Author Topic: Mustachian People Problems (just for fun)  (Read 2162835 times)

zolotiyeruki

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Re: Mustachian People Problems (just for fun)
« Reply #6150 on: March 20, 2019, 07:34:14 AM »
I've been told that heat pumps do not function well below -10C, is this true?
I keep hearing people say that more modern air-source heat pumps are effective down at those temperatures, but it's true that they become less efficient.  Ground source heat pumps don't have that problem, but are a lot more expensive to install because of the cost of burying the loops horizontally or drilling multiple wells for vertical loops.

SheWhoWalksAtLunch

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Re: Mustachian People Problems (just for fun)
« Reply #6151 on: March 20, 2019, 08:34:25 AM »

I've been told that heat pumps do not function well below -10C, is this true?

Air-to-air heat pumps work less efficiently the colder it gets. When  the outside temp is +5C, you put in 1kW and it produces 3,5 kW of electricity. When it is -10C, you put in 1 kW and it produces warmth for maybe 1,5 kW. At a certain point it will not produce more than the 1 kW that you put in.


What's happening at low temperatures is, after there is no more heat in the outside air to pump into the house, an electric coil heater switches on to supplement (bump up) the temperature.  At low outdoor temperatures, you are effectively heating your house with an electric hot plate which can get very expensive very quickly depending on your local electricity prices.

Slow&Steady

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Re: Mustachian People Problems (just for fun)
« Reply #6152 on: March 20, 2019, 09:18:48 AM »
I've been told that heat pumps do not function well below -10C, is this true?
I keep hearing people say that more modern air-source heat pumps are effective down at those temperatures, but it's true that they become less efficient.  Ground source heat pumps don't have that problem, but are a lot more expensive to install because of the cost of burying the loops horizontally or drilling multiple wells for vertical loops.

We have a geothermal heat/air system and I just installed an outdoor wood-burning boiler because our winter electricity usage was 3x what our summer usage was.  I don't like to be cold but I am more than happy to use a blanket so our thermostat is set to more eco-friendly temperatures/schedule.  We have had our system checked out and everyone says that it is in great working condition and that the increased usage should be expected due to the below freezing temperatures.  The wood boiler was installed in early December and our electric usage for this winter is now inline with our electric usage for summer.  We are also planning to try to add additional insulation this year but it isn't like this is an area that is extremely lacking currently, our house is an earth contact (berm, underground, whatever your region calls it) home, 3 sides are concrete walls that are buried. 

Alfred J Quack

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Re: Mustachian People Problems (just for fun)
« Reply #6153 on: March 20, 2019, 12:12:30 PM »
I can see where some people are coming from re: heat pump criticism. I've done my research as well because we were interested in maybe getting one, but it seems it's mainly interesting if your use of natural gas / heating is pretty high and your house is quite big. In our case we calculated that we'd save €75/year while investing €4500 (hybrid installation) up front + we'd have to sacrifice most of a bedroom. That doesn't mean there's anything wrong with heat pumps, I just think they are not particularly suitable for the most common type of house in NL.

Radically cutting down on energy use can be very effective in lowering bills and carbon pollution and is zero waste. I think this should be promoted much more. All I hear about now are EV's and heat pumps.
This is actually dependent on your heating system. I have a normal sized house (100m2/300m3) with radiators and I could have done with a 5kW heatpump which cost about 4500 and I receive 2000 in subsidies. Savings then would have been a lot more than my current heatpump (which is bigger and more expensive due to some assumptions I made early on).

If you have underfloor heating you can generally replace a natural Gas heater quite easily because its already suitable for the output temperatures of a heatpump.

On an enthusiasts forum we use a formula to calculate which size heatpump is appropriate (considering only heating the unit and not tapwater, also continuous heating and no lowering the temperature during the nights):
m3 gasusage per annum x 8 KW heat (which is easily possible in most heaters from 1 m3 of gas). Divide this by 1650 and round up to the nearest whole number.

Example: 1100m3 gas is 8800 / 1650 = 5.33, round up = 6kW sized heatpump.

[edit]
Disclaimer: This calculation is based on -10oC in dutch weather (often windy.
Natural Gas I indicated is low calory NG, do not compare with other types of combustibles. If needed, calculate by kWh in stead but take note of the temperature!

Thanks for the calculation!

I've been told that heat pumps do not function well below -10C, is this true?

For years, Ottawa had artificially cheap electric power. Huge swaths of the city have electric baseboard heaters, and nothing else, when winters are regularly below -30C. Some of the newer homes have natural gas, but anything more than ten years old, or worth $300,000 or less, probably has electric. Some folks are installing the heat pumps for use most of the year, and leaving the electric in as backup during the coldest months. It's something I'm keeping an eye on for when I'm able to buy in a few years.

The power output usually drops some as outdoor temperature drops. My air to water has a technical upgrade that keeps the maximum output the same though, at the cost of more electric power. At -28 C it's still rated for 9kW heat output with 4,5kW electric input.

Just Joe

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Re: Mustachian People Problems (just for fun)
« Reply #6154 on: March 21, 2019, 11:23:54 AM »
Yes. It seems that walking is something that shouldn't be seen as a mode of transport but a pastime...

Haha, at my last job I spent a month working in small town Colorado. Great place, but I would always walk the 2.5 miles to the grocery store or where ever else, along side some pretty epic hikes in the hills there, which also required a 2+ mile walk to the trail head.

I never understood the idea of spending money to drive to the exercise place.

Anyways, really friendly small town of maybe 15k, and at least 2-3x per week I'd have people stop and offer me lifts. Wondering why some strange guy was *walking* a mile out of town. He clearly must have had a breakdown or something.

I went on a group bike ride. Everyone DRIVES to the meeting point and then rides. Not me, I roll up on my bike, ride 18 miles with them and then ride home. I added four miles to my ride b/c no driving to get there.

