Author Topic: Exercise for fat people?  (Read 14385 times)

DaMa

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Re: Exercise for fat people?
« Reply #150 on: June 01, 2019, 07:23:54 AM »
I struggle with health issues that leave me in constant pain, the only workout I can count on that won't make my issues worse in rebounding (you know, those little trampolines). I can get 10000 steps while watching television and I don't even get D.O.M.S. (delayed onset muscle soreness).

You need to spend a little more money to get a good one, the cheaper ones are like walking in a ditch, they bend your knees inward. You want one that provides a flatter surface. I have a Jumpsport 250 and I wear supportive shoes to avoid overpronation.

Diet is also very important, I recommend itrackbites. You can get the basic tracking app for free, the premium is a one time fee of around $10 which provides you with tracking apps that mimic all the most popular (and expensive) diet plans and online support forums. Choose the diet plan that makes sense for you and go for it.

Thanks for the info on rebounding.  That might be a great option for me, and I didn't really know anything about it.

Milizard

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Re: Exercise for fat people?
« Reply #151 on: June 01, 2019, 10:51:56 AM »
I have a pilates reformer machine with a rebounder. It's horizontal rebounding, but it's still a really good workout because holding your legs out vertically really works your abs, too.

debittogether

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Re: Exercise for fat people?
« Reply #152 on: June 01, 2019, 09:27:44 PM »
Can you jump rope? That's a major heart rate booster.   Or jumping jacks.

SecondEngineer

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Re: Exercise for fat people?
« Reply #153 on: June 03, 2019, 09:40:13 AM »
Interesting @SecondEngineer

Most people who IF do lunch and dinner not breakfast and dinner.  Why did you decide to go this route?

I guess I've bought into the whole "most important meal of the day" stuff (I know it's not quite right). I feel more energized in my day if I eat breakfast, and not eating lunch is pretty natural to me when I'm focused on work. I also find it easier to prepare breakfast at home instead of having to pack a lunch.

But that does mean my meals are ~8-9 hours apart and so there's a lot less fasting than might be had by a lunch-dinner IF schedule, which might be 4-5 hours apart. I guess another point is I don't like feeling full when I start dinner.

All in all it isn't a position I stand too firmly on, but just the way things have turned out. I might need to look into it more.

Blueberries

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Re: Exercise for fat people?
« Reply #154 on: June 03, 2019, 01:48:35 PM »
I can't speak to how well this works for anyone else, but I purchased a mini elliptical (basically just the foot pedal portion of the elliptical) that can be used sitting or standing and I am happy with it.  I'm normal weight, but I sit at a desk almost all day and this allows me to be less sedentary while still sitting.  It's easily transportable and small enough to be hidden.  The elliptical was around $80-90 or so and it's been worth every cent.  Another thing I like about it is that you can track your time, steps, distance, etc., which will allow you to set goals.  You can start by doing the machine while sitting and when you're more comfortable, you can use it standing and add in hand weights and/or ankle weights. 

pecunia

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Re: Exercise for fat people?
« Reply #155 on: June 03, 2019, 07:01:42 PM »
Lots of good stuff written herein.  You guys are providing a lot of encouragement to some of us.  One thing that hasn't been mentioned about the weight training is that I read once that it not only strengthens muscle, it also will strengthen your bones.  Any builder knows how important a strong foundation is.

GreenToTheCore

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Re: Exercise for fat people?
« Reply #156 on: June 03, 2019, 07:22:35 PM »
+1 for low impact exercises, biking and swimming

I used to hate swimming but started using a snorkel and mask. It is like night & day. Instead of using all my energy trying not to drown, now I can focus on my form and on using my muscles to pull through the water.

brute

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Re: Exercise for fat people?
« Reply #157 on: June 04, 2019, 06:12:39 AM »
I can't recommend resistance training highly enough. Obviously free weights are ideal, but no need to start there if you're not able to use them safely. Increased bone density, increased muscular and tendon/ligament strength, increased metabolism, better glucose uptake and usage (GLUT-4 rather than insulin, so helps with insulin resistance), and a sense of accomplishment when you set a new personal record.

What I don't like is seeing people follow advanced routines from magazines or websites when they're novices. That's how you end up getting hurt or with tendonitis. A basic strength routine shouldn't take more than 30-40 minutes and only needs to be done twice a week to see great improvements. Obviously if you want to get maximal results,  you'll eventually need more training, but starting slow is good.

dignam

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Re: Exercise for fat people?
« Reply #158 on: June 04, 2019, 06:47:20 AM »
Lower impact is probably more beneficial for someone overweight who is just starting out (biking, swimming).  With running, each foot strike will be with a force more than your body weight, which can be horrible for your joints if you're overweight.  Leading to injury, then the risk of falling into old habits, etc...

Diet aside, the single most effective thing I've done (granted I've never been overweight, but wanted to improve my build) is regular free weight lifting.  2-4 times a week, just pick up the dumbbells.  Just having muscle will burn fat, even at rest.  But, diet is still the most important part of pure weight loss.

GuitarStv

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Re: Exercise for fat people?
« Reply #159 on: June 04, 2019, 07:19:10 AM »
I can't recommend resistance training highly enough. Obviously free weights are ideal, but no need to start there if you're not able to use them safely. Increased bone density, increased muscular and tendon/ligament strength, increased metabolism, better glucose uptake and usage (GLUT-4 rather than insulin, so helps with insulin resistance), and a sense of accomplishment when you set a new personal record.

What I don't like is seeing people follow advanced routines from magazines or websites when they're novices. That's how you end up getting hurt or with tendonitis. A basic strength routine shouldn't take more than 30-40 minutes and only needs to be done twice a week to see great improvements. Obviously if you want to get maximal results,  you'll eventually need more training, but starting slow is good.

