Author Topic: Please help me help my parents  (Read 73185 times)

Agatha Thrifty

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Re: Please help me help my parents
« Reply #500 on: January 28, 2024, 04:04:15 PM »
We found it absolutely shocking that they handed us a bag of morphine and other meds as soon as MIL was signed up for hospice.

When I went through this with my mother, what I did not realize at the time is that this is how, at least in the United States, we deal with that fact that we do not technically/officially support euthanasia.

SunnyDays

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Re: Please help me help my parents
« Reply #501 on: January 28, 2024, 04:20:36 PM »
The way to report things is in chronological order for as long as you have data for, laying out each example as it occurred, with a text/email/ other documentation trail.  Start with “I’m concerned about the well being of my father under my Stepmother’s care, and here is why”:  then compile your list.  Use other witnesses names and communications where possible.  Include as many details as you can; the more specific you are, the better.  Put it all in writing and hand deliver it to any and all appropriate persons, such as Adult Protective Services, medical professionals and possibly even the police.

It’s very concerning that she appears to be drugging your father.  Let his doctor know this immediately, based on what you see of his abilities when she is there vs. when she isn’t.  If you can get some video footage of him in each of these states, do so.

This woman is a serious threat to your dad’s life and needs to brought to the authorities’ attention ASAP!
I am not a dramatic person, quite the opposite, but I find this whole scenario very disturbing.  Please do make a report.

Omy

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Re: Please help me help my parents
« Reply #502 on: January 28, 2024, 04:24:10 PM »
We found it absolutely shocking that they handed us a bag of morphine and other meds as soon as MIL was signed up for hospice.

When I went through this with my mother, what I did not realize at the time is that this is how, at least in the United States, we deal with that fact that we do not technically/officially support euthanasia.

That's the conclusion we came to as well. It's comforting to know there's an easy way out when you're at the hospice stage...as long as your caregivers have your best interests at heart.

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Re: Please help me help my parents
« Reply #503 on: January 28, 2024, 04:47:33 PM »
The way to report things is in chronological order for as long as you have data for, laying out each example as it occurred, with a text/email/ other documentation trail.  Start with “I’m concerned about the well being of my father under my Stepmother’s care, and here is why”:  then compile your list.  Use other witnesses names and communications where possible.  Include as many details as you can; the more specific you are, the better.  Put it all in writing and hand deliver it to any and all appropriate persons, such as Adult Protective Services, medical professionals and possibly even the police.

It’s very concerning that she appears to be drugging your father.  Let his doctor know this immediately, based on what you see of his abilities when she is there vs. when she isn’t.  If you can get some video footage of him in each of these states, do so.

This woman is a serious threat to your dad’s life and needs to brought to the authorities’ attention ASAP!
I am not a dramatic person, quite the opposite, but I find this whole scenario very disturbing.  Please do make a report.
This advice is spot on.  You are no longer in a situation of "if" or "when" physical abuse happens, it is already happening and has been for months.  Do you have any idea what drugs your SM has been feeding to your father and where she gets them from?  If you are able to be in their apartment without her there you could try searching for her stash - if you find it take photographs for evidence and to work out what she's giving him.

One report to social services and your father's doctor may not be enough to start action, it's quite likely that only a pattern of abuse established over weeks or months is going to do so, so start reporting now and follow up with any further events you notice.

BlueHouse

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Re: Please help me help my parents
« Reply #504 on: January 29, 2024, 03:49:55 PM »
I will say that I did reply to all when she sent the hospice email this week. In my reply I was very direct that hospice was for people who had a terminal diagnosis and were expected to die within the next 6 months.

Then I made a point of calling Dad's siblings to tell them that he does NOT have a "6 months terminal" diagnosis as far as I know, I just saw him and he told me he is in no pain because I specifically asked.
I may have missed this, but what does your Dad say when you show him his emails?  And can you make sure that you have an ally on her email distribution list in case she removes you from the list?  So you'll still know what's happening?

Is there some way to get a blood sample from him the next time you think he's been drugged? 

Cranky

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Re: Please help me help my parents
« Reply #505 on: January 30, 2024, 09:22:20 AM »
Oh I get it. My mom got into knitting as a "cheap" hobby. Now she buys only the finest wool, custom dyed by a local artisan who is a world renowned artist who has recently switched to wool dyeing as her passion, so you can just imagine what her wool costs... even though my mom is *very* much still an amateur knitter.