Just Joe

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Re: Mustachian People Problems (just for fun)
« Reply #6155 on: March 21, 2019, 12:01:22 PM »
I too have heard modern heat pumps are better at coping with temps below freezing. We bought a hybrid heat pump that allows us to pick a threshold temp where it switches from heat pump to gas. I have that temp set at about freezing. In my part of the country we see alot of day time temps above freezing and night time temps below freezing. It switches back and forth seamlessly.

I also hear lots of people complain about heat pumps making cool air heat but I guess it depends on what a person wants - lower heating costs or genuinely hot heating air. For us as long as the heat pump air isn't blowing directly on us, it is fine. Walking into the house from outside makes it very clear that the house is truly warm. We heat to about 65F-67F. When we have company coming we might bump it up a little higher while they are with us to be nice but I think the additional warm bodies do a fine job warming the house all by themselves. We are also often cooking at the same time and pumping stove heat into the house as well.   

dragoncar

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Re: Mustachian People Problems (just for fun)
« Reply #6156 on: March 21, 2019, 12:46:42 PM »
Yes. It seems that walking is something that shouldn't be seen as a mode of transport but a pastime...

Haha, at my last job I spent a month working in small town Colorado. Great place, but I would always walk the 2.5 miles to the grocery store or where ever else, along side some pretty epic hikes in the hills there, which also required a 2+ mile walk to the trail head.

I never understood the idea of spending money to drive to the exercise place.

Anyways, really friendly small town of maybe 15k, and at least 2-3x per week I'd have people stop and offer me lifts. Wondering why some strange guy was *walking* a mile out of town. He clearly must have had a breakdown or something.

I went on a group bike ride. Everyone DRIVES to the meeting point and then rides. Not me, I roll up on my bike, ride 18 miles with them and then ride home. I added four miles to my ride b/c no driving to get there.

I bet you’d also run a mile to the gym.  Absolute mad lad

gaja

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Re: Mustachian People Problems (just for fun)
« Reply #6157 on: March 21, 2019, 04:08:03 PM »
Yes. It seems that walking is something that shouldn't be seen as a mode of transport but a pastime...

Haha, at my last job I spent a month working in small town Colorado. Great place, but I would always walk the 2.5 miles to the grocery store or where ever else, along side some pretty epic hikes in the hills there, which also required a 2+ mile walk to the trail head.

I never understood the idea of spending money to drive to the exercise place.

Anyways, really friendly small town of maybe 15k, and at least 2-3x per week I'd have people stop and offer me lifts. Wondering why some strange guy was *walking* a mile out of town. He clearly must have had a breakdown or something.

I went on a group bike ride. Everyone DRIVES to the meeting point and then rides. Not me, I roll up on my bike, ride 18 miles with them and then ride home. I added four miles to my ride b/c no driving to get there.

I bet you’d also run a mile to the gym.  Absolute mad lad

This article doesn't do very well in google translate, but maybe you can get the gist of it: https://www.nrk.no/sport/lange-skiturer-til-og-fra-skirenn-1.7535356. Please note that a Norwegian "mil" is 10 km. When they are talking about femmila, it is the 50 km ski race, tremila is 30 km. So some of these guys would ski 20-50 km (or up to 200-300 km in the far north) to get to a race, where they would compete in 30-50 km skiing, and ski jumping. Afterwards, they would ski back home.

There is a story about one of these guys, who ended up winning the 50 km race. After crossing the finish line he turned to the silver medalist and said "Hey, that was fun! Do you want to go again?".

Linea_Norway

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Re: Mustachian People Problems (just for fun)
« Reply #6158 on: March 22, 2019, 01:26:35 PM »
Yes. It seems that walking is something that shouldn't be seen as a mode of transport but a pastime...

Haha, at my last job I spent a month working in small town Colorado. Great place, but I would always walk the 2.5 miles to the grocery store or where ever else, along side some pretty epic hikes in the hills there, which also required a 2+ mile walk to the trail head.

I never understood the idea of spending money to drive to the exercise place.

Anyways, really friendly small town of maybe 15k, and at least 2-3x per week I'd have people stop and offer me lifts. Wondering why some strange guy was *walking* a mile out of town. He clearly must have had a breakdown or something.

I went on a group bike ride. Everyone DRIVES to the meeting point and then rides. Not me, I roll up on my bike, ride 18 miles with them and then ride home. I added four miles to my ride b/c no driving to get there.

I bet you’d also run a mile to the gym.  Absolute mad lad

This article doesn't do very well in google translate, but maybe you can get the gist of it: https://www.nrk.no/sport/lange-skiturer-til-og-fra-skirenn-1.7535356. Please note that a Norwegian "mil" is 10 km. When they are talking about femmila, it is the 50 km ski race, tremila is 30 km. So some of these guys would ski 20-50 km (or up to 200-300 km in the far north) to get to a race, where they would compete in 30-50 km skiing, and ski jumping. Afterwards, they would ski back home.

There is a story about one of these guys, who ended up winning the 50 km race. After crossing the finish line he turned to the silver medalist and said "Hey, that was fun! Do you want to go again?".

Nansen once went on skis from Bergen to Oslo, a several days trip over a mountain plateau. He then jumped in the ski jump competition of the same pair of skis.

That would be on interesting variation on the modern "nordic combination" sport, doing the XC race and the ski jumping on the same pair of skis...

Just Joe

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Re: Mustachian People Problems (just for fun)
« Reply #6159 on: March 23, 2019, 12:12:38 PM »
Yes. It seems that walking is something that shouldn't be seen as a mode of transport but a pastime...

Haha, at my last job I spent a month working in small town Colorado. Great place, but I would always walk the 2.5 miles to the grocery store or where ever else, along side some pretty epic hikes in the hills there, which also required a 2+ mile walk to the trail head.

I never understood the idea of spending money to drive to the exercise place.

Anyways, really friendly small town of maybe 15k, and at least 2-3x per week I'd have people stop and offer me lifts. Wondering why some strange guy was *walking* a mile out of town. He clearly must have had a breakdown or something.

I went on a group bike ride. Everyone DRIVES to the meeting point and then rides. Not me, I roll up on my bike, ride 18 miles with them and then ride home. I added four miles to my ride b/c no driving to get there.

