Author Topic: Gold, silver and stockpiling food  (Read 3791 times)

PDXTabs

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Re: Gold, silver and stockpiling food
« Reply #50 on: June 11, 2019, 08:46:11 AM »
The average yahoo today would have none of those except "never fired a shot / never hit a target"
and would be far less effective than the already hopelessly ineffective average individual WW2 rifleman. They would make the French resistance look very effective by comparison.

I like the sentiment of your post more than the content. I think that you underestimate how many young people we have sent to Iraq and Afghanistan in the last 16 years. I think that you also underestimate the deterrent effect of eight adults with AR-15s and body armor hunkered down when three of them have seen combat before.

In total, all services contributed 3.1 million troop-years of experience and 58 percent of those years can be attributed to the Army. According to RAND, 1.33 million individuals deployed with the Army between 2001 and 2015 (including the Reserve and National Guard), along with 563,000 from the Navy, 518,000 from the Air Force and 367,000 Marines. Considering the length of the wars in Iraq and Afghanistan, a substantial number of those serving across all services have gone on several deployments. Around 225,000 soldiers who served with the Army deployed at least three times or more. - https://www.forbes.com/sites/niallmccarthy/2018/03/20/2-77-million-service-members-have-served-on-5-4-million-deployments-since-911-infographic/

That doesn't even consider the military contractors, but those folks are almost universally ex-military anyway. It also doesn't count anyone that served in the 90s.
« Last Edit: June 11, 2019, 08:49:47 AM by PDXTabs »

cowpuncher10

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Re: Gold, silver and stockpiling food
« Reply #51 on: June 11, 2019, 09:07:59 AM »
Making sure you vote is likely a far more efficient prepping strategy than any stockpiling.

There is serious economic research tying representative democracy to a specific type of economic disaster - famine and food shortage (google ‘Amartya Sen’ and his work on femine). It seems reasonable to me that other types of man made disasters (war, regime change etc) would also have a strong causal relationship with representative democracy.

It can’t happen here in the US you say??

Consider, two of the last three presidents were first elected with minority vote. They appointed three out of the 9 lifetime USSC justices while only having the mandate from a minority of the population. We have already seen the unnecessary wars, an economic crisis likely partially caused by extreme right wing economic policies etc etc etc..

The stockpiling of alcohol and cigarettes might become necessary if this erosion of democracy continues.

You're right. Far left wing economic policies have worked so well before in the past....and now for Venezuela....

Partial implementation of them worked rather well in US, during 60s.
They do continue to work really well in Scandinavian countries.

You don’t think American policies will work in America??

Venezuela relate to the so called ‘left wing’ policies in the same way Somalia relate to right wing policies. Everything - defense, law, police, justice, economy - are all in private hands there. It’s total free market. No silly government to impose property rights and such. That must be an utopia??!!

Yeah those Scandanavian countries are doing SO well right now. Not like there aren't some cracks in the facade to their social welfare systems starting to show or anything....https://www.reuters.com/article/us-denmark-election-welfare-insight/danes-make-welfare-a-hot-election-issue-as-cracks-show-in-nordic-model-idUSKCN1SZ0IC

Equating Somalia to "right wing" politics is hilarious. Not like it is in a region that has been war torn due to religious or ethnic ideologies....I guess by that same token we can start saying that Venezuela is now showing right wing policies due to the "free market" that is popping up by failures in their government.

I am firmly of the belief that constant relating everything to politics is boring, tiresome, and honestly lazy.

I am a moderate. I have voted multi party in the same election several times before you trot out the whole bigoted racist trumpist lines because I MUST fit in one of those boxes as a fiscally conservative, 2A supporting, socially liberal individual. Please do continue though and tell us of all the free market economies that have brought about ruin to entire countries though...