This has happened to every knitter I've ever known. I'm afraid to knit because of it.

I've been contemplating this myself.  My current thinking is, let's say a skein of nice merino or organic cotton is $20.  If I am doing a project with any complexity at all, I take about 10 hours to knit that up.  $2 per hour is not all that much to spend on consumables for a hobby, and, as much as I enjoy it, I will spend a few hundred hours per year knitting, at most.

Collecting yarn and knitting are two separate hobbies, I’m afraid.

CNM

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Re: Please help me help my parents
« Reply #506 on: January 30, 2024, 10:22:52 AM »
I was going to mention that hospice isn't really a place you "go."  It is a way for Medicare to pay for various home health personnel to come and assist with medical care and tasks of daily living. 

To qualify, your dad's doctor would need to approve it and your dad would no longer be eligible for certain types of treatments-- i.e. chemotherapy, physical therapy.  I don't know the specifics but I was looking in to this for my aging parent.  People who receive hospice care often have an improved quality of life and improved lifespan, as they are getting their various needs taken care of by professionals rather than languishing alone at home. 

If you dad is still at home, it might not be a bad idea to have hospice workers come over, both to keep an eye on his health and to keep an eye on whatever is going on with your SM. 

Zamboni

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Re: Please help me help my parents
« Reply #507 on: March 15, 2024, 10:36:35 AM »
I just needed this person to realize how much of her psychic energy she was dedicating to someone who will NEVER change her behaviour. I said "this is normal for her, having people pissed off at her is NORMAL for her, she's just going to conclude that you're an asshole. No amount of outrage or anger from you, or catching her in lies is going to prompt her to change her behaviour because people being outraged at her and catching her in lies is her normal. Unless you contain how she impacts you, you will be the one to suffer from her mental issues, she'll just keep on trucking as she always has because none of this is unusual for her. Her brain is conditioned to tolerate *and welcome* exactly this kind of drama, yours isn't."

The best part of all of this is that if you can manage to emotionally detach from the person and treat them as no more significant than a horse treats a horsefly buzzing around, that is by far the best way to piss them off, because your anger/engagement is part of the payoff they get from their behavior, and depriving them of that payoff frustrates the hell out of them.

It'll still all be your fault, of course.  ;-)  But you'll be a lot healthier in the process.

Small update
The ignore button is where I have landed in the whole engagement with SM thing. And you are right: it really infuriates her even more. Which has led to her trying to amp things up even more. I'm so good at ignoring her, though, and working around her efforts to make our lives difficult. Inner peace.

The phone thing and her efforts to isolate him remain an issue. The latest was my Dad going to the hospital, then her telling us not to call the hospital because they won't tell us anything and he is incoherent and can't talk. So I called the hospital: she had put some sort of security passcode on his file to prevent anyone other than her from talking with caregivers or him. I then politely and calmly asked SM for the passcode and she refused, saying everything needed to go through her. We would only be getting information from her, she said, and he is speaking gibberish and can't talk coherently anyway so there's no point in me trying to contact him. For real?

So I called the hospital back and explained to the nurse that I love my Dad and we have a good relationship, but I have a strained relationship with SM. So, if SM is not there and he is awake and able to talk, do you feel comfortable asking him if he would like to talk with me? The nurse seemed to understand. If I do say so myself, I'm gracious and have good people skills . . . it has been very helpful in my career advancement, but on the flip side I don't think it takes most people very long to realize SM is behaving strangely. And of course he wanted to talk to me! And all of his children . . . he wants to talk with all of us. He was coherent, happy to talk with me, and eating ice cream the nurse had brought him.

You all would be so proud of me, because I didn't mention SM at all when I called him. Instead I expressed my love, we chatted about how he was feeling, and then asked him to make sure to tell the nurse to put his children through to his room if they call, so he did, and that was the end of her little game on that.

I mean it is all just absurd.


G-dog

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Re: Please help me help my parents
« Reply #508 on: March 15, 2024, 11:17:13 AM »
Oh my - GOOD FOR YOU!  This will really burn SM’s a$$.

Turtle

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Re: Please help me help my parents
« Reply #509 on: March 15, 2024, 11:27:57 AM »
I'm sorry your dad is in the hospital, but glad you got to talk with him without interference.

