Author Topic: The 'I Don't Get It' thread. Rants accepted.  (Read 108797 times)

OurTown

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Re: The 'I Don't Get It' thread. Rants accepted.
« Reply #1000 on: August 09, 2018, 02:24:44 PM »
I don't get it when people use a public restroom and don't wash their hands after using the urinal or toilet. Restrooms at work or public have sinks with water, soap and ways to dry your hands. Most of us were trained as children to wash our hands after going to the potty. This is how we prevent disease! You can't 'see' this stuff on door knobs or door push plates or anywhere.

Unless you urinate on your hands, what's the reason for washing them?  Really you should wash first...your hands are probably much dirtier than whatever else you're touching when you go in there to pee.

I assume people who wash their hands after they pee must not have washed their genitals in the morning.

There is some very old joke about "Harvard men" and "Columbia men" the gist of which is "At Harvard, we wash our hands," followed by "At Columbia, we don't piss on them." 

Don't look at me, I went to Duke.

solon

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Re: The 'I Don't Get It' thread. Rants accepted.
« Reply #1001 on: August 09, 2018, 02:30:46 PM »
At flight school I heard:

Pilots wash their hands after going to the bathroom.
Mechanics wash their hands before going to the bathroom.

Dabnasty

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Re: The 'I Don't Get It' thread. Rants accepted.
« Reply #1002 on: August 09, 2018, 02:57:20 PM »
I don't get it when people use a public restroom and don't wash their hands after using the urinal or toilet. Restrooms at work or public have sinks with water, soap and ways to dry your hands. Most of us were trained as children to wash our hands after going to the potty. This is how we prevent disease! You can't 'see' this stuff on door knobs or door push plates or anywhere.

Unless you urinate on your hands, what's the reason for washing them?  Really you should wash first...your hands are probably much dirtier than whatever else you're touching when you go in there to pee.

I assume people who wash their hands after they pee must not have washed their genitals in the morning.

There is some very old joke about "Harvard men" and "Columbia men" the gist of which is "At Harvard, we wash our hands," followed by "At Columbia, we don't piss on them." 

Don't look at me, I went to Duke.

So you have someone wash your hands for you?

OurTown

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Re: The 'I Don't Get It' thread. Rants accepted.
« Reply #1003 on: August 09, 2018, 02:58:07 PM »
LOL.

DreamFIRE

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Re: The 'I Don't Get It' thread. Rants accepted.
« Reply #1004 on: August 09, 2018, 03:04:08 PM »
(I am however extremely grossed out by people who don't wash their hands after shitting.)

Even worse if it's one of those people that said they were cutting costs by using their hands instead of toilet paper.

WranglerBowman

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Re: The 'I Don't Get It' thread. Rants accepted.
« Reply #1005 on: August 09, 2018, 04:40:12 PM »
I don't get it why Amazon packs small items into large boxes or why some people find it all right to fight in public (I live right in the city).
Rule #1 of Fight Club is pretty clear.
Rule #2 of Fight Club is pretty clear as well.  Also, I don't want to fight in my house because things could get broken.

Roadrunner53

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Re: The 'I Don't Get It' thread. Rants accepted.
« Reply #1006 on: August 10, 2018, 08:01:20 AM »
If you feel your hands are so clean because you took a shower and put your wee wee in clean shorts in the morning then peed later and didn't wash your hands because you are so clean, how would you like a surgeon to operate on you with the same thought process? Your hind end is inside your clean shorts and things migrate around down there. Also, think of all the gross things you have touched before you peed and touched yourself and introduced more germs to yourself. You now have other people's bacteria all over you. BLEH!


Cranky

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Re: The 'I Don't Get It' thread. Rants accepted.
« Reply #1007 on: August 10, 2018, 09:37:11 AM »
Well, I've got nothing to add to the Clean Penis Debate, as entertaining as it is, but - washing your hands regularly is a pretty good way to avoid catching every cold and virus that goes around, and standing at the sink in the bathroom seems like a convenient time to do that.

Roadrunner53

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Re: The 'I Don't Get It' thread. Rants accepted.
« Reply #1008 on: August 10, 2018, 09:55:22 AM »
Just one more thing to think about. How would you like to use the urinal and standing beside you is the chef in a restaurant you are eating at in a few minutes. He walks out without washing his hands.  You asked for a tossed salad and he tossed the lettuce with his bare hands and added tomatoes and other garnish to the salad. He also touched your plate and other foods on your plate with his unwashed hands. Sounds yummy, doesn't it?

But I guess he took a shower and his wee wee was clean as a whistle! No issues there!

GuitarStv

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Re: The 'I Don't Get It' thread. Rants accepted.
« Reply #1009 on: August 10, 2018, 10:11:46 AM »
Just one more thing to think about. How would you like to use the urinal and standing beside you is the chef in a restaurant you are eating at in a few minutes. He walks out without washing his hands.  You asked for a tossed salad and he tossed the lettuce with his bare hands and added tomatoes and other garnish to the salad. He also touched your plate and other foods on your plate with his unwashed hands. Sounds yummy, doesn't it?

But I guess he took a shower and his wee wee was clean as a whistle! No issues there!

From this thread I've learned that it would be cleaner for the chef to toss the salad with his dick (clean since his morning shower) than his hands (super dirty because they are always touching things).

