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General Discussion => Welcome and General Discussion => Topic started by: trailrated on May 22, 2014, 10:41:35 AM

Title: Epic FU money stories
Post by: trailrated on May 22, 2014, 10:41:35 AM
After reading the blog for quite some time I keep seeing people talking about their FU staches (being different than their FIRE amount) as having the security to "stick it to the man" and walk off the job without stress if they want to.

This being said, I have never seen a story about using that FU money. Please, share your stories!!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: trailrated on May 22, 2014, 01:28:34 PM
So nobody has ever thrown down a stack of papers and rode off into the sunset?
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Russ on May 22, 2014, 01:57:20 PM
three hours isn't exactly a long time to wait for a response...

my FU money has allowed me to be very picky about the jobs I take. haven't actually had to tell anybody to fuck off yet though.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: SisterX on May 22, 2014, 02:01:51 PM
Oh man, I don't have any stories.  But I will say that last week I came this close to having an epic one.  I even had my quitting rant all planned out in my head, something about how my boss is a crazy, sociopath bitch and no amount of money is worth putting up with someone like her.  Then I took 2 deep breaths and reminded myself that having my husband get through this 2nd degree without loans is far, far more important than telling that woman exactly what I think of her.  It would have served her right to be left in the lurch (seriously, she needs me) but not exactly worth it on our end.  We could squeeze by until graduation, barely, but I'd rather get the classes all paid for by work before I give my epic rant.  :(
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: mxt0133 on May 22, 2014, 02:04:49 PM
My FU money allowed me to get married, quit my job, and move across the country in the middle of the financial crisis.  That experience solidified my resolve to reach FI.  Since then my wife has been able to quit her job and be a SAHP, spend six weeks overseas to explore the possibility of living abroad for a few years, and allow me to take it 'easy' career wise to be able to spend more time with the kids while they're young.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: DoubleDown on May 22, 2014, 02:08:25 PM
Man, I would have loved to witness a real life Jerry McGuire or Al Pacino in "And Justice For All" ("I'm out of order??! YOU'RE out of order!!").

A former coworker of mine just got fed up a couple of weeks ago and quit without a FIRE plan, just FU money. He didn't think he had enough to quit forever, and really has no idea. He just knew he had enough to last several years at least, and he was fed up, so he gave a week or two notice and left. I actually told him, "You're gonna be okay, you have FU money!" (he had never heard the term before).
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: bacchi on May 22, 2014, 02:31:35 PM
It's not epic but I have quit on a whim more-or-less and immediately walked out of the building. It was very satisfying. Nothing soothes the soul like quitting a toxic job.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Erica/NWEdible on May 22, 2014, 02:49:27 PM
This isn't an FU money thing, but a former coworker of mine when I was cooking professionally still told the best "Quit with Extreme Prejudice" story I've ever heard.

He was working at a very, very popular restaurant - the place du jour. He was saute, which is one of the linchpin positions on a restaurant line - very busy and very fast moving. It was Friday, 7:40, the place was packed with 3 more hours of packed to go.

The chef came in and started screaming about something. Maybe an order came back, I don't know. But insane screaming rants were a pattern, apparently. About five minutes into this screaming abuse, my coworker decides he's had enough, takes off his apron, throws it on the star-top (picture an 8 burner stove, with all burners all on high), tells the chef to go fuck himself and just walks out the back door. He was done.

The flaming apron sealed it for me.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: trailrated on May 22, 2014, 02:50:14 PM
three hours isn't exactly a long time to wait for a response...


Good point, I get impatient. Loved reading the rest of the responses!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: kyanamerinas on May 22, 2014, 03:05:27 PM
2 years expenses saved allowed me to rent my own place nearer my partner after just 2 months freelancing. Perhaps not the most dramatic or wisest move but i love freelancing and couldn't do it without that reassurance of back up.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Cheddar Stacker on May 22, 2014, 03:49:30 PM
I'm coming up on a major crossroads in my career/at my company. I've been reluctant to post details about it here in case there are any closet mustachians in my real life that know who I am or might have ways of figuring it out.

Long story short, I've built a nice FU stache, and plan to double it before this crossroads occurs in a few years. It will be nice to have the option to take the road less traveled if I feel the need.

So trailrated, feel free to PM me in a few years to see if my FU stache came in handy and created a story worth reading. I've actually strongly considered sending a PM to a few of you mustachians to see how you might handle my situation, so if anyone is intrigued enough and willing to read a fairly long, complex, and hopefully confidential story send me a PM.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: feelingroovy on May 22, 2014, 03:59:31 PM
Not an epic leave, but a few years ago DH had a job that paid well but bored him to tears. 

One month into my 3-month maternity leave, I took my departing in-laws to the airport.  I drove home thinking, "two more months home alone with a toddler and a baby."  God help me.

When I got home, I was shocked to find DH was there.  Tuns out half the company got laid off, including him.  We high-fived.

His severance covered us just until I got back to my 3-day-per week job, so we never had to touch the stache.  Those two months with both of us home were the best.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Dr. Doom on May 22, 2014, 04:05:29 PM

I walked out of the highest paying job of my life at the tail end of 2006, IT work for a big financial company.  (Completely transparent hint:  VWELX without the V)

I'd been there about three and a half years.  First two years were good because I had a decent manager who showed signs of being a real human being once in a while.

Third year, I get a new manager, and he's a total Fbag.  He had his last name on his license plate.  Guys on his team instantly began working 65+ hours a week instead of an already demanding 50ish.  The company paid really well so I stuck with it.  It's only work, right?

Wrong.  He started calling all of his guys on home phones, cell phones, etc. to discuss any issues he could think of at any time.  I started to think of him as a terrorist because you never knew when the next attack was coming.  He would frame the calls in the guise of "production support" because part of our role was to provide after-hours support for systems and services that needed to be available.   But many of the topics were not directly related to outages and were really just beatings.  He was a micromanager, a control-freak, and a grade-A douche who hid his insecurity behind his overbearing and driven public persona.  God help his children.

The final straw came when I got a call on Sunday Dec 23rd in 2006.  We had an outage on Saturday and I'd been involved in fixing it.  My girlfriend (now wife) was helping me decorate a small, pathetic looking christmas tree.  We were trying to put work behind us and enjoy one quiet day to ourselves, without any office nonsense, prior to the upcoming week, which was going to be full of family visits and travel.  Just one goddamn quiet day, you know? 

I pick up the phone and he starts complaining about the work I did the previous day, Saturday.  (Saturday mind, you -- work I put in on a non-standard day.  I should also add it was the 6th Saturday in a row that I'd worked.  This was fairly typical for the job.)  He says I need to remember to "fall on my sword" as soon as I get back to the office on Dec 26th -- tell everyone that the Saturday problem was my fault and I'm taking the proper long term corrective actions to resolve it.  (The problem wasn't actually my fault but he wanted me to take responsibility for it anyway.)

I remind him it's Sunday, and we're coming up on Christmas, and ask if there's any current problem that needs to be resolved.  (I'm really asking:  are any systems down?  Is there any business related reason for this call or is this just a friendly Sunday afternoon beating?)  He says yes, the problem is we have too many outages and the perception of the team is negative.   I tell him we should talk about this Thursday live instead of two days before Christmas and hang up the phone.

My SO is furious.  I'm furious.  It's no longer a nice quiet day.  I try to let it go over the holidays but the anger sits in my stomach like a fruitcake from Big Y.  I can't see how I can make it through another year at this place, despite the incredible salary and benefits.

Thursday after Christmas I get into the office and my manager immediately shows up in my office to talk about Visibility, Perception and Politics.  I cut him off and say I'm leaving.

"Leaving, what you don't feel well?"
"No, leaving the company."
He takes a step back.  I'm sitting in my cube and he's standing in front of me.  "Where are you going?"  His eyes are really wide.
"Nowhere."
"You don't have another job lined up?"
"No."
"Is it the salary?"
"No."
"It is, isn't it?  I could work with HR to see if we could work something out."
"No, it's not.  You know what it is."  I'm staring at him with my arms across my chest.  He's clearly uncomfortable, kind of wavering on his feet, but I feel terrific.  I'm thinking:  Today's the last day I'm ever going to have to look at you or hear your voice.

He finally manages to say, "You should think about this.  Someone your age shouldn't leave your job."
And I said "I know exactly what I'm doing here.  Don't worry about me.  Worry about replacing me, because you'll need to."

The conversation went a little longer than that but not much.  They ended up escorting me out, probably because my manager knew I was angry and I had tons of passwords to critical systems and hey you never know.

I got a much better job a month later.  20% overall comp. package cut but 40% reduction in work and 100% removal of my old manager.

No regrets.  I feel obligated to add that it was actually a fine place to work, lots of bright people and interesting technologies.  But even decent jobs become intolerable when you're working under a toxic egomaniac workaholic inhuman prick.

One of the things I'm now fond of saying is that people usually don't leave their jobs.  They leave their managers.   
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: marty998 on May 22, 2014, 05:02:59 PM
...

YOU DA MAN.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: deborah on May 22, 2014, 05:05:36 PM
FU money enabled me to continue to live the life I chose after being hit by a bus.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Wolf_Stache on May 22, 2014, 05:29:46 PM
Dr. Doom, that is epic. I have to agree that EVERY time I've quit a job its been because of the managers or personal reasons (ie moving, school, ect), NEVER because of the job itself.

One place where I worked a guy went to lunch and just never came back. It was actually a decent place to work, I only left to get my Masters Degree, but I truly regret it now - the Masters wasn't worth it and I loved that place.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: ch12 on May 22, 2014, 06:20:43 PM
...

YOU DA MAN.

Dr. Doom's story was amazing. At-will employment FTW.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: CarDude on May 22, 2014, 06:57:31 PM
FU money enabled me to continue to live the life I chose after being hit by a bus.

Eek. What happened there?

Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: CarDude on May 22, 2014, 06:58:31 PM
Oh, and it's not epic, but I've turned down a number of jobs over the years simply because I didn't need the money enough to put up with the coworkers...or commutes. It never gets old.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: 2527 on May 22, 2014, 07:07:02 PM
My dad had a real estate partner who was really pissing him off.  He told her that if she didn't shape up, he would stop paying his half of the mortgage, and let the apartment building go into foreclosure.  She said, "You can't do that, you'll ruin your own credit rating."  He said, "I'm 60 years old, I don't need this apartment building, and I don't need a credit rating, and I'll be happy to ruin my to ruin yours."

After that, she toed the line.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Daisy on May 22, 2014, 07:31:43 PM
Not as epic as Dr. Doom - that was an awe-inspiring story - but here it goes:

I was working at a company I was unhappy at. A couple of things happened:

1. My project was losing funds and I was bored, so I interviewed internally for two projects that were on the upswing. Project 1 was more interesting, but had a boss that everyone warned me about. Project 2 was less interesting. Project 1's manager interviewed me. He was very cordial, but did mention during the interview that it wasn't a 40-hr a week job. When I asked, he mentioned about 55-60 hrs. I heard him out politely. Now, others that worked for him had warned me that he was a micro-manager and asked for things that weren't necessary. I was impressed that at least he was upfront with what he expected. After sleeping on it one night, I went in to work the next day and told him that I couldn't work more than 40-hr weeks. I would work more hours during a crunch time, but not consistently. Then he tried to negotiate with me and said I could do it on the weekends. I politely turned him down and took the offer on Project 2. He looked at me totally surprised with my answer.

2. Project 2 then started to lose funding. Well, I knew if layoffs were going to happen that I would be a target. Some layoffs happened in other groups and based on some emails that went around, I knew our group would be hit. So the week before I expected it, I made sure to empty out my desk, computer, etc. Then when I came in on Monday morning, I got called into HR for them to tell me I was being laid off and had to leave. As I was signing the paperwork (totally jovial on the upcoming "break" I had planned and knowing that as soon as I left the office I would be hanging out at the beach):

- I noticed the date was 6/6 when I was signing the paperwork and openly joked about how weird a coincidence that was (HR lady was perplexed with how relaxed and humorous I was being).

- As I was signing the paperwork, the fire alarm sounded and we all had to evacuate the building. The HR people couldn't believe they now had to spend even more time with me as they escorted me out before bringing me back in to finish signing the paperwork. While we were all outside, I was able to say goodbye to everyone and mentioned I was in the process of being laid off - in front of the HR people.

Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: LalsConstant on May 22, 2014, 09:23:08 PM
Well I've left a couple of jobs because there was some awful stuff going on, but I had no kind of FU money when I did it (I kind of did the second time but it's complicated), so I don't have a story of my own.

But when I was still working at Wal-Mart, I was witness to the Legend of Frank.

Frank was an older, white haired gentleman who was already a hero, he'd had a long military career and the truth is, he was one of the best employees the store had.  But he had his terms.  He had the only job at Wal-Mart he cared to have, and he worked the only shift he cared to work.

But he'd done so well for so long, no one had a problem with this.  Thing is Frank did not need the money, at all.  He had a military pension, his house was paid for, and he was actually delaying Social Security for a bigger payment because he didn't need it.  He worked for reasons that aren't fathomable to me.  He used the money he made to buy fishing lures and gave a chunk of it away to the Children's Miracle Network and stuff like that.

Now I have good and bad things to say about Wal-Mart.  Right now I'm going to say one of the bad things.

I don't know if this is by some evil design (I doubt it, never ascribe to malignancy that which can be explained by incompetence) or what, but it seems every once in a while some goober in Arkansas, for the hell of it, decides to change the way employees are scheduled or what jobs exist and what they do, and the usual effect of this is it tends to make older, more highly paid workers quit or find themselves in situations where they have to resign because they have a personal situation where they can't start working nights instead of mornings or something like that.

As a graduate of business school myself, I call that MBA thinking, and I say that pejoratively.  Actions like this are necessary sometimes but what I saw was something that some overpaid executive cooked up on a spreadsheet to make it look like he/she found a way to save money when in fact he/she was only shuffling people around and causing operational risks.  If (s)he'd paid attention in business school he'd realize what he/she was doing was in fact pointless.

This is what happens when people under intense pressure to justify their huge six or even seven figure salaries who have never worked in a Wal-Mart store, who think of the company not as people and stores and trucks and groceries and merchandise but rather as abstract numbers, make decisions about the jobs of people they will never meet.  I'm sure these corporate people are perfectly nice people, but I doubt very much that the $11 an hour workers whose fates they manipulate are more than an idea or a piece of the data to them.  Dunbar's number.  Wal-Mart has 2 million employees.  You do the math.

Well anyway, someone decided that Frank's job was too cushy and he needed a new schedule.  They basically took his job and another job, cut half the responsibilities and work from each, and switched them so you wound up with this weird situation where the new job had some of both of the old jobs.  And while it wasn't a completely illogical way to do things, it didn't make sense to the people who actually did this work.  This was a "I'm a smart corporate executive and you are a lowly peon, do what I say" initiative.

When this happens, they usually call you in to an office to tell you it's happened right before the schedules showing the changes come out.  That way they can say they gave you advance notice without really giving you any ability to deal with it.  It's a shitty thing they do because they know so many of their good employees won't quit because Wal-Mart is all they have.

But it didn't pan out for them this time.

Frank looked across at the overnight manager and said no, I won't do it.

The manager, who was a real douchebag, said yes you will and you'll like it (witness as unreliable but I can definitely imagine this guy saying that).

Frank looked at him and unclipped something from his belt and something from his shirt pocket.  He then opened his wallet and removed something.

"Here's my box cutter.  Here's my discount card.  And here's my badge.  That's everything I have of yours.  I'm going home."

Three hours into his shift, Frank turned around and walked out the front door of Wal-Mart and into a legend, vanishing in the darkness of the parking lot.  It threw the rest of us into chaos because we had to pick up the slack, but none of us complained, for he was our hero.  Because at some point, every single one of us had wanted to do that.

Last I heard of Frank, he's doing a lot more fishing nowadays.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Dr. Doom on May 22, 2014, 09:23:39 PM
Dr. Doom, that is epic. I have to agree that EVERY time I've quit a job its been because of the managers or personal reasons (ie moving, school, ect), NEVER because of the job itself.

One place where I worked a guy went to lunch and just never came back. It was actually a decent place to work, I only left to get my Masters Degree, but I truly regret it now - the Masters wasn't worth it and I loved that place.

To the guy who just disappeared.. wow.  He missed an opportunity to really enjoy himself.  Confrontations can be fun if you're calm and in control. 

I've been in my industry close to 15 years and one point repeats:  It's not what you do so much as who you have to work with that most directly affects your happiness.  I had some functionally horrible jobs in my late teens (dishwasher, retail) that were made OK because I worked with great people who supported each other and laughed about stuff to relieve stress and fatigue.  But at the same time, functionally great jobs can be rendered miserable by the company you are forced to keep.

Still, congrats on your masters.  Even if there isn't a direct financial payoff, I'm sure that there's some value in it.  I've always semi-regretted not pursuing any edu post-BS.   Learning is awesome.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: KatieSSS on May 22, 2014, 09:34:01 PM
Thank you, all, for these wonderful stories! I really needed to read this after a day like today, where I want to walk right out. I didn't and that is a good thing, but all the more reason to keep building the 'stache :) Someday I will be Frank or Dr. Doom. And it will be glorious.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: limeandpepper on May 22, 2014, 09:38:15 PM
Three hours into his shift, Frank turned around and walked out the front door of Wal-Mart and into a legend, vanishing in the darkness of the parking lot.  It threw the rest of us into chaos because we had to pick up the slack, but none of us complained, for he was our hero.  Because at some point, every single one of us had wanted to do that.

Wow I think this is my favourite story so far! It's like the Shawshank Redemption. (And I have always felt that emotions of The Shawshank Redemption would be an appropriate analogy to my feelings the day I finally break free from my workplace, haha!)

I'll be quitting my job soon, but I doubt it would be epic, as my company genuinely doesn't seem to care about people coming and going. They just make the people left behind work harder. My current draft of my resignation letter has something along the lines of "...new adventures call, and I have decided to embark upon an indefinite sabbatical" - I'm still not sure if I should include that, but it sure feels good to write it down!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: pdxvandal on May 22, 2014, 10:29:02 PM
I left a job 6 years ago, although it wasn't because of FU money.

I had been there about a year at this place where the "leadership" would treat employees unethically i.e., "promoting" someone they didn't like, then asking them to train their replacement for a month ... and then lay off that "promoted" person. Shady financial dealings, dumb office politics, firing someone during their cancer treatments, etc.

So, I'd found a newer, better job and decided to leave the d-bags. Only instead of 2 weeks' notice, I gave them a one-minute notice on a Friday at 4:59 p.m. via a short two-sentence email. And this was 5 minutes after I sent a far friendlier email to the colleagues I respected. So the brass was the last to know. It felt great. No regrets.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Bateaux on May 23, 2014, 06:21:24 AM
My FU Money allows me to post my opinions to social networking sites that might get me fired.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Basenji on May 23, 2014, 06:58:30 AM
One of the things I'm now fond of saying is that people usually don't leave their jobs.  They leave their managers.

Amen. I was at wits end at one point with my manager (but I really liked my actual job and the company) and then just when I was sending out resumes and doing interviews we had a reorganization and I suddenly worked for a whole new chain of bosses. Although the new immediate supervisor isn't the best manager, it's still waaaay better.

Oh, and +1 to knowing I am going to be FI in a limited number of years makes me lighthearted and able to deal with BS better at work.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: iris lily on May 23, 2014, 07:20:19 AM
My FU Money allows me to post my opinions to social networking sites that might get me fired.

hahahaha!

Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: frompa on May 23, 2014, 07:42:45 AM
Wow.  These responses are incredible, as much for what they DON'T say as for what they do.  As a self-employed person for the last several decades, I have a more direct and controllable relationship to my work -- sure there are daily frustrations, but for the most part I can focus on what needs to be done, do it on a schedule that suits me, don't have a manager or HR to deal with, etc..  What I hear from my self-directed perch as I read everyone's stories is a powerful undercurrent of the fear and intimidation inherent in most corporate work places.  And haven't I seen it plenty with my own family and friends? It seems that for most of us work makes us dependent on whims and strategizing by invisible others who have no knowledge of or care for the real human lives they affect, with HR as the ever-willing henchmen (and -women.)  Dependency is too weak a word, slavery too strong a word, but it's somewhere in the middle there.   I find these responses moving.   
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Paul der Krake on May 23, 2014, 07:47:33 AM
Dependency is too weak a word, slavery too strong a word, but it's somewhere in the middle there.
Servitude?
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: frompa on May 23, 2014, 07:51:43 AM
Yes, "servitude" with an "involuntary" in front of it.  That seems about right.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: arebelspy on May 23, 2014, 08:00:16 AM
Yes, "servitude" with an "involuntary" in front of it.  That seems about right.

Don't fool yourself.  It's voluntary.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Insanity on May 23, 2014, 08:06:52 AM
I've got two.  One is from a former co-worker and one is my own.  I don't know if I had FU Money, but I had a new position lined up already within the same company so i wasn't afraid to have something bad happen.

A co-woker was supporting an older web site the company had developed.  There were pager alerts that came out almost nightly, if not multiple times a night. He had already put requests in to have the alerts disabled since they could be handled at 8 AM (it was a repeated alert for the same issue) when he got in and before they needed to be addressed for business reasons.  He didn't need the pager going off all night.  The managers refused.  The bill came in and the Sr. VP was PISSED!  He came down and started berating my co-worker.  The response was epic.  The co-worker took his pager out and handed it to the Sr. VP and said: "You can take the pager and do the support then."   The Sr. VP backed down and said lets try to find another solution.

As for me.  Well, I was on web development team that required "occasional" off hours support.  In the good times, we had 6 people rotating so it was once very six weeks.  But the company decided to offshore the development work and are team dwindled down to 3 and then 1.  Yes, I was the tech lead by that point and I was the last one left.  For weeks at a time, I would get calls in the middle of the night 3-4 times a week.  I would have to be on site for nightly releases every couple of weeks.  My fiancé at the time was getting furious as was I.  She told me to turn the phone in, I told her I was just in it for a little longer.  The straw that broke the camels back was when I got calls 4 nights in a row for things the team should now be able to handle.  I walked into my manager's office and handed him the cell phone and said: "I'm here between 9-5 and will be happy to handle the transition as needed.  I am no longer accessible after those hours.".  His response was mouth agape.  He didn't take me to HR. He didn't do anything.  A week later I was starting my new position in the company, 5 months later I was called back in due to an issue on the site which is a whole different story.

DrDoom is right - most people leave companies because of management and co-workers, not the actual job.  I wanted to convert our sites to more updated technology, management didn't want to do that.  Even with the history of offshoring, I would have done that because it would have been a great learning experience.  Thanks to them, though, I am now doing application security work and much better off!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: tooqk4u22 on May 23, 2014, 08:30:49 AM
I have been offered jobs that make quite a bit more money but wasn't a fit - people would say I can't believe you are not taking it.  And I would respond "Making a change for $10, $20, or $30k is not worth it or that important to me"  People are always dumbfounded.

So FU money gives you the ability to leave but it also gives you the ability to stay.

Of course if I was in a shitty situation I would be all over it.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Vorpal on May 23, 2014, 08:37:35 AM
[Tale of Awesomeness]

I knew I liked you :)  I enjoy your blog, too.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: wild wendella on May 23, 2014, 08:49:30 AM
My husband used his FU money to walk away from a perfectly good job so be could move two hours away to live with me a month before our son was born and be a stay at home dad for a while.  OK, it wasn't actually designated as 'FU' money; he views it as his 'saving for a house' fund.  Regardless, having a $ cushion allows you the freedom to take risks you wouldn't ordinarily consider, because with the cushion they are no longer so risky.

Now almost two years later, he is still a stay-at-home dad and we haven't touched his stash.  :)
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: brewer12345 on May 23, 2014, 09:25:50 AM
Not exactly an FU story, but...

I bailed in January right after the holidays.  There were aspects of the job that were very off-putting (travel), but the important parts of the job were interesting and generally worthwhile.  The problem was everything else.  Endless meetings and conference calls for absolutely no reason.  Reams of useless make-work that did nothing but help the officer class substantiate to their superiors that they had firm control over everything.  A work culture that was so Neolithic it was unbelievable.  A workforce that was equipped to travel all the time and execute independently in the field was not trusted to work from home (where 90+% of the job could be done) at all.  Just last year they finally changed the policy that said that if you did not make it to the office regardless of the weather (we have white out blizzards here) you would be charged a vacation day even if you worked from home.  This was all completely unnecessary, but there was no way to get them to change it.

My direct manager was easily the best I have ever worked for, but like me he was a prisoner of the system.  I took pains to give them 2 weeks' notice, make the transition as easy as I could, spent time schooling up someone who could fill in for me and left on cordial terms.  To this day I don't think they have any idea why I left.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Jon_Snow on May 23, 2014, 09:46:12 AM
If OMY Syndrome doesn't get the better of me, my "FU" later this year will likely be a pathetically polite and thankful one. I have had more than enough of this job (two near fatal close calls, and endless other indignities), but I do realize that the salary they have given me for the past 24 years has helped put me in a position to ER for good at 42.

So yeah, a most boring "FU" to my overseers is likely...
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: biscuitwhomper on May 23, 2014, 11:01:03 AM
I like this thread, as it reminds me of the greatest, yet most unexpected benefit of retiring early.

I now get to choose with whom I associate.

With so much bad behavior out there, this is huge.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: ShortInSeattle on May 23, 2014, 11:21:58 AM
I think FU money is something that employers should encourage. Who would you want working with you, people who actually want to be there or people who feel like they have no choice? Don't companies always say they want engagement? I don't think engagement happens when people feel trapped.

Love the WalMart guy story. A great example of how financial stability/security preserves our dignity. When you are enslaved to paycheck-to-paycheck living, you may need to set your dignity aside if you want to eat that month.









Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Dr. Doom on May 23, 2014, 12:27:35 PM
... all the stuff

Dope.  Noisy pageouts+horribly structured on-call rotations have been an issue just about every place I've worked.  Pushing back is completely reasonable and necessary for sanity. 

I find it amazing that in every case, management is completely shocked when workers refuse to put up with obviously horrible working conditions.  That's how rarely people complain. 

All hail FU money.

Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: MoneyCat on May 23, 2014, 01:42:45 PM
We've only had FU money for a short time now, so I don't have any stories to tell yet.  I am working a job I enjoy right now and this thread has made me realize that I have the financial flexibility now to not have to work jobs I hate anymore.  In the old days, I worked some pretty dangerous jobs where I risked physical injury all the time.  Now, I can be choosy about what jobs I will take and that makes life so much better.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: seanc0x0 on May 23, 2014, 01:51:50 PM
I think FU money is something that employers should encourage. Who would you want working with you, people who actually want to be there or people who feel like they have no choice? Don't companies always say they want engagement? I don't think engagement happens when people feel trapped.

Love the WalMart guy story. A great example of how financial stability/security preserves our dignity. When you are enslaved to paycheck-to-paycheck living, you may need to set your dignity aside if you want to eat that month.

Oh man, engagement.  That word is a loaded one around here, I tells ya!  The HR dept is always sending crap around talking about creating an 'engaged workforce', then when it comes time to negotiate a new collective agreement, they fight tooth and nail to keep the wage increases below inflation. Sure makes us feel engaged!

That said, I did just realize I'm 25 days from hitting my 5 weeks of vacation per year, so it could be worse.  :)

Still working on the FU money. I barely have 2k in the FIRE fund (but at least it's positive!)
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: rujancified on May 23, 2014, 03:01:02 PM
Love this thread. Don't have anything to add just yet, unfortunately.

My current work situation is generally easy, but utterly uninspiring and heavily bureaucratic. My boss is great and looks out for me, so I suppose that's why I stick around.

We're a few years away from FU money being stached up, but I look forward to plotting out a exit strategy.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Free at 55 on May 23, 2014, 03:07:36 PM
I used FU money in 2011 to take a sabbatical. I had just turned 51. I walked into my boss's office and said: I need to tell you something. I'm taking a year off". He said: "We don't allow that here". I said: "I'm not asking for you permission. I'm just doing it." He said: 'We can't guarantee that you can have your job back" I said: "I can't guarantee that I'll want my job back!". He asked: "How can you possibly afford to do this?" I said: "That's really a personal question, but I can tell you it involves savings and investments". Man, this dude was pissed. The president of the company called me to wish me the best and asked me to call him when I returned from my walkabout to discuss some opportunities. I ended up returning to a different department 15 months later. Higher pay. Promotion. I quit again 2 years later. They transferred me to another division. Higher pay. Another promotion.
Frugality pays.
I'm preparing for another world tour.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: trailrated on May 23, 2014, 03:12:59 PM
I used FU money in 2011 to take a sabbatical. I had just turned 51. I walked into my boss's office and said: I need to tell you something. I'm taking a year off". He said: "We don't allow that here". I said: "I'm not asking for you permission. I'm just doing it." He said: 'We can't guarantee that you can have your job back" I said: "I can't guarantee that I'll want my job back!". He asked: "How can you possibly afford to do this?" I said: "That's really a personal question, but I can tell you it involves savings and investments". Man, this dude was pissed. The president of the company called me to wish me the best and asked me to call him when I returned from my walkabout to discuss some opportunities. I ended up returning to a different department 15 months later. Higher pay. Promotion. I quit again 2 years later. They transferred me to another division. Higher pay. Another promotion.
Frugality pays.
I'm preparing for another world tour.

Thank you for sharing, that is quite inspiring to someone young and starting out!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Storapa on May 23, 2014, 03:49:59 PM
Some great stories here.

I call my stash MBs (stands for Money Bananas).  It feels like I'm working at zoo sometimes. I'm just one of the chimps, chasing the others about, hanging about in my tyre etc. Once a month they chuck in some MBs.  I've been so close to telling them to stick the job.  I now know that it's my FU stash.  It feels great to have it sitting there ticking over. 

Keep the stories coming. 

PS... Storapa is Swedish for Big Monkey.......

Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Allison on May 23, 2014, 06:56:49 PM
After crying at work for the 6th time in 6 months, I got a nasty phone from my boss who was the 3rd to hold that position in 1 year.  He went into a meeting after the phone call and I sent him an email saying that this was obviously not working out.  Put my badge on my desk, apologized to my coworkers and walked out.  I heard later that he got out the meeting, saw my email and wondered if it was real.

Three days later I had a job offer in my dream city for a 25% raise.  FU money covered a month of moving and relocation fee before the new paychecks rolled.  Also allowed me to take a week long vacation 4 weeks after I started at the new job.  Best feeling ever to be able to handle all that without financial stress.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: brewer12345 on May 23, 2014, 06:59:35 PM
After crying at work for the 6th time in 6 months

Thanks for the reminder.  I used to end up in tears about twice a week before I quit.  Must have been silly seeing a grown man hop out of a truck at the train station lot with tears running down his face.  Not at all since I quit.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: B L I S S on May 23, 2014, 07:09:59 PM
Such an amazing thread.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: iwasjustwondering on May 23, 2014, 09:09:35 PM
I didn't have FU money, but I did have another job lined up.  I had an abusive sociopath of a boss.  She would call me up after conference calls, to discuss exactly what I did wrong each time (I either talked too much/interrupted, or didn't talk enough).  She criticized everything I did, and everything my coworkers did.  When I joined the company, two people pulled me aside to tell me how abusive Susan was, and to get out, get out, as quickly as I could.  Then I got severe pertussis, almost died (I coughed till I vomited every night, and cracked two ribs from coughing) and was out on disability for a month.  She posted my job on the company website during this time.

But because I did not have FU money, I had to stick with it.  Eventually I found another job and gave notice.  She started to berate me at the beginning of a conference call during my notice period, and I said, "Susan, you will speak to me in a respectful tone of voice, or you won't speak to me at all."  It was awesome.  When the client came on the line, she was so flustered she couldn't speak.

The sad thing is that the one person who managed to stay with her for more than five years became really warped.  He told me we all had to learn how to deal with her, and I said, no, actually, we don't.  Most of us wise up and leave.  He was so sad.  We called him No Affect because he spoke in this weird, scared monotone.  All the people who worked for her for more than two years started to develop this monotone, because it's what she wanted.  We weren't allowed to use the pronoun "I" with the client.  It was "we."  We weren't supposed to be actual human beings, just faceless agency reps.  No Affect ended up getting fired by her a year or so later.  There was no winning with her, and for some reason he couldn't understand that.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: vern on May 23, 2014, 11:26:57 PM
I learned many years ago that you have two choices in this life...you can be management or you can be happy.  Pick one.

A while back my two immediate supervisors called me into their office and said...

"If you don't accept this management position you're never getting promoted again."

My response...

"Cool."

You should have seen their faces!  They couldn't believe that someone would pass up a pay raise just to avoid a bunch of added headaches and stress.  (They ended up promoting a younger person, who of course complained about all of the extra work he had to put in.)

It never ceases to amaze me the amount of hoops people will jump through or the contortions they will go into in order to make a few extra grand a year. 

Having enough money banked made that call a no-brainer!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: mmmellen on May 24, 2014, 05:57:00 AM
Working for someone who is toxic is extremely detrimental, not only to your psych, but also to your health. 

I was an ESL teacher and speak Spanish, also, which meant I did a lot of interpreting in meetings, even when it was not my student being discussed.  I had been moved around to different schools in the system as they moved our minority population around to "balance" the schools racially (not a good move in this system as the schools in the poorer areas were often better performing than the mostly "white" schools. 

Despite the fact that I have decades of experience teaching English to immigrant students successfully, this principal decided I did not know how to teach the children and was forbidden to teach them reading and instead to teach them vocabulary.  The problem is that children learn most of their vocabulary through reading at a certain point as everyday language with children is pretty limited (this is why we read to our children from the time they are babies, to expand their vocabulary and comprehension).

Now, I have a brain injury and could only work three days a week, which really was a huge push for me since I could not function at home, but could not leave financially (did not have FU money as I had used my savings during time off for cancer treatment).

To make a long story short, my principal wrote me up on an observation that was full of lies, which I proved to her during a meeting with others present (including my union rep).  I was told I was not allowed to send my own books home with the students, nor was I to help them learn to read or write (this is what ELL teachers do).  Eventually the stress became so great that I began having seizures on my way home from work one Friday and am now unable to work as this has further injured my brain.

My FU in this is that, since then, the school has gone through many other ESL teachers who have left because the stress was "way too high" and now, I'm sure she is recognizing (although not admitting) that I did know what I was doing.

I have no doubt that if my doctors had not told me I could no longer work, my children would not have a mother now.  The sad part is that I loved teaching.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: johnintaiwan on May 24, 2014, 06:01:07 AM
I've got two. The first happened a few months ago and isnt all that exciting, but the second happened in high school and was pretty great.

A few months ago the other foreign teacher at my school moved away and they hired a new one. I was not very happy about the new hire because he was from Iran and not a native English speaker, but this didn't stop them from telling the parents that even though his English was worse than the local teachers. I got over that since they didnt really have any other choice. But then they wanted me to start giving up some of my hours to him since he had to travel from far away and didnt want to make the trip for just two classes. I told my boss i wasnt happy about this, but there was nothing I could do. So I walked across the street to a rival school during my break, did a demo and got a job offer with a rasie. After the break told them I wouldnt be back after the 2 week Chinese New Year vacation that started the next day. They still call me offering more money if I come back and numerous students have left to find me for private classes or to come to my new school.

Sophomore year in HS I got a job at a gas station (cant pump your own in Oregon) just for spending money and investing. I didnt need the job but wanted to get some money and stay out of trouble. I was only a sophomore but had already completed more school than any of the "adults" there. For about 2 months I would get calls at 6 am on Saturday and Sunday asking if I could come in because someone got arrested or was too drunk/high to work and I was the only one who could do it. I would have to pump the gas and run the car wash by myself until 12 while the owner worked the till. He would always yell at me to wash the windows of every car that came in no matter how busy we were.

One Saturday I got the call and showed up at 6:05 (I lived pretty close). at around 6:30 There were two cars getting filled up and buying a car wash. another was being filled and i was washing the windshield. Boss came out and told me to wash the windshield of every car. I told him, with squigee in hand that I was. He asked about the other two cars and I told him they were getting a car wash. He told me I needed an attitude adjustment. I told him to go fuck himself and that he needed to wash the windows, I quit and just left. He was dumbfounded. He had to shut down the station until the next worker showed up at 12.

Three months latter he lost the station and was working the pumps just like one of us lowly workers and for the same pay (he had taken out a loan from the previous owner and was unable to pay it back. The previous owner took control again). I came in to get some gas and he made a sarcastic comment about my shirt. I told all the other workers in spanish (most of them were from Guatemala) that at least I didnt run my company into the ground. They all started laughing their asses off and he had no idea why.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: DoubleDown on May 24, 2014, 10:04:35 AM
Not a "fuck you" story, but I was able to stick up for myself and some of my coworkers in situation where most are too cautious to.

A co-worker [We'll call him SHITHEAD] that I (and many) have to work with a lot is not mentally stable. He lied very very frequently to try to make himself look good. He treated people like shit often. He'd blow up on people in big meetings with visitors from headquarters - he'd pick one person to try to focus on and blame and try to make them look bad. They'd defend themselves and their team in a reasonable way and he'd just keep going, red, furious, and yelling. He did this to me and my team a few times. I'd always stand up for us and he would blow up in ways unacceptable at our workplace.

Him and I both reported to our plant manager, who was fairly new. I didn't really like the new plant manager, but he wasn't so bad. Three on the management team - basically the three worst on the team - the HR manager, SHITHEAD, and one other guy kissed his ass a ton. They became golfing buddies. They'd golf together every weekend, talk about it at work, etc.. So I was in a situation where I knew that when I stuck up for myself and the others, I'd be in a room with SHITHEAD, his golfing buddy (our boss the plant manager), and his other golfing buddy (the HR manager, who was a miserable HR manager). I'd talked to my boss a number of times about it and I was very clear that it was absolutely not acceptable for this to continue, it but it wasn't getting any better. There were plenty of other people who saw what happened. There was one person, [JOHN] who  SHITHEAD did much worse to than me (harrassment really), but JOHN was scared to stick up for himself because he had a lower hierarchal position and was worried he'd get blamed, had a family to support, etc.  I'd beed documenting what SHITHEAD did, so I emailed it to the HR manager and my boss. My boss was new as a plant manager and he needed to look like he could handle issues with his staff. The next day he looked like shit and told me he didn't sleep the night before. I'm a good employee (which is known across the division), so firing or blaming me was not really an option. My boss knew I'd continue sticking up for myself and that I would escalate if the situation didn't improve quickly. After me, JOHN sent his documentation also. We had a formal meeting together which was pretty much your standard mediation and "be nice to eachother" stuff. A month later I got a promotion with a 15 or 20% raise and relocation (the relocation money ends up being a $10k bonus for me). I'm all but certain the timing was related to me sticking up for myself.

When I left, JOHN got promoted to my position. A few months later, SHITHEAD got a final written warning and has been behaving better now.

Having and using Fuck You money can end up making things work out better for (nearly) all involved.

I enjoyed your story, especially referring to SHITHEAD in all caps throughout!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: DoubleDown on May 24, 2014, 10:16:43 AM
I learned many years ago that you have two choices in this life...you can be management or you can be happy.  Pick one.

Amen. I eventually also started turning down all the "career advancing" star management jobs that were offered to me, and it was a great call. "You mean I can work an extra 10-20 hours a week, with tons of added stress and responsibility and politics and ass-kissing for an extra $10-20k/year? Woohoo, sign me up!!"

And on an unrelated note, so many assholes in this thread! Brings back many fond memories of the innumerable assholes in my career. But lots of great coworkers and managers too to balance them out.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: zataks on May 24, 2014, 10:29:53 AM
I don't have a good story for this nor do I yet have FU money as I'm destroying debt and increasing EF and the stache.  But I've worked hard and taken work seriously in my career and had good and bad bosses.  Only had 3 employers in my career and both of those two times submitting my resignation with notice was very sweet.  The latest resignation, I was still expected to work for my final week but my access to all buildings via keycard, my keys, and my login credentials were taken away and disabled.  I used sick time to get paid for that week and just showed up to submit to a tool inventory before leaving.

mmmellen that's a rough story to hear.  I'm beginning to understand the effects of stress on the body.  While my issues are not as severe as yours were, I am currently under excessive stress and very difficult working conditions that provide little time off and very little sleep and I am beginning to see my health suffer.  The hours are stepping down towards 40 over the next couple weeks and I have two different vacations coming up between now and the middle of July.  Although I don't have the FU money, I would like to tell my boss that I can't do these hours much longer--and hopefully explain that it's not the work that's bothersome but that my health is suffering for it.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: imustachemystash on May 24, 2014, 12:12:46 PM
I learned many years ago that you have two choices in this life...you can be management or you can be happy.  Pick one.

A while back my two immediate supervisors called me into their office and said...

"If you don't accept this management position you're never getting promoted again."

My response...

"Cool."

You should have seen their faces!  They couldn't believe that someone would pass up a pay raise just to avoid a bunch of added headaches and stress.  (They ended up promoting a younger person, who of course complained about all of the extra work he had to put in.)

It never ceases to amaze me the amount of hoops people will jump through or the contortions they will go into in order to make a few extra grand a year. 

Having enough money banked made that call a no-brainer!

Very well put.  My husband is a software developer and he is so much happier just coding instead of having to manage a team of people.  Living the mustachian lifestyle lets him be satisfied what he earns and takes away the pressure of having to earn more more more!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Albert on May 24, 2014, 01:07:26 PM
I don't have any horrible stories as I'm still on my first (possibly only) job after finishing grad school. I think I've been blessed with good bosses and rather relaxed work atmosphere. The second one has been better than the first one, but the first one wasn't particularly bad either. Just not really talented at dealing with people...

I have had, however, once incident from the perspective of a manager (I'm leading a small 2-3 people team). One day a member of my team, a women in her mid 20-ties, comes into my office crying and tells me that she can't work with that other guy in the lab (in his 50-ties, not reporting to me). Apparently he calls her and another female lab mate names, belittles and criticises them constantly. It was a mess, I had to involve my boss and HR to sort it all out. It was a learning experience for me, because I should have noticed something is not right but I didn't… Eventually the guy was given a formal notice and my co-worker was moved elsewhere. I later found out that the perpetrator had a long history of being unable to get along with women, particularly young women.

Also I don't agree with all managerial work being unpleasant. I enjoy very much directing my team, and as far as I know I'm popular with my employees. I manage to make them do a lot of work without being mean or intruding into their private lives. :)

By the way if I handed in my resignation here, I would have to work another 3 months (or they would have to pay me for it). It's very difficult to fire people here unless there is a major reorganisation directed from the very top.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Jon_Snow on May 24, 2014, 01:12:59 PM
This really is the best thread I've read in a long time.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: DoubleDown on May 24, 2014, 02:09:21 PM
Also I don't agree with all managerial work being unpleasant. I enjoy very much directing my team, and as far as I know I'm popular with my employees. I manage to make them do a lot of work without being mean or intruding into their private lives. :)

Agreed, but I think in many (most?) large organizations the "Peter Principle" is in effect. That is, talented employees and managers keep getting promoted until they eventually reach their level of incompetence. Then you're left with some crappy managers. So watch out, if you are good at leading your small team, you just may gain notice and be tapped by your managers to lead an even larger team, or to be the boss of the small team leaders!

I know where I worked (a very, very large organization), we were constantly encouraged to keep striving for more and more responsibility, to keep taking on bigger challenges and larger roles in the organization. It was the #1 promotion criteria. If you were good at your job, you were expected to use that talent on bigger efforts and to lead others. It makes sense, but it also leads people into some positions they just do not want. And of course it feeds the lifestyle inflation treadmill, because the bigger jobs come with bigger pay. It was very difficult for people who were good at their jobs, and just wanted to remain that way, to stay put. And we had plenty of terrible managers who had been promoted until they were in over their heads.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: 5inatrailer on May 24, 2014, 02:41:37 PM
LOVE this thread. Put your money where your mouth is:)

I started my career as a paramedic in a big metro city.  I remember being 23 at 3 am in some hospital eating my supper 8 hrs into a shift thinking "what choices have I made that got me to this shitty point?"

In my chosen field as a firefighter promotions are all done via seniority.  I have moved twice after 7 years.  I now have total bliss at my new job (3 years in I still say I love my job every single day)  I know I'm rambling but coming off night shift brain here.

When I left my first job at 25 I was having trouble with this over controlling ahole of a boss.  His dad had started the ambulance company before the city took it over.  Somehow, he had managed to become a supervisor.  My last day there I ended up our conversation with "My wife doesn't talk to me like that and I love her.  I don't even like you".

My second job as a FF-Paramedic was great for 2 years then started to unravel.  Unrealistic quotas, intolerable work loads, lack of support for PTSD made it really tough.  My platoon of 24 were very tight because of this- like going into battle every single day. It took me 6 months to decide to quit and when I did I cried for 3 hours at my front door (mostly because the boys took me out to get smashed one last time:) 

I left at a time when the company was hiring 25% more workforce.  I loved walking into the Chief's office and handing him my goodbye letter.  I told him it was easy to have successful beginnings somewhere, it was difficult having successful endings.  I told him that my time was up, and for me, this was a successful ending working for them.  I was the first one to leave there and it left them flustered.  They were trying to hire 40 guys and I was leaving after 7 years? Nobody does this.  Well, 5 years later, 15 year vets are quitting every month due to the terrible workload and emotional support.  I like to think I was the ground breaker!

Now at my new job, people can't fathom why I have 15 years into the pension, and left my seniority so I will never make officer.  I tell them that there are other ways to lead people other than by rank.  Setting a good example, and having authority without domination are traits you don't get promoted into. They are traits you develop personally. 
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Latwell on May 24, 2014, 04:00:58 PM
One of my first jobs, I was a hostess. I was terrible at it b/c it wasn't until my next job that I would learn to not be socially awkward. I also hated all my coworkers and my bosses and waking up at the crack of dawn. I remember working on thanksgiving and crying in the bathroom because everyone else that was suppose to come in had called out and my manager told me I couldn't leave and I had to call my boyfriend at the time to tell him and his family not to wait on me any longer, for them to go ahead and eat. This was one of those times where I realized people only care about themselves.

So after only a couple months and shortly after thanksgiving, I was at my job thinking about how much I didn't want to be there so I randomly walked up to the manager that day told them I didn't want to work anymore. They were confused and thought I just wanted to leave early that day. I clarified that I didn't want to work at all or ever and that I'm leaving now and don't expect me to be coming back.

It was that job that made me realize I had to try my best to apply get a job that I WANT and not just a job that was willing to hire me.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: sobezen on May 24, 2014, 06:17:28 PM
These are some really eye opening stories!  Thank you one and all for taking the time to share in such vivid details some of your most challenging life adventures. 
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Financial Threedom on May 24, 2014, 08:42:02 PM
This is not about me having FU money, but an FU job offer, and the timing was nearly perfect.  I was working for this place, lets call it a financial sweatshop, for a few years.  Each year when it was time to talk annual raise, they always had some excuse for giving me a crappy raise: the economy was bad, head office cut the budget, new employee scorecard etc.  So in this particular year, I finally got my annual raise notification letter, and it was brutal, just over 1%, I was offended to even be offered such a figure.  I was super steamed.  I wanted to walk out on the spot.  I had been looking for another job for over a year at that point, I was so ready to go.  Then just a few days after getting this letter I received a job offer, which would be about a 30% raise if I took it.  It also worked out that my manager was meeting with each of us that very same day I received the offer.  So I met with my manager, and let him know right off the bat I've received a job offer from another company.  We talk about it for a bit and he asks about money.  Is there an offer he could take to his boss to see what could be done?  Really??  NOW you want to talk money?  Suddenly now I might be able to get a real raise?   I told him not to bother, because I was 100% taking this job offer no matter what they could suddenly offer me.  It was amazing. 
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Reepekg on May 24, 2014, 11:36:17 PM
A couple of years ago, I had about 4 years of living expenses saved. I was the only US-based employee of a small European start-up company, and the client I was a resident engineer at was going through a nasty downturn because of very poor decision-making by upper management. The problems were actually something my technology could have fixed. Nevertheless, I wasn't surprised when they decided they couldn't afford the project I was on and had to let me go. To give you an idea of the kind of decisions this client made and how they treated their employees, they let me go by blocking my login credentials one Monday morning without a word.

A few weeks later, I get an invitation to lunch with a manager I had reported to at this company in the past. He was a nice enough guy, but he was moving departments in the reorganization and clearly thought he might be able to capitalize on the fact that I must have been hard up for work. He asked me to join the client company in his new group.

Me - "With the state the company is in, the offer would have to be pretty big to convince me to come on board."
Him - "Well, I'm sure we can work something out. What were you thinking?"
Me - A number that was about a 150% raise

His face was priceless. It was more than the VP of Engineering made. He said something along the lines of "I guess there is nothing to discuss then." He got a new job about 2 months later.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Can't Wait on May 25, 2014, 10:05:37 PM
I have an FU story that did NOT work out too well for me.

I had this job in my early 20's as a sales territory rep which basically required me to drive around to a set of stores within a specific geographical area and provide training and motivation to the stores. Of course my performance was based on the performance of the stores I represented. I had to be on call 24/7 to answer any questions these store might have had. On top of that, I had this dick-hole of a boss that would call me all day almost every hour to see where I had been, who I had talked to, and how I was going to get my stores to perform better. This dick-hole also liked to critique everything about me including what kind of tie I wore on any particular day to the scuff marks on my shoes. He would threaten to "put me on the street" (fire me) almost every day if didn't get my stores to perform better. I don't know what came over me one day, but on one of his calls I just blurted out "fuck off man" and hung up on him. He fired me.

I had no money in my savings, no other job lined up, and I had a car payment and rent to make. It took me over 6 months to find a new job and I ended up using credit cards to get by. I accumulated quite a bit of debt doing this and my new job didn't pay nearly what my old job did so I had trouble keeping up with the credit card payments and my credit took a dive. I was finally able to secure a federal govt job that would have made life great but I ended up getting my offer rescinded because I couldn't get the security clearance needed.. because of my poor credit..

It took some time, but I eventually made it to the federal govt and I recovered but man, I sure did pay for those two seconds of bliss when I told the dick-hole to fuck off.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: 5inatrailer on May 26, 2014, 08:47:55 AM
It's clear that everybody leaves sooner or later.  They won't make a statue of you when you leave so best start working on your exit strategy right away.
Either through retirement or other opportunities.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Gracie on May 27, 2014, 07:14:42 AM
One of the things I'm now fond of saying is that people usually don't leave their jobs.  They leave their managers.

So true. My husband is thinking of taking the FU option soon, though I think he plans to make them fire him. He actually is the manager. He was brought in to fix all the problems caused by the previous manager. Turns out HR also screwed up some pay scales and are fighting him about giving the proper increases to affected employees. They are actually trying to change everyone's job description so they don't have to give the correct pay.

It comes out to less than $5000. It is chump change to the company, but would make a huge difference to the employees. Worse, the employees all know the pay is wrong.

This is just one in a string of similar problems recently. I swear, they found all the managers from "Office Space" and hired them.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Zaga on May 27, 2014, 08:13:32 AM
These stories are just great, love reading them!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Rydenio on May 27, 2014, 08:47:56 AM
For me, "FU money" being just enough savings to get by for about a year, it's been more about having that security in the back of my mind when negotiating pay. He can see in my eyes that I won't take any offer just to stay on the job.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: workathomedad on May 27, 2014, 08:52:05 AM
One of the things I'm now fond of saying is that people usually don't leave their jobs.  They leave their managers.

So true. My husband is thinking of taking the FU option soon, though I think he plans to make them fire him. He actually is the manager. He was brought in to fix all the problems caused by the previous manager. Turns out HR also screwed up some pay scales and are fighting him about giving the proper increases to affected employees. They are actually trying to change everyone's job description so they don't have to give the correct pay.

It comes out to less than $5000. It is chump change to the company, but would make a huge difference to the employees. Worse, the employees all know the pay is wrong.

This is just one in a string of similar problems recently. I swear, they found all the managers from "Office Space" and hired them.

If the employees *know* they're purposefully being screwed by an incompetent/uncaring management, it will cost the company a lot more than $5,000/employee in the long-run. Think pretend-working, theft, low-quality, etc. The company will be destroying themselves from the inside out.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: DoubleDown on May 27, 2014, 10:18:36 AM
It's amazing how easily a crappy manager (or even coworker) suddenly added into the mix can ruin what was otherwise a pretty blissful job for others. As a (former) manager myself, I was amazed how often managers would appear that apparently didn't even bother to show up for Day 1 of "Management 101" since they'd go about violating all kinds of tried and true management theory right off the bat. Hell, some of them obviously never even  showed up for "Human Decency 101."

Like, did no one ever tell them to wait at least 90 days after you show up on the job before you start introducing a bunch of changes into the workplace? Or that publicly embarrassing workers in front of their colleagues as the first go-to method is probably not the best way to get results? Or that understanding the subject matter of what you are managing can be useful and even bring some credibility?
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Vitai Slade on May 27, 2014, 12:02:39 PM
This is a great thread! I have a story of my own to add as well. Not quite as badass as the others, but I felt like a champ when I did it.

Back when I was a teenager, I was working as a pizza delivery driver for Papa Johns. I always worked night shift and weekends so I never really got to hang out with friends. One particular Saturday, I worked out a way to get the opening mid-day shift so I could get that night off. I worked my shift, and when it was about time for me to go home, my manager kept telling me to just go on one more delivery, one more, one more. Finally I got fed up with it. I wanted to go hang out with friends, something I NEVER got to do. I told him, 'Look, either you are going to cash out my bank and I am going to leave, or I'm going to leave.' He cashed me out and the next day when I came in for my next shift he told me I was fired. A few days later, I got a call from HR stating that my manager did not have the authority to make me work longer than my scheduled hours and they hired me back at a different location.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: KS on May 27, 2014, 12:17:38 PM
It's amazing how easily a crappy manager (or even coworker) suddenly added into the mix can ruin what was otherwise a pretty blissful job for others.

+1! Several jobs ago, I was very happy, happy enough that when my husband got a job 300ish miles away we chose to live long distance for almost a year until he found something else up here, so I could keep my job I loved. Couple years later, enter new manager, who didn't understand at least 2 out of 3 of your described management theory mistakes (at least he didn't go in for public humiliation thankfully). Within 6-8 months over 30% of our (fairly small) branch of the company had quit, most of whom had been there a while, were awesome at what they did, and had no plans to leave otherwise. That branch has since been shut down and all activities transferred elsewhere. We still sometimes wonder if it was all part of a master shutdown plan and Bad Manager was brought in to intentionally drive out some of the old-timers and reduce the severance payments... Hard to believe anyone could so effectively fake being that bad at their job though, and he legitimately seemed bewildered every time someone else quit.

This thread has turned out to be awesome, some of you have some genuinely epic tales!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: RyanAtTanagra on May 27, 2014, 12:27:16 PM
About 8-9 years ago I was working a pretty miserable job with a crappy boss.  I was in debt (car loan, 2 maxed CCs, 2 student loans) and living paycheck to paycheck.  I wasn't making a lot of money, but more than I felt I could make somewhere else, so I was trapped.  Then a couple things clicked (meeting my frugal girlfriend was the main catalyst).  Over the course of a year I paid off all debts except one of the student loans and started saving 50% of my net.  I only had a couple months savings, but realizing I could get a job making half what I was currently suddenly put me into FU territory.  I made a list of demands for my boss, none of which were met, which is what I expected (he was the kind of guy that viewed everyone as an easily replaceable cog).  So I told him I was starting to job search, knowing what would happen.  Next day I'm handed a layoff notice (due to 'internal restructuring').  I knew 1) he would never let someone stay that was looking around, and 2) that he would have to lay me off (I'd been a flawless employee for 5 years, it would take too much time to build up a fireable case).  This made me qualify for unemployment, which at the time paid 50% of your previous 12 months wages.  Since that's what I'd been living on for a year, it had zero effect on my budget.  5 highly enjoyable and stress-free months later I landed one of the best jobs I've ever had, making 30% more than I was previously.

Not epic 'take this job and shove it', but if I hadn't had the financial stability and confidence, I might still be there.  FU money doesn't always have to be about your bank balance, either.  If you're living on half your paycheck, that opens a lot of doors that people don't usually have.  Most people can't afford to take a pay cut, which keeps them as trapped as debt or lack of savings does.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: BFGirl on May 27, 2014, 12:59:09 PM
Not an epic story, but one that demonstrates the freedom that comes with not having to worry about your job.  My mother's boss retired and she got a new boss who was horrible.  She would work through lunch (had to because of timings in lab experiments she was running) and then her boss would refuse to let her take comp time.  He basically terrorized her over her time for a while.  In the meantime, from savings that she and my dad had, she was able to buy credit towards retirement from another state she had worked in when she was younger.  Once she bought that time, she was eligible to retire.  She got a great deal of satisfaction from telling her boss she was retiring when he thought he had her over a barrel.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: totoro on May 27, 2014, 01:02:37 PM
I have one.

I was working in a mid-size law firm owned by one lawyer (no partners) as a fairly new grad. 

The firm was a microcosm of life and some new lawyers were favourites and others were not.  It was something the junior lawyers spent a lot of time complaining about.  Particularly because of the lack of job security and the idea that if you were not a favourite you could be out at the end of the next big case.

Some lawyers were marked as superstars and rain makers by the owner, and others as workers.  The rain makers got a lot of facilitated client contact, perks, and approval, and recognition for bringing in business.  It was much easier for them to meet billable hours because they travelled to clients, met with them, travelled back and billed for all the hours.  The workers, well, they got to do the legal work for the rain makers, and lots of it.

I was marked as a worker bee.  I didn't mind the work, but I did not want to be put in an office for life doing what I was doing and there seemed to be no easy way to change it due to favortism. 

I decided I had to come up with a solution. I figured out a plan that I believed would increase revenues significantly and save our clients money at the same time.  I thought if I went to the owner it would be a sure-fire win:win:win.  I would be able to implement the plan and get out of the office more to see what our client needs were on the ground, the client would save money, and the firm revenues would increase.

So, I worked on my proposal and scheduled time with the owner, which was a bit intimidating as he and I did not have a lot of prior contact, and then made my pitch.  I thought I had done well, but he flat-out said no, things were fine as they were.  No real reason given.  I left his office thinking that maybe there was something wrong with my proposal.  A reason it would not work.  I couldn't find it.  And then I started to get mad.

I went home, I slept on it, I went back in the morning and gave my notice.  I was offered a significant raise to stay.  I turned it down.  I was still pretty mad.   

It was a bit nerve-wracking to quit, but during the notice period I set up my own practice.  We had some savings and my business plan seemed to indicate that it would work out better than being an employee. I also had young children I want to spend time with.  It was a gamble, but, well, I just did not feel I could keep working for someone who was not interested in positive change.

The day I left two major clients also chose to come with me, and are still with me today.  I immediately made more money working pt than my former ft salary because I had no staff or other overhead to pay for.

And that plan I presented, turned out there was absolutely nothing wrong with it.  It continues to work for me today.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Wolf_Stache on May 27, 2014, 01:59:12 PM
Totally forgot about this story until something today reminded me of it:

At the time I was working as a Temp through Robert Half. For the last 6 months I'd been working at an unnamed financial services office helping them convert their AP system program. I reported directly to the CFO, and due to what happened during the 6 months I was there, I'm 99% certain the CFO was suffering from early onset dementia.

For example, she would give me assignments, then act confused when I gave her the completed report claiming 'I never asked for this.' Another time she sketched out on her white board how she wanted a particular part of the system to work. Luckily that was still up the board later that week, because when I demonstrated it to her she freaked out and screamed at me about how stupid I was. Until I pointed up to the board, pointed to how it was working, and asked her what I did wrong. She stared at the board for about 10 min, then quietly muttered to herself and dismissed me from her office.

I quickly found out I had to get EVERYTHING in writing from her after that.

Anyway, the CFO called me one Monday morning, before the contract was supposed to end, to tell me they didn't need me any longer. I cheerfully said, ok bye! I had three months savings, plus the way my contract was worded I got unemployement.

I jumped on the net, had two interviews lined up for the next day. By Thursday I had a permanent full time offer with a 25% raise over Robert Half. That Friday, Robert Half called me and said the CFO had begged them to have me come back. When I told them, sorry, already have another position starting at $xx,xxx, the silence on the other end of the phone was deafening.

Robert Half still calls me trying to get me to come back. Got a call from them this morning -  which is what reminded me of this story.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: bagap on May 27, 2014, 04:12:13 PM
Best.Thread.Topic.Ever.

I joined the community after being a lurker for some time just to respond. On FOUR different occasions the hubby and I have had the opportunity to say FU to our employers...I'll keep it sorta brief ;)

Years ago, with two toddlers and both of us working full time, hubby's insurance job was relocating him across the country for 6 months from October to March and there was no negotiating the move...every big event in our family happens during that time, all our bdays, anniversary, and of course the holidays.  Yeah, that was a fun FU moment!  He quit and was a stay at home dad for some time and finished up some classes.  He now makes a ton more money as an engineer than he ever made in insurance.

For me, 3 separate FU stories.  First one, I had worked for a large government organization for over 14 years.  Then they hired some horrendous upper management and made completely insane hiring and reorganization decisions.  I put up with it for a year and then said FU!  They tried to keep me as I had excellent evals and was well respected...sorry, no can do! FU!

Second time for me, I worked a job where the commute was 2.5 hours (stupid, I know).  The manager and the work was okay, but the co-workers were certifiable.  A HUGE amount of backstabbing, gossip, inappropriate jokes...put up with it for a year when I decided FU!

Last one happened two months ago.  After almost three years in a mid-size nonprofit which was incompetently run, reeking of favoritism, had PROFOUNDLY inept bosses, and intense micromanagement (yes, folks were actually written up for being 5 minutes late in the mornings or after a break and were regularly fired with no notice or progressive discipline measures being taken)...I delivered the 3rd FU of my career by quitting!

The reason why my husband and I have been able to pretty much walk away from good paying jobs when they become unbearable??? No credit card debt, a paid off home, living within our means, driving economical cars, and saving at least 1/3 to 1/2 of our earnings consistently.

Freedom to CHOOSE to work, is priceless.  The ability to say FU to a shitty workplace/boss/co-workers is ...well, whatever is more priceless than priceless ;)
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: trailrated on May 27, 2014, 04:39:18 PM
Best.Thread.Topic.Ever.

I am trying to be humble after this... but I agree. I finally started a thread that arebelspy responded to!

That being said, awesome story thank you for sharing!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: William on May 27, 2014, 05:22:30 PM
Thanks guys for sharing these stories!  Here I thought this thread would be boring..
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Gracie on May 27, 2014, 06:15:51 PM
One of the things I'm now fond of saying is that people usually don't leave their jobs.  They leave their managers.

So true. My husband is thinking of taking the FU option soon, though I think he plans to make them fire him. He actually is the manager. He was brought in to fix all the problems caused by the previous manager. Turns out HR also screwed up some pay scales and are fighting him about giving the proper increases to affected employees. They are actually trying to change everyone's job description so they don't have to give the correct pay.

It comes out to less than $5000. It is chump change to the company, but would make a huge difference to the employees. Worse, the employees all know the pay is wrong.

This is just one in a string of similar problems recently. I swear, they found all the managers from "Office Space" and hired them.

If the employees *know* they're purposefully being screwed by an incompetent/uncaring management, it will cost the company a lot more than $5,000/employee in the long-run. Think pretend-working, theft, low-quality, etc. The company will be destroying themselves from the inside out.

And the employees in question are Out-standing employees. My Husband is terribly angry about it. Luckily, he is good at hiding the anger. He is persist. He will insist on the raises until they are received or he is fired.

The amazing thing is you don't need a ton of money to FU. We can live on about 1/4th of what we make now. Or half of my income. :D
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: BlueHouse on May 27, 2014, 06:36:57 PM
Never thought about it as a FU story, more of an "always be prepared" story. 
Years ago, the company I worked for was acquired by another and I was asked to move to another city to train employees there about our products.  I took a big bump in pay and got a one year contract.  I knew it was a knowledge transfer situation and that after one year I'd be shown the door, so I was careful to save up and prepare for it. 
Well, at the one year mark, the company was not doing well and everyone was in danger of losing our jobs, but I was the only one prepared for it.  The company hired a "hatchet man" to travel around the country and lay people off.  It was awful.  He was absolutely not qualified to judge who should go and who should stay, but for some reason, the company wanted to give the illusion that this guy was making decisions - and maybe he was but it was very sad to watch what was happening. 
For some reason, when it was time for my branch to get the axe, there were delays after delays.  I had made plans to visit my new boyfriend on his super-awesome ranch, and I was starting to panic that they may not shit-can me in time for my trip.  I finally called the hatchet-man and told him I knew what was happening and wanted to know if we could discuss it over the phone that day?  He fumbled his words and sounded completely surprised but finally hemmed and hawed and said "I wanted to do this in person...."  I cut him off and said "Just mail the package".   (My severance).  It felt so good to get it over with.  I had enough saved up to last a few months, and to move me back to my previous location.   I ended up with few months severance in a lump sum, which meant I qualified for unemployment immediately, so I was able to enjoy a couple months of down-time before I hit the pavement again.  Best vacation ever. 
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Spartana on May 27, 2014, 07:07:57 PM
No epic FU money story here. Just had enough to quit work when I was 42 to support myself for what I thought would be a 5 year work break to do other stuff (play sports, travel...). I quit assumed I'd go back to work and would retire at a more traditional age. But knowing I had a government pension at 50, a paid off house I could sell and downsize, and no debt, kids or hubby either meant I could make the work break turn into early retirement.  Didn't walk off mad or anything, was just ....done....and wanted to do other things before I was too old.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: frugally on May 27, 2014, 07:19:15 PM
The day I left two major clients also chose to come with me, and are still with me today.  I immediately made more money working pt than my former ft salary because I had no staff or other overhead to pay for.

And that plan I presented, turned out there was absolutely nothing wrong with it.  It continues to work for me today.

The beautiful part of this one, totoro, is that you not only FU'd it, but then took a risk on investing in yourself.  Very cool.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Daisy on May 27, 2014, 07:49:41 PM
No epic FU money story here. Just had enough to quit work when I was 42 to support myself for what I thought would be a 5 year work break to do other stuff (play sports, travel...). I quit assumed I'd go back to work and would retire at a more traditional age. But knowing I had a government pension at 50, a paid off house I could sell and downsize, and no debt, kids or hubby either meant I could make the work break turn into early retirement.  Didn't walk off mad or anything, was just ....done....and wanted to do other things before I was too old.

Interesting...at what point did you decide the sabbatical turned into early retirement? Have you worked part time or anything in the meantime to plug any leaks in your plan? I wonder if I get downsized a year earlier than I expected, if I could parlay it into early or at least semi-retirement. It would be nice to hear your experience with this.

I am once-again dreading that my downsizing may happen this year instead of next as I had planned. I am still waiting to sell a house - or else I wouldn't be as worried. But my philosophy in life is that things happen when they should happen. So if I am downsized now I am sure I will figure out a way to get along. I am pretty sure I am FI for my basic needs, so it would just be a matter of figuring out the "luxuries" (how much health insurance I get, how much for travel).
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Jon_Snow on May 27, 2014, 08:28:31 PM
No epic FU money story here. Just had enough to quit work when I was 42 to support myself for what I thought would be a 5 year work break to do other stuff (play sports, travel...). I quit assumed I'd go back to work and would retire at a more traditional age. But knowing I had a government pension at 50, a paid off house I could sell and downsize, and no debt, kids or hubby either meant I could make the work break turn into early retirement.  Didn't walk off mad or anything, was just ....done....and wanted to do other things before I was too old.

As a fellow 42 year old who is a bit nervous about quitting my job (for good?), this post is much appreciated.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: dweebyhawkeyes on May 27, 2014, 11:02:29 PM
So happy to read these- it's downright inspiring to see how much freedom your 'staches have allowed you! It's also made me realize for the first time the power my little 'stache gives me. Although I'm currently blessed with a super easy-going and productive work environment (albeit low-paying), there's enough saved to last a few months and I'm so down with never feeling forced to work somewhere.

I've turned down.. babysitting jobs? Not much for me to contribute. Yet!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: LouisPritchard on May 28, 2014, 02:23:06 AM
Awesome thread. I'm in the midst of planning a FU moment. After working for the largest oil company in the world, getting transferred 1500 miles from home and dealing with some of the worst management I've ever had to deal with, me and the wife have decided to quit and move back home. Now instead of trying to just find a job (I'm in my 30s and still want to work for a while) I've got the wonderful dilemma of shopping for existing businesses or maybe buying a franchise and doing a start up that way. Having the fu stache is really opening up options that wouldn't otherwise exist. Now to just get over the mental issues/blocks that seem to creep in when planning possible self employment. I also kind of want to leave in a way that causes a hr investigation. My supervisors need it badly and I honestly feel it'd be good for this office and co-workers.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Spartana on May 28, 2014, 04:29:37 PM
No epic FU money story here. Just had enough to quit work when I was 42 to support myself for what I thought would be a 5 year work break to do other stuff (play sports, travel...). I quit assumed I'd go back to work and would retire at a more traditional age. But knowing I had a government pension at 50, a paid off house I could sell and downsize, and no debt, kids or hubby either meant I could make the work break turn into early retirement.  Didn't walk off mad or anything, was just ....done....and wanted to do other things before I was too old.

Interesting...at what point did you decide the sabbatical turned into early retirement? Have you worked part time or anything in the meantime to plug any leaks in your plan? I wonder if I get downsized a year earlier than I expected, if I could parlay it into early or at least semi-retirement. It would be nice to hear your experience with this.

I am once-again dreading that my downsizing may happen this year instead of next as I had planned. I am still waiting to sell a house - or else I wouldn't be as worried. But my philosophy in life is that things happen when they should happen. So if I am downsized now I am sure I will figure out a way to get along. I am pretty sure I am FI for my basic needs, so it would just be a matter of figuring out the "luxuries" (how much health insurance I get, how much for travel).
I think about a year after I left work I realized I could actually retire permanently without having to ever work again - even p/t - if I just sold my paid off house and downsized. I did that and became instantly FI.  I was also frugal, debt free, child free, divorced, and had mostly free or very low cost activities and knew I would have a government pension of $1400/month starting at age 50 and had free or low cost medical thru the VA medical system (although I have always bought a low cost private policy). I also have no heirs so have no problem spending down any principal I have in savings or investments over the coming years to supplement my pension as needed. Currently, with a paid off house and low taxes, insurance and utilities, I can live on about half my pension ($700) per month for basic expenses. The extra goes to travel and fun stuff - or needed things like getting the car fixed.  I've been FIREed over a decade now and love it. And no, I haven't had to go to work to plug any financial holes. Just reduce spending in other areas as needed or do without some things that don't have that much importance to me.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: cdttmm on May 28, 2014, 06:07:32 PM
I'll add my FU story to the list. I worked for a well-known educational services company for 15 years. The first 12 years, I was part of an independently owned franchise of the company. The franchise was a family-owned business and I quickly made myself a key player in the business as I liked my job and the office dynamic. Over time, I made myself valuable company-wide by developing some a niche skill-set. When the parent company bought out all the independently owned franchises, I was prepared to move on. I didn't have an FU-worthy stash, but I had several standing job offers so I wasn't concerned. But the parent company was desperate to keep me, so I negotiated a 100% salary bump, with guaranteed raises every year to follow, and a year's worth of severance pay should they ever decide to give me the boot. As an added bonus, the company paid rent so I could stay in my existing office space, which I just happened to own. I knew I wasn't destined for a long stay in what was now corporate land so I started stashing cash and lots of it. Two and a half years later and I saw the writing on the wall. I knew the company would ultimately have to close the division I worked for so I applied to grad school and prepared to leave. I took a weeklong vacation about 6 months later and my boss called me while I was away. I knew it must be important so I returned his call and he broke the news to me that we were getting shut down. I asked for 7 weeks to wrap up existing business, which he agreed to. The next day I got a call from the Ivy League school I had applied to and was told I had been accepted into the next class. Best timing ever. I finished out my seven weeks of work (in week six, the VP of another division called me and asked me to stay with the company in a job that was a demotion -- I declined, in what was not the most polite fashion!), then spent eight weeks relaxing, and went off to grad school for the next year, during which time I collected the year's worth of severance the company owed me. That was in 2010. I've not managed to go back to having a "real" job since. I plan to keep it that way for some time to come.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Daisy on May 28, 2014, 08:22:45 PM
I think about a year after I left work I realized I could actually retire permanently without having to ever work again - even p/t - if I just sold my paid off house and downsized. I did that and became instantly FI.  I was also frugal, debt free, child free, divorced, and had mostly free or very low cost activities and knew I would have a government pension of $1400/month starting at age 50 and had free or low cost medical thru the VA medical system (although I have always bought a low cost private policy). I also have no heirs so have no problem spending down any principal I have in savings or investments over the coming years to supplement my pension as needed. Currently, with a paid off house and low taxes, insurance and utilities, I can live on about half my pension ($700) per month for basic expenses. The extra goes to travel and fun stuff - or needed things like getting the car fixed.  I've been FIREed over a decade now and love it. And no, I haven't had to go to work to plug any financial holes. Just reduce spending in other areas as needed or do without some things that don't have that much importance to me.

Thanks, that was very helpful. I like how you played with your options and finances (selling a home) to get you where you needed to be. And I love your beach volleyball and travel stories. Those are two of some of the things I want to spend more time on. I am also child-free and debt-free and don't plan on leaving much around when I get to the inevitable.

I just "downsized" late last year to a "smaller" place that helped me get mortgage free. I'm still waiting for the old house to sell (hence the nerves). But the new place is still quite luxurious and bigger than I need. I love the area. But I do have that as my ace in the hole if I need it (can sell and downsize even more in the future).

I'm just getting used to my new expense structure with this move. I think I have shaved off $20k in yearly expenses with this move - no mortgage, no yard maintenance, no alarm, no home phone, much less insurance costs, finally cut the cable, etc. It is quite freeing to see the change! And I only moved a mile away!

I am actually understating my stash. I have more than enough to cover my basic expenses at a 4% SWR. But I'd still like to beef up the travel amount and make sure I still have enough to cover my charitable donations. I'm also a little skittish with the current market highs. I'm sure it's doable if I am forced into the situation. We shall see...
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: tanhanivar on May 28, 2014, 08:37:54 PM
Thanks to the guys who posted about crying at work. I'm sorry it happened, but it's also good to know it isn't a 'girly' thing to do or a problem with the employee. It's a human thing, and frequently means there's a problem with the job. Too easy to get shamed out of forgetting that.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Insanity on May 28, 2014, 09:48:32 PM
I guess I should say that I had a reverse FU story which is currently going on as well.

On July 1, it will be 1 year since I was laid off from my full time job.  I have since gone on my own consulting and while the medical costs is severely hindering the take home pay, I am finding myself enjoying my job even more and doing the work that I was hoping to do with the consulting company but never was given the opportunity.  I was always pushed to be on the more technical side (which I can do) rather than the process side which is my stronger suit.

In the ironic portion of this FU, there are two factors.  One, I don't hold the layoff against the company.  I had a lot (still do) of personal things going on that probably distracted me more than I would like to admit it and more than I led on.  Had I asked for help dealing with them, I probably would have gotten it.  They are a good group of people and generally did care.  The second, the one contract I love right now - I beat out two of their consultants for the contract :)



Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: quilter on May 28, 2014, 10:39:12 PM
We reached if at age 52 and decided to pad the stache and wait till 55 because then hubby would get health insurance and we would be able to travel and be very comfortable.
Well, the house next door to us sells and I go over to meet the neighbors. The guy was bought in to "clean house" at the company I worked at.
So business as usual at work for me but after about six months we are told we have all been evaluated and there would be a "right sizing". The next day, HR shows up and people begin getting called into the office and escorted out. There seemed I be an awful lot of 50+ in the mix who stood to lose the most.  In our area jobs were tough to come by and being an unemployed older person was not very promising.  Some people had worked there for 30+ years with good evaluations until my clean house  neighbor comes along.
So we carry on and one day I was in a meeting with my boss/neighbor and he suggests something that I think is unethical. I mention my concerns but I am dismissed with a hand wave.
I make an appointment with the boss and tell him in my heart I feel like there are a lot of wrong things going on and I cannot be a party to it. I resign.

Well, here is the best part, about three months later a for sale sign goes up in their front yard. After he downsized the office they let him go too. It was devastating to them. He had a stay at home wife, two high schoolers and a junior high kid, all who had to switch schools to his new location.

He did apologize to me and conceded some of the things that went on were really morally wrong.

I have never been so glad that I skipped all those going out to eat lunch opportunities, did not buy clothes  and drove an old standard fuel efficient car. Because although I did not say it, FU was in my head if not on my tongue.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Tempe on May 29, 2014, 12:38:20 AM
While I was working my first full time job doing housekeeping while saving for college, I didn't realize how much I hated my job until the end. It was very gossipy talk behind your back place (Some of the older workers were as bad as some of the teenagers working there.) Some of my coworkers were wonderful, some made me cry at different times. The expectations of management to clean rooms in a certain amount of time and the pressure on cleaning fast but not missing things was stressful (Oh god the memories of smashed cereal in every surface from little kids). I hated having the fast team help me more because then I spent time cleaning what they missed outside of my routine.  The pressure to go clean a room instantly because they routinely ignored the 5 pm check in time for guests that showed up earlier. Working for 8-11 hours but never reaching overtime, and crashing asleep once I got home, eating dinner, and then going back to sleep and repeating the next day with my knees hurting.
The owner of the place was one of the worst things at times. He was an elderly man and when he was around he would catch you alone and lecture you about something, sometimes random things, or about something you did wrong, and waste your time. Thank god I lied my ass off around Easter time about going to go to church like things with family so I wouldn't get lectured on values (I could sense it coming when he asked my easter plans and it was a busy saturday, so after one or two minutes he left me alone) One time a van-full of us were hoping to get away from him and ran to catch the ride but we got a full on lecture and he held us up for 30 minutes. (Our entire department used a verb created with his name for when we got caught, it was a valid excuse for lateness with our manager) Some of his complaints were us talking to each in the hallways, that we should only talk in the rooms we were cleaning even though policy and safety was to leave the doors open. I felt bad for him because I think he was getting some form of dementia. No one said anything back to him any time because we were afraid of being fired.

Two months before I was going away to college my mom asked me to quit so I could go home and spend time with my family. At the time there was a heat wave and I was going from AC-ed rooms to heated hallways to the pool areas humidity and was on and off sick for an entire month. When she asked me to quit and I thought about giving notice, the sense of relief I felt was overwhelming and so uplifting. I gave my two weeks the next day and I was so happy. My boss was sad to see me go, and I think tried to convince me not to leave verbally, but I was done. I had a nice chunk of money saved from it all, payed off most of the debt to my mom, and then got to vacation a bit before going to college. Not quite fu money, but having some extra helped the choice to leave. I do have good memories of some of the coworkers, but the bad outweighed the good.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: CU Tiger on May 29, 2014, 06:18:26 PM
I was working for some acupuncturists in a small practice as a part time office helper. I liked the two owners, but the Office Mgr was a terrorist. She never criticized me min staff meetings, but after the meeting would call me at home to criticize something I said, or what I wore...

I asked why we did not discuss these things AT the meetings, rather than on the phone, but she continued this pattern. At review time I did a self review and met with Office Mgr first. She rated me poorly on everything from my looks to my performance. The owners said I had done a fairly good job, but needed to make some changes to suit the Office Manager.

I had FU money, and also knew that I could walk into a temp agency and have immediate work with my skills, so I said I thought I would prefer to quit. I offered two weeks notice. The owner, sounding uncomfortable, said that I did not need to work out my two weeks. I said okay, and wished them well. 30 minutes later they called me and asked if I would work out the notice. I said that I did not believe I would. I offered, they said no, and I was happy to leave it like that.

I have often wondered if the hostile OM ever found someone she liked?
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Kriegsspiel on May 29, 2014, 06:32:51 PM
Has anyone done anything truly epic, like punched someone out, or lit a building on fire? Released live goats into a cubicle village? Pooped on the boss's desk?
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Insanity on May 29, 2014, 06:42:39 PM
Has anyone done anything truly epic, like punched someone out, or lit a building on fire? Released live goats into a cubicle village? Pooped on the boss's desk?

Okay, so I have to tell the story......

I ran into a former co-worker a few years after we both left the company.  I left gracefully, not even FU worthy (cause I wasn't).  It just had played out and I needed a change.

He on the other hand, relayed the story of his exit to me.

I won't go into extreme details for fear someone might recognize it, but it ended with a profanity laced tired and the co-worker telling his manager to basically suck his.....   He then walked out.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: arebelspy on May 29, 2014, 06:46:53 PM
Has anyone done anything truly epic, like punched someone out, or lit a building on fire? Released live goats into a cubicle village? Pooped on the boss's desk?

This guy:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/JetBlue_flight_attendant_incident

Quote
Steven Slater, a flight attendant, announced over the plane's public address system that he had been abused by a passenger and that he quit his job. He then grabbed two beers and exited the plane by deploying the evacuation slide and sliding down it.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Cheddar Stacker on May 29, 2014, 07:44:39 PM
Has anyone done anything truly epic, like punched someone out, or lit a building on fire? Released live goats into a cubicle village? Pooped on the boss's desk?

Not personally but I witnessed a nice one from a co-worker. College job, grocery warehouse, each store delivery had 1 sheet printed. This guy stapled his delivery order to the inside of the trailer, all the way up at the front. He then spent the next 2-3 hours filling the trailer with totally random crap that didn't belong. Then he just left. It took management hours to figure out what happened, then a few of us an hour to fix it. They had to call overtime for the entire union crew to get the orders filled that night because of this guys actions.

Its an epic way to say FU, but this guy clearly did not have proper FU funds in place. He simply had a lot of pent up frustration and took it out on the bosses. 
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: AlexK on May 29, 2014, 08:46:28 PM
Not epic but I want to share. My first engineering job was at an unethical company. As in fined $1M by the government for doing business with Iran unethical. We were expected to change test data for customers if the product tested out of spec. The stress was so bad I would wake up in the middle of the night with feelings of dread. I had to have brain surgery for hydrocephalus and I'm convinced it was the stress that caused it. I didn't have FU money at the time but I found another job and gave notice. The president of the company had me in his office and asked what it would take for me to stay. I told him there would have to be a 1 added to my current salary (I was making about $50k at the time). He laughed and I left.

The new job was 20% pay increase and amazing, I'm still working there 10 years later!

I do know of an EPIC quitting story but I got screwed in the process. I bought a motorcycle from a guy who said the title was in his truck and he would get it for me that night. I stupidly believed him and he never gave me the title. He wouldn't answer his phone when I called. He worked at Walmart and one time I spoofed the caller ID so it looked like Walmart was calling. He answered but gave more excuses. A few months later he went into Walmart and shot his boss in the chest with a 44 Mag (he lived) and holed up in the bathroom until cops came. I had to part that bike out on ebay.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: SisterX on May 30, 2014, 10:37:43 AM
Not epic but I want to share. My first engineering job was at an unethical company. As in fined $1M by the government for doing business with Iran unethical. We were expected to change test data for customers if the product tested out of spec. The stress was so bad I would wake up in the middle of the night with feelings of dread. I had to have brain surgery for hydrocephalus and I'm convinced it was the stress that caused it. I didn't have FU money at the time but I found another job and gave notice. The president of the company had me in his office and asked what it would take for me to stay. I told him there would have to be a 1 added to my current salary (I was making about $50k at the time). He laughed and I left.

The new job was 20% pay increase and amazing, I'm still working there 10 years later!

I do know of an EPIC quitting story but I got screwed in the process. I bought a motorcycle from a guy who said the title was in his truck and he would get it for me that night. I stupidly believed him and he never gave me the title. He wouldn't answer his phone when I called. He worked at Walmart and one time I spoofed the caller ID so it looked like Walmart was calling. He answered but gave more excuses. A few months later he went into Walmart and shot his boss in the chest with a 44 Mag (he lived) and holed up in the bathroom until cops came. I had to part that bike out on ebay.

I'm not sure I'd consider shooting one's boss "epic" in the sense intended by the original question.  More like tragic, no matter what the provocation was.
Pooping on the boss's desk = hilarious.  Shooting the boss = horrific.

However, your story is pretty fantastic.  Glad you got a much better job out of it all!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: CU Tiger on May 30, 2014, 11:05:37 AM
I was raised to be Southern nice and my parents taught me to never burn my bridges behind me. So even if I would like to poop on my bosses desk (and I had one I would have LOVED to do that to) I have always tried to leave with no hard feelings.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Grog on May 30, 2014, 12:30:57 PM
It's interesting reading this stories. Does this happen because there is no social welfare? do not people receive some kind of support the first months they are jobless?
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: frugalnacho on May 30, 2014, 12:42:25 PM
One of my first jobs (still in high school) was bagging groceries.  I put in a notice that I was going on vacation for a week, and it happened to coincide with a summer holiday.  They declined it.  They said if I went on that vacation to not bother coming back.  I did go back - to pick up my last check.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: CommonCents on May 30, 2014, 12:44:32 PM
It's interesting reading this stories. Does this happen because there is no social welfare? do not people receive some kind of support the first months they are jobless?

In the US, if you voluntarily quit a job, it's hard to get unemployment benefits and depends on demonstrating you meet certain requirements.  It's designed to encourage people not to willy nilly quit and sit around on their a$$ while the government (taxpayers) support them. 
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: shotgunwilly on May 30, 2014, 01:46:33 PM
It's interesting reading this stories. Does this happen because there is no social welfare? do not people receive some kind of support the first months they are jobless?

In the US, if you voluntarily quit a job, it's hard to get unemployment benefits and depends on demonstrating you meet certain requirements.  It's designed to encourage people not to willy nilly quit and sit around on their a$$ while the government (taxpayers) support them.

Still happens all the time.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Kriegsspiel on May 30, 2014, 04:12:37 PM
Not epic but I want to share. My first engineering job was at an unethical company. As in fined $1M by the government for doing business with Iran unethical. We were expected to change test data for customers if the product tested out of spec. The stress was so bad I would wake up in the middle of the night with feelings of dread. I had to have brain surgery for hydrocephalus and I'm convinced it was the stress that caused it. I didn't have FU money at the time but I found another job and gave notice. The president of the company had me in his office and asked what it would take for me to stay. I told him there would have to be a 1 added to my current salary (I was making about $50k at the time). He laughed and I left.

The new job was 20% pay increase and amazing, I'm still working there 10 years later!

I do know of an EPIC quitting story but I got screwed in the process. I bought a motorcycle from a guy who said the title was in his truck and he would get it for me that night. I stupidly believed him and he never gave me the title. He wouldn't answer his phone when I called. He worked at Walmart and one time I spoofed the caller ID so it looked like Walmart was calling. He answered but gave more excuses. A few months later he went into Walmart and shot his boss in the chest with a 44 Mag (he lived) and holed up in the bathroom until cops came. I had to part that bike out on ebay.

I'm not sure I'd consider shooting one's boss "epic" in the sense intended by the original question.  More like tragic, no matter what the provocation was.
Pooping on the boss's desk = hilarious.  Shooting the boss = horrific.

However, your story is pretty fantastic.  Glad you got a much better job out of it all!

The greeter's got a gun.
the greeter's got a gun.
Shopping carts are not as fun.
Will he go on the run?
Or does he have to go number two.
He's hiding out in the loo.

They say that when he got a'busted
he had TP stuffed down his crotch.
But, man, you shoulda been there, before the cops arrived.
People all stood around and watched.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Paul der Krake on May 30, 2014, 05:13:20 PM
Goddammit Kriegsspiel, now I have to remove that song from my roadtrip playlist.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Grog on May 30, 2014, 10:57:14 PM


In the US, if you voluntarily quit a job, it's hard to get unemployment benefits and depends on demonstrating you meet certain requirements.  It's designed to encourage people not to willy nilly quit and sit around on their a$$ while the government (taxpayers) support them.

you know this is not how it works in other countries, right? it just seems to me that the fact that FU money is not spreadily available (under the form for instance of unemployment helps) give a chance to all the manager asshole to survive: if everybody working under a piece of shit could just leave and be supported a couple of months before finding a new job, then there would not be almost no asshole manager, since they would be detrimental to your company.
Although my personal point of view is that it should be responsibility of every worker to be in a position of strength, and not rely on the social system.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: libertarian4321 on May 31, 2014, 01:19:15 AM
After reading the blog for quite some time I keep seeing people talking about their FU staches (being different than their FIRE amount) as having the security to "stick it to the man" and walk off the job without stress if they want to.

This being said, I have never seen a story about using that FU money. Please, share your stories!!

FU money is useful in less dramatic ways, too.

Even if you don't do a dramatic "take this job and shove it" thing, FU money can make your life better.

For many years, I worked for a major consulting firm.  It was "expected" that everyone work at least 50 hours per week and be willing to give up their weekends any time those in power thought it "necessary."

Because I had "FU" money, I was able to make it clear to my boss that I would NOT be working ridiculous hours.  I would do my 40-hours, and that was it.  The first time he "requested" (which really, of course, was an order) I work on a Saturday, I told him I don't work weekends.  If he had a problem with that, he was free to lay me off.  He never did, though I'm sure it affected my pay raises and "yearly efficiency report."  Just having "FU" money made my work life easier.

After 5-years there, I'd had enough and wanted to early retire, so I effectively went in and asked to be laid off (I told him I was going to charge the day to the time code for "I don't have any work to do," which at that firm was the equivalent of saying "lay me off RIGHT NOW." :)

Not quite as dramatic as "Take this job and stick it," but just as satisfying.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: totoro on May 31, 2014, 09:07:08 AM


In the US, if you voluntarily quit a job, it's hard to get unemployment benefits and depends on demonstrating you meet certain requirements.  It's designed to encourage people not to willy nilly quit and sit around on their a$$ while the government (taxpayers) support them.

you know this is not how it works in other countries, right? it just seems to me that the fact that FU money is not spreadily available (under the form for instance of unemployment helps) give a chance to all the manager asshole to survive: if everybody working under a piece of shit could just leave and be supported a couple of months before finding a new job, then there would not be almost no asshole manager, since they would be detrimental to your company.
Although my personal point of view is that it should be responsibility of every worker to be in a position of strength, and not rely on the social system.

What kind of mumbo jumbo is that?

In what country do you get un/employment insurance benefits if you quit?  Neither the US nor Canada offers this as far as I'm aware and there are sound policy reasons for not doing so.  The exception is if you can demonstrate you were constructively dismissed.

Now, as far as "asshole managers", in my experience sometimes asshole managers are really fine managers with an asshole employee. It is hard to know without hearing the other side.

In the case where a manager is really unreasonably difficult/harassing they will contravene employment standards and/or human rights protections and you can quit and claim constructive dismissal.  There are often complaints processes that can be accessed in these circumstances as well.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: 5inatrailer on May 31, 2014, 09:13:47 AM
While learning my craft as a paramedic in a busy metro setting, there was this one guy who was very very good at his job. He had been there 20 years and had trained some very excellent practitioners also. If you were sick, you wanted him to come to your aid. That being said, he was very unsettled- like he was angry at himself for not doing something better with his life... anyway,
8 years after I quit (as everyone does there- 1 person has retired out of 1000) I heard a story of how he quit:

It was the typical night shift, call after call kept coming in, and finally at around 11pm, the dispatch gave his ambulance another call.  He said no on the radio, leaned over and shut the truck off (someone else was driving), took the keys and threw them across the road.  He then grabbed his personal belongings and literally walked off into a field.

I love telling that story.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Grog on May 31, 2014, 11:06:30 AM


What kind of mumbo jumbo is that?

In what country do you get un/employment insurance benefits if you quit?  Neither the US nor Canada offers this as far as I'm aware and there are sound policy reasons for not doing so.  The exception is if you can demonstrate you were constructively dismissed.

Now, as far as "asshole managers", in my experience sometimes asshole managers are really fine managers with an asshole employee. It is hard to know without hearing the other side.

In the case where a manager is really unreasonably difficult/harassing they will contravene employment standards and/or human rights protections and you can quit and claim constructive dismissal.  There are often complaints processes that can be accessed in these circumstances as well.

Just meaning to say that since is difficult to quit, employer could use that to enforce a certain stress/abuse because they know that the people CAN'T quit, since they must work to survive paycheck to paycheck.
btw, in most countries in europe you get a unemployment subsidy (if you have worked long enough to have right for) the moment you apply for it: it doesn't matter why you are jobless (even if you quit), just that you are jobless. But many people seek a new job immediately, since the longest you stay on subsidy, the harder it is to find a job since employer will find strange that you are getting the subsidy for so long, and prefer someone else.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: totoro on May 31, 2014, 12:07:45 PM
Which European countries offer an unemployment subsidy to those who have voluntarily resigned/quit?  I see that in Germany you may be able to qualify for some benefits after a three-month waiting period in which you get nothing but have been actively looking for work, which makes some sense. 

As far as not being able to quit because you "must work to survive" paycheck to paycheck, that seems pretty dramatic and something that should be up to the individual to resolve in most cases.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: dweebyhawkeyes on May 31, 2014, 12:30:59 PM
Has anyone done anything truly epic, like punched someone out, or lit a building on fire? Released live goats into a cubicle village? Pooped on the boss's desk?

Not money-related at all- but my friends and I took a live goat to our high school campus after graduation. The sophomores and juniors loved it and administration freaked out. Desire result achieved.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: train_writer on May 31, 2014, 01:05:22 PM
btw, in most countries in europe you get a unemployment subsidy (if you have worked long enough to have right for) the moment you apply for it: it doesn't matter why you are jobless (even if you quit), just that you are jobless.


Which country in Europe is that I am curious?
It is the same here (NL+Belgium) as in the US (only a limited months subsidy in case of unvoluntary layoff). But you can, however, simply ask your employer to lay you off and if they agree, you can collect your build up months of subsidy (depending how long you have been in the work force 3 months up to 2 years).

Still, you are right that the wrong 'manager attitude' is being sustained by this system. Just wait for the years where employees are more in demand than employers.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: train_writer on May 31, 2014, 01:12:17 PM
Epic FU of my Co-worker. A silver haired lady of 60 with a very high work ethic and lots of experience and knowledge in the field decided she did not like the new management and new rules, that prevent personal contact or a personal touch. She was really a bit bullied by management at a certain point.

One 'idle Tuesday', she painted a certain something on the wall of our newly furnished building, she really took her time, like one hour?
Which we co-workers silently supported.
When she was finished she said goodbye to us all, gave us an address of where she would serve us a pint that afternoon and waited for the management meeting to walk passed her "mural".
She smiled, waved and just left.

Badass!!
* Not very detailed because it was kind of an unique painting :)
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Zamboni on May 31, 2014, 02:28:26 PM
These are some great stories.

Long ago at another job I once had a colleague who was quite obviously unhappy.  He had two bosses who were both incompetent and douche bags, and watching their absurdity from a safe distance made me grateful I wasn't in his group.  Instead of making a big scene or even telling anyone he quit, on the last day he was in the office he simply used his corporate card to buy himself and his girlfriend a nice expensive vacation.  The next day they left for their newly purchased vacation on the other side of the world, and then he just never came back.  He travelled a fair amount for work, so even though it was an international flight, the trip was not immediately flagged as unusual.  It took the company some time to figure out that he was not on a business trip and that he did not intend to ever return.  They might have even paid him for the last couple of weeks of that month before they realized he was gone.  Boy, was his boss pissed!  Still makes me laugh even though it was fraud.  He was not a citizen and I don't even know if they ever even found him to get the money back.

FU money:  pretty sure he had it.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: blackomen on May 31, 2014, 11:19:48 PM
I never had to use my FU money yet but I guess I learned the value of it pretty early in my career.

I graduated with a MS in Finance in 2009 with zero job experience.  Yes, it can't be bleaker than that so when I was finally able to land a job in 10 months, I was elated..  and didn't mind that it was a salaried position that paid literally the equivalent of $10/hr !!!  This was my first real job: an assistant analyst for a financial firm that ran several small hedge funds.

I put in 12 hour days and the boss would call me to come in on the weekend like every 3-4 weeks.  I didn't mind back then because I felt lucky to have a job.  Days and days went by and the boss got nastier.  Eventually, it wore on me.

I'm not sure if anyone else who doesn't work in the hedge fund industry (or anything that front-office buy-side in finance) can relate but here are some examples:

- Being yelled at and ridiculed for the smallest mistakes, sometimes for hours on end and receiving the same treatment for multiple days in a row.

- When the weekend came, it was my only refuge from the constant yelling from the boss..  then he calls you in to come in and work on something only to be yelled at even more.  Except there's no pay (since you're salaried.)

- I come in every single day at 6 - 6:30 in the morning since that's when the US markets open on the West Coast and work without even a lunch break until 1:00pm.  Manager deprives me of the much needed lunch break and calls me in for meeting and to be pelted mercilessly with foul language.

The above went on for about a year to a year and a half before I started to break down from the stress.  I started making more and more mistakes, which in finance, was not a good thing.  I think I ended up costing the company more than $100,000 in a single Trading error one time when I accidentally bought instead of selling something like $3 million dollars of a stock.  (That's more than TWICE my annual salary in a single mistake!)  I was pushed to my limits with the persistent daily verbal abuses and these sorts of errors multiplied over the next few months.

At that time, I was casually chatting with one of the secretaries after work and she tactfully told me that I was pretty much the best the company has ever found and proceeded to talk about how the firm hired and fired failure after failure for this position.

I figured I had less to lose than I thought but just to be safe, I checked my bank accounts..  I had saved about $15,000 extra since I started the job and that money could probably last me a year if I got fired.  So I started cutting back my hours..  this job was intended to be a 8 or 9 hour a day deal as opposed to the 12+ I was working so I tested leaving earlier and earlier each day, hopefully to regain my sanity.  I was surprisingly met with little resistance.  Eventually, I was given raises and promotions even though I had effectively cut my daily hours from 12 to like 7-8 today.  To this day, I'm still looking for greener pastures for my career but this experience has taught a valuable lesson about standing your ground.  FU money is ONE tool in your arsenal to accomplish this.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: C40 on June 01, 2014, 12:04:26 PM
Epic FU of my Co-worker. A silver haired lady of 60 with a very high work ethic and lots of experience and knowledge in the field decided she did not like the new management and new rules, that prevent personal contact or a personal touch. She was really a bit bullied by management at a certain point.

One 'idle Tuesday', she painted a certain something on the wall of our newly furnished building, she really took her time, like one hour?
Which we co-workers silently supported.
When she was finished she said goodbye to us all, gave us an address of where she would serve us a pint that afternoon and waited for the management meeting to walk passed her "mural".
She smiled, waved and just left.

Badass!!
* Not very detailed because it was kind of an unique painting :)

What did she paint on the wall? "FU"?
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: train_writer on June 01, 2014, 01:23:20 PM
What did she paint on the wall? "FU"?


Nope, a cartoonesk sea mammal referring to someone in our management with some foul accesoires.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Southern Stashian on June 01, 2014, 02:49:53 PM
Over a decade ago I worked for a national home builder named Len ..... (you fill in the rest). I had been on track to win "builder of the year" and a nice sized bonus on top of my $100k + earnings / bonuses for the year. The bonus would end up becoming my FU money just a few days later .....

Well, living in the south we have to deal with these things called hurricanes, or as my 5'-3" ball sack of a manager would say "hurry-up-canes", basically meaning ditch your own home for the preperation of ours. I would spend days locking down the community with just hours to spare for our own home. Not a good situation.

Anyway, the storm came and went and the next morning I came in to access the damage on my own time. I was amazed to find that 17 of my homes were virtually damage free except for one that a sub had left a window partially opened on, resulting in a flooded kitchen.

As I was cleaning up the damage and removing drywall, my six month pregnant wife and two year old son dropped in on me to see how everything was going and to bring me some lunch. A few minutes later my troll of a manager dropped in too, and after seeing the damage he ripped me a new one with a least a hundred F-bombs directed at me in front of my family.

Nuff said. You just dont do that to a man, especially in front of his family. He was lucky he made it out of the house that afternoon.

Anyway, I now laugh because the very next day he found my keys, company cell and a zerox copy of my middle finger on my desk instructing him on what body part to place it all in. I also sent corporate a polite email (wasn't their fault he had little man syndrome) saying that my manager would have some explaining to do to them.

From what I heard it was quite comical at the awards ceremony the following week when they called out the award for the Top Builder and no one was there to claim it. Talk about a big FU! to him in front of the company and all of his corporate execs when he had to explain on the spot why their top guy just walked away, hehhe.

They spent the next two weeks apologizing and trying to get me to return, offering more $$$ and different leadership but it was too late as I had made up my mind. (and yes, I still received the bonus check in the mail with my final paycheck - a double FU! lol). They eventually collasped into BK so the timing worked out perfectly.

So, in the end I quit my job AND received my FU money (@ $15K)  from the company while also purging myself (and my family) of the angry little man. Score.

I still see him a few times a year and show him my personal, "original copy" of the zeroxed paper that I left for him when I quit years ago.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Vitai Slade on June 02, 2014, 07:09:37 AM
Over a decade ago I worked for a national home builder named Len ..... (you fill in the rest). I had been on track to win "builder of the year" and a nice sized bonus on top of my $100k + earnings / bonuses for the year. The bonus would end up becoming my FU money just a few days later .....

This is the BEST FU story on this thread so far! NICE!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: shotgunwilly on June 02, 2014, 08:27:10 AM
Anyway, I now laugh because the very next day he found my keys, company cell and a zerox copy of my middle finger on my desk instructing him on what body part to place it all in. I also sent corporate a polite email (wasn't their fault he had little man syndrome) saying that my manager would have some explaining to do to them.


This guy wins. Awesome.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: brewer12345 on June 02, 2014, 11:58:15 AM
If I were a manager I would never do the insulting/harassing things I have read on the third page of the thread.  Not only is it a waste of time and energy, but I think there is significant risk to those jerks that someone will snap and go after them physically.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: dragoncar on June 02, 2014, 12:53:37 PM
my 5'-3" ball sack of a manager

... my troll of a manager ...

(wasn't their fault he had little man syndrome)

LOL, short people are such trolls amirite?  Every time I see a shorty, I just like to give them a little kick to remind them how terrible they are.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: galaxie on June 02, 2014, 02:22:10 PM
Not quite FU money, but spending less than I earn has enabled me to take a pay cut in order to go do my dream job.  Nothing wrong with my old job, just the opportunity of a lifetime.  We should still both be able to retire in about 14 years (when I'm 46).
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Gray Matter on June 02, 2014, 02:43:02 PM
my 5'-3" ball sack of a manager

... my troll of a manager ...

(wasn't their fault he had little man syndrome)

LOL, short people are such trolls amirite?  Every time I see a shorty, I just like to give them a little kick to remind them how terrible they are.

Thank you for sticking up for us, Dragoncar!  As a short person who has spawned two short boys, that struck me as well.  Why can't short men be plain ole garden variety assholes like average/tall men?  Why do they have to have "little man syndrome"?
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: trailrated on June 02, 2014, 03:03:28 PM
my 5'-3" ball sack of a manager

... my troll of a manager ...

(wasn't their fault he had little man syndrome)

LOL, short people are such trolls amirite?  Every time I see a shorty, I just like to give them a little kick to remind them how terrible they are.

Thank you for sticking up for us, Dragoncar!  As a short person who has spawned two short boys, that struck me as well.  Why can't short men be plain ole garden variety assholes like average/tall men?  Why do they have to have "little man syndrome"?

"Just cause you have one doesn't mean you have to be one!" But then again I guess you can't use that to call a girl a dick...
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Dr.Vibrissae on June 02, 2014, 03:16:15 PM
my 5'-3" ball sack of a manager

... my troll of a manager ...

(wasn't their fault he had little man syndrome)

LOL, short people are such trolls amirite?  Every time I see a shorty, I just like to give them a little kick to remind them how terrible they are.

Thank you for sticking up for us, Dragoncar!  As a short person who has spawned two short boys, that struck me as well.  Why can't short men be plain ole garden variety assholes like average/tall men?  Why do they have to have "little man syndrome"?

"Just cause you have one doesn't mean you have to be one!" But then again I guess you can't use that to call a girl a dick...
I thought it was calling someone and asshole...
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: warfreak2 on June 02, 2014, 03:23:15 PM
Thank you for sticking up for us, Dragoncar!  As a short person who has spawned two short boys, that struck me as well.  Why can't short men be plain ole garden variety assholes like average/tall men?  Why do they have to have "little man syndrome"?
Q: Why did Southern Stashian's manager get rich when Lehman Brothers collapsed?

A: Because he was short.


...Sorry, couldn't resist. OK OK I'll show myself out.

(Actually, I agree with you. When you make fun of some characteristic that somebody has, even if the particular person you're targeting is an asshole, remember that you're making fun of everyone with that characteristic, not just the asshole. (No offense intended to anyone who has an asshole.))
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: fantabulous on June 02, 2014, 03:44:50 PM
"Just cause you have one doesn't mean you have to be one!" But then again I guess you can't use that to call a girl a dick...

Depends on the woman.

I still see him a few times a year and show him my personal, "original copy" of the zeroxed paper that I left for him when I quit years ago.

Perhaps a bit unhealthy (on my part), but I really enjoy this part of the story.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: trailrated on June 02, 2014, 03:46:02 PM
my 5'-3" ball sack of a manager

... my troll of a manager ...

(wasn't their fault he had little man syndrome)

LOL, short people are such trolls amirite?  Every time I see a shorty, I just like to give them a little kick to remind them how terrible they are.

Thank you for sticking up for us, Dragoncar!  As a short person who has spawned two short boys, that struck me as well.  Why can't short men be plain ole garden variety assholes like average/tall men?  Why do they have to have "little man syndrome"?

"Just cause you have one doesn't mean you have to be one!" But then again I guess you can't use that to call a girl a dick...
I thought it was calling someone and asshole...

You just changed my whole world view. Everything I have ever known is a lie
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Ftao93 on June 02, 2014, 04:20:49 PM
Once I worked at a big corporate flour mill.    It was routine that if you hadn't been there a decade, the senior Union folks ignored your existence. 

The schedule was at times, very punishing, but I had no formal education, and no understanding of anything.  If I had half a brain back then I would have invested, but I was turned off by my friend's daytrading when he lost 50k in a year!

Anyway, we were 12 on, 12 off, every day, for 76 days in a row.  I lived an hour away.  It was like Groundhog Day!

then I realized that my expenses were only about $700 a month, and half of that was gas to get to a job I hated.    I was only 20 and there were women to pursue!  I had about 4k in uncashed checks.  The boss had already been angered by the fact that I had called in a couple of times just to get some darned rest.

I got pulled over for speeding ( was running late).  The boss berated me on how unacceptable it was, how unprofessional I was, I wasn't playing by the rules, etc.  So I told him "I'm probably just not a good fit for this job.  It's boring, unfulfilling, and you're a prick."   Then I left, never to return :).

Had I done anything positive with that money, or any of the money I earned for the next decade, life would be much different.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Southern Stashian on June 02, 2014, 04:22:39 PM
Hahaha! Looking back it does seem that I have an issue with the "smaller people" of society. Since I'm 5'-9" myself and my troll of a wife is 5'-3", you wouldn't think I would have that issue. I mean my oldest 12 year old dwarf of a son is my best buddy while my vertically challenged 9 year old daughter is so beautiful and pint sized 4 year old couldn't be any happier.

Thankfully I don't think that way! ....... :)

Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Gray Matter on June 02, 2014, 06:30:12 PM
Hahaha! Looking back it does seem that I have an issue with the "smaller people" of society. Since I'm 5'-9" myself and my troll of a wife is 5'-3", you wouldn't think I would have that issue. I mean my oldest 12 year old dwarf of a son is my best buddy while my vertically challenged 9 year old daughter is so beautiful and pint sized 4 year old couldn't be any happier.

Thankfully I don't think that way! ....... :)

You really got to hand it short people...

Otherwise they couldn't reach it.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: aclarridge on June 03, 2014, 12:37:56 PM
This is one of my favourite threads - it highlights one amazing "side-benefit" that we can all enjoy on our journey to FI.

No big FUs given by me yet, but I can say that my stash is making me bolder at work in terms of asking for what I want. And I'm learning that the squeaky wheel gets the grease!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: MooseOutFront on June 03, 2014, 08:31:15 PM
I look forward to documenting it here, but my ability to call my own shots at work will almost certainly grow in relation to my stache. Hell, I already give less shits knowing that I no longer need to make all the right moves to hit executive management some day like I used to think. I'll quit looong before I even hit middle management. :)
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: arebelspy on June 04, 2014, 07:33:39 AM
So I started cutting back my hours..  this job was intended to be a 8 or 9 hour a day deal as opposed to the 12+ I was working so I tested leaving earlier and earlier each day, hopefully to regain my sanity.  I was surprisingly met with little resistance.  Eventually, I was given raises and promotions even though I had effectively cut my daily hours from 12 to like 7-8 today.

Your story (and especially this part) totally reminds me of BNL's latest post: "The Man" is You (http://www.bravenewlife.com/06/the-man-is-you/).
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: dude on June 04, 2014, 09:20:03 AM
Not an FU Money story or even a literal FU! story, but more of a hindsight FU-ish story.  Worked at a large law firm between second and third years of law school.  Back then the expectation was you'd get an offer for employment at the end of the summer, for the following year (i.e., after graduation).  I hated everything about that job, about the corporate law firm existence, the white-shoe suit-and-tie set.  And it obviously showed.  At one point, I was given a ridiculously stupid assignment by a 4th or 5th year associate. I asked him what the deadline for completion was, and he told me, no hurry, before the end of summer.  Several weeks later (well short of the end of summer), he calls me to his office and asks where the project is.  I tell him it's only about 30% complete. He tells me he wanted it today.  I politely tell him, no you didn't.  A back and forth ensues that ends up with me going off on the guy, dropping a few F bombs and generally telling him he's full of shit, all heard by others in the vicinity.  This was just one of the many little idiotic typical law firm episodes I had that summer.  Did I mention I hated it?  And I REALLY hated the idiotic billable hour system, where you had to keep track of client billing in six-fucking-minute increments!!  WTF?  I was miserable, and more than a few of my friends noticed it.  Nevertheless, I anticipated getting an offer and taking that job.  It's basically what I'd been programmed to do in law school (and I'd taken this summer position over several others I'd been offered -- times were good).  And it paid really well.  And it was "prestigious." Classic golden handcuff situation.

And then the offer didn't come.  I was politely told over the phone that I wouldn't be getting an offer.  Stunned (though in hindsight, I'm not sure why), I asked if the caller could expound upon the reasons why.  He said, "Some of the Committee members thought you lacked a seriousness of purpose."  In other words, I didn't play the game like a good soldier is supposed to.

It took me a couple days to get past this rejection -- but once I did, I had this overwhelming feeling of liberation.  I'd been freed from taking that shitty job that I would have taken for no other reason than that it paid good money.  Weeks later, I interviewed for my current job with the federal government, and had an offer just a month later.  Turned out to be the best thing that could have happened to me.  16 years later, I'm looking at FIRE in another 5 years and change, and have had a really good career thus far.  No asshole bosses, no make-work B.S., plenty of autonomy, mostly interesting work, a sane work schedule, a shitload of money frankly (not like the law firm job but more than enough), and a pension when I retire.  In short, I hit the career jackpot.  All because I didn't get that offer, thank God.  Not a day goes by when I'm not thankful for the way things turned out. 

So the FU here is more of a hindsight FU to the corporate legal sector, and to my law school for steering me there, and to those Hiring Committee members who apparently thought I'd never amount to much. But even then, I have to temper the FU with a 'thank you,' for the reasons stated above. 

In short, life is good.  -)
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: MidwestGal on June 04, 2014, 09:50:28 AM
I love this thread.

Not terribly epic, but I did quit my first Big Girl job as a manager.  The company wasn't treating their employees very well and my direct boss was also going along with it.  The money I did have enabled me to leave the situation while supporting a family with NO job lined up, and the employer I found a few months later had much more integrity.  I don't work there anymore but still recommend folks to do business with them due to that one factor.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Dr. Doom on June 04, 2014, 10:16:16 AM
So I started cutting back my hours..  this job was intended to be a 8 or 9 hour a day deal as opposed to the 12+ I was working so I tested leaving earlier and earlier each day, hopefully to regain my sanity.  I was surprisingly met with little resistance.  Eventually, I was given raises and promotions even though I had effectively cut my daily hours from 12 to like 7-8 today.

Your story (and especially this part) totally reminds me of BNL's latest post: "The Man" is You (http://www.bravenewlife.com/06/the-man-is-you/).

I would change the title of BNL's article to "The Man Might Be You."  There are clearly times when it's not you -- it's your employer, or possibly even your entire industry.

Look, I'm a geezer of 37 and I lived through the tech downturn of 2000.  Companies were outsourcing like gangbusters, laying off thousands of workers, and if you weren't one of the top contributors, you were gone, period.  I watched it happen:  India and APAC took many of those jobs.  There was intense pressure to increase output and in many cases that meant more hours in the form of unpaid overtime.  I had a few friends get laid off and they had trouble finding work because no one was hiring.

In this case, make no mistake about it, The Man really is The Man.

So make sure you have that FU money built up before you start ratcheting the hours down.   It works out for some people -- maybe even most people -- but not everyone.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: dragoncar on June 04, 2014, 10:25:53 AM
Weeks later, I interviewed for my current job with the federal government, and had an offer just a month later.  ... No asshole bosses, no make-work B.S., plenty of autonomy, mostly interesting work, a sane work schedule, a shitload of money frankly (not like the law firm job but more than enough),

You did hit the jackpot-- I'd caution anyone reading this post not to consider any of the above typical in the federal government
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: dude on June 04, 2014, 12:16:51 PM
Oh, forgot about my favorite FU job-quitting story.  Guy named Willie, a grizzled, bearded biker dude who worked on a roofing crew I worked on one summer (easily one of the worst jobs in America -- this is the industrial, hot tar roofing I'm talking about, not that easy by comparison residential shingling stuff, which I've also done plenty of).  The owner of the company's last name was Grodd (first name withheld).  Mr. Grodd confronted Willie one time on the job, and Willie took exception.  He told him, "Fuck you, your name is Grodd, not God," and promptly walked off the job.  hahaha!

He ended up getting his job back.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: clarkfan1979 on June 04, 2014, 10:44:43 PM
I used FU money in 2011 to take a sabbatical. I had just turned 51. I walked into my boss's office and said: I need to tell you something. I'm taking a year off". He said: "We don't allow that here". I said: "I'm not asking for you permission. I'm just doing it." He said: 'We can't guarantee that you can have your job back" I said: "I can't guarantee that I'll want my job back!". He asked: "How can you possibly afford to do this?" I said: "That's really a personal question, but I can tell you it involves savings and investments". Man, this dude was pissed. The president of the company called me to wish me the best and asked me to call him when I returned from my walkabout to discuss some opportunities. I ended up returning to a different department 15 months later. Higher pay. Promotion. I quit again 2 years later. They transferred me to another division. Higher pay. Another promotion.
Frugality pays.
I'm preparing for another world tour.

sounds like "office space"
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: chesebert on June 05, 2014, 05:38:15 AM
Weeks later, I interviewed for my current job with the federal government, and had an offer just a month later.  ... No asshole bosses, no make-work B.S., plenty of autonomy, mostly interesting work, a sane work schedule, a shitload of money frankly (not like the law firm job but more than enough),

You did hit the jackpot-- I'd caution anyone reading this post not to consider any of the above typical in the federal government

I agree, given the current state of legal industry. A stunt like that today will probably not end well.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: clarkfan1979 on June 05, 2014, 06:37:07 AM
Not that epic, but does involve poop. There are two parts.

Part one: After graduating from undergrad, I took a "year off" before going to grad school. I worked for my cousin's plumbing business. He had someone quit unexpectedly and offered me good money to work for him for one month while he looked for a replacement. He was very nice and paid me well. However, I never worked with him on the job. I worked with a different plumber that treated me like sh*t. He really enjoyed calling me "college boy" and was looking for excuses for yelling at me. I finally lost it and put him in his place. I told him that I was there to help out my cousin and not listen to his bullsh*t. I told him that if he yelled at me again I was going to leave and he would be doing twice the amount of work until a replacement was found. My cousin also had a talk with him and he stopped.

Part two: My uncle was having a party and he hired me to drive drunk people home. The "plumber" knew my uncle and was at the party. I honestly didn't have any hard feelings and things were going well. However, after a few beers he started doing his thing again by calling me "college boy" and yelling at me to do things. I think he was trying to show off. I didn't say anything or do anything until I gave him a ride home. I was taking 4 guys to their houses including the plumber. He was bombed and kept up with his remarks so I dropped him off first. After dropping him off, I got into the van and the other guys were apologizing for his behavior. They suggested that I kick his ass because he was a small man. I would never fight someone for being rude, but I did feel the need to poop. Without saying anything I got out of the van and pooped on his front porch. I wiped my butt with mapquest directions to his house so he knew that it was me. When I got back into the fan the three guys were like, "That's messed up, dude." I said, "You know what, I had to put up with his sh*t for one month. Now he has to put up with mine for one day."

Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: dude on June 05, 2014, 06:38:35 AM
Weeks later, I interviewed for my current job with the federal government, and had an offer just a month later.  ... No asshole bosses, no make-work B.S., plenty of autonomy, mostly interesting work, a sane work schedule, a shitload of money frankly (not like the law firm job but more than enough),

You did hit the jackpot-- I'd caution anyone reading this post not to consider any of the above typical in the federal government

HAHA!  Absolutely right!  I got very fortunate.  And yes @chesebert, the legal market was vastly different then than it is now!  Had I not taken my current path, I was ready to go back to active duty as a lawyer in the JAG corps.  I was told I was a shoe-in, but they weren't making offers until March of my graduation year, whereas my current job gave me an offer in December, so I went with the bird in hand.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: dude on June 05, 2014, 06:40:25 AM
Not that epic, but does involve poop. There are two parts.

Part one: After graduating from undergrad, I took a "year off" before going to grad school. I worked for my cousin's plumbing business. He had someone quit unexpectedly and offered me good money to work for him for one month while he looked for a replacement. He was very nice and paid me well. However, I never worked with him on the job. I worked with a different plumber that treated me like sh*t. He really enjoyed calling me "college boy" and was looking for excuses for yelling at me. I finally lost it and put him in his place. I told him that I was there to help out my cousin and not listen to his bullsh*t. I told him that if he yelled at me again I was going to leave and he would be doing twice the amount of work until a replacement was found. My cousin also had a talk with him and he stopped.

Part two: My uncle was having a party and he hired me to drive drunk people home. The "plumber" knew my uncle and was at the party. I honestly didn't have any hard feelings and things were going well. However, after a few beers he started doing his thing again by calling me "college boy" and yelling at me to do things. I think he was trying to show off. I didn't say anything or do anything until I gave him a ride home. I was taking 4 guys to their houses including the plumber. He was bombed and kept up with his remarks so I dropped him off first. After dropping him off, I got into the van and the other guys were apologizing for his behavior. They suggested that I kick his ass because he was a small man. I would never fight someone for being rude, but I did feel the need to poop. Without saying anything I got out of the van and pooped on his front porch. I wiped my butt with mapquest directions to his house so he knew that it was me. When I got back into the fan the three guys were like, "That's messed up, dude." I said, "You know what, I had to put up with his sh*t for one month. Now he has to put up with mine for one day."

hahaha!  Nice!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: aclarridge on June 05, 2014, 08:06:29 AM
So I started cutting back my hours..  this job was intended to be a 8 or 9 hour a day deal as opposed to the 12+ I was working so I tested leaving earlier and earlier each day, hopefully to regain my sanity.  I was surprisingly met with little resistance.  Eventually, I was given raises and promotions even though I had effectively cut my daily hours from 12 to like 7-8 today.

Your story (and especially this part) totally reminds me of BNL's latest post: "The Man" is You (http://www.bravenewlife.com/06/the-man-is-you/).

I enjoyed this article. From another perspective though, if the "Man" represents the company owners who basically want you to work like a slave for them, then you have to keep in mind that if you are an equity index investor you are a small part of the "Man". If you stick up for yourself like he says, and are a part owner in the company as well, you're the "Man" and from both perspectives you're doing great.
Sometimes when people complain about some jackass corporation that is part of an oligopoly and is ripping them off, I tell them it's a public company, if you think they make so much money then why not just buy part of it and participate in the fantastic profits?
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Kriegsspiel on June 05, 2014, 11:07:39 AM
Not that epic, but does involve poop. There are two parts.

Part one: After graduating from undergrad, I took a "year off" before going to grad school. I worked for my cousin's plumbing business. He had someone quit unexpectedly and offered me good money to work for him for one month while he looked for a replacement. He was very nice and paid me well. However, I never worked with him on the job. I worked with a different plumber that treated me like sh*t. He really enjoyed calling me "college boy" and was looking for excuses for yelling at me. I finally lost it and put him in his place. I told him that I was there to help out my cousin and not listen to his bullsh*t. I told him that if he yelled at me again I was going to leave and he would be doing twice the amount of work until a replacement was found. My cousin also had a talk with him and he stopped.

Part two: My uncle was having a party and he hired me to drive drunk people home. The "plumber" knew my uncle and was at the party. I honestly didn't have any hard feelings and things were going well. However, after a few beers he started doing his thing again by calling me "college boy" and yelling at me to do things. I think he was trying to show off. I didn't say anything or do anything until I gave him a ride home. I was taking 4 guys to their houses including the plumber. He was bombed and kept up with his remarks so I dropped him off first. After dropping him off, I got into the van and the other guys were apologizing for his behavior. They suggested that I kick his ass because he was a small man. I would never fight someone for being rude, but I did feel the need to poop. Without saying anything I got out of the van and pooped on his front porch. I wiped my butt with mapquest directions to his house so he knew that it was me. When I got back into the fan the three guys were like, "That's messed up, dude." I said, "You know what, I had to put up with his sh*t for one month. Now he has to put up with mine for one day."

You win.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: frugally on June 08, 2014, 08:04:30 AM
Not that epic, but does involve poop. There are two parts.

Part one: After graduating from undergrad, I took a "year off" before going to grad school. I worked for my cousin's plumbing business. He had someone quit unexpectedly and offered me good money to work for him for one month while he looked for a replacement. He was very nice and paid me well. However, I never worked with him on the job. I worked with a different plumber that treated me like sh*t. He really enjoyed calling me "college boy" and was looking for excuses for yelling at me. I finally lost it and put him in his place. I told him that I was there to help out my cousin and not listen to his bullsh*t. I told him that if he yelled at me again I was going to leave and he would be doing twice the amount of work until a replacement was found. My cousin also had a talk with him and he stopped.

Part two: My uncle was having a party and he hired me to drive drunk people home. The "plumber" knew my uncle and was at the party. I honestly didn't have any hard feelings and things were going well. However, after a few beers he started doing his thing again by calling me "college boy" and yelling at me to do things. I think he was trying to show off. I didn't say anything or do anything until I gave him a ride home. I was taking 4 guys to their houses including the plumber. He was bombed and kept up with his remarks so I dropped him off first. After dropping him off, I got into the van and the other guys were apologizing for his behavior. They suggested that I kick his ass because he was a small man. I would never fight someone for being rude, but I did feel the need to poop. Without saying anything I got out of the van and pooped on his front porch. I wiped my butt with mapquest directions to his house so he knew that it was me. When I got back into the fan the three guys were like, "That's messed up, dude." I said, "You know what, I had to put up with his sh*t for one month. Now he has to put up with mine for one day."

This is brilliant.  Have you seen him since then?
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Gerard on June 08, 2014, 11:48:02 AM
A lot of the stories here are about people who didn't have anything to go to, or a backup plan, or any money saved... in essence, people who lost their jobs because they preferred the satisfaction of being in charge of the situation for five seconds.

Which is why I think *real* FU money is so powerful. You don't have to use it. You can afford to be nice to everyone, even assholes. You just don't do anything you don't want to, or that you think is wrong. Because you don't need that five-second satisfaction, because you're not stressed out or frustrated or overwhelmed or vulnerable to start with.

</captain obvious>
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: dragoncar on June 08, 2014, 06:19:35 PM
A lot of the stories here are about people who didn't have anything to go to, or a backup plan, or any money saved... in essence, people who lost their jobs because they preferred the satisfaction of being in charge of the situation for five seconds.

Which is why I think *real* FU money is so powerful. You don't have to use it. You can afford to be nice to everyone, even assholes. You just don't do anything you don't want to, or that you think is wrong. Because you don't need that five-second satisfaction, because you're not stressed out or frustrated or overwhelmed or vulnerable to start with.

</captain obvious>

Should be called IPD money ("I politely decline")
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: clarkfan1979 on June 08, 2014, 06:56:19 PM
A lot of the stories here are about people who didn't have anything to go to, or a backup plan, or any money saved... in essence, people who lost their jobs because they preferred the satisfaction of being in charge of the situation for five seconds.

Which is why I think *real* FU money is so powerful. You don't have to use it. You can afford to be nice to everyone, even assholes. You just don't do anything you don't want to, or that you think is wrong. Because you don't need that five-second satisfaction, because you're not stressed out or frustrated or overwhelmed or vulnerable to start with.

</captain obvious>

I politely disagree. I burn bridges because I can afford to do so. Being polite is typically someone who doesn't want to burn a bridge because they might still need something. I like the fu*king thing on fire!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Sofa King on June 08, 2014, 07:05:27 PM
Your story (and especially this part) totally reminds me of BNL's latest post: "The Man" is You (http://www.bravenewlife.com/06/the-man-is-you/).

This was great!!!!


[Mod Edit: Quote tags fixed.]
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: 2527 on June 09, 2014, 09:25:15 AM
The source of strength here was not money, but it is still a good story.

I was a major in the Air Force working for an obnoxious colonel.  At various times, he had thrown food at me, called me an asshole, and little shit.

Then, I was transferred to work in a small office directly supporting a four-star general, the colonel's boss' boss. 

I did something he didn't like, and he called me and started the phone conversation by calling me "fuckface."  The other people in the office could hear it.  I kept my cool, finished the conversation, and waited two days.  He obviously didn't grasp the significance of the fact that I now longer worked for him and was, in fact, pretty highly placed in the 4-star's office.

I went to his office, and told him his behavior was unprofessional and obnoxious, and I had been waiting two days for him to call me and apologize, but he hadn't done so.  I made sure to use the words asshole, fuckface and little shit over and over again.  He kept trying to divert the conversation, but I kept bringing it back to him and his behavior.  At several points, he abruptly stood up and walked around and looked out the window.  He clearly didn't want to be in the conversation.  I advised him several times that if he treated me unprofessionally, I would bring it up with his boss, a two-star general, and if that didn't work, I would bring it up with is boss's boss, who was the 4-star I now worked for. 

It was great.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Miamoo on June 09, 2014, 01:26:52 PM
Wow.  Maybe this has been covered but when I was growing up FU money was something the housewife stashed in case she had to escape from an abusive or intolerable marriage.  Showing my age I suppose.  Very negative and not good eh?
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: citrine on June 09, 2014, 03:13:14 PM
I had some FU money saved up from the sale of my condo in 2005 and from stream lining my expenses....close to $35K.  My job in big pharma was getting out of control with a lying/cheating VP, a diva-esque Director, and just plain dysfunctional group of managers.  I had been told that I was not a team player because I would not fudge the bar tab on the expense report or lie for the VP when his pregnant wife called (he was hanging out with the VP of Marketing in her room drinking). 
We were having a change in management (again) and in the midst of all the interviews and what not...I handed in my resignation and told them I was going to go and explore other avenues...massage school in particular ;)  Many people snickered and laughed outright...said I would be back in a year begging for my job back.
Fast forward 5 years....I have a very successful practice, choose the hours/cases I will work with (medical massage), and the funny part is that a couple of those in high management have found me through Linkedin and became my clients :) I will never work for anyone else again.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Rural on June 09, 2014, 08:03:20 PM
Wow.  Maybe this has been covered but when I was growing up FU money was something the housewife stashed in case she had to escape from an abusive or intolerable marriage.  Showing my age I suppose.  Very negative and not good eh?


I don't know. I'd say having the FU money in that case is much better than not having it, so I wouldn't call it "not good." Too many abused spouses now don't have it.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: europe on June 10, 2014, 06:37:57 AM
Not that epic, but does involve poop.

I like it when posts start like this... :D
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Wildflame on June 10, 2014, 12:33:20 PM
Gerard, I'm not sure it's so simple. Even with FU money, most people are inclined to be accommodating, non-confrontational people. There will always be someone who incites stress or frustration in the workplace. The 'power' of FU money doesn't come from the money itself - it comes from realising that in most circumstances, the 'worst that can happen' is not really that bad, and with that knowledge comes strength. Obviously having cash behind you eliminates many possibilities from 'the worst that can happen', but it's not the money that makes these stories so interesting - it's the object lesson in seeing a person discover their strength and resilience, and pushing back against the arseholes and bullpoop that make so many workplaces much more unpleasant than they need to be.

My FU money story was really boring. I got sick of my job. I wanted to take some time off before changing careers. So I quit, worked out my notice, and am the happier for it. If I was destitute, I could not have done that. One of my co-workers at that job has been in the same low-level retail job for five years working weekends on top of his regular job in a hospital - doing six days a week or thirteen days a fortnight between them. He will not and can not ever quit, because he is up to his armpits in debt and spends money like it's going out of fashion. He stressed about it every time I worked with him. Poor bugger. Thank goodness I'm not that guy. Thank goodness for FU money. =)

EDIT: Ah! I do have a slightly better one. About four months ago another of my coworkers decided to go study - interstate, with classes starting in a week. He was a casual, so he could quit with nothing more than a note. Which, because he hated the boss, is exactly what he did, writing the following immortal words and smiley into the store diary while working on the weekend, taking up a whole A4 page: "I don't work here anymore =) -(Name)". He blocked the boss's mobile and the store phone numbers, packed his stuff in his car and a hired trailer, and was gone just like that. I'm not sure how much savings he had, but it was definitely enough to keep him going for a good 3-4 months at least.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: dweebyhawkeyes on June 10, 2014, 02:54:28 PM
Wow.  Maybe this has been covered but when I was growing up FU money was something the housewife stashed in case she had to escape from an abusive or intolerable marriage.  Showing my age I suppose.  Very negative and not good eh?

Interesting. I offered to rent an apartment for my friend and I if her emotionally abusive boyfriend wouldn't let her out of the relationship.. My FU money, but worth it to me to save her if needed.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Spartana on June 10, 2014, 03:28:11 PM
I think about a year after I left work I realized I could actually retire permanently without having to ever work again - even p/t - if I just sold my paid off house and downsized. I did that and became instantly FI.  I was also frugal, debt free, child free, divorced, and had mostly free or very low cost activities and knew I would have a government pension of $1400/month starting at age 50 and had free or low cost medical thru the VA medical system (although I have always bought a low cost private policy). I also have no heirs so have no problem spending down any principal I have in savings or investments over the coming years to supplement my pension as needed. Currently, with a paid off house and low taxes, insurance and utilities, I can live on about half my pension ($700) per month for basic expenses. The extra goes to travel and fun stuff - or needed things like getting the car fixed.  I've been FIREed over a decade now and love it. And no, I haven't had to go to work to plug any financial holes. Just reduce spending in other areas as needed or do without some things that don't have that much importance to me.

Thanks, that was very helpful. I like how you played with your options and finances (selling a home) to get you where you needed to be. And I love your beach volleyball and travel stories. Those are two of some of the things I want to spend more time on. I am also child-free and debt-free and don't plan on leaving much around when I get to the inevitable.

I just "downsized" late last year to a "smaller" place that helped me get mortgage free. I'm still waiting for the old house to sell (hence the nerves). But the new place is still quite luxurious and bigger than I need. I love the area. But I do have that as my ace in the hole if I need it (can sell and downsize even more in the future).

I'm just getting used to my new expense structure with this move. I think I have shaved off $20k in yearly expenses with this move - no mortgage, no yard maintenance, no alarm, no home phone, much less insurance costs, finally cut the cable, etc. It is quite freeing to see the change! And I only moved a mile away!

I am actually understating my stash. I have more than enough to cover my basic expenses at a 4% SWR. But I'd still like to beef up the travel amount and make sure I still have enough to cover my charitable donations. I'm also a little skittish with the current market highs. I'm sure it's doable if I am forced into the situation. We shall see...
I did tweak some things a bit but nothing too dramatic or life changing. Sort of a "Latte-Factor" kind of trade-off with most things. i.e. I didn't give up things, just found alternative (less expensive) ways to have the things I want. Like you, I also didn't have to move too far from my home in SoCal (Orange County) as I didn't want to move too far from my family and friends. So just moved about 100 miles away (and 7,000 ft up!) and bought a home for about 1/4th the price I sold my place for. And still was close enough to snow ski in the morning and surf at the beach (or play beach volleyball) in the afternoon! So I think there are ways to retire or temporarily quit your job (with enough FU money that is) and not have to make too drastic of a lifestyle change.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: trailrated on June 10, 2014, 07:33:35 PM
Gerard, I'm not sure it's so simple. Even with FU money, most people are inclined to be accommodating, non-confrontational people. There will always be someone who incites stress or frustration in the workplace. The 'power' of FU money doesn't come from the money itself - it comes from realising that in most circumstances, the 'worst that can happen' is not really that bad, and with that knowledge comes strength. Obviously having cash behind you eliminates many possibilities from 'the worst that can happen', but it's not the money that makes these stories so interesting - it's the object lesson in seeing a person discover their strength and resilience, and pushing back against the arseholes and bullpoop that make so many workplaces much more unpleasant than they need to be.

Wow that was so awesome I re-read it 3 times. Perfectly stated!!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Insanity on June 10, 2014, 07:36:13 PM
And still was close enough to snow ski in the morning and surf at the beach (or play beach volleyball) in the afternoon!

You suck.

No, really, you suck.

Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Daisy on June 10, 2014, 08:25:17 PM
So just moved about 100 miles away (and 7,000 ft up!) and bought a home for about 1/4th the price I sold my place for.

Sweet!!! I live in a high COL area, but also close to family and friends...and the beach. But Florida has other beach towns that are cheaper. I guess I can move to one of those in the future. My parents are getting old and frail so I can't move too far away yet.

I would also love to live in Colorado. I can't ever see myself buying two places though.

I agree that there's always a cheaper way to do the same thing and spend a lot less money. You just have to be creative and flexible.

And still was close enough to snow ski in the morning and surf at the beach (or play beach volleyball) in the afternoon!

You are living my dream life!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Spartana on June 10, 2014, 10:29:15 PM
And still was close enough to snow ski in the morning and surf at the beach (or play beach volleyball) in the afternoon!

You suck.

No, really, you suck.
I'm sorry I can't hear you with all that beach sand in my ears :-)!90 minutes outside LA:
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Spartana on June 10, 2014, 10:36:47 PM
So just moved about 100 miles away (and 7,000 ft up!) and bought a home for about 1/4th the price I sold my place for.

Sweet!!! I live in a high COL area, but also close to family and friends...and the beach. But Florida has other beach towns that are cheaper. I guess I can move to one of those in the future. My parents are getting old and frail so I can't move too far away yet.

I would also love to live in Colorado. I can't ever see myself buying two places though.

I agree that there's always a cheaper way to do the same thing and spend a lot less money. You just have to be creative and flexible.

And still was close enough to snow ski in the morning and surf at the beach (or play beach volleyball) in the afternoon!

You are living my dream life!
I think I would have liked to live in a lower cost area myself but living only 90 minutes away from family (also elderly parents) was important to me too. Plus I had several  pets (dogs and cats) so knew I couldn't get a condo or apt or rent a room and had to get a house. It wasn't ideal but was very workable.  Having pets was a big factor when I chose to quit working - even if I had the FU money to do it - as I knew that would greatly effect my  housing options. Much easier to walk off the job when you know you only have yourself to look after and provide for. Something for those with pets contemplating leaving their jobs.

edited to add that I moved back down "The Hill" 2 years ago and bought a house near the beach with my sister back in Orange County Calif. So I am back in a high cost area - although bought the house as a foreclosure during the bottom of the market for a low price- but splitting the purchase cost and housing costs is a huge money saver. Otherwise I wouldn't be able to buy  in this area. And I'm still only 90 minutes from the mountain ski resorts and 10 minutes from the beach :-)!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: iris lily on June 10, 2014, 10:49:09 PM
And still was close enough to snow ski in the morning and surf at the beach (or play beach volleyball) in the afternoon!

You suck.

No, really, you suck.

aw there she is, sashaying around the web gloating again.  :)  She's the Gloat Queen on another simple living board. I can attest to it, I've been reading her posts for more than 10 years and she really DOES have the life. But she knows how to make the decisions to get there.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Spartana on June 10, 2014, 11:08:45 PM
And still was close enough to snow ski in the morning and surf at the beach (or play beach volleyball) in the afternoon!

You suck.

No, really, you suck.

aw there she is, sashaying around the web gloating again.  :)  She's the Gloat Queen on another simple living board. I can attest to it, I've been reading her posts for more than 10 years and she really DOES have the life. But she knows how to make the decisions to get there.
It's not gloating, it's inspirering others to become lazy good for nothing mustachian fools too :-)! And when are you going to quit that job-thingie and join me in lazytown? Then we can both suck!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Insanity on June 11, 2014, 07:34:18 AM
And still was close enough to snow ski in the morning and surf at the beach (or play beach volleyball) in the afternoon!

You suck.

No, really, you suck.

aw there she is, sashaying around the web gloating again.  :)  She's the Gloat Queen on another simple living board. I can attest to it, I've been reading her posts for more than 10 years and she really DOES have the life. But she knows how to make the decisions to get there.
It's not gloating, it's inspirering others to become lazy good for nothing mustachian fools too :-)! And when are you going to quit that job-thingie and join me in lazytown? Then we can both suck!

I don't think it is gloating.  But it doesn't change the fact she still sucks.

You promise my fat and lazy ass a doubles tourney as soon as I FIRE and I'll be there.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: dragoncar on June 11, 2014, 11:21:37 AM
And still was close enough to snow ski in the morning and surf at the beach (or play beach volleyball) in the afternoon!

You suck.

No, really, you suck.
I'm sorry I can't hear you with all that beach sand in my ears :-)!90 minutes outside LA:

I love big bear, but property isn't exactly cheap there.  Is it super seasonal there?  And how bad is the snow?  I've only been in the summer.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Spartana on June 11, 2014, 01:52:36 PM
And still was close enough to snow ski in the morning and surf at the beach (or play beach volleyball) in the afternoon!

You suck.

No, really, you suck.

aw there she is, sashaying around the web gloating again.  :)  She's the Gloat Queen on another simple living board. I can attest to it, I've been reading her posts for more than 10 years and she really DOES have the life. But she knows how to make the decisions to get there.
It's not gloating, it's inspirering others to become lazy good for nothing mustachian fools too :-)! And when are you going to quit that job-thingie and join me in lazytown? Then we can both suck!

I don't think it is gloating.  But it doesn't change the fact she still sucks.

You promise my fat and lazy ass a doubles tourney as soon as I FIRE and I'll be there.
I'll be there to whup your hiney-end :-)! Of course I'm older and slower now since I've been FTRE'd sooooooooo long now. Hmmm...sounds like that could be a gloat :-)!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Spartana on June 11, 2014, 02:06:50 PM
And still was close enough to snow ski in the morning and surf at the beach (or play beach volleyball) in the afternoon!

You suck.

No, really, you suck.
I'm sorry I can't hear you with all that beach sand in my ears :-)!90 minutes outside LA:

I love big bear, but property isn't exactly cheap there.  Is it super seasonal there?  And how bad is the snow?  I've only been in the summer.
Big Bear's not as cheap as it was but still much less when compared to The O.C. - especially the coastal area I was living in (and now live in again). The drive up and back can be hard, especially in winter, and you often need snow tires and 4 x 4 or chains. The roads sometimes get closed because of mudslides or avalanches (and can take week or even months to be re-opened) and there can be wildfires that cause problems. But still, lots of people choose to live there and actually commute to LA or the IE everyday (lots of crazy people IMHO) as there really aren't any good paying jobs up there. Weather-wise it is near perfect I think. Much cooler then most of SoCal in summer (and cold at night), close to year round sunshine, fairly minimal snow (maybe 80 inches a year - and only a 30 minute or less drive to get off the mountain and into warm dry weather), more rain in summer due to thunderstorms but brief refreshing rain, and a pretty place to live. Lots of recreation. The Village area can get crowded but it's an easy walk or bike ride everywhere in the Valley so can go carless - even have a bus that goes between all the mountain communities and down to San Bernardino. I liked living there but it is a small place, surrounded by National Forest, and not for those who want the city life. However, like many resort areas, it has everything a small city has, just on a smaller scale. 4 seasons too - all nice.

Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Daisy on June 11, 2014, 08:38:02 PM
aw there she is, sashaying around the web gloating again.  :)  She's the Gloat Queen on another simple living board. I can attest to it, I've been reading her posts for more than 10 years and she really DOES have the life. But she knows how to make the decisions to get there.

Spartana - the Goddess of FIRE.

I don't see it as gloating. I am quite inspired by her stories.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: iris lily on June 11, 2014, 09:08:41 PM
aw there she is, sashaying around the web gloating again.  :)  She's the Gloat Queen on another simple living board. I can attest to it, I've been reading her posts for more than 10 years and she really DOES have the life. But she knows how to make the decisions to get there.

Spartana - the Goddess of FIRE.

I don't see it as gloating. I am quite inspired by her stories.

Oh it's gloating all right, haha. This is an inside joke of long standing.  And I'm in countdown mode, less than a year to go punching a time clock and then I can sit around and gloat about enjoying a carefree life.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Daisy on June 11, 2014, 09:20:43 PM
aw there she is, sashaying around the web gloating again.  :)  She's the Gloat Queen on another simple living board. I can attest to it, I've been reading her posts for more than 10 years and she really DOES have the life. But she knows how to make the decisions to get there.

Spartana - the Goddess of FIRE.

I don't see it as gloating. I am quite inspired by her stories.

Oh it's gloating all right, haha. This is an inside joke of long standing.  And I'm in countdown mode, less than a year to go punching a time clock and then I can sit around and gloat about enjoying a carefree life.

(premature) Congratulations!

I may be 1-3 years away myself. I am looking forward to the carefree life. I do try my best to incorporate the carefree attitude in my current life. I'm so close to FIRE that even if it happens earlier than planned, I can cope.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Spartana on June 12, 2014, 12:36:51 AM
aw there she is, sashaying around the web gloating again.  :)  She's the Gloat Queen on another simple living board. I can attest to it, I've been reading her posts for more than 10 years and she really DOES have the life. But she knows how to make the decisions to get there.

Spartana - the Goddess of FIRE.

I don't see it as gloating. I am quite inspired by her stories.

Oh it's gloating all right, haha. This is an inside joke of long standing.  And I'm in countdown mode, less than a year to go punching a time clock and then I can sit around and gloat about enjoying a carefree life.
well you know the longer you call me out on my gloating...er...inspiring ancedotes, the worse they will become :-)!

Now if I can only get that flame dress from Hunger Games and the chariot to pull me thru the streets while cheering people throw money and roses at me, then I'll know I am truly The Goddess of FIRE and Queen of the Gloaters! Until then I shall remain humble ole me :-)!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Spartana on June 12, 2014, 12:47:51 AM
OK back to the topic! Has anyone ever just up and left a job with no FU money? Just enough to maybe get them thru for a little while in the hopes of getting something better?

 My younger sister did this kind of thing off and on for years. At 17 - after finishing high school and working a retail job - she went skiing for a weekend with some friends and ended up just staying at the ski resort. No money except a jar of pennies (yep, pennies). She was able to find a place to crash for a few night, scrounge up a bit of food and then a job as a lift ticket checker. She ended up staying there for several years.

Another time she just left her job and took off to New Zealand for a year and returned with 13 cents to her name (worked while she was there picking fruit). Another time she just left her job and travelled around the US for a year. And 4 years in a row she just worked enough in winters so she could take off in summers and spent 4 summers in Alaska (working there too). Lots of other things like that. She eventually got a job with a big defense contractor and "settled" down in her early 30's and has been there ever since and plans to retire from there once she is 55.

And surprisingly, doing all those years of giving the finger to various low paying jobs and spending all her money each time afterwards, she still has a huge stash, was able to buy a place with cash in a SoCal beach community, and could probably retire now oif she chooses. No college education (or debts of any kind) either. So there's hope for people who want to say FU to the job occasionally yet still get ahead.
 
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: ch12 on June 12, 2014, 04:33:42 AM
OK back to the topic! Has anyone ever just up and left a job with no FU money? Just enough to maybe get them thru for a little while in the hopes of getting something better?

My younger sister did this kind of thing off and on for years.
And surprisingly, doing all those years of giving the finger to various low paying jobs and spending all her money each time afterwards, she still has a huge stash, was able to buy a place with cash in a SoCal beach community, and could probably retire now if she chooses. No college education (or debts of any kind) either. So there's hope for people who want to say FU to the job occasionally yet still get ahead.

'Stashing is probably a byproduct of the frugal habits she picked up when she was making small amounts of money. Once she made a normal wage, she kept the habits and ended rich anyway.

I have friends who are still at that stage (early 20s) and I hope they get sorted out the same way. I'm a wee bit jealous of their adventures (where are we this week? Patagonia), but there is something to be said about the stability of an office job with a regular paycheck.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Spartana on June 12, 2014, 09:15:27 AM
OK back to the topic! Has anyone ever just up and left a job with no FU money? Just enough to maybe get them thru for a little while in the hopes of getting something better?

My younger sister did this kind of thing off and on for years.
And surprisingly, doing all those years of giving the finger to various low paying jobs and spending all her money each time afterwards, she still has a huge stash, was able to buy a place with cash in a SoCal beach community, and could probably retire now if she chooses. No college education (or debts of any kind) either. So there's hope for people who want to say FU to the job occasionally yet still get ahead.

'Stashing is probably a byproduct of the frugal habits she picked up when she was making small amounts of money. Once she made a normal wage, she kept the habits and ended rich anyway.

I have friends who are still at that stage (early 20s) and I hope they get sorted out the same way. I'm a wee bit jealous of their adventures (where are we this week? Patagonia), but there is something to be said about the stability of an office job with a regular paycheck.
Yes you are right. She continued to live on very little money and stashed the rest. I know she is happy with her choices to travel and have adventures while young rather then work as she, like me, often see people who have been in school and working hard all their lives who sort of lose it around age 40. All of a sudden dump it all (job, money, often spouse and kids) and run off to the tropical isle (or buy that snazzy red sports car :-)!).  The non-stop/no-breaks school and work thing may really be the culprit behind a lot of mid-life crisis'. Maybe taking a break in between for a couple of years or before serious career can be more stable in the long run then an office job and a pay check. For a little while at least :-)!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: dragoncar on June 12, 2014, 10:06:37 AM
Has anyone ever just up and left a job with no FU money? Just enough to maybe get them thru for a little while in the hopes of getting something better?

Others here disagree, but to me this is the definition of FU money: enough to leave a bad job.  For me it's less than FIRE money, but for others it's the same or even zero.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: OzzieandHarriet on June 12, 2014, 10:51:29 AM
I can't remember exactly when it dawned on me that I could put the maximum into my 401k and IRA. It was some time after I got married at 41 (am now 56). I didn't start working full time until I was 35 and had no clue about retirement accounts because I was just getting by (though frugally). My only investment at the time was a house that my mother helped me buy. But in any case, husband and I both started maxing out all possible retirement accounts at some point in the past 15 years. We both kept getting modest raises every year (his salary always about double mine). When my job became intolerable last year, I did try to improve things there, but nothing worked. I looked at our income and our stash and realized that yes, we had enough for me to jump, so I did. I left on good terms, but left nevertheless.

It's been almost a year now, and we have had no money problems whatsoever. I've been keeping track of how our investments are doing, and they are generating twice as much income as we need (of course that can change depending on the stock market); at the moment, we are living on about half of husband's income and still saving so haven't had to touch the stash.

I was able to set up a freelance side gig, now am wondering if I even need to keep doing that -- it's taking up too much of my valuable time!

Not exactly "epic," but I still can't believe I was able to do it.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Gerard on June 12, 2014, 05:10:01 PM
Gerard, I'm not sure it's so simple. Even with FU money, most people are inclined to be accommodating, non-confrontational people. There will always be someone who incites stress or frustration in the workplace. The 'power' of FU money doesn't come from the money itself - it comes from realising that in most circumstances, the 'worst that can happen' is not really that bad, and with that knowledge comes strength. Obviously having cash behind you eliminates many possibilities from 'the worst that can happen', but it's not the money that makes these stories so interesting - it's the object lesson in seeing a person discover their strength and resilience, and pushing back against the arseholes and bullpoop that make so many workplaces much more unpleasant than they need to be.

I see your point, and your "worst that can happen" point is wise and I thank you for expressing it so clearly. My point was/is that in many of the earlier stories on here, the pushing back involves harming the pusher as much as the pushee. I didn't see much power in them. To deliberately misquote, revenge is a dish best eaten not at all.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Iconoclast on June 13, 2014, 04:36:59 AM
From all the stories here (great thread!) I realized I might have my own FU money story...

After law school, my second full-time job was as a legal researcher at an institute of a certain university. They hired me to write a book for which they had already received the grant. After a few months, I learned I was the only one who applied for the job. Had I known that, I might have bargained a bit harder... My contract was for one year, with the option of being hired for a PhD position afterwards.

Anyhow, it dawned pretty quickly on me that it was a toxic workplace. The professor in charge was a psychopath who would just yell at people if he felt like it. The people around him were a bunch of yes men. My direct colleagues -the other researchers and Ph D students- were great people however. We helped each other out after we'd been the victim of another one of the professor's fits and generally had a lot of fun, behind the backs of management of course.

It took me a few months to write the requested book. After that, the idea was to have me working on other projects to generate some extra income for the institute. The other projects never materialized and I was bored out of my wits. In the beginning, I'd go to the university library to read up on different subjects, but even that got boring. What I did in the end -and I'm not proud of it but as I said, the boredom was intolerable- is go to the office, hang my coat on my desk chair, then bike home again and go back in the evening to pick up my coat. It was pretty clear that I needed another job, so I prepared for the entrance exams for another job in government. I aced those tests (thanks to all the preparation time) and am still in that organization today.

A couple of months before my contract was up, I got the confirmation that I was accepted in the new job. My contract would end in July and the other job would start in October, although they offered me to start earlier, which I politely declined because I had enough 'stache to cover a couple of months of expenses to travel and generally bum around. Those months were awesome! At work I gave my manager the impression that I was very interested in a PhD position, so they thought they could take advantage of me for a couple of more years. Eventually I had to break the news to my (fairly spineless) manager and he listened to me but never replied, he just nodded and never said a word to me after that. I followed up with an e-mail to cover my behind so he could not deny that I had informed him. I think that when I told him, he realized the professor would be screaming at him because I was leaving and he was probably scared shi(r)tless.

A couple of days before my last work day, one of the secretaries informed me that I would have a meeting with the professor in a couple of hours. Obviously he wanted to have one last yelling session at me for some invented reason, while the real reason was that I was committing treason by leaving. I walked out the building and never returned. There was already a farewell party planned with my direct colleagues so there was no damage there.

As I said, I had a few great months in between jobs. The story doesn't end there, however. About six months later, I received the PhD dissertation from my manager in the mail, with a request for money to buy him a gift (AS IF!). When I browsed the book, I noticed that some parts were copied  from articles that I had published in my time at the institute, without the proper footnotes. I notified the committee that had decided on his PhD application, and the PhD graduation ceremony was cancelled. The local press jumped on it. There was a ceremony afterwards, but it was very hush-hush and a note was added to all the dissertation papers that pages X to Y had been written by Iconoclast and the author had "forgotten" to include the footnotes.

About a year later, the institute was disbanded. The university had been building a file against the professor, and he left for another university with some of his yes men. The PhD's were transferred to other departments to finish their work there. The contracts of the other people were not renewed, including my manager. According to LinkedIn, he's still working in my current region in the same field as me, but I'm pretty sure he's unemployed because I never run into him professionally. It doesn't help that when you Google his name, the word plagiarism is never far off.

Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: shadowmoss on June 13, 2014, 07:44:54 AM
Spartana has a(nother) forum to gloat, errr, inspire!  Whoopieeee!  I've been reading her gloats with envy for many years!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Spartana on June 13, 2014, 03:18:15 PM
Spartana has a(nother) forum to gloat, errr, inspire!  Whoopieeee!  I've been reading her gloats with envy for many years!
And now that Iris-Lily will be joining me on the darkside and into ER soon you're next!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Spartana on June 13, 2014, 05:12:04 PM
Friends from the Simple Living forums (waving to all of you) are probably sick of my story but I'll share it anyway, as it might be helpful to others.
Sometimes I wish I was on my own so I could take the leap like Spartana (my frugal Wondertwin!) That being said, my fantasies about quitting and opening a dive shop in Costa Rica intensify every day.  And I don't dive and I've never been to Costa Rica.
Well I love hearing your story - and the "dream life" of opening a dive shop in Costa Rica with out having ever dived - cracked me up.

And before she was a Wonder Twin, she was She-Rah, Princess of Power and Gloat. Hanging with He-Man and Ihamo the Wonder Woman :-)!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: dragoncar on June 13, 2014, 05:22:20 PM
Friends from the Simple Living forums (waving to all of you) are probably sick of my story but I'll share it anyway, as it might be helpful to others.

I had a career meltdown a few years ago in which FU money saved my life, literally.  Short story is I hit a very thick, impenetrable glass ceiling imposed by a boss with psychopathic traits.  Longer story is that they hired someone in over my head to do a job that should have been mine, without ever telling me the job was available.  New hire had NO relevant experience and was totally incapable of doing the job, and it was clear I would be doing it for him.  Oh, and then they tried to give me a 20% paycut because I was no longer in a managerial role.  Almost quit at that point, and again when psycho boss engineered a very negative performance review to cover his butt (I stupidly walked right into that one).  But I had some projects that meant a lot to me that I wanted to wrap up, so I focused on those while I literally started counting the days until I would leave.  I had a lovely excel spreadsheet that calculated what I was earning daily.  I spaced out my time off so that I would have a few "money for nothing" days interspersed every few weeks to help keep me going.  I applied for a fellowship that I was almost certain I would get as my transition strategy.

The day I had my fellowship interview and got confirmation that I would be getting it, I wrote and submitted my resignation.  Originally my DH was going to quit, too (we worked for the same organization), but in the end he decided to stay -- that ended up being good for us financially, but did cause some tension in our marriage.  The fellowship money was only about 1/2 my takehome pay, but our expenses were low and we were basically living off of one salary anyway, so the risks were minimal.  We also had a very large cash stash to fall back on as we had been living way below our means for several years.

I wasn't really sure what I was going to do once the fellowship (which was for about 6 months) was over.  Had originally thought I'd do some kind of consulting, but was worried about whether/how it would work.  Serendipity played her hand and a great job came up right as my fellowship was winding down.  It was a bit below my skill set, and I took a paycut, but it turned out to be just what I needed.  I could do the job well pretty much in my sleep, and quickly became indispensable to the organization and the program.  Decent raises followed, and I'm now on the verge of a major promotion and (hopefully) a more significant raise.  There have been some ups and downs in the last year, and to be honest I'm not sure I'm all that happy with how things have played out and not sure how long I'm going to stick with things.  Definitely in "play it by ear" mode at the moment.  But the last few years have been VERY good for us financially and if push came to shove we are in a position where we could sell our apartment and be financially set for life.  DH doesn't want to do that, and isn't ready to stop working yet, so we're in a bit of a holding pattern.  I look at our spreadsheets pretty obsessively and am running numbers on Fidelity's Retirement INcome Planner regularly just to confirm that we can cut the handcuffs any time.

Sometimes I wish I was on my own so I could take the leap like Spartana (my frugal Wondertwin!) did, but the reality is I wouldn't have gotten this far without a great and supportive spouse, who is someone I want to grow old with, so I need to be patient and wait until he is ready, too.

That being said, my fantasies about quitting and opening a dive shop in Costa Rica intensify every day.  And I don't dive and I've never been to Costa Rica.

So how did it save your life?  I was waiting to hear how the ex-boss murdered his new subordinate.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: FunkyStickman on June 13, 2014, 05:52:29 PM
I guess I'll add my "epiphany" moment.

3 years ago, I was working in I.T. for a small-ish branch of a local manufacturer. I'd been working for about 15 years as a contract desktop support guy, and after all that, I was capped out around $28K a year, if that. Through those 15 years, my wife and I managed to go completely debt-free except our mortgage while raising 4 kids.

So at that time I was working as a contractor in Louisiana. My "manager" was a slacktard in North Carolina who oversaw a half dozen units, mostly small remote ones, like ours. I worked at that factory for 5 years, and he never once came to visit, but somehow our unit was always at the bottom of the performance scorecards. Didn't matter what I did, it was never enough. He would randomly IM me during the day and ask me why I hadn't gotten on certain tickets. Usually it was because our local factory guys couldn't drop what they were doing to wait an hour for us to fix something, so we had to wait till they were available. Over and over, our "manager" would berate our performance, demand action, throttle our internet access, change our process every other month, generally make things as difficult as possible.

A lot of other units had figured out how to "game" the system and were making ridiculous numbers doing nothing at all, but I refused to cheat the system. I documented everything and kept trying to make our customers happy. I spent those 5 years making really good relationships with the managers in the factory, and from being generally helpful and nice, I had a lot of pull with people. One manager pulled me aside and said "Jeff, I like you. If you ever want to leave the I.T. department and come work for me, I'd love to have you." She was cool, but I was stoic and loyal to my "manager."

Then I got seriously hurt, was off of work for 2 months. I had come to my senses... I realized I was never going to make more than $15/hr fixing computers. I was going home hating my job every day.

One day, I asked the HR person off-hand what a starting tractor assembler made, with no experience. They said "$16.50. Why?"

I went straight back to my desk, called my manager, and told him in no uncertain terms that I was quitting.
Him: "You're quitting?"
Me: "Yes. I can make more money assembling tractors in the factory, with no experience, than fixing printers and replacing laptop motherboards all day with 15 years' experience. Think about that for a minute."
Him: "You do know if you quit, you can't come back?"
Me: "Don't worry, that won't happen."
Him: "....."

I'm now working for that woman that asked me to join her department... only built tractors for about 6 months before I got promoted. And now I'm a full company employee, not a contractor. Making almost $50K, and I love my job. Now I'm able to stash 25% of my income towards FI.

If I wasn't debt-free, I never would have had the guts to quit my job. We had 6 months income in the bank.

About a year into the new job, both of my upper managers were replaced... so now my managers are corporate yes-men. One of them only got the position because his old job was eliminated, so they created a management place for him. Yay.

I told them in no uncertain terms that I love my job, I had enough money to not care about working overtime, I did *not* wish to get promoted or go on salary, and I was *not* okay with all the stupidity that went with being a corporate whore. Every week or so I get the "you should have a development plan" speech, and I just tell them I'm not interested in advancement, as I will be retired before either of them.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: PloddingInsight on June 16, 2014, 08:13:17 AM
I guess I'll add my "epiphany" moment.

3 years ago, I was working in I.T. for a small-ish branch of a local manufacturer. I'd been working for about 15 years as a contract desktop support guy, and after all that, I was capped out around $28K a year, if that. Through those 15 years, my wife and I managed to go completely debt-free except our mortgage while raising 4 kids.

So at that time I was working as a contractor in Louisiana. My "manager" was a slacktard in North Carolina who oversaw a half dozen units, mostly small remote ones, like ours. I worked at that factory for 5 years, and he never once came to visit, but somehow our unit was always at the bottom of the performance scorecards. Didn't matter what I did, it was never enough. He would randomly IM me during the day and ask me why I hadn't gotten on certain tickets. Usually it was because our local factory guys couldn't drop what they were doing to wait an hour for us to fix something, so we had to wait till they were available. Over and over, our "manager" would berate our performance, demand action, throttle our internet access, change our process every other month, generally make things as difficult as possible.

A lot of other units had figured out how to "game" the system and were making ridiculous numbers doing nothing at all, but I refused to cheat the system. I documented everything and kept trying to make our customers happy. I spent those 5 years making really good relationships with the managers in the factory, and from being generally helpful and nice, I had a lot of pull with people. One manager pulled me aside and said "Jeff, I like you. If you ever want to leave the I.T. department and come work for me, I'd love to have you." She was cool, but I was stoic and loyal to my "manager."

Then I got seriously hurt, was off of work for 2 months. I had come to my senses... I realized I was never going to make more than $15/hr fixing computers. I was going home hating my job every day.

One day, I asked the HR person off-hand what a starting tractor assembler made, with no experience. They said "$16.50. Why?"

I went straight back to my desk, called my manager, and told him in no uncertain terms that I was quitting.
Him: "You're quitting?"
Me: "Yes. I can make more money assembling tractors in the factory, with no experience, than fixing printers and replacing laptop motherboards all day with 15 years' experience. Think about that for a minute."
Him: "You do know if you quit, you can't come back?"
Me: "Don't worry, that won't happen."
Him: "....."

I'm now working for that woman that asked me to join her department... only built tractors for about 6 months before I got promoted. And now I'm a full company employee, not a contractor. Making almost $50K, and I love my job. Now I'm able to stash 25% of my income towards FI.

If I wasn't debt-free, I never would have had the guts to quit my job. We had 6 months income in the bank.

About a year into the new job, both of my upper managers were replaced... so now my managers are corporate yes-men. One of them only got the position because his old job was eliminated, so they created a management place for him. Yay.

I told them in no uncertain terms that I love my job, I had enough money to not care about working overtime, I did *not* wish to get promoted or go on salary, and I was *not* okay with all the stupidity that went with being a corporate whore. Every week or so I get the "you should have a development plan" speech, and I just tell them I'm not interested in advancement, as I will be retired before either of them.

This is a great story.  Thanks for the inspiration.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Trudie on June 16, 2014, 05:29:39 PM
I read this whole thread from start to finish today.  Very inspirational and funny.

I don't have FU money yet, but I think almost everyone fantasizes about being able to tell their crappy managers off.  What strikes me about this forum is how dehumanizing and rude so many managers are.  I think this is due to the "every person for him/herself" ethic that is so pervasive in the work force.  It's the "eat or be eaten" mentality.  I manage a department at a small company.  My peers and I know that if push came to shove our general manager would throw any of us under the bus.  Especially if his future, job, or compensation were threatened.  He views us all as replaceable cogs in a wheel, but I know that he would have difficulty replacing any one of us.  He can, but it would be expensive and involve using consultants.  Since we're publicly-owned and in a small community I don't think shareholders would stand for it.  In my first month on the job he told me that "We don't really have any exceptional employees here."

My dream -- which I will never realize -- is to give him my two week notice at a difficult time (like before the audit) then basically say, "Fuck you fucker!" 

It will never happen, but it makes me laugh.  It is very likely that I will someday have the great joy of handing in my notice and making his life difficult, however.  And it will piss him off all the more because I don't NEED him, and I don't NEED the job.  Quite honestly, taking the high road and just walking out and making it clear that he doesn't have power over me and I don't owe him anything will be infinitely more satisfying.  That's liberation!


Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: DutchMustachian on June 17, 2014, 05:50:49 AM
These are all very cool FU stories, love them!

Anyone keeping a "FU resignment" letter under a shortcut on their desktop or hard-copy around at work? Just in case you'll need it and have a FU stash?
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: dragoncar on June 17, 2014, 09:00:12 AM
These are all very cool FU stories, love them!

Anyone keeping a "FU resignment" letter under a shortcut on their desktop or hard-copy around at work? Just in case you'll need it and have a FU stash?

Nope, just a bottle of jack and a parachute.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Trudie on June 17, 2014, 10:47:33 AM
These are all very cool FU stories, love them!

Anyone keeping a "FU resignment" letter under a shortcut on their desktop or hard-copy around at work? Just in case you'll need it and have a FU stash?

Nope, just a bottle of jack and a parachute.

"Just a bottle of jack and a parachute..."  Laughing my ass off at that one.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Daisy on June 17, 2014, 11:37:20 AM
Spartana has a(nother) forum to gloat, errr, inspire!  Whoopieeee!  I've been reading her gloats with envy for many years!
And now that Iris-Lily will be joining me on the darkside and into ER soon you're next!

I feel so left out. I just met you and haven't read your gloats for too long yet, but I would like to receive the ER-prodding encouragement from the Queen of Gloat for my ER in the next few years.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: marty998 on June 17, 2014, 04:40:43 PM
What strikes me about this forum is how dehumanizing and rude so many managers are. 

This is the fault of management consultants and the HR industry. Staff are not referred to as people anymore. We are simply "resources" no different than say computers.

It's less of an emotional burden to fire, allocate and restructure resources than it is to do the same with people. Another piece of evidence in favour of the idea you need to be a dispassionate, unfeeling psychopath to be a "good" executive.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: DMoney on June 17, 2014, 07:28:01 PM
Awesome thread. Enjoying reading all the stories.  Raised some good discussions with my SO this evening.

Our take aways: Neither of us are really into burning bridges, especially since we work in rather small fields.  And luckily right now have pretty good bosses.  BUT I do like the idea that FU money gives you more leverage.  For instance, I'm hoping in a year or two my SO can ask to work from home 1-2 days a week in the event we move closer to my new assignment (which would result in a long commute for him).  Reading all these posts has let me know we probably have some leverage in that request.

Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: SingleMomDebt on June 17, 2014, 08:54:36 PM
It's not epic but I have quit on a whim more-or-less and immediately walked out of the building. It was very satisfying. Nothing soothes the soul like quitting a toxic job.

Love the last sentence. And while I love my career, I can't wait for the day I can make an on-the-whim decision like that without hurting me financially.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Lifestyle Deflation on June 17, 2014, 09:01:38 PM
About ~3-4 years ago I was working at a consulting firm and working about 80-90 hours a week. The workload was flat-out ridiculous and I was also on-call 24/7. Every other night I'd get a page at 2 AM that I'd have to respond to. I was about 25 at the time and it was my first "real" job. I'd had it for 3-4 years so I was loyal and didn't rock the boat.

The biggest issue? I made about $50,000. One day I decided to look up what the average consultant in my field was making in my area. It was $100,000. I thought about it for a week or two and decided to ask my boss for a raise to $100,000, printing out the article that said what the average salary was. He made some excuses about "seniority" and other crap and gave me a raise to $55,000.

A month later, still stressed out and feeling like shit, I decided to give my 2 weeks notice without having another job lined up. I had about $10k in savings and I could not take it anymore, I was turning into an alcoholic, stressed out nightmare. After a week of decompression, I tailored my resume and started listening to offers from recruiters.

After 3 job interviews, I got 3 offers and I took a job paying $112k ($150k with bonuses). With a much better work/life balance. I work 45 hours a week today as opposed to 80 then. It was that day I realized how true it is that you have to change companies to move up in pay and in status. You can accept meager raises from one company or get yourself out there and make real money. It's a sad fact of today's corporate climate.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Spartana on June 18, 2014, 12:33:13 PM
Spartana has a(nother) forum to gloat, errr, inspire!  Whoopieeee!  I've been reading her gloats with envy for many years!
And now that Iris-Lily will be joining me on the darkside and into ER soon you're next!

I feel so left out. I just met you and haven't read your gloats for too long yet, but I would like to receive the ER-prodding encouragement from the Queen of Gloat for my ER in the next few years.
Ha Ha! I'm always happy to oblige :-)! The gloat-joke started at another forum because a guy there wanted to retire and we had a sort of poke-fun-at-each-other thing going where I would post something gloaty about early retirement and he would scream loudly :-)! Of course now he is retired and off doing all sorts of adventures - most involving travellin to various part of the world for months on end bike touring. So every few days he sends me a gloaty e-mail and now I'm the one who's screaming. Paybacks are, as they say, a bee-ach!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: arebelspy on June 18, 2014, 02:22:54 PM
No ridiculous FU money story here. Actually I had the opposite experience.

...

I stayed an additional year+ getting great experience while cutting back my hours to ~45hrs/week. It drove him crazy that he couldn't force me to work more hours or make me work on projects that I did not want to work on. However once I hit what the job marketplace considered as an acceptable amount of experience I lined up another job at a 40% pay increase in a different company and left two weeks later. No big exit, no ridiculous story, just the satisfaction that my family was significantly better off.

That's exactly what FU money is - it lets you do what you want at work.  It doesn't mean you have to say FU and have a big quitting story, but it was your cash cushion (FU money) that let you cut back to 45 hrs/week without caring what the boss thought.

Awesome story, thanks for sharing!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: jfer_rose on June 18, 2014, 02:40:30 PM
Posting for no other reason than wanting to make sure I don't miss future replies.

That said, my coworker just quit her job without having another job lined up. She said she has a year's worth of savings to get her through until she figures out what is next. I ran into her the other day and she said AirBnB rental income might even extend that time. Despite the fact she and I shared a fantastic supervisor and immediate coworkers, the work environment has been extremely stressful for all of us the past year or so. So it's very inspirational to me that she quit without knowing what she wants to do next.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: RootofGood on June 18, 2014, 02:55:31 PM
Not exactly throwing my FU money in their faces, but I got let go very suddenly and decided to call it retirement.  I didn't realize I was retired until the next day when I started crunching the numbers to make sure I'm good.  Then everyone in the office found out I had retired at 33.  That's what happens when you start a blog and facebook exists apparently. :)

 Some (like the 50-60-somethings that will never be able to retire) thought it was all a joke.  Months after I got let go, I bumped into my asshole manager that fired me.  I couldn't wipe the smug smile off my face.  When he asked what I was up to these days I just said "you know, hanging out, having a good time, catching up on some reading, playing with the kids".  Asshole manager got shit canned right after he fired me because he didn't hire the right people to replace me (the jobs I left behind were political candy to be handed out by the governor's office to faithful helpers as it turns out).
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: DeepEllumStache on June 18, 2014, 03:08:40 PM
At a company my sister worked for, they randomly announced one morning that there would be drug testing for all employees that afternoon.  More than 1/2 of the guys working at the loading dock left for lunch and never came back.  Not particularly epic but the company probably learned to not schedule across the board drug testing unless they were willing to risk losing entire departments.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Trudie on June 18, 2014, 03:31:02 PM
Really, someone could write a book on this topic.  It's that awesome.

Makes me realize, also, how many turd managers there are.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Chloe358 on June 18, 2014, 05:00:23 PM
Longtime listener, first time caller......Or long time lurker, first time poster.

No epic story just yet, but boss asks why I didn't apply for promotional opportunity.  I say well, I don't know if I want the additional hassle, and really, I'm not going to work here forever.  He says he's not either.  I tell him my plan is 5 years and I'm out.  (My boss and I are both 41).  He says well I'd like to be out of here in 5 years but it's just not possible for me.  I say nothing and he says, so it's possible for you?  I respond and said, not sure, it could be 5 1/2, could be 6, maybe 4, we'll see, but somewhere around there.  He then tells me all the reasons why unexpected things are going to happen and how that will blow my plan around, etc etc.  so I nod my head and inside I'm thinking, well if you got yourself on scorched earth you could be gone in the same time I could.   It was a nice smug feeling anyway.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Primm on June 18, 2014, 07:32:50 PM
Mine isn't my FU money (well, it kind of is) but my husbands. Several years ago he was in a really shitty job, and one closer to home and with far less stress came up. So he applied for and took it.

He is a born organiser - not like me, I might add. When doing training for his new company they recognised this and asked if he wanted to go in as manager for a storefront that needed serious restructure and help, as opposed to the one just down the street that was already functioning well. He said yes. Six months later, once he got the first place up and running nicely and got rid of the dead wood, they "offered" him a transfer to a further away location. He told them he wanted to go back to the original place they'd hired him for. Seriously, it was so close he could have walked home and back for his 1/2 hour lunch break. They told him it was the one hour commute each way place or nothing. So he chose nothing. They countered with "but you have a mortgage! And four teenage children! You can't afford that on your wife's income!"

They were sort of right - we had to cut back the 50% savings rate we were working on for the six months he was out of work (having an awesome time playing with the house and the kids, by the way. And the live-in housekeeper and chef I had - I could get used to that!). But we didn't actually use any of our savings or FU money in the end. And they certainly didn't expect the "no, actually you're wrong, I'm leaving then" response that they got.

Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Daisy on June 18, 2014, 08:18:34 PM
At a company my sister worked for, they randomly announced one morning that there would be drug testing for all employees that afternoon.  More than 1/2 of the guys working at the loading dock left for lunch and never came back.  Not particularly epic but the company probably learned to not schedule across the board drug testing unless they were willing to risk losing entire departments.

Your story reminds me of a really funny thing that happened at work once. There was a guy who was known for being not-too-bright and everyone suspected dabbled in some illegal drugs. We used to have random drug tests. Well, one morning he received notice that he had to report to the nurse's office for a random drug test that afternoon. A co-worker pulled his leg and said that not only would they do a urine test, but that they would also take a strand of his hair to test. Well, this guy goes out to lunch and comes back with a shaved head. He must have still failed the drug test because he was gone soon thereafter.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Trudie on June 18, 2014, 08:20:21 PM
Mine isn't my FU money (well, it kind of is) but my husbands. Several years ago he was in a really shitty job, and one closer to home and with far less stress came up. So he applied for and took it.

He is a born organiser - not like me, I might add. When doing training for his new company they recognised this and asked if he wanted to go in as manager for a storefront that needed serious restructure and help, as opposed to the one just down the street that was already functioning well. He said yes. Six months later, once he got the first place up and running nicely and got rid of the dead wood, they "offered" him a transfer to a further away location. He told them he wanted to go back to the original place they'd hired him for. Seriously, it was so close he could have walked home and back for his 1/2 hour lunch break. They told him it was the one hour commute each way place or nothing. So he chose nothing. They countered with "but you have a mortgage! And four teenage children! You can't afford that on your wife's income!"

They were sort of right - we had to cut back the 50% savings rate we were working on for the six months he was out of work (having an awesome time playing with the house and the kids, by the way. And the live-in housekeeper and chef I had - I could get used to that!). But we didn't actually use any of our savings or FU money in the end. And they certainly didn't expect the "no, actually you're wrong, I'm leaving then" response that they got.

Thanks for sharing this.  It's good to hear others' stories and realize that we probably have more choices than we think we do.  Makes me ponder how many decisions - including my own - are made based on fear.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Daisy on June 18, 2014, 08:22:21 PM
They told him it was the one hour commute each way place or nothing. So he chose nothing. They countered with "but you have a mortgage! And four teenage children! You can't afford that on your wife's income!"

Wow! That took a lot of nerve on their part and was very intrusive. It's like they try to use people's weaknesses to manipulate them to act as they want. I think this is exactly why FU money is needed. It should be no one's business what your financial situation is.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Primm on June 18, 2014, 11:40:33 PM
Yep, we couldn't believe they even went there. Ultimately the 6 months he took off didn't really affect our RE date because he probably avoided a hospital admission for depression, which has happened in the past. So we made less but spent less as well.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: SisterX on June 19, 2014, 11:39:54 AM
I just realized, the most epic FU money story I've ever heard of is my brother's.  It's more of an FU to life than work.  He had a series of unfortunate life events coincide: his longtime girlfriend left him (from what I hear, he basically proposed and she said, "Actually, no, see ya") so he had to move out of the apartment they'd been sharing.  Then he lost his job due to layoffs (in 2009).  Then he turned 30 while living with our parents, jobless and girlfriendless.  He said "Fuck life, I'm out."  Planned a giant trip, mostly by bicycle, and left for the next year.  (If you want to read the whole thing, he kept a blog: http://myliferebooted.blogspot.com/2009_06_01_archive.html.  Just don't mind the spelling errors, he's always been terrible at that!)  It was seriously badass, and I'm still jealous that he did this.

At the time when I told people what he was doing they almost always said, "How can he afford that?!"  I was like, "Um, he saved money while he had a job?"  If you're wondering about the finances, he did it on significantly less than $30,000, because that was the money he set aside for this and he came back with enough to live on for a bit.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: payitoff on June 19, 2014, 12:21:08 PM
I just realized, the most epic FU money story I've ever heard of is my brother's.  It's more of an FU to life than work.  He had a series of unfortunate life events coincide: his longtime girlfriend left him (from what I hear, he basically proposed and she said, "Actually, no, see ya") so he had to move out of the apartment they'd been sharing.  Then he lost his job due to layoffs (in 2009).  Then he turned 30 while living with our parents, jobless and girlfriendless.  He said "Fuck life, I'm out."  Planned a giant trip, mostly by bicycle, and left for the next year.  (If you want to read the whole thing, he kept a blog: http://myliferebooted.blogspot.com/2009_06_01_archive.html.  Just don't mind the spelling errors, he's always been terrible at that!)  It was seriously badass, and I'm still jealous that he did this.

At the time when I told people what he was doing they almost always said, "How can he afford that?!"  I was like, "Um, he saved money while he had a job?"  If you're wondering about the finances, he did it on significantly less than $30,000, because that was the money he set aside for this and he came back with enough to live on for a bit.

EPIC! just scrolled through the blog and that is some priceless experience.. good for him!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Wolf_Stache on June 19, 2014, 01:46:16 PM
I just realized, the most epic FU money story I've ever heard of is my brother's.  It's more of an FU to life than work.  He had a series of unfortunate life events coincide: his longtime girlfriend left him (from what I hear, he basically proposed and she said, "Actually, no, see ya") so he had to move out of the apartment they'd been sharing.  Then he lost his job due to layoffs (in 2009).  Then he turned 30 while living with our parents, jobless and girlfriendless.  He said "Fuck life, I'm out."  Planned a giant trip, mostly by bicycle, and left for the next year.  (If you want to read the whole thing, he kept a blog: http://myliferebooted.blogspot.com/2009_06_01_archive.html.  Just don't mind the spelling errors, he's always been terrible at that!)  It was seriously badass, and I'm still jealous that he did this.

At the time when I told people what he was doing they almost always said, "How can he afford that?!"  I was like, "Um, he saved money while he had a job?"  If you're wondering about the finances, he did it on significantly less than $30,000, because that was the money he set aside for this and he came back with enough to live on for a bit.

Ok, this is awesome! I've been reading his blog, not very far yet, but I'm jealous. Is he still single? LOL
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: jordanread on June 19, 2014, 04:11:15 PM
I was originally going to just comment because I keep missing the updates, but realized something kind of cool.

I've never (until recently) had FU money, but I've always had a kind of life rule where "If I don't like what I'm doing, I do something else or go somewhere else).
One job I had when I was 17 (fast food). The money didn't bug me, but it was really soul crushing. Decided I was done. Turned in my two weeks at the beginning of the shift. The manager was extremely surprised because apparently nobody every did that while making minimum wage. Got put on shitty duty, and I realized that this is how the next two weeks were going to be. Walked up to her and told her I made a mistake. She got all smug and said I could stay. I looked at her, and said "Oh no. I just meant that even though that letter said two week notice, it was more like a two minute warning..." I know I stole that from somewhere, but it was still fun.
Had another job the next day.
Another time I worked as the lead baker. Fun work, biked in, and was on my own until about 6am when everyone else showed up. After some changes in management, they screwed up my check (by shorting me about 50%). I asked the new management what I needed to do to get it fixed, and they said deal with it. As I walked out, I accidentally had my knife open, and cut a 50lb bag of flour open...in front of a giant fan...that was on.

Those were fun, but not a huge deal. However, my most recent position was a bit more serious. I worked at a really cool cable company. Worked my way into a junior application dev role, and slowly worked my way up until I was a full developer with 6 years of professional experience. Lot's of reorganization happened, and the company turned into something like a shinier version of comcast...not pleasant. My boss left, followed shortly thereafter by the rest of my department. New boss came in, and while he was a good politician, not that great at anything else...like managing, or technology, or being smart. I knew I should leave, but was scared to death. I was making like $45K/year!!! I'd be stupid to give that up!! At this time, I also had just found MMM and read every article, plus I had my old boss cheering me on, saying that I was worth a lot more than what I was getting. Thought about looking, so I brushed off the resume, and got the sense of what my skill set was actually worth. The boss called me in, and said (since I was the only one left) that I was invaluable, and they would like to offer me a substantial raise...to $50K.
I realized that invaluable wasn't the right word, and that I wasn't valued at all. I immediately turned in my two weeks notice. 3 days later I got an offer doing work that was really fun, for a substantially larger amount.

So not necessarily an FU money story, but more of an anecdote about how much fear can cost you. You don't even need FU money per se to do the math and know that you'll be okay. FIRE date is within 6 years now, since I almost completely avoided the lifestyle inflation aspect of getting more money.

I'll never forget the day I shot myself in the face with MMM's optimism gun (http://www.mrmoneymustache.com/2012/10/03/the-practical-benefits-of-outrageous-optimism/), and got free from that fear.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: SisterX on June 19, 2014, 04:40:36 PM
I just realized, the most epic FU money story I've ever heard of is my brother's.  It's more of an FU to life than work.  He had a series of unfortunate life events coincide: his longtime girlfriend left him (from what I hear, he basically proposed and she said, "Actually, no, see ya") so he had to move out of the apartment they'd been sharing.  Then he lost his job due to layoffs (in 2009).  Then he turned 30 while living with our parents, jobless and girlfriendless.  He said "Fuck life, I'm out."  Planned a giant trip, mostly by bicycle, and left for the next year.  (If you want to read the whole thing, he kept a blog: http://myliferebooted.blogspot.com/2009_06_01_archive.html.  Just don't mind the spelling errors, he's always been terrible at that!)  It was seriously badass, and I'm still jealous that he did this.

At the time when I told people what he was doing they almost always said, "How can he afford that?!"  I was like, "Um, he saved money while he had a job?"  If you're wondering about the finances, he did it on significantly less than $30,000, because that was the money he set aside for this and he came back with enough to live on for a bit.

Ok, this is awesome! I've been reading his blog, not very far yet, but I'm jealous. Is he still single? LOL

Actually, yes he is!  Broke up with another girlfriend a few months ago, albeit on friendlier terms.  And, he lives in Seattle!  I've sometimes thought about trying to set him up with a Seattle Mustachian....
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: arebelspy on June 19, 2014, 05:17:22 PM
I was originally going to just comment because I keep missing the updates, but realized something kind of cool.

I've never (until recently) had FU money, but I've always had a kind of life rule where "If I don't like what I'm doing, I do something else or go somewhere else).
One job I had when I was 17 (fast food). The money didn't bug me, but it was really soul crushing. Decided I was done. Turned in my two weeks at the beginning of the shift. The manager was extremely surprised because apparently nobody every did that while making minimum wage. Got put on shitty duty, and I realized that this is how the next two weeks were going to be. Walked up to her and told her I made a mistake. She got all smug and said I could stay. I looked at her, and said "Oh no. I just meant that even though that letter said two week notice, it was more like a two minute warning..." I know I stole that from somewhere, but it was still fun.
Had another job the next day.
Another time I worked as the lead baker. Fun work, biked in, and was on my own until about 6am when everyone else showed up. After some changes in management, they screwed up my check (by shorting me about 50%). I asked the new management what I needed to do to get it fixed, and they said deal with it. As I walked out, I accidentally had my knife open, and cut a 50lb bag of flour open...in front of a giant fan...that was on.

Those were fun, but not a huge deal. However, my most recent position was a bit more serious. I worked at a really cool cable company. Worked my way into a junior application dev role, and slowly worked my way up until I was a full developer with 6 years of professional experience. Lot's of reorganization happened, and the company turned into something like a shinier version of comcast...not pleasant. My boss left, followed shortly thereafter by the rest of my department. New boss came in, and while he was a good politician, not that great at anything else...like managing, or technology, or being smart. I new I should leave, but was scared to death. I was making like $45K/year!!! I'd be stupid to give that up!! At this time, I also had just found MMM and read every article, plus I had my old boss cheering me on, saying that I was worth a lot more than what I was getting. Thought about looking, so I brushed off the resume, and got the sense of what my skill set was actually worth. The boss called me in, and said (since I was the only one left) that I was invaluable, and they would like to offer me a substantial raise...to $50K.
I realized that invaluable wasn't the right word, and that I wasn't valued at all. I immediately turned in my two weeks notice. 3 days later I got an offer doing work that was really fun, for a substantially larger amount.

So not necessarily an FU money story, but more of an anecdote about how much fear can cost you. You don't even need FU money per se to do the math and know that you'll be okay. FIRE date is within 6 years now, since I almost completely avoided the lifestyle inflation aspect of getting more money.

I'll never forget the day I shot myself in the face with MMM's optimism gun (http://www.mrmoneymustache.com/2012/10/03/the-practical-benefits-of-outrageous-optimism/), and got free from that fear.

Love it!  Those first two are fun, but that third one is life changing. Awesome!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Spartana on June 19, 2014, 05:24:33 PM
OK I though of a semi-FU story. I worked for a government agency and we consolidated with several others but kept in the lead position  as far as who managed what. I headed my own very small dept. When we consolidated, we were told everyone's hours where changing. I refused to change my hours. Just said "no" and kept coming in at the same time I always did. Did this for awhile with them constantly telling me I couldn't do that. I just said that I hired on at those hours and would work those hours. If that wasn't acceptable then they would have to fire me. They didn't and I just continued on working my same old hours until I quit a year or 2 later.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: zataks on June 19, 2014, 05:55:23 PM
OK I though of a semi-FU story. I worked for a government agency and we consolidated with several others but kept in the lead position  as far as who managed what. I headed my own very small dept. When we consolidated, we were told everyone's hours where changing. I refused to change my hours. Just said "no" and kept coming in at the same time I always did. Did this for awhile with them constantly telling me I couldn't do that. I just said that I hired on at those hours and would work those hours. If that wasn't acceptable then they would have to fire me. They didn't and I just continued on working my same old hours until I quit a year or 2 later.

"I'd prefer not to," may be a bit more apt.  =)
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: arebelspy on June 19, 2014, 06:32:49 PM
OK I though of a semi-FU story. I worked for a government agency and we consolidated with several others but kept in the lead position  as far as who managed what. I headed my own very small dept. When we consolidated, we were told everyone's hours where changing. I refused to change my hours. Just said "no" and kept coming in at the same time I always did. Did this for awhile with them constantly telling me I couldn't do that. I just said that I hired on at those hours and would work those hours. If that wasn't acceptable then they would have to fire me. They didn't and I just continued on working my same old hours until I quit a year or 2 later.

Nice.  It may have hurt your "reviews" or ability to get a glowing recommendation, but if you're not worried about that and are confident in your ability to find a job (which you should be - too many people are scared, rather than confident), then that's the perfect way to handle that.

"I was hired under X, I will continue, if you don't like it, fire me."  Love it. :D
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Wolf_Stache on June 19, 2014, 09:46:13 PM
I just realized, the most epic FU money story I've ever heard of is my brother's.  It's more of an FU to life than work.  He had a series of unfortunate life events coincide: his longtime girlfriend left him (from what I hear, he basically proposed and she said, "Actually, no, see ya") so he had to move out of the apartment they'd been sharing.  Then he lost his job due to layoffs (in 2009).  Then he turned 30 while living with our parents, jobless and girlfriendless.  He said "Fuck life, I'm out."  Planned a giant trip, mostly by bicycle, and left for the next year.  (If you want to read the whole thing, he kept a blog: http://myliferebooted.blogspot.com/2009_06_01_archive.html.  Just don't mind the spelling errors, he's always been terrible at that!)  It was seriously badass, and I'm still jealous that he did this.

At the time when I told people what he was doing they almost always said, "How can he afford that?!"  I was like, "Um, he saved money while he had a job?"  If you're wondering about the finances, he did it on significantly less than $30,000, because that was the money he set aside for this and he came back with enough to live on for a bit.

Ok, this is awesome! I've been reading his blog, not very far yet, but I'm jealous. Is he still single? LOL

Actually, yes he is!  Broke up with another girlfriend a few months ago, albeit on friendlier terms.  And, he lives in Seattle!  I've sometimes thought about trying to set him up with a Seattle Mustachian....

I've been reading his blog. Up through his arrival in London. Sounds like an awesome trip! I've dreamed of doing something smaller down the Pacific coast (N. Cali down the coast). I looked at a tour group that did the ride, but even in my pre-mmm days I thought the price was too steep.

I need to hook up with some other bicyclists in the city. my ex was so inactive, and we did so few things together anyway, that I didn't want to add another activity that I did alone. But now that I'm single, I'd love to join a cycling group up here! In Salt Lake I rode with a group called the Sugarhouse Cyclists. We were just a group of people that would go out on group rides all over the city. Loved it!

If you think he'd be up for it, I'd love to meet, even if its just to discuss cycling in the city!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Spartana on June 20, 2014, 12:09:07 AM
OK I though of a semi-FU story. I worked for a government agency and we consolidated with several others but kept in the lead position  as far as who managed what. I headed my own very small dept. When we consolidated, we were told everyone's hours where changing. I refused to change my hours. Just said "no" and kept coming in at the same time I always did. Did this for awhile with them constantly telling me I couldn't do that. I just said that I hired on at those hours and would work those hours. If that wasn't acceptable then they would have to fire me. They didn't and I just continued on working my same old hours until I quit a year or 2 later.

Nice.  It may have hurt your "reviews" or ability to get a glowing recommendation, but if you're not worried about that and are confident in your ability to find a job (which you should be - too many people are scared, rather than confident), then that's the perfect way to handle that.

"I was hired under X, I will continue, if you don't like it, fire me."  Love it. :D
Just glad I had keys and the security code to get in there or I would have had to start later like everyone else :-)!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Insanity on June 20, 2014, 04:54:49 AM
I just realized, the most epic FU money story I've ever heard of is my brother's.  It's more of an FU to life than work.  He had a series of unfortunate life events coincide: his longtime girlfriend left him (from what I hear, he basically proposed and she said, "Actually, no, see ya") so he had to move out of the apartment they'd been sharing.  Then he lost his job due to layoffs (in 2009).  Then he turned 30 while living with our parents, jobless and girlfriendless.  He said "Fuck life, I'm out."  Planned a giant trip, mostly by bicycle, and left for the next year.  (If you want to read the whole thing, he kept a blog: http://myliferebooted.blogspot.com/2009_06_01_archive.html.  Just don't mind the spelling errors, he's always been terrible at that!)  It was seriously badass, and I'm still jealous that he did this.

At the time when I told people what he was doing they almost always said, "How can he afford that?!"  I was like, "Um, he saved money while he had a job?"  If you're wondering about the finances, he did it on significantly less than $30,000, because that was the money he set aside for this and he came back with enough to live on for a bit.

Ok, this is awesome! I've been reading his blog, not very far yet, but I'm jealous. Is he still single? LOL

Actually, yes he is!  Broke up with another girlfriend a few months ago, albeit on friendlier terms.  And, he lives in Seattle!  I've sometimes thought about trying to set him up with a Seattle Mustachian....

I've been reading his blog. Up through his arrival in London. Sounds like an awesome trip! I've dreamed of doing something smaller down the Pacific coast (N. Cali down the coast). I looked at a tour group that did the ride, but even in my pre-mmm days I thought the price was too steep.

I need to hook up with some other bicyclists in the city. my ex was so inactive, and we did so few things together anyway, that I didn't want to add another activity that I did alone. But now that I'm single, I'd love to join a cycling group up here! In Salt Lake I rode with a group called the Sugarhouse Cyclists. We were just a group of people that would go out on group rides all over the city. Loved it!

If you think he'd be up for it, I'd love to meet, even if its just to discuss cycling in the city!

A friend of mine, isn't really an FU story because he would go back to where he worked, just took 3 months off (he is a contractor so essentially he terminated the contract) to bike cross country.  He lives in Philly, but is blogging about it.  I'm jealous.  Number 1, I wish I had the health and ability to do it.  Number 2, I wish I had the time.  I don't want to be away from my kids that long.  My wife and the would have to follow by car or something. My wife doesn't like to ride.

If you ever have the time, do it.  The stories about the ride are amazing.  The scenery (he's riding through the blue ridge mountains, the colorado mountains).  4300 miles in all.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: oldtoyota on June 20, 2014, 05:58:50 AM

I do know of an EPIC quitting story but I got screwed in the process. I bought a motorcycle from a guy who said the title was in his truck and he would get it for me that night. I stupidly believed him and he never gave me the title. He wouldn't answer his phone when I called. He worked at Walmart and one time I spoofed the caller ID so it looked like Walmart was calling. He answered but gave more excuses. A few months later he went into Walmart and shot his boss in the chest with a 44 Mag (he lived) and holed up in the bathroom until cops came. I had to part that bike out on ebay.

You got screwed? What about the guy who got shot? He had it a bit worse than you.

What if the guy had never owned the bike and you were selling stolen parts?

Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Basenji on June 20, 2014, 06:02:53 AM
OK I though of a semi-FU story. I worked for a government agency and we consolidated with several others but kept in the lead position  as far as who managed what. I headed my own very small dept. When we consolidated, we were told everyone's hours where changing. I refused to change my hours. Just said "no" and kept coming in at the same time I always did. Did this for awhile with them constantly telling me I couldn't do that. I just said that I hired on at those hours and would work those hours. If that wasn't acceptable then they would have to fire me. They didn't and I just continued on working my same old hours until I quit a year or 2 later.

"I'd prefer not to,"may be a bit more apt.  =)
Oh hell yeah Bartleby!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: oldtoyota on June 20, 2014, 06:10:45 AM


What kind of mumbo jumbo is that?

In what country do you get un/employment insurance benefits if you quit?  Neither the US nor Canada offers this as far as I'm aware and there are sound policy reasons for not doing so.  The exception is if you can demonstrate you were constructively dismissed.

Now, as far as "asshole managers", in my experience sometimes asshole managers are really fine managers with an asshole employee. It is hard to know without hearing the other side.

In the case where a manager is really unreasonably difficult/harassing they will contravene employment standards and/or human rights protections and you can quit and claim constructive dismissal.  There are often complaints processes that can be accessed in these circumstances as well.

Just meaning to say that since is difficult to quit, employer could use that to enforce a certain stress/abuse because they know that the people CAN'T quit, since they must work to survive paycheck to paycheck.
btw, in most countries in europe you get a unemployment subsidy (if you have worked long enough to have right for) the moment you apply for it: it doesn't matter why you are jobless (even if you quit), just that you are jobless. But many people seek a new job immediately, since the longest you stay on subsidy, the harder it is to find a job since employer will find strange that you are getting the subsidy for so long, and prefer someone else.


I would like to move into the Dream World Totoro describes. I've never seen a company give a lick about a bad boss. If a boss has half a brain, they are not going to put anything bad in writing and they can easily get around being caught in the act. Even in a case when a boss is caught in the act--banging on the office door of an employee while yelling, for instance--I've seen nothing done.





Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: dude on June 20, 2014, 06:31:22 AM
OK I though of a semi-FU story. I worked for a government agency and we consolidated with several others but kept in the lead position  as far as who managed what. I headed my own very small dept. When we consolidated, we were told everyone's hours where changing. I refused to change my hours. Just said "no" and kept coming in at the same time I always did. Did this for awhile with them constantly telling me I couldn't do that. I just said that I hired on at those hours and would work those hours. If that wasn't acceptable then they would have to fire me. They didn't and I just continued on working my same old hours until I quit a year or 2 later.

At the risk of being labeled one of those lazy, un-fireable government employees (I'm not), I do have to say that the mere presence in the government workforce of numerous employees who should have been fired years ago but haven't been, kinda gives me a sense of security akin to FU money security.  I mean, so long as I don't do drugs and don't commit any serious crimes, it's pretty fucking hard to get fired here.  But on the flip-side, those golden handcuffs (i.e., the generous LEO pension) keep me here no matter how dull or uninspiring my job is (and it is at times just that), so not having the freedom to just walk away on a whim can be a little stifling at times too.  But I can see the light at the end of the tunnel (and it ain't an oncoming train) just less than 5 years away . . .
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Judith681 on June 20, 2014, 10:24:39 AM
Great to hear these stories. I myself do not have too much FU money but enough to last 6 months maybe.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: HawkeyeNFO on June 20, 2014, 11:14:19 AM
OK I though of a semi-FU story. I worked for a government agency and we consolidated with several others but kept in the lead position  as far as who managed what. I headed my own very small dept. When we consolidated, we were told everyone's hours where changing. I refused to change my hours. Just said "no" and kept coming in at the same time I always did. Did this for awhile with them constantly telling me I couldn't do that. I just said that I hired on at those hours and would work those hours. If that wasn't acceptable then they would have to fire me. They didn't and I just continued on working my same old hours until I quit a year or 2 later.

At the risk of being labeled one of those lazy, un-fireable government employees (I'm not), I do have to say that the mere presence in the government workforce of numerous employees who should have been fired years ago but haven't been, kinda gives me a sense of security akin to FU money security.  I mean, so long as I don't do drugs and don't commit any serious crimes, it's pretty fucking hard to get fired here.  But on the flip-side, those golden handcuffs (i.e., the generous LEO pension) keep me here no matter how dull or uninspiring my job is (and it is at times just that), so not having the freedom to just walk away on a whim can be a little stifling at times too.  But I can see the light at the end of the tunnel (and it ain't an oncoming train) just less than 5 years away . . .
SO FUCKING TRUE!!!!  I'm at the Pentagon, and have run out of fingers counting the people who don't even show up to work but continue to geta a full paycheck.  One guy disappearred for over 3 months, and showed up this past Christmas Eve smelling like a distillery.  Sure, they sent him to rehab twice since then, but he is still getting paid.  Another lady had the NCIS investigating here whereabouts, because she never showed up to work over about a 6 month period.  And this doesn't even cover the people who come to work and do nothing.  As for me, I try my best to get the job done, but my office breeds an unhealthy work ethic because all the BS that is tolerated, and the fact that quality work is rewarded with more work, while the slackers earn the same as everyone else.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Spartana on June 20, 2014, 01:03:58 PM
OK I though of a semi-FU story. I worked for a government agency and we consolidated with several others but kept in the lead position  as far as who managed what. I headed my own very small dept. When we consolidated, we were told everyone's hours where changing. I refused to change my hours. Just said "no" and kept coming in at the same time I always did. Did this for awhile with them constantly telling me I couldn't do that. I just said that I hired on at those hours and would work those hours. If that wasn't acceptable then they would have to fire me. They didn't and I just continued on working my same old hours until I quit a year or 2 later.

At the risk of being labeled one of those lazy, un-fireable government employees (I'm not), I do have to say that the mere presence in the government workforce of numerous employees who should have been fired years ago but haven't been, kinda gives me a sense of security akin to FU money security.  I mean, so long as I don't do drugs and don't commit any serious crimes, it's pretty fucking hard to get fired here.  But on the flip-side, those golden handcuffs (i.e., the generous LEO pension) keep me here no matter how dull or uninspiring my job is (and it is at times just that), so not having the freedom to just walk away on a whim can be a little stifling at times too.  But I can see the light at the end of the tunnel (and it ain't an oncoming train) just less than 5 years away . . .
Well quitting was a hard decision to make as a govmint employee. Having to give up those long grueling lunch hours and donut and nap breaks was tough :-)! But seriously, yes it was a tough choice knowing that if I just stayed an extra 8 years until I was 50 I'd have a much bigger pension and if I stayed an additional 5 years beyond that I'd have low cost medical, but I was done so flew the coop. Best decision I made I think.  Now I can nap and eat donuts when ever I want, and take even longer lunches then ever before :-)!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Stache In Training on June 20, 2014, 11:16:01 PM
So I have an FU Money story that is about to happen.  I won't give too many details, just in case someone from my work reads this forum (though I doubt it).  So I'll provide more details when I have given my notice.

So I currently work at a very anti-mustachian job/company, with a gravely micro-manager owner.  Luckily my immediate supervisor is better, but he is micro-managed a ton, so it trickles down.  Within 2 weeks, I'm going to be giving my two-week notice, with no job lined up (more on what I'll be doing later). 

Everyone who works there is very money oriented; as am I, being a mustachian, although I'm sure you can imagine it's the opposite, because they want more money in order to spend more, as opposed to I am money oriented to achieve FIRE.  So I can't wait to see if I get the, "Wait, you're lying.  Where are you headed?"  Or "How will you make ends meet?"  They have no idea I have FU Money, and don't actually need the job.

So while it's not going to be as awesome as a story as "you want me to do what?! nah, I quit."  It'll still be sweet to flaunt it!  And it probably wouldn't be happening without MMM and me building up some FU money!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Self-employed-swami on June 21, 2014, 12:25:41 AM
Mine isn't a quitting story, but I once took a 1 month unpaid medical leave, partially to see if my job was the main cause of my depression, and weigh my options.  I got a doctor's note, and the owners were reasonably decent about it (still paid my healthcare while I was gone).  When I returned after my month off, one of my bitchy co-workers asked me how I could afford to take a month off work, without pay, since we had just bought a house the year before, and my husband was in school full time.  I told her I had ~$138,000 in the bank, and she didn't even know what to say, other than 'oh'. 

I left that place a few months later, to become self employed.  The straw that broke this camel's back, was when I was told that I would be in charge of cleaning the client kitchen, in an e-mail, CCed to the rest of the company, from one of the owners.  I was a professional scientist, and the receptionist had always been responsible for the kitchen duties.  The reason I was being assigned them, was as a weird punishment for an ill-timed joke to one of the owners, during lunch, in the staff kitchen. 

I asked my manger if he had a few minutes, and I told him that I wouldn't be back in the new year (it was December 3rd or so).  He understood, and wished me well.  I consulted with a lawyer about filing a constructive dismissal lawsuit against them, but decided that it wasn't worth my time or energy (they had been sued before, and were very leery of it happening again).  I worked a few more days, before they decided to escort me out, and pay me for the month.  And since the Christmas gifts were already ordered, I also got a nice e-reader as a parting gift, along with the smug satisfaction of knowing that I won't ever have to work for someone like that again (if I ever decide to end my self-employment stint).
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Zamboni on June 21, 2014, 03:51:29 PM
^As a female scientist being told to clean the kitchen, unless male colleagues were also being assigned kitchen duty, you had a sexual harassment case to file, not just a constructive dismissal case.  That aside, I'm glad things are working out for you.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Self-employed-swami on June 21, 2014, 04:05:49 PM
It has been 4 years, and I am glad everyday that I left when I did.

Thank you for your kind words, I had never thought of it like that.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Latwell on June 21, 2014, 06:19:55 PM
Not an FU money story but recently put my manager in his place.

I work for a small firm (10 employees during the summer, 7 in the winter). The owner is in his very late 60s. Many people who work for the firm (or have left recently) are concerned about my bossss age. My coworkers are afraid of "the unknown". My senior coworker and my manager have work for my boss forever.

My boss hasn't made any clear indications as to when he plans on retiring and/or what will happen to the business afterwards. My manager has made it clear that he does not want to take over the business. At this time, he is the only qualified person to take it over.  Every so often my manager tries to talk about my boss doing succession planning. This is followed by my boss telling my manager, "if you are concerned about the business, write me a check and it is yours". That shuts my manager up for a bit.

My manager has become increasingly annoying about the topic. He will come in my office and spend an hour telling me that we should have a meeting with my boss. He thinks I should be the one to voice the concerns because he thinks my boss "likes me the best" and if my manager mentions anything it just turns into an argument.

I tried to tell my manager that I didn't feel comfortable to have a meeting and be the one to put things on the table when my manager and senior worker have worked for my boss 20 years compared to my 3 years.

A month ago, my manager tried to talk to me again about the topic. I stopped him and pointed out that I will not be the person to discuss the topic with my boss. I explained that the only people who need to be concerned are the workers who feel as if they do not have other options. I went on to tell him that I am more than capable of finding a new employer and it won't take long. I have options. If he doesn't have options, he should start working towards creating options.

He hasn't brought it up since, even now that my boss is getting a surgery.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Wolf_Stache on June 22, 2014, 08:32:33 AM
Not an FU money story but recently put my manager in his place.

I work for a small firm (10 employees during the summer, 7 in the winter). The owner is in his very late 60s. Many people who work for the firm (or have left recently) are concerned about my bossss age. My coworkers are afraid of "the unknown". My senior coworker and my manager have work for my boss forever.

My boss hasn't made any clear indications as to when he plans on retiring and/or what will happen to the business afterwards. My manager has made it clear that he does not want to take over the business. At this time, he is the only qualified person to take it over.  Every so often my manager tries to talk about my boss doing succession planning. This is followed by my boss telling my manager, "if you are concerned about the business, write me a check and it is yours". That shuts my manager up for a bit.

My manager has become increasingly annoying about the topic. He will come in my office and spend an hour telling me that we should have a meeting with my boss. He thinks I should be the one to voice the concerns because he thinks my boss "likes me the best" and if my manager mentions anything it just turns into an argument.

I tried to tell my manager that I didn't feel comfortable to have a meeting and be the one to put things on the table when my manager and senior worker have worked for my boss 20 years compared to my 3 years.

A month ago, my manager tried to talk to me again about the topic. I stopped him and pointed out that I will not be the person to discuss the topic with my boss. I explained that the only people who need to be concerned are the workers who feel as if they do not have other options. I went on to tell him that I am more than capable of finding a new employer and it won't take long. I have options. If he doesn't have options, he should start working towards creating options.

He hasn't brought it up since, even now that my boss is getting a surgery.

Nice way to put it!

I currently work for a small business owned by two older men - one is around 70 something, the other is Japanese and honestly I can't tell how old he is (I know he is over 50 because we had a bday party for him last week, but that is the most I know). One owner had a stroke last October. He has done really well in recovery, but who knows if they have any succession plans in place.

However, as you said above, I'm not too worried. I'm employable - everyone needs accountants/CPAs - and I know if anything does happen I can easily take my time to find another job.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Latwell on June 22, 2014, 02:25:20 PM
Not an FU money story but recently put my manager in his place.

I work for a small firm (10 employees during the summer, 7 in the winter). The owner is in his very late 60s. Many people who work for the firm (or have left recently) are concerned about my bossss age. My coworkers are afraid of "the unknown". My senior coworker and my manager have work for my boss forever.

My boss hasn't made any clear indications as to when he plans on retiring and/or what will happen to the business afterwards. My manager has made it clear that he does not want to take over the business. At this time, he is the only qualified person to take it over.  Every so often my manager tries to talk about my boss doing succession planning. This is followed by my boss telling my manager, "if you are concerned about the business, write me a check and it is yours". That shuts my manager up for a bit.

My manager has become increasingly annoying about the topic. He will come in my office and spend an hour telling me that we should have a meeting with my boss. He thinks I should be the one to voice the concerns because he thinks my boss "likes me the best" and if my manager mentions anything it just turns into an argument.

I tried to tell my manager that I didn't feel comfortable to have a meeting and be the one to put things on the table when my manager and senior worker have worked for my boss 20 years compared to my 3 years.

A month ago, my manager tried to talk to me again about the topic. I stopped him and pointed out that I will not be the person to discuss the topic with my boss. I explained that the only people who need to be concerned are the workers who feel as if they do not have other options. I went on to tell him that I am more than capable of finding a new employer and it won't take long. I have options. If he doesn't have options, he should start working towards creating options.

He hasn't brought it up since, even now that my boss is getting a surgery.

Nice way to put it!

I currently work for a small business owned by two older men - one is around 70 something, the other is Japanese and honestly I can't tell how old he is (I know he is over 50 because we had a bday party for him last week, but that is the most I know). One owner had a stroke last October. He has done really well in recovery, but who knows if they have any succession plans in place.

However, as you said above, I'm not too worried. I'm employable - everyone needs accountants/CPAs - and I know if anything does happen I can easily take my time to find another job.

That is exactly what I'm working on, my CPA. And because I work in audit, I can always work for one of my clients or in my client's field if needed (which is always tempting because my salary would double but their job isn't what I want to do just yet).
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: mercenary on June 23, 2014, 04:53:34 AM
So this story kinda comes out of a financial disaster.  Some folks here might not agree with what happend and the way I handled the situation but here goes....

So at the beginning of 2008, my wife and I were in financial ruin.  I had just lost my high paying mill job, had large amounts of consumer credit debt, and no savings to speak of. Bankruptcy was inevitable at this time and by May we had declared insolvency.  I'm a certified Millwright but work in that field was pretty limited at the time. I also hold a class 1 (CDL) drivers license.  I found a job driving a truck in Alberta's oil patch by the end of July of 2008.

Right off the hop I knew that I was going to have problems working here.  Under the rules of bankrupty you could only earn so much money.  If you made over a certain amount, you had to pay half of that towards your creditors.  I began to save that other half in earnest.

So this company....which is a big player in Alberta's oil patch...played fast and loose with the rules of trucking and the rules of safety...IMO.  It was common for drivers to work all day in the shop and then get dispatched out to a 10-15-20 hour job right at the end of the work day.  Under the trucking rules, you needed to declare all shop time as hours worked, not driving....which counted towards your overall hours worked in a day.  These clowns told all of us not to mark in those hours worked but to instead mark them as time off.  That's a big no no in trucking but no one seemed to care.  They also had non qualified workers performing brake jobs, bearing changes and all sorts of other repairs that required a certified tradesperson to perform.

So I kinda just kept my head down and mouth shut until one particular day when I was asked to go into a confined space.  There are all sorts of safety rules that dictate what sorts of steps you need to perform in order to ensure safety for the workers entering the confined space.  I won't go into them here....but I am well versed in what they are from my years spent working in mills.  Anyway...I refused to do the job.  My boss just explodes in anger in front of me and a couple other guys.  He gets really mad and basically accuses me of being a lazy ass who is trying to skip out on the work.  I told him that I had lots of experience in this area and I'd be happy to go over the proper rules with him but he was having none of it.  He took me off the job and told me to go home.  So I did.  Head down....mouth shut.

Skip forward to the middle of winter.  Some folks here might know that in order to travel down many industrial roads in this neck of the woods you need to chain up the drive wheels on the trucks for traction.  These chains are heavy and awkward to deal with.  Well...long story short I end up tweaking a muscle in my back which takes me out of commission for quite a while.  My boss tells me to take a few days off and see how I feel then.  Screw that. I'm off to the doctor.  The doctor does his thing and he wants me to take a month off work.  I show up back at work with all the doctor's notes and stuff and my boss basically says they don't put much stock in what the doctor's say and he wants me back in the truck the next day.  Again screw that.  Doctors orders.  I take a month off.  My back is still pretty sore by the end of the month so I head back to the doctor and he wants me on light duty for another month.  I head back out to work and MY boss is out for lunch.  HIS boss asks me "What are you doing here?"  I told him that I'm back to work light duty for a month.  He says to me that my boss told him that I quit.  I said I definitely didn't quit and here's all my medical records as proof.  My boss gets back to work and gets reamed out...but not fired over this incident.  It's at this point I know my days are numbered.

So I do a month of light duty work in the shop.  Basic clean up and some light filing.  All in all...just busy work while I'm healing up.  I go back to the doc and get a clean bill of health and am cleared to go back driving the truck.....which I do the next day.  By now I've worked here for 10 months.  In that time I've saved up around 10 grand in cash.  It was tough...but the only way I could do it was because of our bankruptcy.  Remember....I could have saved up 20K but half of that money went to my creditors...which I really didn't mind...as it was my fault I got so far in debt with no emergency funds.  Anyway...I've worked for these guys for 10 rough months and was sticking it out with no intentions of quitting or anything like that.  One day after a job I'm back at the shop running my truck through the truck wash.  My boss comes out and tells me he needs to see me in his office.  Off I go and when I get to his office....he's not there....but there is a nice, shiny layoff notice with my name on it sitting on his desk.  I sit back with a big grin on my face.  Sure I wasn't going to quit....but I didn't like working there anyway.  Besides...with the layoff I qualified for unemployment benefits right away.  So he comes in to the office with the HR person and explains that times are slow and they have to let some guys go.  I'm happy and it shows.  Due to the short notice, they owe me a severance AND all my holiday pay.  I walked out of that office with 10k in the bank, a check for 3500 dollars in holiday pay and severance and a big happy smile on my face.  Sure...some of that money had to go to my creditors due to the bankruptcy but with that 10k nest egg, severance, and unemployment benefits I was able to take my sweet time finding a mcuh better job....with better management :)

All in all...it worked out OK.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: warfreak2 on June 23, 2014, 08:46:40 AM
Under the trucking rules, you needed to declare all shop time as hours worked, not driving....which counted towards your overall hours worked in a day.  These clowns told all of us not to mark in those hours worked but to instead mark them as time off.  That's a big no no in trucking but no one seemed to care.  They also had non qualified workers performing brake jobs, bearing changes and all sorts of other repairs that required a certified tradesperson to perform.

So I kinda just kept my head down and mouth shut until one particular day when I was asked to go into a confined space.  There are all sorts of safety rules that dictate what sorts of steps you need to perform in order to ensure safety for the workers entering the confined space.  I won't go into them here....but I am well versed in what they are from my years spent working in mills.  Anyway...I refused to do the job.  My boss just explodes in anger in front of me and a couple other guys.  He gets really mad and basically accuses me of being a lazy ass who is trying to skip out on the work.  I told him that I had lots of experience in this area and I'd be happy to go over the proper rules with him but he was having none of it.
Did you report them to the relevant authorities? You should. It could save somebody's life.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: DoubleDown on June 23, 2014, 10:31:03 AM
Did you report them to the relevant authorities? You should. It could save somebody's life.

I'll second that. Now that you're free of this employer, I hope you'll consider alerting the proper authorities. We just saw Tracy Morgan and Co. get rear ended by a trucker whom the NTSB says was speeding and driving more hours than allowed. And good job on getting your finances turned around, you've come to the right place!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Paul der Krake on June 23, 2014, 10:41:32 AM
Yeah that's terrifying, please please please, report these fools ASAP, they're playing with their employees and the public's lives at risk by putting their drivers through this. It's downright criminal and they deserve more than a scolding for this.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: CNM on June 25, 2014, 12:32:56 PM
Best thread ever!  Posting here so I can check in periodically.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: SwordGuy on June 25, 2014, 07:25:06 PM
Here's an FU story without FU money that still turned out well.

To this day I still think the lady was simply brilliant!

She had a boss who was making her life miserable.  For her mental health, she really, really, really needed to tell him what an SOB the fellow was.

But she also really, really needed her job and its paycheck. 

So she kept quiet and suffered.

Until she came up with a cunning plan.

She went storming into her bosses office, looking mad as hell.

"What's wrong?" he asked.

"I was driving to work today and this asshole cut me off in traffic.  I pulled up along side him and told him ..." 

Then she looked her boss right in the eye and continued,

"You SON OF A BITCH!"

Still looking him straight in the eye, she said, "That's what I said to him.  I said, 'You SON OF A BITCH!'"

"Ok, I feel better now.  Thanks."

And she walked out of his office.

She got all the mental satisfaction of telling her boss off to his face without losing her job.

Simply brilliant!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Inevitable on June 26, 2014, 07:34:13 AM
If you think he'd be up for it, I'd love to meet, even if its just to discuss cycling in the city!

I'm waiting on updates telling us all how you met the love of your life through the FU money stories thread :-P
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Wolf_Stache on June 26, 2014, 07:57:24 AM
If you think he'd be up for it, I'd love to meet, even if its just to discuss cycling in the city!

I'm waiting on updates telling us all how you met the love of your life through the FU money stories thread :-P

Ahahaha!  If that happens I will be sure to update this thread.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: shotgunwilly on June 26, 2014, 07:59:27 AM
If you think he'd be up for it, I'd love to meet, even if its just to discuss cycling in the city!

I'm waiting on updates telling us all how you met the love of your life through the FU money stories thread :-P

HAHA! I was thinking the same thing.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: CommonCents on June 26, 2014, 08:01:06 AM
Not epic, and not me, but I have a coworker that is walking away on July 3rd, with no job lined up.  Seems like she's burnt out from fairly long hours/hard work the past few years which hasn't let up much.  She plans to travel, sing, and study, before she figures out what she wants to do next.  (I don't think she's FIRE at 34ish, but it's not something I've ever asked.  Seems a bit too personal to randomly bring up in conversation.) 
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: DoubleDown on June 26, 2014, 10:54:17 AM
(I don't think she's FIRE at 34ish, but it's not something I've ever asked.  Seems a bit too personal to randomly bring up in conversation.)

It's okay if you do it delicately and on the sly, like this: "So how much money do you have?"
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Latwell on June 26, 2014, 11:35:16 AM
(I don't think she's FIRE at 34ish, but it's not something I've ever asked.  Seems a bit too personal to randomly bring up in conversation.)

It's okay if you do it delicately and on the sly, like this: "So how much money do you have?"

Lol "what's in your wallet"
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: dragoncar on June 26, 2014, 12:41:03 PM
(I don't think she's FIRE at 34ish, but it's not something I've ever asked.  Seems a bit too personal to randomly bring up in conversation.)

It's okay if you do it delicately and on the sly, like this: "So how much money do you have?"

Lol "what's in your wallet"

I think "so, do you think you'll ever go back to work?" might get you there without being too invasive
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Cheddar Stacker on June 26, 2014, 03:28:12 PM
(I don't think she's FIRE at 34ish, but it's not something I've ever asked.  Seems a bit too personal to randomly bring up in conversation.)

It's okay if you do it delicately and on the sly, like this: "So how much money do you have?"

Lol "what's in your wallet"

I think "so, do you think you'll ever go back to work?" might get you there without being too invasive

You got a mustache?
Have some FU money huh?
Been stacking cheddar?

Or just slip her a link to your MMM profile if you're not worried about confidentiality.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: jordanread on June 26, 2014, 08:39:45 PM
Been stacking cheddar?

And now we know how you pick up people. ;-) This should go into the username thread (that you started, if I remember). I originally viewed a creepy dude with a weird wink afterwards...but then I realized who said it, and I then imagined the XXX (beer) guy, which added enough class to where I think you could pull it off.

(http://cdn.memegenerator.net/instances/500x/51723314.jpg)
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: dragoncar on June 26, 2014, 10:55:50 PM

I then imagined the XXX (beer) guy, which added enough class to where I think you could pull it off.



I don't always drink beer.  But when I do, I prefer tres equis.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: arebelspy on June 26, 2014, 11:53:14 PM
Pretty sure the triple x beer guy doesn't always drink beer, but when he does, the bottles get lodged... places (on camera).
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: dragoncar on June 27, 2014, 12:31:27 AM
Pretty sure the triple x beer guy doesn't always drink beer, but when he does, the bottles get lodged... places (on camera).

We're talking about this guy, right?

(http://s3.amazonaws.com/rapgenius/9w57isl3TRypb6zs5BSz_triple_x.jpg)
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: arebelspy on June 27, 2014, 12:59:35 AM
Of course.

The truth is out there.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Cheddar Stacker on June 27, 2014, 06:05:33 AM

I then imagined the XXX (beer) guy, which added enough class to where I think you could pull it off.



I don't always drink beer.  But when I do, I prefer tres equis.

Very nice jordanread. ; )
If dos equis is good, tres equis must be better right? Particularly in our gluttonous culture of more more more.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: jordanread on June 27, 2014, 06:18:06 AM



Very nice jordanread. ; )
If dos equis is good, tres equis must be better right? Particularly in our gluttonous culture of more more more.

You know, I thought that seemed off but couldn't figure out why. I even typed dos, and then took the easy way, which I think turned out even more awesome.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Cheddar Stacker on June 27, 2014, 06:40:03 AM
Agreed
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: shotgunwilly on June 27, 2014, 08:33:59 AM

You know, I thought that seemed off but couldn't figure out why. I even typed dos, and then took the easy way, which I think turned out even more awesome.

Agreed

I triple that. :D
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: RootofGood on June 27, 2014, 09:17:00 PM
I'll drink to that.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Stache In Training on June 27, 2014, 11:05:29 PM
tres equis: https://screen.yahoo.com/tres-equis-ii-000000238.html (https://screen.yahoo.com/tres-equis-ii-000000238.html)
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Cheddar Stacker on June 28, 2014, 07:49:31 AM
tres equis: https://screen.yahoo.com/tres-equis-ii-000000238.html (https://screen.yahoo.com/tres-equis-ii-000000238.html)

Nice. Thanks for sharing. Hadn't seen that.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: mercenary on June 28, 2014, 11:56:50 AM
Did you report them to the relevant authorities? You should. It could save somebody's life.

My God did I yell and scream at the proper authorities.  I talked to anyone who'd listen.  However....without documented proof it breaks down into a "He said, He said" situation.  All I had was my word as my driving logs showed what they needed to in order for me to remain employed.

These kinds of things are rampant in the oil patch trucking industry.  I guarantee the majority of drivers on the road have false logs and they do so willingly.  Drivers do it to make the BIG MONEY as they chase the dream of keeping up with the Joneses and continue to buy crap they don't need just to make themselves look good.

Another quick story...I worked with a driver at this same company I was talking about.  We were driving back to the shop one day talking about life and stuff.  He's telling me he hates his job, can't stand living up here, too much debt, and so on.  I ask him where he'd like to be and he says the happiest he has ever been was while working as a prison guard.....  Ok...to each their own I guess.  Anyway he tells me that he's going to save up some cash in order to quit his job and go back to working in the prison system.  We get back to the shop and go on days off.

So I had six days off but I didn't see him for a few weeks after that.  I run into him in the parking lot one day and he's getting out of a brand new truck with a shiny new 4 wheeler in the back.  He sees me and asks me how I like his new truck and 4 wheeler?  I ask what about the plan to save some cash and get another job?  He mumbles something about needing a new truck and that's where the conversation ends.

These kinds of stories are rampant in the area I work.  I work with plenty of folks who not only drive new trucks...but they drive 60 thousand dollar 1/2 ton trucks.  They own 15 thousand dollar snowmobiles, 20 thousand dollar side by side 4 wheelers, sea doo's, boats, and all manner of different toys but they're all leveraged up to their eyeballs and living paycheck to paycheck. Most of these folks are young and if you could just convince them that they could be retired at 35 or earlier they just laugh.  You talk to the older guys (like me) and they say they need 5-10-15 million to retire......

I'm sure most...if not all...of us know people like that.....
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Glenstache on July 01, 2014, 03:00:14 PM
Not a story, but I came across this image on The Oatmeal and it seemed like a good mental picture for this thread:
https://scontent-b-sea.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-xpa1/t1.0-9/10447073_10154349984680078_6092289075562906656_n.jpg

... and yes, those are stacks of money spelling out FU.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: jordanread on July 01, 2014, 03:45:07 PM
Not a story, but I came across this image on The Oatmeal and it seemed like a good mental picture for this thread:
https://scontent-b-sea.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-xpa1/t1.0-9/10447073_10154349984680078_6092289075562906656_n.jpg

... and yes, those are stacks of money spelling out FU.

I remember following that story. Didn't even think about the FU Money thing...I believe that was $250,000 but can't be sure off the top of my head.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Michael792 on July 01, 2014, 04:02:12 PM
Not a story, but I came across this image on The Oatmeal and it seemed like a good mental picture for this thread:
https://scontent-b-sea.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-xpa1/t1.0-9/10447073_10154349984680078_6092289075562906656_n.jpg

... and yes, those are stacks of money spelling out FU.

I remember following that story. Didn't even think about the FU Money thing...I believe that was $250,000 but can't be sure off the top of my head.


It's $220,000. http://boingboing.net/2012/07/09/oatmeal.html
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: AlmostIndependent on July 01, 2014, 07:16:01 PM
In 2006 I was working as an officer aboard a research ship. I spent 2 months on the ship as the 3rd Officer and then moved up to the 2nd Officer job when that guy went home.  When my 4 months on the ship was up (I had been there about 135 days when we pulled back into port) they asked if I could stay another month because they were having trouble coming up with reliefs; I agreed to stay. They swore on everything holy that they would have a relief waiting on the pier for me when we came back to port. Of course when we pulled back into Japan there is no relief. After 164 days on the ship I put all my stuff in my sea bag and told the Captain I was going home. He gave me some sort of lecture on my responsibility to the ship. I said "fuck you guys" and left to get on the train to Fukuoka to fly home.

The kicker is that after 4 months at home they actually called me to come back to work! It turned out that the guy who had relieved me as 3rd Officer 8 months prior was still on the ship and they needed someone to relieve him. I laughed maniacally and declined the offer.

And that is how I began my sea-going career.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: farmstache on July 01, 2014, 10:00:33 PM
Well... mine isn't exactly a FU story (I think almost everyone said that).

I've been working since I was 19 or 20, I think, so not too young. When I still lived with my parents (up to 26yo, saved some money but not really mustachian, oh had I known!), basically I always considered my internships and jobs from a position of power. After all, I didn't really need the money to live, right?

My first internship was really really nice work, but with a terrible boss, who yelled at everyone and was really unbalanced. My last month there was crazy, she brought 4x more clients than the team had capacity to fulfill, and wouldn't hire new people. In mid-january I told her I was taking more classes that semester and would stop with the internship mid-feb. She asked me to just finish one last thing. I said I might not be able to, but I'd do my best (I did do my best and still wasn't able to finish - it was really a lot of work and I think her way of keeping me there). At least once a week she would casually drop in a conversation that I was staying until the end of that project. I would half smile and give her a serious look of No. Anyway, when classes were about to start, I handed in most things to the other interns and said goodbye. She didn't even turn to look at me when I went into her office. Afterwards she sent an email asking if I could do XYZ for her on the project. I didn't have the balls to say FU, but pretended I never saw it.

My latest FU experience was: I worked as a contractor at this really large multinational company and they merged my team with another in december (meaning they fired everyone from my team). They needed someone to do knowledge transfer to the new team and I was the lowest paid, so they did this amazing offer: you can get your thank-you bonus (2 months salary), work full time for two months (at double my previous PT salary), or work part time for two months (at my previous salary). I laughed out loud when I read this. It was the bonus OR work. So, knowing we can live full well and still save almost 40% of my boyfriend's income, I sat down and wrote a really sweet email where I said this offer made me feel like they didn't value my 3 years of work in the company, and I would love to do the transfer but can't do it only out of the goodness of my heart (these 4 words are actually on my email). In the end I got the bonus, plus full-time salary for 1 month, plus stayed another 4 months in an increased PT salary (because the new office incurred new expenses with transportation and lunch - which of course I banked on by bringing my own from home). And they asked me to stay more time, because I really did love the job and did it pretty well.

Now comes the real FU: for a long time I've been meaning to move to a smaller town, but how? Boyfriend and I passed for this govt job. He was called to fill the position in May, to start in June. If we both got called, we would have this really amazing income that would sum up to almost 100k a year, but no, I wasn't (I was next in line, but they decided they were done and closed the process). So suddenly we would be down to only one income (slightly larger than his previous salary but quite smaller than both of ours combined), and thinking what to do? Well, we have about two year's expenses stashed away, and we can still live comfortably on 50% of his new paycheck. So I kissed my job goodbye, we decided to move anyway and enjoy the new lifestyle, while I look for new opportunities on the new town or telecommuting. In this case, our FU money was the means to achieve a lifestyle choice, not necessarily to quit a job I hated (because I didn't really hate it).

And it's a great feeling to know that whatever money I make will go directly to the stash. I can't seem to see it grow fast enough.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: dragoncar on July 01, 2014, 10:57:42 PM
offer: you can get your thank-you bonus (2 months salary), work full time for two months (at double my previous PT salary), or work part time for two months (at my previous salary). I laughed out loud when I read this. It was the bonus OR work.

So options #1 and #3 were the same amount of money, but #1 is no work and #3 requires work?  Doy.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: farmstache on July 01, 2014, 11:49:18 PM
offer: you can get your thank-you bonus (2 months salary), work full time for two months (at double my previous PT salary), or work part time for two months (at my previous salary). I laughed out loud when I read this. It was the bonus OR work.

So options #1 and #3 were the same amount of money, but #1 is no work and #3 requires work?  Doy.

Yeah! That moment I actually wanted to say FU (and the bf actually told me to).
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: AH013 on July 02, 2014, 07:24:54 AM
offer: you can get your thank-you bonus (2 months salary), work full time for two months (at double my previous PT salary), or work part time for two months (at my previous salary). I laughed out loud when I read this. It was the bonus OR work.

So options #1 and #3 were the same amount of money, but #1 is no work and #3 requires work?  Doy.

Yeah! That moment I actually wanted to say FU (and the bf actually told me to).

I bet they actually expect some people to continue working with an offer like that.  In a bizarre sort of sense, some people would think they would be in a stronger position while hunting for a new job if they are still presently employed....never mind they are sacrificing all those hours they could use job hunting working for no net benefit versus taking the severance.  Add to that they are throwing away another moderately well paying job -- job hunting while on unemployment (usually at 1/2 your regular pay)!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: farmstache on July 02, 2014, 04:15:45 PM
I bet they actually expect some people to continue working with an offer like that.  In a bizarre sort of sense, some people would think they would be in a stronger position while hunting for a new job if they are still presently employed....never mind they are sacrificing all those hours they could use job hunting working for no net benefit versus taking the severance.  Add to that they are throwing away another moderately well paying job -- job hunting while on unemployment (usually at 1/2 your regular pay)!

As a contractor I didn't really have the possibility of getting on unemployment. I'll look into my local laws for this, but I'm pretty sure I can't. Maybe next time? I didn't have the "right" to a severance bonus either. But since they offered the OR, I asked for the AND. And got it. It was really sweet and I must say I only got the guts to negotiate it after reading several threads on this forum and following a few links to external resources on negotiating... Thanks, everyone!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: jordanread on July 02, 2014, 05:30:24 PM
I bet they actually expect some people to continue working with an offer like that.  In a bizarre sort of sense, some people would think they would be in a stronger position while hunting for a new job if they are still presently employed....never mind they are sacrificing all those hours they could use job hunting working for no net benefit versus taking the severance.  Add to that they are throwing away another moderately well paying job -- job hunting while on unemployment (usually at 1/2 your regular pay)!

As a contractor I didn't really have the possibility of getting on unemployment. I'll look into my local laws for this, but I'm pretty sure I can't. Maybe next time? I didn't have the "right" to a severance bonus either. But since they offered the OR, I asked for the AND. And got it. It was really sweet and I must say I only got the guts to negotiate it after reading several threads on this forum and following a few links to external resources on negotiating... Thanks, everyone!

The optimism gun strikes again!! Fear is the mind killer, and you don't know what's possible unless you ask.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Gimesalot on July 03, 2014, 09:28:20 AM
Mine is not quite a "I have FU money right now" story, it is a, "I will have FU money in the future" story.

When I was 16, I was working at a mall department store.  I had originally said I could work every night of the week and all day on the weekends.  I graduated HS and began taking some night classes at the C.C.  My manager at the time was very nice, understanding, and accommodating.  She told me that my education was the most important thing in my life, because she didn't want me to end up like her, 40 something, living pay check to pay check.  Over time, I got fed up working there, so I told her I was leaving.  She asked me to stay because it would make her life easier if I could train my replacement.  I liked her, so I agreed.

Of course, she got promoted, and I got a really crappy manager.  I held out for a while, but one day I was scheduled to come in during one of my night classes.  I told my new manager that I needed to switch my schedule because I had class on Tuesday.  She said I couldn't switch because my employee profile said that I could work every night.  I told her that my schedule had changed since I graduated HS, and that my previous manager had honored my request for Tuesdays off.  She told me, get this, that I needed think about my priorities and get them straight.  My jaw dropped!  I told her that I did not need time to "think about it,"  I knew that my priority was college because, "I didn't want to end up like her, in my 40s working a miserable dead-end job." I was a typical teenager asshole!  She was surprised, and then even more surprised when I told her, that I decided that that was my last night there.  She demanded two weeks notice, which still included me missing class to come to work.  I said, nope!  I could not believe that I didn't get fired for mouthing off to her.

I had very little if any money, but I knew that my engineering degree was enough to say, "FU! I'm out!"
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Zamboni on July 03, 2014, 04:18:44 PM
Quote
She demanded two weeks notice, which still included me missing class to come to work.  I said, nope!  I could not believe that I didn't get fired for mouthing off to her.

Wow, she was a moron.  I think my response to that would have been "Okay, you drive a hard bargain, M'am, so even though I just quit, my last day will actually be two weeks from today instead of tonight.  And you are right:  I will be here on Tuesdays as well."  Then I would just have never come back. 

I find myself explaining the concept of "Nobody HAS TO do ANYTHING when it comes to a job" to people on a regular basis.  We've had more than one person just stop showing up, or email a resignation letter while they are on vacation (with the last day of work conveniently falling on a future date that they are still on vacation), or agree to take on a big project and then turn around and put an "I resign effective immediately" letter under the boss's door after hours, yet somehow the illusion that people have to keep coming into the office until they are given permission to leave persists.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: dragoncar on July 03, 2014, 05:08:56 PM
Quote
She demanded two weeks notice, which still included me missing class to come to work.  I said, nope!  I could not believe that I didn't get fired for mouthing off to her.

Wow, she was a moron.  I think my response to that would have been "Okay, you drive a hard bargain, M'am, so even though I just quit, my last day will actually be two weeks from today instead of tonight.  And you are right:  I will be here on Tuesdays as well."  Then I would just have never come back. 

I find myself explaining the concept of "Nobody HAS TO do ANYTHING when it comes to a job" to people on a regular basis.  We've had more than one person just stop showing up, or email a resignation letter while they are on vacation (with the last day of work conveniently falling on a future date that they are still on vacation), or agree to take on a big project and then turn around and put an "I resign effective immediately" letter under the boss's door after hours, yet somehow the illusion that people have to keep coming into the office until they are given permission to leave persists.

Yeah, nobody HAS to leave bridges intact.  Some could burn them.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: warfreak2 on July 03, 2014, 05:15:36 PM
If bridges start trying to walk over you, then you might not be worried about burning them.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Kriegsspiel on July 03, 2014, 08:21:23 PM
Destroying a bridge might look easy in the movies, but remember: They're designed to withstand the immense shear-forces of wind and weather. Deploying an underwater M-32 satchel charge at the base of each load-bearing pylon looks like the answer, but it might not even shake a modern riveted steel highway or railroad bridge. Without delving into the complex language of the guerrilla combat engineer, the best advice I can give you is to forgo subtlety in favor of brute force: Put two satchel charges at each X-shaped trestle buck, and this should rob the bridge of any reinforcing strength and cause it to buckle nicely.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: farmstache on July 03, 2014, 08:49:35 PM
Destroying a bridge might look easy in the movies, but remember: They're designed to withstand the immense shear-forces of wind and weather. Deploying an underwater M-32 satchel charge at the base of each load-bearing pylon looks like the answer, but it might not even shake a modern riveted steel highway or railroad bridge. Without delving into the complex language of the guerrilla combat engineer, the best advice I can give you is to forgo subtlety in favor of brute force: Put two satchel charges at each X-shaped trestle buck, and this should rob the bridge of any reinforcing strength and cause it to buckle nicely.

Can you please rewrite that in a way that explains the metaphor? I'm not sure you're saying we should explode our bosses or even what exactly is made to withstand wind and weather (the job market)? ;-)
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Middlesbrough on July 03, 2014, 09:07:13 PM
Destroying a bridge might look easy in the movies, but remember: They're designed to withstand the immense shear-forces of wind and weather. Deploying an underwater M-32 satchel charge at the base of each load-bearing pylon looks like the answer, but it might not even shake a modern riveted steel highway or railroad bridge. Without delving into the complex language of the guerrilla combat engineer, the best advice I can give you is to forgo subtlety in favor of brute force: Put two satchel charges at each X-shaped trestle buck, and this should rob the bridge of any reinforcing strength and cause it to buckle nicely.

Can you please rewrite that in a way that explains the metaphor? I'm not sure you're saying we should explode our bosses or even what exactly is made to withstand wind and weather (the job market)? ;-)
What my structural engineering buddy is trying to say is, create a chain type structure with your first hit and knock it down with the second.

If you burn your bridges, do it like a boss.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Michael792 on July 03, 2014, 09:09:40 PM
Destroying a bridge might look easy in the movies, but remember: They're designed to withstand the immense shear-forces of wind and weather. Deploying an underwater M-32 satchel charge at the base of each load-bearing pylon looks like the answer, but it might not even shake a modern riveted steel highway or railroad bridge. Without delving into the complex language of the guerrilla combat engineer, the best advice I can give you is to forgo subtlety in favor of brute force: Put two satchel charges at each X-shaped trestle buck, and this should rob the bridge of any reinforcing strength and cause it to buckle nicely.

Can you please rewrite that in a way that explains the metaphor? I'm not sure you're saying we should explode our bosses or even what exactly is made to withstand wind and weather (the job market)? ;-)

It's easy to quit in an epic manner, but you should remember that dick managers are pretty much born dicks: they're not going to give a shit about you quitting. So instead of using the old go-to Fuck-You-I'm-done methods of quitting, you need to quit in such a manner that no one's going to posses any illusions of a cordial exit. Instead of getting in a more-than-mild spat with said dick manager, the simplest and most effective thing to do is to fucking destroy any hope of good relations with that company, and make sure they know the entire mess is due to dick manager.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Primm on July 03, 2014, 09:39:50 PM
Destroying a bridge might look easy in the movies, but remember: They're designed to withstand the immense shear-forces of wind and weather. Deploying an underwater M-32 satchel charge at the base of each load-bearing pylon looks like the answer, but it might not even shake a modern riveted steel highway or railroad bridge. Without delving into the complex language of the guerrilla combat engineer, the best advice I can give you is to forgo subtlety in favor of brute force: Put two satchel charges at each X-shaped trestle buck, and this should rob the bridge of any reinforcing strength and cause it to buckle nicely.

Can you please rewrite that in a way that explains the metaphor? I'm not sure you're saying we should explode our bosses or even what exactly is made to withstand wind and weather (the job market)? ;-)

It's easy to quit in an epic manner, but you should remember that dick managers are pretty much born dicks: they're not going to give a shit about you quitting. So instead of using the old go-to Fuck-You-I'm-done methods of quitting, you need to quit in such a manner that no one's going to posses any illusions of a cordial exit. Instead of getting in a more-than-mild spat with said dick manager, the simplest and most effective thing to do is to fucking destroy any hope of good relations with that company, and make sure they know the entire mess is due to dick manager.

http://youtu.be/qfSAcVq6s9c?t=2m22s
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Michael792 on July 04, 2014, 02:54:44 AM
Destroying a bridge might look easy in the movies, but remember: They're designed to withstand the immense shear-forces of wind and weather. Deploying an underwater M-32 satchel charge at the base of each load-bearing pylon looks like the answer, but it might not even shake a modern riveted steel highway or railroad bridge. Without delving into the complex language of the guerrilla combat engineer, the best advice I can give you is to forgo subtlety in favor of brute force: Put two satchel charges at each X-shaped trestle buck, and this should rob the bridge of any reinforcing strength and cause it to buckle nicely.

Can you please rewrite that in a way that explains the metaphor? I'm not sure you're saying we should explode our bosses or even what exactly is made to withstand wind and weather (the job market)? ;-)

It's easy to quit in an epic manner, but you should remember that dick managers are pretty much born dicks: they're not going to give a shit about you quitting. So instead of using the old go-to Fuck-You-I'm-done methods of quitting, you need to quit in such a manner that no one's going to posses any illusions of a cordial exit. Instead of getting in a more-than-mild spat with said dick manager, the simplest and most effective thing to do is to fucking destroy any hope of good relations with that company, and make sure they know the entire mess is due to dick manager.

http://youtu.be/qfSAcVq6s9c?t=2m22s

The international association of combat engineers approves of this message.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: pom on July 04, 2014, 05:04:34 AM
She told me, get this, that I needed think about my priorities and get them straight. 

Haha, something similar happened to me too in the last year of HS when I worked in the kitchen of a restaurant. After I quit, the manager told me "it will look bad on your resume". As if graduating as an Actuary I was going to put my HS jobs on my resume and as if HR would care.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: rabbit on July 04, 2014, 10:03:48 AM
Long time reader, first time poster here! My FU money story isn't very epic, but here goes. 
I recently gave my notice at a job I've worked at for over 10 years to go back to grad school full time in a field I'm passionate about.
As a 40 yo single mom of 2, I thought I would be stuck working at a job I hate forever; but after reading MMM and especially jlcollinsnh, I realized that I need to "work to live", not "live to work."
Since I've always been pretty mustachian, I had enough money saved to say FU to my crappy desk job and hello to my dream career. It's a huge step and I'm really excited to take it!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Self-employed-swami on July 04, 2014, 12:21:56 PM
Long time reader, first time poster here! My FU money story isn't very epic, but here goes. 
I recently gave my notice at a job I've worked at for over 10 years to go back to grad school full time in a field I'm passionate about.
As a 40 yo single mom of 2, I thought I would be stuck working at a job I hate forever; but after reading MMM and especially jlcollinsnh, I realized that I need to "work to live", not "live to work."
Since I've always been pretty mustachian, I had enough money saved to say FU to my crappy desk job and hello to my dream career. It's a huge step and I'm really excited to take it!

Congratulations!!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: brewer12345 on July 04, 2014, 12:37:31 PM
Destroying a bridge might look easy in the movies, but remember: They're designed to withstand the immense shear-forces of wind and weather. Deploying an underwater M-32 satchel charge at the base of each load-bearing pylon looks like the answer, but it might not even shake a modern riveted steel highway or railroad bridge. Without delving into the complex language of the guerrilla combat engineer, the best advice I can give you is to forgo subtlety in favor of brute force: Put two satchel charges at each X-shaped trestle buck, and this should rob the bridge of any reinforcing strength and cause it to buckle nicely.

Can you please rewrite that in a way that explains the metaphor? I'm not sure you're saying we should explode our bosses or even what exactly is made to withstand wind and weather (the job market)? ;-)

It's easy to quit in an epic manner, but you should remember that dick managers are pretty much born dicks: they're not going to give a shit about you quitting. So instead of using the old go-to Fuck-You-I'm-done methods of quitting, you need to quit in such a manner that no one's going to posses any illusions of a cordial exit. Instead of getting in a more-than-mild spat with said dick manager, the simplest and most effective thing to do is to fucking destroy any hope of good relations with that company, and make sure they know the entire mess is due to dick manager.

Guppy in the radiator? (a special smell when the heat fires up)
Shrimp in the hollow space of a curtain rod?
Drop a steamer in a desk drawer right before the weekend and break the key off in the lock?
Annoy-a-trons placed in a few offices?
Offer the boss a "chocolate-covered" pretzel?
Leave a tray of ex lax brownies for all in the break room?

There are lots of ways to skin that cat.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: zataks on July 04, 2014, 12:39:49 PM
Shrimp in the hollow space of a curtain rod?

Of all you posted, this seemed the most sinister to me.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: msilenus on July 04, 2014, 02:10:55 PM
Destroying a bridge might look easy in the movies, but remember: They're designed to withstand the immense shear-forces of wind and weather. Deploying an underwater M-32 satchel charge at the base of each load-bearing pylon looks like the answer, but it might not even shake a modern riveted steel highway or railroad bridge. Without delving into the complex language of the guerrilla combat engineer, the best advice I can give you is to forgo subtlety in favor of brute force: Put two satchel charges at each X-shaped trestle buck, and this should rob the bridge of any reinforcing strength and cause it to buckle nicely.

Dear Navy SEAL,

I am a happily married man with a warm and loving wife who is also my best friend. We've been together for 17 years and couldn't be happier. But lately she says she wants separate beds. I'm reeling! We're barely in our 40s, and in my mind separate sleeping is for seniors. Am I making too much of this? Help!

—Anxious In Andersonville
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: G-dog on July 04, 2014, 04:01:51 PM
Dr. Doom "But even decent jobs become intolerable when you're working under a toxic egomaniac workaholic inhuman prick.

One of the things I'm now fond of saying is that people usually don't leave their jobs.  They leave their managers. "

+ infinity ....
This ROCKS!
Businesses know this about managers/supervisors - how come they never appear to get rid of the TOXIN? They seem to prefer to let a lot of good, hard-working people quit, become disengaged (but stay), burn out, etc. rather than deal with the A number one asshat they MUST know is costing them productivity, engagement, quality, reputation, and loyalty.  It just boggles my mind...
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Zamboni on July 04, 2014, 04:51:35 PM
That's awesome, Rabbit!

Quote
Yeah, nobody HAS to leave bridges intact.  Some could burn them.

Deciding you don't have to do XYZ task or project, or even that you don't have to work there is not burning a bridge.  Heck, as long as you get along with most of your co-workers, you can score a glowing recommendation from "the former employer" by just listing a friend/colleague from the place as your reference.  I've served as this type of reference for tons of people.  Nobody really expects to be able to speak with your previous boss; half the time he or she is no longer even working there by the time you need a reference from the place.  It doesn't matter at all what your ex-boss thinks about how you left unless you immediately try to get your job back or another identical job across the street with your ex-boss's buddy. 
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Kriegsspiel on July 04, 2014, 06:16:51 PM
Dear Navy SEAL,

I am a happily married man with a warm and loving wife who is also my best friend. We've been together for 17 years and couldn't be happier. But lately she says she wants separate beds. I'm reeling! We're barely in our 40s, and in my mind separate sleeping is for seniors. Am I making too much of this? Help!

—Anxious In Andersonville

While larger rounds incapacitate a target more reliably than the smaller 5.56, they are also much heavier to hump over the mountains. Being able to lay down a more ferocious volume of fire can be well worth the decrease in stopping power, especially when you have encountered a frisky opponent. Utilize your SAW gunner to suppress incoming fire, while your assault team maneuvers to better overrun the enemy position. If bounding proves difficult, remember, 5.56 can penetrate cover like Swiss cheese, although you will still be prudent to continuously engage targets until all teams have swept the objective area.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Michael792 on July 04, 2014, 10:38:36 PM
Dear Navy SEAL,

I am a happily married man with a warm and loving wife who is also my best friend. We've been together for 17 years and couldn't be happier. But lately she says she wants separate beds. I'm reeling! We're barely in our 40s, and in my mind separate sleeping is for seniors. Am I making too much of this? Help!

—Anxious In Andersonville

While larger rounds incapacitate a target more reliably than the smaller 5.56, they are also much heavier to hump over the mountains. Being able to lay down a more ferocious volume of fire can be well worth the decrease in stopping power, especially when you have encountered a frisky opponent. Utilize your SAW gunner to suppress incoming fire, while your assault team maneuvers to better overrun the enemy position. If bounding proves difficult, remember, 5.56 can penetrate cover like Swiss cheese, although you will still be prudent to continuously engage targets until all teams have swept the objective area.

Also, utilizing air and artillery support can shorten the effort, along with conserving your ammo. Definitely remember to sweep the kill zone afterward to eliminate survivors or take captives, mission depending. Once area is swept and the reports sent up, hopefully you can CM.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Nords on July 04, 2014, 10:51:39 PM
Epic FU money?  How about giving up $750K-$1M in salary & pension?

http://the-military-guide.com/2013/12/12/hanging-on-for-the-military-pension/

As most of you have read by now, I stayed on active duty for 20 years to vest my military pension.  In retrospect that was about eight years too long for my physical & mental health, but I survived the stress.  I should have gone Reserves as soon as my career peaked at the 12-year point, but I was ignorant and overworked and too afraid to even pay serious attention to the Reservists around me.  I didn't understand how a Reserve pension worked, and fear was the main reason I kept chasing those paychecks. 

In 1999, three years before my retirement, my active-duty spouse was picking up the wrong kind of signals from her assignment officer.  She was at her 16-year point, where they know that you're motivated by the pension and unlikely to resign from active duty.  An assignment officer's rationale is that "Needs of the Navy" take precedence over personal (and family) priorities.  My spouse was needed in Norfolk or Yokosuka, but she couldn't stay in Hawaii.

Up until this point the Navy had kept us dual-military spouses together, but now I was on my final tour and my assignment officer had no reason to send me to my spouse's new homeport.  Her orders would be an unaccompanied tour.  My daughter and I would stay in Hawaii until I retired (18-24 months after Mom left) and then we'd go to Mom's duty station. 

We all wanted to feel at home in a place that has the things we like and is closer to Hawaii.  We didn't want to try to live in a foreign land with an unfamiliar culture and no friends-- so my spouse chose Yokosuka.

We resigned ourselves (yet again) to the inevitable and began talking about the family logistics.  One afternoon on the way home from 3rd grade, my daughter broke down in tears.  She only knew a few words of Japanese and she didn't think that she'd be able to learn enough in time to handle the schools.  I explained to her that she'd go to an English-speaking school (on base) where they'd also teach her Japanese, but her feelings made clear that she wasn't happy about being separated from Mom-- and then having to leave her friends (and Hawaii) to get Mom back.

I wasn't very happy about the separation either, although I was in supportive-spouse mode.  But this would be our 14th move, dammit, and I'd had enough.  We'd been in Hawaii since 1989 but we'd had to leave once before ('94-'97 in San Diego) so we knew we wanted to retire in Hawaii.  We were definitely not interested in moving just so that my spouse could check a career block before retiring from active duty.

Things came to a head in early 2000 when my spouse and I were tweaking our transfer plan.  She mentioned that a friend had recommended great family counselors in both Hawaii and Yoko to help us deal with the unaccompanied tour.  When it became clear that this career move might require the assistance of mental-health professionals, we finally asked ourselves:  "Why are we doing this?!?"

I ran the numbers.  If she resigned from active duty and joined the Reserves, then my pension and our savings should bridge the gap until her Reserve pension started in 2022.  By resigning from active duty now (and giving up an active-duty pension in 2003) she'd pass up at least $750K while awaiting her Reserve pension.  Depending on the cost-of-living adjustments to the active-duty pension, the forsaken amount could've been over $1M. 

Her attitude was "Well, if we run out of money then I can always get a real job."  She drafted her resignation letter that night, had her CO endorse it the next morning, and faxed it in to BUPERS before lunch. 

Nobody took her seriously.  A Navy officer's resignation letter can give 12 months' notice, so it's traditionally regarded as merely the start of serious poker negotiations, and the assignment officer ignored her bluff.  He issued her resignation orders, which he expected her to cancel at any minute.  He found her a relief and stopped returning her calls.  We ran our financial numbers again-- still good.  (We didn't appreciate that the stock markets had reached their peak.)  We attended my retirement seminar together and became even more firmly convinced that she'd made the right choice.

In June 2000 we stumbled across our dream home four miles over in the next neighborhood.  Bigger house, better school system, bigger yard, fantastic views.  It was absolutely filthy and in crappy material condition but it has good bones for DIY sweat equity.  It was the pits of Hawaii's decade-long real estate recession, the sellers were desperate, the price was ridiculously low, and our conclusion was "We have to buy this place".  We closed the deal and rented out our old home.  Surprisingly our FI numbers still (barely) worked.  Hey, I could always get a real job too.

You military veterans know what comes next:  we used my spouse's resignation orders to ship our household goods at the Navy's expense.

When the assignment officer saw the invoice, he went nuts.  "Do you realize what you've done?!?  When you cancel your resignation and go to Yoko, you're going to have to pay that back!!"  Spouse got her CO's finger-wagging lecture on "Are you sure you know what you're doing?  I don't think you appreciate the significance of your mistake."  Coworkers asked "Are you guys OK?  Have you started your job search yet?"  None of them could even spell FI, let alone FIRE.

Surprisingly enough, our numbers still worked.  We were hugely leveraged (with an 8% mortgage!) and a job could certainly provide a safety margin, but our rental would offset our gargantuan mortgage payments.  The stock market was a little shaky by late 2000, but we were finally staying in Hawaii.

When she left active duty in May 2001 she had 17 years, 11 months, and 10 days.  She affiliated with the PACOM Reserve unit the next day. 

The stock markets sucked, but our ohana quality of life took a prompt jump.  My spouse spent the first few months taking naps and getting her life back.  During Reserve drill weekends she found a whole new Navy community that appreciated what she could do.  We dug into the DIY home improvement on our new home.  Our daughter thrived in the new school with her new friends.  I cruised on down my retirement glide slope.

Then 9/11 happened. 

When the stock markets re-opened on 17 September 2001, I ran the numbers one again.  Our portfolio was melting down like an ice cube at the beach and the college fund was in jeopardy, but we still had... barely enough.  I retired in June 2002.  We cut expenses and delayed our home improvements, and October 2002 was ugly, and we ate through our cash reserves, but by 2003 we were back on track. 

"Losing" $750K-$1M has not affected our lifestyle one bit.  Pursuing it would have wrecked our family.

No regrets. 
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: arebelspy on July 04, 2014, 10:58:04 PM
I've read it before, and I enjoyed it even more this time.  I love your wife's story Nords, and what she has done since then (the various volunteer work).  It's one of my favorite ER stories.  So awesome.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: dragoncar on July 04, 2014, 11:08:14 PM

Quote
Yeah, nobody HAS to leave bridges intact.  Some could burn them.

Deciding you don't have to do XYZ task or project, or even that you don't have to work there is not burning a bridge. 

That was in response to this:

Quote
We've had more than one person just stop showing up, or email a resignation letter while they are on vacation (with the last day of work conveniently falling on a future date that they are still on vacation), or agree to take on a big project and then turn around and put an "I resign effective immediately" letter under the boss's door after hours

All of which is definitely bridge burning.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: paddedhat on July 05, 2014, 06:17:33 AM

Guppy in the radiator? (a special smell when the heat fires up)
Shrimp in the hollow space of a curtain rod?
Drop a steamer in a desk drawer right before the weekend and break the key off in the lock?
Annoy-a-trons placed in a few offices?
Offer the boss a "chocolate-covered" pretzel?
Leave a tray of ex lax brownies for all in the break room?

There are lots of ways to skin that cat.


A good friend of mine had a small business doing appliance installation and repair.  One day he reports to a mansion just outside of NYC, and spent several hours installing a downdraft exhaust on a new range. He presents the bill to the owner, and expects a check. The owner is a professional body builder, who looks down at my buddy and says, " FU, I'm not paying you, get out" When asked what the issue is, the customer just states that he doesn't have to pay, so get out.  A few weeks later my buddy is surf fishing and lands a serious fish. He waits for darkness, and heads to the muscle head's mansion. He jumps the wall, unscrews the grille from the range exhaust, and using a broom handle, pushes his catch about ten feet into the ductwork under the kitchen........
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: G-dog on July 05, 2014, 09:09:31 AM
Not quite FU stories, but at least Some FU attitude:
I left me first job after college (without FU$) after my boss lied to me about a promotion "the university won't let me promote anyone until they are a co-author on a paper."  Bulshit - the university doesn't give a crap and had all the criteria explicitly listed AND I had turned down an offer to be a co-author on a paper because I thought I hadn't done enough work on that project. So, I found another job (in the same dept) and gave my 2.weeks notice.  Boss tells me it is unprofessional to give only 2weeks notice, a professional (salaried person) should give at least a month. I checked with the new boss, and he says 'fine'.  The next day, the soon-to-be ex-boss asks me if there is anything he can do to get me to stay - I  said 'no' ( but WISH I had said, go see what you can do an let me know --- and THEN I could have turned him down).
At the current job, a co-worker at a higher pay band interrupts a meeting I am having with one of his peers and proceeds to yell at both of us.  Our boss was in town, so I march right to their office, relate the story and say 'I WILL NOT be treated like this!'.  YES - I have FU money and I know I can walk out and be fine for a year or more. The other person who got yelled at has big time school debt, and is quiet as a church mouse (and continued to get abused by the yeller).  The yeller got in trouble, and never yelled at me again, and we mostly just avoided each other when possible.
So, as others have said, FU money gives you more (better) options, even if you don't pull the penultimate trigger.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: vern on July 05, 2014, 02:28:32 PM
We didn't want to try to live in a foreign land with an unfamiliar culture and no friends-- so my spouse chose Yokosuka.

Har!  Great stuff Nords!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: EarlyRetirementGuy on July 08, 2014, 08:43:45 AM
Not as epic as some stories in here, but mine came with a double FU!

A couple of years ago, my partner and I both started working at a local restaurant to supplement our incomes from our other jobs. While we both liked the job, we hated the manager.

He was your typical loud mouthed, arrogant, rude and demeaning boss who believed everything he did was right.

Things eventually came to a head when he started yelling at me one day in the kitchen infront of everyone about some 'compulsory' training I hadnt completed yet. I told him that he hadnt given me any time to do this training while at work and with my other job I didnt have time to do it at home. In the UK it is actually a legal requirement that you are paid to do all compulsory training however he conveniently forgot that fact and demanded I do all training in my own time.

Halfway through his rant, I held up my hand and very calmly said: "I dont come to work to be yelled at so I'm going to be quitting right now. You can continue yelling about things but it doesnt matter from this point onwards. By the way, my partner will also be quitting".

The look on his face was priceless. Luckily my partner and I had both agreed we would quit if either of us wanted to.. and because we both had our other jobs and a large emergency cash pile leaving this one would have no major impacts on us.

Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: jordanread on July 08, 2014, 09:47:20 AM

Halfway through his rant, I held up my hand and very calmly said: "I dont come to work to be yelled at so I'm going to be quitting right now. You can continue yelling about things but it doesnt matter from this point onwards. By the way, my partner will also be quitting".

The look on his face was priceless. Luckily my partner and I had both agreed we would quit if either of us wanted to.. and because we both had our other jobs and a large emergency cash pile leaving this one would have no major impacts on us.

Teamwork!!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: EarlyRetirementGuy on July 09, 2014, 05:57:26 AM
Teamwork!!

It felt good knowing that my partner would support my decision.

Since then she's found another part time job she enjoys far more and I've picked up alot of weekend overtime for my main job which pays alot more!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: G-dog on July 09, 2014, 07:40:39 PM
I left me first job after college.......

Apparently I was a pirate ...AARRGGHH!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: AlmostIndependent on July 11, 2014, 11:49:17 AM
A good friend of mine had a small business doing appliance installation and repair.  One day he reports to a mansion just outside of NYC, and spent several hours installing a downdraft exhaust on a new range. He presents the bill to the owner, and expects a check. The owner is a professional body builder, who looks down at my buddy and says, " FU, I'm not paying you, get out" When asked what the issue is, the customer just states that he doesn't have to pay, so get out.  A few weeks later my buddy is surf fishing and lands a serious fish. He waits for darkness, and heads to the muscle head's mansion. He jumps the wall, unscrews the grille from the range exhaust, and using a broom handle, pushes his catch about ten feet into the ductwork under the kitchen........

While I like the story a better one would have been the installer putting a mechanic's lien on the mansion and then foreclosing on it!

Agreed.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Unique User on July 13, 2014, 01:42:47 PM
These are awesome!  I walked out a job right after college.  I was working as a waiter, the GM who regularly screamed and ranted at waitstaff called me a c***.  I had warned her before that if she did that to me that I would leave and did, I handed her my apron and pad and walked out.  Fancy pants restaurant across from the Board of Trade in Chicago on a busy Friday night, only regret was the office job I landed soon after paid half what I made there.  I think I had enough to pay for a couple months of expenses, but don't need much when you're 22.   
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: avongil on July 13, 2014, 03:12:42 PM
Nords, that brought a tear to my eye.

Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Workinghard on July 13, 2014, 03:32:32 PM
What a great story about priorities, Nords! And look how your daughter turned out and where she's at now. I have no doubt that you made the right decision.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Nords on July 13, 2014, 10:08:59 PM
Nords, that brought a tear to my eye.
What a great story about priorities, Nords! And look how your daughter turned out and where she's at now. I have no doubt that you made the right decision.
Thanks!

After our daughter finishes her tour on her Rota ship, she'll go to a year of nuclear power training.  She'll follow that up with two years in the engineering department of an aircraft carrier (rarely seeing daylight).  Her carrier homeport choices will be East Coast, West Coast, or... Japan.  I'm pretty sure she won't want to stay in the U.S.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: secondcor521 on July 16, 2014, 02:58:03 PM
http://www.departurememo.com/ - more the way I want to be about my departure.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: farmstache on July 16, 2014, 04:54:28 PM
http://www.departurememo.com/ - more the way I want to be about my departure.

Amazing! Wishing her all the luck!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: johnintaiwan on July 16, 2014, 07:59:49 PM
The other teacher at my school is due to leave at the end of them month. Things are getting pretty heated between him and the owner right now. There may be an epic quitting story. The problem though is he has no FU money at all. I think it is gonna be a train wreck.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Daisy on July 16, 2014, 11:52:36 PM
Check out this lawyer's FU story. She turned it into a cartoon.
https://shine.yahoo.com/work-money/lawyer-quits-her-job-with-most-creative-departure-memo-ever-151105791.html

Her website has the whole cartoon:
http://www.departurememo.com/
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Eric on July 17, 2014, 12:06:23 AM
Hey, have you guys seen this website?  It's a cartoon about a lawyer quitting her job.

http://www.departurememo.com/

Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Michael792 on July 17, 2014, 02:18:40 AM
Hey everyone, just thought y'all might want to see this: http://www.departurememo.com/

It's a cartoon by a lawyer about quitting her job.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: gimp on July 17, 2014, 01:54:33 PM
Hey guys, what was that website about a lawyer quitting her job?
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: secondcor521 on July 17, 2014, 06:35:50 PM
Please remove me from this distribution list.  Thank you.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: msilenus on July 17, 2014, 07:29:50 PM
Me too!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: allergic2average on July 17, 2014, 09:30:47 PM
Well I've left a couple of jobs because there was some awful stuff going on, but I had no kind of FU money when I did it (I kind of did the second time but it's complicated), so I don't have a story of my own.

But when I was still working at Wal-Mart, I was witness to the Legend of Frank.

Frank was an older, white haired gentleman who was already a hero, he'd had a long military career and the truth is, he was one of the best employees the store had.  But he had his terms.  He had the only job at Wal-Mart he cared to have, and he worked the only shift he cared to work.

But he'd done so well for so long, no one had a problem with this.  Thing is Frank did not need the money, at all.  He had a military pension, his house was paid for, and he was actually delaying Social Security for a bigger payment because he didn't need it.  He worked for reasons that aren't fathomable to me.  He used the money he made to buy fishing lures and gave a chunk of it away to the Children's Miracle Network and stuff like that.

Now I have good and bad things to say about Wal-Mart.  Right now I'm going to say one of the bad things.

I don't know if this is by some evil design (I doubt it, never ascribe to malignancy that which can be explained by incompetence) or what, but it seems every once in a while some goober in Arkansas, for the hell of it, decides to change the way employees are scheduled or what jobs exist and what they do, and the usual effect of this is it tends to make older, more highly paid workers quit or find themselves in situations where they have to resign because they have a personal situation where they can't start working nights instead of mornings or something like that.

As a graduate of business school myself, I call that MBA thinking, and I say that pejoratively.  Actions like this are necessary sometimes but what I saw was something that some overpaid executive cooked up on a spreadsheet to make it look like he/she found a way to save money when in fact he/she was only shuffling people around and causing operational risks.  If (s)he'd paid attention in business school he'd realize what he/she was doing was in fact pointless.

This is what happens when people under intense pressure to justify their huge six or even seven figure salaries who have never worked in a Wal-Mart store, who think of the company not as people and stores and trucks and groceries and merchandise but rather as abstract numbers, make decisions about the jobs of people they will never meet.  I'm sure these corporate people are perfectly nice people, but I doubt very much that the $11 an hour workers whose fates they manipulate are more than an idea or a piece of the data to them.  Dunbar's number.  Wal-Mart has 2 million employees.  You do the math.

Well anyway, someone decided that Frank's job was too cushy and he needed a new schedule.  They basically took his job and another job, cut half the responsibilities and work from each, and switched them so you wound up with this weird situation where the new job had some of both of the old jobs.  And while it wasn't a completely illogical way to do things, it didn't make sense to the people who actually did this work.  This was a "I'm a smart corporate executive and you are a lowly peon, do what I say" initiative.

When this happens, they usually call you in to an office to tell you it's happened right before the schedules showing the changes come out.  That way they can say they gave you advance notice without really giving you any ability to deal with it.  It's a shitty thing they do because they know so many of their good employees won't quit because Wal-Mart is all they have.

But it didn't pan out for them this time.

Frank looked across at the overnight manager and said no, I won't do it.

The manager, who was a real douchebag, said yes you will and you'll like it (witness as unreliable but I can definitely imagine this guy saying that).

Frank looked at him and unclipped something from his belt and something from his shirt pocket.  He then opened his wallet and removed something.

"Here's my box cutter.  Here's my discount card.  And here's my badge.  That's everything I have of yours.  I'm going home."

Three hours into his shift, Frank turned around and walked out the front door of Wal-Mart and into a legend, vanishing in the darkness of the parking lot.  It threw the rest of us into chaos because we had to pick up the slack, but none of us complained, for he was our hero.  Because at some point, every single one of us had wanted to do that.

Last I heard of Frank, he's doing a lot more fishing nowadays.

The Legend of Frank was epic :)
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Gracie on July 17, 2014, 11:46:27 PM
Update to our FU money story: My husband yelled at the VP of his division a few weeks ago, giving the man a 10-minute lesson in good management technique at the top of his voice. My husband NEVER yells. He said there was a stunned silence in the department. The VP had reprimanded my husband at the front of the office and made some snide remarks. After a few months of this, my husband had enough.

Best part - The VP was apologizing and back-peddling at the end of it. He finally realized he had pushed too far.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: dragoncar on July 18, 2014, 10:10:12 AM
Hey guys, what was that website about a lawyer quitting her job?

I think it was something like goodbye-note.org
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Gone Fishing on August 08, 2014, 12:33:38 PM
Keep them coming!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: tyler1215 on August 08, 2014, 10:49:39 PM
It's technically not an FU story, yet, but I constantly remind the senior managers that they only have to put up with me for 10 more years. Each manager, all in their fifties, says the same thing "I wish I could retire in 10 years." That's when I tell them "not you. I'm retiring in 10 years." I'm literally half their age. One manager loves it when I do that to them.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Michael792 on August 09, 2014, 01:45:55 AM
One time, I told my boss I had to quit because I was joining Active Duty and the Army would be sending me to Korea. She was mad at me, even though I was already in the Army and she knew what I planned on doing. Tried to fire me, but I threw my orders at our general manager. Not only did I not get fired, I have a guaranteed place in the company if I come back within five years. Not that I plan to, just kind of a Fuck You to her.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: RelaxedGal on August 09, 2014, 06:34:02 AM
My husband was stressed at work, hated the long commute, being away from our little girl for hours each day and working evenings and weekends from home.  Not unhappy enough to quit, but to look for a new position.  A buddy called, told him a rival company was opening a new office 5 miles from our house.  Won't you join us?

We expected a pay cut, we just didn't know how much.  Having FU money meant it really didn't matter how much, it was going to be work he enjoyed in a better environment and location.  As long as the offer wasn't enough of a paycut that he felt insulted, we agreed that he'd take the position if offered.

The salary offer matched his old salary plus bonuses.  Not an epic FU money story, but the money gave us freedom and confidence.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: iris lily on August 09, 2014, 10:16:25 AM
My husband was stressed at work, hated the long commute, being away from our little girl for hours each day and working evenings and weekends from home.  Not unhappy enough to quit, but to look for a new position.  A buddy called, told him a rival company was opening a new office 5 miles from our house.  Won't you join us?

We expected a pay cut, we just didn't know how much.  Having FU money meant it really didn't matter how much, it was going to be work he enjoyed in a better environment and location.  As long as the offer wasn't enough of a paycut that he felt insulted, we agreed that he'd take the position if offered.

The salary offer matched his old salary plus bonuses.  Not an epic FU money story, but the money gave us freedom and confidence.

This is a great story, not epic FU like some of the stories above, but it gets to the heart of the matter.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Stache In Training on September 05, 2014, 01:53:22 PM
Not as Epic, but FU money made it happen.

I quit to become a SAHD.  They were blown away and not expecting it at all.  That's not the epic part, but by being poilite and not burning bridges made this next part happen.

After a few weeks, they ask me to lunch, and offer me a promotion to a manager.  So basically the fact that they knew I don't need the money, means they gave me the most aggressive offer they've offered someone in that position, and the job description was changed to how I wanted it.  I was also able to ask for a bunch of vacation days that I now had planned, since I was planning on not working.  That wouldn't have been the case had I not quit and were just offered the promotion while still working there.

So not too epic in the sense of "stick it to the man," but definitely a great story and proof that FU money truly helps and gives you leverage... now I'll just be building even more FU money.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Zamboni on September 05, 2014, 02:51:11 PM
^That's fantastic.  Congrats!

Sometimes you just need to be gone for a little while to be appreciated for your efficiency and hard work.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: arebelspy on September 05, 2014, 05:35:01 PM
Nice, congrats SIT!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Rustyfa on September 08, 2014, 10:00:11 PM
My first post, might as we'll be here.

A little over a month ago I was told my department was going to salary.  This isn't surprising and I am surprised it took this long.  10 days later I was brought in to be told my salary from the new controller who had been working there two months.  They offered my hourly rate x 52 weeks x 40 hours. I slip up and swear a couple times a year but my reaction was to tell him to go f himself.  I couldn't help myself.  I said that if they wanted to retain me they needed to figure in my 7 hours of ot weekly.  They came back with a number that gave me a loss of five percent of my income.  Not ideal but i was later told by a friend higher up that I was the only one to complain and I was making 7500 more than anyone else in my department.  I have the cushion where if my wife and I get fired we can last 6 months and we have a very good start to our retirement.  I figure 9 to 17 years depending on the market.  So mid forties to early fifties.  Without this I would have taken it like the others. 

I was genuinely hurt by this.  I truly like my job and have worked my rear off to be very good at the job.  I was hurt by this and finally called the recruiter that had been hounding me back.  He scheduled an interview for the next day.  I sent out two resumes and after one interview at one spot and four at the other I have two offers.  One for comparable money but not in my field.  I had to turn it down,  would have loved working there but needed financial incentive.  The second offer is a 30 minute commute but offered more than I have made before base wise.  I countered with what i assumed a ridiculous number.  Two weeks go by.  I had emailed to thank them for the offer but decided to call and talk to the owner.  After a solid conversation I know they just can't match what I need to switch, travel etc even though it is a step up in career and money.  5 hours later I get an offer of 4percent more than the ridiculous number I asked for. 

I had to take it, had to.  So now I will be starting over there in a month and am scared and excited.  Having the fu money allowed me to counter at both jobs when a person without it may have been silenced.  I am sort of sad as I truly like my current job and the people.  Had they simply made a fair offer or gone up another 4k on the secondary offer they would have kept me.  Hope this works out well.  I live in rural Midwest and I never thought I would ever earn this much although it isn't close to six figures I see here.

No fu to the company.  I told them it was the best job I have ever had and that I didn't want to leave but financially I had no choice.  I want to not burn a bridge as someday I really may come back and work here again.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: arebelspy on September 09, 2014, 07:52:13 AM
Awesome that you had that flexibility Rustyfa.  I'm sure your current job will miss you.  Hope you like your new job even more than the old one!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Jellyfish on September 09, 2014, 09:05:25 AM
I honestly don't know whether I get kudos or a face punch for this. I am new to MMM, love the forum.  Have been good with saving and investing my whole live, but due to job uncertainties over the last few years started hoarding cash in fear of being laid off.  Sort of accidentally saved a giant FU fund.  Last November my job got miserable (massive project, working 70+ hours per week) and I'm a single mom to a 9 year old boy who was struggling with school.  We just found out he was dyslexic and I needed to have time with him to sort things out.  Long story short my FU fund enabled me to give 2 weeks notice. 

My employer (large consulting firm, I do HR/Recruiting) convinced me to take a 3 month leave of absence instead.  I did, and when I came back I negotiated a flexible work arrangement where I work 8am-3pm at 80% pay.  I'm off when my son comes home from school.  Works great, and now I can focus on my FIRE plan. 

My FU fund gave me the freedom to walk away, and my employer knows I am still willing to do so at any moment, which is great.  I realize after reading the MMM blog and this forum though that having as much cash as I do is ridiculous though (well over 1 year's living expenses, what was I thinking??).  I have Vanguard index funds and investments (401(k) and non-retirement, and am well diversified, just haven't been able to let go of this ridiculous safety blanket of cash.  Time to fix that.  I am 42 and think my ER goal is age 48 or 50.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: jordanread on September 09, 2014, 09:28:05 AM
I honestly don't know whether I get kudos or a face punch for this. I am new to MMM, love the forum.  Have been good with saving and investing my whole live, but due to job uncertainties over the last few years started hoarding cash in fear of being laid off.  Sort of accidentally saved a giant FU fund.  Last November my job got miserable (massive project, working 70+ hours per week) and I'm a single mom to a 9 year old boy who was struggling with school.  We just found out he was dyslexic and I needed to have time with him to sort things out.  Long story short my FU fund enabled me to give 2 weeks notice. 

My employer (large consulting firm, I do HR/Recruiting) convinced me to take a 3 month leave of absence instead.  I did, and when I came back I negotiated a flexible work arrangement where I work 8am-3pm at 80% pay.  I'm off when my son comes home from school.  Works great, and now I can focus on my FIRE plan. 

My FU fund gave me the freedom to walk away, and my employer knows I am still willing to do so at any moment, which is great.  I realize after reading the MMM blog and this forum though that having as much cash as I do is ridiculous though (well over 1 year's living expenses, what was I thinking??).  I have Vanguard index funds and investments (401(k) and non-retirement, and am well diversified, just haven't been able to let go of this ridiculous safety blanket of cash.  Time to fix that.  I am 42 and think my ER goal is age 48 or 50.

My vote is for kudos. Could the money be invested better? Sure. Did it 'buy' you freedom (in some form)? Absolutely. That's what money is about around these parts. :-) Congrats!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: DeepEllumStache on September 09, 2014, 09:28:17 AM
No face punches there, your FU money gave you exactly what it was supposed to give - the power to walk away from a situation that wasn't good for you.  Then you used it to negotiate a better path.  Great job!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: ender on September 09, 2014, 04:20:27 PM
It's technically not an FU story, yet, but I constantly remind the senior managers that they only have to put up with me for 10 more years. Each manager, all in their fifties, says the same thing "I wish I could retire in 10 years." That's when I tell them "not you. I'm retiring in 10 years." I'm literally half their age. One manager loves it when I do that to them.

This is great.

I have some coworkers who are in a similar position, though I'm not bold enough to say something like that to them...
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: fantabulous on September 09, 2014, 08:39:02 PM
I honestly don't know whether I get kudos or a face punch for this.

Kudos to you, face punch to your employer.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: viper155 on September 10, 2014, 06:10:19 AM
I was bartending at a place that I actually loved working in but I was getting bored. I was waiting to be called to my dream job with the FDNY. Biding time. One day I received my notice that I would be getting sworn in 8 weeks later. I went to work the next day and when the boss came in, out of nowhere, I told him I quit. I worked one more day and the day after that I left on a 6 week bicycle journey. I had done this sort of thing before, but this time I did it the right way.
That was 1990. Today I'm retired from my job with the FDNY but it sure did feel good to just pack up and go!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Pat on September 10, 2014, 08:10:50 AM
I agree with what tooqk4u22 said on the first page about FU money affording one the opportunity to stay as well as leave. I enjoy the work I do, most of the people I work with, have a relatively short commute, never travel for work, save >50% of my take-home, and still have room to grow in my career with our organization, so I have turned down other potentially higher paying opportunities because I didn't want to risk ending up somewhere I'm not as happy as I am now.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: TurtleMarkets on September 10, 2014, 01:58:33 PM
Two Stories that are not me but I witnessed.

1. This guy worked with us for a few months. We had a meeting almost monthly were we got yelled at for not doing enough work. All in really vague and unmeasurable terms. I thought they were funny and almost seemed like satire from a office show. This one guy did not. He called off the next day. Then the day after that called in and said I am not coming in today or ever again. Not sure how you want to notify HR or the rest of management but I will mail my ID badge in.  (Click)"   (The manager told us this conversation in a tone like this guy was a loser) Turns out he was working on a side project and needed to work for a few more months before he could go on his own. That meeting made him say it was time.

2. Get an email from a .net devloper that says.  "It was nice working with  you all. Good bye"  Management flipped out because he didnt give any warning. He sent that email and walked out with no explanation.  Still have no idea what happened
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: mrcheese on September 11, 2014, 01:14:27 AM
I’m not sure if this belongs in the “find a new job” gauntlet challenge or here:
I had a horrible job – I took it because I thought it would be a good move but I never did get anything I was promised in the interviews…
Anyway, after a bit over a year in the job, the workload had tripled (as was expected) and they finally got me the long promised assistant. And decided to pay them more than me, even though I would be training and supervising them. This was the straw that broke the camel’s back (see other work related rant from a few months back).
So I did some sums and realised that I did have a couple of months FU money up my sleeve and I could afford to stand up for myself for once. So I did, and got sacked.
But, being in the wrong they had to give me my accrued leave and pay in lieu of notice so I got a few unexpected grand for acting in my own best interests for a change :)
The day after, I bumped into some team mates from a previous government job and got a foot back in the door there. I did get a glorious three weeks of leisure before stepping into a cushy role that pays more per hour for a fraction of the responsibility and has awesome flexibility in a super convenient location. Yes, FU money is a nice thing to have.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: trailrated on September 22, 2014, 08:44:39 AM
OP here, I think this lady takes the cake

http://www.mediabistro.com/tvnewser/alaska-tv-reporter-quits-on-air-fk-it-i-quit_b239657
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: pachnik on September 22, 2014, 09:14:17 AM
OP here, I think this lady takes the cake

http://www.mediabistro.com/tvnewser/alaska-tv-reporter-quits-on-air-fk-it-i-quit_b239657

Wow, I can't believe that one.  Talk about burning bridges.  I don't think I'd ever have the courage to do it quite so dramatically.  Thanks for posting it. 
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: partgypsy on September 23, 2014, 01:19:46 PM
I guess in retrospect I have a couple fu stories. I got a job right out of college that was actually quite good, in the late 80's making 21K a year in the field I wanted to be in (research). In addition to the job I was being paid to do (study coordinator for a study funded by a particular company) I did a lot of other things for them, being a recent college grad and eager beaver, including editing their newsletter, working on other studies, and formatting letters for the secretary (she was there for her looks and that's about it). Anyways the study is expanding to other sites, and I'm flown out to meet the expanded team. I'm also recognized because we were the first site and also helped them redo the data collection forms. The VP of the company lets us know that each site is getting 35K to pay for our job, and to let him know if we are not getting it. My mouth drops open. I figure I don't even care if I get the full 35K, but can use the news to at least get 28K a year. I schedule a meeting with the office manager (it's fall). He says he can only talk salary at the annual meeting in spring. Being naive, I wait until spring. When I go to meet with him, he basically pats me on the head, says that money is short but for me they will stretch and give me a 3% raise. I bring up what the VP said. He basically calls me a liar and "take it or leave it." Mind you, this is an office where 95% of the employees are cowed married middle aged females who work for peanuts, and only the primary doctor and upper management are men who drive cars that cost more than any employee's annual salary. Other sexist things like the women staff had to wear a skirt or dress on days the (male) doctor worked. So I let my immediate supervisor know, and think about it for a day. Basically I was so disgusted by them thinking I was this stupid I didn't think I could work for them anymore. I go back the next day saying "thank you for the opportunity, you said take it or leave it so I leave it; this is my 2 weeks notice". Now it was his turn for his mouth to drop open.
The VP ends up personally calling me, asking me to stay and I will get the money, as long as I agreed to stay until the trial was over (3 years). As I was planning to apply to grad school for the following year I end up having to decline, plus the situation would be, uncomfortable. (I had heard from the grapevine the manager had some "esplaining" to do). During the year and a half I did work there I had saved 7K, and all these long time employees who knew my grad school plans were shaking my hand, and congratulations kind of a Norma Rae moment. Because I lived frugally, was able to take 6 months off, and then just worked a part time job for the few months before beginning grad school.

As I now have dependents and house and such it would take me a lot more to something like that, but strangely it was the right decision at the time.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Joggernot on September 23, 2014, 02:22:50 PM
Just found this article.  Guess we can do this with impunity now...

http://www.caintv.com/obamas-nlrb-now-ordering-reins (http://www.caintv.com/obamas-nlrb-now-ordering-reins)
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: SisterX on September 23, 2014, 03:06:38 PM
Just found this article.  Guess we can do this with impunity now...

http://www.caintv.com/obamas-nlrb-now-ordering-reins (http://www.caintv.com/obamas-nlrb-now-ordering-reins)

What the f*%# did I just read?  I sincerely hope that was satire, because otherwise it's partisan politics beyond inanity and into the realm of crazy.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Joggernot on September 23, 2014, 03:20:07 PM
Just found this article.  Guess we can do this with impunity now...

http://www.caintv.com/obamas-nlrb-now-ordering-reins (http://www.caintv.com/obamas-nlrb-now-ordering-reins)

What the f*%# did I just read?  I sincerely hope that was satire, because otherwise it's partisan politics beyond inanity and into the realm of crazy.
Not satire.  Real.  You can cuss out the boss and expect to keep your job.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: jordanread on September 23, 2014, 04:02:39 PM
Just found this article.  Guess we can do this with impunity now...

http://www.caintv.com/obamas-nlrb-now-ordering-reins (http://www.caintv.com/obamas-nlrb-now-ordering-reins)

I don't think FU money means what you think it means... :D
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: zataks on September 26, 2014, 10:40:10 AM
Kind of have one; it's more about being badass by living below my means than actually having FU money but I think the principles are the same in this case.

Have been extremely over worked and understaffed for a long time and I reached a breaking point and applied for a different position that would be a voluntary demotion for me.  Not really much less money (maybe 5%) but a significant status and responsibility demotion.  I saw my manager yesterday (who I do not directly report to; there's a supervisor as a buffer) and told her how exhausted I am and concerned for my health and that is why I'm applying for the lower position. 
She came back to me later in the day and emailed today saying that they are going to get us temporary assistants for relief until a long-term position can be created as well as attempting to get me a status and wage promotion (10%)! 

tl;dr: because I don't need higher wages I encouraged management to give me help and more money by applying for a lower level job.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: SisterX on September 26, 2014, 11:54:52 AM
Just found this article.  Guess we can do this with impunity now...

http://www.caintv.com/obamas-nlrb-now-ordering-reins (http://www.caintv.com/obamas-nlrb-now-ordering-reins)

What the f*%# did I just read?  I sincerely hope that was satire, because otherwise it's partisan politics beyond inanity and into the realm of crazy.
Not satire.  Real.  You can cuss out the boss and expect to keep your job.

I was referring to the article itself.  It's crap.  And I'm not saying this from a partisan perspective, but as someone who understands journalism.  That article is not it.  Find better sources.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Joggernot on September 26, 2014, 01:59:39 PM
Just found this article.  Guess we can do this with impunity now...

http://www.caintv.com/obamas-nlrb-now-ordering-reins (http://www.caintv.com/obamas-nlrb-now-ordering-reins)

What the f*%# did I just read?  I sincerely hope that was satire, because otherwise it's partisan politics beyond inanity and into the realm of crazy.
Not satire.  Real.  You can cuss out the boss and expect to keep your job.

I was referring to the article itself.  It's crap.  And I'm not saying this from a partisan perspective, but as someone who understands journalism.  That article is not it.  Find better sources.
Please provide me with your list of unbiased sources that I may use them.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: nyxst on September 26, 2014, 02:37:20 PM
Back when I was married my ex had gotten promoted to a new job making decent money and his relative passed away leaving some inheritance.  I thought it was a good opportunity to shift gears and started taking real estate classes.  I worked as a receptionist at a lawyers office for shit money and didn't want to stay there forever.  Anyway, about a year later I was all squared away with my license. They hadn't given me a raise yet and it was about review time. They had increase my workload substantially from just receptionist to now doing all of the filing and estate planning for one of the partners.  I made a long list detailing everything I did for the firm and went in for my review.  I asked for a $8000 raise (which was a huge percentage of my salary...) and they basically laughed me out of the conference room.  So I handed them my two weeks notice (pre-typed) and kept my cool.  Each partner took turns over the next week grilling me on how I was going to manage and trying to scare me into staying.  Finally the 2 weeks passed and on my last Friday I was saying goodbye to my friends. Of course the top dawg partner calls me into his office and offers me a $10,000 to stay and said that he though I was just calling their bluff and they never interviewed anyone for the job and had no one to replace me.  I politely declined and explained that I didn't play games like that, but my moral code said human beings should treat each other with respect.  I was 23 at that time.... he was 67.. and he thought he was way more important that me since he was a big shot lawyer.  I don't think anyone had ever stood up for themselves like that with him.   It felt great! They ended up begging me to come in part time 2 days per week for over 3x my hourly rate to finish the estate work for 3 months.  I took that and ended up using them as my divorce lawyers (free of charge!!) so I'm glad I didn't burn the bridge to the ground.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Cheddar Stacker on September 26, 2014, 02:41:16 PM
@nyxst, cool story. Thanks for sharing.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Zamboni on September 26, 2014, 09:12:33 PM
That is a great story, nyxst.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: SisterX on September 29, 2014, 11:09:17 AM
Just found this article.  Guess we can do this with impunity now...

http://www.caintv.com/obamas-nlrb-now-ordering-reins (http://www.caintv.com/obamas-nlrb-now-ordering-reins)

What the f*%# did I just read?  I sincerely hope that was satire, because otherwise it's partisan politics beyond inanity and into the realm of crazy.
Not satire.  Real.  You can cuss out the boss and expect to keep your job.

I was referring to the article itself.  It's crap.  And I'm not saying this from a partisan perspective, but as someone who understands journalism.  That article is not it.  Find better sources.
Please provide me with your list of unbiased sources that I may use them.

I would never say "unbiased".  Everyone is biased.  I said "better".  The article you linked to?  That's the equivalent of using Buzzfeed as a source.

nyxst, fantastic story!!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: MooseOutFront on September 30, 2014, 09:49:46 AM
@nyxst, perfect FU money story.  FU and your money, guy.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: GardenFun on September 30, 2014, 11:14:43 AM
Worked at a company for over 13 years.  Had a major customer audit coming up.  Was working 12-14hrs/day for months preparing for it.  Boss (CEO) didn't understand the urgency and was consistently pushing against any changes I proposed until customer berated him due to lack of implementation.  It became my fault for not explaining the issue, not his fault for failing to listen for multiple months. 

One month prior to audit, boss tells me that they hired my replacement but are moving me to a new role.  Basically wanted me to sit in audit, state their implementation delay was my fault, and then let me go after audit was complete (my take on the last part).  Even if they didn't let me go, my workload wouldn't be reduced because the new hire would dump all the grunt work on me while she sat in meetings, looking very "director-ish". 

First conversation with boss on this change started with the phrase "you know, it is very hard to go from two incomes to one income".  I was in such shock, I didn't know what to say.  But what he didn't know was that the house was paid off, had plenty of FU money, and I had already planned on exiting the company a month or so after the audit, mostly due to him.  So I submit the 2-week notice, and the HR director (nice guy BTW), comes in and starts with the same "you know, it is very hard to go from two incomes to one income" line.  By this time, I had a night of sleep and a clear head.  I stopped him and said "we can skip the rest of the conversation.  This is where all of you erred in judgment.  I don't NEED to work.  I CHOOSE to work.  Everything we have is paid.  Forget the two week notice, I am quitting right now."  Didn't make a scene, just walked out.  I huge weight was lifted when I walked through those doors.  Met co-workers for lunch and they were happy for me to get the heck out of there.  Still friends with many of them. 

Like someone else said, you don't leave companies, you leave bosses. 
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: SwordGuy on September 30, 2014, 07:36:13 PM
Like someone else said, you don't leave companies, you leave bosses.

I did that very thing today!   

Same client, new client department, new employer, better pay, more interesting technology to work with. :)

Got a nice send off from the client management today, which I'm sure rubbed my old boss the wrong way.  He was lurking around all day today, barely spoke, but looked like he wanted to say something snarky and couldn't.   It was pretty creepy.

Ladies, know that guy who watches you all the time and stands - just so - in a way that makes the hair on the back of your neck stand up?   That's how it was today.   People who came into our work area noticed it right away and commented on it to me.

Only reason I didn't leave over a year ago was because I really believe in what our client does and want to do my best for them.

I don't have an epic FU story to go with it, other than to say that having a goodly stache meant I didn't have to worry while I looked for a better position.  I could negotiate with the client, my (now) past employer, and any potential new employer from a position of strength.   

Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: jprince7827 on October 02, 2014, 07:26:51 AM
So over a period of days I have read every. single. post. on this thread. This is the greatest thread of all time.

I too have a kind-of FU story, though at no point did I burn bridges or say FU.

About 1.2 years ago I was 1.5 years into my first job and hating it. We were working 10-12 hour days and once a quarter we'd spend a weekend in the office. It's software so spending that long coding does something to your mind. This is not to say my boss was an asshole, or even his boss's boss, I love and still love all the people that worked at this company, and consider my former boss one of my best friends and mentors. It was just that the upper management demanded unreasonable things from us in unreasonable time so we all had to put in the effort.

Well, 1.2 years ago, I was standing in the shower after having worked the last 12 days in a row, 10-12 hours each, and suddenly I had a nervous break down. It felt terrible and such a release at the same time. I resolved then and there that I'd begin looking for work elsewhere. I'd done my time.

Right after that, as if the company sensed I was pissed(I had been doing some interviews), the hours lessened, the deadlines became more reasonable, and we graduated to 9-10 hour days and weekends were a virtual guarantee. There was one 34 hour stint in the office overnight to get a product launched but I wore that as a badge of honor. I decided to stay, but also I started posting for jobs on Elance.

I took a job making <5$/hr for 20 hrs to beat out the Indians and built a Ruby gem wrapper for some company's API. It was crappy work. The next job I got a month later paid 20$/hr, and eventually I got that client up to 60$/hr. By the end of last year(about 8 months after said break down), I was charging 80$/hr for 10-15hrs/week on the side of my real job running a private consulting firm.

By January of this year I was making 1$ for every 1$ I made at work, working only 10-15hrs a week, making 100$/hr. I had hired on my co-workers to do part-time work for me and was making 50% margins on their hours as well. In one two week period, I brought in 5,000$, outside of my normal paycheck.

Life was good. I was stashing hard. Then my main client offered me the CTO position at his company, for 2x my current salary, with similar equity. I thought about it hard for three weeks, and then informed my boss. My boss didn't even try to counter me, though if he had matched the price, or even come close, I would have certainly stayed - by this point the hours had gotten much more palatable.

I gave them 6 weeks notice, and during those 6 weeks the company offered me to keep working out of my office there since my new job was completely remote. They wanted to keep an eye on me and basically would let me have my job back whenever I want. In return, whenever they have a question about the software I wrote I'm right there to ask, and I still get to hang out with my co-workers every day(though they're in a different part of the building now.) They're good friends, so it works out.

The new company I work for is a startup and while they DO have money it is a risk. My previous company is worth 500mm. The stashing I did during the last year made sure I had at least 4 months expenses saved up before I dropped the bomb, and this is not even counting the years of coverage I have stashed in my retirement accounts if the worse came to worst.

FU money is a powerful thing. And now I'm freer than I've ever been.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: trailrated on October 02, 2014, 09:25:37 AM
Congrats, truly inspiring! It is pretty amazing to see real world examples paying off...it really reinforces why we all do what we do here.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: dragoncar on October 02, 2014, 09:32:51 AM
So over a period of days I have read every. single. post. on this thread. This is the greatest thread of all time.

I too have a kind-of FU story, though at no point did I burn bridges or say FU.

About 1.2 years ago I was 1.5 years into my first job and hating it. We were working 10-12 hour days and once a quarter we'd spend a weekend in the office. It's software so spending that long coding does something to your mind. This is not to say my boss was an asshole, or even his boss's boss, I love and still love all the people that worked at this company, and consider my former boss one of my best friends and mentors. It was just that the upper management demanded unreasonable things from us in unreasonable time so we all had to put in the effort.

Well, 1.2 years ago, I was standing in the shower after having worked the last 12 days in a row, 10-12 hours each, and suddenly I had a nervous break down. It felt terrible and such a release at the same time. I resolved then and there that I'd begin looking for work elsewhere. I'd done my time.

Right after that, as if the company sensed I was pissed(I had been doing some interviews), the hours lessened, the deadlines became more reasonable, and we graduated to 9-10 hour days and weekends were a virtual guarantee. There was one 34 hour stint in the office overnight to get a product launched but I wore that as a badge of honor. I decided to stay, but also I started posting for jobs on Elance.

I took a job making <5$/hr for 20 hrs to beat out the Indians and built a Ruby gem wrapper for some company's API. It was crappy work. The next job I got a month later paid 20$/hr, and eventually I got that client up to 60$/hr. By the end of last year(about 8 months after said break down), I was charging 80$/hr for 10-15hrs/week on the side of my real job running a private consulting firm.

By January of this year I was making 1$ for every 1$ I made at work, working only 10-15hrs a week, making 100$/hr. I had hired on my co-workers to do part-time work for me and was making 50% margins on their hours as well. In one two week period, I brought in 5,000$, outside of my normal paycheck.

Life was good. I was stashing hard. Then my main client offered me the CTO position at his company, for 2x my current salary, with similar equity. I thought about it hard for three weeks, and then informed my boss. My boss didn't even try to counter me, though if he had matched the price, or even come close, I would have certainly stayed - by this point the hours had gotten much more palatable.

I gave them 6 weeks notice, and during those 6 weeks the company offered me to keep working out of my office there since my new job was completely remote. They wanted to keep an eye on me and basically would let me have my job back whenever I want. In return, whenever they have a question about the software I wrote I'm right there to ask, and I still get to hang out with my co-workers every day(though they're in a different part of the building now.) They're good friends, so it works out.

The new company I work for is a startup and while they DO have money it is a risk. My previous company is worth 500mm. The stashing I did during the last year made sure I had at least 4 months expenses saved up before I dropped the bomb, and this is not even counting the years of coverage I have stashed in my retirement accounts if the worse came to worst.

FU money is a powerful thing. And now I'm freer than I've ever been.

Ah yes, nothing like an incestuous client relationship to keep the money train rolling :-)
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: jprince7827 on October 02, 2014, 01:27:57 PM
Quote

Ah yes, nothing like an incestuous client relationship to keep the money train rolling :-)

Not to mention one of my subcontractors was my brother, so hello nepotism :D He also then did two years of internship at the 500mm company on my recommendation. It's all who you know in this world.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: oinkette on October 06, 2014, 02:35:05 PM
Mine isn't a real FU story but I did manage to quit.

I basically had the boss who could write the book on how NOT to be a manager.  How one could manage to be a micro-manager yet totally unavailable is beyond me, but that was him.  He literally walked around the office at 4:55 each day to make sure everyone was still there.  His way of "motivating" people (literally his words) was to threaten to fire them.

He was absurdly paranoid to the degree that we could not send an email to another department unless we cc'ed him. He forbade us from going to the staff Christmas party or the staff retreat. 

Then he hired a crazy woman to be the assistant manager so he wouldn't have to deal with us lowly worker bees. She basically took her cues from him and one upped them.  She would lie to make us look bad in front of clients.  She took over the 4:55pm rounds, but worse, she was a workaholic and did the rounds at 8am as well to make sure we were there for the start of the day as well. 

One day she informed me, in front of coworkers, that my top was innappropriate because I was "jiggling" in it.  It wasn't even low-cut or tight! I know because I checked with at least 3 other employees (other the ones who were right there and appropriattely mortified for me).

I eventually found another job accross town making 10% more in a better company.  My last day I wore that top just to spite her.  The best part is, we have monthly meetings in town with all the people who work in that industry and so I see both her and my old boss occasionally.  I try to wear that top (which my current boss has no problem with) when I can.  I'm also sure it's a thorn in his paranoid side to know that I discuss him and his awful management style with my current coworkers.  Which I do.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: TootTootBeepBeep on December 05, 2014, 08:04:32 PM
I didn't end up quitting, but it felt really good

I had just gone through a company sponsored training program that was significant in time and money, but poorly run. I didn't get a lot out of it. Throughout the program I gave a lot of feedback to make it more useful, but this fell on deaf ears. Upon being released and required to perform my new monkey skills I still needed to ask for help. I went to a good friend and coworker just down the way to ask how to do a particular task. While talking to my cw and a few others about the task, his boss (a bitter old man who helped fund the training program) approached. He listened for a moment then looked directly at me and said:

You can't even do that? Well you aren't worth much.

I looked him in the eye and stated: You're a Dick.

TBH I didn't actually mean to say it, It was word vomit. BUT IT FELT WONDERFUL!

The company i work for is super prim and proper. It is a large organization, but this man certainly could have had me fired or at least had me written up among other punishments. He and the other cw's stood in disbelief and I walked away.

Though no consequences (that i am aware of) came to be, my small FU 'stache which would cover my expenses for 6 months or so gave me the freedom from anxiety of whatever consequence my word vomit would produce. It was the best, most accidental moment of my working career.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Zamboni on December 05, 2014, 08:17:31 PM
^That's beautiful.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: jprince7827 on December 05, 2014, 08:18:04 PM

I looked him in the eye and stated: You're a Dick.


DAYUMN.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: smalllife on December 06, 2014, 10:20:56 AM
I finally have a story!

I don't have what I consider to be a FU stache, but I just had a major win at work.  My company has been resisting work from home opportunities for people in my department because of some responsibilities that do require physical presence.  I had a conversation with my direct boss and good friend that basically said that if the work environment didn't change I was one foot out the door.  The work is fine, we're just understaffed, overburdened, and have a physically stressful work environment (constant noise, distractions, and interruptions).  That led to a nice long chat with the head of the company, who will be meeting with my department to air some laundry and create a workable list of solutions.  AND I get to test working from home one day a week :-)

I credit a semblance of FU stache, a growing confidence in my skills and employability, and a wonderfully supportive SO.

WIN!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: DoubleDown on December 06, 2014, 10:39:48 AM

One day she informed me, in front of coworkers, that my top was innappropriate because I was "jiggling" in it.  It wasn't even low-cut or tight! I know because I checked with at least 3 other employees (other the ones who were right there and appropriattely mortified for me).


I am not an employment law expert, but I'd say (based on a fair amount of training as a manager) this is about as much of a glaring, textbook, poster child example of sexual harassment that you could find (okay, one slightly step higher would be "have sex with me or I'll fire you"). I'd venture that if you pursued a claim against the company, you would almost certainly win (or force a settlement). I'm not advocating that course of action, because you may very well deem it's best to let it go and give it no further attention or power in your life. But if you were inclined to do so, I'd say you have a rock solid case. Perhaps a lawyer with experience in this area could chime in, if needed.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: ScienceSexSavings on December 06, 2014, 12:00:22 PM
Vengeful fashion statements are my favorite fashion statements.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: RetiredAt63 on December 07, 2014, 06:42:24 AM
My story is not at all dramatic, but it does illustrate the power of FU.

I was close to retirement in my teaching job (1 year to go) when I heard about a really interesting term contract.  I applied, was offered the job, but - the job was at a higher level, in a Province that pays better, and they offered me less than the salary I was already making.  I had checked with the faculty union and knew starting salaries were negotiable, unlike the school I was at where salaries were totally set by the collective agreement (so I was not at all used to negotiating).  I had to sadly but confidently explain that although I really wanted the job, I did not need the job (which they knew) and I could not afford to take the job since they were offering me considerably less than my salary. Counteroffer - if the person talking salary with me could get it, would I take the job if I had a salary match plus some research money? Yes, I say, and a phone call a few days later said I had the new salary.  Of course after that it was a whirlwind move, but no bridges burned.  I am still on excellent terms with colleagues and superiors at my previous school and visit at least once a year.  But I did all the "responsible" things, got everything prepared for my successor, all in about two weeks.    So everyone was happy, although my colleagues were in shock at how fast it all happened - academic moves like I did are usually long slow processes.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: retired? on December 07, 2014, 11:07:38 AM
In my view, the real value of FU$ is that it allows one to not say FU and hang on in fairly poor, but not horrific situations.  It changes your mindset and allows one to ignore stuff that would otherwise make you quit.  Two cases where this is very valuable are 1) you're in a high paying job but want more savings and 2) you are near your preferred full retirement age......allows you to hold on rather than enter a job search.

Unfortunately for me, I didn't realize that I had FU$.  Wasn't until after I quit (first time I'd quit without having a new job lined up) and started reading MMM, etc. that I started to realize I could cut way back on my earnings and be fine.  With my new and better understanding of my situation, I probably would not have quit.  Just knowing you can is a powerful thing.  Makes me think of the quote "The best offense is a good defense".


RE leaving managers rather than companies, attached is what I provided to sr. mgt. who perhaps had no idea how poor the mgr above me really was.  The company has an agenda to have more women in higher roles (a good idea), but there are not many women, at this firm, in roles that would lead to sr mgt roles.  Thus, whether or not a lady has sound mgt skills does not really matter in whether to "fast track" them.  I got a poor one.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Nords on December 07, 2014, 11:17:01 AM
In my view, the real value of FU$ is that it allows one to not say FU and hang on in fairly poor, but not horrific situations.  It changes your mindset and allows one to ignore stuff that would otherwise make you quit.  Two cases where this is very valuable are 1) you're in a high paying job but want more savings and 2) you are near your preferred full retirement age......allows you to hold on rather than enter a job search.

Unfortunately for me, I didn't realize that I had FU$.  Wasn't until after I quit (first time I'd quit without having a new job lined up) and started reading MMM, etc. that I started to realize I could cut way back on my earnings and be fine.  With my new and better understanding of my situation, I probably would not have quit.  Just knowing you can is a powerful thing.  Makes me think of the quote "The best offense is a good defense".
If it's any consolation, anecdotal experience over the last decade (both here and Early-Retirement.org) indicates that once you're FI you have even less patience for the BS. 

I'm skeptical that anyone can ignore quitting-level provocations when they can just-- quit.  Six months before you reach FI, sure.  Six months after-- not so much.

My brother-in-law the tax CPA is coming up on his last tax season.  He just reached FI this summer but he Stockholm Syndrome feels obligated to go through one more marathon with the team before hanging it up in May.  Either that or he wants to make sure that he understands exactly why he's going to ER and never go back...
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: retired? on December 07, 2014, 11:57:11 AM
Nords - I'd call my situation "at FU$ with do-able effort in the spending area", but working another 5 years and I'd be "FU$ with no effort".  That's the trade-off for me.

There's FI and there's FI.  But, I agree, FI doesn't require much change would make it hard to put up with the bs.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: lizzie on December 07, 2014, 12:44:22 PM

One day she informed me, in front of coworkers, that my top was innappropriate because I was "jiggling" in it.  It wasn't even low-cut or tight! I know because I checked with at least 3 other employees (other the ones who were right there and appropriattely mortified for me).


I am not an employment law expert, but I'd say (based on a fair amount of training as a manager) this is about as much of a glaring, textbook, poster child example of sexual harassment that you could find (okay, one slightly step higher would be "have sex with me or I'll fire you"). I'd venture that if you pursued a claim against the company, you would almost certainly win (or force a settlement). I'm not advocating that course of action, because you may very well deem it's best to let it go and give it no further attention or power in your life. But if you were inclined to do so, I'd say you have a rock solid case. Perhaps a lawyer with experience in this area could chime in, if needed.

Nonlawyers are often under the impression that comments like this lead to automatic liability and big payouts from employers. It just isn't so. Sexual harassment is actionable only when it is so severe or pervasive that it effectively changes a term or condition of the plaintiff's employment. The "jiggling" comment almost certainly wouldn't meet that standard. You would be completely shocked at the behavior that courts have said is not severe enough to create liability.

That said, lawsuits are still expensive for employers, even if the employer is almost certainly likely to win. They want employees to stay far away from any behavior that could lead to a lawsuit so as to avoid the expense. That's why they train their managers to nip this kind of thing in the bud.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Raay on December 08, 2014, 01:57:32 PM
Having read many of these stories here, I don't get one point: why do the posters feel self-congratulatory and proud about them in a cynical way?

From my point of view (of a self-employed individual who also employs some other people), you are the guys who have voluntarily signed a contract to work for someone, agreeing to conditions set out in said contract, essentially selling your best-effort labor for a given remuneration. If you don't like the conditions or think the pay is too low, you should have sought employment elsewhere (or maybe self-employment). If your employer is violating the contract terms, politely decline to continue working for them and get out. Even if your employer mistreated you, behaving like some entitled vengeful brat, sabotaging work while waiting for the "enough FU money release" and then sticking it "to the man" when you quit reflects as poorly on you as it does on your unfortunate boss.

Unless you were kidnapped and forced into slave labor, an bad employment contract is by your choice and by your fault to a great extent. Staying longer than you like and sacrificing your ethics and work morale just for the paycheck (or maybe for your children's sake or what not) demonstrates that you were probably not worth hiring in the first place.

P.S. It may come as a shock to you, but managers are people, too, not some bloodthirsty alien exploiters. They may be even genuinely worried about you from time to time, and they are most certainly concerned about making things run smoothly (if only in self-interest).
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: hdizz on December 08, 2014, 02:09:49 PM
Having read many of these stories here, I don't get one point: why do the posters feel self-congratulatory and proud about them in a cynical way?

From my point of view (of a self-employed individual who also employs some other people), you are the guys who have voluntarily signed a contract to work for someone, agreeing to conditions set out in said contract, essentially selling your best-effort labor for a given remuneration. If you don't like the conditions or think the pay is too low, you should have sought employment elsewhere (or maybe self-employment). If your employer is violating the contract terms, politely decline to continue working for them and get out. Even if your employer mistreated you, behaving like some entitled vengeful brat, sabotaging work while waiting for the "enough FU money release" and then sticking it "to the man" when you quit reflects as poorly on you as it does on your unfortunate boss.

Unless you were kidnapped and forced into slave labor, an bad employment contract is by your choice and by your fault to a great extent. Staying longer than you like and sacrificing your ethics and work morale just for the paycheck (or maybe for your children's sake or what not) demonstrates that you were probably not worth hiring in the first place.

P.S. It may come as a shock to you, but managers are people, too, not some bloodthirsty alien exploiters. They may be even genuinely worried about you from time to time, and they are most certainly concerned about making things run smoothly (if only in self-interest).

When you say "employment contract" are you speaking figuratively?  Because while you make some good points, for many the only conditions set out as requirements are the minimum requirements of US labor law, and frankly, even then I've rarely seen all of them met at the same time, and this is at white collar and blue collar jobs alike.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: NumberCruncher on December 08, 2014, 02:16:13 PM
Having read many of these stories here, I don't get one point: why do the posters feel self-congratulatory and proud about them in a cynical way?

From my point of view (of a self-employed individual who also employs some other people), you are the guys who have voluntarily signed a contract to work for someone, agreeing to conditions set out in said contract, essentially selling your best-effort labor for a given remuneration. If you don't like the conditions or think the pay is too low, you should have sought employment elsewhere (or maybe self-employment). If your employer is violating the contract terms, politely decline to continue working for them and get out. Even if your employer mistreated you, behaving like some entitled vengeful brat, sabotaging work while waiting for the "enough FU money release" and then sticking it "to the man" when you quit reflects as poorly on you as it does on your unfortunate boss.

Unless you were kidnapped and forced into slave labor, an bad employment contract is by your choice and by your fault to a great extent. Staying longer than you like and sacrificing your ethics and work morale just for the paycheck (or maybe for your children's sake or what not) demonstrates that you were probably not worth hiring in the first place.

P.S. It may come as a shock to you, but managers are people, too, not some bloodthirsty alien exploiters. They may be even genuinely worried about you from time to time, and they are most certainly concerned about making things run smoothly (if only in self-interest).

You do have a point to a certain extent - sabotaging work is not the healthiest response to a bad work environment, but those stories seem like the minority.

I think the problem is that too often it can feel like you're trapped into a job and don't have the flexibility to choose or just get another job (or maybe the energy to look after particularly stressful days). That's why FU money (and mustachianism in general) can be so powerful, as illustrated in what seems to me as the majority of stories on this thread - you start feeling like you have the agency to up and move, as opposed to living in fear. Many people without as much financial security would see declining work as a luxury they could not afford.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Eric on December 08, 2014, 02:16:44 PM
Having read many of these stories here, I don't get one point: why do the posters feel self-congratulatory and proud about them in a cynical way?

From my point of view (of a self-employed individual who also employs some other people), you are the guys who have voluntarily signed a contract to work for someone, agreeing to conditions set out in said contract, essentially selling your best-effort labor for a given remuneration. If you don't like the conditions or think the pay is too low, you should have sought employment elsewhere (or maybe self-employment). If your employer is violating the contract terms, politely decline to continue working for them and get out. Even if your employer mistreated you, behaving like some entitled vengeful brat, sabotaging work while waiting for the "enough FU money release" and then sticking it "to the man" when you quit reflects as poorly on you as it does on your unfortunate boss.

Congrats!  You figured out the point of this thread!  Quitting feels good when your job sucks, but you can't quit if you're in debt or living paycheck to paycheck.  Hence, F U Money.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Raay on December 08, 2014, 02:17:56 PM
Having read many of these stories here, I don't get one point: why do the posters feel self-congratulatory and proud about them in a cynical way?

From my point of view (of a self-employed individual who also employs some other people), you are the guys who have voluntarily signed a contract to work for someone, agreeing to conditions set out in said contract, essentially selling your best-effort labor for a given remuneration. If you don't like the conditions or think the pay is too low, you should have sought employment elsewhere (or maybe self-employment). If your employer is violating the contract terms, politely decline to continue working for them and get out. Even if your employer mistreated you, behaving like some entitled vengeful brat, sabotaging work while waiting for the "enough FU money release" and then sticking it "to the man" when you quit reflects as poorly on you as it does on your unfortunate boss.

Unless you were kidnapped and forced into slave labor, an bad employment contract is by your choice and by your fault to a great extent. Staying longer than you like and sacrificing your ethics and work morale just for the paycheck (or maybe for your children's sake or what not) demonstrates that you were probably not worth hiring in the first place.

P.S. It may come as a shock to you, but managers are people, too, not some bloodthirsty alien exploiters. They may be even genuinely worried about you from time to time, and they are most certainly concerned about making things run smoothly (if only in self-interest).

When you say "employment contract" are you speaking figuratively?  Because while you make some good points, for many the only conditions set out as requirements are the minimum requirements of US labor law, and frankly, even then I've rarely seen all of them met at the same time, and this is at white collar and blue collar jobs alike.

Well, the places I worked (white collar in Germany) all had written contracts that always included a job description, at least outlining the tasks and responsibilities involved, and also included the clause that I will essentially "do my best" to fulfill my assigned duties. So saying "FU" to my employer or attempting any other "epic" escape would certainly feel to me like breaching the contract that I myself signed.

Here in Germany we also get an "Arbeitszeugnis" at the end of a job - which is a recommendation (or a veiled warning) from the employer that can be presented to (and is often asked by) the next employer. I long felt that it was stupid and patronizing and sucking out employees' liberty, but considering some stories told here, maybe it's not such a bad idea...
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Raay on December 08, 2014, 02:22:31 PM
Having read many of these stories here, I don't get one point: why do the posters feel self-congratulatory and proud about them in a cynical way?

From my point of view (of a self-employed individual who also employs some other people), you are the guys who have voluntarily signed a contract to work for someone, agreeing to conditions set out in said contract, essentially selling your best-effort labor for a given remuneration. If you don't like the conditions or think the pay is too low, you should have sought employment elsewhere (or maybe self-employment). If your employer is violating the contract terms, politely decline to continue working for them and get out. Even if your employer mistreated you, behaving like some entitled vengeful brat, sabotaging work while waiting for the "enough FU money release" and then sticking it "to the man" when you quit reflects as poorly on you as it does on your unfortunate boss.

Congrats!  You figured out the point of this thread!  Quitting feels good when your job sucks, but you can't quit if you're in debt or living paycheck to paycheck.  Hence, F U Money.

Ok, I suppose I'm just arguing semantics. "FU money" certainly has an aggressive/negative/malevolent connotation to me... unlike "FI money". I just note that many stories revolve against long-term unhealthy work relationships and vengeful quitting, not just departure (maybe simply because the latter - not involving any sort of scandalous behavior or vigilance - tend to be rather boring and go unnoticed).
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: GardenFun on December 08, 2014, 05:02:50 PM
One common problem in the U.S. are "non-compete agreements".  So if you are good at your job in a particular field, but the working conditions at your company have deteriorated from when you first hired on (and signed the non-compete), you typically cannot work in the industry for 1-2 years, depending on the length of non-compete paperwork.  For most of us who got a job right out of college and have worked at the same place for 10+ years, trying to break a non-compete agreement is a unknown (and somewhat scary) issue.  Hence, the desire/freedom of having FU money available to ride out the unemployed/underemployed timeframe.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Zamboni on December 08, 2014, 05:22:36 PM
^^Congratulations because it certainly sounds like your working conditions in white collar Germany were better than people is the USA often experience.

Until very recently I have not had a job description that had any substance to it.  In some jobs there was not any description at all, or at least not one that anyone showed to me.  Other descriptions were so vague as to be completely meaningless.  I certainly agree with you:  it is refreshing to have an explicit document that one can examine before taking a job, and then again later whenever there are questions about exactly what one is supposed to be doing. 

But you have to remember that people often take job A (which might or might not have no written job description but is fairly amenable to the person's skills and interests) and then, either gradually over time or suddenly, that lovely job gets morphed into completely different job B without anyone ever asking them about it.  Sometimes it is simply a change of manager that leads to this; some managers just like to ignore formal company policies like working hours and some managers think it is somehow fun or motivational to insult or belittle other people. Sometimes it is a formal restructuring that takes a person out of a role they like and puts them into work conditions they don't enjoy at all. Sometimes someone ends up being harassed daily for years or otherwise harshly mistreated, and this is certainly difficult to predict from a few minutes at an interview before taking a job.  Sometimes a worker (often a women or minority) finds out that he or she is being drastically underpaid compared to everyone else who has the same job.  Sometimes when they point this out to the kind and reasonable manager that we must all surely work for, they are told "tough shit" either quite directly or in not so many words.  Indeed, there are all kinds of reasons someone might have an FU attitude upon leaving a job, and if you have never experienced that, then be thankful that you have had such a charmed working life.

GardenFun, from what I understand non-compete agreements are rarely worth the paper they are written on, but they do effectively scare many people into thinking that can't get another similar job.  Originally they were designed to keep salesmen from stealing customer lists, which made sense. I worked for a company that instituted these mid-stream to all employees after I'd been there a few years (everyone had to sign one when they earned their next promotion.)  The result was that most people just wouldn't tell anyone at work where they were going to work next when they left the company.  It was odd.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: electriceagle on December 08, 2014, 05:39:30 PM
One common problem in the U.S. are "non-compete agreements".  So if you are good at your job in a particular field, but the working conditions at your company have deteriorated from when you first hired on (and signed the non-compete), you typically cannot work in the industry for 1-2 years, depending on the length of non-compete paperwork.  For most of us who got a job right out of college and have worked at the same place for 10+ years, trying to break a non-compete agreement is a unknown (and somewhat scary) issue.  Hence, the desire/freedom of having FU money available to ride out the unemployed/underemployed timeframe.

Fortunately, these are enforceable in California only when your former employer pays you for your time.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: gimp on December 08, 2014, 08:34:13 PM
Quote
from what I understand non-compete agreements are rarely worth the paper they are written on

This is true. California is especially explicit, but it holds true pretty much everywhere: if you want an employee to honor a non-compete, you're paying them.

Investment banks and financial firms actually often do this, if you're laid off or whatever they will pay you 3 months' salary in exchange for a 3-month noncompete agreement. (3 months is normal but it may be more or less.) This is so that by the time you go back to work, any confidential information you had is most likely irrelevant / out in the open.

Tech companies try to make employees sign non-compete agreements but you can just laugh at those. Some try to make the noncompete a condition of employment but they'll never enforce it. In some cases, they will actually pay out to get a noncompete to really hold weight. This is entirely different from signing upon leaving that you won't discuss internal xxyyz and secret blah blah; that's not only good form, it's also probably already implicitly agreed upon when you signed NDAs to start working - now it's just explicit what you're NDAing on. Interviewers always understand an answer like "Well, I worked in this area with these sort of tools, but unfortunately I can't give you explicit details" - because your new employer wants you to be good at keeping secrets.

Basically non-competes are bullshit scare tactics. I've actually heard of non-competes... for people working in fast food... so they "can't" work for any other competition (any other restaurant in the area.) You can imagine exactly how much this is enforced. But you can also imagine scumbag managers ("managers" earning $10/hr instead of $8/hr) threatening high school kids with legal action if they take that taco bell job. Shit's weird, yo.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: farmstache on December 09, 2014, 06:21:03 AM
Well, the places I worked (white collar in Germany) all had written contracts that always included a job description, at least outlining the tasks and responsibilities involved, and also included the clause that I will essentially "do my best" to fulfill my assigned duties. So saying "FU" to my employer or attempting any other "epic" escape would certainly feel to me like breaching the contract that I myself signed.

I think you either might not have experienced workplaces that are just bad enough, or maybe you are in a line of work where people don't suck the life out of their employees. Maybe Germany is nicer about their employers. I had contracts with job descriptions once. About a month in, the whole job description had changed, because me and another employee could work best at different stuff and our manager redivided the responsibilities to cater to our strengths. This was for the best and certainly was not added to the contract. Then there are whole industries where you are hired for 40h weeks, but expected to "give your blood and sweat" to the company, and work 60h weeks. This isn't in the contract and if you want out, you have to basically change your whole field of work, because every company is very similar in this field.

Still, most of us DO AGREE with these crazy conditions beforehand and it isn't them that makes us want to quit in a whim. It's the attitude of a boss after you ask to change some of it, it's a problem with a coworker, it's a particularly long stretch of strenuous work without recognition and taken for granted, it's the fact that you reach FI and don't need it anymore. If you have a boss that sucks, sometimes you won't be able (or want) to quit "politely" as you say. Also, there are bosses that feel extremely insulted by someone's leaving, especially if the reason isn't a higher pay somewhere else.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Dr.Vibrissae on December 09, 2014, 06:25:38 AM
Quote
from what I understand non-compete agreements are rarely worth the paper they are written on
...
Basically non-competes are bullshit scare tactics....
In my field non-competes of a year are pretty typical, however, they are usually geographically limited. They can be challenged on the grounds that the geographic radius (5 miles or whatever) is wider than the area from which clients are drawn.  However, if they are appropriate, they are enforceable.  This is to stop associates from leaving a practice, setting up they're own shop (or moving to a neighboring practice) and poaching their previous employer's clients. Or, less commonly, to prevent a Dr. from selling their practice and then reopening a new practice shortly thereafter.

I worked with one Dr. who was originally hired on a part-time contract (no non-compete clause) though she was now working full-time hours.  She used that fact and the fact that she was the highest grossing Dr. as leverage to improve the terms of our emergency duty and to resist interference from the terrible manager that was hired on just before I left.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Raay on December 09, 2014, 02:46:44 PM
Zamboni and farmstache, I see your point ("this is not what I signed up for"), but still I wouldn't condone developing a FU attitude - I guess I dislike that it implicitly (and perhaps somewhat paradoxically) puts you into a "vengeful victim" position rather than at eye level with your employer.

To put it another way, I don't like the idea of tit for tat taken to such extremes - if someone is an asshole to you, it doesn't automatically justify  being asshole to them (I'd say it's not honorable) or worse yet, toward the company (as in case of a single asshole manager - by making a FU exit you might be striking not so much against that particular person, but more against the organization, which may or may not be at fault for your "misfortune"). To put it even shorter, it's childish behavior.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: RyanAtTanagra on December 09, 2014, 04:23:27 PM
Zamboni and farmstache, I see your point ("this is not what I signed up for"), but still I wouldn't condone developing a FU attitude - I guess I dislike that it implicitly (and perhaps somewhat paradoxically) puts you into a "vengeful victim" position rather than at eye level with your employer.

I think you're looking at it too far on that end of the spectrum.  FU money isn't so you can treat your employer poorly, it's so you don't have to put up with your employer treating YOU poorly.  Before getting into personal finance I was in debt and broke feeling stuck working for a shitty company and a shitty boss.  Once I got my finances under control, nothing about how I treated my company or did my job changed, but it let me see a way out, so I did, burning no bridges and having an open offer to come back.  That's how I read most of the stories here.  Maybe having FU money is like having power, where it can show you what kind of person you are?
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Bikeguy on December 09, 2014, 05:00:12 PM
Wanted to point out that non competes for employees are illegal in California.   So,  if you move to California,  your non compete won't apply.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: SwordGuy on December 09, 2014, 06:34:45 PM
Depends on whether the non-compete has a clause in it stating the court of jurisdiction is somewhere else...
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: iamsoners on December 09, 2014, 09:09:41 PM
Wow, great thread. I've got one, and it involves the entire Board of Directors of our organization...

My first job out of college was working for a rapidly growing non-profit.  It grew way faster than management had the capacity or brains to deal with. After 12 weeks as a temp, they hired me to run an entire department (fresh out of college, with a degree in history which I assure you was entirely unrelated to the task at hand).

In the beginning the work had a sense of urgency to it and I enjoyed essentially getting thrown into the deep end and learning how to swim in my field. But the leaders of this organization were crazy--narcissistic, lazy, fought with each other over everything, were working kick backs, you name it. Job dissatisfaction was high and so was turn-over (about 50% per year).

At one point I quit my job and stayed on as a consultant. My new job didn't pan out and I still really cared about the cause and had hope for changes in the organization (the Board had just fired the E.D.) so I negotiated to come back--at twice what my starting salary had been 24 months prior.

I stayed for another 2 years and though the organization never got better or more effective. It was boring and easy but the money was ridiculous for my age and being a non-profit so I stuck around, saving something like 65%.

But it was crushing my idealism to see these absolute idiots squander so much money, pick fights with each other, and generally do nothing to address our stated mission. One guy, "Tony" was particularly tedious and terrible--farming work out to other departments, taking credit for things he didn't do, boring the shit out of us with his slide-show presentations of photographs from his most recent vacations (which were mandatory!!), doing inane shit like making everyone with an Associate job title carry his 30 houseplants across the office when he moved to a bigger office, always asking the youngest woman in the office to get him a sandwich (that kinda crap makes me mad--you have an assistant, don't take advantage of the new kids). Oh and he organized an all staff retreat led by EST (which may or may not be a cult depending on who you talk to). Honestly--it wasn't the straight up stealing stuff I'd seen previous senior staff do but it was enough to be annnnnnnnnooooyyying but not really my problem since it was in another department.

Then, it just so happened that the day I went to put in my resignation, the E.D. also announced his departure. The Board of Directors of the organization was meeting in person and called us in towards the end of the day to let us know that "Tony" would manage things for the forseeable future (probably a year, maybe forever).  After 25 years of shit jobs, this was finally Tony's big break!

The Board benignly asked if anyone had any questions or concerns.... I raise my hand and politely ask why this guy is being promoted when all of his direct reports have filed complaints against him, their department never meets their targets and he took us all to his cult meeting?  I'm not joking when I say I said it in the politest possible tone. He was sitting 5 feet from me. This set off an hour of others piling on their complaints about why he shouldn't lead the organization.

Ultimately the Board continued with their plan to place him as interim director--which only shows how f'ed up the whole place was. But it felt good to tell them all the crap that was happening under their watch and it did probably prevent him from becoming the permanent ED.

Several years on from that, I probably wouldn't do it again today--it's not worth any professional consequences and it's not as important to me to prove my rightness by being mean.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: iamsoners on December 09, 2014, 09:17:14 PM
As an aside, I also witnessed another pretty badass departure from the same organization.  Our first ED had some actual psychological problems--narcissism high among them. He went through assistants at a pretty fast clip--probably one per month.  At one point we hired a new assistant. He came into work two days, everything seemed as ok as it could be given the crazy boss. The weekend passed, Monday came, everyone said hey, "where's new assistant"?  I sat in the cube next to him. Tuesday: Hey, has anyone seen new assistant?  Wednesday: Someone should call new assistant...

It took the company two weeks to realize new assistant was never coming back.

Also at the same company:
-woman gives her resignation and two weeks notice in protest of them firing one of her friends. Over the next two weeks she files a major complaint with the BBB and gathers confidential info about the org which she then uses to start an "anonymous" blog criticizing the organization--it was well read amongst staff and the entire community of our work.
-man gets fired. deletes all of the files off of his computer before walking out. We had no system to deal with that... the files were literally just gone.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: halftimer on December 09, 2014, 10:31:02 PM
I have 2 related stories of being willing to end a job when the circumstances merited:
1. My long time office was moving to another city, and offered to fund my relocation with them. After considering all the options, I said no but helped train my replacement and accepted a lovely severance/parting package. I took a few months off without even looking for another job, then decided to try out temping.
2. The agency put me in a 'temp to hire' position that started off ok, but my coworkers were horrible. After a particularly bad day I realized there was no reason for me to continue. I called the agency and asked how much notice was needed to quit. "None" (Mental high-five!) But the next day when the agency relayed to the company that I would not be returning, the big boss asked for permission to contact me. I consented and explained why I didn't want to continue, then he explained that my coworkers were "known bullies" but that he planned to close that department in 2 months. They had not yet given the layoff notices, but if I was willing to keep that information confidential they wanted me to continue on during the transition, then afterwards in a better position. I admit it was a lovely feeling going back into work the day after that - having the bullies speculate on why I was not there the day before and then continue with their grumbling - while I smiled with the knowledge that they had 10 years tenure and were about to get rightfully fired, while I was invited to stay in a bought out contract. I continued with that job for a few years with advancing responsibilities and never regretted my early meeting with the boss at the time when I 'quit'.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: jprince7827 on December 10, 2014, 10:11:09 AM
I have 2 related stories of being willing to end a job when the circumstances merited:
1. My long time office was moving to another city, and offered to fund my relocation with them. After considering all the options, I said no but helped train my replacement and accepted a lovely severance/parting package. I took a few months off without even looking for another job, then decided to try out temping.
2. The agency put me in a 'temp to hire' position that started off ok, but my coworkers were horrible. After a particularly bad day I realized there was no reason for me to continue. I called the agency and asked how much notice was needed to quit. "None" (Mental high-five!) But the next day when the agency relayed to the company that I would not be returning, the big boss asked for permission to contact me. I consented and explained why I didn't want to continue, then he explained that my coworkers were "known bullies" but that he planned to close that department in 2 months. They had not yet given the layoff notices, but if I was willing to keep that information confidential they wanted me to continue on during the transition, then afterwards in a better position. I admit it was a lovely feeling going back into work the day after that - having the bullies speculate on why I was not there the day before and then continue with their grumbling - while I smiled with the knowledge that they had 10 years tenure and were about to get rightfully fired, while I was invited to stay in a bought out contract. I continued with that job for a few years with advancing responsibilities and never regretted my early meeting with the boss at the time when I 'quit'.

Oh, that's just delicious. Well played, sir.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: BlueHouse on December 10, 2014, 02:05:17 PM
Unless you were kidnapped and forced into slave labor, an bad employment contract is by your choice and by your fault to a great extent. Staying longer than you like and sacrificing your ethics and work morale just for the paycheck (or maybe for your children's sake or what not) demonstrates that you were probably not worth hiring in the first place.
When I was a college student working as a waitress, I thought it was so much fun!  I couldn't understand how or why the older servers had such negative attitudes or allowed the random bad customer to get under their skin.  Then I realized that the difference in attitudes was because I had choices in my life.  I was in college, working toward any number of better opportunities.  The older servers were single moms or people with no education, struggling to pay the rent or a kid's medical bill.  Not a lot of choice for them. 
While I'm sure you treat your employees with respect and dignity, not everyone does.  And it often seems that those who supervise the people with fewer choices are sometimes complete jerks. 

As I write this, I am remembering a certain Labor Day weekend where the restaurant manager tried to strong-arm me into working a single shift in the middle of the weekend, despite me giving notice weeks in advance that I wouldn't work that weekend.  I was able to say "no thanks" with the knowledge that it could get me sacked.  It didn't, but it did force the lady with kids to cancel her plans to cover the shifts.
 
Education or savings or plans = options=choice
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Paul der Krake on December 10, 2014, 04:42:31 PM
Unless you were kidnapped and forced into slave labor, an bad employment contract is by your choice and by your fault to a great extent. Staying longer than you like and sacrificing your ethics and work morale just for the paycheck (or maybe for your children's sake or what not) demonstrates that you were probably not worth hiring in the first place.
When I was a college student working as a waitress, I thought it was so much fun!  I couldn't understand how or why the older servers had such negative attitudes or allowed the random bad customer to get under their skin.  Then I realized that the difference in attitudes was because I had choices in my life.  I was in college, working toward any number of better opportunities.  The older servers were single moms or people with no education, struggling to pay the rent or a kid's medical bill.  Not a lot of choice for them. 
While I'm sure you treat your employees with respect and dignity, not everyone does.  And it often seems that those who supervise the people with fewer choices are sometimes complete jerks. 

As I write this, I am remembering a certain Labor Day weekend where the restaurant manager tried to strong-arm me into working a single shift in the middle of the weekend, despite me giving notice weeks in advance that I wouldn't work that weekend.  I was able to say "no thanks" with the knowledge that it could get me sacked.  It didn't, but it did force the lady with kids to cancel her plans to cover the shifts.
 
Education or savings or plans = options=choice
This is true for a lot of other, non-employment related things. It's a whole mindset and explains why many members of this board think that tinkering with their cars or going camping is fun.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: iris lily on December 10, 2014, 08:10:44 PM
...--it's not worth any professional consequences and it's not as important to me to prove my rightness by being mean.

It's not mean if it was truthful. That you had the position to say it (because you were skipping out the next day) was golden. Your colleague will forever remember that.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: BlueHouse on December 12, 2014, 12:07:16 PM
I looked him in the eye and stated: You're a Dick.
I've been daydreaming about doing this all week long. I said it out loud about 100 times in my car.  problem is that I'm getting to my goal so much faster with this job than I would with another, so I'm going to have to suck it up a few more years.
I also started thinking that if I did this in front of a few witnesses and the guy really was being a dick, I bet he wouldn't say anything to get me fired either. If his behavior were called into question, I'm guessing he would be mortified for other people to know how he behaves. Anyway, this is my new exit strategy once the house is paid off. 
Thanks for making my day! 
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: vern on December 12, 2014, 08:00:37 PM
"And what hurts is the steadily diminishing humanity of those fighting to hold jobs they don’t want but fear the alternative worse. People simply empty out. They are bodies with fearful and obedient minds. The color leaves the eye. The voice becomes ugly. And the body. The hair. The fingernails. The shoes. Everything does.

As a young man I could not believe that people could give their lives over to those conditions. As an old man, I still can’t believe it. What do they do it for? Sex? TV? An automobile on monthly payments? Or children? Children who are just going to do the same things that they did?

Early on, when I was quite young and going from job to job I was foolish enough to sometimes speak to my fellow workers: “Hey, the boss can come in here at any moment and lay all of us off, just like that, don’t you realize that?”

They would just look at me. I was posing something that they didn’t want to enter their minds.

Now in industry, there are vast layoffs (steel mills dead, technical changes in other factors of the work place). They are layed off by the hundreds of thousands and their faces are stunned:

“I put in 35 years…”

“It ain’t right…”

“I don’t know what to do…”

They never pay the slaves enough so they can get free, just enough so they can stay alive and come back to work. I could see all this. Why couldn’t they? I figured the park bench was just as good or being a barfly was just as good. Why not get there first before they put me there? Why wait?

I just wrote in disgust against it all, it was a relief to get the shit out of my system. And now that I’m here, a so-called professional writer, after giving the first 50 years away, I’ve found out that there are other disgusts beyond the system.

I remember once, working as a packer in this lighting fixture company, one of the packers suddenly said: “I’ll never be free!”

One of the bosses was walking by (his name was Morrie) and he let out this delicious cackle of a laugh, enjoying the fact that this fellow was trapped for life."

Bukowski
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: nancyjnelson on December 14, 2014, 12:32:35 PM
Not an epic FU story - more like frugal habits = financial choices.  I worked for the Dept of State as a Foreign Service officer and really liked my job.  Although I was frequently transferred, I knew that if I didn't like either my supervisor or colleagues, either they or I would be moving on within a couple of years.  Then the world changed and the number of dangerous, unaccompanied tours soared.  The Dept instituted a policy of "fair-share" so that all of us would share the burden of these tours (there aren't many of us - there are fewer FSOs worldwide than full-time musicians with the U.S. Army bands).  I agreed with the policy, but I was a single mother with no one with whom I could have left my daughter.  Boarding school would have been provided, but all kids are different - and mine wouldn't have done well in that environment.  So, having reached the age of 50 with 25 years in, I retired.

My colleagues were taken aback when I told them I didn't plan on getting a full-time job afterwards (pension at age 50 is drastically reduced so most early "retirees" have another full-time job lined up before they take the plunge).  How was I going to survive?  This is where my frugal habits saved me.  While my colleagues had purchased nice houses in the suburbs when they started their careers, I had bought an 850 sq ft fixer-upper within a 5 minute walk to the metro and only one stop to DC.  In addition to saving time (I spent about 35 minutes a day commuting on public transport - my colleagues spent on average 2 1/2 hours), it saved money - $1.40 per trip, vs over $4.00.  When the real estate situation improved, I didn't upgrade.  I also didn't upgrade my 2-dr Toyota despite some urging (a couple of different colleagues actually took me aside and told me that my dented, 17 year old car wasn't part of the image that the U.S. Embassy wanted to project).

When I retired, I sold my house for triple for what I paid for it, moved to the midwest closer to my relatives, and bought a house for cash.  A year later I am working on my own web-based business - it doesn't make any money yet, but I can afford to do what I want.  It's a great feeling. 
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Guesl982374 on December 15, 2014, 02:48:04 PM
Not an epic FU story - more like frugal habits = financial choices.  I worked for the Dept of State as a Foreign Service officer and really liked my job.  Although I was frequently transferred, I knew that if I didn't like either my supervisor or colleagues, either they or I would be moving on within a couple of years.  Then the world changed and the number of dangerous, unaccompanied tours soared.  The Dept instituted a policy of "fair-share" so that all of us would share the burden of these tours (there aren't many of us - there are fewer FSOs worldwide than full-time musicians with the U.S. Army bands).  I agreed with the policy, but I was a single mother with no one with whom I could have left my daughter.  Boarding school would have been provided, but all kids are different - and mine wouldn't have done well in that environment.  So, having reached the age of 50 with 25 years in, I retired.

My colleagues were taken aback when I told them I didn't plan on getting a full-time job afterwards (pension at age 50 is drastically reduced so most early "retirees" have another full-time job lined up before they take the plunge).  How was I going to survive?  This is where my frugal habits saved me.  While my colleagues had purchased nice houses in the suburbs when they started their careers, I had bought an 850 sq ft fixer-upper within a 5 minute walk to the metro and only one stop to DC.  In addition to saving time (I spent about 35 minutes a day commuting on public transport - my colleagues spent on average 2 1/2 hours), it saved money - $1.40 per trip, vs over $4.00.  When the real estate situation improved, I didn't upgrade.  I also didn't upgrade my 2-dr Toyota despite some urging (a couple of different colleagues actually took me aside and told me that my dented, 17 year old car wasn't part of the image that the U.S. Embassy wanted to project).

When I retired, I sold my house for triple for what I paid for it, moved to the midwest closer to my relatives, and bought a house for cash.  A year later I am working on my own web-based business - it doesn't make any money yet, but I can afford to do what I want.  It's a great feeling.

Outstanding. I love it.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: RyanAtTanagra on December 15, 2014, 03:06:40 PM
Not an epic FU story - more like frugal habits = financial choices.
...

Yep good example, FU ability isn't just about money.  It's about being aware you have options, having money being just one of the things that can provide you with an option.  Last time I job searched I realized how many options I have.  Having enough money to tide me over for a bit during a job search + knowing it wouldn't take that long to find something decent if I had to = 'FU money'.

Some peoples FU money limit is $0 because they know they can always get another job, even if it's a different job, which seems to be a freeing mindset that I'm envious of.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: nawhite on December 16, 2014, 09:46:26 AM
Yep good example, FU ability isn't just about money.  It's about being aware you have options, having money being just one of the things that can provide you with an option.  Last time I job searched I realized how many options I have.  Having enough money to tide me over for a bit during a job search + knowing it wouldn't take that long to find something decent if I had to = 'FU money'.

Some peoples FU money limit is $0 because they know they can always get another job, even if it's a different job, which seems to be a freeing mindset that I'm envious of.

I agree with this assessment. I'm a big fan of "keep looking for better jobs constantly. There will eventually be something much better, you just have to be ready when it comes." I moved jobs a lot. I'd usually stick around for a year but because I had been looking for the whole year I had a very good idea of who was hiring and what I was worth. Having another job is freeing in the same way FU money is because it allows you to say "nope, you haven't been treating me the way I want to be treated, so I'm leaving."

When I found my current job (which I'm REALLY happy with) and gave notice at the old one, I was able to say: "you dropped the Employee Stock Purchase Plan this year which is worth over $10k per year to me. Without a big salary increase, you aren't that competitive anymore. Oh and the new company lets me work from home full time." Probably a slightly different feeling than true FU money, but having another job lined up gives you a lot of the same freedom.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: mtn on December 16, 2014, 10:54:18 AM
My “FU” story really isn’t much of one, and it hasn’t been completed yet. I accepted a position with a different company—more money, for the most part better benefits, and hopefully a better situation in terms of the work environment. I’m only giving a week of notice because I need to be employed on the 1st of the year—I get 4 extra days of vacation paid out, and the 401k match. I’m sorely tempted to leave sooner, or take a sick day or two in that week, but I don’t want to burn any bridges. I cannot wait to get out of here though, and if they start treating me poorly during that last week, I’ll just walk out. I’ll have everything out of my desk by then, so I hope that they just tell me to leave that day (they’d have to pay me through the date I give).
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: CommonCents on December 17, 2014, 01:03:22 PM
My “FU” story really isn’t much of one, and it hasn’t been completed yet. I accepted a position with a different company—more money, for the most part better benefits, and hopefully a better situation in terms of the work environment. I’m only giving a week of notice because I need to be employed on the 1st of the year—I get 4 extra days of vacation paid out, and the 401k match. I’m sorely tempted to leave sooner, or take a sick day or two in that week, but I don’t want to burn any bridges. I cannot wait to get out of here though, and if they start treating me poorly during that last week, I’ll just walk out. I’ll have everything out of my desk by then, so I hope that they just tell me to leave that day (they’d have to pay me through the date I give).

If you know now, why not give notice now?  That'd make 2 weeks notice (which is fairly standard) rather than 1 and help to not burn bridges as you say you don't wish to do?
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Holyoak on December 17, 2014, 01:45:29 PM
Quote
FU money isn't so you can treat your employer poorly, it's so you don't have to put up with your employer treating YOU poorly.  Before getting into personal finance I was in debt and broke feeling stuck working for a shitty company and a shitty boss.

Yep, 100%.  How about this for a company and boss; he even signed it:

(http://s19.postimg.org/kpe0egqw3/fuck_you_letter.jpg)

My FU money story was I was getting sick of one of the pilots being a total dick to me, and the other workers...  Rolling eyes, racial/religious comments, completely crap attitude and treatment to us 'lessers" who service/fuel the aircraft.  I did the gig to stay busy, and was fully FI at the time. One day I walked right up to him with nearly every employee present, and told him:

"You're a fucking punk", got the "what did you say", to which I repeated the same, and the boss/owner told me to go home and not return.  I did just that, filed and won my unemployment comp claim, despite the owner/boss stating to the UC committee that he felt I was going to punch a-hole and had witnesses (total lie, playing I got nothing better than to pull the workplace violence card).  Funny too when I reported my initial claim, I was flatly denied because it showed I had two entire quarters of no wages...  Seems douchebag was not reporting my earnings to the state!!!  What a dishonest asshat, and I hope they/IRS nailed him for it.

How sweet it felt to draw a $92/week unemployment check, knowing it made a-holes head explode.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Bikeguy on December 17, 2014, 04:59:19 PM


so I hope that they just tell me to leave that day (they’d have to pay me through the date I give).

I don't think so.   Had a coworker give two weeks notice before Christmas.   You had to work the first day of the next year to get profit sharing.   He said he was quitting Jan 2.  Got a certified letter stating" Thanks for letting us know you want to quit.   Your last day is Dec 23".  Cost him $17K.

Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: mtn on December 18, 2014, 06:20:07 AM
My “FU” story really isn’t much of one, and it hasn’t been completed yet. I accepted a position with a different company—more money, for the most part better benefits, and hopefully a better situation in terms of the work environment. I’m only giving a week of notice because I need to be employed on the 1st of the year—I get 4 extra days of vacation paid out, and the 401k match. I’m sorely tempted to leave sooner, or take a sick day or two in that week, but I don’t want to burn any bridges. I cannot wait to get out of here though, and if they start treating me poorly during that last week, I’ll just walk out. I’ll have everything out of my desk by then, so I hope that they just tell me to leave that day (they’d have to pay me through the date I give).

If you know now, why not give notice now?  That'd make 2 weeks notice (which is fairly standard) rather than 1 and help to not burn bridges as you say you don't wish to do?

If I give 2 weeks now, they could release me on December 30th and I'd be out my 401k match and 4 more days of accrued vacation. That amounts to a little more than I'd like to kiss goodbye; especially since I don't expect to ever come back here (although wouldn't be against it). I have to look out for myself first. Basically, this:



so I hope that they just tell me to leave that day (they’d have to pay me through the date I give).

I don't think so.   Had a coworker give two weeks notice before Christmas.   You had to work the first day of the next year to get profit sharing.   He said he was quitting Jan 2.  Got a certified letter stating" Thanks for letting us know you want to quit.   Your last day is Dec 23".  Cost him $17K.

But for that point, it is in our HR manual that if we resign and they have us leave earlier, they are to pay us for either 2 weeks or through the date we give, whichever is less.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: plainjane on December 18, 2014, 07:07:19 AM
If I give 2 weeks now, they could release me on December 30th and I'd be out my 401k match and 4 more days of accrued vacation. That amounts to a little more than I'd like to kiss goodbye; especially since I don't expect to ever come back here (although wouldn't be against it). I have to look out for myself first.

It's very odd that you would get 4 days accrued based on just one more week of work.  Generally one accrues vacation at a steady rate throughout the year.

In my industry people talk, so giving only a week of notice would be a CLM overall, not just if you wanted to go back to the original company.  Really think this through.

so I hope that they just tell me to leave that day (they’d have to pay me through the date I give).
I don't think so.   Had a coworker give two weeks notice before Christmas.   You had to work the first day of the next year to get profit sharing.   He said he was quitting Jan 2.  Got a certified letter stating" Thanks for letting us know you want to quit.   Your last day is Dec 23".  Cost him $17K.
But for that point, it is in our HR manual that if we resign and they have us leave earlier, they are to pay us for either 2 weeks or through the date we give, whichever is less.
[/quote]

In almost every region you need to be paid out the two weeks (or whatever your minimum notice is), but they have absolutely no reason to pay you out a bonus after you have said you are leaving, even if it was previously established you'd be getting one.  Salary and bonus/profit sharing are two very separate things.  Make sure any bonus you're expecting is dropped into your account before you give notice.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Philociraptor on December 18, 2014, 07:14:15 AM
If I give 2 weeks now, they could release me on December 30th and I'd be out my 401k match and 4 more days of accrued vacation. That amounts to a little more than I'd like to kiss goodbye; especially since I don't expect to ever come back here (although wouldn't be against it). I have to look out for myself first.

It's very odd that you would get 4 days accrued based on just one more week of work.  Generally one accrues vacation at a steady rate throughout the year.

In my industry people talk, so giving only a week of notice would be a CLM overall, not just if you wanted to go back to the original company.  Really think this through.

so I hope that they just tell me to leave that day (they’d have to pay me through the date I give).
I don't think so.   Had a coworker give two weeks notice before Christmas.   You had to work the first day of the next year to get profit sharing.   He said he was quitting Jan 2.  Got a certified letter stating" Thanks for letting us know you want to quit.   Your last day is Dec 23".  Cost him $17K.
But for that point, it is in our HR manual that if we resign and they have us leave earlier, they are to pay us for either 2 weeks or through the date we give, whichever is less.

In almost every region you need to be paid out the two weeks (or whatever your minimum notice is), but they have absolutely no reason to pay you out a bonus after you have said you are leaving, even if it was previously established you'd be getting one.  Salary and bonus/profit sharing are two very separate things.  Make sure any bonus you're expecting is dropped into your account before you give notice.

And this is why if I get a new job I won't be giving notice until Jan 1.

Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: mtn on December 18, 2014, 07:47:21 AM
If I give 2 weeks now, they could release me on December 30th and I'd be out my 401k match and 4 more days of accrued vacation. That amounts to a little more than I'd like to kiss goodbye; especially since I don't expect to ever come back here (although wouldn't be against it). I have to look out for myself first.

It's very odd that you would get 4 days accrued based on just one more week of work.  Generally one accrues vacation at a steady rate throughout the year.

In my industry people talk, so giving only a week of notice would be a CLM overall, not just if you wanted to go back to the original company.  Really think this through.

so I hope that they just tell me to leave that day (they’d have to pay me through the date I give).
I don't think so.   Had a coworker give two weeks notice before Christmas.   You had to work the first day of the next year to get profit sharing.   He said he was quitting Jan 2.  Got a certified letter stating" Thanks for letting us know you want to quit.   Your last day is Dec 23".  Cost him $17K.
But for that point, it is in our HR manual that if we resign and they have us leave earlier, they are to pay us for either 2 weeks or through the date we give, whichever is less.

In almost every region you need to be paid out the two weeks (or whatever your minimum notice is), but they have absolutely no reason to pay you out a bonus after you have said you are leaving, even if it was previously established you'd be getting one.  Salary and bonus/profit sharing are two very separate things.  Make sure any bonus you're expecting is dropped into your account before you give notice.
[/quote]

I think you're missing/mis-interpretting some of this:

Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: eyePod on December 18, 2014, 12:52:26 PM
Quote
She demanded two weeks notice, which still included me missing class to come to work.  I said, nope!  I could not believe that I didn't get fired for mouthing off to her.

Wow, she was a moron.  I think my response to that would have been "Okay, you drive a hard bargain, M'am, so even though I just quit, my last day will actually be two weeks from today instead of tonight.  And you are right:  I will be here on Tuesdays as well."  Then I would just have never come back. 

I find myself explaining the concept of "Nobody HAS TO do ANYTHING when it comes to a job" to people on a regular basis.  We've had more than one person just stop showing up, or email a resignation letter while they are on vacation (with the last day of work conveniently falling on a future date that they are still on vacation), or agree to take on a big project and then turn around and put an "I resign effective immediately" letter under the boss's door after hours, yet somehow the illusion that people have to keep coming into the office until they are given permission to leave persists.

I felt bad about my situation at my previous company but it's similar to this. Terrible morale, tough work that requires a lot of off-shift. No opportunities to move up whatsoever. Layoffs abound and all the top performers left to mop up. Plus there were tons of reorganizations (I went from one manager in 3.5 years to have that one plus 3 new ones in one year, and not due to performance). My wife got an internship in another state and once she accepted, I started looking. We've moved, I got a job before her start time, I got a bigger pay increase than I've ever had, and I'm doing much more satisfying work with a better schedule.

I did kind of blame my wife for it all, but the thing that made it tough was I got the offer 2 weeks after a round of layoffs. If I knew I was going to get it, I could have left, taken a severance, and saved someone else from getting laid off. But I guess that's the way the cookie crumbles.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Sibley on December 19, 2014, 12:14:56 PM
Dear Navy SEAL,

I am a happily married man with a warm and loving wife who is also my best friend. We've been together for 17 years and couldn't be happier. But lately she says she wants separate beds. I'm reeling! We're barely in our 40s, and in my mind separate sleeping is for seniors. Am I making too much of this? Help!

—Anxious In Andersonville

While larger rounds incapacitate a target more reliably than the smaller 5.56, they are also much heavier to hump over the mountains. Being able to lay down a more ferocious volume of fire can be well worth the decrease in stopping power, especially when you have encountered a frisky opponent. Utilize your SAW gunner to suppress incoming fire, while your assault team maneuvers to better overrun the enemy position. If bounding proves difficult, remember, 5.56 can penetrate cover like Swiss cheese, although you will still be prudent to continuously engage targets until all teams have swept the objective area.

Also, utilizing air and artillery support can shorten the effort, along with conserving your ammo. Definitely remember to sweep the kill zone afterward to eliminate survivors or take captives, mission depending. Once area is swept and the reports sent up, hopefully you can CM.

Or maybe you snore/steal blankets/thrash around/something else equally annoying in your sleep and she's tired of it.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: frugalnacho on December 19, 2014, 12:25:11 PM
Dear Navy SEAL,

I am a happily married man with a warm and loving wife who is also my best friend. We've been together for 17 years and couldn't be happier. But lately she says she wants separate beds. I'm reeling! We're barely in our 40s, and in my mind separate sleeping is for seniors. Am I making too much of this? Help!

—Anxious In Andersonville

While larger rounds incapacitate a target more reliably than the smaller 5.56, they are also much heavier to hump over the mountains. Being able to lay down a more ferocious volume of fire can be well worth the decrease in stopping power, especially when you have encountered a frisky opponent. Utilize your SAW gunner to suppress incoming fire, while your assault team maneuvers to better overrun the enemy position. If bounding proves difficult, remember, 5.56 can penetrate cover like Swiss cheese, although you will still be prudent to continuously engage targets until all teams have swept the objective area.

Also, utilizing air and artillery support can shorten the effort, along with conserving your ammo. Definitely remember to sweep the kill zone afterward to eliminate survivors or take captives, mission depending. Once area is swept and the reports sent up, hopefully you can CM.

Or maybe you snore/steal blankets/thrash around/something else equally annoying in your sleep and she's tired of it.

I've been pitching the separate beds idea for awhile but my wife won't go for it.  It's nice to have that special someone there...but it definitely lowers my quality of sleep.  A nice comfortable bed to myself is so much better, and I sleep so much better when I am alone. 
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Pooperman on December 19, 2014, 01:07:28 PM
Dear Navy SEAL,

I am a happily married man with a warm and loving wife who is also my best friend. We've been together for 17 years and couldn't be happier. But lately she says she wants separate beds. I'm reeling! We're barely in our 40s, and in my mind separate sleeping is for seniors. Am I making too much of this? Help!

—Anxious In Andersonville

While larger rounds incapacitate a target more reliably than the smaller 5.56, they are also much heavier to hump over the mountains. Being able to lay down a more ferocious volume of fire can be well worth the decrease in stopping power, especially when you have encountered a frisky opponent. Utilize your SAW gunner to suppress incoming fire, while your assault team maneuvers to better overrun the enemy position. If bounding proves difficult, remember, 5.56 can penetrate cover like Swiss cheese, although you will still be prudent to continuously engage targets until all teams have swept the objective area.

Also, utilizing air and artillery support can shorten the effort, along with conserving your ammo. Definitely remember to sweep the kill zone afterward to eliminate survivors or take captives, mission depending. Once area is swept and the reports sent up, hopefully you can CM.

Or maybe you snore/steal blankets/thrash around/something else equally annoying in your sleep and she's tired of it.

I've been pitching the separate beds idea for awhile but my wife won't go for it.  It's nice to have that special someone there...but it definitely lowers my quality of sleep.  A nice comfortable bed to myself is so much better, and I sleep so much better when I am alone.

Have you tried separate blankets? It helps a lot.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Sibley on December 19, 2014, 01:19:42 PM
Dear Navy SEAL,

I am a happily married man with a warm and loving wife who is also my best friend. We've been together for 17 years and couldn't be happier. But lately she says she wants separate beds. I'm reeling! We're barely in our 40s, and in my mind separate sleeping is for seniors. Am I making too much of this? Help!

—Anxious In Andersonville

While larger rounds incapacitate a target more reliably than the smaller 5.56, they are also much heavier to hump over the mountains. Being able to lay down a more ferocious volume of fire can be well worth the decrease in stopping power, especially when you have encountered a frisky opponent. Utilize your SAW gunner to suppress incoming fire, while your assault team maneuvers to better overrun the enemy position. If bounding proves difficult, remember, 5.56 can penetrate cover like Swiss cheese, although you will still be prudent to continuously engage targets until all teams have swept the objective area.

Also, utilizing air and artillery support can shorten the effort, along with conserving your ammo. Definitely remember to sweep the kill zone afterward to eliminate survivors or take captives, mission depending. Once area is swept and the reports sent up, hopefully you can CM.

Or maybe you snore/steal blankets/thrash around/something else equally annoying in your sleep and she's tired of it.

I've been pitching the separate beds idea for awhile but my wife won't go for it.  It's nice to have that special someone there...but it definitely lowers my quality of sleep.  A nice comfortable bed to myself is so much better, and I sleep so much better when I am alone.

Have you tried separate blankets? It helps a lot.

I know multiple happy couples, various ages, that always or frequently have separate beds. One couple has 2 twin beds pushed up against each other, separate sheets/blankets. Works great for them - one bed is soft, the other is hard as a rock apparently.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Bikeguy on December 19, 2014, 02:07:32 PM


If I give 2 weeks now, they could release me on December 30th and I'd be out my 401k match and 4 more days of accrued vacation. That amounts to a little more than I'd like to kiss goodbye; especially since I don't expect to ever come back here (although wouldn't be against it). I have to look out for myself first.

It's very odd that you would get 4 days accrued based on just one more week of work.  Generally one accrues vacation at a steady rate throughout the year.

In my industry,  vacation is accrued quarterly.   Sounds like the same policy.

Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: jordanread on December 19, 2014, 02:10:06 PM
If I give 2 weeks now, they could release me on December 30th and I'd be out my 401k match and 4 more days of accrued vacation. That amounts to a little more than I'd like to kiss goodbye; especially since I don't expect to ever come back here (although wouldn't be against it). I have to look out for myself first.

It's very odd that you would get 4 days accrued based on just one more week of work.  Generally one accrues vacation at a steady rate throughout the year.

In my industry,  vacation is accrued quarterly.   Sounds like the same policy.

Ah, but vacation is different from Floating Holidays. That's what I get. First of the year, 4 days...the remaining 15 days get accrued over the year.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: plainjane on December 20, 2014, 06:18:49 AM
Ah, but vacation is different from Floating Holidays. That's what I get. First of the year, 4 days...the remaining 15 days get accrued over the year.

And they pay you out for floating holidays?  I thought that was the point of companies doing floating holidays, that they weren't bound by vacation day rules.  (I've never worked at a place that had floating holidays)
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: RWD on December 20, 2014, 08:37:55 AM
Ah, but vacation is different from Floating Holidays. That's what I get. First of the year, 4 days...the remaining 15 days get accrued over the year.

And they pay you out for floating holidays?  I thought that was the point of companies doing floating holidays, that they weren't bound by vacation day rules.  (I've never worked at a place that had floating holidays)

At my company the floating holidays are just arbitrary days during the year that the company has designated a day off that wouldn't otherwise be considered a holiday. This is usually used to give us a longer weekend when a normal single day holiday lands on a Tuesday or Thursday. For example, we always get January 1st off, but for 2015 we are also getting a floating holiday on January 2nd so that we don't have to come in on just one day before the weekend.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: jordanread on December 20, 2014, 10:36:13 AM
Ah, but vacation is different from Floating Holidays. That's what I get. First of the year, 4 days...the remaining 15 days get accrued over the year.

And they pay you out for floating holidays?  I thought that was the point of companies doing floating holidays, that they weren't bound by vacation day rules.  (I've never worked at a place that had floating holidays)

At my company the floating holidays are just arbitrary days during the year that the company has designated a day off that wouldn't otherwise be considered a holiday. This is usually used to give us a longer weekend when a normal single day holiday lands on a Tuesday or Thursday. For example, we always get January 1st off, but for 2015 we are also getting a floating holiday on January 2nd so that we don't have to come in on just one day before the weekend.
Every place I've had floating holidays they are just like vacation days. They are paid, and can be scheduled whenever. And are bought back the same way when you quit.

Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Kansas Beachbum on December 21, 2014, 08:02:52 AM
The Mrs. KBB and I both, without hesitation, jumped on a voluntary separation offer put out by our employer...this is the one where they take volunteers before laying off several hundred more who didn't volunteer to get to "the number" they need.  A combination of a pretty generous separation package and a substantial stache made this a no brainer decision for us.  No hard feelings towards the company as it has been very good to us over the years, just time to move on...and having the resources put back that we do made this entirely a lifestyle decision as opposed to a financial one.  Happily unemployed for a couple weeks now.  Cheers all!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Nords on December 21, 2014, 10:50:50 AM
I'll reiterate the story of a poster from Early-Retirement.org about 8-10 years ago.

He'd been pursuing financial independence for years, and was putting the finishing touches on his plan.  He'd tried to discuss FI with his co-workers years before but they weren't receptive and he'd since kept it all a secret.  I don't think he had a pension but he'd saved diligently in his company 401(k) and his IRA and he had everything ready to go.  He'd already contributed to the stereotypical thread on "How much notice should I give when I quit my job?" and had concluded that he only owed his employer the absolute minimum required by the HR rules.  He'd already prepped his turnover checklist and his training handbook, although he wasn't particularly worried about a contact relief.  He'd even figured out how best to replicate his company-issued laptop (on the cheap) so that he'd start ER with familiar computer gear.

Just a few days before he was ready to give notice, the company had a round of "surprise" layoffs.  (Surprise to most of the employees, not so surprising to most of management.)  He was met at the door by an HR rep, escorted to his boss' office, given the "bad" news, and then escorted to clean out his desk.  He was given a generous severance package and even told that he could keep his company-issued laptop.  He was outta there before lunch.

He said the hardest part of the layoff was keeping a straight face and taking it all seriously.  Inside, of course, he was doing the engineer's happy dance...
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Wolf_Stache on December 22, 2014, 01:06:01 PM
I'll reiterate the story of a poster from Early-Retirement.org about 8-10 years ago.

He'd been pursuing financial independence for years, and was putting the finishing touches on his plan.  He'd tried to discuss FI with his co-workers years before but they weren't receptive and he'd since kept it all a secret.  I don't think he had a pension but he'd saved diligently in his company 401(k) and his IRA and he had everything ready to go.  He'd already contributed to the stereotypical thread on "How much notice should I give when I quit my job?" and had concluded that he only owed his employer the absolute minimum required by the HR rules.  He'd already prepped his turnover checklist and his training handbook, although he wasn't particularly worried about a contact relief.  He'd even figured out how best to replicate his company-issued laptop (on the cheap) so that he'd start ER with familiar computer gear.

Just a few days before he was ready to give notice, the company had a round of "surprise" layoffs.  (Surprise to most of the employees, not so surprising to most of management.)  He was met at the door by an HR rep, escorted to his boss' office, given the "bad" news, and then escorted to clean out his desk.  He was given a generous severance package and even told that he could keep his company-issued laptop.  He was outta there before lunch.

He said the hardest part of the layoff was keeping a straight face and taking it all seriously.  Inside, of course, he was doing the engineer's happy dance...

That is awesome. Thanks for sharing.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: hred17 on December 23, 2014, 03:29:52 AM
My story is not quite as dramatic as some and it certainly was not planned as an "FU - I'm outta here!" type of scenario (although I had dreamed of it many times!).

Years ago I was working for the corporate arm of a computer retailer. I had been hired into the HR department and worked for a horrid, horrid, woman. Over the course of the 16 months I worked there, she proceeded to eliminate almost the entire HR generalist team. I ended up taking on the jobs of what had previously been done by six people. My boss always took credit for things I had done, used to not-so-subtly threaten me if I dared to mention her three-hour lunch breaks to anyone senior, etc, etc. The icing on the cake was that I spent my own money and time to get an advanced HR certification for which I had been promised a relevant increase in salary when I completed it. Needless to say, that did not happen.

I was desperate to quit but had not had time to start looking for another job and didn't have as much money saved as I wanted to feel 100% ok leaving without another job lined up. I was so miserable, and lo and behold, I came down with a very nasty case of the flu. This was the week of Thanksgiving. I was off sick from work on the Tuesday and Wednesday (the only non-vacation time off I ever took the whole time I worked there) and then spent the rest of the holiday weekend sick in bed.

Quite randomly, on the Tuesday of that same week (my first day sick at home) I got a phone call from a former colleague about a job opening and was fast tracked through an interview process. I had an offer by the end of the Thanksgiving weekend (it was a start-up so things moved fast and all of my interviews were done via conference calls and references).

On the Monday after Thanksgiving, I went into my bosses office to hand in my two-week notice. She completely flipped out (I think she realized how screwed she was going to be once I left). She proceeded to start yelling at me, accused me of lying about being sick so I could interview (not true), blah, blah, blah.

I calmly stood there during her rant and then asked her when she stopped yelling "if she was done?". She just stared at me. I proceeded to hand her my doctors note from the previous week (the look on her face was priceless) and then told her "that she did not deserve my two weeks and my notice was now effective immediately." I grabbed my purse off my desk and walked out.

Financially, things were a bit tight for a bit but it was the BEST feeling in the whole world to leave that day. I started my new job three weeks later and am still in the same industry today, 12 years later.

Lesson learned? ALWAYS have FU money. :)
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Workinghard on December 23, 2014, 04:06:24 AM
It's so much fun reading these stories although I doubt if I'd have the ahem, balls, to do some of them but then maybe again I would.

I'm not sure if this counts or not. I gave my notice six weeks ago. Many times during those six weeks I regretted it and wished I had given two weeks notice, but I wanted to help out over the holidays. I guess because I didn't want to burn my bridges it's not truly an FU story. Anyway, after I gave my notice I did not hear from anyone as to whether or not they would like to have me work per diem. I like the work I do and I like the company. I just don't like be treated as an indentured servant.

The owner of the company texts me occasionally and he's the type a person you can speak frankly with. I did share about the indentured servant feeling. Haha. Recently he asked if I would take a VIP pt. It fell on my day off but I agreed to do so. This was after there was an issue with another patient, who didn't like her nurse, and he asked if I go out there and smooth things over which I did.

Anyway, during the course of different texts, I commented that even though I would no longer be full-time I would still like to work for the company if they were interested in having me. I also gave the names of two people I had spoken with but received no response from. He said it was a given that they still wanted me and they would love to have me continue to see their patients. He apologized for that not been communicated to me. The next day I was called into the office by the two people who had not responded to me previously to discuss my hours when I go Per-diem.

I'm sure they think I am the teachers pet, but over the course of three years he has learned that I go that extra mile with my patients. I will visit them in the hospital, help those that can't drive to doctor appointments, send family sympathy cards when one dies, etc. This is all on my own time because I truly care about the people.

More than likely, my weekly hours will probably be the same, but I can take off when I want to take off, confine my route to in-county, and shorter distances, and have control over how many patients I'm willing to see in a day. No more 16 hour days to get my paperwork done. Although I will lose the vacation time, the 15 days is well worth it for the control factor.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: RyanAtTanagra on December 23, 2014, 10:56:10 AM
I'm not sure if this counts or not...

Not so much an FU story but a good reminder that sometimes being a good person and a good employee can be just as worthwhile in getting what you want at work :-)
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Workinghard on December 23, 2014, 02:00:41 PM
I'm not sure if this counts or not...

Not so much an FU story but a good reminder that sometimes being a good person and a good employee can be just as worthwhile in getting what you want at work :-)

True..even if I have to quit to get what I want. Lol.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Taran Wanderer on January 03, 2015, 10:49:00 PM
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Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Prairie Gal on January 04, 2015, 09:20:17 AM
.

Good one!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: JLee on January 04, 2015, 10:34:25 AM
Yep good example, FU ability isn't just about money.  It's about being aware you have options, having money being just one of the things that can provide you with an option.  Last time I job searched I realized how many options I have.  Having enough money to tide me over for a bit during a job search + knowing it wouldn't take that long to find something decent if I had to = 'FU money'.

Some peoples FU money limit is $0 because they know they can always get another job, even if it's a different job, which seems to be a freeing mindset that I'm envious of.

I agree with this assessment. I'm a big fan of "keep looking for better jobs constantly. There will eventually be something much better, you just have to be ready when it comes." I moved jobs a lot. I'd usually stick around for a year but because I had been looking for the whole year I had a very good idea of who was hiring and what I was worth. Having another job is freeing in the same way FU money is because it allows you to say "nope, you haven't been treating me the way I want to be treated, so I'm leaving."

When I found my current job (which I'm REALLY happy with) and gave notice at the old one, I was able to say: "you dropped the Employee Stock Purchase Plan this year which is worth over $10k per year to me. Without a big salary increase, you aren't that competitive anymore. Oh and the new company lets me work from home full time." Probably a slightly different feeling than true FU money, but having another job lined up gives you a lot of the same freedom.
Yup. I don't have something else lined up right now, but I am confident I could find something. I was talking to a coworker about a two week vacation I have planned in May, and I mentioned if it doesn't get approved I'll just go find another job.  Her jaw dropped. :P
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: viper155 on January 04, 2015, 10:53:43 AM
I am in, kind of in my second career. I work for two reasons. To cash flow my kids college tuition and because I like to work. Recently I have amassed enough to pay all the tuitions in cash and I have a nice stash of FU money and a  great passive income. I am grateful. My business can get very tense. It is the entertainment business so there are a lot of ego issues. On this last job which lasted 3 months and ended a couple of weeks ago I casually mentioned to my work friends that I was in total FU mode. I worked and walked around like I did not have a care in the world. Everyone knew why including the ball breaking bosses. It was priceless the way that they dealt with me just because they, and everyone, knew of the position I was in. All the guys were just waiting for me to explode and tell people where to go but, like another poster here said, it's better just to have the card up your sleeve and play it to the hilt. Good luck to everyone on this quest!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: h2ogal on January 11, 2015, 11:56:27 AM
This thread is the ultimate illustration of why Financial Independence is so crucial to living a fulfilling and happy life!

Once you have some financial strength, you never have to let yourself be driven to the point where you feel you must say "FU!".   
 
You don't have to take months of abuse before you quit in exasperation.....   You don't have to do anything you feel is unethical...... You never have to betray your own soul by staying in a position that is unhealthy and stressful...

Being financially independent means you go to work voluntarily, conduct yourself with dignity, show compassion to your co-workers and subordinates, and negotiate from a position of strength.   

I don't think you don't need a massive stache built up to do this....Just a reasonable emergency fund, confidence in your own worth, and marketable skills.  Dual incomes, low expenses and a little bravery goes a long way too.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: taylor044 on January 11, 2015, 02:24:30 PM
Loved reading this thread. For my budget, I renamed my emergency fund category to FU... in all capital letters.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: JCfire on January 12, 2015, 08:25:23 AM
This thread is the ultimate illustration of why Financial Independence is so crucial to living a fulfilling and happy life!

Once you have some financial strength, you never have to let yourself be driven to the point where you feel you must say "FU!".   
 
You don't have to take months of abuse before you quit in exasperation.....   You don't have to do anything you feel is unethical...... You never have to betray your own soul by staying in a position that is unhealthy and stressful...

Being financially independent means you go to work voluntarily, conduct yourself with dignity, show compassion to your co-workers and subordinates, and negotiate from a position of strength.   

I don't think you don't need a massive stache built up to do this....Just a reasonable emergency fund, confidence in your own worth, and marketable skills.  Dual incomes, low expenses and a little bravery goes a long way too.

This thread makes me acutely feel my lack of FU money.  I work in a small industry with few possible employers, I am excellent at my work, and a 2014 change at my company made me wish for FU money for at least the last six months.  Reading these stories makes me that much more determined that this the last time I'll have that feeling.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: tyler1215 on January 24, 2015, 07:56:59 PM
I don't have an FU story but after this past week, I want to get to that point more than ever.

I work as an engineer and about six months ago we hired another "engineer". I use the quotes because he does not have an engineering degree, just tons of experience from being out in the field. This past week we had a piece of equipment that had failed in the field and has been replaced three time prior by an exact copy but new piece of equipment each time. The "engineer" had called for it to be replaced again and I told the field guys to leave it until someone proves the equipment is truly defective, and not actually miscoordinating. The "engineer" sent me an email and included the guys in my group as well. He asked me to explain to him why I superseded his judgement. Side note, he and I are the same level and pay but he is twice my age. With FU money, I would be able to respond back with "please find attached a copy of MY engineering degree for your reference. If you need further explanation, please note the PE initials following my name. They roughly translate to I am the expert!"

Until the moment I have FU money, I have to bite my tongue and play the politics to keep building up my FU fund. Or wait two years when I'm the engineering manager and then he'll be thinking twice about what he says.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Taran Wanderer on January 24, 2015, 09:00:27 PM
"please find attached a copy of MY engineering degree for your reference. If you need further explanation, please note the PE initials following my name. They roughly translate to I am the expert!"

Until the moment I have FU money, I have to bite my tongue and play the politics to keep building up my FU fund. Or wait two years when I'm the engineering manager and then he'll be thinking twice about what he says.

Even if you were older or the manager, that might not get the response that you'd like to get.  It seems like the problem here is that nobody has gotten to the root cause of the "failure".  Could you try explaining that you need to get to root cause, and just installing a new version of the same unit won't do that?  Parts swapping is common in situations like this, but it can cost a lot of money without ever getting to root cause.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Malaysia41 on January 24, 2015, 09:11:13 PM
I don't have an FU story but after this past week, I want to get to that point more than ever.

I work as an engineer and about six months ago we hired another "engineer". I use the quotes because he does not have an engineering degree, just tons of experience from being out in the field. This past week we had a piece of equipment that had failed in the field and has been replaced three time prior by an exact copy but new piece of equipment each time. The "engineer" had called for it to be replaced again and I told the field guys to leave it until someone proves the equipment is truly defective, and not actually miscoordinating. The "engineer" sent me an email and included the guys in my group as well. He asked me to explain to him why I superseded his judgement. Side note, he and I are the same level and pay but he is twice my age. With FU money, I would be able to respond back with "please find attached a copy of MY engineering degree for your reference. If you need further explanation, please note the PE initials following my name. They roughly translate to I am the expert!"

Until the moment I have FU money, I have to bite my tongue and play the politics to keep building up my FU fund. Or wait two years when I'm the engineering manager and then he'll be thinking twice about what he says.

Perhaps try the high road.  It's way less stressful. 

A) assume positive intent.  He felt hurt and responded poorly.  No need to get ruffled under the feathers.
B) focus on the solution.  "Before we replace the part again, I'd like to rule out other possibilities like mis-coordination issues."
C) reply directly to him with no one on cc.  Keep A) and B) in mind with your response.

I'm guessing this guy has a very good idea that you don't think much of him.  Perhaps keep on the lookout for some action he takes that's useful so you can feel less resentful toward him.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: MrsCoolCat on January 24, 2015, 10:29:55 PM
As odput said my Horrible Bosses thread/story is an FU in the making... except I'm just starting with investing so way far from FI than I would like.

For those of you familiar with the thorn against my side, every day I probably imagine Mortal Kombat Fatalitying her ass because of the sheer stupidity of her actions. MIND F*CKED 24-7.

MY FU story involves personally going to her boss, the General Counsel of the company, and dropping off the folder of evidence proving that my boss is the most inefficient person I've ever worked with. I'd say that to him (and HR, too, for my imaginary FU story), too. Luckily I don't think anyone would seriously keep my boss if she had to change companies and she "means well" and is nice. SO I will save/spare her and my bridge by not having it burn down in flames. Life is too short to be that cynical. Even for me. :-)

And boy do I have example after example, which I've already outlined in detail in my Horrible Bosses thread. So for now this will all be imaginary and I will continue to build up my Burn Work Book (like from Mean Girls) with all my evidence as therapeutic justice and as an attempt to keep my sanity from the pure MIND F*CK of it all. Thank you. :-D
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: bzzzt on January 25, 2015, 07:25:13 AM
The "engineer" sent me an email and included the guys in my group as well. He asked me to explain to him why I superseded his judgement. Side note, he and I are the same level and pay but he is twice my age. With FU money, I would be able to respond back with "please find attached a copy of MY engineering degree for your reference. If you need further explanation, please note the PE initials following my name. They roughly translate to I am the expert!"

Until the moment I have FU money, I have to bite my tongue and play the politics to keep building up my FU fund. Or wait two years when I'm the engineering manager and then he'll be thinking twice about what he says.

Opinions are like assholes (eveyone has one) but egos are poison. Degrees and book smarts don't necessarily make you the expert. I don't have enough fingers and toes to count the times where engineers/architects have been not just wrong but TOTALLY wrong in my experience. I try not to do hang people out to dry, but if they play the "I am the expert/boss!" card, I'll let them choke on their piece of paper instead of politely informing them of their mistake before it snowballs.

However, I'm just a lowly tradesman without a piece of paper informing others how smart I am.

Congrats on building up the FU money, but make sure you're doing it for the right reasons.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: luna on January 25, 2015, 07:57:10 AM
The "engineer" sent me an email and included the guys in my group as well. He asked me to explain to him why I superseded his judgement. Side note, he and I are the same level and pay but he is twice my age. With FU money, I would be able to respond back with "please find attached a copy of MY engineering degree for your reference. If you need further explanation, please note the PE initials following my name. They roughly translate to I am the expert!"

Until the moment I have FU money, I have to bite my tongue and play the politics to keep building up my FU fund. Or wait two years when I'm the engineering manager and then he'll be thinking twice about what he says.

Opinions are like assholes (eveyone has one) but egos are poison. Degrees and book smarts don't necessarily make you the expert. I don't have enough fingers and toes to count the times where engineers/architects have been not just wrong but TOTALLY wrong in my experience. I try not to do hang people out to dry, but if they play the "I am the expert/boss!" card, I'll let them choke on their piece of paper instead of politely informing them of their mistake before it snowballs.

However, I'm just a lowly tradesman without a piece of paper informing others how smart I am.

Congrats on building up the FU money, but make sure you're doing it for the right reasons.

This!

Anyone trying to throw their title around instead of the facts will lose my respect pretty much immediately (the typical example in my line of business being "I'm your boss so this is the correct design for this piece of software").

I couldn't care less if you had the opportunity to go to a good university or not. I'd say pretty much half of the people studying computer science with me would never in a lifetime make good programmers. And they still ended up with a comp sci degree. And the best programmer I've ever worked with had a liberal arts degree.

Degrees mean nothing. Facts do.

(Also, I hope you change the attitude of "I know best" before you become a manager. It will be very hard to retain any good people with that way of thinking. A good manager hires people that are expects at what they do, and thus believes that they are better situated to make decisions than the manager himself.)
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Tabaxus on January 25, 2015, 09:00:49 AM
I don't have an FU story but after this past week, I want to get to that point more than ever.

I work as an engineer and about six months ago we hired another "engineer". I use the quotes because he does not have an engineering degree, just tons of experience from being out in the field. This past week we had a piece of equipment that had failed in the field and has been replaced three time prior by an exact copy but new piece of equipment each time. The "engineer" had called for it to be replaced again and I told the field guys to leave it until someone proves the equipment is truly defective, and not actually miscoordinating. The "engineer" sent me an email and included the guys in my group as well. He asked me to explain to him why I superseded his judgement. Side note, he and I are the same level and pay but he is twice my age. With FU money, I would be able to respond back with "please find attached a copy of MY engineering degree for your reference. If you need further explanation, please note the PE initials following my name. They roughly translate to I am the expert!"

Until the moment I have FU money, I have to bite my tongue and play the politics to keep building up my FU fund. Or wait two years when I'm the engineering manager and then he'll be thinking twice about what he says.

Although there has been an implication along these lines in previous posts:  I won't say people like you suck.  I will say that people who think this way suck, so hopefully you fix how you think.  Discounting "tons of experience from being out in the field" when you are some kid out of college is ridiculous.  You can point to the obvious Gates-type example, but even outside of that kind of obvious example, it is still ridiculous. 

You need to do your job, nothing wrong with that, nothing wrong with calling for something to be done differently from the guy with lots of experience, but appealing to authority (in this case, the authority of a piece of paper) is gross.

I know plenty of grizzled paralegals who know more about the law than freshly-minted lawyers.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Westoftown on January 25, 2015, 09:32:41 AM
Just to play devil's advocate, I'll share an experience of when FU money can actually hurt you.  I had a great job of 8 years - pension, good bonus, etc and I liked it but got bored.  After a couple of key customers went out of business, I got a new boss that I didn't like and ended up travelling way too much.  This was the same time as we had 2 babies.   I was just freaked out by life with all the travel, new family, etc, etc.   I knew I wanted to do something new - and thought that quitting would be a great way to make this happen - it would force me to make a change, even though I didnt have a good idea of what that change looked like!  If I didnt quit, I'd end up staying there and find financial reasons not to leave.

Anyway, long story short I quit on a whim.  6 months later I was in a similar job with slightly lower pay.  I guess it worked out, but given that I'm in the same field - I would have been better off riding out that bad manager/travel storm.  The company was great and now I'd be in a better role.

The moral - if you use your FU powers - make sure you have a plan.   IF you don't take control of your career direction, life will do it for you.  I guess everything works out, we're close to FIRE now and I have a concrete exit plan, SMART goals to get there, etc.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: mjs111 on January 25, 2015, 12:49:25 PM
I don't have an FU story but after this past week, I want to get to that point more than ever.

I work as an engineer and about six months ago we hired another "engineer". I use the quotes because he does not have an engineering degree, just tons of experience from being out in the field. This past week we had a piece of equipment that had failed in the field and has been replaced three time prior by an exact copy but new piece of equipment each time. The "engineer" had called for it to be replaced again and I told the field guys to leave it until someone proves the equipment is truly defective, and not actually miscoordinating. The "engineer" sent me an email and included the guys in my group as well. He asked me to explain to him why I superseded his judgement. Side note, he and I are the same level and pay but he is twice my age. With FU money, I would be able to respond back with "please find attached a copy of MY engineering degree for your reference. If you need further explanation, please note the PE initials following my name. They roughly translate to I am the expert!"

Until the moment I have FU money, I have to bite my tongue and play the politics to keep building up my FU fund. Or wait two years when I'm the engineering manager and then he'll be thinking twice about what he says.

he does not have an engineering degree, just tons of experience from being out in the field

I have a degree and I also manage a team.  Many managers (most? almost all?) would tend to value tons of field experience over a degree. I certainly do when I need to hire.  It's also nice to have a mix: older experienced folks and younger (but talented and hungry) folks. The older guys tend to bring a lot of experience and maturity to the team, and the younger guys bring a lot of creativity to the team.  Years and years of experience leads to good judgement, but judgement also can tend to limit creativity, since you already have pretty defined notions about what works and what doesn't.


Or wait two years when I'm the engineering manager and then he'll be thinking twice about what he says.

I hope, for your sake, that if you become a manager that you lose this attitude or you likely won't be a manager for long.  You'll either be moved out of the position, an unhealthy amount of your team will quit, or some combination of the two will occur.  Another poster said it well: as manager you hire good guys to work for you and then get the heck out of their way, supporting them as best they need to get the job done. Instilling fear in them is never part of the equation.

Mike
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Sofa King on January 25, 2015, 01:06:51 PM

 long story short I quit on a whim.

Don't quit on a "whim". Even if something pisses you off at work don't quit rite away just say you don't feel well and leave work rite then and sleep on your decision for a few days to make sure it's what you really want. I don't see ANY downfalls from having FU $$$$$ if you least do that. 
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: mm1970 on January 25, 2015, 01:09:22 PM
Not an epic FU story - more like frugal habits = financial choices.  I worked for the Dept of State as a Foreign Service officer and really liked my job.  Although I was frequently transferred, I knew that if I didn't like either my supervisor or colleagues, either they or I would be moving on within a couple of years.  Then the world changed and the number of dangerous, unaccompanied tours soared.  The Dept instituted a policy of "fair-share" so that all of us would share the burden of these tours (there aren't many of us - there are fewer FSOs worldwide than full-time musicians with the U.S. Army bands).  I agreed with the policy, but I was a single mother with no one with whom I could have left my daughter.  Boarding school would have been provided, but all kids are different - and mine wouldn't have done well in that environment.  So, having reached the age of 50 with 25 years in, I retired.

My colleagues were taken aback when I told them I didn't plan on getting a full-time job afterwards (pension at age 50 is drastically reduced so most early "retirees" have another full-time job lined up before they take the plunge).  How was I going to survive?  This is where my frugal habits saved me.  While my colleagues had purchased nice houses in the suburbs when they started their careers, I had bought an 850 sq ft fixer-upper within a 5 minute walk to the metro and only one stop to DC.  In addition to saving time (I spent about 35 minutes a day commuting on public transport - my colleagues spent on average 2 1/2 hours), it saved money - $1.40 per trip, vs over $4.00.  When the real estate situation improved, I didn't upgrade.  I also didn't upgrade my 2-dr Toyota despite some urging (a couple of different colleagues actually took me aside and told me that my dented, 17 year old car wasn't part of the image that the U.S. Embassy wanted to project).

When I retired, I sold my house for triple for what I paid for it, moved to the midwest closer to my relatives, and bought a house for cash.  A year later I am working on my own web-based business - it doesn't make any money yet, but I can afford to do what I want.  It's a great feeling.
This is great.  I have a friend who I'm pretty sure is a military version of an FSO (not sure if they have the same title?)  But he has had way too many unaccompanied tours of late, so he's getting out.  And very soon.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: LadyStache on January 25, 2015, 01:10:30 PM
I don't have an FU story but after this past week, I want to get to that point more than ever.

I work as an engineer and about six months ago we hired another "engineer". I use the quotes because he does not have an engineering degree, just tons of experience from being out in the field. This past week we had a piece of equipment that had failed in the field and has been replaced three time prior by an exact copy but new piece of equipment each time. The "engineer" had called for it to be replaced again and I told the field guys to leave it until someone proves the equipment is truly defective, and not actually miscoordinating. The "engineer" sent me an email and included the guys in my group as well. He asked me to explain to him why I superseded his judgement. Side note, he and I are the same level and pay but he is twice my age. With FU money, I would be able to respond back with "please find attached a copy of MY engineering degree for your reference. If you need further explanation, please note the PE initials following my name. They roughly translate to I am the expert!"

Until the moment I have FU money, I have to bite my tongue and play the politics to keep building up my FU fund. Or wait two years when I'm the engineering manager and then he'll be thinking twice about what he says.

he does not have an engineering degree, just tons of experience from being out in the field

I have a degree and I also manage a team.  Many managers (most? almost all?) would tend to value tons of field experience over a degree. I certainly do when I need to hire.  It's also nice to have a mix: older experienced folks and younger (but talented and hungry) folks. The older guys tend to bring a lot of experience and maturity to the team, and the younger guys bring a lot of creativity to the team.  Years and years of experience leads to good judgement, but judgement also can tend to limit creativity, since you already have pretty defined notions about what works and what doesn't.


Or wait two years when I'm the engineering manager and then he'll be thinking twice about what he says.

I hope, for your sake, that if you become a manager that you lose this attitude or you likely won't be a manager for long.  You'll either be moved out of the position, an unhealthy amount of your team will quit, or some combination of the two will occur.  Another poster said it well: as manager you hire good guys to work for you and then get the heck out of their way, supporting them as best they need to get the job done. Instilling fear in them is never part of the equation.

Mike

I agree with Mike 100%. I also want to add, the reason you're upset is because he emailed you for an explanation. Perhaps he genuinely wanted to know how to do his job better. Perhaps he had no way of knowing that the equipment had been replaced by brand new equipment recently (he is fairly new to your company after all). And if you were going to overrule him on a project he's been working on, it would have been courteous of you to call him to discuss the issue or to take the initiative to coach him on specific things that could be done in the future before requesting replacements. After all, that's what a real leader would do.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Kris on January 25, 2015, 01:20:14 PM
Not an epic FU story - more like frugal habits = financial choices.  I worked for the Dept of State as a Foreign Service officer and really liked my job.  Although I was frequently transferred, I knew that if I didn't like either my supervisor or colleagues, either they or I would be moving on within a couple of years.  Then the world changed and the number of dangerous, unaccompanied tours soared.  The Dept instituted a policy of "fair-share" so that all of us would share the burden of these tours (there aren't many of us - there are fewer FSOs worldwide than full-time musicians with the U.S. Army bands).  I agreed with the policy, but I was a single mother with no one with whom I could have left my daughter.  Boarding school would have been provided, but all kids are different - and mine wouldn't have done well in that environment.  So, having reached the age of 50 with 25 years in, I retired.

My colleagues were taken aback when I told them I didn't plan on getting a full-time job afterwards (pension at age 50 is drastically reduced so most early "retirees" have another full-time job lined up before they take the plunge).  How was I going to survive?  This is where my frugal habits saved me.  While my colleagues had purchased nice houses in the suburbs when they started their careers, I had bought an 850 sq ft fixer-upper within a 5 minute walk to the metro and only one stop to DC.  In addition to saving time (I spent about 35 minutes a day commuting on public transport - my colleagues spent on average 2 1/2 hours), it saved money - $1.40 per trip, vs over $4.00.  When the real estate situation improved, I didn't upgrade.  I also didn't upgrade my 2-dr Toyota despite some urging (a couple of different colleagues actually took me aside and told me that my dented, 17 year old car wasn't part of the image that the U.S. Embassy wanted to project).

When I retired, I sold my house for triple for what I paid for it, moved to the midwest closer to my relatives, and bought a house for cash.  A year later I am working on my own web-based business - it doesn't make any money yet, but I can afford to do what I want.  It's a great feeling.
This is great.  I have a friend who I'm pretty sure is a military version of an FSO (not sure if they have the same title?)  But he has had way too many unaccompanied tours of late, so he's getting out.  And very soon.

This is a great story.  It is fairly amazing how a few well-traced "paths" seem to attract the majority of the traffic, so much so that it's difficult for most people to see that there are other ways to get from A to B. 
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Cinder on January 25, 2015, 03:01:29 PM

 long story short I quit on a whim.

Don't quit on a "whim". Even if something pisses you off at work don't quit rite away just say you don't feel well and leave work rite then and sleep on your decision for a few days to make sure it's what you really want. I don't see ANY downfalls from having FU $$$$$ if you least do that.

The old saying goes... don't run away from something, run to something.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: tyler1215 on January 26, 2015, 06:19:24 PM
all of the comments to my little tale are beyond amusing. To finish the story, I took the high road and informed our manager about the email. He offered to fire the guy for insubordination. I told the manager to hold off on firing the guy. I'll give him the opportunity to apologize and make things right, but I already have his replacement picked out. When it comes down to it, this is a business. I wouldn't be in the position I'm in unless I was that good. As for my management style, why don't you all Google "Jack Welch". I don't need compassion or sympathy to lead. I need results and a bottom-line, because the second I forget about that then I'll be looking for job and so will everyone else when the company fails. We pursue FIRE to have options ten to twenty years before the average worker. Not because we hate our jobs. Why would anyone punish themselves with a job they hated for ten to fifteen years with their only goal being retirement. Go out and do something with your lives. Make a difference. I know I get to make a difference every day when I go into work.

To make widely acquisitions and comment on a post with little background information is just asine.  you need to learn to ask questions and collect information before adding your two cents. This thread was set up to share stories, not to collect unsolicited comments. As Mark Twain said "better to remain silent and be thought the fool, than to speak and prove them right."
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: caliq on January 26, 2015, 06:25:51 PM
all of the comments to my little tale are beyond amusing. To finish the story, I took the high road and informed our manager about the email. He offered to fire the guy for insubordination. I told the manager to hold off on firing the guy. I'll give him the opportunity to apologize and make things right, but I already have his replacement picked out. When it comes down to it, this is a business. I wouldn't be in the position I'm in unless I was that good. As for my management style, why don't you all Google "Jack Welch". I don't need compassion or sympathy to lead. I need results and a bottom-line, because the second I forget about that then I'll be looking for job and so will everyone else when the company fails. We pursue FIRE to have options ten to twenty years before the average worker. Not because we hate our jobs. Why would anyone punish themselves with a job they hated for ten to fifteen years with their only goal being retirement. Go out and do something with your lives. Make a difference. I know I get to make a difference every day when I go into work.

To make widely acquisitions and comment on a post with little background information is just asine.  you need to learn to ask questions and collect information before adding your two cents. This thread was set up to share stories, not to collect unsolicited comments. As Mark Twain said "better to remain silent and be thought the fool, than to speak and prove them right."

I think you should follow Twain's advice :)

Edit:  I realized that you're probably feeling like everyone just shit on you, and that's kind of what happened.   So I can see why you came back with a hugely defensive reply.

I just want to offer this -- have you ever thought about the best way to achieve the "results and bottom line" you're looking for?  Has it occurred to you that seeing the employees you supervise as people, approaching them with compassion and sympathy, and to work together with them to solve problems might be the most effective way of achieving those results?  It's very hard to be motivated to fix a problem for a guy who's always treating you like shit; if you developed actual relationships with your underlings, their productivity would probably rise, which would make you look even better to your boss...
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Cheddar Stacker on January 26, 2015, 06:38:43 PM
I think you should follow Twain's advice :)

I thought the same thing. I know nothing abut you Tyler1215, but your aggressiveness here seems misplaced. And if you ever re-read the second paragraph you just wrote with an editor's eye you might learn to be a bit more humble. Or not, whatever.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Malaysia41 on January 26, 2015, 06:58:41 PM
all of the comments to my little tale are beyond amusing. To finish the story, I took the high road and informed our manager about the email. He offered to fire the guy for insubordination. I told the manager to hold off on firing the guy. I'll give him the opportunity to apologize and make things right, but I already have his replacement picked out. When it comes down to it, this is a business. I wouldn't be in the position I'm in unless I was that good. As for my management style, why don't you all Google "Jack Welch". I don't need compassion or sympathy to lead. I need results and a bottom-line, because the second I forget about that then I'll be looking for job and so will everyone else when the company fails. We pursue FIRE to have options ten to twenty years before the average worker. Not because we hate our jobs. Why would anyone punish themselves with a job they hated for ten to fifteen years with their only goal being retirement. Go out and do something with your lives. Make a difference. I know I get to make a difference every day when I go into work.

To make widely acquisitions and comment on a post with little background information is just asine.  you need to learn to ask questions and collect information before adding your two cents. This thread was set up to share stories, not to collect unsolicited comments. As Mark Twain said "better to remain silent and be thought the fool, than to speak and prove them right."

Phew.  I'm happy I don't work with you. 

+1 on Cheddar Stacker's comments, and I'll add this:

In the future, you may want to reconsider posting in a public forum where 'face-punching' is both accepted and encouraged. 

In the investor forums, I got beaten up pretty badly.  I thought I had my shit together.  Ultimately, however, the searing face-punches made me take a second look at my thinking.  And damned it if some of those harsh responders weren't right!
   
Title: Realizing my net-value
Post by: bigalsmith101 on January 26, 2015, 07:00:51 PM
I work as an independent contractor and am regularly on call for emergency based response contracts that include traveling across the country as a prerequisite. Every job requires travel.

I am young, married but with no mortgage (very low rent), no children, no pets, very little debt. My wife works with me often as my assistant, thus saving/earning us more money.

Because we have very little debt to service we can afford to decide which jobs to take, and when to take time off.

Until recently I have specifically contracted to a single company for the entirety of my business. Our relationship has been very beneficial to each of us and there has been no reason to diversify. However, due to circumstances out of my control, I have recently had to subcontract through another company (an affiliate and acquaintance in the industry).

When the time came to make the switch, I began to negotiate the contract rates with the new company. Historically I have received 90% of the contract award while the company I originally contracted with kept 10% as a finders fee. 10% is very low, but I am 95% autonomous, thus they make money for simply giving me the contract. I manage all aspects of the job, freeing capacity for the company to pursue more business.

When making the switch I offered to let the new company keep 15% of the award rate. They were flabbergasted. NO WAY. They would offer a minimum of 30%, they have overhead, upkeep, etc!

I pointed out that what while they may have overhead and upkeep with their other contractors, I bring autonomy to the table, thus greatly reducing all of their overhead. I require no maintenance, am completely self sufficient, AND self funded. Thus they have no upfront cost for contract acquisition.

In lieu of the facts, they unhappily offered a 20/80 split, which I accepted, but only for the FIRST contract.

The next contract recently came up and I was contacted by the new company to take the job. They were eager to capitalize on my capacity as they previously had not had a contractor available, and thus could not to accept these lucrative contracts.  I agreed under the condition that the new contract award split would be 15/85. Having seen my previous performance, they agreed. They had no choice. Take it or leave it.

I'm not even part way close to FI, but have a 12mo emergency fund, thus had the option to take the "FU" position. I did, and it worked.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Knapptyme on January 26, 2015, 09:56:13 PM
I think FU Money is an attitude that can be had without the funds to back it up if you believe in your own skills/potential. My example:

In the summer of 2007, I ran a one-week summer soccer camp for high school kids in my area at my school. I had to set up a separate business entity to do it right, but all my proceeds went to benefit the team I coached at that school because there were no funds for the athletic program. I did this same thing the year before and everything went just fine. This year, however, they wanted me to "rent" the field from the school even though they knew all my proceeds went back to the school's soccer program. They told me it was to cover the cost of mowing the field for the week where they would've just let it keep growing until school started again. I thought this was fairly reasonable, but not the brightest move by any means. (Let it be known that the principal was an absolute tool. She had no clue what she was doing, and this was one more piece of evidence.) Anyway, I arrive on Monday for my soccer camp, and the fields have not been mowed. My first day with the kids is in knee-high grass and weeds. Needless to say, I was pissed, especially if that's what I was paying rent for. I stormed into the office to give her a piece of my mind and left to mow half the field that night myself with my push mower so I wouldn't look like such an idiot the next day. The rest of the week went okay; a parent came and mowed the rest of the field for free. The principal came to collect the rent money from me late in the week; I had a bag of coins for her to count out if she cared.

I realize that's a lot of lead-in if you've read this far, but my tale is about one-third in. After the weekend, I get notified on Monday that the school board would like to talk to me about my behavior and interaction with our principal during that week of soccer camp. Apparently, my reaction to the indignity of the fields not being mowed was a sign of insubordination to them. (This is weird because I was a separate entity that was renting the field from the school as instructed. The fact that I happened to be employed there should not have been a factor.) They set up a meeting where I had an opportunity to apologize and come to terms with being the bad guy in this situation. In this special hearing, I stood firm to my beliefs as a soccer coach, a teacher, and a human being that I was in the right. I gave them a list of reasons why it would be foolish to terminate my contract for the upcoming school year and the difficulty they would face in doing so. It felt really good to let them know what a terrible decision they were about to make. After a brief deliberation, I was welcomed back into the room to hear my fate of termination. Here's the best part, and they didn't know this was coming. My wife also worked there as a teacher and resigned immediately. We were young, had recently bought a house, and had no secure income outside of our teaching gigs. Their only response were mouths agape. The principal had the gall to speak, and in her stupidity uttered towards my wife, "Can I get that in writing?" The middle of July is not an ideal time to find replacements for the English and Math Department Chairs as well as new soccer coaches.

The following year was what we call our "lean" year. Mustachian principles had to be used to survive, not thrive with a large savings rate. I began selling some of my video games, old CD's, and books online as a side gig. I did construction work for my brother. I did some substitute teaching (pretty rough sometimes because I took any and all gigs available). In my new temporary job--as in-school suspension room monitor--I was allowed access to the internet all day, every day in what amounted as my search for a new full-time job. I got hooked up with a teacher head-hunting firm and they found a great opportunity for me in the private sector making twice what I made at my other school. The best part was that my wife got hired on at that new school, too. We doubled our income, moved out of wintery Michigan for Florida, and live biking/walking distance from our employment. As for our bumbling principal, she was demoted back to being a fifth-grade teacher the year we moved and is no longer with the school (I'm not sure why).

Having an FU attitude allowed us to pursue even better opportunities elsewhere. I can tell you that school was so conservative, they never thought anyone would be so "reckless" about their future, and that made all the difference. Now, we're just about 9 years from FI and an option to RE which I will likely take. My wife may continue to teach; she finds it fulfilling.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: expatartist on January 26, 2015, 10:43:36 PM
"If you don't take control of your career direction, life will do it for you."

+1 to the poster above who wrote this.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: DoubleDown on January 27, 2015, 09:48:32 AM
I don't need compassion or sympathy to lead.

Where did you get this idea? Did someone teach this to you, or did you conclude it on your own?
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: ender on January 27, 2015, 12:56:52 PM
I don't need compassion or sympathy to lead.

Where did you get this idea? Did someone teach this to you, or did you conclude it on your own?

To be fair, you don't really need it to manage. It generally makes you a poor leader but you can still manage without either compassion or sympathy.

But managing and leading are very, very different things.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Luck12 on January 27, 2015, 01:09:34 PM
As for my management style, why don't you all Google "Jack Welch". I don't need compassion or sympathy to lead. I need results and a bottom-line, because the second I forget about that then I'll be looking for job and so will everyone else when the company fails. We pursue FIRE to have options ten to twenty years before the average worker. Not because we hate our jobs. Why would anyone punish themselves with a job they hated for ten to fifteen years with their only goal being retirement. Go out and do something with your lives. Make a difference. I know I get to make a difference every day when I go into work.

To make widely acquisitions and comment on a post with little background information is just asine.  you need to learn to ask questions and collect information before adding your two cents. This thread was set up to share stories, not to collect unsolicited comments. As Mark Twain said "better to remain silent and be thought the fool, than to speak and prove them right."

Anybody can comment on anything they wish to comment on!  Jack Welch was a big time asshole.   Your management style is one reason a lot of people want FU money so they don't have to put with arrogant and condescending jerk store managers. 
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: dd564 on January 27, 2015, 03:38:57 PM
I don't have an FU story but after this past week, I want to get to that point more than ever.

I work as an engineer and about six months ago we hired another "engineer". I use the quotes because he does not have an engineering degree, just tons of experience from being out in the field. This past week we had a piece of equipment that had failed in the field and has been replaced three time prior by an exact copy but new piece of equipment each time. The "engineer" had called for it to be replaced again and I told the field guys to leave it until someone proves the equipment is truly defective, and not actually miscoordinating. The "engineer" sent me an email and included the guys in my group as well. He asked me to explain to him why I superseded his judgement. Side note, he and I are the same level and pay but he is twice my age. With FU money, I would be able to respond back with "please find attached a copy of MY engineering degree for your reference. If you need further explanation, please note the PE initials following my name. They roughly translate to I am the expert!"

Until the moment I have FU money, I have to bite my tongue and play the politics to keep building up my FU fund. Or wait two years when I'm the engineering manager and then he'll be thinking twice about what he says.

Although there has been an implication along these lines in previous posts:  I won't say people like you suck.  I will say that people who think this way suck, so hopefully you fix how you think.  Discounting "tons of experience from being out in the field" when you are some kid out of college is ridiculous.  You can point to the obvious Gates-type example, but even outside of that kind of obvious example, it is still ridiculous. 

You need to do your job, nothing wrong with that, nothing wrong with calling for something to be done differently from the guy with lots of experience, but appealing to authority (in this case, the authority of a piece of paper) is gross.

I know plenty of grizzled paralegals who know more about the law than freshly-minted lawyers.

I'm not sure why the poster feels the need to show up a seasoned veteran with real life experience.  It's a total pr!ck move to try and create conflict when there is no need for some.  I can only assume that due to his age he has an inferiority complex or something which is unusual for engineers.

At best this appears to be someone being a d!ck just for the sake of being a d!ck.  The older dude is probably planning his own FU story for when this kid becomes the "boss".
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: dd564 on January 27, 2015, 03:45:08 PM
all of the comments to my little tale are beyond amusing. To finish the story, I took the high road and informed our manager about the email. He offered to fire the guy for insubordination. I told the manager to hold off on firing the guy. I'll give him the opportunity to apologize and make things right, but I already have his replacement picked out. When it comes down to it, this is a business. I wouldn't be in the position I'm in unless I was that good. As for my management style, why don't you all Google "Jack Welch". I don't need compassion or sympathy to lead. I need results and a bottom-line, because the second I forget about that then I'll be looking for job and so will everyone else when the company fails. We pursue FIRE to have options ten to twenty years before the average worker. Not because we hate our jobs. Why would anyone punish themselves with a job they hated for ten to fifteen years with their only goal being retirement. Go out and do something with your lives. Make a difference. I know I get to make a difference every day when I go into work.

To make widely acquisitions and comment on a post with little background information is just asine.  you need to learn to ask questions and collect information before adding your two cents. This thread was set up to share stories, not to collect unsolicited comments. As Mark Twain said "better to remain silent and be thought the fool, than to speak and prove them right."

Oh. I responded to your previous post before reading this.

Now, from your post above, I see that you have a bigger dick than any of us here so you win.
Title: Re: Realizing my net-value
Post by: dandarc on January 27, 2015, 04:16:25 PM
I work as an independent contractor and am regularly on call for emergency based response contracts that include traveling across the country as a prerequisite. Every job requires travel.

I am young, married but with no mortgage (very low rent), no children, no pets, very little debt. My wife works with me often as my assistant, thus saving/earning us more money.

Because we have very little debt to service we can afford to decide which jobs to take, and when to take time off.

Until recently I have specifically contracted to a single company for the entirety of my business. Our relationship has been very beneficial to each of us and there has been no reason to diversify. However, due to circumstances out of my control, I have recently had to subcontract through another company (an affiliate and acquaintance in the industry).

When the time came to make the switch, I began to negotiate the contract rates with the new company. Historically I have received 90% of the contract award while the company I originally contracted with kept 10% as a finders fee. 10% is very low, but I am 95% autonomous, thus they make money for simply giving me the contract. I manage all aspects of the job, freeing capacity for the company to pursue more business.

When making the switch I offered to let the new company keep 15% of the award rate. They were flabbergasted. NO WAY. They would offer a minimum of 30%, they have overhead, upkeep, etc!

I pointed out that what while they may have overhead and upkeep with their other contractors, I bring autonomy to the table, thus greatly reducing all of their overhead. I require no maintenance, am completely self sufficient, AND self funded. Thus they have no upfront cost for contract acquisition.

In lieu of the facts, they unhappily offered a 20/80 split, which I accepted, but only for the FIRST contract.

The next contract recently came up and I was contacted by the new company to take the job. They were eager to capitalize on my capacity as they previously had not had a contractor available, and thus could not to accept these lucrative contracts.  I agreed under the condition that the new contract award split would be 15/85. Having seen my previous performance, they agreed. They had no choice. Take it or leave it.

I'm not even part way close to FI, but have a 12mo emergency fund, thus had the option to take the "FU" position. I did, and it worked.
Next year ask for 90-10.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Daisy on January 27, 2015, 08:14:05 PM
I don't have an FU story but after this past week, I want to get to that point more than ever.

I work as an engineer and about six months ago we hired another "engineer". I use the quotes because he does not have an engineering degree, just tons of experience from being out in the field. This past week we had a piece of equipment that had failed in the field and has been replaced three time prior by an exact copy but new piece of equipment each time. The "engineer" had called for it to be replaced again and I told the field guys to leave it until someone proves the equipment is truly defective, and not actually miscoordinating. The "engineer" sent me an email and included the guys in my group as well. He asked me to explain to him why I superseded his judgement. Side note, he and I are the same level and pay but he is twice my age. With FU money, I would be able to respond back with "please find attached a copy of MY engineering degree for your reference. If you need further explanation, please note the PE initials following my name. They roughly translate to I am the expert!"

Until the moment I have FU money, I have to bite my tongue and play the politics to keep building up my FU fund. Or wait two years when I'm the engineering manager and then he'll be thinking twice about what he says.

Although there has been an implication along these lines in previous posts:  I won't say people like you suck.  I will say that people who think this way suck, so hopefully you fix how you think.  Discounting "tons of experience from being out in the field" when you are some kid out of college is ridiculous.  You can point to the obvious Gates-type example, but even outside of that kind of obvious example, it is still ridiculous. 

You need to do your job, nothing wrong with that, nothing wrong with calling for something to be done differently from the guy with lots of experience, but appealing to authority (in this case, the authority of a piece of paper) is gross.

I know plenty of grizzled paralegals who know more about the law than freshly-minted lawyers.

I'm not sure why the poster feels the need to show up a seasoned veteran with real life experience.  It's a total pr!ck move to try and create conflict when there is no need for some.  I can only assume that due to his age he has an inferiority complex or something which is unusual for engineers.

At best this appears to be someone being a d!ck just for the sake of being a d!ck.  The older dude is probably planning his own FU story for when this kid becomes the "boss".

Perhaps this is an FU story after all, but told from the perspective of the older engineer.

Ha ha...reminds me of the demotivational poster:
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: oldtoyota on January 28, 2015, 08:20:44 AM

 long story short I quit on a whim.

Don't quit on a "whim". Even if something pisses you off at work don't quit rite away just say you don't feel well and leave work rite then and sleep on your decision for a few days to make sure it's what you really want. I don't see ANY downfalls from having FU $$$$$ if you least do that.

That is what I did. I wanted to resign last fall and waited several months to do it.

Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: rockstache on January 28, 2015, 08:41:23 AM
all of the comments to my little tale are beyond amusing. To finish the story, I took the high road and informed our manager about the email. He offered to fire the guy for insubordination. I told the manager to hold off on firing the guy. I'll give him the opportunity to apologize and make things right, but I already have his replacement picked out. When it comes down to it, this is a business. I wouldn't be in the position I'm in unless I was that good. As for my management style, why don't you all Google "Jack Welch". I don't need compassion or sympathy to lead. I need results and a bottom-line, because the second I forget about that then I'll be looking for job and so will everyone else when the company fails. We pursue FIRE to have options ten to twenty years before the average worker. Not because we hate our jobs. Why would anyone punish themselves with a job they hated for ten to fifteen years with their only goal being retirement. Go out and do something with your lives. Make a difference. I know I get to make a difference every day when I go into work.

To make widely acquisitions and comment on a post with little background information is just asine.  you need to learn to ask questions and collect information before adding your two cents. This thread was set up to share stories, not to collect unsolicited comments. As Mark Twain said "better to remain silent and be thought the fool, than to speak and prove them right."

I didn't respond to the first one, but man....this guy is exactly why I am saving to be FI, so DH and I don't have to put up with someone like that ever becoming our boss.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: gimp on January 28, 2015, 08:09:52 PM
The "engineer" sent me an email and included the guys in my group as well. He asked me to explain to him why I superseded his judgement. Side note, he and I are the same level and pay but he is twice my age. With FU money, I would be able to respond back with "please find attached a copy of MY engineering degree for your reference. If you need further explanation, please note the PE initials following my name. They roughly translate to I am the expert!"

Well ain't you a dick and a half. I mean, maybe I shouldn't argue with you, since I don't have the "PE" initials following my name, since I'm just an electrical engineer who doesn't need the government to tell me that I can design things.

Winning an argument by appeal to authority - even if that authority is you (though it's really not, it's the certifying agency granting you license to say you're a PE) - is a maneuver that only works on small children. "I'm your parent and you will do what I say, because I know best." Even that doesn't work very well.

Maybe next time you should have a discussion with this person who is your peer, though arguably knows a hell of a lot more than you do, on the proper steps to take. When my boss doesn't know about something I'm doing, he doesn't come running in to tell me my decision is wrong, he asks me to tell him my decision and why I made it. We will come to an agreement on whether something is the right way to go, because we're on the same page; he knows more than I do in general, but I know more about the specific task on which I'm currently working.

Try to remember that, lest you become the sort of piece of shit boss people leave the company from. "I don't need compassion to lead." No, you don't. You can crack the whip all you like. Just remember that if you're cracking the whip, you damn well better be paying out the nose to make it worthwhile for anyone to stay. I can quit tomorrow and have a job as soon as I come back from a nice vacation. I wouldn't give two thoughts before leaving your employ.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Kris on January 28, 2015, 08:25:19 PM
The "engineer" sent me an email and included the guys in my group as well. He asked me to explain to him why I superseded his judgement. Side note, he and I are the same level and pay but he is twice my age. With FU money, I would be able to respond back with "please find attached a copy of MY engineering degree for your reference. If you need further explanation, please note the PE initials following my name. They roughly translate to I am the expert!"

Well ain't you a dick and a half. I mean, maybe I shouldn't argue with you, since I don't have the "PE" initials following my name, since I'm just an electrical engineer who doesn't need the government to tell me that I can design things.

Winning an argument by appeal to authority - even if that authority is you (though it's really not, it's the certifying agency granting you license to say you're a PE) - is a maneuver that only works on small children. "I'm your parent and you will do what I say, because I know best." Even that doesn't work very well.

Maybe next time you should have a discussion with this person who is your peer, though arguably knows a hell of a lot more than you do, on the proper steps to take. When my boss doesn't know about something I'm doing, he doesn't come running in to tell me my decision is wrong, he asks me to tell him my decision and why I made it. We will come to an agreement on whether something is the right way to go, because we're on the same page; he knows more than I do in general, but I know more about the specific task on which I'm currently working.

Try to remember that, lest you become the sort of piece of shit boss people leave the company from. "I don't need compassion to lead." No, you don't. You can crack the whip all you like. Just remember that if you're cracking the whip, you damn well better be paying out the nose to make it worthwhile for anyone to stay. I can quit tomorrow and have a job as soon as I come back from a nice vacation. I wouldn't give two thoughts before leaving your employ.

Teachable moment.

Hope he takes note. + 1.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: TonyPlush on January 28, 2015, 08:35:34 PM
all of the comments to my little tale are beyond amusing. To finish the story, I took the high road and informed our manager about the email. He offered to fire the guy for insubordination. I told the manager to hold off on firing the guy. I'll give him the opportunity to apologize and make things right, but I already have his replacement picked out. When it comes down to it, this is a business. I wouldn't be in the position I'm in unless I was that good. As for my management style, why don't you all Google "Jack Welch". I don't need compassion or sympathy to lead. I need results and a bottom-line, because the second I forget about that then I'll be looking for job and so will everyone else when the company fails. We pursue FIRE to have options ten to twenty years before the average worker. Not because we hate our jobs. Why would anyone punish themselves with a job they hated for ten to fifteen years with their only goal being retirement. Go out and do something with your lives. Make a difference. I know I get to make a difference every day when I go into work.

To make widely acquisitions and comment on a post with little background information is just asine.  you need to learn to ask questions and collect information before adding your two cents. This thread was set up to share stories, not to collect unsolicited comments. As Mark Twain said "better to remain silent and be thought the fool, than to speak and prove them right."
I found it funny that when I googled Jack Welch, this image came up:

(http://i.imgur.com/XWhA3ti.jpg)
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: eyePod on January 29, 2015, 07:18:21 AM
all of the comments to my little tale are beyond amusing. To finish the story, I took the high road and informed our manager about the email. He offered to fire the guy for insubordination. I told the manager to hold off on firing the guy. I'll give him the opportunity to apologize and make things right, but I already have his replacement picked out. When it comes down to it, this is a business. I wouldn't be in the position I'm in unless I was that good. As for my management style, why don't you all Google "Jack Welch". I don't need compassion or sympathy to lead. I need results and a bottom-line, because the second I forget about that then I'll be looking for job and so will everyone else when the company fails. We pursue FIRE to have options ten to twenty years before the average worker. Not because we hate our jobs. Why would anyone punish themselves with a job they hated for ten to fifteen years with their only goal being retirement. Go out and do something with your lives. Make a difference. I know I get to make a difference every day when I go into work.

To make widely acquisitions and comment on a post with little background information is just asine.  you need to learn to ask questions and collect information before adding your two cents. This thread was set up to share stories, not to collect unsolicited comments. As Mark Twain said "better to remain silent and be thought the fool, than to speak and prove them right."

I think you should follow Twain's advice :)

Edit:  I realized that you're probably feeling like everyone just shit on you, and that's kind of what happened.   So I can see why you came back with a hugely defensive reply.

I just want to offer this -- have you ever thought about the best way to achieve the "results and bottom line" you're looking for?  Has it occurred to you that seeing the employees you supervise as people, approaching them with compassion and sympathy, and to work together with them to solve problems might be the most effective way of achieving those results?  It's very hard to be motivated to fix a problem for a guy who's always treating you like shit; if you developed actual relationships with your underlings, their productivity would probably rise, which would make you look even better to your boss...

I think someone's in line for a good reading of 7 habits of highly effective people.

Now, on the one hand, the non-engineer may be a moron. I've seen plenty of people with tons of "industry experience" who were lazy idiots.

On other hand though, I'm glad that I've never had a manager like you. You sound like an a-hole. And honestly, I'm surprised you're hanging out in an ER forum when you seem like you love the cutthroat idea of business and working for the man.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: OldDogNewTrick on January 29, 2015, 07:42:00 AM
Dependency is too weak a word, slavery too strong a word, but it's somewhere in the middle there.
Servitude?

Peonage -
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Prairie Stash on January 29, 2015, 08:06:23 AM
At this point it's getting funny and sad. Tyler made a mistake, multiple people pile on him and call him various adjectives. The other guy (his coworker) also made a mistake.

From what I read both people in the story took the low approach. Tyler for not consulting (informing, talking to etc.) with the other guy, the other guy for making a public display of it. Tyler screwed up and the other guy cc'd his entire group calling for Tyler to defend himself! Since when do experienced guys publicly ridicule new staff? I'd be hostile too if an experienced guy flaunted how I screwed up to my entire working group. However that doesn't excuse Tyler's actions, it just means both parties are behaving badly. I personally hope Tyler views this as a learning opportunity, it's great this happened. Think how much better his group will be if he learns from this, managers aren't born they learn from all their experiences; both good and bad.

Where I'm from Engineers sign an obligation, it was written by Rudyard Kipling (English author long deceased). In that oath we pledge not to belittle our colleagues. We ask for forgiveness for our mistakes. At the time of the obligation we're reminded that engineers can cause great harm when personal jealousies and pettiness corrupt our work.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: fantabulous on January 31, 2015, 05:10:24 AM
Thought I'd add my own, despite not having any serious FU money or having to say FU to work. Last week I came out as transgender at work to little excitement. Having enough money to cover my debts and enough job skills to find some remote work if need be helped me to get over the whole lack of employment protection concern I had. You might say I said FU to being closeted instead.

Also, to be both foamy and on topic, my bosses were all kinds of supportive in helping me get enough things sorted out before making the big announcement. This let me relatively focus on work without them simply cracking the whip.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Malaysia41 on January 31, 2015, 05:36:40 AM
Thought I'd add my own, despite not having any serious FU money or having to say FU to work. Last week I came out as transgender at work to little excitement. Having enough money to cover my debts and enough job skills to find some remote work if need be helped me to get over the whole lack of employment protection concern I had. You might say I said FU to being closeted instead.

Also, to be both foamy and on topic, my bosses were all kinds of supportive in helping me get enough things sorted out before making the big announcement. This let me relatively focus on work without them simply cracking the whip.

Congratulations fantabulous!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: G-dog on January 31, 2015, 06:15:06 AM
Thought I'd add my own, despite not having any serious FU money or having to say FU to work. Last week I came out as transgender at work to little excitement. Having enough money to cover my debts and enough job skills to find some remote work if need be helped me to get over the whole lack of employment protection concern I had. You might say I said FU to being closeted instead.

Also, to be both foamy and on topic, my bosses were all kinds of supportive in helping me get enough things sorted out before making the big announcement. This let me relatively focus on work without them simply cracking the whip.

I am glad your bosses were supportive. Still a very big step for you A congratulations. I am part of my company's LGBTA group and we are working on some training and education to support this exact scenario.  PM me if you have any thoughts, resources, or advice.
Also, I'd like to find a book or other resource regarding personal finance/FI - is any book you would recommend that maybe covers some issues LGBTA face or deal with more frequently than the general population?
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: lizzie on January 31, 2015, 06:47:15 AM
Thought I'd add my own, despite not having any serious FU money or having to say FU to work. Last week I came out as transgender at work to little excitement. Having enough money to cover my debts and enough job skills to find some remote work if need be helped me to get over the whole lack of employment protection concern I had. You might say I said FU to being closeted instead.

Also, to be both foamy and on topic, my bosses were all kinds of supportive in helping me get enough things sorted out before making the big announcement. This let me relatively focus on work without them simply cracking the whip.

Congratulations fantabulous!

+1
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: aschmidt2930 on January 31, 2015, 07:12:49 AM
I don't have an FU story but after this past week, I want to get to that point more than ever.

I work as an engineer and about six months ago we hired another "engineer". I use the quotes because he does not have an engineering degree, just tons of experience from being out in the field. This past week we had a piece of equipment that had failed in the field and has been replaced three time prior by an exact copy but new piece of equipment each time. The "engineer" had called for it to be replaced again and I told the field guys to leave it until someone proves the equipment is truly defective, and not actually miscoordinating. The "engineer" sent me an email and included the guys in my group as well. He asked me to explain to him why I superseded his judgement. Side note, he and I are the same level and pay but he is twice my age. With FU money, I would be able to respond back with "please find attached a copy of MY engineering degree for your reference. If you need further explanation, please note the PE initials following my name. They roughly translate to I am the expert!"

Until the moment I have FU money, I have to bite my tongue and play the politics to keep building up my FU fund. Or wait two years when I'm the engineering manager and then he'll be thinking twice about what he says.

Is your coworker wrong? Probably, but a response like that is childish whether you have FU money or not.  I
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: marketnonsenses on February 02, 2015, 09:03:29 AM
Not Epic but amusing.
I had a job I didnt like and did not like some of my coworkers. It was weird for me because I am really friendly and get along with almost everyone. I got a new job offer and accepted. I gave a full month notice, in part because I could not start the new job for that long. People immediately started treating me ever worse and being extremely rude. They doubled my work because "You will be gone and dont have to do this anymore. You can do more for the last few weeks to give us a break." It was some odd logic. One person stopping working for days because "if you are going to quit why should I have to work."  I explained to one coworker that I could walk out any time I want and do not need to take this abuse. I was only trying to help them transition. After a few days harassment and hostility I emailed everyone saying  I was not coming back the next day. They freaked out. They claimed they didnt know how to do any of my work or the status of anything (I tried telling them multiple times and showed them where I saved my stuff). They tried demanding that I come back and fulfill my time. I told management that I didnt ow them anything. I told them they just fired 5 people without warning and didnt give them a month.  They said I was a bad employee and tried to discredit me. I laughed about all of it. No clue what happened to them. Not living paycheck to paycheck allowed me to leave weeks early.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Cookie78 on February 02, 2015, 09:14:39 AM
Thought I'd add my own, despite not having any serious FU money or having to say FU to work. Last week I came out as transgender at work to little excitement. Having enough money to cover my debts and enough job skills to find some remote work if need be helped me to get over the whole lack of employment protection concern I had. You might say I said FU to being closeted instead.

Also, to be both foamy and on topic, my bosses were all kinds of supportive in helping me get enough things sorted out before making the big announcement. This let me relatively focus on work without them simply cracking the whip.

:D Love stories like this.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Hvillian on February 02, 2015, 09:15:19 AM
People immediately started treating me ever worse and being extremely rude. They doubled my work because "You will be gone and dont have to do this anymore. You can do more for the last few weeks to give us a break." It was some odd logic. One person stopping working for days because "if you are going to quit why should I have to work."  I explained to one coworker that I could walk out any time I want and do not need to take this abuse. I was only trying to help them transition.

Wow, you worked with some crazy people.  Or perhaps small children.  I am glad you got out.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: marketnonsenses on February 02, 2015, 09:33:38 AM
People immediately started treating me ever worse and being extremely rude. They doubled my work because "You will be gone and dont have to do this anymore. You can do more for the last few weeks to give us a break." It was some odd logic. One person stopping working for days because "if you are going to quit why should I have to work."  I explained to one coworker that I could walk out any time I want and do not need to take this abuse. I was only trying to help them transition.

Wow, you worked with some crazy people.  Or perhaps small children.  I am glad you got out.

They are 40-50 year olds who act like children and have high paying jobs. Never been somewhere where so many people slipped though the cracks and ended up with jobs they are wildly unqualified for. There were a couple good ones but on average it was horrible.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: okits on April 30, 2015, 01:46:39 AM
Replying to bump this thread up for newer forum members who haven't seen it.  Very valuable source of encouragement, inspiration, and support.  Thank you everyone who shared their stories.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: okonumiyaki on April 30, 2015, 02:28:20 AM

- is any book you would recommend that maybe covers some issues LGBTA face or deal with more frequently than the general population?

Sorry, can't help it - have you seen the price of a good Broadway show?  (took neice & nephew to Lion King for a major treat - tickets for 4 of us were crazy expensive)
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: mm1970 on April 30, 2015, 11:36:14 AM
all of the comments to my little tale are beyond amusing. To finish the story, I took the high road and informed our manager about the email. He offered to fire the guy for insubordination. I told the manager to hold off on firing the guy. I'll give him the opportunity to apologize and make things right, but I already have his replacement picked out. When it comes down to it, this is a business. I wouldn't be in the position I'm in unless I was that good. As for my management style, why don't you all Google "Jack Welch". I don't need compassion or sympathy to lead. I need results and a bottom-line, because the second I forget about that then I'll be looking for job and so will everyone else when the company fails. We pursue FIRE to have options ten to twenty years before the average worker. Not because we hate our jobs. Why would anyone punish themselves with a job they hated for ten to fifteen years with their only goal being retirement. Go out and do something with your lives. Make a difference. I know I get to make a difference every day when I go into work.

To make widely acquisitions and comment on a post with little background information is just asine.  you need to learn to ask questions and collect information before adding your two cents. This thread was set up to share stories, not to collect unsolicited comments. As Mark Twain said "better to remain silent and be thought the fool, than to speak and prove them right."
I missed this the first time around.  I agree, you are kind of a d!ck.  Actually compassion is a very good skill to have when leading.

I cannot speak for your particular engineer, but some of the best engineers I've worked with have no degree.

When it comes to the equipment being replaced 3 times, with an engineer who has been there 6 months - my first question would have been, "who was responsible for the first two replacements?"  In my industry, 3 replacements might happen in 3 years, which means this 3rd one would have happened to this guy for the first time - and he had no history of it.

And if it was the same guy - for the people who work for me - I would have asked very leading questions on "have we figured out why it failed last two times? What information did we record the last two times?"  I'm all about root cause and documentation so that we don't make the same mistake twice, and so we don't rely on (faulty) memories.

Oh, and I'm an engineer.  With experience.  And degrees.  But not a jerk.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: FatCat on April 30, 2015, 12:58:13 PM
When it comes to experience vs degrees, one does not necessarily indicate a higher skill level than the other. There are plenty of people with years of experience in doing something in less than optimal ways. There are plenty of people with degrees that aren't very good at translating their academic achievements into solving real world problems. Sometimes the person with more years experience will be better. Sometimes the person with the degree will be better. Try to evaluate someone by their actual skill level rather than degrees or years of experience.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: frugalecon on May 31, 2015, 06:04:50 PM
I sometimes find myself checking out this thread on Sunday nights.

Wonder why??

Seems to have been a shortage of epic stories recently.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Nords on May 31, 2015, 08:25:43 PM
I sometimes find myself checking out this thread on Sunday nights.

Wonder why??

Seems to have been a shortage of epic stories recently.
"Sunday Night Syndrome".

My blog's posts on retiring from the military go through the same surge of hits every Sunday night.

One way to avoid this issue would be clicking on the "Notify" button by a post, but that would just spread the Sunday night review out across the rest of the week...
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: happy on June 01, 2015, 03:53:08 AM
Hehe I can believe it. I had a bad case of sunday night blues last night and was on here all hours.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: benjenn on June 01, 2015, 07:06:56 AM
This isn't really an epic FU story but it did make me chuckle when DH said it this weekend.  We're in the countdown to RE the end of July... only 59 days (38 works day!) to go.

As you can imagine, it's getting more and more difficult to trudge along at work for both of us.  He said the way he sees it, one of three things will happen.  1) July 31st will get here and we'll retire and head to the beach; 2) we'll get fired; or 3) someone will do or say something to piss us off and we'll be gone.  Under any of those circumstances, we'll be fine.  :)

The bad thing is that I almost wish for #2 or #3 just because it would mean being done earlier.  LOL.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: LibrarIan on June 01, 2015, 07:22:44 AM
While reading through some of the stories in this thread, I realized that I actually do have one as well. I guess I just never really thought about it much before.

In 2012 I worked for this public library (the #1 system in my whole state). I worked my way up to the coveted position of Young Adult Librarian, meaning I did all the things for teenagers like events, education, school visits, book buying, etc. Not having a MLIS degree, I couldn't *technically* be called a librarian but believe me when I say I did more librarianing than most librarians there (I do have the degree now). I was really good at the job and all my monthly stats showed that.

One day I sat down with my boss in some one-on-one meeting. I asked, when I earned my degree, if my pay would increase. Here's what I was told: Since I was "lucky enough" to get a librarian position without being a librarian, the low-ball pay I was getting was locked into the annual raise cycle. However, if I had been hired as a degree-wielding librarian, I would have been started off higher. Since I was locked in, even if I got a degree at some point, it would have no bearing on my pay. All the effort was going nowhere.

A few weeks later I took a programming aptitude test and passed. Then I got a job interview with an insurance company to do java development and got it, nearly doubling my pay (and they'd teach me coding, pay for transportation and all sorts of other perks). Before I resigned from my library job, I asked once more.

Me   : "Are you sure we can't work out a compromise?"
Boss: "What's done is done. I can't give you more."
Me   : "What if I quit today?" (We were in the middle of our big annual Summer Reading push and were insanely busy)
Boss: "What about all the things you have planned on the calendar? You can't just walk out."
Me   : "Well, since I just got a new job making double the pay since our meeting, it's not really my problem. But I'll finish out the month."
Boss: Blank stare.

My replacement was a degree-holding librarian and got started out making way more than I did, but evidently isn't a favorite in the organization. To this day, my coworkers still ask me if I plan to return.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: asauer on June 01, 2015, 07:54:56 AM
FU money allows me to be really picky when taking new jobs.  A couple years ago, I was recruited for a company to be a founding member of a new division of the org.  Opportunity sounded fun and challenging- starting things is one of my big thrills.  However, right before they made me the offer, they told me there would be travel (I'd asked them NUMEROUS times during the interviews and they said no).  After travelling with work 50% for 8 years I was done.  I said, I wouldn't travel more than 4 weeks per year because I wanted to be home with my family.  So, get this, they came back and increased their offer 20k so that I could "hire a nanny".  I told them that wasn't the point- I wanted to be home with them not have a nanny be home with them.  The SVP kept saying "I don't get it."  Well, that's obvious.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Squirrel away on June 02, 2015, 02:10:15 AM


Me   : "Are you sure we can't work out a compromise?"
Boss: "What's done is done. I can't give you more."
Me   : "What if I quit today?" (We were in the middle of our big annual Summer Reading push and were insanely busy)
Boss: "What about all the things you have planned on the calendar? You can't just walk out."
Me   : "Well, since I just got a new job making double the pay since our meeting, it's not really my problem. But I'll finish out the month."
Boss: Blank stare.



That's hilarious.:D
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: mohawkbrah on June 02, 2015, 02:19:10 AM
all of the comments to my little tale are beyond amusing. To finish the story, I took the high road and informed our manager about the email. He offered to fire the guy for insubordination. I told the manager to hold off on firing the guy. I'll give him the opportunity to apologize and make things right, but I already have his replacement picked out. When it comes down to it, this is a business. I wouldn't be in the position I'm in unless I was that good. As for my management style, why don't you all Google "Jack Welch". I don't need compassion or sympathy to lead. I need results and a bottom-line, because the second I forget about that then I'll be looking for job and so will everyone else when the company fails. We pursue FIRE to have options ten to twenty years before the average worker. Not because we hate our jobs. Why would anyone punish themselves with a job they hated for ten to fifteen years with their only goal being retirement. Go out and do something with your lives. Make a difference. I know I get to make a difference every day when I go into work.

To make widely acquisitions and comment on a post with little background information is just asine.  you need to learn to ask questions and collect information before adding your two cents. This thread was set up to share stories, not to collect unsolicited comments. As Mark Twain said "better to remain silent and be thought the fool, than to speak and prove them right."

you sound like one of the guys that everyone want FU money to get away from.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: cerebus on June 02, 2015, 04:00:07 AM

you sound like one of the guys that everyone want FU money to get away from.

(https://nwinton.files.wordpress.com/2006/12/respect-my-authority.jpeg)

Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: patrickza on June 02, 2015, 06:03:10 AM
Mine wasn't quite epic, but it was a hell of a lot of fun. I did a write-up here http://investorchallenge.co.za/f-you-money/ but to make a long story short, I was looking for a change, so demanded a 50% increase and an extra weeks leave or I'd be out of there. I have a couple of years expenses saved, so enough FU money for me to handle. Got told no and I said thanks, I'll be out of here at month end.

Had the most amazing 4 month holiday in Cape Town. Hiking, biking and paragliding, and only stopped because I got offered double my former rate. Worked out well in the end.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: mm1970 on June 02, 2015, 11:04:24 AM


Me   : "Are you sure we can't work out a compromise?"
Boss: "What's done is done. I can't give you more."
Me   : "What if I quit today?" (We were in the middle of our big annual Summer Reading push and were insanely busy)
Boss: "What about all the things you have planned on the calendar? You can't just walk out."
Me   : "Well, since I just got a new job making double the pay since our meeting, it's not really my problem. But I'll finish out the month."
Boss: Blank stare.



That's hilarious.:D
+1
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Ghzbani on June 02, 2015, 07:50:42 PM
FU money allows me to be really picky when taking new jobs.  A couple years ago, I was recruited for a company to be a founding member of a new division of the org.  Opportunity sounded fun and challenging- starting things is one of my big thrills.  However, right before they made me the offer, they told me there would be travel (I'd asked them NUMEROUS times during the interviews and they said no).  After travelling with work 50% for 8 years I was done.  I said, I wouldn't travel more than 4 weeks per year because I wanted to be home with my family.  So, get this, they came back and increased their offer 20k so that I could "hire a nanny".  I told them that wasn't the point- I wanted to be home with them not have a nanny be home with them.  The SVP kept saying "I don't get it."  Well, that's obvious.

Awesome. Just Awesome.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: oinkette on June 04, 2015, 11:54:48 AM
all of the comments to my little tale are beyond amusing. To finish the story, I took the high road and informed our manager about the email. He offered to fire the guy for insubordination. I told the manager to hold off on firing the guy. I'll give him the opportunity to apologize and make things right, but I already have his replacement picked out. When it comes down to it, this is a business. I wouldn't be in the position I'm in unless I was that good. As for my management style, why don't you all Google "Jack Welch". I don't need compassion or sympathy to lead. I need results and a bottom-line, because the second I forget about that then I'll be looking for job and so will everyone else when the company fails. We pursue FIRE to have options ten to twenty years before the average worker. Not because we hate our jobs. Why would anyone punish themselves with a job they hated for ten to fifteen years with their only goal being retirement. Go out and do something with your lives. Make a difference. I know I get to make a difference every day when I go into work.

To make widely acquisitions and comment on a post with little background information is just asine.  you need to learn to ask questions and collect information before adding your two cents. This thread was set up to share stories, not to collect unsolicited comments. As Mark Twain said "better to remain silent and be thought the fool, than to speak and prove them right."

you sound like one of the guys that everyone want FU money to get away from.

Agreed. Granted I work in the non-profit sector but I've had bosses that didn't need "compassion or sympathy to lead."  Either they don't last long, or the people under them flee like rats on a sinking ship.  There is a balance.. you should learn it before you become the manager.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: biggrey on June 05, 2015, 08:00:29 AM


To make widely acquisitions and comment on a post with little background information is just asine.  you need to learn to ask questions and collect information before adding your two cents. This thread was set up to share stories, not to collect unsolicited comments. As Mark Twain said "better to remain silent and be thought the fool, than to speak and prove them right."
[/quote]

---------------------------

Based on my read of this forum and the character of the majority of its members, I can assure the OP that we typically do not make "widely acquisitions" about things, nor do we post opinions that are "asine" very frequently. 

I think perhaps the OP should take more of Mark Twain's advice and remain silent in more of his interpersonal dealings, whether real or virtual.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: sisto on June 05, 2015, 01:38:11 PM
I love reading these stories. While I don't have an FU money story, I do have an FU quitting story. I've always earned my own money starting at a young age since I didn't come from much of it. My first W-2 job was at Jack in the Box. At the time the job was ok and I was good at it, learned all of the different stations etc. One day I called the store because I needed to talk to a friend that worked there. The manager answered the phone and was very rude to me and hung up on me and I had no idea why. Turns out when I talked to me friend he had a message for me that my hours were cut for a week and that I needed to talk with the manager if I wanted to know why. So I went in to talk with the manager and found out the whole reason was due to me calling at a really busy time. The guys was a real a'hole about the whole thing and told me if I kept arguing over it he would add another week. I stood straight up from the table told him he could cut my hours forever and walked out. It felt amazing. I arranged a job at the other Jack in the Box across town, but right before I was going to start it got shut down. Turns out the jerk manager had it blocked. Turned out to be fine for me, I got a job at a gas station and learned way more and liked it more anyway. Everything happens for a reason!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: MountainManMustache on June 05, 2015, 02:40:01 PM
For me "U" comes before "I".  FU that is, comes before FI.

I used having FU money (for me the amount was really close to FI, so close that only slight adjustment to lifestyle in ER was necessary if the SHTF), to take risks at my job and begin pushing for what was right for clients and the company, not necessarily right for politics within.

It worked well since after about 2 yrs of this behavior they "eliminated" my job and gave me money not only to leave but a bonus to stick around another month to train the new guy (poor guy got not only my job but it was laid on top of his current job, for a lot less than I was making).

So FU money got me FIRED!  HAHAHA.

Happy to be on FIRE, free and wild like a Honey Badger
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: sisto on June 05, 2015, 04:14:18 PM
For me "U" comes before "I".  FU that is, comes before FI.

I used having FU money (for me the amount was really close to FI, so close that only slight adjustment to lifestyle in ER was necessary if the SHTF), to take risks at my job and begin pushing for what was right for clients and the company, not necessarily right for politics within.

It worked well since after about 2 yrs of this behavior they "eliminated" my job and gave me money not only to leave but a bonus to stick around another month to train the new guy (poor guy got not only my job but it was laid on top of his current job, for a lot less than I was making).

So FU money got me FIRED!  HAHAHA.

Happy to be on FIRE, free and wild like a Honey Badger
I'm hoping to engineer the same departure into FIRE. I work and Mega Corp and they do layoff often trying to downsize in certain areas. There is usually a nice package involved and sometimes they allow people to volunteer which is what I'm hoping will coincide with my FIRE date.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: regulator on June 05, 2015, 04:50:17 PM
I sometimes find myself checking out this thread on Sunday nights.

Wonder why??

Seems to have been a shortage of epic stories recently.
"Sunday Night Syndrome".

My blog's posts on retiring from the military go through the same surge of hits every Sunday night.

One way to avoid this issue would be clicking on the "Notify" button by a post, but that would just spread the Sunday night review out across the rest of the week...

One of my old work buddies referred to it as "Suckday night."
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: galaxie on June 17, 2015, 08:01:40 PM
Not quite FU money, but spending less than I earn has enabled me to take a pay cut in order to go do my dream job.  Nothing wrong with my old job, just the opportunity of a lifetime.  We should still both be able to retire in about 14 years (when I'm 46).

I'm checking back in after a year.  Turns out that enjoying my job leads me to read the MMM forums a lot less frequently.  The job change was totally worth it, and FI is still on track too. 
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Nords on June 17, 2015, 08:13:27 PM
Not quite FU money, but spending less than I earn has enabled me to take a pay cut in order to go do my dream job.  Nothing wrong with my old job, just the opportunity of a lifetime.  We should still both be able to retire in about 14 years (when I'm 46).

I'm checking back in after a year.  Turns out that enjoying my job leads me to read the MMM forums a lot less frequently.  The job change was totally worth it, and FI is still on track too.
That's a fantastic way to leverage your FU money...
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: G-dog on June 17, 2015, 08:16:00 PM
Not quite FU money, but spending less than I earn has enabled me to take a pay cut in order to go do my dream job.  Nothing wrong with my old job, just the opportunity of a lifetime.  We should still both be able to retire in about 14 years (when I'm 46).

I'm checking back in after a year.  Turns out that enjoying my job leads me to read the MMM forums a lot less frequently.  The job change was totally worth it, and FI is still on track too.

That is great - happy for you!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: LaserCat on June 17, 2015, 08:49:36 PM
I don't know if I would call it epic, but having a stache of even just a little bit of FU you money allowed me to break my lease and move to another apartment.

Basically I moved into a new place which I quickly found out had neighbors from hell on all sides.  Pacing, stomping guy who worked nights lived above me, guy who loved bass music every single night on one side, and the arguing couple on the other side.

After attempting but never succeeding to contact my bass loving neighbor and after being told off by asking my above neighbor if he could be a bit quieter after midnight, I'd had enough and I broke my lease and moved after 1 month of being there.  My FU money allowed me to afford that.  If I knew then what I know now, I would have stuck it to my landlord to fix it, and I would have been able to leave without a break lease fee.  (Quiet Enjoyment Laws)

In any case, it was worth every penny to keep my sanity.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Daisy on June 17, 2015, 08:54:40 PM
There is so much attrition at my company after many rounds of layoffs, that HR is now worried too many people are leaving. So they arranged some HR feedback sessions. After attending one and speaking my mind, I keep getting invited to more. I basically regurgitate all of the moaning and groaning in the hallways back to HR. I guess the HR lady likes my feedback as I am having a meeting a week now. It's cutting into my "productive" time.

It's a lot of fun though as I say out loud what others are thinking and they all nod in agreement to the HR lady.

I try to be polite, but honest...with the power of FU money at my back pushing me along.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: iknowiyam on June 18, 2015, 10:50:58 AM
There is so much attrition at my company after many rounds of layoffs, that HR is now worried too many people are leaving. So they arranged some HR feedback sessions. After attending one and speaking my mind, I keep getting invited to more. I basically regurgitate all of the moaning and groaning in the hallways back to HR. I guess the HR lady likes my feedback as I am having a meeting a week now. It's cutting into my "productive" time.

It's a lot of fun though as I say out loud what others are thinking and they all nod in agreement to the HR lady.

I try to be polite, but honest...with the power of FU money at my back pushing me along.

I love this, and I think it's great that they want more of your honesty. I don't know about the company, but that HR person seems to really know her biz.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: mm1970 on June 18, 2015, 11:55:33 AM
There is so much attrition at my company after many rounds of layoffs, that HR is now worried too many people are leaving. So they arranged some HR feedback sessions. After attending one and speaking my mind, I keep getting invited to more. I basically regurgitate all of the moaning and groaning in the hallways back to HR. I guess the HR lady likes my feedback as I am having a meeting a week now. It's cutting into my "productive" time.

It's a lot of fun though as I say out loud what others are thinking and they all nod in agreement to the HR lady.

I try to be polite, but honest...with the power of FU money at my back pushing me along.

I love this, and I think it's great that they want more of your honesty. I don't know about the company, but that HR person seems to really know her biz.
This is great.  I just keep my mouth shut, because if I tell anyone about the grumblings, I'm a complainer and not a team player.  Even if I'm not the one grumbling.  At one point, they considered me the "heart" of the company and would want to know what was going on in the trenches.  And I have this face, people tell me how they are really feeling.

But I guess the truth hurts, and now they'd rather not know.  Oh, and they laid off all the lower levels anyway.  I'm the bottom, so I guess I don't need to be the pulse anymore.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: aspiretoretire on June 18, 2015, 02:51:46 PM
amazing stories
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: nobodyspecial on June 18, 2015, 06:16:49 PM
Quote
It's a lot of fun though as I say out loud what others are thinking and they all nod in agreement to the HR lady.
Left a job once and took the opportunity at the exit interview to tell HR about all the problems working there - including the  complete lack of support/contact/interest from HR.
The HR person confessed that HR dept was totally useless and she was leaving herself at the end of the month ....
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Bearded Man on June 18, 2015, 06:44:39 PM
When I was 19 or so I cut the lock off my locker ready to quit, having already threatened to quite over a $100 bonus I was never paid but was promised. My manager called me while I was in my car leaving the garage and talked me off the ledge, making it good by cutting a check that day.

I was living in an apartment, had 3 months expenses, little skills and few options at the time. I walked off the job at a job a few years ago with a paid off house and several years of savings in the bank, but I was leaving for a better job, with a degree and lot's of skills and credentials. I had a few unjust situations in the past and ended up unemployed for a while but learned a valuable lesson to have a job lined up before you make the switch.

You should be able to stomach it for a few months while you find something acceptable. Or you could take the first thing you get within a week or three out and if it sucks you can bide your time while you hop again. Not ideal on the resume but it happens. During that time at work, you can start to dodge if you like. Call in sick on days you have unpleasant meetings. Book conflicting meetings so you don't have to go, etc. Avoid, avoid avoid to make the job more tolerable until you find something else.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: cripzychiken on June 18, 2015, 07:12:35 PM
So in college, my first job was at a restaurant in the kitchen.  Wings and burgers.  Pretty easy, I was the only person that didn't show up high or smoke on the job (hey I was only 18).

Anyways, in December they post a schedule for the entire month since people leave for vacation.  That's fine. Well, the last week of the schedule was the first week of school.  Plus that Monday the college football team was playing in the national title game.  So first team staff, full 8 people.  By then I was the #2 guy in the kitchen - ran it on the weekdays when the kitchen manager had his days off.  But, I had class that day.  I put in writing that b/c of school I couldn't make that shift.  Printed the letter and my schedule and had all 3 managers sign the paper.  I copied it and sent it to all 3 managers and the owner.  The week before the shift I remind everyone that I"m not going to make it, get someone to replace me.  Put that in writing and everyone signed that too - while saying I was stupid, they wouldn't forget.  Anyways, no one fixes the schedule.  They call me 20 minutes before the game starts and ask my why I didn't show.  I didn't answer (my class ended at 7, game started at 9, I was already drinking).

Next day the owner calls me into his office to talk about my 'lack of dedication'.  He was surprised when I gave him (well picked off his desk) the notice that I would skip the shift for school with all 3 managers signatures on it, then the other reminder.  I smiled, told him if he can't run a business and since he treats his employees like criminals for giving him 4 weeks notice of a missed shift for school reasons, I can't work for him.  I quit on the spot.  Apologized to the kitchen team (it was a slow day so being a man down wouldn't be that bad), took a shot with them and left.

2 months later, I'm working at another restaurant, 2 of the 3 managers from the first one had quit (something about bad management) and were interviewing at the new restaurant.  One of them got the job and about 2 weeks later, I told him that he had to fire a guy that walked out on 2 of his shifts that week or I would walk out, I couldn't deal with the short kitchen and idiots who no-showed.  He said he couldn't, I reminded him that I had quit on the spot before and would again.  He asked me to stay the shift so he wouldn't look bad to his new boss (being down 2 guys with 1 quiting) and asked me to name my price - 6 hours and 3 pitchers of beer later, we closed the restaurant down and he had to drive me home. 

Said he never met a kid with a head on his shoulders before and I shouldn't waste my time in kitchens.  I took his advice and never worked in a kitchen again (well except my own, I love cooking).  Plus, now I got a free round when I head back to where he was working. 

Anyways, sometimes, saying FU is great, but keeping bridges with those with true power matters.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Kitsune on June 22, 2015, 01:27:30 PM
So, I was 25 or so, working as a project manager at a publicly-owned company that was, shall we say, going through some difficult times.

Boss: "So, are you sure that the milestones for these 3 projects were hit in January, and not December?"
Me: "Absolutely. The back-up documentation with the dates is attached to that in the correct place on the server."
Boss: "See, that's a problem. We really need these to have been completed in December. Can you change those documents?"
Me: "... Excuse me?"
Boss, blustering: "Well, *this colleague* and *this colleague* already did it for their projects, so you shouldn't have any issue doing it!" *
Me: "You realize that you're asking me to falsify financial documents for a publicly-owned company for the specific purpose of deceiving investors? Can I have that request in writing?"
Boss: "I could fire you for asking that!!"
Me: "Well, I have a year's worth of living expenses in the bank, and you keep insisting on me using my personal computer for work use so all my work files are on there. You can fire me, but I can confirm right now that it would NOT be in your best interest."
Boss: "... Well, I'm going to go look at options to get the revenue we need aligned to December!"

Conclusion 1: If I have been back-to-the-wall financially like some of my colleagues, I probably wouldn't have felt like I could afford to push back on a blatantly illegal request. Big, big problem.
Conclusion 2: There was a colleague in another department I was close with, and I relayed this information over drinks one night after he resigned for a new job. A month later, he asked me for my resume, and hired me... at 50% more than I had been making at this company.
Conclusion 3: A year later, the crappy company was going under, and Unethical Boss applied for a position as my colleague, which I was doing the initial round of interviews for. Let's just say she didn't get a glowing recommendation...

*Note: Colleague 1 had just bought a condo and was broke to the bone, which was common knowledge. Colleague 2 was supporting her family alone and kept complaining about how broke she was. Obviously they felt they didn't have any other options... But seriously, they did WHAT?!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Zamboni on June 22, 2015, 11:56:50 PM
Wow. Some people don't seem to understand basic business ethics at all.  Or, even if they just don't care about ethics or somehow twist around things enough in their mind to decide something clearly unethical is okay after all, they don't seem to understand that something like that WILL come back to bite them (some way, some how) in the future.

That reminds me: I went round and round with a previous boss who was like that. FU money and general principle kept me from going along with any of her shady schemes, and I found a position in a different department.

To make a long story short it finally came around to bite her in the butt a few months ago. Someone at a very high level of power found out about her unethical practices by accident and the SHTF. I got pulled in and questioned about it during an internal investigation, so I got the gritty details. Thankfully while working with her I had stood my ground and not done any of the unethical things she suggested, and so I was able to recount what she suggested but say I never did any of it in my part of the program. She threw the other person who did her bidding right under the bus! Basically that person's career has been crushed. Somehow, though, my former boss has been slippery enough to survive in her job. Said she didn't know that the other person was doing the unethical things. But I guess the higher ups didn't entirely believe her because they asked me about it and then they shut down her participation in an important project. At least now they know they can't trust any of her numbers, they are no longer making any decisions based upon her numbers, and she got completely removed from that big project.

What she was doing would be a very embarrassing scandal if it leaked out to the press and such a leak would cause collateral damage to innocent people. So, I do worry that she's hanging on somehow (probably because her husband, who works here also and is higher on the food chain, is liked and well respected) and that when eventually there is a change at the top she will start her con game all over again and the new administration will be duped.
Hopefully by then I'll be FIREd!

Edited a couple of years later:
Unethical manager above did eventually get fired for unethical behavior (not the good kind of FIREd.) A newly hired person complained in a big way, and that triggered an investigation where everyone who had transferred internally out of her group was interviewed. Despite her terrible behavior, I was still surprised she was sacked because my employer hardly ever lets anyone go from her type of position! All she had to do was act like a normal person and she could have collected that paycheck as long as she wanted. So, let that be a lesson: no, we don't need the crappy treatment, thanks to FU money, but sometimes you can even stay at the same employer and outplay, outwit, outlast your crappy manager who is making you want to quit!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Geostache on June 23, 2015, 08:00:37 AM
I was working full time while finishing my grad degree. It came time for me to do my research, which required me to have some time off during normal business hours. I proposed three different scenarios to my boss, which would still have me complete my 40 hours a week, but allow me the time I needed during business hours to do my research. Each scenario I proposed was me with a "no." When I pressed for reasons why, my boss replied "I need you here during normal business hours, every day." Which was complete BS, because I was never busy the whole 40 hours a week anyway.

Here's where the FU story came in. During this same conversation, my boss had the cojones to say to me "And I don't think you can afford to not have a job."

I replied with "I'm giving you my two week notice. You'll have an official letter on your desk by the end of the day."

The look on his face was priceless.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: RyanAtTanagra on June 23, 2015, 10:40:08 AM
Wow. Some people don't seem to understand basic business ethics at all.  Or, even if they just don't care about ethics or somehow twist around things enough in their mind to decide something clearly unethical is okay after all, they don't seem to understand that something like that WILL come back to bite them (some way, some how) in the future.

That reminds me: I went round and round with a previous boss who was like that. FU money and general principle kept me from going along with any of her shady schemes, and I found a position in a different department.

I forgot about the ethical side of it.  I used to work for a small software company where I was the only tech support person.  The higher ups trained the sales people to basically tell potential customers that our software would do whatever it is they wanted.  Then they were supposed to stall for 30 days during the money-back period, at which point it was too late for them and we could keep their money.  That plan backfired on them all the time when the customer would get me to help them with installation and would ask me about all these things the software was supposed to do and I would tell them that that was wrong, it absolutely cannot do that.  Then they'd go back angry to their sales guy and demand a refund.  My boss and his boss finally came to me very angry and basically told me I couldn't tell the customer the truth, I had to lie and back up the sales guy.  I just looked at them and said 'no'.  They weren't expecting that and fumbled and tried to tell me the same thing in a different way, which was met with another 'no'.  Repeat a couple times.  Finally they just went away, and I kept doing what I was doing.  Pretty sure most of the sales guys were desperate for a job, or they wouldn't have been working at that shitty company in the first place, which I imagine is why they went along with it.  They were mostly good people and knew it wasn't right.  Like others have said, FU money isn't always about quitting, sometimes it's even more important than that.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Nords on June 23, 2015, 10:47:44 AM
She threw the other person who did her bidding right under the bus! Basically that person's career has been crushed. Somehow, though, my former boss has been slippery enough to survive in her job. Said she didn't know that the other person was doing the unethical things.
That reminds me of the highly dramatized yet enlightening book about psychopaths, "Snakes In Suits". 

They don't hate people.  They hardly have any feelings at all for people.  They just see them as pawns to be moved around as needed to support their plans.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: mm1970 on June 23, 2015, 10:55:22 AM
She threw the other person who did her bidding right under the bus! Basically that person's career has been crushed. Somehow, though, my former boss has been slippery enough to survive in her job. Said she didn't know that the other person was doing the unethical things.
That reminds me of the highly dramatized yet enlightening book about psychopaths, "Snakes In Suits". 

They don't hate people.  They hardly have any feelings at all for people.  They just see them as pawns to be moved around as needed to support their plans.
Sadly, I work with someone like that.  The way he treats people is terrible - anyone he sees as "beneath" him.  His boss tried to fire him for cause once and lay him off once, and the upper management saved him because he's of the same ethnic group they are and he's charismatic. He managed to suck up to them big time.

The funny thing is that mid-level management that didn't work closely with him don't understand why we all hate him.  He is incompetent.  He throws people under the bus for his mistakes, he takes credit for everyone else's work.  I mean, I'm still quite flabbergasted that our management doesn't realize it.

