Author Topic: FI, suddenly achievable and disappointing  (Read 21849 times)

ShavinItForLater

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Re: FI, suddenly achievable and disappointing
« Reply #50 on: January 07, 2014, 06:46:55 PM »
In some respects, I might have been better off just being fully focused on my work, and the finances would have taken care of themselves.

You know, it might also just be that you anticipate missing the challenge of having a big project (in this case, the project of achieving FI).  Perhaps setting some new big goal (climb Mt.Whitney? Learn to play an instrument?) is what you need.

It's funny you should say that.  Not only do I think you're spot on with the seeking challenges bit, but I took up a new instrument at age 31 (which I now play almost every day), and I've been climbing big mountains for years, including Whitney.  And then just as our lives were beginning to feel a little too familiar, we decided to have another baby (now 1 yr old).  If that's not a distracting challenge, I don't know what is.

Just find other challenges, ways to maximize your happiness with your extra money and/or time. It always was the underlying purpose in life, and now you simply have more resources to help you with it.

I'm not sure that the pursuit of my own happiness is fully sufficient.  Some of us want to give more than we take. 

I could certainly retire to a life of leisure.  Take my kids to Disneyland, read a lot of books, have a lot of sex.  I was hoping that FI would open other doors, though, the possibility of living a life larger than average.  It's those larger goals I'm having trouble defining.

I'd take issue with saying you might have been better off leaving the finances to themselves.  You never know what surprises are in store, and being FI earlier can only make those surprises (good and bad) easier to deal with.  New job/career opportunity?  Discovered you might like to move to another city?  Suddenly those are options where they may not have been before.  Your job suddenly lays you off?  Suddenly not such a big deal.  Decide you want to pursue a graduate degree?  It's an option if you wanted it.  See a way you could really help someone that might require significant time or money?  You can if you so choose.

I'm sensing what you are really looking for is the next ladder to climb.  In my line of work, there is a big carrot hung out there to become Partner--an owner of the company.  Probably only 1% of people who join out of college ever do, but if you ask most people at various levels below that, that's the big career goal.  They think of it as the end--once they make Partner, they've reached it.  However, if you talk to Partners, you find out they have their own ladder--there are levels of Partners, and when you become one, you're suddenly on the lowest rung of the new ladder.  I don't believe for a minute this is by accident.  These are all very ambitious people, very goal oriented, very competitive--they need something to shoot for, otherwise they'd be quickly bored, and probably quit to find the next ladder to climb.

You've been saying pretty clearly I think what your general goal is--helping others.  There are a million ways to do that, and I think you're the only one who can figure out the best use of your particular abilities and interests in that regard.  What FI gives you is one less constraint on your choices--meeting the financial needs of your family is no longer a required part of the plan.

dude

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Re: FI, suddenly achievable and disappointing
« Reply #51 on: January 08, 2014, 06:57:54 AM »
Interesting.  I wonder sometimes what stepping out of my current life and into a life of FIRE will be like, though knowing myself, I don't anticipate being disappointed. I've been taking steps the last couple years to transition to an entirely new line of "work" (I put work in quotes because what I'm hoping to do is to make a part-time vocation out of a couple of my hobbies).  Leaving a mark on this world is achievable in many, many different ways -- as a friend has pointed out to me in the past.  If you mentor even one person in your lifetime, and that person pays it forward, then by any measure, you've made a difference and left a mark.  In my recreational hobbies, I've mentored a few younger guys, and they regularly tell me how much that's meant to them -- and that's pretty damn satisfying.  So I would say to the OP, with a little introspection I'm confident you will see you are already making a difference and will have ample opportunity to do so in the future (for example -- because climbing mountains happens to be one of the hobbies/passions that I am hoping to make a second career out of -- have you taken a newbie climbing with you, or introduced someone else to the ovewhelming joys of backcountry travel?  I find that turning on that light for someone else, in the way it was turned on for me, is immensely gratifying).

mr. T

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Re: FI, suddenly achievable and disappointing
« Reply #52 on: January 08, 2014, 08:43:14 AM »
The ancient Greeks considered financial independence a prerequisite for a really meaningful life. It allowed them to pursue philosophy, athletics or politics instead of working the farm.