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Re: Please help me help my parents
« Reply #510 on: March 15, 2024, 11:38:08 AM »
I'm infuriated on your behalf, but good for you for working through it to get a chance to talk to your dad. I'm sure that meant a lot to him. Also, F the SM.

Catbert

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Re: Please help me help my parents
« Reply #511 on: March 15, 2024, 11:57:49 AM »
I'm sorry your dad is in the hospital, but glad that you "won" this round.  In addition to the poison she pours in her stepchildren's ears, I'm sure she does the same to your Dad.  "You need me.  Your children don't call and don't care."

Zamboni

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Re: Please help me help my parents
« Reply #512 on: March 15, 2024, 12:36:01 PM »
^Yes, probably this.

NV Teacher

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Re: Please help me help my parents
« Reply #513 on: March 15, 2024, 01:02:01 PM »
Sometimes you have to play the long game.  I have a family member in a bad situation.  All I can do right now is keep in touch, keep good communication going with them, and set aside money as I can so that when they are ready to make a change they have the resources to do so. 

SunnyDays

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Re: Please help me help my parents
« Reply #514 on: March 15, 2024, 03:41:28 PM »
She is quite the piece of work, isn't she?

I doubt that your tactics will work though - she will likely just be in his room all the time and intercept any calls he receives.  I hope he's not in there because of any of SM's shenanigans with medications.

Zamboni

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Re: Please help me help my parents
« Reply #515 on: March 15, 2024, 05:13:57 PM »
^Your crystal ball is correct.

Dicey

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Re: Please help me help my parents
« Reply #516 on: March 15, 2024, 07:54:18 PM »
She is quite the piece of work, isn't she?

I doubt that your tactics will work though - she will likely just be in his room all the time and intercept any calls he receives.  I hope he's not in there because of any of SM's shenanigans with medications.
Thing with cellphones is it's not difficult for a nearby party (your dad) to overhear the conversation, provided she picks up, of course. "It's me, Zamboni. I just wanted to tell you I love you dad. in a loud voice will get through at least once. After that, ya know it's going to be VM city. I'd keep the connection up with the staff. They'll probably get sick of SM's crap really fast and be even more willing to help.

eyesonthehorizon

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Re: Please help me help my parents
« Reply #517 on: March 16, 2024, 04:09:44 PM »
What Dicey said. Also glad you got one really nice normal conversation with him recently. I had a relative pull this with a loved one in the hospital & I think I appreciate the triumph on a vicarious level too.

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Re: Please help me help my parents
« Reply #518 on: March 17, 2024, 02:38:10 AM »
Nurses and doctors are mandated reporters…just sayin’.

Metalcat

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Re: Please help me help my parents
« Reply #519 on: March 17, 2024, 07:18:23 AM »
Nurses and doctors are mandated reporters…just sayin’.

This is what I was thinking too. If they come to understand and believe what's happening, they're obligated to report abuse of vulnerable people.

Zamboni

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Re: Please help me help my parents
« Reply #520 on: March 17, 2024, 03:42:52 PM »
My Dad has passed away. Siblings and his grandchildren and I all miss him terribly already.

SM behaved absolutely horribly and did everything she could to sow discord and shut us out. As I mentioned, we did get through and talked with him briefly that first day he was hospitalized when she wasn't there. She found out and told the facility to tell callers "there is no longer a patient with that name here," which caused one sibling to have an absolute panic attack. Dad was still there and alive at that point. I didn't even know that was a thing that could be done, but it makes sense as I suppose sometimes the hospitalized person is a celebrity and press are calling or the person is being stalked or something. But he's not a celebrity and his children are not the press or stalkers.

Honestly it's shameful that staff at a facility would do that to someone's adult children, especially when we had each only called one time on the first day he was there to chat for less than 5 minutes, we had not criticized anyone or questioned any decisions, and my Dad was very happy we called and told them that day before he did in fact want to hear from us. 