Our former manager (who tried to get rid of him) has positioned himself with FU money so that he says "I don't get what I want, I'm gone".
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Wilson Hall on June 24, 2015, 12:30:09 PM
I was working full time while finishing my grad degree. It came time for me to do my research, which required me to have some time off during normal business hours. I proposed three different scenarios to my boss, which would still have me complete my 40 hours a week, but allow me the time I needed during business hours to do my research. Each scenario I proposed was me with a "no." When I pressed for reasons why, my boss replied "I need you here during normal business hours, every day." Which was complete BS, because I was never busy the whole 40 hours a week anyway.

Here's where the FU story came in. During this same conversation, my boss had the cojones to say to me "And I don't think you can afford to not have a job."

I replied with "I'm giving you my two week notice. You'll have an official letter on your desk by the end of the day."

The look on his face was priceless.

This is awesome.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Mesmoiselle on August 31, 2015, 06:05:26 PM
Would love to read more stories. I'm going to have FU money in 1.6 months and  am really looking forward to it.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: lbmustache on August 31, 2015, 07:57:28 PM
I've got a story.

I started working for a really shitty company. No 401k, no health insurance, low pay, no separate vacation/sick days: all under a 10 day banner of "PTO." Required to work long hours, was micromanaged all day (chastised for "using the bathroom too much," being "too friendly," amongst other things), all the technology was dated, nothing got done, meanwhile the owner was off tooling around in his expensive cars and homes. The whole thing reminded me of that quote, "are you working to make your dreams come true, or someone else's dreams come true?" It was very clear to me that we were all working in substandard conditions for this ass.

All of my coworkers agreed that it was a shitty place. I kept talking about leaving and people would tell me, "you can't piss people off," "you'll never get hired anywhere else," "I could never leave, how will I pay for x,y,z." Keep in mind that this was a company that didn't pay a whole lot and offered marginal benefits.

I spent over a year being miserable. I had about $10-$12k in the bank. Finally, I was like, you know what - I am young, financially secure, I'm just going to chance it and leave and hope that things work out. I can't waste my one life that I've got in this hellhole. I've got an MA, I've had other jobs, if shit hits the fan I guess I can move back home. So I got the balls to leave. I did things the right way and gave 2 weeks notice rather than walking out with middle fingers raised (which is what I wanted to do!). Once I gave the two weeks notice the atmosphere totally changed in the office. All of my coworkers and boss were being really rude and condescending to me. Like, how dare you think you're better than this company?

4 days into my two weeks notice, I lost it. Completely went off the rails. I had had it - didn't care about the reference (which was probably going to be poor anyway given their attitude), didn't care about making nice - whatever. I threw my keys on my boss's desk and stormed out.

I got hired in a new place right away. Ironically I now work less hours and get paid more. Never looked back. ALL POSSIBLE THANKS TO FU MONEY!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Gone Fishing on September 02, 2015, 07:24:51 AM
She threw the other person who did her bidding right under the bus! Basically that person's career has been crushed. Somehow, though, my former boss has been slippery enough to survive in her job. Said she didn't know that the other person was doing the unethical things.
That reminds me of the highly dramatized yet enlightening book about psychopaths, "Snakes In Suits". 

They don't hate people.  They hardly have any feelings at all for people.  They just see them as pawns to be moved around as needed to support their plans.

Current boss is 65 and twice divorced.  He has a slightly younger girlfriend he mentioned he had plans to marry the other day.  While I think he does enjoy her company, I'm convinced he is doing it mostly to have someone to care for him in his old age.  In the conversation he used terms like having his old age care/companionship problem "solved".  Psychopathy is a spectrum and this guy is out there for sure.   
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: mm1970 on September 02, 2015, 11:06:11 AM
I've got a story.

I started working for a really shitty company. No 401k, no health insurance, low pay, no separate vacation/sick days: all under a 10 day banner of "PTO." Required to work long hours, was micromanaged all day (chastised for "using the bathroom too much," being "too friendly," amongst other things), all the technology was dated, nothing got done, meanwhile the owner was off tooling around in his expensive cars and homes. The whole thing reminded me of that quote, "are you working to make your dreams come true, or someone else's dreams come true?" It was very clear to me that we were all working in substandard conditions for this ass.

All of my coworkers agreed that it was a shitty place. I kept talking about leaving and people would tell me, "you can't piss people off," "you'll never get hired anywhere else," "I could never leave, how will I pay for x,y,z." Keep in mind that this was a company that didn't pay a whole lot and offered marginal benefits.

I spent over a year being miserable. I had about $10-$12k in the bank. Finally, I was like, you know what - I am young, financially secure, I'm just going to chance it and leave and hope that things work out. I can't waste my one life that I've got in this hellhole. I've got an MA, I've had other jobs, if shit hits the fan I guess I can move back home. So I got the balls to leave. I did things the right way and gave 2 weeks notice rather than walking out with middle fingers raised (which is what I wanted to do!). Once I gave the two weeks notice the atmosphere totally changed in the office. All of my coworkers and boss were being really rude and condescending to me. Like, how dare you think you're better than this company?

4 days into my two weeks notice, I lost it. Completely went off the rails. I had had it - didn't care about the reference (which was probably going to be poor anyway given their attitude), didn't care about making nice - whatever. I threw my keys on my boss's desk and stormed out.

I got hired in a new place right away. Ironically I now work less hours and get paid more. Never looked back. ALL POSSIBLE THANKS TO FU MONEY!
there's a company in town like that. I  shudder.  A couple of friends have worked there.  One former coworker still does.  He cries on his hour long drive home every day.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: frugalecon on September 03, 2015, 10:30:53 AM
I've got a story.

I started working for a really shitty company. No 401k, no health insurance, low pay, no separate vacation/sick days: all under a 10 day banner of "PTO." Required to work long hours, was micromanaged all day (chastised for "using the bathroom too much," being "too friendly," amongst other things), all the technology was dated, nothing got done, meanwhile the owner was off tooling around in his expensive cars and homes. The whole thing reminded me of that quote, "are you working to make your dreams come true, or someone else's dreams come true?" It was very clear to me that we were all working in substandard conditions for this ass.

All of my coworkers agreed that it was a shitty place. I kept talking about leaving and people would tell me, "you can't piss people off," "you'll never get hired anywhere else," "I could never leave, how will I pay for x,y,z." Keep in mind that this was a company that didn't pay a whole lot and offered marginal benefits.

I spent over a year being miserable. I had about $10-$12k in the bank. Finally, I was like, you know what - I am young, financially secure, I'm just going to chance it and leave and hope that things work out. I can't waste my one life that I've got in this hellhole. I've got an MA, I've had other jobs, if shit hits the fan I guess I can move back home. So I got the balls to leave. I did things the right way and gave 2 weeks notice rather than walking out with middle fingers raised (which is what I wanted to do!). Once I gave the two weeks notice the atmosphere totally changed in the office. All of my coworkers and boss were being really rude and condescending to me. Like, how dare you think you're better than this company?

4 days into my two weeks notice, I lost it. Completely went off the rails. I had had it - didn't care about the reference (which was probably going to be poor anyway given their attitude), didn't care about making nice - whatever. I threw my keys on my boss's desk and stormed out.

I got hired in a new place right away. Ironically I now work less hours and get paid more. Never looked back. ALL POSSIBLE THANKS TO FU MONEY!
there's a company in town like that. I  shudder.  A couple of friends have worked there. One former coworker still does.  He cries on his hour long drive home every day.

I would worry about what that level of emotional distress was doing to my physical health. Not only would you be giving up years of your life, but you are probably also on average shortening your life.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Josiecat on September 03, 2015, 10:54:10 AM
there's a company in town like that. I  shudder.  A couple of friends have worked there. One former coworker still does.  He cries on his hour long drive home every day.

This is so ridiculous.  Get another f-ing job.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Faraday on September 03, 2015, 11:00:42 AM
I'm coming up on a major crossroads in my career/at my company. I've been reluctant to post details about it here in case there are any closet mustachians in my real life that know who I am or might have ways of figuring it out.

Long story short, I've built a nice FU stache, and plan to double it before this crossroads occurs in a few years. It will be nice to have the option to take the road less traveled if I feel the need.

...

Major crossroads! PM Sent...
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Chris22 on September 03, 2015, 11:09:05 AM
there's a company in town like that. I  shudder.  A couple of friends have worked there. One former coworker still does.  He cries on his hour long drive home every day.

This is so ridiculous.  Get another f-ing job.

Or man up and don't cry like a little bitch.  Unless your job is something like hospice nurse for sick kids or putting dogs down, why the hell are you CRYING at work? 
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: mtn on September 03, 2015, 11:19:44 AM
there's a company in town like that. I  shudder.  A couple of friends have worked there. One former coworker still does.  He cries on his hour long drive home every day.

This is so ridiculous.  Get another f-ing job.

Or man up and don't cry like a little bitch.  Unless your job is something like hospice nurse for sick kids or putting dogs down, why the hell are you CRYING at work?

Crying on the drive home.

You really seem to be mad at the world lately. Everything ok?
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Fishindude on September 03, 2015, 11:37:46 AM
When I was a little younger, dumber and poorer in business we used to chase any reasonable prospect and bid for their business.

Some of the purchasing folks were quite adept at setting up what they considered competitive bidding scenarios where they could compare "apples to apples" in order to get the lowest price possible.   Then as soon as you submit your proposal all communication ceases and they hide from you (unless you are low bid, which is unlikely), and a week or two later you get the Dear John letter telling you thanks for your time, we're going with brand X.   Some buyers are also real hard cases on their terms of doing business; slow pay, damage and delays clauses, give you all the risk, etc.

Now days a sale or two isn't going to make us or break us, so when they start going down the "competitive bidding, apples to apples" road, we frequently just politely explain to them that we are not interested in doing business in this manner and walk away.  Have also turned down quite a bit of business that we didn't like the contract terms on, or made adjustments to the terms.

Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Chris22 on September 03, 2015, 11:43:30 AM
there's a company in town like that. I  shudder.  A couple of friends have worked there. One former coworker still does.  He cries on his hour long drive home every day.

This is so ridiculous.  Get another f-ing job.

Or man up and don't cry like a little bitch.  Unless your job is something like hospice nurse for sick kids or putting dogs down, why the hell are you CRYING at work?

Crying on the drive home.

You really seem to be mad at the world lately. Everything ok?

I'm good, living the dream, going on my 17th year in the world not crying at work. 
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: mtn on September 03, 2015, 11:46:36 AM
there's a company in town like that. I  shudder.  A couple of friends have worked there. One former coworker still does.  He cries on his hour long drive home every day.

This is so ridiculous.  Get another f-ing job.

Or man up and don't cry like a little bitch.  Unless your job is something like hospice nurse for sick kids or putting dogs down, why the hell are you CRYING at work?

Crying on the drive home.

You really seem to be mad at the world lately. Everything ok?

I'm good, living the dream, going on my 17th year in the world not crying at work.

Why don't you start your first of not judging people, and trying a little sympathy? Or if not that, just not saying anything?
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Eric on September 03, 2015, 12:00:44 PM
there's a company in town like that. I  shudder.  A couple of friends have worked there. One former coworker still does.  He cries on his hour long drive home every day.

This is so ridiculous.  Get another f-ing job.

Or man up and don't cry like a little bitch.  Unless your job is something like hospice nurse for sick kids or putting dogs down, why the hell are you CRYING at work?

Men don't cry?  Or if they do, they're a little bitch?  Jeez, I'm glad I don't care about my machismo like this.  Seems like a terrible way to view life and I certainly wouldn't want to be boxed in by perceptions of how I'm supposed to act just because I'm male.  It's almost if people have different emotional outlets, even men!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Chris22 on September 03, 2015, 12:06:34 PM
there's a company in town like that. I  shudder.  A couple of friends have worked there. One former coworker still does.  He cries on his hour long drive home every day.

This is so ridiculous.  Get another f-ing job.

Or man up and don't cry like a little bitch.  Unless your job is something like hospice nurse for sick kids or putting dogs down, why the hell are you CRYING at work?

Men don't cry?  Or if they do, they're a little bitch?

If it's over something as insignificant as something at work, correct. 

MOD NOTE: There have been several complaints on this line of threads. I could go through with a big-strike through in red and repaint the thread landscape - but I'm not going to. There is an opportunity here for growth, connection and understanding.

First - I will ask you if these belittling and degrading comments add to the kind of community we want to encourage.
Second - Just today, a friend of mine posted this: 18 Inspiring Men Share What Being Vulnerable Means To Them. As he launches his mission to get these types of conversations started:http://heartmen.net/vulnerable/ (http://heartmen.net/vulnerable/)

I hope you will check it out and come back to posting with a little more empathy, understanding and, yes, vulnerability.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: No Name Guy on September 03, 2015, 12:40:49 PM
...and I watched a co-worker tell the bean counters to go fuck off within the last few days.

Damn it was good.  OK, so this guy was going to retire anyways in the next year or two.  But we're in a business that requires 1/10th hour charging to the various contracts.  This guy is, well, was, being run ragged with 20 different contracts to charge to.  The asshats in bean counting dinged him for supposedly not charging correctly.  Yeah, bullshit.  I've never seen anyone try his level best in a bullshit system.  Anyways, they tagged him for remedial training with his manager.  He sends out his retirement notice - first person on the e-mail is the asshat bean counter in the far off city, 2nd is his manager.

I think Shakespeare was wrong in his assessment.  The first thing we should do is kill all the fucking bean counting accountants.  THEN kill all the lawyers.

[No, no I'm not at all bitter about the bullshit from these fucking, moronic MBA bullshit spewing bean counting penny-wise, million dollar foolish idiots that don't know how to run a company.  They're driving it into the ground - this great American Success Story that was built by engineers and manufacturing workers].

Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: JLee on September 03, 2015, 12:46:03 PM
...and I watched a co-worker tell the bean counters to go fuck off within the last few days.

Damn it was good.  OK, so this guy was going to retire anyways in the next year or two.  But we're in a business that requires 1/10th hour charging to the various contracts.  This guy is, well, was, being run ragged with 20 different contracts to charge to.  The asshats in bean counting dinged him for supposedly not charging correctly.  Yeah, bullshit.  I've never seen anyone try his level best in a bullshit system.  Anyways, they tagged him for remedial training with his manager.  He sends out his retirement notice - first person on the e-mail is the asshat bean counter in the far off city, 2nd is his manager.

I think Shakespeare was wrong in his assessment.  The first thing we should do is kill all the fucking bean counting accountants.  THEN kill all the lawyers.

[No, no I'm not at all bitter about the bullshit from these fucking, moronic MBA bullshit spewing bean counting penny-wise, million dollar foolish idiots that don't know how to run a company.  They're driving it into the ground - this great American Success Story that was built by engineers and manufacturing workers].
Heh. Reminds me, we have a hiring freeze right now because the parent company of my division acquired yet another company.  We're still not at the level of staff we should have, yet we're bringing on new customers left and right. But...omg no money because we bought something else, guess we'll leave all the employees at their 150% workload for another few months!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Chris22 on September 03, 2015, 12:52:55 PM
...and I watched a co-worker tell the bean counters to go fuck off within the last few days.

Damn it was good.  OK, so this guy was going to retire anyways in the next year or two.  But we're in a business that requires 1/10th hour charging to the various contracts.  This guy is, well, was, being run ragged with 20 different contracts to charge to.  The asshats in bean counting dinged him for supposedly not charging correctly.  Yeah, bullshit.  I've never seen anyone try his level best in a bullshit system.  Anyways, they tagged him for remedial training with his manager.  He sends out his retirement notice - first person on the e-mail is the asshat bean counter in the far off city, 2nd is his manager.

I think Shakespeare was wrong in his assessment.  The first thing we should do is kill all the fucking bean counting accountants.  THEN kill all the lawyers.

[No, no I'm not at all bitter about the bullshit from these fucking, moronic MBA bullshit spewing bean counting penny-wise, million dollar foolish idiots that don't know how to run a company.  They're driving it into the ground - this great American Success Story that was built by engineers and manufacturing workers].

It's all fun and games until a customer requests an audit of your charges and can find errors and starts disputing the charges, drags you to court, etc etc.  Or God forbid it's a gov't contract you've fucked up on.  Us bean counters aren't making up this shit because we like fucking with people, you know.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Shane on September 03, 2015, 01:05:12 PM
Back on topic here...

On a Monday morning this June I went into work at my job of 10+ years. I was in a good mood and didn't have any intentions of quitting. During the morning meeting something just set me off, and I spoke up in front of everyone and told them I thought that what our organization was doing was WRONG, IMMORAL, and that we should stop! Everyone's jaws just dropped. One of the managers in the meeting said, "Well, I don't think that one of us should be saying things like that. We all need to be on the same page." My supervisor chimed in and just basically repeated the company policy and told everyone that that's what we would be following.

When we walked out of the meeting my supervisor acted like nothing had happened. He gave me a list of a couple of routine things he wanted me to do that day, and I nodded my head and said okay. As soon as my supervisor walked away I  loaded all of my personal things into a vehicle, went back inside, gave everyone a big hug and wished them all a good life. Apparently no one realized I was quitting at the time. They all just thought I was apologizing for my outburst or not being a team player, or something.

When I walked back outside to the parking lot my supervisor was there. I walked up to him, shook his hand and said, "I'm going home." He was like, "What do you mean? Are you sick?" I said, "No, I'm just over it. I've got better things to do with my time. I don't want to be part of this anymore. I'm leaving." I hopped in the car and drove away. I could see my supervisor in the rear view mirror standing there with his jaw dropped.

At our main office I spent about an hour explaining to our director why I was leaving and why I didn't agree with our organization's policies. She was really nice and asked me to reconsider and stay. She proposed various scenarios that might allow me to stay on and continue working, but by that point I was really beyond wanting to continue working for the organization. I just told her I was sorry and that I was ready to move on.

Our director seemed really concerned that I was making an irresponsible, rash decision. She kept reminding me that I needed to think of my wife (SAHM) and young daughter and that I needed to have a job. I explained to her calmly that I had investments and savings, and that we would be fine. I told her that by my calculations my family and I should be able to live comfortably off of our investments indefinitely. At some point, I may choose to take another job or maybe start a business that interests me, but I shouldn't have to. At that point, the director got kind of quiet, and she said, "Wow, I wish I could do that. If I could, I'd quit too."





 
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: trailrated on September 03, 2015, 01:34:48 PM
Back on topic here...

On a Monday morning this June I went into work at my job of 10+ years. I was in a good mood and didn't have any intentions of quitting. During the morning meeting something just set me off, and I spoke up in front of everyone and told them I thought that what our organization was doing was WRONG, IMMORAL, and that we should stop! Everyone's jaws just dropped. One of the managers in the meeting said, "Well, I don't think that one of us should be saying things like that. We all need to be on the same page." My supervisor chimed in and just basically repeated the company policy and told everyone that that's what we would be following.

When we walked out of the meeting my supervisor acted like nothing had happened. He gave me a list of a couple of routine things he wanted me to do that day, and I nodded my head and said okay. As soon as my supervisor walked away I  loaded all of my personal things into a vehicle, went back inside, gave everyone a big hug and wished them all a good life. Apparently no one realized I was quitting at the time. They all just thought I was apologizing for my outburst or not being a team player, or something.

When I walked back outside to the parking lot my supervisor was there. I walked up to him, shook his hand and said, "I'm going home." He was like, "What do you mean? Are you sick?" I said, "No, I'm just over it. I've got better things to do with my time. I don't want to be part of this anymore. I'm leaving." I hopped in the car and drove away. I could see my supervisor in the rear view mirror standing there with his jaw dropped.

At our main office I spent about an hour explaining to our director why I was leaving and why I didn't agree with our organization's policies. She was really nice and asked me to reconsider and stay. She proposed various scenarios that might allow me to stay on and continue working, but by that point I was really beyond wanting to continue working for the organization. I just told her I was sorry and that I was ready to move on.

Our director seemed really concerned that I was making an irresponsible, rash decision. She kept reminding me that I needed to think of my wife (SAHM) and young daughter and that I needed to have a job. I explained to her calmly that I had investments and savings, and that we would be fine. I told her that by my calculations my family and I should be able to live comfortably off of our investments indefinitely. At some point, I may choose to take another job or maybe start a business that interests me, but I shouldn't have to. At that point, the director got kind of quiet, and she said, "Wow, I wish I could do that. If I could, I'd quit too."

That is fucking awesome
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Pooperman on September 03, 2015, 01:45:41 PM
What was the wrong immoral thing?
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: mm1970 on September 03, 2015, 01:50:37 PM
there's a company in town like that. I  shudder.  A couple of friends have worked there. One former coworker still does.  He cries on his hour long drive home every day.

This is so ridiculous.  Get another f-ing job.
Yes!  Two of my former coworkers were fired from there for just "not getting along/ not a good fit" (yeah, they weren't assholes?)

Anyway, one of them is back, and she said "I told him to leave.  Please find another job.  It's not worth it."

FWIW, there aren't a ton of jobs in town, and I think he has a family.  But yes, he needs to get looking.

I interviewed at the company and got an offer right then (it was very informal interview).  So many red flags (including, they were firing my friend at the time I was interviewing).  They said "we aren't sure why we have a hard time hiring people "like you.  I mean, well, you know..." (Of middle-ages, meaning mid-30s to mid-50s.)  They have a lot of 20 somethings and some 55+ people.

Well, gee, crappy pay, bad benefits, bad place to live, and you start people with 15 days of PTO (including sick time, vacation, and holidays).  15 days?  I get 34 days right now.  15 days wouldn't even cover half the school days off.  People with kids aren't going to do it unless they are desperate.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: mm1970 on September 03, 2015, 01:52:00 PM
there's a company in town like that. I  shudder.  A couple of friends have worked there. One former coworker still does.  He cries on his hour long drive home every day.

This is so ridiculous.  Get another f-ing job.

Or man up and don't cry like a little bitch.  Unless your job is something like hospice nurse for sick kids or putting dogs down, why the hell are you CRYING at work?
Yeah, on the way home.

Grown men putting you down, yelling at you for being "fucking stupid" all day, emotional abuse?  Tip of the iceberg, or so my friends say.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: G-dog on September 03, 2015, 01:55:36 PM
Back on topic here...

On a Monday morning this June I went into work at my job of 10+ years. I was in a good mood and didn't have any intentions of quitting. During the morning meeting something just set me off, and I spoke up in front of everyone and told them I thought that what our organization was doing was WRONG, IMMORAL, and that we should stop! Everyone's jaws just dropped. One of the managers in the meeting said, "Well, I don't think that one of us should be saying things like that. We all need to be on the same page." My supervisor chimed in and just basically repeated the company policy and told everyone that that's what we would be following.

When we walked out of the meeting my supervisor acted like nothing had happened. He gave me a list of a couple of routine things he wanted me to do that day, and I nodded my head and said okay. As soon as my supervisor walked away I  loaded all of my personal things into a vehicle, went back inside, gave everyone a big hug and wished them all a good life. Apparently no one realized I was quitting at the time. They all just thought I was apologizing for my outburst or not being a team player, or something.

When I walked back outside to the parking lot my supervisor was there. I walked up to him, shook his hand and said, "I'm going home." He was like, "What do you mean? Are you sick?" I said, "No, I'm just over it. I've got better things to do with my time. I don't want to be part of this anymore. I'm leaving." I hopped in the car and drove away. I could see my supervisor in the rear view mirror standing there with his jaw dropped.

At our main office I spent about an hour explaining to our director why I was leaving and why I didn't agree with our organization's policies. She was really nice and asked me to reconsider and stay. She proposed various scenarios that might allow me to stay on and continue working, but by that point I was really beyond wanting to continue working for the organization. I just told her I was sorry and that I was ready to move on.

Our director seemed really concerned that I was making an irresponsible, rash decision. She kept reminding me that I needed to think of my wife (SAHM) and young daughter and that I needed to have a job. I explained to her calmly that I had investments and savings, and that we would be fine. I told her that by my calculations my family and I should be able to live comfortably off of our investments indefinitely. At some point, I may choose to take another job or maybe start a business that interests me, but I shouldn't have to. At that point, the director got kind of quiet, and she said, "Wow, I wish I could do that. If I could, I'd quit too."

Congratulations!

http://giphy.com/gifs/MUeQeEQaDCjE4/html5 (http://giphy.com/gifs/MUeQeEQaDCjE4/html5)

(http://giphy.com/gifs/MUeQeEQaDCjE4/html5)
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Gone Fishing on September 03, 2015, 02:11:31 PM
Back on topic here...

On a Monday morning this June I went into work at my job of 10+ years. I was in a good mood and didn't have any intentions of quitting. During the morning meeting something just set me off, and I spoke up in front of everyone and told them I thought that what our organization was doing was WRONG, IMMORAL, and that we should stop! Everyone's jaws just dropped. One of the managers in the meeting said, "Well, I don't think that one of us should be saying things like that. We all need to be on the same page." My supervisor chimed in and just basically repeated the company policy and told everyone that that's what we would be following.

When we walked out of the meeting my supervisor acted like nothing had happened. He gave me a list of a couple of routine things he wanted me to do that day, and I nodded my head and said okay. As soon as my supervisor walked away I  loaded all of my personal things into a vehicle, went back inside, gave everyone a big hug and wished them all a good life. Apparently no one realized I was quitting at the time. They all just thought I was apologizing for my outburst or not being a team player, or something.

When I walked back outside to the parking lot my supervisor was there. I walked up to him, shook his hand and said, "I'm going home." He was like, "What do you mean? Are you sick?" I said, "No, I'm just over it. I've got better things to do with my time. I don't want to be part of this anymore. I'm leaving." I hopped in the car and drove away. I could see my supervisor in the rear view mirror standing there with his jaw dropped.

At our main office I spent about an hour explaining to our director why I was leaving and why I didn't agree with our organization's policies. She was really nice and asked me to reconsider and stay. She proposed various scenarios that might allow me to stay on and continue working, but by that point I was really beyond wanting to continue working for the organization. I just told her I was sorry and that I was ready to move on.

Our director seemed really concerned that I was making an irresponsible, rash decision. She kept reminding me that I needed to think of my wife (SAHM) and young daughter and that I needed to have a job. I explained to her calmly that I had investments and savings, and that we would be fine. I told her that by my calculations my family and I should be able to live comfortably off of our investments indefinitely. At some point, I may choose to take another job or maybe start a business that interests me, but I shouldn't have to. At that point, the director got kind of quiet, and she said, "Wow, I wish I could do that. If I could, I'd quit too."

Nice!  Sounds like you may have some things to share in the job secrets thread! (Sorry, but I can't seem to find it at the moment...)
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Eric on September 03, 2015, 02:39:42 PM
Nice!  Sounds like you may have some things to share in the job secrets thread! (Sorry, but I can't seem to find it at the moment...)

http://forum.mrmoneymustache.com/welcome-to-the-forum/post-secrets-you-know-from-your-previouscurrent-jobs/
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Gone Fishing on September 03, 2015, 02:41:01 PM
Nice!  Sounds like you may have some things to share in the job secrets thread! (Sorry, but I can't seem to find it at the moment...)

http://forum.mrmoneymustache.com/welcome-to-the-forum/post-secrets-you-know-from-your-previouscurrent-jobs/

Thanks!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: BlueHouse on September 03, 2015, 02:59:00 PM
Back on topic here...

On a Monday morning this June I went into work at my job of 10+ years. I was in a good mood and didn't have any intentions of quitting. During the morning meeting something just set me off, and I spoke up in front of everyone and told them I thought that what our organization was doing was WRONG, IMMORAL, and that we should stop! Everyone's jaws just dropped. One of the managers in the meeting said, "Well, I don't think that one of us should be saying things like that. We all need to be on the same page." My supervisor chimed in and just basically repeated the company policy and told everyone that that's what we would be following.

When we walked out of the meeting my supervisor acted like nothing had happened. He gave me a list of a couple of routine things he wanted me to do that day, and I nodded my head and said okay. As soon as my supervisor walked away I  loaded all of my personal things into a vehicle, went back inside, gave everyone a big hug and wished them all a good life. Apparently no one realized I was quitting at the time. They all just thought I was apologizing for my outburst or not being a team player, or something.


Signed, Don Draper.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Wilson Hall on September 03, 2015, 06:25:21 PM
Back on topic here...

On a Monday morning this June I went into work at my job of 10+ years. I was in a good mood and didn't have any intentions of quitting. During the morning meeting something just set me off, and I spoke up in front of everyone and told them I thought that what our organization was doing was WRONG, IMMORAL, and that we should stop! Everyone's jaws just dropped. One of the managers in the meeting said, "Well, I don't think that one of us should be saying things like that. We all need to be on the same page." My supervisor chimed in and just basically repeated the company policy and told everyone that that's what we would be following.

When we walked out of the meeting my supervisor acted like nothing had happened. He gave me a list of a couple of routine things he wanted me to do that day, and I nodded my head and said okay. As soon as my supervisor walked away I  loaded all of my personal things into a vehicle, went back inside, gave everyone a big hug and wished them all a good life. Apparently no one realized I was quitting at the time. They all just thought I was apologizing for my outburst or not being a team player, or something.


Signed, Don Draper.

ROFL
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Taran Wanderer on September 04, 2015, 12:46:03 AM
...and I watched a co-worker tell the bean counters to go fuck off within the last few days.

Damn it was good.  OK, so this guy was going to retire anyways in the next year or two.  But we're in a business that requires 1/10th hour charging to the various contracts.  This guy is, well, was, being run ragged with 20 different contracts to charge to.  The asshats in bean counting dinged him for supposedly not charging correctly.  Yeah, bullshit.  I've never seen anyone try his level best in a bullshit system.  Anyways, they tagged him for remedial training with his manager.  He sends out his retirement notice - first person on the e-mail is the asshat bean counter in the far off city, 2nd is his manager.

I think Shakespeare was wrong in his assessment.  The first thing we should do is kill all the fucking bean counting accountants.  THEN kill all the lawyers.

[No, no I'm not at all bitter about the bullshit from these fucking, moronic MBA bullshit spewing bean counting penny-wise, million dollar foolish idiots that don't know how to run a company.  They're driving it into the ground - this great American Success Story that was built by engineers and manufacturing workers].

This seems to be going around. Hire, hire, hire for accounting, HR, and sales, but no hiring for engineering and manufacturing people who get things done.  I don't know whether to feel better that I'm not alone or worse because it's happening everywhere.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Squirrel away on September 04, 2015, 03:48:57 AM


Our director seemed really concerned that I was making an irresponsible, rash decision. She kept reminding me that I needed to think of my wife (SAHM) and young daughter and that I needed to have a job. I explained to her calmly that I had investments and savings, and that we would be fine. I told her that by my calculations my family and I should be able to live comfortably off of our investments indefinitely. At some point, I may choose to take another job or maybe start a business that interests me, but I shouldn't have to. At that point, the director got kind of quiet, and she said, "Wow, I wish I could do that. If I could, I'd quit too."

Hopefully you gave her food for thought.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Shane on September 04, 2015, 09:58:05 AM
What was the wrong immoral thing?

Nice!  Sounds like you may have some things to share in the job secrets thread! (Sorry, but I can't seem to find it at the moment...)

http://forum.mrmoneymustache.com/welcome-to-the-forum/post-secrets-you-know-from-your-previouscurrent-jobs/

Thanks!

There aren't really any "secrets" to divulge. It was more a difference of opinion. What my former employer is doing is completely legal according to the letter of the law. They have tons of attorneys they can hide behind that will argue in court for them that they aren't doing anything wrong. Many of my former coworkers, some of whom I have great respect for, believe that their employer is doing the right thing, and I respect their right to disagree with me. I'm just grateful that living a simple life and having FU money allowed me to stand up for what I believe in, and not have to back down from the Man.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: G-dog on September 04, 2015, 12:01:12 PM
This is why law, ethics and morals are really separate things. There may be a huge amount of overlap for all three, but sometimes it is just subjective or an area the law doesn't or can't cover very well.

My ethics teacher tried to drill into us that two people can find two opposite solutions to the same scenario, and both can be ethical because ethics is inherently subjective to some degree (and steeped in cultural, societal, family, and personal history).

Glad you had the means to step up and speak your mind, and leave when your company's values did not align with yours.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: eostache on September 04, 2015, 12:13:34 PM
Back on topic here...

On a Monday morning this June I went into work at my job of 10+ years. I was in a good mood and didn't have any intentions of quitting. During the morning meeting something just set me off, and I spoke up in front of everyone and told them I thought that what our organization was doing was WRONG, IMMORAL, and that we should stop! Everyone's jaws just dropped. One of the managers in the meeting said, "Well, I don't think that one of us should be saying things like that. We all need to be on the same page." My supervisor chimed in and just basically repeated the company policy and told everyone that that's what we would be following.

When we walked out of the meeting my supervisor acted like nothing had happened. He gave me a list of a couple of routine things he wanted me to do that day, and I nodded my head and said okay. As soon as my supervisor walked away I  loaded all of my personal things into a vehicle, went back inside, gave everyone a big hug and wished them all a good life. Apparently no one realized I was quitting at the time. They all just thought I was apologizing for my outburst or not being a team player, or something.

When I walked back outside to the parking lot my supervisor was there. I walked up to him, shook his hand and said, "I'm going home." He was like, "What do you mean? Are you sick?" I said, "No, I'm just over it. I've got better things to do with my time. I don't want to be part of this anymore. I'm leaving." I hopped in the car and drove away. I could see my supervisor in the rear view mirror standing there with his jaw dropped.

At our main office I spent about an hour explaining to our director why I was leaving and why I didn't agree with our organization's policies. She was really nice and asked me to reconsider and stay. She proposed various scenarios that might allow me to stay on and continue working, but by that point I was really beyond wanting to continue working for the organization. I just told her I was sorry and that I was ready to move on.

Our director seemed really concerned that I was making an irresponsible, rash decision. She kept reminding me that I needed to think of my wife (SAHM) and young daughter and that I needed to have a job. I explained to her calmly that I had investments and savings, and that we would be fine. I told her that by my calculations my family and I should be able to live comfortably off of our investments indefinitely. At some point, I may choose to take another job or maybe start a business that interests me, but I shouldn't have to. At that point, the director got kind of quiet, and she said, "Wow, I wish I could do that. If I could, I'd quit too."

Fuckin A!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Kashmani on September 04, 2015, 12:34:46 PM
...and I watched a co-worker tell the bean counters to go fuck off within the last few days.

Damn it was good.  OK, so this guy was going to retire anyways in the next year or two.  But we're in a business that requires 1/10th hour charging to the various contracts.  This guy is, well, was, being run ragged with 20 different contracts to charge to.  The asshats in bean counting dinged him for supposedly not charging correctly.  Yeah, bullshit.  I've never seen anyone try his level best in a bullshit system.  Anyways, they tagged him for remedial training with his manager.  He sends out his retirement notice - first person on the e-mail is the asshat bean counter in the far off city, 2nd is his manager.

I think Shakespeare was wrong in his assessment.  The first thing we should do is kill all the fucking bean counting accountants.  THEN kill all the lawyers.

[No, no I'm not at all bitter about the bullshit from these fucking, moronic MBA bullshit spewing bean counting penny-wise, million dollar foolish idiots that don't know how to run a company.  They're driving it into the ground - this great American Success Story that was built by engineers and manufacturing workers].

It's all fun and games until a customer requests an audit of your charges and can find errors and starts disputing the charges, drags you to court, etc etc.  Or God forbid it's a gov't contract you've fucked up on.  Us bean counters aren't making up this shit because we like fucking with people, you know.

Us lawyers have been billing in 0.1s of an hour for decades, and many client's don't even allow block billing so that every call or email has to be set out separately. It's annoying, but that is what timekeeping software is for.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Us2bCool on September 04, 2015, 12:42:30 PM
Glad to see this fantastic thread get resurrected. I happily witnessed an epic FU incident over the past few weeks.  "Diane" is one of the most competent people I've ever worked with, but and she has a very strong sense of justice.  "Mike" is not so competent, but got promoted to be Diane's manager in a classic case of "well, we either promote him or we fire him, and we don't have a good enough reason to fire him". 

Diane went on vacation this Summer, with plenty of notice, had it on the calendar, blah blah. That week, things got rough for Mike, and he unloaded his frustrations on his Director, telling him "and left on vacation without telling me she was going to be gone".

When she got back, Director told her about the incident. She went back to her desk and drafted a letter of resignation, handed it to the Director and said "I refuse to have any more interaction with Mike until I'm gone".  True to her word, she left this week, without having another job lined up. 

I don't really know what her financial situation is, but I know what her pay range is and that she enjoys living frugally, so I'd bet my 'stache she has one built up as well.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Adventine on September 04, 2015, 01:03:53 PM
Oh, that must have been so satisfying.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Trudie on September 04, 2015, 03:12:53 PM
...and I watched a co-worker tell the bean counters to go fuck off within the last few days.

Damn it was good.  OK, so this guy was going to retire anyways in the next year or two.  But we're in a business that requires 1/10th hour charging to the various contracts.  This guy is, well, was, being run ragged with 20 different contracts to charge to.  The asshats in bean counting dinged him for supposedly not charging correctly.  Yeah, bullshit.  I've never seen anyone try his level best in a bullshit system.  Anyways, they tagged him for remedial training with his manager.  He sends out his retirement notice - first person on the e-mail is the asshat bean counter in the far off city, 2nd is his manager.

I think Shakespeare was wrong in his assessment.  The first thing we should do is kill all the fucking bean counting accountants.  THEN kill all the lawyers.

[No, no I'm not at all bitter about the bullshit from these fucking, moronic MBA bullshit spewing bean counting penny-wise, million dollar foolish idiots that don't know how to run a company.  They're driving it into the ground - this great American Success Story that was built by engineers and manufacturing workers].

It's all fun and games until a customer requests an audit of your charges and can find errors and starts disputing the charges, drags you to court, etc etc.  Or God forbid it's a gov't contract you've fucked up on.  Us bean counters aren't making up this shit because we like fucking with people, you know.

Yeah from one fucking bean counter to another... I work with a lot of federal regulations in telecommunications where the most minor hock up can either result in an audit or the withholding of payments from the Federal Communications Commission.  I choose which battles to fight, but sometimes wish others understood that it doesn't take all that much frankly to get others up in your business.  Because we get federal payments how people account for their time on projects is important.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Nords on September 04, 2015, 03:18:16 PM
Yeah from one fucking bean counter to another... I work with a lot of federal regulations in telecommunications where the most minor hock up can either result in an audit or the withholding of payments from the Federal Communications Commission.  I choose which battles to fight, but sometimes wish others understood that it doesn't take all that much frankly to get others up in your business.  Because we get federal payments how people account for their time on projects is important.
So one choice would be to make the tracking & compliance system more user-friendly.

Another choice would be to make life hard on the users.

Hmmm.  Tough choice.

C'mon-- who's going to defend a six-minute tracking interval?!?
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Trudie on September 04, 2015, 03:28:01 PM
I actually think the systems are user-friendly -- available in real time via computer/mobile.  I rarely have to address this issue with people, and not all issues involve regulated funds.

My issue with this is demonizing "bean counters" for being assholes just trying to split fine hairs to make others' lives difficult or defend things on the basis of "principle."  For instance, in my case certain government agencies that we rely on for funding can be pretty unreasonable when it comes to getting payments or auditing records for payments.

Very recently we had a $45K payment that was due to us from an FCC administrative agency get held up for weeks because when we last paid our regulatory fees bill to them my co-worker fat fingered a number and we underpaid by less than ten cents.  Solving the situation involved a ridiculous detour through a phone tree, then over-nighting a check ($20 courier fee) for ten cents.

We're all cogs in a wheel...
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Tyson on September 04, 2015, 03:29:57 PM
...and I watched a co-worker tell the bean counters to go fuck off within the last few days.

Damn it was good.  OK, so this guy was going to retire anyways in the next year or two.  But we're in a business that requires 1/10th hour charging to the various contracts.  This guy is, well, was, being run ragged with 20 different contracts to charge to.  The asshats in bean counting dinged him for supposedly not charging correctly.  Yeah, bullshit.  I've never seen anyone try his level best in a bullshit system.  Anyways, they tagged him for remedial training with his manager.  He sends out his retirement notice - first person on the e-mail is the asshat bean counter in the far off city, 2nd is his manager.

I think Shakespeare was wrong in his assessment.  The first thing we should do is kill all the fucking bean counting accountants.  THEN kill all the lawyers.

[No, no I'm not at all bitter about the bullshit from these fucking, moronic MBA bullshit spewing bean counting penny-wise, million dollar foolish idiots that don't know how to run a company.  They're driving it into the ground - this great American Success Story that was built by engineers and manufacturing workers].
Heh. Reminds me, we have a hiring freeze right now because the parent company of my division acquired yet another company.  We're still not at the level of staff we should have, yet we're bringing on new customers left and right. But...omg no money because we bought something else, guess we'll leave all the employees at their 150% workload for another few months!

Sad news Jlee, 150% workload is the new normal.  Get used to it.  :(
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: happy on September 04, 2015, 04:40:50 PM
+1
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: nobodyspecial on September 04, 2015, 05:21:22 PM
My issue with this is demonizing "bean counters" for being assholes just trying to split fine hairs to make others' lives difficult or defend things on the basis of "principle."  For instance, in my case certain government agencies that we rely on for funding can be pretty unreasonable when it comes to getting payments or auditing records for payments.
So the government bean counters are assholes then ?
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Cpa Cat on September 04, 2015, 05:48:27 PM
...and I watched a co-worker tell the bean counters to go fuck off within the last few days.

Damn it was good.  OK, so this guy was going to retire anyways in the next year or two.  But we're in a business that requires 1/10th hour charging to the various contracts. 

When I worked in public accounting, we also had to charge our time in 1/10th of an hour under specific time codes. I was at one firm where each and every week the lady in time of the time entries would call me on my phone and yell at me for charging to the wrong codes. It always came down the same thing: That code can't be charged to that client.

"Tax services 001" was different from "Tax services 002" which was different from "Tax preparation 002" and "Tax advisory 002." There were a bajillion similar codes, all available to select for every client. Sometimes I would try change it, but it would still be wrong, so she'd yell some more.

So my response was, "Well, what code should I use?"

And she'd yell, "I don't know! It's not my job to decide! You'll have to ask your supervisor!" (And of course my supervisor had no idea what I was talking about).

And I'd respond with, "But if you don't know what the right codes are, then how do you know that I'm using wrong ones. You must have a list."

And she would literally yell at me, "YOU CAN'T USE THAT TIME CODE! CHANGE IT TO SOMETHING ELSE!!!" and slam the phone down.

Then during my first review, I was told that I was taking too much time on timekeeping issues. So the next time she called to yell, I said, "I'm sorry, I don't have time for this. You're just going to have to figure it out. If you're having issues, go ahead and ask my supervisor what codes to charge it to."

I never heard anything about it again.

To this day, I marvel that a grown woman thought it was appropriate to yell at someone at work over time codes.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: G-dog on September 04, 2015, 06:01:32 PM
...and I watched a co-worker tell the bean counters to go fuck off within the last few days.

Damn it was good.  OK, so this guy was going to retire anyways in the next year or two.  But we're in a business that requires 1/10th hour charging to the various contracts.  This guy is, well, was, being run ragged with 20 different contracts to charge to.  The asshats in bean counting dinged him for supposedly not charging correctly.  Yeah, bullshit.  I've never seen anyone try his level best in a bullshit system.  Anyways, they tagged him for remedial training with his manager.  He sends out his retirement notice - first person on the e-mail is the asshat bean counter in the far off city, 2nd is his manager.

I think Shakespeare was wrong in his assessment.  The first thing we should do is kill all the fucking bean counting accountants.  THEN kill all the lawyers.

[No, no I'm not at all bitter about the bullshit from these fucking, moronic MBA bullshit spewing bean counting penny-wise, million dollar foolish idiots that don't know how to run a company.  They're driving it into the ground - this great American Success Story that was built by engineers and manufacturing workers].
Heh. Reminds me, we have a hiring freeze right now because the parent company of my division acquired yet another company.  We're still not at the level of staff we should have, yet we're bringing on new customers left and right. But...omg no money because we bought something else, guess we'll leave all the employees at their 150% workload for another few months!

Sad news Jlee, 150% workload is the new normal.  Get used to it.  :(

Too true, though I am not sure it is even new since this was my corporate life for about the last 7-10 years! Got tired of being lied to about hiring or workload allocation relief. Not my problem anymore.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: MoonShadow on September 04, 2015, 06:07:08 PM
I have actually used the phrase, "FU! I quit!", but I didn't actually have any money at the time, and it was quite stressful for my wife until I got another job.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: JLee on September 04, 2015, 10:54:34 PM
...and I watched a co-worker tell the bean counters to go fuck off within the last few days.

Damn it was good.  OK, so this guy was going to retire anyways in the next year or two.  But we're in a business that requires 1/10th hour charging to the various contracts.  This guy is, well, was, being run ragged with 20 different contracts to charge to.  The asshats in bean counting dinged him for supposedly not charging correctly.  Yeah, bullshit.  I've never seen anyone try his level best in a bullshit system.  Anyways, they tagged him for remedial training with his manager.  He sends out his retirement notice - first person on the e-mail is the asshat bean counter in the far off city, 2nd is his manager.

I think Shakespeare was wrong in his assessment.  The first thing we should do is kill all the fucking bean counting accountants.  THEN kill all the lawyers.

[No, no I'm not at all bitter about the bullshit from these fucking, moronic MBA bullshit spewing bean counting penny-wise, million dollar foolish idiots that don't know how to run a company.  They're driving it into the ground - this great American Success Story that was built by engineers and manufacturing workers].
Heh. Reminds me, we have a hiring freeze right now because the parent company of my division acquired yet another company.  We're still not at the level of staff we should have, yet we're bringing on new customers left and right. But...omg no money because we bought something else, guess we'll leave all the employees at their 150% workload for another few months!

Sad news Jlee, 150% workload is the new normal.  Get used to it.  :(
I decided to change my situation instead of getting used to it. I signed an offer letter with a ~$36k raise today.  Even if it's 150% workload, at least now it's 159% pay! ;)
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: golfreak12 on September 04, 2015, 11:10:36 PM
Back before 9/11 I had finished school with an accounting degree but was still working part-time(PT) and making decent money. I had no care in the world. 31 and never had a fun time job before. Life was fun.
When 9/11 came, the money disappeared and I was forced to find a real job. Its been 3 yrs since I've graduated so accounting wasn't really an option for me.
My buddy had parents who owned 25+ McDonalds. He's like, come work for me. I've work at McDonalds when I was younger so I accepted. I started as an assistant manager. After 7 months, I got bored and wanted to go back to my PT job.(I never quit in the first place. Work is picking up again). Shockingly to me, the higher up offer me a GM position. I was like "hell no". I'm good but I know nothing about running a store on my own but the idea of being on charge was too enticing.
My first store my inside a Walmart. Took me some growing pain but I once again I learned quick. I was now a rising star in the company. Made 40K+ which was the most money I've ever made in my life at 32. My store drove me crazy cause it was 24hr cause I would get calls constantly. I've asked repeatedly to close overnight buy they refused.
Then my brother in Cali bought a house and knew I always wanted to live there(I'm in Florida). He said I can come and live with him anytime as he has a room for me. I used this excuse to quit. I've saved about 20K by now and I figured to go to Cali for a year and blow it all. My brother lives in Sacto so my idea was to go snowboarding as much as I could. When I quit, the owner(my friend's dad) even came and talked to me and told me how I have a bright future at the company and I shouldn't leave.

So I go to Sacto and figured I'd be a bum for a year. Guess what ?? Within a week, I got a job as an Assistant manager at McDonalds. There goes the plan to be a bum. This is a smaller franchise with only 7 stores. They were behind the time as I came from a more advanced McDonalds. The things that I knew amazed them. I showed them better ways of doing Scheduling, inventory, food cost, etc......I would sit in monthly meetings only reserved for GMs and made them feel inadequate. After a yr in Cali, I got bored. All my friends were in Fla and decided to head back. Once again, the they tried to get me to stay, telling me their GMs are making high $50K++. Blah.....
I came to Cali with the intention to blow all my savings but after a yr, it grew.
When I decided to go back to Fla, of course I decided to take it easy and do nothing.
Another friend of mine(a McDonalds GM)), knew I was coming back and asked me to help him out a couple of days a week at his store. I was dumb cause he suckered me in. That couple of days a week turned weekly and then after a month he asked me to be his first assistant. I enjoyed working with the guy and didn't want the responsibility of running the store as I accepted. Things were going great until they decided to move my buddy to another store and bring another GM in. Didn't they know we worked as a combo ??
I was like fucked them and went to my back my PT job(yeah I know its a secret PT job). I already got my PT job back so I told them politely fuck you. You can't expect me to work under another GM and told them I already got another job. My last day on the job there, the VP came and talked to me asking me what would it take for me to stay. I told him I wasn't not BSing because I already got another job. I threw out the idea that if they mad me GM instead of bringing in another GM I would stay. He told me that he would get back to me.
The next day he called me and said the store is mine. I was shocked for a 2nd time. I had to tell the PT job that I couldn't continue with the job now.
So I ran that store very well.
As a franchise, the corporation grade us on 3 main things. Customer complaints, yearly in store reviews and mystery shops. Mystery shops was something all the stores take pride in. We also get bonuses for high mystery shop scores. My store had the highest average for the entire franchise and 4th in the Florida region.
So after a year or so at this store, I was about cooked. Trying to keep up the high mystery shop scores and everything else go me stressed out to no end. I even told my buddy(owner's son), I don't know how long I can last.
Then it happened. One month I let one of my manager in charge of the mystery shop periods. I was in my office doing paper work. We just happened to get a bad score when I was in the office. Let me restate that we had the 4th highest average in the entire Florida. I got ridiculed my our president in our voicemail where everyone can hear. He talked about how I was in the office and not helping out etc.......I was so pisssed off to no end. Highest core in the company and 4th in Florida and he's ridiculing me.
I actually used this excuse to quit. Before I was stressed to death but  I didn't know how to quit. I can now used this reason to quit. I think I shocked everyone when I told them I quit.
Everyday, my boss kept telling me the president would like to talk to me at the franchise office but I refused.
My last day, I went to the franchise office to return everything and I run into the president. He's like "golfreak", when you're done with that can you come to my office to talk. I said sure. After I was done, I took off. Didn't say one word. I was not going to give him a chance to convince me to stay. I've tried quitting this company so many times and they somehow convinced to stay everytime.
Weeks after I quit, my buddy(owner's son) and various people told me how pissed the president was cause I ran out on him. Haha.....
After I quit, I had a bit of money saved up so I decided to do nothing again for as long as I can. After 3 weeks, I was bored to death again. I decided to go back to the PT job and see if I can get a job again. Remembered I took the job and quit just over a year ago. Surprisingly, I once again got the PT job again.
This was in 2006 and I still have the same PT job and making more money than I ever did before.
If I didn't get married 4 yrs ago, I could have FIRE by now but I'm helping my wife get through school and once we become a 2 income household, we could probably retire in 10 yrs.
Sorry for the long story.....
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Alternatepriorities on September 05, 2015, 01:35:09 AM
There are people with awesome stories on here...

I worked for a small engineering firm for the first eight years after I finished college and saved about 1/2 my pay over that time. There were financial ups and downs and money was always a little short. In early 2012 the company hit a really rough spot and announced 12.5% pay cuts for everyone (to their credit the owners took a temporary 100% cut). My coworkers were mostly living paycheck to paycheck and one objected mid meeting that he'd loose his house. After the meeting I walked into my bosses office and told him "there are 9 of us in the department, if I leave that's 12.5% for everyone else." He told me I didn't have to do that. I said, "I've saved enough to cover my needs for a decade and I want to see the world." I agreed to stay 2 months finish up the projects I was working on and come back in a year. The week I left they gave everyone back their 12.5%. I spend the next year living out of my carry on backpack. They tracked my progress on a world map in the hall...

When I returned a year later things were still looking a bit shaky so I moved to Alaska. My boss kept telling me I was doing great at my new job but I wasn't enjoying it. Last year after a 12 months and a 25% raise I gave them six weeks notice without anything lined up. They were a little shocked I could give that much notice and seemed to really appreciate it. I took and 800 mile bike trip and then followed my girlfriend to the middle of nowhere Alaska since she needed a job more than I did. Last fall i started a business and then found some interesting local work. Oddly enough I'm making better money now and having a lot more fun at work. I see my 'stache as a polite "no thank you" fund that provides financial flexibility until i reach full FIRE. Hopefully I'll never need it to be a full "F-U" fund but it's nice to know it's there if I do.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: shelivesthedream on September 05, 2015, 02:29:36 AM
Quote from: Alternatepriorities link=topic=18251.msg795475#msg795475
After the meeting I walked into my bosses office and told him "there are 9 of us in the department, if I leave that's 12.5% for everyone else." ... They tracked my progress on a world map in the hall...

Oh wow, I just love this
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Faraday on September 05, 2015, 09:22:34 AM

...After the meeting I walked into my bosses office and told him "there are 9 of us in the department, if I leave that's 12.5% for everyone else." ....

The week I left they gave everyone back their 12.5%. I spend the next year living out of my carry on backpack. They tracked my progress on a world map in the hall...
...

Awesome story!

Kudos to you for recognizing and acting on the opportunity, and kudos to your former employer (at the small business) for being HONEST and actually letting the employees keep the 12.5% windfall you produced!!!

What I love most is that you kept everyone as friends - good enough friends that they tracked you on a map and cared about what you did after you left. That little business full of great people is a rarity in this cold old world.

Time to head over and check out your 'blog ...
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Faraday on September 05, 2015, 12:56:21 PM
I have not read everyone's stories yet, but I do have my own epic FU money story.

...awesome story here...

They really are competent, professional people - but bad business and money managers. In the end, I maintained great relationships with everyone except the managing partner and the office administrator.

So, wait: do the rest of the attorneys realize the financial risk they are taking by being associated with managing partner and her little rat-on-a-leash? Why wouldn't they get messed with the same way you got messed with?
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: FIREby35 on September 05, 2015, 01:52:39 PM
I have not read everyone's stories yet, but I do have my own epic FU money story.

...awesome story here...

They really are competent, professional people - but bad business and money managers. In the end, I maintained great relationships with everyone except the managing partner and the office administrator.

So, wait: do the rest of the attorneys realize the financial risk they are taking by being associated with managing partner and her little rat-on-a-leash? Why wouldn't they get messed with the same way you got messed with?

Very good question. This actually does happen. One of my friends, and partner at the firm, has told me at least two stories where exactly this sort of thing is happening. Unfortunately, he is also the one who sets his spending to his salary. Actually told me he would like to leave but doesn't have the funds.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Faraday on September 05, 2015, 08:18:13 PM
I have not read everyone's stories yet, but I do have my own epic FU money story.

...awesome story here...

They really are competent, professional people - but bad business and money managers. In the end, I maintained great relationships with everyone except the managing partner and the office administrator.

So, wait: do the rest of the attorneys realize the financial risk they are taking by being associated with managing partner and her little rat-on-a-leash? Why wouldn't they get messed with the same way you got messed with?

Very good question. This actually does happen. One of my friends, and partner at the firm, has told me at least two stories where exactly this sort of thing is happening. Unfortunately, he is also the one who sets his spending to his salary. Actually told me he would like to leave but doesn't have the funds.

Dear God In Heaven Above...a lawyer...someone with what I regard as a great deal of personal and professional power...can be that STUCK?!?
I guess being a wage slave can happen to ANYone.

Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Spiffsome on September 06, 2015, 03:29:49 AM
As a lawyer, I can tell you that we fall onto the same goddamned hedonic treadmill as everyone else. I've got a book called 'The Pinstriped Prison' which describes how big firms deliberately use this effect to keep their new hires from leaving. Give a new graduate a $10,000 loan (referred to as the 'golden handcuffs' - repayable if the graduate leaves in the first year) for office clothes and gear, watch them piss away all of their new income on the flashy lifestyle the partners indulge in, then they realise that they can't leave because they can't save the $10,000  because of their new spending level.

'Millionaire Next Door' describes how the lawyers in their studies were less efficient at accumulating wealth than teachers, because of the inflated lifestyle expectations that come with law firm work. A lot of people are in the legal field because they're motivated by external reward, and law is a great way to get cash and social approval. Once that external reward gets tied to spending as much as you earn, they're stuck.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Paul der Krake on September 06, 2015, 05:45:02 AM
As a lawyer, I can tell you that we fall onto the same goddamned hedonic treadmill as everyone else. I've got a book called 'The Pinstriped Prison' which describes how big firms deliberately use this effect to keep their new hires from leaving. Give a new graduate a $10,000 loan (referred to as the 'golden handcuffs' - repayable if the graduate leaves in the first year) for office clothes and gear, watch them piss away all of their new income on the flashy lifestyle the partners indulge in, then they realise that they can't leave because they can't save the $10,000  because of their new spending level.
I have seen this happen first hand with relocation packages. Dude wouldn't quit over a mere $3,000 that the company paid him to move to the area. Household income over $200k, and worried about $3k? smh
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Jakejake on September 06, 2015, 09:18:35 AM
FU Story from my dad: He worked as a mid level manager in a huge corporation, and had enough years in for a  pension plus FU money. He was informed that he was getting a new supervisor - a guy he's dealt with before that he had no respect for (incompetent, rude, etc). The new supervisor announced that everyone needed to make an appointment to see him individually, to introduce themselves and discuss goals. My dad made his appointment. He walked in carrying a large cardboard box. He said "Hi, my name is __, and these are all my personal things. That's all you need to know about me." And he walked out.

And a couple from me:
1. Working for a micromanaging idiot abusive boss in the federal government, I finally hit the FU point after he followed me into the woman's room to yell at me while I was on the toilet - in a bathroom where the stall doors didn't even close because of the building's foundation settling. I decided for the sake of other employees still stuck there, that I would let his boss know what was happening. We had a staff of maybe 10 people, and one by one they were dropping like flies since he was transferred in. One got a medical disability for mental stress. One had a stroke - on the job. I could see I was starting to have stress related health issues.

He found out I made an appointment with his boss and blew a gasket - claiming that I needed to go through my chain of command if I wanted to talk to his supervisor, like I was seriously going to ask if it was okay with him if I lodged a complaint against him. We ended up having a meeting with his boss, the three of us, because he wouldn't let me go alone.  His boss seemed to think it might be a personality conflict between just us two, with blame to share equally, until the point where I said I already had picked up the paperwork to quit - I showed them the stack of outprocessing papers, and I just thought they needed to know they were losing the whole team because of him being abusive.

My boss lost it when he heard that, and started yelling that this was "just another example of her making a unilateral decision that affected everyone in the office." (Those words are burned into my memory, almost 20 years later!) I asked him, do you mean I should have asked your permission to quit? That was exactly what he meant, that I was overstepping my bounds by making that decision for myself. I'll never forget looking over at his supervisor and seeing her sitting there in stunned silence, with her mouth hanging open.

After the meeting, she found me another job at the same paygrade at the same facility, but a different building. I worked another 5 or so years there and was very happy.

2. In my current job, we unionized a few years ago. For young parents, people at the start of their careers, folks without savings, that's a pretty scary thing because sometimes retribution from management can get ugly. I was able to go in and be the lead negotiator for our contract because if they fired me for it, I just didn't care. And I was more effective than the other two people negotiating on my side because they were too emotionally invested and would create scenes, yelling, using emotional manipulation, going off on tangents about their personal circumstances. I could calmly state "for me this isn't an issue, but I need to stick to this point because the other employees won't sign off on this, and here's why ..."   I got called a communist a couple times by their lawyer (!) but we got the contract signed, and have better working conditions because of it.

In both those things, I didn't actually have to fall back on my FU money, but having it there meant I didn't have anything to lose by making conditions better not just for me, but for the other employees as well.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Faraday on September 06, 2015, 12:39:38 PM
I started reading these stories for the "epicness" of taking control and telling others to shove it, but now I am reading them to reinforce why we do what we do - gaining control over our own lives. For me, these stories have gone from "Hell yeah!" to "Dear God I'm glad I wasn't there". My rush of glee has turned into terror that there are people in this world who get away with that kind of oppression in the office.

I tremble with thankfulness that I've found these forums and that I can build a stash. My employment situation is pretty good compared to those stories, but I've lived through past jobs under pretty similar situations.

In one previous job, the owner of the business would monitor purchases by their employees to determine if they were being "paid too much" in salary. His son would express obvious and direct displeasure at seeing employees have a nice home or car. Seems they had visualized a kind of ranking that everyone had to fall into, that extended all the way to the family's living situation.  Don't want your employees living better than the boss man, no sir!

Of course, being frugal would be ideal in that situation, but you sure wouldn't want info about your stash to get out.

I just need a few more years....just a few....
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: ghsebldr on September 06, 2015, 12:53:15 PM
Sold the nursery and property in SoCal and moved back to Washington to try semi retirement. After starting another nursery to feed my Farmers Market habit it was getting into fall so nothing to do out in the greenhouses.
 I was driving by a Fred Meyer (Kroger) distribution center and they had the normal sign out for help wanted so I decided I'd try it for the holiday season. Got hired on as a temp like everyone else only $12 an hour but I wasn't looking for the money. After a couple of weeks throwing product from pallets to a beltline I was starting to limber up (at 52 yo) and getting in the swing. I mentioned to one of the 20 something regular employees that was a line supervisor that it was starting to feel good working hard for a change. Well a couple of days later I report to my end of the line where there were 12 pallets of stoneware plates and bowls maybe 40 pounds a box but lots of boxes on a 5' tall pallet. Usually they have a person to spell you after a short burst so I cranked them out for about a half hour lifting and tossing when a regular employee walked by with a big smile on his face, I started to notice a couple of the other regulars were watching me work (the regulars didn't have to actually DO anything, they were regular employees) so I looked over to my supervisor and gave her a nod requesting her toward my work area. When she sauntered over she asked if I was getting a good workout, I said I was and needed my second to fill in while I got some water. She just smiled and said that all the other temps were on the other side of the line doing a rush job so I said here work my line for me while I get a drink. She said that supervisors didn't have to do the actual labor that's why they had temps. I looked at her and said that retired people didn't have to either, handed her  my strips of upc codes said see ya and walked away. The regulars were really smiling as I walked by and flipped them off.

 As I was leaving their parking lot I noticed the seasonal help wanted sign in the DHL lot so I pulled over there went in and started 2 days later. Tossing boxes again but was it ever fun. The supervisors were working just as hard as the seasonal employees which was really really hard for 5 hours then the sort was done and everyone went home. Loaded empty 53' trailers from a belt system that came all the way into the truck with you. I had always been a machinist before starting our first nursery so I liked nice straight rows and stacks of freight.
Best hardest job I ever had. I worked that for a few Christmas seasons then DHL got out of the package business. One last note about FU money, After working at DHL for a little over 2 months at our daily pep talk my Station boss called me out  and says HR wanted me to start cashing my damn checks.For the rest of the time there over the 3 years I never cashed a check until the end of the season. My fellow workmates used to kid me about being rich. Far from it but this was all just extra cash. So F u to one company and thank you to the other.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: big_slacker on September 06, 2015, 01:54:27 PM
Great thread, love reading these stories! I have a little bit of $$ but also FU skills. I'm instantly employable if I decide I don't like where I'm working or want to move.

I don't want to post all the details on a public forum, but I worked at a place with a friend as my boss. He is very smart, loyal and I work with him still to this day as a consultant for his own business. We built a great and secure IT network a this place and brought them into the modern era from their former patched together ridiculousness.

His boss was weak and I believe faked/weaseled his way into his position. My buddy's firing was engineered by this guy, and I was passed over for his spot in favor of a blustery, insecure #2.

About a month of both of them asking me to do sloppy work, unethical and in one case illegal things I had enough. Took a book of documentation into the C level exec's office and said I was quitting. After a short meeting going over all the bullshit she asked if I thought this was all coming from the director or the new manager. I said both, but the director hired him right? If anything he's the constant in all the poor decisions around this place.

She did ask me to stay but I said I'll just go work somewhere else thanks. Asked if I would be ok financially doing this. I said no problem, no help needed. So I dropped the grenade and walked out basically. Director got canned and based on linkedin hasn't really done much career wise since.

My buddy and I on the other hand have had plenty of career success since, so the good guys do win sometimes. I've never wanted to be in a position where the douchebags have control. I wonder what the world would be like if everyone had the option?
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Faraday on September 06, 2015, 02:51:30 PM
My buddy and I on the other hand have had plenty of career success since, so the good guys do win sometimes. I've never wanted to be in a position where the douchebags have control. I wonder what the world would be like if everyone had the option?

The world should always be this way. Not that I want employers to get the short end of the stick, but employees need options...way more than they need all the crap they buy with their paychecks. It's horrible to be stuck in a job where you are being mistreated. The world is full of incompetent crazy people who get hired into management positions. How the hell that happens, I just don't know.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: ender on September 06, 2015, 03:06:08 PM
1. Working for a micromanaging idiot abusive boss in the federal government, I finally hit the FU point after he followed me into the woman's room to yell at me while I was on the toilet - in a bathroom where the stall doors didn't even close because of the building's foundation settling. I decided for the sake of other employees still stuck there, that I would let his boss know what was happening. We had a staff of maybe 10 people, and one by one they were dropping like flies since he was transferred in. One got a medical disability for mental stress. One had a stroke - on the job. I could see I was starting to have stress related health issues.

He found out I made an appointment with his boss and blew a gasket - claiming that I needed to go through my chain of command if I wanted to talk to his supervisor, like I was seriously going to ask if it was okay with him if I lodged a complaint against him. We ended up having a meeting with his boss, the three of us, because he wouldn't let me go alone.  His boss seemed to think it might be a personality conflict between just us two, with blame to share equally, until the point where I said I already had picked up the paperwork to quit - I showed them the stack of outprocessing papers, and I just thought they needed to know they were losing the whole team because of him being abusive.

My boss lost it when he heard that, and started yelling that this was "just another example of her making a unilateral decision that affected everyone in the office." (Those words are burned into my memory, almost 20 years later!) I asked him, do you mean I should have asked your permission to quit? That was exactly what he meant, that I was overstepping my bounds by making decision for myself. I'll never forget looking over at his supervisor and seeing her sitting there in stunned silence, with her mouth hanging open.

After the meeting, she found me another job at the same paygrade at the same facility, but a different building. I worked another 5 or so years there and was very happy.

The nice part about people like that is they are pretty easy to give enough rope to hang themselves with.

Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Wolf_Stache on September 06, 2015, 06:00:33 PM
As a lawyer, I can tell you that we fall onto the same goddamned hedonic treadmill as everyone else. I've got a book called 'The Pinstriped Prison' which describes how big firms deliberately use this effect to keep their new hires from leaving. Give a new graduate a $10,000 loan (referred to as the 'golden handcuffs' - repayable if the graduate leaves in the first year) for office clothes and gear, watch them piss away all of their new income on the flashy lifestyle the partners indulge in, then they realise that they can't leave because they can't save the $10,000  because of their new spending level.
I have seen this happen first hand with relocation packages. Dude wouldn't quit over a mere $3,000 that the company paid him to move to the area. Household income over $200k, and worried about $3k? smh

This is my situation right now. I held off on quitting because I wanted to hold out a year so I didn't have to pay them back the money. However, the situation just kept escalating. So put in my resignation last week (should have just done it back in June, but I thought if I could get HR involved things would improve. I was so so wrong).

I have the cash to pay it back, but it does make things tighter for me on looking for a new job, now I have to find something within 2 months instead of 6.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Faraday on September 06, 2015, 06:13:41 PM
As a lawyer, I can tell you that we fall onto the same goddamned hedonic treadmill as everyone else. I've got a book called 'The Pinstriped Prison' which describes how big firms deliberately use this effect to keep their new hires from leaving. Give a new graduate a $10,000 loan (referred to as the 'golden handcuffs' - repayable if the graduate leaves in the first year) for office clothes and gear, watch them piss away all of their new income on the flashy lifestyle the partners indulge in, then they realise that they can't leave because they can't save the $10,000  because of their new spending level.
I have seen this happen first hand with relocation packages. Dude wouldn't quit over a mere $3,000 that the company paid him to move to the area. Household income over $200k, and worried about $3k? smh

This is my situation right now. I held off on quitting because I wanted to hold out a year so I didn't have to pay them back the money. However, the situation just kept escalating. So put in my resignation last week (should have just done it back in June, but I thought if I could get HR involved things would improve. I was so so wrong).

I have the cash to pay it back, but it does make things tighter for me on looking for a new job, now I have to find something within 2 months instead of 6.

Yeah. HR exists to protect MANAGEMENT from lawsuits, not humor the employees. I'm an IT professional who supported HR departments....so I'm not making that shit up. I have a co-worker at the current job who just now discovered that.

So....how are you fixing it. This is a thread of epic stories, not "oh man, I suck so bad...."
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Wolf_Stache on September 07, 2015, 03:52:49 PM
This is my situation right now. I held off on quitting because I wanted to hold out a year so I didn't have to pay them back the money. However, the situation just kept escalating. So put in my resignation last week (should have just done it back in June, but I thought if I could get HR involved things would improve. I was so so wrong).

I have the cash to pay it back, but it does make things tighter for me on looking for a new job, now I have to find something within 2 months instead of 6.

Yeah. HR exists to protect MANAGEMENT from lawsuits, not humor the employees. I'm an IT professional who supported HR departments....so I'm not making that shit up. I have a co-worker at the current job who just now discovered that.

So....how are you fixing it. This is a thread of epic stories, not "oh man, I suck so bad...."

Ok, here is my semi-epic horrible story:

I started at this job at the tail end of February/beginning of March.

Right of the bat there were problems. The person who had previously done this job was still there and training me. His "training" went a bit like this:

Trainer: So I pull this number into this spreadsheet -
Me: Wait, where did you get that number and how do you know to put it there?
trainer: I just know.

Further prodding gets me nowhere. So I basically receive NO training, despite having a trainer. The trainer also gives me a workbook of things that are behind that need to be done ASAP. Some of them are tax returns that are two years past due. Others are things still not done that are related to a merger the company went through the year before I started. I get so sick the first two weeks I'm there that I collapse and am rushed to the emergency room.

Meanwhile, my boss keeps dropping more and more duties on me. My first week I took over all cash forecasting, all the fixed asset stuff, Construction licenses, and became their key user for the new EPR system that was supposed to be going live May 1st.

By April I was in charge of:

By the end of May, go live had been pushed back to October 1st. Meanwhile I was given new duties on TOP of all the duties listed above:

By June I had the following duties ADDED To my plate, and remember I'm STILL in charge of everything above as well:

In the middle of June one day I get so stressed out that I basically have a complete meltdown at work. I go to my boss, begging for help where I'm told I'm just 'not working hard enough.' I walked out of her office, went in the bathroom and cried for an hour. I was VERY VERY tempted to just walk away that day and never come back, but the aforementioned 'golden handcuffs' convinces me to stay and try to get things under control. At this point I've not even been there 4 months and had two breakdowns.

In July I have another meeting with my boss where I tell her I'm overloaded, and ask her to give me priorities. She refuses, tells me 'everything' is a priority and reiterates that the reason I'm behind is that I'm not working enough and not working hard enough. Also, she gives me a list of more duties that she's going to be transferring over to me in the near future.

I begin to cope by literally dropping every task that someone is not asking me for right at that moment, but I'm enough of a stickler that the undone tasks are stressing me out.

At the beginning of Aug I go to HR, and ask them to moderate a meeting between me and my boss. During that meeting, I'm VERY honest with the fact that I haven't been doing a lot of tasks on my list simply because of the lack of time. She FREAKS OUT about the merger related tasks that still aren't done, and insists I do them NOW. She does finally agree to take ONE tasks off my list of duties, but since it is one of the things I hadn't been doing it doesn't affect my workload in any way.

Later in the month she uses the excuse that she took that one task off my list to try and give me three more tasks.

I write a resignation later, and on August 26th go in with the letter in hand to try and have one more conversation with her about my workload.

Now, remember, it is a month before go live. Because of my crazy task list above I've had time to do zero training and written zero documentation and zero procedures. I'm the ONLY one in the department that even knows how to log into the new system.

She doesn't budge so I hand her the letter with my last day as Sept 11th. She FREAKS OUT, but finally calms down long enough to ask if I'll stay until after go live if she takes everything off my tasks list except the training, documentation, and procedure documentation.

So it all works out for me. I have a job for 2 more months, time to job hunt, and since the amount I have to pay back is prorated  it means that I'll only have to pay back about 1/4 of the starting bonus.

After the announcement went out that I was quitting, IT (whom I'd been working closely with on the new system implementation - BTW their jaws hit the floor when I repeated my bosses claim that I wasn't 'working hard enough') offered me a job with them for $25K more a year than I'd been making in accounting. I declined, because F*** this company.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Tyson on September 08, 2015, 05:48:37 PM
This is my situation right now. I held off on quitting because I wanted to hold out a year so I didn't have to pay them back the money. However, the situation just kept escalating. So put in my resignation last week (should have just done it back in June, but I thought if I could get HR involved things would improve. I was so so wrong).

I have the cash to pay it back, but it does make things tighter for me on looking for a new job, now I have to find something within 2 months instead of 6.

Yeah. HR exists to protect MANAGEMENT from lawsuits, not humor the employees. I'm an IT professional who supported HR departments....so I'm not making that shit up. I have a co-worker at the current job who just now discovered that.

So....how are you fixing it. This is a thread of epic stories, not "oh man, I suck so bad...."

Ok, here is my semi-epic horrible story:

I started at this job at the tail end of February/beginning of March.

Right of the bat there were problems. The person who had previously done this job was still there and training me. His "training" went a bit like this:

Trainer: So I pull this number into this spreadsheet -
Me: Wait, where did you get that number and how do you know to put it there?
trainer: I just know.

Further prodding gets me nowhere. So I basically receive NO training, despite having a trainer. The trainer also gives me a workbook of things that are behind that need to be done ASAP. Some of them are tax returns that are two years past due. Others are things still not done that are related to a merger the company went through the year before I started. I get so sick the first two weeks I'm there that I collapse and am rushed to the emergency room.

Meanwhile, my boss keeps dropping more and more duties on me. My first week I took over all cash forecasting, all the fixed asset stuff, Construction licenses, and became their key user for the new EPR system that was supposed to be going live May 1st.

By April I was in charge of:
  • Cash Forecasting
  • Construction Licenses
  • All Fixed assets, including Construction in Progress, gathering backup documentation for all FA purchases, and disposals
  • Approval of all FA invoices before they are paid and reporting on all outstanding FA Purchase Orders
  • Depreciation Forecasting
  • Depreciation monthly entries
  • Monthly prepaid allocations
  • Reconciling all Inter-company accounts at the end of each month (this place has about a dozen different offshoots in Europe, Asia, America, Africa, etc)
  • Sales tax for all 50 states including registration, renewals, and filings

By the end of May, go live had been pushed back to October 1st. Meanwhile I was given new duties on TOP of all the duties listed above:
  • all the User acceptance testing assignments
  • all the system master data validations
  • writing all the procedures & documentation
  • the assignment to train everyone in finance on how to use the new system

By June I had the following duties ADDED To my plate, and remember I'm STILL in charge of everything above as well:
  • Credit Card management of all corporate credit cards
  • Registering fleet vehicles with the Dept of Motor Vehicles
  • Signing off on all outgoing ACH and WIRE payments
  • Filling out the monthly Financial Statement package
  • Management of all corporate insurance

In the middle of June one day I get so stressed out that I basically have a complete meltdown at work. I go to my boss, begging for help where I'm told I'm just 'not working hard enough.' I walked out of her office, went in the bathroom and cried for an hour. I was VERY VERY tempted to just walk away that day and never come back, but the aforementioned 'golden handcuffs' convinces me to stay and try to get things under control. At this point I've not even been there 4 months and had two breakdowns.

In July I have another meeting with my boss where I tell her I'm overloaded, and ask her to give me priorities. She refuses, tells me 'everything' is a priority and reiterates that the reason I'm behind is that I'm not working enough and not working hard enough. Also, she gives me a list of more duties that she's going to be transferring over to me in the near future.

I begin to cope by literally dropping every task that someone is not asking me for right at that moment, but I'm enough of a stickler that the undone tasks are stressing me out.

At the beginning of Aug I go to HR, and ask them to moderate a meeting between me and my boss. During that meeting, I'm VERY honest with the fact that I haven't been doing a lot of tasks on my list simply because of the lack of time. She FREAKS OUT about the merger related tasks that still aren't done, and insists I do them NOW. She does finally agree to take ONE tasks off my list of duties, but since it is one of the things I hadn't been doing it doesn't affect my workload in any way.

Later in the month she uses the excuse that she took that one task off my list to try and give me three more tasks.

I write a resignation later, and on August 26th go in with the letter in hand to try and have one more conversation with her about my workload.

Now, remember, it is a month before go live. Because of my crazy task list above I've had time to do zero training and written zero documentation and zero procedures. I'm the ONLY one in the department that even knows how to log into the new system.

She doesn't budge so I hand her the letter with my last day as Sept 11th. She FREAKS OUT, but finally calms down long enough to ask if I'll stay until after go live if she takes everything off my tasks list except the training, documentation, and procedure documentation.

So it all works out for me. I have a job for 2 more months, time to job hunt, and since the amount I have to pay back is prorated  it means that I'll only have to pay back about 1/4 of the starting bonus.

After the announcement went out that I was quitting, IT (whom I'd been working closely with on the new system implementation - BTW their jaws hit the floor when I repeated my bosses claim that I wasn't 'working hard enough') offered me a job with them for $25K more a year than I'd been making in accounting. I declined, because F*** this company.

Soooo, the companies perspective it "Hey, we f'd you up for months and months.  Please stick around a bit longer, otherwise you put us in a difficult position".  Yeah, I know what I'd say to that....Hahaha.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Cpa Cat on September 08, 2015, 08:04:50 PM
As many of you are aware, I am FIRE'd, but I have a fake job as a self-employed CPA. I like doing taxes and being a CPA is kind of fun.

But I have this weird client. He was one of my first clients and he started as a tax/accounting client, but over time his requests got a little outside of the norm of what you would normally ask your CPA to do. Like shopping for his health insurance, dealing with his property insurance company, drafting letters to various organizations, paying his bills. He even gave my phone number to his mortgage company so that I could "handle" his mortgage refinance. Obviously, I'm not charging this guy enough, because he seems to view me as his personal assistant.

So today, as a courtesy, I sent an email letting know a few of my clients that I'm going on vacation.

About 30 seconds later, I get a call from him: "Before you go on vacation, I need you to submit an invoice for a government contract."

So I reply with, "Um... I don't know how to do that, so I don't think it's going to be possible."

Him: "This is something I'll need you to do monthly. It's really easy, I'll walk you through it. "

Me: "This really isn't what I do. I am a Certified Public Accountant... And my E&O insurance isn't going to cover me if I make an error on something like this. You're going to need to find someone else to do that."

Him: "Other accountants have done it for me in the past. Anyway, I would need more notice than 5 minutes before it's due if I were going to find someone else."

Me: "I think you've misunderstood our professional relationship. I'm not your employee. I said no. It's not open for negotiation."

Him: "I'm sensing some tension. Let's talk about this some more when you've calmed down."

I told him: "Good luck with that." And I hung up. [I must have been calm, because I didn't tell him to shove his phone up his A$$.]

The true beauty of being FIRE'd: I don't need that guy's check to pay my bills.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Taran Wanderer on September 08, 2015, 08:08:38 PM
As many of you are aware, I am FIRE'd, but I have a fake job as a self-employed CPA. I like doing taxes and being a CPA is kind of fun.

But I have this weird client. He was one of my first clients and he started as a tax/accounting client, but over time his requests got a little outside of the norm of what you would normally ask your CPA to do. Like shopping for his health insurance, dealing with his property insurance company, drafting letters to various organizations, paying his bills. He even gave my phone number to his mortgage company so that I could "handle" his mortgage refinance. Obviously, I'm not charging this guy enough, because he seems to view me as his personal assistant.

So today, as a courtesy, I sent an email letting know a few of my clients that I'm going on vacation.

About 30 seconds later, I get a call from him: "Before you go on vacation, I need you to submit an invoice for a government contract."

So I reply with, "Um... I don't know how to do that, so I don't think it's going to be possible."

Him: "This is something I'll need you to do monthly. It's really easy, I'll walk you through it. "

Me: "This really isn't what I do. I am a Certified Public Accountant... And my E&O insurance isn't going to cover me if I make an error on something like this. You're going to need to find someone else to do that."

Him: "Other accountants have done it for me in the past. Anyway, I would need more notice than 5 minutes before it's due if I were going to find someone else."

Me: "I think you've misunderstood our professional relationship. I'm not your employee. I said no. It's not open for negotiation."

Him: "I'm sensing some tension. Let's talk about this some more when you've calmed down."

I told him: "Good luck with that." And I hung up. [I must have been calm, because I didn't tell him to shove his phone up his A$$.]

The true beauty of being FIRE'd: I don't need that guy's check to pay my bills.

The nerve of some people amazes me...

(Him, not you!)
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: dragoncar on September 08, 2015, 08:16:08 PM
epic FU story

Wow, good for you
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: G-dog on September 08, 2015, 08:40:38 PM
@cpa cat
"Him: "I'm sensing some tension. Let's talk about this some more when you've calmed down."

Hahahaha! Re: your retort and hang up - Way to go, this was long overdue! I like how it is your fault that he doesn't have time to find someone else to fulfill a deadline he just told you about (for an issue out of your scope).
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: big_slacker on September 08, 2015, 09:18:20 PM
Yup, when I was self employed it was always about the 80/20 rule. Fire that 20% that take up 80% of your time and energy. :)

As many of you are aware, I am FIRE'd, but I have a fake job as a self-employed CPA. I like doing taxes and being a CPA is kind of fun.

But I have this weird client. He was one of my first clients and he started as a tax/accounting client, but over time his requests got a little outside of the norm of what you would normally ask your CPA to do. Like shopping for his health insurance, dealing with his property insurance company, drafting letters to various organizations, paying his bills. He even gave my phone number to his mortgage company so that I could "handle" his mortgage refinance. Obviously, I'm not charging this guy enough, because he seems to view me as his personal assistant.

So today, as a courtesy, I sent an email letting know a few of my clients that I'm going on vacation.

About 30 seconds later, I get a call from him: "Before you go on vacation, I need you to submit an invoice for a government contract."

So I reply with, "Um... I don't know how to do that, so I don't think it's going to be possible."

Him: "This is something I'll need you to do monthly. It's really easy, I'll walk you through it. "

Me: "This really isn't what I do. I am a Certified Public Accountant... And my E&O insurance isn't going to cover me if I make an error on something like this. You're going to need to find someone else to do that."

Him: "Other accountants have done it for me in the past. Anyway, I would need more notice than 5 minutes before it's due if I were going to find someone else."

Me: "I think you've misunderstood our professional relationship. I'm not your employee. I said no. It's not open for negotiation."

Him: "I'm sensing some tension. Let's talk about this some more when you've calmed down."

I told him: "Good luck with that." And I hung up. [I must have been calm, because I didn't tell him to shove his phone up his A$$.]

The true beauty of being FIRE'd: I don't need that guy's check to pay my bills.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: happy on September 09, 2015, 05:27:35 AM
As many of you are aware, I am FIRE'd, but I have a fake job as a self-employed CPA. I like doing taxes and being a CPA is kind of fun.

But I have this weird client. He was one of my first clients and he started as a tax/accounting client, but over time his requests got a little outside of the norm of what you would normally ask your CPA to do. Like shopping for his health insurance, dealing with his property insurance company, drafting letters to various organizations, paying his bills. He even gave my phone number to his mortgage company so that I could "handle" his mortgage refinance. Obviously, I'm not charging this guy enough, because he seems to view me as his personal assistant.


This is obviously the problem!….sheesh,  senior accountants here charge like a wounded bull ( up to $500/hr).  No way you'd get them to shop for deals on health insurance etc.

The joy of FU money :) and  now you don't have to worry about telling him you've tripled your charge rate.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Faraday on September 09, 2015, 08:36:32 AM
As many of you are aware, I am FIRE'd, but I have a fake job as a self-employed CPA. I like doing taxes and being a CPA is kind of fun.

But I have this weird client. ....

That's an awesome story! You gotta tell us if there ends up being any more to it. I have this feeling he'll be back....?
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: The_path_less_taken on September 09, 2015, 09:22:49 AM
As many of you are aware, I am FIRE'd, but I have a fake job as a self-employed CPA. I like doing taxes and being a CPA is kind of fun.

But I have this weird client. He was one of my first clients and he started as a tax/accounting client, but over time his requests got a little outside of the norm of what you would normally ask your CPA to do. Like shopping for his health insurance, dealing with his property insurance company, drafting letters to various organizations, paying his bills. He even gave my phone number to his mortgage company so that I could "handle" his mortgage refinance. Obviously, I'm not charging this guy enough, because he seems to view me as his personal assistant.

So today, as a courtesy, I sent an email letting know a few of my clients that I'm going on vacation.

About 30 seconds later, I get a call from him: "Before you go on vacation, I need you to submit an invoice for a government contract."

So I reply with, "Um... I don't know how to do that, so I don't think it's going to be possible."

Him: "This is something I'll need you to do monthly. It's really easy, I'll walk you through it. "

Me: "This really isn't what I do. I am a Certified Public Accountant... And my E&O insurance isn't going to cover me if I make an error on something like this. You're going to need to find someone else to do that."

Him: "Other accountants have done it for me in the past. Anyway, I would need more notice than 5 minutes before it's due if I were going to find someone else."

Me: "I think you've misunderstood our professional relationship. I'm not your employee. I said no. It's not open for negotiation."

Him: "I'm sensing some tension. Let's talk about this some more when you've calmed down."

I told him: "Good luck with that." And I hung up. [I must have been calm, because I didn't tell him to shove his phone up his A$$.]

The true beauty of being FIRE'd: I don't need that guy's check to pay my bills.



;-0

You rock!

"Dear Sir,

In light of our last conversation, I thought this would be a good time to go over my billing policy.

I will continue to do your TAXES at the same rate as last year, although next year that fee will double.

I currently will accept phone calls for advice and other transactions at the hourly rate of $350 per, with a one hour minimum. To clarify, that means that if I pick up the phone = you owe me $350. Email reading/writing will continue to be $350 an hour. With a one hour minimum. One email = you owe me $350.

Since I have no idea how to submit the form you mentioned, I anticipate that there will be a studying/learning curve: this takes time away from the things I am supposed to be doing, so that will be $500  per hour for that portion.

And you are absolutely right that 'notice' should be given when terminating a financial relationship: please consider this to be 365 day notice. On this date next year, all the fees previously mentioned will double.

Thank you for your understanding. Before you call me, please re-read this document as calling/emailing will be costly, and these fees are non-negotiable, and effective immediately. CPA Cat"
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: mm1970 on September 09, 2015, 12:55:35 PM
I just want to say, I love this thread.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: LouisPritchard on September 09, 2015, 05:17:17 PM
Well I just quit a $120K a year job after 6 years with the company. Claiming the local management treats the employees like shit would be an understatement. They've gone so far as to trespass on private hunting leases and threaten peoples jobs over it if they press charges. They started in on me for not coming in on my days off, pretending I didn't exist, canceling my vacations, some yelling and screaming and threatening my job, and petty crap like that. I told them a year ago I was going back to school to get the remaining classes I needed to sit the CPA exam, buying a house with cash, packing my stuff and moving across the country back home. All I heard was that I was full of shit and would never leave, cant give up that pension after all. I bought the house back in June and they just said it must be a rental property. So couple weeks ago I wrote a nice long resignation letter with all the crap they've been pulling along with dates and sent it to HR and walked out the door for good, a 2 week notice would have just amped up the harassment so I didn't bother. Had a nice exit interview, they wanted more details, sounds like HR will be paying them a visit to investigate. Starting my last couple of classes tomorrow, hope to get some work doing tax prep this season and take the CPA exam afterwards towards May/June. It's nice not having a mortgage or car notes.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: surlygirl on September 09, 2015, 08:57:33 PM
Lots of awesome stories.

I got my FU fund (or emergency fund) piled up a few years back, and sooo glad I had it.  I'd taken a new job that was 50 (yes, yes, I know...) miles away from home, but the pay was good and it got me out of a job that I'd had for far too long.  I had worked with my manager at a previous job, so I knew her style, she knew mine, and we worked well together.  She told me I could work from home, there would be some travel but not much, and that I'd be doing what I was good at - Business Analyst stuff. 

All of that went to plan until one day in a staff meeting, she announced that she had been promoted to Director of IT and that, among other management changes, I was the ERP Manager.  What the WHAT?  She hadn't asked me if that's what I wanted, just assumed that it would be OK, because who in their right mind would turn down a management position?  I didn't think I'd like it, but was willing to take a chance.  This shiny new title came with a (wait for it) 1% raise. Soon after, we all reported to a new person, the brother-in-law of the brand-new CEO (notice a trend?  High turnover in C/E/D/M levels?).  He was a micromanager to the highest degree and thought you were slacking if you only worked 8 hours. 

I suddenly couldn't work from home anymore. I was traveling almost 50% of the time. On top of having an hour+ commute each way, I was a single mom, the proud owner of an aging house, and was trying to keep a relationship with my boyfriend alive.  I'd put in my 8 hours in the office, then come home and try to juggle DS's homework, housework, laundry, and cooking, then off to work some more once kiddo was asleep.  Our new manager (we called him "Bill" behind his back, our nickname since he was the DBIL of the CEO) would yell if he sent you an email at 11pm and you hadn't responded by the time he woke up in the morning.  He would change deadlines at the last minute, would be ridiculously over-involved in little decisions, and drove everyone crazy.  On my family vacation, I ended up working over 40 hours in order to meet a deadline that had changed AFTER I left for the vacation.

I'd finally had enough.  My (now former) manager (who had quit shortly after "Bill" showed up on the scene) apologized to me for getting me into that situation and encouraged me to get a job I really wanted, not just one that came along.  I did, and she gave me a strong recommendation.  I had my FU fund, so I decided to take some time off between jobs and only gave one week's notice.  I handed in my resignation letter, and the panic began.  I received no less than 3 calls in 10 minutes from people frantic to find out why I was leaving.  I mentioned all of the indignities.  The HR rep that I spoke with got very quiet, and asked if I'd be willing to stay if "Bill" was no longer with the company.  It turns out they fired him 5 minutes BEFORE I handed in my resignation, but they weren't ready to make it public.  I wasn't the only one who had complained (or quit), and brother-in-law or not, they gave him the boot.  I told them no, but that I would be willing to stay the full two weeks instead of the one week I'd put in my resignation letter if they could include the week of missed vacation due to "Bill's" new deadlines in my final payout.  They did.

Even though I stayed on the full two weeks, I still had a two week break between jobs.  My new job only pays me monthly, and I started right at the end of the pay cycle, so I ended up going almost two months without any income to speak of.  I didn't have to touch my FU funds, even better, I was able to stretch that final payout to last me the full time, even with a mortgage and child support payments to make.  It was heaven.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: RosieTR on September 09, 2015, 09:22:20 PM
This isn't the greatest FU story, but here goes. My job had moved to Phoenix, AZ, a place that DH and I both wound up hating. Then at work a couple years in, my boss called an awful meeting in which he told the whole office we were all fired (not FIRE'd ha ha). I had to bite my lip to keep from grinning because all I was thinking after that was, "Woohoo!! Moving back to Colorado!!!!" Then about a week later, it was made clear we were supposed to each arrange to have individual meetings with boss for some sort of debriefing. He told me he hoped I would stay. I told him I wasn't spending another summer in Phoenix (this was like late summer/early fall, by the calendar, anyway). Being very motivated, it was super easy to save for the few months I took to find a job in CO. As it was, I did get a job in January and DH did a couple months after that. But we would have moved back in April even if no job had been forthcoming because we had at least a couple years of bare-bones expenses saved, outside of official tax-advantaged retirement plans.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: mm1970 on September 10, 2015, 09:43:05 AM
Lots of awesome stories.

I got my FU fund (or emergency fund) piled up a few years back, and sooo glad I had it.  I'd taken a new job that was 50 (yes, yes, I know...) miles away from home, but the pay was good and it got me out of a job that I'd had for far too long.  I had worked with my manager at a previous job, so I knew her style, she knew mine, and we worked well together.  She told me I could work from home, there would be some travel but not much, and that I'd be doing what I was good at - Business Analyst stuff. 

All of that went to plan until one day in a staff meeting, she announced that she had been promoted to Director of IT and that, among other management changes, I was the ERP Manager.  What the WHAT?  She hadn't asked me if that's what I wanted, just assumed that it would be OK, because who in their right mind would turn down a management position?  I didn't think I'd like it, but was willing to take a chance.  This shiny new title came with a (wait for it) 1% raise. Soon after, we all reported to a new person, the brother-in-law of the brand-new CEO (notice a trend?  High turnover in C/E/D/M levels?).  He was a micromanager to the highest degree and thought you were slacking if you only worked 8 hours. 

I suddenly couldn't work from home anymore. I was traveling almost 50% of the time. On top of having an hour+ commute each way, I was a single mom, the proud owner of an aging house, and was trying to keep a relationship with my boyfriend alive.  I'd put in my 8 hours in the office, then come home and try to juggle DS's homework, housework, laundry, and cooking, then off to work some more once kiddo was asleep.  Our new manager (we called him "Bill" behind his back, our nickname since he was the DBIL of the CEO) would yell if he sent you an email at 11pm and you hadn't responded by the time he woke up in the morning.  He would change deadlines at the last minute, would be ridiculously over-involved in little decisions, and drove everyone crazy.  On my family vacation, I ended up working over 40 hours in order to meet a deadline that had changed AFTER I left for the vacation.

I'd finally had enough.  My (now former) manager (who had quit shortly after "Bill" showed up on the scene) apologized to me for getting me into that situation and encouraged me to get a job I really wanted, not just one that came along.  I did, and she gave me a strong recommendation.  I had my FU fund, so I decided to take some time off between jobs and only gave one week's notice.  I handed in my resignation letter, and the panic began.  I received no less than 3 calls in 10 minutes from people frantic to find out why I was leaving.  I mentioned all of the indignities.  The HR rep that I spoke with got very quiet, and asked if I'd be willing to stay if "Bill" was no longer with the company.  It turns out they fired him 5 minutes BEFORE I handed in my resignation, but they weren't ready to make it public.  I wasn't the only one who had complained (or quit), and brother-in-law or not, they gave him the boot.  I told them no, but that I would be willing to stay the full two weeks instead of the one week I'd put in my resignation letter if they could include the week of missed vacation due to "Bill's" new deadlines in my final payout.  They did.

Even though I stayed on the full two weeks, I still had a two week break between jobs.  My new job only pays me monthly, and I started right at the end of the pay cycle, so I ended up going almost two months without any income to speak of.  I didn't have to touch my FU funds, even better, I was able to stretch that final payout to last me the full time, even with a mortgage and child support payments to make.  It was heaven.
This one is sweet!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Urchina on September 11, 2015, 01:25:23 AM
While in grad school (financed through work and a scholarship), I was asked to come on as a full-time research project coordinator at the research hospital/medical school where I was employed, doing a job very close to what I thought was my dream job. I jumped at the chance, put my grad career on hold (it had a 7-year ticking clock, so not really on hold...) and moved a couple of hours away to work full-time.

Fast-forward 10 months later and I hate the job so much and am so stressed by two of my three supervisors (yes, I had three bosses -- one of many problems with this job) that I'm vomiting with anxiety every morning before work. I want to go back to grad school but don't see a clear path back financially. To ease the stress, I hit the gym every day after work, then ride the bus home and hop off a couple of stops early to browse the stacks at my favorite used/new/independent bookstore, which was huge enough to function as a library. While there, I happen to pick up a used copy of The Complete Tightwad Gazette by Amy Dacyczyn and figure what the hell. I pay $12 for it and take it home and read the whole thing that night. The frugality light that I've always had gets a high-beam setting from this book. I make a plan.

The next morning I get up, get ready for work, vomit from anxiety, and head out the door. That night I find a new, waaaay cheaper place to live, figure out the bus commute (I rarely drove in that city because public transit was so great) and give up the lease on my trendy little apartment. I move two weeks later and proceed to stash every single last damn dime. I have fun with friends while I'm doing it, but I focus on savings first. This drives my roommates (party girls) nuts, but it turns out they only have to put up with me for another six months because in that time I save about 75% of my salary and have $10,000 in the bank, which is enough to finance the last year of my graduate education. I contact my program and get back in, plus they give me a paying TA position a term early so I can quit my job... in two weeks!

The next day, after I have received and accepted the e-mail offer of employment from my university, I write my resignation letter, have my morning anxiety puke, go in to work, and make an appointment with the most difficult of my three bosses. He is demanding, critical, mercurial, and harsh. He's a terrible boss for me and did not bring out my best achievements. I go in, sit down, and when he waves at me to begin I thank him for the opportunity to work with his team, and it's taught me unbelievably valuable life lessons, etc., etc. Then I tell him I've been offered a TA position at my graduate program, have accepted, and am leaving in two weeks.

For the first time ever in 18 months I have his complete and undivided attention. He is not pleased, but what can he say? I'm going back to grad school. I hand him my resignation letter and two weeks later I am out that door.

Over the next year or so, three of the collaborative scientists on that research project summarily quit the project. Turns out, they didn't like the job, either. One of them later told me they realized that if the grad student (read: academic slave) could claim her freedom, the rest of them could, too.

I graduated two years later with no debt and an incredibly strong sense of what type of work environment does NOT work for me. The unbelievably valuable life lesson learned? Life is too short to stay in a job that makes you puke from anxiety every morning. That's wasn't FU money. That was Freedom Cash.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: nancyjnelson on September 11, 2015, 01:39:13 PM
One of them later told me they realized that if the grad student (read: academic slave) could claim her freedom, the rest of them could, too.

Beautiful.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Faraday on September 11, 2015, 05:24:05 PM
I graduated two years later with no debt and an incredibly strong sense of what type of work environment does NOT work for me. The unbelievably valuable life lesson learned? Life is too short to stay in a job that makes you puke from anxiety every morning. That's wasn't FU money. That was Freedom Cash.

That's one hell of an awesome story.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: FrugalWad on September 11, 2015, 08:33:56 PM
I stopped in at a national motorcycle gear retailer, and the manager was impressed with my knowledge of manufacturer quality and general safety. He offered me a job on the spot. I was well into FU and FI status, but figured it'd be fun BSing all day with the close-knit community of riders. I didn't think much of it, until I got a call for the first round of interviews. They wanted it done immediately, but I was in the middle of something and asked for an hour. The job was close. The first round of interviews go great, until at the end I find out the job I applied for isn't the one I'll be getting. I debate saying well, when the job I want opens up, let me know, but on a whim I say screw it, I'll see what it's like as a salesman instead of a merchandiser.

Round two of the interviews, and I'm with the district manager. I explain to him I'll be happy to work there if I'm not micromanaged, if customer service is top priority over sales, and that the company treats their employees like people. I'm promised up and down that everything is awesome.

I start my first day. It's supposed to be a week of training behind closed doors, but after the second day I'm thrown into the fold. It's retail, so the learning curve isn't steep. I spend two glorious weeks chatting it up with every biker who comes in with an interesting story, make 140% of whatever my sales are supposed to be, and have a blast with the people I work with. Everything is still awesome.

Third week rolls around. Old manager is fired, a new manager-in-training (MIT)is brought up, along with a more seasoned manager (MSM) who's supposed to be showing him the ropes. MSM's idea of manager-employee relations is asking such skill-building questions as, what's your favorite color? Quality leadership right there, right?

Micromanaging from MIT begins immediately. I refuse to upsell the crap they're trying to unload on people that's always front and center on the checkout counters. The people who want them will see them and buy them. The people who don't won't, and I'm not going to try to sucker people into buying things when their wallets are out because corporate feels they're more susceptible to buying crap at that point. So in the middle of a transaction MIT steps between me and the register while reaching across from me to grab whatever trinket's on sale and tells me to try and sell it. Strike one.

One guy and his wife comes in, they had a flat or blow out or something, so they're stranded in the parking lot. I get them a tire and let them borrow tools to fix it. MIT says because of insurance reasons no one can do any maintenance in the parking lot. I ignore him. Bikers don't leave bikers stranded when they can help; the good ones don't, anyway. Another guy comes in at some point and wants to see how a bike stand works. Super fancy thing, top of the line on the market in terms of quality. My personal favorite; I've got a pair in my garage. I'm too happy to show him, because I believe in buying quality once so that you BIFL. I need an adjustable wrench to show him, so I go grab one. MIT doesn't ask what it's for, first thing out of his mouth is we don't lend tools.

My eval comes up, and either it's corporate policy or MSM tells him that no matter how good someone is, they should get the lowest score possible on one eval criteria. Mine was presentation, which means I was poor at explaining to a customer how a product worked. No one in that store knew how anything worked better than I did. I had to show them all the proper way of sizing helmets, for crying out loud. And MIT's surprised when he pulls up my sales and sees I'm still cruising at 140% over quota. At this point, we're reached strikes two through screw this 'tard.

In the meantime, I also have a job as a consultant making about one forty times an hour what I am there. It means meetings and such at times when needed, but not within the hours I'm at the store. I've told them this at the store; they have me from such-a-such time on these days, that's it. Okay, they say. Well, once a month at the store, it's time for everyone to come in late after hours and re-organize displays for new sales. Only MIT also wants everyone to also give a presentation about their favorite item in the store. I say first, that's stupid; that's eating away valuable time it takes to get the store set up. I say second, I probably can't make it anyway, I have a meeting at my other job, and it's outside the hours I said I'd be available. I let the assistant manager know. I let the MSM know. MIT isn't there the two days prior, but I'm not too worried about him not finding out because I just told two other managers.

But apparently communication isn't taught to managers here, because the next day rolls around and it turns out to be a beautiful day in the FUhood. Because of the stupid show and tell tap dance MIT wanted, the store didn't get done, so everyone's scrambling to get that fixed while people are wandering the store. MIT is finally there. I work the day, and at the end MIT asks to come to the back office for a chat.

He gives me a spiel about the importance of teamwork and if I don't show up again without any notice, he'll consider firing me. Then he slips out a written notice of reprimand. I told him I'm not signing it and list my grievances. Goes in one ear and straight out the other. I take my employee shirt off on the spot, toss it on the desk, and tell him I quit. I lasted at that job three weeks. I spent longer waiting for the job interview and corporate to process my resume and do a background check than I spent on the actual job.

Six months later the store was closed down.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Spiffsome on September 12, 2015, 02:06:11 AM
I can't talk about the circumstances right now, but things at my workplace are bad enough that I'm thinking of my FU money and paid-off mortgage with a warm and happy glow.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Jack on September 12, 2015, 07:05:28 AM
The world is full of incompetent crazy people who get hired into management positions. How the hell that happens, I just don't know.

Because most of the sane people either:

1)  Don't want the management jobs in the first place and refuse to be promoted into them; or
2)  Quickly learn how horrible they are and move back to being a primary contributor as soon as they can; or
3)  Go insane themselves; or
4)  Die from overwork.

It's the Peter Principle (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Peter_Principle) in action: competent people keep getting promoted until they stop being competent. Then, instead of being demoted again (like they should be), they stay in their incompetent role.

But what's really terrible are the implications: since the principle applies to all employees, eventually every position would be occupied by an incompetent!

I get so sick the first two weeks I'm there that I collapse and am rushed to the emergency room.

...

In the middle of June one day I get so stressed out that I basically have a complete meltdown at work. I go to my boss, begging for help where I'm told I'm just 'not working hard enough.' I walked out of her office, went in the bathroom and cried for an hour.

...

I begin to cope by literally dropping every task that someone is not asking me for right at that moment, but I'm enough of a stickler that the undone tasks are stressing me out.

I just don't understand this kind of thing. Admittedly, I've somehow been lucky enough never to have a job with that kind of unreasonable workload, but still, I see no reason to get stressed out about it. Be like Peter from Office Space, and just stop caring about the bullshit!

If somebody asks you to get something done, tell them you'll add it to your queue and it'll get done after you've finished the stuff you're already working on. If somebody wants you to work unpaid overtime or come in on your day off, simply tell them you're not doing that. If somebody complains that you're not working fast enough, tell them "too bad." Remember, they're already understaffed -- if they don't like it, what are they going to do? Fire you and thereby screw themselves over harder?! And even if they did, who cares since the alternative would be for you to quit anyway!

Standing up for yourself from the beginning by setting appropriate boundaries and expectations means you never reach an epic "FU, I quit" situation in the first place.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Pooperman on September 12, 2015, 09:56:42 AM
Standing up for yourself from the beginning by setting appropriate boundaries and expectations means you never reach an epic "FU, I quit" situation in the first place.

 +1

This exactly. If you're not willing to set boundaries, expect to be pushed until you set them. Sometimes it will mean getting fired, but if you got fired because they have unrealistic expectations, fuck 'em.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: mm1970 on September 12, 2015, 08:58:33 PM
One of them later told me they realized that if the grad student (read: academic slave) could claim her freedom, the rest of them could, too.

Beautiful.

+1
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: mm1970 on September 12, 2015, 09:08:10 PM
Standing up for yourself from the beginning by setting appropriate boundaries and expectations means you never reach an epic "FU, I quit" situation in the first place.

 +1

This exactly. If you're not willing to set boundaries, expect to be pushed until you set them. Sometimes it will mean getting fired, but if you got fired because they have unrealistic expectations, fuck 'em.
I don't know, personally, for me, they seem to sneak up on you.  Gradually they give you more work.  And you have "stretch goals".  Until one day, ALL your goals are "stretch goals" and they are impossible. It's like they get used to how much you can do, then push you little by little until you break.  I was pretty good at the push back when I was younger, and as I got older, I just would do what I wanted.

I had a position a couple of years ago where I was managing people, and some of them worked nights.  I was working 32 hours a week at the time.  Through a lot of thought, I agreed to go full time, and negotiated a schedule change with my spouse so that I could overlap with the night guys 2 days a week.  Not 10 days after I made the switch, they laid off my entire fucking group.

And not even just that, but as we were walking out of the after-meeting where they discussed the sad reasons for the layoff and how they needed everyone to give "120%!", the company President (whom I'd known for years and worked for at a prior company), said "well, now that you are full time, you can work and give us 120%!"

Fuck you.  I mean, my last layoff hadn't even happened yet, the guy was in the meeting!  (He was the night guy.)  I said "oh, silly, you were already getting 100% when I was at 32 hours, so by definition you'll be getting it!"  My spouse told me that it was probably a poor career move (and he was right), but fuck that.  Asshole. 

Anyway, that's how it happens.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: jlajr on September 13, 2015, 03:01:48 AM
Standing up for yourself from the beginning by setting appropriate boundaries and expectations means you never reach an epic "FU, I quit" situation in the first place.

Amen.

Earlier this year, three people from my technical writing team of 14 were laid off, including the manager, who was a member of the team for almost 25 years and remained a productive writer in her own right; and the two people responsible for a product line (including one who had worked on that product line for 29 years) - despite the company's "single-point-of-failure" initiative.

The new manager and his manager - who has no other functional responsibilities - are not technical writers and have little experience managing technical writing teams or projects. Therefore, they asked a bunch of us to be "coordinators", that is, assume responsibilities and perform tasks the manager and these other experienced writers had assumed and performed. (A brilliant cost-cutting move: The company is now paying a Senior Manager and Director to have less responsibility and do less work than the Manager they laid off.)

As my current position is three or four grades below that level, I informed my manager that I will happily accept these product line-wide and other responsibilities if they change my title and increase my salary significantly. Not surprisingly, he said the company would not do it. Fine, no problem. I was happy to accept my position, for which I'm overqualified, only about a year and a half ago, and I'm happy to continue in that capacity.

Two weeks later, though, they announced that I have been assigned to be a coordinator. They left it up to me to make it clear to my co-coordinator, a much higher-grade writer and a former manager with a couple of decades of experience on the team, that I won't be assuming these responsibilities, which leaves her with them. Also fine.

I also "damaged my image" again not too long ago by refusing to mentor or supervise an incompetent colleague that had been assigned to work with us. At the end of that discussion, my manager asked me if I wanted him to inform the others that I'm no longer a "coordinator". "Sure", I said. Please, demote me after you asked me assume Manager-level responsibilities but refused to promote me to the grade three levels below Manager...

Finally, they hired about a month and a half ago someone with less experience as a technical writer than myself at a grade higher than mine. At the same time they laid off the manager and those writers (who were based in the US, where they cost more), they also opened up three experienced positions on the team in my less-expensive office. Two of those positions are the grade above me. That is, even with open positions at the grade above, they refused to promote me when they asked me to assume those higher-level responsibilities.

So, with some FU money, I have strongly felt the urge to resign before finding another job.

I presume in a month or two we will be told that a colleague has been promoted to a grade higher than myself. She's now at the same grade as me but with a few years less experience as a technical writer. She was also assigned to be a coordinator, but she accepted the responsibilities. Hey, I don't blame her.

Maybe I'll tell them to fuck off at that point.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: jlajr on September 13, 2015, 04:07:11 AM
Sold the nursery and property in SoCal and moved back to Washington to try semi retirement. After starting another nursery to feed my Farmers Market habit it was getting into fall so nothing to do out in the greenhouses.
 I was driving by a Fred Meyer (Kroger) distribution center and they had the normal sign out for help wanted so I decided I'd try it for the holiday season...

Awesome story, ghsebldr.

Reminds me a little of the black jelly bean theory of economics someone mentioned in a comment to a MMM post (http://forum.mrmoneymustache.com/ask-a-mustachian/what-are-your-'black-jelly-beans'/).

You can make a decent amount of money doing things most others don't want to do.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Wilson Hall on September 13, 2015, 07:03:30 AM
Standing up for yourself from the beginning by setting appropriate boundaries and expectations means you never reach an epic "FU, I quit" situation in the first place.

 +1

This exactly. If you're not willing to set boundaries, expect to be pushed until you set them. Sometimes it will mean getting fired, but if you got fired because they have unrealistic expectations, fuck 'em.
I don't know, personally, for me, they seem to sneak up on you.  Gradually they give you more work.  And you have "stretch goals".  Until one day, ALL your goals are "stretch goals" and they are impossible. It's like they get used to how much you can do, then push you little by little until you break.  I was pretty good at the push back when I was younger, and as I got older, I just would do what I wanted.

I had a position a couple of years ago where I was managing people, and some of them worked nights.  I was working 32 hours a week at the time.  Through a lot of thought, I agreed to go full time, and negotiated a schedule change with my spouse so that I could overlap with the night guys 2 days a week.  Not 10 days after I made the switch, they laid off my entire fucking group.

And not even just that, but as we were walking out of the after-meeting where they discussed the sad reasons for the layoff and how they needed everyone to give "120%!", the company President (whom I'd known for years and worked for at a prior company), said "well, now that you are full time, you can work and give us 120%!"

Fuck you.  I mean, my last layoff hadn't even happened yet, the guy was in the meeting!  (He was the night guy.)  I said "oh, silly, you were already getting 100% when I was at 32 hours, so by definition you'll be getting it!"  My spouse told me that it was probably a poor career move (and he was right), but fuck that.  Asshole. 

Anyway, that's how it happens.

This sounds like something that happened to a friend of mine years ago. The two supervisors above her had their positions eliminated and she was told she would be doing their jobs as well as hers. She said fine, and asked for a small (less than $5k) raise for taking on the additional responsibilities. They said no. Friend says ok, here's my two-week notice. The employer was flabbergasted, as was I. Friend was married with two young children and a fair amount of debt; at the time it seemed like a risky move. Within a few months, though, she had landed a job making almost $30k more than the previous one.

I did a mini-FU move about ten years ago. My employer had been doing to me what you described above, adding more and more work even though I could barely keep up. I wasn't complaining, which meant, in their minds, that everything was just fine and dandy. By the time I had been there a year, the place had been re-orged and the turnover was up to about one third of the staff. My original job description no longer matched what I was doing day to day. The final straw came when I asked for a couple weeks off for a vacation, and the next day I was called into a meeting in which I was told I needed to put in more hours to get all the ever-increasing duties of my job done. Went home, talked to the husband, who told me I should quit if I wanted. I did just that, and nine months later ended up in a job that was much better suited to my disposition. Almost ten years later I'm still there. In anticipation of some major management changes next year, I am rebuilding the FU fund just in case.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: cavewoman on September 13, 2015, 11:50:14 AM
Posting so these inspirational stories show up in my new replies
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: markbike528CBX on September 13, 2015, 03:29:49 PM
Pre-FU

The consensus in the office is that the office lifetime is short.
 FU money givs me the peace-of-mind that I can't be forced to go to hell (headquarters, 2000 miles away).
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: ender on September 13, 2015, 03:41:27 PM
I don't know, personally, for me, they seem to sneak up on you.  Gradually they give you more work.  And you have "stretch goals".  Until one day, ALL your goals are "stretch goals" and they are impossible. It's like they get used to how much you can do, then push you little by little until you break.  I was pretty good at the push back when I was younger, and as I got older, I just would do what I wanted.

I was fortunate that when I first started doing these sorts of goals, my first manager who I really worked with basically forced me to set the goals lower than I wanted.

Hindsight being 20-20 it's one of the best career things that happened to me. Setting the "official bar" low means I am free to do all the things that actually add value to the company (and me) instead of playing dumb games.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: nawhite on September 14, 2015, 10:02:18 PM
Some of the Golden handcuff talk got me thinking about one time I left a job 2 weeks short of vesting 9k in 401k match. I had been working a job I really liked with a fantastic team but because our team was so far ahead of schedule compared to the rest of the project, I was asked to do some much less fun stuff for a manager I didn't like as much for 6 months. 6 months came and went and it looked like the new role was going to be extended for another year minimum and likely become permanent. So I started looking and found a new job paying 25k more than I was making doing stuff I'd enjoy with a commute I can do via 20 min on a train instead of 15 miles by car.

I told my immediate manager first who's comment was "you gotta be f-ing kidding me." I offered to stick it out for 6 weeks (very long lead times for hiring defense contractors due to the clearance process so I was trying to be nice) but they realized that if they said I had to leave in 2 weeks then I'd miss 3 years of vesting in my 401k which was worth over 9k and "no one would walk away from 9k, he'll have to stay with us for a while longer". That logic made no sense to me and I was so done with it all at that point I said "just watch me."

It worked out pretty darn well for me too, the new job gave me an additional $5k raise within 6 months and I realized that I could maximize the ESPP program at the new job for another $10k/year risk free on top of my salary (discussing the epic-ly awesome ESPP program with my co-workers definitely deserves a post in the overheard at work thread now that I think about it)
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Guesl982374 on September 15, 2015, 07:26:03 AM
... but they realized that if they said I had to leave in 2 weeks then I'd miss 3 years of vesting in my 401k which was worth over 9k and "no one would walk away from 9k, he'll have to stay with us for a while longer"...

nawhite, that's awesome that you were able to walk away without any issues. I'm with you though, I don't understand their logic. We're they expecting that the need to stay few extra weeks to vest would translate to you having to pass on the new job, thereby forcing you to stay at the company for another 6-12 months? That's pretty weak/convoluted at best.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: AZDude on September 15, 2015, 11:31:26 AM
Loved reading these. Some really great stuff.

Way back in the day, I was having a tough time finding a job, and was working about 30 hours a week doing tech support for slightly more than minimum wage. I was desperate for something higher paying, but found little and so I end up taking another P/T job doing tech support. Well, it was supposed to be part time. After about three days into the two week training, they have a major emergency and suddenly I am on the phones doing support full time, 40+ hours a week, although I am still getting P/T pay.

This goes on for about a month, and I am working 70+ hours a week between the jobs. One job literally ends at 4, the other literally starts at 4, so to say I am doing a juggling act puts it mildly. At this time I go my PoS boss and ask him if I am going to be working full time going forward. He informs that they are understaffed as it is and that yes, there is no way I will be working part time hours. Great, I say, and then I ask if that means I will get bumped to the full time wage. He says yes, but that it might take a few weeks to a month to get the paperwork through. No problem, I tell him, and I gleefully inform my other P/T job that I am resigning.

At this point, even making low wages, at 70+ hours a week for almost two months, I have, for the first time in my life, a decent cash reserve, and I'm dancing in to work because I feel like my financial problems are over. I keep working there for about two months, no raise yet, and I start bugging the boss. He keeps saying the raise is coming and to just be cool. In the meantime I do everything asked of me. I come in early. I take a "lunch" at 2PM so I can handle the extra load when everyone else leaves for a more normal lunch. I stay late on calls even when my co-workers are hanging up on customers because its the end of their shift.

Then one day, I ask my boss again about when I am officially moved to F/T. He tells me "that is not going to happen" and that he is sorry. I ask why, and he blames upper management and some reorganization, but that my hours are not in jeopardy. I flip the fuck out, and call him a corporate lackey, among other things, but somehow I don't get fired. I start coming in late every day. One day the boss asks me to change my schedule to come in at 6AM. I say no. He tells me its not negotiable, I say tough and come in at 8 the next day. I still do not get fired.

My boss asks me one day to do a special project for the company, and I say no, that its not my job. If he wants it done, it will cost him $X.XX dollars per hour more. He is not amused, but unfortunately, I do not get fired since they are super busy and understaffed.

Months go by. My boss stops talking to me, ever, unless it is to criticize me for coming in late. Finally, the reorganization is complete, and a new "co-manager" is appointed to our group. He comes to introduce himself to everyone. He gets to me and we talk about the poor treatment I have received from his company. He apologizes and says he will get it fixed. A couple weeks later I am given a raise that is about 50% of what it should be. My boss and the new co-manager act like they are giving their puppy a dog treat. Two weeks later I land a development job, and start my career in that field.

When I tell my boss, he just nods and says "if you are not here the full two weeks, you will not be eligible for rehire" and turns back around. To say our relationship is toxic at this point is an understatement. A team building activity gets scheduled for my last day, and my co-workers use as it as going-away party. My boss does not show up.

Not sure if that story qualifies, and I would really like to say I learned my lesson at that time about the power of FU money, but sadly it would still be several years before I got my shit together.





Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: mtn on September 15, 2015, 11:46:25 AM
Some of the Golden handcuff talk got me thinking about one time I left a job 2 weeks short of vesting 9k in 401k match. I had been working a job I really liked with a fantastic team but because our team was so far ahead of schedule compared to the rest of the project, I was asked to do some much less fun stuff for a manager I didn't like as much for 6 months. 6 months came and went and it looked like the new role was going to be extended for another year minimum and likely become permanent. So I started looking and found a new job paying 25k more than I was making doing stuff I'd enjoy with a commute I can do via 20 min on a train instead of 15 miles by car.

I told my immediate manager first who's comment was "you gotta be f-ing kidding me." I offered to stick it out for 6 weeks (very long lead times for hiring defense contractors due to the clearance process so I was trying to be nice) but they realized that if they said I had to leave in 2 weeks then I'd miss 3 years of vesting in my 401k which was worth over 9k and "no one would walk away from 9k, he'll have to stay with us for a while longer". That logic made no sense to me and I was so done with it all at that point I said "just watch me."

It worked out pretty darn well for me too, the new job gave me an additional $5k raise within 6 months and I realized that I could maximize the ESPP program at the new job for another $10k/year risk free on top of my salary (discussing the epic-ly awesome ESPP program with my co-workers definitely deserves a post in the overheard at work thread now that I think about it)

Admirable that you're able to do that, but I can't comprehend turning down the $9k! Only two more weeks? Why not work it? They're logic made no sense either, obviously, since you gave 6 weeks--I'd either figure they'd say "Great, thanks for the 6 weeks notice" or "Pack your things and go now".  If it was 8 weeks away from the $9k, or if you needed to start the new job ASAP, sure, I understand... But both parties on this are confusing to me. Definitely wouldn't call that golden handcuffs, or even "One more year" syndrome.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Zamboni on September 15, 2015, 08:29:37 PM
Then one day, I ask my boss again about when I am officially moved to F/T. He tells me "that is not going to happen" and that he is sorry. I ask why, and he blames upper management and some reorganization, but that my hours are not in jeopardy. I flip the fuck out, and call him a corporate lackey, among other things, but somehow I don't get fired. I start coming in late every day. One day the boss asks me to change my schedule to come in at 6AM. I say no. He tells me its not negotiable, I say tough and come in at 8 the next day. I still do not get fired.

My boss asks me one day to do a special project for the company, and I say no, that its not my job. If he wants it done, it will cost him $X.XX dollars per hour more. He is not amused, but unfortunately, I do not get fired since they are super busy and understaffed.

Oh, even though you didn't quit right away, your story still qualifies in my book. Love that you ignored his demands about the earlier starting time.

Having some money in the bank is very empowering, no doubt about it.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Daisy on September 16, 2015, 08:23:23 PM
Anyone see the FU story told in front of an international audience? 33 year old US Open women's tennis winner Flavia Pennetta retires right after accepting the winning trophy and on international TV! Well, she didn't really say FU, but it was a grand retirement speech.

Audio on retiring starts around 1:30:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q1Lol_lkdto

An article describing her thoughts on retiring:
http://news.yahoo.com/flavia-pennetta-wins-us-open-title-210147552--ten.html;_ylt=A0LEV7kHH_pV0wsAV4MnnIlQ;_ylu=X3oDMTEzcnMxdjY1BGNvbG8DYmYxBHBvcwM4BHZ0aWQDRkZSQTAxXzEEc2VjA3Ny

Excerpts:
"With this winning today, my life is perfect," Pennetta said.
"I don't know what I like to do, so I have to discover everything," she said. "It's a new life for me.
"Sometimes we are more scared to take the decision because we don't know what we like or what we're going to do after, how is going to be the life.
"But I think it's going to be a pretty good life. I did everything that I expected.
"And more. Much more."
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: BackNColo on September 17, 2015, 08:22:31 AM
I have 2 sort of FU stories. The first happened when I was in high school. I was working at the local movie theater.  I was the assistant manager and the manager was an OK person. She knew that I had enlisted in the military, but wouldn't leave for 9 months. She scheduled me for Thanksgiving, my birthday, Christmas, and Christmas eve.  I asked her to reconsider. When she didn't I quit. I waited till after the holidays and then got a job at a big box lumber store.

While in the military, an instructed stopped class to tell how much he loved the Navy. He wanted to retire form it. He said," Not everyone will like the Navy as much as me. Save some money or you will be trapped here. It isn't good for you or the Navy." I don't know why he brought this up, but it struck a cord with me and I started saving. Fast forward 6 years. I sold ~60 days vacation back to the Navy, and was on a 30 day terminal leave ( you sign your paperwork and go away, you keep getting paid and have insurance... you get the hint).

I snagged a job right away, while on vacation. It was a strange family owned veterinary medical company. The equipment came in covered in pig/cow/horse feces. I had to troubleshoot the electronics while being conscious of the poo. The company seemed a bit doomed, low tech, but it was a job. The real problem for me was the chain smoking secretaries/wives of the owners). I would shut the door to their area to keep the smoke out of my area. They would immediately open it. Repeat.
 I had been there for 2 weeks when a previously submitted resume landed me a better job, for more money at a different company. I handed in my 5 minutes notice and walked. They wanted 2 weeks... The best [art was I don't even need to list it on a resume, since I was still employed by the Navy.
 
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: force majeure on September 18, 2015, 05:16:23 AM
A guy I worked with, was in the firm for 10 years. He wore the same sweater everyday, always brought in his lunch and just did his job, never spoke to anyone voluntarily. He left the firm this summer aged 35 and someone heard he was living in Bali. That sounds like a plan, there's tons of beachs that nobody goes to, you can rent for $200 a month near Ubud. I would be nervous in a pace like that, like to keep my head on my shoulders, and dont like wearing an orange jumpsuit. Anyway, we heard he was now teaching English and living near the beach, and that he had about 1M in index funds stashed away. Yes, he worked in technology. Hey, its always the IT guys!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Shane on September 18, 2015, 06:35:19 PM
A guy I worked with, was in the firm for 10 years. He wore the same sweater everyday, always brought in his lunch and just did his job, never spoke to anyone voluntarily. He left the firm this summer aged 35 and someone heard he was living in Bali. That sounds like a plan, there's tons of beachs that nobody goes to, you can rent for $200 a month near Ubud. I would be nervous in a pace like that, like to keep my head on my shoulders, and dont like wearing an orange jumpsuit. Anyway, we heard he was now teaching English and living near the beach, and that he had about 1M in index funds stashed away. Yes, he worked in technology. Hey, its always the IT guys!

Maybe he's here on this forum...
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Kriegsspiel on September 18, 2015, 07:10:57 PM
Anyone see the FU story told in front of an international audience? 33 year old US Open women's tennis winner Flavia Pennetta retires right after accepting the winning trophy and on international TV! Well, she didn't really say FU, but it was a grand retirement speech.

Audio on retiring starts around 1:30:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q1Lol_lkdto

An article describing her thoughts on retiring:
http://news.yahoo.com/flavia-pennetta-wins-us-open-title-210147552--ten.html;_ylt=A0LEV7kHH_pV0wsAV4MnnIlQ;_ylu=X3oDMTEzcnMxdjY1BGNvbG8DYmYxBHBvcwM4BHZ0aWQDRkZSQTAxXzEEc2VjA3Ny

Excerpts:
"With this winning today, my life is perfect," Pennetta said.
"I don't know what I like to do, so I have to discover everything," she said. "It's a new life for me.
"Sometimes we are more scared to take the decision because we don't know what we like or what we're going to do after, how is going to be the life.
"But I think it's going to be a pretty good life. I did everything that I expected.
"And more. Much more."

This is a good link for her interview (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YT3L6iEK7BQ), starts at 2:00. It sounds like she just got worn down, "Sometimes it's getting hard for me to compete. This is the important point: when you're on the court, and you have to play 24 weeks a year, you have to fight every week. And if you don't fight every week like I fought today, it's going to be bad.... and I don't feel like I have this power anymore."
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: golfreak12 on September 18, 2015, 08:56:10 PM
A guy I worked with, was in the firm for 10 years. He wore the same sweater everyday, always brought in his lunch and just did his job, never spoke to anyone voluntarily. He left the firm this summer aged 35 and someone heard he was living in Bali. That sounds like a plan, there's tons of beachs that nobody goes to, you can rent for $200 a month near Ubud. I would be nervous in a pace like that, like to keep my head on my shoulders, and dont like wearing an orange jumpsuit. Anyway, we heard he was now teaching English and living near the beach, and that he had about 1M in index funds stashed away. Yes, he worked in technology. Hey, its always the IT guys!

We went to Bali for our honeymoon.
People there were very friendly and I never felt at any time that I was unsafe.
Of course again, I was probably in a touristy area and doesn't know better.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Gyosho on September 19, 2015, 09:42:51 PM
FU money is the greatest! As a previous post says, they can't MAKE you do anything at work, especially when you can leave at any time.

We had an "emergency" one weekend at work and my boss freaked out and started texting me at midnight on a Friday night! I was NOT ON CALL that weekend so I just turned off my phone. He later texted a mutual acquaintance and asked her to track me down! She started leaving me voice mail as well. (WTF?) I ignored both of them until the next afternoon, when I was READY to take the time to get back to him.

And I felt fine doing this because with my FU money I can leave at any time. They need me more than I need them (obviously!)

In the meantime, manager finally realized I was "not available" and got the scheduled on call person to deal with the emergency. By the time I answered him the emergency was mostly resolved and they didn't really need me.

Why was he calling me in the first place? I don't know. Narcissistic entitlement?

Someone once gave me a very useful mantra for these situations - "Don't make your problem my problem."
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: badger1988 on September 20, 2015, 08:53:26 PM
Watching football tonight, and got to thinking...Barry Sanders' retirement was an epic FU money story. Arguably the best running back ever to play in the NFL, and he retired in his prime because he couldn't stand to play another year for the Lions, and they refused to let him go to a different team:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Barry_Sanders (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Barry_Sanders)

"Averaging over 1,500 rushing yards per season, Sanders left the game just 1,457 yards short of being first place on the list for the NFL all-time rushing record at that time."

"He left football healthy, having gained 15,269 rushing yards, 2,921 receiving yards, and 109 touchdowns (99 rushing and 10 receiving). He retired within striking distance of Walter Payton's career rushing mark of 16,726 yards."

"Sanders' retirement came somewhat unexpectedly and was a matter of controversy. Two years earlier, Sanders had renewed his contract with the Lions for $35.4 million over six years with an $11 million signing bonus. The Lions demanded that he return $5.5 million of the bonus. Sanders refused, and the Lions sued. On February 15, 2000, an arbitrator ruled that Sanders had to immediately repay $1.833 million (a sixth of the bonus), with the remaining bonus to be repaid over each of the three years Sanders had left on the contract provided he stayed retired. Before the ruling, Sanders offered to pay back the entire $5.5 million in return for his release from the team."

"Several years after retirement, with repeated refusals to discuss the abruptness of it, Sanders finally admitted that the culture of losing in the Lions' organization was too much to deal with, even though he said that he could still play and that Detroit had made the playoffs in five of his ten seasons."
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: plainjane on September 21, 2015, 05:48:56 AM
Standing up for yourself from the beginning by setting appropriate boundaries and expectations means you never reach an epic "FU, I quit" situation in the first place.
This exactly. If you're not willing to set boundaries, expect to be pushed until you set them. Sometimes it will mean getting fired, but if you got fired because they have unrealistic expectations, fuck 'em.

It's a lot easier to set those boundaries if you have FU money though - or at least a decent EF.  If you have responsibilities and no EF/buffer, it's a lot harder to put things at risk.  It doesn't make for an _epic_ FU story, but being fired due to setting boundaries because you have the buffer to cope with the consequences is actually an FU story too. :)
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: MichikoMustache on September 22, 2015, 01:33:44 AM
I taught one year of school when I was fresh out of college. It was one of the worst periods of my life as I was young, inexperienced, our state school systems sucks and I had 4 different principals in 6 months. I lived at home that year and saved all my money. At the end of the year I quit to travel the world for 3 months. My teacher friends were incredulous--I only needed one more year for "tenure"!

I love teaching and I substitute quite a bit. I've been a sub for for 5 years now. Every year I get asked to teach full-time and because of my FU money, I don't even hesitate saying NO. I love being in the classroom, teaching the kids, and walking away every day from the drama of working for the Department of Education in the People's Republic of Hawaii. I also only sub for teachers I like and respect and who leave me great sub plans.

FU money allows me to continue to love to teach!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: purplish on September 22, 2015, 07:31:05 PM
I feel like I have several FU stories, I guess I've had a lot of jobs lol. 

1) I once had an office job, which was going fine until the guy the boss would always dump on and pick on, quit.  It then became ME to be the one she took her stress out on.  She would yell at me in front of coworkers, be all pissy about anything little thing I didn't do perfectly... the thing that sucked is that the more she nitpicked, the more nervous I got about doing things perfect, which meant I made more mistakes from being stressed!  She was so rude and negative towards me I lost a few pounds from not eating enough, due to the constant stress.  She even told me a coworker didn't like me, so unprofessional (I had minimal contact with this coworker and never had an issue, I'm pretty sure she made it up to push me around).  Unfortunately this negativity I think affected everyone, as all the coworkers were catty and always seemed in a bad mood, they all seemed stuck and unhappy.  Finally I said screw this, I quit and began a Masters program, began bartending part time, and lived off interest from the stache.  Felt SO much better!! 

2) Was at my old job for years, everything going fine.  They hired this awful manager though, who you could never tell if she liked you or hated you, it was like walking on eggshells.  I began having lots of problems with her.  I'd always had a close relationship with the boss, however suddenly she began refusing to let me communicate with the boss at all, especially in regards to her refusing me things the boss had promised (pay, hours).  She even had to "speak to me" after I asked my boss for a promotion... which the boss said she was happy about, and impressed that I'd asked.  There was also one time I saw the battery light was flashing on the thermostat.  I figured I would be helpful and make sure no one got cold, so I told maintenance about it.  Well wouldn't you know, I got spoken too AGAIN.... because apparently I overstepped her authority lol.  Over a battery!  She also changed my job responsibilities without telling the boss, and then was weird about it when I asked when I would get them back.  Eventually she ended up getting in trouble with the boss, because who'd have guessed it... the responsibilities that had been taken from me, didn't get given to anyone!  Way to drop the ball!    The last straw was that after I had asked about the promotion, she told me I couldn't have that promotion because a Masters wasn't enough for that position.  She then ended up putting someone with a BACHELORS LEVEL IN IT!!  I ended up giving my notice, and being super honest in the "exit interview" about the things she was doing, including her changing my job responsibilities.  Recently I found out she was fired within weeks of me quitting.  I'd like to think I had a hand in that ;)  I did have another job lined up, but took a week vacation in between cause I felt like it.

3) The next job I had, that boss had no clue what he was doing.  He was passive aggressive, for example telling me he was unhappy that I did something wrong.... a month ago, my 2nd day on the job.  And he had given me no indication at the time whatsoever that it was something he had even wanted me to do, he had wanted me to just magically know.  He  then, after a month of being there, decided he wanted to change my position and title because he wanted to restructure how we were set up.  I was pretty pissed because they had JUST hired me, and I would NOT have accepted the position had they had the new job listed!  I felt scammed. When I asked what if I didn't accept this new position, his response was "Well, then that would be sad, we would have to hire someone else instead".  I wanted to say fine and quit right then and there, but I decided to say ok for the time being and try it out, while I looked for better jobs.  He continued having lots of problems with the staff, talking down to them, having awful communication (as with me, getting mad that they didn't do things he never told them to do).  I found something else a couple months later, and gave my 2 weeks.  He tried to guilt trip me saying I really should be giving a month notice....um too bad!!  Purposely gave myself a 2 1/2 week vacation in between jobs, using the time to hang out with friends, go to the beach, and go to another country.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: happy on September 23, 2015, 04:44:41 AM
Whats better than 1 FU story: a trilogy!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: seanc0x0 on September 23, 2015, 09:07:18 AM
If there's anything to be learned on the other side (the F-ee, as it were), it's the truth of the saying "People don't leave companies, they leave managers."

I had a totally non-epic FU money story recently.  I'm currently doing a job that I don't care for after having been pushed into the position when they couldn't fill it externally.  I was told "You can apply for this job, or you can do it in addition to your old job. If you apply you'll get a raise."    I wasn't in a position financially to push back, so I took it, even though I really wanted to tell them no.

It had the potential to be interesting, but after a year I've found it not suited to my interests at all. So about a month ago, I had my annual performance review where we discuss goals.  I decided to take a chance and said "I want to move into a different field, I find this one boring."  I figured I'd get a bit of resistance, and I did, but eventually I managed to get them to agree to let me start training in the new field. I made it clear that I didn't really want to leave the organization, but would if I kept being pigeonholed in the area I don't like.

I have already had some discussions with the managers in the new area and they're looking for someone, so there's a good chance that I'll be moving to that area in the next few months.

A couple of years ago, I would have just kept my head down, and done the thing I hate in order to preserve my job and the fully over-allocated paycheque that it provides.  Now, I'm comfortable enough with the stash to take a few risks.

So it's nothing like some of these amazing stories, but I'm pretty happy about it.

Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Shane on September 23, 2015, 09:49:35 AM
If there's anything to be learned on the other side (the F-ee, as it were), it's the truth of the saying "People don't leave companies, they leave managers."

I had a totally non-epic FU money story recently.  I'm currently doing a job that I don't care for after having been pushed into the position when they couldn't fill it externally.  I was told "You can apply for this job, or you can do it in addition to your old job. If you apply you'll get a raise."    I wasn't in a position financially to push back, so I took it, even though I really wanted to tell them no.

It had the potential to be interesting, but after a year I've found it not suited to my interests at all. So about a month ago, I had my annual performance review where we discuss goals.  I decided to take a chance and said "I want to move into a different field, I find this one boring."  I figured I'd get a bit of resistance, and I did, but eventually I managed to get them to agree to let me start training in the new field. I made it clear that I didn't really want to leave the organization, but would if I kept being pigeonholed in the area I don't like.

I have already had some discussions with the managers in the new area and they're looking for someone, so there's a good chance that I'll be moving to that area in the next few months.

A couple of years ago, I would have just kept my head down, and done the thing I hate in order to preserve my job and the fully over-allocated paycheque that it provides.  Now, I'm comfortable enough with the stash to take a few risks.

So it's nothing like some of these amazing stories, but I'm pretty happy about it.

Congratulations!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Kitsune on September 23, 2015, 10:13:01 AM
Perfect example of the subtle use of FU money: my husband is on the phone with his boss as I type. Apparently they want to change his job description to require availability outside of business hours (basically be available from 6am to 11pm, every day)

We have a family, and kids, and he's a good dad who values actually being present for his kids for dinner and evenings and the like, and we just built a house so our 'stash isn't as good as it could be but, y'know what? It ain't bad. Worst-case scenario? My salary (at 4 days/week), plus unemployment for him, STILL gives us enough to maintain our current quality of life and add to our 'stash. (If we were on my salary alone, we'd need an extra 600$/month to make ends meet... which, let's face it, basic consulting work from either of us would cover, or an under-the-table farm job, which is something he enjoys...)

Basically: we don't need the money badly enough to sacrifice family time and time with our kid. So: it's not happening.

The advantage of FU money isn't in saying FU, it's in being able to walk into that meeting and suggest alternative options,  instead of feeling like you need to keep your head down and swallow sh*t to keep the job you feel like you desperately need...
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: okits on September 23, 2015, 10:33:52 AM
Perfect example of the subtle use of FU money: my husband is on the phone with his boss as I type. Apparently they want to change his job description to require availability outside of business hours (basically be available from 6am to 11pm, every day)

We have a family, and kids, and he's a good dad who values actually being present for his kids for dinner and evenings and the like, and we just built a house so our 'stash isn't as good as it could be but, y'know what? It ain't bad. Worst-case scenario? My salary (at 4 days/week), plus unemployment for him, STILL gives us enough to maintain our current quality of life and add to our 'stash. (If we were on my salary alone, we'd need an extra 600$/month to make ends meet... which, let's face it, basic consulting work from either of us would cover, or an under-the-table farm job, which is something he enjoys...)

Basically: we don't need the money badly enough to sacrifice family time and time with our kid. So: it's not happening.

The advantage of FU money isn't in saying FU, it's in being able to walk into that meeting and suggest alternative options,  instead of feeling like you need to keep your head down and swallow sh*t to keep the job you feel like you desperately need...

Nice going.  And agree with what FU Money means. Goes right along with the saying "life is like a shit sandwich. The more bread you have, the less shit you have to eat." 
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Shane on September 23, 2015, 10:45:32 AM
It's surprising to me how many workers give even unreasonable/unpleasant employers the courtesy of 2 weeks or more notice that they're quitting. I realize this is a custom in our society, but it seems kind of one sided to me. Obviously, if you have a good relationship with your manager(s) and your coworkers, giving them notice that you're planning to leave is the polite thing to do. For people who work at companies that suck and have managers that are real dickheads, why give them any notice at all that you're going to quit? Self interest is one reason, obviously. Employees want to get a good recommendation when they apply for future jobs. But when a company fires a worker they rarely give the worker any notice. Most often I've heard of workers being totally blindsided and surprised by someone from HR who takes away the worker's keys and has a security guard escort the worker off of the property. There's no time for the employee to plan ahead, look for another job, save up money, etc.

My question is, why don't companies have to worry about getting a good recommendation from their former employees just as much as employees worry about what their former employers will say about them? Maybe it exists already, but if not, maybe we need an online forum where former employees can post evaluations of companies they have worked for. If many former workers gave a company/manager a bad recommendation, people would stop applying for jobs at that company, the company would be forced to raise wages and/or improve working conditions, or else nobody would apply to work for them anymore...   
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: RWD on September 23, 2015, 10:53:36 AM
Maybe it exists already, but if not, maybe we need an online forum where former employees can post evaluations of companies they have worked for. If many former workers gave a company/manager a bad recommendation, people would stop applying for jobs at that company, the company would be forced to raise wages and/or improve working conditions, or else nobody would apply to work for them anymore...   

There is Glassdoor.com (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Glassdoor), but I think you have to make an account to see everything.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: seanc0x0 on September 23, 2015, 11:45:58 AM


I have already had some discussions with the managers in the new area and they're looking for someone, so there's a good chance that I'll be moving to that area in the next few months.


Congratulations!

Thanks!  Not two hours after writing that I got an offer letter for the new position.  It's been a good day and it's not even lunch!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: trailrated on September 23, 2015, 11:48:57 AM


I have already had some discussions with the managers in the new area and they're looking for someone, so there's a good chance that I'll be moving to that area in the next few months.


Congratulations!

Thanks!  Not two hours after writing that I got an offer letter for the new position.  It's been a good day and it's not even lunch!

Cheers!!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: cripzychiken on September 23, 2015, 11:49:36 AM
My question is, why don't companies have to worry about getting a good recommendation from their former employees just as much as employees worry about what their former employers will say about them? Maybe it exists already, but if not, maybe we need an online forum where former employees can post evaluations of companies they have worked for. If many former workers gave a company/manager a bad recommendation, people would stop applying for jobs at that company, the company would be forced to raise wages and/or improve working conditions, or else nobody would apply to work for them anymore...   

I think it's a mix of people just need jobs and will take anything or they feel like they are the special snowflake that will make everything perfect.  The people who are realistic just know that they will need a higher $$$ to deal with the extra BS that such a job will bring.

The other issue is even places like glassdoor, not everyone uses and it becomes a lot of the "you only post when you want to bitch" that a lot of yelp is covered with.  People with normal experiences don't really post anything.  So it's hard to tell if something is good or bad since you have so few reviews to weigh something against.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: jlajr on September 24, 2015, 01:20:56 AM
Regarding giving notice, I feel fortunate to work (for the second time now) for a company that provides two months' notice, after a year of working. The flip side of that coin is that I also have to give them two months' notice. Potential employers are not too happy about it. I explain that when a company offers to provide two months' notice, I happily agree...

In my country, BTW, the law states that the notice after one year in a salaried position is one month, both ways. I've been told that the two month's notice in my employment agreement is not actually enforceable.

Also, even before I found MMM and started building up my stash, I would try to explain to coworkers and friends that my feelings about a manager or employer are just as important as their feelings about me. We are all valuable commodities, and I try not to work for any manager or at any company that does not appreciate that value. That's why I'm looking around right now; and why I did not recommend anyone send in their resume for a position on my team at a former company.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: BlueHouse on September 24, 2015, 05:46:11 AM

My question is, why don't companies have to worry about getting a good recommendation from their former employees just as much as employees worry about what their former employers will say about them? Maybe it exists already, but if not, maybe we need an online forum where former employees can post evaluations of companies they have worked for. If many former workers gave a company/manager a bad recommendation, people would stop applying for jobs at that company, the company would be forced to raise wages and/or improve working conditions, or else nobody would apply to work for them anymore...   
Actually, when people are escorted away from the workplace after giving notice, it's usually because of morale, safety, securing company assets, ensuring the employee doesn't take proprietary info or customer lists, or just generally keeping someone who is going off to greener pastures from telling the other employees how great life on the outside will be.
But that doesn't mean the employee who was walked out didn't get two weeks of pay. . They almost always do and in every company I've ever worked in, we just say, thanks for the notice, you'll stay on the books for the remainder of your time, but don't bother coming into the office. It's just not productive to have that situation in the office in some cases.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: cripzychiken on September 24, 2015, 06:58:38 AM

My question is, why don't companies have to worry about getting a good recommendation from their former employees just as much as employees worry about what their former employers will say about them? Maybe it exists already, but if not, maybe we need an online forum where former employees can post evaluations of companies they have worked for. If many former workers gave a company/manager a bad recommendation, people would stop applying for jobs at that company, the company would be forced to raise wages and/or improve working conditions, or else nobody would apply to work for them anymore...   
Actually, when people are escorted away from the workplace after giving notice, it's usually because of morale, safety, securing company assets, ensuring the employee doesn't take proprietary info or customer lists, or just generally keeping someone who is going off to greener pastures from telling the other employees how great life on the outside will be.
But that doesn't mean the employee who was walked out didn't get two weeks of pay. . They almost always do and in every company I've ever worked in, we just say, thanks for the notice, you'll stay on the books for the remainder of your time, but don't bother coming into the office. It's just not productive to have that situation in the office in some cases.

It's strictly security and wanting to control what it is you remove from your desk.  I actually had someone go through a datebook/planner and rip out 3 or 4 pages that he felt contained "too much information".  Yeah, I'll really be able to sell the fact that there was a meeting on a project 4 months ago to the Chinese, that is the sort of info they want.

As for pay - if you give notice and then get walked - you get paid.  But if they let you go/fire you, you rarely get 2 weeks paid (outside of cashing your vacation).  At least in my experiences.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: AZDude on September 24, 2015, 11:43:41 AM
Only one time have I left a company and been walked out that day, and that was at a company that did payroll processing, so not really surprising. It was not even hostile or anything, just a "oh, you are leaving, OK, go say goodbye to everyone and we will walk you out". I still got paid for the two weeks. It actually raised my respect for the company the way I was treated to a two week paid vacation.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: iamlittlehedgehog on September 24, 2015, 01:18:17 PM
No necessarily a FU story but...DH and I have been scraping by for a while. We finally have enough saved for me to quit my job and go back to school full time. I give notice in 276 days and counting. I fantasize about that conversation when the work day gets stressful.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: nobodyspecial on September 25, 2015, 09:15:24 AM
I think I have the opposite of one-more-year (perhaps this should be in the MM people problems)

Love the job, love the technical challenges but in a meeting today discussing the next 3-5 years of growth projections and the $Bn valuation they are busy dreaming about all I can think of is; I don't care - I can leave today and live like a grad student, I can do 2more years and live comfortably for ever. I could probably leave sooner if I could persuade my wife that we can live off savings.


Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: mtn on September 25, 2015, 09:32:29 AM
I think I have the opposite of one-more-year (perhaps this should be in the MM people problems)

Love the job, love the technical challenges but in a meeting today discussing the next 3-5 years of growth projections and the $Bn valuation they are busy dreaming about all I can think of is; I don't care - I can leave today and live like a grad student, I can do 2more years and live comfortably for ever. I could probably leave sooner if I could persuade my wife that we can live off savings.

I feel like as soon as you start feeling either "one more year" or what you are describing, you need to put in a hard line on 3 dates:
Date 1: The date that you can live in an efficiency apartment forever
Date 2: The date that you can keep up your current lifestyle without any changes
Date 3: The date that you can improve your current lifestyle.

Aim to retire at Date 2. If you miss it, when you hit date 3, you're out no matter what.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Threshkin on September 25, 2015, 10:04:23 AM
I think I have the opposite of one-more-year (perhaps this should be in the MM people problems)

Love the job, love the technical challenges but in a meeting today discussing the next 3-5 years of growth projections and the $Bn valuation they are busy dreaming about all I can think of is; I don't care - I can leave today and live like a grad student, I can do 2more years and live comfortably for ever. I could probably leave sooner if I could persuade my wife that we can live off savings.

I feel like as soon as you start feeling either "one more year" or what you are describing, you need to put in a hard line on 3 dates:
Date 1: The date that you can live in an efficiency apartment forever
Date 2: The date that you can keep up your current lifestyle without any changes
Date 3: The date that you can improve your current lifestyle.

Aim to retire at Date 2. If you miss it, when you hit date 3, you're out no matter what.

mtn, the trap with this is that #3 is open ended.  How much "improvement" is enough?  An extra $10/month, an extra $1,000, more?
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: zephyr911 on September 25, 2015, 11:16:59 AM
And I'm not sure exactly how, but Glassdoor can be manipulated by the company as well. My former (toxic) workplace has pretty high ratings due to a high percentage of what, to someone who has worked there, are obviously fake positive reviews. Especially telling is the fact that a genuine, bad review gets posted, and then shortly thereafter a whole bunch of glowing reviews magically get posted within about a week. I have not bothered to review the company for this reason. They are I'm sure trying to protect their image as they are always hiring a ton (with growth plus massive turnover, they have to be!) and also have been getting their story out in the press a lot, wouldn't do to have it so easy to search for reviews that say how awful it is to work there.
Is their stock ticker AMZN? lol
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: mtn on September 25, 2015, 12:10:05 PM
I think I have the opposite of one-more-year (perhaps this should be in the MM people problems)

Love the job, love the technical challenges but in a meeting today discussing the next 3-5 years of growth projections and the $Bn valuation they are busy dreaming about all I can think of is; I don't care - I can leave today and live like a grad student, I can do 2more years and live comfortably for ever. I could probably leave sooner if I could persuade my wife that we can live off savings.

I feel like as soon as you start feeling either "one more year" or what you are describing, you need to put in a hard line on 3 dates:
Date 1: The date that you can live in an efficiency apartment forever
Date 2: The date that you can keep up your current lifestyle without any changes
Date 3: The date that you can improve your current lifestyle.

Aim to retire at Date 2. If you miss it, when you hit date 3, you're out no matter what.

mtn, the trap with this is that #3 is open ended.  How much "improvement" is enough?  An extra $10/month, an extra $1,000, more?

Open ended, yeah, but probably easily determined for most people.

For me, it is the amount to own/buy a small house or apartment in Chicagoland and a vacation house in the UP, 4 trips every year, a fun car, a fishing boat, speed boat, and maybe 20 rounds of golf a year. How much is necessary for that? Depending on the housing situation with the rent/owning/buying, probably about $100-$150k a year. 
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Rollin on September 25, 2015, 12:15:43 PM
I think I have the opposite of one-more-year (perhaps this should be in the MM people problems)

Love the job, love the technical challenges but in a meeting today discussing the next 3-5 years of growth projections and the $Bn valuation they are busy dreaming about all I can think of is; I don't care - I can leave today and live like a grad student, I can do 2more years and live comfortably for ever. I could probably leave sooner if I could persuade my wife that we can live off savings.
nbs - I'm in the same boat.  Got new people with some really great energy and ideas, but hey, guess what - I'm gone come 4/16/16.  No one knows this yet though so it can feel odd when they talk about giving me a promotion and what my role will be.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Rollin on September 25, 2015, 12:18:54 PM
I think I have the opposite of one-more-year (perhaps this should be in the MM people problems)

Love the job, love the technical challenges but in a meeting today discussing the next 3-5 years of growth projections and the $Bn valuation they are busy dreaming about all I can think of is; I don't care - I can leave today and live like a grad student, I can do 2more years and live comfortably for ever. I could probably leave sooner if I could persuade my wife that we can live off savings.

I feel like as soon as you start feeling either "one more year" or what you are describing, you need to put in a hard line on 3 dates:
Date 1: The date that you can live in an efficiency apartment forever
Date 2: The date that you can keep up your current lifestyle without any changes
Date 3: The date that you can improve your current lifestyle.

Aim to retire at Date 2. If you miss it, when you hit date 3, you're out no matter what.

mtn, the trap with this is that #3 is open ended.  How much "improvement" is enough?  An extra $10/month, an extra $1,000, more?

Open ended, yeah, but probably easily determined for most people.

For me, it is the amount to own/buy a small house or apartment in Chicagoland and a vacation house in the UP, 4 trips every year, a fun car, a fishing boat, speed boat, and maybe 20 rounds of golf a year. How much is necessary for that? Depending on the housing situation with the rent/owning/buying, probably about $100-$150k a year.

However, going to the UP you need to figure a line item for lotsa beeyer, ya no.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: StetsTerhune on September 25, 2015, 12:46:35 PM
I love love love this thread, I must've missed it when it was first here, and have been reading it slowly all the way through since its "revival."

My big take-away from this, is that I don't have any interesting FU money stories, precisely because I have pretty much always had FU money and/or an FU resume. The fact that I'm just generally a malcontent, and the fact that I have FU money and the skills to easily get a new job means that I don't put up with anything 1/100th as bad as some of the stories on here.

I've changed jobs 4 times, always because my manager has done something mildly annoying to me. I just thought to myself, "I'll bet I can find something better than this" and gone back to my desk and updated my resume.  My only issue in life is that my current gig is so sweet that I know I won't find a job this good again. So I put up with the mild annoyance of an over-eager, %$%@ of a manager. Pretty much the opposite of an FU money story, but in a good way
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: zephyr911 on September 25, 2015, 01:13:35 PM
I've never had FU money in my life, because I'm a dumbass. I've only ever managed to accumulate anything by pushing money to places where I can't touch it, as much as possible. Even after a year and a half reading here, and saving tons, my savings "strategy" pretty much amounts to keeping myself cash-poor so I don't have to really become a badass about spending.
I gather that for many people, paying off all consumer debt and building up a cash cushion is an early baby step on the road to FIRE. For me, investment had to come first and those two things will come last.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: plainjane on September 25, 2015, 01:39:09 PM
If this thread isn't enough for you - http://www.askamanager.org/2015/09/tell-us-your-straw-that-broke-the-camels-back-moment-with-your-job.html#comments has a lot of comments now.  Not quite from the FU money perspective, but still a fair amount of epic FU stories.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: The Pigeon on September 25, 2015, 03:32:15 PM
If this thread isn't enough for you - http://www.askamanager.org/2015/09/tell-us-your-straw-that-broke-the-camels-back-moment-with-your-job.html#comments has a lot of comments now.  Not quite from the FU money perspective, but still a fair amount of epic FU stories.

Wow. That site offers so many awful employee-oppression / stupid rule stories. OMG, employees have take so much shit, and have to bear it with a fake smile whilst withering inside. I'm not sorry to be through with that BS! Ugh!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Middlesbrough on September 25, 2015, 05:59:35 PM
I've never had FU money in my life, because I'm a dumbass. I've only ever managed to accumulate anything by pushing money to places where I can't touch it, as much as possible. Even after a year and a half reading here, and saving tons, my savings "strategy" pretty much amounts to keeping myself cash-poor so I don't have to really become a badass about spending.
I gather that for many people, paying off all consumer debt and building up a cash cushion is an early baby step on the road to FIRE. For me, investment had to come first and those two things will come last.
I haven't had to say FU either and I am right there with you. Having cash to me means I did something wrong. Gotta shove money in all the tax advantage holes.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: FLA on September 25, 2015, 09:09:34 PM
my FU story:  stupidly, I invested well in index funds, not so well in husbands. When I went part time for child rearing, he decided we will put our 403B money in his acct and try to live off my tiny salary (yes, I know, you don't have to say it, I was 26 and had milk brain).  Fast forward, very bad man, I left. His lawyer fought mine so hard on that 403B money, mine saying I should get what I would've had had I not been part-time.  They argued his account, his money.  My lawyer said expect to get maybe 20k if lucky. The judge reads it, interprets it his own way from our divorce decree and I got 86k.  I looked at my lawyer, she was shocked. 

His attorney demanded to see the math, the divorce decree was correct, this was my right and he had agreed to it and must follow it. It was all money I had earned that he transferred to his account or money I would've contributed when working full time plus interest.   Ex stood up slammed his chair and stomped out of the courtroom, only to be led back in by the bailiff,  judge said, "you get up, when I tell you to get up. Any more nonsense and you will be cited for contempt of court and spend a night in jail."  Then he was reading my attorney's response to the petition again, in which she told of several times over the course of our marriage, my ex forged my signature on 403b docs during market turn downs, when he would move everything to cash. I happened to find out accidentally. The judge said, "you forged your wife's signature to gain control of her 403b without telling her?  How many times?  1? 3? 10?  Guess how many are legal-ZERO! This is disgusting! I am standing up now, you may as well, I am leaving and then you may leave.  We clear here?"

money is the only way to hurt my ex, even when it's me taking back my money.  He had been humiliated in court.  He got caught doing illegal things, he never thought he would lose, for the first and last time, I finally for once "got him".  Best FU money story in my book.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: markbike528CBX on September 27, 2015, 12:41:45 AM
If this thread isn't enough for you - http://www.askamanager.org/2015/09/tell-us-your-straw-that-broke-the-camels-back-moment-with-your-job.html#comments has a lot of comments now.  Not quite from the FU money perspective, but still a fair amount of epic FU stories.

Read the entire thread to date.    I'm loath to say it,  but OMFG!   
I feel so much better about my minor life difficulties by comparision to the examples presented.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: zephyr911 on September 27, 2015, 05:34:27 PM
If this thread isn't enough for you - http://www.askamanager.org/2015/09/tell-us-your-straw-that-broke-the-camels-back-moment-with-your-job.html#comments has a lot of comments now.  Not quite from the FU money perspective, but still a fair amount of epic FU stories.

Wow. That site offers so many awful employee-oppression / stupid rule stories. OMG, employees have take so much shit, and have to bear it with a fake smile whilst withering inside. I'm not sorry to be through with that BS! Ugh!
Probably not the intended result, but after reading a few dozen of those, I'm just amazed by how lucky I am to have the job I do, and wonder why I would ever want to leave. Hahaha
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: cerebus on September 28, 2015, 03:16:22 AM
my FU story:  stupidly, I invested well in index funds, not so well in husbands. When I went part time for child rearing, he decided we will put our 403B money in his acct and try to live off my tiny salary (yes, I know, you don't have to say it, I was 26 and had milk brain).  Fast forward, very bad man, I left. His lawyer fought mine so hard on that 403B money, mine saying I should get what I would've had had I not been part-time.  They argued his account, his money.  My lawyer said expect to get maybe 20k if lucky. The judge reads it, interprets it his own way from our divorce decree and I got 86k.  I looked at my lawyer, she was shocked. 

His attorney demanded to see the math, the divorce decree was correct, this was my right and he had agreed to it and must follow it. It was all money I had earned that he transferred to his account or money I would've contributed when working full time plus interest.   Ex stood up slammed his chair and stomped out of the courtroom, only to be led back in by the bailiff,  judge said, "you get up, when I tell you to get up. Any more nonsense and you will be cited for contempt of court and spend a night in jail."  Then he was reading my attorney's response to the petition again, in which she told of several times over the course of our marriage, my ex forged my signature on 403b docs during market turn downs, when he would move everything to cash. I happened to find out accidentally. The judge said, "you forged your wife's signature to gain control of her 403b without telling her?  How many times?  1? 3? 10?  Guess how many are legal-ZERO! This is disgusting! I am standing up now, you may as well, I am leaving and then you may leave.  We clear here?"

money is the only way to hurt my ex, even when it's me taking back my money.  He had been humiliated in court.  He got caught doing illegal things, he never thought he would lose, for the first and last time, I finally for once "got him".  Best FU money story in my book.

Awesome story.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Crabbie on September 28, 2015, 08:24:27 AM
A few years ago the company I was working for was under some seriously hard times financially. There was a layoff coming, a fairly significant portion of the company. I was safe for various reasons (technical lead, seniority, expertise, that kind of stuff), but we had a new hire on the team who had relocated from across the country who was going to be let go. I spoke to my manager and volunteered to be laid off instead. He's still working there, last I heard.


As a bonus, a few months later, I ended up landing a dream job at 3x my old salary.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: markbike528CBX on September 28, 2015, 08:49:01 AM
A few years ago the company I was working for was under some seriously hard times financially. There was a layoff coming, a fairly significant portion of the company. I was safe for various reasons (technical lead, seniority, expertise, that kind of stuff), but we had a new hire on the team who had relocated from across the country who was going to be let go. I spoke to my manager and volunteered to be laid off instead. He's still working there, last I heard.

As a bonus, a few months later, I ended up landing a dream job at 3x my old salary.

Nice to see others thinking along the same lines, and actually doing it.   
Two layoffs ago, I was contemplating volunteering to go, but was pointedly told by someone in-the-know that volunteering wasn't possible.   

Got blindsided by the last layoffs, where I definitely would have volunteered. 
The first I knew about it was one of my colleagues say "did [Markbike528CBX's mentoree] just get layed-off?".

Now having survivor guilt.  Accelerated the job/retirement hunt.   Not sure I could get 3x salary though.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: jlajr on September 28, 2015, 09:11:44 AM
A few years ago the company I was working for was under some seriously hard times financially. There was a layoff coming, a fairly significant portion of the company. I was safe for various reasons (technical lead, seniority, expertise, that kind of stuff), but we had a new hire on the team who had relocated from across the country who was going to be let go. I spoke to my manager and volunteered to be laid off instead. He's still working there, last I heard.


As a bonus, a few months later, I ended up landing a dream job at 3x my old salary.

Using FU money to do something good for someone else instead of saying FU... Wow. Respect.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: AZDude on September 28, 2015, 10:22:39 AM
A few years ago the company I was working for was under some seriously hard times financially. There was a layoff coming, a fairly significant portion of the company. I was safe for various reasons (technical lead, seniority, expertise, that kind of stuff), but we had a new hire on the team who had relocated from across the country who was going to be let go. I spoke to my manager and volunteered to be laid off instead. He's still working there, last I heard.


As a bonus, a few months later, I ended up landing a dream job at 3x my old salary.

Wow, nice job man.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: HairyUpperLip on September 28, 2015, 11:41:48 AM
wow, great thread.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Faraday on September 28, 2015, 02:37:38 PM
A few years ago the company I was working for was under some seriously hard times financially. There was a layoff coming, a fairly significant portion of the company. I was safe for various reasons (technical lead, seniority, expertise, that kind of stuff), but we had a new hire on the team who had relocated from across the country who was going to be let go. I spoke to my manager and volunteered to be laid off instead. He's still working there, last I heard.


As a bonus, a few months later, I ended up landing a dream job at 3x my old salary.

This is a perfect example of how important it can be to know the right time and way to LEAVE a job. This is a tiny tale with giant impact!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: MoonShadow on September 28, 2015, 06:25:10 PM
If this thread isn't enough for you - http://www.askamanager.org/2015/09/tell-us-your-straw-that-broke-the-camels-back-moment-with-your-job.html#comments has a lot of comments now.  Not quite from the FU money perspective, but still a fair amount of epic FU stories.

Wow. That site offers so many awful employee-oppression / stupid rule stories. OMG, employees have take so much shit, and have to bear it with a fake smile whilst withering inside. I'm not sorry to be through with that BS! Ugh!
Probably not the intended result, but after reading a few dozen of those, I'm just amazed by how lucky I am to have the job I do, and wonder why I would ever want to leave. Hahaha

Well, I have had the best job in the world for the past 10 years, but the writing is on the wall.  The parent company is selling off my division to a competitor, and management has already started acting like this is a season of Survivor.  Everyone is just waiting to see who gets voted off the island this week.  I'm not management, per se, so I think it will be a while before the new bosses get to cutting in my section; but I still want to be ready in case I need to pull a golden parachute of my own making.  Lord knows they aren't going to offer one.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: zephyr911 on September 28, 2015, 08:49:40 PM
Well, I have had the best job in the world for the past 10 years, but the writing is on the wall.  The parent company is selling off my division to a competitor, and management has already started acting like this is a season of Survivor.  Everyone is just waiting to see who gets voted off the island this week.  I'm not management, per se, so I think it will be a while before the new bosses get to cutting in my section; but I still want to be ready in case I need to pull a golden parachute of my own making.  Lord knows they aren't going to offer one.
Ooh. Keep your eyes open and be ready for anything!
I'm a fed, and even better, I'm not paid for by tax dollars, so I'd have to fuck up pretty hard to lose my job. But I'm stagnant here, uninterested in advancing, and my latest run of luck with leadership changes is bound to fail eventually. The next time the neverending game of Musical Officers drops a psycho micromanager on us, I need to have my shit in order.
And that's all before I even think about personal goals and dreams, which lie well outside the mission of the current organization, though I generally like my coworkers and the environment. Stupid idealism and shit.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: kaposzta on September 29, 2015, 06:08:08 AM
Great stories! Here's mine:

I had been working for 5.5 years at a giant multinational telecommunication company, in the last 2 years as a senior accountant. The salary was a joke. New junior accountants started to get higher salaries than the seniors, because the annual raise was so low. My teammates were awesome, the managers... not so awesome. The workload was huge, and it was bigger and bigger each year, each month. They were always happy with my work, but I got a new manager right after I became a senior accountant, and things got different.

I got many new tasks, including SAP testing (at night on weekends), coordinating others' work, etc. One of my idea saved countless of hours of work and saved us from making big mistakes, so it was a big contribution. I had voluntary overtimes, and I reached all my targets that were set at the beginning of the year. Then we got our usual annual review, and I got a very bad grade. I told my boss that I had reached all my targets. She replied that my targets had been defined by my previous manager, so she didn't know what my targets were. She added that the problem was my attitude. I mentioned her the (mostly voluntary) overtimes, the night shifts, the double (triple) workload that should be handled by two or three people, but she wasn't interested. She told me I should have obeyed her all the time (there was one time when I told that her idea is not viable - okay, the team was present, I made a mistake, it wasn't professional), and that (as a senior) I was responsible for a giant mistake of one of my co-workers. She added that I didn't hold any trainings (it was not my job, and I had sent many information emails instead), I wasn't proactive enough, and the best one: I should have been a role model (which was apparently the most important task of a senior accountant). I replied with a question: Shouldn't be the managers the role models? She remained silent for a few seconds (LOL), and told me that "yes, they should be". Anyway, I was so angry that I almost punched her in the face. I would never EVER hit a woman (I wouldn't hit anyone), but I was so close this time (I was literally blinded by anger, and totally lost control for a sec - it was quite frightening). Anyway, I remained silent, and supernaturally calm. My manager told me that this bad grade wouldn't affect me in any way, but she lied. I had to make humiliating home works and I didn't get a raise that year.

I told myself: why would I work so much if there's no benefit? So I decreased my 8 hour workday to 4-5. I heavily concentrated solely on my targets, and didn't give a crap about anything else. I was always smiling and showed a positive, proactive, friendly attitude (while I was thinking FU all). The outcome: I got a reward of excellence, and next year suddenly my work was "exceptional". My boss almost fell in love with me, and I slowly became indispensable.

Then I sent my CV to an ever bigger company, and they hired me instantly (+40% raise, the workplace was 10 minutes away (instead of 35 minutes)). Of course I quit. My boss was astonished and became a nervous wreck. When I told her I quit, she immediately started calling the big bosses to find a way to make me stay. I told her: "I would stay if you offered a 15% raise" She told me it's impossible. Then I signed the paper and gave it to her. I gave 1 month notice (it's the minimum in Hungary). I was in a middle of a project, they had to cancel it, because there was no-one who could have proceed with it. My teammeates and I were devastated, because we were all friends, but I had to make this move. I was happy to leave this terrible job, but I was also sad that I because of leaving my friends behind.

And the funny thing is that the new job was horrible, 6 months later I quit :) It's even funnier that I returned to the previous company, but to a different department. I'm only an accountant now, but I get more money than as a senior accountant :) I mostly enjoy what I do now, and I have plenty of free time to learn new things (Excel, VBA, etc.) during the day. The best thing is that my bosses (finally!) appreciate my skills and innovative ideas. I'm planning to work here until FIRE :)

So the process was:
Decent job, low salary and stupid/mean bosses --> "Hey, I have FU money!" --> Terrible job, excellent salary --> "Hey, I have FU money!" --> Excellent job with excellent bosses
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Pooperman on September 29, 2015, 06:37:26 AM
So, give people the finger 'till one hugs you?
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Dumb blonde on September 29, 2015, 08:39:00 AM
Not epic, but here's my story.  I was working freelance on a job. I was a manager to a small team, while I myself reported to 3 managers (!), who could not stand eachother and fought over who was responsible for me and my team. They all wanted control over my team. That's why they hired me: so none of them had control over my team.

The team I managed was great: nice, hard working people who had suffered under this management crisis for years. I didn't like the atmosphere and lost quite a bit of sleep, but I kept around so my team could just do their jobs. It paid well, I was working freelance after all. When I started this job my husband and me had just had a few miserable business years, so I could really use the money.

After about 9 months things got nasty. I had to fight off members of other teams who were trying to take over responsibilities from members of my team, obviously staged by their managers who were trying to take control. I told one of the employees (member of another team) how I felt about this kind of behaviour, that I did not like it and that it had to end. This obviously was not appreciated, and a meeting with my 3 managers was called. I was ready to quit at this point. I had slept bad for months, worked my ass off for my team while trying to keep my 3 managers satisfied, when all they did was fight.

One of the managers insisted that I told my side of the story, all ins and outs. So I did, I told them all what had happened, how I had to fight people off to keep my own team working happily, and I told them what their own teammembers had done trying to take over responsibilities from my team. After telling this, I was suddenly being accused of being the toxic factor. Where did I find the nerve to speak so low of their employees. They did not fire me. And I did not quit on the spot. I should have, but I was too flabbergasted about what had just happened. I stayed around for a few more months. I found replacement for my own position, but she quit after two months, while I was still there finishing up a project. On my last day one of the managers begged me to stay. I felt bad for my team leaving them, but I couldn't take it anymore. I did not have another job lined up, but I had saved up most of the money I had earned on this job so I  had enough money to last me for months. I found another job soon after this, so I never had to use the money.

A few months back the manager who asked me to stay called me again on my cell. I did not answer. He didn't leave a voicemail message.

Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: nobodyspecial on September 29, 2015, 08:47:29 AM
That's the point that your freelance rate suddenly goes up 500%

Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: regulator on September 29, 2015, 08:29:36 PM
I have heard some epic ones from burnt out Wall Streeters that were used and abused.  I think my favorite is a tossup between the guy who put a guppy in every radiator on the floor before he left (stinks out loud whenever the heat goes up) and the dude who dropped a "steamer" in his desk drawer, broke the key off in the lock, and marched out, never to be seen again.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: JoeBlow on September 29, 2015, 10:24:10 PM
I have heard some epic ones from burnt out Wall Streeters that were used and abused.  I think my favorite is a tossup between the guy who put a guppy in every radiator on the floor before he left (stinks out loud whenever the heat goes up) and the dude who dropped a "steamer" in his desk drawer, broke the key off in the lock, and marched out, never to be seen again.

Do you happen to have a link to that?  That would keep me entertained for hours.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: regulator on September 29, 2015, 10:28:00 PM
I have heard some epic ones from burnt out Wall Streeters that were used and abused.  I think my favorite is a tossup between the guy who put a guppy in every radiator on the floor before he left (stinks out loud whenever the heat goes up) and the dude who dropped a "steamer" in his desk drawer, broke the key off in the lock, and marched out, never to be seen again.

Do you happen to have a link to that?  That would keep me entertained for hours.

Sorry, this is all person to person.  Got to hear the tales by working in the trenches with the burnt out.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: cripzychiken on September 30, 2015, 06:21:39 AM

I told myself: why would I work so much if there's no benefit? So I decreased my 8 hour workday to 4-5. I heavily concentrated solely on my targets, and didn't give a crap about anything else. I was always smiling and showed a positive, proactive, friendly attitude (while I was thinking FU all). The outcome: I got a reward of excellence, and next year suddenly my work was "exceptional". My boss almost fell in love with me, and I slowly became indispensable.


Had I coworker who was about to retire and wanted to get a severance package during the next round of layoffs (a few months out) so he did the same thing.  Worked the bare minimum, walked out of meeting if anyone started to talk about anything that wasn't his exact job, refused to help anyone else if it wasn't required for his job.  But his job was done perfectly - since he had 8 hours a day to do it rather than his previous 3-4 hours (and 4-5 of other's peoples crap).

Ended up not getting laid off, but instead got an award for "ignoring the distractions of the work place" so he went to the ceremony they threw him and gave his notice to the CEO there (after he was handed his bonus check).
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: markbike528CBX on September 30, 2015, 10:13:34 AM
I've thought "The Wally Method" could back-fire.
 First time I've seen evidence of it doing so in such a big way.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: madisonengr on October 11, 2015, 10:41:24 PM
My story is having FU money provided a lever that I was able to use to get a 20% raise and overall stronger position at work a few years back.

At that point, I had 13 years of experience and many successful projects under my belt at my company. Although my work was well respected and I'd always received good reviews and slightly above average raises, because I had been there so long and what was happening with the outside market my salary was significantly lower than what the company would have had to pay someone to replace me.

I had pretty frank conversation with my boss about salary. He basically agreed that I should be paid the number I put forth, but he needed to get approval from up the chain. Initially I was optimistic that I would be receiving a raise within a few weeks.

But then nothing happened. My boss, who works in a different city, was kind of avoiding me and when I did see him always had excuses for the delays. He was actually employing the playbook our purchasing department uses when a supplier tries push through a price increase.

After about 2 months of this I had a brief and polite conversation with my boss just before Thanksgiving. I told him I was just looking for a yay or a nay on the raise. He was very deferential and apologized for the delays. I think at that point he first understood I really was going to leave if I didn't get the raise. And while I had been patiently waiting for the decision, there was a limit to my patience.

But in any case nothing changed. A few more weeks passed and I still did not receive an answer. I only got more excuses about decision makers being busy with other things, travel, etc. So around 6pm a few days before Christmas, I gave notice to my boss and explained that in the new year I was not willing to work for less than the number we had first discussed.

My boss was noticeably unsettled and asked me if I had another job lined up. I didn't. I informed him I'd just planned to spend 3 months skiing in Colorado and after that I'd come back home and decide what to do. I was serious. This was my plan. At that point I had a certain amount of freedom because I had about 20x my annual spend saved in a variety of assets.

My boss started giving me some BS about the company missing on some financial targets due to soft sales, etc.. I had suspected this might be coming and had prepped for it in advance -- I volleyed back at him key figures and statements from the annual report that was released a few months earlier (it's a publicly traded company) that painted a rosy picture. Overall earnings and free cash flow were strong and of course were absolutely huge numbers compared to what I was asking for.

At that point my boss and the company sprang into action, finally! By 8am the next morning the raise was authorized effective immediately and I even got a promoted title which I didn't ask for or really care about because I still had the same job responsibilities.

The only reason I was able to pull off this gambit is because of my FU stash. I doubt any of my peers would have been able to do this without having another job lined up. As a group, they generally have affinities for F250's, vacation cottages and oversized surburban houses on large lots.

Depending on what the stock market does and my happiness with my job at the time -  I should be giving my final, non-negotiable(!) notice in 2-6 years.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Shane on October 12, 2015, 11:08:53 AM
^
 l

Nice story. Thanks for sharing!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: frugalecon on October 13, 2015, 05:02:02 PM
My story is having FU money provided a lever that I was able to use to get a 20% raise...

The only reason I was able to pull off this gambit is because of my FU stash. I doubt any of my peers would have been able to do this without having another job lined up. As a group, they generally have affinities for F250's, vacation cottages and oversized surburban houses on large lots.

Depending on what the stock market does and my happiness with my job at the time -  I should be giving my final, non-negotiable(!) notice in 2-6 years.

This story makes me wonder if bosses take note of which of the underlings are stretched and have little leverage when they are thinking about who will get the real sh*t assignments. Is management that forward thinking?
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: atrex on October 13, 2015, 05:35:38 PM
This story makes me wonder if bosses take note of which of the underlings are stretched and have little leverage when they are thinking about who will get the real sh*t assignments. Is management that forward thinking?

Many do.  A very kind and awesome boss I had once noted that I seemed to get anxious easily when clients got upset.  When I responded that it made me worry about my job, he asked if I had stashed much away?  His concern was genuine and I never saw him try to take advantage of someone, but if he makes the connection between job anxiety and financial security, you can bet his more machiavellian counterparts do as well.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: happy on October 14, 2015, 05:34:25 AM
Yes I think this does happen.  In the past, I know I've seen management make decisions based on the fact that the employee has limited options, with an attitude of  "If they don't like it bad luck".
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Faraday on October 14, 2015, 08:33:48 AM
My story is having FU money provided a lever that I was able to use to get a 20% raise...
....
This story makes me wonder if bosses take note of which of the underlings are stretched and have little leverage when they are thinking about who will get the real sh*t assignments. Is management that forward thinking?

IMHO, it happens more purposefully in private or family-owned businesses but I believe it happens everywhere. I worked for one family-owned business where a family member kept track of that kind of information so it could be used when needed.

I grew up in a very rural, backwoods area where rules are often bent or broken depending on personal and business relationships. I have no doubt there are banks who would divulge financial information about employees to an employer if they were asked and if the employer did a lot of business with the bank. 
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: tallen on October 14, 2015, 11:16:22 AM
Some management knows who they can push and who they can't, others don't. My shop's general manager had to make the company owners stop dealing directly with employees a few years ago. They come out one time and wanted me to cut a corner to save money and make a deadline that also made it dangerous to do, I refused. They got real pissed and called the GM in from home to make me do it or fire me, he calmed them down (after much arguing) and got them to do it the right (safe) way, and told him ALL handling of employees has to go through him from now on (they where getting in a habit of coming out and pissing employees off, I was just the first one to tell them no). My boss actually thanked me for making a stand so that he could make that change. Took a year or two to stop getting dirty looks from them though lol
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: tallen on October 14, 2015, 11:24:05 AM
On the other hand it's rather amusing to see someone who thinks the place can't run without them try to make silly demands or think they can get away with bad conduct end up in the office begging to keep their job. It's not always management that's the bad guy.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Wilson Hall on October 14, 2015, 11:25:47 AM
This story makes me wonder if bosses take note of which of the underlings are stretched and have little leverage when they are thinking about who will get the real sh*t assignments. Is management that forward thinking?

Many do.  A very kind and awesome boss I had once noted that I seemed to get anxious easily when clients got upset.  When I responded that it made me worry about my job, he asked if I had stashed much away?  His concern was genuine and I never saw him try to take advantage of someone, but if he makes the connection between job anxiety and financial security, you can bet his more machiavellian counterparts do as well.

I've seen this happen several times: managers would give single parents heavier workload/crummier assignments/more attitude because they knew the employees couldn't simply up and walk away. An organization I worked for years ago was notorious for pushing people into "acting" management positions without extra pay until the position could be filled for real. Apparently it was legal for this to be done for up to a year. I asked a colleague why anyone would put up with this treatment, and she said that people with families to support and few opportunities to move into a better position elsewhere often had no choice. This solidified my determination to keep enough of an emergency fund to be able to walk away at any time.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Rezdent on October 14, 2015, 02:10:28 PM
My story is having FU money provided a lever that I was able to use to get a 20% raise...

The only reason I was able to pull off this gambit is because of my FU stash. I doubt any of my peers would have been able to do this without having another job lined up. As a group, they generally have affinities for F250's, vacation cottages and oversized surburban houses on large lots.

Depending on what the stock market does and my happiness with my job at the time -  I should be giving my final, non-negotiable(!) notice in 2-6 years.

This story makes me wonder if bosses take note of which of the underlings are stretched and have little leverage when they are thinking about who will get the real sh*t assignments. Is management that forward thinking?
I've seen this too, and it worked both ways; I had a job once where my less-experienced coworker kept getting assigned to overtime shifts even after I had repeatedly requested more overtime.  When I confronted the manager they told me that the coworker had children, and so needed the money more than I did...wtf?

Next round of layoffs, this coworker was spared in spite of less seniority and less productivity.  I believe they let some of us go because we were more likely to find good jobs.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: bzzzt on October 14, 2015, 06:38:14 PM
I've seen this too, and it worked both ways; I had a job once where my less-experienced coworker kept getting assigned to overtime shifts even after I had repeatedly requested more overtime.  When I confronted the manager they told me that the coworker had children, and so needed the money more than I did...wtf?

I've also seen that and it really sucked because some were under employed while the "guy with the family" was using it for stupid shit like terrazzo tile in his kitchen and a big SUV for this wife.

Just because someone "needs the money" doesn't mean it's for legitimate shit.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: asauer on October 15, 2015, 05:52:56 AM
I taught one year of school when I was fresh out of college. It was one of the worst periods of my life as I was young, inexperienced, our state school systems sucks and I had 4 different principals in 6 months. I lived at home that year and saved all my money. At the end of the year I quit to travel the world for 3 months. My teacher friends were incredulous--I only needed one more year for "tenure"!

I love teaching and I substitute quite a bit. I've been a sub for for 5 years now. Every year I get asked to teach full-time and because of my FU money, I don't even hesitate saying NO. I love being in the classroom, teaching the kids, and walking away every day from the drama of working for the Department of Education in the People's Republic of Hawaii. I also only sub for teachers I like and respect and who leave me great sub plans.

FU money allows me to continue to love to teach!

Right on! I love being a college adjunct for the same reason.  I get to go and teach and have a great time but I don't have to worry about budgets and political drama!  My department head has asked me to apply for a full-time role but I already have a job I like reasonably well that pays way more...soo...no.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: AmandaS1989 on October 15, 2015, 10:20:58 AM
I have read this thread over the course of two days and a fire has been lit. I am more determined than ever to stash away my own FU money because you never know what could happen.

I just need to pay these stupid CCs off first, but with the help of my tax refund coming up I will hopefully be CC-debt free by April or May of 2016! Then I can really start building that stash and paying down some student loans.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: RyanAtTanagra on October 30, 2015, 03:00:19 PM
Have another (small) epic FU story, along the lines of FU money not having to be about quitting, but just standing strong.  I was pulled into the CEOs office by my boss, which peaked my interest, as that never happens.  Apparently, our company is going to be moving the office across the country, and as I'm the head IT person, I was one of the first told since I'll need to help plan and coordinate things.  Relocation assistance will be offered to everyone.  So in front of the CEO my boss asks if I'd be interested in moving to X location.  I just say 'No.'  We look at each other for a while as he's not sure what to say.  'Why not?  Nice city, nice area, etc etc'.  'No thanks'.  Then he finally says 'well, telecommuting might also be an option for you'.  'Yea, thought that might be the case' (in my head, not out loud).  The CEO and CFO both have families in school here, I know they're sure as hell not moving across the country.  The place we're moving to is actually a really good location, I wouldn't mind moving there at all, but I was willing to call their bluff in order to not box myself.  And I have been thinking about finding another job that would let me telecommute so I can live anywhere, or be nomadic, so this might work out even better.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Pooperman on October 30, 2015, 04:19:29 PM
Have another (small) epic FU story, along the lines of FU money not having to be about quitting, but just standing strong.  I was pulled into the CEOs office by my boss, which peaked my interest, as that never happens.  Apparently, our company is going to be moving the office across the country, and as I'm the head IT person, I was one of the first told since I'll need to help plan and coordinate things.  Relocation assistance will be offered to everyone.  So in front of the CEO my boss asks if I'd be interested in moving to X location.  I just say 'No.'  We look at each other for a while as he's not sure what to say.  'Why not?  Nice city, nice area, etc etc'.  'No thanks'.  Then he finally says 'well, telecommuting might also be an option for you'.  'Yea, thought that might be the case' (in my head, not out loud).  The CEO and CFO both have families in school here, I know they're sure as hell not moving across the country.  The place we're moving to is actually a really good location, I wouldn't mind moving there at all, but I was willing to call their bluff in order to not box myself.  And I have been thinking about finding another job that would let me telecommute so I can live anywhere, or be nomadic, so this might work out even better.

Nice! By the way, it's 'piqued', not 'peaked'.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: RyanAtTanagra on October 30, 2015, 04:21:00 PM
... which peaked my interest...

Nice! By the way, it's 'piqued', not 'peaked'.

Doh, thanks.  I knew that didn't look right.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: MoonShadow on October 30, 2015, 05:06:05 PM
Have another (small) epic FU story, along the lines of FU money not having to be about quitting, but just standing strong.  I was pulled into the CEOs office by my boss, which peaked my interest, as that never happens.  Apparently, our company is going to be moving the office across the country, and as I'm the head IT person, I was one of the first told since I'll need to help plan and coordinate things.  Relocation assistance will be offered to everyone.  So in front of the CEO my boss asks if I'd be interested in moving to X location.  I just say 'No.'  We look at each other for a while as he's not sure what to say.  'Why not?  Nice city, nice area, etc etc'.  'No thanks'.  Then he finally says 'well, telecommuting might also be an option for you'.  'Yea, thought that might be the case' (in my head, not out loud).  The CEO and CFO both have families in school here, I know they're sure as hell not moving across the country.  The place we're moving to is actually a really good location, I wouldn't mind moving there at all, but I was willing to call their bluff in order to not box myself.  And I have been thinking about finding another job that would let me telecommute so I can live anywhere, or be nomadic, so this might work out even better.

Well played, Sir.  Well played.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: hdatontodo on October 31, 2015, 03:29:43 PM
I have read this thread over the course of two days and a fire has been lit. I am more determined than ever to stash away my own FU money because you never know what could happen.

I just need to pay these stupid CCs off first, but with the help of my tax refund coming up I will hopefully be CC-debt free by April or May of 2016! Then I can really start building that stash and paying down some student loans.
What about changing you tax w/h now and not wait until tax time for the money
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Bikeguy on November 01, 2015, 05:28:46 AM
I have read this thread over the course of two days and a fire has been lit. I am more determined than ever to stash away my own FU money because you never know what could happen.

I just need to pay these stupid CCs off first, but with the help of my tax refund coming up I will hopefully be CC-debt free by April or May of 2016! Then I can really start building that stash and paying down some student loans.
Agreed you should pull ahead paying the CC.  If due a refund, you can change your exemptions amount upward and each is worth roughly $50 a month.   So,  change from 1 to 9 and you'll get an extra $400 a month in your paycheck that you can use to pay the credit cards down now.  In January, adjust exemptions to cover $600 in taxes per exemption.  For example, if you are at 1, and will get $1900 back,  change to 4 for the year.   You'll get your money in each paycheck, about $150 extra a month,  and won't give the government an interest free loan.

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Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: RWD on November 01, 2015, 09:41:35 AM
Agreed you should pull ahead paying the CC.  If due a refund, you can change your exemptions amount upward and each is worth roughly $50 a month.

Wouldn't it only be $50/month if you're in the 15% tax bracket? If you're in a higher tax bracket each allowance you claim will reduce your withheld tax more.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Bikeguy on November 01, 2015, 09:48:18 AM
Agreed you should pull ahead paying the CC.  If due a refund, you can change your exemptions amount upward and each is worth roughly $50 a month.

Wouldn't it only be $50/month if you're in the 15% tax bracket? If you're in a higher tax bracket each allowance you claim will reduce your withheld tax more.
You are correct.  Was a few years ago when I did it.

https://turbotax.intuit.com/tax-tools/tax-tips/IRS-Tax-Forms/Fatten-Your-Paycheck-and-Still-Get-a-Tax-Refund/INF12107.html

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Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: AmandaS1989 on November 02, 2015, 06:54:19 AM
I know its stupid to do it, but I don't want to change it. For one, I'm always afraid that I won't have enough withheld and I'll owe the government money. Second, I'm afraid to being tempted to blow that extra money instead of saving it or using it to pay off debt. I just don't trust myself. If I have a big chunk of money to put on a bill all at once it's more satisfying to me than just chipping away at it. I know I should facepunch myself for that but that's how I am.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Bikeguy on November 02, 2015, 07:43:14 AM
I know its stupid to do it, but I don't want to change it. For one, I'm always afraid that I won't have enough withheld and I'll owe the government money. Second, I'm afraid to being tempted to blow that extra money instead of saving it or using it to pay off debt. I just don't trust myself. If I have a big chunk of money to put on a bill all at once it's more satisfying to me than just chipping away at it. I know I should facepunch myself for that but that's how I am.
I respect that decision.   Better to avoid any temptation and guarantee the CCs  get paid down.

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Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: AmandaS1989 on November 02, 2015, 08:00:14 AM
I know its stupid to do it, but I don't want to change it. For one, I'm always afraid that I won't have enough withheld and I'll owe the government money. Second, I'm afraid to being tempted to blow that extra money instead of saving it or using it to pay off debt. I just don't trust myself. If I have a big chunk of money to put on a bill all at once it's more satisfying to me than just chipping away at it. I know I should facepunch myself for that but that's how I am.
I respect that decision.   Better to avoid any temptation and guarantee the CCs  get paid down.

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Thank you Bikeguy. Anyways I have the CCs paid off now. I got a debt consolidation loan from LendingClub a few weeks ago and am only paying 10.98% interest instead of 20% and 25%. I just have the one CC with a balance of $820-something that is interest-free until July so I'm paying about $20 above the minimum to help pay it off in time. After I pay off the loan from LC, a PLUS loan and the remainder on my phone at tax time I'll have about $250/month extra to pay off that last CC and to really pay down my SLs. I'm hoping to refinance most if not all of my loans with Earnest as most of them are 6% or higher. A few are below 5% so depending on what rate I'm offered I might just refinance some of them.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: mm1970 on November 02, 2015, 11:41:44 AM
Have another (small) epic FU story, along the lines of FU money not having to be about quitting, but just standing strong.  I was pulled into the CEOs office by my boss, which peaked my interest, as that never happens.  Apparently, our company is going to be moving the office across the country, and as I'm the head IT person, I was one of the first told since I'll need to help plan and coordinate things.  Relocation assistance will be offered to everyone.  So in front of the CEO my boss asks if I'd be interested in moving to X location.  I just say 'No.'  We look at each other for a while as he's not sure what to say.  'Why not?  Nice city, nice area, etc etc'.  'No thanks'.  Then he finally says 'well, telecommuting might also be an option for you'.  'Yea, thought that might be the case' (in my head, not out loud).  The CEO and CFO both have families in school here, I know they're sure as hell not moving across the country.  The place we're moving to is actually a really good location, I wouldn't mind moving there at all, but I was willing to call their bluff in order to not box myself.  And I have been thinking about finding another job that would let me telecommute so I can live anywhere, or be nomadic, so this might work out even better.
This was nice.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: RecoveringCarClown on November 03, 2015, 10:19:56 PM
This story is not super awesome but this thread needs to keep going, so might as well tell it.

So Bob is a pretty new guy, but he has the knowledge to do the job.  Now there are two parts to his job, the most important 80% of it (part A) is what he needs to do and what management cares about.  First couple years go ok.  End of year three or four, Bob begins to slip up on part A while he works on pet projects and the 20% (Part B).  You see Bob likes working on B while it is only an enabler for A.  Anyway, this comes to a head when Bob gets reprimanded for screwing up A again while spending a ton of time on B.
Next Friday comes and after everyone is long gone, Bob cleans out his desk and sends an email to his boss which happens to be off that day anyway. He writes a pretty long manifesto about all the things that are wrong and how he was working to fix it. He ends it by saying that he resigns.

Bob works in a professional industry and two weeks notice is customarily the minimum and some give a month or more to help transition projects or train new people. We typically have a party or drinks or something to wish them well, etc. Now here is the weird part, we never see Bob again, EVER.  He sent the email and never came back. His boss called him and asked him to come in and help for a week with a transition.  Bob, politely declines, says that he left all company property and that there was no reason to come back.
I have seen countless employees leave in a few different companies, but Bob is the first to disappear into thin air.  I'd like to think he had a stash but no one will ever know!       
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: mistershankly on November 03, 2015, 10:30:30 PM
I have seen countless employees leave in a few different companies, but Bob is the first to disappear into thin air.  I'd like to think he had a stash but no one will ever know!     

Great story!  I like to call that move "The Shawshank"... "the man up and vanished like a fart in the wind".

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yX6FmJAbdAg

Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Astatine on November 03, 2015, 11:27:57 PM
I have nothing to contribute. Just posting to follow.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Imonaboat on November 04, 2015, 06:33:18 AM
It's not FU money related, but similar:

When my friends and I were all 16-20 we all got a job at a new fast food store. There were 12 of us that included all positions from server up to assistant manager, it was great times and we rode into work together and had a blast.

They screwed over one of our friends on pay and refused to even look at it, so we all walked out. They had to close that location down for almost a week over $30 and a 15 minute review to find the error.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: FiguringItOut on November 04, 2015, 09:04:27 AM
It's not FU money related, but similar:

When my friends and I were all 16-20 we all got a job at a new fast food store. There were 12 of us that included all positions from server up to assistant manager, it was great times and we rode into work together and had a blast.

They screwed over one of our friends on pay and refused to even look at it, so we all walked out. They had to close that location down for almost a week over $30 and a 15 minute review to find the error.

This is AWESOME!!!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: russianswinga on November 11, 2015, 04:43:30 PM
They screwed over one of our friends on pay and refused to even look at it, so we all walked out. They had to close that location down for almost a week over $30 and a 15 minute review to find the error.

Ahh the power of collective bargaining
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Gone Fishing on November 19, 2015, 12:15:52 PM
Not quite epic, but the new boss wants to move everyone's offices around.  Everyone else has been "yes men" trying to curry favor.  I told him no thanks!  If he moves me anyway, when I resign next spring, I will tell him that it was because he moved my office just to mess with him...
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: SingleMomDebt on November 19, 2015, 12:17:40 PM

If he moves me anyway, when I resign next spring, I will tell him that it was because he moved my office just to mess with him...

Nice. made me chuckle.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Faraday on November 20, 2015, 10:52:45 AM
Not quite epic, but the new boss wants to move everyone's offices around.  Everyone else has been "yes men" trying to curry favor.  I told him no thanks!  If he moves me anyway, when I resign next spring, I will tell him that it was because he moved my office just to mess with him...

That will be delicious.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Riff on November 20, 2015, 11:51:12 AM
This is probably my favorite thread on the forum.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: G-dog on November 20, 2015, 12:05:16 PM
Not quite epic, but the new boss wants to move everyone's offices around.  Everyone else has been "yes men" trying to curry favor.  I told him no thanks!  If he moves me anyway, when I resign next spring, I will tell him that it was because he moved my office just to mess with him...

That will be delicious.

I am still surprised when bosses come up with these ideas, they are usually trivial kind of PITA events, but they are disruptive, take time, and add no value (usually). But they are astonished (!!!) if you speak up. It is the kind of thing that gets you labelled...
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Gone Fishing on November 20, 2015, 12:11:59 PM
Not quite epic, but the new boss wants to move everyone's offices around.  Everyone else has been "yes men" trying to curry favor.  I told him no thanks!  If he moves me anyway, when I resign next spring, I will tell him that it was because he moved my office just to mess with him...

That will be delicious.

I am still surprised when bosses come up with these ideas, they are usually trivial kind of PITA events, but they are disruptive, take time, and add no value (usually). But they are astonished (!!!) if you speak up. It is the kind of thing that gets you labelled...

Sweet.  I like labels!  I am always telling my wife to label the bags of meat before the go in the freezer!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: G-dog on November 20, 2015, 12:40:27 PM
Not quite epic, but the new boss wants to move everyone's offices around.  Everyone else has been "yes men" trying to curry favor.  I told him no thanks!  If he moves me anyway, when I resign next spring, I will tell him that it was because he moved my office just to mess with him...

That will be delicious.

I am still surprised when bosses come up with these ideas, they are usually trivial kind of PITA events, but they are disruptive, take time, and add no value (usually). But they are astonished (!!!) if you speak up. It is the kind of thing that gets you labelled...

Sweet.  I like labels!  I am always telling my wife to label the bags of meat before the go in the freezer!

Hahahahahaha! You are so organized!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: okits on November 20, 2015, 12:58:31 PM
Not quite epic, but the new boss wants to move everyone's offices around.  Everyone else has been "yes men" trying to curry favor.  I told him no thanks!  If he moves me anyway, when I resign next spring, I will tell him that it was because he moved my office just to mess with him...

That will be delicious.

I am still surprised when bosses come up with these ideas, they are usually trivial kind of PITA events, but they are disruptive, take time, and add no value (usually). But they are astonished (!!!) if you speak up. It is the kind of thing that gets you labelled...

So Close, it sounds like you have less than six months left.  A fun game would be to see how many labels you can pick up (difficult, disruptive, subversive, eccentric, wildly attired) before you quit.  You'll probably be able to pick up a ton just by saying what you really think and doing what you really want. 

"Hawaiian shirts are totally appropriate for casual Fridays!  Fine, I'll add a surfboard-shaped tie if you really think it's a problem..."
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: arebelspy on November 20, 2015, 01:01:05 PM
Fun as it sounds, no need to unnecessarily burn bridges.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: MandalayVA on November 20, 2015, 01:07:43 PM
Today Mr. Mandalay reminded me of how I left my job prior to this one.

I was in upper echelon customer service for an entertainment company.  I loved the job, I loved my supervisor, and my coworkers were awesome.  However, my supervisor was involved in a very serious car accident and wouldn't be back for months while he was recuperating.  The powers that be did a little shuffling, and so Felicia came to preside over the group.

Felicia was the living embodiment of Dolores Umbridge.  She was all smiles and sweet voice, but she remains the nastiest person it's ever been my misfortune to know.  My group had heard horror stories about her for ages, and now we started to live them.  She wrote people up for the stupidest shit.  How stupid?  Try coming back from lunch 75 SECONDS late (yes, she counted).  Laughing while talking with customers ("you really must be more professional, dear"--this was me BTW).  She wrote one woman up for combing her hair at her desk.  And then of course the "dear."  There were regular outbursts of "Are you KIDDING me?!?!?!" coming over her cube wall.  And God, she nitpicked EVERYTHING, but management backed her up without question.  After roughly a month I didn't know whether I was going to go suicidal or homicidal, even though unlike my coworkers I'd only been written up once.  After Mr. Mandalay heard me coming in from work, slamming my purse on the counter and screaming "GAAAAAH FUCKING FELICIA!!!!" for the twentieth time he said over dinner "if you're that fucking miserable, quit.  We've got enough saved, we'll be okay for a while."

I was still nervous, so I vowed to myself that Felicia would have to do something heinous before I'd pull the trigger.  I only had to wait three days.  Felicia wrote me up for "dressing inappropriately."  This was a call center, so we could wear what we wanted as long as it was clean and in good taste.  I am the most conservative dresser on the planet.  The "inappropriate" garment in question was a University of Virginia sweatshirt.

Why did Felicia find it offensive?

She went to Virginia Tech.

I am TOTALLY not kidding. 

I stood up, ripped up the form and said "I quit."

"Dear, I don't think you can afford to quit," Felicia said.

I still remember beaming and saying "Actually, Felicia, I can" and the stunned look on her face as I left her cube.

I heard later on that Felicia ended up getting transferred to the Kansas City branch of the company.  I wonder how many people she wrote up for wearing Jayhawks shirts ...
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Gone Fishing on November 20, 2015, 01:09:35 PM
Fun as it sounds, no need to unnecessarily burn bridges.

Agreed.  I have been dropping a few more frugal hints, though.  Like how I am going to mount my own tires this weekend and how I butcher my animals for meat...

Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: mm1970 on November 20, 2015, 07:00:35 PM
Today Mr. Mandalay reminded me of how I left my job prior to this one.

I was in upper echelon customer service for an entertainment company.  I loved the job, I loved my supervisor, and my coworkers were awesome.  However, my supervisor was involved in a very serious car accident and wouldn't be back for months while he was recuperating.  The powers that be did a little shuffling, and so Felicia came to preside over the group.

Felicia was the living embodiment of Dolores Umbridge.  She was all smiles and sweet voice, but she remains the nastiest person it's ever been my misfortune to know.  My group had heard horror stories about her for ages, and now we started to live them.  She wrote people up for the stupidest shit.  How stupid?  Try coming back from lunch 75 SECONDS late (yes, she counted).  Laughing while talking with customers ("you really must be more professional, dear"--this was me BTW).  She wrote one woman up for combing her hair at her desk.  And then of course the "dear."  There were regular outbursts of "Are you KIDDING me?!?!?!" coming over her cube wall.  And God, she nitpicked EVERYTHING, but management backed her up without question.  After roughly a month I didn't know whether I was going to go suicidal or homicidal, even though unlike my coworkers I'd only been written up once.  After Mr. Mandalay heard me coming in from work, slamming my purse on the counter and screaming "GAAAAAH FUCKING FELICIA!!!!" for the twentieth time he said over dinner "if you're that fucking miserable, quit.  We've got enough saved, we'll be okay for a while."

I was still nervous, so I vowed to myself that Felicia would have to do something heinous before I'd pull the trigger.  I only had to wait three days.  Felicia wrote me up for "dressing inappropriately."  This was a call center, so we could wear what we wanted as long as it was clean and in good taste.  I am the most conservative dresser on the planet.  The "inappropriate" garment in question was a University of Virginia sweatshirt.

Why did Felicia find it offensive?

She went to Virginia Tech.

I am TOTALLY not kidding. 

I stood up, ripped up the form and said "I quit."

"Dear, I don't think you can afford to quit," Felicia said.

I still remember beaming and saying "Actually, Felicia, I can" and the stunned look on her face as I left her cube.

I heard later on that Felicia ended up getting transferred to the Kansas City branch of the company.  I wonder how many people she wrote up for wearing Jayhawks shirts ...
this was pretty awesome, even for someone who went to VA tech
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Vee2001 on November 20, 2015, 10:55:33 PM
Worked as a mid-level manager at a Federal agency.  Organization did poorly on an inspection and inspectors pointed at a number of poor decisions by our Director-level leadership as the root cause.  Numerous subordinates brought the exact same issues to them prior to the inspection but the Directors always knew better.  They had a habit of taking credit for success and pushing blame for failures to others and were stressful people to work for, so I had already been looking at my options and planning an exit strategy.

Get called into a private meeting with one of the Directors who asked me to write a letter to HR saying it was my fault we did poorly on the inspection and request a demotion to a lower graded position because I was in over my head.  I declined.  He said that if I didn't then I would be let go.  I reminded him that I passed my probationary period and they had to prove cause to fire me (after the 1 year probationary period, you're supposed to have job protection).  The Director said that he had already talked to HR, that they can play paperwork games and let me go as a non-disciplinary action that would bypass the protections I'm supposed to get (unethical but not surprising from these people).  I told him to go ahead and do that. 

He was like, "No, you don't understand, we want to keep you.  You can keep doing the same stuff you are now but at the lower position.  In a couple years we can promote you back."

I said, yes, I understand that and, no, I will not write that letter to HR.  That I'd rather get let go than keep working for him.  Needless to say, he wasn't happy.

They do the non-disciplinary action and give me 30-day notice of termination.  Then they take away all of my job duties and move me into, essentially, a converted closet to work out of for the last 30 days.  I don't argue the move and use the 30 days to finish a bunch of coursework that had built up in a correspondence course I was taking.  Then HR notifies me that they will not give me the (mediocre) severance payment because I was being let go for poor performance.  I remind them that it was their choice to use the "non-disciplinary" method to let me go and, if they use that method, I get the severance.  I mentioned a few of the methods I could escalate the issue (congressional complaint, etc) and they quietly gave me the severance.

This is where the planning and exit strategy came into play.  Thanks to the non-disciplinary type of termination, I qualified for unemployment.  Thanks to qualifying for unemployment, I could sell the bank-owned foreclosure I had bought and fixed up a year prior for $120k profit and not pay taxes (usually you have to live in the property for 2 years to get the profit tax free).  I had also already lined up a place I could live for an extended period rent-free. 

So, in the end, I got $120k real estate profit tax-free.  I chilled out on unemployment for a bit over a year (this was during the downturn and I think unemployment lasted for 99 weeks or so), relaxed, traveled a bit, hung out with friends and played lots of video games.  I applied for jobs but only stuff that paid well and looked interesting, I was pretty picky.  Between unemployment and passive income, I was actually cash positive by about $3.5k/month.  A bit after a year one of the interesting jobs panned out and I've been doing that ever since.  Unhappy about all the shenanigans that happened but very happy of the line of action I took and being able to say FU.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: G-dog on November 21, 2015, 06:54:54 AM
Worked as a mid-level manager at a Federal agency.  Organization did poorly on an inspection and inspectors pointed at a number of poor decisions by our Director-level leadership as the root cause.  Numerous subordinates brought the exact same issues to them prior to the inspection but the Directors always knew better.  They had a habit of taking credit for success and pushing blame for failures to others and were stressful people to work for, so I had already been looking at my options and planning an exit strategy.

Get called into a private meeting with one of the Directors who asked me to write a letter to HR saying it was my fault we did poorly on the inspection and request a demotion to a lower graded position because I was in over my head.  I declined.  He said that if I didn't then I would be let go.  I reminded him that I passed my probationary period and they had to prove cause to fire me (after the 1 year probationary period, you're supposed to have job protection).  The Director said that he had already talked to HR, that they can play paperwork games and let me go as a non-disciplinary action that would bypass the protections I'm supposed to get (unethical but not surprising from these people).  I told him to go ahead and do that. 

He was like, "No, you don't understand, we want to keep you.  You can keep doing the same stuff you are now but at the lower position.  In a couple years we can promote you back."

I said, yes, I understand that and, no, I will not write that letter to HR.  That I'd rather get let go than keep working for him.  Needless to say, he wasn't happy.

They do the non-disciplinary action and give me 30-day notice of termination.  Then they take away all of my job duties and move me into, essentially, a converted closet to work out of for the last 30 days.  I don't argue the move and use the 30 days to finish a bunch of coursework that had built up in a correspondence course I was taking.  Then HR notifies me that they will not give me the (mediocre) severance payment because I was being let go for poor performance.  I remind them that it was their choice to use the "non-disciplinary" method to let me go and, if they use that method, I get the severance.  I mentioned a few of the methods I could escalate the issue (congressional complaint, etc) and they quietly gave me the severance.

This is where the planning and exit strategy came into play.  Thanks to the non-disciplinary type of termination, I qualified for unemployment.  Thanks to qualifying for unemployment, I could sell the bank-owned foreclosure I had bought and fixed up a year prior for $120k profit and not pay taxes (usually you have to live in the property for 2 years to get the profit tax free).  I had also already lined up a place I could live for an extended period rent-free. 

So, in the end, I got $120k real estate profit tax-free.  I chilled out on unemployment for a bit over a year (this was during the downturn and I think unemployment lasted for 99 weeks or so), relaxed, traveled a bit, hung out with friends and played lots of video games.  I applied for jobs but only stuff that paid well and looked interesting, I was pretty picky.  Between unemployment and passive income, I was actually cash positive by about $3.5k/month.  A bit after a year one of the interesting jobs panned out and I've been doing that ever since.  Unhappy about all the shenanigans that happened but very happy of the line of action I took and being able to say FU.

<bowing> we're not worthy!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: albireo13 on November 21, 2015, 07:45:30 AM
So Close ...
  If you go around collecting labels maybe they'll let you go, with a package, instead of you quitting
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: albireo13 on November 21, 2015, 07:53:05 AM
I have been so close to quitting this year.  I am maybe 3yrs away from FIRE and have been interviewing with other companies.  I've had some offers but have decided it's not worth starting over in a new job.  I'll just hunker down and plow through the ever increasing corporate BS.
I have a decent engineering job with good benefits and I like the people I work with ... my peer level.
Unfortunately a few mini managers are experts at hen pecking and make the job in-fun. Also, the big company cultured rewards incompetence so, the managers tend to be corporate zombies ... walking about and muttering corporate-speak.
I feel like I am living in a Dilbert comic strip!

I am awaiting my turn to "retire". I need to come up with a fun, but constructive, FU event.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: ShaneD on November 21, 2015, 07:14:03 PM
It has taken weeks, but I have enjoyed reading this whole thread immensely.

I've walked off plenty of jobs with no safety net, but the one where I got to leave thanks to FU money is when I left my full-time job to go freelance. The company was dysfunctional and toxic, very dog-eat-dog culture dictated from the top, and stingy even with its most "valued" (as it were) employees. Always more and more responsibilities, loads of projects with unreasonable demands and deadlines, but never more money or recognition (except for the inept execs). You could rarely even take the vacation days you were allotted, yet you were expected to fall over yourself with gratitude for the peanuts you'd earned.

I kept the leaving process polite, friendly, and positive. When they called in need of help after I'd left, I told them it'd cost an amount more than 3x what I made as a salaried employee. They balked and freaked out. I wished them luck. They agreed to my asking price.

Even better: 9 times out of 10 when they call, I turn down the job.

As others have mentioned, one of the best benefits of FU money is the freedom to choose to say Yes or No.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Jellyfish on November 21, 2015, 07:39:35 PM

When they called in need of help after I'd left, I told them it'd cost an amount more than 3x what I made as a salaried employee. They balked and freaked out. I wished them luck. They agreed to my asking price.


Awesome. This is what I aspire to...
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: civil on November 21, 2015, 08:06:21 PM
Today Mr. Mandalay reminded me of how I left my job prior to this one.

I was in upper echelon customer service for an entertainment company.  I loved the job, I loved my supervisor, and my coworkers were awesome.  However, my supervisor was involved in a very serious car accident and wouldn't be back for months while he was recuperating.  The powers that be did a little shuffling, and so Felicia came to preside over the group.

Felicia was the living embodiment of Dolores Umbridge.  She was all smiles and sweet voice, but she remains the nastiest person it's ever been my misfortune to know.  My group had heard horror stories about her for ages, and now we started to live them.  She wrote people up for the stupidest shit.  How stupid?  Try coming back from lunch 75 SECONDS late (yes, she counted).  Laughing while talking with customers ("you really must be more professional, dear"--this was me BTW).  She wrote one woman up for combing her hair at her desk.  And then of course the "dear."  There were regular outbursts of "Are you KIDDING me?!?!?!" coming over her cube wall.  And God, she nitpicked EVERYTHING, but management backed her up without question.  After roughly a month I didn't know whether I was going to go suicidal or homicidal, even though unlike my coworkers I'd only been written up once.  After Mr. Mandalay heard me coming in from work, slamming my purse on the counter and screaming "GAAAAAH FUCKING FELICIA!!!!" for the twentieth time he said over dinner "if you're that fucking miserable, quit.  We've got enough saved, we'll be okay for a while."

I was still nervous, so I vowed to myself that Felicia would have to do something heinous before I'd pull the trigger.  I only had to wait three days.  Felicia wrote me up for "dressing inappropriately."  This was a call center, so we could wear what we wanted as long as it was clean and in good taste.  I am the most conservative dresser on the planet.  The "inappropriate" garment in question was a University of Virginia sweatshirt.

Why did Felicia find it offensive?

She went to Virginia Tech.

I am TOTALLY not kidding. 

I stood up, ripped up the form and said "I quit."

"Dear, I don't think you can afford to quit," Felicia said.

I still remember beaming and saying "Actually, Felicia, I can" and the stunned look on her face as I left her cube.

I heard later on that Felicia ended up getting transferred to the Kansas City branch of the company.  I wonder how many people she wrote up for wearing Jayhawks shirts ...

At my last job, our on-the-job training included a series of competency exams before we were given access to the computer systems. One exam involved writing some short computer programs, and a grader had to check the security of our programs. I had to get a new grader - the main grader wouldn't pass me because he attended Va Tech and I attended UVA.

I've seen UVA people do this to Hokies, too. Really, people. It's just a school. Let's all get back to making fun of West Virginia already.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: PseudoStache on November 21, 2015, 09:03:38 PM
Haven't seen this movie... but saw the clip on Reddit and immediately thought of this thread...  The numbers are not mustachian, but still....

http://youtu.be/xdfeXqHFmPI
(NSFW: Language....sorry if a repost)
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: shelivesthedream on November 22, 2015, 03:28:32 AM
Haven't seen this movie... but saw the clip on Reddit and immediately thought of this thread...  The numbers are not mustachian, but still....

http://youtu.be/xdfeXqHFmPI
(NSFW: Language....sorry if a repost)

Love this! I wish that everyone aspired to be in the position of fuck you, if not to RE. I think the world would be better if people weren't so afraid.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: nobodyspecial on November 22, 2015, 08:33:24 AM
- the main grader wouldn't pass me because he attended Va Tech and I attended UVA.
That must be a real problem for them, if you want the best scientists and engineers in the world working on your project but half went to VaT and half went to UVA and you can only pick one.

Presumably you have to hope that the second raters who went to Cambridge/MIT/Caltech will happily work with those losers who only got into Oxford/Harvard/Stanford.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: shelivesthedream on November 22, 2015, 09:30:16 AM
- the main grader wouldn't pass me because he attended Va Tech and I attended UVA.
That must be a real problem for them, if you want the best scientists and engineers in the world working on your project but half went to VaT and half went to UVA and you can only pick one.

Presumably you have to hope that the second raters who went to Cambridge/MIT/Caltech will happily work with those losers who only got into Oxford/Harvard/Stanford.

My husband went to two traditionally rival universities for undergrad and postgrad. It fucks with your mind. (We met during undergrad. The first university was clearly better.)
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: civil on November 24, 2015, 04:10:58 PM
- the main grader wouldn't pass me because he attended Va Tech and I attended UVA.
That must be a real problem for them, if you want the best scientists and engineers in the world working on your project but half went to VaT and half went to UVA and you can only pick one.

Presumably you have to hope that the second raters who went to Cambridge/MIT/Caltech will happily work with those losers who only got into Oxford/Harvard/Stanford.

My husband went to two traditionally rival universities for undergrad and postgrad. It fucks with your mind. (We met during undergrad. The first university was clearly better.)

Ha! That's awesome.
I find it's much easier to deal with the people who never cared about football. So many of these rivalries are about football. When dealing with VT football fans, I've had some success with pretending to not know what American football is. Then it's no fun to talk about it :)
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Rollin on November 24, 2015, 04:31:06 PM
Haven't seen this movie... but saw the clip on Reddit and immediately thought of this thread...  The numbers are not mustachian, but still....

http://youtu.be/xdfeXqHFmPI
(NSFW: Language....sorry if a repost)

Hadn't seen that.  That is good!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: SwordGuy on November 24, 2015, 05:19:41 PM
When dealing with VT football fans, I've had some success with pretending to not know what American football is. Then it's no fun to talk about it :)

I don't give a rat's ass about collegiate or professional sports.   They could disappear from the face of the earth and I wouldn't notice if not for all the unhappy whining about it.

Despite not caring one whit, I can't help but have learned many of the names of the different teams and (approximately) which season is which sport, purely by osmosis.

So, if they start talking about football I'll ask a question like, "Football?  That's the big orange ball, isn't it?"
It really stops them cold and they don't bother me about this stuff anymore.

Well, most of them don't.  If they are really obnoxious about it, I'll make a comment like "Well, my sense of self worth isn't attached to how well a bunch of strangers carry a piece of dead pig across a field."

That's a real conversation stopper.

Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Faraday on November 24, 2015, 10:51:41 PM
I don't give a rat's ass about collegiate or professional sports.   They could disappear from the face of the earth and I wouldn't notice if not for all the unhappy whining about it.

+1, sons too. I'm incensed at the thought that the NFL runs tax free.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Chaplin on November 24, 2015, 10:57:44 PM
So, if they start talking about football I'll ask a question like, "Football?  That's the big orange ball, isn't it?"
It really stops them cold and they don't bother me about this stuff anymore.

Well, most of them don't.  If they are really obnoxious about it, I'll make a comment like "Well, my sense of self worth isn't attached to how well a bunch of strangers carry a piece of dead pig across a field."

That's a real conversation stopper.

I love messing with people this way. When a team is referenced, asking if it's the game where they have to bounce a lot, or the one with the weirdly shaped ball, is fun too.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: RyanAtTanagra on November 24, 2015, 11:20:21 PM
I love messing with people this way. When a team is referenced, asking if it's the game where they have to bounce a lot, or the one with the weirdly shaped ball, is fun too.

What's the one where they have to bounce a lot?  Is there a women's division?
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Gray Matter on November 25, 2015, 04:25:41 AM
I don't give a rat's ass about collegiate or professional sports.   They could disappear from the face of the earth and I wouldn't notice if not for all the unhappy whining about it.

Despite not caring one whit, I can't help but have learned many of the names of the different teams and (approximately) which season is which sport, purely by osmosis.

So, if they start talking about football I'll ask a question like, "Football?  That's the big orange ball, isn't it?"
It really stops them cold and they don't bother me about this stuff anymore.

Well, most of them don't.  If they are really obnoxious about it, I'll make a comment like "Well, my sense of self worth isn't attached to how well a bunch of strangers carry a piece of dead pig across a field."

That's a real conversation stopper.

Swoon!  (Sorry, I have a thing for guys who care not one whit--or rat's ass worth--about sports.)
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Rollin on November 25, 2015, 06:03:50 AM
When dealing with VT football fans, I've had some success with pretending to not know what American football is. Then it's no fun to talk about it :)

I don't give a rat's ass about collegiate or professional sports.   They could disappear from the face of the earth and I wouldn't notice if not for all the unhappy whining about it.

Despite not caring one whit, I can't help but have learned many of the names of the different teams and (approximately) which season is which sport, purely by osmosis.

So, if they start talking about football I'll ask a question like, "Football?  That's the big orange ball, isn't it?"
It really stops them cold and they don't bother me about this stuff anymore.

Well, most of them don't.  If they are really obnoxious about it, I'll make a comment like "Well, my sense of self worth isn't attached to how well a bunch of strangers carry a piece of dead pig across a field."

That's a real conversation stopper.

A real annoyance huh?  Sounds like fun poking holes in other people's enjoyment.  Must be a blast hanging out with you.

Sorry for the extra foam...now on to Epic FU stories...

Not epic, but still building mine (i.e., FU money) and could go this very moment, but want to wait and see how the taxes shake out towards the end of the year.  Thankfully, it is a great place to work, but it is still a place that robs me of other options.  For example, today I am looking out at a beautiful clear sky and temps about 65F, yet I am at "work."  Would rather be our riding the bicycle, walking the dog, cruising the boat or motorcycle, hanging out with the family.  Ah soon - April 2016!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: bernardnb on November 25, 2015, 07:54:53 AM
Quote
+1, sons too. I'm incensed at the thought that the NFL runs tax free.

It's only the administrative arm of the league that doesn't pay tax (and even that is over after this year).  The vast majority of the revenues are driven by the teams (tickets, merchandise and the HUGE tv deal).  The teams are not tax-exempt.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Sibley on November 25, 2015, 09:43:20 AM
When dealing with VT football fans, I've had some success with pretending to not know what American football is. Then it's no fun to talk about it :)

I don't give a rat's ass about collegiate or professional sports.   They could disappear from the face of the earth and I wouldn't notice if not for all the unhappy whining about it.

Despite not caring one whit, I can't help but have learned many of the names of the different teams and (approximately) which season is which sport, purely by osmosis.

So, if they start talking about football I'll ask a question like, "Football?  That's the big orange ball, isn't it?"
It really stops them cold and they don't bother me about this stuff anymore.

Well, most of them don't.  If they are really obnoxious about it, I'll make a comment like "Well, my sense of self worth isn't attached to how well a bunch of strangers carry a piece of dead pig across a field."

That's a real conversation stopper.

A real annoyance huh?  Sounds like fun poking holes in other people's enjoyment.  Must be a blast hanging out with you.

Try talking about something else.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: REAL WORLD EXPAT on November 25, 2015, 10:34:21 AM

If he moves me anyway, when I resign next spring, I will tell him that it was because he moved my office just to mess with him...

Nice. made me chuckle.

Not an FU story but on a similar theme when I quit the last job I had I told them it was because they hired another British person (I live in the US). I'd been looking for another job for a while and it was just pure coincidence that the day I planned on handing in my notice HR is introducing this other British expat on his first day. Purely for shits and giggles when I handed my notice in to my boss that afternoon when he got in the office I told him it was because they hired another British person and that was my thing here in the company. They even went as far as saying they'd let the other guy go and which point I told them the fact they'd even thought about brining in another British person in was enough and I felt hurt and was obviously not fulfilling the token British guy role adequately (plus I did not want the new guy to lose his job here as I was leaving anyhow). Worked my notice and left, to this day they think that is the reason I left!   
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Cookie78 on November 25, 2015, 10:41:11 AM

If he moves me anyway, when I resign next spring, I will tell him that it was because he moved my office just to mess with him...

Nice. made me chuckle.

Not an FU story but on a similar theme when I quit the last job I had I told them it was because they hired another British person (I live in the US). I'd been looking for another job for a while and it was just pure coincidence that the day I planned on handing in my notice HR is introducing this other British expat on his first day. Purely for shits and giggles when I handed my notice in to my boss that afternoon when he got in the office I told him it was because they hired another British person and that was my thing here in the company. They even went as far as saying they'd let the other guy go and which point I told them the fact they'd even thought about brining in another British person in was enough and I felt hurt and was obviously not fulfilling the token British guy role adequately (plus I did not want the new guy to lose his job here as I was leaving anyhow). Worked my notice and left, to this day they think that is the reason I left!

LOL
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: secondcor521 on November 25, 2015, 11:35:20 AM
We have a new "health and well-being" initiative at my company...there are signs up all over the place recommending we take the stairs instead of the elevator, more of those anti-germ handwash things installed at the top and bottom of all stairways.  They have also put up signs at the top and bottom of the stairways saying you "must" use the handrails.  I get personal safety and the potential company liability, but the word "must" goes beyond my limits of reasonableness.  I'm thinking about using that as the reason for my leaving.  Not particularly epic, but the last few posts here reminded me of it.

(Real reason is FU/FIRE money plus dissatisfaction with management.)
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: RyanAtTanagra on November 25, 2015, 11:45:01 AM

If he moves me anyway, when I resign next spring, I will tell him that it was because he moved my office just to mess with him...

Nice. made me chuckle.

Not an FU story but on a similar theme when I quit the last job I had I told them it was because they hired another British person (I live in the US). I'd been looking for another job for a while and it was just pure coincidence that the day I planned on handing in my notice HR is introducing this other British expat on his first day. Purely for shits and giggles when I handed my notice in to my boss that afternoon when he got in the office I told him it was because they hired another British person and that was my thing here in the company. They even went as far as saying they'd let the other guy go and which point I told them the fact they'd even thought about brining in another British person in was enough and I felt hurt and was obviously not fulfilling the token British guy role adequately (plus I did not want the new guy to lose his job here as I was leaving anyhow). Worked my notice and left, to this day they think that is the reason I left!

While not FU, that's my favorite story yet, that's hilarious.  That poor guy, I wonder if word got around about you leaving over him and if there was any resentment towards him from others.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: RyanAtTanagra on November 25, 2015, 11:47:28 AM
We have a new "health and well-being" initiative at my company...there are signs up all over the place recommending we take the stairs instead of the elevator, more of those anti-germ handwash things installed at the top and bottom of all stairways.  They have also put up signs at the top and bottom of the stairways saying you "must" use the handrails.  I get personal safety and the potential company liability, but the word "must" goes beyond my limits of reasonableness.  I'm thinking about using that as the reason for my leaving.  Not particularly epic, but the last few posts here reminded me of it.

(Real reason is FU/FIRE money plus dissatisfaction with management.)

Haha do it, don't tell them the 'must' bothers you, just that you don't like using handrails so you can't work there anymore.

'why are you leaving?'
'i don't like using handrails on stairs'
'so don't...'
'but i must, the signs say so, so I have no choice but to leave'

Then see if you can convince them to take the signs down.  Then leave.

And report back if you do!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Kitsune on November 25, 2015, 12:02:14 PM
We have a new "health and well-being" initiative at my company...there are signs up all over the place recommending we take the stairs instead of the elevator, more of those anti-germ handwash things installed at the top and bottom of all stairways.  They have also put up signs at the top and bottom of the stairways saying you "must" use the handrails.  I get personal safety and the potential company liability, but the word "must" goes beyond my limits of reasonableness.  I'm thinking about using that as the reason for my leaving.  Not particularly epic, but the last few posts here reminded me of it.

(Real reason is FU/FIRE money plus dissatisfaction with management.)

Oh, gawd, those health initiatives. Combined with a few people who always get SUPER enthusiastic and who start browbeating everyone else over it. Ugh.

From the asshats at my last office:

"Take the stairs! It's healthier!" No. It's 8am, I don't have the enthusiasm, and the physio appointments have only slightly helped with my hip pain and NO I don't wanna discuss my health with you.

"Are you eating THAT? It's not healthy!" No, it's not healthy, but I am 5 weeks pregnant, nauseous as hell, and am likely to puke on your shoes if I have to smell what you're eating. Right at that moment, crackers, pickles, and blueberries are what stayed down, so that was lunch. Forgive me if I didn't discuss the details of my reproductive and digestive system with the lunch police.

Something about encouraging a lack of boundaries in the workplace just never seems to end well.

The actual reason I left: my boss yelled at me for not wearing heels to a conference where I had to stand up all day, while 8 months pregnant and the approximate size of a small house. Bite me, I quit.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Cookie78 on November 25, 2015, 12:07:07 PM
We have a new "health and well-being" initiative at my company...there are signs up all over the place recommending we take the stairs instead of the elevator, more of those anti-germ handwash things installed at the top and bottom of all stairways.  They have also put up signs at the top and bottom of the stairways saying you "must" use the handrails.  I get personal safety and the potential company liability, but the word "must" goes beyond my limits of reasonableness.  I'm thinking about using that as the reason for my leaving.  Not particularly epic, but the last few posts here reminded me of it.

(Real reason is FU/FIRE money plus dissatisfaction with management.)

Oh, gawd, those health initiatives. Combined with a few people who always get SUPER enthusiastic and who start browbeating everyone else over it. Ugh.

From the asshats at my last office:

"Take the stairs! It's healthier!" No. It's 8am, I don't have the enthusiasm, and the physio appointments have only slightly helped with my hip pain and NO I don't wanna discuss my health with you.

"Are you eating THAT? It's not healthy!" No, it's not healthy, but I am 5 weeks pregnant, nauseous as hell, and am likely to puke on your shoes if I have to smell what you're eating. Right at that moment, crackers, pickles, and blueberries are what stayed down, so that was lunch. Forgive me if I didn't discuss the details of my reproductive and digestive system with the lunch police.

Something about encouraging a lack of boundaries in the workplace just never seems to end well.

The actual reason I left: my boss yelled at me for not wearing heels to a conference where I had to stand up all day, while 8 months pregnant and the approximate size of a small house. Bite me, I quit.

HO-LEE FUCK! That's not acceptable behavior by your boss in my world, EVEN IF you weren't a single one of the things you listed.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: mtn on November 25, 2015, 12:11:56 PM
We have a new "health and well-being" initiative at my company...there are signs up all over the place recommending we take the stairs instead of the elevator, more of those anti-germ handwash things installed at the top and bottom of all stairways.  They have also put up signs at the top and bottom of the stairways saying you "must" use the handrails.  I get personal safety and the potential company liability, but the word "must" goes beyond my limits of reasonableness.  I'm thinking about using that as the reason for my leaving.  Not particularly epic, but the last few posts here reminded me of it.

(Real reason is FU/FIRE money plus dissatisfaction with management.)

Oh, gawd, those health initiatives. Combined with a few people who always get SUPER enthusiastic and who start browbeating everyone else over it. Ugh.

From the asshats at my last office:

"Take the stairs! It's healthier!" No. It's 8am, I don't have the enthusiasm, and the physio appointments have only slightly helped with my hip pain and NO I don't wanna discuss my health with you.

"Are you eating THAT? It's not healthy!" No, it's not healthy, but I am 5 weeks pregnant, nauseous as hell, and am likely to puke on your shoes if I have to smell what you're eating. Right at that moment, crackers, pickles, and blueberries are what stayed down, so that was lunch. Forgive me if I didn't discuss the details of my reproductive and digestive system with the lunch police.

Something about encouraging a lack of boundaries in the workplace just never seems to end well.

The actual reason I left: my boss yelled at me for not wearing heels to a conference where I had to stand up all day, while 8 months pregnant and the approximate size of a small house. Bite me, I quit.

HO-LEE FUCK! That's not acceptable behavior by your boss in my world, EVEN IF you weren't a single one of the things you listed.

Actually, I think that might fall into the realm of sexual harassment.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: okits on November 25, 2015, 12:20:20 PM
We have a new "health and well-being" initiative at my company...there are signs up all over the place recommending we take the stairs instead of the elevator, more of those anti-germ handwash things installed at the top and bottom of all stairways.  They have also put up signs at the top and bottom of the stairways saying you "must" use the handrails.  I get personal safety and the potential company liability, but the word "must" goes beyond my limits of reasonableness.  I'm thinking about using that as the reason for my leaving.  Not particularly epic, but the last few posts here reminded me of it.

(Real reason is FU/FIRE money plus dissatisfaction with management.)

Oh, gawd, those health initiatives. Combined with a few people who always get SUPER enthusiastic and who start browbeating everyone else over it. Ugh.

From the asshats at my last office:

"Take the stairs! It's healthier!" No. It's 8am, I don't have the enthusiasm, and the physio appointments have only slightly helped with my hip pain and NO I don't wanna discuss my health with you.

"Are you eating THAT? It's not healthy!" No, it's not healthy, but I am 5 weeks pregnant, nauseous as hell, and am likely to puke on your shoes if I have to smell what you're eating. Right at that moment, crackers, pickles, and blueberries are what stayed down, so that was lunch. Forgive me if I didn't discuss the details of my reproductive and digestive system with the lunch police.

Something about encouraging a lack of boundaries in the workplace just never seems to end well.

The actual reason I left: my boss yelled at me for not wearing heels to a conference where I had to stand up all day, while 8 months pregnant and the approximate size of a small house. Bite me, I quit.

HO-LEE FUCK! That's not acceptable behavior by your boss in my world, EVEN IF you weren't a single one of the things you listed.

Actually, I think that might fall into the realm of sexual harassment.

It certainly isn't reasonable workplace accommodation for a pregnant employee.  I'm very sorry this happened to you.  :(
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: mtn on November 25, 2015, 12:25:47 PM
We have a new "health and well-being" initiative at my company...there are signs up all over the place recommending we take the stairs instead of the elevator, more of those anti-germ handwash things installed at the top and bottom of all stairways.  They have also put up signs at the top and bottom of the stairways saying you "must" use the handrails.  I get personal safety and the potential company liability, but the word "must" goes beyond my limits of reasonableness.  I'm thinking about using that as the reason for my leaving.  Not particularly epic, but the last few posts here reminded me of it.

(Real reason is FU/FIRE money plus dissatisfaction with management.)

Oh, gawd, those health initiatives. Combined with a few people who always get SUPER enthusiastic and who start browbeating everyone else over it. Ugh.

From the asshats at my last office:

"Take the stairs! It's healthier!" No. It's 8am, I don't have the enthusiasm, and the physio appointments have only slightly helped with my hip pain and NO I don't wanna discuss my health with you.

"Are you eating THAT? It's not healthy!" No, it's not healthy, but I am 5 weeks pregnant, nauseous as hell, and am likely to puke on your shoes if I have to smell what you're eating. Right at that moment, crackers, pickles, and blueberries are what stayed down, so that was lunch. Forgive me if I didn't discuss the details of my reproductive and digestive system with the lunch police.

Something about encouraging a lack of boundaries in the workplace just never seems to end well.

The actual reason I left: my boss yelled at me for not wearing heels to a conference where I had to stand up all day, while 8 months pregnant and the approximate size of a small house. Bite me, I quit.

HO-LEE FUCK! That's not acceptable behavior by your boss in my world, EVEN IF you weren't a single one of the things you listed.

Actually, I think that might fall into the realm of sexual harassment.

It certainly isn't reasonable workplace accommodation for a pregnant employee.  I'm very sorry this happened to you.  :(

FTFY.

There is a difference in saying that you need to dress professionally, and you need to wear heels.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: secondcor521 on November 25, 2015, 01:58:41 PM
We have a new "health and well-being" initiative at my company...there are signs up all over the place recommending we take the stairs instead of the elevator, more of those anti-germ handwash things installed at the top and bottom of all stairways.  They have also put up signs at the top and bottom of the stairways saying you "must" use the handrails.  I get personal safety and the potential company liability, but the word "must" goes beyond my limits of reasonableness.  I'm thinking about using that as the reason for my leaving.  Not particularly epic, but the last few posts here reminded me of it.

(Real reason is FU/FIRE money plus dissatisfaction with management.)

Haha do it, don't tell them the 'must' bothers you, just that you don't like using handrails so you can't work there anymore.

'why are you leaving?'
'i don't like using handrails on stairs'
'so don't...'
'but i must, the signs say so, so I have no choice but to leave'

Then see if you can convince them to take the signs down.  Then leave.

And report back if you do!

Funnier.  And tempting.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Psychstache on November 25, 2015, 03:43:14 PM
Today Mr. Mandalay reminded me of how I left my job prior to this one.

I was in upper echelon customer service for an entertainment company.  I loved the job, I loved my supervisor, and my coworkers were awesome.  However, my supervisor was involved in a very serious car accident and wouldn't be back for months while he was recuperating.  The powers that be did a little shuffling, and so Felicia came to preside over the group.

Felicia was the living embodiment of Dolores Umbridge.  She was all smiles and sweet voice, but she remains the nastiest person it's ever been my misfortune to know.  My group had heard horror stories about her for ages, and now we started to live them.  She wrote people up for the stupidest shit.  How stupid?  Try coming back from lunch 75 SECONDS late (yes, she counted).  Laughing while talking with customers ("you really must be more professional, dear"--this was me BTW).  She wrote one woman up for combing her hair at her desk.  And then of course the "dear."  There were regular outbursts of "Are you KIDDING me?!?!?!" coming over her cube wall.  And God, she nitpicked EVERYTHING, but management backed her up without question.  After roughly a month I didn't know whether I was going to go suicidal or homicidal, even though unlike my coworkers I'd only been written up once.  After Mr. Mandalay heard me coming in from work, slamming my purse on the counter and screaming "GAAAAAH FUCKING FELICIA!!!!" for the twentieth time he said over dinner "if you're that fucking miserable, quit.  We've got enough saved, we'll be okay for a while."

I was still nervous, so I vowed to myself that Felicia would have to do something heinous before I'd pull the trigger.  I only had to wait three days.  Felicia wrote me up for "dressing inappropriately."  This was a call center, so we could wear what we wanted as long as it was clean and in good taste.  I am the most conservative dresser on the planet.  The "inappropriate" garment in question was a University of Virginia sweatshirt.

Why did Felicia find it offensive?

She went to Virginia Tech.

I am TOTALLY not kidding. 

I stood up, ripped up the form and said "I quit."

"Dear, I don't think you can afford to quit," Felicia said.

I still remember beaming and saying "Actually, Felicia, I can" and the stunned look on her face as I left her cube.

I heard later on that Felicia ended up getting transferred to the Kansas City branch of the company.  I wonder how many people she wrote up for wearing Jayhawks shirts ...

The only thing that would have made it better is if you had fired back some southern sass at her 'dear'ing you. A little "oh, sweetie, bless your heart, but I think I can afford to quit. Toodle ooh" said in a way that sounds sweet, but really tells her ' go F yourself PEACE OUT!'

Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: protostache on November 25, 2015, 05:57:46 PM
Today Mr. Mandalay reminded me of how I left my job prior to this one.

I was in upper echelon customer service for an entertainment company.  I loved the job, I loved my supervisor, and my coworkers were awesome.  However, my supervisor was involved in a very serious car accident and wouldn't be back for months while he was recuperating.  The powers that be did a little shuffling, and so Felicia came to preside over the group.

Felicia was the living embodiment of Dolores Umbridge.  She was all smiles and sweet voice, but she remains the nastiest person it's ever been my misfortune to know.  My group had heard horror stories about her for ages, and now we started to live them.  She wrote people up for the stupidest shit.  How stupid?  Try coming back from lunch 75 SECONDS late (yes, she counted).  Laughing while talking with customers ("you really must be more professional, dear"--this was me BTW).  She wrote one woman up for combing her hair at her desk.  And then of course the "dear."  There were regular outbursts of "Are you KIDDING me?!?!?!" coming over her cube wall.  And God, she nitpicked EVERYTHING, but management backed her up without question.  After roughly a month I didn't know whether I was going to go suicidal or homicidal, even though unlike my coworkers I'd only been written up once.  After Mr. Mandalay heard me coming in from work, slamming my purse on the counter and screaming "GAAAAAH FUCKING FELICIA!!!!" for the twentieth time he said over dinner "if you're that fucking miserable, quit.  We've got enough saved, we'll be okay for a while."

I was still nervous, so I vowed to myself that Felicia would have to do something heinous before I'd pull the trigger.  I only had to wait three days.  Felicia wrote me up for "dressing inappropriately."  This was a call center, so we could wear what we wanted as long as it was clean and in good taste.  I am the most conservative dresser on the planet.  The "inappropriate" garment in question was a University of Virginia sweatshirt.

Why did Felicia find it offensive?

She went to Virginia Tech.

I am TOTALLY not kidding. 

I stood up, ripped up the form and said "I quit."

"Dear, I don't think you can afford to quit," Felicia said.

I still remember beaming and saying "Actually, Felicia, I can" and the stunned look on her face as I left her cube.

I heard later on that Felicia ended up getting transferred to the Kansas City branch of the company.  I wonder how many people she wrote up for wearing Jayhawks shirts ...

The only thing that would have made it better is if you had fired back some southern sass at her 'dear'ing you. A little "oh, sweetie, bless your heart, but I think I can afford to quit. Toodle ooh" said in a way that sounds sweet, but really tells her ' go F yourself PEACE OUT!'

Beautiful! Although I would have ended it with "Bye Felicia" as I was walking out the door, but that's just me.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: nobodyspecial on November 25, 2015, 07:46:12 PM
...The "inappropriate" garment in question was a University of Virginia sweatshirt.

Why did Felicia find it offensive?

She went to Virginia Tech.

I am TOTALLY not kidding. 

I stood up, ripped up the form and said "I quit."

"Dear, I don't think you can afford to quit," Felicia said.

I still remember beaming and saying "Actually, Felicia, I can" and the stunned look on her face as I left her cube.

Tell her that the company was paying you a special U of Virginia bonus
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: jorjor on November 26, 2015, 02:50:38 PM
My buddy told a story at Thanksgiving about a coworker who quit by taking a dump on his boss's keyboard and leaving a note.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: EnjoyIt on November 30, 2015, 02:15:56 PM
Long time lurker first time poster:

My FU money story:  New management took over, and my role became more and more demanding.  They would consistently keep pushing me and my team to do things I did not agree with and I did not feel was the right path to getting the job done. They never stepped foot in our area and didn't understand the dynamics of our facility.  I would write long emails and have discussions with my managers in regards to a better way to accomplish our goals, they would get completely ignored, and they continued to push their own agendas. This just kept leading to more and more stress, frustration, and dissatisfaction in my job.  Eventually I decided something needs to change. I have plenty of FU money and at this point did not care if I lost my job or not. I set up a meeting with my managers, told them that they need to listen to their employees, the ones who are actually working in the field and know how to get the job done and that they need to stop ignoring me. If this is not something that they are willing to do, then they should stop wasting my and their time, let me know and I will hand in my resignation. Since then, they have taken my recommendations, our team is more successful than ever, and my job is much more satisfying. Even my managers look good due to our recent success.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: jlajr on November 30, 2015, 11:21:12 PM
...Since then, they have taken my recommendations, our team is more successful than ever, and my job is much more satisfying. Even my managers look good due to our recent success.

Shit, I wish my managers would have reacted the same way as your managers did.

Two of my managers have basically told me if I don't like the way they are (mis)managing me and my team, "The door's always open".

While I have some FU money, I have for the past few months chosen to not resign and spend any of that FU money, endure the frustration and dissatisfaction, and look for other opportunities. Unfortunately, any other opportunity in my profession involves moving, and I'd rather not do that either. The proverbial rock and a hard place. On the other hand, any other opportunity in my field would also likely involve a significantly higher salary, so there's that...

I've basically decided to stop actively looking for another opportunity. I think I'll wait six months or a year, take a nice long vacation, resign, resume looking for another opportunity, and move, either with a new job or not.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: MandalayVA on December 01, 2015, 08:47:34 AM
The only thing that would have made it better is if you had fired back some southern sass at her 'dear'ing you. A little "oh, sweetie, bless your heart, but I think I can afford to quit. Toodle ooh" said in a way that sounds sweet, but really tells her ' go F yourself PEACE OUT!'

Despite the fact that I've lived in the south for twenty years my Jersey blood doesn't allow me to do sass.  :D  And what makes the whole thing hilarious is that I didn't even GO to UVA.  If I'd worn my William & Mary shirt she might have thought me an elitist, ha hah.  I see the college rivalry in my own family (Florida vs. Florida State) and mock everyone for taking it so seriously ...
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Pooperman on December 01, 2015, 09:14:59 AM
The only thing that would have made it better is if you had fired back some southern sass at her 'dear'ing you. A little "oh, sweetie, bless your heart, but I think I can afford to quit. Toodle ooh" said in a way that sounds sweet, but really tells her ' go F yourself PEACE OUT!'

Despite the fact that I've lived in the south for twenty years my Jersey blood doesn't allow me to do sass.  :D  And what makes the whole thing hilarious is that I didn't even GO to UVA.  If I'd worn my William & Mary shirt she might have thought me an elitist, ha hah.  I see the college rivalry in my own family (Florida vs. Florida State) and mock everyone for taking it so seriously ...

Mom went to W&M law school. Speaking of college rivalries, I went to the university that's part of The Rivalry.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: cautiouspessimist on December 01, 2015, 09:45:56 AM
The only thing that would have made it better is if you had fired back some southern sass at her 'dear'ing you. A little "oh, sweetie, bless your heart, but I think I can afford to quit. Toodle ooh" said in a way that sounds sweet, but really tells her ' go F yourself PEACE OUT!'

Despite the fact that I've lived in the south for twenty years my Jersey blood doesn't allow me to do sass.  :D  And what makes the whole thing hilarious is that I didn't even GO to UVA.  If I'd worn my William & Mary shirt she might have thought me an elitist, ha hah.  I see the college rivalry in my own family (Florida vs. Florida State) and mock everyone for taking it so seriously ...

Mom went to W&M law school. Speaking of college rivalries, I went to the university that's part of The Rivalry.

Ohio State?
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Pooperman on December 01, 2015, 10:04:17 AM
The only thing that would have made it better is if you had fired back some southern sass at her 'dear'ing you. A little "oh, sweetie, bless your heart, but I think I can afford to quit. Toodle ooh" said in a way that sounds sweet, but really tells her ' go F yourself PEACE OUT!'

Despite the fact that I've lived in the south for twenty years my Jersey blood doesn't allow me to do sass.  :D  And what makes the whole thing hilarious is that I didn't even GO to UVA.  If I'd worn my William & Mary shirt she might have thought me an elitist, ha hah.  I see the college rivalry in my own family (Florida vs. Florida State) and mock everyone for taking it so seriously ...

Mom went to W&M law school. Speaking of college rivalries, I went to the university that's part of The Rivalry.

Ohio State?
Lehigh University (the other side is Lafayette College). It's the only football rivalry called The Rivalry (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Rivalry_(Lehigh%E2%80%93Lafayette)).
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: cautiouspessimist on December 01, 2015, 10:31:33 AM
The only thing that would have made it better is if you had fired back some southern sass at her 'dear'ing you. A little "oh, sweetie, bless your heart, but I think I can afford to quit. Toodle ooh" said in a way that sounds sweet, but really tells her ' go F yourself PEACE OUT!'

Despite the fact that I've lived in the south for twenty years my Jersey blood doesn't allow me to do sass.  :D  And what makes the whole thing hilarious is that I didn't even GO to UVA.  If I'd worn my William & Mary shirt she might have thought me an elitist, ha hah.  I see the college rivalry in my own family (Florida vs. Florida State) and mock everyone for taking it so seriously ...

Mom went to W&M law school. Speaking of college rivalries, I went to the university that's part of The Rivalry.

Ohio State?
Lehigh University (the other side is Lafayette College). It's the only football rivalry called The Rivalry (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Rivalry_(Lehigh%E2%80%93Lafayette)).


Yeah, I was just joking (though, no, I didn't know for sure what rivalry you were talking about).
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: UnleashHell on December 01, 2015, 02:54:50 PM

If he moves me anyway, when I resign next spring, I will tell him that it was because he moved my office just to mess with him...

Nice. made me chuckle.

Not an FU story but on a similar theme when I quit the last job I had I told them it was because they hired another British person (I live in the US). I'd been looking for another job for a while and it was just pure coincidence that the day I planned on handing in my notice HR is introducing this other British expat on his first day. Purely for shits and giggles when I handed my notice in to my boss that afternoon when he got in the office I told him it was because they hired another British person and that was my thing here in the company. They even went as far as saying they'd let the other guy go and which point I told them the fact they'd even thought about brining in another British person in was enough and I felt hurt and was obviously not fulfilling the token British guy role adequately (plus I did not want the new guy to lose his job here as I was leaving anyhow). Worked my notice and left, to this day they think that is the reason I left!

Ha!!

I might try something similar when I quit but tell them that I'm sick of one person in the office trying to do a British accent and I can't take it anymore. Sadly I have a year to wait.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: NorcalBlue on December 02, 2015, 12:07:31 AM
delete
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: lcerrito on December 02, 2015, 06:52:29 AM
Not a particularly extravagant FU Story, but more of a quiet (yet immensely satisfying) one. Sorry for the length!

I worked as an apparel designer for the last five years at a large clothing retailer located in the Midwest. Last January, the brand decides that it wants to be like all the other fashion brands and have fancy-pants NYC designers. They laid off the Wear-to-Work (dressier clothes) half  of the design team, but asked them to stay for three months while they found their NYC replacements. Whether they truly thought that geographical location was relative to talent or they simply didn't want to pay relocation costs to the Midwestern designers, I don't know. We were told that the Casual half would be staying in the Midwest. I, being a very cynical person, didn't believe a word they said.

On top of that, my new (NYC based) VP who I reported directly to, was a complete and total sociopath. I don't use that term lightly or in ignorance. She genuinely was. On top of that, she was an HR nightmare and a walking litigation. She told me to tell my assistant to wear more makeup, that I needed to wear lipstick, dress in designer clothing, etc. Our company handbook only says that we can't wear bike shorts, rubber flip flops, or inappropriately fitting clothing. There was bullying, fat shaming, calling other employees "mentally ill" and "stupid." She would constantly contradict herself and blame all of her mistakes on other people's supposed ignorance.

I quietly documented every single statement. I met with HR periodically, which was useless since she was the new golden child, so I quietly documented those meetings as well. I updated my resume and started reaching out to my contacts and advised my team to do the same.

Fast forward ten very stress and anger filled months and I was told my position was being eliminated along with the rest of the remaining design team, but that (in a very cheerful voice) "We'd like to extend your employment for another four months!" They had not hired a single new person in NYC for my department yet. I had anticipated this layoff (they put 10 minute meetings in succession on everyone's calendar the day before... stupid.) and brought all my documentation. I asked if it would be easier to negotiate my severance now or later when the legal documents had been drafted. The HR lady replied, "I don't think there is any room for negotiation."

I pushed the stack of documentation toward her, and replied, "Actually, I think there is." That moment still gives me a thrill, lol.

Needless to say, her face went white, my severance amount was greatly increased, and a legal investigation was initiated against my boss.

Less than two weeks later, my entire team and I turned in our resignation letters all at the same time and walked out of the building with big fat severance checks and job offers from other companies. Almost a month later and they still have not found replacements for my team, and they are panicking. I guess they thought all fashion designers were dumb ding-dongs who would meekly stay for four months while they found our replacements. In fairness, there ARE several designers in my company with debt/no FU money who are doing just that.

Not my team. My team all had FU money saved up, and we ended up not even needing it. I got a job offer four hours after I interviewed. It seems not every company thinks geographical location is directly related to intelligence and talent.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Sibley on December 02, 2015, 07:22:22 AM
Not a particularly extravagant FU Story, but more of a quiet (yet immensely satisfying) one. Sorry for the length!


You may not think that's extravagant, but I certainly do! Very cool the way you handled it.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: G-dog on December 02, 2015, 07:29:23 AM
  "asked if it would be easier to negotiate my severance now or later when the legal documents had been drafted. The HR lady replied, "I don't think there is any room for negotiation."

I pushed the stack of documentation toward her, and replied, "Actually, I think there is." That moment still gives me a thrill, lol.

Needless to say, her face went white, my severance amount was greatly increased, and a legal investigation was initiated against my boss."

Lcerrito - my god that must have felt SO GOOD! So glad that you and your team were in a position to stick up for yourselves!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: arebelspy on December 02, 2015, 08:04:25 AM
How did you turn in resignation letters and get severance?  Basically hush money to sign a "I won't sue" document, not really severance?  I was anticipating the story ending with you saying no to the extra 4 months, and just taking the severance, and them being shocked/having to scramble. But the resignation letters threw me.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: DeepEllumStache on December 02, 2015, 08:24:43 AM
Not a particularly extravagant FU Story, but more of a quiet (yet immensely satisfying) one. Sorry for the length!

That was rather beautiful. Well played.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: AlanStache on December 02, 2015, 08:43:53 AM
Great stuff, just following. 
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: AmandaS1989 on December 02, 2015, 08:50:17 AM
That was awesome! And +1 to AlanStache for his signature ;)
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: AlanStache on December 02, 2015, 09:02:01 AM
That was awesome! And +1 to AlanStache for his signature ;)

That signature has kept me in check and stopped me from posting more than one reply :-)
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Gone Fishing on December 02, 2015, 09:37:38 AM
That was awesome! And +1 to AlanStache for his signature ;)

That signature has kept me in check and stopped me from posting more than one reply :-)

As an aside, it looks like Mr. Rogers had plenty of FI/FU money in the event they ever gave him shit...

http://www.celebritynetworth.com/richest-celebrities/actors/fred-rogers-net-worth/

I wonder if he got his sweaters at thrift shops?
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: AmandaS1989 on December 02, 2015, 09:40:10 AM
His mom made the sweaters for him is what I was told
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Gone Fishing on December 02, 2015, 09:47:08 AM
His mom made the sweaters for him is what I was told

Even better!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: gaja on December 02, 2015, 09:51:44 AM
His mom made the sweaters for him is what I was told

I googled that for you: http://www.fredrogers.org/frc/news/mister-rogers-shares-how-his-mother-showed-love

But thanks for the googling tip. Lovely little story.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: arebelspy on December 02, 2015, 12:06:50 PM

His mom made the sweaters for him is what I was told

I googled that for you: http://www.fredrogers.org/frc/news/mister-rogers-shares-how-his-mother-showed-love

But thanks for the googling tip. Lovely little story.

That was wonderful. Thanks for sharing! :)
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: mm1970 on December 02, 2015, 12:56:39 PM
Not a particularly extravagant FU Story, but more of a quiet (yet immensely satisfying) one. Sorry for the length!


You may not think that's extravagant, but I certainly do! Very cool the way you handled it.
I agree, bravo!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: lcerrito on December 02, 2015, 04:17:55 PM
How did you turn in resignation letters and get severance?  Basically hush money to sign a "I won't sue" document, not really severance?  I was anticipating the story ending with you saying no to the extra 4 months, and just taking the severance, and them being shocked/having to scramble. But the resignation letters threw me.

You're correct that the severance was basically "Hush money." If I had stayed the extra four months I would have gotten a bonus that was the equivalent of two paychecks. It took them over a week to draft the severance documents, and at that point I only had job interviews scheduled. Once I got the legal drafts and the job offer, I was out!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: lcerrito on December 02, 2015, 04:20:51 PM
Not a particularly extravagant FU Story, but more of a quiet (yet immensely satisfying) one. Sorry for the length!


You may not think that's extravagant, but I certainly do! Very cool the way you handled it.
I agree, bravo!

Thanks. :) Believe me it took a lot of restraint to not do something crazily epic. Leaving them high and dry was very, very satisfying.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: arebelspy on December 02, 2015, 04:23:41 PM
Nice. Well done lining up the new job, so you could immediately take the severance, resign, and peace out. :D
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: TaxChick on December 02, 2015, 08:11:11 PM
I am pretty sure I am working up to my own story in the near future. Posting to follow.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Vertical Mode on December 03, 2015, 04:06:32 PM
Posting to follow because these stories are great entertainment, but I also thought this piece from HBS was interesting in light of what we're talking about:

http://news.harvard.edu/gazette/story/2015/11/those-toxic-co-workers/
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: scottish on December 04, 2015, 03:57:17 PM
Here's a great story about an IT worker who was let go without even an exit interview:

http://www.theregister.co.uk/2015/12/04/sysadmins_100000_revenge_after_sudden_sacking/ (http://www.theregister.co.uk/2015/12/04/sysadmins_100000_revenge_after_sudden_sacking/)
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Threshkin on December 04, 2015, 04:12:31 PM
Here's a great story about an IT worker who was let go without even an exit interview:

http://www.theregister.co.uk/2015/12/04/sysadmins_100000_revenge_after_sudden_sacking/ (http://www.theregister.co.uk/2015/12/04/sysadmins_100000_revenge_after_sudden_sacking/)

Not exactly a FU story but pretty funny all the same.  "Penny wise and pound foolish"
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: G-dog on December 04, 2015, 04:21:30 PM
Here's a great story about an IT worker who was let go without even an exit interview:

http://www.theregister.co.uk/2015/12/04/sysadmins_100000_revenge_after_sudden_sacking/ (http://www.theregister.co.uk/2015/12/04/sysadmins_100000_revenge_after_sudden_sacking/)

Not exactly a FU story but pretty funny all the same.  "Penny wise and pound foolish"

Good story, but the title is misleading as the system in did NOT take revenge on the company in response to getting sacked, rather the company screwed themselves over (which the system in did not not feel bad about) - corporate karma!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: scottish on December 05, 2015, 08:04:36 AM
Yep, the title was inflammatory.   I thought it was a great story though.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: G-dog on December 05, 2015, 10:27:20 AM
Yep, the title was inflammatory.   I thought it was a great story though.

It is a great story - it illustrates several consequences of the short-term thinking, lack of respect for employees, and disengagement of management that is too prevalent in many organizations
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Faraday on December 06, 2015, 06:51:02 PM
Yep, the title was inflammatory.   I thought it was a great story though.

Typical of TheRegister. I absolutely hate their yellowish journalism.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: DoubleDown on December 11, 2015, 12:47:10 PM
On the one hand, I commend people for leaving a toxic work environment, especially when they have the easy financial means to do it. On the other, some of these stories leave me thinking good people are letting the occasional asshole get the better of them, and that by leaving they're just letting the asshole disrupt the good person's life and continue to merrily abuse everyone else who remains. I wish some of these stories would end along the lines of, "So I told the CEO, either the asshole leaves or I do. They fired the asshole."

Like using a stupid college rivalry as grounds to file an actual, written reprimand against an employee?? Man, I'd tell that person (in a strictly professional way) they better go f*ck themselves first, because if they write me up for something like that they will definitely get f*cked way worse.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: rantk81 on December 11, 2015, 01:47:29 PM
I've found that as I've approached and surpassed having "FU Money", I've felt less and less inclined to ever have to use it.

Someone is being a dick at work?  So what...  So I disengage and surf the web for a while.  What's the worst that happens, they let me go in the next layoff round? LOL.

Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: JLee on December 11, 2015, 02:01:22 PM
I've found that as I've approached and surpassed having "FU Money", I've felt less and less inclined to ever have to use it.

Someone is being a dick at work?  So what...  So I disengage and surf the web for a while.  What's the worst that happens, they let me go in the next layoff round? LOL.

Heh reminds me of when I had planned a vacation before I had the time off approved.  One of my coworkers was like 'but what if they say no?'  I told her I already bought my flight, so I'm going anyway, and absolute worst case I'll just go find another job when I get back.  She was pretty shocked, haha.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: mm1970 on December 11, 2015, 03:51:10 PM
On the one hand, I commend people for leaving a toxic work environment, especially when they have the easy financial means to do it. On the other, some of these stories leave me thinking good people are letting the occasional asshole get the better of them, and that by leaving they're just letting the asshole disrupt the good person's life and continue to merrily abuse everyone else who remains. I wish some of these stories would end along the lines of, "So I told the CEO, either the asshole leaves or I do. They fired the asshole."

Like using a stupid college rivalry as grounds to file an actual, written reprimand against an employee?? Man, I'd tell that person (in a strictly professional way) they better go f*ck themselves first, because if they write me up for something like that they will definitely get f*cked way worse.
I just read an article that discussed how expensive a toxic employee is - does WAY more damage and cost than hiring 5 good employees!

That doesn't prevent companies from hiring toxic employees and keeping them around.   I've experienced this first hand.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: mm1970 on December 11, 2015, 03:52:27 PM
I've found that as I've approached and surpassed having "FU Money", I've felt less and less inclined to ever have to use it.

Someone is being a dick at work?  So what...  So I disengage and surf the web for a while.  What's the worst that happens, they let me go in the next layoff round? LOL.

Heh reminds me of when I had planned a vacation before I had the time off approved.  One of my coworkers was like 'but what if they say no?'  I told her I already bought my flight, so I'm going anyway, and absolute worst case I'll just go find another job when I get back.  She was pretty shocked, haha.
There were actually people, in a specific group at my last company, that would cancel vacation plans because of last minute company needs. I couldn't believe it.

I would never never do that.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: CabinetGuy on December 11, 2015, 03:55:49 PM
On the one hand, I commend people for leaving a toxic work environment, especially when they have the easy financial means to do it. On the other, some of these stories leave me thinking good people are letting the occasional asshole get the better of them, and that by leaving they're just letting the asshole disrupt the good person's life and continue to merrily abuse everyone else who remains. I wish some of these stories would end along the lines of, "So I told the CEO, either the asshole leaves or I do. They fired the asshole."

Like using a stupid college rivalry as grounds to file an actual, written reprimand against an employee?? Man, I'd tell that person (in a strictly professional way) they better go f*ck themselves first, because if they write me up for something like that they will definitely get f*cked way worse.

One bonus for working in construction:  I can tell people to go fuck themselves in a non-professional manner.  No need to parse words, sometimes vulgarity is a necessity.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: bzzzt on December 11, 2015, 10:31:23 PM
There were actually people, in a specific group at my last company, that would cancel vacation plans because of last minute company needs. I couldn't believe it.

I would never never do that.

I keep toying with the idea of throwing my resume at a company that not only would the company ask, they've literally called employees while on vacation and told them they need to get back.

The job security and money are great, but damn is that a kick in the junk. Pre-MMM and kids, I would've jumped at the opportunity, but now I'm not so sure if it's for me anymore.

FU Money: letting reforming work-a-holics make better lifestyle choices.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: dandarc on December 14, 2015, 08:52:56 AM
There were actually people, in a specific group at my last company, that would cancel vacation plans because of last minute company needs. I couldn't believe it.

I would never never do that.

I keep toying with the idea of throwing my resume at a company that not only would the company ask, they've literally called employees while on vacation and told them they need to get back.

The job security and money are great, but damn is that a kick in the junk. Pre-MMM and kids, I would've jumped at the opportunity, but now I'm not so sure if it's for me anymore.

FU Money: letting reforming work-a-holics make better lifestyle choices.
If the money really is great, and you've got no problem executing the 'FU' part, you might give it a go.  You might be the guy that gets the culture changed by not answering the phone when you're on vacation and / or simply saying no.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: mm1970 on December 14, 2015, 11:51:47 AM
There were actually people, in a specific group at my last company, that would cancel vacation plans because of last minute company needs. I couldn't believe it.

I would never never do that.

I keep toying with the idea of throwing my resume at a company that not only would the company ask, they've literally called employees while on vacation and told them they need to get back.

The job security and money are great, but damn is that a kick in the junk. Pre-MMM and kids, I would've jumped at the opportunity, but now I'm not so sure if it's for me anymore.

FU Money: letting reforming work-a-holics make better lifestyle choices.
If the money really is great, and you've got no problem executing the 'FU' part, you might give it a go.  You might be the guy that gets the culture changed by not answering the phone when you're on vacation and / or simply saying no.

Yes, this.  I like to think that I did a bit of that at that company too.

For one, thing, that one group were pretty hard line on PTO.  I mean, if I worked 80 hours in 2 weeks (usually it was 90), I never took vacation time, right?  I mean, really.

But I had friends in the other group that would take 4 hours of vacation if they left work early on Friday. I said "you are exempt, and you've worked 90 hours already this pay period". 

"Well, when I asked my boss, he said..."

Newsflash people: don't ask.  The online computer timecard system DOES NOT CARE when the hours are.  In fact, it only flags the system if you are under 80 for the pay period (and back then, you still got paid the full amount.  I know because I had one pay period at 79.5 hours).

Eventually (took a few years), I convinced the engineers to stop asking and just take advantage of being exempt.  Especially since the pay was shitty (a good $20k under market), and the bosses were all PhD's making $120k+ (10 years ago), and all of whom had made at least a million on the buyout.

It is simply NOT RIGHT for the company to expect you to give them everything, do what it takes, work 100 hours in 2 weeks on a deadline, but expect you to take 3 hours of PTO if you leave early to take your kid to the dentist.  WTF??
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Josiecat on December 14, 2015, 04:13:45 PM
Why are people answering work calls when they are on vacation?  Crazy.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Threshkin on December 14, 2015, 04:47:12 PM
Why are people answering work calls when they are on vacation?  Crazy.

Agreed.  I avoid this by going someplace where "I do not have cell phone coverage".  Sorry but I will not be able to take your call while i am gone.  If your call is urgent, please contact my manager at xxx-xxx-xxxx.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: scottish on December 14, 2015, 04:48:58 PM
:-)   I used to do that.   "Just check your e-mail everyday"    "Sorry, no internet or electricity off the west coast of BC"  "What?"
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Kitsune on December 14, 2015, 05:57:36 PM
:-)   I used to do that.   "Just check your e-mail everyday"    "Sorry, no internet or electricity off the west coast of BC"  "What?"

Verbatim, from my last job:
Me: 'I'll be at the family lake. No cell reception or internet. Back in 2 weeks.'
Boss: 'But... but... what do we do if there's an emergency???!!?'
Me: 'Well, *assistant who was going to take over my job while I was on maternity leave a few months later* is well-trained and knows everything that's going on. So: she can figure it out, or if it's a big enough emergency, she can drive 3 hours out to tell me about it in person, she has the address.'

Oh, man, the look on her face.

I still think that's an excellent way to calibrate 'emergency'. If it's worth 6 hours of driving for me to fix it, FINE, you may disturb my vacation for a half-hour while I work miracles on your issue. Until then, you're paid to handle this problem, so fix it, I don't care how.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: GreenSheep on December 14, 2015, 06:32:37 PM
Kitsune, I completely agree. I'm lucky enough to have a job that is OVER the minute I walk out the door each day, but I'm constantly shaking my head at friends who allow themselves to be sucked into this crap over and over. If the company is set up so that someone is that indispensable, they are doing something seriously wrong. What if that person drops dead? And really, I doubt anyone is that indispensable. It's just that no one else wants to deal with it while they're away. But a vacation should be a VACATION. Not "do whatever you want until we need/want you, then drop everything."
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Kitsune on December 14, 2015, 06:35:59 PM
And because "emergency" doesn't mean "it would be faster if Kitsune did it". I'm not there, someone else can figure it out. This is not brain surgery, I am not the only one who can do this stuff. Do it quickly, maybe, but it CAN be done by someone else, so figure it out.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: MoonShadow on December 14, 2015, 07:59:54 PM
On the one hand, I commend people for leaving a toxic work environment, especially when they have the easy financial means to do it. On the other, some of these stories leave me thinking good people are letting the occasional asshole get the better of them, and that by leaving they're just letting the asshole disrupt the good person's life and continue to merrily abuse everyone else who remains. I wish some of these stories would end along the lines of, "So I told the CEO, either the asshole leaves or I do. They fired the asshole."

Like using a stupid college rivalry as grounds to file an actual, written reprimand against an employee?? Man, I'd tell that person (in a strictly professional way) they better go f*ck themselves first, because if they write me up for something like that they will definitely get f*cked way worse.

One bonus for working in construction:  I can tell people to go fuck themselves in a non-professional manner.  No need to parse words, sometimes vulgarity is a necessity.

Yes, this is the one part of construction work that I miss.  Anytime that some boss threatened to fire me, my response was always, "Don't threaten me with a good time."
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Malaysia41 on December 14, 2015, 10:51:58 PM
I've found that as I've approached and surpassed having "FU Money", I've felt less and less inclined to ever have to use it.

Someone is being a dick at work?  So what...  So I disengage and surf the web for a while.  What's the worst that happens, they let me go in the next layoff round? LOL.

As much as many people around here say they want to be laid off, I suspect it's not such a lighthearted experience. Sure, you get extra money, but I imagine it'd be an ego blow for those of us who don't have the most iron-clad of egos / a total absence of ego.

I was playing poker with some shit-talking expats the other day. They asked what I did for work, as people do. I explained that DH and I had quit our jobs and were living off of savings ( I find that's the most succinct way to put it and have people understand FIRE without explaining FIRE).  A few hands into the game, Craig looked at me sideways. He asked, "were you laid off?"

His question was LOADED with judgement. I could tell that if I had been laid off, he'd think less of me. Not that it mattered in the grand scheme - but the judgement was palpable. I answered honestly, no I hadn't been laid off, it had been my choice. But wow. It hit me that there's more to being laid off than receiving a fat check.  Loads of judgement would come from others, and, perhaps, from self.  Yes, I'm sure I could withstand it and yes, being financially compensated would help. But, it wouldn't be a walk in the park.  It's not something I'd wish for.

.... well of course there's probably a dollar value where I *would* wish for it.  Maybe a couple million, after taxes?  I think I could deal with an ego blow for a couple mil.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: MoonShadow on December 14, 2015, 11:17:38 PM
I've found that as I've approached and surpassed having "FU Money", I've felt less and less inclined to ever have to use it.

Someone is being a dick at work?  So what...  So I disengage and surf the web for a while.  What's the worst that happens, they let me go in the next layoff round? LOL.

As much as many people around here say they want to be laid off, I suspect it's not such a lighthearted experience. Sure, you get extra money, but I imagine it'd be an ego blow for those of us who don't have the most iron-clad of egos / a total absence of ego.


Getting laid off is just part of the deal with construction, though.  It's counterproductive to threaten most veteran construction workers with a lay-off, because most of them expect it eventually anyway.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Malaysia41 on December 14, 2015, 11:25:24 PM
I've found that as I've approached and surpassed having "FU Money", I've felt less and less inclined to ever have to use it.

Someone is being a dick at work?  So what...  So I disengage and surf the web for a while.  What's the worst that happens, they let me go in the next layoff round? LOL.

As much as many people around here say they want to be laid off, I suspect it's not such a lighthearted experience. Sure, you get extra money, but I imagine it'd be an ego blow for those of us who don't have the most iron-clad of egos / a total absence of ego.


Getting laid off is just part of the deal with construction, though.  It's counterproductive to threaten most veteran construction workers with a lay-off, because most of them expect it eventually anyway.

Ah, yes. If it's from an industry where it's business as usual, I can see that.  Where I came from, being laid off came with stigma.  My poker buddies were in similar industries as I was in.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: AlanStache on December 15, 2015, 07:50:23 AM
:-)   I used to do that.   "Just check your e-mail everyday"    "Sorry, no internet or electricity off the west coast of BC"  "What?"

Verbatim, from my last job:
Me: 'I'll be at the family lake. No cell reception or internet. Back in 2 weeks.'
Boss: 'But... but... what do we do if there's an emergency???!!?'
Me: 'Well, *assistant who was going to take over my job while I was on maternity leave a few months later* is well-trained and knows everything that's going on. So: she can figure it out, or if it's a big enough emergency, she can drive 3 hours out to tell me about it in person, she has the address.'

Oh, man, the look on her face.

I still think that's an excellent way to calibrate 'emergency'. If it's worth 6 hours of driving for me to fix it, FINE, you may disturb my vacation for a half-hour while I work miracles on your issue. Until then, you're paid to handle this problem, so fix it, I don't care how.

IIRC the guy from "The Last Lecture" when he went on his honeymoon told his boss that he would only take calls from his mother in law and gave his boss her number.  And that if something was that on fire his boss could call his mother in law and explain the problem and then she could call him.

Also highly recommend "The Last Lecture" if you have not read it.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Rubic on December 15, 2015, 02:25:21 PM
IIRC the guy from "The Last Lecture" when he went on his honeymoon told his boss that he would only take calls from his mother in law and gave his boss her number.  And that if something was that on fire his boss could call his mother in law and explain the problem and then she could call him.

Also highly recommend "The Last Lecture" if you have not read it.

I actually attended a Randy Pausch lecture many years before his "Last Lecture".  I almost skipped it, because the subject -- human-computer-interaction -- wasn't something I was particularly interested in at the time.  (I've since become much more interested.)  Anyway, the lecture was funny, inspiring, and fascinating.  I've used the lessons learned from that brief introduction to the topic in discussions with other UI developers.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: nawhite on December 15, 2015, 02:51:59 PM
IIRC the guy from "The Last Lecture" when he went on his honeymoon told his boss that he would only take calls from his mother in law and gave his boss her number.  And that if something was that on fire his boss could call his mother in law and explain the problem and then she could call him.

Also highly recommend "The Last Lecture" if you have not read it.

I actually attended a Randy Pausch lecture many years before his "Last Lecture".  I almost skipped it, because the subject -- human-computer-interaction -- wasn't something I was particularly interested in at the time.  (I've since become much more interested.)  Anyway, the lecture was funny, inspiring, and fascinating.  I've used the lessons learned from that brief introduction to the topic in discussions with other UI developers.

The actual lecture the book is based on is available on youtube and I think much better presented than it is in the book: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ji5_MqicxSo

I was lucky enough to go to that lecture in person when it was given in 2007. Randy Pausch was a spectacular speaker and teacher. If you're ever in Pittsburgh near the end of a semester, see if you can get into the "Building Virtual Worlds" final presentation. That is the class that Pausch founded at CMU and even to this day, the spirit and excitement he fostered there can still be felt.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: jlajr on December 15, 2015, 10:12:55 PM
Anytime that some boss threatened to fire me, my response was always, "Don't threaten me with a good time."

Sweet.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: plainjane on December 16, 2015, 06:38:12 AM
Newsflash people: don't ask.  The online computer timecard system DOES NOT CARE when the hours are.  In fact, it only flags the system if you are under 80 for the pay period (and back then, you still got paid the full amount.  I know because I had one pay period at 79.5 hours).
The red flags would show up for violation #1 EVEN IF YOU HAD WORKED 20+ HOURS OVER THE WEEKEND FOR A PROGRAM EVENT!

Please note, a decent boss will let you put those weekend hours into the week days to make the time system happy.  Ditto for those times you can't use up the vacation days and you are in "use it or lose it" - you can put in that you took the days, and then in the subsequent month take the vacation and in the time system put in the hours you worked before the roll over.  Granted, you need to have a decent relationship with your boss, but this has rarely been a problem for me.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: AZDude on December 16, 2015, 09:41:39 AM
You know you can lie on your timecard....? The person using it in payroll probably has no one idea who you even are. There are other tricks too. We had a timeclock at one job, despite it allegedly being salary. If I wanted to leave early I would just "forget" to clock out, and tell the timekeeper the time I "left" the next day.

Of course, this only works if you are a quality employee who your boss likes having around and you treat your co-workers well so they don't raise a big stink and will defend you if necessary.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: dragoncar on December 16, 2015, 10:38:30 AM
You know you can lie on your timecard....? The person using it in payroll probably has no one idea who you even are. There are other tricks too. We had a timeclock at one job, despite it allegedly being salary. If I wanted to leave early I would just "forget" to clock out, and tell the timekeeper the time I "left" the next day.

Of course, this only works if you are a quality employee who your boss likes having around and you treat your co-workers well so they don't raise a big stink and will defend you if necessary.

It's a good way to get fired and potentially blacklisted.  I agree you can usually get away with it if your boss consents, but larger companies always have someone higher up who will nuke the department of they find out
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Dicey on December 16, 2015, 11:27:31 AM
As much as many people around here say they want to be laid off, I suspect it's not such a lighthearted experience. Sure, you get extra money, but I imagine it'd be an ego blow for those of us who don't have the most iron-clad of egos / a total absence of ego.

I was playing poker with some shit-talking expats the other day. They asked what I did for work, as people do. I explained that DH and I had quit our jobs and were living off of savings ( I find that's the most succinct way to put it and have people understand FIRE without explaining FIRE).  A few hands into the game, Craig looked at me sideways. He asked, "were you laid off?"

His question was LOADED with judgement. I could tell that if I had been laid off, he'd think less of me. Not that it mattered in the grand scheme - but the judgement was palpable. I answered honestly, no I hadn't been laid off, it had been my choice. But wow. It hit me that there's more to being laid off than receiving a fat check.  Loads of judgement would come from others, and, perhaps, from self.  Yes, I'm sure I could withstand it and yes, being financially compensated would help. But, it wouldn't be a walk in the park.  It's not something I'd wish for.

.... well of course there's probably a dollar value where I *would* wish for it.  Maybe a couple million, after taxes?  I think I could deal with an ego blow for a couple mil.
Oh, M41 this post makes me sad for you. Part of being Mustachian is that you just don't give a fuck about what other people think. He had probably been laid off and was still angry about it. I might have said, "Well, you could say I laid myself off, and I've been having fun ever since."

When I was a kid, my specialist ophthalmologist was all the way across town. My SAHM would schedule a late morning appointment to avoid traffic and then not bother to take me back to school, using the excuse that my eyes were still dilated. I always loved those appointments because I got a few hours off when everyone else was toiling away. I remember that feeling because I've taken joy in replicating it my entire adult life. Now that I'm RE, every day feels that way. It's awesome. I do feel like I'm getting away with something, and it's still a thrill. I just wish I could bottle up the feeling and sent some  to you.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: bzzzt on December 16, 2015, 11:33:28 AM
If the money really is great, and you've got no problem executing the 'FU' part, you might give it a go.  You might be the guy that gets the culture changed by not answering the phone when you're on vacation and / or simply saying no.

Well, I already make great money, so it wouldn't be that much of an upgrade. Not answering the phone gets you disciplined and eventually fired.

It is simply NOT RIGHT for the company to expect you to give them everything, do what it takes, work 100 hours in 2 weeks on a deadline, but expect you to take 3 hours of PTO if you leave early to take your kid to the dentist.  WTF??

That's the thing. At this company, with call outs, 50 hours might be 3 days some weeks. I told one of their guys that we were working overtime, 50hrs, and his reply literally was: "50hrs/week? I remember when I had a part time job like that."

Other work groups literally have forced overtime. 6-12s, 7-12s, for months. Want to take a vacation day on a Sunday? Have to burn 3 and take the weekend off.

Like I said, the workaholic in me wants to go for it, but having to hire a nanny would really cut into any extra money I'd make and my son would probably forget who I am.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Zamboni on December 16, 2015, 12:17:44 PM
^I have no idea why you would even consider working somewhere like that. Why do you even toy with the idea of working there? It is more interesting or prestigious our something?
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: RyanAtTanagra on December 16, 2015, 01:00:34 PM
I had a job that was kind of like that.  On call 24/7, up almost every night dealing with stuff, then in at 8am.  I thought that's what I had to do.  Then we hired a new admin and when he got called at night, depending on how long he was up he would come in late or not at all the next day.  If they asked why he was late he would say 'I was up last night at 3am working'.  Sometimes you just have the attitude of 'I already put in my hours last night/this week.  Say something, I dare you'.  Working long days and weeks occasionally happens when there's a special deadline or issue going on, but if it's a constant thing then that's a staffing issue, which is management's problem, not mine, imo.  I get paid for 40 hours/week (or however many your agreement is).  If that's not enough for the work to get done on a consistent basis, then hire more people.  These are exactly the things FU money is made for.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: PhrugalPhan on December 16, 2015, 01:45:01 PM
Not really a FU money story (as I didn't have FU money at the time), but I did have another job lined up, so this is close.  I finished my Master's degree and moved to the DC burbs to work with an "8(a) subcontractor".  I quickly found out working for 8(a) companies is a bad idea (unless you're not very talented).  The woman running the company (15 employees) was a royal pain and while charging over $100/hr. for our work was paying us about $20/hr.(benefits may have bumped it to $25/hr.).  And then she would try to find ways to save an extra dollar here or there and didn't worry how much it aggravated us (while she was always in late or leaving early to deal with her child and live-in nanny).  My favorites were when she tried to not pay for coffee at our rented offices (to save maybe $20/mo.) and when she didn't want to pay for parking under our building but pay for a nearby lot to save $8/mo.  But only for the guys there ("Its too dangerous for the women to walk over there").  She did lots of other things, but those two stuck out. 

Anyway, I found a job with a 50% pay raise after one month of looking, so I came in on a Friday planning to give 2 weeks notice.  First thing the other guy working on my project tells me is that he is giving a 2 week notice today to her.  I congratulate him but otherwise keep quiet.  At the weekly company meeting later that day, another guy is there chuckling about how he has another job and he is giving his 2 week notice.  "Can you believe we're doing it on the same day.  <boss lady> is going to be really pissed."  I give him a very blank look and say "What makes you think you'll be the last one to resign today?"  He laughs for a few seconds and stops when he realizes what I am saying.  He couldn't keep himself from grinning during the meeting.

You would think having 20% of your employees quitting on the same day would have an impact on her, but nope, still the same b**ch.  On my next to last day we are to meet her early that morning (before 9:00) at the client's office and work on their computers and install needed software.  She barely makes an appearance and after 30 minutes heads out saying we are to stay there when done so we can go over everything that happened with her when she returns (this could easily be done the next day, but whatever...).  She then never returns.  Well...we wait and wait, and wait, and wait...   I guess she did return at some point, as I didn't hear anything from her and finally I left at 4:30 (I hadn't eaten since breakfast at that point).  Next day, my last day, we have the company meeting to review things for the week, and she has the bells to point out I left without waiting for her and wanting an explanation as to why.  I'm sitting there thinking she can't be serious: "Its my last day and she expects me to back down from that - well guess again."  I clear my throat and start and review everything that happened yesterday, what she did, pointing out lots of mistakes in her behavior, and what I did, and end with "and that's why I left when I did".  After a few seconds of silence she starts in on the next item on her agenda never to bring that up again.

It would never get to that point with me any more.  I have enough that while not rich, I would survive just fine for a year or two until I got another job.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: bzzzt on December 16, 2015, 02:09:04 PM
^I have no idea why you would even consider working somewhere like that. Why do you even toy with the idea of working there? It is more interesting or prestigious our something?

I get paid by the hour. If you've got the money, Honey, I've got the time. ;)

Construction doesn't have the nice steady pace of most jobs. When there's work, you work as much as you can because when there's no work, you don't get paid. The week before I got married, I worked 119 hours in 7 days (5-16s, 1-17, 1-22). But, I paid for most of the wedding in that week. I worked 2600hrs in 39 weeks that year. So, 13 weeks off, no pay. If I was still single, I'd still be doing it.

More interesting, more money, stability, and like I said, I'm a reforming workaholic. I usually enjoy what I do.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: jordanread on December 16, 2015, 03:02:51 PM
^I have no idea why you would even consider working somewhere like that. Why do you even toy with the idea of working there? It is more interesting or prestigious our something?

I get paid by the hour. If you've got the money, Honey, I've got the time. ;)

Construction doesn't have the nice steady pace of most jobs. When there's work, you work as much as you can because when there's no work, you don't get paid. The week before I got married, I worked 119 hours in 7 days (5-16s, 1-17, 1-22). But, I paid for most of the wedding in that week. I worked 2600hrs in 39 weeks that year. So, 13 weeks off, no pay. If I was still single, I'd still be doing it.

More interesting, more money, stability, and like I said, I'm a reforming workaholic. I usually enjoy what I do.

Buried the lead a bit there, didn't you? ;) There is a lot of BS I will put up with if I really love what I do (not to say I will like the BS, or tolerate it, or not do everything in my power to prevent it), so that was the lead for me. That being said, HOLY CRAP you worked a crappy 7 days. I can only do that on drugs. I've done 100+ in a stretch, but once I sleep, I'm done being all ambitious.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: mm1970 on December 16, 2015, 04:46:50 PM
IIRC the guy from "The Last Lecture" when he went on his honeymoon told his boss that he would only take calls from his mother in law and gave his boss her number.  And that if something was that on fire his boss could call his mother in law and explain the problem and then she could call him.

Also highly recommend "The Last Lecture" if you have not read it.

I actually attended a Randy Pausch lecture many years before his "Last Lecture".  I almost skipped it, because the subject -- human-computer-interaction -- wasn't something I was particularly interested in at the time.  (I've since become much more interested.)  Anyway, the lecture was funny, inspiring, and fascinating.  I've used the lessons learned from that brief introduction to the topic in discussions with other UI developers.
I went to college at CMU (before  Randy Pausch started there).  I should read his last lecture.

Anyway, at my old job, when I went on a 2 week vacation - a senior coworker asked me for my cell phone #.  I didn't have one.  So I gave him my mom's phone #.

You'd be surprised at how reluctant a 30-something Chinese male is to call someone's mom.  (Even though he'd met her when she was visiting.)
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: arebelspy on December 16, 2015, 05:05:54 PM
I should read his last lecture.

Don't bother--it's one of the most overrated things I can think of.

(Yes, I'm sure that ruffled some feathers.  No offense intended if you enjoyed it.  Just chiming in with another view on it.)
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Pooperman on December 16, 2015, 05:54:57 PM
You know you can lie on your timecard....? The person using it in payroll probably has no one idea who you even are. There are other tricks too. We had a timeclock at one job, despite it allegedly being salary. If I wanted to leave early I would just "forget" to clock out, and tell the timekeeper the time I "left" the next day.

Of course, this only works if you are a quality employee who your boss likes having around and you treat your co-workers well so they don't raise a big stink and will defend you if necessary.

It's a good way to get fired and potentially blacklisted.  I agree you can usually get away with it if your boss consents, but larger companies always have someone higher up who will nuke the department of they find out

My organization had gotten in some extremely deep doo doo at one point due to timekeeping issues on certain contracts, so it was a major major deal.  You did NOT want to mess around with your timecard -- you and your boss were both at risk of immediate termination if there was any falsification.  You had to keep external records documenting all your billing in 15 minute increments.  Which wasted several hours a week, but that was apparently better than the consequences of not being so rigid.

And that is why that line of work is terrible and stressful. Not only do you have to log hours, but some percentage must be billable, and you only get a crappy bonus if you work like 80 hours a week (so you get like 45 billable hours)... So glad I don't do that anymore.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: nobodyspecial on December 16, 2015, 10:00:39 PM
And that is why that line of work is terrible and stressful. Not only do you have to log hours, but some percentage must be billable, and you only get a crappy bonus if you work like 80 hours a week (so you get like 45 billable hours)... So glad I don't do that anymore.
All time must be billed to a project  code.
But you can't bill to a project that is over budget and has used all its hours
And your hours have to add up to the standard 39 hour week - however long you were actually working.

Welcome to consultancy ... I didn't last long
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Malaysia41 on December 16, 2015, 10:49:59 PM
As much as many people around here say they want to be laid off, I suspect it's not such a lighthearted experience. Sure, you get extra money, but I imagine it'd be an ego blow for those of us who don't have the most iron-clad of egos / a total absence of ego.

I was playing poker with some shit-talking expats the other day. They asked what I did for work, as people do. I explained that DH and I had quit our jobs and were living off of savings ( I find that's the most succinct way to put it and have people understand FIRE without explaining FIRE).  A few hands into the game, Craig looked at me sideways. He asked, "were you laid off?"

His question was LOADED with judgement. I could tell that if I had been laid off, he'd think less of me. Not that it mattered in the grand scheme - but the judgement was palpable. I answered honestly, no I hadn't been laid off, it had been my choice. But wow. It hit me that there's more to being laid off than receiving a fat check.  Loads of judgement would come from others, and, perhaps, from self.  Yes, I'm sure I could withstand it and yes, being financially compensated would help. But, it wouldn't be a walk in the park.  It's not something I'd wish for.

.... well of course there's probably a dollar value where I *would* wish for it.  Maybe a couple million, after taxes?  I think I could deal with an ego blow for a couple mil.
Oh, M41 this post makes me sad for you. Part of being Mustachian is that you just don't give a fuck about what other people think. He had probably been laid off and was still angry about it. I might have said, "Well, you could say I laid myself off, and I've been having fun ever since."

When I was a kid, my specialist ophthalmologist was all the way across town. My SAHM would schedule a late morning appointment to avoid traffic and then not bother to take me back to school, using the excuse that my eyes were still dilated. I always loved those appointments because I got a few hours off when everyone else was toiling away. I remember that feeling because I've taken joy in replicating it my entire adult life. Now that I'm RE, every day feels that way. It's awesome. I do feel like I'm getting away with something, and it's still a thrill. I just wish I could bottle up the feeling and sent some  to you.

Thanks Diane C - but don't worry - I'm okay.  I too feel like I'm playing hooky sometimes and it feels great. I just know that if I had been laid off, it may have felt like rejection.  But, I can't say for sure, as I controlled my own FIRE. 

As much as I usually don't give a shit about what people think, there is that small part of me that does. I can't pretend it away. But that's okay. I'm a social human. 

My FIRE was a bit of an FU: on my weekly phone 1:1, my boss told me that I needed to come back to the US. They wanted my job to be done in CA.  I replied, "Umm, nah, we have enough money to live on, I think I'm done." My boss was quiet for a long time.  Then said, "really?  How does that work? I must admit, I'm kind of jealous." A week later, he said, "you can keep doing your job where you are" I said, "nah, I'm done."

Now I get to play hooky every day!  But I am bummed that my shit-talking expat poker buddies won't be able to get together til mid-Jan. :(. What's the point in all this free time if I can't play poker?
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Pooperman on December 17, 2015, 03:58:00 AM
And that is why that line of work is terrible and stressful. Not only do you have to log hours, but some percentage must be billable, and you only get a crappy bonus if you work like 80 hours a week (so you get like 45 billable hours)... So glad I don't do that anymore.
All time must be billed to a project  code.
But you can't bill to a project that is over budget and has used all its hours
And your hours have to add up to the standard 39 hour week - however long you were actually working.

Welcome to consultancy ... I didn't last long

My sanity didn't last long. I lasted 2 years.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: TomTX on December 17, 2015, 05:25:00 AM
As much as many people around here say they want to be laid off, I suspect it's not such a lighthearted experience. Sure, you get extra money, but I imagine it'd be an ego blow for those of us who don't have the most iron-clad of egos / a total absence of ego.

I was playing poker with some shit-talking expats the other day. They asked what I did for work, as people do. I explained that DH and I had quit our jobs and were living off of savings ( I find that's the most succinct way to put it and have people understand FIRE without explaining FIRE).  A few hands into the game, Craig looked at me sideways. He asked, "were you laid off?"

His question was LOADED with judgement. I could tell that if I had been laid off, he'd think less of me. Not that it mattered in the grand scheme - but the judgement was palpable. I answered honestly, no I hadn't been laid off, it had been my choice. But wow. It hit me that there's more to being laid off than receiving a fat check.  Loads of judgement would come from others, and, perhaps, from self.  Yes, I'm sure I could withstand it and yes, being financially compensated would help. But, it wouldn't be a walk in the park.  It's not something I'd wish for.

.... well of course there's probably a dollar value where I *would* wish for it.  Maybe a couple million, after taxes?  I think I could deal with an ego blow for a couple mil.
Oh, M41 this post makes me sad for you. Part of being Mustachian is that you just don't give a fuck about what other people think. He had probably been laid off and was still angry about it. I might have said, "Well, you could say I laid myself off, and I've been having fun ever since."

When I was a kid, my specialist ophthalmologist was all the way across town. My SAHM would schedule a late morning appointment to avoid traffic and then not bother to take me back to school, using the excuse that my eyes were still dilated. I always loved those appointments because I got a few hours off when everyone else was toiling away. I remember that feeling because I've taken joy in replicating it my entire adult life. Now that I'm RE, every day feels that way. It's awesome. I do feel like I'm getting away with something, and it's still a thrill. I just wish I could bottle up the feeling and sent some  to you.

Thanks Diane C - but don't worry - I'm okay.  I too feel like I'm playing hooky sometimes and it feels great. I just know that if I had been laid off, it may have felt like rejection.  But, I can't say for sure, as I controlled my own FIRE. 

As much as I usually don't give a shit about what people think, there is that small part of me that does. I can't pretend it away. But that's okay. I'm a social human. 

My FIRE was a bit of an FU: on my weekly phone 1:1, my boss told me that I needed to come back to the US. They wanted my job to be done in CA.  I replied, "Umm, nah, we have enough money to live on, I think I'm done." My boss was quiet for a long time.  Then said, "really?  How does that work? I must admit, I'm kind of jealous." A week later, he said, "you can keep doing your job where you are" I said, "nah, I'm done."

Now I get to play hooky every day!  But I am bummed that my shit-talking expat poker buddies won't be able to get together til mid-Jan. :(. What's the point in all this free time if I can't play poker?

Very nice exit. They wanted to make a major change in your job requirements, you declined and blindsided them with your ability to just be done. Kudos.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: AlanStache on December 17, 2015, 06:08:40 AM
...

That's the thing. At this company, with call outs, 50 hours might be 3 days some weeks. I told one of their guys that we were working overtime, 50hrs, and his reply literally was: "50hrs/week? I remember when I had a part time job like that."

Other work groups literally have forced overtime. 6-12s, 7-12s, for months. Want to take a vacation day on a Sunday? Have to burn 3 and take the weekend off.

Like I said, the workaholic in me wants to go for it, but having to hire a nanny would really cut into any extra money I'd make and my son would probably forget who I am.

I have trouble seeing how people can be productive working that many hours doing anything that requires thought.  Where I work we are very aware of "negative work" ie you are working at your desk but making so many mistakes or making stupid/bad decisions that the project would be better off with you not putting in those hours.  Different industries or different tasks I guess.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Kitsune on December 17, 2015, 07:53:14 AM
...

That's the thing. At this company, with call outs, 50 hours might be 3 days some weeks. I told one of their guys that we were working overtime, 50hrs, and his reply literally was: "50hrs/week? I remember when I had a part time job like that."

Other work groups literally have forced overtime. 6-12s, 7-12s, for months. Want to take a vacation day on a Sunday? Have to burn 3 and take the weekend off.

Like I said, the workaholic in me wants to go for it, but having to hire a nanny would really cut into any extra money I'd make and my son would probably forget who I am.

I have trouble seeing how people can be productive working that many hours doing anything that requires thought.  Where I work we are very aware of "negative work" ie you are working at your desk but making so many mistakes or making stupid/bad decisions that the project would be better off with you not putting in those hours.  Different industries or different tasks I guess.

I really wish more managers were aware of the concept of 'negative work'
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: AZDude on December 17, 2015, 08:06:04 AM
Studies have shown productivity at just about any jobs falls off a cliff after six consecutive hours. Long days are actually counter-productive, especially so if the employee is getting paid by the hour.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: dandarc on December 17, 2015, 08:08:37 AM
Studies have shown productivity at just about any jobs falls off a cliff after six consecutive hours. Long days are actually counter-productive, especially so if the employee is getting paid by the hour.
Shh!  Don't tell anyone.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: HairyUpperLip on December 17, 2015, 09:21:39 AM
Studies have shown productivity at just about any jobs falls off a cliff after six consecutive hours. Long days are actually counter-productive, especially so if the employee is getting paid by the hour.
Shh!  Don't tell anyone.

Yeah, don't tell them. I'm still hoping one day I'll be on that 4-day 10 hour days grind.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: DeepEllumStache on December 17, 2015, 11:15:55 AM
...

That's the thing. At this company, with call outs, 50 hours might be 3 days some weeks. I told one of their guys that we were working overtime, 50hrs, and his reply literally was: "50hrs/week? I remember when I had a part time job like that."

Other work groups literally have forced overtime. 6-12s, 7-12s, for months. Want to take a vacation day on a Sunday? Have to burn 3 and take the weekend off.

Like I said, the workaholic in me wants to go for it, but having to hire a nanny would really cut into any extra money I'd make and my son would probably forget who I am.

I have trouble seeing how people can be productive working that many hours doing anything that requires thought.  Where I work we are very aware of "negative work" ie you are working at your desk but making so many mistakes or making stupid/bad decisions that the project would be better off with you not putting in those hours.  Different industries or different tasks I guess.

I really wish more managers were aware of the concept of 'negative work'

My boss used to manage a tech group working repair jobs. Upper management started requiring overtime from them. Working regular hours, he saw about 4 tickets completed per day. On the days the techs worked regular hours plus overtime hours, the techs still completed about 4 tickets a day. So we were paying more (additional hours at overtime rate) for the exact same output.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: jordanread on December 17, 2015, 11:30:06 AM
Studies have shown productivity at just about any jobs falls off a cliff after six consecutive hours. Long days are actually counter-productive, especially so if the employee is getting paid by the hour.
Shh!  Don't tell anyone.

Yeah, don't tell them. I'm still hoping one day I'll be on that 4-day 10 hour days grind.

I did love back when I worked 4/10s at one job, and 3/12s at the other. If I was single at the time, I would have crazy amounts of money still. And this was like 10 years ago.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: AlanStache on December 17, 2015, 11:55:46 AM
Studies have shown productivity at just about any jobs falls off a cliff after six consecutive hours. Long days are actually counter-productive, especially so if the employee is getting paid by the hour.
Shh!  Don't tell anyone.

Yeah, don't tell them. I'm still hoping one day I'll be on that 4-day 10 hour days grind.

I did love back when I worked 4/10s at one job, and 3/12s at the other. If I was single at the time, I would have crazy amounts of money still. And this was like 10 years ago.

4/10s once sounded great but now I think it would suck as you loose most all the evening on those 4 days, like get off work go run, quick shower and some leftovers then its bed time.  wash, rinse, repeat.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: mtn on December 17, 2015, 12:19:30 PM
Studies have shown productivity at just about any jobs falls off a cliff after six consecutive hours. Long days are actually counter-productive, especially so if the employee is getting paid by the hour.
Shh!  Don't tell anyone.

Yeah, don't tell them. I'm still hoping one day I'll be on that 4-day 10 hour days grind.

I did love back when I worked 4/10s at one job, and 3/12s at the other. If I was single at the time, I would have crazy amounts of money still. And this was like 10 years ago.

4/10s once sounded great but now I think it would suck as you loose most all the evening on those 4 days, like get off work go run, quick shower and some leftovers then its bed time.  wash, rinse, repeat.

In my past job it would have been a little annoying--although lunch would have been 15 minutes shorter (45 to 30), so I'd have only been there 1:45 later--and I'd have gone in an hour earlier, so it was only 45 minutes later.

The current job it would actually work out pretty well. First, lunch would again be 15-30 minutes shorter, my morning commute would probably  be 5-10 minutes shorter, and the evening commute about the same.  And I ride public transit.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Kitsune on December 17, 2015, 02:09:59 PM
To go with the "minor work victories brought on by confidence and independance" theme:

Boss: *walks into my office, starts talking about how he needs me to review this contract for x,y,z, etc, all very important, etc*
Me: What's your deadline on this?
Boss: *pause* What do you mean?
Me: I'm on vacation in *checks time* 4 minutes. If it's quick, I can look at it now. If it's important, I can review it in the next half hour and give my back-up talking points and advice on how to negotiate this over the next two weeks before I leave. If it's not urgent, I can deal with this myself in January. Pick an option! :)
Boss: ... right. It can wait until January. I'd rather you do it.

Ok then. Vacaaaaation!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: jordanread on December 17, 2015, 03:26:34 PM
Studies have shown productivity at just about any jobs falls off a cliff after six consecutive hours. Long days are actually counter-productive, especially so if the employee is getting paid by the hour.
Shh!  Don't tell anyone.

Yeah, don't tell them. I'm still hoping one day I'll be on that 4-day 10 hour days grind.

I did love back when I worked 4/10s at one job, and 3/12s at the other. If I was single at the time, I would have crazy amounts of money still. And this was like 10 years ago.

4/10s once sounded great but now I think it would suck as you loose most all the evening on those 4 days, like get off work go run, quick shower and some leftovers then its bed time.  wash, rinse, repeat.

That actually worked well for me. Pre-mustachian days, the only way I could save was leave no time for spending. Silly, I know, but that was where I was at that point.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: MoonShadow on December 17, 2015, 06:08:21 PM
Studies have shown productivity at just about any jobs falls off a cliff after six consecutive hours. Long days are actually counter-productive, especially so if the employee is getting paid by the hour.

That depends a great deal on the type of work.  Factory production line work peaks at about 9 hours, which is one reason that so many small factories try to go to a 9 hour workday on a two week, 9 workday, revolving schedule.  Unions hate them though.  Personally, I work a 12 hour regular shift, but my work is closer to a corporate "fireman".  I run around the plant solving problems as they arise.  So the term 'productivity' in my case means something different.  If the production lines are running, I don't have a "productive activity" to engage into, and that is how my employer likes it.  I'm getting paid to not engage into productive work at this very moment.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: bzzzt on December 19, 2015, 08:02:13 AM
I have trouble seeing how people can be productive working that many hours doing anything that requires thought.  Where I work we are very aware of "negative work" ie you are working at your desk but making so many mistakes or making stupid/bad decisions that the project would be better off with you not putting in those hours.  Different industries or different tasks I guess.

A lot of it boils down to project managers having to hit a deadline for one reason or another.

Yesterday was a good example. Was told other company's crew would be ready in the morning, showed up on site at 7am to nothing ready, did as much pre-work as I could, looked like crew would finally be ready to liven by 3:30 (with me losing remote test support at 4pm, due to being Friday), livening goes sideways and the whole day is pretty much a wash.

So, most of my billable day (10hr) is a change order (extra). We told the other company's project manager not to schedule it so close, but he's getting heat to close out the project. It's stupid, but "the money is green and the checks cash."
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: JLee on December 19, 2015, 10:06:57 PM
I had a job that was kind of like that.  On call 24/7, up almost every night dealing with stuff, then in at 8am.  I thought that's what I had to do.  Then we hired a new admin and when he got called at night, depending on how long he was up he would come in late or not at all the next day.  If they asked why he was late he would say 'I was up last night at 3am working'.  Sometimes you just have the attitude of 'I already put in my hours last night/this week.  Say something, I dare you'.  Working long days and weeks occasionally happens when there's a special deadline or issue going on, but if it's a constant thing then that's a staffing issue, which is management's problem, not mine, imo.  I get paid for 40 hours/week (or however many your agreement is).  If that's not enough for the work to get done on a consistent basis, then hire more people.  These are exactly the things FU money is made for.

I basically did that at my last job. When I was called (or stayed late) outside of my normal working hours, I tracked it. I didn't use a single vacation day all summer...just comp day after comp day.  I eventually got past the point of asking, too - I'd basically send an email to my boss/team and say "I'm taking 'X' off, comp day because (reasons)." It worked great. :)
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: effinoff on December 19, 2015, 11:14:42 PM
Hi everyone, been lurking on and off on MMM in the past few weeks and loving this thread! Count me in among those in their thirties now and wishing they had learnt about FI/RE in college and be able turn back time to undo all the stupid decisions and heartbreaks in my 20s.

I have left my share of jobs over the years but there is only 1 where I walked without serving my notice. It was your typical horrible job(shitty boss who took all credit for my work, abusive senior management, underpaid, toxic atmosphere, etc.), and I was intensely envious of friends who seemed to be working at much better companies. However, the job market was quite dry that year, and I had negative net worth(due to living way over my means and getting into credit card debt). I had been unemployed for 6 months before the job offer paying below market rates came through. I felt like I had no choice and just had to suck it up for a long time.

On top of being young and dumb, I was also quite hot-headed(but good at hiding it in public) and often let my emotions get the better of me. I was scared that if I jumped ship, then I may not pass probation period at whatever new job I land, then find myself broke and homeless after 1 week. I was also living with a shitty housemate back then who had disgusting habits, but I felt too poor to move.

So for more than 12 months, I was a combination of angry/sad/envious, as I moped in my room after work on most days. I sat up in bed with my laptop, not wanting to go out with friends and hating on my housemate and boss, while I furiously applied for new jobs. By the time I finally got an offer, I had saved enough money for 3 months of an emergency fund, as well as made a sizeable dent on the credit card debt - all due to staying in so much!

The new employer demanded that I be available to start within 1 week and was not prepared to wait for me to serve my standard 1 month's notice at my shitty job. I looked at my bank account balance, projected expenses, the vacation time I had saved up, and articles about the improving job market. I then came to the conclusion that this was a calculated risk that I could afford, and that I needed to move fast to not lose the job offer.

I spent Monday-Thursday that week cleaning up my desk and taking personal effects home. Friday arrives and I invite my shitty boss to a 5:00pm meeting(preventing him from darting away at 4:00pm like he always did). I hand him my pass and resignation letter and claim that I needed time from off the world of work for personal reasons then walked out without letting him get a word in. The very next Monday, I was at my new job and earning 30% more. Fellow co-workers who I had been repeatedly riling up about the horrible conditions also found the courage to resign a few weeks after I did, leaving boss to scramble to recruit new people when the job market had swung to the jobseekers' side. Before the end of the month, I had also moved out and ditched the gross housemate.

A few weeks later, I get a letter in the mail saying that for not working my notice, I did not get paid out 1 month's worth of vacation time that I had saved up(but I had 7 weeks worth in total, so I got 3 weeks paid out to me that went straight to the emergency fund).

I wish I could say that it was all smooth sailing from then on! I did manage to always have FU money of at least 3 months of an emergency fund ever since that day, but if only I had learned about the concept of FI money earlier...

I'm currently in a new job where I find myself not liking my current boss again, and am considering jumping ship after the Christmas season is over. I currently have more than 18 months of expenses saved up(which I now understand from MMM is way too much cash and I need to put more of it into index ETFs). However, I'm trying to take some time to figure out what I really want in a job so I don't end up somewhere that I dislike(again), so I will probably behave myself this time, skip the FU moment by securing a new job offer first, then serve my 1 month notice at this place before leaving.

To those of you that have job-hopped many times, how have you finally found a place you were willing to stay with until you reach FI?
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: mancityfan on December 20, 2015, 05:49:23 AM
I do check in with this thread on occasion, and it is obviously very popular. However.... am I the only one that finds some of the FU mentality a little sad? What I find sad is the desire to "stick it to the man" as a goal. I do not see it as healthy. I am not very fond of my boss, but I am under no illusions. When I leave in 4-6 years or so, I know I am replaceable. I will not be spending energy on "sticking it" to the boss. I believe that if some of the folks that have followed the FU approach could go back to their old jobs in a few days and weeks and find that life is just bobbing along nicely and that nothing has changed other than someone else is in your cubicle/job!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Shane on December 20, 2015, 03:41:44 PM
I do check in with this thread on occasion, and it is obviously very popular. However.... am I the only one that finds some of the FU mentality a little sad? What I find sad is the desire to "stick it to the man" as a goal. I do not see it as healthy. I am not very fond of my boss, but I am under no illusions. When I leave in 4-6 years or so, I know I am replaceable. I will not be spending energy on "sticking it" to the boss. I believe that if some of the folks that have followed the FU approach could go back to their old jobs in a few days and weeks and find that life is just bobbing along nicely and that nothing has changed other than someone else is in your cubicle/job!

What you're saying is true. I'm under no illusions that telling the Man FU necessarily effects meaningful long-term changes within an organization, although it's possible.

It's human nature, though, to enjoy fantasizing about turning the tables on the normal power structure. Usually, the organization gets to make all the rules. People at higher levels of our organizations, some of whom we may never have met, make rules or issue unilateral decrees, which get handed down to workers in their cubicles, and everyone is just expected to accept and abide by them without question. As we all know, some of these rules are ridiculous and petty. FU money gives workers choices.

I've worked in jobs where we were, for example, told by management that, "our company policy is that we don't pay time and a half for hours worked over 40 per week." When I and other workers pointed out to our managers that what they were doing was in violation of federal labor laws, we were told if we didn't like it, we were always free to work someplace else. Most workers just accepted this, because they felt they had no choice. They had to pay their bills.

Because I have pretty much always had enough FU money that I could afford to, I have been able to tell my bosses what my policies are. If it's okay for company executives to unilaterally create policies, why not the workers? Companies that have been unwilling or unable to follow my policies have gotten fired by me, in other words I quit.

While you may think this is "sad," I disagree. If more people saw the connection between a high savings rate and rapidly accumulating as much FU money as possible, and the freedom that having that money allows them to have, the world would be a better place.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: mm1970 on December 20, 2015, 06:00:50 PM
I had a job that was kind of like that.  On call 24/7, up almost every night dealing with stuff, then in at 8am.  I thought that's what I had to do.  Then we hired a new admin and when he got called at night, depending on how long he was up he would come in late or not at all the next day.  If they asked why he was late he would say 'I was up last night at 3am working'.  Sometimes you just have the attitude of 'I already put in my hours last night/this week.  Say something, I dare you'.  Working long days and weeks occasionally happens when there's a special deadline or issue going on, but if it's a constant thing then that's a staffing issue, which is management's problem, not mine, imo.  I get paid for 40 hours/week (or however many your agreement is).  If that's not enough for the work to get done on a consistent basis, then hire more people.  These are exactly the things FU money is made for.

I basically did that at my last job. When I was called (or stayed late) outside of my normal working hours, I tracked it. I didn't use a single vacation day all summer...just comp day after comp day.  I eventually got past the point of asking, too - I'd basically send an email to my boss/team and say "I'm taking 'X' off, comp day because (reasons)." It worked great. :)
Yes, I've started doing this too, or kind of like it - I stopped counting every 1/4 hour that I am working so that I can "make up hours".  I come in, I work, I leave.  If I need to go to the dentist?  I leave. If  I have a project at the school? I come in late.

We almost went out of business this year.  Lots of layoffs. No raises in 4 years, however we can hire in new folks at market rate.  I realize, in my  head, that it's not personal, it's business.  However, it's not good business to treat your long term good employees that way.  Because they get fed up and leave.  Then we have to pay the replacements more money, and then they have to come up to speed.  A few people have left, some people have given notice and gotten raises.  But we are very top heavy now.

Our new big boss wanted to talk to all of the employees.  And he's pretty blunt and made everyone ask a question.  Well, as the longest-employed person there (and also, not an executive), I asked if there was any money for raises.  Was told "no", and "you don't know how bad off you were". As if I was a little bug and how DARE I ask that question.

Well, I asked that question because it's the single biggest question that every non-executive wants answered, and everyone else is afraid to ask.  So I asked it.  And maybe I'm now labeled, but eh... Every single female senior to me has been laid off or quit, so it's not looking like a comfortable place for me anyway.  I'll just keep working, saving my pennies, looking for a new job, and learning what I can.  As much as the place has been a really depressing place to work, I really enjoy my new position and my new boss.  And dammit if I don't have so much pride that I want to see the place succeed and eventually make money.  If only the planned date of making a profit wasn't 5 years from now.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Sibley on December 20, 2015, 06:08:13 PM
I do check in with this thread on occasion, and it is obviously very popular. However.... am I the only one that finds some of the FU mentality a little sad? What I find sad is the desire to "stick it to the man" as a goal. I do not see it as healthy. I am not very fond of my boss, but I am under no illusions. When I leave in 4-6 years or so, I know I am replaceable. I will not be spending energy on "sticking it" to the boss. I believe that if some of the folks that have followed the FU approach could go back to their old jobs in a few days and weeks and find that life is just bobbing along nicely and that nothing has changed other than someone else is in your cubicle/job!

What you're saying is true. I'm under no illusions that telling the Man FU necessarily effects meaningful long-term changes within an organization, although it's possible.

It's human nature, though, to enjoy fantasizing about turning the tables on the normal power structure. Usually, the organization gets to make all the rules. People at higher levels of our organizations, some of whom we may never have met, make rules or issue unilateral decrees, which get handed down to workers in their cubicles, and everyone is just expected to accept and abide by them without question. As we all know, some of these rules are ridiculous and petty. FU money gives workers choices.

I've worked in jobs where we were, for example, told by management that, "our company policy is that we don't pay time and a half for hours worked over 40 per week." When I and other workers pointed out to our managers that what they were doing was in violation of federal labor laws, we were told if we didn't like it, we were always free to work someplace else. Most workers just accepted this, because they felt they had no choice. They had to pay their bills.

Because I have pretty much always had enough FU money that I could afford to, I have been able to tell my bosses what my policies are. If it's okay for company executives to unilaterally create policies, why not the workers? Companies that have been unwilling or unable to follow my policies have gotten fired by me, in other words I quit.

While you may think this is "sad," I disagree. If more people saw the connection between a high savings rate and rapidly accumulating as much FU money as possible, and the freedom that having that money allows them to have, the world would be a better place.

Did you report them to the department of labor? They tend to think poorly of deliberately flouting employment laws.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Shane on December 21, 2015, 01:52:42 AM
Did you report them to the department of labor? They tend to think poorly of deliberately flouting employment laws.

Believe it or not, I've worked for several companies that knowingly violated federal labor laws. I never filed a complaint against any of the companies that refused to pay us time and a half for hours worked over 40/week. At one job, a couple years after I left, a former coworker filed a complaint with DOL, and he and others still working there got paid a punch of back pay and the employer had to pay a fine, but I had already been gone long enough that I didn't qualify to get anything.

My most recent employer also was in clear violation of the federal Fair Labor Standards Act. I printed out a couple pages of FAQs from DOL's website and tried to show them to my boss twice during meetings, but as soon as he realized what I was trying to get him to read, he pushed the papers away and refused to look at them. All he said was, "We are following the advice we are given by HR, and to the best of my knowledge we are following all laws. If we're in violation of any laws, that's HR's problem. We're just doing what they tell us to do."

In that case, I was pissed off enough that I actually did file a complaint with DOL. The technician who took my complaint over the phone said it sounded to him like my employer was definitely in violation of the law, and he said he was "almost sure" his supervisor would accept my case and order an investigation. Weeks and weeks went by, and finally I got a form letter back from DOL saying that they had declined to accept my  complaint. The letter said that DOL's choosing not to take my case should in no way be construed mean that my case did or did not have merit. It also said I was welcome to pursue my case by hiring a private attorney, but the DOL was in no way encouraging or discouraging me to do so...

When I, again, talked with the technician who originally took my complaint over the phone he mentioned that there had been rumors circulating in his office that with the recent GOP takeover of congress their budget was going to be cut and he and many of his coworkers might lose their jobs. He said that last time the Republicans controlled Congress they cut DOL's budget so much that they didn't have enough investigators to investigate complaints and so even many of the valid complaints got turned down at that time. He suggested that maybe fear of more of the same coming soon was what might have caused my complaint to not be accepted...
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Dicey on December 21, 2015, 08:55:29 AM
I do check in with this thread on occasion, and it is obviously very popular. However.... am I the only one that finds some of the FU mentality a little sad? What I find sad is the desire to "stick it to the man" as a goal. I do not see it as healthy. I am not very fond of my boss, but I am under no illusions. When I leave in 4-6 years or so, I know I am replaceable. I will not be spending energy on "sticking it" to the boss. I believe that if some of the folks that have followed the FU approach could go back to their old jobs in a few days and weeks and find that life is just bobbing along nicely and that nothing has changed other than someone else is in your cubicle/job!
Having FU money made me happy. In my career, I went from great boss to not-great boss a number of times, through no fault of my own. Knowing I could pull the trigger at any time made it much easier to deal with the not-great bosses while they lasted. Actually, not only did FU money make me happier, it made me feel mightily empowered, which is priceless. I never had any particular desire to "stick it to the man", I was all about having options when the tides of business flowed in the wrong direction. I think that you might be interpreting the attitudes of a few as the attitude of all on this thread, mancityfan.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Jack on December 21, 2015, 09:09:30 AM
A few weeks later, I get a letter in the mail saying that for not working my notice, I did not get paid out 1 month's worth of vacation time that I had saved up(but I had 7 weeks worth in total, so I got 3 weeks paid out to me that went straight to the emergency fund).

Speaking of employment laws, I have my doubts that failing to paying out vacation (which is earned hours) is legal either.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: ash7962 on December 21, 2015, 09:28:44 AM
I do check in with this thread on occasion, and it is obviously very popular. However.... am I the only one that finds some of the FU mentality a little sad? What I find sad is the desire to "stick it to the man" as a goal. I do not see it as healthy. I am not very fond of my boss, but I am under no illusions. When I leave in 4-6 years or so, I know I am replaceable. I will not be spending energy on "sticking it" to the boss. I believe that if some of the folks that have followed the FU approach could go back to their old jobs in a few days and weeks and find that life is just bobbing along nicely and that nothing has changed other than someone else is in your cubicle/job!

I see the FU mentality as healthy actually.  Sometimes it is about sticking it to the man, but I've found that many of these stories are about people asserting their right to have good working conditions.  I don't think anyone is trying to screw over their employer just 'cause, and I'm sure most of the companies are able to recover.  The point is that the people here were able to improve their own life by moving to a less toxic workplace without suffering financial stress.  That seems healthy to me.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Icecreamarsenal on December 21, 2015, 09:50:30 AM
I do check in with this thread on occasion, and it is obviously very popular. However.... am I the only one that finds some of the FU mentality a little sad? What I find sad is the desire to "stick it to the man" as a goal. I do not see it as healthy. I am not very fond of my boss, but I am under no illusions. When I leave in 4-6 years or so, I know I am replaceable. I will not be spending energy on "sticking it" to the boss. I believe that if some of the folks that have followed the FU approach could go back to their old jobs in a few days and weeks and find that life is just bobbing along nicely and that nothing has changed other than someone else is in your cubicle/job!
I think you hit the nail a glancing blow.  I don't think these FU stories stem directly from a desire to stick it to the man. While pathetic and unhealthy, the peoples' sides of the stories must be told; how many times were they tread on, to galvanize them to arm themselves with the tool (FI) to fight back?
If you think of it from that perspective, it loses the dullness of revenge and pettiness, and gains an aspirational sheen.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: pachnik on December 21, 2015, 09:57:53 AM
I do check in with this thread on occasion, and it is obviously very popular. However.... am I the only one that finds some of the FU mentality a little sad? What I find sad is the desire to "stick it to the man" as a goal. I do not see it as healthy. I am not very fond of my boss, but I am under no illusions. When I leave in 4-6 years or so, I know I am replaceable. I will not be spending energy on "sticking it" to the boss. I believe that if some of the folks that have followed the FU approach could go back to their old jobs in a few days and weeks and find that life is just bobbing along nicely and that nothing has changed other than someone else is in your cubicle/job!

For me, FU money is an option.  I know that I can leave a job that has become unhealthy for me (and I have had 1 or 2) if I have money saved up.  I've never been under any illusion that replacing me would be difficult.  To me it isn't about " "sticking it" to the boss", it is about taking care of myself. 
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: mancityfan on December 21, 2015, 10:21:46 AM
Thanks for the reasoned responses Diane C, Shane, and pachnik. I also have FU money and certainly feel more relaxed/empowered at work, so I see what you are saying. To narrow it down, my concern is more that folks may really think that they are irreplaceable and "sticking it to the man" will leave some kind of lasting legacy.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: JLee on December 21, 2015, 10:31:53 AM
I do check in with this thread on occasion, and it is obviously very popular. However.... am I the only one that finds some of the FU mentality a little sad? What I find sad is the desire to "stick it to the man" as a goal. I do not see it as healthy. I am not very fond of my boss, but I am under no illusions. When I leave in 4-6 years or so, I know I am replaceable. I will not be spending energy on "sticking it" to the boss. I believe that if some of the folks that have followed the FU approach could go back to their old jobs in a few days and weeks and find that life is just bobbing along nicely and that nothing has changed other than someone else is in your cubicle/job!

I see the FU mentality as healthy actually.  Sometimes it is about sticking it to the man, but I've found that many of these stories are about people asserting their right to have good working conditions.  I don't think anyone is trying to screw over their employer just 'cause, and I'm sure most of the companies are able to recover.  The point is that the people here were able to improve their own life by moving to a less toxic workplace without suffering financial stress.  That seems healthy to me.

I agree. The goal for me isn't to screw over my employer - it's to prevent the opposite.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: JustGettingStarted1980 on December 21, 2015, 10:38:44 AM
Good Thread -> and helps me focus on my end goal, thanks everyone!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: mm1970 on December 21, 2015, 11:07:07 AM
A few weeks later, I get a letter in the mail saying that for not working my notice, I did not get paid out 1 month's worth of vacation time that I had saved up(but I had 7 weeks worth in total, so I got 3 weeks paid out to me that went straight to the emergency fund).

Speaking of employment laws, I have my doubts that failing to paying out vacation (which is earned hours) is legal either.
This is state dependent.  For example, vacation is earned hours in CA, and you  have to pay it out.

It's not the same in every state.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: OkieStache on December 21, 2015, 12:19:54 PM
I have trouble seeing how people can be productive working that many hours doing anything that requires thought.  Where I work we are very aware of "negative work" ie you are working at your desk but making so many mistakes or making stupid/bad decisions that the project would be better off with you not putting in those hours.  Different industries or different tasks I guess.
You mean the entire legal services industry?  Those folks at Biglaw are getting $100k bonuses, but they usually have to have over 1600 (1800 next year) Billable AND Chargeable hours to get it.  That means they are actually working A LOT more than that.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Kitsune on December 21, 2015, 12:31:01 PM
I agree. The goal for me isn't to screw over my employer - it's to prevent the opposite.

THIS. THIS X1000.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Daisy on December 21, 2015, 01:15:55 PM
I agree. The goal for me isn't to screw over my employer - it's to prevent the opposite.

THIS. THIS X1000.

FU money is also to help you pick and choose your assignments at work. For example, I am working on a project I like now and am leading. However it is ending soon, and what my boss wants me to work on next isn't very exciting to me. But he has to keep his other reports happy and give them the next cool assignment...yes he told me this...basically I had my turn so now I need to do some grunt work for a while so he can keep others happy. I am not well suited for the new assignment. I am glad to have FU money to assert myself early next year. I may even ask to get laid off if he can't  find me a good project. That's going to be an interesting conversation.

Since I am so close to FIRE I dont want to take an opportunity away from a younger coworker to shine though. So this is a tough decision to make.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: birdman2003 on December 21, 2015, 01:27:02 PM
following
Title: FIRE money or FU money
Post by: jlajr on December 21, 2015, 10:50:59 PM
So, in light of the recent discussion regarding FU money and choices, I pose the question: If I do not have enough FU money to be completely FIRE, doesn't using the 'Stash or FIRE/FU money for living expenses delay FIRE?

Every day it seems, I decide not to resign from my current full-time job. I have not been offered another full-time job, so I would likely have to use my 'Stash/FIRE/FU money for living expenses for at least some time.

Is this a case of short-term pain for long-term gain?

I also discovered the Afford Anything blog (http://affordanything.com/) recently, so the idea of taking a mini-retirement has crossed my mind. But, again, using the 'Stash now for taking such a mini-retirement presumably involves delaying FIRE.

Thoughts?
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Dicey on December 21, 2015, 11:28:52 PM
Thanks for the reasoned responses Diane C, Shane, and pachnik. I also have FU money and certainly feel more relaxed/empowered at work, so I see what you are saying. To narrow it down, my concern is more that folks may really think that they are irreplaceable and "sticking it to the man" will leave some kind of lasting legacy.
Hey mancityfan, it's nice that you responded to the feedback. I hear your concern, but I really think it's that everybody loves a good "Fuck You" money story, whether they have it or are still working to amass some. In fact, if you read through the entire thread, some of the best stories involve people who had FU money and bowed out to protect others who were not so well positioned. Saving someone else's livelihood is the kind of lasting legacy a mustachian can really feel good about. I also kinda doubt that very many mustachians feel they are irreplaceable, at least as far as a job goes...the whole RE goal is to work for as short a period as possible. I think most folks are planning on using their post-FIRE years to create their lasting legacies, not their working years.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Faraday on December 22, 2015, 12:18:40 AM
Hey mancityfan, it's nice that you responded to the feedback. I hear your concern, but I really think it's that everybody loves a good "Fuck You" money story, whether they have it or are still working to amass some. In fact, if you read through the entire thread, some of the best stories involve people who had FU money and bowed out to protect others who were not so well positioned. Saving someone else's livelihood is the kind of lasting legacy a mustachian can really feel good about. I also kinda doubt that very many mustachians feel they are irreplaceable, at least as far as a job goes...the whole RE goal is to work for as short a period as possible. I think most folks are planning on using their post-FIRE years to create their lasting legacies, not their working years.

Shot, bro! :-) :-) :-)
Title: Re: FIRE money or FU money
Post by: arebelspy on December 22, 2015, 01:59:52 AM
So, in light of the recent discussion regarding FU money and choices, I pose the question: If I do not have enough FU money to be completely FIRE, doesn't using the 'Stash or FIRE/FU money for living expenses delay FIRE?

Of course using FU money to walk away could delay FIRE.  It could also accelerate it (by getting you into a higher paying job, quicker, giving you the courage to look for something else knowing you have that safety net, etc.).

It's more likely to delay your FIRE if you're using the FU money to quit with nothing else lined up.

But it may well be worth it.  Quality of life > a slightly quicker FIRE.
Title: Re: FIRE money or FU money
Post by: mm1970 on December 22, 2015, 08:36:03 AM
So, in light of the recent discussion regarding FU money and choices, I pose the question: If I do not have enough FU money to be completely FIRE, doesn't using the 'Stash or FIRE/FU money for living expenses delay FIRE?

Of course using FU money to walk away could delay FIRE.  It could also accelerate it (by getting you into a higher paying job, quicker, giving you the courage to look for something else knowing you have that safety net, etc.).

It's more likely to delay your FIRE if you're using the FU money to quit with nothing else lined up.

But it may well be worth it.  Quality of life > a slightly quicker FIRE.
and some of us aren't really here for FIRE.  I'm here for FU money.
Title: Epic FU money stories
Post by: arebelspy on December 22, 2015, 08:42:20 AM
So, in light of the recent discussion regarding FU money and choices, I pose the question: If I do not have enough FU money to be completely FIRE, doesn't using the 'Stash or FIRE/FU money for living expenses delay FIRE?

Of course using FU money to walk away could delay FIRE.  It could also accelerate it (by getting you into a higher paying job, quicker, giving you the courage to look for something else knowing you have that safety net, etc.).

It's more likely to delay your FIRE if you're using the FU money to quit with nothing else lined up.

But it may well be worth it.  Quality of life > a slightly quicker FIRE.
and some of us aren't really here for FIRE.  I'm here for FU money.

Ultimately I'd think everyone would be here for FI money, not just FU money, even if you don't want to ER.

And that was, in essence, their question: would you use the FU money to delay FI?  I think the answer, in general, should be yes. Stick it out as long as you can, but then use it for its purpose.

If you aren't even going for ER than the answer is an even more clear yes.

But I'd think everyone would want FI, not just FU money.  Right?  Is there anyone just looking for FU money for a little safety and that's it?
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: EnjoyIt on December 22, 2015, 12:51:17 PM
FU money purchases security and increased happiness without even having to spend a dime. FU money allows us to say "no," or to fight for what we believe in. FU money gives us options.  And the more FU money we have, the more options it can potentially purchase.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: jlajr on December 22, 2015, 08:24:28 PM
Thanks to everyone who responded to my earlier post, especially arebelspy. I guess I just needed to be reminded.

To all of those celebrating, Happy Holidays!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: BlueHouse on December 23, 2015, 01:29:20 PM

Ultimately I'd think everyone would be here for FI money, not just FU money, even if you don't want to ER.

And that was, in essence, their question: would you use the FU money to delay FI?  I think the answer, in general, should be yes. Stick it out as long as you can, but then use it for its purpose.

If you aren't even going for ER than the answer is an even more clear yes.

But I'd think everyone would want FI, not just FU money.  Right?  Is there anyone just looking for FU money for a little safety and that's it?
Right reb, and I'm finding that the closer I get to FI, the less likely I am to use the FU money.  A healthy balance is needed, otherwise when you are SO averse to spending any FU money, you're in the same predicament as someone without FU or EF money. 
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Threshkin on December 23, 2015, 01:31:27 PM

Ultimately I'd think everyone would be here for FI money, not just FU money, even if you don't want to ER.

And that was, in essence, their question: would you use the FU money to delay FI?  I think the answer, in general, should be yes. Stick it out as long as you can, but then use it for its purpose.

If you aren't even going for ER than the answer is an even more clear yes.

But I'd think everyone would want FI, not just FU money.  Right?  Is there anyone just looking for FU money for a little safety and that's it?
Right reb, and I'm finding that the closer I get to FI, the less likely I am to use the FU money.  A healthy balance is needed, otherwise when you are SO averse to spending any FU money, you're in the same predicament as someone without FU or EF money.

I disagree BH.  Even if you are unwilling to spend it, having FU or ER money is MUCH better than not having it at all.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: StartingEarly on December 23, 2015, 01:57:14 PM
Agreed, the person without FU money is way more stressed out about life in general. Worrying about spending down money so you no longer have enough to be comfortable to stick it to the man will never be equal to worrying that you have to do everything perfect and still get fired and lose everything.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: 10YearGoal on December 24, 2015, 06:02:50 AM
On the one hand, I commend people for leaving a toxic work environment, especially when they have the easy financial means to do it. On the other, some of these stories leave me thinking good people are letting the occasional asshole get the better of them, and that by leaving they're just letting the asshole disrupt the good person's life and continue to merrily abuse everyone else who remains.

So maybe a "FU, I'm staying and standing up to the devil" story.... Public education has gotten more and more politicized with leaders coming to districts, ruining them on a variety of fiscal, quality of working life and instructional levels, and then leaving before the shit hits the fan to go somewhere else and do the same thing for more money. My experience was that they attempted to toss me out with the trash as they had done with so many before me who got fired or forced to quit due to extreme mistreatment. Keep in mind, people leave education RARELY once in for 15-20 years as the pension payout is a big consideration. Long story, but I fought, and won the first round of getting my deserved job back. They have tricks for getting around the union but did not expect me to fight back, thus left themselves wide open due to obvious discrimination and breach of contract. However, the treatment received AFTER they knew I was fighting was horrific and continued to last for 6 months. More fighting, to be continued, but once the tide turned it felt really good to know that I stood up for myself but at a cost to myself and my family. I would make the same decision as I am horribly allergic to bullies and unfairness but through my experience I totally understand why people walk away. The EEOC worker told me that a lot of people are mistreated and discriminated against and very few fight it, and she said it's too bad cuz the majority of them would win.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: 10YearGoal on December 24, 2015, 06:04:59 AM
Sorry, the top part was a quote from Doubledown, the last part my entry. I'm sorry that I don't know how to quote someone then reply, I'll try to figure it out!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Gone Fishing on December 24, 2015, 09:21:44 AM
Not quite epic, but the new boss wants to move everyone's offices around.  Everyone else has been "yes men" trying to curry favor.  I told him no thanks!  If he moves me anyway, when I resign next spring, I will tell him that it was because he moved my office just to mess with him...

That will be delicious.

Looks like the new boss is going through with the office move (this will be my 6th office in 8 years all on the same floor).  I can't wait to deliver the line!  He's actually has a pretty good sense of humor so I won't let him worry about for more than a few seconds...
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: mm1970 on December 29, 2015, 12:02:23 PM
This isn't so much of an epic story as it is a sad description of company culture.

In short. Start up. Layoffs. Losing money. New investors. Lots of people bailing. Most staying to see what the raise will be "in six months".

Yeah it was tiny, even though new hires are making market rate.

First one to bail, before the raise even, a critical employee. First they counter. He says no. Then they say" name your price. "

Seriously? The time to handle this was months ago. That kind of tactic will not work. Everyone here know how you treat them. Why would they stay for a single raise?

He is leaving anyway and he's only the first. They think this method works. It does not.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Pooperman on December 29, 2015, 12:15:03 PM
Is naming your price of "half the revenue" appropriate in that circumstance? Make a request they have to refuse and if they don't, you're FI in like 6 months?
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: mm1970 on December 29, 2015, 12:21:25 PM
Is naming your price of "half the revenue" appropriate in that circumstance? Make a request they have to refuse and if they don't, you're FI in like 6 months?
what revenue?
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Pooperman on December 29, 2015, 12:24:09 PM
Is naming your price of "half the revenue" appropriate in that circumstance? Make a request they have to refuse and if they don't, you're FI in like 6 months?
what revenue?
Good point. Um, half the funding? That should be a good number.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: nobodyspecial on December 29, 2015, 12:43:29 PM
Is naming your price of "half the revenue" appropriate in that circumstance? Make a request they have to refuse and if they don't, you're FI in like 6 months?
what revenue?
Good point. Um, half the funding? That should be a good number.
And their daughter's hand, is the tradition - at least for C++ devs around here
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: msilenus on December 29, 2015, 02:53:21 PM
Has anyone here ever actually followed through on an offer like that? I've never been in the situation, but I think it would be fun to play around with the jerks just a little bit. I wouldn't ask for anything completely ridiculous, but maybe 2.5x salary with one-half upfront as a "retention bonus" (and with no claw-back provisions attached) just to see if they'd bite.

A while ago I was offered a package to change jobs.  Everyone knew each other, and I sort of wanted to go, but I wasn't unhappy where I was and I didn't like the package being offered.  I had tried to rigorously and fairly compute the value of it relative to my current gig.  So when I said 'no' and they asked 'what would make you take it?' I knew exactly what the answer was, and it was pretty ridiculous. 

The big difference was an equity-exposure-versus-salary sort of thing.  They were already a medium-large company, and they were pitching it as having small-company growth prospects, and valuing the offer from that perspective.  So we were pretty far apart in terms of how we were viewing the package, and I thought it was far short of what I was already making.

When I declined the offer, the boss-to-be asked "what would you take?" and I told him it would take about a 5x increase in equity to reach parity, at which point I'd take it.  I said I didn't think they could do that, but didn't want to make the decision for them by just rejecting the offer.  He thanked me, and ran it up the chain of command.  I didn't get a counter-offer, but I don't think there were any hard feelings.

History proved me right, too.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: mtn on December 29, 2015, 03:11:39 PM
First one to bail, before the raise even, a critical employee. First they counter. He says no. Then they say" name your price. "

Has anyone here ever actually followed through on an offer like that? I've never been in the situation, but I think it would be fun to play around with the jerks just a little bit. I wouldn't ask for anything completely ridiculous, but maybe 2.5x salary with one-half upfront as a "retention bonus" (and with no claw-back provisions attached) just to see if they'd bite.

When my grandpa retired in the mid 80's, his company tried to get him to sign a non-compete in exchange for $300,000. He wouldn't take it.

Not long after that, another company came knocking, and grandpa kept saying no. He finally got a nice base salary and a good bonus structure--no idea if it made up the $300k--but the icing on the cake was the company car that he got to keep as long as he stayed for (2?) years, and the country club membership that they paid for while he was an employee, and got to keep when he retired again (had to pay his own dues after retirement). So he got probably 2-4 years more work, a new Cadillac, and a country club membership.

I'd have taken the $300,000 myself, but I sure respect the guy for doing what he did--and having the FU money to not take it.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: jlajr on December 29, 2015, 10:25:24 PM
Seriously? The time to handle this was months ago.

How often do I have this exact feeling?

Even if a current employer eventually offers terms I'm willing to accept, it would irritate me that they only expressed willingness to change the terms of my employment after I threaten to leave or announce that I'm leaving.

If they think that strategy works for them, great, but I don't have to enable or encourage it.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: JLee on December 30, 2015, 07:41:58 AM
Seriously? The time to handle this was months ago.

How often do I have this exact feeling?

Even if a current employer eventually offers terms I'm willing to accept, it would irritate me that they only expressed willingness to change the terms of my employment after I threaten to leave or announce that I'm leaving.

If they think that strategy works for them, great, but I don't have to enable or encourage it.

I agree-- if I was that valuable of an employee, then perhaps they should've offered that before I quit. :P
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Guesl982374 on December 30, 2015, 09:56:53 AM
Seriously? The time to handle this was months ago.

How often do I have this exact feeling?

Even if a current employer eventually offers terms I'm willing to accept, it would irritate me that they only expressed willingness to change the terms of my employment after I threaten to leave or announce that I'm leaving.

If they think that strategy works for them, great, but I don't have to enable or encourage it.

I agree-- if I was that valuable of an employee, then perhaps they should've offered that before I quit. :P

I disagree. You guys are taking it too personal. Before you quit, you came to work everyday at the agreed upon rate. It's not the employer's fault if you negotiated a poor pay package upfront. There is an unspoken agreement everyday you go into the office that you are OK working for the agreed upon rate. You need to be willing to walk away (quit) to get that rate changed and show that you aren't OK working for the current rate.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: JLee on December 30, 2015, 10:03:26 AM
Seriously? The time to handle this was months ago.

How often do I have this exact feeling?

Even if a current employer eventually offers terms I'm willing to accept, it would irritate me that they only expressed willingness to change the terms of my employment after I threaten to leave or announce that I'm leaving.

If they think that strategy works for them, great, but I don't have to enable or encourage it.

I agree-- if I was that valuable of an employee, then perhaps they should've offered that before I quit. :P

I disagree. You guys are taking it too personal. Before you quit, you came to work everyday at the agreed upon rate. It's not the employer's fault if you negotiated a poor pay package upfront. There is an unspoken agreement everyday you go into the office that you are OK working for the agreed upon rate. You need to be willing to walk away (quit) to get that rate changed and show that you aren't OK working for the current rate.

Before I quit, I was promoted five times in less than three years and negotiations along the way proved fruitless. I walked away for a 60% raise.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: scottish on December 30, 2015, 01:07:04 PM
I'm with you JLee.  I used to do everything I could to keep my best developers happy.   I didn't want them to even think about looking for another job.  It's wrong to think the employee-employer relationship is just business, you really want a smoothly functioning team who share ownership and objectives, not an interchangeable set of cogs in a machine.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: nobodyspecial on December 30, 2015, 01:10:57 PM
yes but ..... a small turnover can be healthy to bring new people onboard.
Otherwise you can end up with that MUMPS/VMS/REXX system you built in 1980 because nobody has ever left and nobody new ever came in.

Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: StartingEarly on December 30, 2015, 05:37:29 PM
No, you just keep your best people trained. You keep them up to speed with all the new languages and they will be trained by who you want them to be trained by and not who ended up training them by chance.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: scottish on December 30, 2015, 05:54:41 PM
We always had a small turnover no matter what I did.  All 3 of the companies where I was a manager were in decline.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: nobodyspecial on December 30, 2015, 07:05:18 PM
No, you just keep your best people trained. You keep them up to speed with all the new languages and they will be trained by who you want them to be trained by and not who ended up training them by chance.
You need to train your people but it's not the same thing as fresh blood:
New hire saying, I've been playing with docker and I think it could really help on this project because of x,y,z. 
Manager saying, I read in an airline magazine that containers are going to be big so I'm sending one random developer on a training course for whatever our current biggest supplier claims is their container technology. 
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: nobodyspecial on December 30, 2015, 07:08:55 PM
No, you just keep your best people trained. You keep them up to speed with all the new languages and they will be trained by who you want them to be trained by and not who ended up training them by chance.
You need to train your people but it's not the same thing as fresh blood:
New hire saying, I've been playing with docker and I think it could really help on this project because of x,y,z. 
Manager saying, I read in an airline magazine that containers are going to be big so I'm sending one random developer on a training course for whatever our current biggest supplier claims is their container technology. 
Or worse - you are all watching a 1 hour webinar on Azure tomorrow over lunch - so you will all be trained in cloud computing.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: jlajr on December 30, 2015, 10:02:17 PM
I disagree. You guys are taking it too personal. Before you quit, you came to work everyday at the agreed upon rate. It's not the employer's fault if you negotiated a poor pay package upfront. There is an unspoken agreement everyday you go into the office that you are OK working for the agreed upon rate. You need to be willing to walk away (quit) to get that rate changed and show that you aren't OK working for the current rate.

I wholeheartedly agree with you, but only if there had been no negotiation or other discussion of employment terms before threatening to leave or handing in the resignation. In my particular circumstances, that isn't nor hasn't been the case.

Also, I don't think I'd be taking it too personal. Meaning, under the circumstances I just described, I feel it is a poor way of conducting business. It does not affect any personal feelings I might have toward my manager or the employer.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: BlueHouse on January 04, 2016, 08:50:56 AM
Seriously? The time to handle this was months ago.

How often do I have this exact feeling?

Even if a current employer eventually offers terms I'm willing to accept, it would irritate me that they only expressed willingness to change the terms of my employment after I threaten to leave or announce that I'm leaving.

If they think that strategy works for them, great, but I don't have to enable or encourage it.

I agree-- if I was that valuable of an employee, then perhaps they should've offered that before I quit. :P

When I was still working "for the man", I liked my job and felt respected and was learning a lot.  A director of a different company that worked alongside me kept asking me to join them and I kept saying "not interested...don't want to even entertain your offer because I'm happy here...don't want to discuss the details." 
One day she just blurted out how much money she was talking about.  The base salary would have been a $35K increase.  All of a sudden, I was willing to hear the details and I was working for her within a month. 
But the first company kept me happy enough that I didn't feel the need to look elsewhere.  If the new boss hadn't been so persistent, I would probably still be at that job making decent money, but not life-changing. 
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: mm1970 on January 04, 2016, 09:46:36 AM
Seriously? The time to handle this was months ago.

How often do I have this exact feeling?

Even if a current employer eventually offers terms I'm willing to accept, it would irritate me that they only expressed willingness to change the terms of my employment after I threaten to leave or announce that I'm leaving.

If they think that strategy works for them, great, but I don't have to enable or encourage it.

I agree-- if I was that valuable of an employee, then perhaps they should've offered that before I quit. :P

I disagree. You guys are taking it too personal. Before you quit, you came to work everyday at the agreed upon rate. It's not the employer's fault if you negotiated a poor pay package upfront. There is an unspoken agreement everyday you go into the office that you are OK working for the agreed upon rate. You need to be willing to walk away (quit) to get that rate changed and show that you aren't OK working for the current rate.

See what BlueHouse just posted.

I realize that "it's not personal, it's business", but it kind of is.  When you consider you are trading your time for money.

The company tries to get the best people for the least amount of money.

Yes, I negotiated this rate.  Four years ago.  I did not:
negotiate a rate to not change in four year
agree to get more work and responsibility thrown at me due to layoffs, at the same rate as four years ago
agree to hire four newer senior engineers at "going rate" (aka $12k to 30k a year more than I make)
agree to train, or just flat out do the work of, the two higher paid engineers because they are ineffective and/or lazy

The fact of the matter is, if a company is willing to hire "new blood" at market rate, they REALLY need to be careful about keeping current employees underpaid compared to market rate.  In the case of my company:
3/4 hires were "senior" to me in age/ experience, although once you get to over 20 years, it doesn't matter so much - it's more individual areas of expertise
4/4 were paid more than me
2/4 were fabulous and worth any penny. One worked for me.  I did not care that she made more than me.  Both of the 2 came in, figured things out, and got shit done.
The other two were unable or unwilling to do their jobs.  One of them, quite literally, would disappear for hours to walk on the beach.  I ended up doing his job.  The other one shared an office with me and another guy, and asked us how to do his job half the day.  Really dude, you make $30k more than me, I can train you on our computer system but I am NOT doing you job for you.

The company has decided what the job is worth, they should pay it.  Many  many people here have tried to negotiate better terms in light of the lack of raises.  The answer has always be "no", unless they choose to leave, then suddenly it's "name your price".  By then, for the majority of people, it's too late.  Then we are left with a big hole.  The replacement person both costs more AND has to come up to speed.  Hiring and training takes MONTHS.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: scottish on January 04, 2016, 03:42:25 PM
Exactly.   one your employee has started looking for another job, it's already too late.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Kepler on January 10, 2016, 02:33:52 AM

Thanks Diane C - but don't worry - I'm okay.  I too feel like I'm playing hooky sometimes and it feels great. I just know that if I had been laid off, it may have felt like rejection.  But, I can't say for sure, as I controlled my own FIRE. 

As much as I usually don't give a shit about what people think, there is that small part of me that does. I can't pretend it away. But that's okay. I'm a social human. 

I'm puzzled by this, though: I would think layoffs would generally be driven by the financial health of the organisation, and therefore not reflect badly on the staff laid off? It had never actually occurred to me that someone would construe it as somehow reflecting badly on the person laid off - it's not like being individually sacked: they are generally letting lots of people go, and it could be for reasons like major projects winding down, relocations, etc.

I do understand that companies may try to hang on to their most valuable employees, and might want to lay off the least valuable by preference - but that assumes that companies are actually good at making that decision, and that they aren't doing layoffs by some abstract principle over which individual staff have no control (last hired, closest to retirement age, highest salary, etc.).  It also assumes that staff don't voluntarily opt in to being laid off because they want to move on anyway.

At my university, they periodically do calls for voluntary redundancies. The drivers are partially financial, but mainly designed to give the university some flexibility in responding to changing market conditions - and voluntary processes go down better on an industrial relations level.

Sometimes the calls are completely open - anyone who wants to take a voluntary redundancy can. Often, they are restricted in ways that you could construe to be about poor performance - most recently, for example, there was a call for voluntary redundancies that was open only to academic staff who don't have a PhD (for historical reasons, we have a certain percentage of these, but new national standards now prevent these staff from teaching postgrads, so the uni is trying to incentivise either their departure or their completion of a doctoral degree).  But the people who accepted this offer weren't necessarily bad staff. They were mostly just old enough that they didn't want the hassle of getting a doctorate, but also didn't want to be restricted to teaching only undergrads. It seemed a nicer way to deal with the changing regulatory environment than frogmarching people into a doctoral program... And most of the people who put themselves forward were close to retirement anyway. Their departures then opened positions for new staff.

Personally, I have every intention of taking a voluntary redundancy myself, if one comes up close enough to when I'm FI - a well-timed one could even let me leave a year or two earlier than would otherwise be viable. Now, I'm someone who won't care if others assume this means I'm a subpar researcher or whatever - but I would still consider someone who makes blanket negative judgements about people who are laid off, to be revealing that they aren't particularly savvy about how these things work.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: mm1970 on January 10, 2016, 08:40:49 AM
Quote
I'm puzzled by this, though: I would think layoffs would generally be driven by the financial health of the organisation, and therefore not reflect badly on the staff laid off? It had never actually occurred to me that someone would construe it as somehow reflecting badly on the person laid off - it's not like being individually sacked: they are generally letting lots of people go, and it could be for reasons like major projects winding down, relocations, etc.
It hurts to not be a "chosen one".

I was laid off once, when the entire company went out of business and went chapter...whateve the reorg is. Laid off over 400 people, kept 20.  It was easy to not feel bad back then, as I started my new job the next day.

A local company that's been here forever just shut down, and my friends who I got laid off with back in Dec of 1999 just got laid off there.  They closed the whole place, except for a handful to shut down the tools and ship them off.

My current company has had 3 layoffs.  It's hard to get laid off.  The first one, we lost a lot of the younger people that I'd hired the year before.  Only kept 1.
The next layoff, they hit a lot of senior people who were highly paid.  It wasn't done very well because they didn't bother to ask the bosses who was actually doing the work.
The third layoff shut down our manufacturing area.  So all of the manufacturing employees and engineers were laid off...except for two engineers - myself (the first) and one other (the second).  We are in very different jobs now.  But I'd imagine it would have been hard for the others who got laid off - to have not been "chosen" for a transfer to a different spot.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Zaga on January 10, 2016, 08:49:01 AM
I went through a layoff at my last job, worst work day of my life.  And not because I was chosen either.  So many great people who had dedicated their lives to that company were let go.  People who had been friends for 30+ years hurriedly exchanging phone numbers as they were called out.

The worst part is that I was NOT dedicated to that job or that company, so I watched people who I thought should have kept their jobs leave while I kept my job but didn't really want it.  It was heart-rending.  The next year they asked for volunteers, I volunteered.  Hopefully someone who really loved it there got to stay because of me leaving.

So sometimes it's not good to be kept on after a major layoff, it can just suck majorly.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Kepler on January 11, 2016, 12:21:40 AM
I went through a layoff at my last job, worst work day of my life.  And not because I was chosen either.  So many great people who had dedicated their lives to that company were let go.  People who had been friends for 30+ years hurriedly exchanging phone numbers as they were called out.

The worst part is that I was NOT dedicated to that job or that company, so I watched people who I thought should have kept their jobs leave while I kept my job but didn't really want it.  It was heart-rending.  The next year they asked for volunteers, I volunteered.  Hopefully someone who really loved it there got to stay because of me leaving.

So sometimes it's not good to be kept on after a major layoff, it can just suck majorly.

Oh I can completely understand this sort of reaction - whether sadness that other people are being hurt, or sadness at losing a workplace cohort you liked or (for mm1970) had mentored, or anything like that.  Sorry if that was unclear - I can totally see how someone would be upset by a layoff. I was just baffled that, in the interaction described above, the person's poker mate would think it somehow reflects badly on the people laid off.  I would think people might judge people just deciding to quit more than they would people being laid off (not that I think people should either, but I've certainly seen snarky pushbacks on people discussing plans to FIRE...)
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: scottish on January 11, 2016, 03:44:05 PM
I've worked for a couple of companies that did prolonged downsizing.   The first people to go were always  the people we thought weren't performing.   The only exception would occur if an entire business was being eliminated.   One company went out of it's way to try and hold on to their best people.   I was encouraged to trade my low-performers for high-performers from a product that was being shut down.    so I don't find it surprising at all that there can be a stigma attached to someone who's been laid off.
Title: Fired or laid off
Post by: jlajr on January 11, 2016, 11:42:45 PM
A few years ago, I was surprised to find out that some people I know, originally from the US I think, distinguish between being fired versus being laid off:


Because I don't think many people would volunteer to family, friends, or potential employers that they were fired for poor performance, I figured anyone who makes the distinction wouldn't say they were fired anyway. Meaning, even if they were in fact fired for poor performance, they'd say they were laid off.

The point being, I was using the terms interchangeably, not realizing others might have been attaching different meanings to the terms.

A colleague friend of mine, originally from the UK, uses the term sacked for all types of employment termination, I think. I don't think that works for US audiences though.
Title: Re: Fired or laid off
Post by: Rubic on January 12, 2016, 08:02:36 AM
A colleague friend of mine, originally from the UK, uses the term sacked for all types of employment termination, I think. I don't think that works for US audiences though.

I thought the UK term was "made redundant".
Title: Re: Fired or laid off
Post by: mtn on January 12, 2016, 08:27:23 AM
A few years ago, I was surprised to find out that some people I know, originally from the US I think, distinguish between being fired versus being laid off:

  • Being fired meaning a company terminated employment due to poor performance
  • Being laid off meaning a company terminated employment due to reorganization, downsizing, and so on

Because I don't think many people would volunteer to family, friends, or potential employers that they were fired for poor performance, I figured anyone who makes the distinction wouldn't say they were fired anyway. Meaning, even if they were in fact fired for poor performance, they'd say they were laid off.

The point being, I was using the terms interchangeably, not realizing others might have been attaching different meanings to the terms.

A colleague friend of mine, originally from the UK, uses the term sacked for all types of employment termination, I think. I don't think that works for US audiences though.

I've heard friends and family use "fired" to describe when the were indeed fired.

Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Joggernot on January 12, 2016, 08:32:10 AM
In Washington, DC if you were fired for cause, you didn't get unemployment compensation.  If you were "laid off", you got unemployment.  When I was laid off, the company was good in calling it a lay off, not a firing for cause.  Just a personal experience for me.
Title: Re: Fired or laid off
Post by: zephyr911 on January 12, 2016, 08:41:59 AM
Because I don't think many people would volunteer to family, friends, or potential employers that they were fired for poor performance, I figured anyone who makes the distinction wouldn't say they were fired anyway. Meaning, even if they were in fact fired for poor performance, they'd say they were laid off.

The point being, I was using the terms interchangeably, not realizing others might have been attaching different meanings to the terms.
I have friends who were honest about getting fired. They're the only kind worth having. ;)
Title: Re: Fired or laid off
Post by: frugalnacho on January 12, 2016, 08:58:01 AM
A few years ago, I was surprised to find out that some people I know, originally from the US I think, distinguish between being fired versus being laid off:

  • Being fired meaning a company terminated employment due to poor performance
  • Being laid off meaning a company terminated employment due to reorganization, downsizing, and so on

Because I don't think many people would volunteer to family, friends, or potential employers that they were fired for poor performance, I figured anyone who makes the distinction wouldn't say they were fired anyway. Meaning, even if they were in fact fired for poor performance, they'd say they were laid off.

The point being, I was using the terms interchangeably, not realizing others might have been attaching different meanings to the terms.

A colleague friend of mine, originally from the UK, uses the term sacked for all types of employment termination, I think. I don't think that works for US audiences though.

I've heard friends and family use "fired" to describe when the were indeed fired.

I've never known anyone to use the terms interchangeably. 
Title: Re: Fired or laid off
Post by: JLee on January 12, 2016, 08:59:36 AM
A few years ago, I was surprised to find out that some people I know, originally from the US I think, distinguish between being fired versus being laid off:

  • Being fired meaning a company terminated employment due to poor performance
  • Being laid off meaning a company terminated employment due to reorganization, downsizing, and so on

Because I don't think many people would volunteer to family, friends, or potential employers that they were fired for poor performance, I figured anyone who makes the distinction wouldn't say they were fired anyway. Meaning, even if they were in fact fired for poor performance, they'd say they were laid off.

The point being, I was using the terms interchangeably, not realizing others might have been attaching different meanings to the terms.

A colleague friend of mine, originally from the UK, uses the term sacked for all types of employment termination, I think. I don't think that works for US audiences though.

I've heard friends and family use "fired" to describe when the were indeed fired.

I've never known anyone to use the terms interchangeably.

Neither have I.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: frugalnacho on January 12, 2016, 09:17:52 AM
Also it seems totally irrelevant what terminology you would use with a potential employer, as most can and will call your former employer anyway, and your former employer will almost certainly not have an issue using the term fired if you were in fact fired for any reason (poor performance, sexual harassment, stealing, damaging company property, etc).
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Chris22 on January 12, 2016, 09:43:50 AM
There's really three categories:

Laid Off: exited as part of a larger restructuring, job eliminated or moved to another region, etc.  Generally impacts more than 1 person.
Fired/terminated: Let go for poor job performance, etc.
Fired/terminated for cause: did something severely against the rules, like sexual harassment, watching adult movies on company property, theft, etc.

Usually the first is relatively without stigma, assuming it's fairly well known the company is downsizing ("Acme co slashes 1,000 jobs!").  The second is not without stigma, but often a company will let a poor performer resign, and you still might get severance. 

The last is a big no no.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: mm1970 on January 12, 2016, 10:16:50 AM
Also it seems totally irrelevant what terminology you would use with a potential employer, as most can and will call your former employer anyway, and your former employer will almost certainly not have an issue using the term fired if you were in fact fired for any reason (poor performance, sexual harassment, stealing, damaging company property, etc).
This is in fact not true.  Legally it's a big problem, specifically in California.  (I can't speak for other areas)

We've been instructed by our HR that if we are called for reference for former employees, we are ONLY allowed to confirm their employment.  Otherwise, it can be construed as interfering with a person's livelihood.

(I mean, all sorts of back door phone calls happen anyway, when you know someone who knows someone.)  By the way, this goes for good AND bad employees.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: frugalnacho on January 12, 2016, 11:36:44 AM
Also it seems totally irrelevant what terminology you would use with a potential employer, as most can and will call your former employer anyway, and your former employer will almost certainly not have an issue using the term fired if you were in fact fired for any reason (poor performance, sexual harassment, stealing, damaging company property, etc).
This is in fact not true.  Legally it's a big problem, specifically in California.  (I can't speak for other areas)

We've been instructed by our HR that if we are called for reference for former employees, we are ONLY allowed to confirm their employment.  Otherwise, it can be construed as interfering with a person's livelihood.

(I mean, all sorts of back door phone calls happen anyway, when you know someone who knows someone.)  By the way, this goes for good AND bad employees.

Really?  I don't have any first hand experience, but I always thought that was the purpose of calling former employers.  Seems really pointless if they are not allowed to disclose any information other than the person did in fact worked there (or not).  I mean if you were fired for a violent offense, or stealing/damaging company property, or not being able to perform your job (i've worked with people that could not perform basic tasks that were fundamental to their job) it would be critical information to the new employer.  It also defies the entire premise of a reference.  I mean what good is a reference if all my former employer can legally say is "yes frugalnacho worked here until X date"?

EDIT: I'm not a lawyer, but every single source I am finding on a quick google search is telling me you are wrong.  Your company may in fact have this policy, but the first 5 sources I checked said this is a common misconception and there is in fact no laws barring an employer from disclosing that information if they choose to.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: AZDude on January 12, 2016, 11:51:13 AM
Its a liability issue. I listed my former supervisor at a govt agency as a reference and he flat out refused to say anything other than referring them to HR. I finally had to call and ask a personal favor before he would give an OK reference. Every other supervisor was more than happy to say something.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: frugalnacho on January 12, 2016, 11:59:18 AM
Its a liability issue. I listed my former supervisor at a govt agency as a reference and he flat out refused to say anything other than referring them to HR. I finally had to call and ask a personal favor before he would give an OK reference. Every other supervisor was more than happy to say something.

I didn't include it in my post above, but the one caveat all those sources mentioned is that the information must be true.  That shouldn't really have to be listed as a caveat though.  If you get fired for stealing, what liability is the company assuming by relaying that fact to potential employers?  I could understand if they suspected you of something but couldn't prove it, but fired you anyway because it's an at-will agreement and they can fire you, that they shouldn't be allowed to pass on that information.  But if it's factual  I don't understand where the liability comes into play.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: AZDude on January 12, 2016, 12:03:46 PM
Rarely are things that black and white. If you were caught stealing, and there is a police report and conviction, then probably not a big deal. If the company says you were stealing, and fires you, but there is never a conviction or any legal consequences, then you have to be able to prove your assertions in court based on the most-likely flimsy evidence you have.

Much easier to just say "he was let go on XX/XX/XXXX involuntarily", which is impossible to argue.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Chris22 on January 12, 2016, 12:10:18 PM
The code questions are

"Is XXX eligible for rehire?" and "Was XXX let go as part of a larger reduction in force?"  No to either tells a hiring manager all they need to know.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: rockstache on January 12, 2016, 12:12:42 PM
Also it seems totally irrelevant what terminology you would use with a potential employer, as most can and will call your former employer anyway, and your former employer will almost certainly not have an issue using the term fired if you were in fact fired for any reason (poor performance, sexual harassment, stealing, damaging company property, etc).
This is in fact not true.  Legally it's a big problem, specifically in California.  (I can't speak for other areas)

We've been instructed by our HR that if we are called for reference for former employees, we are ONLY allowed to confirm their employment.  Otherwise, it can be construed as interfering with a person's livelihood.

(I mean, all sorts of back door phone calls happen anyway, when you know someone who knows someone.)  By the way, this goes for good AND bad employees.

In my state it is the same way. The only thing that anyone can do is confirm that someone worked here.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: frugalnacho on January 12, 2016, 12:27:16 PM
Also it seems totally irrelevant what terminology you would use with a potential employer, as most can and will call your former employer anyway, and your former employer will almost certainly not have an issue using the term fired if you were in fact fired for any reason (poor performance, sexual harassment, stealing, damaging company property, etc).
This is in fact not true.  Legally it's a big problem, specifically in California.  (I can't speak for other areas)

We've been instructed by our HR that if we are called for reference for former employees, we are ONLY allowed to confirm their employment.  Otherwise, it can be construed as interfering with a person's livelihood.

(I mean, all sorts of back door phone calls happen anyway, when you know someone who knows someone.)  By the way, this goes for good AND bad employees.

In my state it is the same way. The only thing that anyone can do is confirm that someone worked here.

Are you sure this is state law and not just your companies HR policy?

As for mm1970's state of california this is the information I found:

Quote
California

Cal. Civ. Code § 47(c); Cal. Lab. Code §§ 1053, 1055

Information that may be disclosed:

• job performance

• reasons for termination or separation

• knowledge, qualifications, skills, or abilities based upon credible evidence

• eligibility for rehire

Who may request or receive information:

• prospective employer

Employer required to write letter:

• public utility companies only

Not that I intentionally want to be argumentative, but I trust the actual laws of california rather than what your HR department has relayed to you.  Maybe I am mistaken, but I just went and read the law for myself and it seems like they certainly can disclose the reason you were fired to a potential employer that asks.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: turketron on January 12, 2016, 12:37:11 PM
I worked in Payroll at my last job and since we had the employment records for everyone, any and all verifications of employment came to us to complete, including background checks for job applications, mortgages, etc. For liability reasons we were very careful about what we would release and how it was phrased- even with a signed release from the employee we would only release their dates of employment, pay rate, and if they were eligible for rehire.

This was for a temp agency, so for employees who were no longer working we were very careful to state that they didn't quit, nor were they fired. They entered into an agreement with us to work a specific temp assignment- 3 months, for example. After that 3 months, their assignment ended. The employee didn't elect to leave, nor did the employer fire them, so implying that either was the case would be inaccurate and could negatively affect things like state benefits, unemployment, or job applications for other companies.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Papa bear on January 12, 2016, 12:58:41 PM

Also it seems totally irrelevant what terminology you would use with a potential employer, as most can and will call your former employer anyway, and your former employer will almost certainly not have an issue using the term fired if you were in fact fired for any reason (poor performance, sexual harassment, stealing, damaging company property, etc).
This is in fact not true.  Legally it's a big problem, specifically in California.  (I can't speak for other areas)

We've been instructed by our HR that if we are called for reference for former employees, we are ONLY allowed to confirm their employment.  Otherwise, it can be construed as interfering with a person's livelihood.

(I mean, all sorts of back door phone calls happen anyway, when you know someone who knows someone.)  By the way, this goes for good AND bad employees.

Really?  I don't have any first hand experience, but I always thought that was the purpose of calling former employers.  Seems really pointless if they are not allowed to disclose any information other than the person did in fact worked there (or not).  I mean if you were fired for a violent offense, or stealing/damaging company property, or not being able to perform your job (i've worked with people that could not perform basic tasks that were fundamental to their job) it would be critical information to the new employer.  It also defies the entire premise of a reference.  I mean what good is a reference if all my former employer can legally say is "yes frugalnacho worked here until X date"?

EDIT: I'm not a lawyer, but every single source I am finding on a quick google search is telling me you are wrong.  Your company may in fact have this policy, but the first 5 sources I checked said this is a common misconception and there is in fact no laws barring an employer from disclosing that information if they choose to.

In my experience, most organizations have an HR policy that limits information given in references.  (Some will outsource this information to third party firms, such as The Work Number) However, most candidates will provide references that will provide information "outside" of the HR policy.  Candidates that provide references that can't give any information usually don't have any good references to give.

Very rarely will you have a reference that will come out and say that the person was fired. 

Calling on references from a candidate's former organization typically will NOT yield information about if they were fired. Calling the HR department will almost certainly not yield that information.


Source: I've conducted thousands of references nationally.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: mtn on January 12, 2016, 01:26:11 PM
My last job, the supervisor wouldn't give the [phenomenal] intern a recommendation/reference for another internship... with her school. HR policy was that strict.

Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: frugalnacho on January 12, 2016, 01:37:35 PM
As has been established in this thread and countless other threads on the forum the HR department of most companies are usually divorced from reality, have policies that don't make logical sense, and are usually ill informed.  I understand erring on the side of caution and not wanting to bad mouth an employee (even if true) for liability reasons*, but I can't think of any reason not to give a positive recommendation for a phenomenal employee. 

* Actually I don't understand it after reading up on the laws.  It seems most states not only are you allowed to disclose that information, but many states have specifically drafted immunity laws to protect former employers for this exact situation. 
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: mtn on January 12, 2016, 01:44:32 PM
As has been established in this thread and countless other threads on the forum the HR department of most companies are usually divorced from reality, have policies that don't make logical sense, and are usually ill informed.  I understand erring on the side of caution and not wanting to bad mouth an employee (even if true) for liability reasons*, but I can't think of any reason not to give a positive recommendation for a phenomenal employee. 

* Actually I don't understand it after reading up on the laws.  It seems most states not only are you allowed to disclose that information, but many states have specifically drafted immunity laws to protect former employers for this exact situation.

I know that the reason my last company had the “Yes he worked here” or “No, he did not work here” policy was the following true story, although I’m not sure if it was my former company or another one that had the experience:

A guy was hired, and he regularly brought a gun to work—in a secured office with little chance of anything happening. Not only did he bring it, he put it on his desk while he was working. This made a lot of people uncomfortable. When the company tried to tell them, he went all 2nd amendment on them. It was going to be a long tedious process of either firing him and having lawsuits, or figuring out a way to not let the guy bring it in. Eventually they paid him off with a severance package and a glowing letter of recommendation (and his work was phenomenal), and he got a new job. About 5 months into the new job, he goes off the deep end and kills someone with the gun.

The company that had hired him went after the company that wrote the recommendation. Not sure what the outcome was.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: frugalnacho on January 12, 2016, 01:48:05 PM
As has been established in this thread and countless other threads on the forum the HR department of most companies are usually divorced from reality, have policies that don't make logical sense, and are usually ill informed.  I understand erring on the side of caution and not wanting to bad mouth an employee (even if true) for liability reasons*, but I can't think of any reason not to give a positive recommendation for a phenomenal employee. 

* Actually I don't understand it after reading up on the laws.  It seems most states not only are you allowed to disclose that information, but many states have specifically drafted immunity laws to protect former employers for this exact situation.

I know that the reason my last company had the “Yes he worked here” or “No, he did not work here” policy was the following true story, although I’m not sure if it was my former company or another one that had the experience:

A guy was hired, and he regularly brought a gun to work—in a secured office with little chance of anything happening. Not only did he bring it, he put it on his desk while he was working. This made a lot of people uncomfortable. When the company tried to tell them, he went all 2nd amendment on them. It was going to be a long tedious process of either firing him and having lawsuits, or figuring out a way to not let the guy bring it in. Eventually they paid him off with a severance package and a glowing letter of recommendation (and his work was phenomenal), and he got a new job. About 5 months into the new job, he goes off the deep end and kills someone with the gun.

The company that had hired him went after the company that wrote the recommendation. Not sure what the outcome was.

Odd.  That anecdote actually seems to be in support of HR being more truthful and open, not more restrictive and secretive.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: mtn on January 12, 2016, 01:50:28 PM
Not when you can consider the employee could sue for slander/libel if he doesn't like the tone. Just easier to say "Yes" or "No".
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: frugalnacho on January 12, 2016, 02:02:56 PM
Not when you can consider the employee could sue for slander/libel if he doesn't like the tone. Just easier to say "Yes" or "No".

But they can't, i've already posted the laws saying they can't.  It's not slander/libel if it's true. The real issue is whether he has a right to carry a fire arm into work and whether he can be fired for that reason.  Most job sites I work on (in several states) have a very strict no firearm policy.  You are not even allowed to have it in your car on company property, and almost every one of them stresses this fact before we are allowed onsite, and they also have it posted near all the entrance gates.  I'm going to go out on a limb and say that none of these large multi-billion dollar companies are violating the law by not allowing firearms onsite, because they all do it, and they all have been doing it for my entire career.  Your company absolutely could have a made a no firearm policy, and fired him for violating that (after the rule was established and he was made aware of it obviously), and they could have absolutely disclosed that fact to other potential employers and could not have been sued over it. 
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Chris22 on January 12, 2016, 02:10:06 PM
Not when you can consider the employee could sue for slander/libel if he doesn't like the tone. Just easier to say "Yes" or "No".

But they can't, i've already posted the laws saying they can't.  It's not slander/libel if it's true.

What you're saying is true, BUT, it's up to the company to fight the battle in court to clear itself.  MUCH easier to institute a blanket policy "don't say anything".  Even being right can be expensive in terms of legal fees.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: mistershankly on January 12, 2016, 02:17:58 PM
Not when you can consider the employee could sue for slander/libel if he doesn't like the tone. Just easier to say "Yes" or "No".

But they can't, i've already posted the laws saying they can't.  It's not slander/libel if it's true. The real issue is whether he has a right to carry a fire arm into work and whether he can be fired for that reason.  Most job sites I work on (in several states) have a very strict no firearm policy.  You are not even allowed to have it in your car on company property, and almost every one of them stresses this fact before we are allowed onsite, and they also have it posted near all the entrance gates.  I'm going to go out on a limb and say that none of these large multi-billion dollar companies are violating the law by not allowing firearms onsite, because they all do it, and they all have been doing it for my entire career.  Your company absolutely could have a made a no firearm policy, and fired him for violating that (after the rule was established and he was made aware of it obviously), and they could have absolutely disclosed that fact to other potential employers and could not have been sued over it.

What the law says and doesn't say has little to do with what transpires in a mediation if a former employee files a lawsuit.  Most businesses would rather clamp down on disclosure of information than deal with the costs of mediation and possible litigation.  Logical/legal or not, this is the reality that business owners need to contend with.  Unfortunately, the hiring process for the majority of skilled and good people are clouded with the "what if they or the next employer sues" fears of their former employer.  Yes, it is frustrating and unfair but this is the legal climate we all (predominantly in the U.S.) live in these days.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Rural on January 12, 2016, 04:00:44 PM
Its a liability issue. I listed my former supervisor at a govt agency as a reference and he flat out refused to say anything other than referring them to HR. I finally had to call and ask a personal favor before he would give an OK reference. Every other supervisor was more than happy to say something.

I didn't include it in my post above, but the one caveat all those sources mentioned is that the information must be true.  That shouldn't really have to be listed as a caveat though.  If you get fired for stealing, what liability is the company assuming by relaying that fact to potential employers?  I could understand if they suspected you of something but couldn't prove it, but fired you anyway because it's an at-will agreement and they can fire you, that they shouldn't be allowed to pass on that information.  But if it's factual  I don't understand where the liability comes into play.


 When I worked in management, we would do nothing more than confirm dates of employment  to reference calls.  We're not in California, not even close, and the concern was liability.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: scottish on January 12, 2016, 04:09:36 PM
Large tech companies up here won't fire you for poor performance because it's  ... just ... too ... much ... trouble.  It's cheaper to "lay you off" and give you a severance package to end the relationship quickly and cleanly.   To get fired, you have to sexually harass somebody, or break the law on company premises, or something of this nature.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: NumberJohnny5 on January 12, 2016, 04:57:38 PM
What's so upsetting is companies that require references, for example two references within the past 6-12 months, yet have a policy of only confirming the dates the employee worked there.

My wife would just walk around with a stack of blank reference forms (with fields such as hospital worked at, dates, the person's name giving the review, and a comment area). Toward the end of a contract she gets 3-5 people to fill one out for her (this isn't a problem, she's universally liked by all). One contract had this standard policy (prospective employee had to have multiple recent references, but they wouldn't allow references to be given) and were quite surprised that she, in fact, had references. Not just one or two, but a whole stack of them.

We (she) needed an official reference from one hospital for immigration purposes (we're from the US, went to Australia). Basically it had to say she was a competent nurse, was working there for X amount of time, etc. They wouldn't do it (the competent part). Immigration was not happy with the "Yes she worked here" letter, so we had to get another "Our policy is to only give dates of employment to any reference request"; luckily that was sufficient (though I'm guessing the immigration officer was scratching her head over that one).

Once we got the visa approved, she had need of said reference when she was applying for a nursing job in Australia. They absolutely required a letter from her manager stating she was a competent nurse and the dates she worked for them. Well, technically she didn't work for the hospital, she worked for an agency. So she got her recruiter to write her reference letter (on official company letterhead). That made them happy. They called him, apparently he sang her praises because they even commented on the glowing reference he gave her.

Needless to say, if/when we go back to the US and she takes up travel nursing again, we'll give strong preference to that particular recruiter.

Edit: I should probably throw in something FU money related.

As previously mentioned, my wife did travel nursing. Every contract she worked she got an offer to extend. She wanted the holidays off, so would simply not extend through those months, even if begged to. One hospital she worked at was pretty bad and she didn't want to go back (if you're reading this and recognize her...no, we're not talking about you, we're talking about that other hospital). The people were nice, just not the working environment (nowhere near enough staff). She simply didn't accept the extension. No bridges burned, no quitting after a couple months. Had we been desperate for money not only would she have stayed at that extremely stressful hospital, but she would have missed a lot of holidays while the kids were (are) still young.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: nobodyspecial on January 12, 2016, 08:28:18 PM
Large tech companies up here won't fire you for poor performance because it's  ... just ... too ... much ... trouble.  It's cheaper to "lay you off"
If you are only getting rid of one person there isn't usually much difference between "fired" and "redundancy".
You pay them off for the notice period and get them out of the door fast.

It only really matters when you are dumping a % high enough to trigger union or shareholder reporting requirements
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: rockstache on January 13, 2016, 08:48:46 PM

Also it seems totally irrelevant what terminology you would use with a potential employer, as most can and will call your former employer anyway, and your former employer will almost certainly not have an issue using the term fired if you were in fact fired for any reason (poor performance, sexual harassment, stealing, damaging company property, etc).
This is in fact not true.  Legally it's a big problem, specifically in California.  (I can't speak for other areas)

We've been instructed by our HR that if we are called for reference for former employees, we are ONLY allowed to confirm their employment.  Otherwise, it can be construed as interfering with a person's livelihood.

(I mean, all sorts of back door phone calls happen anyway, when you know someone who knows someone.)  By the way, this goes for good AND bad employees.

In my state it is the same way. The only thing that anyone can do is confirm that someone worked here.

Are you sure this is state law and not just your companies HR policy?

As for mm1970's state of california this is the information I found:

Quote
California

Cal. Civ. Code § 47(c); Cal. Lab. Code §§ 1053, 1055

Information that may be disclosed:

• job performance

• reasons for termination or separation

• knowledge, qualifications, skills, or abilities based upon credible evidence

• eligibility for rehire

Who may request or receive information:

• prospective employer

Employer required to write letter:

• public utility companies only

Not that I intentionally want to be argumentative, but I trust the actual laws of california rather than what your HR department has relayed to you.  Maybe I am mistaken, but I just went and read the law for myself and it seems like they certainly can disclose the reason you were fired to a potential employer that asks.

I'm not in California so I don't know what they do there. We don't have an HR department either, it's just what the bosses have told us is the only legal response. I've never cared enough to check.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: MMM98 on January 14, 2016, 07:20:51 AM
Here is one that actually is relevant to the topic

The setting was a Government agency, during a reorg placing employees is top priority.  Often the displaced person in a new position is unwelcome.  Even treated hostile.  Sometimes it’s a bad fit of job skills, sometimes it is simply the manager not getting to fill the position with who they would have chosen.

Samuel was placed in our office and was a bad fit and was not warmly received by our micromanager boss, Barb.  She lived to walk around each morning to see who came in on time, pour over time sheets, and check documents for proper punctuation but rarely added much content or value to the process.  Samuel was quiet and put up with this for 3 ½ years rarely divulging much about himself.  He always brought in his own lunch, occasionally mentioned his rental properties and drove a Toyota from early last decade.  He was sure proud of his later-in-life small child who was in every picture with his stay at home wife photos that covered his desk.  Unassuming is the word that would describe this guy, you could easily overlook him.

One day, on a Wednesday Barb came by and asked if anyone had heard from Samuel, he had been on vacation for two weeks and was due back Monday.  She only had his landline and he had shut it off some time ago.  Was he alright?  She did not want to be inconvenienced to drive over to his home to check on him so she reported him AWOL, Absent without Leave. Off went the report.  I am sure that she spent all morning documenting that she did everything right, all according with the appropriate regulation. HR, said he is not AWOL, he is retired.

HE CAN”T RETIRE! Barb said! He did not get me to sign off on that!

Now that is a FU story. 

Edit to English in punch line, I hate when that happens, thanks to Diane C for letting me know.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: G-dog on January 14, 2016, 07:38:04 AM
^Go Samuel!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: mm1970 on January 14, 2016, 09:11:00 AM
Here is one that actually is relevant to the topic

The setting was a Government agency, during a reorg placing employees is top priority.  Often the displaced person in a new position is unwelcome.  Even treated hostile.  Sometimes it’s a bad fit of job skills, sometimes it is simply the manager not getting to fill the position with who they would have chosen.

Samuel was placed in our office and was a bad fit and was not warmly received by our micromanager boss, Barb.  She lived to walk around each morning to see who came in on time, pour over time sheets, and check documents for proper punctuation but rarely added much content or value to the process.  Samuel was quiet and put up with this for 3 ½ years rarely divulging much about himself.  He always brought in his own lunch, occasionally mentioned his rental properties and drove a Toyota from early last decade.  He was sure proud of his later-in-life small child who was in every picture with his stay at home wife pictures that covered his desk.  Unassuming is the word that would describe this guy, you could easily overlook him.

One day, on a Wednesday Barb came by and asked if anyone had heard from Samuel, he had been on vacation for two weeks and was due back Monday.  She only had his landline and he had shut it off some time ago.  Was he alright?  She did not want to be inconvenienced to drive over to his home to check on him so she reported him AWOL, Absent without Leave. Off went the report.  I am sure that she spent all morning documenting that she did everything right, all according with the appropriate regulation. HR, said he is not AWOL, he is retired.

HE CAN”T RETIRE! Barb said! He did get me to sign off on that!

Now that is a FU story.

Yes, this is awesome!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: zephyr911 on January 14, 2016, 09:27:18 AM
HE CAN”T RETIRE! Barb said! He did get me to sign off on that!
Dude, the way my command tracks HR actions, I don't think I could pull that off, but I can imagine situations in which I'd try.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: frugalnacho on January 14, 2016, 10:01:09 AM
haha, FUCK YOU BARB!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: woopwoop on January 14, 2016, 05:23:34 PM
Wow, that Barb story is amazing!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: russianswinga on January 14, 2016, 05:29:03 PM
haha, FUCK YOU BARB!

For some reason that reminded me of this "retirement" scene in the movie Wanted.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XH7CXtxOflI (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XH7CXtxOflI)
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: With This Herring on January 14, 2016, 06:21:06 PM
Replying to follow.  :)
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: happy on January 14, 2016, 07:30:22 PM
Go Samuel, made me smile.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: pachnik on January 14, 2016, 08:16:37 PM
Go Samuel, made me smile.

Me too!   He could easily be one of us.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: MoonShadow on January 14, 2016, 09:22:53 PM
haha, FUCK YOU BARB!

For some reason that reminded me of this "retirement" scene in the movie Wanted.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XH7CXtxOflI (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XH7CXtxOflI)

On the short list of greatest movies of all time, IMHO.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: albireo13 on January 15, 2016, 07:26:06 AM
I work for a large high tech company. I often got a chuckle over how they would be selective about hiring, claiming that they wanted only "the best talent".
Of course the salary structure was unimpressive.  When asked about increasing salaries for engineers the official response was that the pay was "competitive and consistent with the industry average".    LOL

  So, basically they want to hire the best but expect to pay the average.  Of, course life doesn't work that way and the "best" would leave for elsewhere.

LOL    : )
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Kitsune on January 15, 2016, 08:15:29 AM
I work for a large high tech company. I often got a chuckle over how they would be selective about hiring, claiming that they wanted only "the best talent".
Of course the salary structure was unimpressive.  When asked about increasing salaries for engineers the official response was that the pay was "competitive and consistent with the industry average".    LOL

  So, basically they want to hire the best but expect to pay the average.  Of, course life doesn't work that way and the "best" would leave for elsewhere.

LOL    : )

And then, if they're anything like my old company, they've have eternal and endless 'all management' meetings to discuss the 'retention issue'. Of course, suggestions like 'enable flex time arrangements', or 'pay them what they're worth and what they're leaving for because others are paying those salaries right down the street', were rejected.

There's a reason I'm no longer working there, is all I'm sayin...
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Pooperman on January 15, 2016, 08:56:16 AM
I work for a large high tech company. I often got a chuckle over how they would be selective about hiring, claiming that they wanted only "the best talent".
Of course the salary structure was unimpressive.  When asked about increasing salaries for engineers the official response was that the pay was "competitive and consistent with the industry average".    LOL

  So, basically they want to hire the best but expect to pay the average.  Of, course life doesn't work that way and the "best" would leave for elsewhere.

LOL    : )

And then, if they're anything like my old company, they've have eternal and endless 'all management' meetings to discuss the 'retention issue'. Of course, suggestions like 'enable flex time arrangements', or 'pay them what they're worth and what they're leaving for because others are paying those salaries right down the street', were rejected.

There's a reason I'm no longer working there, is all I'm sayin...

Did you tell them that in the exit interview?
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: nobodyspecial on January 15, 2016, 09:02:41 AM
I work for a large high tech company. I often got a chuckle over how they would be selective about hiring, claiming that they wanted only "the best talent".
Of course the salary structure was unimpressive.  When asked about increasing salaries for engineers the official response was that the pay was "competitive and consistent with the industry average".   
We just wasted half a day in a meeting about recruitment problems presented by a bunch of expensive HR consultants waving an expensive report  (we paid $x0,000 for) which shows average salaries in our area and nationally - and picked the lowest.

I attempted to point out that paying the average meant you get the people that 50% of your competitors rejected.
That salary surveys under-report the truth because they faithfully count lots of low end salary jobs and don't count the secretly negotiated salaries of rock star programmers
And that we might want to look at remote workers given that we are located in one of the worlds highest COL cities

Don't think I'm invited to the next meeting
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: AZDude on January 15, 2016, 09:08:55 AM
Don't think I'm invited to the next meeting

So then a big win for you?
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: zephyr911 on January 15, 2016, 12:03:28 PM
I work for a large high tech company. I often got a chuckle over how they would be selective about hiring, claiming that they wanted only "the best talent".
Of course the salary structure was unimpressive.  When asked about increasing salaries for engineers the official response was that the pay was "competitive and consistent with the industry average".    LOL

  So, basically they want to hire the best but expect to pay the average.  Of, course life doesn't work that way and the "best" would leave for elsewhere.

LOL    : )
And then, if they're anything like my old company, they've have eternal and endless 'all management' meetings to discuss the 'retention issue'. Of course, suggestions like 'enable flex time arrangements', or 'pay them what they're worth and what they're leaving for because others are paying those salaries right down the street', were rejected.

There's a reason I'm no longer working there, is all I'm sayin...
It's truly amazing how much inertia, apathy, and lack of common sense there is in middle management. I'm truly lucky to have the super I do. He fought for alternate work schedules, is now fighting for routine telework, etc.
It's so bad (good) that I'm losing my zeal for FIRE.... ahahaha
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Chris22 on January 15, 2016, 12:40:15 PM
I work for a large high tech company. I often got a chuckle over how they would be selective about hiring, claiming that they wanted only "the best talent".
Of course the salary structure was unimpressive.  When asked about increasing salaries for engineers the official response was that the pay was "competitive and consistent with the industry average".   
We just wasted half a day in a meeting about recruitment problems presented by a bunch of expensive HR consultants waving an expensive report  (we paid $x0,000 for) which shows average salaries in our area and nationally - and picked the lowest.

I attempted to point out that paying the average meant you get the people that 50% of your competitors rejected.
That salary surveys under-report the truth because they faithfully count lots of low end salary jobs and don't count the secretly negotiated salaries of rock star programmers
And that we might want to look at remote workers given that we are located in one of the worlds highest COL cities

Don't think I'm invited to the next meeting

I was 18 months into working for my current employer, and two guys in another group approached me about joining their group to fill an empty role.  Great.  They talked about more visibility, responsibility, etc etc etc.  I eventually agreed, and then they went to HR to get them to make me an offer.  HR determined I was already highly paid, and they'd give me $0.00 to move.  I balked, and eventually a promise by the CEO to help me out come raise time got me to take the role, and in fairness, he did come through for me; got about a $7k raise (about $2500 of which I would have gotten as a COL increase anyways).  That put me around $92k IIRC.  And I worked about 5 months in the new role at the old pay.

I did well, and a year later I was promoted again, to managing my old role.  This time they did a reasonable job taking care of me $$-wise.  So I put out a req for my old role, and HR told me I had a budget of $90k to hire someone.  Eventually decided on a candidate (external) and the HR guys came back and said to hire that guy, we need to offer $99k, 10% over my budget.  I asked, uh, what can we do, and they said, oh don't worry, go ahead with the $99k offer.  WTF?

So for a guy, me, who was approached about filling a role, came with a proven track record at the company, I had to fight for a raise and got ~8%, of which a third I was going to get anyways. 

OTOH, for someone who was entirely unknown, no history at all, external hire, we paid him 10% over our plan (and $7k over what I was getting for the same role) with no blinks or hesitation at all.

Doesn't make sense to me at all.  And by the way, guy we hired turned out to be a shithead we've almost fired 2x now and is on "double secret probation".

Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: nobodyspecial on January 15, 2016, 05:51:05 PM
The only way to get a raise is to leave and return.

It's bad in areas like banking/consultancy - you get hired at market salary in the market when you were hired.
So people that happened to get hired in booms are being paid 30% more than others, and every year your increment is a % of your salary.

Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: scottish on January 15, 2016, 06:02:09 PM
I've had some good raises.  Last time I was promoted, I received a 12% raise I wasn't expecting.  I have never ever *threatened* to leave.   Like zephyr911 said:   
Quote
I'm truly lucky to have the super I do.
   This can make all the difference.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: mm1970 on January 15, 2016, 06:50:12 PM
I work for a large high tech company. I often got a chuckle over how they would be selective about hiring, claiming that they wanted only "the best talent".
Of course the salary structure was unimpressive.  When asked about increasing salaries for engineers the official response was that the pay was "competitive and consistent with the industry average".    LOL

  So, basically they want to hire the best but expect to pay the average.  Of, course life doesn't work that way and the "best" would leave for elsewhere.

LOL    : )
And then, if they're anything like my old company, they've have eternal and endless 'all management' meetings to discuss the 'retention issue'. Of course, suggestions like 'enable flex time arrangements', or 'pay them what they're worth and what they're leaving for because others are paying those salaries right down the street', were rejected.

There's a reason I'm no longer working there, is all I'm sayin...
It's truly amazing how much inertia, apathy, and lack of common sense there is in middle management. I'm truly lucky to have the super I do. He fought for alternate work schedules, is now fighting for routine telework, etc.
It's so bad (good) that I'm losing my zeal for FIRE.... ahahaha
I fought for that stuff back when I was a manager.  It was super hard.  In our case, it was hands on shift work, so what I fought for was a shift differential.  I eventually won, but then they took it away, because my employees were salaried.  "We don't have to give it to them."  "No, but it's fucking shitty that you are requiring them to work 6 pm to 6 am and on weekends.  You give the differential to the hourly employees, so you are just being an ass."
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: jlajr on January 15, 2016, 10:13:41 PM
I work for a large high tech company. I often got a chuckle over how they would be selective about hiring, claiming that they wanted only "the best talent".
Of course the salary structure was unimpressive.  When asked about increasing salaries for engineers the official response was that the pay was "competitive and consistent with the industry average".    LOL

  So, basically they want to hire the best but expect to pay the average.  Of, course life doesn't work that way and the "best" would leave for elsewhere.

LOL    : )

And then, if they're anything like my old company, they've have eternal and endless 'all management' meetings to discuss the 'retention issue'. Of course, suggestions like 'enable flex time arrangements', or 'pay them what they're worth and what they're leaving for because others are paying those salaries right down the street', were rejected.

There's a reason I'm no longer working there, is all I'm sayin...

These.

In April 2015, someone decided to lay off three people on my team of 16, including the manager with 24 years of experience with the products and a lead with 29 years of experience with the products. As part of my business unit's retention initiative, my new manager about a week ago asks me into his office and asks me if I plan on leaving in the next five years. Are you fucking kidding me? Besides the obvious - that is, if you want to retain knowledge, be as productive as possible, and produce the highest quality work, then don't lay your best people off without any knowledge transfer and retain/reward incompetency - I told him it was beyond unacceptable to ask me that question. I might answer the question honestly on an anonymous employee survey - which we had last year. I'm not about to allow them to attribute an answer to me, at which point it becomes a verbal commitment.

I didn't even realize it at the time, because I was a little stunned by the question, but it didn't even occur to me that if my situation remains the same, I should reach FIRE in 5-10 years. I would likely leave or significantly curtail my employment at that point. While other colleagues are aware I am contemplating FIRE in a general sense, I don't discuss specific figures and timelines. Anyway, while I doubt that has filtered back to my manager, you never know.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: AlanStache on January 16, 2016, 07:07:40 AM
... I'm not about to allow them to attribute an answer to me, at which point it becomes a verbal commitment.
...

Saying you intend to stay for X years could be legally binding in your country?!?!?  Like if you left early they could sue or deny retirement benefits  due to losses because you had left?
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: ender on January 16, 2016, 09:08:46 AM
... I'm not about to allow them to attribute an answer to me, at which point it becomes a verbal commitment.
...

Saying you intend to stay for X years could be legally binding in your country?!?!?  Like if you left early they could sue or deny retirement benefits  due to losses because you had left?

Some people might feel bad saying something like that knowing it's not going to be true.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: JLee on January 16, 2016, 04:58:24 PM
I work for a large high tech company. I often got a chuckle over how they would be selective about hiring, claiming that they wanted only "the best talent".
Of course the salary structure was unimpressive.  When asked about increasing salaries for engineers the official response was that the pay was "competitive and consistent with the industry average".   
We just wasted half a day in a meeting about recruitment problems presented by a bunch of expensive HR consultants waving an expensive report  (we paid $x0,000 for) which shows average salaries in our area and nationally - and picked the lowest.

I attempted to point out that paying the average meant you get the people that 50% of your competitors rejected.
That salary surveys under-report the truth because they faithfully count lots of low end salary jobs and don't count the secretly negotiated salaries of rock star programmers
And that we might want to look at remote workers given that we are located in one of the worlds highest COL cities

Don't think I'm invited to the next meeting

I was 18 months into working for my current employer, and two guys in another group approached me about joining their group to fill an empty role.  Great.  They talked about more visibility, responsibility, etc etc etc.  I eventually agreed, and then they went to HR to get them to make me an offer.  HR determined I was already highly paid, and they'd give me $0.00 to move.  I balked, and eventually a promise by the CEO to help me out come raise time got me to take the role, and in fairness, he did come through for me; got about a $7k raise (about $2500 of which I would have gotten as a COL increase anyways).  That put me around $92k IIRC.  And I worked about 5 months in the new role at the old pay.

I did well, and a year later I was promoted again, to managing my old role.  This time they did a reasonable job taking care of me $$-wise.  So I put out a req for my old role, and HR told me I had a budget of $90k to hire someone.  Eventually decided on a candidate (external) and the HR guys came back and said to hire that guy, we need to offer $99k, 10% over my budget.  I asked, uh, what can we do, and they said, oh don't worry, go ahead with the $99k offer.  WTF?

So for a guy, me, who was approached about filling a role, came with a proven track record at the company, I had to fight for a raise and got ~8%, of which a third I was going to get anyways. 

OTOH, for someone who was entirely unknown, no history at all, external hire, we paid him 10% over our plan (and $7k over what I was getting for the same role) with no blinks or hesitation at all.

Doesn't make sense to me at all.  And by the way, guy we hired turned out to be a shithead we've almost fired 2x now and is on "double secret probation".

Yeah...sounds familiar. I was promoted into a new role at my previous employer, then got my annual raise, then got another promotion, and was still making $4k less than the outside guy (in the same position) was making three years previously when he was initially hired.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: MoonShadow on January 16, 2016, 05:12:00 PM
... I'm not about to allow them to attribute an answer to me, at which point it becomes a verbal commitment.
...

Saying you intend to stay for X years could be legally binding in your country?!?!? Like if you left early they could sue or deny retirement benefits  due to losses because you had left?

No, not like that.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: jlajr on January 17, 2016, 12:25:29 AM
... I'm not about to allow them to attribute an answer to me, at which point it becomes a verbal commitment.
...

Saying you intend to stay for X years could be legally binding in your country?!?!?  Like if you left early they could sue or deny retirement benefits  due to losses because you had left?

I have no idea whether it is legally binding in my country, but I'd also rather not have to find out.

Asking the question to me is just as unacceptable as me asking him if the company is going to lay me off/fire me/sack me/terminate my employment agreement in that time period. He wouldn't answer that question, so I can't understand why they think I would answer their question for attribution. Anonymously, maybe.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: TomTX on January 17, 2016, 06:38:13 AM
... I'm not about to allow them to attribute an answer to me, at which point it becomes a verbal commitment.
...

Saying you intend to stay for X years could be legally binding in your country?!?!?  Like if you left early they could sue or deny retirement benefits  due to losses because you had left?

I have no idea whether it is legally binding in my country, but I'd also rather not have to find out.

Asking the question to me is just as unacceptable as me asking him if the company is going to lay me off/fire me/sack me/terminate my employment agreement in that time period. He wouldn't answer that question, so I can't understand why they think I would answer their question for attribution. Anonymously, maybe.

"I have no plans to resign or retire."

Unless you have a signed offer letter in hand from another employer, you don't have a plan.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: jlajr on January 17, 2016, 10:32:24 PM
"I have no plans to resign or retire."

Unless you have a signed offer letter in hand from another employer, you don't have a plan.

Well, a few weeks ago, I came across the idea of mini-retirement, so a plan wouldn't necessarily depend on a signed offer letter in hand from another employer.

Nonetheless, I appreciate your point.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: coin on January 18, 2016, 09:55:31 PM
This thread is a thing of beauty and justice, I am awed.

My coworker at my previous job was a friend of mine and revealed that he was getting paid a couple dollars more an hour than me. Doesn't sound like much more but it worked out to about $5000 per annum.

I was more experienced and had qualifications (that they needed to maintain multi-million dollar contracts) that my buddy didn't, so the pay gap made absolutely no sense because he had not negotiated at all with them and we were doing the exact same job.  I brought it up with them, they told me tough shit and they weren't going to make us equal. Then I accused them of gender discrimination because it suddenly occurred to me I was the only lady performing this job and they denied, denied, denied.

Even if it wasn't gender discrimination, they could have brought our pays in line and I would have shut up and gone back to work rather than spend three weeks in meetings and arguing with them about how they weren't following their own policy. They could have saved money right there!

By that stage I decided to quit in a few weeks whether or not I had found a new job. I get the impression they grossly underestimated me and thought I wouldn't quit.

Luckily for me, I found a job that paid $10k more, put in my notice and that was that. Only after I left did they realise they were suddenly down one of the few people that could work early mornings, who had most of the qualifications they needed for their contracts and who they had just spent thousands of dollars training for said contracts.

They were stupid enough to give me an exit interview form to fill out about my time at the company... As if I wouldn't share with them how annoyed I was about the whole situation. I found it yesterday while I was sorting some papers. My responses were polite but you can tell I was extremely angry when I wrote it because I liked the job but the management were arseholes.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: electriceagle on January 19, 2016, 01:23:52 AM
I did well, and a year later I was promoted again, to managing my old role.  This time they did a reasonable job taking care of me $$-wise.  So I put out a req for my old role, and HR told me I had a budget of $90k to hire someone.  Eventually decided on a candidate (external) and the HR guys came back and said to hire that guy, we need to offer $99k, 10% over my budget.  I asked, uh, what can we do, and they said, oh don't worry, go ahead with the $99k offer.  WTF?

So for a guy, me, who was approached about filling a role, came with a proven track record at the company, I had to fight for a raise and got ~8%, of which a third I was going to get anyways. 

OTOH, for someone who was entirely unknown, no history at all, external hire, we paid him 10% over our plan (and $7k over what I was getting for the same role) with no blinks or hesitation at all.

Doesn't make sense to me at all.  And by the way, guy we hired turned out to be a shithead we've almost fired 2x now and is on "double secret probation".

Yep, the only way to get real raises is to change companies during a boom. A company that hires does so because they recognize an immediate need; the company that you move from only recognizes that you're not worth firing. Ergo, a company that is hiring is motivated to pay more.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Kitsune on January 19, 2016, 07:02:40 AM
I did well, and a year later I was promoted again, to managing my old role.  This time they did a reasonable job taking care of me $$-wise.  So I put out a req for my old role, and HR told me I had a budget of $90k to hire someone.  Eventually decided on a candidate (external) and the HR guys came back and said to hire that guy, we need to offer $99k, 10% over my budget.  I asked, uh, what can we do, and they said, oh don't worry, go ahead with the $99k offer.  WTF?

So for a guy, me, who was approached about filling a role, came with a proven track record at the company, I had to fight for a raise and got ~8%, of which a third I was going to get anyways. 

OTOH, for someone who was entirely unknown, no history at all, external hire, we paid him 10% over our plan (and $7k over what I was getting for the same role) with no blinks or hesitation at all.

Doesn't make sense to me at all.  And by the way, guy we hired turned out to be a shithead we've almost fired 2x now and is on "double secret probation".

Yep, the only way to get real raises is to change companies during a boom. A company that hires does so because they recognize an immediate need; the company that you move from only recognizes that you're not worth firing. Ergo, a company that is hiring is motivated to pay more.

This. I'm currently 31, and I've had 4 professional jobs since graduating from university (BA in English Lit with a minor in European history and women's studies; I clearly wanted a job)

Job 1: 35K/year, 80 hours a week of being screamed at. I lasted 13 months; just long enough to get enough experience to get a better job elsewhere.
Job 2: 40K/year, 55 hours per week, reasonable working conditions in a company I liked. No raises for 3.5 years (start-up that wasn't making money), but I argued a lot of quality-of-life 'raises' (working from home, expensing my phone/internet/bus pass, 2 extra weeks vacation, etc)
Job 3: 68K/year + 8% bonus, 60 hours per week. I was hired by someone I had previously worked with, negotiated well, had experience to back it up, and justified an extra increase by telling the interviewer that if I was giving up all the quality of life bonuses I had at my previous job, that had to be compensated for with money. It worked. *shrugs*It was huge corporate thing and I HATED it, but it was worth it for the money and experience (and knowledge that I hate working for huge and corporate and should avoid at all costs in the future) I worked there 3 years, plus technically a year of maternity leave.
Job 4 (where I'm currently at): 60K/year, 35 hours per week. Slight pay cut, but honestly, I will absolutely lose 8K/year to work 25 hours per week less... because at that salary difference, those hours are paid at 6$/hour CAD... or 60% of minimum wage. Bugger that. If I need 8K more, I'll go be a consultant somewhere for a month or two. Or, y'know, sell some eggs/asparagus/raspberries once our garden gets going. There are better ways to make 8K than to work 25 hours per week for a year...

And the people I graduated university with who are still in the company they started out with? Are working 60+ hours per week for under 40K a year, universally.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Papa Mustache on February 17, 2016, 10:19:40 PM
I'll throw in my bone (story). I've told it before so if it sounds familiar I apologize.

Was working for a once smallish engineering company that did not pay very well in retrospect and that basically used people up. They could do that b/c they had a surplus of applicants in our town at the time - that was the early chapters of the Great Recession.

We'd have company meetings with the managers spinning great yarns about how great things were. Then one day they laid off about ten guys (out of ~145 employees) - a couple really good guys with potential to make way for a lousy manager that needed to backslide to keep his job after failing to measure up.

The guy was/is a nut. I never witnessed any episodes but from time to time he'd throw public tantrums. My direct troubles with him mostly amounted to last second "emergency" assignments that occupied late nights and weekends. Also contradictory instructions. Once delivered I'd notice that these assignments would cool on the back burner for a month or more. Meanwhile I was working unpaid overtime on top of a modest entry-level salary.

I've since heard stories of him doing that to his entire team. Order his guys to work that weekend with 30 mins notice as he's headed out the door and out of town to the mtns for the weekend. Never mind if you had plans... At least his floor team was working hourly and thus overtime. Maybe part of why he got stepped on - causing overtime just so he could throw his weight around.

I was naive, believed the "team" concept for too long and bought the management's spiel at the company pep-rallies. Then the guy that hired me left to start his own company competing with the company he left. Took the cream of the crop experienced engineers and builders. I should have realized that from his POV he could see the place souring. Naive me...

With the guy that hired me gone, I was quickly designing/building projects for several managers. Much higher work load. I was hired to do these projects using methods were were very slow and time consuming. Using some simple software and redesigning the work flow I quietly automated much of what I did. The challenge then was to appear busy. Had to track billing on the various projects. That was eventually all made up b/c it was impossible to account for my time accurately.

I wanted to parlay all this into a promotion but it was clear that during this period, promotions were difficult to obtain, and I was so low on the career ladder my future was uncertain no matter how much I was accomplishing. Also it became clear that their was a "boy's club" that would never leave and no way I could move up more than one more step. And - moving up would mean more unpaid overtime after a modest bump in salary ($4K maybe). It was time to look elsewhere.

Interviewed at other places around the state, had some offers but the best offer was at a different employer in my same town. No relocation expenses. Yay! Accepted.

Went to my manager and delivered my notice. He tried to counter offer and asked how much it would take. $10K was my answer and he shook his head no. Didn't matter b/c I had already accepted the other job offer at nearly the same $10K increase plus much more generous benefits package, much better work/life balance, better people, more interesting work, etc.

The old employer pissed me off during the next two weeks and I decided quietly that I'd take my efficiency hacks with me. I trained my replacement in the slow and boring methods I had been taught several years prior. I backed up all of my projects to DVD plus my software hacks - and left. The backups were in case I ever returned.

The next two or three replacements after me all left within months. Many of my friends at the company left as soon as they could find greener pastures (next few years). Company is still there, bigger now but still a lousy place to work. Oh, and the same "boy's club" runs the place.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: chetmanly on February 18, 2016, 01:21:39 PM
I think FU money is something that employers should encourage. Who would you want working with you, people who actually want to be there or people who feel like they have no choice? Don't companies always say they want engagement? I don't think engagement happens when people feel trapped.

Love the WalMart guy story. A great example of how financial stability/security preserves our dignity. When you are enslaved to paycheck-to-paycheck living, you may need to set your dignity aside if you want to eat that month.

I find it really odd that so many people in hiring positions complain about people who "Are Lazy" and "Refuse to find work", man.. would you WANT to hire those people? Hell I'd pay them to STAY AWAY from my company.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: chetmanly on February 18, 2016, 01:37:15 PM
I don't have an FU story but after this past week, I want to get to that point more than ever.

I work as an engineer and about six months ago we hired another "engineer". I use the quotes because he does not have an engineering degree, just tons of experience from being out in the field. This past week we had a piece of equipment that had failed in the field and has been replaced three time prior by an exact copy but new piece of equipment each time. The "engineer" had called for it to be replaced again and I told the field guys to leave it until someone proves the equipment is truly defective, and not actually miscoordinating. The "engineer" sent me an email and included the guys in my group as well. He asked me to explain to him why I superseded his judgement. Side note, he and I are the same level and pay but he is twice my age. With FU money, I would be able to respond back with "please find attached a copy of MY engineering degree for your reference. If you need further explanation, please note the PE initials following my name. They roughly translate to I am the expert!"

Until the moment I have FU money, I have to bite my tongue and play the politics to keep building up my FU fund. Or wait two years when I'm the engineering manager and then he'll be thinking twice about what he says.

A degree makes you an expert. That's hilarious.

That being said, given the part had failed three times before and replaced three times, that suggests something else is wrong. So good call. Wrong reason.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: electriceagle on February 19, 2016, 08:40:56 AM
A guy was hired, and he regularly brought a gun to work—in a secured office with little chance of anything happening. Not only did he bring it, he put it on his desk while he was working. This made a lot of people uncomfortable. When the company tried to tell them, he went all 2nd amendment on them. It was going to be a long tedious process of either firing him and having lawsuits, or figuring out a way to not let the guy bring it in. Eventually they paid him off with a severance package and a glowing letter of recommendation

Engineer your own layoff indeed!

Edit: Actually, we had a gun guy when I worked at BigMegaCorp. He would talk loudly on the phone about how the government had taken his guns and how he was going to get them back, but in the meantime he had bought more. We were all in cubicles, so everyone could hear his conversations.

This was a time of quarterly layoffs, when hordes of people were being walked out the door every few months. Everyone else in the area was having layoffs as well. Along the way, someone at some other company in the area shot 3-4 of the managers when they got fired.

Gun guy is still there. I guess management didn't want to take the chance....
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: zephyr911 on February 19, 2016, 08:43:54 AM
A degree makes you an expert. That's hilarious.

That being said, given the part had failed three times before and replaced three times, that suggests something else is wrong. So good call. Wrong reason.

It takes a lot more than a degree to get a PE cert. I was an engineer for years (with a degree) and never had one.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: nobodyspecial on February 19, 2016, 09:07:00 AM
It takes a lot more than a degree to get a PE cert. I was an engineer for years (with a degree) and never had one.
Specifically it takes working for years at an old company.
Our startup lost one EEng this year because the only way to get a PE was to work under an already certified PE, which means working for government or an old established company.  It's a really good trick to keep salaries low.

Title: Re: Fired or laid off
Post by: BTDretire on February 19, 2016, 10:14:24 AM
A few years ago, I was surprised to find out that some people I know, originally from the US I think, distinguish between being fired versus being laid off:

  • Being fired meaning a company terminated employment due to poor performance
  • Being laid off meaning a company terminated employment due to reorganization, downsizing, and so on
Because I don't think many people would volunteer to family, friends, or potential employers that they were fired for poor performance, I figured anyone who makes the distinction wouldn't say they were fired anyway. Meaning, even if they were in fact fired for poor performance, they'd say they were laid off.

The point being, I was using the terms interchangeably, not realizing others might have been attaching different meanings to the terms.


A colleague friend of mine, originally from the UK, uses the term sacked for all types of employment termination, I think. I don't think that works for US audiences though.

I've heard friends and family use "fired" to describe when the were indeed fired.


I've never known anyone to use the terms interchangeably.

When I was young my dad was a carpenter, going from construction job to construction job.
So he was often between jobs. I was 10 or 11 when I ask my mom, "why does dad keep getting fired from
his jobs?"  She had to explain to me about construction jobs and when the are finished there is no more work,
so he was laid off waiting for a new job to start.
Title: Re: Fired or laid off
Post by: BlueHouse on February 19, 2016, 10:22:44 AM
A few years ago, I was surprised to find out that some people I know, originally from the US I think, distinguish between being fired versus being laid off:

  • Being fired meaning a company terminated employment due to poor performance
  • Being laid off meaning a company terminated employment due to reorganization, downsizing, and so on

Because I don't think many people would volunteer to family, friends, or potential employers that they were fired for poor performance, I figured anyone who makes the distinction wouldn't say they were fired anyway. Meaning, even if they were in fact fired for poor performance, they'd say they were laid off.

The point being, I was using the terms interchangeably, not realizing others might have been attaching different meanings to the terms.

A colleague friend of mine, originally from the UK, uses the term sacked for all types of employment termination, I think. I don't think that works for US audiences though.

I've heard friends and family use "fired" to describe when the were indeed fired.

I've never known anyone to use the terms interchangeably.

I use the term "shit-canned" pretty routinely.  Even now, I'm a consultant and when the job is done, it's done.  I still say I was shit-canned to family and friends.  To business colleagues I usually say "I'm about to roll-off an assignment if you know of anything coming up".  I always put that in the future tense, so they don't think I'm out of work between jobs -- can make it more difficult to find the next one or to negotiate higher rates. 
Title: Re: Fired or laid off
Post by: msilenus on February 19, 2016, 10:49:29 AM
I use the term "shit-canned" pretty routinely.

Ever since I first heard the phrase "he was managed outside the company" I've preferred the term "shit-canned" for getting fired.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: scottish on February 19, 2016, 08:00:02 PM
After the first 30,000 or 40,000 at Nortel, we started using the term 'whacked'.

"Fred got whacked in the last round."
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: gimp on February 20, 2016, 02:01:12 AM
I liked "promoted to customer."
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Bergal on February 20, 2016, 06:33:19 AM
After my company just shut down one part of the business - and all its workers - they hired "outplacement" experts to help the employees.  What a ridiculous euphemism. 
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: LeRainDrop on February 20, 2016, 10:19:16 PM
Don't be like me: A story of having FU money and not using it when you should.  Friends, the biggest regret I have in my life so far is not quitting a toxic job when I should have, despite actually having adequate FU money to tide me over for quite awhile.  I work in biglaw, with the high hours and high pressure that goes along with that.  But more than that, I became the frog in boiling water over a two-year period, while my used-to-be-mentor found herself in a bad life crossroads and was essentially forced to come back to work under unfavorable terms.  As a result, she set out to prove herself as large and in-charge, and show the firm that those silly associates just couldn't possibly have handled her responsibilities, as we had been doing without her for a year.  In any event, the next two years of my life were buried in pure hell from her, as she was a huge bully, mean girl, moved deadlines to suit her and bury us, found countless ways to assert her power, etc.  Almost every deadline from her was "ASAP," but it was not enough to meet her deadlines -- no, you had to beat them!  I pointed out to her once that you cannot finish work any earlier than ASAP; by definition that is not possible.  That point actually flustered her for a minute while she continued to berate me for, I kid you not, going to a committee lunch for half an hour about three months earlier (yes, this stuck in her craw for three months before she raised it!) because I "could have been billing" during that time but had the nerve to go eat; coming in on a Saturday at noon and staying till 8 p.m., though she had arrived that Saturday at 9 a.m. and stayed till 1 p.m., even though I had specifically cleared it with her ahead of time that I had a conflict in the morning and probably would not arrive until 1 p.m. (so I actually got in an hour early) -- oh, she also mocked me for arriving and asking, "how can I help?"; sending her an email with the results of my assignment at 10:01 a.m., when my deadline was 10 a.m.; and not looking upset enough by her complaints.  I worked several weeks of all-nighters or only a few hours of sleep, developed stress-induced medical conditions (including one surgery, which made me rejoice for the break!), missed my grandmother's funeral to complete work for this lady (who knew her demand was causing me to miss the funeral, and she didn't even bother to thank me, and even got her henchman to tell me the very next week that "if I were being honest with myself, I'd know that I'm just not doing my best"), was strongly discouraged and told she was "disappointed" in me for going to take care of my father for a week after he was in a very bad accident, and this list could go on and on.  At the worst of it, she poisoned a new co-worker against me and others, stirred that pot, intentionally saying different things to the different groups to cause fights and then giving advice that contradicted what she was telling the others so that we would complain about each other and she could presumably somehow be the one person not in the fray.  This plan back-fired once our group realized the conniving shit that the boss lady was causing in an already stressful environment and the groups became friends again.  She treated me and others terribly, and there were so many times I was so fed up and at the end of my rope, but I never said enough is enough.  One awesome co-worker even told me that boss lady was abusing me and I shouldn't put up with it, but I was so lost, I sometimes even defended that boss lady, like she had a grain of truth good reason to be mean to me ("it's true, I did send that email at 10:01 and she asked for it by 10!".  So crazy.  I did go to the higher-ups and got some traction with them, although this b-lady was the golden child of the head of my group, which is why she always managed to get away with so much shit over these two years.  In the end, while my talks with the higher-ups were at their peak, the dragon lady ended up quitting.  I stayed through that, and I regret it every effing day.  Don't be like me -- if you have FU money and the circumstances of your job suck, then use that FU money!!!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: GreenSheep on February 21, 2016, 01:42:32 AM
Sounds like a sociopath.

http://www.amazon.com/Sociopath-Next-Door-Martha-Stout/dp/0767915828/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1456044115&sr=8-1&keywords=sociopath
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Zamboni on February 21, 2016, 08:02:48 AM
I really like Samuel's story of telling HR he was retiring but not ever telling his supervisor. I wonder: how many places would that work? Probably a lot.

LeRainDrop, you have my sympathy. I worked for a similar person for 9 months when I was in college (in my case the supervisor was a man.) Never again. The young lady he hired to replace me told him to stuff it and walked out the first week she was there, and I immediately thought "hmmm, I should have done that!"

When I saw similar craziness traits starting to emerge from a recent supervisor, I immediately activated an exit strategy. It took me more than a year to execute the plan, but having a plan helped me stay sane, keep boundaries firm, and clam up and keep ideas to myself. These boundaries pissed her off even more than normal, of course, as she needed the constantly collect ideas from others so she could keep passing them off as her own ideas, so her level of unprofessional behavior escalated to ridiculous. Nonetheless, I got out and into a better department at the same employer. She still tries to lash out at me sometimes, but she's been caught in some lies related to how she does things and her credibility is finally shot with most people I think. Others have done the same -- escape her but stay in the giant machine -- so now there are several people are my very large employer who escaped the tentacles of this horrible boss. We all smile brightly when we see each other, and sometimes exchange brief stories of escaping her nonsense. At meetings I catch her current employees giving me looks that can other be described as imploring for help, but they are afraid to talk with anyone. In about two years there has been 80% turnover in her staff . . . and this is at a company where turnover is generally very low (my current office has less than 5% turnover in the same time frame.) A big bunch of her lies and unethical behavior got uncovered independently by a third department last year. She threw a subordinate under the bus and survived, although not unscathed in terms of reputation.

It's amazing that the small percent of people who are like these horrible bosses seem to manage to keep their jobs . . . more companies should adopt the No Asshole Rule.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: homestead neohio on March 08, 2016, 08:18:26 PM
Just finished binge-reading and this is an epic thread.  The thing that fascinates me about these stories is how shocked all the bosses are, because it is JUST THAT PERVASIVE that people are stuck in their jobs due to their spending habits and are therefore powerless (or feel powerless) to change their situations.  "Woe is me, a victim."  Every once in a while they encounter a badass who says FU.

I agree with so many others that FU money gives you sanity and options.  I chose not to use my FU money when a good employment situation turned bad (2 good years, 1 not so good, 2 bad), but knowing I could walk away from that job, even as the sole income earner in my family of 4, kept me sane.  DW encouraged me to leave multiple times due to obvious unhappiness, stress and unrealistic expectations.  We frequently would have to cancel weekend plans when told on Friday afternoon I was required to work all weekend, sometimes did not see my kids because I was working or commuting during their waking hours, various other BS.  I came up with coping strategies (took Friday's off to avoid weekend work requests), but those only lasted so long.  Co-workers were having breakdowns, going on meds, and getting divorces, but not quitting.  As I approached my breaking point at work, I started to push back.  If I was ready to walk away, why not just push back on the craziness instead of walking?  Worst they'd do is relieve me of my position, which I was about to do myself.  Every employment situation is different, but for me there were never any consequences of saying "no, I will not work then" or "I will not meet your [totally unrealistic] timeline, but can commit to getting that done by [realistic timeline]".  If told, "that is unacceptable", I'd just say, "I'm sorry that what is possible is not acceptable to you."  I tried to make it about my crazy manager's expectation problem, not my output problem, though it took energy to fend off the unrealistic expectations.  I kept collecting my paycheck while looking for other jobs.  There were still sacrifices including some minor health issues due to stress and being overall unhappy and irritable, which did affect my family life.  I chose to accept this for a time as I did not know how long a job search would take given my desire to stay local and limited local employers in my field. 

It would have immediately felt good to quit, but I suspect I would have gotten stressed over time if I was not finding employment, and I would have felt like I have to take the first thing that came along.  This way I got to keep the 'stache for which I had worked so hard.

I don't know if I would make the same decisions today (and with my current 'stache), but in the end I got a great job at more pay with a good boss at a growing company, so it all worked out. 

I understand the comments people have made in this thread that taking an FU attitude is unhealthy, and they'd rather keep it positive and move on to other opportunities without a focus on hurting a boss, team or company.  I get that, and that is clearly best.  But I've also been in "that situation" where you WANT to deal out a fraction of the harm they've done to you as a matter of JUSTICE, because you are in a position of power to do so.  I did not do anything epic when I left my prior employer, but oh how I fantasized about it. 

Keep the FU stories coming.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: happy on March 09, 2016, 03:05:46 AM
Not exactly an epic story, but a while back I changed jobs and decided to take a couple of months of paid leave to decompress between jobs. The leave was part annual leave and part long service leave. It was all approved and off I went. It took a while for the paperwork to trickle up the line and a boss somewhere near the top of the line decided to not approve the LSL component. Theoretically they can do that, but its pretty unusual. Apparently everyone in my dept was arguing about who's job it was  to ring me up to tell me. Anyway the deal was  come back to work or take leave without pay. 

Having very adequate FU money it was SO nice to not turn a hair and say I would take the leave without pay.  People were quite shocked because everyone expected I would have to come back to work and couldn't survive 4 weeks or so with no income.  Being public service, my leave entitlements are transferred with me, so sooner or later I'll be paid for the leave, so no loss to me.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Elle 8 on March 09, 2016, 04:32:22 AM
... Co-workers were having breakdowns, going on meds, and getting divorces, but not quitting. ...

That's horrible!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Dicey on March 09, 2016, 08:40:17 AM
Not exactly an epic story, but a while back I changed jobs and decided to take a couple of months of paid leave to decompress between jobs. The leave was part annual leave and part long service leave. It was all approved and off I went. It took a while for the paperwork to trickle up the line and a boss somewhere near the top of the line decided to not approve the LSL component. Theoretically they can do that, but its pretty unusual. Apparently everyone in my dept was arguing about who's job it was  to ring me up to tell me. Anyway the deal was  come back to work or take leave without pay. 

Having very adequate FU money it was SO nice to not turn a hair and say I would take the leave without pay.  People were quite shocked because everyone expected I would have to come back to work and couldn't survive 4 weeks or so with no income.  Being public service, my leave entitlements are transferred with me, so sooner or later I'll be paid for the leave, so no loss to me.
So you got to have your cake and eat it too. Good on you! Thanks to you and homestead neohio for reviving this thread, it's one of my favorites.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: mm1970 on March 09, 2016, 11:49:08 AM
Quote
If I was ready to walk away, why not just push back on the craziness instead of walking?  Worst they'd do is relieve me of my position, which I was about to do myself.  Every employment situation is different, but for me there were never any consequences of saying "no, I will not work then" or "I will not meet your [totally unrealistic] timeline, but can commit to getting that done by [realistic timeline]".  If told, "that is unacceptable", I'd just say, "I'm sorry that what is possible is not acceptable to you."  I tried to make it about my crazy manager's expectation problem, not my output problem, though it took energy to fend off the unrealistic expectations.  I kept collecting my paycheck while looking for other jobs. 

I really like this.  I have been at my company for almost 8 years, with a similar issue.  A few great years, then a slide, a couple of very very bad ones.  While I was good at pushing back on work hours the whole time, I found it frustrating for other reasons (being constantly reorganized with new bosses and new responsibilities).  I still had lots of stress, but for awhile realized that working my tail off was getting me nowhere.

So I worked, and looked for a new job.  Didn't find one, but years later now am in a new position with a new boss (same company), and it's MUCH better.  And I collected 2 years of a paycheck in the mean time.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: CorpRaider on March 09, 2016, 12:08:42 PM
Don't be like me: A story of having FU money and not using it when you should.  Friends, the biggest regret I have in my life so far is not quitting a toxic job when I should have, despite actually having adequate FU money to tide me over for quite awhile.  I work in biglaw, with the high hours and high pressure that goes along with that.  But more than that, I became the frog in boiling water over a two-year period, while my used-to-be-mentor found herself in a bad life crossroads and was essentially forced to come back to work under unfavorable terms.  As a result, she set out to prove herself as large and in-charge, and show the firm that those silly associates just couldn't possibly have handled her responsibilities, as we had been doing without her for a year.  In any event, the next two years of my life were buried in pure hell from her, as she was a huge bully, mean girl, moved deadlines to suit her and bury us, found countless ways to assert her power, etc.  Almost every deadline from her was "ASAP," but it was not enough to meet her deadlines -- no, you had to beat them!  I pointed out to her once that you cannot finish work any earlier than ASAP; by definition that is not possible.  That point actually flustered her for a minute while she continued to berate me for, I kid you not, going to a committee lunch for half an hour about three months earlier (yes, this stuck in her craw for three months before she raised it!) because I "could have been billing" during that time but had the nerve to go eat; coming in on a Saturday at noon and staying till 8 p.m., though she had arrived that Saturday at 9 a.m. and stayed till 1 p.m., even though I had specifically cleared it with her ahead of time that I had a conflict in the morning and probably would not arrive until 1 p.m. (so I actually got in an hour early) -- oh, she also mocked me for arriving and asking, "how can I help?"; sending her an email with the results of my assignment at 10:01 a.m., when my deadline was 10 a.m.; and not looking upset enough by her complaints.  I worked several weeks of all-nighters or only a few hours of sleep, developed stress-induced medical conditions (including one surgery, which made me rejoice for the break!), missed my grandmother's funeral to complete work for this lady (who knew her demand was causing me to miss the funeral, and she didn't even bother to thank me, and even got her henchman to tell me the very next week that "if I were being honest with myself, I'd know that I'm just not doing my best"), was strongly discouraged and told she was "disappointed" in me for going to take care of my father for a week after he was in a very bad accident, and this list could go on and on.  At the worst of it, she poisoned a new co-worker against me and others, stirred that pot, intentionally saying different things to the different groups to cause fights and then giving advice that contradicted what she was telling the others so that we would complain about each other and she could presumably somehow be the one person not in the fray.  This plan back-fired once our group realized the conniving shit that the boss lady was causing in an already stressful environment and the groups became friends again.  She treated me and others terribly, and there were so many times I was so fed up and at the end of my rope, but I never said enough is enough.  One awesome co-worker even told me that boss lady was abusing me and I shouldn't put up with it, but I was so lost, I sometimes even defended that boss lady, like she had a grain of truth good reason to be mean to me ("it's true, I did send that email at 10:01 and she asked for it by 10!".  So crazy.  I did go to the higher-ups and got some traction with them, although this b-lady was the golden child of the head of my group, which is why she always managed to get away with so much shit over these two years.  In the end, while my talks with the higher-ups were at their peak, the dragon lady ended up quitting.  I stayed through that, and I regret it every effing day.  Don't be like me -- if you have FU money and the circumstances of your job suck, then use that FU money!!!

Yeah, I had a similar albeit much less psychotic partner once.  She started out great and just went psycho over time as well.  I didn't have FU money but I still bailed right during the financial crisis and man were they dumbstruck that I had to stroke (good fortune really) to make a move right in the middle of a nuclear winter.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: jlajr on March 09, 2016, 11:27:51 PM
...As I approached my breaking point at work, I started to push back.  If I was ready to walk away, why not just push back on the craziness instead of walking?  Worst they'd do is relieve me of my position, which I was about to do myself.  Every employment situation is different, but for me there were never any consequences of saying "no, I will not work then" or "I will not meet your [totally unrealistic] timeline, but can commit to getting that done by [realistic timeline]".  If told, "that is unacceptable", I'd just say, "I'm sorry that what is possible is not acceptable to you."  I tried to make it about my crazy manager's expectation problem, not my output problem, though it took energy to fend off the unrealistic expectations.  I kept collecting my paycheck while looking for other jobs.  There were still sacrifices including some minor health issues due to stress and being overall unhappy and irritable, which did affect my family life.  I chose to accept this for a time as I did not know how long a job search would take given my desire to stay local and limited local employers in my field. 

It would have immediately felt good to quit, but I suspect I would have gotten stressed over time if I was not finding employment, and I would have felt like I have to take the first thing that came along.  This way I got to keep the 'stache for which I had worked so hard...

I know exactly how you felt, applaud you for recognizing that the source of the problem was external not internal, and expressing that recognition.

Between April of last year until about two months ago, I was extremely frustrated at work and looking for another job (which would require moving where I live). If I had been offered any of the jobs for which I applied, I would have accepted it with no hesitation.

Unfortunately, after months of a frustrating job search, usually driving at least two hours each way to interviews/tests and taking vacation time to do so, I decided that I would no longer actively look for another job. I also decided not to move from where I current live and leave my current job, before accepting another position. As you did, I decided to allow my Stash to continue to grow instead of possibly using it to cover expenses while looking for a job.

Coming to these decisions has made a huge difference. I have not fully returned to my pre-April 2015 state of being extremely happy with my situation - but I am nonetheless happy, regardless of what my managers have or have not done, are or are not doing, and will or will not do.

I do what I need to do to maintain a healthy state of mind - such as freely speak my mind or flatly refuse to do certain tasks. The worst-case scenario, as far as I can tell, would be my current employer firing me (or laying me off, or whatever you choose to call it), with a contract-required notice of two months. As that's a fairly attractive option from my point of view, if that happens, I'd simply say something like "Great. Thank you.", leave the office, tell my landlord I'm exercising the clause in my lease that allows me to cancel it with two months' notice, and start looking for a new job and a new place to live.

I actually joke with colleagues that happy jlajr can be just as annoying as frustrated jlajr, and that I suspect that they have started putting happy pills in my lunch. :)
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: 2Birds1Stone on March 10, 2016, 07:06:58 AM
I have only been at my current job for 1.5 years. The money has been really good considering the hours and stress level.

Things are quickly changing, company is laying people off, pulling accounts away from our sales team, increasing quotas, and creating unrealistic expectations and seriously inhibiting out ability to make money.

I am one of the few on my team who has some FU $ saved up. No epic story but we will see how this scenario unfolds for me.

I am not afraid to leave, though for now I will stick it out and see what happens.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Pooperman on March 10, 2016, 07:25:58 AM
I have only been at my current job for 1.5 years. The money has been really good considering the hours and stress level.

Things are quickly changing, company is laying people off, pulling accounts away from our sales team, increasing quotas, and creating unrealistic expectations and seriously inhibiting out ability to make money.

I am one of the few on my team who has some FU $ saved up. No epic story but we will see how this scenario unfolds for me.

I am not afraid to leave, though for now I will stick it out and see what happens.

All hands! Abandon ship!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Northwestie on March 10, 2016, 08:43:31 AM
I have only been at my current job for 1.5 years. The money has been really good considering the hours and stress level.

Things are quickly changing, company is laying people off, pulling accounts away from our sales team, increasing quotas, and creating unrealistic expectations and seriously inhibiting out ability to make money.

I am one of the few on my team who has some FU $ saved up. No epic story but we will see how this scenario unfolds for me.

I am not afraid to leave, though for now I will stick it out and see what happens.



All hands! Abandon ship!

This is a depressing thread.  I can't say I've ever had a horrible boss - one that wasn't the sharpest tool in the shed, but he cared about his employees.  I've just moved on when a company changed hands and just became too large or when they seemed to lose their edge, each time moving to a better situation.  Current job is ideal. 

Plenty of fodder here for Dilbert episodes.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: 2Birds1Stone on March 10, 2016, 08:49:21 AM
I have only been at my current job for 1.5 years. The money has been really good considering the hours and stress level.

Things are quickly changing, company is laying people off, pulling accounts away from our sales team, increasing quotas, and creating unrealistic expectations and seriously inhibiting out ability to make money.

I am one of the few on my team who has some FU $ saved up. No epic story but we will see how this scenario unfolds for me.

I am not afraid to leave, though for now I will stick it out and see what happens.

All hands! Abandon ship!
I'm going to hold off for now. I received a healthy bump to base salary. If/when things get bad enough to warrant my exit. It will be swift and unexpected for my employer.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: chetmanly on March 10, 2016, 09:44:06 AM
A degree makes you an expert. That's hilarious.

That being said, given the part had failed three times before and replaced three times, that suggests something else is wrong. So good call. Wrong reason.

It takes a lot more than a degree to get a PE cert. I was an engineer for years (with a degree) and never had one.

Thank you for correcting me.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: RobFIRE on March 13, 2016, 04:44:58 AM
I've read through this thread over the last few days. Some very interesting and entertaining posts.

My own non-story FU money story is that about 18 months ago I asked (politely and with several weeks' notice) to work remotely. I was working on a software project that had me at client office 3 or 4 days a week anyway so working from home the other days didn't seem to me to be a major step. I knew that if it were refused I had FU money so would have the choice to resign, negotiate harder, or accept it. It was accepted, so no need to even declare existence of FU money. For me that's the point of FU money really: it's entertaining to hear about occasions of real FU moments, bridge burning/revenge can seem cathartic in that instant, but the real point of FU money is giving you real control/options so no work situation leaves you with no choice or powerless to act.

(By that definition I would say that if you don't feel you have full control, e.g. only have up to a few month's core expenses, then it's "emergency fund" rather than "FU money" territory and likely only used as a "last resort")
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: RedmondStash on March 13, 2016, 10:41:41 AM
Great thread. Lots of food for thought.

After a couple of decades in IT, I moved into the videogames industry. If I thought IT was dysfunctional, boy howdy did I not know I was hopping from frying pan into fire.

When I didn't have FU money, I stayed in a couple of toxic jobs in IT. When I finally did have it, I used it not only to leave two really toxic jobs (and managers), but to tell them, professionally and clearly, exactly what I thought of them and why I was leaving. The second job was my dream job, too; I would still be there had I not had a horrible, self-serving manager who had no experience of reasonable business practice outside the games industry.

For me, leaving those jobs was almost as brutal as being in them. The FU money did not give me a sense of pride and accomplishment when I left; I was physically ill and miserable for a long time. Was it me, was I just not employable, would I never find a good job, etc. What the FU money did give me was an exit and time to recuperate.

And yeah. People leave managers, not jobs. The jobs, I liked fine. The managers, not so much.

Now I have a really great job. I love the work, the people, my team, and my manager. I also love knowing that if anyone tries to push me around, I can just saunter out the door and never come back. Because you never know; it's a volatile industry, and people move around all the time. My coworkers' desks are covered with knick-knacks and toys; mine has almost nothing personal, and no more stuff than I can take home in a single box.

So FU money didn't give me any awesome exit stories, but it does give me more confidence and freedom from worry about the future, which lets me enjoy my work even more. It also lets me take jobs I really want even if they don't pay well. Funny thing, though -- when my current company wanted to transition me from contractor to permanent employee, my FU money put me in a position to risk asking for a higher salary to compensate for the pay cut I'd taken when I took the job to begin with. And I got it.

So my FU money led to higher income too. :)
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Daleth on March 13, 2016, 11:41:21 AM
One month into my 3-month maternity leave, I took my departing in-laws to the airport.  I drove home thinking, "two more months home along with a toddler and a baby."  God help me.

When I got home, I was shocked to find DH was there.  Tuns out half the company got laid off, including him.  We high-fived.

That, man. THAT RIGHT THERE. The fact that you can react to a layoff, especially one that hits right after a child is born, with high-fives is THE ENTIRE POINT OF THIS WEBSITE, amirite?? That's what we're all going for: liberation from money-related stress! People who aren't liberated would react to that with tears and possibly acrimony so bad it leads to divorce.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Zoot on March 13, 2016, 12:30:07 PM
One month into my 3-month maternity leave, I took my departing in-laws to the airport.  I drove home thinking, "two more months home along with a toddler and a baby."  God help me.

When I got home, I was shocked to find DH was there.  Tuns out half the company got laid off, including him.  We high-fived.

That, man. THAT RIGHT THERE. The fact that you can react to a layoff, especially one that hits right after a child is born, with high-fives is THE ENTIRE POINT OF THIS WEBSITE, amirite?? That's what we're all going for: liberation from money-related stress! People who aren't liberated would react to that with tears and possibly acrimony so bad it leads to divorce.

Oh, how I wish the forum had a "like" button and that I could press it 10^6 times. 

I've read the entire thread, beginning to end, and have an e-mail alert set up so I can know when responses posted (haven't posted-to-follow until now, though!), but I had forgotten about this story.  Daleth, thanks so much for highlighting it and bringing it before my eyes again--feelingroovy, I keep re-reading this amazing post-partum high-five story and letting it sink in, and in, and in some more--and tears well up in my eyes as I think how wonderful it is that your family knew PEACE in the aftermath of the layoff. 

This site freaking ROCKS.  :)
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Sofa King on March 13, 2016, 05:42:31 PM
[
This site freaking ROCKS.  :)


I concur!!!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: RedmondStash on March 14, 2016, 05:32:37 PM
That, man. THAT RIGHT THERE. The fact that you can react to a layoff, especially one that hits right after a child is born, with high-fives is THE ENTIRE POINT OF THIS WEBSITE, amirite?? That's what we're all going for: liberation from money-related stress! People who aren't liberated would react to that with tears and possibly acrimony so bad it leads to divorce.

Yes. This. My spouse got laid off unexpectedly during massive company cuts many years ago, and it was AWESOME. A little weird at first, having the rug yanked out from under you like that, but that was the happiest, laziest, most relaxed summer we'd spent together in years. Best thing that could have happened for our marriage.

And all because we live within our means and save up extra $$. I still don't get why that's so hard for people who earn decent wages. Maybe someday, more people will start doing it and reaping the rewards. Man, I hope so.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: mm1970 on March 15, 2016, 09:26:01 AM
That, man. THAT RIGHT THERE. The fact that you can react to a layoff, especially one that hits right after a child is born, with high-fives is THE ENTIRE POINT OF THIS WEBSITE, amirite?? That's what we're all going for: liberation from money-related stress! People who aren't liberated would react to that with tears and possibly acrimony so bad it leads to divorce.

Yes. This. My spouse got laid off unexpectedly during massive company cuts many years ago, and it was AWESOME. A little weird at first, having the rug yanked out from under you like that, but that was the happiest, laziest, most relaxed summer we'd spent together in years. Best thing that could have happened for our marriage.

And all because we live within our means and save up extra $$. I still don't get why that's so hard for people who earn decent wages. Maybe someday, more people will start doing it and reaping the rewards. Man, I hope so.
One of my former bosses has been laid off a lot.  I mean, he's almost 60.  He's able to move seamlessly from engineering to management to VP-dom. 

This guy was my MMM soul-mate.  We'd eat our packed lunches (some times he would just bring a baked potato) and talk about savings.  Some gems.
- He once spent an entire summer off with his kids, didn't bother looking for a job
- He owns two homes (one San Diego, one Santa Barbara) and some agricultural land.  He goes back and forth every couple of weeks.
- When he got bored with being the VP, he moved over to a job that required a lot of travel to Asia. Hmmm gee I wonder how he afforded that trip to Italy, eh?
- He's been laid off for almost 2 years. Didn't even look for a job for the first year (fixing up his new house).  Looked for a little while. Now he's busy making wine for fun (I hear it's good).

He has never sweat the layoffs.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: 2Birds1Stone on March 15, 2016, 09:28:59 AM

One of my former bosses has been laid off a lot.  I mean, he's almost 60.  He's able to move seamlessly from engineering to management to VP-dom. 

This guy was my MMM soul-mate.  We'd eat our packed lunches (some times he would just bring a baked potato) and talk about savings.  Some gems.
- He once spent an entire summer off with his kids, didn't bother looking for a job
- He owns two homes (one San Diego, one Santa Barbara) and some agricultural land.  He goes back and forth every couple of weeks.
- When he got bored with being the VP, he moved over to a job that required a lot of travel to Asia. Hmmm gee I wonder how he afforded that trip to Italy, eh?
- He's been laid off for almost 2 years. Didn't even look for a job for the first year (fixing up his new house).  Looked for a little while. Now he's busy making wine for fun (I hear it's good).

He has never sweat the layoffs.

The ultimate FI lifestyle =)
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Mr. Green on March 15, 2016, 10:12:36 AM
Not epic but kinda fun.

A few weeks back, one of my managers asked me if I would mind being added to the call-in rotation temporarily. We had a few people leave our operations team and the Ops people that were left were bitching about how frequently they were on call. It didn't happen and I was glad for that, since I didn't really want to be on call. Plus it's not my job. Yesterday, my manager stopped by and told me he was having me added to the end of the current on-call rotation. June 30 is my last day so I emailed him and said no. I said I needed every weekend I had left before my last day to be prepared for my upcoming journey (I'm thru-hiking the Appalachian Trail). He backed down. If I were not already leaving I wouldn't have said no because I'm a nice guy.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: jordanread on March 15, 2016, 10:34:08 AM
Not epic but kinda fun.

A few weeks back, one of my managers asked me if I would mind being added to the call-in rotation temporarily. We had a few people leave our operations team and the Ops people that were left were bitching about how frequently they were on call. It didn't happen and I was glad for that, since I didn't really want to be on call. Plus it's not my job. Yesterday, my manager stopped by and told me he was having me added to the end of the current on-call rotation. June 30 is my last day so I emailed him and said no. I said I needed every weekend I had left before my last day to be prepared for my upcoming journey (I'm thru-hiking the Appalachian Trail). He backed down. If I were not already leaving I wouldn't have said no because I'm a nice guy.

Okay, where are you documenting this journey of your hike through the AT? It's on my list, and has been discussed in the FIRE Adventures Map Thread (http://forum.mrmoneymustache.com/post-fire/fire-adventures-shared-map/).
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: 2Birds1Stone on March 15, 2016, 10:49:52 AM
(I'm thru-hiking the Appalachian Trail).

I'm genuinely smuckered.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Vertical Mode on March 15, 2016, 10:56:16 AM
Not epic but kinda fun.

A few weeks back, one of my managers asked me if I would mind being added to the call-in rotation temporarily. We had a few people leave our operations team and the Ops people that were left were bitching about how frequently they were on call. It didn't happen and I was glad for that, since I didn't really want to be on call. Plus it's not my job. Yesterday, my manager stopped by and told me he was having me added to the end of the current on-call rotation. June 30 is my last day so I emailed him and said no. I said I needed every weekend I had left before my last day to be prepared for my upcoming journey (I'm thru-hiking the Appalachian Trail). He backed down. If I were not already leaving I wouldn't have said no because I'm a nice guy.

1. Nice! Good demonstration of the power of FUnds. I'm hoping to do the same thing in a few years, take a break and go thru-hike.
2. Northbound or Southbound?
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Mr. Green on March 15, 2016, 11:07:12 AM
Okay, where are you documenting this journey of your hike through the AT? It's on my list, and has been discussed in the FIRE Adventures Map Thread (http://forum.mrmoneymustache.com/post-fire/fire-adventures-shared-map/).
I'm still unsure of this. I dislike the notion of typing because it cannot keep up with speed of thought. For this I've considered a voice recorder, but that doesn't easily translate to online content (for family and friends). I've considered making a series in my FIRE blog (see signature) for this but I'm not sure if I want to commit to blogging while on trail. I really want the experience to be immersive, while providing a break from tech since that's been my career for the last 11 years. I've also considered buying the looseleaf version of AWOL's AT Guide so I can mark them up with thoughts and notes and send them home. That would make a nice memento from the trip without being burdensome to keep So I'm undecided.

2. Northbound or Southbound?
SOBO (Southbound)! My mother, sister, and wife are driving me up to Maine July 2nd. We'll hike up Katahdin on the 3rd, then I'll head south from there.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: jordanread on March 15, 2016, 11:15:50 AM
Okay, where are you documenting this journey of your hike through the AT? It's on my list, and has been discussed in the FIRE Adventures Map Thread (http://forum.mrmoneymustache.com/post-fire/fire-adventures-shared-map/).
I'm still unsure of this. I dislike the notion of typing because it cannot keep up with speed of thought. For this I've considered a voice recorder, but that doesn't easily translate to online content (for family and friends). I've considered making a series in my FIRE blog (see signature) for this but I'm not sure if I want to commit to blogging while on trail. I really want the experience to be immersive, while providing a break from tech since that's been my career for the last 11 years. I've also considered buying the looseleaf version of AWOL's AT Guide so I can mark them up with thoughts and notes and send them home. That would make a nice memento from the trip without being burdensome to keep So I'm undecided.

I like the idea of a voice recorder. Extra batteries or a solar charger. It won't be as immersive for the readers (but really, it's your adventure, so the readers should come in second), but when you get back, you can translate your recordings to a mega post. Just let me know where. Also, have a wonderful time!!!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: 2Birds1Stone on March 15, 2016, 11:20:50 AM
Okay, where are you documenting this journey of your hike through the AT? It's on my list, and has been discussed in the FIRE Adventures Map Thread (http://forum.mrmoneymustache.com/post-fire/fire-adventures-shared-map/).
I'm still unsure of this. I dislike the notion of typing because it cannot keep up with speed of thought. For this I've considered a voice recorder, but that doesn't easily translate to online content (for family and friends). I've considered making a series in my FIRE blog (see signature) for this but I'm not sure if I want to commit to blogging while on trail. I really want the experience to be immersive, while providing a break from tech since that's been my career for the last 11 years. I've also considered buying the looseleaf version of AWOL's AT Guide so I can mark them up with thoughts and notes and send them home. That would make a nice memento from the trip without being burdensome to keep So I'm undecided.

2. Northbound or Southbound?
SOBO (Southbound)! My mother, sister, and wife are driving me up to Maine July 2nd. We'll hike up Katahdin on the 3rd, then I'll head south from there.

July is a late start no? I've been in the Berkshires in September and it's been well below freezing at night.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Mr. Green on March 15, 2016, 11:24:21 AM
Okay, where are you documenting this journey of your hike through the AT? It's on my list, and has been discussed in the FIRE Adventures Map Thread (http://forum.mrmoneymustache.com/post-fire/fire-adventures-shared-map/).
I'm still unsure of this. I dislike the notion of typing because it cannot keep up with speed of thought. For this I've considered a voice recorder, but that doesn't easily translate to online content (for family and friends). I've considered making a series in my FIRE blog (see signature) for this but I'm not sure if I want to commit to blogging while on trail. I really want the experience to be immersive, while providing a break from tech since that's been my career for the last 11 years. I've also considered buying the looseleaf version of AWOL's AT Guide so I can mark them up with thoughts and notes and send them home. That would make a nice memento from the trip without being burdensome to keep So I'm undecided.

2. Northbound or Southbound?
SOBO (Southbound)! My mother, sister, and wife are driving me up to Maine July 2nd. We'll hike up Katahdin on the 3rd, then I'll head south from there.

July is a late start no? I've been in the Berkshires in September and it's been well below freezing at night.
July would be too late for a NOBO but for a SOBO it's on the tail end of fine, assuming the average pace (5-6 months). I'll be south of Harper's Ferry, WV by the end of September. I intend to catch the fall color change as I move through the Shenendoahs and the Great Smoky Mountains.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: 2Birds1Stone on March 15, 2016, 12:20:07 PM
July would be too late for a NOBO but for a SOBO it's on the tail end of fine, assuming the average pace (5-6 months). I'll be south of Harper's Ferry, WV by the end of September. I intend to catch the fall color change as I move through the Shenendoahs and the Great Smoky Mountains.

Very cool! I would 100% meet up with you for a section either in the Harriman Park, NY or Delaware Water Gap, PA area this summer! I want to Thru-hike as well in a few years when the FU stache is larger and I can take 6 months off from working. I plan on doing it Flip Flop Style. Start in WV in spring, hike north with the spring flowers/weather, and then go back to WV once I reach the north end and hike down from WV to GA in the fall.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Prodigal Daughter on March 15, 2016, 12:23:36 PM
Okay, where are you documenting this journey of your hike through the AT? It's on my list, and has been discussed in the FIRE Adventures Map Thread (http://forum.mrmoneymustache.com/post-fire/fire-adventures-shared-map/).
I'm still unsure of this. I dislike the notion of typing because it cannot keep up with speed of thought. For this I've considered a voice recorder, but that doesn't easily translate to online content (for family and friends). I've considered making a series in my FIRE blog (see signature) for this but I'm not sure if I want to commit to blogging while on trail. I really want the experience to be immersive, while providing a break from tech since that's been my career for the last 11 years. I've also considered buying the looseleaf version of AWOL's AT Guide so I can mark them up with thoughts and notes and send them home. That would make a nice memento from the trip without being burdensome to keep So I'm undecided.

2. Northbound or Southbound?
SOBO (Southbound)! My mother, sister, and wife are driving me up to Maine July 2nd. We'll hike up Katahdin on the 3rd, then I'll head south from there.

July is a late start no? I've been in the Berkshires in September and it's been well below freezing at night.
July would be too late for a NOBO but for a SOBO it's on the tail end of fine, assuming the average pace (5-6 months). I'll be south of Harper's Ferry, WV by the end of September. I intend to catch the fall color change as I move through the Shenendoahs and the Great Smoky Mountains.

That is one of my favorite places. An old job had me near Harper's Ferry once or twice a year in early winter and spring staying in a retreat space for a week at a time. The AT went along the ridge above the cabin if I remember correctly. Good memories. Beautiful location.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Pooperman on March 15, 2016, 12:26:53 PM
Okay, where are you documenting this journey of your hike through the AT? It's on my list, and has been discussed in the FIRE Adventures Map Thread (http://forum.mrmoneymustache.com/post-fire/fire-adventures-shared-map/).
I'm still unsure of this. I dislike the notion of typing because it cannot keep up with speed of thought. For this I've considered a voice recorder, but that doesn't easily translate to online content (for family and friends). I've considered making a series in my FIRE blog (see signature) for this but I'm not sure if I want to commit to blogging while on trail. I really want the experience to be immersive, while providing a break from tech since that's been my career for the last 11 years. I've also considered buying the looseleaf version of AWOL's AT Guide so I can mark them up with thoughts and notes and send them home. That would make a nice memento from the trip without being burdensome to keep So I'm undecided.

2. Northbound or Southbound?
SOBO (Southbound)! My mother, sister, and wife are driving me up to Maine July 2nd. We'll hike up Katahdin on the 3rd, then I'll head south from there.

July is a late start no? I've been in the Berkshires in September and it's been well below freezing at night.
July would be too late for a NOBO but for a SOBO it's on the tail end of fine, assuming the average pace (5-6 months). I'll be south of Harper's Ferry, WV by the end of September. I intend to catch the fall color change as I move through the Shenendoahs and the Great Smoky Mountains.

That is one of my favorite places. An old job had me near Harper's Ferry once or twice a year in early winter and spring staying in a retreat space for a week at a time. The AT went along the ridge above the cabin if I remember correctly. Good memories. Beautiful location.

I walked a bit of the train in NY as part of a week long class trip in 5th grade. A few years later, I lived about a mile from the trail and it goes through town so at some point, you'll pass where I used to live :).
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Mr. Green on March 15, 2016, 12:37:59 PM
That is one of my favorite places. An old job had me near Harper's Ferry once or twice a year in early winter and spring staying in a retreat space for a week at a time. The AT went along the ridge above the cabin if I remember correctly. Good memories. Beautiful location.
I live 45 minutes from Harper's Ferry and it's my favorite place to hike. The AT runs through the town, the C&O Canal is right across the river, and the Maryland Heights trail is across the river too, with a stunning overlook (http://"http://www.nps.gov/ncr/hafe/images/B921B200-1DD8-B71C-07B073F1368087CD.jpg") of historic Harper's Ferry.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: mm1970 on March 15, 2016, 03:03:16 PM
Not epic but kinda fun.

A few weeks back, one of my managers asked me if I would mind being added to the call-in rotation temporarily. We had a few people leave our operations team and the Ops people that were left were bitching about how frequently they were on call. It didn't happen and I was glad for that, since I didn't really want to be on call. Plus it's not my job. Yesterday, my manager stopped by and told me he was having me added to the end of the current on-call rotation. June 30 is my last day so I emailed him and said no. I said I needed every weekend I had left before my last day to be prepared for my upcoming journey (I'm thru-hiking the Appalachian Trail). He backed down. If I were not already leaving I wouldn't have said no because I'm a nice guy.
Yes, will you be blogging?

A few years ago (probably when I had my second kid), I got suckered into reading the blog of a woman who thru-hiked the PCT.  (See, my niece thru-hiked the AT, then I  found the blog of a guy who thru hiked the PCT and ended on the same day.  Living in CA, I googled PCT and found her blog.  And it was awesome.  Weather hit early that year, she missed finishing by about 60 miles - tried to "finish" via roads instead of passes, and the damn sequester closed the National parks up near the Canadian border.)

I have no time anymore.  She still blogs infrequently (as a tandem-trucker with her husband), but discovered that she hiked the ADT 10 years ago with her mom.  I totally want to go read that journal.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Mr. Green on March 15, 2016, 03:08:42 PM
Not epic but kinda fun.

A few weeks back, one of my managers asked me if I would mind being added to the call-in rotation temporarily. We had a few people leave our operations team and the Ops people that were left were bitching about how frequently they were on call. It didn't happen and I was glad for that, since I didn't really want to be on call. Plus it's not my job. Yesterday, my manager stopped by and told me he was having me added to the end of the current on-call rotation. June 30 is my last day so I emailed him and said no. I said I needed every weekend I had left before my last day to be prepared for my upcoming journey (I'm thru-hiking the Appalachian Trail). He backed down. If I were not already leaving I wouldn't have said no because I'm a nice guy.
Yes, will you be blogging?

A few years ago (probably when I had my second kid), I got suckered into reading the blog of a woman who thru-hiked the PCT.  (See, my niece thru-hiked the AT, then I  found the blog of a guy who thru hiked the PCT and ended on the same day.  Living in CA, I googled PCT and found her blog.  And it was awesome.  Weather hit early that year, she missed finishing by about 60 miles - tried to "finish" via roads instead of passes, and the damn sequester closed the National parks up near the Canadian border.)

I have no time anymore.  She still blogs infrequently (as a tandem-trucker with her husband), but discovered that she hiked the ADT 10 years ago with her mom.  I totally want to go read that journal.
I want to record my thoughts in some fashion but I'm not committing to blogging just yet. I think it would be an enjoyable experience if I were using speech-to-text software. No way I want to be typing blog length entries on my phone. I'll probably set my blog up up for blogging via email when I leave so that I have that option and if I feel inclined to do it, I will.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: RyanAtTanagra on March 15, 2016, 03:14:50 PM
I want to record my thoughts in some fashion but I'm not committing to blogging just yet. I think it would be an enjoyable experience if I were using speech-to-text software. No way I want to be typing blog length entries on my phone. I'll probably set my blog up up for blogging via email when I leave so that I have that option and if I feel inclined to do it, I will.

What I do on motorcycle trips is record quick highlights in a notepad at the end of the day.  Just enough so I'll remember what I was referring to when I read it later.  Then when I get home I type up a full trip report using my notes.  Though that's only been 10 days at the longest, so that might be hard to do for months on end and still remember what I was talking about by the end.  I'd probably go a full notebook route though, and journal at the end of each day, just because I'd be hesitant to use technology any more than needed, and there's a feeling of connectedness more compatible with being in nature that I get with a notebook that I wouldn't get with a voice recorder or laptop.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: GreenSheep on March 16, 2016, 08:33:21 AM
^ I second that. I keep a little travel journal for any traveling I do (backpacking or otherwise), and although I can type quite fast, I enjoy the fact that writing with a pen forces me to slow down and be concise. And yes, it seems much more in line with being in nature. I can always expand a particular day, experience, etc. into a longer passage by typing when I get home.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Cannot Wait! on March 16, 2016, 11:38:09 AM
Can someone tell me how to add a picture?  I have an epic story that you'd have to see to believe...
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Zikoris on March 16, 2016, 11:42:06 AM
Can someone tell me how to add a picture?  I have an epic story that you'd have to see to believe...

Upload it to Imgur, click the image, then copy and paste the part underneath "BBCode (message boards & forums)"

Here's a monkey chilling and eating a banana.

(http://i.imgur.com/3BRpxrC.jpg)
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: jordanread on March 16, 2016, 11:42:26 AM
Can someone tell me how to add a picture?  I have an epic story that you'd have to see to believe...

Use the img tag. Wrap it around the link to a picture [ img]image url[/img ] (no spaces). Also, you can attach it.

Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Cannot Wait! on March 16, 2016, 11:47:28 AM
I attached it.  Maybe it just doesn't show up in the preview?
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: jordanread on March 16, 2016, 11:49:01 AM
I attached it.  Maybe it just doesn't show up in the preview?

lol.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: green daisy on March 16, 2016, 11:52:25 AM
We're in the midst of one.  Our daughter has a disability for which she requires an accommodation in order to participate in a specific school situation. The school district is refusing to provide her with that accommodation and instead is trying to bribe us to go away by offering us $20k to sign a document agreeing to waive her rights to participate in that specific school activity.  We told them to take their offer and shove it (politely, of coarse).  They even had their district physician call her doctor and try to get him to talk us into accepting their offer.  Of coarse, this offer was made verbally and they never gave us the document, so they will just lie and say it never happened.  If we were given the document, I would pass it on to the Office of Civil Rights.  They're still not giving her the accommodation that she needs, but regardless, I will never have to look my daughter in the eye and say she can't do x activity like all her friends because we are paid for her not to. 
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Cannot Wait! on March 16, 2016, 11:54:43 AM
Can someone tell me how to add a picture?  I have an epic story that you'd have to see to believe...

Ah, there it is.  Sorry for the vulgarity!

This was her response to me telling her that if she doesn't want people quitting all the time, she should try not being so rude.  She apparently didn't get the message!  Thank God for FU money!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Zikoris on March 16, 2016, 12:10:11 PM
Can someone tell me how to add a picture?  I have an epic story that you'd have to see to believe...

Ah, there it is.  Sorry for the vulgarity!

This was her response to me telling her that if she doesn't want people quitting all the time, she should try not being so rude.  She apparently didn't get the message!  Thank God for FU money!

Oh boy. More juicy backstory? What kinds of things was she doing that made people quit all the time?
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Mr. Green on March 16, 2016, 12:12:25 PM
Can someone tell me how to add a picture?  I have an epic story that you'd have to see to believe...

Ah, there it is.  Sorry for the vulgarity!

This was her response to me telling her that if she doesn't want people quitting all the time, she should try not being so rude.  She apparently didn't get the message!  Thank God for FU money!
Not hard to see why people don't want to work for that person. Holy crap!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Vertical Mode on March 16, 2016, 12:16:32 PM
Can someone tell me how to add a picture?  I have an epic story that you'd have to see to believe...

Ah, there it is.  Sorry for the vulgarity!

This was her response to me telling her that if she doesn't want people quitting all the time, she should try not being so rude.  She apparently didn't get the message!  Thank God for FU money!

Wow, that's terrible. Good thing you got out of there. I'd say that effectively proved your point, too, but I bet the irony was lost on her.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Cannot Wait! on March 16, 2016, 12:20:20 PM
Can someone tell me how to add a picture?  I have an epic story that you'd have to see to believe...

Ah, there it is.  Sorry for the vulgarity!

This was her response to me telling her that if she doesn't want people quitting all the time, she should try not being so rude.  She apparently didn't get the message!  Thank God for FU money!

Oh boy. More juicy backstory? What kinds of things was she doing that made people quit all the time?

Docking our pay for ridiculous reasons, expecting us to do way too much for free, trash talking about clients and other coworkers.  Not appreciating us. Unfortunately I really liked the job - but not enough to put up with her.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Pooperman on March 16, 2016, 12:37:26 PM
Can someone tell me how to add a picture?  I have an epic story that you'd have to see to believe...

Ah, there it is.  Sorry for the vulgarity!

This was her response to me telling her that if she doesn't want people quitting all the time, she should try not being so rude.  She apparently didn't get the message!  Thank God for FU money!

Oh boy. More juicy backstory? What kinds of things was she doing that made people quit all the time?

Docking our pay for ridiculous reasons, expecting us to do way too much for free, trash talking about clients and other coworkers.  Not appreciating us. Unfortunately I really liked the job - but not enough to put up with her.

Check your local laws. This may not be legal. If it is, then she can get what's coming to her and you get the money you should have had... all while you sip something cold on a beach somewhere.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Cannot Wait! on March 16, 2016, 12:45:20 PM
Can someone tell me how to add a picture?  I have an epic story that you'd have to see to believe...

