How do professionals in careers that need a nice car handle it?

[mpg350]

Actually if you read The Millionaire Next Door most don't drive a BMW..typical car was a Ford F150 or something like that.
 

[Chris22]

Amongst people who bothered to fill out a survey and/or meet face to face with the MND authors.  There's a TON of bias in that study. 

[mpg350]

I know plenty of rich people and they don’t drive all drive fancy Porches or BMWs and they are worth well over a million dollars.


You also seem to be confusing wealth with income.  I know people that make a high income and look “rich” but when it comes to wealth they have nothing but piles of debt and are just a lost job from it going to crap.

All of that is for another post.

[northernlights]

My husband drives a fully loaded 3 year old Mazda sedan. It doesn't look flashy from the street, but it has all the bells and whistles you'd expect an attorney to have and he gets it washed/vacuumed regularly. I think it's just as nice inside as the Audis or BMWs other attorneys drive but we paid half what they did. I'm grateful I'm in government and will keep trucking in my unloaded hatchback for as long as it runs.

[BlueHouse]

This is so true.  My former boss is an old-money attorney.  His money goes way back to the early 1800s.  He isn't impressed by his own wealth or anyone else's.  He drives a crappy car and doesn't even notice.  Once I had to ride along with him to visit a client.  He drove an old beater van that he had driven his son and his buddies in to a soccer match the day before.  The thing smelled to high heaven of stale burgers and fries and guess what - there were burger and fries wrappers and bags all over the floor.  It was enough to gag a maggot.  The next time we had to visit the client, I drove him in my Honda Civic.  Forty minutes in the car with the dirt and stench of his vehicle was way too much for me.  This guy has inherited wealth of over 10 million dollars.  He doesn't need to prove a thing to anybody.  But he's a slob about his vehicle and his office, although he is always dressed impeccably.

Not exactly the kind of impression that I want to make on my clients. But if you're that rich, then you can afford to be "eccentric"

[TheBeardedIrishman]

Actually if you read The Millionaire Next Door most don't drive a BMW..typical car was a Ford F150 or something like that.
 

Yes it is !

[Lexaholik]

(However this general principle doesn't hold if you service clients from a lower socioeconomic background. To them it's important to appear successful by displaying outward signs of wealth.)


I once worked for a plaintiff side medical malpractice firm that had extremely shady business behaviors.  The offices were lavish with marble floors and fireplaces, expensive Oriental rugs, etc.  They drove top-of-the-line cars.  Their client base was mostly drawn from people in the lower socioeconomic strata, and I guess these kinds of trappings impressed them.  However, having worked for them, I know that they charged their lunches to files every single day, even if they were eating just across the street, charged for every single fax and photocopy etc.. IOW, they nickel-and-dimed their clients, which reduced the size of the checks their clients received when they won their cases.  I lasted there about five months - and if I ever needed the services of an attorney who charged on a contingency fee basis, you can bet that I would ask a lot of questions about whether they were going to be charging for things like this.  (The law firm I work for now does not charge for regular mailings, faxes, phone calls and photocopies unless the number is excessive, which they determine on a case-by-case basis.)  I think it does indeed depend on your client base whether having the trappings of wealth impresses them or turns them off.  I would wonder if clients were being overcharged in order to allow these professionals to afford their Jaguars and their Mont Blanc pens.  Someone else might think, "Gee, these guys must be very successful to make so much money."

I didn't see this until just now. This is just terrible--low income clients are often screwed over by the system but then on top of that, they get screwed over by their own attorneys. Makes me so angry. 

[DoubleDown]

I agree that a good, used, classic luxury car is a great solution. You can find amazing deals on slightly older cars that are well maintained. The depreciation on them is ridiculous, as I suppose lots of people in the luxury markets always want the latest and greatest. Last year I bought a 2006 used Jaguar that looks like new, with low mileage, for only $8k. It's been a great car for me.

[2Birds1Stone]

My friend just picked up a 1999 Jaguar XJR for $3750. CLEAN interior/exterior with just under 100k miles on the motor. This is a car you can feel good about driving and for that price it's an ABSOLUTE steal =D

[chesebert]

Former chairman of a prominent NYC law firm makes 5+mil a year (that's over 400k per month) and drives a Subaru Forester and washes his own dishes. That should put the attorney needs fancy car fallacy to rest.

