Mustachians and Renewable Energy. Please Respond Even if You Don't Use It.

[Vic99]

I burn wood for 95% of heat and own solar PV for 100

[MOD EDIT: Edited poll to allow users to choose multiple options, and to change their vote, so you can update it if you already voted.] 

[Zikoris]

Uh... 400 square foot apartment. I use whatever it is that my building is wired for. I pay a flat $15/month for all utilities.

[Syonyk]

I've got a 2kW array running my office because trenching through basalt sucks.  Not sure if that really counts or not.

[soccerluvof4]

I put none apply. When we had a second home I did burn wood and it worked great for heat (cabin in the woods)  I think solar and wind have aways to go yet but making great strides. Also impressed with the way things are going with autos, never thought it would go or last this long. Going well!

[marty998]

People can have their own geothermal?

Wow...

I wanted to go solar in my apartment. Strata denied my request to put panels on the common area roof.

There will come a point where it will be cheaper one day to go with solar instead of coal. It just needs coal to be priced correctly "negative externalities" that it produces.

[onlykelsey]

I live in a condo and none of those are an option, and I think that may be a common response here...

Some cities I've lived in have let you purchase electricity only from certain renewable sources, which I guess is a proxy.

[retiringearly]

You can purchase renewable energy from many electric utility providers.  I would have included that as an option.

[MasterStache]

Self installed a 5.74 KW array on our previous house. More than paid for itself we when sold the house. Nothing currently.

[Vic99]

You can purchase renewable energy from many electric utility providers.  I would have included that as an option.

Yeah, I almost did, but wanted to see who actually put the hardware in place.

[Vic99]

People can have their own geothermal?

Wow...

I wanted to go solar in my apartment. Strata denied my request to put panels on the common area roof.

There will come a point where it will be cheaper one day to go with solar instead of coal. It just needs coal to be priced correctly "negative externalities" that it produces.

Yes, geothermal at home is an option.  Quite pricey.  One of my student's Dad actually did it here in the Northeast for wealthy customers.  Can't remember the ave price.

[mozar]

Yeah, I almost did, but wanted to see who actually put the hardware in place.

Ooops, then I voted wrong. I said I leased wind, but I actually get it through my utility provider.

[Bicycle_B]

You can purchase renewable energy from many electric utility providers.  I would have included that as an option.

Exactly!  And I would have selected that instead of "want to in the future." 

I participated actively in local politics / activism for a while.  One of my crowd's accomplishments is that anyone on our local grid can "buy green" electricity; you get a fixed rate, often a bit higher than normal rates but sometimes lower, and the commitments from individuals jointly ensure that the city can successfully buy wind and solar power as a substantial part of the city's energy sourcing mix.  I am one of those buyers. 

I know that physically, all the energy in the grid mixes together, but the commitment from individuals supports the utility's accession to our request that it contract for renewable "generation" (collection).  Some of the contracts create renewable collection facilities, other contracts keep existing providers in business and encourage more investment.  I feel that, even though the path is less clear cut than individual purchasers of small energy collection units (windmills, solar cells, etc), "green grid" adopters are using and encouraging renewable energy. 

Also, larger facilities can be more efficient.  Thanks for mentioning the grid option.

[Syonyk]

By "Geothermal," do you mean geothermal energy generation (which I'm not aware of at residential scale), or a ground-source heat pump (which is fairly common)?

[Rural]

Hey, you left out my passive solar heating! It's our primary heat, combined with thermal mass.


ETA: yes to Syonyk - geothermal heating is common and easy (and doesn't have to be expensive if you have a spring or even a stream), but def. not power generation. My parents have been running  the first (spring) for over 40 years, and my brother has the stream version (over a decade now). Both DIY.

[aperture]

You can purchase renewable energy from many electric utility providers.  I would have included that as an option.

This is what we use for 50% of our electricity. I put it under "lease wind".

