Using a scooter rather car

[South african]

I recently bought myself a scooter (honda 110cc) to commute to and from work and also for small trips to the shop etc. It only costed me $1000 and I get roughly 100 mpg while driving in town. I choose the scooter since I think to drive alone in a car for short distances is such a waste of resources and money and to use a bicycle does not appeal to me since I do not feel comfortable or safe on roads if I cannot travel at the same speed as the rest of traffic and I tend to sweat a bit when I arrive at office after bicycling. 

I am now considering selling one of our cars so that we only have one car. We are a family of four (2 kids). My wife can use our car to drop of the kids etc. and we can use the car when we have to travel as a family. I will safe on insurance, fuel, servicing, time in traffic etc. if I do this.

I wondered if there were other mustachians considering this since I personally think it is the best solution for our circumstances.

[eil]

Riding a bicycle would be better. Consider that you pay nothing for gas per trip, is far better for the environment, and makes you healthier all at the same time.

But the bicycle is not always more practical for every given situation. In your case, a scooter might be just fine for commuting to and from work. It's certainly a better option than a car. Maybe you'll still able to use the bicycle for errands and during lower-traffic hours?

[enigmaT120]

Scooters are great for motorized transport.  You can probably get some sort of trunk for hauling stuff.  My first motorcycle was a Yamaha scooter, I think it was 80 CC. 

I don't know how fast you'll be riding, but in general motorcycles are many times more dangerous than bicycles, calculated either by time or by miles.  MMM's article on bicycle safety doesn't mention motorcycles, only comparing cars to bicycles, but motorcycles are way more dangerous than cars.  Which didn't stop me from riding my old BMW almost 9,000 miles last year and my bicycle only 2,000.  Sigh.

[eil]

but motorcycles are way more dangerous than cars.

Statistically speaking, this may be true but I don't think it's universally true. Consider the mental maturity of the average motorcycle rider... (In the US, most riders you see on the road are either invincible teenagers on race spec crotch-rockets or chromed-out hog riders in pirate garb.)

When I ride my motorcycle, I'm hyper-aware of everything that's going on around me. I have far more manoeuvrability and options than a car does if things should go... not as planned, let's say. I can see more because I sit higher than I do in my car. I'm scanning up 12 seconds ahead, looking through my turns, and plotting escape routes constantly. I'm not fiddling with the radio or wondering if my cell phone just made a noise. I'm focused on riding and riding alone. Because of these factors, I actually feel safer commuting on my motorcycle than in my car.

False sense of security? Maybe, but I don't think so.

[kendallf]

chromed-out hog riders in pirate garb.)

My new favorite quote.  I think I'm going to shout "HARRRRR!" at the next Harley I see.  I ride either a motorcycle or a bicycle pretty much exclusively these days, and I'm certain I'm safer on the bicycle, but I'm also certain that's my own fault.  I am a gearhead and when I discovered I could ride a stock motorcycle that would outperform supercars and still get ~40 mpg I became... somewhat over-enthusiastic.  :-)

[thepokercab]

but motorcycles are way more dangerous than cars.

Statistically speaking, this may be true but I don't think it's universally true. Consider the mental maturity of the average motorcycle rider... (In the US, most riders you see on the road are either invincible teenagers on race spec crotch-rockets or chromed-out hog riders in pirate garb.)

When I ride my motorcycle, I'm hyper-aware of everything that's going on around me. I have far more manoeuvrability and options than a car does if things should go... not as planned, let's say. I can see more because I sit higher than I do in my car. I'm scanning up 12 seconds ahead, looking through my turns, and plotting escape routes constantly. I'm not fiddling with the radio or wondering if my cell phone just made a noise. I'm focused on riding and riding alone. Because of these factors, I actually feel safer commuting on my motorcycle than in my car.

False sense of security? Maybe, but I don't think so.

I also ride a scooter, and definitely agree with this.  When I'm riding it- I am constantly focused on what I am doing.  No fiddling with the cell phone, no radio, no one else distracting me.  The stats might say that what I am doing is more dangerous, but I certainly feel like I have more focus. 

I also, much like biking, assume that no other drivers see me on the road.  I'm constantly anticipating drivers to make left or right turns in front me.  So- as long as you are focused, and aware of your surroundings, its pretty safe. 

[Thegoblinchief]

I am considering an e-bike to drop down to a single car family. Our main limitation is that both of our cars are cheap and old. My wife wants us to have a slightly better vehicle before we drop to a single car family.

[Samsam]

Oh! I just bought a scooter off of craigslist :)  It's my little baby now.  Tops it goes 35 mph right now and cars pass me but I feel safer when I'm on the scooter than when I'm biking.  Mostly because around here, there is that mentality that bicycles are not supposed to be in the road.  When I ride my bike I get honked at and passed closely...but on my scooter....going 30mph and maybe 15mph uphill...no one thinks twice.  So weird!

[brianeboatman]

I ride a scooter nearly everyday to work. I love it. I get about 85 miles per gallon.

[YK-Phil]

A scooter is a great middle-of-the-road option. Cheap to buy, economical to use, and easy to drive and maintain. A bicycle is a lot cheaper, and indeed I use mine every day, but for short commutes and to run errands in the neighbourhood. If I lived year-round in a warm weather area, I would probably get myself a little Vespa.