[clarkfan1979]

I am expected to drive a shitty car. That is part of the reason why I chose my profession.

[svb]

I'd buy an old luxury/classic car in mint condition and try to project an image somewhere between waspy old money and Don Draper.

Exactly. The Mercedes W123 or W124 is the perfect car for that situation: luxurious, built like a tank (and much cheaper to fix than newer Mercedes), available with a (relatively) frugal turbodiesel engine and sometimes even a manual transmission. What more could you want?

The key, of course, is it's gotta be mint -- it has to come across as "classic," not "old." Think like this.

have been reading this site for a couple months and registered to say that I am doing exactly this. The "Roger" clip is spot on, and is one I send to my friends on what seems like a frequent basis. they rarely listen.

I'm an attorney at a small/mid-size defense firm in Los Angeles. I have some private clients but mostly rely on the firm's large insurance defense business that keeps us profitable. Most of those clients are individual insureds whose policy is paying for me and thus have little say, if any, in their choice of attorney. I do have to care somewhat though, as I imagine someone telling their adjuster "that guy you hired showed up to inspect my property in a worn out 1992 Buick" might not go over that well.

I've avoided too much flash, but currently have a 2013 Audi A3 diesel on which I have a car loan that thankfully I will be getting rid of shortly when it is bought back by VW/Audi per the terms of the settlement of the diesel scandal lawsuits. Having recently stumbled on this site, I thought this was the perfect opportunity to use the surplus I'll be getting from the settlement to fund a cash purchase of a used car. But with my profession, and moreover, with my lifelong auto enthusiasm to satiate, a completely-utilitarian and sensible pick wasn't going to cut it. I settled on a W123 and I think it fits the needs perfectly. Oh also, I'm doing nearly all the work on it myself, which many in my profession probably couldn't say they're capable of. So that makes a difference too, since parts on a Honda would certainly be cheaper, but I can balance it out somewhat with labor, and the happiness I get from learning new skills whenever I get to repairs that I haven't tackled before.

I picked this 1984 300d up in July for $5k with 183k miles on it. It's not mint, but it's close enough that it functions as a totally serviceable daily driver and so far I've had nothing but compliments from the two clients I've visited driving it. The key was finding one with an interior in good shape, as there are countless examples on Craigslist for $3k or less with interiors that are complete disasters. I feel like I may have overpaid slightly, but after watching the LA market for W123s for about 2 years, it appeared that a decent interior meant a jump in the price bracket to the $5-10k range.



Once my Audi is gone, I plan to budget for repairs on the Merc but those numbers will be drastically reduced from what the car payment was on the Audi.

It was cheap to buy, is cheap to insure, gets decent enough mileage, and has world-renowned long-term endurance/reliability if properly maintained. Yet, if kept looking nice, this car will project "connoisseur" in a way that I think Roger would approve of, without the steep buy-in of the average connoisseur car.

This was right after I purchased it:



And this is after initial work (suspension, lighting, and bringing basic maintenance up to date).



Next is putting the alloy wheels it originally came with back on with a fresh set of tires now that I've completely redone the front suspension and put it into alignment (had to pretty much replace everything). I'm having the wheels powder coated which I think should really help project the clean/mint condition look along with the clean face the Euro headlights/turn signals give. There are so many of these running around LA with wheels covered in age and brake dust that clean ones should really make a difference. Some people like the hubcaps but they're not to my taste (and not what this one originally came with anyway).

[GetItRight]

Lawyer or RE agent needs a "nice car"? They just need to get from A to B reliably in something clean and presentable. A professional driver (of people, not goods) is the only job I can think of where a nice car is required, or at least very beneficial.

A few grand can buy a reliable and presentable car, perfectly suitable for a "professional". I think less of those who borrow money for a vehicle, buy a new vehicle very few years, or are too dumb to learn how to maintain their vehicle.

[Rufus.T.Firefly]

Road warrior here. I drive a Honda Fit. Most of my clients are business owners. As such, they're usually impressed with the economy of such a choice and ask things like "what kind of gas mileage do you get?"