I agree with nearly everything in this post.  I'd only argue with one point - in my experience, someone who is completely out of shape will benefit much more from multiple short sessions (at least 4) per week.  They won't be able to physically push themselves as hard as necessary to get away with just two short sessions a week until they build up a base of strength and endurance.  After a couple months though they can switch to fewer sessions and start to ramp up intensity.

brute

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Re: Exercise for fat people?
« Reply #160 on: June 04, 2019, 07:23:14 AM »
I can't recommend resistance training highly enough. Obviously free weights are ideal, but no need to start there if you're not able to use them safely. Increased bone density, increased muscular and tendon/ligament strength, increased metabolism, better glucose uptake and usage (GLUT-4 rather than insulin, so helps with insulin resistance), and a sense of accomplishment when you set a new personal record.

What I don't like is seeing people follow advanced routines from magazines or websites when they're novices. That's how you end up getting hurt or with tendonitis. A basic strength routine shouldn't take more than 30-40 minutes and only needs to be done twice a week to see great improvements. Obviously if you want to get maximal results,  you'll eventually need more training, but starting slow is good.

I agree with nearly everything in this post.  I'd only argue with one point - in my experience, someone who is completely out of shape will benefit much more from multiple short sessions (at least 4) per week.  They won't be able to physically push themselves as hard as necessary to get away with just two short sessions a week until they build up a base of strength and endurance.  After a couple months though they can switch to fewer sessions and start to ramp up intensity.

good point. I actually had to do that for my SIL last year. It had been so long since I was in that bad of conditioning that I didn't even think about it until I saw it.

Note: I'm not knocking people who are out of shape here. I used to be there. Over 360 pounds and zero exercise. I would get winded walking down the hall. More my appreciation for @GuitarStv  for reminding me of something that I hadn't considered.

pecunia

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Re: Exercise for fat people?
« Reply #161 on: June 07, 2019, 08:34:52 PM »

Note: I'm not knocking people who are out of shape here. I used to be there. Over 360 pounds and zero exercise. I would get winded walking down the hall. More my appreciation for @GuitarStv  for reminding me of something that I hadn't considered.

Congratulations man -  I applaud you.  There are too many feedback forces in our culture preventing us from your success.  I have my old Bowflex in the basement and when I retire in a few months, I will emulate you.

kanga1622

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Re: Exercise for fat people?
« Reply #162 on: June 08, 2019, 07:57:03 PM »
I really enjoy water walking. The water helps take the weight off your joints so you can push harder than if you were simply walking on the sidewalk. My local pool offers water walking in their “lazy river” at certain hours of the day. You get current to walk against and you can still talk to others or use waterproof headphones.

Many fitness centers offer a free or reduced session with a trainer. Some college/university programs in exercise science may also help put together a training routine for you as a way to start working on basics. Yoga classes for beginners can be helpful for flexibility and stability.

NorthernBlitz

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Re: Exercise for fat people?
« Reply #163 on: June 09, 2019, 03:56:29 AM »
I really enjoy water walking. The water helps take the weight off your joints so you can push harder than if you were simply walking on the sidewalk. My local pool offers water walking in their “lazy river” at certain hours of the day. You get current to walk against and you can still talk to others or use waterproof headphones.

Many fitness centers offer a free or reduced session with a trainer. Some college/university programs in exercise science may also help put together a training routine for you as a way to start working on basics. Yoga classes for beginners can be helpful for flexibility and stability.

In the water, I think your body uses energy to keep your temp from falling too.

Villanelle

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Re: Exercise for fat people?
« Reply #164 on: June 09, 2019, 09:35:48 AM »
I thought I posted an update a few days ago, but it looks like it didn't post.

For a few months, life was insane and I changed nothing.  Starting in Jan/Feb, I started making some small changes to diet.  Nothing drastic, but the kinds of things that are likely to actually last--forcing myself to get used to drinking my iced tea unsweetened, for example.  And I'm cooking and eating way more fruits and veggies, among other shifts.  As I mention, knowing what to do food wise has never been a problem.  Now that I'm doing it, it's working as far as weight. 

We've moved, and I can do so many of my errands by walking, so I'm getting more movement, but not necessarily exercise.

All in all, I'm down 9 pounds in a few months.  Slow and steady progress, but I'm not really more fit than I was was when I started this thread.  I'm hoping to swim this summer (the heat and I are not friends).  I'm actually not sure of the depth of our pool, but water walking might be an option.  I'd never heard of it, so thank you!

So I'd say I've made some solid progress in overall health, but not in actually working out and improving strength and heart health, which was the focus of this thread.  Having a pool in our backyard will, I'm hopeful, be helpful.  The landlord just finished opening it for the summer so I'm hoping to get in tomorrow!

Milizard

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Re: Exercise for fat people?
« Reply #165 on: June 09, 2019, 01:04:35 PM »
Congrats--you're doing great so far.  It all goes together, and losing weight and eating healthier helps you to be more fit as well.  I'm  in the opposite boat.  I've been exercising again, but the food has gotten out of hand enough that I need to really focus on that.  I'm trying another calorie tracker app that was mentioned in another thread.  I can already see it's all the little extra snacks that are the culprit.

pecunia

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Re: Exercise for fat people?
« Reply #166 on: June 09, 2019, 07:26:49 PM »
Not sure anybody pointed this one out:

OK - You exercise.  You may weigh the same.  However, you've been exercising.  The fat has been replaced with muscle.  Muscle is more dense than fat.  It's nice to have more room in the clothes.

