Poll

I'd like to buy a used Fitbit ($50Cnd)  I think it'll encourage me to walk/bike more.

yes, buy a used Fitbit for $50
33 (19.8%)
Monitor kijiji for a month or more first to ensure best possible deal
2 (1.2%)
Pay off $20,000 line of credit (8%) first
72 (43.1%)
Not necessary. Just use the ap on your phone
60 (35.9%)

Total Members Voted: 167

Voting closed: March 07, 2018, 09:10:34 PM

Author Topic: Permission to buy a Fitbit  (Read 5592 times)

Mikila

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Re: Permission to buy a Fitbit
« Reply #50 on: February 13, 2018, 09:11:01 AM »
Use the google fit app instead.  Sometimes I don't want to carry my phone and so then I have 2 options: enter the exercise manually or wear it in my fanny pack.  Fanny pack sounds so 1980's but it is very practical.  I can even wear it under my shirt and forget it's there because its profile is slim. 

Scandium

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Re: Permission to buy a Fitbit
« Reply #51 on: February 13, 2018, 09:32:29 AM »
These things don't make any sense to me. Why would I need a gadget to tell me I don't exercise enough? woopie doo, I already knew that. I don't exercise because lack of time, not because lack of information. And it just crudely measures your steps right? Doesn't even have GPS (those things look cool, but are $300+).

By an elastic waist belt, <$10 on amazon. Run with your phone. It'll log speed, time, location, elevation, distance, play music and much more! And you have a phone in an emergency. More than any fitbit could do, and you already have one! Strava or Endomondo is free.

cats

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Re: Permission to buy a Fitbit
« Reply #52 on: February 13, 2018, 09:39:39 AM »
I have found putting the app on my phone and having some friends who will regularly start challenges is very effective at increasing my activity (I am competitive enough that I want to win or at least put in a respectable number of steps when it's on display to others).  I really don't think you need the actual device unless you want to do more than just track steps.

Rosy

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Re: Permission to buy a Fitbit
« Reply #53 on: February 13, 2018, 10:04:14 AM »
All you have to do is bike that seven miles daily until you saved up enough money in gas to buy a used fitbit at the best price you can find. That way you have the best of both worlds, you didn't really spend any money on it, it didn't affect your debt payments and you now have the opportunity to challenge your siblings in a fun, good for your health contest - win-win.

Just because you have debt, doesn't mean you can't have little pleasures now and then or you'll demoralize yourself to the point of giving up and buying more stuff.
I'm in favor of using an app, but I understand that sometimes we all buy stuff we don't really need. Stop dreaming up stuff you want, stuff doesn't help you lose weight or pay off your debt!

 

diapasoun

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Re: Permission to buy a Fitbit
« Reply #54 on: February 13, 2018, 10:29:26 AM »
I have a Charge 2 Fitbit. For the mustachians, this does not work with a older mobile phone (with Windows 8.1 in my case). The app for windows 8 doesn't support a Charge 2. Communcation about this is not clear.
So i now have a 150 euro wristband that only displays 'sync with the app'. I should now by a newer phone to use it.

Getting the app installed on an other phone get you past the message, but you than loose all the trackingdata after a week of not syncing to a phone, so unless you see that person with the other phone at least weakly the data is not retreivable.

Dagobert, you should be able to sync through your computer too. When you bought the Charge it should have come with a little black USB chip -- put that into your computer, download the Fitbit software, and you're good to go. When I first got my Fitbit I didn't even have a smartphone, so that was how I synced it.

Valhalla

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Re: Permission to buy a Fitbit
« Reply #55 on: February 13, 2018, 10:47:27 AM »
#1 - do NOT buy ANYTHING until you have your debt paid off.

#2 - most people miss the utility of a fitbit.  Yes - a fitbit.  I am extremely fit, but I love my fitbit - not for tracking steps (although that's really nice), but for tracking sleep.

I am bad about managing my sleep schedule, and the fitbit allows me to accurately track how long I sleep, the quality of my sleep, and the different types of sleep (light, REM, deep, etc).

I used to have a Charge HR, which was a piece of junk as the integrated band would fail.  I changed to a Charge 2, which has replaceable bands, and it's been ticking along for 1.5+ years now, with perfect function and battery life.

I used to not wear any watch, as I thought my phone was more than sufficient.  These days I feel naked without my Charge 2.  It's really the best.

I would never in a million years buy an Apple Watch, or any other smart watch.  The Charge 2 is really a life changer, in the data it gives you.

Those who never have used a Charge 2, or will never own one, will NEVER understand the utility of it.  It's WAY more than a cheesy step tracker.     

I don't use the social aspects of a fitbit, or many other features, but the sleep tracking is unmatched. If you value your quality of life, you should get a Charge 2 (after paying off debt) to track your sleep.  Most Americans are sleep deprived and do not know it.  This is the single 'hack' that will vastly improve your life.
« Last Edit: February 13, 2018, 10:49:00 AM by Valhalla »
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nancyjnelson

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Re: Permission to buy a Fitbit
« Reply #56 on: February 13, 2018, 03:39:11 PM »
I was gifted an iFitness activity tracker for Christmas, and while it records heart rate and steps, I was mostly interested in it for the sleep monitor.  I have a regular 6:00 am tai chi class three times a week which involves a 30 minute drive.  The iFitness tracker classified my time in the car as "light sleep" and the time in tai chi class as "deep sleep."

I'm not wearing it anymore.

Valhalla

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Re: Permission to buy a Fitbit
« Reply #57 on: February 13, 2018, 03:56:16 PM »
I was gifted an iFitness activity tracker for Christmas, and while it records heart rate and steps, I was mostly interested in it for the sleep monitor.  I have a regular 6:00 am tai chi class three times a week which involves a 30 minute drive.  The iFitness tracker classified my time in the car as "light sleep" and the time in tai chi class as "deep sleep."

I'm not wearing it anymore.
iFitness tracker? What brand is that? Not familiar with it.  Fitbit's sleep tracking is automatic and excellent.
working on my TPS reports...don't bother me, or take my red stapler!

Scandium

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Re: Permission to buy a Fitbit
« Reply #58 on: February 14, 2018, 07:17:20 AM »
#1 - do NOT buy ANYTHING until you have your debt paid off.

#2 - most people miss the utility of a fitbit.  Yes - a fitbit.  I am extremely fit, but I love my fitbit - not for tracking steps (although that's really nice), but for tracking sleep.

I am bad about managing my sleep schedule, and the fitbit allows me to accurately track how long I sleep, the quality of my sleep, and the different types of sleep (light, REM, deep, etc).

I used to have a Charge HR, which was a piece of junk as the integrated band would fail.  I changed to a Charge 2, which has replaceable bands, and it's been ticking along for 1.5+ years now, with perfect function and battery life.

I used to not wear any watch, as I thought my phone was more than sufficient.  These days I feel naked without my Charge 2.  It's really the best.

I would never in a million years buy an Apple Watch, or any other smart watch.  The Charge 2 is really a life changer, in the data it gives you.

Those who never have used a Charge 2, or will never own one, will NEVER understand the utility of it.  It's WAY more than a cheesy step tracker.     

I don't use the social aspects of a fitbit, or many other features, but the sleep tracking is unmatched. If you value your quality of life, you should get a Charge 2 (after paying off debt) to track your sleep.  Most Americans are sleep deprived and do not know it.  This is the single 'hack' that will vastly improve your life.

This is another thing I don't understand. What actionable information do you get from monitoring your sleep? I don't sleep enough? Well woho, I could have figured that out by looking at the clock  when i go to sleep and when I get up! Is 6 hrs < 8 hrs? Yes, well then I don't sleep enough, big surprise. Problem isn't really knowing it, it's getting the kid's stuff ready and dishes done until 11 pm, I don't see how wearing a gyro on my wrist can help with that.. Are there hordes of people who sit around with nothing to do at night and need a device tell them maybe they should go to bed?

Seems redundant, your body has a pretty good built in system to inform you that you're sleep deprived; it's called "being tired". It works even better that something on your wrist.

And what if it tells you your sleep quality is low? Then what? What do you do with that information? Change your mattress? Put scented candles in your room?

ketchup

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Re: Permission to buy a Fitbit
« Reply #59 on: February 14, 2018, 08:09:56 AM »
#1 - do NOT buy ANYTHING until you have your debt paid off.

#2 - most people miss the utility of a fitbit.  Yes - a fitbit.  I am extremely fit, but I love my fitbit - not for tracking steps (although that's really nice), but for tracking sleep.

I am bad about managing my sleep schedule, and the fitbit allows me to accurately track how long I sleep, the quality of my sleep, and the different types of sleep (light, REM, deep, etc).