I bet you’d also run a mile to the gym.  Absolute mad lad

Well there are two details I left out - one I need to lose some weight. The other is my bike has a battery...

Freedomin5

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Re: Mustachian People Problems (just for fun)
« Reply #6160 on: March 23, 2019, 05:04:56 PM »
My MPP is that people whose support and help I need don’t believe me when I say I have a certain amount to invest.

My mom thought I was lying when I told her we may hit $1M net worth by the end of this year. (Well, to be fair, she had been negatively primed because she just spent several days reviewing the financial books of a company whose GM has been lying to the owner about the company’s financial performance, so she is pretty skeptical about seemingly unrealistic projections).

I need her to know our financial situation because we invest in our home country as non-resident expats, which makes our financial picture complicated and also means that my mom has to help us with some of the stuff.

I had to show her our net worth tracker, along with the amounts in the individual accounts. She then said that I added wrong. I told her, “I don’t do the calculations. The app/calculator does it.” So then she added it up again in her head. And then she said...”I’ve never seen anyone save that much money each month.” LOL! Vindicated!

BTDretire

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Re: Mustachian People Problems (just for fun)
« Reply #6161 on: March 23, 2019, 06:22:27 PM »
Hurricane back in Oct. pushed in a brick wall. I ordered 1500 brick  to repair it.
 The rep said they sent the order a little short, you only got 1484 brick, and that's
what the invoice billed 1484 brick @ $0.3999. Because of my vehicle, I had to make two
trips to carry all the brick. When I stacked the first load, I noted it was short, so I counted
what was left at the dealer, it was also short.
 I said to the dealer that I was short 28 brick, "he said what do you want me to do", I said,
 "just credit my credit card for the difference."
 The secretary was there and he said, credit his card and add a $25 handling fee!
 He was pissed, and said nobody ever counts* their brick.
 I told him to just forget it, and he did, so MPP, I had to pay $11 for something I didn't get.

*ya, contractors never count brick, they always order extra, they have plenty, the consumer pays the bill, and ever one is happy. Especially the brick manufacturer that, from "my experience" sends short pallets.

How about I do a chargeback and the dealer gets to pay a $25 chargeback fee?
Ya, I suppose I could play some game, but over all we are thrilled, we did a lot of searching to find a brick that matched our 45 yr old house. We did pretty well, even though new modular brick is 1/2 inch shorter than old modular brick, the mason made it all work out. Now if we can get the carpenters back to make their work run straight. :-(

Andrew9141

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Re: Mustachian People Problems (just for fun)
« Reply #6162 on: March 23, 2019, 07:05:45 PM »
My current employer hands out paper checks instead of direct deposit. I'm constantly being asked if I have received my checks as I am in no rush to cash them in. The benefit of not living paycheck to paycheck.

Threshkin

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Re: Mustachian People Problems (just for fun)
« Reply #6163 on: March 23, 2019, 07:40:59 PM »
My current employer hands out paper checks instead of direct deposit. I'm constantly being asked if I have received my checks as I am in no rush to cash them in. The benefit of not living paycheck to paycheck.

At my first real job the employer also distributed paper checks.  As I didn't have a car at that time it was a pain to get to the bank.  I could live for a month or more on one check so I didn't cash them regularly.  At one point payroll contacted me at work to make sure I was getting my checks.  I had about 10 in my wallet at the time.

I guess I was mustachian even then!

Notes: 1) Kid, living at home basically no fixed expenses.  2) Soon after I bought a car, so much for extra money!

LennStar

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Re: Mustachian People Problems (just for fun)
« Reply #6164 on: March 24, 2019, 01:57:29 AM »
My current employer hands out paper checks instead of direct deposit. I'm constantly being asked if I have received my checks as I am in no rush to cash them in. The benefit of not living paycheck to paycheck.
And that is still legal where you live?

Threshkin

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Re: Mustachian People Problems (just for fun)
« Reply #6165 on: March 24, 2019, 01:08:19 PM »
My current employer hands out paper checks instead of direct deposit. I'm constantly being asked if I have received my checks as I am in no rush to cash them in. The benefit of not living paycheck to paycheck.
And that is still legal where you live?
Why would that be illegal?  Uncommon, sure but illegal?

dragoncar

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Re: Mustachian People Problems (just for fun)
« Reply #6166 on: March 24, 2019, 08:10:22 PM »
My current employer hands out paper checks instead of direct deposit. I'm constantly being asked if I have received my checks as I am in no rush to cash them in. The benefit of not living paycheck to paycheck.
And that is still legal where you live?
Why would that be illegal?  Uncommon, sure but illegal?

Most enlightened countries outlawed employment years ago.  Ever since the machines took over, a citizens dividend (or equivalent) has been the norm throughout civilization

Threshkin

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Re: Mustachian People Problems (just for fun)
« Reply #6167 on: March 24, 2019, 09:52:45 PM »
My current employer hands out paper checks instead of direct deposit. I'm constantly being asked if I have received my checks as I am in no rush to cash them in. The benefit of not living paycheck to paycheck.
And that is still legal where you live?
Why would that be illegal?  Uncommon, sure but illegal?

Most enlightened countries outlawed employment years ago.  Ever since the machines took over, a citizens dividend (or equivalent) has been the norm throughout civilization

<Grin> I have been enjoying my unemployment for almost 2.5 years.

LennStar

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Re: Mustachian People Problems (just for fun)
« Reply #6168 on: March 25, 2019, 02:02:57 AM »
My current employer hands out paper checks instead of direct deposit. I'm constantly being asked if I have received my checks as I am in no rush to cash them in. The benefit of not living paycheck to paycheck.
And that is still legal where you live?
Why would that be illegal?  Uncommon, sure but illegal?
Here in socialist Germany it is illegal to not use bank transfer to pay people, to make sure the money is visible and not given "black" = without paying taxes and social security insurance.

Of course I am not sure if a check is legal or not here. I doubt it, but since nobody uses them to pay people for probably longer as I am alive...

