Limitations to will power - don't scratch the itch?

[dachs]

Hello guys,

so I read an article about psychology, habits and how to change them that I found very interesting: http://gettingstronger.org/psychology/

One point stated there (among lots of other very interesting things) is that you can stop scratching by ignoring the itch and then sort of getting used to it. Is that really true? I'm trying to do that right now and the harder I try the harder it gets... well that's basically what it says in the article, it gets herder (arrgghghh i have to scratch) until it eventuelle it goes away, but has anyone really mastered that?!?!

Taking itching.  You may find that you itch in different places during the day–your nose, scalp, arms, back, or whatever–and you reflexively scratch to relieve the itch “because you have to.”  We assume that itching the sensation of itching is a given, there’s nothing we can do about it.  But that’s not true.  If we ignore it, it will eventually go away. Itching is a physiological reaction based upon histamine release in the skin, and it is subject to classical conditioning. At first, the itch may seem overwhelming and at times almost excruciating. The classical symptoms of extinction bursts will occur, with the itching getting more and more intense, in waves. But by systematically ignoring the itching, it will dissipate with each cycle.

What do you think?

PS: sorry if I write a bit in a hurry but i'm trying to ignore the itching.....
PPS: I have no problem at all with my skin but if you just ignore the itch there will be itch everywhere as I figured out

[HenryDavid]

Raise the barrier to repeating the bad habits/ scratching the itch.
E.g., don't keep potato chips in the house.


Lower the barrier to repeating good habits: keep lots of fruit and veggies in the house.
And so on . . .

[dachs]

Okay, but I meant i it really possible to condition yourself to never have to scratch again?!

Does that work with sneezing as well? Where is the limit?

[Her]

I don't recall the exact term for it from my college biology class, but I remember the professor using sneezing as an example of a particular cycle the body goes through that cannot physically be stopped or reversed. Childbirth was the other example; once you fully go into labor you can't stop the baby from coming out.

Which is to say, no, you can't stop sneezes with willpower because it's not a process you control. But itching is, so sure, you can stop yourself from doing it if you're very mindful. In that article though I feel like the section about scratching was more just an example of how the psychology of the process works. I doubt very many people have attempted to master ignoring itches, because there's usually no real reason for doing so.

[frompa]

I have to disagree on the sneezing question.  Last Winter, I broke some ribs while ice skating.  For the first few weeks, every breath hurt, and I was terrified I'd sneeze.  But I didn't sneeze, not once.  A few more weeks went by, I was in less pain, but knew a sneeze would damn near kill me.  I didn't sneeze. Finally, about two months after my injury, I sneezed and I shouted, "Hurray, I'm all better!!"  Who knew?!

[dachs]

Well I just found it interesting that you can condition your behavior like that.

There are other very interesting examples:

- freedivers learn how to suppress their stimulus to breathing since there is plenty of oxygen in their blood and you just have to practice that
- I've ord or a Kung-Fu-Guy who could even influence is heart-frequenzy and body temperature just with will-power
- ... do you guys have other examples? What would you like to learn?

About itching: I think that if you learn how not to itch and not touch your face it might be useful for your charisma (maybe that's not the right word though). I think that people who are used to speak in public all the time and are always the center of attention have learned to not touch their face and people who are not used to that might seem awkward when they touch their face quite often without even noticing.

[gt7152b]

I'm with frompa. Haven't you ever had someone say "bless you" right before you let out a big satisfying sneeze and then you can't follow through? I hate the preemptive "bless you."

[Chris22]

Okay, but I meant i it really possible to condition yourself to never have to scratch again?!

A good scratch first thing in the morning is one of life's great pleasures.  Why deny yourself that one??

[The_path_less_taken]

There are various religious mystics (Tibetan monks, Sufi masters, etc.) who have more control over their bodily processes: they can handle extreme cold/heat/thirst etc.

Anchorites who lived in caves also somehow managed to survive.

I do believe that willpower can control a good bit more than the average person is willing to admit.

I've been hiking in the high desert and when low on water and parched....imagined biting into an ice cold, crisp, sour dill pickle covered in sharp mustard....the kind you could get from the big wooden barrels on Delancy Street in NYC....and I wasn't thirsty any longer as I was now drooling like dog.

Yet nothing had changed except my FOCUS and my thought process.

I think for me....if I were trying to stop itching I would recall the last time I was snow camping and borderline hypothermic: shaking cold, shivering, fingers numb cold. My body would then be attempting to send blood to extremities which would help with histamine removal. Your brain CAN be trained to control physiological processes.

With time. Some people also just switch focus by yanking a ear lobe or whatever...pinching skin, etc.

[FLBiker]

I've gotten into meditation over the past few years, and I've absolutely had the experience of having a strong itch, paying attention to it (not scratching it) and having it disappear.  Same thing with a strong impulse to sneeze (and I've got allergies).

Don't get me wrong, I don't generally try to avoid sneezing or itching, but they will absolutely pass if you don't do them.

[oldladystache]

I have to disagree on the sneezing question.  Last Winter, I broke some ribs while ice skating.  For the first few weeks, every breath hurt, and I was terrified I'd sneeze.  But I didn't sneeze, not once.  A few more weeks went by, I was in less pain, but knew a sneeze would damn near kill me.  I didn't sneeze. Finally, about two months after my injury, I sneezed and I shouted, "Hurray, I'm all better!!"  Who knew?!

Similar thing happened to me. With a couple of cracked ribs I managed to not sneeze for several weeks. If it's important enough you can do it. I wouldn't have believed it.

[o2bfree]

I've gotten into meditation over the past few years, and I've absolutely had the experience of having a strong itch, paying attention to it (not scratching it) and having it disappear.  Same thing with a strong impulse to sneeze (and I've got allergies).

I get this. Sometimes when I sit half-lotus a lot, like during a retreat, my knees really hurt. But the pain goes away if I look straight at it for awhile...or if I don't look at it for awhile. Seems like it's the going back and forth that makes the pain arise.

[Kaspian]

Okay, but I meant i it really possible to condition yourself to never have to scratch again?!

I've read that scratching an itch dramatically increases the odds that you'll have to scratch the same spot again soon afterwards because you've irritated the skin.

That said, if you ever get stress-induced winter eczema you will learn how not to itch.  (Makes it much worse.) I had that one year and it's my definition of both insanity and hell.  :(