Is it Possible to Quit "Wal-Marting"?

[Faraday]

Lately, I've had two very bad experiences at Wal-Mart (I can explain these later if anyone cares to know). These two experiences have left me pondering the questions:

1) Wal-Mart is our chief destination for groceries, some clothing, expendable auto parts like batteries and oil. Are there better places and better ways to buy? DW and I have membership at Costco, and MMM has a posting showing that warehouse membership can pay off. Is that the better way to go for groceries and "normal stuff"? (better quality, service and price?)

2) I shop frugally, but I believe what I do can be further optimized. I've never seen a case study done on "grocery receipts". Anyone interested in having me post what I buy at Wal-Mart (and what it costs) and have you  folks review what I buy and suggest either a better source/price for the item or a better alternative item altogether?

Thanks;
mefla

[merula]

I don't know if it's possible to quit, but it's definitely possible to not shop at Wal-Mart at all. I know there are plenty of people who love it, but I just can't support their sourcing or HR practices.

I've started a grocery price spreadsheet comparing several local stores, and it's been surprising who actually has the best prices. I took that to Costco recently and about half of the things we were considering getting were cheaper at other places. It's a lot of work to start with, but it has really paid off.

[Faraday]

I don't know if it's possible to quit, but it's definitely possible to not shop at Wal-Mart at all. I know there are plenty of people who love it, but I just can't support their sourcing or HR practices.

I've started a grocery price spreadsheet comparing several local stores, and it's been surprising who actually has the best prices. I took that to Costco recently and about half of the things we were considering getting were cheaper at other places. It's a lot of work to start with, but it has really paid off.

Thanks merula for your quick reply - I need some help on this and you've given me a place to start - I was wondering if a comparison spreadsheet is a good way to go - you've given me enough to know it will work and will "bear fruit" (ha).  Although Wal-Mart sourcing and HR practices have little to do with my Wal-Mart problem, that only adds to the problem.

So: simply take my grocery lists, use them as the left column of a spreadsheet and add columns of prices for each store/competitor?

Thank you!

[Kris]

I wouldn't go into Wal-Mart if my life depended on it (well, you know what I mean), so heck yeah, it's possible not to go there.

We primarily shop Costco.  Aldi, too, if you have it, is a great source if buying in huge quantities doesn't pop your guns.

[sandandsun]

we shop sav-a-lot, aldi, and local grocery store for the very rare specialty item that we need... almost never go to walmart... get car maintenance items at auto stores as needed, and don't really buy clothes any more.  I am trying to think of the last item I bought at walmart and I cant remember?

[Faraday]

I wouldn't go into Wal-Mart if my life depended on it (well, you know what I mean), so heck yeah, it's possible not to go there.
We primarily shop Costco.  Aldi, too, if you have it, is a great source if buying in huge quantities doesn't pop your guns.

Thanks Kris, I much appreciate your comment. We have a Costco membership and could plan "big trips" for essentials. If I can save money that way, all the better. We do have an Aldi nearby - it's right off the parking lot of the Wal-Mart. I use Aldi sporadically, but looks like I'm going to be making Aldi one of my go-to places.

[Faraday]

we shop sav-a-lot, aldi, and local grocery store for the very rare specialty item that we need... almost never go to walmart... get car maintenance items at auto stores as needed, and don't really buy clothes any more.  I am trying to think of the last item I bought at walmart and I cant remember?

OK! I'm seeing good comments for Aldi, Costco and local grocery stores. I've got Advance Auto and Auto Zone I can use for car stuff. (Wal-Mart always beats their price on motor oil and I always insource my oil changes. I'll have to see what Costco has and try to buy it 2 years at a time...

Wait...you don't really buy clothes any more? How? (Goodwill?)

[Jack]

Lately, I've had two very bad experiences at Wal-Mart (I can explain these later if anyone cares to know).

This is the Internet; of course we want to know! And the more salacious, the better! ; )

Anyway, back on topic: In my experience, Aldi beats all other grocery stores on price by a wide margin, including Costco (in fact, for the kinds of things I buy, Costco has a hard time even beating Kroger).

Most non-grocery items aren't needed urgently, so more and more I've found myself ordering them off the Internet (often Amazon.com, but not always).

Clothes get bought at Goodwill, Ross or department stores (e.g. JC Penney, Macy's).

If there's some Wal-mart-ish item I need too urgently to buy online, I go to Target. Despite their incompetent IT, I think Target is better than Wal-Mart in many different ways.

[Retire-Canada]

. Is that the better way to go for groceries and "normal stuff"?

I have a Walmart walking distance from my house. I shop there once or twice a year spending $20/visit or so.

So can you live without Walmart = yes.

Just getting me in the door is a mental health cost of $50 and I haven't bought anything yet.

To be fair I don't go into 90% of the other stores in that complex either....just the drug store, optometrist and the electronics store. All occasionally.

Wallmart is full of cheap junk which I don't need and there are lots of other food options in my neighbourhood.

-- Vik

[Giro]

Walmart sucks.  I hate hate hate it.  I go there maybe twice a year. 

I would never buy clothes at Walmart.  Even if they have a lower upfront cost, the four times each year you have to replace them will negate the value.  Go to Goodwill and find LL Bean or Lands End or similar clothing and it will last 10x longer for a fraction of the cost.

I also try and keep as much of my money in the local or at least national economy as I possibly can.  I don't spend a lot but what I do spend, I would rather spend at the farmer's market. 