Imma

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Re: Mustachian People Problems (just for fun)
« Reply #6169 on: March 25, 2019, 03:12:37 AM »
My current employer hands out paper checks instead of direct deposit. I'm constantly being asked if I have received my checks as I am in no rush to cash them in. The benefit of not living paycheck to paycheck.
And that is still legal where you live?
Why would that be illegal?  Uncommon, sure but illegal?
Here in socialist Germany it is illegal to not use bank transfer to pay people, to make sure the money is visible and not given "black" = without paying taxes and social security insurance.

Of course I am not sure if a check is legal or not here. I doubt it, but since nobody uses them to pay people for probably longer as I am alive...

In NL at least the minimum wage has to be paid into a bank account and I haven't seen a check used in my life either. But it seems that in the US many people don't have bank accounts.

My MPP: I bought some new bras and received €5 store credit that is linked to my personal account and only valid for 3 months. I just bought new bras, I'm not going to need more new ones before the summer!

Linea_Norway

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Re: Mustachian People Problems (just for fun)
« Reply #6170 on: March 25, 2019, 03:28:24 AM »
My current employer hands out paper checks instead of direct deposit. I'm constantly being asked if I have received my checks as I am in no rush to cash them in. The benefit of not living paycheck to paycheck.
And that is still legal where you live?
Why would that be illegal?  Uncommon, sure but illegal?
Here in socialist Germany it is illegal to not use bank transfer to pay people, to make sure the money is visible and not given "black" = without paying taxes and social security insurance.

Of course I am not sure if a check is legal or not here. I doubt it, but since nobody uses them to pay people for probably longer as I am alive...

In NL at least the minimum wage has to be paid into a bank account and I haven't seen a check used in my life either. But it seems that in the US many people don't have bank accounts.

When I arrived in Norway in 1998 I did not have a bank account immediately. That was a problem for my company, so they got me a bank account which their bank. Then they had a place to transfer the money to. For us in Europe it is hard to understand that the US is so "old fashioned" with checks, while we do everything electronically. Although checks in shops have been a valid way for paying for a very long time also after 1998. It still seems to be a valid payment method today. The banks have made it expensive to use, so people just use their cards instead.

LennStar

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Re: Mustachian People Problems (just for fun)
« Reply #6171 on: March 25, 2019, 04:15:40 AM »
My MPP: I bought some new bras and received €5 store credit that is linked to my personal account and only valid for 3 months. I just bought new bras, I'm not going to need more new ones before the summer!
Which is exactly the reason why they gave you the 5€. Because you feel pressed to use them. 

And some people still wonder what all that talk about consumerism is ;)

AnnaGrowsAMustache

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Re: Mustachian People Problems (just for fun)
« Reply #6172 on: March 25, 2019, 05:27:46 AM »
My current employer hands out paper checks instead of direct deposit. I'm constantly being asked if I have received my checks as I am in no rush to cash them in. The benefit of not living paycheck to paycheck.
And that is still legal where you live?
Why would that be illegal?  Uncommon, sure but illegal?
Here in socialist Germany it is illegal to not use bank transfer to pay people, to make sure the money is visible and not given "black" = without paying taxes and social security insurance.

Of course I am not sure if a check is legal or not here. I doubt it, but since nobody uses them to pay people for probably longer as I am alive...

In NL at least the minimum wage has to be paid into a bank account and I haven't seen a check used in my life either. But it seems that in the US many people don't have bank accounts.

When I arrived in Norway in 1998 I did not have a bank account immediately. That was a problem for my company, so they got me a bank account which their bank. Then they had a place to transfer the money to. For us in Europe it is hard to understand that the US is so "old fashioned" with checks, while we do everything electronically. Although checks in shops have been a valid way for paying for a very long time also after 1998. It still seems to be a valid payment method today. The banks have made it expensive to use, so people just use their cards instead.

I don't think I've seen a cheque in 20 years, here in NZ. There might be some old people that still use them. I don't think I've carried cash in about 10 years.

Imma

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Re: Mustachian People Problems (just for fun)
« Reply #6173 on: March 25, 2019, 06:08:23 AM »
My MPP: I bought some new bras and received €5 store credit that is linked to my personal account and only valid for 3 months. I just bought new bras, I'm not going to need more new ones before the summer!
Which is exactly the reason why they gave you the 5€. Because you feel pressed to use them. 

And some people still wonder what all that talk about consumerism is ;)

The credit used to be valid for 12 months so this was not a nice surprise. Now it's valid for only 3 months there's no point in using the loyalty card anymore. If I don't get the credit anymore, they don't get the data anymore :)

ixtap

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Re: Mustachian People Problems (just for fun)
« Reply #6174 on: March 25, 2019, 10:37:10 AM »
In the US bank accounts are expensive, unless you have money to let sit in them. And they can be hard to open if you have bad credit.

There was an issue with places paying (mostly minimum wage) employees with debit cards that charged various fees that basically meant the only free use of your money was to pull it all out at once, within a short time span.

So much so, that we have places passing laws prohibiting cashless establishments, because they are excluding a large part of the population.

LennStar

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Re: Mustachian People Problems (just for fun)
« Reply #6175 on: March 25, 2019, 11:30:11 AM »
So much so, that we have places passing laws prohibiting cashless establishments, because they are excluding a large part of the population.
Well, in Socialist Germany we don't fordid such things.
We just mandate that everyone has to accept Euro. Since coins and bills are the only Euro there is, you have to accept cash ;)
Of course you can accept other things, like the electronic things that make banks increase your account, but that is up to you.

sherr

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Re: Mustachian People Problems (just for fun)
« Reply #6176 on: March 25, 2019, 11:54:58 AM »
My current employer hands out paper checks instead of direct deposit. I'm constantly being asked if I have received my checks as I am in no rush to cash them in. The benefit of not living paycheck to paycheck.

You might want to reconsider and just deposit your checks regularly; I would consider your behavior slightly inconsiderate. More so if you were not cashing checks from actual people and not just a company, but still.