Ah, there it is.  Sorry for the vulgarity!

This was her response to me telling her that if she doesn't want people quitting all the time, she should try not being so rude.  She apparently didn't get the message!  Thank God for FU money!

Wow, that's terrible. Good thing you got out of there. I'd say that effectively proved your point, too, but I bet the irony was lost on her.

It totally was!  Lol
Unfortunately I signed a non compete contract with her.  Does anyone know how enforceable those are?  I can't help but think sending that text to her client list would sway their impression of her. 
This was my post FIRE gig.  I started 6 months ago but I was her longest employee.  I got tired of training new people and thought I'd make a few suggestions.  It was just fun money for me but I felt I had to say something for the other workers and couldn't stand bending my principles anymore.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Dicey on March 16, 2016, 01:04:25 PM
I attached it.  Maybe it just doesn't show up in the preview?
Wait! She called you a "C" You Next Tuesday? She must have been looking in a mirror and gotten confused. Wow, just wow!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Vertical Mode on March 16, 2016, 01:11:01 PM
I attached it.  Maybe it just doesn't show up in the preview?
Wait! She called you a "C" You Next Tuesday? She must have been looking in a mirror and gotten confused. Wow, just wow!

Using that word is one of the fastest ways to take all of the air out of a room.

I also noticed the time stamps on those texts...why was your boss texting you after 9PM? Was that also a regular occurrence?
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: seanc0x0 on March 16, 2016, 01:44:50 PM


Oh boy. More juicy backstory? What kinds of things was she doing that made people quit all the time?

Docking our pay for ridiculous reasons, expecting us to do way too much for free, trash talking about clients and other coworkers.  Not appreciating us. Unfortunately I really liked the job - but not enough to put up with her.

Check your local laws. This may not be legal. If it is, then she can get what's coming to her and you get the money you should have had... all while you sip something cold on a beach somewhere.

Given the Telus header on that phone, I'd say that Cannot Wait! is in Canada. It's pretty much illegal across the whole country for a worker to have their pay docked. Specifically this from the federal labour law section of the website below. Provincial laws may add more restrictions, but this sets the baseline:

Quote
Deductions resulting from a loss of your employer's property or money are not allowed unless you were the only employee to have access to that property or money.

The boss is lucky none of her ex-employees have brought that up with a provincial labour board.

Here's info on the rules in all provinces in Canada:
http://workershelp.ca/wages.asp
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: ringer707 on March 16, 2016, 01:54:51 PM
Can someone tell me how to add a picture?  I have an epic story that you'd have to see to believe...

Ah, there it is.  Sorry for the vulgarity!

This was her response to me telling her that if she doesn't want people quitting all the time, she should try not being so rude.  She apparently didn't get the message!  Thank God for FU money!

Wow, that's terrible. Good thing you got out of there. I'd say that effectively proved your point, too, but I bet the irony was lost on her.

It totally was!  Lol
Unnfortunately I signed a non compete contract with her.  Does anyone know how enforceable those are?  I can't help but think sending that text to her client list would sway their impression of her. 
This was my post FIRE gig.  I started 6 months ago but I was her longest employee.  I got tired of training new people and thought I'd make a few suggestions.  It was just fun money for me but I felt I had to say something for the other workers and couldn't stand bending my principles anymore.

As to the non compete, it generally all depends on the state you live and how the non compete is worded. A lot of overly broad non competes are considered unenforceable, but it just depends on the language. For example, if your non compete says you can't work in XYZ field anywhere for the next 5 years, it's probably not going to be enforceable. If it says you can't work in XYZ field in your metro area for the next year, it will likely be enforceable. Of course, the enforceability of this would be determined most likely by a lawsuit.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Mr. Green on March 16, 2016, 02:50:13 PM
I attached it.  Maybe it just doesn't show up in the preview?
Wait! She called you a "C" You Next Tuesday? She must have been looking in a mirror and gotten confused. Wow, just wow!

Using that word is one of the fastest ways to take all of the air out of a room.

I also noticed the time stamps on those texts...why was your boss texting you after 9PM? Was that also a regular occurrence?
This depends on where you live. In England it's used on the regular, like we use the F-bomb in the US. I see the C-word and the new F-bomb for us Americans. Used to be saying "fuck" would take all the air out of the room.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Northwestie on March 16, 2016, 02:58:26 PM
We're in the midst of one.  Our daughter has a disability for which she requires an accommodation in order to participate in a specific school situation. The school district is refusing to provide her with that accommodation and instead is trying to bribe us to go away by offering us $20k to sign a document agreeing to waive her rights to participate in that specific school activity.  We told them to take their offer and shove it (politely, of coarse).  They even had their district physician call her doctor and try to get him to talk us into accepting their offer.  Of coarse, this offer was made verbally and they never gave us the document, so they will just lie and say it never happened.  If we were given the document, I would pass it on to the Office of Civil Rights.  They're still not giving her the accommodation that she needs, but regardless, I will never have to look my daughter in the eye and say she can't do x activity like all her friends because we are paid for her not to.

Just curious - can you be more specific?  The reason I ask is that I volunteer at a school and there is an incredible amount of requests for "accommodation" some needed - others just make me blink in astonishment.  One-on-one requests for kids who only disability is that they are figgin' lazy.

Or on the other extreme pushing the school to have a kid go skiing who regularly falls out of his chair and can barely shuffle down the hallway unaided.  They would have to strap him in the chair lift and I have no idea how he would get down the bunny slope.   There are groups such as Ski-for-all that have the staff, training, and skill for something like this, but it is way outside the norm for a public school that can't even get the full amount of supplies for teachers' classrooms.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Chris22 on March 16, 2016, 03:23:04 PM
Can someone tell me how to add a picture?  I have an epic story that you'd have to see to believe...

Ah, there it is.  Sorry for the vulgarity!

This was her response to me telling her that if she doesn't want people quitting all the time, she should try not being so rude.  She apparently didn't get the message!  Thank God for FU money!

Wow, that's terrible. Good thing you got out of there. I'd say that effectively proved your point, too, but I bet the irony was lost on her.

It totally was!  Lol
Unnfortunately I signed a non compete contract with her.  Does anyone know how enforceable those are?  I can't help but think sending that text to her client list would sway their impression of her. 
This was my post FIRE gig.  I started 6 months ago but I was her longest employee.  I got tired of training new people and thought I'd make a few suggestions.  It was just fun money for me but I felt I had to say something for the other workers and couldn't stand bending my principles anymore.

Not sure outside the US but generally in the US noncompetes are unenforecable if you aren't an executive.  Noncom in return for $1M of stock grants?  Probably enforceable.  Noncom for a $50k/yr job?  Unenforceable.  Basically they cannot make you unable to earn a living.

IANAL, etc.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: green daisy on March 16, 2016, 04:00:34 PM
We're in the midst of one.  Our daughter has a disability for which she requires an accommodation in order to participate in a specific school situation. The school district is refusing to provide her with that accommodation and instead is trying to bribe us to go away by offering us $20k to sign a document agreeing to waive her rights to participate in that specific school activity.  We told them to take their offer and shove it (politely, of coarse).  They even had their district physician call her doctor and try to get him to talk us into accepting their offer.  Of coarse, this offer was made verbally and they never gave us the document, so they will just lie and say it never happened.  If we were given the document, I would pass it on to the Office of Civil Rights.  They're still not giving her the accommodation that she needs, but regardless, I will never have to look my daughter in the eye and say she can't do x activity like all her friends because we are paid for her not to.

Just curious - can you be more specific?  The reason I ask is that I volunteer at a school and there is an incredible amount of requests for "accommodation" some needed - others just make me blink in astonishment.  One-on-one requests for kids who only disability is that they are figgin' lazy.

Or on the other extreme pushing the school to have a kid go skiing who regularly falls out of his chair and can barely shuffle down the hallway unaided.  They would have to strap him in the chair lift and I have no idea how he would get down the bunny slope.   There are groups such as Ski-for-all that have the staff, training, and skill for something like this, but it is way outside the norm for a public school that can't even get the full amount of supplies for teachers' classrooms.

Northwestie- will send you a pm. 
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: LeRainDrop on March 16, 2016, 04:21:58 PM
Unnfortunately I signed a non compete contract with her.  Does anyone know how enforceable those are?  I can't help but think sending that text to her client list would sway their impression of her. 
This was my post FIRE gig.  I started 6 months ago but I was her longest employee.  I got tired of training new people and thought I'd make a few suggestions.  It was just fun money for me but I felt I had to say something for the other workers and couldn't stand bending my principles anymore.

Not sure outside the US but generally in the US noncompetes are unenforecable if you aren't an executive.  Noncom in return for $1M of stock grants?  Probably enforceable.  Noncom for a $50k/yr job?  Unenforceable.  Basically they cannot make you unable to earn a living.

IANAL, etc.

Whoa, hold on there.  Cannot Wait!, if you are looking for guidance on non-compete law, you really need to consult an attorney familiar with your state's (or other country?) laws because the laws vary greatly by state.  Many states won't dishonor an entire non-compete just because a portion is unenforceable, but will actually "blue pencil" the clause to put greater limits to turn it into an enforceable clause.  The examples that Chris22 wrote, while well-intentioned, represents a pretty common misconception/over-generalization about this area of law.  Although, he is correct on this part: "Basically they cannot make you unable to earn a living."  Definitely consult an attorney if this is an issue you want to understand accurately for your situation.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: RedmondStash on March 16, 2016, 07:23:01 PM
Unnfortunately I signed a non compete contract with her.  Does anyone know how enforceable those are?  I can't help but think sending that text to her client list would sway their impression of her. 
This was my post FIRE gig.  I started 6 months ago but I was her longest employee.  I got tired of training new people and thought I'd make a few suggestions.  It was just fun money for me but I felt I had to say something for the other workers and couldn't stand bending my principles anymore.

Not sure outside the US but generally in the US noncompetes are unenforecable if you aren't an executive.  Noncom in return for $1M of stock grants?  Probably enforceable.  Noncom for a $50k/yr job?  Unenforceable.  Basically they cannot make you unable to earn a living.

IANAL, etc.

Whoa, hold on there.  Cannot Wait!, if you are looking for guidance on non-compete law, you really need to consult an attorney familiar with your state's (or other country?) laws because the laws vary greatly by state.  Many states won't dishonor an entire non-compete just because a portion is unenforceable, but will actually "blue pencil" the clause to put greater limits to turn it into an enforceable clause.  The examples that Chris22 wrote, while well-intentioned, represents a pretty common misconception/over-generalization about this area of law.  Although, he is correct on this part: "Basically they cannot make you unable to earn a living."  Definitely consult an attorney if this is an issue you want to understand accurately for your situation.

Yeah, definitely check with an attorney.

Alternatively -- if that was your private phone that text conversation happened on, you could strike a deal with her: she signs away your noncompete clause, and you agree not to share that text exchange with her clients. You actually have leverage because of her bad behavior.

Just a thought.

Good luck. And good for you for getting out of there! FU money is the best. :)
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Neustache on March 16, 2016, 07:42:10 PM
We're in the midst of one.  Our daughter has a disability for which she requires an accommodation in order to participate in a specific school situation. The school district is refusing to provide her with that accommodation and instead is trying to bribe us to go away by offering us $20k to sign a document agreeing to waive her rights to participate in that specific school activity.  We told them to take their offer and shove it (politely, of coarse).  They even had their district physician call her doctor and try to get him to talk us into accepting their offer.  Of coarse, this offer was made verbally and they never gave us the document, so they will just lie and say it never happened.  If we were given the document, I would pass it on to the Office of Civil Rights.  They're still not giving her the accommodation that she needs, but regardless, I will never have to look my daughter in the eye and say she can't do x activity like all her friends because we are paid for her not to.

Just curious - can you be more specific?  The reason I ask is that I volunteer at a school and there is an incredible amount of requests for "accommodation" some needed - others just make me blink in astonishment.  One-on-one requests for kids who only disability is that they are figgin' lazy.

Or on the other extreme pushing the school to have a kid go skiing who regularly falls out of his chair and can barely shuffle down the hallway unaided.  They would have to strap him in the chair lift and I have no idea how he would get down the bunny slope.   There are groups such as Ski-for-all that have the staff, training, and skill for something like this, but it is way outside the norm for a public school that can't even get the full amount of supplies for teachers' classrooms.

As a parent of a kid in the bottom 20% for processing speed (but also qualified for the gifted program) I.just.can't.even with your statement about laziness.  It looks a whole lot like laziness - it's not.  I have a wonderful video for you if you liked to learn more about learning disabilities. 
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Cannot Wait! on March 17, 2016, 08:21:17 AM
Thank you all for your thoughts and suggestions.
One of the greatest things about being FIREd is the ability to walk away from nasty and negative situations.
:)
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: lifejoy on March 17, 2016, 08:33:20 AM
Can someone tell me how to add a picture?  I have an epic story that you'd have to see to believe...

Ah, there it is.  Sorry for the vulgarity!

This was her response to me telling her that if she doesn't want people quitting all the time, she should try not being so rude.  She apparently didn't get the message!  Thank God for FU money!

Oh boy. More juicy backstory? What kinds of things was she doing that made people quit all the time?

Docking our pay for ridiculous reasons, expecting us to do way too much for free, trash talking about clients and other coworkers.  Not appreciating us. Unfortunately I really liked the job - but not enough to put up with her.

"People don't leave jobs - they leave managers."

So true!!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: modulus on March 17, 2016, 09:37:23 PM
http://www.businessinsider.com/adam-laroche-retires-told-not-to-bring-son-to-clubhouse-2016-3

Relevant to this thread, White Sox player says "I quit" when told he can't bring his 14 year old son to practice and games as often. He must have had some sort of home-schooling arrangement in order for the son to be around the ballpark so much.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: theSlowTurtle on March 18, 2016, 05:06:15 AM
http://www.businessinsider.com/adam-laroche-retires-told-not-to-bring-son-to-clubhouse-2016-3

Relevant to this thread, White Sox player says "I quit" when told he can't bring his 14 year old son to practice and games as often. He must have had some sort of home-schooling arrangement in order for the son to be around the ballpark so much.
I am a Nationals fan (team LaRoche played for a number of years) and heard about this on local radio. My first reaction was "Good for him!"
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Rollin on March 18, 2016, 06:47:02 AM
Can someone tell me how to add a picture?  I have an epic story that you'd have to see to believe...

Ah, there it is.  Sorry for the vulgarity!

This was her response to me telling her that if she doesn't want people quitting all the time, she should try not being so rude.  She apparently didn't get the message!  Thank God for FU money!

That type of belittling and that type of language describing what she (or he) thinks of the other person is not only vulgar, but disgusting.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: frugalecon on March 29, 2016, 07:44:41 PM
http://www.businessinsider.com/adam-laroche-retires-told-not-to-bring-son-to-clubhouse-2016-3

Relevant to this thread, White Sox player says "I quit" when told he can't bring his 14 year old son to practice and games as often. He must have had some sort of home-schooling arrangement in order for the son to be around the ballpark so much.
I am a Nationals fan (team LaRoche played for a number of years) and heard about this on local radio. My first reaction was "Good for him!"

Strange, my first reaction was, "Imagine what a mess it would be if all ball players insisted on bringing their minor children to the park for every game." Also, "hmmm, management is less accommodating to a .207 hitter (2015) than a .259 hitter (2014).
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: azure975 on April 02, 2016, 01:52:45 PM
So close to exercising the FU option right now. It'll agitate me too much to go into details right now but am just so glad to have the option.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Cannot Wait! on April 02, 2016, 04:04:40 PM
Azure975, don't tell us the details...tell us an imaginary tale of how you see your Epic FU fantasy playing out?  That could be fun.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: MissNancyPryor on April 12, 2016, 04:22:08 PM
following!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: RedmondStash on April 12, 2016, 07:15:57 PM
So close to exercising the FU option right now. It'll agitate me too much to go into details right now but am just so glad to have the option.

Word. I've been right on the edge for the past several weeks. And this is in a job I loved right up until it got political and someone started messing with my work.

Knowing I have FU money gives me such peace of mind. I'm still hoping there's a resolution I like to the issues I'm facing right now, but if there isn't -- hey, summer's coming, and there's plenty of time to look for work in the fall.

Good luck, Azure975.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: azure975 on April 12, 2016, 10:22:57 PM

Word. I've been right on the edge for the past several weeks. And this is in a job I loved right up until it got political and someone started messing with my work.

Knowing I have FU money gives me such peace of mind. I'm still hoping there's a resolution I like to the issues I'm facing right now, but if there isn't -- hey, summer's coming, and there's plenty of time to look for work in the fall.

Good luck, Azure975.

Thanks! An update on my situation--I've just been keeping my head down and working on finishing up a project which will end at the end of this month. Then I plan to approach my boss and tell her that I will be moving on over the summer. I have been wanting to take a "mini-retirement" for a long time and this seems like the right time. Hopefully I won't chicken out!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: jlajr on April 12, 2016, 10:52:36 PM
Thanks! An update on my situation--I've just been keeping my head down and working on finishing up a project which will end at the end of this month. Then I plan to approach my boss and tell her that I will be moving on over the summer. I have been wanting to take a "mini-retirement" for a long time and this seems like the right time. Hopefully I won't chicken out!
Go for it, azure975!

I just might do the same...
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: RedmondStash on April 15, 2016, 09:42:26 PM
Thanks! An update on my situation--I've just been keeping my head down and working on finishing up a project which will end at the end of this month. Then I plan to approach my boss and tell her that I will be moving on over the summer. I have been wanting to take a "mini-retirement" for a long time and this seems like the right time. Hopefully I won't chicken out!

Excellent! Spouse & I tried a mini-retirement a couple of years back, and it was really fantastic. So relaxing. We realized based on our spending that we weren't quite at the FI stage yet, but I'm so glad we took retirement for a test-drive. Enjoy yours!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Metric Mouse on April 18, 2016, 06:19:11 AM
posting to follow.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Dicey on April 23, 2016, 12:11:55 AM
All caught up. May I have some more stories please?
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: drunkenNoodles on April 23, 2016, 09:27:46 AM
After several months at my new job, my boss/owner brought up the idea of us partnering and expanding the business. I took a month to think and eventually decided it could be a great idea and we proceeded. After I had started bringing ideas to action, handling large portions of the shared work, and getting in the mental state of being a co-owner, my "boss" decided she didn't want to partner. I believe it's because she realized she would have to make less for a while as the business grew, as well as work with someone who she'd have to treat as an equal.

She decided she wanted me to be her "assistant" instead. Which meant still doing the extra work I was doing as well as being her go-to person for every issue and complaint. Basically reduced to her peon while she gladly referred to me as her assistant and giddily proclaimed me as such to business contacts and other employees.

My boss who i do respect as she's a kind, good-hearted person, is a poor communicator and business owner. The type who can't handle stress or make a decision without panicking. The type who doesn't respect your personal time and sucks your energy talking about all their problems, both personal and business related.

It was just a few years ago that I started saving FU money and working towards FIRE. It has allowed me to give two weeks notice and pursue two much better business opportunities.

And after I gave a respectful, no finger-pointing resignation, my boss who finally got back to me days later had the nerve to say, "I hope you know I'm not mad at you..", HA! What an ego. Grateful for FU money!
 



Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: mm1970 on April 23, 2016, 09:31:42 AM
After several months at my new job, my boss/owner brought up the idea of us partnering and expanding the business. I took a month to think and eventually decided it could be a great idea and we proceeded. After I had started bringing ideas to action, handling large portions of the shared work, and getting in the mental state of being a co-owner, my "boss" decided she didn't want to partner. I believe it's because she realized she would have to make less for a while as the business grew, as well as work with someone who she'd have to treat as an equal.

She decided she wanted me to be her "assistant" instead. Which meant still doing the extra work I was doing as well as being her go-to person for every issue and complaint. Basically reduced to her peon while she gladly referred to me as her assistant and giddily proclaimed me as such to business contacts and other employees.

My boss who i do respect as she's a kind, good-hearted person, is a poor communicator and business owner. The type who can't handle stress or make a decision without panicking. The type who doesn't respect your personal time and sucks your energy talking about all their problems, both personal and business related.

It was just a few years ago that I started saving FU money and working towards FIRE. It has allowed me to give two weeks notice and pursue two much better business opportunities.

And after I gave a respectful, no finger-pointing resignation, my boss who finally got back to me days later had the nerve to say, "I hope you know I'm not mad at you..", HA! What an ego. Grateful for FU money!
Ah, this reminds me of my husband's job after grad school.  A start up run by a narcissist who grew up with a silver spoon in his mouth.  Sole owner of company, kept talking about issuing stock, but never did.  Managed to get contracts and hire great people, but after about 4-5 years of that, I could see the writing on the wall.  He talked about selling the business to my hubby and another senior guy so he could "retire".  I started encouraging him to look elsewhere.  He did, got a better job and the place went belly up 9 months later.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: zolotiyeruki on May 04, 2016, 02:37:59 PM
Replying only to subscribe. I'm grateful I haven't had some of the bad experiences.  Some were less-than-ideal, but for the most part, I've had a good employment experience.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: feelingroovy on May 10, 2016, 03:35:24 PM
One month into my 3-month maternity leave, I took my departing in-laws to the airport.  I drove home thinking, "two more months home along with a toddler and a baby."  God help me.

When I got home, I was shocked to find DH was there.  Tuns out half the company got laid off, including him.  We high-fived.

That, man. THAT RIGHT THERE. The fact that you can react to a layoff, especially one that hits right after a child is born, with high-fives is THE ENTIRE POINT OF THIS WEBSITE, amirite?? That's what we're all going for: liberation from money-related stress! People who aren't liberated would react to that with tears and possibly acrimony so bad it leads to divorce.

Oh, how I wish the forum had a "like" button and that I could press it 10^6 times. 

I've read the entire thread, beginning to end, and have an e-mail alert set up so I can know when responses posted (haven't posted-to-follow until now, though!), but I had forgotten about this story.  Daleth, thanks so much for highlighting it and bringing it before my eyes again--feelingroovy, I keep re-reading this amazing post-partum high-five story and letting it sink in, and in, and in some more--and tears well up in my eyes as I think how wonderful it is that your family knew PEACE in the aftermath of the layoff. 

This site freaking ROCKS.  :)

Thanks, Daleth and ZootsTwin. 

Those two months were truly "the life." We decided then that it was the only way to live--two kids, two stay at home parents.

I never understood why people buy houses and set up lifestyles that require two salaries. That's just asking for trouble.

That newborn is now 12 and we have taken the slow road to FI. We have always been frugal, but this site has given me the strategies to invest. Our wealth-building strategies are much more optimized now.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: afuera on May 11, 2016, 09:58:14 AM
I have a few older people I work with that are very candid about their situation and priorities.  The best way I heard it described was this:

"Every person has two buckets, a brown and a green.  The size of these buckets vary by person and sometimes by the time of day but regardless, the employee will leave when either one gets full."

For now both of my buckets are pretty empty but I'm so happy that by quickly filling up my green bucket (saving more and spending less), I will be able to keep my brown bucket small and feel comfortable leaving whenever it gets full.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: jordanread on May 11, 2016, 10:00:34 AM
"Every person has two buckets, a brown and a green.  The size of these buckets vary by person and sometimes by the time of day but regardless, the employee will leave when either one gets full."

Oh, I like that!!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: 2lazy2retire on May 11, 2016, 12:05:51 PM
Can someone tell me how to add a picture?  I have an epic story that you'd have to see to believe...

Ah, there it is.  Sorry for the vulgarity!

This was her response to me telling her that if she doesn't want people quitting all the time, she should try not being so rude.  She apparently didn't get the message!  Thank God for FU money!


Is she British?

Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: MoneyCat on May 11, 2016, 01:15:47 PM
Lately, I've taken to telling people exactly what I think of them. This has resulted in me either gaining greater respect from people or people cutting me off entirely (which is no big loss.) Seriously, if I upset someone, what are they going to do? Complain to my boss? And then I'll have to spend my day exercising, reading books, and posting on the internet while I live off a small amount of my massive savings? Who cares? Having FU money is awesome.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Cannot Wait! on May 11, 2016, 09:50:06 PM
@2lazy2retire No, she was just nasty.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: LAL on May 12, 2016, 06:40:29 PM
DH last summer went on a 1 month sabbatical on which we moved cross country. He came back on Monday after a month off and turned in his 2 weeks notice.  His boss said "huh I wondered what was going on with you selling your house and planning on renting."  He told HR that it was not a pleasant environment to work when in March they laid off 75% of the department but had been rude enough that they had interviewed and hired all their replacements the previous September-December.  He hadn't been cut but hated the workplace.  So he decided to leave and we left. 

Since even before March he had been doing anything he wanted.  He'd been hoping for a layoff.  Oh well.  Those jerks had laid off his old boss who had just come back from second bout of breast cancer.  She knew she was gone from lack of presence. 

FU money is nice and handy. We probably are close to FI but DH wants to work so here we are.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: SwordGuy on May 12, 2016, 07:20:21 PM
Lately, I've taken to telling people exactly what I think of them. This has resulted in me either gaining greater respect from people or people cutting me off entirely (which is no big loss.) Seriously, if I upset someone, what are they going to do? Complain to my boss? And then I'll have to spend my day exercising, reading books, and posting on the internet while I live off a small amount of my massive savings? Who cares? Having FU money is awesome.

I hope you reserve that negative candor for people who deserve it by being terribly rude or hurtful to other employees, or cause others real inconveniences in their personal life by being unreliable or lazy.

Everyone could use some improvement, it's not right to call out people for harmless foibles.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: firelight on May 22, 2016, 10:51:12 PM
Posting to follow
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: twojabs on May 23, 2016, 04:36:54 PM
I used to have a really controlling manager.

I went for 3 external interviews in August, and 1 internal interview in early September.

On one morning in early December, I got my annual performance review in which, after a year of him being a complete negative micromanagement ass biscuit to me, he gave me a semi positive review and said I need to make more decisions (even tho every decision I've taken had been wrong in the previous 2 years).

Anyway, good review aside, I got a knockback from the internal job that morning too, and he was super smug about it.

He did not, however, know that of 3 external jobs, I received 3 offers on the same morning (well, on the Friday, Saturday and Monday morning).

I went out for my lunch and returned, calmly handing him my resignation letter with a smile on my face, only to see him melt into his chair, claim he was sad and that I had been a good employee.  All this after I "broke the relationship" in going for the internal interview...

A bad boss is bad business, but with a leader you can do your best work.  I didn't go for the highest paying job... But I did go for the right one.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: LouLou on May 25, 2016, 06:48:08 AM
Unnfortunately I signed a non compete contract with her.  Does anyone know how enforceable those are?  I can't help but think sending that text to her client list would sway their impression of her. 
This was my post FIRE gig.  I started 6 months ago but I was her longest employee.  I got tired of training new people and thought I'd make a few suggestions.  It was just fun money for me but I felt I had to say something for the other workers and couldn't stand bending my principles anymore.

Not sure outside the US but generally in the US noncompetes are unenforecable if you aren't an executive.  Noncom in return for $1M of stock grants?  Probably enforceable.  Noncom for a $50k/yr job?  Unenforceable.  Basically they cannot make you unable to earn a living.

IANAL, etc.

Whoa, hold on there.  Cannot Wait!, if you are looking for guidance on non-compete law, you really need to consult an attorney familiar with your state's (or other country?) laws because the laws vary greatly by state.  Many states won't dishonor an entire non-compete just because a portion is unenforceable, but will actually "blue pencil" the clause to put greater limits to turn it into an enforceable clause.  The examples that Chris22 wrote, while well-intentioned, represents a pretty common misconception/over-generalization about this area of law.  Although, he is correct on this part: "Basically they cannot make you unable to earn a living."  Definitely consult an attorney if this is an issue you want to understand accurately for your situation.

Absolutely consult an attorney who has experience in this area.  I love enforcing non-competes, and could enforce a well-written one against someone who made $50k under the right circumstances. And in many states, the courts will just adjust the terms of an otherwise unenforceable non-compete to make it unenforceable ("blue penciling").
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Cannot Wait! on May 25, 2016, 06:58:35 AM
Thanks LouLou!
This was just a small time gig.  Turns out I don't *need* the money as much as I thought and am really enjoying not working at all.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: radram on May 26, 2016, 10:14:34 AM
Binge read the whole thread.  Sad stories, but WONDERFULLY entertaining.  Thank you all.

I have a few stories.  Will post one now, a few more to follow.  The only one I would categorize as an FU will be posted as some other time.

I was given incredible opportunities in my lifetime.  We took advantage of most of them, leading to me being FIRE with 2 FIRE dates.  The first date was the last day of school last year.  My second date was the FIRST day teachers were to report back.  I wasn't there :)

Got a degree in Computer Science in the early 90's, but went to work for my Grandfather in the family manufacturing business to see if that was the career I wanted.  I did not.  I did enjoy making things, but it was a little boring, and there were some issues with management(Uncle, cousin) I did not want to deal with for the rest of my life.  In short, I did not trust them and therefore did not want to be their partner.


After 3 1/2 years, I left to pursue a career using my degree.  So my first FU was not that at all.  It was simply living below our means in order to walk away from a very lucrative company simply because I did not want to stay.  My dad is still there to this day (at 75), HATING it, and destroying his body in order to deal with it(or NOT deal with it).  He can afford to leave anytime he wants to, but won't.

That led to my next FU story, which will be forthcoming.

Anyone else with a family related FU story?




Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: aetherie on May 27, 2016, 07:35:44 AM
a complete negative micromanagement ass biscuit

I'm saving this to share the next time my friend complains about her boss.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: h82goslw on May 28, 2016, 05:23:25 AM
a complete negative micromanagement ass biscuit

I'm saving this to share the next time my friend complains about her boss.

I'm saving this so I can use the phrase
"Complete negative micromanagement ass biscuit"  some day in conversation.  😄
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: coacheichenlaub on May 28, 2016, 07:34:56 PM
Holy cow, this is fantastic.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: everinprogress on May 30, 2016, 08:58:04 PM
I love this thread :)
I don't have a great story, but definitely want to make sure we have enough FU money on hand that we could, should the need arise
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: EcoCanuck on June 02, 2016, 03:42:52 AM
My story is an in-progress story.

Currently I'm working for a job that I really like and have a good team but we have a 'supervisory' manager from another company that has the most combative and rude management style that I have ever experienced. I can't say that every day is an epic FU Money Story what I do have is the confidence that if I were fired I would be fine and my wife is a-ok with us making a dramatic change at any moment.

My entire team is constantly berated and told we are doing things wrong and the smalllllest little thing becomes an hour to two hour long tirade on why everything we do is always wrong. *note* 95% of the time everything is completely unfounded. Within my first 6 months I was threatened to be fired over 30 times - I stopped counting. After the third or fourth threatening I said, 'Yes, by all means. After you do that we can go out and have a few drinks. However this this and this is wrong and I'm very busy." He attempted a few more times to try and scare me in to place before realizing that I had no fear. Now, while he still threatens to fire he's also decided that he likes me and is trying to get me promoted within my own company or brought over to his company.

Having enough money to comfortably walk away at any time has just turned the constant idiocy in to a laughing matter. Unfortunately my coworkers are not in the same position so they feel much more stress and anxiety. While this manager does make days longer and harder to get my work done I'm able to speak my mind and do my damn job all because of epic FU money and the confidence that it has brought.

EcoCanuck
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: simmias on June 02, 2016, 06:07:01 AM
My entire team is constantly berated and told we are doing things wrong and the smalllllest little thing becomes an hour to two hour long tirade on why everything we do is always wrong.
Tabs vs. spaces?
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: zolotiyeruki on June 02, 2016, 07:33:13 AM
My entire team is constantly berated and told we are doing things wrong and the smalllllest little thing becomes an hour to two hour long tirade on why everything we do is always wrong. *note* 95% of the time everything is completely unfounded. Within my first 6 months I was threatened to be fired over 30 times - I stopped counting. After the third or fourth threatening I said, 'Yes, by all means. After you do that we can go out and have a few drinks. However this this and this is wrong and I'm very busy." He attempted a few more times to try and scare me in to place before realizing that I had no fear. Now, while he still threatens to fire he's also decided that he likes me and is trying to get me promoted within my own company or brought over to his company.
The word "bully" comes to mind--as soon as you stood your ground, things turned around.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: CowboyAndIndian on June 02, 2016, 07:38:08 AM
My entire team is constantly berated and told we are doing things wrong and the smalllllest little thing becomes an hour to two hour long tirade on why everything we do is always wrong.
Tabs vs. spaces?

Spaces, never tabs!

(You must be a software developer to understand this one)
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: zolotiyeruki on June 02, 2016, 08:00:11 AM
My entire team is constantly berated and told we are doing things wrong and the smalllllest little thing becomes an hour to two hour long tirade on why everything we do is always wrong.
Tabs vs. spaces?

Spaces, never tabs!

(You must be a software developer to understand this one)
(SW dev here) Are you kidding me!?  Tabs are *way* better than spaces! :)
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: HairyUpperLip on June 02, 2016, 08:09:32 AM
My entire team is constantly berated and told we are doing things wrong and the smalllllest little thing becomes an hour to two hour long tirade on why everything we do is always wrong.
Tabs vs. spaces?

Spaces, never tabs!

(You must be a software developer to understand this one)

Or just seen the most recent episode of Silicon Valley. :-p
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: secondcor521 on June 02, 2016, 08:57:20 AM
My entire team is constantly berated and told we are doing things wrong and the smalllllest little thing becomes an hour to two hour long tirade on why everything we do is always wrong.
Tabs vs. spaces?

Spaces, never tabs!

(You must be a software developer to understand this one)
(SW dev here) Are you kidding me!?  Tabs are *way* better than spaces! :)

I prefer a pre-checkin formatting script, but we never got around to it at my last company...we were spending too much time debating the proper amount of spacing around operators, when to camel case, and other such important stuff.  That's OK, though, because we only spent about 100 engineer-years on the project and then had it canceled, only to be replaced by another project with essentially the same specs, except the main controller was replaced by another part "produced" by a company we bought.  Which was OK except the owner of the company was friends with management at my company - they went to college together or something.  And that the part wasn't done yet.  So last I heard they were off developing a simulation environment because there was no hardware.  I really don't know anymore...I left in February.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Arktinkerer on June 02, 2016, 03:02:56 PM

I prefer a pre-checkin formatting script, but we never got around to it at my last company...we were spending too much time debating the proper amount of spacing around operators, when to camel case, and other such important stuff.  That's OK, though, because we only spent about 100 engineer-years on the project and then had it canceled, only to be replaced by another project with essentially the same specs, except the main controller was replaced by another part "produced" by a company we bought.  Which was OK except the owner of the company was friends with management at my company - they went to college together or something.  And that the part wasn't done yet.  So last I heard they were off developing a simulation environment because there was no hardware.  I really don't know anymore...I left in February.

Set up something like GNU Indent with a check out and check in settings.  Check out code and get it the way you want.  Check in and it goes back to the "standard" with no problems.  Takes about an hour to setup and everyone is happy...unless they are looking over your shoulder.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: secondcor521 on June 02, 2016, 05:35:58 PM
^ Yup.  My general point is that the organization I was in preferred to debate and argue more than solve the problem and move on with life.  TBH, I probably contributed to that culture myself at times.  Anyway, no longer my problem since 2/19/16.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: rantk81 on June 02, 2016, 06:53:34 PM
^ Yup.  My general point is that the organization I was in preferred to debate and argue more than solve the problem and move on with life.  TBH, I probably contributed to that culture myself at times.  Anyway, no longer my problem since 2/19/16.

I think it's possible I am working for that very same company ;)
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: secondcor521 on June 02, 2016, 08:18:57 PM
^ Yup.  My general point is that the organization I was in preferred to debate and argue more than solve the problem and move on with life.  TBH, I probably contributed to that culture myself at times.  Anyway, no longer my problem since 2/19/16.

I think it's possible I am working for that very same company ;)

You, me, and Dilbert.  It's a pandemic I think.  There was a book I started reading once the thesis of which was that all business organizations are inherently messed up simply as a result of their objectives.  Not sure I totally agree, but I can see how it is easier for most places to be yucky.

If you PM me where you work, I'll confirm or deny ;-)
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Zamboni on June 03, 2016, 05:43:50 AM
(http://www.brentroad.com/photos/00534270.jpg)
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: jlajr on June 03, 2016, 07:10:58 AM
Between April of last year until about two months ago, I was extremely frustrated at work and looking for another job (which would require moving where I live). If I had been offered any of the jobs for which I applied, I would have accepted it with no hesitation.

Unfortunately, after months of a frustrating job search, usually driving at least two hours each way to interviews/tests and taking vacation time to do so, I decided that I would no longer actively look for another job. I also decided not to move from where I current live and leave my current job, before accepting another position. As you did, I decided to allow my Stash to continue to grow instead of possibly using it to cover expenses while looking for a job.

Coming to these decisions has made a huge difference. I have not fully returned to my pre-April 2015 state of being extremely happy with my situation - but I am nonetheless happy, regardless of what my managers have or have not done, are or are not doing, and will or will not do.

I do what I need to do to maintain a healthy state of mind - such as freely speak my mind or flatly refuse to do certain tasks. The worst-case scenario, as far as I can tell, would be my current employer firing me (or laying me off, or whatever you choose to call it), with a contract-required notice of two months. As that's a fairly attractive option from my point of view, if that happens, I'd simply say something like "Great. Thank you.", leave the office, tell my landlord I'm exercising the clause in my lease that allows me to cancel it with two months' notice, and start looking for a new job and a new place to live.

I actually joke with colleagues that happy jlajr can be just as annoying as frustrated jlajr, and that I suspect that they have started putting happy pills in my lunch. :)

Well, freely speaking my mind and flatly refusing to do certain tasks has, in fact, resulted in my employer terminating my employment.

When I decided that I would no longer actively look for another job and realized that my employer terminating my employment would be a fairly attractive option from my point of view, I kind of forgot to think about what I would do after my employer terminated my employment. I guess I should do that now.

With two months notice, I'll have some time to do just that.

(Don't say, Wow, two months notice? That's amazing., just yet. The other side of the coin is that if I had resigned, I would have been required to give my employer two months notice as well.)
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: onlykelsey on June 03, 2016, 07:15:18 AM
Between April of last year until about two months ago, I was extremely frustrated at work and looking for another job (which would require moving where I live). If I had been offered any of the jobs for which I applied, I would have accepted it with no hesitation.

Unfortunately, after months of a frustrating job search, usually driving at least two hours each way to interviews/tests and taking vacation time to do so, I decided that I would no longer actively look for another job. I also decided not to move from where I current live and leave my current job, before accepting another position. As you did, I decided to allow my Stash to continue to grow instead of possibly using it to cover expenses while looking for a job.

Coming to these decisions has made a huge difference. I have not fully returned to my pre-April 2015 state of being extremely happy with my situation - but I am nonetheless happy, regardless of what my managers have or have not done, are or are not doing, and will or will not do.

I do what I need to do to maintain a healthy state of mind - such as freely speak my mind or flatly refuse to do certain tasks. The worst-case scenario, as far as I can tell, would be my current employer firing me (or laying me off, or whatever you choose to call it), with a contract-required notice of two months. As that's a fairly attractive option from my point of view, if that happens, I'd simply say something like "Great. Thank you.", leave the office, tell my landlord I'm exercising the clause in my lease that allows me to cancel it with two months' notice, and start looking for a new job and a new place to live.

I actually joke with colleagues that happy jlajr can be just as annoying as frustrated jlajr, and that I suspect that they have started putting happy pills in my lunch. :)

Well, freely speaking my mind and flatly refusing to do certain tasks has, in fact, resulted in my employer terminating my employment.

When I decided that I would no longer actively look for another job and realized that my employer terminating my employment would be a fairly attractive option from my point of view, I kind of forgot to think about what I would do after my employer terminated my employment. I guess I should do that now.

With two months notice, I'll have some time to do just that.

(Don't say, Wow, two months notice? That's amazing., just yet. The other side of the coin is that if I had resigned, I would have been required to give my employer two months notice as well.)

Well, congrats, I think?  Am I misremembering, or are you and your wife expecting a kid?
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: msilenus on June 03, 2016, 11:36:07 AM
I prefer a pre-checkin formatting script...

You clearly reject a reality that is clear to others around you, and yet either lack the courage of your convictions to engage them in open debate, or else know you will lose on the merits. 

Which is to say that you sound like a tabs-man.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: secondcor521 on June 03, 2016, 08:39:57 PM
I prefer a pre-checkin formatting script...

You clearly reject a reality that is clear to others around you, and yet either lack the courage of your convictions to engage them in open debate, or else know you will lose on the merits. 

Which is to say that you sound like a tabs-man.

Wow.  False dichotomy, ad hominem, red herring, and prejudice.  You sound like you're trolling or forgot the /sarcasm tag.

If it matters to anyone, I don't care either way, I think it's a silly argument, and I think it's more productive to let people work the way they like and use technology to ease the interface with each other rather than have endless "religious" debates.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: msilenus on June 03, 2016, 08:57:54 PM
I did not forget the sarcasm tag.  It's more like I failed at not needing it.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: iluvzbeach on June 03, 2016, 08:59:38 PM
OMG, I am not even a coder (which probably means my two cents means nothing), but spaces drive me crazy. Tabs are the ONLY way to go when formatting.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: secondcor521 on June 03, 2016, 09:06:22 PM
I did not forget the sarcasm tag.  It's more like I failed at not needing it.

OK.  Well anyway, I forgot to say in my last post that I was more impressed and amused than offended.  Tx.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: jlajr on June 03, 2016, 11:15:35 PM
Well, congrats, I think?  Am I misremembering, or are you and your wife expecting a kid?

Thank you, onlykelsey. I do feel congrats are in order. :)

On the other hand, I'm not married, so it is not me and my wife expecting a child.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: LeRainDrop on June 04, 2016, 05:46:09 AM
Well, congrats, I think?  Am I misremembering, or are you and your wife expecting a kid?

Thank you, onlykelsey. I do feel congrats are in order. :)

On the other hand, I'm not married, so it is not me and my wife expecting a child.

Nonetheless, congratulations to you, jlajr!  That's exciting news that you will be a father!  Regarding your comments on the job loss, I hope you keep a very positive outlook on it.  Sounds like you stuck to your principles, did not compromise your beliefs at your employer's demand, and now have the opportunity to find a suitable replacement job that is a better match for you personally -- somewhere where their practices align with your own and they recognize the value in having an employee who speaks up.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: jlajr on June 04, 2016, 09:41:36 PM
Nonetheless, congratulations to you, jlajr!  That's exciting news that you will be a father!  Regarding your comments on the job loss, I hope you keep a very positive outlook on it.  Sounds like you stuck to your principles, did not compromise your beliefs at your employer's demand, and now have the opportunity to find a suitable replacement job that is a better match for you personally -- somewhere where their practices align with your own and they recognize the value in having an employee who speaks up.
Thank you, LeRainDrop.

Because I thought the team was managed well, and because I felt my salary was not as important to me as proper management, a little over two years ago:
So, yes, when they fired the manager who hired me and said it was for cost-cutting reasons - Hello, integrity gap! - and made other bone-headed decisions, yes, I was likely more sensitive than others, and more sensitive than I might have been if they were paying me my wider-Israeli-market worth.

Now having gone through similar situations at two successive companies, I'm fairly certain that my proper-management-is-more-important-than-money belief is out the window. Even if the team is managed well today, that could change at any time. What remains when that happens are the relationships with coworkers and how well the salary is achieving my other goals.

BTW I'm not married. It is not me and my wife expecting a child.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Metric Mouse on June 05, 2016, 12:52:35 AM
I did not forget the sarcasm tag.  It's more like I failed at not needing it.

Love it...
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: BTDretire on June 05, 2016, 04:07:43 PM
Nonetheless, congratulations to you, jlajr!  That's exciting news that you will be a father! 
Quote
BTW I'm not married. It is not me and my wife expecting a child.

I have a feeling there are forum members that know something you haven't found out yet.
Let us know if it's a boy or a girl!
                         :-)
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: jlajr on June 05, 2016, 09:13:23 PM
I have a feeling there are forum members that know something you haven't found out yet.
Let us know if it's a boy or a girl!
                         :-)

LOL
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Racer X on June 06, 2016, 07:49:28 AM
My story is an in-progress story.

Currently I'm working for a job that I really like and have a good team but we have a 'supervisory' manager from another company that has the most combative and rude management style that I have ever experienced. I can't say that every day is an epic FU Money Story what I do have is the confidence that if I were fired I would be fine and my wife is a-ok with us making a dramatic change at any moment.

My entire team is constantly berated and told we are doing things wrong and the smalllllest little thing becomes an hour to two hour long tirade on why everything we do is always wrong. *note* 95% of the time everything is completely unfounded. Within my first 6 months I was threatened to be fired over 30 times - I stopped counting. After the third or fourth threatening I said, 'Yes, by all means. After you do that we can go out and have a few drinks. However this this and this is wrong and I'm very busy." He attempted a few more times to try and scare me in to place before realizing that I had no fear. Now, while he still threatens to fire he's also decided that he likes me and is trying to get me promoted within my own company or brought over to his company.

Having enough money to comfortably walk away at any time has just turned the constant idiocy in to a laughing matter. Unfortunately my coworkers are not in the same position so they feel much more stress and anxiety. While this manager does make days longer and harder to get my work done I'm able to speak my mind and do my damn job all because of epic FU money and the confidence that it has brought.

EcoCanuck

Huh.  I wondered what had happened to my old boss...

Seriously - sounds just like someone for which I worked.  Came in with very little knowledge of the business, threatened lots of employees, and cleared house on those she didn't like.  I made it a practice to absolutely ignore her whenever possible.  The one time I was threatened, I think I just snorted and said something to the effect of, "Yeah, sure, good luck with that as your strategy."  The next thing I knew I was on the fast track for a promotion and most of my colleagues had been fired.  One guy had even been driven to a heart attack!  It was a very strange couple of years.   
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Shane on June 06, 2016, 03:49:03 PM
I have a feeling there are forum members that know something you haven't found out yet.
Let us know if it's a boy or a girl!
                         :-)

LOL

JLAIII?
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: SwordGuy on June 06, 2016, 05:24:22 PM
Now having gone through similar situations at two successive companies, I'm fairly certain that my proper-management-is-more-important-than-money belief is out the window. Even if the team is managed well today, that could change at any time. What remains when that happens are the relationships with coworkers and how well the salary is achieving my other goals.

SwordGuy's Law of Management Ability:

"There are up to three layers of management above you that can impact your job on a daily basis.   Over a 5 year period of time, one of them is statistically certain to be horrible at their job."


SwordGuy's Pain Theory of Management:

When faced with a long term, ongoing problem, it's generally because those who cause the problem do not feel the pain of the situation.   The only way to fix the problem is to transfer the pain back to those who cause it.



Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: jlajr on June 06, 2016, 09:07:28 PM
JLAIII?

:)

The thought has never occurred to me. Leonard - and not even as a tribute to an ancestor or relative? I don't think so.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: jlajr on June 06, 2016, 09:37:48 PM
SwordGuy's Law of Management Ability:

"There are up to three layers of management above you that can impact your job on a daily basis.   Over a 5 year period of time, one of them is statistically certain to be horrible at their job."


SwordGuy's Pain Theory of Management:

When faced with a long term, ongoing problem, it's generally because those who cause the problem do not feel the pain of the situation.   The only way to fix the problem is to transfer the pain back to those who cause it.

Amen on both accounts, SwordGuy.

I think I was trying to transfer the pain back to those who caused it, including the HR department. It's possible the HR department was simply waiting for someone to report I had done something wrong. Probably didn't help that one of the things I had done was report HR's failures to the division president and vice president.

I'm quite a piece of work, I tell ya.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: gggggg on June 07, 2016, 06:18:30 PM
My sister worked at a drug store in high school. The manager pissed her off one day, and after telling him to F-off, she walked down the aisles and just scooped all kinds of items off the shelves, onto the floor, with her arms. Surprisingly, they didn't call the cops.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Threshkin on June 08, 2016, 08:54:38 AM
My sister worked at a drug store in high school. The manager pissed her off one day, and after telling him to F-off, she walked down the aisles and just scooped all kinds of items off the shelves, onto the floor, with her arms. Surprisingly, they didn't call the cops.

That is vandalism.  They should have called the cops.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Kitsune on June 08, 2016, 10:04:36 AM
My sister worked at a drug store in high school. The manager pissed her off one day, and after telling him to F-off, she walked down the aisles and just scooped all kinds of items off the shelves, onto the floor, with her arms. Surprisingly, they didn't call the cops.

That's... not great. No real inconvenience to the manger, high risk of getting arrested for vandalism, and, best-case scenario, she just created a hell of a lot of work for other low-paid schlubs still stuck working with the manager.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: vern on June 08, 2016, 04:05:08 PM
My sister worked at a drug store in high school. The manager pissed her off one day, and after telling him to F-off, she walked down the aisles and just scooped all kinds of items off the shelves, onto the floor, with her arms. Surprisingly, they didn't call the cops.

I knew this sounded familiar!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g4e6-QtDRkI
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: gggggg on June 08, 2016, 07:09:12 PM
I'm sure she didn't care at the time. BTW, I am a cop (wasn't then though).
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: FIRE me on June 09, 2016, 08:58:44 AM
My entire team is constantly berated and told we are doing things wrong and the smalllllest little thing becomes an hour to two hour long tirade on why everything we do is always wrong.
Tabs vs. spaces?

Spaces, never tabs!

(You must be a software developer to understand this one)

Tabs, never spaces!

You must know how to create Usenet newsgroups to understand this one.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Rural on June 09, 2016, 01:54:33 PM
My entire team is constantly berated and told we are doing things wrong and the smalllllest little thing becomes an hour to two hour long tirade on why everything we do is always wrong.
Tabs vs. spaces?

Spaces, never tabs!

(You must be a software developer to understand this one)

Tabs, never spaces!

You must know how to create Usenet newsgroups to understand this one.


Argh!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: BTDretire on June 10, 2016, 12:27:35 PM
My entire team is constantly berated and told we are doing things wrong and the smalllllest little thing becomes an hour to two hour long tirade on why everything we do is always wrong.
Tabs vs. spaces?

Spaces, never tabs!

(You must be a software developer to understand this one)

Tabs, never spaces!

You must know how to create Usenet newsgroups to understand this one.

 I'll bet 1/2 the people on this group don't know what a Usenet newsgroup is.
I frequent several everyday, but I have read them long enough to see many that were
useful, are no longer as busy as they used to be. Still some to enjoy though.

And I don't know the tabs/spaces distinction!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: JLee on June 10, 2016, 12:40:50 PM
My entire team is constantly berated and told we are doing things wrong and the smalllllest little thing becomes an hour to two hour long tirade on why everything we do is always wrong.
Tabs vs. spaces?

Spaces, never tabs!

(You must be a software developer to understand this one)

Tabs, never spaces!

You must know how to create Usenet newsgroups to understand this one.

 I'll bet 1/2 the people on this group don't know what a Usenet newsgroup is.
I frequent several everyday, but I have read them long enough to see many that were
useful, are no longer as busy as they used to be. Still some to enjoy though.

And I don't know the tabs/spaces distinction!

I didn't know they were still a thing!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Sibley on June 10, 2016, 12:54:49 PM
My entire team is constantly berated and told we are doing things wrong and the smalllllest little thing becomes an hour to two hour long tirade on why everything we do is always wrong.
Tabs vs. spaces?

Spaces, never tabs!

(You must be a software developer to understand this one)

Tabs, never spaces!

You must know how to create Usenet newsgroups to understand this one.

 I'll bet 1/2 the people on this group don't know what a Usenet newsgroup is.
I frequent several everyday, but I have read them long enough to see many that were
useful, are no longer as busy as they used to be. Still some to enjoy though.

And I don't know the tabs/spaces distinction!

I didn't know they were still a thing!

If you're working in Word or similar, tabs. Because it looks more professional. If you're talking about programming - I neither know, nor care, and I really wish you'd post some funny FU stories instead.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Threshkin on June 10, 2016, 06:40:04 PM
My entire team is constantly berated and told we are doing things wrong and the smalllllest little thing becomes an hour to two hour long tirade on why everything we do is always wrong.
Tabs vs. spaces?

Spaces, never tabs!

(You must be a software developer to understand this one)

Tabs, never spaces!

You must know how to create Usenet newsgroups to understand this one.

 I'll bet 1/2 the people on this group don't know what a Usenet newsgroup is.
I frequent several everyday, but I have read them long enough to see many that were
useful, are no longer as busy as they used to be. Still some to enjoy though.

And I don't know the tabs/spaces distinction!

Usenet!  Noobs

Anyone remember FidoNet?
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: LeRainDrop on June 10, 2016, 08:19:23 PM
If you're working in Word or similar, tabs. Because it looks more professional. If you're talking about programming - I neither know, nor care, and I really wish you'd post some funny FU stories instead.

For the love of god, yes please to epic FU money stories.  Foamy tab spaces need not apply.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: radram on June 10, 2016, 08:36:33 PM
Anyone hear of the programming language whitespace?
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Whitespace_%28programming_language%29

Why can't we all just get along?


+1 for more stories.


radram
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: shelivesthedream on June 11, 2016, 01:26:19 AM
Last night I dreamed I had an epic FU story. I dreamed I was running an art project at my old school with all the people I was at school with, which was a lot like one I am doing in real life. It was awful and they were all mean to me and eventually in a crowded room of them, I just yelled, "I QUIT!" and stormed out. They all laughed and said I'd be back but I just kept on walking and got on the bus and then for some reason took a train to Spain. That's where the director of the project (who I do actually really like) caught up with me and begged me to come back and I said "Not for a million pounds!" And he offered two million and I said OK. So I went back and did crafts with the school bullies for a week and got paid £2m. Then I woke up and the triumphant feeling when I yelled "I QUIT!" remained and I had to check in with myself that I had not in fact quit anything.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: radram on June 11, 2016, 07:02:03 AM
Last night I dreamed I had an epic FU story. I dreamed I was running an art project at my old school with all the people I was at school with, which was a lot like one I am doing in real life. It was awful and they were all mean to me and eventually in a crowded room of them, I just yelled, "I QUIT!" and stormed out. They all laughed and said I'd be back but I just kept on walking and got on the bus and then for some reason took a train to Spain. That's where the director of the project (who I do actually really like) caught up with me and begged me to come back and I said "Not for a million pounds!" And he offered two million and I said OK. So I went back and did crafts with the school bullies for a week and got paid £2m. Then I woke up and the triumphant feeling when I yelled "I QUIT!" remained and I had to check in with myself that I had not in fact quit anything.

Based on your name, maybe you are having a hard time differentiating between real life and sleep.  Are you SURE you didn't quit yesterday?

Great story just the same. 

radram
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: FIRE me on June 11, 2016, 08:13:49 AM

Usenet!  Noobs

Anyone remember FidoNet?
[/quote]

FidoNet is where we told the Usenet Noobs to go back to.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Chaplin on July 29, 2016, 11:02:54 PM

Usenet!  Noobs

Anyone remember FidoNet?

FidoNet is where we told the Usenet Noobs to go back to.

Pshaw! Remember the Kermit protocol for dial-up? Or Gopher? Or Mosaic?

Heck, I can still read a Vernier caliper, although my slide rule skills were never great and have almost vanished (I'm not so old that I actually needed to use one, but my father taught me how). Interestingly, Vernier scales are still around.

Mostly I just wanted to bump this thread so more awesome stories would be posted. This thread almost deserves to be a sticky. I managed to avoid having an Epic FU Money Story, which is a good thing I guess, but I can't get enough of other people's stories.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Primm on July 30, 2016, 05:03:08 AM

Usenet!  Noobs

Anyone remember FidoNet?

FidoNet is where we told the Usenet Noobs to go back to.

Pshaw! Remember the Kermit protocol for dial-up? Or Gopher? Or Mosaic?

Heck, I can still read a Vernier caliper, although my slide rule skills were never great and have almost vanished (I'm not so old that I actually needed to use one, but my father taught me how). Interestingly, Vernier scales are still around.

Mostly I just wanted to bump this thread so more awesome stories would be posted. This thread almost deserves to be a sticky. I managed to avoid having an Epic FU Money Story, which is a good thing I guess, but I can't get enough of other people's stories.
[/quote]

I own two sets of Vernier callipers, one manual set that are a bit out of calibration so there for looks only, and a newer digital set (yep, with a screen that gives me a measurement to one decimal place of a millimetre, plenty of accuracy for what I need!). I'm not sure how these are old-fashioned. Or is that just me?
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: CowboyAndIndian on July 30, 2016, 06:28:09 AM

I own two sets of Vernier callipers, one manual set that are a bit out of calibration so there for looks only, and a newer digital set (yep, with a screen that gives me a measurement to one decimal place of a millimetre, plenty of accuracy for what I need!). I'm not sure how these are old-fashioned. Or is that just me?

Damn, we are all dating ourselves!

I've been on the Internet since 1988, about 5 years before the web. We knew most of the posters on Usenet.

And then AOL opened the floodgates and the unwashed hordes poured in ;-)

PS: Primm/Chaplin, I still have my slide rule and vernier calipers.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Rollin on July 30, 2016, 06:56:42 AM
Last night I dreamed I had an epic FU story. I dreamed I was running an art project at my old school with all the people I was at school with, which was a lot like one I am doing in real life. It was awful and they were all mean to me and eventually in a crowded room of them, I just yelled, "I QUIT!" and stormed out. They all laughed and said I'd be back but I just kept on walking and got on the bus and then for some reason took a train to Spain. That's where the director of the project (who I do actually really like) caught up with me and begged me to come back and I said "Not for a million pounds!" And he offered two million and I said OK. So I went back and did crafts with the school bullies for a week and got paid £2m. Then I woke up and the triumphant feeling when I yelled "I QUIT!" remained and I had to check in with myself that I had not in fact quit anything.

Based on your name, maybe you are having a hard time differentiating between real life and sleep.  Are you SURE you didn't quit yesterday?

Great story just the same. 

radram

I LOLd when you said OK to 2 mill. I would too.

The rest of the foamers, get a room (or start your own thread).
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Rubic on July 30, 2016, 07:25:02 AM
I've been on the Internet since 1988, about 5 years before the web. We knew most of the posters on Usenet.

Me: Since 1985, when I was the Systems Manager at a major university. My boss was the former head of DARPA.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Rollin on July 30, 2016, 07:52:13 AM
I've been on the Internet since 1988, about 5 years before the web. We knew most of the posters on Usenet.

Me: Since 1985, when I was the Systems Manager at a major university. My boss was the former head of DARPA.

Pretty cool epic FU story there!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: dignam on July 30, 2016, 03:17:53 PM
What a great thread.  I'm blessed to work with great co workers (I don't have a problem with any of them) in a very laid back office.  Boss is very easy to work for, lets you do your thing and offers guidance.  Pay is decent, maybe on the lower side but I'm ok with that.

So, I don't have any great FU stories, but since this thread is in a bit of rut for stories, I'll offer a firing story that I was involved in.

Background: worker in question was lady in her mid fifties, morbidly obese and no one really liked working with her.  Terribly negative attitude, and last straw was something she said to a customer I think.  I didn't regularly work with her, much less for her, but in all my dealings she just rubbed me the wrong way.

I came in one morning and my boss called me in to his office.  I have root access to all of our production servers and databases, so he wanted me to cut her access and logins at the exact moment they fired her on the phone.  There was something...incredibly satisfying about the coordination and timing involved.  Cherry on top was that she was a shitty employee.  She was apparently "shocked" we would cut her off like that. 

Anyway, let this teach you folks with terrible attitudes to have some FU money ready in case you get "blind sided" one morning ;)
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: arebelspy on July 30, 2016, 05:52:30 PM
I've been on the Internet since 1988, about 5 years before the web. We knew most of the posters on Usenet.

And then AOL opened the floodgates and the unwashed hordes poured in ;-)

This is known as Eternal September (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eternal_September).  :D
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: ender on July 30, 2016, 06:16:16 PM
I've been on the Internet since 1988, about 5 years before the web. We knew most of the posters on Usenet.

And then AOL opened the floodgates and the unwashed hordes poured in ;-)

This is known as Eternal September (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eternal_September).  :D

+1. Was going to post that, but hey someone else did!

Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: TomTX on July 31, 2016, 07:40:54 AM
I've been on the Internet since 1988, about 5 years before the web. We knew most of the posters on Usenet.

And then AOL opened the floodgates and the unwashed hordes poured in ;-)

This is known as Eternal September (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eternal_September).  :D

I was there, man! It just never ended! You couldn't educate them!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: BlueHouse on July 31, 2016, 05:44:27 PM

This is known as Eternal September (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eternal_September).  :D

WHOA!   Reb, I didn't recognize your avatar. 
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: happy on August 01, 2016, 07:13:50 AM
Looks different without the sunnies, eh?
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: CowboyAndIndian on August 01, 2016, 07:16:50 AM
I've been on the Internet since 1988, about 5 years before the web. We knew most of the posters on Usenet.

And then AOL opened the floodgates and the unwashed hordes poured in ;-)

This is known as Eternal September (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eternal_September).  :D

We used to call them "A**holes On Line" ...

ARS, did not recognize that picture.... I like the one with the shades...
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: CowboyAndIndian on August 01, 2016, 07:40:24 AM
I've been on the Internet since 1988, about 5 years before the web. We knew most of the posters on Usenet.

Me: Since 1985, when I was the Systems Manager at a major university. My boss was the former head of DARPA.

Pretty cool epic FU story there!

Since I derailed this thread, i will try to get it back on track  ;-). Here's my FU story.

I was working in one of the big Wall St. firms as a consultant in 2005 when my contract ended (no worries, I had been there longer than a lot of employees). One of my previous colleagues offered me a job at another big bank/securities firm, so I accepted and she ended up becoming my manager.

The first few  months were good. Was discovering that the code was written by people who should never be allowed near code. It was so bad, so I started working on it. I started making a big difference (very few people who can pick up C++ programs where the code base is un-commented and large in size) and was appreciated by all of the other folks I worked with.

My manager who was really cool in the beginning, appreciating my work had a 180 degree change in her attitude.
It almost felt like her primary job function at this time was to make my life miserable. A month or two after I started getting the treatment, I talked to DW and told her I could not take it any more. Later on, thru common friends, I found out that she was going thru a messy divorce and I guess I was the nearest male she could vent her frustration on.

At this time, we had zero mortgage, no debts, enough FU money in the bank and a my DW had a pretty stable job. So, with DW's blessing, I handed in my two weeks notice. It was like kicking a wasps nest. I got called by other managers offering me a job. The Managing Director called me in and asked me to take back the resignation. I was burnt out, that I did not take back my resignation.

The next couple of months were wonderful. Slept late, studied and did not put in any job applications. Finally got a job after the two month break.

The power of FU money is awesome.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: LeRainDrop on August 01, 2016, 10:41:44 AM
My manager who was really cool in the beginning, appreciating my work had a 180 degree change in her attitude.
It almost felt like her primary job function at this time was to make my life miserable. A month or two after I started getting the treatment, I talked to DW and told her I could not take it any more. Later on, thru common friends, I found out that she was going thru a messy divorce and I guess I was the nearest male she could vent her frustration on.
. . .
The next couple of months were wonderful. Slept late, studied and did not put in any job applications. Finally got a job after the two month break.

The power of FU money is awesome.

Cowboy, I can totally relate to that scenario -- my biggest advocate became the biggest bully.  Like you said, "It almost felt like her primary job function at this time was to make my life miserable."  In her case, she felt forced to come back to work after a one-year personal leave because her husband had just been unexpectedly laid off from his job.  And this happened just days after she had formally resigned from the firm after she got into a negotiations-fight with them over hours and title.  Had to come back with her tail between her legs, and she was none too happy that I had continued to advance in the year she was gone, therefore "threatening" her position.  Fast forward a couple years, and I'm now on "summer vacation," enjoying the good life like you did.  I loved your story.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: CowboyAndIndian on August 01, 2016, 03:02:18 PM
My manager who was really cool in the beginning, appreciating my work had a 180 degree change in her attitude.
It almost felt like her primary job function at this time was to make my life miserable. A month or two after I started getting the treatment, I talked to DW and told her I could not take it any more. Later on, thru common friends, I found out that she was going thru a messy divorce and I guess I was the nearest male she could vent her frustration on.
. . .
The next couple of months were wonderful. Slept late, studied and did not put in any job applications. Finally got a job after the two month break.

The power of FU money is awesome.

Cowboy, I can totally relate to that scenario -- my biggest advocate became the biggest bully.  Like you said, "It almost felt like her primary job function at this time was to make my life miserable."  In her case, she felt forced to come back to work after a one-year personal leave because her husband had just been unexpectedly laid off from his job.  And this happened just days after she had formally resigned from the firm after she got into a negotiations-fight with them over hours and title.  Had to come back with her tail between her legs, and she was none too happy that I had continued to advance in the year she was gone, therefore "threatening" her position.  Fast forward a couple years, and I'm now on "summer vacation," enjoying the good life like you did.  I loved your story.

Thanks LeRainDrop. Loved your story too.

How wonderful that walk away from the office was! I left at 3pm, when the streets of midtown NYC only had tourists and I walked all the way to Penn Station. Few butterflies in my stomach, but a huge load off my shoulders.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: jlajr on August 18, 2016, 11:22:05 PM
Few butterflies in my stomach, but a huge load off my shoulders.
Yep, exactly.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: ducky19 on August 19, 2016, 11:47:05 AM
Was forwarded this email yesterday from an engineer at our company who had finally had enough. I looked up the people he refers to and it's all legit. Pretty epic way to walk if you ask me! Names changed to protect the innocent.

"Date:        08/01/2016 06:02 AM
Subject:        Letter of Resignation (and so much more)



To whom it may concern:

First the formal part...

This letter is to tender my resignation from XYZ as of 6:00 AM Monday August 1, 2016.  Before 6:00 AM I was an engineer for XYZ.  Based on today's work, I expect my health insurance to continue through the end of August 2016. 

Now for the fun part...

Why did I quit?  What would drive an engineering tech lead for an incredibly successful machine , (sold out for the year by the beginning of July!), to quit XYZ? 
 
I'll explain this, but I'll do so in a way that Millennials would understand.  How does one communicate to Millennials?  Why it's simple, through youtube videos, GIFs, and internet memes.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KJtrLKGZZFg

As this move progresses, and more people begin to find other opportunities and say goodbye the only way they know how:


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3eGJOqMHsDI

(BTW my middle finger extends especially high to Rob, Nicole, and Paul.  You were horrible to work with and relied on the shoulders of engineering to do your jobs for you and point out where you were absolutely worthless.)

The group will continue to spiral downhill and lose the people that actually do the work! Soon, Krishna, Klaus, and Tom this is who you'll be leading...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bj563ViG7Qg

Krishna, in the future, it would be best to not cancel your all employee meetings because it's summer, people are on vacation, and you're SO busy moving.  You don't get bumped up two salary grades and get to do things like that... if you continue with a leadership style like that, you may have to take that hope of creating a crown jewel by taking one of your motivational emails and... well...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O42K4EwVssQ

And Klaus, you're welcome for giving you the ABC which is saving sales.  Since you are only capable of listening to those that are yelling at you the loudest at any given time, here goes: YOU ONLY GOT THAT JOB BECAUSE YOU SPEAK GERMAN.  The reality is you're a horrible product manager.  You decided not to fund the ABC even though customers are buying them like crazy.  You also decided to send Rob to represent the ABC at the conference in Vegas rather than me to please your BFF Heiko.  Rob, a guy who didn't know how to look up a drawing until recently, over a tech lead who delivered you a machine on time, on cost, and on quality targets.

(https://i.imgflip.com/zt8lj.jpg)

And Tom, so, yeah, well, you know, you're a guy from Cali-Iowa, who, you know, yeah, well

(http://s2.quickmeme.com/img/fe/fea33a0a86dd60f9c0112bc785e0119ec3542a8cbf69ec042aa0e418b458680c.jpg)

Only in a company like XYZ could a VP of a group losing millions of dollars a quarter still be allowed to continue on with his idea to move a huge group of employees, and only that company would think the plan would work and be successful.  Although I'm sure if you pull the critical OPACC levers and execute on your winning playbook everyone will be non-monetarily compensated for their hard work.

Finally to my colleagues (those of you below a salary grade XX), you can find a job that pays you as much as XYZ, who's benefits are just as good, and who's business cycle won't be like riding a roller-coaster.  I would gladly review anyone's resume and give you numerous websites for job hunting.  I can be reached at the email listed in the CC of this email.  I hope this email will give you something to laugh about and motivate you to look for other opportunities on an otherwise dismal day at the office.

For those frothing at the mouth and grinding your teeth, remember, I have brain cancer, and I'll probably be dead way before you.  (I thank whatever gods may be that I'll die in Wisconsin and not there.)
 
I'll think back at my time at XYZ as I play hockey with my kids on my backyard rink during the winter, sit on the beaches of Lake Michigan on a reasonably hot summer day, enjoy the great bands at Summerfest, and visit with my family (several times a year) that are only a car ride away.

I haven't felt this good since the first time I quit XYZ and was able to get out of town and back to Wisconsin.  (On a side note, the reason I'm giving such short notice is that the last time I quit, I was walked out and not paid for that time.  For those that find something in the future, keep this in mind.  You are nothing to XYZ, just a number.  They won't extend any courtesies to you.  They can fire you at any moment, so you have the right to walk out at any moment.)

"There is no point in looking back. Fuck no, not today, thank you kindly. My heart is filled with joy.  I felt like a monster reincarnation of Horatio Alger:  A man on the move, and just sick enough to be totally confident." -Hunter S. Thompson

Pure Gonzo Engineering

And for those worried about that bridge behind me... well, there's an internet meme for that too...

(http://i1.wp.com/www.thereviewsarein.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/09/may-the-bridges-i-burn-combo.png?w=604)

(In this day and age, I conclude this email with the disclaimer that there is NO intention to communicate violence or destruction of property.  This is true for any statements, videos, meme, or gifs in this email.  The intent is to speak in metaphors for the sake of humor.  No actual violence or destruction of property is implied or intended.)
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: aetherie on August 19, 2016, 11:52:12 AM
That... was... epic.

Does he actually have brain cancer? :(
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: ducky19 on August 19, 2016, 11:55:12 AM
That I don't know, but since the rest of the letter seemed legit I would guess that he does. I realize this isn't your typical FU money story, although I like to think that he had a big enough 'stache that he can live out the rest of his days in comfort.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: G-dog on August 19, 2016, 11:59:36 AM
Oh Ducky19, we have to get this guy some great booze to enjoy!  EPIC! Totally motherfucking epic!

I'll chip in on some booze - I am serious, PM me
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: CowboyAndIndian on August 19, 2016, 12:12:19 PM
Oh Ducky19, we have to get this guy some great booze to enjoy!  EPIC! Totally motherfucking epic!

I'll chip in on some booze - I am serious, PM me

+100

Absoutely. I will chip in too!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Hvillian on August 19, 2016, 12:13:28 PM
That... was... epic.

Does he actually have brain cancer? :(
Exactly.  Epic, then, um . . . brain cancer.  Ah shit.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: ducky19 on August 19, 2016, 12:17:22 PM
I don't know the guy personally (huge company), otherwise I'd have already bought him a bottle. This was just forwarded to me by a friend.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: G-dog on August 19, 2016, 12:18:16 PM
Contact the friend that the Internet hordes are feeling generous!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: dividendman on August 19, 2016, 12:19:39 PM
Wow, amazing.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: ducky19 on August 19, 2016, 12:34:02 PM
Contact the friend that the Internet hordes are feeling generous!

It was already a third generation forward by the time he got it - it's kind of satisfying though that such an epic email is spreading like wildfire through a company of this size. I hope it inspires others to stop and consider their options. I know it has for me!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: zephyr911 on August 19, 2016, 03:17:14 PM
Sweet Jesus that was epick. 99 points out of 100. (-1 because intergenerational shit-talk is beneath such a badass)
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: arebelspy on August 19, 2016, 03:55:35 PM
That was pretty good, thanks for sharing!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: okits on August 19, 2016, 11:43:50 PM
As someone too strategic diplomatic meek ruled by my Inner Bag Lady to burn a bridge, that was cathartic.  Thanks for posting.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Metric Mouse on August 20, 2016, 12:09:37 PM
As someone too strategic diplomatic meek ruled by my Inner Bag Lady to burn a bridge, that was cathartic.  Thanks for posting.

Nice.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Libertea on August 20, 2016, 06:17:15 PM
Didn't post here yet because it's taken me this long to get through all of the rest of your posts (skipping all the weird computer geek speak posts that I don't understand anyway, lol).  Here's my FU story.

Not long after getting out of college, I was working at a job that I liked with people I liked, except for the boss.  (Wow, how many stories here start out that way?)  We'll call him Bob.  Bob was a big bully.  Unfortunately for most of my coworkers, they weren't American citizens, and so basically if Bob fired them, they'd lose their work visas, and back to their home countries they'd have to go.  I, on the other hand, was and am an American citizen.  So on the day when I'd finally had enough of Bob and his bullying ways/unreasonable demands, I went to his office, told him that slavery was outlawed in this country in 1865, and I quit.  Bob was kind of sick of me by that point anyway, so I don't think he really cared all that much, except that I had also gotten one of my (non-American) coworkers riled up about how Bob was treating him.  Bob basically told my friend to go back home, because he (Bob) didn't care if he (my friend) got deported. 

I had no new job lined up at that point, but I didn't really care for myself.  I was young at the time (mid 20s), and I knew I could go stay with my family for a few months until I got a new job.  But there was no way I was going to let my friend get deported.  Nor was letting him go crawling back to Bob an acceptable outcome to me, either.  Bob was making overtures to my friend, telling my friend that if he basically agreed to toe the line, Bob would take him back and my friend wouldn't have to be deported back to his home country.  My friend, unsurprisingly, was scared and ready to cave.

Given this situation, it lit a fire (pun intended) under my butt.  I grabbed my friend, forbade him to go back to work for Bob, and started dragging him to talk to other bosses at the same company.  The two of us got new jobs with another group by the end of the day, and my friend did not have to go crawling back to Bob or go back to his home country because of losing his visa.  The new work group wound up being awesome for both my friend and me; we both liked our new boss way better than Bob.  Everyone in the whole place was talking about how all of Bob's employees were jumping ship.  (After my friend and I left, one other employee of his also changed groups.)

I still ran into Bob occasionally afterward, and he and I would always be syrupy sweet to each other.  But I heard through the grapevine that Bob was pretty pissed about me getting my friend out of his (Bob's) clutches.  Like I said, I don't think Bob cared about losing me from his group, but he was not happy about losing my friend.  I, on the other hand, feel like saving my friend from Bob is one of the top five things I've done in my lifetime that really helped someone/made a difference in their life.  And while I won't deny being glad that it pissed Bob off, I'm more proud of the fact that I stopped him (Bob) from abusing my friend and ruining his (my friend's) life.

FWIW, my friend now has a green card and is married with a child, working for a different company and in no danger of being deported by a bad boss. :-)
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: arebelspy on August 20, 2016, 06:48:26 PM
Way to go Libertea!  That's a good story.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Paul der Krake on August 20, 2016, 07:07:58 PM
There is a special place in hell for bosses who leverage work papers for submission.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: LeRainDrop on August 20, 2016, 07:37:27 PM
Way to go, Libertea!  It really is awesome that you stepped up for your friend in that situation.  Bob can go to hell.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: jlajr on August 20, 2016, 10:45:14 PM
I don't know if I mentioned this on this thread before, but I find it incredible that some people - managers and colleagues - behave or speak at work in a way that they would, presumably, not behave or speak outside of work.

For better or worse, I guess I have difficulty adapting my behavior or speech to circumstances. If someone I meet (outside work) is an ass or we simply don't get along, I likely wouldn't become friends with that person. Similarly, why should I work for someone who is an ass or with whom I don't get along?
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Libertea on August 21, 2016, 12:12:56 AM
There is a special place in hell for bosses who leverage work papers for submission.
Agree.  I wasn't really all that angry for myself, because I had the option to walk away from the job at any time with no repercussions besides financial repercussions since I'm a citizen.  I was fed up enough to be fine with the idea of quitting and just drifting for a bit.  But I did get angry about the injustice of how being fired for challenging Bob would affect my non-citizen friend.  So in a way, he (my friend) helped me too, because I would not have been nearly as motivated to look for a new position right away if I hadn't been worried for what would happen to my friend.  Plus, my friend is one of those totally laid back nice guys that everyone likes.  He worked hard and wasn't a troublemaker like me.  He definitely didn't deserve to have Bob treat him like that.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Neustache on August 21, 2016, 06:55:13 AM
That really puts a dark spin on all the companies trying to hire those with work-visas.  Hadn't thought about how much they could hold over their employees' heads.  Ugh. 
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: AlanStache on August 22, 2016, 12:17:55 PM
That really puts a dark spin on all the companies trying to hire those with work-visas.  Hadn't thought about how much they could hold over their employees' heads.  Ugh.

Go have a look at the search results for "bill gates h1b visa".  Would assume things are common similar at other companies.

Not sure I have a good solution but is a messy system.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: nobodyspecial on August 22, 2016, 12:27:30 PM
Go have a look at the search results for "bill gates h1b visa".  Would assume things are common at other companies.

Not sure I have a good solution but is a messy system.
It's a brilliant system (*). You get to hire cheap workers who can't complain or move to another job.
You get to use the lower wages as a lever on your other workers and get to complain that you can't find qualified staff.
For really qualified foreign workers you have to open an office in another country, but that's ok because you can use that to avoid tax.

* - assuming you are a major multinational corporation. If you are a small company, a startup, a foreign STEM graduate, or an employee it sucks. But hey if you want change buy your own congressman.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: nobodyspecial on August 23, 2016, 08:33:58 PM
A professor once brought up the topic of unemployment (it might have been an economics class), and how it can be bad, etc.... that means that out of 30 of us in this class, 27 of us will have jobs. Why are we worried again?"
If you are in a class with a professor, the 10% unemployment rate probably doesn't apply to you anyway.
It's like being told the life expectancy in some famine struck African country
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: ender on August 23, 2016, 09:11:40 PM
A professor once brought up the topic of unemployment (it might have been an economics class), and how it can be bad, etc.... that means that out of 30 of us in this class, 27 of us will have jobs. Why are we worried again?"
If you are in a class with a professor, the 10% unemployment rate probably doesn't apply to you anyway.
It's like being told the life expectancy in some famine struck African country

I suspect that graduates with a 4-year degree would be hit disproportionately  hard if unemployment was 10%.

Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Bikeguy on August 23, 2016, 09:25:40 PM
A professor once brought up the topic of unemployment (it might have been an economics class), and how it can be bad, etc.... that means that out of 30 of us in this class, 27 of us will have jobs. Why are we worried again?"
If you are in a class with a professor, the 10% unemployment rate probably doesn't apply to you anyway.
It's like being told the life expectancy in some famine struck African country

I suspect that graduates with a 4-year degree would be hit disproportionately  hard if unemployment was 10%.
In Michigan,  those with high school degrees were hit the hardest.  College degrees were fine.   Grad degrees even better. College degree unemployment rate was lower than overall rate.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: JCfire on August 24, 2016, 07:01:29 AM
A professor once brought up the topic of unemployment (it might have been an economics class), and how it can be bad, etc.... that means that out of 30 of us in this class, 27 of us will have jobs. Why are we worried again?"
If you are in a class with a professor, the 10% unemployment rate probably doesn't apply to you anyway.
It's like being told the life expectancy in some famine struck African country

I suspect that graduates with a 4-year degree would be hit disproportionately  hard if unemployment was 10%.

We don't have explicit data on that, because the highest educational category on the unemployment survey is "Bachelors Degree and Higher".  But when unemployment was 10% back in 2009, unemployment in that category was only 5%.  Way more than half the total people in that category have exactly a bachelor's degree -- masters' and PHDs are a small minority of the group.  So I can safely infer that unemployment among people with a bachelors' degree is generally lower than general population unemployment.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: ender on August 24, 2016, 07:26:11 AM
We don't have explicit data on that, because the highest educational category on the unemployment survey is "Bachelors Degree and Higher".  But when unemployment was 10% back in 2009, unemployment in that category was only 5%.  Way more than half the total people in that category have exactly a bachelor's degree -- masters' and PHDs are a small minority of the group.  So I can safely infer that unemployment among people with a bachelors' degree is generally lower than general population unemployment.

However, the demographic in question is "about to graduate bachelors" students -- not overall bachelors holders.

Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: mtn on August 24, 2016, 07:51:16 AM
We don't have explicit data on that, because the highest educational category on the unemployment survey is "Bachelors Degree and Higher".  But when unemployment was 10% back in 2009, unemployment in that category was only 5%.  Way more than half the total people in that category have exactly a bachelor's degree -- masters' and PHDs are a small minority of the group.  So I can safely infer that unemployment among people with a bachelors' degree is generally lower than general population unemployment.

However, the demographic in question is "about to graduate bachelors" students -- not overall bachelors holders.

I could be wrong here, but don't people who have never held a job (i.e. some about to graduate bachelors students) not count towards the unemployment rate?
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: zephyr911 on August 24, 2016, 03:03:56 PM
I, on the other hand, feel like saving my friend from Bob is one of the top five things I've done in my lifetime that really helped someone/made a difference in their life.

I concur, and that's fucking amazing. Hats off to you.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: BlueHouse on August 25, 2016, 01:50:26 PM
Quick, someone post an epic FU money story!

Check back with me later this month.   
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: aetherie on August 25, 2016, 01:55:24 PM
Quick, someone post an epic FU money story!

Check back with me later this month.

*grabs popcorn*
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Mother Fussbudget on August 25, 2016, 02:48:00 PM
Recently discovered this thread... and *BOY* do I have a few EPIC FU stories to impart.

Aside:  I never call these idiot managers 'Assholes', because EVERYONE has an asshole, and I have more respect for my asshole than I do for these clowns.  Where would we be if human beings DIDN'T have assholes?  Asshats would be a better term...
But I prefer the term Tina Fey coined:  Asshair.  Everyone has ass-hairs, and NOBODY likes them.

Asshair#1:  Calera (1990)
I was commuting 1.5hrs/day from Fremont to Santa Clara, working 10 hour days as a software test lead on a Windows based Optical Character Recognition program 'TopScan for Windows'.  Scan a printed page, or put a PDF image thru this program, and get a Microsoft Word document.  The character recognition engine was fine - it was the Windows application that needed LOTS of work.  After my team did a 2-day acceptance test, we found enough defects that we determined we would need 3 months of testing (different scanners, printers, etc) to get 'TopScan' into shape for launch.  Asshair VP of Engineering went BALLISTIC, screamed, yelled, profanity laced diatribe... the works. 

BUT... Developers, and my Test Manager in the room all agreed with my team's assessment. 

Finally Asshair said "It has to be done in a month - no flexibility.  Can we do it in 1 month?"  So I came up with a 24/7, 3-shift testing rotation where we would divide the existing test resources into teams, and test around the clock.  Asshair took the plan to the President.  Response comes back that a 24/7 schedule would be too stressful on the team members.  I came back with a 2-shift solution - 6am-3pm, and 3pm-midnight, thus the "Day Hawks" and the "Night Hawks" were born.  We did it - worked around the clock, another test lead handled the morning team, I handled the evening team, and reported up for all teams at EOD (sometimes as late as 3am).  Three weeks later, we're ready to ship.  That plan saved the project, and made TopScan a successful launch.  Let the promotions begin! 

Former Test Manager wanted to become a developer - boom - happily transferred. I was promoted to Test Manager!
Soon after, I got a call from a head-hunter / recruiter who wanted to place me as a Senior Quality Assurance (test) Engineer with a company making a well known presentation graphics program (think 'Harvard Graphics' competitor) - a software giant (SG) based in WA but with a small artsy group in CA.  I said, "Thanks but no thanks".  I was happy with Calera, and wanted to bask in the success.

Then we waited to see if sales would help the company's bottom line. At the same time, we started work on TopScan for Macintosh.  I brought in my personal Macintosh desktop machine to help defer company costs - one less test machine to purchase.  Some, but not as many, problems were found in the acceptance tests, so a shorter test cycle was needed, but before we could really get started, sales results for TopScan for Windows were in, and were not impressive. 

Layoffs would be next.  We would mothball development until end of summer, giving sales a chance to kick in, and bring in revenue. once sales had a chance to pick up.  Asshair said I could only keep only 1 of our 14 contract testers during the layoff period, and could try to hire them back in the fall.  I thought about it, and asked if I could instead put ALL contractors on a part time basis, have 1 person on a mostly full-time basis, and keep 13 of them one-hour a week, or less, just to keep them on the payroll - the idea would save paperwork, and be a way to keep the team available when we needed them in a month or two.  After all, this team had saved the company's bacon, and shipped a high-quality world class product, they deserved more than a kick in the pants, AND we needed their expertise for the upcoming test effort.  The development manager liked the idea, my former manager liked the idea.  Asshair... not so much. 

Two days later, there was an off-site manager meeting held to discuss the upcoming layoffs. 
All my peer managers were invited, but I was *NOT* invited.  The writing was on the wall. 

Soon I was called into Asshair's office, and greeted with:  "As you know, we're having layoffs, and you've been affected".
I was stunned.  I said I would be happy to do whatever was needed, if we needed to layoff the 13 folks, that would be workable, and I'd be happy to help - he said, "Oh, your help won't be needed - that's already happened".   Since I rode the bus to work, I had to ride the bus home, pick up my car, and come BACK to pick-up my personal computer.  During the double-double-commute, I had time to think, and realized that I'd worked my butt off for months only to be shown the door.  ONLY THEN did I realize how overwhelming the work had been for MONTHS.  I needed a break, and was happy for the chance to get my head together.  I had FU money, and a newish economy car - ROAD TRIP?  I started planning a cross-country road-trip that day.  I gathered my stuff, and went home without further incident.

The NEXT MORNING... (can you guess?)

The recruiter for artsy-SG making the world's leading presentation graphics program called me AT HOME, and asked if I might still be interested in the SG job.  I said, yes, but asked how she got my number.  Evidently two developers who also got the boot that day were already in touch with this recruiter, and BOTH said the BEST PERSON who was laid off was *ME*.  I was embarrassed - gratified, and humbled.  It turned out that the story of my willingness to stand up for my hourly part-time contract workers at the RISK OF MY OWN FULL-TIME JOB was making the rounds in Silicon Valley. 
I said, "Thanks but I need to think about it."

I took a month off, driving across country, and de-compressing. 

When I returned, I *did* interview with the Silicon Valley unit of SG, and after a grueling interview process started two weeks later. 
Once hired, I found out THEY ALSO heard about what happened at Calera - my standing up for my employees - and based on that, and my proven track record as a person who cared about quality, SG wanted to have me on-board.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: marty998 on August 25, 2016, 03:55:06 PM
Fucking brilliant. Good for you MF.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Northwestie on August 25, 2016, 04:52:19 PM
Fucking brilliant. Good for you MF.

Awesome.  Love it.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Mother Fussbudget on August 25, 2016, 05:18:50 PM
Fucking brilliant. Good for you MF.

Awesome.  Love it.
I'm a stand up guy - what can I say.

But wait til tomorrow, and Asshair#2's story...
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: arebelspy on August 25, 2016, 08:42:34 PM
Though most people wouldn't do what you did, having met you and chatted with you a bit, MF, it doesn't surprise me in the least that you did.  Tip of the hat to you, and glad the karma paid off via getting the next job.  Looking forward to the next story.  :)
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Mother Fussbudget on August 26, 2016, 09:27:47 AM
Asshair#2: (1993)
Asshair#2 is a combo-creature of someone I'll call Agnes - my group's test manager - and a misandrist test-lead I'll call Luna.   When you work for a bad manager, but that manager works for a GOOD manager, you can always talk to the person who ultimately makes the decisions.  But when the asshair has grown 2-layers-deep...  Break out the scissors - you're in trouble.

After 3 years working as a Sr. QA Engineer in a Modern Art Gallery Office for a certain software giant (SG), and shepherding version 3 of the world's most widely used presentation graphics program to market by solving deep technical issues (memory leaks, program interaction issues, etc) - for both Windows & Mac - things were looking good.  Son #1 was "on-the-way", and my team was working on the next version of the veritable workhorse graphics program.  That's when the asshairs from WA state came down to CA, and secretly told managers, 'every team of 4 or more people needed to put at least 1 employee on a Performance Improvement Plan', or PIP. 

PIP's had always been a tool in the management toolbox, but SG decided in the spring of '93 to start using the 'PIP' more regularly. 
PIP - weed out the weak, improve the marginal, all through work-a-holic-hell.  You're put 'on probation'.  If you work your ass off, you *might* have a job at the end of the PIP, and can be fired at anytime' during the process.  Others hired before me had SG stock-options to rely on - I know of at least 3 people who used their stock options as FU money, and left as soon as they were confronted with the PIP, and never looked back.  If only *I* had done that...   

You can guess I was 'selected'... 
Scene:  annual performance review.  Me: surprised!  "*I* am underperforming? Why is this the first I've heard of it?".  Everything just fine up until that point.  As an expectant father, I think I was targeted as 'vulnerable' by Asshair - who had no interest in children, and who's non-SG-fit HP management style garnered little respect from anyone on the team - and because I pointed out in a team meeting Asshair was using an overhead projector, pens & flimsies to project the meeting agenda rather than dog-fooding our product which replaced those outdated things. So dual Asshair was looking to feather her cap (see postscripts).  I was asked to WRITE the "plan" - design the hell I needed to work my way out of over the next 90 days to be able to keep my job. I was rigorous, meticulous, and thorough. 
(What the hell was I thinking!?)

But I *was* thinking.  I knew I could work my butt off, perhaps go into 'crunch mode', and pull another 10hr/7days-a-week for 3 months until this was behind me.  I could BEAT this thing - I had a track record of beating the odds at Calera 3 years earlier. (by then Calera was defunct... :?)

Enter Worklife HELL.  I worked 14 hour days, and 20 hour weekends, for 3 months.  I put in more work, and found more defects than anyone else in-the-building.  Two months into it, I got the feedback: "You're not managing your time well - do the same amount of work in fewer hours."  I challenged my lead to show me anyone in the entire organization who was being more productive than I was, and that talk soon died away.  After 3 months, the final 'PIP' evaluation meeting was postponed another month.  One more month of Worklife Hell - long hours, working weekends.  But I did it.

In the end, I was given an 'unsatisfactory review', and the PIP went into my HR record... BUT... I still had my job.  I was the only person in the organization to start a PIP that spring, and survive with my job intact.  I lost all respect for management at that unit of SG for putting ANYONE through that kind of hell - the stress was intolerable, and unsustainable - family life was non-existent.  I made up my mind then and there to find another gig, but hopefully one at the SG 'mothership' in WA.    18 months later, I was living in WA.

Postscript1:
My son was born AFTER Worklife Hell.  He's still one of the 3 lights of my life.  All is well.

Postscript2:
After PIP hell, once in WA, I was called into the SG President's office (!) - Mike Syrup - and asked "why are so many people from the CA test team asking to be transferred to WA?  What the hell is wrong down there?"  I leveled with him, and said Asshair was incompetent, and the PIP process was uncalled for, being used recklessly, and should never have been used on a business unit of 60 people.  Also that if anything, Asshair needed to be PIP'd herself.  [Later, Luna *also* transferred to WA, and Agnes was given a 'stern talking to', 'management training', and kept that position until she left at a time of her choosing several years later]. 

Postscript3:
A few years later, when I was managing teams, SG corporate HR asked about the PIP process, and what *I* thought could be done to improve the process for the employee & for SG?  I may have mentioned that it was Worklife HELL, but didn't use such tame language… I suggested they level with the employee at the start, and make them an "offer-they-couldn't-refuse" along the lines of: "You're never going to survive this process. You can either put yourself through 3 months of hell, at the end of which you'll be fired... OR, you can take a 6 month severance package with pay & benefits, and resign right now".  My understanding is they adopted this procedure AND at the same time made it harder to successfully complete a PIP.  I think it's a cowardly management tool used by poor managers to make themselves look good to their bosses.  Either way a PIP goes, the manager looks good:  a) Asshair got rid of 'dead weight', or b) Asshair got that employee to work their butt off, and 'turned them around'.  Either way, it was a feather in Asshair's cap.  I will never be a fan of the PIP, and will never put myself through one again.  (and encourage others to do likewise should the situation arise...  and it might...)  I faced management issues that I usually worked out with a few conversations - once an employee who boasted regularly about 'gaming the system' wasn't pulling his weight, and spent most of his day on the phone with his wife.  I called him on it, and said it was obvious he wasn't enjoying his job, and should consider doing something where he could work-on-the-phone, perhaps helping customers solve their problems in customer support.   He thought about it, and…  well, ended up leaving on temporary disability, determined to 'work the system' by claiming mental disability, so he could get paid half-his-salary for doing nothing.  But that's not my story… ;-)  And PIP's were to play a role at least one more time.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Dicey on August 26, 2016, 09:49:33 AM
Holy Cow!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: coynemoney on August 26, 2016, 12:36:02 PM
Damn, those PIPs are seriously messed up! Is this still practiced in that company or in the industry at all?
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: mm1970 on August 26, 2016, 12:46:58 PM
These Asshair stories make me sad.  They aren't really "FU" stories, ya know?  I mean I love to read them and that you survived, but the bad Asshairs did too...
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: mm1970 on August 26, 2016, 12:49:30 PM
Damn, those PIPs are seriously messed up! Is this still practiced in that company or in the industry at all?
We have them in our industry, but I've only ever seen them used when they were needed.  Like when there are obvious performance issues.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Kitsune on August 26, 2016, 12:56:21 PM
Damn, those PIPs are seriously messed up! Is this still practiced in that company or in the industry at all?
We have them in our industry, but I've only ever seen them used when they were needed.  Like when there are obvious performance issues.

My last company tried to use them on me. A month after a great evaluation. A week after I announced I was pregnant.

I simply said that it was interesting, and that the Normes du Travail might be interested, and could I have a written copy. All of a sudden, there was no problem.

In conclusion: ASSHATS.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: NoVa on August 26, 2016, 01:03:20 PM
Damn, those PIPs are seriously messed up! Is this still practiced in that company or in the industry at all?
We have them in our industry, but I've only ever seen them used when they were needed.  Like when there are obvious performance issues.

Same here, never seen them used for a reduction in force, it's more "you have screwed up badly and I have to document in case we want to fire you if you don't fix the behavior." But wow, true horror show, pretty sure I wouldn't work a ton of uncompensated overtime to satisfy some sadistic boss.

jfolsen
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Mother Fussbudget on August 26, 2016, 01:48:53 PM
These Asshair stories make me sad.  They aren't really "FU" stories, ya know?  I mean I love to read them and that you survived, but the bad Asshairs did too...
Agreed.  EVERYONE has some amount of Asshair in their lives. Fortunately I no longer abide Asshair in my work life - thank you FU money!  I humbly beg everyone's pardon - these seem like 'honorable mentions' next to some of your stories.  I'm not a vindictive person - live and let live, I say.  But this seemed like a good forum to 'vilify them thru literature' (Jeffrey Chaucer, "First Knight"). 
I only have one (1x) "truly Epic" FU Money story - with Asshair#4. 

Begging everyone's indulgence - next Asshair... Monday?
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: birdman2003 on August 26, 2016, 02:00:33 PM
Yes, please continue!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: homestead neohio on August 26, 2016, 02:18:16 PM
Begging everyone's indulgence - next Asshair... Monday?

Upthread I shared about having to bear difficult boss/work situations and just knowing that I had FU money kept me from having to use it.  That said, the times when people actually say "FU" and/or retaliate to some extent are quite entertaining to read. 

Eagerly awaiting the next installment.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: zolotiyeruki on August 26, 2016, 02:31:25 PM
At my last job, all employees were grouped by salary/experience and force ranked.  There were lots of great employees, but since it was a forced ranking system, there's always the bottom 20%.  I know a guy whose managers had no issues with his actual productivity and work product, but because he lacked visibility to upward management, he was ranked in the bottom 20% and had to do a PIP.  He met or exceeded all the requirements of the PIP, but his ranking didn't improve significantly--again, not because of any negatives, but because of stiff competition and lack of mgt facetime.  He saw the writing on the wall and found a new job about a month later.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: irishbear99 on August 26, 2016, 04:51:08 PM
...Epic story about Felicia...

The only thing that would have made it better is if you had fired back some southern sass at her 'dear'ing you. A little "oh, sweetie, bless your heart, but I think I can afford to quit. Toodle ooh" said in a way that sounds sweet, but really tells her ' go F yourself PEACE OUT!'

Beautiful! Although I would have ended it with "Bye Felicia" as I was walking out the door, but that's just me.

I know it was something like 10 pages ago, but I can't resist...
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Northwestie on August 26, 2016, 05:46:38 PM
Asshair#2: (1993)
Asshair#2 is a combo-creature of someone I'll call Agnes - my group's test manager - and a 300lb silverback diesel-dike test-lead I'll call Luna.   When you work for a bad manager, but that manager works for a GOOD manager, you can always talk to the person who ultimately makes the decisions.  But when the asshair has grown 2-layers-deep...  Break out the scissors - you're in trouble.

After

You seem well-adjusted for someone to have gone thru all this crap.   
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: woodnut on August 26, 2016, 06:23:39 PM
Asshair#2: (1993)
But when the asshair has grown 2-layers-deep...  Break out the scissors - you're in trouble.

That's really funny.

Wow, I've never seen a PIP used as routine practice.  Why would you implement PIP's?  Just do a normal RIF, it accomplishes the same thing without making permanent enemies.  If it is well known that a company does this, it is really bad for recruiting new employees.  The companies I've worked for use PIP's for its intended purpose, company has no layoffs planned but we have a seat moistener we need to get rid of in the meantime and even then they've been rare.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: arebelspy on August 26, 2016, 07:49:54 PM
Even if not traditional FU stories, I enjoy "bad boss" stories too.  (See LivingaFI's career, for example).
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Paul der Krake on August 26, 2016, 08:13:48 PM
If this is in fact the company I think it is, the brutal weeding of "underperforming" employees is a famous tactic. People still talk about it today. Now the top software companies just make it really hard to get hired, so they don't have to fire.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Larsg on August 28, 2016, 03:17:58 PM
I've done it a couple times in my career - in my early 20's, I had zero FU money saved but the job was so bad, I had the confidence to know that I would find something better and I did - much better. I came into the office over the weekend, ensured to tie up any lose ends with any outstanding notes or follow up that was needed for my clients - I do care always about the end users of products no matter the company, and then I typed "I Quit" in the middle of a word doc, printed it and left it on my bosses desk. I waled out that day, bought some beer and pizza to eat w/roomies for when I got home and never looked back. The next day, I began looking for a new gig and found something that set me on a far better path. Then years later, after I was much more financially established, I did walk away from 100K in unvested stock from a good company BUT, I could not take five more years of working with sociopaths all around me. I lined up my next gig that allowed far more flex in hours, location, content and still make a very good living. I gave two weeks and they were shocked. How could I leave that much money on the table? How could I leave them? They did all they could to make me stay but the environment was so bad, clearly there was no number to make me want to get up and go there again. Found this site which turned me on to a way of thinking that as an Xer, just was never in our DNA...but, I'm there now and will FI soon. Late 40's, about 1.3M, no debt but house not paid off. Will work thru what the optimal scenario is next. love the site and the forum. I thank 3M's for opening my eyes to what was right there in front of me. When I leave a company, I have a tendency to not deal with all the silly goodbye and aftermath from the sociopaths. I reach out to my network to those that matter well in advance and lock down that connection, then tend to sneak in over the weekend before I go to pack my things, leave behind anything that does not belong to me, tie up the ends nice and neat so that if you ever had to go back or needed others in the network, I have not burned any bridges. I must say, it does feel great every time, always leaving one scene for something better.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: LeRainDrop on August 28, 2016, 04:27:28 PM
If this is in fact the company I think it is, the brutal weeding of "underperforming" employees is a famous tactic. People still talk about it today. Now the top software companies just make it really hard to get hired, so they don't have to fire.

Yes, very famous.  I'm not even in the industry and I'd heard about it years back.  My dad told me about it, since he worked tangentially with them in sales.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Metric Mouse on August 28, 2016, 04:38:25 PM
...Epic story about Felicia...

The only thing that would have made it better is if you had fired back some southern sass at her 'dear'ing you. A little "oh, sweetie, bless your heart, but I think I can afford to quit. Toodle ooh" said in a way that sounds sweet, but really tells her ' go F yourself PEACE OUT!'

Beautiful! Although I would have ended it with "Bye Felicia" as I was walking out the door, but that's just me.

I know it was something like 10 pages ago, but I can't resist...

never too late for this. :D
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: MonkeyJenga on August 28, 2016, 04:41:22 PM
Bad
Ass
Mother
Fussbudget
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Metric Mouse on August 28, 2016, 04:50:28 PM
Bad
Ass
Mother
Fussbudget

I am now imagining a wallet that says that...
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: WackyTomato on August 29, 2016, 11:44:56 PM
Asshole manager got shit canned right after he fired me because he didn't hire the right people to replace me (the jobs I left behind were political candy to be handed out by the governor's office to faithful helpers as it turns out).

This is pretty standard in the political field... And the corporate sector as well.  Unfortunately.

Humans gonna humans.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: TravelJunkyQC on August 30, 2016, 12:37:04 PM
These Asshair stories make me sad.  They aren't really "FU" stories, ya know?  I mean I love to read them and that you survived, but the bad Asshairs did too...
Agreed.  EVERYONE has some amount of Asshair in their lives. Fortunately I no longer abide Asshair in my work life - thank you FU money!  I humbly beg everyone's pardon - these seem like 'honorable mentions' next to some of your stories.  I'm not a vindictive person - live and let live, I say.  But this seemed like a good forum to 'vilify them thru literature' (Jeffrey Chaucer, "First Knight"). 
I only have one (1x) "truly Epic" FU Money story - with Asshair#4. 

Begging everyone's indulgence - next Asshair... Monday?

Hey, it's Tuesday, where is my asshair?

I feel like we've just stumbled upon the tagline for a new line of anal Nair product.

Aaaaaand. Back to our regularly scheduled programming.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: bittheory on August 30, 2016, 02:24:20 PM
I have absolutely no fear in scheduling impromptu “meetings” with my bosses when I’m not happy at work. I’ve negotiated raises and vacation time with little to no pushback. One reason is because I’m pretty adept at my job. The other is the inherent psychological confidence that comes with FU money.

My epic “FU” story will occur in about 475 days from today. Not really an “FU” since I love my job and boss, but my FU money will make this conversation possible. Here’s how I see it going down.

ME: (Hands boss resignation letter). I wanted to give you a month notice in person and tell you how much I’ve loved working here, but it’s time for me to do something new.

HIM: Something new? What do you mean?

ME: I am moving to Central America with my wife and kids for a year. We’re going to live a simple life by the beach.

HIM: What the? How is that even possible?

ME: Have you noticed how I bring lunch to work almost every day, ride my bike to work twice a week and have been driving the same economy car since I started working here? That’s the tip of the iceberg of how I’m doing this.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: momcpa on August 30, 2016, 02:42:17 PM
I like that conversation with the boss.  Maybe he's noticed you doing those things, but now he will actually SEE the power in doing just that.   Good luck.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Exhale on August 30, 2016, 08:45:52 PM
Asshair#2 is a combo-creature of someone I'll call Agnes - my group's test manager - and a 300lb silverback diesel-dike test-lead I'll call Luna.

Why is that relevant? Also, the term is "dyke" unless your talking about a geographical feature.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: G-dog on August 31, 2016, 08:23:32 AM
Asshair#2 is a combo-creature of someone I'll call Agnes - my group's test manager - and a 300lb silverback diesel-dike test-lead I'll call Luna.

Why is that relevant? Also, the term is "dyke" unless your talking about a geographical feature.

That bothered me as well.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: FunkyStickman on August 31, 2016, 09:47:03 AM
I've posted a few mild FU stories... I have a feeling my best one is coming soon.

Our factory (small agriculture manufacturing facility, part of a huge global brand) just got the news that they're moving 60% of our product to Brazil, and laying off 100+ people, including 20 salaried folks (some of which have been here for over 25 years) and 20% of our wage workers (of which I am one).

Absolutely everybody is freaking out about it. Except me.
We have to go through routine performance reviews, of which I always give canned answers. Cause I Just don't give a crap.

Last week, my boss (who should have been laid off) was asking me about where I wanted to go in the company, and why our department got bad reviews for development/promotion opportunities.

He says "Well, what's your plan with the company?"
I said "I'd be perfectly happy sitting at home, writing novels for a living. I know I'm not ever going to get a promotion, because Dave killed himself going to night school to get a degree, and he gets dumped on and passed over for everything. You think I'd have a chance? Not even interested."

I'll keep the faithful Mustachians updated on my FU progress if/when it goes down.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: zolotiyeruki on August 31, 2016, 09:53:04 AM
Not sure what role, if any, FU money played in this guy's resignation (he had another job lined up), but it is an epic resignation letter:

https://troylaraviere.net/2016/08/30/dear-mayor-emanuel-i-resign-my-position-as-principal-of-the-1-rated-neighborhood-school-in-chicago/
Wow, that was pretty intense.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: momcpa on August 31, 2016, 10:06:51 AM
Funkystickman..........can you share which company this is?  I work for a very small ag company and while there's really no chance of them moving our product to Mexico, it's interesting to me to see more and more of what you are saying.  The farmers are going to be at the mercy of the industry GIANTS for fertilizer, seed, etc.

And yes, please post any updates.   Thanks.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: mm1970 on August 31, 2016, 10:17:26 AM
Asshair#2 is a combo-creature of someone I'll call Agnes - my group's test manager - and a 300lb silverback diesel-dike test-lead I'll call Luna.

Why is that relevant? Also, the term is "dyke" unless your talking about a geographical feature.
I saw that and thought it was some random car-speak that I didn't understand.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: FunkyStickman on August 31, 2016, 10:49:52 AM
Funkystickman..........can you share which company this is?  I work for a very small ag company and while there's really no chance of them moving our product to Mexico, it's interesting to me to see more and more of what you are saying.  The farmers are going to be at the mercy of the industry GIANTS for fertilizer, seed, etc.

And yes, please post any updates.   Thanks.

I may at some point. There are other Mustachians here who work for the same company, and have similar stories. As far as mega-corps go they're pretty decent, but then you see stuff like this and you just have to shake your head. You can DM me if you really want to know, but... it's not that important. It's happening everywhere. Our factory manager smartly retired the week before all this was announced. He knew it was coming.

We've been told all the wage employees will be offered a "Voluntary Separation Package." But we have to go to HR and request it... they're not going to just mail it to everyone. And you can rest assured they're watching who goes to HR and asks. They will be the first ones considered to be cut, once the deadline for voluntary quitting passes.

So do you preemptively take the package, risk going to HR and asking (and possibly get cut anyway without the package), or just pray they don't notice you?

[MOD EDIT: Redacted part about "article" and removed attached picture.]
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Hvillian on August 31, 2016, 10:59:14 AM
@FunkyStickman - FYI - [REDACTED].   Good luck with everything.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: FunkyStickman on August 31, 2016, 11:03:04 AM
@FunkyStickman - FYI - That picture is enough to figure out the company.  I have no interest or industry knowledge, but would take it down if you really don't want the company to be identifiable.   Good luck with everything.

I'm not that worried about it... I have "FU" money in the bank. ;)
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: crispy on August 31, 2016, 11:09:39 AM
Not sure what role, if any, FU money played in this guy's resignation (he had another job lined up), but it is an epic resignation letter:

https://troylaraviere.net/2016/08/30/dear-mayor-emanuel-i-resign-my-position-as-principal-of-the-1-rated-neighborhood-school-in-chicago/

That was a thing of beauty!  Wow!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Pooperman on August 31, 2016, 11:38:53 AM
Funky, you may want to remove that photo. About 5 minutes of Google netted the likely company you work for and location you work at... Or at least block out the ranking.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: RyanAtTanagra on August 31, 2016, 11:39:55 AM
So do you preemptively take the package, risk going to HR and asking (and possibly get cut anyway without the package), or just pray they don't notice you?

I would think if you volunteer to be cut (with the package they're claiming to offer), they turn you down, then cut you without the package, that would be grounds for a lawsuit of some sort.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: trailrated on August 31, 2016, 11:50:00 AM
This is kind of an FU story gone bad...

A driver that worked for our company ended his shift for the day as I gave him his start time for the following day. He said "nope I ain't coming in, I quit! I found a better job that pays $3 more per hour". It was frustrating on my part because I had planned the next days deliveries on him being here. But wasn't that bad because on the side I had gone out to get my Commercial license just in case things ever got crazy and they needed me to fill in and drive.

Next day came around and my value added was praised as things went smoothly and it ended up with me getting a raise shortly after.

Three weeks later this driver came back to the office asking if he could have his job back because the new company he moved to was only working him 20 hours per week instead of the 50 that is standard for us (so much for that extra $3/hr). If he had given us two weeks notice we most likely would have hired him back on, but he burned his bridge so we said no.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Northwestie on August 31, 2016, 11:53:45 AM
@FunkyStickman - FYI - That picture is enough to figure out the company.  I have no interest or industry knowledge, but would take it down if you really don't want the company to be identifiable.   Good luck with everything.

I'm not that worried about it... I have "FU" money in the bank. ;)

:) Best of luck - keep us posted!!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: onlykelsey on August 31, 2016, 12:06:08 PM
@FunkyStickman - FYI - That picture is enough to figure out the company.  I have no interest or industry knowledge, but would take it down if you really don't want the company to be identifiable.   Good luck with everything.

I'm not that worried about it... I have "FU" money in the bank. ;)

I don't think I'd want to spend my FU money on potentially getting sued, though.  I'd check your employment Ks to see what you're allowed to reveal publicly and what the results are of violation.  I bet it's very strongly drafted in their favor.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: FunkyStickman on August 31, 2016, 12:20:36 PM
Funky, you may want to remove that photo. About 5 minutes of Google netted the likely company you work for and location you work at... Or at least block out the ranking.

Crap.. I don't see the option to remove it.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: FunkyStickman on August 31, 2016, 12:24:01 PM
Couldn't see a way to remove the attachment, just deleted the post.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: TexasRunner on August 31, 2016, 01:42:27 PM
Posting to follow... 

Also, I've got a good story baking as I type this.  Once the dust settles I will post up the results.  :)
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: arebelspy on August 31, 2016, 04:23:08 PM
Couldn't see a way to remove the attachment, just deleted the post.

I got you.

Feel free to go back and edit anything else you want, but I think that's all the identifying stuff.  Left the question about take the package now vs. try to stay.

I'd take the package.  ;)
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: FunkyStickman on August 31, 2016, 04:52:30 PM
Couldn't see a way to remove the attachment, just deleted the post.

I got you.

Feel free to go back and edit anything else you want, but I think that's all the identifying stuff.  Left the question about take the package now vs. try to stay.

I'd take the package.  ;)

Dude, thanks, I owe you one.

And yes, I'm seriously considering it, especially if I get demoted back to working on the factory floor assembling machines.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Zaga on August 31, 2016, 06:38:01 PM
I worked for a food giant that offered a "go away" package a few years ago.  I haven't regretted taking it for a second!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Exhale on August 31, 2016, 07:00:19 PM
Asshair#2 is a combo-creature of someone I'll call Agnes - my group's test manager - and a 300lb silverback diesel-dike test-lead I'll call Luna.
Why is that relevant? Also, the term is "dyke" unless your talking about a geographical feature.
I saw that and thought it was some random car-speak that I didn't understand.

No, it isn't car speak. It's a homophobic insult and, given the "300lb" comment, a fat phobic slur as well. Notice that the OP didn't comment on the sexuality or weight of any of the other managers, only the one assumed to be a masculine lesbian and considered to weigh 300 lbs.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: nobodyspecial on August 31, 2016, 08:50:00 PM
It's a homophobic insult
Not anymore, the US Patent and Trademark Office ruled that it isn't offensive
http://www.nclrights.org/press-room/press-release/trademark-office-says-yes-to-dykes-on-bikes/
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: mtn on September 01, 2016, 08:39:11 AM
My dads company was bought out about 1.5 years ago. After finding out what the buying company usually did for the severence package of purchased company's, he was really kinda hoping to get cut--it was 1 week pay for every year you had been at the company. He'd effectively been at the company for 28 years.

Alas, he didn't get the buyout. His manager told him he was nuts if he thought they were going to let him go, "you're too valuable".
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: PhrugalPhan on September 01, 2016, 09:15:24 AM
Alas, he didn't get the buyout. His manager told him he was nuts if he thought they were going to let him go, "you're too valuable".
When you're that close to retirement anyway, if I was told that I would start considering ways to become less "valuable".
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: mtn on September 01, 2016, 09:19:12 AM
Alas, he didn't get the buyout. His manager told him he was nuts if he thought they were going to let him go, "you're too valuable".
When you're that close to retirement anyway, if I was told that I would start considering ways to become less "valuable".


Bonus incentives would make that a pointless exercise.

He definitely has started going in later, leaving earlier, and working from home on Fridays.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: mm1970 on September 01, 2016, 12:05:38 PM
Asshair#2 is a combo-creature of someone I'll call Agnes - my group's test manager - and a 300lb silverback diesel-dike test-lead I'll call Luna.
Why is that relevant? Also, the term is "dyke" unless your talking about a geographical feature.
I saw that and thought it was some random car-speak that I didn't understand.

No, it isn't car speak. It's a homophobic insult and, given the "300lb" comment, a fat phobic slur as well. Notice that the OP didn't comment on the sexuality or weight of any of the other managers, only the one assumed to be a masculine lesbian and considered to weigh 300 lbs.
Well then that's horrible.  One of my best friends is a lesbian and overweight (though not 300 lb).  I guess I assume most people are beyond insults of this kind.  I should know better.

(The word "diesel" threw me off.)
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Mother Fussbudget on September 01, 2016, 03:08:30 PM
Asshair#2 is a combo-creature of someone I'll call Agnes - my group's test manager - and a {redacted} test-lead I'll call Luna.

Why is that relevant? Also, the term is "dyke" unless your talking about a geographical feature.
I saw that and thought it was some random car-speak that I didn't understand.

Apologies all around.  It bothered me more than anyone, and was poor attempt to be descriptive, and instead came off as offensive.  I've updated the OP to indicate the effect of the behavior - this Asshair's unwavering vehement and consistent prejudice against men (misandrist).  It was a large factor, but one I could not address, mention, or even acknowledge within the office political environment without giving the perception of being a white-male misogynist insensitive anti-feminist.  (Hopefully none of which could ever be used to validly describe *this* Mother Fussbudget)

I've updated original post, but it would require a MOD to edit quotes by others
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: G-dog on September 01, 2016, 03:37:22 PM
Asshair#2 is a combo-creature of someone I'll call Agnes - my group's test manager - and a {redacted} test-lead I'll call Luna.

Why is that relevant? Also, the term is "dyke" unless your talking about a geographical feature.
I saw that and thought it was some random car-speak that I didn't understand.

Apologies all around.  It bothered me more than anyone, and was poor attempt to be descriptive, and instead came off as offensive.  I've updated the OP to indicate the effect of the behavior - this Asshair's unwavering vehement and consistent prejudice against men (misandrist).  It was a large factor, but one I could not address, mention, or even acknowledge within the office political environment without giving the perception of being a white-male misogynist insensitive anti-feminist.  (Hopefully none of which could ever be used to validly describe *this* Mother Fussbudget)

I've updated original post, but it would require a MOD to edit quotes by others
Thanks for the follow-up and apology. Gold. Star.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Mother Fussbudget on September 01, 2016, 04:53:25 PM
As for "Asshair #3"... the big internal debate has been:  Should I admit to this, or does it qualify as the biggest "Anti-Mustachian Hall Of Shame" post to date?  Not a boss...  not even someone I worked with.  Someone who sought me out, and who I was vulnerable to due to having FU money.  But the FU money I'm talking about was the kind that made me doubt whether I was capable of handling the large amounts involved, and whether my DIY investing philosophy of "invest in what you know, and what let's you sleep at night" was still a wise game plan.   A cautionary tale to say the least.  Could others learn from it?

In hindsight, I should have listened to myself, and NOT hired a "Financial Advisor", and I caution others against the same.  If you have a game plan that's working - STICK WITH IT.  Don't convince yourself that you need outside advice just because your account goes over an arbitrary amount where you're paying more than your current FI number just to pay the TAXES.  so... here, or anti-mustachian wall of shame?
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Cherry Lane on September 01, 2016, 09:50:23 PM
As for "Asshair #3"...

 so... here, or anti-mustachian wall of shame?

I vote here, since it keeps the series together, even if the story itself would be more appropriate over there.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: MandalayVA on September 02, 2016, 03:22:30 AM
I've posted a few mild FU stories... I have a feeling my best one is coming soon.

Our factory (small agriculture manufacturing facility, part of a huge global brand) just got the news that they're moving 60% of our product to Brazil, and laying off 100+ people, including 20 salaried folks (some of which have been here for over 25 years) and 20% of our wage workers (of which I am one).

Absolutely everybody is freaking out about it. Except me.
We have to go through routine performance reviews, of which I always give canned answers. Cause I Just don't give a crap.

Last week, my boss (who should have been laid off) was asking me about where I wanted to go in the company, and why our department got bad reviews for development/promotion opportunities.

He says "Well, what's your plan with the company?"
I said "I'd be perfectly happy sitting at home, writing novels for a living. I know I'm not ever going to get a promotion, because Dave killed himself going to night school to get a degree, and he gets dumped on and passed over for everything. You think I'd have a chance? Not even interested."

I'll keep the faithful Mustachians updated on my FU progress if/when it goes down.

Substitute "office" for factory and "Philippines or India" for Brazil, and that's my situation, except I'm definitely getting laid off.  Or, as I like to think of it, set free.  :D
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: TexasRunner on September 02, 2016, 08:31:20 AM
Substitute "office" for factory and "Philippines or India" for Brazil, and that's my situation, except I'm definitely getting laid off.  Or, as I like to think of it, set free.  :D

Congratulations!

(Only in this forum could I say that)
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: EnjoyIt on September 02, 2016, 12:56:05 PM
Hi,

Not an epic story but personally satisfying.

I find my work very rewarding (challenging, meaningful, like my coworkers, still learning, generally fascinating what happens during surgery). However the long shifts, lots of "on call"time and very limited vacation time plus having to "ask" for permission to take time off got old fast. So for a few months I asked about going part time. We're short staffed so kept getting the response of "we're not cutting anyone's hours, let's talk again when we have more people."

Finally I said F... it and gave notice saying on xx date, I'm resigning my full time position but would like to continue on a per diem basis. They went with it (see part about being short staffed). It's been marvelous, minimal required shifts but can basically sign up for as many as I want, no call requirements and I tell them my availability, not ask when I can take off. So much more control over my schedule but still get to do work I really enjoy (when I want to be there).

Being FI and not needing the pay or the benefits made it a much easier call.  I wish that position of power for everyone.

Cheers

Kudos to you.  I see this all the time in the healthcare industry.  Often times going per diem also give you a higher pay since the company is not providing benefits anymore.  This works great if the spouse has good benefits at their job.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: MandalayVA on September 04, 2016, 11:57:26 AM
Substitute "office" for factory and "Philippines or India" for Brazil, and that's my situation, except I'm definitely getting laid off.  Or, as I like to think of it, set free.  :D

Congratulations!

(Only in this forum could I say that)

And only in this forum could I write that!  My forty-some-odd soon-to-be-former coworkers are pretty much all OH SHIT while this is the only place I can go WOO HOO!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: thriftyc on September 04, 2016, 06:01:15 PM
Got laid off last year from a job that I enjoyed - after a few months found another job that I thought that I was going enjoy. Ended up being micromanaged - hated it and quit after 6 weeks.  Just went into my managers office and said "I am done" - interesting look on his face.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: fredbear on September 05, 2016, 02:07:56 PM
This being said, I have never seen a story about using that FU money. Please, share your stories!!

I guess this is my story, but it could not have been as satisfactory without my former supervisor.  To set the stage, what turned out to be my final job was publishing, and all of the books required a CD and a website. This extra, non-paper stuff was the responsibility of the technology managers.  We all worked for one woman, and we were arranged by discipline: psychology, statistics, Spanish, sociology, advanced math, English, etc.  I was kind of a mule - when anyone quit or took maternity leave or there was an organizational change, I got that discipline until it was straightened out, so there was not a time during the last 3 years when I wasn't doing 3 jobs, and sometimes up to 5.  Like all the others, I really liked working for her.  She was clear with us, was technically sharp, instituted smart reporting techniques, respected us, backed us.  A manager.  On the other hand, I was a sort of Ur-mustachian, and had built up more than just FU money by then, though I had never thought about it in that way.  One saved.  One invested.  It was a thing which was done.  Thank you Jim Collins and James Clavell, for the concept.

It came to pass that some of the editresses decided to get her moved out, and pulled it off just before one of our weekly conference calls.  Not good.  She told us about her job shift (basically, into the rubber room), and began to sob.  All of us who reported to her were stunned.  What would happen without her?  It had occurred, I think, because the VP was one of those men - we are legion - who are afraid of women.  The editresses mobbed him, forcing her out.  One of them because our new manager.

The new supervisor shamed me publicly and I called my old supervisor to ask if the new one was hunting my head.  She said, "Yes.  At least to the extent that she announced she was after you at a staff meeting."  So I asked her to take a message up, and she agreed.

"I'm going to quit.  Not negotiable.  Negotiable: they can have a good transition, or a bad one." 

"Good transition?"

"I train my successors in each discipline.  I keep all the projects for my disciplines going - attend the kick-off meetings, start the projects for the newest books, keep the others up to their milestones, come in on time with the ones due to publish, stay around as long as they want and do as much as they want, until they are ready to replace me.  And they pay me severance."

"Right.  Severance.  Now.  Bad transition?"

"I take the three weeks of vacation I'm owed, and when I come back, they get a CD-ROM of work records." 

"I'll see the VP and get back to you."

He took the good transition.  And she also told me, "If you need any testimony, let me know."  I didn't know what she meant until I looked into unemployment and found there is a category called "unreasonable supervision."  If the company contests paying it you can present evidence that unreasonable supervision was used to force you out, which is a form of involuntary termination and therefore covered by unemployment.  (They didn't contest it.)

I had a meeting with K, the only really smart HR person I ever worked with.  I liked her, but it was one of those elective disaffinities Emerson didn't write about: I never sensed she could stand me.  At the meeting she was pissy.  Finally I said, "K, you're pissy.  Want to tell me what's wrong here?"

"Well, you quit.  You quit!  And we're paying you severance.  We never do that.  I've never heard of that."

I told her, "As I see it, there are two ways of looking at this.  The first is that the company and I both saw this situation as adults committed to getting the work done as smoothly as possible, without stoppages or getting books bumped out of the print queue,  while getting new people on line.  Ordinary flow of business.  I was going to go, and we are making my going as smooth as we can."

"And the other way of looking at it?"

"It was a cheap act of corporate extortion and I pulled it off."   

Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Taran Wanderer on September 05, 2016, 02:35:27 PM

"It was a cheap act of corporate extortion and I pulled it off."

Awesome!  Thanks for the belly laugh!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Shane on September 05, 2016, 03:11:56 PM
Thanks for the good story fb!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: aperture on September 05, 2016, 03:25:50 PM
loved the story Fredbear - congrats on your elegant departure. -Aperture.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: okits on September 05, 2016, 03:29:31 PM
"It was a cheap act of corporate extortion and I pulled it off."

High five, fredbear!  What a treat to read on Labour Day.  I hope K respected the hell out of you after that honest discussion.  :)
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: arebelspy on September 05, 2016, 05:26:53 PM
"It was a cheap act of corporate extortion and I pulled it off."

Well done!

And great writing. Enjoyed reading that.  :)
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: fredbear on September 05, 2016, 07:46:49 PM
Enjoyed reading that.  :)

Thank you; I enjoyed living it.  I am ashamed to say there were too many times when I was young and stuck around to be abased, because I thought I would starve my small family if I stood up for my dignity. 

I think I have seen your username.  Were you on prospers.org?  Or the original prospers, before so many were undone, and cast into Outer Darkness?
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: RWD on September 05, 2016, 09:03:59 PM
Enjoyed reading that.  :)

I think I have seen your username.  Were you on prospers.org?  Or the original prospers, before so many were undone, and cast into Outer Darkness?

Hmm... avatar matches signature (https://www.prospers.org:444/forum/the-lobby/fred93-blog-021908-late-loan-stats-update/msg84226/#msg84226).    /detectivework

I also read the prospers.org forums, mostly to follow Fred93. I never made an account though...
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: arebelspy on September 05, 2016, 10:51:32 PM
Enjoyed reading that.  :)

Thank you; I enjoyed living it.  I am ashamed to say there were too many times when I was young and stuck around to be abased, because I thought I would starve my small family if I stood up for my dignity. 

I think I have seen your username.  Were you on prospers.org?  Or the original prospers, before so many were undone, and cast into Outer Darkness?
I was indeed. I was on the Black Friday conference call, in fact.   :)

(Was a mod on Prospers.org for awhile as well, but been a long time since I've been over there.)

Where you on this same username?  Feel free to PM if you don't want to post.  :)
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: HappyMargo on September 06, 2016, 12:30:40 AM
Hi,

Not an epic story but personally satisfying.

I find my work very rewarding (challenging, meaningful, like my coworkers, still learning, generally fascinating what happens during surgery). However the long shifts, lots of "on call"time and very limited vacation time plus having to "ask" for permission to take time off got old fast. So for a few months I asked about going part time. We're short staffed so kept getting the response of "we're not cutting anyone's hours, let's talk again when we have more people."

Finally I said F... it and gave notice saying on xx date, I'm resigning my full time position but would like to continue on a per diem basis. They went with it (see part about being short staffed). It's been marvelous, minimal required shifts but can basically sign up for as many as I want, no call requirements and I tell them my availability, not ask when I can take off. So much more control over my schedule but still get to do work I really enjoy (when I want to be there).

Being FI and not needing the pay or the benefits made it a much easier call.  I wish that position of power for everyone.

Cheers

Maybe not an Epic story... but you're still my hero!

I've been mulling this very same career move over in my mind for quite a while now.  Love all the up-sides of Per Diem work (especially the "no call" & ability to pick/choose work days, allowing random long weekends with my DH for camping trips) but I'm still a bit nervous re: the uncertain income part.  "What if I don't get enough hours??"  Which, I think in reality, basically wouldn't happen because of a shortage of qualified OR personnel.  It's just fear holding me back.

However, I've selected a certain $$ amount for my investments to hit, once that threshold is reached, I am taking the plunge.  I look forward to joining you in the Per Diem ranks soon!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Mother Fussbudget on September 06, 2016, 03:04:44 PM
Asshair#3 A cautionary tale.  Asshair#3 could arguably be *ME*, as in "fool me once, shame on you, fool me twice, shame on me".  Hence, this may belong on the 'anti-mustachian wall of shame', but I'll include it here to keep the series in the same thread. 
Timeframe:  1996-to-2003

By 1996, I was doing well at SG (software giant), my vested SG stock options were worth a good deal of money (~$2.5M).  But I had begun to get nervous about having a portfolio worth that much $$.  Nervous about whether my self-guided investing was good enough, or whether I should hire a financial consultant / analyst to help me keep my money invested wisely & safely.  As Will Rogers said, "The only thing more important than return on your investments, is return OF your investments".

Aside:  If you have similar concerns - DON'T WORRY!  Keep planning your investing, and investing to your plan.  You're as smart as any high-priced financial advisor IMHO.  Low Cost ETF's are the vehicles to use today - Total Stock Market, Total Bond Market, and REIT's are what I'm invested in today.  I only wish I had listened to my own advice in late 1999...

In late 1996 I was contacted by Asshair#3 - yes, a cold calling stock broker based in LA who dealt mostly with high-dollar-figure clients, many of whom were at SG.  I said I wasn't interested, but he convinced me to invest $100K with him, and he would use that amount to show how much he could increase my investments.  I maintained a separate account at Fidelity where I had grown a $33K initial investment to almost $800K, so I wasn't worried about losing $100K.

My plan:  pick a date, and do a 'sell-buy' - exercise the vested stock options, and SELL enough shares to generate enough cash to BUY the remaining shares outright, and hold those shares in my account for at least 1 year.  On that initial sell-buy, I paid short-term capital gains equal to my income tax rate (36%).  A year later, I could sell any remaining shares, and pay only 15% long-term capital gains taxes on those shares.  In the late 90's, SG stock was on a roar - rising, splitting, rising again, etc.

Asshair#3 was initially successful enough to convince me to do the sell-buy into an account with him.  In the fall of 98, I did the sell-buy, generating a >$1M tax bill (ouch! - I know...), leaving roughly $2.5M in stock value in that account.  I also moved some $$ into my original self-directed account, bringing it's total to over $1M, and life was good. 

I had always wanted to live on the water, so soon after, I bought a house on a large nearby lake for >$1M.  I wanted to pay cash, but Asshair convinced me to get a mortgage against my stock account - aka *margin* the stock against the lake house.  [In hindsight, I'm sure this generated a nice big kick-back for him].  For the first year or so, this presented no problem...  SG stock continued to climb.  Even the $10K annual waterfront tax bill was a small amount to pay to be able to walk out my backdoor, jump in the boat, and go play on the lake.

But in the fall of 1999 there was a highly publicized court ruling against SG that could potentially impact SG's stock growth.  I asked Asshair, and he said to "stay the course", that it could never get that bad.  "SG is the 'Ferrari' in your account".   At SG, I worked on a major Macintosh product, and solved 'Y2K software defects' in the software we were building - we found nothing too dramatic to solve.  But there was an end of 99 hysteria about Y2K that made me nervous.  I knew the stock market was an emotional market, not always built on actual value, but on *perception*.  That's why on Dec. 30, 1999 (Why do I remember that date so clearly?  It was my birthday), I realized I hadn't slept the previous night worrying over the stock market, and called Asshair#3 from a family vacation in Hawaii to say I wanted to "sell all shares in SG, pay off the lake house, and invest in something less risky - like bonds, and perhaps put some in some $$ in Apple." (I had worked on a Macintosh product the previous year which was doing well in the market, and thought Apple's stock price still had some growth room left - I was happy with the way Steve Jobs was leading Apple). I said I wasn't worried about any of the nightmare Y2K issues, but was worried about the overall emotion-in-the-market, so wanted to get into cash, and sit-it-out.   That day, my account value was north of $5M.  Needless to say, Asshair#3 talked me out of it - talked me out of selling.

Over the following 3 months, I saw SG's stock nudge downward in large part due to the highly publicized court ruling.  By March, the value had plunged erasing 5 years of stock growth.  But that time, I had been forced (twice) to sell shares to cover margin calls against the shares margined for the lakefront property.  In late March, I said I wanted to sell enough to pay off the mortgage, and hold the property in cash, but by then most of my fortune "on-paper" had disappeared.   Soon after is when he convinced me to invest in Enron. 

Yes, the news on Enron was out, and it was clear the stock was going down, but Asshair's pitch was, "Come on - it's ENRON.  Surely they can beat this, and come out of this stronger than ever.  It's ENRON."  I had 10% of what was left in Bonds, ~$600K in cash, and most of the remainder still in SG stock.  (I know - facepalm).  He invested that ~$600K in Enron, and a half-dozen Dot-Com companies hoping to see the same kind of increases in those stocks that SG had seen in the late 90's.  But it was not to be...

Enron tanked.  ALL the Dot-Com stocks tanked.  In those stocks alone, I lost upwards of $600K.  SG stock tanked, and stayed low.  I finally closed the account with Asshair, and the story got back to his leadership, and got him fired.  [It was little consolation, as last time I checked, he's still active at another SoCal based stock firm]. The annual $10K (!) tax bill on the lakefront house (you read that correctly) had by 2003  became a burden, so eventually I sold the house - for a profit, but that ROI did not offset the stock losses.  Eventually moved into a more modest house in the area and paid down >40% up front.  But things were not good at home.   Later (2006) separation, and divorce followed, and after the lawyers bills, and 50/50 split, and once the dust settled, I was left with less than $350K in total assets, and monthly spousal support (including child support) bills. 

A hard story - true.  But all behind me.  I've learned a lot, and will never make the same mistakes again. I may never have as much money in my FI funds, but I've learned to be happy with what I have, and I will always listen to my own investing advice. Advice that's allowed me to grow my FI funds over the years to a point where FI is within reach.

. . . .

Next up... in 2004, I had my one true Epic FU money story....  Asshair#4 may have been a good coder, but was a terrible manager.  And even though I had seen my fortunes decrease, it didn't stop me from using what FU funds I had to pull-the-FU resignation trigger.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: arebelspy on September 06, 2016, 03:09:50 PM
Oof.. that December '99 call.. if only.  :(
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: hollow on September 06, 2016, 04:11:08 PM
Was forwarded this email yesterday from an engineer at our company who had finally had enough...

That was amazing.

To those wishing to donate to this guy, I found a blog quite easily by searching for a phrase that stood out. He has a Paypal donate button.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Secretly Saving on September 06, 2016, 05:00:50 PM
Holy shit.

I don't know what I would have done in the face of that kind of loss. 

Holy shit is what I thought too.  That must have been very painful to watch at the time.

  I love your positive outlook, Mother Fussbudget!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Northwestie on September 06, 2016, 05:22:29 PM
Man - there's a lifetime of financial stories in that one installment.  My life is boring.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: COEE on September 06, 2016, 05:38:30 PM
This being said, I have never seen a story about using that FU money. Please, share your stories!!
"It was a cheap act of corporate extortion and I pulled it off."

Nice!  I'm going remember this and use it someday.  I think this is the best FU story so far... you quit - and got paid to go.  Incredible.  I'm curious what percentage of your salary your severance was if you're willing to share?
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Bicycle_B on September 06, 2016, 05:59:20 PM
Not sure what role, if any, FU money played in this guy's resignation (he had another job lined up), but it is an epic resignation letter:

https://troylaraviere.net/2016/08/30/dear-mayor-emanuel-i-resign-my-position-as-principal-of-the-1-rated-neighborhood-school-in-chicago/

That was a thing of beauty!  Wow!

That's awesome.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: okits on September 06, 2016, 06:56:24 PM
Mother Fussbudget, I'll be honest, I feel physically ill after reading that.  Thanks for sharing what must have been an incredibly difficult lesson and I'm glad you're happy and in a good place now.

Looking forward to the next story.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: fredbear on September 06, 2016, 08:33:54 PM
I'm curious what percentage of your salary your severance was if you're willing to share?

Severance was your full salary at the rate of a week for each year of employment, so 7 weeks or not quite 14% of my annual salary.  The meeting with K the Queen of HR would have been a triumph if I could have pulled it off.   My idea (pre-mustachian, but kind of an entelechy of mustachery if only it had worked) was to be paid none of it and have the whole of the severance dumped to my 401(k), which would have put it WAY past the company match, and indeed, very close to the annual limit for that year, plus fully and immediately vested.  Alas - damned impertinent rogue of a logician HR Queen that she was - K pointed out that 401(K)s were for employees, and a person receiving severance by definition was no longer an employee.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Dicey on September 06, 2016, 10:10:41 PM
Crikey, MF! I had to pause mid-story to turn on a fan! What a story! I'm so glad you lived to tell the tale. To quote Rod Stewart, "and Mother what a lover, you wore me out"!

Years ago, Money Magazine (I think) profiled a bunch of Enron "winners" and put them on the cover of the issue. I always hoped they'd run a "Whatever happened to...?" follow-up, but that wouldn't sell magazines, would it?

I am glad you survived your horror story.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: patrickza on September 07, 2016, 08:09:38 AM
Mother Fussbudget, I'll be honest, I feel physically ill after reading that.  Thanks for sharing what must have been an incredibly difficult lesson and I'm glad you're happy and in a good place now.

Looking forward to the next story.
Same here. What a read, I broke out in cold sweats and it's not even my cash! Seriously well done on picking up the pieces and moving on with your life.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Fastfwd on September 07, 2016, 09:53:02 AM
Not epic but still good story:
Have been working for a big international bank for one year and they tell me I have to start working 11am - 8pm. I tell them no I have kids and want to see them. They tell me you take it or you have to resign. So I tell them fire me then because I am not doing it. They tell me I would not get unemployment and would I be OK? Yes I would; I can retire now if I want to I just work for the luxuries now.


Long story short I resign because it's the same as being fired vs unemployment but I have to give 60 days notice per contract so I do this but don't work evenings. After 60 days they ask me if I want to stay longer because they have not found a replacement and I say no. Left and took the whole summer off while fielding multiple calls from recruiters looking for a very specific skillset that matches what they need and I have.

Satisfaction :)

Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: MrMoogle on September 07, 2016, 09:57:21 AM
Man - there's a lifetime of financial stories in that one installment.  My life is boring.
Boring is good.  You don't want to live in interesting times.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Mother Fussbudget on September 07, 2016, 10:14:15 AM
Man - there's a lifetime of financial stories in that one installment.  My life is boring.
Boring is good.  You don't want to live in interesting times.
+1.  Boring is good.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: RyanAtTanagra on September 07, 2016, 10:21:54 AM
Not epic but still good story:
Have been working for a big international bank for one year and they tell me I have to start working 11am - 8pm. I tell them no I have kids and want to see them. They tell me you take it or you have to resign. So I tell them fire me then because I am not doing it. They tell me I would not get unemployment and would I be OK? Yes I would; I can retire now if I want to I just work for the luxuries now.


Long story short I resign because it's the same as being fired vs unemployment but I have to give 60 days notice per contract so I do this but don't work evenings. After 60 days they ask me if I want to stay longer because they have not found a replacement and I say no. Left and took the whole summer off while fielding multiple calls from recruiters looking for a very specific skillset that matches what they need and I have.

Satisfaction :)

Nice, congrats and good job on not giving in.  For what it's worth, and I know it varies by state, but going from 1st to 2nd shift could be considered a material change in your job, and may have qualified for unemployment.  I definitely wouldn't take the employers word on it.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: mm1970 on September 07, 2016, 10:23:33 AM
Oof.. that December '99 call.. if only.  :(

Always, right?  I started working at a start up company in Jan 2000.  We got bought shortly thereafter.  (So my options were not vested).

Fully vested, they were worth about $840k at the peak.  (but not vested).

In any event...I had a coworker who started before I did - by a year or two.  So he was partially vested.  He exercised his shares and opted to do the margin thing for taxes.  Then the 2000 crash happened...he ended up having to sell shares on the margin calls...in the end, he LOST money.  LOST money.

By the time I was vested the stock was 1/5 the price.  I, my friends, am a "same day sale" girl.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: mtn on September 07, 2016, 10:26:51 AM
Oof.. that December '99 call.. if only.  :(

Always, right?  I started working at a start up company in Jan 2000.  We got bought shortly thereafter.  (So my options were not vested).

Fully vested, they were worth about $840k at the peak.  (but not vested).

In any event...I had a coworker who started before I did - by a year or two.  So he was partially vested.  He exercised his shares and opted to do the margin thing for taxes.  Then the 2000 crash happened...he ended up having to sell shares on the margin calls...in the end, he LOST money.  LOST money.

By the time I was vested the stock was 1/5 the price.  I, my friends, am a "same day sale" girl.

I'd be curious to see a long-term analysis on many different companies to see if "same day sale" is the better option overall.

My dads company was bought out, and he had been slow to sell some options. Worked out well for him. Worked out *really* well for his manager, who hadn't sold any, which he admitted was a very stupid move that paid off. Another friend though sold as soon as the were available. That was a good move overall, but hindsight being 20/20 he was "out" of over $2mil.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: deadlymonkey on September 07, 2016, 10:28:41 AM
Not my FU story, I seem to have a string of good luck and liked all of my jobs EXCEPT my first one which was working on a factory loading dock at the company my father also worked for (a lesson into why education is good so I wouldn't ever have to do that work again).

Anyway, he was a warehouse manager for a large factor that makes ornaments.  It is a year round business but peaks in the fall as stores place orders for Christmas.  It is family owned and most of the employees are immigrants, I never met the owner, but his sons were incompetent and the definition of bad managers.  My father was older and has had Type 1 Diabetes since he was 10.  Fairly well managed but when he his sugar drops he needs to eat immediately.  Excellent worker and great evals and runs his warehouse very well compared to the some of the other ones in the area.  Owner's son is always micromanaging but my dad deals with it because he is older and the area is not really ripe with job prospects.  One day the son comes in and tells him he needs to move a pile of packaging from one area to another in prep for loading the next day.  He didn't need to assign that work as it was obvious and they were going to be doing anyway (standard procedure prepping truck for loading).  My dad's sugar is crashing because is hot in the warehouse and he had been doing a lot of physically demanding work.  He says OK, we are starting in 15 mins I just need to eat a sandwich real fast.  The son goes apeshit and starts yelling that he will not be disobeyed and to start immediately.  My father calmly reminds him that he is diabetic and needs to eat right now to prevent a medical issue.  No dice.  The son demands he put the sandwich down or be fired.  My father thinks for a second and then slowly takes a bite of sandwich.....promptly fired.  Has enough of a stache to last until the company makes a big settlement to avoid the lawsuit. 

Now my father is semi-retired working at an auto dealership driving cars around form point A to B because it is fun and he no longer needs to work thanks to incompetent manager and a sandwich.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Mother Fussbudget on September 07, 2016, 10:43:28 AM
Oof.. that December '99 call.. if only.  :(

Always, right?  I started working at a start up company in Jan 2000.  We got bought shortly thereafter.  (So my options were not vested).

Fully vested, they were worth about $840k at the peak.  (but not vested).

In any event...I had a coworker who started before I did - by a year or two.  So he was partially vested.  He exercised his shares and opted to do the margin thing for taxes.  Then the 2000 crash happened...he ended up having to sell shares on the margin calls...in the end, he LOST money.  LOST money.

By the time I was vested the stock was 1/5 the price.  I, my friends, am a "same day sale" girl.

I didn't say much about that brokerage account I managed on-my-own, and rolled from $33K to >$1M in less than 10 years.  It's because I not only lost all but $350K in Asshair#3's managed account, but had to sell all but my emergency fund from the self-managed account to make up the losses.  And the $350K was split after the divorce... yada, yada, yada.

So yes - a cautionary tale.  Moral of the story: 
Plan your investing strategy, and stick with it - especially when it's VERY successful.  Don't second guess success.
AND...
If you're not sleeping at night because of volatility in the stock market, there's something wrong with your investing strategy, and you need to strongly consider changing to a more conservative investing stance right away.

My subconscious told me change was coming, but I allowed someone who had a vested self-interest in having me stay in an uncertain market (so he could make commissions off every crackpot trade he talked me into) to keep me from making the changes in investment strategy I felt were needed to 'Help Me Sleep At Night'.   

The flip-side is that if you're following your own investment strategy, you have only yourself to blame when the market, or your portfolio value "goes south".  But I can live with THAT better than the alternative.  Better the devil I know... 

Yes, it's been over 15 years now, but I'm in a good place financially mentally, etc. 
Thanks to all for the kind words. 

And yes, I thought about setting up one of those 'give a buck' websites to ask if people would help put me back-in-the-black, but... I still have a pinch of pride... ;-)  All the best! 
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: RyanAtTanagra on September 07, 2016, 10:51:31 AM
My father calmly reminds him that he is diabetic and needs to eat right now to prevent a medical issue.  No dice.  The son demands he put the sandwich down or be fired.  My father thinks for a second and then slowly takes a bite of sandwich.....promptly fired.  Has enough of a stache to last until the company makes a big settlement to avoid the lawsuit. 

F yea!  I've seen too many people sacrifice their health because they're afraid of losing their job.  If only everyone had a stache, shitty employers/bosses might not exist.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: mm1970 on September 07, 2016, 01:21:52 PM
Quote
The flip-side is that if you're following your own investment strategy, you have only yourself to blame when the market, or your portfolio value "goes south".  But I can live with THAT better than the alternative.  Better the devil I know... 

Yeah, I'm super conservative financially, which would not surprise anyone who knows me.  When the market was going crazy, it would never have occurred to me to try to not pay taxes and just use "gains" to pay taxes.

Our company stock was always very volatile.  The good thing is that you could make money if patient.  We had ESPP and we had stock bonuses (small ones) and we had stock options that we got each year.  So, no, the stock options that I got at $32 were never worth anything before I quit (when it was $24), but the options I'd gotten 4 years before at $12 made me some money.

I remember that year, we had a quarterly earnings report that was misunderstood, and badly. Our stock dropped like a stone, conveniently right before we got our options. These were immediately vested.  I think I had 100 shares.  Well, once the misunderstandings were worked out, we were back up.  So my price to buy was $75, and I sold within a month at $120.  A good quick $4500.  My coworker told me I was CRAZY for selling so soon, we were headed to $130!   I said, "meh, okay".

That was November, and by January (when my original shares started vesting) were were at $35 and by Feb we were at $25.  I wasn't so dumb anymore.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Mother Fussbudget on September 07, 2016, 04:28:00 PM
Asshair#4 - My Epic FU Money story (2004)

I left SG on good terms in the fall of 2003 because SG wasn't doing much in web e-commerce.  I wanted to learn e-commerce, and web, so I left (on good terms) to join an existing travel related website company. I was hired as Test Lead for a project team to create a new website for the site's new acquisition company doing luxury travel.  Other teams did flights, rental cars, hotels, cruises, packages, etc.  The team was headed by a dynamic leader "Bob" [who later went on to run a discount hotel website, then a well known job/salary transparency comparison website] - Bob held everything together, and was a joy to work with.  Every employee was licensed as a travel agent, with the ability to get agent discounts, etc.

The team built two websites:  a travel-agent facing website, and a customer facing website presenting essentially the same data.  Every member of the team had two (2x) roles & titles - our 'real' role/title at the 'parent' company (ex:  "Test Lead") and a 'fancy' role/title at the luxury travel company (ex: "Quality Assurance Manger").

Asshair#4 was the Development Manager/'Director of Technology'.  The real job was to direct the developers who coded the website.  The 'fancy' role was just a title, but it went to the head of Asshair#4 to the point where he was not actually doing his DevMgr job while trying to appear to be the DOT in his own mind.  I reported directly to this DevMgr.  As a developer, he had the skills to get hired.  As a leader, he had practically no skills, little in the way of leadership ability.  This was a highly introspective individual who compensated for his employee's lack of psychic abilities by yelling and screaming when people didn't do things exactly as he wanted.

My test team was doing great work - we deployed the agent website, and a first round of the customer facing website.  As a reward, the entire organization was sent on a travel agent 'Familiarization' (FAM) trip.  Fly to Oahu & Maui, see the 5 star hotels we sold, tour the rooms, see the side-trips (baby turtles, adult turtles, dolphins) etc.  Sign Me Up!  But because the team was too large for a single trip, we decided to break this FAM trip into two trips - a skeleton crew would stay behind for trip #1, and travel on FAM trip #2.  With a new baby in the house, I chose to hold-down-the-fort as 'manager in the house', while the rest of the team had fun on a fully paid trip to Oahu & Maui. 

Soon after the FAM trip, Bob left to take a leadership position at a discount hotel website company in the CA bay area.  This left Asshair#4 with no boss until the company could fill the role.  In the meantime, Asshair#4 let it go to his head, and while trying to dress up his work as 'Director of Tech', and 'filling in' as Group Manager, his dev team was not getting the leadership they needed.  He happily started to scapegoat the lack of quality on the Test team (?) who were finding problems in delivered code, especially the test lead - me.  Talk of FAM trip#2 got very quiet as we were finalizing plans for our NEXT project - a rebranded luxury travel website  under an upscale name.  Total price tag for the new plan/work:  $5M. 

Asshair#4 called me into his office to confide in me that the company balked at the $5M price tag, and instead of sticking with the luxury brand, were going to shut down the larger luxury team, and offer local folks the choice of moving to CA bay area (where the acquired company was based), or transferring to other teams.   I asked if I could interview for test lead roles on other teams rather than relocate.  He agreed, so I setup interviews with other teams who were all familiar with my work quarterbacking monthly night-of-deployment sessions for the luxury team.  Two days later, after two (2x) interviews, I was offered a position on one of the more stable teams, and went back to Asshair#4 to tell him I'd been offered the position, and ask how much notice he wanted me to give to transition my responsibilities to other team members.  He hemmed, and hawed, and told me that actually I couldn't transition to the other team AT ALL  because he was going to have to put me on a Performance Improvement Plan (PIP - see the ordeal with Asshair#2). 

I shouted, "WHAT!?!?!  You approved my interviewing on other teams, and I was hired right away, how could you even be thinking about a PIP?"  Asshair#4 said in his discussions with HR in preparation for breaking the news of the down-sizing to the team, he mentioned that I would be taking a role on another team, but had asked HR about what was involved in the PIP process in relation to *me*.   It was news to me, but was clearly a way for him to deflect poor work done by his direct reports on the dev team away from himself as a poor leader.  He needed a scapegoat, and picked me.  Unfortunately, because he 'mentioned a PIP' to HR, HR would not allow me to transfer to another team until I had *completed the PIP process*.  Asshair would be unable to 'transfer his problem' to another team.  I was VERY familiar with the PIP process having been on both sides of PIP's while at SG.  He said something about preparing the paperwork, and I let him know right then and there that this idea of a PIP was completely unfair, unwarranted, and unexpected, and I would not participate in any way.  I told him that if he was serious, he could have my resignation on-the-spot.   He didn't budge, so said "I quit", and left his office.  FU money, and zero tolerance for another PIP made this the ONLY decision.

I went to my office, packed my stuff, and left the building - stopping by HR on the way out to drop off my card key.

Later that day, from home, I logged into my email account out of habit, and noticed my account had not been deleted.  The team received a team-wide email from Asshair#4 trying to explain my quick departure without giving away that the team was going to soon downsize, and leaving more questions than answers.  I *RESPONDED* to this email saying that I was simply leaving of my own free will to pursue outside interests, and part of that was FINALLY going on my own FAM trip on-my-own time.  I wished everyone the best, but in a way that indicated Asshair didn't know what the fuck he was talking about in the original message. I wished everyone the best, and shut down my PC. 

The call to the luxury travel office in CA was fun - everyone there was shocked to learn of my departure, and were happy to help set up a familiarization trip to resorts in Puerto Rico for $0 behind Asshair's back.  Team members in the local office were also shocked, and wanted to take me out to lunch, which we subsequently did that Friday afternoon.  I never let on what was about to happen to the team, and left in a very professional manner. I didn't have a gig lined up, but FU money (after firing Asshair#3) made it possible to take some time, decompress, get my resume in order, and focus on getting a new gig.  I took my time, and had a new gig within 2 months - including the week in Puerto Rico!  One of the corporate VP's later asked me to lunch to understand what had happened - I told him the team did well under Bob, but Asshair#4 was no leader, and was so busy trying to look like a 'Director of Technology', that he was neglecting his main responsibilities as Development Manager.  Basically that Bob held the group together, and it fell apart under Mousey Asshair (which was the truth).

Postscript:
Most of the team transferred to other roles on other teams.  1-2 out of 20 transferred to CA.  The rest left the company... including Asshair#4 who left to become a plain old software developer at another company.  I hope for their sake that company never put him in a leadership position again.  I still have many friends from that company, and am sure I would be welcomed back with open arms, but the Asshair soured the experience.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: TomTX on September 07, 2016, 05:10:36 PM
I'm curious what percentage of your salary your severance was if you're willing to share?

Severance was your full salary at the rate of a week for each year of employment, so 7 weeks or not quite 14% of my annual salary.  The meeting with K the Queen of HR would have been a triumph if I could have pulled it off.   My idea (pre-mustachian, but kind of an entelechy of mustachery if only it had worked) was to be paid none of it and have the whole of the severance dumped to my 401(k), which would have put it WAY past the company match, and indeed, very close to the annual limit for that year, plus fully and immediately vested.  Alas - damned impertinent rogue of a logician HR Queen that she was - K pointed out that 401(K)s were for employees, and a person receiving severance by definition was no longer an employee.

You are receiving severance payment based on your work as employee. Most likely you were still an employee during the discussion.

By her logic, you shouldn't get that final paycheck either since you were no longer an employee.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Zaga on September 07, 2016, 05:23:17 PM
I'm curious what percentage of your salary your severance was if you're willing to share?

Severance was your full salary at the rate of a week for each year of employment, so 7 weeks or not quite 14% of my annual salary.  The meeting with K the Queen of HR would have been a triumph if I could have pulled it off.   My idea (pre-mustachian, but kind of an entelechy of mustachery if only it had worked) was to be paid none of it and have the whole of the severance dumped to my 401(k), which would have put it WAY past the company match, and indeed, very close to the annual limit for that year, plus fully and immediately vested.  Alas - damned impertinent rogue of a logician HR Queen that she was - K pointed out that 401(K)s were for employees, and a person receiving severance by definition was no longer an employee.

You are receiving severance payment based on your work as employee. Most likely you were still an employee during the discussion.

By her logic, you shouldn't get that final paycheck either since you were no longer an employee.
I got a severance payment once, and it was indeed completely ineligible for 401-K.  Not even the usual amount that I had withheld, and no match.  Made me sad!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: LeRainDrop on September 08, 2016, 08:10:14 PM
I'm curious what percentage of your salary your severance was if you're willing to share?

Severance was your full salary at the rate of a week for each year of employment, so 7 weeks or not quite 14% of my annual salary.  The meeting with K the Queen of HR would have been a triumph if I could have pulled it off.   My idea (pre-mustachian, but kind of an entelechy of mustachery if only it had worked) was to be paid none of it and have the whole of the severance dumped to my 401(k), which would have put it WAY past the company match, and indeed, very close to the annual limit for that year, plus fully and immediately vested.  Alas - damned impertinent rogue of a logician HR Queen that she was - K pointed out that 401(K)s were for employees, and a person receiving severance by definition was no longer an employee.

You are receiving severance payment based on your work as employee. Most likely you were still an employee during the discussion.

By her logic, you shouldn't get that final paycheck either since you were no longer an employee.
I got a severance payment once, and it was indeed completely ineligible for 401-K.  Not even the usual amount that I had withheld, and no match.  Made me sad!

Severance can be structured in different ways.  Case in point, I got "severance" over a several-month period, was considered an employee during that time, employer paid my benefits as usual, and I cranked up my 401(k) contributions for those severance payments so as to max out my 401(k) account early in the year before I was no longer employed.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Bee21 on September 09, 2016, 04:25:44 AM
I am famously short tempered but very resilient in hopeless job situations. Until a certain point of course. I was once overworked and underpaid for a private language school for 3 years. Treated fairly poorly and expected to be grateful because i was an immigrant and what a favour they were doing me for employing me and paying me peanuts, even though i made a lot of money for them. We were in the middle of salary negotiations (with low pay, crazy hours, unfair pay as usual) when i was told that i am expected to work an additional 100 hours that year, to be on call  work on saturdays etc. I told him i would consider his generous offer, updated my cv in the library and bought the local paper. There was an ad for a one year teaching contract and they interviewed me that afternoon, offered me the job on the spot, so by 4pm i was able to tell the boss, that i am not renewing my contract. I had about 6 months worth of e fund at that time. The best thing ever.

I had 2 other lunchtime job application situations 3 years later, in a different continent, with similar results.

Job 1- weekly contracts. We found out how many days we would be teaching every Friday. One Friday morning i got a call from a temp agency that they have a monthly contract for some office job, i said yes without even asking what it was. I had about 120 dollars at that time. Told the lady who showed up with next weeks contract that she can give those days to someone else.
 
Job 2
I ended up doing an 18 month stint in that place doing some mindnumbing paper pushing.i hated the fact that they refused to offer  me a longer contract  (was renewed monthly for 18 month) even though it was obvious that they were happy with my work and they needed me. I finally had enough, applied for the first ok looking permanent job, took the new job and simply told them at the end of the month when they wanted to renew me for an other month that i am not signing it, thanks a lot for the experience but i prefer job security.

So yeah, keeping people on short term contracts indefinitely can bite you back.

I almost slammed the door on my current employer last week. Getting really close. My husbands job is a bit rocky, and i dont want both of us to be unemployed, so i just went for a loooong walk at lunchtime instead of applying for something. Must be getting old. Though we have enough to maintain the current lifestyle for a year, or indefinitely with some drastic changes, so i am tempted.Very tempted. Mmmm. Might update my cv, just in case.....
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: MostlyBearded on September 09, 2016, 08:05:35 AM

Now my father is semi-retired working at an auto dealership driving cars around form point A to B because it is fun and he no longer needs to work thanks to incompetent manager and a sandwich.

Ha! Absolutely love this one :)
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: jlajr on September 10, 2016, 12:49:40 AM
Well done!

And great writing. Enjoyed reading that.  :)

+1
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Undecided on September 10, 2016, 10:11:19 AM
Holy shit.

I don't know what I would have done in the face of that kind of loss.  Perhaps hire some out of work tattoo "artists" to emblazon "Come on -- it's Enron!" across the guy's forehead?

Easy come, easy go.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: FIREby35 on September 11, 2016, 07:54:46 AM
I have not read everyone's stories yet, but I do have my own epic FU money story.

I worked at a law firm with 13 attorneys, straight out of law school at 26. I had lots of options because I went to a regionally respected law school and finished near the top of my law class. I rejected many offers for salary positions and chose this firm because it allowed me to create my own practice. We split fees based on various percentages. There was no cap on my earnings.

Fast forward 3.5 years. I was 29 years old. My practice had exploded. There were basically two problems. First, by the time of the FU incident I was making more money than anyone in the firm and I was the youngest person there.  Second, the managing partner and the office administrator were incompetent, bitter and creating a toxic work environment.

A key part of the story is that 6 weeks prior to the FU incident, the managing partner used $10,000 of my money, without permission, to pay all the partners salaries because they had "cash flow issues." They money was paid back a week later. This signaled financial shenanigans on top of being totally, totally toxic.

One day, the managing partner approached me and said she wanted to renegotiate my deal AND audit every case for the appropriate percentage from the prior two years. The renegotiation was ridiculous. The audit was a major, totally unwarranted affront to my integrity - from a person who had just taken $10,000 of my money!

So, I went home with my wife - coincidentally an auditor and accountant. We performed the audit ourselves and ran all the numbers. I discovered that for the prior two years, less than 1% of my income had come from their referrals. I was a major profit center for the firm - generating over $250,000 for the firm over the prior 24 months. And, in fact, the toxic office administrator had intentionally mis-categorized my referrals thereby underpaying me.

Fortunately, I had been on the MMM train since the beginning and had an FU money war-chest of a couple hundred thousand dollars. Interestingly, the MMM choices had been the object of much curiosity since everyone knew I was making a lot but spending very little. Why are you riding your bike to work? Why did you buy such a "modest" house for your income. Why don't you get a new car? Those are actual comments.

So, the FU moment arrived when I delivered a renegotiated contract proposal to the partners. I proposed to pay them a flat monthly fee that amounted to 35% of what they were currently getting. I proposed that if they ever held any of my money without legal authority or permission they pay $1,000 per day for the privilege. Egg on the face of managing partner who had not advised anyone of the $10,000 "cash flow" issue or her proposed audit and renegotiation.

A comment this board will particularly appreciate in response, "We can't take this deal, we'd have to reduce our salaries and our budgets are set to our salaries." Facepalm.

During the wind up phase, the toxic, money stealing office administrator - who had been around long enough to have a way, way over-inflated sense of importance - spoke up during a tense conversation about splitting remaining funds. I looked at her and said, "You have no ownership in this firm, I have never been in business with you and don't want to hear anything you have to say." Hahahahaha. Her jaw dropped. Her upper lip trembled with rage. She didn't say a freaking word. It was the best moment of the entire thing, even better than the contract proposal.

Long story short, I opened my own law firm one week later. I now pay 20% less in overhead. I work dramatically reduced hours because I have actual, dedicated staff for just me - which they would never give me. Also, my gross receipts are up about 10% in the first 12 months. Life is good.

As a post script - the incompetent managing partner hired a guy to fill my office. Remember, that office was earning over $250,000 for the firm in the proceeding 24 months. The guy was paid a salary for six months - rather than have his pay tied to his productivity. Eventually it came out he was a total fraud who lied about being licensed in our state (he did have a different, faraway state). He even filed court documents without the appropriate license. He was fired immediately and the office remains vacant, producing zero profits. Schadenfreude? Yes.

Also as a disclaimer, there are many, many attorneys who are great at servicing their clients but not so good at business. In the event I needed legal help, I would immediately hire any of these attorneys - except the managing partner. They really are competent, professional people - but bad business and money managers. In the end, I maintained great relationships with everyone except the managing partner and the office administrator.

I have an update to this story. Recently, one of the partners of this law firm left and decided to open his law firm, right across the hallway from me. I got a little inside info that had remained hidden for two years.

It turns out the Managing Partner and the toxic office administrator were totally in cahoots to oust me from the firm. After I delivered my proposal, described above, there was a meeting where the partners were going to respond. Apparently, it had been the topic of conversation that it would not make sense for me to continue to pay larger and larger sums of money and they would eventually have to change my deal - which is what I was asking for.  So, my proposal was not a surprise and they were willing to work with me.

Enter the managing partner and administrator: the administrator entered the partner meeting and tendered her immediate resignation if she had to continue to work with me. She then walked out. This would have created a temporary chaos and she was the paralegal for the firms' founder who no one would override. So, they didn't make me a counter offer and instead asked, "If we don't keep him, will Administrator come back." To which managing partner replied immediately, "I'll talk to her about that." Moments later, the resignation was withdrawn and my fate was sealed. The partner who just left the firm - because the same managing partner and toxic administrator were costing him lots and lots of money and stress, said he was in shock at how the whole group had been so masterfully manipulated.

If you recall the story from above, I told her off AFTER she had done all this. It only makes it sweeter.

As they say, living well is the best revenge. I've had my own practice for two years now. I've doubled my net worth. I work 20-30 hours less per week and make more money. Life is good. They really did me a huge favor.

P.S. My leading theory on why the office administrator wanted me gone is that if I had stayed I would have been forced to address her purposely mis-coding my cases and, thereby, underpaying me. This would have been very bad for her as a major breach of trust. So, I think she knew that if I stayed her shenanigans would become a mini-office scandal and potentially she could lose her job. She went for the jugular when she had the chance. Why the Managing Partner was so upset? I think it had to do with calling her out on the $10,000 in front of everyone. But why did they turn their eyes to me prior to the $10,000 blow up and coding discovery? I'll never really know.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: arebelspy on September 11, 2016, 12:37:18 PM
But why did they turn their eyes to me prior to the $10,000 blow up and coding discovery? I'll never really know.

Greed.  You were making so much, and they were going to actually have to give it to you, instead of keeping it themselves.

Thanks for the followup!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: LeRainDrop on September 11, 2016, 01:19:03 PM
But why did they turn their eyes to me prior to the $10,000 blow up and coding discovery? I'll never really know.

Greed.  You were making so much, and they were going to actually have to give it to you, instead of keeping it themselves.

Thanks for the followup!

Greed AND jealousy.  Amazing story, FIREby35!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: starguru on September 11, 2016, 06:10:34 PM
I have not read everyone's stories yet, but I do have my own epic FU money story.

I worked at a law firm with 13 attorneys, straight out of law school at 26. I had lots of options because I went to a regionally respected law school and finished near the top of my law class. I rejected many offers for salary positions and chose this firm because it allowed me to create my own practice. We split fees based on various percentages. There was no cap on my earnings.

Fast forward 3.5 years. I was 29 years old. My practice had exploded. There were basically two problems. First, by the time of the FU incident I was making more money than anyone in the firm and I was the youngest person there.  Second, the managing partner and the office administrator were incompetent, bitter and creating a toxic work environment.

A key part of the story is that 6 weeks prior to the FU incident, the managing partner used $10,000 of my money, without permission, to pay all the partners salaries because they had "cash flow issues." They money was paid back a week later. This signaled financial shenanigans on top of being totally, totally toxic.

One day, the managing partner approached me and said she wanted to renegotiate my deal AND audit every case for the appropriate percentage from the prior two years. The renegotiation was ridiculous. The audit was a major, totally unwarranted affront to my integrity - from a person who had just taken $10,000 of my money!

So, I went home with my wife - coincidentally an auditor and accountant. We performed the audit ourselves and ran all the numbers. I discovered that for the prior two years, less than 1% of my income had come from their referrals. I was a major profit center for the firm - generating over $250,000 for the firm over the prior 24 months. And, in fact, the toxic office administrator had intentionally mis-categorized my referrals thereby underpaying me.

Fortunately, I had been on the MMM train since the beginning and had an FU money war-chest of a couple hundred thousand dollars. Interestingly, the MMM choices had been the object of much curiosity since everyone knew I was making a lot but spending very little. Why are you riding your bike to work? Why did you buy such a "modest" house for your income. Why don't you get a new car? Those are actual comments.

So, the FU moment arrived when I delivered a renegotiated contract proposal to the partners. I proposed to pay them a flat monthly fee that amounted to 35% of what they were currently getting. I proposed that if they ever held any of my money without legal authority or permission they pay $1,000 per day for the privilege. Egg on the face of managing partner who had not advised anyone of the $10,000 "cash flow" issue or her proposed audit and renegotiation.

A comment this board will particularly appreciate in response, "We can't take this deal, we'd have to reduce our salaries and our budgets are set to our salaries." Facepalm.

During the wind up phase, the toxic, money stealing office administrator - who had been around long enough to have a way, way over-inflated sense of importance - spoke up during a tense conversation about splitting remaining funds. I looked at her and said, "You have no ownership in this firm, I have never been in business with you and don't want to hear anything you have to say." Hahahahaha. Her jaw dropped. Her upper lip trembled with rage. She didn't say a freaking word. It was the best moment of the entire thing, even better than the contract proposal.

Long story short, I opened my own law firm one week later. I now pay 20% less in overhead. I work dramatically reduced hours because I have actual, dedicated staff for just me - which they would never give me. Also, my gross receipts are up about 10% in the first 12 months. Life is good.

As a post script - the incompetent managing partner hired a guy to fill my office. Remember, that office was earning over $250,000 for the firm in the proceeding 24 months. The guy was paid a salary for six months - rather than have his pay tied to his productivity. Eventually it came out he was a total fraud who lied about being licensed in our state (he did have a different, faraway state). He even filed court documents without the appropriate license. He was fired immediately and the office remains vacant, producing zero profits. Schadenfreude? Yes.

Also as a disclaimer, there are many, many attorneys who are great at servicing their clients but not so good at business. In the event I needed legal help, I would immediately hire any of these attorneys - except the managing partner. They really are competent, professional people - but bad business and money managers. In the end, I maintained great relationships with everyone except the managing partner and the office administrator.

I have an update to this story. Recently, one of the partners of this law firm left and decided to open his law firm, right across the hallway from me. I got a little inside info that had remained hidden for two years.

It turns out the Managing Partner and the toxic office administrator were totally in cahoots to oust me from the firm. After I delivered my proposal, described above, there was a meeting where the partners were going to respond. Apparently, it had been the topic of conversation that it would not make sense for me to continue to pay larger and larger sums of money and they would eventually have to change my deal - which is what I was asking for.  So, my proposal was not a surprise and they were willing to work with me.

Enter the managing partner and administrator: the administrator entered the partner meeting and tendered her immediate resignation if she had to continue to work with me. She then walked out. This would have created a temporary chaos and she was the paralegal for the firms' founder who no one would override. So, they didn't make me a counter offer and instead asked, "If we don't keep him, will Administrator come back." To which managing partner replied immediately, "I'll talk to her about that." Moments later, the resignation was withdrawn and my fate was sealed. The partner who just left the firm - because the same managing partner and toxic administrator were costing him lots and lots of money and stress, said he was in shock at how the whole group had been so masterfully manipulated.

If you recall the story from above, I told her off AFTER she had done all this. It only makes it sweeter.

As they say, living well is the best revenge. I've had my own practice for two years now. I've doubled my net worth. I work 20-30 hours less per week and make more money. Life is good. They really did me a huge favor.

P.S. My leading theory on why the office administrator wanted me gone is that if I had stayed I would have been forced to address her purposely mis-coding my cases and, thereby, underpaying me. This would have been very bad for her as a major breach of trust. So, I think she knew that if I stayed her shenanigans would become a mini-office scandal and potentially she could lose her job. She went for the jugular when she had the chance. Why the Managing Partner was so upset? I think it had to do with calling her out on the $10,000 in front of everyone. But why did they turn their eyes to me prior to the $10,000 blow up and coding discovery? I'll never really know.

Wow.  Fucking lawyers.  No offense.

If I understand correctly, they were screwing you over by reclassifying your work so they could pay you less.  I'm surprised you let that go so easily. 

Sounds like that practice has serious ethical issues.  Have you considered reporting them to any applicable oversight?
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Exhale on September 11, 2016, 09:51:03 PM
Asshair#2 is a combo-creature of someone I'll call Agnes - my group's test manager - and a {redacted} test-lead I'll call Luna.

Why is that relevant? Also, the term is "dyke" unless your talking about a geographical feature.
I saw that and thought it was some random car-speak that I didn't understand.

Apologies all around.  It bothered me more than anyone, and was poor attempt to be descriptive, and instead came off as offensive.  I've updated the OP to indicate the effect of the behavior - this Asshair's unwavering vehement and consistent prejudice against men (misandrist).  It was a large factor, but one I could not address, mention, or even acknowledge within the office political environment without giving the perception of being a white-male misogynist insensitive anti-feminist.  (Hopefully none of which could ever be used to validly describe *this* Mother Fussbudget)

I've updated original post, but it would require a MOD to edit quotes by others
Thanks for the follow-up and apology. Gold. Star.

Ditto and many thanks! Truly appreciate you doing this.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: FIREby35 on September 12, 2016, 06:30:24 AM


Wow.  Fucking lawyers.  No offense.

If I understand correctly, they were screwing you over by reclassifying your work so they could pay you less.  I'm surprised you let that go so easily. 

Sounds like that practice has serious ethical issues.  Have you considered reporting them to any applicable oversight?




It was actually the non-lawyer who did the miscoding :) It wasn't a lot of money, maybe a few thousand dollars out of a few hundred thousand dollars. Also, the other attorneys in the firm are influential. For example, they could sabotage a judicial application or some other appointment. Although, with FIRE as a goal you can imagine that isn't super high on my priority list. But still, it was not really in my interest to make enemies.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: FunkyStickman on September 12, 2016, 06:44:58 AM
Update on my, erm, "working" situation:
They divulged info for voluntary separation packages this week.
The numbers were pretty dismal.... but it's either that, or risk getting let go and getting nothing.
We'll see what happens in the next few weeks.

Wife told me "for once, I'm totally not worried. We're prepared for this financially."
Put a huge smile on my face.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Secretly Saving on September 12, 2016, 07:54:00 AM
Wife told me "for once, I'm totally not worried. We're prepared for this financially."
Put a huge smile on my face.

That must have felt great.  You have the ability to weather a storm because of the financial plans you've made and you have a wife who feels confident despite the upcoming uncertainty! 
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Sibley on September 12, 2016, 09:28:32 AM
Wife told me "for once, I'm totally not worried. We're prepared for this financially."
Put a huge smile on my face.

That must have felt great.  You have the ability to weather a storm because of the financial plans you've made and you have a wife who feels confident despite the upcoming uncertainty!

Similar stuff at my company (it's hit the news now, so I have no fears). I'm not eligible for the voluntary separation, but I did update my resume. Don't expect anything will happen until mid 2017, if not later. And considering the number of emails I get from recruiters, I have no worries about finding a new job if its necessary.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Apples on September 12, 2016, 10:42:00 AM
Wife told me "for once, I'm totally not worried. We're prepared for this financially."
Put a huge smile on my face.

That must have felt great.  You have the ability to weather a storm because of the financial plans you've made and you have a wife who feels confident despite the upcoming uncertainty!

Yes!  That's a wonderful feeling.  Well done.  My DH quit his job on the spot almost 2 years ago now, and spent 2 months going to local places sniffing out the perfect job.  We weren't worried financially in the least.  It feels so good.  Glad you guys have that.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: arebelspy on September 13, 2016, 03:28:15 AM
Similar stuff at my company (it's hit the news now, so I have no fears). I'm not eligible for the voluntary separation, but I did update my resume. Don't expect anything will happen until mid 2017, if not later. And considering the number of emails I get from recruiters, I have no worries about finding a new job if its necessary.

Why not be proactive and follow up with some of the recruiters now, while you don't need to, rather than hope stuff is still available when it becomes necessary?  Often worth a switch anyways for a raise.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Metric Mouse on September 13, 2016, 09:31:05 AM
Wife told me "for once, I'm totally not worried. We're prepared for this financially."
Put a huge smile on my face.

That must have felt great.  You have the ability to weather a storm because of the financial plans you've made and you have a wife who feels confident despite the upcoming uncertainty!

Yes!  That's a wonderful feeling.  Well done.  My DH quit his job on the spot almost 2 years ago now, and spent 2 months going to local places sniffing out the perfect job.  We weren't worried financially in the least.  It feels so good.  Glad you guys have that.

One of the best feelings in the world, for sure.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Vertical Mode on September 13, 2016, 10:46:17 AM
Similar stuff at my company (it's hit the news now, so I have no fears). I'm not eligible for the voluntary separation, but I did update my resume. Don't expect anything will happen until mid 2017, if not later. And considering the number of emails I get from recruiters, I have no worries about finding a new job if its necessary.

Why not be proactive and follow up with some of the recruiters now, while you don't need to, rather than hope stuff is still available when it becomes necessary?  Often worth a switch anyways for a raise.

Also take into account that, if layoffs happen in bunches, you're going to be competing with a flood of others for the same positions. If you reposition yourself ahead of the wave, you're off-peak relative to when all of your former colleagues are looking. Who's to say that these same recruiters aren't also talking to your coworkers?
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: RyanAtTanagra on September 13, 2016, 11:08:00 AM
Similar stuff at my company (it's hit the news now, so I have no fears). I'm not eligible for the voluntary separation, but I did update my resume. Don't expect anything will happen until mid 2017, if not later. And considering the number of emails I get from recruiters, I have no worries about finding a new job if its necessary.

Why not be proactive and follow up with some of the recruiters now, while you don't need to, rather than hope stuff is still available when it becomes necessary?  Often worth a switch anyways for a raise.

Also take into account that, if layoffs happen in bunches, you're going to be competing with a flood of others for the same positions. If you reposition yourself ahead of the wave, you're off-peak relative to when all of your former colleagues are looking. Who's to say that these same recruiters aren't also talking to your coworkers?

I've heard more than one story here of people, amidst rumors of layoffs, were proactive and found a great new job before they happened, while everyone else stayed, clutching their job hoping to survive.  Everyone that got cut was now competing with everyone else for the few jobs out there, often taking something lower paying because it's all that was left.  If you have a year I'd start considering offers, even if you're really picky about them.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: TheBeardedIrishman on September 13, 2016, 11:18:41 AM
My fu moment came in February  of this year after three years in sales making a ton of money as a young lad however I caught my higher up management taking money out of my comission and putting it into their own . . STEALING.. when I started asking questions they become very defensive. . So I quit right after making a sale. . Literally walked out and said I am going in a different direction. . Fast forward to now my wife and I own our own company buying and selling real estate and we have double our net worth within that time frame. . I often want to call and instead of saying fu  say thank you so so much for what you did. .
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Dicey on September 14, 2016, 10:41:12 AM
My fu moment came in February  of this year after three years in sales making a ton of money as a young lad however I caught my higher up management taking money out of my comission and putting it into their own . . STEALING.. when I started asking questions they become very defensive. . So I quit right after making a sale. . Literally walked out and said I am going in a different direction. . Fast forward to now my wife and I own our own company buying and selling real estate and we have double our net worth within that time frame. . I often want to call and instead of saying fu  say thank you so so much for what you did. .
Loved your last sentence! Badass indeed.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Papa Mustache on September 14, 2016, 10:48:55 AM
Wife told me "for once, I'm totally not worried. We're prepared for this financially."
Put a huge smile on my face.

That must have felt great.  You have the ability to weather a storm because of the financial plans you've made and you have a wife who feels confident despite the upcoming uncertainty!

Similar stuff at my company (it's hit the news now, so I have no fears). I'm not eligible for the voluntary separation, but I did update my resume. Don't expect anything will happen until mid 2017, if not later. And considering the number of emails I get from recruiters, I have no worries about finding a new job if its necessary.

How to do you initially connect with recruiters?
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Sibley on September 14, 2016, 12:06:37 PM
Wife told me "for once, I'm totally not worried. We're prepared for this financially."
Put a huge smile on my face.

That must have felt great.  You have the ability to weather a storm because of the financial plans you've made and you have a wife who feels confident despite the upcoming uncertainty!

Similar stuff at my company (it's hit the news now, so I have no fears). I'm not eligible for the voluntary separation, but I did update my resume. Don't expect anything will happen until mid 2017, if not later. And considering the number of emails I get from recruiters, I have no worries about finding a new job if its necessary.

How to do you initially connect with recruiters?

In my case, they connect with me on linked in. I ignore them.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: TexasRunner on September 14, 2016, 12:26:25 PM
How to do you initially connect with recruiters?

Linkedin.  Responding to online job ads (typically Indeed).  Sometimes through CL Jobs section.  Also, you can google search and call recruiters that work in your specific industry and location.

Seriously, make sure you have a LinkedIn account.  Update something and it will ping recruiters that you have an 'active' tag.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: RyanAtTanagra on September 14, 2016, 12:30:03 PM
How to do you initially connect with recruiters?

Linkedin.  Responding to online job ads (typically Indeed).  Sometimes through CL Jobs section.  Also, you can google search and call recruiters that work in your specific industry and location.

Seriously, make sure you have a LinkedIn account.  Update something and it will ping recruiters that you have an 'active' tag.

You can contact the big recruiters first, and you'll forever be on their list from then on.  I'm not on LinkedIn and I get contacted constantly from recruiters in states I haven't lived in for 5 years, because I once talked to them about a job.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: FunkyStickman on October 01, 2016, 06:27:23 PM
Just to give you folks an update on my situation:

I was told Wednesday that my position is being eliminated in a couple of weeks. I'm now looking for work.

They moved me from an office job to working 11-hour shifts on the factory floor assembling heavy machinery, because so many people have quit. My legs and feet are killing me- especially the hardware implanted in my left leg. Screw that, man.

Yeah.... I'm not sticking around. FU money, indeed. Got a few months income while I look for more suitable work.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: ender on October 01, 2016, 06:36:01 PM
Just to give you folks an update on my situation:

I was told Wednesday that my position is being eliminated in a couple of weeks. I'm now looking for work.

They moved me from an office job to working 11-hour shifts on the factory floor assembling heavy machinery, because so many people have quit. My legs and feet are killing me- especially the hardware implanted in my left leg. Screw that, man.

Yeah.... I'm not sticking around. FU money, indeed. Got a few months income while I look for more suitable work.

Sad to hear.

Glad to hear you are going to get the last laugh ;-)
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: TomTX on October 01, 2016, 06:43:55 PM
Just to give you folks an update on my situation:

I was told Wednesday that my position is being eliminated in a couple of weeks. I'm now looking for work.

They moved me from an office job to working 11-hour shifts on the factory floor assembling heavy machinery, because so many people have quit. My legs and feet are killing me- especially the hardware implanted in my left leg. Screw that, man.

Yeah.... I'm not sticking around. FU money, indeed. Got a few months income while I look for more suitable work.

Unemployment filing sounds justified
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: arebelspy on October 01, 2016, 08:02:15 PM
Sorry to hear it.  Glad you're in a good position financially to deal with it.  I'm sure some of your coworkers are hurting.

Good luck with the job search!  Start now, while still employed.  :)
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: No Name Guy on October 02, 2016, 10:40:58 AM
Update on my FU story.  As a reminder, this is the person that got effed over by a bean counter for not perfectly following a ridiculously complex accounting system.

I chatted with him a bit back and he is currently enrolled in the local community college to learn a foreign language.  His plan is to slow travel this country next spring / summer.

Ahhh....having the money to tell bean counters where to shove it.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Metric Mouse on October 04, 2016, 12:13:51 AM

Ahhh....having the money to tell bean counters where to shove it.

That 'ahh' feeling, for those that haven't felt it, is the same one that working people get on the weekend when they can enjoy their morning coffee on their sunny patio with nothing else planned.  Or, at least, that's what I imagine working people feel like...
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: marty998 on October 04, 2016, 01:33:02 AM
Update on my FU story.  As a reminder, this is the person that got effed over by a bean counter for not perfectly following a ridiculously complex accounting system.

I chatted with him a bit back and he is currently enrolled in the local community college to learn a foreign language.  His plan is to slow travel this country next spring / summer.

Ahhh....having the money to tell bean counters where to shove it.

On behalf of all Bean Counters I can tell you we have just as much trouble with complex accounting systems as the rest of you lot.

We blame the IT guys.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: zolotiyeruki on October 04, 2016, 06:43:43 AM
We blame the IT guys.
Shouldn't we all be blaming the lawyers and politicians?
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: TexasRunner on October 04, 2016, 07:30:07 AM
We blame the IT guys.
Shouldn't we all be blaming the lawyers and politicians?
The answer to this is always yes.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Papa Mustache on October 04, 2016, 09:43:13 AM
How to do you initially connect with recruiters?

Linkedin.  Responding to online job ads (typically Indeed).  Sometimes through CL Jobs section.  Also, you can google search and call recruiters that work in your specific industry and location.

Seriously, make sure you have a LinkedIn account.  Update something and it will ping recruiters that you have an 'active' tag.

You can contact the big recruiters first, and you'll forever be on their list from then on.  I'm not on LinkedIn and I get contacted constantly from recruiters in states I haven't lived in for 5 years, because I once talked to them about a job.

Thanks. I killed off my LinkedIn account a few years ago. Might rethink that now. Am happy where I am but always want to be ready to leap if something changes for the worse.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: WerKater on October 04, 2016, 09:54:48 AM
Update on my FU story.  As a reminder, this is the person that got effed over by a bean counter for not perfectly following a ridiculously complex accounting system.

I chatted with him a bit back and he is currently enrolled in the local community college to learn a foreign language.  His plan is to slow travel this country next spring / summer.

Ahhh....having the money to tell bean counters where to shove it.

On behalf of all Bean Counters I can tell you we have just as much trouble with complex accounting systems as the rest of you lot.

We blame the IT guys.
And we IT guys blame managers who requested the overly complex system (or forced us to make a well-working, simple system much more complex) because they absolutely needed some useless reporting function. With colors. And interactive. And "can you put it on a website so I can check it from my phone"?
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Pooperman on October 04, 2016, 10:31:41 AM
Update on my FU story.  As a reminder, this is the person that got effed over by a bean counter for not perfectly following a ridiculously complex accounting system.

I chatted with him a bit back and he is currently enrolled in the local community college to learn a foreign language.  His plan is to slow travel this country next spring / summer.

Ahhh....having the money to tell bean counters where to shove it.

On behalf of all Bean Counters I can tell you we have just as much trouble with complex accounting systems as the rest of you lot.

We blame the IT guys.
And we IT guys blame managers who requested the overly complex system (or forced us to make a well-working, simple system much more complex) because they absolutely needed some useless reporting function. With colors. And interactive. And "can you put it on a website so I can check it from my phone"?

Don't forget the sales people. They're in on it too.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Threshkin on October 04, 2016, 10:41:40 AM
(http://www.plctalk.net/qanda/uploads/projecttree1.jpg)
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: RedmondStash on October 04, 2016, 11:38:43 AM
(http://www.plctalk.net/qanda/uploads/projecttree1.jpg)

OMG. A thing of beauty.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: sw1tch on October 04, 2016, 12:17:27 PM
I am about to print that and put it on my cube wall.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: JLee on October 04, 2016, 12:30:18 PM
Update on my FU story.  As a reminder, this is the person that got effed over by a bean counter for not perfectly following a ridiculously complex accounting system.

I chatted with him a bit back and he is currently enrolled in the local community college to learn a foreign language.  His plan is to slow travel this country next spring / summer.

Ahhh....having the money to tell bean counters where to shove it.

On behalf of all Bean Counters I can tell you we have just as much trouble with complex accounting systems as the rest of you lot.

We blame the IT guys.
And we IT guys blame managers who requested the overly complex system (or forced us to make a well-working, simple system much more complex) because they absolutely needed some useless reporting function. With colors. And interactive. And "can you put it on a website so I can check it from my phone"?

Or they want $500k in performance, scalability, and redundancy, but only want to spend $50k to do it.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: mm1970 on October 04, 2016, 12:57:49 PM
Update on my FU story.  As a reminder, this is the person that got effed over by a bean counter for not perfectly following a ridiculously complex accounting system.

I chatted with him a bit back and he is currently enrolled in the local community college to learn a foreign language.  His plan is to slow travel this country next spring / summer.

Ahhh....having the money to tell bean counters where to shove it.

On behalf of all Bean Counters I can tell you we have just as much trouble with complex accounting systems as the rest of you lot.

We blame the IT guys.
And we IT guys blame managers who requested the overly complex system (or forced us to make a well-working, simple system much more complex) because they absolutely needed some useless reporting function. With colors. And interactive. And "can you put it on a website so I can check it from my phone"?

Or they want $500k in performance, scalability, and redundancy, but only want to spend $50k to do it.
No no no, what managers REALLY want is this great reporting system that links all the databases that we have.  So we can pull, analyze, and report data efficiently!

But!! What they want is to NOT spend any money on it.  No, we don't need in-house IT, nor do we need a full time DBA!  We are a start up and WE CAN DO IT, with one lady who lives in another state & works part time, one guy who works full time somewhere else and comes in for a few hours a week, one young guy who likes programming on the side and...people like me, who SUCK at programming but are DESPERATE to find ways to pull the data that doesn't involve hours of cutting and pasting, or querying 3 different databases.

/rant
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Kitsune on October 04, 2016, 01:09:17 PM
Update on my FU story.  As a reminder, this is the person that got effed over by a bean counter for not perfectly following a ridiculously complex accounting system.

I chatted with him a bit back and he is currently enrolled in the local community college to learn a foreign language.  His plan is to slow travel this country next spring / summer.

Ahhh....having the money to tell bean counters where to shove it.

On behalf of all Bean Counters I can tell you we have just as much trouble with complex accounting systems as the rest of you lot.

We blame the IT guys.
And we IT guys blame managers who requested the overly complex system (or forced us to make a well-working, simple system much more complex) because they absolutely needed some useless reporting function. With colors. And interactive. And "can you put it on a website so I can check it from my phone"?

Or they want $500k in performance, scalability, and redundancy, but only want to spend $50k to do it.
No no no, what managers REALLY want is this great reporting system that links all the databases that we have.  So we can pull, analyze, and report data efficiently!

But!! What they want is to NOT spend any money on it.  No, we don't need in-house IT, nor do we need a full time DBA!  We are a start up and WE CAN DO IT, with one lady who lives in another state & works part time, one guy who works full time somewhere else and comes in for a few hours a week, one young guy who likes programming on the side and...people like me, who SUCK at programming but are DESPERATE to find ways to pull the data that doesn't involve hours of cutting and pasting, or querying 3 different databases.

/rant

Or people like me, who find ways to run Excel files built on vlookup and formulas to extract data out of the incompatible extracts of 3 different databases. And then the bosses wonder why they can't do it... 'cause you didn't spend a few days building the 'master' Excel file that bridges the gap between your stupid system, and like hell am I letting you mess with it, that's why.

*grump*

Oh, turns out getting the data we actually need out of the system? Less than 5K programming. How long has this been pending? A year. How much of my time (and salary) has been spent figuring work-arounds to the same information? Significanly more.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: No Name Guy on October 04, 2016, 01:39:25 PM
Update on my FU story.  As a reminder, this is the person that got effed over by a bean counter for not perfectly following a ridiculously complex accounting system.

I chatted with him a bit back and he is currently enrolled in the local community college to learn a foreign language.  His plan is to slow travel this country next spring / summer.

Ahhh....having the money to tell bean counters where to shove it.

On behalf of all Bean Counters I can tell you we have just as much trouble with complex accounting systems as the rest of you lot.

We blame the IT guys.
And we IT guys blame managers who requested the overly complex system (or forced us to make a well-working, simple system much more complex) because they absolutely needed some useless reporting function. With colors. And interactive. And "can you put it on a website so I can check it from my phone"?

Nope...this one is straight on the bean counters. 

See, back in the day, even when I was a young pup engineer, bean counters were a sensible lot.  When there was a project, they kept the accounting codes identical throughout the length of a project.  They kept the number of codes to a reasonably small number.  Proving you were using the right codes was easy - go to your manager and get the "Big Book of Accounting Codes" which had about 1 sheet and 10-15 codes in it.  While the engineers grumbled a bit, all in all it was easy to correctly charge so rarely did an engineer get his balls busted by a bean counter for making a mistake (see the correlation - easy system, easy to get it right).  And low and behold, the bean counters could actually provide useful information on past projects.  Like, how much did we actually spend accomplishing Task X on Project Y for Customer Z, since we have Customer B asking for their version of Project Y (lets call that Project Y Alpha) and I need to put in my estimate for Task X-Alpha.\

Now, on the other hand, bean counters are useless pieces of overhead dead weight.  Accounting codes, which the bean counters control, are changed at random intervals.  They proliferate faster than rabbits, with correspondingly narrower and narrower scope per code.  We're audited by bean counters who, I suppose are competent at counting beans, but are ignorant about technical work and if what you're doing is within the described scope of the code.  Their ignorance is my problem, not the other way around - their ignorance can get me fired.   Additional variation codes are added (for example, on training, the generic training code isn't good enough any more, nope....gotta code each individual training class).  The " Big Book of Accounting Codes" no longer exists - it's now an on line resource (since with all the code changes all the time, we just HAD to have it on line instead of paper so those doing actual work could access the most up to date codes)...with an absolutely useless search function that guarantees if you don't already know the correct code, you can never, never I tell you (while twirling my Evil Mustache) find the correct code.  As a results, at times HOURS are wasted trying to find the correct accounting code.  With all the constantly changing codes, the bean counters are now absolutely unable to correlate our past project costs.  What, you want to put in a bid for Project Y Beta based on Project Y and Project Y Alpha?  Sorry, I can't correlate all the charges for Task X and Task X Alpha since we changed the accounting codes at least a half dozen times.

So, yes, in this case, it IS in fact evil bean counters.  It's not the IT system, the bean counters made the coding so effing complex, so narrow, and change it all the time so as to make it almost impossible to comply.  The bean counters own the codes.  All they have to do is stop changing them, and stop narrowing the scope of them.  Of course, the problem then is the Pointy Hair Bean Counter would have to fire 3/4 of his staff due to the reduced bean counting work load, and that would down grade him from a "big important PHB" with a corner office to a peon PHB with an inside office, seriously crimping his empire building.

And I shall have my FU money one day (which I suppose I already do, at 28-30x retirement expenses, but I want 33x as margin) and shall tell the bean counters to shove the beans up their bums, so they're in sight of their eyeballs.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: marty998 on October 04, 2016, 02:32:41 PM
Hmmm... No Name Guy...

Our project reporting starts off simple, then Project Managers start getting upset that we tally up ALL of their expenses, including their celebration drinks.

I've had PMs ask me "what is this?" and then express shock when I send them over the invoice they signed 3 weeks earlier.

It's starts with a single account code (IT project costs), cost centre and project identifier code.

Then they complain about not getting GST refunds, so we add a GST account code for certain expenses.

Then they complain that the contractors costs are being lumped with permanent staff, so we split the staff costs in two.

Then they complain that the IT staff costs are being captured in the staff expense line and not the IT line, so we need a manual workaround that fits with their reporting and not the overall group.

Then they complain that the costs are not being broken down by region, so we implement cost centres for each country in the world.

Then they wonder why we keep coming back to them asking to confirm the details they've written on invoices because according to their own reporting requirement they've coded it incorrectly.

I shouldn't rant however. These guys help keep me employed :)

Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: G-dog on October 04, 2016, 04:35:11 PM
Update on my FU story.  As a reminder, this is the person that got effed over by a bean counter for not perfectly following a ridiculously complex accounting system.

I chatted with him a bit back and he is currently enrolled in the local community college to learn a foreign language.  His plan is to slow travel this country next spring / summer.

Ahhh....having the money to tell bean counters where to shove it.

On behalf of all Bean Counters I can tell you we have just as much trouble with complex accounting systems as the rest of you lot.

We blame the IT guys.
And we IT guys blame managers who requested the overly complex system (or forced us to make a well-working, simple system much more complex) because they absolutely needed some useless reporting function. With colors. And interactive. And "can you put it on a website so I can check it from my phone"?

Or they want $500k in performance, scalability, and redundancy, but only want to spend $50k to do it.
No no no, what managers REALLY want is this great reporting system that links all the databases that we have.  So we can pull, analyze, and report data efficiently!

But!! What they want is to NOT spend any money on it.  No, we don't need in-house IT, nor do we need a full time DBA!  We are a start up and WE CAN DO IT, with one lady who lives in another state & works part time, one guy who works full time somewhere else and comes in for a few hours a week, one young guy who likes programming on the side and...people like me, who SUCK at programming but are DESPERATE to find ways to pull the data that doesn't involve hours of cutting and pasting, or querying 3 different databases.

/rant

Hey, I don't remember writing this? and this isn't my username? But, this was my life!
Funny how companies want to get everything cheap, but want to charges their customers a premium...
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Papa Mustache on October 05, 2016, 09:36:08 AM
Hmmm... No Name Guy...

Our project reporting starts off simple, then Project Managers start getting upset that we tally up ALL of their expenses, including their celebration drinks.

I've had PMs ask me "what is this?" and then express shock when I send them over the invoice they signed 3 weeks earlier.

It's starts with a single account code (IT project costs), cost centre and project identifier code.

Then they complain about not getting GST refunds, so we add a GST account code for certain expenses.

Then they complain that the contractors costs are being lumped with permanent staff, so we split the staff costs in two.

Then they complain that the IT staff costs are being captured in the staff expense line and not the IT line, so we need a manual workaround that fits with their reporting and not the overall group.

Then they complain that the costs are not being broken down by region, so we implement cost centres for each country in the world.

Then they wonder why we keep coming back to them asking to confirm the details they've written on invoices because according to their own reporting requirement they've coded it incorrectly.

I shouldn't rant however. These guys help keep me employed :)

Then I have nothing to complain about... Holy cow what a POS system. The lack of logic I deal with at work is a whole magnitude lower. ;)
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: mm1970 on October 05, 2016, 09:43:43 AM
Update on my FU story.  As a reminder, this is the person that got effed over by a bean counter for not perfectly following a ridiculously complex accounting system.

I chatted with him a bit back and he is currently enrolled in the local community college to learn a foreign language.  His plan is to slow travel this country next spring / summer.

Ahhh....having the money to tell bean counters where to shove it.

On behalf of all Bean Counters I can tell you we have just as much trouble with complex accounting systems as the rest of you lot.

We blame the IT guys.
And we IT guys blame managers who requested the overly complex system (or forced us to make a well-working, simple system much more complex) because they absolutely needed some useless reporting function. With colors. And interactive. And "can you put it on a website so I can check it from my phone"?

Or they want $500k in performance, scalability, and redundancy, but only want to spend $50k to do it.
No no no, what managers REALLY want is this great reporting system that links all the databases that we have.  So we can pull, analyze, and report data efficiently!

But!! What they want is to NOT spend any money on it.  No, we don't need in-house IT, nor do we need a full time DBA!  We are a start up and WE CAN DO IT, with one lady who lives in another state & works part time, one guy who works full time somewhere else and comes in for a few hours a week, one young guy who likes programming on the side and...people like me, who SUCK at programming but are DESPERATE to find ways to pull the data that doesn't involve hours of cutting and pasting, or querying 3 different databases.

/rant

Hey, I don't remember writing this? and this isn't my username? But, this was my life!
Funny how companies want to get everything cheap, but want to charges their customers a premium...
I'm sorry that you feel my pain...the pain of the last 8 years...
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: G-dog on October 05, 2016, 09:49:26 AM
Update on my FU story.  As a reminder, this is the person that got effed over by a bean counter for not perfectly following a ridiculously complex accounting system.

I chatted with him a bit back and he is currently enrolled in the local community college to learn a foreign language.  His plan is to slow travel this country next spring / summer.

Ahhh....having the money to tell bean counters where to shove it.

On behalf of all Bean Counters I can tell you we have just as much trouble with complex accounting systems as the rest of you lot.

We blame the IT guys.
And we IT guys blame managers who requested the overly complex system (or forced us to make a well-working, simple system much more complex) because they absolutely needed some useless reporting function. With colors. And interactive. And "can you put it on a website so I can check it from my phone"?

Or they want $500k in performance, scalability, and redundancy, but only want to spend $50k to do it.
No no no, what managers REALLY want is this great reporting system that links all the databases that we have.  So we can pull, analyze, and report data efficiently!

But!! What they want is to NOT spend any money on it.  No, we don't need in-house IT, nor do we need a full time DBA!  We are a start up and WE CAN DO IT, with one lady who lives in another state & works part time, one guy who works full time somewhere else and comes in for a few hours a week, one young guy who likes programming on the side and...people like me, who SUCK at programming but are DESPERATE to find ways to pull the data that doesn't involve hours of cutting and pasting, or querying 3 different databases.

/rant

Hey, I don't remember writing this? and this isn't my username? But, this was my life!
Funny how companies want to get everything cheap, but want to charges their customers a premium...
I'm sorry that you feel my pain...the pain of the last 8 years...

I'm sorry that you are still soaking in it. My former company is still in the process of granting HUGE bonuses to the upper mngmt and cheating out on everything (mostly by putting it on hold). The amount of profit companies could make if they supported good systems and good workers is mind blowing! I think a factor of 10 increase at least.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Mother Fussbudget on October 05, 2016, 12:57:05 PM
Asshair#0: (c.1986 - I'd completely forgotten about this one. Not Epic, but a 'probationary-to-FTE' lesson here...)
Just out of college, my 2nd short-lived IT job (my last, and only COBOL coding job) was at Loyal American Life Insurance (now defunct). They were the most regimented IT shop I've ever seen. Every day everyone had MANDATORY clock-in (with an old-fashioned time-clock & time-cards) within 5 min of 8am every morning, AND clock out within 5 min of 5pm.  Also, MANDATORY breaks: 15 min at 9:30am, 30 min (lunch) at noon, and 15 min at 3:15pm. Very dehumanizing. 

I was in my 8th year DJ-ing at WABB-FM - a local independent rock station - where I cut back to working strictly weekends while working at Loyal American during the week.  The reason I needed to stay on at the radio station was Loyal American was THE LOWEST PAYING IT SHOP in the region. They not only knew it, but the DevManager kept a public file posted on the system documenting the salaries at other local IT shops (this list included hospitals, tire-manufacturing plants, etc.) The DevManager was working to try to raise salaries for everyone, and hoped to raise everyone very soon.  I started at the Probationary-Programmer rate of $16K/year.  If I did well, within 3 months, I would get a raise to $18K as a regular Programmer.  Joy.  So rather than drop radio airtime duties completely, I kept working weekends to make ends meet. [NOTE:  I pursued a CS degree to increase my income potential.  I had learned the average pay at WABB was around $20K/year as a full-time DJ.]

Also, because of the low pay, I was convinced someone with a good work ethic and enthusiasm could find a better job, so I did NOT stop circulating my resume.  I kept looking for outside work while at Loyal American.  AND, the salary comparison chart gave me 5 additional places to apply! 

Fast forward to the holidays. After 3+ months I received a promotion to FTE Programmer with the updated salary effective on 12/22.  Yay!

BUT... I only received that salary for two holiday-shortened weeks.  The 2nd week of January, I was called into a meeting with the DevManager, and told I was being fired for poor performance.  I was shocked, and stunned having JUST been promoted less than 3 weeks ago - why the sudden change.  The DevManager couldn't come up with any convincing reasons, but the decision was final.  I packed, and left. 

- - - - -

Later, I found out from shocked colleagues what REALLY happened.  Fresh out of college, I stupidly included the Loyal American job on my resume.
[NOTE to others:  if you're looking for a job, and consider a job a temporary position - do NOT include that 'temp' job on your resume.]
I sent that resume to two job applications - including a nearby Sony plant with an IT department. The SONY Director of IT *knew* the Loyal American Director of IT - aka 'Asshair#0' - and called for a reference. (they were golfing buddies)  Asshair#0 apparently said:  "Oh, we were just thinking of firing him".  Bottom line:  Asshair#0 was 'embarrassed' to find one of his happy little automatons was looking for work "without permission" (?!?!) outside the 'happy Loyal American IT shop',  and fired him/me to 'save face'. 

In later years, I learned this is illegal - a violation of federal labor laws.  You cannot give someone a promotion to a regular position (which ends the 'probationary period') and turn around 2 weeks later and 'fire for lack of performance'.  The promotion assumes acceptable performance.  But I was fresh out of school, and didn't want fight it. I didn't want to deal with the negative karma dredged up by fighting the system.  AND... in my own mind I thanked Asshair#0 for giving me a "kick-in-my-complacency...ass".  Had Asshair#0 not 'fired' me, I would never have gotten off my ass and looked for work in Silicon Valley.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: JustGettingStarted1980 on October 06, 2016, 07:18:40 AM
These petty men (and women), with their little fiefdoms.... these can't possible be happy individuals, can they?
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: FIREby35 on October 06, 2016, 07:22:48 AM
These petty men (and women), with their little fiefdoms.... these can't possible be happy individuals, can they?

I don't think so. But, they seem to be everywhere. I'll never understand it.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: UnleashHell on October 06, 2016, 10:48:26 AM
Update on my FU story.  As a reminder, this is the person that got effed over by a bean counter for not perfectly following a ridiculously complex accounting system.

I chatted with him a bit back and he is currently enrolled in the local community college to learn a foreign language.  His plan is to slow travel this country next spring / summer.

Ahhh....having the money to tell bean counters where to shove it.

On behalf of all Bean Counters I can tell you we have just as much trouble with complex accounting systems as the rest of you lot.

We blame the IT guys.
And we IT guys blame managers who requested the overly complex system (or forced us to make a well-working, simple system much more complex) because they absolutely needed some useless reporting function. With colors. And interactive. And "can you put it on a website so I can check it from my phone"?

Or they want $500k in performance, scalability, and redundancy, but only want to spend $50k to do it.
No no no, what managers REALLY want is this great reporting system that links all the databases that we have.  So we can pull, analyze, and report data efficiently!

But!! What they want is to NOT spend any money on it.  No, we don't need in-house IT, nor do we need a full time DBA!  We are a start up and WE CAN DO IT, with one lady who lives in another state & works part time, one guy who works full time somewhere else and comes in for a few hours a week, one young guy who likes programming on the side and...people like me, who SUCK at programming but are DESPERATE to find ways to pull the data that doesn't involve hours of cutting and pasting, or querying 3 different databases.

/rant

Or people like me, who find ways to run Excel files built on vlookup and formulas to extract data out of the incompatible extracts of 3 different databases. And then the bosses wonder why they can't do it... 'cause you didn't spend a few days building the 'master' Excel file that bridges the gap between your stupid system, and like hell am I letting you mess with it, that's why.

*grump*

Oh, turns out getting the data we actually need out of the system? Less than 5K programming. How long has this been pending? A year. How much of my time (and salary) has been spent figuring work-arounds to the same information? Significanly more.

annoying but add access to the excel and thats been my career for the last 10 years. not the next ten though. problems don;t change. staff do!!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: jexy103 on October 06, 2016, 11:59:29 PM
Love everyone's stories! Some are truly inspiring, and at the very least, they remind me that I'm not alone in dealing with unpleasant bosses. I love a PP's line that employees don't quit their jobs, they quit their managers. So true for me. I'm cooking up my own FU story that should reach fruition in a few weeks. I'll post my story once I pull it off.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Taran Wanderer on October 07, 2016, 04:23:39 PM
Hey Jexy,

No need to go force something just to have an epic contribution to this thread!

TW
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: jexy103 on October 17, 2016, 02:54:14 AM
Hey Jexy,

No need to go force something just to have an epic contribution to this thread!

TW

TW, I'm not forcing anything - this lady deserves it! I need to stick around a few more weeks for personal goal reasons, but I'm leaving as soon afterward as I can and it's because of her (and my second-line supervisor not reining her in). She thinks I'm staying until early February, so she'll be surprised to come back from vacation and I have <4 days left of my two weeks' notice remaining.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: theadvicist on December 01, 2016, 08:40:59 AM
Commenting just so I can see updates from Jexy! Stay sensible though.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: dogboyslim on December 01, 2016, 09:43:41 AM
<Image removed>

I hadn't seen that one, but this one is on the wall of one of my PMs cubes:
(https://architectdesigned.files.wordpress.com/2015/08/tree-swing.png)
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: LeRainDrop on December 01, 2016, 05:07:25 PM
I hadn't seen that one, but this one is on the wall of one of my PMs cubes:

dogboyslim, I love that!  I'm totally going to pass that around with my colleagues.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Metric Mouse on December 03, 2016, 05:51:52 AM
I hadn't seen that one, but this one is on the wall of one of my PMs cubes:

dogboyslim, I love that!  I'm totally going to pass that around with my colleagues.

Nice.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: jexy103 on December 06, 2016, 01:40:15 AM

I hadn't seen that one, but this one is on the wall of one of my PMs cubes:

I like it- the last two made me laugh. :-)

theadvicist, as it currently stands, my last working day is this Friday (Dec 9). I'll post my story once it has all played out.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: mwulff on December 06, 2016, 05:32:46 AM
The swing comic is brilliant, but there is also Richards guide to software development:

Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: MichaelB on December 06, 2016, 07:20:14 AM
Posting to follow. I've found this thread a couple of times and lost it--don't want to lose it again. Too good.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: jexy103 on December 21, 2016, 08:43:50 PM
So I don't know if my situation qualifies as "epic", but it was definitely made possible by having FU money. I have a hard time being brief, so I put the TL;DR version first. ;-)

Short version: I'd worked in my office for about a year when we got a new supervisor in June who is absolutely horrid and toxic. I put up with her for a few months, counting down the days until I could quit and never have to deal with her again. When I finally left on December 9th, it got the attention of our executive-level staff, and they are now opening an investigation on the work environment in that office.

Detailed version: I worked as a civilan in the US Department of Defense (DoD), currently stationed overseas. Due to regulations, it was always the plan for DH and I to leave this country in May 2017 (we arrived May 2015 and I started working here in June). I worked in my office happily for about a year, until we got a new supervisor. I didn't use to believe that you could judge a person the first time you met them, but I've learned that you can learn a *lot* from a first impression. She immediately struck me as... well, kind of a bitch. Certainly abrasive. I thought I could learn to work with her, and I did fairly well for a few weeks, but within a month I had created a calendar counting down the number of work days I had left until I could quit. (For those of you familiar with the GS system, I was in a developmental position, meaning I was all but guaranteed a promotion after one year. My promotion date was November 27, so I knew that if I could stick it out until then, I'd get promoted to the next grade level, and then I'd be able to apply for jobs at that higher level at our next duty station in spring/summer 2017. If it hadn't been for that carrot, I would probably have quit sometime between August and early October.)

Anyway, this supervisor didn't know her own job, and therefore didn't understand what her employees actually did or contributed to the office. She was a terrible leader, as in, worse than a vacancy (her hiring manager admitted to me that he wished he had left the position vacant instead of bringing her on, but it's so hard to fire in the federal system). She was very quick to jump to conclusions and/or blame employees for a situation, but then didn't listen to explanations or policies describing why something is the way it is. I worked in a Budget Office, ensuring government funds were spent legally and judiciously, so following policies and regulations is kinda a big part of our job! She would call impromptu meetings, sometimes 2-3 times a day, disrupting our work and scheduled meetings, and half the time the subject content was only relevant to half of us or fewer, so the rest just sat there wasting their time. Then, she changed up everyone's responsibilities, so that no one had the same accounts as before. Her intent was for everyone to learn every aspect of the organization, but what it did was create a lot of confusion for us and our customers, and meant that everyone in our office was learning new accounts all at the same time, meaning everything took longer to get done.

Shortly after she started, I learned that I was pregnant. I waited about 8 weeks to tell work, around week 12/13 (end of first trimester), which was early August. I was concerned that me announcing my pregnancy might negatively affect my annual evaluation (end of October) or worse, my promotion (end of November). When I told her, she was surprisingly understanding, and I thought everything was good. A few weeks later, she told me she was changing my work hours, and I now had to arrive at work 30 minutes earlier every day (7:30 instead of my usual 8:00), take an extra 30 minutes (unpaid!) lunch, and leave at the same time (note: this 30-minute change added 90+ unpaid minutes to my work day, including commute). Due to local restrictions in this overseas location, I didn't have transportation to get to work by 7:30 (I'll provide more details if asked), which is why I'd always started at 8:00. By forcing me to change my hours, she made me choose between 1) additional mental and physical stress on me and baby, 2) AWOL for 30 minutes a day, or 3) use 30 minutes of leave/vacation time a day. DH and I chose for me to do option 3, while I simultaneously filed an EEO complaint due to pregnancy discrimination. EEO tried mediation, she refused to budge and allow me my previous hours back, and 60 days later, no change except a stack of paperwork and less leave/vacation time on the books. :-/

Fortunately for me, now it's end of November, I got a suprisingly good evaluation out of her, and she did approve my promotion. I waited until the promotion paperwork was official in the system, then dropped my resignation letter. Thing is, my supervisor was on vacation that week, so I gave my resignation to *her* supervisor... who failed to communicate to her that I had resigned. So she didn't learn until Wednesday that my last day was on Friday. Meanwhile, I'm packing up my desk and saying good-bye to co-workers. When I went to HR to out-process, the supervisor there knew how bad our office was, and she refused to process my resignation letter until I'd had a meeting with someone at the executive level to get their attention. So I scheduled that, explained to him how bad she was, including policies and regulations she's broken, the toxic work environment she'd created, how many employees had left (2 already) or were looking for other jobs (at least 3 others; we only had 10 employees), and the negative impact this one lady was having on the entire organization (when budget people leave, it takes longer to acquire funding and supplies for the mission). He took me seriously (it helped that a co-worker had already talked to him with her similar complaints), and now the organization is opening an investigation to determine what, exactly, is going on in our office. Potential outcomes range from nothing changes to they fire her for misconduct (breaking policies). But whatever the outcome, my resignation cause them to open an investigation on her, and apparently I'm the talk of the organization for it. And I'm told that her next evaluation will have to reflect the fact there was an investigation on her, regardless of outcome.

Now, I'm not due until February, so under other circumstances, I would have continued working another two months, provided more than 2 weeks' notice to minimize my position's vacancy, and overall made for a smoother transition for the organization. However, DH and I consistently save 50%+ of our income each month, and have ~8 years expenses worth in investments. He's active duty military and he alone makes more than we need in a month, and we could choose to never save another dollar until he retires at 20 years and we'd have more than enough to live on with his expected pension plus our current savings. I only worked because... what else was I going to do all day while he was at work? And who here doesn't want more savings? Now that we're expecting, I plan to stay at home for at least a few months after the birth (maybe 6 or so- see how it goes), and if I feel antsy at home all day, then I'll go back to work when I want, on my own terms, at our next duty station. If I love being a SAHM, I'll continue to do that. But it's our current savings that gives us the flexibility to make these kinds of choices, instead of needing to work until I'm due and then get only 12 weeks unpaid maternity leave before I have to go back to work because I need the paycheck.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: happy on December 22, 2016, 04:16:59 AM
I'd say thats pretty epic. You rock. What a difference FU money makes. How much less stress on you and your unborn child.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Dicey on December 22, 2016, 04:20:43 AM
Was just going to say what happy did. Hooray for you and your FU Money!   
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: SaskyStache on December 22, 2016, 12:15:29 PM
Finally followed through with something i had been thinking about for awhile.

Short Version: Stuck between a Guy A and Lady B. Gave notice, getting rid of most of my crap and heading to New Zealand.

Long Version: So I've been working for the same company for quite a few years. Started at the lowest level position and worked for a couple of years before my term was up. Unemployed for 3 days and hired back on with consecutive 2 month contracts for just over a year until I received another temporary position, which eventually became permanent. So far all good. Sure there were a few hiccups here and there, but every new position I took was a step up and I enjoyed the change. I also got along well with the people I was working with and it is a good company. The Canadian dream? I guess depending on the Canadian.

Here's where it starts getting interesting. Guy A has been in the wind after having been fired a couple of years back, but the union was fighting the termination on his behalf. Coworker 1 that I was working with at the time had some bad blood with Guy A and did not want to work with him again so they accepted a different position in the company when it came up. In fact they had changed Guy A's position when he was working with Coworker 1 so that nobody reported to him directly because of "issues" that arose. At this time no one really knew if he would come back even if he did win; he had issues with a few people in the company.

Anyways I work with Coworker 2 for awhile and all is well until Guy A wins and does decide to come back (fun fact: he's still incredibly anti-union (stealing his money as he puts it)). Well, I work with him for awhile and we don't get along to say the least, but the world keeps spinning. Eventually he takes a temporary position outside the main office with the ability to go back to his old position whenever he wants. I move into Guy A's position (step up) and start working with Lady B. People had given me warnings about Lady B, but I figured how much worse could it be. The first year wasn't bad, but it progressively became a toxic situation. I was making decent money and had just earned another week of vacation, but I always knew that I was not suited for the type of work I'm doing (PR) and never planned on doing it forever; there are also a few other factors that are negatively affecting my work experience. I started feeling myself become increasingly stressed and a worse person. Becoming a worse person is not a fun feeling, and the prospect of either working with Guy A or Lady B for the rest of my years did not sit well.

So I started planning my next steps. I got a 23 month working Holiday Visa for New Zealand, booked a one way ticket and gave notice.

I knew I had done the right thing after I spoke to Lady B in person to let her know that I was quitting and how the transition would go (tying up projects and who would be looking after what going forward...) before the company wide announcement went out. Apparently that was a "jerk move" and she even convinced some people in the office that I'm only quitting now to make her life harder. The office at times feels very high school if that makes any sense. But to be fair most people in the office have been genuinely interested in the decision and supportive of this choice even if some don't fully understand why I'm walking away from a good job --understandable.

I'm still far from FI, but I have enough built up that I'm relatively comfortable with this decision.

Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: GilbertB on December 23, 2016, 03:09:18 AM
Not really a FU tale more of a FTS (funk this shunt):

In France I had two successive jobs in not doing so well companies  as an industrial designer where I took a fairly low pay with the promise of large increases based on earnings.

As an aside, the industrial design world is littered with people who get the degree, a black turtleneck and think they are artists. This muddles the field for people who like the graft not the pedantic tittle.
For me, design is being an interface between client, marketing, management, suppliers, manufacturing and reality: 70% whacking your head against the desk to make opposites a whole, 25% cad work to mash thing sufficiently fine so engineers can digest it and 5% creation (not art).

In any case, 1st company I help bring back from the dead, not only create great stuff for one off's but do it so they can be rented out indifinetly after = big income boost!
So after 3 years what about, my raise boss? No can do no money. But boss proceeds to buy a new car, go on exotic holidays, new big house AND a new building in the middle of naught that has a somewhat dangerous 1 hour plus commute - and if I do any overtime, I miss the last train leaving me no option but sleeping under my desk. I resign after 4 months, one hour before a performance review. They never managed to replace me, had to sell the new building and are more or less to back to how they were when I started. In any case, it was painful due to no FU fund.

Shortly got a new job in a great little company that needed help. I managed to reform the drafting methods, because a de facto commercial architect because they never managed to hire one who was competent. In any case, after 5 great years, no salary increase, same excuses, but bosses had nice houses, nice cars, Patek watches but my pay was two low to get on the housing ladder.

So I met this great Flemish lass, slowly disengaged myself  because I had FU starter fund and moved to Belgium.

After struggling, found a job in a impressive local firm... and saw after a few moths that they were trying to pull the same MBA playbook trick on me, but I stayed on until I could find a way out while my DW was pregnant. Finally, burnt out of industrial design, mostly when I understood that all my staff was earning way more than me for less stress and way shorter hours. So l resigned and gave them a very long debrief on how they were massively mismanaging ressources out of arrogance about production - surprisingly, this got into their thick heads, the GM was ousted and the most urgent of my production improvements implemented. In any case, leaving was much easier because I had a 10 month FU cushion.

But I had had it with industrial design, sadly said an internal FU to the whole industry, and went back to Uni to become a Unlimited Machine Room officer.

Took four years to do three, so it was hard financially, finished with the "best of promotion" and "best final project" gongs, got a 1st job in salvage then got hired for a sailing position and am earning about 1.7x my last industrial design job doing something fun (yes, flanges are fun). :)

I just wish that they gave a class in High School about building a FU buffer to allow one to switch jobs/talk head high/not care about consequences, much faster than what I did.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: TexasRunner on December 23, 2016, 08:01:37 AM
I just wish that they gave a class in High School about building a FU buffer to allow one to switch jobs/talk head high/not care about consequences, much faster than what I did.

THIS.

Has anyone volunteered time to discuss FU / FIRE to their local high school before?  I'm thinking it would just take the support of the current economics teacher and their principal.  It is something I'm strongly considering since it would have helped me greatly coming out of HS and into college...

(We can start a new thread if need be).
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Rural on December 23, 2016, 08:07:57 AM
I just wish that they gave a class in High School about building a FU buffer to allow one to switch jobs/talk head high/not care about consequences, much faster than what I did.

THIS.

Has anyone volunteered time to discuss FU / FIRE to their local high school before?  I'm thinking it would just take the support of the current economics teacher and their principal.  It is something I'm strongly considering since it would have helped me greatly coming out of HS and into college...

(We can start a new thread if need be).


You'll need to change the acronym before approaching a school - while FU would be popular with the kids, it will never make it past the admin.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Guesl982374 on December 23, 2016, 08:10:09 AM
What do you mean...FU stands for 'Forget You'....

haha, agreed. 'FU' would never fly in any school.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: JLee on December 23, 2016, 08:41:24 AM
What do you mean...FU stands for 'Forget You'....

haha, agreed. 'FU' would never fly in any school.

Financially Unconstrained. ;)
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: TexasRunner on December 23, 2016, 10:00:02 AM
What do you mean...FU stands for 'Forget You'....

haha, agreed. 'FU' would never fly in any school.

Financially Unconstrained. ;)

Glad I asked for advice!  ;D

Maybe re-label some things, but at least rolling through the "shockingly Simple Math" with them might set some on the right track.  Good opportunity to discuss why the stock market always goes up and whatnot. 
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Mr. Green on December 23, 2016, 10:03:16 AM
I just wish that they gave a class in High School about building a FU buffer to allow one to switch jobs/talk head high/not care about consequences, much faster than what I did.

THIS.

Has anyone volunteered time to discuss FU / FIRE to their local high school before?  I'm thinking it would just take the support of the current economics teacher and their principal.  It is something I'm strongly considering since it would have helped me greatly coming out of HS and into college...

(We can start a new thread if need be).
This is on my post-FIRE list. I would love to volunteer to give kids a head start. It doesn't have to be as complicated as we get here on this forum but anything that gets their minds thinking about those types of decisions early will change their lives if they run with it. It's probably one of the most broadly impactful things kids could learn.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: BlueHouse on December 23, 2016, 12:40:01 PM
Not really a FU tale more of a FTS (funk this shunt):

In France I had two successive jobs in not doing so well companies  as an industrial designer where I took a fairly low pay with the promise of large increases based on earnings.

As an aside, the industrial design world is littered with people who get the degree, a black turtleneck and think they are artists. This muddles the field for people who like the graft not the pedantic tittle.
For me, design is being an interface between client, marketing, management, suppliers, manufacturing and reality: 70% whacking your head against the desk to make opposites a whole, 25% cad work to mash thing sufficiently fine so engineers can digest it and 5% creation (not art).

In any case, 1st company I help bring back from the dead, not only create great stuff for one off's but do it so they can be rented out indifinetly after = big income boost!
So after 3 years what about, my raise boss? No can do no money. But boss proceeds to buy a new car, go on exotic holidays, new big house AND a new building in the middle of naught that has a somewhat dangerous 1 hour plus commute - and if I do any overtime, I miss the last train leaving me no option but sleeping under my desk. I resign after 4 months, one hour before a performance review. They never managed to replace me, had to sell the new building and are more or less to back to how they were when I started. In any case, it was painful due to no FU fund.

Shortly got a new job in a great little company that needed help. I managed to reform the drafting methods, because a de facto commercial architect because they never managed to hire one who was competent. In any case, after 5 great years, no salary increase, same excuses, but bosses had nice houses, nice cars, Patek watches but my pay was two low to get on the housing ladder.

So I met this great Flemish lass, slowly disengaged myself  because I had FU starter fund and moved to Belgium.

After struggling, found a job in a impressive local firm... and saw after a few moths that they were trying to pull the same MBA playbook trick on me, but I stayed on until I could find a way out while my DW was pregnant. Finally, burnt out of industrial design, mostly when I understood that all my staff was earning way more than me for less stress and way shorter hours. So l resigned and gave them a very long debrief on how they were massively mismanaging ressources out of arrogance about production - surprisingly, this got into their thick heads, the GM was ousted and the most urgent of my production improvements implemented. In any case, leaving was much easier because I had a 10 month FU cushion.

But I had had it with industrial design, sadly said an internal FU to the whole industry, and went back to Uni to become a Unlimited Machine Room officer.

Took four years to do three, so it was hard financially, finished with the "best of promotion" and "best final project" gongs, got a 1st job in salvage then got hired for a sailing position and am earning about 1.7x my last industrial design job doing something fun (yes, flanges are fun). :)

I just wish that they gave a class in High School about building a FU buffer to allow one to switch jobs/talk head high/not care about consequences, much faster than what I did.

I am sorry you went through what appears to be the same issue three times.  While I'm glad it all worked out well in the end, you should also look at what you could have done better and what you could learn. 

Learn how to negotiate better! 

Your bosses with the Pateks clearly outmaneuvered you when it came to negotiating.  While we all would love to think that we will be rewarded fairly for our efforts, the truth of the matter is that you are only worth what you can negotiate for yourself.   If you want to be rewarded based upon your impact to the company, then go on commission.  If you want a nice, safe salary, then realize that when there is little risk, the reward is not as great. 

Glad things worked out for you in the end.
 
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: scottish on December 23, 2016, 02:37:35 PM
Or you could find a job with an honourable and competent boss instead of a highly paid MBA.   I've worked for both types over the years, and the first is much better than the second.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: nawhite on December 23, 2016, 05:07:08 PM
I just wish that they gave a class in High School about building a FU buffer to allow one to switch jobs/talk head high/not care about consequences, much faster than what I did.

THIS.

Has anyone volunteered time to discuss FU / FIRE to their local high school before?  I'm thinking it would just take the support of the current economics teacher and their principal.  It is something I'm strongly considering since it would have helped me greatly coming out of HS and into college...

(We can start a new thread if need be).
This is on my post-FIRE list. I would love to volunteer to give kids a head start. It doesn't have to be as complicated as we get here on this forum but anything that gets their minds thinking about those types of decisions early will change their lives if they run with it. It's probably one of the most broadly impactful things kids could learn.

I volunteered with ja.org a few times. They offer a "Personal Finance" lesson series among many others that teachers can request targeted at many different age groups (how to start a business, how the stock market works, how Micro/Macro economics works, etc.) The personal finance lessons were really good stuff like "how to budget, how credit cards work, how to save for retirement" etc. Definitely look into it.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Rural on December 23, 2016, 07:08:03 PM
What do you mean...FU stands for 'Forget You'....

haha, agreed. 'FU' would never fly in any school.

Financially Unconstrained. ;)

Glad I asked for advice!  ;D

Maybe re-label some things, but at least rolling through the "shockingly Simple Math" with them might set some on the right track.  Good opportunity to discuss why the stock market always goes up and whatnot.


I used "shockingly simple math" with college freshmen this fall, and they noticed and giggled over the word "badassity" in the header image. Just FYI.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: arebelspy on December 23, 2016, 09:56:38 PM
What do you mean...FU stands for 'Forget You'....

haha, agreed. 'FU' would never fly in any school.

Financially Unconstrained. ;)

Glad I asked for advice!  ;D

Maybe re-label some things, but at least rolling through the "shockingly Simple Math" with them might set some on the right track.  Good opportunity to discuss why the stock market always goes up and whatnot.


I used "shockingly simple math" with college freshmen this fall, and they noticed and giggled over the word "badassity" in the header image. Just FYI.

The perfect intro to explaining FU money, how Pete was told he had to remove that to keep the 30k/yr ads from Chase, and he told them to jump in a lake.  Not needing to have your decisions driven by money is the definition of FU money.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: GilbertB on December 23, 2016, 11:18:36 PM
I just wish that they gave a class in High School about building a FU buffer to allow one to switch jobs/talk head high/not care about consequences, much faster than what I did.

I am sorry you went through what appears to be the same issue three times.  While I'm glad it all worked out well in the end, you should also look at what you could have done better and what you could learn. 

Learn how to negotiate better! 

Your bosses with the Pateks clearly outmaneuvered you when it came to negotiating.  While we all would love to think that we will be rewarded fairly for our efforts, the truth of the matter is that you are only worth what you can negotiate for yourself.   If you want to be rewarded based upon your impact to the company, then go on commission.  If you want a nice, safe salary, then realize that when there is little risk, the reward is not as great. 

Glad things worked out for you in the end.
Yup, you are right, good at negotiating for companies, crap at doing it for me.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Rural on December 24, 2016, 03:17:23 AM
What do you mean...FU stands for 'Forget You'....

haha, agreed. 'FU' would never fly in any school.

Financially Unconstrained. ;)

Glad I asked for advice!  ;D

Maybe re-label some things, but at least rolling through the "shockingly Simple Math" with them might set some on the right track.  Good opportunity to discuss why the stock market always goes up and whatnot.


I used "shockingly simple math" with college freshmen this fall, and they noticed and giggled over the word "badassity" in the header image. Just FYI.

The perfect intro to explaining FU money, how Pete was told he had to remove that to keep the 30k/yr ads from Chase, and he told them to jump in a lake.  Not needing to have your decisions driven by money is the definition of FU money.


Yep, I'd forgotten that or I would have used it. But I have that luxury - not so much with the  high schools. Are they less prudish elsewhere?
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: arebelspy on December 24, 2016, 04:04:45 AM
Or you just do it and don't ask. ;)
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Rural on December 24, 2016, 04:45:54 AM
Or you just do it and don't ask. ;)


Works if you're already inside the school (and tenured). But the discussion above was about approach schools to add programming. You'd want to keep that out of any demo materials in that case.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: arebelspy on December 24, 2016, 04:50:21 AM
Good point.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: radram on December 24, 2016, 08:32:45 AM
I just wish that they gave a class in High School about building a FU buffer to allow one to switch jobs/talk head high/not care about consequences, much faster than what I did.

THIS.

Has anyone volunteered time to discuss FU / FIRE to their local high school before?  I'm thinking it would just take the support of the current economics teacher and their principal.  It is something I'm strongly considering since it would have helped me greatly coming out of HS and into college...

(We can start a new thread if need be).

My daughter had a class where they had to create a budget. It is a good start, but there were some things she pointed out to me that SHE thought were weird.  For example, you were FORCED to budget for a phone and home internet. You were not allowed to get a roommate to cut home expenses in half.  Better than nothing I guess.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: TomTX on December 24, 2016, 11:48:59 AM
I just wish that they gave a class in High School about building a FU buffer to allow one to switch jobs/talk head high/not care about consequences, much faster than what I did.

THIS.

Has anyone volunteered time to discuss FU / FIRE to their local high school before?  I'm thinking it would just take the support of the current economics teacher and their principal.  It is something I'm strongly considering since it would have helped me greatly coming out of HS and into college...

(We can start a new thread if need be).

My daughter had a class where they had to create a budget. It is a good start, but there were some things she pointed out to me that SHE thought were weird.  For example, you were FORCED to budget for a phone and home internet. You were not allowed to get a roommate to cut home expenses in half.  Better than nothing I guess.

We had a couple of days (maybe a week) of that stuff when I was in High School.... some years ago. Nothing in the budget was mandated other than documentation of costs. Your job/salary was given to you from a random pool. I "joined" the National Guard to supplement (with a newspaper clipping) and ended up with $30k/year savings.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Zikoris on December 24, 2016, 11:59:50 AM

My daughter had a class where they had to create a budget. It is a good start, but there were some things she pointed out to me that SHE thought were weird.  For example, you were FORCED to budget for a phone and home internet. You were not allowed to get a roommate to cut home expenses in half.  Better than nothing I guess.

I had to do that in middle school! I don't think they required home internet, because it was actually somewhat uncommon and expensive in rural areas at that time, but there were other weird "Must-haves", including having a car.

I think my constant stream of Mustachian philosophy must have impacted my mom, who teaches elementary school, because when she taught that section recently she let the kids do whatever they wanted, and some of it turned out pretty funny. I think one kid who was a supreme court judge got fired, and another kid who owned a hair salon hired him to sweep up hair for minimum wage. I think there were a few weddings and roommate situations. It's amazing what kind of stuff kids come up.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: TomTX on December 24, 2016, 01:43:12 PM

My daughter had a class where they had to create a budget. It is a good start, but there were some things she pointed out to me that SHE thought were weird.  For example, you were FORCED to budget for a phone and home internet. You were not allowed to get a roommate to cut home expenses in half.  Better than nothing I guess.

I had to do that in middle school! I don't think they required home internet, because it was actually somewhat uncommon and expensive in rural areas at that time, but there were other weird "Must-haves", including having a car.

I think my constant stream of Mustachian philosophy must have impacted my mom, who teaches elementary school, because when she taught that section recently she let the kids do whatever they wanted, and some of it turned out pretty funny. I think one kid who was a supreme court judge got fired, and another kid who owned a hair salon hired him to sweep up hair for minimum wage. I think there were a few weddings and roommate situations. It's amazing what kind of stuff kids come up.


"Home Internet" didn't really exist yet when I did mine.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: mustachianteacher on December 24, 2016, 03:24:33 PM
I teach middle school and taught a personal finance elective three times. I quit doing it when admin started treating the class as a math elective for kids who needed math remediation, but it was fun the first two semesters!

I did teach the concept of "FU Money," but I called it having a "Freedom Fund." I also had the kids create a budget, but treated it more like the game LIFE: I let them pick whether they wanted to develop a budget based on working straight out of high school or working with a college degree. Then they were each assigned a few "life events" at random -- things like having to buy plane tickets for a funeral, needing to buy new tires, getting a raise, helping out a sick friend, etc. It was interesting, and I think most of the kids enjoyed it. There was also a really cool interactive game at the time called Bad Credit Hotel, but it doesn't seem like it exists anymore.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: BTDretire on December 24, 2016, 06:10:05 PM

My daughter had a class where they had to create a budget. It is a good start, but there were some things she pointed out to me that SHE thought were weird.  For example, you were FORCED to budget for a phone and home internet. You were not allowed to get a roommate to cut home expenses in half.  Better than nothing I guess.

I had to do that in middle school! I don't think they required home internet, because it was actually somewhat uncommon and expensive in rural areas at that time, but there were other weird "Must-haves", including having a car.

I think my constant stream of Mustachian philosophy must have impacted my mom, who teaches elementary school, because when she taught that section recently she let the kids do whatever they wanted, and some of it turned out pretty funny. I think one kid who was a supreme court judge got fired, and another kid who owned a hair salon hired him to sweep up hair for minimum wage. I think there were a few weddings and roommate situations. It's amazing what kind of stuff kids come up.


"Home Internet" didn't really exist yet when I did mine.

 I remember when our local drive in theater posted
on their sign "Save Free TV". Cable TV was starting to
be connected to homes.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: uppy on December 24, 2016, 07:59:43 PM
When I was a teenager, I worked at a sandwich shop (won't say which but it let's just say it's a national franchise). I was already managing the store while the "store manager" was dating the regional manager and therefore not really doing any managing. I asked for a raise, they offered -- literally -- a 10 cent raise and a PAGER so I could be "on call" on weekends, and a new job title. I guess they thought I would be flattered?

When I told them to F themselves, I had zero FU money, but it felt so damn good to see the regional manager crap his pants because he hadn't prepared for the event that I refused and quit. He had to cover all my shifts until they found someone new. Still makes me chuckle. I was a teen living with 4 friends in a cheap ass house with no real bills and a variety of equally shitty jobs available -- In short, I was invincible. He was a 40-something dude dating a 20 y/o employee, and working at a sandwich shop late hours for who knows how long.

Suckas.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Mezzie on December 26, 2016, 08:19:37 AM
Mine isn't all that epic, but I still like it.

I was at my most financially destitute; I had just under three years of college left, and after paying tuition I just had enough for rent and $12/week of groceries.

We got a new boss at work who liked to yell at and demoralize people. It made what had been a fun college job a nightmare, but I depended on the paycheck and the health insurance. At one point, I got transferred to the food section. On my first day as "manager" there (I hadn't had any training yet), we sold out of most of the food before closing. The boss came by and screamed at me for not ordering enough food (how could I have ordered the food the day before it was my job to do so?). She continued screaming in my face until I cried, and then she yelled at me for crying.

I went to school the next day and asked one of my professors if I could get a job tutoring. He hired me on the spot. I went by the student health center and got health insurance, then I went to work that afternoon and quit. My boss's response, "You aren't even going to give me the courtesy of two weeks' notice?" I said no and held my tongue instead of saying exactly why I was quitting.

My tutoring gig didn't pay much, but it gave me incredible experience and connections that directly led to the career I love now. I also was randomly offered a second job at just the right time. I was a janitor in a theater, but it meant I could see all the musicals I wanted for free, and since a lot of my responsibilities included laundry and my boss couldn't think of anything else for me to do during that time since the bathrooms were already clean and I couldn't clean the house until the audience left, I had built in study time.

At the time I quit, I knew there was a real possibility that I'd be living in my car and using the campus gym for showers, and that was such a better option than dealing with my evil boss one more day, that it didn't scare me. That fleeting fearlessness led to some of the best experiences of my life.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: CowboyAndIndian on December 26, 2016, 09:10:09 AM
Mine isn't all that epic, but I still like it.

I was at my most financially destitute; I had just under three years of college left, and after paying tuition I just had enough for rent and $12/week of groceries.

We got a new boss at work who liked to yell at and demoralize people. It made what had been a fun college job a nightmare, but I depended on the paycheck and the health insurance. At one point, I got transferred to the food section. On my first day as "manager" there (I hadn't had any training yet), we sold out of most of the food before closing. The boss came by and screamed at me for not ordering enough food (how could I have ordered the food the day before it was my job to do so?). She continued screaming in my face until I cried, and then she yelled at me for crying.

I went to school the next day and asked one of my professors if I could get a job tutoring. He hired me on the spot. I went by the student health center and got health insurance, then I went to work that afternoon and quit. My boss's response, "You aren't even going to give me the courtesy of two weeks' notice?" I said no and held my tongue instead of saying exactly why I was quitting.

My tutoring gig didn't pay much, but it gave me incredible experience and connections that directly led to the career I love now. I also was randomly offered a second job at just the right time. I was a janitor in a theater, but it meant I could see all the musicals I wanted for free, and since a lot of my responsibilities included laundry and my boss couldn't think of anything else for me to do during that time since the bathrooms were already clean and I couldn't clean the house until the audience left, I had built in study time.

At the time I quit, I knew there was a real possibility that I'd be living in my car and using the campus gym for showers, and that was such a better option than dealing with my evil boss one more day, that it didn't scare me. That fleeting fearlessness led to some of the best experiences of my life.

Mezzie, that is seriously Epic! To leave without a stache to carry you over is so brave...
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Adventine on December 26, 2016, 05:51:50 PM
Mine isn't all that epic, but I still like it.

I was at my most financially destitute; I had just under three years of college left, and after paying tuition I just had enough for rent and $12/week of groceries.

We got a new boss at work who liked to yell at and demoralize people. It made what had been a fun college job a nightmare, but I depended on the paycheck and the health insurance. At one point, I got transferred to the food section. On my first day as "manager" there (I hadn't had any training yet), we sold out of most of the food before closing. The boss came by and screamed at me for not ordering enough food (how could I have ordered the food the day before it was my job to do so?). She continued screaming in my face until I cried, and then she yelled at me for crying.

I went to school the next day and asked one of my professors if I could get a job tutoring. He hired me on the spot. I went by the student health center and got health insurance, then I went to work that afternoon and quit. My boss's response, "You aren't even going to give me the courtesy of two weeks' notice?" I said no and held my tongue instead of saying exactly why I was quitting.

My tutoring gig didn't pay much, but it gave me incredible experience and connections that directly led to the career I love now. I also was randomly offered a second job at just the right time. I was a janitor in a theater, but it meant I could see all the musicals I wanted for free, and since a lot of my responsibilities included laundry and my boss couldn't think of anything else for me to do during that time since the bathrooms were already clean and I couldn't clean the house until the audience left, I had built in study time.

At the time I quit, I knew there was a real possibility that I'd be living in my car and using the campus gym for showers, and that was such a better option than dealing with my evil boss one more day, that it didn't scare me. That fleeting fearlessness led to some of the best experiences of my life.

Mezzie, that is seriously Epic! To leave without a stache to carry you over is so brave...

I agree, it is definitely epic.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Dicey on December 26, 2016, 09:05:12 PM
+3. Epic, indeed!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Laura33 on January 09, 2017, 07:24:06 PM
Ok, not remotely epic, but gotta keep this thread live, because it entertained me my entire Christmas break.  My story happened in the tech crash, before I felt like I really had FU money.  But we had dual incomes and low expenses relative to our salaries.

DH took an insecure job to move near me when we married; it was sad but not a huge shock when that company went under.  His company offered to transfer him out west, and I found a job with a company there (I'm a lawyer - 30%+ paycut sucked, but jobs were scarce and I was glad to find one).  Alas, the job was pure hell.  The big boss was a fan of the "swoop and poop" management style -- she'd swoop in, yell at you that any idiot would know to do ABC, disappear for a month, then swoop back in for a status check and yell at you for doing ABC, because any idiot would know to do XYZ.  Management knew they were losing good people, but the CEO refused to fire her because he trusted her.

It all came to a head when I had a miscarriage and subsequent D&C and missed a week.  During that week, one of my matters that had been dormant for months suddenly came back to life.  My first day back in the office, she called a meeting of everyone in the department and parceled out all of my work, without ever looking at or saying a word to me (who knew ghosting was a management style in 1999??).  I went back to my office, bawled, pulled myself together, and went back to ask her why she removed me from the project.  She fed me a line about being concerned about my health and not wanting to burden me at a tough time.  Right.  6 months later when I asked for a raise/promotion (the supervisor I had been hired to assist quit two weeks after I arrived, and I had done her job for well over a year), I was turned down, because I had "really fallen down on that project."

Meanwhile, we had built our house, planning to stay there forever.  So I went home, again in tears, and pulled out Quicken and worked the budget until I realized that I could quit and we wouldn't lose the house.  And the weight lifted:  all the crap didn't matter any more, because I didn't NEED that job.  So I started making plans to give my notice. 

Then they announced that the company was being bought, and the severance package was awesome (on the order of 9-10 mos. salary even for me).  So I said, well, hell, I can manage a few more months of this for that kind of cash.  So I hung on for 9 more months.  And damned if the big boss didn't then come meet with me and say "congratulations -- I managed to save your job!"  WTF?  You treat me like shit for 2.5 years, and NOW you start looking out for me?  I quit the next day and went back to telecommuting to my old firm.  Worked well less than half time (had a baby that year), still made 3/4 of what I did at the hell job.

And demonstrating the power of karma:  said evil boss was herself the one who got fired as part of the transition, and the woman who came in and took her place tried very hard to convince me to stay.  I turned her down, politely -- and a few years later we moved back east, and I am now a partner at the same firm I went back to, making probably 4-5x what I made at the hell job.  And the lady I politely turned down is a periodic firm client.

But my DH has my favorite line.  Now, I should say that he is happy in his current job and has zero intention of quitting (maybe ever).  But one day, about 2-3 years after he started, his boss was giving him a hard time about not having any decorations or personal stuff in his office.  And his buddy spoke up and said "his wife's a partner in a law firm, he can be gone in an hour if he gets too pissed off."  And DH just smiled and said, "I may need A job, but I don't need THIS job."  Needless to say, he has felt free to take time off as needed for kid duty (as have I).  Makes two full-time jobs and two kids much more livable on a daily basis.

FU money is awesome.  And cash in the bank isn't the only way to get it -- while you're still building the 'stache, a happily-employed spouse + living on one income goes a long, long way.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: radram on January 10, 2017, 05:58:30 AM
Ok, not remotely epic, but gotta keep this thread live, because it entertained me my entire Christmas break.  My story happened in the tech crash, before I felt like I really had FU money.  But we had dual incomes and low expenses relative to our salaries.

DH took an insecure job to move near me when we married; it was sad but not a huge shock when that company went under.  His company offered to transfer him out west, and I found a job with a company there (I'm a lawyer - 30%+ paycut sucked, but jobs were scarce and I was glad to find one).  Alas, the job was pure hell.  The big boss was a fan of the "swoop and poop" management style -- she'd swoop in, yell at you that any idiot would know to do ABC, disappear for a month, then swoop back in for a status check and yell at you for doing ABC, because any idiot would know to do XYZ.  Management knew they were losing good people, but the CEO refused to fire her because he trusted her.

It all came to a head when I had a miscarriage and subsequent D&C and missed a week.  During that week, one of my matters that had been dormant for months suddenly came back to life.  My first day back in the office, she called a meeting of everyone in the department and parceled out all of my work, without ever looking at or saying a word to me (who knew ghosting was a management style in 1999??).  I went back to my office, bawled, pulled myself together, and went back to ask her why she removed me from the project.  She fed me a line about being concerned about my health and not wanting to burden me at a tough time.  Right.  6 months later when I asked for a raise/promotion (the supervisor I had been hired to assist quit two weeks after I arrived, and I had done her job for well over a year), I was turned down, because I had "really fallen down on that project."

Meanwhile, we had built our house, planning to stay there forever.  So I went home, again in tears, and pulled out Quicken and worked the budget until I realized that I could quit and we wouldn't lose the house.  And the weight lifted:  all the crap didn't matter any more, because I didn't NEED that job.  So I started making plans to give my notice. 

Then they announced that the company was being bought, and the severance package was awesome (on the order of 9-10 mos. salary even for me).  So I said, well, hell, I can manage a few more months of this for that kind of cash.  So I hung on for 9 more months.  And damned if the big boss didn't then come meet with me and say "congratulations -- I managed to save your job!"  WTF?  You treat me like shit for 2.5 years, and NOW you start looking out for me?  I quit the next day and went back to telecommuting to my old firm.  Worked well less than half time (had a baby that year), still made 3/4 of what I did at the hell job.

And demonstrating the power of karma:  said evil boss was herself the one who got fired as part of the transition, and the woman who came in and took her place tried very hard to convince me to stay.  I turned her down, politely -- and a few years later we moved back east, and I am now a partner at the same firm I went back to, making probably 4-5x what I made at the hell job.  And the lady I politely turned down is a periodic firm client.

But my DH has my favorite line.  Now, I should say that he is happy in his current job and has zero intention of quitting (maybe ever).  But one day, about 2-3 years after he started, his boss was giving him a hard time about not having any decorations or personal stuff in his office.  And his buddy spoke up and said "his wife's a partner in a law firm, he can be gone in an hour if he gets too pissed off."  And DH just smiled and said, "I may need A job, but I don't need THIS job."  Needless to say, he has felt free to take time off as needed for kid duty (as have I).  Makes two full-time jobs and two kids much more livable on a daily basis.

FU money is awesome.  And cash in the bank isn't the only way to get it -- while you're still building the 'stache, a happily-employed spouse + living on one income goes a long, long way.
Sounds VERY epic to me. Thank you for sharing.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: radram on January 10, 2017, 06:08:01 AM
Heard a very different definition of FU money yesterday.

I watched a documentary called sour grapes, which does a good job of following a wine scam ($1,000's per bottle, millions of dollars kind of wine). In it, FU money was described as the chunk of money dedicated to spending on nothing, just for the sake of spending.

I have always considered it the money you are willing to spend(savings) to avoid having to do what others want you to do.

I think she really missed the point. It is not the money, it is the freedom that the money provides.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: BTDretire on January 10, 2017, 06:10:41 AM

But my DH has my favorite line.  Now, I should say that he is happy in his current job and has zero intention of quitting (maybe ever).  But one day, about 2-3 years after he started, his boss was giving him a hard time about not having any decorations or personal stuff in his office.  And his buddy spoke up and said "his wife's a partner in a law firm, he can be gone in an hour if he gets too pissed off. "And DH just smiled and said, "I may need A job, but I don't need THIS job." Needless to say, he has felt free to take time off as needed for kid duty (as have I).  Makes two full-time jobs and two kids much more livable on a daily basis.

FU money is awesome.  And cash in the bank isn't the only way to get it -- while you're still building the 'stache, a happily-employed spouse + living on one income goes a long, long way.

  Love his line, it really shows how FU money gives you power and flexability in your job.

 
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: mm1970 on January 10, 2017, 09:57:47 AM
Ok, not remotely epic, but gotta keep this thread live, because it entertained me my entire Christmas break.  My story happened in the tech crash, before I felt like I really had FU money.  But we had dual incomes and low expenses relative to our salaries.

DH took an insecure job to move near me when we married; it was sad but not a huge shock when that company went under.  His company offered to transfer him out west, and I found a job with a company there (I'm a lawyer - 30%+ paycut sucked, but jobs were scarce and I was glad to find one).  Alas, the job was pure hell.  The big boss was a fan of the "swoop and poop" management style -- she'd swoop in, yell at you that any idiot would know to do ABC, disappear for a month, then swoop back in for a status check and yell at you for doing ABC, because any idiot would know to do XYZ.  Management knew they were losing good people, but the CEO refused to fire her because he trusted her.

It all came to a head when I had a miscarriage and subsequent D&C and missed a week.  During that week, one of my matters that had been dormant for months suddenly came back to life.  My first day back in the office, she called a meeting of everyone in the department and parceled out all of my work, without ever looking at or saying a word to me (who knew ghosting was a management style in 1999??).  I went back to my office, bawled, pulled myself together, and went back to ask her why she removed me from the project.  She fed me a line about being concerned about my health and not wanting to burden me at a tough time.  Right.  6 months later when I asked for a raise/promotion (the supervisor I had been hired to assist quit two weeks after I arrived, and I had done her job for well over a year), I was turned down, because I had "really fallen down on that project."

Meanwhile, we had built our house, planning to stay there forever.  So I went home, again in tears, and pulled out Quicken and worked the budget until I realized that I could quit and we wouldn't lose the house.  And the weight lifted:  all the crap didn't matter any more, because I didn't NEED that job.  So I started making plans to give my notice. 

Then they announced that the company was being bought, and the severance package was awesome (on the order of 9-10 mos. salary even for me).  So I said, well, hell, I can manage a few more months of this for that kind of cash.  So I hung on for 9 more months.  And damned if the big boss didn't then come meet with me and say "congratulations -- I managed to save your job!"  WTF?  You treat me like shit for 2.5 years, and NOW you start looking out for me?  I quit the next day and went back to telecommuting to my old firm.  Worked well less than half time (had a baby that year), still made 3/4 of what I did at the hell job.

And demonstrating the power of karma:  said evil boss was herself the one who got fired as part of the transition, and the woman who came in and took her place tried very hard to convince me to stay.  I turned her down, politely -- and a few years later we moved back east, and I am now a partner at the same firm I went back to, making probably 4-5x what I made at the hell job.  And the lady I politely turned down is a periodic firm client.

But my DH has my favorite line.  Now, I should say that he is happy in his current job and has zero intention of quitting (maybe ever).  But one day, about 2-3 years after he started, his boss was giving him a hard time about not having any decorations or personal stuff in his office.  And his buddy spoke up and said "his wife's a partner in a law firm, he can be gone in an hour if he gets too pissed off."  And DH just smiled and said, "I may need A job, but I don't need THIS job."  Needless to say, he has felt free to take time off as needed for kid duty (as have I).  Makes two full-time jobs and two kids much more livable on a daily basis.

FU money is awesome.  And cash in the bank isn't the only way to get it -- while you're still building the 'stache, a happily-employed spouse + living on one income goes a long, long way.
Very very epic.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Kitsune on January 10, 2017, 10:09:27 AM
And DH just smiled and said, "I may need A job, but I don't need THIS job."  Needless to say, he has felt free to take time off as needed for kid duty (as have I).  Makes two full-time jobs and two kids much more livable on a daily basis.

I've said something similar, without FU money.

If you have a standard of living that can be met on 1(ish) salary, and no debt, even no FU money means that your spouse's job is all the safety net you need (and their safety net is your job - it goes both ways). You (collective) need ONE OF you to have a job. Neither of you need THESE PARTICULAR jobs.

As I found out when my husband found out he was getting laid off during my 8th month of pregnancy. We JUST paid off all debt. We have a paid-off car and a VERY affordable mortgage in a place we love living. Maternity leave payments for me + unemployment for him = still 1K going into savings every month. We're FINE.

Meanwhile, his colleagues were freaking out for him and seemed to think that we were going to starve or lose the house. Like... no. He'll take a few months off with the babies, and then get another job, and we'll be FINE.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Bicycle_B on January 10, 2017, 11:49:42 AM
Yay Kitsune clan!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: talltexan on January 10, 2017, 01:33:07 PM
My wife works for a major company (you probably have multiple items in your home produced by this company) who have recently announced that they are delaying the timing of their paychecks this march.

Basically, they will be holding all their employees' money for an additional week. I've located some other funds equivalent to one week's pay for my wife and set it aside--ready to go--but I feel for all her co-workers who do not have that kind of flexibility.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: homestead neohio on January 10, 2017, 01:42:03 PM
My wife works for a major company (you probably have multiple items in your home produced by this company) who have recently announced that they are delaying the timing of their paychecks this march.

Basically, they will be holding all their employees' money for an additional week. I've located some other funds equivalent to one week's pay for my wife and set it aside--ready to go--but I feel for all her co-workers who do not have that kind of flexibility.

This is happening to me and my co-workers right now as a result of an acquisition.  MegaCorp delays payment 1 week, Medium corp did not.  It is RIDICULOUS how much people focus on this!  I guess it really matters to them...  I know many people spend everything they make, but with several weeks of advanced notice you'd think this would not be a hardship, especially when you found out months ago you are getting laid off this year!  Show some spending restraint and have savings, people!  They are not taking the money, just paying it a week later.

To all those people who can say FU (or otherwise push back so they don't get to that point) based on a partner's salary and low expenses, hooray!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: SwordGuy on January 10, 2017, 03:48:38 PM
Having FU Money is "A Great Thing" (TM).

Occasionally, however, there's something even more liberating.

It's "FU Time".

I'll give an example.

My dad was in the US Army and stationed in France back in the 1950s.   He was driving in Paris down a long, one-lane alley.  He was about 3 car lengths from the end of the block and the cross street when a Frenchman pulled into the alley going the opposite direction.

The alley was too narrow for them to pass each other, so someone was going to have to back up and let the other person continue on their way.  My dad, having traveled nearly the entire block, thought the other guy should back up one entire car length.  The other fellow felt my dad should back up the entire length of the block.

The both sat in the respective cars gesturing to the other person to back up.  After doing this several times, the Frenchman got out of his vehicle and stood next to the driver's door, gesturing even more strongly that my dad should back up.  My dad shook his head "No" and repeated his gestures to the other fellow to back up.

This was apparently unacceptable, so the Frenchman came over beside my dad's car door and repeated his gesture.

My dad politely gestured to wait just one moment and got out of his car and locked it.  He then sat down at the corner café and firmly stated, "Garcon, vin rouge!"    (Waiter, a glass of red wine!)

With that my dad clearly communicated that he had all F'n day to sit there and enjoy the day.

The Frenchman got in his car, backed up, and found another route to his destination.

FU Time.


We had an absolute master of FU Time in the USA some decades ago.  His name was Saul Alinsky and he was a community organizer for poor folks.   He realized that the three biggest resources the poor unemployed had were (1) their numbers, (2) they were bored and thus cheaply amused, and (3) they had ALL DAY to cause issues for the rich and complacent.

That's why, even to this day, decades after he died, the right wing spreads lies about him.   He scared them that bad.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: appleblossom on January 11, 2017, 12:48:48 AM
Heard a very different definition of FU money yesterday.

I watched a documentary called sour grapes, which does a good job of following a wine scam ($1,000's per bottle, millions of dollars kind of wine). In it, FU money was described as the chunk of money dedicated to spending on nothing, just for the sake of spending.

I have always considered it the money you are willing to spend(savings) to avoid having to do what others want you to do.

I think she really missed the point. It is not the money, it is the freedom that the money provides.

I noticed the same thing. Good film though.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Dicey on January 11, 2017, 01:13:40 AM
My wife works for a major company (you probably have multiple items in your home produced by this company) who have recently announced that they are delaying the timing of their paychecks this march.

Basically, they will be holding all their employees' money for an additional week. I've located some other funds equivalent to one week's pay for my wife and set it aside--ready to go--but I feel for all her co-workers who do not have that kind of flexibility.

This is happening to me and my co-workers right now as a result of an acquisition.  MegaCorp delays payment 1 week, Medium corp did not.  It is RIDICULOUS how much people focus on this!  I guess it really matters to them...  I know many people spend everything they make, but with several weeks of advanced notice you'd think this would not be a hardship, especially when you found out months ago you are getting laid off this year!  Show some spending restraint and have savings, people!  They are not taking the money, just paying it a week later.
Hmmm, i agree with your perspective, homestead neohio. I was kind of puzzled by TT's need to "locate other funds" to cover a one week pay gap.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Kitsune on January 11, 2017, 07:02:25 AM
My wife works for a major company (you probably have multiple items in your home produced by this company) who have recently announced that they are delaying the timing of their paychecks this march.

Basically, they will be holding all their employees' money for an additional week. I've located some other funds equivalent to one week's pay for my wife and set it aside--ready to go--but I feel for all her co-workers who do not have that kind of flexibility.

This is happening to me and my co-workers right now as a result of an acquisition.  MegaCorp delays payment 1 week, Medium corp did not.  It is RIDICULOUS how much people focus on this!  I guess it really matters to them...  I know many people spend everything they make, but with several weeks of advanced notice you'd think this would not be a hardship, especially when you found out months ago you are getting laid off this year!  Show some spending restraint and have savings, people!  They are not taking the money, just paying it a week later.
Hmmm, i agree with your perspective, homestead neohio. I was kind of puzzled by TT's need to "locate other funds" to cover a one week pay gap.

Enh. I don't keep a paycheck's worth of buffer in my checking account, and I have automatic payments (mortgage, life insurance) that come out of it, so I'd have to 'locate other funds' out of either my savings account, or an investment account, to cover the payments due to come out.

It's not that we don't HAVE the money, it's that the money is in a different spot.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Laura33 on January 11, 2017, 07:20:25 AM

As I found out when my husband found out he was getting laid off during my 8th month of pregnancy.

You too?  That's exactly what happened to us.  I was not nearly as calm about it as you, especially since it had nothing to do with the company's performance (some post-merger tax writeoff thing, followed shortly by the announcement that the company had met financial targets so the CEO got something like $900M in options).  Still angry about that one. . . .
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: mtn on January 11, 2017, 09:02:48 AM
My wife works for a major company (you probably have multiple items in your home produced by this company) who have recently announced that they are delaying the timing of their paychecks this march.

Basically, they will be holding all their employees' money for an additional week. I've located some other funds equivalent to one week's pay for my wife and set it aside--ready to go--but I feel for all her co-workers who do not have that kind of flexibility.

This is happening to me and my co-workers right now as a result of an acquisition.  MegaCorp delays payment 1 week, Medium corp did not.  It is RIDICULOUS how much people focus on this!  I guess it really matters to them...  I know many people spend everything they make, but with several weeks of advanced notice you'd think this would not be a hardship, especially when you found out months ago you are getting laid off this year!  Show some spending restraint and have savings, people!  They are not taking the money, just paying it a week later.
Hmmm, i agree with your perspective, homestead neohio. I was kind of puzzled by TT's need to "locate other funds" to cover a one week pay gap.

Enh. I don't keep a paycheck's worth of buffer in my checking account, and I have automatic payments (mortgage, life insurance) that come out of it, so I'd have to 'locate other funds' out of either my savings account, or an investment account, to cover the payments due to come out.

It's not that we don't HAVE the money, it's that the money is in a different spot.

Same. I'd actually probably just ask my dad for a loan for a week or two--only because it would be a lot easier than transferring the money from one place to another, and then back to said place.

Either that or float more things on a credit card.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: SweetRedWine on January 11, 2017, 10:58:52 AM
These stories are so great and inspiring.  Thank you to all for helping me get through a stressful workday.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Metric Mouse on January 13, 2017, 06:15:11 PM
It's not that we don't HAVE the money, it's that the money is in a different spot.

 You see, the way that my bank account is set up... (http://www.bing.com/videos/search?q=see+the+way+my+bank+account+is+set+up&&view=detail&mid=550682DD65ECFB1615A2550682DD65ECFB1615A2&rvsmid=22FE3BF56E0CE33AC5AE22FE3BF56E0CE33AC5AE&fsscr=0&FORM=VDFSRV)

--- Kevin Hart routine.

Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: LeRainDrop on January 14, 2017, 02:19:07 PM
It's not that we don't HAVE the money, it's that the money is in a different spot.

 You see, the way that my bank account is set up... (http://www.bing.com/videos/search?q=see+the+way+my+bank+account+is+set+up&&view=detail&mid=550682DD65ECFB1615A2550682DD65ECFB1615A2&rvsmid=22FE3BF56E0CE33AC5AE22FE3BF56E0CE33AC5AE&fsscr=0&FORM=VDFSRV)

--- Kevin Hart routine.

Love it!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: EricL on January 17, 2017, 09:45:38 PM
No stories.  Just following.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: everinprogress on January 17, 2017, 09:55:08 PM
My wife works for a major company (you probably have multiple items in your home produced by this company) who have recently announced that they are delaying the timing of their paychecks this march.

Basically, they will be holding all their employees' money for an additional week. I've located some other funds equivalent to one week's pay for my wife and set it aside--ready to go--but I feel for all her co-workers who do not have that kind of flexibility.

This is happening to me and my co-workers right now as a result of an acquisition.  MegaCorp delays payment 1 week, Medium corp did not.  It is RIDICULOUS how much people focus on this!  I guess it really matters to them...  I know many people spend everything they make, but with several weeks of advanced notice you'd think this would not be a hardship, especially when you found out months ago you are getting laid off this year!  Show some spending restraint and have savings, people!  They are not taking the money, just paying it a week later.

To all those people who can say FU (or otherwise push back so they don't get to that point) based on a partner's salary and low expenses, hooray!

This sort of happened at my work last year, except they let everyone know 6-9 MONTHS in advance. Basically many sites were all on different pay schedules, and they were streamlining everything to be on the same schedule to make payroll's job easier. And provided multiple presentations, emails, and handouts outlining how the transition would work. Also provided forms to let people arrange in advance to have overtime or vacation hours paid out so that the one cheque wouldn't look smaller than what they were used to, due to having 6 shifts in it instead of 10 or whatever (voluntary). And they arranged to have it be the 3rd paycheque in one of the 2 '3 paycheque' months of the year (payed biweekly). And they arranged a payroll advance for people to sign up for if they needed that could be payed back over time. I literally can't think of anything else they could have done to make it easier on people...but...
there was still sooo much whining, a rather large number of people convinced they weren't going to be paid for some shifts, people convince that this was completely unfair and impossible.
It was a relief to have some time off during the transition, just so I didn't have to hear about it so much
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Prairie Stash on January 18, 2017, 12:07:37 PM
My wife works for a major company (you probably have multiple items in your home produced by this company) who have recently announced that they are delaying the timing of their paychecks this march.

Basically, they will be holding all their employees' money for an additional week. I've located some other funds equivalent to one week's pay for my wife and set it aside--ready to go--but I feel for all her co-workers who do not have that kind of flexibility.

This is happening to me and my co-workers right now as a result of an acquisition.  MegaCorp delays payment 1 week, Medium corp did not.  It is RIDICULOUS how much people focus on this!  I guess it really matters to them...  I know many people spend everything they make, but with several weeks of advanced notice you'd think this would not be a hardship, especially when you found out months ago you are getting laid off this year!  Show some spending restraint and have savings, people!  They are not taking the money, just paying it a week later.

To all those people who can say FU (or otherwise push back so they don't get to that point) based on a partner's salary and low expenses, hooray!

This sort of happened at my work last year, except they let everyone know 6-9 MONTHS in advance. Basically many sites were all on different pay schedules, and they were streamlining everything to be on the same schedule to make payroll's job easier. And provided multiple presentations, emails, and handouts outlining how the transition would work. Also provided forms to let people arrange in advance to have overtime or vacation hours paid out so that the one cheque wouldn't look smaller than what they were used to, due to having 6 shifts in it instead of 10 or whatever (voluntary). And they arranged to have it be the 3rd paycheque in one of the 2 '3 paycheque' months of the year (payed biweekly). And they arranged a payroll advance for people to sign up for if they needed that could be payed back over time. I literally can't think of anything else they could have done to make it easier on people...but...
there was still sooo much whining, a rather large number of people convinced they weren't going to be paid for some shifts, people convince that this was completely unfair and impossible.
It was a relief to have some time off during the transition, just so I didn't have to hear about it so much
To be fair I would complain. When my company went from monthly to biweekly they wanted to start the new system with a 2 week grace period, which means that work I do is delayed payment for 2 weeks. It was explained that over the course of our career it would balance since our last cheque would come out 2 weeks after we left and it would be the same. In the short term I would have less money to invest that year, effectively I would lose out on $50/year for every year I worked here. 

Its a tried and true MegaCorp windfall, delay pay for a week and gain access to a million dollars ($1000/employee and 1000 employees) that technically should be put aside but can earn interest at 5%. When dealing with invoices its standard practice of Megacorps to pay late, they gain interest off several million dollars that way, its a simple trick that can pay an accountants salary.

If you don't mind losing a few dollars to your company that's your business. Its shady to earn a few dollars off your employees though, I don't like being taken advantage of even when its small amounts.

My company reversed the decision when confronted with the math. They were hoping to slide it past without anyone noticing. They were surprised anyone would care about losing $50/year, to which the rebuttal was "if its insignificant then why do it? Why keep money if you don't need to?"
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Sibley on January 18, 2017, 02:14:22 PM
...
Its a tried and true MegaCorp windfall, delay pay for a week and gain access to a million dollars ($1000/employee and 1000 employees) that technically should be put aside but can earn interest at 5%. When dealing with invoices its standard practice of Megacorps to pay late, they gain interest off several million dollars that way, its a simple trick that can pay an accountants salary.

Actually, the invoices one is frequently related to a company not having their act together to pay on time/early. Which hurts them, because many invoices have a early pay discount - 2/15/net 30 for example. If you pay within 15 days, you get a 2% discount, or it's due within 30 days but no discount. Depending on the interest rates, it is very often financially advantageous to get that discount.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Slow&Steady on January 18, 2017, 02:27:33 PM
And DH just smiled and said, "I may need A job, but I don't need THIS job."  Needless to say, he has felt free to take time off as needed for kid duty (as have I).  Makes two full-time jobs and two kids much more livable on a daily basis.

I've said something similar, without FU money.

If you have a standard of living that can be met on 1(ish) salary, and no debt, even no FU money means that your spouse's job is all the safety net you need (and their safety net is your job - it goes both ways). You (collective) need ONE OF you to have a job. Neither of you need THESE PARTICULAR jobs.

As I found out when my husband found out he was getting laid off during my 8th month of pregnancy. We JUST paid off all debt. We have a paid-off car and a VERY affordable mortgage in a place we love living. Maternity leave payments for me + unemployment for him = still 1K going into savings every month. We're FINE.

Meanwhile, his colleagues were freaking out for him and seemed to think that we were going to starve or lose the house. Like... no. He'll take a few months off with the babies, and then get another job, and we'll be FINE.

I never considered this an FU story but maybe it is.

My husband quit his job when I was 9 months pregnant to start working in real estate.  I don't remember the exact details but his already messed up schedule was going to be even more messed up, he has some health issues that wasn't working well with his job, plus the plan was always for him to cut back if needed/wanted once kids came around.  We had an emergency fund, I had a higher paying job that provided our benefits, and I had 0 desire to stay at home.  Nobody could believe he would quit his job with a 9 month pregnant wife.  We both got really tired of hear people make a comment of "I can't believe you quit when you are about to have a new baby at home."  He got tired of hearing it because we had FU abilities, I got tired of hearing it because nobody says that shit to a woman that quits when she is 9 months pregnant.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Candace on January 18, 2017, 02:49:59 PM
And DH just smiled and said, "I may need A job, but I don't need THIS job."  Needless to say, he has felt free to take time off as needed for kid duty (as have I).  Makes two full-time jobs and two kids much more livable on a daily basis.

I've said something similar, without FU money.

If you have a standard of living that can be met on 1(ish) salary, and no debt, even no FU money means that your spouse's job is all the safety net you need (and their safety net is your job - it goes both ways). You (collective) need ONE OF you to have a job. Neither of you need THESE PARTICULAR jobs.

As I found out when my husband found out he was getting laid off during my 8th month of pregnancy. We JUST paid off all debt. We have a paid-off car and a VERY affordable mortgage in a place we love living. Maternity leave payments for me + unemployment for him = still 1K going into savings every month. We're FINE.

Meanwhile, his colleagues were freaking out for him and seemed to think that we were going to starve or lose the house. Like... no. He'll take a few months off with the babies, and then get another job, and we'll be FINE.

I never considered this an FU story but maybe it is.

My husband quit his job when I was 9 months pregnant to start working in real estate.  I don't remember the exact details but his already messed up schedule was going to be even more messed up, he has some health issues that wasn't working well with his job, plus the plan was always for him to cut back if needed/wanted once kids came around.  We had an emergency fund, I had a higher paying job that provided our benefits, and I had 0 desire to stay at home.  Nobody could believe he would quit his job with a 9 month pregnant wife.  We both got really tired of hear people make a comment of "I can't believe you quit when you are about to have a new baby at home."  He got tired of hearing it because we had FU abilities, I got tired of hearing it because nobody says that shit to a woman that quits when she is 9 months pregnant.

I think this is the definition of an FU story. Epic, even. Hats off to you both.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: RyanAtTanagra on January 18, 2017, 03:13:02 PM
My husband quit his job when I was 9 months pregnant to start working in real estate.  I don't remember the exact details but his already messed up schedule was going to be even more messed up, he has some health issues that wasn't working well with his job, plus the plan was always for him to cut back if needed/wanted once kids came around.  We had an emergency fund, I had a higher paying job that provided our benefits, and I had 0 desire to stay at home.  Nobody could believe he would quit his job with a 9 month pregnant wife.  We both got really tired of hear people make a comment of "I can't believe you quit when you are about to have a new baby at home."  He got tired of hearing it because we had FU abilities, I got tired of hearing it because nobody says that shit to a woman that quits when she is 9 months pregnant.

If you don't confuse the majority every once in a while, you're not living far enough outside the box :-)  Try not to get annoyed and instead see it as a sign you're on the right track.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: BlueHouse on January 19, 2017, 10:53:55 AM
I almost just had one 40 minutes ago, but instead, bit my tongue, left the meeting as if nothing unusual had happened, got in my car and started whimpering like a baby.  I wondered why I was crying and really it's not because I give one shit about any of the people in that meeting.  It's because I wanted to get up and quit but I am not close enough to FIRE to quit.  I have plenty of FU money, but at the rate I'm saving at this job, I could FIRE so much faster by staying here and continuing to eat their shit sandwiches.  So I ate their shit.  Again. 

This is the opposite of an FU money story, but I just had to get it out. 
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: mtn on January 19, 2017, 10:58:00 AM
I almost just had one 40 minutes ago, but instead, bit my tongue, left the meeting as if nothing unusual had happened, got in my car and started whimpering like a baby.  I wondered why I was crying and really it's not because I give one shit about any of the people in that meeting.  It's because I wanted to get up and quit but I am not close enough to FIRE to quit.  I have plenty of FU money, but at the rate I'm saving at this job, I could FIRE so much faster by staying here and continuing to eat their shit sandwiches.  So I ate their shit.  Again. 

This is the opposite of an FU money story, but I just had to get it out.

An ironic golden handcuff story--ironic in the sense that the ONLY reason you're in them is to get to FIRE faster.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Taran Wanderer on January 19, 2017, 11:18:00 AM
I almost just had one 40 minutes ago, but instead, bit my tongue, left the meeting as if nothing unusual had happened, got in my car and started whimpering like a baby.  I wondered why I was crying and really it's not because I give one shit about any of the people in that meeting.  It's because I wanted to get up and quit but I am not close enough to FIRE to quit.  I have plenty of FU money, but at the rate I'm saving at this job, I could FIRE so much faster by staying here and continuing to eat their shit sandwiches.  So I ate their shit.  Again. 

This is the opposite of an FU money story, but I just had to get it out.

I'm sorry you had a bad day.  On the plus side, you have a strategy, and you are sticking to it through your own strength.  So kudos to you for that!
An ironic golden handcuff story--ironic in the sense that the ONLY reason you're in them is to get to FIRE faster.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: JustGettingStarted1980 on January 19, 2017, 11:56:06 AM
We ALL eat shit sandwiches on a regular basis. This is life in general. We have to make compromises to get what we want out of life.  Your compromise is to stay working to achieve FIRE sooner at your desired spending rate. 

I'm not minimizing your tough meeting at all. What I'm trying to say is, stay focused on your goals and this realization of WHY you tolerating bullshit allows you to "bear down" when you need to on those tough days.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Kitsune on January 19, 2017, 12:16:20 PM
We ALL eat shit sandwiches on a regular basis. This is life in general. We have to make compromises to get what we want out of life.  Your compromise is to stay working to achieve FIRE sooner at your desired spending rate. 

I'm not minimizing your tough meeting at all. What I'm trying to say is, stay focused on your goals and this realization of WHY you tolerating bullshit allows you to "bear down" when you need to on those tough days.

Seconding this, because I'Ve been in that situation. There's a time and place to eat a shit sandwich because it's small and your goal is large and your goal is WORTH IT.

The glory of FU money is that, if you decide that the sandwich is big and your goal is important but not THAT important and fuck this shit sandwich THEY'RE gonna eat it and you're gonna WALK... you have that option. A lot of people don't, and just keep eating bigger and bigger piles of it.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: arebelspy on January 19, 2017, 12:57:37 PM
I almost just had one 40 minutes ago, but instead, bit my tongue, left the meeting as if nothing unusual had happened, got in my car and started whimpering like a baby.  I wondered why I was crying and really it's not because I give one shit about any of the people in that meeting.  It's because I wanted to get up and quit but I am not close enough to FIRE to quit.  I have plenty of FU money, but at the rate I'm saving at this job, I could FIRE so much faster by staying here and continuing to eat their shit sandwiches.  So I ate their shit.  Again. 

This is the opposite of an FU money story, but I just had to get it out.

Sorry.  =/

I can't wait for you to come quote this post and tell the story when you DO finally quit.  :D
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Daisy on January 19, 2017, 01:18:44 PM
I almost just had one 40 minutes ago, but instead, bit my tongue, left the meeting as if nothing unusual had happened, got in my car and started whimpering like a baby.  I wondered why I was crying and really it's not because I give one shit about any of the people in that meeting.  It's because I wanted to get up and quit but I am not close enough to FIRE to quit.  I have plenty of FU money, but at the rate I'm saving at this job, I could FIRE so much faster by staying here and continuing to eat their shit sandwiches.  So I ate their shit.  Again. 

This is the opposite of an FU money story, but I just had to get it out.

I disagree. This *IS* an FU story in that you know you are only temporarily eating a shit sandwich. You can observe the craziness around you and just laugh to yourself that you won't  have to tolerate this much longer. You have a means to an end.

Think that if you didn't  have FU money you would really hate HAVING to eat shit sanwiches for most of you life.

Let the shit slide like water off a duck's back. You are almost free!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: okits on January 19, 2017, 01:25:01 PM
I almost just had one 40 minutes ago, but instead, bit my tongue, left the meeting as if nothing unusual had happened, got in my car and started whimpering like a baby.  I wondered why I was crying and really it's not because I give one shit about any of the people in that meeting.  It's because I wanted to get up and quit but I am not close enough to FIRE to quit.  I have plenty of FU money, but at the rate I'm saving at this job, I could FIRE so much faster by staying here and continuing to eat their shit sandwiches.  So I ate their shit.  Again. 

This is the opposite of an FU money story, but I just had to get it out.

Do you have a countdown clock?  It helps to see not only how many more days/months/years you have to go, but how many months/years you have already made it through.

Sorry about the shit-eating.  Have been there.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: fattest_foot on January 19, 2017, 02:47:49 PM
I disagree. This *IS* an FU story in that you know you are only temporarily eating a shit sandwich. You can observe the craziness around you and just laugh to yourself that you won't  have to tolerate this much longer. You have a means to an end.

Think that if you didn't  have FU money you would really hate HAVING to eat shit sanwiches for most of you life.

Let the shit slide like water off a duck's back. You are almost free!

This is actually a really good point.

I dislike having to go to work, and a lot of the time I'm actually really disappointed that I have to do it for several more years. But then I think 7 or 8 years is SO much better than 25-30. I honestly don't know how people do it.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: BlueHouse on January 19, 2017, 03:01:08 PM
I disagree. This *IS* an FU story in that you know you are only temporarily eating a shit sandwich. You can observe the craziness around you and just laugh to yourself that you won't  have to tolerate this much longer. You have a means to an end.

Think that if you didn't  have FU money you would really hate HAVING to eat shit sanwiches for most of you life.

Let the shit slide like water off a duck's back. You are almost free!

This is actually a really good point.

I dislike having to go to work, and a lot of the time I'm actually really disappointed that I have to do it for several more years. But then I think 7 or 8 years is SO much better than 25-30. I honestly don't know how people do it.

Now I'm crying again because all of these comments referencing my crap day just made me feel so much better.   Thank you for the support.  I really needed it today.  What a great community.  Truly!.  Thanks! 
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Adventine on January 19, 2017, 03:46:34 PM
Hey BlueHouse, I'm late to the party, but I just wanted to also chime in and say you're awesome, you've got this, and you're going to post an extremely satisfying conclusion to this shitty job on the forums pretty soon! :D
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: hettie1 on January 19, 2017, 04:16:40 PM
Awesome posts!  LOVE this thread!  Long time MMM reader, but just getting back to the Forums.

Here's mine: I work a full time job (a tech job for a company that I really like) but have always worked a PT job on the side to increase savings/pay for stuff that comes up that I don't want to use my savings for. I’m a great saver, and have saved a fair stash that makes me feel OK with not having the side income.

My most recent PT gig I maintained for almost 7 years as a PCA-type roll at a group home for 6 elderly folks, all in wheel chairs, most non-verbal.  Well, one of them died a while back and they replaced that individual with a 16-year old, fully mobile kid. This kid was hyper-active, non-verbal, and abusive to the staff and residents (think pulling out their hair, kicking them, pushing over their chairs, etc) who of course they can't protect themselves.  All other staff refused to say anything because this was their primary jobs and they didn't want to catch any heat by complaining (apparently complaints about bad situations in the past had fallen on deaf ears or resulted in transfers/firing the staff).  The company got a SIGNIFICANT amount of money for keeping the kid here because of his high behavior issues and therefore willingly put $$ above safety.

One day the kid tried to strangle me – I took pictures of the bruises on my neck, filed a complaint.  The company offered to provide a self-defense class (seriously!).  I asked them how that would help the residents in wheel chairs who can’t move themselves.  No responses.   A few weeks later I found black eyes on a few of the residents.  Filed another complaint.  The nurse told me (on the hush) that the company was putting together a case to fire me to shut me up.  I gave up trying to follow the correct procedures and filed a case directly with the State and then called in to say I was quitting.  (I think they were relieved that they had "gotten rid" of me so easily).
A few months later, one of the staff who still worked at the house told me that a lady from state had shown up  to follow up on the complaint I filed – the kid tried to attack the state worker who had screamed and run out the front door, lol.  A week after that the company was told by state that they had “x” days to get rid of the kid or their entire company would be shut down. 

In the meantime, a manager of another house that I did like offered me the same PT hours at her place, so I still had my extra income and I got the satisfaction of helping out the poor staff and residents at the original house who were too scared or unable to do anything for themselves.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Trifle on January 19, 2017, 04:29:39 PM
Holy shit, Hettie.  That is some serious and sad stuff. Glad you were there to do the right thing.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Mother Fussbudget on January 19, 2017, 04:45:03 PM
Holy shit, Hettie.  That is some serious and sad stuff. Glad you were there to do the right thing.
Indeed.  Thanks for doing the right thing, Hettie!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Taran Wanderer on January 19, 2017, 05:40:19 PM
Holy shit, Hettie.  That is some serious and sad stuff. Glad you were there to do the right thing.
Indeed.  Thanks for doing the right thing, Hettie!

Epic!  Good on you for doing the right thing.  Behold the power for FU Money.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: arebelspy on January 19, 2017, 05:42:15 PM
Yay Hettie!  You may never know what harm you saved some of those people who couldn't protect themselves, but thank you for doing that.  Way to go putting yourself in a position where you could, and then doing it!  :D
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: G-dog on January 19, 2017, 05:47:50 PM
It's great when FU money saves you, but so much better when it saves someone else!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: SwordGuy on January 19, 2017, 06:40:54 PM
Yeah Hettie!!!!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: hettie1 on January 19, 2017, 07:47:30 PM
Hettie, I have been looking at assisted living facilities for my mom recently.   Your story is one of the reasons we chose that route, rather than adult family homes.  My state regulates things fairly well, but if none of the patients or caregivers can speak for themselves, it is scary how things can spin out of control.  On behalf of the medically vulnerable and their family and friends, thank you for taking a stand.

Good choice!  Having worked in several home situations over the last decades I HIGHLY recommend one-on-one care or an actual assisted living home.  Group homes have some great staff, but they can go wrong quickly and its so sad.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Laura33 on January 19, 2017, 09:04:57 PM
Holy effing hell, Hettie.  I am glad there are people like you in this world.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Dicey on January 19, 2017, 09:35:00 PM
Holy effing hell, Hettie.  I am glad there are people like you in this world.
Amen to that!

Also, hugs to you, BlueHouse. I have soooo been there, done that. I am four years post-FIRE and every damn shit sandwich was worth it. I now have no memory of how bad they tasted way back when. Yours is definitely a FU story, because your stash keeps you from ever having to eat another one. You have a choice, and you will prevail in the end. You've got this.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: jlajr on January 19, 2017, 10:12:44 PM
It's great when FU money saves you, but so much better when it saves someone else!

+1 to that, G-dog!

Also, before seeing BlueHouse's post and the comments to it, the thought occurred to me that having at least some FU money kind of forces us to think: When are the shit sandwiches are too big that it becomes worth taking action that could lead to using that FU money before complete FIRE?

Without FU money, we might be able to simply accept that we have to eat the shit sandwiches being served to us in our current situations, unless or until someone offers to serve us something else that might look nice now but could turn into more shit sandwiches.

Is this is a case of "With great power, comes great responsibility" or could it be "Mo' money, mo' problems"? :)
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Metric Mouse on January 20, 2017, 12:37:43 AM
It's great when FU money saves you, but so much better when it saves someone else!

Right?
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: mm1970 on January 20, 2017, 10:35:23 AM
It's great when FU money saves you, but so much better when it saves someone else!
YES
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Bicycle_B on January 20, 2017, 05:38:08 PM
Holy shit, Hettie.  That is some serious and sad stuff. Glad you were there to do the right thing.
Indeed.  Thanks for doing the right thing, Hettie!
+1
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: SEAKSR on January 23, 2017, 03:36:29 PM
P2F...

No epic stories here... I've largely gotten lucky, and just found other employment when the going was looking potentially rough. But each and every one of your stories helps me remember why I maintain my funds, just in case. Thanks everyone!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: talltexan on February 01, 2017, 07:50:56 AM
Bluehouse, hang in there. In my previous job (some years ago, before I learned the ways of the mustache), my wife happened to download mint right about the time things started getting really horrible. I was shocked when she showed me that our net worth was $400,000. I couldn't imagine that kind of money at the time, it seemed so far removed from any reality. It's not enough for us to retire, but I realized how silly I was worrying about one job when we had accumulated that kind of stash seemingly by accident.

Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Dicey on February 01, 2017, 11:26:27 AM
Bluehouse, hang in there. In my previous job (some years ago, before I learned the ways of the mustache), my wife happened to download mint right about the time things started getting really horrible. I was shocked when she showed me that our net worth was $400,000. I couldn't imagine that kind of money at the time, it seemed so far removed from any reality. It's not enough for us to retire, but I realized how silly I was worrying about one job when we had accumulated that kind of stash seemingly by accident.
And that kind of peace of mind is priceless.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: privateer on February 05, 2017, 12:10:41 AM
after spending some time reading through this thread I think I should toss a few in:

1) The first time I realized the power of being flexible and financially secure was about a year after starting my first real engineering gig at company "A"... I had a bachelors degree at the time and was on hiatus from an integrated masters program that I had to finish within 2 years of finishing my bachelors (basically you tag on a year of graduate classes to the end of an intense bachelors for a masters degree).  I went to my manager and asked if I could have a leave of absence approved to go back to school.  My manager at the time (a nice guy actually, but under pressure to get products shipped) thought it would be very unlikely that I could get one approved and discouraged it.... until of course about 2 minutes later when he did a 180 when I suggested that if it wasn't possible I'd need to get the paperwork together for quitting because I had to go back to finish my masters.   educational leave approved :)


2) years later at the same company "A" I had drifted away from my specialty and wanted to get back into it. I found a sweet gig internally in the research division that was interesting, prestigious, and likely to pay a little better to boot.  The hiring manager gave me the thumbs up, however my existing management chain wouldn't approve my transfer saying I was critical and they needed me to stay on 9 more months to finish current projects (of course no promotion or salary bump for said critical engineer :) ). 

Knowing that sweet research gig would be filled in a month or two I started looking around outside and soon found a nice job at a competitor for a 25% salary bump. My old management tried to counter, but I never gave them a number and their counter offer came in under what the competitor was offering so no deal (which also helped avoid the awkwardness of still working there after threatening to leave).

  So off I went to company "B" after 2 weeks notice ! I half expected to be frog marched out the door when I gave notice, but it didn't happen... In fact I still remember one of the project managers asking me to write engineering change orders on my very last day, and eventually having to excuse myself to go to my goodbye party :)


on to FU money tale number 3:
After working at company "B"  for about 10 years I got caught up in a layoff.  My boss several years earlier tried to do something good for me that turned out quite bad.  He gave me a 15% raise one year, but to equal things out, gave me a low amount of stock... no worries, I was fat dumb and happy until 2 years later they needed to layoff 15% of the company, and because they hadn't handed out  bad annual reviews to 15% of the staff, they went back and decided that anyone who had low stock awards in the last few years were underperformers and needed to go. 

Getting the notice was a shock, but at least they gave me 30 days to find a different position internally. Luckily my specialty is in demand and I'm not a total jerk to work with so in the course of 2-3 weeks I had 6 different managers interested in hiring me (but only 2-3 actually had open positions given the tight head count due to the layoff). I also looked around externally, but at the time wasn't interested in moving for family reasons. I eventually ended up taking a job in one of those other divisions in company "B".

fast forward 3 months and my old manager lands a huge secret project in my specialty and needs to staff up significantly. not only that, but said huge project for company "C" is to replace a product that was built at company "A" (where I previously worked). because I understood how things worked at these two different companies I could translate the specs written for Company "A" into the design methodologies of company "B".  I got informally lent to this project and started working on it for about a month when my old manager started asking about transfering me back...

Meanwhile, some of my earlier inquiries made in the heat of potentially being layed off at another company "D" started to circulate internally (my specialty is a relatively small world).  A different manager at company "D" heard I was looking and offered me a gig that would let me work from home. After interviewing with them I negotiated an offer with about a 30%  compensation boost.

so, I called a meeting with my old boss (the one who had to lay me off 3 months earlier) to talk about transfering back to formally start helping out with the secret project. In the room I lay out the fact that I have an offer, and am planning on leaving company "B" unless he can bump me a grade level and match the 30% raise in the external offer.  He promises to work with HR to see what they can do before my offer expires.  Eventually HR drags it out to the last possible second and then comes up with something underwhelming (no grade change and only 15% raise).  So off I go.

Funny enough I don't really harbor any ill will to my old manager (he was really just a technical guy trying to do a managers job at a company that had severe HR and organizational shortcomings).  That said, I'd be lying if I didn't say I felt a sense of Shadenfreude over the whole turn of events.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Cork on February 05, 2017, 09:23:39 PM
after spending some time reading through this thread I think I should toss a few in:

1) The first time I realized the power of being flexible and financially secure was about a year after starting my first real engineering gig at company "A"... I had a bachelors degree at the time and was on hiatus from an integrated masters program that I had to finish within 2 years of finishing my bachelors (basically you tag on a year of graduate classes to the end of an intense bachelors for a masters degree).  I went to my manager and asked if I could have a leave of absence approved to go back to school.  My manager at the time (a nice guy actually, but under pressure to get products shipped) thought it would be very unlikely that I could get one approved and discouraged it.... until of course about 2 minutes later when he did a 180 when I suggested that if it wasn't possible I'd need to get the paperwork together for quitting because I had to go back to finish my masters.   educational leave approved :)

This ones my favorite, so I summarized it for you:

Manager: "I have control over your future."   
You: "No you don't." 
Manager: "Dammit, please still work for us."
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: mm1970 on February 06, 2017, 11:08:11 AM
after spending some time reading through this thread I think I should toss a few in:

1) The first time I realized the power of being flexible and financially secure was about a year after starting my first real engineering gig at company "A"... I had a bachelors degree at the time and was on hiatus from an integrated masters program that I had to finish within 2 years of finishing my bachelors (basically you tag on a year of graduate classes to the end of an intense bachelors for a masters degree).  I went to my manager and asked if I could have a leave of absence approved to go back to school.  My manager at the time (a nice guy actually, but under pressure to get products shipped) thought it would be very unlikely that I could get one approved and discouraged it.... until of course about 2 minutes later when he did a 180 when I suggested that if it wasn't possible I'd need to get the paperwork together for quitting because I had to go back to finish my masters.   educational leave approved :)

This ones my favorite, so I summarized it for you:

Manager: "I have control over your future."   
You: "No you don't." 
Manager: "Dammit, please still work for us."
also least confusing
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Guesl982374 on February 06, 2017, 01:23:32 PM
after spending some time reading through this thread I think I should toss a few in:

1) The first time I realized the power of being flexible and financially secure was about a year after starting my first real engineering gig at company "A"... I had a bachelors degree at the time and was on hiatus from an integrated masters program that I had to finish within 2 years of finishing my bachelors (basically you tag on a year of graduate classes to the end of an intense bachelors for a masters degree).  I went to my manager and asked if I could have a leave of absence approved to go back to school.  My manager at the time (a nice guy actually, but under pressure to get products shipped) thought it would be very unlikely that I could get one approved and discouraged it.... until of course about 2 minutes later when he did a 180 when I suggested that if it wasn't possible I'd need to get the paperwork together for quitting because I had to go back to finish my masters.   educational leave approved :)

This ones my favorite, so I summarized it for you:

Manager: "I have control over your future."   
You: "No you don't." 
Manager: "Dammit, please still work for us."

Funny how that works. I love it.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: solon on February 06, 2017, 04:05:16 PM
Posting to follow.

These stories are great motivation to stay at work and build up some FU money.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: privateer on February 06, 2017, 08:34:13 PM
after spending some time reading through this thread I think I should toss a few in:

1) The first time I realized the power of being flexible and financially secure was about a year after starting my first real engineering gig at company "A"... I had a bachelors degree at the time and was on hiatus from an integrated masters program that I had to finish within 2 years of finishing my bachelors (basically you tag on a year of graduate classes to the end of an intense bachelors for a masters degree).  I went to my manager and asked if I could have a leave of absence approved to go back to school.  My manager at the time (a nice guy actually, but under pressure to get products shipped) thought it would be very unlikely that I could get one approved and discouraged it.... until of course about 2 minutes later when he did a 180 when I suggested that if it wasn't possible I'd need to get the paperwork together for quitting because I had to go back to finish my masters.   educational leave approved :)

This ones my favorite, so I summarized it for you:

Manager: "I have control over your future."   
You: "No you don't." 
Manager: "Dammit, please still work for us."
also least confusing

sorry for the rambling nature.... the 3rd is actually my personal favorite. it summarizes to:

manager: you're laid off but eligible for rehire
(I find someplace else in the company)
(3 months later I start informally helping old manager)
Manager: can you move back to help us officially??
me: only if you match this external offer of a big raise that I got because I was threatened with a layoff a few months ago.
HR: ummmm??
me: bye!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Metric Mouse on February 06, 2017, 08:37:21 PM
after spending some time reading through this thread I think I should toss a few in:

1) The first time I realized the power of being flexible and financially secure was about a year after starting my first real engineering gig at company "A"... I had a bachelors degree at the time and was on hiatus from an integrated masters program that I had to finish within 2 years of finishing my bachelors (basically you tag on a year of graduate classes to the end of an intense bachelors for a masters degree).  I went to my manager and asked if I could have a leave of absence approved to go back to school.  My manager at the time (a nice guy actually, but under pressure to get products shipped) thought it would be very unlikely that I could get one approved and discouraged it.... until of course about 2 minutes later when he did a 180 when I suggested that if it wasn't possible I'd need to get the paperwork together for quitting because I had to go back to finish my masters.   educational leave approved :)

This ones my favorite, so I summarized it for you:

Manager: "I have control over your future."   
You: "No you don't." 
Manager: "Dammit, please still work for us."
Nice. Would even fit in a Dilbert panel.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: givemesunshine on February 06, 2017, 09:11:39 PM
Mine's fairly tame but reading this forum and particularly this thread over the last few months helped me calmly and fearlessly negotiate my recent position change.

I have been employed in my company for ~10 years, underpaid significantly for at least 6 of them due to restrictive 'levels' and 'ceilings'. A number of employees including myself changed to different type of contract which was less secure but had more flexibility for salary negotiations about 3 years ago. I was finally paid a fair salary, at least initially. Recently my responsibilities and the scope of my role have increased significantly and I was doing a lot more work that other co-workers at a similar salary level.

End of contract was 31 December and I received my offer late November. I was offered about $5K more which only put me on a par with the long-termers at my previous level of responsibility and didn't reflect the extra work I had been doing nor the work they were expecting me to take on from January 2017 after a structure change. I refused to sign. Cue lots of flapping about from HR and my manager trying to scare me into signing by saying things like; 'if you want your salary to reflect the next level up your position will have to be re-advertised and you might not get it' and 'your position is not indispensible you know'.

Because I knew I could live for at least two years on savings, plus I knew that my skills and expertise are actually hard to replace due to the systems and processes we use at work, I stood firm. Polite but immoveable. I won't sign for less than the next level up. And I want my salary reviewed in two years, not four. And I want a title change (didn't actually care about that but I thought I may as well ask for everything).

Lots of sighing and frowning and 'I'll see what I can do for you but don't hold your breath' type comments ensued and I quietly went about my business. I returned the following week to a freshly printed contract, increased salary, better benefits and a new title! All because I wasn't afraid to walk away. And also largely because to train someone up would take literally years and make the bosses lives much harder in the interim.

Thank the universe for FU money and lazy employers.

Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Dicey on February 06, 2017, 10:23:26 PM
Mine's fairly tame but reading this forum and particularly this thread over the last few months helped me calmly and fearlessly negotiate my recent position change.

I have been employed in my company for ~10 years, underpaid significantly for at least 6 of them due to restrictive 'levels' and 'ceilings'. A number of employees including myself changed to different type of contract which was less secure but had more flexibility for salary negotiations about 3 years ago. I was finally paid a fair salary, at least initially. Recently my responsibilities and the scope of my role have increased significantly and I was doing a lot more work that other co-workers at a similar salary level.

End of contract was 31 December and I received my offer late November. I was offered about $5K more which only put me on a par with the long-termers at my previous level of responsibility and didn't reflect the extra work I had been doing nor the work they were expecting me to take on from January 2017 after a structure change. I refused to sign. Cue lots of flapping about from HR and my manager trying to scare me into signing by saying things like; 'if you want your salary to reflect the next level up your position will have to be re-advertised and you might not get it' and 'your position is not indispensible you know'.

Because I knew I could live for at least two years on savings, plus I knew that my skills and expertise are actually hard to replace due to the systems and processes we use at work, I stood firm. Polite but immoveable. I won't sign for less than the next level up. And I want my salary reviewed in two years, not four. And I want a title change (didn't actually care about that but I thought I may as well ask for everything).

Lots of sighing and frowning and 'I'll see what I can do for you but don't hold your breath' type comments ensued and I quietly went about my business. I returned the following week to a freshly printed contract, increased salary, better benefits and a new title! All because I wasn't afraid to walk away. And also largely because to train someone up would take literally years and make the bosses lives much harder in the interim.

Thank the universe for FU money and lazy employers.
Don't forget to thank yourself there, zinny1. Wouldn't have happened without your past self making good decisions.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: nnls on February 06, 2017, 10:31:01 PM
Mine's fairly tame but reading this forum and particularly this thread over the last few months helped me calmly and fearlessly negotiate my recent position change.

I have been employed in my company for ~10 years, underpaid significantly for at least 6 of them due to restrictive 'levels' and 'ceilings'. A number of employees including myself changed to different type of contract which was less secure but had more flexibility for salary negotiations about 3 years ago. I was finally paid a fair salary, at least initially. Recently my responsibilities and the scope of my role have increased significantly and I was doing a lot more work that other co-workers at a similar salary level.

End of contract was 31 December and I received my offer late November. I was offered about $5K more which only put me on a par with the long-termers at my previous level of responsibility and didn't reflect the extra work I had been doing nor the work they were expecting me to take on from January 2017 after a structure change. I refused to sign. Cue lots of flapping about from HR and my manager trying to scare me into signing by saying things like; 'if you want your salary to reflect the next level up your position will have to be re-advertised and you might not get it' and 'your position is not indispensible you know'.

Because I knew I could live for at least two years on savings, plus I knew that my skills and expertise are actually hard to replace due to the systems and processes we use at work, I stood firm. Polite but immoveable. I won't sign for less than the next level up. And I want my salary reviewed in two years, not four. And I want a title change (didn't actually care about that but I thought I may as well ask for everything).

Lots of sighing and frowning and 'I'll see what I can do for you but don't hold your breath' type comments ensued and I quietly went about my business. I returned the following week to a freshly printed contract, increased salary, better benefits and a new title! All because I wasn't afraid to walk away. And also largely because to train someone up would take literally years and make the bosses lives much harder in the interim.

Thank the universe for FU money and lazy employers.

yay this is an awesome story. well done and congratulations on your payrise / title change
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: mikefixac on February 07, 2017, 06:10:45 PM
What the hell, this thread's been around awhile, I'll add my $.02. (If I haven't already).

I've had my own business (appliance repair) since 1989. Always did OK, but never set the world on fire. In fact, for me, doing just ok was setting the world on fire. I was totally responsible for how I survived, and I liked that.

A few years ago business dropped and I sought and got a job. All the years of working for myself I envied those who were part of a team. I had a good boss, good pay, good relations with the other employees, and new vehicle. Problem though is I just don't work well as an employee. So after just a few weeks, I drove truck over to bosses house, gave the vehicle and tools back, and quit.

Leaving his house I was jumping up and down clicking my heels I was so happy. 
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Evgenia on February 07, 2017, 06:39:30 PM
I have one.

Context: I was an engineering director down in Silicon Valley. All engineering programs reported in to me. I was in very good standing, got promotions every 6-12 months, year after year, more responsibility, yada yada all that. But, I'd hit the glass ceiling, having been told there was nowhere for me to go. Coincidentally, I was the only female director in the entire, vast place.

My MIL had died after a grueling bout with cancer, hospice, that whole shitty, undeserved kind of end. My husband was unemployed, as he'd quit his job (also in engineering) to take care of his mother in another part of the state (as others have pointed out, another key thing that FU money enables you to do).

It was a busy Software Season at my job, so we cut our annual (and, as you can probably gather, desperately needed) vacation with friends short, returning home on Thursday instead of Sunday.

Lesson #1: Everything bad happens when you go on vacation.

Lesson #2: Never, ever, EVER cut your vacation short. Ever.

I returned to work on Friday and, by 10 AM, was in a meeting with my (guilty, semi freaked out looking) boss explaining that, in the few days I'd been gone, some man had been interviewed and hired to take a brand new VP level position over me, *and* take over my team.

But it gets better... wait for it... My boss said he "hoped I'd stay on" and "could still be the new guy's assistant."

I said "I am no one's assistant. I'm leaving." And then I walked right out of the room and over to my desk, where I realized I probably should have asked my husband about this first, seeing as how we now had no income, him not having a job at the time and all. I texted him and said "Got a sec? Think I just quit my job." He called me and the very first words out of his mouth were, "Want me to come and help pack up your desk? Nothing would give me greater satisfaction than seeing you walk the fuck out of that place."

And that, ladies, is the moment you KNOW you married the perfect man. Unconditional support, he didn't even need to know why, and income, we could figure that out.

The details that emerged in the hours after my boss's announcement were priceless, and even more damning. It turned out my boss's boss had not even interviewed and was totally clueless about this hire (who would report to him), and instantly started fighting it like mad. Someone leaked the results of the new guy's interview and found the majority of people had recommended "No hire" and done so STRONGLY. On, and on. Unmitigated disaster, and nice to watch from afar, happily ensconced in my FU fund.

Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Sydneystache on February 07, 2017, 06:42:52 PM
Awesome! Well done - wow. I agree, never cut your holiday short for some mess that happened while you're away and good on your hubby for supporting you no qs asked.

Very sneaky of your company too. What happened to the hire? Did he last long? Did the company contact you again to come back?
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Adventine on February 07, 2017, 06:58:11 PM
Evgenia, we need to know what happened next!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Evgenia on February 07, 2017, 07:11:22 PM
You guys make me laugh! The hire was allowed to come in on contract, as a contract-to-hire. It was an abysmal failure and, after a few months of his saying things to employees like "I've never met a black person before!" (really) and always asking women on the campus if they were married, he was not hired permanently.

I stayed gone and had a much nicer job (with signing bonus, and lots of other bonuses, and $30k additional salary) in days, from a former colleague who'd moved on a year or so previously.

And I did that until we went FIRE not quite two years ago! :-) THE END. :-)
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Hvillian on February 07, 2017, 07:18:01 PM
Awesome Evegenia, every part (except how you were treated).  Thank you for sharing.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: CowboyAndIndian on February 07, 2017, 08:00:12 PM
Evegenia, the power of FU money and a Spouse who has your back is mighty powerful.

Thanks for sharing
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Metric Mouse on February 07, 2017, 08:01:40 PM
You guys make me laugh! The hire was allowed to come in on contract, as a contract-to-hire. It was an abysmal failure and, after a few months of his saying things to employees like "I've never met a black person before!" (really) and always asking women on the campus if they were married, he was not hired permanently.

I stayed gone and had a much nicer job (with signing bonus, and lots of other bonuses, and $30k additional salary) in days, from a former colleague who'd moved on a year or so previously.

And I did that until we went FIRE not quite two years ago! :-) THE END. :-)
Great story. (For you)
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Laura33 on February 07, 2017, 08:04:22 PM
You guys make me laugh! The hire was allowed to come in on contract, as a contract-to-hire. It was an abysmal failure and, after a few months of his saying things to employees like "I've never met a black person before!" (really) and always asking women on the campus if they were married, he was not hired permanently.

I stayed gone and had a much nicer job (with signing bonus, and lots of other bonuses, and $30k additional salary) in days, from a former colleague who'd moved on a year or so previously.

And I did that until we went FIRE not quite two years ago! :-) THE END. :-)

You are officially awesome - glad you got the last laugh!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: snapperdude on February 07, 2017, 09:56:42 PM
I love you, Evgenia!

I had the whole "hire a man in over your head and expect you to do all his work for him" thing pulled on me twice.   The first time, I finished up some projects that were personally important to me, and then quit.  The second time, I kept working for a few months to bump up the savings until my return to the US, and then FIREd.    I still kind of wish I had walked out immediately both times, though.   It sucks when companies pull that glass ceiling shit....

Sucks when countries do too.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Evgenia on February 07, 2017, 09:58:59 PM
I love you, Evgenia!

I had the whole "hire a man in over your head and expect you to do all his work for him" thing pulled on me twice.   The first time, I finished up some projects that were personally important to me, and then quit.  The second time, I kept working for a few months to bump up the savings until my return to the US, and then FIREd.    I still kind of wish I had walked out immediately both times, though.   It sucks when companies pull that glass ceiling shit....

Love you too! I have to say, awesome as it sounds, I only knew to walk *because* it had happened to me before. I did not, regretfully, walk the first time it happened.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Adventine on February 07, 2017, 11:38:46 PM
You guys make me laugh! The hire was allowed to come in on contract, as a contract-to-hire. It was an abysmal failure and, after a few months of his saying things to employees like "I've never met a black person before!" (really) and always asking women on the campus if they were married, he was not hired permanently.

I stayed gone and had a much nicer job (with signing bonus, and lots of other bonuses, and $30k additional salary) in days, from a former colleague who'd moved on a year or so previously.

And I did that until we went FIRE not quite two years ago! :-) THE END. :-)

Revenge is so, so sweet :D
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: PaulMaxime on February 08, 2017, 12:07:38 AM
My story is this:

I worked at a large Internet company from 2007-2015. During the last 3 years at that company I found my way on to a special project that was run as an "internal startup" Now in Sept of 2015 our group spun off to an independent company.

Most of the other engineers were too scared to make the move. The large company is very stable and pays well and has great benefits. From a team of 80 we ended up with 37 people (only 6 engineers!)

I was able to take the risk and join the spinoff because I am 99% FI at this point. Our little company has become hugely successful in one year and now I'm looking to make real $$$ off of the very large equity grant I got as part of joining the new company.

FU Money == freedom to take risks.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Metric Mouse on February 08, 2017, 12:18:08 AM
My story is this:

I worked at a large Internet company from 2007-2015. During the last 3 years at that company I found my way on to a special project that was run as an "internal startup" Now in Sept of 2015 our group spun off to an independent company.

Most of the other engineers were too scared to make the move. The large company is very stable and pays well and has great benefits. From a team of 80 we ended up with 37 people (only 6 engineers!)

I was able to take the risk and join the spinoff because I am 99% FI at this point. Our little company has become hugely successful in one year and now I'm looking to make real $$$ off of the very large equity grant I got as part of joining the new company.

FU Money == freedom to take risks.

This is exciting! So you 'looted' 37 people from a team of 80? That's quite impressive
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Dicey on February 08, 2017, 12:57:51 AM
I love you, Evgenia!

I had the whole "hire a man in over your head and expect you to do all his work for him" thing pulled on me twice.   The first time, I finished up some projects that were personally important to me, and then quit.  The second time, I kept working for a few months to bump up the savings until my return to the US, and then FIREd.    I still kind of wish I had walked out immediately both times, though.   It sucks when companies pull that glass ceiling shit....

Love you too! I have to say, awesome as it sounds, I only knew to walk *because* it had happened to me before. I did not, regretfully, walk the first time it happened.
Ah, but you learned and you were prepared when it happened again. I love you at least as much as lhamo does, maybe even a tiny bit more.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: woopwoop on February 08, 2017, 01:14:45 PM
My very first (and only) FU story was when I was 16 and had just gotten my first job at an ice cream shop over the summer. After a month or so of working, my mom told me I could go on a trip by myself to visit family in France... I was ecstatic! But when I told the manager and asked for two weeks off, she said I couldn't have it.

What? This was the first job I'd ever had, and it seemed strange to me that I wasn't allowed to come and go as I pleased, and I said, quite surprisedly, that I was going no matter what. The manager made a big fuss about it and said that I wasn't responsible, blah blah blah, you're fired! I went home and cried, but decided to go on the trip - not much of a decision really, as I didn't NEED the money. I worked up until I left, and the manager seemed almost happy to see me "fired."

And then when I came back from vacation, I went back to the ice cream place, where they were still hiring. The owner was surprised to see me, hadn't I been fired? I said yes, but I'm a good worker and I just wanted to take a trip so you should hire me back. And they did, haha! The manager was so butthurt to see me back on the schedule, but I was the only employee that would show up on time and do the work so there was really nothing she could say about it.

Suck it, TCBY!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: mm1970 on February 08, 2017, 02:08:02 PM
I have one.

Context: I was an engineering director down in Silicon Valley. All engineering programs reported in to me. I was in very good standing, got promotions every 6-12 months, year after year, more responsibility, yada yada all that. But, I'd hit the glass ceiling, having been told there was nowhere for me to go. Coincidentally, I was the only female director in the entire, vast place.

My MIL had died after a grueling bout with cancer, hospice, that whole shitty, undeserved kind of end. My husband was unemployed, as he'd quit his job (also in engineering) to take care of his mother in another part of the state (as others have pointed out, another key thing that FU money enables you to do).

It was a busy Software Season at my job, so we cut our annual (and, as you can probably gather, desperately needed) vacation with friends short, returning home on Thursday instead of Sunday.

Lesson #1: Everything bad happens when you go on vacation.

Lesson #2: Never, ever, EVER cut your vacation short. Ever.

I returned to work on Friday and, by 10 AM, was in a meeting with my (guilty, semi freaked out looking) boss explaining that, in the few days I'd been gone, some man had been interviewed and hired to take a brand new VP level position over me, *and* take over my team.

But it gets better... wait for it... My boss said he "hoped I'd stay on" and "could still be the new guy's assistant."

I said "I am no one's assistant. I'm leaving." And then I walked right out of the room and over to my desk, where I realized I probably should have asked my husband about this first, seeing as how we now had no income, him not having a job at the time and all. I texted him and said "Got a sec? Think I just quit my job." He called me and the very first words out of his mouth were, "Want me to come and help pack up your desk? Nothing would give me greater satisfaction than seeing you walk the fuck out of that place."

And that, ladies, is the moment you KNOW you married the perfect man. Unconditional support, he didn't even need to know why, and income, we could figure that out.

The details that emerged in the hours after my boss's announcement were priceless, and even more damning. It turned out my boss's boss had not even interviewed and was totally clueless about this hire (who would report to him), and instantly started fighting it like mad. Someone leaked the results of the new guy's interview and found the majority of people had recommended "No hire" and done so STRONGLY. On, and on. Unmitigated disaster, and nice to watch from afar, happily ensconced in my FU fund.
OMFG. 

That was epic, and your husband is awesome.

Also, glass ceiling sucks rocks.  I hit it a few years ago (at manager level, not director level in engineering but not software), but have since seen new directors hired, whee!  Whatever.  Recently, boss said "you know I can't give you a raise, and we keep hiring expensive people elsewhere.  So, if you need time off without taking PTO, go ahead and take it."  Basically giving me permission to work 6 hour days when I need to.  (Which, with 2 kids, both of whom seem to love getting the stomach flu, is often!)

Also NEVER cut your vacation short!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: mtn on February 08, 2017, 02:22:52 PM
I have one.

Context: I was an engineering director down in Silicon Valley. All engineering programs reported in to me. I was in very good standing, got promotions every 6-12 months, year after year, more responsibility, yada yada all that. But, I'd hit the glass ceiling, having been told there was nowhere for me to go. Coincidentally, I was the only female director in the entire, vast place.

My MIL had died after a grueling bout with cancer, hospice, that whole shitty, undeserved kind of end. My husband was unemployed, as he'd quit his job (also in engineering) to take care of his mother in another part of the state (as others have pointed out, another key thing that FU money enables you to do).

It was a busy Software Season at my job, so we cut our annual (and, as you can probably gather, desperately needed) vacation with friends short, returning home on Thursday instead of Sunday.

Lesson #1: Everything bad happens when you go on vacation.

Lesson #2: Never, ever, EVER cut your vacation short. Ever.

I returned to work on Friday and, by 10 AM, was in a meeting with my (guilty, semi freaked out looking) boss explaining that, in the few days I'd been gone, some man had been interviewed and hired to take a brand new VP level position over me, *and* take over my team.

But it gets better... wait for it... My boss said he "hoped I'd stay on" and "could still be the new guy's assistant."

I said "I am no one's assistant. I'm leaving." And then I walked right out of the room and over to my desk, where I realized I probably should have asked my husband about this first, seeing as how we now had no income, him not having a job at the time and all. I texted him and said "Got a sec? Think I just quit my job." He called me and the very first words out of his mouth were, "Want me to come and help pack up your desk? Nothing would give me greater satisfaction than seeing you walk the fuck out of that place."

And that, ladies, is the moment you KNOW you married the perfect man. Unconditional support, he didn't even need to know why, and income, we could figure that out.

The details that emerged in the hours after my boss's announcement were priceless, and even more damning. It turned out my boss's boss had not even interviewed and was totally clueless about this hire (who would report to him), and instantly started fighting it like mad. Someone leaked the results of the new guy's interview and found the majority of people had recommended "No hire" and done so STRONGLY. On, and on. Unmitigated disaster, and nice to watch from afar, happily ensconced in my FU fund.
OMFG. 

That was epic, and your husband is awesome.

Also, glass ceiling sucks rocks.  I hit it a few years ago (at manager level, not director level in engineering but not software), but have since seen new directors hired, whee!  Whatever.  Recently, boss said "you know I can't give you a raise, and we keep hiring expensive people elsewhere.  So, if you need time off without taking PTO, go ahead and take it."  Basically giving me permission to work 6 hour days when I need to.  (Which, with 2 kids, both of whom seem to love getting the stomach flu, is often!)

Also NEVER cut your vacation short!

Another example of A glass ceiling (not the same that you're talking about here) sucking: A woman in my old job was amazing. Did way more work than anyone on the team, had knowledge that no one else did--she wasn't irreplaceable, but she wasn't someone you'd want to replace.

At a performance review, she basically asked why she wasn't the next level up. They told her that they don't promote to that level. She prodded further and found it was that that department didn't promote to that level. Within 4 months, 4 of us out of 12 had left that team, in part because of that knowledge.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: arebelspy on February 09, 2017, 03:18:00 AM
This is one of my favorite threads. Thanks to all who shared their stories in the last few days. I loved each one of them! :)
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: paddedhat on February 09, 2017, 04:50:12 AM
My very first (and only) FU story was when I was 16 and had just gotten my first job at an ice cream shop over the summer. After a month or so of working, my mom told me I could go on a trip by myself to visit family in France... I was ecstatic! But when I told the manager and asked for two weeks off, she said I couldn't have it.

What? This was the first job I'd ever had, and it seemed strange to me that I wasn't allowed to come and go as I pleased, and I said, quite surprisedly, that I was going no matter what. The manager made a big fuss about it and said that I wasn't responsible, blah blah blah, you're fired! I went home and cried, but decided to go on the trip - not much of a decision really, as I didn't NEED the money. I worked up until I left, and the manager seemed almost happy to see me "fired."

And then when I came back from vacation, I went back to the ice cream place, where they were still hiring. The owner was surprised to see me, hadn't I been fired? I said yes, but I'm a good worker and I just wanted to take a trip so you should hire me back. And they did, haha! The manager was so butthurt to see me back on the schedule, but I was the only employee that would show up on time and do the work so there was really nothing she could say about it.

Suck it, TCBY!

My son, at the same tended age, seemed to have inherited similar values. At 14 YO and after a vigorous search, he found a job at a local Subway shop. Sadly, the franchisee turned out to be pretty mentally ill. She was obsessed with winning some kind of secret shopper, corporate award for cleanliness, or something. She was also obsessed with the fact that every minimum wage serf of hers had to be in motion, every second on the clock. She had her management obsessively controlled to the point that they were terrified of her, and were flat out neurotic, as if she could physically harm them for not giving 100% every moment.  He put up with the very unhealthy environment for about six weeks. One evening I picked him up for a ride home, and he told me he was done with the whole psycho scene, and quit. He was sent out into the empty dining area to rewipe tables that were already clean to operating room standards, He then got called into the office, and told that he was slacking off, and was observed leaning against a table in the dining area, a moment ago. He asked the assistant manager how she could possibly know that, since she was in a closet sized office, in the  back of the store, with the door closed? After a bit of hesitation, she admitted that the owner spent her off hours, at home on her laptop, watching mutiple hidden cameras, and called constantly to bitch about whatever didn't suit her. He then said, "I'm done with you fruit loops, I quit".  His mom was furious, and believed like a good worker drone, that you should never just quit a job. ( like a fourteen year old could damage their CV, FFS) He told his mom that it wasn't up for debate, he was done. He quickly got a job at a local diner, and worked there until he left for college. The owner of the diner later told me he was the hardest working local kid he ever hired. He is now a well paid Engineer, and his mom and I are real proud of him.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: theadvicist on February 09, 2017, 05:26:54 AM
Not so much a FU money story, as a 'I have a job elsewhere and don't need you' story, but I'm enjoying this thread so much I wanted to contribute.

My first day at University I ordered drinks at a bar (come on now, I wasn't there to study!), and chatted with the barman, who turned out to be the owner, who offered me a job. Of course I said yes! More drinking money.

It turned out to be a pretty bad job. Three hour shifts, so I gave up my whole evening for like £14 and came home stinking of beer and smoke, so always had to have a shower. They also made me (non-smoker) clean out the ashtrays, gag.

I hated the job, but not working wasn't an option. I opened a yellow pages and looked for insurance brokers, since I'd done call-centre work before. I just called each one and said, "Hi, I'm an undergrad new to the area looking for part-time admin work". Called all 6 places, left messages. Turns out one lady called me back, called me in for an interview, and said, "I really need someone! I was just so busy I didn't have time to think about advertising!". I worked there the whole time I was at Uni and learnt SO MUCH from that lovely lady.

Meanwhile at the bar, the fired us all (sent P45s and everything) every holiday so that we didn't accrue holiday pay. When I went in all surprised at having been fired (wtf!) I was told they did that to everyone, every holiday, don't worry, come back for my usual shift in January, the bar was quiet when there were no students in town, so they didn't need us student staff then anyway.

I also once got told off for spending too long in the loo, and didn't get paid to clear up at the end of the night, even though it took a good 20 mins. We were allowed to stay on after for one free drink, but you know what? I don't want my payment in alcohol, with co-workers I don't particularly like, meaning I have to stay even later and walk home alone at midnight. Why do I want a drink anyway, I'm showering and going straight to bed!

I served my notice at the bar, of course. But they were seriously shocked when I resigned. What? You don't want to clean gum out of ashtrays full of cigarettes for minimum wage? And be told how long you can spend in the bathroom?

Thank goodness for jobs like that though. Makes me smile every day I come to a tidy clean office and get paid to drink coffee and quietly get on with things.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: mm1970 on February 09, 2017, 12:55:12 PM
Quote
Another example of A glass ceiling (not the same that you're talking about here) sucking: A woman in my old job was amazing. Did way more work than anyone on the team, had knowledge that no one else did--she wasn't irreplaceable, but she wasn't someone you'd want to replace.

At a performance review, she basically asked why she wasn't the next level up. They told her that they don't promote to that level. She prodded further and found it was that that department didn't promote to that level. Within 4 months, 4 of us out of 12 had left that team, in part because of that knowledge.
Yeah, I've been there too.  About 9 years ago, I quit a job.  I was working 30 hours a week and had 2 people working for me.  Due to some changes, my company decided to close down our project at our site.  They offered the 5 of us a job at the same site but in a different group.

The problem: I didn't like that group.  The other problem: I'd been trying to get promoted for 2 years.  I'd had a response of "yes of course!" but then that boss left.  I had three bosses in a year and a half and the newest one (who was very green) was working on it when this change happened.  So I was to get ANOTHER new boss.

I finally went to his boss (the VP) and said "okay, I am due for a promotion and have been working at the next level up for 2 years".  I got "well, that shouldn't be an issue, and why does the title matter?" (because: pay dude, I'm already at the top of the lower pay grade).  So I got a non-answer.  Also, they didn't "believe in part time work so you'll have to work full time, but whatever hours you want".  Uh, thanks?  So, I said "pick one: promotion or let me stay part time".  I got neither.  So I left.

Lather, rinse, repeat for 2 of the next 3 women engineers at the company.  I think they finally learned on #3!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: omachi on February 09, 2017, 03:31:30 PM
Not mine, but DW's, but let's keep the story train rolling.

She worked for a small company, maybe a dozen people total. It was owned by three guys, with one of them controlling the majority of the company and, of course, doing none of the work. She got an internship there as she was finishing up her undergrad and was hired on full time when she graduated. She went pretty quickly from doing production work to management, as nobody there could manage their way out of a wet paper sack. Majority owner was happy to have somebody doing his job and to actually and finally be making a profit. She kept track of all the clients, jobs, workers, etc. for a while and they actually started to make real money. She wasn't being paid much, since the company couldn't afford much when she was hired, so time to ask for a raise and proper title. She knows how the financials look and what she's contributed, going from something like $200K in revenue to $1M without changing company size, so she knows it is both deserved and in the budget.

It would have been so easy for them to just bump her pay by like 50% and say good job, keep it up. She wasn't making much. But no, the majority owner didn't like that she had the gall to ask. She was told she could have a 3% raise and that the owners had been thinking about bringing her in on ownership, but now they weren't going to. Classic BS, but maybe think because she's only a few years out of school at this point that it'd work. She comes home rightfully upset, says she doesn't feel respected and doesn't like working for this jerk. Then she asks point blank "Can I just quit?" to which the response was of course! "Really?" She has nothing lined up and is worried about it, but we have our FU money and my salary covered all our expenses and then some anyway. Immediate relief on her part.

She gives notice and they freak out. One of the minority owners (a decent guy) breaks down in tears, knowing what they're losing and being unable to stop it. Majority owner slings crap about how she's destroying what she worked for and that he'd give her a chance to rescind her resignation and maybe they could work out a little bit larger of a raise. After refusing she's told she can just leave.

A few months later she'd over doubled her salary elsewhere. Small company ends up being audited for shady tax practices. Blessing in disguise, really, and having FU money made it all possible and stress-free.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Just Joe on February 10, 2017, 10:06:53 AM
FU money is nice and so is enough networking to have a job to return to when the new one goes south. I was able to do that when I was younger. Was working a "little" job for average pay while going to college. When the BS got too deep I quit and returned to a previous job making less money but much less BS too. No days off.

All very important learning exercises to me at that point in time. There were some real small town characters in those chapters. What came of that was a desire to focus on engineering and not dealing with people.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: nippycrisp on February 10, 2017, 11:35:52 AM
OK, I'll chip in and contribute ours: My SO is an emergency room veterinarian who sees some crazy stuff. Two years ago, in the middle of the night on Christmas Eve, a guy comes in with a Sphynx (a hairless cat) that has a severely broken femur, 90-degree break on the X-ray. According to the owner, the cat ran out the front door and was hit by a car. It's a little unusual story; this is December, and hairless cats in Chicago rarely race into the street. Plus, the cat has no signs of road rash from skidding on pavement after an impact. SO can't reset the bone manually and tells the owner that the cat needs surgery to insert a plate in his leg. Costs maybe $3K. "Too much," the client says. SO suggests amputating the cat's leg, which is only several hundred dollars. No go again. SO then refers him to a low-cost clinic. Client declines again, ardently insisting he wants his animal euthanized.

The plot thickens somewhat when SO offers him the option of opening Care Credit (this is a credit card for medical or vet care, allowing him to pay in installments if money is tight). The client reveals he's married and claims his wife in on safari in Africa. It seems money isn't much of an issue to these folks, but the guy doesn't want to pay anything to repair his easily-fixable cat. All he wants is to put him to sleep before the wife comes home. SO had already noticed that the injury (and lack of road rash) matches the result of the cat being kicked, possibly by the client who now wants the cat dead*.

The thing is, this is a really sweet kitty. Despite being in significant pain, he's purring and nuzzling anyone who gets in range. So makes one more try to save his life: since this is an exotic pet that will have no trouble being adopted, she offers to have the guy relinquish his rights to the cat. In about two seconds, the guy signs the cat over and is out the door, and my SO finds herself with a sweet, broken-legged cat. I learn of this at 7 AM the next morning, when SO pokes me awake and informs me we have a new guest living in a crate in our second bedroom.

Flash forward three months. We'd paid an orthopedic surgeon to patch the cat back together and he's almost totally recovered. As you might be able to guess, we've bonded with the cat during his convalescence; the plan to find someone else to adopt him is pretty much in the bin at this point - Hamlet is now the newest member of our family.

You know what happens next: At some point, the client's wife returned from Africa and was (understandably) distraught at the absence of her pet. Who knows what the husband told her, but after several months the story of the missing cat finds its way to the couples normal (non-emergency) veterinarian. This vet tells the couple he'll get their cat back and calls the ER, claiming that the case was mishandled and that he should have been consulted (in the middle of the night on Christmas Eve, not bloody likely). Here's the thing: this guy runs a decent-sized practice in the city and refers a good bit of business to the emergency hospital. Management of the hospital reviews the case and finds a well-documented record of what happened. Even so, management promises that they'll get my SO to return the cat immediately. Cue our ringing phone. A truncated version of the conversation that followed:

ER: We need you to return the cat.
Us: Why?
ER: It's their pet.
Us: Not anymore - the guy signed him over. Now he wants it back... after several months? 
ER: We need to keep the business of (angry vet).
Us: I don't think you understand - the cat would be dead if we hadn't stepped in. We paid to bring the cat back to health.
ER: We get it; in fact, we'll pay for the treatment if you return the cat.
Us: He signed it over legally.
ER: We already promised (angry vet) you'd return the cat.
Us: You shouldn't have done that, eh?
ER: You need to return this cat. If you don't, you're risking your job.

Like many responsible adults, SO had never been fired and took the threat very seriously. I, on the other hand, was pissed off. The client had readily signed over the cat - he'd even returned later to drop off some sweaters for him, so there wasn't some last-second change of heart. Moreover, they'd waited months to ask. A cynical man might say that they did this deliberately, to give us time to fix their pet before asking for its return. The ER management was also on my shit list - they were willing to override their own employee - not to mention go into their own pocket - to keep a referrer who was making unreasonable demands - happy. That was hard to respect. I almost wanted them to fire my SO so she wouldn't have to work with such spineless cowards.

I stepped in and told the ER's director that, as one of the cat's co-owners, I wasn't willing to return the cat. If they wanted to try, go ahead and sue me. They reminded me that I was putting SO's job at risk. This was the equivalent of them folding their hand; in addition to having sufficient savings to last a couple of decades, vets are in very high demand; she'd have another gig in a day or two. We had the pleasure of telling them to pound sand. To be honest, I thought it would be more satisfying to watch the medical director bluster and fold, but the guy was too nice - he was just doing what his corporate overlords demanded. It was kind of sad, watching his half-hearted efforts. Naturally, nothing came of it - my SO continued working there and the newest member of our family continued rubbing his face against my stubble whenever he could.   

Picture of outcome attached (I hope).

*I'm not for sure saying the animal was abused, but it's a definite possibility, according to SO.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: G-dog on February 10, 2017, 11:40:14 AM
So glad you saved the cat! Had it gone back, the abuse would have continued.

No doubt the other folks have already gotten another cat.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: RyanAtTanagra on February 10, 2017, 11:51:00 AM
What a great story!  I'm not a fan of hairless cats, but that one looks adorable (the sweater covering him up helps ;-).  How many people would have caved and sent the him back into an abusive home...
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: BlueHouse on February 10, 2017, 12:00:37 PM
What a great story!  I'm not a fan of hairless cats, but that one looks adorable (the sweater covering him up helps ;-).  How many people would have caved and sent the him back into an abusive home...
I am going to love all hairless cats from now on because they could be Hamlet.  Good job on saving his life (both times).
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Dicey on February 10, 2017, 12:05:19 PM
Awww, great story, nippycrisp!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: With This Herring on February 10, 2017, 01:35:57 PM
Good story!  I'm glad that Hamlet now has a loving home without any dangers.

My only qualm would be if the wife really was in Africa for those months and missed the cat as soon as she returned, never knowing that her husband injured it originally and worked to get rid of it.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Adventine on February 10, 2017, 06:32:27 PM
Yay for nippycrisp and crispySO! Also, that cat sweater is fabulous.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: DeepEllumStache on February 10, 2017, 07:45:04 PM
Nippycrisp that was awesome. And that sweater is awesome too.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Metric Mouse on February 10, 2017, 07:52:24 PM
Nippycrisp that was awesome. And that sweater is awesome too.
Right? +1 on both accounts. Need more cat-related-money stories with happy endings around here.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: okits on February 10, 2017, 08:49:55 PM
Naturally, nothing came of it - my SO continued working there and the newest member of our family continued rubbing his face against my stubble whenever he could.   

Big kiss for Hamlet and a huge thank you to your SO and you, nippycrisp.  FU money saving an innocent life is wonderful.

Wonder how "we can't get back the cat you signed away" went over with the wife.  Hope it opened her eyes WRT her husband.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Lyngi on February 10, 2017, 09:26:31 PM
20 years ago I was 8 months pregnant, we had just bought our house. I had only been out of school for 2 years.  One day, my  boss walks me down the hall and tells me the company wanted to lay me off.  We were a really busy pharmacy.  The staff was great, our customers were loyal.  My boss had been hired on after me and he told me he wasn't going to let them do that to me, he was going to quit.  He already had a second, part time job that he could move into full time and was happy to go.   He still works there.   The other pharmacist was much older, ready to retire and spend some time with his wife.  He also quit.   I had my baby.  Boss left.  Company had to contract with a temporary agency to staff the pharmacy in my absence.  Second pharmacist left.   They now had to have two temporary pharmacists.  It cost them more than double the going rate for pharmacists.    I had to go in and do an inventory during my maternity leave.  I came back, the best technician quit.  I had no experience in management, I had to leave my new baby.  We were still really busy. I called one of my preceptors that I had worked for during school.  He put me in touch with my current company.  At the time there was a terrible pharmacist shortage and I had a job in less than a week and I left!!  It was a good move.   Not long after, the district manager called me and offered me more money if I would come back.   It was significant, but I was happy where I was and I told them no.  Afterwards,  I would often wander by the old place and every time there were new faces.  I could tell things were slowing down.  The company went downhill.  Stores started closing across the country.  Finally,  the entire store closed in 2013.  Company is still in trouble.  I had a very lucky escape and I think fondly of my two coworkers who had the F/U money to save my job.
     
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: SwordGuy on February 10, 2017, 11:55:31 PM
Not really an FU money story, but Hamlet's story reminded me of this one.

My dad got sick and went into the hospital.

So my mom took his cat to the vet and had it put to sleep.

Not a damn thing wrong with the cat (other than being unlucky).

Didn't discuss it with my dad beforehand.

She called and told me about it afterward.

I was **not nice** to my mom in that discussion.   **At all.**

I did not say a single dirty word but my mom had an absolute understanding of how I felt about what she had done. 

It bothered her so much that she called my wife the next day and tried to get sympathy from my wife.

(My wife, when we were dating, was forbidden by my mom to go to my mom's home.   My mom had never met her at that time.)

(My wife had two children in her first marriage, I've raised them as my own.   My mother did not consider that I had any children or that she had any grand children.)

(My wife was always polite and cordial to my mom, but there was no love lost on either side.   And I can't fault my wife one single bit for that, either.)

She didn't get any sympathy from my lovely wife.   My wife was more diplomatic than I was (and also had the benefit of hearing about it beforehand), but my mom also knew in no uncertain terms that what she did was unforgivable. 

My dad got a new cat when he got out of the hospital.   I was not privy to any discussions they might have had on that particular topic.

When he got sick and passed away some years later, mom didn't have the cat put to sleep either.   Now that she's passed on, dad's new cat lives with us.   

And he's happy.   He's taking a nap on the couch near me while I write this.

Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: msilenus on February 11, 2017, 11:52:05 AM
Summers at the farm,
Playing with babushka's goat.
Kittens every year.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: ambimammular on February 12, 2017, 08:49:19 AM
Summers at the farm,
Playing with babushka's goat.
Kittens every year.

I see what you did, and I appreciate it.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: radram on February 12, 2017, 04:22:36 PM
Summers at the farm,
Playing with babushka's goat.
Kittens every year.

I see what you did, and I appreciate it.

I missed the hidden message. Anyone care to share?
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: JLee on February 12, 2017, 06:36:07 PM
Summers at the farm,
Playing with babushka's goat.
Kittens every year.

I see what you did, and I appreciate it.

I missed the hidden message. Anyone care to share?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Haiku
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: arebelspy on February 12, 2017, 07:33:55 PM
Summers at the farm,
Playing with babushka's goat.
Kittens every year.

I see what you did, and I appreciate it.

I missed the hidden message. Anyone care to share?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Haiku

I get that it's a hauku.  I don't get the content.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: radram on February 12, 2017, 07:41:24 PM
Summers at the farm,
Playing with babushka's goat.
Kittens every year.

I see what you did, and I appreciate it.

I missed the hidden message. Anyone care to share?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Haiku

I get that it's a hauku.  I don't get the content.

Ditto.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: JLee on February 12, 2017, 07:51:57 PM
Summers at the farm,
Playing with babushka's goat.
Kittens every year.

I see what you did, and I appreciate it.

I missed the hidden message. Anyone care to share?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Haiku

I get that it's a hauku.  I don't get the content.

Ditto.

Oh. Well, that's all I've got. :P
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Metric Mouse on February 12, 2017, 07:59:16 PM
Summers at the farm,
Playing with babushka's goat.
Kittens every year.

I see what you did, and I appreciate it.
It wouldn't be happiness without a violin playing goat.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Abe Froman on February 13, 2017, 07:00:43 AM
Agree with ARS, this is by FAR the best thread on this forum.
Although I have been a guest lurker for a long time I have finally made myself legit -->http://forum.mrmoneymustache.com/profile/?u=31677 (http://forum.mrmoneymustache.com/profile/?u=31677) on the forum, but mostly to follow this thread more easily.

I suppose I am lucky that my work around the salted cured meats industry has proven to be filled with top quality folks and no working through the 'meat grinder.'
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: dandarc on February 13, 2017, 07:50:30 AM
Agree with ARS, this is by FAR the best thread on this forum.
Although I have been a guest lurker for a long time I have finally made myself legit -->http://forum.mrmoneymustache.com/profile/?u=31677 (http://forum.mrmoneymustache.com/profile/?u=31677) on the forum, but mostly to follow this thread more easily.

I suppose I am lucky that my work around the salted cured meats industry has proven to be filled with top quality folks and no working through the 'meat grinder.'
Pastrami is the most sensual of the dried, salted meats.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: radram on February 14, 2017, 06:50:18 AM
I would love to hear a story from one of these people.

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2017-02-13/one-reason-staffers-quit-google-s-car-project-the-company-paid-them-so-much

Are any of you here?

Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Hvillian on February 14, 2017, 07:57:26 AM
I would love to hear a story from one of these people.

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2017-02-13/one-reason-staffers-quit-google-s-car-project-the-company-paid-them-so-much

Are any of you here?

I thought the exact same thing when I saw that in the news this morning.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Tris Prior on February 14, 2017, 11:14:16 AM
I am so happy that Hamlet has a safe and happy home with you. I almost couldn't read your whole post once it became clear that some sort of abuse might've occurred. Heartbreaking. That poor kitty.

And..... I live in Chicago, and have had occasion to avail myself of the kitty ER on a few occasions. I've never gotten anything but wonderful treatment there, but knowing that their corporate overlords would pull that sort of thing does give me pause, I admit.

(Also wondering who the regular Angry Vet who sends them all the business is, though I understand why you wouldn't want to say. My vet owns the practice and is female so at least I know it's not mine!)
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: PaulMaxime on February 19, 2017, 09:23:13 PM
I would love to hear a story from one of these people.

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2017-02-13/one-reason-staffers-quit-google-s-car-project-the-company-paid-them-so-much

Are any of you here?

I'm a former Googler. Worked there 8 years. Pretty much FI at this point but I am still working for another couple years I think.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Zamboni on February 19, 2017, 09:36:21 PM
This is not my story, but an epic FU money (or really an epic FU skill set) story published via a blog:
https://www.susanjfowler.com/blog/2017/2/19/reflecting-on-one-very-strange-year-at-uber (https://www.susanjfowler.com/blog/2017/2/19/reflecting-on-one-very-strange-year-at-uber)

I think I'll pass on ever traveling via Uber again . . . most of their drivers are also on other apps anyway.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: EricL on February 19, 2017, 10:55:18 PM
This is not my story, but an epic FU money (or really an epic FU skill set) story published via a blog:
https://www.susanjfowler.com/blog/2017/2/19/reflecting-on-one-very-strange-year-at-uber (https://www.susanjfowler.com/blog/2017/2/19/reflecting-on-one-very-strange-year-at-uber)

I think I'll pass on ever traveling via Uber again . . . most of their drivers are also on other apps anyway.

Quite a story about a company headquartered in such a so called progressive city in a liberalish state.  If Über is really that way it's doomed. That type of environment and institutional stupidity will poison more than just work related gender issues. 

Edit: And now the story's out: https://techcrunch.com/2017/02/19/former-uber-engineer-says-company-ignored-repeated-reports-of-harassment/
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: 10dollarsatatime on February 19, 2017, 11:35:24 PM
Could have been epic...

There's been a ton of work drama.  I've been doing my supervisor's job for years.  But I enjoy the job, and moves were made to keep the supervisor out of my hair.  He left for medical reasons last September.  I spend the next 4 months doing all of the things.  They finally open his job once the FMLA runs out.  I have to apply for it just like everyone else.

Here's the thing.  I refuse to train a new supervisor.  If I don't get the position, I'm leaving.  I have a year's worth of expenses sitting around.  I can make more freelancing in 4 months than I can in a year at this job.  AND I have another side gig that would easily translate to a full time thing.  I tell this to the boss.  He tells his boss.  .... I get the job, at the highest pay step they can give me.

But I was prepared to clean out my office the day of the interview.  It was a good feeling.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Dicey on February 20, 2017, 12:06:54 AM
^^ Hooray! ^^ Well played.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: radram on February 20, 2017, 05:58:31 AM

I'm a former Googler. Worked there 8 years. Pretty much FI at this point but I am still working for another couple years I think.

You said you used to work there.. Did you achieve FI, but then left to do something else just because you wanted to? Details please :)
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: zolotiyeruki on February 20, 2017, 08:07:00 AM
But I was prepared to clean out my office the day of the interview.  It was a good feeling.
I don't know about the rest of you, but this is certainly epic in my book.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: mm1970 on February 20, 2017, 03:01:38 PM
This is not my story, but an epic FU money (or really an epic FU skill set) story published via a blog:
https://www.susanjfowler.com/blog/2017/2/19/reflecting-on-one-very-strange-year-at-uber (https://www.susanjfowler.com/blog/2017/2/19/reflecting-on-one-very-strange-year-at-uber)

I think I'll pass on ever traveling via Uber again . . . most of their drivers are also on other apps anyway.

Quite a story about a company headquartered in such a so called progressive city in a liberalish state.  If Über is really that way it's doomed. That type of environment and institutional stupidity will poison more than just work related gender issues. 

Edit: And now the story's out: https://techcrunch.com/2017/02/19/former-uber-engineer-says-company-ignored-repeated-reports-of-harassment/
I read this just this morning.  Ugh...
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Mother Fussbudget on February 20, 2017, 03:47:11 PM
LONG... perhaps not 'Epic', but FU money played a HUGE role. Unprecedented.  Monumental.  Big League.  FU First...  (sorry)
It sure was interesting to 'experience'... I'll use letters (A, B, C, etc) to represent company names to protect the innocent.

Two weeks ago, my manager at wireless company T dropped by to tell me that my contract date was up due to new tenure restrictions. (Been in my current role for 3.5 years - new rules say only 18 months allowed). [At the 1-year mark in this position, I decided to do an arguably un-mustachian thing, and purchase a house close to T so I could bike to work AND my son could stay in the right school district, but that's another story].  I contacted my account representative, and she added me to my firm's 'available list' immediately.  I brushed up my resume, and was sent a bunch of bench-guide documentation - since I was likely to be on-the-bench / or between gigs.  As a point of reference, the last time I was on-the-bench 3.5 years ago, I was between gigs for 3 months(!) - during that time I received a small salary, but no hourly compensation (the bread-and-butter of management consultant contractors).

That night, I went home, and crunched numbers...  With a FIRE date 14 months away, I worked with the numbers to see if I could pull the date in sooner.  With lots of belt tightening, I could ACTUALLY PULL IT OFF, and FIRE with around a 6% withdrawal rate for the first 3 years.  Still sounded risky. 
BUT... if I could SELL MY HOUSE, I'd be at or above my FIRE number TODAY.  Problem is, I didn't really want to sell the house.

The next day, joined a weekly call for people on-the-bench to hear about current job prospects, and network with other bench warmers. I found out the average 'bench time' for my firm currently averages only 3 weeks.  Not bad - maybe time for a little rest & relaxation??  I researched flights to sunny climes, and pictured palm trees, and sand between my toes...  ah!  I buffed up the resume, removed things from 10 years ago, and things looked very up-to-date. 

Thursday, I was sought-out via email about a job opportunity at coffee roaster S.  It would be a great fit, I would really like the culture, blah, blah, blah.  So my resume got submitted. 

That Friday, I was called during my drive to work about a 'perfect fit' job at culture-less wireless company A. Good money, I could save a project that was wallowing, etc.  There was also discussion about positions opening soon at software company M who had wanted to hire me 3 years ago, but weren't willing to pay the right $$.  Now things were different, and that was again a real possibility.

Last week, Monday... Tues... Weds... nothing.  No word.  No calls.  No emails.  I called my realtor on Tuesday about SELLING MY HOUSE, and starting geographic arbitrage earlier than planned. In Seattle's overheated housing market, I could net ~$200K if I sold today.  50% appreciation in just over 2 years!!  More to think about.

Weds I missed the weekly bench call - I was on a project related call.  Noon: finally heard that A would not 'show me the money', and the account rep there knew I would take a 'long sabbatical' rather than accept a lower rate.  I expressed my thanks, and realized I'm literally in One More Year syndrome - but I'll only work if the $$ is right.

Weds afternoon, after a party at T headquarters, I bumped into another account rep in-the-elevator. He said hi, and mentioned he had recommended me for a new gig, and asked for my updated resume.  He said, "Please send it", and got off the elevator. No dummy here, I got off WITH HIM instead of going to my destination.  We chatted for 5 minutes about a project manager role that would keep me at T in a new role that wouldn't be subject to any tenure / time limits.  Since it would be at the headquarters building (instead of 11 miles away in hilly Bot Hell), I would again be able to bike to work.  [Yea rolling gym!]

Thursday morning, 'elevator account rep guy' said he'd reviewed my resume, and wondered if I could pump it up to make it look more 'Project Manager-y'.  I went through, and changed the words Program Manager to Project Manager in several key places, and sent an update.  PERFECT!, he said.  When are you free to work in a new role?  March 1st, I said, but I could start immediately if I could give my current team ~10% of my time between now and Mid-March.  He said, Great. When can you interview tomorrow/Friday?.  I says:  Friday Anytime After 1pm.  He set up a Friday 1pm this-is-the-role meeting with him, and a 4pm interview with the hiring manager. 

My Friday started with a traffic slog to Bot Hell to do my current role work, followed by a lunch-time trip back home, and a bike-ride into headquarters.  On the ride in, I literally had to avoid running into my CURRENT manager on the sidewalk.  I told him why I was there, and that if it went well, I would be starting in a new role sooner than expected, giving 10% of my time to his team.  He said he was ALREADY AWARE of this plan(?), and gave me the green light.

The 1pm get-up-to-speed meet went smoothly. Rep guy gave me a heads up on which parts of my resume would pluck the right strings for the hiring manager - that Quality Manager role at retailer A... oops... (not to be confused with wireless A) - as an example.

At 1:30, I the hiring manager emailed
Can you meet earlier than 4pm?
   How about 2:30?
Great. Thanks for being flexible. See you then.
At 2:30, hiring manager bought me a nice soy-chai consumer-sucka-cuppa-pricey coffee drink, and we chatted.
   I'm a get sh***tuff done guy. Project Management isn't rocket science - a box for every thing, and every thing in it's box, blah, blah. 
When were you at retailer-A? I was there too you know.
   2005-2007. A little over 2 years. I built a team from one person - me - to 8 people.  A team that's now 85+ people spread across five continents.
Did you know person-X?
   I've heard the name.  I knew person-Y.
I know person-Y as well.  Small world.  Well... I'm not gonna lie.  We're up against a wall on this one.  We want it to ship in 15 working days, so I need you to start right away. There's a 3pm meeting to review the project, can you make it?
   Sure. When do I start officially.
Start?  You started when I saw your name on the resume. Welcome to the team.

This weekend, I called my realtor, and told him I'd be staying put for the foreseeable future.  Gotta love the flexibility of FU money. 

But it looks like I'll only have time for a weekend stay-cation... oh well.  14 months (or less) to go!

[NOTE:  earlier references to 'dog years' removed - it was a reference to working at retailer A where one year seemed like 7 years out of your life in a real cut-throat environment.]
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: shelivesthedream on February 20, 2017, 04:02:56 PM
That's a great story, but what's with the dog years?
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: RyanAtTanagra on February 20, 2017, 04:13:06 PM
That's a great story, but what's with the dog years?

And all the quotes.  And hyphens.  Good story but that was one painful read.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: gerardc on February 20, 2017, 04:15:41 PM
I would love to hear a story from one of these people.

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2017-02-13/one-reason-staffers-quit-google-s-car-project-the-company-paid-them-so-much

Are any of you here?

From the interview video: "These types of people... not the type of people who're gonna retire, sit around" so I guess not :(

Some of them are founding their own start ups with what they have learned at Google
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Dicey on February 20, 2017, 11:41:13 PM

And all the quotes.  And hyphens.  Good story. but that was one painful read.
FTFY. Loved the story, no problem following along, and I'm not the sharpest shovel in the toolshed.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: shelivesthedream on February 21, 2017, 01:16:42 AM
Quote from: Mother Fussbudget link=topic=18251.msg1441068#msg1441068
[NOTE:  earlier references to 'dog years' removed - it was a reference to working at retailer A where one year seemed like 7 years out of your life in a real cut-throat environment.]

Ah... I get it now! It's funny now you've explained it.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: arebelspy on February 21, 2017, 01:31:25 AM
Could have been epic...

There's been a ton of work drama.  I've been doing my supervisor's job for years.  But I enjoy the job, and moves were made to keep the supervisor out of my hair.  He left for medical reasons last September.  I spend the next 4 months doing all of the things.  They finally open his job once the FMLA runs out.  I have to apply for it just like everyone else.

Here's the thing.  I refuse to train a new supervisor.  If I don't get the position, I'm leaving.  I have a year's worth of expenses sitting around.  I can make more freelancing in 4 months than I can in a year at this job.  AND I have another side gig that would easily translate to a full time thing.  I tell this to the boss.  He tells his boss.  .... I get the job, at the highest pay step they can give me.

But I was prepared to clean out my office the day of the interview.  It was a good feeling.

Nice!

We want it to ship in 15 working days, so I need you to start right away.

Your next few weeks sound like hell, but congrats!  Having that FU money to be able to say "nah, I'll take a sabbatical if you won't show me the money" is so awesome.  :D

Just one more year!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Guesl982374 on February 21, 2017, 08:08:42 AM
Could have been epic...

There's been a ton of work drama.  I've been doing my supervisor's job for years.  But I enjoy the job, and moves were made to keep the supervisor out of my hair.  He left for medical reasons last September.  I spend the next 4 months doing all of the things.  They finally open his job once the FMLA runs out.  I have to apply for it just like everyone else.

Here's the thing.  I refuse to train a new supervisor.  If I don't get the position, I'm leaving.  I have a year's worth of expenses sitting around.  I can make more freelancing in 4 months than I can in a year at this job.  AND I have another side gig that would easily translate to a full time thing.  I tell this to the boss.  He tells his boss.  .... I get the job, at the highest pay step they can give me.

But I was prepared to clean out my office the day of the interview.  It was a good feeling.

Perfect use of leverage. I love it.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: AnswerIs42 on March 02, 2017, 10:19:01 AM
There's a good one on TheDailyWTF today:

http://thedailywtf.com/articles/it-s-no-big-deal (http://thedailywtf.com/articles/it-s-no-big-deal)

One or two complainypants in the comments section ("How could you possibly save enough to retire after 30 years in tech?"), but mostly supportive :)
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: RyanAtTanagra on March 02, 2017, 11:02:06 AM
There's a good one on TheDailyWTF today:

http://thedailywtf.com/articles/it-s-no-big-deal (http://thedailywtf.com/articles/it-s-no-big-deal)

One or two complainypants in the comments section ("How could you possibly save enough to retire after 30 years in tech?"), but mostly supportive :)

Good story, and I'm really impressed with the comments.  Just one guy really, telling the author he's an impossible outlier and his story is a slap in the face to normal people.  Then everyone else defending the author and basically saying if after 30 years in IT you're not financially secure you done f'd up.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: PaulMaxime on March 02, 2017, 07:17:43 PM

I'm a former Googler. Worked there 8 years. Pretty much FI at this point but I am still working for another couple years I think.

You said you used to work there.. Did you achieve FI, but then left to do something else just because you wanted to? Details please :)

Yeah. I was basically FI, but I still had some things I wanted to do as far as working. I had never done a startup. My team spun off from Google to become an independent company in Sept of 2015. Lots of my co-workers couldn't or wouldn't take the risk and stayed behind.

9 months later Niantic Labs launched Pokemon Go. It was a risk worth taking, I think.

Paul
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Metric Mouse on March 02, 2017, 07:58:57 PM
There's a good one on TheDailyWTF today:

http://thedailywtf.com/articles/it-s-no-big-deal (http://thedailywtf.com/articles/it-s-no-big-deal)

One or two complainypants in the comments section ("How could you possibly save enough to retire after 30 years in tech?"), but mostly supportive :)
Nice. Always a complainy pants, in every bunch.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: jordanread on March 03, 2017, 08:22:48 AM

I'm a former Googler. Worked there 8 years. Pretty much FI at this point but I am still working for another couple years I think.

You said you used to work there.. Did you achieve FI, but then left to do something else just because you wanted to? Details please :)

Yeah. I was basically FI, but I still had some things I wanted to do as far as working. I had never done a startup. My team spun off from Google to become an independent company in Sept of 2015. Lots of my co-workers couldn't or wouldn't take the risk and stayed behind.

9 months later Niantic Labs launched Pokemon Go. It was a risk worth taking, I think.

Paul

You are at Niantic? That's freaking awesome (never played PG, but I was a loyal ENL for a while)
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Livingthedream55 on March 03, 2017, 10:21:08 AM
But I was prepared to clean out my office the day of the interview.  It was a good feeling.
I don't know about the rest of you, but this is certainly epic in my book.

This!! OMG   Fantastic to read these!!! 
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: RyanAtTanagra on March 03, 2017, 10:29:18 AM
You are at Niantic? That's freaking awesome (never played PG, but I was a loyal ENL for a while)

Come back, your team needs you!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Jessamine on March 03, 2017, 10:33:58 AM
You are at Niantic? That's freaking awesome (never played PG, but I was a loyal ENL for a while)

Come back, your team needs you!

No they don't.  Come back and join the Resistance!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: jordanread on March 03, 2017, 10:36:09 AM
You are at Niantic? That's freaking awesome (never played PG, but I was a loyal ENL for a while)

Come back, your team needs you!

Players still hit me up for backup when there be creepy people following as they farm the park by my house, but I don't even have phone service anymore. And yes, when I stopped playing, I dropped all of my inventory throughout a week, meeting people and making sure my stuff was useful (including ADA's and Jarvis's). Even turned my guardian over to someone who would take care of it. I really liked being involved in anomalies, and some of the global stuff (like Operation Green Marble) is super fun, but just got too much of a time suck.

You are at Niantic? That's freaking awesome (never played PG, but I was a loyal ENL for a while)

Come back, your team needs you!

No they don't.  Come back and join the Resistance!

That ain't happening :). Frog is still a term of endearment for me, and Smurf is a tongue in cheek insult.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: PaulMaxime on March 03, 2017, 12:13:37 PM

You are at Niantic? That's freaking awesome (never played PG, but I was a loyal ENL for a while)

Yeah, been at Niantic since 2012. I think I'll be here for at least another year or two. It's been pretty intense in the last year - I feel like I've earned every dollar. We have a 4 year vest for our options but I'm not sure I'll make it all the way to 2019. It's hard when you don't really need the extra money, though the work environment is good and I like my coworkers for the most part.

Glad to see we have some Ingress players on here. Personally, I'm resistance all the way, but we do have a good mix of both here at HQ.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: RyanAtTanagra on March 03, 2017, 12:16:47 PM
Glad to see we have some Ingress players on here. Personally, I'm resistance all the way, but we do have a good mix of both here at HQ.

Are you active?  I'm curious if we know each other by agent name.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: mtn on March 03, 2017, 12:20:31 PM

You are at Niantic? That's freaking awesome (never played PG, but I was a loyal ENL for a while)

Yeah, been at Niantic since 2012. I think I'll be here for at least another year or two. It's been pretty intense in the last year - I feel like I've earned every dollar. We have a 4 year vest for our options but I'm not sure I'll make it all the way to 2019. It's hard when you don't really need the extra money, though the work environment is good and I like my coworkers for the most part.


Vesting is, IMHO, one of the most reasonable excuses for "One More Year". Depending on the amount that is at stake, of course, but it could end up being "Two more years salary for one more year of work".



Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Cannot Wait! on March 03, 2017, 04:41:00 PM

You are at Niantic? That's freaking awesome (never played PG, but I was a loyal ENL for a while)

Yeah, been at Niantic since 2012. I think I'll be here for at least another year or two. It's been pretty intense in the last year - I feel like I've earned every dollar. We have a 4 year vest for our options but I'm not sure I'll make it all the way to 2019. It's hard when you don't really need the extra money, though the work environment is good and I like my coworkers for the most part.


Vesting is, IMHO, one of the most reasonable excuses for "One More Year". Depending on the amount that is at stake, of course, but it could end up being "Two more years salary for one more year of work".

Yeah but you are on an EARLY retirement forum where it is also reasonable to leave a job early if there are better things to do with your time!  😉
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: prognastat on March 03, 2017, 04:50:11 PM

You are at Niantic? That's freaking awesome (never played PG, but I was a loyal ENL for a while)

Yeah, been at Niantic since 2012. I think I'll be here for at least another year or two. It's been pretty intense in the last year - I feel like I've earned every dollar. We have a 4 year vest for our options but I'm not sure I'll make it all the way to 2019. It's hard when you don't really need the extra money, though the work environment is good and I like my coworkers for the most part.

Glad to see we have some Ingress players on here. Personally, I'm resistance all the way, but we do have a good mix of both here at HQ.

Cool, my wife loved ingress and we both play Pokemon Go(she is a little more active than I am XD)

As for your situation it is definitely understandable to feel like you should stay for the vesting and not miss out on the money and this will likely be completely up to yourself. If you have more than enough to comfortably FIRE with your current level of spending and current stache then you don't need the extra money and the only reason to stay is because you enjoy it or feel some kind of responsibility to stay till a certain point. If however it gets to the point where you don't enjoy the work then don't let golden handcuffs hold you back.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Nangirl17 on March 03, 2017, 04:55:09 PM
Posting to follow!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: AlanStache on March 03, 2017, 06:19:11 PM
(http://i.imgur.com/bjPOBxX.gif)

All in good jest :-)
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: PaulMaxime on March 03, 2017, 07:27:31 PM
Glad to see we have some Ingress players on here. Personally, I'm resistance all the way, but we do have a good mix of both here at HQ.

Are you active?  I'm curious if we know each other by agent name.

Haven't been playing too much lately because of work, but I'm NumberSix, Lvl 15 Resistance.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: PaulMaxime on March 03, 2017, 07:41:45 PM

Cool, my wife loved ingress and we both play Pokemon Go(she is a little more active than I am XD)

As for your situation it is definitely understandable to feel like you should stay for the vesting and not miss out on the money and this will likely be completely up to yourself. If you have more than enough to comfortably FIRE with your current level of spending and current stache then you don't need the extra money and the only reason to stay is because you enjoy it or feel some kind of responsibility to stay till a certain point. If however it gets to the point where you don't enjoy the work then don't let golden handcuffs hold you back.

Trust me, I'm only here because it's still fun. If that ends I'm gone.

One thing that gives me pause is the Republicans' promise to repeal the ACA. I have a pre-existing condition which will make insurance either really expensive or impossible to get if they get their way. So I can use the extra money as a buffer in case health care becomes an issue.

Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: RyanAtTanagra on March 03, 2017, 10:32:14 PM
Haven't been playing too much lately because of work, but I'm NumberSix, Lvl 15 Resistance.

Doesn't sound familiar, probably different areas of the city, but Linkovich, Lvl 14 ENL if you see me.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: GreenSheep on March 04, 2017, 08:57:55 AM
Yesterday I overheard a conversation between a coworker (C) and one of the housekeeping staff (H). H mentioned that he has 3 working days until retirement, at which point I stuck my nose into the conversation to congratulate him. I had never seen him smile before, but he sure was smiling when we talked about his retirement! I wouldn't call him young, but he looks like he might be a few years younger than "normal" retirement age.

The FU money part of it is that after he walked away, C told me that H had several properties around town and had decided to retire after our company cut the housekeepers' hourly rate almost in half. I would like to think that he is a closet Mustachian. And I love the fact that just because someone empties trash cans for a living doesn't mean they don't know what they're doing with their money!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: mm1970 on March 04, 2017, 10:11:05 AM
Yesterday I overheard a conversation between a coworker (C) and one of the housekeeping staff (H). H mentioned that he has 3 working days until retirement, at which point I stuck my nose into the conversation to congratulate him. I had never seen him smile before, but he sure was smiling when we talked about his retirement! I wouldn't call him young, but he looks like he might be a few years younger than "normal" retirement age.

The FU money part of it is that after he walked away, C told me that H had several properties around town and had decided to retire after our company cut the housekeepers' hourly rate almost in half. I would like to think that he is a closet Mustachian. And I love the fact that just because someone empties trash cans for a living doesn't mean they don't know what they're doing with their money!
I still remember the 2-3 conversations I had with an aide at the hospital when my first son was born.  I can't remember if she was housekeeping or Food service (so long ago).  She and her husband had raised 3 kids, worked hard in their manual labor jobs, and at that point, owned 3 homes in Santa Barbara - free and clear.  Buy a fixer, fix it up, rent it out.  Lather, rinse, repeat.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: BTDretire on March 05, 2017, 05:33:39 AM
  Buy a fixer, fix it up, rent it out.  Lather, rinse, repeat.

 "Lather, rinse, repeat".
 I always thought that 'repeat' part was just a way for Head and Shoulders to double their sales. :-)
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: RetirementInvestingToday on March 05, 2017, 05:54:46 AM
"Lather, rinse, repeat".
 I always thought that 'repeat' part was just a way for Head and Shoulders to double their sales. :-)
A bit like the increase the diameter of the toothpaste nozzle story...
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: erae on March 06, 2017, 07:23:08 AM
I work in corporate training and have hit a couple walls/ceilings when hiring or promotion committees decide they want "someone who knows the business and has good training instincts" over "someone who can mine the expertise of people who know the business to design strong learning experiences." I was hired into my current department by Old Manager, who was in the latter camp and was laid off almost a year ago in an org-wide restructuring. New Manager (new to me, new to management, and new to our department) was brought in shortly after and - after getting his bearings for six months - decided that there wasn't room in this town for two of us who didn't come up through the ranks in our department.

So I've been in the job for two years with strong performance reviews (including my most recent review from New Manager himself) and New Manager decides to give me a hiring exercise to prove that I have the knowledge of our business to keep my job for a third year. Who will judge this exercise? Not him, because he's more of a noob than I am. This exercise will be judged by a peer of his who knows our department's business inside and out and will not know the circumstances of their judgment (namely, that my job is on the line). Having worked in this department for two years, I am confident I can do the exercise. My first move after getting written confirmation about the conditions of this asinine assignment is to reach out to HR and ask if this qualifies as a restructuring of my role. I was hired to do X - I've done X. It sounds like New Manager wants Y. HR encourages me to work with New Manager to reframe this exercise as a development opportunity rather than a high-stakes test. New Manager balks at any questioning of his exercise. He says he spent a lot of time dreaming up this assignment and was thoughtful in its development, messaging, and roll-out to me.  I now have all the information I need to know that this job I'm in - under New Manager - will not end successfully for me, regardless of how well I jump through this hoop he's "thoughtfully" constructed.

Thankfully, I've got a healthy 'stache (around 6x annual expenses) and a supportive partner whose job is secure, so I give notice and....here's the epic bit....one week later HR comes back and reclassifies my transition as a role restructuring. I'm leaving next month, will get paid out for 5-6 weeks of PTO in my last check, and am likely looking at 3 months severance pay given my tenure with the organization. I've got a clean narrative for my departure and am essentially pulling a paycheck through July/August. While my ego doesn't like the circumstances behind this transition, my 'stache is telling her to get over herself.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Patches on March 07, 2017, 09:50:23 AM
After graduating college, my wife and I moved to Seattle with the intent of working until we had enough to travel for a year.  She's an RN and I was a lumber trader.  After 4 years, we had our student loans paid off and found ourselves with $200,000 in the bank and feeling good financially.  My wife applied for a sabbatical and got it easily.  Having that secured, we felt confident to that we'd have work upon return so we purchased our one-way tickets to Buenos Aires.  Since trading lumber is a remarkably cut-throat and competitive industry, I figured I'd just quit my job the week before we flew out and they'd divvy up my accounts among the other traders.

So the week came and I asked to take the CEO out for coffee.  We have always had a good rapport and he could tell something was up...  I told him I needed to quit and he was like, "Why?, You moving to another trading house?"  And I explained the situation and he was like, "Whoa whoa, don't do anything drastic here! We can work out out sabbatical.  Shit man, I thought you getting divorced and moving away or had cancer or something..."  I must have been on edge I guess.

They ended up assigning my accounts to other traders on a temporary basis and upon return my accounts would be given back to me.  On top of that I was given a middling salary ($65,000) until I got my numbers back up.

After spending the South American summer months hiking, camping, and hitchhiking around Patagonia and the Andes, we shipped our camping gear to my parents' house and continued to travel North.  My wife found a great volunteering opportunity in Bolivia with an NGO hospital for a month (I joined the grounds crew) and then we continued on through Colombia.  From there we met my brother in Vietnam and continued around SE Asia for 6 weeks.  All told we were gone for 9 months... and spent an additional several weeks on either end seeing family.  We tracked every nickel and spent just over $24k including flights.

Once back trading lumber I discovered this lovely blog (2012) and we have been angling our finances toward FI ever since.  My career has continued to angle upward... we've got a couple kids now and my wife is happily working part time.  We'll probably ER here in Seattle in the next year or two... and take our girls on the road... at least in the summers.

I just thought it was an interesting story (it's about me after all...) but I also thought it could be inspiring for anyone else in a sales-type job.  "The power of quitting," as they say, even in a cut-throat industry can result in favorable outcomes.



Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: afuera on March 07, 2017, 11:27:15 AM

After spending the South American summer months hiking, camping, and hitchhiking around Patagonia and the Andes, we shipped our camping gear to my parents' house and continued to travel North.  My wife found a great volunteering opportunity in Bolivia with an NGO hospital for a month (I joined the grounds crew) and then we continued on through Colombia.  From there we met my brother in Vietnam and continued around SE Asia for 6 weeks.  All told we were gone for 9 months... and spent an additional several weeks on either end seeing family.  We tracked every nickel and spent just over $24k including flights.


Great story!  I literally daydream about this type of sabbatical constantly.  It sounds perfect.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Bicycle_B on March 07, 2017, 12:25:19 PM
Yesterday I overheard a conversation between a coworker (C) and one of the housekeeping staff (H). H mentioned that he has 3 working days until retirement, at which point I stuck my nose into the conversation to congratulate him. I had never seen him smile before, but he sure was smiling when we talked about his retirement! I wouldn't call him young, but he looks like he might be a few years younger than "normal" retirement age.

The FU money part of it is that after he walked away, C told me that H had several properties around town and had decided to retire after our company cut the housekeepers' hourly rate almost in half. I would like to think that he is a closet Mustachian. And I love the fact that just because someone empties trash cans for a living doesn't mean they don't know what they're doing with their money!

So awesome!

To support your point - In my hometown, a guy who did repairs at the university started buying and fixing up rent houses that catered to students.  Over time, he got dozens of them and became quite wealthy.  Didn't quit as far as I know, but became the director of maintenance at his day job too according to my dad.  Anyway, even if someone empties trash cans or hammers a nail, they might have more money than all of the other people in the office.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: firelight on March 07, 2017, 11:53:54 PM
Got handed a shit sandwich at work today. Even though we have FU money, I'm hanging on since we are expecting our second soon and now isn't the best time to quit. I think I might have something to contribute soon but I hope not atleast for some more time.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Dicey on March 08, 2017, 12:40:59 AM
  Buy a fixer, fix it up, rent it out.  Lather, rinse, repeat.

 "Lather, rinse, repeat".
 I always thought that 'repeat' part was just a way for Head and Shoulders to double their sales. :-)
BRRR is a Thing now: Buy, Renovate, Rent, Repeat. Or Buy, Renovate, Rent, Refinance, Repeat. It's another way for mustachians to double their net worths. :-)
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Icecreamarsenal on March 08, 2017, 07:15:20 AM
  Buy a fixer, fix it up, rent it out.  Lather, rinse, repeat.

 "Lather, rinse, repeat".
 I always thought that 'repeat' part was just a way for Head and Shoulders to double their sales. :-)
BRRR is a Thing now: Buy, Renovate, Rent, Repeat. Or Buy, Renovate, Rent, Refinance, Repeat. It's another way for mustachians to double their net worths. :-)
Another Bigger Pockets fan I see!


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Livingthedream55 on March 08, 2017, 08:21:55 AM
Got handed a shit sandwich at work today. Even though we have FU money, I'm hanging on since we are expecting our second soon and now isn't the best time to quit. I think I might have something to contribute soon but I hope not atleast for some more time.

Sorry to hear Firelight - stay strong and keep your eye on the prize. Someday you will have your FU stache!!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: GreenSheep on March 08, 2017, 10:10:45 AM
Yesterday I overheard a conversation between a coworker (C) and one of the housekeeping staff (H). H mentioned that he has 3 working days until retirement, at which point I stuck my nose into the conversation to congratulate him. I had never seen him smile before, but he sure was smiling when we talked about his retirement! I wouldn't call him young, but he looks like he might be a few years younger than "normal" retirement age.

The FU money part of it is that after he walked away, C told me that H had several properties around town and had decided to retire after our company cut the housekeepers' hourly rate almost in half. I would like to think that he is a closet Mustachian. And I love the fact that just because someone empties trash cans for a living doesn't mean they don't know what they're doing with their money!

Update: It gets even better! Turns out his first day of retirement is his birthday. He's using a vacation day for it. That's one hell of a birthday present!

As for how to make the transition, he says his friends and family already have a growing to do list for him, since they all know he'll soon have a lot of time on his hands. I guess that's one way to do it for those who are concerned about feeling a bit lost when they no longer have to get up and go to work.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Dicey on March 08, 2017, 10:22:09 AM
  Buy a fixer, fix it up, rent it out.  Lather, rinse, repeat.

 "Lather, rinse, repeat".
 I always thought that 'repeat' part was just a way for Head and Shoulders to double their sales. :-)
BRRR is a Thing now: Buy, Renovate, Rent, Repeat. Or Buy, Renovate, Rent, Refinance, Repeat. It's another way for mustachians to double their net worths. :-)
Another Bigger Pockets fan I see!
Lolz, I can't say that's true. I learned the term elsewhere, in a link I followed to an article that was cited on this wonderful forum. Truth is, we were doing it on our own without realizing it was a Thing. We're real estate weirdos and love doing projects. We can't travel right now, so flipping and BRRR-ing help us focus on what we CAN do. We are not hard core on the financial side. For example, we don't re-fi. We pay cash or we get a good loan in the first place. We also flex on the 1% rule, which is BP heresy. Ergo, I don't think Bigger Pockets would completely approve of our ways. We are otherwise FI, so we are not as strict with the numbers as they advocate.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Dicey on March 08, 2017, 10:31:29 AM
Yesterday I overheard a conversation between a coworker (C) and one of the housekeeping staff (H). H mentioned that he has 3 working days until retirement, at which point I stuck my nose into the conversation to congratulate him. I had never seen him smile before, but he sure was smiling when we talked about his retirement! I wouldn't call him young, but he looks like he might be a few years younger than "normal" retirement age.

The FU money part of it is that after he walked away, C told me that H had several properties around town and had decided to retire after our company cut the housekeepers' hourly rate almost in half. I would like to think that he is a closet Mustachian. And I love the fact that just because someone empties trash cans for a living doesn't mean they don't know what they're doing with their money!

Update: It gets even better! Turns out his first day of retirement is his birthday. He's using a vacation day for it. That's one hell of a birthday present!

As for how to make the transition, he says his friends and family already have a growing to do list for him, since they all know he'll soon have a lot of time on his hands. I guess that's one way to do it for those who are concerned about feeling a bit lost when they no longer have to get up and go to work.
Both of my parents have passed away in the last two years. In fact, today is the first anniversary of my Dad's death. This tale sparks a memory... Dad drove an old Toyota Corolla with a license plate frame that read "Retired, Now I Work at Honey-Do Construction". He actually did retire at fifty, badass that he was. RIP, "Pops".
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: BlueHouse on March 08, 2017, 11:17:15 AM
Got handed a shit sandwich at work today. Even though we have FU money, I'm hanging on since we are expecting our second soon and now isn't the best time to quit. I think I might have something to contribute soon but I hope not atleast for some more time.
Hang in there firelight!  As I was reminded when I recently had a shit sandwich, the fact that you have FU money gives you choices and you're choosing to hang in there a little longer.  Knowing that you're accepting it because something else is more important, helped me swallow the first bite.  I've also decided to not put up with so much shit, to just say "that's not okay" more often when I get the sandwich.  Good luck! 

And congratulations on your baby!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: FIREby35 on March 08, 2017, 08:09:39 PM
I have not read everyone's stories yet, but I do have my own epic FU money story.

I worked at a law firm with 13 attorneys, straight out of law school at 26. I had lots of options because I went to a regionally respected law school and finished near the top of my law class. I rejected many offers for salary positions and chose this firm because it allowed me to create my own practice. We split fees based on various percentages. There was no cap on my earnings.

Fast forward 3.5 years. I was 29 years old. My practice had exploded. There were basically two problems. First, by the time of the FU incident I was making more money than anyone in the firm and I was the youngest person there.  Second, the managing partner and the office administrator were incompetent, bitter and creating a toxic work environment.

A key part of the story is that 6 weeks prior to the FU incident, the managing partner used $10,000 of my money, without permission, to pay all the partners salaries because they had "cash flow issues." They money was paid back a week later. This signaled financial shenanigans on top of being totally, totally toxic.

One day, the managing partner approached me and said she wanted to renegotiate my deal AND audit every case for the appropriate percentage from the prior two years. The renegotiation was ridiculous. The audit was a major, totally unwarranted affront to my integrity - from a person who had just taken $10,000 of my money!

So, I went home with my wife - coincidentally an auditor and accountant. We performed the audit ourselves and ran all the numbers. I discovered that for the prior two years, less than 1% of my income had come from their referrals. I was a major profit center for the firm - generating over $250,000 for the firm over the prior 24 months. And, in fact, the toxic office administrator had intentionally mis-categorized my referrals thereby underpaying me.

Fortunately, I had been on the MMM train since the beginning and had an FU money war-chest of a couple hundred thousand dollars. Interestingly, the MMM choices had been the object of much curiosity since everyone knew I was making a lot but spending very little. Why are you riding your bike to work? Why did you buy such a "modest" house for your income. Why don't you get a new car? Those are actual comments.

So, the FU moment arrived when I delivered a renegotiated contract proposal to the partners. I proposed to pay them a flat monthly fee that amounted to 35% of what they were currently getting. I proposed that if they ever held any of my money without legal authority or permission they pay $1,000 per day for the privilege. Egg on the face of managing partner who had not advised anyone of the $10,000 "cash flow" issue or her proposed audit and renegotiation.

A comment this board will particularly appreciate in response, "We can't take this deal, we'd have to reduce our salaries and our budgets are set to our salaries." Facepalm.

During the wind up phase, the toxic, money stealing office administrator - who had been around long enough to have a way, way over-inflated sense of importance - spoke up during a tense conversation about splitting remaining funds. I looked at her and said, "You have no ownership in this firm, I have never been in business with you and don't want to hear anything you have to say." Hahahahaha. Her jaw dropped. Her upper lip trembled with rage. She didn't say a freaking word. It was the best moment of the entire thing, even better than the contract proposal.

Long story short, I opened my own law firm one week later. I now pay 20% less in overhead. I work dramatically reduced hours because I have actual, dedicated staff for just me - which they would never give me. Also, my gross receipts are up about 10% in the first 12 months. Life is good.

As a post script - the incompetent managing partner hired a guy to fill my office. Remember, that office was earning over $250,000 for the firm in the proceeding 24 months. The guy was paid a salary for six months - rather than have his pay tied to his productivity. Eventually it came out he was a total fraud who lied about being licensed in our state (he did have a different, faraway state). He even filed court documents without the appropriate license. He was fired immediately and the office remains vacant, producing zero profits. Schadenfreude? Yes.

Also as a disclaimer, there are many, many attorneys who are great at servicing their clients but not so good at business. In the event I needed legal help, I would immediately hire any of these attorneys - except the managing partner. They really are competent, professional people - but bad business and money managers. In the end, I maintained great relationships with everyone except the managing partner and the office administrator.

I have an update to this story. Recently, one of the partners of this law firm left and decided to open his law firm, right across the hallway from me. I got a little inside info that had remained hidden for two years.

It turns out the Managing Partner and the toxic office administrator were totally in cahoots to oust me from the firm. After I delivered my proposal, described above, there was a meeting where the partners were going to respond. Apparently, it had been the topic of conversation that it would not make sense for me to continue to pay larger and larger sums of money and they would eventually have to change my deal - which is what I was asking for.  So, my proposal was not a surprise and they were willing to work with me.

Enter the managing partner and administrator: the administrator entered the partner meeting and tendered her immediate resignation if she had to continue to work with me. She then walked out. This would have created a temporary chaos and she was the paralegal for the firms' founder who no one would override. So, they didn't make me a counter offer and instead asked, "If we don't keep him, will Administrator come back." To which managing partner replied immediately, "I'll talk to her about that." Moments later, the resignation was withdrawn and my fate was sealed. The partner who just left the firm - because the same managing partner and toxic administrator were costing him lots and lots of money and stress, said he was in shock at how the whole group had been so masterfully manipulated.

If you recall the story from above, I told her off AFTER she had done all this. It only makes it sweeter.

As they say, living well is the best revenge. I've had my own practice for two years now. I've doubled my net worth. I work 20-30 hours less per week and make more money. Life is good. They really did me a huge favor.

P.S. My leading theory on why the office administrator wanted me gone is that if I had stayed I would have been forced to address her purposely mis-coding my cases and, thereby, underpaying me. This would have been very bad for her as a major breach of trust. So, I think she knew that if I stayed her shenanigans would become a mini-office scandal and potentially she could lose her job. She went for the jugular when she had the chance. Why the Managing Partner was so upset? I think it had to do with calling her out on the $10,000 in front of everyone. But why did they turn their eyes to me prior to the $10,000 blow up and coding discovery? I'll never really know.

I know most of you probably couldn't care less, but I wanted to say it somewhere: toxic Managing Partner of this law firm is being forced out of the firm she founded.

Me? Almost FI and just got back from two month sabbatical in Mexico where I settled the biggest case of my life from the beach (literally).

So, so sweet.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: frugal rph on March 08, 2017, 08:55:01 PM
Wow Fireby35, that's great!  She's finally getting what she deserved. 
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Laura33 on March 08, 2017, 10:03:12 PM
I know most of you probably couldn't care less, but I wanted to say it somewhere: toxic Managing Partner of this law firm is being forced out of the firm she founded.

Me? Almost FI and just got back from two month sabbatical in Mexico where I settled the biggest case of my life from the beach (literally).

So, so sweet.

Now THAT is epic.  So happy for you!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Dicey on March 09, 2017, 12:21:16 AM
I know most of you probably couldn't care less, but I wanted to say it somewhere: toxic Managing Partner of this law firm is being forced out of the firm she founded.

Me? Almost FI and just got back from two month sabbatical in Mexico where I settled the biggest case of my life from the beach (literally).

So, so sweet.
I respectfully beg to differ with you, Fb35. Who doesn't  love a good story with a happy ending? Thanks for the update!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: shelivesthedream on March 09, 2017, 01:05:08 AM
I know most of you probably couldn't care less, but I wanted to say it somewhere: toxic Managing Partner of this law firm is being forced out of the firm she founded.

Me? Almost FI and just got back from two month sabbatical in Mexico where I settled the biggest case of my life from the beach (literally).

So, so sweet.
I respectfully beg to differ with you, Fb35. Who doesn't  love a good story with a happy ending? Thanks for the update!

+1 I love updates!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Sydneystache on March 09, 2017, 04:45:22 AM
I know most of you probably couldn't care less, but I wanted to say it somewhere: toxic Managing Partner of this law firm is being forced out of the firm she founded.

Me? Almost FI and just got back from two month sabbatical in Mexico where I settled the biggest case of my life from the beach (literally).

So, so sweet.
I respectfully beg to differ with you, Fb35. Who doesn't  love a good story with a happy ending? Thanks for the update!

+1 I love updates!

+2 What happened to the toxic administrator? Is she still there causing chaos?
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: aperture on March 09, 2017, 05:17:47 AM
I know most of you probably couldn't care less, but I wanted to say it somewhere: toxic Managing Partner of this law firm is being forced out of the firm she founded.

Me? Almost FI and just got back from two month sabbatical in Mexico where I settled the biggest case of my life from the beach (literally).

So, so sweet.
I respectfully beg to differ with you, Fb35. Who doesn't  love a good story with a happy ending? Thanks for the update!

+1 I love updates!

+2 What happened to the toxic administrator? Is she still there causing chaos?
+3 This story just gets better with time.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: LeRainDrop on March 09, 2017, 05:41:51 AM
I know most of you probably couldn't care less, but I wanted to say it somewhere: toxic Managing Partner of this law firm is being forced out of the firm she founded.

Me? Almost FI and just got back from two month sabbatical in Mexico where I settled the biggest case of my life from the beach (literally).

So, so sweet.

From one attorney who worked for a toxic partner lady (me) to another (you), HELL YEAH!!!  All around fabulous news!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Cannot Wait! on March 09, 2017, 06:59:02 AM
It's all good.  I especially love the beach!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: FIREby35 on March 09, 2017, 07:03:24 AM
I know most of you probably couldn't care less, but I wanted to say it somewhere: toxic Managing Partner of this law firm is being forced out of the firm she founded.

Me? Almost FI and just got back from two month sabbatical in Mexico where I settled the biggest case of my life from the beach (literally).

So, so sweet.
I respectfully beg to differ with you, Fb35. Who doesn't  love a good story with a happy ending? Thanks for the update!

+1 I love updates!

+2 What happened to the toxic administrator? Is she still there causing chaos?

Thanks everyone!

As far as I know Toxic Administrator is still around. I'm sure she will be taking on a friendlier attitude towards all without her #1 ally around.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Mother Fussbudget on March 09, 2017, 11:45:39 AM
FIREby35... Office karma's a bitch, ain't it?  ;-)  [Thanks a million for the update - yes, we're interested.  And congrats on running your own practice - here's hoping you'll give mustachian rates if any of us ever needs your services.  All the best!  MF.]
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Evgenia on March 09, 2017, 04:18:20 PM
Thankfully, I've got a healthy 'stache (around 6x annual expenses) and a supportive partner whose job is secure, so I give notice and....here's the epic bit....one week later HR comes back and reclassifies my transition as a role restructuring. I'm leaving next month, will get paid out for 5-6 weeks of PTO in my last check, and am likely looking at 3 months severance pay given my tenure with the organization. I've got a clean narrative for my departure and am essentially pulling a paycheck through July/August. While my ego doesn't like the circumstances behind this transition, my 'stache is telling her to get over herself.

I love that you gave notice. Congratulations. You'll be more than fine. Enjoy a multiple month vacation during what I hope is good weather for you.

I've lost count of how many managers tried things like you've described here. They have a motive, and rather than just state what they want or do the deed (fire you, or whatever), they engage in this more roundabout stuff: "Oh, it's an exercise, it's a test." When did people get so gutless? Make your decisions and own them, already, without all the unnecessary drama and emotion. Oy!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: nouveauRiche on March 09, 2017, 07:08:19 PM
Another Bigger Pockets fan I see!


We got to MMM via Bigger Pockets...
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Metric Mouse on March 11, 2017, 01:40:11 AM
I know most of you probably couldn't care less, but I wanted to say it somewhere: toxic Managing Partner of this law firm is being forced out of the firm she founded.

Me? Almost FI and just got back from two month sabbatical in Mexico where I settled the biggest case of my life from the beach (literally).

So, so sweet.
I respectfully beg to differ with you, Fb35. Who doesn't  love a good story with a happy ending? Thanks for the update!

+1 I love updates!

+2 What happened to the toxic administrator? Is she still there causing chaos?
+3 This story just gets better with time.
+4!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: FIT_Goat on March 11, 2017, 06:42:52 PM
Not really FU money, like most people here think, but back when I was in college I drove a tow-truck for income.  I was working 40-60 hours a week, and taking 18 credit hours during the day.  I drove a $550 beater, that I paid for in cash, and had access to the tools and people who knew cars to keep it running for cheap.

Driving the tow-truck didn't pay "well," but my expenses were minimal.  I was renting a room out of someone's house, and didn't have time to do anything that cost money.  I was taking home $400-$500 a week, and my monthly expenses were under $600.  The rest was just piling up in my checking account.  I had around $8,000 when I finally reached my breaking point.

I worked a 40 hour shift one weekend, sleeping for a couple hours in a motor-home on the lot before getting back on the road.  I was exhausted.  It was too much.  I was driving on too little sleep and it was unsafe.  I was going to kill myself or someone else at the rate I was going.

I went to the owner and told him that I couldn't work like this.  I was willing to continue Friday nights and Saturday nights, but 10 hours each and not the 16 hour shifts currently scheduled.  And, I wasn't going to do any other evening coverage.  "I can't do that.  I need you on call every night and I need you working 6pm to 10am on the weekend."

"Look," I said, "You can have me for the 20 hours a week, or zero hours a week.  Those are the only two options."

"You can't dictate your hours to me!"

"No, but I can quit.  Here are the keys to the truck.  Maybe I'll see you around."  And, I just walked out and drove home.  I figured that I had enough in savings to last me nearly a year, but I would also easily find another job that fit my needs and paid my minimal bills.  At that moment in my life, $8,000 was FU money.

As for my boss?  He called my mom and told on me!  LOL, no joke.  He went to the same church as my mom, and I think he thought that he could get her to tell me to go back and apologize and work for him again.  I don't know exactly what my mom said, but she told me that she told him I was an adult who could make my own decisions.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Dicey on March 11, 2017, 09:38:48 PM
Great story, FIT_Goat! Good for you for recognizing your limits and standing up for yourself and good on your mom for treating you like the adult you were. I'll bet no matter what she said to him, she was supremely proud of you.

The last line reminds me of the time I told someone at a book sale to stop using a scanner. He asked me why I singled him out and I replied that there was a "No Scanner" sign on the end of every row and I could hear his beeping. He got pissed off and said he was going to complain to my boss. I told him I didn't have a boss, I was retired and a library volunteer. The asshat actually had the nerve to call the library and insist that I be fired! The library staff had a good laugh at that, since they know how much time I spend raising money for them.

However, the conflict-averse President of the Friend's Board was actually going to contact him and apologize. I told her if she did, I'd quit the board. (I'm the VP.) Not at all an Epic FU money story, but it was still terrifically fun to stand my ground without worry of repercussion.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: SwordGuy on March 11, 2017, 09:48:49 PM
I replied that there was a "No Scanner" sign on the end of every row
Why does the organization care?  You want to sell the books, you set the price, what's it to you if they want to scan the book before buying it?
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Dicey on March 12, 2017, 04:07:02 AM
I replied that there was a "No Scanner" sign on the end of every row
Why does the organization care?  You want to sell the books, you set the price, what's it to you if they want to scan the book before buying it?

Thanks for asking, Sword Guy. Apologies to everyone else for the slight hijack, but I gotta answer this.

We care for a number of reasons.

- We are the Friends of the Library. We are not the "Source of cheap inventory for book resellers." We take a more cheap books for everyone approach, not just leftover crap that the book resellers don't want.

- The booksellers are the ones who asked us not to allow scanners in the first place. They feel very strongly that it keeps the playing field level. As in, you gotta know your stuff if you want to score the deals, you can't just scan everything.

- Our space is very limited and it gets really tight during peak hours. There simply isn't room for people to move if someone is monopolizing a section with a scanner.

- Next, those fuckers beep and drives those of us who are in the room all day nuts. 

- We work every day the library is open all year long to process the book donations. A large team of dedicated volunteers works for a solid week+ to set up and run the quarterly book sales. We've earned the right to set a few rules. BTW, our price is fifty cents or a dollar for almost everything. Typically, less than 2-3% of our inventory is flagged as "Special" and sold for a little bit more.

- We don't have a lot of storage space, so our culls and leftovers go to a large organized charity (SVdP). If we don't sell something, they are somewhat more likely to, as they operate typical retail stores. They also pick up, which is nice.

Pro Tip: If you really want to score the deals, you become a volunteer at the library. Then you get first pick. #askmehowiknow
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: EnjoyIt on March 12, 2017, 07:46:58 PM
Agree with ARS, this is by FAR the best thread on this forum.
Although I have been a guest lurker for a long time I have finally made myself legit -->http://forum.mrmoneymustache.com/profile/?u=31677 (http://forum.mrmoneymustache.com/profile/?u=31677) on the forum, but mostly to follow this thread more easily.

I suppose I am lucky that my work around the salted cured meats industry has proven to be filled with top quality folks and no working through the 'meat grinder.'
Pastrami is the most sensual of the dried, salted meats.

Is that Constanza?
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Taran Wanderer on March 12, 2017, 09:56:28 PM

- Next, those fuckers beep and drives those of us who are in the room all day nuts. 


All good reasons, but I liked this one best.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: BlueHouse on March 13, 2017, 12:31:18 PM
As for my boss?  He called my mom and told on me! 

That was an awesome story and I LOVE that he tattled!  Too funny!  congratulations!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: dividendman on March 14, 2017, 11:00:50 AM
Agree with ARS, this is by FAR the best thread on this forum.
Although I have been a guest lurker for a long time I have finally made myself legit -->http://forum.mrmoneymustache.com/profile/?u=31677 (http://forum.mrmoneymustache.com/profile/?u=31677) on the forum, but mostly to follow this thread more easily.

I suppose I am lucky that my work around the salted cured meats industry has proven to be filled with top quality folks and no working through the 'meat grinder.'
Pastrami is the most sensual of the dried, salted meats.

Is that Constanza?

Obviously!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Eric on March 14, 2017, 01:15:14 PM
Agree with ARS, this is by FAR the best thread on this forum.
Although I have been a guest lurker for a long time I have finally made myself legit -->http://forum.mrmoneymustache.com/profile/?u=31677 (http://forum.mrmoneymustache.com/profile/?u=31677) on the forum, but mostly to follow this thread more easily.

I suppose I am lucky that my work around the salted cured meats industry has proven to be filled with top quality folks and no working through the 'meat grinder.'
Pastrami is the most sensual of the dried, salted meats.

Is that Constanza?

Obviously!

It was actually George's girlfriend that said that.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VvSEVOIbEMU
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: dividendman on March 14, 2017, 02:01:27 PM
Damn you Eric.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: longstrangetrip on March 18, 2017, 11:49:22 AM
Changed my 401K contribution from 4% to get full company match to max amount

Difference in taxable income of ~$20,000

FU - Not paying for a stinking wall or WW III
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: JoeBlow on March 18, 2017, 09:56:55 PM
Changed my 401K contribution from 4% to get full company match to max amount

Difference in taxable income of ~$20,000

FU - Not paying for a stinking wall or WW III

Sorry but you are still paying for it with your remaining taxes.  You will also gain from the wall (not sure about WWIII) with your investments.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: runewell on March 18, 2017, 11:14:57 PM
Maybe a better way to put that is that your country is paying for the wall in spit of your decision to defer your taxes to a later point in time.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Dicey on March 18, 2017, 11:21:28 PM
Maybe a better way to put that is that your country is paying for the wall in spit of your decision to defer your taxes to a later point in time.
I, too, spit on the decision to build a wall. May it never happen and Dog bless Cemex!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: SwordGuy on March 19, 2017, 08:46:33 AM
Walls are invincible.

However, I expect sales of rope to go up in Mexico. :D

Quote from: Karl Marx
The last capitalist we hang shall be the one who sold us the rope.

Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: firelight on March 22, 2017, 04:06:42 PM
Need to vent: I'm at my second job ever and this is the first time I'm actually seeing it live. I'm seeing layers of office politics and this is a company that is well run and field that is usually less political. I was thinking of trying the management route and used to not understand why so many on this forum hate it. Now I get it! Man, office politics is serious s**t. I might be affected by it a bit (due to being in team, past projects etc) but I'm so so glad I don't have to do that stuff day in and day out.  And I'm super glad that FIRE date is so close and we are not spending on random crap instead.

How do people even deal with this office politics for years and years?
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: msilenus on March 22, 2017, 04:16:35 PM
How do people even deal with this office politics for years and years?

It's a game, like chess or poker.  Some people like it well enough to do it professionally, or else suffer it for the pay despite not liking it.  Biggest real difference is the number of positions in the pro leagues.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: scottish on March 22, 2017, 05:03:50 PM
Quote
How do people even deal with this office politics for years and years?

It's a game, like chess or poker.  Some people like it well enough to do it professionally, or else suffer it for the pay despite not liking it.  Biggest real difference is the number of positions in the pro leagues.

I just stick to the facts.    The political types can suck it.   (I don't present this attitude directly at work though.  :-) )
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Mel70 on March 22, 2017, 05:08:39 PM
Walls are invincible.

However, I expect sales of rope to go up in Mexico. :D

Cmon! Anyone heard of tunnels? Talk about an exercise in futility!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: SwordGuy on March 22, 2017, 06:34:45 PM
Walls are invincible.

However, I expect sales of rope to go up in Mexico. :D

Cmon! Anyone heard of tunnels? Talk about an exercise in futility!

Oh!  That's what the Republicans meant by "shovel ready".
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: zolotiyeruki on March 23, 2017, 06:59:35 AM
Walls are invincible.

However, I expect sales of rope to go up in Mexico. :D

Cmon! Anyone heard of tunnels? Talk about an exercise in futility!
I think you have your political parties mixed up! :P

Oh!  That's what the Republicans meant by "shovel ready".
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: exterous on March 23, 2017, 08:40:41 AM
How do people even deal with this office politics for years and years?

It's a game, like chess or poker.  Some people like it well enough to do it professionally, or else suffer it for the pay despite not liking it.  Biggest real difference is the number of positions in the pro leagues.

Heh - I don't like playing the game but it seems I have at least some aptitude for it. Not a FU Money story but a FU I don't need this job story. I worked long hours during and at school for a profession with some serious CYA needs. Turned out to be a terrible career choice but I forged habits, connections and a work ethic that has served me well since then. I changed fields and got a new job where I worked on teaching myself a new career.

Well the VP for the dept was an awful person with a history of backstabbing. She would regularly scream at and insult people publicly and drove several people to nervous exhaustion. With me as the lowly new guy there were quite a few layers separating us so it didn't really affect me as I kept my head down, did my job and learned my trade. I learned a lot in the time I worked there and started getting job offers from former and new contacts. My current company offered a ton of voluntary and paid for job training options so I continued working there although I did pick up a part time job with a standing full time job offer.

Anyway - my boss ended screwing something up badly. Really badly. He and the VP were best buddies so someone else had to take the fall. Enter the lowly new guy. Imagine my surprise when I was called out and dressed down in front of the entire department for something that I had never done and wasn't aware of. Apparently my raise and bonus were also going to be withheld. After a day of seething rage I confirmed that I still had standing full time job offer elsewhere and prepared my case. Suspecting it would get no where I still followed the proper motions and tried to work it out with my boss and VP - documenting everything. The VP thought I would be scared by the thought of losing my job and tried to lord her position over me so we got no where. When I left the meeting I turned right , away from my cube. She asked where I was going. I told her to file a formal HR review request. After some shock from both of them that someone would dare cross her instead of submitting meekly like pretty much everyone else she tried to tell me I couldn't do that. But I just ignored her and kept walking. I'm stubborn to a fault so I would have done this whether I had another job lined up or not but having the other job took all the stress out of what followed.

At my short lived previous career I had already been part of a few court cases and the formal HR review process had more in common with a court hearing than was probably healthy for a company. My boss and the VP clearly hadn't prepared very well. I'm not sure if that was ineptitude or misplaced contempt for my position but all of their comments involved phrases like "Well, around this time.", "I remember it this way" and he said\she said stuff

Meanwhile my argument was incredibly specific. By habit I had notes, files and emails with exact quotes and times. My boss tried to say that he never got the notes and emails but Microsoft Exchange and file versioning are wonderful things and I had already pulled logs in anticipation of the review process. I responded to his first "I never got that email" with "According to the Microsoft Exchange logs the message was delivered to your inbox at this time and you marked it as read at this time". When he tried to say he never saw my file on the server I responded with "According to the file server logs you made a revision to the file in question on this date at this exact time." I refuted his claim of sending me an email that he never did (he had made this claim in our previous meeting) with a dump of my exchange file logs showing no email like that had been received and asked him to pull his logs to show he sent it. He admitted he may not have sent that email.

The only downside to the hearing is that it was so short. I was enjoying myself more than I probably should have been. True to company form though it had devolved into a yelling match between my VP and the VP of HR. After the found in my favor she tried to obliquely threaten me that basically, my days there were numbered. I laughed and told her "I haven't needed this job for months".

People at my various new places of employment have occasionally tried to play office politics with me but its child's play compared to what I previously saw and dealt with so they've never persisted. I have no doubt that there are many people out there better than I am at it but I do add that to the list of things I learned from the first company.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: JustGettingStarted1980 on March 23, 2017, 10:56:44 AM
Exterous -> this was awesomely epic, and amazingly anal/tech proficient of you. I'm in awe.

JGS
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: cobbb11 on March 23, 2017, 12:49:41 PM
So here's a sort of FU money story I guess:

2 jobs ago, I worked on a help desk for a public company that does HR work for other companies. When I first saw this job online, I realized quickly that I was going through a staffing company to get it. I never quite understood this concept, at least in this instance, since i only did 1 phone interview with the staffing guy, before meeting him for breakfast, before having to do an in-person interview with the HR company anyway. So basically this vampire was getting like half or whatever of my wages for the 6 month contract that I was working for the main company with the idea being they would take me on full-time as long as nothing went wrong. I was working the same hours as the rest of the helpdesk team and doing the same work, but got paid substantially less, no benefits, and had to take a shorter lunch for some reason too. Now I've worked in several IT capacities my career, but this was hands down the WORST.

First off, to even call what I did a helpdesk was kind of misleading. This company was apparently so big and bloated with red tape, probably from being a publicly traded company, that we had a sub-department for EVERYTHING. I was level 1. Basically taking in all the incoming calls/e-mails and making trouble tickets out of them. If the problem wasn't related to a small handful of things we were in charge of fixing, we would push the ticket to the correct department. I'm talking a network team, microsoft team, apple team, hardware team, telecom team, security team, sales support team, development team...the list continues. It was a glorified call center. I used to work at a law firm where we had a small team of about 7 overall with only me and my boss in the regional office I worked out of that would do everything ourselves. Needless to say this was jarring. On top of that, being similar to a call center, our every action was monitored and recorded. You had to log into the phone system to get put in the call-taking rotation, and everyone's status was up on a big screen tv. We were in one open area of half-cubicles with our backs to each other. You got 2 15-minute breaks to use for the day, and if you wanted to use them, you had to go into break mode. So now your status on the tv changed and everyone could see how long you were in the crapper for. And heaven help you if you went to 15:01 in break mode. Then your name would go red on the screen and start flashing at about the 17 minute mark. Your calls were all recorded and 2 random ones were chosen to be evaluated and you would be prosecuted to the fullest extent of the law for every time you went off script or your ticket wasn't up to what they considered par. The majority of my co-workers were annoying and almost always went overboard on their break times, but being full-time they didn't really get reprimanded as the contractors did.

Why would I put myself through all this you ask? Well I had discovered MMM a few years prior to this, and this job was only 4+ miles from home.

Oh the sweet sweet bicycle commute! And this was when gas was still pretty high up. Internally laughing every time I would receive the traffic report from reception about when to avoid the nearby interstate was one of the few things that kept me sane at that job. I quickly got rain weather gear (Florida sucks for that) and was bike riding rain or shine. My best month saw me only filling up my car once. I had to fight with building management to move the bike rack from being next to a pond (not even bolted to anything) to at least a covered outside break area.

So after 5 months there was some falling out between my staffing company boss and HR company boss, so they bought out my contract and took me on full-time a month early. But because there wasn't an official "opening" or whatever phrase they used, I was still in this weird holding pattern. I got an incredibly small pay bump, but still no medical insurance, 401k options, or even vacation days, so I was basically a "direct contractor". On top of that, they had hired another employee after me direct to full-time when I was still under 3rd party contract. I later discovered that the HR company also advertised for job openings on their own. So basically I was just the victim of clicking on the wrong application online. Unbelievable. The final nail in the coffin, was another 3rd party contract employee who started after me getting moved to full-time during a somewhat large re-structuring in my department, where my highly unqualified boss was let go, and a much more reasonable person came in from level 2 to take her place. However at this point the damage was done, I was fed up with going nowhere, leashed to my cubicle like a prisoner for fear of missing a call and having that statistic on my record, and generally being treated like crap despite the weekly metrics being posted and my always being in the top 3 for call availability time, calls taken, tickets created, and tickets closed. Not even bike commuting could help this in the long run.

So long story not made longer, I threw down the gauntlet and gave them one month to make me legit full-time or I would walk. 1 month came and went, I had now been there a week or 2 shy of a year, and I was not about to end up bluffing. FU money let me put in my 2 weeks and I quickly found a job doing IT at an elementary school. So quick in fact that I was leaving work early to go on interviews during those last 2 weeks. 2 of the 3 schools I applied to hired me on the spot (having a college degree for a position requiring only a high school diploma probably helped put me at the top of the resume pile), so I chose the closest one. It was back to a car commute and even worse pay, but holy crap the FREEDOM. I was the only IT guy on site. Got to run the morning news crew with the kids and come up with new intro videos and other multimedia stuff, had the district's helpdesk to call if I needed any assistance (I could only pray they weren't treated like my last job treats helpdesks), and basically got to hang around the school with a walkie talkie, helping out classrooms and computer labs that radioed for me. I even got all the holidays off teachers get too. But like I said, the pay was horrible and I was barely breaking even with just the bare minimum in bills. It's like they knew how little it would feel like "work" and paid accordingly.

So luckily an old friend asked me if I was still in IT and I now work at an accounting firm that she works at (the sad part is that I left the school a week into summer vacation :(((((((( ). But it's the best pay I've ever had, small IT team, no metrics or stats to keep track of, just a general honor system that everyone pulls their weight (and with only 4 of us you can't exactly slack off unnoticed), benefits (I just became eligible for the 401k w/ 50% match on the first 4%, and the best kicker of all is that although the main office that I currently work at is about the same distance the school was (~15 miles one way), they have a smaller satellite office just down the street from the HR company! I currently have negotiated getting to go there once a month, but have a verbal yes that I could start working their full time over the summer after tax season. The plan is to just stay the course and get enough reputation/power to make the trips to the main office become the rarity, since so much troubleshooting can be done remotely these days.

FU money really does help make changes happen easier.

Thanks for sticking through the long read!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: mistershankly on March 23, 2017, 01:20:17 PM
How do people even deal with this office politics for years and years?

It's a game, like chess or poker.  Some people like it well enough to do it professionally, or else suffer it for the pay despite not liking it.  Biggest real difference is the number of positions in the pro leagues.

They work their way from being forced to wrestle the fat man to positions of pulling levers where they are further removed from the bloodbath of middle management politics.  Here is the description of the Fat Man and The Trolley philosophical debate I'm referring to.

http://www.nytimes.com/2013/11/24/books/review/would-you-kill-the-fat-man-and-the-trolley-problem.html

Either way, they become more immune to the politics as well as the calls for compassion (in most cases) to survive and climb out of the immediate moral dilemmas of either caring too much or not giving a shit at all.  Sadly, no one wins as they compromise their humanity in exchange for delusional security and control. 

On the other hand, I've come across some great leaders but even they were (at times) perceived as turning a blind eye or indirectly contributing to damaging office politics.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Just Joe on March 23, 2017, 02:49:47 PM
My argument was incredibly specific. By habit I had notes, files and emails with exact quotes and times. My boss tried to say that he never got the notes and emails but Microsoft Exchange and file versioning are wonderful things and I had already pulled logs in anticipation of the review process. I responded to his first "I never got that email" with "According to the Microsoft Exchange logs the message was delivered to your inbox at this time and you marked it as read at this time". When he tried to say he never saw my file on the server I responded with "According to the file server logs you made a revision to the file in question on this date at this exact time." I refuted his claim of sending me an email that he never did (he had made this claim in our previous meeting) with a dump of my exchange file logs showing no email like that had been received and asked him to pull his logs to show he sent it. He admitted he may not have sent that email.

So can anyone see these logs or are these something on IT support staff can pull. Nice CYA tool.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: dogboyslim on March 23, 2017, 03:59:51 PM
RE Office politics, but not really about FU money other than that I had plenty and "Jane" didn't.

I worked in a large company as the director of one of the research units.  One of our large data projects required integration across 13 different source systems to assemble a common record that was broken up into specific time movements based upon client transactions.  Needless to say, this required someone who had some serious data, ETL and SQL skills.  The original project estimate was that it would take 6 months.  Jane (not her real name) and her compatriot were able to compile and assemble the required input data-set in 2 weeks of major overtime in concert with me as a business resource.

Fast forward 3 years.  I'm the director of one of the largest business units and Jane is critical to my model development work.  Here's where the office politics get interesting.  Jane used to date Mark Andrew Holman (not his real name, but he was a M-AH).  Anyway, Uma Brady (not her real name) started dating M-AH, who was cheating on Jane.  UB and M-AH getting engaged is how Jane found out that M-AH was breaking up with her.  UB brown noses to the IT VP and gets put in a director spot over Jane.  Jane calls me up, explains story, says she's waiting for the ax to drop.  I say don't worry, there's no way they can replace your work.  I start an inventory of all the critical projects my department is working on and highlight all the work Jane was doing on each.  In my world, data is your lifeblood.  I had lots of talented analysts, but few data wizards.  Jane was a very valuable resource.  Anyway, I get the very polite notice from UB that Jane was being moved off of my projects.  I replied saying "Thanks for letting me know, can we have a quick meeting?  I need to understand how your department will be fulfilling the SLA it has with me."

We have meeting.  I had escalated issue to my EVP, so the IT VP was in room.  UB starts talking about how Jane had had some complaints from internal clients and they were moving her to work on more internal projects.  I said "How you assign staff is up to you, but I have an inventory of the projects that Jane is working on and I need to know how you are going to fulfill the needs."  Projects 1-5 were all on the CEOs list of talking points when he spoke about future project enhancements.  The work required to do what Jane did was exhaustive, and she was wicked fast and accurate.  At the end of my description of the project tasks and skill sets needed to replace her the IT VP looked at UB and said "That sounds like 10 people, not 1.  How are you going to source that?"  UB just looked red in the face.  I then innocently asked "BTW, who were the clients that complained?  Based upon your allocation of billing Jane is 100 percent allocated to me, and as far as I can tell she's amazing.  I know the complaint didn't come from me.  UB gets more red, IT VP looks at UB with a questioning look.  UB says "it was an anonymous complaint."

Two weeks later Jane comes in my office closes the door, sits down and says:  "I just got a visit from the IT VP.  It seems that I'm being promoted and will now report to 'Other IT Director' instead of UB.  I have a new job accountability to train data literacy and ETL efficiency and am to be considered the model for how to partner with the business.  I asked ITVP how I'd gone from being told I was being moved away from client facing roles due to complaints to being used as the model for client facing roles and ITVPs reaction was odd.  She laughed loudly and then said that when a business unit Director would go to that much effort to make an IT Director look like a complete schmuck over what was clearly non-work related BS in defense of someone in a different department with the lowest analyst title possible, there was clearly a close relationship with the business.  I asked her to explain that further and then she just said ask you."

Sometimes office politics are the best defense for office politics.  UB lasted all of 6 months as a Director.  After that I got the email that said.  "UB no longer works for _company_."
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: RyanAtTanagra on March 23, 2017, 04:19:58 PM
RE Office politics, but not really about FU money other than that I had plenty and "Jane" didn't.

One of my new favorite stories, bravo!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: seanc0x0 on March 23, 2017, 04:24:58 PM
(snipped for brevity)

That's awesome!  I always like to hear people stand up for those getting unfairly abused. I've been in that position a couple times before learning about FI, and never had anyone stand up for me. Kudos!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: JustGettingStarted1980 on March 23, 2017, 05:09:16 PM
Bravo Dogboy!!!

If we don't stand up for the good eggs, who will?
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Blindsquirrel on March 23, 2017, 07:03:09 PM
   Good Dogboy! That is a great tale!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: firelight on March 24, 2017, 02:35:26 AM
This is awesome, dogboy!! Thanks for sharing! Gives me hope that office politics is not a bad thing, just another tool for how you use it.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Guesl982374 on March 24, 2017, 08:02:20 AM
Sometimes office politics are the best defense for office politics.  UB lasted all of 6 months as a Director.  After that I got the email that said.  "UB no longer works for _company_."

Outstanding!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: mm1970 on March 24, 2017, 11:16:04 AM
Exterous -> this was awesomely epic, and amazingly anal/tech proficient of you. I'm in awe.

JGS

+1000
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: mm1970 on March 24, 2017, 11:24:47 AM
Sometimes office politics are the best defense for office politics.  UB lasted all of 6 months as a Director.  After that I got the email that said.  "UB no longer works for _company_."

Outstanding!
Amazing!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Dicey on March 24, 2017, 11:38:12 AM
Wow, three good ones in a row! You guys rock!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: msilenus on March 24, 2017, 01:43:09 PM
"It seems that I'm being promoted and will now report to 'Other IT Director' instead of UB.  I have a new job accountability to train data literacy and ETL efficiency and am to be considered the model for how to partner with the business.

I can't tell... after all that trouble did you still lose your data maven?
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: gerardc on March 25, 2017, 10:06:53 PM
...

No offense but this looks more like an "I'm fucked" story than an FU one.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: cobbb11 on March 27, 2017, 10:32:11 AM
...

No offense but this looks more like an "I'm fucked" story than an FU one.

Which part? I would think having enough money saved up to fight for what I felt I deserved at the HR company and not bluffing when threatening to leave would be a perfectly adequate example of FU money. The rest of the story was just to illustrate what happened since then and how things managed to work themselves out in the end to where I will (hopefully) be getting nearly the same exact bike commute with even more money and benefits than had I been forced to stay where I was if I was living paycheck to paycheck.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: dogboyslim on March 27, 2017, 12:30:14 PM
"It seems that I'm being promoted and will now report to 'Other IT Director' instead of UB.  I have a new job accountability to train data literacy and ETL efficiency and am to be considered the model for how to partner with the business.

I can't tell... after all that trouble did you still lose your data maven?
Yes and no.  I lost 30% of her time.  I never noticed the difference though as she still delivered everything needed for all my projects.  I suspect my projects got priority in her workload and that as involved as they were, she still wasn't at capacity.  Top notch performer.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: TheBuddha on April 03, 2017, 09:44:01 AM
Not exactly an FU money story, but I think it's in the spirit of the thread.

Quote
BANK LOSES $1 MILLION DEPOSIT IN PARKING VALIDATION DISPUTE (https://www.washingtonpost.com/archive/business/1989/02/21/bank-loses-1-million-deposit-in-parking-validation-dispute/1f5a3a42-b5aa-4857-bcc3-89579b367c58/?utm_term=.e7ce3e960cac)

February 21, 1989

SPOKANE, WASH., FEB. 20 -- A bank in Spokane learned an expensive lesson by refusing to validate a 60-cent parking slip for a destitute-looking man, who retaliated by withdrawing his $1 million account.

"If you have $1 in a bank or $1 million, I think they owe you the courtesy of stamping your parking ticket," John Barrier said in an interview today in the Spokane Spokesman-Review.

Barrier, 59, said he was wearing his usual shabby clothes last October when he pulled his pickup truck into the Old National Bank parking lot in Spokane. He paid a quick visit to his broker, cashed a check at the bank and then went outside to drive away.

The lot boy said there was a 60-cent parking fee, but that Barrier could take his slip inside to get it validated. No problem, he thought, because he had done business at ONB -- now U.S. Bank of Washington -- for more than 30 years. But a teller took one look at his grubby clothes and refused to stamp the parking bill.

"She told me the bank only validated parking tickets when a customer made a transaction and that cashing a check wasn't a transaction," said Barrier.

The millionaire said he asked the teller to call a bank manager, who also refused.

"He looked me up and down and stood back and gave me one of those kinds of looks," said Barrier, turning up his nose to imitate the manager. "I said, 'Fine, you don't need me and I don't need you.' "

Barrier withdrew all his money and took it down the street to Seafirst Bank.

"The first check he brought me was for $1 million," said Dennis Veter, vice president of Seafirst's main Spokane branch.

"You'd never know by looking at him, but you or I should be so lucky."

Phyllis Campbell, area manager for U.S. Bank of Washington, confirmed Barrier's story and said the incident prompted the bank to review the way it does business.

"Every customer should be treated as a guest. Unfortunately, this incident didn't happen that way," Campbell said.

Barrier's picture was taken this month for Seafirst so the bank can promote its new customer in its newsletter this week. While Barrier was standing in front of the Old National Bank building after the photo session, a destitute-looking man walked by.

"You see that guy?" Barrier asked. "Well, we're all the same. I'm no better than that guy or anybody else."

He says he was born a Texas orphan, made it only through the 10th grade and joined the Navy after marrying young. He came to Spokane in the 1950s and made a lot of money buying and refurbishing old buildings.

"Anybody can do it," Barrier said of his wealth. "God gives everybody in life 24 hours a day. It's just how you use those 24 hours that lets you get ahead."


Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: SEAKSR on April 03, 2017, 10:09:55 AM
Thanks for that post. I appreciate the inspiration!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Threshkin on April 03, 2017, 03:27:29 PM
I dress very casually on occasion and have gotten looks like that on occasion.  No one has ever refused me service though.

On the other hand, having $1M+ in a bank savings account is not very mustachian.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: markbike528CBX on April 03, 2017, 04:17:59 PM
I dress very casually on occasion and have gotten looks like that on occasion.  No one has ever refused me service though.

On the other hand, having $1M+ in a bank savings account is not very mustachian.
I've pull out large amounts, dressed in a old biker jacket, nary a blink, didn't even ask for photo ID (had a bank card). 
It was going to a cashier's check and I think I had to sign for it.

$1M might be a small fraction of his stuff (cash allocation)?
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Sydneystache on April 03, 2017, 05:02:34 PM
Love it! Some people are so judgey...glad it bit that bank back. I can really see that teller's career skyrocket...to the bottom.

Along these lines, my DH has a story about a friend of a friend who is a car fanatic. A shabby looking man enters a car dealership.

Shabby to salesman: I would like to buy X car.

Salesman looks at him up and down: Sorry, I don't think you can afford our cars.

Shabby is shocked:  Are you refusing to sell me a car?

Salesman: Sorry mate, no can do.

Shabby: Get me the manager.

Salesman gets manager.

Manager: What can I do for you today [John]?

Shabby: I would like to buy X car.

Manager: No worries. What else?

Shabby: Fire your salesman.

Manager fires salesman. John is one of their best customers and always pays outright.

Moral of the story: Don't be a dick to someone who wears shabbily. This is probably why they are richer than you. Especially in Sydney, our dress standards imply the shabbier you are, the richer you are especially on weekends. The phrase beachbum applies especially to the millionaires up and down our coastlines. My friend who lives on a Sydney point is happy to look like a hippie bum. I have had to tell him off when he decided to wear thongs to a club because of their dress code.

On the opposite scale, people who wear Italian designer suits are insecure and wannabe millionaires.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: CowboyAndIndian on April 03, 2017, 05:16:37 PM
I have had to tell him off when he decided to wear thongs to a club because of their dress code.

I think a translation is needed here.

Thongs is Australian for flip-flops (Thanks Quora, just read this there).

Sydneystache, Thongs in American is extremely minimalist underwear. Do a google search and see the images ;-)

Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Sydneystache on April 03, 2017, 05:22:58 PM
Yeah sorry about that. It's like fanny packs too ;-)
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: markbike528CBX on April 03, 2017, 05:25:39 PM
A Thong is the underwear,   Thongs is a pair of flip flops.     I fortunately did not confuse the two on first reading.

If your buddy is wearing thongs, the underwear, it might defeat the purpose :-)

Signs as--- Temporary Deputy Grammar Sheriff.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: CowboyAndIndian on April 03, 2017, 05:26:00 PM
Yeah sorry about that. It's like fanny packs too ;-)

Yup, as someone whose English was a mix of American and English growing up, I had some issues with the terms in the US.

e.g Rubber -> Eraser (English/Indian English) -> Condom (US)

Fag -> Cigarette (Indian English) -> Deregatory term for a gay person (US)

Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: TheBuddha on April 03, 2017, 06:21:48 PM
I dress very casually on occasion and have gotten looks like that on occasion.  No one has ever refused me service though.

On the other hand, having $1M+ in a bank savings account is not very mustachian.
I've pull out large amounts, dressed in a old biker jacket, nary a blink, didn't even ask for photo ID (had a bank card). 
It was going to a cashier's check and I think I had to sign for it.

$1M might be a small fraction of his stuff (cash allocation)?

I think he had $8M with the bank altogether. The manager at the new bank says "first" check:

Quote
"The first check he brought me was for $1 million,"


I got the story via /r/MaliciousCompliance (https://www.reddit.com/r/MaliciousCompliance/comments/633zlj/parking_validation_requires_a_transaction/). I like that version a little better and it has more details.

Quote
Sorry if this is a repeat. I just stumbled across this sub and immediately thought of a story I read in the Spokane Spokesman-Review about 30 years ago. I looked for the original, but could only find this Washington Post article

The original article had many more satisfying details, and it's likely my memory has added some. For example, I remember the parking fee being 50 cents, not 60.

Anyway, weathered looking guy wearing old jeans and a wrinkled shirt had just cashed a check at a downtown Spokane bank. Spokane had paid parking, but you could get your ticket validated at downtown businesses. With enough validation, parking was free.

As he's leaving, he remembers he didn't get his parking stub validated. He gets back in line and asks the teller to validate the stub.

"I'm sorry, sir, we only validate with a transaction."

He explains he was just here and shows her the receipt. She won't budge. He asks to speak to an upper level bank exec by name. "I'm sorry, sir, he's too busy."

He asks for a manger, explains, and again asks for the upper level exec by name. The manager explains that he's in a meeting and that the customer should leave.

The guy says, "If I make a transaction, you'll validate the ticket?" Yep.

"I'd like to close my account."

The teller gets a snarky look and starts complying, only to have her face fall as she pulls up the details. Suddenly, they are all apologetic and go to get the exec he'd asked for.

He's just as firm as they were and insists he wants his account closed. I recall it being around $8 million.

He took the cashiers checks, walked across the street and opened a new account at a competing bank, after getting his parking validated.

The bank changed their policy. They would validate parking sans transaction.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: farfromfire on April 06, 2017, 07:43:14 AM
Awesome thread!

FIRE is 10-12 years away for me, but when I do finally quit I definitely want people saying, 'Wow, now that guy got canned!'.

A few years ago, the company I worked at was purchased and they proceeded to fire my whole department (~100 people). So one of the fired employees says goodbye to everyone, calmly steps out the door, and sets an SVP's car on fire. It was glorious.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: PathtoFIRE on April 06, 2017, 08:28:27 AM
sets an SVP's car on fire

Wrong FIRE! Damage like that doesn't suggest that the perpetrator had much confidence in their economic position without that job, quite the opposite. I mean I like Office Space as much as the next guy or gal, but I can't help but think that this is the exact opposite of what most people find inspiring about this thread.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: By the River on April 06, 2017, 08:32:22 AM
Awesome thread!

FIRE is 10-12 years away for me, but when I do finally quit I definitely want people saying, 'Wow, now that guy got canned!'.

A few years ago, the company I worked at was purchased and they proceeded to fire my whole department (~100 people). So one of the fired employees says goodbye to everyone, calmly steps out the door, and sets an SVP's car on fire. It was glorious.

That's a way to go out in a blaze of glory.   But I'm wondering about your user name...is it far from early retirement or far from burning a VP's car?
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Cannot Wait! on April 06, 2017, 08:47:47 AM
sets an SVP's car on fire

Wrong FIRE! Damage like that doesn't suggest that the perpetrator had much confidence in their economic position without that job, quite the opposite. I mean I like Office Space as much as the next guy or gal, but I can't help but think that this is the exact opposite of what most people find inspiring about this thread.

Inspiring? No.  Epic?  Hell yeah!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: farfromfire on April 06, 2017, 11:44:03 AM
Awesome thread!

FIRE is 10-12 years away for me, but when I do finally quit I definitely want people saying, 'Wow, now that guy got canned!'.

A few years ago, the company I worked at was purchased and they proceeded to fire my whole department (~100 people). So one of the fired employees says goodbye to everyone, calmly steps out the door, and sets an SVP's car on fire. It was glorious.

That's a way to go out in a blaze of glory.   But I'm wondering about your user name...is it far from early retirement or far from burning a VP's car?
Both, unfortunately. Retirement is 10-12 years away, and I suspect that I should be at that FU money stage before setting fire to anything.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: RyanAtTanagra on April 06, 2017, 11:45:43 AM
Both, unfortunately. Retirement is 10-12 years away, and I suspect that I should be at that FU money stage before setting fire to anything.

Wrong mindset, as a great man said, if you're good at something never do it for free.  Fire for hire as a faster path to FIRE!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: With This Herring on April 19, 2017, 12:39:14 PM
Wow, what a great batch of FU stories!  Good job, dogboyslim!

I have had to tell him off when he decided to wear thongs to a club because of their dress code.

I think a translation is needed here.

Thongs is Australian for flip-flops (Thanks Quora, just read this there).

Sydneystache, Thongs in American is extremely minimalist underwear. Do a google search and see the images ;-)

A Thong is the underwear,   Thongs is a pair of flip flops.     I fortunately did not confuse the two on first reading.

If your buddy is wearing thongs, the underwear, it might defeat the purpose :-)

Signs as--- Temporary Deputy Grammar Sheriff.

Though I recognize that "thongs" can refer to certain sandals, it's always nice to get clarification.  :)  After all, my first thought was that he was going to wear his blue leather thong on Friday night and his green satin thong on Saturday night.  (See also "banana hammock," but not if you are at work.)  And I do have female friends who wear thongs (thong-style pants/panties) under their pants (trousers) on a regular basis.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: albireo13 on April 19, 2017, 12:53:08 PM
thongs .. AKA butt-floss
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Livingthedream55 on April 20, 2017, 07:08:31 AM
I dress very casually on occasion and have gotten looks like that on occasion.  No one has ever refused me service though.

On the other hand, having $1M+ in a bank savings account is not very mustachian.
I've pull out large amounts, dressed in a old biker jacket, nary a blink, didn't even ask for photo ID (had a bank card). 
It was going to a cashier's check and I think I had to sign for it.

$1M might be a small fraction of his stuff (cash allocation)?

I think he had $8M with the bank altogether. The manager at the new bank says "first" check:

Quote
"The first check he brought me was for $1 million,"


I got the story via /r/MaliciousCompliance (https://www.reddit.com/r/MaliciousCompliance/comments/633zlj/parking_validation_requires_a_transaction/). I like that version a little better and it has more details.

Quote
Sorry if this is a repeat. I just stumbled across this sub and immediately thought of a story I read in the Spokane Spokesman-Review about 30 years ago. I looked for the original, but could only find this Washington Post article

The original article had many more satisfying details, and it's likely my memory has added some. For example, I remember the parking fee being 50 cents, not 60.

Anyway, weathered looking guy wearing old jeans and a wrinkled shirt had just cashed a check at a downtown Spokane bank. Spokane had paid parking, but you could get your ticket validated at downtown businesses. With enough validation, parking was free.

As he's leaving, he remembers he didn't get his parking stub validated. He gets back in line and asks the teller to validate the stub.

"I'm sorry, sir, we only validate with a transaction."

He explains he was just here and shows her the receipt. She won't budge. He asks to speak to an upper level bank exec by name. "I'm sorry, sir, he's too busy."

He asks for a manger, explains, and again asks for the upper level exec by name. The manager explains that he's in a meeting and that the customer should leave.

The guy says, "If I make a transaction, you'll validate the ticket?" Yep.

"I'd like to close my account."

The teller gets a snarky look and starts complying, only to have her face fall as she pulls up the details. Suddenly, they are all apologetic and go to get the exec he'd asked for.

He's just as firm as they were and insists he wants his account closed. I recall it being around $8 million.

He took the cashiers checks, walked across the street and opened a new account at a competing bank, after getting his parking validated.

The bank changed their policy. They would validate parking sans transaction.



That was epic!!!!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: paddedhat on April 20, 2017, 07:32:47 AM
I dress very casually on occasion and have gotten looks like that on occasion.  No one has ever refused me service though.

On the other hand, having $1M+ in a bank savings account is not very mustachian.

I had an older friend who was worth at least ten million or so, highly educated, and a retired financial industry exec. The other side of the story was that he drove a POS pickup and spent his summers in worn out boat shoes, ragged cargo shorts, and polo shirts that were best used as shop rags. He had contracted for a five figure landscape job with a local firm. He stopped by their retail store just before the big job was to start. He wanted to grab a few supplies. The staff treated him like garbage, the just couldn't be bothered. He paid for his purchases, and dropped by the owner's office to not only report how he was treated, but to inform them that their biggest job of the year, was no more......................... I imagine there was a lot of ass chewing after he pulled away.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Rowellen on April 20, 2017, 06:23:12 PM
Awesome thread and I can't wait to do this with my current job.

I have 2 stories.
Mine is early in my career. I had about 6 months of expenses saved. I had taken a job that was doomed from before I even started. First interview was with manager A and minority owner B. They were great. Job seemed great. Wonderful. Second interview was with B and majority owner C, who I wouldn't be working with directly. I took an instant dislike to C. Red flag 1.

Red flag 2. The job was preparing tax returns, financial statement and quarterly activity statements (BAS) for SMSFs. The BAS was done but the rest was 2 years behind. Holy shit!

Red flag 3. The ATO was sitting in the office performing full audits on two clients. This is not a common thing in a competent accounting firm but I didn't realise it at the time.

Colleagues, A and B were awesome. The work was challenging and enjoyable. How they had any clients left is beyond me but I enjoyed the catchup work. After 3 months, it was announced that B was leaving. That day. Never to be seen again. He was forced out by C for reasons unknown to me. Red flag 4.

I was worried but still had A as a buffer between myself and C so could mostly avoid him. A few months later C asked me how the catch up was going and when I thought we'd be done and I said great. Should be done in about 6 months. Next thing a colleague was let go. Red flag 5. Another colleague was let go not long after but rehired when C realised she was still needed.

A year in and although I loved the job and my colleagues, C made life miserable for everyone. I was stressed. My BF (now DH) was encouraging me to leave.

The final straw came when I clued on the fact that A was leaving. I confronted him and he confirmed it, saying C made him keep it secret. My performance review was due that week. C said nothing about the A situation, but asked me to justify why I should get a pay rise. I was speechless with fury. A was pushing his work into me. I wasn't ready for his role. I had no idea if I was being tricked into doing his job at lower pay or if he was being replaced.

After talking to BF I quit the next day. Turned out A was being replaced. When I met his replacement, I was so glad to have quit. He was another C. I served my notice. Started looking for work on my last day and had another job the next week.

My second story is my DHs and FILs. They worked together as contractors. When they lost a major contact they took on work as employees for another contractor. When FIL's dad died about 6 months later, he refused to allow them a few days off to grieve and arrange the funeral. They quit on the spot.




Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: kelvin on April 27, 2017, 06:05:01 PM
filched from other social media: "one of the most inspiring things i’ve ever seen was my co-worker quitting on the spot over an argument and proceeding to purposely make eye contact with my manager as she walked out of the fire exit, making the entire stores alarm go off. it’s was on a level of spite i can only dream of achieving."
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: EnjoyIt on April 27, 2017, 06:37:42 PM
filched from other social media: "one of the most inspiring things i’ve ever seen was my co-worker quitting on the spot over an argument and proceeding to purposely make eye contact with my manager as she walked out of the fire exit, making the entire stores alarm go off. it’s was on a level of spite i can only dream of achieving."

Seams very appropriate :)
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Zamboni on April 28, 2017, 01:18:31 AM
I now wish my building at work had fire exits! :-)
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Dicey on April 28, 2017, 05:46:11 AM
filched from other social media: "one of the most inspiring things i’ve ever seen was my co-worker quitting on the spot over an argument and proceeding to purposely make eye contact with my manager as she walked out of the fire exit, making the entire stores alarm go off. it’s was on a level of spite i can only dream of achieving."

Seams very appropriate :)
Only if she worked at JoAnn Fabrics ;-P
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: homestead neohio on April 28, 2017, 12:19:22 PM
filched from other social media: "one of the most inspiring things i’ve ever seen was my co-worker quitting on the spot over an argument and proceeding to purposely make eye contact with my manager as she walked out of the fire exit, making the entire stores alarm go off. it’s was on a level of spite i can only dream of achieving."

Seams very appropriate :)
Only if she worked at JoAnn Fabrics ;-P

Your pun has me in stitches.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: solon on April 28, 2017, 12:33:57 PM
filched from other social media: "one of the most inspiring things i’ve ever seen was my co-worker quitting on the spot over an argument and proceeding to purposely make eye contact with my manager as she walked out of the fire exit, making the entire stores alarm go off. it’s was on a level of spite i can only dream of achieving."

Seams very appropriate :)
Only if she worked at JoAnn Fabrics ;-P

Your pun has me in stitches.

If you cross your fingers after surgery you'll heal faster. Or maybe it's just super-stitchin.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: SwordGuy on April 28, 2017, 03:40:39 PM
filched from other social media: "one of the most inspiring things i’ve ever seen was my co-worker quitting on the spot over an argument and proceeding to purposely make eye contact with my manager as she walked out of the fire exit, making the entire stores alarm go off. it’s was on a level of spite i can only dream of achieving."

Seams very appropriate :)
Only if she worked at JoAnn Fabrics ;-P

Your pun has me in stitches.

If you cross your fingers after surgery you'll heal faster. Or maybe it's just super-stitchin.

We're supposed to be polite to one another.  Stop needling people over their mistakes!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: SwordGuy on April 28, 2017, 05:14:09 PM
filched from other social media: "one of the most inspiring things i’ve ever seen was my co-worker quitting on the spot over an argument and proceeding to purposely make eye contact with my manager as she walked out of the fire exit, making the entire stores alarm go off. it’s was on a level of spite i can only dream of achieving."

Seams very appropriate :)
Only if she worked at JoAnn Fabrics ;-P

Your pun has me in stitches.

If you cross your fingers after surgery you'll heal faster. Or maybe it's just super-stitchin.

We're supposed to be polite to one another.  Stop needling people over their mistakes!
And no more puns on this topic or the thread count will get too high.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: G-dog on April 28, 2017, 05:26:59 PM
filched from other social media: "one of the most inspiring things i’ve ever seen was my co-worker quitting on the spot over an argument and proceeding to purposely make eye contact with my manager as she walked out of the fire exit, making the entire stores alarm go off. it’s was on a level of spite i can only dream of achieving."

Seams very appropriate :)
Only if she worked at JoAnn Fabrics ;-P

Your pun has me in stitches.

If you cross your fingers after surgery you'll heal faster. Or maybe it's just super-stitchin.

We're supposed to be polite to one another.  Stop needling people over their mistakes!
And no more puns on this topic or the thread count will get too high.
Time to stop hemming and hawing and get back on topic.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Izybat on May 04, 2017, 06:13:43 PM
Replying mostly to follow, but also to say that I WISH we had FU money at the moment, or as we call it, a Rage Quit Fund.

DH recently left a job at the company we both worked for (I still work there). He got a job with a huge international company that included a 59% pay increase and a sign-on bonus. He's worked there for 5 whole weeks, and it's been crap the entire time. Not enough training, bosses treating him like crap, terrible customers, on and on. He desperately wants to quit, and has had his finger on the resignation button for almost two weeks now.

Unfortunately, we don't have a huge cash cushion to support him leaving. If he quits in less than a year, he'll have to pay back the bonus, including the 40% or so taxes that were taken out (so basically, we'd have to pay out of our small savings to have him quit). But that savings is really the only savings we have to survive for a short time without his paycheck until he finds a new job. I've tried to convince him to stay on at least long enough to save up the money to repay the bonus, but he's not sure he can last that long (it'll take a good couple of months to earn it back, even with the huge raise).

We've been on a huge "pay down the debt" kick for the last two years, and have managed to pay off a ton (probably like $45,000), but the other side of that is that we haven't been saving because I've been shoveling all the extra money towards debt. Situations like this make me really question my financial plan and Dave Ramsey's stupid mini-emergency fund.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: iluvzbeach on May 04, 2017, 08:25:19 PM
Would the company you're with want him to come back bad enough to give him a bonus to come back so he could pay back the sign-on bonus?
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: GilbertB on May 05, 2017, 04:21:06 AM
I think Ramsey recommends to slow down/stop debt payments when you can feel a storm is coming (your case) and put that sum back into the debt only when the storm has passed.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: shelivesthedream on May 05, 2017, 04:52:46 AM
Could he cope better if you both commit to him quitting the very day that he doesn't need to pay back his bonus - exactly one year of crap but no more? You could get a calendar and mark down the days. A year of crap is a lot of crap, but could he do it for all the extra money? Save it all and then maybe book a holiday of some kind or a fancy dinner or tickets for a big concert for right after he quits - give you both something to look forward to, and only takes up a small percent of the extra money. Just don't end up frittering it away during the year because he "deserves" small treats - you'll have one big treat to look forward to. It would be a big sacrifice but it sounds like it would make an enormous difference to your financial position.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: TomTX on May 05, 2017, 05:30:10 AM
There is a middle ground between "putting up with all the crap" and "FU NOW"

How about just acting as if he has FU money? Boss goes on a rant? Just walk out and go do the training. Customer is crap? Don't put up with unreasonable demands. Etc.

Empowering.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: radram on May 05, 2017, 07:34:54 AM
There is a middle ground between "putting up with all the crap" and "FU NOW"

How about just acting as if he has FU money? Boss goes on a rant? Just walk out and go do the training. Customer is crap? Don't put up with unreasonable demands. Etc.

Empowering.

I agree with this approach. I am sure you do not have to pay it back if he gets fired. While I do not advocate trying to get fired, I believe it is very reasonable to take a stand with some of the more crappy parts of the job.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: boarder42 on May 05, 2017, 07:39:59 AM
Replying mostly to follow, but also to say that I WISH we had FU money at the moment, or as we call it, a Rage Quit Fund.

DH recently left a job at the company we both worked for (I still work there). He got a job with a huge international company that included a 59% pay increase and a sign-on bonus. He's worked there for 5 whole weeks, and it's been crap the entire time. Not enough training, bosses treating him like crap, terrible customers, on and on. He desperately wants to quit, and has had his finger on the resignation button for almost two weeks now.

Unfortunately, we don't have a huge cash cushion to support him leaving. If he quits in less than a year, he'll have to pay back the bonus, including the 40% or so taxes that were taken out (so basically, we'd have to pay out of our small savings to have him quit). But that savings is really the only savings we have to survive for a short time without his paycheck until he finds a new job. I've tried to convince him to stay on at least long enough to save up the money to repay the bonus, but he's not sure he can last that long (it'll take a good couple of months to earn it back, even with the huge raise).

We've been on a huge "pay down the debt" kick for the last two years, and have managed to pay off a ton (probably like $45,000), but the other side of that is that we haven't been saving because I've been shoveling all the extra money towards debt. Situations like this make me really question my financial plan and Dave Ramsey's stupid mini-emergency fund.

umm what is the rate of the debt you're paying down?  this is one of the reasons i choose not to pay down low interest debt.  also you make more money investing it.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: RWD on May 05, 2017, 07:51:15 AM
Situations like this make me really question my financial plan and Dave Ramsey's stupid mini-emergency fund.

You're on the MMM forums now, you can (and should) leave the terrible advice of Dave Ramsey behind. Here is a simplified order that you should be prioritizing your extra money (https://i.imgur.com/fb7Dtmh.png) (from /r/personalfinance on reddit). Notice that a 3-6 month emergency fund is before everything else. There is a more advanced order of prioritization on the forums here (https://forum.mrmoneymustache.com/investor-alley/investment-order/msg1333153/#msg1333153). Again, starts with an emergency fund to your satisfaction. And only then paying down high interest debts after that. Your lower interest debts should wait until you have maxed every tax advantaged account available.

I also agree with TomTX. Most jobs can become much less stressful when you just stop caring about what your coworkers and boss think.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: homestead neohio on May 05, 2017, 08:48:14 AM
I also agree with TomTX. Most jobs can become much less stressful when you just stop caring about what your coworkers and boss think.

+1, disengaging is the fastest path to less stress.

It may also increase the amount of respect your husband gets at work. 

I don't know anything about your husband's boss, Izybat, but I worked for a director who loved to walk all over weak people.  I truly believe he was a megalomaniac who enjoyed experimenting on his management team.  He set completely unrealistic expectations and then watched what people did.  Some had nervous breakdowns and/or family/relationship breakdowns, putting in so many hours trying to meet expectation they knew were not possible.  Others did what they could reasonably get done and said "that's what you get because that is what is reasonable."  If you stood up to him, whether out of desperation or not, it was seen as a sign of confidence and strength.  Only after that did he listen to your ideas and feedback about how to improve things.  Only after that would he accept push-back on unrealistic expectations.  For me, I stood up and gained respect, but that was too late to make the job situation tolerable.  I had no respect for him and had been through too much unnecessarily inflicted pain and moved on to a MUCH better situation.

If your husband is ready to walk, he should just start standing up to the nonsense.  There is nothing to lose if he's already prepared to walk.  This also gives you extra time at high earnings to build the Emergency Fund which you know you need.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Dicey on May 05, 2017, 09:29:12 AM
I'd add to all of the awesome advice ^^above^^ something sassy like, "So this is why the last guy left." Or, "I wonder why this [completely unrealistic expectation] wasn't mentioned in the interviews?" They know they're a toxic environment, that's why they have to pay so much to attract new victims talent.
Toss the grenade right back at them.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: CptCool on May 05, 2017, 10:19:00 AM
Replying mostly to follow, but also to say that I WISH we had FU money at the moment, or as we call it, a Rage Quit Fund.

DH recently left a job at the company we both worked for (I still work there). He got a job with a huge international company that included a 59% pay increase and a sign-on bonus. He's worked there for 5 whole weeks, and it's been crap the entire time. Not enough training, bosses treating him like crap, terrible customers, on and on. He desperately wants to quit, and has had his finger on the resignation button for almost two weeks now.

Unfortunately, we don't have a huge cash cushion to support him leaving. If he quits in less than a year, he'll have to pay back the bonus, including the 40% or so taxes that were taken out (so basically, we'd have to pay out of our small savings to have him quit). But that savings is really the only savings we have to survive for a short time without his paycheck until he finds a new job. I've tried to convince him to stay on at least long enough to save up the money to repay the bonus, but he's not sure he can last that long (it'll take a good couple of months to earn it back, even with the huge raise).

We've been on a huge "pay down the debt" kick for the last two years, and have managed to pay off a ton (probably like $45,000), but the other side of that is that we haven't been saving because I've been shoveling all the extra money towards debt. Situations like this make me really question my financial plan and Dave Ramsey's stupid mini-emergency fund.

I just want to make sure you realize that unless explicitly stated in the employment contract, you DON'T have to pay back the company for the taxes on the bonus. The company is trying to make it easier for themselves and pushing the admin, paperwork, and tax filings onto you. The company is acting as an escrow situation for your income taxes. The money they took out for taxes should be refunded in this case. E.g. if the bonus was $10k, but you only received $7k and $3k was withheld for taxes, you should only have to pay back the $7k and the $3k would be removed from the payroll taxes the company pays to the fed gov. If you were told something else, I'd just tell them to pound sand after quitting and giving back the $7k portion.

Note - this only applies if the final paycheck is less than the amount you have to pay back. In the above example, if your final paycheck is $5k, you'd just write a check to the company for $2k
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: TomTX on May 05, 2017, 10:36:10 AM
Replying mostly to follow, but also to say that I WISH we had FU money at the moment, or as we call it, a Rage Quit Fund.

DH recently left a job at the company we both worked for (I still work there). He got a job with a huge international company that included a 59% pay increase and a sign-on bonus. He's worked there for 5 whole weeks, and it's been crap the entire time. Not enough training, bosses treating him like crap, terrible customers, on and on. He desperately wants to quit, and has had his finger on the resignation button for almost two weeks now.

Unfortunately, we don't have a huge cash cushion to support him leaving. If he quits in less than a year, he'll have to pay back the bonus, including the 40% or so taxes that were taken out (so basically, we'd have to pay out of our small savings to have him quit). But that savings is really the only savings we have to survive for a short time without his paycheck until he finds a new job. I've tried to convince him to stay on at least long enough to save up the money to repay the bonus, but he's not sure he can last that long (it'll take a good couple of months to earn it back, even with the huge raise).

We've been on a huge "pay down the debt" kick for the last two years, and have managed to pay off a ton (probably like $45,000), but the other side of that is that we haven't been saving because I've been shoveling all the extra money towards debt. Situations like this make me really question my financial plan and Dave Ramsey's stupid mini-emergency fund.

I just want to make sure you realize that unless explicitly stated in the employment contract, you DON'T have to pay back the company for the taxes on the bonus. The company is trying to make it easier for themselves and pushing the admin, paperwork, and tax filings onto you. The company is acting as an escrow situation for your income taxes. The money they took out for taxes should be refunded in this case. E.g. if the bonus was $10k, but you only received $7k and $3k was withheld for taxes, you should only have to pay back the $7k and the $3k would be removed from the payroll taxes the company pays to the fed gov. If you were told something else, I'd just tell them to pound sand after quitting and giving back the $7k portion.

Note - this only applies if the final paycheck is less than the amount you have to pay back. In the above example, if your final paycheck is $5k, you'd just write a check to the company for $2k

Beyond that, at most pay back a pro rated portion of the $7k. If you were supposed to work a year and worked 5 weeks, that's ~$1000 less (10% of a year, 10% of 10k)
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: SwordGuy on May 05, 2017, 10:39:01 AM
Or just tell the company you'll pay back what you owe (over and above the last paycheck, which they'll keep).  You'll put them in their place in line after your other creditors.  :)
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Trifle on May 05, 2017, 12:32:45 PM
Also -- check your state laws on final paychecks.  Some states do not allow employers to withhold from your final paycheck, even when you clearly owe them the money. They require the employer to set up another repayment method with the employee.  Which could be a pay-it-back-over-time scenario.   
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Izybat on May 05, 2017, 05:36:57 PM
Wow! Thanks for all the great advice.

We did check, and it claimed somewhere (in writing) that they can ask for the entire amount, the full $10,000 in the above example, rather than what we actually got. Not sure if they actually would, just that they can.  And given the current situation I am adjusting my 'get out of debt' expectations into a 'savings now' reality, but it's obviously not instantaneous. We aren't completely savings free as I've been working on my 401K all along, and while I'm not quite at the max contribution level, I'm getting closer. I've been inching it up a few percent every few months to make it less painful. We're also down to our last two debts, which if I continued to pay off at the rate we've been going would be gone in a year or less. However, that pace seems like it will have to slow down with the current situation.

As for his work situation, I know he's already pushed back some, not answering some emails/phone calls that seem unreasonable for instance, so we'll see how it goes. We're also just about to head out for a week vacation, so that makes it even better. We'll both have some time to decompress.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: JLee on May 07, 2017, 12:23:17 PM
Situations like this make me really question my financial plan and Dave Ramsey's stupid mini-emergency fund.

You're on the MMM forums now, you can (and should) leave the terrible advice of Dave Ramsey behind. Here is a simplified order that you should be prioritizing your extra money (https://i.imgur.com/fb7Dtmh.png) (from /r/personalfinance on reddit). Notice that a 3-6 month emergency fund is before everything else. There is a more advanced order of prioritization on the forums here (https://forum.mrmoneymustache.com/investor-alley/investment-order/msg1333153/#msg1333153). Again, starts with an emergency fund to your satisfaction. And only then paying down high interest debts after that. Your lower interest debts should wait until you have maxed every tax advantaged account available.

I also agree with TomTX. Most jobs can become much less stressful when you just stop caring about what your coworkers and boss think.

That reminds me of a day at my last employer when I mentioned I had a flight planned (IIRC it was for a family funeral), and a coworker asked if I already had the time off approved.  I said no, but it didn't really matter because I'd just go anyway.  The stunned look on her face was priceless.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: COEE on May 07, 2017, 06:07:39 PM
I don't think it's epic, but it is a FU story...

A couple Friday's back I got my pink slip due to a RIF of 30% of the company.  My first reaction was to ask my boss for a letter of reference, which he said he'd give me.  Immediately after my boss gave me the pink slip he gave me a contract offering to bring me back on as a independent contractor - doing the same job at the same price as a my previous job.  Sounds awesome, right?  Wrong!  The contract wouldn't cover benefits or half of the FICA!  This ends up being a 30% hit in salary if I want to take any vacation - and puts my unemployment benefits in jeopardy!  Pppft!  What a crappy awful deal that only benefits them!  They knew it - no question in my mind.

Fast forward a few days of my lamenting weather or not to take the contract gig (it is money after all).  I eventually try to negotiate a better hourly rate and a severance that makes up for my potential loss of unemployment benefits.  They don't want me that bad!  Shocker!  NOT!  I tell them that I'd rather continue with the layoff as originally intended. 

I start clearing my things.  And my bosses boss wants to talk to me.  The tool starts giving me a sob story about how he was trying to give me a 'soft landing' and how he had a hard time getting me the contract offer to begin with and how it was a good deal... blah, blah, blah.  I think he was trying to change my mind.  I took a deep breath and thanks to my mustachian/frugal ways I told him something along the lines of, "I don't need this job.  In fact, I have never needed this job since the day I walked in the door.  I came to work because I liked my pay, I liked the work, and I liked *most* of the people, but today I need this job less than the first day I started working here."  I basically told him to shove the job up his ass.  That felt good.  I don't think he believed what I was telling him.

As I walked out the door for the last time, my boss hands me a letter of recommendation.

Unfortunately, two of my coworkers took the contract deal.  They are getting screwed, and I'm not sure they even know it.  I'm guessing they are not in a position where they can tell their boss to shove it up their ass.  So sad.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: TheBuddha on May 07, 2017, 07:17:25 PM
Great story! I could read stuff like this all day long.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Trifle on May 08, 2017, 04:00:44 AM
I don't think it's epic, but it is a FU story...

A couple Friday's back I got my pink slip due to a RIF of 30% of the company.  My first reaction was to ask my boss for a letter of reference, which he said he'd give me.  Immediately after my boss gave me the pink slip he gave me a contract offering to bring me back on as a independent contractor - doing the same job at the same price as a my previous job.  Sounds awesome, right?  Wrong!  The contract wouldn't cover benefits or half of the FICA!  This ends up being a 30% hit in salary if I want to take any vacation - and puts my unemployment benefits in jeopardy!  Pppft!  What a crappy awful deal that only benefits them!  They knew it - no question in my mind.

Fast forward a few days of my lamenting weather or not to take the contract gig (it is money after all).  I eventually try to negotiate a better hourly rate and a severance that makes up for my potential loss of unemployment benefits.  They don't want me that bad!  Shocker!  NOT!  I tell them that I'd rather continue with the layoff as originally intended. 

I start clearing my things.  And my bosses boss wants to talk to me.  The tool starts giving me a sob story about how he was trying to give me a 'soft landing' and how he had a hard time getting me the contract offer to begin with and how it was a good deal... blah, blah, blah.  I think he was trying to change my mind.  I took a deep breath and thanks to my mustachian/frugal ways I told him something along the lines of, "I don't need this job.  In fact, I have never needed this job since the day I walked in the door.  I came to work because I liked my pay, I liked the work, and I liked *most* of the people, but today I need this job less than the first day I started working here."  I basically told him to shove the job up his ass.  That felt good.  I don't think he believed what I was telling him.

As I walked out the door for the last time, my boss hands me a letter of recommendation.

Unfortunately, two of my coworkers took the contract deal.  They are getting screwed, and I'm not sure they even know it.  I'm guessing they are not in a position where they can tell their boss to shove it up their ass.  So sad.

Good on you COEE!  (And -- if you feel like it -- you could let the DOL know what they are up to . . . )
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Pooperman on May 08, 2017, 04:36:29 AM
Good on you COEE!  (And -- if you feel like it -- you could let the DOL know what they are up to . . . )

Exactly what I was thinking. I'd have been tempted to accept their offer and immediately report to the DOL. What's the worst they can do, fire you...again and get completely screwed by the DOL?
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: bunchbikes on May 08, 2017, 06:01:32 AM
That reminds me of a day at my last employer when I mentioned I had a flight planned (IIRC it was for a family funeral), and a coworker asked if I already had the time off approved.  I said no, but it didn't really matter because I'd just go anyway.  The stunned look on her face was priceless.

When I was a teacher, school policy was no approved absences before/after a holiday break.

I requested to be off Wednesday before the week of thanksgiving, for my brother's wedding.

Principal denied. I told her "I acknowledge that you denied the request, however, I'm letting you know, that I will not be here, and that a sub will be in my place".

I got a note "in my file", and the matter was never brought up again. No consequences whatsoever. I think Principal was secretly cool with it, just couldn't say so, because she'd already denied a dozen other teacher absence requests for that same week.

I was definitely at FU stage, and the job was pretty stress-free, when I stopped playing by all the dumb rules.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: COEE on May 08, 2017, 12:26:42 PM
Good on you COEE!  (And -- if you feel like it -- you could let the DOL know what they are up to . . . )

Exactly what I was thinking. I'd have been tempted to accept their offer and immediately report to the DOL. What's the worst they can do, fire you...again and get completely screwed by the DOL?

Why do you think I agonized about what whether or not to take the contract work? 

Also, Let's just say I don't think the fat lady has finished singing.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Trifle on May 08, 2017, 03:58:18 PM
Good on you COEE!  (And -- if you feel like it -- you could let the DOL know what they are up to . . . )

Exactly what I was thinking. I'd have been tempted to accept their offer and immediately report to the DOL. What's the worst they can do, fire you...again and get completely screwed by the DOL?

Why do you think I agonized about what whether or not to take the contract work? 

Also, Let's just say I don't think the fat lady has finished singing.

:)

One thing about DOL audits -- they come in to look at one thing, and often end up seeing other issues too.  Some common ones: 

--  Misclassifying employees as salaried/exempt from overtime (when really they are hourly/non-exempt).  The definitions are NOT straightforward/intuitive, and this type of misclassification happens all the time. 

--  Failure to pay overtime to people who were due it.  Say the employer had someone misclassified as exempt for years, but the employee was consistently working over 40 hours a week.  The DOL goes back and makes the employer fork over the time-and-a-half for the whole time the employee was misclassified (up to two or three years), plus fines

-- There are some new federal minimum salaries for many exempt employees (~$47k) and some employers don't know about it, or just aren't complying 
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: nawhite on May 08, 2017, 04:42:14 PM
-- There are some new federal minimum salaries for many exempt employees (~$47k) and some employers don't know about it, or just aren't complying

Wait, so if you make less than ~$47k/year, your employer probably needs to make you hourly and pay overtime?
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Smokystache on May 08, 2017, 04:50:32 PM
-- There are some new federal minimum salaries for many exempt employees (~$47k) and some employers don't know about it, or just aren't complying

Wait, so if you make less than ~$47k/year, your employer probably needs to make you hourly and pay overtime?

If we're all talking about the same thing, that got blocked just before it was supposed to take effect:
http://www.nbcnews.com/politics/barack-obama/obama-s-plan-extend-overtime-pay-blocked-federal-court-n687541 (http://www.nbcnews.com/politics/barack-obama/obama-s-plan-extend-overtime-pay-blocked-federal-court-n687541)
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Trifle on May 08, 2017, 05:04:53 PM
-- There are some new federal minimum salaries for many exempt employees (~$47k) and some employers don't know about it, or just aren't complying

Wait, so if you make less than ~$47k/year, your employer probably needs to make you hourly and pay overtime?

Oops.  Spoke too soon. A federal lawsuit has it on hold right now.  www.shrm.org/resourcesandtools/legal-and-compliance/employment-law/pages/flsa-overtime-rule-resources.aspx

And yes -- you've got it.  For many jobs (but not sales or computer programmers), under this new regulation if you earn less than $47k then the employer has to pay you OT.  So if/when this goes through the employer has to choose between raising salaries to that level or paying OT. 

My employer had gone ahead and made the changes (gave some people raises and reclassified others as hourly) before the lawsuit  hit.   Interesting!  I suppose with the new administration anything is possible now. The new rules could go through as is, die, or be modified. 
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: JLee on May 08, 2017, 05:41:08 PM
Good on you COEE!  (And -- if you feel like it -- you could let the DOL know what they are up to . . . )

Exactly what I was thinking. I'd have been tempted to accept their offer and immediately report to the DOL. What's the worst they can do, fire you...again and get completely screwed by the DOL?

Why do you think I agonized about what whether or not to take the contract work? 

Also, Let's just say I don't think the fat lady has finished singing.

:)

One thing about DOL audits -- they come in to look at one thing, and often end up seeing other issues too.  Some common ones: 

--  Misclassifying employees as salaried/exempt from overtime (when really they are hourly/non-exempt).  The definitions are NOT straightforward/intuitive, and this type of misclassification happens all the time. 

--  Failure to pay overtime to people who were due it.  Say the employer had someone misclassified as exempt for years, but the employee was consistently working over 40 hours a week.  The DOL goes back and makes the employer fork over the time-and-a-half for the whole time the employee was misclassified (up to two or three years), plus fines

-- There are some new federal minimum salaries for many exempt employees (~$47k) and some employers don't know about it, or just aren't complying

My former employer is getting sued right now for this exact situation.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: ducky19 on May 11, 2017, 11:19:03 AM
Having a really shitty day at work right now... would love to hear some more stories if anyone has one!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: MNBen on May 11, 2017, 12:28:31 PM
Having a really shitty day at work right now... would love to hear some more stories if anyone has one!

Only because you need it, as I don't think it's super EPIC, but I do like telling it....

Background:  I had a job where I could not stand the boss and it only peaked at the end and I did end up walking out one day and taking the entire summer off before looking for a new job.  I actually didn't know what FU money was, or even FIRE, but knew I was 'different' than the rest and had no issues taking a summer off working on fixing up a home I had just purchased in bankruptcy to start renting.

Also he was actually pretty easy to work around because he was spineless and mostly left me alone, but he was so incompetent it was still tough when he'd get an idea in his head and insist he was right.  And I loved the team I had trained myself and they were some of my favorite workers of any job.   It was also an IT job, I was their lead, and we helped support a warehouse, and the warehouse staff was absolutely amazing!  So I really enjoyed the job, except for the boss.

Story:  So many (too many) years before I eventually walked out, and I was pretty much a one-man team, there was a day when my boss stopped by and told me he was buying me a company cell phone to be carried in case an emergency came up after hours.   This was probably around 2005 when most people had cells phones, but I was a late adapter as I truly didn't need one.

Because I knew that the product I supported was pretty stable and I should seldom need a phone call, I told him I'd agree to carry a cell phone as long as he drafted up rules for when they could call me and what had to wait until the next day.  He agreed.

A few weeks later a cell phone box showed up at my desk.  I tossed it in a drawer and left it there. 

About six months later he stops by and mentions accounting is checking the cell phone bills and there has been zero activity on this number and he shows me the bill with what I guess is my cell's phone number.   

I reach down and pull out the box still sitting in my drawer and ask him if this is that phone.  He asks me why I'm not using it.  I told him I said I'd use it when he drafted up rules for when they could and couldn't call me. 

Needless to say there were rules drafted later that day, but still it made for a great story that still makes me laugh today!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: zolotiyeruki on May 11, 2017, 01:09:00 PM
Quote
About six months later he stops by and mentions accounting is checking the cell phone bills and there has been zero activity on this number and he shows me the bill with what I guess is my cell's phone number.   

I reach down and pull out the box still sitting in my drawer and ask him if this is that phone.  He asks me why I'm not using it.  I told him I said I'd use it when he drafted up rules for when they could and couldn't call me. 