Goodluck.

[Bob W]

Sure it is possible to quit Wal-Mart.

IMHO it would be improbable to beat Wal-Mart on price given that they price match competitors.   Would love to hear your bad experiences?   

I've been to Wal-Marts perhaps as many as 1000 times in my life.   I can't really remember a bad experience that sticks out.   I generally refrain from buying clothes there as they seem to disassemble themselves rather quickly.  So yeah,  clothes from Wal-Mart would qualify as bad experiences.    I should also note that my local Wal-Mart has great workers who are super helpful and very grateful to have jobs.  I particularly think Steve, the auto service manager, is great!   

I sometimes feel that the folks that hate Wal-Mart are really saying that they can't tolerate poor people.  I've seen this refrain from upper income earners in person and it is rather ugly.     

In our rural community here the choices are pretty limited so the millionaires and the welfare moms all tend to end up at Wal-Mart eventually.   

As far as what they pay workers that is between them and their workers.  There is nothing stopping the Wal-Mart employees from unionizing. 

     

*Disclaimer -  I'm from the Ozarks not too far from Bentonville the headquarters of Wal-Mart.   We tend to like our Wal-Marts. 

[Faraday]

Ok, ok. I'll tell the tales. Now, I'm gonna summarize or we'll be here all day. Anyone with questions, just ask:

Visit 1: 6:30PM Friday night, March 13 (ooo...Friday the 13th)
I run about $100 worth of groceries (almost all of next week's groceries) through a self checkout machine. Scan the coupons. Swipe my debit card and conclude the card terminal transaction. Then the machine hangs. I stand there for a moment, signal for help and have this feeling of dread.

Employee monitoring the stations signals me to go to the other open one...and re-do the entire transaction...assuring me it did NOT go against my account "if the machine didn't print a receipt". So I do the complete process of checkout again at another self-checkout terminal, and it happens exactly the same way. I'm livid at this point and have broken into my "say anything I damn well please" mode.

Employee directs me to a cashier's station, where everything gets tabulated correctly, no problems at all. By this point, I've "checked out" three times and spent 45 minutes doing so. Employee telling me the whole time "It's OK, it didn't charge you for the groceries..."

Go home, log in and check my bank account, and I was charged as if I'd bought the same groceries three times.

Go back to the Wal-Mart with my (edited) screen print from the account and i escalate to the highest manager in the building, argue a lot, and realize that there's not a soul working for Wal-Mart who has any understanding of what just happened. Even the manager thinks the transaction has "somehow not really gone through and it will be reversed". I have no idea what he's talking about, the three drafts against my account were successful. There's absolutely no reason Wal-Mart's going to go "oh, we need to give this money back".

Eventually, they go back into "their room", study it some more and come out and agree with me. I guess there was some "help line" they called to get the straight scoop.

I got my money back, but let me tell you, it took a time span of two days (It was resolved around 1pm Saturday). It was both time-consuming and terrifying. Now I'm dealing with the fallout (I run my checking account VERY lean to discourage fraud and enforce my mustachian lifestyle.)

But, at Wal-mart, there's no one in the stores that really understands how electronic financial transactions work, and when they go wrong, they can't help you.

Visit 2: 8:00am Monday March 16 (yes, THIS morning)
Customer service desk manager didn't understand the pro-rated warranty of their batteries and refused to honor it. Escalated to store manager, store manager agreed. After 45 minutes of arguing, I finally got the store to honor the warranty claim printed on the side of both batteries.

So, you see, my problem with Wal-Mart isn't political, social, labor-related, import-related, or anything like that. I actually LOVE Wal-Mart. The problem that's pushing me away is that I don't feel I can trust Wal-Mart to treat my money and time as if they matter - they aren't training their employees well enough to do their jobs with even a semblance of competence. So when their systems screw up, you are lost.

Because of this, I've reached the point where I'm actually afraid to do business with Wal-Mart. I don't expect them to understand how their machines work, to fix things when they break, or to honor warranties on their products.

[Pigeon]

I hate Walmart and almost never go there if I can help it.  My hatred is for both political and customer service reasons.  I will cheerfully pay a little more not to go to Walmart because my life is too short for that.

Whether or not you can shop as cheaply is going to depend on your local shopping situation.  A price book (spreadsheet) is very helpful.  Eventually, you will remember what a good price is for a given staple item. 

[Kris]

So, you see, my problem with Wal-Mart isn't political, social, labor-related, import-related, or anything like that. I actually LOVE Wal-Mart. The problem that's pushing me away is that I don't feel I can trust Wal-Mart to treat my money and time as if they matter - they aren't training their employees well enough to do their jobs with even a semblance of competence. So when their systems screw up, you are lost.

Because of this, I've reached the point where I'm actually afraid to do business with Wal-Mart. I don't expect them to understand how their machines work, to fix things when they break, or to honor warranties on their products.

Actually, I would argue that those two interactions are political/social/labor-related.  For the very reasons you stated: you can't trust them to treat you as though you matter, and they don't bother to train their employees well enough to do their jobs competently.  Not to put too fine a point on it, but the largest retailer in the world has a vested interest in certain political decisions and social/labor policies and outcomes, to keep their profits at a maximum and their investment in employees at a minimum.