I used to have a Charge HR, which was a piece of junk as the integrated band would fail.  I changed to a Charge 2, which has replaceable bands, and it's been ticking along for 1.5+ years now, with perfect function and battery life.

I used to not wear any watch, as I thought my phone was more than sufficient.  These days I feel naked without my Charge 2.  It's really the best.

I would never in a million years buy an Apple Watch, or any other smart watch.  The Charge 2 is really a life changer, in the data it gives you.

Those who never have used a Charge 2, or will never own one, will NEVER understand the utility of it.  It's WAY more than a cheesy step tracker.     

I don't use the social aspects of a fitbit, or many other features, but the sleep tracking is unmatched. If you value your quality of life, you should get a Charge 2 (after paying off debt) to track your sleep.  Most Americans are sleep deprived and do not know it.  This is the single 'hack' that will vastly improve your life.

This is another thing I don't understand. What actionable information do you get from monitoring your sleep? I don't sleep enough? Well woho, I could have figured that out by looking at the clock  when i go to sleep and when I get up! Is 6 hrs < 8 hrs? Yes, well then I don't sleep enough, big surprise. Problem isn't really knowing it, it's getting the kid's stuff ready and dishes done until 11 pm, I don't see how wearing a gyro on my wrist can help with that.. Are there hordes of people who sit around with nothing to do at night and need a device tell them maybe they should go to bed?

Seems redundant, your body has a pretty good built in system to inform you that you're sleep deprived; it's called "being tired". It works even better that something on your wrist.

And what if it tells you your sleep quality is low? Then what? What do you do with that information? Change your mattress? Put scented candles in your room?
I'm as anti-kludgy-tech-bullshit as the next full-blooded Mustachian, but it is a bit more nuanced than you're assuming.

I'm overall a "good sleeper."  My own perception is that I sleep like a rock, falling asleep immediately and never waking up even if there's an end-of-the-world type thunderstorm or an orchestra is playing the 1812 Overture complete with live cannons outside by window.  This functionality isn't really built for me, but even so it's still useful.

It tracks more than (time you wake up) - (time you go to bed).  It tracks movement during sleep as an analog for sleep cycles (and does a pretty good job of it), and most usefully for me, it tells me when I wake up during the night.  Because it turns out that I don't sleep quite as well as I thought, I just never ever remember it happening if I wake up for a minute or two and then fall back asleep.  The tracking keeps me honest about that.

As for what to do when sleep quality is "bad"? Of course there are variables you can change.  I've recently made the switch to side-sleeping for my girlfriend's sanity (I'd been a face-down no-pillow sleeper for the rest of my life to this point, but apparently snoring has become an issue lately and she's a light sleeper).  There are a billion ways to "side sleep" and if I can use Fitbit's sleep quality indicators as one point of data as I change variables, it can help me figure out what is ideal.

I'm also a data junky and love tracking stuff, so I'm biased on that front I suppose.  I'm a firm supporter of "What gets tracked gets changed." to an extent, at least for my personality type.

trollwithamustache

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Re: Permission to buy a Fitbit
« Reply #60 on: February 14, 2018, 08:27:50 AM »
If you really need a fitbit go hang out at your nearest army base and try to buy a used one!


alanB

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Re: Permission to buy a Fitbit
« Reply #61 on: February 14, 2018, 08:39:40 AM »
#1 - do NOT buy ANYTHING until you have your debt paid off.

#2 - most people miss the utility of a fitbit.  Yes - a fitbit.  I am extremely fit, but I love my fitbit - not for tracking steps (although that's really nice), but for tracking sleep.

I am bad about managing my sleep schedule, and the fitbit allows me to accurately track how long I sleep, the quality of my sleep, and the different types of sleep (light, REM, deep, etc).

I used to have a Charge HR, which was a piece of junk as the integrated band would fail.  I changed to a Charge 2, which has replaceable bands, and it's been ticking along for 1.5+ years now, with perfect function and battery life.

I used to not wear any watch, as I thought my phone was more than sufficient.  These days I feel naked without my Charge 2.  It's really the best.

I would never in a million years buy an Apple Watch, or any other smart watch.  The Charge 2 is really a life changer, in the data it gives you.

Those who never have used a Charge 2, or will never own one, will NEVER understand the utility of it.  It's WAY more than a cheesy step tracker.     

I don't use the social aspects of a fitbit, or many other features, but the sleep tracking is unmatched. If you value your quality of life, you should get a Charge 2 (after paying off debt) to track your sleep.  Most Americans are sleep deprived and do not know it.  This is the single 'hack' that will vastly improve your life.

This is another thing I don't understand. What actionable information do you get from monitoring your sleep? I don't sleep enough? Well woho, I could have figured that out by looking at the clock  when i go to sleep and when I get up! Is 6 hrs < 8 hrs? Yes, well then I don't sleep enough, big surprise. Problem isn't really knowing it, it's getting the kid's stuff ready and dishes done until 11 pm, I don't see how wearing a gyro on my wrist can help with that.. Are there hordes of people who sit around with nothing to do at night and need a device tell them maybe they should go to bed?

Seems redundant, your body has a pretty good built in system to inform you that you're sleep deprived; it's called "being tired". It works even better that something on your wrist.

And what if it tells you your sleep quality is low? Then what? What do you do with that information? Change your mattress? Put scented candles in your room?
I'm as anti-kludgy-tech-bullshit as the next full-blooded Mustachian, but it is a bit more nuanced than you're assuming.

I'm overall a "good sleeper."  My own perception is that I sleep like a rock, falling asleep immediately and never waking up even if there's an end-of-the-world type thunderstorm or an orchestra is playing the 1812 Overture complete with live cannons outside by window.  This functionality isn't really built for me, but even so it's still useful.

It tracks more than (time you wake up) - (time you go to bed).  It tracks movement during sleep as an analog for sleep cycles (and does a pretty good job of it), and most usefully for me, it tells me when I wake up during the night.  Because it turns out that I don't sleep quite as well as I thought, I just never ever remember it happening if I wake up for a minute or two and then fall back asleep.  The tracking keeps me honest about that.

As for what to do when sleep quality is "bad"? Of course there are variables you can change.  I've recently made the switch to side-sleeping for my girlfriend's sanity (I'd been a face-down no-pillow sleeper for the rest of my life to this point, but apparently snoring has become an issue lately and she's a light sleeper).  There are a billion ways to "side sleep" and if I can use Fitbit's sleep quality indicators as one point of data as I change variables, it can help me figure out what is ideal.

I'm also a data junky and love tracking stuff, so I'm biased on that front I suppose.  I'm a firm supporter of "What gets tracked gets changed." to an extent, at least for my personality type.

Maybe you would also be interested in a breathing tracker, you might be breathing really badly all day long and not know it!  Or a brain activity tracker, just think about all that lost time when you could have been productively thinking!  I would also recommend one of those radiation monitoring badges, just in case.

Valhalla

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Re: Permission to buy a Fitbit
« Reply #62 on: February 14, 2018, 09:06:12 AM »

Maybe you would also be interested in a breathing tracker, you might be breathing really badly all day long and not know it!  Or a brain activity tracker, just think about all that lost time when you could have been productively thinking!  I would also recommend one of those radiation monitoring badges, just in case.
If you don't give a shit about your own health, that's fine.  Don't knock it for those who actually do care about their own health.

Sleep is one of those things that scientists are still figuring out why it's so important for humans.  It dictates our quality of life, our levels of overall fitness, and how successful you will be at tasks in life.  We spend 1/3 of our life sleeping.  If you don't give a shit about how you sleep, that's fine.

You have no idea how useful the data is, for others.  I have improved my quality of sleep by monitoring not just the duration of sleep, but the relative quality and quantity of each sleeping stage.  When I am short, I make sure to go to bed earlier and longer the following night, or take a nap.  It's all data based, rather than just on how tired you feel. 

I have an edge over someone who doesn't have this data, mentally and physically, especially versus before when I had no idea of how my sleep performance was.

It's easy to belittle someone else for something you clearly don't understand.  Ignorance is always easier than knowledge, for those who don't understand what they're missing in life and can't figure out why they're always one step behind someone else.
working on my TPS reports...don't bother me, or take my red stapler!

Valhalla

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Re: Permission to buy a Fitbit
« Reply #63 on: February 14, 2018, 09:16:16 AM »

This is another thing I don't understand. What actionable information do you get from monitoring your sleep? I don't sleep enough? Well woho, I could have figured that out by looking at the clock  when i go to sleep and when I get up! Is 6 hrs < 8 hrs? Yes, well then I don't sleep enough, big surprise. Problem isn't really knowing it, it's getting the kid's stuff ready and dishes done until 11 pm, I don't see how wearing a gyro on my wrist can help with that.. Are there hordes of people who sit around with nothing to do at night and need a device tell them maybe they should go to bed?