You've been exercising.  You are a little like a racehorse.  You are ready to go.  You have more energy.  Given that you are now sitting in your chair with a lot of muscle instead of a lot of fat, your resting metabolism is higher.  Fat, well it just kinda hangs around until it's needed, but muscle is like a machine.  It needs to be maintained.  It needs to be fed.  It's a nice bonus that it will help burn them Oreos by just sitting.

sillysassy

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Re: Exercise for fat people?
« Reply #167 on: June 10, 2019, 12:30:35 AM »
for exercising, if you can get to swimming pool, SWIM.
it burns lots of calories, but do note that you will feel hungry, don't eat too much.... stick to vegetables without too much oil or salad dressing.

swimming is healthy.

and if u can't get to water, do it like me, i use stationary bikes whenever i want to watch tv. and i do it intensively.

and i go for a stroll after dinner. the stroll helps me relax.

Jugishano

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Re: Exercise for fat people?
« Reply #168 on: June 10, 2019, 02:49:52 AM »
On a basic level it's simply a case of calories in vs calories out. If you burn more than you eat you will lose fat.

You can't "spot reduce" fat from any particular area. If you lose fat overall you will also lose fat from your chest and belly. (Where we store fat... so which areas you will lose fat from quickest... is pretty much genetic so there's nothing you can do to make fat go from one area quicker than others).

The shape of you chest and abs you can improve with weight training - but bear in mind that gaining muscle mass underneath a layer of fat will just push the fat further out...

Villanelle

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Re: Exercise for fat people?
« Reply #169 on: June 10, 2019, 08:48:23 AM »
Just to again clarify since this is thread has been bumped up.  If it's becoming a general fitness/weight loss/whatever thread, from which anyone can benefit, cool.  But I'm not looking for diet info.  As I mentioned I danced and was pretty much a physical machine for years.  I know the diet stuff.  And I know the exercise stuff when it's just trying to carefully fine tune an already maintained machine.  It's getting that machine from rusty and corroded and leaking fluids and in need of some new belts and empty of all gasoline, to up and running and reliable.  And doing so without actually causing more damage to it along the way. 

That said, this morning I did some (very few) basic squats and lunges and stepped up and down my bottom step until I was winded (embarrassingly short time).  None of it was enough for me to feel it in my creaky dancer's knees, but if it's a small part of my daily routien, that's something.  Hopefully I can keep that balance--enough to make some progress but not anger my body.  As I continue to lose weight (the diet piece), hopefully that naturally allows me to ask for more body weight exercises from my joints. 

GuitarStv

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Re: Exercise for fat people?
« Reply #170 on: June 10, 2019, 09:56:40 AM »
Track everything you do.  It helps to progress, and you want to continue to progress your level of fitness until you're able to do high intensity exercise again.  Having stuff physically written down can also help emotionally . . . because you can look back at where you were three or four months ago and see the improvement - even if there haven't been big changes in the past while.

Enigma

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Re: Exercise for fat people?
« Reply #171 on: June 10, 2019, 10:12:49 AM »
What helped me lose weight in 2017/2018 was lots of walking.  Grabbing a vivofit pedometer and walking around town listening to health podcasts.  Food/diet is big but you said you had that under control.  My goal was 13k steps per day and I spent over 90 days in a row getting there.  Although I spent 9 months on the whole weight lose goals.  In the end I went from 216 down to 169.  I also did DEXA scans to ensure that I didnt lose muscle mass.  In that time only 1lb of muscle was lost.

I agree track everything you can.

mm1970

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Re: Exercise for fat people?
« Reply #172 on: June 10, 2019, 11:30:13 AM »
Things that have worked for me when I was either overweight or just injured...

- swimming.  I still love swimming.
- walking, particularly hills.  Walking is therapeutic.
- At home workouts like yoga, weights, HIIT.  I have a Beachbody on Demand membership - so many choices!  I do much better when I pick something and schedule it.  My favorites (you can find similar things on line):

PiYo.  Body weight exercise, sort of Pilates/ Yoga-ish, with HIIT.  What I liked was that everything was modifiable, like burpees.  I would always step back, not jump back, and those are still hard yo!

21-day fix: also easily modifiable and only 30 minutes.  Weights, pilates, yoga, cardio

LIIFT4 - my BFF.  Weights and intervals.  This is what I did when I had my running injury and could not longer run, for 3 months (and I also swam).

Elliptical - my actual BFF is injured and this is currently the only thing she can do without pain.  So that's our Sunday morning bitch session.

Stationary bike - Did this during both pregnancies.

DadJokes

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Re: Exercise for fat people?
« Reply #173 on: June 10, 2019, 03:42:53 PM »
No one who looks at me would say that I'm fat, but I was a hefty 240 lbs. I spent $1k on an electric bike, which has an assist to help me when I am struggling up a hill. It is much easier on the joints than running or even walking. Combined with reducing my carb intake, I've dropped ~8 lbs in about a month. It's certainly an expensive way to lose weight, but it looks to be providing some results.

pecunia

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Re: Exercise for fat people?
« Reply #174 on: June 10, 2019, 08:56:51 PM »
Bicycles also do a much better job of keeping you cool in hot weather.  This is an incentive for their use.

Spud

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Re: Exercise for fat people?
« Reply #175 on: June 10, 2019, 11:54:19 PM »
I found another video that I had stashed which is great for this thread. It’s only 5 minutes long and is definitely worth watching.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eXTiiz99p9o

One of the key points is at 1:35 where it says that one study found that if a 200 pound man ran for an hour, 4 days a week, for a month, he’d lose about 5 pounds at most, assuming everything else (namely his diet and amount of “non-running physical activity”) stayed the same.

If we take this month (June 2019) as an example, that would take 16 hours of running (assuming he runs for an hour every Monday, Tuesday, Thursday and Friday for all 4 weeks of the month) to lose 5 pounds. Could you be bothered to do that for such a small payoff? The return on investment is awful.

Don’t think you’re the exception to the rule because you do something else instead of running. If you’re a swimmer, a cyclist, a rower, a dancer, or you do CrossFit, triathlons, aerobics, boxercise, boxing, martial arts of any kind or sport of any kind, it’s the same for you. General physical activity is useless for burning enough calories to lose weight.

