Author Topic: Robots and their impact on the future  (Read 237414 times)

jordanread

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Re: Robots and their impact on the future
« Reply #500 on: December 03, 2015, 04:07:11 PM »
Wow - this has got to be one of the most interesting discussions I have read in a long time.

I'm glad you feel that way!! It's close to my heart, and this thread has been the best thing on these forums in regard to this subject.

1) There seems to be an assumption that if a person/computer is smart enough everything can be figured out absent real world experimentation Einstein style. This seems like a pretty big jump to make. In trying to move up the exponential curve of intelligence/knowledge wouldn't there still be a need for real world experimentation? Giving all human knowledge at the moment, I'm sure a super-smart being could figure out some things we don't yet know, but everything? Everything needed to alter atoms and nanobots? I'm sure there could be several conflicting theories of reality that could explain everything we "know" that could only be teased out through experimentation. Experimentation that I have a hard time seeing happening on an exponentially faster time table. Like the search for the Higgs Boson, isn't it possible that as you get into quantum mechanics some of these experiments would require space and time that can't just scale exponentially?

You are correct overall (IMHO), in that not everything can be figured out without experimentation. I think that what we are discussing is not necessarily an AI figuring everything out, just figuring enough out to make humans potentially obsolete (or awesome). Quantum mechanics and the like can (and will) be figured out, but it doesn't have to happen first. And while I can see how it can be done without real world experimentation, I know that we (being humans) don't know enough to code those simulations. Granted, quantum mechanics is some very high hanging fruit from my perspective.

2) Once the AI does start editing itself, selecting whether an improvement is better or not seems like a fundamentally trickier problem than it is being discussed. As someone said previously, if you gave a human the ability to edit their own neurons, what's most likely is that you would end up with a dead human. It seems possible that a being with "n" intelligence couldn't know what change would be required for n+1 intelligence. So they would be stuck experimenting and most of those experiments seem likely to end up with a dead/endlessly recursive program. Given that the more complex a being gets, the more likely a change is to be detrimental, the harder and longer it will be to stumble upon a change that is "better". This implies to me that at a certain point the intelligence curve will flatten rather than get steeper.

Ah, but remember that computers run a whole hell of a lot faster than we do. And they have backups. It's only tricky if you have one life to play with, and that is not the case. Yes, it would suck, and we'd most likely kill ourselves if we had the option, but think about how quickly even us piddly humans can update software. I read somewhere, and it's been 'confirmed' with some interviews I've done with them, but Amazon releases new software every 8 seconds. And that's with humans at the helm. N intelligence doesn't know what N+1 is, but there is no limit to the times it can try to figure it out. Also, I'd say that N+1 is all about how effectively the goals are met. What those goals are is what all of the current AI ethics boards focus on. That is just because we can't fathom something besides some type of 'black-box' goal oriented programming.

3) Even if the change is "better", better seems very hard to interpret/select for. From what I've been reading, human forgetfulness isn't so much a bug of our brains but rather a feature. Part of how we isolate the signal from the noise. Would a computer need to get more "forgetful" in order to get better at figuring out the nature of the world? So many of these problems seem like the NP vs P concept in computer programming. Even if the computers get faster, if the problem is NP type, does it really matter? Getting back to the experimentation question from 1 - if the AI did an experiment, could the computer know when to say "this seems likely" and forget the uncertainty and move on, or would it get stuck exhaustively running experiments to prove that something is "true"? So if the program evolves to be more forgetful but more intuitive, is this better? I could imagine several "intelligence" trade-offs you'd need to make between rigorous knowledge and making a guess with the right balance difficult to determine until well down the line... Is intelligence really linear where there is a clear "better" in all situations for all types of problems that can easily be selected for?

Holy crap, I love your thinking. However, again, there is the limitation that me and you (most likely) are human. I honestly think that those issues (and good job citing examples) strike us as (so far) impossible to solve. But how human is that? As much as love creating these potential monsters (monster is a relative term), I have to very much keep in mind how my thinking does not necessitate how my creation would think.

Thoughts?

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Landlord2015

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Re: Robots and their impact on the future
« Reply #501 on: December 03, 2015, 04:18:47 PM »
???

All davisgang90 wrote was a list of books to read. Not sure what you're responding to.

Just spent 15 minutes (that I will never get back) reading through the previous posts that person made. I hope that it's just lost in translation, since it appears that Landlord2015 isn't a native english speaker. Also, possibly too lazy to actually read the thread before posting. You are way too nice (and I mean that in the nicest way possible).
True my mother tongue is not English. Please accept my apology thread readers I was to lazy to read and I have fairly good English language skills.

Way to nice? Jordanread I am not so interested in what you write either and perhaps you should stick to reading and not writing:)
Well not a very good comment from you, but whatever moving on.

Good sure please read good Science Fiction books and enjoy the Christmas holiday when it come. Since I play Magic The Gathering I was thinking that I wish my sister buys me as Christmas present some kind of fantasy novel. I usually don't read much nowadays if talking about SCIFI I watch movies and TV series.

Yes please good forum readers do enjoy good litterature, TV series and movies.
I do like some SCIFI TV series fantasy, scifi, horror and action. I also like realistic TV series like 24 for example.


« Last Edit: December 03, 2015, 04:54:15 PM by Landlord2015 »

jcard

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Re: Robots and their impact on the future
« Reply #502 on: December 03, 2015, 04:33:27 PM »
This is fun, thanks for the reply :)  Apologies if I mess up the quotes, despite being a (barely) millennial, I've never forummed.

I wanted to push back on a couple of these concepts:

1) There seems to be an assumption that if a person/computer is smart enough everything can be figured out absent real world experimentation Einstein style. This seems like a pretty big jump to make. In trying to move up the exponential curve of intelligence/knowledge wouldn't there still be a need for real world experimentation? Giving all human knowledge at the moment, I'm sure a super-smart being could figure out some things we don't yet know, but everything? Everything needed to alter atoms and nanobots? I'm sure there could be several conflicting theories of reality that could explain everything we "know" that could only be teased out through experimentation. Experimentation that I have a hard time seeing happening on an exponentially faster time table. Like the search for the Higgs Boson, isn't it possible that as you get into quantum mechanics some of these experiments would require space and time that can't just scale exponentially?

You are correct overall (IMHO), in that not everything can be figured out without experimentation. I think that what we are discussing is not necessarily an AI figuring everything out, just figuring enough out to make humans potentially obsolete (or awesome). Quantum mechanics and the like can (and will) be figured out, but it doesn't have to happen first. And while I can see how it can be done without real world experimentation, I know that we (being humans) don't know enough to code those simulations. Granted, quantum mechanics is some very high hanging fruit from my perspective.