Seems redundant, your body has a pretty good built in system to inform you that you're sleep deprived; it's called "being tired". It works even better that something on your wrist.

And what if it tells you your sleep quality is low? Then what? What do you do with that information? Change your mattress? Put scented candles in your room?
Sure, your body tells you everything you need to know, that's why most people are becoming obese, cause their hunger mechanism works so well that they stop when they have eaten enough, right?

Many people have sleep apnea, a dangerous sleeping condition, and yet are blissfully ignorant of it.  Their body surely most tell them of this, no?   People have to pay for expensive sleep studies to see if they have some potentially dangerous sleeping condition that interferes with getting enough rest and sleep.  Your brain is not wired to tell you how you sleep, or your quality of sleep.  You don't even remember 90% of the things that happen in the night while you sleep.  Are you really sure that you know everything there is to know about getting good sleep and enough of it?

Ridiculous response.  You spend 1/3 of your life sleeping. Do you have any idea how long you really slept, or the quality of your sleep?  You don't even care to track even a little bit of something that you spend 1/3 of your life doing?  Really???

I'll take any advance in sleep to help me be better physically and mentally.  This is one of the least understood areas of life, why it's so important to our health and well being.  To ridicule this is just stupendous.  Are you really that willfully ignorant of such an important area of life?

This is an area that technology has just barely started to scratch the surface, we need many more advances in the future to tell us how to better control this area.  The improvements in our short term and long term health could be staggering, with the right advances in technology. I'm excited just by the first foray into this area, with my fitbit and the data it generates.

It's your life, you can do whatever you want. Don't knock what other people are finding valuable and insightful, especially if it gives them an edge in life versus the competition who don't care about their own health or long term well-being.
« Last Edit: February 14, 2018, 09:21:18 AM by Valhalla »
working on my TPS reports...don't bother me, or take my red stapler!

GuitarStv

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Re: Permission to buy a Fitbit
« Reply #64 on: February 14, 2018, 10:06:29 AM »
#1 - do NOT buy ANYTHING until you have your debt paid off.

#2 - most people miss the utility of a fitbit.  Yes - a fitbit.  I am extremely fit, but I love my fitbit - not for tracking steps (although that's really nice), but for tracking sleep.

I am bad about managing my sleep schedule, and the fitbit allows me to accurately track how long I sleep, the quality of my sleep, and the different types of sleep (light, REM, deep, etc).

I used to have a Charge HR, which was a piece of junk as the integrated band would fail.  I changed to a Charge 2, which has replaceable bands, and it's been ticking along for 1.5+ years now, with perfect function and battery life.

I used to not wear any watch, as I thought my phone was more than sufficient.  These days I feel naked without my Charge 2.  It's really the best.

I would never in a million years buy an Apple Watch, or any other smart watch.  The Charge 2 is really a life changer, in the data it gives you.

Those who never have used a Charge 2, or will never own one, will NEVER understand the utility of it.  It's WAY more than a cheesy step tracker.     

I don't use the social aspects of a fitbit, or many other features, but the sleep tracking is unmatched. If you value your quality of life, you should get a Charge 2 (after paying off debt) to track your sleep.  Most Americans are sleep deprived and do not know it.  This is the single 'hack' that will vastly improve your life.

This is another thing I don't understand. What actionable information do you get from monitoring your sleep? I don't sleep enough? Well woho, I could have figured that out by looking at the clock  when i go to sleep and when I get up! Is 6 hrs < 8 hrs? Yes, well then I don't sleep enough, big surprise. Problem isn't really knowing it, it's getting the kid's stuff ready and dishes done until 11 pm, I don't see how wearing a gyro on my wrist can help with that.. Are there hordes of people who sit around with nothing to do at night and need a device tell them maybe they should go to bed?

Seems redundant, your body has a pretty good built in system to inform you that you're sleep deprived; it's called "being tired". It works even better that something on your wrist.

And what if it tells you your sleep quality is low? Then what? What do you do with that information? Change your mattress? Put scented candles in your room?
I'm as anti-kludgy-tech-bullshit as the next full-blooded Mustachian, but it is a bit more nuanced than you're assuming.

I'm overall a "good sleeper."  My own perception is that I sleep like a rock, falling asleep immediately and never waking up even if there's an end-of-the-world type thunderstorm or an orchestra is playing the 1812 Overture complete with live cannons outside by window.  This functionality isn't really built for me, but even so it's still useful.

It tracks more than (time you wake up) - (time you go to bed).  It tracks movement during sleep as an analog for sleep cycles (and does a pretty good job of it), and most usefully for me, it tells me when I wake up during the night.  Because it turns out that I don't sleep quite as well as I thought, I just never ever remember it happening if I wake up for a minute or two and then fall back asleep.  The tracking keeps me honest about that.

As for what to do when sleep quality is "bad"? Of course there are variables you can change.  I've recently made the switch to side-sleeping for my girlfriend's sanity (I'd been a face-down no-pillow sleeper for the rest of my life to this point, but apparently snoring has become an issue lately and she's a light sleeper).  There are a billion ways to "side sleep" and if I can use Fitbit's sleep quality indicators as one point of data as I change variables, it can help me figure out what is ideal.

I'm also a data junky and love tracking stuff, so I'm biased on that front I suppose.  I'm a firm supporter of "What gets tracked gets changed." to an extent, at least for my personality type.

So the main benefit of tracking your sleep using a fitbit (which doesn't actually track your EEG brain waves, but guesses based upon nightly movement - so it's a very reliable indicator at all  . . . but I guess that's another post) is that if you choose to change the way you sleep it can tell you if this leads to better sleep?  I'm not entirely sure how this would not be pretty evident from how you feel after a couple weeks of sleeping differently.

ketchup

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Re: Permission to buy a Fitbit
« Reply #65 on: February 14, 2018, 10:12:54 AM »
#1 - do NOT buy ANYTHING until you have your debt paid off.

#2 - most people miss the utility of a fitbit.  Yes - a fitbit.  I am extremely fit, but I love my fitbit - not for tracking steps (although that's really nice), but for tracking sleep.

I am bad about managing my sleep schedule, and the fitbit allows me to accurately track how long I sleep, the quality of my sleep, and the different types of sleep (light, REM, deep, etc).

I used to have a Charge HR, which was a piece of junk as the integrated band would fail.  I changed to a Charge 2, which has replaceable bands, and it's been ticking along for 1.5+ years now, with perfect function and battery life.

I used to not wear any watch, as I thought my phone was more than sufficient.  These days I feel naked without my Charge 2.  It's really the best.

I would never in a million years buy an Apple Watch, or any other smart watch.  The Charge 2 is really a life changer, in the data it gives you.

Those who never have used a Charge 2, or will never own one, will NEVER understand the utility of it.  It's WAY more than a cheesy step tracker.     

I don't use the social aspects of a fitbit, or many other features, but the sleep tracking is unmatched. If you value your quality of life, you should get a Charge 2 (after paying off debt) to track your sleep.  Most Americans are sleep deprived and do not know it.  This is the single 'hack' that will vastly improve your life.

This is another thing I don't understand. What actionable information do you get from monitoring your sleep? I don't sleep enough? Well woho, I could have figured that out by looking at the clock  when i go to sleep and when I get up! Is 6 hrs < 8 hrs? Yes, well then I don't sleep enough, big surprise. Problem isn't really knowing it, it's getting the kid's stuff ready and dishes done until 11 pm, I don't see how wearing a gyro on my wrist can help with that.. Are there hordes of people who sit around with nothing to do at night and need a device tell them maybe they should go to bed?

Seems redundant, your body has a pretty good built in system to inform you that you're sleep deprived; it's called "being tired". It works even better that something on your wrist.

And what if it tells you your sleep quality is low? Then what? What do you do with that information? Change your mattress? Put scented candles in your room?
I'm as anti-kludgy-tech-bullshit as the next full-blooded Mustachian, but it is a bit more nuanced than you're assuming.

I'm overall a "good sleeper."  My own perception is that I sleep like a rock, falling asleep immediately and never waking up even if there's an end-of-the-world type thunderstorm or an orchestra is playing the 1812 Overture complete with live cannons outside by window.  This functionality isn't really built for me, but even so it's still useful.

It tracks more than (time you wake up) - (time you go to bed).  It tracks movement during sleep as an analog for sleep cycles (and does a pretty good job of it), and most usefully for me, it tells me when I wake up during the night.  Because it turns out that I don't sleep quite as well as I thought, I just never ever remember it happening if I wake up for a minute or two and then fall back asleep.  The tracking keeps me honest about that.

As for what to do when sleep quality is "bad"? Of course there are variables you can change.  I've recently made the switch to side-sleeping for my girlfriend's sanity (I'd been a face-down no-pillow sleeper for the rest of my life to this point, but apparently snoring has become an issue lately and she's a light sleeper).  There are a billion ways to "side sleep" and if I can use Fitbit's sleep quality indicators as one point of data as I change variables, it can help me figure out what is ideal.