People have to balance their checkbooks. Companies don't want to have to account for money they've already paid out but is for some reason still sitting in their account. It's clearly bothering people since they keep asking you about it, is it really so much of a bother to swing by an ATM once a month?

dragoncar

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Re: Mustachian People Problems (just for fun)
« Reply #6177 on: March 25, 2019, 12:44:34 PM »
My current employer hands out paper checks instead of direct deposit. I'm constantly being asked if I have received my checks as I am in no rush to cash them in. The benefit of not living paycheck to paycheck.

You might want to reconsider and just deposit your checks regularly; I would consider your behavior slightly inconsiderate. More so if you were not cashing checks from actual people and not just a company, but still.

People have to balance their checkbooks. Companies don't want to have to account for money they've already paid out but is for some reason still sitting in their account. It's clearly bothering people since they keep asking you about it, is it really so much of a bother to swing by an ATM once a month?

Considering you can usually do it with your phone, there’s not much of an excuse

Playing with Fire UK

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Re: Mustachian People Problems (just for fun)
« Reply #6178 on: March 25, 2019, 12:59:03 PM »
My current employer hands out paper checks instead of direct deposit. I'm constantly being asked if I have received my checks as I am in no rush to cash them in. The benefit of not living paycheck to paycheck.

You might want to reconsider and just deposit your checks regularly; I would consider your behavior slightly inconsiderate. More so if you were not cashing checks from actual people and not just a company, but still.

People have to balance their checkbooks. Companies don't want to have to account for money they've already paid out but is for some reason still sitting in their account. It's clearly bothering people since they keep asking you about it, is it really so much of a bother to swing by an ATM once a month?

Considering you can usually do it with your phone, there’s not much of an excuse

If the company was that bothered they could arrange for direct deposit. It'd be different if it was individuals writing the cheques.

kelvin

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Re: Mustachian People Problems (just for fun)
« Reply #6179 on: March 25, 2019, 07:07:37 PM »

Most enlightened countries outlawed employment years ago.  Ever since the machines took over, a citizens dividend (or equivalent) has been the norm throughout civilization

(Chanting) MIN-COME! MIN-COME! MIN-COME!


 Thanks for the laugh, dragoncar.

Alfred J Quack

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Re: Mustachian People Problems (just for fun)
« Reply #6180 on: March 26, 2019, 02:25:25 AM »
So much so, that we have places passing laws prohibiting cashless establishments, because they are excluding a large part of the population.
Well, in Socialist Germany we don't fordid such things.
We just mandate that everyone has to accept Euro. Since coins and bills are the only Euro there is, you have to accept cash ;)
Of course you can accept other things, like the electronic things that make banks increase your account, but that is up to you.
Well, your western neighbour (Netherlands) has the same mandate but there are more and more shops where only electronic payment is possible. Since electronic payment is performed in Euro these shops say they are following mandate. My employer (housing) also does not accept cash but that is mainly to prevent fraude where someone subrents out his house illegaly for a much larger sum, gets paid in cash and then pays his rent in cash.

There was some discussion in parlement recently about this, because appearently some (medically licensed) apothecary's stopped accepting cash and people who needed meds which required an additional payment couldn't get them because they only had cash. The apothecary in question is in a questionable neighbourhood and has been robbed a few times.

Sugaree

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Re: Mustachian People Problems (just for fun)
« Reply #6181 on: March 28, 2019, 09:39:54 AM »
I have two MPPs today.  The first is that it's payday, but I scheduled all my transfers and payments earlier in the week so I didn't have to do anything except double check my spreadsheet.  I don't even get to update the net worth tab until Monday.  I like playing with my money dammit (as long as I'm just moving it from one of my accounts to another and not paying someone else).

The second problem is that I met with a rep from the HDHP that I'm probably going to switch to next open season.  She...said I should consider a standard plan instead (I already have one of those.
 I was asking how the preauthorization worked on one of my husband's prescriptions because his doctor's office is notoriously late getting the paperwork filed on it).  Then she had to go to her car to get the brochure because I'm the only person who ever asks about it. 

ixtap

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Re: Mustachian People Problems (just for fun)
« Reply #6182 on: March 28, 2019, 12:22:41 PM »
I have two MPPs today.  The first is that it's payday, but I scheduled all my transfers and payments earlier in the week so I didn't have to do anything except double check my spreadsheet.  I don't even get to update the net worth tab until Monday.  I like playing with my money dammit (as long as I'm just moving it from one of my accounts to another and not paying someone else).

The second problem is that I met with a rep from the HDHP that I'm probably going to switch to next open season.  She...said I should consider a standard plan instead (I already have one of those.
 I was asking how the preauthorization worked on one of my husband's prescriptions because his doctor's office is notoriously late getting the paperwork filed on it).  Then she had to go to her car to get the brochure because I'm the only person who ever asks about it.

What do other people do on pay day?!

Sugaree

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Re: Mustachian People Problems (just for fun)
« Reply #6183 on: March 28, 2019, 12:32:32 PM »
I have two MPPs today.  The first is that it's payday, but I scheduled all my transfers and payments earlier in the week so I didn't have to do anything except double check my spreadsheet.  I don't even get to update the net worth tab until Monday.  I like playing with my money dammit (as long as I'm just moving it from one of my accounts to another and not paying someone else).

The second problem is that I met with a rep from the HDHP that I'm probably going to switch to next open season.  She...said I should consider a standard plan instead (I already have one of those.
 I was asking how the preauthorization worked on one of my husband's prescriptions because his doctor's office is notoriously late getting the paperwork filed on it).  Then she had to go to her car to get the brochure because I'm the only person who ever asks about it.

What do other people do on pay day?!

Spend it immediately from what I can tell.

Imma

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Re: Mustachian People Problems (just for fun)
« Reply #6184 on: March 28, 2019, 04:12:14 PM »
So much so, that we have places passing laws prohibiting cashless establishments, because they are excluding a large part of the population.
Well, in Socialist Germany we don't fordid such things.
We just mandate that everyone has to accept Euro. Since coins and bills are the only Euro there is, you have to accept cash ;)
Of course you can accept other things, like the electronic things that make banks increase your account, but that is up to you.
Well, your western neighbour (Netherlands) has the same mandate but there are more and more shops where only electronic payment is possible. Since electronic payment is performed in Euro these shops say they are following mandate. My employer (housing) also does not accept cash but that is mainly to prevent fraude where someone subrents out his house illegaly for a much larger sum, gets paid in cash and then pays his rent in cash.

