ipad basically fell out of the sky today, why does this make me sad?

[penguins4everyone!]

this is a space where we all like, talk extensively about our plastic baggie usage, and triumphantly talk about our mastery of bone-broth technique, so i figure it's cool to post about my decidedly trivial problems.

We don't have an ipad.  We have two iphones, 3 macbooks, (one work-owned) and a spectacular television.  Shit is luxurious.  In our affluent social circle, we are the only ones with no ipad.  no need for it, and our being holdouts on this is like the last thing separating us from the sheeple, in my warped mind.  So, today at work, husband wins and ipad in some company raffle for doing something he was supposed to do. (spoiled tech employees)  And I'm impressed, but actually kind of annoyed!  We aren't ipad people!  I read a real book on the plane, I read blogs on a laptop.  And now we're going to be ipad people.  I won't make him sell it so we can buy Vanguard funds, he's excited and I'm not trying to get divorced over this.  But in a way I'm sad. 

I feel like we lost some of our cool-points when we upgraded from our late 80s' era car to a 5 year old car.  I feel nostalgic about walking home from parties at 1am because we were broke-- now we just pay for an Uber or Lyft.  Now I'm sad that I'll be able to watch movies on an airplane because we have an ipad? The hell is going on? Am I just being nostalgic and foolish? Or is lifestyle creep depressing?

[sirdoug007]

It was friggin' free! Doesn't get more frugal than that!


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Syonyk]

So don't use it. Let him use it and you keep doing what you're doing.

I've personally moved enough books enough different places that I'm a fan of ebooks. :)

[penguins4everyone!]

So don't use it. Let him use it and you keep doing what you're doing.

I've personally moved enough books enough different places that I'm a fan of ebooks. :)

I don't know why I'm so bent out of shape about this.  Like it's so bad if I'm sitting on a park bench reading an ipad- a mustachian will walk by and judge me!  I would judge me!  I like looking pulled together and like I belong in the 21st century, but the Ipad is some sort of status symbol tipping point that makes me crazy. 

Also, I'm pretty sure 1/3 of ipad owners got them in some sort of giveaway or raffle so I don't think we're alone here.

[MikeBear]

I won a brand new Sony Ps/4. I sold it for $375, and the money went into my Vanguard Roth IRA.

It didn't make ME sad! lol

[penguins4everyone!]

I won a brand new Sony Ps/4. I sold it for $375, and the money went into my Vanguard Roth IRA.

It didn't make ME sad! lol

haha! i love it. 

and let's be clear, not wanting a free ipad is the very definition of a non-problem.  I am quite aware of that. :)

[Syonyk]

I seriously doubt 33% of iPad owners got them for free.

They are quite common. And very useful for reading.

[Cathy]

Are you sure it's free? After 25-33% federal tax, 1.45% medicare tax, 9.3% California tax, maybe even additional medicare tax, you're looking at, at minimum, 35.75% tax on this ipad, and maybe even more. (Note that the omission of Social Security tax was intentional because the husband is presumably over the maximum for that.)

So, unless the company "grossed up" the ipad, it may be more appropriate to think of this as getting ~64% off an ipad, rather than getting a free ipad.

That said, I do have a tablet which I also obtained for free (from a bank promotion in my case) and I find it useful for watching TV shows on airplanes (or reading books). Not that that's an everyday occurrence, but it's proven useful and convenient. It's a lot more lightweight to pack a tablet than a bunch of books.

[FrugalKube]

Try it you may like it :) If not you can always sell it or give it to someone as a gift

[penguins4everyone!]

Are you sure it's free? After 23-33% federal tax, 1.45% medicare tax, 9.3% California tax, maybe even additional medicare tax, you're looking at, at minimum, 32.75% tax on this ipad, and maybe even more. (Note that the omission of Social Security tax was intentional because the husband is presumably over the maximum for that.)

So, unless the company "grossed up" the ipad, it may be more appropriate to think of this as getting ~67% off an ipad, rather than getting a free ipad.

That said, I do have a tablet which I also obtained for free (from a bank promotion in my case) and I find it useful for watching TV shows on airplanes (or reading books). Not that that's an everyday occurrence, but it's proven useful and convenient. It's a lot more lightweight to pack a tablet than a bunch of books.

woah dang i hope they don't put this down as taxable income for him.  jeez.  They might.  I'm taking an employee benefits class right now and I don't know if this would qualify as "de minimis fringes" or not. 