I'm also a data junky and love tracking stuff, so I'm biased on that front I suppose.  I'm a firm supporter of "What gets tracked gets changed." to an extent, at least for my personality type.

So the main benefit of tracking your sleep using a fitbit (which doesn't actually track your EEG brain waves, but guesses based upon nightly movement - so it's a very reliable indicator at all  . . . but I guess that's another post) is that if you choose to change the way you sleep it can tell you if this leads to better sleep?  I'm not entirely sure how this would not be pretty evident from how you feel after a couple weeks of sleeping differently.
It uses night-time movement and heart rate to do the sleep tracking.  Imperfect as the measurement may be, it's far more unambiguous than how I feel after a few weeks (barring some super dramatic change).  Either way, I like having a record of it all, and there's no way I'd manually keep track of even just sleep/wake times.  I'm also already wearing the damn thing due to the incentive from my health insurance, so I might as well utilize every aspect I find helpful (which is far from all of it - no way I'm setting it up as a "smartwatch" paired with my phone to the extent that fucking texts are displayed on it).

alanB

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Re: Permission to buy a Fitbit
« Reply #66 on: February 14, 2018, 10:14:24 AM »

Maybe you would also be interested in a breathing tracker, you might be breathing really badly all day long and not know it!  Or a brain activity tracker, just think about all that lost time when you could have been productively thinking!  I would also recommend one of those radiation monitoring badges, just in case.
If you don't give a shit about your own health, that's fine.  Don't knock it for those who actually do care about their own health.

Sleep is one of those things that scientists are still figuring out why it's so important for humans.  It dictates our quality of life, our levels of overall fitness, and how successful you will be at tasks in life.  We spend 1/3 of our life sleeping.  If you don't give a shit about how you sleep, that's fine.

You have no idea how useful the data is, for others.  I have improved my quality of sleep by monitoring not just the duration of sleep, but the relative quality and quantity of each sleeping stage.  When I am short, I make sure to go to bed earlier and longer the following night, or take a nap.  It's all data based, rather than just on how tired you feel. 

I have an edge over someone who doesn't have this data, mentally and physically, especially versus before when I had no idea of how my sleep performance was.

It's easy to belittle someone else for something you clearly don't understand.  Ignorance is always easier than knowledge, for those who don't understand what they're missing in life and can't figure out why they're always one step behind someone else.

Sorry for my insensitivity, I must be delirious from only getting 63% optimal sleep.  I thought my comment was funny, but now I'm not sure... I will have to invest in a humor monitor to get some hard data.

Your enthusiasm is a little persuasive though, maybe I will try to borrow my friend's sleep monitor and see how I stack up.

Scandium

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Re: Permission to buy a Fitbit
« Reply #67 on: February 14, 2018, 10:29:34 AM »
Ridiculous response.  You spend 1/3 of your life sleeping. Do you have any idea how long you really slept, or the quality of your sleep?  You don't even care to track even a little bit of something that you spend 1/3 of your life doing?  Really???

I'm in science/engineering, believe me I know and love data. But not data for datas sake. There has to be a purpose and a use for it. Knowing I don't sleep enough doesn't solve the fact that I have things to do at night before I can go to bed, and I imagine this goes for a lot of people. If you don't, and your problem is that you sit up too late good for you. Congratulations. (I suppose this could be a big problem in the RE world with more free time..)

Same with "quality of sleep". If I know, there's not really any action I can take to correct it. What are some things you can do? Perhaps I need to turn in my nerd card, but I'm not wholly convinced by this obsession with tracking and monitoring everything to "hack" ourselves to better lives.

I'm not knocking anything, I just want to know what the use/purpose is. So you're answers are sleep apnea (which yes is real, but pretty limited), and going to sleep earlier if you didn't sleep well one night. And switching from front to side sleeping. Sorry, not sold that this is something that would improve my life (if it does for you then good for you). Are there other examples of actions and improvements you can take based on this data?

I do find your phrasing telling:
"scratching the surface "
"many more advances in the future.. "
"The improvements in our short term and long term health could be staggering,"

It could. Maybe. But for now gathering reams of data about something I can't control holds no appeal to me. I'd do as well with a wristband that yells "Go the fuck to bed!" at 10 pm every night.

diapasoun

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Re: Permission to buy a Fitbit
« Reply #68 on: February 14, 2018, 10:44:32 AM »
Here's the thing with tech, especially wearable tech: what helps one person doesn't necessarily help another, and vice versa.

I don't find the Fitbit sleep thing useful. I sleep pretty well, my data for the sleep tracker has always been boring, and I just don't have any use for the data. On the other hand, not everyone sleeps well. For someone who wakes up at 3a every night and can't get back to sleep, having information on sleep cycling could be very illuminating, and could lead to them pursuing a different treatment path.

I also don't find Fitbit's "here's how many calories you should eat" thing useful -- it's just not calibrated right for my body and so the data it gives me is bad. I've also talked to people for whom that calorie tracker works amazingly. Touche, Fitbit, you calibrated your algorithsm for a different body type than mine, which stubbornly sticks to the same 10 lb range without fail.

On the other hand, I've found Fitbit's weight tracker useful. In particular, because I can compare activity records and calorie intake records against my weight records, I know that my activity levels have very little effect on my weight -- but my food intake does. Yeah, I know this is normal from reading health and wellness articles on the internet, but it's different for me when I have concrete data telling me things about my own body. That changes my behavior for the better.

I also find step tracking useful. I walk every morning and evening, and have gotten back into running a few times a week; nonetheless, my incidental activity varies widely, to the tune of one to two miles a day worth of steps. Figuring out what drives my incidental activity has literally changed how I run my life, and it continues to do so as I get new data. I was genuinely surprised, for example, at how much activity I got in last Saturday from ripping weeds out of our community garden plot. I thought I was gonna have a sore back but no other significant movement -- three miles worth of steps proved that wrong. That's the kind of information that changes my behavior, and makes me spend more time on a particular activity. I'm already looking forward to more weeding! Look at that, a nice yard and more activity than I would get spending time here on these forums. :)

tl;dr What data is valuable to you depends on what your problems are and how you use data. OP may or may not find a Fitbit useful to them. You may or may not find a Fitbit or some other bit of tech to be useful to you. I think it's great to question others about what they anticipate getting out of a fancy piece of tech before shelling out cash for it, because it leads to a more considered decision. I like it when people do this for me, personally, and I hope OP has found the contributions to this thread have helped them in making their decision. Expressing frustrations about a piece of tech you thought would be helpful but isn't -- legit, please do it, we need to know about the whole range of experiences if we're trying to figure out whether a piece of tech would be useful for us. On the other hand, telling other people that what works for them actually doesn't work for them, or is ridiculous -- not so great, or useful, or helpful. Let's try to only fill OP's replies with things that are useful, yeah?

(Sorry OP to get cranky-ish here. I tried to give my useful/non-useful experiences with the Fitbit above in case it helps some.)




GuitarStv

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Re: Permission to buy a Fitbit
« Reply #69 on: February 14, 2018, 10:58:25 AM »
Here's the thing with tech, especially wearable tech: what helps one person doesn't necessarily help another, and vice versa.

I don't find the Fitbit sleep thing useful. I sleep pretty well, my data for the sleep tracker has always been boring, and I just don't have any use for the data. On the other hand, not everyone sleeps well. For someone who wakes up at 3a every night and can't get back to sleep, having information on sleep cycling could be very illuminating, and could lead to them pursuing a different treatment path.

I'm still stuck on this issue.  If I wake up at 3 am every night and can't get back to sleep, what difference does it make if a hyped up wrist watch records this information?  How does that help me solve the problem?

diapasoun

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Re: Permission to buy a Fitbit
« Reply #70 on: February 14, 2018, 11:17:01 AM »
I'm not a sleep expert by any means, but here's what I can think of: Imagine you find your sleep cycles are totally normal, but you're getting woken up in the middle of one. That looks like a sudden environmental cue to me. What's going on in your environment at 3a that could wake you?  Alternately, imagine your sleep cycles are getting really short way quicker than they should be -- like your body is treating 3a as 6a. What's going on with your body that could do that? Maybe supplements would help; maybe altering your sleep schedule would help. Knowing that little bit of data could help you pinpoint a solution much more quickly.

Another scenario -- you find that your sleep quality on the tracker is really good when you fall asleep at 11:30 and get up at 7, but it's terrible when you do 10-6. You find this over and over, and you have the corroboration of getting tired on that earlier schedule, even when you're sticking to it like a good little sleeper. Your body has its preferences, and its preferences are abjectly NOT 10-6. You have actionable data then. And you have it in little charts -- little charts that not only reassure you that you're not crazy, but can reassure your boss when you e.g. ask for an 8a start time instead of a 7:30 start time.