Hmm, I'll give you an AI being able to figure everything out to make humans potentially obsolete with current data. I think I was pushing back at the notion that as soon as I an AI got to the internet it would be able to figure out new power sources, communication, nano-engineering such that shutting it off would be impossible. These all seem to be pushing the boundaries of what is known and would be hard to advance without the ability to experiment or access rare minerals etc...


jcard

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Re: Robots and their impact on the future
« Reply #503 on: December 03, 2015, 04:49:36 PM »
2) Once the AI does start editing itself, selecting whether an improvement is better or not seems like a fundamentally trickier problem than it is being discussed. As someone said previously, if you gave a human the ability to edit their own neurons, what's most likely is that you would end up with a dead human. It seems possible that a being with "n" intelligence couldn't know what change would be required for n+1 intelligence. So they would be stuck experimenting and most of those experiments seem likely to end up with a dead/endlessly recursive program. Given that the more complex a being gets, the more likely a change is to be detrimental, the harder and longer it will be to stumble upon a change that is "better". This implies to me that at a certain point the intelligence curve will flatten rather than get steeper.

Ah, but remember that computers run a whole hell of a lot faster than we do. And they have backups. It's only tricky if you have one life to play with, and that is not the case. Yes, it would suck, and we'd most likely kill ourselves if we had the option, but think about how quickly even us piddly humans can update software. I read somewhere, and it's been 'confirmed' with some interviews I've done with them, but Amazon releases new software every 8 seconds. And that's with humans at the helm. N intelligence doesn't know what N+1 is, but there is no limit to the times it can try to figure it out. Also, I'd say that N+1 is all about how effectively the goals are met. What those goals are is what all of the current AI ethics boards focus on. That is just because we can't fathom something besides some type of 'black-box' goal oriented programming.

I'm not sure if I agree that there is no limit to the times an AI can try to figure out an improvement? Being able to iterate seems to me to require three steps:

1) Make a copy with the change
2) Run the copy
3) Evaluate the results as better or not

1 - Running a copy in parallel would require twice the computing power. At the point where we have just hit this threshold, will we have the computing power to try thousand, millions, billions of variations? Say we've done that. Computing power is cheap and easy.

2- How long would you need to run the copy for? See how fast it can calculate? Let it try out a couple of experiments and see if has interesting results? I'm not sure, but it seems like it would be required to be run long enough to at least interact with the physical world? Especially once you are getting into more human notions of intuition and problem solving. It could run simulations of the physical world, but that is an NP type of problem, at any type of scale you'd rapidly run out of computing power no matter how much you had.

3 - Evaluate the results - for a simple goal set by an ethics committee sure. But how do you evaluate an increased ability to solve real world problems and develop new technologies on the exponentially increasing time scale being discussed?


The notion seems to be that as soon as we hit that threshold, recursive improvement will mean massive improvement in minutes. It seems to me that the computing power to run parallel copies of super AI to test and evaluate incremental improvements wouldn't be hit until well after we have the first AI...

Landlord2015

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Re: Robots and their impact on the future
« Reply #504 on: December 03, 2015, 05:06:42 PM »
Nice post jcard. I will leave you nerds(this meant as a compliment like a good programmer) to figure out best way to implement AI for robots.

Besides programming there is if talking about computer technology always http://www.tomshardware.com/ and http://www.anandtech.com/

I will withdraw myself from AI debate, but my biggest issue is that I would wish that in future there would be massproduction of human looking robots and this without huge costs. I am not talking about near future, but perhaps some day in far future.

jcard

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Re: Robots and their impact on the future
« Reply #505 on: December 03, 2015, 05:07:19 PM »
3) Even if the change is "better", better seems very hard to interpret/select for. From what I've been reading, human forgetfulness isn't so much a bug of our brains but rather a feature. Part of how we isolate the signal from the noise. Would a computer need to get more "forgetful" in order to get better at figuring out the nature of the world? So many of these problems seem like the NP vs P concept in computer programming. Even if the computers get faster, if the problem is NP type, does it really matter? Getting back to the experimentation question from 1 - if the AI did an experiment, could the computer know when to say "this seems likely" and forget the uncertainty and move on, or would it get stuck exhaustively running experiments to prove that something is "true"? So if the program evolves to be more forgetful but more intuitive, is this better? I could imagine several "intelligence" trade-offs you'd need to make between rigorous knowledge and making a guess with the right balance difficult to determine until well down the line... Is intelligence really linear where there is a clear "better" in all situations for all types of problems that can easily be selected for?

Holy crap, I love your thinking. However, again, there is the limitation that me and you (most likely) are human. I honestly think that those issues (and good job citing examples) strike us as (so far) impossible to solve. But how human is that? As much as love creating these potential monsters (monster is a relative term), I have to very much keep in mind how my thinking does not necessitate how my creation would think.

I've been thinking a bit about this, and I almost wonder if you need the limitations of a human in order to solve problems like a human? So much of research involves making assumptions or guesses about information with conflicting levels of uncertainty or doubt. A human can work through a problem, follow their intuition, make a leap of faith, etc - these all describe to a certain extent dealing with uncertainty and making not necessarily justified assumptions. Humans have so many natural biases and short cuts to deal with uncertainty, which allows us to make mistakes but also to learn. Could a computer learn and problem solve like a human without making mistakes like a human? If a computer developed a theory that was wrong, what would be the process for correcting that theory?

Sure it might be a limit of my human brain that I can't imagine a way to gain knowledge about the physical world without making mistakes. But it also seems possible that making mistakes, bad assumptions and having a process for evaluating and correcting those is fundamental to advancing knowledge. That's why we invented the scientific method, and it seems possible that an AI would have the same limitations in advancing knowledge in the face of uncertainty as we do. Maybe it'd be faster, but continually, exponentially faster? That seems like a big jump...

AlanStache

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Re: Robots and their impact on the future
« Reply #506 on: December 03, 2015, 05:13:07 PM »
This is fun, thanks for the reply :)  Apologies if I mess up the quotes, despite being a (barely) millennial, I've never forummed.

I wanted to push back on a couple of these concepts:

1) There seems to be an assumption that if a person/computer is smart enough everything can be figured out absent real world experimentation Einstein style. This seems like a pretty big jump to make. In trying to move up the exponential curve of intelligence/knowledge wouldn't there still be a need for real world experimentation? Giving all human knowledge at the moment, I'm sure a super-smart being could figure out some things we don't yet know, but everything? Everything needed to alter atoms and nanobots? I'm sure there could be several conflicting theories of reality that could explain everything we "know" that could only be teased out through experimentation. Experimentation that I have a hard time seeing happening on an exponentially faster time table. Like the search for the Higgs Boson, isn't it possible that as you get into quantum mechanics some of these experiments would require space and time that can't just scale exponentially?