Needless to say there were rules drafted later that day, but still it made for a great story that still makes me laugh today!
  That's a brilliant story!  Thanks for sharing!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Guesl982374 on May 11, 2017, 01:34:54 PM
Having a really shitty day at work right now... would love to hear some more stories if anyone has one!

I'll give you one too. This one might even help you out...

A few months back my direct manager mentioned to me that he wanted me to take on a Really Shitty Responsibility (RSR) on top of my current work load. I've watched this specific RSR make three of my peers leave the company/leave the work group. I obviously wanted nothing to do with this RSR and it looked like I didn't really have a choice. I had pre-aligned with my DW that I'd leave the company if I got RSR. Before he had the change to formally give me the RSR, I had a conversation with the executive sponsor (ES) on the company's largest project which I am working on and kinda-sorta dotted line report to him. I told the ES that I was getting the RSR and that while I really enjoyed working on the large project and at the company, I probably wouldn't last at the company for very long after I got the RSR. He had personally saw what the RSR did to two out of the three other peers and understood completely.

Within a week, ES went to the CEO of the company and stated that one of his major project risks was needing to keep me focused on the large project. The CEO gave direction to my direct management to NOT give me the RSR. To this day my manager hasn't a clue that I influenced the ES to make this happen.

Morals of the story:
-Don't be afraid to walk away from a job once you have a level of FU money.
-There is typically someone around you in the organization that has interests that align with yours, learn to leverage them.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Zamboni on May 11, 2017, 07:10:38 PM
^I used to call that kind of stuff poison pumpkins (after the Pumpkin Plan book, which I haven't read, but I get the idea from the quick summary provided by my brother.) Now I'm going to start calling them RSR's.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: gerardc on May 11, 2017, 09:47:33 PM
^I used to call that kind of stuff poison pumpkins (after the Pumpkin Plan book, which I haven't read, but I get the idea from the quick summary provided by my brother.) Now I'm going to start calling them RSR's.

What would be examples of RSR so shitty as to make your job miserable?
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Trifle on May 12, 2017, 05:22:06 AM
^I used to call that kind of stuff poison pumpkins (after the Pumpkin Plan book, which I haven't read, but I get the idea from the quick summary provided by my brother.) Now I'm going to start calling them RSR's.

What would be examples of RSR so shitty as to make your job miserable?

Not sure if this was what Liberty had in mind by a RSR, but -- at my workplace there is this one division that is notorious for chewing through senior managers. No one lasts.  The middle managers and line employees in this Shitty Division have a reputation for being a tough bunch -- I've heard the words "sneaky" and "backstabbers" used before.   Guess what? Yesterday the senior manager for Shitty Division resigned.  And guess what?   There are discussions of yours truly being given this RSR.   I am thinking hard about how to respond to this.   On the one hand, I am only two years from FIRE.  On the other hand, I really like my current job and had no intentions of spending my last couple of years stressed out.   More to come, I am sure.   
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Guesl982374 on May 12, 2017, 06:56:57 AM
^I used to call that kind of stuff poison pumpkins (after the Pumpkin Plan book, which I haven't read, but I get the idea from the quick summary provided by my brother.) Now I'm going to start calling them RSR's.

What would be examples of RSR so shitty as to make your job miserable?

In this case, my past peers were given the responsibility of a certain area, but not allows to make any decisions regarding that area (e.g. you are held responsible for the mistakes of your leadership). My past peers were regularly cut out of meetings/discussions with both internal and with external stakeholders, even when they demanded to be a part of them, and then they were reprimanded when things went wrong from the decisions made in that meeting. It's a complete scapegoat position with really low level work for my (and my peers) level.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: BlueHouse on May 12, 2017, 07:33:31 AM
Quote
About six months later he stops by and mentions accounting is checking the cell phone bills and there has been zero activity on this number and he shows me the bill with what I guess is my cell's phone number.   

I reach down and pull out the box still sitting in my drawer and ask him if this is that phone.  He asks me why I'm not using it.  I told him I said I'd use it when he drafted up rules for when they could and couldn't call me. 

Needless to say there were rules drafted later that day, but still it made for a great story that still makes me laugh today!
  That's a brilliant story!  Thanks for sharing!
love this!  It's even better than an FU story. It's a "noBS" story.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Reynold on May 12, 2017, 09:17:44 AM
A couple Friday's back I got my pink slip due to a RIF of 30% of the company.  My first reaction was to ask my boss for a letter of reference, which he said he'd give me.  Immediately after my boss gave me the pink slip he gave me a contract offering to bring me back on as a independent contractor - doing the same job at the same price as a my previous job. 

[snip]

Unfortunately, two of my coworkers took the contract deal.  They are getting screwed, and I'm not sure they even know it.  I'm guessing they are not in a position where they can tell their boss to shove it up their ass.  So sad.

Reminds me of a situation with a friend of mine.  He worked at an emergency notification service, the kind of place that sets up calls to surrounding areas if a nuke plant is melting down or something.  It involved rotating shift work in programming/monitoring the systems, with weekends where you couldn't go more than 15 minutes response time from work.  Most people didn't last there, so he was senior, and usually training one or two others for the other spots at any one time. 

A new outfit bought the company, and laid everyone off, wanting to make them contract employees instead.  He basically looked at the contract, which as in your example didn't include any raise, and said "I'm not willing to take the liability risk for emergency notifications as a contract employee." so he left.  He had mentioned in another context that he had several years of living expenses saved up, so that let him spend 6 months or so job hunting to find something in his somewhat specialized field in a smaller city without having to worry about it.  He now doesn't have to do rotating shifts or weekends. 
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Zamboni on May 12, 2017, 03:56:33 PM
It's clear that some management has the viewpoint that there is always someone else willing to step in and fill the job, so why keep current employees (even top performers) happy? This is a terrible business philosophy, of course, but I see it more and more.

There is tremendous beauty in reaching a point where you just don't have to put up with any BS at work. I haven't had to quit a job over it yet, but I've done things recently like just decide to take 3 days off in the middle of the week to avoid looming BS. Of course, I make an effort not to inconvenience others with my whims, but staying home to chill with the dog really is as simple as turning on my email's "out of office" autoreply. The last time I had a boss who declared that she needed to give "approval" for any of my time off, I would just call in sick instead.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: BlueHouse on May 12, 2017, 04:15:44 PM
It's clear that some management has the viewpoint that there is always someone else willing to step in and fill the job, so why keep current employees (even top performers) happy? This is a terrible business philosophy, of course, but I see it more and more.

I agree, there is some of that element.  At the other end of the spectrum, there are others that will keep someone around who does little or nothing, because finding someone to replace that person is too much trouble.  Neither is good!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Rowellen on May 12, 2017, 07:24:05 PM
The last time I had a boss who declared that she needed to give "approval" for any of my time off, I would just call in sick instead.

My boss was a complete jerk about my having a random day off on the school holidays. I had spent a small fortune on tickets for a musical for all of us (4). He wasn't going to approve my leave. The office manager convinced him to allow it as I already had the tickets. Apparently I was taking advantage of him. I decided then that any random days off I need, I'll be calling in sick. No one will be put out by my not being there. Maybe someone might have to take a message but seriously, i get maybe one phone call a month if I'm lucky. I work via email. My work is not generally time sensitive. The only reason for him to be like this is that he's a control freak.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: nnls on May 12, 2017, 07:52:52 PM

My boss was a complete jerk about my having a random day off on the school holidays. I had spent a small fortune on tickets for a musical for all of us (4). He wasn't going to approve my leave. The office manager convinced him to allow it as I already had the tickets. Apparently I was taking advantage of him. I decided then that any random days off I need, I'll be calling in sick. No one will be put out by my not being there. Maybe someone might have to take a message but seriously, i get maybe one phone call a month if I'm lucky. I work via email. My work is not generally time sensitive. The only reason for him to be like this is that he's a control freak.

The last time I had a boss who declared that she needed to give "approval" for any of my time off, I would just call in sick instead.


In the USA is sick leave and annual leave come out of the same days off? Like you just get four weeks off per year and can use it how ever you want?

I don't know how to word my question properly, but in Australia for example you get a minimum four weeks annual leave and two weeks sick/carers leave, they aren't really interchangeable though. Though if you run out of sick leave you can sometimes use your annual leave for it.

But at every place I have worked, annual leave needs permission, sick leave is what you would just call in and take off as required.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: tiger002 on May 12, 2017, 08:50:30 PM

My boss was a complete jerk about my having a random day off on the school holidays. I had spent a small fortune on tickets for a musical for all of us (4). He wasn't going to approve my leave. The office manager convinced him to allow it as I already had the tickets. Apparently I was taking advantage of him. I decided then that any random days off I need, I'll be calling in sick. No one will be put out by my not being there. Maybe someone might have to take a message but seriously, i get maybe one phone call a month if I'm lucky. I work via email. My work is not generally time sensitive. The only reason for him to be like this is that he's a control freak.

The last time I had a boss who declared that she needed to give "approval" for any of my time off, I would just call in sick instead.


In the USA is sick leave and annual leave come out of the same days off? Like you just get four weeks off per year and can use it how ever you want?

I don't know how to word my question properly, but in Australia for example you get a minimum four weeks annual leave and two weeks sick/carers leave, they aren't really interchangeable though. Though if you run out of sick leave you can sometimes use your annual leave for it.

But at every place I have worked, annual leave needs permission, sick leave is what you would just call in and take off as required.

It depends on the job. Some places have separate sick and annual leave pools while others combine them into PTO.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: nnls on May 12, 2017, 08:55:14 PM

My boss was a complete jerk about my having a random day off on the school holidays. I had spent a small fortune on tickets for a musical for all of us (4). He wasn't going to approve my leave. The office manager convinced him to allow it as I already had the tickets. Apparently I was taking advantage of him. I decided then that any random days off I need, I'll be calling in sick. No one will be put out by my not being there. Maybe someone might have to take a message but seriously, i get maybe one phone call a month if I'm lucky. I work via email. My work is not generally time sensitive. The only reason for him to be like this is that he's a control freak.

The last time I had a boss who declared that she needed to give "approval" for any of my time off, I would just call in sick instead.


In the USA is sick leave and annual leave come out of the same days off? Like you just get four weeks off per year and can use it how ever you want?

I don't know how to word my question properly, but in Australia for example you get a minimum four weeks annual leave and two weeks sick/carers leave, they aren't really interchangeable though. Though if you run out of sick leave you can sometimes use your annual leave for it.

But at every place I have worked, annual leave needs permission, sick leave is what you would just call in and take off as required.

It depends on the job. Some places have separate sick and annual leave pools while others combine them into PTO.

PTO?
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: NoVa on May 12, 2017, 09:01:28 PM
Paid Time Off. They pool the sick leave and vacation together. Usually it is a bit less than the sum would have been.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: nnls on May 12, 2017, 09:05:21 PM
Paid Time Off. They pool the sick leave and vacation together. Usually it is a bit less than the sum would have been.

Oh ok makes sense.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: With This Herring on May 12, 2017, 10:32:19 PM
^I used to call that kind of stuff poison pumpkins (after the Pumpkin Plan book, which I haven't read, but I get the idea from the quick summary provided by my brother.) Now I'm going to start calling them RSR's.

What would be examples of RSR so shitty as to make your job miserable?

At OldFirm, there was a particular huge client that was a disastrous combination of minimum bookkeeping ability, complex company structure, lender interest in financials, and crushing deadlines.  Said client had issues year-round.  Additionally, client was a significant portion of OldFirm's billing, enough so that one person would be assigned to work primarily on client.  I was not that person.  That person ended up crushed by the incessant demands of client and rapidly multiplying financials when client's lending needs increased.  That person ended up working Tax Season-type hours for months and months extra during the year, when none of the rest of OldFirm faced similar time commitments.  That person ended up never taking anywhere near all vacation time permitted (with no rollovers or payouts of unused time), taking client calls while on vacation, missing out on chances for more varied work, and seriously falling behind in necessary professional development.  I saw two that-persons quickly come and go during my time there, and the third was in the middle of burning out when I left.  When the number of financials per year kept multiplying to the point where it looked like I was going to be a second person on that client, that was one of the things that pushed me to leave.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: MrMoogle on May 17, 2017, 10:50:56 AM
Paid Time Off. They pool the sick leave and vacation together. Usually it is a bit less than the sum would have been.

Oh ok makes sense.
It definitely depends on the industry.  My mom works at a hospital, for sick leave you practically need a doctor's note.  Vacation and holidays you need advance approval.

I'm an engineer, I get PPL (paid personal leave, which is just another name for PTO), and as long as I get my work done, I can take PPL whenever I want with little to no notice.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Dicey on May 17, 2017, 11:39:02 AM
Paid Time Off. They pool the sick leave and vacation together. Usually it is a bit less than the sum would have been.

Oh ok makes sense.
It definitely depends on the industry.  My mom works at a hospital, for sick leave you practically need a doctor's note.  Vacation and holidays you need advance approval.

I'm an engineer, I get PPL (paid personal leave, which is just another name for PTO), and as long as I get my work done, I can take PPL whenever I want with little to no notice.
That's one of the reasons DH is still working. He earns 2.7 vacation days per month. A typical month is 18 working days. Overtime is completely optional; he only takes it when he needs it to complete a specific project. He takes his compensation in PTO/Comp Time. He recently did a project which required two non-consecutive weekend days. He netted a week of PTO for his efforts. He's never called in sick in his career, thanks to PTO. Sick days accrue until retirement. They don't pay it out, exactly. Once you declare retirement, you can stop working and start using up your sick days, getting paid at your current rate. This allows you to continue to stay on the company health plan, avoid a lump-sum payout, and unbelievably, continue to accrue vacation hours. Amaze-balls!

His sweet spot of age/years of service will hit in about three years. He will be able to stop working nearly a year before that. Since he loves his job, and we can't travel now anyway, because his mom and her pal, Al Z, live with us, he might as well keep working until we can enjoy a little more control over our lives.

In my working days, I earned a little more than he did , but he has far better benefits, including a defined benefit pension plan and nearly free healthcare.

Sorry if this veered a little off topic, but we have plenty of FU money available to deploy. I keep hoping he'll decide to say "Fuck it" and pull the plug sooner, but he'd go nuts if we were stuck at home.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: fattest_foot on May 17, 2017, 11:39:59 AM
My boss was a complete jerk about my having a random day off on the school holidays. I had spent a small fortune on tickets for a musical for all of us (4). He wasn't going to approve my leave. The office manager convinced him to allow it as I already had the tickets. Apparently I was taking advantage of him. I decided then that any random days off I need, I'll be calling in sick. No one will be put out by my not being there. Maybe someone might have to take a message but seriously, i get maybe one phone call a month if I'm lucky. I work via email. My work is not generally time sensitive. The only reason for him to be like this is that he's a control freak.

This kind of reminds me of a couple years ago where I had to take my dog to the vet so I used sick leave.

I was honest about it, and said that was the reason, and my supervisor threw a fit about how I couldn't use sick leave for that purpose. Had I just not said anything though, she would have been none the wiser and approved it.

So now I just keep my mouth shut. In fact, in general, I've learned that in the workplace it's probably best not to be forthcoming with personal information.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: mtn on May 17, 2017, 12:15:16 PM
My boss was a complete jerk about my having a random day off on the school holidays. I had spent a small fortune on tickets for a musical for all of us (4). He wasn't going to approve my leave. The office manager convinced him to allow it as I already had the tickets. Apparently I was taking advantage of him. I decided then that any random days off I need, I'll be calling in sick. No one will be put out by my not being there. Maybe someone might have to take a message but seriously, i get maybe one phone call a month if I'm lucky. I work via email. My work is not generally time sensitive. The only reason for him to be like this is that he's a control freak.

This kind of reminds me of a couple years ago where I had to take my dog to the vet so I used sick leave.

I was honest about it, and said that was the reason, and my supervisor threw a fit about how I couldn't use sick leave for that purpose. Had I just not said anything though, she would have been none the wiser and approved it.

So now I just keep my mouth shut. In fact, in general, I've learned that in the workplace it's probably best not to be forthcoming with personal information.

"Not feeling good"

I didn't say I'm not feeling good because I'm feeling bad about my dog. I just said I'm not feeling good. Not a lie!

My boss mentioned that he took a mental health day the other day. Made me feel good about it. I've done it once before at this company--not because I was sick or stressed or needed a day away, I had just slept terribly and didn't want to go in. I wouldn't have been an asset that day anyways.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: PhrugalPhan on May 17, 2017, 12:29:11 PM
This kind of reminds me of a couple years ago where I had to take my dog to the vet so I used sick leave.

I was honest about it, and said that was the reason, and my supervisor threw a fit about how I couldn't use sick leave for that purpose. Had I just not said anything though, she would have been none the wiser and approved it.

So now I just keep my mouth shut. In fact, in general, I've learned that in the workplace it's probably best not to be forthcoming with personal information.
Employers can be crazy on the "rules".  Where I work they allow you to donate sick leave to other workers (as well you can use it to take care of family members).  So about 6 years ago my co-worker buddy "R" was going to get surgery where he couldn't drive and would need therapy multiple times a week.   So I was going to pick him up on the way to work, and then leave an hour early on therapy days to drop him off at the therapist (his wife would pick him up later). 

So I apply to donate sick time for the days I would be leaving work early to take him to therapy.  Sorry, no can do, that's not allowed.  You can donate sick leave, but you can't use sick leave to help a co-worker.  After being in a meeting with my buddy and some higher ups apologizing and saying they would look into what else could be done, I finally say forget it I will just use my annual leave on the days I leave early for him.   Afterwards R comes up to me and looks worried about what I said in the meeting.  I tell him not to worry about it, if I feel the need, I will just call in sick on a day I want to take off, and everything will be the same in the end, except now they can feel great about following the rules.

So yeah, I have learned to be quiet in certain situations.  It doesn't help anything when they are crazy about the rules.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Dicey on May 17, 2017, 12:39:30 PM
^Good for you!^ I hope your friend is fine now.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: BlueHouse on May 17, 2017, 12:43:13 PM
This kind of reminds me of a couple years ago where I had to take my dog to the vet so I used sick leave.

I was honest about it, and said that was the reason, and my supervisor threw a fit about how I couldn't use sick leave for that purpose. Had I just not said anything though, she would have been none the wiser and approved it.

So now I just keep my mouth shut. In fact, in general, I've learned that in the workplace it's probably best not to be forthcoming with personal information.
Employers can be crazy on the "rules".  Where I work they allow you to donate sick leave to other workers (as well you can use it to take care of family members).  So about 6 years ago my co-worker buddy "R" was going to get surgery where he couldn't drive and would need therapy multiple times a week.   So I was going to pick him up on the way to work, and then leave an hour early on therapy days to drop him off at the therapist (his wife would pick him up later). 

So I apply to donate sick time for the days I would be leaving work early to take him to therapy.  Sorry, no can do, that's not allowed.  You can donate sick leave, but you can't use sick leave to help a co-worker.  After being in a meeting with my buddy and some higher ups apologizing and saying they would look into what else could be done, I finally say forget it I will just use my annual leave on the days I leave early for him.   Afterwards R comes up to me and looks worried about what I said in the meeting.  I tell him not to worry about it, if I feel the need, I will just call in sick on a day I want to take off, and everything will be the same in the end, except now they can feel great about following the rules.

So yeah, I have learned to be quiet in certain situations.  It doesn't help anything when they are crazy about the rules.
It took me a really long time to stop trying to "fix" what's broken in places like this and just do my own thing and keep quiet about it. 
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: mm1970 on May 17, 2017, 04:42:06 PM
This kind of reminds me of a couple years ago where I had to take my dog to the vet so I used sick leave.

I was honest about it, and said that was the reason, and my supervisor threw a fit about how I couldn't use sick leave for that purpose. Had I just not said anything though, she would have been none the wiser and approved it.

So now I just keep my mouth shut. In fact, in general, I've learned that in the workplace it's probably best not to be forthcoming with personal information.
Employers can be crazy on the "rules".  Where I work they allow you to donate sick leave to other workers (as well you can use it to take care of family members).  So about 6 years ago my co-worker buddy "R" was going to get surgery where he couldn't drive and would need therapy multiple times a week.   So I was going to pick him up on the way to work, and then leave an hour early on therapy days to drop him off at the therapist (his wife would pick him up later). 

So I apply to donate sick time for the days I would be leaving work early to take him to therapy.  Sorry, no can do, that's not allowed.  You can donate sick leave, but you can't use sick leave to help a co-worker.  After being in a meeting with my buddy and some higher ups apologizing and saying they would look into what else could be done, I finally say forget it I will just use my annual leave on the days I leave early for him.   Afterwards R comes up to me and looks worried about what I said in the meeting.  I tell him not to worry about it, if I feel the need, I will just call in sick on a day I want to take off, and everything will be the same in the end, except now they can feel great about following the rules.

So yeah, I have learned to be quiet in certain situations.  It doesn't help anything when they are crazy about the rules.
It took me a really long time to stop trying to "fix" what's broken in places like this and just do my own thing and keep quiet about it.
Yes.  I'm exempt.  At a job long ago and far away, I worked long hours.  And if I needed to leave early, or go to the doctor, I didn't take vacation or sick time ... why would I?  Back then, I easily worked 45-47 hours a week.  Our time card system (because we charged to contracts) was online.  It only cared if the total was 80 in 2 weeks.  Back then, sick time was separate, and unlimited.

I had coworkers whose bosses were sticklers.  As in, they would require their employees to take vacation if they left 2 hours early on a Friday.  Now mind you, these same coworkers would still have 95 hours of work on the books for the 2 weeks.  I simply said "just fill in what you worked and submit".  "But when I asked my boss, he said..."  Oh hon, that's your problem.  Don't ask, just do.  The computer doesn't care where the hours come from.  Is it more than 80?  Does your boss REALLY look to see that each day is >8, or does he see 95 and hit submit?

Took several years before they finally pulled the trigger and stopped taking an hour or two of vacation.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: GreenSheep on May 18, 2017, 11:26:20 AM
So now I just keep my mouth shut. In fact, in general, I've learned that in the workplace it's probably best not to be forthcoming with personal information.

This is so true. The more you tell people, the more ammunition they have against you, even if you've done nothing wrong. It's amazing how people twist things for their own benefit or just because their favorite pastime is Being Offended.

It's also helpful to keep your mouth shut if you want to look really smart. I have a friend who's a neurosurgeon who thinks I'm super smart simply because when we were in school together, I only spoke up if I was 100% sure I knew the right answer, while other people just blurted out whatever came to mind for every question.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: scottish on May 18, 2017, 03:35:29 PM
So now I just keep my mouth shut. In fact, in general, I've learned that in the workplace it's probably best not to be forthcoming with personal information.

This is so true. The more you tell people, the more ammunition they have against you, even if you've done nothing wrong. It's amazing how people twist things for their own benefit or just because their favorite pastime is Being Offended.

It's also helpful to keep your mouth shut if you want to look really smart. I have a friend who's a neurosurgeon who thinks I'm super smart simply because when we were in school together, I only spoke up if I was 100% sure I knew the right answer, while other people just blurted out whatever came to mind for every question.

This.   Better to look calm and remain silent until you have something to say that will have a meaningful impact.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Nudelkopf on May 18, 2017, 11:51:15 PM
Meh, I have zero qualms about calling in sick. As a teacher we don't get to choose when to have annual leave, so if something comes up during term, I just call and say, "I'm not coming in today. I'm using sick leave." It's not like they're gonna ask for proof.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: tickledginger on May 23, 2017, 09:36:12 AM
I'd been holding off on posting to this thread, dreaming of the day where I could tell my own epic FU story. Now, of course, the tale is over - but I can't share details for privacy reasons!

Essentially, we're yet another successful tale of how that FU money supports freedom. My spouse has been holding down a survival job for years that has slowly tipped over from useful and supportive to an absolute nightmare. Spouse, despite his training and desire to pursue his artisic dreams, has an incredible work ethic and just. would. not. leave. There were all sorts of justifications - the health insurance, the other benefits, his retirement fund...all of which really were representing his fear that he didn't deserve a better job. It took almost a year, but I finally convinced him that this job was detrimental to his health and our marriage. I even used language from this thread, telling him that yes, eventually he'd have to have a job, but he didn't have to have THIS job! We set a FU fund goal and set a timeline, after which he had to leave this employer...if not for him, for my sanity! (I was going to grad school full time and working full time. It's been a serious couple of years.) And right after I submitted my thesis, he did it!

Our happy ending(ish - we're still adjusting to our new world, so it's not an ending) is that the FU fund gave him the confidence to leave and even negotiate favorable terms. Knowing that he could just walk away was so empowering, and has also jumpstarted his creative pursuits. He's got an opportunity to think and breathe for the first time in almost fifteen years, and I can already see the improvement in his mental and physical health. Our marriage is stronger. I'm about to graduate, and it feels like we have possibilities and are in charge of our future. Thanks to planning and frugality and that crucial FU fund, we are able to focus on the things that really matter...and one day, I look forward to sharing this story with glorious details!

I remain grateful to this thread for the inspiration. Thanks, all!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Laura33 on May 23, 2017, 10:06:50 AM
. . . .

Congratulations!  Wow, what a relief for you! 

I will have to tell my DH that he has done good in this world and his words will live on after him.  :-)
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: runewell on May 23, 2017, 10:48:05 AM

This kind of reminds me of a couple years ago where I had to take my dog to the vet so I used sick leave.

I was honest about it, and said that was the reason, and my supervisor threw a fit about how I couldn't use sick leave for that purpose. Had I just not said anything though, she would have been none the wiser and approved it.

So now I just keep my mouth shut. In fact, in general, I've learned that in the workplace it's probably best not to be forthcoming with personal information.

Sick leave probably has a specific definition of what it is intended for.  If taking your animal to the vet does not fall under the definition, then you should not have done what you did. 
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: NESailor on May 23, 2017, 11:28:21 AM

This kind of reminds me of a couple years ago where I had to take my dog to the vet so I used sick leave.

I was honest about it, and said that was the reason, and my supervisor threw a fit about how I couldn't use sick leave for that purpose. Had I just not said anything though, she would have been none the wiser and approved it.

So now I just keep my mouth shut. In fact, in general, I've learned that in the workplace it's probably best not to be forthcoming with personal information.


Sick leave probably has a specific definition of what it is intended for.  If taking your animal to the vet does not fall under the definition, then you should not have done what you did.

Hahaha, exactly.  Look, you even get reprimanded on an Internet forum when you don't ;).  I had an HR colleague tell me one thing that's stuck with me since then: "when you need to go, you tell, not ask"   And it's a rule I follow to this day.  Fortunately, for a salaried finance professional this is not a big deal.  Work gets done on time and in acceptable quality so when I need time for whatever, I just take it.  If I'm really gone out of town for fun I'll make that "vacation".
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Guesl982374 on May 23, 2017, 01:22:49 PM
Having a really shitty day at work right now... would love to hear some more stories if anyone has one!

I'll give you one too. This one might even help you out...

A few months back my direct manager mentioned to me that he wanted me to take on a Really Shitty Responsibility (RSR) on top of my current work load. I've watched this specific RSR make three of my peers leave the company/leave the work group. I obviously wanted nothing to do with this RSR and it looked like I didn't really have a choice. I had pre-aligned with my DW that I'd leave the company if I got RSR. Before he had the change to formally give me the RSR, I had a conversation with the executive sponsor (ES) on the company's largest project which I am working on and kinda-sorta dotted line report to him. I told the ES that I was getting the RSR and that while I really enjoyed working on the large project and at the company, I probably wouldn't last at the company for very long after I got the RSR. He had personally saw what the RSR did to two out of the three other peers and understood completely.

Within a week, ES went to the CEO of the company and stated that one of his major project risks was needing to keep me focused on the large project. The CEO gave direction to my direct management to NOT give me the RSR. To this day my manager hasn't a clue that I influenced the ES to make this happen.

Morals of the story:
-Don't be afraid to walk away from a job once you have a level of FU money.
-There is typically someone around you in the organization that has interests that align with yours, learn to leverage them.

I apologize for the boasting but I can't exactly talk about this anywhere else.

It turns out that there was a second part to this story that I didn't realize at the time. Fast forward to today, my manager unexpectedly gives me a large, off cycle raise. Apparently, when my line leadership got wind that I might leave they decided to throw more money at me as a retention plan even though I didn't have a competing offer.

So ... I avoided the RSR and was given more money?? Turns out that's one of the many benefits of FU money...
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: BlueHouse on May 23, 2017, 02:04:00 PM
I apologize for the boasting but I can't exactly talk about this anywhere else.

It turns out that there was a second part to this story that I didn't realize at the time. Fast forward to today, my manager unexpectedly gives me a large, off cycle raise. Apparently, when my line leadership got wind that I might leave they decided to throw more money at me as a retention plan even though I didn't have a competing offer.

So ... I avoided the RSR and was given more money?? Turns out that's one of the many benefits of FU money...
This just made my day.  Thanks for sharing!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Dicey on May 23, 2017, 04:44:10 PM
I apologize for the boasting but I can't exactly talk about this anywhere else.

It turns out that there was a second part to this story that I didn't realize at the time. Fast forward to today, my manager unexpectedly gives me a large, off cycle raise. Apparently, when my line leadership got wind that I might leave they decided to throw more money at me as a retention plan even though I didn't have a competing offer.

So ... I avoided the RSR and was given more money?? Turns out that's one of the many benefits of FU money...
This just made my day.  Thanks for sharing!
Yup. Funny I don't consider stating facts, particularly in this context, boasting. Carry on, good Liberty Stache. And congratulations on that raise. You know what to do with it. Feel free to share the details if you wish. That won't be considered boasting here, either.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: pennyhandlebar on May 24, 2017, 02:38:19 AM
I don't think this story qualifies as "epic," but it was definitely a reminder of how nice it is to not be dependent on a salary. As background, my wife and I are about 75% of the way to our target number -- we still have a ways to go, but one of us being out of work for few months (or even a year) would not be a big deal.

My company, which we'll call "Boutique Inc" has been acquired by a much larger company we'll call "Mega Co." The acquisition went through years ago, and change was pretty minimal for several years after the transaction closed. But now, Mega Co is working on rolling out standardized systems and processes across all its acquisitions globally. In theory, this makes sense and will be a positive change, but some of the global systems and processes are inferior to our existing solutions. For example, the SLAs for Mega Co's approach to one business critical process  would have gotten Boutique Inc's vendors laughed out of the room.

With that background, you can understand there was some tension in the air as we gathered in the conference room for a global conference call covering additional new systems and processes that would be rolled out at Boutique Inc. A number of people raised objections with our leaders from Mega Co during the call and tempers were getting a bit strained. One of my coworkers unfortunately asked a perfectly innocuous question that -- apparently -- was the final straw, because it triggered an angry speech about Boutique Inc's substandard financial performance (this is true, we are not having a great year), and a statement that Mega Co's processes would help us return to profitability and keep Mega Co from closing Boutique Inc down.

When this speech concluded, I said something smart to the effect of "Gee, Boutique Inc is such a badly run business that it would be ridiculous to acquire us!" I didn't realize when I said this that our conference room mic was on -- I thought we were on mute. Fortunately or not, I wasn't close enough to the mic for it to pick me up though. :-)

Immediately after this call, a number of the junior staff were worried about their jobs, and I realized I was completely unworried. I think there's some more mature perspective to thank, but being 75% of the way to FIRE has to help too!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: APowers on June 02, 2017, 10:59:14 PM
Not epic, but still a little bit exciting.

A couple months ago, I asked my boss at Domino's to take me off the schedule, as I have a house to remodel, and over full-time projects at my day job. I told him that I'd be available to come in if they had someone call in sick and they couldn't find anyone else.

They called me a couple days ago to come in; it didn't conflict with what I had going on, so I agreed. About an hour into the shift, the shift manager asked which of us closers (me and the other scheduled closing driver) was going to drive the company car....

The company car. This franchise has a company car, which the owner requires to be driven daily. It's terrible. Relatively uncomfortable, no cupholder large enough for my drink, no flashlight/spotlight for finding house numbers in the dark, TINTED WINDOWS (seriously, who puts tinted windows in a late-night pizza delivery vehicle?), and no mileage reimbursement (important, since I drive a Civic and actually make money on this). AND, the last time I drove it, I had two separate orders of pizza slip off the seat onto the floor (no, I wasn't braking hard); I already hated driving it, but after that incident, I decided I was not driving it again.

I calmly told her that I was not going to drive it (citing the most relevant-to-the-business reason of "I'm not driving a car that throws pizzas off the seat; that's bad customer service"). I thought about it as I was refusing-- what's the worst that can happen? They cut my hours...to what, zero? I'm already there. They fire me....and then the whole closing shift is screwed over by being shorthanded? I don't have to be there, but they need me.

It's not because I have enough money in the bank to not need a job, but being in a position where my other job is already giving me over full-time hours, meant I had power to make this job not suck. Seriously, though-- delivering pizzas is fun. Driving the company car is...not fun.

Epilogue...they also called me the next day, and the shift manager, in trying to convince me to come in, specifically said "I promise I won't ask you to drive the company car."

Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: radram on June 03, 2017, 05:59:01 AM
Not epic, but still a little bit exciting.

A couple months ago, I asked my boss at Domino's to take me off the schedule, as I have a house to remodel, and over full-time projects at my day job. I told him that I'd be available to come in if they had someone call in sick and they couldn't find anyone else.

They called me a couple days ago to come in; it didn't conflict with what I had going on, so I agreed. About an hour into the shift, the shift manager asked which of us closers (me and the other scheduled closing driver) was going to drive the company car....

The company car. This franchise has a company car, which the owner requires to be driven daily. It's terrible. Relatively uncomfortable, no cupholder large enough for my drink, no flashlight/spotlight for finding house numbers in the dark, TINTED WINDOWS (seriously, who puts tinted windows in a late-night pizza delivery vehicle?), and no mileage reimbursement (important, since I drive a Civic and actually make money on this). AND, the last time I drove it, I had two separate orders of pizza slip off the seat onto the floor (no, I wasn't braking hard); I already hated driving it, but after that incident, I decided I was not driving it again.

I calmly told her that I was not going to drive it (citing the most relevant-to-the-business reason of "I'm not driving a car that throws pizzas off the seat; that's bad customer service"). I thought about it as I was refusing-- what's the worst that can happen? They cut my hours...to what, zero? I'm already there. They fire me....and then the whole closing shift is screwed over by being shorthanded? I don't have to be there, but they need me.

It's not because I have enough money in the bank to not need a job, but being in a position where my other job is already giving me over full-time hours, meant I had power to make this job not suck. Seriously, though-- delivering pizzas is fun. Driving the company car is...not fun.

Epilogue...they also called me the next day, and the shift manager, in trying to convince me to come in, specifically said "I promise I won't ask you to drive the company car."

Great story. Did you go back? Would you go back in the future?
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Freedomin5 on June 03, 2017, 08:01:10 AM
Finally have one to contribute.

A few years ago, the company was acquired. They wanted all employees to sign new contracts with the new company as old company technically no longer existed. Many of us were contract employees at the time and paid only for the hours we work. The good consultants were working many hours and billing for more hours. The incompetent ones were working fewer hours and billing less.

So new company decides they want everyone on salary. Except they set the salary structure based on averaging the billing hours of all employees. This meant that the good ones were offered packages that were worth a lot less than they were currently making, and the incompetent ones were offered packages that were a lot more lucrative than their current situation.

You can probably predict what happened. The bad ones jumped at the opportunity. The good ones without FU money reluctantly signed and have been complaining since. The good ones with FU money asked, "You know my current package. If you were me, would you sign this?" HR had no good response to this, stopped responding to our emails and basically left us alone keeping the terms of the old contract.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: APowers on June 03, 2017, 08:07:57 AM
Not epic, but still a little bit exciting.

A couple months ago, I asked my boss at Domino's to take me off the schedule, as I have a house to remodel, and over full-time projects at my day job. I told him that I'd be available to come in if they had someone call in sick and they couldn't find anyone else.

They called me a couple days ago to come in; it didn't conflict with what I had going on, so I agreed. About an hour into the shift, the shift manager asked which of us closers (me and the other scheduled closing driver) was going to drive the company car....

The company car. This franchise has a company car, which the owner requires to be driven daily. It's terrible. Relatively uncomfortable, no cupholder large enough for my drink, no flashlight/spotlight for finding house numbers in the dark, TINTED WINDOWS (seriously, who puts tinted windows in a late-night pizza delivery vehicle?), and no mileage reimbursement (important, since I drive a Civic and actually make money on this). AND, the last time I drove it, I had two separate orders of pizza slip off the seat onto the floor (no, I wasn't braking hard); I already hated driving it, but after that incident, I decided I was not driving it again.

I calmly told her that I was not going to drive it (citing the most relevant-to-the-business reason of "I'm not driving a car that throws pizzas off the seat; that's bad customer service"). I thought about it as I was refusing-- what's the worst that can happen? They cut my hours...to what, zero? I'm already there. They fire me....and then the whole closing shift is screwed over by being shorthanded? I don't have to be there, but they need me.

It's not because I have enough money in the bank to not need a job, but being in a position where my other job is already giving me over full-time hours, meant I had power to make this job not suck. Seriously, though-- delivering pizzas is fun. Driving the company car is...not fun.

Epilogue...they also called me the next day, and the shift manager, in trying to convince me to come in, specifically said "I promise I won't ask you to drive the company car."

Great story. Did you go back? Would you go back in the future?
I did. The money's not bad (ends up netting about $15/hr), and it's fun... at least when I'm not being made to do stupid stuff. I'm still on call for them, and they *love* me-- seriously, they act like I'm some kind of returning messiah when I come in.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: FIREby35 on June 04, 2017, 08:01:27 AM
Not epic, but still a little bit exciting.

A couple months ago, I asked my boss at Domino's to take me off the schedule, as I have a house to remodel, and over full-time projects at my day job. I told him that I'd be available to come in if they had someone call in sick and they couldn't find anyone else.

They called me a couple days ago to come in; it didn't conflict with what I had going on, so I agreed. About an hour into the shift, the shift manager asked which of us closers (me and the other scheduled closing driver) was going to drive the company car....

The company car. This franchise has a company car, which the owner requires to be driven daily. It's terrible. Relatively uncomfortable, no cupholder large enough for my drink, no flashlight/spotlight for finding house numbers in the dark, TINTED WINDOWS (seriously, who puts tinted windows in a late-night pizza delivery vehicle?), and no mileage reimbursement (important, since I drive a Civic and actually make money on this). AND, the last time I drove it, I had two separate orders of pizza slip off the seat onto the floor (no, I wasn't braking hard); I already hated driving it, but after that incident, I decided I was not driving it again.

I calmly told her that I was not going to drive it (citing the most relevant-to-the-business reason of "I'm not driving a car that throws pizzas off the seat; that's bad customer service"). I thought about it as I was refusing-- what's the worst that can happen? They cut my hours...to what, zero? I'm already there. They fire me....and then the whole closing shift is screwed over by being shorthanded? I don't have to be there, but they need me.

It's not because I have enough money in the bank to not need a job, but being in a position where my other job is already giving me over full-time hours, meant I had power to make this job not suck. Seriously, though-- delivering pizzas is fun. Driving the company car is...not fun.

Epilogue...they also called me the next day, and the shift manager, in trying to convince me to come in, specifically said "I promise I won't ask you to drive the company car."

Great story. Did you go back? Would you go back in the future?
I did. The money's not bad (ends up netting about $15/hr), and it's fun... at least when I'm not being made to do stupid stuff. I'm still on call for them, and they *love* me-- seriously, they act like I'm some kind of returning messiah when I come in.

I delivered pizza for five years to pay for community college and university. The last job I had before making it "big time" into the biggest corporate law firm in my region was delivering for Pizza Hut. That was a big jump! Now you are making me wax nostalgic about my pizza delivery days :)
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Zamboni on June 05, 2017, 06:05:58 AM
Pizza delivery drivers represent! One of the more fun jobs in my life . . . and it made me appreciate the value of tipping the delivery driver. The irony is that I only get pizza delivered about once or twice a year now . . .
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Maenad on June 06, 2017, 09:57:29 AM
I finally have an FU money story, not sure how epic it is...

I work in a regulated industry, we have numerous countries that send auditors to our site, as well as companies that audit to various ISO standards for use elsewhere in the world.

Last week, one of the auditing companies sent in an auditor that we've had visit us before, but this time was... different. First, he started talking politics. Like, obvious-what-his-views-were politics. And much like the complaints about professors pushing their political views on their students, we weren't really able to complain, since if you make an auditor cranky, you get lots of findings/observations/non-conformities.

Then it got worse. He threw out a couple of racist/xenophobic shots over the bow. Again, we can't say anything due to the power imbalance.

The FU money comes in today. I set up a meeting with my boss, and said that I think we should "fire" this auditor for his obvious misalignment with our company's values (the racism part, not the politics part), and regardless of what they do, I will not work another audit where he's the auditor. I knew there was a risk of being punished professionally for my refusal to work audits, since it's part of my core job function, but my FU money put me in the position to take a stand here.

My boss made the right noises, at least, about addressing this. What's important to me is that I can still look myself in the mirror tomorrow, and the FU money really helped with that.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: NoVa on June 06, 2017, 10:46:20 AM
I finally have an FU money story, not sure how epic it is...

I work in a regulated industry, we have numerous countries that send auditors to our site, as well as companies that audit to various ISO standards for use elsewhere in the world.

Last week, one of the auditing companies sent in an auditor that we've had visit us before, but this time was... different. First, he started talking politics. Like, obvious-what-his-views-were politics. And much like the complaints about professors pushing their political views on their students, we weren't really able to complain, since if you make an auditor cranky, you get lots of findings/observations/non-conformities.

Then it got worse. He threw out a couple of racist/xenophobic shots over the bow. Again, we can't say anything due to the power imbalance.

The FU money comes in today. I set up a meeting with my boss, and said that I think we should "fire" this auditor for his obvious misalignment with our company's values (the racism part, not the politics part), and regardless of what they do, I will not work another audit where he's the auditor. I knew there was a risk of being punished professionally for my refusal to work audits, since it's part of my core job function, but my FU money put me in the position to take a stand here.

My boss made the right noises, at least, about addressing this. What's important to me is that I can still look myself in the mirror tomorrow, and the FU money really helped with that.

You did the right thing! I am not sure of your specific situation, but usually the ISO audits are handled through a registrar, who sends out the external auditors. Your company is free to pick another registrar, so while an auditor has a lot of "tactical" power, and it's good to not piss them off during the audit, the company has the "strategic" power to dump that registrar, or at least complain and make sure that person is never sent to you again.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Guesl982374 on June 06, 2017, 02:29:38 PM
I finally have an FU money story, not sure how epic it is...

I work in a regulated industry, we have numerous countries that send auditors to our site, as well as companies that audit to various ISO standards for use elsewhere in the world.

Last week, one of the auditing companies sent in an auditor that we've had visit us before, but this time was... different. First, he started talking politics. Like, obvious-what-his-views-were politics. And much like the complaints about professors pushing their political views on their students, we weren't really able to complain, since if you make an auditor cranky, you get lots of findings/observations/non-conformities.

Then it got worse. He threw out a couple of racist/xenophobic shots over the bow. Again, we can't say anything due to the power imbalance.

The FU money comes in today. I set up a meeting with my boss, and said that I think we should "fire" this auditor for his obvious misalignment with our company's values (the racism part, not the politics part), and regardless of what they do, I will not work another audit where he's the auditor. I knew there was a risk of being punished professionally for my refusal to work audits, since it's part of my core job function, but my FU money put me in the position to take a stand here.

My boss made the right noises, at least, about addressing this. What's important to me is that I can still look myself in the mirror tomorrow, and the FU money really helped with that.

Well done!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Nangirl17 on June 07, 2017, 12:10:06 PM
....but my FU money put me in the position to take a stand here.


This is epic.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: nara on June 08, 2017, 09:59:56 PM
I'm not FI, but I do have an FU money type story!

I was working a job that was really burning me out...waking up at 4:00 every morning for a 3+ hour round trip commute to NYC and working 8-10 hours a day with special needs children. My boyfriend and I (now my husband) decided to quit our jobs and go teach English in Korea for a year. We signed our one year contracts for Korea, worked our last few weeks, and then went to Florida mid-winter to WWOOF (live and volunteer at) on an organic farm. What a change it was to go from a stressful city job in bleak winter to picking flowers all day and sleeping under an avocado tree! We lived virtually for free for that month prior to leaving for Korea. While in Korea, we went on trips every weekend and traveled to Thailand and Japan during our school breaks. We had free housing and managed to save enough money to spend 3 months traveling to India, Nepal, China, Tibet, Vietnam, Cambodia, and Malaysia after our contract ended. It was the best time of our lives!!! We even brought a dog home with us from Korea that we rescued from the meat trade (she's now 7!)

When we returned to the US, we were able to pay for our wedding and had enough money leftover still to sit around for 2 months while looking for jobs. We didn't make any money that year---but we didn't spend any of our savings either and had experiences that we wouldn't trade for anything!!!! I accepted a job offer across the country (the year off made no real dent in my ability to find a new job..) and we moved to our new home in Colorado without ever looking back! The decision to abandon our lives in NY for a little adventure was the best thing we've EVER done!!!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: felixbf on June 08, 2017, 11:53:53 PM
I'm not FI, but I do have an FU money type story!

I was working a job that was really burning me out...waking up at 4:00 every morning for a 3+ hour round trip commute to NYC and working 8-10 hours a day with special needs children. My boyfriend and I (now my husband) decided to quit our jobs and go teach English in Korea for a year. We signed our one year contracts for Korea, worked our last few weeks, and then went to Florida mid-winter to WWOOF (live and volunteer at) on an organic farm. What a change it was to go from a stressful city job in bleak winter to picking flowers all day and sleeping under an avocado tree! We lived virtually for free for that month prior to leaving for Korea. While in Korea, we went on trips every weekend and traveled to Thailand and Japan during our school breaks. We had free housing and managed to save enough money to spend 3 months traveling to India, Nepal, China, Tibet, Vietnam, Cambodia, and Malaysia after our contract ended. It was the best time of our lives!!! We even brought a dog home with us from Korea that we rescued from the meat trade (she's now 7!)

When we returned to the US, we were able to pay for our wedding and had enough money leftover still to sit around for 2 months while looking for jobs. We didn't make any money that year---but we didn't spend any of our savings either and had experiences that we wouldn't trade for anything!!!! I accepted a job offer across the country (the year off made no real dent in my ability to find a new job..) and we moved to our new home in Colorado without ever looking back! The decision to abandon our lives in NY for a little adventure was the best thing we've EVER done!!!

That's awesome :)
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Livingthedream55 on June 09, 2017, 07:03:24 AM
I'm not FI, but I do have an FU money type story!

I was working a job that was really burning me out...waking up at 4:00 every morning for a 3+ hour round trip commute to NYC and working 8-10 hours a day with special needs children. My boyfriend and I (now my husband) decided to quit our jobs and go teach English in Korea for a year. We signed our one year contracts for Korea, worked our last few weeks, and then went to Florida mid-winter to WWOOF (live and volunteer at) on an organic farm. What a change it was to go from a stressful city job in bleak winter to picking flowers all day and sleeping under an avocado tree! We lived virtually for free for that month prior to leaving for Korea. While in Korea, we went on trips every weekend and traveled to Thailand and Japan during our school breaks. We had free housing and managed to save enough money to spend 3 months traveling to India, Nepal, China, Tibet, Vietnam, Cambodia, and Malaysia after our contract ended. It was the best time of our lives!!! We even brought a dog home with us from Korea that we rescued from the meat trade (she's now 7!)

When we returned to the US, we were able to pay for our wedding and had enough money leftover still to sit around for 2 months while looking for jobs. We didn't make any money that year---but we didn't spend any of our savings either and had experiences that we wouldn't trade for anything!!!! I accepted a job offer across the country (the year off made no real dent in my ability to find a new job..) and we moved to our new home in Colorado without ever looking back! The decision to abandon our lives in NY for a little adventure was the best thing we've EVER done!!!

Awesome and epic!!!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: arebelspy on June 18, 2017, 09:42:20 AM
Woo, so many good stories in the last few pages!  I love this thread.  :D
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Daisy on June 18, 2017, 06:02:10 PM
Cross posting from the 2017 FIRE thread.

Well I am a month away from my stated FIRE date. I am not sure if I will hit it, but I am definitely trying to chart my escape path.

I am currently tapping into my FU reservoirs to try and right some recent wrongs at work. Will it turn into an epic FU money story? Only time will tell. This may slightly delay my FIRE date but will be well worth it life-satisfaction-wise.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: zolotiyeruki on June 19, 2017, 12:35:54 PM
Cross posting from the 2017 FIRE thread.

Well I am a month away from my stated FIRE date. I am not sure if I will hit it, but I am definitely trying to chart my escape path.

I am currently tapping into my FU reservoirs to try and right some recent wrongs at work. Will it turn into an epic FU money story? Only time will tell. This may slightly delay my FIRE date but will be well worth it life-satisfaction-wise.
Please share if/when you can! :)
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Flyingkea on June 25, 2017, 06:51:58 PM
Posting to follow and with a minor story of my own.

I work in aviation, and it is really common for employers to take advantage of low hour pilots - getting them to do unpaid labor, not always in exchange for flying hours, and certainly less than the legally mandated minimums.

I had 3 years off from aviation, being a SAHP, and I recently went back to work as a casual employee for a small flight school. This school is better than most wrt pay, but recently they sent out an email asking us to be rostered on for a day in the office, unpaid.
Because I didn't need this job, I was able to query this email (it was illegal, but the other guys there are pretty junior and didn't realise how bad it was and needed the experience more than I did) and shortly after sending my query, had some back tracking from the boss in terms of what he was wanting - which was now legal.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: firelight on June 25, 2017, 10:31:45 PM
Posting to follow and with a minor story of my own.

I work in aviation, and it is really common for employers to take advantage of low hour pilots - getting them to do unpaid labor, not always in exchange for flying hours, and certainly less than the legally mandated minimums.

I had 3 years off from aviation, being a SAHP, and I recently went back to work as a casual employee for a small flight school. This school is better than most wrt pay, but recently they sent out an email asking us to be rostered on for a day in the office, unpaid.
Because I didn't need this job, I was able to query this email (it was illegal, but the other guys there are pretty junior and didn't realise how bad it was and needed the experience more than I did) and shortly after sending my query, had some back tracking from the boss in terms of what he was wanting - which was now legal.
Great job! I don't think it's minor - I'm sure your colleagues would've appreciated it too.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Daisy on June 30, 2017, 05:17:58 PM
Cross posting from the 2017 FIRE thread again as it is FU money related.

Sooooo...here is the story.

I thought I might FIRE in 2016 (but probably would have OMY’d anyways), but ended up having a medical emergency that ended up with a brain injury. I have recovered remarkably well, but still have some lingering issues with my cognitive skills not 100% for my high-skilled job. I was out of work for 6 months in 2016. So the time off, although for medical reasons, gave me some breathing room. Also, I returned to a friendly work environment, so I wanted to give them 100% (or rather 80% since I am part time) of my effort in gratitude.

Well, as 2016 was ending and a couple of months after returning to work and now into 2017, the shine of optimism and positivity I was feeling started to fade as two d**k managers started to critique my performance, seemingly to me accusing me of not performing to my previous standards on purpose. They gave me a terrible rating which resulted in no annual pay increase, and doubtfully future bonuses. They threatened to demote me two levels (not just one, talk about sticking a knife in the wound).

But I do have a medical disability due to the brain injury. Although not as bad as it could have been, I still think a little slower and have some trouble with memory and multi-tasking. Now, at first I thought “great, this will probably lead to a layoff and a severance package later in the year as I have been yearning for as I am about to launch into FIRE”. But, I just felt this wasn’t right. Although I can take the financial hit of a layoff, I thought about others with disabilities that in this same situation would be in dire straits if d**k managers that didn’t understand disabilities treated them this way.

I knew my mega-corp’s HR department would be appalled at how my d**k managers were treating someone with a cognitive disability and that this problem was localized to my department. All mention of the brain injury fell onto deaf ears with my d**k mangers. So, I decided to take the risk and go talk to HR and tell them what was happening. The HR person was appalled that my d**k managers had told me upon my return that I should avoid taking PTO to “show my dedication”. And that they totally downplayed my lead role on the project I was on right before the injury (even after having a great performance review on it). I was also threatened with a 2-level demotion (just to stick the knife in the wound). I also decided to throw in some other unsavory things going on in my department where people aren’t treated as professionals (grading people from A to F based on how many tests they write).

So HR person ended up talking to my direct manager and I was prepared for the fallout at this week’s “sync up” with the manager. I thought the manager would be upset. Then I thought it would be the perfect fodder to go the HR in a couple of weeks and say “just give me a buyout package because I can’t deal with these managers”. Rather, my manager’s attitude seems to have done a 180 after their “talk” with HR, who probably set them straight on the law. My manager was totally understanding and very nice this time around.

So now I am in a pickle. I decided to stand up for the disabled rights. I could have just taken the punishment, not gone to HR, and ended up getting laid off, but now it seems I have turned things around with my d**k managers (after HR probably scared them) and now I may not have grounds to go to HR and ask for a buyout package. And after managers are now being nice to me, I may feel obligated to continue on for a while.

But I really want to FIRE...and do it with a package. Sigh...the saga continues…

I guess the FU money came in handy and I hope there is more awareness of all types of disabilities throughout my company now. Or at least they are just scared of lawyers getting involved.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: scottish on June 30, 2017, 05:23:10 PM
But you did the right thing.   That's important.

Also, this story may not be over yet.   In my experience, d**ks don't stop being d**ks just because HR talks to them.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Tyson on June 30, 2017, 05:33:24 PM
But you did the right thing.   That's important.

Also, this story may not be over yet.   In my experience, d**ks don't stop being d**ks just because HR talks to them.

Agreed.  On both counts.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: G-dog on June 30, 2017, 06:01:48 PM
But you did the right thing.   That's important.

Also, this story may not be over yet.   In my experience, d**ks don't stop being d**ks just because HR talks to them.

Exactly. It is their core behavior. This will get interesting....
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: rpr on June 30, 2017, 06:21:32 PM
Posting to follow. I love the stories. Maybe I'll have one someday.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Bicycle_B on June 30, 2017, 06:26:40 PM
Cross posting from the 2017 FIRE thread again as it is FU money related.

I knew my mega-corp’s HR department would be appalled at how my d**k managers were treating someone with a cognitive disability and that this problem was localized to my department. All mention of the brain injury fell onto deaf ears with my d**k mangers. So, I decided to take the risk and go talk to HR and tell them what was happening. The HR person was appalled that my d**k managers had told me upon my return that I should avoid taking PTO to “show my dedication”. And that they totally downplayed my lead role on the project I was on right before the injury (even after having a great performance review on it). I was also threatened with a 2-level demotion (just to stick the knife in the wound). I also decided to throw in some other unsavory things going on in my department where people aren’t treated as professionals (grading people from A to F based on how many tests they write).

So HR person ended up talking to my direct manager and I was prepared for the fallout at this week’s “sync up” with the manager. I thought the manager would be upset. Then I thought it would be the perfect fodder to go the HR in a couple of weeks and say “just give me a buyout package because I can’t deal with these managers”. Rather, my manager’s attitude seems to have done a 180 after their “talk” with HR, who probably set them straight on the law. My manager was totally understanding and very nice this time around.


Way to go Daisy!


So now I am in a pickle. I decided to stand up for the disabled rights. I could have just taken the punishment, not gone to HR, and ended up getting laid off, but now it seems I have turned things around with my d**k managers (after HR probably scared them) and now I may not have grounds to go to HR and ask for a buyout package. And after managers are now being nice to me, I may feel obligated to continue on for a while.

But I really want to FIRE...and do it with a package.

...Or at least they are just scared of lawyers getting involved.

Maybe they're still scared, and they'd be willing to arrange a package if asked?  After all, the managers got better, but they should have been properly trained in the first place, the company is still at fault. If HR has any wiggle room to arrange a package, whether due to these incidents or other grounds, perhaps they would still do it.  Especially if you're up front that the managers improved, and you appreciate that HR did a good job fixing it, you're "asking only for whatever is actually within their professional discretion to arrange" or some such?

Good luck pulling the ripcord in any case. 
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: FIREby35 on June 30, 2017, 06:57:17 PM
Good story. Good job.

As for those guys being straightened up, don't count on it. Keep your wits about you. I agree, they will try and set you up for something.

If they do try more stuff it will just get you a bigger severance package. So, don't let it stress you out, one way or the other :)
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: firelight on June 30, 2017, 07:08:59 PM
Awesome story Daisy!

You can still go to HR and say you don't feel comfortable with the d**k managers after what happened and that you fear retribution and that you want the package if possible. The worst they can say is no but it'll also put them on alert to anything that the managers set you up for and make sure someone else is aware of this possibility
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: paddedhat on June 30, 2017, 07:12:54 PM
But you did the right thing.   That's important.

Also, this story may not be over yet.   In my experience, d**ks don't stop being d**ks just because HR talks to them.

Yep, my dear wife successfully tackled the last 2/3rds of her thirty year teaching career with a traumatic brain injury. Sadly, when you are disabled, there is a small subset of subhumans that WILL kick you when you are down. Some of these bastards even get great joy in doing so.
The very real threat of damage to their career, or creating a legal shit-storm, is often your only protection. Believing that they have "seen the light" is only a delusion on your part. I would strongly suggest that you document to the point of being obsessive. My wife's last principal was one sick individual, who found a lot of satisfaction in making my wife's work life absolutely horrible. The big mistake the principal made was documenting some of her totally illegal abusive behavior and stupidly leaving a significant email trail. The wife had enough and scheduled a meeting with the district's HR director. We gave the HR guy an overview of what was going on, and decided to keep the evidence out of the discussion, just reviewing some key points.  He clearly understood that an ADA lawyer would of thought they died and went to litigation heaven if they ever got their hands of that documentation. After he picked himself off the floor, he offered the wife a chance to leave a year early, with half pay, full benefits and a full year's pension credit. Since we had a nice stash, the money was no issue. Shortly after, the principal was demoted from a showplace, new eighty million dollar middle school to the smallest building in the district, in a remote location. A few years later, still delusional about her status with the district, she applied for, and fully expected to be chosen to replace the retiring assistant superintendent. Ouch, sorry but no love from management. The insider's bet is that the district will be closing her building, and showing her the door, as enrollment continue to drop. I'm quite sure that the DW played a significant part in torpedoing that bitch's career.  Karma, can be a bitch......................

Oh, one more thing daisy, It's DICK. You're here, where the fucks fly, as required. Loosen up :)


Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: AnnaGrowsAMustache on June 30, 2017, 07:27:45 PM
But you did the right thing.   That's important.

Also, this story may not be over yet.   In my experience, d**ks don't stop being d**ks just because HR talks to them.

Yep, my dear wife successfully tackled the last 2/3rds of her thirty year teaching career with a traumatic brain injury. Sadly, when you are disabled, there is a small subset of subhumans that WILL kick you when you are down. Some of these bastards even get great joy in doing so.
The very real threat of damage to their career, or creating a legal shit-storm, is often your only protection. Believing that they have "seen the light" is only a delusion on your part. I would strongly suggest that you document to the point of being obsessive. My wife's last principal was one sick individual, who found a lot of satisfaction in making my wife's work life absolutely horrible. The big mistake the principal made was documenting some of her totally illegal abusive behavior and stupidly leaving a significant email trail. The wife had enough and scheduled a meeting with the district's HR director. We gave the HR guy an overview of what was going on, and decided to keep the evidence out of the discussion, just reviewing some key points.  He clearly understood that an ADA lawyer would of thought they died and went to litigation heaven if they ever got their hands of that documentation. After he picked himself off the floor, he offered the wife a chance to leave a year early, with half pay, full benefits and a full year's pension credit. Since we had a nice stash, the money was no issue. Shortly after, the principal was demoted from a showplace, new eighty million dollar middle school to the smallest building in the district, in a remote location. A few years later, still delusional about her status with the district, she applied for, and fully expected to be chosen to replace the retiring assistant superintendent. Ouch, sorry but no love from management. The insider's bet is that the district will be closing her building, and showing her the door, as enrollment continue to drop. I'm quite sure that the DW played a significant part in torpedoing that bitch's career.  Karma, can be a bitch......................

Oh, one more thing daisy, It's DICK. You're here, where the fucks fly, as required. Loosen up :)

I'm sorry this happened to your wife. It must have been very stressful for her. I have a brain injured colleague and I know it's been a struggle for her. Unfortunately, although no fault of the brain injured colleague's, it's also been a struggle for me. Management have changed her role to allow for her abilities by increasing mine, with no increase in pay or recognition or anything else that might make this situation easier to swallow. That could be why some of your wife's colleagues were dicks. I hope I'm only a dick to management, and not to my colleague!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: paddedhat on June 30, 2017, 09:31:10 PM
But you did the right thing.   That's important.

Also, this story may not be over yet.   In my experience, d**ks don't stop being d**ks just because HR talks to them.

Yep, my dear wife successfully tackled the last 2/3rds of her thirty year teaching career with a traumatic brain injury. Sadly, when you are disabled, there is a small subset of subhumans that WILL kick you when you are down. Some of these bastards even get great joy in doing so.
The very real threat of damage to their career, or creating a legal shit-storm, is often your only protection. Believing that they have "seen the light" is only a delusion on your part. I would strongly suggest that you document to the point of being obsessive. My wife's last principal was one sick individual, who found a lot of satisfaction in making my wife's work life absolutely horrible. The big mistake the principal made was documenting some of her totally illegal abusive behavior and stupidly leaving a significant email trail. The wife had enough and scheduled a meeting with the district's HR director. We gave the HR guy an overview of what was going on, and decided to keep the evidence out of the discussion, just reviewing some key points.  He clearly understood that an ADA lawyer would of thought they died and went to litigation heaven if they ever got their hands of that documentation. After he picked himself off the floor, he offered the wife a chance to leave a year early, with half pay, full benefits and a full year's pension credit. Since we had a nice stash, the money was no issue. Shortly after, the principal was demoted from a showplace, new eighty million dollar middle school to the smallest building in the district, in a remote location. A few years later, still delusional about her status with the district, she applied for, and fully expected to be chosen to replace the retiring assistant superintendent. Ouch, sorry but no love from management. The insider's bet is that the district will be closing her building, and showing her the door, as enrollment continue to drop. I'm quite sure that the DW played a significant part in torpedoing that bitch's career.  Karma, can be a bitch......................

Oh, one more thing daisy, It's DICK. You're here, where the fucks fly, as required. Loosen up :)

I'm sorry this happened to your wife. It must have been very stressful for her. I have a brain injured colleague and I know it's been a struggle for her. Unfortunately, although no fault of the brain injured colleague's, it's also been a struggle for me. Management have changed her role to allow for her abilities by increasing mine, with no increase in pay or recognition or anything else that might make this situation easier to swallow. That could be why some of your wife's colleagues were dicks. I hope I'm only a dick to management, and not to my colleague!

No, fortunately, it nothing to do with others sharing any slack that she couldn't handle. In fact there really was no mental deficit, just lots of physical ones. The issue was that the principal was a recent hire who only comfortable if she had a cult of personality surrounding her. She really needed a small group of ass kissers that worshiped her, and the DW was not willing to partake. It got to the point that some of her minions figured out that they no longer had to actually perform, but could kick back, and do little, then scapegoat whoever was a weak target, outside of the principal's little posse. Eventually the wife was being punished for not picking up the slack for a posse member who was a doe eyed young school counselor, who could bawl on cue, and did little during the day but spend time on a cell phone with her boyfriend, while falling further behind on state mandated evaluations. Since little miss doe eyes was part of the posse, somebody had to pay, and my wife was the chosen one, since in the principal's  sick mind, a severely disabled person was an easy target.  Where she fucked up was that, in her failed attempt to intimidate the DW, she created a totally unbelievable e-mail chain, claiming that she was under severe pressure to address the wife's poor performance, that the district superintendent was on her about the DW's failings, and that it was becoming an issue that was being investigated by the state department of Ed. Problem was, my DW was so far down the chain that the superintendent would know her if he tripped over her. He never had a single conversation with anyone about the DW's performance, and all of it was a bunch of fabrications that her superiors readily confirmed. it was all a sick and well documented game. In the ended it ended the wife's career and essentially destroyed the principal's also.

I'm sorry to hear that you are in a totally different situation and shouldering an unfair burden. It isn't right. Toward the end of my DW's career, she finally relented and allowed her employer to provide an assistant. This was a low cost teacher's aide who did a lot of the physical stuff that she struggled with. It worked out really well. To be in a situation where somebody just can't perform their job, and expect others to take up the slack, essentially doing their work, is a whole other problem. I hope it works out for you.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: AnnaGrowsAMustache on July 01, 2017, 12:08:59 AM

I'm sorry to hear that you are in a totally different situation and shouldering an unfair burden. It isn't right. Toward the end of my DW's career, she finally relented and allowed her employer to provide an assistant. This was a low cost teacher's aide who did a lot of the physical stuff that she struggled with. It worked out really well. To be in a situation where somebody just can't perform their job, and expect others to take up the slack, essentially doing their work, is a whole other problem. I hope it works out for you.

My colleague has lost all ability to pay attention to detail. She's aware of this and struggling with tasks. I think we need to have a coffee and divide up the jobs between us, so neither of us are struggling, but I'm just a bit concerned that she may interpret this as a criticism or me trying to palm off the slightly more tedious jobs. We work as a unit, so either the unit gets things done or it doesn't - if one fails we sort of both fail so hopefully we can divvy things up in a more intelligent way than we are currently.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: shelivesthedream on July 01, 2017, 12:49:58 AM

I'm sorry to hear that you are in a totally different situation and shouldering an unfair burden. It isn't right. Toward the end of my DW's career, she finally relented and allowed her employer to provide an assistant. This was a low cost teacher's aide who did a lot of the physical stuff that she struggled with. It worked out really well. To be in a situation where somebody just can't perform their job, and expect others to take up the slack, essentially doing their work, is a whole other problem. I hope it works out for you.

My colleague has lost all ability to pay attention to detail. She's aware of this and struggling with tasks. I think we need to have a coffee and divide up the jobs between us, so neither of us are struggling, but I'm just a bit concerned that she may interpret this as a criticism or me trying to palm off the slightly more tedious jobs. We work as a unit, so either the unit gets things done or it doesn't - if one fails we sort of both fail so hopefully we can divvy things up in a more intelligent way than we are currently.

She probably knows, and might well be desperate for a chat but embarrassed. I'd really encourage you to talk to her, but to think carefully about how you put it first. Maybe don't even mention her problems if you think it might upset her - just say that now you've had a bit of a re-org of responsibilities maybe you can have a chat about how it's working and see if there's anything either of you would like to swap. Then it's up to her to mention her disability if she wants to.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Playing with Fire UK on July 01, 2017, 02:29:27 AM

I'm sorry to hear that you are in a totally different situation and shouldering an unfair burden. It isn't right. Toward the end of my DW's career, she finally relented and allowed her employer to provide an assistant. This was a low cost teacher's aide who did a lot of the physical stuff that she struggled with. It worked out really well. To be in a situation where somebody just can't perform their job, and expect others to take up the slack, essentially doing their work, is a whole other problem. I hope it works out for you.

My colleague has lost all ability to pay attention to detail. She's aware of this and struggling with tasks. I think we need to have a coffee and divide up the jobs between us, so neither of us are struggling, but I'm just a bit concerned that she may interpret this as a criticism or me trying to palm off the slightly more tedious jobs. We work as a unit, so either the unit gets things done or it doesn't - if one fails we sort of both fail so hopefully we can divvy things up in a more intelligent way than we are currently.

She probably knows, and might well be desperate for a chat but embarrassed. I'd really encourage you to talk to her, but to think carefully about how you put it first. Maybe don't even mention her problems if you think it might upset her - just say that now you've had a bit of a re-org of responsibilities maybe you can have a chat about how it's working and see if there's anything either of you would like to swap. Then it's up to her to mention her disability if she wants to.

+1 to this.

I had an amazingly productive chat with my supervisor and mentee where we were all honest about what work needed to be done and what work we actually LIKED doing and what tasks we thought we were good at. Prior to this there were a couple of concerns about standards and abilities (more a difference in opinion about what the design standards were and how much we focused on content and how much on presentation), and after the talk it was a whole lot better. This is totally the opposite of our management's "address your weaknesses" chat that we had been following. It turned out that my supervisor was taking the bullet of doing the training presentations that he hates and assumed everyone hated. I sodding love giving those presentations. Swap completed.

I'd phrase it as "I've noticed that you are really good at ..... and .....; I enjoy ..... work more; what do you think about trading?" Ask questions about timing and work load and make it clear that you are only looking for win/wins (urgh, I normally hate that phrase), where you switch two tasks, you both enjoy your new task more and both tasks get done better or quicker. IMO we should all be having these conversations with our colleagues more often.

I'm crap at attention to detail after about ten minutes for stuff that doesn't interest me, and if someone offered to switch these tasks with me I'd be delighted. Granted, if someone started with "I've noticed that you are mentally deficient..." then I'd be pissed. So, as SLTD says, you are right to be thoughtful about having the conversation but you should absolutely have it.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: AnnaGrowsAMustache on July 01, 2017, 03:38:08 PM

I'm sorry to hear that you are in a totally different situation and shouldering an unfair burden. It isn't right. Toward the end of my DW's career, she finally relented and allowed her employer to provide an assistant. This was a low cost teacher's aide who did a lot of the physical stuff that she struggled with. It worked out really well. To be in a situation where somebody just can't perform their job, and expect others to take up the slack, essentially doing their work, is a whole other problem. I hope it works out for you.

My colleague has lost all ability to pay attention to detail. She's aware of this and struggling with tasks. I think we need to have a coffee and divide up the jobs between us, so neither of us are struggling, but I'm just a bit concerned that she may interpret this as a criticism or me trying to palm off the slightly more tedious jobs. We work as a unit, so either the unit gets things done or it doesn't - if one fails we sort of both fail so hopefully we can divvy things up in a more intelligent way than we are currently.

She probably knows, and might well be desperate for a chat but embarrassed. I'd really encourage you to talk to her, but to think carefully about how you put it first. Maybe don't even mention her problems if you think it might upset her - just say that now you've had a bit of a re-org of responsibilities maybe you can have a chat about how it's working and see if there's anything either of you would like to swap. Then it's up to her to mention her disability if she wants to.

+1 to this.

I had an amazingly productive chat with my supervisor and mentee where we were all honest about what work needed to be done and what work we actually LIKED doing and what tasks we thought we were good at. Prior to this there were a couple of concerns about standards and abilities (more a difference in opinion about what the design standards were and how much we focused on content and how much on presentation), and after the talk it was a whole lot better. This is totally the opposite of our management's "address your weaknesses" chat that we had been following. It turned out that my supervisor was taking the bullet of doing the training presentations that he hates and assumed everyone hated. I sodding love giving those presentations. Swap completed.

I'd phrase it as "I've noticed that you are really good at ..... and .....; I enjoy ..... work more; what do you think about trading?" Ask questions about timing and work load and make it clear that you are only looking for win/wins (urgh, I normally hate that phrase), where you switch two tasks, you both enjoy your new task more and both tasks get done better or quicker. IMO we should all be having these conversations with our colleagues more often.

I'm crap at attention to detail after about ten minutes for stuff that doesn't interest me, and if someone offered to switch these tasks with me I'd be delighted. Granted, if someone started with "I've noticed that you are mentally deficient..." then I'd be pissed. So, as SLTD says, you are right to be thoughtful about having the conversation but you should absolutely have it.

LOL@ "I've noticed that you are mentally deficient..."

I think I'm going to just remind her of a few years ago when we both came into the roles and deliberately divided things up. There's been a bit of a change in tasks since then, so we probably would have needed that kind of chat regardless of the situation. And I think asking if there's anything she would like to swap is a great idea. Put the ball in her court.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Playing with Fire UK on July 01, 2017, 11:54:35 PM
LOL@ "I've noticed that you are mentally deficient..."

I think I'm going to just remind her of a few years ago when we both came into the roles and deliberately divided things up. There's been a bit of a change in tasks since then, so we probably would have needed that kind of chat regardless of the situation. And I think asking if there's anything she would like to swap is a great idea. Put the ball in her court.

Excellent, glad it raised a smile.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Cache_Stash on August 13, 2017, 12:23:58 PM
PTF
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Dicey on August 13, 2017, 12:30:59 PM
PTF
Dangit! I was hoping someone had posted a new story or six. With so many Badasses out there in FIREland,  it must be time for a new influx of inspiring and motivational tales. Who's next? The mic is officially open.

I think I'll go pop up some popcorn in anticipation of good reads coming...
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: frugalnacho on August 14, 2017, 01:55:44 PM
Some minor back story for me:  My parents got foreclosed on 5 years ago, and I let them move into my house for far below fair market value (about $400-500 below FMV, I just asked them to reimburse me for the mortgage/taxes/insurance).  They lived there for 5 years and did not take care of the place.  I finally asked them to leave because I wanted to sell it, and they got all pissed off and it's caused a huge rift in the family.  Things are not good between me and them still. They got all huffy and moved out within a couple weeks and left the place in total disarray. I don't think they cleaned anything the whole time they were there.  So for the past month I've been cleaning it up and fixing things up (up to about $14K so far plus a couple hundred hours between me/wife/her family).    Also we are about 7 months pregnant after a long battle with infertility and going through IVF (and saving up for IVF because we ended up spending about $40k all said and done).  There have been some other major life stresses that I don't even need to go into now.  Suffice to say my life has been shitty and one big ball of stress for several months now.

So I come into work last week and SURPRISE the company you've worked at for 11 years has been sold! And those raises we promised...how about a pay cut instead?

They calculated my pay rate by excluding the bonus I get (about 15% of my total compensation) to get my "base pay", and then basically giving me that.  They also don't cover nearly as much of the insurance premiums as my previous employer.  The end result is that I previously paid about $1500/yr total for insurance for me and my wife, and now the insurance is switching over at 7 months pregnancy and the my new "family" premiums are going to be over $10k/yr.  I expected a slight jump in insurance when we added a kid, but they've totally changed the rules of the game just before the birth, without ever giving me a heads up, and it's going to affect me about $8k/yr.   

I told them the offer was bullshit and that I'm confident I can go find an engineering job paying more than that immediately.  They want me to start off at the bottom and prove myself, even though I have 11 years experience and played a large part in building the company to the level it was at.  I also have plenty of money socked away and could live for a couple years with no job if necessary.  So I told them all to stuff it and cleaned out my desk and walked out. 

Apparently that got their attention, and after a week of tense back and forth negotiation I now have a new contract.  With this new contract I get:

$13k/yr more salary
Large performance based bonus (estimated $10-15k/yr)
performance review/raise halfway between now and the next normal scheduled review
3 weeks paid paternity leave
"unlimited"* vacation
2 employees under me
I've been promised I don't have to do shitty field work anymore, and can just do office work if I want.

Everyone else in the office is stuck and had no real option but to sign their new contract so they can keep getting a paycheck.  I was the lone hold out.  The change didn't affect anyone else nearly as much as it affected me.  It pretty much worked out to equal compensation for everyone, except 2 of us senior guys, and it affected me much more harshly than the other guy.  All in all though I think it ended up working out in my favor, and should actually decrease my time to FIRE by a couple years or more.

*unlimited in the sense that it's only limited by my ability to get my job done.  Not truly unlimited, but I won't hit a point where they say "no you can't take that day off because you already took 14 days off!".  I'm skeptical how it's all going to work out.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Tyson on August 14, 2017, 02:36:27 PM
So I come into work last week and SURPRISE the company you've worked at for 11 years has been sold! And those raises we promised...how about a pay cut instead?

They calculated my pay rate by excluding the bonus I get (about 15% of my total compensation) to get my "base pay", and then basically giving me that.  They also don't cover nearly as much of the insurance premiums as my previous employer.  The end result is that I previously paid about $1500/yr total for insurance for me and my wife, and now the insurance is switching over at 7 months pregnancy and the my new "family" premiums are going to be over $10k/yr.  I expected a slight jump in insurance when we added a kid, but they've totally changed the rules of the game just before the birth, without ever giving me a heads up, and it's going to affect me about $8k/yr.   

I told them the offer was bullshit and that I'm confident I can go find an engineering job paying more than that immediately.  They want me to start off at the bottom and prove myself, even though I have 11 years experience and played a large part in building the company to the level it was at.  I also have plenty of money socked away and could live for a couple years with no job if necessary.  So I told them all to stuff it and cleaned out my desk and walked out. 

Apparently that got their attention, and after a week of tense back and forth negotiation I now have a new contract.  With this new contract I get:

$13k/yr more salary
Large performance based bonus (estimated $10-15k/yr)
performance review/raise halfway between now and the next normal scheduled review
3 weeks paid paternity leave
"unlimited"* vacation
2 employees under me
I've been promised I don't have to do shitty field work anymore, and can just do office work if I want.

That is freaking AWESOME!!!!  Yeah, the way of the mustache definitely lets you handle these situations from a position of power, which is definitely NOT the norm :)
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Warlord1986 on August 14, 2017, 02:40:24 PM

A shitload of awesome.

You are the hero we both need and deserve.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Dicey on August 14, 2017, 02:43:14 PM
Totally badass, frugalnacho. Congratulations to you, both on your incoming bundle of joy, and your excellent negotiating tactics.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: RyanAtTanagra on August 14, 2017, 02:43:22 PM
So I told them all to stuff it and cleaned out my desk and walked out. 

Apparently that got their attention, and after a week of tense back and forth negotiation I now have a new contract.

Perfect use of FU money, congratulations!  It's amazing how much the game of life changes for the better when you just have a little savings.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Dicey on August 14, 2017, 03:44:27 PM
So I told them all to stuff it and cleaned out my desk and walked out. 

Apparently that got their attention, and after a week of tense back and forth negotiation I now have a new contract.

Perfect use of FU money, congratulations!  It's amazing how much the game of life changes for the better when you just have a little savings.
Or a lot.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: LeRainDrop on August 14, 2017, 04:25:00 PM
Hell yeah, frugalnacho!  I'm sorry to hear you've had so many stresses on you lately, but that is one beautiful FU story that you really made work to your advantage!  Congrats on the successful negotiation and wishing you much happiness with your wife and the new baby!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: mm1970 on August 14, 2017, 06:31:52 PM
A beautiful story that brought tears to my eyes.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: mustachepungoeshere on August 14, 2017, 08:17:38 PM
PTF
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Zamboni on August 14, 2017, 10:28:16 PM
Well done!

FU money proves, once again, to be a wonderful thing.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Adventine on August 14, 2017, 10:56:13 PM
Some minor back story for me:  My parents got foreclosed on 5 years ago, and I let them move into my house for far below fair market value (about $400-500 below FMV, I just asked them to reimburse me for the mortgage/taxes/insurance).  They lived there for 5 years and did not take care of the place.  I finally asked them to leave because I wanted to sell it, and they got all pissed off and it's caused a huge rift in the family.  Things are not good between me and them still. They got all huffy and moved out within a couple weeks and left the place in total disarray. I don't think they cleaned anything the whole time they were there.  So for the past month I've been cleaning it up and fixing things up (up to about $14K so far plus a couple hundred hours between me/wife/her family).    Also we are about 7 months pregnant after a long battle with infertility and going through IVF (and saving up for IVF because we ended up spending about $40k all said and done).  There have been some other major life stresses that I don't even need to go into now.  Suffice to say my life has been shitty and one big ball of stress for several months now.

So I come into work last week and SURPRISE the company you've worked at for 11 years has been sold! And those raises we promised...how about a pay cut instead?

They calculated my pay rate by excluding the bonus I get (about 15% of my total compensation) to get my "base pay", and then basically giving me that.  They also don't cover nearly as much of the insurance premiums as my previous employer.  The end result is that I previously paid about $1500/yr total for insurance for me and my wife, and now the insurance is switching over at 7 months pregnancy and the my new "family" premiums are going to be over $10k/yr.  I expected a slight jump in insurance when we added a kid, but they've totally changed the rules of the game just before the birth, without ever giving me a heads up, and it's going to affect me about $8k/yr.   

I told them the offer was bullshit and that I'm confident I can go find an engineering job paying more than that immediately.  They want me to start off at the bottom and prove myself, even though I have 11 years experience and played a large part in building the company to the level it was at.  I also have plenty of money socked away and could live for a couple years with no job if necessary.  So I told them all to stuff it and cleaned out my desk and walked out. 

Apparently that got their attention, and after a week of tense back and forth negotiation I now have a new contract.  With this new contract I get:

$13k/yr more salary
Large performance based bonus (estimated $10-15k/yr)
performance review/raise halfway between now and the next normal scheduled review
3 weeks paid paternity leave
"unlimited"* vacation
2 employees under me
I've been promised I don't have to do shitty field work anymore, and can just do office work if I want.

Everyone else in the office is stuck and had no real option but to sign their new contract so they can keep getting a paycheck.  I was the lone hold out.  The change didn't affect anyone else nearly as much as it affected me.  It pretty much worked out to equal compensation for everyone, except 2 of us senior guys, and it affected me much more harshly than the other guy.  All in all though I think it ended up working out in my favor, and should actually decrease my time to FIRE by a couple years or more.

*unlimited in the sense that it's only limited by my ability to get my job done.  Not truly unlimited, but I won't hit a point where they say "no you can't take that day off because you already took 14 days off!".  I'm skeptical how it's all going to work out.

Go, frugalnacho!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Paul der Krake on August 15, 2017, 01:12:06 AM
Very nice.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: FIREby35 on August 15, 2017, 07:10:03 AM
FU Money is so powerful. Great job.

I can't help make a slightly larger comment. Can't you just hear all your friends who said bullshit about how your house was modest, your car was old, you are cheap? I know I can! They are the ones who have to meekly accept the attempted abuse you maneuvered away from. They keep thinking that savings is just about the money and things they want. Freedom, baby. It's about freedom.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: plainjane on August 15, 2017, 11:24:22 PM
*unlimited in the sense that it's only limited by my ability to get my job done.  Not truly unlimited, but I won't hit a point where they say "no you can't take that day off because you already took 14 days off!".  I'm skeptical how it's all going to work out.

Make sure you make a record of how many days minimum you think is fair to take and actually take them. It is so easy as a lower level manager & previous independent contributor with a performance bonus to keep on putting off using the vacation days, and you end up not taking them (and then not getting them paid back when you leave because that is part of the 'unlimited' tradeoff).
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: frugalnacho on August 16, 2017, 07:48:01 AM
*unlimited in the sense that it's only limited by my ability to get my job done.  Not truly unlimited, but I won't hit a point where they say "no you can't take that day off because you already took 14 days off!".  I'm skeptical how it's all going to work out.

Make sure you make a record of how many days minimum you think is fair to take and actually take them. It is so easy as a lower level manager & previous independent contributor with a performance bonus to keep on putting off using the vacation days, and you end up not taking them (and then not getting them paid back when you leave because that is part of the 'unlimited' tradeoff).

They seem pretty anal about everyone keeping track of jobs and projects and billable hours.   Part of the reason they gave me a raise and kept me is because they need me.  No one else in the organization can do exactly what I do, how I do it.  I'm critical to keeping this company running, at least in the short term.  I know I'm not truly irreplaceable, but I know they can't go hire someone and get them up to my level any time soon, and probably not for what they are paying me either, so for the next year at least they absolutely need me.  That's all great when I'm negotiating for a raise, but now a couple weeks in when I want to start using my "unlimited" vacation time...well fuck, we have a couple complicated reports that are due this week and no one else is capable of getting them done.  This is the exact reason they need me around, so it's not like I can just go on vacation for the rest of the week.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Sibley on August 16, 2017, 11:50:58 AM
*unlimited in the sense that it's only limited by my ability to get my job done.  Not truly unlimited, but I won't hit a point where they say "no you can't take that day off because you already took 14 days off!".  I'm skeptical how it's all going to work out.

Make sure you make a record of how many days minimum you think is fair to take and actually take them. It is so easy as a lower level manager & previous independent contributor with a performance bonus to keep on putting off using the vacation days, and you end up not taking them (and then not getting them paid back when you leave because that is part of the 'unlimited' tradeoff).

They seem pretty anal about everyone keeping track of jobs and projects and billable hours.   Part of the reason they gave me a raise and kept me is because they need me.  No one else in the organization can do exactly what I do, how I do it.  I'm critical to keeping this company running, at least in the short term.  I know I'm not truly irreplaceable, but I know they can't go hire someone and get them up to my level any time soon, and probably not for what they are paying me either, so for the next year at least they absolutely need me.  That's all great when I'm negotiating for a raise, but now a couple weeks in when I want to start using my "unlimited" vacation time...well fuck, we have a couple complicated reports that are due this week and no one else is capable of getting them done.  This is the exact reason they need me around, so it's not like I can just go on vacation for the rest of the week.

Friday + Monday is a lot easier than Monday - Friday. Just saying.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: frugalnacho on August 16, 2017, 12:53:28 PM
Friday + Monday is a lot easier than Monday - Friday. Just saying.

No doubt.  I'm going to start making Friday half days a thing.  And I'll probably try to take an actual week off twice annually.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: mtn on August 16, 2017, 01:40:00 PM
Friday + Monday is a lot easier than Monday - Friday. Just saying.

No doubt.  I'm going to start making Friday half days a thing.  And I'll probably try to take an actual week off twice annually.

If I were you, I'd schedule a 2 week vacation every year--schedule it 9 months in advance.

I wish I could do that, but the wife hates vacations that long--which I just cannot comprehend.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Primm on August 16, 2017, 07:45:06 PM
If I were you, I'd schedule a 2 week vacation every year--schedule it 9 months in advance.

I wish I could do that, but the wife hates vacations that long--which I just cannot comprehend.

2 weeks is the absolute minimum needed for an effective vacation, IMO.

Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: FIREby35 on August 16, 2017, 08:44:21 PM
I take the last Friday of every month off. It's amazing what 12 additional three day weekends will do for your mindset. They said unlimited...
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: BigHaus89 on August 17, 2017, 10:44:02 AM
I take the last Friday of every month off. It's amazing what 12 additional three day weekends will do for your mindset. They said unlimited...

+1 to this. I use basically all of my vacation for 3 and 4 day weekends. It really helps to recharge and still be able to get out and play.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: frugalnacho on August 17, 2017, 11:34:07 AM
I take the last Friday of every month off. It's amazing what 12 additional three day weekends will do for your mindset. They said unlimited...

That's a good idea, I might just adopt that.  I might also try to bail out early the other 3 fridays also.

2 one-week vacations = 10 days
12 month ending fridays = 12 days
40 other fridays (leave 2 hours early) = 10 days

for a total of 32 days.  That might be pushing it a little.  I'll see if I can get my work done with these new vacation days.  I could always make up extra time during the week if we are busy so I won't actually be taking more vacation, just time shifting the last 2 hours of my friday earlier into the week. 
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Mr Griz on August 17, 2017, 01:31:06 PM
We work a so-called 9/80 schedule with every other Friday off (in exchange for working 9 hour days). However, I have enough vacation time to take off all the working Friday's until my FIRE date next year. So basically I'm just working 4 day weeks from here on out. Sweet.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: honeybbq on August 17, 2017, 01:46:36 PM
Yay, frugal! So happy to hear. It's karma giving back to you after horrible infertility problems. Worst thing in life IMO.

Best of luck in your new role and as a new parent!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: JanF on August 17, 2017, 05:48:58 PM
posting to follow and be inspired!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Dicey on August 17, 2017, 10:22:49 PM
We work a so-called 9/80 schedule with every other Friday off (in exchange for working 9 hour days). However, I have enough vacation time to take off all the working Friday's until my FIRE date next year. So basically I'm just working 4 day weeks from here on out. Sweet.
DH works that same schedule and we love it! He could do the same thing, but he hoards a good chunk of his very generous annual vacation allowance, partly because combining 9/80's, holidays and comp time is one of his favorite work-related games. His FIRE date isn't coming up quite as soon, but he will earn a generous pension with health benefits and COLA in just three more years. I can't wait!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: mm1970 on August 18, 2017, 11:41:56 AM
I take the last Friday of every month off. It's amazing what 12 additional three day weekends will do for your mindset. They said unlimited...

That's a good idea, I might just adopt that.  I might also try to bail out early the other 3 fridays also.

2 one-week vacations = 10 days
12 month ending fridays = 12 days
40 other fridays (leave 2 hours early) = 10 days

for a total of 32 days.  That might be pushing it a little.  I'll see if I can get my work done with these new vacation days.  I could always make up extra time during the week if we are busy so I won't actually be taking more vacation, just time shifting the last 2 hours of my friday earlier into the week.
I'm assuming you get holidays and sick time too?

I get 34 days of PTO a year, so if you are talking 32 days only, I'm not impressed.   If you add 9 holidays and 5 sick days, now we are talking.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: frugalnacho on August 18, 2017, 11:53:36 AM
I take the last Friday of every month off. It's amazing what 12 additional three day weekends will do for your mindset. They said unlimited...

That's a good idea, I might just adopt that.  I might also try to bail out early the other 3 fridays also.

2 one-week vacations = 10 days
12 month ending fridays = 12 days
40 other fridays (leave 2 hours early) = 10 days

for a total of 32 days.  That might be pushing it a little.  I'll see if I can get my work done with these new vacation days.  I could always make up extra time during the week if we are busy so I won't actually be taking more vacation, just time shifting the last 2 hours of my friday earlier into the week.
I'm assuming you get holidays and sick time too?

I get 34 days of PTO a year, so if you are talking 32 days only, I'm not impressed.   If you add 9 holidays and 5 sick days, now we are talking.

Add 9 holidays and 7 sick days to those figures.   Also add 15 days for paternity leave this year (though this will not be a recurring leave for me).
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: crispy on September 13, 2017, 09:01:28 PM
This may not be epic, but it sure made me feel better.

I work with a lot of awesome people, but one of the assistants to a high-level executive is just a nasty piece of work. She yells at people and just treats everyone like dirt. Shed is basically just a bully who thinks she is untouchable and acts accordingly.  She has always been particularly rude to me. I am fairly new and on probation, and I tend to be a friendly, easygoing person so I think she sees me as an easy target.

Back in July, she called me and went off about something stupid. I held my peace, but I  told my boss that she would never, ever speak to me like that again. I am not sure if something was said to her, but she has been semi-pleasant for the past few weeks. Last week, she was back at it and reduced our office assistant to tears. Today, while I was in another area working, she came into our office area, slammed the door as hard as she could and demanded to see me. Since I wasn't available she demanded to see my supervisor and threw a fit because she didn't like how I added something to MY  calendar (apparently blocking off the day for a full day meeting is JUST.NOT.DONE) and then just lied about another perceived infractions. My supervisor basically laughed in her face. She seriously caused a huge scene about a calendar entry.

When I heard about this, I walked down to her office and told her off in a very professional way. She said she had never felt so disrespected in her life, and I told her that she now has taste of what everyone else feels like they deal with her and told her she had better not lie about me again and to never, ever speak to me with an attitude.

When I walked back to my office, I told my supervisor what I had done and to expect her to file a complaint against me tomorrow. I told her (direct quote), "I may be a bitch, but I'm not her bitch" and walked out the door.

So basically, I will see what hits the fan tomorrow...and I don't care. I have watched this person bully people for months and many feel they can't say anything because they need their job. I can because I don't. That is a pretty awesome feeling.


Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: AccidentalMiser on September 13, 2017, 09:10:55 PM
This may not be epic, but it sure made me feel better.

I work with a lot of awesome people, but one of the assistants to a high-level executive is just a nasty piece of work. She yells at people and just treats everyone like dirt. Shed is basically just a bully who thinks she is untouchable and acts accordingly.  She has always been particularly rude to me. I am fairly new and on probation, and I tend to be a friendly, easygoing person so I think she sees me as an easy target.

Back in July, she called me and went off about something stupid. I held my peace, but I  told my boss that she would never, ever speak to me like that again. I am not sure if something was said to her, but she has been semi-pleasant for the past few weeks. Last week, she was back at it and reduced our office assistant to tears. Today, while I was in another area working, she came into our office area, slammed the door as hard as she could and demanded to see me. Since I wasn't available she demanded to see my supervisor and threw a fit because she didn't like how I added something to MY  calendar (apparently blocking off the day for a full day meeting is JUST.NOT.DONE) and then just lied about another perceived infractions. My supervisor basically laughed in her face.she seriously caused a huge scene about a calendar entry.

When I heard about this, I walked down to her office and told her off in a very professional way. She said she had never felt so disrespected in her life, and I told her that she now has taste of what everyone else feels like they deal with her and told her she had better not lie about me again and to never, ever speak to me with an attitude.

When I walked back to my office, I told my supervisor what I had done and to expect her to file a complaint against me tomorrow. I told her (direct quote), "I may be a bitch, but I'm not her bitch" and walked out the door.

So basically, I will see what hits the fan tomorrow...and I don't care. I have watched this person bully people for months and many feel they can't say anything because they need their job. I can because I don't. That is a pretty awesome feeling.

Bravo for you.  We have an executive assistant that is similar at my company.  We call her "Barbzilla".  Hopefully, everything will work out for the best!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: SwordGuy on September 13, 2017, 09:33:24 PM
So basically, I will see what hits the fan tomorrow...and I don't care. I have watched this person bully people for months and many feel they can't say anything because they need their job. I can because I don't. That is a pretty awesome feeling.

First of all, thanks.   Thanks for all the folks who aren't in a position to defend themselves.   
Management will tend to ignore her behavior until they can't - and you've made it visible enough that they may have to stop ignoring it.

Second, bravo for being prepared!

I try to tell folks you're just one psycho boss away from hell, so be prepared.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: MonkeyJenga on September 13, 2017, 09:48:59 PM
This may not be epic, but it sure made me feel better.

I work with a lot of awesome people, but one of the assistants to a high-level executive is just a nasty piece of work. She yells at people and just treats everyone like dirt. Shed is basically just a bully who thinks she is untouchable and acts accordingly.  She has always been particularly rude to me. I am fairly new and on probation, and I tend to be a friendly, easygoing person so I think she sees me as an easy target.

Back in July, she called me and went off about something stupid. I held my peace, but I  told my boss that she would never, ever speak to me like that again. I am not sure if something was said to her, but she has been semi-pleasant for the past few weeks. Last week, she was back at it and reduced our office assistant to tears. Today, while I was in another area working, she came into our office area, slammed the door as hard as she could and demanded to see me. Since I wasn't available she demanded to see my supervisor and threw a fit because she didn't like how I added something to MY  calendar (apparently blocking off the day for a full day meeting is JUST.NOT.DONE) and then just lied about another perceived infractions. My supervisor basically laughed in her face. She seriously caused a huge scene about a calendar entry.

When I heard about this, I walked down to her office and told her off in a very professional way. She said she had never felt so disrespected in her life, and I told her that she now has taste of what everyone else feels like they deal with her and told her she had better not lie about me again and to never, ever speak to me with an attitude.

When I walked back to my office, I told my supervisor what I had done and to expect her to file a complaint against me tomorrow. I told her (direct quote), "I may be a bitch, but I'm not her bitch" and walked out the door.

So basically, I will see what hits the fan tomorrow...and I don't care. I have watched this person bully people for months and many feel they can't say anything because they need their job. I can because I don't. That is a pretty awesome feeling.

Um, this is epic. Come on, it ends with you saying to your boss, "I may be a bitch, but I'm not her bitch," dropping the mic, and walking the fuck out! I LOVE IT.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: arebelspy on September 13, 2017, 10:12:12 PM
When I walked back to my office, I told my supervisor what I had done and to expect her to file a complaint against me tomorrow. I told her (direct quote), "I may be a bitch, but I'm not her bitch" and walked out the door.

BADASS!

(https://media.giphy.com/media/lBoSfr97eDG7u/giphy.gif)
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Gone Fishing on September 13, 2017, 11:48:47 PM
...I tend to be a friendly, easygoing person so I think she sees me as an easy target.

Yep.  That's what they do. 

A few years ago, I was assigned to work with (but not for) a fellow known for yelling at people.  Knowing his reputation, I decided that if he ever came into my office and gave me shit, I was going to stand up and tell him to get the hell out.  Sadly, we were reassigned just a month or two later, and I never got to use my line:(
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Adventine on September 14, 2017, 01:22:44 AM
This may not be epic, but it sure made me feel better.

I work with a lot of awesome people, but one of the assistants to a high-level executive is just a nasty piece of work. She yells at people and just treats everyone like dirt. Shed is basically just a bully who thinks she is untouchable and acts accordingly.  She has always been particularly rude to me. I am fairly new and on probation, and I tend to be a friendly, easygoing person so I think she sees me as an easy target.

Back in July, she called me and went off about something stupid. I held my peace, but I  told my boss that she would never, ever speak to me like that again. I am not sure if something was said to her, but she has been semi-pleasant for the past few weeks. Last week, she was back at it and reduced our office assistant to tears. Today, while I was in another area working, she came into our office area, slammed the door as hard as she could and demanded to see me. Since I wasn't available she demanded to see my supervisor and threw a fit because she didn't like how I added something to MY  calendar (apparently blocking off the day for a full day meeting is JUST.NOT.DONE) and then just lied about another perceived infractions. My supervisor basically laughed in her face. She seriously caused a huge scene about a calendar entry.

When I heard about this, I walked down to her office and told her off in a very professional way. She said she had never felt so disrespected in her life, and I told her that she now has taste of what everyone else feels like they deal with her and told her she had better not lie about me again and to never, ever speak to me with an attitude.

When I walked back to my office, I told my supervisor what I had done and to expect her to file a complaint against me tomorrow. I told her (direct quote), "I may be a bitch, but I'm not her bitch" and walked out the door.

So basically, I will see what hits the fan tomorrow...and I don't care. I have watched this person bully people for months and many feel they can't say anything because they need their job. I can because I don't. That is a pretty awesome feeling.

You're awesome.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: shelivesthedream on September 14, 2017, 03:51:23 AM
Pleeeeeaaaase update us on how she reacts. That was mega!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: HairyUpperLip on September 14, 2017, 09:32:45 AM
Wow, nice. Also looking forward to the update.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: mm1970 on September 14, 2017, 09:46:47 AM
I take the last Friday of every month off. It's amazing what 12 additional three day weekends will do for your mindset. They said unlimited...

That's a good idea, I might just adopt that.  I might also try to bail out early the other 3 fridays also.

2 one-week vacations = 10 days
12 month ending fridays = 12 days
40 other fridays (leave 2 hours early) = 10 days

for a total of 32 days.  That might be pushing it a little.  I'll see if I can get my work done with these new vacation days.  I could always make up extra time during the week if we are busy so I won't actually be taking more vacation, just time shifting the last 2 hours of my friday earlier into the week.
I'm assuming you get holidays and sick time too?

I get 34 days of PTO a year, so if you are talking 32 days only, I'm not impressed.   If you add 9 holidays and 5 sick days, now we are talking.

Add 9 holidays and 7 sick days to those figures.   Also add 15 days for paternity leave this year (though this will not be a recurring leave for me).
Much better.  I interviewed at a company whose starting PTO was 19 days...sick, holiday, and vacation ... and they couldn't understand why they were unable to attract talent, especially people with experience.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: crispy on September 14, 2017, 12:23:38 PM
Well, nothing has been said by her at all.  My supervisor did let me know she has my back if she wants to start something and the few coworkers who have heard about it have high-fived me.    Our big director is out of the office today so it is possible that there could be some repercussions on that end although I suspect the big director will not be inclined to do much because I know she has been on the receiving end of her wrath, too. I have been in a great mood all day.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: RyanAtTanagra on September 14, 2017, 12:25:10 PM
Good job!  My favorite uses of FU money are the ones that benefit others, so bravo to that!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Meowmalade on September 14, 2017, 12:54:07 PM
Well, nothing has been said by her at all.  My supervisor did let me know she has my back if she wants to start something and the few coworkers who have heard about it have high-fived me.    Our big director is out of the office today so it is possible that there could be some repercussions on that end although I suspect the big director will not be inclined to do much because I know she has been on the receiving end of her wrath, too. I have been in a great mood all day.

You're the office hero!!  I bet there were so many other people who wanted to tell her off for ages, but didn't.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Roe on September 14, 2017, 03:21:36 PM
We work a so-called 9/80 schedule with every other Friday off (in exchange for working 9 hour days). However, I have enough vacation time to take off all the working Friday's until my FIRE date next year. So basically I'm just working 4 day weeks from here on out. Sweet.

 Well planned! Will be a nice, smooth sailing up until FIRE.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Zamboni on September 14, 2017, 09:16:48 PM
This may not be epic, but it sure made me feel better.

I work with a lot of awesome people, but one of the assistants to a high-level executive is just a nasty piece of work. She yells at people and just treats everyone like dirt. Shed is basically just a bully who thinks she is untouchable and acts accordingly.  She has always been particularly rude to me. I am fairly new and on probation, and I tend to be a friendly, easygoing person so I think she sees me as an easy target.

Back in July, she called me and went off about something stupid. I held my peace, but I  told my boss that she would never, ever speak to me like that again. I am not sure if something was said to her, but she has been semi-pleasant for the past few weeks. Last week, she was back at it and reduced our office assistant to tears. Today, while I was in another area working, she came into our office area, slammed the door as hard as she could and demanded to see me. Since I wasn't available she demanded to see my supervisor and threw a fit because she didn't like how I added something to MY  calendar (apparently blocking off the day for a full day meeting is JUST.NOT.DONE) and then just lied about another perceived infractions. My supervisor basically laughed in her face.she seriously caused a huge scene about a calendar entry.

When I heard about this, I walked down to her office and told her off in a very professional way. She said she had never felt so disrespected in her life, and I told her that she now has taste of what everyone else feels like they deal with her and told her she had better not lie about me again and to never, ever speak to me with an attitude.

When I walked back to my office, I told my supervisor what I had done and to expect her to file a complaint against me tomorrow. I told her (direct quote), "I may be a bitch, but I'm not her bitch" and walked out the door.

So basically, I will see what hits the fan tomorrow...and I don't care. I have watched this person bully people for months and many feel they can't say anything because they need their job. I can because I don't. That is a pretty awesome feeling.

Bravo for you.  We have an executive assistant that is similar at my company.  We call her "Barbzilla".  Hopefully, everything will work out for the best!

Office nicknames for the awful are the best. We had an incompetent and particularly nasty accountant once who earned the nickname "SheDemon." But of course, everyone pronounced it Shed-eh-mon . . . it was a great inside joke.

Well done, crispy. She flipped out about how you had saved something on your calendar? That's in seriously cray-cray land.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Dicey on September 14, 2017, 10:01:27 PM
Way to cream her, crispy!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: sequoia on September 15, 2017, 04:10:06 AM
This may not be epic, but it sure made me feel better.

I work with a lot of awesome people, but one of the assistants to a high-level executive is just a nasty piece of work. She yells at people and just treats everyone like dirt. Shed is basically just a bully who thinks she is untouchable and acts accordingly.  She has always been particularly rude to me. I am fairly new and on probation, and I tend to be a friendly, easygoing person so I think she sees me as an easy target.

Back in July, she called me and went off about something stupid. I held my peace, but I  told my boss that she would never, ever speak to me like that again. I am not sure if something was said to her, but she has been semi-pleasant for the past few weeks. Last week, she was back at it and reduced our office assistant to tears. Today, while I was in another area working, she came into our office area, slammed the door as hard as she could and demanded to see me. Since I wasn't available she demanded to see my supervisor and threw a fit because she didn't like how I added something to MY  calendar (apparently blocking off the day for a full day meeting is JUST.NOT.DONE) and then just lied about another perceived infractions. My supervisor basically laughed in her face. She seriously caused a huge scene about a calendar entry.

When I heard about this, I walked down to her office and told her off in a very professional way. She said she had never felt so disrespected in her life, and I told her that she now has taste of what everyone else feels like they deal with her and told her she had better not lie about me again and to never, ever speak to me with an attitude.

When I walked back to my office, I told my supervisor what I had done and to expect her to file a complaint against me tomorrow. I told her (direct quote), "I may be a bitch, but I'm not her bitch" and walked out the door.

So basically, I will see what hits the fan tomorrow...and I don't care. I have watched this person bully people for months and many feel they can't say anything because they need their job. I can because I don't. That is a pretty awesome feeling.

If I work at the same place as you, I would be buying you lunch for this! This is soo epic!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: DeepEllumStache on September 15, 2017, 07:11:14 AM
That was perfection. Well done with the office bully.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Ladychips on September 15, 2017, 08:39:28 AM
She said she had never felt so disrespected in her life, and I told her that she now has taste of what everyone else feels like they deal with her...

It could be that this is the first time she ever saw her behavior through another person's eyes.  You might be the catalyst that makes her change the way she treats people for the better.  If not, you have likely been the first chink in the wall that will eventually come crumbling down around her. 

Good for you!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: jrbrokerr on September 15, 2017, 12:19:22 PM
This may not be epic, but it sure made me feel better.

I work with a lot of awesome people, but one of the assistants to a high-level executive is just a nasty piece of work. She yells at people and just treats everyone like dirt. Shed is basically just a bully who thinks she is untouchable and acts accordingly.  She has always been particularly rude to me. I am fairly new and on probation, and I tend to be a friendly, easygoing person so I think she sees me as an easy target.

Back in July, she called me and went off about something stupid. I held my peace, but I  told my boss that she would never, ever speak to me like that again. I am not sure if something was said to her, but she has been semi-pleasant for the past few weeks. Last week, she was back at it and reduced our office assistant to tears. Today, while I was in another area working, she came into our office area, slammed the door as hard as she could and demanded to see me. Since I wasn't available she demanded to see my supervisor and threw a fit because she didn't like how I added something to MY  calendar (apparently blocking off the day for a full day meeting is JUST.NOT.DONE) and then just lied about another perceived infractions. My supervisor basically laughed in her face.she seriously caused a huge scene about a calendar entry.

When I heard about this, I walked down to her office and told her off in a very professional way. She said she had never felt so disrespected in her life, and I told her that she now has taste of what everyone else feels like they deal with her and told her she had better not lie about me again and to never, ever speak to me with an attitude.

When I walked back to my office, I told my supervisor what I had done and to expect her to file a complaint against me tomorrow. I told her (direct quote), "I may be a bitch, but I'm not her bitch" and walked out the door.

So basically, I will see what hits the fan tomorrow...and I don't care. I have watched this person bully people for months and many feel they can't say anything because they need their job. I can because I don't. That is a pretty awesome feeling.

Bravo for you.  We have an executive assistant that is similar at my company.  We call her "Barbzilla".  Hopefully, everything will work out for the best!


Good for you and for your colleagues!! I know your feeling because I have used FU money in a similar way by challenging ass*** managers who think they are the corporate Gods. People in my team also view me as a hero and just don´t understand why I am always so careless of the consequences of my attitude.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: TartanTallulah on September 15, 2017, 03:15:13 PM
This may not be epic, but it sure made me feel better.

I work with a lot of awesome people, but one of the assistants to a high-level executive is just a nasty piece of work. She yells at people and just treats everyone like dirt. Shed is basically just a bully who thinks she is untouchable and acts accordingly.  She has always been particularly rude to me. I am fairly new and on probation, and I tend to be a friendly, easygoing person so I think she sees me as an easy target.

Back in July, she called me and went off about something stupid. I held my peace, but I  told my boss that she would never, ever speak to me like that again. I am not sure if something was said to her, but she has been semi-pleasant for the past few weeks. Last week, she was back at it and reduced our office assistant to tears. Today, while I was in another area working, she came into our office area, slammed the door as hard as she could and demanded to see me. Since I wasn't available she demanded to see my supervisor and threw a fit because she didn't like how I added something to MY  calendar (apparently blocking off the day for a full day meeting is JUST.NOT.DONE) and then just lied about another perceived infractions. My supervisor basically laughed in her face. She seriously caused a huge scene about a calendar entry.

When I heard about this, I walked down to her office and told her off in a very professional way. She said she had never felt so disrespected in her life, and I told her that she now has taste of what everyone else feels like they deal with her and told her she had better not lie about me again and to never, ever speak to me with an attitude.

When I walked back to my office, I told my supervisor what I had done and to expect her to file a complaint against me tomorrow. I told her (direct quote), "I may be a bitch, but I'm not her bitch" and walked out the door.

So basically, I will see what hits the fan tomorrow...and I don't care. I have watched this person bully people for months and many feel they can't say anything because they need their job. I can because I don't. That is a pretty awesome feeling.

Totally epic.

Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: BlueHouse on September 20, 2017, 02:42:22 PM
This may not be epic, but it sure made me feel better.

I work with a lot of awesome people, but one of the assistants to a high-level executive is just a nasty piece of work. She yells at people and just treats everyone like dirt. Shed is basically just a bully who thinks she is untouchable and acts accordingly.  She has always been particularly rude to me. I am fairly new and on probation, and I tend to be a friendly, easygoing person so I think she sees me as an easy target.

Back in July, she called me and went off about something stupid. I held my peace, but I  told my boss that she would never, ever speak to me like that again. I am not sure if something was said to her, but she has been semi-pleasant for the past few weeks. Last week, she was back at it and reduced our office assistant to tears. Today, while I was in another area working, she came into our office area, slammed the door as hard as she could and demanded to see me. Since I wasn't available she demanded to see my supervisor and threw a fit because she didn't like how I added something to MY  calendar (apparently blocking off the day for a full day meeting is JUST.NOT.DONE) and then just lied about another perceived infractions. My supervisor basically laughed in her face. She seriously caused a huge scene about a calendar entry.

When I heard about this, I walked down to her office and told her off in a very professional way. She said she had never felt so disrespected in her life, and I told her that she now has taste of what everyone else feels like they deal with her and told her she had better not lie about me again and to never, ever speak to me with an attitude.

When I walked back to my office, I told my supervisor what I had done and to expect her to file a complaint against me tomorrow. I told her (direct quote), "I may be a bitch, but I'm not her bitch" and walked out the door.

So basically, I will see what hits the fan tomorrow...and I don't care. I have watched this person bully people for months and many feel they can't say anything because they need their job. I can because I don't. That is a pretty awesome feeling.

Totally epic.
Need update.  Quick, quick!  This type of epic FU gives me hope!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: crispy on September 20, 2017, 09:25:17 PM
This may not be epic, but it sure made me feel better.

I work with a lot of awesome people, but one of the assistants to a high-level executive is just a nasty piece of work. She yells at people and just treats everyone like dirt. Shed is basically just a bully who thinks she is untouchable and acts accordingly.  She has always been particularly rude to me. I am fairly new and on probation, and I tend to be a friendly, easygoing person so I think she sees me as an easy target.

Back in July, she called me and went off about something stupid. I held my peace, but I  told my boss that she would never, ever speak to me like that again. I am not sure if something was said to her, but she has been semi-pleasant for the past few weeks. Last week, she was back at it and reduced our office assistant to tears. Today, while I was in another area working, she came into our office area, slammed the door as hard as she could and demanded to see me. Since I wasn't available she demanded to see my supervisor and threw a fit because she didn't like how I added something to MY  calendar (apparently blocking off the day for a full day meeting is JUST.NOT.DONE) and then just lied about another perceived infractions. My supervisor basically laughed in her face. She seriously caused a huge scene about a calendar entry.

When I heard about this, I walked down to her office and told her off in a very professional way. She said she had never felt so disrespected in her life, and I told her that she now has taste of what everyone else feels like they deal with her and told her she had better not lie about me again and to never, ever speak to me with an attitude.

When I walked back to my office, I told my supervisor what I had done and to expect her to file a complaint against me tomorrow. I told her (direct quote), "I may be a bitch, but I'm not her bitch" and walked out the door.

So basically, I will see what hits the fan tomorrow...and I don't care. I have watched this person bully people for months and many feel they can't say anything because they need their job. I can because I don't. That is a pretty awesome feeling.

Totally epic.
Need update.  Quick, quick!  This type of epic FU gives me hope!

Two little updates - My director heard what happened and said not to worry about it because she trusts that I was professional and shared some of the crap she has had to put up with from her. About three hours later, the director came in smiling and shared that executive assistant was rude to her so she promptly put her in her place. Executive assistant then called and apologized to her (this event happened in front of a high level person so I think she was forced). I think I started a mini-revolution.

On a great note, this week the auditors from the group that regulates/accredits us showed up. The area I work in was slammed and had a lot of findings during the last audit which was before I started. I have spent the ten months I have worked here preparing for this and cleaning up the mess that was left. I am the only person that does my particular job so if we get findings in that area, it falls on my head. My area (and the department that my area falls under) received no findings at all which has never happened before. We are the only department that didn't get some finding so we are basically the shining stars right now.

That was why I was so annoyed last week...I have been busting my tail off to get prepared for this audit because we didn't know when they would show up (they give you a three month time frame but no specific dates...they just show up) and she is acting like a damn fool over an Outlook calendar entry. On a funnier note, the auditor I worked with today was complaining that he didn't get lunch yesterday...guess who was responsible for ordering food?
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: okits on September 20, 2017, 09:47:20 PM
I think I started a mini-revolution.

Go crispy, you epic badass.  :) Thanks for the story and update!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: shelivesthedream on September 21, 2017, 02:03:34 AM
Amazing! Such congratulations!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Raenia on September 21, 2017, 05:48:33 AM
That's awesome, crispy, good for you!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: cavewoman on September 21, 2017, 07:28:29 AM
That's super badass!  I once had a similar executive assistant whom we nicknamed elizabitch.  Either toxic or sweet as pie, and very sneaky once you were on her bad side.  Kudos to you!!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Sibley on September 21, 2017, 08:19:20 AM
That was why I was so annoyed last week...I have been busting my tail off to get prepared for this audit because we didn't know when they would show up (they give you a three month time frame but no specific dates...they just show up) and she is acting like a damn fool over an Outlook calendar entry. On a funnier note, the auditor I worked with today was complaining that he didn't get lunch yesterday...guess who was responsible for ordering food?

I'm an auditor, and I deal with external auditors as well. Escalate this. Seriously. If you promise me food, and don't provide it, you make me crabby. Trust me, you do NOT want to make your auditor crabby. I can make your life so much harder. I can decide to write the finding when it could go either way. There can be serious consequences to pissing off your auditors, and you do not know these people. This one person could significantly hurt the company by pulling those types of stunts.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Cache_Stash on September 21, 2017, 08:04:15 PM
That was why I was so annoyed last week...I have been busting my tail off to get prepared for this audit because we didn't know when they would show up (they give you a three month time frame but no specific dates...they just show up) and she is acting like a damn fool over an Outlook calendar entry. On a funnier note, the auditor I worked with today was complaining that he didn't get lunch yesterday...guess who was responsible for ordering food?

I'm an auditor, and I deal with external auditors as well. Escalate this. Seriously. If you promise me food, and don't provide it, you make me crabby. Trust me, you do NOT want to make your auditor crabby. I can make your life so much harder. I can decide to write the finding when it could go either way. There can be serious consequences to pissing off your auditors, and you do not know these people. This one person could significantly hurt the company by pulling those types of stunts.

One of our problems in this world: People can be petty.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Daisy on September 21, 2017, 08:14:05 PM

So now I am in a pickle. I decided to stand up for the disabled rights. I could have just taken the punishment, not gone to HR, and ended up getting laid off, but now it seems I have turned things around with my d**k managers (after HR probably scared them) and now I may not have grounds to go to HR and ask for a buyout package. And after managers are now being nice to me, I may feel obligated to continue on for a while.

But I really want to FIRE...and do it with a package.

...Or at least they are just scared of lawyers getting involved.

Maybe they're still scared, and they'd be willing to arrange a package if asked?  After all, the managers got better, but they should have been properly trained in the first place, the company is still at fault. If HR has any wiggle room to arrange a package, whether due to these incidents or other grounds, perhaps they would still do it.  Especially if you're up front that the managers improved, and you appreciate that HR did a good job fixing it, you're "asking only for whatever is actually within their professional discretion to arrange" or some such?

Good luck pulling the ripcord in any case.

This may or may not have worked...that's all I am saying.

BTW, I am FIRE'ing on 9/29!

Another epic FU story win!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Daisy on September 21, 2017, 08:24:55 PM
Non-disclosure agreement, perhaps?   I know, you can't say.   But that doesn't mean we can't guess!

Well played, Daisy.    Looking forward to welcoming you to FIREdom.

I would never corroborate such a crazy suggestion.

But I do welcome guesses. But I am not going to confirm or deny anything.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: okits on September 21, 2017, 08:24:10 PM

So now I am in a pickle. I decided to stand up for the disabled rights. I could have just taken the punishment, not gone to HR, and ended up getting laid off, but now it seems I have turned things around with my d**k managers (after HR probably scared them) and now I may not have grounds to go to HR and ask for a buyout package. And after managers are now being nice to me, I may feel obligated to continue on for a while.

But I really want to FIRE...and do it with a package.

...Or at least they are just scared of lawyers getting involved.

Maybe they're still scared, and they'd be willing to arrange a package if asked?  After all, the managers got better, but they should have been properly trained in the first place, the company is still at fault. If HR has any wiggle room to arrange a package, whether due to these incidents or other grounds, perhaps they would still do it.  Especially if you're up front that the managers improved, and you appreciate that HR did a good job fixing it, you're "asking only for whatever is actually within their professional discretion to arrange" or some such?

Good luck pulling the ripcord in any case.

This may or may not have worked...that's all I am saying.

BTW, I am FIRE'ing on 9/29!

Another epic FU story win!

We may or may not be thrilled for you.  :) Go, Daisy!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Playing with Fire UK on September 22, 2017, 01:30:16 AM
I'm gonna say it: I'm definitely thrilled.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: arebelspy on September 22, 2017, 07:29:38 AM
Glad to hear it Daisy!  Well deserved! :)
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: frugalnacho on September 22, 2017, 07:39:44 AM
I take the last Friday of every month off. It's amazing what 12 additional three day weekends will do for your mindset. They said unlimited...

That's a good idea, I might just adopt that.  I might also try to bail out early the other 3 fridays also.

2 one-week vacations = 10 days
12 month ending fridays = 12 days
40 other fridays (leave 2 hours early) = 10 days

for a total of 32 days.  That might be pushing it a little.  I'll see if I can get my work done with these new vacation days.  I could always make up extra time during the week if we are busy so I won't actually be taking more vacation, just time shifting the last 2 hours of my friday earlier into the week.

My wife was in a car accident on saturday and the car is totalled, so we've been dealing with insurance and replacing her car all week.  I've only been at work 16 hours so far this week, and half of that has been spent either dealing with the insurance or researching replacement cars.  Not sure exactly how I'm going to record this on my time sheets, but my bosses aren't giving me any shit about it yet. I'm still taking 3 weeks paternity in 2-4 weeks.

EDIT: I accidentally a sentence.  And yes her and the baby are fine. 
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: arebelspy on September 22, 2017, 08:06:26 AM
Yikes! Hope she and the baby are okay, FN!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: With This Herring on September 22, 2017, 08:33:51 AM
That was why I was so annoyed last week...I have been busting my tail off to get prepared for this audit because we didn't know when they would show up (they give you a three month time frame but no specific dates...they just show up) and she is acting like a damn fool over an Outlook calendar entry. On a funnier note, the auditor I worked with today was complaining that he didn't get lunch yesterday...guess who was responsible for ordering food?

I'm an auditor, and I deal with external auditors as well. Escalate this. Seriously. If you promise me food, and don't provide it, you make me crabby. Trust me, you do NOT want to make your auditor crabby. I can make your life so much harder. I can decide to write the finding when it could go either way. There can be serious consequences to pissing off your auditors, and you do not know these people. This one person could significantly hurt the company by pulling those types of stunts.

One of our problems in this world: People can be petty.

The problem is that people can be influenced by things subconsciously.  An adult relative will start getting really argumentative and upset with everyone whenever he is short on sleep.
"[Relative], you're tired!  Stop arguing with people and go take a nap!"
"I'm not tired!  You're just wrong about [some stupid thing]!"
...but then he's back to normal once he's had a nap.

At OldJob, we always made a point of feeding the external auditors well and giving them as much decent coffee as they wanted.





Daisy, congratulations on whatever you may or may not have arranged or negotiated!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: solon on September 22, 2017, 08:53:57 AM
EDIT: I accidentally a sentence.  And yes her and the baby are fine.

I think you accidentallied a word now, too.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: frugalnacho on September 22, 2017, 09:01:19 AM
EDIT: I accidentally a sentence.  And yes her and the baby are fine.

I think you accidentallied a word now, too.

(http://i0.kym-cdn.com/entries/icons/facebook/000/012/132/thatsthejoke.jpg)
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: solon on September 22, 2017, 09:05:58 AM
(https://i.imgflip.com/1wc35a.jpg) (https://imgflip.com/i/1wc35a)
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Dicey on September 22, 2017, 09:13:32 AM
You guys are hill airy ass.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: mm1970 on September 22, 2017, 09:43:10 AM
You guys are hill airy ass.

I LOLd
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: mtn on September 22, 2017, 09:57:35 AM
That was why I was so annoyed last week...I have been busting my tail off to get prepared for this audit because we didn't know when they would show up (they give you a three month time frame but no specific dates...they just show up) and she is acting like a damn fool over an Outlook calendar entry. On a funnier note, the auditor I worked with today was complaining that he didn't get lunch yesterday...guess who was responsible for ordering food?

I'm an auditor, and I deal with external auditors as well. Escalate this. Seriously. If you promise me food, and don't provide it, you make me crabby. Trust me, you do NOT want to make your auditor crabby. I can make your life so much harder. I can decide to write the finding when it could go either way. There can be serious consequences to pissing off your auditors, and you do not know these people. This one person could significantly hurt the company by pulling those types of stunts.

One of our problems in this world: People can be petty.

The problem is that people can be influenced by things subconsciously.  An adult relative will start getting really argumentative and upset with everyone whenever he is short on sleep.
"[Relative], you're tired!  Stop arguing with people and go take a nap!"
"I'm not tired!  You're just wrong about [some stupid thing]!"
...but then he's back to normal once he's had a nap.

At OldJob, we always made a point of feeding the external auditors well and giving them as much decent coffee as they wanted.





Daisy, congratulations on whatever you may or may not have arranged or negotiated!

With the auditors/examiners/whomever, it is a fine line. Take care of them with good coffee, a big room, be very friendly, do what you say you're going to do when you say you're going to do it, etc. But you don't want them to be too comfortable--don't give them the best chairs, try to keep them in a room without a window--things that will subconsciously make them want to get out of there, but aren't blatant.

I saw some analysis, the longer time that an auditor (broad term there) spent at a place, the more issues that were written up. The biggest predictor that an auditor would spend more time in a place? The location itself. For instance, a pharmaceutical plant in Nebraska has less scrutiny than one in San Diego or Chicago. Nobody from the FDA wants to hang out in Lincoln Nebraska; they want to get in and get out. But if they're in Chicago or San Diego (or insert place with reasonable tourism), then they'll extend their trip and find reasons to stay a little longer. "Yeah, I think I'll have to wrap this up on Tuesday instead of Friday; I'll have to stay the weekend--might as well take a trip to Tijuana!"
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: okits on September 22, 2017, 11:29:22 AM
I take the last Friday of every month off. It's amazing what 12 additional three day weekends will do for your mindset. They said unlimited...

That's a good idea, I might just adopt that.  I might also try to bail out early the other 3 fridays also.

2 one-week vacations = 10 days
12 month ending fridays = 12 days
40 other fridays (leave 2 hours early) = 10 days

for a total of 32 days.  That might be pushing it a little.  I'll see if I can get my work done with these new vacation days.  I could always make up extra time during the week if we are busy so I won't actually be taking more vacation, just time shifting the last 2 hours of my friday earlier into the week.

My wife was in a car accident on saturday and the car is totalled, so we've been dealing with insurance and replacing her car all week.  I've only been at work 16 hours so far this week, and half of that has been spent either dealing with the insurance or researching replacement cars.  Not sure exactly how I'm going to record this on my time sheets, but my bosses aren't giving me any shit about it yet. I'm still taking 3 weeks paternity in 2-4 weeks.

EDIT: I accidentally a sentence.  And yes her and the baby are fine. 

I'm glad wife and baby are okay, and that work is being understanding, so far.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Sibley on September 22, 2017, 01:59:09 PM
That was why I was so annoyed last week...I have been busting my tail off to get prepared for this audit because we didn't know when they would show up (they give you a three month time frame but no specific dates...they just show up) and she is acting like a damn fool over an Outlook calendar entry. On a funnier note, the auditor I worked with today was complaining that he didn't get lunch yesterday...guess who was responsible for ordering food?

I'm an auditor, and I deal with external auditors as well. Escalate this. Seriously. If you promise me food, and don't provide it, you make me crabby. Trust me, you do NOT want to make your auditor crabby. I can make your life so much harder. I can decide to write the finding when it could go either way. There can be serious consequences to pissing off your auditors, and you do not know these people. This one person could significantly hurt the company by pulling those types of stunts.

One of our problems in this world: People can be petty.

The problem is that people can be influenced by things subconsciously.  An adult relative will start getting really argumentative and upset with everyone whenever he is short on sleep.
"[Relative], you're tired!  Stop arguing with people and go take a nap!"
"I'm not tired!  You're just wrong about [some stupid thing]!"
...but then he's back to normal once he's had a nap.

At OldJob, we always made a point of feeding the external auditors well and giving them as much decent coffee as they wanted.





Daisy, congratulations on whatever you may or may not have arranged or negotiated!

With the auditors/examiners/whomever, it is a fine line. Take care of them with good coffee, a big room, be very friendly, do what you say you're going to do when you say you're going to do it, etc. But you don't want them to be too comfortable--don't give them the best chairs, try to keep them in a room without a window--things that will subconsciously make them want to get out of there, but aren't blatant.

I saw some analysis, the longer time that an auditor (broad term there) spent at a place, the more issues that were written up. The biggest predictor that an auditor would spend more time in a place? The location itself. For instance, a pharmaceutical plant in Nebraska has less scrutiny than one in San Diego or Chicago. Nobody from the FDA wants to hang out in Lincoln Nebraska; they want to get in and get out. But if they're in Chicago or San Diego (or insert place with reasonable tourism), then they'll extend their trip and find reasons to stay a little longer. "Yeah, I think I'll have to wrap this up on Tuesday instead of Friday; I'll have to stay the weekend--might as well take a trip to Tijuana!"

From experience:
Yes and no, and it entirely depends on the auditor. Some of them really want to go home, so they don't care about the location (I am one of those). Others will try to extend the time in nicer areas. I'm a weirdo, so overall the ones that will try to stay longer in the nice areas outnumber those like me. I want the decent setup, but I also want all the documents, right, organized, on time (early is good). Just so I can go home.

However, I freely admit that I have crabby tendencies. (Which sometimes show up online.) And I hate traveling for work. Not really a people person either.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: GettingClose on September 22, 2017, 05:03:29 PM
This isn't exactly an FU money story, but several months ago our CEO told me that they had "squeezed out" a $5k raise for me.  This would have put me into the position where I was earning just a bit more than 3x the salary of the newest person on my team.

My husband and I have a good annual income (probably 8x what we actually spend, not counting taxes), no debt, and savings such that he is just on point of FIREing.   $5000 * 60% (amount after taxes) is going to make basically no difference at all.  Told the CEO to gave the raise to New Guy instead.  It felt great, and still feels great, especially since no one else knows about it.

Even 5 years ago this would have been inconceivable.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Rowellen on September 22, 2017, 05:08:08 PM
This isn't exactly an FU money story, but several months ago our CEO told me that they had "squeezed out" a $5k raise for me.  This would have put me into the position where I was earning just a bit more than 3x the salary of the newest person on my team.

My husband and I have a good annual income (probably 8x what we actually spend, not counting taxes), no debt, and savings such that he is just on point of FIREing.   $5000 * 60% (amount after taxes) is going to make basically no difference at all.  Told the CEO to gave the raise to New Guy instead.  It felt great, and still feels great, especially since no one else knows about it.

Even 5 years ago this would have been inconceivable.

Wow. That is incredibly generous of you.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: SwordGuy on September 22, 2017, 06:54:45 PM
This isn't exactly an FU money story, but several months ago our CEO told me that they had "squeezed out" a $5k raise for me.  This would have put me into the position where I was earning just a bit more than 3x the salary of the newest person on my team.

My husband and I have a good annual income (probably 8x what we actually spend, not counting taxes), no debt, and savings such that he is just on point of FIREing.   $5000 * 60% (amount after taxes) is going to make basically no difference at all.  Told the CEO to gave the raise to New Guy instead.  It felt great, and still feels great, especially since no one else knows about it.

Even 5 years ago this would have been inconceivable.

Yeah for you!

Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: markbike528CBX on September 22, 2017, 07:20:52 PM
....they "squeezed out" a $5k raise for me.   ......
that phrase reminds me of a biological function.   see also " Don't step in the management" Dilbert book.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Daisy on September 22, 2017, 08:02:28 PM
Glad to hear it Daisy!  Well deserved! :)

Surely you jest.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: arebelspy on September 22, 2017, 09:44:20 PM
Glad to hear it Daisy!  Well deserved! :)

Surely you jest.

Not at all!

You stood up and said something when people were treating you unfairly due to the disability, doing the right thing not only for yourself, but anyone else who might be at that company presently or later.

You got a buy out for it, which is deserved, and that put you over the top to FIRE with your savings, which you had earned and deserved. Thus FIRE.  Well done!  :)
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Daisy on September 22, 2017, 09:59:21 PM
Glad to hear it Daisy!  Well deserved! :)

Surely you jest.

Not at all!

You stood up and said something when people were treating you unfairly due to the disability, doing the right thing not only for yourself, but anyone else who might be at that company presently or later.

You got a buy out for it, which is deserved, and that put you over the top to FIRE with your savings, which you had earned and deserved. Thus FIRE.  Well done!  :)

I will neither confirm nor deny any of the details of your post.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: gaja on September 23, 2017, 09:50:14 AM
This isn't exactly an FU money story, but several months ago our CEO told me that they had "squeezed out" a $5k raise for me.  This would have put me into the position where I was earning just a bit more than 3x the salary of the newest person on my team.

My husband and I have a good annual income (probably 8x what we actually spend, not counting taxes), no debt, and savings such that he is just on point of FIREing.   $5000 * 60% (amount after taxes) is going to make basically no difference at all.  Told the CEO to gave the raise to New Guy instead.  It felt great, and still feels great, especially since no one else knows about it.

Even 5 years ago this would have been inconceivable.
Well done! How did the CEO react?
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Secretly Saving on September 23, 2017, 12:12:52 PM
I was wondering this too!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: crispy on September 23, 2017, 12:55:01 PM
 Congrats, Daisy!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: retireatbirth on September 23, 2017, 08:13:39 PM
Just realized I had a mini FU a few weeks back. I had my mid year and since I hate my job and am contemplating just quitting, I took the time to complain about my job and demand changes within a few months. No shouting and I kept it professional. Things have improved a bit and boss is trying to make me happy now, but I know there's not much that could convince me to stay long anyways. I'm feeling empowered to be this blunt in all future reviews though as my finances will only keep putting ne in stronger and stronger position.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: shelivesthedream on September 24, 2017, 03:22:17 AM
This isn't exactly an FU money story, but several months ago our CEO told me that they had "squeezed out" a $5k raise for me.  This would have put me into the position where I was earning just a bit more than 3x the salary of the newest person on my team.

My husband and I have a good annual income (probably 8x what we actually spend, not counting taxes), no debt, and savings such that he is just on point of FIREing.   $5000 * 60% (amount after taxes) is going to make basically no difference at all.  Told the CEO to gave the raise to New Guy instead.  It felt great, and still feels great, especially since no one else knows about it.

Even 5 years ago this would have been inconceivable.
Well done! How did the CEO react?

That's amazing. You are such a thoughtful, generous person. What did the CEO say, though??
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: GettingClose on September 26, 2017, 11:36:25 AM
This isn't exactly an FU money story, but several months ago our CEO told me that they had "squeezed out" a $5k raise for me.  This would have put me into the position where I was earning just a bit more than 3x the salary of the newest person on my team.

My husband and I have a good annual income (probably 8x what we actually spend, not counting taxes), no debt, and savings such that he is just on point of FIREing.   $5000 * 60% (amount after taxes) is going to make basically no difference at all.  Told the CEO to gave the raise to New Guy instead.  It felt great, and still feels great, especially since no one else knows about it.

Even 5 years ago this would have been inconceivable.
Well done! How did the CEO react?

That's amazing. You are such a thoughtful, generous person. What did the CEO say, though??

Basically, "Wow - but it's your team, so ...."

I was trying to convey that this wasn't that generous an action  - New Guy was buying a house and had a combined household income of probably $70k.  Also, I have some opinions about fairness/equality in compensation, and it would have probably cost me considerably in the area of guilt (difficult to monetize) to have someone working the same hours as me for less than 1/3 the pay. It's my personal cutoff for whatever reason - I can justify 3x the salary due to my greater education, experience, innate ability, whatever - but not more than that.  Need to put my money where my mouth is to feel OK about myself.  I hope this makes sense.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: nawhite on September 26, 2017, 01:17:47 PM
Basically, "Wow - but it's your team, so ...."

I was trying to convey that this wasn't that generous an action  - New Guy was buying a house and had a combined household income of probably $70k.  Also, I have some opinions about fairness/equality in compensation, and it would have probably cost me considerably in the area of guilt (difficult to monetize) to have someone working the same hours as me for less than 1/3 the pay. It's my personal cutoff for whatever reason - I can justify 3x the salary due to my greater education, experience, innate ability, whatever - but not more than that.  Need to put my money where my mouth is to feel OK about myself.  I hope this makes sense.

Not downplaying this at all, I'm impressed you donated your money to some other cause, but just curious why you see that guy as more deserving of your money than people in other countries who don't make 1/3rd what you do but 1/3000th? ~20% of the worlds population makes less than $1/day. Sure you don't need it, but if you're going to donate your money to a charity, I think you should do it purposely in a way that best matches with your values rather than to some guy at work you feel bad for.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: GettingClose on September 26, 2017, 01:32:14 PM
Basically, "Wow - but it's your team, so ...."

I was trying to convey that this wasn't that generous an action  - New Guy was buying a house and had a combined household income of probably $70k.  Also, I have some opinions about fairness/equality in compensation, and it would have probably cost me considerably in the area of guilt (difficult to monetize) to have someone working the same hours as me for less than 1/3 the pay. It's my personal cutoff for whatever reason - I can justify 3x the salary due to my greater education, experience, innate ability, whatever - but not more than that.  Need to put my money where my mouth is to feel OK about myself.  I hope this makes sense.

Not downplaying this at all, I'm impressed you donated your money to some other cause, but just curious why you see that guy as more deserving of your money than people in other countries who don't make 1/3rd what you do but 1/3000th? ~20% of the worlds population makes less than $1/day. Sure you don't need it, but if you're going to donate your money to a charity, I think you should do it purposely in a way that best matches with your values rather than to some guy at work you feel bad for.

a) "charity starts at home" principle
b) I make other donations - but (despite the wording of point "a") there's a difference between charity and justice.  Can't articulate it very well; need to think more first. 
c) I work for a single company and have a single team, and this was my single chance to address income inequality in a meaningful way.  This particular instance had a name and a face, and rightly or wrongly, that matters.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Dicey on September 26, 2017, 09:12:55 PM
It's not wrong. It matters. Gotta say, that other comment made my blood boil.

Charity begins at home, indeed.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: shelivesthedream on September 27, 2017, 12:47:52 AM
Yup - seems like you acted exactly in line with your values regarding income inequality. And hopefully in a way that will make a long-term difference to the organisation. Good on you.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: nawhite on September 27, 2017, 06:56:42 AM
I want to continue this discussion about giving styles but I don't want to derail this thread so I broke it out into another thread at https://forum.mrmoneymustache.com/welcome-to-the-forum/'charity-starts-at-home'-vs-givewell-philosophy/ Please comment there instead so we don't derail this amazing thread.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Taran Wanderer on September 27, 2017, 10:22:47 AM
Wait, you gave five thousand dollars a year to your employee and now you are suggesting we take our comments to another thread so we don't derail this one? I think you're going overboard on this thoughtfulness thing. Rein it in!

/sarcasm

My real comment:  Bravo!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: dandarc on September 27, 2017, 10:31:25 AM
Wait, you gave five thousand dollars a year to your employee and now you are suggesting we take our comments to another thread so we don't derail this one? I think you're going overboard on this thoughtfulness thing. Rein it in!

/sarcasm

My real comment:  Bravo!
Different person gave the $5K raise to an employee from the one who wanted to discuss giving strategies, and was polite enough to open a new thread for that purpose.  Bravo to both of them!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: talltexan on September 29, 2017, 06:54:08 AM
My wife works for a large, multi-industry corporation. They are re-jiggering how they track work hours, so my wife--who currently works 32 hours a week--asked me whether our family was better off with her at 35 or 30 (I think they're going to want her to supply the same amount of time each day).

I gulped, then told her 30. The mustachian muscles are a little weak (we have a Disney habit that we cannot seem to kick), but we've managed to save more than $0.8 million in various investments. Losing 7% of her hours is not nothing, but I couldn't justify asking her to work more with us this far along.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Livingthedream55 on September 29, 2017, 08:13:33 AM
My wife works for a large, multi-industry corporation. They are re-jiggering how they track work hours, so my wife--who currently works 32 hours a week--asked me whether our family was better off with her at 35 or 30 (I think they're going to want her to supply the same amount of time each day).

I gulped, then told her 30. The mustachian muscles are a little weak (we have a Disney habit that we cannot seem to kick), but we've managed to save more than $0.8 million in various investments. Losing 7% of her hours is not nothing, but I couldn't justify asking her to work more with us this far along.

Sweet!  Great choice!!   

FYI - there are ways to do Disney for less (lots of blogs about doing Disney on a budget) so you can challenge yourself to try to still have what brings your family joy for less money. Case in point - I have brought my kids to Disney a few times and the one they have the happiest memories of is the time we stayed off site at a Holiday Inn that had these cheesy character decorated rooms and bunk beds and kid karaoke in the lounge. They don't even remember the time I splurged on a hotel within the park system!  : 0 )
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: GettingClose on September 29, 2017, 11:24:44 AM
My wife works for a large, multi-industry corporation. They are re-jiggering how they track work hours, so my wife--who currently works 32 hours a week--asked me whether our family was better off with her at 35 or 30 (I think they're going to want her to supply the same amount of time each day).

I gulped, then told her 30. The mustachian muscles are a little weak (we have a Disney habit that we cannot seem to kick), but we've managed to save more than $0.8 million in various investments. Losing 7% of her hours is not nothing, but I couldn't justify asking her to work more with us this far along.

That's really great - congratulations!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: JustGettingStarted1980 on September 29, 2017, 11:42:36 AM
Wait, you gave five thousand dollars a year to your employee and now you are suggesting we take our comments to another thread so we don't derail this one? I think you're going overboard on this thoughtfulness thing. Rein it in!

/sarcasm

You don't Derail a Thread, you Unravel It (right?!)
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Taran Wanderer on September 29, 2017, 10:54:58 PM
Different person gave the $5K raise to an employee from the one who wanted to discuss giving strategies, and was polite enough to open a new thread for that purpose.  Bravo to both of them!

Oops, that's what I get for zooming in and not looking at the usernames. Thanks for the correction.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: RWD on September 30, 2017, 08:15:22 AM
You don't Derail a Thread, you Unravel It (right?!)
Why not both?
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Lews Therin on September 30, 2017, 10:26:22 AM
@ RWD : So many bonus points if you did that yourself, just to prove a point.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: CowboyAndIndian on September 30, 2017, 10:31:46 AM
Enough of derailing.

Can we please get back to FU stories?
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: RWD on September 30, 2017, 11:19:52 AM
@ RWD : So many bonus points if you did that yourself, just to prove a point.
I just did a Google image search. Not much creativity required.


Enough of derailing.

Can we please get back to FU stories?
Sorry...

The closest things I've got to FU money stories is with some project flexibility. In one of my early years of employment I was assigned a crappy project for a product I was otherwise not associated with. There was a lot of miscommunication over who was supposed to take responsibility for different parts of the project. Turns out they wanted me to do all the documentation in addition to the coding, even though I wasn't familiar with the product at all. My efforts were met with complaints and criticism from multiple people involved with the product, but no one ever stepped in to actually help. I then I found out that this was essentially a lifetime project... They wanted me to do updates periodically even though I had written up all the documentation such that anyone (preferably someone familiar with the product) could maintain it. Well that went on for several years, but eventually I had a talk with my boss and convinced him that the project could be done much better by someone else and it would be more efficient for the company all around. Afterward I was much happier (and less likely to be fired for my attitude), all because I was willing to stand up and suggest an alternative to my boss's directive.

More recently instead of waiting to be assigned a project I just started my own pet project and have been including it in my status report. No one has complained yet that I'm almost becoming my own boss. I've never been happier at my job, which is kind of ironic since I've been so focused recently on obtaining early retirement.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: force majeure on September 30, 2017, 11:57:48 AM
A guy in my company was working his last day in the office. I have to say he was kind of "managed out the door", so he could give a crap about consequences. He set up a rule in Microsoft Outlook - to block any incoming emails with @thecompany.com in the address, if you get my meaning. It was a very quiet last day, and he had made "bank" already.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: scottish on September 30, 2017, 02:15:30 PM
A guy in my company was working his last day in the office. I have to say he was kind of "managed out the door", so he could give a crap about consequences. He set up a rule in Microsoft Outlook - to block any incoming emails with @thecompany.com in the address, if you get my meaning. It was a very quiet last day, and he had made "bank" already.

Hmm, no wonder he was managed out the door.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: arebelspy on September 30, 2017, 04:49:33 PM
More recently instead of waiting to be assigned a project I just started my own pet project and have been including it in my status report. No one has complained yet that I'm almost becoming my own boss. I've never been happier at my job, which is kind of ironic since I've been so focused recently on obtaining early retirement.

That's awesome.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: RWD on September 30, 2017, 08:54:52 PM
More recently instead of waiting to be assigned a project I just started my own pet project and have been including it in my status report. No one has complained yet that I'm almost becoming my own boss. I've never been happier at my job, which is kind of ironic since I've been so focused recently on obtaining early retirement.

That's awesome.

Thanks. I had pitched the project before and the general consensus was "yep, that would be a good thing to do some day in the future," but no one officially authorized me to start working on it. Probably because it's a huge project that I expect will take six months to a year to complete and there are always smaller tasks that have been given priority.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Spiffsome on September 30, 2017, 10:37:24 PM
I recently took a six-month leave of absence from work due to the current work situation being weird and terrible, and wanting to spend more time with my grandfather as he gets older. The first FU was telling HR that I was taking the unpaid leave option. "You're aware that it's unpaid leave ..."

The second FU was a temporary job that I'd applied for before I decided to make the jump. They invited me in for an interview. The email chain went sort of like this:

"Sorry, I'm not looking for full-time work anymore; family commitments."
"How many days a week are you looking to work?"
"Uh... three, I guess?"
"Come in and we'll interview you anyway."

At the interview itself, they had two placements for someone 3 days / week. Now I'm waiting to see if I've made the cut for one of those. Just gobsmacked that I could get a pretty good job changed to part-time by turning it down.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: MrMoogle on October 02, 2017, 10:44:42 AM
My financial status is known generally, but not the details.  One of my coworkers is switching projects, his current job is a key position, but it's mostly in the background, so there's not as much recognition.  I have commended him in the past in front of others that his work doesn't seem like it would be enjoyable, but he's always happy to do it.  It's obvious I didn't want to do it.  When they looked for someone to take on his work, they didn't even ask me even though it would fit well with what I'm already doing.  #smallvictories
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: EconDiva on October 05, 2017, 10:16:11 AM
That was why I was so annoyed last week...I have been busting my tail off to get prepared for this audit because we didn't know when they would show up (they give you a three month time frame but no specific dates...they just show up) and she is acting like a damn fool over an Outlook calendar entry. On a funnier note, the auditor I worked with today was complaining that he didn't get lunch yesterday...guess who was responsible for ordering food?

I'm an auditor, and I deal with external auditors as well. Escalate this. Seriously. If you promise me food, and don't provide it, you make me crabby. Trust me, you do NOT want to make your auditor crabby. I can make your life so much harder. I can decide to write the finding when it could go either way. There can be serious consequences to pissing off your auditors, and you do not know these people. This one person could significantly hurt the company by pulling those types of stunts.

One of our problems in this world: People can be petty.

Yep...clearly.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Maenad on October 06, 2017, 10:32:02 AM
I have a sad lack-of-FU-money story. I ran into a coworker at a break area who's being denied a PTO request for the days between Xmas and NYE because she's "needed here". Her request was to fly home to Mexico to visit her elderly father and commemorate the anniversary of her mother's death. :-(
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: TomTX on October 06, 2017, 10:46:23 AM
I have a sad lack-of-FU-money story. I ran into a coworker at a break area who's being denied a PTO request for the days between Xmas and NYE because she's "needed here". Her request was to fly home to Mexico to visit her elderly father and commemorate the anniversary of her mother's death. :-(

Please keep these stories to other threads. I come here for a pick-me-up.

Thank you.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Larsg on October 06, 2017, 10:49:16 AM
OK back to the topic! Has anyone ever just up and left a job with no FU money? Just enough to maybe get them thru for a little while in the hopes of getting something better?

 In my early 20's when I was first starting out after college, I did this quite a bit. It was the early 90's and unless you were in accounting, finance, or engineering, then corporate jobs were hard to come by. What was left were a lot of dregs with bad bosses, people mills, etc. When I had enough and realized that I needed more time to focus on getting a better job, I would make sure that I very quietly and confidentially lined up people to cover my work load, document all notes and follow up items still to do, etc so that they were not left in the lurch, and rather than giving notice so that I still had to work for and with people I could not stand, I would just type up a note "I Quit"and leave in the middle of my bosses desk on a Sunday so that he would see it first thing Monday. So I would go in the weekend before, clean out my desk, wrap up anything left undone, and leave clean. I did this probably 3 times and it gave me an incredible sense of control. I would then use the down time to look for a better job and than found those jobs pretty quickly.

Now as a grown up now in the corporate world, I have always been seen as a top performer/top 10% hi-po, etc and when I've had enough a couple times, my bosses would not accept my resignation, asking "what do you want, will give you more money, we'll let you work from home, we'll let you switch jobs, etc. I have had to employ the same routine where I confidentially work with people i trust in advance of my defined exit date to hand off work, document notes and follow up. I then go in the weekend before, clean out my office, leave a nice hand written note as well as an e-mail that outlines that I resign, thank you for everything....etc., leave my bade and laptop, then I'm done. Difference in the corporate world is that i did always line up a new job outside before I did this and have stash vs my 20's where I was completely broke.

My next time, I don't anticipating having another gig lined up. I am close to being completely done, for now at least.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: RyanAtTanagra on October 06, 2017, 10:59:27 AM
I have a sad lack-of-FU-money story. I ran into a coworker at a break area who's being denied a PTO request for the days between Xmas and NYE because she's "needed here". Her request was to fly home to Mexico to visit her elderly father and commemorate the anniversary of her mother's death. :-(

That's sad, one of the subtlest results of having FU money that I didn't even realize I started doing was I stopped asking for things, and just started doing them or telling them I was going to do it, assuming it was kosher.  People at work ask me all the time 'how did you get them to agree to X?'.  'Uh, I never asked, I just did it and they never said anything'.  At which point they look at me like I'm a wackadoo.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: dandarc on October 06, 2017, 11:22:06 AM
I have a sad lack-of-FU-money story. I ran into a coworker at a break area who's being denied a PTO request for the days between Xmas and NYE because she's "needed here". Her request was to fly home to Mexico to visit her elderly father and commemorate the anniversary of her mother's death. :-(

That's sad, one of the subtlest results of having FU money that I didn't even realize I started doing was I stopped asking for things, and just started doing them or telling them I was going to do it, assuming it was kosher.  People at work ask me all the time 'how did you get them to agree to X?'.  'Uh, I never asked, I just did it and they never said anything'.  At which point they look at me like I'm a wackadoo.
I've gotten so used to telling rather than asking at work that I kind of did it to my wife yesterday.  "I'm going on a trip to meet up with my old friends at the end of March" <Pause> "Whoops - what I meant to say is 'I'm thinking about going on a trip at the end of March to meet up with my old friends.  What do you think about that?'"

Maenad - did you suggest CW rephrase the request to not be a question.  "I'm going to be out of the country XX to YY" might elicit a different response.  Of course, the consequences might be worse since employer already heard the question and denied it, but there's always the "elderly father / anniversary of mother's death" card to play.  "Are you really going to fire me over visiting my elderly father?  I don't know how much time he has left . . . "  There's also the option of CW developing a bad cold at the end of December.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Maenad on October 06, 2017, 03:30:50 PM
Maenad - did you suggest CW rephrase the request to not be a question.  "I'm going to be out of the country XX to YY" might elicit a different response.

I did tell her, "I think your flight home may be cancelled and you'll need to catch another one a couple of days later." ;-) She thought about it, and then mentioned that she already had a meeting scheduled with HR.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Luckyvik on October 07, 2017, 04:36:22 PM
OK back to the topic! Has anyone ever just up and left a job with no FU money? Just enough to maybe get them thru for a little while in the hopes of getting something better?

 In my early 20's when I was first starting out after college, I did this quite a bit. It was the early 90's and unless you were in accounting, finance, or engineering, then corporate jobs were hard to come by. What was left were a lot of dregs with bad bosses, people mills, etc. When I had enough and realized that I needed more time to focus on getting a better job, I would make sure that I very quietly and confidentially lined up people to cover my work load, document all notes and follow up items still to do, etc so that they were not left in the lurch, and rather than giving notice so that I still had to work for and with people I could not stand, I would just type up a note "I Quit"and leave in the middle of my bosses desk on a Sunday so that he would see it first thing Monday. So I would go in the weekend before, clean out my desk, wrap up anything left undone, and leave clean. I did this probably 3 times and it gave me an incredible sense of control. I would then use the down time to look for a better job and than found those jobs pretty quickly.

Now as a grown up now in the corporate world, I have always been seen as a top performer/top 10% hi-po, etc and when I've had enough a couple times, my bosses would not accept my resignation, asking "what do you want, will give you more money, we'll let you work from home, we'll let you switch jobs, etc. I have had to employ the same routine where I confidentially work with people i trust in advance of my defined exit date to hand off work, document notes and follow up. I then go in the weekend before, clean out my office, leave a nice hand written note as well as an e-mail that outlines that I resign, thank you for everything....etc., leave my bade and laptop, then I'm done. Difference in the corporate world is that i did always line up a new job outside before I did this and have stash vs my 20's where I was completely broke.

My next time, I don't anticipating having another gig lined up. I am close to being completely done, for now at least.

Yep, in my mid 20's I had a job in a call centre that I detested, I had no money at the time, maybe $500 in the bank if that, I got offered a part-time job at a friend's small business paying less but enough to get by and I thought I could go back to uni part-time to finish my last semester of uni a month later so I told my team leader I was giving them one weeks notice, he sent me to the manager, I told them the same, the manager said that I had to give 4 weeks notice as per my contract, I said I can only give you 1 weeks notice, they said no, I said ok, let me reconsider, that was a Friday, I told my team leader and colleagues I wasn't coming back the next week and I didn't, the manager tried to call me the following week but I didn't answer my phone and that was that.

 They should have just accepted my 1 weeks notice. Now that I'm older and wiser I wish I had insisted on the 1 weeks notice and left it at that.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: SwordGuy on October 07, 2017, 05:33:07 PM
Someone asked for a Lack-of-FU-Money story.

I went to work at a new company some years ago.   I was there about a week when I received an email from the DBA on a different project.  It had been blind-copied to everyone in the office and had been sent to his project manager.   Let's just say he had nothing nice to say to the project manager.

Since I didn't know any of these people, I just kept quiet and observed.

A few months later the project manager took away the DBA's database privileges.   For non IT folks, that's the equivalent of taking away a truck driver's keys.   He's not going to be doing anything useful for the project under those circumstances.

A few days later, someone noticed that his office was empty (i.e, no person or belongings in it).  A hand-written note had been taped to the door that simply said "Gone!!!"   

No notice, no email to HR, nothing.  Just "Gone!!!".

After 3 days he was considered to have abandoned his position and his job was ended.

A couple of days after payday, about 2 weeks later, he showed up at the office hoping to get his job back.   He didn't.

But the story gets better.

A couple of months go by and I'm told that same project manager is not threatening to turn in the company to the Feds and claim "Fraud, waste and abuse" because the project has been mismanaged.

I think to myself, "But isn't he the project manager who would be responsible for said mismanagement?  Surely he's not really planning to do that..."

A couple of weeks go by and I have to go over and ask him something.  I step behind his desk to see the screen he wants to show me and I notice that his web browser on his 2nd monitor is on the federal fraud, waste and abuse website...

"Okey, dokey.  He really is that stupid!"

Some time passes and the fellow is let go.

But it gets better.

Both of them have taken contracts to work in Iraq because they (a) can get a job and (b) it pays really well.  They are stuck in the same 2 person shack in the desert working together...

We all laughed our asses off when we found that out.

Karma!!!!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: AnnaGrowsAMustache on October 07, 2017, 06:23:31 PM
Someone asked for a Lack-of-FU-Money story.

I went to work at a new company some years ago.   I was there about a week when I received an email from the DBA on a different project.  It had been blind-copied to everyone in the office and had been sent to his project manager.   Let's just say he had nothing nice to say to the project manager.

Since I didn't know any of these people, I just kept quiet and observed.

A few months later the project manager took away the DBA's database privileges.   For non IT folks, that's the equivalent of taking away a truck driver's keys.   He's not going to be doing anything useful for the project under those circumstances.

A few days later, someone noticed that his office was empty (i.e, no person or belongings in it).  A hand-written note had been taped to the door that simply said "Gone!!!"   

No notice, no email to HR, nothing.  Just "Gone!!!".

After 3 days he was considered to have abandoned his position and his job was ended.

A couple of days after payday, about 2 weeks later, he showed up at the office hoping to get his job back.   He didn't.

But the story gets better.

A couple of months go by and I'm told that same project manager is not threatening to turn in the company to the Feds and claim "Fraud, waste and abuse" because the project has been mismanaged.

I think to myself, "But isn't he the project manager who would be responsible for said mismanagement?  Surely he's not really planning to do that..."

A couple of weeks go by and I have to go over and ask him something.  I step behind his desk to see the screen he wants to show me and I notice that his web browser on his 2nd monitor is on the federal fraud, waste and abuse website...

"Okey, dokey.  He really is that stupid!"

Some time passes and the fellow is let go.

But it gets better.

Both of them have taken contracts to work in Iraq because they (a) can get a job and (b) it pays really well.  They are stuck in the same 2 person shack in the desert working together...

We all laughed our asses off when we found that out.

Karma!!!!

Is it just me, or are IT folk generally egomaniacal, socially maladjusted drama queens who make every one else's life as difficult as possible???
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: EricL on October 07, 2017, 06:26:48 PM
Someone asked for a Lack-of-FU-Money story.

I went to work at a new company some years ago.   I was there about a week when I received an email from the DBA on a different project.  It had been blind-copied to everyone in the office and had been sent to his project manager.   Let's just say he had nothing nice to say to the project manager.

Since I didn't know any of these people, I just kept quiet and observed.

A few months later the project manager took away the DBA's database privileges.   For non IT folks, that's the equivalent of taking away a truck driver's keys.   He's not going to be doing anything useful for the project under those circumstances.

A few days later, someone noticed that his office was empty (i.e, no person or belongings in it).  A hand-written note had been taped to the door that simply said "Gone!!!"   

No notice, no email to HR, nothing.  Just "Gone!!!".

After 3 days he was considered to have abandoned his position and his job was ended.

A couple of days after payday, about 2 weeks later, he showed up at the office hoping to get his job back.   He didn't.

But the story gets better.

A couple of months go by and I'm told that same project manager is not threatening to turn in the company to the Feds and claim "Fraud, waste and abuse" because the project has been mismanaged.

I think to myself, "But isn't he the project manager who would be responsible for said mismanagement?  Surely he's not really planning to do that..."

A couple of weeks go by and I have to go over and ask him something.  I step behind his desk to see the screen he wants to show me and I notice that his web browser on his 2nd monitor is on the federal fraud, waste and abuse website...

"Okey, dokey.  He really is that stupid!"

Some time passes and the fellow is let go.

But it gets better.

Both of them have taken contracts to work in Iraq because they (a) can get a job and (b) it pays really well.  They are stuck in the same 2 person shack in the desert working together...

We all laughed our asses off when we found that out.

Karma!!!!

Is it just me, or are IT folk generally egomaniacal, socially maladjusted drama queens who make every one else's life as difficult as possible???

Nope.  But perhaps I was just unlucky.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: AnnaGrowsAMustache on October 07, 2017, 06:31:46 PM
Someone asked for a Lack-of-FU-Money story.

I went to work at a new company some years ago.   I was there about a week when I received an email from the DBA on a different project.  It had been blind-copied to everyone in the office and had been sent to his project manager.   Let's just say he had nothing nice to say to the project manager.

Since I didn't know any of these people, I just kept quiet and observed.

A few months later the project manager took away the DBA's database privileges.   For non IT folks, that's the equivalent of taking away a truck driver's keys.   He's not going to be doing anything useful for the project under those circumstances.

A few days later, someone noticed that his office was empty (i.e, no person or belongings in it).  A hand-written note had been taped to the door that simply said "Gone!!!"   

No notice, no email to HR, nothing.  Just "Gone!!!".

After 3 days he was considered to have abandoned his position and his job was ended.

A couple of days after payday, about 2 weeks later, he showed up at the office hoping to get his job back.   He didn't.

But the story gets better.

A couple of months go by and I'm told that same project manager is not threatening to turn in the company to the Feds and claim "Fraud, waste and abuse" because the project has been mismanaged.

I think to myself, "But isn't he the project manager who would be responsible for said mismanagement?  Surely he's not really planning to do that..."

A couple of weeks go by and I have to go over and ask him something.  I step behind his desk to see the screen he wants to show me and I notice that his web browser on his 2nd monitor is on the federal fraud, waste and abuse website...

"Okey, dokey.  He really is that stupid!"

Some time passes and the fellow is let go.

But it gets better.

Both of them have taken contracts to work in Iraq because they (a) can get a job and (b) it pays really well.  They are stuck in the same 2 person shack in the desert working together...

We all laughed our asses off when we found that out.

Karma!!!!

Is it just me, or are IT folk generally egomaniacal, socially maladjusted drama queens who make every one else's life as difficult as possible???

Nope.  But perhaps I was just unlucky.

Huh. Every place I've ever worked, IT end up being the tail wagging the dog, holding the entire place to ransom essentially for some ridiculous process. I once had to cancel an exam because nothing worked and the IT dept were in their weekly meeting. I mean, screw 200 students and staff, because 10 people have to have a meeting..... And this was an exam they knew about in advance because I'd contacted them to make sure everything was operational!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: RyanAtTanagra on October 07, 2017, 08:53:23 PM
Is it just me, or are IT folk generally egomaniacal, socially maladjusted drama queens who make every one else's life as difficult as possible???

Does everyone not in IT think computers are magic and when things go wrong the IT people can just wave their magic wands and immediately fix whatever is wrong and the reason they don't make it magically better right away must definitely be out of spite and hatred of others?
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Paul der Krake on October 07, 2017, 10:07:54 PM
Is it just me, or are IT folk generally egomaniacal, socially maladjusted drama queens who make every one else's life as difficult as possible???
Yes, that's us. In our spare time, we also love pointing out everyone else's spelling mistakes to give them a chance to better themselves. These selfless qualities are why we are the Chosen Ones.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: AnnaGrowsAMustache on October 07, 2017, 10:32:57 PM
Is it just me, or are IT folk generally egomaniacal, socially maladjusted drama queens who make every one else's life as difficult as possible???

Does everyone not in IT think computers are magic and when things go wrong the IT people can just wave their magic wands and immediately fix whatever is wrong and the reason they don't make it magically better right away must definitely be out of spite and hatred of others?

No, but IT folk seem to think that everyone not It folk is a complete digital moron who will buy a dumb excuse because they don't feel like staying after 5pm sharp.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: bacchi on October 07, 2017, 10:42:14 PM
I have a sad lack-of-FU-money story. I ran into a coworker at a break area who's being denied a PTO request for the days between Xmas and NYE because she's "needed here". Her request was to fly home to Mexico to visit her elderly father and commemorate the anniversary of her mother's death. :-(

I was denied a request to attend my grandmother's funeral. As a 23 year old with no FU money, I quietly accepted my fate. One of the worst life decisions I made. I should've just bought the ticket and left work.

I eventually started "telling" rather than "asking," as others mentioned.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: zolotiyeruki on October 08, 2017, 06:40:09 AM
Is it just me, or are IT folk generally egomaniacal, socially maladjusted drama queens who make every one else's life as difficult as possible???

Does everyone not in IT think computers are magic and when things go wrong the IT people can just wave their magic wands and immediately fix whatever is wrong and the reason they don't make it magically better right away must definitely be out of spite and hatred of others?

No, but IT folk seem to think that everyone not It folk is a complete digital moron who will buy a dumb excuse because they don't feel like staying after 5pm sharp.
I think it comes from too many experiences with users who *are* complete digital morons, users who lie ("of course I restarted my computer!"), and users who are abusive (seen in a customer's email just this week: "I hope you're fired!").  It might also come from the ability to fix things with a few keystrokes when all is going haywire around you.  It strokes the ego a bit :)
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: JLee on October 08, 2017, 09:43:59 PM
A lot of people have had some pretty terrible experience with IT people...I'm going to go out on a limb and say you either work for shitty companies, have shitty IT departments, or don't have a job function that's critical enough to merit a response that you deem satisfactory.

I'm on call 24x7 and technically work in IT.  I also don't work on a help desk...
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: AnnaGrowsAMustache on October 08, 2017, 10:28:07 PM
A lot of people have had some pretty terrible experience with IT people...I'm going to go out on a limb and say you either work for shitty companies, have shitty IT departments, or don't have a job function that's critical enough to merit a response that you deem satisfactory.

I'm on call 24x7 and technically work in IT.  I also don't work on a help desk...

Well, we're talking government departments, essentially, even though we're hospitals..... so I'm gonna go with shitty company. With a shitty IT department that's really trying to adapt the hospital processes to the way IT wants to work instead of the other way around. Thank God our mediquip techs and diagnostic equip techs are extraordinary. They GET the fact they work in a hospital. IT doesn't.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Pooperman on October 09, 2017, 07:16:28 AM
A lot of people have had some pretty terrible experience with IT people...I'm going to go out on a limb and say you either work for shitty companies, have shitty IT departments, or don't have a job function that's critical enough to merit a response that you deem satisfactory.

I'm on call 24x7 and technically work in IT.  I also don't work on a help desk...

Sometimes it's shitty process that has been stuck to things it shouldn't be. For example, the cloud-based software I deal with requires a 2-week process to get any changes done in the IT department, despite there being no downtime or any difficulty in undoing changes. I don't work in the IT department so I just ignore that process because it's stupid. However, it does mean that anything I need from IT takes forever and a half to get done. We requested a couple of email boxes 2 weeks ago and they were finally created today.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: CowboyAndIndian on October 09, 2017, 07:49:17 AM
Please, can we get back to FU stories?

Create a new thread if you wish to complain about IT.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: dandarc on October 09, 2017, 08:34:50 AM
Please, can we get back to FU stories?

Create a new thread if you wish to complain about IT.
Here's a minor one.  Wife used to work for the legislature here.  She planned a trip with a friend, and was approved for this trip, leaving the day after the session was supposed to end.  Less than a week before the end of session, they decided to extend it because in spite of the same party controlling the entire legislature, they couldn't get a couple of things done on time.  There was time at the beginning of session for them to do a bunch of BS like "follies" and other "partying like its 1959" type of activities though.  Supposed to be an all hands situation, but wife went on the trip anyway.

Now, she doesn't like to even keep an eye on the money, so I really had to push her to realize we have FU money.  She also really freaks out about work stuff.  "Just go - we have lots of money and you're quitting this summer anyway to go back to school, worst they can do is give you a couple extra months of vacation."
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: MonkeyJenga on October 09, 2017, 10:30:36 AM
This is along the lines of FU Money leading me to tell, not ask. I used to be so terrified of losing my crappy temp jobs or doing the slightest thing wrong that when my grandfather passed over a weekend, I wanted to wait until Monday to ask if I could take time off to go down for the funeral.

Now I set my own hours to a certain extent, which I've never received official permission for. I just started showing up later and waited until somebody mentioned it. Nobody has.

I used to wear sneakers on the subway and change into flats at work. Then I started keeping my sneakers on at my desk and only changing into flats for meetings. Now I wear sneakers all day, every day. I've noticed people looking at my feet, but what are they going to do? Fire me?

The biggest change is mindset. I no longer obsess about getting the highest performance rating or making sure my bosses think I'm perfect. I don't stay late, I don't work through lunch, and I refuse last-minute work requests made on Friday afternoons. What are they gonna do? Fire me?

Unfortunately, I had to be very close to FI before realizing my position of strength and capitalizing on it. I had FU money for a long time before I started acting like it. This was largely because I don't have a BA and thought I wouldn't be able to find anything else. What I didn't realize was how high my performance was compared to the average employee. I could cut waaay back on the stress and still do well. By being less stressed out, I ended up networking more effectively without even trying.

Now I'm about to quit my cushy, stable job with nothing lined up so I can go a-wandering!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: iluvzbeach on October 09, 2017, 11:21:53 AM
^This. Great example of epic, MJ. I'm now in the same boat and it feels so good.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Slee_stack on October 09, 2017, 11:43:58 AM
"partying like its 1959" type of activities
I'm intrigued.  How exactly did folks party in 1959?
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: dandarc on October 09, 2017, 11:50:47 AM
"partying like its 1959" type of activities
I'm intrigued.  How exactly did folks party in 1959?
Well, at least one did it very wrong - made some racist comments at a bar the legislators frequent and wound up being forced to resign.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Aegishjalmur on October 09, 2017, 03:02:22 PM
I don't have stories of my own, but some of these are hilarious.

http://www.askamanager.org/2017/09/spectacular-resignation-stories-share-in-the-comments.html  (http://www.askamanager.org/2017/09/spectacular-resignation-stories-share-in-the-comments.html)

Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: BlueHouse on October 16, 2017, 12:27:04 PM

Huh. Every place I've ever worked, IT end up being the tail wagging the dog, holding the entire place to ransom essentially for some ridiculous process. I once had to cancel an exam because nothing worked and the IT dept were in their weekly meeting. I mean, screw 200 students and staff, because 10 people have to have a meeting..... And this was an exam they knew about in advance because I'd contacted them to make sure everything was operational!
Just a note: many IT people deal with people who regularly describe the problem as "nothing works".  I was lucky enough early on in my career to have a very gentle IT Pro explain to me that "Nothing Works" didn't help him identify the problem and that I needed to use more descriptive sentences. 
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: dandarc on October 16, 2017, 12:36:04 PM

Huh. Every place I've ever worked, IT end up being the tail wagging the dog, holding the entire place to ransom essentially for some ridiculous process. I once had to cancel an exam because nothing worked and the IT dept were in their weekly meeting. I mean, screw 200 students and staff, because 10 people have to have a meeting..... And this was an exam they knew about in advance because I'd contacted them to make sure everything was operational!
Just a note: many IT people deal with people who regularly describe the problem as "nothing works".  I was lucky enough early on in my career to have a very gentle IT Pro explain to me that "Nothing Works" didn't help him identify the problem and that I needed to use more descriptive sentences.
On the "you're going to have to tell me more than that" front - I just got asked in the elevator "What's the status on that request <Person who no longer works here> made 2 months ago?".  I replied "What was it about?".  Answer "I don't remember, and it is none of the things you found in your email from this person and sent to me".
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: BlueHouse on October 16, 2017, 12:59:34 PM

Huh. Every place I've ever worked, IT end up being the tail wagging the dog, holding the entire place to ransom essentially for some ridiculous process. I once had to cancel an exam because nothing worked and the IT dept were in their weekly meeting. I mean, screw 200 students and staff, because 10 people have to have a meeting..... And this was an exam they knew about in advance because I'd contacted them to make sure everything was operational!
Just a note: many IT people deal with people who regularly describe the problem as "nothing works".  I was lucky enough early on in my career to have a very gentle IT Pro explain to me that "Nothing Works" didn't help him identify the problem and that I needed to use more descriptive sentences.
On the "you're going to have to tell me more than that" front - I just got asked in the elevator "What's the status on that request <Person who no longer works here> made 2 months ago?".  I replied "What was it about?".  Answer "I don't remember, and it is none of the things you found in your email from this person and sent to me".

Well, the answer to this one should be pretty straightforward.  "Oh, now I remember.  We found it was user error and everything is working exactly as it should now."  :)
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: MrMoogle on October 16, 2017, 01:24:47 PM

Huh. Every place I've ever worked, IT end up being the tail wagging the dog, holding the entire place to ransom essentially for some ridiculous process. I once had to cancel an exam because nothing worked and the IT dept were in their weekly meeting. I mean, screw 200 students and staff, because 10 people have to have a meeting..... And this was an exam they knew about in advance because I'd contacted them to make sure everything was operational!
Just a note: many IT people deal with people who regularly describe the problem as "nothing works".  I was lucky enough early on in my career to have a very gentle IT Pro explain to me that "Nothing Works" didn't help him identify the problem and that I needed to use more descriptive sentences.
On the "you're going to have to tell me more than that" front - I just got asked in the elevator "What's the status on that request <Person who no longer works here> made 2 months ago?".  I replied "What was it about?".  Answer "I don't remember, and it is none of the things you found in your email from this person and sent to me".

Well, the answer to this one should be pretty straightforward.  "Oh, now I remember.  We found it was user error and everything is working exactly as it should now."  :)
User error :)
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Abe Froman on October 16, 2017, 02:02:44 PM

Huh. Every place I've ever worked, IT end up being the tail wagging the dog, holding the entire place to ransom essentially for some ridiculous process. I once had to cancel an exam because nothing worked and the IT dept were in their weekly meeting. I mean, screw 200 students and staff, because 10 people have to have a meeting..... And this was an exam they knew about in advance because I'd contacted them to make sure everything was operational!
Just a note: many IT people deal with people who regularly describe the problem as "nothing works".  I was lucky enough early on in my career to have a very gentle IT Pro explain to me that "Nothing Works" didn't help him identify the problem and that I needed to use more descriptive sentences.
On the "you're going to have to tell me more than that" front - I just got asked in the elevator "What's the status on that request <Person who no longer works here> made 2 months ago?".  I replied "What was it about?".  Answer "I don't remember, and it is none of the things you found in your email from this person and sent to me".

Well, the answer to this one should be pretty straightforward.  "Oh, now I remember.  We found it was user error and everything is working exactly as it should now."  :)
User error :)

Me:   "It's a PEBKAC Issue."
Them: "Pebkac? What is a pebkac?"
Me: "Problem Exists Between Keyboard And Chair"
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: solon on October 16, 2017, 02:06:29 PM

Huh. Every place I've ever worked, IT end up being the tail wagging the dog, holding the entire place to ransom essentially for some ridiculous process. I once had to cancel an exam because nothing worked and the IT dept were in their weekly meeting. I mean, screw 200 students and staff, because 10 people have to have a meeting..... And this was an exam they knew about in advance because I'd contacted them to make sure everything was operational!
Just a note: many IT people deal with people who regularly describe the problem as "nothing works".  I was lucky enough early on in my career to have a very gentle IT Pro explain to me that "Nothing Works" didn't help him identify the problem and that I needed to use more descriptive sentences.
On the "you're going to have to tell me more than that" front - I just got asked in the elevator "What's the status on that request <Person who no longer works here> made 2 months ago?".  I replied "What was it about?".  Answer "I don't remember, and it is none of the things you found in your email from this person and sent to me".

Well, the answer to this one should be pretty straightforward.  "Oh, now I remember.  We found it was user error and everything is working exactly as it should now."  :)
User error :)

Me:   "It's a PEBKAC Issue."
Them: "Pebkac? What is a pebkac?"
Me: "Problem Exists Between Keyboard And Chair"

Or possibly the I D ten T error.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Sibley on October 17, 2017, 08:52:02 AM

Huh. Every place I've ever worked, IT end up being the tail wagging the dog, holding the entire place to ransom essentially for some ridiculous process. I once had to cancel an exam because nothing worked and the IT dept were in their weekly meeting. I mean, screw 200 students and staff, because 10 people have to have a meeting..... And this was an exam they knew about in advance because I'd contacted them to make sure everything was operational!
Just a note: many IT people deal with people who regularly describe the problem as "nothing works".  I was lucky enough early on in my career to have a very gentle IT Pro explain to me that "Nothing Works" didn't help him identify the problem and that I needed to use more descriptive sentences.
On the "you're going to have to tell me more than that" front - I just got asked in the elevator "What's the status on that request <Person who no longer works here> made 2 months ago?".  I replied "What was it about?".  Answer "I don't remember, and it is none of the things you found in your email from this person and sent to me".

Well, the answer to this one should be pretty straightforward.  "Oh, now I remember.  We found it was user error and everything is working exactly as it should now."  :)
User error :)

Me:   "It's a PEBKAC Issue."
Them: "Pebkac? What is a pebkac?"
Me: "Problem Exists Between Keyboard And Chair"

Or possibly the I D ten T error.

Don't laugh too much. I handle the software for my department, and I mentally sort people into 4 categories for when we're doing anything with the program (setup, install, etc):

1. Ok unless the program melts down.
2. Needs instructions, ok unless big problems
3. Needs detailed instructions and reassurance, can't handle problems
4. Just do it for them.

We also upgraded to a new version recently, so are sorting out the new bugs, etc. Of course, the one person getting hit with the most bugs is also FIRMLY in category 4. Anytime they have a problem, I have no idea if it's user error or an actual problem. So far, we're 50/50. It just takes a lot more time for me to figure out.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: CowboyAndIndian on October 17, 2017, 09:22:39 AM
Please, can we get back to FU stories?

Create a new thread if you wish to complain about IT.

Again, please take your IT threads elsewhere.

Can someone post a great FU Story?
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Slow&Steady on October 17, 2017, 10:12:02 AM
Here is a potential story, not exactly FU money but FU options.  This is still unfolding so we will see what happens.

I have been at my current company for just over 2 years and they were bought by a new company about 3-4 months ago.  Of course the new company came in talking about how awesome they are but that is not how it is turning out to be.  About 1.5 months into this turnover my supervisor (who was completely incompetent at his job) was either fired or walked out.  If you ask anybody that I have worked with for the last 2 years I should have had that position for a long time and would be the correct person for the job.  Instead they gave it to a person, that due to my previous supervisors incompetence, had a much bigger interaction role with the new company than I did.  This person has zero experience in my field and, although they previously wanted somebody with a Master's, will not finish a Bachelor's until Dec (in a completely unrelated role).  I would probably be much more accepting of this if they would have at least interviewed us both for the position and that person just had a better interview but that is not what happened, they didn't interview anybody they just assigned the role.  A few weeks later the new company is giving out everybody's new title, pay band, etc and the title/pay band/etc that I am given is entry level (we have administrators that received the same as I did), this wouldn't be an issue if I was actually an entry level employee but I have over a dozen years experience in my field and since my new supervisor does not know anything about my field or what my previous supervisors field is, I will need to pick up the slack.  I basically told them that I flat out refuse to accept that title/pay band.  A couple weeks have gone by and they have returned with a new title and pay band but I feel it is a half ass attempt to make me shut up.  I also feel like they are not going to try very hard to make me happy because I am 4 months pregnant and they do offer a pretty good maternity leave, I have told them that I really don't want to have to look for a new job as a pregnant woman.

Meanwhile,  I have contacted my previous company to inquire about any openings that they might have.  I am expecting a call back something this week.  When I originally called them the conversation was about them finding me a role that would be a promotion. I am really hoping that I get a call today or tomorrow that will allow me to walk out.  I went this route vs new resumes because my previous company has been known to re-hire people and not start their years of service over, which means that getting maternity leave should be pretty simple.  They also allow for telecommuting on occasion, my old schedule included at least 1 day/week at home.

Additionally, my husband runs a business but has maintained a CDL just in case.  A CDL is very handy to have because you almost always can find a job.  His business is starting to slow down for the winter so last night he sent out a few resumes and already started to receive responses today.  I make more than he probably will with the CDL but the benefits of living off one income means that if I get pissed off enough I can still walk out, knowing that one of us will be able to pick up work pretty quick.

For us a job is required for insurance purposes.  I am 4 months pregnant and DH has MS. We can make lots of things work with what is in savings but insurance is not one that I am willing to pay completely out of pocket for, and we would not qualify for a subsidy at this point in the year.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Dicey on October 18, 2017, 07:20:55 AM
Commercial Driver's License?
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Slow&Steady on October 18, 2017, 02:26:35 PM
Commercial Driver's License?

Yes
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Bicycle_B on October 18, 2017, 02:39:14 PM
Good for you and your husband, NicoleO.  May fortune smile on you.  You are earning it.  Also, best wishes for a healthy pregnancy.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Freedomin5 on October 19, 2017, 04:57:48 AM
Several years ago, the Old Company (OC) I worked for was acquired by New Company (NC).

OC hired highly qualified and experienced people that were managed by even more highly qualified and experienced people. After the acquisition, the qualified people were given new contracts with NC (since OC technically no longer existed). The kicker was that, according to NC management, under the NC's HR policy and salary structure, most people ended up in a lower salary band...as in between 30-50% lower salary.

Over the next several months, because qualified people refused to work for less than market rates and didn't even bother applying for positions or quit, they hired on a lot of unqualified people, then expected the remaining qualified ones to manage/mentor the unqualified ones, on top of maintaining their own existing workload...all for less pay.

FU money allowed me to:

1. Refuse to sign the new contract. When the new manager brought it up and told me I HAD to sign, I asked her, "You know what I make now, and what I would make under the new contract. As a logical, well educated person, would you sign the new contract if you were me?" She smiled sheepishly and then mumbled something about HR and salary structures that couldn't be changed, and how I didn't qualify for the highest band because of years of experience or something. I didn't really hear her because I didn't care enough to listen to the excuses. I was still paid my old salary.

2. Ignore all stupid new processes. When manager brought it up, I told her she could file the paperwork on my behalf if it was really that necessary. None of the paperwork was ever filed because in reality, none of it was that necessary.

3. I was eventually called in to chat with the VP of the group (my manager's manager's manager), who was brought in from NC headquarters. She basically asked me what was wrong with me, phrased as, "You don't seem very happy...why?" So I told her why I thought all the qualified people were leaving, then handed her my resignation letter and walked out of her office.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Zamboni on October 19, 2017, 05:15:22 AM
Well done, Freedomin5!

I hope the future brings either better opportunities with competent managers or a happy and relaxed retirement.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: mm1970 on October 19, 2017, 09:15:21 AM
Several years ago, the Old Company (OC) I worked for was acquired by New Company (NC).

OC hired highly qualified and experienced people that were managed by even more highly qualified and experienced people. After the acquisition, the qualified people were given new contracts with NC (since OC technically no longer existed). The kicker was that, according to NC management, under the NC's HR policy and salary structure, most people ended up in a lower salary band...as in between 30-50% lower salary.

Over the next several months, because qualified people refused to work for less than market rates and didn't even bother applying for positions or quit, they hired on a lot of unqualified people, then expected the remaining qualified ones to manage/mentor the unqualified ones, on top of maintaining their own existing workload...all for less pay.

FU money allowed me to:

1. Refuse to sign the new contract. When the new manager brought it up and told me I HAD to sign, I asked her, "You know what I make now, and what I would make under the new contract. As a logical, well educated person, would you sign the new contract if you were me?" She smiled sheepishly and then mumbled something about HR and salary structures that couldn't be changed, and how I didn't qualify for the highest band because of years of experience or something. I didn't really hear her because I didn't care enough to listen to the excuses. I was still paid my old salary.

2. Ignore all stupid new processes. When manager brought it up, I told her she could file the paperwork on my behalf if it was really that necessary. None of the paperwork was ever filed because in reality, none of it was that necessary.

3. I was eventually called in to chat with the VP of the group (my manager's manager's manager), who was brought in from NC headquarters. She basically asked me what was wrong with me, phrased as, "You don't seem very happy...why?" So I told her why I thought all the qualified people were leaving, then handed her my resignation letter and walked out of her office.
so Glorious!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: BlueHouse on October 19, 2017, 09:23:47 AM
So I told her why I thought all the qualified people were leaving, then handed her my resignation letter and walked out of her office.

This made me so happy.  Well done!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: sequoia on October 19, 2017, 11:52:05 AM
3. I was eventually called in to chat with the VP of the group (my manager's manager's manager), who was brought in from NC headquarters. She basically asked me what was wrong with me, phrased as, "You don't seem very happy...why?" So I told her why I thought all the qualified people were leaving, then handed her my resignation letter and walked out of her office.

I bet the look on her face would be priceless. I would pay a lot of money to be in the room and observe this meeting.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: zolotiyeruki on October 19, 2017, 11:56:01 AM
3. I was eventually called in to chat with the VP of the group (my manager's manager's manager), who was brought in from NC headquarters. She basically asked me what was wrong with me, phrased as, "You don't seem very happy...why?" So I told her why I thought all the qualified people were leaving, then handed her my resignation letter and walked out of her office.

I bet the look on her face would be priceless. I would pay a lot of money to be in the room and observe this meeting.
Indeed!  What was the reaction like?
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: JLee on October 19, 2017, 02:13:45 PM
Several years ago, the Old Company (OC) I worked for was acquired by New Company (NC).

OC hired highly qualified and experienced people that were managed by even more highly qualified and experienced people. After the acquisition, the qualified people were given new contracts with NC (since OC technically no longer existed). The kicker was that, according to NC management, under the NC's HR policy and salary structure, most people ended up in a lower salary band...as in between 30-50% lower salary.

Over the next several months, because qualified people refused to work for less than market rates and didn't even bother applying for positions or quit, they hired on a lot of unqualified people, then expected the remaining qualified ones to manage/mentor the unqualified ones, on top of maintaining their own existing workload...all for less pay.

FU money allowed me to:

1. Refuse to sign the new contract. When the new manager brought it up and told me I HAD to sign, I asked her, "You know what I make now, and what I would make under the new contract. As a logical, well educated person, would you sign the new contract if you were me?" She smiled sheepishly and then mumbled something about HR and salary structures that couldn't be changed, and how I didn't qualify for the highest band because of years of experience or something. I didn't really hear her because I didn't care enough to listen to the excuses. I was still paid my old salary.

2. Ignore all stupid new processes. When manager brought it up, I told her she could file the paperwork on my behalf if it was really that necessary. None of the paperwork was ever filed because in reality, none of it was that necessary.

3. I was eventually called in to chat with the VP of the group (my manager's manager's manager), who was brought in from NC headquarters. She basically asked me what was wrong with me, phrased as, "You don't seem very happy...why?" So I told her why I thought all the qualified people were leaving, then handed her my resignation letter and walked out of her office.

That is fantastic.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: gerardc on October 19, 2017, 08:19:46 PM
That's great, I'm thinking that the more experienced people hold their own and realize their worth, the more corporations will have to pay them or improve working conditions. In a way, Mustachian ways should help social equality in the long term... that's the hope anyway.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Freedomin5 on October 20, 2017, 07:29:05 AM
3. I was eventually called in to chat with the VP of the group (my manager's manager's manager), who was brought in from NC headquarters. She basically asked me what was wrong with me, phrased as, "You don't seem very happy...why?" So I told her why I thought all the qualified people were leaving, then handed her my resignation letter and walked out of her office.

I bet the look on her face would be priceless. I would pay a lot of money to be in the room and observe this meeting.
Indeed!  What was the reaction like?

At first, she was all pretend concerned, like she had read the latest "how to manage people" book and was practicing her empathetic face. She was actually sort of aware of the problems. I just laid them out in a straightforward manner. She took notes as I talked. When I walked out with a big old smile on my face, she was kind of speechless but also kind of not surprised that this happened. They had been experiencing a steady exodus of qualified people for months before I walked.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: crispy on October 20, 2017, 08:39:18 PM
3. I was eventually called in to chat with the VP of the group (my manager's manager's manager), who was brought in from NC headquarters. She basically asked me what was wrong with me, phrased as, "You don't seem very happy...why?" So I told her why I thought all the qualified people were leaving, then handed her my resignation letter and walked out of her office.

I bet the look on her face would be priceless. I would pay a lot of money to be in the room and observe this meeting.
Indeed!  What was the reaction like?

At first, she was all pretend concerned, like she had read the latest "how to manage people" book and was practicing her empathetic face. She was actually sort of aware of the problems. I just laid them out in a straightforward manner. She took notes as I talked. When I walked out with a big old smile on my face, she was kind of speechless but also kind of not surprised that this happened. They had been experiencing a steady exodus of qualified people for months before I walked.

That's beautiful!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: AmyS on November 02, 2017, 11:51:57 PM
I don't know if this involved FU money, but I hope so. Someone on their last day at Twitter shut down 45's account. It stayed down for eleven minutes.

Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: AnnaGrowsAMustache on November 03, 2017, 02:55:26 AM
I don't know if this involved FU money, but I hope so. Someone on their last day at Twitter shut down 45's account. It stayed down for eleven minutes.

That's brilliant. That guy has earned some serious good karma.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: MrAlanBreck on November 03, 2017, 06:39:58 AM
I don't know if this involved FU money, but I hope so. Someone on their last day at Twitter shut down 45's account. It stayed down for eleven minutes.

This is why corporations have such a ruthless policy on people leaving, to the extent some have security escort you to the door the minute you resign.  Some let you know you are fired by your key-card no longer working when you arrive in the morning.

I had an old co-worker who was given a notice of termination, went to his computer, and destroyed three months of his work.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: ponyboy on November 03, 2017, 07:30:10 AM
I don't know if this involved FU money, but I hope so. Someone on their last day at Twitter shut down 45's account. It stayed down for eleven minutes.

That's brilliant. That guy has earned some serious good karma.

What are you talking about?  The guys name is going to be released.  Future employers will not hire him due to the fact that if he ever leaves he may fuck up something at their organization.  Boy he sure showed them...all of 11 minutes.  What a douche monkey.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: ponyboy on November 03, 2017, 07:32:01 AM
I don't know if this involved FU money, but I hope so. Someone on their last day at Twitter shut down 45's account. It stayed down for eleven minutes.

This is why corporations have such a ruthless policy on people leaving, to the extent some have security escort you to the door the minute you resign.  Some let you know you are fired by your key-card no longer working when you arrive in the morning.

I had an old co-worker who was given a notice of termination, went to his computer, and destroyed three months of his work.

Yup...we just had 3 people get laid off.  They were told and escorted off the property immediately.  Management had to round their things up in their offices and meet them outside to deliver. 
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: rockstache on November 03, 2017, 07:43:41 AM
I don't know if this involved FU money, but I hope so. Someone on their last day at Twitter shut down 45's account. It stayed down for eleven minutes.

That's brilliant. That guy has earned some serious good karma.

What are you talking about?  The guys name is going to be released.  Future employers will not hire him due to the fact that if he ever leaves he may fuck up something at their organization.  Boy he sure showed them...all of 11 minutes.  What a douche monkey.

Which he won't care about if he retired. Maybe he doesn't need the money and wanted to start a conversation.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: solon on November 03, 2017, 08:41:58 AM
I don't know if this involved FU money, but I hope so. Someone on their last day at Twitter shut down 45's account. It stayed down for eleven minutes.

That's brilliant. That guy has earned some serious good karma.

He put his ideology above the mission of his company, and in the process took a swipe at a sitting US president. Yeah, brilliant.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: radram on November 03, 2017, 08:59:02 AM
I don't know if this involved FU money, but I hope so. Someone on their last day at Twitter shut down 45's account. It stayed down for eleven minutes.

This is why corporations have such a ruthless policy on people leaving, to the extent some have security escort you to the door the minute you resign.  Some let you know you are fired by your key-card no longer working when you arrive in the morning.

I had an old co-worker who was given a notice of termination, went to his computer, and destroyed three months of his work.

This should be impossible to do from a computer. I understand disgruntled former employees can do some damage, but every company should know this and have a robust system of data backup with multiple sources of verification to protect against accidental AND purposeful loss. Shame of the former employee, as well as the company.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Slow&Steady on November 03, 2017, 09:00:55 AM
I don't know if this involved FU money, but I hope so. Someone on their last day at Twitter shut down 45's account. It stayed down for eleven minutes.

That's brilliant. That guy has earned some serious good karma.

He put his ideology above the mission of his company, and in the process took a swipe at a sitting US president. Yeah, brilliant.

Why does everyone assume it is a he?
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Lews Therin on November 03, 2017, 09:02:57 AM
Statistics? More men than women in Tech.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: solon on November 03, 2017, 09:10:40 AM
Statistics? More men than women in Tech.

In addition, men are usually more aggressive, and therefore more likely to make a career-ending mistake. It may turn out to be a woman, of course, but until we know, we'll keep using "he".

And besides all that, "they" is still just weird when referring to a single person.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: arebelspy on November 03, 2017, 09:11:51 AM
And besides all that, "they" is still just weird when referring to a single person.

You need to get over that. :)

I enjoyed their act of chaos.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Paul der Krake on November 03, 2017, 09:25:12 AM
Said employee may be a customer support/first line employee, where the gender distribution is much closer to 50/50 than engineering roles.

Not that it matters in any way, it's still a dumb move regardless of who they are.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: AlanStache on November 03, 2017, 10:39:46 AM
This should be impossible to do from a computer. I understand disgruntled former employees can do some damage, but every company should know this and have a robust system of data backup with multiple sources of verification to protect against accidental AND purposeful loss. Shame of the former employee, as well as the company.

For a software developer - yes.  For some generic middle manager Excel user many be not.  The words "commit", "check in", "repo" and "branch" have very different meanings outside tech :-)

I have always wondered a bit what rights a former employees has to personal effects in there office.  Can they legally only expect an "honest effort to collect and return personal effects" be made by the company or do they have any right to inspect and remove things?
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: GnomeErcy on November 03, 2017, 10:52:24 AM
Anticipatory FU story coming in:

My wife and I moved recently and last year she wasn't able to have Christmas with her family. This year, they're flying out and we'll spend some time with them; the first Christmas she'd have spent with them in a few years, and their first time visiting us.

She asked off for the 26th of December and was denied PTO - back over three months ago. So she's going to call out sick. If they fire her, so be it. It's ridiculous that with so much notice, in her line of work, she "can't" take that time off when family is in town. We've got the cash to deal with her getting fired if that's what happens. Feelsgoodman
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Daisy on November 03, 2017, 11:32:42 AM
Anticipatory FU story coming in:

My wife and I moved recently and last year she wasn't able to have Christmas with her family. This year, they're flying out and we'll spend some time with them; the first Christmas she'd have spent with them in a few years, and their first time visiting us.

She asked off for the 26th of December and was denied PTO - back over three months ago. So she's going to call out sick. If they fire her, so be it. It's ridiculous that with so much notice, in her line of work, she "can't" take that time off when family is in town. We've got the cash to deal with her getting fired if that's what happens. Feelsgoodman

Most excellent. It's a great feeling to look your boss in the eye and dare him to fire you that way. FU money is awesome. My guess is they will shrivel in fear and just let it pass. It would be dumb of them to make a big deal out of it.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: former player on November 03, 2017, 12:12:28 PM
Anticipatory FU story coming in:

My wife and I moved recently and last year she wasn't able to have Christmas with her family. This year, they're flying out and we'll spend some time with them; the first Christmas she'd have spent with them in a few years, and their first time visiting us.

She asked off for the 26th of December and was denied PTO - back over three months ago. So she's going to call out sick. If they fire her, so be it. It's ridiculous that with so much notice, in her line of work, she "can't" take that time off when family is in town. We've got the cash to deal with her getting fired if that's what happens. Feelsgoodman

Most excellent. It's a great feeling to look your boss in the eye and dare him to fire you that way. FU money is awesome. My guess is they will shrivel in fear and just let it pass. It would be dumb of them to make a big deal out of it.
If an employee's in some safety critical role then 26th December has to be staffed.  Or if its something like retail with sales starting, or customer service on items that are commonly given as Christmas gifts.  When cover is needed in cases such as those then it is usual for the newest employees to be required to take the unpopular shifts/days and that seems fair.

But if its a standard office type job with nothing critical it should be entirely possible for cover by phone/internet to be arranged to be undertaken by willing employees (and perhaps paid extra for).
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: GnomeErcy on November 03, 2017, 12:18:39 PM
Anticipatory FU story coming in:

My wife and I moved recently and last year she wasn't able to have Christmas with her family. This year, they're flying out and we'll spend some time with them; the first Christmas she'd have spent with them in a few years, and their first time visiting us.

She asked off for the 26th of December and was denied PTO - back over three months ago. So she's going to call out sick. If they fire her, so be it. It's ridiculous that with so much notice, in her line of work, she "can't" take that time off when family is in town. We've got the cash to deal with her getting fired if that's what happens. Feelsgoodman

Most excellent. It's a great feeling to look your boss in the eye and dare him to fire you that way. FU money is awesome. My guess is they will shrivel in fear and just let it pass. It would be dumb of them to make a big deal out of it.
If an employee's in some safety critical role then 26th December has to be staffed.  Or if its something like retail with sales starting, or customer service on items that are commonly given as Christmas gifts.  When cover is needed in cases such as those then it is usual for the newest employees to be required to take the unpopular shifts/days and that seems fair.

But if its a standard office type job with nothing critical it should be entirely possible for cover by phone/internet to be arranged to be undertaken by willing employees (and perhaps paid extra for).

The issue is because it's a Tuesday and that's the 'busy day' for her, arbitrarily. Not in a safety critical role, plenty of other folks to cover.

Edit: And to clarify she's been with the company for six years, but when we moved she switched offices. She is no longer the new person even by that standard...They've screwed her out of bonuses THREE years where she realistically should have gotten them (first was because she was a temp until early January, so she didn't work there the full year = no bonus; second was her old office because she was only there a partial year; third was her new office because she was only there a partial year. Other years the offices hit their goals but the company didn't, so no bonuses...overall that's left a really bad taste in her mouth on the company in general).

She's ready for a change regardless of what happens on the 26th.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: AmyS on November 03, 2017, 01:03:38 PM
Love the anticipatory FU money story - that brought a big smile to my face.

Regarding the Twitter employee whose exploits I posted - I have no way of knowing if this is truly an FU money story, or simply a person who just burned all their bridges. One way or another, it was certainly a definitive act.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: arebelspy on November 03, 2017, 01:09:24 PM
Anticipatory FU story coming in:

My wife and I moved recently and last year she wasn't able to have Christmas with her family. This year, they're flying out and we'll spend some time with them; the first Christmas she'd have spent with them in a few years, and their first time visiting us.

She asked off for the 26th of December and was denied PTO - back over three months ago. So she's going to call out sick. If they fire her, so be it. It's ridiculous that with so much notice, in her line of work, she "can't" take that time off when family is in town. We've got the cash to deal with her getting fired if that's what happens. Feelsgoodman

Most excellent. It's a great feeling to look your boss in the eye and dare him to fire you that way. FU money is awesome. My guess is they will shrivel in fear and just let it pass. It would be dumb of them to make a big deal out of it.
If an employee's in some safety critical role then 26th December has to be staffed.  Or if its something like retail with sales starting, or customer service on items that are commonly given as Christmas gifts.  When cover is needed in cases such as those then it is usual for the newest employees to be required to take the unpopular shifts/days and that seems fair.

But if its a standard office type job with nothing critical it should be entirely possible for cover by phone/internet to be arranged to be undertaken by willing employees (and perhaps paid extra for).

The issue is because it's a Tuesday and that's the 'busy day' for her, arbitrarily. Not in a safety critical role, plenty of other folks to cover.

Edit: And to clarify she's been with the company for six years, but when we moved she switched offices. She is no longer the new person even by that standard...

Folks without FU money, sadly.  Good for her!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: GnomeErcy on November 03, 2017, 01:12:52 PM
Anticipatory FU story coming in:

My wife and I moved recently and last year she wasn't able to have Christmas with her family. This year, they're flying out and we'll spend some time with them; the first Christmas she'd have spent with them in a few years, and their first time visiting us.

She asked off for the 26th of December and was denied PTO - back over three months ago. So she's going to call out sick. If they fire her, so be it. It's ridiculous that with so much notice, in her line of work, she "can't" take that time off when family is in town. We've got the cash to deal with her getting fired if that's what happens. Feelsgoodman

Most excellent. It's a great feeling to look your boss in the eye and dare him to fire you that way. FU money is awesome. My guess is they will shrivel in fear and just let it pass. It would be dumb of them to make a big deal out of it.
If an employee's in some safety critical role then 26th December has to be staffed.  Or if its something like retail with sales starting, or customer service on items that are commonly given as Christmas gifts.  When cover is needed in cases such as those then it is usual for the newest employees to be required to take the unpopular shifts/days and that seems fair.

But if its a standard office type job with nothing critical it should be entirely possible for cover by phone/internet to be arranged to be undertaken by willing employees (and perhaps paid extra for).

The issue is because it's a Tuesday and that's the 'busy day' for her, arbitrarily. Not in a safety critical role, plenty of other folks to cover.

Edit: And to clarify she's been with the company for six years, but when we moved she switched offices. She is no longer the new person even by that standard...

Folks without FU money, sadly.  Good for her!

She's looking at a career change anyway, so honestly it's not a big deal anyway. Really nice to have the FU Money. May put some plans on pause but well worth it :)
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: ltt on November 03, 2017, 03:41:17 PM
I don't know if this involved FU money, but I hope so. Someone on their last day at Twitter shut down 45's account. It stayed down for eleven minutes.

That's brilliant. That guy has earned some serious good karma.

What are you talking about?  The guys name is going to be released.  Future employers will not hire him due to the fact that if he ever leaves he may fuck up something at their organization.  Boy he sure showed them...all of 11 minutes.  What a douche monkey.

I agree.....would never hire this guy.  Sorry, but extremely unprofessional...
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: AnnaGrowsAMustache on November 03, 2017, 05:47:22 PM
I'd hire him. He's got personal integrity and balls of steel. I like people that won't sit around letting crap happen and are prepared to burn something to the ground to make a point. It's not a bad thing NOT to be a yes-sir-no-sir monkey. These are the people that make things happen. The guy's just got to find himself a field where being the square peg is the advantage. I speak as a very experienced square peg. What used to be described as 'trouble maker' and 'stirrer' is now 'brought in to change the corporate culture' and 'cutting out the deadwood'.

I once worked as a cleaner at a church that was a little too celebratory of 'white culture', if you know what I mean.  On the day they had a scheduled a festival of said 'white culture', a festival months in the organising, with renowned guest speakers on the subject of 'white culture', I filled every lock in the building with glue. Of course, they just called the locksmiths and the festival went ahead, but I got more than 11 minutes of annoyance for the bastards!

Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: AnnaGrowsAMustache on November 03, 2017, 06:01:14 PM
I don't know if this involved FU money, but I hope so. Someone on their last day at Twitter shut down 45's account. It stayed down for eleven minutes.

That's brilliant. That guy has earned some serious good karma.

He put his ideology above the mission of his company, and in the process took a swipe at a sitting US president. Yeah, brilliant.


This post made me laugh. I seriously could not give even the faintest flying crap about the mission of my company. I only spout their silliness because they pay me to do so. I'm actually all about my personal ideology. I really can't imagine the kind of person who wouldn't be this way! Equally, I don't have the slightest care or respect for the office of the president of the US or any other title that supposedly connotes authority. I take people as I find them and your president I find to be an A grade twat. I'm equally likely to be as disrespectful to the local minister, the chief of police or a surgeon, if I dislike them. If it suits me to be superficially polite and charming and respectful, I'll play the game. If not, I won't. Here we are on a site that actively encourages bucking the system. I'm astounded that most people who have posted about this twitter thing can't see the value in subversive acts. Especially essentially HARMLESS subversive acts. What twitter guy did was quiet resistance, that didn't hurt anyone, and I applaud him for it.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Zikoris on November 03, 2017, 07:13:15 PM
Can we not ruin one of the best threads on the forum with stupid political bullshit?
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: CowboyAndIndian on November 03, 2017, 07:53:57 PM
Can we not ruin one of the best threads on the forum with stupid political bullshit?

+1

Take your political fights out of this thread!!!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Kakashi on November 03, 2017, 09:58:12 PM
I'd hire him. He's got personal integrity and balls of steel. I like people that won't sit around letting crap happen and are prepared to burn something to the ground to make a point. It's not a bad thing NOT to be a yes-sir-no-sir monkey. These are the people that make things happen. The guy's just got to find himself a field where being the square peg is the advantage. I speak as a very experienced square peg. What used to be described as 'trouble maker' and 'stirrer' is now 'brought in to change the corporate culture' and 'cutting out the deadwood'.

I once worked as a cleaner at a church that was a little too celebratory of 'white culture', if you know what I mean.  On the day they had a scheduled a festival of said 'white culture', a festival months in the organising, with renowned guest speakers on the subject of 'white culture', I filled every lock in the building with glue. Of course, they just called the locksmiths and the festival went ahead, but I got more than 11 minutes of annoyance for the bastards!

That's called vandalism. 
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: sequoia on November 03, 2017, 10:13:28 PM
I don't know if this involved FU money, but I hope so. Someone on their last day at Twitter shut down 45's account. It stayed down for eleven minutes.

That's brilliant. That guy has earned some serious good karma.

What are you talking about?  The guys name is going to be released.  Future employers will not hire him due to the fact that if he ever leaves he may fuck up something at their organization.  Boy he sure showed them...all of 11 minutes.  What a douche monkey.

I agree.....would never hire this guy.  Sorry, but extremely unprofessional...

+1. It is one thing to be able to leave a crappy job and have FU money to back it up, which I think what we are celebrating here.

It is a whole different conversation when one destroy his/her work or do damages as walking out the door. This is vandalism and illegal, and that company can press charges. If you are that unhappy with you job, just leave. Why risk losing FU money - if the company press charges, I am sure hiring a lawyer are not cheap. Not to mention possibility of fine and/or jail time. How is that going to look in a resume...

And yes, no need for political rant here - there is a thread for that.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: former player on November 04, 2017, 03:01:54 AM
I don't know if this involved FU money, but I hope so. Someone on their last day at Twitter shut down 45's account. It stayed down for eleven minutes.

That's brilliant. That guy has earned some serious good karma.

What are you talking about?  The guys name is going to be released.  Future employers will not hire him due to the fact that if he ever leaves he may fuck up something at their organization.  Boy he sure showed them...all of 11 minutes.  What a douche monkey.

I agree.....would never hire this guy.  Sorry, but extremely unprofessional...

+1. It is one thing to be able to leave a crappy job and have FU money to back it up, which I think what we are celebrating here.

It is a whole different conversation when one destroy his/her work or do damages as walking out the door. This is vandalism and illegal, and that company can press charges. If you are that unhappy with you job, just leave. Why risk losing FU money - if the company press charges, I am sure hiring a lawyer are not cheap. Not to mention possibility of fine and/or jail time. How is that going to look in a resume...

And yes, no need for political rant here - there is a thread for that.
But Twitter guy didn't exactly destroy anything (the account was recovered in full) and did limited damage (the account was recovered within minutes).  Easier to argue he did Twitter a favour by pointing out how poor their internal security was - for which reason I suspect the chances of them taking any action against him are non-existant.

Also, if they did try to take action, I predict that Twitter guy would have lawyers lining up to argue that he properly took down an account which contravened Twitter rules against harassing people or issuing death threats.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: AnnaGrowsAMustache on November 04, 2017, 03:59:34 AM
I apologise for the political rant. Wasn't really intended as a political rant. I don't care enough about politics even in my own country to truly rant. Anyhoo, the comments on this twitter thing are funny and I'm highly amused by the whole situation.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: fredbear on November 04, 2017, 04:46:11 AM
That's called vandalism.

I've known of two cases of this.  One was a librarian guy in a data-delivery company, passive aggressive to extremes.  You would never have known, based on his unctuous smiles and nervous head-nods, that he was poisonously aggrieved, and we had us a semi-active Bartleby in our office.  He never said a word about whatever was bothering him.  Never to management, never to friends (he did not seem to have any at work.)  He lined up another job, and wipedisked his hard drive.  And no, the company did not have a good backup policy, and ended up going to one of those data-recovery outfits, which failed, so it lost his work plus his part of team tasks.  I would class his replacement job as a form of FU money.

The other was a sadder case, which I think was attributable to a lack of FU money.  It was a startup, and had the usual employees-are-kleenex attitude.  But it was the best job she had ever had (she had a worthless profligate husband and a family to support), and by her conduct she made sure it would be the best job she would ever have.  She desperately needed the job, and when the company worked the flush handle and many of us were circling the toilet bowl, she locked herself in her office, sobbing, and cut up the floppy disks containing the company's QA program with a scissors.  (This was a long time ago, and an irony was that the company was one of the very first to be putting data on optical disks, but was still operating based on floppies.) 
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: sequoia on November 04, 2017, 08:19:29 AM
I don't know if this involved FU money, but I hope so. Someone on their last day at Twitter shut down 45's account. It stayed down for eleven minutes.

That's brilliant. That guy has earned some serious good karma.

What are you talking about?  The guys name is going to be released.  Future employers will not hire him due to the fact that if he ever leaves he may fuck up something at their organization.  Boy he sure showed them...all of 11 minutes.  What a douche monkey.

I agree.....would never hire this guy.  Sorry, but extremely unprofessional...

+1. It is one thing to be able to leave a crappy job and have FU money to back it up, which I think what we are celebrating here.

It is a whole different conversation when one destroy his/her work or do damages as walking out the door. This is vandalism and illegal, and that company can press charges. If you are that unhappy with you job, just leave. Why risk losing FU money - if the company press charges, I am sure hiring a lawyer are not cheap. Not to mention possibility of fine and/or jail time. How is that going to look in a resume...

And yes, no need for political rant here - there is a thread for that.
But Twitter guy didn't exactly destroy anything (the account was recovered in full) and did limited damage (the account was recovered within minutes).  Easier to argue he did Twitter a favour by pointing out how poor their internal security was - for which reason I suspect the chances of them taking any action against him are non-existant.

Also, if they did try to take action, I predict that Twitter guy would have lawyers lining up to argue that he properly took down an account which contravened Twitter rules against harassing people or issuing death threats.

I am not a lawyer, and not going to argue with you if this guy "didn't exactly destroy anything" or did, or if his "limited damage" is actually doing Twitter a favor or not.

Maybe he will have lawyers lining up pro-bono to defend him, maybe he won't, and have to spend money to defend himself. Considering Twitter has a lot more money to burn than this guy, I think we all agree if Twitter press charges, sue him, take him to court, successful or not, it can make life very difficult for this guy, right? So how is this exactly a good thing for this guy? Not to mention that I think some company will not hire him from this - I know I would not. This is not a behavior that should be rewarded imo.

I wonder how this will play out in court, if it goes that far. IMO feels a little like Robin Hood: your honor, I only rob the bank so I can give the money to the poor. If one use this type of argument, then he will not end up in jail? I think not :)

Lets go back to the topic at hand, ok?  :D
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: COEE on November 04, 2017, 09:56:21 AM
So let's get this back to good FU stories!  I've got another one - after posting one just a few pages back!

So I've been unemployed for 6 months now.  At around the 4 month mark I got a call from a company for an interview.  The job was an extremely close match on paper.  I had 10 years experience doing exactly what they needed.  I went in and had a mediocre one hour interview with a panel of about 8 people.  To my surprise the next week they made me an offer for about 70% of my market value!  I've literally known them for all of one hour, and they are making me an offer to work for them (Red flag #1)!  This company, come to find out, was awful.  Their stock, once traded at $250/share was now trading for 5 shares for a penny (Red flag #2).  Horribly mismanaged by all accounts.  I had no tour of the building (red flag #3), no meeting with the people to really get to know that it was a good fit from a chemistry perspective (red flag #4), and no chance to really understand what they wanted me working on in the first 90 days (red flag #5).  Glassdoor reviews were awful - one even says, "Get ready. I'm sure the IRS will be coming for you soon for all your shady dealings. Loose lips sink ships. A lot of employee's won't have any issue telling the Feds their true stories."  (red flag #6).  The job also came with a shitty 25 minute commute on a good day (red flag #7) and shitty benefits (red flag #8).

The extremely poor offer (red flag #9) was the final straw.  I wanted out of this deal bad.  However, I had to be careful because if I refused an offer I could potentially lose my unemployment benefits.  So I negotiated for 100% of my market rate, additional training (~$5k worth), and an additional week of vacation.  Honestly, this was a great deal for both parties - I figured I'd do the job and keep my resume floating around and be ready to jump ship when the right thing came along.  They declined my counter offer, and decided that they were going to look for other candidates.  Phew!  Got out of that one by the skin of my teeth.

During our negotiations the HR person I was working with said they've been talking with other people with twice the experience that wanted less than I did.  I said, "What are you talking to me for then?"  I really wish I could have seen her face when I said that - we were on the phone.  But the truth is that they still haven't found anyone.  I saw they posted the job again 8 days ago - for much less than what they offered me (40% to 60% of the going rate) - they'll never find someone with 5+ years of experience stateside for that salary.

I'm considering posting interview information to glassdoor about my awful experience as well.  Probably also encouraging their current employees to leave if they are making that kind of money.  I mean, I've heard of C grade companies, but I really think they were trying to take advantage of me and seeing if I was hungry.  Thank god for FU money!

I've got one more FU story - but I'll save it for another day.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Bicycle_B on November 04, 2017, 10:10:34 AM
I am not a lawyer, and not going to argue with you if this guy "didn't exactly destroy anything" or did, or if his "limited damage" is actually doing Twitter a favor or not.

Maybe he will have lawyers lining up pro-bono to defend him, maybe he won't, and have to spend money to defend himself. Considering Twitter has a lot more money to burn than this guy, I think we all agree if Twitter press charges, sue him, take him to court, successful or not, it can make life very difficult for this guy, right? So how is this exactly a good thing for this guy? Not to mention that I think some company will not hire him from this - I know I would not. This is not a behavior that should be rewarded imo.

I wonder how this will play out in court, if it goes that far. IMO feels a little like Robin Hood: your honor, I only rob the bank so I can give the money to the poor. If one use this type of argument, then he will not end up in jail? I think not :)

Lets go back to the topic at hand, ok?  :D

Three paragraphs about whether the Twitter quitter's actions will get him in trouble, and then "Let's get back to the topic at hand"?  I can support "Let's get back to the topic", but not "Here's my opinion, you guys can't give yours."

I wasn't going to comment until now.  Here goes:

1. This thread is for epic FU money stories.  The original poster stipulated that the money part is unknown.  Arguments against the Twitter quitter have basically been "she's wrong" or "she'll be in trouble" or "I wouldn't hire her"... but no one has asserted it isn't epic.
2. Regardless of what side of the aisle you're on, if quitting your job makes thousands of random people on the internet talk about it, and your feat involves the Leader of The Free World, it's probably epic.
3. If that one's not epic, the bar's being set pretty high.

Also - some people fall into the Lawful Good camp, others are Chaotic Good.  Sounds to me like the Chaotic Good are arguing (between gleeful guffaws) that it's an epic prank, while the Lawful Good are harrumphing that it's Not Lawful At All.  I'm inclined to acknowledge the difference and accept the submission on the basis that the poster felt it was epic, because neither the Lawful nor Chaotic are going to agree about the specifics.  I'd rather have an inclusive thread than one that rules too many stories out.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: markbike528CBX on November 04, 2017, 12:34:36 PM
.....3paragraph  snip"..........
Lets go back to the topic at hand, ok?  :D

Three paragraphs about whether the Twitter quitter's actions will get him in trouble, and then "Let's get back to the topic at hand"?  I can support "Let's get back to the topic", but not "Here's my opinion, you guys can't give yours."

yet another snip

Also - some people fall into the Lawful Good camp, others are Chaotic Good.  Sounds to me like the Chaotic Good are arguing (between gleeful guffaws) that it's an epic prank, while the Lawful Good are harrumphing that it's Not Lawful At All.  I'm inclined to acknowledge the difference and accept the submission on the basis that the poster felt it was epic, because neither the Lawful nor Chaotic are going to agree about the specifics.  I'd rather have an inclusive thread than one that rules too many stories out.

Happy to see what I perceive as a D&D reference in 2017.

+1 on the "I can support "Let's get back to the topic", but not "Here's my opinion, you guys can't give yours.""

Right or wrong, POTUS  or not ( think CEO , garden variety), still Epic, my vote.


Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: BlueHouse on November 04, 2017, 03:06:35 PM

Three paragraphs about whether the Twitter quitter's actions will get him in trouble, and then "Let's get back to the topic at hand"?  I can support "Let's get back to the topic", but not "Here's my opinion, you guys can't give yours."

I wasn't going to comment until now.  Here goes:

1. This thread is for epic FU money stories.  The original poster stipulated that the money part is unknown.  Arguments against the Twitter quitter have basically been "she's wrong" or "she'll be in trouble" or "I wouldn't hire her"... but no one has asserted it isn't epic.
2. Regardless of what side of the aisle you're on, if quitting your job makes thousands of random people on the internet talk about it, and your feat involves the Leader of The Free World, it's probably epic.
3. If that one's not epic, the bar's being set pretty high.

Also - some people fall into the Lawful Good camp, others are Chaotic Good.  Sounds to me like the Chaotic Good are arguing (between gleeful guffaws) that it's an epic prank, while the Lawful Good are harrumphing that it's Not Lawful At All.  I'm inclined to acknowledge the difference and accept the submission on the basis that the poster felt it was epic, because neither the Lawful nor Chaotic are going to agree about the specifics.  I'd rather have an inclusive thread than one that rules too many stories out.
+1 on all counts.  This is absolutely an epic FU money story whether you agree with the twitter employee's actions or not.  Same as that flight attendant who took a beer, opened the emergency door, and rode to freedom. 
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: jordanread on November 04, 2017, 03:40:54 PM

Three paragraphs about whether the Twitter quitter's actions will get him in trouble, and then "Let's get back to the topic at hand"?  I can support "Let's get back to the topic", but not "Here's my opinion, you guys can't give yours."

I wasn't going to comment until now.  Here goes:

1. This thread is for epic FU money stories.  The original poster stipulated that the money part is unknown.  Arguments against the Twitter quitter have basically been "she's wrong" or "she'll be in trouble" or "I wouldn't hire her"... but no one has asserted it isn't epic.
2. Regardless of what side of the aisle you're on, if quitting your job makes thousands of random people on the internet talk about it, and your feat involves the Leader of The Free World, it's probably epic.
3. If that one's not epic, the bar's being set pretty high.

Also - some people fall into the Lawful Good camp, others are Chaotic Good.  Sounds to me like the Chaotic Good are arguing (between gleeful guffaws) that it's an epic prank, while the Lawful Good are harrumphing that it's Not Lawful At All.  I'm inclined to acknowledge the difference and accept the submission on the basis that the poster felt it was epic, because neither the Lawful nor Chaotic are going to agree about the specifics.  I'd rather have an inclusive thread than one that rules too many stories out.
+1 on all counts.  This is absolutely an epic FU money story whether you agree with the twitter employee's actions or not.  Same as that flight attendant who took a beer, opened the emergency door, and rode to freedom.

I vaguely remember something about that, but now I need to find it again.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: AlanStache on November 04, 2017, 04:46:17 PM
...

+1 on all counts.  This is absolutely an epic FU money story whether you agree with the twitter employee's actions or not.  Same as that flight attendant who took a beer, opened the emergency door, and rode to freedom.

I vaguely remember something about that, but now I need to find it again.

It was a good yarn but I think he was a recovering alcoholic so not the best in that way.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Apple_Tango on November 04, 2017, 08:51:58 PM
I'm in traveling healthcare, and because of my stash I am able to take long breaks between assignments without too much worry. Today was my last day and I got questioned about 100 times from my coworkers about what I was doing next. A few were a little wide eyed when I smiled ear to ear and said "I'm unemployed!!"

Every contract starts out promising and I think "This is a nice place! Maybe I can stay here" but then after about 3 months I am just pacing in my cage waiting to run away as soon as the door opens. And now I'm free!!!!!!!  It's not really an epic FU story, but it allows me to keep building my stash and not be afraid of the insecurity of the job schedule I have. Honestly since I graduated with my degree I have not been able to keep a full time job for more than 9 months. Not because I'm a bad employee! I still have standing offers for pretty much any job I have ever left (the fact that ALL of them are still unfilled or have high turnover should tell you something). I am just counting down the years to FIRE. But these long breaks let me breathe a little bit. And seek needed medical and dental care lol. A vacation to go to the doctor!

The plan this time is just to get a part time job over the holidays, now that my health insurance is coming through COBRA for a few months. My expenses are so low that even with a part time job I should be able to increase the 'stache.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: farfromfire on November 05, 2017, 02:49:11 AM
Anticipatory FU story coming in:

My wife and I moved recently and last year she wasn't able to have Christmas with her family. This year, they're flying out and we'll spend some time with them; the first Christmas she'd have spent with them in a few years, and their first time visiting us.

She asked off for the 26th of December and was denied PTO - back over three months ago. So she's going to call out sick. If they fire her, so be it. It's ridiculous that with so much notice, in her line of work, she "can't" take that time off when family is in town. We've got the cash to deal with her getting fired if that's what happens. Feelsgoodman
Though it's great you guys can afford this, it's insane tht a single PTO day does not get approved, even when requested months in advance. Any decent vacation would end up including a Tuesday after all. What line of work is she in?
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: WootWoot on November 05, 2017, 03:08:34 PM
These aren't my stories but here goes.

When I worked at a newspaper in the late '90s, one of the reporters got fed up and just basically left. He said he had enough money to live on until he found something else. He was only in his 20s so I wondered how the heck he'd managed to save that much money.

This is an FU story. An online acquaintance was working for a college. Apparently her boss was a real witch, and one day, she just snapped and walked out. She really didn't have any money to speak of. The best part was: She sent a letter through the college's email system to the entire staff and faculty, telling everyone how horrible the witch was. (Update: A few years later, she is poor but happy. Inherited a little bit of money, can collect social security, and works small jobs. Just moved to the city of her dreams).

I have an online pen pal who worked in the insurance industry for a long time. She said she saved for a rainy day, and when it rained it poured. When she lost her job, she spent two years looking for another, and never found one. She never went back to work and doesn't have to. She's only 55. I wish I knew her secret...

Well, that last one really wasn't an FU story, but...
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: APowers on November 07, 2017, 07:14:04 AM
Anticipatory FU story coming in:

My wife and I moved recently and last year she wasn't able to have Christmas with her family. This year, they're flying out and we'll spend some time with them; the first Christmas she'd have spent with them in a few years, and their first time visiting us.

She asked off for the 26th of December and was denied PTO - back over three months ago. So she's going to call out sick. If they fire her, so be it. It's ridiculous that with so much notice, in her line of work, she "can't" take that time off when family is in town. We've got the cash to deal with her getting fired if that's what happens. Feelsgoodman
Though it's great you guys can afford this, it's insane tht a single PTO day does not get approved, even when requested months in advance. Any decent vacation would end up including a Tuesday after all. What line of work is she in?
Employer won't give workers days off around christmas? I'm going to guess retail.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: GnomeErcy on November 07, 2017, 10:11:34 AM
Anticipatory FU story coming in:

My wife and I moved recently and last year she wasn't able to have Christmas with her family. This year, they're flying out and we'll spend some time with them; the first Christmas she'd have spent with them in a few years, and their first time visiting us.

She asked off for the 26th of December and was denied PTO - back over three months ago. So she's going to call out sick. If they fire her, so be it. It's ridiculous that with so much notice, in her line of work, she "can't" take that time off when family is in town. We've got the cash to deal with her getting fired if that's what happens. Feelsgoodman
Though it's great you guys can afford this, it's insane tht a single PTO day does not get approved, even when requested months in advance. Any decent vacation would end up including a Tuesday after all. What line of work is she in?
Employer won't give workers days off around christmas? I'm going to guess retail.

Logistics
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: farfromfire on November 07, 2017, 11:15:46 AM
Anticipatory FU story coming in:

My wife and I moved recently and last year she wasn't able to have Christmas with her family. This year, they're flying out and we'll spend some time with them; the first Christmas she'd have spent with them in a few years, and their first time visiting us.

She asked off for the 26th of December and was denied PTO - back over three months ago. So she's going to call out sick. If they fire her, so be it. It's ridiculous that with so much notice, in her line of work, she "can't" take that time off when family is in town. We've got the cash to deal with her getting fired if that's what happens. Feelsgoodman
Though it's great you guys can afford this, it's insane tht a single PTO day does not get approved, even when requested months in advance. Any decent vacation would end up including a Tuesday after all. What line of work is she in?
Employer won't give workers days off around christmas? I'm going to guess retail.

Logistics
That's very sad, how's someone supposed to maintain their sanity in such an environment? Needless to say, this story is in complete contrast to Linda_Norway's thread on the topic of vacation days among US employees, and confirms my suspicion that MMMers aren't exactly representative of the general public...
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: mm1970 on November 07, 2017, 04:11:39 PM
Anticipatory FU story coming in:

My wife and I moved recently and last year she wasn't able to have Christmas with her family. This year, they're flying out and we'll spend some time with them; the first Christmas she'd have spent with them in a few years, and their first time visiting us.

She asked off for the 26th of December and was denied PTO - back over three months ago. So she's going to call out sick. If they fire her, so be it. It's ridiculous that with so much notice, in her line of work, she "can't" take that time off when family is in town. We've got the cash to deal with her getting fired if that's what happens. Feelsgoodman
Though it's great you guys can afford this, it's insane tht a single PTO day does not get approved, even when requested months in advance. Any decent vacation would end up including a Tuesday after all. What line of work is she in?
Employer won't give workers days off around christmas? I'm going to guess retail.

Logistics
That's very sad, how's someone supposed to maintain their sanity in such an environment? Needless to say, this story is in complete contrast to Linda_Norway's thread on the topic of vacation days among US employees, and confirms my suspicion that MMMers aren't exactly representative of the general public...
This whole Christmas time off thing makes me remember something.  So, my big sis has been working at the same insurance company (small town, she's the office manager) for 30+ years now.  There are now 4-5 ladies working at the office for the two insurance salesmen.  In any event, my sister gets first dibs on vacation time (and while her pay is crap, she gets 5 weeks off a year - way better than me).  So she always chooses the same week at Christmas.

That means nobody else gets to take it.  Or only one other person.  We had a convo once and she said that she gets first pick because of seniority.  But the funny thing is, second in seniority is a woman who has been there ONE YEAR LESS.  So this lady basically gets screwed every year.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Dicey on November 07, 2017, 04:27:55 PM
^^Karma's a bitch.^^
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Imma on November 08, 2017, 02:31:38 AM
Anticipatory FU story coming in:

My wife and I moved recently and last year she wasn't able to have Christmas with her family. This year, they're flying out and we'll spend some time with them; the first Christmas she'd have spent with them in a few years, and their first time visiting us.

She asked off for the 26th of December and was denied PTO - back over three months ago. So she's going to call out sick. If they fire her, so be it. It's ridiculous that with so much notice, in her line of work, she "can't" take that time off when family is in town. We've got the cash to deal with her getting fired if that's what happens. Feelsgoodman
Though it's great you guys can afford this, it's insane tht a single PTO day does not get approved, even when requested months in advance. Any decent vacation would end up including a Tuesday after all. What line of work is she in?
Employer won't give workers days off around christmas? I'm going to guess retail.

Logistics
That's very sad, how's someone supposed to maintain their sanity in such an environment? Needless to say, this story is in complete contrast to Linda_Norway's thread on the topic of vacation days among US employees, and confirms my suspicion that MMMers aren't exactly representative of the general public...
This whole Christmas time off thing makes me remember something.  So, my big sis has been working at the same insurance company (small town, she's the office manager) for 30+ years now.  There are now 4-5 ladies working at the office for the two insurance salesmen.  In any event, my sister gets first dibs on vacation time (and while her pay is crap, she gets 5 weeks off a year - way better than me).  So she always chooses the same week at Christmas.

That means nobody else gets to take it.  Or only one other person.  We had a convo once and she said that she gets first pick because of seniority.  But the funny thing is, second in seniority is a woman who has been there ONE YEAR LESS.  So this lady basically gets screwed every year.

That's the biggest downside for me of working at a small company. Only one person can take a vacation at the time and in those type of companies there's often a strong hierarchy. Which means if you're the new person (and you can be the new person for 10 years) you're basically screwed. I'm lucky that my coworkers don't care about christmas, so I get to take the week between christmas and NYE off, but I didn't have a summer holiday. Coworkers have kids, so they want to spend that time with their kids (understandably) and I'm stuck in the office working overtime for the entire summer.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: sequoia on November 08, 2017, 07:41:09 AM

This whole Christmas time off thing makes me remember something.  So, my big sis has been working at the same insurance company (small town, she's the office manager) for 30+ years now.  There are now 4-5 ladies working at the office for the two insurance salesmen.  In any event, my sister gets first dibs on vacation time (and while her pay is crap, she gets 5 weeks off a year - way better than me).  So she always chooses the same week at Christmas.

That means nobody else gets to take it.  Or only one other person.  We had a convo once and she said that she gets first pick because of seniority.  But the funny thing is, second in seniority is a woman who has been there ONE YEAR LESS.  So this lady basically gets screwed every year.

That's the biggest downside for me of working at a small company. Only one person can take a vacation at the time and in those type of companies there's often a strong hierarchy. Which means if you're the new person (and you can be the new person for 10 years) you're basically screwed. I'm lucky that my coworkers don't care about christmas, so I get to take the week between christmas and NYE off, but I didn't have a summer holiday. Coworkers have kids, so they want to spend that time with their kids (understandably) and I'm stuck in the office working overtime for the entire summer.

Wow... I understand the hierarchy thing and trying not to have more than one person on vacation at one time but I am surprised that matter during Christmas time. Unless a company is doing retail, I do not see how other business can be that busy during Christmas.

I used to work for a large company, and around Christmas, we probably have 10% staff around Christmas with nothing to do for those who come in to work. Not only the managers are on vacation, but our clients are on vacations too, so nothing gets done even if we want to.

Sorry I am going off on a tangent. I now definitely appreciate more that I can take time off pretty much anytime I want.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: rockstache on November 08, 2017, 07:47:51 AM
^^Karma's a bitch.^^

I'm confused by this comment unless all the other ladies are mean and awful.

I would never take Christmas week off personally. That is a waste of a vacation week since there is hardly ever any work to do, and crowds everywhere. I'd rather use vacation for when other people are working.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Guesl982374 on November 08, 2017, 09:41:42 AM
I would never take Christmas week off personally. That is a waste of a vacation week since there is hardly ever any work to do, and crowds everywhere. I'd rather use vacation for when other people are working.

I am the same way (for now). What changes the math is when you have kid(s) that are out of school.

But I agree. For your typical cube dweller the week or so around Christmas is where you can work half the time and accomplish twice the amount of work (no interruptions).
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Dicey on November 08, 2017, 10:21:15 AM
^^Karma's a bitch.^^
I'm confused by this comment...
She could share or alternate. She's using her seniority to tilt the playing field. The fact that the next senior person is only slightly less senior kinda makes it sound like she revels in her seniority,  which is not pretty or kind, hence Karma.

Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Dicey on November 08, 2017, 10:27:29 AM
That's the biggest downside for me of working at a small company. Only one person can take a vacation at the time and in those type of companies there's often a strong hierarchy. Which means if you're the new person (and you can be the new person for 10 years) you're basically screwed. I'm lucky that my coworkers don't care about christmas, so I get to take the week between christmas and NYE off, but I didn't have a summer holiday. Coworkers have kids, so they want to spend that time with their kids (understandably) and I'm stuck in the office working overtime for the entire summer.
Imma, the fall is a lovely time to travel. Could you plan something for then so you have something to look forward to in the dog days of summer? I used to go to DC a lot. The best time was in early September. Lovely weather, no lines, and shoulder season rates. The kids were back in school and hadn't had time to plan their rampages field trips yet. It was heavenly.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: rockstache on November 08, 2017, 11:15:14 AM
^^Karma's a bitch.^^
I'm confused by this comment...
She could share or alternate. She's using her seniority to tilt the playing field. The fact that the next senior person is only slightly less senior kinda makes it sound like she revels in her seniority,  which is not pretty or kind, hence Karma.


ohhhh you mean it WILL get her. I thought you meant Karma was a bitch to the lady who couldn't take vacation. Maybe I'd better head back to bed.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: arebelspy on November 08, 2017, 11:22:57 AM
^^Karma's a bitch.^^
I'm confused by this comment...
She could share or alternate. She's using her seniority to tilt the playing field. The fact that the next senior person is only slightly less senior kinda makes it sound like she revels in her seniority,  which is not pretty or kind, hence Karma.


ohhhh you mean it WILL get her. I thought you meant Karma was a bitch to the lady who couldn't take vacation. Maybe I'd better head back to bed.

I read it the same way you did. The clarification made much more sense  :)
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: paddedhat on November 08, 2017, 11:24:29 AM
That's the biggest downside for me of working at a small company. Only one person can take a vacation at the time and in those type of companies there's often a strong hierarchy. Which means if you're the new person (and you can be the new person for 10 years) you're basically screwed. I'm lucky that my coworkers don't care about christmas, so I get to take the week between christmas and NYE off, but I didn't have a summer holiday. Coworkers have kids, so they want to spend that time with their kids (understandably) and I'm stuck in the office working overtime for the entire summer.
Imma, the fall is a lovely time to travel. Could you plan something for then so you have something to look forward to in the dog days of summer? I used to go to DC a lot. The best time was in early September. Lovely weather, no lines, and shoulder season rates. The kids were back in school and hadn't had time to plan their rampages field trips yet. It was heavenly.

One of the great joys of FIREing is that we have discovered that the worker bees have a very fixed window to enjoy a whole lot of opportunities when it comes to recreation and tourism, and since you are post-unemployed, you get to enjoy the best places during the times when the masses have to stay chained to their desks.  We relocated to the heart of the Amish country in PA, earlier this year. We had been visiting the area for two decades, and had a huge concern about moving to a place that sees eight million tourists a year. We had spend many Saturdays in years past, crawling in tourist traffic, and didn't want to turn that into a lifestyle. After a few months of being here, and unwinding a bit, we finally figured out that the ONLY time our neighborhood sucks is from about 10AM to 6PM on Saturdays, from mid-spring to Christmas. That is less than 10% of the time, and we now have a very good handle of every farm road, and back alley in the land, and how to use them to get around the lines of out of state cars that stack up on those days. We just smile when people from out of town say, "you live in a beautiful place, but oh, God, that traffic".

We have also used this concept as we spent a few years roaming around the states in our motorhome, and rarely did anything the would potentially involve crowds on a weekend, or peak times. We made darn sure to find quiet places to hide on the big summer holidays. The wonderful world of RVing can really turn to shit on holidays like the 4th of July, when the campgrounds are 110% full. Occasionally full of families with a litter of screaming little brats and a $300 pop-up camper that blew two tires on the way there. Due to awesome parenting and social skills, they then decide that the way to address the sugared up, screaming little spawn, at 11pm, is to make the bonfire bigger, kick up the drinking a notch, and turn up the sorry-assed country music they and half the county are "enjoying". The amazing part is that, by the last week of August, chucklenuts like this are long gone, and great places are very lightly attended. If you really want your experience to be wonderful and uncrowded, push the limits and get there a week or two before the places are about to roll up the sidewalks for the winter.  Places like the Black Hills, SD, or the coast of Maine, absolutely kick ass in the second half of September, and 80% or more of the crowds are gone. Yellowstone is another great example. They have been setting attendance records every year, and by noon on a typical mid-summer day, the place looks like a street in Manhattan. Get there the week after labor day, and it's like another planet. Without kids to accommodate, being able to take time off in fall and spring is a gift.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: mm1970 on November 08, 2017, 11:58:50 AM
^^Karma's a bitch.^^
I'm confused by this comment...
She could share or alternate. She's using her seniority to tilt the playing field. The fact that the next senior person is only slightly less senior kinda makes it sound like she revels in her seniority,  which is not pretty or kind, hence Karma.


ohhhh you mean it WILL get her. I thought you meant Karma was a bitch to the lady who couldn't take vacation. Maybe I'd better head back to bed.

Well, it hasn't gotten her yet.  Honestly, she quit her job for a better one once.  They begged her to stay.  She lasted a week at the new job.  Asked to go back.  They hired her back as if she never left AND started paying for her health insurance (small office, nobody got health insurance back then).  Because...she's honestly better at the job than anyone else.

Actually, I think 2-3 years ago Lady #2 quit, because she was sleeping with the (married) boss and the truth came out.  When it comes to Karma, my sister has way more good karma than the rest of the office, even with claiming the same week at Christmas. 
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: saguaro on November 08, 2017, 12:39:51 PM

[ If you really want your experience to be wonderful and uncrowded, push the limits and get there a week or two before the places are about to roll up the sidewalks for the winter.  Places like the Black Hills, SD, or the coast of Maine, absolutely kick ass in the second half of September, and 80% or more of the crowds are gone. Yellowstone is another great example. They have been setting attendance records every year, and by noon on a typical mid-summer day, the place looks like a street in Manhattan. Get there the week after labor day, and it's like another planet. Without kids to accommodate, being able to take time off in fall and spring is a gift.

ITA on this.  Spring and fall are the times that DH and I typically travel and we plan things around when schools are in session.  This is also means we avoid the spring break weeks as well. 
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: arebelspy on November 08, 2017, 12:39:07 PM
I don't think Dicey was claiming anywhere near enough knowledge of your sister to say she wasn't valued, or didn't have positive karma, or whatever.

Just that it'd be a nice thing sometimes to let others have it as well, even if it's her "right" to claim it.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Dicey on November 08, 2017, 02:08:48 PM
I don't think Dicey was claiming anywhere near enough knowledge of your sister to say she wasn't valued, or didn't have positive karma, or whatever.

Just that it'd be a nice thing sometimes to let others have it as well, even if it's her "right" to claim it.
Thanks, ARS. You nailed it.

But the funny thing is, second in seniority is a woman who has been there ONE YEAR LESS. So this lady basically gets screwed every year.
Uh, I'm responding to what you wrote about your sister.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Rowellen on November 08, 2017, 02:11:03 PM
But I agree. For your typical cube dweller the week or so around Christmas is where you can work half the time and accomplish twice the amount of work (no interruptions).

I would prefer that too but my boss insists on closing the office for 2 whole weeks at Christmas. So everyone is forced to take leave then. It sucks. Really it's just another example of my boss being a micromanaging control freak.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: AlanStache on November 08, 2017, 02:41:05 PM
But I agree. For your typical cube dweller the week or so around Christmas is where you can work half the time and accomplish twice the amount of work (no interruptions).

I would prefer that too but my boss insists on closing the office for 2 whole weeks at Christmas. So everyone is forced to take leave then. It sucks. Really it's just another example of my boss being a micromanaging control freak.

My boss-man basically closes the company down between xmass and new years; everyone gets paid holiday time.  Then we can take vacation to fill in any gaps to preceding/following weekends.  Basically the thinking is we would be getting nothing done anyway with all external contacts on vacation and half the company otherwise also gone.  It is a good perk.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Daisy on November 08, 2017, 02:56:23 PM
^^Karma's a bitch.^^

I'm confused by this comment unless all the other ladies are mean and awful.

I would never take Christmas week off personally. That is a waste of a vacation week since there is hardly ever any work to do, and crowds everywhere. I'd rather use vacation for when other people are working.

I agree rockstache. That was my Christmas time vacation policy while working. We would typically take long lunches that week with whoever was around. Call it "team building" if you'd like.

However, there was one year where an overeager and overbearing boss started asking around the room who would be in that week. I figured that would mean he would load us with extra work, so I made a game time decision during that meeting to take the week off. It was a good decision.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: LeRainDrop on November 08, 2017, 03:02:32 PM
That's the biggest downside for me of working at a small company. Only one person can take a vacation at the time and in those type of companies there's often a strong hierarchy. Which means if you're the new person (and you can be the new person for 10 years) you're basically screwed. I'm lucky that my coworkers don't care about christmas, so I get to take the week between christmas and NYE off, but I didn't have a summer holiday. Coworkers have kids, so they want to spend that time with their kids (understandably) and I'm stuck in the office working overtime for the entire summer.
Imma, the fall is a lovely time to travel. Could you plan something for then so you have something to look forward to in the dog days of summer? I used to go to DC a lot. The best time was in early September. Lovely weather, no lines, and shoulder season rates. The kids were back in school and hadn't had time to plan their rampages field trips yet. It was heavenly.

One of the great joys of FIREing is that we have discovered that the worker bees have a very fixed window to enjoy a whole lot of opportunities when it comes to recreation and tourism, and since you are post-unemployed, you get to enjoy the best places during the times when the masses have to stay chained to their desks. . . . 

. . . If you really want your experience to be wonderful and uncrowded, push the limits and get there a week or two before the places are about to roll up the sidewalks for the winter.  Places like the Black Hills, SD, or the coast of Maine, absolutely kick ass in the second half of September, and 80% or more of the crowds are gone. Yellowstone is another great example. They have been setting attendance records every year, and by noon on a typical mid-summer day, the place looks like a street in Manhattan. Get there the week after labor day, and it's like another planet. Without kids to accommodate, being able to take time off in fall and spring is a gift.

I absolutely LOVE traveling in September because typically the weather in the US/Europe is still quite pleasant and there are far fewer tourists around.  Best spots I've been in September include Lake Tahoe, the Montana/Wyoming/South Dakota national and state parks (yes, paddedhat, including the Black Hills!), Italy, Greece, and Portugal. I LOVE, LOVE, LOVE September vacations!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: sequoia on November 08, 2017, 04:18:46 PM
But I agree. For your typical cube dweller the week or so around Christmas is where you can work half the time and accomplish twice the amount of work (no interruptions).

I would prefer that too but my boss insists on closing the office for 2 whole weeks at Christmas. So everyone is forced to take leave then. It sucks. Really it's just another example of my boss being a micromanaging control freak.

Perhaps a good example of having FU money... you can walk away from this sucky job....
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Rowellen on November 08, 2017, 04:31:57 PM
But I agree. For your typical cube dweller the week or so around Christmas is where you can work half the time and accomplish twice the amount of work (no interruptions).

I would prefer that too but my boss insists on closing the office for 2 whole weeks at Christmas. So everyone is forced to take leave then. It sucks. Really it's just another example of my boss being a micromanaging control freak.

Perhaps a good example of having FU money... you can walk away from this sucky job....

;) soon. I'm working on it. Sticking it out at the moment as it's bearable. But once I get my long service leave paid out, I'll be looking seriously. It probably won't be epic though.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: zolotiyeruki on November 08, 2017, 08:33:58 PM
I absolutely LOVE traveling in September because typically the weather in the US/Europe is still quite pleasant and there are far fewer tourists around.  Best spots I've been in September include Lake Tahoe, the Montana/Wyoming/South Dakota national and state parks (yes, paddedhat, including the Black Hills!), Italy, Greece, and Portugal. I LOVE, LOVE, LOVE September vacations!
We homeschool our kids, and my work schedule is flexible, so we have the freedom to travel when we want as well.  Last time, we hid Disney World in late January/early February.  The weather was beautiful (cool in the morning, warm but comfortable in the afternoon), the crowds were light, and the hotel rates were cheaper :)
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Sibley on November 09, 2017, 12:42:10 PM
But I agree. For your typical cube dweller the week or so around Christmas is where you can work half the time and accomplish twice the amount of work (no interruptions).

I would prefer that too but my boss insists on closing the office for 2 whole weeks at Christmas. So everyone is forced to take leave then. It sucks. Really it's just another example of my boss being a micromanaging control freak.

Perhaps a good example of having FU money... you can walk away from this sucky job....

;) soon. I'm working on it. Sticking it out at the moment as it's bearable. But once I get my long service leave paid out, I'll be looking seriously. It probably won't be epic though.

Sometimes the epic part is NOT throwing a fit and quitting. I am very proud of the fact that I haven't decked my manager yet. That self control is entirely due to FU money (it's better for me long term right now to stay where I am while job searching).
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Rowellen on November 09, 2017, 02:08:47 PM
But I agree. For your typical cube dweller the week or so around Christmas is where you can work half the time and accomplish twice the amount of work (no interruptions).

I would prefer that too but my boss insists on closing the office for 2 whole weeks at Christmas. So everyone is forced to take leave then. It sucks. Really it's just another example of my boss being a micromanaging control freak.

Perhaps a good example of having FU money... you can walk away from this sucky job....

;) soon. I'm working on it. Sticking it out at the moment as it's bearable. But once I get my long service leave paid out, I'll be looking seriously. It probably won't be epic though.

Sometimes the epic part is NOT throwing a fit and quitting. I am very proud of the fact that I haven't decked my manager yet. That self control is entirely due to FU money (it's better for me long term right now to stay where I am while job searching).

That is true. The position is very convenient and the pay is nice. It's not really the job from hell.  I'm just really bored and my boss is a micromanager. I really shouldn't complain. I restrain from throwing my computer at my boss's head.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: dandarc on November 09, 2017, 02:36:02 PM
That is true. The position is very convenient and the pay is nice. It's not really the job from hell.  I'm just really bored and my boss is a micromanager. I really shouldn't complain. I restrain from throwing my computer at my boss's head.
Real purpose of laptop docking stations - makes throwing the computer at boss' head a little more difficult.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: jlcnuke on November 09, 2017, 03:18:50 PM
^^Karma's a bitch.^^

I'm confused by this comment unless all the other ladies are mean and awful.

I would never take Christmas week off personally. That is a waste of a vacation week since there is hardly ever any work to do, and crowds everywhere. I'd rather use vacation for when other people are working.

I always take Christmas week off. With company holidays, I'm using 3 days of PTO this year to take 11 days off in a row. I like to maximize my "overall" time off by combining PTO with paid holidays to get the most "bang" for my PTO.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Sibley on November 09, 2017, 03:49:57 PM
But I agree. For your typical cube dweller the week or so around Christmas is where you can work half the time and accomplish twice the amount of work (no interruptions).

I would prefer that too but my boss insists on closing the office for 2 whole weeks at Christmas. So everyone is forced to take leave then. It sucks. Really it's just another example of my boss being a micromanaging control freak.

Perhaps a good example of having FU money... you can walk away from this sucky job....

;) soon. I'm working on it. Sticking it out at the moment as it's bearable. But once I get my long service leave paid out, I'll be looking seriously. It probably won't be epic though.

Sometimes the epic part is NOT throwing a fit and quitting. I am very proud of the fact that I haven't decked my manager yet. That self control is entirely due to FU money (it's better for me long term right now to stay where I am while job searching).

That is true. The position is very convenient and the pay is nice. It's not really the job from hell.  I'm just really bored and my boss is a micromanager. I really shouldn't complain. I restrain from throwing my computer at my boss's head.

Oh yes. Tomorrow is going to strain my self control to some extent. However, I will not throw the laptop at the manager. I will also not tell the manager that she's a control freak.

Edit:
Heard from one recruiter, that company wants me to do a 2nd interview when they normally only do 1sts. Because they've got multiple teams fighting to make me an offer and they don't know which team I'd do best at.

Got a voicemail from another recruiter, call her. Ok, I'll call her. Because that's the company I really prefer, and if they want a 2nd interview, I'll make it happen.

Send good thoughts please....
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: radram on November 09, 2017, 08:44:36 PM
But I agree. For your typical cube dweller the week or so around Christmas is where you can work half the time and accomplish twice the amount of work (no interruptions).

I would prefer that too but my boss insists on closing the office for 2 whole weeks at Christmas. So everyone is forced to take leave then. It sucks. Really it's just another example of my boss being a micromanaging control freak.

Perhaps a good example of having FU money... you can walk away from this sucky job....

;) soon. I'm working on it. Sticking it out at the moment as it's bearable. But once I get my long service leave paid out, I'll be looking seriously. It probably won't be epic though.

Sometimes the epic part is NOT throwing a fit and quitting. I am very proud of the fact that I haven't decked my manager yet. That self control is entirely due to FU money (it's better for me long term right now to stay where I am while job searching).

That is true. The position is very convenient and the pay is nice. It's not really the job from hell.  I'm just really bored and my boss is a micromanager. I really shouldn't complain. I restrain from throwing my computer at my boss's head.

Oh yes. Tomorrow is going to strain my self control to some extent. However, I will not throw the laptop at the manager. I will also not tell the manager that she's a control freak.

Edit:
Heard from one recruiter, that company wants me to do a 2nd interview when they normally only do 1sts. Because they've got multiple teams fighting to make me an offer and they don't know which team I'd do best at.

Got a voicemail from another recruiter, call her. Ok, I'll call her. Because that's the company I really prefer, and if they want a 2nd interview, I'll make it happen.

Send good thoughts please....

Give 'em hell!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Dicey on November 09, 2017, 09:04:21 PM
Send good thoughts please....
Consider it done.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Imma on November 10, 2017, 05:56:17 AM
That's the biggest downside for me of working at a small company. Only one person can take a vacation at the time and in those type of companies there's often a strong hierarchy. Which means if you're the new person (and you can be the new person for 10 years) you're basically screwed. I'm lucky that my coworkers don't care about christmas, so I get to take the week between christmas and NYE off, but I didn't have a summer holiday. Coworkers have kids, so they want to spend that time with their kids (understandably) and I'm stuck in the office working overtime for the entire summer.
Imma, the fall is a lovely time to travel. Could you plan something for then so you have something to look forward to in the dog days of summer? I used to go to DC a lot. The best time was in early September. Lovely weather, no lines, and shoulder season rates. The kids were back in school and hadn't had time to plan their rampages field trips yet. It was heavenly.

I usually take some time off in September / October and it's a great time to make trips (which we do if we can) but where we live the weather is unpredictable that time of the year. If we want a reasonable chance of good weather, we need to travel quite far away from home and we don't always feel like spending that kind of money. I don't want to visit tourist attractions during the summer, so I don't miss out on that, but I do miss out on things like local festivals and events, BBQ's and parties at friends' places etc. I work so much overtime I barely have the time and energy to do any of those things even if they're in the evenings or weekends. And for DIY projects outside taking a few days off when there's a good chance of dry weather is convenient too.

I like being off between Christmas and NYE. It's a pretty busy time at my workplace because many of our customers needs to arrange stuff before the New Year and while they know that months before, we always see an increase in orders in December. We visit family and friends during the holidays so we can spend very little time with them if we need to travel to and from their place on the same day to go to work the next morning. And there's also the petty reason of me not liking to bike to and from work in the December darkness. I'm already looking forward to the Christmas holidays! I'm off between 22 December and 1 Jan and I only have to take 3 days off. I'm going to spend that time with my family and partner, in my own home, cooking and eating nice food and drinking hot chocolate in our pyamas next to the Christmas tree.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Rowellen on November 10, 2017, 06:22:14 AM
Send good thoughts please....

Good luck.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: rab-bit on November 10, 2017, 07:05:57 AM
Sometimes the epic part is NOT throwing a fit and quitting. I am very proud of the fact that I haven't decked my manager yet. That self control is entirely due to FU money (it's better for me long term right now to stay where I am while job searching).

I like this. The power of FU money is the freedom to make the choices that benefit you the most. Sometimes that means putting up with a little crap to accomplish a larger goal, and sometimes it means flipping off your boss as you walk out the door.

Best of luck on your 2nd interview!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: scottish on November 10, 2017, 05:13:31 PM
Interesting, I haven't seen trolls working in teams before.   Teambuilding, you say?
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Blindsquirrel on November 11, 2017, 05:20:57 AM
   Here is a short one that will warm your heart. Longtime friend and former coworker works at megacorp. He works from home in IT but in the bizarro world of LIMS systems for pharmaceutical company. Supports a dozen or so sites around the world and is sharp as a tack, easily 3-4x the productivity of the average Joe. He makes very good 6 figure income, bonus, LTI in a LCOL area. He is 49, paid off house, completely FI and a single part time dad.
His boss dumps a metric ass load of work on him and she laughs about it. The laughing part was an error.
He says, "you know, I think I am going to just retire or go part time. I really am working too many hours now and this ass load of work you laugh about is really not funny.  I might be convinced to work a maximum of 20 hours a week with no travel, no stupid meetings, and no overtime. And I mean no overtime!"  She freaks out and is flying in next week to talk about it. My guess is he will tell her he is done and she can take her ass load of work to some other donkey or he will consult at $250-300 an hour when he feels like it. I asked him if he uses a sling to support his enormous balls. :) details to follow.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Trifle on November 11, 2017, 05:48:47 AM
   Here is a short one that will warm your heart. Longtime friend and former coworker works at megacorp. He works from home in IT but in the bizarro world of LIMS systems for pharmaceutical company. Supports a dozen or so sites around the world and is sharp as a tack, easily 3-4x the productivity of the average Joe. He makes very good 6 figure income, bonus, LTI in a LCOL area. He is 49, paid off house, completely FI and a single part time dad.
His boss dumps a metric ass load of work on him and she laughs about it. The laughing part was an error.
He says, "you know, I think I am going to just retire or go part time. I really am working too many hours now and this ass load of work you laugh about is really not funny.  I might be convinced to work a maximum of 20 hours a week with no travel, no stupid meetings, and no overtime. And I mean no overtime!"  She freaks out and is flying in next week to talk about it. My guess is he will tell her he is done and she can take her ass load of work to some other donkey or he will consult at $250-300 an hour when he feels like it. I asked him if he uses a sling to support his enormous balls. :) details to follow.

Love this!!  Thanks!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Bicycle_B on November 11, 2017, 06:20:33 AM
   Here is a short one that will warm your heart. Longtime friend and former coworker works at megacorp. He works from home in IT but in the bizarro world of LIMS systems for pharmaceutical company. Supports a dozen or so sites around the world and is sharp as a tack, easily 3-4x the productivity of the average Joe. He makes very good 6 figure income, bonus, LTI in a LCOL area. He is 49, paid off house, completely FI and a single part time dad.
His boss dumps a metric ass load of work on him and she laughs about it. The laughing part was an error.
He says, "you know, I think I am going to just retire or go part time. I really am working too many hours now and this ass load of work you laugh about is really not funny.  I might be convinced to work a maximum of 20 hours a week with no travel, no stupid meetings, and no overtime. And I mean no overtime!"  She freaks out and is flying in next week to talk about it. My guess is he will tell her he is done and she can take her ass load of work to some other donkey or he will consult at $250-300 an hour when he feels like it. I asked him if he uses a sling to support his enormous balls. :) details to follow.

Today in Missing The Headline:  What is LTI?
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Daisy on November 11, 2017, 10:53:59 AM
   Here is a short one that will warm your heart. Longtime friend and former coworker works at megacorp. He works from home in IT but in the bizarro world of LIMS systems for pharmaceutical company. Supports a dozen or so sites around the world and is sharp as a tack, easily 3-4x the productivity of the average Joe. He makes very good 6 figure income, bonus, LTI in a LCOL area. He is 49, paid off house, completely FI and a single part time dad.
His boss dumps a metric ass load of work on him and she laughs about it. The laughing part was an error.
He says, "you know, I think I am going to just retire or go part time. I really am working too many hours now and this ass load of work you laugh about is really not funny.  I might be convinced to work a maximum of 20 hours a week with no travel, no stupid meetings, and no overtime. And I mean no overtime!"  She freaks out and is flying in next week to talk about it. My guess is he will tell her he is done and she can take her ass load of work to some other donkey or he will consult at $250-300 an hour when he feels like it. I asked him if he uses a sling to support his enormous balls. :) details to follow.

This is going to be gooood...let us know what happens!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: RecoveringCarClown on November 11, 2017, 11:11:58 AM
   Here is a short one that will warm your heart. Longtime friend and former coworker works at megacorp. He works from home in IT but in the bizarro world of LIMS systems for pharmaceutical company. Supports a dozen or so sites around the world and is sharp as a tack, easily 3-4x the productivity of the average Joe. He makes very good 6 figure income, bonus, LTI in a LCOL area. He is 49, paid off house, completely FI and a single part time dad.
His boss dumps a metric ass load of work on him and she laughs about it. The laughing part was an error.
He says, "you know, I think I am going to just retire or go part time. I really am working too many hours now and this ass load of work you laugh about is really not funny.  I might be convinced to work a maximum of 20 hours a week with no travel, no stupid meetings, and no overtime. And I mean no overtime!"  She freaks out and is flying in next week to talk about it. My guess is he will tell her he is done and she can take her ass load of work to some other donkey or he will consult at $250-300 an hour when he feels like it. I asked him if he uses a sling to support his enormous balls. :) details to follow.

Today in Missing The Headline:  What is LTI?


Long Term Incentive plan is my guess but often called LTIP.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Blindsquirrel on November 12, 2017, 09:15:42 AM
   Yes, LTI= Long term incentive, generally a stock grant that vests in 3-5 years. The ones he gets are around 15-20 k every year and they always vest in 3 years, so in theory whenever you walk out you are leaving 45-60k on the table. 100% sure that my friend "C" does not give a rats rear about that. He is the kind of guy who once he makes a decision it is about impossible to change his mind and he does not dither around for even a minute or two. Spoke to him last night and he is pretty much going to politely tell her he is done working fulltime at the end of the year at the very latest and would be willing to work 20 hrs a week at the absolute most for awhile.  ( I am also 100% sure if she gives him any crap or tries again to deposit the previously mentioned ass load of work in his lap, that will result in his becoming quite a bit more definitive in his discussion  and handing in his badge, and computer, etc on the spot.). He said that he is going to have the company paid for HD monitors, etc in his car when he goes to the meeting so if he just quits, he will not have to make another trip to the Megacorp site 20 minutes from his house. Ever! I told him I would pay good money to be a fly on the wall for that meeting. He definitely has an FU size stash/nice paid off house/car/truck/boat/big chunk of land for hunting/200k in college fund for his kid/low overhead lifestyle and no debts at all.  He is also the kind of guy who would actually say "FU".  C is not a jerk and is unfailingly polite in 99.99% of situations. Kind of thinking this may well be the 0.01% situation though.  Will let you know what happens! :)
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: sol on November 12, 2017, 10:21:36 AM
Statistics? More men than women in Tech.

Statistically speaking, men supported Trump and women didn't, so I think it's more likely that the person who shut down Trump's twitter feed for 11 minutes was female.  And Hispanic.  And queer.  And an overweight immigrant veteran small business owner with a belief in democracy and civil liberties.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Paul der Krake on November 12, 2017, 12:57:07 PM
Statistics? More men than women in Tech.

Statistically speaking, men supported Trump and women didn't, so I think it's more likely that the person who shut down Trump's twitter feed for 11 minutes was female.  And Hispanic.  And queer.  And an overweight immigrant veteran small business owner with a belief in democracy and civil liberties.
Haven't you heard? Tech companies only hire white and Asian non-citizen liberal males between the ages of 22 and 36. It's built into the hiring practices to oppress everyone else.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Sibley on November 13, 2017, 01:50:40 PM
Update: I've been told I'm getting an offer from the 2nd choice company. We will see what it looks like. No word back from the flaky recruiter, so I assume that's off the table. I do like them, so assuming I like the offer and we can make the start date work out, I'll accept.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: rab-bit on November 13, 2017, 04:01:38 PM
Congrats!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: radram on November 13, 2017, 04:12:58 PM
Update: I've been told I'm getting an offer from the 2nd choice company. We will see what it looks like. No word back from the flaky recruiter, so I assume that's off the table. I do like them, so assuming I like the offer and we can make the start date work out, I'll accept.
YES!!!! Congrats.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Zamboni on November 14, 2017, 06:40:13 AM
Update: I've been told I'm getting an offer from the 2nd choice company. We will see what it looks like. No word back from the flaky recruiter, so I assume that's off the table. I do like them, so assuming I like the offer and we can make the start date work out, I'll accept.

Well done, good job not letting your computer become airborne while you wait, and good luck in the new job!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Lews Therin on November 14, 2017, 08:26:29 AM
Statistics? More men than women in Tech.

Statistically speaking, men supported Trump and women didn't, so I think it's more likely that the person who shut down Trump's twitter feed for 11 minutes was female.  And Hispanic.  And queer.  And an overweight immigrant veteran small business owner with a belief in democracy and civil liberties.

Well... That statement has been making me laugh over and over. Though have we ruled out Clinton's personal emails and the FBI?
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: talltexan on November 16, 2017, 02:22:07 PM
Statistics? More men than women in Tech.

Statistically speaking, men supported Trump and women didn't, so I think it's more likely that the person who shut down Trump's twitter feed for 11 minutes was female.  And Hispanic.  And queer.  And an overweight immigrant veteran small business owner with a belief in democracy and civil liberties.

Well... That statement has been making me laugh over and over. Though have we ruled out Clinton's personal emails and the FBI?

Are we sure the Potus account was specifically targetted? Is it possible that someone threw a switch deactivating all accounts that start with a "P" because of an ex-romantic partner or something, and didn't even realize it would get the one account everyone watches?
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Bicycle_B on November 16, 2017, 04:12:42 PM
Statistics? More men than women in Tech.

Statistically speaking, men supported Trump and women didn't, so I think it's more likely that the person who shut down Trump's twitter feed for 11 minutes was female.  And Hispanic.  And queer.  And an overweight immigrant veteran small business owner with a belief in democracy and civil liberties.

Well... That statement has been making me laugh over and over. Though have we ruled out Clinton's personal emails and the FBI?

Are we sure the Potus account was specifically targetted? Is it possible that someone threw a switch deactivating all accounts that start with a "P" because of an ex-romantic partner or something, and didn't even realize it would get the one account everyone watches?

I'm pretty sure we're not sure, since there's only one case and we're applying population-level statistical level generalizations plus Sol-level humor. 

Personally I'm intrigued by the statistical "reasoning" but suspect the reasoning given is incorrect.  I wish I knew Bayesian analysis better and could apply it somehow before the actual identity of the person emerges.  More primitively, my first take is to apply case rates (actual numbers out of the air, better research welcome):

80% male/female ratio in tech
60% males vote Trump, 60% women Clinton
Resultant tech voters: 48% male for Trump, 32% male for Clinton, 8% female for Trump, 12% female for Clinton.
Combined result:  Of 44% for Clinton, 32 male to 12 female, giving 8 to 3 odds that the Twitter quitter is male. 

Obviously a less gender rigid analysis would be better.  Nonetheless the heavy skew toward men in tech appears to predominate, making it more likely that the Twitter quitter is male.

Thoughts?
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: tipster350 on November 16, 2017, 04:36:08 PM
Statistics? More men than women in Tech.

Statistically speaking, men supported Trump and women didn't, so I think it's more likely that the person who shut down Trump's twitter feed for 11 minutes was female.  And Hispanic.  And queer.  And an overweight immigrant veteran small business owner with a belief in democracy and civil liberties.

Well... That statement has been making me laugh over and over. Though have we ruled out Clinton's personal emails and the FBI?

Are we sure the Potus account was specifically targetted? Is it possible that someone threw a switch deactivating all accounts that start with a "P" because of an ex-romantic partner or something, and didn't even realize it would get the one account everyone watches?

I'm pretty sure we're not sure, since there's only one case and we're applying population-level statistical level generalizations plus Sol-level humor. 

Personally I'm intrigued by the statistical "reasoning" but suspect the reasoning given is incorrect.  I wish I knew Bayesian analysis better and could apply it somehow before the actual identity of the person emerges.  More primitively, my first take is to apply case rates (actual numbers out of the air, better research welcome):

80% male/female ratio in tech
60% males vote Trump, 60% women Clinton
Resultant tech voters: 48% male for Trump, 32% male for Clinton, 8% female for Trump, 12% female for Clinton.
Combined result:  Of 44% for Clinton, 32 male to 12 female, giving 8 to 3 odds that the Twitter quitter is male. 

Obviously a less gender rigid analysis would be better.  Nonetheless the heavy skew toward men in tech appears to predominate, making it more likely that the Twitter quitter is male.

Thoughts?


Thoughts? Please take that crap elsewhere. This thread is about Epic FU money stories related to jobs. It has been awesome. You're ruining the vibe.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Taran Wanderer on November 16, 2017, 08:50:07 PM
Thoughts? Please take that crap elsewhere. This thread is about Epic FU money stories related to jobs. It has been awesome. You're ruining the vibe.

Yes.  Yes, yes, yes, yes, YES.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Luckyvik on November 16, 2017, 11:40:38 PM
Thoughts? Please take that crap elsewhere. This thread is about Epic FU money stories related to jobs. It has been awesome. You're ruining the vibe.

Yes.  Yes, yes, yes, yes, YES.
Yep back to FU Money Stories please.

I might have one coming up, I applied for an extra weeks leave for the week before Christmas and I was told that this was approved but may be subject to change due to us being a bit short staffed. If they try and cancel my leave I will say ‘sorry, I can’t cancel it, I have already made plans’  I’ll keep you posted if that happens.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Playing with Fire UK on November 17, 2017, 12:57:10 AM
I might have one coming up, I applied for an extra weeks leave for the week before Christmas and I was told that this was approved but may be subject to change due to us being a bit short staffed. If they try and cancel my leave I will say ‘sorry, I can’t cancel it, I have already made plans’  I’ll keep you posted if that happens.

That sounds like an odd definition of "approved". Are they a chaotic place to work generally?
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Luckyvik on November 17, 2017, 01:52:34 AM
I might have one coming up, I applied for an extra weeks leave for the week before Christmas and I was told that this was approved but may be subject to change due to us being a bit short staffed. If they try and cancel my leave I will say ‘sorry, I can’t cancel it, I have already made plans’  I’ll keep you posted if that happens.

That sounds like an odd definition of "approved". Are they a chaotic place to work generally?
Not generally but there has been a fairly recent change of management and there is some pressure to get more done with less. We will see what happens, it’s hard to push back while trying to put out a ‘keen’ vibe (to get promoted and earn more $$$) and when everyone else seems to think it’s the norm to work an extra hour or two a day.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Playing with Fire UK on November 17, 2017, 02:04:18 AM
Not generally but there has been a fairly recent change of management and there is some pressure to get more done with less. We will see what happens, it’s hard to push back while trying to put out a ‘keen’ vibe (to get promoted and earn more $$$) and when everyone else seems to think it’s the norm to work an extra hour or two a day.

Sounds like something is going to be tugging on your FU money whether it is this or the next "enhancement".

If everyone else thinks it, it probably is the norm for your workplace. Crap norm though.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Enigma on November 17, 2017, 03:50:03 AM
I never wanted a job in Washington DC but I took a gov job there that I ended up hating.  Then I got complacent after 2 years.  No one stateside offered near as much as I made there.  At the end of Aug/Sep I was offered a job overseas that I used to do years ago.  One that I enjoyed doing.  If I didn't have my savings and wasn't already FI then I wouldn't have been able to move very quickly.

I ended up selling my new car with a $4k loss.  Had to pay the difference to the bank...  Also had to get rid of my apartment that had a few thousand dollars in fees to break the lease early.

Moving quickly cost me about $10-$15k but I should be able to make it up quickly with my new position where rent is paid.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: radram on November 17, 2017, 07:39:48 AM
I never wanted a job in Washington DC but I took a gov job there that I ended up hating.  Then I got complacent after 2 years.  No one stateside offered near as much as I made there.  At the end of Aug/Sep I was offered a job overseas that I used to do years ago.  One that I enjoyed doing.  If I didn't have my savings and wasn't already FI then I wouldn't have been able to move very quickly.

I ended up selling my new car with a $4k loss.  Had to pay the difference to the bank...  Also had to get rid of my apartment that had a few thousand dollars in fees to break the lease early.

Moving quickly cost me about $10-$15k but I should be able to make it up quickly with my new position where rent is paid.

Great and Epic. Spending money for a better life. Can't think of a better use for $15k. Congratulations and enjoy your new life!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Greenback Reproduction Specialist on November 17, 2017, 08:37:25 AM
Enigma's story reminds me of a similar story of my own. I don't know if I consider mine epic, but having FU money rocks!

I was working a job, that I actually really enjoyed, but along came an opportunity to take a position that paid almost double per hour what I was making. The risk was that it was an open ended contract, with a possibility of termination on short notice if the project were to complete or get cancelled. It was a big opportunity to get to FIRE faster, and having enough FU money in place I was willing to take the risk. Now its been 2 years and I'm still in the open ended contract. At the moment it looks like the project I'm working on will continue for at least a few more years, paid off pretty well. Brought my projected FIRE date from 10yrs to 5yrs... Maybe even sooner, we shall see : )
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Loren Ver on November 17, 2017, 08:44:55 AM
Enigma's story reminds me of a similar story of my own. I don't know if I consider mine epic, but having FU money rocks!

I was working a job, that I actually really enjoyed, but along came an opportunity to take a position that paid almost double per hour what I was making. The risk was that it was an open ended contract, with a possibility of termination on short notice if the project were to complete or get cancelled. It was a big opportunity to get to FIRE faster, and having enough FU money in place I was willing to take the risk. Now its been 2 years and I'm still in the open ended contract. At the moment it looks like the project I'm working on will continue for at least a few more years, paid off pretty well. Brought my projected FIRE date from 10yrs to 5yrs... Maybe even sooner, we shall see : )


That would be awesome if you finished before the contract ended :D.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Sibley on November 17, 2017, 08:48:45 AM
Developments!
I've officially accepted the new position, pending background check (it's a bank). Plan to give notice in December.

I've got a coworker, let's call him Alex. Alex and I are the only 2 on our team with a particular subset of experience, and a lot of it too. We're both working on a project that no one else on the team is capable of doing (that subset of experience is needed). Another team used to do this project (it's an annual thing), but they didn't have capacity so my team took it over. This project is not negotiable, and is high profile. If it goes bad, the big boss will take a lot of heat.

Alex is leaving at the end of the month. I'll be giving notice a week or two after he leaves. This project will have to go back to the original team, and they don't have capacity to handle it.

Pivoting... I'm in charge of day to day admin on the software we use. The person who is my backup - is also looking for a new job.

Is it wrong that I'm enjoying the prospect of the havoc my leaving is going to cause, particularly the timing? This is better than using my FU money!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Greenback Reproduction Specialist on November 17, 2017, 08:51:56 AM
That would be awesome if you finished before the contract ended :D.

It sure would!

FIRE cant seem to happen fast enough ; )
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: okits on November 17, 2017, 01:14:11 PM
Is it wrong that I'm enjoying the prospect of the havoc my leaving is going to cause, particularly the timing? This is better than using my FU money!

If they have underpaid you, under-appreciated you, or treated you badly then no, I'm going to tell you it's not wrong.

Congratulations on the new job!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Livingthedream55 on November 17, 2017, 02:08:39 PM
Is it wrong that I'm enjoying the prospect of the havoc my leaving is going to cause, particularly the timing? This is better than using my FU money!

If they have underpaid you, under-appreciated you, or treated you badly then no, I'm going to tell you it's not wrong.

Congratulations on the new job!

+1  I once turned down a fabulous new job offer because I felt my leaving would be too disruptive to my (then) current job because of all of the transitions/people leaving. A year later, job I stayed with (out of loyalty) selected my department to be eliminated from the agency so I was laid off. Lesson learned!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: scottish on November 17, 2017, 04:05:16 PM
Is it wrong that I'm enjoying the prospect of the havoc my leaving is going to cause, particularly the timing? This is better than using my FU money!

If they have underpaid you, under-appreciated you, or treated you badly then no, I'm going to tell you it's not wrong.

Congratulations on the new job!

+1  I once turned down a fabulous new job offer because I felt my leaving would be too disruptive to my (then) current job because of all of the transitions/people leaving. A year later, job I stayed with (out of loyalty) selected my department to be eliminated from the agency so I was laid off. Lesson learned!

You shouldn't gloat over their misfortune.    That can lead to a negative attitude which will slow you down.  You won't be around to see it actually happen,   but if you were you would see that it's not happy time for anyone involved.

You should still leave of course.    Congrats on the new job!

Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Sibley on November 17, 2017, 06:30:28 PM
Is it wrong that I'm enjoying the prospect of the havoc my leaving is going to cause, particularly the timing? This is better than using my FU money!

If they have underpaid you, under-appreciated you, or treated you badly then no, I'm going to tell you it's not wrong.

Congratulations on the new job!

+1  I once turned down a fabulous new job offer because I felt my leaving would be too disruptive to my (then) current job because of all of the transitions/people leaving. A year later, job I stayed with (out of loyalty) selected my department to be eliminated from the agency so I was laid off. Lesson learned!

You shouldn't gloat over their misfortune.    That can lead to a negative attitude which will slow you down.  You won't be around to see it actually happen,   but if you were you would see that it's not happy time for anyone involved.

You should still leave of course.    Congrats on the new job!

I don't think I'm gloating, but point taken. I will miss most of my coworkers, and I really hope that management has a wake up call about this one manager who's driving all the experienced people out (I'll make #4 that I know of). She's good with very inexperienced staff, but not anyone who knows what they're doing.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Tyson on November 17, 2017, 08:58:55 PM
You shouldn't gloat over their misfortune.    That can lead to a negative attitude which will slow you down.  You won't be around to see it actually happen,   but if you were you would see that it's not happy time for anyone involved.

You should still leave of course.    Congrats on the new job!

Oh I think gloating is totally fine for a few days.  Then yeah, move forward - onwards and upwards!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Freedomin5 on November 18, 2017, 12:13:13 AM
You shouldn't gloat over their misfortune.    That can lead to a negative attitude which will slow you down.  You won't be around to see it actually happen,   but if you were you would see that it's not happy time for anyone involved.

You should still leave of course.    Congrats on the new job!

Oh I think gloating is totally fine for a few days.  Then yeah, move forward - onwards and upwards!

I agree. Whenever you celebrate something, there will always be someone telling you you're [fill in negative emotion/trait/characteristic/behavior] and then tell you you shouldn't do it. Go ahead and be happy, celebrate, and move forward! :)
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Rowellen on November 18, 2017, 03:56:55 AM
Developments!
I've officially accepted the new position, pending background check (it's a bank). Plan to give notice in December.

I've got a coworker, let's call him Alex. Alex and I are the only 2 on our team with a particular subset of experience, and a lot of it too. We're both working on a project that no one else on the team is capable of doing (that subset of experience is needed). Another team used to do this project (it's an annual thing), but they didn't have capacity so my team took it over. This project is not negotiable, and is high profile. If it goes bad, the big boss will take a lot of heat.

Alex is leaving at the end of the month. I'll be giving notice a week or two after he leaves. This project will have to go back to the original team, and they don't have capacity to handle it.

Pivoting... I'm in charge of day to day admin on the software we use. The person who is my backup - is also looking for a new job.

Is it wrong that I'm enjoying the prospect of the havoc my leaving is going to cause, particularly the timing? This is better than using my FU money!

That's awesome. I don't think it's wrong at all. If anything it should show the higher ups that something is seriously wrong in your division. Something that is not you.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Enigma on November 22, 2017, 03:42:27 AM
Developments!
I've officially accepted the new position, pending background check (it's a bank). Plan to give notice in December.

I've got a coworker, let's call him Alex. Alex and I are the only 2 on our team with a particular subset of experience, and a lot of it too. We're both working on a project that no one else on the team is capable of doing (that subset of experience is needed). Another team used to do this project (it's an annual thing), but they didn't have capacity so my team took it over. This project is not negotiable, and is high profile. If it goes bad, the big boss will take a lot of heat.

Alex is leaving at the end of the month. I'll be giving notice a week or two after he leaves. This project will have to go back to the original team, and they don't have capacity to handle it.

Pivoting... I'm in charge of day to day admin on the software we use. The person who is my backup - is also looking for a new job.

Is it wrong that I'm enjoying the prospect of the havoc my leaving is going to cause, particularly the timing? This is better than using my FU money!

It sounds like the company you are with has been the ones taking the gamble.  Either they were not paying well enough -or- they kept cutting people and tasking remaining individuals more.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Maenad on November 22, 2017, 05:21:45 AM
I have a sad lack-of-FU-money story. I ran into a coworker at a break area who's being denied a PTO request for the days between Xmas and NYE because she's "needed here". Her request was to fly home to Mexico to visit her elderly father and commemorate the anniversary of her mother's death. :-(

Happy ending of sorts to report - as it turns out, the co-worker had FU money, so she quit! Hopefully this will be a lesson to her managers that a little flexibility would have been better. (It was one day she was "needed"! She could have done that remotely!)
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: dandarc on November 22, 2017, 06:48:25 AM
I have a sad lack-of-FU-money story. I ran into a coworker at a break area who's being denied a PTO request for the days between Xmas and NYE because she's "needed here". Her request was to fly home to Mexico to visit her elderly father and commemorate the anniversary of her mother's death. :-(

Happy ending of sorts to report - as it turns out, the co-worker had FU money, so she quit! Hopefully this will be a lesson to her managers that a little flexibility would have been better. (It was one day she was "needed"! She could have done that remotely!)
Nice!  From "Sad" to "EPIC" in one update!  Good on your coworker - even with FU money, it can be hard to pull the trigger on that type of move. 
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: shelivesthedream on November 22, 2017, 06:54:10 AM
I have a sad lack-of-FU-money story. I ran into a coworker at a break area who's being denied a PTO request for the days between Xmas and NYE because she's "needed here". Her request was to fly home to Mexico to visit her elderly father and commemorate the anniversary of her mother's death. :-(

Happy ending of sorts to report - as it turns out, the co-worker had FU money, so she quit! Hopefully this will be a lesson to her managers that a little flexibility would have been better. (It was one day she was "needed"! She could have done that remotely!)

Brilliant news!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: RyanAtTanagra on November 22, 2017, 10:29:54 AM
I have a sad lack-of-FU-money story. I ran into a coworker at a break area who's being denied a PTO request for the days between Xmas and NYE because she's "needed here". Her request was to fly home to Mexico to visit her elderly father and commemorate the anniversary of her mother's death. :-(

Happy ending of sorts to report - as it turns out, the co-worker had FU money, so she quit! Hopefully this will be a lesson to her managers that a little flexibility would have been better. (It was one day she was "needed"! She could have done that remotely!)

Awesome!  I hope you had a chance to tell her bravo.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: AMandM on November 23, 2017, 07:09:33 AM
I don't think I'm gloating, but point taken. I will miss most of my coworkers, and I really hope that management has a wake up call about this one manager who's driving all the experienced people out (I'll make #4 that I know of). She's good with very inexperienced staff, but not anyone who knows what they're doing.

Can you (and Alex, and the other person you mentioned) point out this one manager to the higher-ups on your way out?  That might go some way toward helping the coworkers yo0u are leaving behind.
Congrats on the new job!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Sibley on November 23, 2017, 02:36:13 PM
I don't think I'm gloating, but point taken. I will miss most of my coworkers, and I really hope that management has a wake up call about this one manager who's driving all the experienced people out (I'll make #4 that I know of). She's good with very inexperienced staff, but not anyone who knows what they're doing.

Can you (and Alex, and the other person you mentioned) point out this one manager to the higher-ups on your way out?  That might go some way toward helping the coworkers yo0u are leaving behind.
Congrats on the new job!

Alex chose not to say anything. However, I'm well known for being honest and saying things you don't necessarily like to hear. I do plan to (professionally) explain why I'm leaving. I'm expecting to get a counteroffer - they are NOT going to like losing me. But that means that I will get a nice, private interview with the #1 guy in the dept, and possibly with his boss (so #0?).

I passed background much faster than I expected, and we set a start date. I'll start 12/18, so am giving 2 weeks notice Monday. For those of you looking at a calendar, I'm taking a week between jobs.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: rantk81 on November 24, 2017, 06:55:52 AM
A FU story might be brewing with me....  My employer of over 13 years is changing their medical plan network for 2018, to a very restrictive network with only a small hand-full of in-network providers in Chicago. So restrictive that there isn't even a single MRI provider in-network in the entire city of Chicago, and a very minimal number of in-network facilities (a couple of hospitals, only one urgent care center within the whole city of Chicago.) Pathetic for a large employer of a skilled/professional workforce.  Compounding the problem is, they removed ANY out-of-network coverage too. Not even some astoundingly-high-deductible plan. Simply no out of network coverage.

I compared the network of doctors on the employee plan with the network of doctors on the most inexpensive healthcare.gov exchange plan for 2018, and the plan on the exchange had about 3x of the network facilities in Chicago.

The kicker is, it is a global company with facilities all over the country and the world, but our office in Chicago is the only one that is subject to such a restrictive health care network. Employees in other offices of the country are retaining their same nation-wide and much larger network of providers in their medical plans.  Yet our payroll premiums are the same.

I barely use the medical insurance and I am generally pretty healthy. However, I like having a medical plan that assures me that I can get care if I need it. The plan offered by my employer (and exclusively to their Chicago employees) does not reassure me that I would be able to receive quality care if I need it.

It's probably not easy to change jobs around the holidays... but a lot of companies are working through their budgets for 2018, so probably will be looking to move on in the new year.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: WhiteTrashCash on November 24, 2017, 07:17:12 AM
A FU story might be brewing with me....  My employer of over 13 years is changing their medical plan network for 2018, to a very restrictive network with only a small hand-full of in-network providers in Chicago. So restrictive that there isn't even a single MRI provider in-network in the entire city of Chicago, and a very minimal number of in-network facilities (a couple of hospitals, only one urgent care center within the whole city of Chicago.) Pathetic for a large employer of a skilled/professional workforce.  Compounding the problem is, they removed ANY out-of-network coverage too. Not even some astoundingly-high-deductible plan. Simply no out of network coverage.

I compared the network of doctors on the employee plan with the network of doctors on the most inexpensive healthcare.gov exchange plan for 2018, and the plan on the exchange had about 3x of the network facilities in Chicago.

The kicker is, it is a global company with facilities all over the country and the world, but our office in Chicago is the only one that is subject to such a restrictive health care network. Employees in other offices of the country are retaining their same nation-wide and much larger network of providers in their medical plans.  Yet our payroll premiums are the same.

I barely use the medical insurance and I am generally pretty healthy. However, I like having a medical plan that assures me that I can get care if I need it. The plan offered by my employer (and exclusively to their Chicago employees) does not reassure me that I would be able to receive quality care if I need it.

It's probably not easy to change jobs around the holidays... but a lot of companies are working through their budgets for 2018, so probably will be looking to move on in the new year.

Yeah, it sounds like it's time to move on while in your position of strength. The economy is doing well enough right now that it's won't be hard to find another job, especially if you are highly skilled. When it comes down to it, everyone is a business and when employers don't offer an appropriate level of compensation, it's time to take your business elsewhere. Just my two cents, anyway.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: AlanStache on November 24, 2017, 09:20:20 AM
A FU story might be brewing with me....  My employer of over 13 years is changing their medical plan network for 2018, to a very restrictive network with only a small hand-full of in-network providers in Chicago. So restrictive that there isn't even a single MRI provider in-network in the entire city of Chicago, and a very minimal number of in-network facilities (a couple of hospitals, only one urgent care center within the whole city of Chicago.) Pathetic for a large employer of a skilled/professional workforce.  Compounding the problem is, they removed ANY out-of-network coverage too. Not even some astoundingly-high-deductible plan. Simply no out of network coverage.

I compared the network of doctors on the employee plan with the network of doctors on the most inexpensive healthcare.gov exchange plan for 2018, and the plan on the exchange had about 3x of the network facilities in Chicago.

The kicker is, it is a global company with facilities all over the country and the world, but our office in Chicago is the only one that is subject to such a restrictive health care network. Employees in other offices of the country are retaining their same nation-wide and much larger network of providers in their medical plans.  Yet our payroll premiums are the same.

I barely use the medical insurance and I am generally pretty healthy. However, I like having a medical plan that assures me that I can get care if I need it. The plan offered by my employer (and exclusively to their Chicago employees) does not reassure me that I would be able to receive quality care if I need it.

It's probably not easy to change jobs around the holidays... but a lot of companies are working through their budgets for 2018, so probably will be looking to move on in the new year.

Are there local HR people who are aware of this and have some power over it?  Could this have just been some dumb mistake by people in Charlotte NC who did not see the effect in Chicago and will fix it once it is pointed out to them?  Or it could be part of a larger penny-pinching initiative that will have other dumb repercussions and you are right to be moving on.  You dont sound overly happy with your current employer otherwise. 

Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Daisy on November 24, 2017, 11:04:26 AM
A FU story might be brewing with me....  My employer of over 13 years is changing their medical plan network for 2018, to a very restrictive network with only a small hand-full of in-network providers in Chicago. So restrictive that there isn't even a single MRI provider in-network in the entire city of Chicago, and a very minimal number of in-network facilities (a couple of hospitals, only one urgent care center within the whole city of Chicago.) Pathetic for a large employer of a skilled/professional workforce.  Compounding the problem is, they removed ANY out-of-network coverage too. Not even some astoundingly-high-deductible plan. Simply no out of network coverage.

I compared the network of doctors on the employee plan with the network of doctors on the most inexpensive healthcare.gov exchange plan for 2018, and the plan on the exchange had about 3x of the network facilities in Chicago.

The kicker is, it is a global company with facilities all over the country and the world, but our office in Chicago is the only one that is subject to such a restrictive health care network. Employees in other offices of the country are retaining their same nation-wide and much larger network of providers in their medical plans.  Yet our payroll premiums are the same.

I barely use the medical insurance and I am generally pretty healthy. However, I like having a medical plan that assures me that I can get care if I need it. The plan offered by my employer (and exclusively to their Chicago employees) does not reassure me that I would be able to receive quality care if I need it.

It's probably not easy to change jobs around the holidays... but a lot of companies are working through their budgets for 2018, so probably will be looking to move on in the new year.

I just FIREd and ended up going with Liberty Health Share. My coverage starts in December, so I am not sure how the operational stuff with it will go. One of the things I like is that there is no network, you go to whatever provider you want and they negotiate with them. Like I said, I'm not sure how this will work in practice. You also have to agree with their terms, which some people have an issue with. They are a Christian based health sharing group.

If you go this route, then you can stay with your current employer and get your health coverage outside ofyour employer.

Look into it. If you are interested, PM me. They also provide a referral bonus of $100 for any member that refers someone.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Daisy on November 24, 2017, 02:08:47 PM
Great story, Finances With Purpose!

 At Thanksgiving dinner, I told my visiting nieces about my "sabbatical" and they were very interested. I mentioned FU money and they both giggled. I asked if they had heard about it before and they said no, but they instantly understood what it was and what it was useful for.

One just graduated college and is not too happy with her first job and the other is a senior in college. They both like to be frugal, so I hope I can set them on a good course for their life with my advice and FU money stories.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Secretly Saving on November 24, 2017, 02:51:44 PM


I have witnessed, first-hand, what toxic jobs can do to a person's health, well-being, and relationships.  Life's too short.

I spent my 20s learning that the courageous choice is the right one - to do the right thing even when it seems like a financial (emotional, relational, or general) disaster.  I never look back from those choices.  As one wise relative put it, "it's the things I didn't do that I regret."  FU money doesn't create character - it more so magnifies whatever character is present - but it empowers you to make good choices by making those choices cheaper and easier to make.  The hardest thing to do - that nags at you - is usually the one thing you need to do. 

My history and FU money - and especially God - had put me in a position of strength: I was then offered jobs based upon reputation, which made finding new work easy.  In fact, it was too easy: I first had to turn down things that paid well or had some attractiveness, but probably had similar demands.  (Again, thanks to the FU funds for making it easier.)  I love where I went next - my life is so much better - and I have never looked back.  Better hours, better pay per hour, better benefits, better health care, far better work, and far less stress.  Life's too short.

These three ideas/paragraphs really resonated with me.  I used FU money to put in my resignation last week.  I'm not willing to put up with toxic people nor will I let my family suffer (based on the idea that life is too short). I'm willing to make the difficult, but courageous choice (including standing up for those that can't).  Interestingly I have already been offered the next (and better) job which came so easily based on reputation!

I'm looking forward to walking away from one particular toxic coworker with a huge smile on my face.  I'm also looking forward to making a difference at a new job, while having more balance for my family. Thank you FU money!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: ramblez on November 24, 2017, 07:19:46 PM
I wish I could share half the things I would like to here.  And some others' stories, too.  But alas, anonymity and all that.

However, I'll share some of my alternative uses of FU money (along the theme of this thread).  To me, FU money is helpful for self-respect - it empowers you to respect yourself, your family, and your other priorities, too.  On to the story part. 

At the time, I had a nice-sized emergency fund and realized I could live on very little.  I wasn't retired yet, and still am not (or even close), but I also realized that I didn't need to put up with the same level of nonsense I would back when I desperately needed a job (due to debt), either.  Life is short -- too short for some kinds of awfulness -- as I have learned through some hard lessons over the years.

So, my FU Money empowered me to start saying "no" to nonsense.  We need you to work through your holiday (on a project we have known was coming for months or weeks but didn't care enough to prepare for)?  No.  Move my wedding to work on a project that I asked not to be on because the deadlines were during my honeymoon?  No.  (With that one, I said I didn't care if I had a job or not when I came back - I would be gone, and they could figure it out.  They did.  And lo, I still had a job - with as much job security as ever, if not more, because they knew they needed me.)  Do something unethical, even though nobody would ever know it but me?  No.  Put my name on something that is absolutely awful and demonstrably wrong, just to look like we're doing something about a problem?  No.  Find someone else. 

The result: managers began internalizing the costs of their own failures - to plan, to allocate, and to care about people.  The workplace improved some.  I stopped hating my job every day, worrying about the next bomb that would drop.  I simply said no to bombs, and started making people respect some personal boundaries.  I don't check work email at 2PM on a Sunday or stay up all night for the job anymore, and that's just how it is.

After a while, the problem manager labeled me "Mr. No."  I just smiled.  This was ironic, as I worked hard, still put up with a good deal of the typical nonsense, and they knew this - which is why I kept getting the really tough last-minute things.  However, my own boss gained tremendous respect for me as a result, and began saying no more as well.   

Soon, the worst nonsense work began going elsewhere.  Management learned that I would not put up with it.  Eventually, I left the job anyway, even with nothing even lined up (no bridge-burning epic FU story about it; I kept it very professional, even though I told them why I left).  After I left, my former colleagues called me to ask if I could help them strategize about obtaining new positions or if I could hire them now.  Some simply burned out and quit.  Before long, all but a few were gone.  My old boss, the good one, called and offered to hire me pretty much anytime, anywhere.  Others realized that I wasn't bankrupt and didn't seem too concerned, so they asked for help with finances.  Sadly, I cannot imagine that it's better now for the few who remained.  As former colleagues left, they opened up more, and I learned that (as I suspected) it was even worse than I knew.  Most who stayed had no good options. 

I have witnessed, first-hand, what toxic jobs can do to a person's health, well-being, and relationships.  Life's too short. 

I spent my 20s learning that the courageous choice is the right one - to do the right thing even when it seems like a financial (emotional, relational, or general) disaster.  I never look back from those choices.  As one wise relative put it, "it's the things I didn't do that I regret."  FU money doesn't create character - it more so magnifies whatever character is present - but it empowers you to make good choices by making those choices cheaper and easier to make.  The hardest thing to do - that nags at you - is usually the one thing you need to do.  Over the years, those choices in my life have paid far more dividends than the rest, and continue doing so to this day.  (One of them led me into a relationship with my wife, but that's another story for another blog post . . .) 

And wouldn't you know: the day after I left the job, God sent me a check in the mail worth a couple of months' salary, totally unexpected.  I expected, someday, a check for maybe $100.  Nothing like that ever happened before in my life, and nothing like that has ever happened since.  I learned a lot about not worrying, faith, and trust.  Now I take each day's problems as they come, rather than worrying how the next year will turn out.

Meanwhile, that old employer never could figure out why other people wouldn't go work there, accept their offers, and so on.  I did not dish on them, as you may suspect: instead, I just never recommend them.  I'm sure someone else put the word out, and probably not as diplomatically as I would have. 

My history and FU money - and especially God - had put me in a position of strength: I was then offered jobs based upon reputation, which made finding new work easy.  In fact, it was too easy: I first had to turn down things that paid well or had some attractiveness, but probably had similar demands.  (Again, thanks to the FU funds for making it easier.)  I love where I went next - my life is so much better - and I have never looked back.  Better hours, better pay per hour, better benefits, better health care, far better work, and far less stress.  Life's too short.

“God” sent you a cheque?  Please elaborate on that.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: G-dog on November 24, 2017, 07:53:50 PM
A FU story might be brewing with me....  My employer of over 13 years is changing their medical plan network for 2018, to a very restrictive network with only a small hand-full of in-network providers in Chicago. So restrictive that there isn't even a single MRI provider in-network in the entire city of Chicago, and a very minimal number of in-network facilities (a couple of hospitals, only one urgent care center within the whole city of Chicago.) Pathetic for a large employer of a skilled/professional workforce.  Compounding the problem is, they removed ANY out-of-network coverage too. Not even some astoundingly-high-deductible plan. Simply no out of network coverage.

I compared the network of doctors on the employee plan with the network of doctors on the most inexpensive healthcare.gov exchange plan for 2018, and the plan on the exchange had about 3x of the network facilities in Chicago.

The kicker is, it is a global company with facilities all over the country and the world, but our office in Chicago is the only one that is subject to such a restrictive health care network. Employees in other offices of the country are retaining their same nation-wide and much larger network of providers in their medical plans.  Yet our payroll premiums are the same.

I barely use the medical insurance and I am generally pretty healthy. However, I like having a medical plan that assures me that I can get care if I need it. The plan offered by my employer (and exclusively to their Chicago employees) does not reassure me that I would be able to receive quality care if I need it.

It's probably not easy to change jobs around the holidays... but a lot of companies are working through their budgets for 2018, so probably will be looking to move on in the new year.

Could this be a way to force enough people out of the Chicago office so they can shut it down entirely?

I would complain to HR, at any rate.  Might be that some low level HR person made a mistake when choosing the local plan.  Or not.   Either way, it doesn't hurt to ask, especially if you might be leaving anyway.

Lhamo’s first question was my gut reaction. Let you all self-select out of the organization.  It is very weird that this is happening at only one site.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: WhiteTrashCash on November 25, 2017, 06:43:14 AM

“God” sent you a cheque?  Please elaborate on that.

The day after I decided to go, I finally prayed, quit worrying, and then I received a call.  Instead of a $100 check, as we had expected, we received one for far, far more.  We knew we'd be getting a tiny amount (from a settlement) but figured it was trivial.  Turned out to be not as trivial.  Timing couldn't have been better.  Our needs were provided for - thankfully, without having dipping into our emergency fund at all.  (As it happened, we wouldn't have needed the check either - we just didn't know that for a while after.)

It's always a nice moment when you realize that God has stepped in for a second to help out. :-)
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: paddedhat on November 26, 2017, 05:35:48 PM
I've always maintained a position that life is too short to waste it surrounded by toxic people. I hoped that it was rubbing off on our children, but you never know until they are faced with difficulty. My oldest boy was still in his early-teens when he got a job at a local Subway shop. He was a few weeks in, when he started telling us that the owner was a bit crazy, and obsessed with control and making sure that here minimum wage peons were giving her 110% at all times. He has always been a real hard worker, but one day his shift manager pulled him into a corner of the store for a talk. He asked why she wanted to talk in such a strange spot, and she made a paranoid comment about being "watched". He was a bit surprised by that claim, since there were no cameras anywhere. Shortly after, he was alone in the dining area, and leaning on a table for a moment, after scrubbing everything in the room to operating room standards. He heard the phone ring, then got called into the office. The manager told him that he couldn't be leaning on a table. He asked how she would possibly know that? since she couldn't see him from the office, and he is the only other person in the building? She then confessed that the place was loaded with hidden cameras, and the owner spent her time away from the store staring at the monitor in her home, micromanaging and calling to scream about who had spent more than a few seconds not working, or was doing something that deviated from exactly how she wanted it done. He told the manager that he was done, and called for us to come pick him up. I was really happy to see that he learned well. My wife OTOH, was of a much different mindset and had put up with some real abusive A-holes in some of her first jobs. She thought that he had made a big mistake. We agreed to disagree, and I congratulated him for doing the right thing.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: zolotiyeruki on November 26, 2017, 05:42:51 PM
I've always maintained a position that life is too short to waste it surrounded by toxic people. I hoped that it was rubbing off on our children, but you never know until they are faced with difficulty. My oldest boy was still in his early-teens when he got a job at a local Subway shop. He was a few weeks in, when he started telling us that the owner was a bit crazy, and obsessed with control and making sure that here minimum wage peons were giving her 110% at all times. He has always been a real hard worker, but one day his shift manager pulled him into a corner of the store for a talk. He asked why she wanted to talk in such a strange spot, and she made a paranoid comment about being "watched". He was a bit surprised by that claim, since there were no cameras anywhere. Shortly after, he was alone in the dining area, and leaning on a table for a moment, after scrubbing everything in the room to operating room standards. He heard the phone ring, then got called into the office. The manager told him that he couldn't be leaning on a table. He asked how she would possibly know that? since she couldn't see him from the office, and he is the only other person in the building? She then confessed that the place was loaded with hidden cameras, and the owner spent her time away from the store staring at the monitor in her home, micromanaging and calling to scream about who had spent more than a few seconds not working, or was doing something that deviated from exactly how she wanted it done. He told the manager that he was done, and called for us to come pick him up. I was really happy to see that he learned well. My wife OTOH, was of a much different mindset and had put up with some real abusive A-holes in some of her first jobs. She thought that he had made a big mistake. We agreed to disagree, and I congratulated him for doing the right thing.
I feel like I've read this story before somewhere. Have you posted it elsewhere?
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: SwordGuy on November 26, 2017, 05:44:19 PM
Please report the business to your state labor relations board and to the police.
And to the local newspaper and TV stations. 

Might not accomplish something, might get the owner fined, jailed, or scared enough to quit doing it.   

It's worth a try.

Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: sequoia on November 26, 2017, 08:11:32 PM
I've always maintained a position that life is too short to waste it surrounded by toxic people.
....cut....
 He told the manager that he was done, and called for us to come pick him up. I was really happy to see that he learned well.

Congratulations, I believe you have raised him well!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: paddedhat on November 26, 2017, 08:17:25 PM
I've always maintained a position that life is too short to waste it surrounded by toxic people. I hoped that it was rubbing off on our children, but you never know until they are faced with difficulty. My oldest boy was still in his early-teens when he got a job at a local Subway shop. He was a few weeks in, when he started telling us that the owner was a bit crazy, and obsessed with control and making sure that here minimum wage peons were giving her 110% at all times. He has always been a real hard worker, but one day his shift manager pulled him into a corner of the store for a talk. He asked why she wanted to talk in such a strange spot, and she made a paranoid comment about being "watched". He was a bit surprised by that claim, since there were no cameras anywhere. Shortly after, he was alone in the dining area, and leaning on a table for a moment, after scrubbing everything in the room to operating room standards. He heard the phone ring, then got called into the office. The manager told him that he couldn't be leaning on a table. He asked how she would possibly know that? since she couldn't see him from the office, and he is the only other person in the building? She then confessed that the place was loaded with hidden cameras, and the owner spent her time away from the store staring at the monitor in her home, micromanaging and calling to scream about who had spent more than a few seconds not working, or was doing something that deviated from exactly how she wanted it done. He told the manager that he was done, and called for us to come pick him up. I was really happy to see that he learned well. My wife OTOH, was of a much different mindset and had put up with some real abusive A-holes in some of her first jobs. She thought that he had made a big mistake. We agreed to disagree, and I congratulated him for doing the right thing.
I feel like I've read this story before somewhere. Have you posted it elsewhere?
No but I seem to think it may be somewhere in my post history also.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: antarestar on November 27, 2017, 07:49:01 AM
I've always maintained a position that life is too short to waste it surrounded by toxic people. I hoped that it was rubbing off on our children, but you never know until they are faced with difficulty. My oldest boy was still in his early-teens when he got a job at a local Subway shop. He was a few weeks in, when he started telling us that the owner was a bit crazy, and obsessed with control and making sure that here minimum wage peons were giving her 110% at all times. He has always been a real hard worker, but one day his shift manager pulled him into a corner of the store for a talk. He asked why she wanted to talk in such a strange spot, and she made a paranoid comment about being "watched". He was a bit surprised by that claim, since there were no cameras anywhere. Shortly after, he was alone in the dining area, and leaning on a table for a moment, after scrubbing everything in the room to operating room standards. He heard the phone ring, then got called into the office. The manager told him that he couldn't be leaning on a table. He asked how she would possibly know that? since she couldn't see him from the office, and he is the only other person in the building? She then confessed that the place was loaded with hidden cameras, and the owner spent her time away from the store staring at the monitor in her home, micromanaging and calling to scream about who had spent more than a few seconds not working, or was doing something that deviated from exactly how she wanted it done. He told the manager that he was done, and called for us to come pick him up. I was really happy to see that he learned well. My wife OTOH, was of a much different mindset and had put up with some real abusive A-holes in some of her first jobs. She thought that he had made a big mistake. We agreed to disagree, and I congratulated him for doing the right thing.
I feel like I've read this story before somewhere. Have you posted it elsewhere?

I think hidden cameras happen a lot more than people realize.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: rockstache on November 27, 2017, 08:09:26 AM
I've always maintained a position that life is too short to waste it surrounded by toxic people. I hoped that it was rubbing off on our children, but you never know until they are faced with difficulty. My oldest boy was still in his early-teens when he got a job at a local Subway shop. He was a few weeks in, when he started telling us that the owner was a bit crazy, and obsessed with control and making sure that here minimum wage peons were giving her 110% at all times. He has always been a real hard worker, but one day his shift manager pulled him into a corner of the store for a talk. He asked why she wanted to talk in such a strange spot, and she made a paranoid comment about being "watched". He was a bit surprised by that claim, since there were no cameras anywhere. Shortly after, he was alone in the dining area, and leaning on a table for a moment, after scrubbing everything in the room to operating room standards. He heard the phone ring, then got called into the office. The manager told him that he couldn't be leaning on a table. He asked how she would possibly know that? since she couldn't see him from the office, and he is the only other person in the building? She then confessed that the place was loaded with hidden cameras, and the owner spent her time away from the store staring at the monitor in her home, micromanaging and calling to scream about who had spent more than a few seconds not working, or was doing something that deviated from exactly how she wanted it done. He told the manager that he was done, and called for us to come pick him up. I was really happy to see that he learned well. My wife OTOH, was of a much different mindset and had put up with some real abusive A-holes in some of her first jobs. She thought that he had made a big mistake. We agreed to disagree, and I congratulated him for doing the right thing.
I feel like I've read this story before somewhere. Have you posted it elsewhere?

I think hidden cameras happen a lot more than people realize.

I don't think the hidden cameras are the issue. Everyone knows that cameras are everywhere, or at least they should. The problem is the spying, micromanaging owner. That's what FU money is for.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Dicey on November 27, 2017, 08:14:48 AM
I think hidden cameras happen a lot more than people realize.
I think they're fine as long as the employees know they exist. Secret cameras are a whole 'mother story. And no cameras in bathrooms, please.

I know someone who owns multiple donut stores. They're full of cameras, so he can check on them from anywhere with  his phone. IDK if the line staff knows about them, but I'm sure his managers do.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Laura33 on November 27, 2017, 08:41:23 AM
I've always maintained a position that life is too short to waste it surrounded by toxic people. I hoped that it was rubbing off on our children, but you never know until they are faced with difficulty. My oldest boy was still in his early-teens when he got a job at a local Subway shop. He was a few weeks in, when he started telling us that the owner was a bit crazy, and obsessed with control and making sure that here minimum wage peons were giving her 110% at all times. He has always been a real hard worker, but one day his shift manager pulled him into a corner of the store for a talk. He asked why she wanted to talk in such a strange spot, and she made a paranoid comment about being "watched". He was a bit surprised by that claim, since there were no cameras anywhere. Shortly after, he was alone in the dining area, and leaning on a table for a moment, after scrubbing everything in the room to operating room standards. He heard the phone ring, then got called into the office. The manager told him that he couldn't be leaning on a table. He asked how she would possibly know that? since she couldn't see him from the office, and he is the only other person in the building? She then confessed that the place was loaded with hidden cameras, and the owner spent her time away from the store staring at the monitor in her home, micromanaging and calling to scream about who had spent more than a few seconds not working, or was doing something that deviated from exactly how she wanted it done. He told the manager that he was done, and called for us to come pick him up. I was really happy to see that he learned well. My wife OTOH, was of a much different mindset and had put up with some real abusive A-holes in some of her first jobs. She thought that he had made a big mistake. We agreed to disagree, and I congratulated him for doing the right thing.
I feel like I've read this story before somewhere. Have you posted it elsewhere?

I think hidden cameras happen a lot more than people realize.

FWIW, these can be illegal in some states.  Most states require at least one person being taped to have granted permission; others require permission from everyone.*  If it's in the employment context, obviously check any documents you've signed, but if you discover someone is actually spying on you with hidden cameras, might be worth at least checking your state's laws.

*Caveat that my experience has been with audiotapes; not sure it applies to video if it didn't include sound.  I learned this when the real asshat bad guy in a case thought he was being clever by secretly taping our client, trying to trick him into some sort of admission**.  But not only didn't our client say anything to hurt his case, the asshat didn't realize that he was violating the law by taping our client without the client's permission.  Now that was satisfying.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Sibley on November 27, 2017, 08:05:57 PM
Well, I gave notice today at work. Wish I could say that it was epic, but honestly it was mostly exhausting and emotional. (The smoke detector deciding to start chirping at 1am about low battery didn't help with any of it.) I was honest about why I was leaving, and it seems some of the strain I've been under this year showed. It surprised me - I've apparently been employing some defensive mechanisms and didn't realize how much some of this has affected me.
 
Cliff notes of the issues: manager is alternately micromanage-ey and unavailable when you need her, then when you do something perfectly reasonable, tells you that you should have checked with her first. Her written communication style reads as hypercritical and disapproving, even though I know she doesn't intend it that way. Parts of my work require intense manager involvement/review, and she regularly doesn't do this timely. By the time she gets around to it, it's the last minute and becomes a frantic effort to make the changes. Then she tells you not to be so frantic (WTF? You made massive changes to the document half an hour before I have to present it to the VP! I gave the damn thing to you 2 days ago!). While this particular combination is annoying and frustrating for my coworkers, turns out that it's toxic to me. While I like her as a person, as a manager she's a disaster for me.

I've been assured by both my manager's boss and grandboss (various flavors of director) that they will be doing coaching and other things to address the problems. The grand boss told me that he'd been planning to move around the manager assignments so it wasn't so siloed, as well as moving some managerial tasks around to rebalance workloads. All of which is great and should really take the stress off the staff next year, but I don't think I can recover (and it is a recovery) without a massive change. Interestingly, he told me that he would wait to start anything until after my last day "to avoid causing me any more stress". Holy crap, what a day for my poker face to take a vacation! This guy is gruff, blunt, and doesn't pay attention to emotions. I think I made an impression, and I really didn't mean to.
 
They're not really pushing to try to get me to stay, which is not the MO for them. I was told very specifically that if I ever want to return, I just have to say the word. It's one thing for your employee to tell you that they're getting more money or a promotion going somewhere else, and quite different for them to say they're leaving because they feel un-trusted and incompetent due to the mgmt style on a near daily basis and are going to the exact same job but somewhere else. Especially when it's one of your high performers. I got promoted earlier this year, and another director who I work with (but not in my reporting line) hinted that I had been on the promotion list for 2018. (For context, it usually takes 2-3 years to go between these levels.) So clearly, they think I'm good. What a pity my manager had to convey the opposite impression.

I haven't heard from the great-grand boss yet, but I was also told he knows and is not happy. After all, he's got a team of 12 losing 2 experienced staff in the space of a couple weeks (my coworker's last day is Thursday, he's just as good as I am though we have different strengths). This puts a major project in jeopardy. I expect that I will be talking to him at some point. I plan to be more vague about why I'm leaving with him, and hopefully what little poker face I have will be back on by then. Whether or not he tries to get me to stay, we'll see. He generally takes his director's input on staff matters, though has been known to override. I guess it'll depend on why they're deviated from the MO in the first place, and if that gets shared.

I didn't talk to my manager today outside of a hello in passing. I will need to talk to her tomorrow, if nothing else to prioritize what I'm working on for my last 2 weeks. I am not going to tell her that she's the reason I'm leaving - I may be blunt, but I try not to be cruel.

I start at the new job 12/18. My last day at current job is 12/8. I'll be taking the week in between to decompress and probably do a bunch of painting at home. I honestly think knowing that I could quit if I needed to really helped me cope this year. Having FU money gave me the ability to change jobs when it was a good time for me, rather than having to scramble and potentially mess up everything else I've had going on this year.

Sorry for the book. This turned into therapy...
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: iluvzbeach on November 27, 2017, 08:15:41 PM
Congrats, Sibley. Sounds pretty damn epic to me. Hopefully the “therapy” and relief of getting this behind you will result in a good night’s sleep.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Rowellen on November 27, 2017, 08:22:56 PM
Congrats Sibley. I hope the next few weeks aren't too stressful for you.  Good luck in your new position. I like that you were honest about why you were leaving. Perhaps the manager can get some training to improve her performance.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Dicey on November 27, 2017, 08:43:41 PM
Whew! Wnat a story. Do you feel like a weight has lifted?
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Daisy on November 27, 2017, 10:54:54 PM
Sibley, that IS epic!

You gave feedback to upper management and they are going to make changes,AND they are waiting for you to leave to institute some of the changes so that you are not stressed. It sounds like they really value your opinion. OR, in classic megacorp style, after you leave they do nothing and continue as usual. I'm hoping it's the former and not the latter, for your ex-coworkers sake.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Sibley on November 28, 2017, 08:24:56 AM
After a good night's sleep (with no smoke detector chirping!), yes. Big weight off me. I talked to the manager today and it went really well. I like her personally, it's just the work stuff that is such a problem. We're focusing on transitioning my work and me wrapping up what I can. I've got fingers in a lot of pies, so it'll be complex even transitioning.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: mm1970 on November 28, 2017, 11:39:51 AM
After a good night's sleep (with no smoke detector chirping!), yes. Big weight off me. I talked to the manager today and it went really well. I like her personally, it's just the work stuff that is such a problem. We're focusing on transitioning my work and me wrapping up what I can. I've got fingers in a lot of pies, so it'll be complex even transitioning.
It's amazing how the boss and their communication methods can make such a difference.  I've had 8 bosses in my current job, and a few of them SUUUCKED so bad that honestly I would *never* work for them again.  In fact, a recent position opened up that I'm interested in, right up my alley - not. gonna. do. it.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Laura33 on November 28, 2017, 02:18:59 PM
Cliff notes of the issues: manager is alternately micromanage-ey and unavailable when you need her, then when you do something perfectly reasonable, tells you that you should have checked with her first. Her written communication style reads as hypercritical and disapproving, even though I know she doesn't intend it that way. Parts of my work require intense manager involvement/review, and she regularly doesn't do this timely. By the time she gets around to it, it's the last minute and becomes a frantic effort to make the changes. Then she tells you not to be so frantic (WTF? You made massive changes to the document half an hour before I have to present it to the VP! I gave the damn thing to you 2 days ago!). While this particular combination is annoying and frustrating for my coworkers, turns out that it's toxic to me. While I like her as a person, as a manager she's a disaster for me.

Wow, if it weren't for the parts I struck out, I'd think you were working for my old toxic boss.  I call it the "swoop and poop" management style.  And from personal experience, it is not fixable.  You did the right thing; congratulations on getting out of there.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Dave1442397 on November 28, 2017, 02:54:25 PM
Cliff notes of the issues: manager is alternately micromanage-ey and unavailable when you need her, then when you do something perfectly reasonable, tells you that you should have checked with her first. Her written communication style reads as hypercritical and disapproving, even though I know she doesn't intend it that way. Parts of my work require intense manager involvement/review, and she regularly doesn't do this timely. By the time she gets around to it, it's the last minute and becomes a frantic effort to make the changes. Then she tells you not to be so frantic (WTF? You made massive changes to the document half an hour before I have to present it to the VP! I gave the damn thing to you 2 days ago!). While this particular combination is annoying and frustrating for my coworkers, turns out that it's toxic to me. While I like her as a person, as a manager she's a disaster for me.

Wow, if it weren't for the parts I struck out, I'd think you were working for my old toxic boss.  I call it the "swoop and poop" management style.  And from personal experience, it is not fixable.  You did the right thing; congratulations on getting out of there.

I had one of those almost twenty years ago. I knew I was stressed out, but I had no idea how bad it was until I left. The last time I saw my current manager was in August...he's very much a hands-off manager :)
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: AlanStache on November 28, 2017, 03:35:59 PM
Cliff notes of the issues: manager is alternately micromanage-ey and unavailable when you need her, then when you do something perfectly reasonable, tells you that you should have checked with her first. Her written communication style reads as hypercritical and disapproving, even though I know she doesn't intend it that way. Parts of my work require intense manager involvement/review, and she regularly doesn't do this timely. By the time she gets around to it, it's the last minute and becomes a frantic effort to make the changes. Then she tells you not to be so frantic (WTF? You made massive changes to the document half an hour before I have to present it to the VP! I gave the damn thing to you 2 days ago!). While this particular combination is annoying and frustrating for my coworkers, turns out that it's toxic to me. While I like her as a person, as a manager she's a disaster for me.

Wow, if it weren't for the parts I struck out, I'd think you were working for my old toxic boss.  I call it the "swoop and poop" management style.  And from personal experience, it is not fixable.  You did the right thing; congratulations on getting out of there.

I had one of those almost twenty years ago. I knew I was stressed out, but I had no idea how bad it was until I left. The last time I saw my current manager was in August...he's very much a hands-off manager :)

Yep there is a special level of hell for bosses that want to micromanage but dont want to communicate or review what you are doing.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Bicycle_B on November 28, 2017, 03:48:28 PM
Sibley, so glad you left.  Congrats on having your FU money and new job ducks in a row.  Have a great week painting!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Sibley on November 28, 2017, 05:41:38 PM
2nd update for you guys - the email went out around noon that I was leaving. The entire department is pissed I'm leaving. Like, staff, managers, directors, VP, everyone. Top to bottom, bottom to top. People from different states, other teams. All of them. I've had all but one of the directors pull me into their office to try to get me to stay, the last one wasn't in the office today. Multiple managers/directors have offered to put me on their teams. The manager I really like told me she feels bad she didn't realize how bad it was (she's in another state, and I haven't really worked with her all year, why should she know?). I overheard a conversation between 2 mgrs about how they're going to tell the business areas (I'm in internal audit), I wasn't supposed to hear that one. Apparently half the damn company loves me, even the people I've been giving findings to left, right and center. The 2 directors on my team are out of town until Thursday for a conference.

Along with that, half the dept seems to know WHY I'm leaving, without me saying anything. I just keep saying I need a change, and they're like, "is it her?" What do I say to that?!?

It was a very weird day. I don't know how to feel. 8 (working) days left.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: G-dog on November 28, 2017, 07:15:14 PM
Wonderfully weird. It’s nice to know that you are so well respected and liked.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: AlanStache on November 28, 2017, 07:19:23 PM
2nd update for you guys - the email went out around noon that I was leaving. The entire department is pissed I'm leaving. Like, staff, managers, directors, VP, everyone. Top to bottom, bottom to top. People from different states, other teams. All of them. I've had all but one of the directors pull me into their office to try to get me to stay, the last one wasn't in the office today. Multiple managers/directors have offered to put me on their teams. The manager I really like told me she feels bad she didn't realize how bad it was (she's in another state, and I haven't really worked with her all year, why should she know?). I overheard a conversation between 2 mgrs about how they're going to tell the business areas (I'm in internal audit), I wasn't supposed to hear that one. Apparently half the damn company loves me, even the people I've been giving findings to left, right and center. The 2 directors on my team are out of town until Thursday for a conference.

Along with that, half the dept seems to know WHY I'm leaving, without me saying anything. I just keep saying I need a change, and they're like, "is it her?" What do I say to that?!?

It was a very weird day. I don't know how to feel. 8 (working) days left.

You dont make someone you love work under a horrible boss.  Dont forget who put you there and who did not act to get you out.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: crispy on November 28, 2017, 08:14:23 PM
Way to go , Sibley! Going on your own terms is epic! I had a similar manager years ago...nice enough but just a terrible micromanager. It was just soul sucking and really made me question my abilities.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: shelivesthedream on November 29, 2017, 01:27:51 AM
I think the correct answer to "Is it her?!" is "I've talked to grand-boss (or whoever) about my reasons for leaving and given him/her any feedback on the company that I felt necessary." On repeat if necessary.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: UKMustache on November 29, 2017, 04:47:05 AM
I suspect my wife may deploy our FU money in the near future.
She has a new boss and though Mrs UK often sees the best in people, she hates this person.

New bosses management style includes screaming at staff on a regular basis, reducing people to tears in meetings, blaming others for errors and stealing credit for accomplishments.

The latest issue is petty but incredibly annoying, it prompted Mrs UK to ask me if we will be okay if she quits... we will, by cutting some luxuries we can survive indefinitely on my salary!

Approaching Christmas her team (purchasing) are extremely busy and need to cover certain weekends (black Friday etc).

The rota was agreed 4 months ago, my wife would work Sunday 26th November in exchange for leave on Friday 8th December.  We are going on a family holiday for my mum's birthday and as Mrs UK and I had the 8th booked off, we agreed to drive down before everyone else and collect the keys for the cottage, put up some decorations etc.

On Friday 24th November (2 days before) IT issues crippled the online sales and an emergency 'queuing' system was put in place for the weekend.  This meant Sunday overtime was no longer required as sales were restricted.

As my wife couldn't work the Sunday, she hasn't got the available leave for the 8th December. 

She approached the boss and offered (I think) a fair compromise
I start early in the morning so I will make sure to work the time in lieu before the 8th and take a half-day instead.

Boss refused, stating that my wife starts early anyway so it doesn't count.
Mrs UK does start over an hour early (to avoid traffic) so is contracted to 8 hours per day and works 9.5 hours... every single day.

This has really annoyed Mrs UK because:

She is friendly with one of the directors and is going to raise the issue with him.  If the company don't sort it, they are probably going to lose her!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: arebelspy on November 29, 2017, 04:59:57 AM
Oh geez, * that.

She should be taking every Friday off (or half days) for all the extra hours she puts in.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: gaja on November 29, 2017, 05:34:45 AM
I suspect my wife may deploy our FU money in the near future.

(...)

She approached the boss and offered (I think) a fair compromise
I start early in the morning so I will make sure to work the time in lieu before the 8th and take a half-day instead.

Boss refused, stating that my wife starts early anyway so it doesn't count.
Mrs UK does start over an hour early (to avoid traffic) so is contracted to 8 hours per day and works 9.5 hours... every single day.

This has really annoyed Mrs UK because:
  • This boss turns up late most days, including today (the day after this argument)
  • The boss appears to have decided that Mrs UK's voluntary (unpaid) overtime is the companies right
  • Mrs UK often works over weekends and late into the evening to get things done, so now feels very under appreciated
  • We now need to completely re-arrange our travel, my dad will need a day off to travel early instead (self-employed so won't get paid)

She is friendly with one of the directors and is going to raise the issue with him.  If the company don't sort it, they are probably going to lose her!

She has to stop working for free. Especially when it isn't even appriciated. Put in the 8 hours, not a second more. If you get no flexibility, you have to stop giving flexibility.

I have no problem being flexible at work, putting in 60 hour weeks when necessary, work late saturday and sunday nights to reach deadlines, etc. But every single of those hours get written down, and I will either receive OT for them, or take PTO. Usually, i end up with 7 weeks of summer holidays, and long weekends whenever it suits me.

If I want to work for free, I will volunteer at an NGO.

Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: UKMustache on November 29, 2017, 05:48:07 AM
She has to stop working for free. Especially when it isn't even appriciated. Put in the 8 hours, not a second more. If you get no flexibility, you have to stop giving flexibility.

I have no problem being flexible at work, putting in 60 hour weeks when necessary, work late saturday and sunday nights to reach deadlines, etc. But every single of those hours get written down, and I will either receive OT for them, or take PTO. Usually, i end up with 7 weeks of summer holidays, and long weekends whenever it suits me.

If I want to work for free, I will volunteer at an NGO.

I agree, that is the same advice I gave her.

I've also said that it's cool if she wants to join a gym near work, so she can still do the journey early but doesn't have to go into the office.  If she sets off at 6am the drive takes 25-30 minutes, if she sets off at 7am it takes 1.5 hours.

If it were me, I'd stay in bed and set off after 7am... if the boss gave me a hard time when I was late I'd say they should lead by example... but I'm a dick and Mrs UK isn't :D


She regularly works with the director she is friendly with before official office hours start... I also said that next time he approaches her she should explain that she is in the office but not available for work because her boss said it doesn't count!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: gaja on November 29, 2017, 05:59:32 AM
She has to stop working for free. Especially when it isn't even appriciated. Put in the 8 hours, not a second more. If you get no flexibility, you have to stop giving flexibility.

I have no problem being flexible at work, putting in 60 hour weeks when necessary, work late saturday and sunday nights to reach deadlines, etc. But every single of those hours get written down, and I will either receive OT for them, or take PTO. Usually, i end up with 7 weeks of summer holidays, and long weekends whenever it suits me.

If I want to work for free, I will volunteer at an NGO.

I agree, that is the same advice I gave her.

I've also said that it's cool if she wants to join a gym near work, so she can still do the journey early but doesn't have to go into the office.  If she sets off at 6am the drive takes 25-30 minutes, if she sets off at 7am it takes 1.5 hours.

If it were me, I'd stay in bed and set off after 7am... if the boss gave me a hard time when I was late I'd say they should lead by example... but I'm a dick and Mrs UK isn't :D


She regularly works with the director she is friendly with before official office hours start... I also said that next time he approaches her she should explain that she is in the office but not available for work because her boss said it doesn't count!

Great idea to put in an hour at a gym before work! That makes a lot more sense than sitting in traffic for an extra hour.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: shelivesthedream on November 29, 2017, 10:29:31 AM
Poor Mrs UKMustache! My bad self suggests finding something else to do ostentatiously in the office from her arrival time until her official start time. Read a book, watch a film, practice a hobby... If questioned, smile sweetly and explain that since Boss said that work done during this time doesn't count, it doesn't make any sense for her to carry on doing it, does it?

My better self says to simply say "I am taking Friday 8th off as arranged" and see what happens. Odds on, absolutely nothing.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: BlueHouse on November 29, 2017, 10:34:25 AM
I think hidden cameras happen a lot more than people realize.
I think they're fine as long as the employees know they exist. Secret cameras are a whole 'mother story. And no cameras in bathrooms, please.

I know someone who owns multiple donut stores. They're full of cameras, so he can check on them from anywhere with  his phone. IDK if the line staff knows about them, but I'm sure his managers do.

There's really almost no reason not to tell your employees that there are cameras.  It doesn't seem to matter.  People either forget or don't care and those who would, will STILL pull off bad or illegal behavior RIGHT IN FRONT of the cameras!  It's shocking! 

Even at work, where I know internet usage is monitored, here I am....
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: sequoia on November 29, 2017, 10:37:22 AM
I suspect my wife may deploy our FU money in the near future.

(...)

She approached the boss and offered (I think) a fair compromise
I start early in the morning so I will make sure to work the time in lieu before the 8th and take a half-day instead.

Boss refused, stating that my wife starts early anyway so it doesn't count.
Mrs UK does start over an hour early (to avoid traffic) so is contracted to 8 hours per day and works 9.5 hours... every single day.

This has really annoyed Mrs UK because:
  • This boss turns up late most days, including today (the day after this argument)
  • The boss appears to have decided that Mrs UK's voluntary (unpaid) overtime is the companies right
  • Mrs UK often works over weekends and late into the evening to get things done, so now feels very under appreciated
  • We now need to completely re-arrange our travel, my dad will need a day off to travel early instead (self-employed so won't get paid)

She is friendly with one of the directors and is going to raise the issue with him.  If the company don't sort it, they are probably going to lose her!

She has to stop working for free. Especially when it isn't even appriciated. Put in the 8 hours, not a second more. If you get no flexibility, you have to stop giving flexibility.

I have no problem being flexible at work, putting in 60 hour weeks when necessary, work late saturday and sunday nights to reach deadlines, etc. But every single of those hours get written down, and I will either receive OT for them, or take PTO. Usually, i end up with 7 weeks of summer holidays, and long weekends whenever it suits me.

If I want to work for free, I will volunteer at an NGO.

+1. Many jobs ago, I used to get to the office early to avoid traffic during my commute. My boss knows this, and he is fine for me leaving early (2-3 PM instead of 5PM). Our team worked with people in around the globe at that time, so it works well that I come in early, and my teammates come in later so we have broader coverage during the day.

9.5 hr everyday and not getting paid extra, bonus, PTO? That is crazy amount of time to work for free imo.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: GnomeErcy on November 29, 2017, 02:05:05 PM
I suspect my wife may deploy our FU money in the near future.
She has a new boss and though Mrs UK often sees the best in people, she hates this person.

New bosses management style includes screaming at staff on a regular basis, reducing people to tears in meetings, blaming others for errors and stealing credit for accomplishments.

The latest issue is petty but incredibly annoying, it prompted Mrs UK to ask me if we will be okay if she quits... we will, by cutting some luxuries we can survive indefinitely on my salary!

Approaching Christmas her team (purchasing) are extremely busy and need to cover certain weekends (black Friday etc).

The rota was agreed 4 months ago, my wife would work Sunday 26th November in exchange for leave on Friday 8th December.  We are going on a family holiday for my mum's birthday and as Mrs UK and I had the 8th booked off, we agreed to drive down before everyone else and collect the keys for the cottage, put up some decorations etc.

On Friday 24th November (2 days before) IT issues crippled the online sales and an emergency 'queuing' system was put in place for the weekend.  This meant Sunday overtime was no longer required as sales were restricted.

As my wife couldn't work the Sunday, she hasn't got the available leave for the 8th December. 

She approached the boss and offered (I think) a fair compromise
I start early in the morning so I will make sure to work the time in lieu before the 8th and take a half-day instead.

Boss refused, stating that my wife starts early anyway so it doesn't count.
Mrs UK does start over an hour early (to avoid traffic) so is contracted to 8 hours per day and works 9.5 hours... every single day.

This has really annoyed Mrs UK because:
  • This boss turns up late most days, including today (the day after this argument)
  • The boss appears to have decided that Mrs UK's voluntary (unpaid) overtime is the companies right
  • Mrs UK often works over weekends and late into the evening to get things done, so now feels very under appreciated
  • We now need to completely re-arrange our travel, my dad will need a day off to travel early instead (self-employed so won't get paid)

She is friendly with one of the directors and is going to raise the issue with him.  If the company don't sort it, they are probably going to lose her!

TBH she should just leave anyway. My wife may do a similar thing.

She asked off in June for the 26th of December. It's the first time her family is out visiting from out of state since she moved a year and a half ago, and she's not taken off around the holidays in 6 years of working at her company.

I told her to just not show up. Worst that happens is they fire her - which is doubtful because her stuff is WAY too much of a shit show for anybody else to want to deal with. Even if they do, oh well.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Luckyvik on November 29, 2017, 03:35:56 PM

If I want to work for free, I will volunteer at an NGO.
Thanks for this, I’ve been doing free overtime also, must stop doing that.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Sibley on November 29, 2017, 06:12:03 PM
OMG -- you are an internal auditor and she was asking for last minute changes?   RECIPE FOR DISASTER!!!!   No wonder you were stressed.  That kind of management style is bad in all circumstances, but lethal in that kind of an environment.

Ultimately the problem is above her, though.  I bet she was a great individual performer.   Just shouldn't have been promoted.

That is exactly why I don't want to move into management. I'm a great auditor. I would be a terrible audit manager. And yes, she was a very good individual performer.

I basically had a breakdown last night. I honestly thought that mgmt knew I was unhappy, but they didn't care. There have been several specific incidents this year that someone SHOULD have checked in with me, and they didn't. And I talked to them a couple times, got short term help but no long term fix. It appears, based on everyone's reaction to my leaving, that they really didn't get it, and I couldn't process that contradiction (still can't really). I got 2 hours sleep last night, and spent the whole train ride in crying. I didn't go to work. I ended up texting a friend (different dept), and she came down for a bit and we talked. Mostly, she helped me calm down a bit. She helped me text in that I was taking the day off, and looked up the train schedule for me. I went home and went back to bed. The cats were very surprised, but happily napped with me.

After getting some sleep (still a mess, but at least I'm semi-functional now), I'm stuck with 2 basic facts. 1. I don't actually want to leave, and 2. even if they make the changes that I've been told they're planning and switched my manager, I don't think it would be enough to fix ME. Because this is NOT me, I don't do this. I am more important than any job, so I'm still leaving. Unfortunately, in my decidedly NOT rational state this morning, I did text my former manager some of this confusion, so now I need to have another chat with the director tomorrow.

Just goes to show how much a bad mgmt style can mess you up, and you may not even realize it.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Bicycle_B on November 29, 2017, 06:31:19 PM
OMG -- you are an internal auditor and she was asking for last minute changes?   

Holy CRAP.


I basically had a breakdown last night. I honestly thought that mgmt knew I was unhappy, but they didn't care. There have been several specific incidents this year that someone SHOULD have checked in with me, and they didn't. And I talked to them a couple times, got short term help but no long term fix. It appears, based on everyone's reaction to my leaving, that they really didn't get it, and I couldn't process that contradiction (still can't really). I got 2 hours sleep last night, and spent the whole train ride in crying. I didn't go to work. I ended up texting a friend (different dept), and she came down for a bit and we talked. Mostly, she helped me calm down a bit. She helped me text in that I was taking the day off, and looked up the train schedule for me. I went home and went back to bed. The cats were very surprised, but happily napped with me.

After getting some sleep (still a mess, but at least I'm semi-functional now), I'm stuck with 2 basic facts. 1. I don't actually want to leave, and 2. even if they make the changes that I've been told they're planning and switched my manager, I don't think it would be enough to fix ME. Because this is NOT me, I don't do this. I am more important than any job, so I'm still leaving. Unfortunately, in my decidedly NOT rational state this morning, I did text my former manager some of this confusion, so now I need to have another chat with the director tomorrow.

Just goes to show how much a bad mgmt style can mess you up, and you may not even realize it.

Sounds very confusing!  Fwiw, in the midst of confusion, Executing the Plan is usually a good way to overcome the emotional turbulence.  If your plan is to leave, seems like the plan will get you out of a bad situation.

They can always up the ante later and ask for your return... after the bad supervisor is no longer in the job that caused the trouble, once management has become ready to accept more responsibility for their own decisions.  Fwiw, if you were to stay, it still seems like the effect would be to enable the situation to continue.  And you have a perfect cover:  "I already accepted an offer."  I hope you keep and enjoy your upcoming vacation and new job.  Keep getting sleep.  And hey, with all this stress, calling in sick is totally legit!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: former player on November 30, 2017, 01:37:14 AM
Today in conversation with a friend I talked a bit about a situation I had 20 years ago with a bad manager, and realised just how badly it had affected me at the time when I found myself dropping the f bomb about 10 times in one minute.

You are right that you are not the problem, and you are right to move on.  When you have your chat with the director tomorrow, I would think about saying that you are only able to work out your notice if you no longer have to work to your current manager, and that if they are unable to agree to this you will be on sick leave.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: shelivesthedream on November 30, 2017, 02:32:42 AM
I have a couple of freelance friends who have all worked for this guy we call Crazy [Name]. We call him that to remind ourselves never ever ever to work with him again. We've each been through it in turn and it seriously messes with you. Looking back, it's hard to imagine why we put up with him, but at the time we all got this weird tunnel vision about it. Keep leaving - your future self will thank you.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Laura33 on November 30, 2017, 06:49:33 AM
I honestly thought that mgmt knew I was unhappy, but they didn't care. There have been several specific incidents this year that someone SHOULD have checked in with me, and they didn't. And I talked to them a couple times, got short term help but no long term fix. It appears, based on everyone's reaction to my leaving, that they really didn't get it, and I couldn't process that contradiction (still can't really).

I am so sorry.  Please realize that this is not on you, this is completely on them.  I really doubt that it was at all personal; they were just checking in at a superficial level, like people do at work; they did *something*, so they ticked that box, and then went on to the next thing, and so when they didn't hear anything else, they assumed everything was fine.

The thing for you to realize is that this is also crappy management.  The fault here is not just with your immediate boss -- it is with every single other manager there who didn't bother to provide that boss with sufficient training or oversight, who focused on short-term band-aids instead of long-term solutions, and who managed passively and reactively (i.e., only in response to complaints) instead of proactively making sure the teams were properly staffed and supervised.

I am sure many of these same people like you very much as a person and respect you professionally.  They are just in a bad management structure and have never been trained on how to manage properly.  That is a problem that comes from the top, and so it is nothing that you could ever fix even if you stayed.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Sibley on November 30, 2017, 08:28:22 AM
I honestly thought that mgmt knew I was unhappy, but they didn't care. There have been several specific incidents this year that someone SHOULD have checked in with me, and they didn't. And I talked to them a couple times, got short term help but no long term fix. It appears, based on everyone's reaction to my leaving, that they really didn't get it, and I couldn't process that contradiction (still can't really).

I am so sorry.  Please realize that this is not on you, this is completely on them.  I really doubt that it was at all personal; they were just checking in at a superficial level, like people do at work; they did *something*, so they ticked that box, and then went on to the next thing, and so when they didn't hear anything else, they assumed everything was fine.

The thing for you to realize is that this is also crappy management.  The fault here is not just with your immediate boss -- it is with every single other manager there who didn't bother to provide that boss with sufficient training or oversight, who focused on short-term band-aids instead of long-term solutions, and who managed passively and reactively (i.e., only in response to complaints) instead of proactively making sure the teams were properly staffed and supervised.

I am sure many of these same people like you very much as a person and respect you professionally.  They are just in a bad management structure and have never been trained on how to manage properly.  That is a problem that comes from the top, and so it is nothing that you could ever fix even if you stayed.

I know. However, I clearly hit a breaking point. I'm better today, back at work. I'm still emotionally fragile though, and I know it. I'm trying to be very careful to manage my stress load, make sure I eat and sleep enough, etc. One day at a time. This is very unlike me, I've never done anything like this before.

Edit: to be clear, I'm still leaving this job for the new one. I clearly need a change.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Dicey on November 30, 2017, 08:37:08 AM
Great update. Sending you lots of positive energy and hugs.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Aegishjalmur on November 30, 2017, 09:04:38 AM
Sibley,

Congrats on getting out. No job is worth that level of emotional and mental stress.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: MrMoogle on November 30, 2017, 11:08:37 AM
It sounds like you could use more than a week between jobs.  You might want to explore those options.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Sibley on November 30, 2017, 11:23:05 AM
It sounds like you could use more than a week between jobs.  You might want to explore those options.

I'm thinking about it. Haven't decided.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Daisy on November 30, 2017, 11:24:46 AM
I honestly thought that mgmt knew I was unhappy, but they didn't care. There have been several specific incidents this year that someone SHOULD have checked in with me, and they didn't. And I talked to them a couple times, got short term help but no long term fix. It appears, based on everyone's reaction to my leaving, that they really didn't get it, and I couldn't process that contradiction (still can't really).

I am so sorry.  Please realize that this is not on you, this is completely on them.  I really doubt that it was at all personal; they were just checking in at a superficial level, like people do at work; they did *something*, so they ticked that box, and then went on to the next thing, and so when they didn't hear anything else, they assumed everything was fine.

The thing for you to realize is that this is also crappy management.  The fault here is not just with your immediate boss -- it is with every single other manager there who didn't bother to provide that boss with sufficient training or oversight, who focused on short-term band-aids instead of long-term solutions, and who managed passively and reactively (i.e., only in response to complaints) instead of proactively making sure the teams were properly staffed and supervised.

I am sure many of these same people like you very much as a person and respect you professionally.  They are just in a bad management structure and have never been trained on how to manage properly.  That is a problem that comes from the top, and so it is nothing that you could ever fix even if you stayed.

I know. However, I clearly hit a breaking point. I'm better today, back at work. I'm still emotionally fragile though, and I know it. I'm trying to be very careful to manage my stress load, make sure I eat and sleep enough, etc. One day at a time. This is very unlike me, I've never done anything like this before.

Edit: to be clear, I'm still leaving this job for the new one. I clearly need a change.

Yep, agree with Laura33.

When I initially went to HR, they did have a talk with my managers and the tension reduced.

However, when I went to HR the second time, HR person said "but we had a talk with them to tame down the rhetoric". I said yes, they have been nicer to me...but in the sense that now they were barely talking with me, just politely smiling at me in the hallway. So the nasty managers' response was to just avoid me. Maybe they were worried they would screw up again by talking with me and were protecting themselves.

Also, the HR person tried to institute some seminars on improving the work environment, but none of the managers in my department attended. It was only individual contributors that attended. It was a voluntary seminar. I brought this up to the HR person during the second talk, to point out that my management really had no interest in changing. Others had noticed too that no managers went.

I am so happy to be gone.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: KT's Stache on November 30, 2017, 11:42:27 AM
Sibley as someone who is about a month "farther along" than you in this same process, I can tell you it will be hard, but such a positive change once you have a bit of time to reflect on everything that is happening.

I was in a job for 9 years with poor management, and then 4 years ago transferred to a different office where the "worst" manager was the person I was working closest with. I pushed hard to pretend that I could handle it, and that I really did have it all together but was offered a great (and very different) job by a business owner friend and I decided to make a change. I had no idea how much of my identity was wrapped up in being KT from XX, and I was in serious denial about how much stress/unhappiness this job was causing me. Giving my notice was the hardest thing I have done, and then I doubted and freaked out about it for 3 days afterwords until the entire company was informed. After that, it was a great experience (well mostly....).  Co-workers, clients, and community contacts were telling me just what a great job I had done and how much they were going to miss me. I was getting such apathetic or negative feedback for so long before this, I had managed to convince myself that I wasn't good at my job (and basically sucked at all areas of life too). I was so mad that no one had communicated the positive thoughts/feedback to me while I still worked there. I was getting comments like you seem stressed, you should take a day off, but no one actually cared enough to ask me how I was actually doing.

I took a week off between jobs, and was able to process through where my values were and how I actually felt about myself and am working to re-align my life with those values/goals.  My recommendation would be to talk to a couple of different people who know/understand you (your likes, values, goals, skills ect) really well and take some time to talk through this process, then think and evaluate on your own. I repeated this process of going back and forth between friends and introspective thinking several times and each gave me more clarity into myself. 

In the end, it has been an exhausting, emotional, difficult but great outcome. When I started my new job, I had 4 other professionals asking me to do other contracting work for them during their busy time of the year. So, I went from a job where I worked 3,000 hours a year, to one where I work 30-32 hours a week (with only 1 day a week in the office, the rest is at home), and can do contract work when I want, according to my schedule, with people I like to work with. I took a small pay cut to go to part time, but when you factor in the contract work, I will be making about 50% more each year.  This new plan I have aligns with the goals I identified, of having more location mobility/flexibility, more freedom, and allows me more quality time to spend with the people and causes that I hold near to my hear.

A long story to say You can do it!!! Keep yourself a priority, and keep working hard to figure out how life is "Best" for you.
KT
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Dicey on November 30, 2017, 07:16:08 PM
Great post, KT!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Sibley on November 30, 2017, 08:22:02 PM
Yes, thanks KT.

I made it through the day without incident. A few coworkers are aware that I'm somewhat fragile (it was obvious to them, they know me well enough), and quietly redirected conversations a few times. Which I am very grateful for.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Dicey on December 01, 2017, 12:15:48 AM
Yes, thanks KT.

I made it through the day without incident. A few coworkers are aware that I'm somewhat fragile (it was obvious to them, they know me well enough), and quietly redirected conversations a few times. Which I am very grateful for.
Imagine the entire Tenth Anniversary All-Star Cast of Les Miserables belting out "One Day More". You'll get through this and go on to better things and a happier life soon, Sibley, very, very soon.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Prairie Stash on December 01, 2017, 08:21:19 AM
Yes, thanks KT.

I made it through the day without incident. A few coworkers are aware that I'm somewhat fragile (it was obvious to them, they know me well enough), and quietly redirected conversations a few times. Which I am very grateful for.
Imagine the entire Tenth Anniversary All-Star Cast of Les Miserables belting out "One Day More". You'll get through this and go on to better things and a happier life soon, Sibley, very, very soon.
Love the song (one of my favourite memories was seeing it performed while travelling overseas), but didn't most of the people singing meet a tragic end? I also travelled the sewer system in Paris, an actual tourist destination, that Jean Valjean escaped into. Again I hope Sibley fares better ;) 

(hoping Sibley sees the humour, laughter is the best medicine)
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Sibley on December 01, 2017, 08:59:54 AM
Yes, thanks KT.

I made it through the day without incident. A few coworkers are aware that I'm somewhat fragile (it was obvious to them, they know me well enough), and quietly redirected conversations a few times. Which I am very grateful for.
Imagine the entire Tenth Anniversary All-Star Cast of Les Miserables belting out "One Day More". You'll get through this and go on to better things and a happier life soon, Sibley, very, very soon.
Love the song (one of my favourite memories was seeing it performed while travelling overseas), but didn't most of the people singing meet a tragic end? I also travelled the sewer system in Paris, an actual tourist destination, that Jean Valjean escaped into. Again I hope Sibley fares better ;) 

(hoping Sibley sees the humour, laughter is the best medicine)

I'm working on it! Am hanging in there. Thanks all - it helps. (and found out the person taking over some of my projects is struggling with the same things I am. this team has issues)
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: markbike528CBX on December 01, 2017, 12:42:06 PM
Yes, thanks KT.

I made it through the day without incident. A few coworkers are aware that I'm somewhat fragile (it was obvious to them, they know me well enough), and quietly redirected conversations a few times. Which I am very grateful for.
Imagine the entire Tenth Anniversary All-Star Cast of Les Miserables belting out "One Day More". You'll get through this and go on to better things and a happier life soon, Sibley, very, very soon.
Love the song (one of my favourite memories was seeing it performed while travelling overseas), but didn't most of the people singing meet a tragic end? I also travelled the sewer system in Paris, an actual tourist destination, that Jean Valjean escaped into. Again I hope Sibley fares better ;) 

(hoping Sibley sees the humour, laughter is the best medicine)

I'm working on it! Am hanging in there. Thanks all - it helps. (and found out the person taking over some of my projects is struggling with the same things I am. this team has issues)

For a song I'd suggest The Real McKenzies - Best Day Untill Tomorrow https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0lQ5zg4aOJY

Enjoy what'chas got, not what you have not
'tis a weak heart lamenting with sorrow
When the days seem cursed, it could always be worse
Fight depression with sword and arrow

.......

When the world ain't right, and it smithes ye with strife
Ye can now buckle down, it's a test they call life
Very soon you will see what kind of animal you'd be
Taking the bite outta life

When they're testing the gallows, yer hung like a dog
Or they're marching us out to a firing squad
We just smile and recall all the good times we had
It's the best 'til tomorrow

It's the best day 'til tomorrow

........
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: mm1970 on December 01, 2017, 05:11:02 PM
Quote
Also, the HR person tried to institute some seminars on improving the work environment, but none of the managers in my department attended. It was only individual contributors that attended. It was a voluntary seminar. I brought this up to the HR person during the second talk, to point out that my management really had no interest in changing. Others had noticed too that no managers went.

I went to a week long training on management.  Many of our managers went there.  The worst one (a former manager of mine) actually argued with the teacher.  I rolled my eyes SO HARD behind him.  The topic was how to handle ideas in meetings, and to never "tell someone their idea was stupid".  (He was the worst at that.)  He actually said, during this class "sometimes you just HAVE TO be blunt to keep the meeting moving!"

Funniest thing is this guy would tell me how dumb my ideas were, even though I had 10+ years in the industry and he had zero - and he would come up with this GREAT IDEA 2 weeks later.  I stopped coming up with ideas in meeting, and just started running experiments on the side and presenting results when they were done.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Mrs Hen on December 08, 2017, 11:27:31 AM
Wow.  I just finished (re)reading the entire thread, and there are some amazing, inspirational stories here.

It's really helped me come to terms with my own situation, and make a big decision.

I've been working in my field for nearly 30 years, and 21 years with my current employer.  I am good at what I do, work with some great people, and am respected.  I have a good pay and benefits package.  So far, so good.

My company has changed culturally over the years to the point where the only thing that matters is the bottom line.  I understand we need to make money, but there used to be a caring attitude towards employees that paid them back in spades.

The changes have happened gradually over several years, but have suddenly added up to become a huge deal for me.

I am currently working for my 7th line manager in 6 years.  In the last 2 years, I have dealt with my Mother's breast cancer (she's fine now), my Father's rapid decline and death, my Grandmother's gradual decline and death, my own diagnosis with adult onset diabetes, and planned my wedding (the good bit!).

Funnily enough, I ended up in a very fragile mental state , and I was prescribed medication for stress and depression.  These have been slowly reducing over the summer, with a view to coming off them altogether very soon.

Being respected in my role is wonderful, but it has meant I've become the "go-to girl" for everything.  I took on as much as I could over and above my primary role, but I'm aware most of my colleagues are only doing the primary role.  I am not paid any extra for doing the extra work.  I realised I was not coping, went to my manager (promoted into the role 3 months ago), explained my concerns about my health, and asked for my workload to be temporarily reduced for a couple of months while a particular large project was delivered.  Once that was done, I was very happy to take on the extra stuff again.

My manager said no.  No discussion.  My colleagues would be upset, and she wouldn't like that.  So no.

Cue lots of tears (in private!), and a text to my husband asking him if we could afford for me to quit.  He said we could afford for me to do whatever I needed to do.

My doctor has put my medications back up to the maximum dose.  I did not take any time off sick.

I did, however, start looking at our savings in a different way.  We crunched some numbers and realised we were in a pretty good place.  Not FI, but well on our way.  A line from way back in this thread came back to me.  I may need A job, but I don't need THIS job.

I do love my primary role, so I've come up with a plan of action, and I've put in application to go part time.  The company has 3 months to give me an answer, but I think I have a good chance.  If they say no, I will ask to be demoted to a level where there is no expectation of accepting extra tasks.  If they reject that, I'll quit.

So a HUGE thank you to everyone who has posted here.  Some good decisions early in my working life, living within my means, and a nudge (facepunch) from here has made me realise I actually have FU money, and I've had the nerve to use it.

Sorry for the long post!!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: rantk81 on December 08, 2017, 11:38:21 AM
...
My company has changed culturally over the years to the point where the only thing that matters is the bottom line.  I understand we need to make money, but there used to be a caring attitude towards employees that paid them back in spades.

The changes have happened gradually over several years, but have suddenly added up to become a huge deal for me.
...

Many parallels with my employer ...
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: former player on December 08, 2017, 12:16:56 PM
A line from way back in this thread came back to me.  I may need A job, but I don't need THIS job.

I do love my primary role, so I've come up with a plan of action, and I've put in application to go part time.  The company has 3 months to give me an answer, but I think I have a good chance.  If they say no, I will ask to be demoted to a level where there is no expectation of accepting extra tasks.  If they reject that, I'll quit.

So a HUGE thank you to everyone who has posted here.  Some good decisions early in my working life, living within my means, and a nudge (facepunch) from here has made me realise I actually have FU money, and I've had the nerve to use it.

Sorry for the long post!!
No need to apologise: stories like yours are the reason this thread exists.  Congratulations on the FU money and the imminent move to part time/demotion/another job.

While you are waiting for a decision on the part time, you have nothing to lose by pushing back on some of those extra tasks.  Simply saying to someone who asks you to do something extra "I don't have time at the moment, if you want you can ask me again after [Christmas/New Year/Easter] might help in the meantime.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: plainjane on December 08, 2017, 12:43:46 PM
A line from way back in this thread came back to me.  I may need A job, but I don't need THIS job.

I do love my primary role, so I've come up with a plan of action, and I've put in application to go part time.  The company has 3 months to give me an answer, but I think I have a good chance.  If they say no, I will ask to be demoted to a level where there is no expectation of accepting extra tasks.  If they reject that, I'll quit.

So a HUGE thank you to everyone who has posted here.  Some good decisions early in my working life, living within my means, and a nudge (facepunch) from here has made me realise I actually have FU money, and I've had the nerve to use it.

Sorry for the long post!!
No need to apologise: stories like yours are the reason this thread exists.  Congratulations on the FU money and the imminent move to part time/demotion/another job.

While you are waiting for a decision on the part time, you have nothing to lose by pushing back on some of those extra tasks.  Simply saying to someone who asks you to do something extra "I don't have time at the moment, if you want you can ask me again after [Christmas/New Year/Easter] might help in the meantime.

I'm so glad you have not taken their 'no' for an answer.

Another idea in the meantime is to start dropping the things you've asked to have taken off of your plate - "so sorry, I need to get X done". "Hi Manager, I know you said it was important I still do Z. In order for that to happen I'm going to need an extension on delivering Y or get help with it so that I have time to do Z". "I know that in the past I've been able to do Z, but that isn't possible for me any more."

Something for you to practice out loud with your SO? It is always easier if you have practiced scripts first.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: G-dog on December 08, 2017, 05:54:02 PM
...
My company has changed culturally over the years to the point where the only thing that matters is the bottom line.  I understand we need to make money, but there used to be a caring attitude towards employees that paid them back in spades.

The changes have happened gradually over several years, but have suddenly added up to become a huge deal for me.
...

Many parallels with my employer ...

Me too, now my EX-employer!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: RedmondStash on December 08, 2017, 07:32:23 PM
Some really inspirational stories here. Mine doesn't feel inspirational, but I'll add it anyway.

I spent three years at a wonderful job getting to do work I really enjoyed, with people who were vocal about their appreciation. It was one of the healthier office environments I've been in.

Then, a couple of months ago, a guy who'd seemed fine when he was hired a year ago dumped a load of toxic bile on me in a private message, in response to my reaching out to him to clarify something about my role that he seemed to have misunderstood. He basically insulted my work, my work ethic, my competence, and my understanding of the industry, and he tried to set expectations for my job, even though he was nowhere in my management chain, and I've been working in this industry since he was in diapers.

I was shocked, upset, and angry. I didn't respond directly, because it was clear the guy wasn't going to listen to me; instead, I went to his manager, who agreed the guy was way out of line and said he'd talk to him.

Fast forward a month and a half, and suddenly, the situation has been reframed as a personality clash, and now I'm part of the problem. I'm getting pressure from the guy's management to see things from his POV, even though that initial incident was never resolved, and to sit down and have a meeting with him and his manager. I was uncomfortable but ultimately agreed, trying to be a team player.

That meeting was the most disturbing experience I've ever had in a work environment. It was clear to me that the guy didn't actually have an issue with me or my work, or even really understand it; he was overwhelmed and stressed out, and looking for someone to use as a punching bag. And his manager just sat there and let the guy verbally attack me; anger, hostility, and blame were just radiating off the guy the whole time.

So I gave notice. I'd told my manager about the initial incident, but I'd thought it was being handled, so I'd told him he didn't have to do anything. And then things escalated so fast there was no way in hell I was staying at that company. I barely ate or slept for the next couple of weeks, but managed to go into the office and finish up some final tasks. And then my last day came, and I was gone.

Funny thing -- I have heard at least two other people complain about the guy's behavior. So I know it's not just me. I also know that I could have escalated further up his management chain and mine, but it just wasn't worth it, because at the point where his management has been swayed to his side, it's game over and I can't win. I've seen this movie before. The more you escalate, the uglier it gets, and the more you become the problem. I wanted to leave without burning bridges, so I made my quiet exit. I know that as long as I was there, any issues the guy had would be blamed on me. Now, when he picks his next scapegoat, maybe someone in his management chain will start to see the pattern. The whole situation has left a really sour taste in my mouth, but at least I'm free of it now.

I don't know if I'm actually FIRE, but I'm certainly going to take an extended vacation for a year, or two, or ten.

And I thank my lucky stars for my FU money. Never again will I stay in a toxic situation that slowly destroys my health and sanity. And I am so grateful that I have the breathing room to put my stressed-out brain back together, and to recover from one of my more unpleasant and unsettling workplace experiences.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: arebelspy on December 08, 2017, 07:37:02 PM
I think that's a badass story, RedmondStache.

You didn't put up with poor treatment, and gave notice instead. That's the whole reason to have FU money.

Well done!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Warlord1986 on December 11, 2017, 08:32:00 AM
Mrs. Hen and Redmond Stash with the good stories. :)
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: mm1970 on December 11, 2017, 05:31:11 PM
2 good new stories, yay!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Daisy on December 11, 2017, 08:58:12 PM
...
My company has changed culturally over the years to the point where the only thing that matters is the bottom line.  I understand we need to make money, but there used to be a caring attitude towards employees that paid them back in spades.

The changes have happened gradually over several years, but have suddenly added up to become a huge deal for me.
...

Many parallels with my employer ...

Me too, now my EX-employer!

Well I know G-dog and I didn't work for the same employer, but I am wondering if rantk81 and MrsHen's were my same employer. It sure sounds familiar!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Daisy on December 11, 2017, 09:00:07 PM
I don't know if I'm actually FIRE, but I'm certainly going to take an extended vacation for a year, or two, or ten.

Well deserved. Congratulations!

And I thank my lucky stars for my FU money. Never again will I stay in a toxic situation that slowly destroys my health and sanity. And I am so grateful that I have the breathing room to put my stressed-out brain back together, and to recover from one of my more unpleasant and unsettling workplace experiences.

That is the very definition of FU money.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: kskillz on December 12, 2017, 01:37:41 PM
Friends,

(TLDR; take this job and shove it)

My 20+ year career in enterprise IT is coming to an end in 2018 and thanks to FU money, I am not panicking or frantically searching for another job.  In fact, on a daily basis I feel like I might just explode from joy.

I work on a small team of highly experienced IT system engineers for a major retailer.

This retailer leases and operates several data centers across the country and owns tens of millions of dollars worth of data center IT equipment such as servers, network switches, firewalls, storage arrays, etc.

Earlier in 2017, the CIO and board of directors kicked off an ambitious project to close all these data centers and move their entire IT infrastructure to a cloud infrastructure.  The scope of the project is enormous.  Hundreds of applications and one of the top 10 e-commerce sites in the world will need completely migrated out of data centers and into the cloud.

In September of 2017, the company decided to outsource any job related to data center IT to Tata Consulting Services, aka TCS.  Over 70 people were laid off.  Storage engineers, UNIX engineers, networking engineers, data center engineers, anyone with a job supporting or engineering data center solutions was laid off in favor of TCS taking over the work.  I was one of these layoffs.

TCS arranged with the retailer to hire a small number of those laid off to come work for TCS and continue doing their old job, but as a TCS contractor, not as an employee of the retailer.  Of course this move to TCS would get you a huge pay cut, an enormous cost increase in benefits, and officially zero paid time off.

My name was identified as a key engineer, and TCS gave me the "opportunity" to apply for my old job.  I was given about a month to decide if I wanted to join TCS.  The alternative was to train my TCS replacements and be out of a job on 2/1/18.

It took me about an hour to decide to that this was my out. 

I was given a deadline to apply to TCS.  I would have had to interview for my old job.  The day of the deadline, I received a phone call from a TCS recruiter.  The recruiter said he was calling to find out why he hadn't seen my resume submitted yet.  My reply:

"I didn't submit my resume to TCS."

**** crickets  chirp chirp chirp *****

"Uh....... may I ask why not?"

"I don't want to work for TCS."

******** 30 second pause.........  "OK then well wishes to you..."  click

It's hard to describe how I felt during that conversation.  I knew I was willingly making a choice to abandon my career.  The only thing I've ever done in my adult life to make a living was now effectively over, and I did have the opportunity to keep going, but I chose not to.  I refused to work harder for less, and it's all thanks to having FU money.

So here I am employed until 2/1/18.  I'm mostly done training my replacements, and they sure will have their work cut out for them.  I'm abandoning several high profile projects that require attention and expertise.  Good luck to them.  As my last day approaches, I will be offering my services for after 2/1/18 at a very reasonable rate of $200/hr with a 2 hour minimum.

A few of my co-workers did interview with and accept TCS positions.  Other co-workers have found new IT jobs elsewhere.  When they ask me what I'm doing, I tell them that I am done with IT and will be taking at least a year off.  The reactions are comically mixed.  Some people can't believe it and think I'm making a huge, costly mistake.  Others are very supportive with a "good for you" attitude.

My plan now after 2/1/18 is to enjoy a reasonably generous severance, then file for unemployment.  When that runs out, I'll start tapping into my backdoor ROTH for living expenses.  I expect to look for a part time job within walking distance after unemployment runs out.  There is a very nice liquor store within walking distance that is constantly hiring for clerks and stocking staff.  I will absolutely have no problem whatsoever working there for beer money.

Cheers!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Dicey on December 12, 2017, 02:23:40 PM
Nice!!!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Krolik on December 12, 2017, 02:26:16 PM
Well done Kskillz !!! Great story :-)
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Zikoris on December 12, 2017, 03:15:13 PM
What a funny coincidence - I have a friend in real life who also quit a stable job awhile ago to work part time at a liquor store. Apparently it's been going great.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: markbike528CBX on December 12, 2017, 05:25:19 PM
After seeing TCS I couldn't get TPS report out of my head.

The guy who taught me nuclear spectroscopy got himself re-classified so as to be eligible for a layoff. 
Went to work in agriculture and truck driving.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: scottish on December 12, 2017, 05:42:23 PM
Based on my experience with Indian companies, you should be able to buy lots of beer with your consulting fees.

Tata for now. 
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: GettingClose on December 13, 2017, 12:19:41 PM
Epic!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: mm1970 on December 13, 2017, 12:41:46 PM
kskillz, so glorious!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Warlord1986 on December 14, 2017, 10:26:27 AM
That was such a pleasure to read.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: acroy on December 14, 2017, 11:12:14 AM
Great stories recently - thanks!!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Mrs Hen on December 14, 2017, 11:25:23 AM
Great story from kskillz!

I've started pushing back at work.

The current project is huge, and management have realised they are going to struggle to deliver.  They have offered unlimited overtime hours to anyone who wants them.  I haven't asked for any, as I am in that place more than enough already.

The other day my very concerned manager (the one who said no to reducing my workload), asked me into the office.  Very worried I hadn't been given any overtime - lets sit down and allocate you some extra hours now.

I politely declined, while doing the happy dance in my head.  Why would I want more hours, when she has my part time request?

The look on her face was priceless
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: rockstache on December 14, 2017, 11:27:47 AM
Awesome job Mrs. Hen! That must have felt amazing!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Mrs Hen on December 14, 2017, 11:37:06 AM
Awesome job Mrs. Hen! That must have felt amazing!

Felt Gooooooood!!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: gaja on December 14, 2017, 01:49:05 PM
Well done!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Slee_stack on December 14, 2017, 02:13:09 PM
Awesome job Mrs. Hen! That must have felt amazing!

Felt Gooooooood!!
Bam!  Love it.



OT hours...  I repeatedly get the spiel that we can't get more resources and must not be overloaded if we are only working 45 - 50 hours (I average 42).  Strange, but we don't get a dime for anything past 40.


I always zone out when I hear it.  I'm pretty blunt in my response to it though.  'Well, I guess we probably won't be getting a lot of things done then...' or 'Looks like we'll get further behind...'

Not really caring if you lose your job right then and there is a fantastic feeling.


I don't doubt I've frustrated the heck out of my managers.   But I'm still here....42 hours a week.


Others can only take advantage of you if you first give them your permission.  Its been a few years since I've done that.

Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: RyanAtTanagra on December 14, 2017, 02:19:04 PM
(I average 42).  Strange, but we don't get a dime for anything past 40.
....
Others can only take advantage of you if you first give them your permission.  Its been a few years since I've done that.

But why do you continually work 42 hours if you don't get paid for it?  I'd say that's them taking advantage of you.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: RedmondStash on December 14, 2017, 03:35:50 PM
Not really caring if you lose your job right then and there is a fantastic feeling.

...

Others can only take advantage of you if you first give them your permission.  Its been a few years since I've done that.

Amen.

I've worked jobs that had long-term mandatory OT, and all I noticed was a lot of burnt-out people making a lot of mistakes, and often ultimately leaving the company and taking their knowledge and skills with them. Plus it costs $$ to recruit for, hire, and train replacements. Very cost-ineffective solution.

My pushing back on mandatory OT has always surprised people. I think a lot of managers aren't accustomed to employees who actually value themselves and make it a priority to take care of themselves, or who set clear boundaries. Which is strange because it's those who practice self-care who can continue to contribute consistent value indefinitely. I have left jobs because of boundaries I've set being disrespected, and I'm always surprised at how surprised management is when I do that. Maybe it, like FU money, is rare.

I guess even managers lose sight of long-term goals because of pressure for short-term returns. Not unlike some inexperienced investors, I suppose.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: woopwoop on December 14, 2017, 11:33:39 PM
Not as epic as some, but here's a story from when I quit my old job to work on my own business:

I had been managing around a dozen test prep tutors, and had a good relationship with my boss. He was a great boss, really he was, the best I ever had. So I gave him plenty of notice when I decided I wanted to quit - about six months, so that we could transfer my responsibilities to someone else over time. I had been working on a big curriculum project as well as handling all of the high-end clients who wanted "the best tutor you have." I came with a $250/hr price tag, but the clients we had didn't mind paying it.

I'd been working on salary and managing all of the other tutors as well as handling my own students. As the months went by, I finished up the big project. I transitioned the management to the new manager. And then I had two months left and only a handful of students to take care of. My boss came to me and said that since I didn't have the same responsibilities, he wanted to change my pay to hourly, $75/hr. This was a huge pay cut since I only had a few students left, and was only working around ten hours a week.

So I said no.

He hadn't expected this response. Every other tutor was paid $25/hr or so, so he expected me to be thrilled. But I had been expecting my old manager's salary until my quit date, which was still two months away. He didn't want to pay it, he said, because I was no longer doing management stuff. Fair enough.

But still no.

I told him if I had given him a normal two week's notice, he would have been completely screwed, and I felt it was unfair to essentially fire me two months early for getting the transition completed ahead of schedule. Of course, he could fire me, but that would mean a bunch of REALLY angry parents whose students would be losing their "premium" tutor right before the SAT was scheduled. Did he want to do that?

He hemmed and hawed and eventually paid me my manager's salary for two months while I worked happily as a normal tutor with a very light load. And then I quit for good.

My new business did so well that I saved enough to retire in only three years of work. And boom, here we are, and I'm enjoying the FIREd life in my thirties while raising my baby. It wasn't quite an F U, since he was a good guy, but it was epic enough for me :)
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: LeRainDrop on December 15, 2017, 12:48:00 AM
Hell yeah, MrsWhipple!  I love it!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: felixbf on December 15, 2017, 04:55:52 AM
Not really caring if you lose your job right then and there is a fantastic feeling.

...

Others can only take advantage of you if you first give them your permission.  Its been a few years since I've done that.

Amen.

I've worked jobs that had long-term mandatory OT, and all I noticed was a lot of burnt-out people making a lot of mistakes, and often ultimately leaving the company and taking their knowledge and skills with them. Plus it costs $$ to recruit for, hire, and train replacements. Very cost-ineffective solution.

My pushing back on mandatory OT has always surprised people. I think a lot of managers aren't accustomed to employees who actually value themselves and make it a priority to take care of themselves, or who set clear boundaries. Which is strange because it's those who practice self-care who can continue to contribute consistent value indefinitely. I have left jobs because of boundaries I've set being disrespected, and I'm always surprised at how surprised management is when I do that. Maybe it, like FU money, is rare.

I guess even managers lose sight of long-term goals because of pressure for short-term returns. Not unlike some inexperienced investors, I suppose.

Odd , that companies still push for "mandatory OT" as there is no such thing according labour law well at least where i am from..

Take for example we got sent an email that shift workers must cover Christmas and boxing day, i said flat out no!
They told me it is mandatory OT  for shift workers according to company policy, i asked them " show me this policy " and i can ask our Labour Law hot line number if a business can override the law...
10 minutes later an email came through for volunteers instead...

Then i emailed back, thanks for a moment i thought slavery was back sarcastically ..
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: boridi on December 15, 2017, 09:27:25 AM
Not as epic as some, but here's a story from when I quit my old job to work on my own business:

I had been managing around a dozen test prep tutors, and had a good relationship with my boss. He was a great boss, really he was, the best I ever had. So I gave him plenty of notice when I decided I wanted to quit - about six months, so that we could transfer my responsibilities to someone else over time. I had been working on a big curriculum project as well as handling all of the high-end clients who wanted "the best tutor you have." I came with a $250/hr price tag, but the clients we had didn't mind paying it.

I'd been working on salary and managing all of the other tutors as well as handling my own students. As the months went by, I finished up the big project. I transitioned the management to the new manager. And then I had two months left and only a handful of students to take care of. My boss came to me and said that since I didn't have the same responsibilities, he wanted to change my pay to hourly, $75/hr. This was a huge pay cut since I only had a few students left, and was only working around ten hours a week.

So I said no.

He hadn't expected this response. Every other tutor was paid $25/hr or so, so he expected me to be thrilled. But I had been expecting my old manager's salary until my quit date, which was still two months away. He didn't want to pay it, he said, because I was no longer doing management stuff. Fair enough.

But still no.

I told him if I had given him a normal two week's notice, he would have been completely screwed, and I felt it was unfair to essentially fire me two months early for getting the transition completed ahead of schedule. Of course, he could fire me, but that would mean a bunch of REALLY angry parents whose students would be losing their "premium" tutor right before the SAT was scheduled. Did he want to do that?

He hemmed and hawed and eventually paid me my manager's salary for two months while I worked happily as a normal tutor with a very light load. And then I quit for good.

My new business did so well that I saved enough to retire in only three years of work. And boom, here we are, and I'm enjoying the FIREd life in my thirties while raising my baby. It wasn't quite an F U, since he was a good guy, but it was epic enough for me :)

Hmm... this seems similar to an employer cutting an employee's pay by 20% and telling the employee they better take it because they won't be able to pay rent and groceries next month with no job. I guess sometimes the employee is the one doing the arm-twisting.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: RedmondStash on December 15, 2017, 09:42:26 AM
Not as epic as some, but here's a story from when I quit my old job to work on my own business:

I had been managing around a dozen test prep tutors, and had a good relationship with my boss. He was a great boss, really he was, the best I ever had. So I gave him plenty of notice when I decided I wanted to quit - about six months, so that we could transfer my responsibilities to someone else over time. I had been working on a big curriculum project as well as handling all of the high-end clients who wanted "the best tutor you have." I came with a $250/hr price tag, but the clients we had didn't mind paying it.

I'd been working on salary and managing all of the other tutors as well as handling my own students. As the months went by, I finished up the big project. I transitioned the management to the new manager. And then I had two months left and only a handful of students to take care of. My boss came to me and said that since I didn't have the same responsibilities, he wanted to change my pay to hourly, $75/hr. This was a huge pay cut since I only had a few students left, and was only working around ten hours a week.

So I said no.

He hadn't expected this response. Every other tutor was paid $25/hr or so, so he expected me to be thrilled. But I had been expecting my old manager's salary until my quit date, which was still two months away. He didn't want to pay it, he said, because I was no longer doing management stuff. Fair enough.

But still no.

I told him if I had given him a normal two week's notice, he would have been completely screwed, and I felt it was unfair to essentially fire me two months early for getting the transition completed ahead of schedule. Of course, he could fire me, but that would mean a bunch of REALLY angry parents whose students would be losing their "premium" tutor right before the SAT was scheduled. Did he want to do that?

He hemmed and hawed and eventually paid me my manager's salary for two months while I worked happily as a normal tutor with a very light load. And then I quit for good.

My new business did so well that I saved enough to retire in only three years of work. And boom, here we are, and I'm enjoying the FIREd life in my thirties while raising my baby. It wasn't quite an F U, since he was a good guy, but it was epic enough for me :)

Hmm... this seems similar to an employer cutting an employee's pay by 20% and telling the employee they better take it because they won't be able to pay rent and groceries next month with no job.

Several years back, I was in that situation, where my pay as an IT freelancer was cut by 15%; all freelancers' pay was cut across the board. And it had been stagnant for years previously. I actually had FU money then and could have quit, but I finished that project and returned to the team the following year as a different type of freelancer with significantly higher hourly pay. I hate when employers use their power like this. But I get that business is business, and they won't pay more than they have to.

Also, great story, Mrs. Whipple. :) It is wonderful to see someone know their worth and insist on it, knowing they can survive if the answer is leaving the job.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: JLee on December 19, 2017, 12:13:27 PM
Friends,

(TLDR; take this job and shove it)

My 20+ year career in enterprise IT is coming to an end in 2018 and thanks to FU money, I am not panicking or frantically searching for another job.  In fact, on a daily basis I feel like I might just explode from joy.

I work on a small team of highly experienced IT system engineers for a major retailer.

This retailer leases and operates several data centers across the country and owns tens of millions of dollars worth of data center IT equipment such as servers, network switches, firewalls, storage arrays, etc.

Earlier in 2017, the CIO and board of directors kicked off an ambitious project to close all these data centers and move their entire IT infrastructure to a cloud infrastructure.  The scope of the project is enormous.  Hundreds of applications and one of the top 10 e-commerce sites in the world will need completely migrated out of data centers and into the cloud.

In September of 2017, the company decided to outsource any job related to data center IT to Tata Consulting Services, aka TCS.  Over 70 people were laid off.  Storage engineers, UNIX engineers, networking engineers, data center engineers, anyone with a job supporting or engineering data center solutions was laid off in favor of TCS taking over the work.  I was one of these layoffs.

TCS arranged with the retailer to hire a small number of those laid off to come work for TCS and continue doing their old job, but as a TCS contractor, not as an employee of the retailer.  Of course this move to TCS would get you a huge pay cut, an enormous cost increase in benefits, and officially zero paid time off.

My name was identified as a key engineer, and TCS gave me the "opportunity" to apply for my old job.  I was given about a month to decide if I wanted to join TCS.  The alternative was to train my TCS replacements and be out of a job on 2/1/18.

It took me about an hour to decide to that this was my out. 

I was given a deadline to apply to TCS.  I would have had to interview for my old job.  The day of the deadline, I received a phone call from a TCS recruiter.  The recruiter said he was calling to find out why he hadn't seen my resume submitted yet.  My reply:

"I didn't submit my resume to TCS."

**** crickets  chirp chirp chirp *****

"Uh....... may I ask why not?"

"I don't want to work for TCS."

******** 30 second pause.........  "OK then well wishes to you..."  click

It's hard to describe how I felt during that conversation.  I knew I was willingly making a choice to abandon my career.  The only thing I've ever done in my adult life to make a living was now effectively over, and I did have the opportunity to keep going, but I chose not to.  I refused to work harder for less, and it's all thanks to having FU money.

So here I am employed until 2/1/18.  I'm mostly done training my replacements, and they sure will have their work cut out for them.  I'm abandoning several high profile projects that require attention and expertise.  Good luck to them.  As my last day approaches, I will be offering my services for after 2/1/18 at a very reasonable rate of $200/hr with a 2 hour minimum.

A few of my co-workers did interview with and accept TCS positions.  Other co-workers have found new IT jobs elsewhere.  When they ask me what I'm doing, I tell them that I am done with IT and will be taking at least a year off.  The reactions are comically mixed.  Some people can't believe it and think I'm making a huge, costly mistake.  Others are very supportive with a "good for you" attitude.

My plan now after 2/1/18 is to enjoy a reasonably generous severance, then file for unemployment.  When that runs out, I'll start tapping into my backdoor ROTH for living expenses.  I expect to look for a part time job within walking distance after unemployment runs out.  There is a very nice liquor store within walking distance that is constantly hiring for clerks and stocking staff.  I will absolutely have no problem whatsoever working there for beer money.

Cheers!

That's an awesome story.  I strongly encourage you to hold fast to your hourly rate and minimum -- if you spend 5 minutes responding to an email, they get invoiced for $400.
Title: Youth > FU Money
Post by: rementis on December 19, 2017, 03:35:36 PM
So, I have an amusing story from when I was a kid.  It's not based on FU money, but it bears telling because it's about having the power to walk.

At the time I'm 17, and I'm working as a dishwasher/busboy at a busy restaurant in my home town.  I'm toiling along, one with the dishwashing machine, when I remember to schedule myself off for a week the next month. 

On the schedule I black out my time as unavailable, because I was going to the beach for a week with friends.  I didn't think anything else of it because it was pretty far away and others would want the shifts anyway.

So the night before the trip I'm halfway through the dinner shift and talking with my manager.  He mentions something about tomorrow and I say "Oh, I'm out of town.  I'll be at the beach all week."  He says: "Oh, I'm sorry, I can't give you off, I need you next week."  I say:  "You are misunderstanding me, I won't be here next week, no matter what."  He says: "You are working next week or you're fired."

No more talking, just walked out the door.  I'm outside getting into my car when I see the other dishwasher dude coming out.  He says "If you quit, I quit."  LMAO so now they are in a dinner rush and have no one working the machine.  I can't even imagine the firestorm back there all night.

Moral of the story:  17 year old kids who still live at home and have plans to go to the beach don't need your dumb minimum wage job.  :)
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Apples on December 19, 2017, 07:27:52 PM
I manage a crew of teenagers on our farm all summer.  Usually we have hard working kids who enjoy that our job would totally be cool with you missing time for vacations, dentist appointments, camps, etc.  Last summer one kid had a mom who let him do a little too much of whatever he wanted.  He would slack at work, and I would point out that working and money is better than working and no money, and what would your parents say? (because my parents would have kicked my butt for this type of thing, and grounded me, and shamed me, and taught me why it's good to have a work ethic by giving me a dozen chores every day for the rest of the summer....context)  He was like "my mom would be mad, but she'd get over it, and I'd get to sleep in".  Um, wow.  So your story reminded me of the teenager without strong enough parenting at home who was about to walk off the job because it was hot, and I was making him actually work while at work.  Also, he had to stay until 5 even though that would make him late to his random get together volleyball game.  Some teenagers have so much power.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: EricL on December 20, 2017, 02:07:02 AM
I manage a crew of teenagers on our farm all summer.  Usually we have hard working kids who enjoy that our job would totally be cool with you missing time for vacations, dentist appointments, camps, etc.  Last summer one kid had a mom who let him do a little too much of whatever he wanted.  He would slack at work, and I would point out that working and money is better than working and no money, and what would your parents say? (because my parents would have kicked my butt for this type of thing, and grounded me, and shamed me, and taught me why it's good to have a work ethic by giving me a dozen chores every day for the rest of the summer....context)  He was like "my mom would be mad, but she'd get over it, and I'd get to sleep in".  Um, wow.  So your story reminded me of the teenager without strong enough parenting at home who was about to walk off the job because it was hot, and I was making him actually work while at work.  Also, he had to stay until 5 even though that would make him late to his random get together volleyball game.  Some teenagers have so much power.

Yeah.  Except rementis was a responsible teenager and blocked off his time off a calendar month in advance.  And his boss' response when he mentioned it a day prior was an ultimatum.  Rementis' story reminds me of a lot of bosses who are too lazy to do their due diligence as adults and plan ahead when confronted with information. He instead defaulted to childish bullying in lieu of accepting responsibility for his error and finding a legit solution.  And thereby caused an employee to take a knee jerk response to walk off the job along with a co-worker.

Can teenagers be lazy motherfuckers?  Absolutely!  But part of a manager's job is to know their employees.  Part of that is knowing what decisions a teenager is likely to make.  And surprise!  It's not necessarily going to be whatever values the manager's parents inculcated in them. 
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: ducky19 on December 20, 2017, 06:20:57 AM
I was thinking the same thing as EricL - those two situations sound vastly different! I likely would have done the same thing had I done the responsible thing and blocked my time a month in advance!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: partgypsy on December 20, 2017, 07:50:27 AM
That story reminds me of a story of my ex. When he was going to community college he worked as a prep cook at a very busy restaurant. He busted his butt, but noticed because he was cheerful and joking while he did his work, management felt like he wasn't working as hard as the main cook (who scowled and bitched all the time) and rode him. But the people who worked in the kitchen knew who was doing the work because they saw it (sous chef, diswashers, busers). I can't remember the exact reason why this happened, but he was given an ultimatum or that he would be fired. He thought for a few seconds and instead took off his apron and gave it to the manager and said, no I quit. He rides his bike home, wondering how he is going to tell his parents that he no longer has a job. The doorbell rings, and 3 other people from the kitchen are at the door, saying what he did was awesome, and that they all quit too! It was during the dinner rush.

I guess the morale of the story, is if you are going to be an *sshole manager, you need to accept the consequences when you push people too far. 
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: mm1970 on December 20, 2017, 01:15:18 PM
That story reminds me of a story of my ex. When he was going to community college he worked as a prep cook at a very busy restaurant. He busted his butt, but noticed because he was cheerful and joking while he did his work, management felt like he wasn't working as hard as the main cook (who scowled and bitched all the time) and rode him. But the people who worked in the kitchen knew who was doing the work because they saw it (sous chef, diswashers, busers). I can't remember the exact reason why this happened, but he was given an ultimatum or that he would be fired. He thought for a few seconds and instead took off his apron and gave it to the manager and said, no I quit. He rides his bike home, wondering how he is going to tell his parents that he no longer has a job. The doorbell rings, and 3 other people from the kitchen are at the door, saying what he did was awesome, and that they all quit too! It was during the dinner rush.

I guess the morale of the story, is if you are going to be an *sshole manager, you need to accept the consequences when you push people too far.
Yep!

I admit, that I can be rather surly at times.  This was true as a teen.

When I was in college, I was on work-study the first year or two, working the campus pizza joint.  First making pizza, then moved to the cashier position, because I was dating another pizza maker. Whatever.  Then I started dating another cashier.  Ha.  Showed that manager.

Anyway, the problem with being the cashier is that I didn't really like to take any crap.  And at an expensive private college, a lot of silver spoon kids gave me crap.  So I gave them crap right back.  (Things like just being snotty, or asking for something on the menu.  The man in charge of the kitchen would not make something if it wasn't on the menu.  He was not a college student, this was his FT job.  Or asking for the Monday special on Weds.  Again, it's not going to happen.)

My manager would lecture me on my attitude.  I just shrugged and said "sorry, but they are jerks, and I'm going to be jerks right back".

So here's the thing:
1.  I was one of the few cashiers whose drawer always balanced out at the end of the shift.
2.  I always picked up extra shifts.  Every. Single. Sunday., I would get a phone call at 2pm to come in early, when my shift started at 4 pm.  Because the woman (also not a student, this was her job) who was on shift at 2 pm never showed up until around 5 pm.  I was reliable, if reliably cranky.  The only time I said no was during finals when the manager actually called around to the various computer clusters to find me.
3.  I had to deal with a lot of sexual harassment from students at that job.  Customers.  Screw that.

In the end, I worked there 1.5 years to 2 years (can't remember which). Eventually, sophomore/ junior year I was on ROTC scholarship and my engineering load was hard enough I couldn't swing a PT job anymore.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: EricL on December 20, 2017, 08:40:45 PM
And the amazing thing is that, teenagers being who they are, even if they have something at stake like car payments, romantic involvement or disciplinarian parents to worry about, there's a chance they'll say fuck it anyway.  In America we treat teens as guilty until proven 21.  So even teens that are trustworthy would just as soon be hung for being a wolf as for being a sheep. 

That's all I got on that.  Amazingly, I may have an FU story of my own in a week or so.  Certain things need to pan out first though.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Imma on December 21, 2017, 01:32:07 PM
My experience from jobs as a teenager is that managers think they can get away with everything when it's them vs. a 16 year old. Some really enjoy that power trip. I know I pushed back a few times against that kind of shit and I would definitely support my (hypothetical) kid if they stood up for themselves. My parents never cared much about what I did either way, but my s/o worked in a grocery store where he was treated very badly and his parents really tried to get him to submit to that abuse.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Secretly Saving on December 21, 2017, 03:12:51 PM
Well, MMM community, yesterday was my last day, which makes today my first day officially off!  YES! It feels great!   I woke up happy for the first time in a months.  My spouse was happy because I am already moving back to the old me and the kids are happy knowing that their parent is going to have more time for them.

A toxic, really super shitty coworker (and her just as awful family) was enough to get me to use FU money and walk away from a job that I used to love and that I'm genuinely good at.  It was affecting my stress levels and mood while at work and those feelings had even moved outside of normal work hours.  And yet, I stayed.  However, once my kids were being picked on at school by her kid and it wasn't resolving itself within a reasonable amount of time, that was the end of that!  I put my family's health and well-being first!

Interestingly, there were so many complaints from clientele about her (and really some laughable insane stories of her behavior) and yet nothing appeared to be done about it. I thought for sure the people in charge would see the toxicity and let her go, but so far she's only had meetings and been talked to.  I wondered why in the hell am I bothering with this insanity?  Why am I forcing myself to have to interact with someone so damn unhealthy and genuinely cruel to others?  And once that clicked in, I gave notice.  People close to me know that my resignation is a form of meaningful protest.  I don't have to stand idly by and be a part of a community that allows her to hurt others and so starting today, I DIDN'T. 
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: G-dog on December 21, 2017, 03:16:51 PM
@Secretly Saving - hallelujah and congratulations! This is great to read.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: TexasRunner on December 21, 2017, 03:58:48 PM
@Secretly Saving - Fantastic!!!!!

You need to post some of those stories over in the Overheard at Work thread (when you are ready) so that it can be shared and laughed about.  I'm sure some of its pretty funny in a sad way.  The Ask A Manager forum is full of stories of the crazies and that helped me through my last shitty job / job transition.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: RedmondStash on December 22, 2017, 11:20:33 AM
Well, MMM community, yesterday was my last day, which makes today my first day officially off!  YES! It feels great!   I woke up happy for the first time in a months.  My spouse was happy because I am already moving back to the old me and the kids are happy knowing that their parent is going to have more time for them.

A toxic, really super shitty coworker (and her just as awful family) was enough to get me to use FU money and walk away from a job that I used to love and that I'm genuinely good at.  It was affecting my stress levels and mood while at work and those feelings had even moved outside of normal work hours.  And yet, I stayed.  However, once my kids were being picked on at school by her kid and it wasn't resolving itself within a reasonable amount of time, that was the end of that!  I put my family's health and well-being first!

Interestingly, there were so many complaints from clientele about her (and really some laughable insane stories of her behavior) and yet nothing appeared to be done about it. I thought for sure the people in charge would see the toxicity and let her go, but so far she's only had meetings and been talked to.  I wondered why in the hell am I bothering with this insanity?  Why am I forcing myself to have to interact with someone so damn unhealthy and genuinely cruel to others?  And once that clicked in, I gave notice.  People close to me know that my resignation is a form of meaningful protest.  I don't have to stand idly by and be a part of a community that allows her to hurt others and so starting today, I DIDN'T.

Good for you, Secretly Saving! I swear I could have written parts of this word for word myself, except that I don't have kids. It is maddening when a toxic coworker's behavior is not effectively addressed -- or even acknowledged -- in the workplace, especially when it's affecting more than one person. I am glad for you that you had FU money to get yourself out of there.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Greenback Reproduction Specialist on December 22, 2017, 11:34:57 AM

OT hours...  I repeatedly get the spiel that we can't get more resources and must not be overloaded if we are only working 45 - 50 hours (I average 42).  Strange, but we don't get a dime for anything past 40.


I always zone out when I hear it.  I'm pretty blunt in my response to it though.  'Well, I guess we probably won't be getting a lot of things done then...' or 'Looks like we'll get further behind...'

Not really caring if you lose your job right then and there is a fantastic feeling.

I don't doubt I've frustrated the heck out of my managers.   But I'm still here....42 hours a week.

Others can only take advantage of you if you first give them your permission.  Its been a few years since I've done that.


Lol sound very familiar ; )
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: TheWifeHalf on December 23, 2017, 06:38:54 PM
I got a private message that my original post at times, didn't make sense. I wish I could use alcohol as an excuse but can't. I rewrote it, this is the best I can do:


From all indications, son is a very good worker. Kind of like his Dad, can do it all, except Dad cannot work on computers.

Let me see if I can put this in order:
1. Son worked in IT at a hospital. Over the last 10 years, this particular ‘hospital group’ started springing up all over town, they seemed to be really growing.
2. There seem to be a lot of hospitals in this area that now have the colors of this group.
3. Son got a new boss. I could tell it was not a good match right from the beginning.
4. Several of the vendors of the IT dept wanted to hire son but whenever they talked to son’s boss about it, they were told if they did, they would never be a vendor of this hospital group again. So of course, they did not. I can’t remember the exact words, but son’s boss told him he wouldn’t work anywhere else (he must really be good at what he does!)
5. In the meantime, this hospital group bought an independent hospital, proceeding with plans to change it, partly in its IT dept, so son worked over there a lot. So son was in their computer as an employee of the same company that purchased them.
6. I don’t know who brought it to the FTC’s attention, but the hospital group went all the way to the Supreme Court on appeal (who declined to hear the takeover case) and then started making plans to divest the hospital. The FTC said the takeover would give the hospital group too much power, mostly in raising prices.  FTC  appointed a third-party monitor to oversee the divestiture.
7. Like I said, son was in the system as the hospital group’s employee, so he went over to work at the hospital that was once again gaining its independence. Seems like there were several people in the IT dept that son used to work with so he got all the references he needed.
8. I know quite a few nurses who work at that hospital and they all love it there. They have been there 25 – 35 years!
Bye Bye, old boss!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Eckhart on December 24, 2017, 02:16:16 PM
I'm not exactly sure if this fits here, but his stash would have been used if necessary (he gave me permission to add this, because he said it's public knowledge)
My son worked in the IT department of a hospital, part of a company that owns a lot of hospitals and medical stuff around here and keeps buying more. He knows his networking stuff, and I know he's an excellent worker, so is valuable, especially with all the buildings they're buying that need to be 'networked.'

He got a new boss and he came to the realization that he did not care to work for him. A couple of the vendors that came in were interested in hiring son, but he 'heard' that they were told if they take him, the company would no longer be needing them. So he stayed.

A few years ago (maybe 6-7-8?) that company bought an independent hospital and they were working on bringing it up to their level of computer/networking/ some other computer word.

The beginning of 2017 the FTA  said nope, it will give them too much power to raise prices, and the Supreme Court agreed, the process was started to make that lone hospital independent again. It was supposedly the first hospital that they had 'broken up.'

The files they had still had old files, so my son was still in the system. There were a lot of people over there that had left too, gave him glowing reports, so he now works for the newly independent hospital, as their network guy.

We've taught our kids, you play by the rules, but if there's a problem, find ways to work within them to get what you need.

I know people who have worked at that hospital for 15-20-25 years and love their jobs.

Good for your son!  Sounds like he had to weather the storm, but is now sailing with clear skies.  When you love your job, it really shows in the work you do.  I'm guessing he is a SWAMI =)
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: katscratch on December 24, 2017, 05:07:25 PM
I was thinking the same thing as EricL - those two situations sound vastly different! I likely would have done the same thing had I done the responsible thing and blocked my time a month in advance!

Same - and actually my son has had something similar happen to him. He works for the same company in his university town and our hometown, and the university manager has accidentally scheduled him several times when he's in hometown for holidays. The manager has called him at shift start and apologizes right away, but it's still awkward. Today (in town for the holiday), my son was debating whether he should somehow remind his away manager he's not available. He decided it's ultimately not his responsibility once he's submitted his hours and the schedule has been posted, and that a reminder may be interpreted negatively by his manager.


I don't have any FU money stories but I love this thread. I've had more than a few I Will Hold To What I Think Is Right situations at work, though. The most recent was arguing a policy about on call shifts. The upshot is that call shifts started at 3pm and we were expected to call in by 1pm to see if we were needed at 3pm. In my mind this meant we really were on call by 2:15pm as we're required to be within 45 minutes of the workplace. This seemed obvious to me, especially from an hourly employee perspective, but it was quite a dramatic reaction from my supervisor and management and hadn't been questioned in 20+ years. I won.

I've had other situations like that over the years, some more dramatic and led to the firing of people above me in the management chain. It helps that, even though I don't make a lot of money, I know my skill set and personality are valuable in my local job market. Or maybe because I don't make a lot of money I know I can always get another $15/hr job. Professionally-licensed staff don't have quite the same flexibility ;)
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Plina on December 25, 2017, 02:19:59 PM
I am asking for a sabbatical in the end of february with start in August. About a year ago I had pretty much enough of my manager that gave me a shit rise of salary. The manager that hired me quit after four months and one of my coworkers becomes the manager after a six months hiring process and delat with it a way tha I didn’t like.. I was pissed off for 2 weeks after that but had bought a new apartment and lived in it for 2 weeks so I was not prepared to relocate to another city. After being pissed off I decided to save money for a sabbatical and let him deal with finding a replacement. He lost me there and have continued doing it with the next discussion about salaries and recent micromanaging. I absolutely hate micromanaging. Thereafter I have been doing my job but in relation to him nothing extra.

 Here the company have to allow you to take a sabbatical for studying. They can postpone it for 6 months hence the 6 months notice. And I dont want to live my clients or colleagues in a lurch as I like most of them. I will probably take some online courses at university or at least sign up for them to keep my social security. I am planning to come back in june next year which will make him jump of joy because I work in consulting with a fixed salary. Summertime can be really slow in the job especially if you haven’t set up work for summer. When I get back from the sabbatical I am planning to start looking for a new job so I am not planning to stay there longterm. I actually applied for two other positions before Christmas because they sounded interesting and was for an interview for the other. As I haven’t heard back I guess I didn’t get it so I am back to plan for a sabbatical.

Funny thing is that I am heading one of Three development groups within the company and the two other  leaders have left the position for different reasons. I let it slip to one of the members that I was the only original left and WHO know when he needed to replace me. It got totally silent in the phone and he said that it sounded worrisome and hope that I didn’t have something planned. I had to lie that I didn’t. Interesting enough in a meeting with the groups he had made a comment about how he had the confidence in my ability to head to group etc..

So fuck you money is nice to have. If my company doesn’t approve of the leave I am starting to look for something else immediately.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: mstr d on December 27, 2017, 01:32:11 AM
I had a truck delivery to France, they called that it was very very extremely urgent, I should not stop because the entire factory was waiting for it and they needed it today! I said I expect to be there at 18:00, We will be waiting for you after closing hours 17:00 because we really need it before tomorrow

So I drive immidiatly to them, and when I arrived at the gate, it was closed.  I called the office, and this france lady said every one was at home and I could unload it the next day. Bud you told us it was very urgent I asked, and I stayed polite. You can unload it tomorrow at 08:30 when the company is open.

I had to sleep in my truck at the gate from 18:00 to next day 08:30.

They next morning they unloaded it and there was no urgentsy.

And a couple weeks later, they also called they needed it very urgent. Really urgent this time it's real! We really need it today!, it can't wait until tomorrow. We will defitnly wait for you until you arive after closing hours. Other frights get reschudeled that is a lot of work/phone calls and other drivers have to do more loads and drive extra.
So I drive to them with a lot of haste. And when I arrive it's closed again, and the same lady tells me I can sleep here and unload tomorrow at 08:30.
This happened a third time.

And after the third time, my boss was really pissed off, because he had to priorize this fright before others and make a lot of calls. And I had to sleep in my truck again. So I backed my truck up to the front gate , and activated my tipper and unloaded it all at there front gate.

I wish I could see there faces when they arrived at there work the next morning. My boss did not do business with them afterwards and he supported what I did:P.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Imma on December 27, 2017, 08:34:38 AM
And after the third time, my boss was really pissed off, because he had to priorize this fright before others and make a lot of calls. And I had to sleep in my truck again. So I backed my truck up to the front gate , and activated my tipper and unloaded it all at there front gate.

I wish I could see there faces when they arrived at there work the next morning. My boss did not do business with them afterwards and he supported what I did:P.

This is one of the best stories in this thread. I really hate customers that pretend their order is very urgent, so we make all kinds of special arrangements, only to find out it wasn't urgent after all.

To expect someone to sleep in their truck 3(!) times, is just so rude, they deserve this kind of delivery. Luckily your boss felt the same.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Loren Ver on December 27, 2017, 08:40:46 AM
And after the third time, my boss was really pissed off, because he had to priorize this fright before others and make a lot of calls. And I had to sleep in my truck again. So I backed my truck up to the front gate , and activated my tipper and unloaded it all at there front gate.

I wish I could see there faces when they arrived at there work the next morning. My boss did not do business with them afterwards and he supported what I did:P.

This is one of the best stories in this thread. I really hate customers that pretend their order is very urgent, so we make all kinds of special arrangements, only to find out it wasn't urgent after all.

To expect someone to sleep in their truck 3(!) times, is just so rude, they deserve this kind of delivery. Luckily your boss felt the same.

Yes! 3 times, that is nuts.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: meghan88 on December 27, 2017, 10:07:38 AM
Based on my experience with Indian companies, you should be able to buy lots of beer with your consulting fees.

Tata for now.

Hahaha ... good one!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: gypsy79 on December 27, 2017, 10:22:08 AM
My DH was offered a job once and before he accepted, he negotiated leave without pay for a dream vacation we had already scheduled and booked for a couple of months after his start date. This trip took a lot of planning time and also involved some nonrefundable costs.

As the time got closer, his new boss said there was no way he would be able to go on the trip. DH remained calm, replied something noncommittal, and talked to me about it that night. We decided that he was going to tell his boss the next day, you gave your word before I started and there is no negotiation here. I'm taking this trip. (We had a 6 month emergency fund in addition to our trip fund, so decided we didn't care if DH got fired.)

DH delivered the line, boss was shocked, we took the trip, and nobody got fired or quit.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: RedmondStash on December 28, 2017, 10:19:33 AM
My DH was offered a job once and before he accepted, he negotiated leave without pay for a dream vacation we had already scheduled and booked for a couple of months after his start date. This trip took a lot of planning time and also involved some nonrefundable costs.

As the time got closer, his new boss said there was no way he would be able to go on the trip. DH remained calm, replied something noncommittal, and talked to me about it that night. We decided that he was going to tell his boss the next day, you gave your word before I started and there is no negotiation here. I'm taking this trip. (We had a 6 month emergency fund in addition to our trip fund, so decided we didn't care if DH got fired.)

DH delivered the line, boss was shocked, we took the trip, and nobody got fired or quit.

It's so important to hold employers & managers accountable for their promises. Good for you.

I'd also recommend getting things like this in writing before you sign that job offer on the dotted line. Even an email exchange creates a paper trail.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: ketchup on December 28, 2017, 10:55:34 AM
My DH was offered a job once and before he accepted, he negotiated leave without pay for a dream vacation we had already scheduled and booked for a couple of months after his start date. This trip took a lot of planning time and also involved some nonrefundable costs.

As the time got closer, his new boss said there was no way he would be able to go on the trip. DH remained calm, replied something noncommittal, and talked to me about it that night. We decided that he was going to tell his boss the next day, you gave your word before I started and there is no negotiation here. I'm taking this trip. (We had a 6 month emergency fund in addition to our trip fund, so decided we didn't care if DH got fired.)

DH delivered the line, boss was shocked, we took the trip, and nobody got fired or quit.
Wow, that is fantastic.  My girlfriend did something similar a few years ago when she needed to get time off for an event she needed to go to for her side gig, and the boss said the policy was no time off for that month (November in what was basically retail, so I get it).  After they said no, she basically said fine, the day before that will be my last day.  And that's what led to her side gig becoming her only gig (and it's since grown nicely).
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: msilenus on December 28, 2017, 01:14:01 PM
My DH was offered a job once and before he accepted, he negotiated leave without pay for a dream vacation we had already scheduled and booked for a couple of months after his start date. This trip took a lot of planning time and also involved some nonrefundable costs.

As the time got closer, his new boss said there was no way he would be able to go on the trip. DH remained calm, replied something noncommittal, and talked to me about it that night. We decided that he was going to tell his boss the next day, you gave your word before I started and there is no negotiation here. I'm taking this trip. (We had a 6 month emergency fund in addition to our trip fund, so decided we didn't care if DH got fired.)

DH delivered the line, boss was shocked, we took the trip, and nobody got fired or quit.

I'm curious if the manager turned out to be psycho or just oblivious?
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: gypsy79 on December 28, 2017, 01:30:30 PM
My DH was offered a job once and before he accepted, he negotiated leave without pay for a dream vacation we had already scheduled and booked for a couple of months after his start date. This trip took a lot of planning time and also involved some nonrefundable costs.

As the time got closer, his new boss said there was no way he would be able to go on the trip. DH remained calm, replied something noncommittal, and talked to me about it that night. We decided that he was going to tell his boss the next day, you gave your word before I started and there is no negotiation here. I'm taking this trip. (We had a 6 month emergency fund in addition to our trip fund, so decided we didn't care if DH got fired.)

DH delivered the line, boss was shocked, we took the trip, and nobody got fired or quit.

I'm curious if the manager turned out to be psycho or just oblivious?

He was a bit of a psycho, but also a good guy who was new to managing and just hadn't quite figured out boundaries yet. He was actually pretty fun (see also psycho, lol) and we ended up becoming friends with him.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: VoteCthulu on December 28, 2017, 02:35:16 PM
My DH was offered a job once and before he accepted, he negotiated leave without pay for a dream vacation we had already scheduled and booked for a couple of months after his start date. This trip took a lot of planning time and also involved some nonrefundable costs.

As the time got closer, his new boss said there was no way he would be able to go on the trip. DH remained calm, replied something noncommittal, and talked to me about it that night. We decided that he was going to tell his boss the next day, you gave your word before I started and there is no negotiation here. I'm taking this trip. (We had a 6 month emergency fund in addition to our trip fund, so decided we didn't care if DH got fired.)

DH delivered the line, boss was shocked, we took the trip, and nobody got fired or quit.

I'm curious if the manager turned out to be psycho or just oblivious?

He was a bit of a psycho, but also a good guy who was new to managing and just hadn't quite figured out boundaries yet. He was actually pretty fun (see also psycho, lol) and we ended up becoming friends with him.
In my experience, most "emergencies" at work are purely in the mind of some manager. I can't count the number of times I've heard "This has to be done today" and then it wasn't actally needed until weeks later.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: msilenus on December 28, 2017, 03:31:53 PM
He was a bit of a psycho, but also a good guy who was new to managing and just hadn't quite figured out boundaries yet. He was actually pretty fun (see also psycho, lol) and we ended up becoming friends with him.

Definitely not a psycho in the sense I meant, then.  Sounds like he was a bit out of his depth and finding his feet --but ultimately educable.  Great outcome for everyone.

Thanks for replying back.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: better late on December 28, 2017, 03:46:41 PM
I had a truck delivery to France, they called that it was very very extremely urgent, I should not stop because the entire factory was waiting for it and they needed it today! I said I expect to be there at 18:00, We will be waiting for you after closing hours 17:00 because we really need it before tomorrow

So I drive immidiatly to them, and when I arrived at the gate, it was closed.  I called the office, and this france lady said every one was at home and I could unload it the next day. Bud you told us it was very urgent I asked, and I stayed polite. You can unload it tomorrow at 08:30 when the company is open.

I had to sleep in my truck at the gate from 18:00 to next day 08:30.

They next morning they unloaded it and there was no urgentsy.

And a couple weeks later, they also called they needed it very urgent. Really urgent this time it's real! We really need it today!, it can't wait until tomorrow. We will defitnly wait for you until you arive after closing hours. Other frights get reschudeled that is a lot of work/phone calls and other drivers have to do more loads and drive extra.
So I drive to them with a lot of haste. And when I arrive it's closed again, and the same lady tells me I can sleep here and unload tomorrow at 08:30.
This happened a third time.

And after the third time, my boss was really pissed off, because he had to priorize this fright before others and make a lot of calls. And I had to sleep in my truck again. So I backed my truck up to the front gate , and activated my tipper and unloaded it all at there front gate.

I wish I could see there faces when they arrived at there work the next morning. My boss did not do business with them afterwards and he supported what I did:P.

That is an awesome story. Well done! and good on your boss.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: G-dog on December 28, 2017, 04:50:35 PM
My DH was offered a job once and before he accepted, he negotiated leave without pay for a dream vacation we had already scheduled and booked for a couple of months after his start date. This trip took a lot of planning time and also involved some nonrefundable costs.

As the time got closer, his new boss said there was no way he would be able to go on the trip. DH remained calm, replied something noncommittal, and talked to me about it that night. We decided that he was going to tell his boss the next day, you gave your word before I started and there is no negotiation here. I'm taking this trip. (We had a 6 month emergency fund in addition to our trip fund, so decided we didn't care if DH got fired.)

DH delivered the line, boss was shocked, we took the trip, and nobody got fired or quit.

I'm curious if the manager turned out to be psycho or just oblivious?

He was a bit of a psycho, but also a good guy who was new to managing and just hadn't quite figured out boundaries yet. He was actually pretty fun (see also psycho, lol) and we ended up becoming friends with him.
In my experience, most "emergencies" at work are purely in the mind of some manager. I can't count the number of times I've heard "This has to be done today" and then it wasn't actally needed until weeks later.

Or not needed or used at all. That happened to me so many times (office job, writing reports and pulling data because god forbid they’d figure out what they need, plan and prepare for the meeting, or look it up themselves)
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Mrs Hen on December 29, 2017, 03:37:40 PM
Wow.  I just finished (re)reading the entire thread, and there are some amazing, inspirational stories here.

It's really helped me come to terms with my own situation, and make a big decision.

I've been working in my field for nearly 30 years, and 21 years with my current employer.  I am good at what I do, work with some great people, and am respected.  I have a good pay and benefits package.  So far, so good.

My company has changed culturally over the years to the point where the only thing that matters is the bottom line.  I understand we need to make money, but there used to be a caring attitude towards employees that paid them back in spades.

The changes have happened gradually over several years, but have suddenly added up to become a huge deal for me.

I am currently working for my 7th line manager in 6 years.  In the last 2 years, I have dealt with my Mother's breast cancer (she's fine now), my Father's rapid decline and death, my Grandmother's gradual decline and death, my own diagnosis with adult onset diabetes, and planned my wedding (the good bit!).

Funnily enough, I ended up in a very fragile mental state , and I was prescribed medication for stress and depression.  These have been slowly reducing over the summer, with a view to coming off them altogether very soon.

Being respected in my role is wonderful, but it has meant I've become the "go-to girl" for everything.  I took on as much as I could over and above my primary role, but I'm aware most of my colleagues are only doing the primary role.  I am not paid any extra for doing the extra work.  I realised I was not coping, went to my manager (promoted into the role 3 months ago), explained my concerns about my health, and asked for my workload to be temporarily reduced for a couple of months while a particular large project was delivered.  Once that was done, I was very happy to take on the extra stuff again.

My manager said no.  No discussion.  My colleagues would be upset, and she wouldn't like that.  So no.

Cue lots of tears (in private!), and a text to my husband asking him if we could afford for me to quit.  He said we could afford for me to do whatever I needed to do.

My doctor has put my medications back up to the maximum dose.  I did not take any time off sick.

I did, however, start looking at our savings in a different way.  We crunched some numbers and realised we were in a pretty good place.  Not FI, but well on our way.  A line from way back in this thread came back to me.  I may need A job, but I don't need THIS job.

I do love my primary role, so I've come up with a plan of action, and I've put in application to go part time.  The company has 3 months to give me an answer, but I think I have a good chance.  If they say no, I will ask to be demoted to a level where there is no expectation of accepting extra tasks.  If they reject that, I'll quit.

So a HUGE thank you to everyone who has posted here.  Some good decisions early in my working life, living within my means, and a nudge (facepunch) from here has made me realise I actually have FU money, and I've had the nerve to use it.

Sorry for the long post!!

UPDATE:

Today my employer has APPROVED my part time request!!!!!

I don't have words to describe the relief, but I'm also really proud of myself for doing the right thing for ME.

FU money rocks!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: chrisgermany on December 29, 2017, 04:02:12 PM
Congrats! So now its time to practice saying NO to requests and prevent the part time job becoming full time with half pay.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: RyanAtTanagra on December 29, 2017, 04:37:18 PM
Jesus, your manager said no to you reducing your workload because it would upset your coworkers, while you were CRYING to her about your excessive workload?!  What about YOU being upset?  Sincere congrats on getting your part time request approved, but that manager deserves the biggest 'fuck.  you.' possible.  If I were that manager's manager they would be fired.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Bicycle_B on December 30, 2017, 01:32:43 AM
Good for you, MrsHen!  Best wishes for a peaceful and healthy new year.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Trimatty471 on January 01, 2018, 04:46:10 PM
That's the biggest downside for me of working at a small company. Only one person can take a vacation at the time and in those type of companies there's often a strong hierarchy. Which means if you're the new person (and you can be the new person for 10 years) you're basically screwed. I'm lucky that my coworkers don't care about christmas, so I get to take the week between christmas and NYE off, but I didn't have a summer holiday. Coworkers have kids, so they want to spend that time with their kids (understandably) and I'm stuck in the office working overtime for the entire summer.
Imma, the fall is a lovely time to travel. Could you plan something for then so you have something to look forward to in the dog days of summer? I used to go to DC a lot. The best time was in early September. Lovely weather, no lines, and shoulder season rates. The kids were back in school and hadn't had time to plan their rampages field trips yet. It was heavenly.

One of the great joys of FIREing is that we have discovered that the worker bees have a very fixed window to enjoy a whole lot of opportunities when it comes to recreation and tourism, and since you are post-unemployed, you get to enjoy the best places during the times when the masses have to stay chained to their desks.  We relocated to the heart of the Amish country in PA, earlier this year. We had been visiting the area for two decades, and had a huge concern about moving to a place that sees eight million tourists a year. We had spend many Saturdays in years past, crawling in tourist traffic, and didn't want to turn that into a lifestyle. After a few months of being here, and unwinding a bit, we finally figured out that the ONLY time our neighborhood sucks is from about 10AM to 6PM on Saturdays, from mid-spring to Christmas. That is less than 10% of the time, and we now have a very good handle of every farm road, and back alley in the land, and how to use them to get around the lines of out of state cars that stack up on those days. We just smile when people from out of town say, "you live in a beautiful place, but oh, God, that traffic".

We have also used this concept as we spent a few years roaming around the states in our motorhome, and rarely did anything the would potentially involve crowds on a weekend, or peak times. We made darn sure to find quiet places to hide on the big summer holidays. The wonderful world of RVing can really turn to shit on holidays like the 4th of July, when the campgrounds are 110% full. Occasionally full of families with a litter of screaming little brats and a $300 pop-up camper that blew two tires on the way there. Due to awesome parenting and social skills, they then decide that the way to address the sugared up, screaming little spawn, at 11pm, is to make the bonfire bigger, kick up the drinking a notch, and turn up the sorry-assed country music they and half the county are "enjoying". The amazing part is that, by the last week of August, chucklenuts like this are long gone, and great places are very lightly attended. If you really want your experience to be wonderful and uncrowded, push the limits and get there a week or two before the places are about to roll up the sidewalks for the winter.  Places like the Black Hills, SD, or the coast of Maine, absolutely kick ass in the second half of September, and 80% or more of the crowds are gone. Yellowstone is another great example. They have been setting attendance records every year, and by noon on a typical mid-summer day, the place looks like a street in Manhattan. Get there the week after labor day, and it's like another planet. Without kids to accommodate, being able to take time off in fall and spring is a gift.

Yes.  This is the reason why I only take vacations in the fall.  Beautiful weather and no crowds!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: zolotiyeruki on January 01, 2018, 07:11:51 PM
Yes.  This is the reason why I only take vacations in the fall.  Beautiful weather and no crowds!
Homeschooling your kids has similar advantages. Tour DC in mid October? No problem. Disney world in January, with almost no lines? Yup!

(DW is looking at photos of the parks today. Some rides had a wait time of over five hours. The line of cars waiting to park at Magic Kingdom stretched all the way to Hollywood Studios. )
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: marty998 on January 02, 2018, 01:14:26 AM
Yes.  This is the reason why I only take vacations in the fall.  Beautiful weather and no crowds!
Homeschooling your kids has similar advantages. Tour DC in mid October? No problem. Disney world in January, with almost no lines? Yup!

(DW is looking at photos of the parks today. Some rides had a wait time of over five hours. The line of cars waiting to park at Magic Kingdom stretched all the way to Hollywood Studios. )

Who seriously waits in line for over 5 hours????

I do remember the signs Disneyworld and Universal Studios... signs of the "You have 6 hours wait from here" variety. My brother and I schemed a way of being this.

When we were there* the first thing we did was tell mum and dad to go to the coffee shop at the entrance. My brother raced around the park one way and I went the other way to every single ride and we picked up the express line passes - the ones where you can take a card and come back at a designated time of day and jump to the front of the queue. We picked up 8 for every ride - just in case we wanted a second ride :)

They're big parks obviously, but after half an hour we had cards for every ride. We then went round the park backwards... because the majority of people enter the gate, turn left and go around clockwise. Beat the queues and have a much better time all round.

*December 1999, things may have changed since then :)
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: shelivesthedream on January 02, 2018, 07:09:54 AM
I went to Disneyland Paris once when I was about 11 (October 2001 maybe?) and I remember having to pay extra for those skip-to-the-front passes. My parents bought them for exactly one ride for me and one for my brother at the end of the day after we had deemed them the best rides we had been on all day by far and one parent went on with each of us. Mine was called something like Thunder Mountain and my brother's was a haunted house thing. A Friday in October outside the usual UK half term, though, so waits were not insane.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: zolotiyeruki on January 02, 2018, 08:00:02 AM
*December 1999, things may have changed since then :)
Yeah, unfortunately Disney caught on to that, and clamped down on it--you could only get fast passes every X minutes.  And then a couple years ago at Disneyworld, they revamped the whole system so you can only have 3 fast passes total at the beginning of the day, and you can't get any more until you use all three, and then you can only have one at a time.  For people like you and me that understand the system, it was a significant downgrade :(
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: AMandM on January 03, 2018, 08:31:13 AM
And after the third time, my boss was really pissed off, because he had to priorize this fright before others and make a lot of calls. And I had to sleep in my truck again. So I backed my truck up to the front gate , and activated my tipper and unloaded it all at there front gate.

I wish I could see there faces when they arrived at there work the next morning. My boss did not do business with them afterwards and he supported what I did:P.

I LOVE THIS STORY!  Hurray for your boss, too.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: MoneyStacher on January 03, 2018, 03:49:31 PM
This story 100% reminded me of Office Space. If you haven't seen it, rent it tonight!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: sequoia on January 04, 2018, 12:47:07 AM

And after the third time, my boss was really pissed off, because he had to priorize this fright before others and make a lot of calls. And I had to sleep in my truck again. So I backed my truck up to the front gate , and activated my tipper and unloaded it all at there front gate.

Curious, if you can share, what is the material that you dumped in the front gate? I would love to see their faces when they come in the morning :)
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Mrs Hen on January 11, 2018, 10:11:37 AM
Jesus, your manager said no to you reducing your workload because it would upset your coworkers, while you were CRYING to her about your excessive workload?!  What about YOU being upset?  Sincere congrats on getting your part time request approved, but that manager deserves the biggest 'fuck.  you.' possible.  If I were that manager's manager they would be fired.
I kept it together enough to only cry in private, but yes, that's about the size of it.
Congrats! So now its time to practice saying NO to requests and prevent the part time job becoming full time with half pay.
The part time shifts start in July, but they've already come to me with another project.  I've said no, and pointed out I wouldn't be there so much.  This appeared to take them by surprise. 

I'm not entirely sure this battle is over, but for the moment I feel as though the weight of the world has been lifted.

Happy new year everyone.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: mm1970 on January 11, 2018, 10:36:19 AM
Jesus, your manager said no to you reducing your workload because it would upset your coworkers, while you were CRYING to her about your excessive workload?!  What about YOU being upset?  Sincere congrats on getting your part time request approved, but that manager deserves the biggest 'fuck.  you.' possible.  If I were that manager's manager they would be fired.
I kept it together enough to only cry in private, but yes, that's about the size of it.
Congrats! So now its time to practice saying NO to requests and prevent the part time job becoming full time with half pay.
The part time shifts start in July, but they've already come to me with another project.  I've said no, and pointed out I wouldn't be there so much.  This appeared to take them by surprise. 

I'm not entirely sure this battle is over, but for the moment I feel as though the weight of the world has been lifted.

Happy new year everyone.
I've worked PT a couple of different phases in life, and here is what I found:

1.  It took work to regularly walk out the door on time.  But when I had kid pick-up, and a deadline to do so, that made it easier.  It took a month or two to train my coworkers that if they needed data from me for Friday morning, you have to ask by 1 pm on Thu, because I'm out the door at 3:30 pm.  Or I can get it to you by 8 am (because I started early).

2.  In some positions, where there were late meetings and such and no kid pickup issues, it was easier to just come in late and maybe combine that with a long lunch (like take a walk AND eat lunch AND go grocery shopping, or to the pharmacy).

In both cases I was working shorter days, not fewer days. YMMV.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Slow&Steady on January 22, 2018, 11:31:59 AM
This isn't very epic or epic FU money but it did take a lot of courage to go through with it.  We have some savings but not FU savings and we really need to maintain insurance coverage right now.

My company was purchased this past summer and it seemed like it would be a really great thing.  I loved the values that the new company publishes, my very worthless boss was quickly removed from his position, they promised to put a lot of money into this place to upgrade things, all great stuff.  While although the published values are great they are not really at the top of the priority list and we were given a new facility manager that does not "practice what he preaches" when it comes to these values, he also appears to think women should be at home not at work (but I don't have concrete examples of this).  They replaced my worthless boss with somebody that has zero experience in my field, without even opening interviews for the role (I was never considered), several upgrades were made but not in the areas that they were actually needed.  And best of all we all have a lot more paperwork busy work that they like to get all pissed off about if you don't do it but they don't want to tell you what they expect from you beforehand.  We were all given new titles (mine was originally an entry level title that I refused to except), new (more expensive) health insurance, no raises, and it appears that they will not be giving out bonuses.  On top of all of these changes we found out we were pregnant (had been trying for about 6 months) about 2 weeks after the new company took over.  In general everyone recommends you do not try to find a new job while you are pregnant because benefits, FMLA, and specifically short-term disability/maternity leave.  So when I first started getting kicked around I decided that I would just grin a bare it until after the baby came then look for something new. 

It kept getting worse and around Nov I decided that I am good at what I do and maybe I can find another job that will accept my pregnancy.  First I went to my old job to see if they had anything open, they were going through a re-organization and couldn't offer me a position but if I was willing to wait until the re-organization was over they would love to have me back.  Then I saw a posting that looked like something I would be really interested in but it had been open for forever and was technically out of my reach.  I applied but didn't hear anything very quickly so I reached out to my old job again to see if they knew anybody at this new place, what kind of environment it was and if they would put my name in the hiring managers ear.  I got a call back from my old job saying they had just talked to the hiring manager and was forwarding my resume to him.  Fast forward about a month and I got an offer that was very flexible around my pregnancy and was a 30+% raise from what I am currently making. 

I start Monday, insurance will kick in before baby is due, maternity leave is not paid but I will make so much more through 2018 that it doesn't matter.  Savings allowed me to say FU now and not worry about paying for COBRA and taking unpaid leave vs waiting until baby got here, taking maternity leave, coming back to this toxic place before turning in 2 week notice, and then going to the new job.  Again, not very epic but I am really excited to be leaving this environment and to get a huge (to me) raise to do it. 

Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: AmyS on January 22, 2018, 12:02:29 PM
This isn't very epic or epic FU money but it did take a lot of courage to go through with it.  We have some savings but not FU savings and we really need to maintain insurance coverage right now.

My company was purchased this past summer and it seemed like it would be a really great thing.  I loved the values that the new company publishes, my very worthless boss was quickly removed from his position, they promised to put a lot of money into this place to upgrade things, all great stuff.  While although the published values are great they are not really at the top of the priority list and we were given a new facility manager that does not "practice what he preaches" when it comes to these values, he also appears to think women should be at home not at work (but I don't have concrete examples of this).  They replaced my worthless boss with somebody that has zero experience in my field, without even opening interviews for the role (I was never considered), several upgrades were made but not in the areas that they were actually needed.  And best of all we all have a lot more paperwork busy work that they like to get all pissed off about if you don't do it but they don't want to tell you what they expect from you beforehand.  We were all given new titles (mine was originally an entry level title that I refused to except), new (more expensive) health insurance, no raises, and it appears that they will not be giving out bonuses.  On top of all of these changes we found out we were pregnant (had been trying for about 6 months) about 2 weeks after the new company took over.  In general everyone recommends you do not try to find a new job while you are pregnant because benefits, FMLA, and specifically short-term disability/maternity leave.  So when I first started getting kicked around I decided that I would just grin a bare it until after the baby came then look for something new. 

It kept getting worse and around Nov I decided that I am good at what I do and maybe I can find another job that will accept my pregnancy.  First I went to my old job to see if they had anything open, they were going through a re-organization and couldn't offer me a position but if I was willing to wait until the re-organization was over they would love to have me back.  Then I saw a posting that looked like something I would be really interested in but it had been open for forever and was technically out of my reach.  I applied but didn't hear anything very quickly so I reached out to my old job again to see if they knew anybody at this new place, what kind of environment it was and if they would put my name in the hiring managers ear.  I got a call back from my old job saying they had just talked to the hiring manager and was forwarding my resume to him.  Fast forward about a month and I got an offer that was very flexible around my pregnancy and was a 30+% raise from what I am currently making. 

I start Monday, insurance will kick in before baby is due, maternity leave is not paid but I will make so much more through 2018 that it doesn't matter.  Savings allowed me to say FU now and not worry about paying for COBRA and taking unpaid leave vs waiting until baby got here, taking maternity leave, coming back to this toxic place before turning in 2 week notice, and then going to the new job.  Again, not very epic but I am really excited to be leaving this environment and to get a huge (to me) raise to do it.

That is ENORMOUSLY epic!!!! Looking for a new job while pregnant takes some serious ovaries, woman. I bow before you. Don't downplay this - this is one of the best stories on the thread, from my point of view.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Daisy on January 22, 2018, 12:38:45 PM
This isn't very epic or epic FU money but it did take a lot of courage to go through with it.  We have some savings but not FU savings and we really need to maintain insurance coverage right now.

I love new FU money stories. OK, maybe it wasn't technically EPIC, but it was an awesome story using your FU money status to improve your working conditions. I think that is one of the best uses of FU money - improve your circumstances from a position of strength, because you can!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Capt j-rod on January 22, 2018, 12:44:54 PM
I don't know if this qualifies for epic but it happened none the less. The DW is a doc that decided to come back to where we grew up to practice medicine. We were pregnant with our first child when she took her job. We negotiated maternity leave and all started well. As time went on she got busier and busier. We asked that they hire another doc but that was not an option. We continued to work and got pregnant with #2. Her partner that owned the practice offered her a contract making significantly less and deleted the maternity portion of the contract. We nicely declined and he greeted her with a copy box for her belongings and escorted her off the property. Nice guy right? We took a job with the hospital because we wanted to be close to grandparents and loved where we lived. Her practice literally exploded over night. Soon she was 70-80 hours a week and miserable. We once again begged for more partners, but the hospital was un able to find anyone... for 18 months. Finally we drew a line in the dirt and gave them a deadline to make changes. They drug their feet and got very angry when she resigned. AMAZINGLY four weeks later they found another doc.
Had it not been for MMM we would never have made the changes to allow the switch. After the first doc escorted my wife from the property, we started to pay off debt and save $$$ like a fiend. We have gotten 3 "offers" to come back and we still laugh hysterically. We took a 35% cut in pay, but the DW works 3 days a week and quality of life has gone up tremendously. We can't save 60% of the pay anymore, but I can still keep 30% if we stick to the plans. Having a wife and mother back in our home is priceless!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Finallyunderstand on January 22, 2018, 01:45:46 PM
I don't know if this qualifies for epic but it happened none the less. The DW is a doc that decided to come back to where we grew up to practice medicine. We were pregnant with our first child when she took her job. We negotiated maternity leave and all started well. As time went on she got busier and busier. We asked that they hire another doc but that was not an option. We continued to work and got pregnant with #2. Her partner that owned the practice offered her a contract making significantly less and deleted the maternity portion of the contract. We nicely declined and he greeted her with a copy box for her belongings and escorted her off the property. Nice guy right? We took a job with the hospital because we wanted to be close to grandparents and loved where we lived. Her practice literally exploded over night. Soon she was 70-80 hours a week and miserable. We once again begged for more partners, but the hospital was un able to find anyone... for 18 months. Finally we drew a line in the dirt and gave them a deadline to make changes. They drug their feet and got very angry when she resigned. AMAZINGLY four weeks later they found another doc.
Had it not been for MMM we would never have made the changes to allow the switch. After the first doc escorted my wife from the property, we started to pay off debt and save $$$ like a fiend. We have gotten 3 "offers" to come back and we still laugh hysterically. We took a 35% cut in pay, but the DW works 3 days a week and quality of life has gone up tremendously. We can't save 60% of the pay anymore, but I can still keep 30% if we stick to the plans. Having a wife and mother back in our home is priceless!

Family time is what life is all about!  Awesome!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: iluvzbeach on January 22, 2018, 02:17:22 PM
Two really fantastic, Epic FU Money stories in a row. Love them both and kudos to the posters!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: mm1970 on January 23, 2018, 10:44:48 AM
I don't know if this qualifies for epic but it happened none the less. The DW is a doc that decided to come back to where we grew up to practice medicine. We were pregnant with our first child when she took her job. We negotiated maternity leave and all started well. As time went on she got busier and busier. We asked that they hire another doc but that was not an option. We continued to work and got pregnant with #2. Her partner that owned the practice offered her a contract making significantly less and deleted the maternity portion of the contract. We nicely declined and he greeted her with a copy box for her belongings and escorted her off the property. Nice guy right? We took a job with the hospital because we wanted to be close to grandparents and loved where we lived. Her practice literally exploded over night. Soon she was 70-80 hours a week and miserable. We once again begged for more partners, but the hospital was un able to find anyone... for 18 months. Finally we drew a line in the dirt and gave them a deadline to make changes. They drug their feet and got very angry when she resigned. AMAZINGLY four weeks later they found another doc.
Had it not been for MMM we would never have made the changes to allow the switch. After the first doc escorted my wife from the property, we started to pay off debt and save $$$ like a fiend. We have gotten 3 "offers" to come back and we still laugh hysterically. We took a 35% cut in pay, but the DW works 3 days a week and quality of life has gone up tremendously. We can't save 60% of the pay anymore, but I can still keep 30% if we stick to the plans. Having a wife and mother back in our home is priceless!
This is pretty epic.  Work life balance is really important.  I've heard horror stories from doc friends about workloads.  One doc friend's wife was complaining that 2 of the 4 docs were going to be gone.  I said "there is no reason why your husband's office cannot bring someone else in temporarily."  I thought this was important because one of the 2 that was out was on mat leave (someone I know), and it's not like you can't predict that.

Our kids' pediatrician is a hard working guy and has 3 kids, about my kids' ages.  He works at an office with 5 other pediatricians, and they used to share space with urgent care.

My best friend was the pharmacist at Urgent care.  I remember having dinner once and she starts off on a rant at how lazy our pediatrician is.  I don't remember the details, but he had slowly refused to do overtime and at one point negotiated cutting his hours down to 35 a week or so.  I remember this being near the time his 3rd kid was born and his first was starting sports (he's a volunteer coach).

I looked at her and said "wait a minute.  YOUR pediatrician is in the same office.  A woman.  SHE just took a 9 MONTH LEAVE OF ABSENCE to go take care of a sick mother AND refused to come back after the 9 months.  You have no problem with that?  ALL of the other docs have been picking up her slack."

Anyway, it was such a double standard.  She said "oh, you know, you are right!"  It's easy to think someone ELSE needs to be working longer hours, isn't it?
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: AmyS on January 23, 2018, 12:02:20 PM
I don't know if this qualifies for epic but it happened none the less. The DW is a doc that decided to come back to where we grew up to practice medicine. We were pregnant with our first child when she took her job. We negotiated maternity leave and all started well. As time went on she got busier and busier. We asked that they hire another doc but that was not an option. We continued to work and got pregnant with #2. Her partner that owned the practice offered her a contract making significantly less and deleted the maternity portion of the contract. We nicely declined and he greeted her with a copy box for her belongings and escorted her off the property. Nice guy right? We took a job with the hospital because we wanted to be close to grandparents and loved where we lived. Her practice literally exploded over night. Soon she was 70-80 hours a week and miserable. We once again begged for more partners, but the hospital was un able to find anyone... for 18 months. Finally we drew a line in the dirt and gave them a deadline to make changes. They drug their feet and got very angry when she resigned. AMAZINGLY four weeks later they found another doc.
Had it not been for MMM we would never have made the changes to allow the switch. After the first doc escorted my wife from the property, we started to pay off debt and save $$$ like a fiend. We have gotten 3 "offers" to come back and we still laugh hysterically. We took a 35% cut in pay, but the DW works 3 days a week and quality of life has gone up tremendously. We can't save 60% of the pay anymore, but I can still keep 30% if we stick to the plans. Having a wife and mother back in our home is priceless!

Totally epic!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Zamboni on January 24, 2018, 02:59:26 AM
Great stories, Slow&Steady and capt j-rod!

Long ago I was at a trade show for printing companies, and as swag they typically give away slick posters that so you remember how their awesome printers. One of the posters had a beautiful photo of a tree frog on it, and underneath the tree frog it said in big letters "Qualified employees don't grow on trees!"

My colleague and I grabbed two of those, trimmed them to cut the name of the printing company off the bottom, and put them up at work in two parts of the building. One of them got subsequently dramatically ripped down about two years later by a manager in an EPIC tantrum over one of "his guys" leaving gradually but in a scorched earth fashion (his guy was near normal retirement age and had claimed duress due to bullying, went on extended paid medical leave with a doctor's note for mental health, then sued the company for not reigning in the manager.) The dramatic ripping down of my poster made me believe the bullying part . . . although I already thought that manager was an ass.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: SquareD_01 on January 27, 2018, 08:50:08 AM
I'm hoping to be able to add to this thread next week.  Notice goes in on Monday all thanks to FU money!!!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Secretly Saving on January 28, 2018, 09:13:52 PM
Good luck!  It feels great!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Daisy on January 28, 2018, 09:24:22 PM
I'm hoping to be able to add to this thread next week.  Notice goes in on Monday all thanks to FU money!!!

We expect a report soon.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Sibley on January 29, 2018, 08:20:11 AM
I'm hoping to be able to add to this thread next week.  Notice goes in on Monday all thanks to FU money!!!

Are you my coworker? She just gave notice!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: markbike528CBX on January 29, 2018, 12:45:16 PM
I'm hoping to be able to add to this thread next week.  Notice goes in on Monday all thanks to FU money!!!

Are you my coworker? She just gave notice!

Hoping for unlikely coincidence.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Sibley on January 29, 2018, 02:01:30 PM
I'm hoping to be able to add to this thread next week.  Notice goes in on Monday all thanks to FU money!!!

Are you my coworker? She just gave notice!

Hoping for unlikely coincidence.

And sorry to disappoint. Based on a bit of prior post stalking, not the same company - wrong fiscal year end. But that would have been cool.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Daisy on February 05, 2018, 06:39:30 PM
Anticipatory FU story coming in:

My wife and I moved recently and last year she wasn't able to have Christmas with her family. This year, they're flying out and we'll spend some time with them; the first Christmas she'd have spent with them in a few years, and their first time visiting us.

She asked off for the 26th of December and was denied PTO - back over three months ago. So she's going to call out sick. If they fire her, so be it. It's ridiculous that with so much notice, in her line of work, she "can't" take that time off when family is in town. We've got the cash to deal with her getting fired if that's what happens. Feelsgoodman

Most excellent. It's a great feeling to look your boss in the eye and dare him to fire you that way. FU money is awesome. My guess is they will shrivel in fear and just let it pass. It would be dumb of them to make a big deal out of it.

So what happened with this?
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Daisy on February 05, 2018, 06:40:44 PM
   Here is a short one that will warm your heart. Longtime friend and former coworker works at megacorp. He works from home in IT but in the bizarro world of LIMS systems for pharmaceutical company. Supports a dozen or so sites around the world and is sharp as a tack, easily 3-4x the productivity of the average Joe. He makes very good 6 figure income, bonus, LTI in a LCOL area. He is 49, paid off house, completely FI and a single part time dad.
His boss dumps a metric ass load of work on him and she laughs about it. The laughing part was an error.
He says, "you know, I think I am going to just retire or go part time. I really am working too many hours now and this ass load of work you laugh about is really not funny.  I might be convinced to work a maximum of 20 hours a week with no travel, no stupid meetings, and no overtime. And I mean no overtime!"  She freaks out and is flying in next week to talk about it. My guess is he will tell her he is done and she can take her ass load of work to some other donkey or he will consult at $250-300 an hour when he feels like it. I asked him if he uses a sling to support his enormous balls. :) details to follow.

This is going to be gooood...let us know what happens!

So what happened with this?
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: homestead neohio on February 06, 2018, 07:07:36 AM
Paging @GnomeErcy and @Blindsquirrel  with bat signal to get @Daisy some answers.

I'm especially curious about the LIMS admin story.  I've known a few LIMS admins and they have such specialized knowledge and have almost always customized the crap out of the off the shelf systems to meet a company's needs/wants.  Pissing this person off is a bad idea.  Even if they don't break things prior to leaving, finding someone who can understand what they've built and keep it going can take a long time.  When this stuff is used to make release decisions for regulated products, taking a long time can be very bad, depending on inspection frequency.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Daisy on February 06, 2018, 09:56:45 AM
Thanks for tagging them. I didn't think to do that.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Blindsquirrel on February 11, 2018, 11:44:30 AM
     Well, the jury is still out, the place he works at started offering packages for folks to leave at about the same time this happened, so my friend has stuck it out, he hopes to be able to get a package and walk out the door with some extra cash and draw unemployment for the first few months of his "retirement". To further that game he has upped his insolence a bit and has taken the approach of "Welp, if they give me a package, great! If they don't, it does not matter because they are going to get 40 hours of work a week and that is about it. Boss can dump whatever the heck she wants to on my list of S%$T to do, doesn't mean it is going to get done. People in hell want ice water."  His response to the giant mess of work was to go on vacation to Key West for a couple of weeks. Pretty much the absolute definition of F-U in my book. He is a very genial fellow but once he decides I am done with this crap, I think he may just say F-U (literally!) walk.

   That said, he read the copy of "Your Money or Your Life" I gave him and he is probably going to bail out as a full time worker this year. Whether he does that with a months notice and helps them out as a very highly paid consultant working on his lap top from Key West, takes a package (I think there is no way in hell they offer him one because he really is worth a couple of average high level people or he was when I worked with him), or drops his badge and company lap top off at the the security desk some random day has yet to be determined.  My guess is he agrees to work as a consultant 2 days a week remotely for awhile but do not know.  He has F-U money and has held off on actually saying, F-U.  However, lots of coworkers are shaking in their boots about the reductions in force. Having F-U money brings peace and serenity where ever it goes!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: AMandM on February 12, 2018, 06:58:20 PM
This isn't is very epic

FTFY
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: GnomeErcy on February 13, 2018, 09:36:11 AM
Anticipatory FU story coming in:

My wife and I moved recently and last year she wasn't able to have Christmas with her family. This year, they're flying out and we'll spend some time with them; the first Christmas she'd have spent with them in a few years, and their first time visiting us.

She asked off for the 26th of December and was denied PTO - back over three months ago. So she's going to call out sick. If they fire her, so be it. It's ridiculous that with so much notice, in her line of work, she "can't" take that time off when family is in town. We've got the cash to deal with her getting fired if that's what happens. Feelsgoodman

Most excellent. It's a great feeling to look your boss in the eye and dare him to fire you that way. FU money is awesome. My guess is they will shrivel in fear and just let it pass. It would be dumb of them to make a big deal out of it.

So what happened with this?

Sorry, it's been a while since I have checked this. She ended up going in late and leaving early. Things at work turned around quite a bit after I'd posted so we had a bit of a change of heart haha
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: firelight on February 15, 2018, 09:59:26 PM
Catching up on this thread! Love all the stories, keep them coming!

Special shout-out to the ladies who used the FU money power before/during/after maternity leave. It's one of the hardest times to do so due to all the changes happening inside and outside your body and in family, to add work changes to it is pretty awesome!!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: barbaz on February 16, 2018, 12:27:27 AM
It’ll be a while until I have my own stories, but recently my grandparents were offered close to 700k€ for their garden plot. There’s no house on that land, only a 60sqm (650 sq feet) bungalow.

They declined. There’s nothing they would want to buy with that money, except a new garden which would inevitably be smaller and further away from everything else.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Dicey on February 16, 2018, 12:35:41 AM
It’ll be a while until I have my own stories, but recently my grandparents were offered close to 700k€ for their garden plot. There’s no house on that land, only a 60sqm (650 sq feet) bungalow.

They declined. There’s nothing they would want to buy with that money, except a new garden which would inevitably be smaller and further away from everything else.
They sound smart and badass!

Now, I must ask: Why do you not consider a bungalow a house? Isn't it just a type of house, albeit on the smaller side?
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: barbaz on February 16, 2018, 06:18:54 AM
It’ll be a while until I have my own stories, but recently my grandparents were offered close to 700k€ for their garden plot. There’s no house on that land, only a 60sqm (650 sq feet) bungalow.

They declined. There’s nothing they would want to buy with that money, except a new garden which would inevitably be smaller and further away from everything else.
They sound smart and badass!

Now, I must ask: Why do you not consider a bungalow a house? Isn't it just a type of house, albeit on the smaller side?
Ok, technically it is a house. I just wanted to point out that there is no luxury McMansion on this land that would justify the price. It's just 2500sqm (27k sq feet) of conifers, lawns, and fruit trees.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Dicey on February 16, 2018, 07:01:54 AM
It’ll be a while until I have my own stories, but recently my grandparents were offered close to 700k€ for their garden plot. There’s no house on that land, only a 60sqm (650 sq feet) bungalow.

They declined. There’s nothing they would want to buy with that money, except a new garden which would inevitably be smaller and further away from everything else.
They sound smart and badass!

Now, I must ask: Why do you not consider a bungalow a house? Isn't it just a type of house, albeit on the smaller side?
Ok, technically it is a house. I just wanted to point out that there is no luxury McMansion on this land that would justify the price. It's just 2500sqm (27k sq feet) of conifers, lawns, and fruit trees.
Hmmm, 27k sq. feet is a McMansion, luxurious though you say it is not. Is it so large that you grow conifers, lawns and fruit trees inside? I'm kidding (sort of), but are you saying it is a small house on a large wooded lot?
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: barbaz on February 16, 2018, 07:09:21 AM
Hmmm, 27k sq. feet is a McMansion, luxurious though you say it is not. Is it so large that you grow conifers, lawns and fruit trees inside? I'm kidding (sort of), but are you saying it is a small house on a large wooded lot?
Yes, 27k is the size of the lot, not the house.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Dicey on February 16, 2018, 07:25:16 AM
Hmmm, 27k sq. feet is a McMansion, luxurious though you say it is not. Is it so large that you grow conifers, lawns and fruit trees inside? I'm kidding (sort of), but are you saying it is a small house on a large wooded lot?
Yes, 27k is the size of the lot, not the house.
Man, my brain is slow.  I blame the insomnia. So the bungalow-sized house is 650 s.f. and it's on 2700 s.f. of verdant land? In my part of the world, that price would be crazy low. Just a point of clarification to understand what youre describing. There is no denying from whence badassity flows in your family. What an awesome legacy!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Daisy on February 16, 2018, 03:23:37 PM
Anticipatory FU story coming in:

My wife and I moved recently and last year she wasn't able to have Christmas with her family. This year, they're flying out and we'll spend some time with them; the first Christmas she'd have spent with them in a few years, and their first time visiting us.

She asked off for the 26th of December and was denied PTO - back over three months ago. So she's going to call out sick. If they fire her, so be it. It's ridiculous that with so much notice, in her line of work, she "can't" take that time off when family is in town. We've got the cash to deal with her getting fired if that's what happens. Feelsgoodman

Most excellent. It's a great feeling to look your boss in the eye and dare him to fire you that way. FU money is awesome. My guess is they will shrivel in fear and just let it pass. It would be dumb of them to make a big deal out of it.

So what happened with this?

Sorry, it's been a while since I have checked this. She ended up going in late and leaving early. Things at work turned around quite a bit after I'd posted so we had a bit of a change of heart haha

I'm sorry to say that I am disappointed.

I was using your story as an example to others about having FU money. How could they make your wife work that day?!? Others were inspired with your story.

Please come up with a new FU story for me to spread around.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: cosine88 on February 17, 2018, 02:25:05 PM
On a Thursday afternoon my bosses were off-site, and I was pretty bitter about the low pay and the long commute. I signed a new job offer, then I gave them email-notice that my last day was Friday/tomorrow. While they were out of the office I made my rounds and said goodbye to all the decent coworkers. A bunch of people in my department set up a going away party for me before the bosses could stop it. Despite being bitter they sort of had to show up anyway and be nice, at least publicly.

I had three weeks between the two jobs, and I had already wanted to spend a week rock climbing in Mexico with friends who were going. So the next Monday I began a 3-week trip instead of a 1-week trip. Felt so good, and while I'm not FIRE yet, it made me really happy to show up at a place that gave me a better offer; and trading my old 60-minute commute for a 5-minute bike ride really has made a yuuge improvement in my life.

The previous position made me feel trapped, and the low pay ironically made me afraid of losing my job over fear of being too demanding. Now that I make more, I oddly feel more liberated to ask for more again.

Getting the new offer wasn't FU money, but it was such a liberating feeling leaving a toxic job for more money, nicer people and a shorter commute. It's worth all of the effort it takes to hunt for a new one, and now I have time to pursue real estate to actively work towards FIRE.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Loren Ver on February 18, 2018, 02:33:06 PM
This is by far my FAVORITE thread and I really want to contribute.  So I have two stories, they aren’t mine, but my dad’s.  He is the reason I always made sure we had a little pile stashed away just in case.

A little background, my dad retired from the Air Force after about 20 years when he was in his early 40s.  He suddenly and tragically passed away at the age of 54 and 11 months due to a genetic heart condition that was never caught.  But he did get in about 15 vital and fantastic years of retirement instead of dying at a desk.  He has always been my hero for showing me the power of having a plan and that you don’t need to do what everyone else was doing.  These stories are after he retired so he had plenty of walking away money.

My dad always liked people and enjoyed helping them, so after retiring he became a life insurance salesman.   I remember as a kid seeing my dad going off to study for his test.  That had a real impact on me, seeing someone I respected actually take the time to learn something new and work for a goal.  Anyway, after being on the job for a few years he was contacted by an older couple that wanted to change over their current insurance company to his.
 
He met with them and looked over all the policies and such.  It turned out that if they changed to his company they would lose out on a really good, well priced policy they currently had.  So, he told them how to restructure and supplement what they currently had to meet their new needs so they wouldn’t need a whole new policy nor need to change companies.  Sure he didn’t make a sale, but he was able help out this nice couple and he felt pretty good about it.

A few days later his boss figured out what happened and called him into the office.  He told my dad “your job here is to sell insurance, not help people.” And my dad replied “And that’s why I don’t work here anymore,” and he walked out.    That was the last day my dad ever sold insurance.  As a kid you can imagine the impact this had on me and how I thought about my dad.

The second story is more about attitude and not needed to put up with garbage 😊.
 After a few years of having no employment a friend of my dad’s was looking for someone that could teach political science at the local commuter college.   They were getting desperate.  The pay wasn’t very good and they couldn’t find anyone.  So, since my dad was a political science/geography masters he decided teaching college might be fun and took the job.  Things went well for the first semester, though my dad HATED wearing a tie and nice (read uncomfortable) shoes, but he was always good about dressing the part.  In the second semester one of the higher up muckity mucks asked my dad to park over in the field so that the students coming in late could find a place to park.  This did not go over well. My dad was not going to park his jaguar in the mud so some late comers could have better parking.  Out of respect for the students my dad did continue teaching until the end of the semester (he never did tell us where he parked, but I can tell you it wasn’t in the mud) and then quit.  After that he declared he would not wear another tie or pair of uncomfortable shoes except for weddings and funerals. 

And he didn’t.  The last time he wore a tie was for my wedding.  He was happy about it because it matched my mom’s outfit perfectly and he was always good about dressing the part😊.  He died less than a year later.   

Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Palindrome on February 18, 2018, 02:56:41 PM
Your dad sounded like a super bad ass! I love that he put people over profits, with the insurance sales job. He sounds like an amazing man- you must miss him terribly. 54 is such a young age. I'm glad he got to see you get married, before he passed away.

This is by far my FAVORITE thread and I really want to contribute.  So I have two stories, they aren’t mine, but my dad’s.  He is the reason I always made sure we had a little pile stashed away just in case.

A little background, my dad retired from the Air Force after about 20 years when he was in his early 40s.  He suddenly and tragically passed away at the age of 54 and 11 months due to a genetic heart condition that was never caught.  But he did get in about 15 vital and fantastic years of retirement instead of dying at a desk.  He has always been my hero for showing me the power of having a plan and that you don’t need to do what everyone else was doing.  These stories are after he retired so he had plenty of walking away money.

My dad always liked people and enjoyed helping them, so after retiring he became a life insurance salesman.   I remember as a kid seeing my dad going off to study for his test.  That had a real impact on me, seeing someone I respected actually take the time to learn something new and work for a goal.  Anyway, after being on the job for a few years he was contacted by an older couple that wanted to change over their current insurance company to his.
 
He met with them and looked over all the policies and such.  It turned out that if they changed to his company they would lose out on a really good, well priced policy they currently had.  So, he told them how to restructure and supplement what they currently had to meet their new needs so they wouldn’t need a whole new policy nor need to change companies.  Sure he didn’t make a sale, but he was able help out this nice couple and he felt pretty good about it.

A few days later his boss figured out what happened and called him into the office.  He told my dad “your job here is to sell insurance, not help people.” And my dad replied “And that’s why I don’t work here anymore,” and he walked out.    That was the last day my dad ever sold insurance.  As a kid you can imagine the impact this had on me and how I thought about my dad.

The second story is more about attitude and not needed to put up with garbage 😊.
 After a few years of having no employment a friend of my dad’s was looking for someone that could teach political science at the local commuter college.   They were getting desperate.  The pay wasn’t very good and they couldn’t find anyone.  So, since my dad was a political science/geography masters he decided teaching college might be fun and took the job.  Things went well for the first semester, though my dad HATED wearing a tie and nice (read uncomfortable) shoes, but he was always good about dressing the part.  In the second semester one of the higher up muckity mucks asked my dad to park over in the field so that the students coming in late could find a place to park.  This did not go over well. My dad was not going to park his jaguar in the mud so some late comers could have better parking.  Out of respect for the students my dad did continue teaching until the end of the semester (he never did tell us where he parked, but I can tell you it wasn’t in the mud) and then quit.  After that he declared he would not wear another tie or pair of uncomfortable shoes except for weddings and funerals. 

And he didn’t.  The last time he wore a tie was for my wedding.  He was happy about it because it matched my mom’s outfit perfectly and he was always good about dressing the part😊.  He died less than a year later.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Smokystache on February 18, 2018, 05:18:03 PM
....And my dad replied “And that’s why I don’t work here anymore,” and he walked out...   

Boom. I would never be able to think this quickly in a situation like this. Epic.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: cosine88 on February 18, 2018, 08:23:29 PM
Loren, your dad sounds like he was a great person.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Mesmoiselle on February 18, 2018, 09:28:18 PM
I'm in traveling healthcare, and because of my stash I am able to take long breaks between assignments without too much worry. Today was my last day and I got questioned about 100 times from my coworkers about what I was doing next. A few were a little wide eyed when I smiled ear to ear and said "I'm unemployed!!"

Every contract starts out promising and I think "This is a nice place! Maybe I can stay here" but then after about 3 months I am just pacing in my cage waiting to run away as soon as the door opens. And now I'm free!!!!!!!  It's not really an epic FU story, but it allows me to keep building my stash and not be afraid of the insecurity of the job schedule I have. Honestly since I graduated with my degree I have not been able to keep a full time job for more than 9 months. Not because I'm a bad employee! I still have standing offers for pretty much any job I have ever left (the fact that ALL of them are still unfilled or have high turnover should tell you something). I am just counting down the years to FIRE. But these long breaks let me breathe a little bit. And seek needed medical and dental care lol. A vacation to go to the doctor!

The plan this time is just to get a part time job over the holidays, now that my health insurance is coming through COBRA for a few months. My expenses are so low that even with a part time job I should be able to increase the 'stache.

We're clones, except my husband has great insurance so I don't have to deal with COBRA. I only worked 7 months last year. *high five*
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Loren Ver on February 19, 2018, 04:43:26 PM
....And my dad replied “And that’s why I don’t work here anymore,” and he walked out...   

Boom. I would never be able to think this quickly in a situation like this. Epic.

I think 20 years in the Air Force teaches you some skills.  This might be one of them :).

You guys are so kind :):)
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Maenad on February 25, 2018, 07:11:46 AM
This story may not be so epic, but my FU money gave me some great leverage this week.

Backstory: A few months ago at work I discovered a significant error on a large number of documents, none of which were owned by me or my department. I made the rounds of the "owning" managers, who all looked at the issue and basically said, "Yep, that's a problem". Dissatisfied with this response, I escalated to site management and said SOMEONE NEEDS TO OWN CORRECTING THIS ISSUE. SOMEONE WHO IS NOT ME. It got temporarily assigned to another group, I told them everything I knew about it, and washed my hands of the whole mess.

You know what happened next. I got an email this week from my boss stating that they want me to lead up the correction efforts and a meeting would be set up to discuss it. My boss and I met for another reason a couple days later (before the aforementioned meeting was held), and I said, "Every manager I spoke to about this was unwilling to give any resources to actually fix the issue, and those people are needed. I can't do this on my own, and if I start a project without dedicated resources it's just setting me up to fail. I won't do it."

He clarified that they only need me to do the resource estimates on my own (which I can do), and confirmed that the project won't actually start without those resources being committed. So, I didn't have to dig my heels in like I thought, but my FU money gave me the option if I needed it.

Granted, my boss is a good person, and it's not likely he would have done something that cavalier, but if SHTF, FU money is sooooo awesome.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: BTDretire on February 25, 2018, 07:55:19 AM
 This isn't my story and I'm not even sure there is a lot of FU money, But enough!
 My soon to be son-in-law works in the landscaping industry. I'll call him Bill.
From what I have seen go on in the business, there is a lot of employee
movement, people leave start their own business often taking other
employees and customers with them. Constant change seem to be the rule.
  So, Bill's best friend also worked in the company,
his friend quit to go to another company.
 Bill was called in by his boss, I don't know the exact conversation,
but the company was worried he would pass some type of
customer info to his best friend.
 Bill, said if you don't trust me, I can't work here.
 The company offered Bill a reasonable severance package, that
he took on his next job interview. He had the new companies lawyer
look it over, the lawyer said don't sign it. It not only said he wouldn't sue,
it made it difficult for other companies to hire him.
 He had a new job in two days.
  The new company did hire him and will pay him for the next 3 weeks,
 even though he will not start working until after three weeks.
 He had the new job on the second day after being fired.
  I suspect he has a lawsuit, but because of the field he's in,
he's probably better off in the future if he just forgets about it.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Dicey on February 25, 2018, 08:48:54 AM
I think this is my favorite thread on this whole forum. Thanks for the new posts. Keep 'em coming, folks!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: grantmeaname on February 25, 2018, 10:18:09 AM
Now that I've finally read through this giant tome of a thread, I can post a colleague's quitting story. There was no gap in the middle so no FU money involved, but I love the sheer ballsyness of it.

I have a good job with only two drawbacks. The first issue is is the horrific expectations for working hours, which is unfortunately par for the course for the industry. The other is the pay; London is an expensive city but salaries are startlingly low compared to the cost of living. The Brexit vote did not help because Britain imports everything that it has, and so the price of basically everything jumped and then has stayed high since. Management told us "help is on the way", but  nothing happened to the pay scale at our annual reviews two months after Brexit. But then nothing happened to the pay scale 14 months after either. I'm leaving over it, but in a not-at-all epic way.

One of the more senior people in my team went in to the boss, set down a contract for a lateral move to a comparable market for a 50% raise, and said "it would be fiscally irresponsible for me to work here any longer", then walked out. I would have killed to see the look on the boss's face!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: pennyhandlebar on February 27, 2018, 12:14:17 AM
Not sure if this qualifies as "epic" as I think I'm leaving with positive feelings all around and without telling anyone off, but my parents need my help, so I quit my job of 10+ years. It's funny - I'm a little apprehensive even though we have over a year of expenses in our rainy day fund and my wife is still working...and we could live on her salary indefinitely. Not sure what I'm afraid of TBH, but I think I'm learning that I may have built too much of my self-identity around my work. 

I really don't know what's next, but I've given myself permission to not try to get into anything else until the fall. Nice to have the option to take this time, and it's interesting to me to see my co-worker's reactions -- people were generally congratulatory and supportive, but there were a few who seemed surprised I could afford to be out of work for an extended time. heh heh heh, that's the power of the mustache...
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Trifle on February 27, 2018, 03:13:07 AM
Not sure if this qualifies as "epic" as I think I'm leaving with positive feelings all around and without telling anyone off, but my parents need my help, so I quit my job of 10+ years. It's funny - I'm a little apprehensive even though we have over a year of expenses in our rainy day fund and my wife is still working...and we could live on her salary indefinitely. Not sure what I'm afraid of TBH, but I think I'm learning that I may have built too much of my self-identity around my work. 

I really don't know what's next, but I've given myself permission to not try to get into anything else until the fall. Nice to have the option to take this time, and it's interesting to me to see my co-worker's reactions -- people were generally congratulatory and supportive, but there were a few who seemed surprised I could afford to be out of work for an extended time. heh heh heh, that's the power of the mustache...

Nice job, PennyHandlebar.  Go you!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Dicey on February 27, 2018, 09:21:05 AM
One of the more senior people in my team went in to the boss, set down a contract for a lateral move to a comparable market for a 50% raise, and said "it would be fiscally irresponsible for me to work here any longer", then walked out. I would have killed to see the look on the boss's face!
That quote is Epic! Glad to see you back in these parts, grantmeaname. You were missed.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: grantmeaname on February 27, 2018, 09:38:41 AM
Thanks, Dicey! It’s good to be back :)
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Wayward on February 27, 2018, 11:42:49 AM
You guys are awesome, such an inspiring thread! 

In late 2007/early 2008 I was in my early 20’s working as a Customer Service Rep for a small business.  I don’t remember how much I was making per hour, but it wasn’t much.  Almost every week the manager would add more tasks, many of which were not related to my job title.  When I asked for a raise to compensate for the additional tasks I was told it’s a small business and they didn’t have job descriptions.  It was a dead-end job, but at the time I didn’t have a degree so I felt stuck. 

The office culture was awful, with one coworker in particular who would to walk around basically being noisy.  The manager would come into my office with petty complaints like a coworker had seen me reading a book at my desk (which I stated was during lunch break and not against company policy).  The owners were equally awful and turn over in upper management was high: a new higher up would come in, change a bunch of things that didn’t matter, while not dealing with the actual issues, then leave or be fired.  I was even forced to vacate my office and take a desk randomly placed on the main floor with a lot of traffic for a manager that worked at another location, in case he needed to come to our building – He never once used the office.           

The last straw was when the company hired an Accounts Payable person with a fancy degree at another location, but I was pretty much doing his job and just scanning my work to him (where he probably took all the credit).  Even though I didn’t have much FU money, I also didn’t have any debt.  When I refused to continue doing his work, I ended up getting fired for “complaining about doing my job”.  I collected unemployment (which the manager tried to block) and went back to college.  Best thing that ever happened to me!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Target2018 on February 27, 2018, 01:49:43 PM
You guys are awesome, such an inspiring thread! 

In late 2007/early 2008 I was in my early 20’s working as a Customer Service Rep for a small business.  I don’t remember how much I was making per hour, but it wasn’t much.  Almost every week the manager would add more tasks, many of which were not related to my job title.  When I asked for a raise to compensate for the additional tasks I was told it’s a small business and they didn’t have job descriptions.  It was a dead-end job, but at the time I didn’t have a degree so I felt stuck. 

The office culture was awful, with one coworker in particular who would to walk around basically being noisy.  The manager would come into my office with petty complaints like a coworker had seen me reading a book at my desk (which I stated was during lunch break and not against company policy).  The owners were equally awful and turn over in upper management was high: a new higher up would come in, change a bunch of things that didn’t matter, while not dealing with the actual issues, then leave or be fired.  I was even forced to vacate my office and take a desk randomly placed on the main floor with a lot of traffic for a manager that worked at another location, in case he needed to come to our building – He never once used the office.           

The last straw was when the company hired an Accounts Payable person with a fancy degree at another location, but I was pretty much doing his job and just scanning my work to him (where he probably took all the credit).  Even though I didn’t have much FU money, I also didn’t have any debt.  When I refused to continue doing his work, I ended up getting fired for “complaining about doing my job”.  I collected unemployment (which the manager tried to block) and went back to college.  Best thing that ever happened to me!

That is indeed epic.  Good for you!!!!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: sequoia on March 01, 2018, 12:43:24 PM
So most story here is related to job, but thought this story might be appropriate to post here.

We want to sell one of our rental house last fall. Not the best time to sell the house but we want to try it anyway. We had some people who looked at the house. One guy with his big family from South Asia was interested. We met several time, talked over the phone, text, during winter but can not close the deal. They keep wanting more discount, we gave them our bottom line price. It just drags on and on, and starting to get annoying. They would be in contact, and say we will call you but then no news for 2-3 weeks. Then they get in contact again, asking bunch of questions. Then nothing for 2-3 weeks. Then get in contact again. How about new carpet (the house has new carpet but they do not like it). How about getting us new kitchen with marble countertop (wth?). How about new appliances... how about ceiling fans... etc. He was nice, but just amazing how much crap he was wanting us to do eventhough up front I told him we are not doing anything for you. The house is as is. And I mentioned to him come Spring, I may change my mind or someone will buy it for my asking price. There are very limited house for sale in this area because it is within great school district after they re-do the school district.