[205guy]

By geothermal, I would've guessed the op meant ground-sourced heat pump. As others have stated, residential geothermal is extremely rare--though this community never ceases to amaze me because some people have it.

Also, for solar PV, there is a 3rd option to owning or leasing: power-purchase. This is another option that solar city and sunrun offer: they install and own and maintain the panels and inverters on your property, you pay for the entire output (they guarantee an annual minimum). You can pay up front, and then it's a lot like owning (the one thing you don't get are the carbon credits), or you can pay monthly, and the it's essentially leasing.

[alsoknownasDean]

I pay a surcharge for green power, does that count? :)

Sent from my LG-D855 using Tapatalk

[Monkey Uncle]

Have heated with wood almost exclusively for the last 12 winters.  All of my wood is sourced from trees that have either fallen on their own or were cut for some other reason (e.g., safety in residential areas, tops from trees harvested for lumber), thus the carbon was destined for the atmosphere anyway.  It's not completely carbon-neutral due to the fuel used for cutting and transportation, and also due to the fact that if the wood had been left to rot, the carbon would have been released slowly over a decade or more and a small portion of the carbon would have been incorporated into the soil.  But it's a lot greener than using electricity generated by burning coal.  Plus it's a good exercise program, and it's saved me probably $2k a year in electricity costs.

[Vic99]

There comes a point, perhaps, when a poll has too many options . . . however, I understand the mild frustration that comes with wanting to vote for something that you did, but cannot because it is not actually an option in the poll.

I didn't include things like passive solar and green surcharge on bill and voluntarily pay for green power with electric company because I wanted to see who actually put the hardware on their roof, etc

Apparently one of the moderators edited my poll so that you could select more than one.  However, I have an option that says two and and another that says three or more of the above.  But that's okay

[cdttmm]

Own solar PV, solar hot water, and wood boiler.

Use to drive a car that was converted to run on WVO.

[Rollin]

Solar hot water, 'cause it is the lowest hanging fruit (lease expensive with best return). Besides, why ship oil from across the oceans (or waste what we pulled up here) just to heat some water?

[Fishindude]

A significant percentage of our heat comes from wood.   I'd like to have solar at some point but the install is real expensive and I just don't see the cost benefit yet.
Not a fan of wind, as the mechanical moving parts could have tendency to wear out or create problems.

[slugline]

Voted for "none apply" but I'm also one of those signed up with a green provider via the grid.

My house sits under the shade of four large oak trees. While they prevent me from ever seriously considering my own photovoltaic panels on the roof, they make their own contributions toward keeping my summer electric bills manageable.

[mlejw6]

We rent and I voted None Apply. We just purchased the "green energy" option from the local electric provider. We chose to have the surcharge applied to 100% of our bill (lower percentages can be chosen).

[BudgetSlasher]

I want to do PV; when I do it it will likely be a DIY or partial DIY operation (allowed around here with interconnect). Before I engage that I am working the house power consumption over (LED bulbs, DC fans, ECM blower motor for the heat, Delta T ECM circulator motors and so on) and waiting for a change in the kitchen (the wife really wants gas to replace the electric stove. Once the major changes have been made I ideally need to wait at least a year to figure out the annual power consumption.

We looked into geothermal for this house and had multiple installers tell us basically that we were on the cusp of it making senses (as it it may or may not be have a good payback). Ultimately we declined to proceed at that time for 3 reasons; 1) The current system in still functioning correct (in other words geothermal wasn't X dollars more than a new system it was the cost of a new system and X) 2) There are several insulation projects of various difficulties that would have better returns are are more DIYable (and would likely decrease the size of the system we would need) and 3) this is the big one the cost of a retrofit geothermal was significant, at one point I made a list of all the energy efficiency projects that could be undertaken and it was every project I plan on undertaking (air sealing outlets and R-60-to-80 in the attic), some that are only considered at thins point (extra basement insulation on walls and floor) plus major ones that I do not plan on attacking (like residing the house and including several extra inches of rigid foam insulation underneath).  AND a bonus 4th, depending on location and climate air source heat pumps continue to improve . . . they could now do all of the shoulder season quite well efficiently and provide heat during all but the coldest days.