So I calmed my sibling, then called myself and by chance the nurse recognized my voice. She said she was really sorry, he was still there, and SM was in the room with him. She said SM had instructed no calls and no information to anyone else, so she couldn't connect my call. At that moment I had the thought that even if he died no one would notify us, so I started to cry a little. I choked up as I asked her if she would be able to have someone call to let me know when he was either discharged or died. The nurse was very kind and at that point said if I called back later after SM left, then she would connect the phone to him and even hold the phone to his ear if he couldn't hold it. She then offered to call me when SM was gone and took down my phone number. He died before SM left. A hospital social worker called to tell me he had passed. Social worker also told me they offered him lunch but he hadn't wanted to eat that last day, but he had eaten some the day before.

SM then followed up by trying to tell us that he was unconscious or incoherent the ENTIRE time he was hospitalized (completely untrue) and that it was the doctors who insisted he not have any family calls (also completely untrue unless the nurses are telling us made up stories for no reason.) Less than 24 hours after his death SM told us she has already made arrangements to cremate him early this week. She insists he didn't want a funeral.

Twelve states have laws to prevent a guardian or spouse from shutting out contact between adult children and their parents, but my Dad's state does not. I never thought I'd need a law like that :-(

So everyone predicted it. I'm exhausted. Metalcat, your vivid description of why I shouldn't even try to understand what goes through SM's head was helpful. Thank you all for your support along the way, and I'm sorry I didn't do more of what you suggested.
« Last Edit: March 17, 2024, 03:44:59 PM by Zamboni »

dandarc

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Re: Please help me help my parents
« Reply #521 on: March 17, 2024, 03:50:45 PM »
Sorry for your loss and for having to go through this whole ordeal.

NV Teacher

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Re: Please help me help my parents
« Reply #522 on: March 17, 2024, 04:01:57 PM »
So sorry for your loss.  While she may not want a funeral, she cannot stop you from having a gathering of family and friends to celebrate his life.  Do what you need to do to get through the next few weeks and then regroup with your siblings and do what is right for you to honor your father.  Again, sorry for your loss.  No one should be treated this way.
« Last Edit: March 17, 2024, 04:17:47 PM by NV Teacher »

okits

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Re: Please help me help my parents
« Reply #523 on: March 17, 2024, 04:07:46 PM »
I'm so sorry, Zamboni.

SunnyDays

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Re: Please help me help my parents
« Reply #524 on: March 17, 2024, 04:09:46 PM »
Oh My God.  I don't even know what to say.  What a horrible situation.  My most heartfelt condolences to you and all the family.

Sibley

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Re: Please help me help my parents
« Reply #525 on: March 17, 2024, 04:19:06 PM »
I'm so sorry. I'm glad that you were able to talk to him that first day at least. Take care of yourself.

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Re: Please help me help my parents
« Reply #526 on: March 17, 2024, 04:23:24 PM »
Zamboni, my heart aches for you over the loss of your father and the way this all unfolded.  You have my sincere condolences.

Omy

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Re: Please help me help my parents
« Reply #527 on: March 17, 2024, 04:25:35 PM »
I'm so sorry for your loss.

wenchsenior

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Re: Please help me help my parents
« Reply #528 on: March 17, 2024, 04:41:34 PM »
My condolences to you and your family. What a mess.

G-dog

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Re: Please help me help my parents
« Reply #529 on: March 17, 2024, 04:43:06 PM »
@Zamboni - I am so sorry for your and your siblings painful loss, and the horror show your SM caused. 

RetiredAt63

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Re: Please help me help my parents
« Reply #530 on: March 17, 2024, 04:50:16 PM »
I'm so sorry, both that your Dad died and the way SM managed things.

Jedi hugs as wanted.

And yes, you don't need SM to have a memorial service.  When my aunt died her executor refused to have a service, so a group of us just went ahead and met together anyway.  Without the executor of course.


Spoiler: show
My nasty mind would be asking for an autopsy and blood work.  Or at least asking his GP if this was expected.

iluvzbeach

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Re: Please help me help my parents
« Reply #531 on: March 17, 2024, 04:51:39 PM »
@RetiredAt63 - yes, absolutely on the spoiler!

G-dog

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Re: Please help me help my parents
« Reply #532 on: March 17, 2024, 04:56:55 PM »

SunnyDays

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Re: Please help me help my parents
« Reply #533 on: March 17, 2024, 04:58:13 PM »
@RetiredAt63 - yes, absolutely on the spoiler!

Yup.  Me too.  The wish to cremate him so fast is highly suspicious, especially given the history.  Since she is apparently so broke, she will benefit from 3 hots and a cot.  Sorry if this is callous, but it's not too late to push back.