Last month we decided that we going to put that house back as rental. I think we are feed up with them, and we have some family situation that we need to deal with, so no time for this BS. Within 1 day of putting for rent sign, this same guy contacted us that he wants to meet and talk. I text him back, nope house is for rent. He was like what you mean... we are interested... LMAO! It felt sooo good to tell this guy the house is not for sale
 

Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: TomTX on March 02, 2018, 07:49:13 PM

Last month we decided that we going to put that house back as rental. I think we are feed up with them, and we have some family situation that we need to deal with, so no time for this BS. Within 1 day of putting for rent sign, this same guy contacted us that he wants to meet and talk. I text him back, nope house is for rent. He was like what you mean... we are interested... LMAO! It felt sooo good to tell this guy the house is not for sale

You can also just tell him that you need full listing price, he's got until you get a renter in there ;)
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Freedomin5 on March 02, 2018, 09:00:51 PM

Last month we decided that we going to put that house back as rental. I think we are feed up with them, and we have some family situation that we need to deal with, so no time for this BS. Within 1 day of putting for rent sign, this same guy contacted us that he wants to meet and talk. I text him back, nope house is for rent. He was like what you mean... we are interested... LMAO! It felt sooo good to tell this guy the house is not for sale

You can also just tell him that you need full listing price, he's got until you get a renter in there ;)

Yes. This ^^^. "I'm so glad to hear that you are still interested in the house. I look forward to receiving an offer from your real estate agent by end of business day tomorrow."
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: SwordGuy on March 02, 2018, 09:08:25 PM
Quote
"Yes. This ^^^. "I'm so glad to hear that you are still interested in the house AS IS. I look forward to receiving an offer from your real estate agent by end of business day tomorrow."
 

Fixed that for you. :)
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Dicey on March 03, 2018, 10:57:38 AM
Quote
"Yes. This ^^^. "I'm so glad to hear that you are still interested in the house AS IS. I look forward to receiving an offer from your real estate agent by end of business day tomorrow."
 

Fixed that for you. :)
I hate "buyers" like this. They pull this shit, hoping you'll cave. Then they laugh at you and brag to their friends how stupid you are and what a great deal they made. Tell him to fuck right off. Then block his number. THAT'S FU money at work.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: BTDretire on March 03, 2018, 05:45:17 PM
So most story here is related to job, but thought this story might be appropriate to post here.

We want to sell one of our rental house last fall. Not the best time to sell the house but we want to try it anyway. We had some people who looked at the house. One guy with his big family from South Asia was interested. We met several time, talked over the phone, text, during winter but can not close the deal. They keep wanting more discount, we gave them our bottom line price. It just drags on and on, and starting to get annoying. They would be in contact, and say we will call you but then no news for 2-3 weeks. Then they get in contact again, asking bunch of questions. Then nothing for 2-3 weeks. Then get in contact again. How about new carpet (the house has new carpet but they do not like it). How about getting us new kitchen with marble countertop (wth?). How about new appliances... how about ceiling fans... etc. He was nice, but just amazing how much crap he was wanting us to do eventhough up front I told him we are not doing anything for you. The house is as is. And I mentioned to him come Spring, I may change my mind or someone will buy it for my asking price. There are very limited house for sale in this area because it is within great school district after they re-do the school district.

Last month we decided that we going to put that house back as rental. I think we are feed up with them, and we have some family situation that we need to deal with, so no time for this BS. Within 1 day of putting for rent sign, this same guy contacted us that he wants to meet and talk. I text him back, nope house is for rent. He was like what you mean... we are interested... LMAO! It felt sooo good to tell this guy the house is not for sale
  Are you dealing with my brother-in-law? Oh, wait you said big family.
My BIL (also South Asia) negotiates like that. I'm sure he drives people crazy with his requests,
he continually tries to drive the price down. It works for him, but I'd be embarrassed to do that to people.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: sequoia on March 03, 2018, 09:53:59 PM
Quote
"Yes. This ^^^. "I'm so glad to hear that you are still interested in the house AS IS. I look forward to receiving an offer from your real estate agent by end of business day tomorrow."
 

Fixed that for you. :)
I hate "buyers" like this. They pull this shit, hoping you'll cave. Then they laugh at you and brag to their friends how stupid you are and what a great deal they made. Tell him to fuck right off. Then block his number. THAT'S FU money at work.

Exactly!

Haha... honestly we thought about telling him our verbal offer is off. Now we are asking full price just because you try to jerk us around. But like I said earlier, we have some family situation that we are dealing with now, and just do not have the time and energy for this. We monitor the price in the neighborhood closely, and pretty confident we can get pretty close to our asking price this spring if we want to. We just need to have this house either start making money as rental again, or get sold asap.

To close this story, house is now officially out of the market. New tenant is moving in March 15. We managed to rent out the house at higher price than what we expected.

Yay!!

  Are you dealing with my brother-in-law? Oh, wait you said big family.
My BIL (also South Asia) negotiates like that. I'm sure he drives people crazy with his requests,
he continually tries to drive the price down. It works for him, but I'd be embarrassed to do that to people.

Yeah I can not do that. I have placed some low offer for foreclosed properties, but "This is my offer. If you do not like it, I am walking away" kinda deal. I may send another offer if they counter offer.  I would never jerk people around and waste their time.

Yes big family. He brought his wife and kid, his brother in law and his wife, their kids, his parents. And a few more folks that I am unsure who they are. His English is pretty limited so kinda hard to have conversation. I believe we showed the house 3x. I remember on the first visit - we had a open house, there were 4 cars in the driveway. I thought wow lots of people stopping by at the same time, oh wait... you all are related?
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: AnnaGrowsAMustache on March 03, 2018, 10:12:43 PM
OK, so this has been a bit of  a saga but it's turned out slightly epic!

Late last year I worked in a job that had long since outgrown it's job description and rate of pay. I was stressed and burned out. I'd been in discussions with management for a few months but they weren't prepared to alter either the pay rate or the responsibilities. I wasn't get anywhere near market rate for what I was doing.

So, I gave notice and started looking. I'm not a person that can just stick around when I'm not happy. Anyhoo, I ended up applying for a job I thought was WAY out of my league and asking for slightly silly money for it. I got the interview, got told I was the preferred candidate but before I could take the job, the person that was currently doing it withdrew their notice and there turned out not to be a job at all.

I've been unemployed for 3 months over xmas. Last week, the people that interviewed me for the out-of-my-league job phoned and asked me to apply for a job they were advertising. I had an interview the next day, and a job offer the day after that at the silly money rate I'd asked for in the interview for the first job!

So.... now I have a challenging senior-level job, paying more than twice what I was getting last year, at an expanding company AND it's close enough to walk to. Epic!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Step37 on March 03, 2018, 10:17:15 PM
@AnnaGrowsAMustache that is phenomenal!! I was hoping something like that would end up happening after that fell through for you. Congratulations! :)
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: grantmeaname on March 03, 2018, 10:17:22 PM
Fuck yes! That’s amazing! Nothing like stashing beaucoup bucks and then walking home at the end of the day :)
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: AnnaGrowsAMustache on March 04, 2018, 01:33:06 AM
@AnnaGrowsAMustache that is phenomenal!! I was hoping something like that would end up happening after that fell through for you. Congratulations! :)

Thanks. It's all been a bit weird, but hopefully good in the end.

And to the other poster, yes, it'll be nice to walk to. I used to work just a few doors down from the location, and walked to work then on all the fine days. Very pleasant.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Trifle on March 04, 2018, 02:10:13 AM
@AnnaGrowsAMustache that is phenomenal!! I was hoping something like that would end up happening after that fell through for you. Congratulations! :)

Thanks. It's all been a bit weird, but hopefully good in the end.

And to the other poster, yes, it'll be nice to walk to. I used to work just a few doors down from the location, and walked to work then on all the fine days. Very pleasant.

That is fantastic @AnnaGrowsAMustache !!  Congratulations!  That sounds like the holy grail of jobs -- senior level, high pay, and you can walk to work -- completely epic. 
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: BlueHouse on March 04, 2018, 09:44:04 AM
Quote
"Yes. This ^^^. "I'm so glad to hear that you are still interested in the house AS IS. I look forward to receiving an offer from your real estate agent by end of business day tomorrow."
 

Fixed that for you. :)
I hate "buyers" like this. They pull this shit, hoping you'll cave. Then they laugh at you and brag to their friends how stupid you are and what a great deal they made. Tell him to fuck right off. Then block his number. THAT'S FU money at work.
I agree with Dicey 100%.  No need to let this person back into your life because he'll just start trying to negotiate again.  Glad you're rid of him and you'll prob end up making bank long term with the rental.  Nice job!  Gosh, FU money just gives you more power in every aspect of negotiation!  Congrats!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: CoffeeR on March 04, 2018, 10:33:30 AM
Quote
"Yes. This ^^^. "I'm so glad to hear that you are still interested in the house AS IS. I look forward to receiving an offer from your real estate agent by end of business day tomorrow."
 

Fixed that for you. :)
I hate "buyers" like this. They pull this shit, hoping you'll cave. Then they laugh at you and brag to their friends how stupid you are and what a great deal they made. Tell him to fuck right off. Then block his number. THAT'S FU money at work.
I agree with Dicey 100%.  No need to let this person back into your life because he'll just start trying to negotiate again.  Glad you're rid of him and you'll prob end up making bank long term with the rental.  Nice job!  Gosh, FU money just gives you more power in every aspect of negotiation!  Congrats!
To each his own. If the unit is still available (e.g. not rented), I would probably offer the unit back to the buyer --- at an increased price. I would not let them derail my plans (rent or whatever).
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: LeRainDrop on March 04, 2018, 03:42:24 PM
@AnnaGrowsAMustache that is phenomenal!! I was hoping something like that would end up happening after that fell through for you. Congratulations! :)

Thanks. It's all been a bit weird, but hopefully good in the end.

And to the other poster, yes, it'll be nice to walk to. I used to work just a few doors down from the location, and walked to work then on all the fine days. Very pleasant.

That is fantastic @AnnaGrowsAMustache !!  Congratulations!  That sounds like the holy grail of jobs -- senior level, high pay, and you can walk to work -- completely epic.

Fantastic!  Awesome, Anna!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Laura33 on March 04, 2018, 03:46:25 PM
Congrats Anna!  I remember your original post on that topic, and I am SO glad that taking that leap and having confidence in youself paid off in the end (even if not quite as you originally hoped!).
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: SwordGuy on March 04, 2018, 04:24:38 PM
Quote
"Yes. This ^^^. "I'm so glad to hear that you are still interested in the house AS IS. I look forward to receiving an offer from your real estate agent by end of business day tomorrow."
 

Fixed that for you. :)
I hate "buyers" like this. They pull this shit, hoping you'll cave. Then they laugh at you and brag to their friends how stupid you are and what a great deal they made. Tell him to fuck right off. Then block his number. THAT'S FU money at work.
I agree with Dicey 100%.  No need to let this person back into your life because he'll just start trying to negotiate again.  Glad you're rid of him and you'll prob end up making bank long term with the rental.  Nice job!  Gosh, FU money just gives you more power in every aspect of negotiation!  Congrats!
To each his own. If the unit is still available (e.g. not rented), I would probably offer the unit back to the buyer --- at an increased price. I would not let them derail my plans (rent or whatever).

Based upon excellent comments above, I would amend the response to be:

"I'm so glad to hear that you are still interested in the house AS IS. I look forward to receiving an offer from your real estate agent by end of business day tomorrow.  Said offer must include a non-refundable deposit of $[insert amount for your trouble if they fail to close the deal]."
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Bicycle_B on March 04, 2018, 05:16:54 PM
OK, so this has been a bit of  a saga but it's turned out slightly epic!

(snip)

So.... now I have a challenging senior-level job, paying more than twice what I was getting last year, at an expanding company AND it's close enough to walk to. Epic!

Oh YEAH!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: mm1970 on March 05, 2018, 10:52:10 AM
OK, so this has been a bit of  a saga but it's turned out slightly epic!

Late last year I worked in a job that had long since outgrown it's job description and rate of pay. I was stressed and burned out. I'd been in discussions with management for a few months but they weren't prepared to alter either the pay rate or the responsibilities. I wasn't get anywhere near market rate for what I was doing.

So, I gave notice and started looking. I'm not a person that can just stick around when I'm not happy. Anyhoo, I ended up applying for a job I thought was WAY out of my league and asking for slightly silly money for it. I got the interview, got told I was the preferred candidate but before I could take the job, the person that was currently doing it withdrew their notice and there turned out not to be a job at all.

I've been unemployed for 3 months over xmas. Last week, the people that interviewed me for the out-of-my-league job phoned and asked me to apply for a job they were advertising. I had an interview the next day, and a job offer the day after that at the silly money rate I'd asked for in the interview for the first job!

So.... now I have a challenging senior-level job, paying more than twice what I was getting last year, at an expanding company AND it's close enough to walk to. Epic!
epic!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: AnnaGrowsAMustache on March 05, 2018, 05:45:56 PM
Thanks for all the supportive and congratulatory comments, everyone. I've had quite a few IRL as well, which kind of makes up for the stupid comments I got while unemployed. One person, who will never find himself in a position to hire or fire anyone, told me that he wouldn't hire me because of my job history - he feels that 4-6 year stints in jobs shows a lack of commitment. Another person told me I was stupid and irresponsible for quitting. I don't quite know how.... my bills are all paid, no one's going without, even the cat's still eating his premium raw meat. The boss that I quit told me she felt betrayed by my resignation. Um..... you could have paid me what I was worth. I know that going against the majority's idea of how things should work is always difficult, but this experience has been something of an eye opener. FU money is such a good thing!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: better late on March 05, 2018, 08:10:54 PM
Thanks for all the supportive and congratulatory comments, everyone. I've had quite a few IRL as well, which kind of makes up for the stupid comments I got while unemployed. One person, who will never find himself in a position to hire or fire anyone, told me that he wouldn't hire me because of my job history - he feels that 4-6 year stints in jobs shows a lack of commitment. Another person told me I was stupid and irresponsible for quitting. I don't quite know how.... my bills are all paid, no one's going without, even the cat's still eating his premium raw meat. The boss that I quit told me she felt betrayed by my resignation. Um..... you could have paid me what I was worth. I know that going against the majority's idea of how things should work is always difficult, but this experience has been something of an eye opener. FU money is such a good thing!
I am finding your story to be VERY inspiring. Congratulations on the new job!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: JLee on March 05, 2018, 10:56:08 PM
Thanks for all the supportive and congratulatory comments, everyone. I've had quite a few IRL as well, which kind of makes up for the stupid comments I got while unemployed. One person, who will never find himself in a position to hire or fire anyone, told me that he wouldn't hire me because of my job history - he feels that 4-6 year stints in jobs shows a lack of commitment. Another person told me I was stupid and irresponsible for quitting. I don't quite know how.... my bills are all paid, no one's going without, even the cat's still eating his premium raw meat. The boss that I quit told me she felt betrayed by my resignation. Um..... you could have paid me what I was worth. I know that going against the majority's idea of how things should work is always difficult, but this experience has been something of an eye opener. FU money is such a good thing!

4-6 year stints do show a lack of commitment...on the part of the employer, not the employee.  If my previous employer would've preemptively given me the 60% raise that my current employer did, I wouldn't have been looking for other jobs! I'm sure that's not what he meant, but it's true :D
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Luckyvik on March 06, 2018, 03:28:30 AM
4-6 years is a long time now a days!


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: MrMoogle on March 06, 2018, 07:51:02 AM
4-6 years is a long time now a days!


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Exactly what I was thinking!

Although I do think the studies saying so are a little misleading.
Say you have 2 people, one who worked 5 years and one who worked 5x 1 year stints.  The average stint is 1.67 (10/6) years.  If you take the average per person, it's 3 years.  It's kind of like the mean vs median for weddings.  Those who take shorter stints take more of them.  An employer can't really take that into account though.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Livingthedream55 on March 06, 2018, 08:09:57 AM
Thanks for all the supportive and congratulatory comments, everyone. I've had quite a few IRL as well, which kind of makes up for the stupid comments I got while unemployed. One person, who will never find himself in a position to hire or fire anyone, told me that he wouldn't hire me because of my job history - he feels that 4-6 year stints in jobs shows a lack of commitment. Another person told me I was stupid and irresponsible for quitting. I don't quite know how.... my bills are all paid, no one's going without, even the cat's still eating his premium raw meat. The boss that I quit told me she felt betrayed by my resignation. Um..... you could have paid me what I was worth. I know that going against the majority's idea of how things should work is always difficult, but this experience has been something of an eye opener. FU money is such a good thing!

Next time old boss gives you grief and/or shares her feeling of betrayal (WTF?):

Read elsewhere on this forum: "it would be financially irresponsible of me not to take this new job."   BURN!! : 0 )
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: MissNancyPryor on March 06, 2018, 08:39:25 AM
Crappy boss for sure.  Sounds like a good one to leave. 
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: saguaro on March 06, 2018, 08:40:33 AM
Thanks for all the supportive and congratulatory comments, everyone. I've had quite a few IRL as well, which kind of makes up for the stupid comments I got while unemployed. One person, who will never find himself in a position to hire or fire anyone, told me that he wouldn't hire me because of my job history - he feels that 4-6 year stints in jobs shows a lack of commitment. Another person told me I was stupid and irresponsible for quitting. I don't quite know how.... my bills are all paid, no one's going without, even the cat's still eating his premium raw meat. The boss that I quit told me she felt betrayed by my resignation. Um..... you could have paid me what I was worth. I know that going against the majority's idea of how things should work is always difficult, but this experience has been something of an eye opener. FU money is such a good thing!

4-6 year stints do show a lack of commitment...on the part of the employer, not the employee.  If my previous employer would've preemptively given me the 60% raise that my current employer did, I wouldn't have been looking for other jobs! I'm sure that's not what he meant, but it's true :D

Personally I think 4-6 years is plenty of time for an employee to learn the job, to determine how far he/she can advance in terms of position or pay, put the effort toward doing that, and if a no go on part of the employer (for whatever reason) then for the employee to seek other opportunities elsewhere.   

I bailed on my second post college job after a year and a half.  I had gotten a raise plus satisfactory review and told that I had already hit the wage ceiling for my position.  A coworker got the same thing and angrily quit on the spot.   I left two months later for a higher paying job.  Of course they were shocked but what did they expect after telling people that.  But I did give them credit for being honest (even if they didn't expect my particular response to it) and I could move on.

ETA: And wtf with this whole "betrayal" business.  When you have "at will" employment laws in place that takes "betrayal" out of the equation, IMHO.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: PaulMaxime on March 06, 2018, 11:32:40 AM
Thanks for all the supportive and congratulatory comments, everyone. I've had quite a few IRL as well, which kind of makes up for the stupid comments I got while unemployed. One person, who will never find himself in a position to hire or fire anyone, told me that he wouldn't hire me because of my job history - he feels that 4-6 year stints in jobs shows a lack of commitment. Another person told me I was stupid and irresponsible for quitting. I don't quite know how.... my bills are all paid, no one's going without, even the cat's still eating his premium raw meat. The boss that I quit told me she felt betrayed by my resignation. Um..... you could have paid me what I was worth. I know that going against the majority's idea of how things should work is always difficult, but this experience has been something of an eye opener. FU money is such a good thing!

Next time old boss gives you grief and/or shares her feeling of betrayal (WTF?):

Read elsewhere on this forum: "it would be financially irresponsible of me not to take this new job."   BURN!! : 0 )

I hate when companies and bosses act this way. It's business. If the company was having a hard time they'd let employees go without a second thought. One of the top things I tell younger folks when I advise them about their careers is to do what's best for them.

Um..... you could have paid me what I was worth.

Exactly.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: albireo13 on March 06, 2018, 03:28:25 PM
Remember that companies would sell their grandmother
if they could make a dollar on it.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Capt j-rod on March 06, 2018, 09:30:47 PM
I agree with what was said, but employers don't like mustaches... They want you broke and begging for more money and more hours. My wife quit when they refused to hire more help. They paid incredibly well for what she did, and in turn she made them a butt load of money. The problem was that I had no wife and my kids had no mother. They just ran her into the ground. We tried for over a year to negotiate a lower salary for a lighter workload, but they refused and kept saying they couldn't find any help. We drew a line in the dirt and decided that if they didn't change something by a certain date then we were gone. We didn't tell them the date, but told them that we would soon be left no choice but to start looking. The date came and she gave her resignation. They were very pissed and worked her even harder until she left which was 90 days notice. They have contacted her 6 times in the past year trying to get her to come back with more empty promises that they can't back up. The new job is great and they are thrilled to have gotten her. Will it stay this way? Maybe, but if it doesn't the FU money is still in the account and the resume takes less than an hour to clean up. As for me? I keep buying and fixing rentals and maxing out the investments. Nobody but us knows that there is only 4 more years of full time, then 3-5 years of part time employment left. I figured we would save that little tid bit of knowledge for later. They keep us on a need to know basis, so I think they have earned the same.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: PiobStache on March 07, 2018, 12:36:49 PM
Did not tell anyone to FU but I find it's becoming harder and harder to stay focused as our financial independence grows.  We are going to stick it out until 62, another 11 years, because we have definite goals we want to accomplish in retirement.  I'm just hoping we don't pull the trigger early and have to compromise a goal or two.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: RWD on March 07, 2018, 03:21:16 PM
Did not tell anyone to FU but I find it's becoming harder and harder to stay focused as our financial independence grows.  We are going to stick it out until 62, another 11 years, because we have definite goals we want to accomplish in retirement.  I'm just hoping we don't pull the trigger early and have to compromise a goal or two.

I'd rather compromise a goal or two than work until 62, but that's just me.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: TexasRunner on March 07, 2018, 06:30:27 PM
Did not tell anyone to FU but I find it's becoming harder and harder to stay focused as our financial independence grows.  We are going to stick it out until 62, another 11 years, because we have definite goals we want to accomplish in retirement.  I'm just hoping we don't pull the trigger early and have to compromise a goal or two.

I'd rather compromise a goal or two than work until 62, but that's just me.

+1,000,000

I plan to FI in 11 years, and maybe RE if I want.  People die at 60 all. the. time.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Dicey on March 07, 2018, 06:38:53 PM
Did not tell anyone to FU but I find it's becoming harder and harder to stay focused as our financial independence grows.  We are going to stick it out until 62, another 11 years, because we have definite goals we want to accomplish in retirement.  I'm just hoping we don't pull the trigger early and have to compromise a goal or two.

I'd rather compromise a goal or two than work until 62, but that's just me.
+1,000,000

I plan to FI in 11 years, and maybe RE if I want.  People die at 60 all. the. time.
People die at every age, said the person who turned sixty this week and thankfully didn't die. Getting out early is priceless. I have no goals that are worth waiting that long for. I got out at 54 and wish I could have done so even earlier.
Title: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Luckyvik on March 08, 2018, 01:54:38 AM
I have a FU story in progress; so I came in to work the other day and we got called into a meeting turns out my part of the Company (Company A) is getting sold to Company B. We got offered our same jobs at Company B with a small sign on bonus.

It’s likely my DH is getting sent to HongKong for work for 6 months in May so I told work I’m not signing the contract with Company B ( I was originally thinking I would ask Company A to work remotely but Company B is a smaller and not international) I’m now hoping I will get a small redundancy. Even if we don’t end up going to HK, we have FU money so I can wait around for the redundancy and then look for another job.

HR said that they will have to try and find me a job in another part of the company before they look into redundancy. So, we will see what happens!

I’m one of the minority that can afford to hang around without a job.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: MrMoogle on March 08, 2018, 08:04:48 AM
Did not tell anyone to FU but I find it's becoming harder and harder to stay focused as our financial independence grows.  We are going to stick it out until 62, another 11 years, because we have definite goals we want to accomplish in retirement.  I'm just hoping we don't pull the trigger early and have to compromise a goal or two.

I'd rather compromise a goal or two than work until 62, but that's just me.
+1,000,000

I plan to FI in 11 years, and maybe RE if I want.  People die at 60 all. the. time.
People die at every age, said the person who turned sixty this week and thankfully didn't die. Getting out early is priceless. I have no goals that are worth waiting that long for. I got out at 54 and wish I could have done so even earlier.
It depends what they mean by "as our financial independence grows."  If they're now at 2x their current spend rate they're pretty much stuck waiting ~11 years.  If they're at 50x their current spend rate, but want to increase their spend rate by 3x, then I'd probably compromise in between the two somewhere.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: PiobStache on March 08, 2018, 09:31:48 AM
Did not tell anyone to FU but I find it's becoming harder and harder to stay focused as our financial independence grows.  We are going to stick it out until 62, another 11 years, because we have definite goals we want to accomplish in retirement.  I'm just hoping we don't pull the trigger early and have to compromise a goal or two.

I'd rather compromise a goal or two than work until 62, but that's just me.

That is indeed just you.  One of our goals is to start a non-profit to work with disadvantaged kids for early intervention in acquisition of math knowledge.  All studies show they younger they are, the more likely they'll one day be able to obtain higher math skills.  Our lives are not based solely around our selfish needs and this goal is important to us.  Each to his own I say.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: NoraLenderbee on March 08, 2018, 09:43:47 AM
Happy birthday, Dicey!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: RWD on March 08, 2018, 09:46:44 AM
Did not tell anyone to FU but I find it's becoming harder and harder to stay focused as our financial independence grows.  We are going to stick it out until 62, another 11 years, because we have definite goals we want to accomplish in retirement.  I'm just hoping we don't pull the trigger early and have to compromise a goal or two.

I'd rather compromise a goal or two than work until 62, but that's just me.

That is indeed just you.  One of our goals is to start a non-profit to work with disadvantaged kids for early intervention in acquisition of math knowledge.  All studies show they younger they are, the more likely they'll one day be able to obtain higher math skills.  Our lives are not based solely around our selfish needs and this goal is important to us.  Each to his own I say.

How come you aren't starting that now?
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: jeninco on March 08, 2018, 10:38:06 AM
Did not tell anyone to FU but I find it's becoming harder and harder to stay focused as our financial independence grows.  We are going to stick it out until 62, another 11 years, because we have definite goals we want to accomplish in retirement.  I'm just hoping we don't pull the trigger early and have to compromise a goal or two.

I'd rather compromise a goal or two than work until 62, but that's just me.

That is indeed just you.  One of our goals is to start a non-profit to work with disadvantaged kids for early intervention in acquisition of math knowledge.  All studies show they younger they are, the more likely they'll one day be able to obtain higher math skills.  Our lives are not based solely around our selfish needs and this goal is important to us.  Each to his own I say.

How come you aren't starting that now?

OK, without the snippiness on all sides, I'm quite curious about this. Have you figured out some of the details? Who is going to do the teaching? What metrics will you use, and how will you know if/when the program is working? What lure will you offer to get kids and families to participate?

This might need its own thread (probably best placed in Off-Topic), but I've often thought that providing additional support for the 2nd - 4th grade age group would be enormously helpful, and would love to know how you're thinking about approaching this.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: former player on March 08, 2018, 10:42:40 AM
Did not tell anyone to FU but I find it's becoming harder and harder to stay focused as our financial independence grows.  We are going to stick it out until 62, another 11 years, because we have definite goals we want to accomplish in retirement.  I'm just hoping we don't pull the trigger early and have to compromise a goal or two.

I'd rather compromise a goal or two than work until 62, but that's just me.

That is indeed just you.  One of our goals is to start a non-profit to work with disadvantaged kids for early intervention in acquisition of math knowledge.  All studies show they younger they are, the more likely they'll one day be able to obtain higher math skills.  Our lives are not based solely around our selfish needs and this goal is important to us.  Each to his own I say.
@NinetyFour is a soon to be retired teacher of math teachers who does non-profit work on math teaching, you might have a lot in common.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: PiobStache on March 08, 2018, 11:10:37 AM
Did not tell anyone to FU but I find it's becoming harder and harder to stay focused as our financial independence grows.  We are going to stick it out until 62, another 11 years, because we have definite goals we want to accomplish in retirement.  I'm just hoping we don't pull the trigger early and have to compromise a goal or two.

I'd rather compromise a goal or two than work until 62, but that's just me.

That is indeed just you.  One of our goals is to start a non-profit to work with disadvantaged kids for early intervention in acquisition of math knowledge.  All studies show they younger they are, the more likely they'll one day be able to obtain higher math skills.  Our lives are not based solely around our selfish needs and this goal is important to us.  Each to his own I say.

How come you aren't starting that now?

OK, without the snippiness on all sides, I'm quite curious about this. Have you figured out some of the details? Who is going to do the teaching? What metrics will you use, and how will you know if/when the program is working? What lure will you offer to get kids and families to participate?

This might need its own thread (probably best placed in Off-Topic), but I've often thought that providing additional support for the 2nd - 4th grade age group would be enormously helpful, and would love to know how you're thinking about approaching this.

To the prior poster: because we want both our retirement and our non-profit efforts to be properly capitalized.  Not being properly capitalized for both those goals would just be foolish, and while I'm far from the sharpest tool in the shed, I at least like to think I'm not foolish.

Jenico:  Years ago a professor of mine in business school turned me on to the research involving different styles of pedagogy at the university, i.e. lecture, online, self-learing, lecture-online combo, etc.  All the research indicates very little difference in outcomes.  (The granddaddy of all such research comes from a 1968 meta-analysis under "The Teaching Learning Paradox" if you want to research it.)  We were also involved with Math Counts for a number of years and a decade of observation/participation in that between us.

So our plan is heavily tech involved in that guided online learning will be the main method.  We plan to identify a couple of after school youth programs to partner with for our initial learning lab.  We'll take on a couple of cohorts, and a key will be, involved adult figures in their lives (no matter what form that figure takes...which we'll track too, btw ;) )  We'll do entry testing to determine current ability, then intermediate and final testing.  We plan to make this a two or three year program, haven't figured out which yet.  It will also be a program with a highly social aspect, to include field trips to spark interest in good careers, a number of weekend events like BBQs (with some math games!) and the like.  We realize engaging them on a social level is important for retention.

We're not bothering to work out 100% of the details, as we're talking well over a decade yet, and I figure if nothing else technology will continue to change.  We'll write grants to tap into further funding, and as philanthropists ourselves at this point, we know there's nothing more appealing than a program that's already well funded with a strong business plan.

My wife and I are both quants so this is something we're personally invested in.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Prairie Stash on March 08, 2018, 01:23:04 PM
I'm so very happy.

My wife just used the FU money a couple hours ago. She has been employed at 60% time; 24 hours/week tuesday - thursday (3-8 hour shifts). This schedule started after her return from maternity leave so that she could spend more time with the kids and stay employed. It was the optimal solution for us, everyone was happy and we kept on saving. The kids have a little time away from us with other kids, we get more time than we use to with the kids.

Yesterday she was told thats coming to an end, she needs to go to full time. As she is late 30's with two kids, I think her supervisor expected compliance, I think it came as a surprse when my wife wanted to mull it over. As in all these caes the unspoken alternative was she's out of work, no one ever thinks people will consider that option. Luckily for us, we have a decent stash, she isn't bound by normal conventions of needing to cover rent and can live the life she wants. Still, its pretty scary to be confronted with it even after all this preparation.

In case it needs to be said, she said No to returning to full time work. The unspoken alternative is still not being whispered out loud, it happened so fast that I don't think its sunk in yet. I have no idea yet if they'll try to keep her or let her go, I suspect they feel she's bluffing. She still wants to work at 60%, but shes willing to never work again, I'm also sitting on the precipice of FIRE, we're just saving so we can live a few years overseas as a family at this point.

It just makes me so happy that she can make her choice. If she's out of work, her last day should fall on our anniversary. I think that will gurantee I'm husband of the year which is great; however looking forward I'm pretty much going to be a dissapointment for the rest of our anniversaries though, this is impossible to beat.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Step37 on March 08, 2018, 01:32:10 PM
@Prairie Stash I love this story! Being in a position to take no shit is so powerful! Well done to both of you.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Dicey on March 08, 2018, 02:06:13 PM
@Prairie Stash I love this story! Being in a position to take no shit is so powerful! Well done to both of you.
Can't wait to hear the rest of this story. Well done!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: okits on March 08, 2018, 02:35:18 PM
Prairie Stash, I'm curious to hear how it plays out and, if they don't accept "no", on what grounds they legally terminate her employment.  I wouldn't be surprised if they just let her part-time arrangement continue (if they want to force her into full-time I assume there's enough work that they'd have to replace her, which is an extra hassle).  Way to go, both of you, for being able to say no!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: VoteCthulu on March 08, 2018, 03:01:05 PM
Prairie Stash, I'm curious to hear how it plays out and, if they don't accept "no", on what grounds they legally terminate her employment.  I wouldn't be surprised if they just let her part-time arrangement continue (if they want to force her into full-time I assume there's enough work that they'd have to replace her, which is an extra hassle).  Way to go, both of you, for being able to say no!
If they live in an "at will" employment state there doesn't need to be any reason to legally terminate her, but then she will usually qualify for collecting unemployment if it's not "for cause".
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: okits on March 08, 2018, 03:04:44 PM
Prairie Stash, I'm curious to hear how it plays out and, if they don't accept "no", on what grounds they legally terminate her employment.  I wouldn't be surprised if they just let her part-time arrangement continue (if they want to force her into full-time I assume there's enough work that they'd have to replace her, which is an extra hassle).  Way to go, both of you, for being able to say no!
If they live in an "at will" employment state there doesn't need to be any reason to legally terminate her, but then she will usually qualify for collecting unemployment if it's not "for cause".

IIRC (and scanning past posts) I think he's Canadian.  So maybe there will be a nice severance package on offer.  :)))))
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: MissNancyPryor on March 08, 2018, 03:06:10 PM
~this is impossible to beat~

Betcha that first anniversary where you are sitting beside her enjoying the FIRE with her will put this one in the dust!  :-)

Congratulations to you both on this awesome road you are on!

Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: mm1970 on March 08, 2018, 04:11:24 PM
I'm so very happy.

My wife just used the FU money a couple hours ago. She has been employed at 60% time; 24 hours/week tuesday - thursday (3-8 hour shifts). This schedule started after her return from maternity leave so that she could spend more time with the kids and stay employed. It was the optimal solution for us, everyone was happy and we kept on saving. The kids have a little time away from us with other kids, we get more time than we use to with the kids.

Yesterday she was told thats coming to an end, she needs to go to full time. As she is late 30's with two kids, I think her supervisor expected compliance, I think it came as a surprse when my wife wanted to mull it over. As in all these caes the unspoken alternative was she's out of work, no one ever thinks people will consider that option. Luckily for us, we have a decent stash, she isn't bound by normal conventions of needing to cover rent and can live the life she wants. Still, its pretty scary to be confronted with it even after all this preparation.

In case it needs to be said, she said No to returning to full time work. The unspoken alternative is still not being whispered out loud, it happened so fast that I don't think its sunk in yet. I have no idea yet if they'll try to keep her or let her go, I suspect they feel she's bluffing. She still wants to work at 60%, but shes willing to never work again, I'm also sitting on the precipice of FIRE, we're just saving so we can live a few years overseas as a family at this point.

It just makes me so happy that she can make her choice. If she's out of work, her last day should fall on our anniversary. I think that will gurantee I'm husband of the year which is great; however looking forward I'm pretty much going to be a dissapointment for the rest of our anniversaries though, this is impossible to beat.

This is such a great story.  10 years ago, that was me.  I had a 2 year old and had been working 30 hrs/week for over a year.  Company did a reorg, I got a new boss, he said "I don't believe in part time".  I spent a couple of weeks working my way up the chain (mainly talking to his boss, the VP and head of the location).  No go. Even down to
Me: "but Mrs. H works part time." 
New boss: "She's not a technical employee." 
Me: "Wait, she has a PhD in materials science?"
New boss: "She's not in the critical path"
Me: "I'm in the critical path now, working part time, and it works?"
New boss: "I don't care, I don't believe in it"

So, as I'd been thinking of making a change anyway - I called up a FORMER boss and said "I'm looking for a part time job."  And got "you're hired."

I gave notice.  I think they were surprised.  Now, I gave them a very long, 3 months notice, as I promised to finish off my last project.  Thing is, they figured that the other engineer was still there, so no big deal.  Of course, I knew that he was leaving soon after me. 

Fast forward two years and another woman has a baby, and wants to work part time, 25 hours.  They say yes!  She's in the critical path!  And even better, the VP tells her "yeah, we made a mistake with mm1970."  Even though I already had a job lined up, I didn't need it.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: rpr on March 08, 2018, 04:26:45 PM

Fast forward two years and another woman has a baby, and wants to work part time, 25 hours.  They say yes!  She's in the critical path!  And even better, the VP tells her "yeah, we made a mistake with mm1970."  Even though I already had a job lined up, I didn't need it.

@mm1970 -- what a great story. You paved the path for someone else. And kudos also to the VP for realizing and admitting to a mistake.  So many people just refuse to acknowledge mistakes and then continue to dig deeper. Your story is refreshing.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: TomTX on March 09, 2018, 10:11:30 AM

Read elsewhere on this forum: "it would be financially irresponsible of me not to take this new job."   BURN!! : 0 )

Yep, I'm saving that for my exit interview if I get this new job. It's a stretch, but would pay a LOT more.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: TomTX on March 09, 2018, 10:16:47 AM

To the prior poster: because we want both our retirement and our non-profit efforts to be properly capitalized.  Not being properly capitalized for both those goals would just be foolish, and while I'm far from the sharpest tool in the shed, I at least like to think I'm not foolish.

Have you been turned down in all of your grant proposals? How many have you submitted?
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: mm1970 on March 09, 2018, 10:37:49 AM

Fast forward two years and another woman has a baby, and wants to work part time, 25 hours.  They say yes!  She's in the critical path!  And even better, the VP tells her "yeah, we made a mistake with mm1970."  Even though I already had a job lined up, I didn't need it.

@mm1970 -- what a great story. You paved the path for someone else. And kudos also to the VP for realizing and admitting to a mistake.  So many people just refuse to acknowledge mistakes and then continue to dig deeper. Your story is refreshing.
It did take one more round.  After about 2 years they pressured her to go back full time and she said no.  They kept pressuring her until she eventually quit (she also had changes in her childcare, so it wasn't 100% that, but partially.)

Round *3* woman having a baby, about 4-5 years ago.  SHE went back part time and they didn't bug her about going back full time.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: bluebelle on March 09, 2018, 10:52:27 AM
Prairie Stash, I'm curious to hear how it plays out and, if they don't accept "no", on what grounds they legally terminate her employment.  I wouldn't be surprised if they just let her part-time arrangement continue (if they want to force her into full-time I assume there's enough work that they'd have to replace her, which is an extra hassle).  Way to go, both of you, for being able to say no!
If they live in an "at will" employment state there doesn't need to be any reason to legally terminate her, but then she will usually qualify for collecting unemployment if it's not "for cause".

IIRC (and scanning past posts) I think he's Canadian.  So maybe there will be a nice severance package on offer.  :)))))

Canadian labour laws are alot more employee friendly than what I understand some US states have.

But FU money lets you test that stress free!  Yay you!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: jeninco on March 09, 2018, 11:21:53 AM

To the prior poster: because we want both our retirement and our non-profit efforts to be properly capitalized.  Not being properly capitalized for both those goals would just be foolish, and while I'm far from the sharpest tool in the shed, I at least like to think I'm not foolish.

Have you been turned down in all of your grant proposals? How many have you submitted?

Oh, knock it off -- you're just being a jerk at this point. If they don't hate their jobs, and they know what level will be comfortable for them (both in terms of risk and spending), they're working to reach those goals. MYOFB, already.

And personally, if I set up a foundation like that, I'd prefer that it be self-funded, at least for long enough to amass decent results. Because I think the idiots at Ed schools that give out grants are power-hungry and can't do solid statistics, and I hate being jerked around -- even if I believe it's for a good cause.

@PlobStache, I strongly dislike Math Counts -- I think the program leans toward having kids memorize 1-time formulas, rather than learning a variety of strategies for solving problems. Check out Math Olympiad, which tends more towards problems that 3 different students might solve in 3 different ways (and, for extra fun, can then stand up and explain to each other, with well-trained adult assistance, because it can be a challenge to help clarify algebraic, geometric, and graph-theory solving strategies cold.)

Really, though, my experience with math students at all levels up to about Geometry (so 9th or 10th grades) is that if you can get basic math skills and some problem-solving and persistence strategies into kids before 5th grade, you're golden! (And technology is an awesome way to get the basic math facts memorized.)
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: scottish on March 09, 2018, 05:26:44 PM
I agree.   Who wants to FIRE and do your own thing if it means relying on other people's money.    The point is to get away from the bureaucratic rat race, not to spend more time with it.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: TomTX on March 09, 2018, 06:26:27 PM

To the prior poster: because we want both our retirement and our non-profit efforts to be properly capitalized.  Not being properly capitalized for both those goals would just be foolish, and while I'm far from the sharpest tool in the shed, I at least like to think I'm not foolish.

Have you been turned down in all of your grant proposals? How many have you submitted?

Oh, knock it off -- you're just being a jerk at this point. If they don't hate their jobs, and they know what level will be comfortable for them (both in terms of risk and spending), they're working to reach those goals. MYOFB, already.

My single polite post is "just being a jerk"?

You have awfully thin skin, White Knight. This is the land of Facepunches. That wasn't even a love tap. And if OP can't deal with that level of question themselves, they're going to fail at their stated goal. I've been involved in multiple nonprofits at both the grunt and management level, including fundraising.

Also, your dismissal of all grants because of your bad experiences with .edu grants is shortsighted and overly narrow in focus.

It's particularly ironic of you to stick your nose into my discussion with OP and then to nancy-around writing Mind Your Own Fucking Business. You could at least learn from your own acronym.

Grow up.

Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Sibley on March 09, 2018, 09:55:03 PM

To the prior poster: because we want both our retirement and our non-profit efforts to be properly capitalized.  Not being properly capitalized for both those goals would just be foolish, and while I'm far from the sharpest tool in the shed, I at least like to think I'm not foolish.

Have you been turned down in all of your grant proposals? How many have you submitted?

Oh, knock it off -- you're just being a jerk at this point. If they don't hate their jobs, and they know what level will be comfortable for them (both in terms of risk and spending), they're working to reach those goals. MYOFB, already.

My single polite post is "just being a jerk"?

You have awfully thin skin, White Knight. This is the land of Facepunches. That wasn't even a love tap. And if OP can't deal with that level of question themselves, they're going to fail at their stated goal. I've been involved in multiple nonprofits at both the grunt and management level, including fundraising.

Also, your dismissal of all grants because of your bad experiences with .edu grants is shortsighted and overly narrow in focus.

It's particularly ironic of you to stick your nose into my discussion with OP and then to nancy-around writing Mind Your Own Fucking Business. You could at least learn from your own acronym.

Grow up.

Well Tom, you may have asked ONE question in a line of questions that in total were getting jerkish, but you definitely got jerkish in your response. It's a long thread, people get confused sometimes. Chill a tad.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: LeRainDrop on March 09, 2018, 10:24:20 PM
Yeah, can we call a truce and get back to Epic FU Money Stories?

As a follow-up to when I left my law firm nearly two years ago, I heard from one of my colleagues the other day that one of the partners and a counsel were talking about me the other day like how hard it is going to be for me to find a job with the passage of time and what am I doing with my life.  LOL, my friend and I just laughed because what I am doing is not freaking working, traveling the world, doing volunteer work, spending quality time with family in other parts of the country, and also just relaxing.  Silly law firm attorneys who can't see the world beyond billing hours...
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Luckyvik on March 10, 2018, 03:33:07 AM
I have a FU story in progress; so I came in to work the other day and we got called into a meeting turns out my part of the Company (Company A) is getting sold to Company B. We got offered our same jobs at Company B with a small sign on bonus.

It’s likely my DH is getting sent to HongKong for work for 6 months in May so I told work I’m not signing the contract with Company B ( I was originally thinking I would ask Company A to work remotely but Company B is a smaller and not international) I’m now hoping I will get a small redundancy. Even if we don’t end up going to HK, we have FU money so I can wait around for the redundancy and then look for another job.

HR said that they will have to try and find me a job in another part of the company before they look into redundancy. So, we will see what happens!

I’m one of the minority that can afford to hang around without a job.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Update- Now they are screwing us out of a redundancy, they said that as they are offering us equivalent jobs at Company B then there will be no redundancy payment if we don’t sign on to Company B.
They had sent an email week ago stating that there would be a redundancy payment and now they are saying there is not. I looked up the fair work act (Australia) and it’s correct that we are not actually entitled to a redundancy payment but I’m guessing that since they told us we are and now we are not there would be some room for argument, anyone know?
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: runbikerun on March 10, 2018, 04:11:40 AM
One person, who will never find himself in a position to hire or fire anyone, told me that he wouldn't hire me because of my job history - he feels that 4-6 year stints in jobs shows a lack of commitment.

This is one of the weirdest things I've ever heard. One of the best pieces of advice I've ever gotten was from a former manager, who told me when I was leaving that unless I fell completely in love with a specific job, I should be aiming to move roles after eighteen months. His rationale was that in any non-specialist role, 95% of learning happens in those eighteen months, and beyond that point new learning opportunities become far rarer.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Trifle on March 10, 2018, 04:18:55 AM
Update- Now they are screwing us out of a redundancy, they said that as they are offering us equivalent jobs at Company B then there will be no redundancy payment if we don’t sign on to Company B.
They had sent an email week ago stating that there would be a redundancy payment and now they are saying there is not. I looked up the fair work act (Australia) and it’s correct that we are not actually entitled to a redundancy payment but I’m guessing that since they told us we are and now we are not there would be some room for argument, anyone know?

I don't know, but you could ask this over on the Australia Tax board (It's not just about taxes, but also all manner of insurance/employment/legal stuff):  https://forum.mrmoneymustache.com/australia-tax-discussion/ . 

Good luck!  Would be brilliant if you could get a redundancy payment. 

Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: former player on March 10, 2018, 04:34:03 AM
I have a FU story in progress; so I came in to work the other day and we got called into a meeting turns out my part of the Company (Company A) is getting sold to Company B. We got offered our same jobs at Company B with a small sign on bonus.

It’s likely my DH is getting sent to HongKong for work for 6 months in May so I told work I’m not signing the contract with Company B ( I was originally thinking I would ask Company A to work remotely but Company B is a smaller and not international) I’m now hoping I will get a small redundancy. Even if we don’t end up going to HK, we have FU money so I can wait around for the redundancy and then look for another job.

HR said that they will have to try and find me a job in another part of the company before they look into redundancy. So, we will see what happens!

I’m one of the minority that can afford to hang around without a job.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Update- Now they are screwing us out of a redundancy, they said that as they are offering us equivalent jobs at Company B then there will be no redundancy payment if we don’t sign on to Company B.
They had sent an email week ago stating that there would be a redundancy payment and now they are saying there is not. I looked up the fair work act (Australia) and it’s correct that we are not actually entitled to a redundancy payment but I’m guessing that since they told us we are and now we are not there would be some room for argument, anyone know?
You can always argue anything, and if you have a trades union I'm sure they will be able to argue it on your behalf.  I think a legal case based on estoppel (the idea that you can hold someone to their word if you have acted to your detriment as a result) probably doesn't apply because you hadn't lost the offer of the job at Company B before Company A changed their minds.  But definitely one for the Australians to answer more definitively (or as least as definitively as any free legal opinion over the internet).
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: LeRainDrop on March 10, 2018, 07:33:00 AM
I have a FU story in progress; so I came in to work the other day and we got called into a meeting turns out my part of the Company (Company A) is getting sold to Company B. We got offered our same jobs at Company B with a small sign on bonus.

It’s likely my DH is getting sent to HongKong for work for 6 months in May so I told work I’m not signing the contract with Company B ( I was originally thinking I would ask Company A to work remotely but Company B is a smaller and not international) I’m now hoping I will get a small redundancy. Even if we don’t end up going to HK, we have FU money so I can wait around for the redundancy and then look for another job.

HR said that they will have to try and find me a job in another part of the company before they look into redundancy. So, we will see what happens!

I’m one of the minority that can afford to hang around without a job.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Update- Now they are screwing us out of a redundancy, they said that as they are offering us equivalent jobs at Company B then there will be no redundancy payment if we don’t sign on to Company B.
They had sent an email week ago stating that there would be a redundancy payment and now they are saying there is not. I looked up the fair work act (Australia) and it’s correct that we are not actually entitled to a redundancy payment but I’m guessing that since they told us we are and now we are not there would be some room for argument, anyone know?
You can always argue anything, and if you have a trades union I'm sure they will be able to argue it on your behalf.  I think a legal case based on estoppel (the idea that you can hold someone to their word if you have acted to your detriment as a result) probably doesn't apply because you hadn't lost the offer of the job at Company B before Company A changed their minds.  But definitely one for the Australians to answer more definitively (or as least as definitively as any free legal opinion over the internet).

Ditto.  I don't think you could show any actual damages.  But they suck :-/
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Luckyvik on March 10, 2018, 02:10:49 PM
Thanks Tripele, former player and Letaindrop, I will ask in the other board.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Gone_Hiking on March 10, 2018, 08:45:09 PM
On a Thursday afternoon my bosses were off-site, and I was pretty bitter about the low pay and the long commute. I signed a new job offer, then I gave them email-notice that my last day was Friday/tomorrow. While they were out of the office I made my rounds and said goodbye to all the decent coworkers. A bunch of people in my department set up a going away party for me before the bosses could stop it. Despite being bitter they sort of had to show up anyway and be nice, at least publicly.

Good and badass for you.  I have given notice earlier this week and I wish it was a quick going away party.  Instead, there was panic, crying emojis, public praises sounding like eulogies, I half expect a funeral wreath on my desk any day.  I heard that the employer is going to hire two people to replace me, perhaps I can put that on my resume.   But I digress.  Congratulations on a great change!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: driftwood on March 11, 2018, 12:43:56 AM
I have a FU story in progress; so I came in to work the other day and we got called into a meeting turns out my part of the Company (Company A) is getting sold to Company B. We got offered our same jobs at Company B with a small sign on bonus.

It’s likely my DH is getting sent to HongKong for work for 6 months in May so I told work I’m not signing the contract with Company B ( I was originally thinking I would ask Company A to work remotely but Company B is a smaller and not international) I’m now hoping I will get a small redundancy. Even if we don’t end up going to HK, we have FU money so I can wait around for the redundancy and then look for another job.

HR said that they will have to try and find me a job in another part of the company before they look into redundancy. So, we will see what happens!

I’m one of the minority that can afford to hang around without a job.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Update- Now they are screwing us out of a redundancy, they said that as they are offering us equivalent jobs at Company B then there will be no redundancy payment if we don’t sign on to Company B.
They had sent an email week ago stating that there would be a redundancy payment and now they are saying there is not. I looked up the fair work act (Australia) and it’s correct that we are not actually entitled to a redundancy payment but I’m guessing that since they told us we are and now we are not there would be some room for argument, anyone know?
You can always argue anything, and if you have a trades union I'm sure they will be able to argue it on your behalf.  I think a legal case based on estoppel (the idea that you can hold someone to their word if you have acted to your detriment as a result) probably doesn't apply because you hadn't lost the offer of the job at Company B before Company A changed their minds.  But definitely one for the Australians to answer more definitively (or as least as definitively as any free legal opinion over the internet).

Ditto.  I don't think you could show any actual damages.  But they suck :-/

So they made a mistake in saying you would receive a redundancy payment.  But really, why should they pay you to quit?  They literally want to keep you working at your job and are including a bonus FOR YOU TO KEEP YOUR JOB.  My employers pay me to work, but if I QUIT they wouldn't pay me extra money because I chose to not work with them.  It's nice to get pay for quitting, but that's not really the way the world works.  I'm not sure if there's more to the story, but you just seem salty that you can't get free money when you're providing no value to the company (if you leave).
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: shelivesthedream on March 11, 2018, 01:38:43 AM
Quote
It's nice to get paid for quitting, but that's not really the way the world works.

Except it kind of is, though. You might think that you shouldn't get a redundancy payment (given that there is another job available) but they are very common and it is not unreasonable for the OP to expect their company to uphold professional norms. It's not like some huge treat - it's what companies do in this day and age.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Luckyvik on March 11, 2018, 04:15:15 AM
Quote
It's nice to get paid for quitting, but that's not really the way the world works.

Except it kind of is, though. You might think that you shouldn't get a redundancy payment (given that there is another job available) but they are very common and it is not unreasonable for the OP to expect their company to uphold professional norms. It's not like some huge treat - it's what companies do in this day and age.
Thanks @shelivesthedream I will report back what happens
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Trifle on March 11, 2018, 05:43:05 AM
I have a FU story in progress; so I came in to work the other day and we got called into a meeting turns out my part of the Company (Company A) is getting sold to Company B. We got offered our same jobs at Company B with a small sign on bonus.

It’s likely my DH is getting sent to HongKong for work for 6 months in May so I told work I’m not signing the contract with Company B ( I was originally thinking I would ask Company A to work remotely but Company B is a smaller and not international) I’m now hoping I will get a small redundancy. Even if we don’t end up going to HK, we have FU money so I can wait around for the redundancy and then look for another job.

HR said that they will have to try and find me a job in another part of the company before they look into redundancy. So, we will see what happens!

I’m one of the minority that can afford to hang around without a job.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Update- Now they are screwing us out of a redundancy, they said that as they are offering us equivalent jobs at Company B then there will be no redundancy payment if we don’t sign on to Company B.
They had sent an email week ago stating that there would be a redundancy payment and now they are saying there is not. I looked up the fair work act (Australia) and it’s correct that we are not actually entitled to a redundancy payment but I’m guessing that since they told us we are and now we are not there would be some room for argument, anyone know?
You can always argue anything, and if you have a trades union I'm sure they will be able to argue it on your behalf.  I think a legal case based on estoppel (the idea that you can hold someone to their word if you have acted to your detriment as a result) probably doesn't apply because you hadn't lost the offer of the job at Company B before Company A changed their minds.  But definitely one for the Australians to answer more definitively (or as least as definitively as any free legal opinion over the internet).

Ditto.  I don't think you could show any actual damages.  But they suck :-/

So they made a mistake in saying you would receive a redundancy payment.  But really, why should they pay you to quit?  They literally want to keep you working at your job and are including a bonus FOR YOU TO KEEP YOUR JOB.  My employers pay me to work, but if I QUIT they wouldn't pay me extra money because I chose to not work with them.  It's nice to get pay for quitting, but that's not really the way the world works.  I'm not sure if there's more to the story, but you just seem salty that you can't get free money when you're providing no value to the company (if you leave).

I think this totally depends on where you live.  In the US redundancy payments a/k/a severance payouts are not as common, but that's not always true elsewhere. 
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: driftwood on March 11, 2018, 08:05:34 PM
Quote
It's nice to get paid for quitting, but that's not really the way the world works.

Except it kind of is, though. You might think that you shouldn't get a redundancy payment (given that there is another job available) but they are very common and it is not unreasonable for the OP to expect their company to uphold professional norms. It's not like some huge treat - it's what companies do in this day and age.

I thought severance/redudancy pay was for people who were fired, not people who quit. 
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: shelivesthedream on March 12, 2018, 02:16:25 AM
Quote
It's nice to get paid for quitting, but that's not really the way the world works.

Except it kind of is, though. You might think that you shouldn't get a redundancy payment (given that there is another job available) but they are very common and it is not unreasonable for the OP to expect their company to uphold professional norms. It's not like some huge treat - it's what companies do in this day and age.

I thought severance/redudancy pay was for people who were fired, not people who quit.

Being fired and being made redundant are different. If you're fired its because you personally did something so they fire you and hire someone else to do your old job. Being made redundant means that the company decides your job doesn't exist any more. They may offer you something roughly equivalent, but you can argue that it's not the same job and they have basically made you unemployed through no fault of your own. Again, you may believe that redundancy payouts shouldn't exist, but the fact is that a great many companies will then offer you X months salary as a kind of apology. Why? Well, if nothing else, word gets around and it makes them look like nice people who care about their (former) employees.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Linea_Norway on March 12, 2018, 02:26:37 AM
Quote
It's nice to get paid for quitting, but that's not really the way the world works.

Except it kind of is, though. You might think that you shouldn't get a redundancy payment (given that there is another job available) but they are very common and it is not unreasonable for the OP to expect their company to uphold professional norms. It's not like some huge treat - it's what companies do in this day and age.

I thought severance/redudancy pay was for people who were fired, not people who quit.

Being fired and being made redundant are different. If you're fired its because you personally did something so they fire you and hire someone else to do your old job. Being made redundant means that the company decides your job doesn't exist any more. They may offer you something roughly equivalent, but you can argue that it's not the same job and they have basically made you unemployed through no fault of your own. Again, you may believe that redundancy payouts shouldn't exist, but the fact is that a great many companies will then offer you X months salary as a kind of apology. Why? Well, if nothing else, word gets around and it makes them look like nice people who care about their (former) employees.

Sometimes companies (want to) fire someone without have a legitimate reason. Then they also pay/or forced to pay a severance package for that.
If you are close to FIRE that might be a strategy... Make yourself less attractive without doing anything wrong formally and get fired with a nice package.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Zaga on March 12, 2018, 04:59:11 AM
A company I worked for was bought out and the new owners wanted anyone who wasn't perfectly happy to leave, so they offered anyone who signed up 6 months pay to leave.  I had been wanting to leave so that was the kick in the butt I needed to do so.

Not exactly a redundancy, but a severance package for leaving.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Maenad on March 12, 2018, 05:33:27 AM
DH now has an epic FU money story. He's a Subject Matter Expert on a specific skill at his job, and the only one who really understands it. His grandboss has recently been pushing him to compromise his standards for documentation that was going into a governmental submission to sell products in a specific country. He was told that he just had to fit 10 gallons of sh*t in a 5 gallon bucket.

His "no"s went repeatedly unacknowledged until an actual deadline was missed (his warning of which was also ignored), then he was hauled into the office for a dressing-down - he's just a clock-puncher, leaves his computer at his desk in the evenings, works from home too much (though it's OK when other people do it), etc. He firmly defended himself - he was promised decent work-life balance in the interviewing process (he specifically asked), he was promised that WFH was OK under certain conditions, which are met every time, etc. By now he's royally pissed because people have basically been spying on him at work and running to the grandboss like little children. He figures he'll be fired any day now.

We're taking a few days off to decompress this week, and spent yesterday looking at our budget/tracking spreadsheet. Even if he quits/gets fired this month and never works again, we'll still be contributing to savings every month and it'll push back ER for me 6 months to a year. So it really doesn't matter, and he really doesn't care - the damage to his reputation for submitting crappy work would be worse than any "clock-punching" accusations.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: EricL on March 12, 2018, 12:06:55 PM
DH now has an epic FU money story. He's a Subject Matter Expert on a specific skill at his job, and the only one who really understands it. His grandboss has recently been pushing him to compromise his standards for documentation that was going into a governmental submission to sell products in a specific country. He was told that he just had to fit 10 gallons of sh*t in a 5 gallon bucket.

His "no"s went repeatedly unacknowledged until an actual deadline was missed (his warning of which was also ignored), then he was hauled into the office for a dressing-down - he's just a clock-puncher, leaves his computer at his desk in the evenings, works from home too much (though it's OK when other people do it), etc. He firmly defended himself - he was promised decent work-life balance in the interviewing process (he specifically asked), he was promised that WFH was OK under certain conditions, which are met every time, etc. By now he's royally pissed because people have basically been spying on him at work and running to the grandboss like little children. He figures he'll be fired any day now.

We're taking a few days off to decompress this week, and spent yesterday looking at our budget/tracking spreadsheet. Even if he quits/gets fired this month and never works again, we'll still be contributing to savings every month and it'll push back ER for me 6 months to a year. So it really doesn't matter, and he really doesn't care - the damage to his reputation for submitting crappy work would be worse than any "clock-punching" accusations.

I hope he documented his employer's sleazy requests.  It could prove a handy bargaining chip/hand grenade, depending.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: NoraLenderbee on March 12, 2018, 03:05:55 PM
Quote
It's nice to get paid for quitting, but that's not really the way the world works.

Except it kind of is, though. You might think that you shouldn't get a redundancy payment (given that there is another job available) but they are very common and it is not unreasonable for the OP to expect their company to uphold professional norms. It's not like some huge treat - it's what companies do in this day and age.

I thought severance/redudancy pay was for people who were fired, not people who quit.

Redundancy (UK) = layoff (US). Your position is eliminated; you aren't losing your job for performance reasons. You're eligible for severance, if it's offered.
Being fired = you lose your job because they didn't like something you did. Not eligible for severance (in the US), usually.
Quitting = you choose to leave; the company owes you no severance because they didn't make the decision.

Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Laura33 on March 14, 2018, 06:33:06 AM
Quote
It's nice to get paid for quitting, but that's not really the way the world works.

Except it kind of is, though. You might think that you shouldn't get a redundancy payment (given that there is another job available) but they are very common and it is not unreasonable for the OP to expect their company to uphold professional norms. It's not like some huge treat - it's what companies do in this day and age.

I thought severance/redudancy pay was for people who were fired, not people who quit.

Being fired and being made redundant are different. If you're fired its because you personally did something so they fire you and hire someone else to do your old job. Being made redundant means that the company decides your job doesn't exist any more. They may offer you something roughly equivalent, but you can argue that it's not the same job and they have basically made you unemployed through no fault of your own. Again, you may believe that redundancy payouts shouldn't exist, but the fact is that a great many companies will then offer you X months salary as a kind of apology. Why? Well, if nothing else, word gets around and it makes them look like nice people who care about their (former) employees.

Another reason employers offer severance is as an enticement to stay for some set period of time to assist in an orderly transition -- they know that with the uncertainty of a pending merger or whatever, people with options (i.e., the best employees) are immediately going to start looking for other jobs and jumping ship, so they promise severance for anyone who stays through X date. 

In the US, one other popular reason for severance is to persuade people who are being let go to sign a release of any claims against the company.  We do that -- not because we think we have done anything wrong (I'm in charge of our compliance and would bust heads if I knew of anything like that), but because in the US it is very, very easy to file a lawsuit, and even if the suit has no merit, you can still spend a lot of time and money defending against it.  So we offer something like two weeks' pay in return for a release of all such claims.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Adventine on March 14, 2018, 11:39:17 AM
FU money also gives you the ability to be a pleasant worker bee in a hive teeming with discontent.

I project a nice and pleasant demeanor at work, partly because I like to do it and partly because the workday is just that much easier with a positive attitude.

I noticed that, for a couple of weeks now, after our annual performance review and bonus payout, several members of my team have become sullen, disengaged and even openly hostile to management and perceived management "favorites." Unfortunately, one of the perceived "favorites" seems to be... me. At least, that's what I suspect with some people who would formerly say hi in passing, and now don't even acknowledge my greetings or pointedly leave me out of conversations.

It's sad that I got a good performance review/bonus and they (apparently) didn't, but what can I do about that?

Not much, except stay consistently nice and pleasant to everybody, finish all my deliverables on time, and keep coming to work with a smile on my face, and the secret knowledge that I've got 10 years worth of expenses saved up, am stashing 50% of my takehome pay, and can smilingly walk away from rude behavior every time.

Now that I think about it, maybe the consistently pleasant demeanor is exactly what they find so irritating ;)
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: albireo13 on March 15, 2018, 05:32:48 PM
Is your nose brown??

[MOD NOTE: Forum Rule #1]
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: nnls on March 15, 2018, 07:00:12 PM

Now that I think about it, maybe the consistently pleasant demeanor is exactly what they find so irritating ;)
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Dicey on March 15, 2018, 07:10:12 PM
^^Love this!^^
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: SwordGuy on March 15, 2018, 10:35:39 PM
Is your nose brown??

That was an uncalled for statement. 

Bless your heart, it's possible to be perfectly charming, polite, and friendly while not taking shit from anyone. 

.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Prairie Stash on March 16, 2018, 09:11:41 AM
Quote
It's nice to get paid for quitting, but that's not really the way the world works.

Except it kind of is, though. You might think that you shouldn't get a redundancy payment (given that there is another job available) but they are very common and it is not unreasonable for the OP to expect their company to uphold professional norms. It's not like some huge treat - it's what companies do in this day and age.

I thought severance/redudancy pay was for people who were fired, not people who quit.

Redundancy (UK) = layoff (US). Your position is eliminated; you aren't losing your job for performance reasons. You're eligible for severance, if it's offered.
Being fired = you lose your job because they didn't like something you did. Not eligible for severance (in the US), usually.
Quitting = you choose to leave; the company owes you no severance because they didn't make the decision.
Constructive Dismissal - making the job situation intolerable enough that a person quits. Generally eligible for severance.

The person quits, but argues they had no choice. An example can be frequent harassment by colleagues, if you are sexually harassed and quit, its not your fault and the comapny should provide severance. There are a lot of other reasons, the general theme is the company takes actions that make you miserable and you leave (quit), with cause. It requires you to obtain an employment lawyer, generally bridges are burned and it can be very messy.

However the threat of constructive dismissal, or the potential for it, often leads to companies providing severance. Its cheaper and better for a company to provide severance than risk the lawsuit.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: jeninco on March 16, 2018, 09:52:55 AM
Is your nose brown??

That was an uncalled for statement. 

Bless your heart, it's possible to be perfectly charming, polite, and friendly while not taking shit from anyone. 

.

That was a near coffee-keyboard miss, and I'm sure I'm not the only one who caught that -- well played!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: BlueHouse on March 16, 2018, 02:25:08 PM
FU money also gives you the ability to be a pleasant worker bee in a hive teeming with discontent.
I project a nice and pleasant demeanor at work, partly because I like to do it and partly because the workday is just that much easier with a positive attitude.


I love this! I need to remember this more often because I hate being one of those negative people.  Negative people are a drag to be around and I don't want to be one of them!
Quote
... the secret knowledge that I've got 10 years worth of expenses saved up, am stashing 50% of my takehome pay, and can smilingly walk away from rude behavior every time.

Woo HOO!!!!  That's what it's all about!  Way to go, Adventine!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: albireo13 on March 22, 2018, 04:03:27 PM
Is your nose brown??

That was an uncalled for statement. 

Bless your heart, it's possible to be perfectly charming, polite, and friendly while not taking shit from anyone. 

.

Indeed.     : )
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Missy B on March 25, 2018, 11:05:31 PM
I knew a legal admin assistant, very experienced, with the same law firm for thirty years. At some point when she was over sixty, she went in to the partner who made the decisions about staffing, and said, "I'd really like to work 4 days instead of 5. I need the extra day, I don't have the energy I used to." She had a pretty serious hip condition, and she just kept working, never complained about it. She was finding herself still really fatigued after the weekend, and knew she needed to back off work.
"Oh," he says. "Well. That's just not possible. You can't work four days! We need you here, the office is open five days not four, etc." End of discussion.
"Alright," she says. "I thought you might say that, and I understand. And 'm not in a position to work five days anymore. And so I have this for you." And she puts a letter of resignation on his desk, which she had already done. And his eyes go round. He started back-pedalling immediately. Oh, wait, we can work something out, we really need you, yada. So she got her four days. She worked there about 2 more years, then retired.
She had quite a bit of snarky push-back from the 23-year olds doing admin. "Must be nice to work four days," blah blah. They seemed to not grasp that once you've worked somewhere 30 years, you might be valuable enough to work on *your* terms.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: AnnaGrowsAMustache on March 26, 2018, 01:29:22 AM
I knew a legal admin assistant, very experienced, with the same law firm for thirty years. At some point when she was over sixty, she went in to the partner who made the decisions about staffing, and said, "I'd really like to work 4 days instead of 5. I need the extra day, I don't have the energy I used to." She had a pretty serious hip condition, and she just kept working, never complained about it. She was finding herself still really fatigued after the weekend, and knew she needed to back off work.
"Oh," he says. "Well. That's just not possible. You can't work four days! We need you here, the office is open five days not four, etc." End of discussion.
"Alright," she says. "I thought you might say that, and I understand. And 'm not in a position to work five days anymore. And so I have this for you." And she puts a letter of resignation on his desk, which she had already done. And his eyes go round. He started back-pedalling immediately. Oh, wait, we can work something out, we really need you, yada. So she got her four days. She worked there about 2 more years, then retired.
She had quite a bit of snarky push-back from the 23-year olds doing admin. "Must be nice to work four days," blah blah. They seemed to not grasp that once you've worked somewhere 30 years, you might be valuable enough to work on *your* terms.

You don't even have to work somewhere 30 years. All you need is a bit of money, and the gumption to say what you want. Employment is a transaction. I decide what my side of that transaction consists of.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: mm1970 on March 26, 2018, 10:45:17 AM
I knew a legal admin assistant, very experienced, with the same law firm for thirty years. At some point when she was over sixty, she went in to the partner who made the decisions about staffing, and said, "I'd really like to work 4 days instead of 5. I need the extra day, I don't have the energy I used to." She had a pretty serious hip condition, and she just kept working, never complained about it. She was finding herself still really fatigued after the weekend, and knew she needed to back off work.
"Oh," he says. "Well. That's just not possible. You can't work four days! We need you here, the office is open five days not four, etc." End of discussion.
"Alright," she says. "I thought you might say that, and I understand. And 'm not in a position to work five days anymore. And so I have this for you." And she puts a letter of resignation on his desk, which she had already done. And his eyes go round. He started back-pedalling immediately. Oh, wait, we can work something out, we really need you, yada. So she got her four days. She worked there about 2 more years, then retired.
She had quite a bit of snarky push-back from the 23-year olds doing admin. "Must be nice to work four days," blah blah. They seemed to not grasp that once you've worked somewhere 30 years, you might be valuable enough to work on *your* terms.
Yes, I  worked less than 40 hours for a bit after I had my kids.  At my current company, a year of it - mat leave for 10 weeks, then 25 hrs a week for a  few weeks, then 32 hrs a week for the rest of the first year.

So I have many many coworkers around the age of 60-62.  And one of them, in particular I've known forever.  His kids are grown.  His wife works (which is different than most of the other 60-62 year olds, many of them have SAH spouses.)  So, he decided he wanted to "ease" his way into retirement.  Keeping up our pace of a semiconductor company, where these guys are either PhDs or directors doing lots of brain work, is a challenge.  So he asked me what my deal was back then, because he wants to keep the insurance.  At our company, that requires 30 hrs a week (he was hoping for 25).

Anyway, he made the switch.  One guy in particular is so snarky about how "nice" it must be to only work 30 hours.  I pointed out that he gets paid less.  "But we get paid for 40 and work 50!"  Well, that's your deal, right?  The guy who cut his hours is still salaried, so if he works 35 he only gets paid for 30.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: albireo13 on April 03, 2018, 05:18:11 AM
Is your nose brown??

[MOD NOTE: Forum Rule #1]


I want to apologize for my post.  I was in a bad mood from work when I posted.  That's not an excuse.  I violated common decency guidelines.
It won't happen again.

  Best to all.

Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Adventine on April 03, 2018, 06:17:01 AM
Is your nose brown??

[MOD NOTE: Forum Rule #1]


I want to apologize for my post.  I was in a bad mood from work when I posted.  That's not an excuse.  I violated common decency guidelines.
It won't happen again.

  Best to all.



Thanks, Frugal Toque and other consistently nice, decent people on this forum.

Also, albireo13, based on your recent posting history, a break from your own job could be a really good idea :)
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Maenad on April 04, 2018, 09:29:47 AM
DH is using our FU money now, and I'm glad to have the option myself.

First Issue:
DH has been really unhappy at work, largely due to an irreconcilable difference between what he thought he was hired for, and what executive leadership thought he was hired for. He had a serious argument with his grandboss, where things were said. Things you can't take back. Our FU money meant that he was able to give notice today after we had a "financial summit" over the weekend and saw how easily we could keep going on my salary alone (FU money is a backstop for emergencies). He's been job hunting, but is free to leave before finding something new.

Second Issue:
I get along great with my boss. Just found out he's moving to another division within the company. His position will be back-filled, but with who? Will I get along with the new person? After hearing plenty of "new boss" horror stories, I'm glad to have the option to leave if things get ugly.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Livingthedream55 on April 04, 2018, 10:43:05 AM
DH is using our FU money now, and I'm glad to have the option myself.

First Issue:
DH has been really unhappy at work, largely due to an irreconcilable difference between what he thought he was hired for, and what executive leadership thought he was hired for. He had a serious argument with his grandboss, where things were said. Things you can't take back. Our FU money meant that he was able to give notice today after we had a "financial summit" over the weekend and saw how easily we could keep going on my salary alone (FU money is a backstop for emergencies). He's been job hunting, but is free to leave before finding something new.

Second Issue:
I get along great with my boss. Just found out he's moving to another division within the company. His position will be back-filled, but with who? Will I get along with the new person? After hearing plenty of "new boss" horror stories, I'm glad to have the option to leave if things get ugly.

Indeed. It's about freedom. It's very different when going to work everyday is a choice not a necessity. I have "enough" for bare bones FIRE now but am padding my safety net/fun "stache" so my retirement next year will be more comfortable. But if work ever became toxic - I'd be out that door!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: frugalnacho on April 04, 2018, 02:33:31 PM
Some minor back story for me:  My parents got foreclosed on 5 years ago, and I let them move into my house for far below fair market value (about $400-500 below FMV, I just asked them to reimburse me for the mortgage/taxes/insurance).  They lived there for 5 years and did not take care of the place.  I finally asked them to leave because I wanted to sell it, and they got all pissed off and it's caused a huge rift in the family.  Things are not good between me and them still. They got all huffy and moved out within a couple weeks and left the place in total disarray. I don't think they cleaned anything the whole time they were there.  So for the past month I've been cleaning it up and fixing things up (up to about $14K so far plus a couple hundred hours between me/wife/her family).    Also we are about 7 months pregnant after a long battle with infertility and going through IVF (and saving up for IVF because we ended up spending about $40k all said and done).  There have been some other major life stresses that I don't even need to go into now.  Suffice to say my life has been shitty and one big ball of stress for several months now.

So I come into work last week and SURPRISE the company you've worked at for 11 years has been sold! And those raises we promised...how about a pay cut instead?

They calculated my pay rate by excluding the bonus I get (about 15% of my total compensation) to get my "base pay", and then basically giving me that.  They also don't cover nearly as much of the insurance premiums as my previous employer.  The end result is that I previously paid about $1500/yr total for insurance for me and my wife, and now the insurance is switching over at 7 months pregnancy and the my new "family" premiums are going to be over $10k/yr.  I expected a slight jump in insurance when we added a kid, but they've totally changed the rules of the game just before the birth, without ever giving me a heads up, and it's going to affect me about $8k/yr.   

I told them the offer was bullshit and that I'm confident I can go find an engineering job paying more than that immediately.  They want me to start off at the bottom and prove myself, even though I have 11 years experience and played a large part in building the company to the level it was at.  I also have plenty of money socked away and could live for a couple years with no job if necessary.  So I told them all to stuff it and cleaned out my desk and walked out. 

Apparently that got their attention, and after a week of tense back and forth negotiation I now have a new contract.  With this new contract I get:

$13k/yr more salary
Large performance based bonus (estimated $10-15k/yr)
performance review/raise halfway between now and the next normal scheduled review
3 weeks paid paternity leave
"unlimited"* vacation
2 employees under me
I've been promised I don't have to do shitty field work anymore, and can just do office work if I want.

Everyone else in the office is stuck and had no real option but to sign their new contract so they can keep getting a paycheck.  I was the lone hold out.  The change didn't affect anyone else nearly as much as it affected me.  It pretty much worked out to equal compensation for everyone, except 2 of us senior guys, and it affected me much more harshly than the other guy.  All in all though I think it ended up working out in my favor, and should actually decrease my time to FIRE by a couple years or more.

*unlimited in the sense that it's only limited by my ability to get my job done.  Not truly unlimited, but I won't hit a point where they say "no you can't take that day off because you already took 14 days off!".  I'm skeptical how it's all going to work out.

Well there was no bonus for me, or anyone at my office, or anyone in the entire region.  My review/raise scheduled for March 1 hasn't happened yet either.  I've brought it up a few times by this point. 

2017 shaped up that I actually made less money than I did in 2016.  Even after getting a $13k raise from the initial offer, once you factor in the excessive medical premiums and no bonus I made less.  2018 is looking like it's going to be even worse than 2017 (since I'll be with the new company the full year instead of only 5 months like in 2017).

I should have buffed up my resume and been out of here by this point, but I didn't want to cause too much stress to myself or my household by changing careers at the same time as having our first baby.  The baby just screams all night long, so I haven't slept in 5 months and have no time to network or apply to jobs when at home.  I also don't have time to do literally anything.  The last 5 months have been a living hell at home with no sleep, no hobbies, no intimacy, no nothing but dealing with a crying baby.  We have just enough time to cook dinner and clean up, and do laundry, and that all comes at the expense of getting sleep.

The unlimited vacation is a sham, and I'm convinced the company has ulterior motives in offering it.  With the new responsibilities there is never any idle time where I can just fuck off and take vacation.  There is always urgent stuff that needs attention.  But with an unlimited vacation policy they don't have to keep a vacation liability on the books for any of the senior staff, making the books look better.  They also won't have to pay out any accrued vacation when someone leaves, because you don't ever accrue any vacation.

I'd like to start abusing the vacation policy and being a lot more lax at work, but the problem is that I have a personal and professional reputation to uphold, and when I do get another job I will likely work with many of the same people in the industry.  I don't want to shoot myself in the foot by turning in sloppy work or turning in work late, so I feel obligated to deliver quality work still even though I'm fed up with the company.  I don't want to just quit and have a black hole on my resume either, even though I have FU money. 
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: dandarc on April 04, 2018, 02:59:16 PM
That sucks frugalnacho. 

You've hit the nail on the head with the unlimited vacation thing - if the workload alone doesn't get everyone to stop taking vacation, a culture will develop to the same end anyway.  You either call bullshit and take time off anyway or leave.

Best of luck getting out.  In my experience, sloppy is the big thing to avoid - you're just creating more work for yourself later when you rush things.  Late almost never has consequences, because at least where I'm at now, any deadlines are fantasies anyway.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: mm1970 on April 04, 2018, 04:08:23 PM
Quote
Well there was no bonus for me, or anyone at my office, or anyone in the entire region.  My review/raise scheduled for March 1 hasn't happened yet either.  I've brought it up a few times by this point. 

2017 shaped up that I actually made less money than I did in 2016.  Even after getting a $13k raise from the initial offer, once you factor in the excessive medical premiums and no bonus I made less.  2018 is looking like it's going to be even worse than 2017 (since I'll be with the new company the full year instead of only 5 months like in 2017).

I should have buffed up my resume and been out of here by this point, but I didn't want to cause too much stress to myself or my household by changing careers at the same time as having our first baby.  The baby just screams all night long, so I haven't slept in 5 months and have no time to network or apply to jobs when at home.  I also don't have time to do literally anything.  The last 5 months have been a living hell at home with no sleep, no hobbies, no intimacy, no nothing but dealing with a crying baby.  We have just enough time to cook dinner and clean up, and do laundry, and that all comes at the expense of getting sleep.

The unlimited vacation is a sham, and I'm convinced the company has ulterior motives in offering it.  With the new responsibilities there is never any idle time where I can just fuck off and take vacation.  There is always urgent stuff that needs attention.  But with an unlimited vacation policy they don't have to keep a vacation liability on the books for any of the senior staff, making the books look better.  They also won't have to pay out any accrued vacation when someone leaves, because you don't ever accrue any vacation.

I'd like to start abusing the vacation policy and being a lot more lax at work, but the problem is that I have a personal and professional reputation to uphold, and when I do get another job I will likely work with many of the same people in the industry.  I don't want to shoot myself in the foot by turning in sloppy work or turning in work late, so I feel obligated to deliver quality work still even though I'm fed up with the company.  I don't want to just quit and have a black hole on my resume either, even though I have FU money.

This really sucks.  But all I can tell you is...it will get better?

I've got two kids, and the first 2 years were a total wash.  It was probably a bit better for my husband, but nursing, pumping, lack of sleep, full time job (with #1), 80% job (with #2), didn't matter so much.  With kid #1, I was sick for 5 straight months that first winter.  Healthy 30 days from Nov 1 to March 30.  With kid #2 I worked slightly fewer hours and got sick less - but seriously, the quality and volume of output?  Just. Wasn't.  There.  We basically tread water for 2 years with each.  And then, with both kids, right around age 4 you start coming out of the fog.  Now that the little 1 is 6?  I feel almost completely human.

So, my advice would be to keep your head down until you are out of the fob.  Don't worry too much about switching jobs.  Take advantage of flexibility and unlimited PTO.  The hardest thing for me for both kids was getting into the habit of walking out the door at 3:30 pm, when I was used to leaving at 5:30 or 6 pm.  It feels weird.  But you get used to it.  The key thing to remember is that when you are there, you are working.  You are doing good work.  In order for you to do your BEST work you really do need to chill out a bit.  Take vacation.  Shorter work days.  More sleep (as much as possible, anyway, my kids were not good sleepers.)  You will NOT be judged poorly for this if you are getting a lot of  your work done.

The key to refreshing yourself with a vacation is to just take it.  "There's never any time to fuck off."  You aren't fucking off.  You are taking time off.  It might be
- A Friday and a Monday four-day weekend
- A week in Hawaii
- A trip to visit family

The thing is to schedule it.  I mean, schedule it, put it on the calendar, and let everyone know it's happening.  You don't even need to buy plane tickets, just tell people you did.  Don't think that "eh, some day I'm going to just take a Friday off."  That, man, never happens.

Finally, for what it's worth, I started interviewing when my kids were 2.  Changed jobs when kid #1 was 2.5, interviewed when kid #2 was 2 (ended up not changing at that point).  I had a long stretch of no raises, crappy pay, and ended up just cutting my hours way way back because I'm salaried.  And yes, that meant leaving early some days. Coming in late on other days.

There is a light at the end of the tunnel - always keep your finger on the local job market pulse, because you never know.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: frugalnacho on April 04, 2018, 06:34:06 PM
That sucks frugalnacho. 

You've hit the nail on the head with the unlimited vacation thing - if the workload alone doesn't get everyone to stop taking vacation, a culture will develop to the same end anyway.  You either call bullshit and take time off anyway or leave.

Best of luck getting out.  In my experience, sloppy is the big thing to avoid - you're just creating more work for yourself later when you rush things.  Late almost never has consequences, because at least where I'm at now, any deadlines are fantasies anyway.

I did get 3 weeks paternity in november, plus the office shut down for a week over xmas.  I've probably taken 4-5 fridays off in addition to that.  I haven't scheduled another vacation, was kind of waiting for the whole review/raise thing before I started pushing my luck.  But if they aren't going to give a raise, and they aren't doing bonuses, I have no real incentive to bust my ass above and beyond not getting fired.  Well that and my personal/professional reputation.  I will likely end up working for one of our clients or another consulting firm we deal with.  I could end up some where else entirely, but why shut down those opportunities?

I deal with the EPA and the state level equivalents, so most of my deadlines are hard deadlines.

I'm getting my resume in order, starting to network, and talking to recruiters.  I don't know if I'm going to jump ship now, but I'm going to be open to any good opportunities should they present themselves.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: frugalnacho on April 04, 2018, 06:58:45 PM
This really sucks.  But all I can tell you is...it will get better?

I've got two kids, and the first 2 years were a total wash.  It was probably a bit better for my husband, but nursing, pumping, lack of sleep, full time job (with #1), 80% job (with #2), didn't matter so much.  With kid #1, I was sick for 5 straight months that first winter.  Healthy 30 days from Nov 1 to March 30.  With kid #2 I worked slightly fewer hours and got sick less - but seriously, the quality and volume of output?  Just. Wasn't.  There.  We basically tread water for 2 years with each.  And then, with both kids, right around age 4 you start coming out of the fog.  Now that the little 1 is 6?  I feel almost completely human.

So, my advice would be to keep your head down until you are out of the fob.  Don't worry too much about switching jobs.  Take advantage of flexibility and unlimited PTO.  The hardest thing for me for both kids was getting into the habit of walking out the door at 3:30 pm, when I was used to leaving at 5:30 or 6 pm.  It feels weird.  But you get used to it.  The key thing to remember is that when you are there, you are working.  You are doing good work.  In order for you to do your BEST work you really do need to chill out a bit.  Take vacation.  Shorter work days.  More sleep (as much as possible, anyway, my kids were not good sleepers.)  You will NOT be judged poorly for this if you are getting a lot of  your work done.

The key to refreshing yourself with a vacation is to just take it.  "There's never any time to fuck off."  You aren't fucking off.  You are taking time off.  It might be
- A Friday and a Monday four-day weekend
- A week in Hawaii
- A trip to visit family

The thing is to schedule it.  I mean, schedule it, put it on the calendar, and let everyone know it's happening.  You don't even need to buy plane tickets, just tell people you did.  Don't think that "eh, some day I'm going to just take a Friday off."  That, man, never happens.

Finally, for what it's worth, I started interviewing when my kids were 2.  Changed jobs when kid #1 was 2.5, interviewed when kid #2 was 2 (ended up not changing at that point).  I had a long stretch of no raises, crappy pay, and ended up just cutting my hours way way back because I'm salaried.  And yes, that meant leaving early some days. Coming in late on other days.

There is a light at the end of the tunnel - always keep your finger on the local job market pulse, because you never know.

I know I'm not fucking off, but there always seems to be something going on that makes it so I shouldn't be taking vacation.  Big job going on, or having just gone on, or just coming up.  Or a back log of reports that needs to be done.  Right now we've got like 5 big clients that all need their reports asap. So "fucking off" this week is not ideal...but it's always like this! We are always busy!  And I don't get over time.  And I apparently don't get a bonus. So maybe I should just schedule myself a vacation soon.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Rowellen on April 04, 2018, 09:22:06 PM
Yes do it. Schedule that vacation and take it. Just think. The company won't give a shit if work dries up and they need to lay people off. They won't hesitate to shaft you. You don't owe them your loyalty. The work will be done by someone else while you're away or it will wait until you return. Either way, you are entitled to time off and you need to take it or you will lose it.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: firelight on April 05, 2018, 04:13:08 AM
Another person here with unlimited vacation policy company. My bosses are pretty good in taking vacations and don't discourage people from taking theirs. I usually pencil in atleast a day every month or two as mental health days and take them. I run errands, have a relaxed day without kids and generally putter around the house. Also I've found that in companies with unlimited vacation policy, the work never ends and it's always urgent. You have to be the adult and take the vacation when you need them.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: BlueHouse on April 05, 2018, 08:47:04 AM

I deal with the EPA and the state level equivalents, so most of my deadlines are hard deadlines.


There may be a high-level job opening coming open soon at the EPA.  And if it does, I know where you can get a real cheap (but still "market rate") apartment for commuting.  haha
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Ananas on April 05, 2018, 11:27:10 AM
I know I'm not fucking off, but there always seems to be something going on that makes it so I shouldn't be taking vacation.  Big job going on, or having just gone on, or just coming up.  Or a back log of reports that needs to be done.  Right now we've got like 5 big clients that all need their reports asap. So "fucking off" this week is not ideal...but it's always like this! We are always busy!  And I don't get over time.  And I apparently don't get a bonus. So maybe I should just schedule myself a vacation soon.

If you schedule it well in advance, then it should be fine. I have adopted the following mindset: your lack of planning and foresight (boss/company) are not my emergency.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: frugalnacho on April 06, 2018, 10:17:01 AM
Well I just got $6k/yr out of cycle raise today, and a promise that regular review/raises are happening for the entire office (including me) in July.

It's like they know how to give just enough to keep me on board.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Dicey on April 06, 2018, 10:38:14 AM
Well I just got $6k/yr out of cycle raise today, and a promise that regular review/raises are happening for the entire office (including me) in July.

It's like they know how to give just enough to keep me on board.
At least they've figured that out...so many are clueless.  Congratulations!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: solon on April 06, 2018, 10:44:02 AM
Well I just got $6k/yr out of cycle raise today, and a promise that regular review/raises are happening for the entire office (including me) in July.

It's like they know how to give just enough to keep me on board.

Yeah, I'm having a hard time drumming up any empathy...
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: frugalnacho on April 06, 2018, 11:45:41 AM
Well I just got $6k/yr out of cycle raise today, and a promise that regular review/raises are happening for the entire office (including me) in July.

It's like they know how to give just enough to keep me on board.

Yeah, I'm having a hard time drumming up any empathy...

Once you factor in the excessive medical premiums the new company passes to employees*, and the fact that they fucked everyone on a bonus (which I received 12/12 years I worked here before the acquisition) this new $6k raise on top of the $13k raise I fought for at the start, it pretty much just puts me back to what I was earning before the acquisition.  $19k/yr sounds like a lot, but $10k/yr more in medical premiums and a forgone $9k/yr bonus works out to around $19k.  They are acting like they are doing me some huge favor by giving me back the salary they cut from me last year.

*My medical deductions went from around $1.5k/yr to almost $12k/yr.  This year I've switched to a HDHP that is only costing me $6k, but now I have to pay out of pocket for everything.  I was hoping to save money, but with the amount of dr visits for the baby I think my overall medical expenses are going to be the same as the shitty plan last year.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: mm1970 on April 06, 2018, 01:34:45 PM
Well I just got $6k/yr out of cycle raise today, and a promise that regular review/raises are happening for the entire office (including me) in July.

It's like they know how to give just enough to keep me on board.

Yeah, I'm having a hard time drumming up any empathy...

Once you factor in the excessive medical premiums the new company passes to employees*, and the fact that they fucked everyone on a bonus (which I received 12/12 years I worked here before the acquisition) this new $6k raise on top of the $13k raise I fought for at the start, it pretty much just puts me back to what I was earning before the acquisition.  $19k/yr sounds like a lot, but $10k/yr more in medical premiums and a forgone $9k/yr bonus works out to around $19k.  They are acting like they are doing me some huge favor by giving me back the salary they cut from me last year.

*My medical deductions went from around $1.5k/yr to almost $12k/yr.  This year I've switched to a HDHP that is only costing me $6k, but now I have to pay out of pocket for everything.  I was hoping to save money, but with the amount of dr visits for the baby I think my overall medical expenses are going to be the same as the shitty plan last year.

This seems to be par for the course on acquisitions - take stuff away and see how much you'll put up with.  I think it's worth looking around.

The good thing about interviewing around is that...you figure out what you are worth. Sometimes, the job market isn't great and you aren't worth what you think you are.  And of course, that varies by location and year.  Sometimes, you go out there and realize that you are WAY underpaid.

I've seen both in my town in the last 5 years.  Some have quit and gotten screwed (but ended up fine in the end after another move or two).  Some have gotten laid off and are making 50% more than they were here.  I'm still "here" and yay, I got a promotion and a raise, but I know very well that I'm now making exactly what the two lower paid engineers were hired at ... in 2011. 
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: NykkiC on April 06, 2018, 11:10:39 PM
Well I just got $6k/yr out of cycle raise today, and a promise that regular review/raises are happening for the entire office (including me) in July.

It's like they know how to give just enough to keep me on board.

Yeah, I'm having a hard time drumming up any empathy...

Once you factor in the excessive medical premiums the new company passes to employees*, and the fact that they fucked everyone on a bonus (which I received 12/12 years I worked here before the acquisition) this new $6k raise on top of the $13k raise I fought for at the start, it pretty much just puts me back to what I was earning before the acquisition.  $19k/yr sounds like a lot, but $10k/yr more in medical premiums and a forgone $9k/yr bonus works out to around $19k.  They are acting like they are doing me some huge favor by giving me back the salary they cut from me last year.

*My medical deductions went from around $1.5k/yr to almost $12k/yr.  This year I've switched to a HDHP that is only costing me $6k, but now I have to pay out of pocket for everything.  I was hoping to save money, but with the amount of dr visits for the baby I think my overall medical expenses are going to be the same as the shitty plan last year.

Personally, I wouldn’t be quiet about this (not saying you are, just that I wouldn’t be). Any time someone called this a raise, I would politely (but firmly) reply that it was restoring some of the (arbitrary) cuts to my remuneration package. Depending on the audience, I might even point out that I am still worse off than before (due to higher cost of the out of pocket expenses on the new healthcare plan, if I’m reading it right).

Words have power, as does the time frame chosen to assess things on, and some of that power is subconscious. When you add that managers usually have the pressure to keep costs down, I would be concerned that the “raise” you got would (subconsciously or consciously) cause the person doing the review to think ‘NykkiC got a raise recently, there are others who should get one before her.’

But that could just be my paranoia.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: BlueHouse on April 08, 2018, 08:40:53 PM

Personally, I wouldn’t be quiet about this (not saying you are, just that I wouldn’t be). Any time someone called this a raise, I would politely (but firmly) reply that it was restoring some of the (arbitrary) cuts to my remuneration package. Depending on the audience, I might even point out that I am still worse off than before (due to higher cost of the out of pocket expenses on the new healthcare plan, if I’m reading it right).

Words have power, as does the time frame chosen to assess things on, and some of that power is subconscious. When you add that managers usually have the pressure to keep costs down, I would be concerned that the “raise” you got would (subconsciously or consciously) cause the person doing the review to think ‘NykkiC got a raise recently, there are others who should get one before him.’

But that could just be my paranoia.
+1.  Brilliant
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Prairie Stash on April 13, 2018, 11:45:21 AM
I'm so very happy.

My wife just used the FU money a couple hours ago. She has been employed at 60% time; 24 hours/week tuesday - thursday (3-8 hour shifts). This schedule started after her return from maternity leave so that she could spend more time with the kids and stay employed. It was the optimal solution for us, everyone was happy and we kept on saving. The kids have a little time away from us with other kids, we get more time than we use to with the kids.

Yesterday she was told thats coming to an end, she needs to go to full time. As she is late 30's with two kids, I think her supervisor expected compliance, I think it came as a surprse when my wife wanted to mull it over. As in all these caes the unspoken alternative was she's out of work, no one ever thinks people will consider that option. Luckily for us, we have a decent stash, she isn't bound by normal conventions of needing to cover rent and can live the life she wants. Still, its pretty scary to be confronted with it even after all this preparation.

In case it needs to be said, she said No to returning to full time work. The unspoken alternative is still not being whispered out loud, it happened so fast that I don't think its sunk in yet. I have no idea yet if they'll try to keep her or let her go, I suspect they feel she's bluffing. She still wants to work at 60%, but shes willing to never work again, I'm also sitting on the precipice of FIRE, we're just saving so we can live a few years overseas as a family at this point.

It just makes me so happy that she can make her choice. If she's out of work, her last day should fall on our anniversary. I think that will gurantee I'm husband of the year which is great; however looking forward I'm pretty much going to be a dissapointment for the rest of our anniversaries though, this is impossible to beat.
Update:
So she delayed the actual end date to make sure she got the annual bonus. Then a little more to get some health benefits; we get drug plans so we stocked up on drugs. The delay was interesting in that it added 2 days of work to her schedule (on top of the regular days) but probably gained us $3500-4000 in benefits and bonus (still waiting to see all the numbers).

We pulled out a calendar when we worked out the various end dates at home. We added in public holidays, never quit the day before a holiday (Easter)! Then looked at health benefits, new fiscal calendar, fresh benefits! Then looked at existing holidays to see if we could stretch the schedule out and mimic her current schedule, that added a week of potential work. It was a bit of work but well worth the planning, I highly recommend it to anyone leaving a job.

Although it would have been fun to walk out; the slow leave is going to be very lucrative and extremely satisfying. We still get what we want, plus a little extra. We get to stick to our principles and she doesn't need to sacrifice her life for work, I call that a win. On my end, the extra speeds up my FIRE date, which is looking closer than ever, her departure has really got me thinking.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: SwordGuy on April 13, 2018, 01:59:12 PM
I picked May 1st for 3 reasons:

#1) Most important, it's during my wife's last week of work, grading final exams and papers.  It will make her life easier if I do more chores that week.

#2) May 1st is a Tuesday.  The preceding Friday and Monday are paid holidays.   Why turn down free money?

#3) May 1st is International Worker's Day.   "Workers of the World, Unite!  You have nothing to lose but your chains!"   I'm losing my chains on that day, for sure!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: mm1970 on April 13, 2018, 02:17:59 PM
I'm so very happy.

My wife just used the FU money a couple hours ago. She has been employed at 60% time; 24 hours/week tuesday - thursday (3-8 hour shifts). This schedule started after her return from maternity leave so that she could spend more time with the kids and stay employed. It was the optimal solution for us, everyone was happy and we kept on saving. The kids have a little time away from us with other kids, we get more time than we use to with the kids.

Yesterday she was told thats coming to an end, she needs to go to full time. As she is late 30's with two kids, I think her supervisor expected compliance, I think it came as a surprse when my wife wanted to mull it over. As in all these caes the unspoken alternative was she's out of work, no one ever thinks people will consider that option. Luckily for us, we have a decent stash, she isn't bound by normal conventions of needing to cover rent and can live the life she wants. Still, its pretty scary to be confronted with it even after all this preparation.

In case it needs to be said, she said No to returning to full time work. The unspoken alternative is still not being whispered out loud, it happened so fast that I don't think its sunk in yet. I have no idea yet if they'll try to keep her or let her go, I suspect they feel she's bluffing. She still wants to work at 60%, but shes willing to never work again, I'm also sitting on the precipice of FIRE, we're just saving so we can live a few years overseas as a family at this point.

It just makes me so happy that she can make her choice. If she's out of work, her last day should fall on our anniversary. I think that will gurantee I'm husband of the year which is great; however looking forward I'm pretty much going to be a dissapointment for the rest of our anniversaries though, this is impossible to beat.
Update:
So she delayed the actual end date to make sure she got the annual bonus. Then a little more to get some health benefits; we get drug plans so we stocked up on drugs. The delay was interesting in that it added 2 days of work to her schedule (on top of the regular days) but probably gained us $3500-4000 in benefits and bonus (still waiting to see all the numbers).

We pulled out a calendar when we worked out the various end dates at home. We added in public holidays, never quit the day before a holiday (Easter)! Then looked at health benefits, new fiscal calendar, fresh benefits! Then looked at existing holidays to see if we could stretch the schedule out and mimic her current schedule, that added a week of potential work. It was a bit of work but well worth the planning, I highly recommend it to anyone leaving a job.

Although it would have been fun to walk out; the slow leave is going to be very lucrative and extremely satisfying. We still get what we want, plus a little extra. We get to stick to our principles and she doesn't need to sacrifice her life for work, I call that a win. On my end, the extra speeds up my FIRE date, which is looking closer than ever, her departure has really got me thinking.
This is awesome
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Bicycle_B on April 13, 2018, 03:28:21 PM
@SwordGuy and @PrairieStash - wow, great family values as well as financial independence.   AWESOME!!!!!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Paul der Krake on April 13, 2018, 04:06:24 PM
I picked May 1st for 3 reasons:

#1) Most important, it's during my wife's last week of work, grading final exams and papers.  It will make her life easier if I do more chores that week.

#2) May 1st is a Tuesday.  The preceding Friday and Monday are paid holidays.   Why turn down free money?

#3) May 1st is International Worker's Day.   "Workers of the World, Unite!  You have nothing to lose but your chains!"   I'm losing my chains on that day, for sure!
#4 subsidized health insurance for the rest of the month
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: crispy on April 13, 2018, 05:05:10 PM
Nice stories!

Having a stash gives you options and let's you take risk. I posted a month ago about possibly making a jump from a very stressful job I really enjoy to promotional position within the same organization for more money, but a worse commute. I decided to make the leap because I really have nothing to lose. If I hate it, I can afford to quit. I ended up with a 50% pay increase and am loving it so far. My stress level has gone way down.

Sadly, I had so many people at the other place say they wish they could leave but are too afraid that it won't work out and they will be unemployed (jobs are protected after a probationary period and transfers or promotions start that period over). It makes me sad that fear and money worked limit people.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: SwordGuy on April 13, 2018, 09:01:19 PM
I picked May 1st for 3 reasons:

#1) Most important, it's during my wife's last week of work, grading final exams and papers.  It will make her life easier if I do more chores that week.

#2) May 1st is a Tuesday.  The preceding Friday and Monday are paid holidays.   Why turn down free money?

#3) May 1st is International Worker's Day.   "Workers of the World, Unite!  You have nothing to lose but your chains!"   I'm losing my chains on that day, for sure!
#4 subsidized health insurance for the rest of the month

1000 to 1 the cheap bastards I work for drop my insurance on the 1st...     
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Sibley on April 14, 2018, 02:47:25 PM
I picked May 1st for 3 reasons:

#1) Most important, it's during my wife's last week of work, grading final exams and papers.  It will make her life easier if I do more chores that week.

#2) May 1st is a Tuesday.  The preceding Friday and Monday are paid holidays.   Why turn down free money?

#3) May 1st is International Worker's Day.   "Workers of the World, Unite!  You have nothing to lose but your chains!"   I'm losing my chains on that day, for sure!
#4 subsidized health insurance for the rest of the month

1000 to 1 the cheap bastards I work for drop my insurance on the 1st...   

If they've already paid the insurance company (probably have) then they can't.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: HouseofLife on May 11, 2018, 12:40:29 PM
Working for someone who is toxic is extremely detrimental, not only to your psych, but also to your health. 

I was an ESL teacher and speak Spanish, also, which meant I did a lot of interpreting in meetings, even when it was not my student being discussed.  I had been moved around to different schools in the system as they moved our minority population around to "balance" the schools racially (not a good move in this system as the schools in the poorer areas were often better performing than the mostly "white" schools. 

Despite the fact that I have decades of experience teaching English to immigrant students successfully, this principal decided I did not know how to teach the children and was forbidden to teach them reading and instead to teach them vocabulary.  The problem is that children learn most of their vocabulary through reading at a certain point as everyday language with children is pretty limited (this is why we read to our children from the time they are babies, to expand their vocabulary and comprehension).

Now, I have a brain injury and could only work three days a week, which really was a huge push for me since I could not function at home, but could not leave financially (did not have FU money as I had used my savings during time off for cancer treatment).

To make a long story short, my principal wrote me up on an observation that was full of lies, which I proved to her during a meeting with others present (including my union rep).  I was told I was not allowed to send my own books home with the students, nor was I to help them learn to read or write (this is what ELL teachers do).  Eventually the stress became so great that I began having seizures on my way home from work one Friday and am now unable to work as this has further injured my brain.

My FU in this is that, since then, the school has gone through many other ESL teachers who have left because the stress was "way too high" and now, I'm sure she is recognizing (although not admitting) that I did know what I was doing.

I have no doubt that if my doctors had not told me I could no longer work, my children would not have a mother now.  The sad part is that I loved teaching.

Wow... I'm so sorry to hear about the crappy treatment from that Principal. I hope that life is treating you much better now!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: bendixso123 on May 11, 2018, 09:01:40 PM
I remember back when I was 26. I had something like $5K in savings, and I wanted to spend more of my days snowboarding (basically work in the evenings and snowboard from 9-5).

I had a string of jobs in restaurants for years, most requiring mixed shifts. In my spare time, I was slowly building up a freelance writing clientele, but I didn't really feel comfortable enough to just go without a stable job for any extended period of time. That is, until a certain fateful job interview at the Bubba Gump Shrimp House (or whatever the hell it is) in Breckenridge Colorado.

The interviewer asked me which hours I would like to work. I told him I only wanted to work in the evenings so I could snowboard during the day.

He got really angry about it and treated me like some punk kid (probably with reason since there were a lot of punk kids trying to do the same). He told me my expectations were ridiculous.

At that point, I figured the interview was over. So I just casually said, "Okay, well this freelance writing thing I've been doing seems to be taking off, so I think I'll just keep doing that." I will never forget the puzzled look on that poor soul's face. Dude was speechless.

I ended up spending that winter doing exactly what I had set out to do. I went snowboarding nearly every day, and I worked on freelance writing projects at night. Most days, I only worked 2-3 hours. I ended up doing that for two more years, and I even took trips down to New Zealand in the summer to keep the good times rolling when we didn't have snow up north.

I eventually moved into higher paying jobs in software, but I try to remind myself of that experience every now and again. Back then, I was in a far weaker financial position than I'm in right now, but I had this sort of ballsy confidence that I could build a writing business out of a crowded snowboarding frat house, spending as little as a few hours a day on it.

My cushion is much bigger now, but none of that really matters because I have something no employer can take from me - the ability to spin up a business out of almost nothing. I've done it with iOS apps and recently software development tutoring. If I were ever to lose my high-paying work, I could easily start growing those businesses without skipping a beat. There's really nothing to fear at all.

So while I certainly love the warm and secure feeling that FU money gives me, I kind of think FU confidence is better. Sometimes I need to do a better job of channeling my younger self. I kind of had it together back then, albeit in a strange and offbeat lazy snowboarder kind of way.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Bicycle_B on May 11, 2018, 09:26:13 PM
Gotta admit, I admire that.  Two thumbs up.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: FIREby35 on May 12, 2018, 07:57:29 AM
tedbendixson: You are 100% on it. I've told my story earlier. But, basically, I learned the same lesson that earning money independently through entrepreneurship is one way to have perfect security - regardless of a huge stack of cash. I run a law firm now but I know I could start a lawn mowing business, Yoga teaching business, table waiting, really anything. There really are infinite ways of earning money when you stop and think about it. There is nothing to fear if you have physical health and are basically willing to help other people by working. If you add a massive stash to that then their really is nothing to fear but fear itself.

Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Imma on May 12, 2018, 11:53:13 AM
I finally have something to share in this thread too! :)  My s/o and I would like to have a family in the future, but for several reasons that's going to be quite difficult. First of all because of health issues, secondly because he's away from home a lot: he has his own business and a side job. We calculated this week that if we were to have a child (which will not happen any time soon, but hopefully a few years from now) we could afford for him to quit his job and become a SAHP! I would work my office job during the day, he would continue his business in the evenings/weekends.

In our calculations, we used our current spending + expected costs for the child (not much, health care is free). We've used my current income, even though I expect to get a few raises before then. We have calculated 0 from his business (unlikely) and 0 in tax credits and benefits (extremely unlikely) and still we'd be able to make ends meet. In this scenario our savings rate would be fairly low for about 4 years, but we would still be able to save a bit and don't expect to have to use our savings, and this is the worst case scenario. It would make us more dependent on my job, but I've got a stable job and there's a social security safety net in case I get ill + he could always get back to work in case it was really necessary.

Of course there's still the health side of it all, but on a financial/practical level this solves a lot of problems. He's always wanted to be a hands-on father and while I'd love to be a very hands-on mother, the reality is that I probably wouldn't be able to cope with all the housework and a young child. This way we both use our full potential: my earning potential is much higher than his and he will be a much better SAHP. He still has his business, so he's not 100% dependent on my income and can still pursue his passion. He wants to go back to work parttime when our kid is in school.

Even though this isn't happening now, we're both really excited about this :) this is the reward for our frugal life. We're on a relatively low income, but our bills are so low that we could live, as a family, on one parttime income. Over the next few years, we'll save some more and hopefully get a higher income and it would only be easier. It would delay FI by a few years, but I've always wanted a family most of all.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: former player on May 12, 2018, 12:09:17 PM
I finally have something to share in this thread too! :)  My s/o and I would like to have a family in the future, but for several reasons that's going to be quite difficult. First of all because of health issues, secondly because he's away from home a lot: he has his own business and a side job. We calculated this week that if we were to have a child (which will not happen any time soon, but hopefully a few years from now) we could afford for him to quit his job and become a SAHP! I would work my office job during the day, he would continue his business in the evenings/weekends.

In our calculations, we used our current spending + expected costs for the child (not much, health care is free). We've used my current income, even though I expect to get a few raises before then. We have calculated 0 from his business (unlikely) and 0 in tax credits and benefits (extremely unlikely) and still we'd be able to make ends meet. In this scenario our savings rate would be fairly low for about 4 years, but we would still be able to save a bit and don't expect to have to use our savings, and this is the worst case scenario. It would make us more dependent on my job, but I've got a stable job and there's a social security safety net in case I get ill + he could always get back to work in case it was really necessary.

Of course there's still the health side of it all, but on a financial/practical level this solves a lot of problems. He's always wanted to be a hands-on father and while I'd love to be a very hands-on mother, the reality is that I probably wouldn't be able to cope with all the housework and a young child. This way we both use our full potential: my earning potential is much higher than his and he will be a much better SAHP. He still has his business, so he's not 100% dependent on my income and can still pursue his passion. He wants to go back to work parttime when our kid is in school.

Even though this isn't happening now, we're both really excited about this :) this is the reward for our frugal life. We're on a relatively low income, but our bills are so low that we could live, as a family, on one parttime income. Over the next few years, we'll save some more and hopefully get a higher income and it would only be easier. It would delay FI by a few years, but I've always wanted a family most of all.
What a lovely post, Imma.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Bicycle_B on May 12, 2018, 12:42:23 PM
Imma, that's wonderful!  True freedom, with purpose.  Very glad for you both.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: SwordGuy on May 12, 2018, 12:49:28 PM
Bravo @Imma    FI preparedness really does give people options in life.   Yeah, you!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Step37 on May 12, 2018, 05:41:14 PM
Really wonderful, Imma. :)
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: BlueHouse on May 13, 2018, 08:45:01 AM
... I only wanted to work in the evenings so I could snowboard during the day.
 He told me my expectations were ridiculous.


Even though I've been working toward a similar goal (at my advanced age of 50), I STILL think this when I hear it from the younger generations.  Of course, I've only met two People IRL (that I know of) who have their financial shit together and who could pull it off if they wanted to.  Everyone else seems to just think they should be handed everything on a silver platter instead of working hard for it.

I won't be so judgemental in the future though when I hear the dreams though.  When I hear it, I'll say "that's great!  How are you setting yourself up financially to achieve it?" 

What I used to refer to as a "beach bum", I'm slowly realizing should be called "someone who knows when they have enough" . 
Anyway, good story @tedbendixson.  Thanks for sharing!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Dave1442397 on May 13, 2018, 10:08:23 AM
I know a guy who quit college to start a business back in the '80s, and was very successful with it. A few years ago, he wanted his son to go to college, and his son said "Why would I waste four years of my time and your money going to school when you could teach me how to become a millionaire?".

By the time the son's friends were graduating with the usual student loan debt, this kid had become a millionaire, and will never be an employee. FU money at that age is a great way to start out in life.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Bicycle_B on May 13, 2018, 10:42:07 AM
^wow
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: bendixso123 on May 14, 2018, 08:56:22 PM
... I only wanted to work in the evenings so I could snowboard during the day.
 He told me my expectations were ridiculous.


Even though I've been working toward a similar goal (at my advanced age of 50), I STILL think this when I hear it from the younger generations.  Of course, I've only met two People IRL (that I know of) who have their financial shit together and who could pull it off if they wanted to.  Everyone else seems to just think they should be handed everything on a silver platter instead of working hard for it.

I won't be so judgemental in the future though when I hear the dreams though.  When I hear it, I'll say "that's great!  How are you setting yourself up financially to achieve it?" 

What I used to refer to as a "beach bum", I'm slowly realizing should be called "someone who knows when they have enough" . 
Anyway, good story @tedbendixson.  Thanks for sharing!

Glad you like the story! I would say "ski bum" doesn't quite fit the sorts of activities my friends and I did (and some of us continue to do) on the slopes.

Frankly, many of the friends I saw each day were pursuing second careers as athletes. We would get up early and hit 60 foot jumps at 9:00 A.M., well before many people had their first cup of coffee. It was really fun and incredibly fulfilling (I still do this when I can but it's different with a full-time job in software).

Anyway, I just wouldn't want to downplay all of the hard work involved in getting to that level athletically, and I think that's a bit of context the guy interviewing me didn't quite have. He didn't see what my friends and I actually did out there. He just saw the typical partier stereotype, which is totally fair because that's what most mountain town 20 somethings are like.

I have a friend who's still really into it. He just turned 30. Lives in Breckenridge, works at the grocery store, makes a great salary, invests a large portion of it, and hits big jumps in the morning before work. We take park laps and discuss early retirement strategies on the chairlift.

If anything, my snowboarding friends are the ones most concerned with getting to FI. We've always known what we want. We opted out of the corporate world and dove right into it after school. It's just that in our 20s, many of us didn't have the financial education to actually achieve it. Now that some of us are waking up to it, our natural inclination is to go all-in. It's what we're used to.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: barbaz on May 15, 2018, 12:29:20 AM
We take park laps and discuss early retirement strategies on the chairlift.

If anything, my snowboarding friends are the ones most concerned with getting to FI. We've always known what we want. We opted out of the corporate world and dove right into it after school. It's just that in our 20s, many of us didn't have the financial education to actually achieve it. Now that some of us are waking up to it, our natural inclination is to go all-in. It's what we're used to.
Being an avid snowboarder is a case where I could understand the old live-now-save-later mentality, but if you manage to do both that qualifies as epic.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Zikoris on June 06, 2018, 07:02:19 PM
Hmm... mild FU Money story?

My partner started up a side gig a couple of months ago, which has been going really well. Yesterday he asked for reduced hours at his day job, since he's getting buried alive in work between the two things. They said no. So he quit. And it won't harm us one penny financially.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Luckyvik on June 06, 2018, 08:15:23 PM
Hmm... mild FU Money story?

My partner started up a side gig a couple of months ago, which has been going really well. Yesterday he asked for reduced hours at his day job, since he's getting buried alive in work between the two things. They said no. So he quit. And it won't harm us one penny financially.
That's great! Congratulations!


Sent from my Pixel 2 using Tapatalk

Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Dicey on June 06, 2018, 11:17:58 PM
Hmm... mild FU Money story?

My partner started up a side gig a couple of months ago, which has been going really well. Yesterday he asked for reduced hours at his day job, since he's getting buried alive in work between the two things. They said no. So he quit. And it won't harm us one penny financially.
It counts. Good for you, plural!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: former player on June 07, 2018, 02:41:03 AM
Hmm... mild FU Money story?

My partner started up a side gig a couple of months ago, which has been going really well. Yesterday he asked for reduced hours at his day job, since he's getting buried alive in work between the two things. They said no. So he quit. And it won't harm us one penny financially.
Not mild at all, but a full working through of the FU money principle.  Congrats to your partner, and to you for having an awesome mustachian partner.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: By the River on June 07, 2018, 06:54:41 AM
Hmm... mild FU Money story?

My partner started up a side gig a couple of months ago, which has been going really well. Yesterday he asked for reduced hours at his day job, since he's getting buried alive in work between the two things. They said no. So he quit. And it won't harm us one penny financially.
It counts. Good for you, plural!

Wouldn't that be y'all?   

Also great for y'all!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Warlord1986 on June 07, 2018, 07:09:55 AM
I remember back when I was 26. I had something like $5K in savings, and I wanted to spend more of my days snowboarding (basically work in the evenings and snowboard from 9-5).

I had a string of jobs in restaurants for years, most requiring mixed shifts. In my spare time, I was slowly building up a freelance writing clientele, but I didn't really feel comfortable enough to just go without a stable job for any extended period of time. That is, until a certain fateful job interview at the Bubba Gump Shrimp House (or whatever the hell it is) in Breckenridge Colorado.

The interviewer asked me which hours I would like to work. I told him I only wanted to work in the evenings so I could snowboard during the day.

He got really angry about it and treated me like some punk kid (probably with reason since there were a lot of punk kids trying to do the same). He told me my expectations were ridiculous.

At that point, I figured the interview was over. So I just casually said, "Okay, well this freelance writing thing I've been doing seems to be taking off, so I think I'll just keep doing that." I will never forget the puzzled look on that poor soul's face. Dude was speechless.

I ended up spending that winter doing exactly what I had set out to do. I went snowboarding nearly every day, and I worked on freelance writing projects at night. Most days, I only worked 2-3 hours. I ended up doing that for two more years, and I even took trips down to New Zealand in the summer to keep the good times rolling when we didn't have snow up north.

I eventually moved into higher paying jobs in software, but I try to remind myself of that experience every now and again. Back then, I was in a far weaker financial position than I'm in right now, but I had this sort of ballsy confidence that I could build a writing business out of a crowded snowboarding frat house, spending as little as a few hours a day on it.

My cushion is much bigger now, but none of that really matters because I have something no employer can take from me - the ability to spin up a business out of almost nothing. I've done it with iOS apps and recently software development tutoring. If I were ever to lose my high-paying work, I could easily start growing those businesses without skipping a beat. There's really nothing to fear at all.

So while I certainly love the warm and secure feeling that FU money gives me, I kind of think FU confidence is better. Sometimes I need to do a better job of channeling my younger self. I kind of had it together back then, albeit in a strange and offbeat lazy snowboarder kind of way.

I need you to adopt me and teach me your ways.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: MrMoogle on June 07, 2018, 08:35:39 AM
Hmm... mild FU Money story?

My partner started up a side gig a couple of months ago, which has been going really well. Yesterday he asked for reduced hours at his day job, since he's getting buried alive in work between the two things. They said no. So he quit. And it won't harm us one penny financially.
It counts. Good for you, plural!

Wouldn't that be y'all?   

Also great for y'all!
Y'all can be singular too, in certain areas, so they say "all y'all."
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Rural on June 07, 2018, 09:02:13 AM
Hmm... mild FU Money story?

My partner started up a side gig a couple of months ago, which has been going really well. Yesterday he asked for reduced hours at his day job, since he's getting buried alive in work between the two things. They said no. So he quit. And it won't harm us one penny financially.
It counts. Good for you, plural!

Wouldn't that be y'all?   

Also great for y'all!
Y'all can be singular too, in certain areas, so they say "all y'all."


Y’all is plural; “all y’all” is for emphasis, as in, “I caint believe all y’all went along with Bob on that one. John and Joe at least shoulda known better.”
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: MrMoogle on June 07, 2018, 10:58:38 AM
Hmm... mild FU Money story?

My partner started up a side gig a couple of months ago, which has been going really well. Yesterday he asked for reduced hours at his day job, since he's getting buried alive in work between the two things. They said no. So he quit. And it won't harm us one penny financially.
It counts. Good for you, plural!

Wouldn't that be y'all?   

Also great for y'all!
Y'all can be singular too, in certain areas, so they say "all y'all."


Y’all is plural; “all y’all” is for emphasis, as in, “I caint believe all y’all went along with Bob on that one. John and Joe at least shoulda known better.”
I've definitely heard it refer to a single person, and I've heard many people use it that way.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Dicey on June 07, 2018, 11:02:50 AM
Hmm... mild FU Money story?

My partner started up a side gig a couple of months ago, which has been going really well. Yesterday he asked for reduced hours at his day job, since he's getting buried alive in work between the two things. They said no. So he quit. And it won't harm us one penny financially.
It counts. Good for you, plural!

Wouldn't that be y'all?   

Also great for y'all!
Y'all can be singular too, in certain areas, so they say "all y'all."


Y’all is plural; “all y’all” is for emphasis, as in, “I caint believe all y’all went along with Billy Bob on that one. John Boy and Joe Junior at least shoulda known better.”
FTFY. These may or may not be actual relatives.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: solon on June 07, 2018, 11:03:34 AM
+1 for the singular y'all. It's much rarer than the plural y'all, but it does happen.

ETA: in this Tim Hawkins stand up, Tim uses the singular y'all to poke fun at the Durant, OK Shakespeare Festival. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Pk0xOkgGbNY
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Rural on June 07, 2018, 12:35:10 PM
+1 for the singular y'all. It's much rarer than the plural y'all, but it does happen.

ETA: in this Tim Hawkins stand up, Tim uses the singular y'all to poke fun at the Durant, OK Shakespeare Festival. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Pk0xOkgGbNY (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Pk0xOkgGbNY)


Oh, some comedy routines have it presented as singular, but it’s not an accurate reflection of the dialect.*


@Dicey, I know you didn’t mean to be offensive, but I chose the names I did in order to avoid stereotypes in discussing one of the dialects of American English. [I debated for quite a while at the phonetic spellings, but eventually used them because I was discussing dialect.]


I don’t mean to jump on you, because I know it’s hard to think of a group of largely Caucasian people as having any sort of minority status, but I’d argue that we aren’t doing southerners, Appalachians, or the rest of the country any favors when we** present the first two groups as universally backward, inbred, etc, but then turn around and expect them to avoid/overcome cultural racism, sexism, or whatever.




* One source, admittedly a bit dated but accessible online, that discusses the singular y’all controversy from a linguist’s point of view: https://www.jstor.org/stable/454993?seq=1#page_scan_tab_contents (https://www.jstor.org/stable/454993?seq=1#page_scan_tab_contents)

**I’m not saying that’s what you were doing, just that the sort of jokes you presented do tend to feed into that sort of thing. Again, I don’t mean to jump on you, just draw it to all of our attention. It’s not something most non- southern or Appalachian Americans have thought about, or have even been asked to think about, but I think it’s one small part of the current divisions in our country.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Rural on June 07, 2018, 12:48:18 PM
Hmm... mild FU Money story?

My partner started up a side gig a couple of months ago, which has been going really well. Yesterday he asked for reduced hours at his day job, since he's getting buried alive in work between the two things. They said no. So he quit. And it won't harm us one penny financially.
It counts. Good for you, plural!

Wouldn't that be y'all?   

Also great for y'all!
Y'all can be singular too, in certain areas, so they say "all y'all."


Y’all is plural; “all y’all” is for emphasis, as in, “I caint believe all y’all went along with Bob on that one. John and Joe at least shoulda known better.”
I've definitely heard it refer to a single person, and I've heard many people use it that way.


Sorry for the double post, but I missed this somehow and didn’t want to ignore you. Are you sure the uses you heard weren’t the polite distinction between addressee and referent that the article above discusses? As in I might say to someone I run into at the grocery story, “how are y’all doing these days?” But the question (and usually the answer) will be about how the whole family is doing rather than the one person at the store. So it seems like the word is grammatically singular because only one representative of the family is standing there in front of me when I say it, but I did mean the group. That is very common in my experience as well as in studies like tat one.


It is a controversy, but not all that much of one in linguistics. It’s more debated outside academic circles because it’s been presented as singular, I would argue erroneously, so much in popular culture.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: fantabulous on June 07, 2018, 01:28:30 PM
Y'all is gender neutral, so it's finding use in northern social justice circles as well.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: fuzzy math on June 07, 2018, 01:38:21 PM



Oh, some comedy routines have it presented as singular, but it’s not an accurate reflection of the dialect.*


@Dicey, I know you didn’t mean to be offensive, but I chose the names I did in order to avoid stereotypes in discussing one of the dialects of American English. [I debated for quite a while at the phonetic spellings, but eventually used them because I was discussing dialect.]


I don’t mean to jump on you, because I know it’s hard to think of a group of largely Caucasian people as having any sort of minority status, but I’d argue that we aren’t doing southerners, Appalachians, or the rest of the country any favors when we** present the first two groups as universally backward, inbred, etc, but then turn around and expect them to avoid/overcome cultural racism, sexism, or whatever.

* One source, admittedly a bit dated but accessible online, that discusses the singular y’all controversy from a linguist’s point of view: https://www.jstor.org/stable/454993?seq=1#page_scan_tab_contents (https://www.jstor.org/stable/454993?seq=1#page_scan_tab_contents)

**I’m not saying that’s what you were doing, just that the sort of jokes you presented do tend to feed into that sort of thing. Again, I don’t mean to jump on you, just draw it to all of our attention. It’s not something most non- southern or Appalachian Americans have thought about, or have even been asked to think about, but I think it’s one small part of the current divisions in our country.

I appreciate you saying this, it's something I've never thought of. When you compare it to making racist/ethnics jokes against non Caucasian minorities and thinking of how offensive it is, I can see how this does create more of a divide.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Rural on June 07, 2018, 02:05:44 PM
Y'all is gender neutral, so it's finding use in northern social justice circles as well.


That’s pretty cool. It’s fairly universal in the Navy as well, or was some number of years ago when my husband served. The language needs a second person plural.

ETA thanks, fuzzy_math. I’m trying hard not to be offensive myself, which I think would be easy to do in this context.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: MrMoogle on June 07, 2018, 02:16:08 PM
Hmm... mild FU Money story?

My partner started up a side gig a couple of months ago, which has been going really well. Yesterday he asked for reduced hours at his day job, since he's getting buried alive in work between the two things. They said no. So he quit. And it won't harm us one penny financially.
It counts. Good for you, plural!

Wouldn't that be y'all?   

Also great for y'all!
Y'all can be singular too, in certain areas, so they say "all y'all."


Y’all is plural; “all y’all” is for emphasis, as in, “I caint believe all y’all went along with Bob on that one. John and Joe at least shoulda known better.”
I've definitely heard it refer to a single person, and I've heard many people use it that way.


Sorry for the double post, but I missed this somehow and didn’t want to ignore you. Are you sure the uses you heard weren’t the polite distinction between addressee and referent that the article above discusses? As in I might say to someone I run into at the grocery story, “how are y’all doing these days?” But the question (and usually the answer) will be about how the whole family is doing rather than the one person at the store. So it seems like the word is grammatically singular because only one representative of the family is standing there in front of me when I say it, but I did mean the group. That is very common in my experience as well as in studies like tat one.


It is a controversy, but not all that much of one in linguistics. It’s more debated outside academic circles because it’s been presented as singular, I would argue erroneously, so much in popular culture.
So when I hear it in what I call "singular", it's both singular and plural.  Plural because it water downs the rest of the sentence, but directed to a single person.

For example: "Yall need to watch when you back out" to the driver that just backed into them.  It sounds less aggressive than saying "you."  It makes it sound like it wasn't just that driver's fault, like there's a group at fault.

"Yall need to take out the trash," when I'm the only other one in the room.  Technically, I could have gotten her husband to do it when he got back, but she knew I would do it for her, and this was her way of getting me to do it. 

I guess both cases fit into the article, since the reason it works is because it's plural.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Rural on June 07, 2018, 02:28:58 PM
Hmm... mild FU Money story?

My partner started up a side gig a couple of months ago, which has been going really well. Yesterday he asked for reduced hours at his day job, since he's getting buried alive in work between the two things. They said no. So he quit. And it won't harm us one penny financially.
It counts. Good for you, plural!

Wouldn't that be y'all?   

Also great for y'all!
Y'all can be singular too, in certain areas, so they say "all y'all."


Y’all is plural; “all y’all” is for emphasis, as in, “I caint believe all y’all went along with Bob on that one. John and Joe at least shoulda known better.”
I've definitely heard it refer to a single person, and I've heard many people use it that way.


Sorry for the double post, but I missed this somehow and didn’t want to ignore you. Are you sure the uses you heard weren’t the polite distinction between addressee and referent that the article above discusses? As in I might say to someone I run into at the grocery story, “how are y’all doing these days?” But the question (and usually the answer) will be about how the whole family is doing rather than the one person at the store. So it seems like the word is grammatically singular because only one representative of the family is standing there in front of me when I say it, but I did mean the group. That is very common in my experience as well as in studies like tat one.


It is a controversy, but not all that much of one in linguistics. It’s more debated outside academic circles because it’s been presented as singular, I would argue erroneously, so much in popular culture.
So when I hear it in what I call "singular", it's both singular and plural.  Plural because it water downs the rest of the sentence, but directed to a single person.

For example: "Yall need to watch when you back out" to the driver that just backed into them.  It sounds less aggressive than saying "you."  It makes it sound like it wasn't just that driver's fault, like there's a group at fault.

"Yall need to take out the trash," when I'm the only other one in the room.  Technically, I could have gotten her husband to do it when he got back, but she knew I would do it for her, and this was her way of getting me to do it. 

I guess both cases fit into the article, since the reason it works is because it's plural.


That’s very interesting. I’d say yes, your trash example falls into the kind of thing I’m talking about, sort of spreading out responsibility. With the backing into someone, I’ve having trouble seeing how it could work that way if there was only one person in the car. Both driver and car need to be more careful? Surely not. Easier to see it working that way if there was a passenger, I suppose. Then it could have been sort of the passenger’s fault if he or she was distracting the driver, and the polite y’all avoids assigning blame to either person directly. But a solo driver, not so much. If that was the case, it sounds a lot closer to a singular y’all than anything else I’ve seen.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: MrMoogle on June 07, 2018, 03:05:28 PM
*snip*
So when I hear it in what I call "singular", it's both singular and plural.  Plural because it water downs the rest of the sentence, but directed to a single person.

For example: "Yall need to watch when you back out" to the driver that just backed into them.  It sounds less aggressive than saying "you."  It makes it sound like it wasn't just that driver's fault, like there's a group at fault.

"Yall need to take out the trash," when I'm the only other one in the room.  Technically, I could have gotten her husband to do it when he got back, but she knew I would do it for her, and this was her way of getting me to do it. 

I guess both cases fit into the article, since the reason it works is because it's plural.


That’s very interesting. I’d say yes, your trash example falls into the kind of thing I’m talking about, sort of spreading out responsibility. With the backing into someone, I’ve having trouble seeing how it could work that way if there was only one person in the car. Both driver and car need to be more careful? Surely not. Easier to see it working that way if there was a passenger, I suppose. Then it could have been sort of the passenger’s fault if he or she was distracting the driver, and the polite y’all avoids assigning blame to either person directly. But a solo driver, not so much. If that was the case, it sounds a lot closer to a singular y’all than anything else I’ve seen.
The driver example is spreading out blame too, it's just ambiguous to who else it is getting spread to.  The group of drivers who back into people, or something like that.  I guess it's a reminder that other people do it too.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Dicey on June 08, 2018, 12:57:56 AM
There are many long quotes here. I have removed those that do not directly apply for clarity.

Rural said this:
Y’all is plural; “all y’all” is for emphasis, as in, “I caint believe all y’all went along with Bob on that one. John and Joe at least shoulda known better.”

Then Dicey added this:
Y’all is plural; “all y’all” is for emphasis, as in, “I caint believe all y’all went along with Billy Bob on that one. John Boy and Joe Junior at least shoulda known better.”
FTFY. These may or may not be actual relatives.

Now Rural is saying this:

@Dicey, I know you didn’t mean to be offensive, but I chose the names I did in order to avoid stereotypes in discussing one of the dialects of American English. [I debated for quite a while at the phonetic spellings, but eventually used them because I was discussing dialect.]

I don’t mean to jump on you, because I know it’s hard to think of a group of largely Caucasian people as having any sort of minority status, but I’d argue that we aren’t doing southerners, Appalachians, or the rest of the country any favors when we** present the first two groups as universally backward, inbred, etc, but then turn around and expect them to avoid/overcome cultural racism, sexism, or whatever

**I’m not sayilng that’s what you were doing, just that the sort of jokes you presented do tend to feed into that sort of thing. Again, I don’t mean to jump on you, just draw it to all of our attention. It’s not something most non- southern or Appalachian Americans have thought about, or have even been asked to think about, but I think it’s one small part of the current divisions in our country.

I am gobsmacked, Rural. You used "caint" [sic] and "shoulda", so I made the names more Southern sounding, based on my long experience working for companies based in the South. You made a joke and I riffed on it, using my actual life experience. I could literally hear my old boss's voice when I read your post. He was from Rome, GA, and is the first person I ever heard say "cain't". He did it often, but I found it most incongruous when he did it while wearing a suit and tie, giving a sales presentation. His sons may have actually been given double names at birth and been addressed by both names their whole lives. This happens quite often in the South, and far less often elsewhere in the United States. That is simply a fact. I also claimed these type of double names as possibly belonging to family members, which is pretty damn inclusive.

@Rural, you made the joke, I expanded it based on my real life and now I'm being accused (but "not jumped on") of belittling Appalchian Americans and contributing to the "current divisions in our country"? Huh.

If you have any further criticisms, kindly send me a PM. In offering this explanation, if I have somehow managed to offend you further, please know that is not my intention, just as I am positive you did not intend to insult me.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Trifle on June 08, 2018, 04:57:59 AM
*snip*
So when I hear it in what I call "singular", it's both singular and plural.  Plural because it water downs the rest of the sentence, but directed to a single person.

For example: "Yall need to watch when you back out" to the driver that just backed into them.  It sounds less aggressive than saying "you."  It makes it sound like it wasn't just that driver's fault, like there's a group at fault.

"Yall need to take out the trash," when I'm the only other one in the room.  Technically, I could have gotten her husband to do it when he got back, but she knew I would do it for her, and this was her way of getting me to do it. 

I guess both cases fit into the article, since the reason it works is because it's plural.


That’s very interesting. I’d say yes, your trash example falls into the kind of thing I’m talking about, sort of spreading out responsibility. With the backing into someone, I’ve having trouble seeing how it could work that way if there was only one person in the car. Both driver and car need to be more careful? Surely not. Easier to see it working that way if there was a passenger, I suppose. Then it could have been sort of the passenger’s fault if he or she was distracting the driver, and the polite y’all avoids assigning blame to either person directly. But a solo driver, not so much. If that was the case, it sounds a lot closer to a singular y’all than anything else I’ve seen.
The driver example is spreading out blame too, it's just ambiguous to who else it is getting spread to.  The group of drivers who back into people, or something like that.  I guess it's a reminder that other people do it too.

Thanks @Rural and @MrMoogle -- This is is a super interesting discussion.  I'm a lifetime northerner who moved to the southern appalachians just a few years ago.  I have really been enjoying hearing and learning the dialects here.  (Dialects plural -- there are at least two very distinct ones, which I have had explained to me in various ways.) 

I think I've also heard y'all used singularly, but I can't remember the exact context.  Now thanks to this discussion I will be focused on it.  I love the word y'all and use it often, but I usually pronounce it "you all" because I feel like I sound stupid saying it in one syllable, with my northern accent.

There is another plural you that I hear sometimes in this area as a substitute for y'all -- it sounds like "yewns" or "yuns."  Two of my coworkers use that word, and they say they just grew up with it.  They are both from rural areas, small towns, maybe an hour apart.  I am guessing it is a "rural southern" thing?


Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: dcheesi on June 08, 2018, 06:33:33 AM
*snip*
So when I hear it in what I call "singular", it's both singular and plural.  Plural because it water downs the rest of the sentence, but directed to a single person.

For example: "Yall need to watch when you back out" to the driver that just backed into them.  It sounds less aggressive than saying "you."  It makes it sound like it wasn't just that driver's fault, like there's a group at fault.

"Yall need to take out the trash," when I'm the only other one in the room.  Technically, I could have gotten her husband to do it when he got back, but she knew I would do it for her, and this was her way of getting me to do it. 

I guess both cases fit into the article, since the reason it works is because it's plural.


That’s very interesting. I’d say yes, your trash example falls into the kind of thing I’m talking about, sort of spreading out responsibility. With the backing into someone, I’ve having trouble seeing how it could work that way if there was only one person in the car. Both driver and car need to be more careful? Surely not. Easier to see it working that way if there was a passenger, I suppose. Then it could have been sort of the passenger’s fault if he or she was distracting the driver, and the polite y’all avoids assigning blame to either person directly. But a solo driver, not so much. If that was the case, it sounds a lot closer to a singular y’all than anything else I’ve seen.
The driver example is spreading out blame too, it's just ambiguous to who else it is getting spread to.  The group of drivers who back into people, or something like that.  I guess it's a reminder that other people do it too.

Thanks @Rural and @MrMoogle -- This is is a super interesting discussion.  I'm a lifetime northerner who moved to the southern appalachians just a few years ago.  I have really been enjoying hearing and learning the dialects here.  (Dialects plural -- there are at least two very distinct ones, which I have had explained to me in various ways.) 

I think I've also heard y'all used singularly, but I can't remember the exact context.  Now thanks to this discussion I will be focused on it.  I love the word y'all and use it often, but I usually pronounce it "you all" because I feel like I sound stupid saying it in one syllable, with my northern accent.

There is another plural you that I hear sometimes in this area as a substitute for y'all -- it sounds like "yewns" or "yuns."  Two of my coworkers use that word, and they say they just grew up with it.  They are both from rural areas, small towns, maybe an hour apart.  I am guessing it is a "rural southern" thing?
I might be mistaken, but I thought "yuins" or "you-uns" was a actually more of an Appalachian thing, as opposed to the mostly Southern "y'all"?
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: CowboyAndIndian on June 08, 2018, 07:53:41 AM
Can we please return the subject to Epic FU Stories!!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Rubic on June 08, 2018, 07:59:14 AM
I might be mistaken, but I thought "yuins" or "you-uns" was a actually more of an Appalachian thing, as opposed to the mostly Southern "y'all"?

I used to hear "you-uns" (and occassionally "we-uns") in rural Eastern Tennessee, but
it doesn't appear to be part of the regional dialect anymore -- at least in the places I travel.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Dicey on June 08, 2018, 11:08:22 AM
Can we please return the subject to Epic FU Stories!!
Sure. Do you have any?
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: markbike528CBX on June 08, 2018, 11:28:18 AM
Can we please return the subject to Epic FU Stories!!
Sure. Do you have any?

Un-Epic to set a really low bar to get the thread on track.
Last day, greeting, handshaking, all the way around, smiles.
Semi-Epic (for me), I went out to lunch and had my first work lunch beer ever.
Then, on my drive home listened to Soup Dragons "I'm Free (12" Extended Mix / Remastered)"

There, low bar set y'all.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Rural on June 08, 2018, 02:18:19 PM
Can we please return the subject to Epic FU Stories!!
Sure. Do you have any?

Un-Epic to set a really low bar to get the thread on track.
Last day, greeting, handshaking, all the way around, smiles.
Semi-Epic (for me), I went out to lunch and had my first work lunch beer ever.
Then, on my drive home listened to Soup Dragons "I'm Free (12" Extended Mix / Remastered)"

There, low bar set y'all.


Congrats!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Bicycle_B on June 08, 2018, 02:59:43 PM
A friend of mine volunteered helping the homeless. Finally after years of making meals for them, arranging a warm place to sleep on freezing nights, and then setting up a safe space for them to visit on Sunday afternoons with computers to use in addition to a much-needed bathroom, the various donors raised enough money to pay Mr. Friend a small salary.

FU move #1 - no more retail jobs for Mr. F!

FU move #2 - after a year or two of further diligence, Mr. F decided that he deserved this thing rumors call "vacation." Which in his view meant some thrifty but oh so satisfying travel. He searched locations, searched out cheap tickets, found a match, bought the ticket. Then he announced to volunteers and donors when he was going to be out of town, and organized the volunteers to fill in when he was gone.

That was a couple of years ago.  In addition to annual 2 week journeys abroad, Mr. F soon began arranging shorter trips that he could do in between work days. Yesterday, Mr. F returned from what I think is his seventh FU trip. It seems to have been just as satisfying as the first.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: CowboyAndIndian on June 10, 2018, 05:06:56 PM
Can we please return the subject to Epic FU Stories!!
Sure. Do you have any?

I sure do @Dicey Heres the link from my original posting [where I was the one derailing the thread ;-) ]

https://forum.mrmoneymustache.com/welcome-to-the-forum/epic-fu-money-stories/msg1172508/#msg1172508
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Dicey on June 11, 2018, 12:14:21 PM
Can we please return the subject to Epic FU Stories!!
Sure. Do you have any?

I sure do @Dicey Heres the link from my original posting [where I was the one derailing the thread ;-) ]

https://forum.mrmoneymustache.com/welcome-to-the-forum/epic-fu-money-stories/msg1172508/#msg1172508
I remember it well because it was epic. That was a you plural plea for new material. I'm just doing my tiny part to keep one of my favorite threads alive. Got any new stories? <Snirt>

I'm <snirting> because I believe you've been an exemplary mustachian and stayed retired. Anyone else?
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: GeeVee on June 12, 2018, 04:38:30 AM
Okay, this is the story of my parents. As a background, my father was a factory worker and my mother was a house wife. They were very frugal as they grew up in relative poverty during the crises years and were teenagers during World War II years in the Netherlands. At that time, I am talking mid 1950s, my dad got paid weekly in cash. The factory owner would hand out envelopes with money at the end of the week.

On one Friday afternoon, dad went to the office to get his money. His boss said to him 'Here is your wage for the week, but I don't think you deserve it'. Dad responded by saying 'If you don't think that I worked hard enough to earn my money, I don't want it'. He wished the boss a good weekend and left the office without the cash. The boss' wife then went to see my mother and tried her to give my dad's wages for the week. My mother refused to take the money by saying that if her husband did not want to take his wages home for whatever reason, there was no possible way that she could accept it.

The continuous refusal caused great panic with the boss and his wife. Whatever they said, mum and dad refused to accept the money, until the boss finally admitted that my father had worked hard that week and had deservedly earned his wage.  Boss had miscalculated and thought they were living paycheck to paycheck, whilst my parents always had money in the bank and did not need the cash. They rocked !!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: rab-bit on June 12, 2018, 04:45:57 AM
Love this story, @GeeVee !
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: NykkiC on June 12, 2018, 09:00:17 AM
Okay, this is the story of my parents. As a background, my father was a factory worker and my mother was a house wife. They were very frugal as they grew up in relative poverty during the crises years and were teenagers during World War II years in the Netherlands. At that time, I am talking mid 1950s, my dad got paid weekly in cash. The factory owner would hand out envelopes with money at the end of the week.

On one Friday afternoon, dad went to the office to get his money. His boss said to him 'Here is your wage for the week, but I don't think you deserve it'. Dad responded by saying 'If you don't think that I worked hard enough to earn my money, I don't want it'. He wished the boss a good weekend and left the office without the cash. The boss' wife then went to see my mother and tried her to give my dad's wages for the week. My mother refused to take the money by saying that if her husband did not want to take his wages home for whatever reason, there was no possible way that she could accept it.

The continuous refusal caused great panic with the boss and his wife. Whatever they said, mum and dad refused to accept the money, until the boss finally admitted that my father had worked hard that week and had deservedly earned his wage.  Boss had miscalculated and thought they were living paycheck to paycheck, whilst my parents always had money in the bank and did not need the cash. They rocked !!

 Excellent story!

It never ceases to amaze me the difference between how a not insignificant percent of supervisors/bosses/employers will treat someone when they think that person is powerless to leave and how they behave when they realise that the employee doesn’t have to put up with them.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: SwordGuy on June 12, 2018, 11:29:02 AM
Okay, this is the story of my parents. As a background, my father was a factory worker and my mother was a house wife. They were very frugal as they grew up in relative poverty during the crises years and were teenagers during World War II years in the Netherlands. At that time, I am talking mid 1950s, my dad got paid weekly in cash. The factory owner would hand out envelopes with money at the end of the week.

On one Friday afternoon, dad went to the office to get his money. His boss said to him 'Here is your wage for the week, but I don't think you deserve it'. Dad responded by saying 'If you don't think that I worked hard enough to earn my money, I don't want it'. He wished the boss a good weekend and left the office without the cash. The boss' wife then went to see my mother and tried her to give my dad's wages for the week. My mother refused to take the money by saying that if her husband did not want to take his wages home for whatever reason, there was no possible way that she could accept it.

The continuous refusal caused great panic with the boss and his wife. Whatever they said, mum and dad refused to accept the money, until the boss finally admitted that my father had worked hard that week and had deservedly earned his wage.  Boss had miscalculated and thought they were living paycheck to paycheck, whilst my parents always had money in the bank and did not need the cash. They rocked !!

 Excellent story!

It never ceases to amaze me the difference between how a not insignificant percent of supervisors/bosses/employers will treat someone when they think that person is powerless to leave and how they behave when they realise that the employee doesn’t have to put up with them.

Classic bully behavior.   Pick on the weak and defenseless.   Step back from those who are willing and able to fight.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Daisy on June 12, 2018, 01:18:58 PM
Can we please return the subject to Epic FU Stories!!

Maybe this thread should be retitled "Epic FY money stories". F y'all!

Disclaimer: I am not southern and don't expect to know all of the nuances of "y'all". But they do all seem to start with the letter Y.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: RyanAtTanagra on June 12, 2018, 01:28:20 PM
Okay, this is the story of my parents. As a background, my father was a factory worker and my mother was a house wife. They were very frugal as they grew up in relative poverty during the crises years and were teenagers during World War II years in the Netherlands. At that time, I am talking mid 1950s, my dad got paid weekly in cash. The factory owner would hand out envelopes with money at the end of the week.

On one Friday afternoon, dad went to the office to get his money. His boss said to him 'Here is your wage for the week, but I don't think you deserve it'. Dad responded by saying 'If you don't think that I worked hard enough to earn my money, I don't want it'. He wished the boss a good weekend and left the office without the cash. The boss' wife then went to see my mother and tried her to give my dad's wages for the week. My mother refused to take the money by saying that if her husband did not want to take his wages home for whatever reason, there was no possible way that she could accept it.

The continuous refusal caused great panic with the boss and his wife. Whatever they said, mum and dad refused to accept the money, until the boss finally admitted that my father had worked hard that week and had deservedly earned his wage.  Boss had miscalculated and thought they were living paycheck to paycheck, whilst my parents always had money in the bank and did not need the cash. They rocked !!

This is now one of my favorite stories.  Refusing money being handed to you is even more epic and FU than taking it and quitting.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: MrMoogle on June 12, 2018, 01:38:53 PM
Can we please return the subject to Epic FU Stories!!

Maybe this thread should be retitled "Epic FY money stories". F y'all!

Disclaimer: I am not southern and don't expect to know all of the nuances of "y'all". But they do all seem to start with the letter Y.
I don't recall hearing "F**k yall" although I'm sure it's been said.  It's usually just "bless your heart" around here.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: CowboyAndIndian on June 12, 2018, 01:47:38 PM
I remember it well because it was epic. That was a you plural plea for new material. I'm just doing my tiny part to keep one of my favorite threads alive. Got any new stories? <Snirt>

I'm <snirting> because I believe you've been an exemplary mustachian and stayed retired. Anyone else?

Thanks @Dicey. Appreciate the accolades from MMM royalty (Royal Walrus;-))!

I do have one more. Here it is.

I had taken a job at a Wall St. Firm and the location was 10 minutes from home. After a few years of commuting an hour and a half to work in NYC, I was thrilled with working close by. This was not a great company, but I was willing to accept it due to the number of hours a day I saved. I even took an employee position (all my other stints in Wall St. was as a consultant at much higher pay rates).

The first year there was wonderful. Very low pressure to do anything and I had to create work to keep busy. At the end of the first year, the division was sold to one of the new upstart companies on Wall St. I acquired my division about 15 years from founding and by then had become one of the largest mutual fund companies.

The new company had a reputation for only hiring from college because they were young, hardworking, low paid and did not have a family to interfere with work. They never hired anyone older or with experience. The oldest folks other than those of the founders and the board were in their mid-30's. The majority were young men (very few women) straight out of school and who worked long hours. The type of company where the Vice-Chairman walked the floors at 7 am and 7 pm to see who was at work. The type of company where you got looks when someone walked out at 5 pm. The type of company who would layoff a long-term, high performing employee due to performance issues in the year where he was undergoing chemotherapy.

So, there I was at the age of 48, working for a boss who was around 32 and who had a major chip on his shoulder. He did his best to try and put down the employees who had been acquired. He was hoping to get rid of older employees and when after a year, there were no resignations, he tried to get things moving by giving bad reviews. That was the only bad review  I received in my whole career.

I then decided then that the short commute and low money was not acceptable for harassment and put out a couple of feelers. I had a new job in a week (done with ever being an employee, this was a consultant gig) and quit in the middle of the project.

The boss was quite pissed, but I had FU money and did not give a damn!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: okits on June 12, 2018, 01:51:53 PM
The boss was quite pissed, but I had FU money and did not give a damn!

YEAAAAAAAH!!  Cheering for you!

It's always amusing when they treat you badly and then are shocked when you don't go out of your way for them. 

Good stories, @CowboyAndIndian !  Thank you for sharing.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Zamboni on June 12, 2018, 01:52:19 PM
Good job, @CowboyAndIndian!

Here is one from a friend:

Friend was in his 20's and working as a waiter at a big resort.
Resort owner was a trust fund baby with a giant blow problem.
To subsidize his addiction, he dabbled in moving product (think of him as a sort of regional manager).
Low level restaurant staff were recruited to make runs, and my friend got lured into one of these trips. Long story short, he and another waiter ended up working all night as the owner's errand boy for the side business . . . besides the sleep deprivation, he was scared out of his wits the whole time. By the time they made it home, he had vowed this was his first and last side trip.
The next morning, he finally got to bed after driving all night, but he ended up oversleeping and was late for his regular shift waiting tables at the resort.
The owner called him in, b*tched him out, and told him that, to punish him for being late for his shift, he would have to work as a bus boy (for no tips) on the next big holiday instead of waiting tables.

My friend's response?
Literally "Fuck you!"
And then he stormed into the kitchen, pointed to different people saying "Fuck you, and fuck you, and fuck you! I'm outta here, and I'm taking this with me!"
He picked up a bottle of Dom Perignon with a dramatic flourish, and marched right out the door.
He said the head chef was completely calm during his tirade and just waved at him with an "Okay, man, have a good one."
 
The worst part of the story is that his friend, the other waiter, eventually got busted on one of the transportation runs and ended up serving time in prison. He did not rat out anyone . . . resort owner still owns the resort. My friend learned in one night that he has way too much anxiety for a life of crime, and he's been on the straight and narrow ever since.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Sibley on June 12, 2018, 02:35:36 PM
So, I got a new job last December because my old job was giving me issues. There was a whole mental breakdown in fact, that was interesting (it's probably somewhere in this thread actually). Anyway, new job. Great, except for the part where they lied about all the culture problems (previously REALLY toxic, now just messed up), put me on the most dysfunctional team, and that they didn't actually do training. And apparently I hate the whole industry, like really think that it shouldn't exist in current form.

I gave them a chance. I really, really did. But things aren't getting better, they're actually getting worse. I don't want to put up with it. There are more jobs for me than people like me, so I don't need to put up with it.

I got a verbal offer from another company, more money (not really a concern honestly), much better industry, get great vibes from the team. I GRILLED them on culture, morale, training, etc. Really grilled them, to the extent that they seemed surprised. Apparently it worked though, cause they like me.

So, now I get to figure out how to give notice when I've been in the job for 6 months. That should be interesting. Not doing anything until I have the formal, written offer and paperwork is official. So, probably next week.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Zamboni on June 12, 2018, 02:41:06 PM
Good for you, Sibley!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: ambimammular on June 12, 2018, 05:22:25 PM
Yup, good for you! Life is too short to be miserable.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Dicey on June 12, 2018, 06:54:16 PM
Yay for you, Sibley! We would be happy to help you find the very best words when the time comes. I have fresh experience in this arena, as you will see...

Here's a mini-FU-story from a former colleague, who's being pursued by another company. Potential boss is promising the sun, moon and stars to get them on board. It sounded too good to be true, so I checked in with a different former colleague who works for the same company, but different region/boss. He systematically reviewed the list of promises the potential boss had made and gave his educated guess on how likely each one was to actually happen, based on the company's corporate culture. Yeah, my friend was getting smoke blown in a major way. It was damn fun to help proof the very polite "thanks, but no thanks" letter. So happy I could help my friend avoid a potential disaster.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: tomsang on June 12, 2018, 07:06:58 PM
I don't know about Epic, but I have a story about FU money.

We purchased a high end view lot from our builder to build our high end retirement house (Not very Mustachian, but we love it!!).  The house is in a reasonably small town and we are fairly well connected.  Our builder acquired this lot by partnering with a local attorney with the understanding that the builder would build both houses at the same time to save on cost, etc. Our builder is a well known old school reputable builder within the community.  The two of them went into this partnership for the land only with a back of a napkin agreement, maybe slightly more, but not enough. The agreement was pretty fair in theory. Each of them would own a lot.  Builder would sell his lot, attorney would use builder to build his dream retirement house.  Site development, view easements, sharing of community cost, etc.  I am sure our builder did this type of thing with others with no problem.  If both parties are working together you can save a lot of money on the various components.

This attorney put together a standard purchase agreement between the builder and my wife and I.  We agreed to split his attorney fee with the builder(Attorney is not part of the lot sale transaction). Think of a standard form with parcel numbers and a purchase price.  He sent a bill for $10k.  Builder was pissed, I was shocked.  After asking the attorney how many hours did he spend and what was his billing rate (a little late, but they were going to be our neighbors) he informed me that it was based on value not time.  I said this is a standard form.  We have used this form in the past.  Other attorneys charge $300. I told him that I did not think that this was fair, he said send him a check for what I thought was fair.  I sent him a check for $1k for my half. I like to be more than fair in most transactions.  Up until this period, there was no mention that the attorney had this site development agreement with the builder that was supposed to carry over to our lot.

The attorney reached out on a number of things about splitting costs for something and my reply back to him was that as long as it was fair, that I would be happy to partner up to save money.  He never liked that answer. I did not understand why a person would get so frustrated or upset about fairly splitting costs where we can each save money.

About this time I am informed that there is a site development agreement that was not mentioned by the attorney(who drafted the lot purchase or the builder).  The builder, kept saying that the attorney wants to jointly develop the property.  This made sense to me with sewer lines, lot prep, etc.  I did not realize that there was a formal back of the napkin site development agreement.  The attorney never cashed my check, which I understand now why.               

The attorney made the builder's life miserable as everything financial had to go his way.  It started off with demanding the builder to build the house super cheap or he would not give us our view easements.  The view easements were already laid out on the napkin that the builder and attorney put together when they decided to partner on the land.  He was required to give us the easements.  This delayed us, caused us to incur more legal fees than we should have, etc. 

Throughout the build there were a number of items in the early stage, where we were willing to give more than we should with the understanding that we would be living next door to this person for many years.  The asks kept on getting bigger and more unfair as the project would go.  The attorney could look you in the eye and explain to you with a huge smile on his face how this is the way it was meant to be, etc.

When another one of these $3k differences popped up, I said I was not going to pay it.  My builder could see my point, but the attorney was holding up something else, and my builder was going to split the cost with us.  I said I wasn't going to pay it. My builder was going to eat the cost.  I did not like that as well, as the builder and his subcontractors had been abused by this guy during the entire build.

In front of the attorney's wife.  I told our builder that I was not going to pay this and that I would spend up to $100k to take the attorney to court for the previous expenses, get him disbarred, and incur other costs that that we did not need to spend in our construction that they would be obligated to pay half.

The asks stopped occurring. The wife was very concerned about their reputation, which made sense since they screwed over a ton of subcontractors who were already talking about it throughout the town.  We finished the build.  They are a lovely couple, when money is not involved.

The attorney's house was completed over a year ago.  I am not sure if the builder has received final payment.

I am a big believer in fair.  I always would prefer to pay more than my fair share.  Having FU money, allowed me to say that I am willing to spend a ton of money to make you pay a ton of money if you continue to do things that are not fair.   
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Rural on June 12, 2018, 09:01:19 PM
Can we please return the subject to Epic FU Stories!!

Maybe this thread should be retitled "Epic FY money stories". F y'all!

Disclaimer: I am not southern and don't expect to know all of the nuances of "y'all". But they do all seem to start with the letter Y.
I don't recall hearing "F**k yall" although I'm sure it's been said.  It's usually just "bless your heart" around here.


I've said it. :)


On topic: I guess one would have to be mad at the whole company to go for a true F y'all.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Million2000 on June 13, 2018, 03:01:52 PM
Can we please return the subject to Epic FU Stories!!

Maybe this thread should be retitled "Epic FY money stories". F y'all!

Disclaimer: I am not southern and don't expect to know all of the nuances of "y'all". But they do all seem to start with the letter Y.
I don't recall hearing "F**k yall" although I'm sure it's been said.  It's usually just "bless your heart" around here.


I've said it. :)


On topic: I guess one would have to be mad at the whole company to go for a true F y'all.

No, that would be a F all y'all. It's subtle, but there is a difference. Also, intonation is key.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: BlueHouse on June 14, 2018, 01:47:07 PM

I don't recall hearing "F**k yall" although I'm sure it's been said.  It's usually just "bless your heart" around here.

would love to get back on topic, so I'm thinking it right now. 
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Just Joe on June 14, 2018, 02:03:56 PM
Can we please return the subject to Epic FU Stories!!

Maybe this thread should be retitled "Epic FY money stories". F y'all!

Disclaimer: I am not southern and don't expect to know all of the nuances of "y'all". But they do all seem to start with the letter Y.
I don't recall hearing "F**k yall" although I'm sure it's been said.  It's usually just "bless your heart" around here.


I've said it. :)


On topic: I guess one would have to be mad at the whole company to go for a true F y'all.

No, that would be a F all y'all. It's subtle, but there is a difference. Also, intonation is key.

Volume can be important too utilizing that phrase. And that house building lawyer can just go to hell. Good grief!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Rural on June 14, 2018, 09:24:56 PM
Not epic, but:
An "offer" today. Wouldn't I like to serve on the fancy underwater basketweaving committee (example, not actual committee)? I do indeed specialize in fanciness, and the committee would check a box I need to check for next year's annual review. One little thing, though - it would require "a couple" of on-campus meetings this summer, when I am off-contract and not paid. Why, no, thank you, I will not drive hundreds of miles each time to attend an unspecified number of unpaid meetings. Because I am interested in the fanciness of baskets, I may offer to Skype into meetings. Or not.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Zamboni on June 16, 2018, 03:23:23 AM
^This sound like a good opportunity for yes yes no yes

"Thank you for reaching out." (yes)
"It is true that I specialize in fanciness." (yes)
"In the case of this particular opportunity, I must decline." (no)
"Good luck, and I'd be happy to hear how it went in the Fall." (yes)

You don't even need to cite why you are declining ". . . .because I will not attend any meeting this summer" and/or " . . . because I do not care about the particular fanciness of baskets." In fact, not giving a reason is crucial for the success of yes yes no yes. 

And with your timely reminder, I am also going to start remembering to decline meetings when I am not being paid as well . . . there has been way too many of these already, it it is only June!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Happily Irrelevant on June 16, 2018, 02:36:34 PM
Just read the thread.  You don't fully realize what all you put up with until you have FU/FI money.  We end up accepting a lot because "it's our job" and that is just the way it is.  But there is nothing like reaching that point where you don't have to put up with it anymore.   Suddenly a whole lot of things take on a very different perspective.  You look back and can't believe you put up with some of the things you did.   After FIRE'ing I can't imagine going back to work as my tolerance has dropped to zero for anyone telling me I have to do something dumb.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Padonak on June 16, 2018, 03:02:22 PM
^This sound like a good opportunity for yes yes no yes

"Thank you for reaching out." (yes)
"It is true that I specialize in fanciness." (yes)
"In the case of this particular opportunity, I must decline." (no)
"Good luck, and I'd be happy to hear how it went in the Fall." (yes)

You don't even need to cite why you are declining ". . . .because I will not attend any meeting this summer" and/or " . . . because I do not care about the particular fanciness of baskets." In fact, not giving a reason is crucial for the success of yes yes no yes. 

And with your timely reminder, I am also going to start remembering to decline meetings when I am not being paid as well . . . there has been way too many of these already, it it is only June!
That's great, but seems like too much effort. How about not replying to the invite at all and, of course, remembering to never attend unpaid meetings. Not necessarily to decline them, just ignore.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Freedomin5 on June 16, 2018, 03:57:01 PM
My salary is revenue-based. Company asked me to take on a contract. I agreed and billed client at my regular rate. Company then went behind my back and “adjusted” the bill downwards by 50%, and also “adjusted” my revenue numbers downwards by a proportionate amount.

So I sent an email to the CEO. And then simply stopped working on the contract. And then notified the client as to why I was no longer doing any work on his contract. And then gave him the emails of all the key decision makers in this fiasco. The company is probably just going to ignore my complaint. Luckily, I don’t care if I lose my job, and I have several other projects on my plate to keep me busy while I’m “on strike” on this contract.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Rural on June 16, 2018, 07:03:34 PM
^This sound like a good opportunity for yes yes no yes

"Thank you for reaching out." (yes)
"It is true that I specialize in fanciness." (yes)
"In the case of this particular opportunity, I must decline." (no)
"Good luck, and I'd be happy to hear how it went in the Fall." (yes)

You don't even need to cite why you are declining ". . . .because I will not attend any meeting this summer" and/or " . . . because I do not care about the particular fanciness of baskets." In fact, not giving a reason is crucial for the success of yes yes no yes. 

And with your timely reminder, I am also going to start remembering to decline meetings when I am not being paid as well . . . there has been way too many of these already, it it is only June!


I did a modified version of this. I would like to serve on the committee (true). I will not attend summer meetings. I will Skype or web meeting into meetings if Fancy Basket Chair (FBC) sets up the tech and holds meetings at times that work for me. No answer; FBC is probably seeking someone more tech-savvy to help (normally FBC comes to me).
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Step37 on June 16, 2018, 11:49:34 PM
My salary is revenue-based. Company asked me to take on a contract. I agreed and billed client at my regular rate. Company then went behind my back and “adjusted” the bill downwards by 50%, and also “adjusted” my revenue numbers downwards by a proportionate amount.

So I sent an email to the CEO. And then simply stopped working on the contract. And then notified the client as to why I was no longer doing any work on his contract. And then gave him the emails of all the key decision makers in this fiasco. The company is probably just going to ignore my complaint. Luckily, I don’t care if I lose my job, and I have several other projects on my plate to keep me busy while I’m “on strike” on this contract.

Wow, that seems very underhanded of your company to devalue your work like that, particularly without even discussing it with you first. I’m curious to know how this plays out. Way to stand your ground.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: radram on June 17, 2018, 07:32:39 AM
My salary is revenue-based. Company asked me to take on a contract. I agreed and billed client at my regular rate. Company then went behind my back and “adjusted” the bill downwards by 50%, and also “adjusted” my revenue numbers downwards by a proportionate amount.

So I sent an email to the CEO. And then simply stopped working on the contract. And then notified the client as to why I was no longer doing any work on his contract. And then gave him the emails of all the key decision makers in this fiasco. The company is probably just going to ignore my complaint. Luckily, I don’t care if I lose my job, and I have several other projects on my plate to keep me busy while I’m “on strike” on this contract.

Would you have any legal recourse? This sounds more like theft than FU money problems.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Freedomin5 on June 18, 2018, 04:49:15 AM
My salary is revenue-based. Company asked me to take on a contract. I agreed and billed client at my regular rate. Company then went behind my back and “adjusted” the bill downwards by 50%, and also “adjusted” my revenue numbers downwards by a proportionate amount.

So I sent an email to the CEO. And then simply stopped working on the contract. And then notified the client as to why I was no longer doing any work on his contract. And then gave him the emails of all the key decision makers in this fiasco. The company is probably just going to ignore my complaint. Luckily, I don’t care if I lose my job, and I have several other projects on my plate to keep me busy while I’m “on strike” on this contract.

Would you have any legal recourse? This sounds more like theft than FU money problems.

What is this legality thing that you speak of? ;P. I live in China, where laws don’t count for much. And the mental anguish and frustration that I will sustain by fighting is not worth it to me. If we calculate the amount of time I will use to fight this multiplied by my hourly rate, it’s really not worth it. Since the company is only billing 50%, I’ll just do 50% of the work.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: SwordGuy on June 18, 2018, 06:25:16 AM
My salary is revenue-based. Company asked me to take on a contract. I agreed and billed client at my regular rate. Company then went behind my back and “adjusted” the bill downwards by 50%, and also “adjusted” my revenue numbers downwards by a proportionate amount.

So I sent an email to the CEO. And then simply stopped working on the contract. And then notified the client as to why I was no longer doing any work on his contract. And then gave him the emails of all the key decision makers in this fiasco. The company is probably just going to ignore my complaint. Luckily, I don’t care if I lose my job, and I have several other projects on my plate to keep me busy while I’m “on strike” on this contract.

Would you have any legal recourse? This sounds more like theft than FU money problems.

What is this legality thing that you speak of? ;P. I live in China, where laws don’t count for much. And the mental anguish and frustration that I will sustain by fighting is not worth it to me. If we calculate the amount of time I will use to fight this multiplied by my hourly rate, it’s really not worth it. Since the company is only billing 50%, I’ll just do 50% of the work.


And old Soviet saying, "They pretend to pay us and we pretend to work."


Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: TexasRunner on June 19, 2018, 08:27:54 AM
Can we please return the subject to Epic FU Stories!!

Maybe this thread should be retitled "Epic FY money stories". F y'all!

Disclaimer: I am not southern and don't expect to know all of the nuances of "y'all". But they do all seem to start with the letter Y.
I don't recall hearing "F**k yall" although I'm sure it's been said.  It's usually just "bless your heart" around here.

Both sayings exist, its a generational thing...  :)

Bless your heart is probably my favorite saying of all time, especially when the recipient of 'blessing' doesn't understand the phrase. lol.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Trifle on June 19, 2018, 01:22:33 PM
Can we please return the subject to Epic FU Stories!!

Maybe this thread should be retitled "Epic FY money stories". F y'all!

Disclaimer: I am not southern and don't expect to know all of the nuances of "y'all". But they do all seem to start with the letter Y.
I don't recall hearing "F**k yall" although I'm sure it's been said.  It's usually just "bless your heart" around here.

Both sayings exist, its a generational thing...  :)

Bless your heart is probably my favorite saying of all time, especially when the recipient of 'blessing' doesn't understand the phrase. lol.

Yeah, 'bless your heart' has been a hard one for me to figure out since I moved south.  It's versatile.  It seems like it can mean anything along a spectrum from "You poor thing" (when said after you share bad news), to "You're not the sharpest knife in the drawer, are you?" (when said after someone says something clueless) all the way over to "F#&k you, idiot." 
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: MrMoogle on June 20, 2018, 08:45:02 AM

Yeah, 'bless your heart' has been a hard one for me to figure out since I moved south.  It's versatile.  It seems like it can mean anything along a spectrum from "You poor thing" (when said after you share bad news), to "You're not the sharpest knife in the drawer, are you?" (when said after someone says something clueless) all the way over to "F#&k you, idiot." 

Yeah pretty much.  It's a lot of fun, I need to use it more often.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: tipster350 on June 20, 2018, 09:17:33 AM
Hoping the thread can get back on topic. It's a bummer to be disappointed after seeing new posts and thinking that a new FU story has been posted.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Dicey on June 20, 2018, 10:01:47 AM
Hoping the thread can get back on topic. It's a bummer to be disappointed after seeing new posts and thinking that a new FU story has been posted.
Best revenge is to post one of your own. Don't have one? Please avoid wearing complainypants.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: AlanStache on June 20, 2018, 10:53:56 AM
Hoping the thread can get back on topic. It's a bummer to be disappointed after seeing new posts and thinking that a new FU story has been posted.
Best revenge is to post one of your own. Don't have one? Please avoid wearing complainypants.

tipster350 - bless your heart :-) 
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Threshkin on June 27, 2018, 09:48:13 AM
Here is a little one.

In mid-2016 I set a hard deadline to FIRE at the end of April 2017.  This was after several years of OMY.

On October 30 2016, I get an email from my boss saying he needs to call me early the next morning.  I turn to my DW and say either he is leaving or I am.

Sure enough, the next morning I learn that I am being released effective Nov 01.  After the call I do a little happy dance.  As part of the release package I received 6 months of salary which meant I was paid through the end of April 2017, my hard FIRE target! 

Essentially the phone call was me getting a six month paid vacation.  Win Win!!!

No major FUs, I don't like burning bridges (most of the time).  But by following mustacian principles we turned a potentially devastating call into a welcome event.  Those extra six months were enormously valuable to me because I was able spend much more time with my mom who was declining rapidly due to Alzheimers.  She passed in August 2017 so I got 10 months with her full time rather than only 4.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Mother Fussbudget on June 27, 2018, 11:32:59 AM
That's no "little one"... in my book.  The power FU Money gives one to spend irreplaceable time with loved ones...  That's huge!
Both Congratulations on achieving FI, and condolences on your loss.

It's gratifying to know FI enabled you to spend meaningful time with your mom before her passing.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Dicey on June 27, 2018, 12:00:25 PM
That's no "little one"... in my book.  The power FU Money gives one to spend irreplaceable time with loved ones...  That's huge!
Both Congratulations on achieving FI, and condolences on your loss.

It's gratifying to know FI enabled you to spend meaningful time with your mom before her passing.
You said it. H-U-G-E!

And Threshkin, I am sorry for your loss. My MIL has ALZ, lives with us, and has for five years. She's otherwise healthy, so there is no end in  sight.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Threshkin on June 27, 2018, 03:14:02 PM
That's no "little one"... in my book.  The power FU Money gives one to spend irreplaceable time with loved ones...  That's huge!
Both Congratulations on achieving FI, and condolences on your loss.

It's gratifying to know FI enabled you to spend meaningful time with your mom before her passing.
You said it. H-U-G-E!

And Threshkin, I am sorry for your loss. My MIL has ALZ, lives with us, and has for five years. She's otherwise healthy, so there is no end in  sight.
Thanks Mother FB and Dicey.

I feel for you Dicey.  ALZ takes an enormous toll on both the patient and the caregivers.  My mom was also healthy otherwise.  After the initial tipping point she declined gradually for four years and then extremely rapidly over the last few weeks.  I never told her I was FIRE, she would have not understood and would have worried. 
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: tiger002 on June 27, 2018, 06:43:31 PM
This thread is making me want to use Bless y'all's hearts instead of FU one day. Too bad I'm not from the south. Oh well, that might make it even better.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: By the River on June 28, 2018, 07:45:13 AM
This thread is making me want to use Bless y'all's hearts instead of FU one day. Too bad I'm not from the south. Oh well, that might make it even better.

That would be great...
Me (in the future)  "I'm retiring 10 years early because I didn't spend everything that I earned and brown bagged lunch everyday"
CW  "I wish I could do that, I just have too many bills and I need a brand new truck and daily sugar-coffee fix and ..."
Me "Well, bless your heart"
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: MrMoogle on June 28, 2018, 08:37:23 AM
This thread is making me want to use Bless y'all's hearts instead of FU one day. Too bad I'm not from the south. Oh well, that might make it even better.
I don't have much of an accent, but you can really tell I'm from the south when I say "Well, bless your heart." 
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Sibley on June 29, 2018, 07:42:34 AM
So, I got a new job last December because my old job was giving me issues. There was a whole mental breakdown in fact, that was interesting (it's probably somewhere in this thread actually). Anyway, new job. Great, except for the part where they lied about all the culture problems (previously REALLY toxic, now just messed up), put me on the most dysfunctional team, and that they didn't actually do training. And apparently I hate the whole industry, like really think that it shouldn't exist in current form.

I gave them a chance. I really, really did. But things aren't getting better, they're actually getting worse. I don't want to put up with it. There are more jobs for me than people like me, so I don't need to put up with it.

I got a verbal offer from another company, more money (not really a concern honestly), much better industry, get great vibes from the team. I GRILLED them on culture, morale, training, etc. Really grilled them, to the extent that they seemed surprised. Apparently it worked though, cause they like me.

So, now I get to figure out how to give notice when I've been in the job for 6 months. That should be interesting. Not doing anything until I have the formal, written offer and paperwork is official. So, probably next week.

Congrats, @Sibley !!!  Great for you!

Update: today is my last day! I'll be leaving early. Like, very early. Because I have absolutely nothing to do, and I don't feel like sticking around in this dysfunctional place.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: rantk81 on June 29, 2018, 08:06:51 AM
Here is a little one.

That is not a "little" story. That is fantastic that you put yourself in that position.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Mother Fussbudget on July 10, 2018, 09:43:20 AM
Update: today is my last day! I'll be leaving early. Like, very early. Because I have absolutely nothing to do, and I don't feel like sticking around in this dysfunctional place.

Congratulations, Sibley!  Welcome to FIRE!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Sibley on July 11, 2018, 09:39:43 AM
Update: today is my last day! I'll be leaving early. Like, very early. Because I have absolutely nothing to do, and I don't feel like sticking around in this dysfunctional place.

Congratulations, Sibley!  Welcome to FIRE!

Oh, I wish. Not FIREd yet, just left a dysfunctional job. Started new one this week, so far so good. Still working towards FI.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Threshkin on July 11, 2018, 10:38:11 AM
Update: today is my last day! I'll be leaving early. Like, very early. Because I have absolutely nothing to do, and I don't feel like sticking around in this dysfunctional place.

Congratulations, Sibley!  Welcome to FIRE!

Oh, I wish. Not FIREd yet, just left a dysfunctional job. Started new one this week, so far so good. Still working towards FI.

Still worth congratulations Sibley!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Mother Fussbudget on July 11, 2018, 11:10:41 AM
When is an Asshair not an asshair?  (Asshair#5) the latest in a 20+ year saga...

Background... I hit my FIRE number back in April 2018.  Since then, I've continued to work (one-more-month syndrome, because... hey, it's good money) to pad out my taxable account, and generate down payments for new rental properties for long-term cash flow. 
I'm a tech-whore - contracting for technical companies who pay me by-the-hour, the contracting firm is my 'PIMP', and the company I'm helping with their 21st century technical needs is the 'John' (and they screw me whenever they can).

One director @ the firm I'm contracting for has a different project management style from most others here - expressing this as a need to have a 'Squeezable Neck' for each project.  Normally, these neck's belong to FTE's, but our current project is entirely staffed by contractors.  Naturally, my two co-contractors and I work under this director.  Asshair#5 - a co-worker who *thinks* he's my boss, but isn't my boss - has self-elected himself 'Squeezable Neck' for our project.

Two weeks ago, asshair#5 met with me for a one-on-one, and let me know he'd essentially thrown me under the bus with our "client/John".  Ironic, really...

Earlier, I'd let this asshair (really more 'ass-stubble') know that 'sometimes at the company we work for, it's politically expedient to have someone formulate an outside-the-box solution to problems, then "throw that person under the bus", give them a "good talking to", "adopt the idea as your own", and "move on".  Inevitably, the outside-the-box idea is adopted as the "client/John's".  I expressed that of all the people in our team *I* should be the one to use as a 'body under the bus' because I'd reached FI.  BUT... somehow I didn't expect to get the under the bus treatment without warning.  Just as a courtesy.

Oh yeah... Thrown.  Under The Bus.  No warning.  At first I was upset by this, then just laughed and laughed. 
My response, I did two (2) things:
1) Met with my account manager (my *actual* boss), and let him know I would be rolling off the current contract by the end of July.  I encouraged account manager to find someone with additional skills that I don't possess (namely Salesforce experience) as my back-fill for this role, and I would be happy to handoff my work to this back-fill person.  The Account Manager agreed, congratulated me on FI, and asked if I would give him advice on building his own rental property 'fleet'... 
2) Met with Asshair#5, expressed that I understood his dilemma, but that he should have at least told me he was going to throw me under the bus BEFORE doing it. I said there are at least three (3x) squeezable necks on the project, and that if it helps him to do his job better, when he feels he's being squeezed, to use his two free hands to simultaneously squeeze the other two necks.  (mine and another co-worker's).  I asked him to delegate more of the work he's taken on himself. AND to better communicate what he wants the two of us to work on.  But he continues to sit separately, worry, and fret over his laptop, and not tell us anything until our twice weekly team stand-up meetings.

Normally, this would be a frustrating situation, but since FI, I have No More F**k's To Give.  (I should get a T-shirt:  NMFTG)
All the best!  MFB
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Papa bear on July 11, 2018, 01:16:48 PM
When is an Asshair not an asshair?  (Asshair#5) the latest in a 20+ year saga...

Background... I hit my FIRE number back in April 2018.  Since then, I've continued to work (one-more-month syndrome, because... hey, it's good money) to pad out my taxable account, and generate down payments for new rental properties for long-term cash flow. 
I'm a tech-whore - contracting for technical companies who pay me by-the-hour, the contracting firm is my 'PIMP', and the company I'm helping with their 21st century technical needs is the 'John' (and they screw me whenever they can).

One director @ the firm I'm contracting for has a different project management style from most others here - expressing this as a need to have a 'Squeezable Neck' for each project.  Normally, these neck's belong to FTE's, but our current project is entirely staffed by contractors.  Naturally, my two co-contractors and I work under this director.  Asshair#5 - a co-worker who *thinks* he's my boss, but isn't my boss - has self-elected himself 'Squeezable Neck' for our project.

Two weeks ago, asshair#5 met with me for a one-on-one, and let me know he'd essentially thrown me under the bus with our "client/John".  Ironic, really...

Earlier, I'd let this asshair (really more 'ass-stubble') know that 'sometimes at the company we work for, it's politically expedient to have someone formulate an outside-the-box solution to problems, then "throw that person under the bus", give them a "good talking to", "adopt the idea as your own", and "move on".  Inevitably, the outside-the-box idea is adopted as the "client/John's".  I expressed that of all the people in our team *I* should be the one to use as a 'body under the bus' because I'd reached FI.  BUT... somehow I didn't expect to get the under the bus treatment without warning.  Just as a courtesy.

Oh yeah... Thrown.  Under The Bus.  No warning.  At first I was upset by this, then just laughed and laughed. 
My response, I did two (2) things:
1) Met with my account manager (my *actual* boss), and let him know I would be rolling off the current contract by the end of July.  I encouraged account manager to find someone with additional skills that I don't possess (namely Salesforce experience) as my back-fill for this role, and I would be happy to handoff my work to this back-fill person.  The Account Manager agreed, congratulated me on FI, and asked if I would give him advice on building his own rental property 'fleet'... 
2) Met with Asshair#5, expressed that I understood his dilemma, but that he should have at least told me he was going to throw me under the bus BEFORE doing it. I said there are at least three (3x) squeezable necks on the project, and that if it helps him to do his job better, when he feels he's being squeezed, to use his two free hands to simultaneously squeeze the other two necks.  (mine and another co-worker's).  I asked him to delegate more of the work he's taken on himself. AND to better communicate what he wants the two of us to work on.  But he continues to sit separately, worry, and fret over his laptop, and not tell us anything until our twice weekly team stand-up meetings.

Normally, this would be a frustrating situation, but since FI, I have No More F**k's To Give.  (I should get a T-shirt:  NMFTG)
All the best!  MFB

Can you continue to work, please?  These are great stories and I think you need more content to entertain us.

TIA


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Secretly Saving on July 11, 2018, 01:41:10 PM


Normally, this would be a frustrating situation, but since FI, I have No More F**k's To Give.  (I should get a T-shirt:  NMFTG)



I would buy that t-shirt! 
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Daisy on July 11, 2018, 09:18:38 PM


Normally, this would be a frustrating situation, but since FI, I have No More F**k's To Give.  (I should get a T-shirt:  NMFTG)



I would buy that t-shirt!

After reading the original post, I was about to reply and say the same thing! A NMFTG t-shirt does fit in my FIRE budget.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Proud Foot on July 12, 2018, 10:26:55 AM


Normally, this would be a frustrating situation, but since FI, I have No More F**k's To Give.  (I should get a T-shirt:  NMFTG)

I would buy that t-shirt!

After reading the original post, I was about to reply and say the same thing! A NMFTG t-shirt does fit in my FIRE budget.

Is this close enough? (http://cheezetees.com/there-it-goes-my-last-fuck-t-shirt/)

Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Brother Esau on July 12, 2018, 10:38:33 AM
NMFTG bumper stickers should be issued!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Dicey on July 13, 2018, 08:46:42 AM


Normally, this would be a frustrating situation, but since FI, I have No More F**k's To Give.  (I should get a T-shirt:  NMFTG)

I would buy that t-shirt!

After reading the original post, I was about to reply and say the same thing! A NMFTG t-shirt does fit in my FIRE budget.

Is this close enough? (http://cheezetees.com/there-it-goes-my-last-fuck-t-shirt/)
Ooh, Hellboy needs one of these for himself and more for gifts! Paging @UnleashHell... Break out the credit card and order up a supply of these...
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: UnleashHell on July 13, 2018, 09:12:21 AM


Normally, this would be a frustrating situation, but since FI, I have No More F**k's To Give.  (I should get a T-shirt:  NMFTG)

I would buy that t-shirt!

After reading the original post, I was about to reply and say the same thing! A NMFTG t-shirt does fit in my FIRE budget.

Is this close enough? (http://cheezetees.com/there-it-goes-my-last-fuck-t-shirt/)
Ooh, Hellboy needs one of these for himself and more for gifts! Paging @UnleashHell... Break out the credit card and order up a supply of these...

you are gonna have to wait until my last day at work when the FI mission is complete.

I would though!!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: solon on July 13, 2018, 01:14:38 PM
You asked for it! Here is your NMFTG t-shirt: https://smile.amazon.com/dp/B07FKRCC8M
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Dicey on July 13, 2018, 07:35:26 PM


Normally, this would be a frustrating situation, but since FI, I have No More F**k's To Give.  (I should get a T-shirt:  NMFTG)

I would buy that t-shirt!

After reading the original post, I was about to reply and say the same thing! A NMFTG t-shirt does fit in my FIRE budget.

Is this close enough? (http://cheezetees.com/there-it-goes-my-last-fuck-t-shirt/)
Ooh, Hellboy needs one of these for himself and more for gifts! Paging @UnleashHell... Break out the credit card and order up a supply of these...

you are gonna have to wait until my last day at work when the FI mission is complete.

I would though!!
Buy it now, secure in the knowledge that day is a-comin' soon, Hellboy.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: solon on July 14, 2018, 10:07:00 PM
Somebody bought one! That was right nice of you!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: mstr d on July 17, 2018, 11:45:23 AM
I was unloading my truck at a supermarket. After unloading the manager helped me loading my truck again with containers with empty crades.
A employee of the store came outside because se had a lunch break and she started smoking right next the back entrace and tail lift of my truck where I am working.
I asked her nicely if she like to stop smoking or smoke somewhere else. She just ignored me.

I asked nicely again. Still ignored me. Then I said a third time and she says I am outside I have a break I can smoke here. I told her my truck is a workplace and I am allowed to work smoke free. I need to load at this door and you can go somewhere else I can't.
The manager sayed nothing all this time.
I told the girl and the manager, she go smoke somewhere else or this container is the last one I load.

She did not stop. So I closed my tail lift. And the manager wass like??? What are you doing. I said: I just told you this is the last container I gonna load. He: I will not sign the cargo papers!. I said Oke with a smile and I drove off! The manager went inside to call my boss. And I hear the girl asking her manager: bud is it not allowed to smoke?

I was driving back, my boss called me he asked me how are you doing? I said very happy: Great. And asked why I did not load all the containers. I explained everything. He was oke with it, bud i had to call next time. And when I was back the big boss for we we drive was the that owns the store was there and asked me what happened he told me he supported me.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: RyanAtTanagra on July 17, 2018, 11:56:10 AM
I told the girl and the manager, she go smoke somewhere else or this container is the last one I load.

She did not stop. So I closed my tail lift. And the manager wass like??? What are you doing. I said: I just told you this is the last container I gonna load.

People blow so much smoke (hah!) and never follow through on their threats.  Like you, I don't bluff.  I love the surprise when I actually do what I said I was going to do.  "were you listening???"
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: rantk81 on July 17, 2018, 05:27:51 PM
Not really epic but....

Background info:  Just this week, the sale of two of my rental properties closed. It was a bulk-deconversion from a condo building into apartments, with some investment REIT company paying a 30-40% premium over market value for all of the units in the building. It finally closed. I received the proceeds from the sale of my two (paid off) units yesterday, and today I wired a pay-off to the mortgage company on my home. After reserving some for estimated tax payments, I wired the rest of the funds to my broker.  Now I'm sitting on a 100% paid off home, zero debt whatsoever, and between tax-advantaged-retirement accounts and after-tax accounts, I have about 1.25M invested in low cost index funds.

At work today, there was some hair-on-fire emergency just as I was about to leave for the day (after coming in at 7:00am this morning... and my boss came in at 10:00am, mind you)... I decided I would just leave for the day anyway. :D  Life is good.  What are they going to do, fire me tomorrow? lol.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Stash Engineer on July 17, 2018, 07:40:43 PM
Not really epic but....

Background info:  Just this week, the sale of two of my rental properties closed. It was a bulk-deconversion from a condo building into apartments, with some investment REIT company paying a 30-40% premium over market value for all of the units in the building. It finally closed. I received the proceeds from the sale of my two (paid off) units yesterday, and today I wired a pay-off to the mortgage company on my home. After reserving some for estimated tax payments, I wired the rest of the funds to my broker.  Now I'm sitting on a 100% paid off home, zero debt whatsoever, and between tax-advantaged-retirement accounts and after-tax accounts, I have about 1.25M invested in low cost index funds.

At work today, there was some hair-on-fire emergency just as I was about to leave for the day (after coming in at 7:00am this morning... and my boss came in at 10:00am, mind you)... I decided I would just leave for the day anyway. :D  Life is good.  What are they going to do, fire me tomorrow? lol.

Sounds FrEaKiN EPIC to me!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: iluvzbeach on July 17, 2018, 08:13:06 PM
+1. Totally epic! Congrats on a job well done.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Neustache on July 18, 2018, 07:22:03 AM
Not really epic but....

Background info:  Just this week, the sale of two of my rental properties closed. It was a bulk-deconversion from a condo building into apartments, with some investment REIT company paying a 30-40% premium over market value for all of the units in the building. It finally closed. I received the proceeds from the sale of my two (paid off) units yesterday, and today I wired a pay-off to the mortgage company on my home. After reserving some for estimated tax payments, I wired the rest of the funds to my broker.  Now I'm sitting on a 100% paid off home, zero debt whatsoever, and between tax-advantaged-retirement accounts and after-tax accounts, I have about 1.25M invested in low cost index funds.

At work today, there was some hair-on-fire emergency just as I was about to leave for the day (after coming in at 7:00am this morning... and my boss came in at 10:00am, mind you)... I decided I would just leave for the day anyway. :D  Life is good.  What are they going to do, fire me tomorrow? lol.



Yes!! This is where I hope my husband is in about 10 years.  He gets in at 7 and there's always late meetings.  Can't wait until he can say "nope!"  Good for you!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: AlanStache on July 18, 2018, 10:04:34 AM
rantk81 - awesome.  Not sure I could have even gone into the office after clearing the accounts :-)
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: rantk81 on July 18, 2018, 06:17:44 PM
Thanks. I feel like I’m almost FI now, but not enough of a safety margin (especially considering the questions about health expenses in the USA in the future) to call it quits quite yet... bring on the OMY I guess...
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: TomTX on August 10, 2018, 08:34:28 PM
So, I got a new job last December because my old job was giving me issues. There was a whole mental breakdown in fact, that was interesting (it's probably somewhere in this thread actually). Anyway, new job. Great, except for the part where they lied about all the culture problems (previously REALLY toxic, now just messed up), put me on the most dysfunctional team, and that they didn't actually do training. And apparently I hate the whole industry, like really think that it shouldn't exist in current form.

I gave them a chance. I really, really did. But things aren't getting better, they're actually getting worse. I don't want to put up with it. There are more jobs for me than people like me, so I don't need to put up with it.

I got a verbal offer from another company, more money (not really a concern honestly), much better industry, get great vibes from the team. I GRILLED them on culture, morale, training, etc. Really grilled them, to the extent that they seemed surprised. Apparently it worked though, cause they like me.

So, now I get to figure out how to give notice when I've been in the job for 6 months. That should be interesting. Not doing anything until I have the formal, written offer and paperwork is official. So, probably next week.

So, this thread's been dead - so I'm going foamy.

The proper resignation letter is in the style of President Nixon. However, unlike Nixon, you typically are giving notice of intent to quit in a timeperiod (the canonical "2 weeks notice") - thus, the addendum:

"I hereby resign [position] effective [date]"

No explanations, no elaborations, no tearful goodbyes.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Letter_of_Resignation_of_Richard_M._Nixon,_1974.jpg
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Nangirl17 on August 16, 2018, 07:27:41 AM
My SO had a company wide call at work yesterday where they talked about equity vs. equality, and the CEO was "so passionate" about this issue <eyeroll>. My SO dearly wanted to ask if he was going to forego his $16MM salary this year to make it more equitable...

While he could technically retire now, we're going to hold off for a year or two and then he can burn his bridges! I can't wait to copy/paste the email here he sends when he leaves the company!!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: afuera on August 16, 2018, 12:45:19 PM
My SO had a company wide call at work yesterday where they talked about equity vs. equality, and the CEO was "so passionate" about this issue <eyeroll>. My SO dearly wanted to ask if he was going to forego his $16MM salary this year to make it more equitable...

While he could technically retire now, we're going to hold off for a year or two and then he can burn his bridges! I can't wait to copy/paste the email here he sends when he leaves the company!!
Umm, do your SO and I work at the same place?  That is literally exactly what my companies CEO was spouting on about the other day.  Either that or its just a trend...
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: HoustonSker on August 16, 2018, 02:11:56 PM
My SO had a company wide call at work yesterday where they talked about equity vs. equality, and the CEO was "so passionate" about this issue <eyeroll>. My SO dearly wanted to ask if he was going to forego his $16MM salary this year to make it more equitable...

While he could technically retire now, we're going to hold off for a year or two and then he can burn his bridges! I can't wait to copy/paste the email here he sends when he leaves the company!!
Umm, do your SO and I work at the same place?  That is literally exactly what my companies CEO was spouting on about the other day.  Either that or its just a trend...

Equinor?
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: gaja on August 16, 2018, 04:21:08 PM
My SO had a company wide call at work yesterday where they talked about equity vs. equality, and the CEO was "so passionate" about this issue <eyeroll>. My SO dearly wanted to ask if he was going to forego his $16MM salary this year to make it more equitable...

While he could technically retire now, we're going to hold off for a year or two and then he can burn his bridges! I can't wait to copy/paste the email here he sends when he leaves the company!!
Umm, do your SO and I work at the same place?  That is literally exactly what my companies CEO was spouting on about the other day.  Either that or its just a trend...

Equinor?

If some ceos in equinor makes $16millions, the Norwegian media would be very happy to hear about it. The official numbers are closer to $1.6mill. https://www.aftenbladet.no/aenergi/i/G1nv0J/Statoil-sjefen-okte-lonna-med-31-prosent (Table with salaries if you scroll down in article).
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: EricL on August 16, 2018, 04:52:01 PM
OK, I finally found something I definitely have a beef with Nancy over.  She doesn't want to impeach Trump.

https://www.cnbc.com/2018/05/08/nancy-pelosi-shrugs-off-trump-impeachment-ahead-of-midterm-elections.html

Wrong thread? Pelosi was over in off-topic

Yep.  Sorry for foam.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Mesmoiselle on August 17, 2018, 09:20:39 AM
I interview for assignment contract. I am told I will be 1 of 3 employees, and that call will be shared among us three.

I arrive, get roughly two weeks of training, and then become 1 of 2 employees as employee 3 has decided to use all of her vacation to disappear for three weeks. I am 1 of 2 people taking call then obviously. It becomes clear to me that this department really needs 4 employees, not 3, with their current patient load. During that time, Employee 1 puts in her notice, effective the day Employee 3 returns from vacation.

Somehow Employee 3 STILL gets to take more vacation and so there are literally days where I am the only staff for that department that day, and they're bringing in strangers from other locations who don't know what the fuq about anything. I am so irritated by their incompetence, I wish they hadn't come at all, but I digress. I am still 1 of 2 people being on call.

Employee 3 (now employee 1, since she's the only true staff at this point) do our best. But after one evening where I scanned 15 patients, I consider not going back in. My injury is flaring up because of this chronic understaffing, and I'm not willing to destroy myself for anyone. But I'm new with this contract company, and I am not prone to Immediate Quitting so I go in and I find the immediate supervisor.

I tell her about my prior injury, that I'm not interested in being injured again. That the current workload with no reprieve from management was demoralizing. That if I were a regular staff employee, this would be my two weeks notice. But that because I'm contract, I would finish my contract. I add that I am not interested in extending (implied, no matter how fuq'd they are) with the staffing level is as it is now. She assures me that they have hired a new permanent staffer and approved another contract worker.

WE suffer another two weeks. The new people start and pull the clueless "I'm new" card about why they aren't pulling their weight. But I keep in mind everyone is not as quick out the gate as I am (I suppose that's narcissim but it's true) and at least console myself that in 10 more days, they'll get their weight in call at least and I am final 1 of 4.

Employee 1 puts in HER notice. I practically high five her. I contemplate that this location will be asking for an extension, talk it over with the hubs, and decide I'll extend no more than a month ONLY because I'm 2-3 weeks short of my Max the 401k goal, but that would be it. I go in to inquire if they'll be extending, and they put me off with admin bullshit. Which may be true, but I immediately grow impatient with their stupidity. They only have 1 employee left, having lost the other three to chronic understaffing, and they're not ensuring their new employee has help in advance? Additionally, my landlady wants to list the place I'm staying in, and I am no interested in going through the legwork to find a new place to stay if they want to wait until the last desperate moment to ask me. I tell my landlady I'm giving them until the 24th, and then she can list the place. (she's very accomadating, that's still 30 days prior to end of my lease anyway)

But then I see an educational symposium I want to go to. And my injury is flaring up. So, I just told them yesterday, that regardless of whatever their needs are, I won't be available for two weeks end of September for "rest and a symposium."

I know none of this is Quitting with a big FU but someone who was desperate for a paycheck wouldn't have talked to their supervisor that way, nor would they be informing them of when their vacations would be without asking for approval. These are MY wins, and I wanted to share them.

Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Dicey on August 17, 2018, 09:33:21 AM
^^And I am glad you did. Good for you! First rule is: Take Care of Yourself.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Loren Ver on August 17, 2018, 02:29:46 PM

 My injury is flaring up because of this chronic understaffing, and I'm not willing to destroy myself for anyone.

Another great reason to have walking money!!

LV
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Capt j-rod on August 23, 2018, 07:04:28 PM
This is very small scale but funny none the less. I used to restore classic cars years ago. I kept my best one and sold off the rest. I was doing some shop cleaning and there were a set of very nice seats out of chevelle ss. These seats are easily worth $750. I threw them out on the two-face book in the marketplace for $200. Literally a steal but I just wanted them gone and I felt good by giving someone a deal. After two days of messaging and I agree to hold the seats for the guy. He shows up and offers me $100... In my crabby ass pissed off mood I nonchalantly walk over to my tool box, grabbed a box cutter and slashed the shit out the seats. I then turned and replied that they are now worth $100 and I can help him load them in his truck. He was literally speechless and got in the truck and drove away. What he didn't know is that I have OEM seat skins waiting to go on the seats and I was going to throw them in. I loaded them up and gave them to a buddy tonight for free. No good deed ever goes un punished.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Duke03 on August 23, 2018, 08:14:01 PM
This is very small scale but funny none the less. I used to restore classic cars years ago. I kept my best one and sold off the rest. I was doing some shop cleaning and there were a set of very nice seats out of chevelle ss. These seats are easily worth $750. I threw them out on the two-face book in the marketplace for $200. Literally a steal but I just wanted them gone and I felt good by giving someone a deal. After two days of messaging and I agree to hold the seats for the guy. He shows up and offers me $100... In my crabby ass pissed off mood I nonchalantly walk over to my tool box, grabbed a box cutter and slashed the shit out the seats. I then turned and replied that they are now worth $100 and I can help him load them in his truck. He was literally speechless and got in the truck and drove away. What he didn't know is that I have OEM seat skins waiting to go on the seats and I was going to throw them in. I loaded them up and gave them to a buddy tonight for free. No good deed ever goes un punished.

Did we just become best friends?
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: SwordGuy on August 23, 2018, 09:24:15 PM
This is very small scale but funny none the less. I used to restore classic cars years ago. I kept my best one and sold off the rest. I was doing some shop cleaning and there were a set of very nice seats out of chevelle ss. These seats are easily worth $750. I threw them out on the two-face book in the marketplace for $200. Literally a steal but I just wanted them gone and I felt good by giving someone a deal. After two days of messaging and I agree to hold the seats for the guy. He shows up and offers me $100... In my crabby ass pissed off mood I nonchalantly walk over to my tool box, grabbed a box cutter and slashed the shit out the seats. I then turned and replied that they are now worth $100 and I can help him load them in his truck. He was literally speechless and got in the truck and drove away. What he didn't know is that I have OEM seat skins waiting to go on the seats and I was going to throw them in. I loaded them up and gave them to a buddy tonight for free. No good deed ever goes un punished.

Did we just become best friends?

Me too!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: RyanAtTanagra on August 24, 2018, 12:58:30 AM
This is very small scale but funny none the less. I used to restore classic cars years ago. I kept my best one and sold off the rest. I was doing some shop cleaning and there were a set of very nice seats out of chevelle ss. These seats are easily worth $750. I threw them out on the two-face book in the marketplace for $200. Literally a steal but I just wanted them gone and I felt good by giving someone a deal. After two days of messaging and I agree to hold the seats for the guy. He shows up and offers me $100... In my crabby ass pissed off mood I nonchalantly walk over to my tool box, grabbed a box cutter and slashed the shit out the seats. I then turned and replied that they are now worth $100 and I can help him load them in his truck. He was literally speechless and got in the truck and drove away. What he didn't know is that I have OEM seat skins waiting to go on the seats and I was going to throw them in. I loaded them up and gave them to a buddy tonight for free. No good deed ever goes un punished.

Did we just become best friends?

Me too!

Can I be in this awesome club?
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Capt j-rod on August 24, 2018, 06:39:06 AM
LOL! My buddy that I gave them to begged me to take $400... I told him that we would trade later.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Loren Ver on August 24, 2018, 07:50:30 AM
This is very small scale but funny none the less. I used to restore classic cars years ago. I kept my best one and sold off the rest. I was doing some shop cleaning and there were a set of very nice seats out of chevelle ss. These seats are easily worth $750. I threw them out on the two-face book in the marketplace for $200. Literally a steal but I just wanted them gone and I felt good by giving someone a deal. After two days of messaging and I agree to hold the seats for the guy. He shows up and offers me $100... In my crabby ass pissed off mood I nonchalantly walk over to my tool box, grabbed a box cutter and slashed the shit out the seats. I then turned and replied that they are now worth $100 and I can help him load them in his truck. He was literally speechless and got in the truck and drove away. What he didn't know is that I have OEM seat skins waiting to go on the seats and I was going to throw them in. I loaded them up and gave them to a buddy tonight for free. No good deed ever goes un punished.

Did we just become best friends?

Me too!

Can I be in this awesome club?

UHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH.

That is something else.  That guy just offering $100 is special to begin with, but your response is AMAZING.  He is probably posting somewhere about the nut he met and managed to avoid....
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: dollarchaser on August 24, 2018, 03:44:33 PM
Great story. Buying and selling to strangers is almost always a shit show.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Dragonswan on August 27, 2018, 01:27:18 PM
This is very small scale but funny none the less. I used to restore classic cars years ago. I kept my best one and sold off the rest. I was doing some shop cleaning and there were a set of very nice seats out of chevelle ss. These seats are easily worth $750. I threw them out on the two-face book in the marketplace for $200. Literally a steal but I just wanted them gone and I felt good by giving someone a deal. After two days of messaging and I agree to hold the seats for the guy. He shows up and offers me $100... In my crabby ass pissed off mood I nonchalantly walk over to my tool box, grabbed a box cutter and slashed the shit out the seats. I then turned and replied that they are now worth $100 and I can help him load them in his truck. He was literally speechless and got in the truck and drove away. What he didn't know is that I have OEM seat skins waiting to go on the seats and I was going to throw them in. I loaded them up and gave them to a buddy tonight for free. No good deed ever goes un punished.

Did we just become best friends?

Me too!

Can I be in this awesome club?

UHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH.

That is something else.  That guy just offering $100 is special to begin with, but your response is AMAZING.  He is probably posting somewhere about the nut he met and managed to avoid....
Yep probably posted right here in this forum in the Wall of Shame and Comedy section.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Just Joe on August 28, 2018, 06:52:13 AM
This is very small scale but funny none the less. I used to restore classic cars years ago. I kept my best one and sold off the rest. I was doing some shop cleaning and there were a set of very nice seats out of chevelle ss. These seats are easily worth $750. I threw them out on the two-face book in the marketplace for $200. Literally a steal but I just wanted them gone and I felt good by giving someone a deal. After two days of messaging and I agree to hold the seats for the guy. He shows up and offers me $100... In my crabby ass pissed off mood I nonchalantly walk over to my tool box, grabbed a box cutter and slashed the shit out the seats. I then turned and replied that they are now worth $100 and I can help him load them in his truck. He was literally speechless and got in the truck and drove away. What he didn't know is that I have OEM seat skins waiting to go on the seats and I was going to throw them in. I loaded them up and gave them to a buddy tonight for free. No good deed ever goes un punished.

Did we just become best friends?

Me too!

Can I be in this awesome club?

UHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH.

That is something else.  That guy just offering $100 is special to begin with, but your response is AMAZING.  He is probably posting somewhere about the nut he met and managed to avoid....

By now that story has morph'd into you chased him into his truck with a box cutter no doubt. ;)
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: haflander on September 04, 2018, 03:08:58 PM
I love this thread, I get sad when there are no stories for a while. I've been sitting on an FU story from my college days, waiting for a lull in the thread and some boredom at work. If you're short on time, just read the * paragraph.

I had a string of shitty jobs over about 5 yrs in hs/college to pay for school. These included overnight freight/stocking at Home Depot, valet at fancy resort, "waiter" at old folks' home dining room, waiter/bartender at Buffalo Wild Wings, delivery driver for a shady advertising company, assembling heavy duty truck/train locks, appliance delivery/receiving warehouse. Time in each varied from a few days to >1 yr. Typically, I would work during the summer (usually two jobs), and then just quit when it was convenient for me or I couldn't swing the loaded schedule anymore with 15/18 hours of school. Often, I would drive to job 2 (change clothes in the car) after a full day of job 1. I was fired twice from a second job...because the first was going well and Idgaf about the second anymore, and just started sucking at it enough to be fired. I guess that's a mini FU in itself.
Funny side story #1: I was once pulled over; I was speeding to get to the below job on time after school. I was in the middle of changing clothes and I didn't have pants on when the officer got to my window. He was confused but believed my true story, as we were right next to the factory where I worked. Then he looked at my license and asked..."is today your bday?" It was literally my bday, and he let me off with a warning. Thanks cop, wherever you are.

The last of these jobs was at a huge factory that manufactured aluminum parts for clients. Parts were anywhere from huge 100-foot long truck accessories (the railing with holes for tie-down straps) to parts the size of a Rubik's cube. The factory was the size of a several football fields and it was dirty, smelly, and f****** hot. My dept was the CNC lathe machine section, google if necessary. Basically, machines the size of a car/truck would use computer formulas to drill and cut metal pieces. So, you had to know some basic geometry and computer language to know what you're doing, so it was the highest paid and most...white dept of the factory. Sorry, but Idk a more PC way to say that. Even though it was the most skilled, it was still dirty with grime and oil to lube drills, and dangerous. I knew a few guys who didn't have ten fingers from decades of this type of work. One had two half-fingers. I refer to this employer as the Nine Finger Factory, or 9FF. As you can assume, many guys were terrible with money. Several went to the check cashing place every payday for money and paid for literally everything with cash...ya know, can't trust banks or online accounts for my money.
Funny side story #2: I made it out with all ten fingers, but did have one scare. I was trying to loosen a drill bit from its holder. My hand slipped and I cut my wrist on the drill bit. You could see the bone on the side of my wrist, where there's just bone, no muscle. It actually didn't bleed a lot and I was fine. I still have an inch-long scar, but I'm pretty hairy so it's hard to see.
Funny side story #3: Alcoholic boss came in to work wasted once, stumbling and fell asleep. Fired.

*I took the job at 9FF in the beginning of my last summer of school, maybe mid-May. I was on the second shift, 2:30-11:00. Work was monotonous, dirty, and hot, all to be expected. After setting up your machine and getting help to fine tune the measurements, work was as follows... Put part in. Tighten clamps. Press go. Machine drills holes. Loosen clamps. Take old part out. One cycle lasted anywhere from 30 seconds to 5 minutes. I also took two summer classes so I could graduate on time the next May, classes were from about 8:00-12:00. Other than the job inherently sucking but otherwise paying ok, they would change the schedule constantly, and you had no input on your hours. Lot of work this month? The sched is now 6-6. They would tell us this on Friday, for the next Monday. Also on Fridays they would tell us whether we had to work Saturday. Impossible to make any weekend plans for this reason. I would constantly fall asleep in class in the mornings. The profs I had that summer must have known (small classes) but gave me good grades anyway. I was seriously afraid of falling asleep driving home after work. I constantly felt s***-faced drunk, kinda like a zombie. I held on to the job going into the school year knowing I wouldn't keep at it much longer with their BS. I went to grandboss one day telling him I wasn't going to do a variable schedule anymore. He acted like it was a big deal but said ok in the end, I guess we were busy at the time. Around then I did the math of how much I needed to pay off the next and final year of school and decided that after I had that much, I wouldn't work a sched that wasn't convenient for me and school. One (middle of the week?) day found out we were going back to the 6-6 sched. So, I told grandboss I wouldn't come in the next Monday at 6, said I could work the normal hours. He said no, I'm not special, etc. I said ok, Friday is my last day. He said ok but also looked pretty smug, maybe he thought I was bluffing. Guys I worked with didn't care much either for the same reason. Friday I had pizza delivered to work to throw myself a party, knowing it would be the last shitty manual labor job I ever had. That weekend, I went with the gf to her fam's lakehouse and celebrated with lake days and drinking.
Funny side story #4: The low point during this job was when I was talking to a friend and started to nod off and fall asleep mid-conversation when she was talking.

The job sucked but helped me to appreciate $ and be grateful for my education and white-collar job. I didn't take any loans during my last 2 years of school due to the above work and learning my lessons of fed student loans the previous 2 years. I don't have much sympathy for those with huge 6-figure school loan debt because I assume there's no way they were working as much as possible to help pay for school. I keep a few small parts from the factory around my apt and desk at work to remind myself that I have it pretty good. For anyone wondering, I did have enough to pay for school and haven't done a day of a manual labor job since. I drive past 9FF multiple times a week and smile.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: mm1970 on September 04, 2018, 04:37:54 PM
Quote
I don't have much sympathy for those with huge 6-figure school loan debt because I assume there's no way they were working as much as possible to help pay for school.

That was a good story.
Yes, six fig loans are ridiculous.

But what you did was dangerous.  I don't consider working and going to school until you nod off to be at all safe.  Now, I worked PT in college and studied my ass off (4 hours of sleep a night, whee!) and fell asleep in class too - but at least I didn't own a car and only walked across campus.  I wasn't going to accidentally kill someone doing that.

I wouldn't recommend anyone work themselves to exhaustion like that.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: AO1FireTo on September 04, 2018, 05:36:28 PM
This is not about me, but a colleague of mine.

I worked for a large telecommunications company and each year like clockwork they usually lay off x percent of the company.  I had a friend who worked in the long distance department, and he was in charge of all the tables to keep track of the local calling areas.  Each year his department got smaller and smaller until effectively he was the only one that really knew how the tables worked.  If they wanted to make any price changes, etc. they needed him to make the changes or it wouldn't go through.  Well he got a new Director and I guess he didn't really know what my friend did.  My friend got called into a "meeting" and was told that he was getting laid off effectively immediately and asked to sign the exit package.  My friend quietly declined to sign and said that he needed to consult a lawyer.  After he was escorted out, he called all of his contacts at work and told them they better escalate to their VP's because they were effectively screwed now he was gone.


Next day he gets a call from HR offering his old job back plus a small raise.  He politely declinced but did tell them he'd come back as a contractor at double his normal rate as long as they signed a two year contract, and increased his exit package.  Long story short he got what he wanted and has been a contractor for more than the original two years. 
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: zolotiyeruki on September 04, 2018, 07:17:24 PM
This is not about me, but a colleague of mine.

I worked for a large telecommunications company and each year like clockwork they usually lay off x percent of the company.  I had a friend who worked in the long distance department, and he was in charge of all the tables to keep track of the local calling areas.  Each year his department got smaller and smaller until effectively he was the only one that really knew how the tables worked.  If they wanted to make any price changes, etc. they needed him to make the changes or it wouldn't go through.  Well he got a new Director and I guess he didn't really know what my friend did.  My friend got called into a "meeting" and was told that he was getting laid off effectively immediately and asked to sign the exit package.  My friend quietly declined to sign and said that he needed to consult a lawyer.  After he was escorted out, he called all of his contacts at work and told them they better escalate to their VP's because they were effectively screwed now he was gone.


Next day he gets a call from HR offering his old job back plus a small raise.  He politely declinced but did tell them he'd come back as a contractor at double his normal rate as long as they signed a two year contract, and increased his exit package.  Long story short he got what he wanted and has been a contractor for more than the original two years.
Wow.  I'm impressed with the subtle, clever planning there.  He saw the layoff coming, set himself up as a single point of failure, declined to sign the package, and when he had the position of strength, he used it as leverage to get himself a sweet deal.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Hvillian on September 05, 2018, 02:48:28 PM
...  CNC lathe machine section, google if necessary . . .

While I enjoyed your story, I really enjoyed googling "CNC Lathe Machine."  Plenty of interesting videos on youtube of machines doing cool stuff with metal.  Thanks for sharing.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: haflander on September 05, 2018, 03:03:23 PM
mm1970, I can't disagree with you. I wouldn't want my kid to do something like that. I'd much rather save to make sure they don't need to take any loans or shitty jobs. Like many others here, I got about $0 from parents.

Many of us make risky and dangerous decisions while we're young and dumb. I was 17-23 in those years. I'm thankful that these particular choices made me a good amount of money and I didn't lose a finger or hurt anyone. Working like that allowed me to cash flow school and pay cash for 2 used, but still pretty nice for a college kid, cars.

I actually did have an accident driving to that job one day. I backed into my dad's truck in the driveway, so damaged two cars on the same policy. It had nothing to do with exhaustion, though. The main reasons were I was in a hurry and he parked in a weird place and it was July 4th...yeah, still had to work that night. I remember the bosses acting like they did us a favor that day cuz we worked fewer hours than we would have normally. F*** that...pissing on you and calling it rain.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: FrugalToque on September 07, 2018, 10:50:52 AM
Okay, this whole linguistic thing is taking the thread way off topic.  So, amusing as it is, please get back on the thread's central focus.

Thanks,
Toque
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: EricL on September 08, 2018, 01:03:27 AM
While we await the next OT post, here’s a story my father told me years ago.  He swore it was true.  There was a man who hated his alarm clock. This was back when they were proper alarm clocks: mechanical with clanging bells rather than repurposed smart phones or electronics that wake you with gentle music and/or wi fi lighting.  This man hated his alarm clock waking him every morning for his lousy job.  He plotted its murder.  IDK if he retired early of at the usual age.  But he had an elaborate celebration when he did. He dressed up in a tux complete with tails and top hat. He armed himself with a shotgun and took his alarm clock out into the country and with great ceremony shot it to pieces.  He buried it and left a bouquet of roses on the site. Every anniversary of his retirement he dressed in a tux and drove out to the site to lay a bouquet of roses on the site.  He lived long enough to be a subject of great curiosity when developers built a suburb over the site and he continued to solemnly lay roses on someone’s lawn every year. 
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: aGracefulStomp on September 08, 2018, 04:29:31 AM
With no job lined up but not coping with the ridiculous demands of the corporate law gig, I walked into HR of my corporate law job and gave my 4 weeks notice. Instead of accepting my notice, they offered me a 6-month secondment at a community organisation which has great hours, low stress and the same corporate pay. I accepted the secondment. I've used my secondment time to search for a job, and I have just been offered my dream government job = great hours with good pay, job security AND in an area of law that I love.

If I had to secure another job before quitting, I wouldn't have been able to take up the secondment and I wouldn't have looked for and secured the government position. Of course I would not advocate quitting your job before having another job lined up, but I had a 6 month emergency fund and a month of leave saved up that would be paid out. Further, because I save over half of my income each month, the month leave would pay for more than 2 months of my living expenses...which means that I had over 8 months to find another job.

Even better? The position doesn't start for 2 months after my secondment finishes so I'm going to take a 2 month holiday over summer. I already have plans to go camping for a week, to go hiking in New Zealand, and I'm going to learn how to surf :)

I can take this 2 month holiday because of my emergency fund and month of leave...otherwise I would have to face returning to the corporate office to make ends meet. In fact, I won't even have to touch the emergency fund and I'll just use my month of leave payout :)

Not sure if this is "EPIC" and I'm nowhere near FIRE, but there's no way this would have happened if I wasn't financially prepared and frugal!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Trifle on September 08, 2018, 04:35:45 AM
Nice story @EricL !  I did something similar with some of my textbooks after law school, but I didn't dress up or visit the grave afterward.  :)


Absolutely brilliant @aGracefulStomp !  So happy for you!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Schmidty on September 08, 2018, 06:41:34 AM
My story that happened years ago, not with FU money but with a FU budget.

I had been working at a rural hospital an hour and half away from home and was completely miserable.  The hours were okay, basically 4 days a week, being on call 2 of those nights, I just stayed there at the hospital on those nights, so I drove round trip just twice a week.  The pay was good, the job itself was good.  The boss was not.  My boss was supervisor of the department, and being a small rural hospital, was my only co-worker in the department.  Basically we both covered our department. 

This woman was the type that you had to wait to see what mood she was in to know what kind of day you were having.  Mercurial moods, and extreme self-absorbed.  Not one person mattered on this earth more than she did.  Walk on egg shells.  You get the picture.  She also gave her management jobs to me, passing them off as her own to the CEO.  I was completely and utterly miserable and thought I had to put up with it.  I mean, we had bills to pay, right?  About that time I really got in to Dave Ramsey, and was on fire to get out of debt.  My job had a good salary, just thought I would put up with what I had to to get out of debt so I could have FU money and leave that place. 

Well, things don't always work as you plan.  It was affecting my health, losing weight, stomach pains, and all for what?  Once I started working on my budget I started realizing what my actual costs were with keeping that job, and what I was earning after it.  The job didn't sound worth it.  Got really motivated and started really looking into how I can reduce the budget more and more.  And the more I was seeing I really didn't have to stay at this place, the less able I was to handle working for this particular person.  Actually, there was a string of employees that had left before me, and I had heard from other workers that the director wasn't sure why this was happening.  Once I figured out that I really didn't need to stay there, the fire was lit. 

I walked out on a day I literally could not take it anymore.  Boss left for lunch, I wrote up a huge letter to the director detailing why I was leaving, the toxic environment, the work being passed on to others, put the letter under his door, put my badge and key on the desk, and left 2 minutes before she was due to return from lunch.  Hopped in the car and called my (late) husband to tell him and his immediate response was "Woohooo!!!!!". 

Not only were we okay on one income because of the FU budget, but we thrived!  While at home for the next year and doing things at the house to save money and putting every extra penny on debt, we were able to get rid of over $30k of debt, on one income.  I went back to work somewhere else after that year closer and for better pay and we managed to get rid of $26k more debt in 6 more months, debt free baby.  This was over 10 years ago.

Things have changed since, but I still work towards always maintaining and FU budget, because no job is worth the amount of shit some bosses put on a person.  I try to live like a single minimum wage job can still pay the bills, everything else is gravy.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: MissNancyPryor on September 08, 2018, 09:12:27 AM
Yessss!!!  Truly epic and a classic entry for this thread. 
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: radram on September 08, 2018, 09:29:59 AM
I have been FIRE for 3 years from teaching.

2 weeks ago, my former school called. They needed a long term sub for 3 weeks. It was my old position. I didn't really "want" to, but I did leave on great terms and still wish the school and program well. I negotiated what I believed to be a fair rate (close to full day of sub pay for 60% position) for my specialized experience (Computer Science). I bet I could have gotten a lot more, but I really didn't need the money. I even negotiated that the full amount be deposited in my 403b, so as to not count as income this year. And no scheduled meetings, of course :)

On the day I go in to accept, before I got to the district office, there were rumors that the position would be for more than 3 weeks. 6-8 weeks in fact. I told the HR director that I was only able to commit to the agreed 3 weeks, and we will see about the rest. He was fine with that. 5 minutes into our meeting, the HR director offered me a full time position whenever I wanted one. I laughed, and thanked him for the offer.

I was told that in the staff meeting when it was announced I was returning there was applause. It made my feel out of this world to think I was regarded like that. I wasn't there,because no meetings.

Got called in Thursday. Turns out my replacement had a heart attack, a double bypass, and is out a minimum of 3 months. Way more than I bargained for. I told them yesterday I will be there the 3 weeks I agreed to, but not more. If it was going to be 6 weeks, I would have been tempted. Had I not FIRED it very well could have been me. He is 4 years younger than me.

It has been a fantastic week of fond memories seeing former colleagues. When I left 3 years ago, it was the last day of the year that I decide not to return. As a result, I was not really able to say goodbye to very many people back then. It was great to be able to get back to say hello (and goodbye).

Seeing the program, however, was very difficult. Many courses were cut, and my replacement has been struggling. It took me less than 1 day to see I COULD save the program, but I really just have NO desire to do so. I gave my replacement some ideas, but he was not really that interested. One of the main reasons I will not extend my term. You can't save something that doesn't want saving.

Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: FIRE 20/20 on September 08, 2018, 12:50:43 PM
Actually, there was a string of employees that had left before me, and I had heard from other workers that the director wasn't sure why this was happening.  Once I figured out that I really didn't need to stay there, the fire was lit. 

...

I wrote up a huge letter to the director detailing why I was leaving, the toxic environment, the work being passed on to others, put the letter under his door, put my badge and key on the desk, and left 2 minutes before she was due to return from lunch.

Great story, but I want to know what happened to the horrible manager.  If there was a string of employees who had left, the director didn't know why, but when you left you wrote the director a note describing the work environment, did the director take action?  You can't leave that thread hanging!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Dicey on September 09, 2018, 12:09:47 AM
Actually, there was a string of employees that had left before me, and I had heard from other workers that the director wasn't sure why this was happening.  Once I figured out that I really didn't need to stay there, the fire was lit. 

...

I wrote up a huge letter to the director detailing why I was leaving, the toxic environment, the work being passed on to others, put the letter under his door, put my badge and key on the desk, and left 2 minutes before she was due to return from lunch.

Great story, but I want to know what happened to the horrible manager.  If there was a string of employees who had left, the director didn't know why, but when you left you wrote the director a note describing the work environment, did the director take action?  You can't leave that thread hanging!
I want to know, too, so here's a bat signal to @Schmidty. Don't keep us hanging!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Just Joe on September 10, 2018, 08:48:02 AM
"I also took two summer classes so I could graduate on time the next May, classes were from about 8:00-12:00. Other than the job inherently sucking but otherwise paying ok, they would change the schedule constantly, and you had no input on your hours. Lot of work this month? The sched is now 6-6. They would tell us this on Friday, for the next Monday. Also on Fridays they would tell us whether we had to work Saturday. Impossible to make any weekend plans for this reason. I would constantly fall asleep in class in the mornings. The profs I had that summer must have known (small classes) but gave me good grades anyway. I was seriously afraid of falling asleep driving home after work. I constantly felt s***-faced drunk, kinda like a zombie.

I did the same thing for part of my college career. Multiple jobs, third shift, that shit-faced zombie, feeling your described during morning classes. You are so spot on with so many parts of the story. Thanks for the memories! Tough to listen to someone's job complaints when you know their situation could be so, so much worse. And we (wife and I) sure do appreciate where we are in life now compared to back then. Everyone needs to work a few really lousy jobs along the way.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Schmidty on September 11, 2018, 10:35:27 AM
Actually, there was a string of employees that had left before me, and I had heard from other workers that the director wasn't sure why this was happening.  Once I figured out that I really didn't need to stay there, the fire was lit. 

...

I wrote up a huge letter to the director detailing why I was leaving, the toxic environment, the work being passed on to others, put the letter under his door, put my badge and key on the desk, and left 2 minutes before she was due to return from lunch.

Great story, but I want to know what happened to the horrible manager.  If there was a string of employees who had left, the director didn't know why, but when you left you wrote the director a note describing the work environment, did the director take action?  You can't leave that thread hanging!
I want to know, too, so here's a bat signal to @Schmidty. Don't keep us hanging!

Sorry to leave y'all hanging.  She showed up, naturally, at the job I was started with after my year off work.  AWWWKWARD.  She had already given notice there and it was her last week, we never spoke.  She was off to another state, so am unsure of if she repeated her antics at other places.  While questioning delicately at my new place how I was regarded after leaving like I did my former job, was told by more than one person that not one person held it against me, as "every one knows what she is like" having worked with her themselves.  Last I heard she was job-hopping places along with her husband-hopping (she was on #12 when I worked with her, am not even kidding). 
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: By the River on September 11, 2018, 11:14:58 AM
... Last I heard she was job-hopping places along with her husband-hopping (she was on #12 when I worked with her, am not even kidding).

#12 husband?!?  I can see job #12 but after a certain number wouldn't you give up on being married?
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Schmidty on September 12, 2018, 08:27:41 AM
... Last I heard she was job-hopping places along with her husband-hopping (she was on #12 when I worked with her, am not even kidding).

#12 husband?!?  I can see job #12 but after a certain number wouldn't you give up on being married?

You would think, huh?
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Maenad on September 12, 2018, 08:39:17 AM
Just had an FU-money experience this morning!

Backstory: I work at a Mega-Corp, tens of thousands of employees, facilities all over the world, etc. There's a global project to remediate a number of our products, including some at my site. I've been involved in one specific (and specialized) part of the project since January. Another part of the project requires a lead at each site, someone who will organize the activities to be done, people needed, etc. A Project Manager-type role. I am not a Project Manager.

But you know where this is going. This past spring when the division said, "Who's your site lead?" the managers got together, hemmed and hawed, and all said, "My people are Too Busy, but Maenad is already involved, have her do it." My manager agreed and gave the assignment to me.

Over the past 6 months or so it's become brutally clear that I do not have the skills needed for this role. At all. Hell, I don't even know what I don't know. It's to the point that if I continue, I could actually damage my professional reputation by taking on something I'm unprepared for.

So this morning I went to my boss and told him I'm refusing this role and why. And that I understand that this can have negative ramifications on my job, but the impact to my career otherwise would be worse. I really, really didn't want to have that conversation, but the managers of the areas that should be doing this are thinking that if they just say No long enough, I'll cave, and I needed to make it clear to my boss that that isn't an option.

It was a really uncomfortable conversation, but it felt so good to know that I didn't have to hurt my career* just to save my job. And as it turns out, my boss didn't see this as refusing a direct order at all, so he's OK with me saying no.

*Currently projected to last only another 1.5 years, but still.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: magnet18 on September 20, 2018, 01:18:29 PM
Quote
I don't have much sympathy for those with huge 6-figure school loan debt because I assume there's no way they were working as much as possible to help pay for school.

That was a good story.
Yes, six fig loans are ridiculous.

But what you did was dangerous.  I don't consider working and going to school until you nod off to be at all safe.  Now, I worked PT in college and studied my ass off (4 hours of sleep a night, whee!) and fell asleep in class too - but at least I didn't own a car and only walked across campus.  I wasn't going to accidentally kill someone doing that.

I wouldn't recommend anyone work themselves to exhaustion like that.

DW worked 3 part time jobs in college, while she took extra classes to graduate in 3 years.  4am at the Y, morning classes, tutor midday, afternoon classes, work for the newspaper in the evenings, homework until the 4am shift started. Sleep was weekends and naps.  She graduated debt free, but it probably wasn't the wisest.


Anyway, she always had cash, and did have an epic FU story

One summer she was waitressing for a new local Mexican restaurant (she is very white, that'll be relevant).  Owners daughters ran the place and were incompetent pieces of work.  She enjoyed the job most of the summer and got along with her co-workers (many of whom were Mexican), a story of even a crap job can be fun with the right people.

One day the managers told her it would be her last week, there weren't enough hours to go around for the wait staff.  She was only there for the summer, which was ending in a few weeks anyway, so that kinda sucks, but whatever, not a huge deal. 

Her last day she shows up, and they introduce her to a new (Mexican) waitress, and ask her if she can train her replacement. 

DW says "dafuq, i thought there wasn't enough work"
Managers say "well... Also... Actually... You're not exactly authentic enough" (that's an actual quote)

So no, she did not train her "more authentic" replacement, she dropped her apron on the cash register and walked out

A week later the last white waiter was gone too


Unfortunately she was too upset to enjoy her FU, but we give the place the middle finger when we drive by
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: zolotiyeruki on September 20, 2018, 02:48:42 PM
Her last day she shows up, and they introduce her to a new (Mexican) waitress, and ask her if she can train her replacement. 

DW says "dafuq, i thought there wasn't enough work"
Managers say "well... Also... Actually... You're not exactly authentic enough" (that's an actual quote)
Wow.  At least they had the courage to state the reason.

I dunno about the rest of you, but the skin color and facial features of my server are about the last thing I care about when I go out to eat.  What type of person cares whether their server's skin matches that of the people who live in the country where the food originated?
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: markbike528CBX on September 20, 2018, 04:05:06 PM
Not sure if "courage" is correct, or just astonishment that at the racism is called out.

I had a housemate who was very blond, and worked at an East Indian restaurant. I thought it was pretty cool.

I'm more concerned that the restaurant Clientele matches the restaurants ethnicity, but only in locales with enough appropriate persons of that ethnicity.  However, sometimes middle of nowhere has the most awesome ethnic food, with ALL the local ethnics working at that restaurant.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Freedomin5 on September 20, 2018, 07:53:12 PM
Not sure if "courage" is correct, or just astonishment that at the racism is called out.

I had a housemate who was very blond, and worked at an East Indian restaurant. I thought it was pretty cool.

I'm more concerned that the restaurant Clientele matches the restaurants ethnicity, but only in locales with enough appropriate persons of that ethnicity.  However, sometimes middle of nowhere has the most awesome ethnic food, with ALL the local ethnics working at that restaurant.

I'm confused. Why does it matter whether the clientele matches the restaurant's ethnicity? If I'm white and want to eat at an Asian restaurant, or if I'm Asian and feel like Italian food, why does it matter whether I'll "match" the restaurant's food, regardless of how many "appropriate persons of that ethnicity" reside at that particular location? I think I'm misunderstanding something here.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Carless on September 20, 2018, 08:13:04 PM
If you go  to a chinese place in chinatown and everyone there is white, you're probably in some americanized joint like the mandarin that sells chicken balls and other deep fried barely-chinese knockoffs.  If most of the customers are chinese, and the menu is mostly in chinese, and there aren't any forks on the table (only chopsticks) you've probably found a place that's authentic, and good enough that the people most experienced in the cuisine think it's good.

Of course, you might want chicken balls, so it depends what you're after.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: zolotiyeruki on September 20, 2018, 08:13:35 PM
Not sure if "courage" is correct, or just astonishment that at the racism is called out.

I had a housemate who was very blond, and worked at an East Indian restaurant. I thought it was pretty cool.

I'm more concerned that the restaurant Clientele matches the restaurants ethnicity, but only in locales with enough appropriate persons of that ethnicity.  However, sometimes middle of nowhere has the most awesome ethnic food, with ALL the local ethnics working at that restaurant.

I'm confused. Why does it matter whether the clientele matches the restaurant's ethnicity? If I'm white and want to eat at an Asian restaurant, or if I'm Asian and feel like Italian food, why does it matter whether I'll "match" the restaurant's food, regardless of how many "appropriate persons of that ethnicity" reside at that particular location? I think I'm misunderstanding something here.
My guess is he means that if you see your local Chinese community frequent a particular restaurant, it means the restaurant's food is likely more authentic/yummier.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: EricL on September 20, 2018, 10:54:45 PM
Not sure if "courage" is correct, or just astonishment that at the racism is called out.

I had a housemate who was very blond, and worked at an East Indian restaurant. I thought it was pretty cool.

I'm more concerned that the restaurant Clientele matches the restaurants ethnicity, but only in locales with enough appropriate persons of that ethnicity.  However, sometimes middle of nowhere has the most awesome ethnic food, with ALL the local ethnics working at that restaurant.

I'm confused. Why does it matter whether the clientele matches the restaurant's ethnicity? If I'm white and want to eat at an Asian restaurant, or if I'm Asian and feel like Italian food, why does it matter whether I'll "match" the restaurant's food, regardless of how many "appropriate persons of that ethnicity" reside at that particular location? I think I'm misunderstanding something here.
My guess is he means that if you see your local Chinese community frequent a particular restaurant, it means the restaurant's food is likely more authentic/yummier.

Where I live only the serving staff will be Chinese. Often the guys in the back will be Hispanic.  Panda Express may have every ethnicity but Chinese employed.  Not that it matters much.  American Chinese food, while tasty, is not actual Chinese food. 
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: magnet18 on September 21, 2018, 05:50:27 AM
Probably too late...but...termination due to race?

Probably something that would be worth a quick consult.

I seriously brought it up multiple times, because I was pretty sure we could get 1 or 2 others waiters who got let go in on it, but she didn't want the hassle, they only screwed her out of a couple weeks pay

I did forget to mention, she left them hanging in the middle of lunch rush
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: zeli2033 on September 21, 2018, 08:06:47 AM
Just had an FU-money experience this morning!

Backstory: I work at a Mega-Corp, tens of thousands of employees, facilities all over the world, etc. There's a global project to remediate a number of our products, including some at my site. I've been involved in one specific (and specialized) part of the project since January. Another part of the project requires a lead at each site, someone who will organize the activities to be done, people needed, etc. A Project Manager-type role. I am not a Project Manager.

But you know where this is going. This past spring when the division said, "Who's your site lead?" the managers got together, hemmed and hawed, and all said, "My people are Too Busy, but Maenad is already involved, have her do it." My manager agreed and gave the assignment to me.

Over the past 6 months or so it's become brutally clear that I do not have the skills needed for this role. At all. Hell, I don't even know what I don't know. It's to the point that if I continue, I could actually damage my professional reputation by taking on something I'm unprepared for.

So this morning I went to my boss and told him I'm refusing this role and why. And that I understand that this can have negative ramifications on my job, but the impact to my career otherwise would be worse. I really, really didn't want to have that conversation, but the managers of the areas that should be doing this are thinking that if they just say No long enough, I'll cave, and I needed to make it clear to my boss that that isn't an option.

It was a really uncomfortable conversation, but it felt so good to know that I didn't have to hurt my career* just to save my job. And as it turns out, my boss didn't see this as refusing a direct order at all, so he's OK with me saying no.

*Currently projected to last only another 1.5 years, but still.

I’m a little late to celebrating this, but well done standing up for yourself and communicating what you needed in this instance!  Perfect use of having some FU money :)

I have noticed something similar in my own life - having a stronger handle on my finances (not necessarily FU money yet but I can see that on the horizon). Anyway, just having that confidence makes it much easier to be direct and upfront at work when something isn’t working for me or could be better.

Nice job!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: markbike528CBX on September 21, 2018, 09:11:25 AM
Not sure if "courage" is correct, or just astonishment that at the racism is called out.

I had a housemate who was very blond, and worked at an East Indian restaurant. I thought it was pretty cool.

I'm more concerned that the restaurant Clientele matches the restaurants ethnicity, but only in locales with enough appropriate persons of that ethnicity.  However, sometimes middle of nowhere has the most awesome ethnic food, with ALL the local ethnics working at that restaurant.

I'm confused. Why does it matter whether the clientele matches the restaurant's ethnicity? If I'm white and want to eat at an Asian restaurant, or if I'm Asian and feel like Italian food, why does it matter whether I'll "match" the restaurant's food, regardless of how many "appropriate persons of that ethnicity" reside at that particular location? I think I'm misunderstanding something here.
My guess is he means that if you see your local Chinese community frequent a particular restaurant, it means the restaurant's food is likely more authentic/yummier.
Yep, what zolotiyeruki said.   Applies to other ethnicies too, not just Chinese.  Of course, more authentic might not be to your taste ie, YMMV.

Also applies to "American" resturants overseas.  "more authentic" is never spot on, but sometimes surprisingly close.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: okisok on September 21, 2018, 11:29:59 AM

[/quote]
I have noticed something similar in my own life - having a stronger handle on my finances (not necessarily FU money yet but I can see that on the horizon). Anyway, just having that confidence makes it much easier to be direct and upfront at work when something isn’t working for me or could be better.

Nice job!
[/quote]

Exactly this! I've binge-read this thread over the last few days, and it's given me a whole new mindset. I'm not anywhere near FIRE, but I'm working on it. I've been cutting expenses for 18 months & socking more into savings. Knowing that I have a little FU money (maybe 'Thanks, But No Thanks money), plus easily translatable job skills, helps me be more relaxed at my job. It also gives me this same kind of confidence. What are they going to do, fire me? Great, I'll collect unemployment and work some side gigs until I find another job at my level.

Thanks so much to everyone who's posted here!

(Foam: y'all can be singular, like when you don't want to call out an individual or cause offense (as in the car-backing out story another poster told) or like my grandma used it. "Y'all want somethin' ta eat?"; not implying that my mother hadn't offered me food or that I wasn't capable of preparing it myself, but that she would gladly prepare me something to eat. :)
Also, it works beautifully as a gender-neutral second person pronoun, and I use it regularly in the hospitality industry. Don't know the preferred pronoun? 'Y'all' to the rescue! This is from Oklahoma, with family by way of Virginia and Appalachia:)
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Threshkin on September 25, 2018, 05:03:26 PM
This discussion on restaurants and race reminded me of the cultural appropriation uproar in Portlandia last year.  How could a Mexican or an Indian restaurant even consider hiring a white person?

https://www.tastingtable.com/dine/national/portland-kooks-burritos-cultural-appropriation-restaurant-list

/sarc off
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: UK Dancer on October 04, 2018, 08:30:24 AM
Just wanting to bump this awesome thread that I've bingeread this week!

Not my FU story, but my mum:
She worked for one of the Big Four and when she was 52 she turned around to her bosses and said she wanted to retire, assuming they'd negotiate a steadily decreasing part-time arrangement over the next year to hand over her projects etc (in the same way two of her peers were in the process of doing). The partner who supervised her PANICKED, blurting out that they couldn't afford that, no-one had any of her knowledge, there was no-one to take over and he had no plan for replacing her as her skillset was probably unique in the world, let alone the UK.

She came out of that meeting with three weeks of extra PTO and an agreement to let her have a 3 month half-pay sabbatical the following year (the reason she wanted to retire early was to travel and enjoy some new cultures). Stupidly, they didn't set a time limit in the agreement for how long she had to stay so after she'd come back from the sabbatical and been back working for about 6 months, back she comes into his office. "I want to retire." This time, she walks out with another two weeks of PTO and a £15k pay increase.
Another year passes, another "retirement", out she walks with yet another two weeks of PTO and another big pay increase.

Eventually, she retires aged 63, with a whopping 22 weeks of PTO per year, having had three sabbaticals, paid £112k more per year than she was when she first tried to retire and, as a result, with a defined benefit pension plan that had been boosted massively. Even now (5 years later) she's going back to consult 2 or 3 days a month for 160% of her retiring salary...
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: fuzzy math on October 04, 2018, 08:38:56 AM
This discussion on restaurants and race reminded me of the cultural appropriation uproar in Portlandia last year.  How could a Mexican or an Indian restaurant even consider hiring a white person?

https://www.tastingtable.com/dine/national/portland-kooks-burritos-cultural-appropriation-restaurant-list

/sarc off

Portland when you start messing with Por Que No? You've gone too far...
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Livingthedream55 on October 04, 2018, 08:42:23 AM
Just wanting to bump this awesome thread that I've bingeread this week!

Not my FU story, but my mum:
She worked for one of the Big Four and when she was 52 she turned around to her bosses and said she wanted to retire, assuming they'd negotiate a steadily decreasing part-time arrangement over the next year to hand over her projects etc (in the same way two of her peers were in the process of doing). The partner who supervised her PANICKED, blurting out that they couldn't afford that, no-one had any of her knowledge, there was no-one to take over and he had no plan for replacing her as her skillset was probably unique in the world, let alone the UK.

She came out of that meeting with three weeks of extra PTO and an agreement to let her have a 3 month half-pay sabbatical the following year (the reason she wanted to retire early was to travel and enjoy some new cultures). Stupidly, they didn't set a time limit in the agreement for how long she had to stay so after she'd come back from the sabbatical and been back working for about 6 months, back she comes into his office. "I want to retire." This time, she walks out with another two weeks of PTO and a £15k pay increase.
Another year passes, another "retirement", out she walks with yet another two weeks of PTO and another big pay increase.

Eventually, she retires aged 63, with a whopping 22 weeks of PTO per year, having had three sabbaticals, paid £112k more per year than she was when she first tried to retire and, as a result, with a defined benefit pension plan that had been boosted massively. Even now (5 years later) she's going back to consult 2 or 3 days a month for 160% of her retiring salary...

LOVE THIS!!!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: okits on October 04, 2018, 11:23:06 AM
Just wanting to bump this awesome thread that I've bingeread this week!

Not my FU story, but my mum:
She worked for one of the Big Four and when she was 52 she turned around to her bosses and said she wanted to retire, assuming they'd negotiate a steadily decreasing part-time arrangement over the next year to hand over her projects etc (in the same way two of her peers were in the process of doing). The partner who supervised her PANICKED, blurting out that they couldn't afford that, no-one had any of her knowledge, there was no-one to take over and he had no plan for replacing her as her skillset was probably unique in the world, let alone the UK.

She came out of that meeting with three weeks of extra PTO and an agreement to let her have a 3 month half-pay sabbatical the following year (the reason she wanted to retire early was to travel and enjoy some new cultures). Stupidly, they didn't set a time limit in the agreement for how long she had to stay so after she'd come back from the sabbatical and been back working for about 6 months, back she comes into his office. "I want to retire." This time, she walks out with another two weeks of PTO and a £15k pay increase.
Another year passes, another "retirement", out she walks with yet another two weeks of PTO and another big pay increase.

Eventually, she retires aged 63, with a whopping 22 weeks of PTO per year, having had three sabbaticals, paid £112k more per year than she was when she first tried to retire and, as a result, with a defined benefit pension plan that had been boosted massively. Even now (5 years later) she's going back to consult 2 or 3 days a month for 160% of her retiring salary...

LOVE THIS!!!

Yeah.  @UK Dancer , your mum rocks.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: DS on October 04, 2018, 11:41:37 AM
@UK Dancer that is awesome! Interested to hear what her skillset was if you don't mind sharing?
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: UK Dancer on October 05, 2018, 12:55:56 AM
Bearing in mind quite how unique it seems to be as a skillset and given she's still consulting, I'd probably better not be too specific, but it's a highly complex area of international tax law.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Maenad on October 05, 2018, 05:21:34 AM
Your mum is a BOSS!!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: electriceagle on October 05, 2018, 06:49:55 AM
This discussion on restaurants and race reminded me of the cultural appropriation uproar in Portlandia last year.  How could a Mexican or an Indian restaurant even consider hiring a white person?

https://www.tastingtable.com/dine/national/portland-kooks-burritos-cultural-appropriation-restaurant-list

/sarc off

My favorite restaurant in my (second) college town was a Mexican restaurant that was purchased by an Indian family. Best everything ever.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Mother Fussbudget on October 05, 2018, 06:29:57 PM
When is an Asshair not an asshair?  (Asshair#5) the latest in a 20+ year saga...


Can you continue to work, please?  These are great stories and I think you need more content to entertain us.

TIA


Not likely, but I *DO* have a follow-up on Asshair#5 which is karmicly interesting...  funny(?)... you tell me.

Around August 14th, I rode my bike back to my last contract job site to treat myself to a free fancy coffee.  Even without a badge, I walked right in.  In fact, someone who knew me arrived at the same minute I did, and HELD THE DOOR FOR ME(!) 
I had rolled off the contract work on July 31st after training my back-fill person, and saying my goodbyes.  I found my former project co-workers exactly where I expected - 'camping' in the plush kitchen area in one of the more artistic buildings on campus.  We were discouraged from 'camping', but we had been promised a regular place to sit & work since APRIL, so... we did what we had to do to continue to perform good work. 

They were both happy to see me - my friendly co-worker AND my 'backfill'.  BUT... Asshair#5 wasn't scowling in his corner apart from the other two.  But while they seemed glad to see me, they also seemed... nervous.

ME:  So?  What's up? Where's AH5, and why so nervous?
THEM:  He was released from the project yesterday.  (!!!???!!!)  After you left, he had no one to talk him down from the ledge and he continued to muddle in 'corporate politics' (note: a BIG NO-NO when you're a contractor - just 'do-the-job').  The John let him go.  Today, we're meeting with the director to learn OUR fate this morning at 10am. 

WHOA!  Apparently the guy that caused me to pull the "FI" card [admittedly that was a bit passive aggressive, but I could afford to be that way... I certainly wasn't going to get into playing office politics the way Asshair#5 was doing] was 'released' (fired) from the project because he was overreaching his position, and trying to dictate how the development resources should get THEIR jobs done.  There was a massive butting of heads, and it was a fight he wasn't going to win. 

I briefly thought... S#!T, I could slip back in and project manage this thing in his place - I know how *I* would run it, and it would be much more to the client's liking!  But then, I realized I had already starting selling off all my stuff, donating stuff to Goodwill & other thriftstores, etc to prepare to sell the house and move to a LCOL area.  I'd rented the truck for 8/20 - and it wasn't worth postponing FI again just to butter my ego.  Ces't la vie!

Instead, I went into 'calm these guys down' mode.  "You're the two who are actually doing the WORK on the product / Project planning side, and they'd be crazy to let you go.  Just let them know you're still doing the work, and look forward to be able to give direct feedback instead of funneling everything through the 'Asshair#5 Filter'.  It was a bittersweet reunion, but I smiled all the way home after using their 'barista machine' to make myself two fancy coffee's.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: solon on October 05, 2018, 09:12:10 PM
When is an Asshair not an asshair?  (Asshair#5) the latest in a 20+ year saga...


Can you continue to work, please?  These are great stories and I think you need more content to entertain us.

TIA


Not likely, but I *DO* have a follow-up on Asshair#5 which is karmicly interesting...  funny(?)... you tell me.

Around August 14th, I rode my bike back to my last contract job site to treat myself to a free fancy coffee.  Even without a badge, I walked right in.  In fact, someone who knew me arrived at the same minute I did, and HELD THE DOOR FOR ME(!) 
I had rolled off the contract work on July 31st after training my back-fill person, and saying my goodbyes.  I found my former project co-workers exactly where I expected - 'camping' in the plush kitchen area in one of the more artistic buildings on campus.  We were discouraged from 'camping', but we had been promised a regular place to sit & work since APRIL, so... we did what we had to do to continue to perform good work. 

They were both happy to see me - my friendly co-worker AND my 'backfill'.  BUT... Asshair#5 wasn't scowling in his corner apart from the other two.  But while they seemed glad to see me, they also seemed... nervous.

ME:  So?  What's up? Where's AH5, and why so nervous?
THEM:  He was released from the project yesterday.  (!!!???!!!)  After you left, he had no one to talk him down from the ledge and he continued to muddle in 'corporate politics' (note: a BIG NO-NO when you're a contractor - just 'do-the-job').  The John let him go.  Today, we're meeting with the director to learn OUR fate this morning at 10am. 

WHOA!  Apparently the guy that caused me to pull the "FI" card [admittedly that was a bit passive aggressive, but I could afford to be that way... I certainly wasn't going to get into playing office politics the way Asshair#5 was doing] was 'released' (fired) from the project because he was overreaching his position, and trying to dictate how the development resources should get THEIR jobs done.  There was a massive butting of heads, and it was a fight he wasn't going to win. 

I briefly thought... S#!T, I could slip back in and project manage this thing in his place - I know how *I* would run it, and it would be much more to the client's liking!  But then, I realized I had already starting selling off all my stuff, donating stuff to Goodwill & other thriftstores, etc to prepare to sell the house and move to a LCOL area.  I'd rented the truck for 8/20 - and it wasn't worth postponing FI again just to butter my ego.  Ces't la vie!

Instead, I went into 'calm these guys down' mode.  "You're the two who are actually doing the WORK on the product / Project planning side, and they'd be crazy to let you go.  Just let them know you're still doing the work, and look forward to be able to give direct feedback instead of funneling everything through the 'Asshair#5 Filter'.  It was a bittersweet reunion, but I smiled all the way home after using their 'barista machine' to make myself two fancy coffee's.

Would it be too self-serving to point out that I made a t-shirt based on Asshair#5?  https://smile.amazon.com/dp/B07FKRCC8M
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: WhiteTrashCash on October 06, 2018, 12:29:59 PM
This discussion on restaurants and race reminded me of the cultural appropriation uproar in Portlandia last year.  How could a Mexican or an Indian restaurant even consider hiring a white person?

https://www.tastingtable.com/dine/national/portland-kooks-burritos-cultural-appropriation-restaurant-list

/sarc off

That article, just... wow.
[rant]
No offense to the easily offended (which is most Americans these days), but my family has lived on this continent for 15,000 years and in one branch or another absorbed almost every other immigrant group that has entered the territory that is now the United States for the past 400 years. I will make and eat (and sell if I feel like it) any damn food I want. I will also wear any clothes I want, any Halloween costume I want, listen and make any music I want, and produce any kind of art I want. If people don't like it, then they can move to another country that isn't multicultural like ours. [/rant]
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Cannot Wait! on October 17, 2018, 11:45:14 AM
Hey,  for those of you with a long memory - I posted on here 2 years ago about a hideous boss.   Seems I was not alone in thinking so...

https://www.google.com/amp/s/globalnews.ca/news/4557549/kingston-pet-sitting-business-allegedly-mismanaged-says-former-workers-client/amp/

Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: thriftyc on October 22, 2018, 09:41:25 PM
I am about to apply my FU stache and quit a toxic boss/job within the next week or so.  Will be back on this thread to provide an update of how it went!  No job to go to btw.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Dicey on October 23, 2018, 02:36:43 AM
Hey,  for those of you with a long memory - I posted on here 2 years ago about a hideous boss.   Seems I was not alone in thinking so...

https://www.google.com/amp/s/globalnews.ca/news/4557549/kingston-pet-sitting-business-allegedly-mismanaged-says-former-workers-client/amp/
OMG, I totally remember the horrible "you're fired" texts. I hope you landed on your feet, and that everyone gets a fair settlement.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Cannot Wait! on October 23, 2018, 05:54:27 AM
Of course I landed on my feet - I'm a MUSTACHIAN!   LOL :)
I had the feeling she wasn't going to pay me so I told her I'd be holding on to all the clients' keys until she e-transferred me all the money she owed me. She was outraged and threatened to call the police... I told her to go right ahead.
She had no choice but to pay right away, then  she cowardly sent someone else over to collect the keys.   I had that person sign for them and that was that.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: zolotiyeruki on October 23, 2018, 07:42:24 AM
Hey,  for those of you with a long memory - I posted on here 2 years ago about a hideous boss.   Seems I was not alone in thinking so...

https://www.google.com/amp/s/globalnews.ca/news/4557549/kingston-pet-sitting-business-allegedly-mismanaged-says-former-workers-client/amp/
For those who don't have the time to track it down:

The text message exchange between the boss and Cannot Wait!: https://forum.mrmoneymustache.com/welcome-to-the-forum/epic-fu-money-stories/msg1015592/#msg1015592 (https://forum.mrmoneymustache.com/welcome-to-the-forum/epic-fu-money-stories/msg1015592/#msg1015592)
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: DS on October 23, 2018, 08:18:09 AM
Hey,  for those of you with a long memory - I posted on here 2 years ago about a hideous boss.   Seems I was not alone in thinking so...

https://www.google.com/amp/s/globalnews.ca/news/4557549/kingston-pet-sitting-business-allegedly-mismanaged-says-former-workers-client/amp/
For those who don't have the time to track it down:

The text message exchange between the boss and Cannot Wait!: https://forum.mrmoneymustache.com/welcome-to-the-forum/epic-fu-money-stories/msg1015592/#msg1015592 (https://forum.mrmoneymustache.com/welcome-to-the-forum/epic-fu-money-stories/msg1015592/#msg1015592)

I remember the one job I had where the manager would text. I haven't allowed it since. Have had people text and I will respond by email or some other method when I am back in the office.

That conversation was off-the-clock (hourly job) where I just asked for clarification on what the duties were, and the response started with "Fortunately, I am your supervisor and I can tell you what you need to do..." and very abrasive messages followed afterwards. Quit the next day.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: RWD on October 23, 2018, 08:23:10 AM
Hey,  for those of you with a long memory - I posted on here 2 years ago about a hideous boss.   Seems I was not alone in thinking so...

https://www.google.com/amp/s/globalnews.ca/news/4557549/kingston-pet-sitting-business-allegedly-mismanaged-says-former-workers-client/amp/
For those who don't have the time to track it down:

The text message exchange between the boss and Cannot Wait!: https://forum.mrmoneymustache.com/welcome-to-the-forum/epic-fu-money-stories/msg1015592/#msg1015592 (https://forum.mrmoneymustache.com/welcome-to-the-forum/epic-fu-money-stories/msg1015592/#msg1015592)

Wow!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Warlord1986 on October 23, 2018, 08:35:21 AM
Copied from my journal.


So our Executive Director came in my office and told me she wanted to take on a 'leadership role' now that my supervisor was leaving. I said I would need the title of interim director and the according pay. She immediately shot that down. When I said that wouldn't work for me she started threatening me with double speak and dog whistles. I decided life is too short to put up with that crap and sent HR my two weeks notice.

I have some money saved and a part time job. But if anyone wants to buy one of my short stories, here's a link: https://www.amazon.com/dp/B07CKSBZT1
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: markbike528CBX on October 23, 2018, 09:26:17 AM
Copied from my journal.
..... I said that wouldn't work for me she started threatening me with double speak and dog whistles.....

I've read 1984 so I know about double-speak, but I'm curious what constitutes dog whistles.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Warlord1986 on October 23, 2018, 10:19:45 AM
Copied from my journal.
..... I said that wouldn't work for me she started threatening me with double speak and dog whistles.....

I've read 1984 so I know about double-speak, but I'm curious what constitutes dog whistles.

https://www.merriam-webster.com/words-at-play/dog-whistle-political-meaning

When she started saying she would be checking in with me every day and making sure everything got done, she was signaling she would make my life miserable. I decided she can make someone else's life miserable. :)
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: mm1970 on October 23, 2018, 10:47:04 AM
Copied from my journal.
..... I said that wouldn't work for me she started threatening me with double speak and dog whistles.....

I've read 1984 so I know about double-speak, but I'm curious what constitutes dog whistles.

https://www.merriam-webster.com/words-at-play/dog-whistle-political-meaning

When she started saying she would be checking in with me every day and making sure everything got done, she was signaling she would make my life miserable. I decided she can make someone else's life miserable. :)

Good for you!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: DaMa on October 23, 2018, 06:52:13 PM
Copied from my journal.


So our Executive Director came in my office and told me she wanted to take on a 'leadership role' now that my supervisor was leaving. I said I would need the title of interim director and the according pay. She immediately shot that down. When I said that wouldn't work for me she started threatening me with double speak and dog whistles. I decided life is too short to put up with that crap and sent HR my two weeks notice.

I have some money saved and a part time job. But if anyone wants to buy one of my short stories, here's a link: https://www.amazon.com/dp/B07CKSBZT1

Loved your story.  Congratulations!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Blindsquirrel on October 26, 2018, 05:50:28 PM
   Awesome job asking for the pay and title rather than just taking the rotten offer! We had one today at work, mid to late 50s senior purchasing guy quit today, and his last day is this coming Wednesday! His boss was an abrasive tool. (Arrogant without an ounce of smarts to back it up, I suspect he was born with a "Craftsmen" birthmark). He resigned with 3 days notice and pretty sure he bailed about 2 today. I heard this and congratulated him on the great big double bird to Megacorp. He just laughed and said "F this place, I'm retired". He drives a Prius and brings his lunch most days. Pretty GD funny as the joint has lost a number of bright folks in the last few years.  Made my day to see him grinning from ear to ear and happy as hell.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: former player on October 27, 2018, 03:55:07 AM
   Awesome job asking for the pay and title rather than just taking the rotten offer! We had one today at work, mid to late 50s senior purchasing guy quit today, and his last day is this coming Wednesday! His boss was an abrasive tool. (Arrogant without an ounce of smarts to back it up, I suspect he was born with a "Craftsmen" birthmark). He resigned with 3 days notice and pretty sure he bailed about 2 today. I heard this and congratulated him on the great big double bird to Megacorp. He just laughed and said "F this place, I'm retired". He drives a Prius and brings his lunch most days. Pretty GD funny as the joint has lost a number of bright folks in the last few years.  Made my day to see him grinning from ear to ear and happy as hell.


Can you ask him if he's on the mmm forum?
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Blindsquirrel on October 27, 2018, 08:51:08 AM
   I will ask him if he is a fellow MMM traveler for kicks. He has been in the thick of managing/payment processing an $85,000,000 project (sterile pharmaceutical filling line) and a direct quote after his F this place statement  was "I don't need the money and I sure as hell don't need the bullshit". He has been well past the IDGAF phase for awhile and is a genuinely pleasant and funny guy to work with for a couple years.  Hoping to buy him a beer next week. :)
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Warlord1986 on October 29, 2018, 06:26:36 AM
   Awesome job asking for the pay and title rather than just taking the rotten offer!

Thank you!

The rotten offer came after a laundry list of dramas. The Executive Director has ranted about my denomination, drops F-bombs like they're going out of style, refused to help me when my supervisor was throwing tantrums in public, and then threatened me when I said I wasn't going to do the work of two people for the price of one.

Eff all that. HR said I'm leaving on a high note, and I've had lots of people say they'll be references for me.

I went for a hike this weekend. Can't wait to do it on a weekday!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: smalllife on October 29, 2018, 07:31:24 AM
The epicness of this is really diminished by not going into great detail, but I finally have something to share.

I worked at Company A for 4-5 years.  Initially it was great - loved my coworkers, we worked hard (too hard looking back) but we had a fantastic culture and the product/company hit every ethical note I could possibly ask for.  Somewhere along the line, the company found a chicken that laid golden eggs.  Cue modern management and growth mindset.  I've never been one for politics or yes-womaning so I stood up against overload, bad ideas, for the best interests of the clients, etc.  Instead, I was doing three jobs at once, got burnt out and left, accepting a job that on paper was similar but 2x the pay.

Company B was a piece of shit - eh product, lying to customers, poor work culture.   Needless to say I quit after not too long, lesson learned.  Distrust of industry increased.

Went back to Company A, who offered me a great package - reduced hours, higher pay, and the job I had been wanting for years.  A few new higher ups aligned with where I had wanted the company to go, and I wasn't the only one to leave so I gave them the benefit of the doubt.

However, that little pesky modern management and growth mindset was compounded by a 5 year old executive with an unrelated pet project I detested.  When a five year old is in charge they care more about looks and attention than substance, so almost universally disliked or distrusted.   I took concerns up the chain, and every executive agreed  .... but he had final say so nothing was going to change.   Had a heart to heart with my boss, who I like as a person but not as a manager, regarding my position (there just wasn't enough work, ironically, but he wouldn't let me out of his department to be useful) - no action for almost a month.  So, I go in and talk through a six month resignation period to avoid my coworkers being hit hard (I have a special skillset in the software and client base).  Tolerable six months, even if they didn't use a day of it to prepare for me leaving.  Still unpacking mental scars several months down the road, but totally worth it.

Unfortunately they lost one of the last checks against his ego, so apparently it's gotten worse :-(  But, at least I'm not there!

FU money gave me the confidence to talk back, and then to be able to take a break to recover/pivot careers. 

Fun story: 5 year old told me to my face that women are biologically inferior to men in math and science.  It's a mathy job, mostly staffed by women ....

Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: CowboyAndIndian on October 29, 2018, 08:58:54 AM
...
Fun story: 5 year old told me to my face that women are biologically inferior to men in math and science.  It's a mathy job, mostly staffed by women ....

Cannot believe in this day and age that any man can think this!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: former player on October 29, 2018, 09:06:30 AM
...
Fun story: 5 year old told me to my face that women are biologically inferior to men in math and science.  It's a mathy job, mostly staffed by women ....

Cannot believe in this day and age that any man can think this!

I can't believe any woman wouldn't believe it.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: EricL on October 29, 2018, 09:07:19 AM
...
Fun story: 5 year old told me to my face that women are biologically inferior to men in math and science.  It's a mathy job, mostly staffed by women ....

Cannot believe in this day and age that any man can think this!

I can sadly.  There’s a lot of BS that gets sold as a package deal on the Internet that people swallow without picking it apart critically.  Especially if it aligns with an ideology and buy in ingratiates you with one side or not buying it may get you ostracized. 
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: smalllife on October 29, 2018, 10:21:23 AM
...
Fun story: 5 year old told me to my face that women are biologically inferior to men in math and science.  It's a mathy job, mostly staffed by women ....

Cannot believe in this day and age that any man can think this!

I can sadly.  There’s a lot of BS that gets sold as a package deal on the Internet that people swallow without picking it apart critically.  Especially if it aligns with an ideology and buy in ingratiates you with one side or not buying it may get you ostracized.

His is old money/rich-white-guy-club + religion at its core
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: MarciaB on October 29, 2018, 03:30:46 PM
...
Fun story: 5 year old told me to my face that women are biologically inferior to men in math and science.  It's a mathy job, mostly staffed by women ....

Cannot believe in this day and age that any man can think this!

I can sadly.  There’s a lot of BS that gets sold as a package deal on the Internet that people swallow without picking it apart critically.  Especially if it aligns with an ideology and buy in ingratiates you with one side or not buying it may get you ostracized.

His is old money/rich-white-guy-club + religion at its core

What I can't believe is that he is foolish enough to voice this opinion out loud. Like, hasn't he gone to enough HR-covers-their-ass-because-the-lawyers-told-them-to seminars and trainings? I can't tell you how many hours I've had to spend in "trainings" like that over the years.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: smalllife on October 30, 2018, 06:32:04 AM
...
Fun story: 5 year old told me to my face that women are biologically inferior to men in math and science.  It's a mathy job, mostly staffed by women ....

Cannot believe in this day and age that any man can think this!

I can sadly.  There’s a lot of BS that gets sold as a package deal on the Internet that people swallow without picking it apart critically.  Especially if it aligns with an ideology and buy in ingratiates you with one side or not buying it may get you ostracized.

His is old money/rich-white-guy-club + religion at its core

What I can't believe is that he is foolish enough to voice this opinion out loud. Like, hasn't he gone to enough HR-covers-their-ass-because-the-lawyers-told-them-to seminars and trainings? I can't tell you how many hours I've had to spend in "trainings" like that over the years.

We're talking about a guy who can - and does - repeatedly ignore HR warnings and yet is in charge of his little world with no repercussions.  When I called him out on a few things (including that one) his face was shock that someone would dare say something contradictory.  That particular statement was not in the office, but the reason I left is that there was LITERALLY no way to keep him in check.  The one person who might have was checked out and didn't care about much.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Rosy on October 30, 2018, 07:31:25 AM
...
Fun story: 5 year old told me to my face that women are biologically inferior to men in math and science.  It's a mathy job, mostly staffed by women ....

Cannot believe in this day and age that any man can think this!

I can sadly.  There’s a lot of BS that gets sold as a package deal on the Internet that people swallow without picking it apart critically.  Especially if it aligns with an ideology and buy in ingratiates you with one side or not buying it may get you ostracized.

His is old money/rich-white-guy-club + religion at its core

What I can't believe is that he is foolish enough to voice this opinion out loud. Like, hasn't he gone to enough HR-covers-their-ass-because-the-lawyers-told-them-to seminars and trainings? I can't tell you how many hours I've had to spend in "trainings" like that over the years.

WTH do we think it is OK if it is hidden? Instead, they should be forced to wear an emblem on their suits/shirts for all to see. (Feeling radical this morning, haven't finished my first cup of coffee yet:)
The dude is probably in charge of the HR meeting and takes notes on all the hidden machinations on how best to keep the women in their place or deny them the same pay advantages.

smalllife just saw your update - I think until you've worked somewhere like that and saw it in action - even a lot of women still refuse to believe it. Sometimes I think the young women of today have blinders on or have been brainwashed into thinking that women already have equality in the working world.
 
Wage slaves don't fight back, you need both FU money and personal courage to walk away.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Kitsune on October 30, 2018, 07:55:15 AM
...
Fun story: 5 year old told me to my face that women are biologically inferior to men in math and science.  It's a mathy job, mostly staffed by women ....

Cannot believe in this day and age that any man can think this!

I can sadly.  There’s a lot of BS that gets sold as a package deal on the Internet that people swallow without picking it apart critically.  Especially if it aligns with an ideology and buy in ingratiates you with one side or not buying it may get you ostracized.

His is old money/rich-white-guy-club + religion at its core

I once started a new job as a manager of a team, and one dude promptly told me that he had to verify my instructions with, and I quote, 'the man in charge', because he was Christian and couldn't take instructions from a woman.

3 guesses as to how long he lasted...

(Ironically, a year later, he was still job searching, and my dad called to be like 'this dude just applied to work with me and apparently he worked at your company beforeÉ Do you know him?')
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: saguaro on October 30, 2018, 09:12:48 AM
...
Fun story: 5 year old told me to my face that women are biologically inferior to men in math and science.  It's a mathy job, mostly staffed by women ....

Cannot believe in this day and age that any man can think this!

I can sadly.  There’s a lot of BS that gets sold as a package deal on the Internet that people swallow without picking it apart critically.  Especially if it aligns with an ideology and buy in ingratiates you with one side or not buying it may get you ostracized.

His is old money/rich-white-guy-club + religion at its core

I once started a new job as a manager of a team, and one dude promptly told me that he had to verify my instructions with, and I quote, 'the man in charge', because he was Christian and couldn't take instructions from a woman.

Years ago at my workplace, we had a contract project manager come on board to assist with a network transition after a company merger.  He wore his Christianity on his sleeve and was condescending to every woman he encountered.  Until he ended up with a female boss as a result of his former (male boss) bailing on the project.   We watched to see what he would do as his new boss was not the type to take any nonsense.  He stuck around until the end of the project, but we could tell he was gritting his teeth through it.     And....his coordinator at the agency that sent him was also a woman.  With four kids and a husband stayed home to take care of them while she brought in the bacon.   Seat through a luncheon where she was in attendance and talked about her family, he was really gritting his teeth through that one. 

He went on to work as a project manager for another large corporation in the area but it seemed he didn't last long as he was contacting some of us to inquire about coming back.  We did not want him back. 
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Sibley on October 30, 2018, 12:24:58 PM
....
smalllife just saw your update - I think until you've worked somewhere like that and saw it in action - even a lot of women still refuse to believe it. Sometimes I think the young women of today have blinders on or have been brainwashed into thinking that women already have equality in the working world.
 
Wage slaves don't fight back, you need both FU money and personal courage to walk away.

To be fair, I didn't necessarily see it either at first. I do now. It took experience and maturity. When you're right out of college, you expect to be questioned, etc. Regardless of what gender you are. Now, I've been lucky. I'm the right color to protect me from some of it. And I've had luck working with people who aren't at least terrible. I do deal with crap, just a lot less than other women do.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: mm1970 on October 30, 2018, 01:01:05 PM
Quote
I once started a new job as a manager of a team, and one dude promptly told me that he had to verify my instructions with, and I quote, 'the man in charge', because he was Christian and couldn't take instructions from a woman.

Oh my goodness.  I haven't encountered any of that.  I have worked with people who treat women like crap and throw everyone under the bus. That didn't go so well when he realized that I literally have known the company CEO and president and VP for almost two decades.

So my spouse's company ... for a long time, it was run by mostly upper middle class men with wives at home.  Far more than you'd expect.  My guess is a few reasons: 1. Mostly PhDs in tech, so well paid.  2.  cost of living was lower when the company was founded, so you wouldn't spend 60% of your pay on housing. 3. a lot of government work, so on the conservative side.

Now obviously that changes over time.  There are still a lot of guys there in their late 40's and up, but also a lot of 20-somethings.  There are also a growing number of women working there, including some who are married to men who work there.  When my husband started working there, our oldest (at the time, only) child was about 1.5 years old.  We were invited to the company picnic before he even started, and then to the Christmas party.  It only took 10 minutes at each to drive me up a fucking wall.  All the execs asking about how things are going at home...then you let them know that you actually work full time.  And then you get the "oh" and the "look".  (This was 10 yrs ago, still pisses me off!)

And it's better but...not much. There are still groups at his company who are like this, and who grumble at the dads who having working wives - who take off when the kids are sick, etc.  When kid #2 was a newborn, spouse traveled THREE times in the first 6 weeks (for a total of 25% of the days).  On the final trip, night before he was to come home, the government director said "I'm going to need you to stay all weekend in case something goes wrong."  He refused because: duh, 6 week old baby at home.  She complained to his boss about how he needs to hire younger, unencumbered people.  (Which: newsflash, my 44 yo husband got a crap ton more done than a newbie would ... because he's experienced.)  Funny thing, I was so happy when that contract ended, but I still sneer at that woman's name. 
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: mm1970 on October 30, 2018, 01:03:53 PM
....
smalllife just saw your update - I think until you've worked somewhere like that and saw it in action - even a lot of women still refuse to believe it. Sometimes I think the young women of today have blinders on or have been brainwashed into thinking that women already have equality in the working world.
 
Wage slaves don't fight back, you need both FU money and personal courage to walk away.

To be fair, I didn't necessarily see it either at first. I do now. It took experience and maturity. When you're right out of college, you expect to be questioned, etc. Regardless of what gender you are. Now, I've been lucky. I'm the right color to protect me from some of it. And I've had luck working with people who aren't at least terrible. I do deal with crap, just a lot less than other women do.
Plus, I think I've read that studies show that equality really takes a dive after the first few years.  Any kind of "gap" is not necessarily noticed at the beginning, because it's small.

It's one reason why change takes such a long time.  I certainly saw a difference in treatment right off the bat, but then I was a woman in the military (at least my pay was the same!!  Last time that ever happened.)

As you get more experience to where you are the expert, or expect to be taken seriously - that's when the shit really starts to happen.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Antonn Park on December 13, 2018, 02:27:17 PM
Last January I saved enough money to quit my full-time job and start my editing business. I had unexpectedly landed a new client who could provide part-time work that paid twice my hourly pay. My boss asked me to stay longer since new businesses take time to build up. I said, "no thanks!" and it felt great.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: bluebelle on December 13, 2018, 04:27:13 PM
....
smalllife just saw your update - I think until you've worked somewhere like that and saw it in action - even a lot of women still refuse to believe it. Sometimes I think the young women of today have blinders on or have been brainwashed into thinking that women already have equality in the working world.
 
Wage slaves don't fight back, you need both FU money and personal courage to walk away.

To be fair, I didn't necessarily see it either at first. I do now. It took experience and maturity. When you're right out of college, you expect to be questioned, etc. Regardless of what gender you are. Now, I've been lucky. I'm the right color to protect me from some of it. And I've had luck working with people who aren't at least terrible. I do deal with crap, just a lot less than other women do.
Plus, I think I've read that studies show that equality really takes a dive after the first few years.  Any kind of "gap" is not necessarily noticed at the beginning, because it's small.

It's one reason why change takes such a long time.  I certainly saw a difference in treatment right off the bat, but then I was a woman in the military (at least my pay was the same!!  Last time that ever happened.)

As you get more experience to where you are the expert, or expect to be taken seriously - that's when the shit really starts to happen.

I think this is very true.....or my BS tolerance is lower.....I am at a point in my career where I am 'the expert', and I'm getting man-splained more now that I did 15 years ago.....
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Brother Esau on December 13, 2018, 04:40:37 PM
Last January I saved enough money to quit my full-time job and start my editing business. I had unexpectedly landed a new client who could provide part-time work that paid twice my hourly pay. My boss asked me to stay longer since new businesses take time to build up. I said, "no thanks!" and it felt great.

Nice!!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Icecreamarsenal on December 17, 2018, 07:38:29 AM
I'm not Christian, but I didn't realize that men who wear their Christian religions on their sleeves looked down on women.  I thought that would be somehow... not Christ-like?  Fascinating
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: trollwithamustache on December 17, 2018, 08:09:27 AM
Its not really Epic since its been dragging on for a while. Ye Old large petrochemical facility has decided to move all contracted engineering work to one new amazing master services agreement contractor.  A bunch of old guys are happy working through various engineering companies and agencies don't want to switch to the new MSA Contractor, especially at the currently offered lowball rate.  While they aren't MMM, all these guys have their money act together and can retire, so they have refused to switch.

They've blown through their first 2 final warning and final 2 month extensions and are starting a third extension!  This is a solid 25% of the facilitates contract engineering workforce too!

Its been wonderful watching. Absolutely glorious management disconnect, currently I prefer watching this to netflix.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: saguaro on December 17, 2018, 08:23:45 AM
I'm not Christian, but I didn't realize that men who wear their Christian religions on their sleeves looked down on women.  I thought that would be somehow... not Christ-like?  Fascinating

It is un-Christ-like. 

In addition to the guy mentioned in my earlier post on the subject of Christian men looking down on women, especially women in the workplace, I quit a job because I found myself with a manager who believed that women should be at home with children and, as a childless married woman, I realized there would be no promotions or raises from this guy because he was waiting for me to come to my senses, have a baby and quit.  He was shocked when I found a new job instead and with one of the premier employers in the area.   

Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: jeninco on December 17, 2018, 08:57:33 AM
I'm not Christian, but I didn't realize that men who wear their Christian religions on their sleeves looked down on women.  I thought that would be somehow... not Christ-like?  Fascinating

It is un-Christ-like. 

In addition to the guy mentioned in my earlier post on the subject of Christian men looking down on women, especially women in the workplace, I quit a job because I found myself with a manager who believed that women should be at home with children and, as a childless married woman, I realized there would be no promotions or raises from this guy because he was waiting for me to come to my senses, have a baby and quit.  He was shocked when I found a new job instead and with one of the premier employers in the area.

Yeah, I "quit" a job with a manager who was quite clear that I didn't need to earn as much as the guy in the next office who had somewhat less experience than I did and no masters degree.

"Quit" is in quotes, because he was lining me up to be fired because I had realized this and was figuring out how to complain. Also, he claimed I missed a meeting (for which I had called into another coworker to explain my absence, because I was ... at the Obstetrician's office, having a miscarriage).  This was in the early 2000's, so not exactly the olden days. (And I still bump into that manager around town sometimes, ick.)
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Slow&Steady on December 17, 2018, 09:04:05 AM
I'm not Christian, but I didn't realize that men who wear their Christian religions on their sleeves looked down on women.  I thought that would be somehow... not Christ-like?  Fascinating

It is un-Christ-like. 

In addition to the guy mentioned in my earlier post on the subject of Christian men looking down on women, especially women in the workplace, I quit a job because I found myself with a manager who believed that women should be at home with children and, as a childless married woman, I realized there would be no promotions or raises from this guy because he was waiting for me to come to my senses, have a baby and quit.  He was shocked when I found a new job instead and with one of the premier employers in the area.

Yeah, I "quit" a job with a manager who was quite clear that I didn't need to earn as much as the guy in the next office who had somewhat less experience than I did and no masters degree.

"Quit" is in quotes, because he was lining me up to be fired because I had realized this and was figuring out how to complain. Also, he claimed I missed a meeting (for which I had called into another coworker to explain my absence, because I was ... at the Obstetrician's office, having a miscarriage).  This was in the early 2000's, so not exactly the olden days. (And I still bump into that manager around town sometimes, ick.)

A major motivator for me leaving my last job is because when I met my new boss (old company was purchased) I was standing there at like 7 months pregnant and he explained to me that he believes that the woman's job is to stay home and raise kids.  Also my role was environmental and he felt the need to explain to me that he was happy to drive his giant truck (with modifications to remove all emission controls) to counter-balance my EV.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: BlueHouse on December 17, 2018, 09:13:49 AM
I didn't even realize I had an EPIC FUM moment until I described an altercation that I had with a manager to a coworker and his response was "wow, you must be financially secure".  After a second, I smiled very broadly and said, "yeah, I guess I am".  All of a sudden, I was no longer worried about the disagreement we had had.  Best feeling ever. 

Details are not even important.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: markbike528CBX on December 17, 2018, 09:51:01 AM
I didn't even realize I had an EPIC FUM moment until I described an altercation that I had with a manager to a coworker and his response was "wow, you must be financially secure".  After a second, I smiled very broadly and said, "yeah, I guess I am".  All of a sudden, I was no longer worried about the disagreement we had had.  Best feeling ever. 

Details are not even important.

Argument details, no,  but level of escalation, maybe.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Padonak on December 17, 2018, 10:27:54 AM
I'm not Christian, but I didn't realize that men who wear their Christian religions on their sleeves looked down on women.  I thought that would be somehow... not Christ-like?  Fascinating

It is un-Christ-like. 

In addition to the guy mentioned in my earlier post on the subject of Christian men looking down on women, especially women in the workplace, I quit a job because I found myself with a manager who believed that women should be at home with children and, as a childless married woman, I realized there would be no promotions or raises from this guy because he was waiting for me to come to my senses, have a baby and quit.  He was shocked when I found a new job instead and with one of the premier employers in the area.

Yeah, I "quit" a job with a manager who was quite clear that I didn't need to earn as much as the guy in the next office who had somewhat less experience than I did and no masters degree.

"Quit" is in quotes, because he was lining me up to be fired because I had realized this and was figuring out how to complain. Also, he claimed I missed a meeting (for which I had called into another coworker to explain my absence, because I was ... at the Obstetrician's office, having a miscarriage).  This was in the early 2000's, so not exactly the olden days. (And I still bump into that manager around town sometimes, ick.)
Did you get any compensation for that treatment? Did you sue then or go through arbitration?
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: saguaro on December 17, 2018, 10:32:22 AM
I'm not Christian, but I didn't realize that men who wear their Christian religions on their sleeves looked down on women.  I thought that would be somehow... not Christ-like?  Fascinating

It is un-Christ-like. 

In addition to the guy mentioned in my earlier post on the subject of Christian men looking down on women, especially women in the workplace, I quit a job because I found myself with a manager who believed that women should be at home with children and, as a childless married woman, I realized there would be no promotions or raises from this guy because he was waiting for me to come to my senses, have a baby and quit.  He was shocked when I found a new job instead and with one of the premier employers in the area.

Yeah, I "quit" a job with a manager who was quite clear that I didn't need to earn as much as the guy in the next office who had somewhat less experience than I did and no masters degree.

"Quit" is in quotes, because he was lining me up to be fired because I had realized this and was figuring out how to complain. Also, he claimed I missed a meeting (for which I had called into another coworker to explain my absence, because I was ... at the Obstetrician's office, having a miscarriage).  This was in the early 2000's, so not exactly the olden days. (And I still bump into that manager around town sometimes, ick.)

A major motivator for me leaving my last job is because when I met my new boss (old company was purchased) I was standing there at like 7 months pregnant and he explained to me that he believes that the woman's job is to stay home and raise kids.  Also my role was environmental and he felt the need to explain to me that he was happy to drive his giant truck (with modifications to remove all emission controls) to counter-balance my EV.

When I quit to go to the premier employer, henceforth known as The Big Company, I did as much homework as I could to make sure I didn't end up with someone like the old boss.  Luckily the Big Company's HR policies made it difficult for someone to be as overt about women in the workplace as this guy.   One issue is that we were in a small field office, so it was much easier for old boss to run the place like his own personal fiefdom.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: force majeure on December 17, 2018, 12:36:50 PM
I have been underperforming at work. Coming up this week is my PMP, the annual review and rating discussion with my manager.
I saw my rating over his shoulder, and it is "underperform".

I did the numbers, and even with recent market falls, I am near to 25 times salary in nett worth.
Emailed manager early today, told him no need for the one-to-one meeting... I am resigning.
He is in shock, wants to talk first thing tomorrow.

Its a strategy known as... get the retaliation in first.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Cannot Wait! on December 17, 2018, 12:41:48 PM
Love it!   Tell us how it goes tomorrow!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: jeninco on December 17, 2018, 02:26:48 PM
I'm not Christian, but I didn't realize that men who wear their Christian religions on their sleeves looked down on women.  I thought that would be somehow... not Christ-like?  Fascinating

It is un-Christ-like. 

In addition to the guy mentioned in my earlier post on the subject of Christian men looking down on women, especially women in the workplace, I quit a job because I found myself with a manager who believed that women should be at home with children and, as a childless married woman, I realized there would be no promotions or raises from this guy because he was waiting for me to come to my senses, have a baby and quit.  He was shocked when I found a new job instead and with one of the premier employers in the area.

Yeah, I "quit" a job with a manager who was quite clear that I didn't need to earn as much as the guy in the next office who had somewhat less experience than I did and no masters degree.

"Quit" is in quotes, because he was lining me up to be fired because I had realized this and was figuring out how to complain. Also, he claimed I missed a meeting (for which I had called into another coworker to explain my absence, because I was ... at the Obstetrician's office, having a miscarriage).  This was in the early 2000's, so not exactly the olden days. (And I still bump into that manager around town sometimes, ick.)
Did you get any compensation for that treatment? Did you sue then or go through arbitration?

No, which I now have mixed feeling about.  At the time, I just wanted to be done with the whole stinky, steamy pile of a situation. Also, that small company had some other problems (several of which came back to bite them in the 5 years or so after I left).

On the one hand, shortly after I left I became pregnant, and shortly after that I wound up being a subcontractor to the greatest manager I'd had to that point (we'd worked together before). I've now subbed to that guy on and off for 18 years, and I honestly love my work-life balance 95% of the time (I typically work slightly less then half time, on average, at a technical niche job for which I am paid very, very well).

On the other hand, I kinda wish I'd stuck it out and tried to fix the situation somewhat for the next woman who came through.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Daisy on December 17, 2018, 10:48:44 PM
Its been wonderful watching. Absolutely glorious management disconnect, currently I prefer watching this to netflix.

Real life is better than Netflix! Love it!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Laura33 on December 18, 2018, 07:52:41 AM
Details are not even important.

No, but they're fun. Spill!  ;-)
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: dcheesi on December 18, 2018, 08:59:32 AM
I'm not Christian, but I didn't realize that men who wear their Christian religions on their sleeves looked down on women.  I thought that would be somehow... not Christ-like?  Fascinating
Like most faiths, a lot of what goes on in the name of "religion" is really just old tribal values propagating themselves into new generations. The actual tenets of the religion are largely forgotten in favor of the cultural norms that people grew up with, which get conflated with "good Christian1 values" from an early age . This is a prime example of how children learn by what those around them do, more than what they say.

(1 insert name of religion here)
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: zolotiyeruki on December 18, 2018, 09:30:00 AM
I think it's important to separate the misogyny, the Christianity, and the outspokenness, and not assume that there's always a causal relationship between them.  You can't always assume that a person's actions are consistent with their beliefs.  In fact, a basic tenet of Christianity is that a person can't be completely faithful. A religious person's views on women may be in accordance to, orthogonal to, or contrary to their professed belief.

Not every outspoken Christian is misogynist, and making a blanket statement to that effect is, in my opinion, divisive and counterproductive, just like saying Republicans don't care about the poor or that illegal immigrants are all criminal gangsters.  In fact, I'm wracking my brain trying to think of anyone I've met who's an outspoken Christian misogynist, and I'm coming up blank.  But we certainly *remember* those instances, because they're a confluence of three memorable and objectionable traits--the outspokenness, the misogyny, and the Christianity*.

* I call Christianity objectionable here only in the sense that the misogynist's religion is objectionable to the victim in this case
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: shelivesthedream on December 18, 2018, 12:45:04 PM
I think it's important to separate the misogyny, the Christianity, and the outspokenness, and not assume that there's always a causal relationship between them.  You can't always assume that a person's actions are consistent with their beliefs.  In fact, a basic tenet of Christianity is that a person can't be completely faithful. A religious person's views on women may be in accordance to, orthogonal to, or contrary to their professed belief.

Not every outspoken Christian is misogynist, and making a blanket statement to that effect is, in my opinion, divisive and counterproductive, just like saying Republicans don't care about the poor or that illegal immigrants are all criminal gangsters.  In fact, I'm wracking my brain trying to think of anyone I've met who's an outspoken Christian misogynist, and I'm coming up blank.  But we certainly *remember* those instances, because they're a confluence of three memorable and objectionable traits--the outspokenness, the misogyny, and the Christianity*.

* I call Christianity objectionable here only in the sense that the misogynist's religion is objectionable to the victim in this case

Thank you. This is the thing I wanted to say but was worried I would phrase it badly and make things worse. Particularly the bolded - Christians believe that EVERYONE sins. All the time. FWIW, Standard American Christianity is totally alien (and very often unchristian) to me, even though we would be considered conservative/traditional Christians in the UK.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: mm1970 on December 18, 2018, 01:58:20 PM
I'm not Christian, but I didn't realize that men who wear their Christian religions on their sleeves looked down on women.  I thought that would be somehow... not Christ-like?  Fascinating

It is un-Christ-like. 

In addition to the guy mentioned in my earlier post on the subject of Christian men looking down on women, especially women in the workplace, I quit a job because I found myself with a manager who believed that women should be at home with children and, as a childless married woman, I realized there would be no promotions or raises from this guy because he was waiting for me to come to my senses, have a baby and quit.  He was shocked when I found a new job instead and with one of the premier employers in the area.

Yeah, I "quit" a job with a manager who was quite clear that I didn't need to earn as much as the guy in the next office who had somewhat less experience than I did and no masters degree.

"Quit" is in quotes, because he was lining me up to be fired because I had realized this and was figuring out how to complain. Also, he claimed I missed a meeting (for which I had called into another coworker to explain my absence, because I was ... at the Obstetrician's office, having a miscarriage).  This was in the early 2000's, so not exactly the olden days. (And I still bump into that manager around town sometimes, ick.)
Did you get any compensation for that treatment? Did you sue then or go through arbitration?

No, which I now have mixed feeling about.  At the time, I just wanted to be done with the whole stinky, steamy pile of a situation. Also, that small company had some other problems (several of which came back to bite them in the 5 years or so after I left).

On the one hand, shortly after I left I became pregnant, and shortly after that I wound up being a subcontractor to the greatest manager I'd had to that point (we'd worked together before). I've now subbed to that guy on and off for 18 years, and I honestly love my work-life balance 95% of the time (I typically work slightly less then half time, on average, at a technical niche job for which I am paid very, very well).

On the other hand, I kinda wish I'd stuck it out and tried to fix the situation somewhat for the next woman who came through.


Yeah, I know.  This is tough.

I had an experience where I was working part time (30 hrs / week), got a new boss and they told me they don't believe in PT.  I argued.  I lost.  I quit.

The happy note is that they let the next woman who asked for part time go part time.  But after a couple of years, they pressured her to go full time.  She quit.

During this time, there was another woman working part time - that was okay because she "wasn't in a technical position" (she had a PhD in materials science, so they corrected that to "not in the critical path").  After getting more work thrown at her so that she was working 40+ hours...she quit.

Finally, probably 5 years later?  Another new mom who went part time...and they let her stay part time for as long as she liked.  Until they shut down.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Dicey on December 18, 2018, 07:08:51 PM
I'm not Christian, but I didn't realize that men who wear their Christian religions on their sleeves looked down on women.  I thought that would be somehow... not Christ-like?  Fascinating

It is un-Christ-like. 

In addition to the guy mentioned in my earlier post on the subject of Christian men looking down on women, especially women in the workplace, I quit a job because I found myself with a manager who believed that women should be at home with children and, as a childless married woman, I realized there would be no promotions or raises from this guy because he was waiting for me to come to my senses, have a baby and quit.  He was shocked when I found a new job instead and with one of the premier employers in the area.

Yeah, I "quit" a job with a manager who was quite clear that I didn't need to earn as much as the guy in the next office who had somewhat less experience than I did and no masters degree.

"Quit" is in quotes, because he was lining me up to be fired because I had realized this and was figuring out how to complain. Also, he claimed I missed a meeting (for which I had called into another coworker to explain my absence, because I was ... at the Obstetrician's office, having a miscarriage).  This was in the early 2000's, so not exactly the olden days. (And I still bump into that manager around town sometimes, ick.)
Did you get any compensation for that treatment? Did you sue then or go through arbitration?

No, which I now have mixed feeling about.  At the time, I just wanted to be done with the whole stinky, steamy pile of a situation. Also, that small company had some other problems (several of which came back to bite them in the 5 years or so after I left).

On the one hand, shortly after I left I became pregnant, and shortly after that I wound up being a subcontractor to the greatest manager I'd had to that point (we'd worked together before). I've now subbed to that guy on and off for 18 years, and I honestly love my work-life balance 95% of the time (I typically work slightly less then half time, on average, at a technical niche job for which I am paid very, very well).

On the other hand, I kinda wish I'd stuck it out and tried to fix the situation somewhat for the next woman who came through.


Yeah, I know.  This is tough.

I had an experience where I was working part time (30 hrs / week), got a new boss and they told me they don't believe in PT.  I argued.  I lost.  I quit.

The happy note is that they let the next woman who asked for part time go part time.  But after a couple of years, they pressured her to go full time.  She quit.

During this time, there was another woman working part time - that was okay because she "wasn't in a technical position" (she had a PhD in materials science, so they corrected that to "not in the critical path").  After getting more work thrown at her so that she was working 40+ hours...she quit.

Finally, probably 5 years later?  Another new mom who went part time...and they let her stay part time for as long as she liked.  Until they shut down.
Did Karma kill them?
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: mm1970 on December 19, 2018, 12:01:15 PM
I'm not Christian, but I didn't realize that men who wear their Christian religions on their sleeves looked down on women.  I thought that would be somehow... not Christ-like?  Fascinating

It is un-Christ-like. 

In addition to the guy mentioned in my earlier post on the subject of Christian men looking down on women, especially women in the workplace, I quit a job because I found myself with a manager who believed that women should be at home with children and, as a childless married woman, I realized there would be no promotions or raises from this guy because he was waiting for me to come to my senses, have a baby and quit.  He was shocked when I found a new job instead and with one of the premier employers in the area.

Yeah, I "quit" a job with a manager who was quite clear that I didn't need to earn as much as the guy in the next office who had somewhat less experience than I did and no masters degree.

"Quit" is in quotes, because he was lining me up to be fired because I had realized this and was figuring out how to complain. Also, he claimed I missed a meeting (for which I had called into another coworker to explain my absence, because I was ... at the Obstetrician's office, having a miscarriage).  This was in the early 2000's, so not exactly the olden days. (And I still bump into that manager around town sometimes, ick.)
Did you get any compensation for that treatment? Did you sue then or go through arbitration?

No, which I now have mixed feeling about.  At the time, I just wanted to be done with the whole stinky, steamy pile of a situation. Also, that small company had some other problems (several of which came back to bite them in the 5 years or so after I left).

On the one hand, shortly after I left I became pregnant, and shortly after that I wound up being a subcontractor to the greatest manager I'd had to that point (we'd worked together before). I've now subbed to that guy on and off for 18 years, and I honestly love my work-life balance 95% of the time (I typically work slightly less then half time, on average, at a technical niche job for which I am paid very, very well).

On the other hand, I kinda wish I'd stuck it out and tried to fix the situation somewhat for the next woman who came through.


Yeah, I know.  This is tough.

I had an experience where I was working part time (30 hrs / week), got a new boss and they told me they don't believe in PT.  I argued.  I lost.  I quit.

The happy note is that they let the next woman who asked for part time go part time.  But after a couple of years, they pressured her to go full time.  She quit.

During this time, there was another woman working part time - that was okay because she "wasn't in a technical position" (she had a PhD in materials science, so they corrected that to "not in the critical path").  After getting more work thrown at her so that she was working 40+ hours...she quit.

Finally, probably 5 years later?  Another new mom who went part time...and they let her stay part time for as long as she liked.  Until they shut down.
Did Karma kill them?

Ah ha ha, maybe?  I think the company in general went in a different direction.  This office was a small satellite, and HQ decided to shut them down.  In general, HQ was not known to be employee friendly - not the greatest work conditions, and located in a state that is Company-friendly.  The rules in my own state (CA), directly contradicted some company policies, so they had to ease up (like the use-or-lose vacation policy).  Apparently, HQ folks referred to our location as a vacation spot.  Or a spa.  Or something like that.  We all worked hard and more than 40 hours for the FT employees - but apparently HQ prefers 60 hour weeks, but at below median pay.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: saguaro on December 19, 2018, 12:34:01 PM
On the other hand, I kinda wish I'd stuck it out and tried to fix the situation somewhat for the next woman who came through.

Speaking of trying to fix a work situation for the next person, this reminds me of a long term temp assignment I had years ago.  It probably wasn't so much fixing the situation but paving the way for the next person not being blamed for the boss' crazy. 

Setup: sales and marketing office of telecom company recently acquired by an ever growing telecom company, which became infamous years later when their CEO went to jail, but I digress.  I was brought on to replace the previous temp to man the phones and support the sales team, my "self-named" boss was the office manager, henceforth known as Lovely Rita, who only supported the regional sales manager, the top guy in the office.   At first things were fine, I actually enjoyed the assignment and got on well with everyone including Lovely Rita.  Then about six months in, something seemed to change with her.   Lovely Rita became unlovely, critical, and micromanaging, giving me obnoxious tasks like setting up files in one part of the office but insisting that I answer all calls that came in which required I rush to my desk on the other side of the office, while she's yelling for me to answer the phone.  She would listen to my calls from her desk and inform me how I was "mishandling" them, telling me exactly what I should say.   She made subtle threats to replace me however never followed up on this.  Probably because 1) I did my job well and got good feedback from everyone else and 2) she couldn't handle the tasks I did which is why I was there.   When I went on vacation, there was another temp in my place for that last reason, Lovely Rita couldn't cover what I did, even though her workload seemed very light, for one week.  When I got back, I got all kinds of stories of how Lovely Rita micromanaged that temp.

I tolerated it as the pay was decent and, other than Lovely Rita, I liked the work and the people.   I made a good life long friend while there.  Finally it came to pass that, as part of the company acquisition, the office was moving to a location that was really going to be too far for me and my then not-so-reliable car.  I requested a change of assignment as I had a long-standing good relationship with my agency.  Worked out out a change so they could find a new person who could make the commute, bring that person on before I left so I could do some training and make an easier transition for Lovely Rita, who incidentally was not happy that I was leaving despite her previous threats.  However, before I left I warned the agency about my recent experiences with Lovely Rita, perhaps a risky thing to do saying negative things about a client but I felt it my duty to say so for the sake of the next person and hoped that, with my long-standing reputation of being reliable, they would take note of what I told them in case things hit the fan for this person.  Because somehow I had this feeling that Lovely Rita was not going to revert to being, well, Lovely Rita.

So I leave but not before Lovely Rita abruptly decides that the person will not be starting before I depart so I get no training done.  I go to the next assignment.  About a month later, the agency rep comes to check on how things are going.   In talking with her I learn the fate of my successor: he was tossed out after 3 weeks.  It seems that Lovely Rita totally flipped out on him.  It was over him talking with one of the sales reps a mere 10 feet from his desk.  She promptly booted him out of the office for the sin of leaving his desk.  The guy was furious because when he started, he was told this would be a temp to hire position (first time I heard this) and he had passed on a similar assignment to take this job because Lovely Rita put on a nice face when interviewing him.   Fortunately, because of what I had told the agency, they knew it was not the guy's fault.  They got him assigned to the other temp to hire job (the one he passed up on, he had been in the position of having to take one or the other) which luckily was still open.  I was glad for that as I heard good things about him.  But the agency also refused to fill any more assignments for Lovely Rita saying "we can't seem to meet her needs" which is code for when a client becomes too impossible to work with. 
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: mm1970 on December 20, 2018, 02:19:09 PM
Quote
But the agency also refused to fill any more assignments for Lovely Rita saying "we can't seem to meet her needs" which is code for when a client becomes too impossible to work with. 

This is glorious.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: markbike528CBX on December 20, 2018, 03:39:30 PM
Quote
But the agency also refused to fill any more assignments for Lovely Rita saying "we can't seem to meet her needs" which is code for when a client becomes too impossible to work with. 

This is glorious.

The power of FU money also extends to agencies too!   
My former SemiMegaCorp got screwed over by clients.  The client would ask for a major job and then cancel at the last minute.  SemiMajorCorp now writes hefty penalty cancellation clauses for that client.   By contrast, SemiMegaCorp also has taken some sketchy contracts during lean times and gotten screwed as a result.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: saguaro on December 20, 2018, 08:27:54 PM
Quote
But the agency also refused to fill any more assignments for Lovely Rita saying "we can't seem to meet her needs" which is code for when a client becomes too impossible to work with. 

This is glorious.

A couple more interesting things I learned after my departure.

As mentioned, my successor was to start during my last week so I could train.  I get there Monday morning and there's nobody.   Lovely Rita doesn't say anything.   An hour goes by and still nobody.  Because I am busy, I am not exactly counting the minutes.   After another hour, I finally ask Lovely Rita if my successor was coming and got a short abrupt answer that no, he wasn't, he would start next week now.  I was surprised because she really made a big deal about my training this person before I left.  So something changed but didn't know what, I didn't give it much thought.

Later, after I left, I learned from my one friend there that in fact, my successor did show up that morning to start the assignment.  Lovely Rita came down and informed him right there in the lobby that she didn't need him until next week.   So Lovely Rita changed the deal on the spot and sent him on his way.  Weird.  The guy was reportedly taken aback, but being new and his first assignment, he didn't make a fuss, and agreed to report the next week. But I am fairly certain that after 3 weeks, he reassessed the weirdness he encountered that day.

Another interesting tidbit: Lovely Rita was convinced that I sabotaged my computer in some sort of retaliation.   Any computer issues that arose had to be funneled through her, I was not allowed to contact the Help Desk. Any documents coming from the shared drive (she guarded it like a hawk) had to be downloaded by her and given to me on a disk.  OK, that's fine given my employment status there, company policy, etc.   However, during my last week, I was getting an error on startup.  It didn't prevent me from working but I reported the issue to her.  Lovely Rita blew it off.   Since it was my last week, I figured I wasn't going to worry about it, if it wasn't important to her, then it wasn't important to me.

My successor gets there and reports getting the error when he starts working.  Now, Lovely Rita pays attention and makes a big deal about it and drags my friend, who is the support engineer, into the whole thing.  She becomes convinced that somehow I created the problem, forgetting that I reported that issue to her before I left.    There was no convincing her that there were all kinds of reasons for a win.ini error.  Upon hearing this, I wasn't sure whether to be insulted that she would think I would stoop to sabotage, or feel flattered that she thought I had the technical capability to do it, which I didn't, but hey, I decided to feel flattered. 

Truthfully, in this situation, I didn't have FU money.  However, in addition to recently reading Your Money Or Your Life, it was a factor in my deciding that FU money was a very good idea.   The tale of how I quit The Big Company because of FU money is forthcoming.

 
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: AMandM on December 21, 2018, 10:28:41 AM
The tale of how I quit The Big Company because of FU money is forthcoming.

Can't wait!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: saguaro on February 07, 2019, 02:48:35 PM
As promised, here is the saga of leaving The Big Company thanks to FU money.  Because The Big Company was well known I have avoided using buzzwords and phrases that are associated with it.  There’s a ton of stories I can tell about my experience there, but I tried to boil it down to the issues that finally pushed me out the door.

By way of background, The Big Company was considered one of the premier employers in our area, the hometown company done good.   If you got into The Big Company, people considered you as having really made it.  It was to the point you lost friends out of sheer jealousy.   

I started at The Big Company (henceforth referred to TBC for brevity) as a contractor.  Because everyone was beating down the doors to get inside TBC, it wasn’t easy to get hired, as you were playing the numbers game.  But being a contractor could get you in the door quite easily and you could show firsthand you could do the work thereby getting hired that way, with no competition.  It was the path to “TBC employee-hood” for many.   
 
TBC had many divisions/business units and the division I was working for (call it Division A) was a bit obscure in that TBC was not known for Division A’s products but it was a solid performing one.  The culture at TBC was a mixed bag.  While it had a reputation for a “family culture” that valued employees thanks to its founders, those guys had retired by the time I joined.   What remained of that culture really depended on the division / group you were in.  Fortunately, Division A was one of the better ones to work in but TBC was really like a lot of companies, despite their claims that they were different, with their own set of dysfunctions.

So, I do the contract job for six months, then move into a permanent position in another department.    I work this job for over 2 years.  Goes pretty well, liked my boss and coworkers.  Then, in missing the boat in moving to new technology, TBC has a bad enough quarter that they finally announce the Great Unthinkable Thing: layoffs.  Much to the shock of the company true believers who, like those who believed the Titanic was unsinkable, thought that TBC was “layoff proof”.  The Restructuring to Fix Everything is announced but what we all don’t know at the time that it’s the first of many reorgs / sell offs / outsourcing /  new company visions / reinventions of the wheel to come.  As a result, my department is eliminated, and I have 4 months to find another position in the company or leave.   
 
Luckily, I land another position elsewhere in Division A.  However, I learn firsthand about all the HR red tape and how department VPs can fight over internal transfers, even from departments that are on the brink of extinction.   Finally, I get into the new job and things go OK for a while.   Then another bad quarter hits and the decision is made to let all contractors in the facility go.  Unfortunately this means people are having to cover the responsibilities of those contractors without additional pay, in order to “right the ship”. OK, fine, I understand that and furthermore we are all pitching in, it’s not just me, TBC used a lot of contractors. However, I find, along with others, that once you are stuck with these responsibilities, they don’t go away.

CEO leaves and a new CEO, The One to Fix Everything, comes on board.  There’s actually a period of stability and increased profits under him due to a very successful product launch but it’s short lived.  Now things start really going downhill.  Somehow through the next couple of years, I avoid getting axed and a smaller Division A remains, but it is becoming a game of corporate musical chairs.  Anxieties are running high as morale sinks to new lows while business units get sold or spun off, first the little pieces and then the bigger pieces.  More reorgs and nearly quarterly layoffs occur, the latter aided and abetted by the company review / ranking system that TBC somehow thought was a good idea.

I decide to try to hold on as long as possible though I know the end will come sooner or later.  The pay has enabled me to pay off debt and build savings including the FU money, so the more I can have saved when the inevitable happens, the better. I consider moving to one of the bigger divisions which was closer to home and would pay more but with the company in a constant state of shrinkage there’s really no place to transfer to.   

Finally, about a year before my departure, comes yet another Reorg to Fix Everything.   This time it moves me and my boss involuntarily into a newly created group in the corporate structure and out of Division A.  We remain in the same building, working alongside our Division A coworkers but are part of the new corporate entity.  We learn why.  Division A’s time has come and will be sold, so this is how TBC is splitting off the personnel deemed important to TBC before buyout negotiations commence.
 
For the next year I get a front row seat to the unbelievable amounts of sheer idiocy that goes on at the Corporate, aka Ivory Tower level.  Coupled with unreasonable expectations and a ridiculous workload (courtesy of the new boss that I got when I was moved to Corporate, a story in itself), and tired of working with a sword over my head, I decide to just pull the plug with DH agreeing.  Not wait for the bitter end or wait for another job.  Just get out. We had pared down expenses, so we could live on DH’s salary while I searched for a new position.  We had the emergency fund aka FU money.  For the first time in my life I realized I could walk away and be OK! 

We went on vacation (priorities!) and I gave notice when I came back.  My resignation was met with shock that someone would dare to leave TBC, despite it clearly being a sinking ship, especially with nothing lined up.   I was flat out asked “How can you do it?  Did you win the lottery or something?”
 
Post TBC: I enjoyed my summer for a few weeks when I got a call from a recruiter on a Friday afternoon.  Two months to the day that I walked out of TBC, I started my new job….at my old Division A, now acquired by a different company.  With higher pay.

My former coworkers and bosses remaining at TBC were laid off two years later.  Fast forward to today, TBC as it was once known, is a shadow of its former self. 

And that, my dear mustachians, is my personal saga of the power of FU money.


Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Pooperman on February 07, 2019, 05:35:13 PM
Sounds a lot like GE to me.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: mm1970 on February 07, 2019, 06:25:52 PM
Sounds a lot like GE to me.
ah ha that was my thought too.

But then I realized: there are quite a large # of companies that fit this category.

Still glorious!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: solon on February 07, 2019, 09:13:02 PM
Sounds a lot like GE to me.
ah ha that was my thought too.

But then I realized: there are quite a large # of companies that fit this category.

Still glorious!

I thought GE, and then Sears.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: markbike528CBX on February 07, 2019, 09:41:01 PM
..... gigantic snip.....
Two months to the day that I walked out of TBC, I started my new job….at my old Division A, now acquired by a different company.  With higher pay.

......... TBC as it was once known, is a shadow of its former self. 

And that, my dear mustachians, is my personal saga of the power of FU money.

The whole post is awesome.

But walking into your new/old job with higher pay is something that the "burn the bridges" crowd could only dream of.  AND you didn't have to burn bridges, TBC did that for you.

Pooperman, mm1970: 
Ivory tower idioticy is far too common to pin this down to a specific "TBC". 

My SemiBigCorp had a, I kid you not, "Five Year Plan"*.   
 SemiBigCorp bankrupt at year 2.  ex-CEO's employment contract to about 2022 was terminated  2017.

*For those of you who slept through 20th Century History class......https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/First_five-year_plan 
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: EricL on February 07, 2019, 10:22:02 PM
It is an awesome story. 

Sad how many corporations go down with new CEOs desperately pushing people into the water and re-arranging deck chairs with whomever remains while demanding the band play faster.  That's such an easy band aid and it looks good to investors.  For once I'd like to see a company say "Fuck that.  We're going to hold on to the employees we have, cut other stuff that genuinely won't hurt (like executive bonuses), and shit a product that works and sells.  If we die trying it's better to go falling off a cliff than by a thousand cuts."  Not going to hold my breath though.

Congrats to saguaro for breaking free.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: zolotiyeruki on February 08, 2019, 05:58:15 AM
From what I've seen, it seems like TBCs often fail because they're too ossified in legacy costs (like pensions or lots of large B&M stores) or legacy structure/bureaucracy/culture that they can't adapt to changing market forces (Sears, GM) or simply seem to grind to a halt (certain defense contractors, and I think of large govt projects like NASA's SLS project).
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: AMandM on February 08, 2019, 09:47:47 AM
I often wonder how much idiocy is just the natural response to a doomed situation because the world has changed and there isn't a market to support TBC's business any more.  If nothing will save the company, then no matter what corporate does on the final downhill, it'll look like idiocy in the long run.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: DeepEllumStache on February 08, 2019, 10:12:11 AM
I often wonder how much idiocy is just the natural response to a doomed situation because the world has changed and there isn't a market to support TBC's business any more.  If nothing will save the company, then no matter what corporate does on the final downhill, it'll look like idiocy in the long run.

This.

When it’s really going downhill, there aren’t many good choices since everyone brought in is supposed to fix something that needed to have been fixed ten years ago. This creates a fabulous opportunity for idiocy. And because we want to blame someone, we look for the idiocy as the cause when it’s more of a symptom of the decline.

Even if management lets it die gracefully, there comes a point where it’s still going to die. I worked in a portion of the business that was going downhill gracefully (surprising since we’re not know for that). Nothing would save it and everyone knew this was the Titanic. There was the element of fatalism among the employees since no one was trying for the magical Hail Mary. It was probably more efficient since everyone was willing to do what was necessary to prolong the sink versus attempting the latest cool management process, but people still lost their jobs in the end.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Dicey on February 08, 2019, 10:34:17 AM
I agree with @DeepEllumStache. Here is a very recent example:

"The chief executive of California’s largest electric utility has quit as the company faces bankruptcy and possible criminal charges in the wake of last year’s deadly Camp Fire. Geisha Williams—the first Latina chief executive of a Fortune 500 company—has been in charge of Pacific Gas & Electric since March 2017. "

OMG, these fires were believed to be caused by years of mismanagement and neglect by PG&E and she gets the blame after a comparitive nanosecond in the job.

https://www.thedailybeast.com/head-of-california-electric-utility-quits-after-camp-fire-fallout

Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Curmudgeon on February 08, 2019, 02:03:53 PM
DW and I are FIRE'd, but neither of us is opposed to working, assuming it's something we enjoy.  DW enjoys working with special needs students, and so took a position that allowed her to do that, paid a small salary, and provided healthcare benefits.  But after about a year, some structural changes were made, which resulted in many more kids in the same space, with a higher kid-to-instructor ratio.  Some of these kids have behavioral issues (they throw things, grab people, etc.), and being crowded into a small space seemed certain to exacerbate these issues. That, combined with having fewer instructors, made the situation feel unsafe to her, and so she gave notice and quit. 

A few weeks later she found a new position, that also let her work with special needs children, but in a much better environment.  However, the pay is lower, with no benefits. The physical location of the new office was adjacent to the space used by her former employer, so all her former co-workers and old boss can see her working this new job.  They're all scratching their heads, wondering why she would take such a big pay cut to do this. 

Fast-forward a few weeks:  One of her former co-workers is in the hospital, and another on medical leave, recovering from injuries suffered at the hands of the students.  A third employee has quit, not wanting to be the next one.

Working is not so bad, when you don't HAVE to work.

 
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: happyuk on February 08, 2019, 02:09:44 PM
An opposite take on the purpose of the FU fund.  I understand the satisfaction in being in a position to say "stuff you" to any deeply unsatisfactory situation you may find yourself in.

Years ago, circa 1990 I was a young low-paid apprentice.  Even so I was quite a little saver even then, still unaware of index funds, and it was to be another 6 years before I began using the power of the internet to alleviate my incredible ignorance on finance and how the world works in general.

The building firm I worked had for some time been taking a hammering during an ongoing recession and I knew redundancies were on the cards.  I also knew that my employer, a forceful bear of man, who was sometimes prone to loud outbursts and other regrettable behavior was also struggling with creditors and wages etc.

One week he was delayed in obtaining the cash to pay us, and came to me apologizing for the late payment in a state of utter humiliation and misery.  I had by then saved quite a substantial amount of cash, enough to keep me going for at least a year and a half.  I told him not to worry, and offered to work at a reduced rate given that I was still learning a lot of skills.  He was utterly disarmed, muttering something to the effect "no, no it's no sweat". I swear I detected a tear in his eye.

About two years after I had been let go, and at which point I was fine for  work, he rang me offering my old job back, now that he had managed to build his company back up again.  I still think having a good stash of cash enabled me to let go of any underlying resentments I might have had  and do an opposite display of kindness instead.

Frugality works.



Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Gone_Hiking on February 09, 2019, 03:12:07 PM
@happyuk that's an awesome story how you not only saved your sanity but left a relationship with a person who was in over his head intact.  Kudos.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Siebrie on February 11, 2019, 03:38:34 AM
I was hired as Admin (Legal) 11 years ago, by a boss who the interim agency described as 'difficult', so I upped my requested salary by $700/month, and she agreed :) (I should have asked for more). The job was fulltime and permanent from day one. I was trained for a week by the guy that was leaving (his 6-month temp job wasn't prolonged), then I worked on my own for a week, then I had to train my new colleague Admin. We work for the Department (proofreading, layout, filing, corporate housekeeping, Board of Directors support, odd jobs for boss directly).

I worked for that boss for 6 years, and I had 5 Admin colleagues in that time; they all left more or less quickly due to my difficult boss. I could not leave, because my boyfriend/fiance/husband was still studying or in lowpaying jobs, we had two children (2x16wks paid maternity leave), and bought a house, and we needed my income. Then, my boss was fired! Joy!

No boss for 6 months, the whole Department (4 lawyers at different levels of seniority) lightened up. New boss for 2 years, until she got promoted back to her old company (European-American MSA affair). Wonderful boss, great fun to work for, but she thought I was her PA .....

In the meantime, husband has work experience and changes jobs twice, and now earns a normal income (nothing crazy, but decent). Also, in the meantime, company is acquired by Chinese, and company culture changes from family business vibe to strictly commercial/no mercy.

New boss comes in, thinks I'm her PA only, gives my Admin colleague a well-deserved promotion, and then doesn't replace her! I'm now on my own, trying to handle a workload even the two of us couldn't handle, working with a boss who refuses to hear that I'm not happy booking her private family vacation flights and visas to China when there is a proper work backlog. I hate booking flights, I'm a much better proofreader and librarian then I am a travel agent. Boss works from home two days a week, travels a lot, and when in the office, is in meetings all the time.

I run the numbers with husband; we will be able to cope on his salary alone, and he's behind me if I want to leave. I decide to stop pandering to boss, and will make my own list of priorities, and a list of items I'm not able to handle due to not enough time. Then, I find an email on the company printer: boss thinks I'm not loyal and am slacking, and wants to fire me (printed by HR! Who I have taught each one individually how to use secure print!). I have a bad night's sleep, but husband supports me, I start calling law firms, unions, and social security organisations to get all my ducks in a row, and wait for the exit interview. I clear my computer and desk, and collect private contact info of the few colleagues I would like to stay in touch with.

Interview comes, I am still in shock, but at least don't have the first wave of emotions and manage to handle it well. I hand in my phone and laptop immediately, to no longer be connected to them. Second meeting with HR a week later to discuss severance pay and I manage to negotiate 11 months pay (1 month for every year I worked there), outplacement services on top from reputed agency (by law, they have to offer, but only basic, and they can deduct it from the severance pay), health insurance until the end of the year, glowing letter of recommendation, certificate that I was fired due to a reorganisation (which allows me to claim unemployment benefits later).

I have now been home for 3 months and am destressing. The outplacement project has started, but I'm not really in a rush to start working again; I'd like to go back to University and finish my MA. The house is finally properly clean, kids are happy that I can pick them up and have the energy to play and discuss things eith them, husband is happy that he can now fully concentrate on his carreer (he picked dds up fromschool and cooked every night), I have time to contact old friends, and just walk outside as soon as the sun shines.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Imma on February 11, 2019, 05:17:30 AM
@Siebrie that's a pretty epic story! You turned a situation that could potentially have been devastating into something positive. They must have been surprised that you weren't emotional at all and handed in all your belongings right away - did they ever suspect you already knew?
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: saguaro on February 11, 2019, 09:24:17 AM
@Siebrie  quite the story and you got of out there with a decent deal.   Whether or not they suspect you knew ahead of time, you gotta thank whoever didn't follow the secure print procedure.  Because no doubt getting a heads up on what they were planning gave you the chance to plan and be prepared when it finally happened.   Knowledge is power!

Sad how many corporations go down with new CEOs desperately pushing people into the water and re-arranging deck chairs with whomever remains while demanding the band play faster.  That's such an easy band aid and it looks good to investors.  For once I'd like to see a company say "Fuck that.  We're going to hold on to the employees we have, cut other stuff that genuinely won't hurt (like executive bonuses), and shit a product that works and sells.  If we die trying it's better to go falling off a cliff than by a thousand cuts."  Not going to hold my breath though.

Congrats to saguaro for breaking free.

@EricL  thanks.  I will say that many of my coworkers, who were really vested in working for TBC (and the fact that it was supposed to be a different company from all others) were shocked that TBC would fall into such a typical way of downsizing themselves out of existence.   

There were a few folks who actually left the acquired Division A, as soon as it was legally possible, to rejoin TBC.   Hope springs eternal, I guess, but to me it was like escaping the sinking Titanic only to turn around and climb back on board. 

Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: mm1970 on February 11, 2019, 10:26:50 AM
Quote
I have now been home for 3 months and am destressing. The outplacement project has started, but I'm not really in a rush to start working again; I'd like to go back to University and finish my MA. The house is finally properly clean, kids are happy that I can pick them up and have the energy to play and discuss things eith them, husband is happy that he can now fully concentrate on his carreer (he picked dds up fromschool and cooked every night), I have time to contact old friends, and just walk outside as soon as the sun shines.

This is glorious.

I wonder how buried your old boss is.  Ha!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: zolotiyeruki on February 11, 2019, 02:52:50 PM
Interview comes, I am still in shock, but at least don't have the first wave of emotions and manage to handle it well. I hand in my phone and laptop immediately, to no longer be connected to them. Second meeting with HR a week later to discuss severance pay and I manage to negotiate 11 months pay (1 month for every year I worked there), outplacement services on top from reputed agency (by law, they have to offer, but only basic, and they can deduct it from the severance pay), health insurance until the end of the year, glowing letter of recommendation, certificate that I was fired due to a reorganisation (which allows me to claim unemployment benefits later).
That is an awesome story!  Thanks for sharing!  Have you heard at all how things have been running without you, or have you completely disconnected?
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Dicey on February 11, 2019, 08:11:39 PM
Interview comes, I am still in shock, but at least don't have the first wave of emotions and manage to handle it well. I hand in my phone and laptop immediately, to no longer be connected to them. Second meeting with HR a week later to discuss severance pay and I manage to negotiate 11 months pay (1 month for every year I worked there), outplacement services on top from reputed agency (by law, they have to offer, but only basic, and they can deduct it from the severance pay), health insurance until the end of the year, glowing letter of recommendation, certificate that I was fired due to a reorganisation (which allows me to claim unemployment benefits later).
That is an awesome story!  Thanks for sharing!  Have you heard at all how things have been running without you, or have you completely disconnected?
Oh, I'm wondering the same thing! Do tell @Siebrie.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: force majeure on February 17, 2019, 09:11:01 AM
I am getting ready to quit work, but this happened to me recently...

I was checking my stash on Yahoo Finance, and a co-worker saw my "number"
I am getting vibes in my team, that I have been found out.
Was my own fault, as I dont have wing mirrors on my desk.
Anyone dealt with co-worker envy?
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Dicey on February 17, 2019, 11:42:36 AM
I am getting ready to quit work, but this happened to me recently...

I was checking my stash on Yahoo Finance, and a co-worker saw my "number"
I am getting vibes in my team, that I have been found out.
Was my own fault, as I dont have wing mirrors on my desk.
Anyone dealt with co-worker envy?
Can you compensate by moaning about how much money you still owe in SL, mortgage, car, boat, toys, etc. debt? You could claim you're trying to save enough to pay everything off at once a la the Defeat the Net Debt thread.
https://forum.mrmoneymustache.com/throw-down-the-gauntlet/defeat-the-delta/

I personally wouldn't care that much, but it might be fun to mess with them since you've been "found out".
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Rosy on February 17, 2019, 01:26:48 PM
I am getting ready to quit work, but this happened to me recently...

I was checking my stash on Yahoo Finance, and a co-worker saw my "number"
I am getting vibes in my team, that I have been found out.
Was my own fault, as I dont have wing mirrors on my desk.
Anyone dealt with co-worker envy?

It depends - on the atmosphere at work in general and how well you get along with your co-workers. Could be a teaching opportunity to open someone's eye to the opportunity of FIRE or just smile mysteriously and don't engage when asked:)
Either option would make me feel good and proud:) - but there are a myriad of other responses incl some fun snarky ones as well of course.

I'd own it or aren't you proud and happy to be in a position to pull the plug? I can understand stealth wealth to a degree, but I would not go as far as lying about my circumstances - whatever for? You made the most out of your own opportunities and now you can finally say FU or express yourself in an adult way if you so choose.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Dicey on February 18, 2019, 09:32:53 AM
I am getting ready to quit work, but this happened to me recently...

I was checking my stash on Yahoo Finance, and a co-worker saw my "number"
I am getting vibes in my team, that I have been found out.
Was my own fault, as I dont have wing mirrors on my desk.
Anyone dealt with co-worker envy?

It depends - on the atmosphere at work in general and how well you get along with your co-workers. Could be a teaching opportunity to open someone's eye to the opportunity of FIRE or just smile mysteriously and don't engage when asked:)
Either option would make me feel good and proud:) - but there are a myriad of other responses incl some fun snarky ones as well of course.

I'd own it or aren't you proud and happy to be in a position to pull the plug? I can understand stealth wealth to a degree, but I would not go as far as lying about my circumstances - whatever for? You made the most out of your own opportunities and now you can finally say FU or express yourself in an adult way if you so choose.
I can see and appreciate your points, Rosy, but the specific question was how to deal with co-worker envy. Pride of accomplishment doesn't seem to be the issue here.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Chaplin on February 18, 2019, 12:42:11 PM
I am getting ready to quit work, but this happened to me recently...

I was checking my stash on Yahoo Finance, and a co-worker saw my "number"
I am getting vibes in my team, that I have been found out.
Was my own fault, as I dont have wing mirrors on my desk.
Anyone dealt with co-worker envy?

If it's not too late, you could say it's a practice trading account. Lots of brokerages have practice accounts where you can make imaginary trades with imaginary money.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: grantmeaname on February 18, 2019, 03:14:20 PM
But 1) that's a lie, and 2) it's a lie that will become brazen and obvious when OP FIREs in the near future
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: markbike528CBX on February 18, 2019, 07:05:54 PM
But 1) that's a lie, and 2) it's a lie that will become brazen and obvious when OP FIREs in the near future

But there is something literary about a brazen lie.

Mark Twain did it (the Celebrated Jumping Frog of Calaveras County) and was thought quite the charming journalist. http://twain.lib.virginia.edu/projects/price/frog.htm
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: DadJokes on February 19, 2019, 07:21:25 AM
I am getting ready to quit work, but this happened to me recently...

I was checking my stash on Yahoo Finance, and a co-worker saw my "number"
I am getting vibes in my team, that I have been found out.
Was my own fault, as I dont have wing mirrors on my desk.
Anyone dealt with co-worker envy?

I guess it depends on how long before you plan to quit, but you could use it as an opportunity to teach them about FIRE. I know that usually falls on deaf ears or is met with an endless list of excuses as to why you could save that much but they can't, but if you are quitting soon, their envy wouldn't really matter.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: talltexan on February 19, 2019, 11:54:22 AM
I have a nice template for calculating mortgage payments in the same file as a whole series of FIRE planning spreadsheets. One of my co-workers asked for my mortgage template today, and I was checking and re-checking to make sure I didn't send her my FIRE calculations as well.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: JGS1980 on February 21, 2019, 09:41:48 AM
PTF
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: AnnaGrowsAMustache on February 24, 2019, 03:47:24 AM
I'm not sure if this is a good story about FU money or a bad one. About 18 months ago I left a job I'd been at for several years (3) because it was AWFUL. I found another job, which paid a lot more but was slightly insane from the get go - the HR manager that hired me was fired for bullying a month after I arrived. It got worse. And worse. Last thursday there were two seriously last straw moments, and I left mid shift. I'd been there just on a year. Anyhoo, the FU money has given me the freedom to walk, and the leverage to negotiate that I leave immediately and they pay me out four weeks leave. Probably not good for a career, whatever that is (!) but absolutely fantastic for my mental health. I actually feel euphoric. So I guess the bad side of FU money is that you can use it???? I'm a fairly tough broad but I ate of looooooot of shit in this job before I left. I did not have fucks left to give, as the song goes......
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: radram on February 24, 2019, 07:43:52 AM
I'm not sure if this is a good story about FU money or a bad one. About 18 months ago I left a job I'd been at for several years (3) because it was AWFUL. I found another job, which paid a lot more but was slightly insane from the get go - the HR manager that hired me was fired for bullying a month after I arrived. It got worse. And worse. Last thursday there were two seriously last straw moments, and I left mid shift. I'd been there just on a year. Anyhoo, the FU money has given me the freedom to walk, and the leverage to negotiate that I leave immediately and they pay me out four weeks leave. Probably not good for a career, whatever that is (!) but absolutely fantastic for my mental health. I actually feel euphoric. So I guess the bad side of FU money is that you can use it???? I'm a fairly tough broad but I ate of looooooot of shit in this job before I left. I did not have fucks left to give, as the song goes......

Is this an Epic FU money story? Fuck yeah it is!

Congratulations on the ability to prioritize your sanity and well being. Keep us posted.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: CowboyAndIndian on February 24, 2019, 07:44:11 AM
I'm not sure if this is a good story about FU money or a bad one. About 18 months ago I left a job I'd been at for several years (3) because it was AWFUL. I found another job, which paid a lot more but was slightly insane from the get go - the HR manager that hired me was fired for bullying a month after I arrived. It got worse. And worse. Last thursday there were two seriously last straw moments, and I left mid shift. I'd been there just on a year. Anyhoo, the FU money has given me the freedom to walk, and the leverage to negotiate that I leave immediately and they pay me out four weeks leave. Probably not good for a career, whatever that is (!) but absolutely fantastic for my mental health. I actually feel euphoric. So I guess the bad side of FU money is that you can use it???? I'm a fairly tough broad but I ate of looooooot of shit in this job before I left. I did not have fucks left to give, as the song goes......

Good for you Anna.
 
You used FU money to save your sanity and well being!!! Exactly how FU money should be used.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: AnnaGrowsAMustache on February 24, 2019, 03:06:44 PM
Thanks, above posters. I did intend to find another job before I left but I probably waited too long to make that decision, too close to the last straw! So.... job hunting again. I can amp the sideline while I'm looking for jobs, and that will mean a little less eating into the FU fund. Just once I'd like to work in a pleasant, well run company, with nice people!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Sugaree on February 25, 2019, 07:46:04 AM
I don't know if this is actually epic, but here goes.  My husband's job...sucks.  He does groundskeeping for a 180 unit apartment complex.  He likes the job, and it paid decently well.  His boss has hated him ever since he was offered (and turned down) the GM job at another complex.  She has done everything she can over the last two years to make him quit.  Changing his time card and cheating him of time?  Check.  Making him buy back vacation days in cash only days before the start of scheduled trip and still telling him that they couldn't guarantee that he'd have a job when he got back?  Check.  Suspending him for two days because he couldn't/wouldn't rake leaves in a thunderstorm?  Check. 

So, it turns out that she was trying to get him to quit because the company is trying to cut payroll.  It was announced Friday afternoon that everyone was being cut to minimum wage.  That's something like a 40% pay cut for everyone.  Effective today.  He'll be tendering his resignation this morning and we have every intention of fighting them on a constructive dismissal unemployment claim.  They're lucky I can't prove the wage theft. 

The FU part comes in because we don't actually need his job to pay the bills.  The lights aren't going to get cut off.  We're not going to eat ramen noodles for three meals a day.  We probably won't even adjust the amount going into my retirement accounts.  The only part that sucks is that for all their BS, they had a decent 401(k) plan with low-cost Vanguard funds and they matched 50 cents on the dollar up to 16.66%.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Pooperman on February 25, 2019, 09:01:55 AM
I don't know if this is actually epic, but here goes.  My husband's job...sucks.  He does groundskeeping for a 180 unit apartment complex.  He likes the job, and it paid decently well.  His boss has hated him ever since he was offered (and turned down) the GM job at another complex.  She has done everything she can over the last two years to make him quit.  Changing his time card and cheating him of time?  Check.  Making him buy back vacation days in cash only days before the start of scheduled trip and still telling him that they couldn't guarantee that he'd have a job when he got back?  Check.  Suspending him for two days because he couldn't/wouldn't rake leaves in a thunderstorm?  Check. 

So, it turns out that she was trying to get him to quit because the company is trying to cut payroll.  It was announced Friday afternoon that everyone was being cut to minimum wage.  That's something like a 40% pay cut for everyone.  Effective today.  He'll be tendering his resignation this morning and we have every intention of fighting them on a constructive dismissal unemployment claim.  They're lucky I can't prove the wage theft. 

The FU part comes in because we don't actually need his job to pay the bills.  The lights aren't going to get cut off.  We're not going to eat ramen noodles for three meals a day.  We probably won't even adjust the amount going into my retirement accounts.  The only part that sucks is that for all their BS, they had a decent 401(k) plan with low-cost Vanguard funds and they matched 50 cents on the dollar up to 16.66%.

You don't have to prove the wage theft yourself. You report it and the state (or federal, depending) agency will investigate on your behalf. I would report it anyway.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: saguaro on February 25, 2019, 11:18:22 AM
Not an epic story but it appears DH's days are numbered at his current job.  It's not completely unexpected.   In a nutshell, the company has not been doing well in recent years, in part due to being in a declining industry but also some really bad management decisions have not helped.   Just about every day someone from one of the offices is let go and management pretty much is throwing everything at the wall to see what sticks. 

DH was pulled into a meeting, being advised that the company is "restructuring" for the umpteenth time but this time, they want to move him into another position instead of changing bosses.  The job involves working nights and weekends, doing some work that he isn't remotely qualified for (editorial work for a newspaper, he's one of their web developers for the online editions), in an nearly empty building in an industrial area with no security, all for the same pay he is making now.   He actually had to "interview" for this job.    He doesn't think he will get it nor does he want it, though he's concerned they might insist that he try it out for a few weeks.  He mentioned the security concerns as well has he has limited night vision for driving at dark.   He's fully prepared to leave today if they tell him. 

Thanks to FU money (plus DH is eligible take his social security though we won't need it right now) so we will be all right.  In fact, over the weekend he started calculating the cost savings of not working this job like gas, etc.  Not to mention a lot less stress.  DH is 63, he was hoping to make it to 65 but in the last few months started realizing the end of his current employment might come sooner.   He's got a couple of other income streams that he could devote more time to.  He still plans to keep an eye out for job openings as he is willing to take the right opportunity if it presents itself but it's not urgent. 

Funny that they noticed that DH is not particularly upset.  Someone asked if he won the lottery or something.


Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: FIRE Artist on February 25, 2019, 11:50:13 AM


Funny that they noticed that DH is not particularly upset.  Someone asked if he won the lottery or something.

It is insane that normal the expectation now is that someone 2 years out from normal retirement age would be stressed about a layoff. 
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Livingthedream55 on February 25, 2019, 11:51:53 AM
Not an epic story but it appears DH's days are numbered at his current job.  It's not completely unexpected.   In a nutshell, the company has not been doing well in recent years, in part due to being in a declining industry but also some really bad management decisions have not helped.   Just about every day someone from one of the offices is let go and management pretty much is throwing everything at the wall to see what sticks. 

DH was pulled into a meeting, being advised that the company is "restructuring" for the umpteenth time but this time, they want to move him into another position instead of changing bosses.  The job involves working nights and weekends, doing some work that he isn't remotely qualified for (editorial work for a newspaper, he's one of their web developers for the online editions), in an nearly empty building in an industrial area with no security, all for the same pay he is making now.   He actually had to "interview" for this job.    He doesn't think he will get it nor does he want it, though he's concerned they might insist that he try it out for a few weeks.  He mentioned the security concerns as well has he has limited night vision for driving at dark.   He's fully prepared to leave today if they tell him. 

Thanks to FU money (plus DH is eligible take his social security though we won't need it right now) so we will be all right.  In fact, over the weekend he started calculating the cost savings of not working this job like gas, etc.  Not to mention a lot less stress.  DH is 63, he was hoping to make it to 65 but in the last few months started realizing the end of his current employment might come sooner.   He's got a couple of other income streams that he could devote more time to.  He still plans to keep an eye out for job openings as he is willing to take the right opportunity if it presents itself but it's not urgent. 

Funny that they noticed that DH is not particularly upset.  Someone asked if he won the lottery or something.

Might he be eligible for unemployment (even if declining this "opportunity")?
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: BlueHouse on February 25, 2019, 12:02:04 PM
I thought I'd share an FU money story that is my mom's.   She was reliving it again to me, when I finally saw it for what it is:  an FU story. 

Now, I'll start by saying that mom did not actually have FU money, but she did eventually learn her worth in the market -- and that became her FU currency

Background:  Mom is widowed with 5 children to feed.  Money is extremely tight in the household.   Certified as a teacher, a teachers' strike makes finding a job impossible, so mom begins baking cakes and selling them to local restaurants.  After 5-6 months, she has 4-5 fancy restaurants on her daily rotation.  She's making 15-20 cakes and pies per day out of our home kitchen. 

One of her restaurants is a mob-run place at a racetrack.  She despises working with them because they treat her badly and wait weeks to pay her what she's owed -- very difficult when trying to buy supplies. There is a miscommunication over an error and the big boss mobster fires mom -- but makes the bookkeeper do it.  Mom was secretly relieved.  The mobsters were not professional and always ran on emotions. 

4 days later, the bookkeeper comes sniveling back and says the big boss wants her to come back and bake the desserts again. Mom raises the price on some of her desserts and then says she never wants to have to ask to get paid again.  All money is due at delivery or she's taking her cakes with her and never stepping foot inside again. 

I was about 11-12 when this happened, and I still remember the worry she had over how to pay bills and how empowered she was when she came home that day after setting her foot down. 
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: saguaro on February 25, 2019, 12:17:22 PM
Not an epic story but it appears DH's days are numbered at his current job.  It's not completely unexpected.   In a nutshell, the company has not been doing well in recent years, in part due to being in a declining industry but also some really bad management decisions have not helped.   Just about every day someone from one of the offices is let go and management pretty much is throwing everything at the wall to see what sticks. 

DH was pulled into a meeting, being advised that the company is "restructuring" for the umpteenth time but this time, they want to move him into another position instead of changing bosses.  The job involves working nights and weekends, doing some work that he isn't remotely qualified for (editorial work for a newspaper, he's one of their web developers for the online editions), in an nearly empty building in an industrial area with no security, all for the same pay he is making now.   He actually had to "interview" for this job.    He doesn't think he will get it nor does he want it, though he's concerned they might insist that he try it out for a few weeks.  He mentioned the security concerns as well has he has limited night vision for driving at dark.   He's fully prepared to leave today if they tell him. 

Thanks to FU money (plus DH is eligible take his social security though we won't need it right now) so we will be all right.  In fact, over the weekend he started calculating the cost savings of not working this job like gas, etc.  Not to mention a lot less stress.  DH is 63, he was hoping to make it to 65 but in the last few months started realizing the end of his current employment might come sooner.   He's got a couple of other income streams that he could devote more time to.  He still plans to keep an eye out for job openings as he is willing to take the right opportunity if it presents itself but it's not urgent. 

Funny that they noticed that DH is not particularly upset.  Someone asked if he won the lottery or something.

Might he be eligible for unemployment (even if declining this "opportunity")?

He is hoping to get out of there being eligible for unemployment.  He's not sure how they got the idea that he could do this job as it requires a whole different skillset from anything he has done during his career.  Working editorial on the high school newspaper was a loooonggg time ago.   His hours are limited to daylight hours because of issues with night vision, meaning his hours shift with the fall Daylight Savings time change.     

HR was at this first meeting.  Welp, he just learned the sole HR person is out of the office for 2 weeks so maybe he gets to stick around a bit longer. 
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: mm1970 on February 25, 2019, 01:30:21 PM


Funny that they noticed that DH is not particularly upset.  Someone asked if he won the lottery or something.

It is insane that normal the expectation now is that someone 2 years out from normal retirement age would be stressed about a layoff.
In my company we have many people of this age. 

Half wouldn't give a shit.
The other half would be freaking out.

It comes down to medical.  Those eligible for Medicare, or with a working spouse with insurance?  Don't care.

Those with pre-existing expensive conditions?  They care, but mostly for medical reasons.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: SwordGuy on February 25, 2019, 01:57:25 PM
I don't know if this is actually epic, but here goes.  My husband's job...sucks.  He does groundskeeping for a 180 unit apartment complex.  He likes the job, and it paid decently well.  His boss has hated him ever since he was offered (and turned down) the GM job at another complex.  She has done everything she can over the last two years to make him quit.  Changing his time card and cheating him of time?  Check.  Making him buy back vacation days in cash only days before the start of scheduled trip and still telling him that they couldn't guarantee that he'd have a job when he got back?  Check.  Suspending him for two days because he couldn't/wouldn't rake leaves in a thunderstorm?  Check. 

So, it turns out that she was trying to get him to quit because the company is trying to cut payroll.  It was announced Friday afternoon that everyone was being cut to minimum wage.  That's something like a 40% pay cut for everyone.  Effective today.  He'll be tendering his resignation this morning and we have every intention of fighting them on a constructive dismissal unemployment claim.  They're lucky I can't prove the wage theft. 

The FU part comes in because we don't actually need his job to pay the bills.  The lights aren't going to get cut off.  We're not going to eat ramen noodles for three meals a day.  We probably won't even adjust the amount going into my retirement accounts.  The only part that sucks is that for all their BS, they had a decent 401(k) plan with low-cost Vanguard funds and they matched 50 cents on the dollar up to 16.66%.

You don't have to prove the wage theft yourself. You report it and the state (or federal, depending) agency will investigate on your behalf. I would report it anyway.
@Sugaree , just want to up the odds that (a) you see this so you can take action and (b) to help you stick it to the man, because this particular employer deserves it.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Sugaree on February 25, 2019, 03:25:42 PM
I don't know if this is actually epic, but here goes.  My husband's job...sucks.  He does groundskeeping for a 180 unit apartment complex.  He likes the job, and it paid decently well.  His boss has hated him ever since he was offered (and turned down) the GM job at another complex.  She has done everything she can over the last two years to make him quit.  Changing his time card and cheating him of time?  Check.  Making him buy back vacation days in cash only days before the start of scheduled trip and still telling him that they couldn't guarantee that he'd have a job when he got back?  Check.  Suspending him for two days because he couldn't/wouldn't rake leaves in a thunderstorm?  Check. 

So, it turns out that she was trying to get him to quit because the company is trying to cut payroll.  It was announced Friday afternoon that everyone was being cut to minimum wage.  That's something like a 40% pay cut for everyone.  Effective today.  He'll be tendering his resignation this morning and we have every intention of fighting them on a constructive dismissal unemployment claim.  They're lucky I can't prove the wage theft. 

The FU part comes in because we don't actually need his job to pay the bills.  The lights aren't going to get cut off.  We're not going to eat ramen noodles for three meals a day.  We probably won't even adjust the amount going into my retirement accounts.  The only part that sucks is that for all their BS, they had a decent 401(k) plan with low-cost Vanguard funds and they matched 50 cents on the dollar up to 16.66%.

You don't have to prove the wage theft yourself. You report it and the state (or federal, depending) agency will investigate on your behalf. I would report it anyway.
@Sugaree , just want to up the odds that (a) you see this so you can take action and (b) to help you stick it to the man, because this particular employer deserves it.

I totally agree.  It has been one thing after another for months now.  This probably isn't even the half of it.  What sucks is that he really liked his job.  The hours were good.  He loves the tenants.  He liked most of his co-workers.  But local management was allowed to run roughshod over their little fiefdoms. 
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: AMandM on February 25, 2019, 04:17:58 PM
BlueHouse, that is epic. I am full of admiration for you mother!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: TomTX on February 25, 2019, 07:26:31 PM
He is hoping to get out of there being eligible for unemployment.  He's not sure how they got the idea that he could do this job as it requires a whole different skillset from anything he has done during his career.  Working editorial on the high school newspaper was a loooonggg time ago.   His hours are limited to daylight hours because of issues with night vision, meaning his hours shift with the fall Daylight Savings time change.     

HR was at this first meeting.  Welp, he just learned the sole HR person is out of the office for 2 weeks so maybe he gets to stick around a bit longer.

I think "applying for" or accepting the crap job is bad move. If they don't want him, they can fire him, and he should ask for significant severance.

Then file for UI.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Trifle on February 26, 2019, 02:12:54 AM
BlueHouse, that is epic. I am full of admiration for your mother!

+1.  Your mom showed epic backbone @BlueHouse.  And what a fantastic example for her kids.   
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Sugaree on February 26, 2019, 04:06:01 AM
I don't know if this is actually epic, but here goes.  My husband's job...sucks.  He does groundskeeping for a 180 unit apartment complex.  He likes the job, and it paid decently well.  His boss has hated him ever since he was offered (and turned down) the GM job at another complex.  She has done everything she can over the last two years to make him quit.  Changing his time card and cheating him of time?  Check.  Making him buy back vacation days in cash only days before the start of scheduled trip and still telling him that they couldn't guarantee that he'd have a job when he got back?  Check.  Suspending him for two days because he couldn't/wouldn't rake leaves in a thunderstorm?  Check. 

So, it turns out that she was trying to get him to quit because the company is trying to cut payroll.  It was announced Friday afternoon that everyone was being cut to minimum wage.  That's something like a 40% pay cut for everyone.  Effective today.  He'll be tendering his resignation this morning and we have every intention of fighting them on a constructive dismissal unemployment claim.  They're lucky I can't prove the wage theft. 

The FU part comes in because we don't actually need his job to pay the bills.  The lights aren't going to get cut off.  We're not going to eat ramen noodles for three meals a day.  We probably won't even adjust the amount going into my retirement accounts.  The only part that sucks is that for all their BS, they had a decent 401(k) plan with low-cost Vanguard funds and they matched 50 cents on the dollar up to 16.66%.

You don't have to prove the wage theft yourself. You report it and the state (or federal, depending) agency will investigate on your behalf. I would report it anyway.
@Sugaree , just want to up the odds that (a) you see this so you can take action and (b) to help you stick it to the man, because this particular employer deserves it.

I totally agree.  It has been one thing after another for months now.  This probably isn't even the half of it.  What sucks is that he really liked his job.  The hours were good.  He loves the tenants.  He liked most of his co-workers.  But local management was allowed to run roughshod over their little fiefdoms.

Quoting myself to say that they gave him the choice to take minimum wage with no benefits or be "laid off."  He chose laid off.  Unemployment payments are crap here, but he should still get one more paycheck before we have to worry about that.  In theory, he has a week of PTO that should be paid out too, but I'm betting we will have to fight for that and I don't know if it will be worth it.  He has some side gigs lined up already, so I think everything's going to be okay.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Pooperman on February 26, 2019, 05:28:59 AM
I don't know if this is actually epic, but here goes.  My husband's job...sucks.  He does groundskeeping for a 180 unit apartment complex.  He likes the job, and it paid decently well.  His boss has hated him ever since he was offered (and turned down) the GM job at another complex.  She has done everything she can over the last two years to make him quit.  Changing his time card and cheating him of time?  Check.  Making him buy back vacation days in cash only days before the start of scheduled trip and still telling him that they couldn't guarantee that he'd have a job when he got back?  Check.  Suspending him for two days because he couldn't/wouldn't rake leaves in a thunderstorm?  Check. 

So, it turns out that she was trying to get him to quit because the company is trying to cut payroll.  It was announced Friday afternoon that everyone was being cut to minimum wage.  That's something like a 40% pay cut for everyone.  Effective today.  He'll be tendering his resignation this morning and we have every intention of fighting them on a constructive dismissal unemployment claim.  They're lucky I can't prove the wage theft. 

The FU part comes in because we don't actually need his job to pay the bills.  The lights aren't going to get cut off.  We're not going to eat ramen noodles for three meals a day.  We probably won't even adjust the amount going into my retirement accounts.  The only part that sucks is that for all their BS, they had a decent 401(k) plan with low-cost Vanguard funds and they matched 50 cents on the dollar up to 16.66%.

You don't have to prove the wage theft yourself. You report it and the state (or federal, depending) agency will investigate on your behalf. I would report it anyway.
@Sugaree , just want to up the odds that (a) you see this so you can take action and (b) to help you stick it to the man, because this particular employer deserves it.

I totally agree.  It has been one thing after another for months now.  This probably isn't even the half of it.  What sucks is that he really liked his job.  The hours were good.  He loves the tenants.  He liked most of his co-workers.  But local management was allowed to run roughshod over their little fiefdoms.

Quoting myself to say that they gave him the choice to take minimum wage with no benefits or be "laid off."  He chose laid off.  Unemployment payments are crap here, but he should still get one more paycheck before we have to worry about that.  In theory, he has a week of PTO that should be paid out too, but I'm betting we will have to fight for that and I don't know if it will be worth it.  He has some side gigs lined up already, so I think everything's going to be okay.

Just make sure one of you reports the wage theft. It may take a while, but he worked hard for that money... and if they're doing that to him, he's probably not the only one. There can be a finder's fee as well depending on the circumstances. Another agency that might be interested is the IRS (or the state equivalen). When someone messes with wages, there's a decent chance they're also screwing with taxes.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Trifle on February 26, 2019, 06:04:53 AM
I don't know if this is actually epic, but here goes.  My husband's job...sucks.  He does groundskeeping for a 180 unit apartment complex.  He likes the job, and it paid decently well.  His boss has hated him ever since he was offered (and turned down) the GM job at another complex.  She has done everything she can over the last two years to make him quit.  Changing his time card and cheating him of time?  Check.  Making him buy back vacation days in cash only days before the start of scheduled trip and still telling him that they couldn't guarantee that he'd have a job when he got back?  Check.  Suspending him for two days because he couldn't/wouldn't rake leaves in a thunderstorm?  Check. 

So, it turns out that she was trying to get him to quit because the company is trying to cut payroll.  It was announced Friday afternoon that everyone was being cut to minimum wage.  That's something like a 40% pay cut for everyone.  Effective today.  He'll be tendering his resignation this morning and we have every intention of fighting them on a constructive dismissal unemployment claim.  They're lucky I can't prove the wage theft. 

The FU part comes in because we don't actually need his job to pay the bills.  The lights aren't going to get cut off.  We're not going to eat ramen noodles for three meals a day.  We probably won't even adjust the amount going into my retirement accounts.  The only part that sucks is that for all their BS, they had a decent 401(k) plan with low-cost Vanguard funds and they matched 50 cents on the dollar up to 16.66%.

You don't have to prove the wage theft yourself. You report it and the state (or federal, depending) agency will investigate on your behalf. I would report it anyway.
@Sugaree , just want to up the odds that (a) you see this so you can take action and (b) to help you stick it to the man, because this particular employer deserves it.

I totally agree.  It has been one thing after another for months now.  This probably isn't even the half of it.  What sucks is that he really liked his job.  The hours were good.  He loves the tenants.  He liked most of his co-workers.  But local management was allowed to run roughshod over their little fiefdoms.

Quoting myself to say that they gave him the choice to take minimum wage with no benefits or be "laid off."  He chose laid off.  Unemployment payments are crap here, but he should still get one more paycheck before we have to worry about that.  In theory, he has a week of PTO that should be paid out too, but I'm betting we will have to fight for that and I don't know if it will be worth it.  He has some side gigs lined up already, so I think everything's going to be okay.

Just make sure one of you reports the wage theft. It may take a while, but he worked hard for that money... and if they're doing that to him, he's probably not the only one. There can be a finder's fee as well depending on the circumstances. Another agency that might be interested is the IRS (or the state equivalen). When someone messes with wages, there's a decent chance they're also screwing with taxes.

Agree.  Sounds like a phone call to your state Department of Labor (DOL) is in order.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Sugaree on February 26, 2019, 06:21:55 AM
I don't know if this is actually epic, but here goes.  My husband's job...sucks.  He does groundskeeping for a 180 unit apartment complex.  He likes the job, and it paid decently well.  His boss has hated him ever since he was offered (and turned down) the GM job at another complex.  She has done everything she can over the last two years to make him quit.  Changing his time card and cheating him of time?  Check.  Making him buy back vacation days in cash only days before the start of scheduled trip and still telling him that they couldn't guarantee that he'd have a job when he got back?  Check.  Suspending him for two days because he couldn't/wouldn't rake leaves in a thunderstorm?  Check. 

So, it turns out that she was trying to get him to quit because the company is trying to cut payroll.  It was announced Friday afternoon that everyone was being cut to minimum wage.  That's something like a 40% pay cut for everyone.  Effective today.  He'll be tendering his resignation this morning and we have every intention of fighting them on a constructive dismissal unemployment claim.  They're lucky I can't prove the wage theft. 

The FU part comes in because we don't actually need his job to pay the bills.  The lights aren't going to get cut off.  We're not going to eat ramen noodles for three meals a day.  We probably won't even adjust the amount going into my retirement accounts.  The only part that sucks is that for all their BS, they had a decent 401(k) plan with low-cost Vanguard funds and they matched 50 cents on the dollar up to 16.66%.

You don't have to prove the wage theft yourself. You report it and the state (or federal, depending) agency will investigate on your behalf. I would report it anyway.
@Sugaree , just want to up the odds that (a) you see this so you can take action and (b) to help you stick it to the man, because this particular employer deserves it.

I totally agree.  It has been one thing after another for months now.  This probably isn't even the half of it.  What sucks is that he really liked his job.  The hours were good.  He loves the tenants.  He liked most of his co-workers.  But local management was allowed to run roughshod over their little fiefdoms.

Quoting myself to say that they gave him the choice to take minimum wage with no benefits or be "laid off."  He chose laid off.  Unemployment payments are crap here, but he should still get one more paycheck before we have to worry about that.  In theory, he has a week of PTO that should be paid out too, but I'm betting we will have to fight for that and I don't know if it will be worth it.  He has some side gigs lined up already, so I think everything's going to be okay.

Just make sure one of you reports the wage theft. It may take a while, but he worked hard for that money... and if they're doing that to him, he's probably not the only one. There can be a finder's fee as well depending on the circumstances. Another agency that might be interested is the IRS (or the state equivalen). When someone messes with wages, there's a decent chance they're also screwing with taxes.

Yep.  He wants to wait for the letter or recommendation from his manager.  I think that's a mistake given how much she seemed to dislike him, but whatever.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: BlueHouse on February 26, 2019, 07:14:38 AM
BlueHouse, that is epic. I am full of admiration for your mother!

+1.  Your mom showed epic backbone @BlueHouse.  And what a fantastic example for her kids.

Thanks AMandM and Trifele! 
This was back in the late 70s.  People have a hard time understanding just how difficult it was for women to stand up for themselves in those times.  So witnessing her feeling as if she had some control over her own business was incredibly eye-opening for me as a pre-teen girl.  She always told me I could be anything I wanted to be, but I also watched her struggle, so I do believe that small wins like that make a difference. 

Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: fuzzy math on February 26, 2019, 07:38:19 AM
BlueHouse, that is epic. I am full of admiration for your mother!

+1.  Your mom showed epic backbone @BlueHouse.  And what a fantastic example for her kids.

Thanks AMandM and Trifele! 
This was back in the late 70s.  People have a hard time understanding just how difficult it was for women to stand up for themselves in those times.  So witnessing her feeling as if she had some control over her own business was incredibly eye-opening for me as a pre-teen girl.  She always told me I could be anything I wanted to be, but I also watched her struggle, so I do believe that small wins like that make a difference.

That is not a small win! Your mom told the mob to accept her terms or shove it. She might have the most epic story here!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: radram on February 26, 2019, 08:46:06 AM
BlueHouse, that is epic. I am full of admiration for your mother!

+1.  Your mom showed epic backbone @BlueHouse.  And what a fantastic example for her kids.

Thanks AMandM and Trifele! 
This was back in the late 70s.  People have a hard time understanding just how difficult it was for women to stand up for themselves in those times.  So witnessing her feeling as if she had some control over her own business was incredibly eye-opening for me as a pre-teen girl.  She always told me I could be anything I wanted to be, but I also watched her struggle, so I do believe that small wins like that make a difference.

That is not a small win! Your mom told the mob to accept her terms or shove it. She might have the most epic story here!

Agreed. In fact, I think this story is in the wrong thread. It is one thing to say shove it because I have some money and don't have to take any crap (true epic FU money stories). It is another thing entirely to have NOTHING, need EVERYTHING, and STILL say FU ...... to the fucking MOB!

Just WOW. How incredibly inspiring. Thank you for sharing.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: saguaro on February 26, 2019, 09:53:37 AM
BlueHouse, that is epic. I am full of admiration for your mother!

+1.  Your mom showed epic backbone @BlueHouse.  And what a fantastic example for her kids.

Thanks AMandM and Trifele! 
This was back in the late 70s.  People have a hard time understanding just how difficult it was for women to stand up for themselves in those times.  So witnessing her feeling as if she had some control over her own business was incredibly eye-opening for me as a pre-teen girl.  She always told me I could be anything I wanted to be, but I also watched her struggle, so I do believe that small wins like that make a difference.

@BlueHouse  What your mom did was indeed epic.   And I agree, back in the late 70s it was not easy for women to stand up for themselves, it was overcoming a lot of societal programming.  At that same time, my mom had just gone back to work and she had her moments of having to stand up to doctors (who were pretty much male) as a nurse (who were still generally female).  It was not easy for her but she did it.  Good for your mom!

Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Zamboni on February 26, 2019, 09:54:59 AM
@BlueHouse

Your mom's baking must have been great . . . I'm sure that mobster was kicking himself pretty quick as soon as he was missing the taste of the pie (not to mention that I bet a bunch of customers were complaining that the good cake and pie had disappeared!)

Proud of her for sticking up for herself.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: okits on February 26, 2019, 06:37:46 PM
BlueHouse, that is epic. I am full of admiration for your mother!

+1.  Your mom showed epic backbone @BlueHouse.  And what a fantastic example for her kids.

Thanks AMandM and Trifele! 
This was back in the late 70s.  People have a hard time understanding just how difficult it was for women to stand up for themselves in those times.  So witnessing her feeling as if she had some control over her own business was incredibly eye-opening for me as a pre-teen girl.  She always told me I could be anything I wanted to be, but I also watched her struggle, so I do believe that small wins like that make a difference.

That is not a small win! Your mom told the mob to accept her terms or shove it. She might have the most epic story here!

Agreed. In fact, I think this story is in the wrong thread. It is one thing to say shove it because I have some money and don't have to take any crap (true epic FU money stories). It is another thing entirely to have NOTHING, need EVERYTHING, and STILL say FU ...... to the fucking MOB!

Just WOW. How incredibly inspiring. Thank you for sharing.

radram is right, @BlueHouse .  Your mom kicks some serious ass.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: saguaro on February 27, 2019, 03:43:29 PM
Update on DH: his last day in the clusterf**k that is his company is next Friday.   He is leaving with severance plus he can get UI and then social security after that. 

Unlike 10 years ago, when he lost his job in the thick of the Great Recession, this is not a shock.  He's been prepared for the possibility and he is looking forward to working his income streams and get some work done around the house that he's put off because he was too tired and stressed out.   He will look for work just to see if there's something he might be interested in but this time around find a job is not something he's going to be desperately hoping for, it will be a bonus and something he wants to do, not needs to do.   He's on my health insurance so that's not a problem.
 
Interesting that there was nothing more about this so-called "opportunity" that he interviewed for.  And more interesting that there is no talk about getting a person at the management level taking over his responsibilities and then some.  Nope, no sign of Superman, as he calls it.  One of his coworkers called BS on them hiring anyone to do anything.   They just simply lay off people and spread the work to everyone else.   Another funny thing, he was seen as "critical" to the organization so there's a bit of shock that they are actually letting him go.   There are some people who told him they would jump ship if he ever left.  So I think some will be making for the lifeboats if they can find one with their name on it.
 

 
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Sibley on February 28, 2019, 07:20:31 PM
I don't know if this is actually epic, but here goes.  My husband's job...sucks.  He does groundskeeping for a 180 unit apartment complex.  He likes the job, and it paid decently well.  His boss has hated him ever since he was offered (and turned down) the GM job at another complex.  She has done everything she can over the last two years to make him quit.  Changing his time card and cheating him of time?  Check.  Making him buy back vacation days in cash only days before the start of scheduled trip and still telling him that they couldn't guarantee that he'd have a job when he got back?  Check.  Suspending him for two days because he couldn't/wouldn't rake leaves in a thunderstorm?  Check. 

So, it turns out that she was trying to get him to quit because the company is trying to cut payroll.  It was announced Friday afternoon that everyone was being cut to minimum wage.  That's something like a 40% pay cut for everyone.  Effective today.  He'll be tendering his resignation this morning and we have every intention of fighting them on a constructive dismissal unemployment claim.  They're lucky I can't prove the wage theft. 

The FU part comes in because we don't actually need his job to pay the bills.  The lights aren't going to get cut off.  We're not going to eat ramen noodles for three meals a day.  We probably won't even adjust the amount going into my retirement accounts.  The only part that sucks is that for all their BS, they had a decent 401(k) plan with low-cost Vanguard funds and they matched 50 cents on the dollar up to 16.66%.

You don't have to prove the wage theft yourself. You report it and the state (or federal, depending) agency will investigate on your behalf. I would report it anyway.
@Sugaree , just want to up the odds that (a) you see this so you can take action and (b) to help you stick it to the man, because this particular employer deserves it.

I totally agree.  It has been one thing after another for months now.  This probably isn't even the half of it.  What sucks is that he really liked his job.  The hours were good.  He loves the tenants.  He liked most of his co-workers.  But local management was allowed to run roughshod over their little fiefdoms.

Quoting myself to say that they gave him the choice to take minimum wage with no benefits or be "laid off."  He chose laid off.  Unemployment payments are crap here, but he should still get one more paycheck before we have to worry about that.  In theory, he has a week of PTO that should be paid out too, but I'm betting we will have to fight for that and I don't know if it will be worth it.  He has some side gigs lined up already, so I think everything's going to be okay.

Just make sure one of you reports the wage theft. It may take a while, but he worked hard for that money... and if they're doing that to him, he's probably not the only one. There can be a finder's fee as well depending on the circumstances. Another agency that might be interested is the IRS (or the state equivalen). When someone messes with wages, there's a decent chance they're also screwing with taxes.

Yep.  He wants to wait for the letter or recommendation from his manager.  I think that's a mistake given how much she seemed to dislike him, but whatever.

I would snip, but would mess up the formatting somehow.

Anyway, a family member's former employer was screwing up the wages/overtime/etc rules for years. Someone reported it to the state's DOL, and while I think it took a year or more, all the impacted employees eventually got back pay (up to $20k for some), then they all got recategorized so that they're getting salary + overtime pay. (Please don't ask details, I have no idea.) Messing up wages is a big deal. If it's deliberate, even more so.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Trifle on March 01, 2019, 05:11:41 AM
I would snip, but would mess up the formatting somehow.

Anyway, a family member's former employer was screwing up the wages/overtime/etc rules for years. Someone reported it to the state's DOL, and while I think it took a year or more, all the impacted employees eventually got back pay (up to $20k for some), then they all got recategorized so that they're getting salary + overtime pay. (Please don't ask details, I have no idea.) Messing up wages is a big deal. If it's deliberate, even more so.

+1.   In my experience (former employment law attorney) state DOLs always investigate these complaints and take them seriously.  They have specific departments for 'Wage and Hour' complaints, and this is why they exist.  Please do report it @saguaro.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Unique User on March 01, 2019, 06:59:39 AM
I don't know if this is actually epic, but here goes.  My husband's job...sucks.  He does groundskeeping for a 180 unit apartment complex.  He likes the job, and it paid decently well.  His boss has hated him ever since he was offered (and turned down) the GM job at another complex.  She has done everything she can over the last two years to make him quit.  Changing his time card and cheating him of time?  Check.  Making him buy back vacation days in cash only days before the start of scheduled trip and still telling him that they couldn't guarantee that he'd have a job when he got back?  Check.  Suspending him for two days because he couldn't/wouldn't rake leaves in a thunderstorm?  Check. 

So, it turns out that she was trying to get him to quit because the company is trying to cut payroll.  It was announced Friday afternoon that everyone was being cut to minimum wage.  That's something like a 40% pay cut for everyone.  Effective today.  He'll be tendering his resignation this morning and we have every intention of fighting them on a constructive dismissal unemployment claim.  They're lucky I can't prove the wage theft. 

The FU part comes in because we don't actually need his job to pay the bills.  The lights aren't going to get cut off.  We're not going to eat ramen noodles for three meals a day.  We probably won't even adjust the amount going into my retirement accounts.  The only part that sucks is that for all their BS, they had a decent 401(k) plan with low-cost Vanguard funds and they matched 50 cents on the dollar up to 16.66%.

You don't have to prove the wage theft yourself. You report it and the state (or federal, depending) agency will investigate on your behalf. I would report it anyway.
@Sugaree , just want to up the odds that (a) you see this so you can take action and (b) to help you stick it to the man, because this particular employer deserves it.

I totally agree.  It has been one thing after another for months now.  This probably isn't even the half of it.  What sucks is that he really liked his job.  The hours were good.  He loves the tenants.  He liked most of his co-workers.  But local management was allowed to run roughshod over their little fiefdoms.

Quoting myself to say that they gave him the choice to take minimum wage with no benefits or be "laid off."  He chose laid off.  Unemployment payments are crap here, but he should still get one more paycheck before we have to worry about that.  In theory, he has a week of PTO that should be paid out too, but I'm betting we will have to fight for that and I don't know if it will be worth it.  He has some side gigs lined up already, so I think everything's going to be okay.

Not sure what state you are in, but there are specific rules in PTO payout also.  DH's former company (global 50k employee corp) tried to tell him that they did not owe him for PTO, but he had the original hire paperwork that showed otherwise.  In NC, vacation pay needs to be paid upon termination unless there is a written policy that states that vacation pay will be forfeited.  Each state is different, but that is another claim to your state DOL.  Check your state rules and if they don't pay it, I'd report them. 
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: ducky19 on March 01, 2019, 10:19:50 AM
Posting up my DW's story. My wife is a preschool teacher at a private center. She's been working for this place since last August, and has been miserable nearly the entire time. She has been labeled by her boss (the owner) as "confrontational". When asked why, she claimed it was because she questioned the practice of the boss sending out a group text each night with the next day's schedule, then requiring everyone in the group text to reply to the group text. They held it against her for not updating the Facebook site for months, even though she told them back in August that she didn't have admin rights and that they needed to grant those to her if they wanted her to update it (never happened). Since she is salaried, any time off had to be made up - fine. But she was only allowed to count certain hours, the majority of the extra time she put in was not considered eligible. The final straw came yesterday though when she was called into her boss' office and told she was being written up for "missing too much time". Her boss had documented all of the time she claimed my wife missed, but would not let her leave with the sheet without signing it. My wife wanted to cross reference it with her own records and refused to sign it, so they finally gave her a copy. She came home at lunch and found numerous errors/discrepancies that she produced documentation for and copied to the back of the sheet (so it couldn't be misplaced). She took it back into her boss and said, "here is the form, I've attached corrections on the back and signed it, and the sheet below it is my resignation". Her boss wouldn't even look at her and just said, "ok". My wife said, "I'll give you two weeks notice, but I will understand if you don't want it and will leave today if you prefer". Her boss, still not looking at her, said "ok". My wife said, "so.... which do you prefer?" and was finally told she'll take the two weeks. It sucks for my wife's coworkers, because the boss won't hire anyone else and will just expect them to fill in for her. She's already gotten a lot of supportive texts from her coworkers and parents, so she feels validated that not everyone thought she was doing a terrible job (even had some tears from some of her coworkers). I feel for them, but DW has to do what's right for her. She already had another job offer, but we could survive indefinitely without her pay. Just glad she finally put an end to putting up with this one's shit!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Dicey on March 01, 2019, 10:27:03 PM
Posting up my DW's story. My wife is a preschool teacher at a private center. She's been working for this place since last August, and has been miserable nearly the entire time. She has been labeled by her boss (the owner) as "confrontational". When asked why, she claimed it was because she questioned the practice of the boss sending out a group text each night with the next day's schedule, then requiring everyone in the group text to reply to the group text. They held it against her for not updating the Facebook site for months, even though she told them back in August that she didn't have admin rights and that they needed to grant those to her if they wanted her to update it (never happened). Since she is salaried, any time off had to be made up - fine. But she was only allowed to count certain hours, the majority of the extra time she put in was not considered eligible. The final straw came yesterday though when she was called into her boss' office and told she was being written up for "missing too much time". Her boss had documented all of the time she claimed my wife missed, but would not let her leave with the sheet without signing it. My wife wanted to cross reference it with her own records and refused to sign it, so they finally gave her a copy. She came home at lunch and found numerous errors/discrepancies that she produced documentation for and copied to the back of the sheet (so it couldn't be misplaced). She took it back into her boss and said, "here is the form, I've attached corrections on the back and signed it, and the sheet below it is my resignation". Her boss wouldn't even look at her and just said, "ok". My wife said, "I'll give you two weeks notice, but I will understand if you don't want it and will leave today if you prefer". Her boss, still not looking at her, said "ok". My wife said, "so.... which do you prefer?" and was finally told she'll take the two weeks. It sucks for my wife's coworkers, because the boss won't hire anyone else and will just expect them to fill in for her. She's already gotten a lot of supportive texts from her coworkers and parents, so she feels validated that not everyone thought she was doing a terrible job (even had some tears from some of her coworkers). I feel for them, but DW has to do what's right for her. She already had another job offer, but we could survive indefinitely without her pay. Just glad she finally put an end to putting up with this one's shit!
Hooray! I love this story. Erm, well, not quite. I'm sorry she was in such a miserable situation and glad she's found the exit door.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: MissNancyPryor on March 02, 2019, 08:24:23 AM
I think I remember reading this somewhere here but it is a great reminder to get the FU money going immediately in life. 


https://www.thebillfold.com/2016/01/a-story-of-a-fuck-off-fund/

Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: WhiteTrashCash on March 02, 2019, 08:48:54 AM
I think I remember reading this somewhere here but it is a great reminder to get the FU money going immediately in life. 


https://www.thebillfold.com/2016/01/a-story-of-a-fuck-off-fund/ (https://www.thebillfold.com/2016/01/a-story-of-a-fuck-off-fund/)

As someone who lived a version of what happened to that poor girl in the story you shared, I endorse your post. Having FU Money is essential for a person's well-being and reaching that level requires eliminating all the voices that prevent you from saving and investing to make it happen -- which means getting rid of advertising, nexting spendypants friends, and learning to take as much pleasure from watching your money grow as you did from some shiny new gazingus pin.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Capt j-rod on March 02, 2019, 06:38:46 PM
The lovelyDW works in medicine. She switched jobs and life has been much better than the previous workplace. We have made an amazing discovery... No one is in charge! There are lots of big job titles, TONS of meetings where nothing gets done, and no one has the authority to do anything. They complain constantly about everything... They try to get you to work over. They try to switch the schedules. Finally the DW pulled out her contract and asked where it was agreed upon that these things could be changed. No one could get an answer. She politely refused to do what was asked and they threatened to "write her up". She replied that unless she signs the papers that the procedure can't be billed. She suggested three days off without pay, which would happen with more write ups... The problem is that the office manager can't see patients, or perform surgery. No doc, no charges, no surgeries no income to the big machine. Finally administration got involved when the managers called them in. After a quick review of the emails, requests, and other stories... They are currently hiring a new manager LOL. FU money and borderline FIRE give you muscles you never knew you had. She pointed out that an employed physician is very different than a partner. As an employee, you show up, work your shift, do what needs done and go home. They want you to be a part of the practice, but they won't pay more and nothing can quench their thirst. After the meeting they have moved onto others who have no choice but to do what they're told. She is in year 2 of a 3 year contract. They are worried that she doesn't want to renew... They are right!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Freedomin5 on March 04, 2019, 02:31:56 AM
The lovelyDW works in medicine. She switched jobs and life has been much better than the previous workplace. We have made an amazing discovery... No one is in charge! There are lots of big job titles, TONS of meetings where nothing gets done, and no one has the authority to do anything. They complain constantly about everything... They try to get you to work over. They try to switch the schedules. Finally the DW pulled out her contract and asked where it was agreed upon that these things could be changed. No one could get an answer. She politely refused to do what was asked and they threatened to "write her up". She replied that unless she signs the papers that the procedure can't be billed. She suggested three days off without pay, which would happen with more write ups... The problem is that the office manager can't see patients, or perform surgery. No doc, no charges, no surgeries no income to the big machine. Finally administration got involved when the managers called them in. After a quick review of the emails, requests, and other stories... They are currently hiring a new manager LOL. FU money and borderline FIRE give you muscles you never knew you had. She pointed out that an employed physician is very different than a partner. As an employee, you show up, work your shift, do what needs done and go home. They want you to be a part of the practice, but they won't pay more and nothing can quench their thirst. After the meeting they have moved onto others who have no choice but to do what they're told. She is in year 2 of a 3 year contract. They are worried that she doesn't want to renew... They are right!

:D I like this story. I hate it when management tries to get me to do something that is not in my contract or that is unethical.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Sugaree on March 08, 2019, 10:54:15 AM
I don't know if this is actually epic, but here goes.  My husband's job...sucks.  He does groundskeeping for a 180 unit apartment complex.  He likes the job, and it paid decently well.  His boss has hated him ever since he was offered (and turned down) the GM job at another complex.  She has done everything she can over the last two years to make him quit.  Changing his time card and cheating him of time?  Check.  Making him buy back vacation days in cash only days before the start of scheduled trip and still telling him that they couldn't guarantee that he'd have a job when he got back?  Check.  Suspending him for two days because he couldn't/wouldn't rake leaves in a thunderstorm?  Check. 

So, it turns out that she was trying to get him to quit because the company is trying to cut payroll.  It was announced Friday afternoon that everyone was being cut to minimum wage.  That's something like a 40% pay cut for everyone.  Effective today.  He'll be tendering his resignation this morning and we have every intention of fighting them on a constructive dismissal unemployment claim.  They're lucky I can't prove the wage theft. 

The FU part comes in because we don't actually need his job to pay the bills.  The lights aren't going to get cut off.  We're not going to eat ramen noodles for three meals a day.  We probably won't even adjust the amount going into my retirement accounts.  The only part that sucks is that for all their BS, they had a decent 401(k) plan with low-cost Vanguard funds and they matched 50 cents on the dollar up to 16.66%.

You don't have to prove the wage theft yourself. You report it and the state (or federal, depending) agency will investigate on your behalf. I would report it anyway.
@Sugaree , just want to up the odds that (a) you see this so you can take action and (b) to help you stick it to the man, because this particular employer deserves it.

I totally agree.  It has been one thing after another for months now.  This probably isn't even the half of it.  What sucks is that he really liked his job.  The hours were good.  He loves the tenants.  He liked most of his co-workers.  But local management was allowed to run roughshod over their little fiefdoms.

Quoting myself to say that they gave him the choice to take minimum wage with no benefits or be "laid off."  He chose laid off.  Unemployment payments are crap here, but he should still get one more paycheck before we have to worry about that.  In theory, he has a week of PTO that should be paid out too, but I'm betting we will have to fight for that and I don't know if it will be worth it.  He has some side gigs lined up already, so I think everything's going to be okay.

Not sure what state you are in, but there are specific rules in PTO payout also.  DH's former company (global 50k employee corp) tried to tell him that they did not owe him for PTO, but he had the original hire paperwork that showed otherwise.  In NC, vacation pay needs to be paid upon termination unless there is a written policy that states that vacation pay will be forfeited.  Each state is different, but that is another claim to your state DOL.  Check your state rules and if they don't pay it, I'd report them.

Wanna take a guess who didn't get his last paycheck today like he was supposed to? 
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: saguaro on March 08, 2019, 01:26:36 PM
@Sugaree that's terrible.  I echo all the others on reporting them.   

Also want to update all that DH's day of freedom from the clusterf**k is here.  He is leaving with vacation time, severance pay (a big deal since they are known not to give severance per other employees) and.....money refunded because they charged him for health insurance that he opted out of because they messed up the paperwork.

He has learned more about their umpteenth, gazillionth throw something at the wall and see what sticks er, restructuring and this person who is coming on board to take over his job in addition to a bunch of other things (a deal with the devil if you ask me) they will dream up on the spot.   Seems that an ex employee is coming back on board, someone who, incidentally, has come and gone multiple times.  Not sure why this person is giving it another go, even if they need $$.   According to DH, this person knows a lot of the business however, he's not sure about knowledge of the complex software he uses.  He's also been training some other coworkers in the past week and their heads are exploding.   Yep, they are letting someone go without totally knowing what that person does.

At any rate he's leaving on good terms, he has some contacts that might pan out when they all jump ship (he got a lead on another job already), some extra money, plus eligible for UI, plus then SS.   This is better than when he was planning to retire next year. 
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Unique User on March 09, 2019, 06:17:36 AM
@Sugaree  That just sucks.  They think they will get away with it, probably because no one has every called them on it. Internet stranger here, but I'd write up a letter with everything you are owed, including paid PTO time and send to the employer.  Look at your state and see what penalties they face for not paying on time and include in your notice.  Give them a time limit and let them know you will go to your state's DOL to collect after that time.  Formal written notice is crucial in this type of situation.  I've had it happen twice and each time I received everything I was owed within 24 hours. 
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Dicey on March 09, 2019, 08:58:21 AM
@Sugaree  That just sucks.  They think they will get away with it, probably because no one has every called them on it. Internet stranger here, but I'd write up a letter with everything you are owed, including paid PTO time and send to the employer.  Look at your state and see what penalties they face for not paying on time and include in your notice.  Give them a time limit and let them know you will go to your state's DOL to collect after that time.  Formal written notice is crucial in this type of situation.  I've had it happen twice and each time I received everything I was owed within 24 hours.
While I agree with most if this,  I have another, more nefarious suggestion. Look up your state's regulations, make up your spreadsheet on what you are owed and then WAIT. It will get a lot more interesting if they violate state law. You don't need the money for this week's groceries, so why not fuck with them right back?
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: SwordGuy on March 09, 2019, 01:38:05 PM
@Sugaree  That just sucks.  They think they will get away with it, probably because no one has every called them on it. Internet stranger here, but I'd write up a letter with everything you are owed, including paid PTO time and send to the employer.  Look at your state and see what penalties they face for not paying on time and include in your notice.  Give them a time limit and let them know you will go to your state's DOL to collect after that time.  Formal written notice is crucial in this type of situation.  I've had it happen twice and each time I received everything I was owed within 24 hours.
While I agree with most if this,  I have another, more nefarious suggestion. Look up your state's regulations, make up your spreadsheet on what you are owed and then WAIT. It will get a lot more interesting if they violate state law. You don't need the money for this week's groceries, so why not fuck with them right back?

I like the way you think.  After fines and penalties, they'll be less likely to screw over the next person.   Always try to leave the world a better place as you pass thru it...
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Sugaree on March 11, 2019, 05:23:40 AM
@Sugaree  That just sucks.  They think they will get away with it, probably because no one has every called them on it. Internet stranger here, but I'd write up a letter with everything you are owed, including paid PTO time and send to the employer.  Look at your state and see what penalties they face for not paying on time and include in your notice.  Give them a time limit and let them know you will go to your state's DOL to collect after that time.  Formal written notice is crucial in this type of situation.  I've had it happen twice and each time I received everything I was owed within 24 hours.
While I agree with most if this,  I have another, more nefarious suggestion. Look up your state's regulations, make up your spreadsheet on what you are owed and then WAIT. It will get a lot more interesting if they violate state law. You don't need the money for this week's groceries, so why not fuck with them right back?

I like the way you think.  After fines and penalties, they'll be less likely to screw over the next person.   Always try to leave the world a better place as you pass thru it...


I'm kind of liking this idea.  It seems that this is all his local management.  She didn't turn in his final time sheet.  But I'm wondering if she really told them that he left because he had some PTO hours that need to be paid out (at least I think they have to be paid out, but it's Alabama and it's not exactly the most worker-friendly state)  It's really a shame (for them) that one of DH's good childhood friends is an employment attorney.  We've already got a call in to her.  I'm not sure she can still practice here (just passed the bar in her new state), but she should still have connections in the city where the corporate office is located. 
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Dicey on March 11, 2019, 07:52:48 AM
@Sugaree  That just sucks.  They think they will get away with it, probably because no one has every called them on it. Internet stranger here, but I'd write up a letter with everything you are owed, including paid PTO time and send to the employer.  Look at your state and see what penalties they face for not paying on time and include in your notice.  Give them a time limit and let them know you will go to your state's DOL to collect after that time.  Formal written notice is crucial in this type of situation.  I've had it happen twice and each time I received everything I was owed within 24 hours.
While I agree with most if this,  I have another, more nefarious suggestion. Look up your state's regulations, make up your spreadsheet on what you are owed and then WAIT. It will get a lot more interesting if they violate state law. You don't need the money for this week's groceries, so why not fuck with them right back?
I like the way you think.  After fines and penalties, they'll be less likely to screw over the next person.   Always try to leave the world a better place as you pass thru it...
I'm kind of liking this idea.  It seems that this is all his local management.  She didn't turn in his final time sheet.  But I'm wondering if she really told them that he left because he had some PTO hours that need to be paid out (at least I think they have to be paid out, but it's Alabama and it's not exactly the most worker-friendly state)  It's really a shame (for them) that one of DH's good childhood friends is an employment attorney.  We've already got a call in to her.  I'm not sure she can still practice here (just passed the bar in her new state), but she should still have connections in the city where the corporate office is located.
I worked for a large manufacturing company based in another state. They believed they could enforce their state laws throughout the country. My state has a different opinion. When the company said vacation time was "use it or lose it", all it took was a couple of firmly worded emails to HR with a few key quotes from my state's employment code. This resulted in new policies that benefited everyone. In the course of this research, it was also discovered that the task of tracking vacation time is the burden of the employer, not the employee.

Fast forward a few years. A local colleague, a superstar salesperson for decades, was laid off for reasons that looked suspiciously like ageism. The company's severance package was pretty stingy. He decided to go after them for thirty years of unpaid vacation time. Whoopsie! The company did not have accurate records. He ended up with the severance package he was quite happy with. (This is a FU money story, because he didn't need it. He liked working and was great at his job. He was just pissed that they were kicking him to the curb, and making such a paltry severance offer.)

I'm posting this to show that not every case requires a lawyer. Start by reading up on your state's employment code.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: BicycleB on March 11, 2019, 04:44:26 PM
I came for the stories, and then you educated me!

Well done, @Dicey
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Dicey on March 11, 2019, 11:30:04 PM
I came for the stories, and then you educated me!

Well done, @Dicey
Thanks. Musta been an accident.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Unique User on March 12, 2019, 08:02:14 AM
@Sugaree  That just sucks.  They think they will get away with it, probably because no one has every called them on it. Internet stranger here, but I'd write up a letter with everything you are owed, including paid PTO time and send to the employer.  Look at your state and see what penalties they face for not paying on time and include in your notice.  Give them a time limit and let them know you will go to your state's DOL to collect after that time.  Formal written notice is crucial in this type of situation.  I've had it happen twice and each time I received everything I was owed within 24 hours.
While I agree with most if this,  I have another, more nefarious suggestion. Look up your state's regulations, make up your spreadsheet on what you are owed and then WAIT. It will get a lot more interesting if they violate state law. You don't need the money for this week's groceries, so why not fuck with them right back?
I like the way you think.  After fines and penalties, they'll be less likely to screw over the next person.   Always try to leave the world a better place as you pass thru it...
I'm kind of liking this idea.  It seems that this is all his local management.  She didn't turn in his final time sheet.  But I'm wondering if she really told them that he left because he had some PTO hours that need to be paid out (at least I think they have to be paid out, but it's Alabama and it's not exactly the most worker-friendly state)  It's really a shame (for them) that one of DH's good childhood friends is an employment attorney.  We've already got a call in to her.  I'm not sure she can still practice here (just passed the bar in her new state), but she should still have connections in the city where the corporate office is located.
I worked for a large manufacturing company based in another state. They believed they could enforce their state laws throughout the country. My state has a different opinion. When the company said vacation time was "use it or lose it", all it took was a couple of firmly worded emails to HR with a few key quotes from my state's employment code. This resulted in new policies that benefited everyone. In the course of this research, it was also discovered that the task of tracking vacation time is the burden of the employer, not the employee.

Fast forward a few years. A local colleague, a superstar salesperson for decades, was laid off for reasons that looked suspiciously like ageism. The company's severance package was pretty stingy. He decided to go after them for thirty years of unpaid vacation time. Whoopsie! The company did not have accurate records. He ended up with the severance package he was quite happy with. (This is a FU money story, because he didn't need it. He liked working and was great at his job. He was just pissed that they were kicking him to the curb, and making such a paltry severance offer.)

I'm posting this to show that not every case requires a lawyer. Start by reading up on your state's employment code.

Agree!!  @Dicey - I like your idea of dealing with the company better than mine.  :)
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: mm1970 on March 12, 2019, 11:14:14 AM
@Sugaree  That just sucks.  They think they will get away with it, probably because no one has every called them on it. Internet stranger here, but I'd write up a letter with everything you are owed, including paid PTO time and send to the employer.  Look at your state and see what penalties they face for not paying on time and include in your notice.  Give them a time limit and let them know you will go to your state's DOL to collect after that time.  Formal written notice is crucial in this type of situation.  I've had it happen twice and each time I received everything I was owed within 24 hours.
While I agree with most if this,  I have another, more nefarious suggestion. Look up your state's regulations, make up your spreadsheet on what you are owed and then WAIT. It will get a lot more interesting if they violate state law. You don't need the money for this week's groceries, so why not fuck with them right back?
I like the way you think.  After fines and penalties, they'll be less likely to screw over the next person.   Always try to leave the world a better place as you pass thru it...
I'm kind of liking this idea.  It seems that this is all his local management.  She didn't turn in his final time sheet.  But I'm wondering if she really told them that he left because he had some PTO hours that need to be paid out (at least I think they have to be paid out, but it's Alabama and it's not exactly the most worker-friendly state)  It's really a shame (for them) that one of DH's good childhood friends is an employment attorney.  We've already got a call in to her.  I'm not sure she can still practice here (just passed the bar in her new state), but she should still have connections in the city where the corporate office is located.
I worked for a large manufacturing company based in another state. They believed they could enforce their state laws throughout the country. My state has a different opinion. When the company said vacation time was "use it or lose it", all it took was a couple of firmly worded emails to HR with a few key quotes from my state's employment code. This resulted in new policies that benefited everyone. In the course of this research, it was also discovered that the task of tracking vacation time is the burden of the employer, not the employee.

Fast forward a few years. A local colleague, a superstar salesperson for decades, was laid off for reasons that looked suspiciously like ageism. The company's severance package was pretty stingy. He decided to go after them for thirty years of unpaid vacation time. Whoopsie! The company did not have accurate records. He ended up with the severance package he was quite happy with. (This is a FU money story, because he didn't need it. He liked working and was great at his job. He was just pissed that they were kicking him to the curb, and making such a paltry severance offer.)

I'm posting this to show that not every case requires a lawyer. Start by reading up on your state's employment code.
Did we work for the same company?  My old company loved the "Use it or lose it", until they realized that it's not allowed in CA.  Then they adjusted the rule for us to say that you stop accruing after so much time, and adjusted it for their home state to allow them to carry over 40 hours.  Thing is, they often wouldn't allow people to take the time off.  In the end, after about 10 years, I think they adjusted it again to not be use or lose in any sense.

That story about unpaid vacation time was glorious.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: albireo13 on March 13, 2019, 05:25:39 AM
Also, your state's Dept of Labor can be a great advocate if you don't want a lawyer.  It will take time to resolve, if your case is valid but, they can be like a pitbull .... grabbing and not letting go until you submit.
Nothing like getting the state attorney general knocking on their door to make them wet their pants.   
LOL
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Laura33 on March 13, 2019, 07:54:04 AM
@Sugaree:  Please do notify the company, in writing.  The best thing you can do if you want to get your money, go to the state, hire a lawyer, or whatever, is to document document document; otherwise, it's he-said-she-said and bad memories, or looks like you're playing a game of "gotcha."

Yes, theoretically you don't have to, because they should pay your husband what he deserves.  But the reality is that the way to win (or force a settlement, or initiate a DOL investigation) is to create a record that shows very clearly that you have politely and reasonably repeatedly asked for what you are owed.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: spotila on March 13, 2019, 05:01:46 PM
A small FU money story I have - sorry I don't have more details, it was a few years back now

DW was working at a local cafe doing... cafe stuff, barista primarily.
The job started out really well and she made some good friends, money was average, not terrible.
But I believe the cafe sold to new management shortly after this.

As soon as this happened things went downhill due to one of the new ladies in charge.
Bad attitude, yelling at employees, unrealistic or non-contract requests, all the standard stuff.

During a pre-opening standup meeting one morning (discuss cafe operations before opening the doors I guess), the new manager was particularly crazy, spouting nonsense about how lazy they all were an so on.

At the time we had about 5 years' expenses in the stash, and we always agreed we'd just bail if this sort of thing started happening.

So she said (paraphrasing) - "I don't need this kinda BS, I have money...".
And walked straight out the door before the morning rush.

She was worried what I would think, but I couldn't have been more proud.
FU money is great
Also people don't leave their jobs, they leave their managers
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Livingthedream55 on March 14, 2019, 09:47:03 AM
A small FU money story I have - sorry I don't have more details, it was a few years back now

DW was working at a local cafe doing... cafe stuff, barista primarily.
The job started out really well and she made some good friends, money was average, not terrible.
But I believe the cafe sold to new management shortly after this.

As soon as this happened things went downhill due to one of the new ladies in charge.
Bad attitude, yelling at employees, unrealistic or non-contract requests, all the standard stuff.

During a pre-opening standup meeting one morning (discuss cafe operations before opening the doors I guess), the new manager was particularly crazy, spouting nonsense about how lazy they all were an so on.

At the time we had about 5 years' expenses in the stash, and we always agreed we'd just bail if this sort of thing started happening.

So she said (paraphrasing) - "I don't need this kinda BS, I have money...".
And walked straight out the door before the morning rush.

She was worried what I would think, but I couldn't have been more proud.
FU money is great
Also people don't leave their jobs, they leave their managers

That story is badass!

And yes, I'm leaving my manager in just a few months myself. I am just stockpiling the savings at this stage.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: bigair360x on March 14, 2019, 10:49:21 AM
I started working out of college in a corporate IT role and enjoyed the position and thought the money was good. I worked there 6 years until I met my girlfriend who would later become my wife. She asked if I would go with her to New York to live a while while she worked a travel role. I knew that I would essentially have to quit my job to go on this epic trip with her. I knew that I had a little FU money and definitely had the FU skills, so I schemed to ask for a leave of absence thinking I might have my job back when I returned 6 months later. I was granted the 6 month leave with no guarantee that my job would be available when I got back. I was fine with that. "Live once or die trying"... So off we go to live in Manhattan - down town. I had no job or job prospects and my girlfriend wasn't making enough to support me and my bills as I still had a house at home. I busted tail doing odd jobs here and there and figuring out how to make it in the big city. "If you can make it here, you can make it anywhere!".  I ended up leaving to come home engaged to my girlfriend and with more money than I ever thought I would make. We probably would have stayed longer except I was being told that I still had my job waiting for me when I get home. Until 2 days before we were set to get on a plane to come home I got a voicemail telling me that my job was no longer available. I was bummed but was also armed with all my new knowledge and skills learned from NYC so I was excited to see what I could do at home. I started pounding the pavement when I got home doing odd jobs but it didn't translate as well as in NYC so I started looking for a job again. I learned that my previous company was sold to a new entity and that they were struggling to move all their systems over. I reached out and said that I could help make the transition go more smoothly since I had specific knowledge of the systems and people from the previous company. I said I want X$ to turn the operation around and they told me no. FU money allowed me to say "give me a call if you change your mind". 2 days later I got a call "when can you start?". I started right away and walked in to see my previous boss (who didn't tell me that my job was no longer available to me until last minute) packing up his office because they didn't hire him over. What a great feeling!

I ended up working for the new company for another 6 years. During that time they hired a basically abusive manager and a narcissistic psychopath steroidal VP over him.  The VP figured he was king and would do whatever he wanted. This guy showed up in a corporate environment on Halloween as a gladiator with a sword. Yes, a "cut your head off" sword. HR turned a blind eye. He would have poker tournaments where drugs were gambled (instead of money). HR turned a blind eye. On and on.. The expectations were unrealistic, the demands were unreal, and we were being reprimanded for not completing impossible tasks. I realized that the company was not big enough for the three of us so they needed to go, or I needed to go. I had the FU money to walk out clean but I liked my job and the people I worked with other than these two. These two made a lot of stupid mistakes so I started to look for opportunities to make a move and eventually one came. One of the guys that worked under me forwarded an email to me from the VP asking him to modify a tax record for the manager in photoshop so that he would qualify to purchase a new car. I smelled blood and quickly brought the evidence to HR knowing that they would have no choice but to walk the two of them out right then and there. I had a big grin on my face as they were called to HR and walked out of the building. I was promoted to the manager position and all was well for awhile. I later learned that the steroidal VP had a massive heart attack and died in his 40's. Was it karma? I don't know - you decide. I didn't like the guy, and he made my life hell, but I didn't wish death on him. The manager disappeared into the sunset.

I had the manager position for a number of years and all was well until they decided I was a better lead engineer than a manager so I was "promoted" down to lead engineer. I was upset about my "promotion demotion" and that was when things started to go south again. Leadership started taking the company in odd directions and people started to not work together any more and the environment started to become stale. I was upset with leadership again and decided it was time to go and considered taking my FU money and just leaving. I figured I would try to find a different job so as not to dig into my stache so much. I was lucky enough to find my dream job doing what I do best for people that value me and want me to be there. I was offered the position and accepted. I provisioned to give my old company 2 weeks notice but I never did. I transitioned knowledge to my coworkers who loosely knew what my plans were. I still thought the new job was too good to be true. After 1 week I started the new job and started calling in sick from the old job so that I could go back in the event that the new job was in fact too good to be true. After 2 weeks, the big boss of the old company happened to be in town to fire one of the guys on my team (not me). I drove in and pulled him aside and explained everything wrong with leadership and the company and IT in general. I put down my badge and walked out and never looked back.

I later found out that the boss that "promoted demoted" me was later "promoted demoted" herself. Funny how things work out in the long run.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: FIPurpose on March 14, 2019, 11:15:06 AM
@bigair360x That is a crazy ride. Great story!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: BicycleB on March 14, 2019, 10:49:33 PM
Epic first post, @bigair360x. Welcome to the forum.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: CindyBS on March 16, 2019, 02:07:41 PM
Not really "epic", but I did have a moment this week.

I started a new job 3 weeks ago that I quickly realized after starting that I had been misled.  Week one I thought I could last a year.  By week 2 I was sending out resumes.  This week went downhill very rapidly.  A probably arose, management became very difficult with me - especially when I didn't just become passive and take it.   By Wed. night I was very upset about the whole thing.  Thursday I worked through a very awkward day.  Thursday night I emailed the boss with a letter of resignation effective immediately and never went back.

It took a little time for me to "get over" my work ethic and the idea that what I was doing was wrong, but in the end I wasn't going to take it anymore if I didn't have to.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: BicycleB on March 16, 2019, 02:13:20 PM
That's epic enough for me. Well done, @CindyBS!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: iluvzbeach on March 16, 2019, 02:23:30 PM
That's epic enough for me. Well done, @CindyBS!

I totally agree. When you realize something isn’t right, it’s 100% better to cut bait and get out ASAP. Otherwise, after you’ve been there a while it begins to feel normal and acceptable. Nice job on just GTFO.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: markbike528CBX on March 16, 2019, 04:25:15 PM
  Week one I thought I could last a year.  By week 2 I was sending out resumes.  This week went downhill very rapidly. 

The pace of narrative sounds like:
“The first ten million years were the worst," said Marvin, "and the second ten million years, they were the worst too. The third ten million years I didn't enjoy at all. After that I went into a bit of a decline.”
― Douglas Adams, The Restaurant at the End of the Universe
found at: https://www.goodreads.com/quotes/316990-the-first-ten-million-years-were-the-worst-said-marvin

Good to hear that you listened to yourself and GTFO and didn't go into a bit of a decline.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Dicey on March 16, 2019, 04:34:07 PM
Enjoy your time off, @CindyBS! You've earned it!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: SwordGuy on March 16, 2019, 08:14:00 PM
Not really "epic", but I did have a moment this week.

I started a new job 3 weeks ago that I quickly realized after starting that I had been misled.  Week one I thought I could last a year.  By week 2 I was sending out resumes.  This week went downhill very rapidly.  A probably arose, management became very difficult with me - especially when I didn't just become passive and take it.   By Wed. night I was very upset about the whole thing.  Thursday I worked through a very awkward day.  Thursday night I emailed the boss with a letter of resignation effective immediately and never went back.

It took a little time for me to "get over" my work ethic and the idea that what I was doing was wrong, but in the end I wasn't going to take it anymore if I didn't have to.


And you were there such a short time that, unless you're applying for a job with a security clearance, you need never mention it on your resume at all.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Livingthedream55 on March 18, 2019, 10:41:32 AM
Not really "epic", but I did have a moment this week.

I started a new job 3 weeks ago that I quickly realized after starting that I had been misled.  Week one I thought I could last a year.  By week 2 I was sending out resumes.  This week went downhill very rapidly.  A probably arose, management became very difficult with me - especially when I didn't just become passive and take it.   By Wed. night I was very upset about the whole thing.  Thursday I worked through a very awkward day.  Thursday night I emailed the boss with a letter of resignation effective immediately and never went back.

It took a little time for me to "get over" my work ethic and the idea that what I was doing was wrong, but in the end I wasn't going to take it anymore if I didn't have to.


And you were there such a short time that, unless you're applying for a job with a security clearance, you need never mention it on your resume at all.
+1
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: saguaro on March 18, 2019, 11:46:51 AM
Not really "epic", but I did have a moment this week.

I started a new job 3 weeks ago that I quickly realized after starting that I had been misled.  Week one I thought I could last a year.  By week 2 I was sending out resumes.  This week went downhill very rapidly.  A probably arose, management became very difficult with me - especially when I didn't just become passive and take it.   By Wed. night I was very upset about the whole thing.  Thursday I worked through a very awkward day.  Thursday night I emailed the boss with a letter of resignation effective immediately and never went back.

It took a little time for me to "get over" my work ethic and the idea that what I was doing was wrong, but in the end I wasn't going to take it anymore if I didn't have to.
And you were there such a short time that, unless you're applying for a job with a security clearance, you need never mention it on your resume at all.
+1

Good job @CindyBS , when the job turns out that be so bad that 3 weeks later you are sending resumes, it's often better to cut loose than tough it out. 

I can relate to the feeling that I was doing something wrong in just up and leaving.  Years ago, I took a new job and by the 2nd week, it was apparent that I had been misled about the job.  Frankly my new boss was incompetent, she simply wanted someone to basically cover for her while she goofed off.  By the end of 2 weeks, I was informed that she hadn't gotten around to talking to me about my benefits because they were changing, next day I was looking at sending out resumes again.  Middle of week 3, did overtime into the evening because she waltzed in late and gave me a task just before quitting time when I had been sitting around all day.    Next day, she disappeared for most of the day so I took some initiative in learning about the job by asking my coworkers because she was often out of the office and when she was in, she didn't have time to "train" me.   Next and last day, I was chastised for "socializing" while she was out of the office, which was my attempt to learn about the job and told her so.   It was at that point, I clocked out for lunch, took a walk, made my decision, went back to collect some things from my desk without saying anything to anyone, walked out, got in the car and drove off.   I didn't even offer up a resignation letter, I was that pissed off and besides I figured the now ex-boss could figure it out.

Yep, it was not quite professional to just walk off, but they weren't exactly professional with me.  Never mentioned it on a resume.  Even when I applied to The Big Company nearly 3 years later.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: mm1970 on March 18, 2019, 12:19:13 PM
Not really "epic", but I did have a moment this week.

I started a new job 3 weeks ago that I quickly realized after starting that I had been misled.  Week one I thought I could last a year.  By week 2 I was sending out resumes.  This week went downhill very rapidly.  A probably arose, management became very difficult with me - especially when I didn't just become passive and take it.   By Wed. night I was very upset about the whole thing.  Thursday I worked through a very awkward day.  Thursday night I emailed the boss with a letter of resignation effective immediately and never went back.

It took a little time for me to "get over" my work ethic and the idea that what I was doing was wrong, but in the end I wasn't going to take it anymore if I didn't have to.
This is def epic.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: theSlowTurtle on March 18, 2019, 03:03:10 PM
Not really "epic", but I did have a moment this week.

I started a new job 3 weeks ago that I quickly realized after starting that I had been misled.  Week one I thought I could last a year.  By week 2 I was sending out resumes.  This week went downhill very rapidly.  A probably arose, management became very difficult with me - especially when I didn't just become passive and take it.   By Wed. night I was very upset about the whole thing.  Thursday I worked through a very awkward day.  Thursday night I emailed the boss with a letter of resignation effective immediately and never went back.

It took a little time for me to "get over" my work ethic and the idea that what I was doing was wrong, but in the end I wasn't going to take it anymore if I didn't have to.
I feel like this is just begging for more juicy details...
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: talltexan on March 21, 2019, 01:11:25 PM
Add me to the group of people who would like more textured detail w.r.t the word "misled".
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: CindyBS on March 24, 2019, 04:50:15 PM
It was a job working with kids with disabilities.  They were much more physically aggressive than I was led to believe in the interview.   Pretty sad situation overall. 

I've gone from feeling a rush and the thrill of raising a middle finger at the world to being pretty discouraged about the whole thing.  I'm very fortunate to have to cushion to do this, but now I am back into a difficult job search.  Sigh. 
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Fi(re) on the Farm on March 24, 2019, 05:30:36 PM
I thought I'd share an FU money story that is my mom's.   She was reliving it again to me, when I finally saw it for what it is:  an FU story. 

Now, I'll start by saying that mom did not actually have FU money, but she did eventually learn her worth in the market -- and that became her FU currency

Background:  Mom is widowed with 5 children to feed.  Money is extremely tight in the household.   Certified as a teacher, a teachers' strike makes finding a job impossible, so mom begins baking cakes and selling them to local restaurants.  After 5-6 months, she has 4-5 fancy restaurants on her daily rotation.  She's making 15-20 cakes and pies per day out of our home kitchen. 

One of her restaurants is a mob-run place at a racetrack.  She despises working with them because they treat her badly and wait weeks to pay her what she's owed -- very difficult when trying to buy supplies. There is a miscommunication over an error and the big boss mobster fires mom -- but makes the bookkeeper do it.  Mom was secretly relieved.  The mobsters were not professional and always ran on emotions. 

4 days later, the bookkeeper comes sniveling back and says the big boss wants her to come back and bake the desserts again. Mom raises the price on some of her desserts and then says she never wants to have to ask to get paid again.  All money is due at delivery or she's taking her cakes with her and never stepping foot inside again. 

I was about 11-12 when this happened, and I still remember the worry she had over how to pay bills and how empowered she was when she came home that day after setting her foot down.

That's just beautiful!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: nwa-non on April 02, 2019, 11:41:56 AM
Not exactly an FU story, but...

I bailed in January right after the holidays.  There were aspects of the job that were very off-putting (travel), but the important parts of the job were interesting and generally worthwhile.  The problem was everything else.  Endless meetings and conference calls for absolutely no reason.  Reams of useless make-work that did nothing but help the officer class substantiate to their superiors that they had firm control over everything. 

My direct manager was easily the best I have ever worked for, but like me he was a prisoner of the system.  I took pains to give them 2 weeks' notice, make the transition as easy as I could, spent time schooling up someone who could fill in for me and left on cordial terms.  To this day I don't think they have any idea why I left.

This is what drives me insane! The enormous rates that my employer bills me out to HAS to be justified my inanities that are borderline insane. Being busy for the sake of looking/being busy.

I wish I had the courage to walk off. I've brought down the OMY syndrome to 5 more months. Almost every day I look at the number of days left
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: CindyBS on April 05, 2019, 06:31:46 AM
Not really "epic", but I did have a moment this week.

I started a new job 3 weeks ago that I quickly realized after starting that I had been misled.  Week one I thought I could last a year.  By week 2 I was sending out resumes.  This week went downhill very rapidly.  A probably arose, management became very difficult with me - especially when I didn't just become passive and take it.   By Wed. night I was very upset about the whole thing.  Thursday I worked through a very awkward day.  Thursday night I emailed the boss with a letter of resignation effective immediately and never went back.

It took a little time for me to "get over" my work ethic and the idea that what I was doing was wrong, but in the end I wasn't going to take it anymore if I didn't have to.
This is def epic.


****UPDATE*****

I am so, so happy I had both the FU money and courage to walk out of that situation. 

I just got hired for a different job - same number of hours.  Salary is more than twice the salary of the bad job!!   :-) 
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: RWD on April 05, 2019, 07:13:54 AM
Not really "epic", but I did have a moment this week.

I started a new job 3 weeks ago that I quickly realized after starting that I had been misled.  Week one I thought I could last a year.  By week 2 I was sending out resumes.  This week went downhill very rapidly.  A probably arose, management became very difficult with me - especially when I didn't just become passive and take it.   By Wed. night I was very upset about the whole thing.  Thursday I worked through a very awkward day.  Thursday night I emailed the boss with a letter of resignation effective immediately and never went back.

It took a little time for me to "get over" my work ethic and the idea that what I was doing was wrong, but in the end I wasn't going to take it anymore if I didn't have to.
This is def epic.

****UPDATE*****

I am so, so happy I had both the FU money and courage to walk out of that situation. 

I just got hired for a different job - same number of hours.  Salary is more than twice the salary of the bad job!!   :-)

Nice, congrats!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: MonkeyJenga on April 05, 2019, 07:24:01 AM
Whoo congrats Cindy!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Step37 on April 05, 2019, 08:10:59 AM
YAY @CindyBS!! That is so great! 😁
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: partgypsy on April 05, 2019, 10:11:22 AM
My mother has some hilarious stories of a series of jobs she had after moving away from teaching community college, and trying to get a job with higher salary and benefits. Like one she thought was just kind of new age, but it was actually some kind of cult. The cafeteria was vegetarian and you cleaned your own bowl afterwards and they did some kind of ritual before eating. And one where she was hired to be an assistant to a broker, but they thought she was good enough and they had to take a test and she was on her way to becoming a broker herself when she thought, what the hell am I doing? She didn't have confidence in herself and dropped out of the program. And one where she was an employee, but she spent so much time explaining and teaching the software to the other middle aged ladies, they thought she was a computer whiz and- fired their only IT person (who not only installed the software but also dealt with hardware issues) and changed her title to IT person. As she was just an ordinary person with no IT background, that did not end well.
Another one she was a salesperson for educational software to companies. She actually ended up doing really well, because her background was as an English teacher and she could explain in regular language (versus tech or sales langauge) what the software did and how it could help their company. She became too successful, so the owner kept switching her region to give her region to less successful people after she made the original sales, invite himself to her sales pitches and when they got the sale say that he was the person who got the commission, not her.

The one I was reminded of was, she got hired to work as a teacher in a closed mental health facility, teens. They told her as part of her job, that she had to participate in "take downs". (i.e. if a teen gets agitated, violent, that she as the teacher would need to restrain or "take them down"). (she's an out of shape, middle aged lady, a grandmother at that point).  She said no, she doesn't agree to do this.  Within the first month one of her students became violent. Rather than participating in a "take down" she ended up talking him down and no force was needed. However, since she did not do a "take down", they administration put a note in her work record. At that point she said thanks but no thanks (and you people are nuts!). 
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: mm1970 on April 05, 2019, 01:06:36 PM
Not really "epic", but I did have a moment this week.

I started a new job 3 weeks ago that I quickly realized after starting that I had been misled.  Week one I thought I could last a year.  By week 2 I was sending out resumes.  This week went downhill very rapidly.  A probably arose, management became very difficult with me - especially when I didn't just become passive and take it.   By Wed. night I was very upset about the whole thing.  Thursday I worked through a very awkward day.  Thursday night I emailed the boss with a letter of resignation effective immediately and never went back.

It took a little time for me to "get over" my work ethic and the idea that what I was doing was wrong, but in the end I wasn't going to take it anymore if I didn't have to.
This is def epic.


****UPDATE*****

I am so, so happy I had both the FU money and courage to walk out of that situation. 

I just got hired for a different job - same number of hours.  Salary is more than twice the salary of the bad job!!   :-)
so awesome
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Alfred J Quack on April 05, 2019, 01:39:43 PM
Posting to follow.

My current employer is reasonable (management goes every which way but my boss and his boss keep us on a more than reasonable track).

The only FU like thing that happened to me was after I got fired from a part-time job in a supermarket (at 17) because the manager claimed he saw me smoking pot in a cafe at night the day before. Which was impossible because I was working at the time he claimed. And since I had to work until 23:00 it was unreasonable to expect me to be back at 6:00. They did this a couple of times even though I said they shouldn't because I was prone to oversleeping, even a special 80dB alarm couldn't wake me.
So I go home, not quite bothered because at 17 I could find a job in 2 days, maybe 3.

I had indeed landed a job after a few interviews at several temp agencies. I was working in a freezer cell, packing premade lunches for 6f an hour (about 3$). When I was done on the first day I walked out and never went back because I got a call to work at McDonalds.
On the plus, I wasn't cold anymore, just hot. On the downside, they paid me 5,50 an hour.

Incidentally, my mom sent a vicious letter to the supermarket corporate after we received a questionnaire because of my resignation. She detailed all the things they did wrong like letti g a minor work past his maximum time, too many hours, ignoring mandatory break time between 2 consecutive shifts (at least 10 hours for a minor).
Everything was in their systems because they used time cards. I walk in a couple of months later and chat with a former coworker. Appearently the team leader, and his assistant (who fired me) had been relocated to locations far away for our standards. We never heard back about the letter to corporate but I suspect they did the transfer because of it.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Taran Wanderer on April 05, 2019, 09:19:05 PM
Posting to follow.

My current employer is reasonable (management goes every which way but my boss and his boss keep us on a more than reasonable track).

The only FU like thing that happened to me was after I got fired from a part-time job in a supermarket (at 17) because the manager claimed he saw me smoking pot in a cafe at night the day before. Which was impossible because I was working at the time he claimed. And since I had to work until 23:00 it was unreasonable to expect me to be back at 6:00. They did this a couple of times even though I said they shouldn't because I was prone to oversleeping, even a special 80dB alarm couldn't wake me.
So I go home, not quite bothered because at 17 I could find a job in 2 days, maybe 3.

I had indeed landed a job after a few interviews at several temp agencies. I was working in a freezer cell, packing premade lunches for 6f an hour (about 3$). When I was done on the first day I walked out and never went back because I got a call to work at McDonalds.
On the plus, I wasn't cold anymore, just hot. On the downside, they paid me 5,50 an hour.

Incidentally, my mom sent a vicious letter to the supermarket corporate after we received a questionnaire because of my resignation. She detailed all the things they did wrong like letti g a minor work past his maximum time, too many hours, ignoring mandatory break time between 2 consecutive shifts (at least 10 hours for a minor).
Everything was in their systems because they used time cards. I walk in a couple of months later and chat with a former coworker. Appearently the team leader, and his assistant (who fired me) had been relocated to locations far away for our standards. We never heard back about the letter to corporate but I suspect they did the transfer because of it.

And justice is served!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Alfred J Quack on April 06, 2019, 03:02:34 PM
@Taran Wanderer, presumably ;)

But writing the previous story made me realise that we actually do have a somewhat epic story.

DW was working for one of the larger healthcare organisations in the city who provide care for the elderly (at home or institutionalised). She started working with a 1 year contract which has a 1 month trial period and a 1 month notice-period (2 for the employer but only with signature by a judge, local law).

She was supposed to receive training for one week, and be surpless for the 2nd so that she could tag along with more experienced colleagues. But, healthcare being healthcare, she had to start fulltime on the workfloor from day one including responsibilities where lower qualified personel called her in case of questions, emergencies etc. 29 days after starting she gets called into the office, her work is sub-par (well duh!) and colleagues have been complaining (without specifying about what). They were going to extend her trial period by one month after which she was no longer welcome (i.e. she was let go during her trial period).

She came home, quite distressed and I told her I would handle it. Since DW is foreing the language is a barrier so the legal terms would have been difficult for her. I called her HR contact, said my piece in a reasonable way and basically told them "you can't do this, it's unlawful, and fix it". They denied in all vehemence that what they did was unlawful and that my wife being foreing was the source of the whole problem (her language skills were appearently the problem, her previous employers lauded her attempts and had no problem that her grammar was often a bit off as long as she could make the meaning clear).
I had a few back and forths with them, they wouldn't budge. So, I called a lawyer and asked them how much to handle this, 600,- for a few letters and at least another 600,- again if it goes to court. 600,- isn't a big deal for us but for someone in my wife's job (often parttime, unwilling to confront and dependent on the income and frequently single moms too) that's quite a sum without any guaranteed prospect of returns. I said go for it. The lawyer had a nice back and forth with HR.

Meanwhile my wife is in her last week. HR or the manager was putting on airs and she had to work 6 days, one until 23:00, starting the next at 7:00 and that for all consecutive workdays (she had 3 of those days the past month and their union agreement states that such a shift may only occur once every 14 days). I called her HR again and said that if they didn't change it, we would report them. I also implied that my wife wasn't feeling well and might call in sick (which had serious repercussions if she left the workforce sick, as in they had to keep on paying sickleave for up to 10 years if she was unable to work).
They changed the shifts to all late shifts, annoying but OK. Salarywise, my wife didn't need to work (my base salary was more than enough for living cost) so we didn't apply for unemployment. Unemployment has some very annoying rules and my wife didn't want to go through that again. Also, there was a risk that we had to return the unemployment money if the lawyer didn't do a good job and ended the contract in the wrong way.

1 month later, DW had the same job with a different employer at a close-by town/village ;P The lawyer had an offer from the previous employer entailing that they would pay one more month of salary, it should have been the 10 month still left in the contract BUT my wife would have to remain "available" in case te employer folded and let het finish the contract. So, I told the lawyer that we wanted 2 months as a final offer (matching the employer notice period) and otherwise we would go to court and I told the lawyer specifically to mention that as well. They accepted.

For me this was a case of principle and I would have taken them to court, regardless of the outcome or cost. They are a fairly big company and know how the rules work. They knowingly transgressed and played ignorant which appearently works and I figured it should stop. What also played a major part is that they advertise that they desperately needed people, women returning to the workplace after the kids left home (education included) were more than welcome. But when my wife was hired, all promisses went out the window (even the mandatory training and re-certification one) and they basically walked all over her.
Realistically, they won't change their ways but at least they got bitten by their own stupidity.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: SwordGuy on April 06, 2019, 03:22:37 PM
For me this was a case of principle and I would have taken them to court, regardless of the outcome or cost. They are a fairly big company and know how the rules work. They knowingly transgressed and played ignorant which appearently works and I figured it should stop.

On behalf of helpless and downtrodden employees everywhere, thank you.   People need to stick together.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: AO1FireTo on April 06, 2019, 07:01:48 PM
For me this was a case of principle and I would have taken them to court, regardless of the outcome or cost. They are a fairly big company and know how the rules work. They knowingly transgressed and played ignorant which appearently works and I figured it should stop.

On behalf of helpless and downtrodden employees everywhere, thank you.   People need to stick together.

Yes Bravo for making taking them on.  Sounds like a good use of FU money to me.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: ducky19 on April 22, 2019, 12:54:20 PM
Posting up my DW's story. My wife is a preschool teacher at a private center. She's been working for this place since last August, and has been miserable nearly the entire time. She has been labeled by her boss (the owner) as "confrontational". When asked why, she claimed it was because she questioned the practice of the boss sending out a group text each night with the next day's schedule, then requiring everyone in the group text to reply to the group text. They held it against her for not updating the Facebook site for months, even though she told them back in August that she didn't have admin rights and that they needed to grant those to her if they wanted her to update it (never happened). Since she is salaried, any time off had to be made up - fine. But she was only allowed to count certain hours, the majority of the extra time she put in was not considered eligible. The final straw came yesterday though when she was called into her boss' office and told she was being written up for "missing too much time". Her boss had documented all of the time she claimed my wife missed, but would not let her leave with the sheet without signing it. My wife wanted to cross reference it with her own records and refused to sign it, so they finally gave her a copy. She came home at lunch and found numerous errors/discrepancies that she produced documentation for and copied to the back of the sheet (so it couldn't be misplaced). She took it back into her boss and said, "here is the form, I've attached corrections on the back and signed it, and the sheet below it is my resignation". Her boss wouldn't even look at her and just said, "ok". My wife said, "I'll give you two weeks notice, but I will understand if you don't want it and will leave today if you prefer". Her boss, still not looking at her, said "ok". My wife said, "so.... which do you prefer?" and was finally told she'll take the two weeks. It sucks for my wife's coworkers, because the boss won't hire anyone else and will just expect them to fill in for her. She's already gotten a lot of supportive texts from her coworkers and parents, so she feels validated that not everyone thought she was doing a terrible job (even had some tears from some of her coworkers). I feel for them, but DW has to do what's right for her. She already had another job offer, but we could survive indefinitely without her pay. Just glad she finally put an end to putting up with this one's shit!

Came here for some inspiration today (after Easter Monday blah's), and realized I have an update for my DW's story. She recently interviewed for and was hired for a part time special education early childhood position at the next town over (less than ten minutes from home). She doesn't start until August, but she's been in touch with the assistant in the room and the current teacher and will go in and job shadow some this spring yet. She was super excited to find a part time position as it allows her to be available for our kids' appointments (orthodontist, etc.) and her mom's appointments (lives with us and has regular doctor visits). She will still have her summers off but be able to have her pay spread over 12 months like a normal teacher - best of both worlds! I'm super happy for her, now just need to find a replacement gig for me...  ;)
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: CowboyAndIndian on April 22, 2019, 12:57:57 PM
Posting up my DW's story. My wife is a preschool teacher at a private center. She's been working for this place since last August, and has been miserable nearly the entire time. She has been labeled by her boss (the owner) as "confrontational". When asked why, she claimed it was because she questioned the practice of the boss sending out a group text each night with the next day's schedule, then requiring everyone in the group text to reply to the group text. They held it against her for not updating the Facebook site for months, even though she told them back in August that she didn't have admin rights and that they needed to grant those to her if they wanted her to update it (never happened). Since she is salaried, any time off had to be made up - fine. But she was only allowed to count certain hours, the majority of the extra time she put in was not considered eligible. The final straw came yesterday though when she was called into her boss' office and told she was being written up for "missing too much time". Her boss had documented all of the time she claimed my wife missed, but would not let her leave with the sheet without signing it. My wife wanted to cross reference it with her own records and refused to sign it, so they finally gave her a copy. She came home at lunch and found numerous errors/discrepancies that she produced documentation for and copied to the back of the sheet (so it couldn't be misplaced). She took it back into her boss and said, "here is the form, I've attached corrections on the back and signed it, and the sheet below it is my resignation". Her boss wouldn't even look at her and just said, "ok". My wife said, "I'll give you two weeks notice, but I will understand if you don't want it and will leave today if you prefer". Her boss, still not looking at her, said "ok". My wife said, "so.... which do you prefer?" and was finally told she'll take the two weeks. It sucks for my wife's coworkers, because the boss won't hire anyone else and will just expect them to fill in for her. She's already gotten a lot of supportive texts from her coworkers and parents, so she feels validated that not everyone thought she was doing a terrible job (even had some tears from some of her coworkers). I feel for them, but DW has to do what's right for her. She already had another job offer, but we could survive indefinitely without her pay. Just glad she finally put an end to putting up with this one's shit!

Came here for some inspiration today (after Easter Monday blah's), and realized I have an update for my DW's story. She recently interviewed for and was hired for a part time special education early childhood position at the next town over (less than ten minutes from home). She doesn't start until August, but she's been in touch with the assistant in the room and the current teacher and will go in and job shadow some this spring yet. She was super excited to find a part time position as it allows her to be available for our kids' appointments (orthodontist, etc.) and her mom's appointments (lives with us and has regular doctor visits). She will still have her summers off but be able to have her pay spread over 12 months like a normal teacher - best of both worlds! I'm super happy for her, now just need to find a replacement gig for me...  ;)

Awesome.
FU money meant she got the better job!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Sugaree on April 25, 2019, 02:40:02 PM
It's interesting reading this stories. Does this happen because there is no social welfare? do not people receive some kind of support the first months they are jobless?

There are unemployment benefits.  But you usually don't qualify if you quit or get fired for cause.  Your former employer can and, in many cases, will fight you for it. 
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Buffaloski Boris on April 25, 2019, 03:47:29 PM
Inspiring stories. But from a different perspective. They inspire me to encourage my kids to be entrepreneurs. If you work for yourself and hate your boss, then who’s to blame for that?
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: RyanAtTanagra on April 25, 2019, 04:12:33 PM
Inspiring stories. But from a different perspective. They inspire me to encourage my kids to be entrepreneurs. If you work for yourself and hate your boss, then who’s to blame for that?

In that case all your customers/clients are your boss, and FU money could give you the power to say it to one of them and still be able to handle the loss of business.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: SwordGuy on April 25, 2019, 04:44:24 PM
Inspiring stories. But from a different perspective. They inspire me to encourage my kids to be entrepreneurs. If you work for yourself and hate your boss, then who’s to blame for that?

In that case all your customers/clients are your boss, and FU money could give you the power to say it to one of them and still be able to handle the loss of business.

Yes!!!!   This!!!!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Unique User on April 26, 2019, 06:02:49 AM
Inspiring stories. But from a different perspective. They inspire me to encourage my kids to be entrepreneurs. If you work for yourself and hate your boss, then who’s to blame for that?

In that case all your customers/clients are your boss, and FU money could give you the power to say it to one of them and still be able to handle the loss of business.

Agree!  We lived in a fancy pants ski resort several years back and owned a small catering/private chef company (mostly just us).  The first couple years were super tough, but our last couple years we turned down business.  The politician's wife that was just unpleasant and never tipped - we were busy the next couple times she called.  The very well known celebrity that called and had multiple requirements for us to be his personal chef - husband told the assistant that it sounded like too much of a hassle and to call someone else.  Anyone that called about a wedding - we'd tell them that we were sorry, but we don't cater weddings. 
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: CowboyAndIndian on April 26, 2019, 08:00:18 AM
Inspiring stories. But from a different perspective. They inspire me to encourage my kids to be entrepreneurs. If you work for yourself and hate your boss, then who’s to blame for that?

In that case all your customers/clients are your boss, and FU money could give you the power to say it to one of them and still be able to handle the loss of business.

Agree!  We lived in a fancy pants ski resort several years back and owned a small catering/private chef company (mostly just us).  The first couple years were super tough, but our last couple years we turned down business.  The politician's wife that was just unpleasant and never tipped - we were busy the next couple times she called.  The very well known celebrity that called and had multiple requirements for us to be his personal chef - husband told the assistant that it sounded like too much of a hassle and to call someone else.  Anyone that called about a wedding - we'd tell them that we were sorry, but we don't cater weddings.

Awesome. FU money at work!!
I like it that you told the assistant that it was too much hassle. Hopefully, it got back to the celebrity.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Montecarlo on April 29, 2019, 05:29:22 AM
Following
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Montecarlo on April 29, 2019, 06:53:56 AM
Just to keep this thread going...

Background: I work in a field services organization with two corporate offices in two states.  I started working as a data bitch for the CEO at corporate office A before office B was opened near his home, where I was relocated there.  I hated the weather and increasingly disliked working for the CEO.  He is a smart guy, but prone to outbursts, easily agitated, makes vague requests and is unhappy despite multiple genuine attempts to fulfill them and multiple revisions... and I was treated better than most people there.  He also had a severely dysfunctional relationship with the CFO, and we have a new ownership group and new board of directors.


So I politic myself into getting a role leading a department where I knew the current director was about to be fired.  The guy they had slated to take over didn't want the job, so it wasn't too hard to get it and a nice raise along with it.  Most of the staff was at office A, but I would stay at office B.  I have frequently gossiped with the CFOs minion about what a nutcase the CEO is, and it must have gotten back to the CFO.  We wind up having drinks.

CFO: Won't you do a better job in office A?
Me: Yes, but CEO, I'm a wussy pants, waah waah
CFO: If you want to move to office A, I will make it happen.
Me: How?
CFO:  I'll tell CEO, Monte is moving to office A.  That's it.
Me: What if CEO flips out and wants to fire me?
CFO: I won't let that happen.

I did want to move.  Better weather (gulf summers suck, omg, give me northern winter any day over gulf summer), friends, no pyscho bosses.  But I was worried.  I thought the CFO was using me to weaken the CEO, I figured I would now be considered politically aligned with CFO and an enemy of the state.  But I also had a big stash of FU money, even though I didn't think of it that way.

I think it over a few weeks and tell CFO I want to move.  The CEOs right hand man calls me in for a chat, which was awkward but polite.  A few months later I am relocated back to office A.  Life continues, no drama or fallout.

I got a little worried when the board shot the CFO, figuring that may spell the end for me.  But then I remembered - I have an EVEN BIGGER FU stash than I had before.

So far no fallout.  I've seen the CEO a couple times since then.  He's kind of forgot about me.  If you're not in his presence on a daily basis, you basically don't exist.  Which is pretty f'ing awesome right now.  I'm flying under the radar, making tons of $$$ and stashing it.  I'm working my ass off, but my overworked boss back in office B barely has time to oversee anything I do.  I basically run autonomously and can get shit done the right way for a company that has been good to me, but also am secure that I can walk out or get shot anytime and still be okay.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Farmgirl on April 29, 2019, 10:53:42 AM
These stories are so inspirational.  Keep 'em coming!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Candace on April 29, 2019, 11:14:27 AM
Just to keep this thread going...

Background: I work in a field services organization with two corporate offices in two states.  I started working as a data bitch for the CEO at corporate office A before office B was opened near his home, where I was relocated there.  I hated the weather and increasingly disliked working for the CEO.  He is a smart guy, but prone to outbursts, easily agitated, makes vague requests and is unhappy despite multiple genuine attempts to fulfill them and multiple revisions... and I was treated better than most people there.  He also had a severely dysfunctional relationship with the CFO, and we have a new ownership group and new board of directors.


So I politic myself into getting a role leading a department where I knew the current director was about to be fired.  The guy they had slated to take over didn't want the job, so it wasn't too hard to get it and a nice raise along with it.  Most of the staff was at office A, but I would stay at office B.  I have frequently gossiped with the CFOs minion about what a nutcase the CEO is, and it must have gotten back to the CFO.  We wind up having drinks.

CFO: Won't you do a better job in office A?
Me: Yes, but CEO, I'm a wussy pants, waah waah
CFO: If you want to move to office A, I will make it happen.
Me: How?
CFO:  I'll tell CEO, Monte is moving to office A.  That's it.
Me: What if CEO flips out and wants to fire me?
CFO: I won't let that happen.

I did want to move.  Better weather (gulf summers suck, omg, give me northern winter any day over gulf summer), friends, no pyscho bosses.  But I was worried.  I thought the CFO was using me to weaken the CEO, I figured I would now be considered politically aligned with CFO and an enemy of the state.  But I also had a big stash of FU money, even though I didn't think of it that way.

I think it over a few weeks and tell CFO I want to move.  The CEOs right hand man calls me in for a chat, which was awkward but polite.  A few months later I am relocated back to office A.  Life continues, no drama or fallout.

I got a little worried when the board shot the CFO, figuring that may spell the end for me.  But then I remembered - I have an EVEN BIGGER FU stash than I had before.

So far no fallout.  I've seen the CEO a couple times since then.  He's kind of forgot about me.  If you're not in his presence on a daily basis, you basically don't exist.  Which is pretty f'ing awesome right now.  I'm flying under the radar, making tons of $$$ and stashing it.  I'm working my ass off, but my overworked boss back in office B barely has time to oversee anything I do.  I basically run autonomously and can get shit done the right way for a company that has been good to me, but also am secure that I can walk out or get shot anytime and still be okay.
This is a fantastic story. May you continue to be badass.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: MoMan on May 02, 2019, 09:26:32 AM
Here’s my epic FU money story:

Over summer break during school I stayed at the college town to work and hang with friends. One of my 2 PT jobs was “barback” at a high volume night club. That meant I ran clean glassware and restocked booze for the bartenders, and they in turn were supposed to give us a cut of their tips—always a screw job. It was super crowded and we literally were given whistles to manage our way through the crowds carrying racks of glasses above our heads.

The job was shitty enough without additional BS but the two proverbial straws came when the elevators broke down. You see, when the bar closed at 2 a.m. we barbacks were responsible for rounding up all the 50-gallon trash bins full of half-empty beer, discarded appetizers, sometimes vomit, and all manner of nastiness. After 7 straight hours of 200 people slamming drinks, there would be a couple dozen of these heavily loaded, reeking containers. We would drag them down the hall and onto the freight elevator to the loading dock and empty them. We informed the boss that the elevator wasn’t working and asked if we could return the next day to finish the task, to which he agreed. Then his partner found out and reversed that decision. So we had to drag these heavy foul containers up two flights of stairs, sloshing their contents all over our clothes. I was pissed but too exhausted to protest any more.

The next evening I showed up for my scheduled shift and clocked in at 5:00 to start prepping (i.e. thawing) the crappy free appetizers for the evening crowd. The place was nearly empty because most people wouldn’t start arriving for a couple of hours. About 15 minutes into my shift, one of the owners instructs me to punch out and sit around until things pick up. Wait, so you want me clock out, sit on my ass unpaid for an hour so you can save $5? So I clock out, take a seat and wait until things get nice and busy, then clock in again. When things get to full volume I walk up to one of the deusch bags, hand him my apron and said, “I quit.”
D-Bag: “How about if you just finish your shift?”
M: “No thanks”

It felt fucking great! I lined up another job within a week or two.

As an aside: One of the other jobs we barbacks did was bathroom attendant. This place was really attempting to look like a high end venue, so we would sit on a stool and hand people towels for when they wash their hands. We also offered an array of a half-dozen colognes to use complimentary. At first glance, this seemed like an unsavory role, but I immediately realized that I got to keep all the tips that I received. It was much more lucrative, even though a lot of dicks hang out there (sorry, couldn’t resist!).
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Montecarlo on May 02, 2019, 01:03:42 PM
Nice story!  I always hated bathroom attendants.  Made me feel guilty for not tipping whenever I had to take a piss.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: haflander on May 02, 2019, 01:16:26 PM
+1. I had to explain this phenomenon to my gf, she didn't know it was a Thing. We went to a dueling piano and rowdy country bar with a cover and bathroom attendant. Who would think those could all be the same place??

Go to the bathroom. See that there is a bathroom attendant. Sigh. Do your business. Approach the sink. Guy turns on water...um, ok. Wet your hands. Guy points soap thing at you and squeezes it out into your hand...um, ok. Wash your hands. Guy turns off water, I guess he thinks I had enough...um, ok. Guy gives you paper towels...um, ok. Mumble "thanks" and run while avoiding eye contact and a tip.

Of course this is with 10 other guys in the bathroom shuffling around each other. Oh, and as mentioned, there's this big thing of cologne and candy to choose from.

The whole thing is cringe-worthy. Won't be going back there anytime soon. /r
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Cool Friend on May 02, 2019, 01:22:56 PM
I always thought bathroom attendants existed to make sure you're not doing drugs or banging in there.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: jps on May 02, 2019, 03:34:52 PM
+1. I had to explain this phenomenon to my gf, she didn't know it was a Thing. We went to a dueling piano and rowdy country bar with a cover and bathroom attendant. Who would think those could all be the same place??

Go to the bathroom. See that there is a bathroom attendant. Sigh. Do your business. Approach the sink. Guy turns on water...um, ok. Wet your hands. Guy points soap thing at you and squeezes it out into your hand...um, ok. Wash your hands. Guy turns off water, I guess he thinks I had enough...um, ok. Guy gives you paper towels...um, ok. Mumble "thanks" and run while avoiding eye contact and a tip.

Of course this is with 10 other guys in the bathroom shuffling around each other. Oh, and as mentioned, there's this big thing of cologne and candy to choose from.

The whole thing is cringe-worthy. Won't be going back there anytime soon. /r

This sounds really uncomfortable.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Buffaloski Boris on May 02, 2019, 06:26:19 PM
I think I remember reading this somewhere here but it is a great reminder to get the FU money going immediately in life. 


https://www.thebillfold.com/2016/01/a-story-of-a-fuck-off-fund/

That’s a nice story. One I might read to DD. Without the profanity; it’s a Freedom Unlimited fund after all.😁
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Montecarlo on May 02, 2019, 06:40:18 PM
I think I remember reading this somewhere here but it is a great reminder to get the FU money going immediately in life. 


https://www.thebillfold.com/2016/01/a-story-of-a-fuck-off-fund/

That’s a nice story. One I might read to DD. Without the profanity; it’s a Freedom Unlimited fund after all.😁

Nice!  Every young woman needs to read that.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Buffaloski Boris on May 02, 2019, 06:52:37 PM
I think I remember reading this somewhere here but it is a great reminder to get the FU money going immediately in life. 


https://www.thebillfold.com/2016/01/a-story-of-a-fuck-off-fund/

That’s a nice story. One I might read to DD. Without the profanity; it’s a Freedom Unlimited fund after all.😁

Nice!  Every young woman needs to read that.

It’s a great story. I told it to my DD as a bedtime story, with appropriate editing of course. 😁
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: AMandM on May 03, 2019, 07:26:50 AM
The whole thing is cringe-worthy. Won't be going back there anytime soon. /r

OTOH, I've been to many places, mostly in Europe, where bathroom attendants are not cringe-worthy and not part of a would-be "classy" decor. The vibe is more janitor than Jeeves. They clean the toilet and wipe the sink after each customer.

But I've also been to one where part of the attendant's job was to hand each visitor a few sheets of toilet paper. I've always wondered what happens if you discover you need more....
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Sugaree on May 03, 2019, 08:17:36 AM
I'm not Christian, but I didn't realize that men who wear their Christian religions on their sleeves looked down on women.  I thought that would be somehow... not Christ-like?  Fascinating
Like most faiths, a lot of what goes on in the name of "religion" is really just old tribal values propagating themselves into new generations. The actual tenets of the religion are largely forgotten in favor of the cultural norms that people grew up with, which get conflated with "good Christian1 values" from an early age . This is a prime example of how children learn by what those around them do, more than what they say.

(1 insert name of religion here)

Y’all are painting with broad brushes. It all depends on the Christian (or Buddhist, or Hindu, or Muslim, or what have you.) People use all sorts of reasons for excusing their misbehavior.

I’m not much into “wearing my Christianity on my sleeve” however the sort of blanket statements that Christians are sexist, misogynist, backbiting, hypocritical, or intrinsically evil really do become tedious after awhile.

Those are Christers.  There's a difference.  Sadly the Christers seem, at least vocally, to outnumber the Christians these days.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: RyanAtTanagra on May 03, 2019, 11:23:37 AM
Can we please not devolve this thread into an argument about religion
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Abe Froman on May 03, 2019, 12:00:20 PM
Can we please not devolve this thread into an argument about religion

-erm... AMEN Brother!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: ducky19 on May 03, 2019, 03:54:34 PM
The whole thing is cringe-worthy. Won't be going back there anytime soon. /r

OTOH, I've been to many places, mostly in Europe, where bathroom attendants are not cringe-worthy and not part of a would-be "classy" decor. The vibe is more janitor than Jeeves. They clean the toilet and wipe the sink after each customer.

But I've also been to one where part of the attendant's job was to hand each visitor a few sheets of toilet paper. I've always wondered what happens if you discover you need more....

I guess at that point, you choose between handing the fella a bill to get a few more squares or just wiping your ass with the bill...
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Just Joe on May 03, 2019, 08:23:43 PM
If the attendant is keeping the bathroom clean then I'm all for it. If the attendant is there to turn on my water and hand me a towel - then no thanks, I can do that myself.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: DadJokes on May 08, 2019, 09:03:41 AM
Minor story to keep this thread on the first page:

My wife is finishing her fifth year as an elementary teacher. She, from my biased perspective, has done a good job. Her students do well, parents don't complain about her, and she has helped to integrate more technology use in the school. When asked what she would like to do next year, she requested that she remain in the same grade, teaching the same subject. Despite this, she was told yesterday (on teacher appreciation day no less) that she will be moving grades for the third time since she has been there. She came home in tears because she felt like the principals have no confidence in her teaching abilities. In the past, administration has moved teachers around as a means to get bad teachers to quit (easier than firing). The principals specifically told her that was not the reason she was being moved, but their actions speak louder than their words to me. Add to that the fact that every time you change grades, you have to get age appropriate resources for your new classroom, often with your own money. So she spent the evening in tears, not because of something a student did or something a parent said, but because she feels that her bosses have no confidence in her abilities.

I was able to convince her to go in today and tell them how she feels. Thanks to our FU money, she doesn't have to worry about losing her job, which gave her the confidence she needed to express her feelings regarding their decision. While she will still be moving, they will be working to get her additional grants to supply her new classroom with resources, and they are aware that another move will result in my wife quitting the job (though we would wait until the end of the summer to tell them as a final FU).

I wish I could convince her to walk away now, but she is terrified of change. She actually teaches at the same elementary school that she went to as a child. The only way she will leave this job is if it is to become a stay-at-home mom. We could afford that, but I'd rather not have to stop all retirement contributions for her to do so.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: AfricanMustache on May 08, 2019, 10:12:25 AM
Minor story to keep this thread on the first page:

My wife is finishing her fifth year as an elementary teacher. She, from my biased perspective, has done a good job. Her students do well, parents don't complain about her, and she has helped to integrate more technology use in the school. When asked what she would like to do next year, she requested that she remain in the same grade, teaching the same subject. Despite this, she was told yesterday (on teacher appreciation day no less) that she will be moving grades for the third time since she has been there. She came home in tears because she felt like the principals have no confidence in her teaching abilities. In the past, administration has moved teachers around as a means to get bad teachers to quit (easier than firing). The principals specifically told her that was not the reason she was being moved, but their actions speak louder than their words to me. Add to that the fact that every time you change grades, you have to get age appropriate resources for your new classroom, often with your own money. So she spent the evening in tears, not because of something a student did or something a parent said, but because she feels that her bosses have no confidence in her abilities.

I was able to convince her to go in today and tell them how she feels. Thanks to our FU money, she doesn't have to worry about losing her job, which gave her the confidence she needed to express her feelings regarding their decision. While she will still be moving, they will be working to get her additional grants to supply her new classroom with resources, and they are aware that another move will result in my wife quitting the job (though we would wait until the end of the summer to tell them as a final FU).

I wish I could convince her to walk away now, but she is terrified of change. She actually teaches at the same elementary school that she went to as a child. The only way she will leave this job is if it is to become a stay-at-home mom. We could afford that, but I'd rather not have to stop all retirement contributions for her to do so.

As they say, people don't quit their job, they quit their boss.

My wife has been coming home in tears for months, due to her boss treating her like cr@p. She was the hardest-working, most effective employee in the department since she started in her company. But her direct manager mistreated, micro-managed and abused her (in front of other colleagues) to the point where there was a complete breakdown in communication and cooperation - they didn't even greet each other in the mornings.

So a couple of months back I told her I think she should just quit. She had been working since she was 16 and couldn't quite get past the idea of feeling unproductive and putting her career on pause (work ethic can sometimes be our worst enemy). Since she was also studying towards a degree at the same time, I managed to convince her to see it as an opportunity to focus on her studies full time and be productive that way.

So she resigned last month and we're spending our first week actually together and not just seeing each other in passing due to our "hectic" work schedules. It has been bliss and we have connected like never before. And no more coming home with eyes thick from crying all day.

Although we don't yet have significant FU money in terms of savings/investments, the financial remodeling we've done on the expenses side since joining the MMM philosophy has made it possible for us to go single-income indefinitely and allowed her to upskill herself and fast-track her career when she's ready to do so.

Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: RyanAtTanagra on May 08, 2019, 10:43:04 AM
Although we don't yet have significant FU money in terms of savings/investments, the financial remodeling we've done on the expenses side since joining the MMM philosophy has made it possible for us to go single-income indefinitely and allowed her to upskill herself and fast-track her career when she's ready to do so.

Yep!  FU money doesn't necessarily mean savings.  When I hit a 50% savings rate, even with no real savings yet, I realized I could quit and get a job making literally half what I was making and be totally fine.  And I should EASILY be able to find a job making that.  It reduced my work stress immensely and shortly thereafter did quit the unpleasant job I had previously been stuck in, and took unemployment (which paid 50% my wage) for a few months to decompress, and it was one of the best and least stressful things I've ever done.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: zolotiyeruki on May 08, 2019, 10:45:22 AM
In the past, administration has moved teachers around as a means to get bad teachers to quit (easier than firing). The principals specifically told her that was not the reason she was being moved, but their actions speak louder than their words to me.
I know a few educators, and their biggest problems always stem from administration, whether it be on the school level, school district level, or state level.  The constant micromanaging and lack of trust has led many a teacher to resign.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: mm1970 on May 08, 2019, 11:24:55 AM
Minor story to keep this thread on the first page:

My wife is finishing her fifth year as an elementary teacher. She, from my biased perspective, has done a good job. Her students do well, parents don't complain about her, and she has helped to integrate more technology use in the school. When asked what she would like to do next year, she requested that she remain in the same grade, teaching the same subject. Despite this, she was told yesterday (on teacher appreciation day no less) that she will be moving grades for the third time since she has been there. She came home in tears because she felt like the principals have no confidence in her teaching abilities. In the past, administration has moved teachers around as a means to get bad teachers to quit (easier than firing). The principals specifically told her that was not the reason she was being moved, but their actions speak louder than their words to me. Add to that the fact that every time you change grades, you have to get age appropriate resources for your new classroom, often with your own money. So she spent the evening in tears, not because of something a student did or something a parent said, but because she feels that her bosses have no confidence in her abilities.

I was able to convince her to go in today and tell them how she feels. Thanks to our FU money, she doesn't have to worry about losing her job, which gave her the confidence she needed to express her feelings regarding their decision. While she will still be moving, they will be working to get her additional grants to supply her new classroom with resources, and they are aware that another move will result in my wife quitting the job (though we would wait until the end of the summer to tell them as a final FU).

I wish I could convince her to walk away now, but she is terrified of change. She actually teaches at the same elementary school that she went to as a child. The only way she will leave this job is if it is to become a stay-at-home mom. We could afford that, but I'd rather not have to stop all retirement contributions for her to do so.

I'm of two minds on this:
1.  It is true that this is how they get teachers to quit or retire.  We had a teacher who had been there for 40 years, and was long overdue for needing to retire.  She was ADD by then.  Luckily, my kid was very self motivated.  She also had a tough year as she took some time off to care for her ailing/dying father.  The principal decided to move her to a new grade, and she said no way.  So she retired.  I remember when the principal said she decided to retire (I'm on a committee).  I kind of rolled my eyes because I know he forced the issue.  But it was the right thing to do.  He's really good at hiring quality teachers.

2.  The other thing is that your wife is new.  The OTHER time that teachers get moved around is when they are new.  We have many veteran teachers at our elementary school, and a few newer ones (some young, some transfers).  Inevitably, when we need to reorganize because of enrollment (say, when we have one grade with 90 students, and one grade with only 40 students), the newer teachers are the ones that have to switch.

It doesn't mean they suck.  It means that, if you have a second grade with 3 classrooms of 30 students each, and a 3rd grade classroom of 2 classes with 25 students each...what happens the next year?  You need another 3rd grade teacher.  The veteran 2nd grade teachers get priority to keep their grade.  We've had several teachers move 2-3 times in the last 5 years because of this.  We've also hired 2 new teachers who have moved because they were originally subs for maternity leaves.  Then got pink slipped, but then someone retired, so they were rehired for a year, then got pink slipped, but then someone else moved into administration - so they were able to stay. 

I can think of one teacher who went from 2nd to 3rd to 2nd.  One that went from 2nd to 5th.  One that went from K to 3rd.  Two veteran teachers that basically swapped (4th/5th).  Plus we've ended up with partial classes the last 3 years - like combo K/1st or combo 5th/6th.  They try not to make the same teacher do a combo 2 years in a row, because it's hard.  It's not uncommon and doesn't mean they don't like her.  It is very stressful though.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: DadJokes on May 08, 2019, 11:55:08 AM
I can think of one teacher who went from 2nd to 3rd to 2nd.  One that went from 2nd to 5th.  One that went from K to 3rd.  Two veteran teachers that basically swapped (4th/5th).  Plus we've ended up with partial classes the last 3 years - like combo K/1st or combo 5th/6th.  They try not to make the same teacher do a combo 2 years in a row, because it's hard.  It's not uncommon and doesn't mean they don't like her.  It is very stressful though.

She has gone 5th to 2nd to 5th and now back to 2nd. At five years in, she may be junior, but she isn't even the most junior person in her current grade.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Laura33 on May 09, 2019, 06:22:36 AM
I can think of one teacher who went from 2nd to 3rd to 2nd.  One that went from 2nd to 5th.  One that went from K to 3rd.  Two veteran teachers that basically swapped (4th/5th).  Plus we've ended up with partial classes the last 3 years - like combo K/1st or combo 5th/6th.  They try not to make the same teacher do a combo 2 years in a row, because it's hard.  It's not uncommon and doesn't mean they don't like her.  It is very stressful though.

She has gone 5th to 2nd to 5th and now back to 2nd. At five years in, she may be junior, but she isn't even the most junior person in her current grade.

Listen to mm1970. 

When other people take actions that hurt you, there are almost always two possible interpretations:  yes, they were trying to hurt you for some reason; or no, they were thinking of their own concerns, and hurting you was just an unintended or unavoidable consequence.  Life tends to be happier when you assume option 2 until proven otherwise.  Added bonus:  that also tends to be true, as people tend to focus on what they need, not how their choice affects others.  As Dr. Phil says, you'd care a lot less about what other people think of you if you knew how infrequently they do.

Here, they are moving her back and forth between the same two grades!  That sounds very much like they need to make moves but are trying to minimize the negative impact on the teacher involved (at least she's done it before and has the materials and the syllabus and doesn't need to start from scratch, right?).  Seems like if they really wanted to make her so miserable that she leaves, they could have done a much better job of it without any additional effort.  So either they're really crappy at forcing people out, or they're not trying to.

Doesn't mean she needs to be happy about it, and she is entitled to walk at any time, for any reason.  But her decision shouldn't be driven by an unsupported assumption that is very likely not true.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: DadJokes on May 09, 2019, 06:44:59 AM
I've probably characterized things incorrectly when relaying information here. Based on her conversations with the principals since then, we don't believe they are moving her in an attempt to get her to quit. As I mentioned, she has done a lot to improve the school's use of technology, which is a surefire way to create some job security.

At this point, I am not frustrated with her administration's intent so much as their inability to realize what their decision would cause. Not only is the process frustrating for my wife, but there is a stigma with any teachers that are frequently moved around, which impacts how she will be treated by other teachers in the school.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: EricL on May 09, 2019, 09:31:07 AM
Eh.  It doesn't matter whether the administrators moved her out of necessity, ignorance or because they're pieces of shit.  The OP believes they had lousy motives.  You may have more teaching experience but since we're all not involved (and won't ever be) it doesn't hurt to roll with their interpretation.

In the interest of staying OT, here's a rework of a scene from The Gambler by James Collins originally done by John Goodman.  Goodman had a better delivery but Collins has better lines.

Edit: Would be a more interesting post If I actually posted the damn video  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eikbQPldhPY
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Car Jack on May 09, 2019, 09:51:15 AM
If you're FI, then she has the ability to go in on the first day of class and walk in to administration and give them a choice......"put me back in the grade I had or I am done right now.  You know I wanted to stay in my grade and moved me anyways.  I don't care what the logistics are....you have 5 seconds.".  And then, after 5 seconds, walk out and go home.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Rosy on May 09, 2019, 11:50:47 AM
I think I remember reading this somewhere here but it is a great reminder to get the FU money going immediately in life. 


https://www.thebillfold.com/2016/01/a-story-of-a-fuck-off-fund/

That’s a nice story. One I might read to DD. Without the profanity; it’s a Freedom Unlimited fund after all.😁

Nice!  Every young woman needs to read that.

It’s a great story. I told it to my DD as a bedtime story, with appropriate editing of course. 😁

So pleased to read a story about empowering women - we all need a freedom fund:) Interesting blog/site.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Psychstache on May 09, 2019, 04:42:52 PM
If you're FI, then she has the ability to go in on the first day of class and walk in to administration and give them a choice......"put me back in the grade I had or I am done right now.  You know I wanted to stay in my grade and moved me anyways.  I don't care what the logistics are....you have 5 seconds.".  And then, after 5 seconds, walk out and go home.

In most states, you sign a teaching contract in April/May for the upcoming school year. Breaching that contract on the 1st day of school is a violation that would allow the district to file against your teaching certificate which would be a big black mark for any future employment.

Probably best to keep this option as a fun nuclear fantasy unless you are pretty certain you have no desire to teach anymore.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Smokystache on May 09, 2019, 07:58:35 PM
... she was told yesterday (on teacher appreciation day no less) that she will be moving grades for the third time since she has been there. ...

I do not have any credible sources to back this up ... but I heard from some friends who are teachers (k-5 in the US) that if you are a new teacher to a grade then you get a "pass" if your students' average on state standardized tests was below state goals. Thus, principals in underperforming schools (due to a variety of potential reasons), would frequently switch teachers among grades in order to never get in trouble with the district/state.

No source for this, but this was one reason a co-worker's spouse believed why 90% of his elementary school's teachers were shifted to new grades every few years.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Kitsune on May 10, 2019, 07:11:01 AM
... she was told yesterday (on teacher appreciation day no less) that she will be moving grades for the third time since she has been there. ...

I do not have any credible sources to back this up ... but I heard from some friends who are teachers (k-5 in the US) that if you are a new teacher to a grade then you get a "pass" if your students' average on state standardized tests was below state goals. Thus, principals in underperforming schools (due to a variety of potential reasons), would frequently switch teachers among grades in order to never get in trouble with the district/state.

No source for this, but this was one reason a co-worker's spouse believed why 90% of his elementary school's teachers were shifted to new grades every few years.

And then teachers at 'underperforming' schools get to equip their classrooms at their own cost every few years, and therefore ensure that there are fewer resources (because what you accululate over 20 years doesn't match what you accumulate over 2 years...)... and then we wonder why, with new teachers, less funding, and fewer resources, it continues to underperform. I wonder. I have no idea. Someone run a study on this.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Threshkin on May 14, 2019, 06:41:01 PM
... she was told yesterday (on teacher appreciation day no less) that she will be moving grades for the third time since she has been there. ...

I do not have any credible sources to back this up ... but I heard from some friends who are teachers (k-5 in the US) that if you are a new teacher to a grade then you get a "pass" if your students' average on state standardized tests was below state goals. Thus, principals in underperforming schools (due to a variety of potential reasons), would frequently switch teachers among grades in order to never get in trouble with the district/state.

No source for this, but this was one reason a co-worker's spouse believed why 90% of his elementary school's teachers were shifted to new grades every few years.

And then teachers at 'underperforming' schools get to equip their classrooms at their own cost every few years, and therefore ensure that there are fewer resources (because what you accululate over 20 years doesn't match what you accumulate over 2 years...)... and then we wonder why, with new teachers, less funding, and fewer resources, it continues to underperform. I wonder. I have no idea. Someone run a study on this.

Yes!  We should divert funds from teacher salaries and classroom supplies to do this study.  Oh and we should replicate this study across multiple schools, districts, and grades to ensure we have "meaningful, representative and accurate" data.  Then we should run the study for several years to looks for trends! 
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Taran Wanderer on May 15, 2019, 12:26:51 AM
I'm not sure if this is an epic FU money story or a MPP (Mustachian People Problem), but I always wanted my own FU money story, so here goes...

I've been unhappy with some things at work.  I threatened to retire early.  I was serious.  I got some things fixed and a raise.

Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Alfred J Quack on May 15, 2019, 02:03:30 AM
I'm not sure if this is an epic FU money story or a MPP (Mustachian People Problem), but I always wanted my own FU money story, so here goes...

I've been unhappy with some things at work.  I threatened to retire early.  I was serious.  I got some things fixed and a raise.

Regardless of classification, I'd call that Epic. Well done :)
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: BicycleB on May 16, 2019, 12:05:31 PM
I'm not sure if this is an epic FU money story or a MPP (Mustachian People Problem), but I always wanted my own FU money story, so here goes...

I've been unhappy with some things at work.  I threatened to retire early.  I was serious.  I got some things fixed and a raise.

Regardless of classification, I'd call that Epic. Well done :)

Agree. EPIC!!!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: alcon835 on May 26, 2019, 04:03:27 PM
+1 for this whole thread. I am a huge fan! It took me about a month of reading this thread a few times a week to make it all the way through, but I'm finally here!

I've got a few FU money stories that I may post here at some point in the future once I can remember the more interesting details, haha.

I learned a few years ago that even better than an FU fund (which I have) is skills and good friends. I've worked hard to make friends with the folks I work with and those relationships at my last few jobs have left me with a friends in leadership roles that want me to join their teams if I ever become available. It's definitely a different kind of FU but has opened the door for me to take certain actions and say certain things that I would never have done otherwise! This has helped a lot in HR situations where I've been able to take a stand and risk loosing my job calling out generally protected people.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: SimpleLifer on June 09, 2019, 07:52:01 AM
My FU money empowered me to go to HR and report a Sr. Mgr who was insulting the women on the team, but the final straw was when he told a meek-mannered Indian woman, "don't expect to get a day off to celebrate Diwali...you're in America now!!!"

I also brought about 10-pages of notes of past events that gave insight to the overall mismanagement and toxic culture of the organization.  It is seriously a case study for the toxic masculinity of tech companies. 

That Sr. Mgr was promoted to Director of another org, my direct manager was fired, and ultimately the toxic culture continues with the other bullies who remain in their positions. 

I still work there because it's close to home, but I am saving furiously so that once I leave, I can be done for good.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: CowboyAndIndian on June 09, 2019, 12:21:45 PM
My FU money empowered me to go to HR and report a Sr. Mgr who was insulting the women on the team, but the final straw was when he told a meek-mannered Indian woman, "don't expect to get a day off to celebrate Diwali...you're in America now!!!"

I also brought about 10-pages of notes of past events that gave insight to the overall mismanagement and toxic culture of the organization.  It is seriously a case study for the toxic masculinity of tech companies. 

That Sr. Mgr was promoted to Director of another org, my direct manager was fired, and ultimately the toxic culture continues with the other bullies who remain in their positions. 

I still work there because it's close to home, but I am saving furiously so that once I leave, I can be done for good.

Good for you @SimpleLifer

This is a case where they promote the incompetent. Rising to the level of the Sr. Mgr's incompetence. Another division is going be a toxic area to work.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: A Fella from Stella on June 24, 2019, 12:42:17 PM
My ex-boss' son, who I will call Snotty McStuffington IV, knew I'd been cheated out of some commissions. One day he said in an email that, ".....you don't have to be a baby about it."

My written reply was, "Go fuck yourself. I mean that literally. Next time you're fucking yourself, you should know that you've earned it."

A month later I gave notice. The boss asked me to not say anything until after Christmas to prevent the other employees from worrying, and that my only job for the following 6 weeks was to secure another job if I didn't already have one.

I received a Christmas bonus, 6 weeks pay to job search, and did some "business travel" where I caught up with a buddy I'd not seen in 8 years.

Regarding Snotty McStuffington IV, we don't keep in touch.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Padonak on June 24, 2019, 12:56:42 PM
  ^Epic story right there
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: A Fella from Stella on June 24, 2019, 04:21:09 PM
  ^Epic story right there

Glad you liked it. I swear that while it's very condensed, it's entirely true.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: markbike528CBX on June 24, 2019, 09:37:43 PM
My ex-boss' son, who I will call Snotty McStuffington IV, knew I'd been cheated out of some commissions. One day he said in an email that, ".....you don't have to be a baby about it."

My written reply was, "Go fuck yourself. I mean that literally. Next time you're fucking yourself, you should know that you've earned it."

A month later I gave notice. The boss asked me to not say anything until after Christmas to prevent the other employees from worrying, and that my only job for the following 6 weeks was to secure another job if I didn't already have one.

I received a Christmas bonus, 6 weeks pay to job search, and did some "business travel" where I caught up with a buddy I'd not seen in 8 years.

Regarding Snotty McStuffington IV, we don't keep in touch.

How did ex-boss (presumably Snotty McStuffington III) not have any irritation at you for such a blunt response?
  a)didn't care/ wanted to do the same,but couldn't because of family
  b) wasn't told by Snotty McStuffington IV because of ???

and why the  wait to "prevent the other employees from worrying"?  Not understanding that at all. Quit is quit, not layoff/fired.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: A Fella from Stella on June 25, 2019, 04:21:13 AM
My ex-boss' son, who I will call Snotty McStuffington IV, knew I'd been cheated out of some commissions. One day he said in an email that, ".....you don't have to be a baby about it."

My written reply was, "Go fuck yourself. I mean that literally. Next time you're fucking yourself, you should know that you've earned it."

A month later I gave notice. The boss asked me to not say anything until after Christmas to prevent the other employees from worrying, and that my only job for the following 6 weeks was to secure another job if I didn't already have one.

I received a Christmas bonus, 6 weeks pay to job search, and did some "business travel" where I caught up with a buddy I'd not seen in 8 years.

Regarding Snotty McStuffington IV, we don't keep in touch.

How did ex-boss (presumably Snotty McStuffington III) not have any irritation at you for such a blunt response?
  a)didn't care/ wanted to do the same,but couldn't because of family
  b) wasn't told by Snotty McStuffington IV because of ???

and why the  wait to "prevent the other employees from worrying"?  Not understanding that at all. Quit is quit, not layoff/fired.

The boss never brought it up, and I am positive the son told him. The boss has also called me 4 times since I left when he had issues with a customer, an employee, his nephew, and the IRS.

Boss' worry: I think the boss worried he could be sued for the commissions. It wouldn't have been the first time.

People worrying: When I was hired, things began to change at the company. Employees, including a nephew who'd been there 20 years, thought the business was going to be sold, but now felt more secure.

Things that changed: I updated the corporate guidelines and employee manuals, started an annual employee appreciation barbecue during work hours, created a social media presence and blog, and updated all product photos to meet the standards for Amazon, Shoplet, Wayfair, etc, who then began carrying our lines. I also replaced my boss in his role of going on the road. Additionally, we started receiving grants that I applied for that were specifically for businesses looking to add employees, update their processes, or seek out local consulting work. Regarding the consulting, they were great, but the boss would not share the final report, or implement anything they suggested, and told someone he was worried the consulting co was trying to poach me; they weren't, but that was how he was; not wanting to share anything while also worried people could get what they wanted elsewhere.

The FU event/My departure: It was right before Thanksgiving. I did not expect to be fired for it, but had some things lined up if I was. Approaching Christmas, I couldn't stand being there as an employee anymore, and had one last meeting with the boss, attempting to coordinate a purchase with the previously mentioned nephew. It was a long-shot because it would require him getting paid over time, and competitors were offering him cash. When he rejected our offer, I told him I would be leaving. He asked me to give him a day. The next day he asked if I had a job. I said no, but had actually been working for another company remotely the entire year. That's when he offered to just pay me to job search from mid-December through January, on the condition that he'd let everyone know in a company meeting, and that we'd have a going away lunch for me.

How it ended: A year later the boss sold the building for about $10MM, but appears to have retained the brand name.
Title: Ghostwriting for a Best-Selling Author/Speaker
Post by: A Fella from Stella on June 25, 2019, 02:23:04 PM
Adding another story:

I was ghostwriting a book for a best-selling author [how to land that gig explained below]. Now, I'm not FI, but I have passive income that is very helpful, so I can afford to negotiate a deal like this: I will work as much as it takes to create a high-quality product to your liking for royalties with no limit.