Some of these people are multi-millionaires. Occasionally they are driving fancy cars, but most drive economy cars. And most of my clients that have a lot of money don't show it off because they don't want anyone to know how much they have.

The downside if I drove a fancy car is that the client may assume they're funding my fancy-pants lifestyle.

[franklin w. dixon]

Just buy like 3-4 cheap cars and weld them together into one super car

[ctardi]

I know and work with dozens of millionaires (my office is in the executive hallway of a F100 subsidiary).  Some drive nice cars.  Some drive shitty cars.  Some pay cash.  Some lease.  Some finance.  One drove a 10y/o Chrysler Sebring and a 20 y/o BMW he bought restored, and then went out one day and bought a $120k Porsche on a whim (5+ years ago, he still drives it).  Several of them do, in fact, drive BMWs.  But most of them drive Mercedes.  Our CEO drives a Mercedes, our CFO drives a Porsche, the Executive VPGM of my division drives a BMW.  All made $1M+ last year. 

Generalizations are fun.

Does earning more than $1M in a year make someone a millionaire?

[pudding]

Im a bit of a part time pimp... kinda thinking my BMW is part of the deal

[Jack]

I'd buy an old luxury/classic car in mint condition and try to project an image somewhere between waspy old money and Don Draper.

Exactly. The Mercedes W123 or W124 is the perfect car for that situation: luxurious, built like a tank (and much cheaper to fix than newer Mercedes), available with a (relatively) frugal turbodiesel engine and sometimes even a manual transmission. What more could you want?

The key, of course, is it's gotta be mint -- it has to come across as "classic," not "old." Think like this.

have been reading this site for a couple months and registered to say that I am doing exactly this. The "Roger" clip is spot on, and is one I send to my friends on what seems like a frequent basis. they rarely listen.

Awesome! And nice car!

[ketchup]

GF and I solved this with a nice-looking newish car with a shitload of very-well-maintained highway miles on it.  We just bought a 2009 Hyundai Accent with 250,000 miles for $1000.

It'll be nice for her to drive up to her clients in that instead of our big old ugly-and-rumbly '92 Buick station wagon we lost a month ago.

[svb]

Lawyer or RE agent needs a "nice car"? They just need to get from A to B reliably in something clean and presentable.

In many cases, that won't be enough.

I got to witness proof first hand last week. At a recent site visit, defense counsel showed up driving a beige Toyota Camry that looked about 10+ years old. A comment was made by a bystander "well, I don't think they're paying him enough." I don't necessarily agree with the sentiment, but the fact remains that people like this exist, they have these opinions, and they may make hiring decisions or be potential clients, so govern your choices accordingly.

[Last Night]

I am part of the young professional crew that needs a presentable car and there are definitely easy ways to do this without breaking the bank.

I drive an 9 year old Japanese luxury car that people think is a year or two old because of the general upkeep and quality of paint.  This is strictly my work car and I baby it for those reasons and I rarely drive it outside of work.  My weekend warrior is my wife's 12 year old Toyota that we share otherwise.

Generalizations are cast wide and presentation (from car, to body language, to clothing) can very much make or break your deals/career regardless of what the masses think.  The good thing is there are still "mustachian" ways of achieving the look.  It does suck that we are judged on appearance and perceived wealth from material possessions, but it has happened since forever and will continue into eternity.  Embrace it, don't fall victim to it and enjoy.  It's actually fun to look better off than someone who spent 5x to 10x what you did, but perceived $ value image is the same lol

[use2betrix]

I understand that people might have 10+ year old cars that are in excellent shape as "if they were new." But I promise you - no one is going to honestly think a 10+ year old car is a year or two old if they know anything about cars. Nearly every model I can think of has changed design at least once or twice in the last 10 years. Jeep Wrangler is about the only one I can think of that was last changed exterior wise in 2007. Granted it has received different interior and engine upgrades.

[Jack]

I understand that people might have 10+ year old cars that are in excellent shape as "if they were new." But I promise you - no one is going to honestly think a 10+ year old car is a year or two old if they know anything about cars. Nearly every model I can think of has changed design at least once or twice in the last 10 years. Jeep Wrangler is about the only one I can think of that was last changed exterior wise in 2007. Granted it has received different interior and engine upgrades.