:P

Roadrunner53

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Re: The 'I Don't Get It' thread. Rants accepted.
« Reply #1010 on: August 10, 2018, 10:22:05 AM »
Just one more thing to think about. How would you like to use the urinal and standing beside you is the chef in a restaurant you are eating at in a few minutes. He walks out without washing his hands.  You asked for a tossed salad and he tossed the lettuce with his bare hands and added tomatoes and other garnish to the salad. He also touched your plate and other foods on your plate with his unwashed hands. Sounds yummy, doesn't it?

But I guess he took a shower and his wee wee was clean as a whistle! No issues there!

From this thread I've learned that it would be cleaner for the chef to toss the salad with his dick (clean since his morning shower) than his hands (super dirty because they are always touching things).

I agree, probably true. Morale of the story: wash your hands, make your own food, eat at home.

:P

dragoncar

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Re: The 'I Don't Get It' thread. Rants accepted.
« Reply #1011 on: August 10, 2018, 11:34:28 AM »
Just one more thing to think about. How would you like to use the urinal and standing beside you is the chef in a restaurant you are eating at in a few minutes. He walks out without washing his hands.  You asked for a tossed salad and he tossed the lettuce with his bare hands and added tomatoes and other garnish to the salad. He also touched your plate and other foods on your plate with his unwashed hands. Sounds yummy, doesn't it?

But I guess he took a shower and his wee wee was clean as a whistle! No issues there!

From this thread I've learned that it would be cleaner for the chef to toss the salad with his dick (clean since his morning shower) than his hands (super dirty because they are always touching things).

:P

Gross as it sounds, itís probably true.  Someone with agar do a washed dick culture and an unwashed hand culture and get back to us

dragoncar

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Re: The 'I Don't Get It' thread. Rants accepted.
« Reply #1012 on: August 10, 2018, 11:35:11 AM »
At flight school I heard:

Pilots wash their hands after going to the bathroom.
Mechanics wash their hands before going to the bathroom.

Dude you forgot the first rule of flight club

dragoncar

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Re: The 'I Don't Get It' thread. Rants accepted.
« Reply #1013 on: August 10, 2018, 11:36:57 AM »
If you feel your hands are so clean because you took a shower and put your wee wee in clean shorts in the morning then peed later and didn't wash your hands because you are so clean, how would you like a surgeon to operate on you with the same thought process? Your hind end is inside your clean shorts and things migrate around down there. Also, think of all the gross things you have touched before you peed and touched yourself and introduced more germs to yourself. You now have other people's bacteria all over you. BLEH!

Nice straw man.  I wouldnít want a surgeon using his bare hands, washed or not, touching genitals or not.  There is a reason hygeine standards are higher for surgeons than food prep

I'm a red panda

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Re: The 'I Don't Get It' thread. Rants accepted.
« Reply #1014 on: August 10, 2018, 12:30:55 PM »
Just one more thing to think about. How would you like to use the urinal and standing beside you is the chef in a restaurant you are eating at in a few minutes. He walks out without washing his hands.  You asked for a tossed salad and he tossed the lettuce with his bare hands and added tomatoes and other garnish to the salad. He also touched your plate and other foods on your plate with his unwashed hands. Sounds yummy, doesn't it?

But I guess he took a shower and his wee wee was clean as a whistle! No issues there!

From this thread I've learned that it would be cleaner for the chef to toss the salad with his dick (clean since his morning shower) than his hands (super dirty because they are always touching things).

:P

Gross as it sounds, itís probably true.  Someone with agar do a washed dick culture and an unwashed hand culture and get back to us

It needs to be washed like 5 hours ago, and had just been used to urinate. Not a freshly washed one.

GuitarStv

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Re: The 'I Don't Get It' thread. Rants accepted.
« Reply #1015 on: August 10, 2018, 12:31:31 PM »
Just one more thing to think about. How would you like to use the urinal and standing beside you is the chef in a restaurant you are eating at in a few minutes. He walks out without washing his hands.  You asked for a tossed salad and he tossed the lettuce with his bare hands and added tomatoes and other garnish to the salad. He also touched your plate and other foods on your plate with his unwashed hands. Sounds yummy, doesn't it?

But I guess he took a shower and his wee wee was clean as a whistle! No issues there!

From this thread I've learned that it would be cleaner for the chef to toss the salad with his dick (clean since his morning shower) than his hands (super dirty because they are always touching things).

:P

Gross as it sounds, itís probably true.  Someone with agar do a washed dick culture and an unwashed hand culture and get back to us

This must also be why armpits never smell, right?  I mean they get washed and then just sit there under my shirt . .. untouched by the dirty outer world.

:P

driftwood

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Re: The 'I Don't Get It' thread. Rants accepted.
« Reply #1016 on: August 10, 2018, 02:11:27 PM »
Just one more thing to think about. How would you like to use the urinal and standing beside you is the chef in a restaurant you are eating at in a few minutes. He walks out without washing his hands.  You asked for a tossed salad and he tossed the lettuce with his bare hands and added tomatoes and other garnish to the salad. He also touched your plate and other foods on your plate with his unwashed hands. Sounds yummy, doesn't it?

But I guess he took a shower and his wee wee was clean as a whistle! No issues there!

I don't care if either the chef or the surgeon washed their hands when they used the bathroom. I care that they washed their hands before touching anything in the kitchen, or starting a surgery. When I go to prepare food in my house I wash my hands, so whether I came straight from the bathroom or just sitting on the couch I'm starting with clean hands. I think surgeons work the same way too... scrubbing before a surgery.

sui generis

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Re: The 'I Don't Get It' thread. Rants accepted.
« Reply #1017 on: August 10, 2018, 02:54:16 PM »
Just one more thing to think about. How would you like to use the urinal and standing beside you is the chef in a restaurant you are eating at in a few minutes. He walks out without washing his hands.  You asked for a tossed salad and he tossed the lettuce with his bare hands and added tomatoes and other garnish to the salad. He also touched your plate and other foods on your plate with his unwashed hands. Sounds yummy, doesn't it?

