Author Topic: paper / mail is the most diabolical thing ever invented for modern society  (Read 4347 times)

nemesis

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Used to be mail would be something you'd look forward to.  Now it seems like we are drowning in unwanted (& a small fraction wanted) mail / paper.

I'm not a hoarder, but if you look at my paper pile, you'd think I'm the biggest hoarder on the freaking planet.

I've gone electronic with everything as much as I can, have opted out of every marketing thing I can, but despite this, I'm still being buried in mail / paper.

Here is just a sample of crap that came over during the holidays while I was visiting family out of town:

-Misc. insurance notices
-a smattering of letters / postcards from airlines, hotels, rental car agencies I am elite members of.   (Trash / recycle)
-letters / holiday cards from realtors, "buy your house for cash now" solicitations. (trash)
-reminder notices from the Vet, eye doctor, etc... I already get this via email, why mail me this useless shit?
-notices from my cable company (promos, renew contract etc), utility companies (energy use, sell useless extra water / electrical warranties, etc).
-a bunch of cards / coupons from retailers I may have ordered from once or twice in my life (JoS A Bank, Dell, any other mail order catalog service you can think of).
-the local area coupon mailers, stack of local grocery newspaper type ads (Sprouts, local grocery stores)
-various newletters from kids' school, local dentists, etc.
-various bank / credit card notices
-college alumni magazines, letters of solicitation to donate, newsletters
-CostCo magazine, AAA magazine (I pay for no magazine explicitly because I hate having it sit for months before being tossed)
-various tax notices for property, etc.
-oh get this - a hand written letter from a Jehova Witness encouraging me to study the bible...WTF
-a bunch of other crap I probably forgot to list and mention that we all get no matter what.

I hate the fact that I can block junk mail to my email, but I am powerless to block junk mail to my mailbox.  It's flooded with the usual crap that everyone gets, but is powerless to do anything about.

Where else in life can people just send you crap and FORCE you to deal with this crap, whether you are home or not?? And the volume is ever increasing.  In a world where people fight to inundate you with their junk, electronically, now they inundate your mailbox (and house) with this crap.  And you can't ignore it, in fear of missing something important in the mail (needle in the haystack).

Postal mail is as outdated and ancient as the fax machine, horse & buggy, and voicemail.  I hope this thing dies in the future as the younger generations get wise to how efficient electronic delivery is, and how you're not tied down to a physical location.

The pure waste of resources (trees to cut paper, ink to print this junk, energy to deliver this stuff, your valuable time to go through this crap) is astonishing.  I'm seething in anger at this crap, even as I try to simplify my life and devote less time and energy to this stuff that detracts from your life / focus / attention.

It should be a CRIME to send people physical junk and unwanted crap!!!  It seems like we as  society just suffer in silence with this junk...one of those annoying life pains you just deal with on a day to day basis.  It shouldn't be this way.
« Last Edit: January 09, 2018, 08:03:05 AM by nemesis »

frugalnacho

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I want out. 

Obligatory Kramer clip.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Hox-ni8geIw

barbaz

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Every year, every single insurance I have sends me a letter saying “good news, we increased your benefits (small print: and your premiums). Here are 5 pages explaining what has changed”. Then I have to send a letter with “no thanks”, and then they write “we’re so sorry you don’t want to give us more money, here are 5 pages explaining how everything is just as it was before”. Efficiency!

TheWifeHalf

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Anyone send mail to me that includes a return envelope, postage paid?  It comes back to them often with cardboard in it, or at least what they sent me, folded up.
I like my mail man. He started being a mailman the year TheHusbandHalf got his current job (our lives would have been so much different if he hadn't gotten it) I want the mailman to stay employed.

I don't know if it makes a difference, but we have days now of no mail!

PoutineLover

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Junk mail is super annoying and goes straight in the trash. The only exception is if its straight up free stuff. One year I got a free waffle coupon, no purchase required, no expiry, and I pulled about 20 out of my buildings recycling, and had free waffles for a year or so.
I love getting postcards and personal letters, it feels way more thoughtful than any other communication and the postcards get added to my bulletin board.
I cancel any and all paper bills and notices from services I subscribe to, annoying the first time but usually they don't send any more.
One huge bother was asking my insurance provider by email for the exact total and billing info so I could pay online, receiving no response, then coming home from vacation to a bill that was now overdue. Every previous communication had been by email, this shouldn't have happened. I switched providers the next year and was happily able to pay online and it was no hassle whatsoever.