SunnyDays

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Re: Gold, silver and stockpiling food
« Reply #52 on: June 11, 2019, 09:09:25 AM »
Although I don't own any, I do think gold might have a place, but probably not in bar form, unless way down the road when a semi-banking situation re-emerges.  I mean, who's going to trade a whole bar for a loaf of bread (or whatever)?  If it's to be used in any practical form like that, then small amounts, like jewelry, make more sense.  But I'll put my bets on toilet paper being a highly valuable item!

ericrugiero

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Re: Gold, silver and stockpiling food
« Reply #53 on: June 11, 2019, 11:36:33 AM »
Gold and silver seems like a good option to have as a hedge but it won't be useful in every scenario. 

If some kind of apocalypse happens I would definitely want to have some guns to defend myself and my family.  That doesn't mean it's sensible to stockpile bunches of guns and many thousands of rounds of ammo.  Just a few guns and a few hundred rounds would be enough. 

Probably the best thing to own would be some basic foods and other consumables.  Olive oil was mentioned above and that makes sense.  What are other items that it makes sense to save?  Preferably things that are reasonably priced, have a long shelf life and could sustain a family for a few months. 

Khaetra

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Re: Gold, silver and stockpiling food
« Reply #54 on: June 11, 2019, 12:00:54 PM »
Probably the best thing to own would be some basic foods and other consumables.  Olive oil was mentioned above and that makes sense.  What are other items that it makes sense to save?  Preferably things that are reasonably priced, have a long shelf life and could sustain a family for a few months.

Rice and dried beans are the first things besides water I would add to the list.

ctuser1

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Re: Gold, silver and stockpiling food
« Reply #55 on: June 11, 2019, 08:33:55 PM »
Yeah those Scandanavian countries are doing SO well right now. Not like there aren't some cracks in the facade to their social welfare systems starting to show or anything....https://www.reuters.com/article/us-denmark-election-welfare-insight/danes-make-welfare-a-hot-election-issue-as-cracks-show-in-nordic-model-idUSKCN1SZ0IC
I can show you a gazillion links showing they have a lot more financial mobility than US allows it's kids.
And the cracks you speak of is no larger than what we have in the US and addressing them is no harder than it is here.

Equating Somalia to "right wing" politics is hilarious.
And equating Venezuela to current US "left wing" politics is kosher??

Hypocrisy much??

Maybe you would consider right wing utopias of some parts of Afghanistan as less hilarious versions of your model then? Parts where government has disappeared and everything is privatized??

I am firmly of the belief that constant relating everything to politics is boring, tiresome, and honestly lazy.
Must be another present day conservative belief, where I am supposed to pay no attention to what you do but only to what you say!
 
I did not bring explicit partisan politics to this thread, but simply pointed out that the abysmally low voter participation indirectly causes the erosion of participatory democracy in the US - as evidenced by frequent recurrence of minority rule. Fixing this would likely act to counteract the "doomsday scenarios" being talked about in this thread.
This "constant relating everything to" partisan politics was done by you.

I am a moderate. I have voted multi party in the same election several times before you trot out the whole bigoted racist trumpist lines because I MUST fit in one of those boxes as a fiscally conservative, 2A supporting, socially liberal individual. Please do continue though and tell us of all the free market economies that have brought about ruin to entire countries though...
"I have a black friend", strawman - all wrapped into one. A fantastic "conservative" defence.

Did I, or the left wing you speak of, ever mention "market economies" to be evil?

Radagast

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Re: Gold, silver and stockpiling food
« Reply #56 on: June 11, 2019, 09:41:31 PM »
I like the sentiment of your post more than the content. I think that you underestimate how many young people we have sent to Iraq and Afghanistan in the last 16 years. I think that you also underestimate the deterrent effect of eight adults with AR-15s and body armor hunkered down when three of them have seen combat before.
Well sure just imagine 8 US veterans of the US-Mexico war out stopping General Sherman. 8 young German veterans of the Franco-Prussian War with their full 1870 service equipment in All Quiet on the Western Front being ground to dust (ok, chronologically that doesn't quite work I think). 8 Cossack veterans of the Eastern Front off to stop the barbaric Red Horde in 1919 (the Cossacks were the best the empire had, I recently read a British account). 8 French veterans of WW1 with the best rifles of 1917 repelling the Blitzkrieg. 8 Japanese service members newly returned from Nanjing with sidearms to defend Hiroshima. 8 aging US veterans valiantly shooting down hypersonic missiles or millions of solar powered artificially intelligent autonomous insect aircraft with infrared eyes (foreign vs. domestic enemy?). To have a chance, you better also have 100,000 or 100,000,000 like minded buddies with bleeding edge technology and supreme organization. If the best buddies fail to keep the nation alive after all, I'd rather have a hill of beans. And if I later found I lived through to a time of prosperity despite everything, a few gold coins from my past self would seem better than a few thousand rounds.