*****

Like I said, I don't use the sleep part at all. I think Valhalla would be better able to describe concrete steps he's taken because of sleep tracking. I like the step tracking, which has had a profound and positive impact on how I approach my day-to-day life. That I can go on and on about.

big_slacker

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Re: Permission to buy a Fitbit
« Reply #71 on: February 14, 2018, 04:32:18 PM »
I don't quibble about stuff that makes me alive.  If there's even a 1% chance that it will improve OP's health 1%, isn't $50 worth it?  I agree that equipment alone won't make you healthy -- that exercise is more about attitude and habits... but if the Fitbit purchase can positively affect attitude and habits, is it really so bad?

I just bought a $1,500 dollar treadmill.  Because it's cold as fuK outside and I'm tired of driving to Planet Fitness.  If I lose my mustache, whatever.

Based on this post, doesn't seem like you had one.

From the poll results, posters are, generally, not objecting to the concept of a FitBit, only to the concept of buying one with $20,000 of debt.

I object to the concept of a fitbit.

If you want to get in shape, you don't need electronic fitness tracker doodads designed designed to have a relatively short life.  You need to exercise.  If you want a fitness tracker, keep a pen and paper and write down times/distances that you run or weights/reps that you lift.  This is cheaper, just as motivational, just as useful, and significantly less environmentally damaging.




[...]bought a $1,500 dollar treadmill.  Because it's cold as fuK outside and I'm tired of driving to Planet Fitness.  If I lose my mustache, whatever.

Could have bought $150 worth of winter clothes, pile on those layers until you are puffed up like a snowman.  Problem solved, you will be toasty warm and get some resistance training while you are at it!

You'll find that even when it's very cold you don't really need that much clothing to stay warm.  Exercise will generate a lot of heat.  When it's extremely cold you only need a good hat, a face mask, some warm gloves, boots that aren't too heavy, and skipants/skijacket.

Protip - when temperatures are in the -30s (C) and you're out jogging in skipants . . . only wear underwear beneath them.  It helps to keep you from overheating as much.

Man, that totally depends on the conditions. If it's JUST cold yeah decent base layer, jacket, gloves, smartwool socks, boots, hat and maybe a mask depending on temp.

If it's high 30's, low 40's and rain like seattle area winters it get MISERABLE unless you've got waterproof gear, and to get waterproof stuff that vents and doesn't overheat you can be challenging and often $$.

Final point, I love your posts and like you I lean towards the hardcore side of things. But I also know that not all things are for all people, and I'd much rather see someone spend money on a gym membership they USE than a bunch of gear they don't. :D

BTW-I just bought power meter pedals and am running a Zwift setup for the winter. So much easier to get consistent PRODUCTIVE training vs junk miles/hours when the stars align and I can rush outside for an hour or two? Tech isn't always the enemy and has real benefits if you're using it purposefully.

zoltani

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Re: Permission to buy a Fitbit
« Reply #72 on: February 14, 2018, 05:16:18 PM »
These devices are to get you used to wearable tech that tracks you and your movements under the guise of helping you accomplish something. Ita a necessary step to get people to be OK with micro chipping and other tech/brain/human interfaces. Who really owns the data collected when you wear a fitbit?
“The hardest thing in the world is to simplify your life. It’s so easy to make it complex. What’s important is leading an examined life.”

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Rosy

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Re: Permission to buy a Fitbit
« Reply #73 on: February 14, 2018, 08:30:25 PM »
These devices are to get you used to wearable tech that tracks you and your movements under the guise of helping you accomplish something. Ita a necessary step to get people to be OK with micro chipping and other tech/brain/human interfaces. Who really owns the data collected when you wear a fitbit?

My thoughts exactly.
The lure is, of course, all the benefits one has ..., but there are always consequences.

Valhalla

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Re: Permission to buy a Fitbit
« Reply #74 on: February 14, 2018, 09:30:01 PM »
Here's the thing with tech, especially wearable tech: what helps one person doesn't necessarily help another, and vice versa.

I don't find the Fitbit sleep thing useful. I sleep pretty well, my data for the sleep tracker has always been boring, and I just don't have any use for the data. On the other hand, not everyone sleeps well. For someone who wakes up at 3a every night and can't get back to sleep, having information on sleep cycling could be very illuminating, and could lead to them pursuing a different treatment path.

I'm still stuck on this issue.  If I wake up at 3 am every night and can't get back to sleep, what difference does it make if a hyped up wrist watch records this information?  How does that help me solve the problem?
The difference, is #1 - you become aware you get up at 3am rather than blissfully unaware, like 99% of the people.  #2, you figure out what's causing you to wake up at 3am.  Is it GERD? Is it drinking too much fluids before bed?  Is it eating too much or too little before bed?  Is it something you can control?

People don't just randomly wake up at 3am for no reason.  The data helps you become aware, and see what you can do about it.

As our bodies age, our ability to sleep changes, for better or for worse.  I can monitor how my body reacts when I exercise at different times of the day, when I have the deepest sleep, when I wake up a lot, and how much sleep I get in each stage. 

Having this data is amazing, and I can look at my patterns to see if there are things I need to address.  My sleep quality has improved a ton since getting a fitbit.  I feel far more rested, sharper, and my body feels much better now that I actually have some idea of how I sleep, and things that impact my sleep, and what adjustments I can make.
working on my TPS reports...don't bother me, or take my red stapler!

Valhalla

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Re: Permission to buy a Fitbit
« Reply #75 on: February 14, 2018, 09:32:39 PM »
These devices are to get you used to wearable tech that tracks you and your movements under the guise of helping you accomplish something. Ita a necessary step to get people to be OK with micro chipping and other tech/brain/human interfaces. Who really owns the data collected when you wear a fitbit?
If you want to go back to the dark days, go live in a cave.  Your whereabouts are tracked by many devices.  In fact, why are you posting on MMM? Your IP address, your PC / browser info is being leaked online.  You shouldn't even be here posting info, willingly giving away your info to strangers!

In all honesty, WTF is fitbit or any random company going to do with my sleep data?  I use a junk email for my fitbit that I never check (but I never get spam from them), and I don't use my fitbit to job or run, so no GPS data.  So what is there to be afraid of?

Some of this privacy stuff is prudent, some of it is absurd.  Fitbit is losing money, if they're making money on all the data they're collecting off of you, they're sucking at it.  Concerns about this issue is a non-issue, imho.
« Last Edit: February 14, 2018, 09:34:14 PM by Valhalla »
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RookieStache

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Re: Permission to buy a Fitbit
« Reply #76 on: February 15, 2018, 06:43:24 AM »
Without knowing your health history or current BMI/weight, I would say yes. If I had to guess, I would say fitbit's will work for 40% of people and circa 60% of people who are "competitive".

I received one as a gift 3 years ago and loved it. I quickly upgraded to one that tells time and date as well as lets me know if someone is calling/texting. I've never been over weight but I sit at a desk job and it motivates me to move around and hit a certain amount of steps each day. I also have about 3 meetings a day for work and it helps me keep track of time when i'm roaming around the company office (which is often). I had lost it for 3 days a couple of weeks ago, and felt naked. If you do happen to be overweight or don't get exercise, this fitbit could save you thousands of dollars in the long run for hospital bills.

Health > $50

zoltani

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Re: Permission to buy a Fitbit
« Reply #77 on: February 15, 2018, 07:24:20 AM »
These devices are to get you used to wearable tech that tracks you and your movements under the guise of helping you accomplish something. Ita a necessary step to get people to be OK with micro chipping and other tech/brain/human interfaces. Who really owns the data collected when you wear a fitbit?
If you want to go back to the dark days, go live in a cave.  Your whereabouts are tracked by many devices.  In fact, why are you posting on MMM? Your IP address, your PC / browser info is being leaked online.  You shouldn't even be here posting info, willingly giving away your info to strangers!

In all honesty, WTF is fitbit or any random company going to do with my sleep data?  I use a junk email for my fitbit that I never check (but I never get spam from them), and I don't use my fitbit to job or run, so no GPS data.  So what is there to be afraid of?

Some of this privacy stuff is prudent, some of it is absurd.  Fitbit is losing money, if they're making money on all the data they're collecting off of you, they're sucking at it.  Concerns about this issue is a non-issue, imho.

So the only two options are total buy in or live in a cave? That's not a very convincing argument. It's not really about selling data either. I know of at least one case where wearable data was used to convict someone and send them to jail.
“The hardest thing in the world is to simplify your life. It’s so easy to make it complex. What’s important is leading an examined life.”