But I guess he took a shower and his wee wee was clean as a whistle! No issues there!

I don't care if either the chef or the surgeon washed their hands when they used the bathroom. I care that they washed their hands before touching anything in the kitchen, or starting a surgery. When I go to prepare food in my house I wash my hands, so whether I came straight from the bathroom or just sitting on the couch I'm starting with clean hands. I think surgeons work the same way too... scrubbing before a surgery.
This.  I wash my hands in the bathroom because it is the norm and it is a convenient time, being right there by a sink, to wash and try to maintain some semblence of basic hygiene.  Much less so because of what I did in the bathroom.  But I go more out of my way to wash my hands depending on what I am about to do next.  Like prepping dinner.  Or taking my contacts out of my eyes, etc.  And between all that, I feel like it adds up to a decent amount of handwashing per day to maintain health and reduce the risk of communicable disease. 

I mean, the bathroom is a tiny bit arbitrary - you know that coworker that just walked out of the bathroom without washing her hands, so you were super careful to grab the door handle with a paper towel?  Yeah, she just went straight to the company kitchen to make coffee and open the refrigerator and use that sink. Oh and she sneezed right before she did that as well...is anyone using a paper towel to touch all those things, too?  We all feel like the bathroom is a place to be super germaphobic, but spend the rest of the day touching lots of gross things.  Really, the bathroom is just a convenient place to wash your hands, which you should probably do even if you didn't just use a toilet and even if you don't have to touch a single thing in that bathroom.

Miss Piggy

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Re: The 'I Don't Get It' thread. Rants accepted.
« Reply #1018 on: August 10, 2018, 03:03:52 PM »
I mean, the bathroom is a tiny bit arbitrary - you know that coworker that just walked out of the bathroom without washing her hands, so you were super careful to grab the door handle with a paper towel?  Yeah, she just went straight to the company kitchen to make coffee and open the refrigerator and use that sink. Oh and she sneezed right before she did that as well...is anyone using a paper towel to touch all those things, too?  We all feel like the bathroom is a place to be super germaphobic, but spend the rest of the day touching lots of gross things.  Really, the bathroom is just a convenient place to wash your hands, which you should probably do even if you didn't just use a toilet and even if you don't have to touch a single thing in that bathroom.

Germophobe here (but I have a very valid reason to avoid germs, which I won't get into here). I get re-annoyed every morning when I have to touch EIGHT door handles and elevator buttons to get to my desk at work. The elevator buttons are fairly easy to avoid using an elbow if I'm not carrying too much stuff, but the doors are very heavy, and depending on the direction I'm walking through them, I have no choice but to grab the handle. (If I'm walking the other direction, I'll kick it open.)  The good news is that women in my office never leave the restroom without at least a cursory wash. (That said, yes, I still grab the bathroom door handle with a paper towel.)  Ugh. I have issues.

dragoncar

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Re: The 'I Don't Get It' thread. Rants accepted.
« Reply #1019 on: August 10, 2018, 04:04:24 PM »
Just one more thing to think about. How would you like to use the urinal and standing beside you is the chef in a restaurant you are eating at in a few minutes. He walks out without washing his hands.  You asked for a tossed salad and he tossed the lettuce with his bare hands and added tomatoes and other garnish to the salad. He also touched your plate and other foods on your plate with his unwashed hands. Sounds yummy, doesn't it?

But I guess he took a shower and his wee wee was clean as a whistle! No issues there!

From this thread I've learned that it would be cleaner for the chef to toss the salad with his dick (clean since his morning shower) than his hands (super dirty because they are always touching things).

:P

Gross as it sounds, itís probably true.  Someone with agar do a washed dick culture and an unwashed hand culture and get back to us

This must also be why armpits never smell, right?  I mean they get washed and then just sit there under my shirt . .. untouched by the dirty outer world.

:P

BO bacteria are not harmful.  They are natural body flora.  Again, sounds gross but not going to cause illness

Roadrunner53

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Re: The 'I Don't Get It' thread. Rants accepted.
« Reply #1020 on: August 10, 2018, 06:08:01 PM »
There are so many disgusting things to touch that we all have to be careful of. Yes, you washed your pee pee then you went to the grocery store. You go to a grocery store and you grab a cart where some kid crapped his pants and his mother changed the diaper in the seat on the cart. You open the freezer doors to get out some veggies and other junk. Some of the veggies were placed in the freezer by some sick kid who had a cold and sneezed all over his hands while putting junk in the freezer. Then you go to the deli. The guy who is cutting your meat is also sick and coughing while cutting your sliced ham. The cashier is checking you out and she has been touching dirty money and things and touches all your junk you are buying. Then you, who have washed your wiener that was magnificently washed, you now have to pee. You take your wing ding out of your clean shorts and think of all the gross junk you have touched and are now touching your wing ding. UGH! So many germs everywhere.

dragoncar

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Re: The 'I Don't Get It' thread. Rants accepted.
« Reply #1021 on: August 10, 2018, 06:27:51 PM »
There are so many disgusting things to touch that we all have to be careful of. Yes, you washed your pee pee then you went to the grocery store. You go to a grocery store and you grab a cart where some kid crapped his pants and his mother changed the diaper in the seat on the cart. You open the freezer doors to get out some veggies and other junk. Some of the veggies were placed in the freezer by some sick kid who had a cold and sneezed all over his hands while putting junk in the freezer. Then you go to the deli. The guy who is cutting your meat is also sick and coughing while cutting your sliced ham. The cashier is checking you out and she has been touching dirty money and things and touches all your junk you are buying. Then you, who have washed your wiener that was magnificently washed, you now have to pee. You take your wing ding out of your clean shorts and think of all the gross junk you have touched and are now touching your wing ding. UGH! So many germs everywhere.