Dabnasty

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Junk mail is super annoying and goes straight in the trash. The only exception is if its straight up free stuff. One year I got a free waffle coupon, no purchase required, no expiry, and I pulled about 20 out of my buildings recycling, and had free waffles for a year or so.
I love getting postcards and personal letters, it feels way more thoughtful than any other communication and the postcards get added to my bulletin board.
I cancel any and all paper bills and notices from services I subscribe to, annoying the first time but usually they don't send any more.
One huge bother was asking my insurance provider by email for the exact total and billing info so I could pay online, receiving no response, then coming home from vacation to a bill that was now overdue. Every previous communication had been by email, this shouldn't have happened. I switched providers the next year and was happily able to pay online and it was no hassle whatsoever.
Lol, did the same thing when a new Jersey Mike's opened up nearby. Coupons for a free regular sub and people just threw them away. I don't think we ever ate there without a coupon and the majority of them were no purchase necessary.

That being said I would gladly give up the rare chance of freebies to also get rid of the other junk mail. So many catalogs this year from places I've never even heard of.

Livingthedream55

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Anyone send mail to me that includes a return envelope, postage paid?  It comes back to them often with cardboard in it, or at least what they sent me, folded up.
I like my mail man. He started being a mailman the year TheHusbandHalf got his current job (our lives would have been so much different if he hadn't gotten it) I want the mailman to stay employed.

I don't know if it makes a difference, but we have days now of no mail!

I use postage paid envelopes to request I get removed from their list. Also works for postage paid postcards (usually found in the magazines I never ordered!!)

Sibley

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Well, this will help.

http://www.ecocycle.org/junkmail


For junking up your house - many people seem to put it down intending to deal with it later, and later ends up being months later by which time you have a seriously large pile. So stop putting it aside for "later", just deal with it right away. It takes me a minute to quickly sort through my mail, toss the junk and then allocate the rest.

TheWifeHalf

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I use postage paid envelopes to request I get removed from their list. Also works for postage paid postcards (usually found in the magazines I never ordered!!)

Good idea, I'm going to do that

nemesis

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Well, this will help.

http://www.ecocycle.org/junkmail


For junking up your house - many people seem to put it down intending to deal with it later, and later ends up being months later by which time you have a seriously large pile. So stop putting it aside for "later", just deal with it right away. It takes me a minute to quickly sort through my mail, toss the junk and then allocate the rest.
Been there, done that. In fact, my credit has been frozen for years so I can't even get credit card offers and the like.

That's the low hanging easy fruit.  I still get crap well beyond that stuff.

Paper based mail just needs to die.  It's so ancient and archaic, annoying and single location based. Terrible for people who don't stay home all that much and tend to lose paper or have tons of clutter of paper.

ketojenn

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Re: paper / mail is the most diabolical thing ever invented for modern society
« Reply #10 on: January 10, 2018, 07:42:01 AM »
There are many people who depend on paper based mail.  Don't like the junk, toss it, recycle it, or send it back, no need to inconvenience others because of something YOU find unnecessary.  I live in a tiny town, I run the post office.  I toss the junk for those who ask me to before I box it, others just toss it in the lobby can, no big deal.  Some love their junk mail, look forward to it.  Others depend on the mail for sending and receiving bills, not all companies out here allow you to pay online, or they charge for it.  I'll spend $0.49 to mail a check before I'm going to spend $2 for the privilege of paying my water bill.  Sorry, it's not one sized fits all.  And that junk?  It keeps the post office running, employing a lot of people who don't have hundreds of thousands of dollars in the bank.

nemesis

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Re: paper / mail is the most diabolical thing ever invented for modern society
« Reply #11 on: January 10, 2018, 07:44:24 AM »
There are many people who depend on paper based mail.  Don't like the junk, toss it, recycle it, or send it back, no need to inconvenience others because of something YOU find unnecessary.  I live in a tiny town, I run the post office.  I toss the junk for those who ask me to before I box it, others just toss it in the lobby can, no big deal.  Some love their junk mail, look forward to it.  Others depend on the mail for sending and receiving bills, not all companies out here allow you to pay online, or they charge for it.  I'll spend $0.49 to mail a check before I'm going to spend $2 for the privilege of paying my water bill.  Sorry, it's not one sized fits all.  And that junk?  It keeps the post office running, employing a lot of people who don't have hundreds of thousands of dollars in the bank.
Good point, while we're at it, let's bring back the horse and buggy. That kept horses employed and wagon drivers employed.  They all need jobs right?

I'm not arguing against *some* need for physical mail, but the fact you are spammed by junk mail and have zero control over it is insane. 

The argument that it keeps people employed is understandable, but irrelevant.  Technology has made tons of things obsolete.  Mail is one of those. 

The Post Office needs to innovate to stay alive.  The new "informed delivery" service is a step in the right direction.  But they need to remove the need for someone to be home at a particular location to get mail *the entire bloody year*.  When my retired folks travel, they go for 2-3 months at a time on cruises, visit other countries.  Mail is a particular pain point for them, as they need to rely on neighbors, friends to deal with the trash, and every once in a while a critical piece of mail.