cowpuncher10

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Re: Gold, silver and stockpiling food
« Reply #57 on: June 12, 2019, 06:13:45 AM »
Yeah those Scandanavian countries are doing SO well right now. Not like there aren't some cracks in the facade to their social welfare systems starting to show or anything....https://www.reuters.com/article/us-denmark-election-welfare-insight/danes-make-welfare-a-hot-election-issue-as-cracks-show-in-nordic-model-idUSKCN1SZ0IC
I can show you a gazillion links showing they have a lot more financial mobility than US allows it's kids.
And the cracks you speak of is no larger than what we have in the US and addressing them is no harder than it is here.

Equating Somalia to "right wing" politics is hilarious.
And equating Venezuela to current US "left wing" politics is kosher??

Hypocrisy much??

Maybe you would consider right wing utopias of some parts of Afghanistan as less hilarious versions of your model then? Parts where government has disappeared and everything is privatized??

I am firmly of the belief that constant relating everything to politics is boring, tiresome, and honestly lazy.
Must be another present day conservative belief, where I am supposed to pay no attention to what you do but only to what you say!
 
I did not bring explicit partisan politics to this thread, but simply pointed out that the abysmally low voter participation indirectly causes the erosion of participatory democracy in the US - as evidenced by frequent recurrence of minority rule. Fixing this would likely act to counteract the "doomsday scenarios" being talked about in this thread.
This "constant relating everything to" partisan politics was done by you.

I am a moderate. I have voted multi party in the same election several times before you trot out the whole bigoted racist trumpist lines because I MUST fit in one of those boxes as a fiscally conservative, 2A supporting, socially liberal individual. Please do continue though and tell us of all the free market economies that have brought about ruin to entire countries though...
"I have a black friend", strawman - all wrapped into one. A fantastic "conservative" defence.

Did I, or the left wing you speak of, ever mention "market economies" to be evil?

Ah yes. Resorting to the strawman fallacy when presented with a fact. Sorry I don't fit into your box bud. Must be tough with that dogmatic approach of yours.

I'm sorry, actually I'm not, that your Somalia example and my example of Venezuela don't line up in your mind. One of which is in one of the most unstable regions of the world, which you seem incapable of grasping, and the other which was a beacon of "left wing" policies before succumbing to...."left wing" policies.

I hope you can get back on topic, stockpiling precious metals, and leave politics to the side. It does seem like it may be a challenge to you though since everything is due to the "evil" conservatives....smh

Nickyd£g

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Re: Gold, silver and stockpiling food
« Reply #58 on: June 12, 2019, 06:14:00 AM »
I live in the UK and am prepping for Brexit. Seriously, if we get a no deal Brexit we can expect delays of all goods plus economic recession, if not collapse. So I've prepped 6 months of food, toiletries, toilet paper and meds, and opened a few credit cards at 0% in case i need to leave the country. Obviously, we don't have guns and gold etc will be useless.

Imma

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Re: Gold, silver and stockpiling food
« Reply #59 on: June 12, 2019, 06:54:08 AM »
I live in the UK and am prepping for Brexit. Seriously, if we get a no deal Brexit we can expect delays of all goods plus economic recession, if not collapse. So I've prepped 6 months of food, toiletries, toilet paper and meds, and opened a few credit cards at 0% in case i need to leave the country. Obviously, we don't have guns and gold etc will be useless.