At 2:25 the video mentions metabolic compensation as a factor that causes a slowdown in weight loss.

There are a number of ways this happens.

Firstly, if you’re lighter, you will burn fewer calories when you move around than someone who is heavier. The body has less weight to move, and it takes less energy to do that.

Secondly, if you do a lot of running, cycling, swimming or rowing, your body (nervous system) refines these movements in very subtle ways that over time. Subtle enough that they can’t be seen with the naked eye. Basically, your body becomes extremely efficient at whatever your frequently practiced movement is. It doesn’t matter if you’re doing burpees, jumping jacks, skipping, punching a heavy bag, ten pin bowling, squats, deadlifts, power cleans, roundhouse kicks, moving furniture, even walking, whatever.

If you practice something over and over and over and over again for months, years or decades, your nervous system is going to fine tune the shit out of that movement or sequence of movements to ensure that you can do it as efficiently as possible in terms of energy expenditure (calorie burn). That means, someone who has been doing ballroom dancing for 10 years will burn fewer calories doing it than a total novice (all other things being equal).

This is supported by what the video shows at 2:38 – the study on the Hadza tribe in Tanzania, Africa. Despite being much more active, the tribe who lead an active lifestyle out on the savanna didn’t actually burn any more calories than test subjects from America and Europe who lead a traditional, relative inactive, modern Western lifestyle.

The difference? Food intake. The Hadza simply don’t have access to any high calorie foods. Nothing artificial. Nothing processed. They either grow it, rear it or hunt it. If the calorie burn of Westerners and African tribes people is the same, why then do sedentary Western office workers get so fat? Answer - because they spend all day shovelling calories into their faces whilst they sit at their desks. Nothing more scientific than that. The Hadza don’t have that choice of mindlessly eating loads of calories. Yes, it’s a fucking choice. We Westerners don't HAVE to do it either.

As far as exercise is concerned, resistance training is king. Firstly if it protects you against sarcopenia, osteopenia and osteoporosis as I described in my previous post on this thread. In that respect it's the closest thing we have to a fountain of youth. It really is physical medicine. Secondly, he main aim of resistance training on a diet is to preserve muscle mass and keep that resting metabolic rate from dropping (the yellow bar in the video above won’t shrink when you lose weight). Muscle is far more metabolically active than any other tissue in your body. It takes something like 2 calories per day to maintain a pound of fat. With muscle, the figure is higher. How much higher, is the source of much debate, but it's estimated to be somewhere in the region of 6 to 20 calories per pound of muscle. At a minimum, that's 3 times more metabolically active than fat.

Here’s a great study to illustrate what resistance training can do for you when dieting.

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/10487375

PURPOSE:
The purpose of this study was to examine the physiological effects of a weight-loss dietary regimen with or without exercise.

METHODS:
Thirty-five overweight men were matched and randomly placed into either a control group or one of three dietary groups.

There were 6 men in the control group.
There were 8 men in the diet-only group.
There were 11 men in a diet group that performed aerobic exercise three times per week
There were 10 men in a diet group that performed both aerobic exercise and strength training three times per week

RESULTS:

After 12 weeks,

Diet only group lost 9.64kg (69% was fat = 6.65kg)

Diet and aerobics group lost 8.99kg (78% was fat = 7.01kg)

Diet, aerobics and strength training group lost 9.90kg (97% was fat = 9.60kg)

Aerobics on its own, 3 times a week, whatever format it took, lost an extra 0.36kg of fat over 12 weeks compared to diet accompanied by no exercise at all.

This is more evidence that aerobics are just dreadful for weight loss. Is it really worth the effort? Whilst it doesn't say how long they were doing aerobics for in each session, or how intense it was regardless, it's massively inefficient, yielding only 360 grams greater fat loss than if you didn't do it at all.

That said, aerobics seemed to spare an extra 1kg of muscle. It is however blown away by those who also did strength training.

Diet Only = 2.99kg of muscle lost.
Aerobics = 1.98kg of muscle lost.
Aerobics and Strength = 0.3kg of muscle lost.

The diet-only group also demonstrated a significant reduction in fat-free mass, not just muscle, but also bone tissue and organ tissue etc.

Sadly I couldn't find any details on exactly what aerobics or strength training programs these people undertook. I would love to see the results of the study if it were conducted again with the addition of a 4th group who did only diet and strength training, but no aerobics. Chances are they would come out on top as they would obtain all the benefits of diet and strength training, but wouldn't have aerobics needlessly eating into their ability to recover from the strength training sessions, meaning they would gain more muscle and strength and possibly lose even more fat.

GuitarStv

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Re: Exercise for fat people?
« Reply #176 on: June 11, 2019, 07:59:40 AM »
Although I fully support the idea of doing resistance training and cardio, coupled with fixing a diet . . . that study of less than 40 men is way too small to draw conclusions.

I've never been able to lose much weight simply by doing strength training alone . . . at least partly because if you want your lifts (and therefore the intensity of your workout) to increase, you need to put on mass.  My deadlift is way higher when I'm 220 lbs than it is when I'm 190.  I've kept the same waist measurement from 175 lbs all the way up to 220lbs, but at 220 lbs I get noticeably winded when jogging or going for a long bike ride.  At 175 my endurance for running/cycling is very high, but I'm noticeably weaker.

I've done strength training for two decades now.  I'm a fan.  It's good for you.  But that said, I've always lost weight more easily with a mix of strength training and cardio.  I went from 195 to 170lbs in three months doing three hour and a half sessions a week boxing and an hour or two of barbell exercises each week.  Hell, I'm 200 lbs right now  . . . and depending on the heat I'll lose 10 - 16 lbs just going for a long (160 km) bike ride (yes, some of it is water weight . . . but three days later I'm still down 5-6 lbs from one session).