I prefer to just pull down my pants and aim by pure willpower.  Keep the dick clean

solon

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Re: The 'I Don't Get It' thread. Rants accepted.
« Reply #1022 on: August 10, 2018, 07:09:47 PM »
There are so many disgusting things to touch that we all have to be careful of. Yes, you washed your pee pee then you went to the grocery store. You go to a grocery store and you grab a cart where some kid crapped his pants and his mother changed the diaper in the seat on the cart. You open the freezer doors to get out some veggies and other junk. Some of the veggies were placed in the freezer by some sick kid who had a cold and sneezed all over his hands while putting junk in the freezer. Then you go to the deli. The guy who is cutting your meat is also sick and coughing while cutting your sliced ham. The cashier is checking you out and she has been touching dirty money and things and touches all your junk you are buying. Then you, who have washed your wiener that was magnificently washed, you now have to pee. You take your wing ding out of your clean shorts and think of all the gross junk you have touched and are now touching your wing ding. UGH! So many germs everywhere.

I hate it when the cashiers are checking me out and then touching all my junk and things.

Primm

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Re: The 'I Don't Get It' thread. Rants accepted.
« Reply #1023 on: August 11, 2018, 12:48:38 AM »
If you feel your hands are so clean because you took a shower and put your wee wee in clean shorts in the morning then peed later and didn't wash your hands because you are so clean, how would you like a surgeon to operate on you with the same thought process? Your hind end is inside your clean shorts and things migrate around down there. Also, think of all the gross things you have touched before you peed and touched yourself and introduced more germs to yourself. You now have other people's bacteria all over you. BLEH!

Nice straw man.  I wouldnít want a surgeon using his bare hands, washed or not, touching genitals or not.  There is a reason hygeine standards are higher for surgeons than food prep

Yep. Surgeons are putting their hands (albeit gloved) into open body cavities. Touching intact skin or things that other people touch with their intact skin is not even close to the same thing.

BookLoverL

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Re: The 'I Don't Get It' thread. Rants accepted.
« Reply #1024 on: August 13, 2018, 01:20:16 AM »
Of course I always wash my hands before starting food prep, after using the bathroom, and after taking the litter out. But I really don't see how there are any more germs on a bathroom door handle than in a myriad of other places that you don't think about.

And yes, a surgeon or other hospital worker should have much higher standards of hygiene when at work than anywhere else, which should involve gloves, disinfectants, and thorough washes immediately before starting procedures...

EricL

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« Reply #1025 on: August 13, 2018, 01:29:57 AM »
I used to work in a hospital.  The management had to remind the staff to constantly wash their hands.  I've heard this is not uncommon.

dragoncar

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Re: The 'I Don't Get It' thread. Rants accepted.
« Reply #1026 on: August 13, 2018, 11:44:33 AM »
I used to work in a hospital.  The management had to remind the staff to constantly wash their hands.  I've heard this is not uncommon.

Hospitals are known to be pretty filthy.  They do a decent job, considering, but itís still best to be more careful in hospitals and clinics.

Still, I trust that the OR is held to a higher standard than the general premesis.

I'm a red panda

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Re: The 'I Don't Get It' thread. Rants accepted.
« Reply #1027 on: August 13, 2018, 12:04:34 PM »
I used to work in a hospital.  The management had to remind the staff to constantly wash their hands.  I've heard this is not uncommon.

I was recently in a hospital and had a blood draw that sprayed on a chair that the woman who drew it didn't notice. I pointed it out to the next person who came in (x-ray tech). He got a wet paper towel, wiped it up.
He never put a glove on or washed his hand afterwards.

I wrote a note to the hospital to remind their staff of universal precautions.  I mean, my blood is fine- but uh... it was an ER, they didn't know that.

DirtDiva

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Re: The 'I Don't Get It' thread. Rants accepted.
« Reply #1028 on: August 13, 2018, 08:11:06 PM »
1.  Long plastic/fake fingernails, because they are gross and provide a huge crevice for bacteria, and because they effectively make your hands useless.

2.  Tarantula length and thickness eyelashes.  I find it hard to concentrate on what the person is saying because Iím busy wondering if it makes it hard to blink.

I guess Iím more Dirt than Diva.

( of course the previous generation of old codgers looked at my generation of teenagers and wondered why we wore our jeans so tight it was hard to sit down, and so it goes)

MDfive21

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« Reply #1029 on: August 14, 2018, 07:51:42 AM »
agree 100% on the eyelashes.  it makes me cringe that women feel they have to do that to look good.  i'm generally anti-makeup to begin with but the eyelashes and heavy makeup are as much a turn off as cigarette smoke.

OtherJen

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Re: The 'I Don't Get It' thread. Rants accepted.
« Reply #1030 on: August 14, 2018, 08:13:14 AM »
agree 100% on the eyelashes.  it makes me cringe that women feel they have to do that to look good.  i'm generally anti-makeup to begin with but the eyelashes and heavy makeup are as much a turn off as cigarette smoke.

Do they do it because they think they have to or because they actually like it?