Yvon Chouinard

trollwithamustache

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Re: Permission to buy a Fitbit
« Reply #78 on: February 15, 2018, 08:02:28 AM »

I'm still stuck on this issue.  If I wake up at 3 am every night and can't get back to sleep, what difference does it make if a hyped up wrist watch records this information?  How does that help me solve the problem?

since the fit bit cant tell time, its not really fair to call it a hyped up wristwatch!


GuitarStv

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Re: Permission to buy a Fitbit
« Reply #79 on: February 15, 2018, 08:31:57 AM »

I'm still stuck on this issue.  If I wake up at 3 am every night and can't get back to sleep, what difference does it make if a hyped up wrist watch records this information?  How does that help me solve the problem?

since the fit bit cant tell time, its not really fair to call it a hyped up wristwatch!

Downgraded wristwatch?  :P

galliver

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Re: Permission to buy a Fitbit
« Reply #80 on: February 15, 2018, 12:42:09 PM »
Does anyone asking about the value of Fitbit data track their spending? What's the value of that? Why not just check your bank balance, which tells you if you're broke or not? Except of course we all know the value of it. Once you have the details, you can see what specifically caused any changes, get yourself back on track (watch your grocery bill, etc) or adapt your expectations if those changes are permanent/semi-permanent (e.g. if you get married, have a kid, they start daycare, you have to go on medication, etc). Maybe you adapt the former to balance out the latter. Whatever is going on, having the detailed information allows you to make better decisions to work toward your goal(s).

Maybe you're sufficiently established in your money habits that you don't budget, don't track in Mint or YNAB or on paper, you just check that your balances are doing what you expect. Maybe you're satisfied with your fitness and sleep habits and don't see a need for that data. That's fine. No one is trying to convince you to buy a Fitbit! Really! Enjoy not having one. But (some of) you are devaluing the choices of those who *do* find value in one, who find the information helps them make changes...whether by identifying patterns or by being a motivational force.

I have a Charge HR--all the trackers that didn't do heart rate seemed like glorified pedometers to me; I would probably get an off brand or $10 mechanical one of those, or just use my phone. A couple things I've noticed since using my Fitbit: I'm really sedentary when I work from home and it gets me down, so I've made a conscious effort to work a walk or run in on those days; sometimes, I'll do laps up and down stairs to meet my "floors" goal even though it's arbitrary; and when I feel really crappy going uphill on a hike or running, my heart rate is up there, and taking a break or slowing down helps me feel better and finish the activity (like a poster above, helps me recognize and accept when I might actually working too hard for my body and regulate so that I'm pushing myself a good amount). Could someone potentially have these insights without the help of a gadget? Certainly. But (a) *I* personally simply *wouldn't* have thought about things in quite the same way without the data in front of me and (b) we live in a society that teaches us to internalize and ignore our physical needs (sleep, movement, etc) for various other goals (work, school, caring for others, etc). Many of us are too accustomed to disregarding our body's cues that we are missing something (tiredness, bad moods, lack of focus, etc). Again, not true for *everybody,* and if you're in touch with yourself, that is fantastic and wonderful, move along. But what you see in this thread is many people saying "yes, this was of value to me" and some others saying "no it couldn't possibly have been." How can you possibly say that for someone else? About something you haven't even tried?

None of this is to say OP needs one or should get one, which I think depends as much on their income as the other factors mentioned. With an income of $100k+ a $20k debt can probably be gone in under a year (or you have much lower-hanging fruit than a $50-$100 gadget to reckon with...or kids). If you're trying to pay off the $20k making $35k, your budget probably needs to be a lot tighter and the cumulative effect of spending the $50-$100 at 8% (effectively, by spending on a Fitbit instead of paying off the debt) is much greater.

GuitarStv

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Re: Permission to buy a Fitbit
« Reply #81 on: February 15, 2018, 01:38:28 PM »
Does anyone asking about the value of Fitbit data track their spending? What's the value of that? Why not just check your bank balance, which tells you if you're broke or not?

No.  None.  My investments aren't shown as part of my bank balance.



Except of course we all know the value of it.Once you have the details, you can see what specifically caused any changes, get yourself back on track (watch your grocery bill, etc) or adapt your expectations if those changes are permanent/semi-permanent (e.g. if you get married, have a kid, they start daycare, you have to go on medication, etc). Maybe you adapt the former to balance out the latter. Whatever is going on, having the detailed information allows you to make better decisions to work toward your goal(s).

The long term and eventual goal is to get to a point where doing the right thing is simply a natural action.  It doesn't require special tools that can fail you, it's not dependent upon external forces that you have no control over.  You do it yourself, for you . . . because you're awesome.



Maybe you're sufficiently established in your money habits that you don't budget, don't track in Mint or YNAB or on paper, you just check that your balances are doing what you expect. Maybe you're satisfied with your fitness and sleep habits and don't see a need for that data. That's fine. No one is trying to convince you to buy a Fitbit! Really! Enjoy not having one. But (some of) you are devaluing the choices of those who *do* find value in one, who find the information helps them make changes...whether by identifying patterns or by being a motivational force.

These people are not as weak as they claim to be.  I believe that they can be stronger, smarter, and learn to sleep better without a fitbit!  And in so doing they'll save themselves some money, and save the planet from a tiny bit of waste!  Literally EVERYONE wins!



what you see in this thread is many people saying "yes, this was of value to me" and some others saying "no it couldn't possibly have been." How can you possibly say that for someone else? About something you haven't even tried?

Maybe because I've blown money in the past on things that seemed like they would be essential to living a healthy life that totally didn't pan out, and I'm hoping to both prevent other people from feeling stupid, from growing dependence upon unnecessary things, and from creating more waste that the planet can't handle.

I've never had sex with a porcupine, but would advocate against it.  It's possible to use past experiences and failure to extrapolate likely outcomes and base advice upon that.

galliver

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Re: Permission to buy a Fitbit
« Reply #82 on: February 15, 2018, 02:34:21 PM »
what you see in this thread is many people saying "yes, this was of value to me" and some others saying "no it couldn't possibly have been." How can you possibly say that for someone else? About something you haven't even tried?

Maybe because I've blown money in the past on things that seemed like they would be essential to living a healthy life that totally didn't pan out, and I'm hoping to both prevent other people from feeling stupid, from growing dependence upon unnecessary things, and from creating more waste that the planet can't handle.

I've never had sex with a porcupine, but would advocate against it.  It's possible to use past experiences and failure to extrapolate likely outcomes and base advice upon that.

Ok, you've advocated. I'm not sure it was effective as I don't think you've convinced anyone (much less most people) who expressed the opposite opinion. You may also have offended some of them/us and pitted them against yourself by calling them "weak" (for example) while knowing nothing about them and their lives.  So what now? What's the plan to actually convince people to avoid "growing dependence upon unnecessary things, and from creating more waste that the planet can't handle," per your stated goal? Where do you go from here? Or is the actual goal to make yourself feel better and flaunt your "strength" by putting others down and arguing online? Because in that case your continuing to double down on your points and your approach actually  makes sense...

GuitarStv

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Re: Permission to buy a Fitbit
« Reply #83 on: February 15, 2018, 02:49:31 PM »
I didn't call anyone weak, quite the opposite.  I believe that their strength (both mental and physical) will allow anyone to get fitter without the need for electronic tracking.

Valhalla

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Re: Permission to buy a Fitbit
« Reply #84 on: February 15, 2018, 02:57:22 PM »
I didn't call anyone weak, quite the opposite.  I believe that their strength (both mental and physical) will allow anyone to get fitter without the need for electronic tracking.
Go ahead and convince yourself of that.

I'm not here to sell you a fitbit.  For me, being enlightened of information about my sleep has been amazing.  I am quite intelligent and diligent, but I don't even remember what time I went to bed last night or when I woke up last night, never mind the nights before that.  I don't know of anyone who keeps a log to track their sleep, even if they did, it would be tedious and inaccurate, as how can you recall when you exactly fell asleep?

You remind me of my friend, a Luddite who ridiculed smart phones.  He was the last one to get a cellphone, kept a landline even though he always missed out on social events because he was never home when people arranged get togethers.  "I don't need a stinking cellphone", he would insist, until he realized he was missing out. 

Then he finally got a smartphone, and now wonders he can live without it.  "I don't need access to the internet, I can just go to the computer at the library to look up information when I'm out!" he would proclaim.  Now he googles everything and is amazed that he can find information on the fly at any time. 

So yea, I'm not going to convince you on the benefits of knowing your sleeping patterns.  You'll never be convinced.  Doesn't hurt me one bit.  I'll just be sharper than you, have a technological edge, and be healthier in my life than you will be.  Suits me just fine.