There was some discussion in parlement recently about this, because appearently some (medically licensed) apothecary's stopped accepting cash and people who needed meds which required an additional payment couldn't get them because they only had cash. The apothecary in question is in a questionable neighbourhood and has been robbed a few times.

I understand electronic payment is much more convenient for business owners, but what I dislike is that in our country paying cash is starting to get frowned upon / associated with crime. It's true that many criminals have loads of cash to spend, but paying cash in itself is not a shady thing to do and shouldn't be seen as such. In fact I think paying cash is a very useful budgeting tool for some people. I think many people have no idea how far advanced the cashless society already is. For example, if you need to prove you've paid certain expenses for tax purposes, like childcare, you can't just prove it with a signed receipt from the childcare organisation. You also need to show a bank statement showing that you've taken out that exact amount of money in cash right before the payment, or the taxman can legally assume you're laundering money.

I understand the fight against the illegal economy (I live in the south, narco's rule this place) but at the same time, you don't want to put the whole informal economy under government watch. There's nothing wrong with people making a little bit of cash through selling used items or occasionally (not as a real job) providing services to friends or neighbours like fixing a bike or cleaning a home. The informal economy  = not necessary criminal and fullfills an important role in society. 

APowers

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Re: Mustachian People Problems (just for fun)
« Reply #6185 on: March 29, 2019, 01:09:25 AM »
MPP: my income for 2018 is $2k too high to qualify for Turbotax's free-file system, so now I have to RE-enter all my info into a different free e-file system.

Also MPP....income is higher this year than it's ever been (AGI ~$36k), and now I have these stupid rich people problems, like....taxes.

Cool Friend

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Re: Mustachian People Problems (just for fun)
« Reply #6186 on: March 29, 2019, 11:35:44 AM »
Noticed that my student loan servicer didn't auto-debit at the end of this month, so I logged in to my account and found that my next payment won't be until January of 2020.  Apparently a big lump payment I made in February pushed my next required payment all the way into next year!

So they're working to put my next due payment for next month back on track, and meanwhile I made a one-time payment for this month.

RWD

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Re: Mustachian People Problems (just for fun)
« Reply #6187 on: March 29, 2019, 12:00:52 PM »
Noticed that my student loan servicer didn't auto-debit at the end of this month, so I logged in to my account and found that my next payment won't be until January of 2020.  Apparently a big lump payment I made in February pushed my next required payment all the way into next year!

So they're working to put my next due payment for next month back on track, and meanwhile I made a one-time payment for this month.

Yeah, you definitely want to make sure everything is in order here. I have heard of some sleazy lenders that will prepay future interest instead of principal with a lump sum.

rantk81

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Re: Mustachian People Problems (just for fun)
« Reply #6188 on: March 29, 2019, 12:43:54 PM »
Noticed that my student loan servicer didn't auto-debit at the end of this month, so I logged in to my account and found that my next payment won't be until January of 2020.  Apparently a big lump payment I made in February pushed my next required payment all the way into next year!

So they're working to put my next due payment for next month back on track, and meanwhile I made a one-time payment for this month.

Yeah, you definitely want to make sure everything is in order here. I have heard of some sleazy lenders that will prepay future interest instead of principal with a lump sum.

That should be illegal.

RWD

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Re: Mustachian People Problems (just for fun)
« Reply #6189 on: March 29, 2019, 01:07:08 PM »
Noticed that my student loan servicer didn't auto-debit at the end of this month, so I logged in to my account and found that my next payment won't be until January of 2020.  Apparently a big lump payment I made in February pushed my next required payment all the way into next year!

So they're working to put my next due payment for next month back on track, and meanwhile I made a one-time payment for this month.

Yeah, you definitely want to make sure everything is in order here. I have heard of some sleazy lenders that will prepay future interest instead of principal with a lump sum.

That should be illegal.

It's called advance due date and it is a very common practice:
https://lendedu.com/blog/shouldnt-advance-due-date-on-student-loans/

Maybe I worded my statement weird, but essentially you are paying the next month's payment but even though you already gave them the money they will pretend like they didn't get it until the next payment is due. Hence you'll pay the same amount of interest even though you paid early.

Cool Friend

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Re: Mustachian People Problems (just for fun)
« Reply #6190 on: March 29, 2019, 01:23:09 PM »
Noticed that my student loan servicer didn't auto-debit at the end of this month, so I logged in to my account and found that my next payment won't be until January of 2020.  Apparently a big lump payment I made in February pushed my next required payment all the way into next year!

So they're working to put my next due payment for next month back on track, and meanwhile I made a one-time payment for this month.

Yeah, you definitely want to make sure everything is in order here. I have heard of some sleazy lenders that will prepay future interest instead of principal with a lump sum.

That should be illegal.

It's called advance due date and it is a very common practice:
https://lendedu.com/blog/shouldnt-advance-due-date-on-student-loans/

Maybe I worded my statement weird, but essentially you are paying the next month's payment but even though you already gave them the money they will pretend like they didn't get it until the next payment is due. Hence you'll pay the same amount of interest even though you paid early.

Ahh, weird!

In my case, I paid a lump $10,000.  In my account info, it tells me that $9,976.72 was applied to the principal (the remainder applied to interest), and indeed, my current loan balance reflects that.  So I should be safe right?  In the situation you're describing, would my loan balance would remain the same after having paid the lump sum, with the lump sum being applied to the balance every month?

RWD

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Re: Mustachian People Problems (just for fun)
« Reply #6191 on: March 29, 2019, 01:57:29 PM »
Noticed that my student loan servicer didn't auto-debit at the end of this month, so I logged in to my account and found that my next payment won't be until January of 2020.  Apparently a big lump payment I made in February pushed my next required payment all the way into next year!

So they're working to put my next due payment for next month back on track, and meanwhile I made a one-time payment for this month.