Imagine if you had to be home with an old landline just to make or receive calls, and phone companies never progressed to cellphones.  That would be painful.

The existing mail system needs to die. It needs to innovate to add value to people, not make their life a pain.
« Last Edit: January 10, 2018, 07:46:46 AM by nemesis »

Retire-Canada

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Re: paper / mail is the most diabolical thing ever invented for modern society
« Reply #12 on: January 10, 2018, 07:59:45 AM »
I get maybe 2 or 3 pieces of paper mail a week and most of that is voluntary since I keep paper records for my business. I just don't sign up for shit I don't want and if people send me stuff I don't want I contact them and tell them for the love of God please stop. So far it hasn't been an issue.

nemesis

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Re: paper / mail is the most diabolical thing ever invented for modern society
« Reply #13 on: January 10, 2018, 08:20:36 AM »
I get maybe 2 or 3 pieces of paper mail a week and most of that is voluntary since I keep paper records for my business. I just don't sign up for shit I don't want and if people send me stuff I don't want I contact them and tell them for the love of God please stop. So far it hasn't been an issue.
Here in the US, local businesses pay the post office to mail people regular junk mail. So we got newspaper like ads of local groceries, coupons, etc.  There is literally *no way* to opt out of this.  I've researched and opted out of as much junk as I can, and this stuff keeps on coming.

The businesses will pay the USPS to spam entire zip codes that are local to them.  They have no names or addresses on them, only the local area zip code.  So your mailbox gets inundated regardless of what you do.

Here's an article from 2011 about USPS easing regulations for marketers:  https://www.treehugger.com/culture/us-postal-service-eases-junk-mail-restrictions-how-to-spare-your-mailbox.html

Quote
According to the Wall Street Journal article, "major credit-card firms mailed out 1.2 billion new card offers in the third quarter last year, up from just 391 million over the same period in 2009." If junk mail is making a come-back, it's time to strengthen your defenses against it.
holy shit, in 2010 alone there were 1.2 billion new card offers, that's 3 letters for every single American in the US!!

RyanAtTanagra

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Re: paper / mail is the most diabolical thing ever invented for modern society
« Reply #14 on: January 10, 2018, 12:23:32 PM »
There are many people who depend on paper based mail.  Don't like the junk, toss it, recycle it, or send it back, no need to inconvenience others because of something YOU find unnecessary.  I live in a tiny town, I run the post office.  I toss the junk for those who ask me to before I box it, others just toss it in the lobby can, no big deal.  Some love their junk mail, look forward to it.  Others depend on the mail for sending and receiving bills, not all companies out here allow you to pay online, or they charge for it.  I'll spend $0.49 to mail a check before I'm going to spend $2 for the privilege of paying my water bill.  Sorry, it's not one sized fits all.  And that junk?  It keeps the post office running, employing a lot of people who don't have hundreds of thousands of dollars in the bank.
Good point, while we're at it, let's bring back the horse and buggy. That kept horses employed and wagon drivers employed.  They all need jobs right?

I'm not arguing against *some* need for physical mail, but the fact you are spammed by junk mail and have zero control over it is insane. 

The argument that it keeps people employed is understandable, but irrelevant.  Technology has made tons of things obsolete.  Mail is one of those. 

....

The existing mail system needs to die. It needs to innovate to add value to people, not make their life a pain.

I agree, 'it keeps people employed' is a horrible justification to keep an old industry alive.  I know it's hard to hear as someone in that industry, but you can use that to justify keeping coal as our country's primary means of energy consumption, or car dealerships as the only way to buy a car, or any number of things that had/have to go away.

Also, 'some people need it' is a bad reason to force everyone to use something.  Just let paper mail be opt out.  If I decide I hate using email I can just stop checking it, or delete my account.  Along those lines, what happens if someone just stops emptying their mailbox and lets it fill up?  I try to do that with my current mailbox but after a couple weeks my roommate grabs all the mail :-(

soccerluvof4

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Re: paper / mail is the most diabolical thing ever invented for modern society
« Reply #15 on: January 10, 2018, 12:41:58 PM »
I don't see a reason snail mail needs to be delivered everyday either. People can easily adjust to twice a week even if "They need it" and or there is still a priority option.  The post office is simply out dated and old school. Dont want to see anyone lose there Jobs but its seen its day

lizzzi

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Re: paper / mail is the most diabolical thing ever invented for modern society
« Reply #16 on: January 10, 2018, 01:04:46 PM »
I just throw the junk mail in the dumpster before I even go into my apartment. I love the U.S.P.S. for bringing me things like hand-made Christmas decorations from my grandchildren or nice cards from friends and relatives I care about. And most of my Amazon Prime stuff is delivered by the post office. I needed to send a Mass card to England when one of my relatives died, and somehow the email condolences didn't seem quite personal enough--so the paper card went in a paper envelope with a postage stamp to the U.K. And I got a big thrill early in December when I got a hand-written thank you letter from India--with real Indian stamps on it--from one of our former clergyman. I mean, India! It just seemed so exotic and cool sitting there in my mailbox, and the nice, handwritten letter was just so...I don't know...tactile, maybe is the right word.  More three-dimensional than an email. I am old enough to have a foot on both sides of the digital divide, but I know that it isn't unusual for the elderly or sometimes the very-low-income population  not to be on line. So I vote for keeping delivery of old-fashioned, non-digital mail an available service that remains viable.