"Do you need an advance?" he asked. "Monthly pay?"

"Nope. Just the chance to show you what I've got."

For the next 16 months we ended up writing what I consider to be 3 versions of the book, which could have been 3 overlapping products (not uncommon in the self-help business). At the end of it he said he wasn't happy, and asked to settle up.

I said, "You owe me nothing."

"No," he said, "you've put your heart and soul into this. I have to pay you something. How about $10,000, or if you can wait, $25,000 on first royalties."

"But there won't be any royalties," because I failed.

At this there was a silence, and he filled it by saying "But who will own the intellectual property?"

"There won't be any. But if you find some content you can use, I'll get a percentage of the original royalty deal."

"Look," he said, "I want to reward your efforts, so think it over and let me know."

My estimate was that I would make $300,000 off the book, so I emailed him a long analysis that settled on

(a) $50k today, or
(b) $25k today with another $50k on royalties over the first 100,000 copies sold.

We had some back and forth. He concluded by saying his offer of $10k was generous, and that I was greedy.

I said, "Let's go back to our original deal, dated xx/xx/xxxx," where I got paid only if something I created was used in the final product.

Maybe I was just stubborn to let go of the bird in the hand, but the truth is that I didn't need $10k. I take that home about every 4 weeks. What I wanted was a best-seller and $300k, preferably 5x over. He has not released a book since before we worked together.

[How to land that gig]

I shot gunned it - contacting publishers, agents, authors, athletes, pretty much anyone - trying to sell something else I'd written. This guy didn't get back to me, so I followed up twice and we had an hour-long conversation that concluded with him asking if I'd consider writing an updated version of a previous best-seller about how the web is going to make billions!. We ended up creating nothing, but I'm still trying.
Title: Re: Ghostwriting for a Best-Selling Author/Speaker
Post by: AnnaGrowsAMustache on June 25, 2019, 06:21:12 PM
Adding another story:

I was ghostwriting a book for a best-selling author [how to land that gig explained below]. Now, I'm not FI, but I have passive income that is very helpful, so I can afford to negotiate a deal like this: I will work as much as it takes to create a high-quality product to your liking for royalties with no limit.

"Do you need an advance?" he asked. "Monthly pay?"

"Nope. Just the chance to show you what I've got."

For the next 16 months we ended up writing what I consider to be 3 versions of the book, which could have been 3 overlapping products (not uncommon in the self-help business). At the end of it he said he wasn't happy, and asked to settle up.

I said, "You owe me nothing."

"No," he said, "you've put your heart and soul into this. I have to pay you something. How about $10,000, or if you can wait, $25,000 on first royalties."

"But there won't be any royalties," because I failed.

At this there was a silence, and he filled it by saying "But who will own the intellectual property?"

"There won't be any. But if you find some content you can use, I'll get a percentage of the original royalty deal."

"Look," he said, "I want to reward your efforts, so think it over and let me know."

My estimate was that I would make $300,000 off the book, so I emailed him a long analysis that settled on

(a) $50k today, or
(b) $25k today with another $50k on royalties over the first 100,000 copies sold.

We had some back and forth. He concluded by saying his offer of $10k was generous, and that I was greedy.

I said, "Let's go back to our original deal, dated xx/xx/xxxx," where I got paid only if something I created was used in the final product.

Maybe I was just stubborn to let go of the bird in the hand, but the truth is that I didn't need $10k. I take that home about every 4 weeks. What I wanted was a best-seller and $300k, preferably 5x over. He has not released a book since before we worked together.

[How to land that gig]

I shot gunned it - contacting publishers, agents, authors, athletes, pretty much anyone - trying to sell something else I'd written. This guy didn't get back to me, so I followed up twice and we had an hour-long conversation that concluded with him asking if I'd consider writing an updated version of a previous best-seller about how the web is going to make billions!. We ended up creating nothing, but I'm still trying.

Have I missed something? You worked for 16 months and got nothing for it..... because you were holding out for the big score.... that hasn't come.
Title: Re: Ghostwriting for a Best-Selling Author/Speaker
Post by: Rural on June 25, 2019, 07:29:50 PM
Adding another story:

I was ghostwriting a book for a best-selling author [how to land that gig explained below]. Now, I'm not FI, but I have passive income that is very helpful, so I can afford to negotiate a deal like this: I will work as much as it takes to create a high-quality product to your liking for royalties with no limit.

"Do you need an advance?" he asked. "Monthly pay?"

"Nope. Just the chance to show you what I've got."

For the next 16 months we ended up writing what I consider to be 3 versions of the book, which could have been 3 overlapping products (not uncommon in the self-help business). At the end of it he said he wasn't happy, and asked to settle up.

I said, "You owe me nothing."

"No," he said, "you've put your heart and soul into this. I have to pay you something. How about $10,000, or if you can wait, $25,000 on first royalties."

"But there won't be any royalties," because I failed.

At this there was a silence, and he filled it by saying "But who will own the intellectual property?"

"There won't be any. But if you find some content you can use, I'll get a percentage of the original royalty deal."

"Look," he said, "I want to reward your efforts, so think it over and let me know."

My estimate was that I would make $300,000 off the book, so I emailed him a long analysis that settled on

(a) $50k today, or
(b) $25k today with another $50k on royalties over the first 100,000 copies sold.

We had some back and forth. He concluded by saying his offer of $10k was generous, and that I was greedy.

I said, "Let's go back to our original deal, dated xx/xx/xxxx," where I got paid only if something I created was used in the final product.

Maybe I was just stubborn to let go of the bird in the hand, but the truth is that I didn't need $10k. I take that home about every 4 weeks. What I wanted was a best-seller and $300k, preferably 5x over. He has not released a book since before we worked together.

[How to land that gig]

I shot gunned it - contacting publishers, agents, authors, athletes, pretty much anyone - trying to sell something else I'd written. This guy didn't get back to me, so I followed up twice and we had an hour-long conversation that concluded with him asking if I'd consider writing an updated version of a previous best-seller about how the web is going to make billions!. We ended up creating nothing, but I'm still trying.

Have I missed something? You worked for 16 months and got nothing for it..... because you were holding out for the big score.... that hasn't come.


I think what you missed is that he declined to let the guy out of the contract and simultaneously give up 16 months of work for $10K he didn't need.
Title: Re: Ghostwriting for a Best-Selling Author/Speaker
Post by: A Fella from Stella on June 25, 2019, 08:16:29 PM
Adding another story:

I was ghostwriting a book for a best-selling author.....................

Have I missed something? You worked for 16 months and got nothing for it..... because you were holding out for the big score.... that hasn't come.


Rural is right. But maybe this will also help explain.

During the month we were negotiating, I said to my wife, "why am I being like this? Literally the night before, I'd said if he offered me five grand to just walk away, I'd take it." Because working with him had become a frustrating waste of time.

"Because," she said, "you don't need $10,000. You need $300,000."

And she was right. $10k didn't mean much to me, but $300,000 paid off my house, freeing up $2800 every month 14.5 years early. Also, if I'd have let the work go for less than $50k after 16 months, and it became the best-selling book, I'd really hate myself, because I knew that could be the case.

SEPARATE, BUT RELATED NOTE: I teach a college class or two per semester, and one of the things I tell my students is that at some point you'll become so valuable that you're going to start turning things down that you'd have previously tripped over yourself to get. You'll be offered positions on corporate and charitable boards, you'll be offered to teach at multiple colleges, and opportunities to be a keynote speaker. And when this happens, you can pick and choose, and you can also choose your price. I then tell them (I guess another FU story - maybe I'm the problem here!) about a college I was teaching at where the kids were fantastic, but the boss was a total nightmare. At the point where I lost half a night's sleep over her expecting me to be available 7 days a week on email, I gave myself a week to think it over, and let her know that I would not return the following semester.

You get to a point where you can set a standard. It's not always monetary.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Gondolin on June 26, 2019, 08:28:22 AM
Quote
Have I missed something? You worked for 16 months and got nothing for it..... because you were holding out for the big score.... that hasn't come.

If I were the cynical type I would say that Mr. Big Shot DID like the finished product and was trying to cut his ghostwriter out on the cheap.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: SwordGuy on June 26, 2019, 08:32:50 AM
Quote
Have I missed something? You worked for 16 months and got nothing for it..... because you were holding out for the big score.... that hasn't come.

If I were the cynical type I would say that Mr. Big Shot DID like the finished product and was trying to cut his ghostwriter out on the cheap.
And I would take actions to be able to prove Mr. Big Shot plagiarized the work product when he releases his own, royalty free version later.    Copyright infringement can be lucrative if the person doing it has the money to pay.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: fattest_foot on June 26, 2019, 08:54:51 AM
I guess I don't understand the writing business, but I'd be pretty pissed if I didn't get paid for 16 months worth of work.

That $10k is "insignificant" seems to be missing the point. If there are never any royalties, you worked for free. This wasn't a "I'm not working for only $10k because I'm worth $300k" The work was already done.

But maybe that's just how that entire industry works?
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: BicycleB on June 26, 2019, 09:05:15 AM
I think he challenged the guy instead of taking a crappy deal. The chance at $300k (including possible collection re infringement) was worth more than $10k in hand. Because he haz FU $.

Epic!!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: A Fella from Stella on June 26, 2019, 09:06:56 AM
Quote
Have I missed something? You worked for 16 months and got nothing for it..... because you were holding out for the big score.... that hasn't come.

If I were the cynical type I would say that Mr. Big Shot DID like the finished product and was trying to cut his ghostwriter out on the cheap.
And I would take actions to be able to prove Mr. Big Shot plagiarized the work product when he releases his own, royalty free version later.    Copyright infringement can be lucrative if the person doing it has the money to pay.

I did keep an eye out to see if he would release a book after all (he has not), and that I'd have a fair claim to a portion of it. If he did, then after the big initial sales I'd cordially reach out after figuring the percentage. If the book was totally different, then I'd also feel good that he was not only a completely straight shooter who was incredibly generous, after all, but also a gentleman of the highest caliber.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: A Fella from Stella on June 26, 2019, 09:12:15 AM
I guess I don't understand the writing business, but I'd be pretty pissed if I didn't get paid for 16 months worth of work.

That $10k is "insignificant" seems to be missing the point. If there are never any royalties, you worked for free. This wasn't a "I'm not working for only $10k because I'm worth $300k" The work was already done.

But maybe that's just how that entire industry works?

That is completely understandable. For me, writing is something I pursue as an all-or-nothing venture. I want unlimited royalties only, and am willing to make nothing if that's how it goes down. I have also edited work for free, if I truly enjoy the book, and like the person.

To start, this author asked me what kind of deal I wanted, and he agreed to royalties only, with no limit. If we sold 1,000,000 copies, which was his average, it would have come to $300k.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Tyson on June 26, 2019, 09:33:17 AM
Quote
Have I missed something? You worked for 16 months and got nothing for it..... because you were holding out for the big score.... that hasn't come.

If I were the cynical type I would say that Mr. Big Shot DID like the finished product and was trying to cut his ghostwriter out on the cheap.

This.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: A Fella from Stella on June 26, 2019, 09:37:12 AM
I think he challenged the guy instead of taking a crappy deal. The chance at $300k (including possible collection re infringement) was worth more than $10k in hand. Because he haz FU $.

Epic!!

Thanks! You are correct. While I am not rich, I have some cushion via passive income, and a fairly paid profession.

I felt suspicious of this offer, and while $10k is not nothing, it's like nothing for all of the work I did, especially if my work was good enough in the end, which seemed possible based on our discussions.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: NorCal on June 26, 2019, 11:02:08 AM
I think he challenged the guy instead of taking a crappy deal. The chance at $300k (including possible collection re infringement) was worth more than $10k in hand. Because he haz FU $.

Epic!!

Thanks! You are correct. While I am not rich, I have some cushion via passive income, and a fairly paid profession.

I felt suspicious of this offer, and while $10k is not nothing, it's like nothing for all of the work I did, especially if my work was good enough in the end, which seemed possible based on our discussions.

I'm curious, why don't you just tell him he owes you nothing, you'll keep the IP rights, and try to publish it under your own name?

I'm imagine the total value is lower without the "brand name" attached, but maybe it could increase the value of your own personal brand.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: FIPurpose on June 26, 2019, 11:11:34 AM
I think he challenged the guy instead of taking a crappy deal. The chance at $300k (including possible collection re infringement) was worth more than $10k in hand. Because he haz FU $.

Epic!!

Thanks! You are correct. While I am not rich, I have some cushion via passive income, and a fairly paid profession.

I felt suspicious of this offer, and while $10k is not nothing, it's like nothing for all of the work I did, especially if my work was good enough in the end, which seemed possible based on our discussions.

I'm curious, why don't you just tell him he owes you nothing, you'll keep the IP rights, and try to publish it under your own name?

I'm imagine the total value is lower without the "brand name" attached, but maybe it could increase the value of your own personal brand.

I'm guessing he does not have a right to publish, only to a part of the royalties.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Warlord1986 on June 26, 2019, 02:13:27 PM
Copied from my journal.


So our Executive Director came in my office and told me she wanted to take on a 'leadership role' now that my supervisor was leaving. I said I would need the title of interim director and the according pay. She immediately shot that down. When I said that wouldn't work for me she started threatening me with double speak and dog whistles. I decided life is too short to put up with that crap and sent HR my two weeks notice.

I have some money saved and a part time job. But if anyone wants to buy one of my short stories, here's a link: https://www.amazon.com/dp/B07CKSBZT1

Just an update. I spent the last few months bumming around, working as a waitress (and filling a $15,000 wholesale order for that business), reading a lot of books about Venice, Istanbul, and the Medicis, getting certified as a Stand Up Paddleboarding instructor, dating a bit, and volunteering. The library where I volunteer hired me. I start on Monday. The position is part time, but it's enough to pay my bills, and I'll be back in the state retirement system (which I didn't know when I applied!). My funds are at roughly the same place they were when I left, and I'm saving for a trip to Malta. This sabbatical turned out really well for me! :3
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: By the River on June 26, 2019, 04:26:14 PM
Copied from my journal.


So our Executive Director came in my office and told me she wanted to take on a 'leadership role' now that my supervisor was leaving. I said I would need the title of interim director and the according pay. She immediately shot that down. When I said that wouldn't work for me she started threatening me with double speak and dog whistles. I decided life is too short to put up with that crap and sent HR my two weeks notice.

I have some money saved and a part time job. But if anyone wants to buy one of my short stories, here's a link: https://www.amazon.com/dp/B07CKSBZT1

Just an update. I spent the last few months bumming around, working as a waitress (and filling a $15,000 wholesale order for that business), reading a lot of books about Venice, Istanbul, and the Medicis, getting certified as a Stand Up Paddleboarding instructor, dating a bit, and volunteering. The library where I volunteer hired me. I start on Monday. The position is part time, but it's enough to pay my bills, and I'll be back in the state retirement system (which I didn't know when I applied!). My funds are at roughly the same place they were when I left, and I'm saving for a trip to Malta. This sabbatical turned out really well for me! :3

Congratulations, that really turned out well. 
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Ladychips on June 26, 2019, 05:37:33 PM
Copied from my journal.


So our Executive Director came in my office and told me she wanted to take on a 'leadership role' now that my supervisor was leaving. I said I would need the title of interim director and the according pay. She immediately shot that down. When I said that wouldn't work for me she started threatening me with double speak and dog whistles. I decided life is too short to put up with that crap and sent HR my two weeks notice.

I have some money saved and a part time job. But if anyone wants to buy one of my short stories, here's a link: https://www.amazon.com/dp/B07CKSBZT1

Just an update. I spent the last few months bumming around, working as a waitress (and filling a $15,000 wholesale order for that business), reading a lot of books about Venice, Istanbul, and the Medicis, getting certified as a Stand Up Paddleboarding instructor, dating a bit, and volunteering. The library where I volunteer hired me. I start on Monday. The position is part time, but it's enough to pay my bills, and I'll be back in the state retirement system (which I didn't know when I applied!). My funds are at roughly the same place they were when I left, and I'm saving for a trip to Malta. This sabbatical turned out really well for me! :3

This is a beautiful story!  Thanks for sharing it.  Can you share more details about how your Executive Director reacted when she found out you gave notice?  The story doesn't need it...I'm just a nosy Nellie!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Neustache on June 26, 2019, 06:06:02 PM
Copied from my journal.


So our Executive Director came in my office and told me she wanted to take on a 'leadership role' now that my supervisor was leaving. I said I would need the title of interim director and the according pay. She immediately shot that down. When I said that wouldn't work for me she started threatening me with double speak and dog whistles. I decided life is too short to put up with that crap and sent HR my two weeks notice.

I have some money saved and a part time job. But if anyone wants to buy one of my short stories, here's a link: https://www.amazon.com/dp/B07CKSBZT1

Just an update. I spent the last few months bumming around, working as a waitress (and filling a $15,000 wholesale order for that business), reading a lot of books about Venice, Istanbul, and the Medicis, getting certified as a Stand Up Paddleboarding instructor, dating a bit, and volunteering. The library where I volunteer hired me. I start on Monday. The position is part time, but it's enough to pay my bills, and I'll be back in the state retirement system (which I didn't know when I applied!). My funds are at roughly the same place they were when I left, and I'm saving for a trip to Malta. This sabbatical turned out really well for me! :3

That's amazing!  Part time at the library sounds like a great gig!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: A Fella from Stella on June 26, 2019, 08:58:28 PM
I think he challenged the guy instead of taking a crappy deal. The chance at $300k (including possible collection re infringement) was worth more than $10k in hand. Because he haz FU $.

Epic!!

Thanks! You are correct. While I am not rich, I have some cushion via passive income, and a fairly paid profession.

I felt suspicious of this offer, and while $10k is not nothing, it's like nothing for all of the work I did, especially if my work was good enough in the end, which seemed possible based on our discussions.

I'm curious, why don't you just tell him he owes you nothing, you'll keep the IP rights, and try to publish it under your own name?

I'm imagine the total value is lower without the "brand name" attached, but maybe it could increase the value of your own personal brand.

I'm guessing he does not have a right to publish, only to a part of the royalties.


This author has a name and a core base of hard core fans. It's the kind of situation where he could release a bad book and sell 500k copies. In fact, if he sold 500k copies it would be his greatest failure.

If I published it under my own name, it would go nowhere. Not just because I don't have a name, but also because it was written with references to his other work, even adapting a chapter from a former book to be more relevant to today.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: A Fella from Stella on June 26, 2019, 09:00:25 PM
Can you share more details about how your Executive Director reacted when she found out you gave notice?  The story doesn't need it...I'm just a nosy Nellie!

I'd like to know as well.

Great job.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: NykkiC on June 26, 2019, 09:50:44 PM
I guess I don't understand the writing business, but I'd be pretty pissed if I didn't get paid for 16 months worth of work.

That $10k is "insignificant" seems to be missing the point. If there are never any royalties, you worked for free. This wasn't a "I'm not working for only $10k because I'm worth $300k" The work was already done.

But maybe that's just how that entire industry works?

That is completely understandable. For me, writing is something I pursue as an all-or-nothing venture. I want unlimited royalties only, and am willing to make nothing if that's how it goes down. I have also edited work for free, if I truly enjoy the book, and like the person.

To start, this author asked me what kind of deal I wanted, and he agreed to royalties only, with no limit. If we sold 1,000,000 copies, which was his average, it would have come to $300k.

I’d add, for people like A Fella from Stella, that the deal you took would be considered a terrible deal for most professional ghostwriters. Books, even by people with good track records, can tank for a thousand different reasons. Maybe the self-help guy gets caught in a scandal or another book by someone even bigger in that space is released on the same topic right before the one you worked on comes out, and sales are basically zero. It’s a huge gamble on your part, with the potential for getting nothing. I get that’s the point of the post in this thread, but I feel like we need to make it clear to people browsing this thread with no background in the industry that, ninty-nine times out of a hundred, a ghostwriter would turn down this deal (sometimes with extreme prejudice).
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: A Fella from Stella on June 27, 2019, 05:36:41 AM
I guess I don't understand the writing business, but I'd be pretty pissed if I didn't get paid for 16 months worth of work.

That $10k is "insignificant" seems to be missing the point. If there are never any royalties, you worked for free. This wasn't a "I'm not working for only $10k because I'm worth $300k" The work was already done.

But maybe that's just how that entire industry works?

That is completely understandable. For me, writing is something I pursue as an all-or-nothing venture. I want unlimited royalties only, and am willing to make nothing if that's how it goes down. I have also edited work for free, if I truly enjoy the book, and like the person.

To start, this author asked me what kind of deal I wanted, and he agreed to royalties only, with no limit. If we sold 1,000,000 copies, which was his average, it would have come to $300k.

I’d add, for people like A Fella from Stella, that the deal you took would be considered a terrible deal for most professional ghostwriters. Books, even by people with good track records, can tank for a thousand different reasons. Maybe the self-help guy gets caught in a scandal or another book by someone even bigger in that space is released on the same topic right before the one you worked on comes out, and sales are basically zero. It’s a huge gamble on your part, with the potential for getting nothing. I get that’s the point of the post in this thread, but I feel like we need to make it clear to people browsing this thread with no background in the industry that, ninty-nine times out of a hundred, a ghostwriter would turn down this deal (sometimes with extreme prejudice).

NykkiC, you are correct. The odds of this book being a big deal were better-than-remote, so I wanted to take the chance. For almost any other author, I would have needed money on the front-end with a strict 90-day deadline for completion, and then would have negotiated royalties with a $250k cap, knowing that sales would never make that cap.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Warlord1986 on June 27, 2019, 07:59:26 AM
Can you share more details about how your Executive Director reacted when she found out you gave notice?  The story doesn't need it...I'm just a nosy Nellie!

I'd like to know as well.

Great job.

Thanks y’all!

She wasn’t used to people telling her no, so when I refused her kind offer of doing two jobs for the pay of one, she threatened me and left to go to a meeting with the other top brass in the organization. I emailed the other top brass my two weeks notice, so they got it while in that meeting (and I know HR was checking email) so the whole meeting got my message and my explanation of why I was leaving. This meant she had 100% turnover in a year. She came back and slammed her office door. She spent the next two weeks not speaking to me, and leaving me out of office activities. I kid you not, she called her administration assistant and my outgoing supervisor into an office and slammed the door in my face. I heard them giggling behind the door.

I documented everything, the anti-Catholic bigotry, the bullying, name-calling, vulgarity (she called other women cooters), the retaliation, and the overall office environment she created and encouraged (my supervisor was fond of screaming about Goddamn straight white men and there Goddamn penisis, but she was another nightmare altogether. Screaming at me in front of colleagues, public tantrums, insulting project manager’s projects, slamming things on her desk, and lying). Everyone on campus had a story about this woman and everyone knew how she got her first admin assistant fired (and then laughed when she heard the woman was driving Uber to make ends meet. I really can’t get over that). While I was documenting stuff, I also told all my fellow Catholics, and all the other religious minority colleagues, about her comments. Her job strongly relies on having good relationships with colleagues and the community. Several people stopped volunteering at her events. Partly because she was fond of screaming fits, partly because who wants to work with a bigot?

I have it on good authority that HR and the College President were not happy about her behavior and some disciplinary action was taken. She’s still working there. She said she hated it multiple times, but whenever she came into the deli where I worked she made a point to wear brand new Lily Pulitzer. And to be rude to other customers. Who are often very wealthy and influential people in the community.

And that’s why I left before I found a full time job.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: A Fella from Stella on June 27, 2019, 08:26:22 AM
Can you share more details about how your Executive Director reacted when she found out you gave notice?  The story doesn't need it...I'm just a nosy Nellie!

I'd like to know as well.

Great job.

Thanks y’all!

She wasn’t used to people telling her no...................



Thanks for sharing. You did a great thing by sparing yourself.

Will you use the documentation for any legal action? It sounds to me like you have grounds to at least make a small claim if you wanted to DIY.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: radram on June 27, 2019, 08:32:37 AM
Copied from my journal.


So our Executive Director came in my office and told me she wanted to take on a 'leadership role' now that my supervisor was leaving. I said I would need the title of interim director and the according pay. She immediately shot that down. When I said that wouldn't work for me she started threatening me with double speak and dog whistles. I decided life is too short to put up with that crap and sent HR my two weeks notice.

I have some money saved and a part time job. But if anyone wants to buy one of my short stories, here's a link: https://www.amazon.com/dp/B07CKSBZT1

Just an update. I spent the last few months bumming around, working as a waitress (and filling a $15,000 wholesale order for that business), reading a lot of books about Venice, Istanbul, and the Medicis, getting certified as a Stand Up Paddleboarding instructor, dating a bit, and volunteering. The library where I volunteer hired me. I start on Monday. The position is part time, but it's enough to pay my bills, and I'll be back in the state retirement system (which I didn't know when I applied!). My funds are at roughly the same place they were when I left, and I'm saving for a trip to Malta. This sabbatical turned out really well for me! :3

That library gig sounds fantastic! Do you get perks, like getting to check out books for free?

Kidding of course. My daughter would just LOVE a gig like that. Actual books are a must for her. She loves all the senses of the actual book. Are you the same?
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: FireLane on June 27, 2019, 08:59:55 AM
Copied from my journal.

So our Executive Director came in my office and told me she wanted to take on a 'leadership role' now that my supervisor was leaving. I said I would need the title of interim director and the according pay. She immediately shot that down. When I said that wouldn't work for me she started threatening me with double speak and dog whistles. I decided life is too short to put up with that crap and sent HR my two weeks notice.

I have some money saved and a part time job. But if anyone wants to buy one of my short stories, here's a link: https://www.amazon.com/dp/B07CKSBZT1

Just an update. I spent the last few months bumming around, working as a waitress (and filling a $15,000 wholesale order for that business), reading a lot of books about Venice, Istanbul, and the Medicis, getting certified as a Stand Up Paddleboarding instructor, dating a bit, and volunteering. The library where I volunteer hired me. I start on Monday. The position is part time, but it's enough to pay my bills, and I'll be back in the state retirement system (which I didn't know when I applied!). My funds are at roughly the same place they were when I left, and I'm saving for a trip to Malta. This sabbatical turned out really well for me! :3

Kickass! What a great example of the power of F-U money.

Also, uh, is it OK to be surprised that Warlord1986 is a woman?
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Warlord1986 on June 27, 2019, 09:04:54 AM
Can you share more details about how your Executive Director reacted when she found out you gave notice?  The story doesn't need it...I'm just a nosy Nellie!

I'd like to know as well.

Great job.

Thanks y’all!

She wasn’t used to people telling her no...................



Thanks for sharing. You did a great thing by sparing yourself.

Will you use the documentation for any legal action? It sounds to me like you have grounds to at least make a small claim if you wanted to DIY.

I thought about it and spoke to family and friends who are lawyers. They all said it was ‘she-said, she-said’, legal action would take 1-3 years, be very expensive, and there was no guarantee of an outcome in my favor. That didn’t sound like a good way to spend my time, and honestly, I was just exhausted after dealing with that lunacy. There were no spoons left.

@radram Yes, I love physical books! It’s really hard to concentrate on stuff online. In addition to being back in the state retirement system, there are a lot of knitting circles, and I’m told people regularly bring in tasty baked goods! As the HR lady said, “you’re in Library-land now!”

@FireLane I’m actually a rather scrawny woman, and not a large, robust Viking. :(
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Ladychips on June 27, 2019, 10:38:37 AM
Thanks for the additional info although the details made me sad.  Good for you for getting out!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: saguaro on June 27, 2019, 11:42:22 AM
I thought about it and spoke to family and friends who are lawyers. They all said it was ‘she-said, she-said’, legal action would take 1-3 years, be very expensive, and there was no guarantee of an outcome in my favor. That didn’t sound like a good way to spend my time, and honestly, I was just exhausted after dealing with that lunacy. There were no spoons left.

Years ago after getting fired from from a job, after being informed that I was not performing adequately never mind I got a raise 2 months before, I considered legal action.  I talked to attorneys and an acquaintance who was HR director at another company who agreed they didn't follow their own progressive discipline policies, but in the end I decided to let it go because of the time it would take and interfere with my next job not to mention moving on with my life.

Two years later, the boss who fired me got a taste of her own medicine.  She was notorious not only for constant turnover in her own department but was behind firings of other people in other departments.  The bosses who let her get away with this all retired.  The guy who took over leadership of the organization was someone that she fought with and whom she had seriously pissed off.  Once he had the authority to fire her he wasted no time.  Oops, made the mistake of not identifying the next in line and cozy up.  Unfortunately he fired her whole department with the exception of one person who was smart enough to identify who would succeed the retiring executives and took measures to distance herself.  She eventually became president of the organization.   

To be honest, I was quite satisfied with hearing the outcome.  And I didn't have to spend money or go through legal hassles. Maybe @Warlord1986 you will have the same satisfaction.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: A Fella from Stella on June 27, 2019, 08:20:17 PM
I thought about it and spoke to family and friends who are lawyers. They all said it was ‘she-said, she-said’, legal action would take 1-3 years, be very expensive, and there was no guarantee of an outcome in my favor. That didn’t sound like a good way to spend my time, and honestly, I was just exhausted after dealing with that lunacy. There were no spoons left.

Years ago after getting fired from from a job.........................To be honest, I was quite satisfied with hearing the outcome.  And I didn't have to spend money or go through legal hassles. Maybe @Warlord1986 you will have the same satisfaction.

Referring to bad bosses, you cannot screw so many people and not have it come back on you in some way. Not because of magical karma, but because of non-magical people.

To quote "The Big Lebowski," This is what happens when you fuck a stranger in the ass. Only this isn't a stranger. This is someone who WILL definitely have something on you eventually because they see you everyday.

I once had a subordinate who did her best to undermine me, and she was protected by someone senior to me. That guy - her protector - ended up getting into trouble for forging company documents, and he was gone. She tried to keep it up, but realized she was in quicksand, so did everything she could to transfer out, saying that I was out to get her. A sympathetic manager took her under his wing. A month later he came to me and said "I can't believe what I'm dealing with," as did a subordinate of his. I just shrugged because she wasn't my problem anymore.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: saguaro on June 28, 2019, 09:24:58 AM
I thought about it and spoke to family and friends who are lawyers. They all said it was ‘she-said, she-said’, legal action would take 1-3 years, be very expensive, and there was no guarantee of an outcome in my favor. That didn’t sound like a good way to spend my time, and honestly, I was just exhausted after dealing with that lunacy. There were no spoons left.

Years ago after getting fired from from a job.........................To be honest, I was quite satisfied with hearing the outcome.  And I didn't have to spend money or go through legal hassles. Maybe @Warlord1986 you will have the same satisfaction.

Referring to bad bosses, you cannot screw so many people and not have it come back on you in some way. Not because of magical karma, but because of non-magical people.

To quote "The Big Lebowski," This is what happens when you fuck a stranger in the ass. Only this isn't a stranger. This is someone who WILL definitely have something on you eventually because they see you everyday.

Yep, and eventually you mess with the wrong person.

She had a pattern of cycling through people, as I learned after I was hired, which troubled me.  But a lot of coworkers bought into her reasons/excuses.....until she fired me. After I left, I heard those same coworkers were shocked that she canned me, I was well-liked and respected and it seemed to be the tipping point where people started to think that maybe, just maybe the problem was her.   What happened after I left: she trained her sights on another person who quit before she could get fired.  After that, she yanked someone from another department over to hers because she was short-staffed, the person was unwilling to go after seeing what happened to me, but ex-boss forced the issue knowing that person was a single mom and needed the job.  Six months after my departure, she moved yet another person over to her dept into a position similar to mine. 

The organization was in bad financial shape, the CFO had quit along with the senior VP who was tagged as the person to succeed the President/CEO who was a year away from retiring.  New executive comes on board to help right the ship and it's this person that ex-boss starts to fight with.  One issue was that ex-boss' mom came in a couple of times a week to help, new executive says can't have nepotism so mom had to go, pissing off ex-boss.  She predictably cycles through another person in her department, firing him a week after his wife had a baby.  I heard he was super pissed and he did not go quietly, it was shortly after this that she got canned along with most of her staff.   She made the critical mistake of fighting with this key person when she knew all her protectors were retiring.  Then again, maybe he already got wind of her antics.  One time I had to talk to him to make arrangements to transfer my 403b money and he knew who I was. 
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Dicey on June 28, 2019, 09:36:15 AM
I thought about it and spoke to family and friends who are lawyers. They all said it was ‘she-said, she-said’, legal action would take 1-3 years, be very expensive, and there was no guarantee of an outcome in my favor. That didn’t sound like a good way to spend my time, and honestly, I was just exhausted after dealing with that lunacy. There were no spoons left.

Years ago after getting fired from from a job.........................To be honest, I was quite satisfied with hearing the outcome.  And I didn't have to spend money or go through legal hassles. Maybe @Warlord1986 you will have the same satisfaction.

Referring to bad bosses, you cannot screw so many people and not have it come back on you in some way. Not because of magical karma, but because of non-magical people.

To quote "The Big Lebowski," This is what happens when you fuck a stranger in the ass. Only this isn't a stranger. This is someone who WILL definitely have something on you eventually because they see you everyday.

Yep, and eventually you mess with the wrong person.

She had a pattern of cycling through people, as I learned after I was hired, which troubled me.  But a lot of coworkers bought into her reasons/excuses.....until she fired me. After I left, I heard those same coworkers were shocked that she canned me, I was well-liked and respected and it seemed to be the tipping point where people started to think that maybe, just maybe the problem was her.   What happened after I left: she trained her sights on another person who quit before she could get fired.  After that, she yanked someone from another department over to hers because she was short-staffed, the person was unwilling to go after seeing what happened to me, but ex-boss forced the issue knowing that person was a single mom and needed the job.  Six months after my departure, she moved yet another person over to her dept into a position similar to mine. 

The organization was in bad financial shape, the CFO had quit along with the senior VP who was tagged as the person to succeed the President/CEO who was a year away from retiring.  New executive comes on board to help right the ship and it's this person that ex-boss starts to fight with.  One issue was that ex-boss' mom came in a couple of times a week to help, new executive says can't have nepotism so mom had to go, pissing off ex-boss.  She predictably cycles through another person in her department, firing him a week after his wife had a baby.  I heard he was super pissed and he did not go quietly, it was shortly after this that she got canned along with most of her staff.   She made the critical mistake of fighting with this key person when she knew all her protectors were retiring.  Then again, maybe he already got wind of her antics.  One time I had to talk to him to make arrangements to transfer my 403b money and he knew who I was.
Wow! Did you ever learn what happened to the guy with the new baby?
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: saguaro on June 28, 2019, 10:21:02 AM
I thought about it and spoke to family and friends who are lawyers. They all said it was ‘she-said, she-said’, legal action would take 1-3 years, be very expensive, and there was no guarantee of an outcome in my favor. That didn’t sound like a good way to spend my time, and honestly, I was just exhausted after dealing with that lunacy. There were no spoons left.

Years ago after getting fired from from a job.........................To be honest, I was quite satisfied with hearing the outcome.  And I didn't have to spend money or go through legal hassles. Maybe @Warlord1986 you will have the same satisfaction.

Referring to bad bosses, you cannot screw so many people and not have it come back on you in some way. Not because of magical karma, but because of non-magical people.

To quote "The Big Lebowski," This is what happens when you fuck a stranger in the ass. Only this isn't a stranger. This is someone who WILL definitely have something on you eventually because they see you everyday.

<snip for brevity> She predictably cycles through another person in her department, firing him a week after his wife had a baby.  I heard he was super pissed and he did not go quietly, it was shortly after this that she got canned along with most of her staff.<snip> 

Wow! Did you ever learn what happened to the guy with the new baby?

According to a former coworker I was in touch with, he made a lot of noise about being fired, including consulting an attorney.   This was interesting because the organization was an HR consulting firm that advised companies about labor law, collective bargaining, EEOC regs, etc.  A lot of our time was spent advising companies steering them away from anything that could subject them to lawsuits yet my ex-boss couldn't always follow our own policies or followed them but for stupid shit.   The guy unfortunately did not have a case, (because employment-at-will laws) but for the first time, ex-boss had someone willing to raise hell over it, causing unwanted attention and to the wrong person.  This put turnover in her department on the new guy's radar, plus all the conflicts, plus all her "protectors" had retired so he had reasons and a clear field to get rid of her. 

ETA:  The guy who was fired was ticked off not only for the timing, but he and his wife decided to have a baby because of this job and its attendant money and benefits.  So to have the rug pulled out from under him after they have the baby, was pretty bad.  But ex-boss had a predatory streak, she seemed to zero on on people when they had difficulties or challenges in their lives.  She was behind firing a guy who just lost his mother to cancer, was getting a divorce on top of health problems of his own due to a diabetes diagnosis.  When I was fired, I was getting over something that was a stubborn intestinal bug which was nothing compared to having a baby, cancer and type 1 diabetes, but one of my ex-boss lame excuses for firing me was that I was "sick". 
 
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: A Fella from Stella on June 28, 2019, 10:45:40 AM
I thought about it and spoke to family and friends who are lawyers. They all said it was ‘she-said, she-said’, legal action would take 1-3 years, be very expensive, and there was no guarantee of an outcome in my favor. That didn’t sound like a good way to spend my time, and honestly, I was just exhausted after dealing with that lunacy. There were no spoons left.

Years ago after getting fired from from a job.........................To be honest, I was quite satisfied with hearing the outcome.  And I didn't have to spend money or go through legal hassles. Maybe @Warlord1986 you will have the same satisfaction.

Referring to bad bosses, you cannot screw so many people and not have it come back on you in some way. Not because of magical karma, but because of non-magical people.

To quote "The Big Lebowski," This is what happens when you fuck a stranger in the ass. Only this isn't a stranger. This is someone who WILL definitely have something on you eventually because they see you everyday.

Yep, and eventually you mess with the wrong person.

She had a pattern of cycling through people..............................

My current manager has this reputation, but we're in government, so she couldn't fire people, only belittle them.

Several people filed EEO complaints about her early on, so she had to settle down a bit.

When I came on board she kept trying to get me to confess that my background was embellished on my resume and cover letter. It wasn't. And then she made 2 fatal errors.
FATAL ERROR 1: She asked me to do something that was a violation (not a crime) when I was very new. I clarified over email and she took the walk over to me in person to confirm, for which I had a witness. the paperwork could only go through with her signature, so I did it. Word spread around the office, and it made her wary.
FATAL ERROR 2: A work product I created was rejected. She asked why I would do it in the way that I did, and I speculated that my initial thought was that that was how I was instructed, but perhaps it changed. Without checking my hypothesis, she went on the record to say that I was lying about what I was told, and "always blaming others." Lo and behold, my hypothesis was correct.

I said I was glad it was cleared up, and strategically let 3 co-workers know how upset I was, and that I had a written log of 8 different things she'd done in just 5 months since I arrived.

Since that day, she treats any perceived error I might make as though perhaps she's mistaken, and I was recently given a mid-year bonus.

And she is counting down the days until her retirement.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: saguaro on June 28, 2019, 11:19:23 AM
And she is counting down the days until her retirement.

I hope the number of days aren't many.

My ex-boss bounced around a couple of jobs afterward, eventually moving out of the area and settling elsewhere in the state.  I think because of the industry, crossing paths with her one staff member who survived and rose to the top of the organization that canned her, the organization that she hoped to lead, might have been too much.   At least I no longer had to worry about looking for a job and having to deal with her again (she was in HR). 
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: SwordGuy on June 29, 2019, 05:07:58 PM
Saw this meme and thought of this thread.

It also reminded me of a story way back in the day.

I didn't have FU money, but I did have FU expertise.   

I came into work one morning and my boss told me he had ordered pagers for me and for all the programmers who reported to me.  (Yep, pagers, not cell phones or smart phones.  Told you it was back in the day!)

Now, these pagers would be totally useless because we (a) wrote really good code so there just weren't many defects that users had to deal with and (b) the only consistent problems users faced were network related, not program related.  So we would spend our time tracking down networking people.  My immediate thought was that the users could do that with -- drum roll please -- giving the network people the pagers.

So I looked my boss in the eye and said, very deliberately, "When I and my programmers write such bad code that we need to carry pagers, **I** will find another line of work."   And then I said nothing more, I just looked at him.

Never did see those damn pagers.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: flipboard on June 29, 2019, 11:46:32 PM
Now, these pagers would be totally useless because we (a) wrote really good code so there just weren't many defects that users had to deal with and (b) the only consistent problems users faced were network related, not program related.  So we would spend our time tracking down networking people.  My immediate thought was that the users could do that with -- drum roll please -- giving the network people the pagers.

So I looked my boss in the eye and said, very deliberately, "When I and my programmers write such bad code that we need to carry pagers, **I** will find another line of work."   And then I said nothing more, I just looked at him.
Wow that is arrogant. On your side, not the bosses.

To be fair: pager duty would require additional compensation, but no one writes flawless code and if you want systems without downtime pagers are the only way that has been shown to work.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: SwordGuy on June 30, 2019, 12:48:01 AM
Now, these pagers would be totally useless because we (a) wrote really good code so there just weren't many defects that users had to deal with and (b) the only consistent problems users faced were network related, not program related.  So we would spend our time tracking down networking people.  My immediate thought was that the users could do that with -- drum roll please -- giving the network people the pagers.

So I looked my boss in the eye and said, very deliberately, "When I and my programmers write such bad code that we need to carry pagers, **I** will find another line of work."   And then I said nothing more, I just looked at him.
Wow that is arrogant. On your side, not the bosses.

To be fair: pager duty would require additional compensation, but no one writes flawless code and if you want systems without downtime pagers are the only way that has been shown to work.

No, we didn't write flawless code.  But we damn well knew what code was absolutely essential to work correctly and we made sure it did.  99.9% of the remaining code could wait until morning to deal with.  It was the nature of the business we were in.   The network people that ran across the 0.1% of the time when we needed to come in to work off hours could call us and we could come in.  In the six years I was there, no one ever had to call us in...

The bosses plan would have had us called 100% of the time and us calling the network people to come in 98% of the time.  The other 1.9% would be "we'll fix the software in the morning" and the remaining 0.1% would have us coming in right away.   That was just plain bass-ackward and that's why I refused.

PS -- I had to put about 2% of our manpower on fixing defects in our software.  The rest was for new software development, either green fields work or enhancements to existing code because the business wanted more functionality or laws or contracts had changed.  I've read that industry averages for fixing software are in the 50-80% range.

I had really good people working for me, we had good processes, we got specifications from really good analysts who worked with really savvy business people.  I've written a lot of conference papers and technical articles over the years to teach people good techniques to improve software quality and software development speed.    I used to present 1-3 papers at 5-6 software conferences a year and have been an editor or contributing editor for 4 different technical magazines.

For example, I was presented with a specifications problem in the business.  Corporate HQ had tried to solve it with their software and the resulting product required four full time programmers just to get the data representing cargo containers "unstuck" so users could continue to move the containers around and record what they were doing.   They showed me the 12 SQL statements they used to verify what the users were allowed to do.    Each was over a dozen printed sheets of paper long.    I'm damn good at SQL but it would take me a couple of days to work out what the statement was doing and by that time my brain was full.   And there were 11 more statements to go thru.   

I took the same problem and in a few weeks had developed a technique to analyze the requirements and used it to produce the specs.  I designed and built a specifications database to hold a series of decision tables and a business-rule based engine that would populate the tables based on simple business rules that a user could easily verify for correctness.   In the process of the analysis, I identified 14 variables and 25 events that had 122.5 quadrillion combinations of pre-event states, events, and post-event states.    It took less than 2 hundred business rules to weed those down to less than a thousand allowable combinations.  Addition additional variables into the mix was simple and quick to do, so when we identified a rule that needed an extra variable we could incorporate it within an hour, including re-validating our rules against the presence of a new variable.   My initial "best educated guess" had identified 5 variables and 25 events so I went thru the new variable drill another 9 times.  A business rule included a business English statement and a SQL where clause fragment that tied to the variables and events and their respective values that were pertinent to the rule.   The where clause needed to be written such that we could say, "This rule is broken when...".  Example Rule:  "We do not sell containers we do not own."    This rule is broken when " Ownership != 'our company' and event = 'Sell' ".  Script would run thru the event database and mark all combinations that broke that rule as invalid.

Advantages to doing it this way were seriously important: 

A generic routine could be used to determine whether the pre-event state, event and post-event state were valid combinations.  Much easier to code and test than all those combinations with individual if-then statements..

If someone wanted to change a rule, I could run a query to determine which combinations would be newly forbidden by the new rule and which would be newly allowed by the new rule.   That way, we could get useful feedback so the users could refine the rule before we put it into production.   "What?  No, we can't let that happen!  Let's modify the rule so..."

Not only that, but if a user (or developer) wanted to know why they weren't allowed to take an action they wanted to take, we could give them a list of all pertinent business rules.

One of the key data entry screen languages we worked in allowed us to load up the source code into a structured database.   I wrote scripts to verify standards compliance or to modify code components to meet new standards.   Other scripts would write reference manuals for the data entry screens.   

In later years, I would write scripts to read a database design and produce prototype business specifications for the data maintenance screens and reports.   I would write other scripts that would read the database design and identify likely business rules and record them as candidate rules in a rule database.  If the rule was approved, other scripts would write the database enforcement code with either fully working code or a stub marked with an @ToDo marker and the specifications the code should meet.   Data entry screens knew how to read the business rule database so a generic routine could tell the user what rules were being violated or just which ones applied to the data.   All of these techniques removed human labor and the vagaries of human error from large portions of the system.  So, instead of spending our time finding and fixing random defects in simple to intermediate code, we could spend much more attention on the key parts of a system that really needed to be correct.

So no, I don't think that I was being arrogant.   :)

Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Zaga on June 30, 2019, 06:46:23 AM
Sword Guy, I work indirectly with people who write code that I have to use and OMG I wish they were half as competent as you sound!  I do testing when new code is added, and despite the extensive testing there are always huge problems in production.  We are dealing with a production problem that takes up to an hour of my time EVERY DAY to fix, and it's been that way for months and they still haven't figured out how to fix it.  Gah!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: SwordGuy on June 30, 2019, 09:34:51 AM
Sword Guy, I work indirectly with people who write code that I have to use and OMG I wish they were half as competent as you sound!  I do testing when new code is added, and despite the extensive testing there are always huge problems in production.  We are dealing with a production problem that takes up to an hour of my time EVERY DAY to fix, and it's been that way for months and they still haven't figured out how to fix it.  Gah!
Huge, long running problems are usually due to a bad design solution.   A good design for complicated data transformation programs includes built-in ways to prove it's working or prove where it's not working correctly.  It's actually faster to build the transformation program and one or two "prove it's right" programs than it is to build just the transformation program by itself (unless you don't care whether it works).  Makes testing largely automated and fewer things get past the programmer because they've automated the testing and the tests tell them exactly what kind of data isn't being handled correctly.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: FIPurpose on June 30, 2019, 11:26:26 AM
I have never been a part of any software team where when I joined, I always thought the whole thing needed to be rewritten/ rethought out. When I join, I see huge glaring problems, where the programmer or two who wrote the code simply acclimated to having to constantly write patches and fixes every couple days. And he was the only one who knew how to write those fixes!

The biggest barrier is always the software guys themselves. They have so much on their plate + they're maintaining all this legacy code, but the irony is that they should absolutely be the ones involved in the rewrite. All code needs to be written twice. Once you understand the problem, where the logic of your first attempt breaks down and complicates things, you can more clearly see the problem for what it is.

The second biggest barrier is the boss. Bosses hate to risk a redevelopment. They remember how long it took to make it the first time, and they imagine that it will take just as long the second time. But that is rarely true (unless the first attempt was really really bad).

My current job involves maintaining a number of websites. My company took over a contract/code from a years old project that never went to production. And it was easy to see why. Large amounts of duplicate code, lots of dead code because programmers are super afraid to delete any code, so red herrings and dead ends start littering the code base. (Code should be a french garden, not a junk yard). And lots of patch work to get things boot strapped. We brought up rewriting the front end in a more modern style and framework, but were shot down immediately be the contract owners. They did not want this project being delayed any longer. I can understand the frustration, but working in a bad code base lengthens the new feature dev time, bug fix time, and overall frustration with the work.

And since working on a completely new project is rarely the case, your decisions and organization at the beginning of a project has huge consequences positive or negative down the line. Bad decisions, and you will eventually have to burn it and start again. Good decisions, and you will only have to prune and cater to your code as it grows.

I have never worked any job where the first thing I did wasn't cleaning and reorganizing away 30-50% of the existing code base.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: scottish on June 30, 2019, 11:35:05 AM
I've had similar experiences.   The first time you build something it's likely to be ugly unless you're allowed to refactor it on an ongoing basis.   And even then it may be ugly.

Things are so busy negotiating requirements, schedule, deployment, etc., it's hard to get people focused on having a viable architecture.

Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Zaga on June 30, 2019, 12:17:18 PM
Sword Guy, I work indirectly with people who write code that I have to use and OMG I wish they were half as competent as you sound!  I do testing when new code is added, and despite the extensive testing there are always huge problems in production.  We are dealing with a production problem that takes up to an hour of my time EVERY DAY to fix, and it's been that way for months and they still haven't figured out how to fix it.  Gah!
Huge, long running problems are usually due to a bad design solution.   A good design for complicated data transformation programs includes built-in ways to prove it's working or prove where it's not working correctly.  It's actually faster to build the transformation program and one or two "prove it's right" programs than it is to build just the transformation program by itself (unless you don't care whether it works).  Makes testing largely automated and fewer things get past the programmer because they've automated the testing and the tests tell them exactly what kind of data isn't being handled correctly.
I..I...I...
did not know this was possible.  What I'm doing (I'm in retail accounting) is manually checking every test transaction bit by bit and making sure that all the parts of all the transactions add up to the same number that the code calculates.  Among other things.  It's painful.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Candace on June 30, 2019, 02:27:54 PM
This is a cool discussion, but can we please get the thread back on topic?
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: fredbear on June 30, 2019, 06:51:10 PM
...
In later years, I would write scripts to read a database design and produce prototype business specifications for the data maintenance screens and reports.   I would write other scripts that would read the database design and identify likely business rules and record them as candidate rules in a rule database.  If the rule was approved, other scripts would write the database enforcement code with either fully working code or a stub marked with an @ToDo marker and the specifications the code should meet.   Data entry screens knew how to read the business rule database so a generic routine could tell the user what rules were being violated or just which ones applied to the data.   All of these techniques removed human labor and the vagaries of human error from large portions of the system.  So, instead of spending our time finding and fixing random defects in simple to intermediate code, we could spend much more attention on the key parts of a system that really needed to be correct.
.../quote]

For God's sake, where were you back when I was hiring?  For the matter of that, now I am working with a volunteer organization that has chosen a classic hacker -- his operating mode could be summed up as: he does what seems cool at the time, documents nothing, and abandons it half-assed and to move on to the next thing he thinks cool -- to automate our business solutions via the web; I wish I could have found you when that project started.  Nothing specified, nothing tested, no bug-fix or enhancement plans.  Given the budget, it's hopeless now.  I am noiselessly retreating like a cat that stepped in cowpiss.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: BicycleB on June 30, 2019, 09:49:21 PM
Software people - that was the most educational discussion I've seen in my entire life. Thanks!!!

Everyone else, sorry for the interruption.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: A Fella from Stella on July 02, 2019, 05:24:53 AM
This is a cool discussion, but can we please get the thread back on topic?

About a Guy I Know:

A CPA friend of mine had a pretty nice business going. One year he gets referred a special project for a start-up that ends up taking off in such a way that it monopolizes his firm's time, and he ends up making 2.5x what he normally would have. A year later the start-up is still growing, and begins demanding that he move his office 40 miles to their location. He says, "Let me help you find another firm."

End of Discussion.


A Year Later

Same guy sold his company (net worth maybe $3MM) and was then asked to be president of another company, so he's there about a year, working for a guy who is probably worth $100MM. The richer guy is used to yelling at people, telling them how to be, where to go, etc., and the guy I know is used to having dozens of clients, or, as he called them, many bosses, some of whom are difficult.

After about a year of making $500k as president of this guy's company, things are going well, but the guy comes in yelling like a maniac. The CPA tells him he has done everything he can to help the business, and it's time to transition.

The guy began sputtering, and my friend said he'd give him 6 months, but it was over.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: A Fella from Stella on July 05, 2019, 06:46:14 AM
Young kid at my office is in graduate school and getting the GI Bill. The new GI Bill affords him something like $3,000 per month in tax free pay, and pays the tuition in addition to that. At his job as a law clerk, he's making maybe $1,800.

Approaching his last semester he requests to be moved to part-time hours so he can get the best grades possible. They say "no, it's not possible." He says, "okay, I'm giving 2 weeks notice."

Suddenly, it was possible.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: A Fella from Stella on July 05, 2019, 06:55:30 AM
My wife was working in a call center for the veterans hospital and it was a really tough job (veterans don't usually like the VA, and they're a tough bunch anyway). 3 months in she asks if she can have "mom hours" so she can be there for the kids at the start and end of the days. They say it's not possible; that it could never be allowed.

She interviews for another job and comes back saying "I have another offer. I'll stay for mom hours." They give it to her.

A year in, she asks to be moved into a department, and off the phones. They say there are no openings. As summer approaches she tells her supervisor that she'd like to take unpaid leave because the job is just so awful and she can't bear the idea of missing being there with her kids to be there instead. The boss says it's not possible.

"Okay," she says, and gives 2 weeks notice.

Suddenly, there's an opening and they can bump her up in pay grade early, but it would 40 hours, not mom hours.

6 months later she starts her job at the Treasury Department and someone from the VA is there, too. Turns out when my wife was on mom hours she was answering more calls than anyone else in the call center, and that the departments were asking for people to be trained to model her notes.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: RyanAtTanagra on July 05, 2019, 10:08:47 AM
Young kid at my office is in graduate school and getting the GI Bill. The new GI Bill affords him something like $3,000 per month in tax free pay, and pays the tuition in addition to that. At his job as a law clerk, he's making maybe $1,800.

Approaching his last semester he requests to be moved to part-time hours so he can get the best grades possible. They say "no, it's not possible." He says, "okay, I'm giving 2 weeks notice."

Suddenly, it was possible.

I'd still leave.  'I don't work for companies that play these games.'
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Dicey on July 05, 2019, 10:13:28 AM
Young kid at my office is in graduate school and getting the GI Bill. The new GI Bill affords him something like $3,000 per month in tax free pay, and pays the tuition in addition to that. At his job as a law clerk, he's making maybe $1,800.

Approaching his last semester he requests to be moved to part-time hours so he can get the best grades possible. They say "no, it's not possible." He says, "okay, I'm giving 2 weeks notice."

Suddenly, it was possible.

I'd still leave.  'I don't work for companies that play these games.'
Meh, he's a grad student, he'll be moving on naturally anyway. If they want to keep him, they know they're going to have to deal with him with respect. Win-win.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: RyanAtTanagra on July 05, 2019, 10:35:15 AM
If they want to keep him, they know they're going to have to deal with him with respect.

True that
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: EricL on July 05, 2019, 12:37:03 PM
My wife was working in a call center for the veterans hospital and it was a really tough job (veterans don't usually like the VA, and they're a tough bunch anyway). 3 months in she asks if she can have "mom hours" so she can be there for the kids at the start and end of the days. They say it's not possible; that it could never be allowed.

She interviews for another job and comes back saying "I have another offer. I'll stay for mom hours." They give it to her.

A year in, she asks to be moved into a department, and off the phones. They say there are no openings. As summer approaches she tells her supervisor that she'd like to take unpaid leave because the job is just so awful and she can't bear the idea of missing being there with her kids to be there instead. The boss says it's not possible.

"Okay," she says, and gives 2 weeks notice.

Suddenly, there's an opening and they can bump her up in pay grade early, but it would 40 hours, not mom hours.

6 months later she starts her job at the Treasury Department and someone from the VA is there, too. Turns out when my wife was on mom hours she was answering more calls than anyone else in the call center, and that the departments were asking for people to be trained to model her notes.

Please thank your wife for me.  I know veterans can be very difficult to deal with.  I am one.  Often the VA as an institution screwed them over and people like your wife, who are actually effective, have to deal with the fallout, plus the other veteran problems.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Warlord1986 on July 06, 2019, 09:47:14 AM
I thought about it and spoke to family and friends who are lawyers. They all said it was ‘she-said, she-said’, legal action would take 1-3 years, be very expensive, and there was no guarantee of an outcome in my favor. That didn’t sound like a good way to spend my time, and honestly, I was just exhausted after dealing with that lunacy. There were no spoons left.

Years ago after getting fired from from a job, after being informed that I was not performing adequately never mind I got a raise 2 months before, I considered legal action.  I talked to attorneys and an acquaintance who was HR director at another company who agreed they didn't follow their own progressive discipline policies, but in the end I decided to let it go because of the time it would take and interfere with my next job not to mention moving on with my life.

Two years later, the boss who fired me got a taste of her own medicine.  She was notorious not only for constant turnover in her own department but was behind firings of other people in other departments.  The bosses who let her get away with this all retired.  The guy who took over leadership of the organization was someone that she fought with and whom she had seriously pissed off.  Once he had the authority to fire her he wasted no time.  Oops, made the mistake of not identifying the next in line and cozy up.  Unfortunately he fired her whole department with the exception of one person who was smart enough to identify who would succeed the retiring executives and took measures to distance herself.  She eventually became president of the organization.   

To be honest, I was quite satisfied with hearing the outcome.  And I didn't have to spend money or go through legal hassles. Maybe @Warlord1986 you will have the same satisfaction.

I'm pretty sure that's already in the works. This woman (as well as my former supervisor) made it a point to tick off and/or backstab everyone who crossed their paths. People notice this stuff.

The story about the guy on the GI Bill fills my heart with joy.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: A Fella from Stella on July 06, 2019, 10:07:42 AM
My wife was working in a call center for the veterans hospital .................

Please thank your wife for me.  I know veterans can be very difficult to deal with.  I am one.  Often the VA as an institution screwed them over and people like your wife, who are actually effective, have to deal with the fallout, plus the other veteran problems.

I will. She knows how much veterans can hate the VA, but from the inside ended up having a lot of respect for the insititution as as proof that we probably can nationalize healthcare given its overall success.

Thankfully because of the Vietnam vets who got no help from "the greatest generation" Post-9/11 vets have amazing benefits that are setting them up for such incredible success.

She and I used our benefits to buy a home, get AA, BS and MBAs, and last year even got free tickets to a major tennis event where we brought a bunch of kids from the local HS so they could see Sloane Stephens.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: A Fella from Stella on July 06, 2019, 10:17:53 AM
My oldest was working at a grocery store, and absolutely hated it, but had a goal to sock away $5k. As she was approaching 18 she let her boss know "I'm turning 18 and would like to move into one of the departments, preferably in the back."

Boss said she wasn't sure (my daughter was repeatedly the most efficient cashier - they tracked and posted it each week).

"Okay, well, I'm giving notice that if I'm not moved when I turn 18, I'm leaving."

Her birthday came and they said they just couldn't move her, despite the posting that there were openings. She submitted official with resignation paperwork with 2 more weeks notice, and was gone. When she didn't show up, a manager called and told her she was supposed to be at work, and could be fired. She said, "I gave notice. It's in my file. But I'll come in if I can work off the register."

She's had 4 months off and this coming week begins her new job. She still has $5k in the bank because she's done some babysitting.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: SwordGuy on July 06, 2019, 10:54:21 AM
My oldest was working at a grocery store, and absolutely hated it, but had a goal to sock away $5k. As she was approaching 18 she let her boss know "I'm turning 18 and would like to move into one of the departments, preferably in the back."

Boss said she wasn't sure (my daughter was repeatedly the most efficient cashier - they tracked and posted it each week).

"Okay, well, I'm giving notice that if I'm not moved when I turn 18, I'm leaving."

Her birthday came and they said they just couldn't move her, despite the posting that there were openings. She submitted official with resignation paperwork with 2 more weeks notice, and was gone. When she didn't show up, a manager called and told her she was supposed to be at work, and could be fired. She said, "I gave notice. It's in my file. But I'll come in if I can work off the register."

She's had 4 months off and this coming week begins her new job. She still has $5k in the bank because she's done some babysitting.

That's really bad management!   It's as bad as my last manager, who had me rewrite my letter of resignation 3 times to get it to his standards, and then was completely surprised I was quitting when my last day at work neared.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: scottish on July 06, 2019, 12:03:18 PM
That's a time to be passive-aggressive.

"I'll get right on that boss.   Have it on your desk by the end of the week..."
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: SwordGuy on July 06, 2019, 12:05:44 PM
That's a time to be passive-aggressive.

"I'll get right on that boss.   Have it on your desk by the end of the week..."

I wrote the first one on my time, as is fair.

After that, it was work as assigned, so I did it on the clock.   If that's what he wanted to pay me to do, okey-dokey.   I was tired of programming in JavaScript anyway. :)
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: FireLane on July 08, 2019, 08:38:08 AM
That's really bad management!   It's as bad as my last manager, who had me rewrite my letter of resignation 3 times to get it to his standards, and then was completely surprised I was quitting when my last day at work neared.

Uh, WTF? What kind of micromanaging asshole demands rewrites on a resignation letter? Once he's seen the letter, the necessary information has been conveyed. It doesn't need to be beautiful!

If it were me, I'd have made it shorter and more curt each time he said it wasn't good enough:

"Dear Boss: Quit. -Me"
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: HMman on July 09, 2019, 01:24:42 PM
That's really bad management!   It's as bad as my last manager, who had me rewrite my letter of resignation 3 times to get it to his standards, and then was completely surprised I was quitting when my last day at work neared.

Uh, WTF? What kind of micromanaging asshole demands rewrites on a resignation letter? Once he's seen the letter, the necessary information has been conveyed. It doesn't need to be beautiful!

If it were me, I'd have made it shorter and more curt each time he said it wasn't good enough:

"Dear Boss: Quit. -Me"

Sounds like the Nixon approach. Short and sweet:

(https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/b/b4/Letter_of_Resignation_of_Richard_M._Nixon%2C_1974.jpg/585px-Letter_of_Resignation_of_Richard_M._Nixon%2C_1974.jpg)
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: A Fella from Stella on July 09, 2019, 03:15:17 PM
I'm not sure what it says about me that I have multiple stories between me, my wife, kids, and friends, but.......

Buddy of mine is a lawyer. Upon graduating he got a good job, but then received notice that his Peace Corps application was accepted. He accepted the appointment.

PEACE CORPS: We know you want to go to China to do government consulting, but we want to send you to Micronesia where you'll teach English to children.

FRIEND: Uhhhhhhhh, no.

PEACE CORPS: But it will be like a 2 year vacation, teaching children on a beach.

FRIEND: Nope.

They relented.

While in the Peace Corps, he ended up having serious problems with the leadership his second year. He was really stressing about it, but enjoyed the work, and was making good contacts. Multiple times, he was offered jobs at different businesses, but turned them down so he could finish his tour.

Then his father died. While home on convalescence, he thought over all of the stuff he dealt with, and concluded that he'd actually been in a very hostile work environment. Wanting to just finish his tour, he was going to let it go, but then he began receiving emails while home with an annual review that was very poor, and was told he was required to sign immediately.

FRIEND: "I'm burying my father and caring for my mother. I will address this in 1 week."

PEACE CORPS: "No, you must sign it or face further consequences."

A week later he replied with points he contended with (they said he was AWOL on a day that turned out to be a Chinese Holiday, and another where he was photographed by a newspaper while working).

He strung it out for a month, extending his time at home when he found out from a friend they'd boxed up all of his personal effects and moved him to another apartment, claiming that he and his mother were too distraught. All the while he was interviewing with Chinese businesses. Upon receiving an agreeable offer, he resigned from the Peace Corps and let his new employer fly him business class to Beijing.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: FIPurpose on July 09, 2019, 04:02:40 PM
I'm not sure what it says about me that I have multiple stories between me, my wife, kids, and friends, but.......

Buddy of mine is a lawyer. Upon graduating he got a good job, but then received notice that his Peace Corps application was accepted. He accepted the appointment.

PEACE CORPS: We know you want to go to China to do government consulting, but we want to send you to Micronesia where you'll teach English to children.

FRIEND: Uhhhhhhhh, no.

PEACE CORPS: But it will be like a 2 year vacation, teaching children on a beach.

FRIEND: Nope.

They relented.

While in the Peace Corps, he ended up having serious problems with the leadership his second year. He was really stressing about it, but enjoyed the work, and was making good contacts. Multiple times, he was offered jobs at different businesses, but turned them down so he could finish his tour.

Then his father died. While home on convalescence, he thought over all of the stuff he dealt with, and concluded that he'd actually been in a very hostile work environment. Wanting to just finish his tour, he was going to let it go, but then he began receiving emails while home with an annual review that was very poor, and was told he was required to sign immediately.

FRIEND: "I'm burying my father and caring for my mother. I will address this in 1 week."

PEACE CORPS: "No, you must sign it or face further consequences."

A week later he replied with points he contended with (they said he was AWOL on a day that turned out to be a Chinese Holiday, and another where he was photographed by a newspaper while working).

He strung it out for a month, extending his time at home when he found out from a friend they'd boxed up all of his personal effects and moved him to another apartment, claiming that he and his mother were too distraught. All the while he was interviewing with Chinese businesses. Upon receiving an agreeable offer, he resigned from the Peace Corps and let his new employer fly him business class to Beijing.

Sounds about right.

VOLUNTEER: hey, I'm in a really toxic environment; I'm constantly in danger of sexual assault from my co-workers; I can't do any real work because my house is so poorly constructed that I have to work on it in order to keep living.

PEACE CORPS: well, that's Peace Corps. It's what you signed up for.

VOLUNTEER: Yeah can you just move somewhere else, or at least pay an extra $50 a month for a house that isn't falling apart.

PEACE CORPS: No. This is what you signed up for (just ignore all the promises on the website). This is just how PC is.

VOLUNTEER: Well, then I don't really have any other choice but to quit.

PEACE CORPS: *sigh of relief* here's your ticket back home. byyyyeee!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Slow&Steady on July 11, 2019, 08:36:28 AM
Not really FU money ... but my current job is pissing me off and I already have another one lined up (so maybe FU experience)

I started my current job 18 months ago, it was a HUGE raise and really got me out of a toxic environment.  Current job pays well, was a move up the ladder, has decent benefits but the commute sucks, it requires travel, the work/life balance is fake, the ENTIRE office lacks personality, and I have continuously been asked to do something with no background information but then magically there are all these documents that I should have consulted (that I didn't know existed) after I have re-created the wheel and not done it to match the background documents.

I was asked a couple of weeks ago to develop a training that we could turn into an online training.  This was annoying because you could pay for this type of training right off the shelf but I was told that we want it specific to our facilities, okay whatever.  So I have spent the last couple weeks trying to figure out exactly what they want in this and utilizing prepared documents (that I had access to) pertaining to this topic.  I sent the draft of the content out yesterday before I left (early) for the day, and was feeling really good about getting things marked off my list.  This morning I have an email that says "Let's talk about this in the morning and make sure you bring the quick reference guide that the facilities have for this topic" ... I have never seen or heard about this quick reference guide and have been giving in-person training on this topic for over 18 months.  My supervisor that sent that email acted shocked when I told him I did not know what he was talking about and proceeded to try to find the quick reference guide, he also does not have a copy of it. When I asked why he didn't tell me that he wanted the training to be based on the quick reference guide in the 1st place he told me that he wanted to see what I would come up with on my own. The part that I have "missing" in the training is a very specific formula that the company developed internally several years ago to determine if a specific step needs to be taken. Apparently, in this quick reference guide is the only place that the formula is listed.

Now I have wasted 2 weeks putting this thing together and it doesn't have the information in it that they wanted, because I was never given this information.  Beyond that I have given training for this topic in-person 4 different times and the reference has never been brought up.  My supervisor starts asking why I didn't look though the box of stuff from the person that had my job before.  UMMM, because there is no box and it is your responsibility to make sure I am "trained" for my job or at least have access to the documents required to do my job, specifically if they pertain to an exact topic that I am asking you about!

I have submitted 4 week notice (because I feel like 2 weeks is too short to not burn bridges) and will be going to a different job that pays even better, has a 9/80 schedule, better commute, doesn't require travel, and I just got an email from my new supervisor that shows that the work/life balance isn't fake and that he has a personality.  Getting the email from my future boss at the same time as I was dealing with this crap from my current boss really made me just want to walk out.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: jps on July 11, 2019, 09:09:16 AM
Not really FU money ... but my current job is pissing me off and I already have another one lined up (so maybe FU experience)

I started my current job 18 months ago, it was a HUGE raise and really got me out of a toxic environment.  Current job pays well, was a move up the ladder, has decent benefits but the commute sucks, it requires travel, the work/life balance is fake, the ENTIRE office lacks personality, and I have continuously been asked to do something with no background information but then magically there are all these documents that I should have consulted (that I didn't know existed) after I have re-created the wheel and not done it to match the background documents.

I was asked a couple of weeks ago to develop a training that we could turn into an online training.  This was annoying because you could pay for this type of training right off the shelf but I was told that we want it specific to our facilities, okay whatever.  So I have spent the last couple weeks trying to figure out exactly what they want in this and utilizing prepared documents (that I had access to) pertaining to this topic.  I sent the draft of the content out yesterday before I left (early) for the day, and was feeling really good about getting things marked off my list.  This morning I have an email that says "Let's talk about this in the morning and make sure you bring the quick reference guide that the facilities have for this topic" ... I have never seen or heard about this quick reference guide and have been giving in-person training on this topic for over 18 months.  My supervisor that sent that email acted shocked when I told him I did not know what he was talking about and proceeded to try to find the quick reference guide, he also does not have a copy of it. When I asked why he didn't tell me that he wanted the training to be based on the quick reference guide in the 1st place he told me that he wanted to see what I would come up with on my own. The part that I have "missing" in the training is a very specific formula that the company developed internally several years ago to determine if a specific step needs to be taken. Apparently, in this quick reference guide is the only place that the formula is listed.

Now I have wasted 2 weeks putting this thing together and it doesn't have the information in it that they wanted, because I was never given this information.  Beyond that I have given training for this topic in-person 4 different times and the reference has never been brought up.  My supervisor starts asking why I didn't look though the box of stuff from the person that had my job before.  UMMM, because there is no box and it is your responsibility to make sure I am "trained" for my job or at least have access to the documents required to do my job, specifically if they pertain to an exact topic that I am asking you about!

I have submitted 4 week notice (because I feel like 2 weeks is too short to not burn bridges) and will be going to a different job that pays even better, has a 9/80 schedule, better commute, doesn't require travel, and I just got an email from my new supervisor that shows that the work/life balance isn't fake and that he has a personality.  Getting the email from my future boss at the same time as I was dealing with this crap from my current boss really made me just want to walk out.

Sounds like a great opportunity to escape a bad situation! Nice work.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: A Fella from Stella on July 11, 2019, 09:46:10 AM
Not really FU money ... but my current job is pissing me off and I already have another one lined up (so maybe FU experience)

........................

will be going to a different job that pays even better, has a 9/80 schedule, better commute, doesn't require travel, and I just got an email from my new supervisor that shows that the work/life balance isn't fake and that he has a personality.  Getting the email from my future boss at the same time as I was dealing with this crap from my current boss really made me just want to walk out.

A little comedy bit about working at a place where you gave notice

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PHgNMJviO6I

Enjoy and good luck.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Mesmoiselle on July 12, 2019, 04:00:36 AM
I'm a medical contractor. Last company I contracted with, my contact was full of passive aggressive shenanigans. But since I really only had to put up with him twice per job, I didn't care more than actually getting a 401k match. Until he had the audacity to try to drop me as a contractor with little fanfare. I was pretty annoyed, but not enough to go out of my way to spend effort to complain. They'd lost me as a client; punishment given. And Jobs get thrown at me constantly by multiple companies as it is. But then his company emailed me asking for feedback.

Well, if you're going to go email me for feedback... I gave full blown with names, and Facebook and text references. Would have attached a photo file if I could. And that I would go out of my way to not recommend them ever to any one of my fellow contractors.

Phone started blowing up, all the paperwork I'd requested weeks before showed up, and then I get an email. Pretty please would I talk to Mr. Passive Aggressive. I replied, "You made it very clear you didn't wish to work with me anymore. I agree with that decision. Thank you."

And that was the end of that. Bridge burned and I don't care.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: ducky19 on July 12, 2019, 01:23:55 PM
I'm a medical contractor. Last company I contracted with, my contact was full of passive aggressive shenanigans. But since I really only had to put up with him twice per job, I didn't care more than actually getting a 401k match. Until he had the audacity to try to drop me as a contractor with little fanfare. I was pretty annoyed, but not enough to go out of my way to spend effort to complain. They'd lost me as a client; punishment given. And Jobs get thrown at me constantly by multiple companies as it is. But then his company emailed me asking for feedback.

Well, if you're going to go email me for feedback... I gave full blown with names, and Facebook and text references. Would have attached a photo file if I could. And that I would go out of my way to not recommend them ever to any one of my fellow contractors.

Phone started blowing up, all the paperwork I'd requested weeks before showed up, and then I get an email. Pretty please would I talk to Mr. Passive Aggressive. I replied, "You made it very clear you didn't wish to work with me anymore. I agree with that decision. Thank you."

And that was the end of that. Bridge burned and I don't care.

EPIC. Thanks for sharing!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: AnnaGrowsAMustache on July 12, 2019, 05:45:48 PM
I just started a new job after FU-ing the last job, which was awful. The new job seems easy, with no responsibility and good pay. However, there's a VERY high staff turnover and most of the staff seem frustrated with what is definately an old fashioned system. There's constant negativity. I find it kind of amusing, partly because of my last employment experience and partly because my area of activity in the new job is dealing with incident reports at prisons and corrections centers nationally. The kind of incidents I get would make any job seem like a breeze. For instance, at no point today has anyone spat in my mouth, or punched me in the head multiple times, or stabbed me in the eye with their finger, or broken my arm.

Anyone who works in a shitty, stressful environment, who can leave, should leave. I just wanted to share my new found perspective on stressful jobs!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Maenad on July 12, 2019, 05:58:30 PM
And that was the end of that. Bridge burned and I don't care.

Nice! Some bridges need to be burned - bad actions need to have consequences if there's to be any hope of a healthy workplace.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Mesmoiselle on July 13, 2019, 04:24:34 AM
And that was the end of that. Bridge burned and I don't care.

Nice! Some bridges need to be burned - bad actions need to have consequences if there's to be any hope of a healthy workplace.

As far as I can tell, Mr. p.A. still works with them but he seems? Quieter? On the Traveling Contract Facebook group I mentioned in the feedback email.

So maybe I've helped that Facebook group out at least
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: A Fella from Stella on July 17, 2019, 07:14:02 PM
Co-worker of mine at a family run business took on the kind of responsibility you want an employee to take on. He was traveling to see customers, putting in good amounts of billable hours, and the business' biggest client considered him "part of the team."

While he was making a couple hundred thousand for the company, he was only making $40k.

Meanwhile, I'd be in meetings where they were saying the guy wasn't that great an employee. Basically, they were worried he'd ask for what he was worth in year 2. What they didn't know is that he had two other gigs going.

Becoming unhappy with the situation, he gave 2 months notice. They talked about just firing him, but decided they'd make him suffer by only having him work 24 hours a week, and pay him 40% less; that way he could go to the big clients, but get paid less. Well, it turned out the guy had never once called in sick, took a vacation day, or used credit hours (there was no OT, just credit), so when the timesheets came in, he was allocating those hours. They were totally pissed, and actually OWED HIM money when he left!

When he left, it was to go hiking for the month - mostly daily jaunts on different trails.

2 years later, the epic FU came. He sent us all invitations to his house warming.

"Hmmpph. Probably a gift grab," someone said.

Invitation specifically said, NO GIFTS.

Of the 12 invites, I was the only one who went. They couldn't stand the idea that he ended up doing just fine without them.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Taran Wanderer on July 17, 2019, 10:43:58 PM
We hear about entitlement mentality with regard to public assistance quite a bit, but this type of entitlement mentality really bugs me. Here is someone who is making the family owned company money, and they don’t reward it or celebrate it. Maybe they even begrudge it a little. And then when the guy is doing fine without them, they hold it against him. What kind of messed up situation is that? 
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Dicey on July 17, 2019, 11:47:24 PM
We hear about entitlement mentality with regard to public assistance quite a bit, but this type of entitlement mentality really bugs me. Here is someone who is making the family owned company money, and they don’t reward it or celebrate it. Maybe they even begrudge it a little. And then when the guy is doing fine without them, they hold it against him. What kind of messed up situation is that?
Sounds like the good ol' green-eyed monster.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: zolotiyeruki on July 18, 2019, 06:17:48 AM
We hear about entitlement mentality with regard to public assistance quite a bit, but this type of entitlement mentality really bugs me. Here is someone who is making the family owned company money, and they don’t reward it or celebrate it. Maybe they even begrudge it a little. And then when the guy is doing fine without them, they hold it against him. What kind of messed up situation is that?
I think the entitlement mentality applies to people in lots of situations, not just those on public assistance.  I, for one, have to check myself occasionally, even though I'm fully employed and self-sufficient.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: SwordGuy on July 18, 2019, 07:35:45 AM
We hear about entitlement mentality with regard to public assistance quite a bit, but this type of entitlement mentality really bugs me. Here is someone who is making the family owned company money, and they don’t reward it or celebrate it. Maybe they even begrudge it a little. And then when the guy is doing fine without them, they hold it against him. What kind of messed up situation is that?
I'm willing to bet those family owners aren't the founder of the company.  They are probably 2nd or 3rd generation, 3rd-rate people who have it better than their merits deserve due to their inheritance.   Deep down they know it and someone with real competence working near them just makes the contrast between their inadequacy and the other person's ability that much clearer.  Being 3rd-rate people, they don't take that as a challenge to better themselves so they put down the other person instead.

Explains a lot about today's world in the country I live in.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: A Fella from Stella on July 18, 2019, 08:07:51 AM
We hear about entitlement mentality with regard to public assistance quite a bit, but this type of entitlement mentality really bugs me. Here is someone who is making the family owned company money, and they don’t reward it or celebrate it. Maybe they even begrudge it a little. And then when the guy is doing fine without them, they hold it against him. What kind of messed up situation is that?
I'm willing to bet those family owners aren't the founder of the company.  They are probably 2nd or 3rd generation, 3rd-rate people who have it better than their merits deserve due to their inheritance.   Deep down they know it and someone with real competence working near them just makes the contrast between their inadequacy and the other person's ability that much clearer.  Being 3rd-rate people, they don't take that as a challenge to better themselves so they put down the other person instead.

Explains a lot about today's world in the country I live in.

That's an incredible insight. Supposedly, "Big Al" was a generous guy who loved giving a well-earned bonus. "Middle and Little Al" were the opposite. They hated that someone else might make money, and even fired a guy for bringing in a huge client at an initially discounted rate, saying it was because he cost them $80,000..........even $1,000,000 later.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: mm1970 on July 18, 2019, 11:26:04 AM
We hear about entitlement mentality with regard to public assistance quite a bit, but this type of entitlement mentality really bugs me. Here is someone who is making the family owned company money, and they don’t reward it or celebrate it. Maybe they even begrudge it a little. And then when the guy is doing fine without them, they hold it against him. What kind of messed up situation is that?
I dunno, it's weird.  My sister is an office manager for an insurance company.  Has been for decades.  She's really good at it.  15 years ago or so, her boss gave her the opportunity to get certified to do insurance sales.  It was a small office at that point, with two owners / insurance salesmen, and two office workers.

Well, she got certified, and turned out that she was good at it!  When it came time to pay her the $400 commission for her first sales, they balked.  And decided that she needed to stay as the office manager.  She got mad but never did fight it much (not a lot of jobs in the rural community).  Actually, eventually they built a prison nearby, so she got a job there.  Spent a week managing inputs for prisoners, twice the power went out and she was locked in a room with prisoners (it was a state prison, so... bad people.) 

That was enough for her.  She called her boss, they were desperate without her, so she got her job back WITH health insurance (no, she'd never had it before, was always on her husband's insurance, but he was out of a job soon, so they needed insurance.)

Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: partgypsy on July 18, 2019, 11:37:06 AM
Wow, the boss who burned her bridges after her protectors were gone, sound so much like an old boss of mine. She bragged about having dirt on people, making someone else effectively resign to an honorary only job. She was trying behind the scenes to get the head of the department she was in demoted or gone. She made it plain she wanted to move to administrative role and be the head. So while she had her sources for gossip and dirt, she also made a lot of enemies. Even during my time some people refused to work with her.

After I got pregnant it became a very hostile work situation, and she ended up (after much verbal abuse and harrasment) firing me in a pique post-baby. While I did have people coming out of the wood work after I was fired to hear my story, I wanted to move on and didn't gossip (though I did file a complain with eeoc). Anyways around 3 years after I had left, I heard she was gone. I never heard why exactly. As she was always saying discriminatory things in earshot of people which was ignored, someone more powerful than her probably ended up using everything that ended up in her file against her to force her out. Never did get that administrator role that she wanted (understatement!). 
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: fantabulous on August 02, 2019, 01:13:46 AM
Thought I'd add my own, despite not having any serious FU money or having to say FU to work. Last week I came out as transgender at work to little excitement. Having enough money to cover my debts and enough job skills to find some remote work if need be helped me to get over the whole lack of employment protection concern I had. You might say I said FU to being closeted instead.

Also, to be both foamy and on topic, my bosses were all kinds of supportive in helping me get enough things sorted out before making the big announcement. This let me relatively focus on work without them simply cracking the whip.

Maybe epic in that I have a 4.5 year old update to this. Over this time span, I've remained at the same web hosting company, have become a locally known trans activist, and now have solid FU money. At an upbeat company wide meeting, I asked the CEO what the company's plans were for handling customers who are potentially dangerous to myself and other employees. I got to watch the CEO and CFO squirm in front of an audience trying to address the question, and practically feel the breathlessness in the room. I also now have a direct in with the CFO to air further concerns. I have my transition and my activism work to thank for my spine, and FU money as a safety net.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: former player on August 02, 2019, 01:29:06 AM
Thought I'd add my own, despite not having any serious FU money or having to say FU to work. Last week I came out as transgender at work to little excitement. Having enough money to cover my debts and enough job skills to find some remote work if need be helped me to get over the whole lack of employment protection concern I had. You might say I said FU to being closeted instead.

Also, to be both foamy and on topic, my bosses were all kinds of supportive in helping me get enough things sorted out before making the big announcement. This let me relatively focus on work without them simply cracking the whip.

Maybe epic in that I have a 4.5 year old update to this. Over this time span, I've remained at the same web hosting company, have become a locally known trans activist, and now have solid FU money. At an upbeat company wide meeting, I asked the CEO what the company's plans were for handling customers who are potentially dangerous to myself and other employees. I got to watch the CEO and CFO squirm in front of an audience trying to address the question, and practically feel the breathlessness in the room. I also now have a direct in with the CFO to air further concerns. I have my transition and my activism work to thank for my spine, and FU money as a safety net.
What a splendid update.  Congratulations to all of it.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: sea_saw on August 02, 2019, 02:57:09 AM
YES! Amazing work.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: BicycleB on August 02, 2019, 04:22:19 AM
^Impressive, @fantabulous!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: rantk81 on August 02, 2019, 08:31:27 AM
Thought I'd add my own, despite not having any serious FU money or having to say FU to work. Last week I came out as transgender at work to little excitement. Having enough money to cover my debts and enough job skills to find some remote work if need be helped me to get over the whole lack of employment protection concern I had. You might say I said FU to being closeted instead.

Also, to be both foamy and on topic, my bosses were all kinds of supportive in helping me get enough things sorted out before making the big announcement. This let me relatively focus on work without them simply cracking the whip.

Maybe epic in that I have a 4.5 year old update to this. Over this time span, I've remained at the same web hosting company, have become a locally known trans activist, and now have solid FU money. At an upbeat company wide meeting, I asked the CEO what the company's plans were for handling customers who are potentially dangerous to myself and other employees. I got to watch the CEO and CFO squirm in front of an audience trying to address the question, and practically feel the breathlessness in the room. I also now have a direct in with the CFO to air further concerns. I have my transition and my activism work to thank for my spine, and FU money as a safety net.

Congratulations!  I can't even fathom the guts that must have taken to do that.  Another reason we should all be striving for FU Money!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: RyanAtTanagra on August 02, 2019, 09:38:10 AM
Thought I'd add my own, despite not having any serious FU money or having to say FU to work. Last week I came out as transgender at work to little excitement. Having enough money to cover my debts and enough job skills to find some remote work if need be helped me to get over the whole lack of employment protection concern I had. You might say I said FU to being closeted instead.

Also, to be both foamy and on topic, my bosses were all kinds of supportive in helping me get enough things sorted out before making the big announcement. This let me relatively focus on work without them simply cracking the whip.

Maybe epic in that I have a 4.5 year old update to this. Over this time span, I've remained at the same web hosting company, have become a locally known trans activist, and now have solid FU money. At an upbeat company wide meeting, I asked the CEO what the company's plans were for handling customers who are potentially dangerous to myself and other employees. I got to watch the CEO and CFO squirm in front of an audience trying to address the question, and practically feel the breathlessness in the room. I also now have a direct in with the CFO to air further concerns. I have my transition and my activism work to thank for my spine, and FU money as a safety net.

Is there more background to this?  It sounds like your company was supportive then you needlessly put them on the spot with a difficult question out of nowhere in front of everyone?
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Maenad on August 02, 2019, 10:37:31 AM
We live in a world with a lot of people that think that discrimination and outright violence towards LGBT+ people is A-OK, and the LGBT+ people and allies have gotten tired of pretending it isn't a problem. Additionally, more and more people are getting tired of bad behavior in the workplace and in business relationships in general. Those of us that do not have to tolerate toxicity have an obligation to speak up for people who don't have that freedom.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: former player on August 02, 2019, 10:43:30 AM
Thought I'd add my own, despite not having any serious FU money or having to say FU to work. Last week I came out as transgender at work to little excitement. Having enough money to cover my debts and enough job skills to find some remote work if need be helped me to get over the whole lack of employment protection concern I had. You might say I said FU to being closeted instead.

Also, to be both foamy and on topic, my bosses were all kinds of supportive in helping me get enough things sorted out before making the big announcement. This let me relatively focus on work without them simply cracking the whip.

Maybe epic in that I have a 4.5 year old update to this. Over this time span, I've remained at the same web hosting company, have become a locally known trans activist, and now have solid FU money. At an upbeat company wide meeting, I asked the CEO what the company's plans were for handling customers who are potentially dangerous to myself and other employees. I got to watch the CEO and CFO squirm in front of an audience trying to address the question, and practically feel the breathlessness in the room. I also now have a direct in with the CFO to air further concerns. I have my transition and my activism work to thank for my spine, and FU money as a safety net.

Is there more background to this?  It sounds like your company was supportive then you needlessly put them on the spot with a difficult question out of nowhere in front of everyone?
What on earth about the question "how do you keep your employees safe" is supposed to be difficult?  If it's difficult, it's because the company is not doing the job it should be and making sure its employees are safe at work, and with Trump's policies and rhetoric in relation to transpeople the issue of safety is more pertinent for them now than ever.   Not having an answer is a big red flag and I'm glad @fantabulous' company seems to be recognising that.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: RyanAtTanagra on August 02, 2019, 11:01:01 AM
We live in a world with a lot of people that think that discrimination and outright violence towards LGBT+ people is A-OK, and the LGBT+ people and allies have gotten tired of pretending it isn't a problem. Additionally, more and more people are getting tired of bad behavior in the workplace and in business relationships in general. Those of us that do not have to tolerate toxicity have an obligation to speak up for people who don't have that freedom.

I agree with all of that.

What on earth about the question "how do you keep your employees safe" is supposed to be difficult?  If it's difficult, it's because the company is not doing the job it should be and making sure its employees are safe at work, and with Trump's policies and rhetoric in relation to transpeople the issue of safety is more pertinent for them now than ever.   Not having an answer is a big red flag and I'm glad @fantabulous' company seems to be recognising that.

Is there a history of danger from customers at the company?  An upbeat meeting seems like a weird time to bring that up out of nowhere, if it isn't something that was attempted to get addressed previously, which is why I was wondering if there was more backstory to it.  If I was working at a web hosting company (which usually has zero in-person interaction with customers) I'd probably be caught off guard by that question too.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Padonak on August 02, 2019, 11:04:44 AM


Is there more background to this?  It sounds like your company was supportive then you needlessly put them on the spot with a difficult question out of nowhere in front of everyone?

One of the main reasons I am trying to reach FI is so that i can avoid people who try to put me on the spot.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: fantabulous on August 02, 2019, 11:22:24 AM
Is there more background to this?  It sounds like your company was supportive then you needlessly put them on the spot with a difficult question out of nowhere in front of everyone?

Hate sites the company hosts and the credible doxxing threat from customers who host these sites came to light at the company recently. This is a company with phone/email based support, and not a self service provider. While this is the first time I spoke directly to the executives about it, I had already spoken to managers about the need for policy. Whether that be updating the company's terms of services, flagging potentially dangerous accounts, etc, there was very little in place. I gave a face to the real human cost of "just business", and notably forced them to address the issue to rank and file employees. There wasn't any avoiding putting them on the spot, save for sitting down when I needed to stand up for my coworkers who weren't in a position to do so. It was still a very measured question I posed, because I know how to shoot for the goal of change rather than merely embarrassment. A reminder that as part of my update, I now have the CFO's ear in these matters in addition to managers.

Edit to add: While I had planned throughout the meeting to speak up, I likely would have continued pursuing less public channels if the concerns were addressed to any degree at the meeting. They were not.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: minimustache1985 on August 02, 2019, 11:27:32 AM
Thought I'd add my own, despite not having any serious FU money or having to say FU to work. Last week I came out as transgender at work to little excitement. Having enough money to cover my debts and enough job skills to find some remote work if need be helped me to get over the whole lack of employment protection concern I had. You might say I said FU to being closeted instead.

Also, to be both foamy and on topic, my bosses were all kinds of supportive in helping me get enough things sorted out before making the big announcement. This let me relatively focus on work without them simply cracking the whip.

Maybe epic in that I have a 4.5 year old update to this. Over this time span, I've remained at the same web hosting company, have become a locally known trans activist, and now have solid FU money. At an upbeat company wide meeting, I asked the CEO what the company's plans were for handling customers who are potentially dangerous to myself and other employees. I got to watch the CEO and CFO squirm in front of an audience trying to address the question, and practically feel the breathlessness in the room. I also now have a direct in with the CFO to air further concerns. I have my transition and my activism work to thank for my spine, and FU money as a safety net.

Is there more background to this?  It sounds like your company was supportive then you needlessly put them on the spot with a difficult question out of nowhere in front of everyone?
What on earth about the question "how do you keep your employees safe" is supposed to be difficult?  If it's difficult, it's because the company is not doing the job it should be and making sure its employees are safe at work, and with Trump's policies and rhetoric in relation to transpeople the issue of safety is more pertinent for them now than ever.   Not having an answer is a big red flag and I'm glad @fantabulous' company seems to be recognising that.
Agreed, and many companies don’t have a real answer.  I’m a cis woman who had a national customer rep threaten to spank me and had a good laugh.  My company told me to avoid being alone with that rep- they didn’t do squat, they weren’t going to risk the account and our HR couldn’t do anything to another company’s employee.  Thankfully I only had to interact with the jerk a few times a year, and my verbal response to the incident was enough to dissuade him from continuing to say crap like that to me.  I don’t think this guy would have actually laid a hand on me, but it was clear that if he did it would have been my problem.

My FU was deciding to become a SAHM, which we could do because of saving hard before having our son, though I left the company on good terms with an extended notice to transition accounts before departing, and didn’t actually tell anyone to F off.

@fantabulous it’s wonderful you’re able to have that influence and stand up for not only yourself but those who may otherwise feel forced to put up with it to keep food on their tables.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: BlueHouse on August 03, 2019, 09:00:27 AM
Quote
seems like a weird time to bring that up out of nowhere

I really appreciate the education I'm getting from the MeToo movement and the LGBQT and the BLM activist movements.  I'm just a regular person, but am starting to realize all the ways I've been socialized to think certain behaviors are normal, if not okay.  I'm now starting to realize that we all have to think different and that's hard to do.  Bottom line:  it's not okay to NOT have a plan for the safety of all your employees.  It doesn't sound as if @fantabulous was aggressive, just trying to call attention to the need for a plan right now. 
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: RyanAtTanagra on August 03, 2019, 11:02:40 AM
Is there more background to this?  It sounds like your company was supportive then you needlessly put them on the spot with a difficult question out of nowhere in front of everyone?

Hate sites the company hosts and the credible doxxing threat from customers who host these sites came to light at the company recently. This is a company with phone/email based support, and not a self service provider. While this is the first time I spoke directly to the executives about it, I had already spoken to managers about the need for policy. Whether that be updating the company's terms of services, flagging potentially dangerous accounts, etc, there was very little in place. I gave a face to the real human cost of "just business", and notably forced them to address the issue to rank and file employees. There wasn't any avoiding putting them on the spot, save for sitting down when I needed to stand up for my coworkers who weren't in a position to do so. It was still a very measured question I posed, because I know how to shoot for the goal of change rather than merely embarrassment. A reminder that as part of my update, I now have the CFO's ear in these matters in addition to managers.

Edit to add: While I had planned throughout the meeting to speak up, I likely would have continued pursuing less public channels if the concerns were addressed to any degree at the meeting. They were not.

Thanks for the follow up!  I knew there had to be more to the story.  That makes total sense and I commend you for insisting on safety for everyone.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Siebrie on August 12, 2019, 08:20:05 AM
I was hired as Admin (Legal) 11 years ago, by a boss who the interim agency described as 'difficult', so I upped my requested salary by $700/month, and she agreed :) (I should have asked for more). The job was fulltime and permanent from day one. I was trained for a week by the guy that was leaving (his 6-month temp job wasn't prolonged), then I worked on my own for a week, then I had to train my new colleague Admin. We work for the Department (proofreading, layout, filing, corporate housekeeping, Board of Directors support, odd jobs for boss directly).

I worked for that boss for 6 years, and I had 5 Admin colleagues in that time; they all left more or less quickly due to my difficult boss. I could not leave, because my boyfriend/fiance/husband was still studying or in lowpaying jobs, we had two children (2x16wks paid maternity leave), and bought a house, and we needed my income. Then, my boss was fired! Joy!

No boss for 6 months, the whole Department (4 lawyers at different levels of seniority) lightened up. New boss for 2 years, until she got promoted back to her old company (European-American MSA affair). Wonderful boss, great fun to work for, but she thought I was her PA .....

In the meantime, husband has work experience and changes jobs twice, and now earns a normal income (nothing crazy, but decent). Also, in the meantime, company is acquired by Chinese, and company culture changes from family business vibe to strictly commercial/no mercy.

New boss comes in, thinks I'm her PA only, gives my Admin colleague a well-deserved promotion, and then doesn't replace her! I'm now on my own, trying to handle a workload even the two of us couldn't handle, working with a boss who refuses to hear that I'm not happy booking her private family vacation flights and visas to China when there is a proper work backlog. I hate booking flights, I'm a much better proofreader and librarian then I am a travel agent. Boss works from home two days a week, travels a lot, and when in the office, is in meetings all the time.

I run the numbers with husband; we will be able to cope on his salary alone, and he's behind me if I want to leave. I decide to stop pandering to boss, and will make my own list of priorities, and a list of items I'm not able to handle due to not enough time. Then, I find an email on the company printer: boss thinks I'm not loyal and am slacking, and wants to fire me (printed by HR! Who I have taught each one individually how to use secure print!). I have a bad night's sleep, but husband supports me, I start calling law firms, unions, and social security organisations to get all my ducks in a row, and wait for the exit interview. I clear my computer and desk, and collect private contact info of the few colleagues I would like to stay in touch with.

Interview comes, I am still in shock, but at least don't have the first wave of emotions and manage to handle it well. I hand in my phone and laptop immediately, to no longer be connected to them. Second meeting with HR a week later to discuss severance pay and I manage to negotiate 11 months pay (1 month for every year I worked there), outplacement services on top from reputed agency (by law, they have to offer, but only basic, and they can deduct it from the severance pay), health insurance until the end of the year, glowing letter of recommendation, certificate that I was fired due to a reorganisation (which allows me to claim unemployment benefits later).

I have now been home for 3 months and am destressing. The outplacement project has started, but I'm not really in a rush to start working again; I'd like to go back to University and finish my MA. The house is finally properly clean, kids are happy that I can pick them up and have the energy to play and discuss things eith them, husband is happy that he can now fully concentrate on his carreer (he picked dds up fromschool and cooked every night), I have time to contact old friends, and just walk outside as soon as the sun shines.

9 months later: we still haven't touched the payout money. We are living off of dh's salary, but slowly eating our other savings, so it's time for me to start jobhunting, or rather jobbaiting :) A lady I know has just started a non-profit, with government subsidy and lobbygroups' subsidy, to aid garage owners to test and sanatize the soil underneath their properties. I'll set up the admin/office management part, think up procedures for persuading and tracking the participants, and then plan to leave when the stressful part of actually contracting comes :)

I have enjoyed being at home, day trips, reading (so much reading!), gardening, and a fortnight in Austria with the four of us. Spending the full summer break with my daughters is fun!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: A Fella from Stella on August 20, 2019, 11:23:36 AM
Cousin of mine just told me this story:

He's working for a small machine shop run by a nice family. One day it snows (it doesn't snow often where he lives), so he calls in and says he's going to stay home since there'll be little-to-no work because trucks they expected to come in would be delayed. The boss says he'll pick him up.

"No," cousin says, "I'll just take a day off to be with my kids."

Next day his boss confronts him about why he really didn't come in. My cousin said he didn't want to miss this chance to be with his kids in the snow. Boss called him a liar.

And then he quit.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: bluebelle on August 20, 2019, 12:40:06 PM
Cousin of mine just told me this story:

He's working for a small machine shop run by a nice family. One day it snows (it doesn't snow often where he lives), so he calls in and says he's going to stay home since there'll be little-to-no work because trucks they expected to come in would be delayed. The boss says he'll pick him up.

"No," cousin says, "I'll just take a day off to be with my kids."

Next day his boss confronts him about why he really didn't come in. My cousin said he didn't want to miss this chance to be with his kids in the snow. Boss called him a liar.

And then he quit.
that is pretty epic.....can't say I'd like to work for someone that thinks calling me a liar is appropriate.  OTH, if there was work that needed doing, not coming in because you want to play in the snow is unfair to a small family business - they can't been their commitments.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: A Fella from Stella on August 20, 2019, 01:51:43 PM
Cousin of mine just told me this story:

He's working for a small machine shop run by a nice family. One day it snows (it doesn't snow often where he lives), so he calls in and says he's going to stay home since there'll be little-to-no work because trucks they expected to come in would be delayed. The boss says he'll pick him up.

"No," cousin says, "I'll just take a day off to be with my kids."

Next day his boss confronts him about why he really didn't come in. My cousin said he didn't want to miss this chance to be with his kids in the snow. Boss called him a liar.

And then he quit.
that is pretty epic.....can't say I'd like to work for someone that thinks calling me a liar is appropriate.  OTH, if there was work that needed doing, not coming in because you want to play in the snow is unfair to a small family business - they can't been their commitments.

He was specifically told work they expected wasn't going to be there, and that everyone else was there anyway (boss picked them up). Maybe the boss had a fun thing going on that he was excited about. Can't say. All I know is that my cousin said he was very confused about how it escalated like it did, but felt certain that leaving was the right thing to do.

He's been a SAHD dad for 8 months now and said he's never felt more fulfilled. I'm so happy for him because he's such a good dude.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: A Fella from Stella on August 20, 2019, 01:53:22 PM
Thought I'd add my own, despite not having any serious FU money or having to say FU to work. Last week I came out as transgender at work to little excitement. Having enough money to cover my debts and enough job skills to find some remote work if need be helped me to get over the whole lack of employment protection concern I had. You might say I said FU to being closeted instead.

Also, to be both foamy and on topic, my bosses were all kinds of supportive in helping me get enough things sorted out before making the big announcement. This let me relatively focus on work without them simply cracking the whip.

Maybe epic in that I have a 4.5 year old update to this. Over this time span, I've remained at the same web hosting company, have become a locally known trans activist, and now have solid FU money. At an upbeat company wide meeting, I asked the CEO what the company's plans were for handling customers who are potentially dangerous to myself and other employees. I got to watch the CEO and CFO squirm in front of an audience trying to address the question, and practically feel the breathlessness in the room. I also now have a direct in with the CFO to air further concerns. I have my transition and my activism work to thank for my spine, and FU money as a safety net.

Is there more background to this?  It sounds like your company was supportive then you needlessly put them on the spot with a difficult question out of nowhere in front of everyone?
What on earth about the question "how do you keep your employees safe" is supposed to be difficult?  If it's difficult, it's because the company is not doing the job it should be and making sure its employees are safe at work, and with Trump's policies and rhetoric in relation to transpeople the issue of safety is more pertinent for them now than ever.   Not having an answer is a big red flag and I'm glad @fantabulous' company seems to be recognising that.
Agreed, and many companies don’t have a real answer.  I’m a cis woman who had a national customer rep threaten to spank me and had a good laugh.  My company told me to avoid being alone with that rep- they didn’t do squat, they weren’t going to risk the account and our HR couldn’t do anything to another company’s employee.  Thankfully I only had to interact with the jerk a few times a year, and my verbal response to the incident was enough to dissuade him from continuing to say crap like that to me.  I don’t think this guy would have actually laid a hand on me, but it was clear that if he did it would have been my problem.


I'm female and over 50.  With a 7 year exception (female run and focused workplace) I've always worked in male dominated fields.  I don't have a single epic FU story, but I have countless stories of male customers/co-workers thinking they could touch/insult/threaten me just because I'm a girl. Thanks to my FU money I frequently felt able to push back and did (one or two situations were dangerous and focusing on getting to safety was paramount, the pushback for those came later).  At several workplaces I was even able to speak up and protect younger/less able female co-workers. 

More of us (and not just those of us who are viewed as potential victims) should be asking companies what their plans are to protect employees.  Way to go Fantabulous!

Aside from loving your name, I'm also going to share this with my oldest, who has some sweet cash set aside, and has so far just had good workplace experiences.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: bluebelle on August 20, 2019, 03:21:40 PM
Cousin of mine just told me this story:

He's working for a small machine shop run by a nice family. One day it snows (it doesn't snow often where he lives), so he calls in and says he's going to stay home since there'll be little-to-no work because trucks they expected to come in would be delayed. The boss says he'll pick him up.

"No," cousin says, "I'll just take a day off to be with my kids."

Next day his boss confronts him about why he really didn't come in. My cousin said he didn't want to miss this chance to be with his kids in the snow. Boss called him a liar.

And then he quit.
that is pretty epic.....can't say I'd like to work for someone that thinks calling me a liar is appropriate.  OTH, if there was work that needed doing, not coming in because you want to play in the snow is unfair to a small family business - they can't been their commitments.

He was specifically told work they expected wasn't going to be there, and that everyone else was there anyway (boss picked them up). Maybe the boss had a fun thing going on that he was excited about. Can't say. All I know is that my cousin said he was very confused about how it escalated like it did, but felt certain that leaving was the right thing to do.

He's been a SAHD dad for 8 months now and said he's never felt more fulfilled. I'm so happy for him because he's such a good dude.
Boss is just a jackass I guess....got what he deserved
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Zamboni on August 21, 2019, 02:39:00 AM
My experience is that some people are really weird about just being prudent and cancelling when the weather is terrible. If boss had to pick multiple people up, then the roads were obviously not in good enough shape for people to feel comfortable driving . . . it wasn't just your cousin. Which means it was unsafe driving conditions, and thus people in non-emergency jobs should stay home. Period. It's not like your cousin is an ICU nurse.

If the roads are bad enough that I don't feel comfortable driving myself, then I am actually much more uncomfortable being in a vehicle driven by someone else because I grew up in a heavy snow climate and I am excellent at driving in snow. So boss had some control issue going on there, at a minimum, and good for your cousin to escape the lack of respect for normal boundaries.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Alfred J Quack on August 21, 2019, 06:13:37 AM
Not sure if this is Epic FU but had a talk with DW yesterday because she is overworked because of her extra effort because I had an accident last year (and 2 kids who need special attention and a job where her boss is a yelling micromanager). The work schedule (only weekends in the late evening) wreaks havoc on her sleep schedule and the mondays are hell because of it.
I told her not to worry, we've got the stash and absolutely no need for her to keep the job because of my income. She also said she wanted to go back into healthcare but wanted to take a few months before doing so which is fine.

So, we made the choice and she's going to resign this weekend, take some time to re(dis)cover  herself and then find something she would like to do. Whether it being paid or not.

We also discussed my job, as i've got combined job (basically 2 jobs, 9 hours a week for one and 27 hours a week for the other at the same employer) with different and sometimes conflicting priorities. This was a compromised promotion because I get to do some of the work of the higher paid job but am mainly active in the lower paid job. I do get paid based on the higher job though so it'll be a small drop in salary (which is also fine).
So, I'm going to ask my boss if I can drop the 9 hours of the higher job and just keep myself busy full time in the simpler job.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: A Fella from Stella on August 21, 2019, 10:25:24 AM
Not sure if this is Epic FU but had a talk with DW yesterday because she is overworked because of her extra effort because I had an accident last year (and 2 kids who need special attention and a job where her boss is a yelling micromanager). The work schedule (only weekends in the late evening) wreaks havoc on her sleep schedule and the mondays are hell because of it.
I told her not to worry, we've got the stash and absolutely no need for her to keep the job because of my income. She also said she wanted to go back into healthcare but wanted to take a few months before doing so which is fine.

So, we made the choice and she's going to resign this weekend, take some time to re(dis)cover  herself and then find something she would like to do. Whether it being paid or not.

We also discussed my job, as i've got combined job (basically 2 jobs, 9 hours a week for one and 27 hours a week for the other at the same employer) with different and sometimes conflicting priorities. This was a compromised promotion because I get to do some of the work of the higher paid job but am mainly active in the lower paid job. I do get paid based on the higher job though so it'll be a small drop in salary (which is also fine).
So, I'm going to ask my boss if I can drop the 9 hours of the higher job and just keep myself busy full time in the simpler job.

While not epic or FU, it's still good.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Alfred J Quack on August 21, 2019, 12:07:11 PM
Not sure if this is Epic FU but had a talk with DW yesterday because she is overworked because of her extra effort because I had an accident last year (and 2 kids who need special attention and a job where her boss is a yelling micromanager). The work schedule (only weekends in the late evening) wreaks havoc on her sleep schedule and the mondays are hell because of it.
I told her not to worry, we've got the stash and absolutely no need for her to keep the job because of my income. She also said she wanted to go back into healthcare but wanted to take a few months before doing so which is fine.

So, we made the choice and she's going to resign this weekend, take some time to re(dis)cover  herself and then find something she would like to do. Whether it being paid or not.

We also discussed my job, as i've got combined job (basically 2 jobs, 9 hours a week for one and 27 hours a week for the other at the same employer) with different and sometimes conflicting priorities. This was a compromised promotion because I get to do some of the work of the higher paid job but am mainly active in the lower paid job. I do get paid based on the higher job though so it'll be a small drop in salary (which is also fine).
So, I'm going to ask my boss if I can drop the 9 hours of the higher job and just keep myself busy full time in the simpler job.

While not epic or FU, it's still good.

The FU is there though, if only non-verbally to my wife's boss. They are already short-handed and are now losing their last capable worker. They even resorted to putting the driver behind the grill.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: mm1970 on August 26, 2019, 05:24:43 PM

I am so glad to be done and finally really FIRE'd.   

Ah, this whole thing gave me the warm and fuzzies.  Congrats!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: RWTL on August 26, 2019, 05:40:45 PM

Side note, for fun I came in extra early today and watched every single one of my co-workers come in later than they should and watched them leave after putting in only about 7 hours.  As I said, I was following the rest of the staff with my comings and goings and it was nice to prove that she was out of line
 

I really liked this part.  Feels like something I would do to keep myself entertained.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Dicey on August 26, 2019, 06:53:13 PM
Way to go, MissNancyPryor!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: 2sk22 on August 27, 2019, 05:54:29 AM
So I did today.  Color me D.O.N.E. 

Heartiest congratulations! Theres nothing so satisfying as quitting a job in such a definite and dramatic way!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: AO1FireTo on August 27, 2019, 06:23:01 AM


I quit. 

She freaked out.  She refused to accept my resignation.   



Must feel so good to have that option.  Sitting there listening to nonsense and have the option to just say, OK, I'm out of here.  To me that's why FI is important, I gives you freedom, you are no longer a slave to the economic system.  Well done!!!!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: AMandM on August 27, 2019, 08:58:46 AM
She then ham-handedly turned the topic to my hours.  She said she noticed I only worked 7 hours a day and I really need to work 8.

I quit. 

She freaked out. 

Love this.

I wonder if, somewhere on the internet, there's a forum where bosses post stories like this from the other side. "In the middle of the regular review of one of my reports, it got a bit awkward because I had to tell her she wasn't working the required hours--and she just up and quit! Can you believe it?"
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: trollwithamustache on August 27, 2019, 11:00:14 AM
She then ham-handedly turned the topic to my hours.  She said she noticed I only worked 7 hours a day and I really need to work 8.

I quit. 

She freaked out. 

Love this.

I wonder if, somewhere on the internet, there's a forum where bosses post stories like this from the other side. "In the middle of the regular review of one of my reports, it got a bit awkward because I had to tell her she wasn't working the required hours--and she just up and quit! Can you believe it?"

Its an interesting point... so our the poster isn't performing the job well and both the boss and poster understand this.  But maybe attendance is the boss's short term plan to make job performance ok.  Butt in seat time based jobs seem to be very common in large organizations.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Alfred J Quack on August 27, 2019, 12:47:26 PM
Butt in seat time based jobs seem to be very common in large organizations.
The question is:
I work a job where attendance is required for my job title. My colleagues on the same team (but with a different job title) are not required because they often work outside office hours on planned maintenance/changes. They are expected to put in their hours though, but working a couple more this week and a couple less next week is no problem (nor is working from home). The key is, of course, trust.

We've seen departments where that trust was gone (new manager, usually) where basically everything fell apart.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Step37 on August 27, 2019, 10:50:17 PM
Slow clap for @MissNancyPryor - how great to be in a position to send such a powerful message. One can hope that they learn something...
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: SwordGuy on August 27, 2019, 10:58:24 PM
Slow clap for @MissNancyPryor - how great to be in a position to send such a powerful message. One can hope that they learn something...

Smart managers learn from their mistakes.

Dumb ones blame others and NEVER, EVER learn from their mistakes -- because they never made any.

Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: former player on August 28, 2019, 05:04:40 AM
I am so glad to be done and finally really FIRE'd.     
Congratulations.  Definitely an epic FU money story.

I've had some bad managers in my time, and come to the conclusion that a manager only has three jobs-

1.  To hire the right people and fire the wrong ones.
2.  To give people the information they need (this includes training, overseeing any needed improvement of work output - very rare if you've hired the right people, and ensuring that organisational information flows as it should)
3.  Not to get in the way of the people doing the real work.

Of course, a manager might have a "real" job as well which actually makes things happen for the organisation.  But far too many managers end up hampering the work of an organisation instead of facilitating it. Less is usually more when it comes to managing people.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: theSlowTurtle on August 28, 2019, 07:33:33 AM
After ruminating a few days I can say the whole hours thing really, really bugs me. 

So which is it: Am I a great catch that they were able to lure back after lamenting my absence and now have big leadership visions for,

 -or-

am I a dishonest hourly clerk who is singled out from the group and found to be cheating on her time card?

Trying to paint me as both was mind numbingly stupid.  I think because she lost the argument about me moving up to her vision in the first part of the conversation she thought she could zing me with treating me like a low level hourly person as a demonstration that she was still in control of me.  If I don’t follow her vision I will bear the wrath of being treated like I can’t wipe my own ass. 

Monty, I will take Door Number 3 and GTFO instead. 

She never saw that coming and that makes her a foolish manager.  Further, when I quit she should have quickly wished me well and let me carry on my way— that would have been a show of strength and dignity on her part.
Do you have to submit a timesheet stating 8 hours a day? I am a government contractor so I have to be a stickler with my time...federal crime otherwise. I had a big issue with coworkers doing the same thing...that amplified when I was promoted to manager and had to start approving those timesheets. I called someone out on their blatant timecard issues...it got ugly

On the other hand there are definitely times where our software is down and we can't really do much if any work. I remain in my seat and surf the net...is that any better? Probably not...but I rationalize to myself that if an emergency comes up I'm here for it. It's just a bad situation in the U.S. where hours are a really big deal...if companies would switch the value based pricing we could stop all the timesheet nonsense! I honestly believe my entire team could accomplish 98% of our work in 30/week....but I digress.

Enjoy retirement!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: BlueHouse on August 28, 2019, 09:12:43 AM
I do not accept hammer blows because I don't need the job.
I am printing this out and hanging it above my cube.  I do actually need a job, but I don't necessarily need this job.  And it's healthy for me to remember this.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Warlord1986 on August 28, 2019, 07:54:18 PM
@MissNancyPryor I want to be like you when I grow up.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: RyanAtTanagra on August 28, 2019, 10:34:01 PM
Nice FU MissNancyPrior!

Sometimes i think a fun post-fire job would be to get hired at known toxic companies and fuck with the management.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: BlueHouse on August 29, 2019, 10:13:15 AM
Nice FU MissNancyPrior!

Sometimes i think a fun post-fire job would be to get hired at known toxic companies and fuck with the management.

I'm going to graduate to this once I'm done with all the telemarketers. 
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: jeninco on August 29, 2019, 11:23:21 AM
Nice FU MissNancyPrior!

Sometimes i think a fun post-fire job would be to get hired at known toxic companies and fuck with the management.

I'm going to graduate to this once I'm done with all the telemarketers.

So, we'll expect to hear back from you in ... what, a week or three? about your new job at Wells Fargo?
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: thesis on August 29, 2019, 11:26:01 AM
Sometimes i think a fun post-fire job would be to get hired at known toxic companies and fuck with the management.

This!

It would take some serious FI concentration to not internalize the stress in work locations like that, but wouldn't it be fun to turn toxic environments around by having the leverage to get the right things done? Even the leverage to get rid of the bad apples? "So-and-so is ruining your company. I can help you fix your problems, but you're going to fire so-and-so first".
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: GreenToTheCore on August 29, 2019, 06:38:19 PM
Nice FU MissNancyPrior!

Sometimes i think a fun post-fire job would be to get hired at known toxic companies and fuck with the management.

Oh man, this.
Imagine getting hired into HR, finding a problem manager, and filling their team with fellow FI mustachians... *touches fingertips with an evil grin*

Edited for clarity.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: zolotiyeruki on August 29, 2019, 07:55:34 PM
Nice FU MissNancyPrior!

Sometimes i think a fun post-fire job would be to get hired at known toxic companies and fuck with the management.

Oh man, this.
Imagine getting hired into HR, finding a problem manager, and filling their team with fellow FI mustachians... *touches fingertips with an evil grin*
Ooh, I like the idea of infiltrating multiple positions.  Hmmm, it might even make for a good TV show....maybe something like....

"Two years ago, a handful of workers were chewed out by a boss for something they didn't do.  These people promptly quit their jobs and joined the FIRE movement.  Today, still wanted by the Internet Retirement Police, they thrive as spoilers of mismanagement.  If your manager stinks...and nobody in HR is willing to help...and if you can find them...maybe you can enlist*...the FI-Team." (cue heroic music)

* no, you can't hire them, because they're retired.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: RWTL on August 30, 2019, 03:41:38 AM


"Two years ago, a handful of workers were chewed out by a boss for something they didn't do.  These people promptly quit their jobs and joined the FIRE movement.  Today, still wanted by the Internet Retirement Police, they thrive as spoilers of mismanagement.  If your manager stinks...and nobody in HR is willing to help...and if you can find them...maybe you can enlist*...the FI-Team." (cue heroic music)


This worked as intended....I was hearing the A-Team the whole time I read this.  Well done.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: fantabulous on August 30, 2019, 11:36:19 AM
Nice FU MissNancyPrior!

Sometimes i think a fun post-fire job would be to get hired at known toxic companies and fuck with the management.

Oh man, this.
Imagine getting hired into HR, finding a problem manager, and filling their team with fellow FI mustachians... *touches fingertips with an evil grin*
Ooh, I like the idea of infiltrating multiple positions.  Hmmm, it might even make for a good TV show....maybe something like....

"Two years ago, a handful of workers were chewed out by a boss for something they didn't do.  These people promptly quit their jobs and joined the FIRE movement.  Today, still wanted by the Internet Retirement Police, they thrive as spoilers of mismanagement.  If your manager stinks...and nobody in HR is willing to help...and if you can find them...maybe you can enlist*...the FI-Team." (cue heroic music)

* no, you can't hire them, because they're retired.

As long as we still get to build cabbage cannons.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Emerald on August 30, 2019, 12:05:05 PM
Nice FU MissNancyPrior!

Sometimes i think a fun post-fire job would be to get hired at known toxic companies and fuck with the management.

Oh man, this.
Imagine getting hired into HR, finding a problem manager, and filling their team with fellow FI mustachians... *touches fingertips with an evil grin*
Ooh, I like the idea of infiltrating multiple positions.  Hmmm, it might even make for a good TV show....maybe something like....

"Two years ago, a handful of workers were chewed out by a boss for something they didn't do.  These people promptly quit their jobs and joined the FIRE movement.  Today, still wanted by the Internet Retirement Police, they thrive as spoilers of mismanagement.  If your manager stinks...and nobody in HR is willing to help...and if you can find them...maybe you can enlist*...the FI-Team." (cue heroic music)

* no, you can't hire them, because they're retired.

As long as we still get to build cabbage cannons.

I ain't getting on no plane.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: okisok on August 30, 2019, 11:13:33 PM
Sometimes i think a fun post-fire job would be to get hired at known toxic companies and fuck with the management.

This!

It would take some serious FI concentration to not internalize the stress in work locations like that, but wouldn't it be fun to turn toxic environments around by having the leverage to get the right things done? Even the leverage to get rid of the bad apples? "So-and-so is ruining your company. I can help you fix your problems, but you're going to fire so-and-so first".

Ha! I've actually done this. It wasn't because I had FU money, but because I didn't need the job. It was several years ago when I was frugal but not Mustachian. I took a part-time job to save up for some traveling. It was the same company that my full-time job was with. They needed someone with my expertise and experience. I found out who was causing the problems that necessitated them hiring me, and was very straight up with management. "X is your problem, and will keep causing problems no matter who you fire or promote." They got rid of that person and it solved a lot of their problems in that department.
If I'd been desperate for money or the job, I would've kept my head down and begrudgingly kept working with the toxic person. THey would have kept trying to hire or train their way out of the issue. I'm still proud of that one!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Dicey on August 30, 2019, 11:31:34 PM
Nice FU MissNancyPrior!

Sometimes i think a fun post-fire job would be to get hired at known toxic companies and fuck with the management.

Oh man, this.
Imagine getting hired into HR, finding a problem manager, and filling their team with fellow FI mustachians... *touches fingertips with an evil grin*
Ooh, I like the idea of infiltrating multiple positions.  Hmmm, it might even make for a good TV show....maybe something like....

"Two years ago, a handful of workers were chewed out by a boss for something they didn't do.  These people promptly quit their jobs and joined the FIRE movement.  Today, still wanted by the Internet Retirement Police, they thrive as spoilers of mismanagement.  If your manager stinks...and nobody in HR is willing to help...and if you can find them...maybe you can enlist*...the FI-Team." (cue heroic music)

* no, you can't hire them, because they're retired.

As long as we still get to build cabbage cannons.

I ain't getting on no plane.
You can be a regional specialist.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: SwordGuy on August 31, 2019, 08:22:30 PM
I am sticking with my theory that she pulled it out of her ass as an attempt to wrest control over me since I would not accept the idea of moving up out of the job.  I had already frustrated her by wanting to just do the job I was hired for so she had no other bullets.  She didn't think she would actually kill me with it but she was wrong.
[/quote]vi
@MissNancyPryor

In the olden days, when someone was knighted, the person doing the knighting would use the hand to strike the person being knighted a terrific blow to the face.  It was called "the buffet". 

(PS -- that's buff-it, not buf-fey.   It means a violent blow with a hand or fist, not a table full of serve-yourself food.)

With that buffet went these words, "Take this blow and no other."   

Being a sword guy, I view MMM's face punches in a very similar way.

When you graduate to FU or FI status, you no longer put up with other people's shit.  You stand for what you believe to be the right.

So walk proud, you've followed in a long tradition of chivalric behavior.  :)

Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: BicycleB on September 02, 2019, 03:35:23 PM
I am sticking with my theory that she pulled it out of her ass as an attempt to wrest control over me since I would not accept the idea of moving up out of the job.  I had already frustrated her by wanting to just do the job I was hired for so she had no other bullets.  She didn't think she would actually kill me with it but she was wrong.
vi
@MissNancyPryor

In the olden days, when someone was knighted, the person doing the knighting would use the hand to strike the person being knighted a terrific blow to the face.  It was called "the buffet". 

(PS -- that's buff-it, not buf-fey.   It means a violent blow with a hand or fist, not a table full of serve-yourself food.)

With that buffet went these words, "Take this blow and no other."   

Being a sword guy, I view MMM's face punches in a very similar way.

When you graduate to FU or FI status, you no longer put up with other people's shit.  You stand for what you believe to be the right.

So walk proud, you've followed in a long tradition of chivalric behavior.  :)
[/quote]

Learn something new every day?

My day is done. Thanks,@SwordGuy!

:)
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Well Respected Man on September 11, 2019, 05:01:03 PM
I finally have a story to share!

My daughter got a part time job at a ski shop, which is a great opportunity, should be fun, etc. It didn't turn out that way, as she was the only female employee, and when she became ill, the manager [I assume, don't know exactly] was not very accommodating, kind of retaliating by not scheduling her at all. It's also just stressing her out because she has a full load of classes, and her academics were not great last year.

So she's quitting. I mentioned that she should do what is right for her, and to remember this feeling of control and freedom (I am paying for her education and room and board, so her current power comes from privilege, not savings). I explained that to be in that position of power, she needs to save 50%+ of her income, and always have enough to walk if the situation warrants.

I think she gets it, and mentioned that she still has a good amount of savings from her summer job. Planting the seeds of a potential future epic FU money story.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Loren Ver on September 11, 2019, 06:47:34 PM
Nice FU MissNancyPrior!

Sometimes i think a fun post-fire job would be to get hired at known toxic companies and fuck with the management.

Oh man, this.
Imagine getting hired into HR, finding a problem manager, and filling their team with fellow FI mustachians... *touches fingertips with an evil grin*
Ooh, I like the idea of infiltrating multiple positions.  Hmmm, it might even make for a good TV show....maybe something like....

"Two years ago, a handful of workers were chewed out by a boss for something they didn't do.  These people promptly quit their jobs and joined the FIRE movement.  Today, still wanted by the Internet Retirement Police, they thrive as spoilers of mismanagement.  If your manager stinks...and nobody in HR is willing to help...and if you can find them...maybe you can enlist*...the FI-Team." (cue heroic music)

* no, you can't hire them, because they're retired.

As long as we still get to build cabbage cannons.

I ain't getting on no plane.

This made my day so much better.  We are currently on season three.
DH cross stitched this for me for retirement.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: RWTL on September 12, 2019, 03:37:29 AM
I finally have a story to share!

My daughter got a part time job at a ski shop, which is a great opportunity, should be fun, etc. It didn't turn out that way, as she was the only female employee, and when she became ill, the manager [I assume, don't know exactly] was not very accommodating, kind of retaliating by not scheduling her at all. It's also just stressing her out because she has a full load of classes, and her academics were not great last year.

So she's quitting. I mentioned that she should do what is right for her, and to remember this feeling of control and freedom (I am paying for her education and room and board, so her current power comes from privilege, not savings). I explained that to be in that position of power, she needs to save 50%+ of her income, and always have enough to walk if the situation warrants.

I think she gets it, and mentioned that she still has a good amount of savings from her summer job. Planting the seeds of a potential future epic FU money story.

Good job Dad.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Much Fishing to Do on September 12, 2019, 05:31:16 AM
I explained that to be in that position of power, she needs to save 50%+ of her income

I think that's a great age to say this as you maybe the only one she's ever going to hear a savings rate even considered outside the range of 0%-20%...
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: talltexan on September 18, 2019, 10:56:24 AM
Advocating that you should always save 50% of your income seems kind of impossible for a parent to carry out successfully.

Your daughter's income will grow rapidly through the decade of her 20's. An easier path for her is to get used to saving some, but then commit to saving 50% of any raises that appear.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: RyanAtTanagra on September 18, 2019, 11:37:05 AM
Advocating that you should always save 50% of your income seems kind of impossible for a parent to carry out successfully.

Your daughter's income will grow rapidly through the decade of her 20's. An easier path for her is to get used to saving some, but then commit to saving 50% of any raises that appear.

Impossible for parents making how much?  For every financial goal someone says is impossible, you can find someone else doing it.  We, as mustachians, come across this from people all the time.  Impossible shouldn't be in our vocabulary.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: SwordGuy on September 18, 2019, 11:52:25 AM
Advocating that you should always save 50% of your income seems kind of impossible for a parent to carry out successfully.

Your daughter's income will grow rapidly through the decade of her 20's. An easier path for her is to get used to saving some, but then commit to saving 50% of any raises that appear.

Impossible for parents making how much?  For every financial goal someone says is impossible, you can find someone else doing it.  We, as mustachians, come across this from people all the time.  Impossible shouldn't be in our vocabulary.
Bravo!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: saguaro on September 18, 2019, 11:53:13 AM
I finally have a story to share!

My daughter got a part time job at a ski shop, which is a great opportunity, should be fun, etc. It didn't turn out that way, as she was the only female employee, and when she became ill, the manager [I assume, don't know exactly] was not very accommodating, kind of retaliating by not scheduling her at all. It's also just stressing her out because she has a full load of classes, and her academics were not great last year.

So she's quitting. I mentioned that she should do what is right for her, and to remember this feeling of control and freedom (I am paying for her education and room and board, so her current power comes from privilege, not savings). I explained that to be in that position of power, she needs to save 50%+ of her income, and always have enough to walk if the situation warrants.

I think she gets it, and mentioned that she still has a good amount of savings from her summer job. Planting the seeds of a potential future epic FU money story.

Good job Dad.

This is great.   A good lesson to learn early on, that feeling of freedom and control is invaluable.   And she has a start on the savings. 
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Chris Pascale on September 22, 2019, 10:23:46 AM
A lot of this is on the 2019 cohort thread but it fits here and I was encouraged to post it in this widely-read thread. 

I left my very stressful job April 5th, 2019 as per the glorious FIRE plan of quitting at age 50.  I quickly returned to work later that month at a place I used to work years prior in an effort to transition and SWAMI my way into a retirement.  I felt like I needed a transition period from the crazy corporate life with its ridiculous cross country travel to a time where I could still earn a little bit as a safety net and would finally be able to develop my life outside of work and be social since I would finally be no one's boss. 

I shifted from a high power boss type job pre-FIRE to more of a technical analyst, but still salaried and with a decent paycheck.  Unfortunately I have been there 4 months and it is boring beyond all hell.  There is a struggle because the person who is supposed to be training me is a passive aggressive dude who told me flat out, "No one taught me anything here, I had to figure it out for myself" and then proceeded to not teach me anything there.  Every bit of knowledge I have gained has been painfully acquired.  It was clear that he did not want me to be the successful candidate for this job, he wanted a buddy of his, but they could not meet the salary requirements.  The fact that I easily figured out that I was not his first choice should tell you everything about how he treated me after I arrived.   

But, the goals of transitioning are being met for the most part-- I have enjoyed not carrying a company cell phone any longer and the extension of medical insurance as well as a paycheck.  Even though it is boring and I have the constant friction with the dude in the next cubicle I decided that I would stay a year so as not to be a jerk about things and show some gratitude.     

Last Friday my boss and I had our regular 1:1 session and she said she could tell I was not happy.  I explained (again, because I have been saying it to her since my second week there) that I was not getting the training I needed and was frustrated but I was sorry I was not hiding it better.  She encouraged me to take a promotion where my skill set and leadership experience would be better used.  I declined and emphasized that I purposefully downshifted to this role in order to build a life that was not driven by work.  After a while we developed some ideas on how I could find a path forward and we agreed. 

She then ham-handedly turned the topic to my hours.  She said she noticed I only worked 7 hours a day and I really need to work 8.

I quit. 

She freaked out.  She refused to accept my resignation.   

It was fairly dramatic but I explained that I have been working the exact same hours as the rest of the group, I am a salaried individual, and furthermore I asked more than once when I got on board what the deal was and it was agreed I was fine.  I had just spent 40 minutes going through how I was struggling with getting necessary training from a guy who refuses to provide it and to move to a discussion about my HOURS of all things was just too much.  I told her I simply can't take that and therefore I quit.  She told me to sleep on it and let her know Monday.

So I did today.  Color me D.O.N.E. 

Today it was a surprisingly good discussion with her.  I agreed to help us both by doing a graceful exit.  "It just wasn't a fit, I am going to go back to my early retirement" will be our story.  I can live with that.  The only question now is if I should work at all into September or if I can take vacation days to get me another full month of health insurance to ease the transition out to the exchange.   

Side note, for fun I came in extra early today and watched every single one of my co-workers come in later than they should and watched them leave after putting in only about 7 hours.  As I said, I was following the rest of the staff with my comings and goings and it was nice to prove that she was out of line.

I am really glad that doing this short encore job gave me the chance to have an oh-so-satisfying EPIC FU MONEY story as my final exit from working life.  That must have been what these few months were for, a small gift to myself in that I do not have to put up with a boring job where I can't get good training and am going to be hounded about my hours.  Perfect.   

I am so glad to be done and finally really FIRE'd.   

Going to share this with my kids. Excellent story. They were way out of line.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: talltexan on October 03, 2019, 06:58:18 AM
Advocating that you should always save 50% of your income seems kind of impossible for a parent to carry out successfully.

Your daughter's income will grow rapidly through the decade of her 20's. An easier path for her is to get used to saving some, but then commit to saving 50% of any raises that appear.

Impossible for parents making how much?  For every financial goal someone says is impossible, you can find someone else doing it.  We, as mustachians, come across this from people all the time.  Impossible shouldn't be in our vocabulary.
Bravo!

Raising a child who saves 50% of his or her income is not a financial goal. My children won't even listen to me about easy stuff I want them to do.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: RyanAtTanagra on October 03, 2019, 11:38:51 AM
I have a new entry, from my sister, whom in a short time got to experience two different aspects of FU money.

She took on a part-time small-town bartending job for extra money.  She bartended in school so it was an easy job to pick up.  She learned quickly that the owner was the angry, yelling kind of boss.  But she didn't really need the job, and as such she realized the yelling and anger didn't bother her, where as previously if would have.  But now it just rolled off her back and she could just ignore him.  Benefit of FU money #1.

Until the other night when he starting yelling at her directly like she was an idiot, which she decided she absolutely wasn't ok with.  She told him 'no one talks to me like that' and walked.  Benefit of FU money #2.

Very proud of her, and very happy she's in the position to not put up with bullshit anymore.  I wish everyone were taught the power of that.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: bluebelle on October 03, 2019, 02:22:11 PM
I have a new entry, from my sister, whom in a short time got to experience two different aspects of FU money.

She took on a part-time small-town bartending job for extra money.  She bartended in school so it was an easy job to pick up.  She learned quickly that the owner was the angry, yelling kind of boss.  But she didn't really need the job, and as such she realized the yelling and anger didn't bother her, where as previously if would have.  But now it just rolled off her back and she could just ignore him.  Benefit of FU money #1.

Until the other night when he starting yelling at her directly like she was an idiot, which she decided she absolutely wasn't ok with.  She told him 'no one talks to me like that' and walked.  Benefit of FU money #2.

Very proud of her, and very happy she's in the position to not put up with bullshit anymore.  I wish everyone were taught the power of that.
the attitude from FU money is a powerful thing....just having that attitude shuts down alot of work-place bullies.   Having the air of 'I won't put up with that shit' often stops the bullies.   Good for your daughter for knowing when to walk away.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Just Joe on October 04, 2019, 09:04:41 AM
Raising a child who saves 50% of his or her income is not a financial goal. My children won't even listen to me about easy stuff I want them to do.

Hang in there Tall Texan. Sometimes your kids will surprise you. From the outside it looks messy but one day they reveal that something you taught them stuck.

DW and I are in a similar situation with our kids.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Adventine on October 04, 2019, 12:58:54 PM
Raising a child who saves 50% of his or her income is not a financial goal. My children won't even listen to me about easy stuff I want them to do.

Hang in there Tall Texan. Sometimes your kids will surprise you. From the outside it looks messy but one day they reveal that something you taught them stuck.

DW and I are in a similar situation with our kids.

Kids learn by example, not by lectures. All you can do is set a good example.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Sandi_k on October 11, 2019, 12:45:21 PM
This thread is so much fun! So here's one of mine...

My first job, working as a cashier at a stop-and-shop quicky mart. I got the job as a junior in high school, paid 15 cents more per hour than minimum wage. Decent manager, the owners showed up to count the cash and sign for deliveries, everything else was on us.

We had pretty good continuity, people stayed typically 12-24 months, with occasional bumps in pay. Pretty laid back, to the point where payroll checks were loaded under the cash drawer every other Friday, and anyone could scan them as they weren't in envelopes.

Well, a new guy had been hired, and I was training him his first week. I was now graduated from HS, and starting at the junior college up the hill. I'd moved out to my own apartment (at age 17!), and was a great employee for them - never sick, always willing to cover for others' absences, never late, good at training. When paychecks came out in New Guys' second week, as I sorted through the stack to get my check, I could see that his hourly rate was higher than mine.

OK, I hadn't asked for a raise for awhile, and surely I was worth it, and I understood that the boss doesn't *have* to pay me more unless I ask...so I do.

The next Saturday morning, the owner was in, and I asked him for a raise. I mentioned that I'd been there now 18 months, was now a college student, and was worth a 50 cent raise (so I'd be making 25 cents more than New Guy). So I would have gone from $3.90/hour to $4.40/hr. Boss says nope.

I ask why I'm being paid less than New Guy. Boss says it's because he does swing shift (3pm-11pm). I remind him that *I* do swing shift, too! And I am worth more. Still nope. Even worse, he dared me - "If you think you're worth more, go find someone else to pay it."

So I go up the hill to the JC's job board for college students, find a listing for a small Mom and Pop copy shop in town (coincidentally, half a mile from my new apartment), and go in person to apply. I am hired on the spot, to start the next day, at $4.75 per hour.

I then ride my badass new scooter (bought two weeks before, paid for in cash, from job savings) to the quicky mart, and tender my immediate resignation (no one ever gave two weeks notice for the cashier/stocking job). He's dumbfounded, and I am delighted. It could only have been more epic if I'd managed it on the holiday weekend a couple of weeks earlier.

That was in 1983, and it still gives me joy to have proven to that old misogynistic assh*le that there were young women who wouldn't put up with his sh*t.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: techwiz on October 11, 2019, 01:10:14 PM
This thread is so much fun! So here's one of mine...

My first job, working as a cashier at a stop-and-shop quicky mart. I got the job as a junior in high school, paid 15 cents more per hour than minimum wage. Decent manager, the owners showed up to count the cash and sign for deliveries, everything else was on us.

We had pretty good continuity, people stayed typically 12-24 months, with occasional bumps in pay. Pretty laid back, to the point where payroll checks were loaded under the cash drawer every other Friday, and anyone could scan them as they weren't in envelopes.

Well, a new guy had been hired, and I was training him his first week. I was now graduated from HS, and starting at the junior college up the hill. I'd moved out to my own apartment (at age 17!), and was a great employee for them - never sick, always willing to cover for others' absences, never late, good at training. When paychecks came out in New Guys' second week, as I sorted through the stack to get my check, I could see that his hourly rate was higher than mine.

OK, I hadn't asked for a raise for awhile, and surely I was worth it, and I understood that the boss doesn't *have* to pay me more unless I ask...so I do.

The next Saturday morning, the owner was in, and I asked him for a raise. I mentioned that I'd been there now 18 months, was now a college student, and was worth a 50 cent raise (so I'd be making 25 cents more than New Guy). So I would have gone from $3.90/hour to $4.40/hr. Boss says nope.

I ask why I'm being paid less than New Guy. Boss says it's because he does swing shift (3pm-11pm). I remind him that *I* do swing shift, too! And I am worth more. Still nope. Even worse, he dared me - "If you think you're worth more, go find someone else to pay it."

So I go up the hill to the JC's job board for college students, find a listing for a small Mom and Pop copy shop in town (coincidentally, half a mile from my new apartment), and go in person to apply. I am hired on the spot, to start the next day, at $4.75 per hour.

I then ride my badass new scooter (bought two weeks before, paid for in cash, from job savings) to the quicky mart, and tender my immediate resignation (no one ever gave two weeks notice for the cashier/stocking job). He's dumbfounded, and I am delighted. It could only have been more epic if I'd managed it on the holiday weekend a couple of weeks earlier.

That was in 1983, and it still gives me joy to have proven to that old misogynistic assh*le that there were young women who wouldn't put up with his sh*t.

Wow Epic FU story. I would have like to seen his face when he found out you were out of there.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: RyanAtTanagra on October 11, 2019, 01:13:13 PM
@Sandi_k good one!

That reminds me of a really good one an ex of mine had.  She was working at a family owned produce market.  Really nice market, but the father was a grade A ass.  My ex was a great worker, but refused to kowtow to anyone, so he didn't like her.  When he decided he didn't want someone there anymore, he wouldn't just let them go, because he might have to pay unemployment, so he would just cut their hours so they'd have to quit, which is shitty but pretty common in retail.  He started doing it to her and pissed her off, so she talked to the unemployment office and they said that probably qualifies for partial unemployment, so she filed for it.  He got piiiiisssed and disputed it.  She stuck it out, won, told everyone there about it (so he couldn't pull that shit again), then quit.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Dogastrophe on October 11, 2019, 01:31:29 PM
Even worse, he dared me - "If you think you're worth more, go find someone else to pay it."



A few years ago my wife's manager said very same thing to her.  She had arranged a meeting to discuss a raise.  She presented him with a list of extra responsibilities she had taken on over the past year and asked for ~$3000 raise.  About a month after he threw his dare in her face she resigned for her new job (with a $4K bump and has since increased even further).  Best of all, they are on their 3rd person in her role in 3 years.  Current person is only doing ~1/2 what she was doing.  From what we have heard, her old manager has commented a few times how they were stupid to have let her leave like they did. 
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Sandi_k on October 11, 2019, 01:43:56 PM
@RyanAtTanagra , nice! You reminded me of my favorite FU story, that I helped engineer...

DH and I bought our first house, in 1992. Not married, but together 10+ years, so it's all good. We cobble together a 10% DP, and move in.

I have my first post-college FT job, doing well for my age. DH is just out of college too, still working his college job at a local bike shop (he's super-good with fixing things, handy to have around). He'd worked there for ~2+ years, and was now the most senior (and most expensive) employee. He was also the guy who did ALL of the bicycle repairs. During his time there, he actually got a following of bike nerds, who would bring their fancy bikes in to be optimized by DH.

He's paid well enough, he hates interviewing, not really looking for a job (even after being taped up and robbed at gunpoint, but that's another story!)

After the robbery, the owner decides it's time to sell. So he does. New owner looks at DH's payroll, and decides he's going to get him out. So he assigns him to the other shop, about a 40 minute commute via freeway in the Bay Area. Instead of the current 20 minute commute. The employee with whom he was swapped (the most expensive employee at the other shop) decided to quit instead of putting up with the reassignment. DH doesn't.

So then the owner reduces his hours, by 25%, saying that the business is slowing (actually, business was recovering from the recession, and receipts were up). DH still doesn't quit, but he starts looking for another job. Slowly.

Well, owner pays out another month, and decides DH is still too expensive, so he "lets him go." DH comes home, all depressed and feeling worthless (he's an introvert, hates looking for work). I tell him he can file for unemployment, since he wasn't fired for cause. DH perks up!

I advise DH to call the owner the next day, no hassle, and ask him if he'd sign a letter of reference for DH, to "aid in his job search." Owner says yes. DH asks if it's OK if we draft it, and he'll bring it by the following day for a signature. Owner says yes.

So I draft the letter, outlining DH's three years of work in the shop, his expertise in repair, his solid work ethic, his perfect attendance, his reassignment to the other shop and his willingness "to work where he was most needed by the business," and then I note owner's dismay at having to lay him off due to "lack of funds, and lack of work", as evidenced by the prior reduction to 75% time.

DH takes it in, owner happily signs it (he didn't have to do any work! DH is going away without drama!). DH then went STRAIGHT TO THE UNEMPLOYMENT OFFICE, AND FILED.

Owner fights it, says he fired DH for bad attitude, attendance, possible thievery, he's not sure, but maybe...

So a conference call is scheduled with an adjudicator. DH listens to owner spew his lies, and then simply says: "Huh. That's not at all what you said in your written reference letter for me. You said it was due to lack of funds and lack of work."

Stunned silence. Then the adjudicator asks owner: "Is this true? Did you write a letter of reference for [DH]?" Owner admits that yes, he did sign a letter of reference, and it might have included those terms.

That was it. Dispute settled in DH's favor, and he proceeded to de-PTSD for the next 6 months while continuing to pay his Mustachian-level bills from the UE checks.

And because we kept a lockdown on the budget, he was able to turn down Blockbuster and their evil corporate hiring practices, AND buy a sweet 1967 Honda Dream 305 motorcycle during that 6 months of unemployment.

Overall: pretty sweet.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Sandi_k on October 11, 2019, 01:50:04 PM
@Sandi_k love, love, LOVE that story. 

And in the end he is proven to be a complete moron and you were proven to be an excellent clerk who follows directions.  His direction to go find someone else to pay you more was his last order and followed to a tee. 

Ha!


Thanks, @MissNancyPryor ! That was my very first job, and I have NEVER forgotten that work is a mutual contract. I *always* have the right to walk, and I make sure I have the ability to do so, too.

My current boss is an *ss, but I choose to stay because he knows my worth - I've negotiated SERIOUS pay upgrades in the past decade with him, and I punch him right back when he tries to throat punch me. I am staying for the pension, until 2025. But he rotates out in June 2021.

Only 20 more months with him. I cannot wait!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: eostache on October 11, 2019, 03:09:52 PM

That was it. Dispute settled in DH's favor, and he proceeded to de-PTSD for the next 6 months while continuing to pay his Mustachian-level bills from the UE checks.


I got laid off a pretty decent tech job this past summer. Having been laid off past jobs I had saved my paychecks (while co-workers were buying new trucks). I wasn't too unhappy to be laid off. I'm not even close to FIRE, but have enough of a stash to not worry for a while. I got a couple months severance pay, plus cash to pay COBRA (got a cheap Marketplace plan instead). I'm collecting unemployment for 6 months now, it's enough to pay the bills so I don't need to hurry to find the next job.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: mm1970 on October 11, 2019, 04:29:52 PM
@Sandi_k

You win for the best new stories today!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Sandi_k on October 11, 2019, 04:45:28 PM
@Sandi_k

You win for the best new stories today!

Thank you, @mm1970
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: alcon835 on October 13, 2019, 08:17:26 AM
A few years ago I worked in cyber security at a large cosmetics company. I was part of a team of about 25 security folks in a company of 5,000 with around 600 being IT. So a larger IT org.

In cyber security, we worked very closely with other teams. The problem, however, is of the 25 people on my team, only 4 of us did the work. It was a frustrating experiencing being required to pick up the slack of 20 other people, but I strive to serve the company I work for well and to do my job with excellence, so I put that aside and didn't worry much about it.

Over my time there, I was repeatedly called out for excellence and became the go-to guy in the cyber security team. Is an attack happening? I'm up to be the main responder. Do we need to smooth out things with another team? Send me. Do we need some new products? I need to test them out and work across the organization to see if its a fit.

In the end they promoted me...sort of. They put two people under me and said I was a team lead, but refused to change my official title or give me a raise saying that HR could take a year or longer to get me the raise and title. I'd always been an unofficial team lead, training and support everyone in cyber security, but had never been offered a manager position before and decided it was worth waiting 8-12 months to get the titles on my resume (I've since learned to put what I did on a resume, not what they call it).

Well, people like to talk with me and I have always been into personal finance so eventually conversations with my coworkers turned to our salaries. Turns out, I was severely under paid - by at least 40%; and this was without taking my promotion into account.

I started doing research: talking with folks I knew in the industry, reading online forums, and looking at job posting to put together a number right in the middle of what the industry was paying for my promoted role. I took that information to my boss at my next one-on-one and proceeded to walk him through what I was looking for in salary when they finally promoted me and why I thought those numbers were fair.

He was clearly stunned by the conversation and didn't even take a second to process what I'd said. Instead he told me, "You started at this company underpaid and you will always be underpaid as long as you work here. The promotion is not going to be negotiable and it's more like a 5% increase." I pointed out that the role should be paid at what the role is worth and not be based on my current salary. He shrugged his shoulders and basically said, "That's the way that it is and I'm not going to fight to get you any more."

That was the moment I knew it was time to leave. It was suddenly clear that they knew they were taking advantage of me. They knew I was ignorant of what the industry was paying and used that leverage to severely underpay me while hiring other folks at 40-60% more than me. And even when I proved to be one of the strongest assets on their team, the only response was a shrug of the shoulders and a "that's the way that it is."

So I started looking for work immediately. Within 3 weeks I had a job paying me an even higher salary than I had requested in the promotion. I turned in my notice ASAP and was walked out that day.

While it wasn't my savings that let me walk, my financial independence and my skill set meant I could leave if I needed too and gave me confidence to have the raise conversation. It felt so gratifying to see that my research was correct. I've since built up a strong emergency fund and begun working my way into true mustacian independence.

I work at an amazing organization now in a management role where I've been able to right size salaries and bring people up to where they should be in the industry. I am loving what I do every day and my emergency fund means I can FU if anything ever changes. It's a great place to be!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: 2sk22 on October 13, 2019, 09:21:42 AM
@alcon835 A wonderfully inspiring story! Since I work in software too, I know that good security people are really hard to find so I'm very happy that you're now getting paid what you're worth.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: RWD on October 13, 2019, 10:23:03 AM
Instead he told me, "You started at this company underpaid and you will always be underpaid as long as you work here."

Holy crap, I can't believe he told you that straight up. That's practically telling your employee to leave for greener pastures.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: SwordGuy on October 13, 2019, 10:23:49 AM
Many years ago I was manager of programming for the US for a multinational corporation.   I had seriously trained up our programmers and analysts.  We got really impressive results with very few people.   95% of our resources went to new functionality and only 5% had to be used on fixing mistakes or poorly done work.  Industry standards at the time were fairly close to the opposite of that.

Management didn't want to increase their pay "because we've already done the budget for the year".  So we waited until the next budget cycle and -- surprise -- no raise.    Within 6 months the department was gutted because most left for significantly more money elsewhere.  (I got a 30% raise right off.)

I got word a few years later that the US corporate president had (too late) realized what a treasure he had in our department and was bemoaning that he was never going to get that kind of IT department again.

It was nice to be missed but much better to be well paid. :)
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Montecarlo on October 13, 2019, 12:23:56 PM
Instead he told me, "You started at this company underpaid and you will always be underpaid as long as you work here."

Holy crap, I can't believe he told you that straight up. That's practically telling your employee to leave for greener pastures.

Maybe they were tired of him making them look bad.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: mm1970 on October 14, 2019, 12:14:22 PM
Instead he told me, "You started at this company underpaid and you will always be underpaid as long as you work here."

Holy crap, I can't believe he told you that straight up. That's practically telling your employee to leave for greener pastures.

Insane, but true.

Quote
I pointed out (because for some reason these dorks making $300K per year running large sections of a multi-national corporation simply don't get it) that if I hired some nobody from off the street I would have to pay them the higher amount.  They would come with zero company-specific business acumen, loyalty, etc. and there was no guarantee they would work out for the long term.  Still got push back and it took a few more weeks of crap to resolve it.   

Lordy, I had a long hard fight for two of my people years ago...they were going from hourly to salary, and bigboss kept offering $43k, then $50k.  THEY MAKE $51K WITH OVERTIME DUDE.  They were going from tech to engineering (hourly to salary).
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: gipsygrrl on October 14, 2019, 02:49:35 PM
I'm so excited to have one of my first FU money experiences today! It's little, but mighty.

I am a designer and this weekend (Ugh - weekend. Strike one.) I had a client contact me about a job. The last line of her e-mail, verbatim, was "if you're interested, I can explain exactly what we need on a very tight timeline and even tighter budget." Gawd, what a horrible proposition!

Of course there are a few reasons to consider a job like that... if it's an important client or could lead to other, better jobs, etc. But that didn't apply here. In past years, I would have had to take the job because I needed the money, period. Now I'm able to discriminate, and I kind of feel like throwing myself a party because it's so awesome. Three cheers for being able to take a pass on the crappy assignments of life!!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Dogastrophe on October 14, 2019, 03:22:02 PM
I'm so excited to have one of my first FU money experiences today! It's little, but mighty.

I am a designer and this weekend (Ugh - weekend. Strike one.) I had a client contact me about a job. The last line of her e-mail, verbatim, was "if you're interested, I can explain exactly what we need on a very tight timeline and even tighter budget." Gawd, what a horrible proposition!

Of course there are a few reasons to consider a job like that... if it's an important client or could lead to other, better jobs, etc. But that didn't apply here. In past years, I would have had to take the job because I needed the money, period. Now I'm able to discriminate, and I kind of feel like throwing myself a party because it's so awesome. Three cheers for being able to take a pass on the crappy assignments of life!!

Well done!  Often times you will come out ahead by not taking a crappy job.

Flip side, at least they have a budget and they didn't offer to pay you in "exposure" on their 100 follower instagram.  :)
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: mm1970 on October 15, 2019, 11:11:51 AM
I'm so excited to have one of my first FU money experiences today! It's little, but mighty.

I am a designer and this weekend (Ugh - weekend. Strike one.) I had a client contact me about a job. The last line of her e-mail, verbatim, was "if you're interested, I can explain exactly what we need on a very tight timeline and even tighter budget." Gawd, what a horrible proposition!

Of course there are a few reasons to consider a job like that... if it's an important client or could lead to other, better jobs, etc. But that didn't apply here. In past years, I would have had to take the job because I needed the money, period. Now I'm able to discriminate, and I kind of feel like throwing myself a party because it's so awesome. Three cheers for being able to take a pass on the crappy assignments of life!!
I prob would have asked how tight the budget was (maybe you did?) One person's tight budget is another person's flush one.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: EscapedApe on October 15, 2019, 12:44:35 PM
I work at an amazing organization now and in a management role where I've been able to right size salaries and bring people up to where they should be in the industry. I am loving what I do every day and my emergency fund means I can FU if anything ever changes. It's a great place to be!

Good for you man, that's an awesome outcome.

The lesson here is: people will get away with whatever you let them get away with, so know your worth, and re-educate yourself from time to time so you're always in the know.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: GreenToTheCore on October 16, 2019, 10:37:37 PM
I'm so excited to have one of my first FU money experiences today! It's little, but mighty.

I am a designer and this weekend (Ugh - weekend. Strike one.) I had a client contact me about a job. The last line of her e-mail, verbatim, was "if you're interested, I can explain exactly what we need on a very tight timeline and even tighter budget." Gawd, what a horrible proposition!

Of course there are a few reasons to consider a job like that... if it's an important client or could lead to other, better jobs, etc. But that didn't apply here. In past years, I would have had to take the job because I needed the money, period. Now I'm able to discriminate, and I kind of feel like throwing myself a party because it's so awesome. Three cheers for being able to take a pass on the crappy assignments of life!!
Hip hip hurray!
Hip hip hurray!
Hip hip hurray!

Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: frekwentflier on October 19, 2019, 05:27:15 PM
I can honestly say that this thread has changed my entire life for the better over the past year. It's amazing to me how much life improvement one can get just by being able to say NO to unreasonable work demands.  I'm not FIREd yet, but I'm close enough that I've already started acting like it when it comes to work assignments. Here are some of the things I've done in the past year. Some might not consider them epic, but they are epic to me.

A background, I have been in some form of IT Consulting for over 25 years. For at least half that time, I've traveled 75-100% to work on projects at customer sites. When I was young and single, all of the traveling was great!  Now that I'm older and married, it became a tedious chore.

Over the past 5 years, I have worked and trained very hard to become a certified expert in a particular technology that is very much in-demand right now. My previous job was traveling 100% doing various projects in this technology for various customers. Some of those customers came from the actual technology company, others came thru the medium-sized consulting firm that I worked for.

As some may know, in IT Consulting, the bill rates can be quite high.  $250-$350/hour is not uncommon.  However, I was only making a fraction of that.  Knowing just what my little slice of the pie was infuriated me constantly.  *I* was the one leaving my family on Sunday afternoon and returning Friday night every week, yet everybody else actually made more money.

Every month the company would give 1 consultant a special bonus for going "above and beyond". There was one other consultant and I who traveled full time, everybody else got to go home to their families every night or worked from home.  Neither of us never got the bonus.  Why?  Because we didn't put in enough extra effort.  They didn't care that we were stuck on planes or at airports 10-20 hours/week.

And on top of that, my manager was constantly trying to get me to do extra work on the side that my company was actually billing for, but I was paid a salary, so no extra money for me.  "You're stuck in a hotel room all week, so you have plenty of time to do this extra work" was his constant excuse. So even though I did a lot of this extra work, I still didn't get nominated for the monthly bonus.

After reading MMM and this thread, assessing how financially stable we actually were, and realizing that with my status as an expert in this high-demand technology, I could easily find another job, I decided to just stop taking all of their sh*t. 

The first step was that I stopped doing all extra work.  At first I just ignored any requests.  When my manager asked for the status of them, I politely but sternly informed him that I was already billing 40 hours/week for the customer, and if he wanted me to do anything else, he needed to figure out a way to pay me extra for it. He gave me a hard time, but I simply told him that if he didn't like it, he could fire me and lose all of the billing revenue that I was bringing in.

I then informed him that my 100% traveling days were over.  Either find me something local to me, or preferably, work-at-home, or another company would.  My company had paid a lot of money to get me trained on this technology, so I gave them 6 months to reduce my travel schedule.  Believe me, they've made 100x as much money from my billings as they ever paid to train me, probably more.

And third, rather than having the internal travel agency book my flights and hotels, I started making my own reservations. They were constantly nickel and diming me on flights/hotels. Making me take cheaper flights at crazy times and putting me up at cheaper hotels very far away from the customer sites.  No more.  When confronted about this, I simply said either I make my own travel reservations, or I don't travel 1 foot outside of my house.

They backed down on everything. My life did improve somewhat, but sure enough, after 6 months, there was absolutely no movement on reducing my travel, so I started looking for a new work-at-home job.  I found it in less than a month and am now writing this post from my desk at my own house.  My commute is 20 feet from Bedroom 1 to Bedroom 3.  :)  My wife is so happy to have me home more, and I got a 20% raise to boot! 

It's amazing how much better your life can get when you just do what's best for you and your family.

I hope others will read this and get some inspiration from it.  FU money is great, but even if you're not quite there yet, having partial FU-money as well as a FU-skillset can go a long way to improving your life. 

Thank you MMM Community for inspiring me to make these much-needed changes!!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Cherry Lane on October 19, 2019, 05:31:05 PM
Great story, @frekwentflier !  You may be due for a new username, though.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: ditheca on October 19, 2019, 05:48:14 PM
... I started looking for a new work-at-home job.  I found it in less than a month and am now writing this post from my desk at my own house.  My commute is 20 feet from Bedroom 1 to Bedroom 3.  :)  My wife is so happy to have me home more, and I got a 20% raise to boot! 

How did you find the work-at-home job?  I haven't had much luck finding reliable opportunities.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: AO1FireTo on October 19, 2019, 06:47:52 PM
That's pretty epic.  I think we forget sometimes that it costs a lot of money to replace a highly skilled worker...$$$$$$

We have more power than we realize.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: RyanAtTanagra on October 19, 2019, 08:10:42 PM
I can honestly say that this thread has changed my entire life for the better over the past year. It's amazing to me how much life improvement one can get just by being able to say NO to unreasonable work demands.

Great story!  And I agree, learning the concept of FU money has changed my life for the better.  Before, I never knew that it was possible to just say 'no', and to ask for/demand things that others were afraid to.  Doing so doesn't mean you're not still an exceptional employee, it's just establishing boundaries, which ends up being healthy for both sides.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: BicycleB on October 19, 2019, 08:58:40 PM
Way to go, @frekwentflier!

Let us know if you change your name to formerfrekwentflier...
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: frekwentflier on October 19, 2019, 09:27:51 PM
I still fly a lot, but now it's for vacations only.  :) 
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: frekwentflier on October 19, 2019, 09:33:42 PM
... I started looking for a new work-at-home job.  I found it in less than a month and am now writing this post from my desk at my own house.  My commute is 20 feet from Bedroom 1 to Bedroom 3.  :)  My wife is so happy to have me home more, and I got a 20% raise to boot! 

How did you find the work-at-home job?  I haven't had much luck finding reliable opportunities.

Being able to find a work-at-home job very much depends on your choice of career. The technology that I specialize in just happens to be very easy to do remotely. Forward-thinking companies realize that they can save a lot of money on office space, etc. by enabling remote workers. As long as the job gets done, who cares where it's done?

If remote work is important to you, but no such jobs exist in your field, you may want to consider a career change. If you do, I hope it works out for you.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: shelivesthedream on October 20, 2019, 03:57:37 AM
Amazing story! Thank you!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: ditheca on October 21, 2019, 09:13:33 AM
Being able to find a work-at-home job very much depends on your choice of career. The technology that I specialize in just happens to be very easy to do remotely. Forward-thinking companies realize that they can save a lot of money on office space, etc. by enabling remote workers. As long as the job gets done, who cares where it's done?

If remote work is important to you, but no such jobs exist in your field, you may want to consider a career change. If you do, I hope it works out for you.

I'm am IT manager by experience and a full stack developer by skill.  I currently work 100% from home (hundreds of miles from the nearest office!).  I landed the position 10 years ago as a regular employee at our headquarters; work from home was negotiated later.  My job isn't bad, but I feel trapped because I don't know how to find a similar position.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: former player on October 21, 2019, 10:31:07 AM
Being able to find a work-at-home job very much depends on your choice of career. The technology that I specialize in just happens to be very easy to do remotely. Forward-thinking companies realize that they can save a lot of money on office space, etc. by enabling remote workers. As long as the job gets done, who cares where it's done?

If remote work is important to you, but no such jobs exist in your field, you may want to consider a career change. If you do, I hope it works out for you.

I'm am IT manager by experience and a full stack developer by skill.  I currently work 100% from home (hundreds of miles from the nearest office!).  I landed the position 10 years ago as a regular employee at our headquarters; work from home was negotiated later.  My job isn't bad, but I feel trapped because I don't know how to find a similar position.
I might as well say that after finding a house that is in a great location for me I feel trapped because I can't find one that's in an even better location.

Sometimes good enough is good enough.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Threshkin on October 21, 2019, 05:15:27 PM
Instead he told me, "You started at this company underpaid and you will always be underpaid as long as you work here."

Holy crap, I can't believe he told you that straight up. That's practically telling your employee to leave for greener pastures.

That is literally telling you to file a wage discrimination suit.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: SwordGuy on October 21, 2019, 07:05:39 PM
Instead he told me, "You started at this company underpaid and you will always be underpaid as long as you work here."

Holy crap, I can't believe he told you that straight up. That's practically telling your employee to leave for greener pastures.

That is literally telling you to file a wage discrimination suit.
Not in the US, unless the context was some form of racial, religious, gender or similar basis for the discrimination.

Just being hired at a lower wage and getting the same % raise as others isn't discrimination under US law.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: alcon835 on October 21, 2019, 07:45:39 PM
Instead he told me, "You started at this company underpaid and you will always be underpaid as long as you work here."

Holy crap, I can't believe he told you that straight up. That's practically telling your employee to leave for greener pastures.

Maybe they were tired of him making them look bad.

They were pretty shocked and upset that I left and started bad mouthing me - specifically that I asked for a raise. One of my coworkers (still a friend) pointed out that my request was reasonable since I was making significantly more than I'd asked for. They never really had an answer to him on that but started bad mouthing me more.

That guy works for me now :)
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: alcon835 on October 21, 2019, 07:46:53 PM
I work at an amazing organization now and in a management role where I've been able to right size salaries and bring people up to where they should be in the industry. I am loving what I do every day and my emergency fund means I can FU if anything ever changes. It's a great place to be!

Good for you man, that's an awesome outcome.

The lesson here is: people will get away with whatever you let them get away with, so know your worth, and re-educate yourself from time to time so you're always in the know.

I completely agree!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: talltexan on November 04, 2019, 08:44:42 AM
Six years ago I was able to escape a drama-filled situation working for a small consulting entity within a university to take a new job doing economic forecasting for a public utility.

Today, the data series I spent those years building (it's survey data) has suddenly become the highest priority for our director of accounting. So I'm having to crawl back to people at that old job to see if they'll share the data with me (otherwise we'd have to pay $2,000 in subscription fees). So all you badass people, congrats! As for me, I'm trading some pride to save my manager $2,000.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: BicycleB on November 04, 2019, 08:48:52 AM
Good luck, fellow Texan!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: talltexan on November 11, 2019, 07:01:17 AM
Update-
director of accounting really loves the chart I made from these data. So I guess it's all okay.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: AdrianC on November 12, 2019, 06:12:26 AM
And on top of that, my manager was constantly trying to get me to do extra work on the side that my company was actually billing for, but I was paid a salary, so no extra money for me.  "You're stuck in a hotel room all week, so you have plenty of time to do this extra work" was his constant excuse.

I used to get this line, too. I did get bonuses, but when I worked out my hourly rate on these extra hours it was still less than minimum wage.

As soon as I could I became an independent contractor. Cut out that middle-man. Never looked back.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: rockeTree on February 07, 2020, 08:44:49 AM
It's not all that Epic but it was nice to be asked to apply for a sure thing promotion to a job I didn't want and reject it immediately. It's a pretty big raise, they said. I save half my income and mostly like my job, I said. Nothing at all would change in my daily life except that I would mostly dislike my job and be saving a somewhat higher percent of my income. Find another sucker.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: jps on February 07, 2020, 09:20:41 AM
It's not all that Epic but it was nice to be asked to apply for a sure thing promotion to a job I didn't want and reject it immediately. It's a pretty big raise, they said. I save half my income and mostly like my job, I said. Nothing at all would change in my daily life except that I would mostly dislike my job and be saving a somewhat higher percent of my income. Find another sucker.

That's an awesome example of FU money, rockeTree! Way to stick it to the man.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Alternatepriorities on February 07, 2020, 10:18:14 AM
It's not all that Epic but it was nice to be asked to apply for a sure thing promotion to a job I didn't want and reject it immediately. It's a pretty big raise, they said. I save half my income and mostly like my job, I said. Nothing at all would change in my daily life except that I would mostly dislike my job and be saving a somewhat higher percent of my income. Find another sucker.

Isn’t avoiding BS spendy pants consumption so you can also avoid wasting your life on BS work you don’t enjoy the reason this blog and forum exist? I’d rate that as epic.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Dicey on February 07, 2020, 11:35:58 AM
It's not all that Epic but it was nice to be asked to apply for a sure thing promotion to a job I didn't want and reject it immediately. It's a pretty big raise, they said. I save half my income and mostly like my job, I said. Nothing at all would change in my daily life except that I would mostly dislike my job and be saving a somewhat higher percent of my income. Find another sucker.

Isn’t avoiding BS spendy pants consumption so you can also avoid wasting your life on BS work you don’t enjoy the reason this blog and forum exist? I’d rate that as epic.
Totally agree, though I'd rate it as "Epic", with a capital "E".
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Alternatepriorities on February 07, 2020, 02:19:37 PM
Good point Dicey. More capital is always a good thing.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: BTDretire on February 08, 2020, 08:55:53 AM

It was nice to be missed but much better to be well paid. :)

What a great line!
 That line should be sent to all previous employers when people left for being under paid.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Chris Pascale on February 08, 2020, 04:43:22 PM
It's not all that Epic but it was nice to be asked to apply for a sure thing promotion to a job I didn't want and reject it immediately. It's a pretty big raise, they said. I save half my income and mostly like my job, I said. Nothing at all would change in my daily life except that I would mostly dislike my job and be saving a somewhat higher percent of my income. Find another sucker.

Isn’t avoiding BS spendy pants consumption so you can also avoid wasting your life on BS work you don’t enjoy the reason this blog and forum exist? I’d rate that as epic.
Totally agree, though I'd rate it as "Epic", with a capital "E".

Because no fireworks are going off, it's easy to think this isn't an Epic story, but you have to think of how you claimed ownership of your life and joy, and realize that that's a big deal.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Buffaloski Boris on February 08, 2020, 08:49:55 PM
It's not all that Epic but it was nice to be asked to apply for a sure thing promotion to a job I didn't want and reject it immediately. It's a pretty big raise, they said. I save half my income and mostly like my job, I said. Nothing at all would change in my daily life except that I would mostly dislike my job and be saving a somewhat higher percent of my income. Find another sucker.

I have to agree with the other posters. This deserves Epic with an an E.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: rockeTree on February 09, 2020, 03:55:42 PM
Aw, thanks all!

This was reinforced by talking with a buddy who was shocked that I would turn it down, told me that he had never even considered rejecting a promotion, that that was the only way he could imagine saving money, and that he would be much happier in his previous role at his company, but "that's just not now it works." (He could save by eating food made at home more than a couple nights a month but that's a different conversation and of course his business).

I feel like being very conscious that I don't have to make default consumption choices not only makes it easy to save, but supports not making default earning choices. I don't need another $25k/year before taxes if it won't make a huge difference to my retirement date (which is mostly driven by varying assumptions about market returns at this point) and will make a huge negative difference in my quality of life.

I also talked to work bosses more and both said what promotions I would consider and laid out what conditions I would need to even contemplate the position they want me in, which they seemed to take on board as real possibilities. We shall see, but either way I'm fine and coming at it from a position of strength!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: BicycleB on February 10, 2020, 12:11:16 AM
Epic, @rockeTree!

For fun, here's 2 hours of epic music:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KaXXVzGy7Y8
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: BlueHouse on February 10, 2020, 07:26:41 AM
Aw, thanks all!

This was reinforced by talking with a buddy who was shocked that I would turn it down, told me that he had never even considered rejecting a promotion, that that was the only way he could imagine saving money, and that he would be much happier in his previous role at his company, but "that's just not now it works." (He could save by eating food made at home more than a couple nights a month but that's a different conversation and of course his business).

I feel like being very conscious that I don't have to make default consumption choices not only makes it easy to save, but supports not making default earning choices. I don't need another $25k/year before taxes if it won't make a huge difference to my retirement date (which is mostly driven by varying assumptions about market returns at this point) and will make a huge negative difference in my quality of life.

I also talked to work bosses more and both said what promotions I would consider and laid out what conditions I would need to even contemplate the position they want me in, which they seemed to take on board as real possibilities. We shall see, but either way I'm fine and coming at it from a position of strength!
I agree it was completely EPIC! 
One thing to remember about how lucky we are that we have arranged our lives such that we can make choices like this:  I have worked with multiple companies that have paths to advancement and if you have more than 2 years without hitting the expectation of the "next rung", then your pay actually starts to decrease.  They don't want people to sit in comfy jobs and not move up.  I can see from the company's perspective why they do it, but from a mustachian lifestyle, so glad it's not a more prevalent practice. 
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: ctuser1 on February 10, 2020, 07:58:48 AM
I started doing research: talking with folks I knew in the industry, reading online forums, and looking at job posting to put together a number right in the middle of what the industry was paying for my promoted role. I took that information to my boss at my next one-on-one and proceeded to walk him through what I was looking for in salary when they finally promoted me and why I thought those numbers were fair.

He was clearly stunned by the conversation and didn't even take a second to process what I'd said. Instead he told me, "You started at this company underpaid and you will always be underpaid as long as you work here. The promotion is not going to be negotiable and it's more like a 5% increase." I pointed out that the role should be paid at what the role is worth and not be based on my current salary. He shrugged his shoulders and basically said, "That's the way that it is and I'm not going to fight to get you any more."

That was the moment I knew it was time to leave. It was suddenly clear that they knew they were taking advantage of me. They knew I was ignorant of what the industry was paying and used that leverage to severely underpay me while hiring other folks at 40-60% more than me. And even when I proved to be one of the strongest assets on their team, the only response was a shrug of the shoulders and a "that's the way that it is."

How megacorps work has some complicated and convoluted reasoning behind it that will only make sense if you start thinking at scale.

As an employee, however, you operate within that given environment, with little opportunity to change that. As an individual, I believe the most rational stance is to recognize that:
1. Megacorp has no loyalty to you, and you shouldn't have any to it either.
2. You, however, need to have a strong loyalty to the individuals you work with, i.e. your team. They are your future network. You want to be remembered as a good team member by your teammates.

#2 and #1 often conflict. When it does, I choose to let #2 take precedence.

So, in your story, the fact that you were "surprised" that you were underpaid indicates you did not keep updated how much you are worth in the market. That indicates a violation of rule #1 that I follow.

Then, when you found out about that from the grapevine, your assume your manager, or his manager, has the ability to remedy that situation. 99% of the time that is not the case. The only time your manager(s) can do anything is if/when you show up with a 2-week-notice with another offer in hand. Even that gambit is risky. If your manager decides to fight for better salary - he has to burn a significant amount of political capital.

The most rational choice in this case is to take another offer, give your two week notice and and politely mention that you got a better opportunity while giving the notice, and make preparations to leave. If they do want to keep you, they might try to give a counter - but I am usually *very* uncomfortable taking those (I've been there, and declined it) for many reasons. THEN, some time later, a year or two, if your older job wants to bring you back with appropriate raises and stuff - you can move back. DW had this almost happen last year when her old employer gave her  an offer without any interview when they heard she was looking. This worked massively to her advantage since she could negotiate hardball (with extreme politeness) with the new job where she actually landed. She got a 50%+ raise this way from a single job hop.

I write this not with an intention to criticize you, but with the hope that more people can start acting rationally in these situations. Very few do. It is hard - as I can see when I try to advise DW to act opposite to what her instinctive reactions are in a given situation.

 
 
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Just Joe on February 10, 2020, 12:23:06 PM
Teen#1 gave their Epic FU announcement to their employer - and left. And days later the reality of quitting without a job has set in. Oh well, lesson learned. Don't repeat it. That child's super power is not learning their lessons until testing them IRL.

We talked about that a couple of months ago b/c we knew the teen was unhappy with the person they had been paired up with. That person had alot of rough edges.

Better to learn this lesson now with no responsibilities or bills and while living at home... Time to go find another job kid...
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: BicycleB on February 10, 2020, 01:09:23 PM
^LOL

@ctuser1, great post - very thought provoking!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: RyanAtTanagra on February 10, 2020, 01:11:13 PM
Teen#1 gave their Epic FU announcement to their employer - and left. And days later the reality of quitting without a job has set in. Oh well, lesson learned. Don't repeat it. That child's super power is not learning their lessons until testing them IRL.

We talked about that a couple of months ago b/c we knew the teen was unhappy with the person they had been paired up with. That person had alot of rough edges.

Better to learn this lesson now with no responsibilities or bills and while living at home... Time to go find another job kid...

So more of Epic FM (Fucked Myself) story?  I bet that would make for a good thread too.  "Times I thought I was using FU money but it ended up backfiring".
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: DaMa on February 10, 2020, 03:30:31 PM
I have a F*Ed Myself story which is pretty timely, considering recent discussion.

I had a nice offer for a new job, gave notice, and and received a counter-offer that included a pay increase and another week of paid vacation.  So I stayed.  3 months later my boss was fired and I ended up reporting to a total ass.  I ended up reaching out to the person who'd offered me the new job, who happily offered to hire me.  He wouldn't budge on the original offer, though, so it was actually a pay cut.  Which I took gladly.

Not quite epic, but I never again even considered a counter-offer.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Reynold on February 10, 2020, 03:58:22 PM
He was clearly stunned by the conversation and didn't even take a second to process what I'd said. Instead he told me, "You started at this company underpaid and you will always be underpaid as long as you work here. The promotion is not going to be negotiable and it's more like a 5% increase." 

I have a friend who, when starting a new job, was told something like "We pay slightly below market wages, but we want better than average performers!"  He and I were both puzzled by that contradiction, but he took the job anyway (his division/location at previous employer was shutting down).  I think he has generally been happy at his new job over the last decade, and has been promoted, but he is also very easy going so wasn't likely to make any big waves about things like pay. 

In my own case, at a previous employer, I started somewhat underpaid but so were the other people at the company because it was a startup, not a software one but the old fashioned kind that made physical things and so took many years to grow.  Some years in, out of the blue one year I got a 15% raise because they finally were big enough and had the resources to do a market analysis and increase the pay of the people there who were underpaid.  I realize that is contradictory to the experiences most people in this thread have talked about, but there was a reason I stayed there for almost 2 decades, they were a good place to work for most of that. 
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Reynold on February 10, 2020, 04:19:21 PM
How megacorps work has some complicated and convoluted reasoning behind it that will only make sense if you start thinking at scale.

As an employee, however, you operate within that given environment, with little opportunity to change that. As an individual, I believe the most rational stance is to recognize that:
1. Megacorp has no loyalty to you, and you shouldn't have any to it either.
2. You, however, need to have a strong loyalty to the individuals you work with, i.e. your team. They are your future network. You want to be remembered as a good team member by your teammates.

#2 and #1 often conflict. When it does, I choose to let #2 take precedence.

I have a story about that, when I got laid off from Company A just before Christmas in 2008 as the U.S. economy was dropping, I made sure I left on good terms with everyone.  I've since hired my previous boss as an occasional consultant where I work now, he was laid off shortly after me, most of my group at Company A went away.  Meanwhile his main job is with Company B, started by his, and my, even earlier boss at Company A.  Company B has now hired half a dozen other people from Company A who got laid off or left in the last few years.  My two former bosses also use me as a consultant on some other things they have going.  Networks with former colleagues can be invaluable, the people who are competent, who you want to work with again, also tend to be able to recognize that YOU were competent.  :)

I have a friend who has gotten a couple of jobs that way, he is terrible with people skills but a genius at keeping ISP systems and networks running.  More than one person who left a place he worked and got a job elsewhere poached him from his former employer with a raise, he is in a relatively small city so the IT people know each other.  One employer, a tiny ISP, went out of business after he got hired away, because he was the only one they had left who actually knew how to work the system.  Some new owners bought it and didn't understand who did what, they were under the impression ctuser1 describes so aptly that all workers are interchangeable cogs and so laid off his former manager as too expensive. 

All too poorly understood by megacorps is that if you make the workplace unpleasant, by overloading employees, putting them in jobs they don't want, and so on, the first ones who leave are the ones who are skilled enough to get jobs elsewhere, so the first 10% to go was probably doing 50% of your work. 
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Zaga on February 10, 2020, 04:58:09 PM
I don't get it, don't they do the math and realize that it costs a whole lot of money to replace someone?!  It's worth investing a little bit in your good employees so that you don't have to train and retrain.

My current job is losing people in droves.  The turnover there has always been absurdly high, but this is worse than that.  Something like half of HR left in the past few weeks.  It's like rats leaving a sinking ship.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: scottish on February 10, 2020, 05:57:52 PM
I don't get it, don't they do the math and realize that it costs a whole lot of money to replace someone?!  It's worth investing a little bit in your good employees so that you don't have to train and retrain.

My current job is losing people in droves.  The turnover there has always been absurdly high, but this is worse than that.  Something like half of HR left in the past few weeks.  It's like rats leaving a sinking ship.

Companies do not understand Price's law:   

Quote
The square root of the number of people in a domain do 50% of the work. This means that in a company of 10 employees, 3 of them do 1/2 the work. The remaining 50% of the work is done by the other 7 people.

Not to say I really understand Price's law.   If you have a factory with 10000 people, are 100 of them doing 50% of the work?   
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: ctuser1 on February 10, 2020, 06:45:00 PM
I don't get it, don't they do the math and realize that it costs a whole lot of money to replace someone?!  It's worth investing a little bit in your good employees so that you don't have to train and retrain.

My current job is losing people in droves.  The turnover there has always been absurdly high, but this is worse than that.  Something like half of HR left in the past few weeks.  It's like rats leaving a sinking ship.

If you ask 100 people working in your company, how many will respond they are underpaid?
If you rephrase - "are you underpaid given all the bull**** you have to go through here"? How many will answer yes?

Out of all the "yes" answers, how many are genuinely underpaid?
Do you have an objective criteria to identify people who are genuinely underpaid, AND will every accept the verdict of this "objective criteria"? If it was enacted, that will cause some dissatisfaction and disruption - what justifies that cost?

Out of all the "no" answers, how many are simply complacent? Do you just want to give them raises, with the risk others will notice that this employee is suddenly so ecstatic, put 2 and 2 together, and demand their fix-it?

If you keep a lid on all these, then the max cost is x number of "key person risk" materialize and you have to have some sort of "shit has hit the fan" management routine in place. Much easier!!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: markbike528CBX on February 11, 2020, 12:29:17 AM
I don't get it, don't they do the math and realize that it costs a whole lot of money to replace someone?!  It's worth investing a little bit in your good employees so that you don't have to train and retrain.

My current job is losing people in droves.  The turnover there has always been absurdly high, but this is worse than that.  Something like half of HR left in the past few weeks.  It's like rats leaving a sinking ship.

HR is leaving!? 
Make sure you've backed up (to home) any personal information/items you have at work. Put on your life jacket, which should be stuffed full of resumes. Don't stand under C-suit balconys.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Zaga on February 11, 2020, 04:56:12 AM
I don't get it, don't they do the math and realize that it costs a whole lot of money to replace someone?!  It's worth investing a little bit in your good employees so that you don't have to train and retrain.

My current job is losing people in droves.  The turnover there has always been absurdly high, but this is worse than that.  Something like half of HR left in the past few weeks.  It's like rats leaving a sinking ship.

HR is leaving!? 
Make sure you've backed up (to home) any personal information/items you have at work. Put on your life jacket, which should be stuffed full of resumes. Don't stand under C-suit balconys.
I've been down this road before, more than once.  I'm prepared for the whole company to fold at a moment's notice, and I don't keep anything personal on my work computer ever!  And yes, I'm looking for a change myself :-)
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: ctuser1 on February 11, 2020, 07:56:19 AM
I've been down this road before, more than once.  I'm prepared for the whole company to fold at a moment's notice, and I don't keep anything personal on my work computer ever!  And yes, I'm looking for a change myself :-)

Your age shows as 39 (which isn't to far from mine). So you must have been through the 2008, just like all of us in our age group or older did. :-D...

I somehow survived 3 entire-LOB-closures and maybe 15-20 rounds of layoffs in the 2-3 years around that time. Battle scars...

It was scary. I hope to at least be lean-FI next time anything half as scary comes around!!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: saguaro on February 11, 2020, 02:12:42 PM
How megacorps work has some complicated and convoluted reasoning behind it that will only make sense if you start thinking at scale.

As an employee, however, you operate within that given environment, with little opportunity to change that. As an individual, I believe the most rational stance is to recognize that:
1. Megacorp has no loyalty to you, and you shouldn't have any to it either.
2. You, however, need to have a strong loyalty to the individuals you work with, i.e. your team. They are your future network. You want to be remembered as a good team member by your teammates.

#2 and #1 often conflict. When it does, I choose to let #2 take precedence.

When I worked at the Big Company, I realized several years in after they started their rounds of downsizing / rightsizing / spinoffs / reinventions of the wheel that for all their previous declarations of valuing their employees, that the people who actually believed and practiced this were gone (at the top at least) replaced by those who simply thought everyone was a cog that could fit every wheel which was crazy considering the various projects and business units they had.  That was when I switched my focus from No. 1 to No. 2.   But there were those employees, especially long-term ones, who could not believe that the previously "layoff-proof" Big Company had changed, that somehow it still deserved their fealty (#1)  And when some employees who remained got hired away by former coworkers/bosses who got canned and landed on their feet elsewhere, sometimes for a better job with better pay, they still were shocked that someone would leave (#1 conflicting with #2).

Even when I realized that the Big Company was going down like the Titantic with its days numbered, I knew that at the very least I had a good network for the future in place (#2).  That was my #2 "lifeboat" and it paved (or rather I rowed?) my way for the next job.
 
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Plina on February 12, 2020, 10:56:52 AM
How megacorps work has some complicated and convoluted reasoning behind it that will only make sense if you start thinking at scale.

As an employee, however, you operate within that given environment, with little opportunity to change that. As an individual, I believe the most rational stance is to recognize that:
1. Megacorp has no loyalty to you, and you shouldn't have any to it either.
2. You, however, need to have a strong loyalty to the individuals you work with, i.e. your team. They are your future network. You want to be remembered as a good team member by your teammates.

#2 and #1 often conflict. When it does, I choose to let #2 take precedence.

When I worked at the Big Company, I realized several years in after they started their rounds of downsizing / rightsizing / spinoffs / reinventions of the wheel that for all their previous declarations of valuing their employees, that the people who actually believed and practiced this were gone (at the top at least) replaced by those who simply thought everyone was a cog that could fit every wheel which was crazy considering the various projects and business units they had.  That was when I switched my focus from No. 1 to No. 2.   But there were those employees, especially long-term ones, who could not believe that the previously "layoff-proof" Big Company had changed, that somehow it still deserved their fealty (#1)  And when some employees who remained got hired away by former coworkers/bosses who got canned and landed on their feet elsewhere, sometimes for a better job with better pay, they still were shocked that someone would leave (#1 conflicting with #2).

Even when I realized that the Big Company was going down like the Titantic with its days numbered, I knew that at the very least I had a good network for the future in place (#2).  That was my #2 "lifeboat" and it paved (or rather I rowed?) my way for the next job.
 

Interestingly enough you also see no 1 among many young employees that have newly graduated. You often see them shouting out how fantastic it is working for company x because you have had a really interesting day for planning for world domination. After a couple of years you realise that you have the same bs every year without nothing changing or that you rather spend your weekend with your family instead of planning for world domination. It is not actually a reward to go on that trip rather it feels like a punishment or a must do.

 I worked previously for a megacorp and basically the only thing that matterad was how much money you pulled in. Oh, they talked about other values and how the employees were their most valuable asset bla bla. But their words did not match their actions.

I also give my loyalty to my coworkers and my boss if I think she/he deserves it. I have always had excellent backning from my coworkers when I have been looking for something new.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Alternatepriorities on February 12, 2020, 11:46:02 AM
Interestingly enough you also see no 1 among many young employees that have newly graduated. You often see them shouting out how fantastic it is working for company x because you have had a really interesting day for planning for world domination. After a couple of years you realise that you have the same bs every year without nothing changing or that you rather spend your weekend with your family instead of planning for world domination. It is not actually a reward to go on that trip rather it feels like a punishment or a must do.

 I worked previously for a megacorp and basically the only thing that matterad was how much money you pulled in. Oh, they talked about other values and how the employees were their most valuable asset bla bla. But their words did not match their actions.

I also give my loyalty to my coworkers and my boss if I think she/he deserves it. I have always had excellent backning from my coworkers when I have been looking for something new.

That happens at small companies too in my experience. Though to be fair the guy running that company did come from a mega corp. It all fell apart when the money stopped flowing in, but at least it gave me an story to post here forty some pages ago...

...
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: AnnaGrowsAMustache on February 12, 2020, 03:01:27 PM
Interestingly enough you also see no 1 among many young employees that have newly graduated. You often see them shouting out how fantastic it is working for company x because you have had a really interesting day for planning for world domination. After a couple of years you realise that you have the same bs every year without nothing changing or that you rather spend your weekend with your family instead of planning for world domination. It is not actually a reward to go on that trip rather it feels like a punishment or a must do.

 I worked previously for a megacorp and basically the only thing that matterad was how much money you pulled in. Oh, they talked about other values and how the employees were their most valuable asset bla bla. But their words did not match their actions.

I also give my loyalty to my coworkers and my boss if I think she/he deserves it. I have always had excellent backning from my coworkers when I have been looking for something new.

That happens at small companies too in my experience. Though to be fair the guy running that company did come from a mega corp. It all fell apart when the money stopped flowing in, but at least it gave me an story to post here forty some pages ago...

...

Small companies are bad. The small, husband and wife run companies are the absolute worst. No matter how smart each are as individuals, once they're egging each other on it rapidly becomes dumb and dumber. NEVER again will I work for a husband and wife team.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: PhrugalPhan on February 12, 2020, 07:37:13 PM
Small companies are bad. The small, husband and wife run companies are the absolute worst. No matter how smart each are as individuals, once they're egging each other on it rapidly becomes dumb and dumber. NEVER again will I work for a husband and wife team.
That was my experience too.  Can't say I miss it that's for sure.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Alternatepriorities on February 12, 2020, 08:39:49 PM
Small companies are bad. The small, husband and wife run companies are the absolute worst. No matter how smart each are as individuals, once they're egging each other on it rapidly becomes dumb and dumber. NEVER again will I work for a husband and wife team.
That was my experience too.  Can't say I miss it that's for sure.

Interesting. Possibly the best place I’ve ever worked was husband and wife small business. The pay was inline with the work (restaurant) and the environment was generally very positive. I actually had a mini FU money story the last summer I worked there. I thought I’d make some extra cash by taking a second job at another restaurant (a megacorp for my small town). I told the boss at the first place I wouldn’t be able to work the occasional overtime because of the new job. Started the new job and it was a total cluster... I quit after the first night because the place was so miserable and I didn’t need a second income that badly... The next day I told the owner “I can work in a kitchen that badly run after working here put me back on the occasional overtime” and immediately got a raise!   
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Siebrie on February 13, 2020, 02:47:08 AM
A friend of mine did her Master's project in Applied Mathematics in a small company and came to a surprising conclusion. Company: printing fabrics on-demand; staff: husband (in charge of printing), wife (admin), husband's brother (representative, on the road all day). The company was not making the profit it could make and asked for help. The conclusion: the husband had to grow a spine! Everytime the brother confirmed a sale, he called the wife, who then told the husband to stop everything and fulfill this specific order. This messed up the normal run of the small factory and cost them a lot of time in extra cleaning of the paint rollers, etc. :)
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: AnnaGrowsAMustache on February 13, 2020, 05:03:26 AM
A friend of mine did her Master's project in Applied Mathematics in a small company and came to a surprising conclusion. Company: printing fabrics on-demand; staff: husband (in charge of printing), wife (admin), husband's brother (representative, on the road all day). The company was not making the profit it could make and asked for help. The conclusion: the husband had to grow a spine! Everytime the brother confirmed a sale, he called the wife, who then told the husband to stop everything and fulfill this specific order. This messed up the normal run of the small factory and cost them a lot of time in extra cleaning of the paint rollers, etc. :)

That's pretty much how the husband/wife team operated in the place I worked. Everything they wanted was urgent and important, even if actually there were far more urgent and important client or outside agency related tasks to be done. Yeah, I'll stop getting together information requested by the auditor that has to be done TODAY just so I can spend an hour calling your patients to confirm they got a non-urgent text that the software says they did in fact get all while you toddle out for a midday run??? Or hey, sure I'll stop invoicing which generates actual money coming in so I can babysit your kid for the afternoon?!

They had no idea at all how to separate what they wanted in the moment, from the tasks that actually were important from a business standpoint. And they were plain unprofessional as well.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: SeaG1ant on February 13, 2020, 06:25:20 AM
 know its stupid to do it, but I don't want to change it. For one, I'm always afraid that I won't have enough withheld and I'll owe the government money. Second, I'm afraid to being tempted to blow that extra money instead of saving it or using it to pay off debt. I just don't trust myself. If I have a big chunk of money to put on a bill all at once it's more satisfying to me than just chipping away at it. I know I should facepunch myself for that but that's how I am.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: dandarc on February 13, 2020, 06:26:46 AM
Wrong thread @SeaG1ant ?
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Plina on February 13, 2020, 11:26:03 AM
Small companies are bad. The small, husband and wife run companies are the absolute worst. No matter how smart each are as individuals, once they're egging each other on it rapidly becomes dumb and dumber. NEVER again will I work for a husband and wife team.
That was my experience too.  Can't say I miss it that's for sure.

Interesting. Possibly the best place I’ve ever worked was husband and wife small business. The pay was inline with the work (restaurant) and the environment was generally very positive. I actually had a mini FU money story the last summer I worked there. I thought I’d make some extra cash by taking a second job at another restaurant (a megacorp for my small town). I told the boss at the first place I wouldn’t be able to work the occasional overtime because of the new job. Started the new job and it was a total cluster... I quit after the first night because the place was so miserable and I didn’t need a second income that badly... The next day I told the owner “I can work in a kitchen that badly run after working here put me back on the occasional overtime” and immediately got a raise!   

I am coming to the conclusion that I don’t like working for other people. I currently work for a small company. The biggest problem currently is that we are waiting for a decision to be made so we can start our work. The waiting is starting to drive me crazy as I don’t really have so much to do. Combine that with the fact that I don’t have anything in common with my colleagues, so the days feel really long. We are going to hire more people when we get the go so hopefully someone that I have something in common.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: CptCool on February 13, 2020, 12:14:15 PM
A friend of mine did her Master's project in Applied Mathematics in a small company and came to a surprising conclusion. Company: printing fabrics on-demand; staff: husband (in charge of printing), wife (admin), husband's brother (representative, on the road all day). The company was not making the profit it could make and asked for help. The conclusion: the husband had to grow a spine! Everytime the brother confirmed a sale, he called the wife, who then told the husband to stop everything and fulfill this specific order. This messed up the normal run of the small factory and cost them a lot of time in extra cleaning of the paint rollers, etc. :)

That's pretty much how the husband/wife team every company I've ever worked at operated in the place I worked. Everything they wanted was urgent and important, even if actually there were far more urgent and important client or outside agency related tasks to be done. Yeah, I'll stop getting together information requested by the auditor that has to be done TODAY just so I can spend an hour calling your patients to confirm they got a non-urgent text that the software says they did in fact get all while you toddle out for a midday run??? Or hey, sure I'll stop invoicing which generates actual money coming in so I can babysit your kid for the afternoon?!

They had no idea at all how to separate what they wanted in the moment, from the tasks that actually were important from a business standpoint. And they were plain unprofessional as well.

Updated your quote where bold = me. I feel like every company i've ever worked at has failed miserably with prioritization. Everything is always high priority, so nothing ever gets done.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: zolotiyeruki on February 13, 2020, 01:13:58 PM

That's pretty much how the husband/wife team every company I've ever worked at operated in the place I worked. Everything they wanted was urgent and important, even if actually there were far more urgent and important client or outside agency related tasks to be done. Yeah, I'll stop getting together information requested by the auditor that has to be done TODAY just so I can spend an hour calling your patients to confirm they got a non-urgent text that the software says they did in fact get all while you toddle out for a midday run??? Or hey, sure I'll stop invoicing which generates actual money coming in so I can babysit your kid for the afternoon?!

They had no idea at all how to separate what they wanted in the moment, from the tasks that actually were important from a business standpoint. And they were plain unprofessional as well.

Updated your quote where bold = me. I feel like every company i've ever worked at has failed miserably with prioritization. Everything is always high priority, so nothing ever gets done.
Heh, I work for a small company, and I push back on this at least a few times each week: "Is this a higher priority than <insert current top priority project>?"  I've seen it cause the requester to pause for a few moments to consider it.  It's lovely, because it 1) keeps the blame away from me if something gets delayed due to shifting priorities, and 2) it's a helpful reminder to The Powers That Be that their resources are finite.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: turketron on February 13, 2020, 01:37:19 PM
Heh, I work for a small company, and I push back on this at least a few times each week: "Is this a higher priority than <insert current top priority project>?"  I've seen it cause the requester to pause for a few moments to consider it.  It's lovely, because it 1) keeps the blame away from me if something gets delayed due to shifting priorities, and 2) it's a helpful reminder to The Powers That Be that their resources are finite.

There are some good scripts on https://www.askamanager.org/ about how to bring this up, some variation of your script, or something like "I can do that today, but it means that ____ won't get done until Friday..." with the additional recommendation of doing this via email/slack/etc when possible so there's a record of the conversation.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: dignam on February 13, 2020, 02:04:43 PM
Heh, I work for a small company, and I push back on this at least a few times each week: "Is this a higher priority than <insert current top priority project>?"  I've seen it cause the requester to pause for a few moments to consider it.  It's lovely, because it 1) keeps the blame away from me if something gets delayed due to shifting priorities, and 2) it's a helpful reminder to The Powers That Be that their resources are finite.

There are some good scripts on https://www.askamanager.org/ about how to bring this up, some variation of your script, or something like "I can do that today, but it means that ____ won't get done until Friday..." with the additional recommendation of doing this via email/slack/etc when possible so there's a record of the conversation.

Guess I should count myself lucky.  We are very good at this at my company.  If a product owner asks my team to tackle something, one of my first questions is "where does this fall in priority?" Followed by "this and that will need to be pushed to the side then".  A lot of the time I don't even have to ask.  It's all about setting expectations.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: BlueHouse on February 14, 2020, 07:43:45 AM
A friend of mine did her Master's project in Applied Mathematics in a small company and came to a surprising conclusion. Company: printing fabrics on-demand; staff: husband (in charge of printing), wife (admin), husband's brother (representative, on the road all day). The company was not making the profit it could make and asked for help. The conclusion: the husband had to grow a spine! Everytime the brother confirmed a sale, he called the wife, who then told the husband to stop everything and fulfill this specific order. This messed up the normal run of the small factory and cost them a lot of time in extra cleaning of the paint rollers, etc. :)

That's pretty much how the husband/wife team every company I've ever worked at operated in the place I worked. Everything they wanted was urgent and important, even if actually there were far more urgent and important client or outside agency related tasks to be done. Yeah, I'll stop getting together information requested by the auditor that has to be done TODAY just so I can spend an hour calling your patients to confirm they got a non-urgent text that the software says they did in fact get all while you toddle out for a midday run??? Or hey, sure I'll stop invoicing which generates actual money coming in so I can babysit your kid for the afternoon?!

They had no idea at all how to separate what they wanted in the moment, from the tasks that actually were important from a business standpoint. And they were plain unprofessional as well.

Updated your quote where bold = me. I feel like every company i've ever worked at has failed miserably with prioritization. Everything is always high priority, so nothing ever gets done.

heheh.  I worked for a small company where one of the partners (the business minded guy) worked 8-5 and the other partner (the creative genius programmer) worked 11ish to 2am-ish.  In the mornings, partner #1 would give me one set of priorities and in the afternoon, partner #2 gave me a different set. It was not easy, but it was fun because I loved that company and what we were building.  I tried to avoid partner #1 in the mornings because I didn't want to follow his instructions. 
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Warlord1986 on February 15, 2020, 02:11:44 PM
Copied from my journal.


So our Executive Director came in my office and told me she wanted to take on a 'leadership role' now that my supervisor was leaving. I said I would need the title of interim director and the according pay. She immediately shot that down. When I said that wouldn't work for me she started threatening me with double speak and dog whistles. I decided life is too short to put up with that crap and sent HR my two weeks notice.

I have some money saved and a part time job. But if anyone wants to buy one of my short stories, here's a link: https://www.amazon.com/dp/B07CKSBZT1

Just an update. I spent the last few months bumming around, working as a waitress (and filling a $15,000 wholesale order for that business), reading a lot of books about Venice, Istanbul, and the Medicis, getting certified as a Stand Up Paddleboarding instructor, dating a bit, and volunteering. The library where I volunteer hired me. I start on Monday. The position is part time, but it's enough to pay my bills, and I'll be back in the state retirement system (which I didn't know when I applied!). My funds are at roughly the same place they were when I left, and I'm saving for a trip to Malta. This sabbatical turned out really well for me! :3

Another update: the library has been very good to me. I started a non-fiction book club, planned a speaker series where religious leaders come in and talk about their religions and answer questions, and read lots of books. <3 I recently accepted an offer to go full time. Starting March 1, I will have medical benefits and a full time salary again. :) I'm not making huge money, but with a housemate and a side gig here and there, I can still save plenty. Cross your fingers for Malta!

Regarding my former supervisor, and the Executive Director: the supervisor is busy at her new job throwing tantrums and making everyone hate her. It's a small community and more than one person has independently mentioned her, not knowing I used to work with her. I haven't heard as much about the ED, which is somewhat surprising. I am aware that her last fundraiser did not do very well.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: DaMa on February 15, 2020, 05:39:43 PM
Way to go @Warlord1986!  Congratulations!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Zaga on February 15, 2020, 05:41:42 PM
Sounds great!  It's hard to tell where life will take you when you're busy living it.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Just Joe on February 17, 2020, 10:14:20 AM
A friend of mine did her Master's project in Applied Mathematics in a small company and came to a surprising conclusion. Company: printing fabrics on-demand; staff: husband (in charge of printing), wife (admin), husband's brother (representative, on the road all day). The company was not making the profit it could make and asked for help. The conclusion: the husband had to grow a spine! Everytime the brother confirmed a sale, he called the wife, who then told the husband to stop everything and fulfill this specific order. This messed up the normal run of the small factory and cost them a lot of time in extra cleaning of the paint rollers, etc. :)

That's pretty much how the husband/wife team every company I've ever worked at operated in the place I worked. Everything they wanted was urgent and important, even if actually there were far more urgent and important client or outside agency related tasks to be done. Yeah, I'll stop getting together information requested by the auditor that has to be done TODAY just so I can spend an hour calling your patients to confirm they got a non-urgent text that the software says they did in fact get all while you toddle out for a midday run??? Or hey, sure I'll stop invoicing which generates actual money coming in so I can babysit your kid for the afternoon?!

They had no idea at all how to separate what they wanted in the moment, from the tasks that actually were important from a business standpoint. And they were plain unprofessional as well.

Updated your quote where bold = me. I feel like every company i've ever worked at has failed miserably with prioritization. Everything is always high priority, so nothing ever gets done.

heheh.  I worked for a small company where one of the partners (the business minded guy) worked 8-5 and the other partner (the creative genius programmer) worked 11ish to 2am-ish.  In the mornings, partner #1 would give me one set of priorities and in the afternoon, partner #2 gave me a different set. It was not easy, but it was fun because I loved that company and what we were building.  I tried to avoid partner #1 in the mornings because I didn't want to follow his instructions.

I worked for a company like that. Partner#1 was a level headed guy. Partner#2 had issues possibly including substance abuse issues. Definitely had in the past. Conflicting orders, hard to get anything done, etc.

Made do for a while but they had me paired with a coworker who was a safety concern. Coworker set the work pace and if he didn't want to eat lunch (he was dieting) then I didn't get to eat lunch.

After several safety situations I quit and went back to a previous employer who was happy to have me back.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: dd564 on February 18, 2020, 01:32:33 PM

Holy crap, I can't believe he told you that straight up. That's practically telling your employee to leave for greener pastures.

In some cases, an excellent manager will tell you exactly that. (They'll tell you because the value your relationship more than their job).

In a company I am familiar with, once you are hired, you only get a percentage increase.  I felt I was underpaid and it was confirmed when I was promoted and people who were doing less than me were in the same position I head before changing, were paid more than me.

The reasons companies don't pay these SUPERSTAR people better is:

1. The employee may never find out.
2. The employee may find out but never complain.
3. The employee is too lazy to find a better option (or they keep employee too busy to have time to interview).
4. If they are motivated by money first, they aren't company people and will probably leave when times get stressful anyway. Better to have employees you can depend on and the undependable will weed themselves out through salary demands. (Or they know some employees will just outgrow them financially. Budgets for that type of company can't handle large salaries due to small margins or bad management).
5. At some point an employee can only work at 100 MPH for so long. Paying them a big raise might curb that work ethic in because of the feeling they "finally made it" from an earnings standpoint.
and finally...
#6.  EVERYONE IS REPLACEABLE.
The might not hire the exact same as you, but they might hire two other people to do what you did.  One will be bad, the other will be good.  In 6-12 months, one will leave through firing or on their own, the other will work to be close to the level you were.  The rest of your team that remains will actually have to pick up a bit of the load SUPERSTAR employee was carrying, but things will normalize in 3 months.



Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Threshkin on February 18, 2020, 11:21:44 PM

Holy crap, I can't believe he told you that straight up. That's practically telling your employee to leave for greener pastures.

In some cases, an excellent manager will tell you exactly that. (They'll tell you because the value your relationship more than their job).

In a company I am familiar with, once you are hired, you only get a percentage increase.  I felt I was underpaid and it was confirmed when I was promoted and people who were doing less than me were in the same position I head before changing, were paid more than me.

The reasons companies don't pay these SUPERSTAR people better is:

1. The employee may never find out.
2. The employee may find out but never complain. 

Early in my professional career I found out I was underpaid and complained.  Actually had the guts to suggest that I may need to talk to the Labor Relations Board regarding equal pay for equal work.  Netted me a 40% raise.

3. The employee is too lazy to find a better option (or they keep employee too busy to have time to interview). 

About a year later I got a better offer from an manager and turned in my notice.  Told them the new salary in my resignation letter.  Two days before my last day they realized I might consider a counter offer.  Got me a second 40% raise.  (Pissed off the other company but they, a startup, went under within a year.)

4. If they are motivated by money first, they aren't company people and will probably leave when times get stressful anyway. Better to have employees you can depend on and the undependable will weed themselves out through salary demands. (Or they know some employees will just outgrow them financially. Budgets for that type of company can't handle large salaries due to small margins or bad management).

I left for good about 18 months later because I could read the writing on the wall.  The company had lost momentum in the market and was about to crash.  Out of 17 people in my marketing department, I was the first to leave but within 6 months there were only 2 people left.  Everyone else had quit, from VP to Administrator. I just beat the stress.

5. At some point an employee can only work at 100 MPH for so long. Paying them a big raise might curb that work ethic in because of the feeling they "finally made it" from an earnings standpoint.
and finally...
#6.  EVERYONE IS REPLACEABLE.
The might not hire the exact same as you, but they might hire two other people to do what you did.  One will be bad, the other will be good.  In 6-12 months, one will leave through firing or on their own, the other will work to be close to the level you were.  The rest of your team that remains will actually have to pick up a bit of the load SUPERSTAR employee was carrying, but things will normalize in 3 months.

The funny thing was that I didn't have FI or even much FU money at the time.  I just had the invincibility of youth.....and no installment debt!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: dandarc on February 19, 2020, 07:13:05 AM
To your point @Threshkin - https://www.mrmoneymustache.com/2018/03/09/money-and-confidence-are-interchangeable/ (https://www.mrmoneymustache.com/2018/03/09/money-and-confidence-are-interchangeable/)
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: alcon835 on February 20, 2020, 06:35:20 AM
I started doing research: talking with folks I knew in the industry, reading online forums, and looking at job posting to put together a number right in the middle of what the industry was paying for my promoted role. I took that information to my boss at my next one-on-one and proceeded to walk him through what I was looking for in salary when they finally promoted me and why I thought those numbers were fair.

He was clearly stunned by the conversation and didn't even take a second to process what I'd said. Instead he told me, "You started at this company underpaid and you will always be underpaid as long as you work here. The promotion is not going to be negotiable and it's more like a 5% increase." I pointed out that the role should be paid at what the role is worth and not be based on my current salary. He shrugged his shoulders and basically said, "That's the way that it is and I'm not going to fight to get you any more."

That was the moment I knew it was time to leave. It was suddenly clear that they knew they were taking advantage of me. They knew I was ignorant of what the industry was paying and used that leverage to severely underpay me while hiring other folks at 40-60% more than me. And even when I proved to be one of the strongest assets on their team, the only response was a shrug of the shoulders and a "that's the way that it is."

How megacorps work has some complicated and convoluted reasoning behind it that will only make sense if you start thinking at scale.

As an employee, however, you operate within that given environment, with little opportunity to change that. As an individual, I believe the most rational stance is to recognize that:
1. Megacorp has no loyalty to you, and you shouldn't have any to it either.
2. You, however, need to have a strong loyalty to the individuals you work with, i.e. your team. They are your future network. You want to be remembered as a good team member by your teammates.

#2 and #1 often conflict. When it does, I choose to let #2 take precedence.

So, in your story, the fact that you were "surprised" that you were underpaid indicates you did not keep updated how much you are worth in the market. That indicates a violation of rule #1 that I follow.

Then, when you found out about that from the grapevine, your assume your manager, or his manager, has the ability to remedy that situation. 99% of the time that is not the case. The only time your manager(s) can do anything is if/when you show up with a 2-week-notice with another offer in hand. Even that gambit is risky. If your manager decides to fight for better salary - he has to burn a significant amount of political capital.

The most rational choice in this case is to take another offer, give your two week notice and and politely mention that you got a better opportunity while giving the notice, and make preparations to leave. If they do want to keep you, they might try to give a counter - but I am usually *very* uncomfortable taking those (I've been there, and declined it) for many reasons. THEN, some time later, a year or two, if your older job wants to bring you back with appropriate raises and stuff - you can move back. DW had this almost happen last year when her old employer gave her  an offer without any interview when they heard she was looking. This worked massively to her advantage since she could negotiate hardball (with extreme politeness) with the new job where she actually landed. She got a 50%+ raise this way from a single job hop.

I write this not with an intention to criticize you, but with the hope that more people can start acting rationally in these situations. Very few do. It is hard - as I can see when I try to advise DW to act opposite to what her instinctive reactions are in a given situation.

 
 

This was a few years ago now, and honestly, it was more the "nail in the coffin" than the catalyst for change. I went in telling them what I needed to make as part of my promotion to better meet with the market and knew going it that it would probably end up in my looking for work elsewhere. What surprised me was the phrase, "you came in underpaid and will always be underpaid as long as you work here." I honestly never thought I'd hear that from a manager and it's definitely the wrong thing to do for the employee and the team and the company.

As for point #2, I have maintained my relationships over there with the exception of two people, and at this point I'm very happy with the decisions I've made up until this point and the way it's played out.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: alcon835 on February 20, 2020, 06:38:01 AM
He was clearly stunned by the conversation and didn't even take a second to process what I'd said. Instead he told me, "You started at this company underpaid and you will always be underpaid as long as you work here. The promotion is not going to be negotiable and it's more like a 5% increase." 

I have a friend who, when starting a new job, was told something like "We pay slightly below market wages, but we want better than average performers!"  He and I were both puzzled by that contradiction, but he took the job anyway (his division/location at previous employer was shutting down).  I think he has generally been happy at his new job over the last decade, and has been promoted, but he is also very easy going so wasn't likely to make any big waves about things like pay. 

In my own case, at a previous employer, I started somewhat underpaid but so were the other people at the company because it was a startup, not a software one but the old fashioned kind that made physical things and so took many years to grow.  Some years in, out of the blue one year I got a 15% raise because they finally were big enough and had the resources to do a market analysis and increase the pay of the people there who were underpaid.  I realize that is contradictory to the experiences most people in this thread have talked about, but there was a reason I stayed there for almost 2 decades, they were a good place to work for most of that.

This is such a fantastic point to make! There really are organizations out there that do what is right for the employee. Especially those folks who take risks with an organization should be remembered and supported. I'm so glad you brought this up!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: alcon835 on February 20, 2020, 06:48:39 AM

Holy crap, I can't believe he told you that straight up. That's practically telling your employee to leave for greener pastures.

In some cases, an excellent manager will tell you exactly that. (They'll tell you because the value your relationship more than their job).

In a company I am familiar with, once you are hired, you only get a percentage increase.  I felt I was underpaid and it was confirmed when I was promoted and people who were doing less than me were in the same position I head before changing, were paid more than me.

The reasons companies don't pay these SUPERSTAR people better is:

1. The employee may never find out.
2. The employee may find out but never complain.
3. The employee is too lazy to find a better option (or they keep employee too busy to have time to interview).
4. If they are motivated by money first, they aren't company people and will probably leave when times get stressful anyway. Better to have employees you can depend on and the undependable will weed themselves out through salary demands. (Or they know some employees will just outgrow them financially. Budgets for that type of company can't handle large salaries due to small margins or bad management).
5. At some point an employee can only work at 100 MPH for so long. Paying them a big raise might curb that work ethic in because of the feeling they "finally made it" from an earnings standpoint.
and finally...
#6.  EVERYONE IS REPLACEABLE.
The might not hire the exact same as you, but they might hire two other people to do what you did.  One will be bad, the other will be good.  In 6-12 months, one will leave through firing or on their own, the other will work to be close to the level you were.  The rest of your team that remains will actually have to pick up a bit of the load SUPERSTAR employee was carrying, but things will normalize in 3 months.

I see #6 from competent companies. There are some where the good people leave and are replaced with not good people. I've had more than one ex-managed come to me a year+ after leaving an organization and tell me, "Nothing has been done at X part of the company since you left..."

Which, honestly, is a massive failure of that organization. If a manager can't replace someone and keep moving the needle, what's the point of having that manager in that position? And yet, I've seen it time and time again, people get into manager roles and don't know how to hire/train/motivate/prioritize their team. After their superstar(s) leave, they're left with little progress.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Imma on February 20, 2020, 10:24:37 AM
I'm in a difficult position at work, I may need FU money soon. My organisation is in a big transition (merger, acquisition, that type of stuff, I don't want to go into details) and our future will be decided in a couple of weeks. I've been here for 18 months out of a 2 year contract that's supposed to result in a permanent position when this contract ends.

I've been told "through the grapevine" but not officially, that I will be expected to work fulltime after graduation (this was never discussed previously and most women in my country don't work fulltime) and also that due to the company transition it's going to be unlikely that the specialist role is still something they can offer. My contract is parttime, they can't force me to switch to fulltime but they can of course not renew my contract. In a few weeks we will know more about the details of the transition and I will request a meeting with my boss to discuss the implications formally.

Lately however there are aspects within the company culture that have become more visible that I am really starting to resent. There is very little flexibility when it comes to working hours even though this is something we discussed beforehand. There's a personality clash between me and one other person who I was told was only temping for a short period but who's contract is extended all the time. I have tried everything in my power to resolve this but it hasn't worked, and we are in a job where we need to cooperate. But most importantly the lack of diversity is starting to kill me. At first everyone in my office was on their best behaviour (me being a woman of the Millenial generation, my coworkers being mostly gen X males) but masks have dropped and I am tired of hearing racist and sexist BS. I have called out people because of this but every time this results in a backlash, as in, everyone in the room turning against me with raised voices, also the only other woman who is not sexist but is definitely racist. I don't think my coworkers would classify themselves as sexist, I mean, they're not saying stuff like "mothers should not work" like a real sexist. They just say they believe that children need their mother around 24/7 before they are of school age because otherwise they will not thrive, and this is the natural order of things. Which is just a longwinded BS way to say the same thing. (I'm totally fine with people choosing to be SAHP's, but please just say 'we have chosen for my partner to stay at home' instead of telling me what's natural and what's not).

As a young woman with a non-conventional life I stand out. Honestly I will stand out at most places, even though I try to blend in. I have tried to frame our frugality as a form of environmentalism and as a way that my artist partner can focus on his art (which is the truth, but also sounds better than saying 'I'm not a consumer sucka like you guys are') and this is also ridiculed quite often. As a result of all of this I've become more withdrawn and unfortunately the quality of my work is suffering too. Because I'm slowly withdrawing from the group process sometimes I'm not up to speed about stuff on the (work-related) office talk. I have the feeling the temp is also not always passing on messages for me as they should (but can't prove this).

All in all, I will need to have a 1 on 1 talk with my boss when the future of the company is announced. And I need to discuss why I don't feel comfortable at work anymore, in a way that the boss will understand. I'm not sure it's even possible for me to change the company culture even if my boss would agree with me. I think there's a fair chance we'll either decide to part ways or my contract will not be renewed in October. I've not got a lot of liquid cash right now, but I could sell off investments if I had to. I have a side hustle that would  probably bring in just enough income for my half of the bills and I could always find a side job waiting tables or something. I'm just soooo tired of office culture and never fitting in. It's almost worse than high school.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: mm1970 on February 20, 2020, 10:50:34 AM
Quote
All in all, I will need to have a 1 on 1 talk with my boss when the future of the company is announced. And I need to discuss why I don't feel comfortable at work anymore, in a way that the boss will understand. I'm not sure it's even possible for me to change the company culture even if my boss would agree with me. I think there's a fair chance we'll either decide to part ways or my contract will not be renewed in October. I've not got a lot of liquid cash right now, but I could sell off investments if I had to. I have a side hustle that would  probably bring in just enough income for my half of the bills and I could always find a side job waiting tables or something. I'm just soooo tired of office culture and never fitting in. It's almost worse than high school.
I'm sorry you are going through this.  It is so tough.  I don't have it that bad (high school was worse, for sure!) but office politics and difficult people make work...wearying.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Imma on February 20, 2020, 11:31:16 AM
Quote
All in all, I will need to have a 1 on 1 talk with my boss when the future of the company is announced. And I need to discuss why I don't feel comfortable at work anymore, in a way that the boss will understand. I'm not sure it's even possible for me to change the company culture even if my boss would agree with me. I think there's a fair chance we'll either decide to part ways or my contract will not be renewed in October. I've not got a lot of liquid cash right now, but I could sell off investments if I had to. I have a side hustle that would  probably bring in just enough income for my half of the bills and I could always find a side job waiting tables or something. I'm just soooo tired of office culture and never fitting in. It's almost worse than high school.
I'm sorry you are going through this.  It is so tough.  I don't have it that bad (high school was worse, for sure!) but office politics and difficult people make work...wearying.

I had my own tribe of nerds and goths in highschool, I don't have that here. It's not that I'm an extremely weird antisocial person, but I am a woman, I'm a bit of a geek, I'm not into fashion, I'm not particularly nurturing, I'm into music and crafts and history books and stuff like that. I'm not into owning fancy stuff. Just your average mustachian I suppose :) It seems that so far I always end up in organisations dominated by older males who hire younger males who are just like them. There are plenty of other women in grad school with me but it's said they don't last long in this field, which is why they aren't hired, but I dunno, maybe there's a reason they all leave the field so quickly and it's not because women are difficult? ( I think you're an engineer if I remember correctly, I can imagine that's also a very male dominated field)

I'm really good at what I'm specializing in, but I'm not good in all aspects of my general job. Let's say I'm much better at designing high quality baskets than at fixing the looms for underwater basket weaving when they break. I'm trying really hard to becoming better at loom fixing, I watch youtube video's about it in my spare time, but trying to improve means I'm asking lots of questions to coworkers and I work slowly which they perceive as me being incompetent. And of course, I am not good at loom fixing, but hey, I'm not a loom mechanic, I never claimed to be, please let me design the fancy baskets that we can sell for $$$ because that's what I'm really good at. When I do get to design it's always a big success.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: jeninco on February 20, 2020, 01:04:07 PM
Quote
All in all, I will need to have a 1 on 1 talk with my boss when the future of the company is announced. And I need to discuss why I don't feel comfortable at work anymore, in a way that the boss will understand. I'm not sure it's even possible for me to change the company culture even if my boss would agree with me. I think there's a fair chance we'll either decide to part ways or my contract will not be renewed in October. I've not got a lot of liquid cash right now, but I could sell off investments if I had to. I have a side hustle that would  probably bring in just enough income for my half of the bills and I could always find a side job waiting tables or something. I'm just soooo tired of office culture and never fitting in. It's almost worse than high school.
I'm sorry you are going through this.  It is so tough.  I don't have it that bad (high school was worse, for sure!) but office politics and difficult people make work...wearying.

<snip, for conciseness, and because you don't have to defend who you are!>

It seems that so far I always end up in organisations dominated by older males who hire younger males who are just like them. There are plenty of other women in grad school with me but it's said they don't last long in this field, which is why they aren't hired, but I dunno, maybe there's a reason they all leave the field so quickly and it's not because women are difficult? ( I think you're an engineer if I remember correctly, I can imagine that's also a very male dominated field)

I'm really good at what I'm specializing in, but I'm not good in all aspects of my general job. Let's say I'm much better at designing high quality baskets than at fixing the looms for underwater basket weaving when they break. I'm trying really hard to becoming better at loom fixing, I watch youtube video's about it in my spare time, but trying to improve means I'm asking lots of questions to coworkers and I work slowly which they perceive as me being incompetent. And of course, I am not good at loom fixing, but hey, I'm not a loom mechanic, I never claimed to be, please let me design the fancy baskets that we can sell for $$$ because that's what I'm really good at. When I do get to design it's always a big success.

I'm sorry you're in this situation. I'm ... a bit older then you (not quite a Boomer), have a MS in Applied Math, and have spent my professional life in a couple of highly technical fields where I'm frequently the only woman in the room (less now then in the last, knock wood).  I basically have had one awesome boss, and have followed him around for most of the past 25 years to avoid a bunch of this BS.

Pretty much anytime someone starts making generalizations about "what women are like" they're wrong, at least as applies to me. I've gotten to the point where I often just look at the person, and let them think about it. This probably works better if you're over a certain age.

I suggest looking over the website askamanager.org before meeting with your boss. Allison covers a lot of the concepts you're looking to express, and while the site is US-focused, there are commenters and questions from other places, too.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: AnnaGrowsAMustache on February 20, 2020, 03:49:15 PM
Quote
All in all, I will need to have a 1 on 1 talk with my boss when the future of the company is announced. And I need to discuss why I don't feel comfortable at work anymore, in a way that the boss will understand. I'm not sure it's even possible for me to change the company culture even if my boss would agree with me. I think there's a fair chance we'll either decide to part ways or my contract will not be renewed in October. I've not got a lot of liquid cash right now, but I could sell off investments if I had to. I have a side hustle that would  probably bring in just enough income for my half of the bills and I could always find a side job waiting tables or something. I'm just soooo tired of office culture and never fitting in. It's almost worse than high school.
I'm sorry you are going through this.  It is so tough.  I don't have it that bad (high school was worse, for sure!) but office politics and difficult people make work...wearying.

I had my own tribe of nerds and goths in highschool, I don't have that here. It's not that I'm an extremely weird antisocial person, but I am a woman, I'm a bit of a geek, I'm not into fashion, I'm not particularly nurturing, I'm into music and crafts and history books and stuff like that. I'm not into owning fancy stuff. Just your average mustachian I suppose :) It seems that so far I always end up in organisations dominated by older males who hire younger males who are just like them. There are plenty of other women in grad school with me but it's said they don't last long in this field, which is why they aren't hired, but I dunno, maybe there's a reason they all leave the field so quickly and it's not because women are difficult? ( I think you're an engineer if I remember correctly, I can imagine that's also a very male dominated field)

I'm really good at what I'm specializing in, but I'm not good in all aspects of my general job. Let's say I'm much better at designing high quality baskets than at fixing the looms for underwater basket weaving when they break. I'm trying really hard to becoming better at loom fixing, I watch youtube video's about it in my spare time, but trying to improve means I'm asking lots of questions to coworkers and I work slowly which they perceive as me being incompetent. And of course, I am not good at loom fixing, but hey, I'm not a loom mechanic, I never claimed to be, please let me design the fancy baskets that we can sell for $$$ because that's what I'm really good at. When I do get to design it's always a big success.

As a fellow outsider, let me tell you the hard truth: you will never change the company culture. Your boss will never change the company culture. The culture is a result of the attitudes of all the people that work there and all of the years of previous rules/regulations/acceptable practices. That's not going to change anytime soon. Don't waste your breath talking to your boss. Just leave. All you can do is walk away.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: SwordGuy on February 20, 2020, 08:10:51 PM
Quote
All in all, I will need to have a 1 on 1 talk with my boss when the future of the company is announced. And I need to discuss why I don't feel comfortable at work anymore, in a way that the boss will understand. I'm not sure it's even possible for me to change the company culture even if my boss would agree with me. I think there's a fair chance we'll either decide to part ways or my contract will not be renewed in October. I've not got a lot of liquid cash right now, but I could sell off investments if I had to. I have a side hustle that would  probably bring in just enough income for my half of the bills and I could always find a side job waiting tables or something. I'm just soooo tired of office culture and never fitting in. It's almost worse than high school.
I'm sorry you are going through this.  It is so tough.  I don't have it that bad (high school was worse, for sure!) but office politics and difficult people make work...wearying.

I had my own tribe of nerds and goths in highschool, I don't have that here. It's not that I'm an extremely weird antisocial person, but I am a woman, I'm a bit of a geek, I'm not into fashion, I'm not particularly nurturing, I'm into music and crafts and history books and stuff like that. I'm not into owning fancy stuff. Just your average mustachian I suppose :) It seems that so far I always end up in organisations dominated by older males who hire younger males who are just like them. There are plenty of other women in grad school with me but it's said they don't last long in this field, which is why they aren't hired, but I dunno, maybe there's a reason they all leave the field so quickly and it's not because women are difficult? ( I think you're an engineer if I remember correctly, I can imagine that's also a very male dominated field)

I'm really good at what I'm specializing in, but I'm not good in all aspects of my general job. Let's say I'm much better at designing high quality baskets than at fixing the looms for underwater basket weaving when they break. I'm trying really hard to becoming better at loom fixing, I watch youtube video's about it in my spare time, but trying to improve means I'm asking lots of questions to coworkers and I work slowly which they perceive as me being incompetent. And of course, I am not good at loom fixing, but hey, I'm not a loom mechanic, I never claimed to be, please let me design the fancy baskets that we can sell for $$$ because that's what I'm really good at. When I do get to design it's always a big success.

As a fellow outsider, let me tell you the hard truth: you will never change the company culture. Your boss will never change the company culture. The culture is a result of the attitudes of all the people that work there and all of the years of previous rules/regulations/acceptable practices. That's not going to change anytime soon. Don't waste your breath talking to your boss. Just leave. All you can do is walk away.

You can be like the lady who left Uber and blogged about what it was like there, with supporting documentation.

Here's the physical world equivalent, a Molotov cocktail.   It may or may not end up changing the entire culture but some folks can end up burned beyond all recognition:

Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: AnnaGrowsAMustache on February 21, 2020, 05:15:35 AM
Quote
All in all, I will need to have a 1 on 1 talk with my boss when the future of the company is announced. And I need to discuss why I don't feel comfortable at work anymore, in a way that the boss will understand. I'm not sure it's even possible for me to change the company culture even if my boss would agree with me. I think there's a fair chance we'll either decide to part ways or my contract will not be renewed in October. I've not got a lot of liquid cash right now, but I could sell off investments if I had to. I have a side hustle that would  probably bring in just enough income for my half of the bills and I could always find a side job waiting tables or something. I'm just soooo tired of office culture and never fitting in. It's almost worse than high school.
I'm sorry you are going through this.  It is so tough.  I don't have it that bad (high school was worse, for sure!) but office politics and difficult people make work...wearying.

I had my own tribe of nerds and goths in highschool, I don't have that here. It's not that I'm an extremely weird antisocial person, but I am a woman, I'm a bit of a geek, I'm not into fashion, I'm not particularly nurturing, I'm into music and crafts and history books and stuff like that. I'm not into owning fancy stuff. Just your average mustachian I suppose :) It seems that so far I always end up in organisations dominated by older males who hire younger males who are just like them. There are plenty of other women in grad school with me but it's said they don't last long in this field, which is why they aren't hired, but I dunno, maybe there's a reason they all leave the field so quickly and it's not because women are difficult? ( I think you're an engineer if I remember correctly, I can imagine that's also a very male dominated field)

I'm really good at what I'm specializing in, but I'm not good in all aspects of my general job. Let's say I'm much better at designing high quality baskets than at fixing the looms for underwater basket weaving when they break. I'm trying really hard to becoming better at loom fixing, I watch youtube video's about it in my spare time, but trying to improve means I'm asking lots of questions to coworkers and I work slowly which they perceive as me being incompetent. And of course, I am not good at loom fixing, but hey, I'm not a loom mechanic, I never claimed to be, please let me design the fancy baskets that we can sell for $$$ because that's what I'm really good at. When I do get to design it's always a big success.

As a fellow outsider, let me tell you the hard truth: you will never change the company culture. Your boss will never change the company culture. The culture is a result of the attitudes of all the people that work there and all of the years of previous rules/regulations/acceptable practices. That's not going to change anytime soon. Don't waste your breath talking to your boss. Just leave. All you can do is walk away.

You can be like the lady who left Uber and blogged about what it was like there, with supporting documentation.

Here's the physical world equivalent, a Molotov cocktail.   It may or may not end up changing the entire culture but some folks can end up burned beyond all recognition:

Still a giant waste of time, but now you've created enemies AND got yourself a rep as a whistleblower.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: SwordGuy on February 21, 2020, 06:04:05 AM
Quote
All in all, I will need to have a 1 on 1 talk with my boss when the future of the company is announced. And I need to discuss why I don't feel comfortable at work anymore, in a way that the boss will understand. I'm not sure it's even possible for me to change the company culture even if my boss would agree with me. I think there's a fair chance we'll either decide to part ways or my contract will not be renewed in October. I've not got a lot of liquid cash right now, but I could sell off investments if I had to. I have a side hustle that would  probably bring in just enough income for my half of the bills and I could always find a side job waiting tables or something. I'm just soooo tired of office culture and never fitting in. It's almost worse than high school.
I'm sorry you are going through this.  It is so tough.  I don't have it that bad (high school was worse, for sure!) but office politics and difficult people make work...wearying.

I had my own tribe of nerds and goths in highschool, I don't have that here. It's not that I'm an extremely weird antisocial person, but I am a woman, I'm a bit of a geek, I'm not into fashion, I'm not particularly nurturing, I'm into music and crafts and history books and stuff like that. I'm not into owning fancy stuff. Just your average mustachian I suppose :) It seems that so far I always end up in organisations dominated by older males who hire younger males who are just like them. There are plenty of other women in grad school with me but it's said they don't last long in this field, which is why they aren't hired, but I dunno, maybe there's a reason they all leave the field so quickly and it's not because women are difficult? ( I think you're an engineer if I remember correctly, I can imagine that's also a very male dominated field)

I'm really good at what I'm specializing in, but I'm not good in all aspects of my general job. Let's say I'm much better at designing high quality baskets than at fixing the looms for underwater basket weaving when they break. I'm trying really hard to becoming better at loom fixing, I watch youtube video's about it in my spare time, but trying to improve means I'm asking lots of questions to coworkers and I work slowly which they perceive as me being incompetent. And of course, I am not good at loom fixing, but hey, I'm not a loom mechanic, I never claimed to be, please let me design the fancy baskets that we can sell for $$$ because that's what I'm really good at. When I do get to design it's always a big success.

As a fellow outsider, let me tell you the hard truth: you will never change the company culture. Your boss will never change the company culture. The culture is a result of the attitudes of all the people that work there and all of the years of previous rules/regulations/acceptable practices. That's not going to change anytime soon. Don't waste your breath talking to your boss. Just leave. All you can do is walk away.

You can be like the lady who left Uber and blogged about what it was like there, with supporting documentation.

Here's the physical world equivalent, a Molotov cocktail.   It may or may not end up changing the entire culture but some folks can end up burned beyond all recognition:

Still a giant waste of time, but now you've created enemies AND got yourself a rep as a whistleblower.

That's a fair point, it can be a waste of time.   Then again, it can cause change, or at least punish the guilty.

There are more subtle ways if you've got *some* decent people to work with.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Hula Hoop on February 21, 2020, 06:04:34 AM
Still a giant waste of time, but now you've created enemies AND got yourself a rep as a whistleblower.

I agree.  Maybe if you're FIRE and really never need to work again or deal with people in your former field then this would be OK but otherwise, how exhausting.

You mention that women in your country almost always work part time.  So I assume that that means that women, specifically, are expected culturally to step back from work roles and do most housework and childcare - although I'm sure that there are some women and men who reject these cultural norms.  So it sounds like a country with old fashioned traditional views of gender roles.  Unfortunately, in this situation, changing the entire culture single handedly would be taking on a lot.  It might also be hard to change things from within such a culture. 

Could you find work with a foreign multinational from a country with less rigid gender norms and more powerful working women?  Even here in Italy, things aren't as rigid as you describe gender-wise.  I have kids and work full time  and I have a lot of female colleagues who are similar to me.  With women in powerful positions at my workplace ,  it's hard to stick to rigid gender stereotypes.  I'm sure some people think these things but they would never say them.  My husband picks the kids up every day at school and there are always tons of dads there. 
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Buffaloski Boris on February 21, 2020, 06:36:42 AM
Quote
All in all, I will need to have a 1 on 1 talk with my boss when the future of the company is announced. And I need to discuss why I don't feel comfortable at work anymore, in a way that the boss will understand. I'm not sure it's even possible for me to change the company culture even if my boss would agree with me. I think there's a fair chance we'll either decide to part ways or my contract will not be renewed in October. I've not got a lot of liquid cash right now, but I could sell off investments if I had to. I have a side hustle that would  probably bring in just enough income for my half of the bills and I could always find a side job waiting tables or something. I'm just soooo tired of office culture and never fitting in. It's almost worse than high school.
I'm sorry you are going through this.  It is so tough.  I don't have it that bad (high school was worse, for sure!) but office politics and difficult people make work...wearying.

I had my own tribe of nerds and goths in highschool, I don't have that here. It's not that I'm an extremely weird antisocial person, but I am a woman, I'm a bit of a geek, I'm not into fashion, I'm not particularly nurturing, I'm into music and crafts and history books and stuff like that. I'm not into owning fancy stuff. Just your average mustachian I suppose :) It seems that so far I always end up in organisations dominated by older males who hire younger males who are just like them. There are plenty of other women in grad school with me but it's said they don't last long in this field, which is why they aren't hired, but I dunno, maybe there's a reason they all leave the field so quickly and it's not because women are difficult? ( I think you're an engineer if I remember correctly, I can imagine that's also a very male dominated field)

I'm really good at what I'm specializing in, but I'm not good in all aspects of my general job. Let's say I'm much better at designing high quality baskets than at fixing the looms for underwater basket weaving when they break. I'm trying really hard to becoming better at loom fixing, I watch youtube video's about it in my spare time, but trying to improve means I'm asking lots of questions to coworkers and I work slowly which they perceive as me being incompetent. And of course, I am not good at loom fixing, but hey, I'm not a loom mechanic, I never claimed to be, please let me design the fancy baskets that we can sell for $$$ because that's what I'm really good at. When I do get to design it's always a big success.

As a fellow outsider, let me tell you the hard truth: you will never change the company culture. Your boss will never change the company culture. The culture is a result of the attitudes of all the people that work there and all of the years of previous rules/regulations/acceptable practices. That's not going to change anytime soon. Don't waste your breath talking to your boss. Just leave. All you can do is walk away.

You can be like the lady who left Uber and blogged about what it was like there, with supporting documentation.

Here's the physical world equivalent, a Molotov cocktail.   It may or may not end up changing the entire culture but some folks can end up burned beyond all recognition:

Still a giant waste of time, but now you've created enemies AND got yourself a rep as a whistleblower.

I’m sorry for the situation. To me this is WHY we want to have a union where we work and WHY FI. Most places aren’t unionized these days, so that leaves FI. I’ve seen a lot of speaking truth to power in the workplace issues over the years, and outside of situations where there is an institutional process that has your back (E.g. a competent union) , it doesn’t typically end well for the person who is acting as the lightning rod.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: BlueHouse on February 21, 2020, 07:37:50 AM
Quote
All in all, I will need to have a 1 on 1 talk with my boss when the future of the company is announced. And I need to discuss why I don't feel comfortable at work anymore, in a way that the boss will understand. I'm not sure it's even possible for me to change the company culture even if my boss would agree with me. I think there's a fair chance we'll either decide to part ways or my contract will not be renewed in October. I've not got a lot of liquid cash right now, but I could sell off investments if I had to. I have a side hustle that would  probably bring in just enough income for my half of the bills and I could always find a side job waiting tables or something. I'm just soooo tired of office culture and never fitting in. It's almost worse than high school.
I'm sorry you are going through this.  It is so tough.  I don't have it that bad (high school was worse, for sure!) but office politics and difficult people make work...wearying.

I had my own tribe of nerds and goths in highschool, I don't have that here. It's not that I'm an extremely weird antisocial person, but I am a woman, I'm a bit of a geek, I'm not into fashion, I'm not particularly nurturing, I'm into music and crafts and history books and stuff like that. I'm not into owning fancy stuff. Just your average mustachian I suppose :) It seems that so far I always end up in organisations dominated by older males who hire younger males who are just like them. There are plenty of other women in grad school with me but it's said they don't last long in this field, which is why they aren't hired, but I dunno, maybe there's a reason they all leave the field so quickly and it's not because women are difficult? ( I think you're an engineer if I remember correctly, I can imagine that's also a very male dominated field)

I'm really good at what I'm specializing in, but I'm not good in all aspects of my general job. Let's say I'm much better at designing high quality baskets than at fixing the looms for underwater basket weaving when they break. I'm trying really hard to becoming better at loom fixing, I watch youtube video's about it in my spare time, but trying to improve means I'm asking lots of questions to coworkers and I work slowly which they perceive as me being incompetent. And of course, I am not good at loom fixing, but hey, I'm not a loom mechanic, I never claimed to be, please let me design the fancy baskets that we can sell for $$$ because that's what I'm really good at. When I do get to design it's always a big success.

As a fellow outsider, let me tell you the hard truth: you will never change the company culture. Your boss will never change the company culture. The culture is a result of the attitudes of all the people that work there and all of the years of previous rules/regulations/acceptable practices. That's not going to change anytime soon. Don't waste your breath talking to your boss. Just leave. All you can do is walk away.
This comment about changing company culture reminded me of the first company I worked for after college.  It was pretty darn unethical -- lots of pressure on the sales team to "make quota" and lots of pressure on the executives to make their numbers for dividends for investors. This led to lying and cheating and lots of partying in between.  So much of the old boy network including golf trips and strip clubs and harassment of women.  If I hadn't seen it with my own eyes I would never believe when people tell me stories like this at their companies.  It actually was gross, but at the time, I just thought it was normal, and even fun. 
Anyway, after 4 years working there, the company kind of got caught in its lies and got acquired by another company that was more straightlaced.  As soon as the acquisition was finalized, the reorgs started.  We were all shocked by the people that were let go immediately. Mostly because we had all bought into how valuable these players were.  the RIFs kept coming until we finally realized they were going to let every single person who was an employee of the first company go.  And we realized that they had to do it because they couldn't know how far the poison had reached and how deep it was embedded.  We all just accepted this fate.   I was given an opportunity to move to another part of the country and work with their new sales team.  I fully understood that it was a transfer of my knowledge to their team and that I would be let go at the end of the contract term.  Within one year after the move, there were about 12 originals of us left, and we all got fired at the one year mark.   That was the only time I saw a company culture change.    It worked out okay for me because that one year doubled my salary and gave me a different type of job that shoved me out of what was viewed as women's work and into men's work.   
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: mtn on February 21, 2020, 07:39:20 AM


I don't think my coworkers would classify themselves as sexist, I mean, they're not saying stuff like "mothers should not work" like a real sexist. They just say they believe that children need their mother around 24/7 before they are of school age because otherwise they will not thrive, and this is the natural order of things. Which is just a longwinded BS way to say the same thing. (I'm totally fine with people choosing to be SAHP's, but please just say 'we have chosen for my partner to stay at home' instead of telling me what's natural and what's not).




Your italicized part and my bolded part of your paragraph are at odds with each other. They're saying the same thing, it is sexist, that makes them sexist, at least for this part of the job/life.

Incidentally, I once had that opinion and I once wanted my wife to stay home before our kids were school aged. I still would LIKE it, but as I've grown up I've learned it isn't always the best option. Funnily enough, our opinions have reversed on it. My wife once never would have considered it, but now we're doing everything we can so she can stay home with the kid(s). We wouldn't be able to take that step without FU money - we don't have much of it, but enough that my wife can stay home to take care of kiddo, at least for a couple of years.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: BicycleB on February 21, 2020, 09:31:04 AM
@Imma, I hope your situation is the beginning of a great FU story. It sounds like you're ripe for a change to a better job. The old job has unfixable problems. You have time and money to look for a new job. Further corporate pressures may accelerate the process, but the trend is there. Best wishes for finding a really good employer!!!

I sympathize about being good at one part of the job and not another. I've been through that and another friend is experiencing it now. Fwiw, a search focused on a job that meets your strengths and a culture that is less sexist may involve very few targets, but the focus might just weed out all the other bad employers too. I don't know if this will all proceed at a pace that feels comfortable, but I think there is a very very good option out there somewhere. I hope your thrift, savings and energy lead you to it.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Imma on February 21, 2020, 09:34:58 AM
Still a giant waste of time, but now you've created enemies AND got yourself a rep as a whistleblower.

I agree.  Maybe if you're FIRE and really never need to work again or deal with people in your former field then this would be OK but otherwise, how exhausting.

You mention that women in your country almost always work part time.  So I assume that that means that women, specifically, are expected culturally to step back from work roles and do most housework and childcare - although I'm sure that there are some women and men who reject these cultural norms.  So it sounds like a country with old fashioned traditional views of gender roles.  Unfortunately, in this situation, changing the entire culture single handedly would be taking on a lot.  It might also be hard to change things from within such a culture. 

Could you find work with a foreign multinational from a country with less rigid gender norms and more powerful working women?  Even here in Italy, things aren't as rigid as you describe gender-wise.  I have kids and work full time  and I have a lot of female colleagues who are similar to me.  With women in powerful positions at my workplace ,  it's hard to stick to rigid gender stereotypes.  I'm sure some people think these things but they would never say them.  My husband picks the kids up every day at school and there are always tons of dads there.
I actually already work for a foreign multinational! My company is from a European country that's conservative in other ways. In that country, women either work fulltime or stay at home. I'm not sure if that's much better. But women in leadership roles are still fairly rare, not just in my country but nationwide.  I have to say that in my country we are progressive about many other things, for example being gay isn't an issue and no one cares if you are religious. I know in many other countries this can still cause issues in the workplace.

For me, due to my health I'm not interested in working fulltime but I am interested in doing specialist work. I designed a new high end basket today and everyone was super happy with it. I think the expectation I will have kids soon and lose my ambition is one of the reasons they're hesitating to let me progress. There are lots more female loom fixers, this is seen as more as a 'woman's job'.

It's not always awful, today was a good day, but there used to be more good and less bad days.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: SwordGuy on February 21, 2020, 09:40:12 AM


I don't think my coworkers would classify themselves as sexist, I mean, they're not saying stuff like "mothers should not work" like a real sexist. They just say they believe that children need their mother around 24/7 before they are of school age because otherwise they will not thrive, and this is the natural order of things. Which is just a longwinded BS way to say the same thing. (I'm totally fine with people choosing to be SAHP's, but please just say 'we have chosen for my partner to stay at home' instead of telling me what's natural and what's not).




Your italicized part and my bolded part of your paragraph are at odds with each other. They're saying the same thing, it is sexist, that makes them sexist, at least for this part of the job/life.

Incidentally, I once had that opinion and I once wanted my wife to stay home before our kids were school aged. I still would LIKE it, but as I've grown up I've learned it isn't always the best option. Funnily enough, our opinions have reversed on it. My wife once never would have considered it, but now we're doing everything we can so she can stay home with the kid(s). We wouldn't be able to take that step without FU money - we don't have much of it, but enough that my wife can stay home to take care of kiddo, at least for a couple of years.

I pretty sure you missed the sarcasm in their post.      Granted there's no sarcasm font, but the italics were a clue. :)
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: mm1970 on February 21, 2020, 11:47:54 AM
Quote
All in all, I will need to have a 1 on 1 talk with my boss when the future of the company is announced. And I need to discuss why I don't feel comfortable at work anymore, in a way that the boss will understand. I'm not sure it's even possible for me to change the company culture even if my boss would agree with me. I think there's a fair chance we'll either decide to part ways or my contract will not be renewed in October. I've not got a lot of liquid cash right now, but I could sell off investments if I had to. I have a side hustle that would  probably bring in just enough income for my half of the bills and I could always find a side job waiting tables or something. I'm just soooo tired of office culture and never fitting in. It's almost worse than high school.
I'm sorry you are going through this.  It is so tough.  I don't have it that bad (high school was worse, for sure!) but office politics and difficult people make work...wearying.

I had my own tribe of nerds and goths in highschool, I don't have that here. It's not that I'm an extremely weird antisocial person, but I am a woman, I'm a bit of a geek, I'm not into fashion, I'm not particularly nurturing, I'm into music and crafts and history books and stuff like that. I'm not into owning fancy stuff. Just your average mustachian I suppose :) It seems that so far I always end up in organisations dominated by older males who hire younger males who are just like them. There are plenty of other women in grad school with me but it's said they don't last long in this field, which is why they aren't hired, but I dunno, maybe there's a reason they all leave the field so quickly and it's not because women are difficult? ( I think you're an engineer if I remember correctly, I can imagine that's also a very male dominated field)

I'm really good at what I'm specializing in, but I'm not good in all aspects of my general job. Let's say I'm much better at designing high quality baskets than at fixing the looms for underwater basket weaving when they break. I'm trying really hard to becoming better at loom fixing, I watch youtube video's about it in my spare time, but trying to improve means I'm asking lots of questions to coworkers and I work slowly which they perceive as me being incompetent. And of course, I am not good at loom fixing, but hey, I'm not a loom mechanic, I never claimed to be, please let me design the fancy baskets that we can sell for $$$ because that's what I'm really good at. When I do get to design it's always a big success.

As a fellow outsider, let me tell you the hard truth: you will never change the company culture. Your boss will never change the company culture. The culture is a result of the attitudes of all the people that work there and all of the years of previous rules/regulations/acceptable practices. That's not going to change anytime soon. Don't waste your breath talking to your boss. Just leave. All you can do is walk away.
This is mostly true.  However, I have seen quite a few shifts in my (smaller, startup) company culture.  As those of us who are here have aged, the culture has HAD to let up a bit - to allow people to be parents, recover from illness, or age gracefully.  The "culture" of a company of mostly 20-something men changes as those men become 40-something with wives and kids.

Likewise, while I'm not a huge fan of my husband's company culture (lot of old white men), in the last 10 years THEIR culture has shifted a bit.  When he started, I got REALLY tired of the attitudes I got from management "wait, you work full time?" (meaning he had to take on 1/2 the childcare and house duty).  Well, now they are 2x bigger, so 2x more people, a LOT more young people, and a LOT more women and parents from dual working couples.

I've also had middle managers get hired here who are very good at "managing up", so I have seen a few shifts in culture.

It's a slow, painful process however.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Hula Hoop on February 22, 2020, 03:42:28 AM


I don't think my coworkers would classify themselves as sexist, I mean, they're not saying stuff like "mothers should not work" like a real sexist. They just say they believe that children need their mother around 24/7 before they are of school age because otherwise they will not thrive, and this is the natural order of things. Which is just a longwinded BS way to say the same thing. (I'm totally fine with people choosing to be SAHP's, but please just say 'we have chosen for my partner to stay at home' instead of telling me what's natural and what's not).




Your italicized part and my bolded part of your paragraph are at odds with each other. They're saying the same thing, it is sexist, that makes them sexist, at least for this part of the job/life.

Incidentally, I once had that opinion and I once wanted my wife to stay home before our kids were school aged. I still would LIKE it, but as I've grown up I've learned it isn't always the best option. Funnily enough, our opinions have reversed on it. My wife once never would have considered it, but now we're doing everything we can so she can stay home with the kid(s). We wouldn't be able to take that step without FU money - we don't have much of it, but enough that my wife can stay home to take care of kiddo, at least for a couple of years.

IMO it's not sexist to believe that it's better for the kids if one parent stays home or works part time while children are young (so long as you don't impose those beliefs on others as Imma's managers seem to) but it is sexist to believe that that always has to be the mother of the children and not even consider the possibility of the dad staying home (or working part time) with the kids. 

My husband has contemplated stay at home fatherhood at various points, mainly because he's the lower earner by far, but so far has rejected it for various reasons.  We don't necessarily disclose our incomes to random people but it should be pretty obvious from the nature of our jobs that I'm the one who brings home most of the bacon yet I've still had various people (not Italians though) suggest that I should give up my career or work part time while our kids are small.  No one has ever suggested this to my DH (apart from me).  I find this rather puzzling.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Imma on February 22, 2020, 08:13:30 AM
My friend has a fulltime management position that she's really happy with and her husband has a fulltime physically demanding job that he's less passionate about. They have several young kids and of course it's a challenge to balance all of that. I don't think anyone has ever suggested he should go parttime or quit, but they keep asking her about it. I know he actually tried to go parttime but his boss refused.

I think everyone should make their own choices about raising their families, and I don't think one choice is inherently better than others. I have friends who thrive as stay at home parents, others feel better working, and some people don't have a choice and most find a way to make it work. I don't think women are programmed to always be good mothers and that men are not wired to be primary caregivers.

I don't care that much about coworkers' views, especially since I don't even have children, but from the statements they have made, it looks they hold the view that men are biologically programmed to be X and women to be Y. And I think it's likely that's colouring their view of me.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: markbike528CBX on February 22, 2020, 08:38:35 AM
My friend has a fulltime management position that she's really happy with and her husband has a fulltime physically demanding job that he's less passionate about. They have several young kids and of course it's a challenge to balance all of that. I don't think anyone has ever suggested he should go parttime or quit, but they keep asking her about it. I know he actually tried to go parttime but his boss refused.

I think everyone should make their own choices about raising their families, and I don't think one choice is inherently better than others. I have friends who thrive as stay at home parents, others feel better working, and some people don't have a choice and most find a way to make it work. I don't think women are programmed to always be good mothers and that men are not wired to be primary caregivers.

I don't care that much about coworkers' views, especially since I don't even have children, but from the statements they have made, it looks they hold the view that men are biologically programmed to be X and women to be Y. And I think it's likely that's colouring their view of me.
Men are biologically programmed to be XY and women are biologically programmed to be XX. (Gene humor, YMMV)
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: partgypsy on February 22, 2020, 08:44:32 AM
To your point @Threshkin - https://www.mrmoneymustache.com/2018/03/09/money-and-confidence-are-interchangeable/ (https://www.mrmoneymustache.com/2018/03/09/money-and-confidence-are-interchangeable/)

big dollar energy
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: partgypsy on February 22, 2020, 09:04:40 AM
And here is a positive job story. The first job (first real job out of grad school) when I got pregnant, turned into a hostile work situation, where I was harrassed both during pregnancy (she was very mad at me for getting pregnant) and after returning the friction point was my decision to breastfeed and hence needing to take an actual lunch break to pump... Before I gave birth the room that was reserved for pumping in my building (a hospital no less) was closed because it was basically condemmed. I let boss know I was going to pump in my office. She first didn't say anything, and then tried to get me in trouble to HR saying I pumped in my office without her permission. To avoid problems every day I walked halfway across campus to next closest location to pump. But then she complained I was away from my desk too long (before I would just eat at desk quickly)... she ended up firing me even though even she had to rate me as fully successful in my job performance. Very traumatic at the time (new mom needing a job, also had to walk away from 3 papers in progress) but a blessing in disguise because it was a toxic work situation.   

Fast forward 17? years later at my current job they actually created a pump room for new moms. People contributed things like artwork, comfortable chair, little table etc to make it niche. The majority of people in my department are women, including now the director (though the old director also created a great work environment for all employees). And the general culture has changed.

Anyways, one person generally cannot change a bad or toxic work environment, particularly if the toxicity comes from the top. From my own experience (though it is hard) not to be so tied to your job. If things are bad search out a better working environment, there are ones out there.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: RobertMa on February 23, 2020, 08:07:17 PM
Quote
Likewise, while I'm not a huge fan of my husband's company culture (lot of old white men),

I'm inspired by the freedom being attained. But I see no need for this race/gender/age stereotyping. Could someone point out to me what negative culture I am carrying around as an old white man?
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: AnnaGrowsAMustache on February 23, 2020, 08:45:51 PM
Quote
Likewise, while I'm not a huge fan of my husband's company culture (lot of old white men),

I'm inspired by the freedom being attained. But I see no need for this race/gender/age stereotyping. Could someone point out to me what negative culture I am carrying around as an old white man?

I think your comment here pretty much sums it up, frankly. As an old white man you might personally be quite liberal and inclusive. I'm going to go ahead and assume that you are. However, as an old white man, you have benefited from certain privileges that not old, and not white and not male people have not. That's not your fault, and of course you should take advantages of the opportunities you have had. The problem lies in not being able to recognise the privileges you have had that others haven't - and that's what your comment shows pretty clearly, imo. I think you need to understand what privilege is. Have a look at this wee comic:


https://www.boredpanda.com/privilege-explanation-comic-strip-on-a-plate-toby-morris/

Just to be perfectly clear, I'm not having a go at you personally. Just being an old white man does not make you a bad person or anything else! It's not your fault that we live in this system anymore than it is mine, but it is all of our responsibility to see the system for what it is.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: alienbogey on February 23, 2020, 11:02:34 PM
So I guess it was okay to use the race/gender/stereotyping ("old white men") because some were insufficiently aware of "privilege". 

Now that we have all been educated about "privilege", is it still okay to use race/gender/stereotyping?
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: AnnaGrowsAMustache on February 23, 2020, 11:32:24 PM
So I guess it was okay to use the race/gender/stereotyping ("old white men") because some were insufficiently aware of "privilege". 

Now that we have all been educated about "privilege", is it still okay to use race/gender/stereotyping?

I think you've missed the point. That's ok. Not everyone has to be on the same page.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Frugal Giant on February 24, 2020, 03:45:26 AM
Anna I think you missed the point, and that is okay…however I am going to tell you a story to show that things aren’t always what they seem.

My age, my gender, and my skin colour don’t say anything about the challenges I have faced.  I don’t think of myself as old, but I cannot claim to be young any more.  I am a white male who identifies more with the right hand side of that comic than the left.

My parents got divorced when I was 2 and I never even met my father until I was 14, and that didn’t turn out well in the end.  My mother raised me by herself and the entire time I was growing up we lived firmly below the poverty line, but her pride kept her from seeking financial assistance.  She worked long hours and many weekends to barely scrape by.

At the age of 18 I was kicked out of the house and had to fend for myself.  I dropped out of my last year of high school to work.  But my timing was poor, at the time there was governmental legislation mandating gender and colour diversity quotas in workplace hiring.  So a white male 16-21 high school dropout wasn’t a quota anyone needed to fill.  I took the only job I could get and lived in fear of losing that job.  I took night school classes to complete high school and applied to University as a mature student.  I got a better job where I could live on 20+ hours a week and took on massive debt to go to University.  But because I was working my loans didn’t cover my needs, and with no buffer I hit a cycle of working harder, missing classes and assignments, and eventually realizing I needed to drop out to make more money.

Without a degree and with lots of debt I worked hard and took any promotions I could.  I put in insane hours and tried to get above the debt.  Twice I got out, and twice my mother needed help and pushed me back down into debt.

Unknown to me I had suffered for 45 years with undiagnosed celiac disease.  The food I was eating was making my body attack itself.  My chronic pain increased, my health decreased, until it was severely impacting my life.

As an older white man the only privilege I ever experienced was being born and raised in a first world country.  Living under the poverty line for over half of my life in a first world country was still better than a significant portion of the populace in a third world country.

The other privileges I have had were finding MMM and marrying my wife 5 years ago.  Both MMM and my wife helped me turn my small nest egg into a budding stash.  Both allowed me to overcome the horrible relationship I had with money and to overcome the bad money lessons I picked up along my journey.

3 years ago when I was finally diagnosed with celiac disease I had the great privilege to quit my horrible job for a miserable company without a job to go to and spend the time getting used to a gluten free diet, getting my health back to “normal”, and taking a certificate course to retrain for a new career that, hopefully, won’t suck so much…and allow me to retire at 55…not early per se, but better than the average.

On the outside, when I retire early, it will look like I am just another old white man who hit freedom 55 from a position of privilege…and all my hard work and fighting will be interpreted as a shiny silver platter.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: alcon835 on February 24, 2020, 05:32:39 AM
While a great conversation around sexism, it's not the purpose of this thread. I recommend we pivot the sexism talk to a new thread and leave this one to the FU stories.

I love this thread, have followed it for years now. Would hate to see it spiral away from what it's been for so long.

Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Livingthedream55 on February 24, 2020, 07:50:09 AM
While a great conversation around sexism, it's not the purpose of this thread. I recommend we pivot the sexism talk to a new thread and leave this one to the FU stories.

I love this thread, have followed it for years now. Would hate to see it spiral away from what it's been for so long.

+1
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: mm1970 on February 24, 2020, 10:36:44 AM
Quote
Likewise, while I'm not a huge fan of my husband's company culture (lot of old white men),

I'm inspired by the freedom being attained. But I see no need for this race/gender/age stereotyping. Could someone point out to me what negative culture I am carrying around as an old white man?
You personally?  Maybe nothing.

However, the first few years of company picnics and holiday parties at his company?  Let me count the ways.

"How's the baby?"  Great.  "Must be hard."  Yes, especially with a full time job.  "YOU WORK FULL TIME??"  Yes.
"We need your husband to travel in April".  No.  "He needs to be dedicated to his job." Our son is having surgery, fuck off.
"What do you do all day?"  Engineering, same thing he does.  "What, WHY?  You have kids!"  And a mortgage, and by the way we didn't buy a house for $250k in the 1990s bud, they were $750k by the time we bought a house.

On travel: "I'm going to need you to stay through the weekend in case something goes wrong."  Husband: nope, I'm leaving tomorrow (Friday).  Can't stay, wife will kill me.  "I am going to talk to your BOSS, you need to be DEDICATED."  Husband: I've got 2 kids, one of whom is SIX WEEKS OLD.

It's simply the expectation that times are the way they were when these men started work.
- They had cheaper homes (California was easier back then).
- Their wives were at home, or still are, or work part time.
- They could do all the travel they wanted while the little woman held down the home front.
- No need to bother daddy with school holidays, sick kids, or doctor's appointments.

Are all men like this?  No.
Are a good 80% of the men in management at my husband's company like this?  Yes.  (Well, a couple have retired, but still it's a high percentage.) 

Only a small percentage of the men at my company are blatantly like this.  Most of the older men have children (but their wives didn't work) HOWEVER they've worked with working mothers before.

Most of the men at my company in their 30s and 40s take on equal child care duties - a few have even taken their FULL paid family leave, if you can imagine (6 weeks, state leave).
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: CowboyAndIndian on February 24, 2020, 10:38:56 AM
While a great conversation around sexism, it's not the purpose of this thread. I recommend we pivot the sexism talk to a new thread and leave this one to the FU stories.

I love this thread, have followed it for years now. Would hate to see it spiral away from what it's been for so long.

+1

+1

Can we please get back to the FU stories?
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: MrMoogle on February 24, 2020, 12:09:09 PM
Quote
Likewise, while I'm not a huge fan of my husband's company culture (lot of old white men),

I'm inspired by the freedom being attained. But I see no need for this race/gender/age stereotyping. Could someone point out to me what negative culture I am carrying around as an old white man?
I think if we add one word, everyone is happy and nothing is taken from the story: (lot of bigoted old white men)

bigot: a person who is intolerant toward those holding different opinions
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Zikoris on February 24, 2020, 12:32:23 PM
Quote
Likewise, while I'm not a huge fan of my husband's company culture (lot of old white men),

I'm inspired by the freedom being attained. But I see no need for this race/gender/age stereotyping. Could someone point out to me what negative culture I am carrying around as an old white man?
I think if we add one word, everyone is happy and nothing is taken from the story: (lot of bigoted old white men)

bigot: a person who is intolerant toward those holding different opinions

I'd rather take out the racism and sexism altogether and go with "lots of bigoted people", but maybe that's just me.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: alienbogey on February 24, 2020, 10:42:01 PM
So I guess it was okay to use the race/gender/stereotyping ("old white men") because some were insufficiently aware of "privilege". 

Now that we have all been educated about "privilege", is it still okay to use race/gender/stereotyping?

I think you've missed the point. That's ok. Not everyone has to be on the same page.

And I think you've missed the point.  That's ok, it makes us even.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: shelivesthedream on February 25, 2020, 02:15:03 AM
https://www.askamanager.org/2017/09/spectacular-resignation-stories-share-in-the-comments.html
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: AnnaGrowsAMustache on February 25, 2020, 04:11:19 AM
So I guess it was okay to use the race/gender/stereotyping ("old white men") because some were insufficiently aware of "privilege". 

Now that we have all been educated about "privilege", is it still okay to use race/gender/stereotyping?

I think you've missed the point. That's ok. Not everyone has to be on the same page.

And I think you've missed the point.  That's ok, it makes us even.

Haha, indeed it does
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Loren Ver on February 25, 2020, 07:26:19 AM
https://www.askamanager.org/2017/09/spectacular-resignation-stories-share-in-the-comments.html

HA! 
When I left my company to FIRE, I gave my (remote) boss 6 weeks notice so he could start the rather long hiring process.  I didn't want to leave my team in a lurch.  He didn't tell anyone for weeks, including HR.  I finally asked him if I should tell HR (and the team), and he was like oh yeah, let me get on that.  So with less than two weeks left, things got rolling.  I finally broke down and told the team unofficially since things were getting awkward with scheduling.  Not my problem.  Easier if I don't have to train the new person :).

I think my former boss is just waiting until retirement.  He seems so done.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: SwordGuy on February 25, 2020, 08:47:45 AM
https://www.askamanager.org/2017/09/spectacular-resignation-stories-share-in-the-comments.html

HA! 
When I left my company to FIRE, I gave my (remote) boss 6 weeks notice so he could start the rather long hiring process.  I didn't want to leave my team in a lurch.  He didn't tell anyone for weeks, including HR.  I finally asked him if I should tell HR (and the team), and he was like oh yeah, let me get on that.  So with less than two weeks left, things got rolling.  I finally broke down and told the team unofficially since things were getting awkward with scheduling.  Not my problem.  Easier if I don't have to train the new person :).

I think my former boss is just waiting until retirement.  He seems so done.

Yeah, I gave 7 months notice, plus found a qualified candidate, and they still goofed off and screwed up getting a replacement. 
AND were surprised to discover the date I was leaving even after making me re-submit my resignation message 4 times so it would meet their standards.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Plina on February 25, 2020, 09:56:15 AM
https://www.askamanager.org/2017/09/spectacular-resignation-stories-share-in-the-comments.html

HA! 
When I left my company to FIRE, I gave my (remote) boss 6 weeks notice so he could start the rather long hiring process.  I didn't want to leave my team in a lurch.  He didn't tell anyone for weeks, including HR.  I finally asked him if I should tell HR (and the team), and he was like oh yeah, let me get on that.  So with less than two weeks left, things got rolling.  I finally broke down and told the team unofficially since things were getting awkward with scheduling.  Not my problem.  Easier if I don't have to train the new person :).

I think my former boss is just waiting until retirement.  He seems so done.

Yeah, I gave 7 months notice, plus found a qualified candidate, and they still goofed off and screwed up getting a replacement. 
AND were surprised to discover the date I was leaving even after making me re-submit my resignation message 4 times so it would meet their standards.

When I took a sabbatical I told my boss about 8 months in advance and he thought it was anto tight schedule to find a replacement and asked me to postpone it so they would have about a year to find a replacement. I refused and when I went on a sabbatical they had still not found a replacement.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Much Fishing to Do on February 25, 2020, 02:45:19 PM
https://www.askamanager.org/2017/09/spectacular-resignation-stories-share-in-the-comments.html

HA! 
When I left my company to FIRE, I gave my (remote) boss 6 weeks notice so he could start the rather long hiring process.  I didn't want to leave my team in a lurch.  He didn't tell anyone for weeks, including HR.  I finally asked him if I should tell HR (and the team), and he was like oh yeah, let me get on that.  So with less than two weeks left, things got rolling.  I finally broke down and told the team unofficially since things were getting awkward with scheduling.  Not my problem.  Easier if I don't have to train the new person :).

I think my former boss is just waiting until retirement.  He seems so done.

Yeah, I gave 7 months notice, plus found a qualified candidate, and they still goofed off and screwed up getting a replacement. 
AND were surprised to discover the date I was leaving even after making me re-submit my resignation message 4 times so it would meet their standards.

Wow, crazy.  I wonder, if you had never submitted a proper resignation would the punishment for that have been termination or making you stay?
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: SwordGuy on February 25, 2020, 05:02:08 PM
https://www.askamanager.org/2017/09/spectacular-resignation-stories-share-in-the-comments.html

HA! 
When I left my company to FIRE, I gave my (remote) boss 6 weeks notice so he could start the rather long hiring process.  I didn't want to leave my team in a lurch.  He didn't tell anyone for weeks, including HR.  I finally asked him if I should tell HR (and the team), and he was like oh yeah, let me get on that.  So with less than two weeks left, things got rolling.  I finally broke down and told the team unofficially since things were getting awkward with scheduling.  Not my problem.  Easier if I don't have to train the new person :).

I think my former boss is just waiting until retirement.  He seems so done.

Yeah, I gave 7 months notice, plus found a qualified candidate, and they still goofed off and screwed up getting a replacement. 
AND were surprised to discover the date I was leaving even after making me re-submit my resignation message 4 times so it would meet their standards.

Wow, crazy.  I wonder, if you had never submitted a proper resignation would the punishment for that have been termination or making you stay?

I thought it was funny so I went along with it -- but resignation letters #2 thru #4 were written on company time as it was being done at company direction.  :)

Had I not found it amusing and a source for a good story I would have simply refused.    Worst they could have done was fire me -- which would open them to a labor lawsuit, make them look stupid to the client, screw over the client, and let me FIRE half a year earlier.   That would have been fine by me, I was just delaying it so I didn't fire before my wife's school year was over.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: AMandM on February 25, 2020, 06:39:19 PM
AND were surprised to discover the date I was leaving even after making me re-submit my resignation message 4 times so it would meet their standards.

If ever you wondered whether retiring was the right move, I guess this settled the question!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Body Surfer on February 29, 2020, 10:42:10 AM
More of a MM $ principles story than an FU story.

I am/was a physician in private practice for over twenty years but getting very tired of dealing with health insurance companies. Decided to take some time off. I went back to school to enter another profession for the short term. Living well below our means and saving $- classic MM style: This enabled me to do these changes.

DW became very stressed at her work and began having health problems. She was able to quit and is now feeling much better.

I will retire in late May.

We have an AA that allows me to sleep at night. Just following the great advice learned here. It works and we have benefited.

Thank you MM community.




Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: RWTL on February 29, 2020, 11:50:19 AM
More of a MM $ principles story than an FU story.

I am/was a physician in private practice for over twenty years but getting very tired of dealing with health insurance companies. Decided to take some time off. I went back to school to enter another profession for the short term. Living well below our means and saving $- classic MM style: This enabled me to do these changes.

DW became very stressed at her work and began having health problems. She was able to quit and is now feeling much better.

I will retire in late May.

We have an AA that allows me to sleep at night. Just following the great advice learned here. It works and we have benefited.

Thank you MM community.

That’s awesome.  Congrats
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: alcon835 on March 01, 2020, 08:03:59 AM
More of a MM $ principles story than an FU story.

I am/was a physician in private practice for over twenty years but getting very tired of dealing with health insurance companies. Decided to take some time off. I went back to school to enter another profession for the short term. Living well below our means and saving $- classic MM style: This enabled me to do these changes.

DW became very stressed at her work and began having health problems. She was able to quit and is now feeling much better.

I will retire in late May.

We have an AA that allows me to sleep at night. Just following the great advice learned here. It works and we have benefited.

Thank you MM community.

That is fantastic! You changed careers, let your wife quit her job, feel good about your work, and are about to FIRE! Keep doing what you're doing!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Zamboni on March 02, 2020, 05:15:33 PM
lol at Chris Matthews quitting on the air to kick off his last Hardball tonight:

"After Matthews’ on-air announcement, Hardball went on commercial break.

When it came back, it was Steve Kornacki Iooking surprised. After some laudatory remarks about Matthews, Kornacki said they’ll have to fill this hour then it went on immediate commercial break." -Ahmed Baba
 
Guess he has his FU money!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Chris Pascale on March 02, 2020, 05:52:43 PM
lol at Chris Matthews quitting on the air to kick off his last Hardball tonight:

"After Matthews’ on-air announcement, Hardball went on commercial break.

When it came back, it was Steve Kornacki Iooking surprised. After some laudatory remarks about Matthews, Kornacki said they’ll have to fill this hour then it went on immediate commercial break." -Ahmed Baba
 
Guess he has his FU money!

The story I read about this left me a little confused. Granted, it was on Yahoo! which is not known for high quality.

Was he like Bill O'Reilly, or like the guy from public radio who patted someone on the back?
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: tipster350 on March 03, 2020, 06:13:20 AM
Chris Matthews, if you're reading here, come and tell your FU story! We're waiting for you!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: dcheesi on March 03, 2020, 06:39:14 AM
lol at Chris Matthews quitting on the air to kick off his last Hardball tonight:

"After Matthews’ on-air announcement, Hardball went on commercial break.

When it came back, it was Steve Kornacki Iooking surprised. After some laudatory remarks about Matthews, Kornacki said they’ll have to fill this hour then it went on immediate commercial break." -Ahmed Baba
 
Guess he has his FU money!

The story I read about this left me a little confused. Granted, it was on Yahoo! which is not known for high quality.

Was he like Bill O'Reilly, or like the guy from public radio who patted someone on the back?
Sounds like mostly verbal stuff; a series of public gaffes, combined with accusations of inappropriate "flirting" behind the scenes.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: AlanStache on March 03, 2020, 10:49:08 AM
...
Was he like Bill O'Reilly, or like the guy from public radio who patted someone on the back?

The speed and thoroughness of Garrison Keillor's removal makes me suspect he had a reputation behind the scenes and that he probably should have been dealt with years ago.  Or maybe he wanted to retire and this was a convent way for everyone to get out of a contract. 
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Kris on March 03, 2020, 11:03:22 AM
...
Was he like Bill O'Reilly, or like the guy from public radio who patted someone on the back?

The speed and thoroughness of Garrison Keillor's removal makes me suspect he had a reputation behind the scenes and that he probably should have been dealt with years ago.  Or maybe he wanted to retire and this was a convent way for everyone to get out of a contract.

I think the former is likely. But definitely not the latter.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: iris lily on March 04, 2020, 06:50:45 AM
...
Was he like Bill O'Reilly, or like the guy from public radio who patted someone on the back?

The speed and thoroughness of Garrison Keillor's removal makes me suspect he had a reputation behind the scenes and that he probably should have been dealt with years ago.  Or maybe he wanted to retire and this was a convent way for everyone to get out of a contract.

He was an old white guy whose schtick was tired a decade before he left.

The first time he retired he should have stayed that way. Honestly, the geezer factor at NPR was noticeably lightened upon his departure.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: BlueHouse on March 04, 2020, 08:13:25 AM
lol at Chris Matthews quitting on the air to kick off his last Hardball tonight:

"After Matthews’ on-air announcement, Hardball went on commercial break.

When it came back, it was Steve Kornacki Iooking surprised. After some laudatory remarks about Matthews, Kornacki said they’ll have to fill this hour then it went on immediate commercial break." -Ahmed Baba
 
Guess he has his FU money!

The story I read about this left me a little confused. Granted, it was on Yahoo! which is not known for high quality.

Was he like Bill O'Reilly, or like the guy from public radio who patted someone on the back?
Sounds like mostly verbal stuff; a series of public gaffes, combined with accusations of inappropriate "flirting" behind the scenes.
I think your comments sounds a bit dismissive with a lack of understanding of how years and years of inappropriate ANYTHING can just drain the lifeforce out of a human being.  Women are subjected to it constantly from birth and are taught a series of behaviors to minimize, excuse, downplay, and ignore -- just to stay safe. 

I won't judge what happened in this situation because I don't know.  But I also won't say "oh, it was JUST verbal". 

Look, I get it.  Some women gave back as good as they got.  But why WHY does anyone think any of that belongs in the workplace?  I HAVE NEVER SEEN FLIRTING IN ANY JOB DESCRIPTION.  have you?
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: dcheesi on March 04, 2020, 08:20:08 AM
lol at Chris Matthews quitting on the air to kick off his last Hardball tonight:

"After Matthews’ on-air announcement, Hardball went on commercial break.

When it came back, it was Steve Kornacki Iooking surprised. After some laudatory remarks about Matthews, Kornacki said they’ll have to fill this hour then it went on immediate commercial break." -Ahmed Baba
 
Guess he has his FU money!

The story I read about this left me a little confused. Granted, it was on Yahoo! which is not known for high quality.

Was he like Bill O'Reilly, or like the guy from public radio who patted someone on the back?
Sounds like mostly verbal stuff; a series of public gaffes, combined with accusations of inappropriate "flirting" behind the scenes.
I think your comments sounds a bit dismissive with a lack of understanding of how years and years of inappropriate ANYTHING can just drain the lifeforce out of a human being.  Women are subjected to it constantly from birth and are taught a series of behaviors to minimize, excuse, downplay, and ignore -- just to stay safe. 

I won't judge what happened in this situation because I don't know.  But I also won't say "oh, it was JUST verbal". 

Look, I get it.  Some women gave back as good as they got.  But why WHY does anyone think any of that belongs in the workplace?  I HAVE NEVER SEEN FLIRTING IN ANY JOB DESCRIPTION.  have you?
Point taken. Also the information I had read up to that point may have underplayed the extent of it. Having read additional information since then, it seems that it was more of a pervasive pattern of behavior on his part.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Trudie on March 04, 2020, 10:23:25 PM
Looking back at the day I quit, it all feels rather epic now.  I had already planned to quit days before ever walking in the room.  Disgusted with lots of shenanigans, toxic culture, a fuckwit (term coined by ExFlyBoy) for a boss who didn’t give two shits about his employees, a rapid turnover in all areas of the company, I’d had enough.  In the same conversation in which said “fuckwit” explained he wanted to send me to some sort of management training, I basically said without much fanfare that I was leaving.  The hypocrisy of someone who doesn’t do annual performance reviews, routinely has little tantrums, and is an absentee boss really took the cake.  He totally lost his shit.  “I’m going to need that in writing!” he bellowed.

I was taken aback in the moment, but him losing his shit was such a tell.  And I felt like a boss when I returned a minute later with my already prepared letter.  It was obvious that for me it wasn’t a knee jerk thing.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: DadJokes on March 05, 2020, 06:13:58 AM
Looking back at the day I quit, it all feels rather epic now.  I had already planned to quit days before ever walking in the room.  Disgusted with lots of shenanigans, toxic culture, a fuckwit (term coined by ExFlyBoy) for a boss who didn’t give two shits about his employees, a rapid turnover in all areas of the company, I’d had enough.  In the same conversation in which said “fuckwit” explained he wanted to send me to some sort of management training, I basically said without much fanfare that I was leaving.  The hypocrisy of someone who doesn’t do annual performance reviews, routinely has little tantrums, and is an absentee boss really took the cake.  He totally lost his shit.  “I’m going to need that in writing!” he bellowed.

I was taken aback in the moment, but him losing his shit was such a tell.  And I felt like a boss when I returned a minute later with my already prepared letter.  It was obvious that for me it wasn’t a knee jerk thing.

That's great.

I've always wondered: why do employers require a formal resignation letter? What are the consequences if you don't provide one? And if they do ask for one, what's to stop someone from spending the next couple days working on it instead of doing it on their own time?
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: SwordGuy on March 05, 2020, 06:28:13 AM
Looking back at the day I quit, it all feels rather epic now.  I had already planned to quit days before ever walking in the room.  Disgusted with lots of shenanigans, toxic culture, a fuckwit (term coined by ExFlyBoy) for a boss who didn’t give two shits about his employees, a rapid turnover in all areas of the company, I’d had enough.  In the same conversation in which said “fuckwit” explained he wanted to send me to some sort of management training, I basically said without much fanfare that I was leaving.  The hypocrisy of someone who doesn’t do annual performance reviews, routinely has little tantrums, and is an absentee boss really took the cake.  He totally lost his shit.  “I’m going to need that in writing!” he bellowed.

I was taken aback in the moment, but him losing his shit was such a tell.  And I felt like a boss when I returned a minute later with my already prepared letter.  It was obvious that for me it wasn’t a knee jerk thing.

That's great.

I've always wondered: why do employers require a formal resignation letter? What are the consequences if you don't provide one? And if they do ask for one, what's to stop someone from spending the next couple days working on it instead of doing it on their own time?
In some jurisdictions the employee still has the job so it can't be filled until some time has passed (when the employee doesn't show up and is legally considered to have abandoned the job).   A formal resignation letter acts as proof the employee doesn't want the job anymore.   Plus, they can't claim they were fired without cause or laid off and claim unemployment.   Well, actually, they can claim it, but the employer will be off the hook due to the letter.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: techwiz on March 05, 2020, 06:35:16 AM

That's great.

I've always wondered: why do employers require a formal resignation letter? What are the consequences if you don't provide one? And if they do ask for one, what's to stop someone from spending the next couple days working on it instead of doing it on their own time?

I assume most employers need it as legal proof you have resigned your position.

Thinking back I remember an employee once just not show up for work. During the first week everyone was worried he was really sick or something. Nobody could reach him, finally his boss was able to reach him and he basically said he did feel like working anymore, but refused to put anything in writing. It took HR another couple of weeks to figure out what to do and ended up having to file some type of "job abandonment termination" paperwork. I always thought it was sad and wondered why anyone would do that, but maybe it was his "Epic FU"!   
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: SwordGuy on March 05, 2020, 06:44:56 AM

That's great.

I've always wondered: why do employers require a formal resignation letter? What are the consequences if you don't provide one? And if they do ask for one, what's to stop someone from spending the next couple days working on it instead of doing it on their own time?

I assume most employers need it as legal proof you have resigned your position.

Thinking back I remember an employee once just not show up for work. During the first week everyone was worried he was really sick or something. Nobody could reach him, finally his boss was able to reach him and he basically said he did feel like working anymore, but refused to put anything in writing. It took HR another couple of weeks to figure out what to do and ended up having to file some type of "job abandonment termination" paperwork. I always thought it was sad and wondered why anyone would do that, but maybe it was his "Epic FU"!   
Had a guy pack up his stuff and write "GONE!!!" on a post-it he put on his office door.    No one was sure whether he had to leave for the day or he had quit.

After 3 days he was considered to have abandoned his job.

After the next payday he showed back up and wanted to come to work.  Nope.   Apparently he had forgotten about needing a paycheck.

Now comes the really, really funny part.

He and his project manager had been fighting over project stuff.   I was brand new and didn't know either of them and didn't work with them.   But it was really obvious they hated each other.   Project manager locked the guy out of the project database.  Guy was the database administrator.   Guy sent project manager an email telling said manager how bad a job he was doing and BCC (Blind-copied) everyone in the office.   That was in my first week at this company.   Project manager threatened to turn in company to government for fraud, waste and abuse.    I found that a bit odd because he was the project manager and the one responsible for telling people on the project what to do...    Project manager leaves a few months later.

Then comes the big recession.   Jobs are scarce.   Both lose their jobs and go to work on a defense contract in a 2 man shack in Iraq for 6 months.  The exact same 2 man shack.

Karma is a bitch.

Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: mm1970 on March 05, 2020, 01:50:22 PM
Quote
Then comes the big recession.   Jobs are scarce.   Both lose their jobs and go to work on a defense contract in a 2 man shack in Iraq for 6 months.  The exact same 2 man shack.

Karma is a bitch.

ah ha haha
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: talltexan on March 11, 2020, 01:46:00 PM
I imagine that when auditors look at the financial transactions of a company, and they ask, "Why isn't this guy getting paid?" it's good to have a piece of paper to show them.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: CindyBS on March 11, 2020, 02:50:19 PM
Not so much an FU, because I actually really like my boss and my company - but this is more an unexpected opportunity just arose that I could not even try without my FU money.

I work for a very small company that provides things for large, mostly outdoor, events (think stages and the like).  We are in a temperate climate, so it has been our slow season for months.  We just had 80% of our business for March and early April cancelled due to Covid-19.  Slow season + cancellations with nothing to replace it and no idea when we are going to recover = huge financial crunch.

I am seriously considering walking into my boss's office tomorrow and offering to be laid off for 3-4 weeks in exchange for non-monetary compensation going forward.  Something like 1 week off every month of the slow season (4 extra weeks of vacation).  I can certainly make up any work I would miss and our company is so small and labor is the biggest cost - losing my pay as a bill for the next 4 weeks will really help.

I'll get paid half my pay for 4 weeks but in exchange get 8 weeks off - the 4 weeks I'm laid off and the 4 extra weeks vacation in the the slow season of 2020-2021.  Seems like a good deal.  I can easily do the rest of my work in the slow season in 3 weeks/month and without our work for March, there won't be much work for me to do in the next 4 weeks anyway. 

This kind of begs the question why doesn't he just lay me off without the deal.  Honestly, he would be afraid I would find another job so he is not going to do lay-off unless he absolutely has no other choice.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: AlanStache on March 11, 2020, 05:11:37 PM
Not so much an FU, because I actually really like my boss and my company - but this is more an unexpected opportunity just arose that I could not even try without my FU money.

I work for a very small company that provides things for large, mostly outdoor, events (think stages and the like).  We are in a temperate climate, so it has been our slow season for months.  We just had 80% of our business for March and early April cancelled due to Covid-19.  Slow season + cancellations with nothing to replace it and no idea when we are going to recover = huge financial crunch.

I am seriously considering walking into my boss's office tomorrow and offering to be laid off for 3-4 weeks in exchange for non-monetary compensation going forward.  Something like 1 week off every month of the slow season (4 extra weeks of vacation).  I can certainly make up any work I would miss and our company is so small and labor is the biggest cost - losing my pay as a bill for the next 4 weeks will really help.

I'll get paid half my pay for 4 weeks but in exchange get 8 weeks off - the 4 weeks I'm laid off and the 4 extra weeks vacation in the the slow season of 2020-2021.  Seems like a good deal.  I can easily do the rest of my work in the slow season in 3 weeks/month and without our work for March, there won't be much work for me to do in the next 4 weeks anyway. 

This kind of begs the question why doesn't he just lay me off without the deal.  Honestly, he would be afraid I would find another job so he is not going to do lay-off unless he absolutely has no other choice.

Dont care more about your bosses company than it cares about you.  You want the free time now - cool; just remember if you dropped dead you would be replaced (at some point).
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: CindyBS on March 11, 2020, 05:34:55 PM
Not so much an FU, because I actually really like my boss and my company - but this is more an unexpected opportunity just arose that I could not even try without my FU money.

I work for a very small company that provides things for large, mostly outdoor, events (think stages and the like).  We are in a temperate climate, so it has been our slow season for months.  We just had 80% of our business for March and early April cancelled due to Covid-19.  Slow season + cancellations with nothing to replace it and no idea when we are going to recover = huge financial crunch.

I am seriously considering walking into my boss's office tomorrow and offering to be laid off for 3-4 weeks in exchange for non-monetary compensation going forward.  Something like 1 week off every month of the slow season (4 extra weeks of vacation).  I can certainly make up any work I would miss and our company is so small and labor is the biggest cost - losing my pay as a bill for the next 4 weeks will really help.

I'll get paid half my pay for 4 weeks but in exchange get 8 weeks off - the 4 weeks I'm laid off and the 4 extra weeks vacation in the the slow season of 2020-2021.  Seems like a good deal.  I can easily do the rest of my work in the slow season in 3 weeks/month and without our work for March, there won't be much work for me to do in the next 4 weeks anyway. 

This kind of begs the question why doesn't he just lay me off without the deal.  Honestly, he would be afraid I would find another job so he is not going to do lay-off unless he absolutely has no other choice.

Dont care more about your bosses company than it cares about you.  You want the free time now - cool; just remember if you dropped dead you would be replaced (at some point).

In a regular job I would agree - however, I was friends with my boss for 10+ years before he hired me (he's the business owner) and gave me a job at really rough time in my life when I really needed it.  He is also super cool and gives me a very flexible schedule. 
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: BicycleB on March 11, 2020, 10:29:09 PM
@CindyBS, I like your plan to offer the layoff for vacation time. Good luck.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Moonwaves on March 12, 2020, 01:07:27 AM
Sounds like a plan @CindyBS - but I would just be careful about couching it in terms of a layoff. Say something like alternative or flexible working hours arrangement. I think that's what you're talking about but wanted to mention it just in case. Just make sure to pay attention to potential implications for any benefits you might get through your job (pension, social security, health insurance and so on). Good luck with it.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Imma on March 12, 2020, 02:56:12 AM
Sounds like a plan @CindyBS - but I would just be careful about couching it in terms of a layoff. Say something like alternative or flexible working hours arrangement. I think that's what you're talking about but wanted to mention it just in case. Just make sure to pay attention to potential implications for any benefits you might get through your job (pension, social security, health insurance and so on). Good luck with it.

Yes, I think I would frame it as unpaid leave or something, rather than a tenporary layoff.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Dicey on March 12, 2020, 07:59:19 AM
A friend of mine voluntarily did this during the last recession. She just had her boss move her to the bottom of the schedule until the work resumed. She was available on call if needed, but otherwise didn't turn up for work. When the economy recovered, she jumped right back in at the top of the list. She still works there. Her boss adores her and never forgets that she helped keep the boat afloat.

Just to clarify - You're not planning on filing for unemployment benefits, correct?
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Alternatepriorities on March 12, 2020, 11:15:38 AM
I am seriously considering walking into my boss's office tomorrow and offering to be laid off for 3-4 weeks in exchange for non-monetary compensation going forward.  Something like 1 week off every month of the slow season (4 extra weeks of vacation).  I can certainly make up any work I would miss and our company is so small and labor is the biggest cost - losing my pay as a bill for the next 4 weeks will really help.

I did something very similar at a small business 8 years ago. We called it an "Unpaid leave of absence" so that they did not have to pay increased unemployment insurance and I did not have a gap on my employment record. Totally worth it.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: talltexan on March 16, 2020, 07:07:11 AM
A friend of mine voluntarily did this during the last recession. She just had her boss move her to the bottom of the schedule until the work resumed. She was available on call if needed, but otherwise didn't turn up for work. When the economy recovered, she jumped right back in at the top of the list. She still works there. Her boss adores her and never forgets that she helped keep the boat afloat.

Just to clarify - You're not planning on filing for unemployment benefits, correct?

Good friend of mine bargained himself down to 2 days/week in 2010 as an alternative to being laid off. He stayed at that level until 2018, when he hung it up to become a SAH dad to 3 (and later 4) kids.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: ctuser1 on March 16, 2020, 07:46:28 AM
Not much of a FU story (I’ve been *very* fortunate to have very good organizations as my employers).

Episode 1 (a consulting company, think MBB, Big 4 etc).
I didn’t get some bonus I thought I was verbally promised. So I rage quit!!
Of course, I was in my 20s. In hindsight, that was a stupid decision. But it worked out. My boss called me 2 months later, and brought me back at a higher salary.

Episode 2 (at the end of a short stint at a tech company)
I told my boss I’ll quit. He was upset that I was going to leave without finishing the project I owned. So I negotiated with my new place that I’ll join 3 months later. They were a little pissed, but okay.
So I wrap up my project at the old place and leave. My old boss does not show up at my farewell drinks on Friday. I show up at my old place over the weekend to see through a critical release - technically after I’m no longer an employee. Old boss is still pissed. He tells me “it’s unprofessional on your part to not tell me beforehand if you are not being given sufficiently interesting or challenging projects”.

But the real fun begins after this. Old boss, for whatever reason, fails to notify HR that I left. So my paychecks keep coming. You should have seen the consternation at the HR, and the panic in my old boss’ voice when he called me. I was a little pissed at him, but didn’t cause any drama in refunding the extra paycheck.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Free Spirit on March 19, 2020, 01:27:23 PM
Not sure if it counts as epic but here's my FU Money - Coronavirus Edition:

Yesterday - get the call that work is shutting down for two weeks due to possible exposure to the virus. Coworker works a day job for another company and half their staff is sick and someone is presumed positive, even the owner of that company is seriously ill. My work issues a statement on social media saying per advice from the state health department they are shutting down for at least a week. (By the way, they were treating it as NBD a week ago)

Today, I get a call from the big man in charge, " Great news! We are far more removed than we initially thought! The other owner tested negative and we don't even know if the friend of a friend of a friend is even positive, so we'll keep you posted on what we decide in the next few days. By the way, are you itching to get back to it?"

I laugh internally and give a resounding "NOPE! Due to the nature of our work, the age of our customers, and the proximity to other people, I'm afraid for my own well being as well as others and will continue to self quarantine just to be safe. I have a lot of older relatives and I want to do the right thing."

I work in a restaurant and I'm on the lower end of the pay scale so I'm probably the person you picture as having no plan in place, paycheck to paycheck, and having a mini crisis through all this. Thanks to MMM and this forum, my emergency fund is big enough to weather this storm for a good year and probably then some. They can shove it if they think I'm going to work right now.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Alternatepriorities on March 19, 2020, 01:32:17 PM
I work in a restaurant and I'm on the lower end of the pay scale so I'm probably the person you picture as having no plan in place, paycheck to paycheck, and having a mini crisis through all this. Thanks to MMM and this forum, my emergency fund is big enough to weather this storm for a good year and probably then some. They can shove it if they think I'm going to work right now.

Yup, that makes it epic. The journey to FI starts to pay big dividends long before you are completely free.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: BicycleB on March 19, 2020, 02:41:01 PM
Well done, @Free Spirit!!!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Warlord1986 on March 19, 2020, 10:47:23 PM
Niiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiice!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Fi(re) on the Farm on March 22, 2020, 04:32:30 PM
I work in a restaurant and I'm on the lower end of the pay scale so I'm probably the person you picture as having no plan in place, paycheck to paycheck, and having a mini crisis through all this. Thanks to MMM and this forum, my emergency fund is big enough to weather this storm for a good year and probably then some. They can shove it if they think I'm going to work right now.

Free Spirit, I'm am so happy for you. Back in the days when I was single, raising 2 kids and dead broke this would have killed me. We just found out that my husband is loosing his job in a month because of Covid-19 but that just gives him more time to finish off my honey-do list.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: talltexan on March 31, 2020, 05:19:37 PM
Indeed, being able to approach every decision from the perspective of "does this increase my health risk by too much for the benefit it gives?" rather than from the financial perspective is a great benefit of having accumulated an ample 'stache.

Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: achvfi on April 01, 2020, 08:07:21 AM
My friend is a nurse and is in her 50-60s. At her age she is at high risk if she gets infected with COVID-19. She works at a hospital and was not allowed to use enough protective equipment due to potential shortages in future. She quit right away!

They did a great job financially and are going to be just fine.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: GreenSheep on April 01, 2020, 01:38:50 PM
My friend is a nurse and is in her 50-60s. At her age she is at high risk if she gets infected with COVID-19. She works at a hospital and was not allowed to use enough protective equipment due to potential shortages in future. She quit right away!

They did a great job financially and are going to be just fine.

YES!!! I've been waiting to hear a story like this! Patients will only be worse off in the long run if the people trying to care for them aren't well protected. Hospitals are not the caring, loving places their billboards would like you to believe. They are cold, hard businesses that happen to employ (usually) good, caring people.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: ducky19 on April 01, 2020, 01:45:55 PM
My FIL is a nurse by trade, but also a real estate whiz on the side (at one point had ~25 rentals, but has pared it back to 5-6 now that he's in his mid 70's). Yesterday we received a statewide emergency text asking for all medical professionals to sign up to volunteer. My wife immediately called him to tell him off if he was considering it, but he said, "nope, they couldn't pay me enough right now to do that". This from the man who would work an off shift for the bonuses, because... "$50/hour!". Glad he's got enough sense to stay far away from this tragedy. He's long since not needed the money and he's definitely in a high risk age group.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Alternatepriorities on April 01, 2020, 01:48:38 PM
My friend is a nurse and is in her 50-60s. At her age she is at high risk if she gets infected with COVID-19. She works at a hospital and was not allowed to use enough protective equipment due to potential shortages in future. She quit right away!

They did a great job financially and are going to be just fine.

I have a 65 year old Aunt who is a delivery nurse. Her hospital tried to tell her she they didn't have enough masks for her to wear one in the delivery room... She said she would bring her own... They said she couldn't do that, so she told them to fire her if they wanted to but she wasn't going to work without one. So far they've backed down.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: zolotiyeruki on April 01, 2020, 07:43:58 PM
My FIL is a nurse by trade, but also a real estate whiz on the side (at one point had ~25 rentals, but has pared it back to 5-6 now that he's in his mid 70's). Yesterday we received a statewide emergency text asking for all medical professionals to sign up to volunteer. My wife immediately called him to tell him off if he was considering it, but he said, "nope, they couldn't pay me enough right now to do that". This from the man who would work an off shift for the bonuses, because... "$50/hour!". Glad he's got enough sense to stay far away from this tragedy. He's long since not needed the money and he's definitely in a high risk age group.
Let me guess--he's in Illinois?  I got that "emergency alert" yesterday, and it annoyed the heck out of me.  As far as I can tell, they sent it to every single cell phone in the state.  That sort of thing is for imminent, impending doom-type scenarios.  Tornado warnings, flash flood warnings perhaps.  But not "hey, we need your help!"  Yeesh.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Dicey on April 01, 2020, 11:33:43 PM
This is a tangent: Hospitals are not accepting homemade PPE. But on the local listserves, medical personnel are pleading for anything they can get and people are making masks for them like crazy. I think the hospitals are worried about liability should a homemade mask prove ineffective. WTF?
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: YHD on April 02, 2020, 10:02:20 AM
@Dicey--also public perception.  If all the hospital workers are masked, the patients start to think that they also need to be masked (YES, they do).  And that the hospital is a germy place (YES, it is).  Patient demand for masks will stress the hospital's supply.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Dicey on April 02, 2020, 11:04:57 AM
@Dicey--also public perception.  If all the hospital workers are masked, the patients start to think that they also need to be masked (YES, they do).  And that the hospital is a germy place (YES, it is).  Patient demand for masks will stress the hospital's supply.
In January, I had to get a TB test for a hospital-related volunteer gig. The intake for the blood draw was through Urgent Care. There were a lot of sick people there. When I got sick in mid-March with what may or may not have been CV, I was determined not to seek medical care unless or until I experienced shortness of breath. Fortunately, that didn't happen. I haven't set foot in a public space in 17 days, but if I absolutely have to, you bet I'll be wearing a mask, even if I have to make it myself.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Alternatepriorities on April 02, 2020, 12:23:24 PM
This is a tangent: Hospitals are not accepting homemade PPE. But on the local listserves, medical personnel are pleading for anything they can get and people are making masks for them like crazy. I think the hospitals are worried about liability should a homemade mask prove ineffective. WTF?

Hooray for CYA safety! I believe this kind of bogus safety thinking is one of the reasons that this has turned into such a mess. No one wants to take any risk of making the wrong decision on less they can pass that risk off on someone else.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: dandarc on April 20, 2020, 11:05:52 AM
I've got a "stick it to the man" one pending - hoping they come around on "you need to take a pay cut so the company will be more profitable", but I doubt it. Seriously - they didn't even try to frame it in terms of the emergency. I guess I appreciate the honesty.

Regardless, we've actually increased our charitable giving by 4-5 times since the outbreak started. We're up to $500 per week, plus the prior $600 per month now. All to local charities, via our church, which has a long-established tradition of "sharing the plate' with various charities. In light of the pandemic, rather than splitting these donations, we're just aggregating and forwarding on to the selected charity each week, so this has made it very easy for us to donate much more. We're going to continue doing this as long as we can.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: solon on April 20, 2020, 12:27:51 PM
I've got a "stick it to the man" one pending - hoping they come around on "you need to take a pay cut so the company will be more profitable", but I doubt it. Seriously - they didn't even try to frame it in terms of the emergency. I guess I appreciate the honesty.

Regardless, we've actually increased our charitable giving by 4-5 times since the outbreak started. We're up to $500 per week, plus the prior $600 per month now. All to local charities, via our church, which has a long-established tradition of "sharing the plate' with various charities. In light of the pandemic, rather than splitting these donations, we're just aggregating and forwarding on to the selected charity each week, so this has made it very easy for us to donate much more. We're going to continue doing this as long as we can.

+1

I have found that outrageous generosity is easier than I expected, and way more satisfying. Good on ya!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: dandarc on May 01, 2020, 10:41:20 AM
Hinted at a brewing one earlier. Today, a payment was past due. Not unusual - in the past I email "hey this is past due now", they respond "oops - will be in your account tomorrow." And then the payment is in my account the next day. Today though the answer is "all 1099 payments have to be approved by executive team, so I'll try to get you an estimate on when".

So I'm not working any more until at the very least there is an estimate for when I will be paid. Having 2 months of unpaid work at what appears to be significant risk of non-payment is more than enough for me.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Alternatepriorities on May 01, 2020, 11:02:26 AM
Hinted at a brewing one earlier. Today, a payment was past due. Not unusual - in the past I email "hey this is past due now", they respond "oops - will be in your account tomorrow." And then the payment is in my account the next day. Today though the answer is "all 1099 payments have to be approved by executive team, so I'll try to get you an estimate on when".

So I'm not working any more until at the very least there is an estimate for when I will be paid. Having 2 months of unpaid work at what appears to be significant risk of non-payment is more than enough for me.

Good call. It was before this Covid mess, but I had a client get later and later with payments. I'd know and worked with them for 14 years at that point so I was pretty accommodating. They had always paid eventually. On the last project they promised payment "as soon as we collect from our client"... Well, they never hired the EE staff the project required and eventually their customer pulled the project without payment. I got left with 400+ hours of unpaid invoices. Never again.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: dandarc on May 01, 2020, 11:16:58 AM
@Alternatepriorities - will be interesting to see how long this lasts. The longer it is, the more my rate goes up for them. And the probability of demanding a retainer.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Alternatepriorities on May 01, 2020, 01:41:05 PM
@Alternatepriorities - will be interesting to see how long this lasts. The longer it is, the more my rate goes up for them. And the probability of demanding a retainer.

Yeah, I typically offer a discount for projects I'll enjoy and to companies I like working for. I haven't raised my rate in five years for my first client because I invoice on Monday and am paid on Friday without fail. They also never question my hours and last year they invited my wife and I to their company Christmas party. I'd much rather work with clients like them. Having FU money gives me the option to take a little less money and tell PITA clients to bugger off.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Madalope on May 05, 2020, 10:08:04 PM
Hi All,  new here.  I noticed this thread dates back to 2014, but I thought it was interesting enough that I would share my story.

I have worked in the Information Tech field for over 24 years in varying capacities.  If anyone is familiar with it, you know most positions pay pretty well but there is stress that goes along with the position.  I am 52 now and back in October 2019 I had been growing increasingly stressed by the constant changes Management and ownership of the company was having on my personal life.  Bi Weekly meetings on performance.  Constant micro management to such an extent that I was told I left 1 minute early and was not a team player?  Even though I had freely started my shift 30 minutes early daily of which didn't seem to show dedication.  Add to that that my boss was 20 years my junior without essential management / people skills.  I worked with a group of people who didn't pull their weight and I felt more of the higher level work was thrust upon me, then to cap it off, they changed the way I could organize my schedule so that I was not in control of my day to day workload.   I had mentally told myself that I wanted to quit.   I had saved and invested over a 25 year plan.  Made the right decisions, paid off my home, no car loans, no debt except insurance and utilities.  It occurred to me I could easily resign and take some mental time to do nothing which I haven't experienced since I was a teenager.  I longed to read, listen to music, experience more quality time without the dark cloud of deadlines, a work problem unsolved which lingered in my mind all the time.  I even went to the point of writing my resignation letter but by the next day, I would have a cup of coffee, then put the fantasy away.   One day in a meeting, my performance was again being questioned and I just mentally decided right there and then, it's time.  I stood up to my boss and said, "I am sorry, but I am resigning now".  I walked out of the office, then back to my desk, packed up my laptop and most of the things I had and quickly said goodbye to my co-workers nearby and walked out.  My boss ran out and talked to me asking if this is truly what I wanted to do, and I said it wasn't personal, but I was deeply unhappy.   
If you are not happy with the day to day, and not feeling proud on your drive home and mentally ok without thinking about work after your day is over, you will be weighed down.  Having saved and invested for years with cash reserves that I could live on, I always kept that in the back of my mind that I can use it.  If you can make the change for well being, do it.  It may open other avenues for you.  I am still on a long sabbatical for 7 months now and I still do not want part of a day job at present.  I honestly do not know if I want to go back anytime soon.  That's my story.  Best
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: markbike528CBX on May 05, 2020, 10:50:34 PM
Madalope, nice first post.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: RWTL on May 06, 2020, 04:00:40 AM
Madalope, nice first post.

Agree.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: dandarc on May 06, 2020, 07:38:32 AM
+1. Hope to read more from @Madalope.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Aegishjalmur on May 06, 2020, 07:52:59 AM
Awesome Madalope. I just wish you had a camera to record the look on your bosses face when you did that.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: mm1970 on May 06, 2020, 12:26:50 PM
That is an awesome story!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: achvfi on May 06, 2020, 01:23:46 PM
@Madalope, Inspiring story. Congrats on strength of your position.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: foghorn on May 06, 2020, 01:24:07 PM
Great story - and inspiring.  Well done.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Psychstache on May 06, 2020, 01:58:19 PM
Awesome Madalope. I just wish you had a camera to record the look on your bosses face when you did that.


Don't worry, I found the footage of his last day on the internet:


(https://i.pinimg.com/originals/a6/ed/1e/a6ed1edcdfb8fed5b552b2afb172a3ec.jpg)
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: desk_jockey on May 06, 2020, 05:09:41 PM
"I am sorry, but I am resigning now".  I walked out of the office, ... , and I said it wasn't personal, but I was deeply unhappy.   

Stories like this are why I keep coming back to this thread.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: alcon835 on May 06, 2020, 07:34:41 PM
*Slow Clap*

Well done. Very well done!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: BlueHouse on May 08, 2020, 01:36:46 PM

 On the last project they promised payment "as soon as we collect from our client"... Well, they never hired the EE staff the project required and eventually their customer pulled the project without payment. I got left with 400+ hours of unpaid invoices. Never again.

I've had a few companies I work with write this language into my contract.  I immediately take out a pen and cross it out.  My work for them is not dependent upon their relationship with anybody else.  I wish more people understood that contracts are simply agreements between two parties and that both of those parties have equal standing and equal ability to change any part of a written contract.  It feels so good to do it too, especially when the contracts admin on the other side is relatively young and doesn't know that it's allowed. They're shocked that I would have the audacity to cross out their printed form!  Ha!   I feel as if I'm teaching them a valuable life lesson by seeing this in action. 
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: markbike528CBX on May 08, 2020, 03:21:01 PM

 On the last project they promised payment "as soon as we collect from our client"... Well, they never hired the EE staff the project required and eventually their customer pulled the project without payment. I got left with 400+ hours of unpaid invoices. Never again.

I've had a few companies I work with write this language into my contract.  I immediately take out a pen and cross it out.  My work for them is not dependent upon their relationship with anybody else.  I wish more people understood that contracts are simply agreements between two parties and that both of those parties have equal standing and equal ability to change any part of a written contract.  It feels so good to do it too, especially when the contracts admin on the other side is relatively young and doesn't know that it's allowed. They're shocked that I would have the audacity to cross out their printed form!  Ha!   I feel as if I'm teaching them a valuable life lesson by seeing this in action.
I’d pay to see the video of the admin as they “but..but...but.. sputter.... “

I once had to tell a young guy that I was NOT going to take a picture of every sample as it was placed in the instrument (20 samples, each measured 5 times) .  “But my boss says so”, answer: he is not MY boss :-)   There also was a cultural divide , kid was Japanese, I was old, cranky American.  I told him if his boss wanted it that bad, HE should do it. He did the first night, then tailed off.  My camera was a 12Mpixel, 4MB/pic macro lens.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Alternatepriorities on May 11, 2020, 11:38:20 AM

 On the last project they promised payment "as soon as we collect from our client"... Well, they never hired the EE staff the project required and eventually their customer pulled the project without payment. I got left with 400+ hours of unpaid invoices. Never again.

I've had a few companies I work with write this language into my contract.  I immediately take out a pen and cross it out.  My work for them is not dependent upon their relationship with anybody else.  I wish more people understood that contracts are simply agreements between two parties and that both of those parties have equal standing and equal ability to change any part of a written contract.  It feels so good to do it too, especially when the contracts admin on the other side is relatively young and doesn't know that it's allowed. They're shocked that I would have the audacity to cross out their printed form!  Ha!   I feel as if I'm teaching them a valuable life lesson by seeing this in action.

They were very much in breach of contract. I knew there was a risk of things going down the way they did, but tried to keep the project alive for their customer's sake as well as the friends I had who worked for the client, but didn't have any control over company spending... I learned some very valuable lessons about top heave business models and having the management of an engineering firm skew heavily from one discipline while trying to manage three. I've certainly wasted 400 hours for less cause in my life.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Ethel on May 28, 2020, 06:15:04 PM
Ugh... is it an Epic FU story if you really, really don't want it to happen? Because I might have one in my near future.

I really like my employer. Great boss, great colleagues, fun job, good money. Even the higher-ups are genuinely decent people.

But...

We went through a much needed restructuring earlier this year. Two bloated departments (relics from the company's start-up days) were split into a dozen. But my work unit, which is of comparable size to the newly formed departments, has been in limbo these past five months.

And now there's talk of splitting us up and dividing us among the other departments. It makes no sense. We provide a specialized service (think IT maintenance, except it isn't because I don't want to give too many identifying details). We need a team to balance workload and train younglings junior employees. We each have our area of expertise within our specialization. We work well together.

Problem is we're the newest work unit in the company (though already three years old). And my boss who formed it always got quite a bit of pushback, mainly from one manager for reasons I don't get, even though the numbers and client feedback prove that we're essential to project success.

Honestly, this unit was the reason I joined the company in the first place. If it's dissolved, I don't want to remain here. I don't want to be a random department's pet IT gal. But among all the places I've worked at, this is (was?) hands down the best. If only they stopped being stubborn goobers.

I was honest with my boss today and said that if our team was dissolved, I wouldn't stay - not as an ultimatum, but so that she isn't blindsided if/when I quit. She's been struggling to keep us together and I hate to lay more pressure on her, but yeah...I'm quite discouraged by how this is going.

I have a couple years worth of expenses saved and I'm confident that I'd be able to land a job fairly quickly. But I would hate to leave.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: markbike528CBX on May 28, 2020, 09:43:55 PM
...I really like my employer. Great boss, great colleagues, fun job, good money. Even the higher-ups are genuinely decent people.

But...

Honestly, this unit was the reason I joined the company in the first place. If it's dissolved, I don't want to remain here.

I was honest with my boss today and said that if our team was dissolved, I wouldn't stay - not as an ultimatum, but so that she isn't blindsided if/when I quit. She's been struggling to keep us together and I hate to lay more pressure on her, but yeah...I'm quite discouraged by how this is going.
.......
If you haven't already, try to spin this to the boss as backing her play to keep the team together.
She can say, if you split the team up, the former parts of the team won't be there to pick up the pieces.

I'm reasonably confident that a boss I had played this card.  SemiBigCorp HQ Question : How many of the 15 very core people would move to SemiBigCorp HQ?  Boss answer:  maybe one :-)
SemiBigCorp HQ: well we guess you can stay at current location.

Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: engineerjourney on May 29, 2020, 08:06:20 AM
Not necessarily a full FU story since my management is actually awesome and didnt push back at this BUT I am now using 2-3 hours of PTO every week (which pretty much uses up my monthly accrual) to deal with being a two full time working parent household while not having childcare for two kids under 5.  It will put me on some list the director keeps of 40.0s (people that dont give free OT to the company) but I don't give a shit because I have enough money I can go on an unpaid leave of absence if they want to push me!  Based on my supervisor and manager I dont see this getting to the FU point but I am able to make this decision without the fear of repercussions that others might have because of my FU money.  FU money for the win!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: achvfi on May 29, 2020, 09:29:10 AM
Not necessarily a full FU story since my management is actually awesome and didnt push back at this BUT I am now using 2-3 hours of PTO every week (which pretty much uses up my monthly accrual) to deal with being a two full time working parent household while not having childcare for two kids under 5.  It will put me on some list the director keeps of 40.0s (people that dont give free OT to the company) but I don't give a shit because I have enough money I can go on an unpaid leave of absence if they want to push me!  Based on my supervisor and manager I dont see this getting to the FU point but I am able to make this decision without the fear of repercussions that others might have because of my FU money.  FU money for the win!

That's fantastic! Cheers to FU money.

I am in similar situation. For last couple of years, I am using up most of paid time off I have available. Vacations, sick time, volunteer time so on. This year I also have parental leave. Together with this additional time off I am working only 3 days a week.

4 days a week, I am available to help with kids and spend time together. Our family is loving it.

If a benefit is provided to me I am going to use it. I see many people barely use their time off, set up imaginary hurdles afraid of consequences. FU money helps not giving shit.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Uturn on May 29, 2020, 11:35:52 AM
It will put me on some list the director keeps of 40.0s (people that dont give free OT to the company)

When I signed on with the company, they agreed to pay me $x/yr for 40hr/week.  If they want 40+, they can pay me $x+.  But it really should be a bit of give and take.  If there is an emergency, I will work extra.  Then when I need to go to the doc or some other errand, I expect to not have to use PTO.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: FireLane on May 29, 2020, 03:39:54 PM
It will put me on some list the director keeps of 40.0s (people that dont give free OT to the company) but I don't give a shit because I have enough money I can go on an unpaid leave of absence if they want to push me!

Your company penalizes people for using the benefits they earned and not working more than the hours they agreed to work? I'd tell them to screw themselves and be out of there pronto!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: saguaro on May 29, 2020, 04:43:02 PM
If a benefit is provided to me I am going to use it. I see many people barely use their time off, set up imaginary hurdles afraid of consequences. FU money helps not giving shit.

When I was at the Big Company there were tons of people who would not use their time off to the point they would lose the time and this was when the vacation time was allowed to accrue up to a couple of years and they still lost it.  One time I mentioned I was going on vacation and coworker said "Really?  That's not the Big Company way"  and my response was "Big Company gives me these benefits and I am going to use them".   Big Company's benefits were generous and no way was I not using them.

Incidentally I never had a problem requesting vacation time, I always gave sufficient notice and worked around any really busy times which worked for me as well as for them.  I didn't have the FU money at first but Big Company's paychecks paved the way to stash that FU money that enabled me to jump the Big Company ship years later.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: mm1970 on May 29, 2020, 04:50:25 PM
It will put me on some list the director keeps of 40.0s (people that dont give free OT to the company)

When I signed on with the company, they agreed to pay me $x/yr for 40hr/week.  If they want 40+, they can pay me $x+.  But it really should be a bit of give and take.  If there is an emergency, I will work extra.  Then when I need to go to the doc or some other errand, I expect to not have to use PTO.
Yup
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Dicey on May 29, 2020, 04:56:34 PM
My last pre-FIRE company was based in the fine state of Georgia. They tried to institute a use-it-or-lose-it vacation policy. I noped the fuck out on them, pointing out that I was their person in CA, and in CA, that's not legal, and they had to follow CA rules for CA employees. I made a lot of new CA friends when the company finally wised up. Later, one of these friends was let go after many years of excellent performance. I think his downfall was that he made his job look too easy, he was that good. During the severance negotiations, he said, "And of course, you will be paying me all of my back vacation pay..." "What?" they cried. Yup, in CA, the onus is on the employer to keep track of all vacation monies owed. We were part of a company that had been purchased and absorbed by the current parent company. Nobody kept any records back then. If you took time off, you just told your boss and arranged for someone to cover you. There were no official records. My friend got quite a nice severance package in the end. Serves those fuckers right.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: AnnaGrowsAMustache on May 30, 2020, 11:14:14 AM
If a benefit is provided to me I am going to use it. I see many people barely use their time off, set up imaginary hurdles afraid of consequences. FU money helps not giving shit.

When I was at the Big Company there were tons of people who would not use their time off to the point they would lose the time and this was when the vacation time was allowed to accrue up to a couple of years and they still lost it.  One time I mentioned I was going on vacation and coworker said "Really?  That's not the Big Company way"  and my response was "Big Company gives me these benefits and I am going to use them".   Big Company's benefits were generous and no way was I not using them.

Incidentally I never had a problem requesting vacation time, I always gave sufficient notice and worked around any really busy times which worked for me as well as for them.  I didn't have the FU money at first but Big Company's paychecks paved the way to stash that FU money that enabled me to jump the Big Company ship years later.

Pfft to the Big Company way. Any Big Company that has an official "Way" is to be avoided at all costs.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Buffaloski Boris on May 30, 2020, 12:36:59 PM
If a benefit is provided to me I am going to use it. I see many people barely use their time off, set up imaginary hurdles afraid of consequences. FU money helps not giving shit.

When I was at the Big Company there were tons of people who would not use their time off to the point they would lose the time and this was when the vacation time was allowed to accrue up to a couple of years and they still lost it.  One time I mentioned I was going on vacation and coworker said "Really?  That's not the Big Company way"  and my response was "Big Company gives me these benefits and I am going to use them".   Big Company's benefits were generous and no way was I not using them.

Incidentally I never had a problem requesting vacation time, I always gave sufficient notice and worked around any really busy times which worked for me as well as for them.  I didn't have the FU money at first but Big Company's paychecks paved the way to stash that FU money that enabled me to jump the Big Company ship years later.

Pfft to the Big Company way. Any Big Company that has an official "Way" is to be avoided at all costs.

And they deserve a union to deal with as a bonus.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Plina on May 30, 2020, 12:45:09 PM
If a benefit is provided to me I am going to use it. I see many people barely use their time off, set up imaginary hurdles afraid of consequences. FU money helps not giving shit.

When I was at the Big Company there were tons of people who would not use their time off to the point they would lose the time and this was when the vacation time was allowed to accrue up to a couple of years and they still lost it.  One time I mentioned I was going on vacation and coworker said "Really?  That's not the Big Company way"  and my response was "Big Company gives me these benefits and I am going to use them".   Big Company's benefits were generous and no way was I not using them.

Incidentally I never had a problem requesting vacation time, I always gave sufficient notice and worked around any really busy times which worked for me as well as for them.  I didn't have the FU money at first but Big Company's paychecks paved the way to stash that FU money that enabled me to jump the Big Company ship years later.

Here you get a talk with your manager if you haven't set your vacation time wishes before a specific date. My manager asked if I didn't want to have vacation because I had not set the dates for the summer. I had just been postponing as I don't know how the travel restrictions will be for the summer.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: partgypsy on May 31, 2020, 07:23:08 AM
Been enjoying all these stories. It's interesting to hear the covid related stories. My little brother works as installer. His company didn't shut down though seems dubious that they were essential. He took a month off with annual leave and unpaid leave but his management was really putting pressure for him to come back so he's working since end of April/beginning of may. There have been individual jobs where he has shown up, multiple people working in an enclosed place, masks around their neck and he calls the client and let's them know the install will need to be rescheduled. They are not happy, but it seems if clients and bosses don't care about unsafe situations the employee needs to speak up.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: partgypsy on May 31, 2020, 07:52:34 AM
I had 2 f you situations in my life. One where I was just out of college doing an interesting demanding job and it was a great learning opportunity. Being one of two people running clinical trials for a drs office.  At one point I flew down to be trained and kick off (one of main studies I was coordinating was being expanded to multiple sites,to meet the entire team). I also helped design the data collection forms and be a resource for the rest of the team. Anyways the company vp that was sponsoring the study lets me and new hires know that they are paying our Drs offices x (11 k more than I was getting) for our salary, or to relieve us of any other duties (only supposed to do that study) and if not getting that money, let him personally know. I didn't care about getting full amount (it seemed like so much money!), and I was still happy to help the office in other duties but thought I could use it to negotiate a raise. When I return from trip the manager puts me off, says can't talk about compensation except at annual time (6 months from then) so I wait. Before the annual performance reviews there's a general meeting explaining bc of Medicare changes they will not be bringing in as much and everyone should not expect any raise this year. I go into meeting, he says the same thing, bla bla and I say this doesn't apply to me because company a is funding my salary. And what they told us. And I say what would be fair is a 4k raise and Im ok continuing my other duties as well (because I knew I could handle the workload). And the middle-aged manager blows up "that's bullshit! I don't know what you heard but you heard wrong".  And says 5% raise, take it or leave it. Anyways I was flabbergasted that he called me a liar to my face. So I sat on it a week, and met with him and said "I thought about your offer and I'm going to leave it." And then he was upset (his face turned pale). Anyways in my one week notice time I get a personal call from the VP of the company asking me to stay, offering more than I asked for. At that point though I had made up my mind to leave. Other issue they wanted me to agree to stay on for the duration of the trial (2-3 years) and I knew I was applying to grad school the following year and couldn't do that.  I did hear from the grapevine that the manager got in trouble because that's when the company realized they were pocketing the money. I don't feel bad at all because he handled the situation terribly.  I'm actually a pretty risk averse person. But it was the principle of the thing.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Ethel on May 31, 2020, 01:55:12 PM
...I really like my employer. Great boss, great colleagues, fun job, good money. Even the higher-ups are genuinely decent people.

But...

Honestly, this unit was the reason I joined the company in the first place. If it's dissolved, I don't want to remain here.

I was honest with my boss today and said that if our team was dissolved, I wouldn't stay - not as an ultimatum, but so that she isn't blindsided if/when I quit. She's been struggling to keep us together and I hate to lay more pressure on her, but yeah...I'm quite discouraged by how this is going.
.......
If you haven't already, try to spin this to the boss as backing her play to keep the team together.
She can say, if you split the team up, the former parts of the team won't be there to pick up the pieces.

I'm reasonably confident that a boss I had played this card.  SemiBigCorp HQ Question : How many of the 15 very core people would move to SemiBigCorp HQ?  Boss answer:  maybe one :-)
SemiBigCorp HQ: well we guess you can stay at current location.

My boss plays the politics game much better than I so I'm sure she'll use this as ammunition when the time comes. I've been her semi-official second-in-command since I started here and have the most technical experience. The rest of our team are mostly junior employees, so me leaving would be unpleasant for the company. I don't think they'd make us a department just to keep me, but it might tip the scales a little.

I don't know if the others would leave. The juniors would likely stay because all in all, this is a better company than most for someone fresh out of college. Dissolving the team would be pretty much a demotion for the rest of us.

It's nice to know that I don't have to swallow that indignity even if I'd be sad about quitting.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: mm1970 on June 01, 2020, 11:00:24 AM
My last pre-FIRE company was based in the fine state of Georgia. They tried to institute a use-it-or-lose-it vacation policy. I noped the fuck out on them, pointing out that I was their person in CA, and in CA, that's not legal, and they had to follow CA rules for CA employees. I made a lot of new CA friends when the company finally wised up. Later, one of these friends was let go after many years of excellent performance. I think his downfall was that he made his job look too easy, he was that good. During the severance negotiations, he said, "And of course, you will be paying me all of my back vacation pay..." "What?" they cried. Yup, in CA, the onus is on the employer to keep track of all vacation monies owed. We were part of a company that had been purchased and absorbed by the current parent company. Nobody kept any records back then. If you took time off, you just told your boss and arranged for someone to cover you. There were no official records. My friend got quite a nice severance package in the end. Serves those fuckers right.
This sounds familiar.  Long ago and far away, my CA company was acquired by a company in NC.  The NC company had a use-it-or-lose-it policy.  Our HR informed them of CA law.

So, they couldn't do that with us.  Eventually, they adjusted the vacation policy a few times.  They allowed people in NC to "carry over" 40 hours (basically, otherwise everyone was taking vacation in June before the July FY start).  They instituted a "cap" on everyone, where you would not accrue more hours.  I never got close to that cap.

Sometimes, I liken various company cultures to an abusive boyfriend or marriage.  They make you thing that there is something wrong with you, but you are afraid to leave.  My group at that company was fine, actually.  I trained my boss early on with my policy of "I will work extra when needed, but I will not do it just because.  And, if I end up working overtime for 3 weeks straight and need time off, I WILL NOT take vacation.  This is a 2 way street buddy."

Note, this was not the norm in the other part of the company.  They were hard core.  My best friend would tell me about how she'd be putting in 100+ hours in 2 weeks, and by Friday wanted to take a few hours off for an appointment or to go play with her nieces, and her boss would have her take vacation when she asked.  It took a few years, but I told her "you know, the online timecard system does not care when you work.  As long as it says >80 hours in a 2 week period, you get paid.  Your boss isn't looking that closely, and you are salaried."

Years later, I ended up working with a guy from HQ.  This is how hard core HQ was in that group that my friend was in.  They referred to us as something like "COMPANYX Beach division".  Because most people at our office worked 45-50 hours, not 60-75+ hours a week, we were considered slackers.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Zaga on June 02, 2020, 06:01:25 AM
My company just instituted early out every Friday.  We can leave at 1 if we have 40 hours in, and OT is strongly discouraged.  I love it!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Dicey on June 02, 2020, 06:40:33 AM
My company just instituted early out every Friday.  We can leave at 1 if we have 40 hours in, and OT is strongly discouraged.  I love it!
Enjoy it!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: mm1970 on June 02, 2020, 10:36:24 AM
I hadn't been thinking of this as a FU story, but @partgypsy made me realize my current situation probably is.  At the start of Covid, the DH's company sent out a lawyer-ed up letter outlining the precautions all public facing employees MUST take.  Letter in hand, DH went to his manager to request the disposable masks, hand sanitizer, gloves and cleaning sprays clearly listed as requirements to perform his job.  His manager replied that the company would not be providing anything on the list.  It was DH's responsibility to source, pay for and consistently utilize the required safety equipment.  The DH quit the next day with my blessing. 

Now that the state and local shelter in place orders are being loosened, the manager has been in touch (repeatedly) demanding DH return to his post.  The manager can't seem to wrap their head around the fact that 1) we had't applied for unemployment assistance (he quit, we knew he wouldn't qualify) and 2) that he wasn't ready and willing to beg for his job back after 6+ weeks without a paycheck.  The DH is enjoying himself at home and we're considering this experience to be a pre-FIRE smoke break.
This is pretty glorious.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: BicycleB on June 02, 2020, 10:47:25 AM
I hadn't been thinking of this as a FU story, but @partgypsy made me realize my current situation probably is.  At the start of Covid, the DH's company sent out a lawyer-ed up letter outlining the precautions all public facing employees MUST take.  Letter in hand, DH went to his manager to request the disposable masks, hand sanitizer, gloves and cleaning sprays clearly listed as requirements to perform his job.  His manager replied that the company would not be providing anything on the list.  It was DH's responsibility to source, pay for and consistently utilize the required safety equipment.  The DH quit the next day with my blessing. 

Now that the state and local shelter in place orders are being loosened, the manager has been in touch (repeatedly) demanding DH return to his post.  The manager can't seem to wrap their head around the fact that 1) we had't applied for unemployment assistance (he quit, we knew he wouldn't qualify) and 2) that he wasn't ready and willing to beg for his job back after 6+ weeks without a paycheck.  The DH is enjoying himself at home and we're considering this experience to be a pre-FIRE smoke break.

What a fun story!

Wait, it could have also saved your lives. Now that's epic.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: goat_music_generator on June 02, 2020, 11:59:29 AM
I hadn't been thinking of this as a FU story, but @partgypsy made me realize my current situation probably is.  At the start of Covid, the DH's company sent out a lawyer-ed up letter outlining the precautions all public facing employees MUST take.  Letter in hand, DH went to his manager to request the disposable masks, hand sanitizer, gloves and cleaning sprays clearly listed as requirements to perform his job.  His manager replied that the company would not be providing anything on the list.  It was DH's responsibility to source, pay for and consistently utilize the required safety equipment.  The DH quit the next day with my blessing. 

Now that the state and local shelter in place orders are being loosened, the manager has been in touch (repeatedly) demanding DH return to his post.  The manager can't seem to wrap their head around the fact that 1) we had't applied for unemployment assistance (he quit, we knew he wouldn't qualify) and 2) that he wasn't ready and willing to beg for his job back after 6+ weeks without a paycheck.  The DH is enjoying himself at home and we're considering this experience to be a pre-FIRE smoke break.

A+. Excellent.

I mean, it's unfortunate that you had to pull the trigger on this, but great to feel secure enough that you can.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Dicey on June 02, 2020, 12:25:40 PM
I hadn't been thinking of this as a FU story, but @partgypsy made me realize my current situation probably is.  At the start of Covid, the DH's company sent out a lawyer-ed up letter outlining the precautions all public facing employees MUST take.  Letter in hand, DH went to his manager to request the disposable masks, hand sanitizer, gloves and cleaning sprays clearly listed as requirements to perform his job.  His manager replied that the company would not be providing anything on the list.  It was DH's responsibility to source, pay for and consistently utilize the required safety equipment.  The DH quit the next day with my blessing. 

Now that the state and local shelter in place orders are being loosened, the manager has been in touch (repeatedly) demanding DH return to his post.  The manager can't seem to wrap their head around the fact that 1) we had't applied for unemployment assistance (he quit, we knew he wouldn't qualify) and 2) that he wasn't ready and willing to beg for his job back after 6+ weeks without a paycheck.  The DH is enjoying himself at home and we're considering this experience to be a pre-FIRE smoke break.

What a fun story!

Wait, it could have also saved your lives. Now that's epic.
Epic indeed!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: TomTX on June 02, 2020, 01:17:30 PM
I hadn't been thinking of this as a FU story, but @partgypsy made me realize my current situation probably is.  At the start of Covid, the DH's company sent out a lawyer-ed up letter outlining the precautions all public facing employees MUST take.  Letter in hand, DH went to his manager to request the disposable masks, hand sanitizer, gloves and cleaning sprays clearly listed as requirements to perform his job.  His manager replied that the company would not be providing anything on the list.  It was DH's responsibility to source, pay for and consistently utilize the required safety equipment.  The DH quit the next day with my blessing. 

Now that the state and local shelter in place orders are being loosened, the manager has been in touch (repeatedly) demanding DH return to his post.  The manager can't seem to wrap their head around the fact that 1) we had't applied for unemployment assistance (he quit, we knew he wouldn't qualify) and 2) that he wasn't ready and willing to beg for his job back after 6+ weeks without a paycheck.  The DH is enjoying himself at home and we're considering this experience to be a pre-FIRE smoke break.

Sounds like a great exit.

Any reason you didn't contact the state labor board? Mandating employees buy their own cleaning supplies and PPE for on-the-job use doesn't sound legal.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: fredbear on June 02, 2020, 03:05:21 PM
I...

Now that the state and local shelter in place orders are being loosened, the manager has been in touch (repeatedly) demanding DH return to his post.  ...

I had a fairly shaky supplier who tried to get me to order her contractors to work for her and to tell them that unless they worked for her, there was no work for them.  It was important, she advised, because she was going to be taking 6 weeks off, self-finding.  I told her, "13th amendment, Jeannie."  That your husband's company would require PPE it would not furnish, and is now demanding he return to work, well, SWWAL, what monstrous, palpable, insufferable unconstitutional arrogance.   

One of the better posts on one of my favorite forum topics. 
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Hayden on June 02, 2020, 04:30:36 PM
I am really enjoying reading these stories! 

It reminds me of my grandfather - when he first starting working at a factory (this was probably around the late 1930s) the work day started at 8am.  Every day the boss would come out at 8am, lock the gates and not open them again until 8.30am.  Thus if you were one minute late, you weren't able to enter until 8.30am and half an hour of your wages would be docked from your pay.

After many months of arriving early and working hard, one morning my grandfather had a puncture on his bike and was a few minutes late.  The boss locked him out - my grandfather simply biked away, never to return! 

He got another job the same day.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: dandarc on June 02, 2020, 04:36:11 PM
Awesome story @Hayden. Welcome!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: marty998 on June 03, 2020, 05:03:14 AM
I am really enjoying reading these stories! 

It reminds me of my grandfather - when he first starting working at a factory (this was probably around the late 1930s) the work day started at 8am.  Every day the boss would come out at 8am, lock the gates and not open them again until 8.30am.  Thus if you were one minute late, you weren't able to enter until 8.30am and half an hour of your wages would be docked from your pay.

After many months of arriving early and working hard, one morning my grandfather had a puncture on his bike and was a few minutes late.  The boss locked him out - my grandfather simply biked away, never to return! 

He got another job the same day.

the boss doesn't seem like he's working too hard taking time out to lock the gate and unlock the gate all the time....

If it takes him 5 minutes to lock, and 5 to unlock (by the time he gets back to his desk), then 10 minutes a day, 50 a week = 40 hours a year just spent locking and unlocking gates.

That doesn't sound like a value add productive exercise...
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: talltexan on June 03, 2020, 06:23:31 AM
Props to your grandfather for biking to work. I just got done watching the episode of "The Office" where Jim is trying out biking to work, and winds up so drunk that he cannot bike home safely.

Talk about a show that makes you admire these Epic FU stories!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: alcon835 on June 03, 2020, 06:46:34 AM
I hadn't been thinking of this as a FU story, but @partgypsy made me realize my current situation probably is.  At the start of Covid, the DH's company sent out a lawyer-ed up letter outlining the precautions all public facing employees MUST take.  Letter in hand, DH went to his manager to request the disposable masks, hand sanitizer, gloves and cleaning sprays clearly listed as requirements to perform his job.  His manager replied that the company would not be providing anything on the list.  It was DH's responsibility to source, pay for and consistently utilize the required safety equipment.  The DH quit the next day with my blessing. 

Now that the state and local shelter in place orders are being loosened, the manager has been in touch (repeatedly) demanding DH return to his post.  The manager can't seem to wrap their head around the fact that 1) we had't applied for unemployment assistance (he quit, we knew he wouldn't qualify) and 2) that he wasn't ready and willing to beg for his job back after 6+ weeks without a paycheck.  The DH is enjoying himself at home and we're considering this experience to be a pre-FIRE smoke break.

This is why I love this thread! Great story and the right call. This is exactly what FU money is for.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: ZsaZsa on June 03, 2020, 07:43:05 AM
I hadn't been thinking of this as a FU story, but @partgypsy made me realize my current situation probably is.  At the start of Covid, the DH's company sent out a lawyer-ed up letter outlining the precautions all public facing employees MUST take.  Letter in hand, DH went to his manager to request the disposable masks, hand sanitizer, gloves and cleaning sprays clearly listed as requirements to perform his job.  His manager replied that the company would not be providing anything on the list.  It was DH's responsibility to source, pay for and consistently utilize the required safety equipment.  The DH quit the next day with my blessing. 

Now that the state and local shelter in place orders are being loosened, the manager has been in touch (repeatedly) demanding DH return to his post.  The manager can't seem to wrap their head around the fact that 1) we had't applied for unemployment assistance (he quit, we knew he wouldn't qualify) and 2) that he wasn't ready and willing to beg for his job back after 6+ weeks without a paycheck.  The DH is enjoying himself at home and we're considering this experience to be a pre-FIRE smoke break.

"pre-FIRE smoke break"...I love it!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Dicey on June 03, 2020, 08:07:19 AM
 It's a thing. I believe @couponvan is our longest running chain smoker smoke breaker.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Plina on June 03, 2020, 11:42:40 AM
I had a fuck you moment with my boss today. I was supposed to take the notes today at the company annual meeting and a board meeting. Yesterday, I realised that they had made a procedural mistake in the process as a result of that the meeting was made digital due to Corona. The rules that guide the annual meetings are really strict and if you don’t follow them it can make the decisions  invalid. I found it out accidentally so I outlined the problem to my boss at a meeting yesterday but she didn’t see it as a problem.

I could not let it go so I spent some more time doing research and  half of the night thinking about it and came to the conclusion that I could not go to the meeting and pretend everything is ok. There is a point in the meeting agenda were the ask if the board has invited everyone correctly..  I talked to another lawyer this morning and we found a way to do it so it would tick all the legal boxes by changing the setup. My boss had a talk with the chairman of the board that is formally responsible for the meeting and they had decided to proceed in a way that partly hides the problem. Their solution could have solved the problem if they had documented the decision but it would have forced them to admit the mistake. Her concluding remark was that the chairman had decided that they would do like that.

So i told her that I could not take the notes as I could not sit there and pretend that everything is ok from a legal point of view. I told her that it would feel wrong and unethical. I suggested that a colleague could jump in and take the notes if it was ok to her.

 She hates to admit mistakes and look bad in front of the board but she also says she can’t stand when people lie. I don’t understand how she explains this to herself. The funny thing is that we had a workshop about conflictsolving and resolution yesterday before this shit blew up. I could conclude to a colleague today that we had a conflict of values.

She avoided everybody after the meetings today so it will be interesting to see her approach tomorrow. Legally she can’t fire me and I would guess she didn’t want this to blow up in her face so I am not worried about losing my job. She doesn’t like conflicts so my guess is we will have a talk and then she will pretend that this never happaned. Me, I am pretty tired already after 7 months at this place so I am pretty much prepared to leave after my three months long notice with a bullshit reason. I have been thinking about starting my own law practice but within a years time when I have more money saved. I have money for a year without a salary. It is in stocks and cash but it is difficult to predict what the effects will be of this current Corona-crisis. I could probably find a new job without problems but I am tired of corporate bs and bosses and would prefer to be my own.

Edited to make it less rambling.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Dicey on June 03, 2020, 08:16:37 PM
I hadn't been thinking of this as a FU story, but @partgypsy made me realize my current situation probably is.  At the start of Covid, the DH's company sent out a lawyer-ed up letter outlining the precautions all public facing employees MUST take.  Letter in hand, DH went to his manager to request the disposable masks, hand sanitizer, gloves and cleaning sprays clearly listed as requirements to perform his job.  His manager replied that the company would not be providing anything on the list.  It was DH's responsibility to source, pay for and consistently utilize the required safety equipment.  The DH quit the next day with my blessing. 

Now that the state and local shelter in place orders are being loosened, the manager has been in touch (repeatedly) demanding DH return to his post.  The manager can't seem to wrap their head around the fact that 1) we had't applied for unemployment assistance (he quit, we knew he wouldn't qualify) and 2) that he wasn't ready and willing to beg for his job back after 6+ weeks without a paycheck.  The DH is enjoying himself at home and we're considering this experience to be a pre-FIRE smoke break.
I just read this to DH and he's pretty adamant that you could file and be approved under the circumstances. Might be worth looking into.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: RWTL on June 04, 2020, 04:20:10 AM
I had a fuck you moment with my boss today. I was supposed to take the notes today at the company annual meeting and a board meeting. Yesterday, I realised that they had made a procedural mistake in the process as a result of that the meeting was made digital due to Corona. The rules that guide the annual meetings are really strict and if you don’t follow them it can make the decisions  invalid. I found it out accidentally so I outlined the problem to my boss at a meeting yesterday but she didn’t see it as a problem.

I could not let it go so I spent some more time doing research and  half of the night thinking about it and came to the conclusion that I could not go to the meeting and pretend everything is ok. There is a point in the meeting agenda were the ask if the board has invited everyone correctly..  I talked to another lawyer this morning and we found a way to do it so it would tick all the legal boxes by changing the setup. My boss had a talk with the chairman of the board that is formally responsible for the meeting and they had decided to proceed in a way that partly hides the problem. Their solution could have solved the problem if they had documented the decision but it would have forced them to admit the mistake. Her concluding remark was that the chairman had decided that they would do like that.

So i told her that I could not take the notes as I could not sit there and pretend that everything is ok from a legal point of view. I told her that it would feel wrong and unethical. I suggested that a colleague could jump in and take the notes if it was ok to her.

 She hates to admit mistakes and look bad in front of the board but she also says she can’t stand when people lie. I don’t understand how she explains this to herself. The funny thing is that we had a workshop about conflictsolving and resolution yesterday before this shit blew up. I could conclude to a colleague today that we had a conflict of values.

She avoided everybody after the meetings today so it will be interesting to see her approach tomorrow. Legally she can’t fire me and I would guess she didn’t want this to blow up in her face so I am not worried about losing my job. She doesn’t like conflicts so my guess is we will have a talk and then she will pretend that this never happaned. Me, I am pretty tired already after 7 months at this place so I am pretty much prepared to leave after my three months long notice with a bullshit reason. I have been thinking about starting my own law practice but within a years time when I have more money saved. I have money for a year without a salary. It is in stocks and cash but it is difficult to predict what the effects will be of this current Corona-crisis. I could probably find a new job without problems but I am tired of corporate bs and bosses and would prefer to be my own.

Edited to make it less rambling.

Always good to take actions that help you sleep at night.   I'm glad you have options to carry you on the the next job if this doesn't work out.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: BlueHouse on June 04, 2020, 08:03:56 AM

It will put me on some list the director keeps of 40.0s (people that dont give free OT to the company)


I am not familiar with this term 40.0s.  Is there a phonetic way of saying this that means something?  Does this mean the director keeps a list of forty people that are considered to be zeroes?     
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: RWD on June 04, 2020, 08:08:07 AM
It will put me on some list the director keeps of 40.0s (people that dont give free OT to the company)

I am not familiar with this term 40.0s.  Is there a phonetic way of saying this that means something?  Does this mean the director keeps a list of forty people that are considered to be zeroes?   

I haven't heard it either but I assume it's because they are working exactly 40 hours as opposed to even slightly over (i.e. won't work 40.1 hours).
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: dandarc on June 04, 2020, 08:10:22 AM
40 hours per week is typically the baseline expectation for people in the US. If you're hourly, you often start getting overtime beyond that amount. If you're salaried, you don't get paid overtime. But they still track how many hours you put in.

So the list of 40.0s is the list of people that only work 40 hours each week and therefore are seen by some as doing the bare minimum. However @engineerjourney correctly asserts these are actually the people doing it right - not giving free overtime to the company.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: frugalnacho on June 04, 2020, 09:08:37 AM
I have seen employment offer letters that specify more than 40.  Like you are being paid $80k/yr, but they specifically mention that you are expected to work 50-60 hours.  In those instances the salary and the expectations are crystal clear though.  All of my offer letters have been based off of 40 hours, so that is what I work.  If they want more than 40 they need to specify up front so we can all agree, otherwise I'm not just giving my time to the company for free.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: BlueHouse on June 04, 2020, 09:51:52 AM
It will put me on some list the director keeps of 40.0s (people that dont give free OT to the company)

I am not familiar with this term 40.0s.  Is there a phonetic way of saying this that means something?  Does this mean the director keeps a list of forty people that are considered to be zeroes?   

I haven't heard it either but I assume it's because they are working exactly 40 hours as opposed to even slightly over (i.e. won't work 40.1 hours).

Oh of course!  I am self-employed now so I just don't even think of working in those terms anymore. Thank you!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Much Fishing to Do on June 04, 2020, 10:43:55 AM
I have seen employment offer letters that specify more than 40.  Like you are being paid $80k/yr, but they specifically mention that you are expected to work 50-60 hours.  In those instances the salary and the expectations are crystal clear though.  All of my offer letters have been based off of 40 hours, so that is what I work.  If they want more than 40 they need to specify up front so we can all agree, otherwise I'm not just giving my time to the company for free.

Yeah, but in the end most of these offers are nothing but an understanding of the initial terms as most are still at-will employees unless otherwise agreed upon.  Every day an employer can always change the terms (demand/expect more hours, cut pay rate (for any future hours worked), etc) and every day the employee can always decide they really don't want to be there and walk away.  My employer was dragging their feet paying my annual bonus and cut my pay rate when covid concerns hit...my complaints focused on what I had already earned (the overdue bonus) and accepted the new pay rate going forward was their prerogative.  When they sent me a email to reply to to confirm I understood my new rate my first thought was to say thanks for the offer but no thanks....but hey, its still a great rate and job set-up that works for me so no reason to get all FUey...
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Plina on June 04, 2020, 10:48:59 AM
I had a fuck you moment with my boss today. I was supposed to take the notes today at the company annual meeting and a board meeting. Yesterday, I realised that they had made a procedural mistake in the process as a result of that the meeting was made digital due to Corona. The rules that guide the annual meetings are really strict and if you don’t follow them it can make the decisions  invalid. I found it out accidentally so I outlined the problem to my boss at a meeting yesterday but she didn’t see it as a problem.

I could not let it go so I spent some more time doing research and  half of the night thinking about it and came to the conclusion that I could not go to the meeting and pretend everything is ok. There is a point in the meeting agenda were the ask if the board has invited everyone correctly..  I talked to another lawyer this morning and we found a way to do it so it would tick all the legal boxes by changing the setup. My boss had a talk with the chairman of the board that is formally responsible for the meeting and they had decided to proceed in a way that partly hides the problem. Their solution could have solved the problem if they had documented the decision but it would have forced them to admit the mistake. Her concluding remark was that the chairman had decided that they would do like that.

So i told her that I could not take the notes as I could not sit there and pretend that everything is ok from a legal point of view. I told her that it would feel wrong and unethical. I suggested that a colleague could jump in and take the notes if it was ok to her.

 She hates to admit mistakes and look bad in front of the board but she also says she can’t stand when people lie. I don’t understand how she explains this to herself. The funny thing is that we had a workshop about conflictsolving and resolution yesterday before this shit blew up. I could conclude to a colleague today that we had a conflict of values.

She avoided everybody after the meetings today so it will be interesting to see her approach tomorrow. Legally she can’t fire me and I would guess she didn’t want this to blow up in her face so I am not worried about losing my job. She doesn’t like conflicts so my guess is we will have a talk and then she will pretend that this never happaned. Me, I am pretty tired already after 7 months at this place so I am pretty much prepared to leave after my three months long notice with a bullshit reason. I have been thinking about starting my own law practice but within a years time when I have more money saved. I have money for a year without a salary. It is in stocks and cash but it is difficult to predict what the effects will be of this current Corona-crisis. I could probably find a new job without problems but I am tired of corporate bs and bosses and would prefer to be my own.

Edited to make it less rambling.

Always good to take actions that help you sleep at night.   I'm glad you have options to carry you on the the next job if this doesn't work out.

Yes, it is nice to have options. She gave me a speech today of how she has less trust in me as I had put the reputation of the company in jeopardy and caused trouble for her and my colleague. I will apologize to my colleague tomorrow for putting her in a difficult spot but I knew that she was totally capable to pull it off. I also got a legal letter that notified me that she thought I had violated my work contract by refusing doing a task and that was in breech with my loyalty duty to the company as it could have damaged the owners picture of the company. It should be read that it could have damaged the picture of her.

And by that action she pretty much guaranteed that she will get my letter of resignation. I haven't decided if she will get it right before her vacation starts or after I am back from my vacation. Probably after my vacation because by postponing it until the end of august I can sock away about 6-8 months of expenses during my period of notice. July-August will basically be vacation time. It will also allow me to explore some connections before deciding if I want be self-employed or not.

We will have a new conversation tomorrow were I will probably express my lack of trust in her after giving me this letter. She will probably get a letter stating my disappointment of the legal letter as I only followed my ethical compass and could not bring myself to brake my code of honor. :) It can be nice to have for the record and it would be nice if it led to a buyout but that is too much to hope for. I have to admit that I got pissed when I got the letter but now I am more amused by her play. I think it will get consequences that she has not thought about. I am grateful that I bought less apartment that I could afford and that I have a lot of savings. I probably would not have been as amused about this as I am if that had not been the case.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: zolotiyeruki on June 04, 2020, 10:57:27 AM
Yes, it is nice to have options. She gave me a speech today of how she has less trust in me as I had put the reputation of the company in jeopardy and caused trouble for her and my colleague. I will apologize to my colleague tomorrow for putting her in a difficult spot but I knew that she was totally capable to pull it off. I also got a legal letter that notified me that she thought I had violated my work contract by refusing doing a task and that was in breech with my loyalty duty to the company as it could have damaged the owners picture of the company. It should be read that it could have damaged the picture of her.

And by that action she pretty much guaranteed that she will get my letter of resignation. I haven't decided if she will get it right before her vacation starts or after I am back from my vacation. Probably after my vacation because by postponing it until the end of august I can sock away about 6-8 months of expenses during my period of notice. July-August will basically be vacation time. It will also allow me to explore some connections before deciding if I want be self-employed or not.

We will have a new conversation tomorrow were I will probably express my lack of trust in her after giving me this letter. She will probably get a letter stating my disappointment of the legal letter as I only followed my ethical compass and could not bring myself to brake my code of honor. :) It can be nice to have for the record and it would be nice if it led to a buyout but that is too much to hope for. I have to admit that I got pissed when I got the letter but now I am more amused by her play. I think it will get consequences that she has not thought about. I am grateful that I bought less apartment that I could afford and that I have a lot of savings. I probably would not have been as amused about this as I am if that had not been the case.
What I have learned from a lot of other people's experience is to DOCUMENT EVERYTHING, and back it up somewhere separate, i.e. somewhere where you won't lose access to it upon separation.  In your response, lay out explicitly what the request was, and how/why it was unethical/illegal/whatever, and the potential consequences of requiring an employee to perform said request.  It may also be appropriate to CC others in the chain of command, so that there's no plausible deniability.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Plina on June 04, 2020, 11:23:42 AM
Yes, it is nice to have options. She gave me a speech today of how she has less trust in me as I had put the reputation of the company in jeopardy and caused trouble for her and my colleague. I will apologize to my colleague tomorrow for putting her in a difficult spot but I knew that she was totally capable to pull it off. I also got a legal letter that notified me that she thought I had violated my work contract by refusing doing a task and that was in breech with my loyalty duty to the company as it could have damaged the owners picture of the company. It should be read that it could have damaged the picture of her.

And by that action she pretty much guaranteed that she will get my letter of resignation. I haven't decided if she will get it right before her vacation starts or after I am back from my vacation. Probably after my vacation because by postponing it until the end of august I can sock away about 6-8 months of expenses during my period of notice. July-August will basically be vacation time. It will also allow me to explore some connections before deciding if I want be self-employed or not.

We will have a new conversation tomorrow were I will probably express my lack of trust in her after giving me this letter. She will probably get a letter stating my disappointment of the legal letter as I only followed my ethical compass and could not bring myself to brake my code of honor. :) It can be nice to have for the record and it would be nice if it led to a buyout but that is too much to hope for. I have to admit that I got pissed when I got the letter but now I am more amused by her play. I think it will get consequences that she has not thought about. I am grateful that I bought less apartment that I could afford and that I have a lot of savings. I probably would not have been as amused about this as I am if that had not been the case.
What I have learned from a lot of other people's experience is to DOCUMENT EVERYTHING, and back it up somewhere separate, i.e. somewhere where you won't lose access to it upon separation.  In your response, lay out explicitly what the request was, and how/why it was unethical/illegal/whatever, and the potential consequences of requiring an employee to perform said request.  It may also be appropriate to CC others in the chain of command, so that there's no plausible deniability.

I will document it but I don't want to escalate it too much by spreading it through email to others as I will have to be in contact with them in the future if I want to work in that part of the field. The company were I work has a lot of money because it has been constructed to spread financing in the field during a 20 year period. I can survive without doing the work but I don't want to cut out the opportunity. My boss, who is the CEO, would need to be pretty stupid to let this out because I don't think it would be looked favorably by the owners or others that she tried to cover up things. I am the lawyer in the company. So when I leave the company most of the people outside the company will get a bs reason to why I leave.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Chris @ Saturday Financial on June 04, 2020, 11:32:38 AM
Yes, it is nice to have options. She gave me a speech today of how she has less trust in me as I had put the reputation of the company in jeopardy and caused trouble for her and my colleague. I will apologize to my colleague tomorrow for putting her in a difficult spot but I knew that she was totally capable to pull it off. I also got a legal letter that notified me that she thought I had violated my work contract by refusing doing a task and that was in breech with my loyalty duty to the company as it could have damaged the owners picture of the company. It should be read that it could have damaged the picture of her.

And by that action she pretty much guaranteed that she will get my letter of resignation. I haven't decided if she will get it right before her vacation starts or after I am back from my vacation. Probably after my vacation because by postponing it until the end of august I can sock away about 6-8 months of expenses during my period of notice. July-August will basically be vacation time. It will also allow me to explore some connections before deciding if I want be self-employed or not.

We will have a new conversation tomorrow were I will probably express my lack of trust in her after giving me this letter. She will probably get a letter stating my disappointment of the legal letter as I only followed my ethical compass and could not bring myself to brake my code of honor. :) It can be nice to have for the record and it would be nice if it led to a buyout but that is too much to hope for. I have to admit that I got pissed when I got the letter but now I am more amused by her play. I think it will get consequences that she has not thought about. I am grateful that I bought less apartment that I could afford and that I have a lot of savings. I probably would not have been as amused about this as I am if that had not been the case.
What I have learned from a lot of other people's experience is to DOCUMENT EVERYTHING, and back it up somewhere separate, i.e. somewhere where you won't lose access to it upon separation.  In your response, lay out explicitly what the request was, and how/why it was unethical/illegal/whatever, and the potential consequences of requiring an employee to perform said request.  It may also be appropriate to CC others in the chain of command, so that there's no plausible deniability.

I will document it but I don't want to escalate it too much by spreading it through email to others as I will have to be in contact with them in the future if I want to work in that part of the field. The company were I work has a lot of money because it has been constructed to spread financing in the field during a 20 year period. I can survive without doing the work but I don't want to cut out the opportunity. My boss, who is the CEO, would need to be pretty stupid to let this out because I don't think it would be looked favorably by the owners or others that she tried to cover up things. I am the lawyer in the company. So when I leave the company most of the people outside the company will get a bs reason to why I leave.

You don't need to copy others in the email, but responding to the letter is great advice. In your response, I would also mention that you were acting in the best interest of the company. You noticed that the law would be broken, and you took all of the steps within your power to prevent the law from being broken. Frame everything from the perspective that you were/are attempting to follow the law while also respectfully yielding to her authority as your boss. Be respectful but firm in your communication. From what I understand, her actions are the ones that put the reputation of the company at risk.

ETA: After re-reading I'm not sure whether a law was broken or a rule (without the force of law) was broken. You're the lawyer and you're much closer to the actual situation, so obviously you should act as you feel is best. Regardless, it appears that you were not only acting in accordance with your ethical compass but also in the best interest of the company.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: markbike528CBX on June 04, 2020, 11:42:26 AM
Yes, it is nice to have options. She gave me a speech today of how she has less trust in me as I had put the reputation of the company in jeopardy and caused trouble for her and my colleague. I will apologize to my colleague tomorrow for putting her in a difficult spot but I knew that she was totally capable to pull it off. I also got a legal letter that notified me that she thought I had violated my work contract by refusing doing a task and that was in breech with my loyalty duty to the company as it could have damaged the owners picture of the company. It should be read that it could have damaged the picture of her.

And by that action she pretty much guaranteed that she will get my letter of resignation. I haven't decided if she will get it right before her vacation starts or after I am back from my vacation. Probably after my vacation because by postponing it until the end of august I can sock away about 6-8 months of expenses during my period of notice. July-August will basically be vacation time. It will also allow me to explore some connections before deciding if I want be self-employed or not.

We will have a new conversation tomorrow were I will probably express my lack of trust in her after giving me this letter. She will probably get a letter stating my disappointment of the legal letter as I only followed my ethical compass and could not bring myself to brake my code of honor. :) It can be nice to have for the record and it would be nice if it led to a buyout but that is too much to hope for. I have to admit that I got pissed when I got the letter but now I am more amused by her play. I think it will get consequences that she has not thought about. I am grateful that I bought less apartment that I could afford and that I have a lot of savings. I probably would not have been as amused about this as I am if that had not been the case.
What I have learned from a lot of other people's experience is to DOCUMENT EVERYTHING, and back it up somewhere separate, i.e. somewhere where you won't lose access to it upon separation.  In your response, lay out explicitly what the request was, and how/why it was unethical/illegal/whatever, and the potential consequences of requiring an employee to perform said request.  It may also be appropriate to CC others in the chain of command, so that there's no plausible deniability.

I will document it but I don't want to escalate it too much by spreading it through email to others as I will have to be in contact with them in the future if I want to work in that part of the field. The company were I work has a lot of money because it has been constructed to spread financing in the field during a 20 year period. I can survive without doing the work but I don't want to cut out the opportunity. My boss, who is the CEO, would need to be pretty stupid to let this out because I don't think it would be looked favorably by the owners or others that she tried to cover up things. I am the lawyer in the company. So when I leave the company most of the people outside the company will get a bs reason to why I leave.

+1 to zolotiyeruki statement of documenting.
But wait, CEO gave you a legal letter documenting that there was, in fact, an incident?  WTF? 
This makes your documentation a simple matter of referring to the incident and the letter a no-brainer. But you as a lawyer already know this....just saying for others.

If I was the CEO, I _might_ have written an informal note as a reminder for later and NOT give it to you.
At the most the CEO might use it later for a PIP (pre-separation Personal Improvement Plan) or denial of unemployment benefits.
I certainly would not have documented or even acknowledged the existance an ethical incident.
Edit to add "even acknowledged"
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Plina on June 04, 2020, 12:17:36 PM
Yes, it is nice to have options. She gave me a speech today of how she has less trust in me as I had put the reputation of the company in jeopardy and caused trouble for her and my colleague. I will apologize to my colleague tomorrow for putting her in a difficult spot but I knew that she was totally capable to pull it off. I also got a legal letter that notified me that she thought I had violated my work contract by refusing doing a task and that was in breech with my loyalty duty to the company as it could have damaged the owners picture of the company. It should be read that it could have damaged the picture of her.

And by that action she pretty much guaranteed that she will get my letter of resignation. I haven't decided if she will get it right before her vacation starts or after I am back from my vacation. Probably after my vacation because by postponing it until the end of august I can sock away about 6-8 months of expenses during my period of notice. July-August will basically be vacation time. It will also allow me to explore some connections before deciding if I want be self-employed or not.

We will have a new conversation tomorrow were I will probably express my lack of trust in her after giving me this letter. She will probably get a letter stating my disappointment of the legal letter as I only followed my ethical compass and could not bring myself to brake my code of honor. :) It can be nice to have for the record and it would be nice if it led to a buyout but that is too much to hope for. I have to admit that I got pissed when I got the letter but now I am more amused by her play. I think it will get consequences that she has not thought about. I am grateful that I bought less apartment that I could afford and that I have a lot of savings. I probably would not have been as amused about this as I am if that had not been the case.
What I have learned from a lot of other people's experience is to DOCUMENT EVERYTHING, and back it up somewhere separate, i.e. somewhere where you won't lose access to it upon separation.  In your response, lay out explicitly what the request was, and how/why it was unethical/illegal/whatever, and the potential consequences of requiring an employee to perform said request.  It may also be appropriate to CC others in the chain of command, so that there's no plausible deniability.

I will document it but I don't want to escalate it too much by spreading it through email to others as I will have to be in contact with them in the future if I want to work in that part of the field. The company were I work has a lot of money because it has been constructed to spread financing in the field during a 20 year period. I can survive without doing the work but I don't want to cut out the opportunity. My boss, who is the CEO, would need to be pretty stupid to let this out because I don't think it would be looked favorably by the owners or others that she tried to cover up things. I am the lawyer in the company. So when I leave the company most of the people outside the company will get a bs reason to why I leave.

You don't need to copy others in the email, but responding to the letter is great advice. In your response, I would also mention that you were acting in the best interest of the company. You noticed that the law would be broken, and you took all of the steps within your power to prevent the law from being broken. Frame everything from the perspective that you were/are attempting to follow the law while also respectfully yielding to her authority as your boss. Be respectful but firm in your communication. From what I understand, her actions are the ones that put the reputation of the company at risk.

ETA: After re-reading I'm not sure whether a law was broken or a rule (without the force of law) was broken. You're the lawyer and you're much closer to the actual situation, so obviously you should act as you feel is best. Regardless, it appears that you were not only acting in accordance with your ethical compass but also in the best interest of the company.

I will respond to the letter. Good point of the framing. I will put a lot of emphasis on the best interest of the company and outline the actions that could have been taken instead of breaking the law so that if she chooses to take it further she can't do it without getting in trouble herself. I would say she broke a law, where the consequence would be that annual meeting and the decisions made there would be invalid if somebody decided to question it in court.

We will have a new conversation tomorrow were I will probably express my lack of trust in her after giving me this letter. She will probably get a letter stating my disappointment of the legal letter as I only followed my ethical compass and could not bring myself to brake my code of honor. :) It can be nice to have for the record and it would be nice if it led to a buyout but that is too much to hope for. I have to admit that I got pissed when I got the letter but now I am more amused by her play. I think it will get consequences that she has not thought about. I am grateful that I bought less apartment that I could afford and that I have a lot of savings. I probably would not have been as amused about this as I am if that had not been the case.
What I have learned from a lot of other people's experience is to DOCUMENT EVERYTHING, and back it up somewhere separate, i.e. somewhere where you won't lose access to it upon separation.  In your response, lay out explicitly what the request was, and how/why it was unethical/illegal/whatever, and the potential consequences of requiring an employee to perform said request.  It may also be appropriate to CC others in the chain of command, so that there's no plausible deniability.

I will document it but I don't want to escalate it too much by spreading it through email to others as I will have to be in contact with them in the future if I want to work in that part of the field. The company were I work has a lot of money because it has been constructed to spread financing in the field during a 20 year period. I can survive without doing the work but I don't want to cut out the opportunity. My boss, who is the CEO, would need to be pretty stupid to let this out because I don't think it would be looked favorably by the owners or others that she tried to cover up things. I am the lawyer in the company. So when I leave the company most of the people outside the company will get a bs reason to why I leave.

+1 to zolotiyeruki statement of documenting.
But wait, CEO gave you a legal letter documenting that there was, in fact, an incident?  WTF? 
This makes your documentation a simple matter of referring to the incident and the letter a no-brainer. But you as a lawyer already know this....just saying for others.

If I was the CEO, I _might_ have written an informal note as a reminder for later and NOT give it to you.
At the most the CEO might use it later for a PIP (pre-separation Personal Improvement Plan) or denial of unemployment benefits.
I certainly would not have documented or even acknowledged the existance an ethical incident.
Edit to add "even acknowledged"

I am not US-based so different set of rules. If she would want to fire me in the future she has to notify me that I haven't upheld my part of the deal and remind me of my obligations. My refusal to do my work once is not enough to fire me but if she can keep adding stuff like this she could use them as proof in the future of my negligence. Therefore I have to sign the letter to confirm that I got it and I might write the response on that letter for the fun of it to ensure that it does not disappear together with an email copy of it due to the time it takes to be delivered by mail. You know I don't have a printer at home.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Dicey on June 04, 2020, 03:15:11 PM
I hadn't been thinking of this as a FU story, but @partgypsy made me realize my current situation probably is.  At the start of Covid, the DH's company sent out a lawyer-ed up letter outlining the precautions all public facing employees MUST take.  Letter in hand, DH went to his manager to request the disposable masks, hand sanitizer, gloves and cleaning sprays clearly listed as requirements to perform his job.  His manager replied that the company would not be providing anything on the list.  It was DH's responsibility to source, pay for and consistently utilize the required safety equipment.  The DH quit the next day with my blessing. 

Now that the state and local shelter in place orders are being loosened, the manager has been in touch (repeatedly) demanding DH return to his post.  The manager can't seem to wrap their head around the fact that 1) we had't applied for unemployment assistance (he quit, we knew he wouldn't qualify) and 2) that he wasn't ready and willing to beg for his job back after 6+ weeks without a paycheck.  The DH is enjoying himself at home and we're considering this experience to be a pre-FIRE smoke break.
I just read this to DH and he's pretty adamant that you could file and be approved under the circumstances. Might be worth looking into.

We're in North Carolina where unemployment benefits are punitive rather than compensatory.  Under normal circumstances, quitting (regardless of reason) is an instant disqualification for benefits (and you have to be fired in very specific ways or you wont qualify if you get fired either.)  There are new Covid-19 exceptions that allow you to quit and claim, but you pretty much have to have an active diagnosis or live with someone with an active diagnosis or you don't qualify.  For us, its not worth the weekly hassle (even sick you still have to provide proof you're looking for work - from your hospital bed presumably).
Wow! Still? In CA, workers don't even have to attempt to look for work right now.

Also, I'd kind of forgotten what state you're in (see, I'm not a stalker), but I remember when I worked for a company that was based in the South, they treated their workers like shit and totally got away with it. People with decades of service were earning a pittance and were grateful to have jobs. Quite a difference on opposite ends of the same country. On the plus side, see how successful I've been at erasing my working years from memory, lol? There's hope for my work-related PTSD yet.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Zaga on June 04, 2020, 06:03:33 PM
I hadn't been thinking of this as a FU story, but @partgypsy made me realize my current situation probably is.  At the start of Covid, the DH's company sent out a lawyer-ed up letter outlining the precautions all public facing employees MUST take.  Letter in hand, DH went to his manager to request the disposable masks, hand sanitizer, gloves and cleaning sprays clearly listed as requirements to perform his job.  His manager replied that the company would not be providing anything on the list.  It was DH's responsibility to source, pay for and consistently utilize the required safety equipment.  The DH quit the next day with my blessing. 

Now that the state and local shelter in place orders are being loosened, the manager has been in touch (repeatedly) demanding DH return to his post.  The manager can't seem to wrap their head around the fact that 1) we had't applied for unemployment assistance (he quit, we knew he wouldn't qualify) and 2) that he wasn't ready and willing to beg for his job back after 6+ weeks without a paycheck.  The DH is enjoying himself at home and we're considering this experience to be a pre-FIRE smoke break.
I just read this to DH and he's pretty adamant that you could file and be approved under the circumstances. Might be worth looking into.

We're in North Carolina where unemployment benefits are punitive rather than compensatory.  Under normal circumstances, quitting (regardless of reason) is an instant disqualification for benefits (and you have to be fired in very specific ways or you wont qualify if you get fired either.)  There are new Covid-19 exceptions that allow you to quit and claim, but you pretty much have to have an active diagnosis or live with someone with an active diagnosis or you don't qualify.  For us, its not worth the weekly hassle (even sick you still have to provide proof you're looking for work - from your hospital bed presumably).
Wow! Still? In CA, workers don't even have to attempt to look for work right now.

Also, I'd kind of forgotten what state you're in (see, I'm not a stalker), but I remember when I worked for a company that was based in the South, they treated their workers like shit and totally got away with it. People with decades of service were earning a pittance and were grateful to have jobs. Quite a difference on opposite ends of the same country. On the plus side, see how successful I've been at erasing my working years from memory, lol? There's hope for my work-related PTSD yet.
PA unemployment requires you to do I think 2 job searches a week on a state run website.  But only after you've been unemployed for 30 days.  I was unemployed for 2 weeks for covid, so I never searched.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: engineerjourney on June 05, 2020, 06:58:22 AM
yeah you guys figured out what I meant by 40.0ers.  My company is heavy engineering and lots of engineering jobs (at least in the USA for the discipline I am) tend to work you for 50+ hours a week for salary compensation (no OT payment).  At our company different levels are required to give "free hours" before OT becomes paid.  So for example a Eng I would have to give 5 hours free before being paid for OT (so worked 46 hours, would get paid for 41 hrs).  For a supervisor its 10 hours free before OT becomes paid.  Its expected that you dont watch the clock, so 40.0s are considered clock watchers and minimum workers (our time is measured in 6 min increments and you have to clock in/out so some people do time it down to the minute for leaving).  It has no bearing on amount or quality of work done.  Sometimes it is true that a 40.0er is a slacker but its not always the case so to me the metric isnt useful unless you have other performance issues with the person.  At the director level they are looking at Sales performance and the "free hours" are very useful to the company for making profits so they would love a ton of 45ers.  Just a part of being at a MegaCorp.  Since having kids I usually work 40-42 hours a week but now thats down under 40, haha. 
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: mm1970 on June 05, 2020, 10:05:44 AM
yeah you guys figured out what I meant by 40.0ers.  My company is heavy engineering and lots of engineering jobs (at least in the USA for the discipline I am) tend to work you for 50+ hours a week for salary compensation (no OT payment).  At our company different levels are required to give "free hours" before OT becomes paid.  So for example a Eng I would have to give 5 hours free before being paid for OT (so worked 46 hours, would get paid for 41 hrs).  For a supervisor its 10 hours free before OT becomes paid.  Its expected that you dont watch the clock, so 40.0s are considered clock watchers and minimum workers (our time is measured in 6 min increments and you have to clock in/out so some people do time it down to the minute for leaving).  It has no bearing on amount or quality of work done.  Sometimes it is true that a 40.0er is a slacker but its not always the case so to me the metric isnt useful unless you have other performance issues with the person.  At the director level they are looking at Sales performance and the "free hours" are very useful to the company for making profits so they would love a ton of 45ers.  Just a part of being at a MegaCorp.  Since having kids I usually work 40-42 hours a week but now thats down under 40, haha.
Ah, I don't miss those days.  When I was in my 20s and 30s, I averaged a lot of hours every week.  I think my first year at this one company it was 47.5 hours a week.  That meant for every 40 hour week I had, I had a 55 hour week.  It was a pretty brutal schedule but doable at my age.  Those hours only decreased over the years.  I remember the boss telling me that 45 minimum was expected, because "you know those last 5 each week, or 1 per day are productive, because you aren't sitting around just waiting to go home!"  Um, it was actually in writing, which was illegal here at the time.

In any event, I'm old now.  I don't do that anymore.  When hours are needed, I do them.  When not, I don't.  We are understaffed and sorry, but your inability to staff or properly select the number of projects that are doable is NOT my problem.  Of course, plenty of studies show that increasing hours actually decreases overall productivity.  But hey, it's all about the numbers, amirite?
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: AMandM on June 05, 2020, 11:11:37 AM
yeah you guys figured out what I meant by 40.0ers.  My company is heavy engineering and lots of engineering jobs (at least in the USA for the discipline I am) tend to work you for 50+ hours a week for salary compensation (no OT payment).  At our company different levels are required to give "free hours" before OT becomes paid.  So for example a Eng I would have to give 5 hours free before being paid for OT (so worked 46 hours, would get paid for 41 hrs).  For a supervisor its 10 hours free before OT becomes paid.  Its expected that you dont watch the clock, so 40.0s are considered clock watchers and minimum workers (our time is measured in 6 min increments and you have to clock in/out so some people do time it down to the minute for leaving).  It has no bearing on amount or quality of work done.  Sometimes it is true that a 40.0er is a slacker but its not always the case so to me the metric isnt useful unless you have other performance issues with the person.  At the director level they are looking at Sales performance and the "free hours" are very useful to the company for making profits so they would love a ton of 45ers.  Just a part of being at a MegaCorp.  Since having kids I usually work 40-42 hours a week but now thats down under 40, haha.

I have a BIL who used to do IT for a company that did data mining for lawyers. Everyone worked nonstop 55 hours a week, it was super competitive, everyone backstabbed each other, etc. Then he switched to a religious nonprofit. He hadn't been there a week when a colleague stopped by his desk while he was typing with one hand and holding a sandwich in the other and said, "Dude, it's lunchtime. Take a break." His internal reaction was, "Who is this guy who's trying to undermine me and get ahead of me?"  A few days later his boss said to him at 5:15, "What are you still doing here? Don't you have a wife and kids? Go home!"  It took him quite a while to realize that the organization really meant it when they said they value work-life balance.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: RWTL on June 05, 2020, 02:40:26 PM
Quote
His internal reaction was, "Who is this guy who's trying to undermine me and get ahead of me?"  A few days later his boss said to him at 5:15, "What are you still doing here? Don't you have a wife and kids? Go home!"  It took him quite a while to realize that the organization really meant it when they said they value work-life balance.

Isn't it funny how we are conditioned to think a certain way. 
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: WerKater on June 08, 2020, 03:16:51 AM
Its expected that you dont watch the clock, so 40.0s are considered clock watchers and minimum workers (our time is measured in 6 min increments and you have to clock in/out so some people do time it down to the minute for leaving). 
Isn't it funny that a company
- makes employees clock in and out and measures their time to a tenth of an hour,
- yet when the same employees are actually aware of and care about the time they gave the company, they are derided as "clock watchers"?
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: evme on June 08, 2020, 03:34:52 AM
This was some time ago. I was working PT about 25-30 hrs/week as a tutor/teacher at a private accredited tutoring center. The boss/owner was not a nice woman and ripped off the desperate parents while paying us indentured servants (err.... employees) peanuts, in the range of $12-15/hr. To supplement my income I started a side gig in e-commerce and quickly started making more from the side gig than the job. Eventually, significantly more. Anyway, at some point I realized I wasn't going to work for this woman anymore and told her I was quitting. I'll never forget the look on her face when I told her I was leaving -- total shock. She just said, "good for you".
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: talltexan on June 08, 2020, 07:47:18 AM
$15/hour for one of those tutoring services actually sounds higher than what I would have expected (I, too, was working for one).
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: BicycleB on June 09, 2020, 03:37:57 PM
This was some time ago. I was working PT about 25-30 hrs/week as a tutor/teacher at a private accredited tutoring center. The boss/owner was not a nice woman and ripped off the desperate parents while paying us indentured servants (err.... employees) peanuts, in the range of $12-15/hr. To supplement my income I started a side gig in e-commerce and quickly started making more from the side gig than the job. Eventually, significantly more. Anyway, at some point I realized I wasn't going to work for this woman anymore and told her I was quitting. I'll never forget the look on her face when I told her I was leaving -- total shock. She just said, "good for you".

LOL. Good for you indeed!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: savedandsaving on June 09, 2020, 04:16:53 PM
Then he switched to a religious nonprofit. He hadn't been there a week when a colleague stopped by his desk while he was typing with one hand and holding a sandwich in the other and said, "Dude, it's lunchtime. Take a break." His internal reaction was, "Who is this guy who's trying to undermine me and get ahead of me?"  A few days later his boss said to him at 5:15, "What are you still doing here? Don't you have a wife and kids? Go home!"  It took him quite a while to realize that the organization really meant it when they said they value work-life balance.

Love this!! Stopping by just to sing the praises of religious nonprofits--I worked for one too, and I got great wages (as a mere customer service rep), 100% employer-paid high quality healthcare for me/spouse/any dependants, generous vacations, sick time, catered lunch, flexible hours, and genuinely kind coworkers. I'm sure there are some out there that don't practice what they preach, but in my experience they sure do.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: evme on June 11, 2020, 06:30:02 PM
$15/hour for one of those tutoring services actually sounds higher than what I would have expected (I, too, was working for one).

I think I started at $12/hr. Not exactly the best wage for a college grad, but I suppose it could have been worse too.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: AMandM on June 12, 2020, 12:02:41 AM
$15/hour for one of those tutoring services actually sounds higher than what I would have expected (I, too, was working for one).

I think I started at $12/hr. Not exactly the best wage for a college grad, but I suppose it could have been worse too.

That seems low to me. I made $20-25/hour ten years ago, though I did have a master's and I aced the mock SAT that all tutors had to take. Or maybe that's why that tutoring center is no longer in business.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: BTDretire on June 12, 2020, 04:58:29 AM
$15/hour for one of those tutoring services actually sounds higher than what I would have expected (I, too, was working for one).

I think I started at $12/hr. Not exactly the best wage for a college grad, but I suppose it could have been worse too.

 Gee, I started at $0.60/hr, but then it was only a couple years after graduating from elementary school!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Plina on June 15, 2020, 09:38:40 AM
I had a fuck you moment with my boss today. I was supposed to take the notes today at the company annual meeting and a board meeting. Yesterday, I realised that they had made a procedural mistake in the process as a result of that the meeting was made digital due to Corona. The rules that guide the annual meetings are really strict and if you don’t follow them it can make the decisions  invalid. I found it out accidentally so I outlined the problem to my boss at a meeting yesterday but she didn’t see it as a problem.

I could not let it go so I spent some more time doing research and  half of the night thinking about it and came to the conclusion that I could not go to the meeting and pretend everything is ok. There is a point in the meeting agenda were the ask if the board has invited everyone correctly..  I talked to another lawyer this morning and we found a way to do it so it would tick all the legal boxes by changing the setup. My boss had a talk with the chairman of the board that is formally responsible for the meeting and they had decided to proceed in a way that partly hides the problem. Their solution could have solved the problem if they had documented the decision but it would have forced them to admit the mistake. Her concluding remark was that the chairman had decided that they would do like that.

So i told her that I could not take the notes as I could not sit there and pretend that everything is ok from a legal point of view. I told her that it would feel wrong and unethical. I suggested that a colleague could jump in and take the notes if it was ok to her.

 She hates to admit mistakes and look bad in front of the board but she also says she can’t stand when people lie. I don’t understand how she explains this to herself. The funny thing is that we had a workshop about conflictsolving and resolution yesterday before this shit blew up. I could conclude to a colleague today that we had a conflict of values.

She avoided everybody after the meetings today so it will be interesting to see her approach tomorrow. Legally she can’t fire me and I would guess she didn’t want this to blow up in her face so I am not worried about losing my job. She doesn’t like conflicts so my guess is we will have a talk and then she will pretend that this never happaned. Me, I am pretty tired already after 7 months at this place so I am pretty much prepared to leave after my three months long notice with a bullshit reason. I have been thinking about starting my own law practice but within a years time when I have more money saved. I have money for a year without a salary. It is in stocks and cash but it is difficult to predict what the effects will be of this current Corona-crisis. I could probably find a new job without problems but I am tired of corporate bs and bosses and would prefer to be my own.

Edited to make it less rambling.

Always good to take actions that help you sleep at night.   I'm glad you have options to carry you on the the next job if this doesn't work out.

Yes, it is nice to have options. She gave me a speech today of how she has less trust in me as I had put the reputation of the company in jeopardy and caused trouble for her and my colleague. I will apologize to my colleague tomorrow for putting her in a difficult spot but I knew that she was totally capable to pull it off. I also got a legal letter that notified me that she thought I had violated my work contract by refusing doing a task and that was in breech with my loyalty duty to the company as it could have damaged the owners picture of the company. It should be read that it could have damaged the picture of her.

And by that action she pretty much guaranteed that she will get my letter of resignation. I haven't decided if she will get it right before her vacation starts or after I am back from my vacation. Probably after my vacation because by postponing it until the end of august I can sock away about 6-8 months of expenses during my period of notice. July-August will basically be vacation time. It will also allow me to explore some connections before deciding if I want be self-employed or not.

We will have a new conversation tomorrow were I will probably express my lack of trust in her after giving me this letter. She will probably get a letter stating my disappointment of the legal letter as I only followed my ethical compass and could not bring myself to brake my code of honor. :) It can be nice to have for the record and it would be nice if it led to a buyout but that is too much to hope for. I have to admit that I got pissed when I got the letter but now I am more amused by her play. I think it will get consequences that she has not thought about. I am grateful that I bought less apartment that I could afford and that I have a lot of savings. I probably would not have been as amused about this as I am if that had not been the case.

An update:
I have had two chats with my boss and a couple of ones with my union. In the first chat we concluded that she didn’t have the same trust in me as previously and I concluded that it had also affected my trust for her. She also told that she saw that it would be difficult to continue working together with the lack of trust on both sides and asked how I looked at it. I told her that I thought we should continue working as previously because now I realised there was a possibility that they would buy me out. If I can walk away with X months of salary I will be pleased to play the lets continue as normally-play. She told me that might be difficult and I asked what she suggested. She told me she wanted to get back to me after she saw my written reply to the legal letter.

I left my written reply yesterday at the office and emailed it to her this morning. Today at our meeting she came back to the issue of the difficulties to continue working together. She also pointed out that the chairman was responsible for the mistake not her. She continued that it was clear from my response that I only was looking at what was best for the company. She though that I could make a good job somewhere else. I continued on the same line and added that I saw no other solution than continuing working together due to the bad job market. The only available job was at one of our owners. After some back and forth I also mentioned that I saw no other option than continuing as I was not prepared to take the economic consequences of resigning. She told me that the company might be able to help with that but she would need a couple of days to come up with an offer. I really look forward to seeing her offer. To be continued...
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: RyanAtTanagra on June 15, 2020, 10:32:46 AM
An update:
I have had two chats with my boss and a couple of ones with my union. In the first chat we concluded that she didn’t have the same trust in me as previously and I concluded that it had also affected my trust for her. She also told that she saw that it would be difficult to continue working together with the lack of trust on both sides and asked how I looked at it. I told her that I thought we should continue working as previously because now I realised there was a possibility that they would buy me out. If I can walk away with X months of salary I will be pleased to play the lets continue as normally-play. She told me that might be difficult and I asked what she suggested. She told me she wanted to get back to me after she saw my written reply to the legal letter.

I left my written reply yesterday at the office and emailed it to her this morning. Today at our meeting she came back to the issue of the difficulties to continue working together. She also pointed out that the chairman was responsible for the mistake not her. She continued that it was clear from my response that I only was looking at what was best for the company. She though that I could make a good job somewhere else. I continued on the same line and added that I saw no other solution than continuing working together due to the bad job market. The only available job was at one of our owners. After some back and forth I also mentioned that I saw no other option than continuing as I was not prepared to take the economic consequences of resigning. She told me that the company might be able to help with that but she would need a couple of days to come up with an offer. I really look forward to seeing her offer. To be continued...

Way to play your cards right!  Looking forward to the follow up.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Dicey on June 15, 2020, 11:12:15 AM
Nice job. Thanks for the edit on the original post, it really did make the situation much easier to follow. The mustachian who started their own practice recently is @ReadySetMillionaire. It took me a while to remember, because RSM's not been posting as frequently lately. Maybe he'll see this bat signal, so I won't include any spoilers,  lol.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Greenback Reproduction Specialist on June 15, 2020, 11:45:04 AM
An update:
I have had two chats with my boss and a couple of ones with my union. In the first chat we concluded that she didn’t have the same trust in me as previously and I concluded that it had also affected my trust for her. She also told that she saw that it would be difficult to continue working together with the lack of trust on both sides and asked how I looked at it. I told her that I thought we should continue working as previously because now I realised there was a possibility that they would buy me out. If I can walk away with X months of salary I will be pleased to play the lets continue as normally-play. She told me that might be difficult and I asked what she suggested. She told me she wanted to get back to me after she saw my written reply to the legal letter.

I left my written reply yesterday at the office and emailed it to her this morning. Today at our meeting she came back to the issue of the difficulties to continue working together. She also pointed out that the chairman was responsible for the mistake not her. She continued that it was clear from my response that I only was looking at what was best for the company. She though that I could make a good job somewhere else. I continued on the same line and added that I saw no other solution than continuing working together due to the bad job market. The only available job was at one of our owners. After some back and forth I also mentioned that I saw no other option than continuing as I was not prepared to take the economic consequences of resigning. She told me that the company might be able to help with that but she would need a couple of days to come up with an offer. I really look forward to her offer. To be continued...

Very nicely done!! :thumbs up
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: RWTL on June 15, 2020, 04:33:40 PM
I had a fuck you moment with my boss today. I was supposed to take the notes today at the company annual meeting and a board meeting. Yesterday, I realised that they had made a procedural mistake in the process as a result of that the meeting was made digital due to Corona. The rules that guide the annual meetings are really strict and if you don’t follow them it can make the decisions  invalid. I found it out accidentally so I outlined the problem to my boss at a meeting yesterday but she didn’t see it as a problem.

I could not let it go so I spent some more time doing research and  half of the night thinking about it and came to the conclusion that I could not go to the meeting and pretend everything is ok. There is a point in the meeting agenda were the ask if the board has invited everyone correctly..  I talked to another lawyer this morning and we found a way to do it so it would tick all the legal boxes by changing the setup. My boss had a talk with the chairman of the board that is formally responsible for the meeting and they had decided to proceed in a way that partly hides the problem. Their solution could have solved the problem if they had documented the decision but it would have forced them to admit the mistake. Her concluding remark was that the chairman had decided that they would do like that.

So i told her that I could not take the notes as I could not sit there and pretend that everything is ok from a legal point of view. I told her that it would feel wrong and unethical. I suggested that a colleague could jump in and take the notes if it was ok to her.

 She hates to admit mistakes and look bad in front of the board but she also says she can’t stand when people lie. I don’t understand how she explains this to herself. The funny thing is that we had a workshop about conflictsolving and resolution yesterday before this shit blew up. I could conclude to a colleague today that we had a conflict of values.

She avoided everybody after the meetings today so it will be interesting to see her approach tomorrow. Legally she can’t fire me and I would guess she didn’t want this to blow up in her face so I am not worried about losing my job. She doesn’t like conflicts so my guess is we will have a talk and then she will pretend that this never happaned. Me, I am pretty tired already after 7 months at this place so I am pretty much prepared to leave after my three months long notice with a bullshit reason. I have been thinking about starting my own law practice but within a years time when I have more money saved. I have money for a year without a salary. It is in stocks and cash but it is difficult to predict what the effects will be of this current Corona-crisis. I could probably find a new job without problems but I am tired of corporate bs and bosses and would prefer to be my own.

Edited to make it less rambling.

Always good to take actions that help you sleep at night.   I'm glad you have options to carry you on the the next job if this doesn't work out.

Yes, it is nice to have options. She gave me a speech today of how she has less trust in me as I had put the reputation of the company in jeopardy and caused trouble for her and my colleague. I will apologize to my colleague tomorrow for putting her in a difficult spot but I knew that she was totally capable to pull it off. I also got a legal letter that notified me that she thought I had violated my work contract by refusing doing a task and that was in breech with my loyalty duty to the company as it could have damaged the owners picture of the company. It should be read that it could have damaged the picture of her.

And by that action she pretty much guaranteed that she will get my letter of resignation. I haven't decided if she will get it right before her vacation starts or after I am back from my vacation. Probably after my vacation because by postponing it until the end of august I can sock away about 6-8 months of expenses during my period of notice. July-August will basically be vacation time. It will also allow me to explore some connections before deciding if I want be self-employed or not.

We will have a new conversation tomorrow were I will probably express my lack of trust in her after giving me this letter. She will probably get a letter stating my disappointment of the legal letter as I only followed my ethical compass and could not bring myself to brake my code of honor. :) It can be nice to have for the record and it would be nice if it led to a buyout but that is too much to hope for. I have to admit that I got pissed when I got the letter but now I am more amused by her play. I think it will get consequences that she has not thought about. I am grateful that I bought less apartment that I could afford and that I have a lot of savings. I probably would not have been as amused about this as I am if that had not been the case.

An update:
I have had two chats with my boss and a couple of ones with my union. In the first chat we concluded that she didn’t have the same trust in me as previously and I concluded that it had also affected my trust for her. She also told that she saw that it would be difficult to continue working together with the lack of trust on both sides and asked how I looked at it. I told her that I thought we should continue working as previously because now I realised there was a possibility that they would buy me out. If I can walk away with X months of salary I will be pleased to play the lets continue as normally-play. She told me that might be difficult and I asked what she suggested. She told me she wanted to get back to me after she saw my written reply to the legal letter.

I left my written reply yesterday at the office and emailed it to her this morning. Today at our meeting she came back to the issue of the difficulties to continue working together. She also pointed out that the chairman was responsible for the mistake not her. She continued that it was clear from my response that I only was looking at what was best for the company. She though that I could make a good job somewhere else. I continued on the same line and added that I saw no other solution than continuing working together due to the bad job market. The only available job was at one of our owners. After some back and forth I also mentioned that I saw no other option than continuing as I was not prepared to take the economic consequences of resigning. She told me that the company might be able to help with that but she would need a couple of days to come up with an offer. I really look forward to seeing her offer. To be continued...

Nice.  Can't wait to hear how this turns out.  Good luck.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: BuffaloStache on June 15, 2020, 08:44:45 PM
I've been on these forums for a while and only just found this thread. So inspirational and awesome to read these stories- thanks!

I don't have a big FU story, but a mini one. At my old company, I legitimately think I was the first male employee to take full advantage (3 months) of FMLA paternity leave (US unpaid family leave allowance) when my first child was born. My direct boss was supportive, but my department head, VP, HR reps, and others couldn't seem to understand why a male would want to take that time off. I kept getting incredulous looks and questions like "you know the leave is unpaid, right"? "Are you and your family going to be ok during this time"? It was amazing.

The best part about the whole thing was that the company's vacation accrual "cap" policy was so high that I had been able to save up ahead of time and got ~50% of the paternity leave paid for with vacation time. Many people also seemed dumbfounded that either A) I had the discipline/preparation to have that much vacation built up {asked by the few people I knew who always blew through their vacation time early each year}, or B) That I would actually burn through that much vacation time in one, solid chunk {asked by the majority of people that were actively losing vacation time because they were at the cap}... What else is vacation time for? 
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: ReadySetMillionaire on June 16, 2020, 09:13:25 AM
Nice job. Thanks for the edit on the original post, it really did make the situation much easier to follow. The mustachian who started their own practice recently is @ReadySetMillionaire. It took me a while to remember, because RSM's not been posting as frequently lately. Maybe he'll see this bat signal, so I won't include any spoilers,  lol.

PM with any solo practice questions; I'll provide an update in my thread here soon.

Cheers!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Zaga on June 16, 2020, 01:48:58 PM
I've been on these forums for a while and only just found this thread. So inspirational and awesome to read these stories- thanks!

I don't have a big FU story, but a mini one. At my old company, I legitimately think I was the first male employee to take full advantage (3 months) of FMLA paternity leave (US unpaid family leave allowance) when my first child was born. My direct boss was supportive, but my department head, VP, HR reps, and others couldn't seem to understand why a male would want to take that time off. I kept getting incredulous looks and questions like "you know the leave is unpaid, right"? "Are you and your family going to be ok during this time"? It was amazing.

The best part about the whole thing was that the company's vacation accrual "cap" policy was so high that I had been able to save up ahead of time and got ~50% of the paternity leave paid for with vacation time. Many people also seemed dumbfounded that either A) I had the discipline/preparation to have that much vacation built up {asked by the few people I knew who always blew through their vacation time early each year}, or B) That I would actually burn through that much vacation time in one, solid chunk {asked by the majority of people that were actively losing vacation time because they were at the cap}... What else is vacation time for?
That awesome, you've set a new precedent!  I bet there's a younger person there, male or female, who will have seen what you did and think that maybe when they have kids that their family can do the same.  So WTG!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Freedomin5 on June 17, 2020, 12:41:04 PM
Just a small story...

For the past three days, my boss asked me to help out with a client facing role in a new process. I have several coworkers, but I got picked because I’m bilingual.  It turns out that it involves being shouted at for an hour by clients. The first day was bad as the kinks hadn’t been worked out. I was told that they were working on a new plan and Day 2 would be better. The second day was bad too. After Day 2, I was told that they were implementing a new plan and Day 3 would be better. Yesterday was the third day, and it was the worst day ever for the process. I was screamed at by an irate customer (whom I just tuned out after the first 10 seconds). So at the end of the day, I told my boss that I quit that particular role. I’m not going to lose my job over this small insubordination (because the other person doing this role also quit the role after yesterday), but FU money means that I don’t feel the need to do everything the higher ups ask of me, especially if it involves having nightmares afterwards and waking up at 2 AM and not being able to sleep again.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: shadesofgreen on June 17, 2020, 12:43:45 PM
Just a small story...

For the past three days, my boss asked me to help out with a client facing role in a new process. I have several coworkers, but I got picked because I’m bilingual.  It turns out that it involves being shouted at for an hour by clients. The first day was bad as the kinks hadn’t been worked out. I was told that they were working on a new plan and Day 2 would be better. The second day was bad too. After Day 2, I was told that they were implementing a new plan and Day 3 would be better. Yesterday was the third day, and it was the worst day ever for the process. I was screamed at by an irate customer (whom I just tuned out after the first 10 seconds). So at the end of the day, I told my boss that I quit that particular role. I’m not going to lose my job over this small insubordination (because the other person doing this role also quit the role after yesterday), but FU money means that I don’t feel the need to do everything the higher ups ask of me, especially if it involves having nightmares afterwards and waking up at 2 AM and not being able to sleep again.

That just sounds horrible all the way around.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Taran Wanderer on June 17, 2020, 01:20:33 PM
Sounds like your boss needs to fire the customer.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: SwordGuy on June 17, 2020, 01:20:56 PM
Just a small story...

For the past three days, my boss asked me to help out with a client facing role in a new process. I have several coworkers, but I got picked because I’m bilingual.  It turns out that it involves being shouted at for an hour by clients. The first day was bad as the kinks hadn’t been worked out. I was told that they were working on a new plan and Day 2 would be better. The second day was bad too. After Day 2, I was told that they were implementing a new plan and Day 3 would be better. Yesterday was the third day, and it was the worst day ever for the process. I was screamed at by an irate customer (whom I just tuned out after the first 10 seconds). So at the end of the day, I told my boss that I quit that particular role. I’m not going to lose my job over this small insubordination (because the other person doing this role also quit the role after yesterday), but FU money means that I don’t feel the need to do everything the higher ups ask of me, especially if it involves having nightmares afterwards and waking up at 2 AM and not being able to sleep again.


One way to disarm the screaming is to quietly say, "Sir.  Sir.  Sir.  Sir.   Sir.   Sir." and repeat until they stop screaming for a bit.

Then look them straight in the eye and say, "There are only two people in this conversation who care about what you need to have happen.  And one of them is about to lose interest."    Smile for one brief second.   That special smile that isn't a sunny smile, it's not a smirk, it's a FU smile that shows you don't need them, they need you.   And then say nothing more until they decide whether they want to be helped or they want to scream.   If they want to keep screaming, you pick up your stuff, with the comment, "I remain committed to help you in a calm, polite, professional manner.   Let me know when you would like to begin."   And gently walk out the door.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: RyanAtTanagra on June 17, 2020, 01:53:57 PM
"I remain committed to help you in a calm, polite, professional manner.   Let me know when you would like to begin."   And gently walk out the door.

Ooooh, I'm saving that one for future potential use.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: solon on June 17, 2020, 01:55:19 PM
"I remain committed to help you in a calm, polite, professional manner.   Let me know when you would like to begin."   And gently walk out the door.

Ooooh, I'm saving that one for future potential use.

This works great on children throwing a tantrum, too!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Freedomin5 on June 17, 2020, 01:58:31 PM
Just a small story...

For the past three days, my boss asked me to help out with a client facing role in a new process. I have several coworkers, but I got picked because I’m bilingual.  It turns out that it involves being shouted at for an hour by clients. The first day was bad as the kinks hadn’t been worked out. I was told that they were working on a new plan and Day 2 would be better. The second day was bad too. After Day 2, I was told that they were implementing a new plan and Day 3 would be better. Yesterday was the third day, and it was the worst day ever for the process. I was screamed at by an irate customer (whom I just tuned out after the first 10 seconds). So at the end of the day, I told my boss that I quit that particular role. I’m not going to lose my job over this small insubordination (because the other person doing this role also quit the role after yesterday), but FU money means that I don’t feel the need to do everything the higher ups ask of me, especially if it involves having nightmares afterwards and waking up at 2 AM and not being able to sleep again.


One way to disarm the screaming is to quietly say, "Sir.  Sir.  Sir.  Sir.   Sir.   Sir." and repeat until they stop screaming for a bit.

Then look them straight in the eye and say, "There are only two people in this conversation who care about what you need to have happen.  And one of them is about to lose interest."    Smile for one brief second.   That special smile that isn't a sunny smile, it's not a smirk, it's a FU smile that shows you don't need them, they need you.   And then say nothing more until they decide whether they want to be helped or they want to scream.   If they want to keep screaming, you pick up your stuff, with the comment, "I remain committed to help you in a calm, polite, professional manner.   Let me know when you would like to begin."   And gently walk out the door.

I was going to say that I’ll report back to let you know if that tactic is transferable to Chinese culture, but then I realized I can’t because I quit that role. :D
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Plina on June 17, 2020, 02:09:03 PM
Thank you everyone for the support. I will get back with an update when I get an offer. Today, the boss pretended that everything is normal so obviously it helps to know she might get rid of me. :-) Due to a holiday on friday, I expect her to get back to me next week.


Nice job. Thanks for the edit on the original post, it really did make the situation much easier to follow. The mustachian who started their own practice recently is @ReadySetMillionaire. It took me a while to remember, because RSM's not been posting as frequently lately. Maybe he'll see this bat signal, so I won't include any spoilers,  lol.

PM with any solo practice questions; I'll provide an update in my thread here soon.

Cheers!

Thanks for the offer, I will probably take you up on your offer when my road forwards is more clear.

I read your whole thread yesterday evening and got so many ideas from you and the others. I have been reading the E-myth for attorneys today.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Chris Pascale on June 17, 2020, 02:20:49 PM
In the first chat we concluded that she didn’t have the same trust in me as previously and I concluded that it had also affected my trust for her.

So glad you were able to say this to her.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: bbqbonelesswing on June 17, 2020, 02:37:38 PM
One way to disarm the screaming is to quietly say, "Sir.  Sir.  Sir.  Sir.   Sir.   Sir." and repeat until they stop screaming for a bit.

Then look them straight in the eye and say, "There are only two people in this conversation who care about what you need to have happen.  And one of them is about to lose interest."    Smile for one brief second.   That special smile that isn't a sunny smile, it's not a smirk, it's a FU smile that shows you don't need them, they need you.   And then say nothing more until they decide whether they want to be helped or they want to scream.   If they want to keep screaming, you pick up your stuff, with the comment, "I remain committed to help you in a calm, polite, professional manner.   Let me know when you would like to begin."   And gently walk out the door.

Amen. I've been in customer-facing roles most of my career. Been yelled at a lot. I don't tolerate it- if you want to yell, I'm hanging up. There is no excuse for speaking to another person in that kind of manner. Thankfully I work for a company with the same values, and we are encouraged to fire customers (within reason) if they are costing us more than they're worth. But if you don't work for a company like that, it's always nice to have that FU money to fall back on. Otherwise being treated like that can really eat at you.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: BicycleB on June 17, 2020, 08:12:30 PM
Just a small story...

For the past three days, my boss asked me to help out with a client facing role in a new process. I have several coworkers, but I got picked because I’m bilingual.  It turns out that it involves being shouted at for an hour by clients. The first day was bad as the kinks hadn’t been worked out. I was told that they were working on a new plan and Day 2 would be better. The second day was bad too. After Day 2, I was told that they were implementing a new plan and Day 3 would be better. Yesterday was the third day, and it was the worst day ever for the process. I was screamed at by an irate customer (whom I just tuned out after the first 10 seconds). So at the end of the day, I told my boss that I quit that particular role. I’m not going to lose my job over this small insubordination (because the other person doing this role also quit the role after yesterday), but FU money means that I don’t feel the need to do everything the higher ups ask of me, especially if it involves having nightmares afterwards and waking up at 2 AM and not being able to sleep again.


One way to disarm the screaming is to quietly say, "Sir.  Sir.  Sir.  Sir.   Sir.   Sir." and repeat until they stop screaming for a bit.

Then look them straight in the eye and say, "There are only two people in this conversation who care about what you need to have happen.  And one of them is about to lose interest."    Smile for one brief second.   That special smile that isn't a sunny smile, it's not a smirk, it's a FU smile that shows you don't need them, they need you.   And then say nothing more until they decide whether they want to be helped or they want to scream.   If they want to keep screaming, you pick up your stuff, with the comment, "I remain committed to help you in a calm, polite, professional manner.   Let me know when you would like to begin."   And gently walk out the door.

I was going to say that I’ll report back to let you know if that tactic is transferable to Chinese culture, but then I realized I can’t because I quit that role. :D

LOL
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Freedomin5 on June 19, 2020, 09:33:32 AM
Just a small story...

For the past three days, my boss asked me to help out with a client facing role in a new process. I have several coworkers, but I got picked because I’m bilingual.  It turns out that it involves being shouted at for an hour by clients. The first day was bad as the kinks hadn’t been worked out. I was told that they were working on a new plan and Day 2 would be better. The second day was bad too. After Day 2, I was told that they were implementing a new plan and Day 3 would be better. Yesterday was the third day, and it was the worst day ever for the process. I was screamed at by an irate customer (whom I just tuned out after the first 10 seconds). So at the end of the day, I told my boss that I quit that particular role. I’m not going to lose my job over this small insubordination (because the other person doing this role also quit the role after yesterday), but FU money means that I don’t feel the need to do everything the higher ups ask of me, especially if it involves having nightmares afterwards and waking up at 2 AM and not being able to sleep again.


One way to disarm the screaming is to quietly say, "Sir.  Sir.  Sir.  Sir.   Sir.   Sir." and repeat until they stop screaming for a bit.

Then look them straight in the eye and say, "There are only two people in this conversation who care about what you need to have happen.  And one of them is about to lose interest."    Smile for one brief second.   That special smile that isn't a sunny smile, it's not a smirk, it's a FU smile that shows you don't need them, they need you.   And then say nothing more until they decide whether they want to be helped or they want to scream.   If they want to keep screaming, you pick up your stuff, with the comment, "I remain committed to help you in a calm, polite, professional manner.   Let me know when you would like to begin."   And gently walk out the door.

I was going to say that I’ll report back to let you know if that tactic is transferable to Chinese culture, but then I realized I can’t because I quit that role. :D

LOL

I’m happy to say that they ended up revamping the entire process so that no one needs to be subjected to that torture every again!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: markbike528CBX on June 19, 2020, 04:32:44 PM
Just a small story...

For the past three days, my boss asked me to help out with a client facing role in a new process. I have several coworkers, but I got picked because I’m bilingual.  It turns out that it involves being shouted at for an hour by clients. The first day was bad as the kinks hadn’t been worked out. I was told that they were working on a new plan and Day 2 would be better. The second day was bad too. After Day 2, I was told that they were implementing a new plan and Day 3 would be better. Yesterday was the third day, and it was the worst day ever for the process. I was screamed at by an irate customer (whom I just tuned out after the first 10 seconds). So at the end of the day, I told my boss that I quit that particular role. I’m not going to lose my job over this small insubordination (because the other person doing this role also quit the role after yesterday), but FU money means that I don’t feel the need to do everything the higher ups ask of me, especially if it involves having nightmares afterwards and waking up at 2 AM and not being able to sleep again.


One way to disarm the screaming is to quietly say, "Sir.  Sir.  Sir.  Sir.   Sir.   Sir." and repeat until they stop screaming for a bit.

Then look them straight in the eye and say, "There are only two people in this conversation who care about what you need to have happen.  And one of them is about to lose interest."    Smile for one brief second.   That special smile that isn't a sunny smile, it's not a smirk, it's a FU smile that shows you don't need them, they need you.   And then say nothing more until they decide whether they want to be helped or they want to scream.   If they want to keep screaming, you pick up your stuff, with the comment, "I remain committed to help you in a calm, polite, professional manner.   Let me know when you would like to begin."   And gently walk out the door.

I was going to say that I’ll report back to let you know if that tactic is transferable to Chinese culture, but then I realized I can’t because I quit that role. :D

LOL

I’m happy to say that they ended up revamping the entire process so that no one needs to be subjected to that torture every again!

The power of FU money (and some stones by your coworker who also said "enough").
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: fuzzy math on June 21, 2020, 10:15:28 AM
Plina, looking forward to hearing the next steps this week! This is truly epic to witness as it happens.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Plina on June 22, 2020, 11:15:15 AM
In the first chat we concluded that she didn’t have the same trust in me as previously and I concluded that it had also affected my trust for her.

So glad you were able to say this to her.

I was pretty pissed at her and I knew there was not much she could do legally.



Plina, looking forward to hearing the next steps this week! This is truly epic to witness as it happens.

Thanks! Today, in our daily meeting that was concluded in about 5 minutes, she wanted to talk about "the other issue". She had come to the conclusion that if I didn't  want to quit she could terminate my employment either due to "personal reasons" or due to "lack of work". I would be excused from working during my notice period of three months and I would also get some additional months of salary. Personal reasons is out of question as it is used if the employee have screwed up in some way and it would also punish me if I want to have unemployment benefits and insurance. I am not going to take the shit for this. Lack of work is an interesting excuse as we have recently hired people and you have a right to be rehired if there is a need to hire within a certain period. They have prepped everything for hiring a couple of more people. But as an employer you don't really have to show the lack of work. So either she had googled the options and taken the first response or her HR-advisor is really bad.

She also wondered if I wanted the union to do the negotiation, which I would have guessed was her preference due to her pained expression when I suggested that she would present me with a written proposal that I could consider and take to the union for review. The union has negotiators and lawyers that can negotiate on my behalf but after a talk with them I decided to go this route at least for now.

My guess is that she offers between 3-6 months plus the "no work" during the notice period, which would mean between 6-9 months of extra pay. I would guess that she doesn't want me to get back after my vacation in July-august but I will probably suggest that I work from home a week more to be able to do a nice handover to someone. But I will be prepping everything including a goodbye email to everyone in the projects that I am working in so I don't leave everything in a mess for them as the circle of people that work in the field is small and I don't want to burn any bridges. I have a bs reason for leaving and I would be pretty happy with getting paid for 6 months as I was prepared to resign and I haven't even worked 8 months in this place. I can live with that amount for more than a year without problems.

She is going to get back to me with a written proposal. As she is going on a three weeks vacation next Friday I would guess that she wants this to be finished before that but I am not in a hurry as I will go on a four week vacation in four weeks time. I would prefer that my notice period didn't start before august. The show goes on...
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: BicycleB on June 23, 2020, 01:14:10 PM
Way to go @Plina, negotiating like a champ!

I love the way you keep checking your options, deciding the best path and then following it perfectly.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: fuzzy math on June 23, 2020, 01:17:56 PM
I still can't believe your boss is going to be allowed to waste so much company money getting rid of you just to save face on her end. If this ever comes out she will likely be fired over it.

I hope you can sneak by to your September goal date.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: BNgarden on June 23, 2020, 02:19:26 PM
I still can't believe your boss is going to be allowed to waste so much company money getting rid of you just to save face on her end. If this ever comes out she will likely be fired over it.

I hope you can sneak by to your September goal date.

^^^  I also can't believe she's going this route, and hope you get all you desire from a departure.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Plina on June 23, 2020, 11:25:00 PM
I still can't believe your boss is going to be allowed to waste so much company money getting rid of you just to save face on her end. If this ever comes out she will likely be fired over it.

I hope you can sneak by to your September goal date.

^^^  I also can't believe she's going this route, and hope you get all you desire from a departure.

Because of some company specific reasons she can hide it in the current budget but there  will probably be a lot of talk when I don’t get back after the vacation. She is the CEO so my guess it she will hide it from the board. My story will probably be that I realised it was not the workplace for me so after a talk with my boss we decided that it was best if I ended it during the summer. Due to the difficulties to fire workers it is normal to be bought out if you want to get rid of people. CEO though, don’t have that protection. I don’t know how our board views it though.

I got an offer yesterday with the three months of no work during the notice period plus an extra month of pay. During those three months I would still be employed and receive all my benefits but excused from needing to work during 15/7 to 15/10. It also means that I don’t need to take out any vacation so I can get it payed out in october which is a half month of pay extra. Then I would get an additional months salary without the benefits. I have no limitations in accepting a new job during that period and even if I did I will still get everything.

I realised after some reflection that she can’t give me more than totally 5 months without it going over her limit of signing contracts. If it goes over that she have to take it to the board and then we get a lot of unknowns in to play. So I will tell her that I will sign the deal if I get 2 months salary in addition to the notice period. The offer was less then I hoped but ok according to the union due to my short employment at the company. I would  probably not get more if I would take it further and frankly I have already closed this door in my mind.

I talked to a career coach yesterday that was offered by my university for alumni and the talk made it pretty clear that it is not the place for me anyway so I will try to cut my losses. With 5 months of salary I can live up to a year and after those 5 months I could get unemployment benefits that would get me 80 % of my salary during 6 months and less thereafter during another 6 months. But if nothing REALLY interesting come up during the summer I will announce the launch of my own company in the end of august after using part of summer preparing that.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Dicey on June 23, 2020, 11:37:49 PM
Wow! Way to go. @Plina! That's making lemonade out of lemons. Hopefully she agrees to your counter.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: former player on June 24, 2020, 02:03:11 AM
You sound as though you are completely on top of this.  Best of luck in the remaining negotiations although I don't think you need it - you are head and shoulders above the CEO.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: lemanfan on June 24, 2020, 03:55:01 AM
Way to go @Plina, negotiating like a champ!

I love the way you keep checking your options, deciding the best path and then following it perfectly.

I have to agree, well executed.  My guess is that we are living if not in the same country, then at least under very similar rules and culture of business, and your way of doing things is probably the best I've heard of so far in similar situations  :) 
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: NorthernMonkey on June 24, 2020, 06:26:31 AM
5 months full pay seems a good deal. I'd accept and move on.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: GreenToTheCore on June 24, 2020, 01:15:10 PM
Way to go @Plina, negotiating like a champ!

I love the way you keep checking your options, deciding the best path and then following it perfectly.

I have to agree, well executed.  My guess is that we are living if not in the same country, then at least under very similar rules and culture of business, and your way of doing things is probably the best I've heard of so far in similar situations  :)

Piling on.
I am so impressed with and thankful that you're sharing your approach with us. Saving this in case I need an example to reference in the future...
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Plina on June 24, 2020, 03:07:17 PM
Way to go @Plina, negotiating like a champ!

I love the way you keep checking your options, deciding the best path and then following it perfectly.

I have to agree, well executed.  My guess is that we are living if not in the same country, then at least under very similar rules and culture of business, and your way of doing things is probably the best I've heard of so far in similar situations  :)

Thanks for the encouragement everybody!

@lemanfan - We live in the same country.

We have reached an agreement and I got my 5 months! I was looking at the tax implications this morning and realized that the final payments of vacation time and two months of salaries would be taxed with 54 %. Ouch! In the end the tax will not be higher than normally if I don't start a new job. I will get it back as a tax refund but I took that knowledge to my boss and told that more than half of my pay would disappear in taxes so I would not receive even close as much as I would normally. Instead I would receive about 2/3 after tax of what I would receive normally. So I suggested that we would make it two months of pay so I would receive about 1,5 or little less of my normal pay.  She did some mental calculations and probably came to the conclusion that was within here signing limit and we had a deal.

I also got included some extra time that is normally included in my pay so that was about two more days of pay. We concluded the deal with a discussion about the non disclosure part that was a bit unclear and I happened to suggest a broader circle that would get knowledge of the deal than in the suggestion, as in the whole company. She got the wording clarified and suggested that we should keep the original version were only we have the knowledge of the agreement because she doesn't want to set a precedent within the company (that if you piss of the boss you get paid to leave). I agreed to her version because I also want to keep the agreement secret for outsiders. I prefer that they wonder or think that I have the financial means to not give a shit and leave because it was not a good fit. Officially, we will tell that we have come to a mutual agreement that the role was not a good fit for me and I will leave now before we go into a new phase in the company. Were she added that was even the truth. Not quite my view of the things but .... :)

That was followed by a really strange conversation as I suggested that the signing could be made digitally so that we could tell the news to my colleagues on Friday before some of them go on vacation. The paper thing would take some days as it would need to be sent by post as we work from home. She saw a problem with that because the signing software had been transfered to a colleague (after I pissed her off) and she didn't want her to know about it. To which I concluded that the colleague would be the one to make the payments, as that and other financial stuff is her responsibility, so she would get the knowledge anyway. So hopefully tomorrow I will get the agreement for signing.

I have 14 workdays left so during that time I will be transferring all my projects to someone else and writing a paper as a goodbye gift to a group that I am part of. I promised to deliver it before I went on vacation. Unfortunately, I will not be able to take part of the discussion of the paper. I am also co-heading a group with a couple of subgroups so my co-head will get a nasty surprise when he is back from his vacation. I have been the figurehead of the group as I have done most of the admin and held most of the meetings. I have also had my fingers in someway in most of pots in the company so I think someone is going to need to use a lot more external lawyers in the future or hire a new lawyer. In my field it is not that easy, as there are not enough senior lawyers. I also need to give back my computer, phone and keys before the end of August. I will be out of town until the middle of august or maybe longer so it was not practical to do it before if I don't send them in. She thought it would be good to have a farewell party in august for me (if that is what I want) and I could hand over the stuff then.

The countdown has started...
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: okits on June 24, 2020, 03:18:05 PM
Congratulations, @Plina .  I agree with others that you handled this very shrewdly.  I hope it wasn't too stressful for you.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Dicey on June 24, 2020, 04:14:25 PM
What a journey this has turned into. I can't wait to hear what happens next. I hope you use your time off well and when you're ready, land a great new job. I believe that word will seep out that you made a moral stand and others will come searching for you.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Plina on June 24, 2020, 11:18:35 PM
Congratulations, @Plina .  I agree with others that you handled this very shrewdly.  I hope it wasn't too stressful for you.

Thanks, @okits. It has actually been pretty amusing. The reason I have been able to look at this from a more amused perspective is that I have FU-money and don’t feel that my actions would put my financial life in jeopardy. I am realy grateful that I don’t live paycheck to paycheck because then I doubt that I would see it amusing in the same way.

What a journey this has turned into. I can't wait to hear what happens next. I hope you use your time off well and when you're ready, land a great new job. I believe that word will seep out that you made a moral stand and others will come searching for you.

Thanks @Dicey! I will take the rest of july off and spend it with family. Thereafter I will start the preparations for my own company if nothing really interesting has come up.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Plina on June 26, 2020, 11:30:14 AM
The agreement was signed yesterday and my colleagues got the news today. My boss told that I am leaving and that we have come to a mutual agreement that I will work my last day the 14 th of july. I hand over my stuff in August and we will have a goodbyeevent. Not any happy faces among the colleagues. We have had our first meeting about the upcoming handovers to those that are to take over my duties. I will start spreading the news about my departure.

I asked the colleague that I am closest if the boss had said anything as she called immediately after the announcement. According to her the boss had not told anything even though she had openly asked if anything had happened due to the strange mood that has been in some of the meetings. The boss had not given any reply.

11 days left to freedom...
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: AlanStache on June 26, 2020, 11:37:50 AM
The agreement was signed yesterday and my colleagues got the news today. My boss told that I am leaving and that we have come to a mutual agreement that I will work my last day the 14 th of july. I hand over my stuff in August and we will have a goodbyeevent. Not any happy faces among the colleagues. We have had our first meeting about the upcoming handovers to those that are to take over my duties. I will start spreading the news about my departure.

I asked the colleague that I am closest if the boss had said anything as she called immediately after the announcement. According to her the boss had not told anything even though she had openly asked if anything had happened due to the strange mood that has been in some of the meetings. The boss had not given any reply.

11 days left to freedom...

Awesome!  Not sure where you are in the world but I think a Hawaiian shirt would be appropriate last day attire.  Dont forget to slick work electronics of personal stuff.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Plina on June 26, 2020, 12:13:53 PM
The agreement was signed yesterday and my colleagues got the news today. My boss told that I am leaving and that we have come to a mutual agreement that I will work my last day the 14 th of july. I hand over my stuff in August and we will have a goodbyeevent. Not any happy faces among the colleagues. We have had our first meeting about the upcoming handovers to those that are to take over my duties. I will start spreading the news about my departure.

I asked the colleague that I am closest if the boss had said anything as she called immediately after the announcement. According to her the boss had not told anything even though she had openly asked if anything had happened due to the strange mood that has been in some of the meetings. The boss had not given any reply.

11 days left to freedom...

Awesome!  Not sure where you are in the world but I think a Hawaiian shirt would be appropriate last day attire.  Dont forget to slick work electronics of personal stuff.

The last workday will be from home but I will probably put on flipflops when I go in to hand over the electronics in August. To buy an hawaiian shirt for one occasion would be unmustachian.  ;-)

I always leave empty electronics when I leave. I also wipe the phone and set the phone to original settings. The cleaning process has started.

Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: BicycleB on June 26, 2020, 05:59:05 PM
Way to go, Plina!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: talltexan on July 01, 2020, 08:13:25 AM
I don't know if they're open in your area, but I've had pretty good success building out a Hawaiian shirt collection with some pieces in the single-digit range by checking out thrift shops.

When I realized my previous job would be ending, I started wearing Hawaiian shirts into the office every day, and made it three consecutive weeks without a repeat. I'd encourage you to buck up and spend $6-$9 to add the Hawaiian shirt to your look when you turn in your electronics.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Plina on July 01, 2020, 10:02:20 AM
I don't know if they're open in your area, but I've had pretty good success building out a Hawaiian shirt collection with some pieces in the single-digit range by checking out thrift shops.

When I realized my previous job would be ending, I started wearing Hawaiian shirts into the office every day, and made it three consecutive weeks without a repeat. I'd encourage you to buck up and spend $6-$9 to add the Hawaiian shirt to your look when you turn in your electronics.

Stores are open but I don’t actually know if you would find Hawaiian shirts there. They feel more like a masquerade stuff here and for males. I will skip that part. ;-)

I have been baffling people today as I have emailed a couple people in a project that I am taking part in that I will leave in the middle of july. One of them gratulated me for my new position and wondered if she could ask were I was going. I felt pretty bad for her when I emailed her back that I didn’t have a new workplace lined up but I would take the summer to figure out the next step. I told her and her colleague that I would probably go back to consulting. They are working in one of our owner companies and I know the guy left his previous employer due to some disagreement and started his own consulting company and now has some kind of consulting agreement with the owner company.

I also told another acquitance that I lunch with regularly and whose legal services my company has been buying, that I would leave the company. I just told her that the work was not for me and she told me that I seamed really optimistic about leaving although I had nothing lined up. :-) I know they have been recruting a couple of months ago so I wanted to put it out there that I was looking for something else in consulting.

It is interesting how you can send out a message, without actually saying that much. :-) To leave a company in the middle of a pandemic and economic downturn without anything else... and by being positive about that...

I have been toying with a business plan and a name for a new company but that I am only sharing that with some people fairly close to me.

Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Plina on July 01, 2020, 10:53:57 AM
Update: I happened to check my workphone before I was going to put it away and I had received an email from the acquitance that I had a lunch with today. She had told her boss that I was on the market for a new job and that we had a really nice collaboration. So they would really like to talk with me about my plans for the future as they are recruiting. I happened to mention during our lunch that I was not interested to work in a firm that thought work was life so she mentioned that they were open for working full- or parttime and they had no problem if you wanted to work from home extensively.

I will have a chat with them and see what comes up. They are the best in the field at what they do as well as nice so they would be one of few companies that could derail my plans for a company of my own at least for a while. It would take my game to the next level.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: former player on July 01, 2020, 12:24:13 PM
Awesome.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: RyanAtTanagra on July 01, 2020, 12:39:39 PM
I happened to mention during our lunch that I was not interested to work in a firm that thought work was life so she mentioned that they were open for working full- or parttime and they had no problem if you wanted to work from home extensively.

Hell yea.  Cheers for being in a position to demand what you want.  That ability is priceless.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: mm1970 on July 01, 2020, 12:41:12 PM
Sweet!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: alcon835 on July 01, 2020, 01:14:19 PM
Update: I happened to check my workphone before I was going to put it away and I had received an email from the acquitance that I had a lunch with today. She had told her boss that I was on the market for a new job and that we had a really nice collaboration. So they would really like to talk with me about my plans for the future as they are recruiting. I happened to mention during our lunch that I was not interested to work in a firm that thought work was life so she mentioned that they were open for working full- or parttime and they had no problem if you wanted to work from home extensively.

I will have a chat with them and see what comes up. They are the best in the field at what they do as well as nice so they would be one of few companies that could derail my plans for a company of my own at least for a while. It would take my game to the next level.

Getting an FU story in real time is the best! Thank you for your story, your ongoing interactions, and your updates!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: AMandM on July 01, 2020, 04:49:00 PM
Getting an FU story in real time is the best! Thank you for your story, your ongoing interactions, and your updates!

This. I am loving this story!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Plina on July 08, 2020, 07:25:50 AM
I had a really interesting Teams-meeting with the owner of the law firm and my acquintance. The owner started basically the meeting with "it is so nice that you are leaving your current employer" in the meaning that now we might be able to hire you. Then she asked why I was leaving and I gave the bad fit speech and also told that I was not in agreement with my boss and when I told that we had come to a disagreement related to legal administrative rules that I could not bend due to being a lawyer she just said "well done Plina". Then the issue of me quitting was out of the world. Our meeting was supposed to be one hour and it ended up being almost two hours of laughter. No talk about references or that other stuff when you don't know the people before hand. I have come in to contact with the owner in my work and in different work related occasions.

I like what the firm stands for and their focus on quality and not being as formal as some firms. Some benefits will not be as good as working for a larger company but that I can live with. They have a person going on maternity leave in the fall so I would have work immediately. We talked preliminary about starting the first of September, which would give me a 6 week vacation before starting. We have not talked about the salary yet but we will have a new chat on Friday. The biggest downside so far is that their office is in the other end of the town but I would only need to go into the office 1-2 days during the week and there was also talk about moving the office to a more central location. It is about 30 minutes bike ride to the office.

So if we can agree on the salary I will have a new job in September. This means that I reduced my time to fire with at least between 6-8 months without taking account my new salary. The funny thing is that most of the people will now believe (if this goes through) that I used my current position to trade myself up to a new and even better position.

Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Raenia on July 08, 2020, 08:00:47 AM
I had a really interesting Teams-meeting with the owner of the law firm and my acquintance. The owner started basically the meeting with "it is so nice that you are leaving your current employer" in the meaning that now we might be able to hire you. Then she asked why I was leaving and I gave the bad fit speech and also told that I was not in agreement with my boss and when I told that we had come to a disagreement related to legal administrative rules that I could not bend due to being a lawyer she just said "well done Plina". Then the issue of me quitting was out of the world. Our meeting was supposed to be one hour and it ended up being almost two hours of laughter. No talk about references or that other stuff when you don't know the people before hand. I have come in to contact with the owner in my work and in different work related occasions.

I like what the firm stands for and their focus on quality and not being as formal as some firms. Some benefits will not be as good as working for a larger company but that I can live with. They have a person going on maternity leave in the fall so I would have work immediately. We talked preliminary about starting the first of September, which would give me a 6 week vacation before starting. We have not talked about the salary yet but we will have a new chat on Friday. The biggest downside so far is that their office is in the other end of the town but I would only need to go into the office 1-2 days during the week and there was also talk about moving the office to a more central location. It is about 30 minutes bike ride to the office.

So if we can agree on the salary I will have a new job in September. This means that I reduced my time to fire with at least between 6-8 months without taking account my new salary. The funny thing is that most of the people will now believe (if this goes through) that I used my current position to trade myself up to a new and even better position.

Good for you, that sounds wonderful!  And hey, in a way you could say you did leverage your old position to trade up - you used your old job to display your commitment to moral/legal action, and that helped you get the new job :)
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: zolotiyeruki on July 08, 2020, 09:09:00 AM
I like what the firm stands for and their focus on quality and not being as formal as some firms. Some benefits will not be as good as working for a larger company but that I can live with. They have a person going on maternity leave in the fall so I would have work immediately. We talked preliminary about starting the first of September, which would give me a 6 week vacation before starting. We have not talked about the salary yet but we will have a new chat on Friday. The biggest downside so far is that their office is in the other end of the town but I would only need to go into the office 1-2 days during the week and there was also talk about moving the office to a more central location. It is about 30 minutes bike ride to the office.
That sounds fantastic, and I hope it works out for you.

One word of caution--I would advise you to not consider the potential office move when deciding whether to work for the new company.  Plans change all the time, and it's far more likely that their office will stay where it is.  I've learned from too many experiences that it's wiser to plan on what is, rather than on what a future (or current) employer says what might come.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Mustachianchlud on July 08, 2020, 09:36:55 AM
MY FU money came in handy at a moment 25 years ago, where I was hired as the credit manager of a regional branch of a national copier company that was floundering - and that was why they needed me, because they could not keep up with the receivables.  The credit department was so overworked, that I would get 80-90 messages per day with NEW problems for my staff of 6 to address, on top of the previous day's, such that by friday I had over 400 messages that I could not return, after spending all week working on last week's 400 problems.  Management was patient, and I was making progress, hiring 4 temps, getting the staff humming as a team, and collecting more money each week, reducing receivables outstanding by 15% in the second month, 25% by the third month on the job, etc.  A real pressure cooker environment.  In month 4 the CFO leaves, leaving me the 2nd highest financial executive in the region, after the comptroller, who has no idea how I do my job.  Then the company hires a general manager VP with no credit experience - fun ensues.  Without any research or understanding of the business situation, he calls a meeting of the department heads and gives a speech to "lay down the law" - including "as of now, all bonuses are cancelled" - so I raise my hand and ask the question:  " Does that include bonuses that are legal obligations under a properly approved employment contract between myself and the company?"   Steam comes out of his ears....and then the HR head confirms in front of the entire management staff that, yes, I am the only one with an employment contract that obligates the company to pay me bonuses if certain targets are met (and I am ahead of those targets already) for the next 2 years....   Then he goes on ... "All vacation time or days off are cancelled for the indefinite future"    I raise my hand:  "I have a day off Friday which was approved months ago by your predecessor for me to participate as best man in a wedding. It is out of town (250 miles away) and I cannot be here Friday"  His response:  "YOU WILL BE IN THE OFFICE THAT FRIDAY"  My response:  "Sorry but that is not possible. I will be out that day"   Steam comes out of his ears again... and he storms out.  After the wedding, I come in bright an early Monday to find he calls me into his office and suspends me.  I am to return to my office and sit there doing nothing.  I read the paper all day, and the next and the next.  The Comptroller is told to do my job too, on top of his own.  The Comptroller begs me to help him handle the weekly conference call with the main office CFO and Credit Manager  who grills him on our progress ... and I answer all their questions.  By the next week, I am reinstated in the job.  But the finances worsen to the point that within a few more months, the situation is hopeless, and I am let go with the comptroller, and the VP, and the region is shut down.  Soon after the entire company files for bankruptcy.  But thanks to my employment contract, and my FU money, I had a helluva fun time pissing off the jerk VP, and became a bit legendary among the company staff - many of whom keep in touch.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Plina on July 08, 2020, 10:00:58 AM
I like what the firm stands for and their focus on quality and not being as formal as some firms. Some benefits will not be as good as working for a larger company but that I can live with. They have a person going on maternity leave in the fall so I would have work immediately. We talked preliminary about starting the first of September, which would give me a 6 week vacation before starting. We have not talked about the salary yet but we will have a new chat on Friday. The biggest downside so far is that their office is in the other end of the town but I would only need to go into the office 1-2 days during the week and there was also talk about moving the office to a more central location. It is about 30 minutes bike ride to the office.
That sounds fantastic, and I hope it works out for you.

One word of caution--I would advise you to not consider the potential office move when deciding whether to work for the new company.  Plans change all the time, and it's far more likely that their office will stay where it is.  I've learned from too many experiences that it's wiser to plan on what is, rather than on what a future (or current) employer says what might come.

Thanks!

I agree with you about the office move. I don’t count with that in my considerations. If they don’t move and I like working there I am prepared to move closer to the office. It is not a big thing to bike there twice a week. The head office is in another city and it would be me and another person working in here so it would not be a major thing to move us as they are renting offices in an office hotel.



So if we can agree on the salary I will have a new job in September. This means that I reduced my time to fire with at least between 6-8 months without taking account my new salary. The funny thing is that most of the people will now believe (if this goes through) that I used my current position to trade myself up to a new and even better position.

Good for you, that sounds wonderful!  And hey, in a way you could say you did leverage your old position to trade up - you used your old job to display your commitment to moral/legal action, and that helped you get the new job :)

That is a good point but because most of the people will not know that happened they will draw some other conclusion. :-)
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Dicey on July 08, 2020, 11:50:48 AM
Fingers crossed for a good outcome, @Plina! I agree with @Raenia's characterization 100%.

And thanks for the new story @Mustachianchlud. Welcome to the forum!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Much Fishing to Do on July 08, 2020, 11:59:59 AM
Then he goes on ... "All vacation time or days off are cancelled for the indefinite future"    I raise my hand:  "I have a day off Friday which was approved months ago by your predecessor for me to participate as best man in a wedding. It is out of town (250 miles away) and I cannot be here Friday"  His response:  "YOU WILL BE IN THE OFFICE THAT FRIDAY"  My response:  "Sorry but that is not possible. I will be out that day"   Steam comes out of his ears again... and he storms out.

This reminds me of a great FU moment I experienced long ago.  Someone was needing a day off (for a pretty serious reason) when we were swamped to make a deadline.  The boss told them in front of everyone "no, you cannot take Weds off"...they replied "You misunderstand, I wasn't asking if I could take Weds off, I was asking if I can come back to work on Thurs after I take Weds off...."  ;-)
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: mm1970 on July 08, 2020, 12:10:17 PM
Then he goes on ... "All vacation time or days off are cancelled for the indefinite future"    I raise my hand:  "I have a day off Friday which was approved months ago by your predecessor for me to participate as best man in a wedding. It is out of town (250 miles away) and I cannot be here Friday"  His response:  "YOU WILL BE IN THE OFFICE THAT FRIDAY"  My response:  "Sorry but that is not possible. I will be out that day"   Steam comes out of his ears again... and he storms out.

This reminds me of a great FU moment I experienced long ago.  Someone was needing a day off (for a pretty serious reason) when we were swamped to make a deadline.  The boss told them in front of everyone "no, you cannot take Weds off"...they replied "You misunderstand, I wasn't asking if I could take Weds off, I was asking if I can come back to work on Thurs after I take Weds off...."  ;-)
This made me giggle.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Dicey on July 08, 2020, 12:50:58 PM
Then he goes on ... "All vacation time or days off are cancelled for the indefinite future"    I raise my hand:  "I have a day off Friday which was approved months ago by your predecessor for me to participate as best man in a wedding. It is out of town (250 miles away) and I cannot be here Friday"  His response:  "YOU WILL BE IN THE OFFICE THAT FRIDAY"  My response:  "Sorry but that is not possible. I will be out that day"   Steam comes out of his ears again... and he storms out.

This reminds me of a great FU moment I experienced long ago.  Someone was needing a day off (for a pretty serious reason) when we were swamped to make a deadline.  The boss told them in front of everyone "no, you cannot take Weds off"...they replied "You misunderstand, I wasn't asking if I could take Weds off, I was asking if I can come back to work on Thurs after I take Weds off...."  ;-)
This made me giggle.
Me, too. What was the response from the boss?
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: zolotiyeruki on July 08, 2020, 02:08:31 PM
Then he goes on ... "All vacation time or days off are cancelled for the indefinite future"    I raise my hand:  "I have a day off Friday which was approved months ago by your predecessor for me to participate as best man in a wedding. It is out of town (250 miles away) and I cannot be here Friday"  His response:  "YOU WILL BE IN THE OFFICE THAT FRIDAY"  My response:  "Sorry but that is not possible. I will be out that day"   Steam comes out of his ears again... and he storms out.

This reminds me of a great FU moment I experienced long ago.  Someone was needing a day off (for a pretty serious reason) when we were swamped to make a deadline.  The boss told them in front of everyone "no, you cannot take Weds off"...they replied "You misunderstand, I wasn't asking if I could take Weds off, I was asking if I can come back to work on Thurs after I take Weds off...."  ;-)
Wow, that takes guts to say something like that!  I would love to know what the boss's face looked like in response.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Plina on July 08, 2020, 02:26:52 PM
Then he goes on ... "All vacation time or days off are cancelled for the indefinite future"    I raise my hand:  "I have a day off Friday which was approved months ago by your predecessor for me to participate as best man in a wedding. It is out of town (250 miles away) and I cannot be here Friday"  His response:  "YOU WILL BE IN THE OFFICE THAT FRIDAY"  My response:  "Sorry but that is not possible. I will be out that day"   Steam comes out of his ears again... and he storms out.

I can't even imagine someone saying that and surviving as as boss here. As a boss you have to special reasons to deny someone 4 weeks of vacation during summer, such as a pandemic for example. The hospitals seems to have problems solving the summer vacations every year so they end up paying a lot of extra to their employees so that they will postpone parts of their vacation too a later date or to take extra shifts.

Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: alcon835 on July 08, 2020, 07:15:25 PM
MY FU money came in handy at a moment 25 years ago, where I was hired as the credit manager of a regional branch of a national copier company that was floundering - and that was why they needed me, because they could not keep up with the receivables.  The credit department was so overworked, that I would get 80-90 messages per day with NEW problems for my staff of 6 to address, on top of the previous day's, such that by friday I had over 400 messages that I could not return, after spending all week working on last week's 400 problems.  Management was patient, and I was making progress, hiring 4 temps, getting the staff humming as a team, and collecting more money each week, reducing receivables outstanding by 15% in the second month, 25% by the third month on the job, etc.  A real pressure cooker environment.  In month 4 the CFO leaves, leaving me the 2nd highest financial executive in the region, after the comptroller, who has no idea how I do my job.  Then the company hires a general manager VP with no credit experience - fun ensues.  Without any research or understanding of the business situation, he calls a meeting of the department heads and gives a speech to "lay down the law" - including "as of now, all bonuses are cancelled" - so I raise my hand and ask the question:  " Does that include bonuses that are legal obligations under a properly approved employment contract between myself and the company?"   Steam comes out of his ears....and then the HR head confirms in front of the entire management staff that, yes, I am the only one with an employment contract that obligates the company to pay me bonuses if certain targets are met (and I am ahead of those targets already) for the next 2 years....   Then he goes on ... "All vacation time or days off are cancelled for the indefinite future"    I raise my hand:  "I have a day off Friday which was approved months ago by your predecessor for me to participate as best man in a wedding. It is out of town (250 miles away) and I cannot be here Friday"  His response:  "YOU WILL BE IN THE OFFICE THAT FRIDAY"  My response:  "Sorry but that is not possible. I will be out that day"   Steam comes out of his ears again... and he storms out.  After the wedding, I come in bright an early Monday to find he calls me into his office and suspends me.  I am to return to my office and sit there doing nothing.  I read the paper all day, and the next and the next.  The Comptroller is told to do my job too, on top of his own.  The Comptroller begs me to help him handle the weekly conference call with the main office CFO and Credit Manager  who grills him on our progress ... and I answer all their questions.  By the next week, I am reinstated in the job.  But the finances worsen to the point that within a few more months, the situation is hopeless, and I am let go with the comptroller, and the VP, and the region is shut down.  Soon after the entire company files for bankruptcy.  But thanks to my employment contract, and my FU money, I had a helluva fun time pissing off the jerk VP, and became a bit legendary among the company staff - many of whom keep in touch.

Wow, I get that times can be tough and an organization needs to ask a lot from people, but taking away bonuses and eliminating vacation? That's a recipe for demoralization and a failure to meet your goals.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Model96 on July 08, 2020, 07:57:28 PM
I love my FU money, I used it a few times but my best was when I actually FIREd at the end of my yearly job review. I humoured my slimy supervisor the whole way through and gave him my resignation notice at the end......I'll treasure the look on his face forever :)
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: alcon835 on July 08, 2020, 08:22:11 PM
I love my FU money, I used it a few times but my best was when I actually FIREd at the end of my yearly job review. I humoured my slimy supervisor the whole way through and gave him my resignation notice at the end......I'll treasure the look on his face forever :)

You gotta give us more than that! lol
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: BuffaloStache on July 09, 2020, 12:53:21 PM
...
 The boss told them in front of everyone "no, you cannot take Weds off"...they replied "You misunderstand, I wasn't asking if I could take Weds off, I was asking if I can come back to work on Thurs after I take Weds off...."  ;-)

This is amazing. I'm lucky that I've never really been denied vacation, but that sounds awful.

I love my FU money, I used it a few times but my best was when I actually FIREd at the end of my yearly job review. I humoured my slimy supervisor the whole way through and gave him my resignation notice at the end......I'll treasure the look on his face forever :)

You gotta give us more than that! lol

Agreed! More details, please! Sounds like a great FU money story to me.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Model96 on July 10, 2020, 12:06:01 AM


I love my FU money, I used it a few times but my best was when I actually FIREd at the end of my yearly job review. I humoured my slimy supervisor the whole way through and gave him my resignation notice at the end......I'll treasure the look on his face forever :)

You gotta give us more than that! lol

Agreed! More details, please! Sounds like a great FU money story to me.

Hehe, the job was a lot more interesting than him, as well as too complex for him :)
FIRE is the ultimate FU !
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: rantk81 on July 11, 2020, 02:29:16 PM
Yesterday was my last day, after working at the same place since 2004.
I didn't do anything "epic" -- and many of my co-workers seemed genuinely sad (over video call) that I was leaving.

But damn, did it feel good to delete all the VPN software and browser history/cookies from all the sites to internal company resources!
Today I took a leisurely walk to the office, and dropped off my badge with the security-person on duty.

Monday, a new chapter starts!  I could probably FIRE now, but I'm going to be starting a new job for the time being.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: RWTL on July 11, 2020, 02:32:07 PM
Yesterday was my last day, after working at the same place since 2004.
I didn't do anything "epic" -- and many of my co-workers seemed genuinely sad (over video call) that I was leaving.

But damn, did it feel good to delete all the VPN software and browser history/cookies from all the sites to internal company resources!
Today I took a leisurely walk to the office, and dropped off my badge with the security-person on duty.

Monday, a new chapter starts!  I could probably FIRE now, but I'm going to be starting a new job for the time being.

Congrats!  I bet that leisurely walk felt good.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Plina on July 14, 2020, 06:49:59 AM
Last day at work today. Wohoo! I have delivered my last report. Emptied my computer and sent some goodbye messages to a group I work with. The funny part is that most of the people have just assumed that I change workplaces to somewhere else. It is like they can’t even imagine someone leaving their job without anything in place. :-) One person have asked what I will do now and I told her that I am considering between two options, but nothing is final yet.

We have actually agreed on a salary and I get a small increase but also 6 weeks of vacation which is one more then the standard. I could have gotten a bit more with less vacation but I prefer the vacation time. Plus a bonus if the company does well. We have not signed the contract yet as everything was decided last friday afternoon and their vacation started. I guess they figured that because I don’t have any notice period it really doesn’t matter that we sign the contract in the beginning of August. The owner told the employees the news and we have agreed on the terms so I consider it basically a done deal but I will not go public with it before the contract is signed.

If it does not happen I always have the option of starting my own firm. So now it is time to enjoy my free time!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: former player on July 14, 2020, 06:52:19 AM
Congratulations.  I hope you can enjoy the summer off.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Dicey on July 14, 2020, 06:56:59 AM
Last day at work today. Wohoo! I have delivered my last report. Emptied my computer and sent some goodbye messages to a group I work with. The funny part is that most of the people have just assumed that I change workplaces to somewhere else. It is like they can’t even imagine someone leaving their job without anything in place. :-) One person have asked what I will do now and I told her that I am considering between two options, but nothing is final yet.

We have actually agreed on a salary and I get a small increase but also 6 weeks of vacation which is one more then the standard. I could have gotten a bit more with less vacation but I prefer the vacation time. Plus a bonus if the company does well. We have not signed the contract yet as everything was decided last friday afternoon and their vacation started. I guess they figured that because I don’t have any notice period it really doesn’t matter that we sign the contract in the beginning of August. The owner told the employees the news and we have agreed on the terms so I consider it basically a done deal but I will not go public with it before the contract is signed.

If it does not happen I always have the option of starting my own firm. So now it is time to enjoy my free time!
Congratulations,  @Plina . I'm sorry you had to go through such upheaval, but am glad you took us along for the ride and that it ended well. Enjoy your time off!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: zolotiyeruki on July 14, 2020, 07:30:03 AM
We have actually agreed on a salary and I get a small increase but also 6 weeks of vacation which is one more then the standard. I could have gotten a bit more with less vacation but I prefer the vacation time. Plus a bonus if the company does well. We have not signed the contract yet as everything was decided last friday afternoon and their vacation started. I guess they figured that because I don’t have any notice period it really doesn’t matter that we sign the contract in the beginning of August. The owner told the employees the news and we have agreed on the terms so I consider it basically a done deal but I will not go public with it before the contract is signed.
Putting yourself in a position where you can take a pay cut in order to get more vacation must feel incredible!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Dicey on July 14, 2020, 08:09:01 AM
We have actually agreed on a salary and I get a small increase but also 6 weeks of vacation which is one more then the standard. I could have gotten a bit more with less vacation but I prefer the vacation time. Plus a bonus if the company does well. We have not signed the contract yet as everything was decided last friday afternoon and their vacation started. I guess they figured that because I don’t have any notice period it really doesn’t matter that we sign the contract in the beginning of August. The owner told the employees the news and we have agreed on the terms so I consider it basically a done deal but I will not go public with it before the contract is signed.
Putting yourself in a position where you can take a pay cut in order to get more vacation must feel incredible!
She's still getting an increase from her previous position, for the win!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Plina on July 15, 2020, 01:20:13 PM
We have actually agreed on a salary and I get a small increase but also 6 weeks of vacation which is one more then the standard. I could have gotten a bit more with less vacation but I prefer the vacation time. Plus a bonus if the company does well. We have not signed the contract yet as everything was decided last friday afternoon and their vacation started. I guess they figured that because I don’t have any notice period it really doesn’t matter that we sign the contract in the beginning of August. The owner told the employees the news and we have agreed on the terms so I consider it basically a done deal but I will not go public with it before the contract is signed.
Putting yourself in a position where you can take a pay cut in order to get more vacation must feel incredible!
She's still getting an increase from her previous position, for the win!

As I got an increase I don’t actually see it as an pay cut. I was in the same position about 6 years ago and then I chose the money. I ended regretting that. It is actually pretty common here to negotiate a sixth week of vacation. My goals during these last years has been to not be dependent on the amount of salary I get as I have seen former colleagues not being happy in a workplace and not being able to move forward due to lifestyle increases.

Thanks @former player and @Dicey! It was not in my plans but I am pretty satisfied with the result and I have also learned a lot about myself.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: ItsALongStory on July 15, 2020, 05:51:54 PM
I love my FU money, I used it a few times but my best was when I actually FIREd at the end of my yearly job review. I humoured my slimy supervisor the whole way through and gave him my resignation notice at the end......I'll treasure the look on his face forever :)

I was going to do the same thing but was thinking about it more from a practical perspective as I'd be meeting with my boss anyway. I really like him though so that's clearly a hugely different scenario. My wife educated me of the dick move that would be so I'll have to approach it a different way. Current plan of record is to resign Monday August 17th or Tuesday August 18th with at least 2 weeks notice so we can fly out mid to late September.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: rantk81 on July 18, 2020, 06:17:19 PM
Every day at my new employer brings a smile to me....

Attended the "Benefits" meeting last week. OH BOY, it's going to be nice going to the doctor whenever I want, for a $10 co-pay!  Instead of doing the mental gymnastics of whether or not I think it is worth paying $250 to get something checked out!

My former employer had a HDHP plan, where the deductible is LARGER than the OUT-OF-POCKET-MAXIMUM is at my new employer! Holy Shit!

Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Chris Pascale on July 18, 2020, 07:15:27 PM
Every day at my new employer brings a smile to me....

Attended the "Benefits" meeting last week. OH BOY, it's going to be nice going to the doctor whenever I want, for a $10 co-pay!  Instead of doing the mental gymnastics of whether or not I think it is worth paying $250 to get something checked out!

My former employer had a HDHP plan, where the deductible is LARGER than the OUT-OF-POCKET-MAXIMUM is at my new employer! Holy Shit!

that's great!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: NumberJohnny5 on July 19, 2020, 05:57:14 PM
I'll throw a couple in here for the heck of it.

Wife is an RN. I'm a stay at home dad. For a while she was a travel nurse. Anyone who's done that knows that finding and negotiating a contract is a full-time job in and of itself. Just the paperwork alone whenever you sign up with a new agency takes up the better part of the day, and that's if you already have everything ready (licenses, certifications, immunizations, competencies, etc.). I took care of the majority of that. Anyway...

Had her signed up with a few agencies, used the same one for two different contracts one year. Take a break. The next year, get a contract lined up and we're ready to go. Basically, I tell them that as long as we get the all-clear (including signed contract) by Wednesday, we can be there by the following Monday. We get the contract, but then get last minute word that she can't start until she gets positive titers (vs previous two contracts where we just needed to prove she had her immunizations). That's an added expense and hassle, but ok, we'll go get those. But before we sign (technically she's the only one signing, but I consider it a team effort) we need to either get the test results back showing a positive result, OR word from the agency that if she no longer had immunity for something, she could still start the contract as long as she got a booster shot and had titers redrawn until she showed immunity for everything they needed. Well, no word Wednesday. I said ok, fine, one more day, but we absolutely MUST know by end of day Thursday. Well, we got the lab results back, but they screwed up (if I remember correctly, instead of checking for HepC immunity, they checked to see if she had HepC). They did a rush, but no way we'd get it back that day. Agency still refused to say "yes, she can still start the contract even with a negative test result". Friday morning, they call and say she's a go. We say "great, we can be there the NEXT Monday, but not this Monday." That apparently wasn't good enough so they rescinded the offer and found someone else I suppose. No big deal, she ends up getting a MUCH more lucrative contract with a different agency. In fact it was a decent pay bump just in the hourly/stipends, but they actually supplied housing on top of that (and we later learned, a car rental). Extended that contract then went back the next year.

Next one was also a travel assignment. It would have been close to where we were moving to, foot in the door of somewhere she wanted to work full-time, etc. We worked everything out, and then got the contract. Basically, everywhere showed the tax-free stipend being $X/wk, but the contract stated it as a monthly amount. No big deal right? Well, the weekly amount that had been quoted was based on a 30 day month, even though there are seven months out of the year with 31 days (so the stipend that is paid weekly would be a tiny bit less in a month with 31 days). The recruiter pointed out that February would get the same monthly pay but spread over 28 days, so really it wasn't a big deal. I pointed out that it only worked in the traveler's favor if they only worked Feb-March-April (28 days plus 31 days plus 30 days) in a non-leap year (I should note that the standard travel nurse contract is 13 weeks). The recruiter pointed out that it was only $XXX (I want to say it was a bit under $200) over the entire contract period. I said, ok then, since it's not much, put it in the contract that she gets $XXX as a bonus. They said no, we walked.

No idea what the moral of the story is. I just like not being in a situation where we have to do whatever "they" say we have to. We live up to our end of the bargain, but if they want to change the rules and we don't want to dance for them...we'll just walk away from it. In fact we've done that when buying houses too. It's actually why we have no mortgage on our current home.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Dicey on July 20, 2020, 12:24:36 AM
No idea what the moral of the story is. I just like not being in a situation where we have to do whatever "they" say we have to. We live up to our end of the bargain, but if they want to change the rules and we don't want to dance for them...we'll just walk away from it. In fact we've done that when buying houses too. It's actually why we have no mortgage on our current home.
Oh, come on, don't leave us hanging! Tell us the house story, please!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: NumberJohnny5 on July 20, 2020, 07:43:06 AM
Oh, come on, don't leave us hanging! Tell us the house story, please!

It's not really that exciting of a story. Though I guess the others weren't exciting either.

I'll start with a different house. Mobile home actually. It was a foreclosure in a rural area. Waited for a price drop then offered something like $18,750 (each time we made an offer, had to bother the bank to get a new letter saying we had that exact amount available...didn't want to let on that we had more, they were nice to accommodate us like that). Well it's a done deal, lady says I can go ahead and switch utilities over, I drop some flooring off at the place so we can get started on it as soon as the contract is actually signed. Well there's a problem with the title (literally, they suddenly realized that they didn't have a title for the mobile home), the real estate agent basically turns on us saying she'll have to report that we've put our stuff on the property (I go back and get the flooring moved, no big deal, but she was being a total b*tch). Bit confused, I mean she said we could even turn the utilities on in our name (we had scheduled the turn-on for a later date, easy enough to cancel, but still). She made it very clear that the house was no longer under contract

Well, that issue was fixed in about a week. She expected us to honor the contract. I said "no, you made it very clear that the prior contract was null and void, I wish to make a new offer." She refused, so I had to contact HER boss and make her do her job. Got the place for ~$17,750 (maybe it was $17.5, I forget the exact number without looking through old paperwork). She was there for the closing and was NOT happy.

Current house. We go with one of those "we'll work with you if you have special circumstances" companies. I check them out, they're not half bad. And we do have special circumstances; we've been living in Australia the past seven years and have virtually zero recent US income (wife just started a travel job so we'd have some paystubs, they paid weekly so we quickly got the number of paystubs they needed). Basic stuff at first, provide tons of documentation (and fix the mistakes they made on paperwork they sent to us), show where every cent in the bank account came from (we had transferred our AUD to USD, so I had to show the AUS account it came from, the transferwise transaction converting it, then the resulting deposit in the current US bank account), etc. Few hiccups but from what I'd read about other people's experiences buying a house and the whole mortgage process, it seemed fairly smooth (we are EXTREMELY on top of things). Fast forward a bit, we're a couple weeks from closing. Mortgage didn't pass underwriting, they don't know why (that's your JOB), but quickly determine that they had submitted an extremely old survey (it's allowed to be 2-3 years old I think, but this was well over a decade old). Someone there dropped the ball big time. They say they'll get it done ASAP. Some back and forth, it drags on, Thursday becomes Friday becomes no later than Monday (the Monday of the week we want to close by). I forget the exact timing, but when it became apparent it was coming down to the wire, I liquidated both our IRAs straight into our checking account. Once it cleared I sent updated documents to the mortgage company showing the new bank balance and where the funds came from (I doubt it was actually needed, but I did it under the guise of "since you want detailed info of where every cent has come from, here you go"). Told them the funds were moved so we could purchase the house in cash in case they didn't get their stuff together in time. Lady freaked out a bit (mortgage company got $0 if we didn't actually get a mortgage with them). Checked prior emails, she wrote this verbatim:

"I know that you were wanting to just pay cash for the home if the deal could not close this week, but I’m not sure if it is a good idea to take all of your money to purchase a home outright.  You then put yourself in a position to where if any emergency comes up, you may not be able to help yourself.  You might also have to put off making changes/upgrades to the home."

Should note that we had more than was required to purchase the house, so we still had some funds for an emergency (plus, with no mortgage, the amount needed is lower, right?). And of COURSE we needed to immediately upgrade a new (to us) house (admittedly I did cut out a hole to utilize the space under the staircase).

Held firm. They told us about the process they had to follow, that we couldn't rush things, if they got X and Y done by Z then there was a mandatory three day period then we could close the following week. Held firm, said we were closing this Friday regardless. Then we got an email with this exact subject (minus personal info redacted): "FW: Encompass Loan #123456789, 'Name' is ready for Clear to Close by Underwriter". I could tell what was up right away, but played dumb and asked what is the difference between "clear to close" which we require no later than Wednesday, and this "ready to clear to close by underwriter" that you're telling me about? It was obviously a way for them to tell us the magic phrase "clear to close" without actually meaning it.

Wednesday rolls around, we wire the funds to the escrow after making a thousand percent sure that if the mortgage company gave us the actual clear to close by end of business that day, they'd refund all but the deposit. Was pretty nervous until I got confirmation they got the wire (didn't take long). Didn't help that our bank tried to get the account number wrong (maybe almost $200k isn't much for you, but lady, it's nearly all we have!). Don't worry, I always double-check everything (after the near mix-up on their part, I quadruple-checked both what was on their computer and the paperwork that was signed). Well, no clear to close by end of day Wednesday, so we tell the realtor this will be a cash sale (the title company needed one full business day to change everything over, so they had to know by end of Wednesday to have everything ready by Friday).

Of course Thursday morning-ish (late morning, but before lunch) we got the clear to close. Bank didn't bother notifying us (they were correct to not contact us, as we told them this was now a cash sale and they could stop working on the paperwork; the realtor is the one who let us know). Signed the paperwork Friday and started moving in ASAP.

Should probably note that kids and I had been staying at my brother's house with his wife and my mom for nearly three months. My wife had been there about two months longer with the idea to get a job and settled in by the time the rest of us showed up. Nerves were frazzled, and at one point in August I promised that "I'll do whatever I can to get us moved into our own house by the end of the month." The Friday we closed was August 30, waiting until the next week was completely off the table if we had any other option.

Having to start over with our retirement accounts was a big blow, but I'll admit it was nice to give the bank the shaft when they were trying to jerk us around. And don't worry, we dumped a large amount back into the IRAs before our 60 day rollover window closed (we did have to carry a balance on credit cards for a number of months, but eh...they're all paid off now and we're back on track).
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: grantmeaname on July 20, 2020, 08:16:04 AM
Oh my god, that's a GIANT middle finger.

Badass.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: bigblock440 on July 20, 2020, 08:17:32 AM
Every day at my new employer brings a smile to me....

Attended the "Benefits" meeting last week. OH BOY, it's going to be nice going to the doctor whenever I want, for a $10 co-pay!  Instead of doing the mental gymnastics of whether or not I think it is worth paying $250 to get something checked out!

My former employer had a HDHP plan, where the deductible is LARGER than the OUT-OF-POCKET-MAXIMUM is at my new employer! Holy Shit!

that's great!

Depends on what the premium is
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: bigblock440 on July 20, 2020, 08:24:59 AM
Oh, come on, don't leave us hanging! Tell us the house story, please!

It's not really that exciting of a story. Though I guess the others weren't exciting either.

I'll start with a different house. Mobile home actually. It was a foreclosure in a rural area. Waited for a price drop then offered something like $18,750 (each time we made an offer, had to bother the bank to get a new letter saying we had that exact amount available...didn't want to let on that we had more, they were nice to accommodate us like that). Well it's a done deal, lady says I can go ahead and switch utilities over, I drop some flooring off at the place so we can get started on it as soon as the contract is actually signed. Well there's a problem with the title (literally, they suddenly realized that they didn't have a title for the mobile home), the real estate agent basically turns on us saying she'll have to report that we've put our stuff on the property (I go back and get the flooring moved, no big deal, but she was being a total b*tch). Bit confused, I mean she said we could even turn the utilities on in our name (we had scheduled the turn-on for a later date, easy enough to cancel, but still). She made it very clear that the house was no longer under contract

Well, that issue was fixed in about a week. She expected us to honor the contract. I said "no, you made it very clear that the prior contract was null and void, I wish to make a new offer." She refused, so I had to contact HER boss and make her do her job. Got the place for ~$17,750 (maybe it was $17.5, I forget the exact number without looking through old paperwork). She was there for the closing and was NOT happy.

Current house. We go with one of those "we'll work with you if you have special circumstances" companies. I check them out, they're not half bad. And we do have special circumstances; we've been living in Australia the past seven years and have virtually zero recent US income (wife just started a travel job so we'd have some paystubs, they paid weekly so we quickly got the number of paystubs they needed). Basic stuff at first, provide tons of documentation (and fix the mistakes they made on paperwork they sent to us), show where every cent in the bank account came from (we had transferred our AUD to USD, so I had to show the AUS account it came from, the transferwise transaction converting it, then the resulting deposit in the current US bank account), etc. Few hiccups but from what I'd read about other people's experiences buying a house and the whole mortgage process, it seemed fairly smooth (we are EXTREMELY on top of things). Fast forward a bit, we're a couple weeks from closing. Mortgage didn't pass underwriting, they don't know why (that's your JOB), but quickly determine that they had submitted an extremely old survey (it's allowed to be 2-3 years old I think, but this was well over a decade old). Someone there dropped the ball big time. They say they'll get it done ASAP. Some back and forth, it drags on, Thursday becomes Friday becomes no later than Monday (the Monday of the week we want to close by). I forget the exact timing, but when it became apparent it was coming down to the wire, I liquidated both our IRAs straight into our checking account. Once it cleared I sent updated documents to the mortgage company showing the new bank balance and where the funds came from (I doubt it was actually needed, but I did it under the guise of "since you want detailed info of where every cent has come from, here you go"). Told them the funds were moved so we could purchase the house in cash in case they didn't get their stuff together in time. Lady freaked out a bit (mortgage company got $0 if we didn't actually get a mortgage with them). Checked prior emails, she wrote this verbatim:

"I know that you were wanting to just pay cash for the home if the deal could not close this week, but I’m not sure if it is a good idea to take all of your money to purchase a home outright.  You then put yourself in a position to where if any emergency comes up, you may not be able to help yourself.  You might also have to put off making changes/upgrades to the home."

Should note that we had more than was required to purchase the house, so we still had some funds for an emergency (plus, with no mortgage, the amount needed is lower, right?). And of COURSE we needed to immediately upgrade a new (to us) house (admittedly I did cut out a hole to utilize the space under the staircase).

Held firm. They told us about the process they had to follow, that we couldn't rush things, if they got X and Y done by Z then there was a mandatory three day period then we could close the following week. Held firm, said we were closing this Friday regardless. Then we got an email with this exact subject (minus personal info redacted): "FW: Encompass Loan #123456789, 'Name' is ready for Clear to Close by Underwriter". I could tell what was up right away, but played dumb and asked what is the difference between "clear to close" which we require no later than Wednesday, and this "ready to clear to close by underwriter" that you're telling me about? It was obviously a way for them to tell us the magic phrase "clear to close" without actually meaning it.

Wednesday rolls around, we wire the funds to the escrow after making a thousand percent sure that if the mortgage company gave us the actual clear to close by end of business that day, they'd refund all but the deposit. Was pretty nervous until I got confirmation they got the wire (didn't take long). Didn't help that our bank tried to get the account number wrong (maybe almost $200k isn't much for you, but lady, it's nearly all we have!). Don't worry, I always double-check everything (after the near mix-up on their part, I quadruple-checked both what was on their computer and the paperwork that was signed). Well, no clear to close by end of day Wednesday, so we tell the realtor this will be a cash sale (the title company needed one full business day to change everything over, so they had to know by end of Wednesday to have everything ready by Friday).

Of course Thursday morning-ish (late morning, but before lunch) we got the clear to close. Bank didn't bother notifying us (they were correct to not contact us, as we told them this was now a cash sale and they could stop working on the paperwork; the realtor is the one who let us know). Signed the paperwork Friday and started moving in ASAP.

Should probably note that kids and I had been staying at my brother's house with his wife and my mom for nearly three months. My wife had been there about two months longer with the idea to get a job and settled in by the time the rest of us showed up. Nerves were frazzled, and at one point in August I promised that "I'll do whatever I can to get us moved into our own house by the end of the month." The Friday we closed was August 30, waiting until the next week was completely off the table if we had any other option.