Quote
One of the key points is at 1:35 where it says that one study found that if a 200 pound man ran for an hour, 4 days a week, for a month, he’d lose about 5 pounds at most, assuming everything else (namely his diet and amount of “non-running physical activity”) stayed the same.

If we take this month (June 2019) as an example, that would take 16 hours of running (assuming he runs for an hour every Monday, Tuesday, Thursday and Friday for all 4 weeks of the month) to lose 5 pounds. Could you be bothered to do that for such a small payoff? The return on investment is awful.

5 lbs a month is pretty good for weight loss.  That's 60 lbs a year.  For getting about what the average person is recommended to get in exercise each week.  That's an awful return on investment to you?

brute

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Re: Exercise for fat people?
« Reply #177 on: June 11, 2019, 08:06:30 AM »
Although I fully support the idea of doing resistance training and cardio, coupled with fixing a diet . . . that study of less than 40 men is way too small to draw conclusions.

I've never been able to lose much weight simply by doing strength training alone . . . at least partly because if you want your lifts (and therefore the intensity of your workout) to increase, you need to put on mass.  My deadlift is way higher when I'm 220 lbs than it is when I'm 190.  I've kept the same waist measurement from 175 lbs all the way up to 220lbs, but at 220 lbs I get noticeably winded when jogging or going for a long bike ride.  At 175 my endurance for running/cycling is very high, but I'm noticeably weaker.

I've done strength training for two decades now.  I'm a fan.  It's good for you.  But that said, I've always lost weight more easily with a mix of strength training and cardio.  I went from 195 to 170lbs in three months doing three hour and a half sessions a week boxing and an hour or two of barbell exercises each week.  Hell, I'm 200 lbs right now  . . . and depending on the heat I'll lose 10 - 16 lbs just going for a long (160 km) bike ride (yes, some of it is water weight . . . but three days later I'm still down 5-6 lbs from one session).



Quote
One of the key points is at 1:35 where it says that one study found that if a 200 pound man ran for an hour, 4 days a week, for a month, he’d lose about 5 pounds at most, assuming everything else (namely his diet and amount of “non-running physical activity”) stayed the same.

If we take this month (June 2019) as an example, that would take 16 hours of running (assuming he runs for an hour every Monday, Tuesday, Thursday and Friday for all 4 weeks of the month) to lose 5 pounds. Could you be bothered to do that for such a small payoff? The return on investment is awful.

5 lbs a month is pretty good for weight loss.  That's 60 lbs a year.  For getting about what the average person is recommended to get in exercise each week.  That's an awful return on investment to you?

I agree with this completely. There are a couple reasons I'd never suggest anyone go completely without cardio. First, your heart and lungs are pretty important. Like, you kind of die if they don't work. Second, improved cardio lets you push harder in weight training. If you're still sucking air 10 minutes after a set of heavy squats, how intense can your training really be? (Caveat for those of us who are only interested in hoisting maximal weight. But we're not the topic here).

I dropped over 150 pounds in a single year with diet and cardio. I SOOO wish I had been weight training at the time. I looked like a cancer patient, people constantly asked me if I needed anything or how long I had. (Given that no one ever asked that when I was ACTUALLY on chemo for 2 years, kind of irritating). I have trouble losing weight when I train with heavy loads though, the increase in appetite is almost unbearable.

RichCantante

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Re: Exercise for fat people?
« Reply #178 on: June 11, 2019, 10:39:56 AM »
Everyone says it's 80/20 diet/exercise but for me its opposite. Basically exercise is what does it for me. Every time I think I can lose a bit with calorie counting I fail. What works is hard exercise. I am a naturally muscular person so I think my body just wants to go hard. When I lose weight you see the muscles more and people think I spent hours lifting weights, but no, the muscles were just hidden. That said, I need to do strength again. Just started looking into that Athlean guy and doing bodyweight exercises as I no longer go to a gym.

Another idea that works for me: Don't pay to exercise, get paid to exercise! So, teach a dance or yoga class! I have done this before and would like to set up a regular class near me. Being fat is definitely not a negative, and I have had (and have been) many non-thin dance/zumba/aerobics teachers.

Also, RunBet and StepBet have been consistently making me $$ and are addictive.

Final thought, it's always fun for me to read someone talking about age as a limiting factor, and I sit there nodding my head thinking yep it's a little bit true, this is what the future holds for me... then I read their age and they are 15 years younger than me haha! Exercise has made me eternally young.

joe189man

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Re: Exercise for fat people?
« Reply #179 on: June 11, 2019, 11:30:52 AM »
I would highly recommend a service that tests your gut microbiome (the bacteria in your digestive tract). i did this about 18 months ago and followed the food recommendations based upon the gut bacteria i did or did not have. i easily lost weight with just changing in and out a few foods. everyone is different through, my wife has a completely different set of stomach bugs and its hard to cook for both of us.

we used viome, i highly recommend it, i just did a retest because of some antibiotics use several months ago

diet is where everything starts with loosing weight and getting the ball rolling 

dcheesi

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Re: Exercise for fat people?
« Reply #180 on: June 11, 2019, 11:57:34 AM »
On strength training: does anyone have suggestions for how to motivate or incorporate strength training into daily life? I've never been able to stick to a fitness routine, or any sort of "exercise" for its own sake; I need some other motivation.

MMM helped me with getting moving, with all the arguments for walking, biking etc. for practical Mustachian reasons. I walk to lunch, dance to music, jog up stairs since it's faster than the elevator, etc. But aside from maybe carrying groceries occasionally, I've struggled to come up with similar rationales for strength exercises. Ideas?