On the bright side, people who know about cars are (in my estimation, at least) more likely to realize how smart owning the 10+ year old car is, and appreciate (a) your sense of taste in carefully picking the right one (which is why this strategy doesn't work with a Camry), and (b) your diligence in keeping it immaculate.

[Papa Mustache]

I understand that people might have 10+ year old cars that are in excellent shape as "if they were new." But I promise you - no one is going to honestly think a 10+ year old car is a year or two old if they know anything about cars. Nearly every model I can think of has changed design at least once or twice in the last 10 years. Jeep Wrangler is about the only one I can think of that was last changed exterior wise in 2007. Granted it has received different interior and engine upgrades.

I have a very ordinary older VW grocery getter. After I bought it I had a couple of people who commented that they thought VW went out of business when they quit selling aircooled Beetles in the USA. This was a decade or so ago. Older folks that didn't pay attention to the brands of cars around them. 

People can be very myopic about some things. 

[Last Night]

I understand that people might have 10+ year old cars that are in excellent shape as "if they were new." But I promise you - no one is going to honestly think a 10+ year old car is a year or two old if they know anything about cars. Nearly every model I can think of has changed design at least once or twice in the last 10 years. Jeep Wrangler is about the only one I can think of that was last changed exterior wise in 2007. Granted it has received different interior and engine upgrades.

You've entirely missed the point.

There are many decade old cars that have aged well and look presentable, whether they look 1-2 years old or 5-6 years old but are 15 years old.  90%+ of the population wouldn't know either way...is it shiny? Yes, is it clean? Yes....that's about as detail oriented as most people get, with "brand" being up there, but surprisingly not everyone pays attention.

Take a decade old Lexus GS...you think if you told someone it's a 2013 they would question you? Obviously not the point and nobody cares...but to the general public this looks like a relatively new/fancy car, but it's over a decade old:




We've enjoyed about 2 decades of very similar styling refreshes so many of the redesigns blend from generation to generation.  It's not like when we moved from square bodied 80's vehicles into the rounder/more feminine body lines on vehicles in the 90's.  Playing off a 1980's car as a 1990's would be next to impossible even to the general population, but playing off a mid 2000's model for a mid '10 model, sure.

[Bracken_Joy]

Partially I think it depends if your clients are seeing the outside or inside of your car. For DH, they only ever see the exterior really. We ended up buying a VW Jetta TDI (sigh... recall). It was less than a year old, 30k miles on it. Someone else took the depreciation hit for us. Most importantly, it was the lowest trim level. Looks great on the outside, and no one needs to know you only have pretty basic features. Most people do not pay *that* close of attention. We keep it clean and detailed, and he gets compliments on it all the time. Never mind that my 5 year old truck is worth twice as much money. =P It's the little jetta that gets all the compliments.

[svb]

I understand that people might have 10+ year old cars that are in excellent shape as "if they were new." But I promise you - no one is going to honestly think a 10+ year old car is a year or two old if they know anything about cars. Nearly every model I can think of has changed design at least once or twice in the last 10 years. Jeep Wrangler is about the only one I can think of that was last changed exterior wise in 2007. Granted it has received different interior and engine upgrades.

You've entirely missed the point.

Sorry to disagree but I think actually you have missed the point. A 10 year old luxury car like that Lexus may fool some people, but to anyone in the know, a 10 year old luxury car is just old. A 30 year old luxury car is (or at least is more likely to be) a classic.

The point is that while the 10 year old Lexus may well be reasonable and a practical & pragmatic choice, it doesn't really stand up to scrutiny of the kind being discussed here. It may suit your needs, but it fails the "Roger Test."

[effigy98]

We buy luxury cars, but get them after the 3 or 4 year lease, they are really inexpensive compared to the initial price (60k down to 25k) and usually come with an additional 2 to 4 year warranty which you will easily burn thru because usually something goes wrong with them. I usually sell them for a little less than I bought them for after the warranty expires. It works out to probably around 2k a year to drive Porsches and BMWs.