I think this is sensible. In your position I would also make sure I have medication and a decent stockpile of food, especially imported food that you use on a daily basis like olive oil, canned tomatoes, coffee, tea. Fresh good will be most likely to be scarce for a bit but you can't stockpile that.

You're not suddenly going to be living in Venezuela but trade will definitely be disrupted and delays are certainly expected especially in the short term. The company I work for is also stockpiling. I don't want to go into detail too much but what we do is vital for transport and we take that responsability seriously. If disaster happens anyway you can't blame us.

gaja

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Re: Gold, silver and stockpiling food
« Reply #60 on: June 12, 2019, 07:03:47 AM »
Yeah those Scandanavian countries are doing SO well right now. Not like there aren't some cracks in the facade to their social welfare systems starting to show or anything....https://www.reuters.com/article/us-denmark-election-welfare-insight/danes-make-welfare-a-hot-election-issue-as-cracks-show-in-nordic-model-idUSKCN1SZ0IC

Thank you for your concern, but contrary to the rumours, we are doing quite fine. Unemployment is down, and the national Norwegian pension fund is currently at 9 100 000 000 000 NOK. https://www.nbim.no/no/

What Reuters has picked up on are the public reactions to a political shift the last 5-10 years from a left wing social democracy towards a more liberal/centrist social democracy. The ruling coalitions in the Scandinavian countries have focused on reducing taxes and strengthening private companies, and have been making (small) cuts in the welfare system. We are still well within what would be considered "raging lunatic socialism" in US eyes, but for us who are used to left wing social democracies, it has been an uncomfortable course alteration towards the center/right. And the majority do not like it. So, in the election in Denmark last week, the power shifted back to the left wing. And if the current polls keep up, the local elections in Norway in September will also turn towards the left, probably with a substantial increase for the left wing socialists (including former communists) and green. Sweden is a bit more complex, but they did end up with a coalition government run by the social democrats and green.

DadJokes

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Re: Gold, silver and stockpiling food
« Reply #61 on: June 12, 2019, 08:22:23 AM »
I just love when a perfectly good thread turns into political arguments.

BicycleB

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Re: Gold, silver and stockpiling food
« Reply #62 on: June 12, 2019, 09:01:31 AM »
@Malkynn, your posts have suggested that you have a clearer list of preparations to make than most of us have - or at least, one rooted in actual study of ordinary emergencies. Care to share a top 5 or top 10 list of useful preparations to make instead of gold 'n' silver?

ctuser1

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Re: Gold, silver and stockpiling food
« Reply #63 on: June 12, 2019, 09:26:24 AM »
Ah yes. Resorting to the strawman fallacy when presented with a fact. Sorry I don't fit into your box bud. Must be tough with that dogmatic approach of yours.

Dude. Your box is pretty clear.
Up is down. Right is left. Doublespeak reigns supreme!!

I'm sorry, actually I'm not, that your Somalia example and my example of Venezuela don't line up in your mind. One of which is in one of the most unstable regions of the world, which you seem incapable of grasping, and the other which was a beacon of "left wing" policies before succumbing to...."left wing" policies.

I don't know which left wing you're talking about.
Anyone with fact based approach will back things that worked in the past.

What are those policies?

Well, how about the conservative policies championed by most "conservatives" from Lincoln through Eisenhower? The same conservatism that championed - gasp - conserving the environment, anybody remember Teddy Roosevelt? Before the "conservative" movement was hijacked by the "Jim Crow" spawn of Confederates you are so much in love with?
 
Add a smattering of "liberalism" for good balance!! You know, the liberal "new deal" part - implemented through strong opposition of Hoover, and pragmatic compromise of Eisenhower.

Not everything in the past worked of course!! e.g. Smoot Holly was definitely a disaster, as was Communism-inspired price controls during WWII. So ideas like those should be dumped as fast as possible!!

I don't know. You say Venezuela followed THIS "left wing" policy???

I bet then Somalia and most parts of Afganistan must be a model "conservative" states. They have no government at all. Isn't that what the staunch "conservatives" demand? No government? Government is evil (except when it sends the SS checks - ignore this part, it does not exist in Somalia/Afganistan)!!