[HazelStone]

I stopped shopping at Walmart because they had nothing on the shelves. Peak hours, off-peak hours, didn't matter- I would have better luck in an East German grocery store circa 1975. When you can't get more than half the things on your grocery list, the time and the aggravation is not worth the bother. Also, Walmart's prices are great if you're getting cheesy poofs or Fritos, less so if you are getting actual food.

[Jack]

I sometimes feel that the folks that hate Wal-Mart are really saying that they can't tolerate poor people.  I've seen this refrain from upper income earners in person and it is rather ugly.     

<snark>Funny, considering how predatory Wal-Mart acts towards its employees, I'd figure that folks who hate poor people would be big fans of Wal-Mart!</snark>

But seriously, even leaving the labor, ethical, and product-quality issues aside, I just can't stand the fact that they intentionally under-staff the registers such that there's always a 10+ minute wait in line to check out. Even if they do price-match*, the little bit of money theoretically saved isn't worth the time and aggravation.

(* I'm skeptical about whether Wal-Mart would actually agree to price-match most of what I buy at Aldi, since it's almost all private-label and mostly unadvertised.)

[Cookie78]

I hate Walmart and almost never go there if I can help it.  My hatred is for both political and customer service reasons.  I will cheerfully pay a little more not to go to Walmart because my life is too short for that.

Whether or not you can shop as cheaply is going to depend on your local shopping situation.  A price book (spreadsheet) is very helpful.  Eventually, you will remember what a good price is for a given staple item.

Me too. Maybe once a year I need something and I don't know where else to go to buy it. I feel an incredible sense of rage the minute I step foot inside and immediately regret it. No one is helpful. It's always crowded (someone told me recently that my nearest walmart is the busiest one in Canada. If it's not true, it's got to be close).

I need to start a price book! I have no idea what food usually costs. Usually I just go to the nearest grocery store and buy stuff on sale if I can. I'm going to add this to the list of things I could work on and improve.

[Bob W]

Melfa,  I feel your pain on the self check out!   They are slow and prone to frustration.   On the plus side, if I just have 1 or 2 items, they are usually uber fast. 

I'm sure you can regain your faith in the future.   We actually had our credit card info stolen in the Target hack -- so yeah, one needs to check on their electronic payments no matter where they are made. 

For those of you who think Wal-Mart pays their workers too little --- I can tell you this.   I work with folks with physical and intellectual disabilities.   Our local Wal-Mart has gone beyond to call to provide jobs for some of my clients.   Sure they are greeters or lot attendants but they are working and loving their jobs.  So $7.50 working at Wal-Mart or 75 cents and hour at the Sheltered Workshop?

[Faraday]

I'm thankful for your replies! (Every one!)  Knowing others never go there and do just fine really helps. Now I feel confident that I can change where and how I spend money and be successful.

Now, I'd like to use this change as an opportunity to optimize! So let me ask these two things:

1) Can I achieve "some" optimization simply by prepping a spreadsheet and doing the research?
...and...
2) Do people ever prepare and post shopping lists (spreadsheets) for case study and review? I'd like two kinds of review:

   a. Am I getting the item for the best price or from the best source? (Aldi vs. WalMart? Buy vs. grow, barter, etc?)
   b. Is there an ALTERNATIVE item I should be using that would be better/cheaper/more nutritious/more cost efficient? (example: does it make more nutritional or $$ sense to buy romaine, iceberg or spring mix lettuces?)

[Tyler]

Another option is to simply try a different Wal-Mart. Like any store, the experience varies by location. The one near my house today is actually quite nice, and I've had nothing but good experiences there.

[sandandsun]

we shop sav-a-lot, aldi, and local grocery store for the very rare specialty item that we need... almost never go to walmart... get car maintenance items at auto stores as needed, and don't really buy clothes any more.  I am trying to think of the last item I bought at walmart and I cant remember?

OK! I'm seeing good comments for Aldi, Costco and local grocery stores. I've got Advance Auto and Auto Zone I can use for car stuff. (Wal-Mart always beats their price on motor oil and I always insource my oil changes. I'll have to see what Costco has and try to buy it 2 years at a time...

Wait...you don't really buy clothes any more? How? (Goodwill?)

well, we are about 7 years out from ER (could be sooner if we want, but that is target date) and we have all of the work clothes we need (and then some).  I imagine I'll continue to buy the odd pair of jeans or whatever as needed, but the truth is we have closets full of nice clothes and we don't even wear most of what we already own... I bought a new pair of dress shoes recently. And I buy running shoes regularly, but none of that I would get at walmart anyway.  But yeah- we probably don't spend more than 3-400 per year on clothing- and that is mostly shoes...

[Faraday]

Melfa,  I feel your pain on the self check out!   They are slow and prone to frustration.   On the plus side, if I just have 1 or 2 items, they are usually uber fast. 

I'm sure you can regain your faith in the future.   We actually had our credit card info stolen in the Target hack -- so yeah, one needs to check on their electronic payments no matter where they are made. 

For those of you who think Wal-Mart pays their workers too little --- I can tell you this.   I work with folks with physical and intellectual disabilities.   Our local Wal-Mart has gone beyond to call to provide jobs for some of my clients.   Sure they are greeters or lot attendants but they are working and loving their jobs.  So $7.50 working at Wal-Mart or 75 cents and hour at the Sheltered Workshop?

Bob, I'm with you on that. ESPECIALLY the fact that disabled workers can find meaningful, satisfying employment. One of my good friends has been blind from birth and what you say is his exact same complaint - he wants meaningful work, not a handout. He wants to prove himself to be an asset to the community.