[Jack]

Sorry to disagree but I think actually you have missed the point. A 10 year old luxury car like that Lexus may fool some people, but to anyone in the know, a 10 year old luxury car is just old. A 30 year old luxury car is (or at least is more likely to be) a classic.

The point is that while the 10 year old Lexus may well be reasonable and a practical & pragmatic choice, it doesn't really stand up to scrutiny of the kind being discussed here. It may suit your needs, but it fails the "Roger Test."

It depends. IMO, a 2006 Lexus ES 350 would fail the Roger Test, while a 2006 Lexus IS 350 with a manual transmission would pass it. (Of course, a 2005 IS 300 would pass by a wider margin.)

[Chris22]

Partially I think it depends if your clients are seeing the outside or inside of your car. For DH, they only ever see the exterior really. We ended up buying a VW Jetta TDI (sigh... recall). It was less than a year old, 30k miles on it. Someone else took the depreciation hit for us. Most importantly, it was the lowest trim level. Looks great on the outside, and no one needs to know you only have pretty basic features. Most people do not pay *that* close of attention. We keep it clean and detailed, and he gets compliments on it all the time. Never mind that my 5 year old truck is worth twice as much money. =P It's the little jetta that gets all the compliments.

What sort of discount did you get?  Pre-scandal, TDI VWs had some of the lowest depreciation rates out there and were precisely the sorts of cars that it made basically no sense to buy "nearly new".  I'd be shocked if you got a material discount (again assuming you bought pre-scandal) baring some sort of damage, heinous color, etc.

[Bracken_Joy]

Partially I think it depends if your clients are seeing the outside or inside of your car. For DH, they only ever see the exterior really. We ended up buying a VW Jetta TDI (sigh... recall). It was less than a year old, 30k miles on it. Someone else took the depreciation hit for us. Most importantly, it was the lowest trim level. Looks great on the outside, and no one needs to know you only have pretty basic features. Most people do not pay *that* close of attention. We keep it clean and detailed, and he gets compliments on it all the time. Never mind that my 5 year old truck is worth twice as much money. =P It's the little jetta that gets all the compliments.

What sort of discount did you get?  Pre-scandal, TDI VWs had some of the lowest depreciation rates out there and were precisely the sorts of cars that it made basically no sense to buy "nearly new".  I'd be shocked if you got a material discount (again assuming you bought pre-scandal) baring some sort of damage, heinous color, etc.

It was a manual and they were moving into a studio with a new baby and no parking spot. They'd had it on CL for more than a month. We low-balled, and they accepted. Apparently no one likes buying manuals.

[JLee]

I understand that people might have 10+ year old cars that are in excellent shape as "if they were new." But I promise you - no one is going to honestly think a 10+ year old car is a year or two old if they know anything about cars. Nearly every model I can think of has changed design at least once or twice in the last 10 years. Jeep Wrangler is about the only one I can think of that was last changed exterior wise in 2007. Granted it has received different interior and engine upgrades.

You've entirely missed the point.

Sorry to disagree but I think actually you have missed the point. A 10 year old luxury car like that Lexus may fool some people, but to anyone in the know, a 10 year old luxury car is just old. A 30 year old luxury car is (or at least is more likely to be) a classic.

The point is that while the 10 year old Lexus may well be reasonable and a practical & pragmatic choice, it doesn't really stand up to scrutiny of the kind being discussed here. It may suit your needs, but it fails the "Roger Test."

It's somewhat similar for sports cars, IMO.  There's an age where it looks like you're definitely driving it because you want to, and not because you can't afford something newer. This only holds true if it's in excellent condition, of course.

For example, my Toyota is over 25 years old and has north of 260k on it.

[Last Night]

I understand that people might have 10+ year old cars that are in excellent shape as "if they were new." But I promise you - no one is going to honestly think a 10+ year old car is a year or two old if they know anything about cars. Nearly every model I can think of has changed design at least once or twice in the last 10 years. Jeep Wrangler is about the only one I can think of that was last changed exterior wise in 2007. Granted it has received different interior and engine upgrades.

You've entirely missed the point.

Sorry to disagree but I think actually you have missed the point. A 10 year old luxury car like that Lexus may fool some people, but to anyone in the know, a 10 year old luxury car is just old. A 30 year old luxury car is (or at least is more likely to be) a classic.