[nawhite]

I paid for a company to install solar panels (3.125 KW) on my roof and then started renting the house and moved into an RV that I installed 660W of panels on (https://therecklesschoice.com/2016/04/29/diy-rv-solar/). We also have one of those solar shower bags, that counts as solar hot water right?

In the future, we're planning on building a house with PV solar for electricity running a ground source heat pump with a wood stove as a backup. It's a dream, we'll see if we can make it happen.

That said, BudgetSlasher is absolutely doing it right. Insulation is a WAY better ROI than any of these.

[Cranky]

We have looked at it, but really - it's very expensive and we won't live long enough to see a savings from it.

We've cut our electric and gas use by 40% in the last decade.

[BlueMR2]

It's so expensive with us having such low bills.  We'll see what Solar PV prices are when the roof needs replacement.  Already planning on a standing seam metal roof, would be a good time to do solar if we ever do it...

[CNM]

Other than what could be termed "passive solar" (a huge sun room that heats up our house nicely in the winter), we have no alternative energy installed in our home.  We thought about solar panels, but we just don't use that much electricity to make it worthwhile.  If we ever get an electric car or install air conditioning then it might make financial sense but our utilities are too cheap as it stands now! 

[Tom Bri]

I can't vote because none of the choices match. I burn a lot of wood in a fireplace, but that isn't an option above. Also, I use solar energy to heat cooking water. My little solar box heats water to almost, but not quite boiling, and minute on the stove completes the process. We dry clothing with sunshine.
The fireplace cuts about 1/3 off the winter gas bill. No idea how much the solar box saves, but we use it daily spring through fall. I am interested in increasing my solar use, but don't want to dive into another of what looks like a complex hobby.

[NaturallyHappier]

18 KW (approximately 23 MW per year) Solar PV with geothermal heat/air conditioning.

[MoneyCat]

We get 100% of our electricity from PV on our roof. Unfortunately, the house was already set up for natural gas heat and it would be too expensive to change that to something renewable.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

[Vic99]

The fireplace cuts about 1/3 off the winter gas bill.

Tom, do you have glass doors with a fairly tight seal around the fireplace?  If the fireplace is an open burn, I'm curious how it can lower your gas bill . . . perhaps you have a really tight newer house with seams taped and spray foam insulation?

[Syonyk]

We get 100% of our electricity from PV on our roof. Unfortunately, the house was already set up for natural gas heat and it would be too expensive to change that to something renewable.

Do you have air conditioning?

When you need to replace your air conditioner for whatever reason, put a heat pump in instead.  That gets you air conditioning, and it also gets you electric heat-transfer heating for most of the year.  They usually switch to a backup set of coils around 20-30F (depending on the unit).  Keep your furnace, and put in a dual-fuel aware thermostat (the Nest can do this).  Configure it so that it will use the heat pump as long as possible, and instead of using the electric backup coils that come with the heat pump (which are just bigass resistors), kick the furnace on for heat when the temperature is too low for the heat pump.

You'll replace basically all of your natural gas use in spring and fall with electric use, and will still be able to keep the house warm in the dead of winter wherever you are.

Depending on where you live, you may have to call a bunch of HVAC shops to find one willing to do this, though.  Heat pumps aren't a thing in parts of the country that get properly cold, and dual fuel systems are weird enough that I expect a lot of shops won't touch them.

===========

At some point, I plan to put panels on my house roof - I live in a great sunny area, but there's no way I can get paid for excess power.  Just a bill credit.  So going overkill is of no advantage until I get something to soak the excess power.  Since I'm planning on buying a beater Leaf at some point for local potting around, that should work fine with a somewhat oversized system.

[Tom Bri]

The fireplace cuts about 1/3 off the winter gas bill.