Now, "faith in technology" is another thing altogether. See, I myself am a computer engineer and have been in IT my entire professional career. I don't work with those specific terminals, but I can visualize what happens, what the exact error in programming might be.

The employee believes customer account debiting happens ONLY after the receipt is printed. My problem proves that's not true.

Think about that just a minute. If you use a debit card, Wal-Mart debits your checking account before you get a receipt. In this case, the machine failed precisely to print my receipt yet still debited my account. And I had nothing at that moment to prove it. I left the store paying $300 for $100 worth of groceries and had nothing to back me up except the word of the employee who was watching and trying to help me.

In addition to that, being in the position of having to convince the associate store manager that "the system wasn't going to magically refund my money" was what scared me. The manager thought, somehow, that transactions done at different times on different terminals would be flagged as "the same" and "reconciled". That is not true, never has been, and there's never ever been any reason to even think that. 

Now: my arguments aren't merely a matter of principle - I still don't have my money back, because it takes three days to reverse a debit transaction. Today, I'm still owed $200 by Wal-Mart and I'm currently operating on a $$ transfer out of my FU FUND. Good thing I moved the money quickly enough - my electric bill auto-draft would have failed and I'd incur insufficient funds fees from both my power company and my bank.

Most stuff I see here on the forums that's defined as "anti-mustachian" are things WE take responsibility for - mostly short-sighted, ignorant or greedy behavior. I submit to you all that Wal-Mart has acted just as plainly anti-mustachian in the worst possible way.

It seems to me, then that the most mustachian way I can respond is to optimize them out of my cash flow. I am under no illusion that it will be easy - (honestly, until this thread, I worried it might be impossible.) Doing that without blowing up the budget I already have is what scares the bejeebus out of me.

[sandandsun]

I'm thankful for your replies! (Every one!)  Knowing others never go there and do just fine really helps. Now I feel confident that I can change where and how I spend money and be successful.

Now, I'd like to use this change as an opportunity to optimize! So let me ask these two things:

1) Can I achieve "some" optimization simply by prepping a spreadsheet and doing the research?
...and...
2) Do people ever prepare and post shopping lists (spreadsheets) for case study and review? I'd like two kinds of review:

   a. Am I getting the item for the best price or from the best source? (Aldi vs. WalMart? Buy vs. grow, barter, etc?)


   b. Is there an ALTERNATIVE item I should be using that would be better/cheaper/more nutritious/more cost efficient? (example: does it make more nutritional or $$ sense to buy romaine, iceberg or spring mix lettuces?)

All of that would likely be helpful, and I am sure there are many folks here who would like to dive into the details with you.  I will say that I don't have time to do anything nearly as complex as that... we simply shop at Aldi or Savalot for 95% of our food- we pretty much buy what we want there, avoiding processed and pre-packaged food as much as possible... we spend a little less than 350/mo on food for a family of 4 and that is good enough for us.  We could probably cut some by price matching/coupons/whatever, but w two full time jobs and kids, we just don't want to devote the time to it... as long as you do your main shopping at aldi, youre going to save a ton of money if you stick to normal food and not a lot of pre-packaged stuff...   good luck!

[NathanP]

As a quick/simple fix to the debit card fiasco.. Use a credit card at Walmart. They accept them, and you can enjoy some cash-back rewards while knowing that transactions can be disputed and you don't have to fight to get your money back.

+1 for Aldi. I buy 90% of my family's groceries there and purchase the remaining 10% from a local chain. In my opinion, what makes Aldi great is exactly what makes Walmart terrible: convenient size, small parking lot free of carts, very efficient cashiers, and minimal in-store marketing via house-sized displays of soda/chips.

[Kaspian]

It seemed before FIRE I used to "have to" Wal-Mart about once a month.  Mint says my frequency since finding MMM is now 1.5 visits per year.  All my food comes from the discount grocery store and all the little things from the Dollar Store or Dollarama.  Wal-Mart is now only for very specific toiletries (which I buy a year's supply of in one go), socks, and underwear.

[Faraday]

I'm thankful for your replies! (Every one!)  Knowing others never go there and do just fine really helps. Now I feel confident that I can change where and how I spend money and be successful.

Now, I'd like to use this change as an opportunity to optimize! So let me ask these two things:

1) Can I achieve "some" optimization simply by prepping a spreadsheet and doing the research?
...and...
2) Do people ever prepare and post shopping lists (spreadsheets) for case study and review? I'd like two kinds of review:

   a. Am I getting the item for the best price or from the best source? (Aldi vs. WalMart? Buy vs. grow, barter, etc?)


   b. Is there an ALTERNATIVE item I should be using that would be better/cheaper/more nutritious/more cost efficient? (example: does it make more nutritional or $$ sense to buy romaine, iceberg or spring mix lettuces?)

All of that would likely be helpful, and I am sure there are many folks here who would like to dive into the details with you.  I will say that I don't have time to do anything nearly as complex as that... we simply shop at Aldi or Savalot for 95% of our food- we pretty much buy what we want there, avoiding processed and pre-packaged food as much as possible... we spend a little less than 350/mo on food for a family of 4 and that is good enough for us.  We could probably cut some by price matching/coupons/whatever, but w two full time jobs and kids, we just don't want to devote the time to it... as long as you do your main shopping at aldi, youre going to save a ton of money if you stick to normal food and not a lot of pre-packaged stuff...   good luck!