I donít enjoy wearing a lot of makeup, but I have friends who do enjoy it and use it as a form of artistic expression. Other female friends donít wear it at all. Makeup can be fun, though. I enjoy lipstick. When I was little, it was the one product in my momís cosmetic bag that I always wanted to wear because I liked the colors, texture, scent, application, etc. My husband generally prefers me without lipstick and I often accommodate his preference, but sometimes I wear it just because I still enjoy it.

I agree that it is sad that some women feel that such things are required.

GreenEggs

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« Reply #1031 on: August 14, 2018, 11:38:38 AM »
The ridiculously long fingernails are a self inflicted impairment.  I can't imagine an employer allowing it.  As a customer I'm insulted by companies that do allow their employees to be less effective at assisting me.  I think I will begin complaining directly to them, since I am the customer and am "always right"!  LOL  ;)

MDfive21

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Re: The 'I Don't Get It' thread. Rants accepted.
« Reply #1032 on: August 15, 2018, 12:03:33 PM »
agree 100% on the eyelashes.  it makes me cringe that women feel they have to do that to look good.  i'm generally anti-makeup to begin with but the eyelashes and heavy makeup are as much a turn off as cigarette smoke.

Do they do it because they think they have to or because they actually like it?


that would be a very interesting woman-on-the-street survey question! 

i really don't know.  i'm a mid-40s married guy so my current experience is somewhat limited, but i know my wife puts on a 'natural look' amount of makeup because her coworkers and clients do and she doesn't want to be the odd one out that doesn't wear any.  we've talked about it.  she would probably wear some anyway, so with her it's maybe 25/75 choice/peer pressure.

but if makeup use falls along a normal distribution curve, plenty of women only do it out of obligation to social norms.  back in the day i remember having female friends who would complain about having to get made up before they went anywhere.  or 'i would go but i don't have makeup on' or similar comments.

Trifele

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« Reply #1033 on: August 15, 2018, 01:22:32 PM »
agree 100% on the eyelashes.  it makes me cringe that women feel they have to do that to look good.  i'm generally anti-makeup to begin with but the eyelashes and heavy makeup are as much a turn off as cigarette smoke.

Do they do it because they think they have to or because they actually like it?


that would be a very interesting woman-on-the-street survey question! 

but if makeup use falls along a normal distribution curve, plenty of women only do it out of obligation to social norms. 

[raises hand] Yep, I'm one.  I hate makeup, but I wear the minimum required to look 'normal' in my workplace. On non workdays I don't wear any at all.  Once I FIRE next year I sooooo look forward to never having to do that again!

Veritasvosliberabit

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Re: The 'I Don't Get It' thread. Rants accepted.
« Reply #1034 on: August 15, 2018, 01:55:56 PM »
On the gentrification issue, I have a question for those who view it as  problem to be solved.  What is the solution?  Price-fixing?  Won't that have the implication of chilling investment and keeping an area poor?

I might not be your target, because I don't think gentrification can be stopped, but I do think we can do things to minimize the impact:
-End restrictive zoning laws that require specific kinds of housing in an area, so that there are more housing options at a variety of price points.
-Allow accessory dwelling units (basement apartments, garage apartments, "granny flats"), which lets lower- and fixed-income homeowners to reap the benefits of their valuable location without selling, and increases in housing supply.
-Increase investment in public transit and remove parking minimums in new construction. ("Free parking" drives up the cost of construction and is a waste of space in urban areas.)
-Offer to trade developers zoning variances (building height, setbacks, etc) for public benefits (dedicated low-income units, green space, etc).

None of these things are individual actions, but they require being involved in local politics, where it is actually surprisingly easy for one person to make a big impact. Generally, really boring-sounding stuff like "District Land Use Committee" are dominated by older homeowners who want to "preserve neighborhood character", and don't recognize that, long-term, that's impossible.

I live in a neighbourhood with a certain reputation that has improved a lot over the last 10-15 years. People who have moved here in recent years are teachers, nurses, social workers etc, educated people with jobs that pay average wages. Having all these people move in has been a lifesaver for the neighbourhood as a whole, but many areas have become too expensive for people on minimum wage. The problem is that we are now out of truly cheap neighbourhoods - even the bad areas have improved so much they are now quite expensive. Except for some very rural areas, in a large part of my country it's become impossible to live comfortably (as a renter or a homeowner) on a lower income. Housing costs have grown much faster than income has over the last half century.

A lot of homes in my neighbourhood are owned by a non-profit housing association (that was formed as a charity 100 years ago) and they sell homes at a discounted rate to people on a lower-than-average income (max 30k) on the condition that they sell the house back to the housing assocation at the same discounted rate. We were able to purchase our house with a 40% discount. We will eventually sell it back to the association for 60% of the value at the date of the sale, but this discount allows us to live cheaply, save money, build up some equity in the property and once we sell it, it will go to another young, hardworking couple that is in need of a break. I personally think this is a great scheme: this way properties go to those in need and not to slum landlords, while improving the neighbourhood.

If the neighborhood is too expensive for those making minimum wage they have the option to move to a cheaper location while still making minimum wage.

Imma

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Re: The 'I Don't Get It' thread. Rants accepted.
« Reply #1035 on: August 15, 2018, 04:37:34 PM »
On the gentrification issue, I have a question for those who view it as  problem to be solved.  What is the solution?  Price-fixing?  Won't that have the implication of chilling investment and keeping an area poor?

