Went BACK to work today

[rahby1us]

Long story short went back to work today. FIRE'd in 2017 after a layoff with spending at about 3.8% Moved across the country to live and recreate out west. We got pregnant. Converted our condo in our previous city to an airbnb that's performing great so far.

Love it in our new town but want to buy a place. First child on the way, thinking we'll have 2 or 3. Might need some more outdoor toys to get the most out of new setting. So going back felt like the right thing to do, was able to land a job in corporate finance pretty quickly (the company was a perfect match for my resume).

Left the office today at 5pm... it was dark outside. Ugh, haha. Not looking forward to the loss of freedom, but i think seeing the accounts growing faster than usual and securing cheap healthcare will help ease any mental pain. Anyone else go through something similar? Would love to hear about others' experiences and any advice!

[Cassie]

Sounds like you are young so will have a second retirement when you are ready:))

[Buffaloski Boris]

Congrats on the upcoming baby!  Yeah, kids will throw a spanner into your finances. But they are soooo worth it! I assume your SO is staying home? 

I haven't retired myself so don't have any specific advice. The good thing that I see is that since you have had a taste of retirement and presumably still have FU money, your work experience might be better this go round. It's all in what you make of it.     

[rahby1us]

Yeah, SO will stay home. She is a photographer so as her biz starts up she's substitute teaching. Very flexible with the holidays coming up we can go home without any difficulty. Seems like it could be really good long term, I might even sign up too once I fire again!

[soccerluvof4]

Being young if thats what you feel then good for you. Like @spartana mentioned perhaps you will miss the freedom and go back into retirement. For me I found side gigs was a better route to pick up some extra things I wanted without committing myself to a JOB. Just stick to your practices that got you to fire the first time. Good Luck!

[cangelosibrown]

I did basically this exact thing. "Retired" in 2016, went back to work in 2018 after having a kid and moving to a higher COL area out west. Was able to immediately find a great job that I am really enjoying.

It's very difficult for me, having a young child and not being certain where we'll live long term, to project my future budget. It's very nice to not have to worry about what I spend at all these days and still have my NW grow very quickly. I honestly haven't even thought about RE again, or setting any sort of target for that. I'm sure it'll happen eventually (and could happen immediately if I really wanted to), but I'm enjoying working for the moment, and work isn't affecting my life too much ( baby restrictions> work restrictions).

Curious, if you don't mind posting it, where you moved out west?

[Daisyedwards800]

So how is it?

[Cornel_Westside]

What is your target for retiring again? Is this indefinite? I assume with a few years of FIRE, you have a good idea of your spending under FIRE. Obviously kids throw a wrench in that, but I assume you could estimate the additional money you'll need and how long you'll need to work to hit your new number.

[rahby1us]

I did basically this exact thing. "Retired" in 2016, went back to work in 2018 after having a kid and moving to a higher COL area out west. Was able to immediately find a great job that I am really enjoying.

It's very difficult for me, having a young child and not being certain where we'll live long term, to project my future budget. It's very nice to not have to worry about what I spend at all these days and still have my NW grow very quickly. I honestly haven't even thought about RE again, or setting any sort of target for that. I'm sure it'll happen eventually (and could happen immediately if I really wanted to), but I'm enjoying working for the moment, and work isn't affecting my life too much ( baby restrictions> work restrictions).

Curious, if you don't mind posting it, where you moved out west?

We are in Fort Collins, CO. How about you? To address Cornel_Westside, we're hoping to qualify for a mortgage, use the insurance to defray initial medical costs for 2, maaaybe 3 kids (hoping for one of each). By socking away my decent salary almost entirely, a few years might be enough. We'll see what the rugrat(s) end up costing us, what sort of home we end up in and then try to set a target.  The housing seems like the biggest controllable variable there. Prices here are quite high, and i won't say we have expensive taste, but maybe we set our expectations on what we could afford in our prior lower COL area.

[cangelosibrown]

We are in Fort Collins, CO. How about you? To address Cornel_Westside, we're hoping to qualify for a mortgage, use the insurance to defray initial medical costs for 2, maaaybe 3 kids (hoping for one of each). By socking away my decent salary almost entirely, a few years might be enough. We'll see what the rugrat(s) end up costing us, what sort of home we end up in and then try to set a target.  The housing seems like the biggest controllable variable there. Prices here are quite high, and i won't say we have expensive taste, but maybe we set our expectations on what we could afford in our prior lower COL area.

How are you liking Fort Collins? We're still trying to figure out where we want to settle long-term and that's one of the possibilities we've talked about quite a bit. I'm out in Washington state right now. It's great out here, but the housing is much more expensive than I want to be paying forever. Obviously it's all relative, but I can't really believe how expensive the west coast is. Parts of Colorado seem to be getting close to this, but Fort Collins still looks pretty reasonable to me.

[rahby1us]

We absolutely LOVE it here. The only downside so far is actually the housing prices, haha. Just a lot more $ than Georgia where we came from. I'd take a look at zillow listings to see what you think. One thing that has been surprising for CO for us, given the focus on being outside is how small all of the yards are here especially in any of the new neighborhoods. A 1/4 acre lot is considered big anywhere even close to town (and i use the term close loosely). In reality, with a 2000 sq foot house on it, you are still probably 25 feet from your neighbors bathroom : /

Buuuut, i only complain because we've been looking lately. The access to the outdoors, the Poudre river, the people here, the weather, Old town and the events there, the surrounding areas... all of these aspects have exceeded our expectations of Fort Collins; I guess that explains the housing demand!