You are correct overall (IMHO), in that not everything can be figured out without experimentation. I think that what we are discussing is not necessarily an AI figuring everything out, just figuring enough out to make humans potentially obsolete (or awesome). Quantum mechanics and the like can (and will) be figured out, but it doesn't have to happen first. And while I can see how it can be done without real world experimentation, I know that we (being humans) don't know enough to code those simulations. Granted, quantum mechanics is some very high hanging fruit from my perspective.

Hmm, I'll give you an AI being able to figure everything out to make humans potentially obsolete with current data. I think I was pushing back at the notion that as soon as I an AI got to the internet it would be able to figure out new power sources, communication, nano-engineering such that shutting it off would be impossible. These all seem to be pushing the boundaries of what is known and would be hard to advance without the ability to experiment or access rare minerals etc...

welcome!

Yes going from purely digital to physical manipulation may be hard (obligatory: http://what-if.xkcd.com/5/).  In theory production machinery and computer controlled physical infrastructure should be air gapped (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Air_gap_(networking)) for boring old computer security reasons but this is very often not the case.  I suspect that http://www.rethinkrobotics.com/baxter/ will not be air gaped for remote updates - but I really have no idea about them specifically.

hope to read/post more when I get home.
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Landlord2015

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Re: Robots and their impact on the future
« Reply #507 on: December 04, 2015, 04:10:43 PM »
Yes going from purely digital to physical manipulation may be hard (obligatory: http://what-if.xkcd.com/5/).  In theory production machinery and computer controlled physical infrastructure should be air gapped (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Air_gap_(networking)) for boring old computer security reasons but this is very often not the case.  I suspect that http://www.rethinkrobotics.com/baxter/ will not be air gaped for remote updates - but I really have no idea about them specifically.

hope to read/post more when I get home.
That Baxter has like a dog simple adaptle learning ability somewhat seems impressive.

The Baxter is designed cute and perhaps more for the industry environment.

Well about airgap security...
Computer security i.e hackers and malvare(example virus) etc that is one threat if talking about military use of robots not to say how critical targets nuclear power plants can be.

My moral is harsh the so called "sex robots" today can not compete with beautiful looking prostitutes though you have less risk of disease. That said there is preventive precausitons like condome and people in westernized countries do not die from HIV nowadays usually due to very effective medicine.
« Last Edit: December 04, 2015, 04:18:18 PM by Landlord2015 »

Bakari

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Re: Robots and their impact on the future
« Reply #508 on: December 12, 2015, 03:47:00 PM »
Wow - this has got to be one of the most interesting discussions I have read in a long time.

Reading through it all, I feel like there are couple of basic things that are being missed and I am curious what everyone thinks of them:

1) There seems to be an assumption that if a person/computer is smart enough everything can be figured out absent real world experimentation Einstein style. This seems like a pretty big jump to make. In trying to move up the exponential curve of intelligence/knowledge wouldn't there still be a need for real world experimentation? Giving all human knowledge at the moment, I'm sure a super-smart being could figure out some things we don't yet know, but everything? Everything needed to alter atoms and nanobots? I'm sure there could be several conflicting theories of reality that could explain everything we "know" that could only be teased out through experimentation. Experimentation that I have a hard time seeing happening on an exponentially faster time table. Like the search for the Higgs Boson, isn't it possible that as you get into quantum mechanics some of these experiments would require space and time that can't just scale exponentially?

2) Once the AI does start editing itself, selecting whether an improvement is better or not seems like a fundamentally trickier problem than it is being discussed. As someone said previously, if you gave a human the ability to edit their own neurons, what's most likely is that you would end up with a dead human. It seems possible that a being with "n" intelligence couldn't know what change would be required for n+1 intelligence. So they would be stuck experimenting and most of those experiments seem likely to end up with a dead/endlessly recursive program. Given that the more complex a being gets, the more likely a change is to be detrimental, the harder and longer it will be to stumble upon a change that is "better". This implies to me that at a certain point the intelligence curve will flatten rather than get steeper.

3) Even if the change is "better", better seems very hard to interpret/select for. From what I've been reading, human forgetfulness isn't so much a bug of our brains but rather a feature. Part of how we isolate the signal from the noise. Would a computer need to get more "forgetful" in order to get better at figuring out the nature of the world? So many of these problems seem like the NP vs P concept in computer programming. Even if the computers get faster, if the problem is NP type, does it really matter? Getting back to the experimentation question from 1 - if the AI did an experiment, could the computer know when to say "this seems likely" and forget the uncertainty and move on, or would it get stuck exhaustively running experiments to prove that something is "true"? So if the program evolves to be more forgetful but more intuitive, is this better? I could imagine several "intelligence" trade-offs you'd need to make between rigorous knowledge and making a guess with the right balance difficult to determine until well down the line... Is intelligence really linear where there is a clear "better" in all situations for all types of problems that can easily be selected for?

Thoughts?


While every single one of your points in potentially (and probably) valid, computers don't need to be dramatically "smarter" than people to displace labor as we know it.  They only have to be good enough to do their particular job.  We are already basically at the point where robot drivers are better than human drivers, even if a Google Car can't also play the piano or file your taxes.  Even if the robot isn't better at a job, if it is even as good - or even close to as good - but only demands a "salary" of a few dollars of electricity each day, the robot gets the job.

Computers may never be able to solve science questions that we haven't solved yet without experimentation, but few jobs have ever depended on the verification or falsification of quark theory
Anything I've said here useful or interesting?  Find a lot more of my thoughts here: http://randomthoughts.fyi

Landlord2015

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Re: Robots and their impact on the future
« Reply #509 on: December 13, 2015, 12:31:09 PM »
Wow - this has got to be one of the most interesting discussions I have read in a long time.

Reading through it all, I feel like there are couple of basic things that are being missed and I am curious what everyone thinks of them:

1) There seems to be an assumption that if a person/computer is smart enough everything can be figured out absent real world experimentation Einstein style. This seems like a pretty big jump to make. In trying to move up the exponential curve of intelligence/knowledge wouldn't there still be a need for real world experimentation? Giving all human knowledge at the moment, I'm sure a super-smart being could figure out some things we don't yet know, but everything? Everything needed to alter atoms and nanobots? I'm sure there could be several conflicting theories of reality that could explain everything we "know" that could only be teased out through experimentation. Experimentation that I have a hard time seeing happening on an exponentially faster time table. Like the search for the Higgs Boson, isn't it possible that as you get into quantum mechanics some of these experiments would require space and time that can't just scale exponentially?