I hope you can get back on topic, stockpiling precious metals, and leave politics to the side. It does seem like it may be a challenge to you though since everything is due to the "evil" conservatives....smh
I get it. Up is down!!
You pulled it OT, and obviously you will scream loudest about it!!

Aelias

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Re: Gold, silver and stockpiling food
« Reply #64 on: June 12, 2019, 09:48:04 AM »
I live in the UK and am prepping for Brexit. Seriously, if we get a no deal Brexit we can expect delays of all goods plus economic recession, if not collapse. So I've prepped 6 months of food, toiletries, toilet paper and meds, and opened a few credit cards at 0% in case i need to leave the country. Obviously, we don't have guns and gold etc will be useless.

I think this is sensible. In your position I would also make sure I have medication and a decent stockpile of food, especially imported food that you use on a daily basis like olive oil, canned tomatoes, coffee, tea. Fresh good will be most likely to be scarce for a bit but you can't stockpile that.

You're not suddenly going to be living in Venezuela but trade will definitely be disrupted and delays are certainly expected especially in the short term. The company I work for is also stockpiling. I don't want to go into detail too much but what we do is vital for transport and we take that responsability seriously. If disaster happens anyway you can't blame us.

This makes perfect sense to me, particularly where it's something like a crash-out Brexit that is not inevitable but a very possible, near term scenario.  Agree that stockpiling meds should be first priority (though it's worth being mindful of expiration dates and impact on potency).  Then food and other household staples.  May also make sense to have some money stashed in Euros or other currency, as who knows what's going to happen to the GBP.

Malkynn

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Re: Gold, silver and stockpiling food
« Reply #65 on: June 12, 2019, 10:35:27 AM »
@Malkynn, your posts have suggested that you have a clearer list of preparations to make than most of us have - or at least, one rooted in actual study of ordinary emergencies. Care to share a top 5 or top 10 list of useful preparations to make instead of gold 'n' silver?

LOL!

Oh goodness no.
I have virtually zero preparations for handling any emergencies beyond basic weather-type emergencies, which are common here.

Beyond basic prep of having some water, non perishable food, batteries, portable phone chargers and meds, I don't bother with anything beyond that, because it's impossible to reasonably prepare for major events because they are so varied and impractical to prepare for.

I remember once asking DH what we should do to be prepared and he laughed and said "live without regrets".

BicycleB

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Re: Gold, silver and stockpiling food
« Reply #66 on: June 12, 2019, 11:12:36 AM »
@Malkynn, thanks for the reply. If I used any meds, the 5 items you listed would be my private prep too. The other 4 items are exactly what I have around the house, for exactly the same reason. Instead of meds, I count our bottle of bleach as an emergency water purifier.

Even when you say "no", you help. Two thumbs up!

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I do keep a bug out bag, thanks to stern instructions from @SailorSam that everyone should have one. It's now "the place where all my useful pocket litter" goes, plus a backup dop kit and bottle of water. I know what to grab now if I have to flee a fire.

Fwiw, I do think of being friendly to neighbors as a form of emergency preparation. I've read that communities with existing ties are more relient. But it's also part of a good life anyway.

On to living a life of no regrets...
« Last Edit: June 12, 2019, 11:15:28 AM by BicycleB »

Imma

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Re: Gold, silver and stockpiling food
« Reply #67 on: June 12, 2019, 12:38:46 PM »
I found a good survival prep list once (probably on MMM!) and it starts off with things like 'try to not get yourself in dangerous situations' and 'watch out in traffic' because those are the most likely disasters. Having an emergency fund was pretty high on that list, as well as having a week's worth of food and water, a flashlight etc. Basic first aid was also on the list I believe.

I think there's also a big difference between prepping "just because" and preparing for likely events. In the UK, that's Brexit, in other parts of the world it could be hurricanes or earthquakes. You can't prepare for all disasters but it's very sensible to prepare for things that are likely to happen. Medication shortages are a real thing where I live so I always try to make sure I have a little stash.