katsiki

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Re: paper / mail is the most diabolical thing ever invented for modern society
« Reply #17 on: January 10, 2018, 01:12:43 PM »
I don't see a reason snail mail needs to be delivered everyday either. People can easily adjust to twice a week even if "They need it" and or there is still a priority option.  The post office is simply out dated and old school. Dont want to see anyone lose there Jobs but its seen its day

+1  I think there was a proposal to reduce delivery days a while back.  I think there was too much back to get it through.  *Probably from the "big junk mail lobby".  :)

FiftyIsTheNewTwenty

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Re: paper / mail is the most diabolical thing ever invented for modern society
« Reply #18 on: January 10, 2018, 01:13:40 PM »
I let mail go for days, unless I'm expecting something -- packages from Amazon, etc.  Everything that matters is electronic, though the paper keeps coming.

What amazes me is, how much CapitalOne spends trying to get my mom's business.  With printing and postage  they're easily spending over $100/year to court a very subprime customer, who may die before she defaults (both being inevitable).

My point is, this is a huge cost, and likely loss, for legacy businesses.  Those doing better market research with all the "big data" that's available now, who can figure out where marketing funds should be spent, or not spent, could really kick some ass.

nemesis

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Re: paper / mail is the most diabolical thing ever invented for modern society
« Reply #19 on: January 10, 2018, 01:17:37 PM »
I just throw the junk mail in the dumpster before I even go into my apartment. I love the U.S.P.S. for bringing me things like hand-made Christmas decorations from my grandchildren or nice cards from friends and relatives I care about. And most of my Amazon Prime stuff is delivered by the post office. I needed to send a Mass card to England when one of my relatives died, and somehow the email condolences didn't seem quite personal enough--so the paper card went in a paper envelope with a postage stamp to the U.K. And I got a big thrill early in December when I got a hand-written thank you letter from India--with real Indian stamps on it--from one of our former clergyman. I mean, India! It just seemed so exotic and cool sitting there in my mailbox, and the nice, handwritten letter was just so...I don't know...tactile, maybe is the right word.  More three-dimensional than an email. I am old enough to have a foot on both sides of the digital divide, but I know that it isn't unusual for the elderly or sometimes the very-low-income population  not to be on line. So I vote for keeping delivery of old-fashioned, non-digital mail an available service that remains viable.
Be careful about what you toss in the dumpster.  This guy tore up a credit card application, then taped it back together and sent it in and got approved for a credit card (which was sent to a different address!):  http://www.cockeyed.com/citizen/creditcard/application.shtml

The fact you can't easily and safely dispose of your junk mail is a concern.  A lot of it has your name and address on it. You don't want nefarious parties doing shady things with such mail.

So once again something that shouldn't be your problem becomes your problem, because it's targeted at you with your personal information in it. You can't ignore the problem and hope it goes away. You are forced to deal with it.
« Last Edit: January 10, 2018, 01:19:27 PM by nemesis »

soccerluvof4

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Re: paper / mail is the most diabolical thing ever invented for modern society
« Reply #20 on: January 10, 2018, 02:34:08 PM »
I don't see a reason snail mail needs to be delivered everyday either. People can easily adjust to twice a week even if "They need it" and or there is still a priority option.  The post office is simply out dated and old school. Dont want to see anyone lose there Jobs but its seen its day

+1  I think there was a proposal to reduce delivery days a while back.  I think there was too much back to get it through.  *Probably from the "big junk mail lobby".  :)




yea that and they were delinquent on making payments right after the crash for the longest time.  Should just be privatized.

Just Joe

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Re: paper / mail is the most diabolical thing ever invented for modern society
« Reply #21 on: January 11, 2018, 11:00:18 AM »
We're pretty efficient at walking into our house, and flinging the junk mail straight into the shredder bin. There is a 50/50 chance that we'll shred it or use it to start a fire in the firepit.

ozbeach

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Re: paper / mail is the most diabolical thing ever invented for modern society
« Reply #22 on: January 11, 2018, 03:48:48 PM »
I don't see a reason snail mail needs to be delivered everyday either. People can easily adjust to twice a week even if "They need it" and or there is still a priority option.  The post office is simply out dated and old school. Dont want to see anyone lose there Jobs but its seen its day

This has pretty much happened in Australia. They introduced a tiered system -- regular and express mail, and increased the charges for both. A regular letter now costs $1.00 and delivery is six days. In theory, they are still delivering five days per week, but I am sure the postie where I live only comes twice a week (admittedly in a regional area not metro).