[Cathy]

The ipad 3 costs $400-800 depending on the model. That's more than many Americans are paid in a week.

Also note that whether the ipad has to be included in income is determined solely by the law. Whether the employer includes it in the Form W-2 is irrelevant to whether it is taxable.

[mveill1]

A large part of what drives over-consumption is status competition / envy. In your case, I suspect that unlike most other people it's your frugality, and your membership of what you see as an elite group of people, that feed into your sense of status/ego that may border on the unhealthy.

I say this because firstly, the appearance, disappearance, ownership of an object shouldn't bother you that much. Also, the fact that you admit how embarrassed you'd feel if a member of your superior in-group ("mustachians", as opposed to the unenlightened "sheeple") saw you with an iPad.

If you accept that your own barometer of status has switched from consumption to frugality, then I'd suggest that this is what you should focus on. Be more charitable to yourself, to other humans that follow a different lifestyle, and try to make your ego less dependent on what other people (ANY other people) think of you.

I hope this does not come across as insulting in any way. I have the exact same traits and working on them. Also, bear in mind I know very little about you so of course I could be way off-base.

[iampatriciag]

My FIL got both my husband and I iPad Minis two Christmases ago, paid for (in part) by his APPLE STOCK GAINS!   

We both said, "thank you very much!" and try really hard not to use them to take pictures in front of anyone.

[scrubbyfish]

I don't know why I'm so bent out of shape about this.  Like it's so bad if I'm sitting on a park bench reading an ipad- a mustachian will walk by and judge me!  I would judge me!

I feel this way!!!!! :)    I literally feel red-faced even having it, worse when people see that I have it.

My son has autism, the school wanted him to get an iPad to facilitate stuff there, and Autism Funding paid for it. Since we got it in December, I have been running around explaining to people how we got it, i.e., that I didn't pay for it! That's because I'm embarrassed that anyone might think we'd spend hundreds of dollars on such a thing. It's so incongruent with the rest of our life.

Also, so far no one has been able to show me how it's helpful in autism, and the school printed off the materials they wanted him to have, so he uses it for games and I use it for some portable work stuff (which, honestly, I do love it for!).

[Neustache]

I kind of get this. 

We are going on a big trip and I am considering getting a cell phone to use while I'm in a new city with my kids.  It hurts.  Because right now, I'm the girl without a cell phone.  I feel your pain. 

[Clean Shaven]

The first one is free.

When you want some more, you know who to come to. And if any of your friends are looking for a good time, send them over too.

[skunkfunk]

mastery of bone-broth technique

I wish! I haven't made a broth good enough to use, yet. They're all gross.

[mathlete]

I feel like we lost some of our cool-points when we upgraded from our late 80s' era car to a 5 year old car.

I think at the very least this is a bit irrational. Not terribly so or harmfully so though.

The saving of money is the good part, not the withholding of nice things.

[Jack]

The hell is going on?

Let's see:

• You live in San Francisco
• You (apparently exclusively) use Apple products, but you don't want to be seen as "iPad people"
• You want to be "[separated] from the sheeple"
• You're worried about losing "cool points" because your car isn't old enough

My diagnosis is that you've become a hipster. Other symptoms include wearing "vintage" clothes, DIY and/or gardening, and being a snob about organic or "eco-friendly" goods (including non-food goods, such as textiles).

Fortunately, the condition is not fatal -- just annoying to non-hipsters.

[Neustache]

The hell is going on?

Let's see:

• You live in San Francisco
• You (apparently exclusively) use Apple products, but you don't want to be seen as "iPad people"
• You want to be "[separated] from the sheeple"
• You're worried about losing "cool points" because your car isn't old enough

My diagnosis is that you've become a hipster. Other symptoms include wearing "vintage" clothes, DIY and/or gardening, and being a snob about organic or "eco-friendly" goods (including non-food goods, such as textiles).

Fortunately, the condition is not fatal -- just annoying to non-hipsters.

LOL!  This made me chuckle.   One question - does your husband sport a beard?

[mveill1]

The hell is going on?