Having to start over with our retirement accounts was a big blow, but I'll admit it was nice to give the bank the shaft when they were trying to jerk us around. And don't worry, we dumped a large amount back into the IRAs before our 60 day rollover window closed (we did have to carry a balance on credit cards for a number of months, but eh...they're all paid off now and we're back on track).

The second one is definitely an epic FU
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Just Joe on August 23, 2020, 07:48:28 AM
I want to say thank you for this concept of FU money. Never thought I'd need it. Have a job I can live with for now. I need to unload just a little.

Applied for a job at my current employer. Its a step up in responsibilities and salary. Expecting an interview b/c the advertisement reads like it was written with me in mind skills-wise.

Excited about the potential new challenges. I've been invited to attend meetings at that level recently so I'm getting a peek at how things work.

More time I spend in the presence of my boss's boss - the more disappointed I am with that person. I am realizing likely unhappy I would be working in close collaboration with that person and how much my boss shields us from that person. It also explains why my boss seems defeated at times.

Oh how petty and small this upper level person is. I had worked with them on a few topics and was initially impressed but as time goes on it looks like they can't handle it and are bullying the people that answer to them for reasons unknown. Now I find out that my boss may be looking for another job.

So I'm sitting back and looking the situation over. DW and I are comfortable. Not sure if the money is worth the extra wear and tear. Right now, sitting here reviewing last week's events - it isn't.

I think for entertainment sake I'll attend an interview if offered but decline the offer if extended. Just mostly doing recon for myself.

Am still surprised at how petty this person has turned out to be. We have so many big engineering topics to work on and they have time to pick on people? No thanks... 

Have several years of expenses saved up as long as DW is employed.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: SwordGuy on August 23, 2020, 07:54:40 AM

More time I spend in the presence of my boss's boss - the more disappointed I am with that person. I am realizing likely unhappy I would be working in close collaboration with that person and how much my boss shields us from that person. It also explains why my boss seems defeated at times.

Oh how petty and small this upper level person is. I had worked with them on a few topics and was initially impressed but as time goes on it looks like they can't handle it and are bullying the people that answer to them for reasons unknown. Now I find out that my boss may be looking for another job.


Take the time to truly THANK your boss for what he does for you and your team.   They deserve it.

Plus, you might have a ready-made job waiting for you wherever they end up. :)

I try to explain to younger folks that they are only one sociopath away from being sick to death of their job and burnt out their career, so get that FU money lined up asap.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Dicey on August 23, 2020, 08:08:46 AM
@NumberJohnny5 , thanks for responding to my question! I don't know how I missed it until now. You have a great writing style and memory for detail. That was a great story.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Loren Ver on August 23, 2020, 08:11:21 AM
@NumberJohnny5 - great name! You and your wife sound like a good team :).  Good stories too.  Poor mortgage company, they should have had their act together, you know, like it was their job.

No disassemble!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Dicey on August 23, 2020, 08:18:09 AM

More time I spend in the presence of my boss's boss - the more disappointed I am with that person. I am realizing likely unhappy I would be working in close collaboration with that person and how much my boss shields us from that person. It also explains why my boss seems defeated at times.

Oh how petty and small this upper level person is. I had worked with them on a few topics and was initially impressed but as time goes on it looks like they can't handle it and are bullying the people that answer to them for reasons unknown. Now I find out that my boss may be looking for another job.


Take the time to truly THANK your boss for what he does for you and your team.   They deserve it.

Plus, you might have a ready-made job waiting for you wherever they end up. :)

I try to explain to younger folks that they are only one sociopath away from being sick to death of their job and burnt out their career, so get that FU money lined up asap.
Completely agree.

Murphy's Law says since you don't really want the job now, it's even more likely you'll get the offer. Might be good to discuss what you've learned with your boss (while you're thanking them profusely). Something good still might come out of this, but it's great that your FU money means there's no pressure on you to accept any changes you don't want.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Just Joe on August 23, 2020, 09:27:00 AM

More time I spend in the presence of my boss's boss - the more disappointed I am with that person. I am realizing likely unhappy I would be working in close collaboration with that person and how much my boss shields us from that person. It also explains why my boss seems defeated at times.

Oh how petty and small this upper level person is. I had worked with them on a few topics and was initially impressed but as time goes on it looks like they can't handle it and are bullying the people that answer to them for reasons unknown. Now I find out that my boss may be looking for another job.


Take the time to truly THANK your boss for what he does for you and your team.   They deserve it.

Plus, you might have a ready-made job waiting for you wherever they end up. :)

I try to explain to younger folks that they are only one sociopath away from being sick to death of their job and burnt out their career, so get that FU money lined up asap.

Will do! Good idea.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Just Joe on August 23, 2020, 10:05:02 AM
Meanwhile looks like we're entering a period of keeping one's head down. Self-limiting water cooler time and web use. I have a job where I typically get done what needs done ahead of schedule due to efficiency and proficiency with the technology available to me. Might also be time to move from a PAYGO phone to more something with a data plan so I can get my music, podcasts and forums without a network log trail. Have already been living by the clock unlike some of my coworkers. Would not be surprised if the big boss suddenly start looking at people's web histories. Traditionally this has been an outfit that has been very flexible about web use, hours, etc as long as everything got done - which it has in our team.

Not sure what has changed b/c business has been similar to last year despite COVID. Budgets are similar. No layoffs. Actually hired a couple engineers.

Frustrating b/c my (our) team has long moved heaven and earth to get whatever needs to get done. Now the big boss has turned into a bully to some. Not a good sign. Not a good situation when going the extra mile isn't enough.   

Not eager to look for another employer. DW and I have a good location/routine/budget/future as we approach retirement. Maybe ten years. Lower income than some here (LCOL) and we had a later start than some. 

Okay done unloading. Feel better now.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: gaja on August 25, 2020, 02:49:41 PM
A relatively weird story in running in Norwegian news now, and I'm not sure whether I agree with all decisions being made, but it feels like it might fit here:

We need a new leader for the oil fund (1 000 000 000 000 USD and counting https://www.nbim.no/). Nikolai Tangen, a Norwegian investor who has been living in UK was offered the job, but there was worry about conflicts of interest and (potential for) corruption. Part of the worry was that he owned large parts of an investment fund  and loads of other stuff, total value in the billions range. After a lot of public unrest, and the parliament voting on whether to force the central bank to stop the process, it looked like Tangen had a FU moment. Sunday he declared that he was giving away the fund to a public trust (where he won't be part of the board), and the rest of his money, between 500 and 700 million USD, he will put in a savings account in a bank at ~0 % interest.

I still don't like him, I don't think he is the type of person we need for that job and I don't trust there will be no corruption, but I have to admire the attitude. And he will basically paying to do the job; the salary is ~300 000 USD, and he will be paying ~1.5 million USD in wealth tax.
https://www.newsinenglish.no/2020/08/24/tangen-cleared-to-take-over-oil-fund/
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: scottish on August 25, 2020, 03:00:01 PM
Tangen seems to have some character:

Quote
“I think we can all say that Nicolai has stretched himself very far with this agreement,” Øystein Olsen, governor of Norges Bank, said at a press conference Monday evening after his bank board’s crisis meeting Monday afternoon.

“I think it’s fair to say that Øystein owes me a beer,” Tangen told reporters when it was all over. “I asked Øystein if I could put the money in Norges Bank, but I’m not allowed to do that.”

What is it that you dislike about him?
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: gaja on August 25, 2020, 03:50:43 PM
Tangen seems to have some character:

Quote
“I think we can all say that Nicolai has stretched himself very far with this agreement,” Øystein Olsen, governor of Norges Bank, said at a press conference Monday evening after his bank board’s crisis meeting Monday afternoon.

“I think it’s fair to say that Øystein owes me a beer,” Tangen told reporters when it was all over. “I asked Øystein if I could put the money in Norges Bank, but I’m not allowed to do that.”

What is it that you dislike about him?

Objectively:
a) He has messed up earlier and come very close to (or maybe over the limit of) corruption by inviting a lot of the most powerful people in Norway on a luxurious conference/holiday just a short time before he got the job. Whether that was really corruption or not: the head of the oil fund has to behave perfectly because we invest in companies all over the world. Today, "everyone" knows that there is no point in bribes. Rumors spreading, even if they are not true, will be costly and time consuming. The employees of the oil fund have the strictest anti corruption regulations imaginable, they can barely accept flowers if they hold a speech somewhere. So far, Tangen has not shown that he understands the role.

b) The reason we have so much money in the fund is that the population trusts that it is kept safe for them. If the oil fund manager is perceived as untrustworthy, the political will to save money might dwindle. And the Norwegian people in general have a very low trust of "rich people" (the amount of money is not very important; you can be rich, but you can't behave like a "rich person" ("riking")).


Subjectively: I like that the oil fund is boring and index based, mixed with equally boring property investments. I'm afraid Tangen will do more active investments. He has a very good track record, we might make more money, but I don't like it.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: BicycleB on August 25, 2020, 08:25:28 PM
This Norwegian oil fund story is interesting. @gaja, thanks for posting your thoughts.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Plina on August 25, 2020, 10:15:05 PM
Tangen seems to have some character:

Quote
“I think we can all say that Nicolai has stretched himself very far with this agreement,” Øystein Olsen, governor of Norges Bank, said at a press conference Monday evening after his bank board’s crisis meeting Monday afternoon.

“I think it’s fair to say that Øystein owes me a beer,” Tangen told reporters when it was all over. “I asked Øystein if I could put the money in Norges Bank, but I’m not allowed to do that.”

What is it that you dislike about him?

Objectively:
a) He has messed up earlier and come very close to (or maybe over the limit of) corruption by inviting a lot of the most powerful people in Norway on a luxurious conference/holiday just a short time before he got the job. Whether that was really corruption or not: the head of the oil fund has to behave perfectly because we invest in companies all over the world. Today, "everyone" knows that there is no point in bribes. Rumors spreading, even if they are not true, will be costly and time consuming. The employees of the oil fund have the strictest anti corruption regulations imaginable, they can barely accept flowers if they hold a speech somewhere. So far, Tangen has not shown that he understands the role.

b) The reason we have so much money in the fund is that the population trusts that it is kept safe for them. If the oil fund manager is perceived as untrustworthy, the political will to save money might dwindle. And the Norwegian people in general have a very low trust of "rich people" (the amount of money is not very important; you can be rich, but you can't behave like a "rich person" ("riking")).


Subjectively: I like that the oil fund is boring and index based, mixed with equally boring property investments. I'm afraid Tangen will do more active investments. He has a very good track record, we might make more money, but I don't like it.

If he is worth billions would not the cost of the conference/holiday equal what it cost for an ordinary person to invite their friends for a party or dinner if you compare incomes and costs?
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Playing with Fire UK on August 26, 2020, 12:34:54 AM
If he is worth billions would not the cost of the conference/holiday equal what it cost for an ordinary person to invite their friends for a party or dinner if you compare incomes and costs?

But that isn't the measure of the potential to bribe. Even if a gift is insignificant to give, if it is significant for the recipient then it might be enough to influence a decision. Looking like a bribe, or close to a bribe, or possibly a bribe is a problem in itself.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: gaja on August 26, 2020, 12:53:22 AM
Tangen seems to have some character:

Quote
“I think we can all say that Nicolai has stretched himself very far with this agreement,” Øystein Olsen, governor of Norges Bank, said at a press conference Monday evening after his bank board’s crisis meeting Monday afternoon.

“I think it’s fair to say that Øystein owes me a beer,” Tangen told reporters when it was all over. “I asked Øystein if I could put the money in Norges Bank, but I’m not allowed to do that.”

What is it that you dislike about him?

Objectively:
a) He has messed up earlier and come very close to (or maybe over the limit of) corruption by inviting a lot of the most powerful people in Norway on a luxurious conference/holiday just a short time before he got the job. Whether that was really corruption or not: the head of the oil fund has to behave perfectly because we invest in companies all over the world. Today, "everyone" knows that there is no point in bribes. Rumors spreading, even if they are not true, will be costly and time consuming. The employees of the oil fund have the strictest anti corruption regulations imaginable, they can barely accept flowers if they hold a speech somewhere. So far, Tangen has not shown that he understands the role.

b) The reason we have so much money in the fund is that the population trusts that it is kept safe for them. If the oil fund manager is perceived as untrustworthy, the political will to save money might dwindle. And the Norwegian people in general have a very low trust of "rich people" (the amount of money is not very important; you can be rich, but you can't behave like a "rich person" ("riking")).


Subjectively: I like that the oil fund is boring and index based, mixed with equally boring property investments. I'm afraid Tangen will do more active investments. He has a very good track record, we might make more money, but I don't like it.

If he is worth billions would not the cost of the conference/holiday equal what it cost for an ordinary person to invite their friends for a party or dinner if you compare incomes and costs?

There are to ways to interpret it, and neither is good:

a) Tangen is an incredibly naive rich man who doesn't understand that inviting leading politicians, the current head of the oil fund, and loads of other powerful people, to an all expense paid luxury weekend is highly problematic. If he really is that naive, how can he be the leader of the oil fund, handling a trillion USD, and interacting with people who will buy him beers and then mention "we would like you to do us a favor, though"? Several of the attendees have had to make public apologies after the event - I doubt they are very happy about that.

b) Tangen knew very well what he did. He wanted more influence and power, and he invited just the right people to a weekend of luxury to get the right connections, and be able to contact them later for favors. That is corruption, and unacceptable. The argument for this interpretation, is emails surfacing where he has contacted people who were at the event to get information and advice about the available job as oil fund manager.

The third aspect of this: The reason we have a high level of trust in the Norwegian society is that we try to keep everyone on a level playing field. If I call the mayor of my city, I believe he will give me just as much attention as if a person with a lot of money in the bank calls him. Tangen showed that this belief is not right, since I highly doubt those on his guest list would attend if I threw together a barbecue in the garden and invited them to hang out. But hey, maybe I should try?
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Plina on August 26, 2020, 03:18:26 AM
If he is worth billions would not the cost of the conference/holiday equal what it cost for an ordinary person to invite their friends for a party or dinner if you compare incomes and costs?

But that isn't the measure of the potential to bribe. Even if a gift is insignificant to give, if it is significant for the recipient then it might be enough to influence a decision. Looking like a bribe, or close to a bribe, or possibly a bribe is a problem in itself.

I would say it depended on the invitation list. If they are his "friends" it would make it difficult to make it a bribe. If they on the other hand are to him unknown politicians, government workers etc then it would not look good.

Tangen seems to have some character:

Quote
“I think we can all say that Nicolai has stretched himself very far with this agreement,” Øystein Olsen, governor of Norges Bank, said at a press conference Monday evening after his bank board’s crisis meeting Monday afternoon.

“I think it’s fair to say that Øystein owes me a beer,” Tangen told reporters when it was all over. “I asked Øystein if I could put the money in Norges Bank, but I’m not allowed to do that.”

What is it that you dislike about him?

Objectively:
a) He has messed up earlier and come very close to (or maybe over the limit of) corruption by inviting a lot of the most powerful people in Norway on a luxurious conference/holiday just a short time before he got the job. Whether that was really corruption or not: the head of the oil fund has to behave perfectly because we invest in companies all over the world. Today, "everyone" knows that there is no point in bribes. Rumors spreading, even if they are not true, will be costly and time consuming. The employees of the oil fund have the strictest anti corruption regulations imaginable, they can barely accept flowers if they hold a speech somewhere. So far, Tangen has not shown that he understands the role.

b) The reason we have so much money in the fund is that the population trusts that it is kept safe for them. If the oil fund manager is perceived as untrustworthy, the political will to save money might dwindle. And the Norwegian people in general have a very low trust of "rich people" (the amount of money is not very important; you can be rich, but you can't behave like a "rich person" ("riking")).


Subjectively: I like that the oil fund is boring and index based, mixed with equally boring property investments. I'm afraid Tangen will do more active investments. He has a very good track record, we might make more money, but I don't like it.

If he is worth billions would not the cost of the conference/holiday equal what it cost for an ordinary person to invite their friends for a party or dinner if you compare incomes and costs?

There are to ways to interpret it, and neither is good:

a) Tangen is an incredibly naive rich man who doesn't understand that inviting leading politicians, the current head of the oil fund, and loads of other powerful people, to an all expense paid luxury weekend is highly problematic. If he really is that naive, how can he be the leader of the oil fund, handling a trillion USD, and interacting with people who will buy him beers and then mention "we would like you to do us a favor, though"? Several of the attendees have had to make public apologies after the event - I doubt they are very happy about that.

b) Tangen knew very well what he did. He wanted more influence and power, and he invited just the right people to a weekend of luxury to get the right connections, and be able to contact them later for favors. That is corruption, and unacceptable. The argument for this interpretation, is emails surfacing where he has contacted people who were at the event to get information and advice about the available job as oil fund manager.

The third aspect of this: The reason we have a high level of trust in the Norwegian society is that we try to keep everyone on a level playing field. If I call the mayor of my city, I believe he will give me just as much attention as if a person with a lot of money in the bank calls him. Tangen showed that this belief is not right, since I highly doubt those on his guest list would attend if I threw together a barbecue in the garden and invited them to hang out. But hey, maybe I should try?

I would say it is more problematic that the leading politicians and the head of the fund participated in the conference/weekend. Even if Tangen was naive or knew what he did, they should have never accepted the invitation. That is for me even worse as they should have been aware of the rules. I have worked for government for years before going private and I think it is troublesome to see how certain people in the government accept lunches from companies. That was not ok, where I worked. When it comes to other influential people, it would depend on their relationship or their companies relationship if it should be seen as problematic.

I live in Sweden I can say that I have no illusions that I will get the same treatment from the person in the highest political office in my city that the CEO of Volvo would get or an otherwise more known person. Money talks in to many cases.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: gaja on August 26, 2020, 03:45:36 AM
He was "friends" with some of them, but not all. And if he just was another rich financial guy, I would say the blame was completely on the people attending. But now he wants to be on the bureaucratic side of the table, and therefore it reflects badly on him that he created that mess.

As to the CEO of Volvo vs me: what Volvo says is important for a lot of people and the economy of the municipality. So it makes sense that he would get more time with the mayor than me. But the spouse of the Volvo CEO and I should be treated the same, although he or she probably has a lot more money in the bank. The money in itself should not matter.

On the issue of equality, there is a big difference between Norway and Sweden in mentality. You still have nobility and a long tradition of powerful families. When we were under Sweden and Denmark they tried introducing nobility to Norway, and we hated it. So as soon as we were free enough to make a constitution, we banned it. The king was chosen to avoid war (with a Danish prince on the throne, Sweden was less likely to attack). We expect the royal family to behave just like the rest of us. There was for instance a big shift in public opinion about dismantling the monarchy when the we learned that the princess had transferred from a public to a private school.

This doesn't mean Norway has less of this type of corruption than Sweden, just that the public reacts more negatively when something comes out in the media, and it is even more important that the leaders are perceived as part of "us common folks", not "those rich snobs".
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Plina on August 26, 2020, 04:56:46 AM
He was "friends" with some of them, but not all. And if he just was another rich financial guy, I would say the blame was completely on the people attending. But now he wants to be on the bureaucratic side of the table, and therefore it reflects badly on him that he created that mess.

As to the CEO of Volvo vs me: what Volvo says is important for a lot of people and the economy of the municipality. So it makes sense that he would get more time with the mayor than me. But the spouse of the Volvo CEO and I should be treated the same, although he or she probably has a lot more money in the bank. The money in itself should not matter.

On the issue of equality, there is a big difference between Norway and Sweden in mentality. You still have nobility and a long tradition of powerful families. When we were under Sweden and Denmark they tried introducing nobility to Norway, and we hated it. So as soon as we were free enough to make a constitution, we banned it. The king was chosen to avoid war (with a Danish prince on the throne, Sweden was less likely to attack). We expect the royal family to behave just like the rest of us. There was for instance a big shift in public opinion about dismantling the monarchy when the we learned that the princess had transferred from a public to a private school.

This doesn't mean Norway has less of this type of corruption than Sweden, just that the public reacts more negatively when something comes out in the media, and it is even more important that the leaders are perceived as part of "us common folks", not "those rich snobs".

I agree that you should be treated the same but I would guess that she probably still would get preferential treatment because the mayor would not want to risk get on the bad side of the CEO. But hey, I am bit cynical when it comes to stuff like that. And I am not saying that he has not any blame in it.

I would say that the nobility in itself doesn't matter but the money and land that comes with it. We have some powerful enterprising families. Although, they seem to be pretty toned down and not flashy. It is interesting to hear about the differences. Our royal family is expected to behave more "royally" although Victoria is seen as a pretty sympathetic and ordinary person. I believe the acceptance for the royal family would be pretty low IF Victoria was not the next in line. I don't give much her siblings and their spouses. Most of the people like her even if they don't care about the monarchy.

Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: talltexan on August 26, 2020, 06:36:25 AM
A relatively weird story in running in Norwegian news now, and I'm not sure whether I agree with all decisions being made, but it feels like it might fit here:

We need a new leader for the oil fund (1 000 000 000 000 USD and counting https://www.nbim.no/). Nikolai Tangen, a Norwegian investor who has been living in UK was offered the job, but there was worry about conflicts of interest and (potential for) corruption. Part of the worry was that he owned large parts of an investment fund  and loads of other stuff, total value in the billions range. After a lot of public unrest, and the parliament voting on whether to force the central bank to stop the process, it looked like Tangen had a FU moment. Sunday he declared that he was giving away the fund to a public trust (where he won't be part of the board), and the rest of his money, between 500 and 700 million USD, he will put in a savings account in a bank at ~0 % interest.

I still don't like him, I don't think he is the type of person we need for that job and I don't trust there will be no corruption, but I have to admire the attitude. And he will basically paying to do the job; the salary is ~300 000 USD, and he will be paying ~1.5 million USD in wealth tax.
https://www.newsinenglish.no/2020/08/24/tangen-cleared-to-take-over-oil-fund/

I care about ethics and all, but wouldn't it be fine for him to take the $700 million and at least buy government bonds?
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: gaja on August 26, 2020, 10:30:26 AM
A relatively weird story in running in Norwegian news now, and I'm not sure whether I agree with all decisions being made, but it feels like it might fit here:

We need a new leader for the oil fund (1 000 000 000 000 USD and counting https://www.nbim.no/). Nikolai Tangen, a Norwegian investor who has been living in UK was offered the job, but there was worry about conflicts of interest and (potential for) corruption. Part of the worry was that he owned large parts of an investment fund  and loads of other stuff, total value in the billions range. After a lot of public unrest, and the parliament voting on whether to force the central bank to stop the process, it looked like Tangen had a FU moment. Sunday he declared that he was giving away the fund to a public trust (where he won't be part of the board), and the rest of his money, between 500 and 700 million USD, he will put in a savings account in a bank at ~0 % interest.

I still don't like him, I don't think he is the type of person we need for that job and I don't trust there will be no corruption, but I have to admire the attitude. And he will basically paying to do the job; the salary is ~300 000 USD, and he will be paying ~1.5 million USD in wealth tax.
https://www.newsinenglish.no/2020/08/24/tangen-cleared-to-take-over-oil-fund/

I care about ethics and all, but wouldn't it be fine for him to take the $700 million and at least buy government bonds?

Sure, and he will probably find some properties or similar to invest in, but in the heat of the moment I can imagine he didn't want to discuss any more details. Just fuck the nagging about investments; look, everything is in cash now.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Montecarlo on August 27, 2020, 09:23:50 PM
I really enjoyed reading @Plina  ‘s story!

I saw the references to 40.0ers earlier in the thread.  Admittedly I’ve only worked for one company coming out of the military, but I don’t keep a time sheet at all.  How common is it for salaried employees to keep time sheets?
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: SwordGuy on August 27, 2020, 10:05:33 PM
I really enjoyed reading @Plina  ‘s story!

I saw the references to 40.0ers earlier in the thread.  Admittedly I’ve only worked for one company coming out of the military, but I don’t keep a time sheet at all.  How common is it for salaried employees to keep time sheets?

All the defense contractors I worked for pretended I had a salaried job but I was an hourly worker.   If I didn't account for 40 hours I didn't get my full salary.    Scummy but true.

Now, the timesheet had to be kept because the company billed by the hour, so they had to have the the documentation on the hours worked.   Same when I worked as a salaried consultant for private industry (where I actually was salaried).
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Alternatepriorities on August 27, 2020, 11:43:48 PM
I really enjoyed reading @Plina  ‘s story!

I saw the references to 40.0ers earlier in the thread.  Admittedly I’ve only worked for one company coming out of the military, but I don’t keep a time sheet at all.  How common is it for salaried employees to keep time sheets?

All the defense contractors I worked for pretended I had a salaried job but I was an hourly worker.   If I didn't account for 40 hours I didn't get my full salary.    Scummy but true.

Now, the timesheet had to be kept because the company billed by the hour, so they had to have the the documentation on the hours worked.   Same when I worked as a salaried consultant for private industry (where I actually was salaried).

Same here. And it’s important to note that billing more than 40 hours never meant getting paid more than my standard salary. At least until I became a self employed contractor and billed myself out hourly.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: SwordGuy on August 28, 2020, 07:39:45 AM
I really enjoyed reading @Plina  ‘s story!

I saw the references to 40.0ers earlier in the thread.  Admittedly I’ve only worked for one company coming out of the military, but I don’t keep a time sheet at all.  How common is it for salaried employees to keep time sheets?

All the defense contractors I worked for pretended I had a salaried job but I was an hourly worker.   If I didn't account for 40 hours I didn't get my full salary.    Scummy but true.

Now, the timesheet had to be kept because the company billed by the hour, so they had to have the the documentation on the hours worked.   Same when I worked as a salaried consultant for private industry (where I actually was salaried).

Same here. And it’s important to note that billing more than 40 hours never meant getting paid more than my standard salary. At least until I became a self employed contractor and billed myself out hourly.

Yes!!   The worst of both worlds!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: LightTripper on August 28, 2020, 08:00:15 AM
I'm a consultant and get billed out by the hour.  I do however get a bonus which pretty much reflects what I billed out, how much of it (and others' revenues) I brought in, and how much of others' time/revenues I managed. I think that's pretty standard for consulting, so the time sheet is really important!

Sent from my ONEPLUS A6003 using Tapatalk

Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Sibley on August 28, 2020, 08:14:26 AM
I really enjoyed reading @Plina  ‘s story!

I saw the references to 40.0ers earlier in the thread.  Admittedly I’ve only worked for one company coming out of the military, but I don’t keep a time sheet at all.  How common is it for salaried employees to keep time sheets?

All the defense contractors I worked for pretended I had a salaried job but I was an hourly worker.   If I didn't account for 40 hours I didn't get my full salary.    Scummy but true.

Now, the timesheet had to be kept because the company billed by the hour, so they had to have the the documentation on the hours worked.   Same when I worked as a salaried consultant for private industry (where I actually was salaried).

Same here. And it’s important to note that billing more than 40 hours never meant getting paid more than my standard salary. At least until I became a self employed contractor and billed myself out hourly.

Yes!!   The worst of both worlds!

Are these companies subject to State labor laws? Because if so, that's illegal.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Alternatepriorities on August 28, 2020, 11:46:25 AM
I really enjoyed reading @Plina  ‘s story!

I saw the references to 40.0ers earlier in the thread.  Admittedly I’ve only worked for one company coming out of the military, but I don’t keep a time sheet at all.  How common is it for salaried employees to keep time sheets?

All the defense contractors I worked for pretended I had a salaried job but I was an hourly worker.   If I didn't account for 40 hours I didn't get my full salary.    Scummy but true.

Now, the timesheet had to be kept because the company billed by the hour, so they had to have the the documentation on the hours worked.   Same when I worked as a salaried consultant for private industry (where I actually was salaried).

Same here. And it’s important to note that billing more than 40 hours never meant getting paid more than my standard salary. At least until I became a self employed contractor and billed myself out hourly.

Yes!!   The worst of both worlds!

Are these companies subject to State labor laws? Because if so, that's illegal.

In my examples at least it was not "required" that I work more than 40 hours a week. The experience sticks with me because I grew up very blue collar and have never fully shifted away from the hourly rate mind set. To me working unpaid overtime meant my hourly rate was decreasing. I asked other salaried people about that and they all said "salaried means I'm paid to do this job and how many hours it takes doesn't matter". That answer bothered me because finishing the job in 30 hours wasn't allowed. I was able to flex my time all over the place at the first company so I'd have 6 hours one day and 9 two other days and no one cared. That was the company from the previous epic FU money story...

Over the years I've come to the conclusion that the different ways people relate time and money explains much of difference in how we relate to money. It's a lot harder to spend wildly or be super generous when it feels like I've literally trades "X" hours of my life for the money I'm spending/giving.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Sibley on August 28, 2020, 01:03:44 PM
I really enjoyed reading @Plina  ‘s story!

I saw the references to 40.0ers earlier in the thread.  Admittedly I’ve only worked for one company coming out of the military, but I don’t keep a time sheet at all.  How common is it for salaried employees to keep time sheets?

All the defense contractors I worked for pretended I had a salaried job but I was an hourly worker.   If I didn't account for 40 hours I didn't get my full salary.    Scummy but true.

Now, the timesheet had to be kept because the company billed by the hour, so they had to have the the documentation on the hours worked.   Same when I worked as a salaried consultant for private industry (where I actually was salaried).

Same here. And it’s important to note that billing more than 40 hours never meant getting paid more than my standard salary. At least until I became a self employed contractor and billed myself out hourly.

Yes!!   The worst of both worlds!

Are these companies subject to State labor laws? Because if so, that's illegal.

In my examples at least it was not "required" that I work more than 40 hours a week. The experience sticks with me because I grew up very blue collar and have never fully shifted away from the hourly rate mind set. To me working unpaid overtime meant my hourly rate was decreasing. I asked other salaried people about that and they all said "salaried means I'm paid to do this job and how many hours it takes doesn't matter". That answer bothered me because finishing the job in 30 hours wasn't allowed. I was able to flex my time all over the place at the first company so I'd have 6 hours one day and 9 two other days and no one cared. That was the company from the previous epic FU money story...

Over the years I've come to the conclusion that the different ways people relate time and money explains much of difference in how we relate to money. It's a lot harder to spend wildly or be super generous when it feels like I've literally trades "X" hours of my life for the money I'm spending/giving.

You're not wrong, but if you're classified as salary, and you work less than 40 hours, then it's generally illegal to dock your pay if someone works less. That's part of the justification for not requiring overtime pay for working more than 40 hours.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: markbike528CBX on August 28, 2020, 01:37:03 PM
I really enjoyed reading @Plina  ‘s story!

I saw the references to 40.0ers earlier in the thread.  Admittedly I’ve only worked for one company coming out of the military, but I don’t keep a time sheet at all.  How common is it for salaried employees to keep time sheets?

All the defense contractors I worked for pretended I had a salaried job but I was an hourly worker.   If I didn't account for 40 hours I didn't get my full salary.    Scummy but true.

Now, the timesheet had to be kept because the company billed by the hour, so they had to have the the documentation on the hours worked.   Same when I worked as a salaried consultant for private industry (where I actually was salaried).

Same here. And it’s important to note that billing more than 40 hours never meant getting paid more than my standard salary. At least until I became a self employed contractor and billed myself out hourly.

Yes!!   The worst of both worlds!

Are these companies subject to State labor laws? Because if so, that's illegal.

In my examples at least it was not "required" that I work more than 40 hours a week. The experience sticks with me because I grew up very blue collar and have never fully shifted away from the hourly rate mind set. To me working unpaid overtime meant my hourly rate was decreasing. I asked other salaried people about that and they all said "salaried means I'm paid to do this job and how many hours it takes doesn't matter". That answer bothered me because finishing the job in 30 hours wasn't allowed. I was able to flex my time all over the place at the first company so I'd have 6 hours one day and 9 two other days and no one cared. That was the company from the previous epic FU money story...

Over the years I've come to the conclusion that the different ways people relate time and money explains much of difference in how we relate to money. It's a lot harder to spend wildly or be super generous when it feels like I've literally trades "X" hours of my life for the money I'm spending/giving.

You're not wrong, but if you're classified as salary, and you work less than 40 hours, then it's generally illegal to dock your pay if someone works less. That's part of the justification for not requiring overtime pay for working more than 40 hours.
Yep, illegal to dock pay, but if you have a "butts in seats" sort of boss, you'll get short-shrifted on pay raises, promotions, and an extra dose of hassle.

At SemiBigCorp, we had to jump through lots of hoops if we wanted to get paid overtime when working at the home or other office.  Even out in the field, it had to be special circumstances (SemiBigCorp was in bankruptcy at the time though).

My understanding of US federal government is timesheets are _required_ for billing the government, but not related to salaried pay. 
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Alternatepriorities on August 28, 2020, 01:39:55 PM
I really enjoyed reading @Plina  ‘s story!

I saw the references to 40.0ers earlier in the thread.  Admittedly I’ve only worked for one company coming out of the military, but I don’t keep a time sheet at all.  How common is it for salaried employees to keep time sheets?

All the defense contractors I worked for pretended I had a salaried job but I was an hourly worker.   If I didn't account for 40 hours I didn't get my full salary.    Scummy but true.

Now, the timesheet had to be kept because the company billed by the hour, so they had to have the the documentation on the hours worked.   Same when I worked as a salaried consultant for private industry (where I actually was salaried).

Same here. And it’s important to note that billing more than 40 hours never meant getting paid more than my standard salary. At least until I became a self employed contractor and billed myself out hourly.

Yes!!   The worst of both worlds!

Are these companies subject to State labor laws? Because if so, that's illegal.

In my examples at least it was not "required" that I work more than 40 hours a week. The experience sticks with me because I grew up very blue collar and have never fully shifted away from the hourly rate mind set. To me working unpaid overtime meant my hourly rate was decreasing. I asked other salaried people about that and they all said "salaried means I'm paid to do this job and how many hours it takes doesn't matter". That answer bothered me because finishing the job in 30 hours wasn't allowed. I was able to flex my time all over the place at the first company so I'd have 6 hours one day and 9 two other days and no one cared. That was the company from the previous epic FU money story...

Over the years I've come to the conclusion that the different ways people relate time and money explains much of difference in how we relate to money. It's a lot harder to spend wildly or be super generous when it feels like I've literally trades "X" hours of my life for the money I'm spending/giving.

You're not wrong, but if you're classified as salary, and you work less than 40 hours, then it's generally illegal to dock your pay if someone works less. That's part of the justification for not requiring overtime pay for working more than 40 hours.

I'd be a lot more likely to contest the issue today. Another reason to have FU money... Or at least a polite "no thank you" money.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: slipslop on August 30, 2020, 02:49:09 PM
Perhaps more in the “polite ‘no thank you’” than the “epic FU”, but still feeling pretty Epic right now.


Business Clients: We need X, built in this way.
Yours truly: This is pretty expensive. You could consider alternative A, which gets you 80% of what you need in about 20% of the time, or alternative B, which gets you 95% of what you need in 40% of the time.
Business Client Director: No. We need X, built in this way.
Yours truly to my managers: Thats fine. Based on historical time and the best numbers and research we have, we can have this ready for you between August and November of 2021.
My managers: Yikes! They’ll never go for that. We will present that we can have it between March and April of 2021.
Yours truly: Based on history and everything that we know, that is unlikely to be true. Remember that there are alternatives that are realistic though less complete, in that timeline.
My managers to my director: We can have it done between March and April of 2021.
My managers and director to Business Client Director: We can have it done between March and April of 2021.
Business Client Director: We need it done by December 2020.
My managers to Business Client Director: We can revisit alternative A, which is feasible in that time frame, or alternative B, which can be done in just a few additional months.
Business Client Director: No. We need X, built in this way. By December 2020.
My Director: You will have it.
My Managers: Okay, we understand. You will have it.
My Managers to me: We will have to have it done by December 2020 in this way. Here is a plan that, if we execute perfectly an a way that we have never done before, we hope will get us done by December 2020.
Yours truly: With this plan, the delivery date calculates out to June of 2021? That’s an improvement, but…
My Managers: Well, you will work something out.

Yours truly, a day later: I have just applied for these other internal positions. I hope you will support my transfer.


Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: okits on August 30, 2020, 03:43:10 PM
Perhaps more in the “polite ‘no thank you’” than the “epic FU”, but still feeling pretty Epic right now.

Face-palm for everyone involved except you!  🤦🏻‍♀️  Good for you for consistently offering realistic timelines.

Yours truly, a day later: I have just applied for these other internal positions. I hope you will support my transfer.

If there's any danger whatsoever that your current bosses would try to block an internal move, you'd do well to look externally, too.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: slipslop on August 30, 2020, 03:49:45 PM
Yours truly, a day later: I have just applied for these other internal positions. I hope you will support my transfer.

If there's any danger whatsoever that your current bosses would try to block an internal move, you'd do well to look externally, too.

I have applied to more external positions than internal. But, unlike the internal positions, I don't have to tell my bosses about the external positions until my departure is imminent.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: okits on August 30, 2020, 04:00:09 PM
Yours truly, a day later: I have just applied for these other internal positions. I hope you will support my transfer.

If there's any danger whatsoever that your current bosses would try to block an internal move, you'd do well to look externally, too.

I have applied to more external positions than internal. But, unlike the internal positions, I don't have to tell my bosses about the external positions until my departure is imminent.

Good job!  👍 I hope you land someplace good before current place squeezes you too hard for this unrealistic project.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: scottish on August 30, 2020, 05:53:20 PM
I know you're planning on leaving but...

All these managers.    Do they actually help manage the project, or do they just give you objectives and tell you to figure it out?

If you can get them involved in running the project it may help with delivery.   Presumably their ass is on the line as well as yours.   
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: BicycleB on August 30, 2020, 08:15:21 PM
Perhaps more in the “polite ‘no thank you’” than the “epic FU”, but still feeling pretty Epic right now...

Yours truly, a day later: I have just applied for these other internal positions. I hope you will support my transfer.

(claps) Well done, @slipslop!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: NorthernMonkey on August 31, 2020, 03:18:33 AM
I really enjoyed reading @Plina  ‘s story!

I saw the references to 40.0ers earlier in the thread.  Admittedly I’ve only worked for one company coming out of the military, but I don’t keep a time sheet at all.  How common is it for salaried employees to keep time sheets?

Where I work, all the guys that report into me are salaried, and we keep time sheets. They are used to work out cost allocation of engineering time to projects (each hour of engineer time worked on a project gets billed $x to that project).

They arent used to keep track of how much work people are doing since theyre the most hopeless way of measuring productivity. Its easy to record 12 hours working in one day, but spend the whole day watching netflix, and equally to work your ass off for 4 hours and get loads done.

Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: engineerjourney on September 01, 2020, 05:29:50 AM
I really enjoyed reading @Plina  ‘s story!

I saw the references to 40.0ers earlier in the thread.  Admittedly I’ve only worked for one company coming out of the military, but I don’t keep a time sheet at all.  How common is it for salaried employees to keep time sheets?

All the defense contractors I worked for pretended I had a salaried job but I was an hourly worker.   If I didn't account for 40 hours I didn't get my full salary.    Scummy but true.

Now, the timesheet had to be kept because the company billed by the hour, so they had to have the the documentation on the hours worked.   Same when I worked as a salaried consultant for private industry (where I actually was salaried).

Same here. And it’s important to note that billing more than 40 hours never meant getting paid more than my standard salary. At least until I became a self employed contractor and billed myself out hourly.

Yes!!   The worst of both worlds!

Are these companies subject to State labor laws? Because if so, that's illegal.

In my examples at least it was not "required" that I work more than 40 hours a week. The experience sticks with me because I grew up very blue collar and have never fully shifted away from the hourly rate mind set. To me working unpaid overtime meant my hourly rate was decreasing. I asked other salaried people about that and they all said "salaried means I'm paid to do this job and how many hours it takes doesn't matter". That answer bothered me because finishing the job in 30 hours wasn't allowed. I was able to flex my time all over the place at the first company so I'd have 6 hours one day and 9 two other days and no one cared. That was the company from the previous epic FU money story...

Over the years I've come to the conclusion that the different ways people relate time and money explains much of difference in how we relate to money. It's a lot harder to spend wildly or be super generous when it feels like I've literally trades "X" hours of my life for the money I'm spending/giving.

You're not wrong, but if you're classified as salary, and you work less than 40 hours, then it's generally illegal to dock your pay if someone works less. That's part of the justification for not requiring overtime pay for working more than 40 hours.

They don't dock your pay, they just make you use your PTO or vacation or sick time if you go under 40 which is legal from my reading.  And being salary exempt (most white collar salary) means they don't have to pay you for overtime. 
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: rockstache on September 01, 2020, 05:42:04 AM
Actually...I don't think that's legal. ^^^ It might be stricter in my state (most things are), but generally if they treat you as an hourly employee, then they have to classify you as one. The guidance we were given by the AGs office is that salaried employees should always take their PTO in 4 or 8 hour increments. If they're being required to put in 1-2 hour vacation or sick time increments, then they're hourly employees and need to be classified that way. It's one of the things that falls in favor of the employee, not the employer, so to keep from running afoul of the law, they should not be topping off people's under 40 with vacation or sick. JMHO
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Sugaree on September 01, 2020, 05:47:24 AM
Actually...I don't think that's legal. ^^^ It might be stricter in my state (most things are), but generally if they treat you as an hourly employee, then they have to classify you as one. The guidance we were given by the AGs office is that salaried employees should always take their PTO in 4 or 8 hour increments. If they're being required to put in 1-2 hour vacation or sick time increments, then they're hourly employees and need to be classified that way. It's one of the things that falls in favor of the employee, not the employer, so to keep from running afoul of the law, they should not be topping off people's under 40 with vacation or sick. JMHO

This has been something that I've been going through at work.  I've been (probably rightly) classified as exempt for the last 11 years.  The new HR specialist came in and audited my status and decided that I should be non-exempt.  I got a nice chunk of backpay for 300-400 hours of backpay over the last 2 years, but I'm not convinced that the next HR specialist won't reverse that and ask for it back. 
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: dcheesi on September 01, 2020, 08:45:51 AM
Actually...I don't think that's legal. ^^^ It might be stricter in my state (most things are), but generally if they treat you as an hourly employee, then they have to classify you as one. The guidance we were given by the AGs office is that salaried employees should always take their PTO in 4 or 8 hour increments. If they're being required to put in 1-2 hour vacation or sick time increments, then they're hourly employees and need to be classified that way. It's one of the things that falls in favor of the employee, not the employer, so to keep from running afoul of the law, they should not be topping off people's under 40 with vacation or sick. JMHO

This has been something that I've been going through at work.  I've been (probably rightly) classified as exempt for the last 11 years.  The new HR specialist came in and audited my status and decided that I should be non-exempt.  I got a nice chunk of backpay for 300-400 hours of backpay over the last 2 years, but I'm not convinced that the next HR specialist won't reverse that and ask for it back.
Same thing happened to a friend of mine; someone made a labor complaint, and next thing you know he and bunch of other people in professional positions were reclassified as hourly. There's a big difference between what companies get away with (most of the time), and what's actually legal. And sometimes it's a case by case thing.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Plina on September 01, 2020, 11:32:55 AM
I really enjoyed reading @Plina  ‘s story!


Thanks @Montecarlo!

I had my first real workday at the new job today. Looking good so far. :) I started it last week with a conference at a spa.

I visited my former job last Monday to return my computer etc. We had an akward 45 minutes coffee and cake farewell, were I told the happy news about my new workplace. My former boss concluded twice that she thought the job would fit me well and I got a outdoor plant, that weighs about 5 kilos as a farewell gift. Considering that it was a pain in the ass to get home when you don't use public transport I was pretty close to dumping it in the closest trash can but used the bike service to get it home. I will consider the 5 months pay that they paid as a nice farewell gift! My guess is that 1-2 of my colleagues will also be leaving within 1-2 years. I happened to arrive at the end of a meeting and one of my colleagues were clearly frustrated with the lack of progress and she saw the results of opposing the boss.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: mm1970 on September 01, 2020, 12:13:14 PM
Perhaps more in the “polite ‘no thank you’” than the “epic FU”, but still feeling pretty Epic right now.


Business Clients: We need X, built in this way.
Yours truly: This is pretty expensive. You could consider alternative A, which gets you 80% of what you need in about 20% of the time, or alternative B, which gets you 95% of what you need in 40% of the time.
Business Client Director: No. We need X, built in this way.
Yours truly to my managers: Thats fine. Based on historical time and the best numbers and research we have, we can have this ready for you between August and November of 2021.
My managers: Yikes! They’ll never go for that. We will present that we can have it between March and April of 2021.
Yours truly: Based on history and everything that we know, that is unlikely to be true. Remember that there are alternatives that are realistic though less complete, in that timeline.
My managers to my director: We can have it done between March and April of 2021.
My managers and director to Business Client Director: We can have it done between March and April of 2021.
Business Client Director: We need it done by December 2020.
My managers to Business Client Director: We can revisit alternative A, which is feasible in that time frame, or alternative B, which can be done in just a few additional months.
Business Client Director: No. We need X, built in this way. By December 2020.
My Director: You will have it.
My Managers: Okay, we understand. You will have it.
My Managers to me: We will have to have it done by December 2020 in this way. Here is a plan that, if we execute perfectly an a way that we have never done before, we hope will get us done by December 2020.
Yours truly: With this plan, the delivery date calculates out to June of 2021? That’s an improvement, but…
My Managers: Well, you will work something out.

Yours truly, a day later: I have just applied for these other internal positions. I hope you will support my transfer.
I don't know how I missed this.

This is my life.  Our company got into an agreement with another company with milestones for four projects built into the calendar for 2-3 years.

Not a single milestone is/was achievable based on how long it takes to actually build things.  Not a one.  OH, and 3 of the projects had the same damn due date, and are competing for all the same equipment.  Really.

I'm the program manager, who is always telling... everyone...here's the schedule but we won't meet it... lather, rinse, repeat for 4 projects for 3 years...
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Sugaree on September 01, 2020, 12:53:41 PM
Actually...I don't think that's legal. ^^^ It might be stricter in my state (most things are), but generally if they treat you as an hourly employee, then they have to classify you as one. The guidance we were given by the AGs office is that salaried employees should always take their PTO in 4 or 8 hour increments. If they're being required to put in 1-2 hour vacation or sick time increments, then they're hourly employees and need to be classified that way. It's one of the things that falls in favor of the employee, not the employer, so to keep from running afoul of the law, they should not be topping off people's under 40 with vacation or sick. JMHO

This has been something that I've been going through at work.  I've been (probably rightly) classified as exempt for the last 11 years.  The new HR specialist came in and audited my status and decided that I should be non-exempt.  I got a nice chunk of backpay for 300-400 hours of backpay over the last 2 years, but I'm not convinced that the next HR specialist won't reverse that and ask for it back.
Same thing happened to a friend of mine; someone made a labor complaint, and next thing you know he and bunch of other people in professional positions were reclassified as hourly. There's a big difference between what companies get away with (most of the time), and what's actually legal. And sometimes it's a case by case thing.

I'll be honest and say that I'm pretty sure the original HR specialist had it right and I should have been exempt as a computer worker.  I fall into that really narrow definition of computer worker that existed when the FLSA was written.  My co-workers who are system admins and network admins have always been coded non-exempt because they didn't write code.   
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Alternatepriorities on September 01, 2020, 12:55:36 PM
Perhaps more in the “polite ‘no thank you’” than the “epic FU”, but still feeling pretty Epic right now.


Business Clients: We need X, built in this way.
Yours truly: This is pretty expensive. You could consider alternative A, which gets you 80% of what you need in about 20% of the time, or alternative B, which gets you 95% of what you need in 40% of the time.
Business Client Director: No. We need X, built in this way.
Yours truly to my managers: Thats fine. Based on historical time and the best numbers and research we have, we can have this ready for you between August and November of 2021.
My managers: Yikes! They’ll never go for that. We will present that we can have it between March and April of 2021.
Yours truly: Based on history and everything that we know, that is unlikely to be true. Remember that there are alternatives that are realistic though less complete, in that timeline.
My managers to my director: We can have it done between March and April of 2021.
My managers and director to Business Client Director: We can have it done between March and April of 2021.
Business Client Director: We need it done by December 2020.
My managers to Business Client Director: We can revisit alternative A, which is feasible in that time frame, or alternative B, which can be done in just a few additional months.
Business Client Director: No. We need X, built in this way. By December 2020.
My Director: You will have it.
My Managers: Okay, we understand. You will have it.
My Managers to me: We will have to have it done by December 2020 in this way. Here is a plan that, if we execute perfectly an a way that we have never done before, we hope will get us done by December 2020.
Yours truly: With this plan, the delivery date calculates out to June of 2021? That’s an improvement, but…
My Managers: Well, you will work something out.

Yours truly, a day later: I have just applied for these other internal positions. I hope you will support my transfer.
I don't know how I missed this.

This is my life.  Our company got into an agreement with another company with milestones for four projects built into the calendar for 2-3 years.

Not a single milestone is/was achievable based on how long it takes to actually build things.  Not a one.  OH, and 3 of the projects had the same damn due date, and are competing for all the same equipment.  Really.

I'm the program manager, who is always telling... everyone...here's the schedule but we won't meet it... lather, rinse, repeat for 4 projects for 3 years...

It was trying to meet those impossible deadlines as the lead engineer that drove me towards FIRE before I found MMM and had a word for it. There is nothing like sitting in a meeting listening to the supper optimistic promises being made and knowing it would fall to me to make it happen if it were possible. Oddly enough after I left that job I had a conversation with the ridiculously optimistic VP as friends and found the endless optimism really encouraging... It feels very different when it isn't my job to engineer their dreams into reality.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: joleran on September 01, 2020, 01:00:15 PM
It was trying to meet those impossible deadlines as the lead engineer that drove me towards FIRE before I found MMM and had a word for it. There is nothing like sitting in a meeting listening to the supper optimistic promises being made and knowing it would fall to me to make it happen if it were possible. Oddly enough after I left that job I had a conversation with the ridiculously optimistic VP as friends and found the endless optimism really encouraging... It feels very different when it isn't my job to engineer their dreams into reality.

It's only been in the last year that I've started to think of deadlines more as "promise rings" than marriage.  I don't know any actual stats but it seems like at least 80% of them are missed across a good few companies and their vendors in my experience.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Alternatepriorities on September 01, 2020, 01:02:09 PM
It was trying to meet those impossible deadlines as the lead engineer that drove me towards FIRE before I found MMM and had a word for it. There is nothing like sitting in a meeting listening to the supper optimistic promises being made and knowing it would fall to me to make it happen if it were possible. Oddly enough after I left that job I had a conversation with the ridiculously optimistic VP as friends and found the endless optimism really encouraging... It feels very different when it isn't my job to engineer their dreams into reality.

It's only been in the last year that I've started to think of deadlines more as "promise rings" than marriage.  I don't know any actual stats but it seems like at least 80% of them are missed across a good few companies and their vendors in my experience.

I wish I had learned that sooner.

Although the motivation to FIRE has worked out very well so maybe it was worth the stress...
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: ScreamingHeadGuy on September 01, 2020, 07:38:36 PM
Perhaps more in the “polite ‘no thank you’” than the “epic FU”, but still feeling pretty Epic right now.


Business Clients: We need X, built in this way.
Yours truly: This is pretty expensive. You could consider alternative A, which gets you 80% of what you need in about 20% of the time, or alternative B, which gets you 95% of what you need in 40% of the time.
Business Client Director: No. We need X, built in this way.
Yours truly to my managers: Thats fine. Based on historical time and the best numbers and research we have, we can have this ready for you between August and November of 2021.
My managers: Yikes! They’ll never go for that. We will present that we can have it between March and April of 2021.
Yours truly: Based on history and everything that we know, that is unlikely to be true. Remember that there are alternatives that are realistic though less complete, in that timeline.
My managers to my director: We can have it done between March and April of 2021.
My managers and director to Business Client Director: We can have it done between March and April of 2021.
Business Client Director: We need it done by December 2020.
My managers to Business Client Director: We can revisit alternative A, which is feasible in that time frame, or alternative B, which can be done in just a few additional months.
Business Client Director: No. We need X, built in this way. By December 2020.
My Director: You will have it.
My Managers: Okay, we understand. You will have it.
My Managers to me: We will have to have it done by December 2020 in this way. Here is a plan that, if we execute perfectly an a way that we have never done before, we hope will get us done by December 2020.
Yours truly: With this plan, the delivery date calculates out to June of 2021? That’s an improvement, but…
My Managers: Well, you will work something out.

Yours truly, a day later: I have just applied for these other internal positions. I hope you will support my transfer.

Like a boss.  I give you a slowclap!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: alcon835 on September 02, 2020, 07:13:47 AM
I really enjoyed reading @Plina  ‘s story!


Thanks @Montecarlo!

I had my first real workday at the new job today. Looking good so far. :) I started it last week with a conference at a spa.

I visited my former job last Monday to return my computer etc. We had an akward 45 minutes coffee and cake farewell, were I told the happy news about my new workplace. My former boss concluded twice that she thought the job would fit me well and I got a outdoor plant, that weighs about 5 kilos as a farewell gift. Considering that it was a pain in the ass to get home when you don't use public transport I was pretty close to dumping it in the closest trash can but used the bike service to get it home. I will consider the 5 months pay that they paid as a nice farewell gift! My guess is that 1-2 of my colleagues will also be leaving within 1-2 years. I happened to arrive at the end of a meeting and one of my colleagues were clearly frustrated with the lack of progress and she saw the results of opposing the boss.

It's good to see your happy ending!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Dicey on September 02, 2020, 07:32:03 AM
...and a happy beginning.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: jinga nation on September 02, 2020, 12:33:34 PM
I really enjoyed reading @Plina  ‘s story!

I saw the references to 40.0ers earlier in the thread.  Admittedly I’ve only worked for one company coming out of the military, but I don’t keep a time sheet at all.  How common is it for salaried employees to keep time sheets?

All the defense contractors I worked for pretended I had a salaried job but I was an hourly worker.   If I didn't account for 40 hours I didn't get my full salary.    Scummy but true.

Now, the timesheet had to be kept because the company billed by the hour, so they had to have the the documentation on the hours worked.   Same when I worked as a salaried consultant for private industry (where I actually was salaried).

Same here. And it’s important to note that billing more than 40 hours never meant getting paid more than my standard salary. At least until I became a self employed contractor and billed myself out hourly.

Yes!!   The worst of both worlds!

Are these companies subject to State labor laws? Because if so, that's illegal.

In my examples at least it was not "required" that I work more than 40 hours a week. The experience sticks with me because I grew up very blue collar and have never fully shifted away from the hourly rate mind set. To me working unpaid overtime meant my hourly rate was decreasing. I asked other salaried people about that and they all said "salaried means I'm paid to do this job and how many hours it takes doesn't matter". That answer bothered me because finishing the job in 30 hours wasn't allowed. I was able to flex my time all over the place at the first company so I'd have 6 hours one day and 9 two other days and no one cared. That was the company from the previous epic FU money story...

Over the years I've come to the conclusion that the different ways people relate time and money explains much of difference in how we relate to money. It's a lot harder to spend wildly or be super generous when it feels like I've literally trades "X" hours of my life for the money I'm spending/giving.

You're not wrong, but if you're classified as salary, and you work less than 40 hours, then it's generally illegal to dock your pay if someone works less. That's part of the justification for not requiring overtime pay for working more than 40 hours.

They don't dock your pay, they just make you use your PTO or vacation or sick time if you go under 40 which is legal from my reading.  And being salary exempt (most white collar salary) means they don't have to pay you for overtime.
Fellow defense contractor here. On my contracts since 2010, even though I'm salaried, every hour that I work over 40 (has to be pre-authorized by customer) gets me paid at the regular rate. If I work over 40 without pre-auth, I don't get paid and both my employer and customer frown. If I work under 40, have to make it up with PTO hours. If out of PTO, then lube up to get bent over by HR.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: jinga nation on September 02, 2020, 12:43:11 PM
Perhaps more in the “polite ‘no thank you’” than the “epic FU”, but still feeling pretty Epic right now.


Business Clients: We need X, built in this way.
Yours truly: This is pretty expensive. You could consider alternative A, which gets you 80% of what you need in about 20% of the time, or alternative B, which gets you 95% of what you need in 40% of the time.
Business Client Director: No. We need X, built in this way.
Yours truly to my managers: Thats fine. Based on historical time and the best numbers and research we have, we can have this ready for you between August and November of 2021.
My managers: Yikes! They’ll never go for that. We will present that we can have it between March and April of 2021.
Yours truly: Based on history and everything that we know, that is unlikely to be true. Remember that there are alternatives that are realistic though less complete, in that timeline.
My managers to my director: We can have it done between March and April of 2021.
My managers and director to Business Client Director: We can have it done between March and April of 2021.
Business Client Director: We need it done by December 2020.
My managers to Business Client Director: We can revisit alternative A, which is feasible in that time frame, or alternative B, which can be done in just a few additional months.
Business Client Director: No. We need X, built in this way. By December 2020.
My Director: You will have it.
My Managers: Okay, we understand. You will have it.
My Managers to me: We will have to have it done by December 2020 in this way. Here is a plan that, if we execute perfectly an a way that we have never done before, we hope will get us done by December 2020.
Yours truly: With this plan, the delivery date calculates out to June of 2021? That’s an improvement, but…
My Managers: Well, you will work something out.

Yours truly, a day later: I have just applied for these other internal positions. I hope you will support my transfer.
I don't know how I missed this.

This is my life.  Our company got into an agreement with another company with milestones for four projects built into the calendar for 2-3 years.

Not a single milestone is/was achievable based on how long it takes to actually build things.  Not a one.  OH, and 3 of the projects had the same damn due date, and are competing for all the same equipment.  Really.

I'm the program manager, who is always telling... everyone...here's the schedule but we won't meet it... lather, rinse, repeat for 4 projects for 3 years...

It was trying to meet those impossible deadlines as the lead engineer that drove me towards FIRE before I found MMM and had a word for it. There is nothing like sitting in a meeting listening to the supper optimistic promises being made and knowing it would fall to me to make it happen if it were possible. Oddly enough after I left that job I had a conversation with the ridiculously optimistic VP as friends and found the endless optimism really encouraging... It feels very different when it isn't my job to engineer their dreams into reality.

@slipslop i'm living this right now on a current contract. luckily my internal PM and management thinks like me, and value my inputs and judgement.

My director knows I have FU money. He knows I have a good rental income that would cover food, housing, utilities, plus more. He knows our family income is more than what he makes. But he's also an engineer at heart and accepts logical inputs and lets me be picky about contracts and projects i wish to work on.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Sand101 on September 02, 2020, 08:41:53 PM

My managers and director to Business Client Director: We can have it done between March and April of 2021.
Business Client Director: We need it done by December 2020.


Luckily I have reasonably risk averse bosses, but the above is my life.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: joleran on September 03, 2020, 08:10:11 PM
Now that I am retired, I can share this.

I was fed up with my job and had a "check-in" call in an open office, but with a remote manager.  I put the call on conference where I loudly told them I hadn't done any work for the last several months, had no confidence in the ability of our products to make money, and they needed to tell me how that was going to happen.  They offered me a written retention bonus to stay on for another year.  I asked for changes in the bonus offer phrasing and more money.  After a meeting with executive management and general counsel to negotiate the agreement and to talk about the direction of the company, they accepted and I got what I asked for.

To this day I don't know why they didn't just kick me to the curb, but other than actually saying it, "FU money" indeed.  Absolute insanity and stupidity on my part and everyone else involved.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Model96 on September 03, 2020, 10:40:41 PM
Now that I am retired, I can share this.

I was fed up with my job and had a "check-in" call in an open office, but with a remote manager.  I put the call on conference where I loudly told them I hadn't done any work for the last several months, had no confidence in the ability of our products to make money, and they needed to tell me how that was going to happen.  They offered me a written retention bonus to stay on for another year.  I asked for changes in the bonus offer phrasing and more money.  After a meeting with executive management and general counsel to negotiate the agreement and to talk about the direction of the company, they accepted and I got what I asked for.

To this day I don't know why they didn't just kick me to the curb, but other than actually saying it, "FU money" indeed.  Absolute insanity and stupidity on my part and everyone else involved.

Not insanity and stupidity on your part...unless you had no FU miney! I was advising my daughter just this morning to ask for a pay rise, when she complained the management at her job had lost the plot and people were leaving wholesale. She might as well try to get better pay before she finds a better employer!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: ysette9 on September 03, 2020, 11:35:49 PM
I really enjoyed reading @Plina  ‘s story!

I saw the references to 40.0ers earlier in the thread.  Admittedly I’ve only worked for one company coming out of the military, but I don’t keep a time sheet at all.  How common is it for salaried employees to keep time sheets?

All the defense contractors I worked for pretended I had a salaried job but I was an hourly worker.   If I didn't account for 40 hours I didn't get my full salary.    Scummy but true.

Now, the timesheet had to be kept because the company billed by the hour, so they had to have the the documentation on the hours worked.   Same when I worked as a salaried consultant for private industry (where I actually was salaried).

Same here. And it’s important to note that billing more than 40 hours never meant getting paid more than my standard salary. At least until I became a self employed contractor and billed myself out hourly.

Yes!!   The worst of both worlds!

Are these companies subject to State labor laws? Because if so, that's illegal.

In my examples at least it was not "required" that I work more than 40 hours a week. The experience sticks with me because I grew up very blue collar and have never fully shifted away from the hourly rate mind set. To me working unpaid overtime meant my hourly rate was decreasing. I asked other salaried people about that and they all said "salaried means I'm paid to do this job and how many hours it takes doesn't matter". That answer bothered me because finishing the job in 30 hours wasn't allowed. I was able to flex my time all over the place at the first company so I'd have 6 hours one day and 9 two other days and no one cared. That was the company from the previous epic FU money story...

Over the years I've come to the conclusion that the different ways people relate time and money explains much of difference in how we relate to money. It's a lot harder to spend wildly or be super generous when it feels like I've literally trades "X" hours of my life for the money I'm spending/giving.

You're not wrong, but if you're classified as salary, and you work less than 40 hours, then it's generally illegal to dock your pay if someone works less. That's part of the justification for not requiring overtime pay for working more than 40 hours.

They don't dock your pay, they just make you use your PTO or vacation or sick time if you go under 40 which is legal from my reading.  And being salary exempt (most white collar salary) means they don't have to pay you for overtime.
Fellow defense contractor here. On my contracts since 2010, even though I'm salaried, every hour that I work over 40 (has to be pre-authorized by customer) gets me paid at the regular rate. If I work over 40 without pre-auth, I don't get paid and both my employer and customer frown. If I work under 40, have to make it up with PTO hours. If out of PTO, then lube up to get bent over by HR.
I spent most of my career at a defense contractor and then a year or so at a tech company at the end. It was amazingly feeling to no longer keep a time card. For the first time in my career I took lunch breaks and socialized with coworkers. It was an actual, enjoyable break rather than a constant watch the clock trade off thinking about how much later I would have to stay at the end of the day.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: dcheesi on September 04, 2020, 01:11:27 PM
Now that I am retired, I can share this.

I was fed up with my job and had a "check-in" call in an open office, but with a remote manager.  I put the call on conference where I loudly told them I hadn't done any work for the last several months, had no confidence in the ability of our products to make money, and they needed to tell me how that was going to happen.  They offered me a written retention bonus to stay on for another year.  I asked for changes in the bonus offer phrasing and more money.  After a meeting with executive management and general counsel to negotiate the agreement and to talk about the direction of the company, they accepted and I got what I asked for.

To this day I don't know why they didn't just kick me to the curb, but other than actually saying it, "FU money" indeed.  Absolute insanity and stupidity on my part and everyone else involved.
This sounds a lot like a scene from Office Space!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: joleran on September 04, 2020, 07:59:47 PM
This sounds a lot like a scene from Office Space!

There is so much power in doing crazy stuff that most people would never think of doing.  Maybe I'll get bitten someday, but every time I think I've just gone too far... I get accommodated.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: LennStar on September 05, 2020, 02:52:40 AM
Take the time to truly THANK your boss for what he does for you and your team.   They deserve it.

Plus, you might have a ready-made job waiting for you wherever they end up. :)

I try to explain to younger folks that they are only one sociopath away from being sick to death of their job and burnt out their career, so get that FU money lined up asap.
Yeah, thank him. Such people get never praised enough.

I want to mention that sociopaths are 3 times more likely to encounter on big companie's top level than in the whole population. Afaik no one has done a study about middle levels of management, but I suspect the rate is even higher there.


If he is worth billions would not the cost of the conference/holiday equal what it cost for an ordinary person to invite their friends for a party or dinner if you compare incomes and costs?

But that isn't the measure of the potential to bribe. Even if a gift is insignificant to give, if it is significant for the recipient then it might be enough to influence a decision. Looking like a bribe, or close to a bribe, or possibly a bribe is a problem in itself.
Actually the worth is negligible on an emotional level, that's just the way our brains are wired as a "social animal". The mentioned flower is not a bribe because it is seen as just normal social behavior (and btw. that may be true for the rich giver in the fund case) like shaking hands.
However, if you would add something that is unusual, even if the cost is only 10€, the reciever will be influenced to reciproce.

I really enjoyed reading @Plina  ‘s story!

I saw the references to 40.0ers earlier in the thread.  Admittedly I’ve only worked for one company coming out of the military, but I don’t keep a time sheet at all.  How common is it for salaried employees to keep time sheets?
In Germany since this year it's mandatory if you risk (work longer hours) getting under minimum wage.

Quote
It's only been in the last year that I've started to think of deadlines more as "promise rings" than marriage.  I don't know any actual stats but it seems like at least 80% of them are missed across a good few companies and their vendors in my experience.
Back at professional school I learned that 90% if IT projects fail either in time or money, often both.
So I would not speak of promises, but of wishes ;)
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: BlueHouse on September 05, 2020, 03:20:08 PM
This sounds a lot like a scene from Office Space!

There is so much power in doing crazy stuff that most people would never think of doing.  Maybe I'll get bitten someday, but every time I think I've just gone too far... I get accommodated.
This is also the George Costanza working model.  Whatever you think is the right thing to do....do the opposite. 
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: 2sk22 on September 17, 2020, 10:08:06 AM
This is also the George Costanza working model.  Whatever you think is the right thing to do....do the opposite.

There is so much to learn from George Costanza in terms of work (or should I say slacking) strategies: I have used the "leave on a high note" approach several times myself very successfully!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: frugalnacho on September 17, 2020, 10:27:16 AM
I'm always working on that penske file. 
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Asalted_Nut on September 17, 2020, 11:39:41 AM
I'm always working on that penske file.

You are aware...
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: johndoe on September 17, 2020, 09:57:35 PM
I loudly told them I hadn't done any work for the last several months...  I asked for changes in the bonus offer phrasing and more money.  ... I got what I asked for.
I am not an HR professional, but none of this makes any sense to me haha.  So you did nothing for months?  I never understand how people can just do nothing.  You couldn't ask any bosses for a task?  Weird, and I really can't understand why you would ever admit this to someone in the company, much less the bosses.  But hey it worked so what do I know?!  I can't imagine a scenario where it makes sense to pay a slacker more rather than immediately fire them.

Maybe it's "the Bobs" from office space where you just need more motivation? Bizarre
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: SwordGuy on September 17, 2020, 10:50:11 PM
I loudly told them I hadn't done any work for the last several months...  I asked for changes in the bonus offer phrasing and more money.  ... I got what I asked for.
I am not an HR professional, but none of this makes any sense to me haha.  So you did nothing for months?  I never understand how people can just do nothing.  You couldn't ask any bosses for a task?  Weird, and I really can't understand why you would ever admit this to someone in the company, much less the bosses.  But hey it worked so what do I know?!  I can't imagine a scenario where it makes sense to pay a slacker more rather than immediately fire them.

Maybe it's "the Bobs" from office space where you just need more motivation? Bizarre

I had a sociopathic boss who refused to assign me any tasks at work.   I didn't realize he was a sociopath, I just thought he was feeling insecure because he was young and I had way more experience.   I was trying to repair the breach between us and he was working to get me fired.  (I finally figured that out when he made his move.)

Because I didn't have any assignments and I wanted to be useful, I started writing automation programs to automate common tasks that we programmers had to do on every project.    He used that as evidence against me??   In a meeting with him and his supervisor, he brought up that charge.   When I pointed out I was trying to be useful since he wouldn't assign me any work, the supervisor told me I should have gone to her to get work assignments instead.  WTF???   

I ended up quitting before they could fire me (for better working conditions, pay and vacation) in a different department down the hall. :)   But before I did I fired back.   I made it very clear to government management and corporate management what was going on.   Not to save my job, but to protect them from the harm he would cause if left unchecked.   It took about 8 months but that sociopath was escorted out of the building by security and never allowed back.   My former coworkers made a point of dropping by to share the news. :)
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: LennStar on September 18, 2020, 04:21:16 AM

I ended up quitting before they could fire me (for better working conditions, pay and vacation) in a different department down the hall. :)   But before I did I fired back.   I made it very clear to government management and corporate management what was going on.   Not to save my job, but to protect them from the harm he would cause if left unchecked.   It took about 8 months but that sociopath was escorted out of the building by security and never allowed back.   My former coworkers made a point of dropping by to share the news. :)
Good Riddance!

Unfortunately, for every psychopath they kick out, 3 others are still there.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: joleran on September 18, 2020, 07:11:35 AM
I loudly told them I hadn't done any work for the last several months...  I asked for changes in the bonus offer phrasing and more money.  ... I got what I asked for.
I am not an HR professional, but none of this makes any sense to me haha.  So you did nothing for months?  I never understand how people can just do nothing.  You couldn't ask any bosses for a task?  Weird, and I really can't understand why you would ever admit this to someone in the company, much less the bosses.  But hey it worked so what do I know?!  I can't imagine a scenario where it makes sense to pay a slacker more rather than immediately fire them.

Maybe it's "the Bobs" from office space where you just need more motivation? Bizarre

It's actually happened multiple times in my career.  My second job I had a boss that decided how long tasks were going to take and told the stakeholders this timeline.  If I finished early and asked for more work, none would be forthcoming until the end of his estimate.

For this latest one though, I got into that dilbert situation where I didn't really have any daily responsibilities and was supposed to be doing vague architecture stuff.  The company was in extreme turmoil, churning through CEOs and upper management, and my boss had something like 40 direct reports and was remote besides.  I did work for a while, but basically the work was just ignored as priorities got wiped from the map repeatedly and daily 20 person design meetings were made to "align" people which just turned into a game of politics with a VP there.  So, I just slipped through the cracks and probably could have continued to do so for some time.

It is uniquely demotivating to feel your work doesn't matter and then proving it directly.  I should have moved on instead of negotiating, but I was able to leverage the bonus into a big raise at a new company as soon as the retention period expired.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: johndoe on September 18, 2020, 08:59:17 AM
@joleran @SwordGuy interesting cases...I guess I've been lucky with my bosses!  I have to think if there was something massively wrong I wouldn't hesitate to escalate it to the next level.  To tie it to FU money, I'd think of it like "I'm going to make sure the upper level people know the truth" rather than not be able to contribute work.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: mm1970 on September 18, 2020, 10:14:14 AM
I loudly told them I hadn't done any work for the last several months...  I asked for changes in the bonus offer phrasing and more money.  ... I got what I asked for.
I am not an HR professional, but none of this makes any sense to me haha.  So you did nothing for months?  I never understand how people can just do nothing.  You couldn't ask any bosses for a task?  Weird, and I really can't understand why you would ever admit this to someone in the company, much less the bosses.  But hey it worked so what do I know?!  I can't imagine a scenario where it makes sense to pay a slacker more rather than immediately fire them.

Maybe it's "the Bobs" from office space where you just need more motivation? Bizarre

It's actually happened multiple times in my career.  My second job I had a boss that decided how long tasks were going to take and told the stakeholders this timeline.  If I finished early and asked for more work, none would be forthcoming until the end of his estimate.

For this latest one though, I got into that dilbert situation where I didn't really have any daily responsibilities and was supposed to be doing vague architecture stuff.  The company was in extreme turmoil, churning through CEOs and upper management, and my boss had something like 40 direct reports and was remote besides.  I did work for a while, but basically the work was just ignored as priorities got wiped from the map repeatedly and daily 20 person design meetings were made to "align" people which just turned into a game of politics with a VP there.  So, I just slipped through the cracks and probably could have continued to do so for some time.

It is uniquely demotivating to feel your work doesn't matter and then proving it directly.  I should have moved on instead of negotiating, but I was able to leverage the bonus into a big raise at a new company as soon as the retention period expired.
This is sort of the opposite of what happened to a friend of mine. She got laid off from a big government contractor, which is how we found her and hired her.

She got moved around a lot - reassigned to different bosses because her job description was vast and she didn't "fit" anywhere.  When widespread layoffs came, she was let go.  (This place is known for big hirings and firings, and also for people being territorial ... if you are the only person who knows how to do X, then you don't get laid off.)

Well, she did a lot of things.  One of her side jobs was that...every 3 months, all of the company computers have to change passwords.  So she would set a calendar and change the passwords in the group labs every 90 days, and then send out the info.

Well, what happened after she was gone and the 90 days were up?  All of the computers in the labs locked up because the passwords were not changed... That continued for a couple of years...all these things that she did...

Ha, she worked for us for 5 years, then we had a mass layoff.  She ended up BACK there, at a higher level position and higher pay...
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: achvfi on September 18, 2020, 11:45:12 AM
@joleran @SwordGuy interesting cases...I guess I've been lucky with my bosses!  I have to think if there was something massively wrong I wouldn't hesitate to escalate it to the next level.  To tie it to FU money, I'd think of it like "I'm going to make sure the upper level people know the truth" rather than not be able to contribute work.

It only takes one bad boss to suck the life out of you. I was 10 years into my career until I had a bad boss. Shit really hits the fan when you are out of luck.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: AerynLee on September 18, 2020, 03:12:47 PM
I loudly told them I hadn't done any work for the last several months...  I asked for changes in the bonus offer phrasing and more money.  ... I got what I asked for.
I am not an HR professional, but none of this makes any sense to me haha.  So you did nothing for months?  I never understand how people can just do nothing.  You couldn't ask any bosses for a task?  Weird, and I really can't understand why you would ever admit this to someone in the company, much less the bosses.  But hey it worked so what do I know?!  I can't imagine a scenario where it makes sense to pay a slacker more rather than immediately fire them.

Maybe it's "the Bobs" from office space where you just need more motivation? Bizarre
I'm a very efficient worker. Not saying I'm an amazing worker, I just move through the computer efficiently and make processes for my regular work that let me get through them quicker than others would. I've had a few jobs where when I run out of things to do and ask for more tasks, they either don't have anything for me (for various reasons including being overstaffed or someone refusing to give up an ounce of knowledge) or they dredge up some obscure task that isn't actually needed or even wanted and my time ends up wasted anyway. When you add that onto being praised for being such a good employee that gets so much done, there's just not much incentive to ask for more. At my last job I got to where there were days where I did nothing but would have been promoted to the second highest level of my department if I'd stayed.

I'm actually about two years into my first job that I don't have a lot of extra time and it's been a weird adjustment to not reading the internet for hours a day on the clock
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: rantk81 on September 18, 2020, 05:22:21 PM
There's an amazing spectrum of jobs and companies -- where you can be hair-on-fire-busy for 60+ hours a week.... Or you can be struggling to fill the time from 9-5 due to boredom.  I've experienced both.  Extremes at both ends suck, for their own reasons.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: zolotiyeruki on September 18, 2020, 06:49:47 PM
There's also the unfortunate job that expects you to be there 60 hours per week, even if you have nothing to do. The best IMO is where you're meaningfully busy for 40 hiurs, and there's no expectation to spend more time than that at work
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: ixtap on September 18, 2020, 07:23:12 PM
There's an amazing spectrum of jobs and companies -- where you can be hair-on-fire-busy for 60+ hours a week.... Or you can be struggling to fill the time from 9-5 due to boredom.  I've experienced both.  Extremes at both ends suck, for their own reasons.

DH has both at his current job, depending on the cycle. Luckily, has has learned to."fill" the slow weeks with recreational activities.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: BuffaloStache on September 18, 2020, 09:50:40 PM
I loudly told them I hadn't done any work for the last several months...  I asked for changes in the bonus offer phrasing and more money.  ... I got what I asked for.
I am not an HR professional, but none of this makes any sense to me haha.  So you did nothing for months?  I never understand how people can just do nothing.  You couldn't ask any bosses for a task?  Weird, and I really can't understand why you would ever admit this to someone in the company, much less the bosses.  But hey it worked so what do I know?!  I can't imagine a scenario where it makes sense to pay a slacker more rather than immediately fire them.

Maybe it's "the Bobs" from office space where you just need more motivation? Bizarre

I've watched (form a short, amused distance) many colleagues do this, but actually use it to jump from company to company. Essentially they join a new company, make a good first impression and do well at all the "onboarding" tasks that are mostly mindless, and then proceed to do basically no work. They use the time to find their next gig, and then jump ship before they really get caught for not doing anything. What really amazes me about Corporate America is that almost all of these people seem to be wildly successful, and are typically able to negotiate promotions each time they jump to a new company (and often several years before they've hit the "minimum" required experience needed for various salary levels/jobs).

It really is sad, but it goes to show that corporate loyalty is actually an obstacle to career/salary success in the modern American working world. This is especially true if you are working at medium-to-large size companies, almost regardless of industry. This was an interesting, albeit slightly long read about this: https://hbr.org/2015/07/setting-the-record-straight-on-switching-jobs (https://hbr.org/2015/07/setting-the-record-straight-on-switching-jobs)
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: evanc on September 19, 2020, 11:32:01 AM
Incoming! Last year, end of November, a coworker requested time off in conjunction with Christmas holiday and was denied. She was denied because she lacked* 1 or 2 days of the total amount of requested number of days. She told them, I understand that I do not have enough days, but this is a very important trip, so I would be more than happy to take the extra day or two without pay. They said no (no legitimate business purpose for the denial, just no). I won’t bore you with details, but trust me when I say that due to the nature of our work, it would have made absolutely no difference whether she took these days off in Dec, as requested, or waited another month or two to build up the requisite amount of hours. The problem for her, of course, she didn’t have the luxury of waiting. This trip was happening with or without her.

She tried again to explain to them that the reason that the trip was so important was because it was a trip to visit with family in India, which would be the last time she could spend time with her terminally ill mother (who emigrated to USA many years ago). They wouldn’t budge, so she essentially told them, I have limited time left with my mother, and I am going on this trip, so if you are going to fire me over it, that is your decision.  And they did.  They literally just let her go, out of spite. I have worked with her for almost a decade, she has consistently had good performance reviews, and now our team of 10 is down to 9 (we were a team of 12 earlier in the year, but had already lost two other people, because they transferred to other departments due to the lack of management support - starting to see a pattern here?).

Despite my already exceedingly low opinion of management, even I was shocked by the way absolute absence of empathy in this situation. Solely to flex their muscle, a valuable employee is now gone, which only hurts the business (not her, she’s fine. Thank you, FU money). I told her when she left, I know this is a difficult decision and many people would not make the same decision or understand why you have done what you have done, but I completely respect you for having the courage of your conviction that this is a once in a lifetime opportunity. You won’t get this chance again, and I firmly believe that when you look back on this decision, you will have no regrets.

*She had a lower than average leave balance at this point, because she had taken some time off to care for her mother when she was initially diagnosed. Management was well aware of this. It should also be noted that there is office precedence for taking LWOP, even for just vacation purposes. This well known practice was another reason that I can only conclude that their decision was made in spite.

Moral of the story: if she had NOT had the FU money, she probably would have had to accept the denial and live the rest of her life with regret over missing those final days with her ailing mother. As so many others have said, FU money gives you options.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Zaga on September 19, 2020, 11:37:15 AM
Good for her!  I would have done the same. 

Actually one summer I had to take a day or 2 unpaid off every week for 2 months to care for an ailing family member, and my boss let me and worked around my absences.  I stayed at that job 7 years, it was generally a good place to work until it was bought out by a private equity firm and went completely bonkers.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Dave1442397 on September 19, 2020, 03:07:45 PM
There's also the unfortunate job that expects you to be there 60 hours per week, even if you have nothing to do. The best IMO is where you're meaningfully busy for 40 hiurs, and there's no expectation to spend more time than that at work

I had one of those jobs back in the '90s. People would spend have their day goofing off and hanging out in each other's office, and then stay until all hours of the night to look busy.

It took me a few weeks to figure out the system and get familiar with the software, and at that point I don't think there was a single day where I wouldn't be finished my assigned work by 2:30pm. After a few weeks of me leaving at my scheduled end time, they asked me if I had a second job to go to :) 

I only lasted there 18 months before getting so frustrated with their work practices that I found another job and quit. The guy who assigned all my work (not my manager) was upset, and called a higher-up VP in the Corporate office to have him try to get me to stay. No chance...

I looked up a few of my old co-workers on LinkedIn, and the ones I could find still work there, doing the same thing they've been doing since 1990. Good gig if you can stand it.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: evanc on September 19, 2020, 04:33:41 PM
Good for her!  I would have done the same. 

Actually one summer I had to take a day or 2 unpaid off every week for 2 months to care for an ailing family member, and my boss let me and worked around my absences.  I stayed at that job 7 years, it was generally a good place to work until it was bought out by a private equity firm and went completely bonkers.

Right? Because humanity.

And they (mgmt) get the same awestruck look on their face each time someone else quits. I have learned that it’s senseless to try converting people who clearly don’t want to change. Keep your head down, build the stache, then adios. Maybe one day they’ll see the error of their ways, mabe not. I won’t be sticking around long enough to find out.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: evanc on September 20, 2020, 07:57:56 AM
An observation: reading these stories, it seems quite common for the reaction of a boss or colleague to be, did you win the lottery? as if that would be the only logical explanation for quitting a job, or at least the first one that comes to mind. As if it is utterly unimaginable to the ordinary person that someone could simply have saved money and invested it. Sad commentary on the current state of the world. This is why we need to teach basic financial literacy in schools. [/ soapbox]
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Psychstache on September 20, 2020, 06:20:47 PM
An observation: reading these stories, it seems quite common for the reaction of a boss or colleague to be, did you win the lottery? as if that would be the only logical explanation for quitting a job, or at least the first one that comes to mind. As if it is utterly unimaginable to the ordinary person that someone could simply have saved money and invested it. Sad commentary on the current state of the world. This is why we need to teach basic financial literacy in schools. [/ soapbox]

The problem is that any school financial literacy course would feature a curriculum written by the Foundation for Teaching America about Finance, a shell non-profit owned and operated by Wells Fargo and PayDay Loan Companies.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: LennStar on September 21, 2020, 03:54:48 AM
An observation: reading these stories, it seems quite common for the reaction of a boss or colleague to be, did you win the lottery? as if that would be the only logical explanation for quitting a job, or at least the first one that comes to mind. As if it is utterly unimaginable to the ordinary person that someone could simply have saved money and invested it. Sad commentary on the current state of the world. This is why we need to teach basic financial literacy in schools. [/ soapbox]

The problem is that any school financial literacy course would feature a curriculum written by the Foundation for Teaching America about Finance, a shell non-profit owned and operated by Wells Fargo and PayDay Loan Companies.
They even lobbied google to hide them when I tried to have a look!

I think you have that name wrong.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: bbqbonelesswing on September 21, 2020, 06:18:16 AM
An observation: reading these stories, it seems quite common for the reaction of a boss or colleague to be, did you win the lottery? as if that would be the only logical explanation for quitting a job, or at least the first one that comes to mind. As if it is utterly unimaginable to the ordinary person that someone could simply have saved money and invested it. Sad commentary on the current state of the world. This is why we need to teach basic financial literacy in schools. [/ soapbox]

This was the reaction I got last time I quit a job. A few years ago I was working at a restaurant while studying to switch careers into IT. It was a pretty sweet gig as far as they go, with mostly college kids on staff who would drop shifts all the time. This was great for me as I could pick those extra shifts up and stack my schedule, and made pretty good money. The downside was that it was a corporate chain with an obsession over secret shopping. We'd get shopped constantly, and anything less than 100% was deemed a failure.

Anyway, one day I get some shoppers at my table and don't give the full-on corporate-approved greeting, so I get a 90%. This warrants a meeting with the GM, who puts me on a 4-seat section for the upcoming weekend as punishment. This is totally bullshit as a double-double over the weekend would net me like $500, sometimes more. Having that small of a section would cut that drastically. So I just said I have bills to pay, I can't work for nothing all weekend. Our GM wouldn't budge so I said, "Ok, that's fine, this will be my last shift. I quit." As soon as those words came out of my mouth her tone totally changed to concern- "But how are you going to pay your bills? Are you going to be ok?" Ok? I have 6+ months of expenses saved up in cash, I'm going to be just fine!

I took the next few months off to continue studying, then landed a new job where I'm still working today. Between jobs I came in to eat there a few times and one manager would always ask how I was doing or if I had found another job yet. I would just tell him no, I was temporarily retired. I think that made him really depressed to hear.

Job hopping is pretty common in the restaurant industry, but good money management isn't. Most of the people I've worked with, front and back of the house alike, spend whatever they make. On top of that, most of the folks I worked with at this place were college kids or alcoholics, so it was apparently shocking that I had actually saved anything at all. I'll never forget the absolute shock and confusion on this GM's face- priceless.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: BikeFanatic on September 21, 2020, 06:27:58 AM
As a former restaurant worker and shopper, I love this story, I never gave bad reviews as a shopper except once and it was nearly as scathing as it could have been. Restaurant work is very hard and you can’t be perfect and walking on eggshells all the time with each customer.
Makes me think I can retire normally at work or just up and quit if they push me too hard, but likely I will just calmly retire with two weeks notice.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: bbqbonelesswing on September 21, 2020, 06:36:48 AM
As a former restaurant worker and shopper, I love this story, I never gave bad reviews as a shopper except once and it was nearly as scathing as it could have been. Restaurant work is very hard and you can’t be perfect and walking on eggshells all the time with each customer.
Makes me think I can retire normally at work or just up and quit if they push me too hard, but likely I will just calmly retire with two weeks notice.

I think of two weeks notice as a courtesy. It's nice to give your boss a little time to plan before you go. But if they don't respect you, fuck em.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: DS on September 21, 2020, 06:47:15 AM
So strange to think of a workplace with "punishments."
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: AMandM on September 21, 2020, 10:25:35 AM
So strange to think of a workplace with "punishments."

I agree. What is mgt thinking?  "This will teach a good lesson! Next time a customer comes in, bbqbonelesswings will remember the risk of a 4-seat shift and will make sure to give the proper greeting!"
or maybe
"Customer greeted improperly--bad!  Bbqbonelesswings deprived of income--balance of badness restored!"
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: AMandM on September 21, 2020, 10:42:32 AM
On not having work to do:

One summer in high school I worked for an office temp agency. One gig was as a receptionist, where I sat at a desk near the entrance, which was also the traffic hub of the office. I answered the phone, directed visitors, and typed up letters (on a typewriter--this was long time ago). Since there were few phone calls, fewer visitors, and still fewer letters, I took my paperback out of my bag and read while I waited for work to show up. After a few hours, my supervisor took me aside and said it was bad for other people's morale to see me having reading for pleasure instead of working, so I was not to read any more. I pointed out that I was accomplishing everything I was hired for, but he said that was irrelevant, it wasn't fair for others to feel like I was being paid to have fun. He actually said he'd rather I just sit idle.

I did not have FU money or the concept of it, but I do remember thinking that this was only bearable because it was a two-week assignment. I could not have stood the boredom of literally doing nothing on a permanent basis. From then on, when there was nothing to do, I'd stick a sheet of paper into the typewriter and start typing a letter to a friend. I'm still kind of pleased with 17yo me for this solution that made me look like I was working. Nowadays I'd have a computer and could read books online without fear of discovery.

Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Dicey on September 21, 2020, 10:49:41 AM
I had something similar happen once at a job. Customer complained becauseI  momentarily stepped away from helping him to assist a mama with a baby, and my manager slashed my hours. Literally, no hours from M-F, so I scheduled a trip. Then manager asked me to work the Wednesday. "Uh, sorry, I'll be out of town." Another customer got wind of what happened and wrote a letter praising me to the Store Manager. Two weeks later, I was named "Customer Service All-Star", which meant my (professionally photographed, at the company's expense) picture hung on the wall for all to see and my employee discount went from 20% to 33% for an entire year.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Zamboni on September 21, 2020, 11:17:32 AM
So strange to think of a workplace with "punishments."

It's weird to explicitly dole out "punishments" to workers, and it is especially strange to think that way when dealing with a good employee in a field where there is chronic shortages and high employee turnover. My other half had a similar thing happen where a restaurant manager demoted a server to busboy for a day to "teach a lesson" for a one time very minor thing . . . other half just quit on the spot, so then they were short handed for at least the next week. Other half then walked down the street and was hired by the competing place on the spot. Didn't even miss a shift.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: SwordGuy on September 21, 2020, 01:06:24 PM
So strange to think of a workplace with "punishments."

It's weird to explicitly dole out "punishments" to workers, and it is especially strange to think that way when dealing with a good employee in a field where there is chronic shortages and high employee turnover. My other half had a similar thing happen where a restaurant manager demoted a server to busboy for a day to "teach a lesson" for a one time very minor thing . . . other half just quit on the spot, so then they were short handed for at least the next week. Other half then walked down the street and was hired by the competing place on the spot. Didn't even miss a shift.
There are a lot of bullies and people with (often well deserved) insecurities that find their way into middle management.
They take it out on whomever they can.

FU money is a wonderful thing.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Zamboni on September 21, 2020, 03:37:46 PM
^Yeah, it's weird how much many people will put up with in terms of overwork and abusive management.

I just quit a part of my job because I was hating it. The way I phrased it to my boss was "I gave this new role a try, but it's just not a good fit for me, so I'm going to go back to doing my old job. Please transition this to someone else over the next two weeks."

Could the boss have fired me? Sure. Did it happen? Nope. In fact, pretty much everyone at work who hears the news says "Good for you!" I think my stock went up at the company more than it went down, honestly.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: BicycleB on September 21, 2020, 04:43:01 PM
^Yeah, it's weird how much many people will put up with in terms of overwork and abusive management.

I just quit a part of my job because I was hating it. The way I phrased it to my boss was "I gave this new role a try, but it's just not a good fit for me, so I'm going to go back to doing my old job. Please transition this to someone else over the next two weeks."

Could the boss have fired me? Sure. Did it happen? Nope. In fact, pretty much everyone at work who hears the news says "Good for you!" I think my stock went up at the company more than it went down, honestly.

Wow, that's brilliant! Epic indeed, @Zamboni.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: evanc on September 21, 2020, 07:08:28 PM
Some years ago (10?) DW worked for a company A but had ambivalent feelings about it. The pay was so so, and the commute was a killer. On the upside, it had decent healthcare and 401(k) benefits. All things considered, she started looking for a new job and found what appeared to be a perfect fit and Company B, which would be only a 10 minute drive (compared to the 1.5 hours each way with company a). Not only with the commute significantly improve, but the pay was actually higher at Company B. No brainer, right? First day at work, right away, she can tell this is not what she signed up for. The manager is yelling at people, everyone seems scared, and there is no training. Red flags left and right. She tries to stick it out for a couple of days, but quickly realizes this is clearly not where she needs to be. She called me in tears, says she cannot do this, it is not what she signed up for, etc. and basically left the office, ostensibly to “check the mail” (this was one of the new job duties) and never returned.  HR calls, wants to know what happened, and DW explains verbal abuse, the lack of training, etc. company b HR is very understanding And asks if there is anything they can do to bring her back - my gut says they were not surprised at anything they heard, which is probably why there was a vacancy in the first place. She says thanks but no thanks.

Same day, calls up her former boss (don’t burn those bridges if you don’t have to) from company a and negotiates a return at a higher salary and new job title. She had previously attempted to negotiate a wage increase but was told that it was impossible. After she left, however, magically there was money now available in the budget. Turns out, they were more than happy to have her back and were dreading the process of replacing her. She was also able to negotiate a couple of weeks delayed start for what we now refer to as her “unemployment vacation.” She needed the time to decompress from the company b trauma (and thanks to not living paycheck to paycheck, it was no big deal to us).

To this day, we still have a chuckle every once in a while about “going to check the mail.” I told her, just imagine the other people in that office. You are an urban legend for sure.

P.S. she still works for company a, but in the last 10 years has switched roles/departments 3 times, each with a significant pay increase. We relocated much closer, cutting commute time by 2/3, and she was able to negotiate 2 days/wk WFH in an office culture where WFH is virtually unheard of (at least pre-COVID). Meanwhile, almost everyone she works with just stays in the same position and never really gets more than COLA pay increases. Squeaky wheel, people! But more to the point of this thread, FU money gave us options. But for the FUM, some of those risks would likely been but daydreams. Cheers, mustachians!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: ysette9 on September 21, 2020, 08:20:35 PM
Some years ago (10?) DW worked for a company A but had ambivalent feelings about it. The pay was so so, and the commute was a killer. On the upside, it had decent healthcare and 401(k) benefits. All things considered, she started looking for a new job and found what appeared to be a perfect fit and Company B, which would be only a 10 minute drive (compared to the 1.5 hours each way with company a). Not only with the commute significantly improve, but the pay was actually higher at Company B. No brainer, right? First day at work, right away, she can tell this is not what she signed up for. The manager is yelling at people, everyone seems scared, and there is no training. Red flags left and right. She tries to stick it out for a couple of days, but quickly realizes this is clearly not where she needs to be. She called me in tears, says she cannot do this, it is not what she signed up for, etc. and basically left the office, ostensibly to “check the mail” (this was one of the new job duties) and never returned.  HR calls, wants to know what happened, and DW explains verbal abuse, the lack of training, etc. company b HR is very understanding And asks if there is anything they can do to bring her back - my gut says they were not surprised at anything they heard, which is probably why there was a vacancy in the first place. She says thanks but no thanks.

Same day, calls up her former boss (don’t burn those bridges if you don’t have to) from company a and negotiates a return at a higher salary and new job title. She had previously attempted to negotiate a wage increase but was told that it was impossible. After she left, however, magically there was money now available in the budget. Turns out, they were more than happy to have her back and were dreading the process of replacing her. She was also able to negotiate a couple of weeks delayed start for what we now refer to as her “unemployment vacation.” She needed the time to decompress from the company b trauma (and thanks to not living paycheck to paycheck, it was no big deal to us).

To this day, we still have a chuckle every once in a while about “going to check the mail.” I told her, just imagine the other people in that office. You are an urban legend for sure.

P.S. she still works for company a, but in the last 10 years has switched roles/departments 3 times, each with a significant pay increase. We relocated much closer, cutting commute time by 2/3, and she was able to negotiate 2 days/wk WFH in an office culture where WFH is virtually unheard of (at least pre-COVID). Meanwhile, almost everyone she works with just stays in the same position and never really gets more than COLA pay increases. Squeaky wheel, people! But more to the point of this thread, FU money gave us options. But for the FUM, some of those risks would likely been but daydreams. Cheers, mustachians!
That is a great story. Three cheers for your awesome SO, and for you for supporting.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Zamboni on September 21, 2020, 10:47:55 PM
Haha good for her for ghosting that job!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: bbqbonelesswing on September 22, 2020, 08:43:02 AM
Good for her just walking away! No need to put up with that. I'm sure she wasn't the first or last to bail.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: rpr on September 22, 2020, 10:43:50 AM
^^ @evanc --

What a great story.

PS: I love this thread.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: BuffaloStache on September 22, 2020, 12:05:16 PM
As a former restaurant worker and shopper, I love this story, I never gave bad reviews as a shopper except once and it was nearly as scathing as it could have been. Restaurant work is very hard and you can’t be perfect and walking on eggshells all the time with each customer.
Makes me think I can retire normally at work or just up and quit if they push me too hard, but likely I will just calmly retire with two weeks notice.

I think of two weeks notice as a courtesy. It's nice to give your boss a little time to plan before you go. But if they don't respect you, fuck em.

Not exactly an FU Money story, but I watched an FU story unfold several years ago at a former work-place that is related to this.

A very well respected, very senior Chief Engineer at my old company was paramount to literally every technical decision that was made at the company. If any important changes were to be made, tweaks to various pieces of hardware, changes in software, etc., it was essentially required to go talk to this person and get his buy-in before going into a formal decision making meeting (a standard meeting with mostly manager-types and contractors). As you could imagine, this person was completely overloaded and often worked long hours to make sure he gave each person adequate time to learn about their recommended change. Despite a great positive attitude and sharp mind, he was overworked, underpaid, and didn't feel like he was getting the respect he deserved as having such of an important position in the company.

One day, on a Friday, I went to talk to him at ~6pm (the only time I could find a 15 minute period free on his schedule) about an upcoming hardware change-project I was leading. In typical fashion, he listened to my overview of the project and gave excellent feedback and advice. At the end of our discussion, when I asked him if he would support me during a formal change meeting on Monday (I had just set up the meeting and sent out invitations), he said "I definitely support this change, but I just sent in my notice to leave 20 minutes ago. I won't be with the company on Monday, so I won't have that authority anymore. But it's been great to work with you, BuffaloStache". He didn't say anything else about it, smiled, and quickly hurried off to his next meeting.

I was dumbfounded to say the least, but I incorporated all of the changes/pieces of advice that we discussed and planned to push ahead. When Monday came around, I went into the conference room and set-up the Teleconference software as was customary for these types of meetings. After logging in, I was shocked to see the Chief Engineer's name on the attendee list! When I asked about it, he said "I work for [oversight contractor company name] now, and look forward to the presentation". The collective jaws of every manager in the room fell to the floor. After the meeting, he called me to tell me that he switched jobs and was getting paid more to work mostly remotely and enjoy a lot greater flexibility. He said that the company often signed him up for incredibly difficult tasks without giving him any time to think about it, so he figured he'd do the same with his departure. That guy is a corporate hero to me.

TL;DR- Vitally important Chief Engineer quit on a Friday afternoon with absolutely no advanced notice, and then started on Monday at a contractor company essentially overseeing his previous work for higher pay and mostly remote.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: ysette9 on September 22, 2020, 02:30:20 PM
As a former restaurant worker and shopper, I love this story, I never gave bad reviews as a shopper except once and it was nearly as scathing as it could have been. Restaurant work is very hard and you can’t be perfect and walking on eggshells all the time with each customer.
Makes me think I can retire normally at work or just up and quit if they push me too hard, but likely I will just calmly retire with two weeks notice.

I think of two weeks notice as a courtesy. It's nice to give your boss a little time to plan before you go. But if they don't respect you, fuck em.

Not exactly an FU Money story, but I watched an FU story unfold several years ago at a former work-place that is related to this.

A very well respected, very senior Chief Engineer at my old company was paramount to literally every technical decision that was made at the company. If any important changes were to be made, tweaks to various pieces of hardware, changes in software, etc., it was essentially required to go talk to this person and get his buy-in before going into a formal decision making meeting (a standard meeting with mostly manager-types and contractors). As you could imagine, this person was completely overloaded and often worked long hours to make sure he gave each person adequate time to learn about their recommended change. Despite a great positive attitude and sharp mind, he was overworked, underpaid, and didn't feel like he was getting the respect he deserved as having such of an important position in the company.

One day, on a Friday, I went to talk to him at ~6pm (the only time I could find a 15 minute period free on his schedule) about an upcoming hardware change-project I was leading. In typical fashion, he listened to my overview of the project and gave excellent feedback and advice. At the end of our discussion, when I asked him if he would support me during a formal change meeting on Monday (I had just set up the meeting and sent out invitations), he said "I definitely support this change, but I just sent in my notice to leave 20 minutes ago. I won't be with the company on Monday, so I won't have that authority anymore. But it's been great to work with you, BuffaloStache". He didn't say anything else about it, smiled, and quickly hurried off to his next meeting.

I was dumbfounded to say the least, but I incorporated all of the changes/pieces of advice that we discussed and planned to push ahead. When Monday came around, I went into the conference room and set-up the Teleconference software as was customary for these types of meetings. After logging in, I was shocked to see the Chief Engineer's name on the attendee list! When I asked about it, he said "I work for [oversight contractor company name] now, and look forward to the presentation". The collective jaws of every manager in the room fell to the floor. After the meeting, he called me to tell me that he switched jobs and was getting paid more to work mostly remotely and enjoy a lot greater flexibility. He said that the company often signed him up for incredibly difficult tasks without giving him any time to think about it, so he figured he'd do the same with his departure. That guy is a corporate hero to me.

TL;DR- Vitally important Chief Engineer quit on a Friday afternoon with absolutely no advanced notice, and then started on Monday at a contractor company essentially overseeing his previous work for higher pay and mostly remote.
Hahaha... love it
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: mm1970 on September 22, 2020, 05:37:38 PM
As a former restaurant worker and shopper, I love this story, I never gave bad reviews as a shopper except once and it was nearly as scathing as it could have been. Restaurant work is very hard and you can’t be perfect and walking on eggshells all the time with each customer.
Makes me think I can retire normally at work or just up and quit if they push me too hard, but likely I will just calmly retire with two weeks notice.

I think of two weeks notice as a courtesy. It's nice to give your boss a little time to plan before you go. But if they don't respect you, fuck em.

Not exactly an FU Money story, but I watched an FU story unfold several years ago at a former work-place that is related to this.

A very well respected, very senior Chief Engineer at my old company was paramount to literally every technical decision that was made at the company. If any important changes were to be made, tweaks to various pieces of hardware, changes in software, etc., it was essentially required to go talk to this person and get his buy-in before going into a formal decision making meeting (a standard meeting with mostly manager-types and contractors). As you could imagine, this person was completely overloaded and often worked long hours to make sure he gave each person adequate time to learn about their recommended change. Despite a great positive attitude and sharp mind, he was overworked, underpaid, and didn't feel like he was getting the respect he deserved as having such of an important position in the company.

One day, on a Friday, I went to talk to him at ~6pm (the only time I could find a 15 minute period free on his schedule) about an upcoming hardware change-project I was leading. In typical fashion, he listened to my overview of the project and gave excellent feedback and advice. At the end of our discussion, when I asked him if he would support me during a formal change meeting on Monday (I had just set up the meeting and sent out invitations), he said "I definitely support this change, but I just sent in my notice to leave 20 minutes ago. I won't be with the company on Monday, so I won't have that authority anymore. But it's been great to work with you, BuffaloStache". He didn't say anything else about it, smiled, and quickly hurried off to his next meeting.

I was dumbfounded to say the least, but I incorporated all of the changes/pieces of advice that we discussed and planned to push ahead. When Monday came around, I went into the conference room and set-up the Teleconference software as was customary for these types of meetings. After logging in, I was shocked to see the Chief Engineer's name on the attendee list! When I asked about it, he said "I work for [oversight contractor company name] now, and look forward to the presentation". The collective jaws of every manager in the room fell to the floor. After the meeting, he called me to tell me that he switched jobs and was getting paid more to work mostly remotely and enjoy a lot greater flexibility. He said that the company often signed him up for incredibly difficult tasks without giving him any time to think about it, so he figured he'd do the same with his departure. That guy is a corporate hero to me.

TL;DR- Vitally important Chief Engineer quit on a Friday afternoon with absolutely no advanced notice, and then started on Monday at a contractor company essentially overseeing his previous work for higher pay and mostly remote.
I love this
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: nawhite on October 01, 2020, 09:00:09 AM
I was working in IT for a company and my workload had been dropping precipitously for the past few months. Basically me and my team had automated our outsourced most of our tasks and most of my coworkers could see what was happening and were leaving left and right. Over a year we went from 15 to about 7 people on staff due to attrition and none of the positions were backfilled because there was so much less work to do. While this was going on I negotiated basically unlimited unpaid time off but when I asked to go to 3 days a week, HR said sorry we can't do that.

At the same time, I found MMM about 8 years ago and had saved a ton of money. Like 70% of my FIRE number. Also, over the past 3 years I had been slowly growing a side business teaching whitewater kayaking on nights and weekends. So this year, when quarantine started to get lifted (our state called it "Safer at home and in the vast outdoors") they included guidelines for outdoor guides. Within 4 days I had 15 calls for full day lessons and the calls kept coming. With that much of a backlog, I decided to give notice at the IT job two weeks later. In order to help with the transition I agreed to a 1 month notice period and to be available for consulting for a couple days in case something came up.

On my last day, it became clear that my manager thought that I was just going to consulting in order to try to get the 3 days a week thing I wanted before and he wanted to figure out how to schedule my 3 days per week indefinitely. I don't remember the exact words I used in a one on one meeting with him that day but it was something along the lines of "Sorry man, too little too late. I'll help with the transition but I don't need the money, I'm out."

PS: Kayak lesson demand was insane and I was just going by the seat of my pants trying to keep up and accepting some requests that I probably shouldn't have or should have been combined together. I made close to $20k this year during an abridged (due to covid) 4-month teaching season. I'm taking the winter to make some changes to make it more repeatable and lucrative but getting $40k in 6 months of work won't be crazy for next year. Sure it's not my IT salary but I don't care. I like this more and I really don't need the money. And all my gear is a business expense now haha.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: ysette9 on October 01, 2020, 02:42:13 PM
Wonderful!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: SwordGuy on October 01, 2020, 02:43:08 PM
Way to go @nawhite !
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: LightTripper on October 01, 2020, 03:23:42 PM
Great story - must have been very satisfying :)
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Warlord1986 on October 02, 2020, 08:09:38 PM
I was working in IT for a company and my workload had been dropping precipitously for the past few months. Basically me and my team had automated our outsourced most of our tasks and most of my coworkers could see what was happening and were leaving left and right. Over a year we went from 15 to about 7 people on staff due to attrition and none of the positions were backfilled because there was so much less work to do. While this was going on I negotiated basically unlimited unpaid time off but when I asked to go to 3 days a week, HR said sorry we can't do that.

At the same time, I found MMM about 8 years ago and had saved a ton of money. Like 70% of my FIRE number. Also, over the past 3 years I had been slowly growing a side business teaching whitewater kayaking on nights and weekends. So this year, when quarantine started to get lifted (our state called it "Safer at home and in the vast outdoors") they included guidelines for outdoor guides. Within 4 days I had 15 calls for full day lessons and the calls kept coming. With that much of a backlog, I decided to give notice at the IT job two weeks later. In order to help with the transition I agreed to a 1 month notice period and to be available for consulting for a couple days in case something came up.

On my last day, it became clear that my manager thought that I was just going to consulting in order to try to get the 3 days a week thing I wanted before and he wanted to figure out how to schedule my 3 days per week indefinitely. I don't remember the exact words I used in a one on one meeting with him that day but it was something along the lines of "Sorry man, too little too late. I'll help with the transition but I don't need the money, I'm out."

PS: Kayak lesson demand was insane and I was just going by the seat of my pants trying to keep up and accepting some requests that I probably shouldn't have or should have been combined together. I made close to $20k this year during an abridged (due to covid) 4-month teaching season. I'm taking the winter to make some changes to make it more repeatable and lucrative but getting $40k in 6 months of work won't be crazy for next year. Sure it's not my IT salary but I don't care. I like this more and I really don't need the money. And all my gear is a business expense now haha.

My new hero.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: AO1FireTo on October 02, 2020, 08:13:40 PM
I was working in IT for a company and my workload had been dropping precipitously for the past few months. Basically me and my team had automated our outsourced most of our tasks and most of my coworkers could see what was happening and were leaving left and right. Over a year we went from 15 to about 7 people on staff due to attrition and none of the positions were backfilled because there was so much less work to do. While this was going on I negotiated basically unlimited unpaid time off but when I asked to go to 3 days a week, HR said sorry we can't do that.

At the same time, I found MMM about 8 years ago and had saved a ton of money. Like 70% of my FIRE number. Also, over the past 3 years I had been slowly growing a side business teaching whitewater kayaking on nights and weekends. So this year, when quarantine started to get lifted (our state called it "Safer at home and in the vast outdoors") they included guidelines for outdoor guides. Within 4 days I had 15 calls for full day lessons and the calls kept coming. With that much of a backlog, I decided to give notice at the IT job two weeks later. In order to help with the transition I agreed to a 1 month notice period and to be available for consulting for a couple days in case something came up.

On my last day, it became clear that my manager thought that I was just going to consulting in order to try to get the 3 days a week thing I wanted before and he wanted to figure out how to schedule my 3 days per week indefinitely. I don't remember the exact words I used in a one on one meeting with him that day but it was something along the lines of "Sorry man, too little too late. I'll help with the transition but I don't need the money, I'm out."

PS: Kayak lesson demand was insane and I was just going by the seat of my pants trying to keep up and accepting some requests that I probably shouldn't have or should have been combined together. I made close to $20k this year during an abridged (due to covid) 4-month teaching season. I'm taking the winter to make some changes to make it more repeatable and lucrative but getting $40k in 6 months of work won't be crazy for next year. Sure it's not my IT salary but I don't care. I like this more and I really don't need the money. And all my gear is a business expense now haha.

My new hero.

Wow this is a pretty cool.  Must have been cool feeling to know that you now had the power.  I think that is what we are all really striving for here, to gain control so we can live life on our terms.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Blondetuco on October 08, 2020, 04:12:08 PM
I relocated across the country and started a new job right as COVID was hitting. Unfortunately I missed a lot of red flags early-on: my manger wouldn't look me in the eyes during the interview and she was replacing 2 of her 3 reports after she joined the company a couple months earlier. The offer came as the state shut down, so I jumped at it.

What followed was 6 months of toxicity. Other than some odds-and-ends she asked me to handle, we didn't talk responsibilities or expectations until I scheduled my own one-on-one after the first month. She began working from home, and called me insubordinate for problem solving with the on-site managers and "going behind her back". She openly discussed firing the "useless" floor technicians because they didn't complete tasks that they were never assigned. I was once called brainless on a managerial email chain after I followed her lead on something and she flip-flopped her stance.

Without pinching back the budget, I have about 17 months of cash on-hand (looking to buy a house). I told her Monday that I was leaving, politely said I would do happier in another environment, and the conversation ended cordially. The next day, I get on a conference call and see it's just my boss and co-worker. Somehow forgetting that this is not a private call, she begins belittling me to her other report. My work is sloppy, she's tried repeatedly to get me to fix it but I won't listen, I might not get replaced because "what does he even do here??". The other managers and supervisors begin joining the call and overhear this. Reality set-in when she said "Is anyone else on here yet? I better check before I say anything else....oh......"

I called her the next day to say that I heard everything that was discussed. I explained that she's entitled to those opinions of me, that I haven't been enthusiastic about my work either, but I would prefer that she privately give that feedback to me. Her response was "I'm sorry you overheard it, but I meant every word". I explained that I have been respectful of her during my exit interview and when the other managers asked why I was leaving. Her response was "Thank for for taking the high road, but I can't do the same while trying to correct your mistakes".

The next day I schedule a meeting with our facility's HR, share the highlights of my time with the company, and receive her contact information to provide to potential employers. Apparently everyone has seen this behavior from the fringes, but this is the first time someone put forward a formal complaint. She encouraged me to word all of this in an email to her manager and the HR rep that conducted my exit interview. Writing that email was the happiest 30 minutes of my employment.

At 2pm I sent her an email: "I've decided that today is my last day of employment. My laptop and keys are on my desk. I have already let HR know, and you can talk to them if you have any questions".
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: bbqbonelesswing on October 08, 2020, 04:58:53 PM
I relocated across the country and started a new job right as COVID was hitting. Unfortunately I missed a lot of red flags early-on: my manger wouldn't look me in the eyes during the interview and she was replacing 2 of her 3 reports after she joined the company a couple months earlier. The offer came as the state shut down, so I jumped at it.

What followed was 6 months of toxicity. Other than some odds-and-ends she asked me to handle, we didn't talk responsibilities or expectations until I scheduled my own one-on-one after the first month. She began working from home, and called me insubordinate for problem solving with the on-site managers and "going behind her back". She openly discussed firing the "useless" floor technicians because they didn't complete tasks that they were never assigned. I was once called brainless on a managerial email chain after I followed her lead on something and she flip-flopped her stance.

Without pinching back the budget, I have about 17 months of cash on-hand (looking to buy a house). I told her Monday that I was leaving, politely said I would do happier in another environment, and the conversation ended cordially. The next day, I get on a conference call and see it's just my boss and co-worker. Somehow forgetting that this is not a private call, she begins belittling me to her other report. My work is sloppy, she's tried repeatedly to get me to fix it but I won't listen, I might not get replaced because "what does he even do here??". The other managers and supervisors begin joining the call and overhear this. Reality set-in when she said "Is anyone else on here yet? I better check before I say anything else....oh......"

I called her the next day to say that I heard everything that was discussed. I explained that she's entitled to those opinions of me, that I haven't been enthusiastic about my work either, but I would prefer that she privately give that feedback to me. Her response was "I'm sorry you overheard it, but I meant every word". I explained that I have been respectful of her during my exit interview and when the other managers asked why I was leaving. Her response was "Thank for for taking the high road, but I can't do the same while trying to correct your mistakes".

The next day I schedule a meeting with our facility's HR, share the highlights of my time with the company, and receive her contact information to provide to potential employers. Apparently everyone has seen this behavior from the fringes, but this is the first time someone put forward a formal complaint. She encouraged me to word all of this in an email to her manager and the HR rep that conducted my exit interview. Writing that email was the happiest 30 minutes of my employment.

At 2pm I sent her an email: "I've decided that today is my last day of employment. My laptop and keys are on my desk. I have already let HR know, and you can talk to them if you have any questions".

I love that this is your first post here. Good for you!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Dicey on October 08, 2020, 11:07:07 PM
I relocated across the country and started a new job right as COVID was hitting. Unfortunately I missed a lot of red flags early-on: my manger wouldn't look me in the eyes during the interview and she was replacing 2 of her 3 reports after she joined the company a couple months earlier. The offer came as the state shut down, so I jumped at it.

What followed was 6 months of toxicity. Other than some odds-and-ends she asked me to handle, we didn't talk responsibilities or expectations until I scheduled my own one-on-one after the first month. She began working from home, and called me insubordinate for problem solving with the on-site managers and "going behind her back". She openly discussed firing the "useless" floor technicians because they didn't complete tasks that they were never assigned. I was once called brainless on a managerial email chain after I followed her lead on something and she flip-flopped her stance.

Without pinching back the budget, I have about 17 months of cash on-hand (looking to buy a house). I told her Monday that I was leaving, politely said I would do happier in another environment, and the conversation ended cordially. The next day, I get on a conference call and see it's just my boss and co-worker. Somehow forgetting that this is not a private call, she begins belittling me to her other report. My work is sloppy, she's tried repeatedly to get me to fix it but I won't listen, I might not get replaced because "what does he even do here??". The other managers and supervisors begin joining the call and overhear this. Reality set-in when she said "Is anyone else on here yet? I better check before I say anything else....oh......"

I called her the next day to say that I heard everything that was discussed. I explained that she's entitled to those opinions of me, that I haven't been enthusiastic about my work either, but I would prefer that she privately give that feedback to me. Her response was "I'm sorry you overheard it, but I meant every word". I explained that I have been respectful of her during my exit interview and when the other managers asked why I was leaving. Her response was "Thank for for taking the high road, but I can't do the same while trying to correct your mistakes".

The next day I schedule a meeting with our facility's HR, share the highlights of my time with the company, and receive her contact information to provide to potential employers. Apparently everyone has seen this behavior from the fringes, but this is the first time someone put forward a formal complaint. She encouraged me to word all of this in an email to her manager and the HR rep that conducted my exit interview. Writing that email was the happiest 30 minutes of my employment.

At 2pm I sent her an email: "I've decided that today is my last day of employment. My laptop and keys are on my desk. I have already let HR know, and you can talk to them if you have any questions".

I love that this is your first post here. Good for you!
Another badass in the house!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: RWTL on October 09, 2020, 04:15:45 AM

At 2pm I sent her an email: "I've decided that today is my last day of employment. My laptop and keys are on my desk. I have already let HR know, and you can talk to them if you have any questions".

RWTL stands and claps....
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: DadJokes on October 09, 2020, 06:16:43 AM
Sucks to go through all of that, but that's an excellent FU money story!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Blondetuco on October 09, 2020, 09:02:34 AM
Thanks everybody. This blog/forum has changed my savings rate from 6% to 65% in the last three years. That job would have consumed me you all didn't preach this alternative.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: SwordGuy on October 09, 2020, 09:28:12 AM
Thanks everybody. This blog/forum has changed my savings rate from 6% to 65% in the last three years. That job would have consumed me you all didn't preach this alternative.

@Blondetuco, now THAT's an epic story!  Good job!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: mm1970 on October 09, 2020, 10:05:49 AM
Epic indeed
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: LennStar on October 09, 2020, 11:34:58 AM
It has just started. It takes a long time to make an epic. So far it's only a ballad at most.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Dicey on October 09, 2020, 06:40:44 PM
It has just started. It takes a long time to make an epic. So far it's only a ballad at most.
We are here to encourage one another. Please don't minimize someone else's accomplishments. There is no nice reason for this.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: solon on October 09, 2020, 09:08:06 PM
It has just started. It takes a long time to make an epic. So far it's only a ballad at most.
We are here to encourage one another. Please don't minimize someone else's accomplishments. There is no nice reason for this.

I think he was just making a joke about the word epic.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: SwordGuy on October 09, 2020, 10:14:19 PM
It has just started. It takes a long time to make an epic. So far it's only a ballad at most.
We are here to encourage one another. Please don't minimize someone else's accomplishments. There is no nice reason for this.

Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: LennStar on October 10, 2020, 01:05:48 AM
I feel so old for still knowing the original meaning of epic... (hint: It is an really really long piece of literature, generally poem. And for the old greeks it was all of "story poems". Like the Gilgamesh Epic.)
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: marty998 on October 10, 2020, 04:27:42 AM
I feel so old for still knowing the original meaning of epic... (hint: It is an really really long piece of literature, generally poem. And for the old greeks it was all of "story poems". Like the Gilgamesh Epic.)

No one has ever heard the Greek National Anthem in full because it’s goes on for a good few days...
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Dicey on October 10, 2020, 04:36:16 AM
I feel so old for still knowing the original meaning of epic... (hint: It is an really really long piece of literature, generally poem. And for the old greeks it was all of "story poems". Like the Gilgamesh Epic.)
Language evolves. The word in question has long since acquired additional shades of meaning. There's a grammar thread where your audience might be more receptive, but on this thread, you just sound pedantic.

@SwordGuy, as you can see, LennStar clearly wasn't joking.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: SwordGuy on October 10, 2020, 06:31:08 AM
I feel so old for still knowing the original meaning of epic... (hint: It is an really really long piece of literature, generally poem. And for the old greeks it was all of "story poems". Like the Gilgamesh Epic.)
Language evolves. The word in question has long since acquired additional shades of meaning. There's a grammar thread where your audience might be more receptive, but on this thread, you just sound pedantic.

@SwordGuy, as you can see, LennStar clearly wasn't joking.
I still think he was.  Let's ask.

@LennStar , were you joking with word play on word meanings or not?   
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Dicey on October 10, 2020, 06:50:15 AM
I feel so old for still knowing the original meaning of epic... (hint: It is an really really long piece of literature, generally poem. And for the old greeks it was all of "story poems". Like the Gilgamesh Epic.)
Language evolves. The word in question has long since acquired additional shades of meaning. There's a grammar thread where your audience might be more receptive, but on this thread, you just sound pedantic.

@SwordGuy, as you can see, LennStar clearly wasn't joking.
I still think he was.  Let's ask.

@LennStar , were you joking with word play on word meanings or not?   
Aww, @SwordGuy, you're such a mensch!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: LennStar on October 10, 2020, 10:45:02 AM
I feel so old for still knowing the original meaning of epic... (hint: It is an really really long piece of literature, generally poem. And for the old greeks it was all of "story poems". Like the Gilgamesh Epic.)
Language evolves. The word in question has long since acquired additional shades of meaning. There's a grammar thread where your audience might be more receptive, but on this thread, you just sound pedantic.

@SwordGuy, as you can see, LennStar clearly wasn't joking.
I still think he was.  Let's ask.

@LennStar , were you joking with word play on word meanings or not?   

It was supposed to be a funny remark on (changing) words, yes.
The worst part is you bad guys have even infected German, I have heard people using "episch" the same way as in Englisch.
In 50 years kids will think the Gilgamesh Epos is a big mountain in the Himalajas or something like that... *sigh*
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Sandi_k on October 10, 2020, 12:03:00 PM
I feel so old for still knowing the original meaning of epic... (hint: It is an really really long piece of literature, generally poem. And for the old greeks it was all of "story poems". Like the Gilgamesh Epic.)
Language evolves. The word in question has long since acquired additional shades of meaning. There's a grammar thread where your audience might be more receptive, but on this thread, you just sound pedantic.

@SwordGuy, as you can see, LennStar clearly wasn't joking.
I still think he was.  Let's ask.

@LennStar , were you joking with word play on word meanings or not?   

It was supposed to be a funny remark on (changing) words, yes.
The worst part is you bad guys have even infected German, I have heard people using "episch" the same way as in Englisch.
In 50 years kids will think the Gilgamesh Epos is a big mountain in the Himalajas or something like that... *sigh*

Get off my lawn! *waves fists wildly*

Does that translate into German as well?! :D
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: BicycleB on October 11, 2020, 04:54:51 AM
I feel so old for still knowing the original meaning of epic... (hint: It is an really really long piece of literature, generally poem. And for the old greeks it was all of "story poems". Like the Gilgamesh Epic.)
Language evolves. The word in question has long since acquired additional shades of meaning. There's a grammar thread where your audience might be more receptive, but on this thread, you just sound pedantic.

@SwordGuy, as you can see, LennStar clearly wasn't joking.
I still think he was.  Let's ask.

@LennStar , were you joking with word play on word meanings or not?   

It was supposed to be a funny remark on (changing) words, yes.
The worst part is you bad guys have even infected German, I have heard people using "episch" the same way as in Englisch.
In 50 years kids will think the Gilgamesh Epos is a big mountain in the Himalajas or something like that... *sigh*

LOL
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: markbike528CBX on October 11, 2020, 10:21:11 AM
I feel so old for still knowing the original meaning of epic... (hint: It is an really really long piece of literature, generally poem. And for the old greeks it was all of "story poems". Like the Gilgamesh Epic.)
To keep the pedantic tone of the thread alive, I would note that the Epic of Gilgamesh is Sumerian, not Greek. 
I realize what may have been meant was "story poems" = Greek , example from another culture- Gilgamesh.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: LennStar on October 11, 2020, 11:43:39 AM
I feel so old for still knowing the original meaning of epic... (hint: It is an really really long piece of literature, generally poem. And for the old greeks it was all of "story poems". Like the Gilgamesh Epic.)
To keep the pedantic tone of the thread alive, I would note that the Epic of Gilgamesh is Sumerian, not Greek. 
I realize what may have been meant was "story poems" = Greek , example from another culture- Gilgamesh.
Roughly that. Gilgamesh is afaik the oldest one that has the name in it (and one of the best known).

And btw. the oldest written records at all we have are about debt forgiveness. Just in case you thought debt was a modern problem ;)
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: markbike528CBX on October 11, 2020, 05:17:24 PM
I feel so old for still knowing the original meaning of epic... (hint: It is an really really long piece of literature, generally poem. And for the old greeks it was all of "story poems". Like the Gilgamesh Epic.)
To keep the pedantic tone of the thread alive, I would note that the Epic of Gilgamesh is Sumerian, not Greek. 
I realize what may have been meant was "story poems" = Greek , example from another culture- Gilgamesh.
Roughly that. Gilgamesh is afaik the oldest one that has the name in it (and one of the best known).

And btw. the oldest written records at all we have are about debt forgiveness. Just in case you thought debt was a modern problem ;)
Very probably in conjunction with taxes (fees, protection by "king", assessment .....etc etc..)
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: LennStar on October 12, 2020, 03:04:11 AM
I feel so old for still knowing the original meaning of epic... (hint: It is an really really long piece of literature, generally poem. And for the old greeks it was all of "story poems". Like the Gilgamesh Epic.)
To keep the pedantic tone of the thread alive, I would note that the Epic of Gilgamesh is Sumerian, not Greek. 
I realize what may have been meant was "story poems" = Greek , example from another culture- Gilgamesh.
Roughly that. Gilgamesh is afaik the oldest one that has the name in it (and one of the best known).

And btw. the oldest written records at all we have are about debt forgiveness. Just in case you thought debt was a modern problem ;)
Very probably in conjunction with taxes (fees, protection by "king", assessment .....etc etc..)
Not directly at least. Of course taxes existed (albeit not in the form we think of today) and were one expense you could not not do.
But it generally was about "richer getting rich on our debts, and we get into slavery as result". That's why debt forgiveness was invented - the literal blank slate (as those old guys wrote on clay tablets) to free people out of debt slavery before you run out of people who aren't slaves. It was a constant topic for thousands of years, as you can see in the "jubilee year" of the bible.
It's quite humbling to know that one of the biggest and oldest problems humanity has is one born out of our society (or our personal souls - greed) itself. Basically only starving is more dangerous...
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: shelivesthedream on October 12, 2020, 04:57:43 AM
I actually heard a great sermon recently about debt in ancient Judea and people selling themselves into slavery for a certain period of time when they couldn't pay with money (and how that was different from being a foreign captured-in-war slave). Basically declaring bankruptcy, except that the debtor still "paid" the debt in some way. I was reminded of Shylock's pound of flesh. It was chilling, really.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: talltexan on October 12, 2020, 08:16:22 AM
What's interesting is that debt is indeed an ancient problem, but there was a very interesting passage in Capital in the Twenty-First Century that argued that--until there was an income tax--there was no culture of people who thought of income as an annual thing. It was all about weekly salary in the gilded age. (unless you inherited money, but that would be wealth, not income)
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: rantk81 on October 12, 2020, 08:20:32 AM
Doesn't money just represent a claim on future goods, services, resources?  So one could say that all money is, is a score-card on who owes who -- a.k.a. money = (someone else's) debt.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: LennStar on October 12, 2020, 08:51:10 AM
Doesn't money just represent a claim on future goods, services, resources?  So one could say that all money is, is a score-card on who owes who -- a.k.a. money = (someone else's) debt.
That is what antropologists say for a century, who have studied how it was over the millenia.

Economists say, this is all bullshit because we say it should be otherwise and we are the money profession and not some stupid liberal arts, right?
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: tipster350 on October 12, 2020, 09:58:14 AM
Was super excited to see new posts in this thread about Epic FU stories .... to find a whole string of OT  /0\
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: LennStar on October 13, 2020, 03:42:40 AM
Was super excited to see new posts in this thread about Epic FU stories .... to find a whole string of OT  /0\
Turn more consumer suckas into MMM folks and you might find more epic FU stories here.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: blurkraken22 on October 13, 2020, 06:16:27 AM
This is not exactly an FU money story, partially because I didn't even know what FU money was back then. Partially because there was no FU needed. But it's a nice way to use your FU money.

I was reasonably happy at work with some minor annoyances--I haven't found the perfect job yet. I had negotiated a pretty nice situation for myself at work, where I was working 3/4 time. Based on a recommendation from my manager, I transferred from my technical role into a pre-sales role. My new manager in pre-sales knew and agreed that I would be working 3/4 time in the new role. Yet, within a couple of months they were pressuring me come back to work full-time. Minor annoyance. In balance, 3/4 time was an awesome deal for me and not every employer would allow it in a position like mine. I definitely was not leaving for people problems or because of the job. One of my biggest complaints about my career to that point was that I was never able to figure out how to convince the company to transfer me to one of their offices abroad because I really really wanted to work in another country. I had talked to them about Singapore and France, but nothing stuck.

On the home front, I was about to get married. Our FU money was our savings to buy a boat. One of my other life ideas was to live on a boat and sail around the Caribbean and perhaps the world. I have more life ideas than I have lives. We had started co-saving about the time we started co-habitating. At the same time we were beginning to realize that the boat was never going to work out. My soon-to-be-wife turned an interesting shade of green on mildly choppy waters.

But when one door closes, another one opens. My soon-to-be-wife's family owned an apartment in a very very HCOL city abroad. The apartment was scheduled for sale in the indefinite future. For the moment the problem was that the building was scheduled for construction for exterior refacing. It's noisy, dusty work, but does not enter the unit. The family weren't going to sell during contstuction because it would depress the price. The apartment was going to be empty for at least a year. I saw an apportunity and proposed my idea to my bride. Soon enough she had secured family permission for us to go stay there during the construction. Perfect position: got financial runway and a mostly free place to stay! The only remaining question: what about work?

I proposed to my boss that the company should let me take 3 months unpaid leave. The company declined and told me their policy was 4 weeks. That was sufficient for me to make my decision. I explained to my boss that I needed to resign and I hoped maybe they would want me back some day. Before I left, I wrote a very nice letter about how much I had enjoyed working for them so far, but had an adventure I needed to go chase. After leaving work, we fixed up our current place as a rental (property value still a bit underwater after the great recession, but it could cash flow) and moved abroad. The experience was phenomenal. The money lasted longer than we expected. More adventures ensued as a result. Never a single regret about that decision. Plus, there are still more stories to tell after this one. :D
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: LightTripper on October 13, 2020, 06:38:32 AM
It may not be traditional "FU" @blurkraken22 but still a cool story.  More "Free U" than "F**k U"!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Dicey on October 13, 2020, 06:59:49 AM
@brukraken22, IMO this totally counts as an Epic FU story. It's also far closer to on topic than a discussion of etymology ;-)
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: BicycleB on October 13, 2020, 12:39:56 PM
It may not be traditional "FU" @blurkraken22 but still a cool story.  More "Free U" than "F**k U"!

+2! Great story, great term!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: blurkraken22 on October 14, 2020, 07:40:55 AM
About 8-9 years ago I was working a pretty miserable job with a crappy boss.  I was in debt (car loan, 2 maxed CCs, 2 student loans) and living paycheck to paycheck.  I wasn't making a lot of money, but more than I felt I could make somewhere else, so I was trapped.  Then a couple things clicked (meeting my frugal girlfriend was the main catalyst).  Over the course of a year I paid off all debts except one of the student loans and started saving 50% of my net.  I only had a couple months savings, but realizing I could get a job making half what I was currently suddenly put me into FU territory.  I made a list of demands for my boss, none of which were met, which is what I expected (he was the kind of guy that viewed everyone as an easily replaceable cog).  So I told him I was starting to job search, knowing what would happen.  Next day I'm handed a layoff notice (due to 'internal restructuring').  I knew 1) he would never let someone stay that was looking around, and 2) that he would have to lay me off (I'd been a flawless employee for 5 years, it would take too much time to build up a fireable case).  This made me qualify for unemployment, which at the time paid 50% of your previous 12 months wages.  Since that's what I'd been living on for a year, it had zero effect on my budget.  5 highly enjoyable and stress-free months later I landed one of the best jobs I've ever had, making 30% more than I was previously.

Not epic 'take this job and shove it', but if I hadn't had the financial stability and confidence, I might still be there.  FU money doesn't always have to be about your bank balance, either.  If you're living on half your paycheck, that opens a lot of doors that people don't usually have.  Most people can't afford to take a pay cut, which keeps them as trapped as debt or lack of savings does.
That boss of yours was doing you a solid and he knew it. I hoped you called him up and thanked him.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: RyanAtTanagra on October 14, 2020, 08:00:14 AM
That boss of yours was doing you a solid and he knew it. I hoped you called him up and thanked him.

Nah, he really wasn't, it was just his fastest/only option.  The reason I was so miserable at that job was because of him and his lack of ethics.  He would tell the sales people to promise customers features our product didn't do, nor would ever do.  Then when they bought and came to me to help them get it set up, and would ask about these features, I'd say 'no it doesn't do that'.  He started getting mad at all the return requests and told me 'you have to string them along until the 30-day money back guarantee is past'.  'Umm, yea I'm not doing that'.  That's when I decided I needed to figure out how to get out.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: SwordGuy on October 14, 2020, 08:50:56 AM
That boss of yours was doing you a solid and he knew it. I hoped you called him up and thanked him.

Nah, he really wasn't, it was just his fastest/only option.  The reason I was so miserable at that job was because of him and his lack of ethics.  He would tell the sales people to promise customers features our product didn't do, nor would ever do.  Then when they bought and came to me to help them get it set up, and would ask about these features, I'd say 'no it doesn't do that'.  He started getting mad at all the return requests and told me 'you have to string them along until the 30-day money back guarantee is past'.  'Umm, yea I'm not doing that'.  That's when I decided I needed to figure out how to get out.

Sociopaths like that are the reason we can't trust businesses with public safety.   It's why we need safety regulations and regulators who work for the public.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: jinga nation on October 14, 2020, 10:35:40 AM
That boss of yours was doing you a solid and he knew it. I hoped you called him up and thanked him.

Nah, he really wasn't, it was just his fastest/only option.  The reason I was so miserable at that job was because of him and his lack of ethics.  He would tell the sales people to promise customers features our product didn't do, nor would ever do.  Then when they bought and came to me to help them get it set up, and would ask about these features, I'd say 'no it doesn't do that'.  He started getting mad at all the return requests and told me 'you have to string them along until the 30-day money back guarantee is past'.  'Umm, yea I'm not doing that'.  That's when I decided I needed to figure out how to get out.

Sociopaths like that are the reason we can't trust businesses with public safety.   It's why we need safety regulations and regulators who work for the public.

I was lucky I had this situation early in my engineering career. When the company owner made incredulous promises to customers, and my engineering manager and team leads protested, her first task was to fire the engineering manager. Her second task was to corral the SW/HW/Mech engineers in a conference room and instruct us "how to engineer" (she had no technical education or experience). Her third task was to bring in a new engineering manager, a bitch of a bulldog. Finally all "non-compliant" engineers were laid-off in waves. These were the people who billed to contracts and performed the design HW/Mech design and wrote code. I was laid off in the second wave, in the middle of a final design review of my work. That Friday's happy hour, we were literally discussing who was going to do the work since there wasn't anyone competent left in the building. Literally 90-95% of the real talent had been dismissed over the 2 layoffs.
One co-worker, previously a Kodak lifer, who was also laid off, told me there was a silver lining. When Upper Management makes false promises which are technically unrealistic or impossible, and starts threatening our jobs, it's time to look elsewhere ASAP. This advice served me well 3.5 years later, when I saw warning signs, gave a heads-up to my closest co-workers (we played soccer after work twice a week), found an opportunity, and skipped town. Heard a couple of months later they had layoffs, and the middle-level younger engineers (28-40) were laid off. They kept the cheap young inexperienced engineers and the old fogeys who hated training new talent. 6Sigma/MBA-level decisions had frightening repercussions on deliverables to Space & Defense customers. Penalties were incurred.
It also spurred me to be better at everything I do, make a small career switch, get FI, have my FU stash, and work for a company where I'm valued. In the 2 comma club. Job could go away tomorrow and my family will be fine.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Taran Wanderer on October 14, 2020, 11:30:45 AM
That boss of yours was doing you a solid and he knew it. I hoped you called him up and thanked him.

Nah, he really wasn't, it was just his fastest/only option.  The reason I was so miserable at that job was because of him and his lack of ethics.  He would tell the sales people to promise customers features our product didn't do, nor would ever do.  Then when they bought and came to me to help them get it set up, and would ask about these features, I'd say 'no it doesn't do that'.  He started getting mad at all the return requests and told me 'you have to string them along until the 30-day money back guarantee is past'.  'Umm, yea I'm not doing that'.  That's when I decided I needed to figure out how to get out.

I really don’t understand why this sort of behavior can’t be criminally prosecuted as fraud.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: former player on October 14, 2020, 11:55:01 AM
That boss of yours was doing you a solid and he knew it. I hoped you called him up and thanked him.

Nah, he really wasn't, it was just his fastest/only option.  The reason I was so miserable at that job was because of him and his lack of ethics.  He would tell the sales people to promise customers features our product didn't do, nor would ever do.  Then when they bought and came to me to help them get it set up, and would ask about these features, I'd say 'no it doesn't do that'.  He started getting mad at all the return requests and told me 'you have to string them along until the 30-day money back guarantee is past'.  'Umm, yea I'm not doing that'.  That's when I decided I needed to figure out how to get out.

I really don’t understand why this sort of behavior can’t be criminally prosecuted as fraud.
It would clog up the courts too much?
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: jinga nation on October 14, 2020, 12:08:25 PM
That boss of yours was doing you a solid and he knew it. I hoped you called him up and thanked him.

Nah, he really wasn't, it was just his fastest/only option.  The reason I was so miserable at that job was because of him and his lack of ethics.  He would tell the sales people to promise customers features our product didn't do, nor would ever do.  Then when they bought and came to me to help them get it set up, and would ask about these features, I'd say 'no it doesn't do that'.  He started getting mad at all the return requests and told me 'you have to string them along until the 30-day money back guarantee is past'.  'Umm, yea I'm not doing that'.  That's when I decided I needed to figure out how to get out.

I really don’t understand why this sort of behavior can’t be criminally prosecuted as fraud.
It would clog up the courts too much?
also the onus is on the employee to collect evidence and prove it. and whistleblowers don't get protected despite the law.
easier to say "fuck it, I quit" than to stay and prove it wrong. there's no financial gain to be made by employee.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Taran Wanderer on October 14, 2020, 12:15:09 PM
Even whistleblower activity generally results in only civil remedies In cases like these. I’m suggesting that this is criminal behavior that should be prosecuted as theft or fraud. It would be in the interest of the cheated customers to pursue criminal charges.

Court capacity is a different (but clearly related) issue. That said, we seem to always have court capacity for low level criminal theft, but why don’t we create that capacity for large scale fraud, theft, and corruption? The answer will likely take us further off topic, so no need for answers. Consider it rhetorical.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: bbqbonelesswing on October 14, 2020, 12:31:27 PM
Even whistleblower activity generally results in only civil remedies In cases like these. I’m suggesting that this is criminal behavior that should be prosecuted as theft or fraud. It would be in the interest of the cheated customers to pursue criminal charges.

Court capacity is a different (but clearly related) issue. That said, we seem to always have court capacity for low level criminal theft, but why don’t we create that capacity for large scale fraud, theft, and corruption? The answer will likely take us further off topic, so no need for answers. Consider it rhetorical.

In my experience (post-sales), the lame salespeople who do this will usually oversell juuust enough so the customer can still use the product, and be 90% happy, but be annoyed a few things are missing. Ie you'll hear a lot of customers saying things like "Salesman Bob told us feature X was on the way later this year- can't wait for it to be ready!" and have to walk it back. I've never seen such a big disaster that we had to go to court or anything like that.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: SwordGuy on October 14, 2020, 01:20:13 PM
Even whistleblower activity generally results in only civil remedies In cases like these. I’m suggesting that this is criminal behavior that should be prosecuted as theft or fraud. It would be in the interest of the cheated customers to pursue criminal charges.

Court capacity is a different (but clearly related) issue. That said, we seem to always have court capacity for low level criminal theft, but why don’t we create that capacity for large scale fraud, theft, and corruption? The answer will likely take us further off topic, so no need for answers. Consider it rhetorical.

The same reason it's criminal theft when an employee takes an employer's stuff (enforced by tax-payer funded police, district attorneys, jails and courts) but it's a civil matter when an employer steals wages from an employee (enforced by employee-funded investigators and attorneys).   Because those who have the gold make the rules.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: blurkraken22 on October 15, 2020, 06:04:26 PM
That boss of yours was doing you a solid and he knew it. I hoped you called him up and thanked him.

Nah, he really wasn't, it was just his fastest/only option.  The reason I was so miserable at that job was because of him and his lack of ethics.  He would tell the sales people to promise customers features our product didn't do, nor would ever do.  Then when they bought and came to me to help them get it set up, and would ask about these features, I'd say 'no it doesn't do that'.  He started getting mad at all the return requests and told me 'you have to string them along until the 30-day money back guarantee is past'.  'Umm, yea I'm not doing that'.  That's when I decided I needed to figure out how to get out.

Well that's ironic! He did what a good boss would offer to do for an employee they liked.

On the ehhiics side, I'm in the software industry (B2B) and that kind of overselling is common enough without being intentional. I'm glad you were able to make a stand and get out and I really hope that guy lost all his customers and then his job .
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Montecarlo on October 15, 2020, 06:42:15 PM
My wife told me a story that a coworker was assigned to be a member of the safety team as as collateral responsibility.  The coworker didn’t respond when told.  He just turned around, went to his boss, and threatened to quit.

Wondering if he is here on this thread?
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: SwordGuy on October 15, 2020, 07:09:53 PM
My boss once came to me and said he had ordered pagers for me and for those programmers who reported to me.  (Yep, that long ago, I'm that old!)

That would be a total waste of our time because our software worked.   The network was unreliable and we would spend our off hours trying to track down network people.    Screw that!

I looked him in the eye and said, calmly and slowly, "When I and my programmers write such bad code that we require pagers, **I** will find another line of work."

I never saw those damn pagers.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: dandarc on October 15, 2020, 09:00:21 PM
Wow - I'd venture a guess you weren't doing government contract work @SwordGuy. Or this might have been back when there was adequate supply of fairly good programmers to meet the demand (because of the low demand - the supply was severely limited I'm sure, but we didn't always have platforms that made everyone with 2 weeks of downtime and $1,000 to become a "coder"), and stuff like quality was valued over meeting the deadline.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: RyanAtTanagra on October 15, 2020, 09:05:22 PM
That boss of yours was doing you a solid and he knew it. I hoped you called him up and thanked him.

Nah, he really wasn't, it was just his fastest/only option.  The reason I was so miserable at that job was because of him and his lack of ethics.  He would tell the sales people to promise customers features our product didn't do, nor would ever do.  Then when they bought and came to me to help them get it set up, and would ask about these features, I'd say 'no it doesn't do that'.  He started getting mad at all the return requests and told me 'you have to string them along until the 30-day money back guarantee is past'.  'Umm, yea I'm not doing that'.  That's when I decided I needed to figure out how to get out.

Well that's ironic! He did what a good boss would offer to do for an employee they liked.

On the ehhiics side, I'm in the software industry (B2B) and that kind of overselling is common enough without being intentional. I'm glad you were able to make a stand and get out and I really hope that guy lost all his customers and then his job .

If was the owner, but yea, basically :-)   It was a software company, and from what I heard, after I left all that shit got worse and not too long after that they went out of business.  Double slap in the face to the owner I'm sure, because at some point while I was working there, when things were going well, he had a buyout offer that would have set him up for life, and he refused it because he had dollar signs in his eyes on where he could take the company.  Couple lessons to anyone that starts a company: 1) the person that can start a successful company from the bottom isn't the same person that can take it to the next level.  Don't be arrogant, and 2) if you get an offer that can make you FI, take it and just start another endeavor without the worries of needing to succeed and sustain your family.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Dicey on October 15, 2020, 09:56:00 PM
That boss of yours was doing you a solid and he knew it. I hoped you called him up and thanked him.

Nah, he really wasn't, it was just his fastest/only option.  The reason I was so miserable at that job was because of him and his lack of ethics.  He would tell the sales people to promise customers features our product didn't do, nor would ever do.  Then when they bought and came to me to help them get it set up, and would ask about these features, I'd say 'no it doesn't do that'.  He started getting mad at all the return requests and told me 'you have to string them along until the 30-day money back guarantee is past'.  'Umm, yea I'm not doing that'.  That's when I decided I needed to figure out how to get out.

Well that's ironic! He did what a good boss would offer to do for an employee they liked.

On the ehhiics side, I'm in the software industry (B2B) and that kind of overselling is common enough without being intentional. I'm glad you were able to make a stand and get out and I really hope that guy lost all his customers and then his job .

If was the owner, but yea, basically :-)   It was a software company, and from what I heard, after I left all that shit got worse and not too long after that they went out of business.  Double slap in the face to the owner I'm sure, because at some point while I was working there, when things were going well, he had a buyout offer that would have set him up for life, and he refused it because he had dollar signs in his eyes on where he could take the company.  Couple lessons to anyone that starts a company: 1) the person that can start a successful company from the bottom isn't the same person that can take it to the next level.  Don't be arrogant, and 2) if you get an offer that can make you FI, take it and just start another endeavor without the worries of needing to succeed and sustain your family.
Any idea what he's doing now?
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: RyanAtTanagra on October 15, 2020, 10:21:57 PM
That boss of yours was doing you a solid and he knew it. I hoped you called him up and thanked him.

Nah, he really wasn't, it was just his fastest/only option.  The reason I was so miserable at that job was because of him and his lack of ethics.  He would tell the sales people to promise customers features our product didn't do, nor would ever do.  Then when they bought and came to me to help them get it set up, and would ask about these features, I'd say 'no it doesn't do that'.  He started getting mad at all the return requests and told me 'you have to string them along until the 30-day money back guarantee is past'.  'Umm, yea I'm not doing that'.  That's when I decided I needed to figure out how to get out.

Well that's ironic! He did what a good boss would offer to do for an employee they liked.

On the ehhiics side, I'm in the software industry (B2B) and that kind of overselling is common enough without being intentional. I'm glad you were able to make a stand and get out and I really hope that guy lost all his customers and then his job .

If was the owner, but yea, basically :-)   It was a software company, and from what I heard, after I left all that shit got worse and not too long after that they went out of business.  Double slap in the face to the owner I'm sure, because at some point while I was working there, when things were going well, he had a buyout offer that would have set him up for life, and he refused it because he had dollar signs in his eyes on where he could take the company.  Couple lessons to anyone that starts a company: 1) the person that can start a successful company from the bottom isn't the same person that can take it to the next level.  Don't be arrogant, and 2) if you get an offer that can make you FI, take it and just start another endeavor without the worries of needing to succeed and sustain your family.
Any idea what he's doing now?

Hah, man I haven't even thought about wondering about that.  Had to look him up.  Looks like he became a business consultant for security/tech companies, and might currently be a C-level at a local tech security company.  So that's about as expected.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Model96 on October 16, 2020, 12:34:05 AM
Remember, there's only 2 industries that call their customers 'users'.....IT and Illegal drugs! LoL
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: 2sk22 on October 16, 2020, 07:17:03 AM
My boss once came to me and said he had ordered pagers for me and for those programmers who reported to me.  (Yep, that long ago, I'm that old!)

That would be a total waste of our time because our software worked.   The network was unreliable and we would spend our off hours trying to track down network people.    Screw that!

I looked him in the eye and said, calmly and slowly, "When I and my programmers write such bad code that we require pagers, **I** will find another line of work."

I never saw those damn pagers.

I have a similar story except I wish I had responded like you did! Back in the early 90s, at my first job, I was the only one who knew how to debug a complex piece of experimental equipment. I had a long commute so I was given a company cell phone (the size of a briefcase) to keep in the car so I could be reached while on the road. Initially, I felt flattered that I was so important as to warrant being given a cell phone. But I soon found out that it meant that people in the office could reach me at all hours - gah! Never again did I accept such off-hours responsibilities in my career :-)
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: SwordGuy on October 16, 2020, 08:18:15 AM
Wow - I'd venture a guess you weren't doing government contract work @SwordGuy. Or this might have been back when there was adequate supply of fairly good programmers to meet the demand (because of the low demand - the supply was severely limited I'm sure, but we didn't always have platforms that made everyone with 2 weeks of downtime and $1,000 to become a "coder"), and stuff like quality was valued over meeting the deadline.

It was back when pagers were in use, not cellphones. :)   So yes, this was back in the day.

And it certainly wasn't government contract work, I've done that too.   That's a totally different work environment than working in private industry.

I was just damn good at my job, I had good programmers working for me and I made sure folks used good methods and techniques so our quality was high and our delivery times were decent.   95% of our programming effort went into producing new functionality, 5% went into dealing with issues that cropped up -- and most of that was in one 3rd party software package.

And, equally important, my boss knew I was damn good at my job.  He wasn't likely to get that kind of results from my replacement.   

FWIW, I've never seen a surplus of really good programmers in my industry.    Or even competent ones.   And I've been working in the industry since 1982.   
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: bluebelle on October 16, 2020, 08:38:03 AM
Wow - I'd venture a guess you weren't doing government contract work @SwordGuy. Or this might have been back when there was adequate supply of fairly good programmers to meet the demand (because of the low demand - the supply was severely limited I'm sure, but we didn't always have platforms that made everyone with 2 weeks of downtime and $1,000 to become a "coder"), and stuff like quality was valued over meeting the deadline.

It was back when pagers were in use, not cellphones. :)   So yes, this was back in the day.

And it certainly wasn't government contract work, I've done that too.   That's a totally different work environment than working in private industry.

I was just damn good at my job, I had good programmers working for me and I made sure folks used good methods and techniques so our quality was high and our delivery times were decent.   95% of our programming effort went into producing new functionality, 5% went into dealing with issues that cropped up -- and most of that was in one 3rd party software package.

And, equally important, my boss knew I was damn good at my job.  He wasn't likely to get that kind of results from my replacement.   

FWIW, I've never seen a surplus of really good programmers in my industry.    Or even competent ones.   And I've been working in the industry since 1982.
and this was why I ended up on call...........fixing other's  incompetence.....all too common a theme
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: dandarc on October 16, 2020, 10:31:11 AM
Good programmer - key skills have nothing to do with technology really.

Observant enough to see when code you wrote didn't work quite right. Tenacious enough to figure it out. Diplomatic enough to not get yourself fired. Secure enough to ask the questions to get clear on what they want before you start writing your code.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: techwiz on October 16, 2020, 10:40:35 AM
Good programmer - key skills have nothing to do with technology really.

Observant enough to see when code you wrote didn't work quite right. Tenacious enough to figure it out. Diplomatic enough to not get yourself fired. Secure enough to ask the questions to get clear on what they want before you start writing your code.

If we knew want they want before starting to code(and that didn't change) it would be too easy.  Working in the government with many changes to the policies/politics on the fly,  ends up making programs so illogical and complex over the years even with good programmers it's a challenge.   
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: jinga nation on October 16, 2020, 10:55:19 AM
Remember, there's only 2 industries that call their customers 'users'.....IT and Illegal drugs! LoL
And in both, never consume your product.
Drug dealers are just Value-Added Resellers. They offer complementary and complimentary add-ons.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: dandarc on October 16, 2020, 11:13:02 AM
Good programmer - key skills have nothing to do with technology really.

Observant enough to see when code you wrote didn't work quite right. Tenacious enough to figure it out. Diplomatic enough to not get yourself fired. Secure enough to ask the questions to get clear on what they want before you start writing your code.

If we knew want they want before starting to code(and that didn't change) it would be too easy.  Working in the government with many changes to the policies/politics on the fly,  ends up making programs so illogical and complex over the years even with good programmers it's a challenge.   
Trust me I know . . . but I'd characterize most of the problems I see as "bad programming" and not the fault of changing regulations.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: blurkraken22 on October 17, 2020, 08:30:13 PM
I was so excited when I found this thread that I immediately wrote up an old story to share. That was five days ago. Since then I've managed to read about 20% of the thread (up to page 13).

I'm feeling therapized!

I've had a troublesome run in my current position over the past two years, first working under a manager who meant well, then absorbing a number of his responsibilities, then being rejected when I was stupid enough to apply for his job when he left. Eventually it all adds up to another FU story, but I have not reached the end of it and I probably don't have the perspective to write it up well just yet. My main lesson for the summer is HR always sides with management.

My question for today: why should I put in the effort to be honest in my exit survey? It's not (yet) an interview, they have a long-ass survey I'm meant to fill out on the HR portal. Should I tell them where I will work next? Surely I have no obligation to do that. But more importantly, is there any reason for me to spend time explaining their problems that they should already know about?

My supervisor was in his role for about 4 years. He had been there and proven himself incompetent for so long that people actually apologized to me about it when I arrived. He was there for another 1.5 years before moving to another role. The higher-ups kept talking about how the company had failed him. WTF!? Failed him? What about the 10-12 people who have to report to him?

[Aside: He's really an OK guy, but somehow completely incapable of making a decent decision as a manager of people. He always tried to find the one most important factor in every situation and would then make a one-factor decision based on that. I can see how that strategy could work wonders in some scenarios, but it rarely worked for what we do. He was also deeply cynical about people and their motivations. He tried not to show it, but inside, he really thinks people will take everything they can get away with and slack off as much as possible. I feel sad, because I don't think anyone could become a leader starting from that kind of belief system. Anyway, much to Mrs. BK's consternation, I do not blame him for this situation. He reached his Peter Principle job and was smart enough to walk away from it after 4 years of professional suffering.]

At a personal-level, the culture is pretty respectful here, which I'm thankful for. But the bureaucracy shows otherwise clearly. If the rules you have in place institutionalize a process of treating people like you cannot trust them, the message gets through.

A fairly simple message to corporate leadership: if you're spending a lot time time repeating "we value our employees" it's most likely because you have not done the things that would SHOW you value your employees.

BUT, back to the base question, is there any reason I should try to share this in an exit interview? I do not need an emotional release at this point, I'm moving to a better situation. I could lean FIRE today, but I'm holding off because the market highs have me feeling nervous. So I'm starting a new job at a new company in the next couple of months. What good will it do to spend my time and effort trying to tell HR things they either already know or would already know if they cared enough to pay attention?

EDITS: Clarity, missing words.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: zolotiyeruki on October 17, 2020, 09:51:05 PM
No, I would not tell your current employer where you're going.  I think it would be appropriate in your exit survey to state things like "Lack of autonomy" or "Lack of opportunity for professional growth," or even "poor project management" but having been down that path before, it's a Sisyphean task.  HR won't care what you write--they're only doing it because it's part of the procedure, and they're not the decision-makers, so your feedback is irrelevant to them.  And Management  is unlikely to care, either--they're too wrapped up in other things to read an exiting employee's feedback.  From what I've seen/read/heard, the only way to force a change is to either A) get into management yourself, or B) become such a key employee (i.e. indispensable AND known and respected a couple layers up) that you have some leverage, and even then, you're unlikely to effect any change.

What I'd suggest is 1) document EVERYTHING, and store it offsite, 2) network with the people who ARE competent.  Who knows, maybe your new employer will be awesome, and also need to hire more people, and you could help your new employer snipe/rescue some people from your old workplace.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: former player on October 18, 2020, 02:42:35 AM
You don't share any of it.    You go completely bland: "I have enjoyed being able to make a contribution to the success of [project] and wish the company well for the future."
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: 2sk22 on October 18, 2020, 04:51:01 AM
You don't share any of it.    You go completely bland: "I have enjoyed being able to make a contribution to the success of [project] and wish the company well for the future."

Completely agree. There is no advantage to be gained by being honest in an exit interview, no matter how angry you feel about the company you are departing.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: NorCal on October 18, 2020, 07:00:24 AM
You don't share any of it.    You go completely bland: "I have enjoyed being able to make a contribution to the success of [project] and wish the company well for the future."

Completely agree. There is no advantage to be gained by being honest in an exit interview, no matter how angry you feel about the company you are departing.

Agree. If you feel the need/desire to share, you can do it anonymously on a site like Glassdoor. In my experience, management will actually pay more attention to this than the silly exit interview surveys.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: saguaro on October 18, 2020, 07:34:15 AM
You don't share any of it.    You go completely bland: "I have enjoyed being able to make a contribution to the success of [project] and wish the company well for the future."

Completely agree. There is no advantage to be gained by being honest in an exit interview, no matter how angry you feel about the company you are departing.

Agree. If you feel the need/desire to share, you can do it anonymously on a site like Glassdoor. In my experience, management will actually pay more attention to this than the silly exit interview surveys.

Yep, exactly what I did when I left the Big Company.   I kept things pretty bland in the exit interview, which was over the phone because the Big Company outsourced even that function by then and the person on the other end was obviously pretty disengaged with the whole thing.  Some time later I posted on Glassdoor addressing the basic issues at the company, but gave no specific details to my situation.

Also when I left, even when people try to guess my real reasons (such as my boss, who could be pretty difficult) I kept it to the blandest reason possible.

ETA: Nobody believed that I was leaving without a job lined up, which I was.  2 months later, when I was hired by the division spun off from the Big Company, some were convinced that had been my plan but wasn't. 
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Sibley on October 18, 2020, 09:56:59 AM
And also - just forget to do that survey thing. Seriously. What are they going to do, fire you?
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: NumberJohnny5 on October 18, 2020, 10:06:47 AM
And also - just forget to do that survey thing. Seriously. What are they going to do, fire you?

"Why did you leave your last job?"

"I was fired because I didn't show up for the exit interview."

"...."
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: blurkraken22 on October 18, 2020, 08:49:52 PM
Thanks for the advice. I have indeed gone super bland in filling out their forms.

A funny, but not funny addition to my exit interview story. The subject of HR portal task is:

Subject: Terminate: blurkraken22

Is there some repressed agression hidden there? LOL. My last mission is to explain to HR why that is a terrible subject to ever send to a human being.

Long gone are the days of idealism when I thought it was HR's mission to treat us like humans.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Adventine on October 19, 2020, 01:58:34 AM
I work in HR and on behalf of all those trying to treat employees like human beings and not like pixels on a screen, I am sorry. How awful.

Enjoy your new found freedom!

Thanks for the advice. I have indeed gone super bland in filling out their forms.

A funny, but not funny addition to my exit interview story. The subject of HR portal task is:

Subject: Terminate: blurkraken22

Is there some repressed agression hidden there? LOL. My last mission is to explain to HR why that is a terrible subject to ever send to a human being.

Long gone are the days of idealism when I thought it was HR's mission to treat us like humans.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: blurkraken22 on October 19, 2020, 02:37:44 AM
I work in HR and on behalf of all those trying to treat employees like human beings and not like pixels on a screen, I am sorry. How awful.

Enjoy your new found freedom!
How does HR experience impact your read on this entire thread?
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: LennStar on October 19, 2020, 03:37:40 AM
Thanks for the advice. I have indeed gone super bland in filling out their forms.

A funny, but not funny addition to my exit interview story. The subject of HR portal task is:

Subject: Terminate: blurkraken22

Is there some repressed agression hidden there? LOL. My last mission is to explain to HR why that is a terrible subject to ever send to a human being.

Long gone are the days of idealism when I thought it was HR's mission to treat us like humans.

Could have been worse. Like "Terminate and hide" or "...cut off".
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Adventine on October 19, 2020, 03:54:14 AM
I work in HR and on behalf of all those trying to treat employees like human beings and not like pixels on a screen, I am sorry. How awful.

Enjoy your new found freedom!
How does HR experience impact your read on this entire thread?

I've been avidly following this thread for years, not through an HR lens, but through a FIRE lens. I'm off-duty when I'm on the MMM forums :)
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Dicey on October 19, 2020, 04:17:32 AM
I work in HR and on behalf of all those trying to treat employees like human beings and not like pixels on a screen, I am sorry. How awful.

Enjoy your new found freedom!
How does HR experience impact your read on this entire thread?

I've been avidly following this thread for years, not through an HR lens, but through a FIRE lens. I'm off-duty when I'm on the MMM forums :)
Nice to see you posting outside the journals section, @Adventine! I'm used to "seeing" you there and it made me smile to see your posts on this thread today. Go, you!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: rockstache on October 19, 2020, 04:20:02 AM
I work in HR and on behalf of all those trying to treat employees like human beings and not like pixels on a screen, I am sorry. How awful.

Enjoy your new found freedom!
How does HR experience impact your read on this entire thread?

I've been avidly following this thread for years, not through an HR lens, but through a FIRE lens.
+1 I'm in HR too, but both here and at work, I'm basically always rooting for people, even when I have to do my job around them. We had a guy leave a toxic manager last month, for a great position and I was privately thrilled for him. Although I gave him the standard line, "We wish you all the best in your future endeavors," I really meant it. I did my job in a professional manner, but I don't run HR or the company. Everyone knows that manager is toxic, and there are 3 more good employees getting set to leave because of him too, but he's got the backing of some high level execs that love him and there's not a thing I could ever do about it.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Adventine on October 19, 2020, 05:03:02 AM
I work in HR and on behalf of all those trying to treat employees like human beings and not like pixels on a screen, I am sorry. How awful.

Enjoy your new found freedom!
How does HR experience impact your read on this entire thread?

I've been avidly following this thread for years, not through an HR lens, but through a FIRE lens. I'm off-duty when I'm on the MMM forums :)
Nice to see you posting outside the journals section, @Adventine! I'm used to "seeing" you there and it made me smile to see your posts on this thread today. Go, you!

Oh, I'm always lurking in this thread. It's one of my all time faves ;)

I work in HR and on behalf of all those trying to treat employees like human beings and not like pixels on a screen, I am sorry. How awful.

Enjoy your new found freedom!
How does HR experience impact your read on this entire thread?

I've been avidly following this thread for years, not through an HR lens, but through a FIRE lens.
+1 I'm in HR too, but both here and at work, I'm basically always rooting for people, even when I have to do my job around them. We had a guy leave a toxic manager last month, for a great position and I was privately thrilled for him. Although I gave him the standard line, "We wish you all the best in your future endeavors," I really meant it. I did my job in a professional manner, but I don't run HR or the company. Everyone knows that manager is toxic, and there are 3 more good employees getting set to leave because of him too, but he's got the backing of some high level execs that love him and there's not a thing I could ever do about it.

Exactly right - I do my job as professionally as I can. But I don't set policy, I don't make hiring/firing decisions, and I try to put myself in the other person's shoes as much as I can.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: BuffaloStache on October 19, 2020, 12:51:17 PM
No, I would not tell your current employer where you're going.  I think it would be appropriate in your exit survey to state things like "Lack of autonomy" or "Lack of opportunity for professional growth," or even "poor project management" but having been down that path before, it's a Sisyphean task.  HR won't care what you write--they're only doing it because it's part of the procedure, and they're not the decision-makers, so your feedback is irrelevant to them.  And Management  is unlikely to care, either--they're too wrapped up in other things to read an exiting employee's feedback.  From what I've seen/read/heard, the only way to force a change is to either A) get into management yourself, or B) become such a key employee (i.e. indispensable AND known and respected a couple layers up) that you have some leverage, and even then, you're unlikely to effect any change.

What I'd suggest is 1) document EVERYTHING, and store it offsite, 2) network with the people who ARE competent.  Who knows, maybe your new employer will be awesome, and also need to hire more people, and you could help your new employer snipe/rescue some people from your old workplace.

I know I'm late to this game but I really like @zolotiyeruki 's response- ditto. When I left my first company, I also didn't officially tell the company where I was going. It became sort of a game in the days leading up to my departure: people would run up to my cube and kept guessing where they thought I was going. Most were wrong, and I only confirmed where I was actually going about a month later. Even then I only confirmed it with the competent people that I was/still am close with (#2 above). 
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: jinga nation on October 19, 2020, 02:09:09 PM
I work in HR and on behalf of all those trying to treat employees like human beings and not like pixels on a screen, I am sorry. How awful.

Enjoy your new found freedom!
How does HR experience impact your read on this entire thread?

I've been avidly following this thread for years, not through an HR lens, but through a FIRE lens.
+1 I'm in HR too, but both here and at work, I'm basically always rooting for people, even when I have to do my job around them. We had a guy leave a toxic manager last month, for a great position and I was privately thrilled for him. Although I gave him the standard line, "We wish you all the best in your future endeavors," I really meant it. I did my job in a professional manner, but I don't run HR or the company. Everyone knows that manager is toxic, and there are 3 more good employees getting set to leave because of him too, but he's got the backing of some high level execs that love him and there's not a thing I could ever do about it.

Been in that situation, been that engineer who was the first of many to walk out the door. This was young me, in my 2nd full-time job, in a Fortune 500.
The high-level exec was protected because he was doing what was required of him, to get rid of the talent, after ensuring process were documented and people had been cross-trained in Puerto Rico and Bangalore.
People don't matter if the focus is solely on the bottom line to deliver shareholder value. At all short-term costs.
Gave a lot of (useful, to me) information to my director during the exit interview. My team lead told me it was waste of time, management would use it as proof they're on the right track to outsourcing our work.

Always say nice things on your way out, not the real truth. You want the new employer to get a good feedback about you. Never ever voluntarily tell your old employer where you're going.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: blurkraken22 on October 21, 2020, 06:37:17 PM
It could be that this is the first time she ever saw her behavior through another person's eyes.  You might be the catalyst that makes her change the way she treats people for the better.  If not, you have likely been the first chink in the wall that will eventually come crumbling down around her. 

Good for you!
I really like this response because it assumes that the antagonist can change. In fact, the most epic story of all would be the one where the office bully woke up, realized what they were doing, and changed their behavior.

I did not grow up with good role models at home for providing constructive feedback and helping people improve their behavior. I also worked mostly alone for the first few years of my career (it was the nature of that role). Eventually, being a top performer in my group, my manager began asking me to mentor and coach newer engineers. Alas, at first I was clumsy and overly critical when I started trying to teach. I have rubbed people the wrong way. In retrospect, I can even say I was the ass hat. As often happens (particularly to young engineers), I thought being technically correct was more important than my colleague's feelings. It's a sort of "let's talk facts and keep feelings out of it" mindset. How naive to think that people can really do that. Eventually I learned that if you're trying to teach someone and they're not "getting it", as the teacher it's your responsibility to package the message in a format the learner can consume.

I was lucky to meet a very very good mentor right around the time I started working in a more team-oriented environment, but my path could have been quite different. Sometimes people are just being ass hots because they see something wrong, want to fix it, but don't have the communications skills to address it well.

By no means am I suggesting we enable bullies. That's not the solution at all. But to go and professionally explain to them why their behavior is not making the situation better might trigger a better story line. And if it does not, a documented conversation along these lines will be a great thing to submit to supervisor or HR down the road if this person cannot improve.

TLDL: If you're calm and a good communicator, you can put the office bully on a PIP. :D

EDIT: I always find ways to improve clarity after hitting the post button.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: jamaicaspanish on October 21, 2020, 07:58:27 PM
I teach Spanish and English as a retirement side gig.
One of my clients taught me one of the greatest lessons ever. Truly perspective-shifting.
She asked me to rephrase my feedback question from 
Do you understand?
to
Am I explaining it well?

I try to embrace the responsibility of reaching the student, not just expecting the student to make progress.
Kind of Mountain and Mohammed stuff.
I hope I explained that well.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: AO1FireTo on October 21, 2020, 08:04:50 PM
I teach Spanish and English as a retirement side gig.
One of my clients taught me one of the greatest lessons ever. Truly perspective-shifting.
She asked me to rephrase my feedback question from 
Do you understand?
to
Am I explaining it well?

I try to embrace the responsibility of reaching the student, not just expecting the student to make progress.
Kind of Mountain and Mohammed stuff.
I hope I explained that well.

Love it!!!  I am going to start using that with my daughter.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: LennStar on October 22, 2020, 04:31:35 AM
I teach Spanish and English as a retirement side gig.
One of my clients taught me one of the greatest lessons ever. Truly perspective-shifting.
She asked me to rephrase my feedback question from 
Do you understand?
to
Am I explaining it well?

I try to embrace the responsibility of reaching the student, not just expecting the student to make progress.
Kind of Mountain and Mohammed stuff.
I hope I explained that well.

Love it!!!  I am going to start using that with my daughter.
It even gets a bonus point because it "creates" the option of "you explained well, but I still don't understand". Which means that not the same information in a different way, but additional information is needed.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: RWTL on October 24, 2020, 08:40:34 AM
I teach Spanish and English as a retirement side gig.
One of my clients taught me one of the greatest lessons ever. Truly perspective-shifting.
She asked me to rephrase my feedback question from 
Do you understand?
to
Am I explaining it well?

I try to embrace the responsibility of reaching the student, not just expecting the student to make progress.
Kind of Mountain and Mohammed stuff.
I hope I explained that well.

I've always said "Does that make sense?" but I think I'm going to switch to this above.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: SereneOne on October 24, 2020, 05:35:36 PM
This thread has entertained me greatly over the past few weeks. I created an account just to submit my story. It didn't seem epic at the time but it felt BA to type it out.

Here's a story from many years ago...more about FU skills than FU money. This experience taught me alot about myself and work/life balance. Some bridges deserve to be burned and the earth salted.

I'm a school psychologist in a school. This position is in major demand in my state because there is no one else in the district who can do a part of our job (test students to help determine if there is a disability). I leave District A as the only psychologist because the then superintendent who was retiring refused to give me a raise I requested. I loved the culture at District A and the people but felt I needed to make the move for my career. District B had a higher salary scale and more opportunity for upward mobility. 

August: I made the move to District B after their two psychologists retired. I was hired and they were working on hiring another person. The school district is too big for just one of us and the state has rules limiting how many students I can serve. All is going well until I start being asked to do additional work beyond my contracted day. 

September
: Usually, "extra work" is expected in my role but they still hadn't filled the other psychlogist's spot as yet so I could see they were aiming to have me do the job of two people. I emailed the superintendent and told her I'd be more than happy to contract with them after my hours to do any additional work they needed. This was the beginning of the craziest school year of all time. This incident was when apparently I poisoned the superintendent against me. In September!!! I was told there was absolutely no way they would contract with me, I was relieved of several other responsibilities and told to prioritize my day appropriately. I'll admit to being flabbergasted but I continued to do my work (not the extra and went on about my day). I'll admit to being a little naive since I thought this was over and I'd stay in my corner. 

October: I got the flu and took several days off. My wife and kids all got the flu and I took more days off. In my state, sick time is a state provided benefit (it transfers with you from school to school) and I was actually sick so I took a total of 8 days off in a 14 day period. My job is very deadline driven (federal requirements), so I did work while sick, came in for half days and missed ZERO deadlines. 

November: I come into work and was handed a letter of reprimand by my supervisor. I'm the straightest of the straight arrows out there so this was a bit shocking. After the shock I ask about my rights as an employee and ask pointed questions about why I was being treated significantly different than any other employee regarding a state benefit. These questions did nothing to endear me to the superintendent (S), assistant superintendent (AS) or my supervisor. I wrote a letter of appeal outlining why what was being done was discrimination and potentially illegal. I was asked to get a doctor's note for every instance of illness. Annoying but easily done and no one else had to do this. Just me. 

I remember clearly meeting with S and telling her that I didn't want a fight. I just wanted to be allowed to do my job and do it well since I was good at it. After all I had missed zero deadlines and every objective measure was positive. She said she didn't want to fight either. I thought she softened but then she said I "would do what she told me to do, no questions asked." I laughed and said, "ok, so it's going to be a fight then." I do nothing outside of contracted hours and stay late 

***The reader may be asking themselves why I didn't quit at this point. I considered it but in my state you can have your license suspended for up to a year (no work) for leaving in the middle of a school year. I had babies at home and my wife was stay at home. I didn't have THAT much FU money***

December: Another letter of reprimand this month, I can't remember what about. Most likely insubordination because I flat out said "no" several times. They couldn't fire me because they needed me. They were just trying to make me miserable.

No additional psychologist has been hired. The S, AS and supervisor start to realize that I will reach my caseload maximum soon. I've been tracking every single student I have contact with and realize I'll be done in January at this pace. My role is significantly limited at this point, I have to share a weekly calendar with them and they give me additional responsibilities (!!!!) that were pretty much BS paperwork and busywork. At this point my direct supervisor begins to realize that I'm good at my job and I've done everything that's been asked of me. He gives me a positive mid-year evaluation!!! :D S and AS are pissed. This positive evaluation becomes a giant hammer I use to beat back any negative thing S or AS say against me.

January: I get emailed a laundry list of new tasks for me to complete. I email back and say I won't be doing any of those. What is being asked of me is unethical and potentially illegal. I was asked to supervise a teacher. Something I had never done was not qualified to do. This is when I started to cc the school board on everything and get the teacher's union involved (I am non union). S requests a meeting with the AS and my direct supervisor to go over my new tasks. At this point I had a two year contract with the school. Although employees cannot break contract in the middle of a school year we can leave between school years. I clarified with a state education department lawyer in September. In our meeting I make the mistake (at the end of the meeting while I was getting up) of saying that I'd get them through to the end of the year following all the rules and laws, without missing any deadlines.

The superintendent set her jaw and stated I had a two year contract and they were not releasing me. I laughed and said what I stated above about leaving between years per the state education department lawyer. The superintendent said again that she would refuse to release me. I looked around, stood up, laughed incredulously and said, "I'm not sure what about I just said you didn't understand. I. WILL. NOT. BE. HERE. NEXT SCHOOL YEAR." I did it slowly enough like I thought she didn't understand English then walked out.

I leave this meeting and file a complaint with the Office of Civil rights (OCR) and the equal opportunity commission (EEOC) about withholding of a state issued benefit (sick leave). There was a time limit on when I could complain from the time the incident happened.

February: Turns out my old district A superintendent did retire and hired my friend, a former principal who knew me and my work well. The new psychologist was not working out well for them. They posted my old job again so I applied and got it with a small raise. :) AS and S hear about this through the area grapevine and they are pissed. 

Superintendent receives the official OCR and EEOC complaint. From this point there is ABSOLUTE radio silence. It was eerie. There was zero contact from S or AS. I'm assuming their lawyer recommended it.

March-May: I get to do my job (just my part) with no extra work. AS tells me they wish they had taken me up on my offer to contract with them. Me too. They had to hire a local clinical psych who charged them an arm and a leg. I turn my letter of resignation into the district on the absolute last possible day. :D 

One year later: The school board changed. The superintendent was demoted to being a teacher. Not even kidding. I think there was something in her contract about guaranteed employment so they demoted her. The AS was demoted to principal. My supervisor resigned after it was found out he was sleeping with a teacher he supervised. He was married. I'm thinking I wasn't the issue here.

This has just been a bad memory since then. I'm still at District A for the time being. I see another FU moment shaping up. My friend, the current superintendent is training me in a school finance area that only she and I know how to do. She is planning on retiring this year. :)
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: RWTL on October 24, 2020, 05:43:18 PM
This thread has entertained me greatly over the past few weeks. I created an account just to submit my story. It didn't seem epic at the time but it felt BA to type it out.

Here's a story from many years ago...more about FU skills than FU money. This experience taught me alot about myself and work/life balance. Some bridges deserve to be burned and the earth salted.

I'm a school psychologist in a school. This position is in major demand in my state because there is no one else in the district who can do a part of our job (test students to help determine if there is a disability). I leave District A as the only psychologist because the then superintendent who was retiring refused to give me a raise I requested. I loved the culture at District A and the people but felt I needed to make the move for my career. District B had a higher salary scale and more opportunity for upward mobility.

August: I made the move to District B after their two psychologists retired. I was hired and they were working on hiring another person. The school district is too big for just one of us and the state has rules limiting how many students I can serve. All is going well until I start being asked to do additional work beyond my contracted day.

September
: Usually, "extra work" is expected in my role but they still hadn't filled the other psychlogist's spot as yet so I could see they were aiming to have me do the job of two people. I emailed the superintendent and told her I'd be more than happy to contract with them after my hours to do any additional work they needed. This was the beginning of the craziest school year of all time. This incident was when apparently I poisoned the superintendent against me. In September!!! I was told there was absolutely no way they would contract with me, I was relieved of several other responsibilities and told to prioritize my day appropriately. I'll admit to being flabbergasted but I continued to do my work (not the extra and went on about my day). I'll admit to being a little naive since I thought this was over and I'd stay in my corner.

October: I got the flu and took several days off. My wife and kids all got the flu and I took more days off. In my state, sick time is a state provided benefit (it transfers with you from school to school) and I was actually sick so I took a total of 8 days off in a 14 day period. My job is very deadline driven (federal requirements), so I did work while sick, came in for half days and missed ZERO deadlines.

November: I come into work and was handed a letter of reprimand by my supervisor. I'm the straightest of the straight arrows out there so this was a bit shocking. After the shock I ask about my rights as an employee and ask pointed questions about why I was being treated significantly different than any other employee regarding a state benefit. These questions did nothing to endear me to the superintendent (S), assistant superintendent (AS) or my supervisor. I wrote a letter of appeal outlining why what was being done was discrimination and potentially illegal. I was asked to get a doctor's note for every instance of illness. Annoying but easily done and no one else had to do this. Just me.

I remember clearly meeting with S and telling her that I didn't want a fight. I just wanted to be allowed to do my job and do it well since I was good at it. After all I had missed zero deadlines and every objective measure was positive. She said she didn't want to fight either. I thought she softened but then she said I "would do what she told me to do, no questions asked." I laughed and said, "ok, so it's going to be a fight then." I do nothing outside of contracted hours and stay late

***The reader may be asking themselves why I didn't quit at this point. I considered it but in my state you can have your license suspended for up to a year (no work) for leaving in the middle of a school year. I had babies at home and my wife was stay at home. I didn't have THAT much FU money***

December: Another letter of reprimand this month, I can't remember what about. Most likely insubordination because I flat out said "no" several times. They couldn't fire me because they needed me. They were just trying to make me miserable.

No additional psychologist has been hired. The S, AS and supervisor start to realize that I will reach my caseload maximum soon. I've been tracking every single student I have contact with and realize I'll be done in January at this pace. My role is significantly limited at this point, I have to share a weekly calendar with them and they give me additional responsibilities (!!!!) that were pretty much BS paperwork and busywork. At this point my direct supervisor begins to realize that I'm good at my job and I've done everything that's been asked of me. He gives me a positive mid-year evaluation!!! :D S and AS are pissed. This positive evaluation becomes a giant hammer I use to beat back any negative thing S or AS say against me.

January: I get emailed a laundry list of new tasks for me to complete. I email back and say I won't be doing any of those. What is being asked of me is unethical and potentially illegal. I was asked to supervise a teacher. Something I had never done was not qualified to do. This is when I started to cc the school board on everything and get the teacher's union involved (I am non union). S requests a meeting with the AS and my direct supervisor to go over my new tasks. At this point I had a two year contract with the school. Although employees cannot break contract in the middle of a school year we can leave between school years. I clarified with a state education department lawyer in September. In our meeting I make the mistake (at the end of the meeting while I was getting up) of saying that I'd get them through to the end of the year following all the rules and laws, without missing any deadlines.

The superintendent set her jaw and stated I had a two year contract and they were not releasing me. I laughed and said what I stated above about leaving between years per the state education department lawyer. The superintendent said again that she would refuse to release me. I looked around, stood up, laughed incredulously and said, "I'm not sure what about I just said you didn't understand. I. WILL. NOT. BE. HERE. NEXT SCHOOL YEAR." I did it slowly enough like I thought she didn't understand English then walked out.

I leave this meeting and file a complaint with the Office of Civil rights (OCR) and the equal opportunity commission (EEOC) about withholding of a state issued benefit (sick leave). There was a time limit on when I could complain from the time the incident happened.

February: Turns out my old district A superintendent did retire and hired my friend, a former principal who knew me and my work well. The new psychologist was not working out well for them. They posted my old job again so I applied and got it with a small raise. :) AS and S hear about this through the area grapevine and they are pissed.

Superintendent receives the official OCR and EEOC complaint. From this point there is ABSOLUTE radio silence. It was eerie. There was zero contact from S or AS. I'm assuming their lawyer recommended it.

March-May: I get to do my job (just my part) with no extra work. AS tells me they wish they had taken me up on my offer to contract with them. Me too. They had to hire a local clinical psych who charged them an arm and a leg. I turn my letter of resignation into the district on the absolute last possible day. :D

One year later: The school board changed. The superintendent was demoted to being a teacher. Not even kidding. I think there was something in her contract about guaranteed employment so they demoted her. The AS was demoted to principal. My supervisor resigned after it was found out he was sleeping with a teacher he supervised. He was married. I'm thinking I wasn't the issue here.

This has just been a bad memory since then. I'm still at District A for the time being. I see another FU moment shaping up. My friend, the current superintendent is training me in a school finance area that only she and I know how to do. She is planning on retiring this year. :)

Glad you joined to post that.  What a crazy story.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: LennStar on October 25, 2020, 02:03:15 AM
Yeah. Holy shit.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: 2sk22 on October 25, 2020, 03:45:16 AM
@SereneOne Thats truly epic and definitely belongs in the hall-of-fame! And welcome to the forum!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: bbqbonelesswing on October 25, 2020, 08:48:03 AM
Totally badass first post!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Psychstache on October 25, 2020, 09:17:02 AM
snip of awesome story of school district shooting themselves in the foot from their own pettiness.

Excellent story @SereneOne. Also, another male School Psych with an interest in personal finance? It's like two unicorns meeting!!


August: I made the move to District B after their two psychologists retired. I was hired and they were working on hiring another person. The school district is too big for just one of us and the state has rules limiting how many students I can serve. All is going well until I start being asked to do additional work beyond my contracted day.

I would love if you would share (or PM me) what state this is. I do some working with our state association and help with some lobbying efforts and we do not have anything like that state rule. Our state as a whole has about a 1:2800 psych:student ratio at the moment (with some regions being as bad a 1:16,000!!). Would be interesting to see how the state wrote that law.

Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: SereneOne on October 25, 2020, 10:06:48 AM
Ha! Thanks everyone who responded. It was quite the year and I’m glad to be on the forum.

And yes, not too many male school psychs to begin with. I shot you a pm. Your state ratio is something! Ours is nowhere near that high thankfully.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: rpr on October 25, 2020, 11:44:09 PM
@SereneOne -- welcome. What a story!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: mm1970 on October 26, 2020, 02:51:10 PM
That was a glorious story!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: blurkraken22 on November 01, 2020, 01:56:06 AM
I finally finished reading the entire thread! Wow! It has been EPIC. I want to thank everyone for their stories. On a personal level, I think this thread has helped me to better tell the difference between petty annoyances and serious work issues. I've been a lot luckier in my career than I realized. TBD: if I can keep the perspective I've learned from this thread or if I'm just getting cantankerous and cranky...

...
I'm really good at what I'm specializing in, but I'm not good in all aspects of my general job. Let's say I'm much better at designing high quality baskets than at fixing the looms for underwater basket weaving when they break. I'm trying really hard to becoming better at loom fixing, I watch youtube video's about it in my spare time, but trying to improve means I'm asking lots of questions to coworkers and I work slowly which they perceive as me being incompetent. And of course, I am not good at loom fixing, but hey, I'm not a loom mechanic, I never claimed to be, please let me design the fancy baskets that we can sell for $$$ because that's what I'm really good at. When I do get to design it's always a big success.

@Imma Did you make any moves? I was hoping you would manage to find a role that where your main duties would involve design and no obligation to fix looms.

It's a thing. I believe @couponvan is our longest running chain smoker smoke breaker.
Can you tell me more about this concept? I may have had a smoke break by already, but I want to be sure I understand the definition before I say that.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: fuzzy math on November 01, 2020, 07:24:19 AM
Bravo @SereneOne !!! We should all practice saying "I'm not sure what about I just said you didn't understand. I. WILL. NOT. BE. HERE. NEXT SCHOOL YEAR."  to our shitty employers!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Imma on November 01, 2020, 09:11:31 AM
@blurkraken22 funny you ask today!  I'm officially starting a new job as a basket design auditor today! My previous employer decided to sell off their design devision due to Covid. I had heard rumours and put two and two together so when I was called into the office to be told they were going to let me go, I was able to tell them I had a job interview the next day. I was hired there and will start tomorrow. My previous employer was kind and offered me a generous deal - they acknowledged they had hired me for one thing and then let me do very different work. They agreed my new job would be a better fit and actually recommended me to my new employer.

Tomorrow is my first day of work. I'll be much better paid, better benefits, office is walking distance from home but right now we're 100% work from home. I was asked to defer my last year of grad school (I do evening classes on top of my job) but in return they'll pay my tuition next year and when I get Master of Basket Design degree I'll be able to apply for a better paid position as a senior basket design auditor. I'll still not be able to design myself but I think I will enjoy this job. I enjoyed the auditing parts of my previous job. And we're in the middle of a pandemic and the next few years will be challenging, so a steady, fulltime job with benefits is just what I need. Especially since my partner works in an industry heavily affected by Covid.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: RetiredAt63 on November 01, 2020, 09:52:59 AM
@Imma, that's great news. Congratulations!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Imma on November 01, 2020, 02:06:48 PM
@Imma, that's great news. Congratulations!

Thanks! I'm really happy with it too. I used to get tons of requests from recruiters on LinkedIn but that stopped as soon as the pandemic happened. I got this job through someone in my network, I didn't actually have to apply.

People tell me how lucky I was, and I am, but it's also been hard work. I've put a lot of effort in my work, I went back for a Master's degree in the evenings (and paid it myself) I put a lot of effort in making connections with people although that's not my natural talent. I was lucky that I was hired for this position but I also put myself in this position where this could happen to me.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: SwordGuy on November 01, 2020, 02:32:21 PM
@Imma, that's great news. Congratulations!

Thanks! I'm really happy with it too. I used to get tons of requests from recruiters on LinkedIn but that stopped as soon as the pandemic happened. I got this job through someone in my network, I didn't actually have to apply.

People tell me how lucky I was, and I am, but it's also been hard work. I've put a lot of effort in my work, I went back for a Master's degree in the evenings (and paid it myself) I put a lot of effort in making connections with people although that's not my natural talent. I was lucky that I was hired for this position but I also put myself in this position where this could happen to me.

It may be luck, but it's self-manufactured luck...

Good job!

My wife got a free ride to Emory University for her Masters and PhD, plus a stipend.    It took a bit of luck (she was choice #13 for 12 slots, someone ahead of her went somewhere else), but she did LOTS of extra work to get that #13 slot.   
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: RyanAtTanagra on November 01, 2020, 03:27:22 PM
People tell me how lucky I was, and I am, but it's also been hard work.

Luck is what people call it so they don't have to feel bad for not putting in the work that lets people take advantage of, or create, the 'lucky' opportunity.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: SwordGuy on November 01, 2020, 03:52:43 PM
People tell me how lucky I was, and I am, but it's also been hard work.

Luck is what people call it so they don't have to feel bad for not putting in the work that lets people take advantage of, or create, the 'lucky' opportunity.

Yep.

I found this book to be really interesting.    The Luck Factor by Richard Wiseman.

Looks at luck and some studies he did to test the presence or absence of luck, and how to go about increasing luck.

https://www.amazon.com/Richard-Wiseman-Luck-Factor-New/dp/B00N4EXVW8/ref=sr_1_1?dchild=1&keywords=wiseman+luck&qid=1604271035&s=books&sr=1-1
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: blurkraken22 on November 01, 2020, 05:03:08 PM
People tell me how lucky I was, and I am, but it's also been hard work. I've put a lot of effort in my work, I went back for a Master's degree in the evenings (and paid it myself) I put a lot of effort in making connections with people although that's not my natural talent. I was lucky that I was hired for this position but I also put myself in this position where this could happen to me.

You recognized the parts of your job that you loved, separated those parts from the ones you didn't love, and took rational steps to train up and find a job where you could do more of what you love. That sounds like working smart to me, but maybe there's some luck thrown in there too. ;)

I'm glad you've found something that seems to fit so well!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: markbike528CBX on November 01, 2020, 06:56:18 PM
@blurkraken22 funny you ask today!  I'm officially starting a new job as a basket design auditor today! My previous employer decided to sell off their design devision due to Covid. I had heard rumours and put two and two together so when I was called into the office to be told they were going to let me go, I was able to tell them I had a job interview the next day. I was hired there and will start tomorrow. My previous employer was kind and offered me a generous deal - they acknowledged they had hired me for one thing and then let me do very different work. They agreed my new job would be a better fit and actually recommended me to my new employer.

Tomorrow is my first day of work. I'll be much better paid, better benefits, office is walking distance from home but right now we're 100% work from home. I was asked to defer my last year of grad school (I do evening classes on top of my job) but in return they'll pay my tuition next year and when I get Master of Basket Design degree I'll be able to apply for a better paid position as a senior basket design auditor. I'll still not be able to design myself but I think I will enjoy this job. I enjoyed the auditing parts of my previous job. And we're in the middle of a pandemic and the next few years will be challenging, so a steady, fulltime job with benefits is just what I need. Especially since my partner works in an industry heavily affected by Covid.

@Imma :  Please tell me that "basket design auditor" and "Master of Basket Design degree" are code words for another actual degree/job.
If not, I'll have to rework all my "underwater basket weaving" degree jokes.  Dangit :-)
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: former player on November 02, 2020, 02:33:09 AM
@blurkraken22 funny you ask today!  I'm officially starting a new job as a basket design auditor today! My previous employer decided to sell off their design devision due to Covid. I had heard rumours and put two and two together so when I was called into the office to be told they were going to let me go, I was able to tell them I had a job interview the next day. I was hired there and will start tomorrow. My previous employer was kind and offered me a generous deal - they acknowledged they had hired me for one thing and then let me do very different work. They agreed my new job would be a better fit and actually recommended me to my new employer.

Tomorrow is my first day of work. I'll be much better paid, better benefits, office is walking distance from home but right now we're 100% work from home. I was asked to defer my last year of grad school (I do evening classes on top of my job) but in return they'll pay my tuition next year and when I get Master of Basket Design degree I'll be able to apply for a better paid position as a senior basket design auditor. I'll still not be able to design myself but I think I will enjoy this job. I enjoyed the auditing parts of my previous job. And we're in the middle of a pandemic and the next few years will be challenging, so a steady, fulltime job with benefits is just what I need. Especially since my partner works in an industry heavily affected by Covid.

@Imma :  Please tell me that "basket design auditor" and "Master of Basket Design degree" are code words for another actual degree/job.
If not, I'll have to rework all my "underwater basket weaving" degree jokes.  Dangit :-)
A friend of mine has a farm near the sea with a wetland that grows willow.  There is a right of common over it, from time immemorial, for fishermen to harvest the willow to make crab and lobster baskets, which they would weave.  So weaving underwater baskets is a time honoured occupation in my part of the world.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Taran Wanderer on November 02, 2020, 12:46:35 PM
But are they actually doing the weaving while underwater...?

😉
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: jeninco on November 02, 2020, 01:19:56 PM
@blurkraken22 funny you ask today!  I'm officially starting a new job as a basket design auditor today! My previous employer decided to sell off their design devision due to Covid. I had heard rumours and put two and two together so when I was called into the office to be told they were going to let me go, I was able to tell them I had a job interview the next day. I was hired there and will start tomorrow. My previous employer was kind and offered me a generous deal - they acknowledged they had hired me for one thing and then let me do very different work. They agreed my new job would be a better fit and actually recommended me to my new employer.

Tomorrow is my first day of work. I'll be much better paid, better benefits, office is walking distance from home but right now we're 100% work from home. I was asked to defer my last year of grad school (I do evening classes on top of my job) but in return they'll pay my tuition next year and when I get Master of Basket Design degree I'll be able to apply for a better paid position as a senior basket design auditor. I'll still not be able to design myself but I think I will enjoy this job. I enjoyed the auditing parts of my previous job. And we're in the middle of a pandemic and the next few years will be challenging, so a steady, fulltime job with benefits is just what I need. Especially since my partner works in an industry heavily affected by Covid.

@Imma :  Please tell me that "basket design auditor" and "Master of Basket Design degree" are code words for another actual degree/job.
If not, I'll have to rework all my "underwater basket weaving" degree jokes.  Dangit :-)
A friend of mine has a farm near the sea with a wetland that grows willow.  There is a right of common over it, from time immemorial, for fishermen to harvest the willow to make crab and lobster baskets, which they would weave.  So weaving underwater baskets is a time honoured occupation in my part of the world.

That piece of information just made one more piece of the linguistic world click into place for me -- thanks!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: WhiteTrashCash on November 03, 2020, 06:06:46 AM
@blurkraken22 funny you ask today!  I'm officially starting a new job as a basket design auditor today! My previous employer decided to sell off their design devision due to Covid. I had heard rumours and put two and two together so when I was called into the office to be told they were going to let me go, I was able to tell them I had a job interview the next day. I was hired there and will start tomorrow. My previous employer was kind and offered me a generous deal - they acknowledged they had hired me for one thing and then let me do very different work. They agreed my new job would be a better fit and actually recommended me to my new employer.

Tomorrow is my first day of work. I'll be much better paid, better benefits, office is walking distance from home but right now we're 100% work from home. I was asked to defer my last year of grad school (I do evening classes on top of my job) but in return they'll pay my tuition next year and when I get Master of Basket Design degree I'll be able to apply for a better paid position as a senior basket design auditor. I'll still not be able to design myself but I think I will enjoy this job. I enjoyed the auditing parts of my previous job. And we're in the middle of a pandemic and the next few years will be challenging, so a steady, fulltime job with benefits is just what I need. Especially since my partner works in an industry heavily affected by Covid.

@Imma :  Please tell me that "basket design auditor" and "Master of Basket Design degree" are code words for another actual degree/job.
If not, I'll have to rework all my "underwater basket weaving" degree jokes.  Dangit :-)

Maybe we could change those jokes to a degree in Interpretive Dance? No, there are probably high-paying jobs in that field too.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Imma on November 03, 2020, 06:37:48 AM
@blurkraken22 funny you ask today!  I'm officially starting a new job as a basket design auditor today! My previous employer decided to sell off their design devision due to Covid. I had heard rumours and put two and two together so when I was called into the office to be told they were going to let me go, I was able to tell them I had a job interview the next day. I was hired there and will start tomorrow. My previous employer was kind and offered me a generous deal - they acknowledged they had hired me for one thing and then let me do very different work. They agreed my new job would be a better fit and actually recommended me to my new employer.

Tomorrow is my first day of work. I'll be much better paid, better benefits, office is walking distance from home but right now we're 100% work from home. I was asked to defer my last year of grad school (I do evening classes on top of my job) but in return they'll pay my tuition next year and when I get Master of Basket Design degree I'll be able to apply for a better paid position as a senior basket design auditor. I'll still not be able to design myself but I think I will enjoy this job. I enjoyed the auditing parts of my previous job. And we're in the middle of a pandemic and the next few years will be challenging, so a steady, fulltime job with benefits is just what I need. Especially since my partner works in an industry heavily affected by Covid.

@Imma :  Please tell me that "basket design auditor" and "Master of Basket Design degree" are code words for another actual degree/job.
If not, I'll have to rework all my "underwater basket weaving" degree jokes.  Dangit :-)

Maybe we could change those jokes to a degree in Interpretive Dance? No, there are probably high-paying jobs in that field too.

I know everyone on MMM is into STEM subjects, but I know quite a few people with Liberal Arts / Art school degrees who are doing just fine financially and also more than a few people with STEM degrees who are not. I think very few degrees are actually completely useless.

I am not a real underwater basket weaver irl, I can't tell you what I do now but I am open about what I went to school for: history and law.

A degree is just proof you can stick with a project for a few years and that you have gained some knowledge, but in real life other things matter as well: being able to work with coworkers, office politics, creative thinking, entrepreneurship, management skills.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: RetiredAt63 on November 03, 2020, 10:08:10 AM
I know someone with a Psych/law degree who is doing just fine.  I also know that not all STEM degrees make you lots of money, as in almost all Biologists.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Plina on November 03, 2020, 11:47:48 AM
I know someone with a Psych/law degree who is doing just fine.  I also know that not all STEM degrees make you lots of money, as in almost all Biologists.

A Psych degree can be useful in dealing with clients if you work in the law field. :-)

An update: I have been at my new job for two months and I had a surprising discussion with my boss today. She asked if I would be interested in a manager position half of the time and working as a lawyer the other half. She is not enjoying the manager parts of being a company owner and wants to focus on the legal stuff. So she has been thinking about an external CEO but has not found someone who would fit. She and the officer manager thinks I would be a good fit. It interest me because even though I like parts of the lawyering stuff I also like the development stuff that would come with the position. We will talk further on friday.

The funny thing is that I talked with a friend on Sunday and told that I had 4 months left on my probationary period before my contract would be a normal until further notice contract. I was obviously doing way better than I thought!

My mother also asked today what I had done or will do with the money I got for leaving my previous job. She also had realised that I could not spend all my salary. I told her I would take a really expensive cruise to Antartica to see the penguins when the covid is over and I was saving for retirement. She concluded that I would be a millionaire and I did not deny that.

Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: BicycleB on November 03, 2020, 12:12:14 PM
I know someone with a Psych/law degree who is doing just fine.  I also know that not all STEM degrees make you lots of money, as in almost all Biologists.

A Psych degree can be useful in dealing with clients if you work in the law field. :-)

An update: I have been at my new job for two months and I had a surprising discussion with my boss today. She asked if I would be interested in a manager position half of the time and working as a lawyer the other half. She is not enjoying the manager parts of being a company owner and wants to focus on the legal stuff. So she has been thinking about an external CEO but has not found someone who would fit. She and the officer manager thinks I would be a good fit. It interest me because even though I like parts of the lawyering stuff I also like the development stuff that would come with the position. We will talk further on friday.

The funny thing is that I talked with a friend on Sunday and told that I had 4 months left on my probationary period before my contract would be a normal until further notice contract. I was obviously doing way better than I thought!

My mother also asked today what I had done or will do with the money I got for leaving my previous job. She also had realised that I could not spend all my salary. I told her I would take a really expensive cruise to Antartica to see the penguins when the covid is over and I was saving for retirement. She concluded that I would be a millionaire and I did not deny that.



Good for your mom! It's nice to be respected, too.

I like that you're now in a position of deciding what to do at work based on what you want to do. Looking forward, I imagine that the CEO role would be a great experience for running your own firm later. Sounds like a great option for you.

It's epic how well your FU story really is turning out.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: lhamo on November 03, 2020, 01:15:11 PM
@blurkraken22 funny you ask today!  I'm officially starting a new job as a basket design auditor today! My previous employer decided to sell off their design devision due to Covid. I had heard rumours and put two and two together so when I was called into the office to be told they were going to let me go, I was able to tell them I had a job interview the next day. I was hired there and will start tomorrow. My previous employer was kind and offered me a generous deal - they acknowledged they had hired me for one thing and then let me do very different work. They agreed my new job would be a better fit and actually recommended me to my new employer.

Tomorrow is my first day of work. I'll be much better paid, better benefits, office is walking distance from home but right now we're 100% work from home. I was asked to defer my last year of grad school (I do evening classes on top of my job) but in return they'll pay my tuition next year and when I get Master of Basket Design degree I'll be able to apply for a better paid position as a senior basket design auditor. I'll still not be able to design myself but I think I will enjoy this job. I enjoyed the auditing parts of my previous job. And we're in the middle of a pandemic and the next few years will be challenging, so a steady, fulltime job with benefits is just what I need. Especially since my partner works in an industry heavily affected by Covid.

@Imma :  Please tell me that "basket design auditor" and "Master of Basket Design degree" are code words for another actual degree/job.
If not, I'll have to rework all my "underwater basket weaving" degree jokes.  Dangit :-)

Maybe we could change those jokes to a degree in Interpretive Dance? No, there are probably high-paying jobs in that field too.

Science magazine has a very popular annual "Dance Your Ph.D." competition.  Given the state of higher ed at the moment, I would not be surprised if the chances of getting a paying job based on your interpretive dance version of your dissertation is actually better than just counting on the written version....

https://www.sciencemag.org/news/2020/02/watch-winner-year-s-dance-your-phd-contest
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: LennStar on November 04, 2020, 01:45:41 AM
Don't put all MMM people in one hat, please! I am nearly as far away as STEM as possible. I do work in an IT company now though :D

An update: I have been at my new job for two months and I had a surprising discussion with my boss today. She asked if I would be interested in a manager position half of the time and working as a lawyer the other half. She is not enjoying the manager parts of being a company owner and wants to focus on the legal stuff. So she has been thinking about an external CEO but has not found someone who would fit. She and the officer manager thinks I would be a good fit. It interest me because even though I like parts of the lawyering stuff I also like the development stuff that would come with the position. We will talk further on friday.
Wow! That sounds interesting. Personally I always find it boring to do the same thing the whole day. And in this case you might be able to slowly grow into, which is definitely a nice thing.
Talk with your boss that you are doing in a sort of phasing, that would surely be better for both of you.

On a similar topic:
Here in Germany many craftsman will close (or already have) their small business because they can't find a suitable successor (all getting in the age at once, low amount of young people). They would love someone they can show the ropes for a few years and who then takes over the company.
It is that way in the US / Canada too?
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: lemanfan on November 04, 2020, 02:23:37 AM
An update: I have been at my new job for two months and I had a surprising discussion with my boss today. She asked if I would be interested in a manager position half of the time and working as a lawyer the other half. She is not enjoying the manager parts of being a company owner and wants to focus on the legal stuff. So she has been thinking about an external CEO but has not found someone who would fit. She and the officer manager thinks I would be a good fit. It interest me because even though I like parts of the lawyering stuff I also like the development stuff that would come with the position. We will talk further on friday.

Wow, interesting development!  It can really lead to bigger things ahead!

One caution though - sometimes it can be hard to manage your boss... to have her both "over" you as owner and/or board and "below" you as one of the  persons you should manage.  I have seen it fail.  But I have also seen it succeed.  It really depends a lot on how the now non-CEO owner handles things, especially "in public" where it's visible to the rest of the company and possibly other stakeholders.  You seem like a person who knows where to draw the line, so I think it'll go great.  :)
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Plina on November 05, 2020, 11:22:47 AM
Don't put all MMM people in one hat, please! I am nearly as far away as STEM as possible. I do work in an IT company now though :D

An update: I have been at my new job for two months and I had a surprising discussion with my boss today. She asked if I would be interested in a manager position half of the time and working as a lawyer the other half. She is not enjoying the manager parts of being a company owner and wants to focus on the legal stuff. So she has been thinking about an external CEO but has not found someone who would fit. She and the officer manager thinks I would be a good fit. It interest me because even though I like parts of the lawyering stuff I also like the development stuff that would come with the position. We will talk further on friday.
Wow! That sounds interesting. Personally I always find it boring to do the same thing the whole day. And in this case you might be able to slowly grow into, which is definitely a nice thing.
Talk with your boss that you are doing in a sort of phasing, that would surely be better for both of you.

On a similar topic:
Here in Germany many craftsman will close (or already have) their small business because they can't find a suitable successor (all getting in the age at once, low amount of young people). They would love someone they can show the ropes for a few years and who then takes over the company.
It is that way in the US / Canada too?

I am planning to discuss some sort of phasing at least for those parts of the job that are not familiar to me.

I am not US/Canada based but I guess that is a pretty universial problem.

An update: I have been at my new job for two months and I had a surprising discussion with my boss today. She asked if I would be interested in a manager position half of the time and working as a lawyer the other half. She is not enjoying the manager parts of being a company owner and wants to focus on the legal stuff. So she has been thinking about an external CEO but has not found someone who would fit. She and the officer manager thinks I would be a good fit. It interest me because even though I like parts of the lawyering stuff I also like the development stuff that would come with the position. We will talk further on friday.

Wow, interesting development!  It can really lead to bigger things ahead!

One caution though - sometimes it can be hard to manage your boss... to have her both "over" you as owner and/or board and "below" you as one of the  persons you should manage.  I have seen it fail.  But I have also seen it succeed.  It really depends a lot on how the now non-CEO owner handles things, especially "in public" where it's visible to the rest of the company and possibly other stakeholders.  You seem like a person who knows where to draw the line, so I think it'll go great.  :)


I have thought about it. This is one of points that we have to discuss before I accept the job. I don’t want to end up in a position were this doesn’t work because she undermines me. If it doesn’t work I will be the one that has to leave. If it works it will also fasten my way to FIRE and if it doesn’t it will be an annoyance for a while.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: halftimer on November 22, 2020, 09:28:17 AM
At the beginning of COVID, it looked like my job was in jeopardy so we did some quick forecasting and reassured ourselves that without changing any spending we had enough on hand for 6-8 months of expenses, and if we went to a bare bones budget and accessed saving deposits we could easily make it through 2 years of expenses without touching retirement funds. A few months pass and our financial situation is slightly improved as our expenses are naturally reduced with less travel, commuting, eating out, etc and at the same time the reality of job loss is still there (a few coworkers were laid off) so we stayed cautious.

At the end of summer, my husband was called into a meeting at work and presented with a new employment contract set to take effect in 4 days. The new terms would eliminate the weekly day off, severely limit sick days, and had a few other unappealing clauses. They said it was so they could ensure coverage during covid in case anyone got sick, but it really had no provision for isolating if you had symptoms, only if you had a positive test (no days off while waiting for results of test - what?!) This was presented as a take it or leave it - either it takes effect in 4 days or you have no contract and no job. Well, they had no idea that we were not as dependant on the job as they thought so it was an easy choice on our end to "Leave it".

Did I mention that his on-call shift was also set to start in 4 days, and no one else was scheduled for that overtime for the next 2 weeks - just my husband? So they had to scramble to have their small team cover 2 weeks of extra work because they made an ultimatum. Later the manager privately asked, 'isn't this short notice for letting us know you are not continuing in the job?' Uh, yeah. But it's exactly the same 4 days you gave us.

Less than 2 months later and he had 3 job offers - all with his preferred 0.8 FTE schedule, and accepted the one closest to home that just happens to have zero on-call shifts and it's working out great. The job he left had an 'urgent' job posting online until about a week ago.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: TomTX on November 22, 2020, 10:13:40 AM

Did I mention that his on-call shift was also set to start in 4 days, and no one else was scheduled for that overtime for the next 2 weeks - just my husband? So they had to scramble to have their small team cover 2 weeks of extra work because they made an ultimatum. Later the manager privately asked, 'isn't this short notice for letting us know you are not continuing in the job?' Uh, yeah. But it's exactly the same 4 days you gave us.

I think my response would be "Oh! I'd be happy to continue the job! When will you have the contract ready for me to continue the job instead of changing the terms of work?"

Quote
Less than 2 months later and he had 3 job offers - all with his preferred 0.8 FTE schedule, and accepted the one closest to home that just happens to have zero on-call shifts and it's working out great. The job he left had an 'urgent' job posting online until about a week ago.

Good for you!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: ender on November 22, 2020, 11:45:25 AM

Did I mention that his on-call shift was also set to start in 4 days, and no one else was scheduled for that overtime for the next 2 weeks - just my husband? So they had to scramble to have their small team cover 2 weeks of extra work because they made an ultimatum. Later the manager privately asked, 'isn't this short notice for letting us know you are not continuing in the job?' Uh, yeah. But it's exactly the same 4 days you gave us.

It's nuts to me how many managers and companies seem to expect a sense of loyalty around things like this.

It's so easy for them to "buy" that loyalty, too, things like contractual notice periods on both sides, etc.

Most American job contracts literally say that it's "at-will" and can be ended by either party at any time. It'd be trivial for companies to add something like "if this contract is ended by the company we will pay a minimum of X weeks/months pay" and actually create some loyalty.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: shelivesthedream on November 22, 2020, 12:03:36 PM
Later the manager privately asked, 'isn't this short notice for letting us know you are not continuing in the job?' Uh, yeah. But it's exactly the same 4 days you gave us.

I find that nonsense so frustrating! Good on you for taking some pre-emptive action cutting your expenses rather than sticking your finger sin your ears.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: bbqbonelesswing on November 22, 2020, 12:43:25 PM
Did I mention that his on-call shift was also set to start in 4 days, and no one else was scheduled for that overtime for the next 2 weeks - just my husband? So they had to scramble to have their small team cover 2 weeks of extra work because they made an ultimatum. Later the manager privately asked, 'isn't this short notice for letting us know you are not continuing in the job?' Uh, yeah. But it's exactly the same 4 days you gave us.

I love this and I have no sympathy for your husband's previous employer. I've heard similar things from managers in the past when quitting. My response has always been, "well, then why did you push me to quit?" So dumb.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: halftimer on November 22, 2020, 12:58:03 PM

Did I mention that his on-call shift was also set to start in 4 days, and no one else was scheduled for that overtime for the next 2 weeks - just my husband? So they had to scramble to have their small team cover 2 weeks of extra work because they made an ultimatum. Later the manager privately asked, 'isn't this short notice for letting us know you are not continuing in the job?' Uh, yeah. But it's exactly the same 4 days you gave us.

I think my response would be "Oh! I'd be happy to continue the job! When will you have the contract ready for me to continue the job instead of changing the terms of work?"

We did consider having him work the new contract schedule until they could find a replacement. But there was zero incentive for him to do so - those would be the worst 2 weeks ever! It would have all the on-call overtime plus missing 2 appointments that were previously set for his days off, and I'm sure all the garbage assignments since they knew he was leaving. Instead he had a few weeks off before even starting to look for a new job.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Adventine on November 22, 2020, 05:40:21 PM
@halftimer I'm glad you and your husband made the choices that you did. Well done!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: AMandM on November 22, 2020, 07:55:59 PM
Later the manager privately asked, 'isn't this short notice for letting us know you are not continuing in the job agreeing to be screwed over?'

FTFH
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: bmjohnson35 on November 22, 2020, 08:25:07 PM
At the beginning of COVID, it looked like my job was in jeopardy so we did some quick forecasting and reassured ourselves that without changing any spending we had enough on hand for 6-8 months of expenses, and if we went to a bare bones budget and accessed saving deposits we could easily make it through 2 years of expenses without touching retirement funds. A few months pass and our financial situation is slightly improved as our expenses are naturally reduced with less travel, commuting, eating out, etc and at the same time the reality of job loss is still there (a few coworkers were laid off) so we stayed cautious.

At the end of summer, my husband was called into a meeting at work and presented with a new employment contract set to take effect in 4 days. The new terms would eliminate the weekly day off, severely limit sick days, and had a few other unappealing clauses. They said it was so they could ensure coverage during covid in case anyone got sick, but it really had no provision for isolating if you had symptoms, only if you had a positive test (no days off while waiting for results of test - what?!) This was presented as a take it or leave it - either it takes effect in 4 days or you have no contract and no job. Well, they had no idea that we were not as dependant on the job as they thought so it was an easy choice on our end to "Leave it".

Did I mention that his on-call shift was also set to start in 4 days, and no one else was scheduled for that overtime for the next 2 weeks - just my husband? So they had to scramble to have their small team cover 2 weeks of extra work because they made an ultimatum. Later the manager privately asked, 'isn't this short notice for letting us know you are not continuing in the job?' Uh, yeah. But it's exactly the same 4 days you gave us.

Less than 2 months later and he had 3 job offers - all with his preferred 0.8 FTE schedule, and accepted the one closest to home that just happens to have zero on-call shifts and it's working out great. The job he left had an 'urgent' job posting online until about a week ago.

Congrats.  So many become too dependent on their jobs because of not saving and making poor financial choices.  Employers appear to assume this and their policies often reflect it.  CEO's can drive companies into the ground and walk away with millions when asked to leave, but employees in lower position are often taken for granted.   
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: alcon835 on November 23, 2020, 07:03:13 AM
That's exactly what FU money was meant for! Great job holding to your guns!

People don't believe me when I tell them money = freedom. Pointing folks to the stories in this thread has really opened a lot of eyes to how the world would look if folks would handle their funds a bit more responsibly!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: LightTripper on November 23, 2020, 07:19:43 AM
Great story @halftimer : as the PP said, that is exactly what FU money is for!  Sounds like your OH has really landed on his feet with the new job too - great outcome!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: halftimer on November 23, 2020, 06:19:43 PM
Later the manager privately asked, 'isn't this short notice for letting us know you are not continuing in the job agreeing to be screwed over?'

FTFH

Haha! Yes, I'm so glad we were not in a desperate position to have to accept those screwy terms.
I don't think I mentioned it above, but our forecasting included 2 years of expenses covered even if we both lost our jobs. So it was very easy to turn down the new contract.

On the other hand, he is not used to changing jobs so there was definitely some mental stress. It was mitigated knowing that we could wait until the right offer came along, and our finances would be ok. The first offer he got came really fast, but it sounded like a stressful position, had a few red flags about the team he would be working with, and was a long commute away. He declined and waited another 2 weeks until the position he wanted came through.

In the meantime, I have 4.5 weeks of vacation time to use up soon and no where to go. I might just take a mini sabbatical myself.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: BuffaloStache on November 24, 2020, 01:53:03 PM
Echoing what others have said above, you and your husband did an excellent job, @halftimer

...
I don't think I mentioned it above, but our forecasting included 2 years of expenses covered even if we both lost our jobs. So it was very easy to turn down the new contract.

On the other hand, he is not used to changing jobs so there was definitely some mental stress. It was mitigated knowing that we could wait until the right offer came along, and our finances would be ok.
...

This is an important thing that many people minimize; having momentum in a (even a crappy) job can cause people to stick around much longer than they should. The good news here is that it gets easier the more you do it. I switched jobs ~3 years ago and it was very hard for me to do, since I had a false belief that some portion of my identity was tied up in that specific company. Now my eyes are more opened, and I'd be able to leave much sooner if things started getting bad. 
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Catbert on November 26, 2020, 10:31:37 AM
Not me and not exactly epic, but...

I have a friend who is a veterinarian and in the Before Times worked 32 hours a week (Fridays off).  In March when schools went on-line she switched to working just 2 days a week.  She worked Mondays and Fridays which are the worst days in a vet office as a trade-off.  In the Fall she decided to home school her middle-schoolers rather than continue on-line.  The owner allowed her to since he knew she had options (aka FU money).

Now we come to last week.  Case rates are up and continuing to rise in our area.  Many of the employees in the practice are young female vet techs who have Covid fatigue.  They are continually partying and out for drinks after work.  All the things none of us should be doing.   There is nothing the practice can or is willing do about their outside activities.  My friend went to the owner and is now on LWOP until she feels comfortable coming back.  She was aiming to FIRE in a couple of years and her boss knew it.  Maybe she'll go early.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: mm1970 on November 27, 2020, 10:47:58 AM
Later the manager privately asked, 'isn't this short notice for letting us know you are not continuing in the job agreeing to be screwed over?'

FTFH

Haha! Yes, I'm so glad we were not in a desperate position to have to accept those screwy terms.
I don't think I mentioned it above, but our forecasting included 2 years of expenses covered even if we both lost our jobs. So it was very easy to turn down the new contract.

On the other hand, he is not used to changing jobs so there was definitely some mental stress. It was mitigated knowing that we could wait until the right offer came along, and our finances would be ok. The first offer he got came really fast, but it sounded like a stressful position, had a few red flags about the team he would be working with, and was a long commute away. He declined and waited another 2 weeks until the position he wanted came through.

In the meantime, I have 4.5 weeks of vacation time to use up soon and no where to go. I might just take a mini sabbatical myself.
This was pretty glorious, I must say!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Bloop Bloop Reloaded on November 28, 2020, 01:05:27 AM
Received a trial brief I didn't like. I'd previously told the solicitor how to prepare it for trial and she didn't follow my instructions. I didn't realise this till 3pm the day before the trial when I went to read the brief.

In another time when I was younger and dumber, I would have felt bad for the solicitor, who by now had only 1-2 hours to replace me with another counsel, and I would have just accepted the brief.

This time I called in sick and returned the brief. The solicitor can go find someone who's desperate enough for work that he or she will accept a last minute hand me down.

I was happy to forego the money and the goodwill in return for not having to save someone's hide. My job isn't to do someone else's dirty work.

Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: AMandM on November 28, 2020, 12:02:27 PM
I think the smaller-scale stories like Catbert's and BloopBloopReloaded's are important. They show that FU money isn't only for all-or-nothing quit-your-job events, but also gives you freedom in situations like a bad brief or lax safety.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Bloop Bloop Reloaded on November 29, 2020, 08:35:44 PM
Yes. It's a virtuous cycle.

Putting up your fees can sometimes mean that people think it's a marker of quality - it may or may not be. If you are not fussed about the risk of getting less work you have the option to arbitrarily set your fees a bit higher than what true market rate might dictate. If you're lucky, the market will see that as 'the market at work' and you will actually develop your reputation a bit - as long as you can produce the goods. In this manner, your work lags behind your fees, rather than your fees lagging behind your work.

My own mentor told me "you are worth what you think you are worth" and that kind of holds true in all industries in which customers have asymmetric information (and that would be essentially all professional services industries).

I frequently talk to my colleagues and tell them to up their fees - it's good for us as a whole and I genuinely think those counsel are undercharging - but not everyone listens to me. Some do, though.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: malachite on December 02, 2020, 12:48:21 PM
I can't believe I've never noticed this thread before. Only about three pages in, but had to post my own story:

A few years ago I am working as a software architect. I finish one major assignment and start on my next, helping out a different group (same boss but different coworkers). This group already has a lead architect.

For a time things go okay. I think this is largely because I was new to the project and still 'deferential' to the lead because I didn't really know the system yet. It doesn't take too long for things to go downhill. Over the course of the next year situations become increasingly intolerable. Some highlights:
1) I both stay late and work through lunch for a week to get an urgent feature designed, written, and tested. I check in the new code late on Friday and go home. The next Monday I find out the lead has reverted my changes calling them 'wrong' and 'irredeemable' but offering no more concrete critique. He then decides to redo them himself. His 'better' changes take twice as long to write, miss the deadline, and require several tests to be waived when they still fail even after completion.
2) Lead is offended that my boss left a meeting lead by the lead when the time for the meeting ran out. The lead marches up to my boss's office, interrupts the next meeting that is just starting, and proceeds to chew him out (despite being massively outranked by my boss). The shouting gets so loud that half the people in the cube-farm are poking their heads above the cube walls, staring.
3) Lead frequently attempts to 'win' discussions by the attrition tactic, simply refusing to budge until the other party gets tired and goes away.

Many other people report the Lead's behavior, and at one point I am called into a meeting with the lead, my boss & the head of HR to discuss how to 'smooth things over'.  Nothing much changes.

One day over lunch I am working on a personal programming project on my computer. It is written in Java. Lead comes over to my computer with a problem: "I am having trouble figuring out what this section of code is doing. It looks like it was written by a Java programmer."
The pejorative use of the term 'java programmer' was unmistakable. Leaving aside the fact that I was just writing Java code myself, I am also surround by people who are full-time Java developers. I hear at least one of them start to protest, but I override them and interrupt the lead, calling out his unwarranted (although frequent) judgemental stereotyping.

Rather than rephrase or apologize, he doubles down, saying 'what do you expect, C++ is just a superior language'. Before the snarc filter could stop it, I replied "Well as long as we are just declaring things, Java is a superior language'". His face looked like it would explode and he immediately proceeded into a continuous stream of reasons why C++ is better. After about twenty seconds of this I simply go back to my own work, as it is still lunch I just can't put up with this guy's behavior anymore. After several attempts to get me to continue the argument he gets the hint and goes back to his own computer.

Once I calm down I realize that this is it. I have taken so much of this guy's nonsense & abuse that I literally have no patience remaining. If I have to put up with even one more of his condescending remarks I might loose all composure and explain to him just what kind of person I think he is. As soon as my boss gets back from lunch I am in his office, outlining what happened, that it was the last straw & I am done, and that I need to be on a different project. My boss, who is generally a good guy, asks 'how quickly'? I respond with 'now'.

Only the confidence of knowing I was financially secure allowed me to be bold enough to make these demands as I did.

Afterward: I was transferred to another project the next day (fortunately my company always has plenty of things to work on). The lead 'resigned' from the company less than 6 months later. When he left his team was down to a professional tester & 3 developers with less than 3 years of combined experience. Literally everyone else on the team had left the company rather than speak up about the way they were being treated. As the person with by far the most experience with the project, I was brought back in as lead. After a few weeks of working with them, one of the team members confided to me "LEAD used to say you were overrated, but what you are doing with the code makes so much more sense." I'll have to say, it was pretty cathartic being able to joke with these other devs about how mad the LEAD would be as we systematically undid all of the flaws he had insisted on building into the product.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: SwordGuy on December 02, 2020, 02:10:59 PM
@malachite , Awesome story!   Been there, felt your pain.    FU money is a glorious thing.   Sometimes all it takes is an FU attitude!    Here's a totally different situation but hopefully a story that will amuse you.


Years ago I went to work for a Pop software company.  (Too small to be a Mom & Pop.)  Owner drinks and snorts coke and goes broke.   With his permission we take over the software and then we sell a conversion of it to a different computer operating system for a new client.

We're delivering a new module every few weeks.   We did the basic student registration module, then the alumni module next (because we got paid the same per module and it was simple and easy).

The #2 guy at this school ran the alumni department.   He would tell the #1 guy that our software "just didn't work" but could never give a single specific instance of a defect.    We came to believe that he had never used it and was afraid of the computer.  (A not uncommon problem back in the day!)

It was a DEC VAX computer.   A weird feature of the DEC terminals (screens and keyboards) was that the keyboard came with a hard, opaque plastic dust cover.     We snuck into the guy's office after hours and stole his keyboard but left the dust cover in place on his desk.

Two weeks later we pulled up to the school, parked in front of the window to the conference room so we could be seen to arrive, and went into the meeting room where people were already starting to arrive.  We got the usual vague song and dance about the alumni software not working.   

After the meeting we asked the #1 guy to stay back for a moment.  After the room cleared out, we explained to the #1 guy that we were tired of hearing that our alumni module didn't work.  It worked.  It worked just fine.   We believed that the #2 guy had never even tried to use it.   And this is where it got fun.  "We believe that so strongly that the last time we were here two weeks ago, we stole his keyboard and left the dust cover in place.  We're willing to wager, sight-unseen, that he doesn't know it's gone."    At that point my wife pulled his keyboard out of a big bag she had been toting.

#1 guy looked at us in total surprise.    He walked out of the room at a brisk pace and came back a few minutes later.   We never discussed that subsystem again.   It was perfect.

We didn't have FU money.  We were just tired of putting up with shit being tossed on our professional reputation.   
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Alternatepriorities on December 02, 2020, 03:12:44 PM
@malachite , Awesome story!   Been there, felt your pain.    FU money is a glorious thing.   Sometimes all it takes is an FU attitude!    Here's a totally different situation but hopefully a story that will amuse you.


Years ago I went to work for a Pop software company.  (Too small to be a Mom & Pop.)  Owner drinks and snorts coke and goes broke.   With his permission we take over the software and then we sell a conversion of it to a different computer operating system for a new client.

We're delivering a new module every few weeks.   We did the basic student registration module, then the alumni module next (because we got paid the same per module and it was simple and easy).

The #2 guy at this school ran the alumni department.   He would tell the #1 guy that our software "just didn't work" but could never give a single specific instance of a defect.    We came to believe that he had never used it and was afraid of the computer.  (A not uncommon problem back in the day!)

It was a DEC VAX computer.   A weird feature of the DEC terminals (screens and keyboards) was that the keyboard came with a hard, opaque plastic dust cover.     We snuck into the guy's office after hours and stole his keyboard but left the dust cover in place on his desk.

Two weeks later we pulled up to the school, parked in front of the window to the conference room so we could be seen to arrive, and went into the meeting room where people were already starting to arrive.  We got the usual vague song and dance about the alumni software not working.   

After the meeting we asked the #1 guy to stay back for a moment.  After the room cleared out, we explained to the #1 guy that we were tired of hearing that our alumni module didn't work.  It worked.  It worked just fine.   We believed that the #2 guy had never even tried to use it.   And this is where it got fun.  "We believe that so strongly that the last time we were here two weeks ago, we stole his keyboard and left the dust cover in place.  We're willing to wager, sight-unseen, that he doesn't know it's gone."    At that point my wife pulled his keyboard out of a big bag she had been toting.

#1 guy looked at us in total surprise.    He walked out of the room at a brisk pace and came back a few minutes later.   We never discussed that subsystem again.   It was perfect.

We didn't have FU money.  We were just tired of putting up with shit being tossed on our professional reputation.   

This is amazing!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: malachite on December 02, 2020, 05:06:37 PM
<highly fulfilling story of software development justice>   

This is amazing!

I agree, I'm sure it was infuriating at the time, but it sure makes a good story now.  I can just visualize the scene where guy #1 realizes guy #2 has been 'using' a computer without a keyboard for 2 weeks.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: scottish on December 02, 2020, 07:35:23 PM
Yeah, that's a great ending.   And you folks must have had nerves of steel to pull it off!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Dicey on December 02, 2020, 09:04:53 PM
Yeah, that's a great ending.   And you folks must have had nerves of steel to pull it off!
OMG, @scottish, I love your siggy line!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Zaga on December 02, 2020, 09:42:08 PM
That is a delightful story!  I remember the first year of college all our email was on a Vax system.  It was weird, it was 1997, far too late for Vax to still have been a thing, yet there we were.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: LennStar on December 03, 2020, 04:32:35 AM
<highly fulfilling story of software development justice>   

This is amazing!

I agree, I'm sure it was infuriating at the time, but it sure makes a good story now.  I can just visualize the scene where guy #1 realizes guy #2 has been 'using' a computer without a keyboard for 2 weeks.

Amazing story!

And if I were #1 guy, I certainly would not have fired you. Not so sure about #2. I might have shoveled him out with the keyboard.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: achvfi on December 03, 2020, 08:13:20 AM
@malachite , Awesome story!   Been there, felt your pain.    FU money is a glorious thing.   Sometimes all it takes is an FU attitude!    Here's a totally different situation but hopefully a story that will amuse you.


Years ago I went to work for a Pop software company.  (Too small to be a Mom & Pop.)  Owner drinks and snorts coke and goes broke.   With his permission we take over the software and then we sell a conversion of it to a different computer operating system for a new client.

We're delivering a new module every few weeks.   We did the basic student registration module, then the alumni module next (because we got paid the same per module and it was simple and easy).

The #2 guy at this school ran the alumni department.   He would tell the #1 guy that our software "just didn't work" but could never give a single specific instance of a defect.    We came to believe that he had never used it and was afraid of the computer.  (A not uncommon problem back in the day!)

It was a DEC VAX computer.   A weird feature of the DEC terminals (screens and keyboards) was that the keyboard came with a hard, opaque plastic dust cover.     We snuck into the guy's office after hours and stole his keyboard but left the dust cover in place on his desk.

Two weeks later we pulled up to the school, parked in front of the window to the conference room so we could be seen to arrive, and went into the meeting room where people were already starting to arrive.  We got the usual vague song and dance about the alumni software not working.   

After the meeting we asked the #1 guy to stay back for a moment.  After the room cleared out, we explained to the #1 guy that we were tired of hearing that our alumni module didn't work.  It worked.  It worked just fine.   We believed that the #2 guy had never even tried to use it.   And this is where it got fun.  "We believe that so strongly that the last time we were here two weeks ago, we stole his keyboard and left the dust cover in place.  We're willing to wager, sight-unseen, that he doesn't know it's gone."    At that point my wife pulled his keyboard out of a big bag she had been toting.

#1 guy looked at us in total surprise.    He walked out of the room at a brisk pace and came back a few minutes later.   We never discussed that subsystem again.   It was perfect.

We didn't have FU money.  We were just tired of putting up with shit being tossed on our professional reputation.   

Reading this I burst out laughing. You must be so frustrated to pull off such crazy stuff @SwordGuy
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Fru-Gal on December 03, 2020, 08:15:03 AM
What a fantastic story, @SwordGuy!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Chris@TTL on December 03, 2020, 09:15:48 AM
My FU money story (a snippet from my post on FU money (https://www.tictoclife.com/fu-money/)):
...
It was the first time I was making over $100K/year. Not a feat I’d thought I’d manage on a liberal arts degree and no certificates to speak of—certainly not at 25 years old.

I had something to lose.

After several months of very positive feedback and a generally good experience, I was called in for an earlier-than-expected review.

They offered me a full-time position with a slightly higher salary, performance bonus, and huge benefits package.

I was already saving about 50% of what I earned, but the retirement benefits would greatly speed up my financial independence path.

I had about $50,000 to my name at the time with no debt.

As we were finishing up the meeting, they had one very unexpected caveat to the offer I’d need to accept.

“You’ll need to cease operations of your business.”

Now mind you, at the time, my little side consultancy was basically nothing. I might have earned a few thousand dollars from it in the same year. Just from existing clients—maintaining the service I’d offered them in years prior. These were small organizations in an entirely different sector with tiny budgets.

I certainly didn’t compete with the Beltway bandits.

I said thank you very much. Once I had time to look through the benefits package and consider everything, I’d follow up with my answer.

I sent an email shortly after the meeting asking for clarity about the business:

“In regard to my side business, I haven’t taken on a new client since I started working with the company. It’s hardly active, really just taking payments to continue to offer existing services to fulfill contract obligations. I’m not sure how reasonable it is to cancel those existing contracts.”

The response: “You’ll need to dissolve the actual LLC.”

That night, I spent a lot of time thinking about what was being asked of me. Initially, I thought I might need to cease ongoing operations—but they were asking me to dissolve the entire company. A business I’d started years before and genuinely meant something to me.

At the time, I still had ongoing service contracts with every single client I’d ever had. Sure, it wasn’t much money—but the point was to keep those relationships alive. Remember all those concrete contracts I talked about earlier?

I’d have to break those contracts—it’d hurt my reputation and have some financial consequences. At the same time, it just seemed wrong.

The next day I went into the office like normal. I set up a brief morning meeting with my supervisor.

I explained that I wouldn’t be able to break my existing client contracts, that I was obligated to keep to the terms. Once my client contracts were up for annual renewal, I offered to not renew them. However, the LLC would not be dissolved.

My supervisor thanked me and said he’d follow up shortly. I went back to my desk and awaited the outcome.

Not long after, my supervisor showed up at my desk. He looked upset, apologized, and said that not only was my offer rescinded but that they were canceling my contract.

Right then.

As in—”Get your stuff—we’re walking out right now. Give me your security badge.”

I shut down my workstation, grabbed my bag and a few personal items, then walked out the door with the supervisor right behind me.

I drove home stunned, but happy with my decision.

FU money let me do what I thought was right. And I wasn’t the least bit worried about paying my bills until I found a new job.
...
Full source: This Is the Power of FU Money (and How I Was Escorted Out) (https://www.tictoclife.com/fu-money/)
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: BicycleB on December 03, 2020, 10:22:45 AM
@malachite , Awesome story!   Been there, felt your pain.    FU money is a glorious thing.   Sometimes all it takes is an FU attitude!    Here's a totally different situation but hopefully a story that will amuse you.


Years ago I went to work for a Pop software company.  (Too small to be a Mom & Pop.)  Owner drinks and snorts coke and goes broke.   With his permission we take over the software and then we sell a conversion of it to a different computer operating system for a new client.

We're delivering a new module every few weeks.   We did the basic student registration module, then the alumni module next (because we got paid the same per module and it was simple and easy).

The #2 guy at this school ran the alumni department.   He would tell the #1 guy that our software "just didn't work" but could never give a single specific instance of a defect.    We came to believe that he had never used it and was afraid of the computer.  (A not uncommon problem back in the day!)

It was a DEC VAX computer.   A weird feature of the DEC terminals (screens and keyboards) was that the keyboard came with a hard, opaque plastic dust cover.     We snuck into the guy's office after hours and stole his keyboard but left the dust cover in place on his desk.

Two weeks later we pulled up to the school, parked in front of the window to the conference room so we could be seen to arrive, and went into the meeting room where people were already starting to arrive.  We got the usual vague song and dance about the alumni software not working.   

After the meeting we asked the #1 guy to stay back for a moment.  After the room cleared out, we explained to the #1 guy that we were tired of hearing that our alumni module didn't work.  It worked.  It worked just fine.   We believed that the #2 guy had never even tried to use it.   And this is where it got fun.  "We believe that so strongly that the last time we were here two weeks ago, we stole his keyboard and left the dust cover in place.  We're willing to wager, sight-unseen, that he doesn't know it's gone."    At that point my wife pulled his keyboard out of a big bag she had been toting.

#1 guy looked at us in total surprise.    He walked out of the room at a brisk pace and came back a few minutes later.   We never discussed that subsystem again.   It was perfect.

We didn't have FU money.  We were just tired of putting up with shit being tossed on our professional reputation.   

LOL!!!!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: alcon835 on December 03, 2020, 12:18:01 PM
Not long after, my supervisor showed up at my desk. He looked upset, apologized, and said that not only was my offer rescinded but that they were canceling my contract.

Right then.

As in—”Get your stuff—we’re walking out right now. Give me your security badge.”

I shut down my workstation, grabbed my bag and a few personal items, then walked out the door with the supervisor right behind me.

I drove home stunned, but happy with my decision.

FU money let me do what I thought was right. And I wasn’t the least bit worried about paying my bills until I found a new job.
...


WOW! Did you ever find out why they were so gung ho about shutting down your side hustle?
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Taran Wanderer on December 03, 2020, 12:47:36 PM
It sounds like it was a test of loyalty to them. F that. If they value your loyalty more than your underlying honesty and commitment to fulfilling your obligations to your past clients, that’s a huge red flag. As a leader, that commitment and integrity is what I would find most valuable, and I would be more likely to keep you around.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: okisok on December 03, 2020, 05:21:26 PM
It sounds like it was a test of loyalty to them. F that. If they value your loyalty more than your underlying honesty and commitment to fulfilling your obligations to your past clients, that’s a huge red flag. As a leader, that commitment and integrity is what I would find most valuable, and I would be more likely to keep you around.

I agree on the loyalty test. The industry I just left after almost 20 years was huge on that stupid shit. For jobs that averaged less than $30k a year with few benefits. It also has a low entry threshold, so it's really easy to get a job. The only leverage a lot of companies have is this imaginary 'loyalty to the company'.
When we had trouble attracting and keeping good staff, I constantly said we need to pay more. That's the bottom line--better salary or better benefits. The owners and upper-level management refused to do it. After beating my head against this wall for a few months of middle-level management, I left the industry completely. Our here in the real world, the company I work for understands that good benefits, good salary, and a good working environment *create* loyalty, not some rah-rah crap being spouted by HR.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: zolotiyeruki on December 03, 2020, 07:12:58 PM
It sounds like it was a test of loyalty to them. F that. If they value your loyalty more than your underlying honesty and commitment to fulfilling your obligations to your past clients, that’s a huge red flag. As a leader, that commitment and integrity is what I would find most valuable, and I would be more likely to keep you around.
When we had trouble attracting and keeping good staff, I constantly said we need to pay more. That's the bottom line--better salary or better benefits. The owners and upper-level management refused to do it. After beating my head against this wall for a few months of middle-level management, I left the industry completely. Our here in the real world, the company I work for understands that good benefits, good salary, and a good working environment *create* loyalty, not some rah-rah crap being spouted by HR.
A couple years ago, I nearly left my employer for another job.  I work for two partners, and have a good relationship with both.  My salary had basically stayed stagnant for a few years.  One of the partners is convinced (and I actually agree) that salary increases don't make people more productive.  But the realization I came to (and subsequently shared) is that salary increases *do* help your productive people to stay.  Transition costs, whether it be replacing an employee or relocating a business, are really stinkin' high, especially in a small and highly technical business such as ours.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: RyanAtTanagra on December 03, 2020, 08:59:53 PM
One of the partners is convinced (and I actually agree) that salary increases don't make people more productive.  But the realization I came to (and subsequently shared) is that salary increases *do* help your productive people to stay.

Yea, I would agree with both those statements.  Raises are satisfying for 2-3 paychecks, then it goes away.  But getting paid adequately and having a pleasant working environment keeps me where I'm at.  Doesn't have to be an amazing working environment.  We don't have a free snack table and coffee bar and ping pong area and video game room.  But I don't mind going in to work, and am comfortable when I'm there (and I like the people I work with, which is probably most important).  I could make more elsewhere, but not significantly more, and I know I might chase more money and dislike where I end up.  So I stay, confidently and happily.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Plina on December 03, 2020, 11:12:38 PM
It sounds like it was a test of loyalty to them. F that. If they value your loyalty more than your underlying honesty and commitment to fulfilling your obligations to your past clients, that’s a huge red flag. As a leader, that commitment and integrity is what I would find most valuable, and I would be more likely to keep you around.
When we had trouble attracting and keeping good staff, I constantly said we need to pay more. That's the bottom line--better salary or better benefits. The owners and upper-level management refused to do it. After beating my head against this wall for a few months of middle-level management, I left the industry completely. Our here in the real world, the company I work for understands that good benefits, good salary, and a good working environment *create* loyalty, not some rah-rah crap being spouted by HR.
A couple years ago, I nearly left my employer for another job.  I work for two partners, and have a good relationship with both.  My salary had basically stayed stagnant for a few years.  One of the partners is convinced (and I actually agree) that salary increases don't make people more productive.  But the realization I came to (and subsequently shared) is that salary increases *do* help your productive people to stay.  Transition costs, whether it be replacing an employee or relocating a business, are really stinkin' high, especially in a small and highly technical business such as ours.

I had a workplace were I basically was angry every year after my so called salary negotiation. First year, I was pissed for two weeks because the increase was less than inflation and due to factors outside of my control so I basically got a decrease. Next year, I put the meeting in the beginning of the week because I didn’t want to disturb my weekend. Those meetings were a real demotivating factor in my job satisfaction and did contribute to the fact that I left the company. I have also been in a place were I asked for a salary increase, I didn’t think I would get because it was in a government position even though I deserved it. The manager pulled that off. That was a big loyalty boost from my point of view.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: LennStar on December 04, 2020, 04:14:12 AM
It sounds like it was a test of loyalty to them. F that. If they value your loyalty more than your underlying honesty and commitment to fulfilling your obligations to your past clients, that’s a huge red flag. As a leader, that commitment and integrity is what I would find most valuable, and I would be more likely to keep you around.
"Loyality Tests" like those are complete BS. Not only you make your people unhappy (which is a sure way to lower loyality), but you also tend to end up with people in vulnerable positions (as in "I can't afford to go!!"), wich are prime targets for "secret side hustles", bribery or theft.

Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Chris@TTL on December 04, 2020, 08:25:26 AM
Not long after, my supervisor showed up at my desk. He looked upset, apologized, and said that not only was my offer rescinded but that they were canceling my contract.

Right then.

As in—”Get your stuff—we’re walking out right now. Give me your security badge.”

I shut down my workstation, grabbed my bag and a few personal items, then walked out the door with the supervisor right behind me.

I drove home stunned, but happy with my decision.

FU money let me do what I thought was right. And I wasn’t the least bit worried about paying my bills until I found a new job.
...
Full source: This Is the Power of FU Money (and How I Was Escorted Out) (https://www.tictoclife.com/fu-money/)

WOW! Did you ever find out why they were so gung ho about shutting down your side hustle?

Surprisingly, not really. I kept in touch with a couple of the non-management creative and tech folks. Apparently it was a requirement from upon high—not from anyone I interacted with on a daily basis.

The strange part is that the only way they'd even know about my little agency was by way of my original resume and then Googling for the company. It's not like it was something I talked about at work (primarily because, again, it barely made any money as I was just maintaining existing relationships).

It sounds like it was a test of loyalty to them. F that. If they value your loyalty more than your underlying honesty and commitment to fulfilling your obligations to your past clients, that’s a huge red flag. As a leader, that commitment and integrity is what I would find most valuable, and I would be more likely to keep you around.
"Loyality Tests" like those are complete BS. Not only you make your people unhappy (which is a sure way to lower loyality), but you also tend to end up with people in vulnerable positions (as in "I can't afford to go!!"), wich are prime targets for "secret side hustles", bribery or theft.



Some folks mentioning it was likely a sort of "loyalty test".

It could have been.

If I had to guess, it was some weird HR rule that had zero flexibility—or the one person who might have been able to overturn it (boss's boss) was indeed testing for loyalty when I initially asked for some time to think it over and followed up with questions about maintaining the business.

It was an altogether strange experience. This is a company with its own on-site museum exhibiting their military & tech advances. You'd recognize their name—they're big. My little side hustle was not any competition.

They offered me the position a couple of months ahead of when they were supposed to evaluate the contract-to-hire (1 year). And they offered more money than I was making under the contract position with a full benefits package (usually you make a little less as W2 than 1099).

They had pretty strict "levels" within the org where everyone starts at the bottom unless you're something akin to partner level where you get profit-sharing etc. They were offering to start me out a level higher than the lowest.

Lots of things pointed to them being happy with my performance. Really strange to lose it all over such a small thing.

Then again, I'm pretty happy with how things turned out! I switched over to higher ed which I quite enjoyed—even taking on an adjunct position at one point. Some years later, I left the "big city" for a slower pace and restarted my business full-time. And that's what really got me to FI.

Thanks, FU money. :-)
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Tigerpine on December 04, 2020, 09:47:55 AM
I interned for a short time at a company that had you sign a contract stating that you agreed that all of your earned income had to be from the company.  There was no flexibility in their policy.  Knowing about that policy was a major factor in why I never applied for a permanent position there.  They're basically requiring you to be completely financially dependent on the company.  Oh, and they had a non-compete clause, too.

Companies are like people.  Some are controlling by nature.  Best to avoid them if at all possible.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Boll weevil on December 04, 2020, 10:42:58 AM
I read the story as the person’s job and side hustle were in the same (or at least related) industries, and the concerns there are potential leakage of intellectual property and working the side hustle on company time (programming windows look the same from far away... is the person working on company stuff or side hustle?).

Had the side hustle been something totally unrelated such as yard work or working in a restaurant, I’m guessing the company wouldn’t have brought it up.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: NorCal on December 04, 2020, 10:53:37 AM
Most likely, someone did something entirely unethical and/or illegal with a side hustle in the companies history.  Some exec got upset and the company put "no outside employment" in the company handbook, and no provision for exceptions.  This mentality is pretty common in anything government/contractor related.

Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: DeepEllumStache on December 04, 2020, 11:09:33 AM
Or they really hate people schilling MLMs in the workplace and went overboard.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Chris@TTL on December 04, 2020, 11:20:23 AM
I read the story as the person’s job and side hustle were in the same (or at least related) industries, and the concerns there are potential leakage of intellectual property and working the side hustle on company time (programming windows look the same from far away... is the person working on company stuff or side hustle?).

Had the side hustle been something totally unrelated such as yard work or working in a restaurant, I’m guessing the company wouldn’t have brought it up.

Perhaps. The side hustle was mostly in digital support on the web. For example, the primary client at the time that remained was involved in giving scholarships to needy children. I provided some web-related guidance for them.

The work I did at the company was internal facing and more technical as part of a large communications project.

The only real relationship was that both types of work were digital. A little like if suggested you couldn't run a side gig that built mountain bike trails in your local parks because your primary work was in geological analysis of mineral deposits in the Congo. They're both outdoors. :-)

Most likely, someone did something entirely unethical and/or illegal with a side hustle in the companies history.  Some exec got upset and the company put "no outside employment" in the company handbook, and no provision for exceptions.  This mentality is pretty common in anything government/contractor related.



This is the sort of reasoning I would lean towards.

And to be clear (and supporting what @Boll weevil was saying), I don't necessarily disagree with what the company did or why they did it. I'm sure there is some sort of explanation and historical good reason for it. And more importantly, they can make hiring decisions based on whatever they wish (within legal bounds).

I was sharing the story to highlight a good reason to have FU money, and a fun escorted "walk of shame" out of the office. :-)
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: bmjohnson35 on December 04, 2020, 01:31:34 PM
I read the story as the person’s job and side hustle were in the same (or at least related) industries, and the concerns there are potential leakage of intellectual property and working the side hustle on company time (programming windows look the same from far away... is the person working on company stuff or side hustle?).

Had the side hustle been something totally unrelated such as yard work or working in a restaurant, I’m guessing the company wouldn’t have brought it up.

Perhaps. The side hustle was mostly in digital support on the web. For example, the primary client at the time that remained was involved in giving scholarships to needy children. I provided some web-related guidance for them.

The work I did at the company was internal facing and more technical as part of a large communications project.

The only real relationship was that both types of work were digital. A little like if suggested you couldn't run a side gig that built mountain bike trails in your local parks because your primary work was in geological analysis of mineral deposits in the Congo. They're both outdoors. :-)

Most likely, someone did something entirely unethical and/or illegal with a side hustle in the companies history.  Some exec got upset and the company put "no outside employment" in the company handbook, and no provision for exceptions.  This mentality is pretty common in anything government/contractor related.



This is the sort of reasoning I would lean towards.

And to be clear (and supporting what @Boll weevil was saying), I don't necessarily disagree with what the company did or why they did it. I'm sure there is some sort of explanation and historical good reason for it. And more importantly, they can make hiring decisions based on whatever they wish (within legal bounds).

I was sharing the story to highlight a good reason to have FU money, and a fun escorted "walk of shame" out of the office. :-)


I had less than a favorable opinion of my company's HR department.  Policy usually is grounded in legal precedent or lessons learned. Although these stories are entertaining, I agree that their main purpose is to illustrate the value of FU money. 
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Taran Wanderer on December 04, 2020, 01:50:42 PM
Even in a company where a central part of HR’s job is to develop people and cultivate company culture, their foundational basis is to ensure legal compliance and protect the company. If you’re working for Megacorp, or even Mediumcorp, you need to remember that and accept it.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: zolotiyeruki on December 04, 2020, 02:01:04 PM
Had the side hustle been something totally unrelated such as yard work or working in a restaurant, I’m guessing the company wouldn’t have brought it up.
Sadly, too often it's a blanket policy of "no outside businesses, period."  I know a couple of guys who worked for a huge multinational oil company with such a policy.  They started a web-based side business.  There was absolutely no overlap between the two industries, and yet the policy applied.  At first they just didn't mention they had a side gig, and then eventually the side gig became profitable enough that they quit their day jobs.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: techwiz on December 04, 2020, 02:52:43 PM
then eventually the side gig became profitable enough that they quit their day jobs.

That might be the reason right there!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Uturn on December 04, 2020, 03:07:13 PM
then eventually the side gig became profitable enough that they quit their day jobs.

That might be the reason right there!

Holding someone back to force loyalty. Not really the person I would want to work for.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Bloop Bloop Reloaded on December 05, 2020, 05:19:12 AM
Had the side hustle been something totally unrelated such as yard work or working in a restaurant, I’m guessing the company wouldn’t have brought it up.
Sadly, too often it's a blanket policy of "no outside businesses, period."  I know a couple of guys who worked for a huge multinational oil company with such a policy.  They started a web-based side business.  There was absolutely no overlap between the two industries, and yet the policy applied.  At first they just didn't mention they had a side gig, and then eventually the side gig became profitable enough that they quit their day jobs.

HR/businesses are stupid. They don't know how to harness the power of employees. Businesses think they have power but it is the workers who have all the power. Businesses are rooted to the spot. Employees, if they're good and talented, can work for anyone in the world, including themselves (even more so in today's knowledge-based economy). Businesses have to give into good employees' demands otherwise it's all over, red rover. Particularly in this day and age of retrenchment payouts and sick leave, employees can really screw around with employers if they want to (though it pays to not burn bridges).

I'm constantly amazed by how conflict-avoidant many employees are. Sure, if you're a poor/average employee it pays to keep your mouth shut. But the stars and super stars are mostly short changing themselves. By making demands of their employer and skipping jobs they could get a lot more money in their pocket. FIRE aims to make that easier by removing any reliance you have on your employer, and thus evening the bargaining power.

I have found that when you no longer care about a business relationship's future, that is when you have the most power. And you should try to have that impartiality in all your business relationships.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Zaga on December 05, 2020, 07:42:29 AM
Had the side hustle been something totally unrelated such as yard work or working in a restaurant, I’m guessing the company wouldn’t have brought it up.
Sadly, too often it's a blanket policy of "no outside businesses, period."  I know a couple of guys who worked for a huge multinational oil company with such a policy.  They started a web-based side business.  There was absolutely no overlap between the two industries, and yet the policy applied.  At first they just didn't mention they had a side gig, and then eventually the side gig became profitable enough that they quit their day jobs.

HR/businesses are stupid. They don't know how to harness the power of employees. Businesses think they have power but it is the workers who have all the power. Businesses are rooted to the spot. Employees, if they're good and talented, can work for anyone in the world, including themselves (even more so in today's knowledge-based economy). Businesses have to give into good employees' demands otherwise it's all over, red rover. Particularly in this day and age of retrenchment payouts and sick leave, employees can really screw around with employers if they want to (though it pays to not burn bridges).

I'm constantly amazed by how conflict-avoidant many employees are. Sure, if you're a poor/average employee it pays to keep your mouth shut. But the stars and super stars are mostly short changing themselves. By making demands of their employer and skipping jobs they could get a lot more money in their pocket. FIRE aims to make that easier by removing any reliance you have on your employer, and thus evening the bargaining power.

I have found that when you no longer care about a business relationship's future, that is when you have the most power. And you should try to have that impartiality in all your business relationships.
Clearly you live in a country where workers have actual rights.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: zolotiyeruki on December 05, 2020, 01:36:56 PM
Had the side hustle been something totally unrelated such as yard work or working in a restaurant, I’m guessing the company wouldn’t have brought it up.
Sadly, too often it's a blanket policy of "no outside businesses, period."  I know a couple of guys who worked for a huge multinational oil company with such a policy.  They started a web-based side business.  There was absolutely no overlap between the two industries, and yet the policy applied.  At first they just didn't mention they had a side gig, and then eventually the side gig became profitable enough that they quit their day jobs.

HR/businesses are stupid. They don't know how to harness the power of employees.
I disagree.  Not with the outcomes--I agree with you there.  HR's job isn't to harness the power of employees.  Their job isn't to use common sense, nor to act in anyone's (the employee's or the business's) best interest.  HR's job, at least in large businesses, is to enforce the rules set up by management, no matter how nonsensical the rules are, or how much damage would be done to the company by enforcing bad policy.  One of those two guys was a high-performer, on the fast track to upper management, when he chose to leave instead.  Recently, he told me the story of a good friend of his, who used to work for one of the FAANGs, and was similarly a high-performer.  He did something that apparently ruffled some feathers, although it violated no written company policy, did not affect his job performance, and was in no way detrimental to the company.  He got fired.  Zero warning, zero opportunity to course correct, zero consideration for the high-five-to-low-six-figure cost to the company to replace him, no regard for the wishes of his chain of command.

Management, of course, sets the policies for HR to enforce, and, like most large bureaucracies, they can't consider every corner case, nor allow for the use of judgment, because that opens the door to unequal treatment of people under varying circumstances, or for varying enforcement of the rules depending on which HR person is doing the enforcement.  No-questions-asked enforcement of the policies is "safe," but highly efficient, and at the scale of a large business, it's sort of unavoidable in order to avoid chaos.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Bloop Bloop Reloaded on December 05, 2020, 04:46:26 PM
I know HR is in place to act as a cushion between employees and management. Just like real estate agents are there to cushion between renters and landlords. Both jobs are unimaginably dull. But while rules and policies should be applied consistently, pay should not. HR and management have plenty of discretion re: pay yet they constantly try to lowball employees. While this might be good policy in the main, when it comes to your star employees, if you don't give in to their pay demands there is a real risk of them leaving. For me that's what happened and now I work for myself and I am free to set my own exorbitant hourly rate which I now do. My old employers now sometimes contract with me at a much higher rate than I had ever asked when I was an employee. To me that makes no sense.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: rockstache on December 05, 2020, 05:50:09 PM
I mean...meh? Star employees do get to dictate a lot more than they probably realize. But also, 95% of our employees THINK they’re stars when only 5% or so would be hard to replace. When people bring us their ultimatums, we just tell them we wish them well. In the US we’re mostly at will employers so there are no real costs to letting them leave. If they leave of their own volition we don’t even have to pay unemployment. I don’t say this because I think it’s right, but because it’s reality. Most of our workforce have very little sway over their situation, except to choose to leave.

In the US, HR is not there to be a buffer between employees and management. They’re there to keep the company from being sued. In the meantime, they have other tasks, but that’s priority #1.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Zaga on December 05, 2020, 08:53:24 PM
I mean...meh? Star employees do get to dictate a lot more than they probably realize. But also, 95% of our employees THINK they’re stars when only 5% or so would be hard to replace. When people bring us their ultimatums, we just tell them we wish them well. In the US we’re mostly at will employers so there are no real costs to letting them leave. If they leave of their own volition we don’t even have to pay unemployment. I don’t say this because I think it’s right, but because it’s reality. Most of our workforce have very little sway over their situation, except to choose to leave.

In the US, HR is not there to be a buffer between employees and management. They’re there to keep the company from being sued. In the meantime, they have other tasks, but that’s priority #1.
I would disagree with the bolded above, because this is horribly short sighted.  No, there are no immediate obvious costs, but training a new person every few months to a year is expensive!  It's much cheaper to pay a bit more or give other perks than to constantly lose people (and institutional knowledge).
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Kazyan on December 05, 2020, 10:27:04 PM
I'm constantly amazed by how conflict-avoidant many employees are. Sure, if you're a poor/average employee it pays to keep your mouth shut[...]

Most people are average. Otherwise, 'average' would mean something different.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: lutorm on December 06, 2020, 12:49:43 AM
I'm constantly amazed by how conflict-avoidant many employees are. Sure, if you're a poor/average employee it pays to keep your mouth shut[...]

Most people are average. Otherwise, 'average' would mean something different.
Technically no, most people are not necessarily average. Half the people are below the median, half are above. But the average can practically be anywhere between the best and the worst.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: former player on December 06, 2020, 02:10:21 AM
I'm constantly amazed by how conflict-avoidant many employees are. Sure, if you're a poor/average employee it pays to keep your mouth shut[...]

Most people are average. Otherwise, 'average' would mean something different.
Technically no, most people are not necessarily average. Half the people are below the median, half are above. But the average can practically be anywhere between the best and the worst.

The definition of "average" seems to have diverged: one meaning for the average person and another for the pedantic.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: LennStar on December 06, 2020, 05:41:58 AM
I'm constantly amazed by how conflict-avoidant many employees are. Sure, if you're a poor/average employee it pays to keep your mouth shut[...]

Most people are average. Otherwise, 'average' would mean something different.
Technically no, most people are not necessarily average. Half the people are below the median, half are above. But the average can practically be anywhere between the best and the worst.

The definition of "average" seems to have diverged: one meaning for the average person and another for the pedantic.
You mean one for the Average Joe and one for the person who knows what it means.
My favorite example is always the multimillionaire.
You have 9 people without any money.
One person has 10 million.
So in average everyone is a millionaire.

That is btw. what is happening especially in the US, just worse: For every multimillionaire you have several people in debt.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Kazyan on December 06, 2020, 07:55:40 AM
You mean one for the Average Joe and one for the person who knows what it means.

This is a pretty snide comment, given that the distinction is both unimportant to the point and incomplete in its pedantry. "Average" can refer to either the mean, median, or mode of a series, so it's kind of puzzling to go out of one's way to start correcting us with the idea that we're obviously talking about the mean. All else being equal, instead of making assumptions that don't fit the text, why not make assumptions that do fit the text?

I didn't find it illustrative to speculate about the exact distribution of effort/skill level among employees. That's not something you can easily quantify, anyway. If it's all the same to you, let's assume it's either a normal distribution or is otherwise like most datasets where people even bother to calculate an average--that is to say, the mean and median are close enough values that when we're having colloquial discussions, that we don't really need to specify which average we mean.

Finally, the point about single extremely high outliers skewing the mean is true. But if that's the case, then the "most people are average" point to explain Bloop's observation only changes in a pedantic way--those extremely high outliers are thus even rarer cases than we would have expected for a normal distribution, so it's definitely advantageous for most people to keep their mouth shut.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: lutorm on December 06, 2020, 12:19:59 PM
You mean one for the Average Joe and one for the person who knows what it means.

This is a pretty snide comment, given that the distinction is both unimportant to the point and incomplete in its pedantry. "Average" can refer to either the mean, median, or mode of a series, so it's kind of puzzling to go out of one's way to start correcting us with the idea that we're obviously talking about the mean. All else being equal, instead of making assumptions that don't fit the text, why not make assumptions that do fit the text?

I didn't find it illustrative to speculate about the exact distribution of effort/skill level among employees. That's not something you can easily quantify, anyway. If it's all the same to you, let's assume it's either a normal distribution or is otherwise like most datasets where people even bother to calculate an average--that is to say, the mean and median are close enough values that when we're having colloquial discussions, that we don't really need to specify which average we mean.

Finally, the point about single extremely high outliers skewing the mean is true. But if that's the case, then the "most people are average" point to explain Bloop's observation only changes in a pedantic way--those extremely high outliers are thus even rarer cases than we would have expected for a normal distribution, so it's definitely advantageous for most people to keep their mouth shut.
I have personally never seen the term "average" used to mean anything but the mean. But the distinction is anything but pedantry. People being ignorant about this distinction is exactly why we see bills being promoted by saying things like "this Bill will give taxpayers an average tax cut of $1000" to make people think that they're going to get a $1000 tax cut when it in fact means that the 0.1% get a $1,000,000 tax cut and anyone who makes below $250k gets $0...

The degree to which people's skill level, however you define that, is normal or skewed is a good question. There may be a long tail of highly skilled people, but there's probably also a long tail of completely incompetent ones. If you let skill be a signed value, meaning that there are people who actually make a net negative contribution, it might actually be pretty symmetric.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Bloop Bloop Reloaded on December 06, 2020, 07:45:13 PM
When I said average I meant mean, and I assume skill is roughly distributed in a normal distribution.

It may be that for average workers it's best to shut up, but my point was that many truly skilled workers behave as if they were average workers - because that is the culture that we're brought up in - don't shake the tree, etc, etc.

Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: LennStar on December 07, 2020, 04:31:40 AM
You mean one for the Average Joe and one for the person who knows what it means.

This is a pretty snide comment, given that the distinction is both unimportant to the point and incomplete in its pedantry.
Maybe it's because I am a pedandric German, but I think:
It's only a snide comment to those who have slept during math 6th class.

If you think it's unimportant, then let me ask you this: Do you care if you earn $2000 or $3000 a month?
Because that is the unimportant, pedantric difference between average and median income.

It's like those people who think a maximum tax rate of 50% means they have to pay 50% on the first dollar.

You just can't have a successful communication if even those basics of meaning are not clear.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: grantmeaname on December 07, 2020, 06:44:51 AM
You are misunderstanding the meaning of the word "average" vs the "arithmetic mean". You are discarding all the meanings of the term except for the one that let you make a snide correction of someone else, and the person you are correcting made a statement that was correct and comprehensible for any meaning of the word rather than just the one that you seem to approve of.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Dicey on December 07, 2020, 07:01:16 AM
You mean one for the Average Joe and one for the person who knows what it means.

This is a pretty snide comment, given that the distinction is both unimportant to the point and incomplete in its pedantry.
Maybe it's because I am a pedandric German, but I think:
It's only a snide comment to those who have slept during math 6th class.

If you think it's unimportant, then let me ask you this: Do you care if you earn $2000 or $3000 a month?
Because that is the unimportant, pedantric difference between average and median income.

It's like those people who think a maximum tax rate of 50% means they have to pay 50% on the first dollar.

You just can't have a successful communication if even those basics of meaning are not clear.
No, it isn't like that at all. Let's not derail the derailment even further. Cue Elsa singing "Let It Go".
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: simmias on December 07, 2020, 07:09:12 AM
This used to be my favorite thread.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Dicey on December 07, 2020, 07:10:28 AM
This used to be my favorite thread.
It will be again.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: YYK on December 07, 2020, 07:58:54 AM
Note to self: don't use the p-word on the mustache forums
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Adventine on December 07, 2020, 08:08:33 AM
I have always secretly wanted to witness an FU money story in person, but now that most people WFH, I haven't had the opportunity.

Maybe one of these days I'll receive a company-wide final rage quit email from someone... One can dream.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: LennStar on December 07, 2020, 10:50:45 AM
I have always secretly wanted to witness an FU money story in person, but now that most people WFH, I haven't had the opportunity.

Maybe one of these days I'll receive a company-wide final rage quit email from someone... One can dream.
Don't wait for good things to happen. Make them happen yourself!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: BicycleB on December 07, 2020, 02:14:59 PM
I have always secretly wanted to witness an FU money story in person, but now that most people WFH, I haven't had the opportunity.

Maybe one of these days I'll receive a company-wide final rage quit email from someone... One can dream.

LOL. #wfhgoals
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Adventine on December 07, 2020, 03:07:43 PM
I have always secretly wanted to witness an FU money story in person, but now that most people WFH, I haven't had the opportunity.

Maybe one of these days I'll receive a company-wide final rage quit email from someone... One can dream.
Don't wait for good things to happen. Make them happen yourself!
Ha! Maybe I'll put it in my email signature as a sneaky motivational quote, effective at evading management!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Bloop Bloop Reloaded on December 08, 2020, 12:55:31 AM
I have always secretly wanted to witness an FU money story in person, but now that most people WFH, I haven't had the opportunity.

Maybe one of these days I'll receive a company-wide final rage quit email from someone... One can dream.

Even if I was super annoyed at a firm and wanted to rage quit, I'd not do it in writing or in a cheeky/histrionic way. I don't think that helps anyone. It doesn't increase your leverage, it won't make your next employer/principal pay more, and it's not going to hurt your current employer (unless you're genuinely whistleblowing or something). Heck even if I were retiring and had no further need to maintain happy relations, I'd still bow out graciously. It's your actions (in leaving/negotiating) that count not your words!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Adventine on December 08, 2020, 01:21:12 AM
I have always secretly wanted to witness an FU money story in person, but now that most people WFH, I haven't had the opportunity.

Maybe one of these days I'll receive a company-wide final rage quit email from someone... One can dream.

Even if I was super annoyed at a firm and wanted to rage quit, I'd not do it in writing or in a cheeky/histrionic way. I don't think that helps anyone. It doesn't increase your leverage, it won't make your next employer/principal pay more, and it's not going to hurt your current employer (unless you're genuinely whistleblowing or something). Heck even if I were retiring and had no further need to maintain happy relations, I'd still bow out graciously. It's your actions (in leaving/negotiating) that count not your words!

Oh yes, no arguments here. In real life, outside MMM Forumland, always better to bow out graciously and leave behind a good impression, no matter how unhappy someone has been in their job.

But in this tiny corner of the internet, it's fun to read the stories!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: NorthernMonkey on December 08, 2020, 04:26:29 AM
I have always secretly wanted to witness an FU money story in person, but now that most people WFH, I haven't had the opportunity.

Maybe one of these days I'll receive a company-wide final rage quit email from someone... One can dream.

Even if I was super annoyed at a firm and wanted to rage quit, I'd not do it in writing or in a cheeky/histrionic way. I don't think that helps anyone. It doesn't increase your leverage, it won't make your next employer/principal pay more, and it's not going to hurt your current employer (unless you're genuinely whistleblowing or something). Heck even if I were retiring and had no further need to maintain happy relations, I'd still bow out graciously. It's your actions (in leaving/negotiating) that count not your words!

Oh yes, no arguments here. In real life, outside MMM Forumland, always better to bow out graciously and leave behind a good impression, no matter how unhappy someone has been in their job.

But in this tiny corner of the internet, it's fun to read the stories!

I've seen it done. It was amazing to watch. Someone I worked with quit for another job. He was set to work his notice as normal which he did for a little while, then in the last few days he made a point of finding everyone who he had a minor gripe with and telling them exactly what he thought. It lasted for a couple of days before HR got wind and he was escorted off. (mega corp so things take a while to get traction) It was a couple of days of spectacular bridge burning extravaganza.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: alcon835 on December 08, 2020, 06:06:28 AM
I have always secretly wanted to witness an FU money story in person, but now that most people WFH, I haven't had the opportunity.

Maybe one of these days I'll receive a company-wide final rage quit email from someone... One can dream.

Even if I was super annoyed at a firm and wanted to rage quit, I'd not do it in writing or in a cheeky/histrionic way. I don't think that helps anyone. It doesn't increase your leverage, it won't make your next employer/principal pay more, and it's not going to hurt your current employer (unless you're genuinely whistleblowing or something). Heck even if I were retiring and had no further need to maintain happy relations, I'd still bow out graciously. It's your actions (in leaving/negotiating) that count not your words!

Oh yes, no arguments here. In real life, outside MMM Forumland, always better to bow out graciously and leave behind a good impression, no matter how unhappy someone has been in their job.

But in this tiny corner of the internet, it's fun to read the stories!

I'll add, most FU stories aren't all that dramatic in real life. The recent one with the CLO leaving the company because of a dispute with the CEO felt dramatic, but from the company's point of view, it was pretty ho-hum. She went to the CEO personally, she explained her problems and where to draw the line, she used the power of her role and her contract to get her out of the situation, and she was free to do all of that (even when the CEO pressured her to stop) because of her FU money.

That's what it's all about, having the freedom to hold your ground or make a choice that works for you. Heck, that's what FIRE is ultimately about as well.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Adventine on December 08, 2020, 06:28:31 AM
There's one extremely memorable FU Money post by Dr. Doom, near the start of this thread, that illustrates the kind of "I quit" moment that I want to witness. I've never had such a horrible manager, but damn it would be entertaining to see something like that in real life.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Green_Tea on December 08, 2020, 06:50:20 AM
Maybe it's because I am a pedandric German, but I think:
It's only a snide comment to those who have slept during math 6th class.

If you think it's unimportant, then let me ask you this: Do you care if you earn $2000 or $3000 a month?
Because that is the unimportant, pedantric difference between average and median income.

Please don't advocate against German people!

I think you miss the point, that the average has 2 meanings: one in a mathematical sense in which only very few people make up the average (e.g. only very few people earn EXACTLY 2.000 Euros) and a broader meaning of "the majority in the middle" which in a normal distribution is localized around the average +/- some (as shown in "the average Joe").

You see, I like to be the clever one too, so I get where your comment comes from, but sometimes it's better to assume most other people are clever too and to interpret what they say the way they actually meant it and most people would interpret it that aren't "snobbish know-it-alls" ;)

Eh back to topic: love those FU-money-Stories ;D
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Proud Foot on December 08, 2020, 09:07:36 AM
I have always secretly wanted to witness an FU money story in person, but now that most people WFH, I haven't had the opportunity.

Maybe one of these days I'll receive a company-wide final rage quit email from someone... One can dream.

Even if I was super annoyed at a firm and wanted to rage quit, I'd not do it in writing or in a cheeky/histrionic way. I don't think that helps anyone. It doesn't increase your leverage, it won't make your next employer/principal pay more, and it's not going to hurt your current employer (unless you're genuinely whistleblowing or something). Heck even if I were retiring and had no further need to maintain happy relations, I'd still bow out graciously. It's your actions (in leaving/negotiating) that count not your words!

Oh yes, no arguments here. In real life, outside MMM Forumland, always better to bow out graciously and leave behind a good impression, no matter how unhappy someone has been in their job.

But in this tiny corner of the internet, it's fun to read the stories!

I'll add, most FU stories aren't all that dramatic in real life. The recent one with the CLO leaving the company because of a dispute with the CEO felt dramatic, but from the company's point of view, it was pretty ho-hum. She went to the CEO personally, she explained her problems and where to draw the line, she used the power of her role and her contract to get her out of the situation, and she was free to do all of that (even when the CEO pressured her to stop) because of her FU money.

That's what it's all about, having the freedom to hold your ground or make a choice that works for you. Heck, that's what FIRE is ultimately about as well.

I haven't gotten the chance to read the document but my SIL was able to save it before the company wiped the email. There was a senior HR employee who sent their immediate resignation out and bcc'd the entire organization (4-5000 employees). The email just said they quit effective immediately and to read the attachment. The attachment was a 13 page document full of detailed accounts of inappropriate behavior, inconsistent application of policies, and gross misconduct within the department and organization as a whole.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: By the River on December 08, 2020, 10:16:51 AM
I've seen it done. It was amazing to watch. Someone I worked with quit for another job. He was set to work his notice as normal which he did for a little while, then in the last few days he made a point of finding everyone who he had a minor gripe with and telling them exactly what he thought. It lasted for a couple of days before HR got wind and he was escorted off. (mega corp so things take a while to get traction) It was a couple of days of spectacular bridge burning extravaganza.

Maybe he was just celebrating Festivus early
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: markbike528CBX on December 08, 2020, 10:19:21 AM
I have always secretly wanted to witness an FU money story in person, but now that most people WFH, I haven't had the opportunity.

Maybe one of these days I'll receive a company-wide final rage quit email from someone... One can dream.

Even if I was super annoyed at a firm and wanted to rage quit, I'd not do it in writing or in a cheeky/histrionic way. I don't think that helps anyone. It doesn't increase your leverage, it won't make your next employer/principal pay more, and it's not going to hurt your current employer (unless you're genuinely whistleblowing or something). Heck even if I were retiring and had no further need to maintain happy relations, I'd still bow out graciously. It's your actions (in leaving/negotiating) that count not your words!

Oh yes, no arguments here. In real life, outside MMM Forumland, always better to bow out graciously and leave behind a good impression, no matter how unhappy someone has been in their job.

But in this tiny corner of the internet, it's fun to read the stories!

I'll add, most FU stories aren't all that dramatic in real life. The recent one with the CLO leaving the company because of a dispute with the CEO felt dramatic, but from the company's point of view, it was pretty ho-hum. She went to the CEO personally, she explained her problems and where to draw the line, she used the power of her role and her contract to get her out of the situation, and she was free to do all of that (even when the CEO pressured her to stop) because of her FU money.

That's what it's all about, having the freedom to hold your ground or make a choice that works for you. Heck, that's what FIRE is ultimately about as well.

I haven't gotten the chance to read the document but my SIL was able to save it before the company wiped the email. There was a senior HR employee who sent their immediate resignation out and bcc'd the entire organization (4-5000 employees). The email just said they quit effective immediately and to read the attachment. The attachment was a 13 page document full of detailed accounts of inappropriate behavior, inconsistent application of policies, and gross misconduct within the department and organization as a whole.

Oooh,oooh, please share it.  It sounds EPIC and might be FU money. 
Redacting names and identifying information of course, if you have the energy.  I'm back in COVID lockdown, so I'm searching for scraps of entertainment.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: IsThisAGoodUsername on December 08, 2020, 10:24:54 AM
I've seen it done. It was amazing to watch. Someone I worked with quit for another job. He was set to work his notice as normal which he did for a little while, then in the last few days he made a point of finding everyone who he had a minor gripe with and telling them exactly what he thought. It lasted for a couple of days before HR got wind and he was escorted off. (mega corp so things take a while to get traction) It was a couple of days of spectacular bridge burning extravaganza.

Maybe he was just celebrating Festivus early

Ah yes, the Airing of the Grievances!
(https://seinfeldmemes.com/wp-content/uploads/2019/12/1A57F577-F2F8-4A8F-B7D8-FC13EC431B67.gif)
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: nippycrisp on December 08, 2020, 11:02:48 AM
Alright, we need a quitting story to reset things. This one's from 1998, and it's not mine, although I did witness it at close range.

My first real job was at a massive telemarketing company, trying (mostly unsuccessfully) to sell mail meters to businesses. After being trained to read the script, new telemarketers were held in a special area until we made a sale. This story is about Kwame, the sales runt of our litter.

Kwame’s Final Song

For every success in telemarketer hell there were hundreds of quiet disappointments. And with mounting failure came more unwanted attention from management. New employees that failed to convert their first score quickly began to feel the pressure to lose their sales virginity. The last holdout from our cohort was Kwame. Kwame was a nice guy, but a little too much ADD to hold down a sales job.
 
After two weeks without a single sale, Kwame was put back in training. When he came back, his calls were monitored by Marlene, the morbidly obese supervisor responsible for indoctrinating new hires. Often times, Marlene would sit next to Kwame, listening in on his calls - this is common in telemarketing, and the main reason phone salesmen don't easily quit - on a duplicate headset. As Kwame tried to work off the script, Marlene would whisper mostly-useless advice at him. Predictably, Kwame couldn’t handle juggling the script, a phone conversation and Marlene’s frantic wisdom (“Make them commit!”). As a result, his pitches grew ever more feeble and his sales remained unrealized.
 
After two more weeks of failure, it stood to reason that Kwame was not far from being put to pasture. It is surprising then, that his end came unexpectedly, and with more dignity than one might imagine.
 
For space reasons, Kwame had been released into the general population. On this particular day, he was sitting in the cubicle next to me. By now, Marlene had given up on live-coaching him, and had retreated to her office, where there was a TV that she used to watch her soaps. The theme of this day’s call list seemed to be sports-related businesses. Midway through the shift, Kwame drew a sports memorabilia shop. After making his halfhearted pitch unsuccessfully, Kwame brightened and asked if this year’s Topps Platinum Series MLB cards had arrived yet. What transpired next was a stunning example of reverse-telemarketing. Within minutes, the shop owner had apparently sweet-talked Kwame into buying something**.
 
There was one wrinkle, though: Kwame’s call was being monitored. Marlene the Manager had been listening, and she raced out from the back just as Kwame began reading off his credit card info into the phone. Marlene moved to intercept, but her pillowy body was too wide to fit down the narrow aisle of back-to-back telemarketers. You could hear the squishy collisions grow louder as she bounce-brushed hapless workers on her authority-fueled charge.
 
“Hang up the phone, Kwame!” Marlene commanded, eyes blazing as she plodded towards him. Kwame’s gaze traveled between Marlene, the credit card already in hand, and the rows of phone drones mumbling into their headsets around him. By the time he refocused on Marlene, it was clear he’d made a tactical decision to continue the transaction. Without saying a word, he ignored the supervisor’s imperative and continued feeding his credit card info into the phone.
 
Marlene verbally fired Kwame one second later. He nodded understandingly and put up a finger, asking for silence to complete his final transaction (for the record, this left his lifetime sales total with Marketing Solutions at an impressive minus one). Marlene, apparently drunk on the tiny amount of power she wielded, decided to escalate the situation, again ordering Kwame to hang up, and adding that he needed to pack up his shit immediately. Kwame took this with surprising equanimity, raising his voice only enough to be heard over the irate supervisor.
 
By this point, the altercation has attracted a crowd of interested onlookers. With Marlene so spectacularly deployed, everyone knew that the gestapo wasn't listening in. As a result, work ground to a halt as four-hundred depressed telemarketers watched the unfolding show. And what a show it was. Marlene was apoplectic, cursing out Kwame. For his part, Kwame was struggling to complete his purchase over her histrionics, and was simultaneously screaming his credit card information into the phone for all to hear.
 
In a perfect storm moment, Marlene dropped the N-word at exactly the same time Kwame’s credit card was declined. The mercurial Kwame finally exploded, splitting his fire between Marlene, the poor store owner, and Mastercard. After a furious minute of back-and-forth, Kwame rose and proceeded to leap on top of his swivel chair. “Fuck you!” he screamed into the phone. “Fuck you!” he repeated as he threw the phone's receiver at Marlene. The handset reached the end of its cord and jerked backwards with only centimeters to spare before striking Marlene between the eyes. Marlene pinwheeled backwards, jiggling mightily before dropping into what appeared to be a modified judo stance. “And fuck you!” Kwame added, jabbing a finger towards the small group of managers who’d appeared in response to the ruckus. Kwame rotated violently in my direction and leveled a finger at me. I flinched in anticipating of some overflow anger, readying myself to defend against a possible flip-kick.
 
At the last second, Mount Kwame became dormant. “You’re all cool,” he announced to the shocked crowd in a softer voice. Momentum spent, he hopped off the chair and headed for the front door, the last time any of us ever saw him. 

For those interested in life at this place during the last wave of telemarketing, this is part of a larger story I wrote here: https://www.ofmiceandmolecules.com/the-last-telemarketer.html (https://www.ofmiceandmolecules.com/the-last-telemarketer.html)

**These were early internet days where this sort of thing still happened.

ETA: Kwame's FU Money status was unknown, but he drove a Huffy, so his expenses were low.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: bbqbonelesswing on December 08, 2020, 11:24:15 AM
I love that. Telemarketing is such a crazy job. In college I worked a short stint on the phones and at our office, everyone was either a college kid or an alcoholic with nowhere else to work. When I decided to quit I just stopped showing up and nobody ever called or checked up on me, I just stopped getting checks. I imagine most places are a revolving door.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: markbike528CBX on December 08, 2020, 12:42:08 PM
I love that. Telemarketing is such a crazy job. In college I worked a short stint on the phones and at our office, everyone was either a college kid or an alcoholic with nowhere else to work. When I decided to quit I just stopped showing up and nobody ever called or checked up on me, I just stopped getting checks. I imagine most places are a revolving door.

Aggg.  I'm not good with sales, multitasking, or pressure.  I'd like to think that I'd have similar grace to Kwame.  Based on the evidence of my career, the Magic 8 Ball says "NO F...g way dude!" .

https://www.indra.com/cgi-bin/spikes-8-ball
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: jinga nation on December 08, 2020, 12:55:09 PM
Kwame could have milked being called the N-word by Marlene. Under no circumstances, even reverse-telemarketing, is it okay to call anyone a racist epithet.
Marlene and the company dodged bullets.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: pdxvandal on December 08, 2020, 01:42:14 PM
You're an engaging writer, Nippycrisp ... that was highly entertaining. I also got caught in the telemarketing world during a summer in Ohio, as I had an unpaid internship, but needed a part-time gig to eat. It was pretty bad, although I did get way more "sales" than Kwame. On my last day, I filled up my Chevron plastic mug with beer, and sipped on that for the first hour of my four-hour shift and flirted with some women on the other line, before I was asked to call it a day.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: rpr on December 08, 2020, 01:58:57 PM
@nippycrisp -- Thanks for that story. I also enjoyed reading the linked blog.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Smokystache on December 08, 2020, 02:47:29 PM


Kwame’s Final Song

For every success in telemarketer hell ...
... Kwame's FU Money status was unknown, but he drove a Huffy, so his expenses were low.

Slow clap. Nicely written. Thanks for that!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Adventine on December 08, 2020, 05:20:22 PM
Thank you @nippycrisp !
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Adventine on December 08, 2020, 07:12:20 PM
I'm finally back on my desktop so I can repost Dr. Doom's FU Money story, posted way back in 2014:



I walked out of the highest paying job of my life at the tail end of 2006, IT work for a big financial company.  (Completely transparent hint:  VWELX without the V)

I'd been there about three and a half years.  First two years were good because I had a decent manager who showed signs of being a real human being once in a while.

Third year, I get a new manager, and he's a total Fbag.  He had his last name on his license plate.  Guys on his team instantly began working 65+ hours a week instead of an already demanding 50ish.  The company paid really well so I stuck with it.  It's only work, right?

Wrong.  He started calling all of his guys on home phones, cell phones, etc. to discuss any issues he could think of at any time.  I started to think of him as a terrorist because you never knew when the next attack was coming.  He would frame the calls in the guise of "production support" because part of our role was to provide after-hours support for systems and services that needed to be available.   But many of the topics were not directly related to outages and were really just beatings.  He was a micromanager, a control-freak, and a grade-A douche who hid his insecurity behind his overbearing and driven public persona.  God help his children.

The final straw came when I got a call on Sunday Dec 23rd in 2006.  We had an outage on Saturday and I'd been involved in fixing it.  My girlfriend (now wife) was helping me decorate a small, pathetic looking christmas tree.  We were trying to put work behind us and enjoy one quiet day to ourselves, without any office nonsense, prior to the upcoming week, which was going to be full of family visits and travel.  Just one goddamn quiet day, you know? 

I pick up the phone and he starts complaining about the work I did the previous day, Saturday.  (Saturday mind, you -- work I put in on a non-standard day.  I should also add it was the 6th Saturday in a row that I'd worked.  This was fairly typical for the job.)  He says I need to remember to "fall on my sword" as soon as I get back to the office on Dec 26th -- tell everyone that the Saturday problem was my fault and I'm taking the proper long term corrective actions to resolve it.  (The problem wasn't actually my fault but he wanted me to take responsibility for it anyway.)

I remind him it's Sunday, and we're coming up on Christmas, and ask if there's any current problem that needs to be resolved.  (I'm really asking:  are any systems down?  Is there any business related reason for this call or is this just a friendly Sunday afternoon beating?)  He says yes, the problem is we have too many outages and the perception of the team is negative.   I tell him we should talk about this Thursday live instead of two days before Christmas and hang up the phone.

My SO is furious.  I'm furious.  It's no longer a nice quiet day.  I try to let it go over the holidays but the anger sits in my stomach like a fruitcake from Big Y.  I can't see how I can make it through another year at this place, despite the incredible salary and benefits.

Thursday after Christmas I get into the office and my manager immediately shows up in my office to talk about Visibility, Perception and Politics.  I cut him off and say I'm leaving.

"Leaving, what you don't feel well?"
"No, leaving the company."
He takes a step back.  I'm sitting in my cube and he's standing in front of me.  "Where are you going?"  His eyes are really wide.
"Nowhere."
"You don't have another job lined up?"
"No."
"Is it the salary?"
"No."
"It is, isn't it?  I could work with HR to see if we could work something out."
"No, it's not.  You know what it is."  I'm staring at him with my arms across my chest.  He's clearly uncomfortable, kind of wavering on his feet, but I feel terrific.  I'm thinking:  Today's the last day I'm ever going to have to look at you or hear your voice.

He finally manages to say, "You should think about this.  Someone your age shouldn't leave your job."
And I said "I know exactly what I'm doing here.  Don't worry about me.  Worry about replacing me, because you'll need to."

The conversation went a little longer than that but not much.  They ended up escorting me out, probably because my manager knew I was angry and I had tons of passwords to critical systems and hey you never know.

I got a much better job a month later.  20% overall comp. package cut but 40% reduction in work and 100% removal of my old manager.

No regrets.  I feel obligated to add that it was actually a fine place to work, lots of bright people and interesting technologies.  But even decent jobs become intolerable when you're working under a toxic egomaniac workaholic inhuman prick.

One of the things I'm now fond of saying is that people usually don't leave their jobs.  They leave their managers.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: ysette9 on December 08, 2020, 08:49:20 PM
Alright, we need a quitting story to reset things. This one's from 1998, and it's not mine, although I did witness it at close range.

My first real job was at a massive telemarketing company, trying (mostly unsuccessfully) to sell mail meters to businesses. After being trained to read the script, new telemarketers were held in a special area until we made a sale. This story is about Kwame, the sales runt of our litter.

Kwame’s Final Song

For every success in telemarketer hell there were hundreds of quiet disappointments. And with mounting failure came more unwanted attention from management. New employees that failed to convert their first score quickly began to feel the pressure to lose their sales virginity. The last holdout from our cohort was Kwame. Kwame was a nice guy, but a little too much ADD to hold down a sales job.
 
After two weeks without a single sale, Kwame was put back in training. When he came back, his calls were monitored by Marlene, the morbidly obese supervisor responsible for indoctrinating new hires. Often times, Marlene would sit next to Kwame, listening in on his calls - this is common in telemarketing, and the main reason phone salesmen don't easily quit - on a duplicate headset. As Kwame tried to work off the script, Marlene would whisper mostly-useless advice at him. Predictably, Kwame couldn’t handle juggling the script, a phone conversation and Marlene’s frantic wisdom (“Make them commit!”). As a result, his pitches grew ever more feeble and his sales remained unrealized.
 
After two more weeks of failure, it stood to reason that Kwame was not far from being put to pasture. It is surprising then, that his end came unexpectedly, and with more dignity than one might imagine.
 
For space reasons, Kwame had been released into the general population. On this particular day, he was sitting in the cubicle next to me. By now, Marlene had given up on live-coaching him, and had retreated to her office, where there was a TV that she used to watch her soaps. The theme of this day’s call list seemed to be sports-related businesses. Midway through the shift, Kwame drew a sports memorabilia shop. After making his halfhearted pitch unsuccessfully, Kwame brightened and asked if this year’s Topps Platinum Series MLB cards had arrived yet. What transpired next was a stunning example of reverse-telemarketing. Within minutes, the shop owner had apparently sweet-talked Kwame into buying something**.
 
There was one wrinkle, though: Kwame’s call was being monitored. Marlene the Manager had been listening, and she raced out from the back just as Kwame began reading off his credit card info into the phone. Marlene moved to intercept, but her pillowy body was too wide to fit down the narrow aisle of back-to-back telemarketers. You could hear the squishy collisions grow louder as she bounce-brushed hapless workers on her authority-fueled charge.
 
“Hang up the phone, Kwame!” Marlene commanded, eyes blazing as she plodded towards him. Kwame’s gaze traveled between Marlene, the credit card already in hand, and the rows of phone drones mumbling into their headsets around him. By the time he refocused on Marlene, it was clear he’d made a tactical decision to continue the transaction. Without saying a word, he ignored the supervisor’s imperative and continued feeding his credit card info into the phone.
 
Marlene verbally fired Kwame one second later. He nodded understandingly and put up a finger, asking for silence to complete his final transaction (for the record, this left his lifetime sales total with Marketing Solutions at an impressive minus one). Marlene, apparently drunk on the tiny amount of power she wielded, decided to escalate the situation, again ordering Kwame to hang up, and adding that he needed to pack up his shit immediately. Kwame took this with surprising equanimity, raising his voice only enough to be heard over the irate supervisor.
 
By this point, the altercation has attracted a crowd of interested onlookers. With Marlene so spectacularly deployed, everyone knew that the gestapo wasn't listening in. As a result, work ground to a halt as four-hundred depressed telemarketers watched the unfolding show. And what a show it was. Marlene was apoplectic, cursing out Kwame. For his part, Kwame was struggling to complete his purchase over her histrionics, and was simultaneously screaming his credit card information into the phone for all to hear.
 
In a perfect storm moment, Marlene dropped the N-word at exactly the same time Kwame’s credit card was declined. The mercurial Kwame finally exploded, splitting his fire between Marlene, the poor store owner, and Mastercard. After a furious minute of back-and-forth, Kwame rose and proceeded to leap on top of his swivel chair. “Fuck you!” he screamed into the phone. “Fuck you!” he repeated as he threw the phone's receiver at Marlene. The handset reached the end of its cord and jerked backwards with only centimeters to spare before striking Marlene between the eyes. Marlene pinwheeled backwards, jiggling mightily before dropping into what appeared to be a modified judo stance. “And fuck you!” Kwame added, jabbing a finger towards the small group of managers who’d appeared in response to the ruckus. Kwame rotated violently in my direction and leveled a finger at me. I flinched in anticipating of some overflow anger, readying myself to defend against a possible flip-kick.
 
At the last second, Mount Kwame became dormant. “You’re all cool,” he announced to the shocked crowd in a softer voice. Momentum spent, he hopped off the chair and headed for the front door, the last time any of us ever saw him. 

For those interested in life at this place during the last wave of telemarketing, this is part of a larger story I wrote here: https://www.ofmiceandmolecules.com/the-last-telemarketer.html (https://www.ofmiceandmolecules.com/the-last-telemarketer.html)

**These were early internet days where this sort of thing still happened.

ETA: Kwame's FU Money status was unknown, but he drove a Huffy, so his expenses were low.
For more of this excellent storytelling, wander over to @nippycrisp’s journal, all.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: ysette9 on December 08, 2020, 08:52:15 PM
I'm finally back on my desktop so I can repost Dr. Doom's FU Money story, posted way back in 2014:



I walked out of the highest paying job of my life at the tail end of 2006, IT work for a big financial company.  (Completely transparent hint:  VWELX without the V)

I'd been there about three and a half years.  First two years were good because I had a decent manager who showed signs of being a real human being once in a while.

Third year, I get a new manager, and he's a total Fbag.  He had his last name on his license plate.  Guys on his team instantly began working 65+ hours a week instead of an already demanding 50ish.  The company paid really well so I stuck with it.  It's only work, right?

Wrong.  He started calling all of his guys on home phones, cell phones, etc. to discuss any issues he could think of at any time.  I started to think of him as a terrorist because you never knew when the next attack was coming.  He would frame the calls in the guise of "production support" because part of our role was to provide after-hours support for systems and services that needed to be available.   But many of the topics were not directly related to outages and were really just beatings.  He was a micromanager, a control-freak, and a grade-A douche who hid his insecurity behind his overbearing and driven public persona.  God help his children.

The final straw came when I got a call on Sunday Dec 23rd in 2006.  We had an outage on Saturday and I'd been involved in fixing it.  My girlfriend (now wife) was helping me decorate a small, pathetic looking christmas tree.  We were trying to put work behind us and enjoy one quiet day to ourselves, without any office nonsense, prior to the upcoming week, which was going to be full of family visits and travel.  Just one goddamn quiet day, you know? 

I pick up the phone and he starts complaining about the work I did the previous day, Saturday.  (Saturday mind, you -- work I put in on a non-standard day.  I should also add it was the 6th Saturday in a row that I'd worked.  This was fairly typical for the job.)  He says I need to remember to "fall on my sword" as soon as I get back to the office on Dec 26th -- tell everyone that the Saturday problem was my fault and I'm taking the proper long term corrective actions to resolve it.  (The problem wasn't actually my fault but he wanted me to take responsibility for it anyway.)

I remind him it's Sunday, and we're coming up on Christmas, and ask if there's any current problem that needs to be resolved.  (I'm really asking:  are any systems down?  Is there any business related reason for this call or is this just a friendly Sunday afternoon beating?)  He says yes, the problem is we have too many outages and the perception of the team is negative.   I tell him we should talk about this Thursday live instead of two days before Christmas and hang up the phone.

My SO is furious.  I'm furious.  It's no longer a nice quiet day.  I try to let it go over the holidays but the anger sits in my stomach like a fruitcake from Big Y.  I can't see how I can make it through another year at this place, despite the incredible salary and benefits.

Thursday after Christmas I get into the office and my manager immediately shows up in my office to talk about Visibility, Perception and Politics.  I cut him off and say I'm leaving.

"Leaving, what you don't feel well?"
"No, leaving the company."
He takes a step back.  I'm sitting in my cube and he's standing in front of me.  "Where are you going?"  His eyes are really wide.
"Nowhere."
"You don't have another job lined up?"
"No."
"Is it the salary?"
"No."
"It is, isn't it?  I could work with HR to see if we could work something out."
"No, it's not.  You know what it is."  I'm staring at him with my arms across my chest.  He's clearly uncomfortable, kind of wavering on his feet, but I feel terrific.  I'm thinking:  Today's the last day I'm ever going to have to look at you or hear your voice.

He finally manages to say, "You should think about this.  Someone your age shouldn't leave your job."
And I said "I know exactly what I'm doing here.  Don't worry about me.  Worry about replacing me, because you'll need to."

The conversation went a little longer than that but not much.  They ended up escorting me out, probably because my manager knew I was angry and I had tons of passwords to critical systems and hey you never know.

I got a much better job a month later.  20% overall comp. package cut but 40% reduction in work and 100% removal of my old manager.

No regrets.  I feel obligated to add that it was actually a fine place to work, lots of bright people and interesting technologies.  But even decent jobs become intolerable when you're working under a toxic egomaniac workaholic inhuman prick.

One of the things I'm now fond of saying is that people usually don't leave their jobs.  They leave their managers.
Dr Doom is still my all-time favorite blog.
I spent a good amount of time reading hill while frustrated at work in the last several years of my career.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: MoseyingAlong on December 08, 2020, 10:09:13 PM
I'm finally back on my desktop so I can repost Dr. Doom's FU Money story, posted way back in 2014:

.....

Dr Doom is a fantastic storyteller. I check his blog every once in a while hoping he's posted something new. I'm happy he's off doing whatever but sad that he's stopped posting.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: LennStar on December 09, 2020, 04:24:05 AM
Alright, we need a quitting story to reset things. This one's from 1998, and it's not mine, although I did witness it at close range.

My first real job was at a massive telemarketing company, trying (mostly unsuccessfully) to sell mail meters to businesses. After being trained to read the script, new telemarketers were held in a special area until we made a sale. This story is about Kwame, the sales runt of our litter.

Kwame’s Final Song


Sounds like a telemerketer's equivalent to the CO half of the Navy has seen changing the course of the ship to get the sun out of his eyes :D

I have only one question:
What the hell is a mail meter?

I have something like a medieval mill in front of my eyes, but instead of water it's mail and instead of a grinding stone there is a chalk mark for every X amount of mail flowing down the wheel.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Moonwaves on December 09, 2020, 04:35:10 AM
I have only one question:
What the hell is a mail meter?

I have something like a medieval mill in front of my eyes, but instead of water it's mail and instead of a grinding stone there is a chalk mark for every X amount of mail flowing down the wheel.
LOL
I think it's a franking machine.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: dcheesi on December 09, 2020, 05:47:19 AM
I have only one question:
What the hell is a mail meter?

I have something like a medieval mill in front of my eyes, but instead of water it's mail and instead of a grinding stone there is a chalk mark for every X amount of mail flowing down the wheel.
LOL
I think it's a franking machine.
No offense, but if we don't know what "mail meter" means, what are the odds that "franking[?!] machine" is going to help us much? :-)

Mr. Google says it's a "postage meter", which is to say a special printer that prints metered postage on outgoing mail:
https://faq.usps.com/s/article/What-is-a-Postage-meter#:~:text=Postage%20Meters%20are%20postage%20printing,the%20actual%20date%20of%20mailing.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Moonwaves on December 09, 2020, 06:54:50 AM
I have only one question:
What the hell is a mail meter?

I have something like a medieval mill in front of my eyes, but instead of water it's mail and instead of a grinding stone there is a chalk mark for every X amount of mail flowing down the wheel.
LOL
I think it's a franking machine.
No offense, but if we don't know what "mail meter" means, what are the odds that "franking[?!] machine" is going to help us much? :-)

Mr. Google says it's a "postage meter", which is to say a special printer that prints metered postage on outgoing mail:
https://faq.usps.com/s/article/What-is-a-Postage-meter#:~:text=Postage%20Meters%20are%20postage%20printing,the%20actual%20date%20of%20mailing.
Sorry, I figured it was just an American vs. British term, not that people wouldn't know what it is. And since I was replying to Lennstar (who is German) and the German word for that device is almost the same (Frankiermaschine), I figured he would understand.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Dicey on December 09, 2020, 07:00:15 AM
I have only one question:
What the hell is a mail meter?

I have something like a medieval mill in front of my eyes, but instead of water it's mail and instead of a grinding stone there is a chalk mark for every X amount of mail flowing down the wheel.
LOL
I think it's a franking machine.
No offense, but if we don't know what "mail meter" means, what are the odds that "franking[?!] machine" is going to help us much? :-)

Mr. Google says it's a "postage meter", which is to say a special printer that prints metered postage on outgoing mail:
https://faq.usps.com/s/article/What-is-a-Postage-meter#:~:text=Postage%20Meters%20are%20postage%20printing,the%20actual%20date%20of%20mailing.
Sorry, I figured it was just an American vs. British term, not that people wouldn't know what it is. And since I was replying to Lennstar (who is German) and the German word for that device is almost the same (Frankiermaschine), I figured he would understand.
I'm not German, and I got it, but maybe it's because I'm old. I even remember when Pitney Bowes was a common first job out of college sales job.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: dcheesi on December 09, 2020, 08:58:21 AM
I have only one question:
What the hell is a mail meter?

I have something like a medieval mill in front of my eyes, but instead of water it's mail and instead of a grinding stone there is a chalk mark for every X amount of mail flowing down the wheel.
LOL
I think it's a franking machine.
No offense, but if we don't know what "mail meter" means, what are the odds that "franking[?!] machine" is going to help us much? :-)

Mr. Google says it's a "postage meter", which is to say a special printer that prints metered postage on outgoing mail:
https://faq.usps.com/s/article/What-is-a-Postage-meter#:~:text=Postage%20Meters%20are%20postage%20printing,the%20actual%20date%20of%20mailing.
Sorry, I figured it was just an American vs. British term, not that people wouldn't know what it is. And since I was replying to Lennstar (who is German) and the German word for that device is almost the same (Frankiermaschine), I figured he would understand.
Ah, no worries. I'm from the USA, and I'd never heard the term "franking" before. I'm familiar with the postage-meter concept, just not all the names for it. As @Dicey mentioned, "Pitney Bowes" used to be the household name for that sort of thing here.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: tct on December 09, 2020, 10:13:26 AM
The biggest $ FU money story of all time:
https://www.foxbusiness.com/business-leaders/tesla-elon-musk-california-texas
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: mm1970 on December 09, 2020, 12:47:08 PM
The biggest $ FU money story of all time:
https://www.foxbusiness.com/business-leaders/tesla-elon-musk-california-texas
Bye Felicia
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: AlanStache on December 09, 2020, 01:52:14 PM
The biggest $ FU money story of all time:
https://www.foxbusiness.com/business-leaders/tesla-elon-musk-california-texas
Bye Felicia

Just to prevent a half page discussion on what is "Bye Felicia" means:
https://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=bye%20felicia (https://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=bye%20felicia)
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Dicey on December 09, 2020, 03:37:54 PM
The biggest $ FU money story of all time:
https://www.foxbusiness.com/business-leaders/tesla-elon-musk-california-texas
Bye Felicia
Fellow Californian, laughing right along with you...
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Dicey on December 09, 2020, 03:43:07 PM
And of course, there's this. And now I'll be singing that for the rest of the day.

Moving to save on taxes is a crapshoot. Municipalities have to find ways to pay the bills, they just use different terminology for the way they extort their citizens get the money they need.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Blackeagle on December 09, 2020, 06:14:01 PM
On the flip side, Elon is doing some pretty cool stuff in Texas (https://arstechnica.com/science/2020/12/starship-rises-high-performs-a-flawless-flip-but-doesnt-quite-stick-the-landing/).
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: LennStar on December 10, 2020, 03:40:08 AM
I have only one question:
What the hell is a mail meter?

I have something like a medieval mill in front of my eyes, but instead of water it's mail and instead of a grinding stone there is a chalk mark for every X amount of mail flowing down the wheel.
LOL
I think it's a franking machine.
No offense, but if we don't know what "mail meter" means, what are the odds that "franking[?!] machine" is going to help us much? :-)

Mr. Google says it's a "postage meter", which is to say a special printer that prints metered postage on outgoing mail:
https://faq.usps.com/s/article/What-is-a-Postage-meter#:~:text=Postage%20Meters%20are%20postage%20printing,the%20actual%20date%20of%20mailing.
Sorry, I figured it was just an American vs. British term, not that people wouldn't know what it is. And since I was replying to Lennstar (who is German) and the German word for that device is almost the same (Frankiermaschine), I figured he would understand.

And for the record, I have. :D

Frankiermaschinenverwirrungsauflösungsdanksagungspost. (post that said thanks for clearing up the confusion about the franking machine)
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: WhiteTrashCash on December 10, 2020, 06:50:57 AM
The biggest $ FU money story of all time:
https://www.foxbusiness.com/business-leaders/tesla-elon-musk-california-texas
Bye Felicia
Fellow Californian, laughing right along with you...

Yeah, I don't know why people think this is such a great thing, because now Elon Musk has to live in Texas. Ew.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Psychstache on December 10, 2020, 09:13:49 AM
The biggest $ FU money story of all time:
https://www.foxbusiness.com/business-leaders/tesla-elon-musk-california-texas
Bye Felicia
Fellow Californian, laughing right along with you...

Yeah, I don't know why people think this is such a great thing, because now Elon Musk has to live in Texas. Ew.

Can confirm. Live in Texas. The tax savings are very much a 'you get what you pay for' kind of situation.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: partgypsy on December 10, 2020, 09:42:48 AM
I love that. Telemarketing is such a crazy job. In college I worked a short stint on the phones and at our office, everyone was either a college kid or an alcoholic with nowhere else to work. When I decided to quit I just stopped showing up and nobody ever called or checked up on me, I just stopped getting checks. I imagine most places are a revolving door.

I worked a telemarketing job  (customer satisfaction surveys for purchase or repair of luxury autos) between a serious job and starting grad school. when I was interviewing they asked me how long I was thinking I was going to stay at the job. I am terrible at lying so let them know I was planning to work until going to grad school in x months. The interviewer noticeiably relaxed at this news. While this was an interview to hire me they don't WANT people staying... It wasn't the worst job but it was sucky. I had to take 2 buses to get there and back, and it was one phone call after another (you were on a headset and phones were dialed and connected automatically) and sometimes after you finish a call a supervisor's voice will suddenly be on your line giving you advice.
My most exciting moment was when I was connected to speak to a John Kennedy Jr in Boston MA (this was early 90's). Alas a middle-aged sounding lady answered the phone and said he wasn't there, so I wasn't able to speak to him on the phone.

A more relevant story is that of my ex. He was working at a restaurant in the back in HS or community college age. The manager was awful and yelled all the time, also would mess with people's schedules just for fun. I don't remember the actual details but manager in the middle of a busy shift started yelling at him, even though he was doing the work of two people because they were short staffed. So he had enough took off his apron and said he quits (in the middle of the shift). And the manager says somethng inane like "you can't do that!" and he says "I just did" and leaves. He's at home when 3 more people from the kitchen show up at his doorstep saying that they quit too! And as they left the manager was in the kitchen trying to cook food even though he didn't know how to.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: former player on December 10, 2020, 09:45:07 AM
The biggest $ FU money story of all time:
https://www.foxbusiness.com/business-leaders/tesla-elon-musk-california-texas
Bye Felicia
Fellow Californian, laughing right along with you...

Yeah, I don't know why people think this is such a great thing, because now Elon Musk has to live in Texas. Ew.

Can confirm. Live in Texas. The tax savings are very much a 'you get what you pay for' kind of situation.
If you are as rich as Musk you more or less have your own small country surrounding you and it will be much the same wherever you are.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Psychstache on December 10, 2020, 10:20:54 AM
The biggest $ FU money story of all time:
https://www.foxbusiness.com/business-leaders/tesla-elon-musk-california-texas
Bye Felicia
Fellow Californian, laughing right along with you...

Yeah, I don't know why people think this is such a great thing, because now Elon Musk has to live in Texas. Ew.

Can confirm. Live in Texas. The tax savings are very much a 'you get what you pay for' kind of situation.
If you are as rich as Musk you more or less have your own small country surrounding you and it will be much the same wherever you are.

Which only further begs the question that if you can live anywhere,  why would you live in a shitty climate like Texas?
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Sibley on December 10, 2020, 10:22:07 AM
The biggest $ FU money story of all time:
https://www.foxbusiness.com/business-leaders/tesla-elon-musk-california-texas
Bye Felicia
Fellow Californian, laughing right along with you...

Yeah, I don't know why people think this is such a great thing, because now Elon Musk has to live in Texas. Ew.

Can confirm. Live in Texas. The tax savings are very much a 'you get what you pay for' kind of situation.
If you are as rich as Musk you more or less have your own small country surrounding you and it will be much the same wherever you are.

Which only further begs the question that if you can live anywhere,  why would you live in a shitty climate like Texas?

Because Texas is probably going to leave him alone and do whatever he wants. Regardless if it's a good idea or not.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: WhiteTrashCash on December 10, 2020, 11:41:01 AM
The biggest $ FU money story of all time:
https://www.foxbusiness.com/business-leaders/tesla-elon-musk-california-texas
Bye Felicia
Fellow Californian, laughing right along with you...

Yeah, I don't know why people think this is such a great thing, because now Elon Musk has to live in Texas. Ew.

Can confirm. Live in Texas. The tax savings are very much a 'you get what you pay for' kind of situation.
If you are as rich as Musk you more or less have your own small country surrounding you and it will be much the same wherever you are.

Which only further begs the question that if you can live anywhere,  why would you live in a shitty climate like Texas?

Because Texas is probably going to leave him alone and do whatever he wants. Regardless if it's a good idea or not.

Musk is also wealthy enough that he doesn't need to do his own shopping, so he won't encounter the wingnuts who open carry assault rifles to the grocery store in Texas.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: AlanStache on December 10, 2020, 12:05:01 PM
Moving to Texas would let him be more hands on with StarShip and the giga-factorie(s?) opening there .  StarShip is the path for him to become even more insanely rich and fulfill one of his major stated goals of getting people off this isolated single rock.  Also he was vocally opposed to the California covid restrictions vs Texas having fewer restrictions.  At this point he no longer needs to be around the west coast tech/vc infrastructure - they will come to him when he wants them.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: BicycleB on December 10, 2020, 01:27:45 PM
The biggest $ FU money story of all time:
https://www.foxbusiness.com/business-leaders/tesla-elon-musk-california-texas
Bye Felicia
Fellow Californian, laughing right along with you...

Yeah, I don't know why people think this is such a great thing, because now Elon Musk has to live in Texas. Ew.

Can confirm. Live in Texas. The tax savings are very much a 'you get what you pay for' kind of situation.
If you are as rich as Musk you more or less have your own small country surrounding you and it will be much the same wherever you are.

Which only further begs the question that if you can live anywhere,  why would you live in a shitty climate like Texas?

LOL.

Just got back inside after a brisk masked 45 minute stroll in my backyard. Tromping a lovely figure 8 of sorts there due to personal quarantine. Clear blue skies, 76 degrees F, the gentlest of breezes rustling the leaves. Terrible climate. Terrible!

Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: haflander on December 10, 2020, 01:36:40 PM
LOL.

Just got back inside after a brisk masked 45 minute stroll in my backyard. Tromping a lovely figure 8 of sorts there due to personal quarantine. Clear blue skies, 76 degrees F, the gentlest of breezes rustling the leaves. Terrible climate. Terrible!

Agree. Beautiful day in Big D as well, 78 right now. T-shirt and shorts, multiple walks with the dog outside, not to mention "working" from the patio.

Don't ask about August, though.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: mm1970 on December 10, 2020, 02:37:45 PM
LOL.

Just got back inside after a brisk masked 45 minute stroll in my backyard. Tromping a lovely figure 8 of sorts there due to personal quarantine. Clear blue skies, 76 degrees F, the gentlest of breezes rustling the leaves. Terrible climate. Terrible!

Agree. Beautiful day in Big D as well, 78 right now. T-shirt and shorts, multiple walks with the dog outside, not to mention "working" from the patio.

Don't ask about August, though.
Yeah, about 5-10 years ago my old boss and a different friend were trying to lure me to Dallas.  It was summer.  Hard no thanks.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Uturn on December 10, 2020, 02:51:05 PM
I lived in Fort Worth most of my life, moved to NC about 3 years ago.  I have been back to DFW 3 or 4 times, and each time I think "nope, still don't miss it."
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: zolotiyeruki on December 10, 2020, 03:23:33 PM
I used to live in the Houston area.  I hated the climate.  But that was about the only I thing I disliked.  Everything else was fantastic--the people, the food, low housing prices, good schools, low taxes...
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Psychstache on December 10, 2020, 04:29:33 PM
I lived in Houston for 20 years. Hot and humid as balls and it rained at least once a day.

Lived in San Antonio for about 4 years. Hot as balls.

Currently live in Dallas and I've been here for about 10 years. hottest balls and then it also gets ridiculously cold sometimes.

Don't let a handful of days this time of year and like a week in April fool you. The climate here is shit and I stand by that statement.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: haflander on December 10, 2020, 05:39:39 PM
I lived in Houston for 20 years. Hot and humid as balls and it rained at least once a day.

Lived in San Antonio for about 4 years. Hot as balls.

Currently live in Dallas and I've been here for about 10 years. hottest balls and then it also gets ridiculously cold sometimes.

Don't let a handful of days this time of year and like a week in April fool you. The climate here is shit and I stand by that statement.

Ok, now you've really lost any and all credibility. Let someone from the Midwest or Northeast chime in and tell you what ridiculously cold actually means.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: RyanAtTanagra on December 10, 2020, 05:50:43 PM
Ok, now you've really lost any and all credibility. Let someone from the Midwest or Northeast chime in and tell you what ridiculously cold actually means.

Let's not.  Can we get back on topic?
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: dandarc on December 10, 2020, 06:00:15 PM
Ok, now you've really lost any and all credibility. Let someone from the Midwest or Northeast chime in and tell you what ridiculously cold actually means.

Let's not.  Can we get back on topic?
It was late December of 2007. The City of Lansing, MI had just run out of salt for the roads, with no end to winter in sight. I got a call from a recruiter - "we have a position open on a project with the Florida Department of Children and Families." I didn't have much money, but I had some. That tiny pile of FU money gave me just enough of a sense of security to give my notice and take the new job in the warmer climate - started January 8th if I recall correctly.

Close enough?
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: RyanAtTanagra on December 10, 2020, 06:20:59 PM
Ok, now you've really lost any and all credibility. Let someone from the Midwest or Northeast chime in and tell you what ridiculously cold actually means.

Let's not.  Can we get back on topic?
It was late December of 2007. The City of Lansing, MI had just run out of salt for the roads, with no end to winter in sight. I got a call from a recruiter - "we have a position open on a project with the Florida Department of Children and Families." I didn't have much money, but I had some. That tiny pile of FU money gave me just enough of a sense of security to give my notice and take the new job in the warmer climate - started January 8th if I recall correctly.

Close enough?

Good segway.  Bravo and thank you :-)
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Alternatepriorities on December 10, 2020, 07:05:33 PM
Ok, now you've really lost any and all credibility. Let someone from the Midwest or Northeast chime in and tell you what ridiculously cold actually means.

Let's not.  Can we get back on topic?

Come on, it will be fun... I'd like to submit that "ridiculously cold" starts around -55 F when even the winter diesle/heating oil gels up and won't flow out of the tanks into the furnace anymore. Though I'd be willing to hear arguments for -44 F when propane stays a liquid at atmospheric pressure and the kitchen stove stops working.

Bring it back to the topic at hand, I submit that the warm comforting feeling of looking out the window at a fat pile of firewood in the yard as the mercury freezes solid (-38F) is very similar to the feeling of seeing a nice fat FU fund in the bank when the boss makes your blood boil!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: markbike528CBX on December 10, 2020, 07:31:01 PM
-55F might be where the orange paint peals off the black boxes.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: LennStar on December 11, 2020, 04:24:05 AM
-55F might be where the orange paint peals off the black boxes.
You win the Jackpot.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: BlueHouse on December 11, 2020, 06:05:05 AM
then eventually the side gig became profitable enough that they quit their day jobs.

That might be the reason right there!

Holding someone back to force loyalty. Not really the person I would want to work for.

I used to think of this as salaried employees should be giving all their brain CPU cycles to the company.  Now that I have a life outside of my job, I no longer feel that way (for me), but I've seen enough people abuse their positions and "double dip" by doing outside work on company time that it still makes me leery.  And for a salaried employee, what exactly is "company time" vs. non-company time?  Most of my great ideas come to me at 4:30 am or in the shower in the morning. 

Then again, I just came to the conclusion that I've spent my entire life anxious about work --- even when I'm completely prepared and ready for anything, I'm still stressed and anxious. 

Anyway, FU money means I no longer care about this and people can do whatever they want.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: snowball on December 11, 2020, 08:18:10 AM
The fact that I have enough money now for leanFIRE is...increasingly turning me into a loose cannon at work, it seems.  (Might lead to an epic story eventually.  For now, I give you an anecdote.)

A few weeks ago I had a brilliant realization that I don't think would ever have come to me back in the days when I was more concerned about holding onto my job.  Context: The nameplates on our office doors consist of a plastic holder with a slip of paper, your name and title printed on it.  Normally Facilities staff come swap out the paper when an office is reassigned or a title changes.

But it's just a piece of paper.  Eminently self-replaceable...

And - my job title is so boring.  Hardly an incentive to continue OMY'ing, though my employer knows not that this is what I am doing.  But really, for my employer's own good, clearly my boring title is a morale / staff retention issue that needs to be addressed (she says virtuously).

Thought led to action within the hour, and thus...my new job title was born.

So far no one's noticed the change except a few people I pointed it out to, who found it hilarious.  I bet I can go literally years without anyone noticing on their own, especially since I retained the first couple of words from my official title.  You'd have to keep reading to notice, and who does that?  (I guess I will find out!)

My new title? Section Head, Dragon and Pixiedust Wrangling.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Dicey on December 11, 2020, 08:24:07 AM
-55F might be where the orange paint peals off the black boxes.
Is there a ringing sound when that happens?
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Adventine on December 11, 2020, 08:39:13 AM
The fact that I have enough money now for leanFIRE is...increasingly turning me into a loose cannon at work, it seems.  (Might lead to an epic story eventually.  For now, I give you an anecdote.)

A few weeks ago I had a brilliant realization that I don't think would ever have come to me back in the days when I was more concerned about holding onto my job.  Context: The nameplates on our office doors consist of a plastic holder with a slip of paper, your name and title printed on it.  Normally Facilities staff come swap out the paper when an office is reassigned or a title changes.

But it's just a piece of paper.  Eminently self-replaceable...

And - my job title is so boring.  Hardly an incentive to continue OMY'ing, though my employer knows not that this is what I am doing.  But really, for my employer's own good, clearly my boring title is a morale / staff retention issue that needs to be addressed (she says virtuously).

Thought led to action within the hour, and thus...my new job title was born.

So far no one's noticed the change except a few people I pointed it out to, who found it hilarious.  I bet I can go literally years without anyone noticing on their own, especially since I retained the first couple of words from my official title.  You'd have to keep reading to notice, and who does that?  (I guess I will find out!)

My new title? Section Head, Dragon and Pixiedust Wrangling.

Got any openings for Team Coordinator for Rainbow Sparkles?
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Dicey on December 11, 2020, 09:13:50 AM
The fact that I have enough money now for leanFIRE is...increasingly turning me into a loose cannon at work, it seems.  (Might lead to an epic story eventually.  For now, I give you an anecdote.)

A few weeks ago I had a brilliant realization that I don't think would ever have come to me back in the days when I was more concerned about holding onto my job.  Context: The nameplates on our office doors consist of a plastic holder with a slip of paper, your name and title printed on it.  Normally Facilities staff come swap out the paper when an office is reassigned or a title changes.

But it's just a piece of paper.  Eminently self-replaceable...

And - my job title is so boring.  Hardly an incentive to continue OMY'ing, though my employer knows not that this is what I am doing.  But really, for my employer's own good, clearly my boring title is a morale / staff retention issue that needs to be addressed (she says virtuously).

Thought led to action within the hour, and thus...my new job title was born.

So far no one's noticed the change except a few people I pointed it out to, who found it hilarious.  I bet I can go literally years without anyone noticing on their own, especially since I retained the first couple of words from my official title.  You'd have to keep reading to notice, and who does that?  (I guess I will find out!)

My new title? Section Head, Dragon and Pixiedust Wrangling.

Got any openings for Team Coordinator for Rainbow Sparkles?
I'd hire you for that job in a heartbeat. Oh, wait...I'm FIRE.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Adventine on December 11, 2020, 09:16:35 AM
@Dicey for you, this sparkle specialist will always work for free ;)
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Plina on December 11, 2020, 09:26:35 AM
then eventually the side gig became profitable enough that they quit their day jobs.

That might be the reason right there!

Holding someone back to force loyalty. Not really the person I would want to work for.

I used to think of this as salaried employees should be giving all their brain CPU cycles to the company.  Now that I have a life outside of my job, I no longer feel that way (for me), but I've seen enough people abuse their positions and "double dip" by doing outside work on company time that it still makes me leery.  And for a salaried employee, what exactly is "company time" vs. non-company time?  Most of my great ideas come to me at 4:30 am or in the shower in the morning. 

Then again, I just came to the conclusion that I've spent my entire life anxious about work --- even when I'm completely prepared and ready for anything, I'm still stressed and anxious. 

Anyway, FU money means I no longer care about this and people can do whatever they want.

I think it is enough if I give my 40 hours per week as average of my brainpower  to the company. That is what they pay me. Some weeks it is less and some weeks it is more. My brain is unfortunately sometimes unable to shut off and steals a bit more brainpower. Because I have flexible workhours I don’t see it as as problem to do personal things during a workday, but I would not double dip.

I have never felt that I can’t express my opinion at a workplace but I also realize I care less about company bs the more money I have.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: techwiz on December 11, 2020, 10:17:53 AM
The fact that I have enough money now for leanFIRE is...increasingly turning me into a loose cannon at work, it seems.  (Might lead to an epic story eventually.  For now, I give you an anecdote.)

A few weeks ago I had a brilliant realization that I don't think would ever have come to me back in the days when I was more concerned about holding onto my job.  Context: The nameplates on our office doors consist of a plastic holder with a slip of paper, your name and title printed on it.  Normally Facilities staff come swap out the paper when an office is reassigned or a title changes.

But it's just a piece of paper.  Eminently self-replaceable...

And - my job title is so boring.  Hardly an incentive to continue OMY'ing, though my employer knows not that this is what I am doing.  But really, for my employer's own good, clearly my boring title is a morale / staff retention issue that needs to be addressed.

Thought led to action within the hour, and thus...my new job title was born.

So far no one's noticed the change except a few people I pointed it out to, who found it hilarious.  I bet I can go literally years without anyone noticing on their own, especially since I retained the first couple of words from my official title.  You'd have to keep reading to notice, and who does that?  (I guess I will find out!)

My new title? Section Head, Dragon and Pixiedust Wrangling.

Love it.

We have done the same at our office, putting up nicknames, motivational/humorous additions.  We do not have clients coming to our cubicles and now with working from home those little moral boosting titles don't get seen at all. 

Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: lhamo on December 11, 2020, 11:14:56 AM
The fact that I have enough money now for leanFIRE is...increasingly turning me into a loose cannon at work, it seems.  (Might lead to an epic story eventually.  For now, I give you an anecdote.)

A few weeks ago I had a brilliant realization that I don't think would ever have come to me back in the days when I was more concerned about holding onto my job.  Context: The nameplates on our office doors consist of a plastic holder with a slip of paper, your name and title printed on it.  Normally Facilities staff come swap out the paper when an office is reassigned or a title changes.

But it's just a piece of paper.  Eminently self-replaceable...

And - my job title is so boring.  Hardly an incentive to continue OMY'ing, though my employer knows not that this is what I am doing.  But really, for my employer's own good, clearly my boring title is a morale / staff retention issue that needs to be addressed (she says virtuously).

Thought led to action within the hour, and thus...my new job title was born.

So far no one's noticed the change except a few people I pointed it out to, who found it hilarious.  I bet I can go literally years without anyone noticing on their own, especially since I retained the first couple of words from my official title.  You'd have to keep reading to notice, and who does that?  (I guess I will find out!)

My new title? Section Head, Dragon and Pixiedust Wrangling.

Got any openings for Team Coordinator for Rainbow Sparkles?

I can send you my C.V that shows I am eminently qualified for Senior Technical Advisor, Doing Whatever the Fuck I Want Division.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: desk_jockey on December 11, 2020, 11:54:15 AM
Thought led to action within the hour, and thus...my new job title was born.
[...]
My new title? Section Head, Dragon and Pixiedust Wrangling.

Yes, self-confidence in one’s ability and standing within the company multiplied by FU money should lead to new and improved job titles.   An abbreviated version of my official job title is Bid Manager.   On multiple occasions in internal use, that title has been changed to Bid Messiah. 
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Dicey on December 11, 2020, 12:15:29 PM
@Dicey for you, this sparkle specialist will always work for free ;)
Awww, but instead of working, let's play together instead. After the pandemic, of course.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Aegishjalmur on December 11, 2020, 01:42:40 PM


My new title? Section Head, Dragon and Pixiedust Wrangling.

That is hilarious.... The sad part is that most people are so burned out on buzzwords and business speak that they will assume it's just an obscure code or new phrase and will not question it as they don't want to appear out of the loop....
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Alternatepriorities on December 11, 2020, 01:44:40 PM


My new title? Section Head, Dragon and Pixiedust Wrangling.

That is hilarious.... The sad part is that most people are so burned out on buzzwords and business speak that they will assume it's just an obscure code or new phrase and will not question it as they don't want to appear out of the loop....

I start to tune out about the third buzzword.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: markbike528CBX on December 11, 2020, 04:12:21 PM


My new title? Section Head, Dragon and Pixiedust Wrangling.

That is hilarious.... The sad part is that most people are so burned out on buzzwords and business speak that they will assume it's just an obscure code or new phrase and will not question it as they don't want to appear out of the loop....

I bet people assume it is a variation on "agile" , I mean if you can have a scrum leader, the idea of Dragons dropping Pixiedust isn't that farfetched.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: snowball on December 11, 2020, 05:52:04 PM


My new title? Section Head, Dragon and Pixiedust Wrangling.

That is hilarious.... The sad part is that most people are so burned out on buzzwords and business speak that they will assume it's just an obscure code or new phrase and will not question it as they don't want to appear out of the loop....

I bet people assume it is a variation on "agile" , I mean if you can have a scrum leader, the idea of Dragons dropping Pixiedust isn't that farfetched.

Lol, this is not that sort of workplace.  Pretty conservative, too.  If this came to the attention of the powers that be, I would definitely be told to take it down...though I don't think I'd be fired.  (But if I were?  Awesome epic FU story I'd be telling for the rest of my life!  So, not a deterrent.)
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: LennStar on December 12, 2020, 06:30:48 AM
My new title? Section Head, Dragon and Pixiedust Wrangling.
Sound cool to me! You certainly don't want to be without one when a Dragon turns up spraying Pixiedust everywhere.

Did you get that from a book or so? I am quite sure I read (very similar) that before somewhere. Sounds like something Terry Pratchett would put onto his door when he was still PR guy for an atomic power plant. But I don't think it's from there.

Since I always correct the commas of my boss, maybe I should rename myself Senior Advisor for Arcane Epistemological Grammatical Correctness.

You guys know what? I open a thread. https://forum.mrmoneymustache.com/welcome-to-the-forum/your-fu-job-title/
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Zaga on December 12, 2020, 07:25:14 AM
One time someone gave my husband the nametag maker at his job at the movie theater.  So for awhile he was "Thagar, Destroyer of Worlds, Taker of Tickets".

His boss thought it was funny so he got to keep it.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Mr. Green on December 13, 2020, 04:52:47 PM
So far no one's noticed the change except a few people I pointed it out to, who found it hilarious.  I bet I can go literally years without anyone noticing on their own, especially since I retained the first couple of words from my official title.  You'd have to keep reading to notice, and who does that?  (I guess I will find out!)

My new title? Section Head, Dragon and Pixiedust Wrangling.
This jogged a memory from a dark time in my career.

In my early 20's I worked a tech job in a fairly toxic environment where a lot of money was being thrown around. I changed the nameplate on the wall of my cubicle to say "BOLO" (be on the lookout). Below that I had the quote "Status is buying things you can't afford to impress people you don't even like." I was pretty bitter. Lol

No one ever said anything.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: NorCal on December 14, 2020, 07:20:32 AM
So far no one's noticed the change except a few people I pointed it out to, who found it hilarious.  I bet I can go literally years without anyone noticing on their own, especially since I retained the first couple of words from my official title.  You'd have to keep reading to notice, and who does that?  (I guess I will find out!)

My new title? Section Head, Dragon and Pixiedust Wrangling.
This jogged a memory from a dark time in my career.

In my early 20's I worked a tech job in a fairly toxic environment where a lot of money was being thrown around. I changed the nameplate on the wall of my cubicle to say "BOLO" (be on the lookout). Below that I had the quote "Status is buying things you can't afford to impress people you don't even like." I was pretty bitter. Lol

No one ever said anything.

I love these petty forms of subversion.

Mine was my second deployment to Iraq, and I was DONE with the whole thing. 

One of my jobs was keeping track of all 750 of our people.  I had to know who was in country, who was on leave, who was in the hospital, etc.  I would stand up in our morning meetings and brief the commander on what had changed in the prior day.  Everyone listened to me drone on, no one cared, but I had to do it anyway.

One day, the Good Idea Fairy decides to put this whole briefing in PowerPoint and have the whole presentation loop 24 hours a day to make the TOC (tactical operations center) look high-tech out of a movie.  Since no one cared about my in-person briefing, I knew they could care less about my PowerPoint slides.

I updated the slides for about three days.  Then I decided to see how long I could go without updating the slides before someone noticed.

Those slides were not updated for the remaining 8 months of the deployment.  Even as I briefed different numbers every single day.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: LennStar on December 14, 2020, 08:56:11 AM
Did the slides include a date?
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: BicycleB on December 14, 2020, 09:30:47 AM
I once attended an accounting class by a guy who used to run a bank. He started out in tech support, more or less, during the early computer days when the "computer department" generated reports because no one else had computers.

When he became department head, there were 150 reports generated for the company. His first act was to stop sending them. His plan was to permanently cancel any report that no one requested during the next 90 days. Half of the reports died.

He didn't have to leave his job to say FU to unnecessary work!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: markbike528CBX on December 14, 2020, 12:18:13 PM
I once attended an accounting class by a guy who used to run a bank. He started out in tech support, more or less, during the early computer days when the "computer department" generated reports because no one else had computers.

When he became department head, there were 150 reports generated for the company. His first act was to stop sending them. His plan was to permanently cancel any report that no one requested during the next 90 days. Half of the reports died.

He didn't have to leave his job to say FU to unnecessary work!
Wow, real life TPS reports.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: dandarc on December 14, 2020, 02:18:55 PM
I once attended an accounting class by a guy who used to run a bank. He started out in tech support, more or less, during the early computer days when the "computer department" generated reports because no one else had computers.

When he became department head, there were 150 reports generated for the company. His first act was to stop sending them. His plan was to permanently cancel any report that no one requested during the next 90 days. Half of the reports died.

He didn't have to leave his job to say FU to unnecessary work!
Wow, real life TPS reports.
Ours was called "Project Tracking System" - PTS - at large mutual insurance company I worked for out of college. My direct boss back then had a striking resemblance to Milton.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: ysette9 on December 15, 2020, 08:42:14 PM
Oh god, the meaningless reports.

I took a manager position at a test laboratory and I got this stack of reports delivered to my desk on weekly metrics. You can imagine that with a department of engineers and a lot of repetitive tests you can generate an almost unlimited number of reports. I had the guy in charge sit down and explain them all to me and realized that most were legacy things for an odd-duck manager who had been retired for years but had ruled with such an iron first that a lot of his nonsense policies were still in place. I took pleasure in first axing the dead tree weekly ritual and then working with my counterpart leading a sister lab to pare down the reports to only those that were actually meaningful.

It feels sacrilegious  as an engineer to say no to more data and graphs but there really is a thing as too much.

Same company, different job, my name plate was under a small section of the cubicle farm titled “Entropy Studies”.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: BicycleB on December 15, 2020, 09:13:11 PM
Really titled "Entropy Studies"? And you had to cut down the reports that were continuing by momentum? LOL
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: SwordGuy on December 15, 2020, 09:15:05 PM
Oh god, the meaningless reports.

I took a manager position at a test laboratory and I got this stack of reports delivered to my desk on weekly metrics. You can imagine that with a department of engineers and a lot of repetitive tests you can generate an almost unlimited number of reports. I had the guy in charge sit down and explain them all to me and realized that most were legacy things for an odd-duck manager who had been retired for years but had ruled with such an iron first that a lot of his nonsense policies were still in place. I took pleasure in first axing the dead tree weekly ritual and then working with my counterpart leading a sister lab to pare down the reports to only those that were actually meaningful.

It feels sacrilegious  as an engineer to say no to more data and graphs but there really is a thing as too much.

Same company, different job, my name plate was under a small section of the cubicle farm titled “Entropy Studies”.

I used to work for a Dutch multi-national shipping firm.    One of the megacorporation companies had a business deal where they prepared a report, then went thru a manual ritual to confirm that their printed report matched their business partner's printed report.   It gets better.   The business partner company was purchased by the megacorporation and then they were migrated to work off the exact same database.

And, you guessed it, they still met to manually confirm that their printed reports matched!   Took them years before someone figured it out!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Alternatepriorities on December 16, 2020, 12:12:31 AM

I used to work for a Dutch multi-national shipping firm.    One of the megacorporation companies had a business deal where they prepared a report, then went thru a manual ritual to confirm that their printed report matched their business partner's printed report.   It gets better.   The business partner company was purchased by the megacorporation and then they were migrated to work off the exact same database.

And, you guessed it, they still met to manually confirm that their printed reports matched!   Took them years before someone figured it out!

They weren’t meeting to review that report in Aruba by any chance?
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: SwordGuy on December 16, 2020, 06:52:29 AM
Nope.  Rotterdam.  Even the Dutch didn't like Rotterdam. :)
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: snowball on December 16, 2020, 06:09:08 PM
My new title? Section Head, Dragon and Pixiedust Wrangling.
Did you get that from a book or so? I am quite sure I read (very similar) that before somewhere. Sounds like something Terry Pratchett would put onto his door when he was still PR guy for an atomic power plant. But I don't think it's from there.

Possibly I did?  I don't think so, but I've read a LOT of books in my life, lol.  Things do pile up in your subconscious.

Hmm.  Now that I think on it, it may have been partially inspired by the Head Bug Wrangler title that Kareen Koudelka snags instead of lab assistant in A Civil Campaign...
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: GeeVee on December 19, 2020, 09:34:30 AM
Only a small story.. I am a senior manager at a small sized company and usually swan around in the office pretending to be a SWAMI. One day the company owner said to me “Don’t get me wrong, but you don’t work over-time”. I replied “Don’t get me wrong, but I have a life”.

I do a very specialized job at the firm and am a major fee earner for the company. The owner wanted to hire a guy from outside the industry to become the general manager to alleviate his work load.  Anyway, I laughed and said “I will not accept a manager who is going to tell me how I will do my job. I will stick a note on my door stating ‘No talk. No touch. No eye contact”.

General manager from outside the industry is hired and starts overseeing the entire company but me to his great annoyance. I report directly to the owner of the company when and if necessary, but usually am doing my own thing solving complex client problems and taking care of internal company issues. General manager tried to boss me around, but I shut him down immediately politely and professionally. Being a pretend SWAMI rocks..I will act for the good of the company only and disregard office politics. Just 3 years more of being pretend SWAMI..then I will be the real thing.
 
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: BicycleB on December 19, 2020, 03:07:13 PM
Only a small story.. I am a senior manager at a small sized company and usually swan around in the office pretending to be a SWAMI. One day the company owner said to me “Don’t get me wrong, but you don’t work over-time”. I replied “Don’t get me wrong, but I have a life”.

I do a very specialized job at the firm and am a major fee earner for the company. The owner wanted to hire a guy from outside the industry to become the general manager to alleviate his work load.  Anyway, I laughed and said “I will not accept a manager who is going to tell me how I will do my job. I will stick a note on my door stating ‘No talk. No touch. No eye contact”.

General manager from outside the industry is hired and starts overseeing the entire company but me to his great annoyance. I report directly to the owner of the company when and if necessary, but usually am doing my own thing solving complex client problems and taking care of internal company issues. General manager tried to boss me around, but I shut him down immediately politely and professionally. Being a pretend SWAMI rocks..I will act for the good of the company only and disregard office politics. Just 3 years more of being pretend SWAMI..then I will be the real thing.

A hard but good line you take there, much respect @GeeVee. Epic in that you act confidently while not actually FI. Epic!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: GeeVee on December 20, 2020, 04:44:26 AM
Thank you, @BicycleB. Over the years, I have seen the ego inflating effect the title manager has on people and have found those people incredibly boring. As such, I am trying to be the manager which I would like have had myself, somebody who will stand up for what they believe is right and protect people who need protection regardless of the fall out. I also treat the owner of the company with kindness and take over work from him as well when he gets overwhelmed.

On the other hand, a coworker said that “you can try to mess with Geevee, but the last thing you want is Geevee messing with you.”  Kindness should not be taken as weakness. I have very firm boundaries.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Sandi_k on December 20, 2020, 11:07:47 AM

Hmm.  Now that I think on it, it may have been partially inspired by the Head Bug Wrangler title that Kareen Koudelka snags instead of lab assistant in A Civil Campaign...

Love the reference to LMB - my favorite SF series of all time. I <3 Miles.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Wolfpack Mustachian on January 01, 2021, 06:53:49 PM
FU money moment: One day before vacation, learn that I have a new "interim" boss in the monthly revolving door that is management. Then that afternoon, email says that new boss wishes to meet *later* that afternoon. Then in the evening, new boss texts me several more times to meet. Did not reply. The last thing I needed was some seed of concern planted in my mind right before vacation by my interim boss! Thx, FU money!

This is great! Avoiding nonsense like whatever "emergency" needs your attention by someone who doesn't even know anything that's going on because they're new to their own job right before you're going to be on vacation and not work on it is a wonderful FU money application!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Fru-Gal on January 01, 2021, 07:52:15 PM
Thx for getting it exactly, @Wolfpack Mustachian -- I proudly shared this with my mom & she did not get it at all LOL. Hmm maybe because I did not say anything about FU money? Regardless, does not 100% require FU money to do this, this is basic mental health preservation/boundary-setting.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: NorthernMonkey on January 02, 2021, 12:52:02 PM
I used to work for a Dutch multi-national shipping firm.    One of the megacorporation companies had a business deal where they prepared a report, then went thru a manual ritual to confirm that their printed report matched their business partner's printed report.   It gets better.   The business partner company was purchased by the megacorporation and then they were migrated to work off the exact same database.

And, you guessed it, they still met to manually confirm that their printed reports matched!   Took them years before someone figured it out!

My first job in IT was in 1999, working on getting rid of anything without a 'year 2000 ok' sticker.
In the server room was this huge wardrobe sized machine with two dinner place sized tape reels, which every day recorded some critical production data, was then put in a big box, and overnight couriered to the largest customer. This data was Critical, with a capital C. This machine must be kept running.

We phoned up the IT team of the customer, and asked them about it. It turned out they had a similar machine, that was kept just because we kept sending them these tapes, but it would be much easier for them if we could email it over instead.

Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: rpr on January 02, 2021, 02:55:59 PM
@NorthernMonkey -- that was funny. Thanks.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: DrinkCoffeeStackMoney on January 04, 2021, 10:42:38 AM
A couple years ago my current employer tried to force me to cancel a vacation that I had planned ten months earlier so I could attend training in Denver. They stated that this shouldn't be an issue since they gave me five weeks notice. I told them it wasn't about the notice, it was about their request interfered with a vacation I had planned almost a year in advance. When they tried to push me harder to cancel I told them that I would not be cancelling my plans regardless of consequence, and if it was that big of an issue they could just have my last check ready the day I left for vacation. Needless to say they not only backed down and rescheduled the training, but I got a huge promotion a year later. That was the first time I realized the power of FU money.

Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Uturn on January 04, 2021, 11:30:32 AM
My company transferred me from TX to NC to be a Sr Security Engineer in our SOC.  I also agreed to be an escalation point for the NOC since I also have a ton of networking experience and years of experience in an older technology that the company makes a ton of money supporting. I was soon doing only NOC things and not security, and I let it go on far too long.  I finally had enough and last February, I set a meeting with my boss.  I told him that I was not transferred here to be a network engineer, I agreed to be a security engineer.  It's not like I am asking to do something the company does not need, nor am I asking to be moved to a position that I am not qualified for. He started to give me the needs of the company speech.  I replied with "I've been with this company for 5 years in 3 roles across two states, I have a lot of institutional knowledge about our company and our customers.  I also will do security engineering, you just need to decide if I do it for this company or another one." 

Suddenly, the needs of the company changed and I have been extremely happy in my security role.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: SwordGuy on January 04, 2021, 01:00:25 PM
My company transferred me from TX to NC to be a Sr Security Engineer in our SOC.  I also agreed to be an escalation point for the NOC since I also have a ton of networking experience and years of experience in an older technology that the company makes a ton of money supporting. I was soon doing only NOC things and not security, and I let it go on far too long.  I finally had enough and last February, I set a meeting with my boss.  I told him that I was not transferred here to be a network engineer, I agreed to be a security engineer.  It's not like I am asking to do something the company does not need, nor am I asking to be moved to a position that I am not qualified for. He started to give me the needs of the company speech.  I replied with "I've been with this company for 5 years in 3 roles across two states, I have a lot of institutional knowledge about our company and our customers.  I also will do security engineering, you just need to decide if I do it for this company or another one." 

Suddenly, the needs of the company changed and I have been extremely happy in my security role.

Perfectly done.  I bow to your expertise in explaining your FU Money position.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: BicycleB on January 04, 2021, 02:04:14 PM
My company transferred me from TX to NC to be a Sr Security Engineer in our SOC.  I also agreed to be an escalation point for the NOC since I also have a ton of networking experience and years of experience in an older technology that the company makes a ton of money supporting. I was soon doing only NOC things and not security, and I let it go on far too long.  I finally had enough and last February, I set a meeting with my boss.  I told him that I was not transferred here to be a network engineer, I agreed to be a security engineer.  It's not like I am asking to do something the company does not need, nor am I asking to be moved to a position that I am not qualified for. He started to give me the needs of the company speech.  I replied with "I've been with this company for 5 years in 3 roles across two states, I have a lot of institutional knowledge about our company and our customers.  I also will do security engineering, you just need to decide if I do it for this company or another one." 

Suddenly, the needs of the company changed and I have been extremely happy in my security role.

@Uturn made them do a Uturn!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: zolotiyeruki on January 04, 2021, 04:07:38 PM
"you just need to decide if I do it for this company or another one." 
Wow, that's putting it rather pleasingly bluntly.  Did you say it in those words? :D
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Ladychips on January 04, 2021, 06:25:09 PM
My company transferred me from TX to NC to be a Sr Security Engineer in our SOC.  I also agreed to be an escalation point for the NOC since I also have a ton of networking experience and years of experience in an older technology that the company makes a ton of money supporting. I was soon doing only NOC things and not security, and I let it go on far too long.  I finally had enough and last February, I set a meeting with my boss.  I told him that I was not transferred here to be a network engineer, I agreed to be a security engineer.  It's not like I am asking to do something the company does not need, nor am I asking to be moved to a position that I am not qualified for. He started to give me the needs of the company speech.  I replied with "I've been with this company for 5 years in 3 roles across two states, I have a lot of institutional knowledge about our company and our customers.  I also will do security engineering, you just need to decide if I do it for this company or another one." 

Suddenly, the needs of the company changed and I have been extremely happy in my security role.

Bravo!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Bloop Bloop Reloaded on January 04, 2021, 08:54:32 PM
then eventually the side gig became profitable enough that they quit their day jobs.

That might be the reason right there!

Holding someone back to force loyalty. Not really the person I would want to work for.

I used to think of this as salaried employees should be giving all their brain CPU cycles to the company.  Now that I have a life outside of my job, I no longer feel that way (for me), but I've seen enough people abuse their positions and "double dip" by doing outside work on company time that it still makes me leery.  And for a salaried employee, what exactly is "company time" vs. non-company time?  Most of my great ideas come to me at 4:30 am or in the shower in the morning. 

Then again, I just came to the conclusion that I've spent my entire life anxious about work --- even when I'm completely prepared and ready for anything, I'm still stressed and anxious. 

Anyway, FU money means I no longer care about this and people can do whatever they want.

I think it is enough if I give my 40 hours per week as average of my brainpower  to the company. That is what they pay me. Some weeks it is less and some weeks it is more. My brain is unfortunately sometimes unable to shut off and steals a bit more brainpower. Because I have flexible workhours I don’t see it as as problem to do personal things during a workday, but I would not double dip.

I have never felt that I can’t express my opinion at a workplace but I also realize I care less about company bs the more money I have.

When I was an employee I was only paid about 1/8 of what I billed so I figured it was only fair that I put in about 50% effort to the company (in fact, it should have been 12.5% effort but that low amount of effort would have gotten me fired). Otherwise I would take sick days, moonlight, do contract work for other clients (as long as there was no conflict) without telling my employer, etc

I wasn't paid enough to care. And the advantage of having, even at that time, a decent stash was that I wasn't afraid to be mercenary.

I still liked my work and my colleagues, for it wasn't their fault, but I was just indifferent to my employer as an entity.

I wouldn't expect any employee to care much, unless that employee was paid miraculously well, or was actually rather incompetent and therefore the job represented a bit of a charity drive.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: BlueHouse on January 06, 2021, 10:19:43 AM
then eventually the side gig became profitable enough that they quit their day jobs.

That might be the reason right there!

Holding someone back to force loyalty. Not really the person I would want to work for.

I used to think of this as salaried employees should be giving all their brain CPU cycles to the company.  Now that I have a life outside of my job, I no longer feel that way (for me), but I've seen enough people abuse their positions and "double dip" by doing outside work on company time that it still makes me leery.  And for a salaried employee, what exactly is "company time" vs. non-company time?  Most of my great ideas come to me at 4:30 am or in the shower in the morning. 

Then again, I just came to the conclusion that I've spent my entire life anxious about work --- even when I'm completely prepared and ready for anything, I'm still stressed and anxious. 

Anyway, FU money means I no longer care about this and people can do whatever they want.

I think it is enough if I give my 40 hours per week as average of my brainpower  to the company. That is what they pay me. Some weeks it is less and some weeks it is more. My brain is unfortunately sometimes unable to shut off and steals a bit more brainpower. Because I have flexible workhours I don’t see it as as problem to do personal things during a workday, but I would not double dip.

I have never felt that I can’t express my opinion at a workplace but I also realize I care less about company bs the more money I have.

When I was an employee I was only paid about 1/8 of what I billed so I figured it was only fair that I put in about 50% effort to the company (in fact, it should have been 12.5% effort but that low amount of effort would have gotten me fired). Otherwise I would take sick days, moonlight, do contract work for other clients (as long as there was no conflict) without telling my employer, etc

I wasn't paid enough to care. And the advantage of having, even at that time, a decent stash was that I wasn't afraid to be mercenary.

I still liked my work and my colleagues, for it wasn't their fault, but I was just indifferent to my employer as an entity.

I wouldn't expect any employee to care much, unless that employee was paid miraculously well, or was actually rather incompetent and therefore the job represented a bit of a charity drive.
The difference between billing rate and salary should be understood well before acting out something like this.  There are people in the office whose work supports your efforts, but are considered indirect costs.  Your charge rate must cover their salaries.  It also has to cover the cost of equipment, facilities, fringe for all workers, etc. 
If you truly respected your colleagues, you wouldn't approach this as a transaction that can be understood unless you know the overhead rates of your company. 
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: RyanAtTanagra on January 06, 2021, 10:42:13 AM
The difference between billing rate and salary should be understood well before acting out something like this.  There are people in the office whose work supports your efforts, but are considered indirect costs.  Your charge rate must cover their salaries.  It also has to cover the cost of equipment, facilities, fringe for all workers, etc. 
If you truly respected your colleagues, you wouldn't approach this as a transaction that can be understood unless you know the overhead rates of your company.

This.  I hear people often who see the top line and think that's the bottom line.  'They charge X but it only costs Y to make', and don't realize how many other things there are in between.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: markbike528CBX on January 06, 2021, 01:28:57 PM
The difference between billing rate and salary should be understood well before acting out something like this.  There are people in the office whose work supports your efforts, but are considered indirect costs.  Your charge rate must cover their salaries.  It also has to cover the cost of equipment, facilities, fringe for all workers, etc. 
If you truly respected your colleagues, you wouldn't approach this as a transaction that can be understood unless you know the overhead rates of your company.

This.  I hear people often who see the top line and think that's the bottom line.  'They charge X but it only costs Y to make', and don't realize how many other things there are in between.

It does indicate what the market will bear.  My charge-out rate was a 4x what my gross salary was.  It was sort of irritating.   
I understand supporting needed people like admins/secretaries and the accountants, and to a lesser extent, salespersons* as I certainly don't want their jobs, and they make my work life far easier.   I've done some minor accounting stuff as a project manager and was forced to do admin stuff (time cards, word processing etc) and I didn't delight in those tasks.  I mostly objected to supporting upper management getting paid big for making my work life more difficult.

I've thought that a fair contractor charge rate was about 1/3 to 1/2 of my wage-earner chargeout rate.   I haven't been temped to verify this, as I'm happily FIRED

*However, hanging out with salespeople is hard on the liver due to excessive drinking.  Also I have a gift of telling the truth and not being believable, so I suck at sales.

Oh yeah, I forgot that even I was not billable some of the time, like when I was on the MMM forum at work :-).  My actual on-site work at the customers was basically about 2 months a year, with the rest of the year preparation for those two months.

Edit to note that I was sometimes "overhead" myself.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: TomTX on January 07, 2021, 10:52:01 AM
The difference between billing rate and salary should be understood well before acting out something like this.  There are people in the office whose work supports your efforts, but are considered indirect costs.  Your charge rate must cover their salaries.  It also has to cover the cost of equipment, facilities, fringe for all workers, etc. 
If you truly respected your colleagues, you wouldn't approach this as a transaction that can be understood unless you know the overhead rates of your company.

An 8x "overhead rate" is insane.

Some overhead? Sure.

8x? No Freaking Way - and I have spent years overseeing consultant contracts where I know exactly what the worker is paid and what the charge rate is.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: grantmeaname on January 07, 2021, 11:08:46 AM
100% of your time is client billable? In law and accounting firms it's more like 50%, and worse for more senior employees.

You take a 2.5-3.5x overhead rate and 50% billability, and 8x seems pretty reasonable.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Dreamer40 on January 07, 2021, 11:38:22 AM
Hello inspirational lovelies! I’m a longtime lurker and MMM article reader. I feel like my introduction belongs in the epic FU money story thread.

I’m 40 years old, female, married, no kids. I’m a federal attorney who has mostly hated being an attorney since I became one at 27. Parts of it are ok and I'm good at it, but I fell into a litigator role and going to court has always completely stressed me out. But I’ve been sticking it out because I was interested in the subject matter and I could get the job done in 40 hours a week. I’ve been slowly creeping toward FIRE but also spent a lot on travel adventures in my 30s (which I’m now glad I did while I could pre-covid!).

For the past few years, the work environment has been slowly going downhill, and the quantity of work skyrocketing. The faster I work to keep up, the more bonus work I’m assigned because I’m “efficient.” I’m now routinely up at night stressing about work with no improvements in sight. I started grumbling to my supervisors about burnout and retirement a few months ago. Yesterday I finally said I would consider not retiring soon if they would reassign my court appearances and give me more other work instead. A supervisor called my retirement comment “charming" and made no promises. So I put in my notice today. I’ll work another 2 months to finish up some pending assignments. My last day will be the day before a scheduled court appearance so they’ll have to find someone to cover it after all. My supervisor said she thought I was kidding about the retirement thing and all the big bosses asked if there was anything they could do to change my mind. Sounds like they'd now be happy to let me out of the court appearances. Nah, that's ok.

I was about 2 years away from the slightly-fat FIRE we wanted (not counting my deferred pension, which will just be bonus money when I can start collecting it in 22 years). But my husband is happy to work longer to get us there and he’s truly interested in his career. He'll probably work quite a bit longer even after we reach the FI level we have in mind. I’m excited to handle our cooking and do things to make his life easier. I love cooking. I even  enjoy cleaning my house since I like my house and keeping my stuff nice. There are all kinds of jobs I might like to try someday after I recover from burnout. I miss having different temporary jobs where I worked with people who weren't lawyers. But for now, I’m going to wait for a covid vaccine and fulfill my spring gardening dreams. I’m going to build a bamboo trellis and grow peas this year!!!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Alternatepriorities on January 07, 2021, 11:50:59 AM
Well played Dreamer40! Congratulations on your early retirement.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: AMandM on January 07, 2021, 01:00:09 PM
Congratulations Dreamer40!  Enjoy your garden and your house!

A supervisor called my retirement comment “charming" and made no promises.

In your shoes, that might have made me quit on the spot.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: AO1FireTo on January 07, 2021, 01:22:18 PM
Hello inspirational lovelies! I’m a longtime lurker and MMM article reader. I feel like my introduction belongs in the epic FU money story thread.

I’m 40 years old, female, married, no kids. I’m a federal attorney who has mostly hated being an attorney since I became one at 27. Parts of it are ok and I'm good at it, but I fell into a litigator role and going to court has always completely stressed me out. But I’ve been sticking it out because I was interested in the subject matter and I could get the job done in 40 hours a week. I’ve been slowly creeping toward FIRE but also spent a lot on travel adventures in my 30s (which I’m now glad I did while I could pre-covid!).

For the past few years, the work environment has been slowly going downhill, and the quantity of work skyrocketing. The faster I work to keep up, the more bonus work I’m assigned because I’m “efficient.” I’m now routinely up at night stressing about work with no improvements in sight. I started grumbling to my supervisors about burnout and retirement a few months ago. Yesterday I finally said I would consider not retiring soon if they would reassign my court appearances and give me more other work instead. A supervisor called my retirement comment “charming" and made no promises. So I put in my notice today. I’ll work another 2 months to finish up some pending assignments. My last day will be the day before a scheduled court appearance so they’ll have to find someone to cover it after all. My supervisor said she thought I was kidding about the retirement thing and all the big bosses asked if there was anything they could do to change my mind. Sounds like they'd now be happy to let me out of the court appearances. Nah, that's ok.

I was about 2 years away from the slightly-fat FIRE we wanted (not counting my deferred pension, which will just be bonus money when I can start collecting it in 22 years). But my husband is happy to work longer to get us there and he’s truly interested in his career. He'll probably work quite a bit longer even after we reach the FI level we have in mind. I’m excited to handle our cooking and do things to make his life easier. I love cooking. I even  enjoy cleaning my house since I like my house and keeping my stuff nice. There are all kinds of jobs I might like to try someday after I recover from burnout. I miss having different temporary jobs where I worked with people who weren't lawyers. But for now, I’m going to wait for a covid vaccine and fulfill my spring gardening dreams. I’m going to build a bamboo trellis and grow peas this year!!!

Being a lawyer, you certainly have a skill set that could lead to a variety of interesting careers if you wanted.  Take the parts of the law you enjoy and design a new job.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Abe Froman on January 07, 2021, 01:30:52 PM
Well played Dreamer40! Congratulations on your early retirement.

Charming even.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: goat_music_generator on January 07, 2021, 02:42:51 PM
Hello inspirational lovelies! I’m a longtime lurker and MMM article reader. I feel like my introduction belongs in the epic FU money story thread.

I’m 40 years old, female, married, no kids. I’m a federal attorney who has mostly hated being an attorney since I became one at 27. Parts of it are ok and I'm good at it, but I fell into a litigator role and going to court has always completely stressed me out. But I’ve been sticking it out because I was interested in the subject matter and I could get the job done in 40 hours a week. I’ve been slowly creeping toward FIRE but also spent a lot on travel adventures in my 30s (which I’m now glad I did while I could pre-covid!).

For the past few years, the work environment has been slowly going downhill, and the quantity of work skyrocketing. The faster I work to keep up, the more bonus work I’m assigned because I’m “efficient.” I’m now routinely up at night stressing about work with no improvements in sight. I started grumbling to my supervisors about burnout and retirement a few months ago. Yesterday I finally said I would consider not retiring soon if they would reassign my court appearances and give me more other work instead. A supervisor called my retirement comment “charming" and made no promises. So I put in my notice today. I’ll work another 2 months to finish up some pending assignments. My last day will be the day before a scheduled court appearance so they’ll have to find someone to cover it after all. My supervisor said she thought I was kidding about the retirement thing and all the big bosses asked if there was anything they could do to change my mind. Sounds like they'd now be happy to let me out of the court appearances. Nah, that's ok.

I was about 2 years away from the slightly-fat FIRE we wanted (not counting my deferred pension, which will just be bonus money when I can start collecting it in 22 years). But my husband is happy to work longer to get us there and he’s truly interested in his career. He'll probably work quite a bit longer even after we reach the FI level we have in mind. I’m excited to handle our cooking and do things to make his life easier. I love cooking. I even  enjoy cleaning my house since I like my house and keeping my stuff nice. There are all kinds of jobs I might like to try someday after I recover from burnout. I miss having different temporary jobs where I worked with people who weren't lawyers. But for now, I’m going to wait for a covid vaccine and fulfill my spring gardening dreams. I’m going to build a bamboo trellis and grow peas this year!!!

Woot, congrats! Similar garden dreams here -- I'm planning on snow peas :-)
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Trifle on January 07, 2021, 02:45:39 PM
Congratulations Dreamer40!  Enjoy your garden and your house!

A supervisor called my retirement comment “charming" and made no promises.

In your shoes, that might have made me quit on the spot.

+1.   REing is the next sweetest revenge.  :)

@Dreamer40 have you checked out the 2021 FIRE Cohort?  Nice group.  https://forum.mrmoneymustache.com/welcome-to-the-forum/2021-fire-cohort/700/?topicseen
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: AlanStache on January 07, 2021, 02:50:45 PM
100% of your time is client billable? In law and accounting firms it's more like 50%, and worse for more senior employees.

I have spend the vast majority of my 15 years with my current employer on direct charge numbers; overall I would guess I am near 95%.  There have been many years that were effetely 100%.  #EngineerLife
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Dreamer40 on January 07, 2021, 02:51:52 PM
Thanks, everyone! Boy was the supervisor who made the charming comment surprised... Worth it purely for the shock factor! She's also someone who has been retirement-eligible for awhile, was out for a long time after an injury, but came back and is still hanging onto the job. I don't think she can fathom anyone walking away.

Only 55 days till I officially separate. That's hardly enough time to plan what bottle of champagne I want to drink.

Yay for snow peas! My mother-in-law lives down the street from me and just sent over some beautiful landscaping books. She's excited, too.

I'll check out the 2021 cohort thread - thanks!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Mrs. Sloth on January 07, 2021, 07:51:20 PM

For the past few years, the work environment has been slowly going downhill, and the quantity of work skyrocketing. The faster I work to keep up, the more bonus work I’m assigned because I’m “efficient.”

This has been my problem in my career. I am shit on with more work and more complex work because I have the capability to handle it but working for the government means I am only awarded with more work and stress w/o more in pay. Well, I am tired of it all and cant wait for FIRE myself!

Congrats on an EPIC exit to FIRE!!!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: BuffaloStache on January 08, 2021, 07:24:43 AM
Echoing others- congrats and well done!


For the past few years, the work environment has been slowly going downhill, and the quantity of work skyrocketing. The faster I work to keep up, the more bonus work I’m assigned because I’m “efficient.”

This has been my problem in my career. I am shit on with more work and more complex work because I have the capability to handle it but working for the government means I am only awarded with more work and stress w/o more in pay. Well, I am tired of it all and cant wait for FIRE myself!

Congrats on an EPIC exit to FIRE!!!

I was in the same boat, but then left the company that was "rewarding" me. It's odd, but I've definitely tempered expectations at the new job, and I'm getting promotions and raises like I never did at the old company. I don't understand it, but it's working...
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: WhiteTrashCash on January 08, 2021, 08:07:05 AM

For the past few years, the work environment has been slowly going downhill, and the quantity of work skyrocketing. The faster I work to keep up, the more bonus work I’m assigned because I’m “efficient.”

This has been my problem in my career. I am shit on with more work and more complex work because I have the capability to handle it but working for the government means I am only awarded with more work and stress w/o more in pay. Well, I am tired of it all and cant wait for FIRE myself!

Congrats on an EPIC exit to FIRE!!!

Those kinds of work expectations and lack of reward are typical with jobs on Hillbilly Mountain, which is why people have learned not to work hard or try to advance themselves. It's a sad situation.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Alternatepriorities on January 08, 2021, 01:21:48 PM
Most of these stories are understandably work related but another thread reminded me of a time frugality gave me the money to flip the bird to a nonwork problem.

I'd been working full time for just over a year and as I was still living like I had in college I'd stashed a bit of cash. My mother was an alcoholic and my brother and I learned that her house was being foreclosed because she'd been missing payments. After looking at the numbers my brother suggested we combine our savings an buy it from her. Turned out she was too far removed from reality to sign the paperwork, but her small town bank worked with us foreclosing the house and selling it to us the same day. She lived there for the rest of her life and honestly I'm still not sure she understood why her house wasn't foreclosed. Our sisters were not left homeless and when our mother died ~18 months later the sale of the house covered the cost of her funeral, helping them move, and even gave us all a small inheritance. None of that would have been possible if my brother and I hadn't been so frugal before hand.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Plina on January 08, 2021, 01:43:00 PM

For the past few years, the work environment has been slowly going downhill, and the quantity of work skyrocketing. The faster I work to keep up, the more bonus work I’m assigned because I’m “efficient.”

This has been my problem in my career. I am shit on with more work and more complex work because I have the capability to handle it but working for the government means I am only awarded with more work and stress w/o more in pay. Well, I am tired of it all and cant wait for FIRE myself!

Congrats on an EPIC exit to FIRE!!!

Those kinds of work expectations and lack of reward are typical with jobs on Hillbilly Mountain, which is why people have learned not to work hard or try to advance themselves. It's a sad situation.

I would say it fairly typical in many companies and government. I worked in consultancy and business was always good except in april-may when it was time for the salary talks. The cost was up and the market unstable.

I set the expectations in my current position of what I was interested in and not interested in. I am happy to pitch in more than 40 hours sometimes, but 40 hours are my baseline. I told the owner of the lawfirm that I don’t want the job to become my life. I was offered to work parttime or fulltime based on my preference. As long as I deliver according to the agreed expectations I am having a lot of freedom. If you have to much, you have to say that and ask what the boss wants you to prioritize between. I have seen many colleagues burnout due to a bad combination of not saying no at work or in private life. I am not going to let that happen to me. No job is worth that.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: achvfi on January 08, 2021, 02:17:56 PM
Most of these stories are understandably work related but another thread reminded me of a time frugality gave me the money to flip the bird to a nonwork problem.

I'd been working full time for just over a year and as I was still living like I had in college I'd stashed a bit of cash. My mother was an alcoholic and my brother and I learned that her house was being foreclosed because she'd been missing payments. After looking at the numbers my brother suggested we combine our savings an buy it from her. Turned out she was too far removed from reality to sign the paperwork, but her small town bank worked with us foreclosing the house and selling it to us the same day. She lived there for the rest of her life and honestly I'm still not sure she understood why her house wasn't foreclosed. Our sisters were not left homeless and when our mother died ~18 months later the sale of the house covered the cost of her funeral, helping them move, and even gave us all a small inheritance. None of that would have been possible if my brother and I hadn't been so frugal before hand.

An Epic story indeed! peace of mind you gave to your family considering the circumstances is invaluable.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: SwordGuy on January 08, 2021, 04:14:17 PM
Most of these stories are understandably work related but another thread reminded me of a time frugality gave me the money to flip the bird to a nonwork problem.

I'd been working full time for just over a year and as I was still living like I had in college I'd stashed a bit of cash. My mother was an alcoholic and my brother and I learned that her house was being foreclosed because she'd been missing payments. After looking at the numbers my brother suggested we combine our savings an buy it from her. Turned out she was too far removed from reality to sign the paperwork, but her small town bank worked with us foreclosing the house and selling it to us the same day. She lived there for the rest of her life and honestly I'm still not sure she understood why her house wasn't foreclosed. Our sisters were not left homeless and when our mother died ~18 months later the sale of the house covered the cost of her funeral, helping them move, and even gave us all a small inheritance. None of that would have been possible if my brother and I hadn't been so frugal before hand.

Yeah, you and your brother and the banker!   Well done!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Alternatepriorities on January 08, 2021, 04:20:45 PM
Most of these stories are understandably work related but another thread reminded me of a time frugality gave me the money to flip the bird to a nonwork problem.

I'd been working full time for just over a year and as I was still living like I had in college I'd stashed a bit of cash. My mother was an alcoholic and my brother and I learned that her house was being foreclosed because she'd been missing payments. After looking at the numbers my brother suggested we combine our savings an buy it from her. Turned out she was too far removed from reality to sign the paperwork, but her small town bank worked with us foreclosing the house and selling it to us the same day. She lived there for the rest of her life and honestly I'm still not sure she understood why her house wasn't foreclosed. Our sisters were not left homeless and when our mother died ~18 months later the sale of the house covered the cost of her funeral, helping them move, and even gave us all a small inheritance. None of that would have been possible if my brother and I hadn't been so frugal before hand.

Yeah, you and your brother and the banker!   Well done!

We never met the banker in person, we just talked with her on the phone because we were another state. I wish I'd looked her up the next time I went to visit. I hope she's doing well FIRE'd now too.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: BicycleB on January 09, 2021, 01:11:21 PM
Most of these stories are understandably work related but another thread reminded me of a time frugality gave me the money to flip the bird to a nonwork problem.

I'd been working full time for just over a year and as I was still living like I had in college I'd stashed a bit of cash. My mother was an alcoholic and my brother and I learned that her house was being foreclosed because she'd been missing payments. After looking at the numbers my brother suggested we combine our savings an buy it from her. Turned out she was too far removed from reality to sign the paperwork, but her small town bank worked with us foreclosing the house and selling it to us the same day. She lived there for the rest of her life and honestly I'm still not sure she understood why her house wasn't foreclosed. Our sisters were not left homeless and when our mother died ~18 months later the sale of the house covered the cost of her funeral, helping them move, and even gave us all a small inheritance. None of that would have been possible if my brother and I hadn't been so frugal before hand.

Wow! I think anybody in the world would respect that.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Alternatepriorities on January 09, 2021, 07:08:56 PM
Wow! I think anybody in the world would respect that.

Thanks! Looking back on it now that was probably the first time in my life I had money to buy options. By the time my mother died 18 months later I'd stashed enough additional money I could negotiate for 5 weeks off to deal all the troubles that came with that. I politely told them I needed the time off, unpaid was fine, and I could either work there when I finished or I'd work somewhere else. They asked me to come back :)  It was so much an FU as "I really need to take care of this more than I need this job". Fifteen years later, I'm quite certain that was the right choice. Both my sisters are doing well, my bother will be FI this year too, and we're all pretty close despite being scattered about the country at times. Things could have turned out so much worse if we didn't have or think we had any options.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: AMandM on January 09, 2021, 11:06:01 PM
Those are both epic stories, @Alternatepriorities, but, at the same time, I'm kind of scandalized that someone who doesn't have the cognitive capacity to sell her house can still be foreclosed on. In your case, you and your brother were clearly acting in the best interest of your relatives, but it's easy to imagine a similar scenario in which the sons buy the mother's foreclosed house, evict her, and flip it for a quick profit
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Alternatepriorities on January 10, 2021, 01:51:58 AM
Those are both epic stories, @Alternatepriorities, but, at the same time, I'm kind of scandalized that someone who doesn't have the cognitive capacity to sell her house can still be foreclosed on. In your case, you and your brother were clearly acting in the best interest of your relatives, but it's easy to imagine a similar scenario in which the sons buy the mother's foreclosed house, evict her, and flip it for a quick profit

Well she hadn’t been paying the mortgage in months by that point and didn’t have any money to pay it with. I can’t really fault the bank for moving to foreclose. Though even at 25 I knew enough to tell her to pay the mortgage rather than any other debts she had. She wouldn’t listen though and it probably would have backfired anyway. Even without a mortgage she was in bankruptcy when she passed. The part I found most scandalous was the number of new credit applications she was receiving while in bankruptcy. A dozen or more arrived in the two weeks between her death and when we cancelled her mail. The bankruptcy was dismissed (not sure of the legal term) after i showed her public aid that she had less that $500 in assets when she died. I never did find out her total debt. Very thankful to live in a time and place where debts are not passed on the children.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: BlueHouse on January 14, 2021, 07:50:03 AM
I'm losing all interest in work and I'm almost to one year away from my RE planned date (was a stretch goal, but it's becoming clear that unless there's a major correction, I can do it quite comfortably). 
So I'm looking at moving my RE date earlier, but I'm hesitating and starting to think of all kinds of scenarios to walk away.  Most of them are to not say anything other than "need to focus on family". 

But today I started thinking that I'd like to tell the Security Officer (holds my clearance) that I plan to start consuming pot. 

That's it.  Just see what they do with the info.  HAHAHA  If I travel, I have to give them notice.  I really wonder what they would do if I called and said "I plan to start getting high on mm-dd-yyyy."  I wonder if they even have any procedure in place or if they would just be like "okay, thanks for letting us know" 
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: rantk81 on January 14, 2021, 07:58:58 AM
I'm losing all interest in work and I'm almost to one year away from my RE planned date (was a stretch goal, but it's becoming clear that unless there's a major correction, I can do it quite comfortably). 
So I'm looking at moving my RE date earlier, but I'm hesitating and starting to think of all kinds of scenarios to walk away.  Most of them are to not say anything other than "need to focus on family". 

But today I started thinking that I'd like to tell the Security Officer (holds my clearance) that I plan to start consuming pot. 

That's it.  Just see what they do with the info.  HAHAHA  If I travel, I have to give them notice.  I really wonder what they would do if I called and said "I plan to start getting high on mm-dd-yyyy."  I wonder if they even have any procedure in place or if they would just be like "okay, thanks for letting us know"

Would highly recommend you don't do anything to get terminated for cause... You never know how it might impact you in the future.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: alcon835 on January 14, 2021, 08:03:00 AM
I'm losing all interest in work and I'm almost to one year away from my RE planned date (was a stretch goal, but it's becoming clear that unless there's a major correction, I can do it quite comfortably). 
So I'm looking at moving my RE date earlier, but I'm hesitating and starting to think of all kinds of scenarios to walk away.  Most of them are to not say anything other than "need to focus on family". 

But today I started thinking that I'd like to tell the Security Officer (holds my clearance) that I plan to start consuming pot. 

That's it.  Just see what they do with the info.  HAHAHA  If I travel, I have to give them notice.  I really wonder what they would do if I called and said "I plan to start getting high on mm-dd-yyyy."  I wonder if they even have any procedure in place or if they would just be like "okay, thanks for letting us know"

Would highly recommend you don't do anything to get terminated for cause... You never know how it might impact you in the future.

I agree with the above. Just put in your notice and be done with it. You don't have to give a reason. Doing something that could get you blacklisted may be something you regret later.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Much Fishing to Do on January 14, 2021, 09:08:23 AM
I'm losing all interest in work and I'm almost to one year away from my RE planned date (was a stretch goal, but it's becoming clear that unless there's a major correction, I can do it quite comfortably). 
So I'm looking at moving my RE date earlier, but I'm hesitating and starting to think of all kinds of scenarios to walk away.  Most of them are to not say anything other than "need to focus on family". 

But today I started thinking that I'd like to tell the Security Officer (holds my clearance) that I plan to start consuming pot. 

That's it.  Just see what they do with the info.  HAHAHA  If I travel, I have to give them notice.  I really wonder what they would do if I called and said "I plan to start getting high on mm-dd-yyyy."  I wonder if they even have any procedure in place or if they would just be like "okay, thanks for letting us know"

I wouldn't go there.  Within days you'd have coworkers who never talked to you before wanting to hang out with you....
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: jps on January 14, 2021, 09:13:59 AM
I'm losing all interest in work and I'm almost to one year away from my RE planned date (was a stretch goal, but it's becoming clear that unless there's a major correction, I can do it quite comfortably). 
So I'm looking at moving my RE date earlier, but I'm hesitating and starting to think of all kinds of scenarios to walk away.  Most of them are to not say anything other than "need to focus on family". 

But today I started thinking that I'd like to tell the Security Officer (holds my clearance) that I plan to start consuming pot. 

That's it.  Just see what they do with the info.  HAHAHA  If I travel, I have to give them notice.  I really wonder what they would do if I called and said "I plan to start getting high on mm-dd-yyyy."  I wonder if they even have any procedure in place or if they would just be like "okay, thanks for letting us know"

Folks above me are probably rightly encouraging you not to do this, but I am saddened that none of them pointed out that this is freakin' hilarious. Thanks for giving me a big laugh as I start my day.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: AMandM on January 14, 2021, 11:26:12 AM
Those are both epic stories, @Alternatepriorities, but, at the same time, I'm kind of scandalized that someone who doesn't have the cognitive capacity to sell her house can still be foreclosed on. In your case, you and your brother were clearly acting in the best interest of your relatives, but it's easy to imagine a similar scenario in which the sons buy the mother's foreclosed house, evict her, and flip it for a quick profit

Well she hadn’t been paying the mortgage in months by that point and didn’t have any money to pay it with. I can’t really fault the bank for moving to foreclose.
I can see that. In a situation where the bank didn't know you and your brother and your mother, hopefully there would have been some mechanism to appoint someone independent to act on behalf of your mother.

Quote
Though even at 25 I knew enough to tell her to pay the mortgage rather than any other debts she had. She wouldn’t listen though and it probably would have backfired anyway. Even without a mortgage she was in bankruptcy when she passed. The part I found most scandalous was the number of new credit applications she was receiving while in bankruptcy. A dozen or more arrived in the two weeks between her death and when we cancelled her mail. The bankruptcy was dismissed (not sure of the legal term) after i showed her public aid that she had less that $500 in assets when she died. I never did find out her total debt. Very thankful to live in a time and place where debts are not passed on the children.
Scandalous indeed.  I hope it was predators like that who got stuck with your mother's debt.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: mwulff on January 14, 2021, 12:59:15 PM
I don't know if it's a FU story, but it certainly is epic.

I had a meeting with my boss today which isn't that unusual. We have a great working relationship and are quite casual with each other, it also helps that we both married a doctor so we have some common ground.

Anyway... We start discussing changes we could implement after covid loosens its grip on our lives. He gets that faraway look and says "You know I've been thinking that we should just shutdown the office and work from home permanently, then we just require everyone to fill out timesheets with a 5 minute resolution and that will be much better..." *pause for effect* "but then I remembered that if I did that you would give notice on the spot and find a new hobby..." *big smirk*

Not going to lie, he had me in the first half. But it still feels epic that he knows that I am FI and be completely chill about it, I never told him specifically but discussions about investments, property have been going around the office and I guess he picked up on it.

And I am willing to concede that he pulled an epic-troll on me today :). I was halfway expected to get rick-rolled as well.

PS. For the record I have decided long ago that timesheets are an instant reason to quit a job. I've actually turned down jobs that required me to track my time.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Alternatepriorities on January 14, 2021, 01:09:30 PM
Those are both epic stories, @Alternatepriorities, but, at the same time, I'm kind of scandalized that someone who doesn't have the cognitive capacity to sell her house can still be foreclosed on. In your case, you and your brother were clearly acting in the best interest of your relatives, but it's easy to imagine a similar scenario in which the sons buy the mother's foreclosed house, evict her, and flip it for a quick profit

Well she hadn’t been paying the mortgage in months by that point and didn’t have any money to pay it with. I can’t really fault the bank for moving to foreclose.
I can see that. In a situation where the bank didn't know you and your brother and your mother, hopefully there would have been some mechanism to appoint someone independent to act on behalf of your mother.
Quote

Yeah, I don't know what they would have done if we hadn't been involved. I assume the foreclosure would have gone ahead as scheduled and then police would have been called to evict her and my sisters from the property?



Quote
Though even at 25 I knew enough to tell her to pay the mortgage rather than any other debts she had. She wouldn’t listen though and it probably would have backfired anyway. Even without a mortgage she was in bankruptcy when she passed. The part I found most scandalous was the number of new credit applications she was receiving while in bankruptcy. A dozen or more arrived in the two weeks between her death and when we cancelled her mail. The bankruptcy was dismissed (not sure of the legal term) after i showed her public aid that she had less that $500 in assets when she died. I never did find out her total debt. Very thankful to live in a time and place where debts are not passed on the children.
Scandalous indeed.  I hope it was predators like that who got stuck with your mother's debt.
Same here. As it was mostly from major card companies I believe it is a safe bet.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: CodingHare on January 14, 2021, 01:26:29 PM
I don't know if it's a FU story, but it certainly is epic.

I had a meeting with my boss today which isn't that unusual. We have a great working relationship and are quite casual with each other, it also helps that we both married a doctor so we have some common ground.

Anyway... We start discussing changes we could implement after covid loosens its grip on our lives. He gets that faraway look and says "You know I've been thinking that we should just shutdown the office and work from home permanently, then we just require everyone to fill out timesheets with a 5 minute resolution and that will be much better..." *pause for effect* "but then I remembered that if I did that you would give notice on the spot and find a new hobby..." *big smirk*

Not going to lie, he had me in the first half. But it still feels epic that he knows that I am FI and be completely chill about it, I never told him specifically but discussions about investments, property have been going around the office and I guess he picked up on it.

And I am willing to concede that he pulled an epic-troll on me today :). I was halfway expected to get rick-rolled as well.

PS. For the record I have decided long ago that timesheets are an instant reason to quit a job. I've actually turned down jobs that required me to track my time.

Hah, that was a good one!  Glad you have a boss you can joke with like that.  And good on knowing you limits on what you will tolerate.

Ironically, I intentionally sought out a job with timesheets.  The 5 minutes a day I devote to caring about it means I actually get paid for my overtime now.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: mwulff on January 14, 2021, 02:18:49 PM
Ironically, I intentionally sought out a job with timesheets.  The 5 minutes a day I devote to caring about it means I actually get paid for my overtime now.

I just don't overtime :) Much easier and keeps me at a good work-life balance and keeps the boss happy. If the unthinkable should happen I do put in some overtime, all I have to do is leave earlier some other day.

It's pretty sweet if you value your freedom as much as I do.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: trollwithamustache on January 14, 2021, 03:23:50 PM
PS. For the record I have decided long ago that timesheets are an instant reason to quit a job. I've actually turned down jobs that required me to track my time.

 I've had a few decent timesheet gigs... If you can fill out the timesheet a week or month ahead of time and someone from accounting/admin thanks you, it has seemed to correspond to places where you pay a little lip service to following the rules and they bother someone else.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: dblaace on January 14, 2021, 03:33:39 PM
PS. For the record I have decided long ago that timesheets are an instant reason to quit a job. I've actually turned down jobs that required me to track my time.
I am salary and have to fill out a time sheet online. Previously I would just put in  put in 8 for every day and any holidays or pto. They decided that the really didn't need the time worked since I was salary and just to record any time off but I still had to approve it weekly.

So now most of the time I approve a blank time sheet.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: BlueHouse on January 14, 2021, 04:48:46 PM
I'm losing all interest in work and I'm almost to one year away from my RE planned date (was a stretch goal, but it's becoming clear that unless there's a major correction, I can do it quite comfortably). 
So I'm looking at moving my RE date earlier, but I'm hesitating and starting to think of all kinds of scenarios to walk away.  Most of them are to not say anything other than "need to focus on family". 

But today I started thinking that I'd like to tell the Security Officer (holds my clearance) that I plan to start consuming pot. 

That's it.  Just see what they do with the info.  HAHAHA  If I travel, I have to give them notice.  I really wonder what they would do if I called and said "I plan to start getting high on mm-dd-yyyy."  I wonder if they even have any procedure in place or if they would just be like "okay, thanks for letting us know"

Folks above me are probably rightly encouraging you not to do this, but I am saddened that none of them pointed out that this is freakin' hilarious. Thanks for giving me a big laugh as I start my day.

Thank you!  I found it hilarious mostly because I truly do not think they would do anything. I’m done. I’m not going back. I don’t care about burning bridges (although I don’t think it’s really burning bridges). Also, I’ve been so worried about what to tell them why I’m leaving (there will be questions and I don’t intend to tell them the truth) this oils be an easy way out. It’s not illegal so they can’t hold it against me and if I tell them in advance they must either act or accept.
I’m talking myself into it the more I think on it.

I’ve already told many people I work with that I intend to become a total stoner once I retire. I don’t think anyone actually believes me because I’m incredibly square.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: NorCal on January 14, 2021, 05:21:00 PM
I'm losing all interest in work and I'm almost to one year away from my RE planned date (was a stretch goal, but it's becoming clear that unless there's a major correction, I can do it quite comfortably). 
So I'm looking at moving my RE date earlier, but I'm hesitating and starting to think of all kinds of scenarios to walk away.  Most of them are to not say anything other than "need to focus on family". 

But today I started thinking that I'd like to tell the Security Officer (holds my clearance) that I plan to start consuming pot. 

That's it.  Just see what they do with the info.  HAHAHA  If I travel, I have to give them notice.  I really wonder what they would do if I called and said "I plan to start getting high on mm-dd-yyyy."  I wonder if they even have any procedure in place or if they would just be like "okay, thanks for letting us know"

Folks above me are probably rightly encouraging you not to do this, but I am saddened that none of them pointed out that this is freakin' hilarious. Thanks for giving me a big laugh as I start my day.

Thank you!  I found it hilarious mostly because I truly do not think they would do anything. I’m done. I’m not going back. I don’t care about burning bridges (although I don’t think it’s really burning bridges). Also, I’ve been so worried about what to tell them why I’m leaving (there will be questions and I don’t intend to tell them the truth) this oils be an easy way out. It’s not illegal so they can’t hold it against me and if I tell them in advance they must either act or accept.
I’m talking myself into it the more I think on it.

I’ve already told many people I work with that I intend to become a total stoner once I retire. I don’t think anyone actually believes me because I’m incredibly square.

As a former member of the military, I strongly encourage this approach on the condition that you retell the actual events here.

They always tell you that it's better to be completely honest about these things than have something to be blackmailed over, right?
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Glenstache on January 14, 2021, 06:49:39 PM
I'm losing all interest in work and I'm almost to one year away from my RE planned date (was a stretch goal, but it's becoming clear that unless there's a major correction, I can do it quite comfortably). 
So I'm looking at moving my RE date earlier, but I'm hesitating and starting to think of all kinds of scenarios to walk away.  Most of them are to not say anything other than "need to focus on family". 

But today I started thinking that I'd like to tell the Security Officer (holds my clearance) that I plan to start consuming pot. 

That's it.  Just see what they do with the info.  HAHAHA  If I travel, I have to give them notice.  I really wonder what they would do if I called and said "I plan to start getting high on mm-dd-yyyy."  I wonder if they even have any procedure in place or if they would just be like "okay, thanks for letting us know"

Folks above me are probably rightly encouraging you not to do this, but I am saddened that none of them pointed out that this is freakin' hilarious. Thanks for giving me a big laugh as I start my day.

Thank you!  I found it hilarious mostly because I truly do not think they would do anything. I’m done. I’m not going back. I don’t care about burning bridges (although I don’t think it’s really burning bridges). Also, I’ve been so worried about what to tell them why I’m leaving (there will be questions and I don’t intend to tell them the truth) this oils be an easy way out. It’s not illegal so they can’t hold it against me and if I tell them in advance they must either act or accept.
I’m talking myself into it the more I think on it.

I’ve already told many people I work with that I intend to become a total stoner once I retire. I don’t think anyone actually believes me because I’m incredibly square.
I had applied for a DC job at one point that included a pretty intensive background check. There was a fun moment where I was on a polygraph with a crew-cut wearing DOD operator asking me to describe exactly how much pot I had smoked while in college in Santa Cruz, just for the record. We agreed on a rough estimate based on number of days as an acceptable answer.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: jeninco on January 14, 2021, 09:02:17 PM
I'm losing all interest in work and I'm almost to one year away from my RE planned date (was a stretch goal, but it's becoming clear that unless there's a major correction, I can do it quite comfortably). 
So I'm looking at moving my RE date earlier, but I'm hesitating and starting to think of all kinds of scenarios to walk away.  Most of them are to not say anything other than "need to focus on family". 

But today I started thinking that I'd like to tell the Security Officer (holds my clearance) that I plan to start consuming pot. 

That's it.  Just see what they do with the info.  HAHAHA  If I travel, I have to give them notice.  I really wonder what they would do if I called and said "I plan to start getting high on mm-dd-yyyy."  I wonder if they even have any procedure in place or if they would just be like "okay, thanks for letting us know"

Folks above me are probably rightly encouraging you not to do this, but I am saddened that none of them pointed out that this is freakin' hilarious. Thanks for giving me a big laugh as I start my day.

Thank you!  I found it hilarious mostly because I truly do not think they would do anything. I’m done. I’m not going back. I don’t care about burning bridges (although I don’t think it’s really burning bridges). Also, I’ve been so worried about what to tell them why I’m leaving (there will be questions and I don’t intend to tell them the truth) this oils be an easy way out. It’s not illegal so they can’t hold it against me and if I tell them in advance they must either act or accept.
I’m talking myself into it the more I think on it.

I’ve already told many people I work with that I intend to become a total stoner once I retire. I don’t think anyone actually believes me because I’m incredibly square.
I had applied for a DC job at one point that included a pretty intensive background check. There was a fun moment where I was on a polygraph with a crew-cut wearing DOD operator asking me to describe exactly how much pot I had smoked while in college in Santa Cruz, just for the record. We agreed on a rough estimate based on number of days as an acceptable answer.

A friend of mine who worked for decades at DoD said that the key word to use was "experimental". Which, of course, led to a discussion of just how long/how many times could be considered an experiment. ("I wanted to get a statistically significant result!")
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: LennStar on January 15, 2021, 04:04:45 AM
Those are both epic stories, @Alternatepriorities, but, at the same time, I'm kind of scandalized that someone who doesn't have the cognitive capacity to sell her house can still be foreclosed on. In your case, you and your brother were clearly acting in the best interest of your relatives, but it's easy to imagine a similar scenario in which the sons buy the mother's foreclosed house, evict her, and flip it for a quick profit

Well she hadn’t been paying the mortgage in months by that point and didn’t have any money to pay it with. I can’t really fault the bank for moving to foreclose.
I can see that. In a situation where the bank didn't know you and your brother and your mother, hopefully there would have been some mechanism to appoint someone independent to act on behalf of your mother.

Quote
Though even at 25 I knew enough to tell her to pay the mortgage rather than any other debts she had. She wouldn’t listen though and it probably would have backfired anyway. Even without a mortgage she was in bankruptcy when she passed. The part I found most scandalous was the number of new credit applications she was receiving while in bankruptcy. A dozen or more arrived in the two weeks between her death and when we cancelled her mail. The bankruptcy was dismissed (not sure of the legal term) after i showed her public aid that she had less that $500 in assets when she died. I never did find out her total debt. Very thankful to live in a time and place where debts are not passed on the children.
Scandalous indeed.  I hope it was predators like that who got stuck with your mother's debt.
Reading that again I had a new thought: What if the mother had gotten the credits a few weeks before she dies.
I don't know how it is in the US, but in Germany you can gift/endowment (whats the English legal term?) up to 400K/decade for a child without paying taxes (talk about "You can't give poor/unemployed free money or they will stop working/search for new work!!!" never again please).
Your mothers gifts you that sum and dies.
You refuse the inheritance (and such the debt).
You have the money, the predators the middle finger. Sounds good if you ask me!


Quote
There was a fun moment where I was on a polygraph
Fortunately such unworking toothsayer's equipment is illegal here.
It's hard to find a red flag for a working place that's bigger than that. Except you want a job writing horoscopes maybe.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Imma on January 15, 2021, 06:23:23 AM
@LennStar in NL all gifts made in the 180 days before death are considered to be part of the inheritance, exactly to avoid the scenario where people give away all their assets and keep the debts.

Lots of people start to give away money to their children starting when they are about retirement age. That way the assets will be mostly gone by the time a person dies.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: ScreamingHeadGuy on January 15, 2021, 07:54:26 PM
This started off innocently enough with an email to my supervisor:

"Just a reminder I’m off on Monday 1/18." (Recall this is MLK Jr. Day - a federally recognized holiday.)

It quickly escalated with his reply:

"(ScreamingHeadGuy),

This is getting ridiculous, when do you intend to put in 40 hours a week?
You had off yesterday Sick and now Monday off."

It is true - I did take a sick day yesterday.  But what does it matter that I have a sick day and then take a regularly scheduled vacation (which I'm probably now going to use sick time for instead just to poke the wound) the next week?  So I jumped the shark with my reply:

(Supervisor),

If you are unhappy with my performance as an employee of (firm's long formal name - like when your mom yells at you using your middle name you know it's serious) I suggest you bring the matter to the attention of HR so as to draft a separation agreement which protects the interests of (acronym for firm)and myself.  In that agreement I would expect:

(list of 17 items firm and/or I would do as part of agreement - mostly stolen from a former co-worker's agreement which I had obtained a copy of)

I’d propose the “end of employment” date be between 2/19 and 3/5, which should provide for adequate time to transfer projects over.  This also would allow me a reasonable time to begin (and maybe finish) a search for a new job and possibly altogether avoid needing to apply for unemployment.

If you so choose to end this professional relationship I’d like to thank you for the time we’ve spent working together.  Either way I’ll check back with you on Tuesday."

Part of that is a bald-faced lie - I'm not going to seriously look for another job and I'm just trying to string-out employment as long as I can to cram my 401(k) as full as I can for the year; because of that I'm not going to file an unemployment claim - but my firm doesn't need to know that.  Besides if they think I'm headed to a competitor they're more likely to pay me to go away quietly and keep my mouth shut afterwards. 
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: solon on January 15, 2021, 08:26:36 PM
I'd like to know what the 17 items are.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: DaMa on January 15, 2021, 08:35:49 PM
@ScreamingHeadGuy, I think this is my favorite FU story so far.  LOVE it!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: markbike528CBX on January 15, 2021, 09:44:10 PM
I'd like to know what the 17 items are.
Hear, Hear, President Wilson only had 14 points to reorganize all of Europe.  https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fourteen_Points
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: 2sk22 on January 16, 2021, 03:53:24 AM
@ScreamingHeadGuy Now we really need to know what happened after you sent this epic email!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: RWTL on January 16, 2021, 05:06:40 AM
@ScreamingHeadGuy Now we really need to know what happened after you sent this epic email!

Love it.  Me too.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: former player on January 16, 2021, 05:26:13 AM
@ScreamingHeadGuy Now we really need to know what happened after you sent this epic email!

Love it.  Me too.
I hope we'll find out on Tuesday, but it's possible ScreamingHeadGuy will be too busy to post.  I'm sure it will be good when he does.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Emerald on January 19, 2021, 08:28:22 AM
@ScreamingHeadGuy Now we really need to know what happened after you sent this epic email!

Love it.  Me too.
I hope we'll find out on Tuesday, but it's possible ScreamingHeadGuy will be too busy to post.  I'm sure it will be good when he does.

I've been hanging out in this thread just waiting for an update.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: ScreamingHeadGuy on January 20, 2021, 07:13:38 PM
I'd like to know what the 17 items are.

Nothing out of the ordinary - it's pretty much standard stuff (from what I've seen of other agreements). 

Firm would: pay me 8 weeks' salary as severance, continue to award PTO until my end of employment, payout all accumulated PTO at end of employment, extend health insurance coverage to last day of month my employment ends, immediately provide letter with date of end of health insurance coverage.

I would: waive any claims against firm, waive any bonus firm issues, return any office equipment firm wants, agree not to disparage firm, not share confidential information, not share trade secrets. 

Note: I specifically did leave out "not contact firm's clients" because I want to use that as leverage if they think I'm looking to poach clients when I move to a competitor.

As of yet my supervisor has only sent one email with the gist of "I'll get back to you after I talk to HR."  Given the pace of our not-in-house HR department this could mean I'm cut loose tomorrow or in six weeks from Friday.  Either way is fine with me, as long as they pay up. 
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: solon on January 21, 2021, 09:13:30 AM
I'd like to know what the 17 items are.

Nothing out of the ordinary - it's pretty much standard stuff (from what I've seen of other agreements). 

Firm would: pay me 8 weeks' salary as severance, continue to award PTO until my end of employment, payout all accumulated PTO at end of employment, extend health insurance coverage to last day of month my employment ends, immediately provide letter with date of end of health insurance coverage.

I would: waive any claims against firm, waive any bonus firm issues, return any office equipment firm wants, agree not to disparage firm, not share confidential information, not share trade secrets. 

Note: I specifically did leave out "not contact firm's clients" because I want to use that as leverage if they think I'm looking to poach clients when I move to a competitor.

As of yet my supervisor has only sent one email with the gist of "I'll get back to you after I talk to HR."  Given the pace of our not-in-house HR department this could mean I'm cut loose tomorrow or in six weeks from Friday.  Either way is fine with me, as long as they pay up.

Cool. I'm going to work some of these into future contracts. And good luck with your transition!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: SKL-HOU on January 22, 2021, 02:52:28 PM
I'd like to know what the 17 items are.

Nothing out of the ordinary - it's pretty much standard stuff (from what I've seen of other agreements). 

Firm would: pay me 8 weeks' salary as severance, continue to award PTO until my end of employment, payout all accumulated PTO at end of employment, extend health insurance coverage to last day of month my employment ends, immediately provide letter with date of end of health insurance coverage.

I would: waive any claims against firm, waive any bonus firm issues, return any office equipment firm wants, agree not to disparage firm, not share confidential information, not share trade secrets. 

Note: I specifically did leave out "not contact firm's clients" because I want to use that as leverage if they think I'm looking to poach clients when I move to a competitor.

As of yet my supervisor has only sent one email with the gist of "I'll get back to you after I talk to HR."  Given the pace of our not-in-house HR department this could mean I'm cut loose tomorrow or in six weeks from Friday.  Either way is fine with me, as long as they pay up.

I saw on another thread that you were done. So did you get anything you asked for?
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: ScreamingHeadGuy on January 22, 2021, 02:55:10 PM
I'd like to know what the 17 items are.

Nothing out of the ordinary - it's pretty much standard stuff (from what I've seen of other agreements). 

Firm would: pay me 8 weeks' salary as severance, continue to award PTO until my end of employment, payout all accumulated PTO at end of employment, extend health insurance coverage to last day of month my employment ends, immediately provide letter with date of end of health insurance coverage.

I would: waive any claims against firm, waive any bonus firm issues, return any office equipment firm wants, agree not to disparage firm, not share confidential information, not share trade secrets. 

Note: I specifically did leave out "not contact firm's clients" because I want to use that as leverage if they think I'm looking to poach clients when I move to a competitor.

As of yet my supervisor has only sent one email with the gist of "I'll get back to you after I talk to HR."  Given the pace of our not-in-house HR department this could mean I'm cut loose tomorrow or in six weeks from Friday.  Either way is fine with me, as long as they pay up.

I saw on another thread that you were done. So did you get anything you asked for?

I might be contractually obligated to not discuss whether or not I have agreed to a separation package.  Maybe sorry for that. 
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: achvfi on January 22, 2021, 02:57:08 PM
I might be contractually obligated to not discuss whether or not I have agreed to a separation package.  Maybe sorry for that. 

Cool! Sounds good to me :)
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Dicey on January 22, 2021, 03:29:30 PM
I'd like to know what the 17 items are.

Nothing out of the ordinary - it's pretty much standard stuff (from what I've seen of other agreements). 

Firm would: pay me 8 weeks' salary as severance, continue to award PTO until my end of employment, payout all accumulated PTO at end of employment, extend health insurance coverage to last day of month my employment ends, immediately provide letter with date of end of health insurance coverage.

I would: waive any claims against firm, waive any bonus firm issues, return any office equipment firm wants, agree not to disparage firm, not share confidential information, not share trade secrets. 

Note: I specifically did leave out "not contact firm's clients" because I want to use that as leverage if they think I'm looking to poach clients when I move to a competitor.

As of yet my supervisor has only sent one email with the gist of "I'll get back to you after I talk to HR."  Given the pace of our not-in-house HR department this could mean I'm cut loose tomorrow or in six weeks from Friday.  Either way is fine with me, as long as they pay up.

I saw on another thread that you were done. So did you get anything you asked for?

I might be contractually obligated to not discuss whether or not I have agreed to a separation package.  Maybe sorry for that.
For how long?
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Chris Pascale on January 22, 2021, 06:44:44 PM
I might be contractually obligated to not discuss whether or not I have agreed to a separation package.  Maybe sorry for that. 

Cool! Sounds good to me :)

Wow, so your name really is Screaming Head Guy.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: talltexan on January 27, 2021, 11:26:07 AM
His parents gave him "Head" for the middle name because of family tradition.

Otherwise, could have been Screaming James Guy.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: asauer on February 26, 2021, 10:49:35 AM
I posted over in Bad Assity but someone suggested I post over here as well.  Yesterday I quit my incredibly toxic job.  It's been pretty bad for 3 years (since my hiring manager left and the CEO put his BFF who got fired from another org in place).  But, the last 4 months have been horrific, it's really affecting my mental health.  As an example of the kind of guy he is- he is the Chief HR Officer and this summer said "We should have a fried chicken food truck and a bunch of watermelon this week for our (mostly black) employee population because 'those people like that kind of thing'.  Seriously, you can't make this shit up.

In November was 'offered' a promotion- in reality I was  told I would be in a new role that was recently vacated.  Not only was I told that I would be in this VP role, but would also keep my old job so now I have 2 50 hour/ week jobs.  And they didn't want to pay me more.  Rather, I would be 'on a path' to more comp.  No.  Fucking.  Way.  So, I negotiated 20k more $ and actually got it b/c I appealed to HR regarding internal comp equity.  Then they dumped a client on me that is both verbally and emotionally abusive.  I don't mean 'difficult'.  I've dealt with that for a long time but this is actually abusive.  I reported her behaviors several times and the org refused to investigate (counter to federal law).  On top of that my boss kept saying 'What did I give you an extra 20k for if you can't handle a tough client?!"  Well, fuck them.  I don't need that.  Nothing is worth my mental health.

So in my mind I set an April 1 leave date.  We're nearly FI so I have a good runway.  I then reached out to someone who approached me for a contract role a few months ago.  They were still looking so I signed and quit.  I'll start with them on March 15th and the contract will take me all the way to my FIRE date in Feb 2022.  Leadership was totally floored when I resigned and started panicking over an upcoming big important meeting with the shit client. They wanted me to still attend.  I said nopey nope nope.  If they want to cut my notice short, fine with me.

I'm excited about the new job.  I get to approach it as mostly fun and temporary.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Dicey on February 26, 2021, 11:53:13 AM
Good for you @asauer! Enjoy what comes next.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Tinker on February 26, 2021, 12:03:00 PM
If they want to cut my notice short, fine with me.
The last threat/ultimatum of desperate management, "we're going to make you miss these last 2 weeks of pay!" is really just a relieved "oh god, thank you so much!" when you quit for FU reasons
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Much Fishing to Do on February 26, 2021, 12:05:37 PM
I posted over in Bad Assity but someone suggested I post over here as well.  Yesterday I quit my incredibly toxic job.  It's been pretty bad for 3 years (since my hiring manager left and the CEO put his BFF who got fired from another org in place).  But, the last 4 months have been horrific, it's really affecting my mental health.  As an example of the kind of guy he is- he is the Chief HR Officer and this summer said "We should have a fried chicken food truck and a bunch of watermelon this week for our (mostly black) employee population because 'those people like that kind of thing'.  Seriously, you can't make this shit up.

In November was 'offered' a promotion- in reality I was  told I would be in a new role that was recently vacated.  Not only was I told that I would be in this VP role, but would also keep my old job so now I have 2 50 hour/ week jobs.  And they didn't want to pay me more.  Rather, I would be 'on a path' to more comp.  No.  Fucking.  Way.  So, I negotiated 20k more $ and actually got it b/c I appealed to HR regarding internal comp equity.  Then they dumped a client on me that is both verbally and emotionally abusive.  I don't mean 'difficult'.  I've dealt with that for a long time but this is actually abusive.  I reported her behaviors several times and the org refused to investigate (counter to federal law).  On top of that my boss kept saying 'What did I give you an extra 20k for if you can't handle a tough client?!"  Well, fuck them.  I don't need that.  Nothing is worth my mental health.

So in my mind I set an April 1 leave date.  We're nearly FI so I have a good runway.  I then reached out to someone who approached me for a contract role a few months ago.  They were still looking so I signed and quit.  I'll start with them on March 15th and the contract will take me all the way to my FIRE date in Feb 2022.  Leadership was totally floored when I resigned and started panicking over an upcoming big important meeting with the shit client. They wanted me to still attend.  I said nopey nope nope.  If they want to cut my notice short, fine with me.

I'm excited about the new job.  I get to approach it as mostly fun and temporary.

Good for you, there is no way someone even just halfway to FI should deal with that for more than a month before just moving on. 

"nearly FI", or someone who plans to just work one more year, is practically speaking the same as FI unless there is some golden handcuff situation (a pension starting or something), so you can ditch this new job as well if its not interesting and healthy (i.e. there's no way you can really count on being in better shape to RE in a year than right now, given the market can certainly correct faster than you can earn money at this point, so you're already day to day IMO).  Congrats.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: markbike528CBX on February 26, 2021, 12:06:49 PM
Good for you @asauer! Enjoy what comes next.
Definitely meets the EPIC FU money story criteria!   Sometimes I wish I had a good story, but tales like yours are a good reason to only experience FU Money vicariously.
Awesome move!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Much Fishing to Do on February 26, 2021, 12:06:57 PM
If they want to cut my notice short, fine with me.
The last threat/ultimatum of desperate management, "we're going to make you miss these last 2 weeks of pay!" is really just a relieved "oh god, thank you so much!" when you quit for FU reasons
yeah, there's absolutely no way I'd give them the two weeks anyway, you've got another job starting soon, take the time off instead.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: 2sk22 on February 26, 2021, 12:07:52 PM
So in my mind I set an April 1 leave date.  We're nearly FI so I have a good runway.  I then reached out to someone who approached me for a contract role a few months ago.  They were still looking so I signed and quit.  I'll start with them on March 15th and the contract will take me all the way to my FIRE date in Feb 2022.  Leadership was totally floored when I resigned and started panicking over an upcoming big important meeting with the shit client. They wanted me to still attend.  I said nopey nope nope.  If they want to cut my notice short, fine with me.

I'm excited about the new job.  I get to approach it as mostly fun and temporary.

Excellent! Definitely belongs in the hall of fame among these stories!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: alcon835 on February 26, 2021, 12:55:08 PM
Congratulations! What a terrible situation. This is another reminder of the power and importance of FU money. If the situation is good, you don't need it. But if the situation is bad, you have the freedom to walk away and they can't abuse or manipulate you into it anymore.

I get so much enjoyment when people are blown away that someone doesn't need a job. "Yes, I have enough money to live for a very long time without a job, thank you very much. I don't need to cower before you..."
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: maisymouser on February 26, 2021, 01:41:54 PM
Every time I hear one of these truly badass quitting stories, this quote comes to mind...

Seriously, congratulations! I can't imagine being in that position at work, FU money or no.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: ScreamingHeadGuy on February 26, 2021, 03:43:30 PM
Fuck yes @asauer !
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: BlueHouse on February 26, 2021, 07:18:11 PM
I said nopey nope nope. 

I feel like that should be your motto!  Congrats @asauer
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: asauer on February 28, 2021, 04:47:20 AM
I said nopey nope nope. 

I feel like that should be your motto!  Congrats @asauer
You better believe it! 😆
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: asauer on February 28, 2021, 04:53:05 AM
If they want to cut my notice short, fine with me.
The last threat/ultimatum of desperate management, "we're going to make you miss these last 2 weeks of pay!" is really just a relieved "oh god, thank you so much!" when you quit for FU reasons

Exactly.  FI means never having to grovel.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: BlueHouse on March 01, 2021, 07:23:06 AM
I don't think I ever followed up to provide all the gory details of my epic FU money story. 

I did give notice, I'm 5 days away from my last day, and although I've had hundreds of daydreams over the past decade about how it would actually happen, the most epic thing about it (to me) was that it wasn't epic at all.  Funny enough, once I ended up being secure enough in my finances, I didn't need any outrageous exit strategy.  Even now, as I'm thinking "oh, you know what someone should really do in that department"?  I write half an email to start it, then I delete it and say "fuck it...why should I care".  To me, that's the most epic thing of all.  Not letting them have any space in my head any more.  I still have people that call me on weekends (WEEKENDS) to vent about work problems.  I know it will eventually taper off, but should I just cut it off cold turkey?  These aren't "friends".  These are people who have and could directly affect my past and future earnings. 

Sorry it's not entertaining at all, but it actually feels better to me than anything with drama. 

oh, and to follow up with the previous pot-smoking thing.  Yes, I've told a few people who have asked "what are you gonna do on day1?"  that I'm gonna get high, but they don't believe it (and neither do I).  They just laugh.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: 2sk22 on March 01, 2021, 07:33:50 AM
...
didn't need any outrageous exit strategy.  Even now, as I'm thinking "oh, you know what someone should really do in that department"?  I write half an email to start it, then I delete it and say "fuck it...why should I care".  To me, that's the most epic thing of all.  Not letting them have any space in my head any more.  I still have people that call me on weekends (WEEKENDS) to vent about work problems.  I know it will eventually taper off, but
...

Hah - its more than 18 months since I quit from a megacorp and, occasionally, there are still times when I start composing emails in my mind about everything that was broken :-)

Getting the company out of your head is a slow process.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: BuffaloStache on March 01, 2021, 08:22:34 AM
...
I still have people that call me on weekends (WEEKENDS) to vent about work problems.  I know it will eventually taper off, but should I just cut it off cold turkey?  These aren't "friends". These are people who have and could directly affect my past and future earnings
...

If they aren't friends or people you are friendly with, then I think it's fine to cut cold turkey if you feel inclined to. But the "could directly affect my future earnings" statement caught my attention... How? Are you relying on the company to do well to pay you a pension? Or is there some other deferred compensation package you are looking at?

The other aspect to think about here is the entertainment value. It's dark, but sometimes it could give you entertainment/provide even more vindication to hear that the environment still sucks.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: lhamo on March 01, 2021, 08:55:20 AM
...
didn't need any outrageous exit strategy.  Even now, as I'm thinking "oh, you know what someone should really do in that department"?  I write half an email to start it, then I delete it and say "fuck it...why should I care".  To me, that's the most epic thing of all.  Not letting them have any space in my head any more.  I still have people that call me on weekends (WEEKENDS) to vent about work problems.  I know it will eventually taper off, but
...

Hah - its more than 18 months since I quit from a megacorp and, occasionally, there are still times when I start composing emails in my mind about everything that was broken :-)

Getting the company out of your head is a slow process.

It gets easier with time.  I am 5+ years out from my last day at old org.   I got a message out of the blue a couple of weeks ago -- the guy they hired in over my head is leaving and they were wondering if I'd come back.  Took me about 3 seconds to nope out of that one.  My Inner Bag Lady did keep whispering in my ear "but the money!" over the next few hours/days, but I have learned to ignore her.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: asauer on March 01, 2021, 09:09:12 AM

 Not letting them have any space in my head any more. 


This! I think we never realize how much real estate work and work people take up in our brain until we give the eviction notice.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Shane on March 01, 2021, 11:13:27 AM
I don't think I ever followed up to provide all the gory details of my epic FU money story. 

I did give notice, I'm 5 days away from my last day, and although I've had hundreds of daydreams over the past decade about how it would actually happen, the most epic thing about it (to me) was that it wasn't epic at all.  Funny enough, once I ended up being secure enough in my finances, I didn't need any outrageous exit strategy.  Even now, as I'm thinking "oh, you know what someone should really do in that department"?  I write half an email to start it, then I delete it and say "fuck it...why should I care".  To me, that's the most epic thing of all.  Not letting them have any space in my head any more.  I still have people that call me on weekends (WEEKENDS) to vent about work problems.  I know it will eventually taper off, but should I just cut it off cold turkey?  These aren't "friends".  These are people who have and could directly affect my past and future earnings. 

Sorry it's not entertaining at all, but it actually feels better to me than anything with drama. 

oh, and to follow up with the previous pot-smoking thing.  Yes, I've told a few people who have asked "what are you gonna do on day1?"  that I'm gonna get high, but they don't believe it (and neither do I).  They just laugh.
Are you, for some reason, not able to get high now? Like, does your employer drug test you? Cannabis is legal is D.C., now, right? Since we FIRED, and especially since Covid started, I've been smoking a lot more weed than I ever did while working, mostly because I've got the free time, and fewer responsibilities. It feels like I'm a teenager again.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: mm1970 on March 01, 2021, 06:45:22 PM
totally epic
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Sibley on March 02, 2021, 07:59:58 AM
I don't think I ever followed up to provide all the gory details of my epic FU money story. 

I did give notice, I'm 5 days away from my last day, and although I've had hundreds of daydreams over the past decade about how it would actually happen, the most epic thing about it (to me) was that it wasn't epic at all.  Funny enough, once I ended up being secure enough in my finances, I didn't need any outrageous exit strategy.  Even now, as I'm thinking "oh, you know what someone should really do in that department"?  I write half an email to start it, then I delete it and say "fuck it...why should I care".  To me, that's the most epic thing of all.  Not letting them have any space in my head any more.  I still have people that call me on weekends (WEEKENDS) to vent about work problems.  I know it will eventually taper off, but should I just cut it off cold turkey?  These aren't "friends".  These are people who have and could directly affect my past and future earnings. 

Sorry it's not entertaining at all, but it actually feels better to me than anything with drama. 

oh, and to follow up with the previous pot-smoking thing.  Yes, I've told a few people who have asked "what are you gonna do on day1?"  that I'm gonna get high, but they don't believe it (and neither do I).  They just laugh.
Are you, for some reason, not able to get high now? Like, does your employer drug test you? Cannabis is legal is D.C., now, right? Since we FIRED, and especially since Covid started, I've been smoking a lot more weed than I ever did while working, mostly because I've got the free time, and fewer responsibilities. It feels like I'm a teenager again.

There are other reasons someone may choose to not partake in weed. And those reasons are perfectly valid, acceptable, and should be respected.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: RetiredAt63 on March 02, 2021, 09:06:26 AM
I don't think I ever followed up to provide all the gory details of my epic FU money story. 

I did give notice, I'm 5 days away from my last day, and although I've had hundreds of daydreams over the past decade about how it would actually happen, the most epic thing about it (to me) was that it wasn't epic at all.  Funny enough, once I ended up being secure enough in my finances, I didn't need any outrageous exit strategy.  Even now, as I'm thinking "oh, you know what someone should really do in that department"?  I write half an email to start it, then I delete it and say "fuck it...why should I care".  To me, that's the most epic thing of all.  Not letting them have any space in my head any more.  I still have people that call me on weekends (WEEKENDS) to vent about work problems.  I know it will eventually taper off, but should I just cut it off cold turkey?  These aren't "friends".  These are people who have and could directly affect my past and future earnings. 

Sorry it's not entertaining at all, but it actually feels better to me than anything with drama. 

oh, and to follow up with the previous pot-smoking thing.  Yes, I've told a few people who have asked "what are you gonna do on day1?"  that I'm gonna get high, but they don't believe it (and neither do I).  They just laugh.
Are you, for some reason, not able to get high now? Like, does your employer drug test you? Cannabis is legal is D.C., now, right? Since we FIRED, and especially since Covid started, I've been smoking a lot more weed than I ever did while working, mostly because I've got the free time, and fewer responsibilities. It feels like I'm a teenager again.

There are other reasons someone may choose to not partake in weed. And those reasons are perfectly valid, acceptable, and should be respected.

Some of us don't want the smoke in our lungs.  Some of us just aren't interested.  Just like some of us don't smoke/chew tobacco.  Or drink alcohol.  The opportunity to do something doesn't imply everyone will want to do it.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Sugaree on March 02, 2021, 10:34:57 AM
Every time I hear one of these truly badass quitting stories, this quote comes to mind...

Seriously, congratulations! I can't imagine being in that position at work, FU money or no.

I feel this in my soul right now.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Shane on March 02, 2021, 12:37:36 PM
I don't think I ever followed up to provide all the gory details of my epic FU money story. 

I did give notice, I'm 5 days away from my last day, and although I've had hundreds of daydreams over the past decade about how it would actually happen, the most epic thing about it (to me) was that it wasn't epic at all.  Funny enough, once I ended up being secure enough in my finances, I didn't need any outrageous exit strategy.  Even now, as I'm thinking "oh, you know what someone should really do in that department"?  I write half an email to start it, then I delete it and say "fuck it...why should I care".  To me, that's the most epic thing of all.  Not letting them have any space in my head any more.  I still have people that call me on weekends (WEEKENDS) to vent about work problems.  I know it will eventually taper off, but should I just cut it off cold turkey?  These aren't "friends".  These are people who have and could directly affect my past and future earnings. 

Sorry it's not entertaining at all, but it actually feels better to me than anything with drama. 

oh, and to follow up with the previous pot-smoking thing.  Yes, I've told a few people who have asked "what are you gonna do on day1?"  that I'm gonna get high, but they don't believe it (and neither do I).  They just laugh.
Are you, for some reason, not able to get high now? Like, does your employer drug test you? Cannabis is legal is D.C., now, right? Since we FIRED, and especially since Covid started, I've been smoking a lot more weed than I ever did while working, mostly because I've got the free time, and fewer responsibilities. It feels like I'm a teenager again.

There are other reasons someone may choose to not partake in weed. And those reasons are perfectly valid, acceptable, and should be respected.

Some of us don't want the smoke in our lungs.  Some of us just aren't interested.  Just like some of us don't smoke/chew tobacco.  Or drink alcohol.  The opportunity to do something doesn't imply everyone will want to do it.
Of course, there are many possible valid reasons people might choose not to consume cannabis, lol. My only reason for asking was because BH sounded like they wanted to get high, but were not, for some reason...
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: RetiredAt63 on March 02, 2021, 12:55:53 PM
I don't think I ever followed up to provide all the gory details of my epic FU money story. 

I did give notice, I'm 5 days away from my last day, and although I've had hundreds of daydreams over the past decade about how it would actually happen, the most epic thing about it (to me) was that it wasn't epic at all.  Funny enough, once I ended up being secure enough in my finances, I didn't need any outrageous exit strategy.  Even now, as I'm thinking "oh, you know what someone should really do in that department"?  I write half an email to start it, then I delete it and say "fuck it...why should I care".  To me, that's the most epic thing of all.  Not letting them have any space in my head any more.  I still have people that call me on weekends (WEEKENDS) to vent about work problems.  I know it will eventually taper off, but should I just cut it off cold turkey?  These aren't "friends".  These are people who have and could directly affect my past and future earnings. 

Sorry it's not entertaining at all, but it actually feels better to me than anything with drama. 

oh, and to follow up with the previous pot-smoking thing.  Yes, I've told a few people who have asked "what are you gonna do on day1?"  that I'm gonna get high, but they don't believe it (and neither do I).  They just laugh.
Are you, for some reason, not able to get high now? Like, does your employer drug test you? Cannabis is legal is D.C., now, right? Since we FIRED, and especially since Covid started, I've been smoking a lot more weed than I ever did while working, mostly because I've got the free time, and fewer responsibilities. It feels like I'm a teenager again.

There are other reasons someone may choose to not partake in weed. And those reasons are perfectly valid, acceptable, and should be respected.

Some of us don't want the smoke in our lungs.  Some of us just aren't interested.  Just like some of us don't smoke/chew tobacco.  Or drink alcohol.  The opportunity to do something doesn't imply everyone will want to do it.
Of course, there are many possible valid reasons people might choose not to consume cannabis, lol. My only reason for asking was because BH sounded like they wanted to get high, but were not, for some reason...

Good point.  I know there are lots of times after a stressful event, or a hot day in the garden, I have said "I need a drink".  But not really or maybe yes but not with alcohol.  Or sometimes with alcohol. It all depends.  English is full of these not very definite (definitive?) phrases.    ;-)
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: RyanAtTanagra on March 02, 2021, 01:58:27 PM
What a world we live in now where people feel the need to defend their lack of pot use.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: gaja on March 02, 2021, 02:49:57 PM
I'm not using FU money at the current time, but I am spending some of my hard earned human capital. The second to the top boss is not doing a good job, and it is influencing my opportunity to do mine. So I am currently causing some noise within the organization, both through the top boss, and through the HSA/union. Will be very interesting to see how this turns out. I'm quite hard to fire, so I doubt it has any large consequences. Might influence an upcoming promotion, might get some more backlash in my everyday work. If it gets too bad, I can get a new job in a few days, or take some months off and do nothing.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: frugalecon on March 02, 2021, 04:12:03 PM
I posted over in Bad Assity...

So in my mind I set an April 1 leave date.  We're nearly FI so I have a good runway.  I then reached out to someone who approached me for a contract role a few months ago.  They were still looking so I signed and quit.  I'll start with them on March 15th and the contract will take me all the way to my FIRE date in Feb 2022.  Leadership was totally floored when I resigned and started panicking over an upcoming big important meeting with the shit client. They wanted me to still attend.  I said nopey nope nope.  If they want to cut my notice short, fine with me.

I'm excited about the new job.  I get to approach it as mostly fun and temporary.

Reading this post, I thought how awesome it would be to print up t-shirts that read: “Nopey Nope Nope” and start wearing them to work in the week or so before giving notice. Or heck, once you get to FI and just want to mess with people. When someone asked you to do something unreasonable, could just point to the shirt.

Sorry, I am having a shit week at work, so this is making me fantasize about what could be very soon...
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: frugalecon on March 02, 2021, 05:48:55 PM
I posted over in Bad Assity...

So in my mind I set an April 1 leave date.  We're nearly FI so I have a good runway.  I then reached out to someone who approached me for a contract role a few months ago.  They were still looking so I signed and quit.  I'll start with them on March 15th and the contract will take me all the way to my FIRE date in Feb 2022.  Leadership was totally floored when I resigned and started panicking over an upcoming big important meeting with the shit client. They wanted me to still attend.  I said nopey nope nope.  If they want to cut my notice short, fine with me.

I'm excited about the new job.  I get to approach it as mostly fun and temporary.

Reading this post, I thought how awesome it would be to print up t-shirts that read: “Nopey Nope Nope” and start wearing them to work in the week or so before giving notice. Or heck, once you get to FI and just want to mess with people. When someone asked you to do something unreasonable, could just point to the shirt.

Sorry, I am having a shit week at work, so this is making me fantasize about what could be very soon...

Sorry, another thought. On the back of the T-shirt, it could read “What Part of ‘Nopey Nope Nope’ Don’t You Understand?” People could then ponder that while you are walking away from them.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Sandi_k on March 02, 2021, 08:25:53 PM
If I do something like Nopey Nope, it would be to get t-shirts made with this graphic:

Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: GreenToTheCore on March 02, 2021, 11:41:18 PM
heh heh, I keep thinking about the Nope cards in the game Exploding Kittens. My favorite is the Narnope.

(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/B-PHyh9CAAEZS_f.jpg)
(https://www.wordjoiner.co.nz/assets/uploads/Nope-576x675.jpg)
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: BlueHouse on March 03, 2021, 08:41:08 AM
...
I still have people that call me on weekends (WEEKENDS) to vent about work problems.  I know it will eventually taper off, but should I just cut it off cold turkey?  These aren't "friends". These are people who have and could directly affect my past and future earnings
...

If they aren't friends or people you are friendly with, then I think it's fine to cut cold turkey if you feel inclined to. But the "could directly affect my future earnings" statement caught my attention... How? Are you relying on the company to do well to pay you a pension? Or is there some other deferred compensation package you are looking at?

The other aspect to think about here is the entertainment value. It's dark, but sometimes it could give you entertainment/provide even more vindication to hear that the environment still sucks.
"Future Earnings"  Just in case I ever decide I need to work there again.  If I'm secure enough in my FI, then no...they really can't affect any future earnings.  Thanks for the reminder of that.  (YAY!)
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: BlueHouse on March 03, 2021, 08:47:53 AM


Are you, for some reason, not able to get high now? Like, does your employer drug test you? Cannabis is legal is D.C., now, right? Since we FIRED, and especially since Covid started, I've been smoking a lot more weed than I ever did while working, mostly because I've got the free time, and fewer responsibilities. It feels like I'm a teenager again.

I hold a clearance. 


There are other reasons someone may choose to not partake in weed. And those reasons are perfectly valid, acceptable, and should be respected.
I kind of want to partake, but I haven't always liked the feeling in the past.  If it will help make me mellower, then I'm all for it.  If there are some healing properties that I can use for anti-inflammation, I'll go there. 

Some of us don't want the smoke in our lungs.  Some of us just aren't interested.  Just like some of us don't smoke/chew tobacco.  Or drink alcohol.  The opportunity to do something doesn't imply everyone will want to do it.
I'm a former smoker, and I would loooooooovvvve to inhale again, but I won't because I'm afraid it would lead me back to cigarettes.  So if I do decide to partake, I will probably go with edibles of some sort. 
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: BlueHouse on March 03, 2021, 09:04:10 AM
heh heh, I keep thinking about the Nope cards in the game Exploding Kittens. My favorite is the Narnope.

(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/B-PHyh9CAAEZS_f.jpg)
(https://www.wordjoiner.co.nz/assets/uploads/Nope-576x675.jpg)

I may try to find this game, just so I can carry these cards around in my pocket and distribute freely.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Abe Froman on March 03, 2021, 09:18:21 AM
heh heh, I keep thinking about the Nope cards in the game Exploding Kittens. My favorite is the Narnope.

(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/B-PHyh9CAAEZS_f.jpg)
(https://www.wordjoiner.co.nz/assets/uploads/Nope-576x675.jpg)

I may try to find this game, just so I can carry these cards around in my pocket and distribute freely.

Our family LOVES this game. And it just got NUTS for us as we just included the expansion packs.
Matt Inman's comics are funny as hell - because it mixes a little vulgar humor with true knowledge and intelligence. Probably why The Simpsons writers have done so well for so long.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: RetiredAt63 on March 03, 2021, 09:19:06 AM
I'm a former smoker, and I would loooooooovvvve to inhale again, but I won't because I'm afraid it would lead me back to cigarettes.  So if I do decide to partake, I will probably go with edibles of some sort.

I always thought tobacco was the "gateway drug", not pot.  If you can smoke cigarettes you can smoke anything.   ;-)
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: BlueHouse on March 03, 2021, 09:34:49 AM
I'm a former smoker, and I would loooooooovvvve to inhale again, but I won't because I'm afraid it would lead me back to cigarettes.  So if I do decide to partake, I will probably go with edibles of some sort.

I always thought tobacco was the "gateway drug", not pot.  If you can smoke cigarettes you can smoke anything.   ;-)
haha  yeah.  But the feeling of inhaling deeply was also addicting.  I do not ever want to do that again (other than for fresh clean air) because I cannot be trusted not to jump back to cigs.  God they're just awful.  It's been over 20 years since I quit and I still fear the hold they had on me.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Alternatepriorities on March 03, 2021, 10:02:44 AM
I'm a former smoker, and I would loooooooovvvve to inhale again, but I won't because I'm afraid it would lead me back to cigarettes.  So if I do decide to partake, I will probably go with edibles of some sort.

I always thought tobacco was the "gateway drug", not pot.  If you can smoke cigarettes you can smoke anything.   ;-)
haha  yeah.  But the feeling of inhaling deeply was also addicting.  I do not ever want to do that again (other than for fresh clean air) because I cannot be trusted not to jump back to cigs.  God they're just awful.  It's been over 20 years since I quit and I still fear the hold they had on me.

Congratulations on quitting. My father has never been able to despite walking away from Alcohol and a couple of "harder" drugs cold turkey more that 35 years ago... He's tried numerous times to quit smoking and even managed for a few days at a time, but it never sticks. Probably the primary reason I've never had any interest in smoking anything...
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: AO1FireTo on March 03, 2021, 11:22:26 AM
I'm a former smoker, and I would loooooooovvvve to inhale again, but I won't because I'm afraid it would lead me back to cigarettes.  So if I do decide to partake, I will probably go with edibles of some sort.

I always thought tobacco was the "gateway drug", not pot.  If you can smoke cigarettes you can smoke anything.   ;-)
haha  yeah.  But the feeling of inhaling deeply was also addicting.  I do not ever want to do that again (other than for fresh clean air) because I cannot be trusted not to jump back to cigs.  God they're just awful.  It's been over 20 years since I quit and I still fear the hold they had on me.

Congratulations on quitting. My father has never been able to despite walking away from Alcohol and a couple of "harder" drugs cold turkey more that 35 years ago... He's tried numerous times to quit smoking and even managed for a few days at a time, but it never sticks. Probably the primary reason I've never had any interest in smoking anything...

Seeing my grandfather die from emphysema when I was a kid killed any desire I had to smoke.  He couldn't even walk across the room without stopping to catch his breath.  He made me promise to never smoke, and I'm so glad I kept that promise.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: former player on March 03, 2021, 11:53:45 AM
I'm a former smoker, and I would loooooooovvvve to inhale again, but I won't because I'm afraid it would lead me back to cigarettes.  So if I do decide to partake, I will probably go with edibles of some sort.

I always thought tobacco was the "gateway drug", not pot.  If you can smoke cigarettes you can smoke anything.   ;-)
haha  yeah.  But the feeling of inhaling deeply was also addicting.  I do not ever want to do that again (other than for fresh clean air) because I cannot be trusted not to jump back to cigs.  God they're just awful.  It's been over 20 years since I quit and I still fear the hold they had on me.

Congratulations on quitting. My father has never been able to despite walking away from Alcohol and a couple of "harder" drugs cold turkey more that 35 years ago... He's tried numerous times to quit smoking and even managed for a few days at a time, but it never sticks. Probably the primary reason I've never had any interest in smoking anything...

Seeing my grandfather die from emphysema when I was a kid killed any desire I had to smoke.  He couldn't even walk across the room without stopping to catch his breath.  He made me promise to never smoke, and I'm so glad I kept that promise.
I have a good friend whose son has been dealing (and mostly failing) with cannabis-induced psychosis for the last 20 years.  I'd never touch cannabis even without the smoking hazard. 
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: asauer on March 03, 2021, 12:36:53 PM
I posted over in Bad Assity...

So in my mind I set an April 1 leave date.  We're nearly FI so I have a good runway.  I then reached out to someone who approached me for a contract role a few months ago.  They were still looking so I signed and quit.  I'll start with them on March 15th and the contract will take me all the way to my FIRE date in Feb 2022.  Leadership was totally floored when I resigned and started panicking over an upcoming big important meeting with the shit client. They wanted me to still attend.  I said nopey nope nope.  If they want to cut my notice short, fine with me.

I'm excited about the new job.  I get to approach it as mostly fun and temporary.
This is a fabulous idea!

Reading this post, I thought how awesome it would be to print up t-shirts that read: “Nopey Nope Nope” and start wearing them to work in the week or so before giving notice. Or heck, once you get to FI and just want to mess with people. When someone asked you to do something unreasonable, could just point to the shirt.

Sorry, I am having a shit week at work, so this is making me fantasize about what could be very soon...
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Shane on March 03, 2021, 08:34:53 PM
I have a good friend whose son has been dealing (and mostly failing) with cannabis-induced psychosis for the last 20 years.  I'd never touch cannabis even without the smoking hazard.

Cannabis doesn't 'induce psychosis." People who are psychotic sometimes self-medicate with all kinds of things, including cannabis, but that's not what causes their psychosis. The (often heavy) cannabis use is more a symptom of their underlying mental problems.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: GreenToTheCore on March 03, 2021, 08:38:46 PM
I may try to find this game, just so I can carry these cards around in my pocket and distribute freely.

Our family LOVES this game. And it just got NUTS for us as we just included the expansion packs.
Matt Inman's comics are funny as hell - because it mixes a little vulgar humor with true knowledge and intelligence. Probably why The Simpsons writers have done so well for so long.

Agreed, it has become a friend favorite. Poetry for Neanderthals was a good one with the whole family, young nephew included.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: former player on March 03, 2021, 10:57:13 PM
I have a good friend whose son has been dealing (and mostly failing) with cannabis-induced psychosis for the last 20 years.  I'd never touch cannabis even without the smoking hazard.

Cannabis doesn't 'induce psychosis." People who are psychotic sometimes self-medicate with all kinds of things, including cannabis, but that's not what causes their psychosis. The (often heavy) cannabis use is more a symptom of their underlying mental problems.
Hard to tell the difference if someone goes from functioning and sane to non-functioning and insane immediately after a heavy bout of smoking though, right?
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Freedomin5 on March 04, 2021, 02:17:43 AM
I have a good friend whose son has been dealing (and mostly failing) with cannabis-induced psychosis for the last 20 years.  I'd never touch cannabis even without the smoking hazard.

Cannabis doesn't 'induce psychosis." People who are psychotic sometimes self-medicate with all kinds of things, including cannabis, but that's not what causes their psychosis. The (often heavy) cannabis use is more a symptom of their underlying mental problems.

According to the Diagnostic and Statistical Manual of Mental Disorders, 5th Edition(DSM-5), also known as the “bible” of mental disorders, also what psychiatrists and psychologists use to diagnose mental disorders, cannabis absolutely can induce psychosis.

ICD-9-CM Code 292.9
ICD-10-CM Code F12.159 (with use disorder, mild), F12.259 (with use disorder, moderate/severe), F12.959 (without use disorder)

Unless you’re telling me you know more than the teams of experts from some of the top universities in the world that were tasked with updating the DSM.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: tipster350 on March 04, 2021, 05:47:07 AM
I can't wait for this thread to get back on topic!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Dicey on March 04, 2021, 06:39:20 AM
I can't wait for this thread to get back on topic!
Hahaha, good luck with that!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: RetiredAt63 on March 04, 2021, 08:50:05 AM
I can't wait for this thread to get back on topic!

You just need to come up with an epic FU money story.   ;-)
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: BuffaloStache on March 04, 2021, 11:08:22 AM
None of them are my stories, and it's unclear that any of these are even FU stories, but I'll do my part to try to bring this thread back on track: https://www.monster.com/career-advice/article/4-wild-quitting-job-stories (https://www.monster.com/career-advice/article/4-wild-quitting-job-stories)

Love the ingenuity of some people! I'd love to do something like this (almost entirely non-harmful) if I was leaving an employer I loved.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: swashbucklinstache on March 04, 2021, 01:47:27 PM
I've got a potential one brewing in a 2000 person company.

9(!!!!!!!!) months ago a person who reports to the C suite indicated they'd like to give me 3 of their 4 subroles as an "apprentice" which is code for "without losing credit for it for a few months in case my new roles don't work out." It's influential work and very poorly defined, which is appropriate for that person's level, which is two levels above mine, and represents a shift in career direction to a new vertical. So I asked about title and pay to help me decide, hearing "we'll get back to you" which is fair since this involves multiple people. I wasn't thrilled with having to bring those things up to the C suite nor several of the follow-ups from leadership who basically expect me to immediately take them up on it.

In the meantime I've been declining meeting invitations associated with the role, or attending and declining most action items, which has undoubtedly ruffled some feathers. I've held steady, buoyed by the fact that the average tenure in these roles has been < 1 year, with the big wigs kicking you out or people burning out, and we get raises annually... This otherwise has been the right move, since I'm (correctly) on my own in delegating current tasks to make room.

Last week we got annual review promotions and I got one and a very healthy raise, but I happen to know these roles were not a part of that calculus. I think senior management is going to have a conniption fit when they approach me soon with "now that that's settled..." and I interrupt them to say "I was promoted to level 5 because I'm doing level 5 work. If you want me to do level 6 work in the other vertical I'm still waiting for information on title and pay to help me make that choice."
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: RyanAtTanagra on March 04, 2021, 02:41:53 PM
In the meantime I've been declining meeting invitations associated with the role, or attending and declining most action items, which has undoubtedly ruffled some feathers.

Nice, good play.  Follow up later when you can, curious to hear how things play out.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: BicycleB on March 04, 2021, 02:42:47 PM
Live action report (well, inaction on their part) - indeed epic!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: jinga nation on March 08, 2021, 04:02:11 PM
I don't have an epic FU money story. But this post by @SwordGuy , on this thread, in 2016 got my brain cogs spinning:
https://forum.mrmoneymustache.com/welcome-to-the-forum/epic-fu-money-stories/msg1110522/#msg1110522

Things at my previous job weren't going well. Every other week I (along with my lead network engineer) were the whipping boys of a high-level gov civilian in the DoD. (The engineer who was the whipping boy in my "respite week" is my current director.) There came a time, after a year of whippings, that I took my manager outside the office and told him I was tired of working with a shitty software product, which I had assessed 18 months prior and said it was worse than a sack of manure, yet the agency purchased it. The vendor support was piss-poor, and the gov oversight was getting into my underwear. I asked for another job within the company. My manager said no, I had to stay to work and complete the project in the next 6 months as it was high-visibilty. Later that week, I read the above-mentioned post on this thread. Took my boss outside, told him I was ready to quit. He asked me about money; I said I had enough saved up. (Between rental income and my wife's earnings, we would be fine.) In addition, I was also wearing 2 other hats, so they'd need 2-3 people to replace me. He gave me a 10% raise on the spot, and got me a bonus $10k a week later. He thought that would satisfy someone with FU money. A couple of months later, after several interviews, and taking my time to pick, I went with a small business where I had latitude to do many different things, instead of being stuck in a Fortune 500 where I was just another billable butt-in-seat resource.

Thanks to FU money and advice on this forum, I'm now making 33% more than I did 3 years ago (not counting for inflation). I have a flex-work schedule, zero management and gov people sitting on my head.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: dandarc on March 08, 2021, 04:21:03 PM
10% raise on the spot + $10K bonus should be insulting. Company (and this manager specifically) was underpaying you for quite a while if they could do that pretty much instantaneously. Great move getting out of there!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: jinga nation on March 08, 2021, 05:58:26 PM
10% raise on the spot + $10K bonus should be insulting. Company (and this manager specifically) was underpaying you for quite a while if they could do that pretty much instantaneously. Great move getting out of there!
He was a company man. I was being paid par-for-the-course at the time, and it was a convenient place to work since my kids were in the onsite daycare. There wasn't any potential for technical growith, and I didn't want to become management. I had started playing with cloud infrastructure at my desk in my spare time and got noticed by the co-worker/fellow whipping boy. He ended up hiring me a few months after he left. He's my director now and is a pretty good chap who recognizes talent and tries to hold on to them
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: alcon835 on March 08, 2021, 06:03:00 PM
What I really want to know, what did your boss say when you told him you were quitting after all, a few weeks later?
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: jinga nation on March 08, 2021, 06:48:42 PM
What I really want to know, what did your boss say when you told him you were quitting after all, a few weeks later?
He was a big fan of phrases/sayings, the midwesterner he was.
So I told him I wasn't impressed by his batting average.
And that a blind man could have been batting better than his attempts to get me anything bigger.
And that I had to take care of myself, my family, and my health (mental in this case).
^all 3 were verbatim phrases he'd say all the time.
It left him gobsmacked. He tried to say something, 3 seconds of incoherent mumbling, and then he put out his hand and said he wished me all the best. He acknowledged at my leaving lunch that it would be hard to replace me. 
I moved to a building right across from my old workplace, and sometimes I have to go to his department for a meeting with engineers there, and end up meeting him. But he's been polite and cordial since (he got promoted).

Another bonus of being a Mustachian and ex-Boglehead is that at my current employer, I complained about our crappy 401k. The owners told me to write up a paper showing proof, which convinced them. Ended up moving the 401k to Guideline, reducing employer fees/costs by 77%.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Alternatepriorities on March 08, 2021, 07:34:16 PM
Another bonus of being a Mustachian and ex-Boglehead is that at my current employer, I complained about our crappy 401k. The owners told me to write up a paper showing proof, which convinced them. Ended up moving the 401k to Guideline, reducing employer fees/costs by 77%.

Nice job on that one!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: 2sk22 on March 09, 2021, 03:25:34 AM
I don't have an epic FU money story. But this post by @SwordGuy , on this thread, in 2016 got my brain cogs spinning:
https://forum.mrmoneymustache.com/welcome-to-the-forum/epic-fu-money-stories/msg1110522/#msg1110522

Things at my previous job weren't going well. Every other week I (along with my lead network engineer) were the whipping boys of a high-level gov civilian in the DoD. (The engineer who was the whipping boy in my "respite week" in my current director.) There came a time, after a year of whippings, that I took my manager outside the office and told him I was tired of working with a shitty software product, which I had assessed 18 months prior and said it was worse than a sack of manure, yet the agency purchased it. The vendor support was piss-poor, and the gov oversight was getting into my underwear. I asked for another job within the company. My manager said no, I had to stay to work and complete the project in the next 6 months as it was high-visibilty. Later that week, I read the above-mentioned post on this thread. Took my boss outside, told him I was ready to quit. He asked me about money; I said I had enough saved up. (Between rental income and my wife's earnings, we would be fine.) In addition, I was also wearing 2 other hats, so they'd need 2-3 people to replace me. He gave me a 10% raise on the spot, and got me a bonus $10k a week later. He thought that would satisfy someone with FU money. A couple of months later, after several interviews, and taking my time to pick, I went with a small business where I had latitude to do many different things, instead of being stuck in a Fortune 500 where I was just another billable butt-in-seat resource.

Thanks to FU money and advice on this forum, I'm now making 33% more than I did 3 years ago (not counting for inflation). I have a flex-work schedule, zero management and gov people sitting on my head.

Good for you! Even when you actually have genuine FU money, it can be difficult to actually make use of it - fear of the unknown etc.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: alcon835 on March 09, 2021, 06:35:25 AM
What I really want to know, what did your boss say when you told him you were quitting after all, a few weeks later?
Another bonus of being a Mustachian and ex-Boglehead is that at my current employer, I complained about our crappy 401k. The owners told me to write up a paper showing proof, which convinced them. Ended up moving the 401k to Guideline, reducing employer fees/costs by 77%.

Ha! I love it! I did something similar, got the company to add a match to the 401k last year. This year I've almost got them to adopt "True up" so we don't have to meter the contributions out over 26 paychecks and potentially miss a match or two at the end of year!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: RWD on March 09, 2021, 07:15:11 AM
I have declined two pointless meetings this week without giving a reason. No one has asked so far.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: bbqbonelesswing on March 09, 2021, 07:51:37 AM
I have declined two pointless meetings this week without giving a reason. No one has asked so far.

Yes!! I love this. Keep it up. I'm trying to decline more meetings myself and have found that usually, nobody asks or cares why I didn't go.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: jinga nation on March 09, 2021, 09:19:58 AM
I have declined two pointless meetings this week without giving a reason. No one has asked so far.

Yes!! I love this. Keep it up. I'm trying to decline more meetings myself and have found that usually, nobody asks or cares why I didn't go.

I get added to random meetings. The worse part is a lack of agenda or topics to discuss. Hence I don't attend. They haven't noticed. It has been 3 years at the customer site.
(I've always made it a point to provide attendees with an agenda in meetings I set up to make it productive and quick.)
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: RetiredAt63 on March 09, 2021, 10:47:48 AM
I have declined two pointless meetings this week without giving a reason. No one has asked so far.

Yes!! I love this. Keep it up. I'm trying to decline more meetings myself and have found that usually, nobody asks or cares why I didn't go.

I get added to random meetings. The worse part is a lack of agenda or topics to discuss. Hence I don't attend. They haven't noticed. It has been 3 years at the customer site.
(I've always made it a point to provide attendees with an agenda in meetings I set up to make it productive and quick.)

Maybe academia is different? Maybe it's the unions? Every place I've taught, agendas had to be sent out well in advance.  The really effective meeting chairs put a start time on each item.  Hmm, nope, not just work, all my non-work groups have agendas for their meetings.  If there isn't an agenda it is a social get-together, not a meeting.

You hang out with a lazy/sloppy crowd.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: anotherAlias on March 09, 2021, 11:25:07 AM
I have declined two pointless meetings this week without giving a reason. No one has asked so far.

Yes!! I love this. Keep it up. I'm trying to decline more meetings myself and have found that usually, nobody asks or cares why I didn't go.

Oh man, I'm jealous.  Someone of some level of importance would notice if I skipped a meeting.  This has less to do with my importance and more to do with the level of micromanaging that has become the norm in my department.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: jinga nation on March 09, 2021, 11:43:31 AM
I have declined two pointless meetings this week without giving a reason. No one has asked so far.

Yes!! I love this. Keep it up. I'm trying to decline more meetings myself and have found that usually, nobody asks or cares why I didn't go.

I get added to random meetings. The worse part is a lack of agenda or topics to discuss. Hence I don't attend. They haven't noticed. It has been 3 years at the customer site.
(I've always made it a point to provide attendees with an agenda in meetings I set up to make it productive and quick.)

Maybe academia is different? Maybe it's the unions? Every place I've taught, agendas had to be sent out well in advance.  The really effective meeting chairs put a start time on each item.  Hmm, nope, not just work, all my non-work groups have agendas for their meetings.  If there isn't an agenda it is a social get-together, not a meeting.

You hang out with a lazy/sloppy crowd.
Sir, this is the DoD/FedGov. Thank you for the compliments.
Don't forget to pay your taxes. Uncle Sam loves you.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: markbike528CBX on March 09, 2021, 11:57:36 AM
I have declined two pointless meetings this week without giving a reason. No one has asked so far.

Yes!! I love this. Keep it up. I'm trying to decline more meetings myself and have found that usually, nobody asks or cares why I didn't go.

Oh man, I'm jealous.  Someone of some level of importance would notice if I skipped a meeting.  This has less to do with my importance and more to do with the level of micromanaging that has become the norm in my department.
Maybe not, if you are not on the agenda, outta sight, outta mind might apply. 
If there isn't an agenda or at least a script for daily meetings then, nearly by definition, it is useless.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: mm1970 on March 09, 2021, 12:13:32 PM
@jinga nation I think that was epic!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: anotherAlias on March 09, 2021, 12:16:23 PM
I have declined two pointless meetings this week without giving a reason. No one has asked so far.

Yes!! I love this. Keep it up. I'm trying to decline more meetings myself and have found that usually, nobody asks or cares why I didn't go.

Oh man, I'm jealous.  Someone of some level of importance would notice if I skipped a meeting.  This has less to do with my importance and more to do with the level of micromanaging that has become the norm in my department.
Maybe not, if you are not on the agenda, outta sight, outta mind might apply. 
If there isn't an agenda or at least a script for daily meetings then, nearly by definition, it is useless.
We don't always have an agenda but I tend to get asked questions a lot.  Plus my manager is in almost all of my meetings, and is very much a micromanager.  I can assure you they would notice. 
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: AlanStache on March 09, 2021, 01:01:50 PM
And we are not big on meetings...
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: markbike528CBX on March 09, 2021, 01:10:23 PM
I have declined two pointless meetings this week without giving a reason. No one has asked so far.

Yes!! I love this. Keep it up. I'm trying to decline more meetings myself and have found that usually, nobody asks or cares why I didn't go.

Oh man, I'm jealous.  Someone of some level of importance would notice if I skipped a meeting.  This has less to do with my importance and more to do with the level of micromanaging that has become the norm in my department.
Maybe not, if you are not on the agenda, outta sight, outta mind might apply. 
If there isn't an agenda or at least a script for daily meetings then, nearly by definition, it is useless.
We don't always have an agenda but I tend to get asked questions a lot.  Plus my manager is in almost all of my meetings, and is very much a micromanager.  I can assure you they would notice.
Start slow and avoid the useless meetings that your manager _doesn't_ attend.
Or stroke the ego, and say "this is a management level meeting, I'll give you all the info needed".
Or if you have and desire to use FU money, just don't go.   Have a critical gig going at those times.    YMMV
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: RetiredAt63 on March 09, 2021, 02:22:30 PM
I have declined two pointless meetings this week without giving a reason. No one has asked so far.

Yes!! I love this. Keep it up. I'm trying to decline more meetings myself and have found that usually, nobody asks or cares why I didn't go.

I get added to random meetings. The worse part is a lack of agenda or topics to discuss. Hence I don't attend. They haven't noticed. It has been 3 years at the customer site.
(I've always made it a point to provide attendees with an agenda in meetings I set up to make it productive and quick.)

Maybe academia is different? Maybe it's the unions? Every place I've taught, agendas had to be sent out well in advance.  The really effective meeting chairs put a start time on each item.  Hmm, nope, not just work, all my non-work groups have agendas for their meetings.  If there isn't an agenda it is a social get-together, not a meeting.

You hang out with a lazy/sloppy crowd.
Sir, this is the DoD/FedGov. Thank you for the compliments.
Don't forget to pay your taxes. Uncle Sam loves you.

Sorry, my built-in editor had the urge to make some revisions.    ;-)

Sir, this is the DoD/FedGov. Thank you for the compliments.
Don't forget to pay your taxes. Uncle Sam loves you.

>>>>>

Ma'am, this is the DoD/FedGov. Thank you for the compliments.
Don't forget to pay your taxes. Uncle Sam loves you.  You are a Canadian, Uncle Sam isn't sure how he feels about you.  You don't pay any taxes here. Do you buy lots of American goods?  Do you spend lots of money here on vacation?
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Smokystache on March 09, 2021, 02:53:14 PM

Maybe academia is different? Maybe it's the unions? Every place I've taught, agendas had to be sent out well in advance.  The really effective meeting chairs put a start time on each item.  Hmm, nope, not just work, all my non-work groups have agendas for their meetings.  If there isn't an agenda it is a social get-together, not a meeting.

You hang out with a lazy/sloppy crowd.

My old faculty meetings had agendas - but you still couldn't pay me enough to go back to one. A bunch of PhDs sitting in a room and everyone thinks they know more than everyone else and has to get their $.02 in. Doesn't matter if they have any expertise on the topic - Enrollments down? I've got a few ideas for Admissions!!  - Low fundraising?? Why don't they try this! 

The only thing that saved us was the room was needed for the next class at 2pm. Have to go! Ugh.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: RetiredAt63 on March 10, 2021, 06:00:46 AM

Maybe academia is different? Maybe it's the unions? Every place I've taught, agendas had to be sent out well in advance.  The really effective meeting chairs put a start time on each item.  Hmm, nope, not just work, all my non-work groups have agendas for their meetings.  If there isn't an agenda it is a social get-together, not a meeting.

You hang out with a lazy/sloppy crowd.

My old faculty meetings had agendas - but you still couldn't pay me enough to go back to one. A bunch of PhDs sitting in a room and everyone thinks they know more than everyone else and has to get their $.02 in. Doesn't matter if they have any expertise on the topic - Enrollments down? I've got a few ideas for Admissions!!  - Low fundraising?? Why don't they try this! 

The only thing that saved us was the room was needed for the next class at 2pm. Have to go! Ugh.

Our meetings were useful only because everyone had to  be out at the scheduled end time, we all had classes to get to.  And yes academics can talk forever - it is what we are paid to do, after all.  We didn't want the second half of the agenda tabled until the next time because we ran out of time, that way lies madness. 

I've seen the endless yak-yak at non-work meetings too, especially executive meetings.  Some people seem to see meetings as social time.  I don't but then I am an introvert, let's just get the agenda covered and be done!  Even if "done" is really meeting followed by social time, let's keep them separate!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: bbqbonelesswing on March 10, 2021, 08:00:40 AM

Maybe academia is different? Maybe it's the unions? Every place I've taught, agendas had to be sent out well in advance.  The really effective meeting chairs put a start time on each item.  Hmm, nope, not just work, all my non-work groups have agendas for their meetings.  If there isn't an agenda it is a social get-together, not a meeting.

You hang out with a lazy/sloppy crowd.

My old faculty meetings had agendas - but you still couldn't pay me enough to go back to one. A bunch of PhDs sitting in a room and everyone thinks they know more than everyone else and has to get their $.02 in. Doesn't matter if they have any expertise on the topic - Enrollments down? I've got a few ideas for Admissions!!  - Low fundraising?? Why don't they try this! 

The only thing that saved us was the room was needed for the next class at 2pm. Have to go! Ugh.

Our meetings were useful only because everyone had to  be out at the scheduled end time, we all had classes to get to.  And yes academics can talk forever - it is what we are paid to do, after all.  We didn't want the second half of the agenda tabled until the next time because we ran out of time, that way lies madness. 

I've seen the endless yak-yak at non-work meetings too, especially executive meetings.  Some people seem to see meetings as social time.  I don't but then I am an introvert, let's just get the agenda covered and be done!  Even if "done" is really meeting followed by social time, let's keep them separate!

My manager looooves to turn meetings into social time. Commonly heard at the end of the set meeting time: "Does anyone have a hard stop?"
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Nutty on March 10, 2021, 10:19:46 AM
My manager looooves to turn meetings into social time. Commonly heard at the end of the set meeting time: "Does anyone have a hard stop?"
I might have worked for that one too.  Yes, I do have a hard stop if you expect me to complete my projects by your imposed deadline.  Several people would clutch their phones and excuse themselves, never to return.  Some people would have their coworker call them with a "get out of meeting free" call.  Good friends will cover for you.

I've walked out of meetings that strayed from an agenda.  I've also took control, imposed my agenda and adjourned them early.  I've got work to do and this ain't it.

BTW, quitting time can be a hard stop too.  I've got better places to be.  Don't get me wrong, I love my paycheck, er, company during working hours.  :)
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: BussoV6 on March 11, 2021, 03:23:48 AM

Maybe academia is different? Maybe it's the unions? Every place I've taught, agendas had to be sent out well in advance.  The really effective meeting chairs put a start time on each item.  Hmm, nope, not just work, all my non-work groups have agendas for their meetings.  If there isn't an agenda it is a social get-together, not a meeting.

You hang out with a lazy/sloppy crowd.

My old faculty meetings had agendas - but you still couldn't pay me enough to go back to one. A bunch of PhDs sitting in a room and everyone thinks they know more than everyone else and has to get their $.02 in. Doesn't matter if they have any expertise on the topic - Enrollments down? I've got a few ideas for Admissions!!  - Low fundraising?? Why don't they try this! 

The only thing that saved us was the room was needed for the next class at 2pm. Have to go! Ugh.

Our meetings were useful only because everyone had to  be out at the scheduled end time, we all had classes to get to.  And yes academics can talk forever - it is what we are paid to do, after all.  We didn't want the second half of the agenda tabled until the next time because we ran out of time, that way lies madness. 

I've seen the endless yak-yak at non-work meetings too, especially executive meetings.  Some people seem to see meetings as social time.  I don't but then I am an introvert, let's just get the agenda covered and be done!  Even if "done" is really meeting followed by social time, let's keep them separate!

My manager looooves to turn meetings into social time. Commonly heard at the end of the set meeting time: "Does anyone have a hard stop?"

I'm the one with a hard stop everytime a meeting threatens to run over. I also decline anything where I don't see the value as being worth my time.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: LennStar on March 11, 2021, 04:47:02 AM
The really effective meeting chairs put a start time on each item.
And the people who get things done put an end time to a meeting (and adhere to it).

The only thing that saved us was the room was needed for the next class at 2pm. Have to go! Ugh.

Our meetings were useful only because everyone had to  be out at the scheduled end time, we all had classes to get to.

LOL see? QED!

If there is a definitive end, people will only talk about the important things once they get used to it. And people who can't do that (there is always one ego too big) get the social distancing treatment and learn it after a bit - or leave one way or the other.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: RetiredAt63 on March 11, 2021, 09:02:50 AM
The really effective meeting chairs put a start time on each item.
And the people who get things done put an end time to a meeting (and adhere to it).

The only thing that saved us was the room was needed for the next class at 2pm. Have to go! Ugh.

Our meetings were useful only because everyone had to  be out at the scheduled end time, we all had classes to get to.

LOL see? QED!

If there is a definitive end, people will only talk about the important things once they get used to it. And people who can't do that (there is always one ego too big) get the social distancing treatment and learn it after a bit - or leave one way or the other.

Exactly.  The start time for an item is the end time for the previous item, so that works.  Our last agenda item was always "any other business"  so it could be super short or horribly long.  Definitely an end time had to be there.  Plus people learned that anything important needed its own agenda spot since AOB tended to not be the best place for informed discussion.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Alternatepriorities on March 11, 2021, 12:49:40 PM
More of a "polite no thank you" than an FU, but it was still very satisfying.

DW and I hit FI last year, but she still really likes her work. They clearly like her too because they offered her a promotion this spring. It'd be a nice raise for her and we think she will enjoy the new role even more than the current one. The only problem is her current contract is 186 days a year and the new one is 220 and losing seven weeks of potential travel would not be worth it.  So, she told them she would love the job, but is only willing to work a 200 day contract. Even though it's still a substantial raise, they seemed surprised she didn't mind giving up 20 days of pay. Once they realized she was serious they accepted her proposal. FI means she didn't have to choose between career advancement and having time off to enjoy life.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: dandarc on March 11, 2021, 01:22:49 PM
May not be FU, but certainly EPIC @Alternatepriorities!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: RetiredAt63 on March 11, 2021, 03:16:55 PM
May not be FU, but certainly EPIC @Alternatepriorities!

Yes, good for her!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Warlord1986 on March 14, 2021, 11:46:10 AM
@Alternatepriorities  good one! Always happy to see people choose life over money.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Blondetuco on March 15, 2021, 12:04:10 PM
I posted a few months back about leaving a job because of a horrible boss. Turns out I wasn't the only one that had enough of her crap, and she was recently let go. They were unable to fill my position in the five(!!!) months since I left.

I was contacted today about coming back to the company under new management. Luckily, my SO and I just had a conversation about how well we're doing financially - and how much happier I've been - since taking a 30% paycut in my current position. It was the easiest "Thanks, but no thanks" I have given someone.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Dicey on March 15, 2021, 08:01:01 PM
I posted a few months back about leaving a job because of a horrible boss. Turns out I wasn't the only one that had enough of her crap, and she was recently let go. They were unable to fill my position in the five(!!!) months since I left.

I was contacted today about coming back to the company under new management. Luckily, my SO and I just had a conversation about how well we're doing financially - and how much happier I've been - since taking a 30% paycut in my current position. It was the easiest "Thanks, but no thanks" I have given someone.
Whoop, whoop!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: LightTripper on March 16, 2021, 03:59:20 AM
Great to hear about karma in full action there @Blondetuco !
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: swashbucklinstache on March 16, 2021, 09:24:30 AM
I've got a potential one brewing in a 2000 person company.

9(!!!!!!!!) months ago a person who reports to the C suite indicated they'd like to give me 3 of their 4 subroles as an "apprentice" which is code for "without losing credit for it for a few months in case my new roles don't work out." It's influential work and very poorly defined, which is appropriate for that person's level, which is two levels above mine, and represents a shift in career direction to a new vertical. So I asked about title and pay to help me decide, hearing "we'll get back to you" which is fair since this involves multiple people. I wasn't thrilled with having to bring those things up to the C suite nor several of the follow-ups from leadership who basically expect me to immediately take them up on it.

In the meantime I've been declining meeting invitations associated with the role, or attending and declining most action items, which has undoubtedly ruffled some feathers. I've held steady, buoyed by the fact that the average tenure in these roles has been < 1 year, with the big wigs kicking you out or people burning out, and we get raises annually... This otherwise has been the right move, since I'm (correctly) on my own in delegating current tasks to make room.

Last week we got annual review promotions and I got one and a very healthy raise, but I happen to know these roles were not a part of that calculus. I think senior management is going to have a conniption fit when they approach me soon with "now that that's settled..." and I interrupt them to say "I was promoted to level 5 because I'm doing level 5 work. If you want me to do level 6 work in the other vertical I'm still waiting for information on title and pay to help me make that choice."
We've progressed to IMs of "do you have a few minutes to chat" actually being the meetings I've been declining, people currently doing roles but who have no authority to change things coming to me asking about when I'll be the roles because they're so busy and attempting to get me to just do it, and meetings with vague topics turning into "thanks for joining, let's talk through this task I'm handing off to you"....
Meanwhile some of the people doing this role are leaving the company and referencing these roles directly. They need help and I want to help, but I mean....
Requests for people to sign up in meetings full of my peers are met with silence....
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: RyanAtTanagra on March 16, 2021, 10:09:24 AM
meetings with vague topics turning into "thanks for joining, let's talk through this task I'm handing off to you"....

Are you accepting the tasks?  Sounds like if you don't formally accept the role their next tactic is to just trickle it onto you.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: LightTripper on March 16, 2021, 10:19:15 AM
Right - sounds like they are relying on goodwill that somebody (probably you) will just sweep up the dropped tasks to be helpful.  Which would be a worst of all worlds as it won't even be in your job description or compensated.  Your managers need to actually manage the situation ... sounds like it would be worth actively reaching out to your manager to discuss the situation?
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: swashbucklinstache on March 16, 2021, 10:50:22 AM
Yep! My immediate manager is definitely in the loop and is taking it up the chain with a clear bright line "this is not going to just happen to work itself out" directive.