Spud

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Re: Exercise for fat people?
« Reply #181 on: June 11, 2019, 12:03:47 PM »
I was going to write a long reply to GuitarStv and brute and get into a debate etc but this thread is about exercise for fat people and I feel I've started to derail it. Your avergae fat person is probably too self conscious to go to a gym or get on a bike. It mihgt not be possible

Guitarstv - a 160km bike ride is not something a fat person is going to be doing any time soon. I didn't get what you meant about that study on less than 40 men being too small to draw conclusions.

brute - I'm sure you realise this, but there is a whole spectrum of strength training out there. At one end you have 1RM attempts on major barbell movements with 5+ minutes between sets, and at the other you have lighter weights (possibly bodyweight) performed in a circuit training fashion with very little rest between sets. I opt for a halfway house between the two and get plenty of "cardio effect" without doing any cardio. Recently sprinted up a steep, rocky hill, roughly 100 yards, faster than a teenager who was out running and when I got to the top, I had plenty left in the tank, more than him. I don't do any running. But I do perform relatively heavy leg work in the 12-20 rep range 3 times a week with no more than 2 minutes between sets, some time as little as 45 seconds between sets. It's far more demanding on my thighs, glutes and cardio system than a quick sprint up a hill. Our heart and lungs are slaves to our muscular system. It doesn't matter how you work your muscles. If you place demands on them, your heart and lungs have to kick into action to supply them with what you need. People have now idea of the simultaneous conditioning and muscle building effect that weights can give you. It gives you everything traditional cardio does, and a load more benefits that cardio doesn't.

When you lost 150 pounds - what dietary changes did you make? That would have been responsible for most of the weight loss.




DeniseNJ

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Re: Exercise for fat people?
« Reply #182 on: June 11, 2019, 12:04:33 PM »
Youtube "yoga with adriene."  It's gentle and strength training and won't strain knees or make anything bounce that you want still.  She's really great.  She says the 5 min of yoga that you do is better for you than the hour of yoga that you don't do.  She has lots of short videos, some 5 min long for office use.  She's got some 30 day programs that build on themselves and vary in length.  It is not just stretches--it can really be a workout.  But you can do it at home whenever so weather doesn't matter.  You don't need special shoes or clothes or equipment and you feet and knees won't hurt.  It won't cause more damage to already aging and strained body parts.  I don't like bringing this bod to the gym or the pool.  Weight lifting sounding good but you need weights.  Running is a no-go if you're currently heavy and have had past knee issues--wait until you're more fit for that.  Really yoga is the perfect excercise if you're over weight--or anybody really.

DeniseNJ

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Re: Exercise for fat people?
« Reply #183 on: June 11, 2019, 12:17:07 PM »
Totally disagree with biking and swimming for overweight people who don't excericse.  I'm overweight and do not want to change in a locker room, and squeeze into a swim suit and the sight of my giant butt on my tiny bike seat is something no one needs to be exposed to.  Plus balance is way off if you never excercise.

If you're just starting you don't want to buy special clothes, shoes, and equipment, or have to go to the gym.  Yoga with Adrienne until your balance is good, your joints are strong, and you feel like taking it outside.

pecunia

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Re: Exercise for fat people?
« Reply #184 on: June 11, 2019, 12:27:47 PM »
Totally disagree with biking and swimming for overweight people who don't excericse.  I'm overweight and do not want to change in a locker room, and squeeze into a swim suit and the sight of my giant butt on my tiny bike seat is something no one needs to be exposed to.  Plus balance is way off if you never excercise.

If you're just starting you don't want to buy special clothes, shoes, and equipment, or have to go to the gym.  Yoga with Adrienne until your balance is good, your joints are strong, and you feel like taking it outside.

All this fancy stuff - Don't forget the value of long walks.  Good for muscles, thought and digestion.  Plus you sleep better.  Walks are good enough for many of us to have our endorphins stirred up too.

GuitarStv

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Re: Exercise for fat people?
« Reply #185 on: June 11, 2019, 12:45:16 PM »
On strength training: does anyone have suggestions for how to motivate or incorporate strength training into daily life? I've never been able to stick to a fitness routine, or any sort of "exercise" for its own sake; I need some other motivation.

This will be different for everyone.  You're kinda responsible for your own motivation and need to find something that is exciting to you.  I like riding my bike . . . going on long bike rides is an extension of that.  I liked competing in martial arts tournaments . . . so martial arts were a way to do that.  Getting stronger is really exciting, so lifting weights regularly and seeing my strength improve over time was fun.

It's best to dedicate a chunk of time to working on stuff directly, but there's always a way you can get some amount of strength training while doing other stuff.  Carry your backpack with you everywhere you walk and put a 25 lb plate in it, or a bag of rice or something.  Bike to the grocery store and haul things back on your bike rather than drive.  Put a chin-up bar on the bathroom door frame and make yourself do 10 pull-ups each time you use the washroom.  Every commercial break that comes up as you're watching TV do 20 burpees.  Hell, even just changing your tires from winter to summer/summer to winter can involve a lot of lifting and pushing.

The key is developing it into a habit so that it feels weird to not being working out every day.  Another key is to record what you're doing so that you can see the improvement you're making over time.

mm1970

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Re: Exercise for fat people?
« Reply #186 on: June 11, 2019, 02:35:33 PM »
Totally disagree with biking and swimming for overweight people who don't excericse.  I'm overweight and do not want to change in a locker room, and squeeze into a swim suit and the sight of my giant butt on my tiny bike seat is something no one needs to be exposed to.  Plus balance is way off if you never excercise.

If you're just starting you don't want to buy special clothes, shoes, and equipment, or have to go to the gym.  Yoga with Adrienne until your balance is good, your joints are strong, and you feel like taking it outside.
Thing is, swimming is just, for me, relaxing and great on the joints. I swam all through my second pregnancy, dealing with the jokes about overflowing the pool (the pool was filled to the top already).  Water exercise in general is good on the joints.