[HPstache]

So it sounds like the 4% rule may not be baby-proof?

[FIRE Artist]

So it sounds like the 4% rule may not be baby-proof?

Not the 4% rule, rather the spending plan wasn’t baby-proof. 

[insufFIcientfunds]

i didn't go back to work but had to change hours from 6-230 to 9-5 to take the kid to school. Wife now does 6-230. That way we avoid after school care because 1. Cost; 2. Cost; 3. He can come home and spend time with wife.

It feels like I went back to work though. My afternoons now are not free like they used to be. I do however get to spend every morning before work with my kids, so that is pretty fun.

I'd say just try and immerse yourself in your job while you are there, then when you leave, brain dump on the way home and spend time with the family. I enjoy some co-workers and chatting with them, reading MMM, and doing some work. Then at 5, I brain dump and go home. Rinse and repeat.

Good luck!

[HPstache]

So it sounds like the 4% rule may not be baby-proof?

Not the 4% rule, rather the spending plan wasn’t baby-proof.

Good point

[Dicey]

How much work history will you need to show to satisfy a mortgage lender?

[robartsd]

I did basically this exact thing. "Retired" in 2016, went back to work in 2018 after having a kid and moving to a higher COL area out west. Was able to immediately find a great job that I am really enjoying.

It's very difficult for me, having a young child and not being certain where we'll live long term, to project my future budget. It's very nice to not have to worry about what I spend at all these days and still have my NW grow very quickly. I honestly haven't even thought about RE again, or setting any sort of target for that. I'm sure it'll happen eventually (and could happen immediately if I really wanted to), but I'm enjoying working for the moment, and work isn't affecting my life too much ( baby restrictions> work restrictions).

Curious, if you don't mind posting it, where you moved out west?

We are in Fort Collins, CO. How about you? To address Cornel_Westside, we're hoping to qualify for a mortgage, use the insurance to defray initial medical costs for 2, maaaybe 3 kids (hoping for one of each). By socking away my decent salary almost entirely, a few years might be enough. We'll see what the rugrat(s) end up costing us, what sort of home we end up in and then try to set a target.  The housing seems like the biggest controllable variable there. Prices here are quite high, and i won't say we have expensive taste, but maybe we set our expectations on what we could afford in our prior lower COL area.

Nice to hear stories of people not having difficulty finding decent jobs after a couple year gap in employment. My guess is that by the time you are setting the target, it will be very close; though as you say, housing will likely be the biggest variable.

[rahby1us]

So it sounds like the 4% rule may not be baby-proof?

Not the 4% rule, rather the spending plan wasn’t baby-proof.

Good point

I think baby spending and wanting to qualify for a mortgage were the 2 reasons we always knew I would come back to work, at least for a little bit. If you are working a "standard" W2 job i was told that you can qualify for a mortgage with your first paycheck. That looks to be true but i'll provide an update once I'm able to prove it.
In my inquiries with a lender, you don't get much credit for having a large stache of cash (at least working with quicken i didn't). We were going to qualify for very small loan considering what we've got invested. I've got 2 rentals, but those aren't super profitable when looking at my taxes. I'm taking depreciation and as many write offs as i legally can thus reducing my AGI for taxes... but also for qualifying income.
That coupled with the fact that our goals to get pregnant lined up timewise with our goal to qualify for a mortgage in our new town made it a no brainer, I'll take the company insurance rather than pay 100% out of pocket.

If we were just going to continue the status quo we were at 3.33% yearly spending.

For the kid, i'm budgeting an increase in our discretionary spend from 32k to 51k per year. (this # includes food, gas and anything that's largely controllable, but does not include utilities, phone, car insurance, a buffer for medical expenses and car repairs and annual taxes. I've budgeted for those expenses but keep them separate as they are safety margins or largely optimized already) Hmm, i've been thinking $19k a year for a kid sounds like plenty, but haven't factored in that we'll probly be having more than 1. I'm not going to spoil them, but don't have a baseline on this??? What do you guys think?

Before retiring again, i'd like to be at around 3.8% or lower, and calculate that # to include a 10% drop in the market, just in case we go to a recession the day after i put in notice : )

Would love any input or feedback on the above, I've just started work again, and would rather here critiques today so i can plan/act than in a couple years when i wish i would have done things differently.

[robartsd]

For the kid, i'm budgeting an increase in our discretionary spend from 32k to 51k per year.

I wouldn't expand the budget that much myself, you're adding more than 50% of the budget for 2 adults to get to the budget for a family of 3. Sure you left out a few things, but lots of things will be cheaper than a 50% increase.

Before retiring again, i'd like to be at around 3.8% or lower, and calculate that # to include a 10% drop in the market, just in case we go to a recession the day after i put in notice : )

So you're choosing 3.42% (3.8% * 90%) as you SWR. The 4% rule is designed to handle recessions already. I understand that people think we will have below historic average returns in the next decade or so. I tend to use 5% for average returns in my accumulation projections and I think there is some room to argue that the safety of targeting a withdraw rate a bit lower than 4% is worthwhile, but I think you're being foolishly over conservative in setting this target.

I don't think it's a bad idea that you're going back to work to 1) qualify for a mortage, 2) have your babies on employer medical plan, 3) save extra for an expected increase in spending of an unknown amount, but with existing room to safely increase your spending by at least 20%, I don'think you need too.