2) Once the AI does start editing itself, selecting whether an improvement is better or not seems like a fundamentally trickier problem than it is being discussed. As someone said previously, if you gave a human the ability to edit their own neurons, what's most likely is that you would end up with a dead human. It seems possible that a being with "n" intelligence couldn't know what change would be required for n+1 intelligence. So they would be stuck experimenting and most of those experiments seem likely to end up with a dead/endlessly recursive program. Given that the more complex a being gets, the more likely a change is to be detrimental, the harder and longer it will be to stumble upon a change that is "better". This implies to me that at a certain point the intelligence curve will flatten rather than get steeper.

3) Even if the change is "better", better seems very hard to interpret/select for. From what I've been reading, human forgetfulness isn't so much a bug of our brains but rather a feature. Part of how we isolate the signal from the noise. Would a computer need to get more "forgetful" in order to get better at figuring out the nature of the world? So many of these problems seem like the NP vs P concept in computer programming. Even if the computers get faster, if the problem is NP type, does it really matter? Getting back to the experimentation question from 1 - if the AI did an experiment, could the computer know when to say "this seems likely" and forget the uncertainty and move on, or would it get stuck exhaustively running experiments to prove that something is "true"? So if the program evolves to be more forgetful but more intuitive, is this better? I could imagine several "intelligence" trade-offs you'd need to make between rigorous knowledge and making a guess with the right balance difficult to determine until well down the line... Is intelligence really linear where there is a clear "better" in all situations for all types of problems that can easily be selected for?

Thoughts?


While every single one of your points in potentially (and probably) valid, computers don't need to be dramatically "smarter" than people to displace labor as we know it.  They only have to be good enough to do their particular job.  We are already basically at the point where robot drivers are better than human drivers, even if a Google Car can't also play the piano or file your taxes.  Even if the robot isn't better at a job, if it is even as good - or even close to as good - but only demands a "salary" of a few dollars of electricity each day, the robot gets the job.

Computers may never be able to solve science questions that we haven't solved yet without experimentation, but few jobs have ever depended on the verification or falsification of quark theory
True robots do not need to be so smart as humans for many tasks.  Sex robots though they don't need to came same smartness. I have never used such things but from youtube videos that I have seen the so called sex dolls or robots are a huge disapointment. The argument they are more safe sex is also mostly made by salesmen of those products or uneducated people who do not know that there exist very effective medicine vs HIV. Of course protection i.e condome is good to use also to avoid other diseases and to by mistake make children but HIV is not a death sentence nowadays unless you never take medicine.

jordanread

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Re: Robots and their impact on the future
« Reply #510 on: December 13, 2015, 05:11:47 PM »
Wow - this has got to be one of the most interesting discussions I have read in a long time.

Reading through it all, I feel like there are couple of basic things that are being missed and I am curious what everyone thinks of them:

1) There seems to be an assumption that if a person/computer is smart enough everything can be figured out absent real world experimentation Einstein style. This seems like a pretty big jump to make. In trying to move up the exponential curve of intelligence/knowledge wouldn't there still be a need for real world experimentation? Giving all human knowledge at the moment, I'm sure a super-smart being could figure out some things we don't yet know, but everything? Everything needed to alter atoms and nanobots? I'm sure there could be several conflicting theories of reality that could explain everything we "know" that could only be teased out through experimentation. Experimentation that I have a hard time seeing happening on an exponentially faster time table. Like the search for the Higgs Boson, isn't it possible that as you get into quantum mechanics some of these experiments would require space and time that can't just scale exponentially?

2) Once the AI does start editing itself, selecting whether an improvement is better or not seems like a fundamentally trickier problem than it is being discussed. As someone said previously, if you gave a human the ability to edit their own neurons, what's most likely is that you would end up with a dead human. It seems possible that a being with "n" intelligence couldn't know what change would be required for n+1 intelligence. So they would be stuck experimenting and most of those experiments seem likely to end up with a dead/endlessly recursive program. Given that the more complex a being gets, the more likely a change is to be detrimental, the harder and longer it will be to stumble upon a change that is "better". This implies to me that at a certain point the intelligence curve will flatten rather than get steeper.

3) Even if the change is "better", better seems very hard to interpret/select for. From what I've been reading, human forgetfulness isn't so much a bug of our brains but rather a feature. Part of how we isolate the signal from the noise. Would a computer need to get more "forgetful" in order to get better at figuring out the nature of the world? So many of these problems seem like the NP vs P concept in computer programming. Even if the computers get faster, if the problem is NP type, does it really matter? Getting back to the experimentation question from 1 - if the AI did an experiment, could the computer know when to say "this seems likely" and forget the uncertainty and move on, or would it get stuck exhaustively running experiments to prove that something is "true"? So if the program evolves to be more forgetful but more intuitive, is this better? I could imagine several "intelligence" trade-offs you'd need to make between rigorous knowledge and making a guess with the right balance difficult to determine until well down the line... Is intelligence really linear where there is a clear "better" in all situations for all types of problems that can easily be selected for?

Thoughts?


While every single one of your points in potentially (and probably) valid, computers don't need to be dramatically "smarter" than people to displace labor as we know it.  They only have to be good enough to do their particular job.  We are already basically at the point where robot drivers are better than human drivers, even if a Google Car can't also play the piano or file your taxes.  Even if the robot isn't better at a job, if it is even as good - or even close to as good - but only demands a "salary" of a few dollars of electricity each day, the robot gets the job.

Computers may never be able to solve science questions that we haven't solved yet without experimentation, but few jobs have ever depended on the verification or falsification of quark theory

Thats a good point, especially as it relates to the impact on jobs, if not the more mercurial singularity place that I go. Thanks for jumping back in and grounding me a bit. Going a bit further on this, looking at current deep learning trends (like the 'black box' type of just showing results, and the system somehow figuring things out better than we can - See the 2012 Google Science Fair Winner for a 3 year old example of the actual tech) even if a position is replaced by a robot or computer that does exactly as well as a human, I wouldn't foresee it staying that way for very long. I don't want to say creative, but the kind of jobs that we can't make an algorithm for currently (I'll think of more actual examples later), kind of like a surgeon, would be most affected by this.

Doubling down on the idea of a doctor, I could completely envision a scenario like this (and most of the numbers are made up - I don't have time right now to really look them all up):

From a Hospital (v1.0):
Finally, there is a robot in a hospital near you that can match a trauma surgeon in success rates. As our decorated current doctor is good enough to have a 70% full recovery rate, so can our new bot. Be part of the future.