There's nothing special equipment about a swim suit.  I swim early mornings at the Y, with a bunch of old farts (really, at 48 I'm the youngest, most are in their 70s and 80s).  Half of them are overweight too, and nobody cares.  Because I go first thing, I actually put my suit on at home.  Then shower and change in the locker room after.  There are rooms for that if you like, at my Y.

Also I'm mostly a fan of recumbent bikes.  Less balance required.

Mostly off topic, for spring break this year we spent two days at Great Wolf Lodge, which is a giant indoor water park.  It was fabulous.  There were ALL ages and ALL types of bodies there, in their suits, going down the slides.  It was refreshing, because in the media you only see perfect bodies.  Here, you saw everything - and the best part was, if you wanted to have fun - you had to get over yourself.  Yup, I have big thighs and cellulite.  Nobody cares.  There were only a handful of people in full coverups.

mm1970

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Re: Exercise for fat people?
« Reply #187 on: June 11, 2019, 02:38:08 PM »
On strength training: does anyone have suggestions for how to motivate or incorporate strength training into daily life? I've never been able to stick to a fitness routine, or any sort of "exercise" for its own sake; I need some other motivation.

MMM helped me with getting moving, with all the arguments for walking, biking etc. for practical Mustachian reasons. I walk to lunch, dance to music, jog up stairs since it's faster than the elevator, etc. But aside from maybe carrying groceries occasionally, I've struggled to come up with similar rationales for strength exercises. Ideas?
I struggle with this too.  The only thing that has worked for me is a plan of some sort.

Currently: I belong to a gym and take weight training classes.

In the past: I've done "challenges" (pushups/ squats/ crunches) for a month - a certain # each day.

Also: on-line workouts.  I'm a fan of beachbody, but there are plenty of free ones.  But for me, just having access isn't enough.  I literally HAVE to write out a schedule of what I'm going to do each day.  (Which is why BB works for me - I pick a program, write out the calendar and follow it).  Oh, it's Thursday, LEG DAY.

dcheesi

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Re: Exercise for fat people?
« Reply #188 on: June 13, 2019, 12:47:44 PM »
On strength training: does anyone have suggestions for how to motivate or incorporate strength training into daily life? I've never been able to stick to a fitness routine, or any sort of "exercise" for its own sake; I need some other motivation.

MMM helped me with getting moving, with all the arguments for walking, biking etc. for practical Mustachian reasons. I walk to lunch, dance to music, jog up stairs since it's faster than the elevator, etc. But aside from maybe carrying groceries occasionally, I've struggled to come up with similar rationales for strength exercises. Ideas?
I struggle with this too.  The only thing that has worked for me is a plan of some sort.

Currently: I belong to a gym and take weight training classes.

In the past: I've done "challenges" (pushups/ squats/ crunches) for a month - a certain # each day.

Also: on-line workouts.  I'm a fan of beachbody, but there are plenty of free ones.  But for me, just having access isn't enough.  I literally HAVE to write out a schedule of what I'm going to do each day.  (Which is why BB works for me - I pick a program, write out the calendar and follow it).  Oh, it's Thursday, LEG DAY.
On strength training: does anyone have suggestions for how to motivate or incorporate strength training into daily life? I've never been able to stick to a fitness routine, or any sort of "exercise" for its own sake; I need some other motivation.

This will be different for everyone.  You're kinda responsible for your own motivation and need to find something that is exciting to you.  I like riding my bike . . . going on long bike rides is an extension of that.  I liked competing in martial arts tournaments . . . so martial arts were a way to do that.  Getting stronger is really exciting, so lifting weights regularly and seeing my strength improve over time was fun.

It's best to dedicate a chunk of time to working on stuff directly, but there's always a way you can get some amount of strength training while doing other stuff.  Carry your backpack with you everywhere you walk and put a 25 lb plate in it, or a bag of rice or something.  Bike to the grocery store and haul things back on your bike rather than drive.  Put a chin-up bar on the bathroom door frame and make yourself do 10 pull-ups each time you use the washroom.  Every commercial break that comes up as you're watching TV do 20 burpees.  Hell, even just changing your tires from winter to summer/summer to winter can involve a lot of lifting and pushing.

The key is developing it into a habit so that it feels weird to not being working out every day.  Another key is to record what you're doing so that you can see the improvement you're making over time.
Thanks, all!

I suppose I was hoping for some perfectly seamless solution, as I tend to adhere poorly to arbitrary-seeming additions to my routine (through a weird combination of laziness and over-optimization impulses).

But maybe when I move in a few months, I'll have a window to create new routines which will stick. That's kind of how the walking and stairs thing happened a few years ago, and I think it makes it easier to establish new norms, since I'm not just changing one thing out of the blue. Guess I need to think about what specific habits I want to incorporate when the time comes.

Villanelle

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Re: Exercise for fat people?
« Reply #189 on: June 13, 2019, 05:52:31 PM »
I got a pool floatation belt and did my first pool workout today.  Wow!  Definitely a great workout, and I felt it was a good mix of cardio and resistance.  I also liked that I could adjust the resistance quite easily.  Bend the legs a little, turn the hands from flat to sideways, etc.  And I overheat quite easily (and always have, even when I was in prime condition) so the pool clearly helps with that aspect of things.

I'm feeling super worn out, in a great way, this evening. 


Mrs. D.

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Re: Exercise for fat people?
« Reply #190 on: June 13, 2019, 08:07:44 PM »
I haven't read through all the posts here so I apologize if this is a repeat, but I highly recommend Fitness Blender. Their videos are free, you can do everything at home with little to no equipment, or you can improvise things like water bottles for weights. Look for Low Impact Cardio or Total Body Toning which both help you burn a lot of calories and work up a decent sweat without any jumping or bouncing. Good luck and keep at it.

Cranky

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Re: Exercise for fat people?
« Reply #191 on: June 14, 2019, 06:31:08 AM »
If you are too self-conscious for a gym because you think everyone will be great looking, I agree that you might want to look at your local Y, because they get a huge range of people - fat, skinny, old, young, gym rats, people just starting.