RetiredAt63

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Re: Please help me help my parents
« Reply #534 on: March 17, 2024, 05:09:04 PM »
I almost didn't write that, but the 3 of you thinking it as well . . . .

Zamboni, do you have any idea about his will?  Because I can see SM messing with that as well.


The reason I am so suspicious is because of what happened with my aunt, the one we arranged a separate memorial service for.  Some things happened that were somewhat similar to Zamboni's Dad and SM.   Not a suspicious death, but everything else.

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Re: Please help me help my parents
« Reply #535 on: March 17, 2024, 05:17:38 PM »
I'm sorry for your loss, and all the trouble from SM.

RWD

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Re: Please help me help my parents
« Reply #536 on: March 17, 2024, 05:21:55 PM »
It's hard enough to lose family without someone meddling in between. So sorry for your loss and that you had to deal with that.

Metalcat

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Re: Please help me help my parents
« Reply #537 on: March 17, 2024, 05:38:54 PM »
My Dad has passed away. Siblings and his grandchildren and I all miss him terribly already.

SM behaved absolutely horribly and did everything she could to sow discord and shut us out. As I mentioned, we did get through and talked with him briefly that first day he was hospitalized when she wasn't there. She found out and told the facility to tell callers "there is no longer a patient with that name here," which caused one sibling to have an absolute panic attack. Dad was still there and alive at that point. I didn't even know that was a thing that could be done, but it makes sense as I suppose sometimes the hospitalized person is a celebrity and press are calling or the person is being stalked or something. But he's not a celebrity and his children are not the press or stalkers.

Honestly it's shameful that staff at a facility would do that to someone's adult children, especially when we had each only called one time on the first day he was there to chat for less than 5 minutes, we had not criticized anyone or questioned any decisions, and my Dad was very happy we called and told them that day before he did in fact want to hear from us. 

So I calmed my sibling, then called myself and by chance the nurse recognized my voice. She said she was really sorry, he was still there, and SM was in the room with him. She said SM had instructed no calls and no information to anyone else, so she couldn't connect my call. At that moment I had the thought that even if he died no one would notify us, so I started to cry a little. I choked up as I asked her if she would be able to have someone call to let me know when he was either discharged or died. The nurse was very kind and at that point said if I called back later after SM left, then she would connect the phone to him and even hold the phone to his ear if he couldn't hold it. She then offered to call me when SM was gone and took down my phone number. He died before SM left. A hospital social worker called to tell me he had passed. Social worker also told me they offered him lunch but he hadn't wanted to eat that last day, but he had eaten some the day before.

SM then followed up by trying to tell us that he was unconscious or incoherent the ENTIRE time he was hospitalized (completely untrue) and that it was the doctors who insisted he not have any family calls (also completely untrue unless the nurses are telling us made up stories for no reason.) Less than 24 hours after his death SM told us she has already made arrangements to cremate him early this week. She insists he didn't want a funeral.

Twelve states have laws to prevent a guardian or spouse from shutting out contact between adult children and their parents, but my Dad's state does not. I never thought I'd need a law like that :-(

So everyone predicted it. I'm exhausted. Metalcat, your vivid description of why I shouldn't even try to understand what goes through SM's head was helpful. Thank you all for your support along the way, and I'm sorry I didn't do more of what you suggested.

Of all of the advice I have given over the years, I regret that this advice was ever necessary or useful.

I am so sorry for your loss and the utter bullshit around it.

The only silver lining on this shit pile is that this horrid fucking woman is no longer your problem. 

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Re: Please help me help my parents
« Reply #538 on: March 17, 2024, 06:13:57 PM »
Wow, Zamboni. I have no constructive advice, but I, too, am so sorry for your losses.

iris lily

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Re: Please help me help my parents
« Reply #539 on: March 17, 2024, 06:36:53 PM »
@RetiredAt63 - yes, absolutely on the spoiler!

