.  I wish MMM had been around back then, because I could have designed my life around a 50%-75% savings rate from the get-go.  But then again, maybe I wouldn't have "heard" the message back then -- it was the first time in my life I was making "real" money, and I enjoyed the luxurious feeling of being able to go to the grocery store without a list.

[lemonlyman]

ER

I hate my job. Everyone I work with (and for) is great. I just don't like the responsibilities I have.

[Schaefer Light]

I just want to be able to wake up in the morning and do whatever the fuck I want.

[MrsPete]

Started off with FI. ER is just a byproduct.

Interesting question.  Yes, this. 

I grew up without financial stability, and my initial goal was NOT to continue living that lifestyle.  The idea of retiring early is nice, but it takes a distant, distant, distant backseat to being financially stable. 

I'd rather work 'til 65 but be financially stable ... rather than retire at 35 and always scrape by or find myself needing to take on a seasonal job occasionally.

[Pigeon]

FI.  We are FI but won't ER by the standards of anyone here, probably around age 62.  That's ER compared to where my thinking was a couple of years ago when I really started paying attention to how much money we'd accumulated with the set it and forget it mindset of payroll deduction and automated investing.  I had been thinking we'd work to 68 or so.

I want a good sized stache.  In the last couple of years we've buried my FIL, my father and then my MIL.  All were quite elderly, and I've seen the big advantage having funds gives you in terms of being able to make the twilight years easier.  There are a lot of lovely places that allow seniors to live independently by providing some level of service, like transportation, and I'd like to keep that as an option if possible once I'm not comfortable driving someday down the road.  Those places aren't cheap, but they provide seniors with a sense of community that I think I'd like, especially should I be widowed some day.

We also have one kid in college and one who is a junior in high school.  We believe in providing a basic college education, and even though we have the money set aside to do that, I wouldn't be comfortable RE until that's over.

Dh is also entitled to an inflation-adjusted pension and hanging around a couple more years will make an appreciable difference in that.

[Abooki]

ER all the way!!!!!!!!!!!
1- my goal before discovering FIRE was to move back home(somewhere in Africa) from the States when I was 30 but I didn't know how. (FIRE date has been extended now that I know my number)
2- could careless about my job or working for someone. And would like to go back home and create something for my people.

[MasterStache]

I chose "Other" because our very short term goal is wife continuing to work while I transition to part-time. Plan to be FI in 1 or 2 years and RE in 10 years. I only say 10 because my wife is choosing to continue working as she enjoys her job an doesn't really want to quit. She also has  a flexible schedule and doesn't have to work 40 hour weeks.

[apricity22]

Financial Independence! Once I get there I can be choosy about employment or have early retirement as an option.

[Saving4Fire]

Financial Independence! Once I get there I can be choosy about employment or have early retirement as an option.

Same.   I want to reduce stress and add more interesting options to my life.   FI will do that.

[Spitfire]

ER for sure. I'm either a lazy person in general or my job is so boring that it has drained the life out of me, but I'm looking forward to not working.

[azure975]

FI
The thought of not doing some kind of daily work that provides for the "greater good"is unthinkable.   

Let's see, I sit on two library boards, and a community art group board. I co-chair an annual community-wide volunteer event, and usher at our Regional  Theater, just off the top of my head. My MIL and her pal Al Z. Heimer live with us. I think I'm contributing to the "greater good", to the point that I wouldn't have time to work.

Agreed--part of why I want ER is SO THAT I can do something that contributes to the greater good. Seems like most corporate jobs are the opposite!

[Inaya]

FI


I want to be able to take on jobs that I enjoy (e.g., baking, dog walking, working in a tea shop, etc.) but be able to quit before I get burnt out. Also not having to stress about where my next job is coming from is priceless.

[Goldielocks]

FI

I was scared shitless at being the only income earner for the family, while having a variable rate adjustable mortgage of $550k or more.   

I was not able to quit a job and take a lower paying one, or to just stop work and look for another, etc.  I HAD to make $150k per year or more, to make ends meet, and those jobs here are not that common.

Neat thing is the ER follows very closely after FI, especially if you intend to pick up interesting occasional work from time to time.

[rockstache]

FI

I'll probably always do something - I just want to make sure it's something I want.

[BFGirl]

My primary goal is FI so that I have the ability to quit a higher paying more stressful job and either concentrate on my side gig or take lower paying less stressful employment.  Having choices is the goal.

[LifeHappens]

FI is my goal. We are bare bones FI now, but enjoy our crazy spendypants lifestyle too much to go full on Mustachian. I am in the process of downshifting to a 3 or 4 day work week so we have more time to play.

[Retire-Canada]

ER and to get there I need to be FI.

[pachnik]

My goal is FI.   I know that as people get older, it is harder to find jobs.  I want to not feel desperate to find work at 57 or so.   And to have the financial ability to take a lower-paying part-time job rather that have to look around for full-time work. 

And I don't miss the stuff I used to fritter away my money on anyway.  So shooting for FI is a win/win for me. 

[azure975]

My goal is FI.   I know that as people get older, it is harder to find jobs.  I want to not feel desperate to find work at 57 or so.   And to have the financial ability to take a lower-paying part-time job rather that have to look around for full-time work. 

And I don't miss the stuff I used to fritter away my money on anyway.  So shooting for FI is a win/win for me.

Yes to this for sure! I don't know how all these people who say they're going to work until they die are so confident that they are going to be able to find work in their late 50s and 60s. I sure wouldn't want to take that risk. And what if your health declines and you are unable to work?