There are hundreds of ways to lead a meaningful life. If your way is your job, I congratulate you. That makes everything a lot simpler. Just keep doing it. As a bonus you can stop wasting time and energy worrying about getting fired, reorganisations, getting transferred to another office far away and that kind of stuff.

acroy

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Re: FI, suddenly achievable and disappointing
« Reply #53 on: January 08, 2014, 08:55:00 AM »
It's those larger goals I'm having trouble defining.

Sounds like you need some navel gazing time.

Let us know, if anything, what you discover.

LOL - shazam!

sol - I'm in a similar situation - become a SWAMI if you like, go solo in your career, or move to Hawaii and become a surf instructor. Doesn't matter if you don't know how to surf, neither will your pupils!! That's my plan!!

aclarridge

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Re: FI, suddenly achievable and disappointing
« Reply #54 on: January 08, 2014, 09:05:57 AM »
Just find other challenges, ways to maximize your happiness with your extra money and/or time. It always was the underlying purpose in life, and now you simply have more resources to help you with it.

I'm not sure that the pursuit of my own happiness is fully sufficient.  Some of us want to give more than we take. 

I could certainly retire to a life of leisure.  Take my kids to Disneyland, read a lot of books, have a lot of sex.  I was hoping that FI would open other doors, though, the possibility of living a life larger than average.  It's those larger goals I'm having trouble defining.

Maximizing your own happiness, for most people, probably means giving more than you take, or giving back, or whatever. The kind of high you get from helping people out and making your society/world better is something worth pursuing and is probably required in some way to feel completely happy (in most peoples' psyches).

aclarridge

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Re: FI, suddenly achievable and disappointing
« Reply #55 on: January 08, 2014, 09:11:10 AM »
Also, you are going to need to define those larger goals yourself, based on your own abilities and thoughts regarding how you can make the world as better a place as possible with your newfound resources. It's an open-ended problem, but you can break it up into smaller closed problems with specific (arbitrary) targets. Use your imagination.

RootofGood

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Re: FI, suddenly achievable and disappointing
« Reply #56 on: January 08, 2014, 03:41:55 PM »
Also stop to consider who will enjoy the better world you seek to create.  Don't forget to enjoy the better world we inherited today from our predecessors. 

Dr. Doom

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Re: FI, suddenly achievable and disappointing
« Reply #57 on: January 08, 2014, 04:30:57 PM »
First, congrats on hitting FI.  It's a huge, hard-fought achievement.

I'm loving this thread because it's essentially an examination of my own situation, and who doesn't love to read about themselves?  Not me!  But seriously, about three months ago I realized that I could quit if I wanted to as well.  The SWR, 3%ish on my assets covers my living expenses.  Done. 

I've come to think of this situation as the "I've solved my money issues (i.e. I'm FI!) but I don't know What Comes Next." 

In fact, thinking about what comes next is what comes next.  For some folks, like MMM, the answer presented itself in his son, his desire for travel, and his building opportunities.  He also clearly loves running the blog. 

But others who don't have an answer yet need to work on it, just like they worked on getting to FI.