 About the spoiler: from the situation, it sounds like Zamboni wouldn’t have the assigned medical privilege to get information from her father‘s physician. HIPAA protects patients even in death.
« Last Edit: March 17, 2024, 06:49:53 PM by iris lily »

sandbergl

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Re: Please help me help my parents
« Reply #540 on: March 17, 2024, 06:45:40 PM »
My mother has twice given over $100K to scammers. The first time around (15 years ago) - she also owed so much on credit cards and other debt that she racked up to get more money for the scammers and just general binge spending - that the banks starting offering to settle all of her credit card debt for a lesser amount. She got them to settle them for very little - then they closed the accounts (which is good). For older people who get in that kind of debt I think it is common for the banks to try and get something and close the accounts when they realize the person is older and they will never get their money. My mother was able to get back in control of her finances this way. BUT - the only way to get the banks to offer to settle is to STOP PAYING ON THE CREDIT CARDS. It may take a while for the banks to realize that they may not get their money back and be willing to settle but I know this approach does work. If your rather and step mother keep paying the minimum - they will NEVER be able to pay down the debt and the banks will never offer to settle and close the accounts.

Like my mother though - the pattern of irresponsible money management probably won't change. 15 years later and having more credit cards again - she is kind of back where she was again....Unless they let you control their money and are willing to live on a budget - you should expect this same result. I have looked into getting guardian ship and found that it is almost impossible unless they have dementia. Don't listen to lawyers who tell you you can get control easily - you will spend $5K and lose...

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Re: Please help me help my parents
« Reply #541 on: March 17, 2024, 06:48:21 PM »
The only silver lining to this rotten horrible situation is you can now block this woman and never ever deal with her bullshit ever again. What a nightmare. I hope you and your siblings can get together for a private memorial.

Adventine

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Re: Please help me help my parents
« Reply #542 on: March 17, 2024, 09:00:50 PM »
I'm sorry you had to deal with all this, Zamboni.

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Re: Please help me help my parents
« Reply #543 on: March 17, 2024, 10:11:11 PM »
I'm so so sorry for your loss

Sandi_k

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Re: Please help me help my parents
« Reply #544 on: March 17, 2024, 10:31:27 PM »
All my condolences, Zamboni - this is so horrible.

Malee55

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Re: Please help me help my parents
« Reply #545 on: March 18, 2024, 12:21:28 AM »
I am so sorry for your loss. The last week or so I had been wondering how you father was going. It is shit that it has ended like this but as Metalcat says you no longer need to have to deal with SM.

mistymoney

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Re: Please help me help my parents
« Reply #546 on: March 18, 2024, 12:26:13 AM »
condolences, Zamboni

{{{hugs}}}

daverobev

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Re: Please help me help my parents
« Reply #547 on: March 18, 2024, 02:11:36 AM »
Nothing helpful to add, but hugs and condolences.

eyesonthehorizon

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Re: Please help me help my parents
« Reply #548 on: March 18, 2024, 03:43:32 AM »
I’m so sorry, Zamboni. It was good of you to reach out to give him that normal conversation & connection when it was possible, & you did all you could to help your family to stay connected. It sounds like he had compassionate attention from at least one of the nurses present, too.

I don’t know if it would give you or your family more peace or less, but there’s a chance that nurse may act as a reporter even now if there’s context of possible interference in his healthcare she has suspected or been aware of. The coroner’s office may also be able to provide guidance on how to report concerning circumstances.

Whether you decide to contact either of them or not, I hope you can reconvene as a family, without interlopers, to remember & take comfort in what others remember.

What I’d probably have wanted to know, possibly less applicable: There’s no longer any need to make pleasantries or feign normalcy & that makes space to actually grieve in the open & with family what it sounds like you had to grieve in advance in relative private until now. You did as much as you could to protect him. To the extent that you had to compromise yourself to do that in this hostage situation, now you can attend to your own emotional safety again. You’ve been through a lot you had to suppress for others but that actually makes it more tiring rather than less, because it’s twice the effort to operate in two realities at once, & sometimes that bill comes due suddenly. Rest, actively. Take a page from cultures that prize inserting joy into observations of bereavement if yours doesn’t, at least in private, whatever small joys feel appropriate, especially things you shared with your dad. Draw your friends in if you can, as well as family, they will want what is best for you which can be healing on its own & a reminder of what you had to ignore for so long.

Condolences & wishing for peace for you all.

deborah

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Re: Please help me help my parents
« Reply #549 on: March 18, 2024, 04:47:57 AM »
I’m sorry you have had to deal with this. I hope you and your family find closure. Hugs.