For a one time cost of $90, my Charge 2 has given me amazing information to improve my life over the last 1.5 years.  I'm convinced myself it's worth every penny and more.  If you can't be bothered to improve your life with this easy information at your fingertips, good for you.  Be in the dark, LOL.  It will suit you.  You'll convince yourself that it's not worth it. You can manage your life just fine without technology.  Good luck with your life man.    The alternate version of you that's smarter, sharper, more fit and intelligent, won't ever know that you could have become that better version.  No one will convince you.  And that's just fine...
working on my TPS reports...don't bother me, or take my red stapler!

zoltani

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Re: Permission to buy a Fitbit
« Reply #85 on: February 15, 2018, 03:11:32 PM »
Not being able to live without something does not equate to it making your life better.

You'll never be convinced.  Doesn't hurt me one bit.  I'll just be sharper than you, have a technological edge, and be healthier in my life than you will be.  Suits me just fine.

Wow!
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Re: Permission to buy a Fitbit
« Reply #86 on: February 15, 2018, 03:42:42 PM »
I didn't call anyone weak, quite the opposite.  I believe that their strength (both mental and physical) will allow anyone to get fitter without the need for electronic tracking.
Go ahead and convince yourself of that.

I'm not here to sell you a fitbit.  For me, being enlightened of information about my sleep has been amazing.  I am quite intelligent and diligent, but I don't even remember what time I went to bed last night or when I woke up last night, never mind the nights before that.  I don't know of anyone who keeps a log to track their sleep, even if they did, it would be tedious and inaccurate, as how can you recall when you exactly fell asleep?

You remind me of my friend, a Luddite who ridiculed smart phones.  He was the last one to get a cellphone, kept a landline even though he always missed out on social events because he was never home when people arranged get togethers.  "I don't need a stinking cellphone", he would insist, until he realized he was missing out. 

Then he finally got a smartphone, and now wonders he can live without it.  "I don't need access to the internet, I can just go to the computer at the library to look up information when I'm out!" he would proclaim.  Now he googles everything and is amazed that he can find information on the fly at any time. 

So yea, I'm not going to convince you on the benefits of knowing your sleeping patterns.  You'll never be convinced.  Doesn't hurt me one bit.  I'll just be sharper than you, have a technological edge, and be healthier in my life than you will be.  Suits me just fine.

For a one time cost of $90, my Charge 2 has given me amazing information to improve my life over the last 1.5 years.  I'm convinced myself it's worth every penny and more.  If you can't be bothered to improve your life with this easy information at your fingertips, good for you.  Be in the dark, LOL.  It will suit you.  You'll convince yourself that it's not worth it. You can manage your life just fine without technology.  Good luck with your life man.    The alternate version of you that's smarter, sharper, more fit and intelligent, won't ever know that you could have become that better version.  No one will convince you.  And that's just fine...
Careful, GuitarStv doesn't have a cell phone. :P

GuitarStv

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Re: Permission to buy a Fitbit
« Reply #87 on: February 15, 2018, 04:17:28 PM »
I didn't call anyone weak, quite the opposite.  I believe that their strength (both mental and physical) will allow anyone to get fitter without the need for electronic tracking.
Go ahead and convince yourself of that.

I'm not here to sell you a fitbit.  For me, being enlightened of information about my sleep has been amazing.  I am quite intelligent and diligent, but I don't even remember what time I went to bed last night or when I woke up last night, never mind the nights before that.  I don't know of anyone who keeps a log to track their sleep, even if they did, it would be tedious and inaccurate, as how can you recall when you exactly fell asleep?

You remind me of my friend, a Luddite who ridiculed smart phones.  He was the last one to get a cellphone, kept a landline even though he always missed out on social events because he was never home when people arranged get togethers.  "I don't need a stinking cellphone", he would insist, until he realized he was missing out. 

Then he finally got a smartphone, and now wonders he can live without it.  "I don't need access to the internet, I can just go to the computer at the library to look up information when I'm out!" he would proclaim.  Now he googles everything and is amazed that he can find information on the fly at any time. 

So yea, I'm not going to convince you on the benefits of knowing your sleeping patterns.  You'll never be convinced.  Doesn't hurt me one bit.  I'll just be sharper than you, have a technological edge, and be healthier in my life than you will be.  Suits me just fine.

For a one time cost of $90, my Charge 2 has given me amazing information to improve my life over the last 1.5 years.  I'm convinced myself it's worth every penny and more.  If you can't be bothered to improve your life with this easy information at your fingertips, good for you.  Be in the dark, LOL.  It will suit you.  You'll convince yourself that it's not worth it. You can manage your life just fine without technology.  Good luck with your life man.    The alternate version of you that's smarter, sharper, more fit and intelligent, won't ever know that you could have become that better version.  No one will convince you.  And that's just fine...
Careful, GuitarStv doesn't have a cell phone. :P

The cell phone fad will pass.  :P

zoltani

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Re: Permission to buy a Fitbit
« Reply #88 on: February 15, 2018, 04:21:01 PM »
Brain implants for everyone!
“The hardest thing in the world is to simplify your life. It’s so easy to make it complex. What’s important is leading an examined life.”

Yvon Chouinard

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Re: Permission to buy a Fitbit
« Reply #89 on: February 15, 2018, 09:17:51 PM »
I didn't call anyone weak, quite the opposite.  I believe that their strength (both mental and physical) will allow anyone to get fitter without the need for electronic tracking.
Go ahead and convince yourself of that.

I'm not here to sell you a fitbit.  For me, being enlightened of information about my sleep has been amazing.  I am quite intelligent and diligent, but I don't even remember what time I went to bed last night or when I woke up last night, never mind the nights before that.  I don't know of anyone who keeps a log to track their sleep, even if they did, it would be tedious and inaccurate, as how can you recall when you exactly fell asleep?

You remind me of my friend, a Luddite who ridiculed smart phones.  He was the last one to get a cellphone, kept a landline even though he always missed out on social events because he was never home when people arranged get togethers.  "I don't need a stinking cellphone", he would insist, until he realized he was missing out. 

Then he finally got a smartphone, and now wonders he can live without it.  "I don't need access to the internet, I can just go to the computer at the library to look up information when I'm out!" he would proclaim.  Now he googles everything and is amazed that he can find information on the fly at any time. 

So yea, I'm not going to convince you on the benefits of knowing your sleeping patterns.  You'll never be convinced.  Doesn't hurt me one bit.  I'll just be sharper than you, have a technological edge, and be healthier in my life than you will be.  Suits me just fine.

For a one time cost of $90, my Charge 2 has given me amazing information to improve my life over the last 1.5 years.  I'm convinced myself it's worth every penny and more.  If you can't be bothered to improve your life with this easy information at your fingertips, good for you.  Be in the dark, LOL.  It will suit you.  You'll convince yourself that it's not worth it. You can manage your life just fine without technology.  Good luck with your life man.    The alternate version of you that's smarter, sharper, more fit and intelligent, won't ever know that you could have become that better version.  No one will convince you.  And that's just fine...
You're mistaking me for a person who cares. I don't give a crap if OP get a fitbit. I was just saying I don't understand the purpose of one, and the mountains of data it produce.

You, and others, keep saying *that* a fitbit (specifically sleep tracking) improved your life. But not *how* it did. What are some examples of fitbit told you X so you did Y? What are actions you can take to improve your sleep?

big_slacker

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Re: Permission to buy a Fitbit
« Reply #90 on: February 16, 2018, 06:40:45 AM »
I didn't call anyone weak, quite the opposite.  I believe that their strength (both mental and physical) will allow anyone to get fitter without the need for electronic tracking.
Go ahead and convince yourself of that.

I'm not here to sell you a fitbit.  For me, being enlightened of information about my sleep has been amazing.  I am quite intelligent and diligent, but I don't even remember what time I went to bed last night or when I woke up last night, never mind the nights before that.  I don't know of anyone who keeps a log to track their sleep, even if they did, it would be tedious and inaccurate, as how can you recall when you exactly fell asleep?

You remind me of my friend, a Luddite who ridiculed smart phones.  He was the last one to get a cellphone, kept a landline even though he always missed out on social events because he was never home when people arranged get togethers.  "I don't need a stinking cellphone", he would insist, until he realized he was missing out. 

Then he finally got a smartphone, and now wonders he can live without it.  "I don't need access to the internet, I can just go to the computer at the library to look up information when I'm out!" he would proclaim.  Now he googles everything and is amazed that he can find information on the fly at any time. 

So yea, I'm not going to convince you on the benefits of knowing your sleeping patterns.  You'll never be convinced.  Doesn't hurt me one bit.  I'll just be sharper than you, have a technological edge, and be healthier in my life than you will be.  Suits me just fine.