The point is that while the 10 year old Lexus may well be reasonable and a practical & pragmatic choice, it doesn't really stand up to scrutiny of the kind being discussed here. It may suit your needs, but it fails the "Roger Test."

lol

[Last Night]

Sorry to disagree but I think actually you have missed the point. A 10 year old luxury car like that Lexus may fool some people, but to anyone in the know, a 10 year old luxury car is just old. A 30 year old luxury car is (or at least is more likely to be) a classic.

The point is that while the 10 year old Lexus may well be reasonable and a practical & pragmatic choice, it doesn't really stand up to scrutiny of the kind being discussed here. It may suit your needs, but it fails the "Roger Test."

It depends. IMO, a 2006 Lexus ES 350 would fail the Roger Test, while a 2006 Lexus IS 350 with a manual transmission would pass it. (Of course, a 2005 IS 300 would pass by a wider margin.)

That gen IS350 didn't come in manual.

[Jack]

Sorry to disagree but I think actually you have missed the point. A 10 year old luxury car like that Lexus may fool some people, but to anyone in the know, a 10 year old luxury car is just old. A 30 year old luxury car is (or at least is more likely to be) a classic.

The point is that while the 10 year old Lexus may well be reasonable and a practical & pragmatic choice, it doesn't really stand up to scrutiny of the kind being discussed here. It may suit your needs, but it fails the "Roger Test."

It depends. IMO, a 2006 Lexus ES 350 would fail the Roger Test, while a 2006 Lexus IS 350 with a manual transmission would pass it. (Of course, a 2005 IS 300 would pass by a wider margin.)

That gen IS350 didn't come in manual.

IS 250, then? I guess that goes to show that I'm not a big fan of Lexus. (This whole analogy would have worked better with BMWs...)

[Syonyk]

We've enjoyed about 2 decades of very similar styling refreshes so many of the redesigns blend from generation to generation.  It's not like when we moved from square bodied 80's vehicles into the rounder/more feminine body lines on vehicles in the 90's.  Playing off a 1980's car as a 1990's would be next to impossible even to the general population, but playing off a mid 2000's model for a mid '10 model, sure.

The point here, I don't think, is to try and claim a 10 year old luxury car is new.  It can certainly be well maintained, but it still looks like you're just driving an older car.

Go 20-30 years back?  Into the 80s or 90s style, with a well maintained car, both cosmetically and mechanically?  That's clearly something you drive because you love that car.

It's somewhat similar for sports cars, IMO.  There's an age where it looks like you're definitely driving it because you want to, and not because you can't afford something newer. This only holds true if it's in excellent condition, of course.

Yup.  A 90s BMW stands out as a 90s BMW - and if you're still driving it, and it runs great, you're probably doing so because you like that car, not because you can't afford a newer one.

At some point I'm planning to do a frame up restoration on an old RX-7... :)

[Jack]

Yup.  A 90s BMW stands out as a 90s BMW - and if you're still driving it, and it runs great, you're probably doing so because you like that car, not because you can't afford a newer one.

When I eventually need a four-door car, hopefully it will be something like this:

At some point I'm planning to do a frame up restoration on an old RX-7... :)

At the autocross this weekend, there was a guy with a third-gen RX-7. As he was doing his fourth run, the announcer said something like "as the owner of an RX-7 that's capable of doing three autocross runs without catching on fire, this guy's already won."

[Syonyk]

At the autocross this weekend, there was a guy with a third-gen RX-7. As he was doing his fourth run, the announcer said something like "as the owner of an RX-7 that's capable of doing three autocross runs without catching on fire, this guy's already won."

I... um.

I may have made some "You know you're an RX-7 owner if..." shirts a long while ago.

One of the entries is, "You carry a fire extinguisher, you've used it on your car, and you still drive that car."

[Mr Dorothy Dollar]

Lawyers should be more worried about billable hrs. If a lawyer is in the rain making business, the lawyer should be selling her skillset not her ride.

As to real-estate agent both my best agents had crappy cars. I found them based on reviews and recommendations. The one that had a nice car was not worth the commission.

Be the change in the world you want. Judge people based on less material qualities and be less concerned with material qualities.