Most businesses started charging for mail deliveries, so bank statements and utility bills now cost you a dollar or two, or you opt to receive electronically for free.

I also think we have laws around junk mail -- if you have a notice on your letterbox they are not allowed to deliver.

tldr: I would be lucky to get more than one letter every two or three months in my letterbox.

nemesis

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Re: paper / mail is the most diabolical thing ever invented for modern society
« Reply #23 on: January 11, 2018, 03:51:15 PM »
I don't see a reason snail mail needs to be delivered everyday either. People can easily adjust to twice a week even if "They need it" and or there is still a priority option.  The post office is simply out dated and old school. Dont want to see anyone lose there Jobs but its seen its day

This has pretty much happened in Australia. They introduced a tiered system -- regular and express mail, and increased the charges for both. A regular letter now costs $1.00 and delivery is six days. In theory, they are still delivering five days per week, but I am sure the postie where I live only comes twice a week (admittedly in a regional area not metro).

Most businesses started charging for mail deliveries, so bank statements and utility bills now cost you a dollar or two, or you opt to receive electronically for free.

I also think we have laws around junk mail -- if you have a notice on your letterbox they are not allowed to deliver.

tldr: I would be lucky to get more than one letter every two or three months in my letterbox.
What happened to all the postman who lost their jobs?

JLee

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Re: paper / mail is the most diabolical thing ever invented for modern society
« Reply #24 on: January 11, 2018, 04:52:48 PM »
I just throw the junk mail in the dumpster before I even go into my apartment. I love the U.S.P.S. for bringing me things like hand-made Christmas decorations from my grandchildren or nice cards from friends and relatives I care about. And most of my Amazon Prime stuff is delivered by the post office. I needed to send a Mass card to England when one of my relatives died, and somehow the email condolences didn't seem quite personal enough--so the paper card went in a paper envelope with a postage stamp to the U.K. And I got a big thrill early in December when I got a hand-written thank you letter from India--with real Indian stamps on it--from one of our former clergyman. I mean, India! It just seemed so exotic and cool sitting there in my mailbox, and the nice, handwritten letter was just so...I don't know...tactile, maybe is the right word.  More three-dimensional than an email. I am old enough to have a foot on both sides of the digital divide, but I know that it isn't unusual for the elderly or sometimes the very-low-income population  not to be on line. So I vote for keeping delivery of old-fashioned, non-digital mail an available service that remains viable.
Be careful about what you toss in the dumpster.  This guy tore up a credit card application, then taped it back together and sent it in and got approved for a credit card (which was sent to a different address!):  http://www.cockeyed.com/citizen/creditcard/application.shtml

The fact you can't easily and safely dispose of your junk mail is a concern. A lot of it has your name and address on it. You don't want nefarious parties doing shady things with such mail.

So once again something that shouldn't be your problem becomes your problem, because it's targeted at you with your personal information in it. You can't ignore the problem and hope it goes away. You are forced to deal with it.

Sure you can.

nemesis

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Re: paper / mail is the most diabolical thing ever invented for modern society
« Reply #25 on: January 11, 2018, 04:53:50 PM »
I just throw the junk mail in the dumpster before I even go into my apartment. I love the U.S.P.S. for bringing me things like hand-made Christmas decorations from my grandchildren or nice cards from friends and relatives I care about. And most of my Amazon Prime stuff is delivered by the post office. I needed to send a Mass card to England when one of my relatives died, and somehow the email condolences didn't seem quite personal enough--so the paper card went in a paper envelope with a postage stamp to the U.K. And I got a big thrill early in December when I got a hand-written thank you letter from India--with real Indian stamps on it--from one of our former clergyman. I mean, India! It just seemed so exotic and cool sitting there in my mailbox, and the nice, handwritten letter was just so...I don't know...tactile, maybe is the right word.  More three-dimensional than an email. I am old enough to have a foot on both sides of the digital divide, but I know that it isn't unusual for the elderly or sometimes the very-low-income population  not to be on line. So I vote for keeping delivery of old-fashioned, non-digital mail an available service that remains viable.
Be careful about what you toss in the dumpster.  This guy tore up a credit card application, then taped it back together and sent it in and got approved for a credit card (which was sent to a different address!):  http://www.cockeyed.com/citizen/creditcard/application.shtml

The fact you can't easily and safely dispose of your junk mail is a concern. A lot of it has your name and address on it. You don't want nefarious parties doing shady things with such mail.

