Author Topic: Getting what we want isn't what we really want  (Read 6008 times)

Cap_Scarlet

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Getting what we want isn't what we really want
« on: May 23, 2016, 12:53:43 PM »
I was reading this article this morning http://www.raptitude.com/2016/05/what-we-want/ and it made me think whether that's true.

And then I read this article on MMM http://www.mrmoneymustache.com/2011/10/22/what-is-hedonic-adaptation-and-how-can-it-turn-you-into-a-sukka/ which seems to follow a similar theme.

I can really relate to a lot of this.  Actually, as a music lover, the bit about enjoying a great song but feeling a little sad because you know that each time you listen it's gradually slipping away from you.

But the more serious stuff is a little scarier.  "I really want that car" then you get the car and for the first few weeks it feel great.  You even refuse to fart in there.  But one day, its raining and ....well...one little fart won't hurt.  And then the new car thing is over.  but the thing that really hurts is that next time you need a bigger car.  The spending is like a drug but the hit gets smaller and smaller every time.  and you feel sad because a whole chunk of money has evaporated.

So controlling spending is like any addiction.  Don't we all hate the 'social smoker'?  The guy who can smoke a few cigarettes every month or so but then no more.  Some of us (me included) have addictive personalities, the only way to stop is complete withdrawal.  Maybe that's what its like with spending?  Free stuff is the new drug!
« Last Edit: May 23, 2016, 12:57:34 PM by Cap_Scarlet »

tarheeldan

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Re: Getting what we want isn't what we really want
« Reply #1 on: May 23, 2016, 01:02:13 PM »
People absolutely spend that way. I was having a dinner with a friend last night that is feeling down and wants to buy a car he can't afford. He knows it'll be a fleeting pleasure but keeps going back to the idea.

I find I enjoy life much more changing my insides than chasing fleeting external things. A pervasive, mostly constant joy which is much better than the short highs and long and low lows that I used to live in.

Mr. Green

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Re: Getting what we want isn't what we really want
« Reply #2 on: May 23, 2016, 01:11:56 PM »
You even refuse to fart in there.  But one day, its raining and ....well...one little fart won't hurt.  And then the new car thing is over.
Dude, if one fart kills the new car smell there are some digestive problems that need to be addressed!

bobechs

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Re: Getting what we want isn't what we really want
« Reply #3 on: May 23, 2016, 01:18:28 PM »
You even refuse to fart in there.  But one day, its raining and ....well...one little fart won't hurt.  And then the new car thing is over.
Dude, if one fart kills the new car smell there are some digestive problems that need to be addressed!

Dude, it's a metaphor.  Me-ta-ph-or.

big_slacker

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Re: Getting what we want isn't what we really want
« Reply #4 on: May 23, 2016, 08:15:47 PM »
This doesn't just apply to things, but also to goals. Even something like FIRE. IF you're doing it as part of a life strategy/philosophy (AKA mindfully) then alright. If you're doing it because you have an idea that you will be more happy if you get it or less happy if you don't then...... you're doing it wrong. :D

Johnez

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Re: Getting what we want isn't what we really want
« Reply #5 on: May 23, 2016, 10:32:36 PM »
Could this not be trait we've developed over the years? If satisfaction were so easy to attain, how hard would we as individuals or a species survive, grow, evolve? The negatives are clear enough, addiction and emptiness upon receiving false "wants," but all the more reason to turn attention to the "true," greater goals. To strive isn't the problem, the problem is distraction, and picking the wrong "wants" to go after. Never have I felt empty after beating an opponent in a match, nor receiving high marks on tests or essays. Only the fuel to go even further. Which is totally different from the emptiness that sucks motivation out.

RocketSurgeon

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Re: Getting what we want isn't what we really want
« Reply #6 on: May 24, 2016, 08:27:55 AM »
You even refuse to fart in there.  But one day, its raining and ....well...one little fart won't hurt.  And then the new car thing is over.
Dude, if one fart kills the new car smell there are some digestive problems that need to be addressed!

Dude, it's a metaphor.  Me-ta-ph-or.

Dude, it's a joke. J-o-k-e. (Maybe not best joke ever, but still.)

Mr. Green

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Re: Getting what we want isn't what we really want
« Reply #7 on: May 24, 2016, 09:45:02 AM »
You even refuse to fart in there.  But one day, its raining and ....well...one little fart won't hurt.  And then the new car thing is over.
Dude, if one fart kills the new car smell there are some digestive problems that need to be addressed!

Dude, it's a metaphor.  Me-ta-ph-or.
Yeah, you missed that one.

Tyson

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Re: Getting what we want isn't what we really want
« Reply #8 on: May 24, 2016, 09:28:58 PM »
You even refuse to fart in there.  But one day, its raining and ....well...one little fart won't hurt.  And then the new car thing is over.
Dude, if one fart kills the new car smell there are some digestive problems that need to be addressed!