Let's see:

• You live in San Francisco
• You (apparently exclusively) use Apple products, but you don't want to be seen as "iPad people"
• You want to be "[separated] from the sheeple"
• You're worried about losing "cool points" because your car isn't old enough

My diagnosis is that you've become a hipster. Other symptoms include wearing "vintage" clothes, DIY and/or gardening, and being a snob about organic or "eco-friendly" goods (including non-food goods, such as textiles).

Fortunately, the condition is not fatal -- just annoying to non-hipsters.

LOL!  This made me chuckle.   One question - does your husband sport a beard?

Funny, but a hipster wouldn't be so honest about their insecurities? I maintain my theory that it's reverse inflatable neighbour syndrome!

[Davids]

Don't feel bad about it, you got it for free (or whatever a raffle ticket may have cost). Getting something for free is the best, whether it is a lunch or an ipad.

[hunniebun]

It is hard when you pride yourself on something (like not owning an ipad) and then have to eat crow when one comes into your life. I am sure it is a temporary feeling and you'll get used to it!  And hey...a free ipad!  :)   ...on a side note, I used to be devoted to real books and vowed I would never be an e-reading kind of gal...but them a friend gave me a bunch of digital books...and now I am hooked on reading on my ipad.  It is very handy in so many ways! 

[R62]

I have an iPad 2, love it, and certainly don't feel like it makes me elite, not elite, cool, or not cool.  It's my daily go-to for staying organized and connected to the things I enjoy.  But then, I don't have:

... two iphones, 3 macbooks, (one work-owned) and a spectacular television. 

I never stop to think what others think of my having an iPad, and I suspect you'll get over the discomfort and/or angst.

[Gone Fishing]

We were given an Ipad as a gift.  It sat on a shelf for 2-3 months before we ever turned it on because we were not one of those people.  But once we did it quickly became my go-to home computing device.  Great for Youtube, browsing, etc.  Not so great for typing lengthy replys on forums.  Nice tool, I will probably replace it with a less expensive tablet if when it gets broken by myself or the kids.  Just be careful not to get addicted, I probably spend too much time on it because it is so easy to pick up and waste time on.     

[BlueMR2]

So, today at work, husband wins and ipad in some company raffle for doing something he was supposed to do. (spoiled tech employees)  And I'm impressed, but actually kind of annoyed!  We aren't ipad people!  I read a real book on the plane, I read blogs on a laptop.  And now we're going to be ipad people.  I won't make him sell it so we can buy Vanguard funds, he's excited and I'm not trying to get divorced over this.  But in a way I'm sad.

I get it.  My house has a number of items in it like that.  I didn't need it, but it was some desirable thing that I either won or was given for some reason.  They just don't get used very much.  Luckily we do have the space to store them...

[waffle]

I really don't get this. Based on your other electronics it doesn't seem like you are adverse to technology, and you certainly aren't adverse to apple products. Are you just anti ipad because you think that getting something useful/convenient for free is going to turn you into an over spending consumer? There is no point of going against the grain simply to go against something.

For me personally I use all apple products and the setup that works great for me is a Mac Mini as my home base and an ipad for portability. Total cost about the same as one MacBook. When the first ipad came out I was in college and jumped on it right away. Just in the first two years of owning it I easily saved over $500 on textbooks since I could find electronic/pdf versions for free or much much cheaper than the print versions.

[Syonyk]

I'll admit to also having purchased an iPad on opening day. Perhaps not the wisest purchase, but they are sure useful. I read a lot of PDF based material and reading several hundred pages of tech manual is a lot nicer on a tablet than at my desk.

Identifying yourself by what you don't own does seem weird to me...

[penguins4everyone!]

The hell is going on?

Let's see:

• You live in San Francisco
• You (apparently exclusively) use Apple products, but you don't want to be seen as "iPad people"
• You want to be "[separated] from the sheeple"
• You're worried about losing "cool points" because your car isn't old enough

My diagnosis is that you've become a hipster. Other symptoms include wearing "vintage" clothes, DIY and/or gardening, and being a snob about organic or "eco-friendly" goods (including non-food goods, such as textiles).

Fortunately, the condition is not fatal -- just annoying to non-hipsters.

HA.  Dr. you may be on to something with this diagnosis.  My husband DOES have a beard, for the record.  And so much flannel.

[surfhb]

There are SO many things my iPad saves me time on.....it's probably the most MMM consumer item around.   