Yeah, you definitely want to make sure everything is in order here. I have heard of some sleazy lenders that will prepay future interest instead of principal with a lump sum.

That should be illegal.

It's called advance due date and it is a very common practice:
https://lendedu.com/blog/shouldnt-advance-due-date-on-student-loans/

Maybe I worded my statement weird, but essentially you are paying the next month's payment but even though you already gave them the money they will pretend like they didn't get it until the next payment is due. Hence you'll pay the same amount of interest even though you paid early.

Ahh, weird!

In my case, I paid a lump $10,000.  In my account info, it tells me that $9,976.72 was applied to the principal (the remainder applied to interest), and indeed, my current loan balance reflects that.  So I should be safe right?  In the situation you're describing, would my loan balance would remain the same after having paid the lump sum, with the lump sum being applied to the balance every month?

You are probably fine. I am not entirely sure what it would look like. I imagine it would decrease your principal (plus new interest) one payment at a time until the initial payment was exhausted.

Alfred J Quack

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Re: Mustachian People Problems (just for fun)
« Reply #6192 on: March 29, 2019, 02:05:09 PM »
So much so, that we have places passing laws prohibiting cashless establishments, because they are excluding a large part of the population.
Well, in Socialist Germany we don't fordid such things.
We just mandate that everyone has to accept Euro. Since coins and bills are the only Euro there is, you have to accept cash ;)
Of course you can accept other things, like the electronic things that make banks increase your account, but that is up to you.
Well, your western neighbour (Netherlands) has the same mandate but there are more and more shops where only electronic payment is possible. Since electronic payment is performed in Euro these shops say they are following mandate. My employer (housing) also does not accept cash but that is mainly to prevent fraude where someone subrents out his house illegaly for a much larger sum, gets paid in cash and then pays his rent in cash.

There was some discussion in parlement recently about this, because appearently some (medically licensed) apothecary's stopped accepting cash and people who needed meds which required an additional payment couldn't get them because they only had cash. The apothecary in question is in a questionable neighbourhood and has been robbed a few times.

I understand electronic payment is much more convenient for business owners, but what I dislike is that in our country paying cash is starting to get frowned upon / associated with crime. It's true that many criminals have loads of cash to spend, but paying cash in itself is not a shady thing to do and shouldn't be seen as such. In fact I think paying cash is a very useful budgeting tool for some people. I think many people have no idea how far advanced the cashless society already is. For example, if you need to prove you've paid certain expenses for tax purposes, like childcare, you can't just prove it with a signed receipt from the childcare organisation. You also need to show a bank statement showing that you've taken out that exact amount of money in cash right before the payment, or the taxman can legally assume you're laundering money.

I understand the fight against the illegal economy (I live in the south, narco's rule this place) but at the same time, you don't want to put the whole informal economy under government watch. There's nothing wrong with people making a little bit of cash through selling used items or occasionally (not as a real job) providing services to friends or neighbours like fixing a bike or cleaning a home. The informal economy  = not necessary criminal and fullfills an important role in society.

I understand you point but there is a large grey area in cash payment. In the daycare example, this is resolved at our end by the fact that you have to work a minimum number of hours to be eligible for a subsidy. Both the employer and the daycare have to report your hours+income/cost. If you don't have enough working hours because your boss pays you partly in cash without taxes then you simply cannot receive the subsidy. Pay taxes, get cheaper daycare.
My wife works too few hours for the amount of daycare we receive though so we are only partially subsidized. The city wanted to sponsor us but for 80,- per month more we can also use daycare during the school holidays :P Since we are mustachian this is no problem.

The law over here is also that at least minimum wage is paid by wire, the amount over minimum wage can be paid in cash. This is for a few reasons I can think of:
1. If you owe someone money, this makes it possible to deduct part of the with a judge's approval
2. Most costs like housing, electric, healthcare etc. Can only be paid via bank transfer, if you have at least the bare minimum there are fewer chances of not being able to pay on time.


Threshkin

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Re: Mustachian People Problems (just for fun)
« Reply #6193 on: March 29, 2019, 05:31:20 PM »
Back in the dark days when I had loans to pay when I made additional payments I always put "Apply to principal only" or similar on the check and on the paper statement if there was one.  I also always made two payments.  One for the regular amount due and one for the extra payment.

This was on the advice of the lenders.  Worked for me.

(Dating myself by not using electronic payments.)

Imma

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Re: Mustachian People Problems (just for fun)
« Reply #6194 on: March 30, 2019, 01:27:00 AM »
So much so, that we have places passing laws prohibiting cashless establishments, because they are excluding a large part of the population.
Well, in Socialist Germany we don't fordid such things.
We just mandate that everyone has to accept Euro. Since coins and bills are the only Euro there is, you have to accept cash ;)
Of course you can accept other things, like the electronic things that make banks increase your account, but that is up to you.
Well, your western neighbour (Netherlands) has the same mandate but there are more and more shops where only electronic payment is possible. Since electronic payment is performed in Euro these shops say they are following mandate. My employer (housing) also does not accept cash but that is mainly to prevent fraude where someone subrents out his house illegaly for a much larger sum, gets paid in cash and then pays his rent in cash.

There was some discussion in parlement recently about this, because appearently some (medically licensed) apothecary's stopped accepting cash and people who needed meds which required an additional payment couldn't get them because they only had cash. The apothecary in question is in a questionable neighbourhood and has been robbed a few times.

I understand electronic payment is much more convenient for business owners, but what I dislike is that in our country paying cash is starting to get frowned upon / associated with crime. It's true that many criminals have loads of cash to spend, but paying cash in itself is not a shady thing to do and shouldn't be seen as such. In fact I think paying cash is a very useful budgeting tool for some people. I think many people have no idea how far advanced the cashless society already is. For example, if you need to prove you've paid certain expenses for tax purposes, like childcare, you can't just prove it with a signed receipt from the childcare organisation. You also need to show a bank statement showing that you've taken out that exact amount of money in cash right before the payment, or the taxman can legally assume you're laundering money.