So once again something that shouldn't be your problem becomes your problem, because it's targeted at you with your personal information in it. You can't ignore the problem and hope it goes away. You are forced to deal with it.

Sure you can.
I've destroyed about 5 of these suckers from CostCo.  Thank goodness for their return policy!

RyanAtTanagra

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Re: paper / mail is the most diabolical thing ever invented for modern society
« Reply #26 on: January 11, 2018, 05:00:31 PM »
tldr: I would be lucky to get more than one letter every two or three months in my letterbox.

I hate you :-(

driftwood

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Re: paper / mail is the most diabolical thing ever invented for modern society
« Reply #27 on: January 12, 2018, 01:51:53 AM »
I hate the junk mail too... how would they like it if I showed up to their home and handed them garbage? What makes it wrong is that instead of having a company rep walk up to you and offer a flyer (which you could turn down, or even ignore the person), you come home to this stuff being pushed through your door or left in your mailbox.  For most of us, they are literally delivering garbage, which we then have to dispose of.

Junk mail goes immediately in the recycle bin or trash. Why would you let it pile up and store it?

For those who think it's fine because it keeps postal folks employed... um, sure it does, but is that really a reason to keep something around? Did we keep slavery around just to keep the slaving industry employees employed?  I could pay someone to deliver shit to your house every week, and build an industry on it, but keeping people employed doesn't really justify keeping a practice or industry going.


soccerluvof4

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Re: paper / mail is the most diabolical thing ever invented for modern society
« Reply #28 on: January 12, 2018, 03:24:14 AM »
I hate the junk mail too... how would they like it if I showed up to their home and handed them garbage? What makes it wrong is that instead of having a company rep walk up to you and offer a flyer (which you could turn down, or even ignore the person), you come home to this stuff being pushed through your door or left in your mailbox.  For most of us, they are literally delivering garbage, which we then have to dispose of.

Junk mail goes immediately in the recycle bin or trash. Why would you let it pile up and store it?

For those who think it's fine because it keeps postal folks employed... um, sure it does, but is that really a reason to keep something around? Did we keep slavery around just to keep the slaving industry employees employed?  I could pay someone to deliver shit to your house every week, and build an industry on it, but keeping people employed doesn't really justify keeping a practice or industry going.


Yea, you don't keep the post office open to keep people their jobs. Streamline it over a period of time two 3 days a week and help those people find jobs if need be. Now is the time to do it. Like i said , I dont want to see people lose their jobs BUT you have to run it like a profitable business or at the very least more efficient. So we create garbage so people can have jobs?! hmmmm talk about environment friendly. Or get someone who really knows the business , a hire up from Fex-ex or UPS and turn it into a profit machine. They way it is now and had been is crap. Have to change with the times.

Sibley

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Re: paper / mail is the most diabolical thing ever invented for modern society
« Reply #29 on: January 12, 2018, 08:48:57 AM »
I'm fine with cutting back the USPS, but only AFTER we make sure that internet access is available, reliable, and affordable for everyone in the US. Free ebills don't do you any good if you can't access the internet.

Sayonara925

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Re: paper / mail is the most diabolical thing ever invented for modern society
« Reply #30 on: January 12, 2018, 09:22:22 AM »
There are many people who depend on paper based mail.  Don't like the junk, toss it, recycle it, or send it back, no need to inconvenience others because of something YOU find unnecessary.  I live in a tiny town, I run the post office.  I toss the junk for those who ask me to before I box it, others just toss it in the lobby can, no big deal.  Some love their junk mail, look forward to it.

Reminded me of this video that really got to me...

https://youtu.be/pmARFs-w84c

CheapScholar

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Re: paper / mail is the most diabolical thing ever invented for modern society
« Reply #31 on: January 12, 2018, 09:22:59 AM »
I was lucky to get 29 free chipotle coupons when a chipotle opened when I was a struggling law student.  Lived in a huge apartment complex so it was easy to get the coupons, as there were trash bins next to the mailboxes.  Here's the kicker, the coupons expired in about 3 weeks.  Wife and I ate burritos nearly every day.  Gave a few coupons to friends.  Didn't go back to chipotle for nearly a year after that.