The problem is it can be a time suck.....like scamming this forum on a daily basis.  ;)

[Jack]

There are SO many things my iPad saves me time on.....it's probably the most MMM consumer item around.   

... except for an Android tablet, which would do all the same things at half the price. ; )

The problem is it can be a time suck.....like scamming this forum on a daily basis.  ;)

Well now, that's not very nice at all! You should definitely stop doing that.

[Syonyk]

HA.  Dr. you may be on to something with this diagnosis.  My husband DOES have a beard, for the record.  And so much flannel.

Does he carry a flip phone too? :p  I think we've gotten to the root of the problem here...

... except for an Android tablet, which would do all the same things at half the price. ; )

With a radically reduced selection of actually well written apps, and a lot less reliability.  And if you go too cheap, they're utterly unusable to start with.  Also, depending on what you're doing with them, the 16:9 aspect ratio most of them use is worse for reading PDFs on.

There exist some nice Android tablets, but the cost starts rapidly approaching iPad territory.

[R62]

Identifying yourself by what you don't own does seem weird to me...

Possibly as weird as identifying yourself by what you do own ...

[Syonyk]

Identifying yourself by what you don't own does seem weird to me...

Possibly as weird as identifying yourself by what you do own ...

I totally agree.  Both are letting "stuff" identify you.

[Sayonara925]

The sky...
We only got raindrops.  Also makes me sad.

[mak1277]

Before I got an iPad I couldn't really figure out what I'd use it for.  Then I got one and it was basically attached to me every waking moment for 2+ yrs.  It was my book, my internet, my note pad at work, my tv and on and on.  I don't think I used my home computer one time in two years when I had my iPad.  Then it got stolen...I haven't replaced it...but I still don't use my computer at home.  I don't know if there's a point, but I can say an iPad is the perfect replacement for both mac and iPhone if you're just entertaining yourself at home.

[lifejoy]

I can relate. I don't have a "smart" phone, and it is a small part of my identity. Kind of, look at me - I'm rebelling against your social norms, and I don't value technology the same as you.

That being said... keep an open mind. My ipad has become my ONLY tool. I use it over the desktop, laptop, and cell phone! It's a super handy device, highly portable. Give it a chance?

[penguins4everyone!]

I can relate. I don't have a "smart" phone, and it is a small part of my identity. Kind of, look at me - I'm rebelling against your social norms, and I don't value technology the same as you.

That being said... keep an open mind. My ipad has become my ONLY tool. I use it over the desktop, laptop, and cell phone! It's a super handy device, highly portable. Give it a chance?

Hey lifejoy! I like your tumblr- been following you for a while.  I have some consumer (pinterest fueled) demons and I think you agonize over the pretty thing wants vs. mustachian values in the same way I do.  You might like the blog www.readingmytealeaves.com, fashionable, thoughtful, but minimalist.  The lifestyle blog without the spending. 

I held out on the smart phone for what I felt like was a really long time, my first smartphone was an iphone 5.  I had the same reservations then, I liked being the one with no smart phone.  But now I like being the one that can use my phone GPS to get somewhere quickly, and it really is good entertainment when stuck in a waiting room somewhere.  I think what I might do is see if I can live without my laptop for a month now that we have the ipad, and then if all goes well sell my MacBook.  And I'll buy a Vanguard fund with the proceeds :)   

[jmusic]

We both said, "thank you very much!" and try really hard not to use them to take pictures in front of anyone.

Oh god that drives me futs when people do that!  Definitely out of the cool kids club if you do such, even ONCE, in public!

[guitar_stitch]

I don't know why I'm so bent out of shape about this.  Like it's so bad if I'm sitting on a park bench reading an ipad- a mustachian will walk by and judge me!  I would judge me

Maybe you need to worry less about judgement.  It's wasted mental capacity that can be put to other uses.

[scrubbyfish]

I held out on the smart phone for what I felt like was a really long time [...]  I had the same reservations then, I liked being the one with no smart phone.

ha ha, yeah, I think I value being not a total luddite, but at least one step behind ;)    Why? I dunno. It was true of me before I learned about MMM. I was last in my tribe to get a cell phone, now the one I have is quite old and limited... I have very little tech. I think for me I feel a need to hold out a bit, to help pull back the reigns on consumerism. If I have a crappier phone, no data plan, sporadic internet, and an older laptop, others will know they can too! I guess it's important to me to help slow things down.