Thanks sandandsun, much appreciated. I and DW live the keto lifestyle, so we buy very little pre-packaged manufactured food. Maybe a very occasional Atkins meal bought at the shopping club.

I've been to Aldi before and I like it very much, but I think the Aldi near me is a "smaller" store, if there is such a thing? It's pretty small and there's very limited selection of fresh vegetables and meats (but their pork has been amazing quality...).

[TheOldestYoungMan]

I quit walmart a few years ago, but I'm back now as I've trimmed expenses.  There's a couple reasons.

1.  I can bike to the local walmart.  It isn't super close, but I can get there.

2.  I don't buy all that much stuff aside from food.  So if it is a food item that comes in a box, with any sort of processing (like sausage or butter) odds are walmart has it cheaper than the grocery store.  I don't buy much of this sort of thing, but if it has a long shelf life then I buy as much as I can carry when I go there.

3.  Walmart has self-checkout, neither of the two grocery stores in range of me does.

4.  I only go there a couple of times a year.  And I'm going for things that are mass produced the same everywhere you go, and it's cheaper at walmart than the handful of minutes I spent shopping online.  It has to be significantly cheaper.  If the trip isn't going to save me $15.00 then I just order it online (it's kind of a long bike ride).

5.  Coupons.  Whatever I'm looking for it seems like there's a coupon for it using that walmart coupon website.

6.  It's the only store that far away that also sells whatever part of my bicycle broke on the way there.

7.  If I haven't had time to properly shop an item for whatever reason, I know walmart isn't going to rip me off too badly.  What I get might be crap, but it will do for right now.

And yea, shoes, clothes, sporting equipment, belts, the only luck I've ever had at walmart was dickies.  Everything else was crap.

But mass-produced clothing like hanes socks or undershirts, walmart will have the lowest price.  I don't buy that more than about once every ten years, but that's where I go.

[LiveLean]

Wal-Mart vs. Costco. Different business models. Wal-Mart wants to sell crap as cheaply as possible, pay employees as little as possible, preferably with no benefits.

Costco sells quality stuff, caps markup, makes slim margins largely due to membership fees, pays employees a living wage with benefits and has the highest employee retention rate in retail. Costco has half the stores as Wal-Mart/Sams, greater sales. Wall Street always hates Costco because they don't do the cost-cutting stuff Wal-Mart does. Then again, Costco stock has done well in recent years.

Costco provides strong customer service, treats its members like members. Wal-Mart, well, you get what you pay for.

If you still hold the stereotype of Costco only selling 4-gallon bottles of ketchup, it's time to revisit. You can buy a gallon of milk, 18 eggs, a bag of bananas, a Rotisserie chicken -- most anything you can get at a grocery store -- though Costco doesn't have as much of the processed crap you find in the middle aisles of grocery stores.

The only time I shop at Wal-Mart is when I'm visiting my college alma mater. I find Wal-Mart sells surprisingly high-quality college logo merchandise at a fraction of the price of the student bookstore and other campus shops. I've gotten T-shirts, hats, flip-flops, pajama bottoms, shorts -- everything with my college logo at the Wal-Mart off campus. Otherwise, I don't shop at Wal-Mart ever.

[Faraday]

As a quick/simple fix to the debit card fiasco.. Use a credit card at Walmart. They accept them, and you can enjoy some cash-back rewards while knowing that transactions can be disputed and you don't have to fight to get your money back.

+1 for Aldi. I buy 90% of my family's groceries there and purchase the remaining 10% from a local chain. In my opinion, what makes Aldi great is exactly what makes Walmart terrible: convenient size, small parking lot free of carts, very efficient cashiers, and minimal in-store marketing via house-sized displays of soda/chips.

Nathan, good point and you are 100% correct. I heard a half dozen times "if you had used a credit card, we could refund your money immediately". It only incensed me more, since the default mode of the terminals is to use DEBIT.  I'll never, ever, ever use a debit card there again...

[I'm a red panda]

Wait...you don't really buy clothes any more? How?

I've found that once you are no longer a child, and don't grow out of clothes each season- they don't really need to be replaced that often.  Most of my clothes are 5-10 years old. I have many t-shirts from 15 years ago, when I started college.

[Jack]

4.  I only go there a couple of times a year.  And I'm going for things that are mass produced the same everywhere you go, and it's cheaper at walmart than the handful of minutes I spent shopping online.  It has to be significantly cheaper.  If the trip isn't going to save me $15.00 then I just order it online (it's kind of a long bike ride).

5.  Coupons.  Whatever I'm looking for it seems like there's a coupon for it using that walmart coupon website.

6.  It's the only store that far away that also sells whatever part of my bicycle broke on the way there.

You're doing it wrong.

4. Mass-produced [especially name-brand] stuff like that should be a very small proportion of your budget

5. Almost everything you can use a coupon for is overpriced to begin with. Or conversely, the kinds of things you should be buying are things that you can't get a coupon for (unless it's of the "$X off your entire purchase" variety).

6. Maintain your bike properly so it's reliable.

[gnomemom]

I shop at Walmart.  I don't hate it most of the time.  It's the cheapest for many of the things we buy.  We also shop Aldi for groceries - and internet for most everything else.

I could go to Target - but I don't find it to really be that much better of a shopping experience. 

Our Walmart has a huge grocery department, and plenty of organics! 