Some thoughts:
  • Pretty much everyone who is considering leaving their job because they're FI is going to go through this.  I can imagine that in 3-4 years, when tons of folks on these boards are at or very close to their number, threads like this are going to litter the landscape like kitten videos on youtube.  But for now, they're relatively rare.
  • This is the polar opposite of a mid-life crisis.  A mid-life crisis is looking around and saying "Fuck.  I'm trapped.  I thought my life would be different/better/etc.  But it's just going to be this forever."  This is saying "I'm not trapped.  I have complete freedom.  I can change course.  Or not. It's my choice." 
  • Having the opportunity to leave the workforce at such a young age forces you to confront big life-issues (like the legacy questions you raise) much earlier than most people do.  In fact, when a 'normal' person retires at 65, many of these questions are no longer relevant; the answer has already been defined, the window for alteration closed.  I think that simply having the opportunity to make changes to your life path is extraordinary.
  • How people spend their time after not working 40+ hours a week is a very individual decision.  Some people will create their own business and work harder than ever.  Others might travel.  Or spend a ton of time with kids or family.  Volunteer, pursue creative opportunities, fix houses.  For a while I thought about ordering box-wine in bulk and making it my mission to watch the entirety of everything ever released to Netflix.   (Note:  I unfortunately realized this is impossible because viewable hours are added to their inventory quicker than I can watch their current offerings.)
  • I pored over some retirement forums to get a sense for how people who did it  felt.  It takes most people 6 months to a year to "get into it."  There's time required to adjust.  If you've spent the last 15 years working super hard and your job is suddenly gone, you'll have a big hole to fill.  But it's fillable, and the possibility of change is exciting to most people.
  • You say you love your job.  Does this include your organization, or does it just mean you love the function you perform?  If it's just the function, you might want to consider donating your expertise to an org. that you care more about to make your contribution to the world more meaningful, i.e. to address some of your need for a legacy
  • How do you know it's disappointing if you haven't left yet? 
  • Have you tried to take a long vacation to trial-run your departure from the standard working life?
  • Could you take unpaid leave for several months to give yourself even more time to test the waters?

Saying that reaching FI is disappointing is almost like saying life and its billion possibilities is disappointing.  I really hope you don't feel this way and wish you luck on your search for meaningful answers.




« Last Edit: January 08, 2014, 06:08:21 PM by Q_Train »

Sohcrates

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Re: FI, suddenly achievable and disappointing
« Reply #58 on: January 21, 2014, 09:51:44 PM »
Interesting thread, thanks to all who contributed.
I went to a (very expensive) yoga retreat with my wife a number of years ago, and talked with a number of people there. Everyone was very successful(financially) but almost all were there trying to figure out what to do next. It was a real eye opener to me- I never really pursued money before that, and certainly less so afterward. After much deliberation, all I managed to come up with was the simple (and cliche) enjoy everything that is in front of you. I no longer set goals, I chose a job,life,wife,hobbies,interests I enjoy and pay attention to whatever it is I'm doing in the given moment.

Best of luck to you all!

Nords

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Re: FI, suddenly achievable and disappointing
« Reply #59 on: January 22, 2014, 12:11:38 AM »
Some skills transfer to the nonprofit sector better than others.  If you're a CIA spy or a military fighter pilot, the private sector doesn't really offer you meaningfully comparable options.  If you work in HR or IT then sure, you can do that about anywhere.   My job wouldn't transition so well, hence my reluctance to let go of it.
I'm callin' hogwash on those metaphors.  CIA spies are in big demand for industrial espionage, even if it's just the legal version of forensic financial analysis with extra hacker skills.

The Air Force colonel who flew AIR FORCE ONE for eight years?  He found his dream job as the head of flight operations for Discount Tire.  He says he enjoys his "retirement career" even more because the media doesn't get in his way... and tires don't complain about the coffee being cold. 

You've finally achieved your goal, but you seem to feel that it doesn't let you do what you want-- so find a new goal.  You claim to enjoy your job, but a more precise description of that would be that you enjoy the fulfilling aspects of it while you don't care for the hassles.  Maybe it's time to re-negotiate the terms of your employment, or maybe you should set a new goal of finding/creating a job that has all of the fulfilling aspects and none of the hassles.

But when you're FI, it's absolutely unacceptable to work at a job which has problems you don't enjoy.  You (or your boss) can hire other people to take care of that.  You have the financial power to negotiate better terms, or the financial freedom to go find them somewhere else, or the planning skills to save enough additional assets to create them on your own.