For a one time cost of $90, my Charge 2 has given me amazing information to improve my life over the last 1.5 years.  I'm convinced myself it's worth every penny and more.  If you can't be bothered to improve your life with this easy information at your fingertips, good for you.  Be in the dark, LOL.  It will suit you.  You'll convince yourself that it's not worth it. You can manage your life just fine without technology.  Good luck with your life man.    The alternate version of you that's smarter, sharper, more fit and intelligent, won't ever know that you could have become that better version.  No one will convince you.  And that's just fine...
You're mistaking me for a person who cares. I don't give a crap if OP get a fitbit. I was just saying I don't understand the purpose of one, and the mountains of data it produce.

You, and others, keep saying *that* a fitbit (specifically sleep tracking) improved your life. But not *how* it did. What are some examples of fitbit told you X so you did Y? What are actions you can take to improve your sleep?

Got an example for you. I'm a mountain biker and was training for a 12 hour epic with a lot of climbing.  I noticed that I was pretty consistently cramping  on climbs at the tail end of training rides. I was thinking I wasn't fueling well enough or maybe just getting old, I was just dealing with the cramping. Then I got a garmin 935 with HRM, plugs into cadence I figured out the issue fairly quickly. Old single speeder now on a geared full suspension bike I was pushing too big a gear at too low a cadence. I THOUGHT my cadence was higher and my HR lower, it was the opposite. I ended up re-gearing the bike and learning to spin better. I'm happy I did as the actual event would have been HELL with the way I was riding previous.

Of course discipline, best practices and being in touch with your body get you 80% of the way there, maybe more. But having some specific data points can do wonders.

Scandium

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Re: Permission to buy a Fitbit
« Reply #91 on: February 16, 2018, 08:15:31 AM »
Got an example for you. I'm a mountain biker and was training for a 12 hour epic with a lot of climbing.  I noticed that I was pretty consistently cramping  on climbs at the tail end of training rides. I was thinking I wasn't fueling well enough or maybe just getting old, I was just dealing with the cramping. Then I got a garmin 935 with HRM, plugs into cadence I figured out the issue fairly quickly. Old single speeder now on a geared full suspension bike I was pushing too big a gear at too low a cadence. I THOUGHT my cadence was higher and my HR lower, it was the opposite. I ended up re-gearing the bike and learning to spin better. I'm happy I did as the actual event would have been HELL with the way I was riding previous.

Of course discipline, best practices and being in touch with your body get you 80% of the way there, maybe more. But having some specific data points can do wonders.

Well cool, but:
1) that's a HR and cadance monitor. The fitbit does none of that. It's a pedomenter on your wrist. It can tell whether you moved during sleep.
2) That's a pretty serious athletic use, I barely understand most of it. I was thinking more in the realm of normal people's daily lives..

big_slacker

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Re: Permission to buy a Fitbit
« Reply #92 on: February 16, 2018, 09:56:39 AM »
Got an example for you. I'm a mountain biker and was training for a 12 hour epic with a lot of climbing.  I noticed that I was pretty consistently cramping  on climbs at the tail end of training rides. I was thinking I wasn't fueling well enough or maybe just getting old, I was just dealing with the cramping. Then I got a garmin 935 with HRM, plugs into cadence I figured out the issue fairly quickly. Old single speeder now on a geared full suspension bike I was pushing too big a gear at too low a cadence. I THOUGHT my cadence was higher and my HR lower, it was the opposite. I ended up re-gearing the bike and learning to spin better. I'm happy I did as the actual event would have been HELL with the way I was riding previous.

Of course discipline, best practices and being in touch with your body get you 80% of the way there, maybe more. But having some specific data points can do wonders.

Well cool, but:
1) that's a HR and cadance monitor. The fitbit does none of that. It's a pedomenter on your wrist. It can tell whether you moved during sleep.
2) That's a pretty serious athletic use, I barely understand most of it. I was thinking more in the realm of normal people's daily lives..

I wasn't defending the fitbit specifically, just tech in general. I'm not TOTALLY with GuitarSTV's anti-tech stance, but I'm definitely of the opinion that anyone wanting to be fit and healthy needs to dial in good eating, sleeping and exercise habits IN THAT ORDER before they think about putting a cherry on top with supplements, electronic trackers, etc.

GuitarStv

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Re: Permission to buy a Fitbit
« Reply #93 on: February 16, 2018, 10:17:05 AM »
FWIW, (and cell phone issue aside) I'm not really anti-tech.  If you're doing indoor training on a bike for example, having a power meter makes a lot of sense.  I can understand how someone might want to track heart rate while jogging to gauge effort.  My concern is with people who start to believe they can't live without these gadgets, or who become so dependent upon them that they won't train without.

If you want to get really, really good at something (pretty much anything) you just need to do it.  Over and over, little by little, you will excel at it.  Focusing on the gear and the technology available first and foremost is like eating the pepper and forgetting the steak.

seanc0x0

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Re: Permission to buy a Fitbit
« Reply #94 on: February 16, 2018, 10:48:38 AM »
Got an example for you. I'm a mountain biker and was training for a 12 hour epic with a lot of climbing.  I noticed that I was pretty consistently cramping  on climbs at the tail end of training rides. I was thinking I wasn't fueling well enough or maybe just getting old, I was just dealing with the cramping. Then I got a garmin 935 with HRM, plugs into cadence I figured out the issue fairly quickly. Old single speeder now on a geared full suspension bike I was pushing too big a gear at too low a cadence. I THOUGHT my cadence was higher and my HR lower, it was the opposite. I ended up re-gearing the bike and learning to spin better. I'm happy I did as the actual event would have been HELL with the way I was riding previous.

Of course discipline, best practices and being in touch with your body get you 80% of the way there, maybe more. But having some specific data points can do wonders.

Well cool, but:
1) that's a HR and cadance monitor. The fitbit does none of that. It's a pedomenter on your wrist. It can tell whether you moved during sleep.
2) That's a pretty serious athletic use, I barely understand most of it. I was thinking more in the realm of normal people's daily lives..

Some Fitbit models have a heart rate monitor.

I'll chime in here since I have a Fitbit (work pays for it, I just have to pay tax, so why not).  Since I've gotten my Fitbit, I move a lot more, especially during the workday. I have a goal set and always try to hit it on workdays. It also has a feature where if I haven't moved for an hour, it'll remind me to get up and move/stretch a bit. I find this quite useful as it prevents me from sitting still so long I start to stiffen up.  It's also helped me keep track of things such as weight, calorie intake, and exercise such that I've lost about 50lbs over the last 4 years. I could have done all this without it, but I'd say I've gotten value from it.

All that said, if I wasn't getting one for almost free, there's no way I'd bother.  The data is nifty, but not really worth the price it'd have cost me.  Especially since I've gone through 3 in the last 5 years, they don't seem to hold up well. For comparison, I still have my old Timex my parents gave me for graduating from high-school in 1996 and it's working fine.

kiwi

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Re: Permission to buy a Fitbit
« Reply #95 on: February 16, 2018, 10:23:34 PM »
Forget the Fitbit! Buy the Jawbone Up on Amazon - $8.99! I was thinking about a step tracker for a long time, but didn't want to spend the money.

The company is bankrupt, but the device works great, the corresponding app works great, and heck, it's only $8.99. Also, it's a tiny little device, and you don't need to charge it every day, you just change the battery every 3 months or so.

I'm sold on it. I exercised regularly before, but it's definitely motivating to see the step count go up, and get the little fireworks when you've gotten to your goal.


big_slacker

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Re: Permission to buy a Fitbit
« Reply #96 on: February 17, 2018, 08:00:46 AM »
FWIW, (and cell phone issue aside) I'm not really anti-tech.  If you're doing indoor training on a bike for example, having a power meter makes a lot of sense.  I can understand how someone might want to track heart rate while jogging to gauge effort.  My concern is with people who start to believe they can't live without these gadgets, or who become so dependent upon them that they won't train without.

If you want to get really, really good at something (pretty much anything) you just need to do it.  Over and over, little by little, you will excel at it.  Focusing on the gear and the technology available first and foremost is like eating the pepper and forgetting the steak.

Totally agree, we're saying the same thing. Proper fundamentals and then seat time is the key to going from beginner to early advanced in the least amount of time, almost without fail across most disciplines. The rest you can decide on once you're good.

SachaFiscal

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Re: Permission to buy a Fitbit
« Reply #97 on: February 17, 2018, 08:36:48 AM »
I got a fitbit as a gift from work one year and it wasn't all that it's cracked up to be. I gave it to my husband and he no longer uses it.  It had to be charged all the time (seemed like a lot).  It also seemed to track washing dishes as steps. Also the strap broke a couple of times within that year and he had to get replacements. I think a step tracker is a good idea if it will make you walk and move more but the fitbit product is not worth it in my opinion.  You might as well just use an app on your phone or if you don't like carrying your phone around just get a simple small step tracker (less expensive).