PDXTabs

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Re: Gold, silver and stockpiling food
« Reply #68 on: June 12, 2019, 01:31:42 PM »
If the best buddies fail to keep the nation alive after all, I'd rather have a hill of beans. And if I later found I lived through to a time of prosperity despite everything, a few gold coins from my past self would seem better than a few thousand rounds.

I don't know what you're talking about, but I'm talking about protecting the hill of beans. I have a theory that hills of beans under armed guard are like bicycles and locks. You might not have the best lock, but as long as your lock is obviously superior to the lock next to it you will probably be just fine.

EDITed to add - but as I stated earlier, my plan is to run away, not to hunker down.
« Last Edit: June 12, 2019, 01:42:19 PM by PDXTabs »

MrDelane

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Re: Gold, silver and stockpiling food
« Reply #69 on: June 12, 2019, 06:30:42 PM »
I remember once asking DH what we should do to be prepared and he laughed and said "live without regrets".

That is fantastic.

Radagast

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Re: Gold, silver and stockpiling food
« Reply #70 on: June 12, 2019, 08:47:30 PM »
If the best buddies fail to keep the nation alive after all, I'd rather have a hill of beans. And if I later found I lived through to a time of prosperity despite everything, a few gold coins from my past self would seem better than a few thousand rounds.

I don't know what you're talking about, but I'm talking about protecting the hill of beans. I have a theory that hills of beans under armed guard are like bicycles and locks. You might not have the best lock, but as long as your lock is obviously superior to the lock next to it you will probably be just fine.

EDITed to add - but as I stated earlier, my plan is to run away, not to hunker down.
I have a theory that humans are herd animals. If your society is dominant, guarding your beans will be effective but hardly necessary. If a crisis destroys your society, guarding your beans will be necessary but hardly possible. Either the society that defeated you will just do whatever they want and you will be powerless, or if it spontaneously fell apart a new one will form very rapidly and create its own order. Individually your only hope is to be part of the dominant society, if not you can only try to survive until you are part of one again. Having a gun is pretty much negligible compared to the group dynamic.

cowpuncher10

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Re: Gold, silver and stockpiling food
« Reply #71 on: June 13, 2019, 09:59:46 AM »
Ah yes. Resorting to the strawman fallacy when presented with a fact. Sorry I don't fit into your box bud. Must be tough with that dogmatic approach of yours.

Dude. Your box is pretty clear.
Up is down. Right is left. Doublespeak reigns supreme!!

I'm sorry, actually I'm not, that your Somalia example and my example of Venezuela don't line up in your mind. One of which is in one of the most unstable regions of the world, which you seem incapable of grasping, and the other which was a beacon of "left wing" policies before succumbing to...."left wing" policies.

I don't know which left wing you're talking about.
Anyone with fact based approach will back things that worked in the past.

What are those policies?

Well, how about the conservative policies championed by most "conservatives" from Lincoln through Eisenhower? The same conservatism that championed - gasp - conserving the environment, anybody remember Teddy Roosevelt? Before the "conservative" movement was hijacked by the "Jim Crow" spawn of Confederates you are so much in love with?
 
Add a smattering of "liberalism" for good balance!! You know, the liberal "new deal" part - implemented through strong opposition of Hoover, and pragmatic compromise of Eisenhower.

Not everything in the past worked of course!! e.g. Smoot Holly was definitely a disaster, as was Communism-inspired price controls during WWII. So ideas like those should be dumped as fast as possible!!

I don't know. You say Venezuela followed THIS "left wing" policy???

I bet then Somalia and most parts of Afganistan must be a model "conservative" states. They have no government at all. Isn't that what the staunch "conservatives" demand? No government? Government is evil (except when it sends the SS checks - ignore this part, it does not exist in Somalia/Afganistan)!!

I hope you can get back on topic, stockpiling precious metals, and leave politics to the side. It does seem like it may be a challenge to you though since everything is due to the "evil" conservatives....smh
I get it. Up is down!!
You pulled it OT, and obviously you will scream loudest about it!!

I see you have been indoctrinated with doublethink and newspeak. How typical.