But, it's all relative. Two of my family members have even less tech than me, and most of my neighbours have super pokey desktop computers and/or no cell. So, I don't know if I'm helping anyone else go slower, but I know I'm looking to them to help me do so!

[lifejoy]

We both said, "thank you very much!" and try really hard not to use them to take pictures in front of anyone.

Oh god that drives me futs when people do that!  Definitely out of the cool kids club if you do such, even ONCE, in public!

Bwahaha ok so in defense of people who actually do this... It's my only camera! I don't have a smart phone and I don't have a camera. So yeah I look totally lame but it works really well haha

[FIRE me]

woah dang i hope they don't put this down as taxable income for him.  jeez.  They might.  I'm taking an employee benefits class right now and I don't know if this would qualify as "de minimis fringes" or not.

I feel your angst. I have free high dollar life insurance that I don't need or want, and every week I have taxable imputed income added to my pay because of it.

[libertarian4321]

HA.  Dr. you may be on to something with this diagnosis.  My husband DOES have a beard, for the record.  And so much flannel.

Does he carry a flip phone too? :p  I think we've gotten to the root of the problem here...

... except for an Android tablet, which would do all the same things at half the price. ; )

With a radically reduced selection of actually well written apps, and a lot less reliability.  And if you go too cheap, they're utterly unusable to start with.  Also, depending on what you're doing with them, the 16:9 aspect ratio most of them use is worse for reading PDFs on.

There exist some nice Android tablets, but the cost starts rapidly approaching iPad territory.

Really?

Hmm, lets consider that for a moment.

The cheapest junior iPad will set you back $250.  Probably most iFans wouldn't be caught dead with it, because it just ain't iHip enough.  The starting price for iPads iCool enough to actually be seen with among iHipsters will set you back $400 minimum, up to the iHOLYCRAPTHISTHINGISEXPENSIVE at well over $800.

Sure, you can buy Android machines for $50.  I don't know how "reliable" they are as I have never owned one. 

But even the "brand" name Android machines can be purchased for about $175 (Nexus or Galaxy 7), which is a Hell of a lot cheaper than even the cheapest iMoney, er, iPad.

I have a $99 Samsung Galaxy Tab 3 Lite.  Does it have all the bells and whistles of an iEmptyyourwallet?  No.

But it does what I need it to do, and isn't that pretty much what it should do?

So you don't need an iWhatevertheHell. 

Apple has done a masterful job of branding.  They've convinced people to pay exorbitant iPrices for their iCool iProducts.  Their profit margins are MUCH higher than the rest of the industry- and that, my friends, means you are paying far more than the intrinsic "value" of the hardware in the machines.

So if you need all the bells and whistles, or if you are using the iWhatever to impress chicks and get laid, go ahead and buy it.

But for many of us, it isn't necessary to spend that much.

I'm not iHip, I'm not iCool.  I've probably saved tens of thousands over the years buying "boring" but more practical non-Apple products and investing the difference.  I'm just a boring old multimillionaire engineer who has been using computers since the '70s.   Probably since before a lot of you iHipsters were iBorn.  I don't need to pay the iPremium for the iCool, and many of you probably don't, either.

Typed from my very uncool non-Apple DESKTOP (oh, the horror- a PC compatible desktop probably rates about 1 out of 100 on the iCool scale :)

[RetiredAt63]

OK, I now know how uncool I am - Lenovo reconditioned desktop running Windows 7, Asus 8" tablet (bought on sale, no less), Nexus 5 cell phone with no data plan (brand new, old phone died, I used my Fido dollars to pay for it).  Until a year ago I was tablet-less (did have a Kindle, now I use the Kindle app on my tablet, I have COLOUR!!!).

Oh the shame.

[MrStash2000]

Sell one of your three MacBooks and keep the iPad

[Syonyk]

Sure, you can buy Android machines for $50.  I don't know how "reliable" they are as I have never owned one.

Given that they often don't even work for any useful value of work (connect to wifi, run a browser), they don't.

But even the "brand" name Android machines can be purchased for about $175 (Nexus or Galaxy 7), which is a Hell of a lot cheaper than even the cheapest iMoney, er, iPad.