Dude, it's a metaphor.  Me-ta-ph-or.

Rocket Raccoon: [about Drax] His people are completely literal. Metaphors go over his head.
 
Drax the Destroyer: *Nothing* goes over my head...! My reflexes are too fast, I would catch it.

JoRocka

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Re: Getting what we want isn't what we really want
« Reply #9 on: May 25, 2016, 07:11:27 AM »
You even refuse to fart in there.  But one day, its raining and ....well...one little fart won't hurt.  And then the new car thing is over.
Dude, if one fart kills the new car smell there are some digestive problems that need to be addressed!

Dude, it's a metaphor.  Me-ta-ph-or.

Rocket Raccoon: [about Drax] His people are completely literal. Metaphors go over his head.
 
Drax the Destroyer: *Nothing* goes over my head...! My reflexes are too fast, I would catch it.
You're my hero for quoting that.

SyZ

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Re: Getting what we want isn't what we really want
« Reply #10 on: May 27, 2016, 02:30:26 PM »
I'm pretty sure becoming FIRE and having the hardest decision of my day be if I want to put pants on before I go decide what to cook for dinner while listening to music and doing a jigsaw puzzle  in my paid for comfortable home and no responsibilities is exactly what I really want

RosieTR

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Re: Getting what we want isn't what we really want
« Reply #11 on: May 27, 2016, 09:13:24 PM »
I think there is a push and pull. If you have no goals because you have killed all desire, how is that different from depression? I dabble in reading literature about healthy aging, and wow some of the happiest people ever are elderly people who have goals. Like big ones-learning a new language at 80 or 90 yo, or taking up swimming or dance or something. There are folks who are never happy because they're never satisfied and pursue various goals without ever reflecting on them. I do wonder whether seeking mindful reflection and gratitude periodically is a counter to pursuit of goals for goals' sake, and helps defuse that never-ending dissatisfaction.

The meal example is a great one. Actually stopping, momentarily, while you're eating that yummy thing to reflect on what a perfect moment it is, creates the memory of having a great meal. Yes, it's fleeting, but acknowledging that moment and remembering it helps to make it more meaningful than the enjoyment would otherwise be. In contrast, hedonic adaption is when you go from noticing how great that meal really is to expecting every meal to be that great, and then being constantly disappointed when it's not. Or not even disappointed, but just oblivious. Obliviousness may be the real crux of hedonic adaptation, and purposefully putting yourself in situations where you can't help but notice afterward how great "normal" is counters that deeply.

matchewed

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Re: Getting what we want isn't what we really want
« Reply #12 on: May 28, 2016, 09:12:26 AM »
I think there is a push and pull. If you have no goals because you have killed all desire, how is that different from depression? I dabble in reading literature about healthy aging, and wow some of the happiest people ever are elderly people who have goals. Like big ones-learning a new language at 80 or 90 yo, or taking up swimming or dance or something. There are folks who are never happy because they're never satisfied and pursue various goals without ever reflecting on them. I do wonder whether seeking mindful reflection and gratitude periodically is a counter to pursuit of goals for goals' sake, and helps defuse that never-ending dissatisfaction.

The meal example is a great one. Actually stopping, momentarily, while you're eating that yummy thing to reflect on what a perfect moment it is, creates the memory of having a great meal. Yes, it's fleeting, but acknowledging that moment and remembering it helps to make it more meaningful than the enjoyment would otherwise be. In contrast, hedonic adaption is when you go from noticing how great that meal really is to expecting every meal to be that great, and then being constantly disappointed when it's not. Or not even disappointed, but just oblivious. Obliviousness may be the real crux of hedonic adaptation, and purposefully putting yourself in situations where you can't help but notice afterward how great "normal" is counters that deeply.

The removing of desire does not remove all other emotions. Depression can be thought of as a lack of feeling; where all the feelings are replaced with a sense of emptiness, or perhaps just persistent negative emotions. Lack of desire can still have happiness, satisfaction, joy, sadness...etc. Removing desire just means you can learn to be satisfied with outcomes regardless of the goal, or satisfied with life regardless of the curveballs.

fishnfool

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Re: Getting what we want isn't what we really want
« Reply #13 on: May 28, 2016, 10:53:32 AM »
Yeah, if you can't get what you want or be with who you want....love the one you're with....https://youtu.be/PgZsUGP00k8

Another music lover!

Cap_Scarlet

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Re: Getting what we want isn't what we really want
« Reply #14 on: May 28, 2016, 03:28:18 PM »
If I reflect on all the "things" I've had then those with most value  are the moments when you know you are "in the moment".  Its like taking an emotional photograph