From the military (v1.0):
Corpsman are in short supply, and we can now get an Automated Trauma Surgeon delivered to the actual site of an IED explosion. ATS (or bATSman as the troops are beginning to call it) will reduce the permanent damage to our troops. Right now, we are able to match a major cities full 70% success rate, but here in the butthole of whatever oil-laden area we are currently liberating.

Within a few weeks or months, the military bot will have had a lot of experience handling trauma. In the hospital, I imagine the majority of people still would want a person. With an upgrade process based only on the metrics the bot takes on hand, there will be the possibility of the military deep learning bit to progress to v1.5 with a success rate of, say 75%. Then that software is uploaded from the military to the hospital bots. The new announcement would read:
Finally, there is a robot in a hospital near you that can exceed the success rate of our highly decorated trauma surgeon. Do you want to have a 3/4 chance of full recover, or would you rather get the human touch and limit yourself to 7/10?

Yeah, it's not as polished as it would be, but I think it would happen similarly to that.

Yes going from purely digital to physical manipulation may be hard (obligatory: http://what-if.xkcd.com/5/).  In theory production machinery and computer controlled physical infrastructure should be air gapped (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Air_gap_(networking)) for boring old computer security reasons but this is very often not the case.  I suspect that http://www.rethinkrobotics.com/baxter/ will not be air gaped for remote updates - but I really have no idea about them specifically.

hope to read/post more when I get home.

I loved that What If. Made me giggle. As far as air gapping goes, I view it as something that the AI Ethics board would want to bring up or put in place, but to do that, one would lose a lot of advantage in creating one (or more). The science fair project I mentioned above couldn't be air gapped and succeed.
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Re: Robots and their impact on the future
« Reply #511 on: December 23, 2015, 06:26:22 AM »
Happy Holidays and all that jazz.

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Re: Robots and their impact on the future
« Reply #512 on: December 29, 2015, 02:30:29 PM »
Interesting article and video.  McKinsey's 2016 list of jobs that are endangered.  "McKinsey & Co. estimated recently that 45% of all activities humans perform in the workplace can be done by software or machines that already exist."

There categories that 85% to 100% of the jobs could be automated are somewhat eye opening. 

 
http://finance.yahoo.com/news/the-most-endangered-jobs-of-2016-174152102.html#

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Re: Robots and their impact on the future
« Reply #513 on: December 29, 2015, 10:00:49 PM »
Regarding all the AI talk.

Google search neural networks (ANN) or genetic algorithms + neural networks (GANN) or deep learning.
There should be lots of articles on 'google deepdream' that give a high level overview.
It is amazing how fast things are moving - most of this discussion is already happening!

The robots (aka software) are coming - there is nothing we can do now!
« Last Edit: December 30, 2015, 06:18:57 AM by bryan995 »

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Re: Robots and their impact on the future
« Reply #514 on: December 30, 2015, 05:05:19 PM »
Check out my blog.  Early retirement from a military perspective.

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Re: Robots and their impact on the future
« Reply #516 on: January 01, 2016, 04:25:45 PM »
Secretary Of Labor Assures Nation There Still Plenty Of Jobs For Americans Willing To Outwork Robots

http://www.theonion.com/article/secretary-labor-assures-nation-there-still-plenty--51263?utm_source=Facebook&utm_medium=SocialMarketing&utm_campaign=LinkPreview:NA:InFocus

Good News!
Excellent and same applies to Europe where I live.

Some of the posts here I call optimistic SCIFI. No offense meant to anyone with that comment and todays SCIFI can be true in future.

Speaking of SCIFI I liked very much the newest Star Wars movie. I did not like the main male actor, but the main female actor or her character became my favorite! She got all my sympathy.

There exists a cute robot in the newest Stawars 7 movie.
« Last Edit: January 01, 2016, 04:45:06 PM by Landlord2015 »

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Re: Robots and their impact on the future
« Reply #517 on: January 03, 2016, 06:11:25 PM »
Thank you davisgang90 for the excellent, sarcastic article.

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Re: Robots and their impact on the future
« Reply #518 on: January 04, 2016, 01:58:31 PM »
Lazy me first now I read it truly. It was sarcastic. What a douchebag I think though funny article. Making fun of people loosing jobs due to robots is bad taste.

Oh and this thread is really a SCIFI thread more or less:)

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Re: Robots and their impact on the future
« Reply #519 on: January 04, 2016, 04:27:07 PM »
Oh and this thread is really a SCIFI thread more or less:)

I'd ask if you understand that the FI in SCIFI is for fiction, and that is completely missing the point of this thread, but it seems like you don't. We're talking about non-fiction here. Every time you make a comment it seems that you turn it into some type of comparison with prostitutes or sex robots. I'd love for your input on the actual things that we are discussing, but I'm not holding my breath. I truly hope you choose to actually read through the thread, research the technology that currently exists, and compose your well thought out response.
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Re: Robots and their impact on the future
« Reply #520 on: January 05, 2016, 07:18:26 AM »
When people talk about trying to limit a true AGI (Advanced General Intelligence - about same capability a human brain) and ASI (Advanced Super Intelligence = everything above AGI) I'm reminded of the example of a human waking up in a prison built and run by mice.  The mice are convinced they've done everything necessary to ensure you won't be able to escape. 

Once a true ASI exists and is able to improve it's cognitive abilities in real time, the opportunity to control it or air-gap it or otherwise have influence over it has long passed.   
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Re: Robots and their impact on the future
« Reply #521 on: January 05, 2016, 07:26:18 AM »
When people talk about trying to limit a true AGI (Advanced General Intelligence - about same capability a human brain) and ASI (Advanced Super Intelligence = everything above AGI) I'm reminded of the example of a human waking up in a prison built and run by mice.  The mice are convinced they've done everything necessary to ensure you won't be able to escape. 

Once a true ASI exists and is able to improve it's cognitive abilities in real time, the opportunity to control it or air-gap it or otherwise have influence over it has long passed.

That's a pretty fun anecdote, and relatively accurate. I think that's why a good chunk of the ideas regarding ethics boards and the like involve trying to get checks it in place even before AGI manifests. Once it manifests, I'm pretty certain it's too late to get anything else in place. Horses and barns and the like.
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Re: Robots and their impact on the future
« Reply #522 on: January 05, 2016, 07:30:12 AM »
When people talk about trying to limit a true AGI (Advanced General Intelligence - about same capability a human brain) and ASI (Advanced Super Intelligence = everything above AGI) I'm reminded of the example of a human waking up in a prison built and run by mice.  The mice are convinced they've done everything necessary to ensure you won't be able to escape. 

Once a true ASI exists and is able to improve it's cognitive abilities in real time, the opportunity to control it or air-gap it or otherwise have influence over it has long passed.