I understand the fight against the illegal economy (I live in the south, narco's rule this place) but at the same time, you don't want to put the whole informal economy under government watch. There's nothing wrong with people making a little bit of cash through selling used items or occasionally (not as a real job) providing services to friends or neighbours like fixing a bike or cleaning a home. The informal economy  = not necessary criminal and fullfills an important role in society.

I understand you point but there is a large grey area in cash payment. In the daycare example, this is resolved at our end by the fact that you have to work a minimum number of hours to be eligible for a subsidy. Both the employer and the daycare have to report your hours+income/cost. If you don't have enough working hours because your boss pays you partly in cash without taxes then you simply cannot receive the subsidy. Pay taxes, get cheaper daycare.
My wife works too few hours for the amount of daycare we receive though so we are only partially subsidized. The city wanted to sponsor us but for 80,- per month more we can also use daycare during the school holidays :P Since we are mustachian this is no problem.

The law over here is also that at least minimum wage is paid by wire, the amount over minimum wage can be paid in cash. This is for a few reasons I can think of:
1. If you owe someone money, this makes it possible to deduct part of the with a judge's approval
2. Most costs like housing, electric, healthcare etc. Can only be paid via bank transfer, if you have at least the bare minimum there are fewer chances of not being able to pay on time.

It totally makes sense for the employer to have to pay at least the minimum wage in cash. Ultimately this protects the worker most of of all.

But that's not what I meant. As a user of childcare who received subsidy (kot) which for non-Dutch readers is almost every two-income family in the country, to qualify for the subsidy you need to prove you've actually paid the invoices. You can get random checks. This part makes sense.

What doesn't make sense is that an invoice signed off by the receiver of the payment is not valid proof of payment. You need to accompany every invoice with a copy of your bank statement showing either the transfer to the daycare's bank account or a withdrawal of the exact amount of cash at the same date as the payment was made. If you cannot do this - for example because you're a money launderer, or because you like to budget with cash and withdraw your money from your account when it's paid, of because you're a small business owner who receives payments in cash and doesn't want to pay a lot of costs to put that money in the bank to withdraw it later on, you have to pay all the received subsidy back. This can be a 4/5-figure sum a year and they can go back 5 years.

I do think it is really unfair to lump every single cash payment in with fraud. Cash money is valid currency and it should stay that way. The way our law and tax authorities think right now, is 'if you use cash you are a criminal unless you can prove otherwise and the burden of proof is on you". They are also not honest about this - obviously every receiver of childcare subsidy gets a letter about needing proof of payment but they don't tell that they don't accept the regular proof of payment, a signed invoice by the receiver.

I see a lot of people with tax debts and 80% of the high tax debts I see is linked to cash payment of invoices. These are debts sometimes higher than a family's yearly income and will put them in poverty for years. I'm confident the vast majority of them aren't criminals.

Fomerly known as something

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Re: Mustachian People Problems (just for fun)
« Reply #6195 on: March 30, 2019, 08:31:53 AM »


I don't think I've seen a cheque in 20 years, here in NZ. There might be some old people that still use them. I don't think I've carried cash in about 10 years.
[/quote]

It maybe because I don't have a NZ bank account, but 2 years ago I was required to pay in cash at several of the smaller B&B's when I was traveling there.

Linea_Norway

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Re: Mustachian People Problems (just for fun)
« Reply #6196 on: March 30, 2019, 08:50:47 AM »


I don't think I've seen a cheque in 20 years, here in NZ. There might be some old people that still use them. I don't think I've carried cash in about 10 years.

It maybe because I don't have a NZ bank account, but 2 years ago I was required to pay in cash at several of the smaller B&B's when I was traveling there.
[/quote]

Now this smells like black income to me. Or they simply want to avoid paying a large fee if you pay from a foreign bank account. CC often take 2%, PayPal takes a fee. Did you get a receipt?

Linea_Norway

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Re: Mustachian People Problems (just for fun)
« Reply #6197 on: March 30, 2019, 09:23:35 AM »
Yesterday I visited an aquintance, and Facebook friend. She asked some questions about whether we were now well settled in our new house and liked it there. I don't yet dare to come out of the closet as a next year Fire person, so I couldn't honostly answer that I regret having bought a clownhouse and that we are going to downsize next year to free up all those savings that we put in it. I mumbled something about the house being too big and a lot of work to clean and paint.
Then she asked where I would like to live. I answered that if we didn't have to consider jobs, we would move out into the country, somewhere along the coast, otherwise our current area is fine.
Difficult that I don't feel comfortable to tell the full truth that our plan next year is to do all that, selling and moving into the country.

pdxmonkey

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Re: Mustachian People Problems (just for fun)
« Reply #6198 on: March 30, 2019, 11:31:44 PM »
I have two MPPs today.  The first is that it's payday, but I scheduled all my transfers and payments earlier in the week so I didn't have to do anything except double check my spreadsheet.  I don't even get to update the net worth tab until Monday.  I like playing with my money dammit (as long as I'm just moving it from one of my accounts to another and not paying someone else).

The second problem is that I met with a rep from the HDHP that I'm probably going to switch to next open season.  She...said I should consider a standard plan instead (I already have one of those.
 I was asking how the preauthorization worked on one of my husband's prescriptions because his doctor's office is notoriously late getting the paperwork filed on it).  Then she had to go to her car to get the brochure because I'm the only person who ever asks about it.

What do other people do on pay day?!
Heck if I know. We moved to fortnightly pay and so now I can never remember which week payday is. I liked it better when it was once a month on the same day of the month. It's actually a problem getting paid more often because it's harder to automate everything and I have to check things more often.

I didn't think it would be a big deal, but now I actively dislike it.
« Last Edit: March 30, 2019, 11:33:43 PM by pdxmonkey »

Taran Wanderer

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Re: Mustachian People Problems (just for fun)
« Reply #6199 on: March 31, 2019, 01:34:40 PM »
I had the same problem when our company switched. I actually put in on my calendar as a reminder. My other method is to change my contacts every two weeks. One Friday is payday, the next is new contacts. Works out pretty well.