I did have a bad experience using the self-checkout - where it glitched up at the end and charged me twice - but it was only one item, so I decided it was not worth the hassle to get my $3.00 back.  Otherwise, I use a credit card when I shop there (well, everywhere since the big Target breach, actually). 

[Faraday]

You're doing it wrong.

Mommmaaaaaa! Jack is kicking sand in Timmy's face!

4. Mass-produced [especially name-brand] stuff like that should be a very small proportion of your budget

OP was talking about stuff like underwear or canned soup. A 3 pack of Hanes is a 3 pack of Hanes no matter where you go. So what should he be buying instead? Dumpster diving hospitals for used gauze to weave his own underwear? C'mon man!

5. Almost everything you can use a coupon for is overpriced to begin with. Or conversely, the kinds of things you should be buying are things that you can't get a coupon for (unless it's of the "$X off your entire purchase" variety).

Tru, tru. However, needing products for which there is no other alternative (OCuSOFT eye wipes) and boy, I don't blow 10 bucks on a box of 30 without the $3 coupon in-hand.

6. Maintain your bike properly so it's reliable.

Innertubes! Innertubes! If he had a snakebite on the way to the store, WM has the cheapest price on innertubes, tires, tire valves, "goop", headlights, taillights, etc.

[The_path_less_taken]

I dislike a great many things about WalMart.

But when they're the cheapest on something I'll often bite the bullet and shop there. There is no Aldi here. I have heard that the .99 store is supposedly trying to muscle into fresh fruit and veggies but haven't actually checked them out...really prefer organic if possible.

OP: if your local store is open 24/7, your best bet is to go in very early/late as the crowds are thinner.

[eil]

I don't have any hangups about Walmart so I find myself there about once a month for random items. Usually its automotive stuff like oil, batteries, various consumables, etc. Auto parts stores are great for buying actual auto parts, but even the good ones like AAP have insane markup on the stuff out on the sales floor. I also do my propane exchanges there because Walmart charges between $17-$19 for an exchange while every other place (with the same brand) changes upward of $25.

[ABC123]

I dislike Walmart because it is impossible to navigate the aisles packed with people, there are never enough registers open, and the workers in general seem to not want to be there.  But the biggest reason I rarely go there is that I just don't think their prices are all that great.  I shop almost exclusively at Kroger and get much better prices overall.  Of course, whether Walmart is the best place to shop or not depends on where you live and what other options you have.  I don't find it worth it to me to shop at Costco either, but many people love it. 

[Jack]

You're doing it wrong.

Mommmaaaaaa! Jack is kicking sand in punching Timmy's face!

FTFY. And isn't that what this forum is for?

4. Mass-produced [especially name-brand] stuff like that should be a very small proportion of your budget

OP was talking about stuff like underwear or canned soup. A 3 pack of Hanes is a 3 pack of Hanes no matter where you go. So what should he be buying instead? Dumpster diving hospitals for used gauze to weave his own underwear? C'mon man!

If you're the kind of person who eats canned soup, I would hope you'd be buying it much more often than underwear. And canned soup, unlike underwear, has a store-brand option.

Besides, canned soup is also 'doing it wrong.' Make a big batch of homemade soup and can it (or freeze it, I guess) yourself instead.

(I'm not going to suggest sewing your own underwear, since buying mass-market non-designer clothes are cheaper than DIY. However, has anybody been in a bad urban neighborhood and seen guys selling underwear out of a truck really cheap ($1 T-shirts, 50 pairs of socks for $10, etc.)? I've seen those and wondered what the catch is...)

6. Maintain your bike properly so it's reliable.

Innertubes! Innertubes! If he had a snakebite on the way to the store, WM has the cheapest price on innertubes, tires, tire valves, "goop", headlights, taillights, etc.

"Snakebite" flats are usually caused by underinflated tires, which pretty much proves my point.

[Faraday]

You're doing it wrong.

Mommmaaaaaa! Jack is kicking sand in punching Timmy's face!

FTFY. And isn't that what this forum is for?
"Snakebite" flats are usually caused by underinflated tires, which pretty much proves my point.

Oh lordy, you GO grilfrand, you GO!

Pardon me while I fall out of my chair laughing at your edit of the line. Damn boy don't back away from a fight. Hit it and git it man!

Seriously, tho, thank you for the clear points. I have a clean set of mason jars gonna get used pretty quick this summer, I'll name one of 'em "Jack" in your honor. :-)

Now, I realize this thread is devolving into "Why I hate Wal-Mart". I don't mean to run a "Wal-Mart Haters Support Group" - I just want to know how to break away and not be a drone.

So, Mr. Jack, bring the knowledge, shine the light some more.....what things do you find you have to buy and where do you buy 'em? How can I buy those things at best price, make them myself, whatever I need to be doing?

[Jack]

Pardon me while I fall out of my chair laughing at your edit of the line. Damn boy don't back away from a fight. Hit it and git it man!

I try! :D

So, Mr. Jack, bring the knowledge, shine the light some more.....what things do you find you have to buy and where do you buy 'em? How can I buy those things at best price, make them myself, whatever I need to be doing?

I posted earlier in the thread.

Beyond that, my main strategy is just to buy fresh and frozen foods, not boxed or canned. My wife and I have gotten to the point where we're cooking from scratch the vast majority of the time. About the only things I can think of that we buy pre-made are guacamole*, dairy (butter / sour cream / cheese), condiments, tomato products (e.g. spaghetti sauce) and grains (dried pasta / tortillas / bread) -- and except for the dairy, we make even those things from scratch sometimes.