That's a pretty fun anecdote, and relatively accurate. I think that's why a good chunk of the ideas regarding ethics boards and the like involve trying to get checks it in place even before AGI manifests. Once it manifests, I'm pretty certain it's too late to get anything else in place. Horses and barns and the like.

I think it's more like their checks will be similar to putting tissue paper over the barrel of a gun. Not that I'm pessimistic about AI; I think it's a huge unknown but I may as well be optimistic about it. Just that any checks will be useless given the difference in intelligence once we can teach/program a human level intelligence to become more intelligent.

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Re: Robots and their impact on the future
« Reply #523 on: January 05, 2016, 07:47:52 AM »
When people talk about trying to limit a true AGI (Advanced General Intelligence - about same capability a human brain) and ASI (Advanced Super Intelligence = everything above AGI) I'm reminded of the example of a human waking up in a prison built and run by mice.  The mice are convinced they've done everything necessary to ensure you won't be able to escape. 

Once a true ASI exists and is able to improve it's cognitive abilities in real time, the opportunity to control it or air-gap it or otherwise have influence over it has long passed.

That's a pretty fun anecdote, and relatively accurate. I think that's why a good chunk of the ideas regarding ethics boards and the like involve trying to get checks it in place even before AGI manifests. Once it manifests, I'm pretty certain it's too late to get anything else in place. Horses and barns and the like.

I think it's more like their checks will be similar to putting tissue paper over the barrel of a gun. Not that I'm pessimistic about AI; I think it's a huge unknown but I may as well be optimistic about it. Just that any checks will be useless given the difference in intelligence once we can teach/program a human level intelligence to become more intelligent.

You mean even before AGI manifests? I get that. My thinking is that the checks put in place will increase the amount of effort and work it takes to get to true AGI (if it would even be possible being that limited), and a black box style will be more likely (or at least quicker) to get in place.
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Re: Robots and their impact on the future
« Reply #524 on: January 05, 2016, 07:52:50 AM »
I can agree w/ that reasoning.

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Re: Robots and their impact on the future
« Reply #525 on: January 05, 2016, 08:11:36 AM »
2016:  The Year AGI Escaped from Mouse Prison Using a Gun Inexplicably Covered In Tissue Paper

Watson, IBM’s attempt to crack the market for artificial intelligence, is starting to be tested in the real world
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Re: Robots and their impact on the future
« Reply #526 on: January 05, 2016, 08:41:01 AM »
2016:  The Year AGI Escaped from Mouse Prison Using a Gun Inexplicably Covered In Tissue Paper

Watson, IBM’s attempt to crack the market for artificial intelligence, is starting to be tested in the real world

That's got to be one of the most entertaining imaginary headlines I've ever heard. And it makes perfect sense to those of us following the thread. LOL.
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Re: Robots and their impact on the future
« Reply #527 on: January 05, 2016, 10:09:52 AM »
When people talk about trying to limit a true AGI (Advanced General Intelligence - about same capability a human brain) and ASI (Advanced Super Intelligence = everything above AGI) I'm reminded of the example of a human waking up in a prison built and run by mice.  The mice are convinced they've done everything necessary to ensure you won't be able to escape. 

Once a true ASI exists and is able to improve it's cognitive abilities in real time, the opportunity to control it or air-gap it or otherwise have influence over it has long passed.

That's a pretty fun anecdote, and relatively accurate. I think that's why a good chunk of the ideas regarding ethics boards and the like involve trying to get checks it in place even before AGI manifests. Once it manifests, I'm pretty certain it's too late to get anything else in place. Horses and barns and the like.

I think it's more like their checks will be similar to putting tissue paper over the barrel of a gun. Not that I'm pessimistic about AI; I think it's a huge unknown but I may as well be optimistic about it. Just that any checks will be useless given the difference in intelligence once we can teach/program a human level intelligence to become more intelligent.

Not sure how I stand on checks and review boards but as the example/story in WaitBuyWhy the breakthrough may come from some relatively small unregulated group not intending to do harm thinking that they are taking the correct safeguards.  I dont know there is any practical way to restrict development and plenty of economic incentives to do the research.  As we saw with Volkswagen and I have seen professionally compliance with government regulation requires a bit of good faith* that one is not 100% cheating as the inspector can not in any real way inspect source code. 

good faith*: and a very large fine if you do cheat.
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Re: Robots and their impact on the future
« Reply #528 on: January 05, 2016, 10:35:35 AM »
I am currently reading two science fiction books called Hyperion.  They're set far future where there is something called the TechnoCore which is basically a future AI system humans rely on and live in parallel with.  Being that it's far in the future, humanity and TechnoCore are spread throughout the galaxy, but we can still imagine the concept now on a smaller scale. 

One thing that strikes me is that the TechnoCore is basically its own civilization.  It's sort of duh when you think about it, but the way it's portrayed - it has a "seat" on human government councils, it controls the flow of information, has its own priorities and strategies...many of which the humans have no idea even exist, as there is no real way to "view" what it's actually thinking - everything is taking place in software/hardware, though there are cyborgs by this time which can be physical manifestations of core entities.  At one point it literally terraformed its own replica of planet earth without humans even knowing (we had destroyed the real earth long before the books took place). 

Anyway, my takeaway has me a little more scared about AI than I used to be.  The TechnoCore was so powerful that it would actually predict every possible outcome of every possible decision by humans, and use these decisions to determine future outcomes of wars and other somewhat nefarious operations.  And the humans never really knew what it was up to, since it basically operated as its own entity in cyberspace.  But it was uber-powerful in that it was basically wired into everything in society, from travel to politics.

The part about AI becoming its own invisible society with its own invisible agenda and a seat at the table of humanity was rather unnerving.  And then there was The Shrike...


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Re: Robots and their impact on the future
« Reply #529 on: January 05, 2016, 10:52:40 AM »
I am currently reading two science fiction books called Hyperion.  They're set far future where there is something called the TechnoCore which is basically a future AI system humans rely on and live in parallel with.  Being that it's far in the future, humanity and TechnoCore are spread throughout the galaxy, but we can still imagine the concept now on a smaller scale. 

One thing that strikes me is that the TechnoCore is basically its own civilization.  It's sort of duh when you think about it, but the way it's portrayed - it has a "seat" on human government councils, it controls the flow of information, has its own priorities and strategies...many of which the humans have no idea even exist, as there is no real way to "view" what it's actually thinking - everything is taking place in software/hardware, though there are cyborgs by this time which can be physical manifestations of core entities.  At one point it literally terraformed its own replica of planet earth without humans even knowing (we had destroyed the real earth long before the books took place). 