I wouldn't mind having a low-stress part time job in retirement but I wouldn't want to have to depend on it to pay the bills.

[jjandjab]

FI.

I am a physician and generally enjoy my job and have a reasonable schedule. With a career that didn't really result in earnings until age 32 (and not having been too smart about money choices until 3 years ago or so), I just can't see leaving all that earning potential before my late 50s. And my profession makes it near impossible to rejoin if you have gone more than 2 years without patient contact.

[BigHaus89]

Our goal is FI for now. We both love what we do, but no matter how great the corporate job is, it still sucks. We are working towards more flexibility with our schedules.

[Zikoris]

ER. Y'all clearly have stronger work ethics than me.

[TwoWorlds]

FI

Want to be able to control any outcome in my life and my families.  In the end ER is the result from being FI as the stress from work is too much. 

I look at my parents and they both worked until they were 69.  Not really because they had to but they wanted to make sure they had enough $$$ to get through retirement.  Now they don't want to travel and missed a lot of things with their grandchildren and have more $$$ than they will ever spend in retirement. 

As I said I want to be in control of my future and FI gets me there!!!

[cdttmm]

ER

I tried early retirement at age 36 and failed. Went back to work after just 10 weeks. But I don't really call what I do now a "real" job. I figure I'll try retiring again one of these days because ER has always really been the goal.

[Sydneystache]

I just want to be able to wake up in the morning and do whatever the fuck I want.

Same.

[Linea_Norway]

I just want to be able to wake up in the morning and do whatever the fuck I want.

Same.

Same here.

Jay!
+1

[TartanTallulah]

This thread has made me think a bit. FI is my priority, but I don't want a secure independent income for life so that I can do expensive things or buy more stuff, I want to be in a position where I can choose whether and how much to work and can hand in my notice without worrying where the next meal, or even the next vacation, is going to come from. So it's ER too. But I don't want to retire, I've got years of experience in this job and most of the time I quite enjoy it, but I would enjoy it more if I thought I was doing it for fun and the income was just a welcome bonus. So FI ...

(Quietly self-combusts from thinking round and round in ever-decreasing circles.)

The real answer is that I am, theoretically, FI - just - and still working. Which is no answer at all.

[Bird In Hand]

Early in my career my goal was RE.  Now I'm planning to progressively unwind my career via ESR until FI, and then play it by ear to decide whether to keep working my current job (which I still enjoy), switch careers, or do something totally different.

[EscapeVelocity2020]

This thread has made me think a bit. FI is my priority, but I don't want a secure independent income for life so that I can do expensive things or buy more stuff, I want to be in a position where I can choose whether and how much to work and can hand in my notice without worrying where the next meal, or even the next vacation, is going to come from. So it's ER too. But I don't want to retire, I've got years of experience in this job and most of the time I quite enjoy it, but I would enjoy it more if I thought I was doing it for fun and the income was just a welcome bonus. So FI ...

(Quietly self-combusts from thinking round and round in ever-decreasing circles.)

The real answer is that I am, theoretically, FI - just - and still working. Which is no answer at all.

Whew, read this post first then went back through page 1.  Sometimes it sucks to have a job and not feel like you ever have enough time... but then again, I know that I secretly enjoy having things on 'the back burner'.  Like, just before this, I was contemplating a message to Pete about how FI / ER is a great message to the vast majority of people, but is it for everyone?  I guess it is a reprisal of the 'what if everyone became frugal' post.  I disagreed with his conclusions.  Some of the posts I read reminded me of Pete's 'first retire, then get rich' post - folks want to ER and be lazy, or get to FI in order to not have to necessarily worry about money.  And both groups will actually 'get rich' in a rising market, but neither follows the path of FI / ER in order to unleash the work ethic and make the 400k Pete makes.  Which makes me a little sad, because we should all get a taste of this sweet Mustachian perspective he blogs from.  He quit personally for ER and then talked his spouse into quitting after the family was FI. 

But I'm rambling a bit.  This is what reading too many posts at once does to a guy like me.  Probably obsolete, too much input and I overload, but it's fun, in a way.  Only problem is that I end up thinking that I'm doing something important, meanwhile there are things like Trump pulling out of the Paris Accord actually are happening that terrify me and make me realize that I must do something larger or more effectual.  Tomorrow...  hopefully tomorrow will reliably be better than today.

To the OP, which kicked off this post, was that I think that the 'ER' voters knew right away that that was their primary goal.  So if you are confused between voting FI or ER, you probably made the right choice voting FI, and congrats on getting there!

[Freedomin5]

This thread has made me think a bit. FI is my priority, but I don't want a secure independent income for life so that I can do expensive things or buy more stuff, I want to be in a position where I can choose whether and how much to work and can hand in my notice without worrying where the next meal, or even the next vacation, is going to come from. So it's ER too. But I don't want to retire, I've got years of experience in this job and most of the time I quite enjoy it, but I would enjoy it more if I thought I was doing it for fun and the income was just a welcome bonus. So FI ...

(Quietly self-combusts from thinking round and round in ever-decreasing circles.)

The real answer is that I am, theoretically, FI - just - and still working. Which is no answer at all.

Couldn't have said it better myself. These are my sentiments exactly. Working in China, things change in the blink of an eye, most people play politics, and for someone like me who doesn't like getting involved in politics, tooting my own horn, or putting others down, FI gives me the freedom to leave if things get too hairy.