We pay attention to the Kroger and Aldi weekly ads to catch deals on produce and meat, but we don't bother with coupons.

Oh! Here's a good tip: buy spices from a fancy hippie grocery store, the kind that carries them in bulk. You may or may not save on the price per pound compared to buying them in jars or tins from the regular grocery, but you'll save heaps by being able to buy only a little bit of a spice you don't use often instead of having to buy a whole jar that'll eventually go bad. Bulk spices are usually of better quality, too. (On the other hand, the hippie grocery prices other bulk things, like grains or beans, too expensively to be worth it.)

Regarding non-groceries, our main strategy is to just not buy much stuff. The only non-grocery purchases in the last month were something for $5 my wife bought from Citi Trends, brake pads and rotors from Amazon.com, windshield wipers from RockAuto, and... err... a $3600 used car to install them on.

(Okay, on second thought, maybe this month is a bad example. But on months when I don't buy cars we don't buy much else either, I swear!)

(* Around here, Wholly Guacamole from Costco (or the similar store brand item from Aldi) is usually cheaper on a per-avocado-equivalent basis than actual avocados.)

[LalsConstant]

You know after working FT at Wal-Mart for 2 years of my adult life, comments like these just make me shake my head.  To the point, Wal-Mart has effectively standardized big box discount retail.  I choose to buy my groceries at another store and find I spend a little more but I like what I get better.  Or shop at Wal-Mart and give people like me an economic opportunity and realize any business of any size is going to do some things you really agree with and some you do not.  Go to the store you like best and ignore pretentious comments.

[Pigeon]

I'm thankful for your replies! (Every one!)  Knowing others never go there and do just fine really helps. Now I feel confident that I can change where and how I spend money and be successful.

Now, I'd like to use this change as an opportunity to optimize! So let me ask these two things:

1) Can I achieve "some" optimization simply by prepping a spreadsheet and doing the research?
...and...
2) Do people ever prepare and post shopping lists (spreadsheets) for case study and review? I'd like two kinds of review:

   a. Am I getting the item for the best price or from the best source? (Aldi vs. WalMart? Buy vs. grow, barter, etc?)
   b. Is there an ALTERNATIVE item I should be using that would be better/cheaper/more nutritious/more cost efficient? (example: does it make more nutritional or $$ sense to buy romaine, iceberg or spring mix lettuces?)

Interesting idea.

The thing that makes this highly complicated is that grocery stores and prices tend to be very regional.  And most stores have pricing that changes pretty often for a large number of products.  I live in an area serviced by the Price Chopper chain of supermarkets.  This one chain, which only operates in a handful of states, creates multiple weekly fliers for my state alone.

[Gimesalot]

I tried walmart, but I hated it.  First, it seems like there are never enough people working.  I would wait 15 to 20 minutes at the deli for sliced meat.  I have waited almost an hour, to pay.  As if that weren't bad enough, half of the stuff I need is out of stock, so I end up going to a more expensive place for those items.   Not to mention the chaos that occurs in the closest walmart. 

I rather pay a  little more, and take half as long, with 10% of the stress. 

[gomike]

This is why I don't use debit cards unless I have to, ie ALDI.

[xenon5]

The vast majority of non-food and non-clothes things I buy come from the internet.  Prices are usually the same or better than at retail stores and I can save time and money that would be otherwise spent going to the store and back.  I also get to avoid all the crowds and marketing shenanigans that happen in shopping centers with the muzak, radio ads, and billboards.  I'm also less likely to get distracted and buy something I see in store that I don't really need.  A win-win.

For food, I try to live near a decent grocery store.  Just try a few new places in your neighborhood until you find one you like.  For clothes, I go once a year for most of my items in January after getting some christmas gift cards.  I only buy clothes the rest of the year if I seriously need to replace something.

[MoneyCat]

Honestly, you can get better deals on better quality products from places other than Walmart.  Walmart is absolute garbage.  There's a great website on "retail archaeology" which shows photos of ten year old technology products being sold for near original sticker price on Walmart clearance racks.  They don't really give very good deals.

[TheOldestYoungMan]

4.  I only go there a couple of times a year.  And I'm going for things that are mass produced the same everywhere you go, and it's cheaper at walmart than the handful of minutes I spent shopping online.  It has to be significantly cheaper.  If the trip isn't going to save me $15.00 then I just order it online (it's kind of a long bike ride).

5.  Coupons.  Whatever I'm looking for it seems like there's a coupon for it using that walmart coupon website.

6.  It's the only store that far away that also sells whatever part of my bicycle broke on the way there.

You're doing it wrong.

4. Mass-produced [especially name-brand] stuff like that should be a very small proportion of your budget

5. Almost everything you can use a coupon for is overpriced to begin with. Or conversely, the kinds of things you should be buying are things that you can't get a coupon for (unless it's of the "$X off your entire purchase" variety).

6. Maintain your bike properly so it's reliable.

4.  It is a very small proportion of my budget.  A smaller proportion because I get it at wal-mart.

5.  Almost everything, yes.  But not everything.  There are a few exceptions.  I don't buy things because I have a coupon, but due to catering to people for whom every cent matters, wal-mart makes it easy to find and use coupons on things I was going to buy anyways.  Sometimes I have to substitute products to get an equivalent for cheaper.  But that's alright.