Tom, do you have glass doors with a fairly tight seal around the fireplace?  If the fireplace is an open burn, I'm curious how it can lower your gas bill . . . perhaps you have a really tight newer house with seams taped and spray foam insulation?

I'll be honest with you, I don't know why it seems to work. It is a rather crappy, cheap fireplace installed with the house in 1980. House is very well insulated, but the fireplace is nothing special. It does have glass doors and a blower. The main thing, I believe, is that it is situated in the room we use the most, which is also the coldest room in the house. So we keep the whole house temp down in the low 60s, and use the fireplace to warm the family room, which it does very well. It is basically a high-maintenance space heater.
My guestimate of 1/3 cost reduction comes from looking at our bills the first 5 years we were in the house, and comparing them to more recent years after we started using the fireplace almost daily December through February. Comparing December to December for all years, for example, shows an immediate and sharp drop in $ spent. I did not attempt to go back and see if there was a change in gas costs that might otherwise account for this change.

[Monkey Uncle]

The fireplace cuts about 1/3 off the winter gas bill.

Tom, do you have glass doors with a fairly tight seal around the fireplace?  If the fireplace is an open burn, I'm curious how it can lower your gas bill . . . perhaps you have a really tight newer house with seams taped and spray foam insulation?

I'll be honest with you, I don't know why it seems to work. It is a rather crappy, cheap fireplace installed with the house in 1980. House is very well insulated, but the fireplace is nothing special. It does have glass doors and a blower. The main thing, I believe, is that it is situated in the room we use the most, which is also the coldest room in the house. So we keep the whole house temp down in the low 60s, and use the fireplace to warm the family room, which it does very well. It is basically a high-maintenance space heater.
My guestimate of 1/3 cost reduction comes from looking at our bills the first 5 years we were in the house, and comparing them to more recent years after we started using the fireplace almost daily December through February. Comparing December to December for all years, for example, shows an immediate and sharp drop in $ spent. I did not attempt to go back and see if there was a change in gas costs that might otherwise account for this change.

The price of natural gas has dropped sharply since its peak in the mid-2000s, just before the fracking boom took off.  It is hovering near multi-year lows right now, about 1/3 of what it was 10 years ago.

http://www.tradingeconomics.com/commodity/natural-gas

Click the "historical" tab and set the x-axis to "max."

[Cranky]

My cost/unit for natural gas is almost 50% lower than it was 10 years ago. At the same time, our usage has fallen by 40% - partly, I think, because we've had two kids move out, but also because we've replaced the windows and the roof. Our natural gas bill is less than $40/month, which is one reason why switching to any other power source is just not cost effective for us.

[socalteacher]

Buying our own solar system (3.59 system) was a great investment in our comfort. All said and done, after federal rebate and two referral kickbacks from the company that installed our system, the cost was right at $7,600. Prior to solar we never used the AC but now we keep the house at a nice 73 degrees (has been in the 90-100s outside all week). Even with all this usage we are still positive by about 700Kwh with the energy company.

[Bateaux]

We use our woodstove for most of our heating.   Mainly because we hate the dryness of the central heat.  If we were to stay in this home I'd invest in solar.  Not sure where we will live in FIRE.  If it's a boat or RV definitely will have solar.  Our eventual land based home will have solar and really good insulation.  If we pick the right climate and home design then there will be little need for heat or cooling. 

[Vic99]

It would appear that 30% of us use renewable energy as part of our home infrastructure in some form.  Some other percent pay the surcharge to support renewable.  And a significant number want to invest in it in the future.

[big_slacker]

A big chunk of our grid power is hydro, that's not an option in the poll. :)

[screwit]

We're on 100% renewable energy through our provider. As far as I can tell that wasn't an option on the poll?

[SimplyMarvie]

We currently live in work provided housing where alternate energy systems aren't an option (unless you count our emergency generator?) but it's absolutely something we're planning for as we build our own place looking toward retirement.