Strength training - I find that carrying the 40# bag of kitty litter downstairs and the basket of wet laundry upstairs is pretty good exercise, but I also have a couple of kettle balls sitting in the kitchen and I do some lifts with those every day, several times/day.

And you can buy a pretty nice exercise bike for $200 (less on Craigs list, I'm sure) and plunk it right in front of the tv. I really love mine.

katscratch

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Re: Exercise for fat people?
« Reply #192 on: June 14, 2019, 08:15:09 AM »
This last year I've had to seek out exercise for "really unfit people" that wouldn't make my injured parts worse, or my non-injured parts bad by overcompensating for my injury.

One thing I've found that really helps how I physically feel is doing joint exercises called CARs, for Controlled Articular Rotations. Basically you move each joint through its range of motion, slowly and with a little bit of tension in the muscles. I was very surprised the first time I did it that I was sweating - it makes you really use your muscles in a focused way, with similar concentration to what you'd need for lifting a weight, and moving slow enough to know when you've reached the limit. I'm not great yet at doing them daily (more like once or twice a week), but I definitely enjoy the results.

I am someone who needs visual direction to know I'm doing things right, so here's the first YouTube result that looks like what I do:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wbkDfRoAuwc

oldladystache

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Re: Exercise for fat people?
« Reply #193 on: June 14, 2019, 09:33:13 AM »
I am someone who needs visual direction to know I'm doing things right, so here's the first YouTube result that looks like what I do:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wbkDfRoAuwc

Wow, thanks for that. I've bookmarked it and I'm gonna start doing it.

Villanelle

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Re: Exercise for fat people?
« Reply #194 on: June 18, 2019, 01:10:23 PM »
I've been keeping up with the pool workouts and really enjoy them.  Not much additional movement on the scale, but a noticeable difference in my body and the fit of my clothes.  However, I am starving, and exhausted.  I'm working out for about 40 minutes at a fairly high intensity (out of breath, can speak but not carry on a conversation), with short breaks or intermittent easier exercises, so I don't think I'm over doing it.  Every night, I am absolutely dragging.  My legs feel tired, but pleasantly so.  My overall body (or mind?) feels super exhausted and sleepy.  And I am ravenous nearly all the time.  I'm trying to resist the urge to eat more, but... soooo hungry!

diapasoun

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Re: Exercise for fat people?
« Reply #195 on: June 18, 2019, 01:54:02 PM »
If you've added in 40 minutes of high intensity exercise every day for the last five days... yeah, of course you're sleepy and ravenous! That's a really big change in the amount you're moving your body around.

Since you have an athletic background, it probably doesn't feel like you're exercising very much -- but it also sounds like this is a big change from what your exercise regimen has been lately. Going at a lower intensity or going less frequently will likely help a lot with the sleepiness/hunger.

Dogastrophe

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Re: Exercise for fat people?
« Reply #196 on: June 18, 2019, 01:54:16 PM »
For me (another fat guy working to be a not-so fat guy), I find when I get really hungry, I'll drink a glass of water instead of reaching for food.  Most times it does the trick ... for times it doesn't I grab a handful of grapes from the fridge.

Parizade

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Re: Exercise for fat people?
« Reply #197 on: June 18, 2019, 02:08:14 PM »
I've been keeping up with the pool workouts and really enjoy them.  Not much additional movement on the scale, but a noticeable difference in my body and the fit of my clothes.  However, I am starving, and exhausted.  I'm working out for about 40 minutes at a fairly high intensity (out of breath, can speak but not carry on a conversation), with short breaks or intermittent easier exercises, so I don't think I'm over doing it.  Every night, I am absolutely dragging.  My legs feel tired, but pleasantly so.  My overall body (or mind?) feels super exhausted and sleepy.  And I am ravenous nearly all the time.  I'm trying to resist the urge to eat more, but... soooo hungry!

Have you tried drinking a glass of fat free chocolate milk after your workout? A cup is only 140 calories and it makes an almost perfect recovery drink with protien, carbs, and electrolytes. I've found it really helps.

wenchsenior

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Re: Exercise for fat people?
« Reply #198 on: June 18, 2019, 03:44:15 PM »
I had plenty of muscle memory for swimming when I took it up again, but I had no actual fitness. The first couple of weeks, 20 minutes of low intensity swimming (which felt ok while I was doing it) would nevertheless leave me shaking so much I couldn't boost myself out of the pool at the end...had to use the ladder...I couldn't believe it! And I slept like the dead, too.

Now, after a couple years, I can swim at medium to high intensity for 45-60 minutes, pop out of the pool like a cork, and feel MORE energetic than when I went in.  But I do get a bit hungrier for dinner swimming this way (which is fine b/c normally my appetite is very poor).

Give it time.  You'll pick up conditioning quickly at the rate you are going.

GreenToTheCore

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Re: Exercise for fat people?
« Reply #199 on: June 19, 2019, 11:58:43 AM »
I found another video that I had stashed which is great for this thread. It’s only 5 minutes long and is definitely worth watching.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eXTiiz99p9o

PURPOSE:

METHODS:

RESULTS:

Sadly I couldn't find any details on exactly what aerobics or strength training programs these people undertook. I would love to see the results of the study if it were conducted again with the addition of a 4th group who did only diet and strength training, but no aerobics. Chances are they would come out on top as they would obtain all the benefits of diet and strength training, but wouldn't have aerobics needlessly eating into their ability to recover from the strength training sessions, meaning they would gain more muscle and strength and possibly lose even more fat.

Hey @Spud, I wanted to recognize the effort that went into writing this post. I really appreciate when folks find external data. In addition to that, not only did you concisely summarize it for us but you also discussed the merits and flaws of the research.

+1 for effort
+1k for critical thinking