Sure.  And you can get a refurb iPad Mini 2 (with the retina display) for $250 on the Apple Store.  I've got a Nexus 7.  The iPad Mini is a better device unless you value running Android (which, currently, I do).  For the same cost, you can also get an iPad 3 (retina display, still runs the latest iOS) on eBay.  At least for the "reading things" use case, the retina displays are quite nice, and do a great job of making complex full page PDFs readable (I read a lot of academic papers).  So, slightly more expensive than a decent Android device, but not the $800+ you're implying one likely needs to spend.

I have a $99 Samsung Galaxy Tab 3 Lite.  Does it have all the bells and whistles of an iEmptyyourwallet?  No.

If that works for you, awesome.  There are plenty of uses cases in which a 1024x600 resolution display isn't hugely useful.  And what version of Android is it on (Samsung, historically, being "ship-and-forget" with regards to OS updates/security patches/etc).

So you don't need an iWhatevertheHell.

Need?  No.  Works a whole lot better than many Android devices?  Yeah, they do.  And it has more useful apps than Android's large selection of free-to-play addictionware games.  You don't *need* a portable computing device at all, but to claim there's no benefit to anyone from Apple's hardware/software/ecosystem is a bit questionable.

...and that, my friends, means you are paying far more than the intrinsic "value" of the hardware in the machines.

Sure.  A bundle of hardware with no software for it, however, is somewhat useless to me (I mean, I could write an OS for it, but it'd take me a couple years).  So the development that goes into iOS/OS X/etc is of significant value, which is what at least some of the higher cost goes to.  And, for whatever reasons, resale value remains high on the hardware, so TCO can be surprisingly low over a period of time.

Typed from my very uncool non-Apple DESKTOP (oh, the horror- a PC compatible desktop probably rates about 1 out of 100 on the iCool scale :)

On the other hand, your keyboard appears to have a slightly stuck 'i' key. :p

[justajane]

It's interesting to me that having less technology would be part of your identity in such a way that you would be embarrassed when you upgrade. I have a $15 flip phone that I keep because it is cheap and I like being unplugged and "in the moment" when I am out and about. But I am actually embarrassed by this device and only pull it out when absolutely necessary. I never even have it on. I am embarrassed when I tell people that the best way to reach me is my home phone - but obviously not embarrassed enough to change habits that I've had for most of my adult life.

But I'm 37 and far from a hipster, so that probably has something to do with it. In other words, I'm not counter cultural per se. Just cheap, although I do not like the expectation that I can be reached at all times. I do not like it when people whip out their (mostly) Apple devices when we are hanging out. I guess in that sense my reasons for being a "hold out" are more nuanced than I think. But it's not because I'm just "not a smartphone person."

Having said all that, my pride in having never purchased anything by Apple probably approximates the OP's thoughts about holding out so long in having an ipad. It's a kind of reverse snobbery.

[In the hole]

I actually know what you mean. I used to drive a 1994 geo metro with a bad starter (compression started it every day for months on end, always had to park facing downhill), dodgy 2nd gear that I eventually just stopped using (probably the synchro? Transmissions may as well run on magic for all I know) and many duct tape-assisted exterior parts. I loved it more than any other car, precisely because it was so dilapidated yet unkillable.

Now I drive a three year old Honda Fit with an automatic transmission. It's better in every possible measure than the old geo, but I still feel kind of bummed out by it. I would rather be the guy in my apartment complex with the old Pontiac he keeps going by tooling on it every weekend. There's definitely a twisted sense of superiority that comes from not having fancy things in our consumer culture.

But make no mistake, you and I are still being judgmental and insecure. Just because the value system is inverted doesn't make it ok for us to look down our noses at people with nice things, any more than it would be to do so in the more traditional direction.

[Syonyk]

I would rather be the guy in my apartment complex with the old Pontiac he keeps going by tooling on it every weekend.

Geo Metro starters are *not* hard to replace. :p  Just saying.

While I can't quite understand your preference for Pontiacs, I certainly agree about keeping older vehicles running.  I'd genuinely much rather drive an old 70s Jag or something, even if it was a maintenance intensive garage queen, than a new luxury car (for a "fun" car - probably not as a daily driver).  Though that may also be due to the V-12 sounding incredible. :)

I intend to keep my truck on the road pretty much indefinitely.  It's 20 years old now, and if it hauls my casket away from my funeral, I'd be quite happy (assuming said funeral is another 60-70 years off... I'd be quite annoyed if it were this month).