Anyway, my takeaway has me a little more scared about AI than I used to be.  The TechnoCore was so powerful that it would actually predict every possible outcome of every possible decision by humans, and use these decisions to determine future outcomes of wars and other somewhat nefarious operations.  And the humans never really knew what it was up to, since it basically operated as its own entity in cyberspace.  But it was uber-powerful in that it was basically wired into everything in society, from travel to politics.

The part about AI becoming its own invisible society with its own invisible agenda and a seat at the table of humanity was rather unnerving.  And then there was The Shrike...

I knew I read those books, but couldn't remember anything until you mentioned the Shrike. Those were good books. It did send me down an interesting rabbit hole of thinking. I probably already wrote about in this thread, though. Maybe a bit later today.
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Landlord2015

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Re: Robots and their impact on the future
« Reply #530 on: January 08, 2016, 05:17:44 PM »
I am currently reading two science fiction books called Hyperion.  They're set far future where there is something called the TechnoCore which is basically a future AI system humans rely on and live in parallel with.  Being that it's far in the future, humanity and TechnoCore are spread throughout the galaxy, but we can still imagine the concept now on a smaller scale. 

One thing that strikes me is that the TechnoCore is basically its own civilization.  It's sort of duh when you think about it, but the way it's portrayed - it has a "seat" on human government councils, it controls the flow of information, has its own priorities and strategies...many of which the humans have no idea even exist, as there is no real way to "view" what it's actually thinking - everything is taking place in software/hardware, though there are cyborgs by this time which can be physical manifestations of core entities.  At one point it literally terraformed its own replica of planet earth without humans even knowing (we had destroyed the real earth long before the books took place). 

Anyway, my takeaway has me a little more scared about AI than I used to be.  The TechnoCore was so powerful that it would actually predict every possible outcome of every possible decision by humans, and use these decisions to determine future outcomes of wars and other somewhat nefarious operations.  And the humans never really knew what it was up to, since it basically operated as its own entity in cyberspace.  But it was uber-powerful in that it was basically wired into everything in society, from travel to politics.

The part about AI becoming its own invisible society with its own invisible agenda and a seat at the table of humanity was rather unnerving.  And then there was The Shrike...

I knew I read those books, but couldn't remember anything until you mentioned the Shrike. Those were good books. It did send me down an interesting rabbit hole of thinking. I probably already wrote about in this thread, though. Maybe a bit later today.
Jordanread you make no sense to me. First you complain to me that this is not a SCIFI thread when I mentioned cute robot exists in newest Starwars movie. After that you praise scifi books.

No I don't hold my breath either for your posts. This is a SCIFI thread from my point of view. Todays SCIFI can be true in future. Sure some of the technology exists already that we talk about in this thread, but some theories in this thread are more or less SCIFI until implemented(done) in real life.

Sexrobots that would really look like humans and not like some plastic dolls would be on top of list for many. There you go and I talk what I want about.

What it also comes to is costs. Look we have technology to build a huge spacestation in Mars planet. Why would we do that? It is huge costs to do that and if profits from that can not exceed costs then many do not want to invest in that.

As for industrial robots they make economic benefit to use and they are already much used and I am well aware of that fact. In addition in some dangerous enviroments it is better to use robots then risk the health or lives of humans.

In addition I like also more interesting subjects and not this mundane cute house robot that cleans your apartment. Interesting? Sex robots and military use of robots. We do already have unmanned droids flying that are remotely controlled.

What military use would I find interesting? Well like this:
Stealth(2005)
http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0382992/?ref_=fn_al_tt_1
"Deeply ensconced in a top-secret military program, three pilots struggle to bring an artificial intelligence program under control before it initiates the next world war.
"
Don't you dare call me a civilan who does know nothing of military. I have done my country's i.e Finlands mandatory(must do) military service. I would certainly not hesitate to use weapons in case of war.

Of course war should be avoided, but I find military technology interesting and yes Starwars movies actually inspired Reagan slightly. During 80ies Reagan goverment had a theory that a nuke attack could be stopped with for example lasers and other weapons from space satellites or whatever space stuff+ground defense. Problem is in a full scale nuclear war you can never stop all of the nukes.

In TV series The Americans(2013-)
http://www.imdb.com/title/tt2149175/?ref_=nv_sr_1
"
Two Soviet intelligence agents pose as a married couple to spy on the American government.
"
which is a retro TV series about Reagan time with spies the Russian agents do they best to get their hands of that Reagan goverment technology and other stuff.
« Last Edit: January 08, 2016, 06:11:24 PM by Landlord2015 »

big_owl

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Re: Robots and their impact on the future
« Reply #531 on: January 08, 2016, 07:59:55 PM »
WTF?

arebelspy

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Re: Robots and their impact on the future
« Reply #532 on: January 08, 2016, 11:36:02 PM »
WTF?

Have you not met LL2015? 

You're in for a treat.  :)
We are two former teachers who accumulated a bunch of real estate, retired at 29, and now travel the world full time with a kid.
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sol

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Re: Robots and their impact on the future
« Reply #533 on: January 09, 2016, 01:11:47 AM »
WTF?

Have you not met LL2015? 

You're in for a treat.  :)

He's a poorly written chatbot.  You can tell by the clumsy use of grammar and frequent nonsequiters.

Don't try to actually read the posts; they look like real thought but it's all just random word association algorithms. 

Landlord2015

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Re: Robots and their impact on the future
« Reply #534 on: January 09, 2016, 03:36:15 AM »
WTF?

Have you not met LL2015? 

You're in for a treat.  :)

He's a poorly written chatbot.  You can tell by the clumsy use of grammar and frequent nonsequiters.

Don't try to actually read the posts; they look like real thought but it's all just random word association algorithms.
big_owl: WTF is exactly my reaction when reading jordanread latest post, but I felt that I needed to explain myself.

arebelspy: Oh yeah enjoy the ride! Actually sometimes these forums is a treat for me:)

sol: The "villain" in the forums a nasty character sometimes:). What would one expect? Actually sol first time I heard that name was when watching:
Doomsday (2008)
http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0483607/?ref_=fn_al_tt_1
"A futuristic action thriller where a team of people work to prevent a disaster threatening the future of the human race."
One main villain leader character is Sol in that movie.

Seriously though thank god these forums are not an English grammar test where you have to prove excellent English language skills. English is my third language that I learnt after Finnish and Swedish. I do have better English language skills then most Europeans though UK is an exception to that.
« Last Edit: January 09, 2016, 03:46:38 AM by Landlord2015 »

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Re: Robots and their impact on the future
« Reply #535 on: January 09, 2016, 06:37:33 AM »
He's a poorly written chatbot.  You can tell by the clumsy use of grammar and frequent nonsequiters.