I might not be your target, because I don't think gentrification can be stopped, but I do think we can do things to minimize the impact:
-End restrictive zoning laws that require specific kinds of housing in an area, so that there are more housing options at a variety of price points.
-Allow accessory dwelling units (basement apartments, garage apartments, "granny flats"), which lets lower- and fixed-income homeowners to reap the benefits of their valuable location without selling, and increases in housing supply.
-Increase investment in public transit and remove parking minimums in new construction. ("Free parking" drives up the cost of construction and is a waste of space in urban areas.)
-Offer to trade developers zoning variances (building height, setbacks, etc) for public benefits (dedicated low-income units, green space, etc).

None of these things are individual actions, but they require being involved in local politics, where it is actually surprisingly easy for one person to make a big impact. Generally, really boring-sounding stuff like "District Land Use Committee" are dominated by older homeowners who want to "preserve neighborhood character", and don't recognize that, long-term, that's impossible.

I live in a neighbourhood with a certain reputation that has improved a lot over the last 10-15 years. People who have moved here in recent years are teachers, nurses, social workers etc, educated people with jobs that pay average wages. Having all these people move in has been a lifesaver for the neighbourhood as a whole, but many areas have become too expensive for people on minimum wage. The problem is that we are now out of truly cheap neighbourhoods - even the bad areas have improved so much they are now quite expensive. Except for some very rural areas, in a large part of my country it's become impossible to live comfortably (as a renter or a homeowner) on a lower income. Housing costs have grown much faster than income has over the last half century.

A lot of homes in my neighbourhood are owned by a non-profit housing association (that was formed as a charity 100 years ago) and they sell homes at a discounted rate to people on a lower-than-average income (max 30k) on the condition that they sell the house back to the housing assocation at the same discounted rate. We were able to purchase our house with a 40% discount. We will eventually sell it back to the association for 60% of the value at the date of the sale, but this discount allows us to live cheaply, save money, build up some equity in the property and once we sell it, it will go to another young, hardworking couple that is in need of a break. I personally think this is a great scheme: this way properties go to those in need and not to slum landlords, while improving the neighbourhood.

If the neighborhood is too expensive for those making minimum wage they have the option to move to a cheaper location while still making minimum wage.

Well, no, they don't, because this is still the very cheapest neighbourhood around. There are no even cheaper locations to move to, except for some extremely rural areas with hardly any jobs, which is why no one lives there in the first place. The cheapest homes in the cheapest neighbourhoods will cost someone on minimum wage probably at least half of their income in rent, utilities and local taxes. We are very quickly running out of affordable homes in this country. The average house now costs 4,5 times the average income. (average sales price of house is 288k, average family income is 64k before taxes).

thd7t

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Re: The 'I Don't Get It' thread. Rants accepted.
« Reply #1036 on: August 16, 2018, 01:59:29 PM »
On the gentrification issue, I have a question for those who view it as  problem to be solved.  What is the solution?  Price-fixing?  Won't that have the implication of chilling investment and keeping an area poor?

I might not be your target, because I don't think gentrification can be stopped, but I do think we can do things to minimize the impact:
-End restrictive zoning laws that require specific kinds of housing in an area, so that there are more housing options at a variety of price points.
-Allow accessory dwelling units (basement apartments, garage apartments, "granny flats"), which lets lower- and fixed-income homeowners to reap the benefits of their valuable location without selling, and increases in housing supply.
-Increase investment in public transit and remove parking minimums in new construction. ("Free parking" drives up the cost of construction and is a waste of space in urban areas.)
-Offer to trade developers zoning variances (building height, setbacks, etc) for public benefits (dedicated low-income units, green space, etc).

None of these things are individual actions, but they require being involved in local politics, where it is actually surprisingly easy for one person to make a big impact. Generally, really boring-sounding stuff like "District Land Use Committee" are dominated by older homeowners who want to "preserve neighborhood character", and don't recognize that, long-term, that's impossible.

I live in a neighbourhood with a certain reputation that has improved a lot over the last 10-15 years. People who have moved here in recent years are teachers, nurses, social workers etc, educated people with jobs that pay average wages. Having all these people move in has been a lifesaver for the neighbourhood as a whole, but many areas have become too expensive for people on minimum wage. The problem is that we are now out of truly cheap neighbourhoods - even the bad areas have improved so much they are now quite expensive. Except for some very rural areas, in a large part of my country it's become impossible to live comfortably (as a renter or a homeowner) on a lower income. Housing costs have grown much faster than income has over the last half century.

A lot of homes in my neighbourhood are owned by a non-profit housing association (that was formed as a charity 100 years ago) and they sell homes at a discounted rate to people on a lower-than-average income (max 30k) on the condition that they sell the house back to the housing assocation at the same discounted rate. We were able to purchase our house with a 40% discount. We will eventually sell it back to the association for 60% of the value at the date of the sale, but this discount allows us to live cheaply, save money, build up some equity in the property and once we sell it, it will go to another young, hardworking couple that is in need of a break. I personally think this is a great scheme: this way properties go to those in need and not to slum landlords, while improving the neighbourhood.

If the neighborhood is too expensive for those making minimum wage they have the option to move to a cheaper location while still making minimum wage.
If someone has retired on a fixed income and lives in a paid off house, should they be forced to move if gentrification raises their taxes?

GreenEggs

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Re: The 'I Don't Get It' thread. Rants accepted.
« Reply #1037 on: August 16, 2018, 04:31:18 PM »
On the gentrification issue, I have a question for those who view it as  problem to be solved.  What is the solution?  Price-fixing?  Won't that have the implication of chilling investment and keeping an area poor?