6.  I meant this more as a joke, just because I usually am due to replace a tube when I go to walmart, on account of how infrequently I go to walmart.  It's a 20 mile ride there, and bizarrely, it's also 20 miles to get back.

My point was that there are things you don't really buy that often or that have a very long shelf life.  So you can take the hit of having to go to walmart every once in awhile and reap about 95% of the total benefit of ever going.

I am not super wild about canned food, but I live in hurricane country so there comes a point where you end up with at least some food that will survive non-conditioned spaces and can be eaten with little to no prep.

[Megma]

I am from a small town where there a few shopping options, Walmart being the main one. It doesn't have the stocking issues or lines some have mentioned. I don't enjoy how HUGE the store is, it's exhausting.

Now I avoid shopping there, I live in a bigger city and have choices. Watch "the high cost of low prices" and see how you feel about Walmart afterwards....I try not to shop there and prefer to keep more money in my community and shop places that treat employees better. Walmart's tactics to discourage unions and avoid paying overtime and discrimination against women is pretty thoroughly documented.

I wouldn't say I hate it, but it's easily avoided and I'd rather shop elsewhere. Aldi has cheap groceries, Amazon brings anything I want to my house for free...kinda hard to top that for convenience!

[Joan-eh?]

I refuse to shop there. Inside once. But have never bought. I invite you to watch "the high cost of low price" documentary.  I try to avoid all chains. I'd rather support people than corporations.

[PMG]

Yes.  It is possible to quit Walmart. 

I live rurally.  We have a couple groceries, dollar stores and a Walmart.  I quit Walmart 3 years ago and haven't looked back.  I told myself I could shop Walmart only if the item I needed was not available anywhere else locally, but I haven't needed to.  Maybe my staple foods would be a few cents cheaper, but I would inevitably pick up other junk and spend just as much if not more than if I shop at the local grocery.  I like my money staying locally.

I recognize that other stores also treat employees poorly, but Walmart is a leader.  IIf they were to change policy the others would have to follow. I won't support it until there is change.   

Honestly I noticed a shift in my social life after I cut Walmart.  This is a small town.  Walmart was where I ran into friends and aquaintances heard news (not all gossip...) and planned parties and got together for impromtu movie nights. That happens at the grocery, too but not at the same frequency as Walmart. 

[ltt]

Ok, ok. I'll tell the tales. Now, I'm gonna summarize or we'll be here all day. Anyone with questions, just ask:

Visit 1: 6:30PM Friday night, March 13 (ooo...Friday the 13th)
I run about $100 worth of groceries (almost all of next week's groceries) through a self checkout machine. Scan the coupons. Swipe my debit card and conclude the card terminal transaction. Then the machine hangs. I stand there for a moment, signal for help and have this feeling of dread.

Employee monitoring the stations signals me to go to the other open one...and re-do the entire transaction...assuring me it did NOT go against my account "if the machine didn't print a receipt". So I do the complete process of checkout again at another self-checkout terminal, and it happens exactly the same way. I'm livid at this point and have broken into my "say anything I damn well please" mode.

Employee directs me to a cashier's station, where everything gets tabulated correctly, no problems at all. By this point, I've "checked out" three times and spent 45 minutes doing so. Employee telling me the whole time "It's OK, it didn't charge you for the groceries..."

Go home, log in and check my bank account, and I was charged as if I'd bought the same groceries three times.

Go back to the Wal-Mart with my (edited) screen print from the account and i escalate to the highest manager in the building, argue a lot, and realize that there's not a soul working for Wal-Mart who has any understanding of what just happened. Even the manager thinks the transaction has "somehow not really gone through and it will be reversed". I have no idea what he's talking about, the three drafts against my account were successful. There's absolutely no reason Wal-Mart's going to go "oh, we need to give this money back".

Eventually, they go back into "their room", study it some more and come out and agree with me. I guess there was some "help line" they called to get the straight scoop.

I got my money back, but let me tell you, it took a time span of two days (It was resolved around 1pm Saturday). It was both time-consuming and terrifying. Now I'm dealing with the fallout (I run my checking account VERY lean to discourage fraud and enforce my mustachian lifestyle.)

But, at Wal-mart, there's no one in the stores that really understands how electronic financial transactions work, and when they go wrong, they can't help you.

Visit 2: 8:00am Monday March 16 (yes, THIS morning)
Customer service desk manager didn't understand the pro-rated warranty of their batteries and refused to honor it. Escalated to store manager, store manager agreed. After 45 minutes of arguing, I finally got the store to honor the warranty claim printed on the side of both batteries.

So, you see, my problem with Wal-Mart isn't political, social, labor-related, import-related, or anything like that. I actually LOVE Wal-Mart. The problem that's pushing me away is that I don't feel I can trust Wal-Mart to treat my money and time as if they matter - they aren't training their employees well enough to do their jobs with even a semblance of competence. So when their systems screw up, you are lost.

Because of this, I've reached the point where I'm actually afraid to do business with Wal-Mart. I don't expect them to understand how their machines work, to fix things when they break, or to honor warranties on their products.

I guess the answer to your question would be "No."  You're expecting too much from Walmart employees......seriously.

My problem lies when their checkout "scales" can't read very lightweight items, and then repeatedly tells me on the screen that I didn't bag the item.....ugh.

I think you can stay out of Walmart, but only if you live in a larger metropolitan area.  If you live somewhere rural, you're pretty much out of luck and stuck with Walmart.