As for a motorcycle, I love them. I had many bikes, and still own one, a quasi-mint 1971 Triumph Tiger which is the last bike I will have, and also coincidentally the first one I bought, back in the days. I no longer ride it and it has been sitting in the parkade for the past few years, and a couple of times a year, I put my leather jacket on and ride it around the parkade for thirty minutes, pretending I am Marlon Brando. This is the only material thing I am attached too, but I am getting closer to getting rid of it. I don't ride mainly because I don't trust other drivers on the road, and I don't trust myself, even if I am a very level-headed driver and by all standards, one that always drives defensively, and always below the speed limit and practicing hypermiling. But riding a motorcycle, very much like a powerful sports car, is fun. We hear that comment every time: the fun factor. Unfortunately, fun and driving should not go together in my opinion. Fun makes us take risks that we would never take if we were driving a Skoda or a moped, even those of us who are otherwise disciplined and careful drivers.

[meadow lark]

Love my new scooter!  I don't know how dangerous it is.  I definitely drive fewer miles now that I don't have a car, so that  should be factored in when comparing risk.  For instance, I have a prescription to pick up at the doctors office 10 miles away.  They completely bug because they don't want to just fax it to the pharmacy.  I am going to call tomorrow, see if there is anyway I can convince them.  If not I will pick it up in 2 weeks when I have to be in that part of town, anyway.  In the past I would have just driven over and got it.

[johnintaiwan]

Scooters are the norm where I live. Cars are not as common except out in the countryside. I love driving mine. In town the top speed is not a big deal since you cant go more than 60km/h anyway. I also love that you can park it anywhere. It is not very fun to ride in the rain though and can be a little slippery. I would suggest you do your research though if you are going to buy one in the states. I have hear that many of the chinese made scooters are of poor quality and have problems after only a few years. I bought my scooter used here for about $600USD and it is now about 16 years old and running fine.

[enigmaT120]

As for a motorcycle, I love them. I had many bikes, and still own one, a quasi-mint 1971 Triumph Tiger which is the last bike I will have, and also coincidentally the first one I bought, back in the days. <big snip>

 Unfortunately, fun and driving should not go together in my opinion. Fun makes us take risks that we would never take if we were driving a Skoda or a moped, even those of us who are otherwise disciplined and careful drivers.

I think you packed a lot of wisdom in that last couple of sentences.  Trouble is, I think riding a bicycle is fun, too. 

I still have my '70 Triumph Bonneville.  It's sitting at about 96,000 miles and waiting for some paint and a front fork rebuild before I can push it over 100,000.

Eil, I think I drive my pickup with the same awareness I take to my bicycle and motorcycle riding, largely because I don't want to hit anybody else.  I wish everybody had to get around by bicycle and motorcycle before they were allowed to drive larger vehicles.

[Ftao93]

We own 3 scoots and 1 motorcycle.  no car.

The smaller scoots are in-town (Ok, sometimes we ride them much farther than they are intended to go...) urban beasts, we average 95 and 80mpg.  The MC gets @ 68 (it is a low strung, low HP Honda) and an old 87 Helix I bought to build mechanical aptitude.  It will be my wife's 'big bike', or resold for about what I will have into it. 

Only the motorcycle is financed, everything else is owned (no more new, ever!), and insurance is relatively cheap.  It will get really cheap in 2 years.

It isn't a cheap initial investment, at least not if you ride full time.  You need good protection, and hot/cold/wet riding gear.  Good gear is not cheap, but you should own it for 5-10 years at a time, so if you're committed it's not a big deal.

At any time we could probably downsize 2 of these, and also not ride for recreation, which would save even more, but it's good to have a spare.    Bicycling would also rock, but we already own the gear for P2W vehicles.

We're able to get the majority of a month's groceries at the store onto/into 2 scooters.

Far from a magical ideal solution, but they are pretty great for 90% of what we do.
 

[Runge]

I am considering an e-bike to drop down to a single car family. Our main limitation is that both of our cars are cheap and old. My wife wants us to have a slightly better vehicle before we drop to a single car family.

I've looked into e-bikes as well (assuming you mean e-motorcycle or e-scooter), but I found that they're way too pricey for the benefit. When looking at the numbers, the energy-cost efficiency isn't really that much better than just getting a scooter that gets 85-100 mpg. The gas scooter will cost roughly half as much but have similar recurring costs. You'd likely find that your ROI time frame doesn't make sense for an e-scooter. That, coupled with the scooters being silent (i.e. other cars can't hear you), makes me very wary about getting an electric scooter. At least that's what I've found when I looked into it.

But ultimately you'd have to run the financials of it yourself and compare apples to apples. This is just my 2 cents.

[BlueMR2]

I wondered if there were other mustachians considering this since I personally think it is the best solution for our circumstances.

I'll let you know!  I'm hoping to do some motorcycle commuting starting this Summer.  Unfortunately, the only reasonable route to work involves the expressway, so a scooter won't cut it.  Won't be selling the cars, but it'd be great to get 2x the gas mileage (current car gets low 30's, motorcycle I expect mid 60's).

[CarDude]

From a fuel efficiency standpoint, they're great. From a safety standpoint, there's a 30x greater risk of death per mile traveled than cars (for motorcycled vehicles overall). I can't buy the "irresponsible rider" arguments simply because cyclist demographics haven't changed that much in the last 20ish years compared to how much they did from the 80s to late 90s, yet the death rates compared to cars haven't paralleled the demographic changes.

I look at these cases and numbers on a daily basis; there once was a time when I'd have loved a scooter of my own. However, until we get a number of changes in our car culture, I can't recommend them. That said, if the safety issue doesn't bother you, they're awesome little vehicles. There's a sense of freedom and connection with the environment that you get on a scooter / motorcycle that you just don't get in a car. Of course, the same could be said for riding a bicycle vs. a motored cycle.