I might not be your target, because I don't think gentrification can be stopped, but I do think we can do things to minimize the impact:
-End restrictive zoning laws that require specific kinds of housing in an area, so that there are more housing options at a variety of price points.
-Allow accessory dwelling units (basement apartments, garage apartments, "granny flats"), which lets lower- and fixed-income homeowners to reap the benefits of their valuable location without selling, and increases in housing supply.
-Increase investment in public transit and remove parking minimums in new construction. ("Free parking" drives up the cost of construction and is a waste of space in urban areas.)
-Offer to trade developers zoning variances (building height, setbacks, etc) for public benefits (dedicated low-income units, green space, etc).

None of these things are individual actions, but they require being involved in local politics, where it is actually surprisingly easy for one person to make a big impact. Generally, really boring-sounding stuff like "District Land Use Committee" are dominated by older homeowners who want to "preserve neighborhood character", and don't recognize that, long-term, that's impossible.

I live in a neighbourhood with a certain reputation that has improved a lot over the last 10-15 years. People who have moved here in recent years are teachers, nurses, social workers etc, educated people with jobs that pay average wages. Having all these people move in has been a lifesaver for the neighbourhood as a whole, but many areas have become too expensive for people on minimum wage. The problem is that we are now out of truly cheap neighbourhoods - even the bad areas have improved so much they are now quite expensive. Except for some very rural areas, in a large part of my country it's become impossible to live comfortably (as a renter or a homeowner) on a lower income. Housing costs have grown much faster than income has over the last half century.

A lot of homes in my neighbourhood are owned by a non-profit housing association (that was formed as a charity 100 years ago) and they sell homes at a discounted rate to people on a lower-than-average income (max 30k) on the condition that they sell the house back to the housing assocation at the same discounted rate. We were able to purchase our house with a 40% discount. We will eventually sell it back to the association for 60% of the value at the date of the sale, but this discount allows us to live cheaply, save money, build up some equity in the property and once we sell it, it will go to another young, hardworking couple that is in need of a break. I personally think this is a great scheme: this way properties go to those in need and not to slum landlords, while improving the neighbourhood.

If the neighborhood is too expensive for those making minimum wage they have the option to move to a cheaper location while still making minimum wage.
If someone has retired on a fixed income and lives in a paid off house, should they be forced to move if gentrification raises their taxes?


This is a capitalist country.  Pay up or move on.  That's how it works. 


I don't like it, but that seems to be how things work in the USA.

BTDretire

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Re: The 'I Don't Get It' thread. Rants accepted.
« Reply #1038 on: August 16, 2018, 04:48:39 PM »


This is a capitalist country.  Pay up or move on.  That's how it works. 

I don't like it, but that seems to be how things work in the USA.

 Precisely why I think property taxes are the worst tax.
 The largest asset many families ever have and they must continue to rent it from the government.
For the rest of their lives, until the very end, the government says. give me your money or I'll take your house.
 Arrgh!

Dicey

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Re: The 'I Don't Get It' thread. Rants accepted.
« Reply #1039 on: August 16, 2018, 09:08:16 PM »
This is a capitalist country.  Pay up or move on.  That's how it works. 
I don't like it, but that seems to be how things work in the USA.
Precisely why I think property taxes are the worst tax.
The largest asset many families ever have and they must continue to rent it from the government.
For the rest of their lives, until the very end, the government says. give me your money or I'll take your house.
Arrgh!
All the more reason to amass a shitload of money before prepaying a cheap-ass, fixed rate mortgage. Taxes, insurance, utilities and maintenance always go up. You never truly own your home. Fall behind on your taxes and see how fast you lose your "paid-for" home.

dragoncar

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Re: The 'I Don't Get It' thread. Rants accepted.
« Reply #1040 on: August 16, 2018, 10:46:44 PM »
This is a capitalist country.  Pay up or move on.  That's how it works. 
I don't like it, but that seems to be how things work in the USA.
Precisely why I think property taxes are the worst tax.
The largest asset many families ever have and they must continue to rent it from the government.
For the rest of their lives, until the very end, the government says. give me your money or I'll take your house.
Arrgh!
All the more reason to amass a shitload of money before prepaying a cheap-ass, fixed rate mortgage. Taxes, insurance, utilities and maintenance always go up. You never truly own your home. Fall behind on your taxes and see how fast you lose your "paid-for" home.

This is why I think property taxes are the best tax.  Look back at the chain of title for your land.  There's likely some shady shit there.  While I generally believe in the construct of land ownership for pragmatic purposes, you didn't create the land.  Your improvements are yours, but the earth belongs to the the people at large.

shelivesthedream

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Re: The 'I Don't Get It' thread. Rants accepted.
« Reply #1041 on: August 17, 2018, 02:51:45 AM »
I don't get why people are so insistent on getting on the Tube before letting everyone else off. Clearly they are in SUCH rush that they just HAVE to storm on the second the doors open, but it creates a huge amount of congestion with people blocking the doors and obstructing other people (as well as being hugely rude) that the train leaves LATER than if everyone had just been allowed to get off and then everyone get on.

merula

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Re: The 'I Don't Get It' thread. Rants accepted.
« Reply #1042 on: August 17, 2018, 06:12:57 AM »
I don't get why people are so insistent on getting on the Tube before letting everyone else off. Clearly they are in SUCH rush that they just HAVE to storm on the second the doors open, but it creates a huge amount of congestion with people blocking the doors and obstructing other people (as well as being hugely rude) that the train leaves LATER than if everyone had just been allowed to get off and then everyone get on.