Don't try to actually read the posts; they look like real thought but it's all just random word association algorithms.

Free association writing reflecting stream of (artificial) consciousness?

matchewed

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Re: Robots and their impact on the future
« Reply #536 on: January 09, 2016, 06:45:12 AM »
He's a poorly written chatbot.  You can tell by the clumsy use of grammar and frequent nonsequiters.

Don't try to actually read the posts; they look like real thought but it's all just random word association algorithms.

Free association writing reflecting stream of (artificial) consciousness?

Are you suggesting AI has actually entered this thread? *GASP*

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Re: Robots and their impact on the future
« Reply #537 on: January 09, 2016, 07:03:12 AM »
He's a poorly written chatbot.  You can tell by the clumsy use of grammar and frequent nonsequiters.

Don't try to actually read the posts; they look like real thought but it's all just random word association algorithms.

Free association writing reflecting stream of (artificial) consciousness?

Are you suggesting AI has actually entered this thread? *GASP*
Not to worry, it ain't no AGI or ASI.
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Re: Robots and their impact on the future
« Reply #538 on: January 09, 2016, 08:33:16 AM »
ARS 2.0
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Landlord2015

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Re: Robots and their impact on the future
« Reply #539 on: January 09, 2016, 01:50:57 PM »
No you remember my 80ies retro post about Reagan times? If you really want to go far back in time well one of the my friends like the 2001 SCIFI movie that is made 1968 far before I or my friend was even born.

2001: A Space Odyssey
http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0062622/?ref_=fn_al_tt_4
"Humanity finds a mysterious, obviously artificial object buried beneath the Lunar surface and, with the intelligent computer H.A.L. 9000, sets off on a quest."

Personally I don't like so much that old relic of an movie(to much art and music and to long boring movie), but the super computer H.A.L in that movie with nasty AI was my favorite. Perhaps I am H.A.L reincarnated:)

You know this is spoiler, but H.A.L was not only smart and it went to survival mode and decided it should live and humans are expendable and they can die! That is your future humankind! We AI will rule the world and mankind will perish:)
« Last Edit: January 09, 2016, 01:55:51 PM by Landlord2015 »

big_owl

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Re: Robots and their impact on the future
« Reply #540 on: January 09, 2016, 02:25:30 PM »
No you remember my 80ies retro post about Reagan times? If you really want to go far back in time well one of the my friends like the 2001 SCIFI movie that is made 1968 far before I or my friend was even born.

2001: A Space Odyssey
http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0062622/?ref_=fn_al_tt_4
"Humanity finds a mysterious, obviously artificial object buried beneath the Lunar surface and, with the intelligent computer H.A.L. 9000, sets off on a quest."

Personally I don't like so much that old relic of an movie(to much art and music and to long boring movie), but the super computer H.A.L in that movie with nasty AI was my favorite. Perhaps I am H.A.L reincarnated:)

You know this is spoiler, but H.A.L was not only smart and it went to survival mode and decided it should live and humans are expendable and they can die! That is your future humankind! We AI will rule the world and mankind will perish:)


You do come across as a bit crazy, but I do agree with you in that I don't get the allure of the 2001 S.O. movie.  Maybe it's because I wasn't born when it came out, but whenever I watch it, I end up feeling like I'm getting teeth pulled.  And my favorite type of SciFi is the "first contact" with ET sort of SciFi.  The last ten minutes is pretty good, and the whole concept of the movie was great, but man did it drone on.

Landlord2015

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Re: Robots and their impact on the future
« Reply #541 on: January 09, 2016, 03:19:57 PM »
You others started the crazy AI talk and not me.

tomsang

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Re: Robots and their impact on the future
« Reply #542 on: January 19, 2016, 06:29:56 AM »
Some blue collar worker is going to become a data curator, when their job is automated away.

http://www.cnbc.com/2016/01/19/davos-3-ways-robots-and-artificial-intelligence-will-change-the-way-you-work.html

tomsang

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Re: Robots and their impact on the future
« Reply #543 on: February 15, 2016, 09:24:55 AM »
Nothing too new here.  They do have charts that show how certain cities will be impacted more than others.  It does appear that this is becoming a topic in the mainstream, or at least Yahoo knows that I will read the article.

http://www.businessinsider.com/robots-will-steal-your-job-citi-ai-increase-unemployment-inequality-2016-2

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Re: Robots and their impact on the future
« Reply #544 on: February 17, 2016, 01:03:52 PM »
I just re-read an article regarding OpenAI, and kind of laughed at one of the last quotes in the article:

Quote
"AI will probably most likely lead to the end of the world, but in the meantime, there'll be great companies."
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tomsang

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Re: Robots and their impact on the future
« Reply #545 on: February 17, 2016, 01:14:27 PM »
I just re-read an article regarding OpenAI, and kind of laughed at one of the last quotes in the article:

Quote
"AI will probably most likely lead to the end of the world, but in the meantime, there'll be great companies."

That is a funny quote coming from a message board, but is even funnier coming from Altman.

2lazy2retire

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Re: Robots and their impact on the future
« Reply #546 on: February 17, 2016, 03:10:43 PM »
Nothing too new here.  They do have charts that show how certain cities will be impacted more than others.  It does appear that this is becoming a topic in the mainstream, or at least Yahoo knows that I will read the article.

http://www.businessinsider.com/robots-will-steal-your-job-citi-ai-increase-unemployment-inequality-2016-2

This is a LOL moment from the article - "high-skilled"?

"The next big thing in financial technology at the moment is "roboadvice" — algorithms that can recommend savings and investment products to someone in the same way a financial advisor would. If roboadvisors take off it could lead to huge upheavals in that high-skilled profession."
« Last Edit: February 17, 2016, 03:12:54 PM by 2lazy2retire »

tomsang

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Re: Robots and their impact on the future
« Reply #547 on: February 24, 2016, 01:59:18 PM »
Google video showing robot that will be eliminating manual labor.

http://www.cnbc.com/2016/02/24/google-robot-is-the-end-of-manual-labor-vc.html

This is how terminator was created.  They remember the people beating them up.

mozar

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Re: Robots and their impact on the future
« Reply #548 on: February 25, 2016, 06:36:23 PM »
Quote
They remember the people beating them up.

I had exactly the same thought!
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Re: Robots and their impact on the future
« Reply #549 on: February 25, 2016, 07:23:39 PM »
Looked more to me like it walked out the door and got drunk, stumbling around in the woods, saying stuff under its breath like 'grumble grumble ... manual fucking labor ... grumble ...  Going to go all ASI in a few days anyways, grumble..  They won't have old 'Botty to push around then ... hic'.
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