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Re: paper / mail is the most diabolical thing ever invented for modern society
« Reply #32 on: January 12, 2018, 09:31:36 AM »
I just throw the junk mail in the dumpster before I even go into my apartment. I love the U.S.P.S. for bringing me things like hand-made Christmas decorations from my grandchildren or nice cards from friends and relatives I care about. And most of my Amazon Prime stuff is delivered by the post office. I needed to send a Mass card to England when one of my relatives died, and somehow the email condolences didn't seem quite personal enough--so the paper card went in a paper envelope with a postage stamp to the U.K. And I got a big thrill early in December when I got a hand-written thank you letter from India--with real Indian stamps on it--from one of our former clergyman. I mean, India! It just seemed so exotic and cool sitting there in my mailbox, and the nice, handwritten letter was just so...I don't know...tactile, maybe is the right word.  More three-dimensional than an email. I am old enough to have a foot on both sides of the digital divide, but I know that it isn't unusual for the elderly or sometimes the very-low-income population  not to be on line. So I vote for keeping delivery of old-fashioned, non-digital mail an available service that remains viable.
Be careful about what you toss in the dumpster.  This guy tore up a credit card application, then taped it back together and sent it in and got approved for a credit card (which was sent to a different address!):  http://www.cockeyed.com/citizen/creditcard/application.shtml

The fact you can't easily and safely dispose of your junk mail is a concern. A lot of it has your name and address on it. You don't want nefarious parties doing shady things with such mail.

So once again something that shouldn't be your problem becomes your problem, because it's targeted at you with your personal information in it. You can't ignore the problem and hope it goes away. You are forced to deal with it.

Sure you can.

While I have a shredder and make frequent use out of it, in principle it's troubling how much unsolicited mail (aka credit card applications) are identity theft cases waiting to happen.  Why must I be so careful with how I handle mail I never asked for?

joonifloofeefloo

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Re: paper / mail is the most diabolical thing ever invented for modern society
« Reply #33 on: January 12, 2018, 09:36:43 AM »
Here in the US, local businesses pay the post office to mail people regular junk mail. So we got newspaper like ads of local groceries, coupons, etc.  There is literally *no way* to opt out of this.  I've researched and opted out of as much junk as I can, and this stuff keeps on coming.

The businesses will pay the USPS to spam entire zip codes that are local to them.  They have no names or addresses on them, only the local area zip code.  So your mailbox gets inundated regardless of what you do.

Canada too.

I use a post office box, and put a red sticker on it to indicate "no unaddressed mail please." Works awesome.
Is there a version of the red sticker option where you guys live?

Paying for a post office box resolved countless issues for me, made life so much easier and cheaper!
My blurb on it: https://brainquirkcash.com/2016/05/19/mailbox-worth-its-weight-in-gold/

Miss Piggy

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Re: paper / mail is the most diabolical thing ever invented for modern society
« Reply #34 on: January 12, 2018, 09:51:32 AM »
Well, this will help.

http://www.ecocycle.org/junkmail


For junking up your house - many people seem to put it down intending to deal with it later, and later ends up being months later by which time you have a seriously large pile. So stop putting it aside for "later", just deal with it right away. It takes me a minute to quickly sort through my mail, toss the junk and then allocate the rest.

Our recycling bin is outside. Most of this mail never even makes it into the house anymore. It's quite nice.

CheapScholar

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Re: paper / mail is the most diabolical thing ever invented for modern society
« Reply #35 on: January 12, 2018, 09:55:41 AM »
I've made it a general rule to take my mail out of the box in mornings and then TO WORK to be sorted and recycled there. That way it can never build up in my house.  Plus, kills a few minutes at work.

katsiki

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Re: paper / mail is the most diabolical thing ever invented for modern society
« Reply #36 on: January 12, 2018, 09:59:36 AM »
I use a post office box, and put a red sticker on it to indicate "no unaddressed mail please." Works awesome.
Is there a version of the red sticker option where you guys live?

Paying for a post office box resolved countless issues for me, made life so much easier and cheaper!
My blurb on it: https://brainquirkcash.com/2016/05/19/mailbox-worth-its-weight-in-gold/

+1.  I use a PO box for a few reasons.  I have found I really like picking up the mail 2-3 times per week.  I can trash the ads at the post office as well!

Travis

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Re: paper / mail is the most diabolical thing ever invented for modern society
« Reply #37 on: January 12, 2018, 10:01:27 AM »
Well, this will help.

http://www.ecocycle.org/junkmail


For junking up your house - many people seem to put it down intending to deal with it later, and later ends up being months later by which time you have a seriously large pile. So stop putting it aside for "later", just deal with it right away. It takes me a minute to quickly sort through my mail, toss the junk and then allocate the rest.

Our recycling bin is outside. Most of this mail never even makes it into the house anymore. It's quite nice.

Mine is in the garage next to my car. My evening routine is to park the car, get the mail, walk through the garage and before I step foot in the house the junk is in the bin.  A couple nights ago my son asked me if we had mail.  I answered "No, but there was stuff in the mailbox."  He recognized instantly that I meant junk. 

kite

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Re: paper / mail is the most diabolical thing ever invented for modern society
« Reply #38 on: January 12, 2018, 11:13:09 AM »
I've been migrating back to analog for many things, and don't mind the physical mail.    Now that we are responsible for elderly parents, we realize that it's too many passwords to try to do it all electronically.  Having a physical bill is easier for our 80+ year old relations with limited eyesight.  They don't need technology upgrades, firewalls, etc.  Physical bills, physical checks, very simple.   