Of the ~15 metros I've ridden, the majority have people waiting for current riders to exit before entering. The ones I can think of that didn't were London and Hong Kong. (Though to be fair I haven't been to the massively overcrowded ones in Tokyo or anything.)

OtherJen

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Re: The 'I Don't Get It' thread. Rants accepted.
« Reply #1043 on: August 17, 2018, 07:54:42 AM »
I don't get why people are so insistent on getting on the Tube before letting everyone else off. Clearly they are in SUCH rush that they just HAVE to storm on the second the doors open, but it creates a huge amount of congestion with people blocking the doors and obstructing other people (as well as being hugely rude) that the train leaves LATER than if everyone had just been allowed to get off and then everyone get on.

Of the ~15 metros I've ridden, the majority have people waiting for current riders to exit before entering. The ones I can think of that didn't were London and Hong Kong. (Though to be fair I haven't been to the massively overcrowded ones in Tokyo or anything.)

Even during evening rush hour, I didnít have problems getting on/off of train cars in Tokyo. We were packed in like sardines, but it was somehow orderly.

accolay

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Re: The 'I Don't Get It' thread. Rants accepted.
« Reply #1044 on: August 26, 2018, 10:38:40 PM »
Even during evening rush hour, I didnít have problems getting on/off of train cars in Tokyo. We were packed in like sardines, but it was somehow orderly.

Singapore's transit was pretty orderly as I recall. They had diagonal lines painted on the ground at a number of stops reminding people to stand to the sides and let people exit before boarding.

Just Joe

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Re: The 'I Don't Get It' thread. Rants accepted.
« Reply #1045 on: August 30, 2018, 07:22:30 AM »
A quick return to the bathroom topic: at work I don't always wash in the bathroom if my next destination is my lab/shop area b/c I stock it with better soap and paper towels than the custodial staff puts in the bathrooms. ;)

Fomerly known as something

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Re: The 'I Don't Get It' thread. Rants accepted.
« Reply #1046 on: September 03, 2018, 06:37:11 AM »
People who come to a public park and ignore the signs that say all dogs must be on a 6 ft leash.  I'm not even talking about the people who have a leash and the dog is not on it right at that second but I was hiking and it looked like the medium sized dog didn't come to the park with a leash at all.  (no attempt by the owner to put one on as I came toward them on a trail).

I like dogs, I work around working dogs who are incredibly well trained but I know they are dogs.  They are not human and don't reason like humans sometimes their prey drive kicks in when you don't expect it or they get irritated and snap at something espcially something that is not part of their pack.  Too many owners forget that.

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Re: The 'I Don't Get It' thread. Rants accepted.
« Reply #1047 on: September 03, 2018, 07:48:25 AM »
People who come to a public park and ignore the signs that say all dogs must be on a 6 ft leash.  I'm not even talking about the people who have a leash and the dog is not on it right at that second but I was hiking and it looked like the medium sized dog didn't come to the park with a leash at all.  (no attempt by the owner to put one on as I came toward them on a trail).

I like dogs, I work around working dogs who are incredibly well trained but I know they are dogs.  They are not human and don't reason like humans sometimes their prey drive kicks in when you don't expect it or they get irritated and snap at something espcially something that is not part of their pack.  Too many owners forget that.

My dog has been attacked twice by large breed dogs that were off leash.  Both times the owners were yelling "It's OK, he's very friendly" as the their dog was biting my small beagle hard enough to draw blood.  Both times I had to repeatedly kick the attacking dog (and kick it quite hard) to get it to back off because the owner didn't even try to stop the attack.  I really like dogs, and wish I could kick the owners who both never bothered to socialize/train their dog properly and decided not to maintain control of their animal instead of the animal itself.

Trifele

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Re: The 'I Don't Get It' thread. Rants accepted.
« Reply #1048 on: September 03, 2018, 08:26:21 AM »
People who come to a public park and ignore the signs that say all dogs must be on a 6 ft leash.  I'm not even talking about the people who have a leash and the dog is not on it right at that second but I was hiking and it looked like the medium sized dog didn't come to the park with a leash at all.  (no attempt by the owner to put one on as I came toward them on a trail).

I like dogs, I work around working dogs who are incredibly well trained but I know they are dogs.  They are not human and don't reason like humans sometimes their prey drive kicks in when you don't expect it or they get irritated and snap at something espcially something that is not part of their pack.  Too many owners forget that.

My dog has been attacked twice by large breed dogs that were off leash.  Both times the owners were yelling "It's OK, he's very friendly" as the their dog was biting my small beagle hard enough to draw blood.  Both times I had to repeatedly kick the attacking dog (and kick it quite hard) to get it to back off because the owner didn't even try to stop the attack.  I really like dogs, and wish I could kick the owners who both never bothered to socialize/train their dog properly and decided not to maintain control of their animal instead of the animal itself.

Similar story here.  A few years ago on a trail I had my dog (30 pound beagle mix) on a leash when she was attacked by a much larger dog that was off leash and at least 100 feet away from its owner.  My dog could have been killed if I hadn't repeatedly kicked the attacking dog hard.  The dog's owner didn't try to stop her dog and never apologized.  Wish I could have kicked her.   


Mezzie

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Re: The 'I Don't Get It' thread. Rants accepted.
« Reply #1049 on: September 03, 2018, 08:36:34 AM »
I love dogs I know, but am terrified of dogs I don't know that are off-leash. This stems from having been mauled by a dog as a kid. We have plenty of dog parks and a designated area of beach for dogs to run around freely, so it's pretty frustrating (and terrifying) when I'm at a park and large dogs start loping towards me while the owners jusf laugh.