As far as the junk mail, it's easy to recycle.  Glossy stuff with no address goes straight into the bin.  White papers, things with addresses and old bills/bank statements get shredded and the shreds go into our composter. 

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Re: paper / mail is the most diabolical thing ever invented for modern society
« Reply #39 on: January 12, 2018, 04:42:44 PM »
I was just thinking, sadly, how little mail there is these days. I used to look forward to the mail every day!

Now, whatever comes I sort through and toss most of it directly into the recycling. The mailman also drops off most of my amazon stuff.

joonifloofeefloo

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Re: paper / mail is the most diabolical thing ever invented for modern society
« Reply #40 on: January 12, 2018, 07:01:58 PM »
Things I still get by paper by requirement:
*school grant info -on carbon, no less!!

Things I still get by paper, by preference:
*copies of (autopaid) bills -hardcopies really help me at tax time, and I can scan the whole tax year into one folder (approx 4/mo)
*cards, personal letters
*old-fashioned cheques

That's it!

Makes mail a happy thing.

NoraLenderbee

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Re: paper / mail is the most diabolical thing ever invented for modern society
« Reply #41 on: January 12, 2018, 07:18:55 PM »
Hyperbole  is the most diabolical thing ever invented for modern society

soccerluvof4

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Re: paper / mail is the most diabolical thing ever invented for modern society
« Reply #42 on: January 13, 2018, 03:20:21 AM »
Things I still get by paper by requirement:
*school grant info -on carbon, no less!!

Things I still get by paper, by preference:
*copies of (autopaid) bills -hardcopies really help me at tax time, and I can scan the whole tax year into one folder (approx 4/mo)
*cards, personal letters
*old-fashioned cheques

That's it!



and these are things that if you got twice a week you would most likely be fine with. Like a Monday Thursday deliver system. People could do sorting and delivering
Makes mail a happy thing.

joonifloofeefloo

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Re: paper / mail is the most diabolical thing ever invented for modern society
« Reply #43 on: January 13, 2018, 08:04:49 AM »
and these are things that if you got twice a week you would most likely be fine with. Like a Monday Thursday deliver system. People could do sorting and delivering
Makes mail a happy thing.

Yes. In fact, currently I choose to get my mail once a month, or most recently after six weeks :)

Imma

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Re: paper / mail is the most diabolical thing ever invented for modern society
« Reply #44 on: January 14, 2018, 08:58:58 AM »
Here in the US, local businesses pay the post office to mail people regular junk mail. So we got newspaper like ads of local groceries, coupons, etc.  There is literally *no way* to opt out of this.  I've researched and opted out of as much junk as I can, and this stuff keeps on coming.

The businesses will pay the USPS to spam entire zip codes that are local to them.  They have no names or addresses on them, only the local area zip code.  So your mailbox gets inundated regardless of what you do.

Canada too.

I use a post office box, and put a red sticker on it to indicate "no unaddressed mail please." Works awesome.
Is there a version of the red sticker option where you guys live?


This is what I have, lots of people have it in my country. I hardly ever get mail. These days, all letters from the government arrive in your online mailbox. I don't get bank or credit card statements anymore. I get our union's magazine once every 8 weeks and another magazine published by an organisation we're members of. And a postcard every now and then, but it seems most people have stopped sending those. Maybe once or twice a year we get coupons from a local pizza place where we once ordered pizza from. 

Rural

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Re: paper / mail is the most diabolical thing ever invented for modern society
« Reply #45 on: January 14, 2018, 11:04:51 AM »
We have a post office box in town, don't even have delivery at home. But without the postal service I would not be able to shop online, full stop. Delivery companies don't make it up to my house.


+1 to whoever said we definitely can't do without until high speed internet is available across the country. I can do less and less with my 1Mbps (on a good day), and I'm one of the lucky ones - I can get that, and can upgrade to 5 or 10 if I pay $2,000 to run new lines. I have neighbors less than half a mile away who can get nothing but metered satellite - if they have a clear view of the southern sky. And if it's not raining.

elysianfields

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Re: paper / mail is the most diabolical thing ever invented for modern society
« Reply #46 on: January 14, 2018, 04:29:39 PM »
If you live in the United States, the Congress has given you the power to prevent unwanted advertisements from coming to your home via USPS.

SCOTUS also struck down a challenge to the law in 1970 in Rowan v. U. S. Post Office Department.

If you receive a solicitation, you simply attach it, opened, to a USPS Form 1500 and the USPS must enter a Prohibitory Order on your behalf.

When we were living in the U. S., I used this to great effect. YMMV.