It's unfortunate because there's a very real possibility that if they just showed me a table that clearly showed they're paying me like a level 6, even if my title isn't, that I'd likely grumble about being voluntold but then set to doing it. We're in professional services too, so they only really care about my salary so much since we're just billing it out anyway. It's 1000% them fishing for people who'll feel bad and pick up the slack, not wanting to use political points with other C suites if they don't have to, not $. Just doing it is a fine way to gain responsibilities early in a professional services career but at some point you have to do more of purposeful 'explosion ladder' approach to get stronger not just 5 more pull-ups. Our job descriptions, like many consultants, are basically the equivalent "get stronger", fast and loose.

I'm telling people in the roles that I'm not able to assist yet, breaking that pattern only in the case of things that are extremely simple or otherwise interesting to me. They're left with the impression I want to help..
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: AMandM on March 16, 2021, 11:23:11 AM
It's 1000% them fishing for people who'll feel bad and pick up the slack, not wanting to use political points with other C suites if they don't have to, not $.
I'm baffled by this. Why does it cost anyone political points to fill a staffing need?  Can't someone just say to whoever has the authority, "Swashbucklinstache would be a great fit to lead tasks X, y, and Z, so I propose we offer her $300k and the title Chief Sub-Panjandrum if she will accept those responsibilities"?
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: swashbucklinstache on March 16, 2021, 12:17:55 PM
It's 1000% them fishing for people who'll feel bad and pick up the slack, not wanting to use political points with other C suites if they don't have to, not $.
I'm baffled by this. Why does it cost anyone political points to fill a staffing need?  Can't someone just say to whoever has the authority, "Swashbucklinstache would be a great fit to lead tasks X, y, and Z, so I propose we offer her $300k and the title Chief Sub-Panjandrum if she will accept those responsibilities"?
You're not wrong, it isn't at all rational. Life and times of a consultancy though at this level. Asking for anything at all from another group, HR to literally do their job in this case, requires a political trade-off. It also requires the C suit to spend 10 consecutive minutes focusing on the division they run instead of how they can get promoted or an extra half percent on their bonus, (or actual more important things, to be fair) which probably explains the 9 month wait time. We bill our time in 6 minute increments and our company #2 starts her day by reviewing yesterday's numbers...

Not a surprise FI is on the mind, nor that more sanely run startups are eating our lunch.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: dandarc on March 16, 2021, 01:09:51 PM
Professional consulting firms often get to a certain size and lose the ability to think. And there tends to be a correlated sense of entitlement to the margin they charge as well. Tend to sell out to ever larger firms until one of those firms is "Deloitte" or one of the other huge players or the whole thing just collapses due to company's previously mentioned back-office incompetence and sense of entitlement.

Maybe that's specific to government IT consulting, but I've seen the show play out twice now since 2008 - first firm I got into this with back then was in the "blowing up and not in a good way" stage, but being new I had no idea what I was witnessing at the time. Latest one sold out shortly after I joined. But between these two firms was a local outfit that seems content staying small - heading back to work with them in May if paperwork goes through.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: swashbucklinstache on March 16, 2021, 01:49:11 PM
Professional consulting firms often get to a certain size and lose the ability to think. And there tends to be a correlated sense of entitlement to the margin they charge as well. Tend to sell out to ever larger firms until one of those firms is "Deloitte" or one of the other huge players or the whole thing just collapses due to company's previously mentioned back-office incompetence and sense of entitlement.

Maybe that's specific to government IT consulting, but I've seen the show play out twice now since 2008 - first firm I got into this with back then was in the "blowing up and not in a good way" stage, but being new I had no idea what I was witnessing at the time. Latest one sold out shortly after I joined. But between these two firms was a local outfit that seems content staying small - heading back to work with them in May if paperwork goes through.
Pretty much. Based on the talent walking out the door we're in the early stages of the latter.

It's a difficult model to effectively scale, which is part of the reason they don't sell for high multiples. Management is kind of like simultaneous running 10-3000 companies at once, more of a loose coalition than a company. Pros and cons to that arrangement of course, and if one wants to trade that set of problems for another the door's always there.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Alternatepriorities on March 16, 2021, 02:32:58 PM
May not be FU, but certainly EPIC @Alternatepriorities!
Thanks! It feels pretty epic for us.

@Alternatepriorities  good one! Always happy to see people choose life over money.

This is a good reminder. I suspect I will always be temped if "the money is good enough" and I need to remember that there is a declining utility to the money especially if it comes at the cost of mental or physical health...
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: dandarc on March 19, 2021, 06:51:36 AM
Notice given Wednesday with 5/1 end date. And working 4 days per week starting next week until then (thanks new leave policy of only paying out 80 hours!), new gig will be 3 days per week in May. The couple people who asked what the next thing is I said "semi-retirement, and if I had any courage / willingness to cut our budget more than I really want to, I could be going to full-on retirement".

Now if I can get this damn website they asked me to stand up to actually work today I'll be in really good shape. I really hate the system programmer parts of the job, and that work seems to quite often find me. Actually looking back, this sort of thing becoming more of the job than I'd like has probably driven every major career change I've made since college.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: scottish on March 19, 2021, 03:41:30 PM
Professional consulting firms often get to a certain size and lose the ability to think. And there tends to be a correlated sense of entitlement to the margin they charge as well. Tend to sell out to ever larger firms until one of those firms is "Deloitte" or one of the other huge players or the whole thing just collapses due to company's previously mentioned back-office incompetence and sense of entitlement.

Maybe that's specific to government IT consulting, but I've seen the show play out twice now since 2008 - first firm I got into this with back then was in the "blowing up and not in a good way" stage, but being new I had no idea what I was witnessing at the time. Latest one sold out shortly after I joined. But between these two firms was a local outfit that seems content staying small - heading back to work with them in May if paperwork goes through.

It's Price's law at work:

Quote
Price’s Law says that 50% of work at a company is done by a small number of people.  Specifically, it says that 50% of work is done by the square root of the number of employees.

Once those people start leaving the organization slowly grinds to a halt.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: jinga nation on March 19, 2021, 07:14:22 PM
Notice given Wednesday with 5/1 end date. And working 4 days per week starting next week until then (thanks new leave policy of only paying out 80 hours!), new gig will be 3 days per week in May. The couple people who asked what the next thing is I said "semi-retirement, and if I had any courage / willingness to cut our budget more than I really want to, I could be going to full-on retirement".

Now if I can get this damn website they asked me to stand up to actually work today I'll be in really good shape. I really hate the system programmer parts of the job, and that work seems to quite often find me. Actually looking back, this sort of thing becoming more of the job than I'd like has probably driven every major career change I've made since college.

Nice! I'm living FI/FIRE vicariously thru folks like you (IT/engineering/sysadmin keyboard masher here).
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: dandarc on March 20, 2021, 10:51:40 AM
Notice given Wednesday with 5/1 end date. And working 4 days per week starting next week until then (thanks new leave policy of only paying out 80 hours!), new gig will be 3 days per week in May. The couple people who asked what the next thing is I said "semi-retirement, and if I had any courage / willingness to cut our budget more than I really want to, I could be going to full-on retirement".

Now if I can get this damn website they asked me to stand up to actually work today I'll be in really good shape. I really hate the system programmer parts of the job, and that work seems to quite often find me. Actually looking back, this sort of thing becoming more of the job than I'd like has probably driven every major career change I've made since college.

Nice! I'm living FI/FIRE vicariously thru folks like you (IT/engineering/sysadmin keyboard masher here).
Took about 8.5 years for our investments to go from $40K to > $1M - we didn't make any investments other than broad market index funds that are advocated basically everywhere in the FIRE community. I guess we technically had investment real estate for 17 months in there, but it performed quite badly - we gave the tenant who we knew outside of "rent the house" a hell of a deal because we knew, to the extent these things can be known, that we would be moving back into this house quite soon.

So the process advocated on most FIRE sites such as this one definitely does work if my experience is any indication. The FU part for me was low-key - I started talking about retirement and manager trying to talk me out of it immediately realizes I'm really going and there isn't anything they can do to stop it. They probably could make a stink and prevent me from taking this particular thing I've got lined up, but they almost certainly won't because all they'd be doing is pissing off a customer and I'm just one person who is only willing to work 24 hours per week now - not exactly a big money maker for a consulting firm no matter how you slice it.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: talltexan on March 29, 2021, 06:21:53 AM
People on the internet are talking about the employer who sent a man his final paycheck in the form of "motor-fluid-covered pennies"

https://www.nytimes.com/2021/03/25/business/auto-shop-pennies.html (https://www.nytimes.com/2021/03/25/business/auto-shop-pennies.html)

The employer's quote about how he "cannot remember" if he dropped off five hundred pounds of pennies somewhere is breath-taking.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: zolotiyeruki on March 29, 2021, 06:35:58 AM
People on the internet are talking about the employer who sent a man his final paycheck in the form of "motor-fluid-covered pennies"

https://www.nytimes.com/2021/03/25/business/auto-shop-pennies.html (https://www.nytimes.com/2021/03/25/business/auto-shop-pennies.html)

The employer's quote about how he "cannot remember" if he dropped off five hundred pounds of pennies somewhere is breath-taking.
Wow, that's petty.

Now, how to fix it?  That's not too bad, actually.  Slosh them around in a 55-gallon drum with a few gallons of gasoline, then do the same with soapy water. 
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: SwordGuy on March 29, 2021, 06:52:32 AM
Maybe he should dump some motor oil in front of the shop's door.  You know, being a good and honest citizen returning the "overage" in his paycheck.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: dandarc on March 29, 2021, 07:03:04 AM
Aside from the cleaning the motor oil this falls under "don't threaten me with a good time" - I'm weird even for this forum in that I used to literally have "count my change by hand" as a hobby - dump it out, count it up, return to the jug. Every couple of months I'd do that - I found it calming.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Zaga on March 29, 2021, 08:06:53 AM
Aside from the cleaning the motor oil this falls under "don't threaten me with a good time" - I'm weird even for this forum in that I used to literally have "count my change by hand" as a hobby - dump it out, count it up, return to the jug. Every couple of months I'd do that - I found it calming.
I also kind of love counting and rolling coins.  I get it.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: haflander on March 29, 2021, 08:11:26 AM
Aside from the cleaning the motor oil this falls under "don't threaten me with a good time" - I'm weird even for this forum in that I used to literally have "count my change by hand" as a hobby - dump it out, count it up, return to the jug. Every couple of months I'd do that - I found it calming.
I also kind of love counting and rolling coins.  I get it.

Even though you're handling pennies and quarters, part of the allure for me is pretending that I'm Scrooge McDuck, swimming in thousands of gold coins.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: dandarc on March 29, 2021, 09:50:27 AM
Aside from the cleaning the motor oil this falls under "don't threaten me with a good time" - I'm weird even for this forum in that I used to literally have "count my change by hand" as a hobby - dump it out, count it up, return to the jug. Every couple of months I'd do that - I found it calming.
I also kind of love counting and rolling coins.  I get it.

Even though you're handling pennies and quarters, part of the allure for me is pretending that I'm Scrooge McDuck, swimming in thousands of gold coins.
I actually started rolling $10 worth of pennies every time I counted the money in the jug and exchanging for $1 coins at the bank which I'd put back in the jug to make it gradually look more like Scrooge McDuck's vault. By the time we moved to California and I deposited the more than $1,000 in the jug, it had a noticeably golder hue overall.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Smokystache on March 29, 2021, 10:31:21 AM
People on the internet are talking about the employer who sent a man his final paycheck in the form of "motor-fluid-covered pennies"

https://www.nytimes.com/2021/03/25/business/auto-shop-pennies.html (https://www.nytimes.com/2021/03/25/business/auto-shop-pennies.html)

The employer's quote about how he "cannot remember" if he dropped off five hundred pounds of pennies somewhere is breath-taking.

I liked the recommendation that if the owner doesn't remember if he dropped them off, then how does the ex-employee know that this is his last payment for wages? (Yea, I know they left a pay stub...) If the employer doesn't admit it outright, then he still needs to pay the man.

Sounds like this was the tip of the iceberg - pulling down female employees pants in front of staff, yelling and belittling other employees, a real gem of a guy. Their reviews on Facebook have just gotten destroyed.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: SwordGuy on March 29, 2021, 10:39:11 AM
People on the internet are talking about the employer who sent a man his final paycheck in the form of "motor-fluid-covered pennies"

https://www.nytimes.com/2021/03/25/business/auto-shop-pennies.html (https://www.nytimes.com/2021/03/25/business/auto-shop-pennies.html)

The employer's quote about how he "cannot remember" if he dropped off five hundred pounds of pennies somewhere is breath-taking.

I liked the recommendation that if the owner doesn't remember if he dropped them off, then how does the ex-employee know that this is his last payment for wages? (Yea, I know they left a pay stub...) If the employer doesn't admit it outright, then he still needs to pay the man.

Sounds like this was the tip of the iceberg - pulling down female employees pants in front of staff, yelling and belittling other employees, a real gem of a guy. Their reviews on Facebook have just gotten destroyed.

Oh, yeah!   He's got a pay stub but he's GOT NO CASHED CHECK and NO RECEIPT FOR PAYMENT.   The employer is on record that he can't remember dropping the coins off and NO ONE WOULD FORGET DOING THIS to someone.  Ergo, he hasn't paid the wages because he hasn't got proof he paid.

It's just a coincidence that someone left a bunch of hazmat pennies in the driveway and it was pretty rude to leave the paystub in that hazmat pile.

I think he should contact BOTH the environmental dept for hazmat dumping AND the labor board for non-payment.   Let his prior employer decide whether he wants to own up to the hazmat dumping and pay those fines or claim the coins aren't from him and PAY THE WAGES AGAIN.

Living well and getting revenge is the best revenge.   ;)
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: RyanAtTanagra on March 29, 2021, 11:11:00 AM
I think he should contact BOTH the environmental dept for hazmat dumping AND the labor board for non-payment.   Let his prior employer decide whether he wants to own up to the hazmat dumping and pay those fines or claim the coins aren't from him and PAY THE WAGES AGAIN.

I like the way you think
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: SwordGuy on March 29, 2021, 01:25:55 PM
I think he should contact BOTH the environmental dept for hazmat dumping AND the labor board for non-payment.   Let his prior employer decide whether he wants to own up to the hazmat dumping and pay those fines or claim the coins aren't from him and PAY THE WAGES AGAIN.

I like the way you think

You know, if he had just been paid in pennies that would be bad enough.   Petty and vile.  And if this fellow NEEDED that money right away to pay his rent or buy food it would have been even worse.

But coating the coins in hazmat liquids is beyond petty and vile.  It is absolutely worthy of retaliation.

FYI, the fellow should keep the dirty liquid he's using to wash off the pennies with.   If the employer decides to acknowledge that those were the wages, the employee return that skanky water in said wheelbarrow to his old employer because he, the employee, is an honest fellow and doesn't want to be paid anything he wasn't owed.   Of course, the wheelbarrow is so unwieldy, what with the wheels flattened from the weight of the pennies; it would be a shame if he accidentally spilled the liquid all over the lobby.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: SwordGuy on March 29, 2021, 01:27:30 PM
After all, he wouldn't want to be accused of taking office supplies home with him!

At times like these it's important to keep the moral high ground, especially when the lower ground is flooded with skanky, oily water.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: LennStar on March 30, 2021, 05:20:40 AM
Not office supplies, work material.

People on the internet are talking about the employer who sent a man his final paycheck in the form of "motor-fluid-covered pennies"

https://www.nytimes.com/2021/03/25/business/auto-shop-pennies.html (https://www.nytimes.com/2021/03/25/business/auto-shop-pennies.html)

The employer's quote about how he "cannot remember" if he dropped off five hundred pounds of pennies somewhere is breath-taking.
As later written in the article (contrary the the first fat paragraph) even after Trump this is likely an environmental protection law violation. Was my first thought.

But I think it is interesting that there is no rule regarding to the form of payment.
How is it in the US? In Germany shops don't have to accept bills above 100€ (for small amounts) or heaps of cents. It should also go the other way.

Saying that, maybe someone wants to pay for his next repair in pennies? Securely deposited inside a block of concrete.

I think he should contact BOTH the environmental dept for hazmat dumping AND the labor board for non-payment.   Let his prior employer decide whether he wants to own up to the hazmat dumping and pay those fines or claim the coins aren't from him and PAY THE WAGES AGAIN.

I like the way you think

Me too.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: AlanStache on March 30, 2021, 08:54:12 AM
I just looked it up and in the US you can pay your federal taxes in cash at various gas and continent stations; if you showed up at 7-11 with a bucket of oil covered pennies to pay your 500$ tax bill (or to buy a cup of coffee) the clerk would tell you to pound sand.  Cash has utility for two reasons 1) we all agree to use it, 2) you can pay our taxes with it.  Oil covered pennies fail both those marks so I think you could make a case that he was not paid.  The point of money is to be a usable intermediate unit for exchange.  IANAL and all that...
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: NumberJohnny5 on March 30, 2021, 09:58:37 AM
The last time I looked this up (it's been a while), the technicality was that US currency was to be accepted for all DEBTS. A store could refuse to take a wheelbarrow of pennies. A gas station...I suppose it would depend. Have you already pumped gas? If so, I guess they have to accept it (assuming it's not hazardous waste). It's become more and more common for stations to require you to prepay for fuel, so they could refuse your twenty rolls of pennies if they wanted (no debt = no requirement to accept legal currency as payment).

The employer had a debt to the employee in the amount of $500. I don't reckon there's any legal requirement to NOT pay in pennies. That said, if the employer clearly stated they don't remember dropping off $500 of pennies via a wheelbarrow full of oil, I too would assume that they in fact did not do so. Had they paid via check, they'd have a copy of the cancelled check. Direct deposit, they can get a printout from their bank showing that the wages were indeed paid to the employee. Wheelbarrow just left out front...um...if "I" were the owner of a business and was paying employees legal wages in cash...I'd at least have them sign off stating they got the correct amount of money. Did they at least pull an Amazon and take a photo of the wheelbarrow by the front door? If not...one can make the assumption that the two things are related (wheelbarrow full of pennies plus payment stub on top), but if the employer denies knowledge...I would immediately assume they are NOT related (because there's no way they would forget a mode of payment that far removed from the norm). It's possible that the employer had someone drop off the last paycheck in cash, in a nice sealed envelope. Someone else comes along interested in the wheelbarrow full of money, decides against stealing it when they realize it's covered in oil, but happily takes the envelope full of cash (discarding the paystub in the process). The employer has not ensured that the payment was received by the proper recipient, so they need to re-issue the payment, preferably via a method that can be traced better than cash.

That's my two (oil-free) cents.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: LennStar on March 31, 2021, 04:15:10 AM
I just looked it up and in the US you can pay your federal taxes in cash at various gas and continent stations; if you showed up at 7-11 with a bucket of oil covered pennies to pay your 500$ tax bill (or to buy a cup of coffee) the clerk would tell you to pound sand.  Cash has utility for two reasons 1) we all agree to use it, 2) you can pay our taxes with it.  Oil covered pennies fail both those marks so I think you could make a case that he was not paid.  The point of money is to be a usable intermediate unit for exchange.  IANAL and all that...

Actually 1) comes from 2)
That is how money came into existance: States (governments/kings) wanted to pay soldiers. But paying them in hens is a hassle and quite dirty. So they created money. But what should soldiers do with money if nobody wanted it?
So the kings decided that taxes had to be paid with money, turning their realms economy into a money-seeking society. Since only soldier had money, the economy turned into an army-supporting enterprise.

At least that is what archeoligists and ethnologists will tell you. Most economists will do a very different story.
And btw. don't try to tell that to those "government is always bad and we do money without them" guys.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: grantmeaname on March 31, 2021, 06:00:12 AM
yeah, that's totally false
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Sibley on March 31, 2021, 10:44:32 AM
I just looked it up and in the US you can pay your federal taxes in cash at various gas and continent stations; if you showed up at 7-11 with a bucket of oil covered pennies to pay your 500$ tax bill (or to buy a cup of coffee) the clerk would tell you to pound sand.  Cash has utility for two reasons 1) we all agree to use it, 2) you can pay our taxes with it.  Oil covered pennies fail both those marks so I think you could make a case that he was not paid.  The point of money is to be a usable intermediate unit for exchange.  IANAL and all that...

Actually 1) comes from 2)
That is how money came into existance: States (governments/kings) wanted to pay soldiers. But paying them in hens is a hassle and quite dirty. So they created money. But what should soldiers do with money if nobody wanted it?
So the kings decided that taxes had to be paid with money, turning their realms economy into a money-seeking society. Since only soldier had money, the economy turned into an army-supporting enterprise.

At least that is what archeoligists and ethnologists will tell you. Most economists will do a very different story.
And btw. don't try to tell that to those "government is always bad and we do money without them" guys.

I believe that it was far more complicated than that, but it was certainly part of it. There's ample evidence of societies that had both physical money (coins) and extensive bartering, and both were necessary and valuable parts of the system. And I am aware of instances where taxes, or equivalent to taxes, were paid with labor or goods. Lower classes may not have had money and existed purely on a barter system, while the upper classes did have coin, but that doesn't mean that barter wasn't important either.

As for the archaeologists vs economists - both are interesting and valuable, but they're not looking at things in the same way, or for the same things. It's a weakness. Society is not black and white, and when you try to view it that way you will likely come to the wrong conclusion. A holistic approach, which considers many needs and influences, is much better for a fuller understanding. Or at least as much as we're able to understand of a society that existed hundreds or thousands of years ago.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: BicycleB on March 31, 2021, 02:59:13 PM
I just looked it up and in the US you can pay your federal taxes in cash at various gas and continent stations
"Your federal taxes" meaning "federal tax on gasoline"? Or "your federal income tax"?

I've heard of convenience stores offering to cash tax refund checks. Is that what you mean?

I'm assuming "continent station" is typo for "convenience store".
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: dandarc on March 31, 2021, 03:14:19 PM
You can pay your income taxes in cash at various retail stores around the country:

https://www.irs.gov/payments/pay-with-cash-at-a-retail-partner
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: simmias on March 31, 2021, 03:16:47 PM
You guys tell the best Epic FU money stories!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Taran Wanderer on March 31, 2021, 06:52:54 PM
This is definitely my favorite thread on the MMM Forum.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: BicycleB on March 31, 2021, 07:40:15 PM
You can pay your income taxes in cash at various retail stores around the country:

https://www.irs.gov/payments/pay-with-cash-at-a-retail-partner

I did not know that! (Obviously.) Sorry for the hijack, ya'll. Here's a true story for your trouble.

ETA: Did I tell this one before?? Long ago I meant not to tell it, to maintain anonymity. After writing this, it occurred to me that I've gotten slack lately and may have told it - probably in this very thread! But I can't find it. Anyway, enjoy this telling of the tale.

***

Sometimes it doesn't take a lot of cash to say FU to an employer. Sometimes it just takes a conscience, or a couple months' pay in the bank. That was my situation when I took down a multimillion dollar securities fraud.

I didn't know at first that I was working for crooks. I was just an early 20something with no job who answered an ad for "unlimited pay, make your own hours", aka commission sales. The product in that pre-internet era was a buying club membership for home furnishings. They trained you to make this hour long scripted pitch from a flip book, face to face with a customer at their home, to explain how their $700 lifetime membership would save them thousands of dollars on all the furniture purchases they'd make for the rest of their lives. If they bit, they could visit the showroom forever, peruse paper catalogs, and order from All The Major Manufacturers at wholesale pricing, meaning 50% off retail catalog price (though they had to pay 10% service fee).

Not as crazy as it sounds now, depending on the customer's purchasing habits, because retail was stodgy then and plenty of people would get at least some savings from it over time. Still a tough sell, but I closed a few before giving up the ghost. By then the owners had recognized other talents in me, and I became the Accounts Payable Manager at the princely rate of $4.25/hour. Hey, it was 90 cents above minimum wage!

The original proposition was legit, I soon found, in that real customers who had bought memberships would come in and order stuff. They'd pick out $3200 of furniture and write a $1600 check, and their furniture would be shipped to the store, and they'd come pick it up. They were happy enough, the business did what it said, all good.

It took me a while to detect the flaw - because it wasn't in the core business. It was in the execution that the owners had slipped from legitimate creativity into dubious schemes and, eventually, trouble. At first they’d done great in volume of membership sales, raking in cash from memberships. In our rural area, it more than paid the cost of a nice showroom with a little warehouse in the back and couple of clerks. When sales slowed, they hired new people (like me) to beat the bushes, maybe sell a few friends. Then came the fatal brainstorm: financing.

$700 was a lot for a membership, so they arranged a credit line where the customer could just make monthly payments until the $700 was paid off. The owners got $700 up front in commissions and hired a "Finance Manager" to handle the paperwork. The lender got paid over time, everyone happy. Interest was an ungodly 24%, but once the dotted line was signed, who cared?

I think the trouble began when they realized how much money 24% was. Wanting a slice, they started putting out ads in local newspaper of our rural area offering high interest to individuals, so that they could use the borrowed money to finance the contracts. “High” for the individuals might be 10% - a lot better than a savings account, better than bonds even back then, but enough to leave the owners a fat 14% profit. Perhaps a legitimate deal there too. Creative, eh?

By the time I started, they’d fallen behind on paying suppliers, maybe by spending a little too much on motorcycles and flying lessons, which was why I was hired. “Managing” the accounts receivable turned out to mean persuading angry furniture makers to send us the customers’ furniture when we hadn’t paid for the last batch yet! Once I understood, I showed backbone by proposing a deal of my own. “I’ll get us off hold,” I told the owners, “but you have to give me the service fee to use against our back bills.” I didn’t mean me personally, I mean my department got the money to use for catching up. It took a month or two to get the hang of persuading the suppliers and getting actual shipments in, but it worked. Slowly but surely, I was working down the backlog, getting all the orders filled, reducing what we owed. Until I realized nobody was selling memberships any more.

I’d been one of the last people to sell any memberships. A few people tried after me, but failed as quickly as I had, and no else was starting. The owners weren’t selling any either. But in the newspaper, there were ads where they were borrowing money for new contracts. Where was the money going?

I started asking questions to the nice ol’ country lady at the front desk who’d been there for years. Yep, there were people coming in and depositing money for the financing. Little old ladies putting in tens of thousands of dollars sometimes. Were any memberships being sold? Haven’t seen any lately. Well if there’s no sales, how will they pay back the promissory notes to the little old ladies?

“I don’t know,” she replied. “What are you thinking?”

I gulped and finally said, Well, they’re not getting any money from my department because we’re just catching up. I guess someday the service fees would be something, but it doesn’t seem like enough to pay the whole business. Honestly, I think I need to write a letter to the state that they’re taking people’s money and probably can’t pay it back.

“Well, are you gonna write ‘em?”

If they’re able to pay it back, interrupting them would make the whole thing to fall apart, and actually cause them not to pay the little old ladies. Have they gone up and down in sales before, or just gradually sold less and less? Less and less, she said. Well, I probably better write the state. I’ve never done anything like this before, I guess it’ll take a few days.

“Keep me posted,” she said.

Shortly thereafter, the owners began a new sales campaign. Activity buzzed all around. I delayed my letter and told the lady. But then, after a few weeks, they ran out of energy. “I’m gonna have to write,” I finally said. “Keep me posted,” again.

Three days later, having written fifteen pages longhand at home in the evenings but not yet sent the letter, I looked up from my desk to see three huge dudes in blue uniforms at the showroom door. They were state police, and they wanted to see the Treasurer. Shortly thereafter, I arrived at work in the morning to find padlocks on the door. The owners were sentenced to sixteen months in state prison for securities fraud. As I understand it, the promissory notes they gave the individual lenders should have been registered as securities but weren't.

Eventually I realized how the cards collapsed. The clerk lady had told her buddy, the finance manager, that the jig was up. Figuring it was better to report than be one of the people charged, Finance Manager reported to the state. I don’t think the little old ladies were ever paid.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: SwordGuy on April 01, 2021, 06:09:43 AM
So, here's an epic FU story I just remembered.

Back in the 1980s or 90s a dear friend of mine worked for a factory in Texas.   The management of the firm got a brilliant idea from the good idea fairy and implemented it in secret.

They were going to cut their labor costs big time!

Basically, everyone came to work Monday morning to discover they no longer worked for the company.   The company had hired an employee leasing firm to provide employees for them, so now they worked for this employee leasing firm -- for less pay and benefits.

Three fourths of the employees at the factory walked off the job that morning and didn't come back.
 
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Alternatepriorities on April 01, 2021, 11:36:47 AM
More of a funny exit than an FU story...

A friend is retiring from the navy after 20 years and they do exit counseling to help people transition to civilian life. Coordinating this for others has been his job for the last couple of years so he knows system.

He just sent me this summary of today's remote session.

It took an hour to introduce ourselves because none of the 20 people could figure out their mic or video or they were distracted when their turn came - even though we went alphabetically down the roster on the left side of the screen... Please introduce yourself and tell us using nonnavy terms what you do now and what you will do when you are out.

His answer:
I’m _____ I herd deaf cats with a squirt gun and plan to continue that when I get out by transitioning to be a stay at home dad.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: mm1970 on April 01, 2021, 11:42:47 AM
So, here's an epic FU story I just remembered.

Back in the 1980s or 90s a dear friend of mine worked for a factory in Texas.   The management of the firm got a brilliant idea from the good idea fairy and implemented it in secret.

They were going to cut their labor costs big time!

Basically, everyone came to work Monday morning to discover they no longer worked for the company.   The company had hired an employee leasing firm to provide employees for them, so now they worked for this employee leasing firm -- for less pay and benefits.

Three fourths of the employees at the factory walked off the job that morning and didn't come back.
 
This is pretty glorious
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: RyanAtTanagra on April 01, 2021, 11:45:05 AM
What happened to the factory?  I would hope something horrible, but I suspect probably a few days lost productivity until they staffed back up again?

It's sad the amount of bullshit that wouldn't happen if everyone just had some FU money and didn't put up with it.  Or maybe there'd be way more bullshit because some people would just be assholes w/ their FU money?
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: swashbucklinstache on April 01, 2021, 11:56:06 AM
It's 1000% them fishing for people who'll feel bad and pick up the slack, not wanting to use political points with other C suites if they don't have to, not $.
I'm baffled by this. Why does it cost anyone political points to fill a staffing need?  Can't someone just say to whoever has the authority, "Swashbucklinstache would be a great fit to lead tasks X, y, and Z, so I propose we offer her $300k and the title Chief Sub-Panjandrum if she will accept those responsibilities"?
You're not wrong, it isn't at all rational. Life and times of a consultancy though at this level. Asking for anything at all from another group, HR to literally do their job in this case, requires a political trade-off. It also requires the C suit to spend 10 consecutive minutes focusing on the division they run instead of how they can get promoted or an extra half percent on their bonus, (or actual more important things, to be fair) which probably explains the 9 month wait time. We bill our time in 6 minute increments and our company #2 starts her day by reviewing yesterday's numbers...

Not a surprise FI is on the mind, nor that more sanely run startups are eating our lunch.
Well, another week goes by. Through three relevant meetings I've heard:
A) separately, HR might make everyone doing your current role equal to your role, even for people doing versions 10% as complicated (roles I groomed them into and gave away 5+ years and 3 promotions ago)
B) in plans and meetings I've heard you're being put down as doing & owning the new roles, with the old people in as backup
C) we just did annual goals so I'm sure taking these roles was in yours
D) has this gone so far that you're just doing this now? I don't think we'll get any backing from (c suit requesting it who oversees these roles) on anything related to this but let me know if you need anything and I can try my best.

I did my boss a favor and let him know that under no circumstances will I be accepting these roles without title and compensation addressed, in line with my latest email from fall 2020, and that if I'm in any meeting where someone describes me as "role X lead" I will be speaking up to correct them regardless of who is in attendance.

Happy Monday everyone.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: RyanAtTanagra on April 01, 2021, 12:15:59 PM
I did my boss a favor and let him know that under no circumstances will I be accepting these roles without title and compensation addressed, in line with my latest email from fall 2020, and that if I'm in any meeting where someone describes me as "role X lead" I will be speaking up to correct them regardless of who is in attendance.

Niiiiice, what was his reply?
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: swashbucklinstache on April 01, 2021, 12:39:44 PM
I did my boss a favor and let him know that under no circumstances will I be accepting these roles without title and compensation addressed, in line with my latest email from fall 2020, and that if I'm in any meeting where someone describes me as "role X lead" I will be speaking up to correct them regardless of who is in attendance.

Niiiiice, what was his reply?
He said he'll take it to the C suit. 37th time's the charm, here's hoping.

Soon enough there'll be a day of reckoning when the internal client stops getting their needs met. I hope my boss is CYAing appropriately...
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Wolfpack Mustachian on April 01, 2021, 04:16:22 PM
What happened to the factory?  I would hope something horrible, but I suspect probably a few days lost productivity until they staffed back up again?

It's sad the amount of bullshit that wouldn't happen if everyone just had some FU money and didn't put up with it.  Or maybe there'd be way more bullshit because some people would just be assholes w/ their FU money?

If 3/4 of the people is an accurate amount that left, I would be surprised if the factory continued. Factory work can be very hard to staff for and for retention, regardless of solid pay. Add to that the amount of knowledge that would be lost (knowledge is a big commodity in manufacturing, especially floor knowledge on how to keep equipment running with all of its quirks), and I wouldn't be surprised if the factory never opened back up again. It certainly could, but this could be a death blow.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: zolotiyeruki on April 01, 2021, 10:33:08 PM
It's 1000% them fishing for people who'll feel bad and pick up the slack, not wanting to use political points with other C suites if they don't have to, not $.
I'm baffled by this. Why does it cost anyone political points to fill a staffing need?  Can't someone just say to whoever has the authority, "Swashbucklinstache would be a great fit to lead tasks X, y, and Z, so I propose we offer her $300k and the title Chief Sub-Panjandrum if she will accept those responsibilities"?
You're not wrong, it isn't at all rational. Life and times of a consultancy though at this level. Asking for anything at all from another group, HR to literally do their job in this case, requires a political trade-off. It also requires the C suit to spend 10 consecutive minutes focusing on the division they run instead of how they can get promoted or an extra half percent on their bonus, (or actual more important things, to be fair) which probably explains the 9 month wait time. We bill our time in 6 minute increments and our company #2 starts her day by reviewing yesterday's numbers...

Not a surprise FI is on the mind, nor that more sanely run startups are eating our lunch.
Well, another week goes by. Through three relevant meetings I've heard:
A) separately, HR might make everyone doing your current role equal to your role, even for people doing versions 10% as complicated (roles I groomed them into and gave away 5+ years and 3 promotions ago)
B) in plans and meetings I've heard you're being put down as doing & owning the new roles, with the old people in as backup
C) we just did annual goals so I'm sure taking these roles was in yours
D) has this gone so far that you're just doing this now? I don't think we'll get any backing from (c suit requesting it who oversees these roles) on anything related to this but let me know if you need anything and I can try my best.

I did my boss a favor and let him know that under no circumstances will I be accepting these roles without title and compensation addressed, in line with my latest email from fall 2020, and that if I'm in any meeting where someone describes me as "role X lead" I will be speaking up to correct them regardless of who is in attendance.

Happy Monday everyone.
This one is definitely popcorn-worthy.  I want to know what happens next!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: BikeFanatic on April 03, 2021, 01:05:33 AM
Quote
Leadership was totally floored when I resigned and started panicking over an upcoming big important meeting with the shit client. They wanted me to still attend.  I said nopey nope nope.

Epic!
I love that ending, what a bunch of dicks!

I wish I had an epic story, I felt so burnt out, and there was undue stress and some toxic people at my job, but mostly professional  with drama I'd say. I gave 2 weeks notice and said I will not consider any part time offers. That was January six months into a OMY senario.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Boll weevil on April 05, 2021, 09:25:29 AM
This one doesn’t fit into the typical employee bucks the employer narrative, but there’s still a good-humored FU in here.

We’re represented by a union, but work in a right-to-work/open shop state, so membership typically runs in the 25-35% range. But around contract negotiation time, the union goes on a big membership drive to try to have a better negotiating position (they’re typically able to get it up to 60-70% through the vote, and then it promptly falls back to usual levels until the next negotiation).

So a few years ago during one of those drives, they ask (coworker) to join. He keeps saying no, and eventually throws out that if the recruiter can get (lead, who isn’t at his desk but sits right across the aisle from (coworker)) to join, he’ll join too.

I’m not sure if (lead) is against all unions in general, but he has been fairly vocal about how he sees out union as worthless, so (coworker) had good reason to believe it wouldn’t happen.

So the recruiter comes back when (lead) is around and does his typical pitch, and (lead) of course says no. So then the recruiter mentions that the main reason he’s asking is that (coworker) said he’d join if (lead) did.

And (lead) says “Oh, in that case, sign me up.”

I heard about it later, and in that conversation (lead) said something to the effect of “That’ll teach (coworker) not to try to hide behind others on stuff like that.”
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: dandarc on April 05, 2021, 09:53:08 AM
That's a great one. They "Hold-my-beer"-ed each other into a smart decision.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: RyanAtTanagra on April 05, 2021, 10:08:27 AM
“That’ll teach (coworker) not to try to hide behind others on stuff like that.”

Now we need an Awesome Levels of FU Pettiness thread
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: scottish on April 05, 2021, 03:13:23 PM
“That’ll teach (coworker) not to try to hide behind others on stuff like that.”

Now we need an Awesome Levels of FU Pettiness thread

Maybe (coworker) learned how to say "Nopey nope nope nope" since then.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: fuzzy math on April 06, 2021, 08:46:22 AM
I have an epic FU story, but I did not have the FU money at the time to back it up, and its something that has come back to bite me in the ass over the years (small field). I still don't care and I'd do it the same way.

I worked for a private medical group that consisted of 11 people, with 5 of them being partners. They made all the decisions, they directed the employees when to work, they made 2x as much for the same job and they took 8 weeks of vacation a year while offering the employees 4. Basically any time a partner called you, you'd be getting reamed out, or told for whatever reason why you were to be the one doing the work that day while they sat on their asses.

I'd worked for this company for 3 years when things started going south. Partners were grumpy, they started acting real nervous. The company party was canceled, they had a meeting and told us there were financial problems. One of the partners was a dolt and had been put in charge of a contract that none of the other partners wanted to do. Dolt proceeded to generally fuck things up and they lost the contract. It had provided over 4 FTEs and they were sweating it. They didn't want to get rid of anyone because that would mean they'd have to do more work, so I think they slowly let the company coffers run dry.

A few months pass, and they let us know that they're going to have to let go of 2 people. They're "going to start asking around and soliciting feedback on everyone" so just hold tight and wait to see if you're listed as either of the 2 people (out of 6 employees) getting canned. I've been watching this, and having asked a lot of questions am acutely aware that canning 2 people will not make up for the loss of 4 FTEs.

At this time I'm pregnant, and one of the Doctors we work with invites me to their Christmas party because we're fairly friendly. Since the party is hosted at his partner physician's house, I pull him aside and ask if I can come to the party because I was invited by physician 1 and I didn't want to crash his house without him knowing I'm coming. It turns into this HUGE shitstorm where he's apologizing because he accidentally snubbed our entire group, he hadn't intended to forget us etc. He calls the partners to apologize and invite them, and I'm hung out to dry. The partners call ME, tell me that I've embarrassed the entire group, we could lose more contracts as a result of this etc etc. Later on that week in the middle of a clinical day I get told that I'm being pulled out of my patient assignment to have a meeting with all of the partners. I thought I was going to be fired on the spot. I called my husband, had him run to walmart and buy me a voice recorder and go to this meeting. In the end they just grilled me, harassed me about what an embarrassment I was and let me go back to taking care of my patient. I was totally fried, terrified, shaking etc.

Incident 2 regarding this employer. When I announced that I was pregnant, things had already started to go bad financially. They were obviously very annoyed that I'd dared to have another child (already had 1 baby while employed there), and when I told them my intent to take 7 weeks off and return like the previous time, I was told "you do not tell us what you will be taking. you can ask and we will let you know what's allowed. we did not appreciate your attitude and your assumption that you could do that stretch of time". I got a ton of shit over the phone, had multiple partners calling me, this one particular lady was horribly bitchy and was always tasked with being the awful disciplinarian with everyone. So I cry on the phone, say I don't understand why its a problem this time, and they let me know that 2 of the partners had already scheduled vacation for my anticipated leave time and that I must be back because they could not change their plans and we had to have enough people to cover our patient needs. I was also told that since vacation accrues during the year and cannot roll over to the next, I hadn't already earned the time or the right to be off for the current year.

The partners finally name 1 person who is going to be canned and give her 2 months notice so she can find a new job. They tell everyone that they like us all so much its so hard to decide that they just can't pick a 2nd person. I'm sitting there pregnant, evaluating the 2 incidents I listed above and realizing there's a good chance that they want me gone, but legally can't get rid of me while pregnant. So I have my baby, go on leave, interview for jobs while on maternity leave. The horrible bitch lady's oldest son is getting married on a Saturday so I give my notice to quit 2 days beforehand. I send them all an email titled "new employment" that says "I've taken a new job, my last day is X" and nothing else. A shit storm of phone calls occur and everyone's telling me I can't just give notice via email, that I'm burning my bridges, this is a small field and everyone knows everyone and it could hurt me etc. I know it ruined bitch lady's ability to relax and enjoy her precious poopsie's wedding and I would do it again IN A HEARTBEAT.

I know I should have done something legally regarding the pregnancy leave but I figured no matter what happened (if I had pursued something) they would have had justification for getting rid of me as the 2nd person. I let it go because I was naive and just wanted out. These people also harassed a coworker when she was assigned jury duty (also illegal!)

A follow up to the company - a 3rd employee left when I did and they were down to 8 employees. They never rehired, they clearly didn't have the money. The hospitals eventually got sick of them and told them their contracts weren't being renewed. The company folded and the partners all went to work as hospital employees with a fraction of the money or benefits they had earned by stiffing us employees. Good riddance to them. I still get nervous when I visit friends in that old town that I might run into bitch lady at Target or something, and whether I'd be ready to tell her off that I should have sued her.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Dicey on April 06, 2021, 02:47:39 PM
You can pay your income taxes in cash at various retail stores around the country:

https://www.irs.gov/payments/pay-with-cash-at-a-retail-partner

I did not know that! (Obviously.) Sorry for the hijack, ya'll. Here's a true story for your trouble.

ETA: Did I tell this one before?? Long ago I meant not to tell it, to maintain anonymity. After writing this, it occurred to me that I've gotten slack lately and may have told it - probably in this very thread! But I can't find it. Anyway, enjoy this telling of the tale.

***

Sometimes it doesn't take a lot of cash to say FU to an employer. Sometimes it just takes a conscience, or a couple months' pay in the bank. That was my situation when I took down a multimillion dollar securities fraud.

I didn't know at first that I was working for crooks. I was just an early 20something with no job who answered an ad for "unlimited pay, make your own hours", aka commission sales. The product in that pre-internet era was a buying club membership for home furnishings. They trained you to make this hour long scripted pitch from a flip book, face to face with a customer at their home, to explain how their $700 lifetime membership would save them thousands of dollars on all the furniture purchases they'd make for the rest of their lives. If they bit, they could visit the showroom forever, peruse paper catalogs, and order from All The Major Manufacturers at wholesale pricing, meaning 50% off retail catalog price (though they had to pay 10% service fee).

Not as crazy as it sounds now, depending on the customer's purchasing habits, because retail was stodgy then and plenty of people would get at least some savings from it over time. Still a tough sell, but I closed a few before giving up the ghost. By then the owners had recognized other talents in me, and I became the Accounts Payable Manager at the princely rate of $4.25/hour. Hey, it was 90 cents above minimum wage!

The original proposition was legit, I soon found, in that real customers who had bought memberships would come in and order stuff. They'd pick out $3200 of furniture and write a $1600 check, and their furniture would be shipped to the store, and they'd come pick it up. They were happy enough, the business did what it said, all good.

It took me a while to detect the flaw - because it wasn't in the core business. It was in the execution that the owners had slipped from legitimate creativity into dubious schemes and, eventually, trouble. At first they’d done great in volume of membership sales, raking in cash from memberships. In our rural area, it more than paid the cost of a nice showroom with a little warehouse in the back and couple of clerks. When sales slowed, they hired new people (like me) to beat the bushes, maybe sell a few friends. Then came the fatal brainstorm: financing.

$700 was a lot for a membership, so they arranged a credit line where the customer could just make monthly payments until the $700 was paid off. The owners got $700 up front in commissions and hired a "Finance Manager" to handle the paperwork. The lender got paid over time, everyone happy. Interest was an ungodly 24%, but once the dotted line was signed, who cared?

I think the trouble began when they realized how much money 24% was. Wanting a slice, they started putting out ads in local newspaper of our rural area offering high interest to individuals, so that they could use the borrowed money to finance the contracts. “High” for the individuals might be 10% - a lot better than a savings account, better than bonds even back then, but enough to leave the owners a fat 14% profit. Perhaps a legitimate deal there too. Creative, eh?

By the time I started, they’d fallen behind on paying suppliers, maybe by spending a little too much on motorcycles and flying lessons, which was why I was hired. “Managing” the accounts receivable turned out to mean persuading angry furniture makers to send us the customers’ furniture when we hadn’t paid for the last batch yet! Once I understood, I showed backbone by proposing a deal of my own. “I’ll get us off hold,” I told the owners, “but you have to give me the service fee to use against our back bills.” I didn’t mean me personally, I mean my department got the money to use for catching up. It took a month or two to get the hang of persuading the suppliers and getting actual shipments in, but it worked. Slowly but surely, I was working down the backlog, getting all the orders filled, reducing what we owed. Until I realized nobody was selling memberships any more.

I’d been one of the last people to sell any memberships. A few people tried after me, but failed as quickly as I had, and no else was starting. The owners weren’t selling any either. But in the newspaper, there were ads where they were borrowing money for new contracts. Where was the money going?

I started asking questions to the nice ol’ country lady at the front desk who’d been there for years. Yep, there were people coming in and depositing money for the financing. Little old ladies putting in tens of thousands of dollars sometimes. Were any memberships being sold? Haven’t seen any lately. Well if there’s no sales, how will they pay back the promissory notes to the little old ladies?

“I don’t know,” she replied. “What are you thinking?”

I gulped and finally said, Well, they’re not getting any money from my department because we’re just catching up. I guess someday the service fees would be something, but it doesn’t seem like enough to pay the whole business. Honestly, I think I need to write a letter to the state that they’re taking people’s money and probably can’t pay it back.

“Well, are you gonna write ‘em?”

If they’re able to pay it back, interrupting them would make the whole thing to fall apart, and actually cause them not to pay the little old ladies. Have they gone up and down in sales before, or just gradually sold less and less? Less and less, she said. Well, I probably better write the state. I’ve never done anything like this before, I guess it’ll take a few days.

“Keep me posted,” she said.

Shortly thereafter, the owners began a new sales campaign. Activity buzzed all around. I delayed my letter and told the lady. But then, after a few weeks, they ran out of energy. “I’m gonna have to write,” I finally said. “Keep me posted,” again.

Three days later, having written fifteen pages longhand at home in the evenings but not yet sent the letter, I looked up from my desk to see three huge dudes in blue uniforms at the showroom door. They were state police, and they wanted to see the Treasurer. Shortly thereafter, I arrived at work in the morning to find padlocks on the door. The owners were sentenced to sixteen months in state prison for securities fraud. As I understand it, the promissory notes they gave the individual lenders should have been registered as securities but weren't.

Eventually I realized how the cards collapsed. The clerk lady had told her buddy, the finance manager, that the jig was up. Figuring it was better to report than be one of the people charged, Finance Manager reported to the state. I don’t think the little old ladies were ever paid.
Hmmm, this sounds a bit familiar, but for a slightly different reason. Wasn't part of this scheme that the prices quoted did not include freight? So the customer paid cost +freight, which isn't quite the same as 50% savings?
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: BicycleB on April 06, 2021, 03:37:37 PM

Hmmm, this sounds a bit familiar, but for a slightly different reason. Wasn't part of this scheme that the prices quoted did not include freight? So the customer paid cost +freight, which isn't quite the same as 50% savings?


Freight from manufacturer to our showroom / warehouse was included. So was our labor (including mine) for unloading from the manufacturer's delivery truck into our warehouse, and if requested by the customer, from our warehouse floor onto the customer's pickup truck. We only had one warehouse guy so I helped him load stuff! Customers aka members just paid 10% service fee on the 50% of retail list.

It might sound like something else that did have a freight charge though. Or maybe I mis-explained before somewhere?

Anyway, when I saw the police and the padlock, it seemed epic to me. As did the newspaper story where they were sentenced to actual jail time.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Model96 on April 06, 2021, 05:38:20 PM
This one doesn’t fit into the typical employee bucks the employer narrative, but there’s still a good-humored FU in here.

We’re represented by a union, but work in a right-to-work/open shop state, so membership typically runs in the 25-35% range. But around contract negotiation time, the union goes on a big membership drive to try to have a better negotiating position (they’re typically able to get it up to 60-70% through the vote, and then it promptly falls back to usual levels until the next negotiation).

So a few years ago during one of those drives, they ask (coworker) to join. He keeps saying no, and eventually throws out that if the recruiter can get (lead, who isn’t at his desk but sits right across the aisle from (coworker)) to join, he’ll join too.

I’m not sure if (lead) is against all unions in general, but he has been fairly vocal about how he sees out union as worthless, so (coworker) had good reason to believe it wouldn’t happen.

So the recruiter comes back when (lead) is around and does his typical pitch, and (lead) of course says no. So then the recruiter mentions that the main reason he’s asking is that (coworker) said he’d join if (lead) did.

And (lead) says “Oh, in that case, sign me up.”

I heard about it later, and in that conversation (lead) said something to the effect of “That’ll teach (coworker) not to try to hide behind others on stuff like that.”

Some sad people and practices at that workplace......
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: mm1970 on April 07, 2021, 10:44:24 AM
I have an epic FU story, but I did not have the FU money at the time to back it up, and its something that has come back to bite me in the ass over the years (small field). I still don't care and I'd do it the same way.

I worked for a private medical group that consisted of 11 people, with 5 of them being partners.
*snip*

Okay, I found this a bit hard to follow because I'm not in the medical field, but my OB/GYN office has a similar setup (private medical office that does work AT the hospital, but not FOR the hospital).  So,  I can kinda sorta maybe understand the dynamics here.

I think you absolutely handled it in the best way possible, considering the circumstances.  Fuck 'em.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: swashbucklinstache on April 07, 2021, 02:09:39 PM
It's 1000% them fishing for people who'll feel bad and pick up the slack, not wanting to use political points with other C suites if they don't have to, not $.
I'm baffled by this. Why does it cost anyone political points to fill a staffing need?  Can't someone just say to whoever has the authority, "Swashbucklinstache would be a great fit to lead tasks X, y, and Z, so I propose we offer her $300k and the title Chief Sub-Panjandrum if she will accept those responsibilities"?
You're not wrong, it isn't at all rational. Life and times of a consultancy though at this level. Asking for anything at all from another group, HR to literally do their job in this case, requires a political trade-off. It also requires the C suit to spend 10 consecutive minutes focusing on the division they run instead of how they can get promoted or an extra half percent on their bonus, (or actual more important things, to be fair) which probably explains the 9 month wait time. We bill our time in 6 minute increments and our company #2 starts her day by reviewing yesterday's numbers...

Not a surprise FI is on the mind, nor that more sanely run startups are eating our lunch.
Well, another week goes by. Through three relevant meetings I've heard:
A) separately, HR might make everyone doing your current role equal to your role, even for people doing versions 10% as complicated (roles I groomed them into and gave away 5+ years and 3 promotions ago)
B) in plans and meetings I've heard you're being put down as doing & owning the new roles, with the old people in as backup
C) we just did annual goals so I'm sure taking these roles was in yours
D) has this gone so far that you're just doing this now? I don't think we'll get any backing from (c suit requesting it who oversees these roles) on anything related to this but let me know if you need anything and I can try my best.

I did my boss a favor and let him know that under no circumstances will I be accepting these roles without title and compensation addressed, in line with my latest email from fall 2020, and that if I'm in any meeting where someone describes me as "role X lead" I will be speaking up to correct them regardless of who is in attendance.

Happy Monday everyone.
This one is definitely popcorn-worthy.  I want to know what happens next!
Well, so far today I've heard from the internal client that they really want someone in this role ASAP,  with a response rom my to-be peer that they've seen me put in the role on paper already. The client is politically savvy enough to see what's happening and quickly changed the subject.

Later in the meeting they asked me to follow up with the person currently in the role about getting a name assigned to some task, with organizing such things being a key part of the role.  Current role-ee (-er?) gave an answer essentially indicating they're not considering themselves accountable for getting the answer any longer, indirectly implying that it was up to me. My to-be peer, who is a nice person but sometimes misses the subtlety (see above) IMs me innocently suggesting that, no joke, I might be a good fit for doing that task if we don't have a name.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: RyanAtTanagra on April 07, 2021, 03:07:45 PM
Well, so far today I've heard from the internal client that they really want someone in this role ASAP,  with a response rom my to-be peer that they've seen me put in the role on paper already. The client is politically savvy enough to see what's happening and quickly changed the subject.

Later in the meeting they asked me to follow up with the person currently in the role about getting a name assigned to some task, with organizing such things being a key part of the role.  Current role-ee (-er?) gave an answer essentially indicating they're not considering themselves accountable for getting the answer any longer, indirectly implying that it was up to me. My to-be peer, who is a nice person but sometimes misses the subtlety (see above) IMs me innocently suggesting that, no joke, I might be a good fit for doing that task if we don't have a name.

I assume/hope your responses have been either silence or 'this is not my responsibility'?
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: swashbucklinstache on April 07, 2021, 03:50:52 PM
Well, so far today I've heard from the internal client that they really want someone in this role ASAP,  with a response rom my to-be peer that they've seen me put in the role on paper already. The client is politically savvy enough to see what's happening and quickly changed the subject.

Later in the meeting they asked me to follow up with the person currently in the role about getting a name assigned to some task, with organizing such things being a key part of the role.  Current role-ee (-er?) gave an answer essentially indicating they're not considering themselves accountable for getting the answer any longer, indirectly implying that it was up to me. My to-be peer, who is a nice person but sometimes misses the subtlety (see above) IMs me innocently suggesting that, no joke, I might be a good fit for doing that task if we don't have a name.

I assume/hope your responses have been either silence or 'this is not my responsibility'?
Yep. Still developing of course, but silence to the person currently in the role and joking deflecting to the to-be peer, just because they're not politically savvy/important enough to hear the truth honestly and were genuinely trying to be helpful, like a doe in the woods on their first "opening day". I am starting to tire of repeatedly being put in a position where the truth is "no one knows, because my great-grandboss can't answer a simple question in 10 months" to a politically connected internal client of his, who already knows that's the answer but benefits from me being the one to say it out loud. I think I'll let my boss know that tomorrow and re-verbalize that I've bit my tongue for the last time on the matter and he should engage in serious CYA now if he hasn't already. My CYA is a lot of money in the bank and a paper trail for good measure. Of course, I'd make the point politely and professionally or just stop attending meetings, no sense being rash. Unlike this absolute legend: https://www.voiceofsandiego.org/topics/news/city-comptroller-i-said-no-to-filner-credit-card-expenses/ (https://www.voiceofsandiego.org/topics/news/city-comptroller-i-said-no-to-filner-credit-card-expenses/)

Quote
Whitfield said he did not have any problem denying the mayor’s office’s requests. He said the best advice he’s received came from his boss from his first job: Always put some money away so that you have the independence to say no, even to people above you.

“I’ve got a lot of fucking money in the bank,” Whitfield said. “It allows me to sleep at night. It allows me to do my job with a whole lot integrity and not worry about losing it.”

If you ever wonder why your boss doesn't accomplish anything and doesn't "get it" it might be because she/he's dealing with stuff like this all day. Suppose that may well be what's going on in my great-grandboss's world as well in this situation too. At some point though you need to tell your boss to get out of the way because you have decisions to make. Or maybe the great-grandboss doesn't want the role filled by his team at all. Who knows. I don't and I'm also done caring.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Blackeagle on April 07, 2021, 05:01:54 PM
https://www.voiceofsandiego.org/topics/news/city-comptroller-i-said-no-to-filner-credit-card-expenses/ (https://www.voiceofsandiego.org/topics/news/city-comptroller-i-said-no-to-filner-credit-card-expenses/)

Quote
Whitfield said he did not have any problem denying the mayor’s office’s requests. He said the best advice he’s received came from his boss from his first job: Always put some money away so that you have the independence to say no, even to people above you.

“I’ve got a lot of fucking money in the bank,” Whitfield said. “It allows me to sleep at night. It allows me to do my job with a whole lot integrity and not worry about losing it.”

That’s a pretty epic FU money story!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Zamboni on April 07, 2021, 07:53:34 PM
Lol, the SD mayor is clearly corrupt, but the Comptroller also sounds like a pain in the ass. Glad he has FU money to enable being a pain in the ass, but he seems like the kind of guy who makes other people wish they had their own FU money.

I work with someone who "questions every expense" for our department. It just gets really old having to explain things like why I used colored paper for a particular batch of copies because she's just stopping by to make sure I know that "colored paper costs more than white paper." Umm, yeah, I'm aware, but I get paid so much that the time I just spent justifying my easily justifiable use of the colored paper for that task last week has now wiped out all of the pennies you "saved" our employer for the entire year with your pettiness. She's also convinced that employees are stealing the dry ice because less get signed out than gets delivered each week. She doesn't understand the concepts of sublimation and thermal energy . . . she wanted to actually install a camera in the area where the dry ice is stored to catch the culprits.

Lol, some day I should submit my resignation letter on colored paper. Pink!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: LennStar on April 08, 2021, 03:57:06 AM
Lol, the SD mayor is clearly corrupt, but the Comptroller also sounds like a pain in the ass. Glad he has FU money to enable being a pain in the ass, but he seems like the kind of guy who makes other people wish they had their own FU money.

I work with someone who "questions every expense" for our department. It just gets really old having to explain things like why I used colored paper for a particular batch of copies because she's just stopping by to make sure I know that "colored paper costs more than white paper." Umm, yeah, I'm aware, but I get paid so much that the time I just spent justifying my easily justifiable use of the colored paper for that task last week has now wiped out all of the pennies you "saved" our employer for the entire year with your pettiness. She's also convinced that employees are stealing the dry ice because less get signed out than gets delivered each week. She doesn't understand the concepts of sublimation and thermal energy . . . she wanted to actually install a camera in the area where the dry ice is stored to catch the culprits.

Lol, some day I should submit my resignation letter on colored paper. Pink!

What does she think people do with the dry ice? Do a Corona-party every week? What do you do with that stuff privately?

Any yeas, I have seen (and heard a lot) about paper usage tracking. Somehow they never seem to realize that even if they prevent every private printout their wage alone is more expensive. Generally people have the moral thinking that 2 pages a month because it just happend is okay, but not 20 and don't do that at work.

Or the all-time favorite of the genious controller who insisted on thinner toilet paper and was then surprised that people used more. 
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: swashbucklinstache on April 08, 2021, 06:59:24 AM
Lol, the SD mayor is clearly corrupt, but the Comptroller also sounds like a pain in the ass. Glad he has FU money to enable being a pain in the ass, but he seems like the kind of guy who makes other people wish they had their own FU money.

I work with someone who "questions every expense" for our department. It just gets really old having to explain things like why I used colored paper for a particular batch of copies because she's just stopping by to make sure I know that "colored paper costs more than white paper." Umm, yeah, I'm aware, but I get paid so much that the time I just spent justifying my easily justifiable use of the colored paper for that task last week has now wiped out all of the pennies you "saved" our employer for the entire year with your pettiness. She's also convinced that employees are stealing the dry ice because less get signed out than gets delivered each week. She doesn't understand the concepts of sublimation and thermal energy . . . she wanted to actually install a camera in the area where the dry ice is stored to catch the culprits.

Lol, some day I should submit my resignation letter on colored paper. Pink!

What does she think people do with the dry ice? Do a Corona-party every week? What do you do with that stuff privately?

Any yeas, I have seen (and heard a lot) about paper usage tracking. Somehow they never seem to realize that even if they prevent every private printout their wage alone is more expensive. Generally people have the moral thinking that 2 pages a month because it just happend is okay, but not 20 and don't do that at work.

Or the all-time favorite of the genious controller who insisted on thinner toilet paper and was then surprised that people used more.
The answer to what you do at home with dry ice is always putting dish soap on it and running water over it or doing a ribbon seal like this:
https://youtu.be/tM9mi-5t_Ug (https://youtu.be/tM9mi-5t_Ug)


But the penny counter reminds me of when my university finally got rid of the job of going to every dorm and turning on/off the ability to either make or track the time used for long distance phone calls. Paying the department to do that cost much more than just letting everyone use it.


I do think in the SD case it was more 10k handbags, things for around the house, and first class travel upgrades if I recall correctly.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Sandi_k on April 08, 2021, 11:08:37 AM

But the penny counter reminds me of when my university finally got rid of the job of going to every dorm and turning on/off the ability to either make or track the time used for long distance phone calls. Paying the department to do that cost much more than just letting everyone use it.


OMG, yes. One of my first jobs at my university was compiling and "billing" faculty for the faxes they sent out over the departmental machine. It took 20 hours per month to do the billing, and netted probably $50 back to the department's coffers.

When I became manager in a different unit a few years later, I unilaterally stopped the practice of charging for faxes, and became beloved by the faculty, *and* the staff who had been undertaking that task for years.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Malee55 on April 12, 2021, 09:50:45 PM
I have never considered having FU money because I have always loved my job (I am a nurse). However I look back at my career and I know that I have not applied for promotion because I did not want the extra stress and did not need more money. The extra money was minute and to me definitely not worth it. Having that option is so worth it.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: draco44 on April 12, 2021, 09:57:02 PM
I have never considered having FU money because I have always loved my job (I am a nurse). However I look back at my career and I know that I have not applied for promotion because I did not want the extra stress and did not need more money. The extra money was minute and to me definitely not worth it. Having that option is so worth it.

I like this. It's preemptively saying FU to a job that wouldn't be good for you. The cleanest exit of all.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: AMandM on April 18, 2021, 07:26:45 PM
I am starting to tire of repeatedly being put in a position where the truth is "no one knows, because my great-grandboss can't answer a simple question in 10 months" to a politically connected internal client of his, who already knows that's the answer but benefits from me being the one to say it out loud. I think I'll let my boss know that tomorrow and re-verbalize that I've bit my tongue for the last time on the matter and he should engage in serious CYA now if he hasn't already.

It's been almost two weeks! Anything new? Maybe you're not updating the forum because you're off on a beach somewhere enjoying your FU money ;-)
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: swashbucklinstache on April 19, 2021, 06:27:11 AM
I am starting to tire of repeatedly being put in a position where the truth is "no one knows, because my great-grandboss can't answer a simple question in 10 months" to a politically connected internal client of his, who already knows that's the answer but benefits from me being the one to say it out loud. I think I'll let my boss know that tomorrow and re-verbalize that I've bit my tongue for the last time on the matter and he should engage in serious CYA now if he hasn't already.

It's been almost two weeks! Anything new? Maybe you're not updating the forum because you're off on a beach somewhere enjoying your FU money ;-)
Sadly I'm getting 2-3 'requests' a day and didn't want to just spam the thread everyday!

The latest reading between the lines is that I think the great-grandboss is going to declare my boss accountable for these roles to not deal with it. For me that means that since it will then be a direct line up from me, as opposed to now where my "uncle" is accountable, it is more of a "reassignment" than a "we're interested in you taking on this stretch role if you're interested" deal. That should mean it is a little harder to say FU to my immediate boss than the faceless C suit, and doubly so because I'm senior enough in a fluid enough industry that this isn't really an inappropriate/uncommon sort of thing. (Consulting job descriptions are basically "get it done, level appropriately").

I proactively nipped that in the bud with my boss and made it clear that I do not care who is accountable for the role, my questions still stand. In the meantime I continue to take on the pieces that are interesting to me and either ignore, say no to, or do the others as slowly as possible.

The bigger piece is that, unfortunately, my main project work ends 6/30. We're a billable industry where you eat what you kill and I don't yet have anything lined up. So the closer we creep to that day the closer we get to me not really being able to say no, because I'd then be saying "instead of doing this role I would prefer to instead do nothing and still get paid for it." So I'm talking with my boss this week to try to find other project opportunities. If I get defaulted into the role I will still push for $$ up front and will make it very clear that I'm unhappy with being backdoored into things if we get there. It sucks, because this is a role that could be fun (strategy and process creation) and have outsized returns (growth) if a happy and motivated employee does it and "kept the lights on" returns if they're not.

I've also spent the weekend getting my resume in shape. My industry, tech/data, is on fire right now. I could credibly apply to senior individual contributor roles at better companies, senior analytics or product manager roles at peer companies, or associate/director of analytics positions at smaller companies. I got pinged last week by a big tech recruiter for a data science position that would double my total comp. We're talking this week. I'm not competitive really and they hand out interviews like candy but you only need one to say yes...

For context, I'm at 835k which is a 2.9% WR for my current expenses (24k avg. the last 8 years). My FIRE plans are atypical though, as they're either "I have no idea, I'm only 32, let's not lock us in to < 40k a year before life events" or "spend a few years AirBnbing in city centers where housing alone takes you to 4.5% WR, plus some seed money gifted for others' retirement, so maybe 1.3-1.6mm?" I'm saving 115k a year, so it would be ideal if this company would just stay reasonable for the next 1-3 years...
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: alcon835 on April 19, 2021, 07:49:51 AM
...I'm saving 115k a year, so it would be ideal if this company would just stay reasonable for the next 1-3 years...

That, right there, is the hard part about being so close to full Financial Independance when you're young. In my experience, the devil you know is often worse than the devil you don't - since you can vet for and negotiate against the things you don't like. I say, keep interviewing and looking at the options that are out there. No reason to be unhappy and forced into something you shouldn't be doing.

You aren't simply a cog to be moved around at your boss' (or boss' boss') desires. You are hired to fulfill a role and you enjoy it. More, you're willing to make the move and provide meaningfully higher ROI to your company. There is, quite honestly, no reason for them to force you into this without more pay.

And if you really do like it, then maybe showing them an offer from another company will be enough for them to write the check for your transition.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: swashbucklinstache on April 19, 2021, 09:27:32 AM
...I'm saving 115k a year, so it would be ideal if this company would just stay reasonable for the next 1-3 years...

That, right there, is the hard part about being so close to full Financial Independance when you're young. In my experience, the devil you know is often worse than the devil you don't - since you can vet for and negotiate against the things you don't like. I say, keep interviewing and looking at the options that are out there. No reason to be unhappy and forced into something you shouldn't be doing.

You aren't simply a cog to be moved around at your boss' (or boss' boss') desires. You are hired to fulfill a role and you enjoy it. More, you're willing to make the move and provide meaningfully higher ROI to your company. There is, quite honestly, no reason for them to force you into this without more pay.

And if you really do like it, then maybe showing them an offer from another company will be enough for them to write the check for your transition.
Yep, exactly this. The company is essentially totally recession proof as well, and a lot of my value is accrued middle management company-specific knowledge. Even more, if I say no to these roles it will kill career progression here but it's very unlikely there'd be any further consequence. So I'm looking, but the deal would have to be sweet to jump. As little as another year or two could totally remove $ from the equation.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: elysianfields on April 19, 2021, 09:16:45 PM
Another bonus of being a Mustachian and ex-Boglehead is that at my current employer, I complained about our crappy 401k. The owners told me to write up a paper showing proof, which convinced them. Ended up moving the 401k to Guideline, reducing employer fees/costs by 77%.

That is the bomb, @jinga nation , way to implement a win-win!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: bluebelle on April 20, 2021, 11:44:46 AM
I have to wait for the lawsuits to settle before I give any details, but I never thought I'd have a story for this thread.   It's not in my nature to burn bridges on the way out, but the company fired the first salvo.   And it may not be 'epic', but having FU money has certainly given me the safety net to do what is right for my health.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: RyanAtTanagra on April 20, 2021, 11:47:16 AM
I have to wait for the lawsuits to settle before I give any details, but I never thought I'd have a story for this thread.   It's not in my nature to burn bridges on the way out, but the company fired the first salvo.   And it may not be 'epic', but having FU money has certainly given me the safety net to do what is right for my health.

I don't know how it can fail to be epic with lawsuits involved.  Can't wait to hear it.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: dandarc on April 20, 2021, 12:47:57 PM
I have to wait for the lawsuits to settle before I give any details, but I never thought I'd have a story for this thread.   It's not in my nature to burn bridges on the way out, but the company fired the first salvo.   And it may not be 'epic', but having FU money has certainly given me the safety net to do what is right for my health.

I don't know how it can fail to be epic with lawsuits involved.  Can't wait to hear it.

+1. Best of luck bluebelle, and please do keep us posted!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: ysette9 on April 20, 2021, 02:03:45 PM
If I pop my popcorn now will it be stale by the time the story drops? Can’t wait!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Blackeagle on April 20, 2021, 04:51:16 PM
I have to wait for the lawsuits to settle before I give any details, but I never thought I'd have a story for this thread.   It's not in my nature to burn bridges on the way out, but the company fired the first salvo.   And it may not be 'epic', but having FU money has certainly given me the safety net to do what is right for my health.

Congrats bluebelle. Looking forward to hearing the story when you can tell it.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Freedomin5 on April 21, 2021, 03:37:28 AM
I have to wait for the lawsuits to settle before I give any details, but I never thought I'd have a story for this thread.   It's not in my nature to burn bridges on the way out, but the company fired the first salvo.   And it may not be 'epic', but having FU money has certainly given me the safety net to do what is right for my health.

I don't know how it can fail to be epic with lawsuits involved.  Can't wait to hear it.

And it looks like bluebelle is Canadian. We hardly ever sue each other and are not known to be a particularly litigious society. Now my curiosity really is piqued.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Hula Hoop on May 05, 2021, 03:03:48 PM
This story made me think of this thread.  https://www.bbc.com/news/business-56977650 (https://www.bbc.com/news/business-56977650)

In a nutshell, a cleaner in a bank in the UK quit and retired after being verbally abused by one of the bankers.  She left a note telling them that she had quit because of the verbal abuse and advising them to be kinder which her son posted online.  Good for her!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: RWTL on May 06, 2021, 03:27:40 AM
This story made me think of this thread.  https://www.bbc.com/news/business-56977650 (https://www.bbc.com/news/business-56977650)

In a nutshell, a cleaner in a bank in the UK quit and retired after being verbally abused by one of the bankers.  She left a note telling them that she had quit because of the verbal abuse and advising them to be kinder which her son posted online.  Good for her!

Thanks for sharing this.  The note is totally right - we are ALL no better than the cleaner.  Some people need to have their attitudes checked.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Taran Wanderer on May 06, 2021, 10:30:32 AM
I was going through our local international airport last month. I was struck again by how clean the bathroom was - they are always clean! I scanned the QR code and left a compliment and thank you on the complaint form. This makes me glad I did!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Hula Hoop on May 07, 2021, 03:38:43 AM
This story made me think of this thread.  https://www.bbc.com/news/business-56977650 (https://www.bbc.com/news/business-56977650)

In a nutshell, a cleaner in a bank in the UK quit and retired after being verbally abused by one of the bankers.  She left a note telling them that she had quit because of the verbal abuse and advising them to be kinder which her son posted online.  Good for her!

Thanks for sharing this.  The note is totally right - we are ALL no better than the cleaner.  Some people need to have their attitudes checked.

Agreed 100%
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: alcon835 on May 07, 2021, 06:59:33 AM
I was going through our local international airport last month. I was struck again by how clean the bathroom was - they are always clean! I scanned the QR code and left a compliment and thank you on the complaint form. This makes me glad I did!

Yeah, a lot of airport bathrooms have the Smile/frown thing (or they did pre-COVID). If the bathroom was clean, I always hit the smile.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Bloop Bloop Reloaded on May 08, 2021, 03:53:42 AM
Settlements usually have a non-disparagement clause so you have to be careful what you say.

Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: BicycleB on May 08, 2021, 06:42:58 AM
Settlements usually have a non-disparagement clause so you have to be careful what you say.

Here's hoping that our anonymous forum provides just enough wiggle room for the story to be told!

In the spirit of Dickens, character names can be expressive, even while in our forum, they obscure identities. Soon we will learn the secret tale behind this generation's Jarndyce v Jarndyce. Right???
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Dicey on May 09, 2021, 01:24:26 PM
Settlements usually have a non-disparagement clause so you have to be careful what you say.

Here's hoping that our anonymous forum provides just enough wiggle room for the story to be told!

In the spirit of Dickens, character names can be expressive, even while in our forum, they obscure identities. Soon we will learn the secret tale behind this generation's Jarndyce v Jarndyce. Right???
Well, that was an interesting rabbit hole. Thanks!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: RWD on May 13, 2021, 07:40:38 AM
I have declined two pointless meetings this week without giving a reason. No one has asked so far.
I got a promotion so I figure my company likes me enough that I could push harder against useless meetings. I'm on two projects where the project manager likes to hold meetings twice a week to "touch base" (ugh). I'm fine with once a week but apparently I'm supposed to be grateful its not like some other projects where they meet every day... I rarely have much to contribute to these meetings and almost everything could be handled with a few e-mails anyway.

So this week I declined two recurring meetings with barely any justification, all four meetings next week (vacation), and the first two meetings the week after that (no justification at all). That was on Monday and the project manager hasn't said a thing. In fact, he ended up cancelling the other two meetings this week so it looks like I'll be able to avoid ten meetings in a row!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Fru-Gal on May 13, 2021, 06:34:53 PM
Bravo, @RWD!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: pdxvandal on May 14, 2021, 10:48:22 AM
Nice work @RWD! Behold, the power of FU money. Unfortunately, I took a meeting at 4 p.m. yesterday on a gorgeous sunny day, however, no one knew I already got my Vitamin D that afternoon by playing 9 holes of "medical appointment" golf. Just starting to dip my toes into FIRE life, but hope to officially be there 12-18 months from now.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: lutorm on May 26, 2021, 12:49:34 AM
So this week I declined two recurring meetings with barely any justification, all four meetings next week (vacation), and the first two meetings the week after that (no justification at all). That was on Monday and the project manager hasn't said a thing. In fact, he ended up cancelling the other two meetings this week so it looks like I'll be able to avoid ten meetings in a row!
The CEO of our company regularly sends out emails to the effect of "if you're in a meeting that you don't feel is worth your time, you have my personal permission to walk out". ;-)
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: AMandM on May 26, 2021, 10:46:18 AM
The CEO of our company regularly sends out emails to the effect of "if you're in a meeting that you don't feel is worth your time, you have my personal permission to walk out". ;-)

And does it work? Do people at your company regularly walk out of unproductive meetings? Or are your company's meetings generally productive?
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: former player on May 26, 2021, 11:28:20 AM
One firm here in the UK was reputed to have a "money" clock in its meeting rooms - everyone at the meeting had to put in their hourly rate when they entered the room and the clock totted up the cost of the meeting for as long as it continued, as an incentive to finish.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: zolotiyeruki on May 26, 2021, 12:51:43 PM
One firm here in the UK was reputed to have a "money" clock in its meeting rooms - everyone at the meeting had to put in their hourly rate when they entered the room and the clock totted up the cost of the meeting for as long as it continued, as an incentive to finish.
That is absolutely brilliant!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: AlanStache on May 26, 2021, 01:52:04 PM
One firm here in the UK was reputed to have a "money" clock in its meeting rooms - everyone at the meeting had to put in their hourly rate when they entered the room and the clock totted up the cost of the meeting for as long as it continued, as an incentive to finish.
That is absolutely brilliant!

Brilliant or a way to be penny wise pound foolish.... 

But my employer could legitimately be accused of having to few meetings.  (yes that can actually be a thing.)
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Tinker on May 26, 2021, 02:24:53 PM
One firm here in the UK was reputed to have a "money" clock in its meeting rooms - everyone at the meeting had to put in their hourly rate when they entered the room and the clock totted up the cost of the meeting for as long as it continued, as an incentive to finish.
you could see that as an incentive to finish... or an incentive to keep watching that tick up while you do next to nothing.
In all seriousness, most meetings should be emails. And most emails shouldn't exist.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: former player on May 26, 2021, 02:32:22 PM
One firm here in the UK was reputed to have a "money" clock in its meeting rooms - everyone at the meeting had to put in their hourly rate when they entered the room and the clock totted up the cost of the meeting for as long as it continued, as an incentive to finish.
you could see that as an incentive to finish... or an incentive to keep watching that tick up while you do next to nothing.
In all seriousness, most meetings should be emails. And most emails shouldn't exist.
To be fair, this was BE (Before Email).

It's a wonder we survived at all.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: lutorm on May 26, 2021, 02:48:35 PM
The CEO of our company regularly sends out emails to the effect of "if you're in a meeting that you don't feel is worth your time, you have my personal permission to walk out". ;-)

And does it work? Do people at your company regularly walk out of unproductive meetings? Or are your company's meetings generally productive?
I think it sort of does, it does lead to a strong company-wide awareness that meetings aren't free, and unless people are directly asked to attend a meeting I think there's no pushback if you don't. The principle applies more strongly to large meetings, if you have a one on one with your manager and you walk out, I doubt that would be appreciated... ;-)

Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: marty998 on May 26, 2021, 08:53:03 PM
Settlements usually have a non-disparagement clause so you have to be careful what you say.

Here's hoping that our anonymous forum provides just enough wiggle room for the story to be told!

In the spirit of Dickens, character names can be expressive, even while in our forum, they obscure identities. Soon we will learn the secret tale behind this generation's Jarndyce v Jarndyce. Right???
Well, that was an interesting rabbit hole. Thanks!

Only in law can telling the truth wind you up in more trouble.

Estate battles are epic. Can’t divulge too many details but I once worked at a small accounting practice whose ongoing viability was underwritten by a certain estate. The fees charged made up a significant proportion of what one could consider to be the “4%” generated from the estate.

The firm also had on board as a client the lawyer responsible for defending the estate in court, and he would have eaten up the remainder of the 4%.

Conceivably, this is still continuing a couple of decades on, and could go on in perpetuity as the estate had a long track record of generating investment returns significantly in excess of 4%.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: badger1988 on May 26, 2021, 09:19:53 PM
More of a "no thanks" story than "FU" story, but I thought I'd post here because having a big stash and not desiring to inflate my lifestyle is what makes answers to questions like these pretty easy for me:

I work as an engineer in product development for a large corporation. The manufacturing side of our business unit has been swamped with demand, and hasn't been able to hire skilled labor quickly enough to meet it. So, today I get a call from my manager out of the blue offering me the opportunity to work an additional 20hrs/wk through the end of August as a machinist. The idea is that I could do something like 6x10hr days: M-Th in my normal engineering function, and F-Sa as a machinist making equivalent of time and a half my normal salary. I did the math, and it would have worked out to about $24,000 worth of overtime. It could be a fun change of pace, but from a work-life balance I'd much rather have my summer free this year and tack a few months of normal work onto the end of my career. So, it was an easy "no thanks" for me.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: NumberJohnny5 on May 28, 2021, 01:48:43 PM
While we're waiting on something actually Epic and/or FU, I'll share our most recent story.

Wife was offered a job contingent on her getting a bachelor's degree. Turns out they couldn't actually offer that, so she was offered a different position with a verbal promise that the original job would be hers when she did get the degree. She'd have to work nights in the interim, which she hates, but figured it'd be for a year max.

A year passes, she graduates, they post the job listing, and her manager explains that there have been a few other applicants. Basically, prepping my wife for the possibility that she might not get the position. Few days later, wife puts in a PTO request to start burning up the weeks she's accumulated, states she wants to go to days when she gets back, AND asks her manager to fill out a referral form for her because she's started applying to other jobs. She got the official offer (for the originally promised position) within the week.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: FlytilFIRE on May 28, 2021, 03:12:35 PM
Bravo, 5.
Well played by your partner.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: SwordGuy on May 28, 2021, 03:14:50 PM
While we're waiting on something actually Epic and/or FU, I'll share our most recent story.

Wife was offered a job contingent on her getting a bachelor's degree. Turns out they couldn't actually offer that, so she was offered a different position with a verbal promise that the original job would be hers when she did get the degree. She'd have to work nights in the interim, which she hates, but figured it'd be for a year max.

A year passes, she graduates, they post the job listing, and her manager explains that there have been a few other applicants. Basically, prepping my wife for the possibility that she might not get the position. Few days later, wife puts in a PTO request to start burning up the weeks she's accumulated, states she wants to go to days when she gets back, AND asks her manager to fill out a referral form for her because she's started applying to other jobs. She got the official offer (for the originally promised position) within the week.

Sounds pretty darn epic to me!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Wolfpack Mustachian on May 29, 2021, 04:54:04 AM
While we're waiting on something actually Epic and/or FU, I'll share our most recent story.

Wife was offered a job contingent on her getting a bachelor's degree. Turns out they couldn't actually offer that, so she was offered a different position with a verbal promise that the original job would be hers when she did get the degree. She'd have to work nights in the interim, which she hates, but figured it'd be for a year max.

A year passes, she graduates, they post the job listing, and her manager explains that there have been a few other applicants. Basically, prepping my wife for the possibility that she might not get the position. Few days later, wife puts in a PTO request to start burning up the weeks she's accumulated, states she wants to go to days when she gets back, AND asks her manager to fill out a referral form for her because she's started applying to other jobs. She got the official offer (for the originally promised position) within the week.

Absolutely. This totally fits and is really the best case in my opinion. FU money stories tend to end with jobs over and bridges being burned. These can be exciting and are the best popcorn stories often :-). However, as a non-confrontational person, I'd personally much prefer something where you just say, this is how it is (because you have the sense of freedom to do it regardless of the consequences), and the company fixes the problem (that they should have done already) and makes the situation better. Rock on for her!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: alcon835 on May 29, 2021, 07:29:56 AM
While we're waiting on something actually Epic and/or FU, I'll share our most recent story.

Wife was offered a job contingent on her getting a bachelor's degree. Turns out they couldn't actually offer that, so she was offered a different position with a verbal promise that the original job would be hers when she did get the degree. She'd have to work nights in the interim, which she hates, but figured it'd be for a year max.

A year passes, she graduates, they post the job listing, and her manager explains that there have been a few other applicants. Basically, prepping my wife for the possibility that she might not get the position. Few days later, wife puts in a PTO request to start burning up the weeks she's accumulated, states she wants to go to days when she gets back, AND asks her manager to fill out a referral form for her because she's started applying to other jobs. She got the official offer (for the originally promised position) within the week.

Absolutely. This totally fits and is really the best case in my opinion. FU money stories tend to end with jobs over and bridges being burned. These can be exciting and are the best popcorn stories often :-). However, as a non-confrontational person, I'd personally much prefer something where you just say, this is how it is (because you have the sense of freedom to do it regardless of the consequences), and the company fixes the problem (that they should have done already) and makes the situation better. Rock on for her!

100% agreed! The best kind of FU story is when financial freedom gives you the ability to demand the right thing and see it done. Watching the world burn is fun and all (as long as I'm not standing amongst the flames!), but the better stories are the ones where something wrong is made right.

Thank you for the excellent FU story! Here's hoping it rattles a few more memories from the many, many lurkers :D
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: NumberJohnny5 on May 29, 2021, 07:43:16 AM
Thanks for the positive feedback! I viewed it as on the low-end of epic and since I'm obviously biased, figured it'd probably be just below the line; i.e. "nearly" epic. Maybe my definition of epic is a bit high, or it's just been a slow week.

It is definitely nice to know you have options.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: SereneOne on May 30, 2021, 07:19:53 AM
Didn't think I'd have anything to add to this thread again but while we're waiting for epic stories I thought I'd share my getting a raise story.

I've been doing some extra work with my old boss at $3k per year. She had a specific skill and she was teaching me so that if anything happened to her I knew what needed to be done. I had been assisting her for about 4 years at this rate which is fine. I was learning.

Long story short, old boss left and new boss came in this year and asked if I was going to continue doing said skill. I said I wasn't going to do it for $3k (I used the gratitude sandwich so it was alot nicer than just me saying "No"). He asked me how much? I said $16k. He said ok. Win win.

Side note he said "Ok" so quickly I wonder if I should have gone higher. $16k is fair but it's fun to wonder. :D
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Smokystache on May 30, 2021, 08:29:44 AM
Didn't think I'd have anything to add to this thread again but while we're waiting for epic stories I thought I'd share my getting a raise story.

I've been doing some extra work with my old boss at $3k per year. She had a specific skill and she was teaching me so that if anything happened to her I knew what needed to be done. I had been assisting her for about 4 years at this rate which is fine. I was learning.

Long story short, old boss left and new boss came in this year and asked if I was going to continue doing said skill. I said I wasn't going to do it for $3k (I used the gratitude sandwich so it was alot nicer than just me saying "No"). He asked me how much? I said $16k. He said ok. Win win.

Side note he said "Ok" so quickly I wonder if I should have gone higher. $16k is fair but it's fun to wonder. :D

433% raise with 5 seconds of negotiation easily qualifies as epic.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: alcon835 on May 30, 2021, 08:44:18 AM
Side note he said "Ok" so quickly I wonder if I should have gone higher. $16k is fair but it's fun to wonder. :D

That tends to haunt me too...lol.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: lemanfan on May 31, 2021, 01:05:23 AM
Side note he said "Ok" so quickly I wonder if I should have gone higher. $16k is fair but it's fun to wonder. :D

That's a real negotiation lesson there, thought in classes.  Don't say "yes" too quickly, leaving the other party wondering if they should be unhappy with the results even if they reach their goals.

And just one of the reasons in face to face negotiations where it pays off to just be quiet for five seconds before saying yes.  :)
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: FIPurpose on May 31, 2021, 07:07:25 AM
At my current job, they have given me every raise I've ever asked for or very close to it. Almost everytime, it's no fuss "yep, ok".

Makes me question myself, but I think more likely, the manager just wants to keep me, and there's a range in which he knows they can pay.

I think when a manager wants to keep you, they don't want to leave the impression that you're close to "the line where you're no longer worth it". Keep them happy and satisfied do that they don't look around.

There probably is a number that would be too much (could be that if you said $17k, he said the top he could do is $16k). I've known from managers where if someone said a figure at the top of the range they're allowed to go, they don't fight it and let the person have the top of the range. (Plenty of managers hate negotiating too!)
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: BoonDogle on June 01, 2021, 10:26:04 AM
My Epic FU story is just in its infancy as I have yet to leave.  Background : I have been at this company since college (25 years).  It isn’t always an easy transition when one of the owners leaves and I do care about the future of the company and the younger owners who are in the same boat I was in 10 to 20 years ago.  All of my workload will need to be carried by someone else and their workloads are already pretty heavy.  They may need to bring someone else onboard.  So I wanted to give them a say into when I made the move to allow for some transition and to make sure it is seamless (within reason, of course).

About 2 weeks ago I told another owner of the company that I was thinking I would sell my portion of the company and leave in the next year or so.  I mentioned that I would like him to put together a transition plan, let me know what he needs from me before I leave, and the timing that would work best for the company and other owners.  It caught him off guard a bit that I would consider the company’s needs in my decision as I am in my 40s.  I’m not sure anyone my age or younger has given him this kind of news until after they had another job lined up and a date set that they were leaving.  I plan to do something for another year or two after I leave so not quite pulling the ripcord on retirement yet, but just getting away from the stress that is becoming increasingly difficult for me to manage.  I plan to take my time after I leave to look for something that works well for me.  Salary will not be a huge factor in where I go.

That is where we are to date.  Still waiting on a plan from the group.  Will probably be a big topic at our next meeting I'm sure.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: RyanAtTanagra on June 01, 2021, 10:32:13 AM
That is where we are to date.  Still waiting on a plan from the group.  Will probably be a big topic at our next meeting I'm sure.

Nice.  In my experience, no matter how much notice you give, they wait until the last week to start doing anything about it.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: SwordGuy on June 01, 2021, 10:59:04 AM
That is where we are to date.  Still waiting on a plan from the group.  Will probably be a big topic at our next meeting I'm sure.

Nice.  In my experience, no matter how much notice you give, they wait until the last week to start doing anything about it.

Agreed!!!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: shelivesthedream on June 01, 2021, 11:55:21 AM
I've really been enjoying the quietly epic stories lately. No big crash-n-burn flounce, just the financial security to ask politely but firmly for what you want without fear of the consequences - and getting it!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: BoonDogle on June 01, 2021, 12:20:36 PM
That is where we are to date.  Still waiting on a plan from the group.  Will probably be a big topic at our next meeting I'm sure.

Nice.  In my experience, no matter how much notice you give, they wait until the last week to start doing anything about it.

I think that is possible but if so, I'll set a date and leave.  If they give me a plan that looks reasonable and tell me they need me to stay until it is executed, I'll consider it.  I don't feel like I have given up control of the situation, just looking for their input.  Knowing what I know about the other owners, I think they will follow through with what they said they would do.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: BoonDogle on June 01, 2021, 12:26:34 PM
I've really been enjoying the quietly epic stories lately. No big crash-n-burn flounce, just the financial security to ask politely but firmly for what you want without fear of the consequences - and getting it!

Thanks SLTD.  I have worked with and trained many of the younger owners.  I know they are right where I was 10, 15, or 20 years ago.  I look forward to staying in touch with them afterwards.  I'd enjoy working with them going forward, but I can no longer deal with some of the stresses of the job and clients that I work with.  So it is time to go (or at least the beginning of the process).
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: scottish on June 01, 2021, 03:04:10 PM
That is where we are to date.  Still waiting on a plan from the group.  Will probably be a big topic at our next meeting I'm sure.

Nice.  In my experience, no matter how much notice you give, they wait until the last week to start doing anything about it.

Agreed!!!

For sure.   After all, you may come to your senses and change your mind.    Like that horse might learn to sing!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: BuffaloStache on June 08, 2021, 09:10:49 AM
That is where we are to date.  Still waiting on a plan from the group.  Will probably be a big topic at our next meeting I'm sure.

Nice.  In my experience, no matter how much notice you give, they wait until the last week to start doing anything about it.

Agreed!!!

For sure.   After all, you may come to your senses and change your mind.    Like that horse might learn to sing!

A week is even generous in my experience! No joke, when I left my old job my management told me who my replacements would be 2 business days before my departure... and I had given 4 weeks notice. Fortunately I had already identified (mostly the same) replacements and trained many of them, but that's only because I cared about the people I worked with and didn't want to burn any bridges. When my management gave me the list, I merely pointed them to the people that I had already trained... Wasn't my problem anymore.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: AerynLee on June 08, 2021, 11:32:29 AM
That is where we are to date.  Still waiting on a plan from the group.  Will probably be a big topic at our next meeting I'm sure.

Nice.  In my experience, no matter how much notice you give, they wait until the last week to start doing anything about it.

Agreed!!!

For sure.   After all, you may come to your senses and change your mind.    Like that horse might learn to sing!

A week is even generous in my experience! No joke, when I left my old job my management told me who my replacements would be 2 business days before my departure... and I had given 4 weeks notice. Fortunately I had already identified (mostly the same) replacements and trained many of them, but that's only because I cared about the people I worked with and didn't want to burn any bridges. When my management gave me the list, I merely pointed them to the people that I had already trained... Wasn't my problem anymore.
I gave two months notice leaving my last job and they didn't even advertise the position until three months after I left. In the subsequent two and a half years I have seen them post that position seven times for a team of three people. They're on their third generation because no one will stay now
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: SwordGuy on June 08, 2021, 12:42:07 PM
I gave two months notice leaving my last job and they didn't even advertise the position until three months after I left. In the subsequent two and a half years I have seen them post that position seven times for a team of three people. They're on their third generation because no one will stay now

And yet they NEVER learn...
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Lady SA on June 08, 2021, 01:32:07 PM
No exciting bridge-burning, rage-quitting story here, just someone who had the FU-money-confidence to prioritize my time over a paycheck.

I'm having a baby in July (yay!). My company is a big corporation but has a generous (for for the US) parental leave policy: STD paid at 100%, plus an additional 4 weeks at 100% pay for bonding. This coincidentally gets you to 10-12 weeks fully paid of the 12 weeks of FMLA job protected (but not guaranteed to be paid at all) leave. 12 weeks/3 months of maternity leave is pretty standard for the US, but usually most of that is unpaid for most folks. So all in all, my company is pretty solid.

I, however, said F that. I WILL stay home for 6 months with my new baby, and paying me or not during that time is no nevermind to me. Thankfully, my immediate leader was on board with an extended (unpaid, obviously) leave from the get-go, but I was fully prepared to play hardball with him if he wasn't.

This request threw HR for a loop, though. In my huge, long-running company, apparently no one (????) has ever asked for an extended parental leave? My idea was to just tack on a sabbatical/unpaid personal leave at the end of my maternity leave (both leave types exist and I personally know colleagues who have done both leave types at my company), plus maybe burn some personal vacation I've been hoarding as well. But when I asked for the two leaves adjacently, it was like I had grown 4 extra heads, HR had no idea how to handle it and were hemming and hawing over if it were possible or not.

If I hadn't had FU money, I probably 1) wouldn't have even considered taking a multi-month unpaid leave in the first place and 2) would have dropped it right there when I ran into resistance, and just done the normal maternity leave. But since I did have FU money, I stood firm, basically planned my own leave myself by studying all the policies, and basically forced HR to (reluctantly) go along with my plan. It was a lot more work than I was expecting, and I'm annoyed at the comical red tape I had to wade through and the patchwork policies that I had to string together because we live in the US, but in the end I got the full 6 months that I wanted. I call that a FU success!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: BicycleB on June 08, 2021, 01:56:56 PM
^ I say - epic!!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Leseratte2021 on June 08, 2021, 02:37:26 PM
Well done Lady SA! All the best for you and your baby!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: alcon835 on June 08, 2021, 03:13:39 PM
HR had no idea how to handle it and were hemming and hawing over if it were possible or not.

Uh, yes of course it's possible. The question isn't "can we do this" it's more "learn to do your job and put it into the system".

It consistently shocks me that employers think they have some say over us. Everything is negotiable. Nothing is set in stone. HR's "policy" is just that, a policy which can be altered, adjusted, and bent to meet the current person's needs.

And yet, HR departments always seem blindsided by this.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Model96 on June 08, 2021, 08:57:32 PM
I hate to generalise, but it seems that many HR Departments baulk at approving leave that they deem 'excessive' regardless of Company policies.
In 2005 I was able to book a whole year off work using my accrued Annual Leave and Long Service Leave here in Australia. My Manager approved it all and it was not going to cause any staff shortges etc, but HR and senior management still chased me for 'more information' simply because I was getting something they didn't think I deserved😂
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: alcon835 on June 09, 2021, 05:38:03 AM
I hate to generalise, but it seems that many HR Departments baulk at approving leave that they deem 'excessive' regardless of Company policies.
In 2005 I was able to book a whole year off work using my accrued Annual Leave and Long Service Leave here in Australia. My Manager approved it all and it was not going to cause any staff shortges etc, but HR and senior management still chased me for 'more information' simply because I was getting something they didn't think I deserved😂

Again, just insanity. There are so many false presuppositions there, it boggles the mind.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Psychstache on June 09, 2021, 07:28:24 AM
HR had no idea how to handle it and were hemming and hawing over if it were possible or not.

Uh, yes of course it's possible. The question isn't "can we do this" it's more "learn to do your job and put it into the system".

It consistently shocks me that employers think they have some say over us. Everything is negotiable. Nothing is set in stone. HR's "policy" is just that, a policy which can be altered, adjusted, and bent to meet the current person's needs.

And yet, HR departments always seem blindsided by this.

HR is the most poorly named department in the world because they are not resourceful and barely human.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: NumberJohnny5 on June 09, 2021, 10:32:49 AM
I hate to generalise, but it seems that many HR Departments baulk at approving leave that they deem 'excessive' regardless of Company policies.
In 2005 I was able to book a whole year off work using my accrued Annual Leave and Long Service Leave here in Australia. My Manager approved it all and it was not going to cause any staff shortges etc, but HR and senior management still chased me for 'more information' simply because I was getting something they didn't think I deserved😂

#1. The idea of taking an entire year off and still having a job to go back to is unheard of here in the States. We lived in Australia when our third was born, and there was absolutely no pushback when my wife wanted to take the whole year off. In fact, it was fairly common to take a second year off. Just a bit of nice culture shock.

#2. When our first was born, we lived in Tennessee, which (surprise) allowed her to take up to FOUR MONTHS off for the birth of a child. FMLA gives 12 weeks, which seemed to be the most that anyone actually took. No one actually tried to take off more than that (plenty took less, obviously). My wife just said she wanted the full four months that Tennessee said she could have, and they eventually relented and let her have 16 weeks. For those who understand that most months are longer than four weeks, you can already tell that she was shortchanged. They also said it had to start from the date that she delivered. If the baby came a week early, then leave started a week early. She scheduled vacation time the week before he was due, but then she delivered that week so...yeah, that's when leave started. They made sure she knew that they knew, because they sent some flowers or something, I forget what it was (sounds like a nice enough gesture, except she didn't phone anyone to say she delivered...meaning someone was checking hospital records and at the very least saw her name pop up as a patient; it's possible they didn't actually go into the records, so we didn't turn it into a big deal...I should note that she worked as a nurse and delivered at a hospital in the same system, but still a different hospital in a different city). They were just so very very adamant that she didn't get a single day more than they thought was absolutely necessary to give. And no...she didn't deliver during a very busy time when they were short staffed. We didn't have FU money at the time, but still gave more pushback than they were used to.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Zamboni on June 09, 2021, 09:30:19 PM
I think the biggest factor sometimes in not wanting to grant long leaves or atypical work hours is jealousy, plain and simple.

I had a job many years ago where I negotiated a four 8-hr-day work week schedule before accepting the position. I felt it was important to have the time with my young children, and the pay wasn't super high, so 32 hours seemed reasonable based upon the salary level the could give me compared to previous positions I had held.

There was a women in an HR function who made it very clear over and over that she resented my 4 day schedule. She told me straight up within the first month that she didn't think the boss should have allowed it. But, bottom line, she was just jealous, because she could have had the same schedule if she just asked for it, but she was not willing/able to take the pay cut that an 80% work week would have entailed. So petty. So inflexible. Ugh. Lol, I should have remarked to her off-hand in an unrelated conversation that petty inflexibility has been shown to be a sign of low intelligence. I need to work on my aristocratic snark.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: NorthernIkigai on June 10, 2021, 02:44:54 AM
I hate to generalise, but it seems that many HR Departments baulk at approving leave that they deem 'excessive' regardless of Company policies.
In 2005 I was able to book a whole year off work using my accrued Annual Leave and Long Service Leave here in Australia. My Manager approved it all and it was not going to cause any staff shortges etc, but HR and senior management still chased me for 'more information' simply because I was getting something they didn't think I deserved😂

I wonder what kind of "more information" anyone is looking for in these kinds of situations. What did they really expect you to say, and why did they think it was any of their business? (Assuming you didn't work with anything super secret and they were afraid you'd take your intel and set up a competing business or start working for a competitor... In which case you could also have just quit and done that anyway.)

I'm planning to take a year off at some point (but from autumn to autumn rather than a calendar year, partly for tax reasons), and I am certainly thinking about what I will say to people when they ask out of curiosity or just in the form of small talk. But I don't expect anyone to chase me specifically to get more information. Time off is just time off.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: RyanAtTanagra on June 10, 2021, 10:44:52 AM
I think the biggest factor sometimes in not wanting to grant long leaves or atypical work hours is jealousy, plain and simple.

I had a job many years ago where I negotiated a four 8-hr-day work week schedule before accepting the position. I felt it was important to have the time with my young children, and the pay wasn't super high, so 32 hours seemed reasonable based upon the salary level the could give me compared to previous positions I had held.

There was a women in an HR function who made it very clear over and over that she resented my 4 day schedule. She told me straight up within the first month that she didn't think the boss should have allowed it. But, bottom line, she was just jealous, because she could have had the same schedule if she just asked for it, but she was not willing/able to take the pay cut that an 80% work week would have entailed. So petty. So inflexible. Ugh. Lol, I should have remarked to her off-hand in an unrelated conversation that petty inflexibility has been shown to be a sign of low intelligence. I need to work on my aristocratic snark.

It's a very dumb thing to get angry at.  It's not even making an exception for you.  Anyone could do it if they tried.  People just can't afford/don't want to take a 20% pay cut.  But then they get jealous of not having a 20% shorter work week?  I was expecting some snark when I went to 32hrs at work, and prepared what to say.  "I've been living on a sailboat for the past 5 years to cut expenses and save money.  You could do it too if you want to be able to take a 20% pay cut".  But no one really said anything.  Everyone at work is too reasonable.  Very boring.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Wolfpack Mustachian on June 10, 2021, 10:58:33 AM
I think the biggest factor sometimes in not wanting to grant long leaves or atypical work hours is jealousy, plain and simple.

I had a job many years ago where I negotiated a four 8-hr-day work week schedule before accepting the position. I felt it was important to have the time with my young children, and the pay wasn't super high, so 32 hours seemed reasonable based upon the salary level the could give me compared to previous positions I had held.

There was a women in an HR function who made it very clear over and over that she resented my 4 day schedule. She told me straight up within the first month that she didn't think the boss should have allowed it. But, bottom line, she was just jealous, because she could have had the same schedule if she just asked for it, but she was not willing/able to take the pay cut that an 80% work week would have entailed. So petty. So inflexible. Ugh. Lol, I should have remarked to her off-hand in an unrelated conversation that petty inflexibility has been shown to be a sign of low intelligence. I need to work on my aristocratic snark.

It's a very dumb thing to get angry at.  It's not even making an exception for you.  Anyone could do it if they tried.  People just can't afford/don't want to take a 20% pay cut.  But then they get jealous of not having a 20% shorter work week?  I was expecting some snark when I went to 32hrs at work, and prepared what to say.  "I've been living on a sailboat for the past 5 years to cut expenses and save money.  You could do it too if you want to be able to take a 20% pay cut".  But no one really said anything.  Everyone at work is too reasonable.  Very boring.

Boring can be really nice, though....
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: mm1970 on June 10, 2021, 03:11:59 PM
I think the biggest factor sometimes in not wanting to grant long leaves or atypical work hours is jealousy, plain and simple.

I had a job many years ago where I negotiated a four 8-hr-day work week schedule before accepting the position. I felt it was important to have the time with my young children, and the pay wasn't super high, so 32 hours seemed reasonable based upon the salary level the could give me compared to previous positions I had held.

There was a women in an HR function who made it very clear over and over that she resented my 4 day schedule. She told me straight up within the first month that she didn't think the boss should have allowed it. But, bottom line, she was just jealous, because she could have had the same schedule if she just asked for it, but she was not willing/able to take the pay cut that an 80% work week would have entailed. So petty. So inflexible. Ugh. Lol, I should have remarked to her off-hand in an unrelated conversation that petty inflexibility has been shown to be a sign of low intelligence. I need to work on my aristocratic snark.

It's a very dumb thing to get angry at.  It's not even making an exception for you.  Anyone could do it if they tried.  People just can't afford/don't want to take a 20% pay cut.  But then they get jealous of not having a 20% shorter work week?  I was expecting some snark when I went to 32hrs at work, and prepared what to say.  "I've been living on a sailboat for the past 5 years to cut expenses and save money.  You could do it too if you want to be able to take a 20% pay cut".  But no one really said anything.  Everyone at work is too reasonable.  Very boring.
Yup.  I've done this twice, when I had my kids.  With company #1 and kid #1 they paid me hourly when I made the switch to 75%, though I was an exempt employee.  It was great, because if I had a long week and worked 35 hr, I got paid for exactly what I worked.

With company #2, they continued to keep me exempt, so I opted for 80% instead of 75% because I just KNEW 30 hr was not going to happen, it would be 32 most weeks. 

Well, fast forward years later, and a coworker wants to ease into retirement, so she asks me how the whole thing worked as far as pay and benefits go (basically, you have to be 75% to keep bennies).  So, they didn't LOVE that (she wanted 25 h a week, not 30), but did 30 h anyway.

Another coworker was BITTER.  He complained, multiple times, about her only working 30h a week and the rest of us work 50-60.  I just said "you can make the same switch for lower pay.  And by the way, she is still exempt, so her pay is 75% even if she works 40 h a week."  He was also nearing retirement (about 5 yr older than her).
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: okonumiyaki on June 11, 2021, 12:09:14 AM
Re long holidays - I worked for a firm that insisted that you had to take a 'long leave' minimum two weeks every year.

It was for anti-fraud purposes - they had been burned by a manager whose corruption was only discovered when he had gone to hospital for a long while - until then he had been a hero, never taking any time off (apart from a few days here and there) and so had always been able to cover his tracks...
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: MrMoogle on June 11, 2021, 10:48:17 AM
My company is pretty awesome with that kind of stuff.  They will hold your job for you for the first 364 days for maternity leave (if that's what you request).  I'm not sure about the pay as I've never looked it up.  I know they offer paternity leave too, but I don't have the details of that.  A woman I worked with had a baby, took the year off.  Came back for a year and had another baby.  Repeated once more and she became a stay at home mom.  They also allowed her to come back part time after the first baby.  They didn't bat an eye when I requested part time. 
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: partgypsy on June 11, 2021, 01:59:13 PM
I can't remember if I told this story before, but worked in the medical center of a well known university. I was a three year post doc, with rules with 40 days a month (Al/sl). I submitted leave sheets the entire time and used about a 2 weeks a year. . When I became a research associate in the same lab, about a year later became pregnant. I lost all my sl and Al changing my position. The hospital had 0 paid weeks for family or parental leave.  While I was allowed to take time off without losing my job, definitely got pushback from my boss, with my paychecks about 30-50% my normal paycheck during my leave time. With my 2nd child, I was now working for the government. Someone in my department told me I should put myself on the donate leave list, for my leave after giving birth. When I went to submit the paperwork, HR told me that wasn't allowed, as childbirth was not a recognized medical condition. So I'm like, ok and didn't think anything of it. I was able to take advance leave in this case, long since paid back. Since then I had seen a number of requests to donate annual leave time to staff who were expecting (you can only donate your annual leave, not your sick leave for this), so way interpreted, not consistent. Suffice to say, I am thankful both my pregnancies and births were relatively uneventful as parental leave policies in the us kind of suck and not make it easy to be a working mom. Hopefully they have gotten better.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Model96 on June 12, 2021, 06:46:40 AM
I hate to generalise, but it seems that many HR Departments baulk at approving leave that they deem 'excessive' regardless of Company policies.
In 2005 I was able to book a whole year off work using my accrued Annual Leave and Long Service Leave here in Australia. My Manager approved it all and it was not going to cause any staff shortges etc, but HR and senior management still chased me for 'more information' simply because I was getting something they didn't think I deserved😂

I wonder what kind of "more information" anyone is looking for in these kinds of situations. What did they really expect you to say, and why did they think it was any of their business? (Assuming you didn't work with anything super secret and they were afraid you'd take your intel and set up a competing business or start working for a competitor... In which case you could also have just quit and done that anyway.)

I'm planning to take a year off at some point (but from autumn to autumn rather than a calendar year, partly for tax reasons), and I am certainly thinking about what I will say to people when they ask out of curiosity or just in the form of small talk. But I don't expect anyone to chase me specifically to get more information. Time off is just time off.

It was easy to ignore them, none of them tried to speak face to face with me.
I just told everyone I was on annual leave, only my wife and kids knew for how long!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: JLee on June 16, 2021, 10:30:18 AM
Re long holidays - I worked for a firm that insisted that you had to take a 'long leave' minimum two weeks every year.

It was for anti-fraud purposes - they had been burned by a manager whose corruption was only discovered when he had gone to hospital for a long while - until then he had been a hero, never taking any time off (apart from a few days here and there) and so had always been able to cover his tracks...

I had to do that when I worked for a bank (one or two weeks' consecutive time off was mandatory).

Meanwhile at my current job I can't get more than a long weekend until at least August....with 4.5 weeks PTO still yet to use for this year.  :(
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: LennStar on June 17, 2021, 10:58:01 AM
Again I am aghast at how awful it is here in goddamn Socialism with our 20 minimum days holidays, not counting sick days and 9+3 month of parental leave.

btw. Even while being pregnant is not a medical condition for sick leave etc., having a several pound parasite inside you is.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: gooki on June 18, 2021, 01:55:44 AM
My wife exercised our fuck you money to perfection this week.

She applied for a senior business partner role at her current employer.  It's a promotion in paper and dollars only as she's been doing the senior role for sometime already just without the recognition/reward. My wife's well respected by the managers she coaches, a great mentor to the younger staff in their team, and trusted by her team mates

She went through the whole interview process with her reporting manager (not one of the ones she coaches) and a couple of other staff, waited a couple of weeks, and was then told nope, no senior position for you, were hiring someone external. So she asked for reasons, and got vague stuff like the other candidate has worked with unions, when in my wife's interview her manager skipped over that question entirely. To rub salt in the wound her manager goes maybe you'd be interested in this job at xyz company. And my wife's like. Hell no. I applied for the job I'm already doing, and did you know that other job at company xyz is open because the last person in that role killed themself.

So my wife's angry as fuck but stays professional, and wraps that meeting up, and schedules one for a couple of days time when she's cooled down.

So next meeting, my wife's tries to get some real answers about why she wasn't hired. Brings up that they skipped they union question in her interview and her manager flips out and changes the subject to 'projects" and why my wife's name isn't on any of her managers projects (never mind that my wife just lead largest organisational change, or that other people are already leading those projects).

So my wife calmly gets up, and says something along the lines of, I can see you're not in a good space, if you're not able to have a constructive conversation with me I'll be leaving, and we can do this another time.

Her manager calms down and agrees to be constructive. It doesn't last long and my wife has to get up again and bring her manager back in line. Her manager starts apologizing because this is starting to look pretty bad. So my wife point blank asks if there's a problem with her performance. Her manager responds with no. So it becomes pretty clear through the rest of the meeting that it's personal, but her manager is to bat shit crazy to be honest and just say it.

My wife takes the next day as a mental health day, and drafts her resignation.

This Friday she handed the resignation letter to her manager. The managers response was 'oh? Do you have somewhere else to go?' and my wife cool as ice says 'no, I'm happy to go', spins round and exits the room.

So proud of my wife. Not just just because she left a place that doesn't support her, but because she was the bigger person the whole time.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: LennStar on June 18, 2021, 03:57:24 AM
Nice!
But I would have liked the "okay, then I stop doing the work of the position I am not officially in" and see what happened then.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: DeepEllumStache on June 18, 2021, 11:43:13 AM
My wife takes the next day as a mental health day, and drafts her resignation.

This Friday she handed the resignation letter to her manager. The managers response was 'oh? Do you have somewhere else to go?' and my wife cool as ice says 'no, I'm happy to go', spins round and exits the room.

That was gloriously epic!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: okits on June 18, 2021, 01:06:21 PM
Congratulations to your badass wife (and to you, @gooki ! This stuff doesn't happen in a vacuum.)

Not just just because she left a place that doesn't support her

Err, a place that was actively exploiting her and obstructing her.  She is well rid of that kind of environment, I'm happy for you both!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: FIRE 20/20 on June 19, 2021, 11:40:55 AM
...I was a three year post doc, with rules with 40 days a month (Al/sl)...

Can you clarify this part?  I don't understand "40 days a month" or (Al/sl). 
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Fru-Gal on July 07, 2021, 04:20:22 PM
Because I have FU money, am trying to be more assertive.

I have valuable and unique skills that are widely recognized in the company. At the same time, I have no authority or assistance. I have a ton of autonomy. Problem is a Mark Twain-like thing that happens where my successes become attractive to poachers.

How to deal with this? Like, the one thing that keeps me going is my autonomy with my projects (which are collaborative, made even more difficult because I have no titular authority so I have to be diplomatic as fuck).

New guy just got hired days ago. Boss says, "Take your great ideas, and go work with him." Collaboratively, but with an implication that maybe I'll soon work *for* this guy.

I know it happens to men too, but as a woman in a male-dominated field, am so tired of being put under someone new -- who may or may not last and is often an idiot. (Yes of course I go in with an open mind, not a bad attitude, etc. etc.)

Asked my boss for a team to report to me and funding to grow the project. Response: "Sure! Talk to that new guy [whom I've never even met, not even in my department, but ostensibly similar skills to mine] and come up with a plan." I mean WTF????

Are my decades of experience and well documented years of results (highest in company) really meaningless in comparison to some "new guy" with a fancy title?
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: former player on July 07, 2021, 04:39:25 PM
Yes.

Can you go look for a new job with more pay and status?
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: swashbucklinstache on July 07, 2021, 05:00:20 PM
I am starting to tire of repeatedly being put in a position where the truth is "no one knows, because my great-grandboss can't answer a simple question in 10 months" to a politically connected internal client of his, who already knows that's the answer but benefits from me being the one to say it out loud. I think I'll let my boss know that tomorrow and re-verbalize that I've bit my tongue for the last time on the matter and he should engage in serious CYA now if he hasn't already.

It's been almost two weeks! Anything new? Maybe you're not updating the forum because you're off on a beach somewhere enjoying your FU money ;-)
Sadly I'm getting 2-3 'requests' a day and didn't want to just spam the thread everyday!

The latest reading between the lines is that I think the great-grandboss is going to declare my boss accountable for these roles to not deal with it. For me that means that since it will then be a direct line up from me, as opposed to now where my "uncle" is accountable, it is more of a "reassignment" than a "we're interested in you taking on this stretch role if you're interested" deal. That should mean it is a little harder to say FU to my immediate boss than the faceless C suit, and doubly so because I'm senior enough in a fluid enough industry that this isn't really an inappropriate/uncommon sort of thing. (Consulting job descriptions are basically "get it done, level appropriately").

I proactively nipped that in the bud with my boss and made it clear that I do not care who is accountable for the role, my questions still stand. In the meantime I continue to take on the pieces that are interesting to me and either ignore, say no to, or do the others as slowly as possible.

The bigger piece is that, unfortunately, my main project work ends 6/30. We're a billable industry where you eat what you kill and I don't yet have anything lined up. So the closer we creep to that day the closer we get to me not really being able to say no, because I'd then be saying "instead of doing this role I would prefer to instead do nothing and still get paid for it." So I'm talking with my boss this week to try to find other project opportunities. If I get defaulted into the role I will still push for $$ up front and will make it very clear that I'm unhappy with being backdoored into things if we get there. It sucks, because this is a role that could be fun (strategy and process creation) and have outsized returns (growth) if a happy and motivated employee does it and "kept the lights on" returns if they're not.

I've also spent the weekend getting my resume in shape. My industry, tech/data, is on fire right now. I could credibly apply to senior individual contributor roles at better companies, senior analytics or product manager roles at peer companies, or associate/director of analytics positions at smaller companies. I got pinged last week by a big tech recruiter for a data science position that would double my total comp. We're talking this week. I'm not competitive really and they hand out interviews like candy but you only need one to say yes...

For context, I'm at 835k which is a 2.9% WR for my current expenses (24k avg. the last 8 years). My FIRE plans are atypical though, as they're either "I have no idea, I'm only 32, let's not lock us in to < 40k a year before life events" or "spend a few years AirBnbing in city centers where housing alone takes you to 4.5% WR, plus some seed money gifted for others' retirement, so maybe 1.3-1.6mm?" I'm saving 115k a year, so it would be ideal if this company would just stay reasonable for the next 1-3 years...
Well. 6/30 came and went and I have new "other" project so status quo was humming along. BUT, unrelated, today they walked the great grandboss out (hourly billable company = immediately removed at that level). Says the plan is for his C suit boss to cover until a hire is made, which is much less than ideal since that person knows nothing about what we do as a non-tech person... Person that's been trying to get me to do their job said interim boss was going to be meeting with us and we should talk about the future of these roles so we can shape them how we want them to be a.k.a. one more avenue to try and shove the work off his plate. Pretty sure I'm going to say if you want me in this role that is an immediate 50% base pay increase, and keep interviewing in the background all the while.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: jinga nation on July 07, 2021, 05:21:22 PM
Because I have FU money, am trying to be more assertive.

I have valuable and unique skills that are widely recognized in the company. At the same time, I have no authority or assistance. I have a ton of autonomy. Problem is a Mark Twain-like thing that happens where my successes become attractive to poachers.

How to deal with this? Like, the one thing that keeps me going is my autonomy with my projects (which are collaborative, made even more difficult because I have no titular authority so I have to be diplomatic as fuck).

New guy just got hired days ago. Boss says, "Take your great ideas, and go work with him." Collaboratively, but with an implication that maybe I'll soon work *for* this guy.

I know it happens to men too, but as a woman in a male-dominated field, am so tired of being put under someone new -- who may or may not last and is often an idiot. (Yes of course I go in with an open mind, not a bad attitude, etc. etc.)

Asked my boss for a team to report to me and funding to grow the project. Response: "Sure! Talk to that new guy [whom I've never even met, not even in my department, but ostensibly similar skills to mine] and come up with a plan." I mean WTF????

Are my decades of experience and well documented years of results (highest in company) really meaningless in comparison to some "new guy" with a fancy title?

Leverage the FU money by finding another position externally.
Betcha in 24-48H when you give notice to current employer, you'll be given fancy title, more $$$, maybe a team, funding, etc. Magically appearing like a genie from an oil lamp.
At that point you decide if you want to stay or move on to the new employer.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Fru-Gal on July 07, 2021, 05:40:40 PM
Quote
Yes.

LOL. Thanks for the responses. I did want to vent.

Also, sigh, you mean I have to be proactive...? 😂
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: zolotiyeruki on July 07, 2021, 08:06:16 PM
Because I have FU money, am trying to be more assertive.

I have valuable and unique skills that are widely recognized in the company. At the same time, I have no authority or assistance. I have a ton of autonomy. Problem is a Mark Twain-like thing that happens where my successes become attractive to poachers.

How to deal with this? Like, the one thing that keeps me going is my autonomy with my projects (which are collaborative, made even more difficult because I have no titular authority so I have to be diplomatic as fuck).

New guy just got hired days ago. Boss says, "Take your great ideas, and go work with him." Collaboratively, but with an implication that maybe I'll soon work *for* this guy.

I know it happens to men too, but as a woman in a male-dominated field, am so tired of being put under someone new -- who may or may not last and is often an idiot. (Yes of course I go in with an open mind, not a bad attitude, etc. etc.)

Asked my boss for a team to report to me and funding to grow the project. Response: "Sure! Talk to that new guy [whom I've never even met, not even in my department, but ostensibly similar skills to mine] and come up with a plan." I mean WTF????

Are my decades of experience and well documented years of results (highest in company) really meaningless in comparison to some "new guy" with a fancy title?

Leverage the FU money by finding another position externally.
Betcha in 24-48H when you give notice to current employer, you'll be given fancy title, more $$$, maybe a team, funding, etc. Magically appearing like a genie from an oil lamp.
At that point you decide if you want to stay or move on to the new employer.
^^^This
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: LibrarIan on July 10, 2021, 06:23:11 AM
I started as a developer at a megacorp nine years ago. Great job for the most part. I found this site shortly after being hired and have developed a good amount of FU money. This has led me to cut a lot of the office environment bs out of my day.

For example, when I first got hired and really needed the job, I kept my mouth shut in meetings unless I was spoken to and if the others got off topic and wasted lots of time arguing or chatting, I would just sit there and wait it out. What else could I do? But with FU money, I don't tolerate pointless meetings anymore. Recently I was in a meeting when my coding partner and I could have been working on a big project. Two people started bickering and it became clear that productivity ended and time wasting was going to be the rest of the meeting. I interrupted the project manager and the developer she was arguing with and said, "Bob and I are going to get to work. Have a nice afternoon." And we left, with Bob looking kind of stunned. Afterwards he told me that he's never seen anyone leave a meeting early. One of the people arguing reached out and apologized for their behavior and thanked me for bringing them to their senses.

FU money has also given me the ability to stick up for myself. Just yesterday, a coworker promised during our morning standup meeting that she'd have some important requirements to me ASAP. My boss agreed that this was very important and that those requirements should be prioritized so I could get the work done that day (lol). The day goes by and I busy myself with other things while waiting. Ten minutes before I log off (we're mostly still working from home at this point), the coworker presented me with what I needed and let my boss know. Instead of my boss questioning why it took my coworker the entire day to do this, leaving me no time, my boss instead thanked this coworker and told me to get started on them immediately. I told her I was finishing up something and it was the end of the day. She said this needed to be done immediately (it really doesn't, trust me). I simply said that the requirements should have been to me hours ago and that I'd start on them Monday. I logged off and haven't heard a peep.

FU money has also given the willingness to look for a permanent job working from home. The pandemic forced everyone at my job to work from home starting March 2020 and most are still doing this. Despite the great success the company has had in this work model, they suddenly decided that we "do our best work together" and that all employees will be in the physical office at least three days a week. I loooooove working from home and there isn't anything about my job that requires being at the office. The forced WFH experiment has proven that it works. The only reason they want developers back is micromanagement. I applied for permanent home work. The CIO himself has to approve it. My reasoning was honest - preference. I have already told my boss that if it's not approved I'll just find a job at any one of the abundant remote development jobs that are out there now. We'll see what happens.

It's a great feeling not to be tied down to a job.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: BicycleB on July 10, 2021, 08:45:04 AM
^Epic? Yep, works for me! :)
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: alcon835 on July 10, 2021, 09:39:22 AM
I started as a developer at a megacorp nine years ago. Great job for the most part. I found this site shortly after being hired and have developed a good amount of FU money. This has led me to cut a lot of the office environment bs out of my day.

For example, when I first got hired and really needed the job, I kept my mouth shut in meetings unless I was spoken to and if the others got off topic and wasted lots of time arguing or chatting, I would just sit there and wait it out. What else could I do? But with FU money, I don't tolerate pointless meetings anymore. Recently I was in a meeting when my coding partner and I could have been working on a big project. Two people started bickering and it became clear that productivity ended and time wasting was going to be the rest of the meeting. I interrupted the project manager and the developer she was arguing with and said, "Bob and I are going to get to work. Have a nice afternoon." And we left, with Bob looking kind of stunned. Afterwards he told me that he's never seen anyone leave a meeting early. One of the people arguing reached out and apologized for their behavior and thanked me for bringing them to their senses.

FU money has also given me the ability to stick up for myself. Just yesterday, a coworker promised during our morning standup meeting that she'd have some important requirements to me ASAP. My boss agreed that this was very important and that those requirements should be prioritized so I could get the work done that day (lol). The day goes by and I busy myself with other things while waiting. Ten minutes before I log off (we're mostly still working from home at this point), the coworker presented me with what I needed and let my boss know. Instead of my boss questioning why it took my coworker the entire day to do this, leaving me no time, my boss instead thanked this coworker and told me to get started on them immediately. I told her I was finishing up something and it was the end of the day. She said this needed to be done immediately (it really doesn't, trust me). I simply said that the requirements should have been to me hours ago and that I'd start on them Monday. I logged off and haven't heard a peep.

FU money has also given the willingness to look for a permanent job working from home. The pandemic forced everyone at my job to work from home starting March 2020 and most are still doing this. Despite the great success the company has had in this work model, they suddenly decided that we "do our best work together" and that all employees will be in the physical office at least three days a week. I loooooove working from home and there isn't anything about my job that requires being at the office. The forced WFH experiment has proven that it works. The only reason they want developers back is micromanagement. I applied for permanent home work. The CIO himself has to approve it. My reasoning was honest - preference. I have already told my boss that if it's not approved I'll just find a job at any one of the abundant remote development jobs that are out there now. We'll see what happens.

It's a great feeling not to be tied down to a job.

Glad to see FU money doing work in 2021!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: FIPurpose on July 10, 2021, 02:18:22 PM
I've noticed that at least half of the software dev jobs out there now are offering 100% remote work. I really don't know what these companies are thinking that they can force workers back to the office.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: JLee on July 10, 2021, 02:39:16 PM
I've noticed that at least half of the software dev jobs out there now are offering 100% remote work. I really don't know what these companies are thinking that they can force workers back to the office.

My roommate is being forced back in the office, where he spends the day on Zoom calls with other people who aren't at his location anyway.  It's ridiculous.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Much Fishing to Do on July 10, 2021, 03:06:20 PM
I've noticed that at least half of the software dev jobs out there now are offering 100% remote work. I really don't know what these companies are thinking that they can force workers back to the office.

My roommate is being forced back in the office, where he spends the day on Zoom calls with other people who aren't at his location anyway.  It's ridiculous.

A family member just told me he was already forced back.  and he works almost completely with people on the other coast.... I just don't get.  (I get that some bosses want to be controlling, or just a pain, but why in the world would the company think its worth paying big city downtown office building rent to do that.  I owned and ran a business for 10 years with 8 employees that didn't need to be in an office so there was no way I ever considered blowing money on rent when I knew they'd view working form home as a perk anyway (and sure made everyone a lot more flexible when for the feast and famine times)
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: JLee on July 10, 2021, 03:33:30 PM
I've noticed that at least half of the software dev jobs out there now are offering 100% remote work. I really don't know what these companies are thinking that they can force workers back to the office.

My roommate is being forced back in the office, where he spends the day on Zoom calls with other people who aren't at his location anyway.  It's ridiculous.

A family member just told me he was already forced back.  and he works almost completely with people on the other coast.... I just don't get.  (I get that some bosses want to be controlling, or just a pain, but why in the world would the company think its worth paying big city downtown office building rent to do that.  I owned and ran a business for 10 years with 8 employees that didn't need to be in an office so there was no way I ever considered blowing money on rent when I knew they'd view working form home as a perk anyway (and sure made everyone a lot more flexible when for the feast and famine times)

I suspect a huge part of it is old-school managers who are clinging to the "that's the way we've always done it" mindset (with a healthy dose of "if people are in the office, then there's no chance of them doing personal things on *gasp* company time!!11).

Purely speculation on my part, though.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Aegishjalmur on July 10, 2021, 04:52:46 PM
I've noticed that at least half of the software dev jobs out there now are offering 100% remote work. I really don't know what these companies are thinking that they can force workers back to the office.

My roommate is being forced back in the office, where he spends the day on Zoom calls with other people who aren't at his location anyway.  It's ridiculous.

A family member just told me he was already forced back.  and he works almost completely with people on the other coast.... I just don't get.  (I get that some bosses want to be controlling, or just a pain, but why in the world would the company think its worth paying big city downtown office building rent to do that.  I owned and ran a business for 10 years with 8 employees that didn't need to be in an office so there was no way I ever considered blowing money on rent when I knew they'd view working form home as a perk anyway (and sure made everyone a lot more flexible when for the feast and famine times)

I suspect a huge part of it is old-school managers who are clinging to the "that's the way we've always done it" mindset (with a healthy dose of "if people are in the office, then there's no chance of them doing personal things on *gasp* company time!!11).

Purely speculation on my part, though.



I think part of it is that and they spent big bucks on the office lease, furnishings, equipment, ect. So even though it's cheaper and more efficient to have workers work remotely, they are looking at all this other stuff they acquired and are not using and counting their pennies.  Sunk cost fallacy at its finest.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Dicey on July 10, 2021, 06:20:42 PM
I've noticed that at least half of the software dev jobs out there now are offering 100% remote work. I really don't know what these companies are thinking that they can force workers back to the office.

My roommate is being forced back in the office, where he spends the day on Zoom calls with other people who aren't at his location anyway.  It's ridiculous.

A family member just told me he was already forced back.  and he works almost completely with people on the other coast.... I just don't get.  (I get that some bosses want to be controlling, or just a pain, but why in the world would the company think its worth paying big city downtown office building rent to do that.  I owned and ran a business for 10 years with 8 employees that didn't need to be in an office so there was no way I ever considered blowing money on rent when I knew they'd view working form home as a perk anyway (and sure made everyone a lot more flexible when for the feast and famine times)

I suspect a huge part of it is old-school managers who are clinging to the "that's the way we've always done it" mindset (with a healthy dose of "if people are in the office, then there's no chance of them doing personal things on *gasp* company time!!11).

Purely speculation on my part, though.
Another possibility is that they're paying for office space they haven't been using. They don't want to let good money go to waste. Nevermind about losing employees...
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: desk_jockey on July 10, 2021, 09:55:50 PM
I've noticed that at least half of the software dev jobs out there now are offering 100% remote work. I really don't know what these companies are thinking that they can force workers back to the office.

My roommate is being forced back in the office, where he spends the day on Zoom calls with other people who aren't at his location anyway.  It's ridiculous.

My suggestions to your roommate:
(a) go in for a day and take photos of the office for a work-at-home zoom background, so that people can choose to believe you're in the office; or
(b) wear a heavy mask in the office and insure any speech on the zoom calls are muffled to the point that nobody can understand, so that eventually you get told to go home to take the calls.

Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Uturn on July 11, 2021, 08:53:05 AM
I once worked for a company that did contract work for the government.  We were supporting networks in the middle East from TX. Every other week another engineer and I would swap working from home on Friday so that we could knock out tickets for a day without being interrupted. Then the company instituted a no work from home policy.  Their thinking was if you are remote, you are not as efficient. Never mind that even in the office, we were still remote to those that we supported.

So then, instead of working from home, we would fly to the DC office and work a day from there.  Since no one knew who we were, there was no interruptions.  The bosses were ok with this because we were still in a company facility.   
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Alternatepriorities on July 11, 2021, 11:27:16 AM
I once worked for a company that did contract work for the government.  We were supporting networks in the middle East from TX. Every other week another engineer and I would swap working from home on Friday so that we could knock out tickets for a day without being interrupted. Then the company instituted a no work from home policy.  Their thinking was if you are remote, you are not as efficient. Never mind that even in the office, we were still remote to those that we supported.

So then, instead of working from home, we would fly to the DC office and work a day from there.  Since no one knew who we were, there was no interruptions.  The bosses were ok with this because we were still in a company facility.

This was more or less the policy at DW's school office before the pandemic... Alaska had a large number of students learning remotely even before the pandemic. She works with a school's correspondence program. Pre pandemic she could work in any office in the state and count the day as a contract day. Work done from any other location didn't count... Despite all indications being that people working from home were as productive the past year (they served twice as many students without doubling the staff), it looks like they are returning to that policy now... DW just moved up a level and plans to fight to reinstitute a remote work option. We are FI, so this is a bit of and FU money battle.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: BuffaloStache on July 13, 2021, 07:40:25 AM
I've noticed that at least half of the software dev jobs out there now are offering 100% remote work. I really don't know what these companies are thinking that they can force workers back to the office.

My roommate is being forced back in the office, where he spends the day on Zoom calls with other people who aren't at his location anyway.  It's ridiculous.

This is mostly my job. Fortunately my company hasn't forced us back yet. They tell us that they "expect" us to come in "on some sort of regular schedule", but that nothing is forced. So I've taken to coming into the office ~once a month in the morning hours, and then pick up lunch from one of my favorite takeout spots on the way home before working from home in the afternoons. If I'm pressed, I'll explain that this is a "regular schedule", haha. Most of the people I work with day-to-day (that are in the same state) also work fully remotely, so there's that as well.

...
So then, instead of working from home, we would fly to the DC office and work a day from there.  Since no one knew who we were, there was no interruptions.  The bosses were ok with this because we were still in a company facility.   

This is amazing! Would you fly into DC and home on the same day? Sounds like a quick way to rack up air miles, and get paid to sit on an airplane and read books/watch movies/etc. (one of the best perks of business travel, IMO).
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: rantk81 on July 13, 2021, 07:53:56 AM
This is amazing! Would you fly into DC and home on the same day? Sounds like a quick way to rack up air miles, and get paid to sit on an airplane and read books/watch movies/etc. (one of the best perks of business travel, IMO).

That actually sounds pretty miserable to me.  I find it extremely stressful and draining to go through the air-travel-rigmarole.... twice in one day (in addition to doing actual work) sounds awful.

Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Uturn on July 14, 2021, 06:13:57 AM

...
So then, instead of working from home, we would fly to the DC office and work a day from there.  Since no one knew who we were, there was no interruptions.  The bosses were ok with this because we were still in a company facility.   

This is amazing! Would you fly into DC and home on the same day? Sounds like a quick way to rack up air miles, and get paid to sit on an airplane and read books/watch movies/etc. (one of the best perks of business travel, IMO).

I would usually fly in late Thursday and back out Friday evening.  Getting out of DC on Friday evening sucks.  There was nothing nice about it.  But I could go on all day about the dumbassery that went on at that company.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: markbike528CBX on July 14, 2021, 07:37:56 AM
...snip....
But I could go on all day about the dumbassery that went on at that company.
Please do.
I'd suggest the "Overheard at work" thread.
Or tell Scott Adams so he can put it in "Dilbert" if he hasn't done so already.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: jinga nation on July 14, 2021, 09:29:22 AM
This is amazing! Would you fly into DC and home on the same day? Sounds like a quick way to rack up air miles, and get paid to sit on an airplane and read books/watch movies/etc. (one of the best perks of business travel, IMO).

That actually sounds pretty miserable to me.  I find it extremely stressful and draining to go through the air-travel-rigmarole.... twice in one day (in addition to doing actual work) sounds awful.

I would, if I could bill travel time. I used to to do this at a previous employer. Billing started 2H prior to flight. and ended 1H after flight, or when I got to client site. Just had to make sure to log everything. This was in the late 2000s. Wife was working long CPA hours and in grad school; didn't have kids.
I've done 16 hour days to fill in for someone at another regional site for some very important tests that are planned months in advance; fortunately it was very rare. Stopped doing it and then quit that employer when they changed the rules and didn't appreciate the efforts of the engineers to step in at the last minute. They had the gall to say "you should appreciate you have a job" during the last housing meltdown.
Didn't have FU money at the time, but did find a better job for a 30% raise and FU'd the department manager. Some bridges can be burnt.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Playing with Fire UK on July 14, 2021, 09:35:43 AM
This is amazing! Would you fly into DC and home on the same day? Sounds like a quick way to rack up air miles, and get paid to sit on an airplane and read books/watch movies/etc. (one of the best perks of business travel, IMO).

That actually sounds pretty miserable to me.  I find it extremely stressful and draining to go through the air-travel-rigmarole.... twice in one day (in addition to doing actual work) sounds awful.

BuffaloStache is me when I took a job involving loads of travel. rantk81 is me two years later.

I just declined to fly from London to south America for a one morning meeting. Boss was surprised and disappointed. My carbon footprint says thank you to my FU money.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: jinga nation on July 14, 2021, 09:42:08 AM
This is amazing! Would you fly into DC and home on the same day? Sounds like a quick way to rack up air miles, and get paid to sit on an airplane and read books/watch movies/etc. (one of the best perks of business travel, IMO).

That actually sounds pretty miserable to me.  I find it extremely stressful and draining to go through the air-travel-rigmarole.... twice in one day (in addition to doing actual work) sounds awful.

BuffaloStache is me when I took a job involving loads of travel. rantk81 is me two years later.

I just declined to fly from London to south America for a one morning meeting. Boss was surprised and disappointed. My carbon footprint says thank you to my FU money.

One morning meeting for a trans-continental flight? I would try and turn this into a minimum 5-day trip aka boondoggle. There so much corporate jargon I could use to justify up the chain.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: NorthernIkigai on July 14, 2021, 10:37:54 AM
I just declined to fly from London to south America for a one morning meeting.

I thought the UK time zone was only 1 hour behind Central European Time, not 2 years behind...
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Playing with Fire UK on July 14, 2021, 10:49:32 AM
I just declined to fly from London to south America for a one morning meeting.

I thought the UK time zone was only 1 hour behind Central European Time, not 2 years behind...

Ridiculous right? It's as if we've managed to unlearn everything Covid taught us.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: bbqbonelesswing on July 14, 2021, 05:50:07 PM
I've noticed that at least half of the software dev jobs out there now are offering 100% remote work. I really don't know what these companies are thinking that they can force workers back to the office.

My roommate is being forced back in the office, where he spends the day on Zoom calls with other people who aren't at his location anyway.  It's ridiculous.

This is so accurate. I've been going back to the office a few days per week, but my customers are spread out all over the globe. We have no in-person meetings unless it's a rare big visit. It makes no sense; I can take a call from my apartment just as easily as I could from an office. I'm sure it has nothing to do with the fact that our CEO doubled down and bought a new office building in 2019...
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: SwordGuy on July 14, 2021, 06:15:50 PM
Ridiculous right? It's as if we've managed to unlearn everything Covid taught us.

I know a lot of people who haven't learned a truthful lesson about Covid yet.   At least 45% of the folks in my county haven't learned yet.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Plina on July 15, 2021, 12:53:52 PM
I just declined to fly from London to south America for a one morning meeting.

I thought the UK time zone was only 1 hour behind Central European Time, not 2 years behind...

Ridiculous right? It's as if we've managed to unlearn everything Covid taught us.

Here the companies are making big savings on travel and minimized offices. There is no way they can justify going back to precovid level of travel.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Playing with Fire UK on July 15, 2021, 02:54:56 PM
I just declined to fly from London to south America for a one morning meeting.

I thought the UK time zone was only 1 hour behind Central European Time, not 2 years behind...

Ridiculous right? It's as if we've managed to unlearn everything Covid taught us.

Here the companies are making big savings on travel and minimized offices. There is no way they can justify going back to precovid level of travel.

I'm sure that's true for some companies in the UK. Mine seems to be looking to show clients that we care about them by flying half way around the world to shake their hand and share our germs. I'm not sure it's what our clients want...
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: pasadenafr on July 15, 2021, 03:10:20 PM
I've noticed that at least half of the software dev jobs out there now are offering 100% remote work. I really don't know what these companies are thinking that they can force workers back to the office.

My roommate is being forced back in the office, where he spends the day on Zoom calls with other people who aren't at his location anyway.  It's ridiculous.

This is so accurate. I've been going back to the office a few days per week, but my customers are spread out all over the globe. We have no in-person meetings unless it's a rare big visit. It makes no sense; I can take a call from my apartment just as easily as I could from an office. I'm sure it has nothing to do with the fact that our CEO doubled down and bought a new office building in 2019...

This reminds me of my previous job. We used to work shifts, where we had to be in the office at 8am (ok). Then we outsourced that work, and stopped doing shift things, but we were still expected to show up at 8am (🙄). The thing is, most - if not all - of my job involved working with people on the East coast or in Europe (I was based on the West coast) so I had non-stop calls in the early morning. Most of the time starting at 6am or 7am, sometimes (rarely) earlier, and back-to-back until 8 or 9am. So most days, I would show up in the office somewhere between 8:30 and 9:30am. Before that, I was online in the chat app.

My boss kept bitching about it and told me that if I couldn't be there at 8am, then I should come in before my calls and take them from the office. Main reason was that it looked bad for the rest of the team. Never mind that none of us actually needed to be there at 8am, and never mind that when I was showing up after everybody, I had already been working for 3 hours to their (or his) 30 minutes.

I always refused and there was nothing he could do about it except dinging me during my annual review.

Oh and since we were hourly, and our useless "shifts" ended at 5pm, he also got to pay me overtime lol.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: mm1970 on July 16, 2021, 11:21:53 AM
Quote
FU money has also given the willingness to look for a permanent job working from home. The pandemic forced everyone at my job to work from home starting March 2020 and most are still doing this. Despite the great success the company has had in this work model, they suddenly decided that we "do our best work together" and that all employees will be in the physical office at least three days a week. I loooooove working from home and there isn't anything about my job that requires being at the office. The forced WFH experiment has proven that it works. The only reason they want developers back is micromanagement. I applied for permanent home work. The CIO himself has to approve it. My reasoning was honest - preference. I have already told my boss that if it's not approved I'll just find a job at any one of the abundant remote development jobs that are out there now. We'll see what happens.

This is funny.  We have been working *mostly* from home since March 2020 also, except for the 15% of people who need to be in person to run equipment.  In the last few months, more people have been going in because they are vaccinated.  Lots of people love working at home - saves on commute, fewer distractions.

The company has been saying since May that we'll be returning to the office in September.  At least weekly, we are told to think about this and plan for this.  Also: they realize that WFH is attractive to many, so it will be allowed, for a maximum of 2 days a week.  In summary:
- plan for returning to the office
- discuss with your manager
- we aren't going to be specifying the details company-wide, you have to work it out for your manager
- it can be 3 days at the office/ 2 days at home, or 4/1, but you MUST be in the office at least 3 days
- but work it out with your manager :P
- (obvious lack of discussion about the 2 employees who live in other states - they were kept on FT after they moved away)
- obvious lack of discussion about how we have employees in Asia that we work with daily
- tiny bit of discussion (brought up by me) that new equipment is going into the building and we are losing office space.
- tiny bit of discussion about our growing COVID cases locally

But...is anyone REALLY going to be checking?  I mean, I have late afternoon meeting with Asia 3-4 days a week, and I really don't want to be at the office until 6:30 or 7 pm 3-4 days a week.  If I take them from home, I can eat dinner while working...

Anyway, fun times.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: rantk81 on July 16, 2021, 12:02:00 PM
This is funny.  We have been working *mostly* from home since March 2020 also, except for the 15% of people who need to be in person to run equipment.  In the last few months, more people have been going in because they are vaccinated.  Lots of people love working at home - saves on commute, fewer distractions.

The company has been saying since May that we'll be returning to the office in September.  At least weekly, we are told to think about this and plan for this.  Also: they realize that WFH is attractive to many, so it will be allowed, for a maximum of 2 days a week.  In summary:

Hah, I'm hearing the exact same wishy-washy stuff from my employer.

Fun fact: I was on-boarded to this company during the Covid WFH, and have never met another co-worker in person, nor seen the inside of an office.  Even still, I've been performing great, and have received sparkling perf-evaluations from the people I work with and report to.

Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Dave1442397 on July 16, 2021, 12:25:02 PM
After a lot of futzing around by HR, and with conflicting messages coming from various levels of management, it looks like I'll be full time remote once the dust settles.

The good thing about this company is that once they put a label on you, it tends to be non-removable, so once I get classified as a remote worker, that should be the end of it.

I save a lot of money by staying home. I've put 1,237 miles on my car so far this year. If I were driving to work, it would be 72 miles round trip every day, plus a $5 bridge toll.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: bbqbonelesswing on July 16, 2021, 04:04:03 PM
But...is anyone REALLY going to be checking?

At our company, no. Pre-covid I had the ability to work from home 2 days a week. Nobody kept track, so many people just worked fully remote.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: BicycleB on July 16, 2021, 04:32:11 PM
But...is anyone REALLY going to be checking?

At our company, no. Pre-covid I had the ability to work from home 2 days a week. Nobody kept track, so many people just worked fully remote.

Aha! The limit is not what they say. It's what you do.

"That's helpful." - Peggy, Mad Men
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cNwtgUkeKv8
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Rural on July 17, 2021, 08:07:53 AM
But...is anyone REALLY going to be checking?

At our company, no. Pre-covid I had the ability to work from home 2 days a week. Nobody kept track, so many people just worked fully remote.


Similar situation here. We're supposedly going to be back fully in person in fall, just in time for the big Delta surge, no masks and under 30% vaccinated. I do need to be there for one class (I'm one of the few vaccinated, and I'll mask). Trying to decide if I'll go in to work from my office with door shut and window open one other day, or not. No one will know, and I'd get the mission critical project I need to finish up done better and quicker from home.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: JLee on July 17, 2021, 10:08:43 AM
But...is anyone REALLY going to be checking?

At our company, no. Pre-covid I had the ability to work from home 2 days a week. Nobody kept track, so many people just worked fully remote.


Similar situation here. We're supposedly going to be back fully in person in fall, just in time for the big Delta surge, no masks and under 30% vaccinated. I do need to be there for one class (I'm one of the few vaccinated, and I'll mask). Trying to decide if I'll go in to work from my office with door shut and window open one other day, or not. No one will know, and I'd get the mission critical project I need to finish up done better and quicker from home.

Oh that is rough. If it were me I probably wouldn't go in either.

My employer has announced that all employees must be vaccinated by a specific date, and if they don't comply (or provide HR with a medical or religious reason otherwise) they will no longer be employed.  I'm surprised they took that step, but frankly I'm glad to see it and I hope more companies do the same.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Plina on July 17, 2021, 12:14:28 PM
But...is anyone REALLY going to be checking?

At our company, no. Pre-covid I had the ability to work from home 2 days a week. Nobody kept track, so many people just worked fully remote.


Similar situation here. We're supposedly going to be back fully in person in fall, just in time for the big Delta surge, no masks and under 30% vaccinated. I do need to be there for one class (I'm one of the few vaccinated, and I'll mask). Trying to decide if I'll go in to work from my office with door shut and window open one other day, or not. No one will know, and I'd get the mission critical project I need to finish up done better and quicker from home.

Oh that is rough. If it were me I probably wouldn't go in either.

My employer has announced that all employees must be vaccinated by a specific date, and if they don't comply (or provide HR with a medical or religious reason otherwise) they will no longer be employed.  I'm surprised they took that step, but frankly I'm glad to see it and I hope more companies do the same.

What kind of religious reason can you have?
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Imma on July 17, 2021, 12:58:16 PM
But...is anyone REALLY going to be checking?

At our company, no. Pre-covid I had the ability to work from home 2 days a week. Nobody kept track, so many people just worked fully remote.


Similar situation here. We're supposedly going to be back fully in person in fall, just in time for the big Delta surge, no masks and under 30% vaccinated. I do need to be there for one class (I'm one of the few vaccinated, and I'll mask). Trying to decide if I'll go in to work from my office with door shut and window open one other day, or not. No one will know, and I'd get the mission critical project I need to finish up done better and quicker from home.

Oh that is rough. If it were me I probably wouldn't go in either.

My employer has announced that all employees must be vaccinated by a specific date, and if they don't comply (or provide HR with a medical or religious reason otherwise) they will no longer be employed.  I'm surprised they took that step, but frankly I'm glad to see it and I hope more companies do the same.

What kind of religious reason can you have?

Many orthodox Christians in my country oppose vaccination as a matter of principle (not just Covid, all vaccination). It's God's divine Providence that makes us sick or healthy. If God decides we're going to be sick, we can use all available methods to get healthy again, but if we get a vaccination we're basically playing God ourselves. They oppose insurance and seatbelts for the same reason.

In these orthodox communities outbreaks of diseases like measles and polio happen every decade. When someone ends up in hospital, the church community pays the medical bills.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: AMandM on July 17, 2021, 04:40:48 PM

Oh that is rough. If it were me I probably wouldn't go in either.

My employer has announced that all employees must be vaccinated by a specific date, and if they don't comply (or provide HR with a medical or religious reason otherwise) they will no longer be employed.  I'm surprised they took that step, but frankly I'm glad to see it and I hope more companies do the same.

What kind of religious reason can you have?

IIRC, Christian Scientists and Jehovah's Witnesses are opposed in principle to all vaccinations. Christian Scientists are opposed to medical interventions in general, and I *think* Jehovah's Witnesses refuse injections (along with transfusions, IVs, tattoos, and piercings) because they constitute mutilation of the body as created by God.

edited to fix quote formatting
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Model96 on July 17, 2021, 06:38:25 PM
Proof that education is the most powerful tool on Earth, but still not powerful enough to neutralise the most powerful force on Earth, which is stupidity.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Sibley on July 17, 2021, 08:17:44 PM

Oh that is rough. If it were me I probably wouldn't go in either.

My employer has announced that all employees must be vaccinated by a specific date, and if they don't comply (or provide HR with a medical or religious reason otherwise) they will no longer be employed.  I'm surprised they took that step, but frankly I'm glad to see it and I hope more companies do the same.

What kind of religious reason can you have?

IIRC, Christian Scientists and Jehovah's Witnesses are opposed in principle to all vaccinations. Christian Scientists are opposed to medical interventions in general, and I *think* Jehovah's Witnesses refuse injections (along with transfusions, IVs, tattoos, and piercings) because they constitute mutilation of the body as created by God.

I find it highly ironic that the name of the church is Christian Scientists. They certainly don't seem to embrace science.

edit: fixed the formating cause it bugs me
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: snowball on July 17, 2021, 11:19:55 PM
If God decides we're going to be sick, we can use all available methods to get healthy again, but if we get a vaccination we're basically playing God ourselves. They oppose insurance and seatbelts for the same reason.

I don't understand why, if getting vaccinated or taking other reasonable precautions is playing God, going to the hospital is fine...Surely, if it's God's will that you get sick, you should also leave your recovery completely up to him, and not be interfering with the outcome he's decided on for you.

I feel it's because these people don't really have the courage of their convictions, when push comes to shove.  It's easy to refuse preventative care; you can choose to believe nothing bad is going to happen.  Not so easy to refuse treatment after you're sick and maybe staring death in the face.

(I know there are those who do refuse to go to the hospital.  I respect that a whole lot more, except when it comes to them refusing to take their kids...that's infuriating.)
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: kina on July 18, 2021, 04:54:41 AM


IIRC, Christian Scientists and Jehovah's Witnesses are opposed in principle to all vaccinations. Christian Scientists are opposed to medical interventions in general, and I *think* Jehovah's Witnesses refuse injections (along with transfusions, IVs, tattoos, and piercings) because they constitute mutilation of the body as created by God.

@AMandM , you are misinformed. I am not a JW but have a relative who is. They will accept IV's except for blood transfusions. No problem with injections (this person is fully Covid--as well as other--vaccinated), I don't know about tattoos and piercings but doubt that they are prohibited. Also the 'reasoning' you state is incorrect. The transfusion thing has to do with the "drinking of blood" that is a Hebrew prohibition (related to idol worship). I don't consider it the same thing but my relative and the JW religion does.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: GreenSheep on July 18, 2021, 05:19:42 AM
If God decides we're going to be sick, we can use all available methods to get healthy again, but if we get a vaccination we're basically playing God ourselves. They oppose insurance and seatbelts for the same reason.

I don't understand why, if getting vaccinated or taking other reasonable precautions is playing God, going to the hospital is fine...Surely, if it's God's will that you get sick, you should also leave your recovery completely up to him, and not be interfering with the outcome he's decided on for you.

I feel it's because these people don't really have the courage of their convictions, when push comes to shove.  It's easy to refuse preventative care; you can choose to believe nothing bad is going to happen.  Not so easy to refuse treatment after you're sick and maybe staring death in the face.

(I know there are those who do refuse to go to the hospital.  I respect that a whole lot more, except when it comes to them refusing to take their kids...that's infuriating.)

This reminds me of that old joke about a person stranded on a desert island, convinced God is going to save them. A boat stops by and offers to help, and they tell the boat no, they're sure that God is going to save them, so they'll wait for God. Then a helicopter, a few other things... insert creative modes of transportation here. All of them are told no thanks, God is going to come save me. The person ends up dying and going to heaven, where they ask God what happened. And God says, "Well, I tried! I sent a boat, a helicopter, etc.! What more did you want?!"
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: LennStar on July 18, 2021, 08:30:04 AM
That's like the joke where one prays to win in the lottery until finally one day God screams "At least play the lottery!"

If God decides we're going to be sick, we can use all available methods to get healthy again, but if we get a vaccination we're basically playing God ourselves. They oppose insurance and seatbelts for the same reason.

I don't understand why, if getting vaccinated or taking other reasonable precautions is playing God, going to the hospital is fine...Surely, if it's God's will that you get sick, you should also leave your recovery completely up to him, and not be interfering with the outcome he's decided on for you.
Not to mention that if God wants you to get sick, he can f*** well do it even if you are vaccinated! It's blashemy to think that a vaccination can oppose God's will!!!
(Also how do you know if the sickness cames from God or Satan?)
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: RyanAtTanagra on July 18, 2021, 09:11:06 AM
Can we get back to epic stories?
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Dicey on July 18, 2021, 10:08:31 AM
Can we get back to epic stories?
Sure. Got one?
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: RyanAtTanagra on July 18, 2021, 10:54:44 AM
Can we get back to epic stories?
Sure. Got one?

Hah, should have expected that.  Ok fiiiiine.  Not super epic, but I was recently reminded of how having a stash gives you so many more options that you otherwise may never even see.

I went to 32-hour (4-day) weeks about 18 months ago at work.  My workload had been diminishing for a while, and I had been making good progress on savings, so I decided to take advantage of it.  So I took a 20% paycut, which was all well and good.  Then 3 months later the pandemic hit, putting a temporary (we'll see) stop to bonuses, which was another 20% cut, which was still ok.  Then mid-pandemic we bought a house and expenses went way up, which was still..... ok-ish.  But we also bought knowing there were renovations and changes we wanted to make, which are expensive, so I'm feeling a shortage of money for the first time in over a decade.

So I debated going back to 40 hours, which they would let me if I asked.  But I've also wanted to try out contract work, which is hard to get going when you have a full time job (and many hobbies).  But now I essentially have an extra day I can devote to it, so I started working on figuring out how the contracting world works.   I got my first potential gig via a recommendation from a friend, had a phone call w/ the owner, and what he's needing is exactly what I do.  Halfway through the conversation he asks me how much it would cost him to just bring me on full time, which caught me off guard and made me stop to think.  I turned him down (we're still going forward with contract work), because a) I'm not looking to commit to 40-hr full time employment, probably ever again, and b) I actually like my job and company (and the industry we're in), and am not looking to leave it quite yet.

It was a good moment for a couple reasons.  1)  I knew I didn't dislike my job, but didn't realize how much I enjoyed it until I was presented with an offer to leave, and didn't want to, and 2) I suddenly had several paths in front of me that I got to choose from, which just doesn't happen when you are (or feel) stuck in a job that takes all your time an energy.  Having a stash, if nothing else, just gives you breathing room to step back and take a look around.

Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: AMandM on July 18, 2021, 01:33:47 PM


IIRC, Christian Scientists and Jehovah's Witnesses are opposed in principle to all vaccinations. Christian Scientists are opposed to medical interventions in general, and I *think* Jehovah's Witnesses refuse injections (along with transfusions, IVs, tattoos, and piercings) because they constitute mutilation of the body as created by God.

@AMandM , you are misinformed. I am not a JW but have a relative who is. They will accept IV's except for blood transfusions. No problem with injections (this person is fully Covid--as well as other--vaccinated), I don't know about tattoos and piercings but doubt that they are prohibited. Also the 'reasoning' you state is incorrect. The transfusion thing has to do with the "drinking of blood" that is a Hebrew prohibition (related to idol worship). I don't consider it the same thing but my relative and the JW religion does.

I stand corrected. Thank you, @kina!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: kina on July 18, 2021, 05:02:42 PM
@AMandM, I think my inner schoolmarm got the best of me, there. Apologies for the tone!

(I think I'll go write "I will speak in a kind manner" 100 times for penance...)
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: AMandM on July 18, 2021, 08:32:56 PM
@kina, the tone sounded fine to me! No apologies (or lines) needed!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: 20957 on July 18, 2021, 09:20:50 PM
Just fyi, Christian Scientists often choose not to vaccinate but their is no requirement about it. The only requirement is actually that you follow the law in your jurisdiction about public health.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: snowball on July 19, 2021, 06:21:36 AM
The fact that I have enough money now for leanFIRE is...increasingly turning me into a loose cannon at work, it seems.  (Might lead to an epic story eventually.  For now, I give you an anecdote.)

A few weeks ago I had a brilliant realization that I don't think would ever have come to me back in the days when I was more concerned about holding onto my job.  Context: The nameplates on our office doors consist of a plastic holder with a slip of paper, your name and title printed on it.  Normally Facilities staff come swap out the paper when an office is reassigned or a title changes.

But it's just a piece of paper.  Eminently self-replaceable...

And - my job title is so boring.  Hardly an incentive to continue OMY'ing, though my employer knows not that this is what I am doing.  But really, for my employer's own good, clearly my boring title is a morale / staff retention issue that needs to be addressed (she says virtuously).

Thought led to action within the hour, and thus...my new job title was born.

So far no one's noticed the change except a few people I pointed it out to, who found it hilarious.  I bet I can go literally years without anyone noticing on their own, especially since I retained the first couple of words from my official title.  You'd have to keep reading to notice, and who does that?  (I guess I will find out!)

My new title? Section Head, Dragon and Pixiedust Wrangling.

I still don't have any truly epic stories, but I did officially resign and pick a last day - Nov 4.  I note that my self-assigned title is still up on my office door, so this will mark about a year that I've been the Section Head of Dragon and Pixiedust Wrangling.

Mostly no one's noticed, but another Section Head - from the IT dept - did wander into my office one day and choked laughing.  I increased my internal estimate of her attention to detail (I don't know her well).  Also her sense of humour.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: LennStar on July 19, 2021, 08:31:57 AM
The fact that I have enough money now for leanFIRE is...increasingly turning me into a loose cannon at work, it seems.  (Might lead to an epic story eventually.  For now, I give you an anecdote.)

A few weeks ago I had a brilliant realization that I don't think would ever have come to me back in the days when I was more concerned about holding onto my job.  Context: The nameplates on our office doors consist of a plastic holder with a slip of paper, your name and title printed on it.  Normally Facilities staff come swap out the paper when an office is reassigned or a title changes.

But it's just a piece of paper.  Eminently self-replaceable...

And - my job title is so boring.  Hardly an incentive to continue OMY'ing, though my employer knows not that this is what I am doing.  But really, for my employer's own good, clearly my boring title is a morale / staff retention issue that needs to be addressed (she says virtuously).

Thought led to action within the hour, and thus...my new job title was born.

So far no one's noticed the change except a few people I pointed it out to, who found it hilarious.  I bet I can go literally years without anyone noticing on their own, especially since I retained the first couple of words from my official title.  You'd have to keep reading to notice, and who does that?  (I guess I will find out!)

My new title? Section Head, Dragon and Pixiedust Wrangling.

I still don't have any truly epic stories, but I did officially resign and pick a last day - Nov 4.  I note that my self-assigned title is still up on my office door, so this will mark about a year that I've been the Section Head of Dragon and Pixiedust Wrangling.

Mostly no one's noticed, but another Section Head - from the IT dept - did wander into my office one day and choked laughing.  I increased my internal estimate of her attention to detail (I don't know her well).  Also her sense of humour.
Damn, and now you have to change it. Translocating Section Head, Dragon, End of World and Pixiedust Wrangling or something like that.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: WerKater on July 27, 2021, 12:35:55 PM
This is not epic, nor is it a full story (yet). But if it becomes those things it will involve FU money, so I am posting it anyway.

My manager and the higher-ups want to introduce <NewFormalProcess> for something we regularly need to do (details don't matter). The process is actually something I agree with. Most of the actual work within the process will have to be done by me and a few others on the same level as me (and we are actually already doing it, except there is no formal process). Open question is how fast we should be able to do this process. Since I am currently already doing this work, I like to believe that I have a very reasonable idea about how long it takes. I am usually a reasonable person, unless someone pisses me off.

I suggested one week.

His reaction:
No, that is much too slow, we need to be faster. Like one or two days.
Me: There is no way we can do that reliably. Maybe in some trivial cases, but most of the time, the process requires coordination and discussion between a few people. And these people have a lot on their plates already. It can easily take a few days to hash this sort of thing out between all relevant persons.
Manager: You can just call a meeting at the same day with all relevant persons and discuss it then.
Me: No, we can't. Many people have very full schedules (you know, just like you). And also other work to do.
Manager: You can always call a same-day meeting. Just do it at 6pm.
Me: [speechless for a moment]. Most people leave long before 6pm. And I certainly don't want to work so late. If it's very rarely, ok. But even then, it needs to be planned, so not same-day. Many people (like me...) have private obligations.
Manager: We can force you to. We can order you to do overtime [note: saying this ("force", "order") is totally out-of-character for the guy].
Me: [now I am pissed] First, no, you can't. [1]
Me: And second, do you remember how we talked about problems with employee retention recently? I can tell you now that this won't help.
Me: And besides, it is definitely not usual that <Process> would even need to be completed within one week. Usually, we know about it at least roughly multiple weeks in advance. In all cases that I know where somethign sprang on us "suddenly", it was always because somebody (I am looking at you, higher-ups...) actually already knew about it but failed to pass it on in a timely manner.

The discussion continued a little but it became clear that we would not agree. We postponed it and will discuss it with all involved persons to also get their opinion.

[1]
This answer left him speechless for a moment. It has multiple levels (which I did not discuss with him):
First, legally, he can't force me to do overtime since my contract does not mention it and that means that he cannot demand it.
More importantly, he can't force me, because that is one thing that will surely make me quit on his ass (or maybe just ignore the demand and dare him to fire me -- a labor court would probably not look kindly on an employer who tries to force a father to work overtime, despite no contractual obligation. And while said father would actually have to pick his kid up from daycare).

This is actually the very first time that something at work made my mind jump to the "FU Money" concept, so it maybe sort of fits in here.


Let's see how it plays out. Whatever happens, FU money has already worked. I am definitely not worried about the outcome.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Fru-Gal on July 27, 2021, 12:53:48 PM
Way to go! Great answer. Always helpful to read these and add to my store of stock answers to unreasonable demands.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: alcon835 on July 27, 2021, 04:36:29 PM
This is an epic FU story! You held your ground in a situation when others would have cowered. Having the FU money in your back pocket freed you to have this conversation. Totally epic!!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: gooki on July 28, 2021, 01:09:57 AM
Fuck yeah. That managers got some unrealistic expectations.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: 2sk22 on July 28, 2021, 03:27:12 AM
Well done @WerKater !
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: MissNancyPryor on July 28, 2021, 09:08:46 AM
 @WerKater- you might enjoy Dr. Doom's blog, livingafi.com
 
On his run up to his first FIRE he documented his career experience that feels like your entry here.  He has many posts that go through his working life and the middle sections dealing with incompetent bosses with unreasonable time demands is extra good stuff, and his blooming sense of the power of FU money is documented.  Dr. Doom writes very well and it is an enjoyable blog, even though it is pretty old stuff by internet standards.

Maybe some other readers here might enjoy it so I figured I would post the link.   
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: ysette9 on July 28, 2021, 12:19:55 PM
Dr Doom is my favorite blogger, if that isn’t sacrilege to say around these parts. 
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Shane on July 28, 2021, 12:57:44 PM
Let's see how it plays out. Whatever happens, FU money has already worked. I am definitely not worried about the outcome.

Yeah, just knowing that you have options, other than just accepting whatever management tries to force onto you, often changes everything.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Wolfpack Mustachian on July 31, 2021, 08:41:02 AM
This is not epic, nor is it a full story (yet). But if it becomes those things it will involve FU money, so I am posting it anyway.

My manager and the higher-ups want to introduce <NewFormalProcess> for something we regularly need to do (details don't matter). The process is actually something I agree with. Most of the actual work within the process will have to be done by me and a few others on the same level as me (and we are actually already doing it, except there is no formal process). Open question is how fast we should be able to do this process. Since I am currently already doing this work, I like to believe that I have a very reasonable idea about how long it takes. I am usually a reasonable person, unless someone pisses me off.

I suggested one week.

His reaction:
No, that is much too slow, we need to be faster. Like one or two days.
Me: There is no way we can do that reliably. Maybe in some trivial cases, but most of the time, the process requires coordination and discussion between a few people. And these people have a lot on their plates already. It can easily take a few days to hash this sort of thing out between all relevant persons.
Manager: You can just call a meeting at the same day with all relevant persons and discuss it then.
Me: No, we can't. Many people have very full schedules (you know, just like you). And also other work to do.
Manager: You can always call a same-day meeting. Just do it at 6pm.
Me: [speechless for a moment]. Most people leave long before 6pm. And I certainly don't want to work so late. If it's very rarely, ok. But even then, it needs to be planned, so not same-day. Many people (like me...) have private obligations.
Manager: We can force you to. We can order you to do overtime [note: saying this ("force", "order") is totally out-of-character for the guy].
Me: [now I am pissed] First, no, you can't. [1]
Me: And second, do you remember how we talked about problems with employee retention recently? I can tell you now that this won't help.
Me: And besides, it is definitely not usual that <Process> would even need to be completed within one week. Usually, we know about it at least roughly multiple weeks in advance. In all cases that I know where somethign sprang on us "suddenly", it was always because somebody (I am looking at you, higher-ups...) actually already knew about it but failed to pass it on in a timely manner.

The discussion continued a little but it became clear that we would not agree. We postponed it and will discuss it with all involved persons to also get their opinion.

[1]
This answer left him speechless for a moment. It has multiple levels (which I did not discuss with him):
First, legally, he can't force me to do overtime since my contract does not mention it and that means that he cannot demand it.
More importantly, he can't force me, because that is one thing that will surely make me quit on his ass (or maybe just ignore the demand and dare him to fire me -- a labor court would probably not look kindly on an employer who tries to force a father to work overtime, despite no contractual obligation. And while said father would actually have to pick his kid up from daycare).

This is actually the very first time that something at work made my mind jump to the "FU Money" concept, so it maybe sort of fits in here.


Let's see how it plays out. Whatever happens, FU money has already worked. I am definitely not worried about the outcome.

Sometimes I wonder if these guys have ever been told no in a situation like this. Not just pushback (which is probably rare in and of itself) but a firm no. I know you say it's out of character with the manager but people in all of these situations that come up on this thread in general all seem to have similar reactions of total disbelief.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: SwordGuy on July 31, 2021, 09:04:25 AM

Sometimes I wonder if these guys have ever been told no in a situation like this. Not just pushback (which is probably rare in and of itself) but a firm no. I know you say it's out of character with the manager but people in all of these situations that come up on this thread in general all seem to have similar reactions of total disbelief.

Self-absorbed, selfish people rarely consider the viewpoint of others until said viewpoint hits them upside the head like a 2x4.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: arebelspy on July 31, 2021, 10:58:01 PM
Saw this post on Reddit.

Title: My boss's secretary quit this morning after delivering breakfast.

Post:
(https://preview.redd.it/uxia2zdihrd71.jpg?width=960&crop=smart&auto=webp&s=899c8931fb6d9f8a08daaa90fc973a22ef8fc148)

Man, if that isn't an epic FU story*, I don't know what is. A picture tells 1000 words here. :D


*Sure, we don't know for sure she had FU money, but whatever.


Credit: https://www.reddit.com/r/Wellthatsucks/comments/osndlx/my_bosss_secretary_quit_this_morning_after/
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Plina on August 01, 2021, 12:56:52 AM
Saw this post on Reddit.

Title: My boss's secretary quit this morning after delivering breakfast.

Post:
(https://preview.redd.it/uxia2zdihrd71.jpg?width=960&crop=smart&auto=webp&s=899c8931fb6d9f8a08daaa90fc973a22ef8fc148)

Man, if that isn't an epic FU story*, I don't know what is. A picture tells 1000 words here. :D


*Sure, we don't know for sure she had FU money, but whatever.


Credit: https://www.reddit.com/r/Wellthatsucks/comments/osndlx/my_bosss_secretary_quit_this_morning_after/

Looks like she made them a big favor if that is supposed to be breakfast.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Dicey on August 01, 2021, 02:17:22 AM
Those are big bites. I bet she enjoyed them all!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: LennStar on August 01, 2021, 08:58:18 AM
Saw this post on Reddit.

Title: My boss's secretary quit this morning after delivering breakfast.


Looks like she made them a big favor if that is supposed to be breakfast.
Yeah, thought the same. That maybe count as teatime sweets or something, but not as a meal. Especially not the first of the day. I don't even want to imagine how much sugar is in there and what it does to your liver and diabetes if that is your first meal of the day.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Chaplin on August 01, 2021, 09:27:59 AM
Saw this post on Reddit.

Title: My boss's secretary quit this morning after delivering breakfast.


Looks like she made them a big favor if that is supposed to be breakfast.
Yeah, thought the same. That maybe count as teatime sweets or something, but not as a meal. Especially not the first of the day. I don't even want to imagine how much sugar is in there and what it does to your liver and diabetes if that is your first meal of the day.

I say this in gentle humor: I think you're missing the point. Even if she ate them it's a one-time, brilliantly delivered, epic message. She could have taken each bite and spit it out - we don't know and she's probably not telling.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: shelivesthedream on August 01, 2021, 11:49:57 AM
And odds on she brought in a special treat for first thing in the morning/"breakfast"... then opened the box.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Plina on August 01, 2021, 02:00:52 PM
Saw this post on Reddit.

Title: My boss's secretary quit this morning after delivering breakfast.


Looks like she made them a big favor if that is supposed to be breakfast.
Yeah, thought the same. That maybe count as teatime sweets or something, but not as a meal. Especially not the first of the day. I don't even want to imagine how much sugar is in there and what it does to your liver and diabetes if that is your first meal of the day.

I say this in gentle humor: I think you're missing the point. Even if she ate them it's a one-time, brilliantly delivered, epic message. She could have taken each bite and spit it out - we don't know and she's probably not telling.

I didn’t miss the point, I just found it interesting that someone called that breakfast.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Shane on August 02, 2021, 04:50:57 AM

I didn’t miss the point, I just found it interesting that someone called that breakfast.

Guessing you haven't been to the US lately. If you saw what average Americans look like in 2021, it wouldn't surprise you, at all, that many here consider sugary donuts a completely normal 'breakfast.'
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Luke Warm on August 02, 2021, 04:54:19 AM

I didn’t miss the point, I just found it interesting that someone called that breakfast.

Guessing you haven't been to the US lately. If you saw what average Americans look like in 2021, it wouldn't surprise you, at all, that many here consider sugary donuts a completely normal 'breakfast.'

yep. there's always a crowd at the krispy kreme.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: johndoe on August 06, 2021, 11:27:44 AM
Maybe I don't understand "FU money"... always assumed it was something like "I'm here because I get satisfaction out of [insert task]; I don't need the paycheck and won't blindly comply with superiors' orders if they're not the right thing to do".  How does burning bridges by doing something like eating someone's donuts become an "epic" move?  Even if that employee was mistreated for years, it's impossible for them to not appear petty by doing something like this.  Am I in the minority here?
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: AlanStache on August 06, 2021, 12:09:57 PM
Maybe I don't understand "FU money"... always assumed it was something like "I'm here because I get satisfaction out of [insert task]; I don't need the paycheck and won't blindly comply with superiors' orders if they're not the right thing to do".  How does burning bridges by doing something like eating someone's donuts become an "epic" move?  Even if that employee was mistreated for years, it's impossible for them to not appear petty by doing something like this.  Am I in the minority here?

"Entertainment should not consist of novel situations that are amusing and out of the ordinary but rather should be restricted to mundane and mutually respectful interactions."  /s
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: SwordGuy on August 06, 2021, 12:11:26 PM
Maybe I don't understand "FU money"... always assumed it was something like "I'm here because I get satisfaction out of [insert task]; I don't need the paycheck and won't blindly comply with superiors' orders if they're not the right thing to do".  How does burning bridges by doing something like eating someone's donuts become an "epic" move?  Even if that employee was mistreated for years, it's impossible for them to not appear petty by doing something like this.  Am I in the minority here?

FU money means you have enough resources that you can do just fine for long enough to get another source of income.  Obviously, if one is also FI, "long enough" = "forever".   It means you can afford to say "No." to things that you find unacceptable.

Was taking that bite out of the donuts petty.   Yes, it was.   But there's a truly important difference between a petty action by someone with power and someone who's been on the bottom and finally, FINALLY gets a chance to say FU in a way that gives them a chance to even the score.   Very few people would respond like that unless their management had been mean, cruel, petty, arbitrary, etc., for what seemed like an interminable period of time to the victim. 

Just quitting doesn't convey the message of "I hate your fucking guts you pathetic excuse for a human being".    Delivering their box of donuts with a bite taken out of each one -- probably an unpaid task they had to do on their way to work -- is a way to do that.   

The odds are 100 to 1 that the manager deserved to receive that message. 
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: solon on August 06, 2021, 12:29:05 PM
I'm with @johndoe. This is the act of a petty bridge burner, not someone refusing an immoral order because they don't need the money.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Wolfpack Mustachian on August 06, 2021, 12:34:08 PM
Maybe I don't understand "FU money"... always assumed it was something like "I'm here because I get satisfaction out of [insert task]; I don't need the paycheck and won't blindly comply with superiors' orders if they're not the right thing to do".  How does burning bridges by doing something like eating someone's donuts become an "epic" move?  Even if that employee was mistreated for years, it's impossible for them to not appear petty by doing something like this.  Am I in the minority here?

In regards to the burning bridges part in general, I view stories on here like watching a movie. I would likely never do it myself, but I envision myself having the guts/wit to do something similar at a particularly rough job I had. I don't think I would ever have it in me to burn a bridge in some of these more extreme ways, but I have been in some tough situations and can see the appeal.

In terms of this particular one, I guess it depends on the situation. If she was specifically tasked with bringing breakfast for her boss I can understand it. In all my work situations, something like that would have been more communal, so I definitely wouldn't have done it if it could have felt directed at more than just my boss specifically. All in all, my response was dang, she got the message across that she was pissed.

I personally prefer ones where the response is directly related to the problem - a boss habitually overloads an employee, the employee finally says enough is enough and refuses, they are told there is no option, and then the employee quits, leaving the aggressive boss to hold the bag for everything. I guess it does seem a little less petty to me when they are directly tied to the problem and are a logical consequence of the action.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: trollwithamustache on August 06, 2021, 12:51:44 PM
I'm with @johndoe. This is the act of a petty bridge burner, not someone refusing an immoral order because they don't need the money.

It can definitely get a bit muddy on the difference between Epic and Petty.  I'd argue the blindsiding of management is a big part of a story's epic-ness. That complete lack of understanding that you are not pay check to paycheck. And the Donuts has the blindsiding. 

If she just had her sick kid lick all the donuts, that would have been Petty.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Plina on August 06, 2021, 02:08:04 PM

I didn’t miss the point, I just found it interesting that someone called that breakfast.

Guessing you haven't been to the US lately. If you saw what average Americans look like in 2021, it wouldn't surprise you, at all, that many here consider sugary donuts a completely normal 'breakfast.'

I was a couple of years ago. Mostly we ended buying breakfast food to the hotelroom or apartment because the hotel breakfast was a huge disappointment. I often ended up buying a bagel with creme cheese and coffee for breakfast.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: zolotiyeruki on August 07, 2021, 06:05:33 AM
I've never been aware of any requirement that FU money be used with dignity, class, and grace.  Certainly you can earn bonus internet popularity points if you do, but there are plenty of examples in this thread where a certain degree of forthrightness, bordering on the brusque or even rude, has been necessary to get the point across.  I mean, the key phrase itself is extremely vulgar, so I don't think we should expect that its use be always professional and polite.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: johndoe on August 07, 2021, 06:50:09 AM
Fair responses, I can see how the notion of "I've always been mistreated here, now I can settle the score with boss X" could be appealing.  But imagine you're "boss X" here.  Wouldn't you interpret the donut message as "wow...that employee was crazy.  Clearly they weren't a good team member and we're better off without them"?  I can't imagine this would cause any sort of internal reflection.

From my vantage point, if you're going to burn a bridge so thoroughly, why not do it over a topic that really matters?  If boss X made your life hell and hurt the org, why not go out by presenting facts to boss X's boss about their ineptitude/lack of ethics, and explain that caused you to leave?  If you really want something to change, eating someone's donut isn't going to cut it.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: RWTL on August 07, 2021, 06:58:32 AM
Fair responses, I can see how the notion of "I've always been mistreated here, now I can settle the score with boss X" could be appealing.  But imagine you're "boss X" here.  Wouldn't you interpret the donut message as "wow...that employee was crazy.  Clearly they weren't a good team member and we're better off without them"?  I can't imagine this would cause any sort of internal reflection.

From my vantage point, if you're going to burn a bridge so thoroughly, why not do it over a topic that really matters?  If boss X made your life hell and hurt the org, why not go out by presenting facts to boss X's boss about their ineptitude/lack of ethics, and explain that caused you to leave?  If you really want something to change, eating someone's donut isn't going to cut it.

I'd like to think I'm a good manager - I've never had this type of thing happen to me.  If I did, I would throw out the donuts and move on with my day.  It wouldn't bother me in the least.  I've been in leadership for 26 years and I've seen people do the craziest things.  We'd like to think that these FU moments really make someone reflect on their behavior.  I suspect you are right, most people would just think it was a crazy employee.

I still enjoy all the stories and did find it funny that someone did that to the donuts.

Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Psychstache on August 07, 2021, 07:01:21 AM
Fair responses, I can see how the notion of "I've always been mistreated here, now I can settle the score with boss X" could be appealing.  But imagine you're "boss X" here.  Wouldn't you interpret the donut message as "wow...that employee was crazy.  Clearly they weren't a good team member and we're better off without them"?  I can't imagine this would cause any sort of internal reflection.

From my vantage point, if you're going to burn a bridge so thoroughly, why not do it over a topic that really matters?  If boss X made your life hell and hurt the org, why not go out by presenting facts to boss X's boss about their ineptitude/lack of ethics, and explain that caused you to leave?  If you really want something to change, eating someone's donut isn't going to cut it.

Because the odds of whatever you choose to do actually changing the behavior or difficult, rude, and/or abusive managers is unlikely, so why not do something that is moderately annoying/inconvenient for them.

I love where I work now, but I definitely have an old job in mind that, had I become FI while working there, I would have gone full scorched earth on everybody. Or more simply:


https://youtu.be/rJjKP8vYjpQ

Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: LennStar on August 07, 2021, 08:14:53 AM
I mean, the key phrase itself is extremely vulgar, so I don't think we should expect that its use be always professional and polite.
Yes, I just can't imagine the thread titled "Epic you can sexual intercourse someone else money stories".
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: pasadenafr on August 07, 2021, 08:47:44 AM
Fair responses, I can see how the notion of "I've always been mistreated here, now I can settle the score with boss X" could be appealing.  But imagine you're "boss X" here.  Wouldn't you interpret the donut message as "wow...that employee was crazy.  Clearly they weren't a good team member and we're better off without them"?  I can't imagine this would cause any sort of internal reflection.

From my vantage point, if you're going to burn a bridge so thoroughly, why not do it over a topic that really matters?  If boss X made your life hell and hurt the org, why not go out by presenting facts to boss X's boss about their ineptitude/lack of ethics, and explain that caused you to leave?  If you really want something to change, eating someone's donut isn't going to cut it.

I'd like to think I'm a good manager - I've never had this type of thing happen to me.  If I did, I would throw out the donuts and move on with my day.  It wouldn't bother me in the least.  I've been in leadership for 26 years and I've seen people do the craziest things.  We'd like to think that these FU moments really make someone reflect on their behavior.  I suspect you are right, most people would just think it was a crazy employee.

I still enjoy all the stories and did find it funny that someone did that to the donuts.

Sometimes, it's just about sending the message and saying what you have to say. I'm sure it made her feel better and released some of her pent-up frustrations.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Weisass on August 07, 2021, 08:52:25 AM
Quote
Sometimes, it's just about sending the message and saying what you have to say. I'm sure it made her feel better and released some of her pent-up frustrations.

Exactly. I think it misses the point to start extrapolating out about what this may have taught some boss somewhere. I think sometimes it is just simply satisfying to make your feelings crystal clear, because you CAN.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: SwordGuy on August 07, 2021, 09:00:42 AM
FIf boss X made your life hell and hurt the org, why not go out by presenting facts to boss X's boss about their ineptitude/lack of ethics, and explain that caused you to leave?  If you really want something to change, eating someone's donut isn't going to cut it.

Because only in fairy stories is the person who says "The Emperor has no clothes" a hero.

I worked at McD's in high school and college and grad school and had become an associate manager, which basically means an hourly employee who is paid an extra $0.10 an hour for some management responsibilities.  I was good at my job and had been around a long time.

We got a new manager.  Nice lady, generally a good manager EXCEPT when something went wrong.  Then she panicked and started screaming at the employees.  If you know anything about how a kitchen works at lunch you'll know that was exactly the wrong thing to do.    It was so bad the customers were apologizing to the counter help.  The customers were embarrassed for the employees.

So, when the area supervisor came thru I pulled him aside and told him we had a problem.   That's when I was told that I "had an attitude problem".   

Which was actually perceptive of him because I can tell you that after he said that I sure as hell NOW had an attitude problem.

Managers stick together and rarely consider the possibility that a fellow manager is the problem instead of the employees.   If they do consider it, they generally ignore it unless it interferes with their own life or career.   It's how most of them roll.  Think of it as the pointy-haired boss wall of silence.



Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Taran Wanderer on August 07, 2021, 10:04:14 AM
In our organization, we have a regular program of 1:1 meetings with our direct reports, and Skip 1:1 meetings with their reports.  Then there are roundtables, surveys, and other venues to identify both high performers and problem leaders.  These leaders get coaching, and if that doesn't work, they get to find the opportunity to apply their skills elsewhere.  This has been a pretty big change from earlier years, and the change in the organization has been profound.  In the past, we had people in leadership positions that everyone knew shouldn't be there, but nobody did anything about it.  Now, those people are few and far between.

It's true that in some organizations there is a pointy-haired boss wall of silence... but it doesn't have to be that way.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: SwordGuy on August 07, 2021, 10:09:02 AM
In our organization, we have a regular program of 1:1 meetings with our direct reports, and Skip 1:1 meetings with their reports.  Then there are roundtables, surveys, and other venues to identify both high performers and problem leaders.  These leaders get coaching, and if that doesn't work, they get to find the opportunity to apply their skills elsewhere.  This has been a pretty big change from earlier years, and the change in the organization has been profound.  In the past, we had people in leadership positions that everyone knew shouldn't be there, but nobody did anything about it.  Now, those people are few and far between.

It's true that in some organizations there is a pointy-haired boss wall of silence... but it doesn't have to be that way.

You're absolutely right!   It doesn't HAVE to be that way.   But it very often is. 
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: ScreamingHeadGuy on August 07, 2021, 01:50:57 PM
More on-topic. 

Just this past week my wife told her boss she was not going to travel to a remote site when she could more easily perform the task in an online setting (and travel would have had a negative impact on her more important task). 
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Wolfpack Mustachian on August 07, 2021, 02:17:14 PM
More on-topic. 

Just this past week my wife told her boss she was not going to travel to a remote site when she could more easily perform the task in an online setting (and travel would have had a negative impact on her more important task).

I anticipate a big upswing of fu situations in general about remote situations even amongst peyote without truly having fu money. It may be subtle,  but people aren't going to take being forced back into an office full time or into unnecessary travel or the like without reason like they previously did.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: okonumiyaki on August 08, 2021, 02:56:35 AM
Maybe I don't understand "FU money"... always assumed it was something like "I'm here because I get satisfaction out of [insert task]; I don't need the paycheck and won't blindly comply with superiors' orders if they're not the right thing to do".  How does burning bridges by doing something like eating someone's donuts become an "epic" move?  Even if that employee was mistreated for years, it's impossible for them to not appear petty by doing something like this.  Am I in the minority here?

FU money means you have enough resources that you can do just fine for long enough to get another source of income.  Obviously, if one is also FI, "long enough" = "forever".   It means you can afford to say "No." to things that you find unacceptable.

Was taking that bite out of the donuts petty.   Yes, it was.   But there's a truly important difference between a petty action by someone with power and someone who's been on the bottom and finally, FINALLY gets a chance to say FU in a way that gives them a chance to even the score.   Very few people would respond like that unless their management had been mean, cruel, petty, arbitrary, etc., for what seemed like an interminable period of time to the victim. 

Just quitting doesn't convey the message of "I hate your fucking guts you pathetic excuse for a human being".    Delivering their box of donuts with a bite taken out of each one -- probably an unpaid task they had to do on their way to work -- is a way to do that.   

The odds are 100 to 1 that the manager deserved to receive that message.

I went to a traditional UK boarding school, and I was in the most traditional house in that school.  Fagging had officially been abolished years before (fagging = junior boys being servants to senior boys) but in my house it still existed, but technically as punishment (i.e. caught doing something wrong = make & bring tea to the senior boys, or clean their shoes, make their beds etc)  However, the 'punishments' were scrupulously handed out on an unofficial roster.  Because if any fag felt they were being picked on unfairly, the tea would have urine in it.  So, yeah, I am totally on board with the doughnut bites.

(the house building was so old - 14th century - that it was protected internally and externally, so still had separate dormitories and study rooms for all biys, vs the other houses that had been modernised to be like college dorm rooms, this accounted for the different culture)
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: IsThisAGoodUsername on August 08, 2021, 07:04:21 AM
I went to a traditional UK boarding school, and I was in the most traditional house in that school.  Fagging had officially been abolished years before (fagging = junior boys being servants to senior boys) but in my house it still existed, but technically as punishment (i.e. caught doing something wrong = make & bring tea to the senior boys, or clean their shoes, make their beds etc)  However, the 'punishments' were scrupulously handed out on an unofficial roster.  Because if any fag felt they were being picked on unfairly, the tea would have urine in it.  So, yeah, I am totally on board with the doughnut bites.

This is a good example of the USA and UK being separated by a common language.  :)
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: MyOtherBrotherDarryl on August 08, 2021, 09:31:57 AM
More on-topic. 

Just this past week my wife told her boss she was not going to travel to a remote site when she could more easily perform the task in an online setting (and travel would have had a negative impact on her more important task).

I anticipate a big upswing of fu situations in general about remote situations even amongst peyote without truly having fu money. It may be subtle,  but people aren't going to take being forced back into an office full time or into unnecessary travel or the like without reason like they previously did.

Do not change your typo.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: MyOtherBrotherDarryl on August 08, 2021, 09:46:57 AM
Fantastic thread - been reading it over the past couple of weeks.

I've quit teaching two jobs in my time not because I had FU money but because I had FU skills and, critically for education, FU certification (i.e. certification in a high-demand field).  Nothing epic, I'm afraid, but I'll share anyway.

For Job A, I sent an email to HR and my boss saying I'd be resigning at the end of my contract. I left because the boss was a walking bundle of hypocrisy and I didn't want to deal with it anymore. With FU certification, I knew I'd have little trouble finding another job and I was right.

Job B was similar - I again resigned at the end of my contract - and took a chance on a part-time university job that might lead to bigger and better things. If it failed, I would have little difficulty finding a full-time position in my certification field. Being mustachian, long before I ever discovered the term, helped. I had a nice little cushion if needed.

In the end, the part-time gig did indeed lead to better things: a tenured professorship, better pay, and more control over my time.

I am not, alas, a professor of FU Studies. Nor can one currently get FU certification, not in so many words. But I'm working on it. I would suggest a course reading list starting with the collected works of Thompson, Hunter S. and the cinematic oeuvre of Jackson, Samuel L., with supplemental materials by Malkiel, Burton L. and Bogle, John C.

Index funds, motherfucker.

Edited for clarity.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Taran Wanderer on August 08, 2021, 01:09:10 PM
I would suggest a course reading list starting with the collected works of Thompson, Hunter S. and the cinematic oeuvre of Jackson, Samuel L., with supplemental materials by Malkiel, Burton L. and Bogle, John C.

Index funds, motherfucker.

Love it!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: BicycleB on August 08, 2021, 02:24:59 PM
I would suggest a course reading list starting with the collected works of Thompson, Hunter S. and the cinematic oeuvre of Jackson, Samuel L., with supplemental materials by Malkiel, Burton L. and Bogle, John C.

Index funds, motherfucker.

Love it!

LOL.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Wolfpack Mustachian on August 08, 2021, 04:17:30 PM
More on-topic. 

Just this past week my wife told her boss she was not going to travel to a remote site when she could more easily perform the task in an online setting (and travel would have had a negative impact on her more important task).

I anticipate a big upswing of fu situations in general about remote situations even amongst peyote without truly having fu money. It may be subtle,  but people aren't going to take being forced back into an office full time or into unnecessary travel or the like without reason like they previously did.

Do not change your typo.

How on earth did autocorrect get that out of people?!?
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: omachi on August 08, 2021, 07:53:47 PM
More on-topic. 

Just this past week my wife told her boss she was not going to travel to a remote site when she could more easily perform the task in an online setting (and travel would have had a negative impact on her more important task).

I anticipate a big upswing of fu situations in general about remote situations even amongst peyote without truly having fu money. It may be subtle,  but people aren't going to take being forced back into an office full time or into unnecessary travel or the like without reason like they previously did.

Do not change your typo.

How on earth did autocorrect get that out of people?!?
I just figured it was a frequency based suggestion and you've been out wandering the desert.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Taran Wanderer on August 08, 2021, 07:56:15 PM
I just figured all this wfh has been happening amidst an uptick in the use of peyote…  kinda made sense then.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: shelivesthedream on August 09, 2021, 05:05:25 AM
Some workplaces you have a chance of changing something, some you just don't. I've been in a situation where I was very unfairly treated but knew my complaint would be dismissed. I just silently didn't apply to work there again next season, because I knew all the other worker bees had heard the manager yelling at me and I wanted to retain the moral high ground in their eyes (because they might hook me up with future work). But dang, maybe I should just post her a box of half eaten doughnuts now...
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: BussoV6 on August 09, 2021, 08:06:22 AM
I went to a traditional UK boarding school, and I was in the most traditional house in that school.  Fagging had officially been abolished years before (fagging = junior boys being servants to senior boys) but in my house it still existed, but technically as punishment (i.e. caught doing something wrong = make & bring tea to the senior boys, or clean their shoes, make their beds etc)  However, the 'punishments' were scrupulously handed out on an unofficial roster.  Because if any fag felt they were being picked on unfairly, the tea would have urine in it.  So, yeah, I am totally on board with the doughnut bites.

This is a good example of the USA and UK being separated by a common language.  :)

Yes, "nipping out for a fag" doesn't have the same meaning in the US vs UK...
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: MyOtherBrotherDarryl on August 09, 2021, 10:08:02 AM
I just figured all this wfh has been happening amidst an uptick in the use of peyote…  kinda made sense then.

Hence the popularity of shirts with... buttons.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: JLee on August 09, 2021, 12:27:41 PM
I'm with @johndoe. This is the act of a petty bridge burner, not someone refusing an immoral order because they don't need the money.

It's a thread about "fuck you money" stories, not "I politely declined to do something because I am fiscally prepared" stories. :P
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Malossi792 on August 10, 2021, 03:40:31 AM
I'm with @johndoe. This is the act of a petty bridge burner, not someone refusing an immoral order because they don't need the money.

It's a thread about "fuck you money" stories, not "I politely declined to do something because I am fiscally prepared" stories. :P
Yeah, we have a separate thread for polite stories:
https://forum.mrmoneymustache.com/welcome-to-the-forum/satisfying-'no-thank-you'-money-stories/
This one is for the popcorn-worty, often bridge-burning FU-p*rn AFAIK ;)
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: BlueHouse on August 15, 2021, 03:00:28 PM
Maybe I don't understand "FU money"... always assumed it was something like "I'm here because I get satisfaction out of [insert task]; I don't need the paycheck and won't blindly comply with superiors' orders if they're not the right thing to do".  How does burning bridges by doing something like eating someone's donuts become an "epic" move?  Even if that employee was mistreated for years, it's impossible for them to not appear petty by doing something like this.  Am I in the minority here?

In regards to the burning bridges part in general, I view stories on here like watching a movie. I would likely never do it myself, but I envision myself having the guts/wit to do something similar at a particularly rough job I had. I don't think I would ever have it in me to burn a bridge in some of these more extreme ways, but I have been in some tough situations and can see the appeal.

In terms of this particular one, I guess it depends on the situation. If she was specifically tasked with bringing breakfast for her boss I can understand it. In all my work situations, something like that would have been more communal, so I definitely wouldn't have done it if it could have felt directed at more than just my boss specifically. All in all, my response was dang, she got the message across that she was pissed.

I personally prefer ones where the response is directly related to the problem - a boss habitually overloads an employee, the employee finally says enough is enough and refuses, they are told there is no option, and then the employee quits, leaving the aggressive boss to hold the bag for everything. I guess it does seem a little less petty to me when they are directly tied to the problem and are a logical consequence of the action.

As someone who has FIRED earlier this year, I can definitively say that thinking of all the different ways I could make an epic FU story got me through the last few years of a mentally draining job.  But when it came time to do the deed, the old adage "Living well is the best revenge" really came true for me.  I didn't feel as if I owed anyone a real explanation and a quiet exit felt like the best revenge that I could muster. 

I had had a work nemesis for years and almost all of my revenge fantasies involved him, but I hadn't had much interaction with him through Covid, so just leaving before his retirement (4 months later) was very satisfactory to me.  It still feels great! 
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: fuzzy math on August 15, 2021, 03:32:48 PM
At an old job in Portland I had a coworker I hated so much (went out of his way to question everything I said - work related or personal), that I dreamed of leaving a VooDoo Donut chocolate cock n balls donut on his desk. I had a severance package for my position being eliminated, so I couldn't risk it for the donut but the thought got me through many days there... Glad to see someone else has thought of being petty with donuts!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: pdxvandal on August 15, 2021, 06:46:42 PM
@fuzzy math ... that is an epic thought at least. I miss the Cock n Balls donut, at least for its novelty. I'm in the PDX area as well and hoping to get out of the rat race next summer. Enjoy your FIRE!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: BlueHouse on August 15, 2021, 07:16:01 PM
At an old job in Portland I had a coworker I hated so much (went out of his way to question everything I said - work related or personal), that I dreamed of leaving a VooDoo Donut chocolate cock n balls donut on his desk. I had a severance package for my position being eliminated, so I couldn't risk it for the donut but the thought got me through many days there... Glad to see someone else has thought of being petty with donuts!

This made me think of a few things that my brother and a friend of his did as pranks.  They always called them pranks, but to me they seemed really mean-spirited and only to be used against someone who "deserved it". 
My brother took a cafeteria egg salad sandwich and duct taped it under the conference table of his boss.  Not too terrible, as I'm sure someone found it rather quickly.
His friend took remnants of a shellfish dinner and unscrewed an overhead vent cover, put the garbage inside, and replaced the vent cover.  I cannot imagine that anyone found that for quite a while.  He claimed it was just because he thought it was funny as a parting reminder, but I've always thought that was really mean.  I'd take half-eaten donuts any day.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Alfred J Quack on August 16, 2021, 06:51:45 AM
I don't think this is really Epic but I wouldn't have done it without FU money...

I've been working for this employer for over a decade. Since then the building has been remodelled and the climate control performance has dropped to unacceptable levels. However, my boss (current and former) have told me that shorts are not acceptable. Asked 10 years ago via the workers comp (which I think is the correct equivalent, co-workers who talk/negotiate with CEO level because of local law requirements). Back then the answer was that there was no dresscode but to adhere to the long pants to show solidarity to the workers who did have a dress code.

Years later, the temps at the office keep going up to a standard 25C during 20C outdoor temps, and higher as the outdoors temp rises. Climate control is abysmal and even with all windows open there's basically no fresh air unless there's a huricane blowing in the right direction.
I said to myself, screw it, I'm going in shorts because it's Covid time and I have 0 interaction with customers. Also, there are like 5 coworkers in a 100+ desk building.
2 weeks later, my boss pulls me aside and says that he has no qualms with my prefrences but that he had been mandated by the CEO that no shorts were allowed. Meanwhile our co-workers of the female persuasion could wear dresses/skirts and workers (like masons, plumbers) who visit customers could go in company logo provided shorts if temps outside are above 25C.

Well, thats kind of unfair, right? So I contacted my workers comp representative and laid out my case: If I work in the office and wear a decent pair of shorts I am presentable to the customers but not allowed to by the CEO's. The workers have a requirement that 25C outdoors temp is a minimum for shorts, why not for office workers too?
If my female coworker wears the same shorts it's not a problem. The female coworkers can even wear a dress, skirt or something like it. Why can't I? Do I need to wear a skirt to the office then? Because I will (and truly, I would)!

Talks between the workers comp and CEO's have concluded, result: There is no mandate on dresscode for office personel, nor will there be other than being presentable. If I want to wear shorts I'm allowed to do so, within reason and as long as it is respectable. The respectable part may be up for discussion, same as mini-skirts with flip-flops are.

So, this is a Win, right?
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: youngwildandfree on August 16, 2021, 07:10:47 AM
I don't think this is really Epic but I wouldn't have done it without FU money...

I've been working for this employer for over a decade. Since then the building has been remodelled and the climate control performance has dropped to unacceptable levels. However, my boss (current and former) have told me that shorts are not acceptable. Asked 10 years ago via the workers comp (which I think is the correct equivalent, co-workers who talk/negotiate with CEO level because of local law requirements). Back then the answer was that there was no dresscode but to adhere to the long pants to show solidarity to the workers who did have a dress code.

Years later, the temps at the office keep going up to a standard 25C during 20C outdoor temps, and higher as the outdoors temp rises. Climate control is abysmal and even with all windows open there's basically no fresh air unless there's a huricane blowing in the right direction.
I said to myself, screw it, I'm going in shorts because it's Covid time and I have 0 interaction with customers. Also, there are like 5 coworkers in a 100+ desk building.
2 weeks later, my boss pulls me aside and says that he has no qualms with my prefrences but that he had been mandated by the CEO that no shorts were allowed. Meanwhile our co-workers of the female persuasion could wear dresses/skirts and workers (like masons, plumbers) who visit customers could go in company logo provided shorts if temps outside are above 25C.

Well, thats kind of unfair, right? So I contacted my workers comp representative and laid out my case: If I work in the office and wear a decent pair of shorts I am presentable to the customers but not allowed to by the CEO's. The workers have a requirement that 25C outdoors temp is a minimum for shorts, why not for office workers too?
If my female coworker wears the same shorts it's not a problem. The female coworkers can even wear a dress, skirt or something like it. Why can't I? Do I need to wear a skirt to the office then? Because I will (and truly, I would)!

Talks between the workers comp and CEO's have concluded, result: There is no mandate on dresscode for office personel, nor will there be other than being presentable. If I want to wear shorts I'm allowed to do so, within reason and as long as it is respectable. The respectable part may be up for discussion, same as mini-skirts with flip-flops are.

So, this is a Win, right?

I think it's a win! I have similar issues right now with climate control. It gets unbearably hot in the office/labs. Because it's a scientific lab environment I do wear long pants when I'm running experiments, but if I don't expect to be in the lab (paperwork/grant writing day) I wear shorts or skirts. There are no written rules about it, but it was a big mental hurdle for me to even broach the subject. Freedom and cooler outfits feel fantastic.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Sugaree on August 16, 2021, 08:05:59 AM
I don't think this is really Epic but I wouldn't have done it without FU money...

I've been working for this employer for over a decade. Since then the building has been remodelled and the climate control performance has dropped to unacceptable levels. However, my boss (current and former) have told me that shorts are not acceptable. Asked 10 years ago via the workers comp (which I think is the correct equivalent, co-workers who talk/negotiate with CEO level because of local law requirements). Back then the answer was that there was no dresscode but to adhere to the long pants to show solidarity to the workers who did have a dress code.

Years later, the temps at the office keep going up to a standard 25C during 20C outdoor temps, and higher as the outdoors temp rises. Climate control is abysmal and even with all windows open there's basically no fresh air unless there's a huricane blowing in the right direction.
I said to myself, screw it, I'm going in shorts because it's Covid time and I have 0 interaction with customers. Also, there are like 5 coworkers in a 100+ desk building.
2 weeks later, my boss pulls me aside and says that he has no qualms with my prefrences but that he had been mandated by the CEO that no shorts were allowed. Meanwhile our co-workers of the female persuasion could wear dresses/skirts and workers (like masons, plumbers) who visit customers could go in company logo provided shorts if temps outside are above 25C.

Well, thats kind of unfair, right? So I contacted my workers comp representative and laid out my case: If I work in the office and wear a decent pair of shorts I am presentable to the customers but not allowed to by the CEO's. The workers have a requirement that 25C outdoors temp is a minimum for shorts, why not for office workers too?
If my female coworker wears the same shorts it's not a problem. The female coworkers can even wear a dress, skirt or something like it. Why can't I? Do I need to wear a skirt to the office then? Because I will (and truly, I would)!

Talks between the workers comp and CEO's have concluded, result: There is no mandate on dresscode for office personel, nor will there be other than being presentable. If I want to wear shorts I'm allowed to do so, within reason and as long as it is respectable. The respectable part may be up for discussion, same as mini-skirts with flip-flops are.

So, this is a Win, right?

I think it's a win! I have similar issues right now with climate control. It gets unbearably hot in the office/labs. Because it's a scientific lab environment I do wear long pants when I'm running experiments, but if I don't expect to be in the lab (paperwork/grant writing day) I wear shorts or skirts. There are no written rules about it, but it was a big mental hurdle for me to even broach the subject. Freedom and cooler outfits feel fantastic.

The summer that I was pregnant, my office instituted an "energy saving policy" in which the thermostats in each individual office were locked into a pre-set temperature of 78 degrees.  We ended up having a bunch of localized heat waves in our office.  About every hour and a half someone would go wave a cigarette lighter around underneath the thermostat until it kicked the air on for awhile. 
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: fuzzy math on August 16, 2021, 08:45:28 AM
@fuzzy math ... that is an epic thought at least. I miss the Cock n Balls donut, at least for its novelty. I'm in the PDX area as well and hoping to get out of the rat race next summer. Enjoy your FIRE!

Unfortunately due to my position being eliminated there, and the niche field I'm in I had to leave OR to find another job. Not FIREd yet, but 75% of the way there and I may peace out from my current job within the next 6 - 18 months if things stay as they are. Did they get rid of the donut? My fave one there was actually the peach fritter with cream cheese frosting. Alas, I have a gluten allergy and can't eat them anymore :(
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: zolotiyeruki on August 16, 2021, 09:30:16 AM
The summer that I was pregnant, my office instituted an "energy saving policy" in which the thermostats in each individual office were locked into a pre-set temperature of 78 degrees.  We ended up having a bunch of localized heat waves in our office.  About every hour and a half someone would go wave a cigarette lighter around underneath the thermostat until it kicked the air on for awhile.
When I lived in Houston, I tried keeping the thermostat set at 78.  I really did.  But I just couldn't take it, and neither could my family.

Of course, it didn't help that at the office, their (corporate) idea of an acceptable temperatures was 62 degrees.  Seriously.  Our admin kept a space heater under her desk during the summer.

If you have the problem of a too-low (and non-adjustable) temperature, there's a cool little fix: drape a damp paper towel over the thermostat.  Evaporative cooling will make the thermostat think that the room is colder than it actually is.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: youngwildandfree on August 16, 2021, 11:28:50 AM
My boss likes it at 77. We have a current compromise of 74 + the shorts/skirts on non-lab days.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Dicey on August 16, 2021, 12:56:43 PM
...someone would go wave a cigarette lighter around underneath the thermostat until it kicked the air on for awhile.

If you have the problem of a too-low (and non-adjustable) temperature, there's a cool little fix: drape a damp paper towel over the thermostat.  Evaporative cooling will make the thermostat think that the room is colder than it actually is.
Wow! These are things I wish I'd known sooner.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Dave1442397 on August 16, 2021, 03:42:56 PM
The summer that I was pregnant, my office instituted an "energy saving policy" in which the thermostats in each individual office were locked into a pre-set temperature of 78 degrees.  We ended up having a bunch of localized heat waves in our office.  About every hour and a half someone would go wave a cigarette lighter around underneath the thermostat until it kicked the air on for awhile.
When I lived in Houston, I tried keeping the thermostat set at 78.  I really did.  But I just couldn't take it, and neither could my family.

Of course, it didn't help that at the office, their (corporate) idea of an acceptable temperatures was 62 degrees.  Seriously.  Our admin kept a space heater under her desk during the summer.

If you have the problem of a too-low (and non-adjustable) temperature, there's a cool little fix: drape a damp paper towel over the thermostat.  Evaporative cooling will make the thermostat think that the room is colder than it actually is.

Ha, I was the one with the space heater under my desk in the summer months. I started at 6am, but by 7:30am the air had kicked in and by 9am my fingers would be stiff with cold. That heater ran from 8am to 2pm every day.

I used to be able to adjust the thermostat, but I guess building management got tired of people playing with thermostats, and put lockable plastic box covers over them. A handy straightened paper clip could find its way through the vents in the cover and adjust the temperature, but after enduring that for a while, they removed the thermostats completely.

I love working from home. I have my thermostat set to 76F in the summer months, and it's perfect.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: bizziel on August 17, 2021, 02:37:30 PM
In 2016 my dad was diagnosed with cancer. I lived a 5 hr drive away. The next day i went to the office and said i wouldn't be back (i should have given 3 months notice as that's what my contract specified, which is not unusual in the uk), listed my house with a sales agent and drove home to be with my parents. 3 months later my dad died.

Not an epic FU story as my work were wonderful and completely understanding, but the time i got to spend with him because i didn't have to work was utterly priceless. I also stayed living with my mum for another couple of months to help with probate and support her emotionally as we grieved. This is what FU money gives you, freedom when you need it. 
 

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Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: AMandM on August 17, 2021, 03:28:21 PM
Maybe not FU, but definitely epic. Congratulations on acting on your priorities, and my sympathy for the loss of your father.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Dicey on August 17, 2021, 04:48:07 PM
In 2016 my dad was diagnosed with cancer. I lived a 5 hr drive away. The next day i went to the office and said i wouldn't be back (i should have given 3 months notice as that's what my contract specified, which is not unusual in the uk), listed my house with a sales agent and drove home to be with my parents. 3 months later my dad died.

Not an epic FU story as my work were wonderful and completely understanding, but the time i got to spend with him because i didn't have to work was utterly priceless. I also stayed living with my mum for another couple of months to help with probate and support her emotionally as we grieved. This is what FU money gives you, freedom when you need it. 
Sorry about your dad. Glad you understood how important that time was. That's a rare gift.

Welcome to the MMM Forum!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: bizziel on August 18, 2021, 12:39:19 AM
Thank you both

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Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: CowboyAndIndian on August 18, 2021, 06:49:46 AM
In 2016 my dad was diagnosed with cancer. I lived a 5 hr drive away. The next day i went to the office and said i wouldn't be back (i should have given 3 months notice as that's what my contract specified, which is not unusual in the uk), listed my house with a sales agent and drove home to be with my parents. 3 months later my dad died.

Not an epic FU story as my work were wonderful and completely understanding, but the time i got to spend with him because i didn't have to work was utterly priceless. I also stayed living with my mum for another couple of months to help with probate and support her emotionally as we grieved. This is what FU money gives you, freedom when you need it. 

Wow, what an epic first post!

Sorry about your dad. I'm glad you got to spend time with him and was able to support your mother in this time.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: dcheesi on August 18, 2021, 07:05:49 AM
In 2016 my dad was diagnosed with cancer. I lived a 5 hr drive away. The next day i went to the office and said i wouldn't be back (i should have given 3 months notice as that's what my contract specified, which is not unusual in the uk), listed my house with a sales agent and drove home to be with my parents. 3 months later my dad died.

Not an epic FU story as my work were wonderful and completely understanding, but the time i got to spend with him because i didn't have to work was utterly priceless. I also stayed living with my mum for another couple of months to help with probate and support her emotionally as we grieved. This is what FU money gives you, freedom when you need it. 
 

Sent from my SM-G950F using Tapatalk
Sorry about your dad. I'm glad you had the strength (and FU money) to make that decision.

As it happens, I was spared that choice by the coincidence of COVID (universal WFH meant I could stay with my dad without giving up my job). I'm so glad I was able to be there for him and with him. But I'm not sure if I would have had the strength or clarity to do it if I'd had to leave my job first.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: bizziel on August 18, 2021, 10:32:45 AM
In 2016 my dad was diagnosed with cancer. I lived a 5 hr drive away. The next day i went to the office and said i wouldn't be back (i should have given 3 months notice as that's what my contract specified, which is not unusual in the uk), listed my house with a sales agent and drove home to be with my parents. 3 months later my dad died.

Not an epic FU story as my work were wonderful and completely understanding, but the time i got to spend with him because i didn't have to work was utterly priceless. I also stayed living with my mum for another couple of months to help with probate and support her emotionally as we grieved. This is what FU money gives you, freedom when you need it. 
 

Sent from my SM-G950F using Tapatalk
Sorry about your dad. I'm glad you had the strength (and FU money) to make that decision.

As it happens, I was spared that choice by the coincidence of COVID (universal WFH meant I could stay with my dad without giving up my job). I'm so glad I was able to be there for him and with him. But I'm not sure if I would have had the strength or clarity to do it if I'd had to leave my job first.
I'm sorry about your Dad.

Yes, wfh would have made it much easier for me. I hope that employers will now be more flexible with this to allow people to fit there jobs around their lives more easily.

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Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: frugal rph on August 24, 2021, 09:54:39 AM
I have been unhappy at my job for years but not miserable and it had always provided a decent work life balance so I stuck around.  Once we started administering the Pfizer vaccines at the same time they cut our support staff's hours, things became miserable.  I was having to work 2 to 4 hours extra (unpaid) every day to keep up.  Several other pharmacists in my area quit, so my partner and I were having to cover eachother's vacation time or we would not be allowed to go.  So here I am working 14ish hours a day and picking up extra shifts that I have no desire to work.  I had to get on medication for anxiety and depression.

About 3 weeks ago, I got a breakthrough case of Covid.  Per company policy and CDC guidelines I am unable to work for 10 days (my job cannot be done remotely).  During this time, my boss texts me daily with complaints about how poorly the store is being run, prescriptions are not ready on time, the pharmacist covering for me opened the store late, etc.  I am actually locked out of the system since I'm on sick leave and cannot do anything about any of this.  My boss is the one in charge of the people covering my leave.  Not one single inquiry about my health or if my family was ok.  Luckily I had a mild case and did not spread it to anyone. Also my anxiety and depression almost completely disappeared while I was on sick leave.

My husband and I had a long talk.  He had been trying to get my to leave my job for months but I was scared to leave a high paying job and had rationalized all the bad parts as being worth it.  But this forced leave was the wake up call I needed.  I told my boss that in 1 month I'm stepping down to part-time and I'll only be available on a set schedule that I will dictate.  We are so short handed right now that I know I'll be able to get all the hours I want.  Plus I'm good at what I do and other pharmacists will want me to cover their stores.  He was not happy and went on and on about what a tight spot I'm leaving him in. 

Before I got Covid I would have been upset and worried about leaving the store in a lurch and my boss possibly disliking me.  Now I just don't care.  I'm going to work part-time at this job and decide if I financially need to get another job or if I can just stick with this one.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Nutty on August 24, 2021, 10:18:43 AM
Before I got Covid I would have been upset and worried about leaving the store in a lurch and my boss possibly disliking me.  Now I just don't care.  I'm going to work part-time at this job and decide if I financially need to get another job or if I can just stick with this one.
I'm sorry that your boss showed you what his priorities were.  Good for you for drawing a line and going through with a life changing improving decision.  The bosses need to understand that it is a mutual agreement.

P2 picked up a part time retail job and really liked it and the people.  P2 was good at the job and everyone noticed.  The boss sent out a decree that everyone was required at the holiday sale and no exceptions.  P2 made an exception and cleaned out their locker due to prior commitments.  Driving people away to make yourself look good can backfire.

Glad you are feeling better and in a good place.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: zolotiyeruki on August 24, 2021, 11:18:02 AM
This sounds like a classic "I need A job, but not THIS job" kind of story.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: jinga nation on August 24, 2021, 01:11:16 PM
My boss is the one in charge of the people covering my leave.  Not one single inquiry about my health or if my family was ok.  Luckily I had a mild case and did not spread it to anyone. Also my anxiety and depression almost completely disappeared while I was on sick leave.

You boss wasn't doing their job of getting you coverage. Your boss doesn't care about you. Your boss doesn't realize that the nicest thing you did was to cut your hours. Your boss doesn't realize that he'd have been screwed worse if one of his best performers had quit with a short notice. Your boss can go stuff it where the sun don't shine.

I used to work as a pharmacy tech around the last millennium. Pharmacy district managers were assholes then, and seem to be just about the same based on your outcome.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: frugal rph on August 26, 2021, 08:42:32 AM
Update to my story on the previous page about getting breakthrough Covid and realizing my job is toxic.  I gave my boss a set schedule that I would work, but he is not respecting it.  He basically told me that I could work the hours he needs me or none at all.  I'm not sure why he thought this would work since the entire state where I am is really short on staff and we both know it's better to have me working part time than none at all.

So I called my old manager from another district and I'm going to transfer there in 2 weeks.  He is glad to have me in any capacity since he knows I'll do a good job.  I'm starting out 2 days a week on days of my choice and we'll see how my mental health is.  Nice old manager is going to handle it all with current jerk manager so I don't have to deal with him.  Although part of me wants to hear his reaction :).

Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: okits on August 26, 2021, 08:45:19 AM
Update to my story on the previous page about getting breakthrough Covid and realizing my job is toxic.  I gave my boss a set schedule that I would work, but he is not respecting it.  He basically told me that I could work the hours he needs me or none at all.  I'm not sure why he thought this would work since the entire state where I am is really short on staff and we both know it's better to have me working part time than none at all.

So I called my old manager from another district and I'm going to transfer there in 2 weeks.  He is glad to have me in any capacity since he knows I'll do a good job.  I'm starting out 2 days a week on days of my choice and we'll see how my mental health is.  Nice old manager is going to handle it all with current jerk manager so I don't have to deal with him.  Although part of me wants to hear his reaction :).

Congratulations, that is an excellent outcome. 
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Nutty on August 26, 2021, 10:15:04 AM
It's always amusing when someone's bluff gets called.  Good job and good for you.  Will the commute change?
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: mm1970 on August 26, 2021, 10:33:04 AM
Update to my story on the previous page about getting breakthrough Covid and realizing my job is toxic.  I gave my boss a set schedule that I would work, but he is not respecting it.  He basically told me that I could work the hours he needs me or none at all.  I'm not sure why he thought this would work since the entire state where I am is really short on staff and we both know it's better to have me working part time than none at all.

So I called my old manager from another district and I'm going to transfer there in 2 weeks.  He is glad to have me in any capacity since he knows I'll do a good job.  I'm starting out 2 days a week on days of my choice and we'll see how my mental health is.  Nice old manager is going to handle it all with current jerk manager so I don't have to deal with him.  Although part of me wants to hear his reaction :).
Please come back and tell us the reaction if you learn of it.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: DaMa on August 26, 2021, 01:11:34 PM
When I was 21, I had a job at a dry cleaners.  I worked afternoons, and my SIL would watch my kids for a few hours until DH got home.  The job had one weekday off, closed on Sundays, and every other Saturday off.  Right after I started I asked if I could have Tuesday off every week, but was told no -- had to rotate the weekday.  Not like I was asking for Monday, but fine.  First Saturday off comes around, and can't have it.  We were short staffed.  This continues for a few months.  Then we finally have 6 people and are fully staffed.  So the schedule goes up, and I'm off the next Saturday.  I book a camping trip with my family.  On Thursday, the boss changes the schedule and puts me on Saturday.  I say, I can't work.  I made plans.  She says someone quit so we are short again, so you have to work.  I was so mad.  When I went to lunch, I decided I was done and since they didn't think notice was needed, I wouldn't give them any.  I just didn't go back.  When I went in to pick up my final paycheck two weeks later, she said, "You should have stayed.  You could have the day shift now." (Two more people quit after me.)  WTF!  I didn't have childcare for a day shift.  How clueless can you be?

It's not an epic FU money story.  I went to work, because DH needed 3 crowns and our insurance only paid 50%.  I worked long enough to pay for that, and get us into a new car.

That experience was a huge part of my decision to go back to college.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: ysette9 on August 26, 2021, 07:47:04 PM
When I was 21, I had a job at a dry cleaners.  I worked afternoons, and my SIL would watch my kids for a few hours until DH got home.  The job had one weekday off, closed on Sundays, and every other Saturday off.  Right after I started I asked if I could have Tuesday off every week, but was told no -- had to rotate the weekday.  Not like I was asking for Monday, but fine.  First Saturday off comes around, and can't have it.  We were short staffed.  This continues for a few months.  Then we finally have 6 people and are fully staffed.  So the schedule goes up, and I'm off the next Saturday.  I book a camping trip with my family.  On Thursday, the boss changes the schedule and puts me on Saturday.  I say, I can't work.  I made plans.  She says someone quit so we are short again, so you have to work.  I was so mad.  When I went to lunch, I decided I was done and since they didn't think notice was needed, I wouldn't give them any.  I just didn't go back.  When I went in to pick up my final paycheck two weeks later, she said, "You should have stayed.  You could have the day shift now." (Two more people quit after me.)  WTF!  I didn't have childcare for a day shift.  How clueless can you be?

It's not an epic FU money story.  I went to work, because DH needed 3 crowns and our insurance only paid 50%.  I worked long enough to pay for that, and get us into a new car.

That experience was a huge part of my decision to go back to college.
Good for you
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: blurkraken22 on August 31, 2021, 07:12:28 PM
Thanks everybody. This blog/forum has changed my savings rate from 6% to 65% in the last three years. That job would have consumed me you all didn't preach this alternative.

This is why I keep reading this thread! 65% is an amazing savings rate and go ahead and pay yourself first, you worked hard for it.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: blurkraken22 on August 31, 2021, 07:23:47 PM
Not directly at least. Of course taxes existed (albeit not in the form we think of today) and were one expense you could not not do.
But it generally was about "richer getting rich on our debts, and we get into slavery as result". That's why debt forgiveness was invented - the literal blank slate (as those old guys wrote on clay tablets) to free people out of debt slavery before you run out of people who aren't slaves. It was a constant topic for thousands of years, as you can see in the "jubilee year" of the bible.
It's quite humbling to know that one of the biggest and oldest problems humanity has is one born out of our society (or our personal souls - greed) itself. Basically only starving is more dangerous...

A reference to Debt: The First 5,000 Years? That book has percolated in my brain at a pretty deep level. I started rereadig it this year and I'm still impressed with lens change. I keep thinking of the contrast between anonymous debt that can be bought and sold by corporations versus some of the examples of native cultures where to fail to help another human in need was considered to fail as a human yourself. I have a list of books for MMM bookclub if anyone wants to join. :)

There are a small number of books that really changed how I think about humans, culture, and how we think. Debt and Thinking: Fast and Slow come to mind.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: SwordGuy on August 31, 2021, 08:20:04 PM

There are a small number of books that really changed how I think about humans, culture, and how we think. Debt and Thinking: Fast and Slow come to mind.

E.F. Schumacher.  Small is Beautiful: Economics as if People Mattered
E.F. Schumacher.  A Guide for the Perplexed
Saul Alinsky. Rules for Radicals
John Rawls.  A Theory of Justice
Howard Zinn.  A People's History of the United States


Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: LennStar on September 02, 2021, 07:19:33 AM
Not directly at least. Of course taxes existed (albeit not in the form we think of today) and were one expense you could not not do.
But it generally was about "richer getting rich on our debts, and we get into slavery as result". That's why debt forgiveness was invented - the literal blank slate (as those old guys wrote on clay tablets) to free people out of debt slavery before you run out of people who aren't slaves. It was a constant topic for thousands of years, as you can see in the "jubilee year" of the bible.
It's quite humbling to know that one of the biggest and oldest problems humanity has is one born out of our society (or our personal souls - greed) itself. Basically only starving is more dangerous...

A reference to Debt: The First 5,000 Years? That book has percolated in my brain at a pretty deep level.
Yes and yes.
I love ethnology, so having all that background and history in one place was immensely interesting. I also recommend it for every fantasy writer. There is a lot of "weird" things and how they came to be the way they are.

btw. if you haven't read the book in my signature. For me it was "finally everything that I knew but could not put in words made into a theoretical framework".
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: blurkraken22 on September 02, 2021, 09:08:50 PM
Not directly at least. Of course taxes existed (albeit not in the form we think of today) and were one expense you could not not do.
But it generally was about "richer getting rich on our debts, and we get into slavery as result". That's why debt forgiveness was invented - the literal blank slate (as those old guys wrote on clay tablets) to free people out of debt slavery before you run out of people who aren't slaves. It was a constant topic for thousands of years, as you can see in the "jubilee year" of the bible.
It's quite humbling to know that one of the biggest and oldest problems humanity has is one born out of our society (or our personal souls - greed) itself. Basically only starving is more dangerous...

A reference to Debt: The First 5,000 Years? That book has percolated in my brain at a pretty deep level.
Yes and yes.
I love ethnology, so having all that background and history in one place was immensely interesting. I also recommend it for every fantasy writer. There is a lot of "weird" things and how they came to be the way they are.

btw. if you haven't read the book in my signature. For me it was "finally everything that I knew but could not put in words made into a theoretical framework".

Maybe I'm doing something wrong... but I don't see a signature. :o
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Dicey on September 02, 2021, 09:51:15 PM
Not directly at least. Of course taxes existed (albeit not in the form we think of today) and were one expense you could not not do.
But it generally was about "richer getting rich on our debts, and we get into slavery as result". That's why debt forgiveness was invented - the literal blank slate (as those old guys wrote on clay tablets) to free people out of debt slavery before you run out of people who aren't slaves. It was a constant topic for thousands of years, as you can see in the "jubilee year" of the bible.
It's quite humbling to know that one of the biggest and oldest problems humanity has is one born out of our society (or our personal souls - greed) itself. Basically only starving is more dangerous...

A reference to Debt: The First 5,000 Years? That book has percolated in my brain at a pretty deep level.
Yes and yes.
I love ethnology, so having all that background and history in one place was immensely interesting. I also recommend it for every fantasy writer. There is a lot of "weird" things and how they came to be the way they are.

btw. if you haven't read the book in my signature. For me it was "finally everything that I knew but could not put in words made into a theoretical framework".

Maybe I'm doing something wrong... but I don't see a signature. :o
@blurkraken22 - You won't until you get to 100 posts. It's a recent hurdle to cut down on spammers and other nefarious types.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: blurkraken22 on September 03, 2021, 05:35:25 AM
Maybe I'm doing something wrong... but I don't see a signature. :o
@blurkraken22 - You won't until you get to 100 posts. It's a recent hurdle to cut down on spammers and other nefarious types.
So the solution is to quickly spam out another 50 posts to prove I'm not a spammer, right? ;D
@LennStar What's the book in your sig?
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Dogastrophe on September 03, 2021, 06:49:19 AM
Maybe I'm doing something wrong... but I don't see a signature. :o
@blurkraken22 - You won't until you get to 100 posts. It's a recent hurdle to cut down on spammers and other nefarious types.
So the solution is to quickly spam out another 50 posts to prove I'm not a spammer, right? ;D
@LennStar What's the book in your sig?

The Dictator's Handbook: Why Bad Behavior is Almost Always Good Politics
Bruce Bueno de Mesquita and Alastair Smith

Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Dicey on September 03, 2021, 07:21:08 AM
Maybe I'm doing something wrong... but I don't see a signature. :o
@blurkraken22 - You won't until you get to 100 posts. It's a recent hurdle to cut down on spammers and other nefarious types.
So the solution is to quickly spam out another 50 posts to prove I'm not a spammer, right? ;D
@LennStar What's the book in your sig?
I don't make the rules,  but as a long time forumite, I sure as hell appreciate the effect of them. The mods do a bang-up job.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Lyngi on September 04, 2021, 10:03:38 PM
I have been unhappy at my job for years but not miserable and it had always provided a decent work life balance so I stuck around.  Once we started administering the Pfizer vaccines at the same time they cut our support staff's hours, things became miserable.  I was having to work 2 to 4 hours extra (unpaid) every day to keep up.  Several other pharmacists in my area quit, so my partner and I were having to cover eachother's vacation time or we would not be allowed to go.  So here I am working 14ish hours a day and picking up extra shifts that I have no desire to work.  I had to get on medication for anxiety and depression.
WAIT, are you my twin??  All of this.  I had the same conversation with my husband earlier this year.   I haven't had the courage to talk to my boss yet..  I'm considering stepping down after the first of the year and go part time.  I am proud of you having the guts to take control of your life.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Lyngi on September 04, 2021, 10:08:50 PM
Update to my story on the previous page about getting breakthrough Covid and realizing my job is toxic.  I gave my boss a set schedule that I would work, but he is not respecting it.  He basically told me that I could work the hours he needs me or none at all.  I'm not sure why he thought this would work since the entire state where I am is really short on staff and we both know it's better to have me working part time than none at all.

So I called my old manager from another district and I'm going to transfer there in 2 weeks.  He is glad to have me in any capacity since he knows I'll do a good job.  I'm starting out 2 days a week on days of my choice and we'll see how my mental health is.  Nice old manager is going to handle it all with current jerk manager so I don't have to deal with him.  Although part of me wants to hear his reaction :).
  Oh my gosh!!!!   Your boss sounds like my boss.  Exactly why I'm afraid to say anything.   I'm not quite ready to quit, I kinda need the  health insurance.   Please keep us updated.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: blurkraken22 on September 06, 2021, 08:09:01 AM
Maybe I'm doing something wrong... but I don't see a signature. :o
@blurkraken22 - You won't until you get to 100 posts. It's a recent hurdle to cut down on spammers and other nefarious types.
So the solution is to quickly spam out another 50 posts to prove I'm not a spammer, right? ;D
@LennStar What's the book in your sig?
I don't make the rules,  but as a long time forumite, I sure as hell appreciate the effect of them. The mods do a bang-up job.
My joke was likely in poor taste. I've dealt with spammers on another forum previously and it's a huge time suck. No disrespect intended to the mods. My apologies.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: CowboyAndIndian on September 06, 2021, 09:14:42 AM
Update to my story on the previous page about getting breakthrough Covid and realizing my job is toxic.  I gave my boss a set schedule that I would work, but he is not respecting it.  He basically told me that I could work the hours he needs me or none at all.  I'm not sure why he thought this would work since the entire state where I am is really short on staff and we both know it's better to have me working part time than none at all.

So I called my old manager from another district and I'm going to transfer there in 2 weeks.  He is glad to have me in any capacity since he knows I'll do a good job.  I'm starting out 2 days a week on days of my choice and we'll see how my mental health is.  Nice old manager is going to handle it all with current jerk manager so I don't have to deal with him.  Although part of me wants to hear his reaction :).
Awesome.

The power of FU money!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: omachi on September 06, 2021, 03:26:39 PM
Maybe I'm doing something wrong... but I don't see a signature. :o
@blurkraken22 - You won't until you get to 100 posts. It's a recent hurdle to cut down on spammers and other nefarious types.
So the solution is to quickly spam out another 50 posts to prove I'm not a spammer, right? ;D
@LennStar What's the book in your sig?
I don't make the rules,  but as a long time forumite, I sure as hell appreciate the effect of them. The mods do a bang-up job.
My joke was likely in poor taste. I've dealt with spammers on another forum previously and it's a huge time suck. No disrespect intended to the mods. My apologies.
Nah, your comment was amusing. I chuckled. Spammers suck and all, but the notion of spamming to get around anti-spam hurdles is funny as long as you don't actually go on a spamming spree.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: BicycleB on September 06, 2021, 03:32:05 PM
Maybe I'm doing something wrong... but I don't see a signature. :o
@blurkraken22 - You won't until you get to 100 posts. It's a recent hurdle to cut down on spammers and other nefarious types.
So the solution is to quickly spam out another 50 posts to prove I'm not a spammer, right? ;D

@blurkraken22, you're going to fit right in :)
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: uniwelder on October 13, 2021, 11:35:32 AM
Yesterday was my last official day of work.  This is a little off course from the plan of the last 5 years--- I was supposed to get myself down to just clumping hours here and there as projects develop, but 'straw that broke the camel's back' type of thing left me to just quit entirely. 

When I went from salaried to hourly, my payrate was calculated to be (gross pay)/(40*52) but I thought it should be (gross pay + retirement + insurance)/(40*48) to account for actual compensation divided by number of actual hours worked in a year.  Overall discrepancy meant I would be paid 2/3 of my regular salaried rate, while adding significantly more value to the position since I would only be working the hours actually needed to do the job with no dead time. 

This all was a 1 year ago, and for reasons I won't go into, I couldn't just quit or negotiate to the proper amount.  That all changed a month ago, so I told my boss I would quit unless my payrate was adjusted to the proper amount--- a 50% increase.  He was sympathetic and knows our financial situation, but because of bureaucracy, it wasn't possible.  Yesterday I backed up all my files and handed in my keys and badge. 

If my position can be offered again, at an equivalent or better rate to what I had been paid originally, I'll take it, but am in no hurry and don't need it.  The work is interesting and most people are jealous of what I get to do, but I've held a grudge the last year over feeling like I was being taken advantage of and not appreciated.  Finding MMM and accumulating the FU money is what made this possible.  I'd have gotten to this point eventually, but this site has really accelerated the process.  My story isn't epic, and even though I've been very open with my coworkers about planning in the last 5 years, it seems to still be a shock now that reality has hit.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: dandarc on October 13, 2021, 11:45:43 AM
Congratulations @uniwelder ! Sometimes the timeline changes - and the powers that be must know now that you really are serious.

I regret not standing firm last July in a similar situation, although without as significant a pay cut. Funny how when management gets what they claim to want in changing the terms of your work how quickly a timeline can adjust . . .
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Adventine on October 13, 2021, 12:47:20 PM
Good for you being in a good position to walk away, @uniwelder !
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: uniwelder on October 13, 2021, 01:24:54 PM
Congratulations @uniwelder ! Sometimes the timeline changes - and the powers that be must know now that you really are serious.
I regret not standing firm last July in a similar situation, although without as significant a pay cut. Funny how when management gets what they claim to want in changing the terms of your work how quickly a timeline can adjust . . .
Good for you being in a good position to walk away, @uniwelder !

Thank you! 
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Boll weevil on October 13, 2021, 03:42:12 PM


When I went from salaried to hourly, my payrate was calculated to be (gross pay)/(40*52) but I thought it should be (gross pay + retirement + insurance)/(40*48) to account for actual compensation divided by number of actual hours worked in a year.  Overall discrepancy meant I would be paid 2/3 of my regular salaried rate, while adding significantly more value to the position since I would only be working the hours actually needed to do the job with no dead time. 


Were you still a direct employee or working on contract? If you were direct, and the company was still paying retirement + insurance (+vacation?), then the formula that was used seems right. Otherwise you’d be double-dipping on the benefits, so to speak.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: uniwelder on October 13, 2021, 07:42:35 PM


When I went from salaried to hourly, my payrate was calculated to be (gross pay)/(40*52) but I thought it should be (gross pay + retirement + insurance)/(40*48) to account for actual compensation divided by number of actual hours worked in a year.  Overall discrepancy meant I would be paid 2/3 of my regular salaried rate, while adding significantly more value to the position since I would only be working the hours actually needed to do the job with no dead time. 


Were you still a direct employee or working on contract? If you were direct, and the company was still paying retirement + insurance (+vacation?), then the formula that was used seems right. Otherwise you’d be double-dipping on the benefits, so to speak.

I was still a direct employee.  I went from salaried with benefits to hourly without benefits, so no double dipping in my rate calculation.  It was a voluntary decision.  I could have stayed salary, but I wanted to drastically reduce my hours so I was only working as needed.  My boss would have been happy spending an extra 75k/year keeping me on salary, but I didn't want to be obligated to be at the workplace if not needed.  The hourly payrate was an HR decision, not my boss' exactly, though I think he could have had a bit more influence if he realized what the consequences would be a year later. 
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: JAYSLOL on October 14, 2021, 09:06:40 AM
Update to my story on the previous page about getting breakthrough Covid and realizing my job is toxic.  I gave my boss a set schedule that I would work, but he is not respecting it.  He basically told me that I could work the hours he needs me or none at all.  I'm not sure why he thought this would work since the entire state where I am is really short on staff and we both know it's better to have me working part time than none at all.

So I called my old manager from another district and I'm going to transfer there in 2 weeks.  He is glad to have me in any capacity since he knows I'll do a good job.  I'm starting out 2 days a week on days of my choice and we'll see how my mental health is.  Nice old manager is going to handle it all with current jerk manager so I don't have to deal with him.  Although part of me wants to hear his reaction :).

DW did the same, her boss wanted her to work weekends but that didn’t work well for us, so she found another job and all of a sudden they were totally fine with her just working weekdays if she came back
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: dandarc on October 14, 2021, 02:10:45 PM
Update to my story on the previous page about getting breakthrough Covid and realizing my job is toxic.  I gave my boss a set schedule that I would work, but he is not respecting it.  He basically told me that I could work the hours he needs me or none at all.  I'm not sure why he thought this would work since the entire state where I am is really short on staff and we both know it's better to have me working part time than none at all.

So I called my old manager from another district and I'm going to transfer there in 2 weeks.  He is glad to have me in any capacity since he knows I'll do a good job.  I'm starting out 2 days a week on days of my choice and we'll see how my mental health is.  Nice old manager is going to handle it all with current jerk manager so I don't have to deal with him.  Although part of me wants to hear his reaction :).

DW did the same, her boss wanted her to work weekends but that didn’t work well for us, so she found another job and all of a sudden they were totally fine with her just working weekdays if she came back
Hope she stayed at other job or at least got a big raise or something if she went back.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: magus on October 15, 2021, 06:03:24 AM
I once attended an accounting class by a guy who used to run a bank. He started out in tech support, more or less, during the early computer days when the "computer department" generated reports because no one else had computers.

When he became department head, there were 150 reports generated for the company. His first act was to stop sending them. His plan was to permanently cancel any report that no one requested during the next 90 days. Half of the reports died.

He didn't have to leave his job to say FU to unnecessary work!

I am actually a big fan of this tactic for anyone that ever takes over an FP&A team. I’ve done this a couple times, minus the reports I used from my team
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: SwordGuy on October 15, 2021, 09:10:23 AM
I once attended an accounting class by a guy who used to run a bank. He started out in tech support, more or less, during the early computer days when the "computer department" generated reports because no one else had computers.

When he became department head, there were 150 reports generated for the company. His first act was to stop sending them. His plan was to permanently cancel any report that no one requested during the next 90 days. Half of the reports died.

He didn't have to leave his job to say FU to unnecessary work!

That's a dangerous tactic because some reports are only used at the end of a fiscal year.    Best to take that into account.  Otherwise, yep, it's a great way to cut out unnecessary work!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: TomTX on October 15, 2021, 11:37:19 AM
I once attended an accounting class by a guy who used to run a bank. He started out in tech support, more or less, during the early computer days when the "computer department" generated reports because no one else had computers.

When he became department head, there were 150 reports generated for the company. His first act was to stop sending them. His plan was to permanently cancel any report that no one requested during the next 90 days. Half of the reports died.

He didn't have to leave his job to say FU to unnecessary work!

That's a dangerous tactic because some reports are only used at the end of a fiscal year.    Best to take that into account.  Otherwise, yep, it's a great way to cut out unnecessary work!

Schedule the 90 days to start shortly before the end of the FY.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: habanero on October 15, 2021, 11:55:19 AM
Schedule the 90 days to start shortly before the end of the FY.

Early in my job life we had an old big-ass dot matrix printer spitting out vast ammounts of paper every morning. Noone used the output from this beast. When we pointed out that it was no point in printing this stuff the reply was that noone knew what job it was or how to stop it. It was something put on the mainframe probably 10-20 years ago and probably made sense at the time. Eventually someone figured out what it was and stopped it, or someone just threw up the monster of a printer, cant really remeber.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: BlueHouse on October 15, 2021, 12:14:44 PM
Schedule the 90 days to start shortly before the end of the FY.

Early in my job life we had an old big-ass dot matrix printer spitting out vast ammounts of paper every morning. Noone used the output from this beast. When we pointed out that it was no point in printing this stuff the reply was that noone knew what job it was or how to stop it. It was something put on the mainframe probably 10-20 years ago and probably made sense at the time. Eventually someone figured out what it was and stopped it, or someone just threw up the monster of a printer, cant really remeber.

Someone posted on craigslist today a free printer stand.  It was one of those with the slit in the top of the table and the big empty space underneath for reams and reams of perforated printer paper.  I was thinking about how so few people younger than me would even know what that table was made for.  If you tried to tell kids today about paper that came in one continuous sheet that we had to separate at perforations, what would they say?
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: youngwildandfree on October 15, 2021, 02:10:26 PM
Schedule the 90 days to start shortly before the end of the FY.

Early in my job life we had an old big-ass dot matrix printer spitting out vast ammounts of paper every morning. Noone used the output from this beast. When we pointed out that it was no point in printing this stuff the reply was that noone knew what job it was or how to stop it. It was something put on the mainframe probably 10-20 years ago and probably made sense at the time. Eventually someone figured out what it was and stopped it, or someone just threw up the monster of a printer, cant really remeber.

Someone posted on craigslist today a free printer stand.  It was one of those with the slit in the top of the table and the big empty space underneath for reams and reams of perforated printer paper.  I was thinking about how so few people younger than me would even know what that table was made for.  If you tried to tell kids today about paper that came in one continuous sheet that we had to separate at perforations, what would they say?

"Doesn't that require killing a lot of trees?"

Or maybe the young people in my life are just extra environmentally conscious.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: shadowmoss on October 15, 2021, 02:49:01 PM
Using piles of that continuous green bar paper was situation normal back then.  It was the only way to get output from the mainframes.  Also went through amazingng amounts of punch cards.  From what I've heard.  From older friends.  Right.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: dandarc on October 15, 2021, 03:46:44 PM
There's nothing quite like a banner printed at home or school on 10 to 20 linear feet of paper that is already attached together for you. I don't know how kids today cope without this being a regular part of their lives.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Sibley on October 15, 2021, 06:05:46 PM
Anyone else build forts in the basement with it? Pretty sure I got in trouble. Worth it though!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: ixtap on October 15, 2021, 06:09:42 PM
Anyone else build forts in the basement with it? Pretty sure I got in trouble. Worth it though!

Blankets are a better fort material, due to the extra width and sound blocking.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Sibley on October 15, 2021, 07:35:47 PM
Anyone else build forts in the basement with it? Pretty sure I got in trouble. Worth it though!

Blankets are a better fort material, due to the extra width and sound blocking.

Agreed, and those were used in the living room. But you make do with what you've got.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: geekette on October 16, 2021, 05:02:09 PM
Using piles of that continuous green bar paper was situation normal back then.  It was the only way to get output from the mainframes.  Also went through amazingng amounts of punch cards.  From what I've heard.  From older friends.  Right.
Graduation day watching the contents of a box of punch cards flutter down from the roof of the residence hall like oversized playing cards...  Also, not me.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: dblaace on October 16, 2021, 08:48:48 PM
Using piles of that continuous green bar paper was situation normal back then.  It was the only way to get output from the mainframes.  Also went through amazingng amounts of punch cards.  From what I've heard.  From older friends.  Right.
I used to work on those printers & readers.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: bluebelle on October 17, 2021, 08:19:53 AM
Using piles of that continuous green bar paper was situation normal back then.  It was the only way to get output from the mainframes.  Also went through amazingng amounts of punch cards.  From what I've heard.  From older friends.  Right.
I used to work on those printers & readers.

I feel old now.........
BTW, we called that paper "pajama paper", because of the stripes
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: JoePublic3.14 on October 19, 2021, 05:16:03 PM
There's nothing quite like a banner printed at home or school on 10 to 20 linear feet of paper that is already attached together for you. I don't know how kids today cope without this being a regular part of their lives.

Yeah, I’ve thought about that now and again over the years.

What was that print program that made banners? It’ll come to me….probably at 1am.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Wile E. Coyote on October 19, 2021, 06:23:39 PM
There's nothing quite like a banner printed at home or school on 10 to 20 linear feet of paper that is already attached together for you. I don't know how kids today cope without this being a regular part of their lives.

Yeah, I’ve thought about that now and again over the years.

What was that print program that made banners? It’ll come to me….probably at 1am.
The Print Shop, maybe?
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: JoePublic3.14 on October 20, 2021, 10:19:26 AM
There's nothing quite like a banner printed at home or school on 10 to 20 linear feet of paper that is already attached together for you. I don't know how kids today cope without this being a regular part of their lives.

Yeah, I’ve thought about that now and again over the years.

What was that print program that made banners? It’ll come to me….probably at 1am.
The Print Shop, maybe?

Yeah, think you nailed it. That would wear out the ole printer
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: dhc on October 26, 2021, 08:42:18 PM
Not really epic, but after an executive not in my chain of command scheduled a meeting with me to discuss his disapproval of some actions he imagined but that I did not actually take, refused to listen when I told him as much, and patronizingly lectured me on how my actions could affect others in the organization, I emailed him and the CEO (his boss) some direct feedback explaining that he was out of line and requesting any future feedback be direct and actionable. Welp...we'll see how it goes over.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: former player on October 27, 2021, 01:20:30 AM
Not really epic, but after an executive not in my chain of command scheduled a meeting with me to discuss his disapproval of some actions he imagined but that I did not actually take, refused to listen when I told him as much, and patronizingly lectured me on how my actions could affect others in the organization, I emailed him and the CEO (his boss) some direct feedback explaining that he was out of line and requesting any future feedback be direct and actionable. Welp...we'll see how it goes over.
That is epic, especially if your top brass take it as a teacheable moment.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Ladychips on October 27, 2021, 05:22:06 AM
Not really epic, but after an executive not in my chain of command scheduled a meeting with me to discuss his disapproval of some actions he imagined but that I did not actually take, refused to listen when I told him as much, and patronizingly lectured me on how my actions could affect others in the organization, I emailed him and the CEO (his boss) some direct feedback explaining that he was out of line and requesting any future feedback be direct and actionable. Welp...we'll see how it goes over.

Please come back and tell us how it goes.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: AlanStache on October 27, 2021, 07:12:10 AM
Not really epic, but after an executive not in my chain of command scheduled a meeting with me to discuss his disapproval of some actions he imagined but that I did not actually take, refused to listen when I told him as much, and patronizingly lectured me on how my actions could affect others in the organization, I emailed him and the CEO (his boss) some direct feedback explaining that he was out of line and requesting any future feedback be direct and actionable. Welp...we'll see how it goes over.

Did you know the topic of the meeting before hand?  Did you show up to the meeting?
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Hall11235 on October 27, 2021, 11:57:09 AM
Not super epic, but maybe still worth a post...

My boss (the CEO), went to the office last Sunday to drop his custom-made Oooh La La RV off in the parking lot (long story), and get some work done. In addition to being the primary pre-sales support admin and installation manager of the descendants of those printers we were talking about on the last page, I also do cover some facilities stuff. This includes the alarm system.

I had shown the CEO how to use the alarm to arm and disarm the system (very easy - Pin + Away or Pin + Arm). Well, on that Sunday, he couldn't figure it out, triggered the alarm and the police showed up, etc. etc. He calls me, and, since it is Sunday at 3, I have a tone with him that he doesn't like.

Fast forward to Tuesday, he calls me and tells me that I am too valuable to ever leave, so that means he needs to compensate me enough that he can call me on a Sunday for emergencies and not be upset. This compensation turned into an additional 10k for me, and raises for all of my direct reports.

If I had known that all I had to do get raises was be an ass to my boss, I would have started a long time ago...
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Taran Wanderer on October 27, 2021, 01:28:01 PM
That’s epic.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: mm1970 on October 27, 2021, 01:44:30 PM
Quote
If I had known that all I had to do get raises was be an ass to my boss, I would have started a long time ago...
Hm maybe I should try this!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: NorthernIkigai on October 27, 2021, 02:05:52 PM
Fast forward to Tuesday, he calls me and tells me that I am too valuable to ever leave, so that means he needs to compensate me enough that he can call me on a Sunday for emergencies and not be upset. This compensation turned into an additional 10k for me

Epic AND hilarious! Were you even thinking you were flexing your FU money muscles here, or was it inadvertent?

Of course, paying a Mustachian more “to keep them from ever leaving” may not be a successful move…
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: rantk81 on October 27, 2021, 02:47:05 PM
Quote
Of course, paying a Mustachian more “to keep them from ever leaving” may not be a successful move…

LOL! I've actually had that thought in my mind before, when I received raises/bonuses.
My employer thinks that they are rewarding me and making me loyal, in order to work harder and stay longer.... and for a mustachian, it is exactly the opposite!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Mr. Green on October 27, 2021, 02:58:54 PM
Definitely epic. Is 10k enough for your boss to call you on Sunday without you being upset?
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Hall11235 on October 27, 2021, 03:06:46 PM
Fast forward to Tuesday, he calls me and tells me that I am too valuable to ever leave, so that means he needs to compensate me enough that he can call me on a Sunday for emergencies and not be upset. This compensation turned into an additional 10k for me

Epic AND hilarious! Were you even thinking you were flexing your FU money muscles here, or was it inadvertent?

Of course, paying a Mustachian more “to keep them from ever leaving” may not be a successful move…

I wish my brain was that big, haha! I was just irritated he had the temerity to call me on a Sunday!!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: dblaace on October 27, 2021, 03:55:08 PM
Of course, paying a Mustachian more “to keep them from ever leaving” may not be a successful move…
My boss once said he'd pay me more but I'd just leave sooner.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: dandarc on October 27, 2021, 04:09:45 PM
Of course, paying a Mustachian more “to keep them from ever leaving” may not be a successful move…
My boss once said he'd pay me more but I'd just leave sooner.
And you immediately submitted your resignation, right?
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: dblaace on October 27, 2021, 04:37:07 PM
Of course, paying a Mustachian more “to keep them from ever leaving” may not be a successful move…
My boss once said he'd pay me more but I'd just leave sooner.
And you immediately submitted your resignation, right?
No, it was in a joking manor. However I now have 29 28 days left.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Dicey on October 27, 2021, 06:00:51 PM
Of course, paying a Mustachian more “to keep them from ever leaving” may not be a successful move…
My boss once said he'd pay me more but I'd just leave sooner.
And you immediately submitted your resignation, right?
No, it was in a joking manor. However I now have 29 28 days left.
Does your boss know this?
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: dblaace on October 27, 2021, 06:26:43 PM
Of course, paying a Mustachian more “to keep them from ever leaving” may not be a successful move…
My boss once said he'd pay me more but I'd just leave sooner.
And you immediately submitted your resignation, right?
No, it was in a joking manor. However I now have 29 28 days left.
Does your boss know this?
Oh yeah, I gave him 5 months notice. He said that over a year ago.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: moof on October 27, 2021, 08:20:43 PM
I have about two years left to hit my number, but things have been rough at work.  I am tired of having to manage my managers, among a great many other faults.

So after my wife realized just how unhappy I was she gave me the freedom to resign without getting anything lined up.  I told my manager today what I was thinking.  I gave him 48 hours to change my mind (i.e. come up with a viable plan to make things suck less) or he’ll get my official notice Friday.  I like most of the folks I work with, including him, but the company just is a basket-case that has broken my spirit.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: SwordGuy on October 27, 2021, 08:26:02 PM
I have about two years left to hit my number, but things have been rough at work.  I am tired of having to manage my managers, among a great many other faults.

So after my wife realized just how unhappy I was she gave me the freedom to resign without getting anything lined up.  I told my manager today what I was thinking.  I gave him 48 hours to change my mind (i.e. come up with a viable plan to make things suck less) or he’ll get my official notice Friday.  I like most of the folks I work with, including him, but the company just is a basket-case that has broken my spirit.

FU money is a wonderful thing and this is what it's for!  Good job!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: NorthernIkigai on October 28, 2021, 01:44:30 AM
Quote
Of course, paying a Mustachian more “to keep them from ever leaving” may not be a successful move…

LOL! I've actually had that thought in my mind before, when I received raises/bonuses.
My employer thinks that they are rewarding me and making me loyal, in order to work harder and stay longer.... and for a mustachian, it is exactly the opposite!

I guess it does work, until it very suddenly doesn't anymore. There's a recent discussion somewhere on the board about whether or not to let your employer know you have money (and therefore options). I guess in most circumstances it's better to at least be vague about your stash and timeline, since it can make a big professional difference whether you'll want to be employed for another year or 5 or 10.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: uniwelder on October 28, 2021, 03:41:58 AM
I have about two years left to hit my number, but things have been rough at work.  I am tired of having to manage my managers, among a great many other faults.

So after my wife realized just how unhappy I was she gave me the freedom to resign without getting anything lined up.  I told my manager today what I was thinking.  I gave him 48 hours to change my mind (i.e. come up with a viable plan to make things suck less) or he’ll get my official notice Friday.  I like most of the folks I work with, including him, but the company just is a basket-case that has broken my spirit.

Be sure to update with the conclusion!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Hall11235 on October 28, 2021, 05:55:48 AM
Definitely epic. Is 10k enough for your boss to call you on Sunday without you being upset?

For now, yes. I have a reputation of being 'blunt' and not playing 'the game' (as it relates to office politics,etc.). There is a clear understanding of who needs who in this employer-employee relationship. Every person I have reported to knows how small I live, and it has allowed me to earn respect from my superiors since I can be honest without fear of losing my shirt. :)
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Plina on October 28, 2021, 06:58:34 AM
Definitely epic. Is 10k enough for your boss to call you on Sunday without you being upset?

For now, yes. I have a reputation of being 'blunt' and not playing 'the game' (as it relates to office politics,etc.). There is a clear understanding of who needs who in this employer-employee relationship. Every person I have reported to knows how small I live, and it has allowed me to earn respect from my superiors since I can be honest without fear of losing my shirt. :)

In most organisations you actually get rewarded for speaking up, because there are a lot of people not wanting to do it. I have always said what I thought even though I have learned to be more diplomatic than in my youth. I can play the game if it is needed to achieve an objective but prefer not to. I would probably not tell my employer when I was planning to leave but I would make certain that it is my choice to stay because I want to and not because I need to.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: alcon835 on October 28, 2021, 07:10:55 AM
Not really epic, but after an executive not in my chain of command scheduled a meeting with me to discuss his disapproval of some actions he imagined but that I did not actually take, refused to listen when I told him as much, and patronizingly lectured me on how my actions could affect others in the organization, I emailed him and the CEO (his boss) some direct feedback explaining that he was out of line and requesting any future feedback be direct and actionable. Welp...we'll see how it goes over.

This is the DEFINITION of epic FU! The story isn't over, but the very fact you could do this is epic beyond belief! Keep us updated :)
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: NorthernIkigai on October 28, 2021, 07:44:18 AM
In most organisations you actually get rewarded for speaking up, because there are a lot of people not wanting to do it. I have always said what I thought even though I have learned to be more diplomatic than in my youth.

And not just speaking up and saying what you think, but also asking for clarification when you don't understand something. I've found that people respect me a lot more when I say "I don't understand this bit here, could you explain it?" instead of just nodding along (like a lot of my colleagues do) and then misunderstanding and not doing the work right.

People are afraid they are going to look stupid if they admit to not understanding something, whereas it's literally part of the job to make sure they do understand it. Usually colleagues also appreciate that I asked since they also didn't get it but were too chicken to let anyone know... Not to mention all the holes in plans that get discovered because someone doesn't understand how it's supposed to work and then even the ones in charge realize it doesn't actually work.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: AlanStache on October 28, 2021, 11:59:56 AM
I have made a point of asking 'dumb' questions in meetings in front of the new hire/fresh outs so they can see how it works and it is welcome (at least I hope that was what they took away).  Also I have spoken to some of then about personal finance and recommended mmm.  "I want you to feel financially secure so you can tell me I am full of shit when I am without fear of being fired and broke."
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: LennStar on October 29, 2021, 02:52:37 AM
I have made a point of asking 'dumb' questions in meetings in front of the new hire/fresh outs so they can see how it works and it is welcome (at least I hope that was what they took away).  Also I have spoken to some of then about personal finance and recommended mmm.  "I want you to feel financially secure so you can tell me I am full of shit when I am without fear of being fired and broke."
Isn't it strange that there are so many people on the internets who like to tell everyone how shit they are but nearly nobody in real life?
Maybe that are all those who can't say it in real life for this reason and they woudl stop if they would be FI?

Yeah right, but I can dream, okay?
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: dhc on October 29, 2021, 11:34:14 PM
Not really epic, but after an executive not in my chain of command scheduled a meeting with me to discuss his disapproval of some actions he imagined but that I did not actually take, refused to listen when I told him as much, and patronizingly lectured me on how my actions could affect others in the organization, I emailed him and the CEO (his boss) some direct feedback explaining that he was out of line and requesting any future feedback be direct and actionable. Welp...we'll see how it goes over.

Please come back and tell us how it goes.
Both my boss and the CEO backed me up, exec in question seems to realize be overreached despite a non-apology, and hopefully that's the last I have to think about it!

My take is actually that, as someone else mentioned upthread, most people tend to respect you for having a spine and being politely assertive in such circumstances, which seems to be what happened here.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Ladychips on October 30, 2021, 03:14:00 AM
Not really epic, but after an executive not in my chain of command scheduled a meeting with me to discuss his disapproval of some actions he imagined but that I did not actually take, refused to listen when I told him as much, and patronizingly lectured me on how my actions could affect others in the organization, I emailed him and the CEO (his boss) some direct feedback explaining that he was out of line and requesting any future feedback be direct and actionable. Welp...we'll see how it goes over.

Please come back and tell us how it goes.
Both my boss and the CEO backed me up, exec in question seems to realize be overreached despite a non-apology, and hopefully that's the last I have to think about it!

My take is actually that, as someone else mentioned upthread, most people tend to respect you for having a spine and being politely assertive in such circumstances, which seems to be what happened here.

Very nice! Thanks for following up!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: gooki on October 30, 2021, 05:28:25 AM
My wife exercised our fuck you money to perfection this week.

She applied for a senior business partner role at her current employer.  It's a promotion in paper and dollars only as she's been doing the senior role for sometime already just without the recognition/reward. My wife's well respected by the managers she coaches, a great mentor to the younger staff in their team, and trusted by her team mates

She went through the whole interview process with her reporting manager (not one of the ones she coaches) and a couple of other staff, waited a couple of weeks, and was then told nope, no senior position for you, were hiring someone external...

Update time. Because of our fuck you money, my wife has been picky about her next role... Now shes just signed up with a new organization at a higher level position, better salary and doing more of what she loves and less of what she doesn't.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: LennStar on October 30, 2021, 05:36:44 AM
My wife exercised our fuck you money to perfection this week.

She applied for a senior business partner role at her current employer.  It's a promotion in paper and dollars only as she's been doing the senior role for sometime already just without the recognition/reward. My wife's well respected by the managers she coaches, a great mentor to the younger staff in their team, and trusted by her team mates

She went through the whole interview process with her reporting manager (not one of the ones she coaches) and a couple of other staff, waited a couple of weeks, and was then told nope, no senior position for you, were hiring someone external...

Update time. Because of our fuck you money, my wife has been picky about her next role... Now shes just signed up with a new organization at a higher level position, better salary and doing more of what she loves and less of what she doesn't.

Sounds like a good deal to me!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Dicey on October 30, 2021, 08:49:21 AM
My wife exercised our fuck you money to perfection this week.

She applied for a senior business partner role at her current employer.  It's a promotion in paper and dollars only as she's been doing the senior role for sometime already just without the recognition/reward. My wife's well respected by the managers she coaches, a great mentor to the younger staff in their team, and trusted by her team mates

She went through the whole interview process with her reporting manager (not one of the ones she coaches) and a couple of other staff, waited a couple of weeks, and was then told nope, no senior position for you, were hiring someone external...

Update time. Because of our fuck you money, my wife has been picky about her next role... Now shes just signed up with a new organization at a higher level position, better salary and doing more of what she loves and less of what she doesn't.
Has she given notice yet? I want to hear how that went :-)
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Loren Ver on October 30, 2021, 09:16:13 AM
My wife exercised our fuck you money to perfection this week.

She applied for a senior business partner role at her current employer.  It's a promotion in paper and dollars only as she's been doing the senior role for sometime already just without the recognition/reward. My wife's well respected by the managers she coaches, a great mentor to the younger staff in their team, and trusted by her team mates

She went through the whole interview process with her reporting manager (not one of the ones she coaches) and a couple of other staff, waited a couple of weeks, and was then told nope, no senior position for you, were hiring someone external...

Update time. Because of our fuck you money, my wife has been picky about her next role... Now shes just signed up with a new organization at a higher level position, better salary and doing more of what she loves and less of what she doesn't.
Has she given notice yet? I want to hear how that went :-)

She turned in her resignation in the original post with no place to go (IIRC).  gooki cut the quote short. 
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: dandarc on October 30, 2021, 09:26:20 AM
My wife exercised our fuck you money to perfection this week.

She applied for a senior business partner role at her current employer.  It's a promotion in paper and dollars only as she's been doing the senior role for sometime already just without the recognition/reward. My wife's well respected by the managers she coaches, a great mentor to the younger staff in their team, and trusted by her team mates

She went through the whole interview process with her reporting manager (not one of the ones she coaches) and a couple of other staff, waited a couple of weeks, and was then told nope, no senior position for you, were hiring someone external...

Update time. Because of our fuck you money, my wife has been picky about her next role... Now shes just signed up with a new organization at a higher level position, better salary and doing more of what she loves and less of what she doesn't.
Has she given notice yet? I want to hear how that went :-)

She turned in her resignation in the original post with no place to go (IIRC).  gooki cut the quote short.
Goddamn is this badass - end of that story in gooki's words: "The managers response was 'oh? Do you have somewhere else to go?' and my wife cool as ice says 'no, I'm happy to go', spins round and exits the room."
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: moof on November 01, 2021, 03:38:48 PM
I have about two years left to hit my number, but things have been rough at work.  I am tired of having to manage my managers, among a great many other faults.

So after my wife realized just how unhappy I was she gave me the freedom to resign without getting anything lined up.  I told my manager today what I was thinking.  I gave him 48 hours to change my mind (i.e. come up with a viable plan to make things suck less) or he’ll get my official notice Friday.  I like most of the folks I work with, including him, but the company just is a basket-case that has broken my spirit.

FU money is a wonderful thing and this is what it's for!  Good job!
I ended up giving them till today (Monday) to finish discussing my minimum line in the stand for changing things.  Company policy is not bendable enough, so I signed my resignation later and slid it across the table.  I feel for the managers, I like both of them personally, but the company has driven me crazy.  2 weeks and I'm out of here.  Sad, but relieving.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: BicycleB on November 01, 2021, 04:19:04 PM
I have about two years left to hit my number, but things have been rough at work.  I am tired of having to manage my managers, among a great many other faults.

So after my wife realized just how unhappy I was she gave me the freedom to resign without getting anything lined up.  I told my manager today what I was thinking.  I gave him 48 hours to change my mind (i.e. come up with a viable plan to make things suck less) or he’ll get my official notice Friday.  I like most of the folks I work with, including him, but the company just is a basket-case that has broken my spirit.

FU money is a wonderful thing and this is what it's for!  Good job!
I ended up giving them till today (Monday) to finish discussing my minimum line in the stand for changing things.  Company policy is not bendable enough, so I signed my resignation later and slid it across the table.  I feel for the managers, I like both of them personally, but the company has driven me crazy.  2 weeks and I'm out of here.  Sad, but relieving.

Congrats, @moof! Best wishes in your new adventures. You've crossed the Rubicon!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: CowboyAndIndian on November 02, 2021, 06:46:12 AM
My wife exercised our fuck you money to perfection this week.

She applied for a senior business partner role at her current employer.  It's a promotion in paper and dollars only as she's been doing the senior role for sometime already just without the recognition/reward. My wife's well respected by the managers she coaches, a great mentor to the younger staff in their team, and trusted by her team mates

She went through the whole interview process with her reporting manager (not one of the ones she coaches) and a couple of other staff, waited a couple of weeks, and was then told nope, no senior position for you, were hiring someone external...

Update time. Because of our fuck you money, my wife has been picky about her next role... Now shes just signed up with a new organization at a higher level position, better salary and doing more of what she loves and less of what she doesn't.

Really EPIC FU!

Congrats to your wife.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: CowboyAndIndian on November 02, 2021, 06:49:28 AM
I ended up giving them till today (Monday) to finish discussing my minimum line in the stand for changing things.  Company policy is not bendable enough, so I signed my resignation later and slid it across the table.  I feel for the managers, I like both of them personally, but the company has driven me crazy.  2 weeks and I'm out of here.  Sad, but relieving.

Way to go @moof.

I've resigned once without a job lined up due to a toxic boss. Looking back, it was the best decision I made. It was wonderful for my mental health.

I spent a couple of months at home decompressing, then found another job (Story somewhere in the archives of this thread)
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: LetsRetireYoung on November 07, 2021, 09:32:39 AM
I'm not sure if my story is epic, but it definitely puts the "F" in "FU" hahaha

I spent 11.5 years working for Amazon, from a lowly warehouse temp to being a financial analyst at one of their biggest warehouses in North America. (Amazing what you can do if you transfer a lot, learn Excel, and are stubborn.) And yes, every negative story you heard about the company is true in some form or another. (I.e. it's not the warehouse workers that pee in bottles - it's the van drivers. Etc...)

Aaaanyway, the last 5 years were just part of my big plan: get a work transfer to another country, become a permanent resident of that country, squirrel away enough money to lean-FIRE, and then pull the plug. When I transferred from Seattle to Toronto, I had to take a 48% cut (yes, forty-eight percent) to my total compensation. That sucked - a lot - but it was a stepping stone to my final objective.

After yet another re-org, almost everyone (except me lol) transferred away, and we ended up with a lot of external hires who didn't quite know what the job entailed, so they doubled down on pointless paperwork, etc. Some of my newer, less experienced colleagues would take it all seriously, to the point where they would log on and work on Sundays (!!!) just to get the meaningless Monday reports done ahead of time. They would also keep bridging the bridges to the weekly bridges allll the way until Thursday. That was not healthy, and there were many other such incidents.

I finally got my Canadian PR (permanent residency) 2 years after moving here. That meant I no longer needed the job: before that, I was on a work permit, which meant "lose the job = go back home." :( I'd also used my financial skillz to handpick a portfolio of vastly undervalued stocks in May 2020... (Energy, retail shopping, cruise ships, etc) After I cashed in all my AMZN stock for my beat-up stock portfolio, it went up 197% the following year. Sooo, money was no longer the issue, either. :)

I think that toward the very end, my bosses realized I might not stay there forever. They finally got me my long-awaited promotion. It was just a 10% raise in total compensation. :-/ That's not too bad in and of itself, but that still meant I'd be making 43% less than when I was a lower-ranked office clerk back in Seattle 2 years prior.

Soooo, a week after they sent out the big and fancy promotion email, I sent them my 2-week notice LOLOLOLOL. In the email, I made it clear that my motivation wasn't spite or anything of the sort - it was just money, plain and simple. The bosses did not reply (aside from a curt acknowledgement), so I can only imagine how much my insubordination pissed them off. :) I finally received a very dry and formal "Thank you for all your hard work" reply from them at the very end. I'm a bit sad that I'll never know just how much my "FU" email embarrassed them, but on the upside, my imagination can keep coming up with different hilarious scenarios. :)
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: zolotiyeruki on November 07, 2021, 10:23:46 AM
I suspect the rigid bureaucracy and HR processes in the company have more to do with your only-10% raise and your bosses' silence than any intent the bosses may have had.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: ysette9 on November 07, 2021, 10:23:52 AM
Nice work creating a plan and then executing it to get what you want in life! Bravo.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: LetsRetireYoung on November 07, 2021, 10:43:30 AM
I suspect the rigid bureaucracy and HR processes in the company have more to do with your only-10% raise and your bosses' silence than any intent the bosses may have had.
To be fair, I did not blame my bosses - they were only the symptom of the company's many failings. I do, however, blame my immediate boss (a typical MBA cultist who never even bothered to install the Excel ODBC connections in 3 years of working there...) for lying. He'd claimed he'd promoted lots of people under him (turned out that wasn't true), and he kept dangling a carrot in front of me, saying I "won't believe how huge the raise is gonna be! :) " It later turned out that he had no idea what it would actually be LOL - compared to his grandiose promises, 10% seemed rather on the low side. Ahhh, corporate world...

Nice work creating a plan and then executing it to get what you want in life! Bravo.
Thanks, eh. :) I like to think of myself as a strategist. Most people live paycheck to paycheck and plan 2 weeks out. I plan 5-10 years at a time. I actually do make literal 5-year plans for myself - I write them down, then document my progress, etc. You can take a boy from the Soviet Union... :P
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: bmjohnson35 on November 07, 2021, 11:05:19 AM

Congrats! It's so rewarding to develop and successfully execute a plan.   

I certainly don't miss the insidious corporate "machine".   
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: LetsRetireYoung on November 07, 2021, 12:18:41 PM

Congrats! It's so rewarding to develop and successfully execute a plan.   
Thanks. :) And yeah, that was such an indescribable feeling, driving back home after turning in my badge and my laptop, knowing that not only did I complete my 5-year plan ahead of time, but that I also managed to beat the system by retiring 30 years ahead of time. This is what the Ocean's Eleven crew must have felt like after they pulled off the heist hahahaha
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: gaja on November 07, 2021, 12:45:56 PM

Congrats! It's so rewarding to develop and successfully execute a plan.   
Thanks. :) And yeah, that was such an indescribable feeling, driving back home after turning in my badge and my laptop, knowing that not only did I complete my 5-year plan ahead of time, but that I also managed to beat the system by retiring 30 years ahead of time. This is what the Ocean's Eleven crew must have felt like after they pulled off the heist hahahaha

What are the highlights for the updated 5-year plan?
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Anon-E-Mouze on November 07, 2021, 01:08:33 PM
Okay, this isn't technically an "FU money" story, but it is epic, it involves quitting a job, and there was an "FU", so I think it fits.

When I was a teenager (in the early 80s recession), my dad was working for a small consulting firm that was struggling, and layoffs were looming. Thankfully, my dad had both solid $$ in the bank and had started networking for a new job early on, so he was okay. He gave 4 weeks' notice of his departure to his boss, who learned that my dad was moving on to a big, financially sound consulting firm. And the boss was NOT happy about this because he was stretched thin financially, didn't have a solid lead on a job yet, and was generally an envious and ineffective people-manager.

Until the economic downturn, the company's coffee/tea lady had done her rounds at the office with a company-supplied stock of Peek Frean cookies. We happened to love Peek Freans in our house. They were the favorite cookie of my paternal grandmother, who had lived with us for about 5 years until had died (about 6 months before this story takes place).

On my dad's last day at work, he brought several large boxes of Peek Freans to the office, and gave them to the coffee/tea lady to distribute on her rounds that day. When she arrived at my dad's manager's office, he took a couple of cookies and asked, "Has the company reinstated cookies?" She said, "No. X brought them as a thank you gift for the office for his last day at work."  The manager took the cookie he was about to pop into his mouth, flung it into the garbage can and growled, "I'm not going to eat that F... B..d's cookies."

Well, of course, the coffee/tea lady told my dad this story. But he was a gentleman and he said something like "Many people are feeling stress about the company's future so I understand why someone might act out of frustration."

Fast forward a few months and my dad gets a call from a colleague at his former employer - one of the biggest companies in my dad's industry (BigCo). He was calling to ask my dad if he had any views on my dad's former manager at the small consulting firm, who was about to be offered a job if the reference checks went well.

My dad wasn't comfortable saying something positive (because the cookie-throwing behaviour was consistent with his former manager's general course of conduct) but he also didn't want to torpedo the job either. So he said, "I didn't work with Y for very long, so I'm not in a position to provide feedback."

A few days later, the former colleague from BigCo called back. He said, "I know you and I know you go out of your way to say something positive about people. So your silence concerns me. We are about to hire this guy for a very senior managerial role and I need to know if there are reasons for concern."

So my dad told him the cookie story. And his former colleague said, "I'm not hiring anyone that petty and temperamental."

Moral of the story: Don't toss your cookies in front of other people.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Fru-Gal on November 07, 2021, 02:01:53 PM
Quote
Thanks. :) And yeah, that was such an indescribable feeling, driving back home after turning in my badge and my laptop, knowing that not only did I complete my 5-year plan ahead of time, but that I also managed to beat the system by retiring 30 years ahead of time. This is what the Ocean's Eleven crew must have felt like after they pulled off the heist hahahaha

Thanks for the inspiring story. Congrats!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: DadJokes on November 07, 2021, 02:16:25 PM
Okay, this isn't technically an "FU money" story, but it is epic, it involves quitting a job, and there was an "FU", so I think it fits.

How dumb was that manager to use your dad as a reference? Even if he didn't think your dad knew about the cookie incident, it sounds like there wasn't much goodwill between them.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: markbike528CBX on November 07, 2021, 02:54:10 PM
Moral of the story: Don't toss your cookies in front of other people.
Yes, be more discreet when you "toss your cookies" or "reverse drink" or "talk to Ralph on the big white telephone"   :-)
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Blackeagle on November 07, 2021, 02:59:00 PM
How dumb was that manager to use your dad as a reference? Even if he didn't think your dad knew about the cookie incident, it sounds like there wasn't much goodwill between them.

The manager may not have used him as a reference.  The guy at BigCo was a former colleague, so he may have just been using his contacts to check the manager out, beyond any provided references. 
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: markbike528CBX on November 07, 2021, 03:00:28 PM
Okay, this isn't technically an "FU money" story, but it is epic, it involves quitting a job, and there was an "FU", so I think it fits.

How dumb was that manager to use your dad as a reference? Even if he didn't think your dad knew about the cookie incident, it sounds like there wasn't much goodwill between them.
I had an potential in-house interviewee/hire, and asked a reference (also in-house) and got the response "I wouldn't touch [person X] with a ten foot pole".   
Slimmed down potential interview list real fast.  If you can't get your references to lie or at least shade the truth for you, they shouldn't be references.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Adventine on November 07, 2021, 03:46:10 PM
How dumb was that manager to use your dad as a reference? Even if he didn't think your dad knew about the cookie incident, it sounds like there wasn't much goodwill between them.

The manager may not have used him as a reference.  The guy at BigCo was a former colleague, so he may have just been using his contacts to check the manager out, beyond any provided references.
I agree, this is the more likely scenario.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Anon-E-Mouze on November 07, 2021, 03:48:41 PM
Moral of the story: Don't toss your cookies in front of other people.
Yes, be more discreet when you "toss your cookies" or "reverse drink" or "talk to Ralph on the big white telephone"   :-)

The manager didn't give my dad's name as a reference. The hiring manager at BigCo called my dad because he knew that my dad had worked with the guy, and because the hiring manager trusted my dad's judgment.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: SwordGuy on November 07, 2021, 05:34:31 PM
For when you are obligated to give a reference for someone, and you want to be honest, but not get in trouble with your relative or friend for telling the truth:

That's when you need the Lexicon of Inconspicuously Ambiguous Referrals (LIAR).
For a chronically absent employeeA man like him is hard to find.
For a dishonest employeeHe's an unbelievable worker.
For a lazy employee   You would indeed be fortunate to get this person to work for you.
For the office drunk   Every hour with him was a happy hour.
For a chronically absent employee   It seemed her career was just taking off.
For a dishonest employee   Her true ability was deceiving.
For a stupid employee   I most enthusiastically recommend this candidate with no qualifications whatsoever.
For the office drunk   He generally found him loaded with work to do.
For an employee who is not worth further consideration as a job candidate   All in all, I cannot say enough good things about this candidate or recommend him too highly.
For an employee who is so unproductive that the job is better left unfilled   I can assure you that no person would be better for the job.
For a lazy employee   He could not care less about the number of hours he has to put in.
For an employee who is not worth further consideration as a job candidate   I would urge you to waste no time in making this candidate an offer of employment.
For a stupid employee   There is nothing you can teach a man like him.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Adventine on November 07, 2021, 05:38:55 PM
@SwordGuy  thank you for my laugh out loud moment of the day.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Chris Pascale on November 07, 2021, 06:53:45 PM
@SwordGuy  thank you for my laugh out loud moment of the day.

AGreed. I'm glad it's at the top of the page so more people will see it.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: SwordGuy on November 07, 2021, 06:54:54 PM
LIAR has been around since the 1980s (at least). 
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Sibley on November 07, 2021, 08:06:02 PM
Re informal references.... I worked at company A. Left there, was working at company B. Company B is hiring, and a guy from company A applies. The manager asked if I knew the guy. Yes, I did. Couldn't speak to his work. But I could speak to the restraining order that one of the women in that department had to take out against him.

Your actions have a way of following you.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: semiretired31 on November 07, 2021, 08:07:35 PM
Not sure this counts as epic. But, I spent the Fall soccer season coaching junior high girls from 3-5 for 9 weeks. Big commitment away from my job and wouldn’t have had the stones to ask to do it if I wasn’t in the position I’m in. Added bonus, actually made a little money for my time.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: LetsRetireYoung on November 07, 2021, 09:41:56 PM

Congrats! It's so rewarding to develop and successfully execute a plan.   
Thanks. :) And yeah, that was such an indescribable feeling, driving back home after turning in my badge and my laptop, knowing that not only did I complete my 5-year plan ahead of time, but that I also managed to beat the system by retiring 30 years ahead of time. This is what the Ocean's Eleven crew must have felt like after they pulled off the heist hahahaha

What are the highlights for the updated 5-year plan?
In no particular order... :)
1. Sell my Shoreline, WA (just north of Seattle) condo after the subway station right next to it gets completed in 2024.
2. Become a published sci-fi author. (Actual book/short story publications, not Kindle.)
3. Obtain Canadian citizenship (currently a permanent resident)
4. Become a snowbird and visit 3 different continents.
5. Continue enjoying the lean-FIRE life. :)
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Apples on November 08, 2021, 06:51:28 AM
What I really want to know, what did your boss say when you told him you were quitting after all, a few weeks later?
He was a big fan of phrases/sayings, the midwesterner he was.
So I told him I wasn't impressed by his batting average.
And that a blind man could have been batting better than his attempts to get me anything bigger.
And that I had to take care of myself, my family, and my health (mental in this case).
^all 3 were verbatim phrases he'd say all the time.
It left him gobsmacked. He tried to say something, 3 seconds of incoherent mumbling, and then he put out his hand and said he wished me all the best. He acknowledged at my leaving lunch that it would be hard to replace me. 
I moved to a building right across from my old workplace, and sometimes I have to go to his department for a meeting with engineers there, and end up meeting him. But he's been polite and cordial since (he got promoted).

Another bonus of being a Mustachian and ex-Boglehead is that at my current employer, I complained about our crappy 401k. The owners told me to write up a paper showing proof, which convinced them. Ended up moving the 401k to Guideline, reducing employer fees/costs by 77%.
@jinga nation I'd like to know how you determined what the employer fees/costs were on each plan.  Is there a specific document to find it on?  I ask because I want to convince my boss to change our SIMPLE IRA from Raymond James/MFS to Fidelity or somewhere similar.  RJ/MFS have taken away the sales charge when I buy my A shares each month, but the quarterly charges have increased to my account.  I have access to our company's books (I'm sort of HR, though someone else does the retirement contributions), and to the company's side of the retirement accounts.  I just need to know what to look for.

To note, I work on a family-owned farm, with a bunch of employees but my boss is my Dad, and the "other person" who handles retirement contributions is my Mom.  So, easy to access the information if I know what I'm looking for.  I've looked before, but they make it tricky to find such things.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: jinga nation on November 08, 2021, 06:59:34 AM
What I really want to know, what did your boss say when you told him you were quitting after all, a few weeks later?
He was a big fan of phrases/sayings, the midwesterner he was.
So I told him I wasn't impressed by his batting average.
And that a blind man could have been batting better than his attempts to get me anything bigger.
And that I had to take care of myself, my family, and my health (mental in this case).
^all 3 were verbatim phrases he'd say all the time.
It left him gobsmacked. He tried to say something, 3 seconds of incoherent mumbling, and then he put out his hand and said he wished me all the best. He acknowledged at my leaving lunch that it would be hard to replace me. 
I moved to a building right across from my old workplace, and sometimes I have to go to his department for a meeting with engineers there, and end up meeting him. But he's been polite and cordial since (he got promoted).

Another bonus of being a Mustachian and ex-Boglehead is that at my current employer, I complained about our crappy 401k. The owners told me to write up a paper showing proof, which convinced them. Ended up moving the 401k to Guideline, reducing employer fees/costs by 77%.
@jinga nation I'd like to know how you determined what the employer fees/costs were on each plan.  Is there a specific document to find it on?  I ask because I want to convince my boss to change our SIMPLE IRA from Raymond James/MFS to Fidelity or somewhere similar.  RJ/MFS have taken away the sales charge when I buy my A shares each month, but the quarterly charges have increased to my account.  I have access to our company's books (I'm sort of HR, though someone else does the retirement contributions), and to the company's side of the retirement accounts.  I just need to know what to look for.

To note, I work on a family-owned farm, with a bunch of employees but my boss is my Dad, and the "other person" who handles retirement contributions is my Mom.  So, easy to access the information if I know what I'm looking for.  I've looked before, but they make it tricky to find such things.

Asked my employer's plan admin to find out the 401k plan provider's annual plan admin fees, record keeping/admin/trustee/custodial activities, average investment expense ratio, annual advisor fee, advisory expenses, first year plan costs, loan/distribution fees, and find out which of these are employer paid and which are borne by employee. Use these to come up with a gross ER and effective annual per participant cost. And ask the same questions to the prospects.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Apples on November 08, 2021, 07:17:50 AM
What I really want to know, what did your boss say when you told him you were quitting after all, a few weeks later?
He was a big fan of phrases/sayings, the midwesterner he was.
So I told him I wasn't impressed by his batting average.
And that a blind man could have been batting better than his attempts to get me anything bigger.
And that I had to take care of myself, my family, and my health (mental in this case).
^all 3 were verbatim phrases he'd say all the time.
It left him gobsmacked. He tried to say something, 3 seconds of incoherent mumbling, and then he put out his hand and said he wished me all the best. He acknowledged at my leaving lunch that it would be hard to replace me. 
I moved to a building right across from my old workplace, and sometimes I have to go to his department for a meeting with engineers there, and end up meeting him. But he's been polite and cordial since (he got promoted).

Another bonus of being a Mustachian and ex-Boglehead is that at my current employer, I complained about our crappy 401k. The owners told me to write up a paper showing proof, which convinced them. Ended up moving the 401k to Guideline, reducing employer fees/costs by 77%.
@jinga nation I'd like to know how you determined what the employer fees/costs were on each plan.  Is there a specific document to find it on?  I ask because I want to convince my boss to change our SIMPLE IRA from Raymond James/MFS to Fidelity or somewhere similar.  RJ/MFS have taken away the sales charge when I buy my A shares each month, but the quarterly charges have increased to my account.  I have access to our company's books (I'm sort of HR, though someone else does the retirement contributions), and to the company's side of the retirement accounts.  I just need to know what to look for.

To note, I work on a family-owned farm, with a bunch of employees but my boss is my Dad, and the "other person" who handles retirement contributions is my Mom.  So, easy to access the information if I know what I'm looking for.  I've looked before, but they make it tricky to find such things.

Asked my employer's plan admin to find out the 401k plan provider's annual plan admin fees, record keeping/admin/trustee/custodial activities, average investment expense ratio, annual advisor fee, advisory expenses, first year plan costs, loan/distribution fees, and find out which of these are employer paid and which are borne by employee. Use these to come up with a gross ER and effective annual per participant cost. And ask the same questions to the prospects.

Thanks.  I was hoping most of this would be on some special form. Looks like I'll be digging for it.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: jinga nation on November 08, 2021, 07:52:24 AM
What I really want to know, what did your boss say when you told him you were quitting after all, a few weeks later?
He was a big fan of phrases/sayings, the midwesterner he was.
So I told him I wasn't impressed by his batting average.
And that a blind man could have been batting better than his attempts to get me anything bigger.
And that I had to take care of myself, my family, and my health (mental in this case).
^all 3 were verbatim phrases he'd say all the time.
It left him gobsmacked. He tried to say something, 3 seconds of incoherent mumbling, and then he put out his hand and said he wished me all the best. He acknowledged at my leaving lunch that it would be hard to replace me. 
I moved to a building right across from my old workplace, and sometimes I have to go to his department for a meeting with engineers there, and end up meeting him. But he's been polite and cordial since (he got promoted).

Another bonus of being a Mustachian and ex-Boglehead is that at my current employer, I complained about our crappy 401k. The owners told me to write up a paper showing proof, which convinced them. Ended up moving the 401k to Guideline, reducing employer fees/costs by 77%.
@jinga nation I'd like to know how you determined what the employer fees/costs were on each plan.  Is there a specific document to find it on?  I ask because I want to convince my boss to change our SIMPLE IRA from Raymond James/MFS to Fidelity or somewhere similar.  RJ/MFS have taken away the sales charge when I buy my A shares each month, but the quarterly charges have increased to my account.  I have access to our company's books (I'm sort of HR, though someone else does the retirement contributions), and to the company's side of the retirement accounts.  I just need to know what to look for.

To note, I work on a family-owned farm, with a bunch of employees but my boss is my Dad, and the "other person" who handles retirement contributions is my Mom.  So, easy to access the information if I know what I'm looking for.  I've looked before, but they make it tricky to find such things.

Asked my employer's plan admin to find out the 401k plan provider's annual plan admin fees, record keeping/admin/trustee/custodial activities, average investment expense ratio, annual advisor fee, advisory expenses, first year plan costs, loan/distribution fees, and find out which of these are employer paid and which are borne by employee. Use these to come up with a gross ER and effective annual per participant cost. And ask the same questions to the prospects.

Thanks.  I was hoping most of this would be on some special form. Looks like I'll be digging for it.

Had to do some digging, but found my post with the attachments: https://forum.mrmoneymustache.com/antimustachian-wall-of-shame-and-comedy/overheard-at-work-the-anti-antimustachian-edition/msg2522176/#msg2522176 (https://forum.mrmoneymustache.com/antimustachian-wall-of-shame-and-comedy/overheard-at-work-the-anti-antimustachian-edition/msg2522176/#msg2522176)
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: LennStar on November 08, 2021, 01:45:09 PM
saying I "won't believe how huge the raise is gonna be! :) " It later turned out that he had no idea what it would actually be LOL - compared to his grandiose promises, 10% seemed rather on the low side.
Now, did you believe what you saw when you saw it or not?
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: LetsRetireYoung on November 08, 2021, 03:15:48 PM
saying I "won't believe how huge the raise is gonna be! :) " It later turned out that he had no idea what it would actually be LOL - compared to his grandiose promises, 10% seemed rather on the low side.
Now, did you believe what you saw when you saw it or not?
hahahaha - I'd had a sneaking suspicion that I'd get screwed, so I'd intentionally let my hopes down. (I just wanted to see what it was that I'd spent so many years chasing, before I finally quit. Something to cross of my list, you know?) So yes, I definitely believed it when I saw that moving up by a whole new level was a measly 10% raise. Cheapskates. :P

I haven't stayed in touch with them, but I suspect they had to hire 2 people to replace me. Perhaps more. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ Getting 2-3 replacements has been the norm for me every time I switched teams or cities. Frupidity strikes again! ;)
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: TomTX on November 09, 2021, 07:00:15 AM
I'd like to know how you determined what the employer fees/costs were on each plan.  Is there a specific document to find it on?  I ask because I want to convince my boss to change our SIMPLE IRA from Raymond James/MFS to Fidelity or somewhere similar.  RJ/MFS have taken away the sales charge when I buy my A shares each month, but the quarterly charges have increased to my account.  I have access to our company's books (I'm sort of HR, though someone else does the retirement contributions), and to the company's side of the retirement accounts.  I just need to know what to look for.
Here you go.  $25 per participant per year, waived with $50k in assets.

https://investor.vanguard.com/small-business-retirement-plans/simple-ira
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Apples on November 09, 2021, 08:39:45 AM
thank you @jinga nation
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: saguaro on November 11, 2021, 09:14:54 AM
  Re informal references.... I worked at company A. Left there, was working at company B. Company B is hiring, and a guy from company A applies. The manager asked if I knew the guy. Yes, I did. Couldn't speak to his work. But I could speak to the restraining order that one of the women in that department had to take out against him.

Your actions have a way of following you.

Years ago, got a call asking for a reference for a guy that worked in our warehouse and left after a very short time, like 3-6 months.  I couldn't really say anything about his work since he was in the warehouse and I was in the office, completely different jobs.   When I explained this, the annoyed caller asked why then was I listed as a reference, apparently assuming I had agreed to be one.    I said "well, maybe because he had a massive crush on me, yeah that's probably it" which he did, he made no secret of it in spite of the fact I was married and the guys in the warehouse were telling him to cool it.   He didn't cross the line into restraining area territory though.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: accolay on November 22, 2021, 03:27:24 AM
I've read this entire thread over a few weeks and thought I'd add my own little story for those who need some more material. Not epic, but FU worthy: I had options because I had cash. Long winded and you know mostly how it ends.

I knew little to nothing about money in my formative years except that having money was better than not having money. I had a couple of really broke experiences early on while in the military which eventually developed me into a saver. Prior to my discharge I had manged to save about two years plus of expenses and was planning on it helping out while I was in school.

After discharge I worked in a Far Away Land under a travel work visa, returned state-side, took the summer off then moved to The Big City and worked menial jobs in the autumn. My expenses were low, I owned my car and had no debt. I lived with some roommates and ate meals at home etc. etc.

I was involved in a long distance relationship at the time and was saving up for another long vacation before I started school in the spring semester. The jobs I had payed for all my living expenses, the entire trip and then some so I wouldn't have to touch the savings. A part-time second job was in retail.

If you've worked retail you know that the end of the year is big sale times. Staff is really needed from before Thanksgiving to after Christmas when all the returns come back and people spend gift cards. The FU savings gave me the option to stop working for December. I'd thought I'd either quit or be fired but I wasn't going to be there regardless. The manager wasn't remotely happy when I told her but kept me on to work when I came back- good help is hard to find.

And I spent the holidays in a Far Away Land in the warm and sun while the retail job was in the Cold White North.

Having that cash gave me many opportunities until after I graduated. I cannot remember hardship from the frugality required to save but I will always remember the security and experiences the savings provided me.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: BicycleB on November 23, 2021, 02:52:59 PM
@accolay, sounds epic to me!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: jalich on November 29, 2021, 08:21:11 AM
Hi all, I have an unexpected contribution to this thread.

I've been targeting 2/22/2022 as my retirement date for at least 6 years now. The date is getting terrifyingly close and happens to neatly coincide with a major project some friends are starting and would like my help with. This project is something I am pretty excited to work on and will be out of state for maybe 3 weeks, completely immersed in it and having a good time to boot.

With that as my previously-unknown-to-my-workplace background, I was talking with my boss just before Thanksgiving about a new project he wants me to lead. As he's going thru the details, it's apparent to me that the project will be ramping up right as I'm planning on ramping down. While I'm quite certain work will continue just fine without me I don't want to purposefully make things any harder than I have to. Fully prepared and fully expecting to turn this conversation into a retirement conversation, I tell him I'm interested in the project (because I am) but I'll be taking an extended time to help some friends in the spring and that might be a wrinkle on me leading this project. I tell him it's pretty important to me to help my friends, I need a break, the work will be fun, I'm approaching burnout, etc.

He asks how long am I going to be out and I tell him 2-3 months - again fully expecting it to be a way to segue this conversation into retirement planning. Because I'm taking this time one way or another. He doesn't even blink and immediately says "OK, you should do it. We'll figure it out."

Well shit. One one hand, I now have 3 uninterrupted months of vacation to cover 3 weeks of fun-work and the rest to just decompress a bit. All while being paid. On the other hand I now have a mild case of OMY and don't know what's going to happen when I return to work and I didn't really solve the how-do-I-retire "problem". It's not really a problem, but the only reason I was able to politely say "I'm not asking, I'm telling"  is having enough saved to be OK no matter the outcome.

I can't imagine asking for this much time off even a few years ago as it feels transgressive and might put a bump in my career path... but at this point I absolutely do not care about those things. We finally have enough money for the time we have left, and I'm prioritizing time. I still plan on retiring in 2022, just maybe a bit later than planned. My wife's contract runs to 2023, so there's no critical time pressure until then.


:)



tl;dr - was planning on quitting/retiring, got 3 months paid vacation instead, and will sort the job when I return.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Dicey on November 29, 2021, 09:37:01 AM
Wow!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Rural on November 29, 2021, 01:13:41 PM
We finally have enough money for the time we have left, and I'm prioritizing time.


And this is how it's done. Good for you.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: DaMa on November 29, 2021, 07:30:13 PM
tl;dr - was planning on quitting/retiring, got 3 months paid vacation instead, and will sort the job when I return.

Epic indeed!  Congratulations!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Wolfpack Mustachian on November 29, 2021, 08:42:11 PM
tl;dr - was planning on quitting/retiring, got 3 months paid vacation instead, and will sort the job when I return.

This would also fit wonderfully under Mustachian People Problems :-). As they say, what a great problem to have!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: alcon835 on December 02, 2021, 06:27:55 AM
This. This is FU money!!!! Congratulations! That’s MASSIVE!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Fi(re) on the Farm on December 03, 2021, 09:20:27 AM
Not quite an FU story because I love my boss and my job but when the pandemic hit I started working from home. My daughter who's disabled also lost her day program.

We got through the lockdown pretty well but in October they told me I had to come back to work 5 days per 2 week pay period. My daughter is getting services 2 days a week for 2.5 hours each time. I told my boss I would be working from home 5 days a pay period and using up my vacation time the days I was required to be in (I'd be done by Dec. 31) I wasn't planning on retiring just yet but because of all the planning and saving I did it would be something I could easily do. 

Because I've got a ton of institutional knowledge my boss really didn't want to lose me so my supervisor's supervisor went to the big boss and I'm working from home most of the time and going in when my child has care. I like my co-workers so going in a couple of afternoons a week has been great but I also know that if they change their mind I'm good with that too.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Dicey on December 03, 2021, 09:27:32 AM
Not quite an FU story because I love my boss and my job but when the pandemic hit I started working from home. My daughter who's disabled also lost her day program.

We got through the lockdown pretty well but in October they told me I had to come back to work 5 days per 2 week pay period. My daughter is getting services 2 days a week for 2.5 hours each time. I told my boss I would be working from home 5 days a pay period and using up my vacation time the days I was required to be in (I'd be done by Dec. 31) I wasn't planning on retiring just yet but because of all the planning and saving I did it would be something I could easily do. 

Because I've got a ton of institutional knowledge my boss really didn't want to lose me so my supervisor's supervisor went to the big boss and I'm working from home most of the time and going in when my child has care. I like my co-workers so going in a couple of afternoons a week has been great but I also know that if they change their mind I'm good with that too.
Good for you! Glad they figured something out..
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: TheYeti on December 06, 2021, 09:33:24 AM
This is my favorite thread and I have read the entire thing over the last several months. I have a cautionary tale to add:

A decade or so ago in town far away I started a new job with EvilMegaCorp. This would be my 3rd company after college and I had 11 years’ experience at this point. I have always had exemplary reviews; I work hard and expect my compensation to match my effort. At EvilMegaCorp we manufactured very complex Widgets and I was a Manufacturing Engineer for them. I was hired to do job A for Boss A but 2 weeks after I start a guy in a critical position quit and I was asked to do Job B for Boss B. Let’s call Boss B “Brian”. My thought was ‘who am I to refuse a different position when I just walked in the door’ and perhaps this is good opportunity for me to show I am a team player….

Brian was just hired into his manager position after being a Manufacturing Engineer himself. Our relationship starts off innocently enough and we seem to get along. After a couple of months and HR finishes up the paper work for transferring me to Brian’s group, I get called into his office. Brian wants to verify that my listed Salary is correct. I verify that it is correct, then he tells me I am way overpaid for how long have been with EvilMegaCorp. I tell him that I have 11 years’ experience and that EvilMegaCorp hired me at this salary. He then proceeds to tell me the salary of everybody else on the team (this typically a management no no and a red flag). I was not the highest paid BTW, but I think my salary bothered him because I was likely making more than him. This was the point that everything changed….That year he gave me the lowest possible raise and I found out it was the lowest raise on the team. He screwed up and I saw the raise (in the system) prior to the performance review meeting. I was ready for him and asked him, why he screwed me over. I had performed better than most on the team and I had the metrics to prove it. He stammered and was taken aback by how prepared I was but it didn’t matter, raise was already in the books. He did not like being confronted and started a passive aggressive campaign to assassinate my character to management and anyone else that would listen. Comments in front of the team like, “I [Brian] have a question you might finally know: where is the gym reimbursement form located at?” He increased my workload, which as you know, can force you to overlook certain things. When mistakes were made, he jumped on them. Then I would make sure everything was perfect as possible but this would slow me down so I would get accused of not getting my work done, so I started working more hours…. You know how it goes. More poor performance reviews followed.

The straw that broke the camel’s back for me occurred when our plant was hurting for output in the 4th quarter and Brian volunteered me to review production part records before they shipped every morning, afternoon, and night. So I worked my normal 7am to 4:30pm. I would review the part records at 7am, 3pm, then at 9pm I had to log in from home and review as many parts that were listed to ship that evening. On Saturday and Sunday I would login 3 times per day and do it. This usually took about an hour each login. I was salaried so no extra compensation. This was only temporary though….. I had gotten approval for a vacation day, the day before Thanksgiving, it was my Birthday and DW had plans for us. Brian made sure to tell me that over my vacation and the holiday I had to login and review part records. On my vacation day I had to work 5 hours reviewing part records. Upon return on Monday I put down that I took a half day vacation to which Brian rejected my timesheet. I immediately went to his office and told him I worked 5 hours that day, 3 hours on Thanksgiving, 2 hours on Black Friday, then 3 hours on Saturday and Sunday. He said it didn’t matter. Since I had told him I would be on vacation on Wednesday, I needed to use 8 hours of vacation. I reinforced that he was an asshole and started my job search that day. I got an internal position elsewhere and apparently wasn’t the only one looking as 3 of us ended up leaving in the same week. They ended up replacing me with 2 engineers. I moved on to the next job with a great supervisor and began to succeed again. Promotions and raises were easy to come by again.

My Lessons:
1.   If you see red flags with your supervisor start a plan to get out. I came to EvilMegaCorp with a high level of confidence in my engineering abilities. If Brian had tried this crap right off the bat I hope that I would have recognized it and immediately jumped ship. As this happened over a longer period of time Brian slowly eroded my confidence, I was getting to a miserable place. Also I had never had a bad supervisor prior to Brian so I was under the impression that I could ‘turn this around’ and I stayed in that job longer than I should have.
2.   The boss that hires you has a vested interest in YOU being a success. I never should have agreed to work for Brian. I should have stayed with the guy that hired me to EvilMegaCorp. Brian used this against me on multiple occasions, “I [Brian] never hired him” He wanted to make it clear that he doesn’t make bad hiring decisions. Now, whenever my supervisor leaves and they just replace him/her, I update my resume. I want to work for the person that has picked me. If you work for a good/moral manager this is not an issue, but as you can see from this thread there’s a lot of jerks out there.
3.   Know your stash. I had FU money, but didn’t realize it and didn’t utilize it.
4.   Don’t work an extra 500 hours for an extra $500. This is company dependent but at many of the places I have worked the difference between the “average” raise and the “excellent” raise is 1%. The effort to get that extra 1% is crazy hard and requires too many hours, plus raises are too often handed out based on who is ‘liked’ rather than who deserves it.
5.   Without the bad there cannot be good. If I ran into Brian on the street today, was having a bad day and he made some stupid comment, I might be tempted to punch his face. Nevertheless, without him I would not have known how good the rest of my supervisors have been; how good the rest of my career has been. There is a part of me that is grateful to that Asshat, because now when I have a “bad” day, I reflect back and think of what really bad days are like. I realize how blessed I have been for the great coworkers, management, and people in my life. Life is good and I am grateful for that.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Dicey on December 06, 2021, 04:58:52 PM
Wow, that was a great (but shitty) story. I'm glad you escaped. You're a good writer, I hope you'll hang around the forum and share more stories.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: gooki on December 06, 2021, 06:26:43 PM
Brian sounds like a class A dick.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: rpr on December 06, 2021, 07:30:57 PM
@TheYeti -- great story and I liked your lesson number 2.
Title: Epic FU money stories
Post by: swaneesr on December 06, 2021, 08:00:31 PM
Wow. Thank you for sharing your wisdom. 

I too am an engineer for a MegaCorp. I have been in this role for nearly 25 years. Overall, I have been in a similar role for 32 years. I have never experienced a manager as bad as your “Brian”. I have had some managers better than others. I am also aware of a couple of “Brian’s” that others have suffered under.

Because of your articulate writing, many of us will know and be able to avoid the same problems or react faster.

Thank you for sharing.

I am out here commissioning a new production line. I really need to introduce myself and join the 2022 Cohort.

I come here for the wisdom and the face punches to combat my spendy pants nature……..

Swanee


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: TheYeti on December 08, 2021, 06:07:59 AM
A decade or so ago in town far away I started a new job with EvilMegaCorp. This would be my 3rd company after college and I had 11 years’ experience at this point. I have always had exemplary reviews; I work hard and expect my compensation to match my effort. At EvilMegaCorp we manufactured very complex Widgets and I was a Manufacturing Engineer for them. I was hired to do job A for Boss A but 2 weeks after I start a guy in a critical position quit and I was asked to do Job B for Boss B. Let’s call Boss B “Brian”.

Here is a quick add on story from working for the same supervisor:
We had a talented young female engineer “Bella” in our department. Brian told us in staff meeting that Bella was considering taking a different job and that she presently couldn’t be at the staff meeting as the Director of Engineering had come from out of town to try to convince her not to leave. Brian then explained that the Director had a “woman quota” to maintain. Just after he gets done explaining it, Bella walks into the meeting we are presently having. Brian then tells her that he was just talking behind her back and the Director was there to maintain the “woman quota”. Yeah she quit…
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: grantmeaname on December 08, 2021, 06:13:50 AM
what a colossal dickhead
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: mm1970 on December 08, 2021, 10:00:09 AM
A decade or so ago in town far away I started a new job with EvilMegaCorp. This would be my 3rd company after college and I had 11 years’ experience at this point. I have always had exemplary reviews; I work hard and expect my compensation to match my effort. At EvilMegaCorp we manufactured very complex Widgets and I was a Manufacturing Engineer for them. I was hired to do job A for Boss A but 2 weeks after I start a guy in a critical position quit and I was asked to do Job B for Boss B. Let’s call Boss B “Brian”.

Here is a quick add on story from working for the same supervisor:
We had a talented young female engineer “Bella” in our department. Brian told us in staff meeting that Bella was considering taking a different job and that she presently couldn’t be at the staff meeting as the Director of Engineering had come from out of town to try to convince her not to leave. Brian then explained that the Director had a “woman quota” to maintain. Just after he gets done explaining it, Bella walks into the meeting we are presently having. Brian then tells her that he was just talking behind her back and the Director was there to maintain the “woman quota”. Yeah she quit…
fuck that guy.

Signed, a female engineer who is tired of this shit.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: JGS1980 on December 08, 2021, 11:12:08 AM
A decade or so ago in town far away I started a new job with EvilMegaCorp. This would be my 3rd company after college and I had 11 years’ experience at this point. I have always had exemplary reviews; I work hard and expect my compensation to match my effort. At EvilMegaCorp we manufactured very complex Widgets and I was a Manufacturing Engineer for them. I was hired to do job A for Boss A but 2 weeks after I start a guy in a critical position quit and I was asked to do Job B for Boss B. Let’s call Boss B “Brian”.

Here is a quick add on story from working for the same supervisor:
We had a talented young female engineer “Bella” in our department. Brian told us in staff meeting that Bella was considering taking a different job and that she presently couldn’t be at the staff meeting as the Director of Engineering had come from out of town to try to convince her not to leave. Brian then explained that the Director had a “woman quota” to maintain. Just after he gets done explaining it, Bella walks into the meeting we are presently having. Brian then tells her that he was just talking behind her back and the Director was there to maintain the “woman quota”. Yeah she quit…
fuck that guy.

Signed, a female engineer who is tired of this shit.

Exactly! I love this forum
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: CodingHare on December 08, 2021, 11:40:56 AM
A decade or so ago in town far away I started a new job with EvilMegaCorp. This would be my 3rd company after college and I had 11 years’ experience at this point. I have always had exemplary reviews; I work hard and expect my compensation to match my effort. At EvilMegaCorp we manufactured very complex Widgets and I was a Manufacturing Engineer for them. I was hired to do job A for Boss A but 2 weeks after I start a guy in a critical position quit and I was asked to do Job B for Boss B. Let’s call Boss B “Brian”.

Here is a quick add on story from working for the same supervisor:
We had a talented young female engineer “Bella” in our department. Brian told us in staff meeting that Bella was considering taking a different job and that she presently couldn’t be at the staff meeting as the Director of Engineering had come from out of town to try to convince her not to leave. Brian then explained that the Director had a “woman quota” to maintain. Just after he gets done explaining it, Bella walks into the meeting we are presently having. Brian then tells her that he was just talking behind her back and the Director was there to maintain the “woman quota”. Yeah she quit…
fuck that guy.

Signed, a female engineer who is tired of this shit.
Sounds like Brian has a 'man quota' he wanted to keep.  Good on the engineer for quitting that sexist bullcrap.  Just wish someone had let the VP know so Brian could be fired.  Oh well, stuff like this is why I keep accumulating the stash.  ~Another female engineer
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: frugalnacho on December 08, 2021, 01:00:05 PM
glad to see this forum is meeting their women engineer quota.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: LennStar on December 08, 2021, 02:04:16 PM
glad to see this forum is meeting their women engineer quota.
I fear we might fall short of the male nurse quota though.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: jinga nation on December 08, 2021, 05:15:27 PM
glad to see this forum is meeting their women engineer quota.

I'm a male in IT/Tech/Engineering. When I hear stupid fake shit about women from a team lead/manager/leadership because of some make-believe stereotype, immediate red flag is raised, and I start looking for opportunities externally. Because this time it was women, next time it will about a minority, and it will go on. In my experience, HR does nothing, so time to bail. That FU Stash activation feels so good.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: former player on December 08, 2021, 05:33:59 PM
glad to see this forum is meeting their women engineer quota.
I fear we might fall short of the male nurse quota though.
There's at least one, Murse, and maybe some more?
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: jamaicaspanish on December 08, 2021, 06:54:19 PM
Manny checking in ...
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: jeninco on December 08, 2021, 07:36:52 PM
glad to see this forum is meeting their women engineer quota.

I'm a male in IT/Tech/Engineering. When I hear stupid fake shit about women from a team lead/manager/leadership because of some make-believe stereotype, immediate red flag is raised, and I start looking for opportunities externally. Because this time it was women, next time it will about a minority, and it will go on. In my experience, HR does nothing, so time to bail. That FU Stash activation feels so good.

IF you feel that you're in a position to do so, it would be super-cool if you would push back on that shit.

Because it's far more effective when a bro says "seriously dude? The 1950s called, and they want their sexism back" then when a woman says ... anything, because that makes her a bitchy bitch.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Freedomin5 on December 08, 2021, 11:06:23 PM
A decade or so ago in town far away I started a new job with EvilMegaCorp. This would be my 3rd company after college and I had 11 years’ experience at this point. I have always had exemplary reviews; I work hard and expect my compensation to match my effort. At EvilMegaCorp we manufactured very complex Widgets and I was a Manufacturing Engineer for them. I was hired to do job A for Boss A but 2 weeks after I start a guy in a critical position quit and I was asked to do Job B for Boss B. Let’s call Boss B “Brian”.

Here is a quick add on story from working for the same supervisor:
We had a talented young female engineer “Bella” in our department. Brian told us in staff meeting that Bella was considering taking a different job and that she presently couldn’t be at the staff meeting as the Director of Engineering had come from out of town to try to convince her not to leave. Brian then explained that the Director had a “woman quota” to maintain. Just after he gets done explaining it, Bella walks into the meeting we are presently having. Brian then tells her that he was just talking behind her back and the Director was there to maintain the “woman quota”. Yeah she quit…

Was Brian on the autism spectrum? Sounds like he is clueless when it comes to social awareness.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: LightTripper on December 09, 2021, 03:13:47 AM
People can actually be sexist dicks without being autistic (and vice versa :)   )
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: SwordGuy on December 09, 2021, 06:24:12 AM
People can actually be sexist dicks without being autistic (and vice versa :)   )

Absolutely!  The general name for Brian's mental disease is called "Bigotry", a more specific categorization would be "Misogyny".
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Weisass on December 09, 2021, 07:40:43 AM
People can actually be sexist dicks without being autistic (and vice versa :)   )

Absolutely!  The general name for Brian's mental disease is called "Bigotry", a more specific categorization would be "Misogyny".

Indeed, no need to smear neuro-divergent folks when the answer is simple: he’s an ass.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: jinga nation on December 09, 2021, 07:47:56 AM
glad to see this forum is meeting their women engineer quota.

I'm a male in IT/Tech/Engineering. When I hear stupid fake shit about women from a team lead/manager/leadership because of some make-believe stereotype, immediate red flag is raised, and I start looking for opportunities externally. Because this time it was women, next time it will about a minority, and it will go on. In my experience, HR does nothing, so time to bail. That FU Stash activation feels so good.

IF you feel that you're in a position to do so, it would be super-cool if you would push back on that shit.

Because it's far more effective when a bro says "seriously dude? The 1950s called, and they want their sexism back" then when a woman says ... anything, because that makes her a bitchy bitch.

My first full time engineering job in the mid-2000s, with the Engineering Ethics class from university still fresh in my mind, and having gone thru the various employer training, I called out a senior engineer during a meeting, as soon as he uttered ridiculous nonsense. He talked trash about 2 female engineers (who were my E-school classmates) and the Turkish change management lady. But the female CEO of that company didn't like my pushing back, and they never forgot. When we had layoffs, the 2 female engineers were fired in the first round and I got their work. A month later, they fired me for cause, for belittling a senior. IDGAF and had 6 months of emergency fund and had made local industry contacts.

Next workplace, my team lead and senior techs would call out others who said sexist and racist things, so I was part of a like-minded team. But our female manager wasn't a fan of our callouts as well as our refusal to put a blind eye on inspection fails and workplace safety violations. So our team got the least raises despite being critical to the company (no products could be certified without our department testing them for compliance and signing off). I was denied a promotion (had been verbally informed a month prior that I would be). Manager and her boss, a female director, openly said my minority was good at being frugal and thrifty, and said working with this company was a raise unto itself. HR didn't give a damn when I raised it, they said those were heat of the moment responses by management. I quit a couple of weeks later with a 30% more pay, a day after my 3 year stock vesting hit 100%.

It might seem super-cool to many when men stand up for women in the workplace, but we're the ones who get the shaft, financially and morally.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: jeninco on December 09, 2021, 08:56:35 AM
@jinga nation , thanks for trying, and I'm sorry it ended so poorly for you. Your managers were assholes, what can I say?

 I did say "if you feel that you're in a position to do so", because if the Bros don't speak up, how will this BS ever end?
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: SwordGuy on December 09, 2021, 08:59:50 AM
It might seem super-cool to many when men stand up for women in the workplace, but we're the ones who get the shaft TOO, financially and morally.

Fixed that for you.   Women and minorities were ALREADY getting the shaft.

And thanks for speaking up.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: RetiredAt63 on December 09, 2021, 09:38:09 AM
It might seem super-cool to many when men stand up for women in the workplace, but we're the ones who get the shaft TOO, financially and morally.

Fixed that for you.   Women and minorities were ALREADY getting the shaft.

And thanks for speaking up.

Yes, managers like that are just spreading the shafting around more evenly.

Same things applies in social situations, btw.  If you (any generic male) get negative feedback from standing up for a woman/minority, you can be sure they have already been getting negative treatment.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: jinga nation on December 09, 2021, 05:29:41 PM
@jeninco @SwordGuy yup, got to have that solidarity and resist the stupid management. They're going around with a caulk lube gun and a strap-on hunting for the next target, Elmer Fudd style.

[MOD NOTE: Okay, I realize we were already doing "shafting" before this, but maybe we could lay off the more literal, graphic sexual assault metaphors?  We do have a rule about this?  Thanks -  Toque]
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: swaneesr on December 09, 2021, 10:12:19 PM
@jinga nation , thanks for trying, and I'm sorry it ended so poorly for you. Your managers were assholes, what can I say?

 I did say "if you feel that you're in a position to do so", because if the Bros don't speak up, how will this BS ever end?
I am a senior engineer and in a position to speak up. We do not put up with any of that crap on my projects. High preforming teams are built on respect and trust. We call it out immediately. Sexism and bigotry can not be tolerated in any setting.

I guess I understand that my stash and position and the fact I could retire make speaking up easy for me.

Swanee


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: jinga nation on December 10, 2021, 07:29:23 AM
@jinga nation , thanks for trying, and I'm sorry it ended so poorly for you. Your managers were assholes, what can I say?

 I did say "if you feel that you're in a position to do so", because if the Bros don't speak up, how will this BS ever end?
I am a senior engineer and in a position to speak up. We do not put up with any of that crap on my projects. High preforming teams are built on respect and trust. We call it out immediately. Sexism and bigotry can not be tolerated in any setting.

I guess I understand that my stash and position and the fact I could retire make speaking up easy for me.

Swanee


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

Now that I'm a senior engineer and team lead, I do speak up. Fortunately, current and immediate previous employer take sexism/racism extremely seriously. But I have called out 2 numbnoggins for saying stupid shit; they were sub-contractors and their immediate supervisors made these two chucklefucks go for additional training.  Because if I didn't, the female gov employee, a Navy vet and disabled and minority, who sat next cube over, who heard these 2 muppets, was getting ready to make an official complaint. And if that had happened, shit would have hit the fan, everyone would have to go for mandatory training, projects would get impacted, and potential loss of contract and going into the agency's bad books (employers and personnel).
Their supervisors were thankful for me stepping in and nipping this at the bud.

But back to the topic of this thread: During the pandemic, I found out that a bunch of people who sit around me (Gov, Military, contractors) have emergency funds and FU money. We had deep discussions on investing strategies, lazy portfolios, index funds, and walking away from a toxic employer if need be. There's a couple of undercover millionaires, I'm so proud of all these non-MMM Mustachians.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Freedomin5 on December 10, 2021, 01:35:45 PM
People can actually be sexist dicks without being autistic (and vice versa :)   )

Absolutely!  The general name for Brian's mental disease is called "Bigotry", a more specific categorization would be "Misogyny".

Indeed, no need to smear neuro-divergent folks when the answer is simple: he’s an ass.

I was asking because it’s sad when people who genuinely did not know better because of something that’s not their fault get called names like “bigot”, “ass”, and “misogynistic” just because he lacks the ability to understand social cues and social conventions. The fact is, we don’t know why Brian said what he said, and even though what he said was inappropriate and unkind, calling him names is also unkind.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Psychstache on December 10, 2021, 01:38:37 PM
People can actually be sexist dicks without being autistic (and vice versa :)   )

Absolutely!  The general name for Brian's mental disease is called "Bigotry", a more specific categorization would be "Misogyny".

Indeed, no need to smear neuro-divergent folks when the answer is simple: he’s an ass.

I was asking because it’s sad when people who genuinely did not know better because of something that’s not their fault get called names like “bigot”, “ass”, and “misogynistic”. The fact is, we don’t know why Brian said what he said, and even though what he said was inappropriate and unkind, calling him names is also unkind.

Sure it's possible, but other examples from the story indicate Brian had enough social awareness to know how to throw OP under the bus at work to railroad him out. Internet diagnosis of "mysogynist asshat" seems to fit the available information.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: TheYeti on December 13, 2021, 07:15:38 AM
People can actually be sexist dicks without being autistic (and vice versa :)   )

Absolutely!  The general name for Brian's mental disease is called "Bigotry", a more specific categorization would be "Misogyny".

Indeed, no need to smear neuro-divergent folks when the answer is simple: he’s an ass.

I was asking because it’s sad when people who genuinely did not know better because of something that’s not their fault get called names like “bigot”, “ass”, and “misogynistic”. The fact is, we don’t know why Brian said what he said, and even though what he said was inappropriate and unkind, calling him names is also unkind.

Sure it's possible, but other examples from the story indicate Brian had enough social awareness to know how to throw OP under the bus at work to railroad him out. Internet diagnosis of "mysogynist asshat" seems to fit the available information.

Unchecked Arrogance is my opinion on Brian. Not only did he do what he did to Bella by acknowledging the “Woman Quote” but he also would pass out everyone’s salary data like it was Halloween Candy. These are both major HR violations, not to mention a way to really get the team gel…. Yet when people would complain to HR about it, nothing would happen. After one person in the group complained, there was no indication at all HR even talked to Brian about it. I spoke with Bella about the “woman quota” incident and told her that was not ok, she said she would tell HR on way out the door…. Another competent engineer gone. Beyond general common decency, EvilMegaCorp was major company so I know they had training for supervisors. Brian had to know he was not allowed to divulge this kind of information. Lack of oversight by HR/management and a culture that rewards this kind of arrogance is how it happens.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: former player on December 13, 2021, 07:25:59 AM
Part of longstanding patterns of discrimination is that straight white males don't get picked up on mistakes (like Brian disclosing confidential information) in circumstances where others who aren't straight white males do.   He can afford to be a shit because he is protected by that status, the fall-off rate for people without that status is high because one mistake derails their career.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: SwordGuy on December 13, 2021, 08:00:07 AM
Part of longstanding patterns of discrimination is that straight white males don't get picked up on mistakes (like Brian disclosing confidential information) in circumstances where others who aren't straight white males do.   He can afford to be a shit because he is protected by that status, the fall-off rate for people without that status is high because one mistake derails their career.

Just look at Brock Turner for an amazing example of the principle.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Sandi_k on December 13, 2021, 11:00:12 AM
Part of longstanding patterns of discrimination is that straight white males don't get picked up on mistakes (like Brian disclosing confidential information) in circumstances where others who aren't straight white males do.   He can afford to be a shit because he is protected by that status, the fall-off rate for people without that status is high because one mistake derails their career.

Just look at Brock Turner for an amazing example of the principle.

I'd rather not. ;)
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: JoePublic3.14 on December 14, 2021, 05:41:12 AM
Because if I didn't, the female gov employee, a Navy vet and disabled and minority, who sat next cube over, who heard these 2 muppets, was getting ready to make an official complaint. And if that had happened, shit would have hit the fan, everyone would have to go for mandatory training, projects would get impacted, and potential loss of contract and going into the agency's bad books (employers and personnel).


Here’s the part I don’t like and feel gets in the way of working to make continuous forward progress.

A lot of places have systems in place in an attempt to keep improving. If these systems aren’t used, how in the hell can anyone expect improvement? We all need to be accountable and act swiftly.

If there was a basis for an official complaint, then there should have been an official complaint filed. It is much easier to clean the shit when it is on the fan.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: former player on December 14, 2021, 05:51:16 AM
Because if I didn't, the female gov employee, a Navy vet and disabled and minority, who sat next cube over, who heard these 2 muppets, was getting ready to make an official complaint. And if that had happened, shit would have hit the fan, everyone would have to go for mandatory training, projects would get impacted, and potential loss of contract and going into the agency's bad books (employers and personnel).


Here’s the part I don’t like and feel gets in the way of working to make continuous forward progress.

A lot of places have systems in place in an attempt to keep improving. If these systems aren’t used, how in the hell can anyone expect improvement? We all need to be accountable and act swiftly.

If there was a basis for an official complaint, then there should have been an official complaint filed. It is much easier to clean the shit when it is on the fan.
I'm sure there are places of work where a complaint to the hierarchy about the way the hierarchy works is dealt with fairly and without adverse consequences to the complainant.  There just aren't very many, and those that there are tend to be in the public sector where 1) the hierarchy doesn't have money invested in the business and 2) there are outside pressures on standards and openness.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Petunia 100 on December 19, 2021, 06:49:01 PM

5.   Without the bad there cannot be good. If I ran into Brian on the street today, was having a bad day and he made some stupid comment, I might be tempted to punch his face. Nevertheless, without him I would not have known how good the rest of my supervisors have been; how good the rest of my career has been. There is a part of me that is grateful to that Asshat, because now when I have a “bad” day, I reflect back and think of what really bad days are like. I realize how blessed I have been for the great coworkers, management, and people in my life. Life is good and I am grateful for that.

If you ever do run into Brian, this is what you tell him.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Fresh Bread on December 19, 2021, 08:59:55 PM
... It is much easier to clean the shit when it is on the fan.

This is a terrible analogy! It would be really hard to clean.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: TomTX on December 20, 2021, 07:21:52 AM
... It is much easier to clean the shit when it is on the fan.

This is a terrible analogy! It would be really hard to clean.

Not as hard as if the fan was rotating and flung bits everywhere...
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: BlueHouse on December 20, 2021, 03:29:55 PM
Because if I didn't, the female gov employee, a Navy vet and disabled and minority, who sat next cube over, who heard these 2 muppets, was getting ready to make an official complaint. And if that had happened, shit would have hit the fan, everyone would have to go for mandatory training, projects would get impacted, and potential loss of contract and going into the agency's bad books (employers and personnel).


Here’s the part I don’t like and feel gets in the way of working to make continuous forward progress.

A lot of places have systems in place in an attempt to keep improving. If these systems aren’t used, how in the hell can anyone expect improvement? We all need to be accountable and act swiftly.

If there was a basis for an official complaint, then there should have been an official complaint filed. It is much easier to clean the shit when it is on the fan.
I'm sure there are places of work where a complaint to the hierarchy about the way the hierarchy works is dealt with fairly and without adverse consequences to the complainant.  There just aren't very many, and those that there are tend to be in the public sector where 1) the hierarchy doesn't have money invested in the business and 2) there are outside pressures on standards and openness.

I don't like the passage because it can sound as if the hero of the story is somehow blaming the person one cube over for forcing him to act as he was meant to in the first place.  I'm sure that wasn't jinganation's intent, but a story like this really doesn't need someone else to be the "reason" why a policy is enacted.  It doesn't need someone else to be "the asshole".  I think we're all meant to enforce these actions and not cry or complain about it when it's done so that *no one* is "the asshole".
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: jinga nation on December 27, 2021, 07:41:20 AM
I don't know if my situation is a FU money story or a MPP. (If y'all say MPP, I'll move it there.)

A couple of weeks ago, a cloud service provider (CSP) recruiter contacted me for a position. A relative works there. Had the 30 minute screening call (which was almost an hour) and it went well, which opened up a few different opportunities in different customer sectors due to my background and experience. I was to send my résumé to recruiter and they would let me know "as soon as possible". I asked them to clarify benefits, working hours, etc.

However, this was just before the holidays, so I didn't expect a reply. But it got me thinking. Do I really want this position? To have this big name company on my résumé, and for what? I've done stints are 3 other Fortune 500s where I was a just a small tooth on a cog, in an organization of hundreds of cogs. I talked to my relative, who explained the interview process, and how to prepare, etc.

The recruiter explained the benefits, said they were excellent for the industry. 10 days of time off for the first 3 years, use as you accrue, and 6 personal days, plus 7 public holidays. The base pay he mentioned was about $4k more than I get. But the real trade off is the stock (RSU). CSP is known for having a wrote in stone pay/RSU policy, there's no negotiating. They lock in your pay/RSU for 4 years.

Current small sized employer has a rule that as long as I bill customer 1800H/year, or 150H/month on average, I can take the rest of the time off. Since non-billable time is minimal, less than 8H/year, I get PTO of 5 weeks. Plus I get 10 public holidays (work in the DoD sector, so get President's Day, Veterans' Day, Columbus Day).

In essence, I'd be trading time off for stock and a few more work hours per week and increased travel (when the company lifts the work from home rule). New job would be 20-30% domestic flying around and 45H/week of billing.

I work for a good, small professional services company, we've become known for a niche specialty, our CEO and CTO are always working on new contracts/renewals and they have a technical background where the company culture is excellent. Lots of autonomy, I am a team/project lead, and help on other projects too, some proposals and proof-of-concepts.

Currently I work from home and travel to local customer site 2-3 days/week. I'm home by 4pm, drop my young kids for their sports training and go exercise. Help out kids with homework after dinner and help the wife cook/clean up the kitchen. No out of town travel away from family. Plus get to see my dad over dinner 2-3x/week when he joins us.

Wife and I have good pay, rental income from several condos, 2 homes (renovating one, then moving in, and selling the old one in this crazy  RE market), and retirement/brokerage accounts. We aren't in need of more money (and more stress) at the expense of a balanced work/life routine. My wife is looking at changing jobs to a less stressful and lesser hours gig.

We have FU money, we are technically FI, in the 2 comma club. We're already talking about me going FIRE in 12 years, when I turn 55 (because my job and industry is fun, because the people are fun). Wife probably will be retiring earlier. And we'll downsize. All this is in the IPS/long-term plan.

I don't need or want the CSP gig.

Thanks FU Money.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Adventine on December 27, 2021, 07:52:35 AM
@jinga nation  yeah, I'd say that's an enviable MPP!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Zamboni on December 27, 2021, 08:04:34 AM
Not quite an FU story because I love my boss and my job but when the pandemic hit I started working from home. My daughter who's disabled also lost her day program.

We got through the lockdown pretty well but in October they told me I had to come back to work 5 days per 2 week pay period. My daughter is getting services 2 days a week for 2.5 hours each time. I told my boss I would be working from home 5 days a pay period and using up my vacation time the days I was required to be in (I'd be done by Dec. 31) I wasn't planning on retiring just yet but because of all the planning and saving I did it would be something I could easily do. 

Because I've got a ton of institutional knowledge my boss really didn't want to lose me so my supervisor's supervisor went to the big boss and I'm working from home most of the time and going in when my child has care. I like my co-workers so going in a couple of afternoons a week has been great but I also know that if they change their mind I'm good with that too.

This is great! I'm really glad they decided to work with you . . . even though they only did it because it was their best option and probably not out of caring for you. Either way, it's a win for you and your daughter!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: BicycleB on December 28, 2021, 04:23:19 PM
I don't know if my situation is a FU money story or a MPP. (If y'all say MPP, I'll move it there.)

A couple of weeks ago, a cloud service provider (CSP) recruiter contacted me for a position. A relative works there. Had the 30 minute screening call (which was almost an hour) and it went well, which opened up a few different opportunities in different customer sectors due to my background and experience. I was to send my résumé to recruiter and they would let me know "as soon as possible". I asked them to clarify benefits, working hours, etc.

However, this was just before the holidays, so I didn't expect a reply. But it got me thinking. Do I really want this position? To have this big name company on my résumé, and for what? I've done stints are 3 other Fortune 500s where I was a just a small tooth on a cog, in an organization of hundreds of cogs. I talked to my relative, who explained the interview process, and how to prepare, etc.

The recruiter explained the benefits, said they were excellent for the industry. 10 days of time off for the first 3 years, use as you accrue, and 6 personal days, plus 7 public holidays. The base pay he mentioned was about $4k more than I get. But the real trade off is the stock (RSU). CSP is known for having a wrote in stone pay/RSU policy, there's no negotiating. They lock in your pay/RSU for 4 years.

Current small sized employer has a rule that as long as I bill customer 1800H/year, or 150H/month on average, I can take the rest of the time off. Since non-billable time is minimal, less than 8H/year, I get PTO of 5 weeks. Plus I get 10 public holidays (work in the DoD sector, so get President's Day, Veterans' Day, Columbus Day).

In essence, I'd be trading time off for stock and a few more work hours per week and increased travel (when the company lifts the work from home rule). New job would be 20-30% domestic flying around and 45H/week of billing.

I work for a good, small professional services company, we've become known for a niche specialty, our CEO and CTO are always working on new contracts/renewals and they have a technical background where the company culture is excellent. Lots of autonomy, I am a team/project lead, and help on other projects too, some proposals and proof-of-concepts.

Currently I work from home and travel to local customer site 2-3 days/week. I'm home by 4pm, drop my young kids for their sports training and go exercise. Help out kids with homework after dinner and help the wife cook/clean up the kitchen. No out of town travel away from family. Plus get to see my dad over dinner 2-3x/week when he joins us.

Wife and I have good pay, rental income from several condos, 2 homes (renovating one, then moving in, and selling the old one in this crazy  RE market), and retirement/brokerage accounts. We aren't in need of more money (and more stress) at the expense of a balanced work/life routine. My wife is looking at changing jobs to a less stressful and lesser hours gig.

We have FU money, we are technically FI, in the 2 comma club. We're already talking about me going FIRE in 12 years, when I turn 55 (because my job and industry is fun, because the people are fun). Wife probably will be retiring earlier. And we'll downsize. All this is in the IPS/long-term plan.

I don't need or want the CSP gig.

Thanks FU Money.

I applaud this quiet yet epic FU. Well done, @jinga nation!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Malossi792 on December 29, 2021, 01:09:39 PM
I don't know if my situation is a FU money story or a MPP. (If y'all say MPP, I'll move it there.)

https://images.app.goo.gl/VNkTZeHb8fBgbipz6
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: zolotiyeruki on December 30, 2021, 12:31:50 PM
Saw this one on Facebook: https://www.reddit.com/r/antiwork/comments/rn52k6/twas_the_night_before_my_resignation/

tl;dr:
Guy with FU money (henceforce GWFUM) is a key player in his organization, is the only person with his skills at the company, despite trying to get a backup.  Saves his vacation days so he can take the holidays off.  High-priority contract comes up in Dec, due by EOY.  Client waits two weeks to send required information.  GWFUM's boss tells GWFUM on Dec 21that the job must be done and that he (boss) has declined GWFUM's time off.  On top of that, HR department stands firm that days off are use-it-or-lose-it.

GWFUM resigns. 

Urgent Client is now facing hundreds of thousands of dollars in fines.  GWFUM's now-former employer is facing $10k's of penalties per day for not fulfilling their contracts (not just with Urgent Client, but other existing clients). GWFUM enjoys his holidays with his family.

GWFUM's post with images of the conversation via text got deleted by reddit's moderators, but someone on Facebook captured it first, and you can see it here: https://www.facebook.com/photo/?fbid=3113816372271449&set=pcb.3113816665604753
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: RyanAtTanagra on December 30, 2021, 01:21:19 PM
Glad someone saved the images, that was an entertaining read.  I like how furious he is over the loss of $X but won't pay him a fraction of $X to save it, out of pride.  Sure is expensive to be prideful.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Taran Wanderer on December 30, 2021, 03:20:14 PM
Wow. Just wow.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: kina on December 30, 2021, 03:24:53 PM
Priceless! Thanks for sharing!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: MissNancyPryor on December 30, 2021, 03:51:35 PM
I love this.  Totally passing it on. 

Interesting to note that the reddit poster made a specific choice to prioritize family after waking up to the reality of where a company's loyalty truly lies.  Did that mean they became a slacker on the job?  Nope, they became a "cornerstone" of the company.  Remember that any time someone says that those who do well in their careers are misguided or greedy capitalists -- you can live for the good of your family and pursue FIRE while being a kick ass employee.  In fact, being that kick ass employee can make FIRE happen faster than planned.  So many of us were awesome at what we did, and we left anyway.   
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Sibley on December 30, 2021, 04:14:53 PM
I suspect that company isn't going to be around much longer.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: SwordGuy on December 30, 2021, 04:15:43 PM
Glad someone saved the images, that was an entertaining read.  I like how furious he is over the loss of $X but won't pay him a fraction of $X to save it, out of pride.  Sure is expensive to be prideful.

It just goes to show that the power imbalance between management and employees has been so much in favor of employers for so long that many simply cannot grasp the idea of an employee refusing to do what they are told.

FU money is truly a wonderful thing.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Model96 on December 30, 2021, 04:22:43 PM
Saw this one on Facebook: https://www.reddit.com/r/antiwork/comments/rn52k6/twas_the_night_before_my_resignation/

tl;dr:
Guy with FU money (henceforce GWFUM) is a key player in his organization, is the only person with his skills at the company, despite trying to get a backup.  Saves his vacation days so he can take the holidays off.  High-priority contract comes up in Dec, due by EOY.  Client waits two weeks to send required information.  GWFUM's boss tells GWFUM on Dec 21that the job must be done and that he (boss) has declined GWFUM's time off.  On top of that, HR department stands firm that days off are use-it-or-lose-it.

GWFUM resigns. 

Urgent Client is now facing hundreds of thousands of dollars in fines.  GWFUM's now-former employer is facing $10k's of penalties per day for not fulfilling their contracts (not just with Urgent Client, but other existing clients). GWFUM enjoys his holidays with his family.

GWFUM's post with images of the conversation via text got deleted by reddit's moderators, but someone on Facebook captured it first, and you can see it here: https://www.facebook.com/photo/?fbid=3113816372271449&set=pcb.3113816665604753

Entertaining, but impossible to believe
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: MissNancyPryor on December 30, 2021, 04:53:02 PM
Saw this one on Facebook: https://www.reddit.com/r/antiwork/comments/rn52k6/twas_the_night_before_my_resignation/


Entertaining, but impossible to believe

I always say that about the "am I the asshole" reddit thread.  Seems like a lot of creative writing goes on there with the same themes coming up on rotation.  Still, I hope this one is real.  If it isn't I don't even care because I know there are people right here on this board who could totally pull this off, so it works for me. 
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: jinga nation on December 30, 2021, 05:12:55 PM
Found the GWFUM posts in the Reddit archives. Posting here so y'all don't have to track to Zuck's Muck:

Quote
Posted by iambeaker Submissions Comments at Thu, Dec 30, 2021 11:03 AM in antiwork
...There arose such a clatter, I sprang from my bed to see what was the matter.
https://www.reddit.com/r/antiwork/comments/rs554s/there_arose_such_a_clatter_i_sprang_from_my_bed/
0 Comments
Apologies for the delay in response... I had a personal matter which needed urgent attention. [I appreciate awards, but please save lives instead. In memory of my friend, who used to take 2 hour lunches with me.](https://diabetes.org/) Again, I appreciate all the messages of support, offers of help, and the spirited debate. I understand both sides of the business and I welcome all feedback. *Previously:* **Part 1:** [Twas The Night Before My Resignation](https://reddit.com/r/antiwork/comments/rn52k6/twas_the_night_before_my_resignation/) **Part 2:** [Not A Creature Was Stirring](https://reddit.com/r/antiwork/comments/rq0cmc/not_a_creature_was_stirring/) [Part 2 Text Conversation (Deleted due to Rule Violation)](https://imgur.com/a/UoGdpZI) **Previously:** Manager notified me I would need to work the week between Christmas and New Year's Day despite me having the week off approved (July). This determination was made in part to a government contractor (the client) facing a fine due to noncompliance as a result of an audit. Requests for data needed to bring the client into compliance were ignored until days before Christmas. I chose family over company and resigned the Monday after Christmas. Starting the Monday after Christmas, the manager begins to use different types of manipulation techniques and smear campaigns to change my mind. The company's CEO helps strong arm the process. During this time, a different client sends a corrupted file, and the department processes the file, causing an entire branch of reports to go down. The company is bound by a uptime clause in the contract, causing panic within the company. For every hour the reports are unresponsive, the company is fined (per report). I offer various solutions to help the company mediate the solution, but the offers are rejected. **Present Day:** Throughout the day, the manager and CEO send a barrage of texts and phone calls. One of my coworkers finds the documentation and fixes the reports. Later in the afternoon, he is served corrective action because he was accountable for processing the corrupted file and did not find the documentation faster. He tells me the manager, HR, and the CEO spent all night finding evidence to support the corrective action. I tell him to get his resume up to date. Total down time: 16 hours Around 3pm, I get a phone call from a new number. It was the client's business manager (the liaison between the former company and the client). I explained to her the delay of getting data until Christmas (despite multiple requests), the loss of a full week of PTO, the text messages/phone calls, and my offer to come back to help her company reach compliance. The business manager told me a different story. The manager and CEO called her earlier to inform her I quit and I am "stalling the project as ransom" in order to obtain more money. I explained how one could skew this view, but I am not actively seeking to return. After observing how the company treats their employees and after being treated post resignation, I have no interest in returning to the company. The business manager asks me what terms (rate, signing bonus, etc.) what I was seeking to return to my former company. She tells me she will call back in an hour and not respond to any more texts from the manager or CEO. **CEO Text:** Did the business manager call you? Did she give you a piece of her mind? **Manager Text:** I bet the business manager is going to make you personally pay for that fine! The business manager calls me back on a conference call and asks, "What do you need to finish this project? Software, data, tools, etc.?" I give her a list of everything I need. I answer other questions related to the project. She says, "Here's the plan. We are going to offer you a contract to finish this API for us by the end of the year for double the hourly rate you asked. If you can finish by 12/31, we will give you the signing bonus. After the New Year, we will see where we are staffing wise and maybe, we can find you a spot, but there is no guarantee, especially if you do not the project. Is that a deal?" I agree to the terms. I inform to put terms in writing and I can start as soon as IT gives me a virtual machine. The business manager says, "No problem, legal checked the contract and there is a clause stating if your former company is unable to perform a function which they agreed to do, we are able to outsource it to a third party and charge the company for it. I just need them to state they are unable to perform the API function, and we will bill them for your time." *TLDR;* The client is giving me a contract and billing my former company double my asking rate because the former company is unable to successfully execute a function by the deadline they agreed to in a contract.

The text message screenshots: https://imgur.com/a/UoGdpZI

BTW: everything on Reddit gets archived, even if the post is deleted and the user is deleted.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: JoePublic3.14 on December 30, 2021, 06:58:22 PM
Saw this one on Facebook: https://www.reddit.com/r/antiwork/comments/rn52k6/twas_the_night_before_my_resignation/

tl;dr:
Guy with FU money (henceforce GWFUM) is a key player in his organization, is the only person with his skills at the company, despite trying to get a backup.  Saves his vacation days so he can take the holidays off.  High-priority contract comes up in Dec, due by EOY.  Client waits two weeks to send required information.  GWFUM's boss tells GWFUM on Dec 21that the job must be done and that he (boss) has declined GWFUM's time off.  On top of that, HR department stands firm that days off are use-it-or-lose-it.

GWFUM resigns. 

Urgent Client is now facing hundreds of thousands of dollars in fines.  GWFUM's now-former employer is facing $10k's of penalties per day for not fulfilling their contracts (not just with Urgent Client, but other existing clients). GWFUM enjoys his holidays with his family.

GWFUM's post with images of the conversation via text got deleted by reddit's moderators, but someone on Facebook captured it first, and you can see it here: https://www.facebook.com/photo/?fbid=3113816372271449&set=pcb.3113816665604753

Entertaining, but impossible to believe

Yeah, some tough ones in there. If they were ‘friends' for whatever number of years, and the situation was so dire, the texts make no sense, pounding on GWFUM's front door would be believable.

But I also hope it is true…
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: SwordGuy on December 30, 2021, 07:04:27 PM
Saw this one on Facebook: https://www.reddit.com/r/antiwork/comments/rn52k6/twas_the_night_before_my_resignation/

tl;dr:
Guy with FU money (henceforce GWFUM) is a key player in his organization, is the only person with his skills at the company, despite trying to get a backup.  Saves his vacation days so he can take the holidays off.  High-priority contract comes up in Dec, due by EOY.  Client waits two weeks to send required information.  GWFUM's boss tells GWFUM on Dec 21that the job must be done and that he (boss) has declined GWFUM's time off.  On top of that, HR department stands firm that days off are use-it-or-lose-it.

GWFUM resigns. 

Urgent Client is now facing hundreds of thousands of dollars in fines.  GWFUM's now-former employer is facing $10k's of penalties per day for not fulfilling their contracts (not just with Urgent Client, but other existing clients). GWFUM enjoys his holidays with his family.

GWFUM's post with images of the conversation via text got deleted by reddit's moderators, but someone on Facebook captured it first, and you can see it here: https://www.facebook.com/photo/?fbid=3113816372271449&set=pcb.3113816665604753

Entertaining, but impossible to believe

Yeah, some tough ones in there. If they were ‘friends' for whatever number of years, and the situation was so dire, the texts make no sense, pounding on GWFUM's front door would be believable.

But I also hope it is true…

For some managers, 'friends' means "You did what I wanted and I didn't go out of my way to screw you over just for spite."    And nothing more.

I've seen equally stupid and myopic and self-centered behavior from some managers before.   AND even less rational all at the same time.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: JoePublic3.14 on December 30, 2021, 07:43:25 PM
Saw this one on Facebook: https://www.reddit.com/r/antiwork/comments/rn52k6/twas_the_night_before_my_resignation/

tl;dr:
Guy with FU money (henceforce GWFUM) is a key player in his organization, is the only person with his skills at the company, despite trying to get a backup.  Saves his vacation days so he can take the holidays off.  High-priority contract comes up in Dec, due by EOY.  Client waits two weeks to send required information.  GWFUM's boss tells GWFUM on Dec 21that the job must be done and that he (boss) has declined GWFUM's time off.  On top of that, HR department stands firm that days off are use-it-or-lose-it.

GWFUM resigns. 

Urgent Client is now facing hundreds of thousands of dollars in fines.  GWFUM's now-former employer is facing $10k's of penalties per day for not fulfilling their contracts (not just with Urgent Client, but other existing clients). GWFUM enjoys his holidays with his family.

GWFUM's post with images of the conversation via text got deleted by reddit's moderators, but someone on Facebook captured it first, and you can see it here: https://www.facebook.com/photo/?fbid=3113816372271449&set=pcb.3113816665604753

Entertaining, but impossible to believe

Yeah, some tough ones in there. If they were ‘friends' for whatever number of years, and the situation was so dire, the texts make no sense, pounding on GWFUM's front door would be believable.

But I also hope it is true…

For some managers, 'friends' means "You did what I wanted and I didn't go out of my way to screw you over just for spite."    And nothing more.

I've seen equally stupid and myopic and self-centered behavior from some managers before.   AND even less rational all at the same time.

Yeah, my point was that it seems likely the manager would know where the guy lived. Especially since the manager, or someone close to,the situation, had the wife’s cell number.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Model96 on December 30, 2021, 08:41:22 PM
I suspect that company isn't going to be around much longer.

That Company doesn't deserve to be around if it did indeed allow only one person to know such crucial operational information..
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: SwordGuy on December 30, 2021, 08:57:44 PM
I suspect that company isn't going to be around much longer.

That Company doesn't deserve to be around if it did indeed allow only one person to know such crucial operational information..

You might be surprised how often that scenario plays out in the tech world.   

And they totally mismanaged getting out of the mess, too.

Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: zolotiyeruki on December 30, 2021, 09:09:31 PM
Found the GWFUM posts in the Reddit archives. Posting here so y'all don't have to track to Zuck's Muck:

Quote
Posted by iambeaker Submissions Comments at Thu, Dec 30, 2021 11:03 AM in antiwork
...There arose such a clatter, I sprang from my bed to see what was the matter.
https://www.reddit.com/r/antiwork/comments/rs554s/there_arose_such_a_clatter_i_sprang_from_my_bed/
0 Comments
Apologies for the delay in response... I had a personal matter which needed urgent attention. [I appreciate awards, but please save lives instead. In memory of my friend, who used to take 2 hour lunches with me.](https://diabetes.org/) Again, I appreciate all the messages of support, offers of help, and the spirited debate. I understand both sides of the business and I welcome all feedback.
*Previously:*
**Part 1:** [Twas The Night Before My Resignation](https://reddit.com/r/antiwork/comments/rn52k6/twas_the_night_before_my_resignation/)
**Part 2:** [Not A Creature Was Stirring](https://reddit.com/r/antiwork/comments/rq0cmc/not_a_creature_was_stirring/) [Part 2 Text Conversation (Deleted due to Rule Violation)](https://imgur.com/a/UoGdpZI)
**Previously:** Manager notified me I would need to work the week between Christmas and New Year's Day despite me having the week off approved (July). This determination was made in part to a government contractor (the client) facing a fine due to noncompliance as a result of an audit. Requests for data needed to bring the client into compliance were ignored until days before Christmas. I chose family over company and resigned the Monday after Christmas. Starting the Monday after Christmas, the manager begins to use different types of manipulation techniques and smear campaigns to change my mind. The company's CEO helps strong arm the process. During this time, a different client sends a corrupted file, and the department processes the file, causing an entire branch of reports to go down. The company is bound by a uptime clause in the contract, causing panic within the company. For every hour the reports are unresponsive, the company is fined (per report). I offer various solutions to help the company mediate the solution, but the offers are rejected.
**Present Day:** Throughout the day, the manager and CEO send a barrage of texts and phone calls. One of my coworkers finds the documentation and fixes the reports. Later in the afternoon, he is served corrective action because he was accountable for processing the corrupted file and did not find the documentation faster. He tells me the manager, HR, and the CEO spent all night finding evidence to support the corrective action. I tell him to get his resume up to date. Total down time: 16 hours Around 3pm, I get a phone call from a new number. It was the client's business manager (the liaison between the former company and the client). I explained to her the delay of getting data until Christmas (despite multiple requests), the loss of a full week of PTO, the text messages/phone calls, and my offer to come back to help her company reach compliance. The business manager told me a different story. The manager and CEO called her earlier to inform her I quit and I am "stalling the project as ransom" in order to obtain more money. I explained how one could skew this view, but I am not actively seeking to return. After observing how the company treats their employees and after being treated post resignation, I have no interest in returning to the company. The business manager asks me what terms (rate, signing bonus, etc.) what I was seeking to return to my former company. She tells me she will call back in an hour and not respond to any more texts from the manager or CEO.
**CEO Text:** Did the business manager call you? Did she give you a piece of her mind?
**Manager Text:** I bet the business manager is going to make you personally pay for that fine! The business manager calls me back on a conference call and asks, "What do you need to finish this project? Software, data, tools, etc.?" I give her a list of everything I need. I answer other questions related to the project. She says, "Here's the plan. We are going to offer you a contract to finish this API for us by the end of the year for double the hourly rate you asked. If you can finish by 12/31, we will give you the signing bonus. After the New Year, we will see where we are staffing wise and maybe, we can find you a spot, but there is no guarantee, especially if you do not the project. Is that a deal?" I agree to the terms. I inform to put terms in writing and I can start as soon as IT gives me a virtual machine. The business manager says, "No problem, legal checked the contract and there is a clause stating if your former company is unable to perform a function which they agreed to do, we are able to outsource it to a third party and charge the company for it. I just need them to state they are unable to perform the API function, and we will bill them for your time."

*TLDR;* The client is giving me a contract and billing my former company double my asking rate because the former company is unable to successfully execute a function by the deadline they agreed to in a contract.

The text message screenshots: https://imgur.com/a/UoGdpZI

BTW: everything on Reddit gets archived, even if the post is deleted and the user is deleted.
Thanks for posting that, as the user's account has been deleted.  I suspect some legal wranglings are in process...
(is there a way to view deleted posts?)
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: ysette9 on December 30, 2021, 09:45:40 PM
That truly was epic. Damn.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: gooki on December 30, 2021, 11:14:53 PM
That was great. Thanks for sharing.

One of my favorite phone features is being able to block numbers. If any work college calls me after hours with something that isn't truly urgent they get blocked right away. I ended up blocking a couple of consultants and a director.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: NorthernIkigai on December 31, 2021, 12:26:05 AM
So… API person with FU money ended up working between Christmas and New Year anyway, on the same project, except now directly for the client and for more money and with no guarantee of a future job. While I agree that the original employer deserves everything they got (and more), this doesn’t quite feel like the win it felt like before this last update. I thought the point was to relax with the family?
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: 2sk22 on December 31, 2021, 03:20:01 AM
I don't know if my situation is a FU money story or a MPP. (If y'all say MPP, I'll move it there.)

A couple of weeks ago, a cloud service provider (CSP) recruiter contacted me for a position. A relative works there. Had the 30 minute screening call (which was almost an hour) and it went well, which opened up a few different opportunities in different customer sectors due to my background and experience. I was to send my résumé to recruiter and they would let me know "as soon as possible". I asked them to clarify benefits, working hours, etc.
...
Wife and I have good pay, rental income from several condos, 2 homes (renovating one, then moving in, and selling the old one in this crazy  RE market), and retirement/brokerage accounts. We aren't in need of more money (and more stress) at the expense of a balanced work/life routine. My wife is looking at changing jobs to a less stressful and lesser hours gig.

We have FU money, we are technically FI, in the 2 comma club. We're already talking about me going FIRE in 12 years, when I turn 55 (because my job and industry is fun, because the people are fun). Wife probably will be retiring earlier. And we'll downsize. All this is in the IPS/long-term plan.

I don't need or want the CSP gig.

Thanks FU Money.

Since I worked in the field, I have a pretty good idea who this CSP is :-) But in any case, I really approve of your thought process. I was also heavily recruited by (very likely) the same CSP and I turned them down too. You have a good work-life balance and your situation looks good so I think you made the right decision.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: 2sk22 on December 31, 2021, 03:25:07 AM
I suspect that company isn't going to be around much longer.

That Company doesn't deserve to be around if it did indeed allow only one person to know such crucial operational information..

You might be surprised how often that scenario plays out in the tech world.   

And they totally mismanaged getting out of the mess, too.

You are absolutely right about this! When I quit a mega company in 2019, there was considerable panic since I was the only one who knew how a critical subsystem of a big product worked. Mind you, I had been offering for months to train other people with no takers.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: JoePublic3.14 on December 31, 2021, 06:50:15 AM
That was great. Thanks for sharing.

One of my favorite phone features is being able to block numbers. If any work college calls me after hours with something that isn't truly urgent they get blocked right away. I ended up blocking a couple of consultants and a director.

That’s awesome! I love that policy.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Zamboni on December 31, 2021, 08:26:12 AM
That was great. Thanks for sharing.

One of my favorite phone features is being able to block numbers. If any work college calls me after hours with something that isn't truly urgent they get blocked right away. I ended up blocking a couple of consultants and a director.

Do you know what happens when they try to call you again after you block them? Does it just ring and ring until they give up? Does it just not connect to anything? Or does it give them some msg about the number being unavailable?
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Malossi792 on December 31, 2021, 08:57:23 AM
That was great. Thanks for sharing.

One of my favorite phone features is being able to block numbers. If any work college calls me after hours with something that isn't truly urgent they get blocked right away. I ended up blocking a couple of consultants and a director.

Do you know what happens when they try to call you again after you block them? Does it just ring and ring until they give up? Does it just not connect to anything? Or does it give them some msg about the number being unavailable?
It's like when your phone is turned off, at least for me. You can always try with someone sitting next to you (don't forget to unblock them later).
Great feature for peace of mind.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: ysette9 on December 31, 2021, 09:15:20 AM
On thé iPhone it is Do Not Disturb in the settings. You set the hours when you don’t want notifications and any call doesn’t vibrate or ring. It might go straight to voicemail; I’m not sure there. Only people on your Favorites list can get through. I think if the same number calls you three times in a row it will get through on the last try.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Turtle on December 31, 2021, 09:31:38 AM
As far as working during Twixtmas week after all; GWFUM got to work from home, around the family schedule, rather than in the office with the attendant risks and distractions so probably still got family time in addition to much more money and appreciation.

I can totally believe that pointy haired boss couldn't read the documentation but one of the coworkers could.  My guess is that coworker may even have volunteered to be back up but been told there was no time for training.  Seems to fit with my experiences and the rest of the story.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Sibley on December 31, 2021, 09:49:04 AM
I suspect that company isn't going to be around much longer.

That Company doesn't deserve to be around if it did indeed allow only one person to know such crucial operational information..

You might be surprised how often that scenario plays out in the tech world.   

And they totally mismanaged getting out of the mess, too.

I'm an auditor. I'm well aware. I've also seen plenty of them go out of business, or survive in a greatly reduced fashion.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: gooki on December 31, 2021, 12:50:17 PM
That was great. Thanks for sharing.

One of my favorite phone features is being able to block numbers. If any work college calls me after hours with something that isn't truly urgent they get blocked right away. I ended up blocking a couple of consultants and a director.

Do you know what happens when they try to call you again after you block them? Does it just ring and ring until they give up? Does it just not connect to anything? Or does it give them some msg about the number being unavailable?
It's like when your phone is turned off, at least for me. You can always try with someone sitting next to you (don't forget to unblock them later).
Great feature for peace of mind.

This. And I don't have voicemail setup. The director asked me about it and I just shrugged and mumbled something and networks. I should have been more direct and just said I don't accept non emergency work calls after-hours. But I'm not comfortable with confrontation.

On thé iPhone it is Do Not Disturb in the settings. You set the hours when you don’t want notifications and any call doesn’t vibrate or ring. It might go straight to voicemail; I’m not sure there. Only people on your Favorites list can get through. I think if the same number calls you three times in a row it will get through on the last try.

Blocking a number is more intense than setting do not disturb. Once blocked your phone doesn't even notify you of the call, and they can never get through no matter how many times they try until you unblock the number.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: jinga nation on December 31, 2021, 04:41:07 PM
(is there a way to view deleted posts?)
Example for this GWFUM:
https://camas.github.io/reddit-search/#{%22subreddit%22:%22antiwork%22,%22resultSize%22:100,%22query%22:%22twas%22}
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Malossi792 on January 01, 2022, 07:14:35 AM
Oh Do not disturb!
Another favourite of mine. In fact, it has been continuously turned on for about 10 days now. You get to decide whose calls come through (close family members only for me), for everything else it's muted. You get the notification, other party hears your ,,phone ringing" until they get bored with you not picking up. I use it every night off, too (or just shut the phone off entirely).
Blocking a number for good is reserved for the biggest jerks in my life, usually colleagues who I have to tolerate in the workplace but just won't in my free time.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Warlord1986 on January 01, 2022, 12:34:19 PM
Can you share more details about how your Executive Director reacted when she found out you gave notice?  The story doesn't need it...I'm just a nosy Nellie!

I'd like to know as well.

Great job.

Thanks y’all!

She wasn’t used to people telling her no, so when I refused her kind offer of doing two jobs for the pay of one, she threatened me and left to go to a meeting with the other top brass in the organization. I emailed the other top brass my two weeks notice, so they got it while in that meeting (and I know HR was checking email) so the whole meeting got my message and my explanation of why I was leaving. This meant she had 100% turnover in a year. She came back and slammed her office door. She spent the next two weeks not speaking to me, and leaving me out of office activities. I kid you not, she called her administration assistant and my outgoing supervisor into an office and slammed the door in my face. I heard them giggling behind the door.

I documented everything, the anti-Catholic bigotry, the bullying, name-calling, vulgarity (she called other women cooters), the retaliation, and the overall office environment she created and encouraged (my supervisor was fond of screaming about Goddamn straight white men and there Goddamn penisis, but she was another nightmare altogether. Screaming at me in front of colleagues, public tantrums, insulting project manager’s projects, slamming things on her desk, and lying). Everyone on campus had a story about this woman and everyone knew how she got her first admin assistant fired (and then laughed when she heard the woman was driving Uber to make ends meet. I really can’t get over that). While I was documenting stuff, I also told all my fellow Catholics, and all the other religious minority colleagues, about her comments. Her job strongly relies on having good relationships with colleagues and the community. Several people stopped volunteering at her events. Partly because she was fond of screaming fits, partly because who wants to work with a bigot?

I have it on good authority that HR and the College President were not happy about her behavior and some disciplinary action was taken. She’s still working there. She said she hated it multiple times, but whenever she came into the deli where I worked she made a point to wear brand new Lily Pulitzer. And to be rude to other customers. Who are often very wealthy and influential people in the community.

And that’s why I left before I found a full time job.

Just an update on how things turned out.

I am now working full time at the library and have been since March of 2020. The pay isn't much, but my coworkers are kind and respectful, and I genuinely like them as people. My leadership is the same, and has taken every opportunity to be supportive. I produced a series of video recordings featuring leaders of different religions that was one of our most popular programs during 2020. I consider it a highlight of my career. I've since produced several book talks, my most recent one being on books about the Holy Land. I partnered with a Jewish coworker who had visited the Holy Land and could offer a second perspective. That turned out really well and I'm pretty proud of that project.

Like I said, the pay isn't much, so I got a housemate. This saved me more than $500 a month, which I tossed in my Roth IRA. I fully funded that last year. My housemate is a lovely human, and I'm really glad I got to know her better. She's getting married in Feb. and I'm invited to the wedding.

I started a side hustle offering writing/editing services. I love it, and it brings in some extra money. I'm hoping that when I am ready to move on, I'll be able to use that to segue into a higher paying job, perhaps in technical writing.

My savings/investments total over $120,000. I'm proud of that.

The ED I used to work for was recently managed out. I have to admit, it is cathartic to know someone realized her behavior was inappropriate and disgusting. I've spent years trying to forgive both of those women. It's an uphill battle.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: bmjohnson35 on January 01, 2022, 10:41:09 PM
Found the GWFUM posts in the Reddit archives. Posting here so y'all don't have to track to Zuck's Muck:

Quote
Posted by iambeaker Submissions Comments at Thu, Dec 30, 2021 11:03 AM in antiwork
...There arose such a clatter, I sprang from my bed to see what was the matter.
https://www.reddit.com/r/antiwork/comments/rs554s/there_arose_such_a_clatter_i_sprang_from_my_bed/
0 Comments
Apologies for the delay in response... I had a personal matter which needed urgent attention. [I appreciate awards, but please save lives instead. In memory of my friend, who used to take 2 hour lunches with me.](https://diabetes.org/) Again, I appreciate all the messages of support, offers of help, and the spirited debate. I understand both sides of the business and I welcome all feedback. *Previously:* **Part 1:** [Twas The Night Before My Resignation](https://reddit.com/r/antiwork/comments/rn52k6/twas_the_night_before_my_resignation/) **Part 2:** [Not A Creature Was Stirring](https://reddit.com/r/antiwork/comments/rq0cmc/not_a_creature_was_stirring/) [Part 2 Text Conversation (Deleted due to Rule Violation)](https://imgur.com/a/UoGdpZI) **Previously:** Manager notified me I would need to work the week between Christmas and New Year's Day despite me having the week off approved (July). This determination was made in part to a government contractor (the client) facing a fine due to noncompliance as a result of an audit. Requests for data needed to bring the client into compliance were ignored until days before Christmas. I chose family over company and resigned the Monday after Christmas. Starting the Monday after Christmas, the manager begins to use different types of manipulation techniques and smear campaigns to change my mind. The company's CEO helps strong arm the process. During this time, a different client sends a corrupted file, and the department processes the file, causing an entire branch of reports to go down. The company is bound by a uptime clause in the contract, causing panic within the company. For every hour the reports are unresponsive, the company is fined (per report). I offer various solutions to help the company mediate the solution, but the offers are rejected. **Present Day:** Throughout the day, the manager and CEO send a barrage of texts and phone calls. One of my coworkers finds the documentation and fixes the reports. Later in the afternoon, he is served corrective action because he was accountable for processing the corrupted file and did not find the documentation faster. He tells me the manager, HR, and the CEO spent all night finding evidence to support the corrective action. I tell him to get his resume up to date. Total down time: 16 hours Around 3pm, I get a phone call from a new number. It was the client's business manager (the liaison between the former company and the client). I explained to her the delay of getting data until Christmas (despite multiple requests), the loss of a full week of PTO, the text messages/phone calls, and my offer to come back to help her company reach compliance. The business manager told me a different story. The manager and CEO called her earlier to inform her I quit and I am "stalling the project as ransom" in order to obtain more money. I explained how one could skew this view, but I am not actively seeking to return. After observing how the company treats their employees and after being treated post resignation, I have no interest in returning to the company. The business manager asks me what terms (rate, signing bonus, etc.) what I was seeking to return to my former company. She tells me she will call back in an hour and not respond to any more texts from the manager or CEO. **CEO Text:** Did the business manager call you? Did she give you a piece of her mind? **Manager Text:** I bet the business manager is going to make you personally pay for that fine! The business manager calls me back on a conference call and asks, "What do you need to finish this project? Software, data, tools, etc.?" I give her a list of everything I need. I answer other questions related to the project. She says, "Here's the plan. We are going to offer you a contract to finish this API for us by the end of the year for double the hourly rate you asked. If you can finish by 12/31, we will give you the signing bonus. After the New Year, we will see where we are staffing wise and maybe, we can find you a spot, but there is no guarantee, especially if you do not the project. Is that a deal?" I agree to the terms. I inform to put terms in writing and I can start as soon as IT gives me a virtual machine. The business manager says, "No problem, legal checked the contract and there is a clause stating if your former company is unable to perform a function which they agreed to do, we are able to outsource it to a third party and charge the company for it. I just need them to state they are unable to perform the API function, and we will bill them for your time." *TLDR;* The client is giving me a contract and billing my former company double my asking rate because the former company is unable to successfully execute a function by the deadline they agreed to in a contract.

The text message screenshots: https://imgur.com/a/UoGdpZI

BTW: everything on Reddit gets archived, even if the post is deleted and the user is deleted.

If this is real and not a work of fiction or at least embellished, it's a truly an Epic FU story.  I have seen first hand how companies can come to rely on a single person for critical technical knowledge and I have also seen examples where management and/or HR can be incredibley arrogant and prideful.  I can also easily see them absorbing those huge fines and unwilling to meet the employees demands, despite their situation.  It's crazy how companies will pay a failure of a CEO millions to just leave, yet can't wrap their head around paying someone in the lower ranks the money he was asking of them.   
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: SwordGuy on January 02, 2022, 06:18:37 AM

If this is real and not a work of fiction or at least embellished, it's a truly an Epic FU story.  I have seen first hand how companies can come to rely on a single person for critical technical knowledge and I have also seen examples where management and/or HR can be incredibley arrogant and prideful.  I can also easily see them absorbing those huge fines and unwilling to meet the employees demands, despite their situation.  It's crazy how companies will pay a failure of a CEO millions to just leave, yet can't wrap their head around paying someone in the lower ranks the money he was asking of them.

Or even treating them with basic human respect...

The clincher is writing up the programmer who did manage to make stuff work in order to cover their butts.   How's that for completely demoralizing an entire department?  No one's ever going to step up again while those two managers are in charge.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: bmjohnson35 on January 02, 2022, 09:09:54 AM

If this is real and not a work of fiction or at least embellished, it's a truly an Epic FU story.  I have seen first hand how companies can come to rely on a single person for critical technical knowledge and I have also seen examples where management and/or HR can be incredibley arrogant and prideful.  I can also easily see them absorbing those huge fines and unwilling to meet the employees demands, despite their situation.  It's crazy how companies will pay a failure of a CEO millions to just leave, yet can't wrap their head around paying someone in the lower ranks the money he was asking of them.

Or even treating them with basic human respect...

The clincher is writing up the programmer who did manage to make stuff work in order to cover their butts.   How's that for completely demoralizing an entire department?  No one's ever going to step up again while those two managers are in charge.

Agreed. This is probably the most unbelievable part of the story.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: JLee on January 02, 2022, 09:15:15 AM

If this is real and not a work of fiction or at least embellished, it's a truly an Epic FU story.  I have seen first hand how companies can come to rely on a single person for critical technical knowledge and I have also seen examples where management and/or HR can be incredibley arrogant and prideful.  I can also easily see them absorbing those huge fines and unwilling to meet the employees demands, despite their situation.  It's crazy how companies will pay a failure of a CEO millions to just leave, yet can't wrap their head around paying someone in the lower ranks the money he was asking of them.

Or even treating them with basic human respect...

The clincher is writing up the programmer who did manage to make stuff work in order to cover their butts.   How's that for completely demoralizing an entire department?  No one's ever going to step up again while those two managers are in charge.

Agreed. This is probably the most unbelievable part of the story.

I'd believe it.  I was in a meeting last year where my boss's boss's boss told our entire department that it's management's opinion that the real work happens in the office, and the IT department hadn't been in the office.  For context, we were not allowed to go into the office due to the established COVID protocols -- and we had built the entire remote work system/infrastructure (that kept the company functioning) from scratch with no advance notice (they were telling us on a Wednesday it would never happen and then decided WFH was happening on Friday).

So, I don't work there anymore -- and neither do a significant percentage of other senior employees.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Proud Foot on January 02, 2022, 10:41:28 AM

If this is real and not a work of fiction or at least embellished, it's a truly an Epic FU story.  I have seen first hand how companies can come to rely on a single person for critical technical knowledge and I have also seen examples where management and/or HR can be incredibley arrogant and prideful.  I can also easily see them absorbing those huge fines and unwilling to meet the employees demands, despite their situation.  It's crazy how companies will pay a failure of a CEO millions to just leave, yet can't wrap their head around paying someone in the lower ranks the money he was asking of them.

Or even treating them with basic human respect...

The clincher is writing up the programmer who did manage to make stuff work in order to cover their butts.   How's that for completely demoralizing an entire department?  No one's ever going to step up again while those two managers are in charge.

Agreed. This is probably the most unbelievable part of the story.

I would believe it. I know someone who was let go of their job because they didn't "follow proper protocol" in firing an employee. This person had all the documented everything to protect the company from unlawful termination, discrimination, or any other claim the fired employee might try to claim. The person I know was let go because it was not done in the specific HR approved manner.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: SwordGuy on January 02, 2022, 11:36:08 AM

If this is real and not a work of fiction or at least embellished, it's a truly an Epic FU story.  I have seen first hand how companies can come to rely on a single person for critical technical knowledge and I have also seen examples where management and/or HR can be incredibley arrogant and prideful.  I can also easily see them absorbing those huge fines and unwilling to meet the employees demands, despite their situation.  It's crazy how companies will pay a failure of a CEO millions to just leave, yet can't wrap their head around paying someone in the lower ranks the money he was asking of them.

Or even treating them with basic human respect...

The clincher is writing up the programmer who did manage to make stuff work in order to cover their butts.   How's that for completely demoralizing an entire department?  No one's ever going to step up again while those two managers are in charge.

Agreed. This is probably the most unbelievable part of the story.

I worked with a manager who intentionally drove out anyone competent in her department.   She was a totally unqualified imposter who feared that anyone good might replace her, so she made sure no one in her department was competition. 

She would have thrown any of her employees under the bus to save her skin if she thought she could get away with it.

There are gobs of stories out there about managers whose most important goal is to look good to upper management no matter who they have to screw over to do so.   So, since someone is clearly at fault when the company is paying huge sums of money in penalties, who is that going to be:

1) managers who allowed a single point of failure -- they don't want THIS option chosen,
2) managers whose mismanagement caused a key employee to quit -- they don't want THIS option chosen either,
3) managers who had their disgruntled employee properly document what has to be done and the only reason that things aren't done right is another employee failed...   Yep, that's what they want.  No fault for them here.


Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: mm1970 on January 03, 2022, 10:56:28 AM
That was very entertaining, and unfortunately, believable.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: rockstache on January 04, 2022, 10:35:05 AM
Can you share more details about how your Executive Director reacted when she found out you gave notice?  The story doesn't need it...I'm just a nosy Nellie!

I'd like to know as well.

Great job.

Thanks y’all!

She wasn’t used to people telling her no, so when I refused her kind offer of doing two jobs for the pay of one, she threatened me and left to go to a meeting with the other top brass in the organization. I emailed the other top brass my two weeks notice, so they got it while in that meeting (and I know HR was checking email) so the whole meeting got my message and my explanation of why I was leaving. This meant she had 100% turnover in a year. She came back and slammed her office door. She spent the next two weeks not speaking to me, and leaving me out of office activities. I kid you not, she called her administration assistant and my outgoing supervisor into an office and slammed the door in my face. I heard them giggling behind the door.

I documented everything, the anti-Catholic bigotry, the bullying, name-calling, vulgarity (she called other women cooters), the retaliation, and the overall office environment she created and encouraged (my supervisor was fond of screaming about Goddamn straight white men and there Goddamn penisis, but she was another nightmare altogether. Screaming at me in front of colleagues, public tantrums, insulting project manager’s projects, slamming things on her desk, and lying). Everyone on campus had a story about this woman and everyone knew how she got her first admin assistant fired (and then laughed when she heard the woman was driving Uber to make ends meet. I really can’t get over that). While I was documenting stuff, I also told all my fellow Catholics, and all the other religious minority colleagues, about her comments. Her job strongly relies on having good relationships with colleagues and the community. Several people stopped volunteering at her events. Partly because she was fond of screaming fits, partly because who wants to work with a bigot?

I have it on good authority that HR and the College President were not happy about her behavior and some disciplinary action was taken. She’s still working there. She said she hated it multiple times, but whenever she came into the deli where I worked she made a point to wear brand new Lily Pulitzer. And to be rude to other customers. Who are often very wealthy and influential people in the community.

And that’s why I left before I found a full time job.

Just an update on how things turned out.

I am now working full time at the library and have been since March of 2020. The pay isn't much, but my coworkers are kind and respectful, and I genuinely like them as people. My leadership is the same, and has taken every opportunity to be supportive. I produced a series of video recordings featuring leaders of different religions that was one of our most popular programs during 2020. I consider it a highlight of my career. I've since produced several book talks, my most recent one being on books about the Holy Land. I partnered with a Jewish coworker who had visited the Holy Land and could offer a second perspective. That turned out really well and I'm pretty proud of that project.

Like I said, the pay isn't much, so I got a housemate. This saved me more than $500 a month, which I tossed in my Roth IRA. I fully funded that last year. My housemate is a lovely human, and I'm really glad I got to know her better. She's getting married in Feb. and I'm invited to the wedding.

I started a side hustle offering writing/editing services. I love it, and it brings in some extra money. I'm hoping that when I am ready to move on, I'll be able to use that to segue into a higher paying job, perhaps in technical writing.

My savings/investments total over $120,000. I'm proud of that.

The ED I used to work for was recently managed out. I have to admit, it is cathartic to know someone realized her behavior was inappropriate and disgusting. I've spent years trying to forgive both of those women. It's an uphill battle.

I love this summary. You're a boss.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: felixbf on January 05, 2022, 12:09:37 AM
glad to see this forum is meeting their women engineer quota.

I'm a male in IT/Tech/Engineering. When I hear stupid fake shit about women from a team lead/manager/leadership because of some make-believe stereotype, immediate red flag is raised, and I start looking for opportunities externally. Because this time it was women, next time it will about a minority, and it will go on. In my experience, HR does nothing, so time to bail. That FU Stash activation feels so good.

IF you feel that you're in a position to do so, it would be super-cool if you would push back on that shit.

Because it's far more effective when a bro says "seriously dude? The 1950s called, and they want their sexism back" then when a woman says ... anything, because that makes her a bitchy bitch.

My first full time engineering job in the mid-2000s, with the Engineering Ethics class from university still fresh in my mind, and having gone thru the various employer training, I called out a senior engineer during a meeting, as soon as he uttered ridiculous nonsense. He talked trash about 2 female engineers (who were my E-school classmates) and the Turkish change management lady. But the female CEO of that company didn't like my pushing back, and they never forgot. When we had layoffs, the 2 female engineers were fired in the first round and I got their work. A month later, they fired me for cause, for belittling a senior. IDGAF and had 6 months of emergency fund and had made local industry contacts.

Next workplace, my team lead and senior techs would call out others who said sexist and racist things, so I was part of a like-minded team. But our female manager wasn't a fan of our callouts as well as our refusal to put a blind eye on inspection fails and workplace safety violations. So our team got the least raises despite being critical to the company (no products could be certified without our department testing them for compliance and signing off). I was denied a promotion (had been verbally informed a month prior that I would be). Manager and her boss, a female director, openly said my minority was good at being frugal and thrifty, and said working with this company was a raise unto itself. HR didn't give a damn when I raised it, they said those were heat of the moment responses by management. I quit a couple of weeks later with a 30% more pay, a day after my 3 year stock vesting hit 100%.

It might seem super-cool to many when men stand up for women in the workplace, but we're the ones who get the shaft, financially and morally.

HR is not there to help the normal employees. Only to look after the company and it's managers.
Never take anything up with HR, it is a loosing battle most times.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: NoVa on January 05, 2022, 09:53:00 AM
glad to see this forum is meeting their women engineer quota.

I'm a male in IT/Tech/Engineering. When I hear stupid fake shit about women from a team lead/manager/leadership because of some make-believe stereotype, immediate red flag is raised, and I start looking for opportunities externally. Because this time it was women, next time it will about a minority, and it will go on. In my experience, HR does nothing, so time to bail. That FU Stash activation feels so good.

IF you feel that you're in a position to do so, it would be super-cool if you would push back on that shit.

Because it's far more effective when a bro says "seriously dude? The 1950s called, and they want their sexism back" then when a woman says ... anything, because that makes her a bitchy bitch.

My first full time engineering job in the mid-2000s, with the Engineering Ethics class from university still fresh in my mind, and having gone thru the various employer training, I called out a senior engineer during a meeting, as soon as he uttered ridiculous nonsense. He talked trash about 2 female engineers (who were my E-school classmates) and the Turkish change management lady. But the female CEO of that company didn't like my pushing back, and they never forgot. When we had layoffs, the 2 female engineers were fired in the first round and I got their work. A month later, they fired me for cause, for belittling a senior. IDGAF and had 6 months of emergency fund and had made local industry contacts.

Next workplace, my team lead and senior techs would call out others who said sexist and racist things, so I was part of a like-minded team. But our female manager wasn't a fan of our callouts as well as our refusal to put a blind eye on inspection fails and workplace safety violations. So our team got the least raises despite being critical to the company (no products could be certified without our department testing them for compliance and signing off). I was denied a promotion (had been verbally informed a month prior that I would be). Manager and her boss, a female director, openly said my minority was good at being frugal and thrifty, and said working with this company was a raise unto itself. HR didn't give a damn when I raised it, they said those were heat of the moment responses by management. I quit a couple of weeks later with a 30% more pay, a day after my 3 year stock vesting hit 100%.

It might seem super-cool to many when men stand up for women in the workplace, but we're the ones who get the shaft, financially and morally.

HR is not there to help the normal employees. Only to look after the company and it's managers.
Never take anything up with HR, it is a loosing battle most times.

HR works for the company. Also, it's right there in the title, how to turn Humans into Resources. If you have a legitimate legal issue, they might help, because they don't want to expose the company to liability.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: snowball on January 09, 2022, 05:01:02 AM
HR works for the company. Also, it's right there in the title, how to turn Humans into Resources. If you have a legitimate legal issue, they might help, because they don't want to expose the company to liability.

I've found them helpful on occasion;  you just need to make sure their goals are going to align with yours regarding whatever the issue is, and perhaps be mindful in the way you frame the issue for them.  And definitely anything that could turn into a legal issue will light a fire under them (if it's a well-run HR dept).  It mystifies me when people seem to think HR is supposed to be some kind of...impartial source of justice.  As you say, that's not at all what they're for;  they work for the company.  Though that doesn't mean they will always side with a manager in a dispute, which I suppose is where the misconception comes from.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Wolfpack Mustachian on January 09, 2022, 06:21:03 AM
glad to see this forum is meeting their women engineer quota.

I'm a male in IT/Tech/Engineering. When I hear stupid fake shit about women from a team lead/manager/leadership because of some make-believe stereotype, immediate red flag is raised, and I start looking for opportunities externally. Because this time it was women, next time it will about a minority, and it will go on. In my experience, HR does nothing, so time to bail. That FU Stash activation feels so good.

IF you feel that you're in a position to do so, it would be super-cool if you would push back on that shit.

Because it's far more effective when a bro says "seriously dude? The 1950s called, and they want their sexism back" then when a woman says ... anything, because that makes her a bitchy bitch.

My first full time engineering job in the mid-2000s, with the Engineering Ethics class from university still fresh in my mind, and having gone thru the various employer training, I called out a senior engineer during a meeting, as soon as he uttered ridiculous nonsense. He talked trash about 2 female engineers (who were my E-school classmates) and the Turkish change management lady. But the female CEO of that company didn't like my pushing back, and they never forgot. When we had layoffs, the 2 female engineers were fired in the first round and I got their work. A month later, they fired me for cause, for belittling a senior. IDGAF and had 6 months of emergency fund and had made local industry contacts.

Next workplace, my team lead and senior techs would call out others who said sexist and racist things, so I was part of a like-minded team. But our female manager wasn't a fan of our callouts as well as our refusal to put a blind eye on inspection fails and workplace safety violations. So our team got the least raises despite being critical to the company (no products could be certified without our department testing them for compliance and signing off). I was denied a promotion (had been verbally informed a month prior that I would be). Manager and her boss, a female director, openly said my minority was good at being frugal and thrifty, and said working with this company was a raise unto itself. HR didn't give a damn when I raised it, they said those were heat of the moment responses by management. I quit a couple of weeks later with a 30% more pay, a day after my 3 year stock vesting hit 100%.

It might seem super-cool to many when men stand up for women in the workplace, but we're the ones who get the shaft, financially and morally.

HR is not there to help the normal employees. Only to look after the company and it's managers.
Never take anything up with HR, it is a loosing battle most times.

HR works for the company. Also, it's right there in the title, how to turn Humans into Resources. If you have a legitimate legal issue, they might help, because they don't want to expose the company to liability.

This is an important point. It's also important to understand HR are people, too. If they're HR in a situation with multi-hundreds of people to manage like a factory setting, they've likely dealt with untold ridiculousness of situations and deal with complaints all the time. I know I'd probably become pretty cynical if I had to deal with what they have to deal with. I've found if you're nice to them and reasonable the good ones can be helpful.....but as you say, they're first loyalty is always the company.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: RWTL on January 09, 2022, 12:37:17 PM
glad to see this forum is meeting their women engineer quota.

I'm a male in IT/Tech/Engineering. When I hear stupid fake shit about women from a team lead/manager/leadership because of some make-believe stereotype, immediate red flag is raised, and I start looking for opportunities externally. Because this time it was women, next time it will about a minority, and it will go on. In my experience, HR does nothing, so time to bail. That FU Stash activation feels so good.

IF you feel that you're in a position to do so, it would be super-cool if you would push back on that shit.

Because it's far more effective when a bro says "seriously dude? The 1950s called, and they want their sexism back" then when a woman says ... anything, because that makes her a bitchy bitch.

My first full time engineering job in the mid-2000s, with the Engineering Ethics class from university still fresh in my mind, and having gone thru the various employer training, I called out a senior engineer during a meeting, as soon as he uttered ridiculous nonsense. He talked trash about 2 female engineers (who were my E-school classmates) and the Turkish change management lady. But the female CEO of that company didn't like my pushing back, and they never forgot. When we had layoffs, the 2 female engineers were fired in the first round and I got their work. A month later, they fired me for cause, for belittling a senior. IDGAF and had 6 months of emergency fund and had made local industry contacts.

Next workplace, my team lead and senior techs would call out others who said sexist and racist things, so I was part of a like-minded team. But our female manager wasn't a fan of our callouts as well as our refusal to put a blind eye on inspection fails and workplace safety violations. So our team got the least raises despite being critical to the company (no products could be certified without our department testing them for compliance and signing off). I was denied a promotion (had been verbally informed a month prior that I would be). Manager and her boss, a female director, openly said my minority was good at being frugal and thrifty, and said working with this company was a raise unto itself. HR didn't give a damn when I raised it, they said those were heat of the moment responses by management. I quit a couple of weeks later with a 30% more pay, a day after my 3 year stock vesting hit 100%.

It might seem super-cool to many when men stand up for women in the workplace, but we're the ones who get the shaft, financially and morally.

HR is not there to help the normal employees. Only to look after the company and it's managers.
Never take anything up with HR, it is a loosing battle most times.

HR works for the company. Also, it's right there in the title, how to turn Humans into Resources. If you have a legitimate legal issue, they might help, because they don't want to expose the company to liability.

This is an important point. It's also important to understand HR are people, too. If they're HR in a situation with multi-hundreds of people to manage like a factory setting, they've likely dealt with untold ridiculousness of situations and deal with complaints all the time. I know I'd probably become pretty cynical if I had to deal with what they have to deal with. I've found if you're nice to them and reasonable the good ones can be helpful.....but as you say, they're first loyalty is always the company.

Just like all things in life, this is generally true, but there are exceptions.  I have found HR to be very pro-employee in some specific settings.  In one example I was a manager and HR recommended some specific actions for our employee to take that allowed him to access a death benefit (employee was terminally ill).  It was their suggestion for the employee take the actions that got them the benefit - and if they only looked out for the company they could have not said anything.  The company self-insured those kinds of payments - so it did come out of company funds.

Honestly, this is one of the moments I will cherish the most in my career.  The family sent me a thank you letter for helping them.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Wolfpack Mustachian on January 09, 2022, 01:15:18 PM
glad to see this forum is meeting their women engineer quota.

I'm a male in IT/Tech/Engineering. When I hear stupid fake shit about women from a team lead/manager/leadership because of some make-believe stereotype, immediate red flag is raised, and I start looking for opportunities externally. Because this time it was women, next time it will about a minority, and it will go on. In my experience, HR does nothing, so time to bail. That FU Stash activation feels so good.

IF you feel that you're in a position to do so, it would be super-cool if you would push back on that shit.

Because it's far more effective when a bro says "seriously dude? The 1950s called, and they want their sexism back" then when a woman says ... anything, because that makes her a bitchy bitch.

My first full time engineering job in the mid-2000s, with the Engineering Ethics class from university still fresh in my mind, and having gone thru the various employer training, I called out a senior engineer during a meeting, as soon as he uttered ridiculous nonsense. He talked trash about 2 female engineers (who were my E-school classmates) and the Turkish change management lady. But the female CEO of that company didn't like my pushing back, and they never forgot. When we had layoffs, the 2 female engineers were fired in the first round and I got their work. A month later, they fired me for cause, for belittling a senior. IDGAF and had 6 months of emergency fund and had made local industry contacts.

Next workplace, my team lead and senior techs would call out others who said sexist and racist things, so I was part of a like-minded team. But our female manager wasn't a fan of our callouts as well as our refusal to put a blind eye on inspection fails and workplace safety violations. So our team got the least raises despite being critical to the company (no products could be certified without our department testing them for compliance and signing off). I was denied a promotion (had been verbally informed a month prior that I would be). Manager and her boss, a female director, openly said my minority was good at being frugal and thrifty, and said working with this company was a raise unto itself. HR didn't give a damn when I raised it, they said those were heat of the moment responses by management. I quit a couple of weeks later with a 30% more pay, a day after my 3 year stock vesting hit 100%.

It might seem super-cool to many when men stand up for women in the workplace, but we're the ones who get the shaft, financially and morally.

HR is not there to help the normal employees. Only to look after the company and it's managers.
Never take anything up with HR, it is a loosing battle most times.

HR works for the company. Also, it's right there in the title, how to turn Humans into Resources. If you have a legitimate legal issue, they might help, because they don't want to expose the company to liability.

This is an important point. It's also important to understand HR are people, too. If they're HR in a situation with multi-hundreds of people to manage like a factory setting, they've likely dealt with untold ridiculousness of situations and deal with complaints all the time. I know I'd probably become pretty cynical if I had to deal with what they have to deal with. I've found if you're nice to them and reasonable the good ones can be helpful.....but as you say, they're first loyalty is always the company.

Just like all things in life, this is generally true, but there are exceptions.  I have found HR to be very pro-employee in some specific settings.  In one example I was a manager and HR recommended some specific actions for our employee to take that allowed him to access a death benefit (employee was terminally ill).  It was their suggestion for the employee take the actions that got them the benefit - and if they only looked out for the company they could have not said anything.  The company self-insured those kinds of payments - so it did come out of company funds.

Honestly, this is one of the moments I will cherish the most in my career.  The family sent me a thank you letter for helping them.

Great story and you're right, I shouldn't have said always. Corporate America tends to corrupt even the best ones - leading to the crux of threads like this, and the higher you go in it, the less likely you are to retain your conscious. However, there are always those welcome exceptions who exemplify positive virtues even in the midst of it all.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: jinga nation on January 09, 2022, 05:09:56 PM
glad to see this forum is meeting their women engineer quota.

I'm a male in IT/Tech/Engineering. When I hear stupid fake shit about women from a team lead/manager/leadership because of some make-believe stereotype, immediate red flag is raised, and I start looking for opportunities externally. Because this time it was women, next time it will about a minority, and it will go on. In my experience, HR does nothing, so time to bail. That FU Stash activation feels so good.

IF you feel that you're in a position to do so, it would be super-cool if you would push back on that shit.

Because it's far more effective when a bro says "seriously dude? The 1950s called, and they want their sexism back" then when a woman says ... anything, because that makes her a bitchy bitch.

My first full time engineering job in the mid-2000s, with the Engineering Ethics class from university still fresh in my mind, and having gone thru the various employer training, I called out a senior engineer during a meeting, as soon as he uttered ridiculous nonsense. He talked trash about 2 female engineers (who were my E-school classmates) and the Turkish change management lady. But the female CEO of that company didn't like my pushing back, and they never forgot. When we had layoffs, the 2 female engineers were fired in the first round and I got their work. A month later, they fired me for cause, for belittling a senior. IDGAF and had 6 months of emergency fund and had made local industry contacts.

Next workplace, my team lead and senior techs would call out others who said sexist and racist things, so I was part of a like-minded team. But our female manager wasn't a fan of our callouts as well as our refusal to put a blind eye on inspection fails and workplace safety violations. So our team got the least raises despite being critical to the company (no products could be certified without our department testing them for compliance and signing off). I was denied a promotion (had been verbally informed a month prior that I would be). Manager and her boss, a female director, openly said my minority was good at being frugal and thrifty, and said working with this company was a raise unto itself. HR didn't give a damn when I raised it, they said those were heat of the moment responses by management. I quit a couple of weeks later with a 30% more pay, a day after my 3 year stock vesting hit 100%.

It might seem super-cool to many when men stand up for women in the workplace, but we're the ones who get the shaft, financially and morally.

HR is not there to help the normal employees. Only to look after the company and it's managers.
Never take anything up with HR, it is a loosing battle most times.

HR works for the company. Also, it's right there in the title, how to turn Humans into Resources. If you have a legitimate legal issue, they might help, because they don't want to expose the company to liability.

This is an important point. It's also important to understand HR are people, too. If they're HR in a situation with multi-hundreds of people to manage like a factory setting, they've likely dealt with untold ridiculousness of situations and deal with complaints all the time. I know I'd probably become pretty cynical if I had to deal with what they have to deal with. I've found if you're nice to them and reasonable the good ones can be helpful.....but as you say, they're first loyalty is always the company.

Just like all things in life, this is generally true, but there are exceptions.  I have found HR to be very pro-employee in some specific settings.  In one example I was a manager and HR recommended some specific actions for our employee to take that allowed him to access a death benefit (employee was terminally ill).  It was their suggestion for the employee take the actions that got them the benefit - and if they only looked out for the company they could have not said anything.  The company self-insured those kinds of payments - so it did come out of company funds.

Honestly, this is one of the moments I will cherish the most in my career.  The family sent me a thank you letter for helping them.

Great story and you're right, I shouldn't have said always. Corporate America tends to corrupt even the best ones - leading to the crux of threads like this, and the higher you go in it, the less likely you are to retain your conscious. However, there are always those welcome exceptions who exemplify positive virtues even in the midst of it all.

The "next workplace" I described above, with the female manager and female director, was a Fortune 500.
We never went to HR, because that place was known as Honeywell Resources. They had only the company's welfare at heart.
(According to the pre-merger lifers, the company went to the dogs bollocks when Allied Signal purchased Honeywell and kept the H name since Allied Signal had a terrible name. And the CEO during my time there was David Cote, one of GE's Jack Welch's proteges, slash master extraordinaire.)
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: bill1827 on January 10, 2022, 03:21:11 AM
(According to the pre-merger lifers, the company went to the dogs bollocks when Allied Signal purchased Honeywell and kept the H name since Allied Signal had a terrible name.)

Do you mean "went to the dogs" i.e. got much worse or "became the dogs bollocks" i.e. became the best?

I guess you mean got worse.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: rockstache on January 10, 2022, 07:59:42 AM
Hello, ringing in as an HR worker here. There are 3 of us in my particular HR (couple hundred employees), and I am always, always in favor of the employee, unless they are being particularly dickish, or the sort who is always taking advantage of every little thing (and therefore not worth me utilizing my limited goodwill for). Despite being just a peon, on several occasions I have spoken up and gotten policy changed in favor of a person or large group. However, I have a boss, and she is a little more old school ('be glad you have a job and don't complain about your benefits'), so sometimes I lose the battle. Anyway, I just say that to say that like anything, it's all over the place and depends on the company and the individuals and also sometimes like, whether they had coffee that morning (which is not right of course, but they are only human). Be nice to your HR peeps - it could help you out!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: jinga nation on January 10, 2022, 10:39:03 AM
(According to the pre-merger lifers, the company went to the dogs bollocks when Allied Signal purchased Honeywell and kept the H name since Allied Signal had a terrible name.)

Do you mean "went to the dogs" i.e. got much worse or "became the dogs bollocks" i.e. became the best?

I guess you mean got worse.

yes, I meant "went to the dogs".
i say "dogs bollocks" quite often... so unknowingly joined the two phrases.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: mm1970 on January 10, 2022, 12:32:21 PM
Hello, ringing in as an HR worker here. There are 3 of us in my particular HR (couple hundred employees), and I am always, always in favor of the employee, unless they are being particularly dickish, or the sort who is always taking advantage of every little thing (and therefore not worth me utilizing my limited goodwill for). Despite being just a peon, on several occasions I have spoken up and gotten policy changed in favor of a person or large group. However, I have a boss, and she is a little more old school ('be glad you have a job and don't complain about your benefits'), so sometimes I lose the battle. Anyway, I just say that to say that like anything, it's all over the place and depends on the company and the individuals and also sometimes like, whether they had coffee that morning (which is not right of course, but they are only human). Be nice to your HR peeps - it could help you out!
We had a fantastic HR director at one point. Yeah, they are always for the company, but this one director convinced the company to pay me my full salary while out on mat leave.  It had never happened before, and hasn't happened since because she left.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: talltexan on January 11, 2022, 06:18:41 AM
When my wife was expecting our first, one of the supervisors took me aside and told me the story of how he'd given a seminar in Indiana on the day his daughter was born (this was at an academic institution).
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: NorthernIkigai on January 11, 2022, 06:25:47 AM
When my wife was expecting our first, one of the supervisors took me aside and told me the story of how he'd given a seminar in Indiana on the day his daughter was born (this was at an academic institution).
...and hopefully finished with "and that was the worst mistake of my life". But somehow I'm assuming my hope is in vain.

(Although I first read that as India rather than Indiana, which made it sound even worse, but I guess it might as well have been India from the point of view of his wife.)
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: JoePublic3.14 on January 11, 2022, 07:41:55 AM
When my wife was expecting our first, one of the supervisors took me aside and told me the story of how he'd given a seminar in Indiana on the day his daughter was born (this was at an academic institution).

“That’s nice. Sorry, I have an appointment, need to step out”

“That’s nice. Would you be able to proofread some edits to my resumé?”

“I know I looked like I was paying attention, but sorry, I have some work to do.”

“You tell me this under the false assumption that I care”

“I bet there is a non-zero chance you fail a paternity test”
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Warlord1986 on January 11, 2022, 08:46:42 AM
When my wife was expecting our first, one of the supervisors took me aside and told me the story of how he'd given a seminar in Indiana on the day his daughter was born (this was at an academic institution).
...and hopefully finished with "and that was the worst mistake of my life". But somehow I'm assuming my hope is in vain.

(Although I first read that as India rather than Indiana, which made it sound even worse, but I guess it might as well have been India from the point of view of his wife.)

At least India would have been interesting. Imagine missing out on the birth of your child for $#@! Indiana. That's just sad.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Sibley on January 11, 2022, 06:45:16 PM
When my wife was expecting our first, one of the supervisors took me aside and told me the story of how he'd given a seminar in Indiana on the day his daughter was born (this was at an academic institution).
...and hopefully finished with "and that was the worst mistake of my life". But somehow I'm assuming my hope is in vain.

(Although I first read that as India rather than Indiana, which made it sound even worse, but I guess it might as well have been India from the point of view of his wife.)

At least India would have been interesting. Imagine missing out on the birth of your child for $#@! Indiana. That's just sad.

Hey, I live there.

But you're right. Indiana isn't very interesting. Though we do seem to be breaking records (at least in the state) for the number of people dead from Covid. But again, not very interesting.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Gremlin on January 11, 2022, 07:07:09 PM
When my wife was expecting our first, one of the supervisors took me aside and told me the story of how he'd given a seminar in Indiana on the day his daughter was born (this was at an academic institution).

“I bet there is a non-zero chance you fail a paternity test”
Comedy gold!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Sandi_k on January 11, 2022, 10:09:34 PM
When my wife was expecting our first, one of the supervisors took me aside and told me the story of how he'd given a seminar in Indiana on the day his daughter was born (this was at an academic institution).

Wow, sounds like you know my former boss.

He liked to tell this story, under the mistaken assumption that it made him look engaged and devoted to his academic endeavors. Instead, it made us all think he was a jack*ss and his wife was a saint.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: talltexan on January 13, 2022, 07:40:31 AM
eight years ago, I left my academic job to work for an electric utility.

What fascinates me is that the people who work for the utility all assumed I didn't know anything about actually putting in long hours, they all assume I was working just 4 hours/week during my time in the academy. I've had perhaps 3-4 times in those eight years when I was working as hard as I was every day at the university.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: scottish on January 13, 2022, 03:09:56 PM
Many academics work pretty hard.   What was your field?
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: RetiredAt63 on January 13, 2022, 05:29:30 PM
Many academics work pretty hard.   What was your field?

When I was teaching it didn't seem to matter what our fields were.  We were all working about double what our contract hours were supposed to be.  And for yearly contracts there is no overtime.  Support staff got overtime or equivalent time off, and some were pretty vocal about their better deal.  ;-/

My DD swore she would never be a teacher.  She isn't.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Gerard on January 14, 2022, 07:39:25 AM
Support staff got overtime or equivalent time off, and some were pretty vocal about their better deal.  ;-/

I remember the day the professors in our department realized the departmental secretary had a yacht.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: frugalnacho on January 14, 2022, 08:34:04 AM
Some minor back story for me:  My parents got foreclosed on 5 years ago, and I let them move into my house for far below fair market value (about $400-500 below FMV, I just asked them to reimburse me for the mortgage/taxes/insurance).  They lived there for 5 years and did not take care of the place.  I finally asked them to leave because I wanted to sell it, and they got all pissed off and it's caused a huge rift in the family.  Things are not good between me and them still. They got all huffy and moved out within a couple weeks and left the place in total disarray. I don't think they cleaned anything the whole time they were there.  So for the past month I've been cleaning it up and fixing things up (up to about $14K so far plus a couple hundred hours between me/wife/her family).    Also we are about 7 months pregnant after a long battle with infertility and going through IVF (and saving up for IVF because we ended up spending about $40k all said and done).  There have been some other major life stresses that I don't even need to go into now.  Suffice to say my life has been shitty and one big ball of stress for several months now.

So I come into work last week and SURPRISE the company you've worked at for 11 years has been sold! And those raises we promised...how about a pay cut instead?

They calculated my pay rate by excluding the bonus I get (about 15% of my total compensation) to get my "base pay", and then basically giving me that.  They also don't cover nearly as much of the insurance premiums as my previous employer.  The end result is that I previously paid about $1500/yr total for insurance for me and my wife, and now the insurance is switching over at 7 months pregnancy and the my new "family" premiums are going to be over $10k/yr.  I expected a slight jump in insurance when we added a kid, but they've totally changed the rules of the game just before the birth, without ever giving me a heads up, and it's going to affect me about $8k/yr.   

I told them the offer was bullshit and that I'm confident I can go find an engineering job paying more than that immediately.  They want me to start off at the bottom and prove myself, even though I have 11 years experience and played a large part in building the company to the level it was at.  I also have plenty of money socked away and could live for a couple years with no job if necessary.  So I told them all to stuff it and cleaned out my desk and walked out. 

Apparently that got their attention, and after a week of tense back and forth negotiation I now have a new contract.  With this new contract I get:

$13k/yr more salary
Large performance based bonus (estimated $10-15k/yr)
performance review/raise halfway between now and the next normal scheduled review
3 weeks paid paternity leave
"unlimited"* vacation
2 employees under me
I've been promised I don't have to do shitty field work anymore, and can just do office work if I want.

Everyone else in the office is stuck and had no real option but to sign their new contract so they can keep getting a paycheck.  I was the lone hold out.  The change didn't affect anyone else nearly as much as it affected me.  It pretty much worked out to equal compensation for everyone, except 2 of us senior guys, and it affected me much more harshly than the other guy.  All in all though I think it ended up working out in my favor, and should actually decrease my time to FIRE by a couple years or more.

*unlimited in the sense that it's only limited by my ability to get my job done.  Not truly unlimited, but I won't hit a point where they say "no you can't take that day off because you already took 14 days off!".  I'm skeptical how it's all going to work out.

*unlimited in the sense that it's only limited by my ability to get my job done.  Not truly unlimited, but I won't hit a point where they say "no you can't take that day off because you already took 14 days off!".  I'm skeptical how it's all going to work out.

Make sure you make a record of how many days minimum you think is fair to take and actually take them. It is so easy as a lower level manager & previous independent contributor with a performance bonus to keep on putting off using the vacation days, and you end up not taking them (and then not getting them paid back when you leave because that is part of the 'unlimited' tradeoff).

They seem pretty anal about everyone keeping track of jobs and projects and billable hours.   Part of the reason they gave me a raise and kept me is because they need me.  No one else in the organization can do exactly what I do, how I do it.  I'm critical to keeping this company running, at least in the short term.  I know I'm not truly irreplaceable, but I know they can't go hire someone and get them up to my level any time soon, and probably not for what they are paying me either, so for the next year at least they absolutely need me.  That's all great when I'm negotiating for a raise, but now a couple weeks in when I want to start using my "unlimited" vacation time...well fuck, we have a couple complicated reports that are due this week and no one else is capable of getting them done.  This is the exact reason they need me around, so it's not like I can just go on vacation for the rest of the week.

Hard to believe it's been 4.5 years since this happened.   

Well the company reneged on giving bonuses.  To everyone.  Office morale was on a steady decline the entire year I stuck around.  I stuck around for 1 year because the previous owner of the company pulled me aside, said he was sorry how everything went down and how I got thrown under the bus, he wasn't expecting that to happen to me, and I was critical to the operation of the office, and the new owners were idiots.  So he offered me a $10k bonus from him personally if I would stick around for 1 year during the transition (I think he wanted things to go as smooth as possible since he didn't get paid 100% up front).  He is a solid dude and kept his word and gave me a $10k money order 1 year later.  I did also end up getting an out of cycle raise of $6k/yr after about 6 months.  But boy did they resent having to pay me more money than they originally planned on, even though the office was insanely profitable (multiple $M/yr).  And they reneged on bonuses for everyone, and I don't think they ever reinstated them.

Even though I was now making $18k/yr more than the initial offer, I was able to promptly find a new job paying another $14k/yr more with even cheaper benefits, so I took it.  After I left, the office started to fall apart and the reporting went to shit.  The data and report quality declined just like I said it would, and they had to start outsourcing their reporting to other offices, and it was a huge clusterfuck that no one liked.  The clients didn't like it either and were getting frustrated by the new company.   People kept finding new jobs and bailing out of the company.  4 years after the sale, only 2 out of the original 13 employees remained.  And they were 2 of the worst employees, all of the quality employees that actually brought value to the company are gone.  According to one of the employees still there they haven't booked any new work in almost 6 months and are operating as a logistics hub at this point.  It's not clear to me how they are going to even keep this office running at this point.

And now I've started a new competing company with one of the other former employees.   I have 12 years experience, and he has 14.  We want to make a lot of money, but we also both have a personal goal of putting the final nail in the coffin, crushing this office, and taking all the clients.  It would be really satisfying to basically rebuild the same company with the same clients, and ultimately sell it back to the same parent company so they can come in and fuck it all up again.

Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: jinga nation on January 14, 2022, 09:27:46 AM
It would be really satisfying to basically rebuild the same company with the same clients, and ultimately sell it back to the same parent company so they can come in and fuck it all up again.

This would be the ultimate "Fuck You" if you were able to FIRE on that sale.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: JoePublic3.14 on January 14, 2022, 09:37:22 AM
Support staff got overtime or equivalent time off, and some were pretty vocal about their better deal.  ;-/

I remember the day the professors in our department realized the departmental secretary had a yacht.

An FU yacht, that’s pretty cool. I wonder what it was named?

Over Time
Prof Funded
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Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Plina on January 14, 2022, 09:41:21 AM
It would be really satisfying to basically rebuild the same company with the same clients, and ultimately sell it back to the same parent company so they can come in and fuck it all up again.

This would be the ultimate "Fuck You" if you were able to FIRE on that sale.

I would not want to sell my company to someone I know would fuck it up. It would also be like telling your employees fuck you to sell to someone that would make them unemployed.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: haflander on January 14, 2022, 09:51:18 AM
My favorite forum thread, so I have to contribute every once in a while.

I'm pretty happy in my current job, but an old work acquaintence has been trying to pull me away to a competitor company. Very similar job, but would be 35-40% increase. Both are big companies and many individuals have worked for both. After some LinkedIn sleuthing, I was able to ask around my company (discreetly, of course) about what others' experience was like at the other company (before they joined my current company). Big majority of people said that our current place is way better for work/life, organization, caring for employees. We're talking about a big difference in pay, but at what cost? How much are my nights and weekends worth to me? Btw, I currently get paid OT after 40 hours, something that's very rare in my industry (still FT salary). And my salary is nothing to sneeze at on its own. I already have 25 days PTO, tons of benefits, week off between Xmas and New Year's.

I'm leaning strongly toward declining gracefully. It's the kind of job you'd jump for if you didn't like your current job, were laid off, whatever. But I'm really happy right now, so it's a much different situation.

That's the power of FU money and living below your means.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: frugalnacho on January 14, 2022, 10:00:17 AM
It would be really satisfying to basically rebuild the same company with the same clients, and ultimately sell it back to the same parent company so they can come in and fuck it all up again.

This would be the ultimate "Fuck You" if you were able to FIRE on that sale.

I expect to reach FI before that point.  I don't think we are terribly far off right now with a NW of $900k+.   It just seems to make more sense to go into business for myself rather than trying to hunt around for another job to grind out for a few more years.  I think I'll have more freedom and be happier working for myself.  Boss can't give me shit for cutting out early on Friday, or for rolling in late occasionally, or for taking a mid day nap if that's what I feel I need.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: MissNancyPryor on January 14, 2022, 01:00:28 PM
Not sure where this story fits but it just struck me so I will tell it.  It is in the category of "I am much smarter now and should not have put up with that bullshit."

In the olden days when paychecks came printed on actual paper in sealed envelopes that were handed out on Fridays, the office manager stopped by and placed mine on my desk.  I opened it.  Something was wrong, it was not close to my usual amount.  It took me several moments to realize I was handed my co-worker Ann's paycheck. 

Right at that time the office manager took another swing around and handed me mine.  She said that since I was going to the warehouse I would be dropping off Ann's to her, and she walked away quickly before I could muster the nerve to say I just opened the confidential pay statement of Ann.

After a few minutes I went to the manager's office and told her what happened and asked for a new envelope for Ann's statement so she would not feel embarrassed that someone had inadvertently opened it.  That bitch of an office manager refused (even though the envelopes were on site), and weakly grinned that I simply needed to admit to Ann what I had done when handing over the paycheck.  I ....... did.  Ann was not pleased, of course.  We were both mortified. 

It is so clear to me now.  If this had happened today I simply would have dropped Ann's opened paycheck on the office manager's desk and walked away with a curt, "Nope."

I look back and can't believe I allowed her to treat me like I had done something wrong when it was her presumption that I would be her delivery girl that started it.  Back then I didn't feel like I had the power to stand up to her but now I see it would have been the easiest thing. 

I like who I grew up to be.     

         

Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: draco44 on January 14, 2022, 01:19:02 PM
That bitch of an office manager refused (even though the envelopes were on site), and weakly grinned that I simply needed to admit to Ann what I had done when handing over the paycheck.

I'm very glad you like who you grew up to be and wouldn't tolerate being pushed around like this now.

I especially disliked from your story how it was apparently framed as a horrible thing YOU did. I mean, taking the paycheck that your manager hand-delivered to your desk and opening it under the assumption that they would have handed you the correct one? How dare you!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Adventine on January 14, 2022, 01:28:41 PM
That bitch of an office manager refused (even though the envelopes were on site), and weakly grinned that I simply needed to admit to Ann what I had done when handing over the paycheck.

I'm very glad you like who you grew up to be and wouldn't tolerate being pushed around like this now.

I especially disliked from your story how it was apparently framed as a horrible thing YOU did. I mean, taking the paycheck that your manager hand-delivered to your desk and opening it under the assumption that they would have handed you the correct one? How dare you!


"I like who I grew up to be" is one of the best measures of success I've ever seen.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: MissNancyPryor on January 14, 2022, 01:34:57 PM
I was such a people pleaser.  I am glad I grew out of it. 

I can't imagine what she would have said if I did leave the open envelope with her-  "Nancy opened it!" would just breed questions about why the actual fuck it was given to Nancy in the first place.  I am sure a new envelope would have been found instantly before that manager delivered the check and she would not have complained to my boss about my refusal to deliver or my accidental opening of it because again the finger is pointed back at her.  What the hell was I thinking.  Nothing would be easier than going toe-to-toe with her and I crumbled. 

Regrets, I have few.     
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: JoePublic3.14 on January 14, 2022, 01:41:57 PM
I was such a people pleaser.  I am glad I grew out of it. 

I can't imagine what she would have said if I did leave the open envelope with her-  "Nancy opened it!" would just breed questions about why the actual fuck it was given to Nancy in the first place.  I am sure a new envelope would have been found instantly before that manager delivered the check and she would not have complained to my boss about my refusal to deliver or my accidental opening of it because again the finger is pointed back at her.  What the hell was I thinking.  Nothing would be easier than going toe-to-toe with her and I crumbled. 

Regrets, I have few.   

Ah, it’s really damn hard to take the best action in real time. I can list quickly five of these types of things. But I like to think each one has made me better and I won’t get bullied the same way twice.

Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: RWTL on January 14, 2022, 02:48:16 PM
That bitch of an office manager refused (even though the envelopes were on site), and weakly grinned that I simply needed to admit to Ann what I had done when handing over the paycheck.

I'm very glad you like who you grew up to be and wouldn't tolerate being pushed around like this now.

I especially disliked from your story how it was apparently framed as a horrible thing YOU did. I mean, taking the paycheck that your manager hand-delivered to your desk and opening it under the assumption that they would have handed you the correct one? How dare you!


"I like who I grew up to be" is one of the best measures of success I've ever seen.

...and one of the best mentally healthy statements.   
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Warlord1986 on January 14, 2022, 03:00:38 PM
That bitch of an office manager refused (even though the envelopes were on site), and weakly grinned that I simply needed to admit to Ann what I had done when handing over the paycheck.

I'm very glad you like who you grew up to be and wouldn't tolerate being pushed around like this now.

I especially disliked from your story how it was apparently framed as a horrible thing YOU did. I mean, taking the paycheck that your manager hand-delivered to your desk and opening it under the assumption that they would have handed you the correct one? How dare you!


"I like who I grew up to be" is one of the best measures of success I've ever seen.

...and one of the best mentally healthy statements.

Seconding all of this.

I have doubts that the office manager hag likes herself.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: iluvzbeach on January 14, 2022, 04:00:07 PM
That bitch of an office manager refused (even though the envelopes were on site), and weakly grinned that I simply needed to admit to Ann what I had done when handing over the paycheck.

I'm very glad you like who you grew up to be and wouldn't tolerate being pushed around like this now.

I especially disliked from your story how it was apparently framed as a horrible thing YOU did. I mean, taking the paycheck that your manager hand-delivered to your desk and opening it under the assumption that they would have handed you the correct one? How dare you!


"I like who I grew up to be" is one of the best measures of success I've ever seen.

...and one of the best mentally healthy statements.

@RWTL Thank you so much for posting this response. You have no idea how it hits home. 2021 was a total shit year for me, in particular as it pertains to one of my parents (who is now deceased.) I was having a conversation with the other parent and they apologized for some of the choices they’d made in life that resulted in me having much more contact with the (now deceased) parent than I otherwise would have and my response was along the lines of “It’s actually okay because I like who I am and I don’t know that I’d be the person I am today if things had been different.” I never stopped to consider that might be a mentally healthy statement. Yes, life has had its challenge but, damn, I turned out pretty well anyway. Thank you for making my day.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Zamboni on January 15, 2022, 07:07:26 PM
That's great that y'all like how you turned out.

And kudos to the parent who reflected on some things they did and apologized to you. That's actually really nice that they did that. My parents did some really, really crappy stuff to us, and I assure you that neither will ever apologize to us. My Mom is especially unlikely to apologize as she seems to enjoy retelling stories about some of her own absolute worst behavior with the spin that she was either the victim or triumphant in some way. I'm really sick of hearing these stories of things she did that traumatized me as a child over and over and over. As a result, we just can barely stand to be around her, which is hard now that she is elderly and getting dementia and has aggressive cancer and needs help. My siblings and I very carefully limit the exposure our own children have to her, but she seems oblivious about that.

I wish that I had had FU money as a younger child. I worked hard from age 16+ and got my FU money before I graduated high school and moved out, finding a bedroom in a duplex for crazy low rent of $100 a month. So my awful mother taught me to be a really self sufficient scrapper, which I guess is worth something.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: iluvzbeach on January 15, 2022, 07:42:36 PM
@Zamboni, my post was directly above yours and I believe you responded to me. I do feel fortunate to have a healthy, close relationship with my surviving parent.

Your description of your mom and your relationship with her sounds almost identical to my husband’s mom & his relationship with her, down to and including her current age & health situation. It’s just a really shitty situation to be in and I’m sorry you’ve had to deal with something similar. Some people just suck, there’s no other way to word it.

I hope you have, at least, found some other people in life who you have been able to establish healthy relationships with.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: LennStar on January 16, 2022, 01:46:22 AM

Right at that time the office manager took another swing around and handed me mine.  She said that since I was going to the warehouse I would be dropping off Ann's to her, and she walked away quickly before I could muster the nerve to say I just opened the confidential pay statement of Ann.

After a few minutes I went to the manager's office and told her what happened and asked for a new envelope for Ann's statement so she would not feel embarrassed that someone had inadvertently opened it.  That bitch of an office manager refused (even though the envelopes were on site), and weakly grinned that I simply needed to admit to Ann what I had done when handing over the paycheck.  I ....... did.  Ann was not pleased, of course.  We were both mortified. 
     
The most interesting thing for me is that knowing the amount of someone else is negative. Why?
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Dave1442397 on January 16, 2022, 08:51:17 AM

Right at that time the office manager took another swing around and handed me mine.  She said that since I was going to the warehouse I would be dropping off Ann's to her, and she walked away quickly before I could muster the nerve to say I just opened the confidential pay statement of Ann.

After a few minutes I went to the manager's office and told her what happened and asked for a new envelope for Ann's statement so she would not feel embarrassed that someone had inadvertently opened it.  That bitch of an office manager refused (even though the envelopes were on site), and weakly grinned that I simply needed to admit to Ann what I had done when handing over the paycheck.  I ....... did.  Ann was not pleased, of course.  We were both mortified. 
     
The most interesting thing for me is that knowing the amount of someone else is negative. Why?

Because now the other person assumes that you know how much they make, and they do not know how much you make. They may assume you feel superior because you make more, or angry because you make less. Either way, it's something they would rather keep private.

I worked at a company 25 years ago that was subject to something called Schedule G by the IRS. Someone realized that said schedule meant that the salary of anyone who made > $50k/yr was considered public information. That spreadsheet flew around the office at the speed of light. I was making $11k more than my immediate supervisor...I'm sure that went down well!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: FIPurpose on January 16, 2022, 09:43:02 AM

Right at that time the office manager took another swing around and handed me mine.  She said that since I was going to the warehouse I would be dropping off Ann's to her, and she walked away quickly before I could muster the nerve to say I just opened the confidential pay statement of Ann.

After a few minutes I went to the manager's office and told her what happened and asked for a new envelope for Ann's statement so she would not feel embarrassed that someone had inadvertently opened it.  That bitch of an office manager refused (even though the envelopes were on site), and weakly grinned that I simply needed to admit to Ann what I had done when handing over the paycheck.  I ....... did.  Ann was not pleased, of course.  We were both mortified. 
     
The most interesting thing for me is that knowing the amount of someone else is negative. Why?

Because now the other person assumes that you know how much they make, and they do not know how much you make. They may assume you feel superior because you make more, or angry because you make less. Either way, it's something they would rather keep private.

I worked at a company 25 years ago that was subject to something called Schedule G by the IRS. Someone realized that said schedule meant that the salary of anyone who made > $50k/yr was considered public information. That spreadsheet flew around the office at the speed of light. I was making $11k more than my immediate supervisor...I'm sure that went down well!

At least in the engineering world, engineers making more than their supervisor isn't too uncommon of an experience depending on how the job duties are set up. I remember my first boss out of college quietly telling me that I would be surprised what some of the long-time employees were making kind of hinting to me that I was probably making more than a couple of them. I don't know if he meant it this way, but it told me "the only way you're making more money here is by quitting and then coming back." And sure enough, almost every single new college hire was out of there after about 3 years of experience.

Another job I worked at was a team of engineers but the manager came from a manufacturing background so knew relatively little about the software process. I wouldn't be surprised if half of the team was paid more than he was.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Zamboni on January 16, 2022, 10:35:23 AM
The fact that it is common in technical fields for the people with technical backgrounds to make more than their managers doesn't mean it doesn't make the poor managers really, really mad. Some managers think they should always make more than everyone else in the group. My most recent FU money story involved exactly that scenario.

Basically I was splitting my time between two departments 60/40. The 60% department had hired me, was more mission critical for the organization, and was 100% reliant on my technical skillset. The 40% portion of my job was more administrative but still required my technical skillset, and that group manager didn't seem to understand that. She had no technical skills at all, and in fact was a spousal hire, and somehow she had gotten put in charge of this small group. Don't even get me started on the spousal hire thing, which can work out in some circumstances, but which has generally been a major problem various places I have worked.

So I was split between these departments and the bigger boss (boss's boss) decided I was doing such an outstanding job in the 60% mission critical role that he called me out of the blue and gave me a gigantic, out of cycle raise because he was worried that I might leave. I think it was really an equity bump to match my salary to others in that department, but it doesn't really matter why I got this huge raise unexpectedly, obviously I was happy to make more money. This was in early 2010 when companies were still recovering from the 2008 downturn, and I had been hired in 2009 at relatively lower pay because I needed to leave another position and basically was taking what I could get in order to keep working, because I like my work for the most part. When the manager of the 40% side found out, she started acting really nasty to me. After a couple of weeks she point blank told me "you shouldn't be making more than I am. Period."

My response was just to calmly tell her that my salary was still below market value for my skills, it wasn't my fault if she felt she was being underpaid, and that she should take that up with her boss rather than taking it out on me. She had also been angling for a title change the whole time I had been there, complaining that other people in her type of job had a different title. Well, other people had higher qualifications and could contribute to the higher level technical aspects of their group, but again she didn't seem to understand that. So she did go talk to him a couple of weeks later, he told her a raise and title change was a no go due to her lack of qualifications, and after that she proceeded to get even nastier to me.

Long story short, I decided that day that I wasn't working for her anymore. I went to that building twice a week as I was supposed to and went into my office and shut the door to work on whatever suited me while I worked on transitioning to the other role 100%. Any required meetings she held I basically talked as little as possible, which drove her nuts because she knew I know a lot and am comfortable generating ideas and explaining things in simple terms she could understand. It took just over a year to get transferred, but my confidence that it would happen, my lack of really needing the money, and staying friendly with the other people in both departments, whom I liked, made it bearable.

A few years later she had an all-out group mutiny and ended up fired <- not the good kind. Unfortunately before that happened she threw multiple people in her group under the bus and damaged their careers. I was lucky to get out before she was able to do something similar to me.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: mm1970 on January 17, 2022, 12:24:46 PM
Quote
So I was split between these departments and the bigger boss (boss's boss) decided I was doing such an outstanding job in the 60% mission critical role that he called me out of the blue and gave me a gigantic, out of cycle raise because he was worried that I might leave. I think it was really an equity bump to match my salary to others in that department, but it doesn't really matter why I got this huge raise unexpectedly, obviously I was happy to make more money. This was in early 2010 when companies were still recovering from the 2008 downturn, and I had been hired in 2009 at relatively lower pay because I needed to leave another position and basically was taking what I could get in order to keep working, because I like my work for the most part. When the manager of the 40% side found out, she started acting really nasty to me. After a couple of weeks she point blank told me "you shouldn't be making more than I am. Period."

This is unfortunate.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Plina on January 17, 2022, 12:48:23 PM

Right at that time the office manager took another swing around and handed me mine.  She said that since I was going to the warehouse I would be dropping off Ann's to her, and she walked away quickly before I could muster the nerve to say I just opened the confidential pay statement of Ann.

After a few minutes I went to the manager's office and told her what happened and asked for a new envelope for Ann's statement so she would not feel embarrassed that someone had inadvertently opened it.  That bitch of an office manager refused (even though the envelopes were on site), and weakly grinned that I simply needed to admit to Ann what I had done when handing over the paycheck.  I ....... did.  Ann was not pleased, of course.  We were both mortified. 
     
The most interesting thing for me is that knowing the amount of someone else is negative. Why?

That is an excellent way to keep wages down. I normally check the wages of my future colleagues before I am offered a job so I see this only as positive. But I had a colleague that came from academia to consulting and she accepted a salary that she was not satisfied with. Before the next salary decision I told her what I had and I found out hers and another colleague of mine. She had lower then me and I had a bit lower then him but based on his background I would have thought he had a lot more. So basically I was pretty happy with my salary after that talk and she was not. The interesting thing was that she was pretty vocal that she didn’t want to stay at the firm but she could not afford to work less (which she would have been allowed due to kids). I think she continued to sulk for a year after I left before she also left.

The manager told me that I had one of the highest salaries in the firm and showed me some graphs. I would have guessed that I was in the same ballpark as he. But he quieted down when I pointed out that those were salaries for engineers and I was a lawyer so he was comparing apples with oranges. My colleagues also had a lot lower billing tagets, which he also had convingly forgotten. He left the company about a year after I left when he came back from paternity leave. I heard that they were not that happy with his performance. I was not the only one that left. I would not be surprised if my and others exit interviews paid a role in that. I guess it also paid a role in that I didn’t later get a consulting agreement with them as my colleagues but I never got among well with the boss boss either. Frankly, my boss was a good project manager but a really lousy manager. The boss boss could never respond to anything, he always responded he would think about it and get back to you. Yeah, right! But I miss some of my colleagues.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Zamboni on January 17, 2022, 03:54:54 PM
^^The weird part about it all was that she had a super easy job. She had all very motivated professionals in the group doing above and beyond everything that needed to be done. All she had to do was smile, turn in personnel reviews once a year, and take credit for her productive team, and she could have stayed in the job forever making a LOT of money for someone with her credentials. Basically it's a necessary function that no one really cares about, and it's not a gateway to other higher management roles. So just kick back and collect your above average paycheck while your employees get it all done perfectly, and don't make waves? Instead, she whined and connived and feuded with others and ended up losing her job.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: SwordGuy on January 17, 2022, 04:35:02 PM
^^The weird part about it all was that she had a super easy job. She had all very motivated professionals in the group doing above and beyond everything that needed to be done. All she had to do was smile, turn in personnel reviews once a year, and take credit for her productive team, and she could have stayed in the job forever making a LOT of money for someone with her credentials. Basically it's a necessary function that no one really cares about, and it's not a gateway to other higher management roles. So just kick back and collect your above average paycheck while your employees get it all done perfectly, and don't make waves? Instead, she whined and connived and feuded with others and ended up losing her job.

Hater's gotta hate.   Whiners gotta whine.   And backstabbing liars gotta backstab and lie.

People are who they are until they're motivated to change for the better or worse.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Psychstache on January 17, 2022, 06:57:28 PM
^^The weird part about it all was that she had a super easy job. She had all very motivated professionals in the group doing above and beyond everything that needed to be done. All she had to do was smile, turn in personnel reviews once a year, and take credit for her productive team, and she could have stayed in the job forever making a LOT of money for someone with her credentials. Basically it's a necessary function that no one really cares about, and it's not a gateway to other higher management roles. So just kick back and collect your above average paycheck while your employees get it all done perfectly, and don't make waves? Instead, she whined and connived and feuded with others and ended up losing her job.

Hater's gotta hate.   Whiners gotta whine.   And backstabbing liars gotta backstab and lie.

People are who they are until they're motivated to change for the better or worse.

something something the frog and the scorpion something something.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: SwordGuy on January 17, 2022, 07:44:33 PM
something something the frog and the scorpion something something.
Very apt!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: gooki on January 17, 2022, 07:51:02 PM
^^The weird part about it all was that she had a super easy job. She had all very motivated professionals in the group doing above and beyond everything that needed to be done. All she had to do was smile, turn in personnel reviews once a year, and take credit for her productive team,

It's so refreshing when you get a manager that understands this.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Warlord1986 on January 18, 2022, 10:59:51 AM
^^The weird part about it all was that she had a super easy job. She had all very motivated professionals in the group doing above and beyond everything that needed to be done. All she had to do was smile, turn in personnel reviews once a year, and take credit for her productive team, and she could have stayed in the job forever making a LOT of money for someone with her credentials. Basically it's a necessary function that no one really cares about, and it's not a gateway to other higher management roles. So just kick back and collect your above average paycheck while your employees get it all done perfectly, and don't make waves? Instead, she whined and connived and feuded with others and ended up losing her job.

Bless her little heart. Some people really are dumber than a sack of hammers.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: EnjoyTheJourney on January 22, 2022, 10:58:02 AM
"FU" would be stronger language than I'd use to characterize the way I left my last job. But, leaving was still satisfying.

This past fall the institution's president and provost decided to force all faculty to teach on campus this spring. It was announced very shortly before spring schedules were finalized, when the fall semester was already underway. Even the small number of us who, for personal or medical reasons, had been teaching fully online even before the pandemic were told to hurry up and submit paperwork to have leave approved either under the state or federal family leave act, as otherwise we would be teaching on campus in the spring. The timeline for that was short, by that point, and it would have been a challenge to get the appointments needed completed in time, along with the paperwork. All this took place while the delta variant was on the rise.

The dean for our school didn't push back against the rushed way this was handled or against the shift to doing the bare legal minimum vis a vis allowing faculty to teach fully online when dealing with challenging circumstances.

I warned the head of our unit that working was a voluntary act on my part and that I could leave whenever I chose (we've been financially ready for retirement for a few years now). I wrote a draft email intended for the provost and president outlining why the changes were unnecessarily rushed and in the longer run counterproductive. Then I realized that I was trying to do the dean's job for him, given that it's his job to protect the school, and not mine. I deleted the draft email and shifted to planning for retirement. My paperwork has been submitted and I will not be teaching this spring semester.

Being retired feels awesome.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Loren Ver on January 22, 2022, 01:34:15 PM
Congratulations!  Enjoy, Enjoy!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: AMandM on January 22, 2022, 02:51:20 PM
I deleted the draft email and shifted to planning for retirement.

That's the real FU part.

Congrats on your retirement!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Dicey on January 22, 2022, 03:25:17 PM
"FU" would be stronger language than I'd use to characterize the way I left my last job. But, leaving was still satisfying.

This past fall the institution's president and provost decided to force all faculty to teach on campus this spring. It was announced very shortly before spring schedules were finalized, when the fall semester was already underway. Even the small number of us who, for personal or medical reasons, had been teaching fully online even before the pandemic were told to hurry up and submit paperwork to have leave approved either under the state or federal family leave act, as otherwise we would be teaching on campus in the spring. The timeline for that was short, by that point, and it would have been a challenge to get the appointments needed completed in time, along with the paperwork. All this took place while the delta variant was on the rise.

The dean for our school didn't push back against the rushed way this was handled or against the shift to doing the bare legal minimum vis a vis allowing faculty to teach fully online when dealing with challenging circumstances.

I warned the head of our unit that working was a voluntary act on my part and that I could leave whenever I chose (we've been financially ready for retirement for a few years now). I wrote a draft email intended for the provost and president outlining why the changes were unnecessarily rushed and in the longer run counterproductive. Then I realized that I was trying to do the dean's job for him, given that it's his job to protect the school, and not mine. I deleted the draft email and shifted to planning for retirement. My paperwork has been submitted and I will not be teaching this spring semester.

Being retired feels awesome.
Adding another hearty congratulations to the pile!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Zamboni on January 24, 2022, 04:39:16 PM
Well done, EnjoyTheJourney!

Deans are basically bobbleheads. It's sad.

And you made the right call! My own little college has had almost 1800 students with positive COVID results already this Spring, while state college down the road has over 3500. Teaching in person is turning out to be a pain when a half dozen students in each class are quarantined every week. All absent students now have the expectation that everything, including lecture videos and all opportunities for class participation, will also be online. So we are all teaching on demand hybrid courses. Fun times!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: DadJokes on January 25, 2022, 06:00:49 AM
"FU" would be stronger language than I'd use to characterize the way I left my last job. But, leaving was still satisfying.

This past fall the institution's president and provost decided to force all faculty to teach on campus this spring. It was announced very shortly before spring schedules were finalized, when the fall semester was already underway. Even the small number of us who, for personal or medical reasons, had been teaching fully online even before the pandemic were told to hurry up and submit paperwork to have leave approved either under the state or federal family leave act, as otherwise we would be teaching on campus in the spring. The timeline for that was short, by that point, and it would have been a challenge to get the appointments needed completed in time, along with the paperwork. All this took place while the delta variant was on the rise.

The dean for our school didn't push back against the rushed way this was handled or against the shift to doing the bare legal minimum vis a vis allowing faculty to teach fully online when dealing with challenging circumstances.

I warned the head of our unit that working was a voluntary act on my part and that I could leave whenever I chose (we've been financially ready for retirement for a few years now). I wrote a draft email intended for the provost and president outlining why the changes were unnecessarily rushed and in the longer run counterproductive. Then I realized that I was trying to do the dean's job for him, given that it's his job to protect the school, and not mine. I deleted the draft email and shifted to planning for retirement. My paperwork has been submitted and I will not be teaching this spring semester.

Being retired feels awesome.

Is this you?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RrOzY86YcEM

I assume not, but I couldn't help but think of that video when I read your post. Congratulations on your retirement!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: EnjoyTheJourney on January 25, 2022, 07:54:07 AM
...

Is this you?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RrOzY86YcEM

I assume not, but I couldn't help but think of that video when I read your post. Congratulations on your retirement!
No, that's not me.

That person seems to be engaging in a kind of primal scream. If that faculty member posted here, then there might be a lot more salty language than the kind in my post.

There are probably a lot of educators at all levels in the education industry weighing quitting, at this point. We've been privileged in how we can go ahead with those plans; if more were financially ready, there would undoubtedly be more educators leaving the profession. This website and a couple of others were helpful for us reaching that goal; we had no idea a pandemic was coming, and that just makes us appreciate more how much this website has helped us.

Well done, EnjoyTheJourney!

Deans are basically bobbleheads. It's sad.

And you made the right call! My own little college has had almost 1800 students with positive COVID results already this Spring, while state college down the road has over 3500. Teaching in person is turning out to be a pain when a half dozen students in each class are quarantined every week. All absent students now have the expectation that everything, including lecture videos and all opportunities for class participation, will also be online. So we are all teaching on demand hybrid courses. Fun times!
My former dean used to be a professor and he empathized relatively well with faculty. He would also push back at times to protect the school's faculty from interference from above. Unfortunately, in the last few years he seems to have pretty much turned into an administrative bobblehead.

As an example of how far he has shifted, he had OK'd purely online teaching for me and a handful of others for whom circumstances made that a reasonable choice. When he was asked why he didn't try to push back against the move to force everybody back on campus in a short time frame, regardless of how they were teaching before the pandemic, he said he didn't push back because the change would only affect a small number of people.

When I found out about that, the choice to leave became quite a bit easier to make.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: maisymouser on January 25, 2022, 10:42:04 AM
"FU" would be stronger language than I'd use to characterize the way I left my last job. But, leaving was still satisfying.

This past fall the institution's president and provost decided to force all faculty to teach on campus this spring. It was announced very shortly before spring schedules were finalized, when the fall semester was already underway. Even the small number of us who, for personal or medical reasons, had been teaching fully online even before the pandemic were told to hurry up and submit paperwork to have leave approved either under the state or federal family leave act, as otherwise we would be teaching on campus in the spring. The timeline for that was short, by that point, and it would have been a challenge to get the appointments needed completed in time, along with the paperwork. All this took place while the delta variant was on the rise.

The dean for our school didn't push back against the rushed way this was handled or against the shift to doing the bare legal minimum vis a vis allowing faculty to teach fully online when dealing with challenging circumstances.

I warned the head of our unit that working was a voluntary act on my part and that I could leave whenever I chose (we've been financially ready for retirement for a few years now). I wrote a draft email intended for the provost and president outlining why the changes were unnecessarily rushed and in the longer run counterproductive. Then I realized that I was trying to do the dean's job for him, given that it's his job to protect the school, and not mine. I deleted the draft email and shifted to planning for retirement. My paperwork has been submitted and I will not be teaching this spring semester.

Being retired feels awesome.

Is this you?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RrOzY86YcEM

I assume not, but I couldn't help but think of that video when I read your post. Congratulations on your retirement!

Ah, thank you for sharing this @DadJokes. I haven't grinned this widely in a looooong time.

For some context, he has a follow-up video explaining how this is all part of his course. (not sure how that works now that he's on leave/suspended?) Anyway, I found it very refreshing and much more exciting, spurring more critical thinking than I had in my college courses back in ~2009.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: jinga nation on February 07, 2022, 11:08:11 AM
I don't know if my situation is a FU money story or a MPP. (If y'all say MPP, I'll move it there.)

A couple of weeks ago, a cloud service provider (CSP) recruiter contacted me for a position. A relative works there. Had the 30 minute screening call (which was almost an hour) and it went well, which opened up a few different opportunities in different customer sectors due to my background and experience. I was to send my résumé to recruiter and they would let me know "as soon as possible". I asked them to clarify benefits, working hours, etc.

However, this was just before the holidays, so I didn't expect a reply. But it got me thinking. Do I really want this position? To have this big name company on my résumé, and for what? I've done stints are 3 other Fortune 500s where I was a just a small tooth on a cog, in an organization of hundreds of cogs. I talked to my relative, who explained the interview process, and how to prepare, etc.

The recruiter explained the benefits, said they were excellent for the industry. 10 days of time off for the first 3 years, use as you accrue, and 6 personal days, plus 7 public holidays. The base pay he mentioned was about $4k more than I get. But the real trade off is the stock (RSU). CSP is known for having a wrote in stone pay/RSU policy, there's no negotiating. They lock in your pay/RSU for 4 years.

Current small sized employer has a rule that as long as I bill customer 1800H/year, or 150H/month on average, I can take the rest of the time off. Since non-billable time is minimal, less than 8H/year, I get PTO of 5 weeks. Plus I get 10 public holidays (work in the DoD sector, so get President's Day, Veterans' Day, Columbus Day).

In essence, I'd be trading time off for stock and a few more work hours per week and increased travel (when the company lifts the work from home rule). New job would be 20-30% domestic flying around and 45H/week of billing.

I work for a good, small professional services company, we've become known for a niche specialty, our CEO and CTO are always working on new contracts/renewals and they have a technical background where the company culture is excellent. Lots of autonomy, I am a team/project lead, and help on other projects too, some proposals and proof-of-concepts.

Currently I work from home and travel to local customer site 2-3 days/week. I'm home by 4pm, drop my young kids for their sports training and go exercise. Help out kids with homework after dinner and help the wife cook/clean up the kitchen. No out of town travel away from family. Plus get to see my dad over dinner 2-3x/week when he joins us.

Wife and I have good pay, rental income from several condos, 2 homes (renovating one, then moving in, and selling the old one in this crazy  RE market), and retirement/brokerage accounts. We aren't in need of more money (and more stress) at the expense of a balanced work/life routine. My wife is looking at changing jobs to a less stressful and lesser hours gig.

We have FU money, we are technically FI, in the 2 comma club. We're already talking about me going FIRE in 12 years, when I turn 55 (because my job and industry is fun, because the people are fun). Wife probably will be retiring earlier. And we'll downsize. All this is in the IPS/long-term plan.

I don't need or want the CSP gig.

Thanks FU Money.

Update time:
The recruiter ghosted me. But I'm a stickler for professionalism, so I contacted him to see if it was still open or the slot had been filled. He replied that it was filled, without any apology or reason for lack of earlier response. Fine, it is what it is.
Last week, a hiring manager from same CSP asks me for my resume. Told him that I've been ghosted by a recruiter thus am wary of CSP's hiring process. He said he's directly responsible for filling job openings, not a recruiter, so we have back and forth messages on a professional networking website. Agree to talk on the phone, but time and date not fixed. This morning, reading my tech newsletters, came across this: https://medium.com/geekculture/my-amazon-reptilian-brain-86607f0e7193
I didn't want to get CSP's corporate mindthink process embedded in me. I didn't want my career with CSP to be determined by CSP's leadership principles. (FWIW, I subscribe to IEEE's Code of Ethics (https://www.ieee.org/about/corporate/governance/p7-8.html) since becoming a student member in 2001.)
This morning, replied to the hiring manager and said I'll pass on any opportunity.
Wasn't worth it, with their world-class "10-days of time-off" for the first 3 years. No amount of RSU/stock can substitute for the 5-6 weeks of time off I get currently for spending time with family and an aging parent.
Coincidentally, a high school friend works for the same CSP on the infrastructure side, in Europe, as a chartered civil engineer. He's been there a year, but is planning to move on in the near future. He isn't happy, and said benefits are worse compared to the traditional civil engineering companies.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: SwordGuy on March 15, 2022, 11:44:23 PM
My FU story is a bit different from ones I've told in the past.

I guess I'll start with the time-honored question, "What is FU money for?"

It's the ability to have a certain amount of freedom to do what ought or needs to be done.   

For example, one might use that freedom to tell an abusive person in authority, "No.  That is unacceptable."

Or one might use it to walk away from an intolerable situation.

Those two situations probably cover 95+% of all FU stories.

In my FU story, which is currently ongoing, I'm doing both.

I'm giving a big FU to an abusive person in authority and I'm using FU money to enable walking away.

"But, SwordGuy, aren't you already retired for almost 4 years?"

Yeah, I retired from my place of employment, but I didn't retire from being a responsible citizen of the world.

I used some of my FU money to send funds to the Ukrainian Army as a FU to Putin.   I'll be sending more each month because he's a person in authority that needs to receive as many FUs as it's possible to deliver.    In case you want to hire the Ukrainian Army to deliver some FUs on your behalf, here's the link:  https://bank.gov.ua/en/news/all/natsionalniy-bank-vidkriv-spetsrahunok-dlya-zboru-koshtiv-na-potrebi-armiyi (https://bank.gov.ua/en/news/all/natsionalniy-bank-vidkriv-spetsrahunok-dlya-zboru-koshtiv-na-potrebi-armiyi)

We've opened up our home to a refugee from Ukraine.    As some of you know, I make art (such as it is) in a variety of mediums.   So rather than just put a random person (and possibly their kids) in our spare bedroom, I looked for an artist who already knew how to sell products on the internet and made things that could be made in my own workshops at home.   That way, they would have a place to live and a way to make money until they could go home or get back on their feet.   They'll arrive in a couple of weeks.    This particular artist already had a visa from an earlier exhibition of their work, so we (hopefully) dodged that bullet.

But don't worry, I have several more refugee artists that could be helped.   All that's needed is a place to live and a place nearby to make their work (and possibly some FU money used to purchase some initial supplies on their behalf).   

Right now, I'm looking for a place for a ceramic artist, a graphic artist/jr web developer, a wood/resin worker, and a pianist.   Some are alone, some have a kid or two.   I expect more will contact me.   I've been reading the US Foreign Affairs Manual to learn the rules for visas and working in country so that I can write a solid invitation letter that won't cause problems with getting a visa or at the US border.

I have to tell you, this is the best FU money I've ever used because it's literally being used for real freedom.

And when my kids and grandkids ask what I did during this extremely difficult time in our world's history, where freedom is on the line, I'll be able to tell them with pride about my efforts.   As General Patton would say, I won't have to tell them I shoveled shit in Louisiana or be limited to bragging about my high savings rate this year.

I hope I'll hear from you with explanations of how you're using some FU money in a similar way.

Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: eyesonthehorizon on March 16, 2022, 02:21:40 AM
... We've opened up our home to a refugee from Ukraine. ...
This is the best thing I’ve heard on this forum since the legal victory to reunite a family across the border. I’m so glad you had & took the opportunity. It will be a joyful house to have so many people in it creating beautiful things in a difficult era. (My FU money went to healing Putin-inflicted injuries, but if I’m being honest I hope most sincerely that he gets a piece of your mind.)
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: iluvzbeach on March 16, 2022, 07:16:31 AM
Swordguy, what you’re doing is really incredible. Thank you!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: zolotiyeruki on March 16, 2022, 07:25:36 AM
SwordGuy, you and I disagree on a lot of stuff, but I think what you're doing is awesome, and a great example to follow.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: AlanStache on March 16, 2022, 08:32:11 AM
Swordguy - would you consider starting a new thread devoted to this (if there is not one already) so we can have one consolidated reference?
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: HawkeyeNFO on March 16, 2022, 10:18:39 AM
FUCK YEAH, Swordguy!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: SwordGuy on March 16, 2022, 10:25:18 AM
Swordguy - would you consider starting a new thread devoted to this (if there is not one already) so we can have one consolidated reference?

Per your request:

https://forum.mrmoneymustache.com/welcome-to-the-forum/epic-fu-money-stories-to-help-others/ (https://forum.mrmoneymustache.com/welcome-to-the-forum/epic-fu-money-stories-to-help-others/)
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Shane on March 16, 2022, 10:33:34 AM
Go SwordGuy!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: gooki on March 16, 2022, 11:21:01 PM
And continuing on from my wife's epic FU story. She's now poached one of her former colleagues.

Apparently my wifes old manager is furious. Wife's response was classic on hearing this "I don't care, she hated me already".
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: RyanAtTanagra on March 17, 2022, 09:32:20 AM
And continuing on from my wife's epic FU story. She's now poached one of her former colleagues.

Apparently my wifes old manager is furious. Wife's response was classic on hearing this "I don't care, she hated me already".

The ultimate FU, when you continue to F them after you're gone.  Love it.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: bob2021 on March 29, 2022, 11:15:43 AM
My FU story is not contentious, but I like to think it worked out pretty well for me. I've been waiting to write this for the last 2 years :-).

Backstory:
In 2018 we were approaching "our number" and starting to look at what we wanted retirement to look like (I found MMM in 2013 and it clearly articulated a lot of thoughts I had about being FI by 50). We lived near downtown in a good sized city and were looking for something a little more relaxed. We couldn't agree on where we wanted to go and I thought we might actually stay where we were. In 2019, some friends of ours had picked up and moved to a small community with great outdoors (skiing, golf, hiking, lakes, etc all close by). After talking to them, we bought a lot and decided to build a house.

I had "the talk" with my boss that I was moving in 2020 and intending to quit. Within a couple days, HR wanted to talk. HR and a couple leaders I worked for wanted to know if there was a scenario where I would stay. We agreed that I'd work 3 days a week, and spend one week a month in the corporate office. At 42, and after 2 years of this (and because of COVID, I haven't been to the office since moving), I've decided I'm done and told my boss I'm leaving at the end of June. I've got a new part-time "job" that hardly even counts as it has extreme flexibility and is something I've been volunteering with already. So, nothing contentious, but FI has allowed us to end up in a place better than we imagined, and I was able to squeeze out some pretty good work terms while I OMY'd a couple times (and stress went way down once my "give a f*ck meter" got recalibrated).
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Shane on March 29, 2022, 12:56:14 PM
Congrats, bob! Good for you. Hope you enjoy your retirement.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: BicycleB on March 29, 2022, 04:22:52 PM
Great story, @bob2021!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Dicey on March 29, 2022, 08:49:24 PM
L love it when someone drops the invisibility cloak of lurkdom to throw down a tale as good as that. Congratulations @bob2021!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: shingy on May 22, 2022, 09:17:36 AM
I love this thread, but it's been too quiet lately. There's gotta be some epic FU stories happening during the "Great Resignation"!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Chaplin on May 22, 2022, 09:23:28 AM
I love this thread, but it's been too quiet lately. There's gotta be some epic FU stories happening during the "Great Resignation"!

I wonder how much epicness had to do with rarity. If lots of people are moving around it just becomes normal. It's so easy to move around that the tension necessary to create an epic story doesn't have time to develop.

But yes, we need more epic stories!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: SwordGuy on May 22, 2022, 10:48:20 PM
City clerk wanted to take some vacation days, the city refused.

Clerk up and quit.

City government has had to shut down because she quit.  (It's a very small town.)

https://www.msn.com/en-us/lifestyle/travel/a-maine-town-reportedly-shut-down-after-its-only-clerk-quit-when-her-vacation-request-was-denied/ar-AAXz0i3 (https://www.msn.com/en-us/lifestyle/travel/a-maine-town-reportedly-shut-down-after-its-only-clerk-quit-when-her-vacation-request-was-denied/ar-AAXz0i3)
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Malossi792 on May 23, 2022, 01:23:42 PM
I limped along for about 2yrs at work and ultimately developed depression, anxiety and terrible insomnia.  20/20 if I had to do it all over again I wouldn't have wasted those two years of my life as a shell of my former self.  Finally last October I told my boss to fuck himself (literally I said that) and resigned and spent the rest of my days driving a supercar to work and flexing hard on my boss.  7mo later and they still haven't found a replacement for me, I work as an independent contractor two days a week doing way less work but get paid twice as much....and get paid hourly.  This is they way.  Still have the same boss, btw, but the power dynamic is the exact opposite.
Batsignal @big_owl
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Gronnie on May 26, 2022, 03:01:43 PM
I don't know if my situation is a FU money story or a MPP. (If y'all say MPP, I'll move it there.)

A couple of weeks ago, a cloud service provider (CSP) recruiter contacted me for a position. A relative works there. Had the 30 minute screening call (which was almost an hour) and it went well, which opened up a few different opportunities in different customer sectors due to my background and experience. I was to send my résumé to recruiter and they would let me know "as soon as possible". I asked them to clarify benefits, working hours, etc.

However, this was just before the holidays, so I didn't expect a reply. But it got me thinking. Do I really want this position? To have this big name company on my résumé, and for what? I've done stints are 3 other Fortune 500s where I was a just a small tooth on a cog, in an organization of hundreds of cogs. I talked to my relative, who explained the interview process, and how to prepare, etc.

The recruiter explained the benefits, said they were excellent for the industry. 10 days of time off for the first 3 years, use as you accrue, and 6 personal days, plus 7 public holidays. The base pay he mentioned was about $4k more than I get. But the real trade off is the stock (RSU). CSP is known for having a wrote in stone pay/RSU policy, there's no negotiating. They lock in your pay/RSU for 4 years.

Current small sized employer has a rule that as long as I bill customer 1800H/year, or 150H/month on average, I can take the rest of the time off. Since non-billable time is minimal, less than 8H/year, I get PTO of 5 weeks. Plus I get 10 public holidays (work in the DoD sector, so get President's Day, Veterans' Day, Columbus Day).

In essence, I'd be trading time off for stock and a few more work hours per week and increased travel (when the company lifts the work from home rule). New job would be 20-30% domestic flying around and 45H/week of billing.

I work for a good, small professional services company, we've become known for a niche specialty, our CEO and CTO are always working on new contracts/renewals and they have a technical background where the company culture is excellent. Lots of autonomy, I am a team/project lead, and help on other projects too, some proposals and proof-of-concepts.

Currently I work from home and travel to local customer site 2-3 days/week. I'm home by 4pm, drop my young kids for their sports training and go exercise. Help out kids with homework after dinner and help the wife cook/clean up the kitchen. No out of town travel away from family. Plus get to see my dad over dinner 2-3x/week when he joins us.

Wife and I have good pay, rental income from several condos, 2 homes (renovating one, then moving in, and selling the old one in this crazy  RE market), and retirement/brokerage accounts. We aren't in need of more money (and more stress) at the expense of a balanced work/life routine. My wife is looking at changing jobs to a less stressful and lesser hours gig.

We have FU money, we are technically FI, in the 2 comma club. We're already talking about me going FIRE in 12 years, when I turn 55 (because my job and industry is fun, because the people are fun). Wife probably will be retiring earlier. And we'll downsize. All this is in the IPS/long-term plan.

I don't need or want the CSP gig.

Thanks FU Money.

Update time:
The recruiter ghosted me. But I'm a stickler for professionalism, so I contacted him to see if it was still open or the slot had been filled. He replied that it was filled, without any apology or reason for lack of earlier response. Fine, it is what it is.
Last week, a hiring manager from same CSP asks me for my resume. Told him that I've been ghosted by a recruiter thus am wary of CSP's hiring process. He said he's directly responsible for filling job openings, not a recruiter, so we have back and forth messages on a professional networking website. Agree to talk on the phone, but time and date not fixed. This morning, reading my tech newsletters, came across this: https://medium.com/geekculture/my-amazon-reptilian-brain-86607f0e7193
I didn't want to get CSP's corporate mindthink process embedded in me. I didn't want my career with CSP to be determined by CSP's leadership principles. (FWIW, I subscribe to IEEE's Code of Ethics (https://www.ieee.org/about/corporate/governance/p7-8.html) since becoming a student member in 2001.)
This morning, replied to the hiring manager and said I'll pass on any opportunity.
Wasn't worth it, with their world-class "10-days of time-off" for the first 3 years. No amount of RSU/stock can substitute for the 5-6 weeks of time off I get currently for spending time with family and an aging parent.
Coincidentally, a high school friend works for the same CSP on the infrastructure side, in Europe, as a chartered civil engineer. He's been there a year, but is planning to move on in the near future. He isn't happy, and said benefits are worse compared to the traditional civil engineering companies.

2 weeks vacation working as a professional in the tech industry? That's awful! Truly makes me appreciate working for a company with a take as much as you want policy (that actually means it and basically has never even blinked an eye at one of my vacation requests).
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: uniwelder on May 26, 2022, 03:30:28 PM
City clerk wanted to take some vacation days, the city refused.

Clerk up and quit.

City government has had to shut down because she quit.  (It's a very small town.)

https://www.msn.com/en-us/lifestyle/travel/a-maine-town-reportedly-shut-down-after-its-only-clerk-quit-when-her-vacation-request-was-denied/ar-AAXz0i3 (https://www.msn.com/en-us/lifestyle/travel/a-maine-town-reportedly-shut-down-after-its-only-clerk-quit-when-her-vacation-request-was-denied/ar-AAXz0i3)

Thanks for posting this!  From what I read, the position was only paid 16 hours per week anyway, even though she reportedly worked more than that trying to keep up with the demands of that responsibility plus others.  Some people can be really short sighted.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: AccidentialMustache on June 25, 2022, 11:08:59 PM
I don't think I ever posted mine here... Or if I did search is failing me. These are both in the past, and while the second is pandemic, it is pre-"great resignation" movement.

----

A long time ago: Shenanigans were afoot and my team had to apply to an internal, team-only search in order to re-title our jobs. Everyone was "supposed" to know what position to apply for. Well I looked at the positions and was like, "I'm doing everything in the Senior position", especially since I had been interim manager for the team for months before they hired a permanent manager (I didn't want the manager position).

So shenanigan go down, I'm "coached" verbally (eg, not recorded) to apply for the proper position. I do, but I also apply for another position, but programming instead of sysadmin. Crucially the new position was a "12-month contract" position. HR comes to my office, closes the door and says, "you do know this is only a 12-month position and you wouldn't be guaranteed a renewal?" In their defense, maybe they were concerned I was out for the FMLA 12 weeks of parental leave (all paid, I had vacation and sick to burn) while the shenanigans were going on.

My response was simply, "Yes I know what '12-month contract' means." Suddenly there was an opportunity to start working with the programming team, while still doing my sysadmin day job, with a plan of transitioning over "once my sysadmin duties completed." Well that never happened because I quit and went into the private sector instead. But a no-fear attitude apparently ruffled some feathers in an unsuccessful attempt to retain me.

----

More recently: I was shown the door at my previous gig. The pitch I was sold didn't match reality a few months in and needless to say I was not happy. I had been debating do I leave or do I shut up, buckle down, and ride it out for a year or two and hope for a stock payout to take us to "instant fire even if we'd started from 0".

CTO/Head HR calls me on a Friday afternoon. Well as soon as I hear them both on the line I know there's only one reason they're both here. CTO dances around the topic, I guess to soften it or something, but eventually manages to say my employment is terminated.

I laughed in response.

There was dead silence for a long time after I finished laughing. 10 seconds? 20? I think I asked if they were still there.

Why did I laugh? Well, one, FU money. We'd had a pile of cash ready for a downpayment for a new rental (if we could find one or two), so we had a year+ of runway. Two, I'd started the interview process with a recruiter who reached out. I figured I better get in practice if I was going to go job hunting and DW had convinced me staying wasn't actually an option. So yeah, kinda heading out the door already and you want to give me all the time I need to interview, decompress, and pay me a severance for the privilege?

Youbetcha I had a good laugh, at their literal expense.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: LennStar on June 26, 2022, 01:43:39 AM
A good laugh is good to your health!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Zamboni on June 26, 2022, 06:39:45 PM
^^Yeah, that had to feel great to be planning to quit anyway and then have them give you a severance package. Well done!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Zamboni on June 29, 2022, 11:07:15 AM
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_G-sijKNU9c (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_G-sijKNU9c)

This one really makes me laugh. I totally identify with the guy being interviewed.

I once had a Sunday only gig at Au Bon Pain that went down pretty much like that, although not with the masterful note on the door referring people to other stores . . . that was definitely the epic part in this story!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: zolotiyeruki on June 29, 2022, 11:41:40 AM
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_G-sijKNU9c (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_G-sijKNU9c)

This one really makes me laugh. I totally identify with the guy being interviewed.
Holy smokes, that guy looks like Comic Book Guy from the Simpsons!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: solon on June 29, 2022, 01:06:35 PM
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_G-sijKNU9c (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_G-sijKNU9c)

This one really makes me laugh. I totally identify with the guy being interviewed.
Holy smokes, that guy looks like Comic Book Guy from the Simpsons!

I was bored to tears. If I was that guy's manager I would have fired him long ago out of shear boredom!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Zamboni on June 29, 2022, 01:34:05 PM
^It definitely went on too long . . . the whole video piece could have been cut to 1/3 the length.

Nonetheless, I don't blame the guy being interviewed. He's probably was a decent employee who showed up on time and did the job he's supposed to do. So here's a couple of employees making a good faith effort, and some idiot regional manager wants to fire them randomly to try to save a buck an hour or something? Yeah, I hope they are plagued by labor woes for ever after at this point.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: stashgrower on July 04, 2022, 06:51:28 AM

I'm giving a big FU to an abusive person in authority and I'm using FU money to enable walking away.

"But, SwordGuy, aren't you already retired for almost 4 years?"

Yeah, I retired from my place of employment, but I didn't retire from being a responsible citizen of the world.

...

I have to tell you, this is the best FU money I've ever used because it's literally being used for real freedom.


SwordGuy your FU story rocks!!!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: samanil on July 05, 2022, 07:16:42 PM
Nothing too crazy, but my site lead was becoming an intolerable pain in the ass--impatient and pushy and snippy basically all of the time, despite everyone working hard and doing their best, which in almost all cases was good enough. It reached a point where I woke up in the middle of the night with chest pain and decided enough is enough.

The next day I told him if the high tension vibe continued, I was out of there. "I'm on the brink of throwing in the towel," I told him.

He changed the beat of his drum--QUICK!!! He backed way off, and it felt incredible.

That very same weekend I started reading the book "Set Boundaries, Find Peace," which I cannot recommend highly enough. One of the ideas is that when you set a boundary, be prepared to defend it. People will test it, and if you don't defend, the boundary disappears.

So sure enough my site lead started being a pain in the ass again. The issue was that I recently asked to drop down to a 4 day work week, which I was allowed to do (I'm 20% retired!). With a 4th of July off, my schedule was basically a 4 day weekend, then a 3 day work week and then another 3 day weekend. He was upset about that (jealous) and rude to me about it, and pressured me to come in to have less time off.

So the next day I said I didn't like being spoken to in that way, and that if he did it again, I would bring it up again. I also said "I am taking 4 days off, then working 3, then taking 3 off." I didn't ask, I told him that's what I was doing. He graciously accepted my boundary (which the book says most people will), which was nice, but I have little doubt he's going to be rude again, in which case I am prepared to say "Please don't use that tone with me".

I have become convinced that failing to set a boundary when someone is rude to you is highly damaging to your mental health. I've realized that the consequence of NOT setting firm boundaries with rude people is far worse than losing my job. Thus, my path forward is very clear: set boundaries no matter what, even if I get fired.

It's pretty liberating to have this clarity. My net worth is somewhere between 1 and 200k. I'm never going back to letting people be rude to me, and I don't give a fuck if it results in me losing my job.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Sandi_k on July 05, 2022, 08:25:46 PM
@samanil - Way to Go!

I applaud your boundary setting - you are entirely correct. I am supposed to be off every other Friday, but since Covid, I have not enforced that boundary firmly.

Now I have a new boss, and he expects me to work every Friday. Kind of. So I am trying to take every Friday off this summer, to reset my energy for the new year.

If you're 20% retired, for a week with a holiday, I would only work 3 days, too. You're doing it right!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Loren Ver on July 06, 2022, 06:33:52 AM
Nothing too crazy, but my site lead was becoming an intolerable pain in the ass--impatient and pushy and snippy basically all of the time, despite everyone working hard and doing their best, which in almost all cases was good enough. It reached a point where I woke up in the middle of the night with chest pain and decided enough is enough.

The next day I told him if the high tension vibe continued, I was out of there. "I'm on the brink of throwing in the towel," I told him.

He changed the beat of his drum--QUICK!!! He backed way off, and it felt incredible.

That very same weekend I started reading the book "Set Boundaries, Find Peace," which I cannot recommend highly enough. One of the ideas is that when you set a boundary, be prepared to defend it. People will test it, and if you don't defend, the boundary disappears.

So sure enough my site lead started being a pain in the ass again. The issue was that I recently asked to drop down to a 4 day work week, which I was allowed to do (I'm 20% retired!). With a 4th of July off, my schedule was basically a 4 day weekend, then a 3 day work week and then another 3 day weekend. He was upset about that (jealous) and rude to me about it, and pressured me to come in to have less time off.

So the next day I said I didn't like being spoken to in that way, and that if he did it again, I would bring it up again. I also said "I am taking 4 days off, then working 3, then taking 3 off." I didn't ask, I told him that's what I was doing. He graciously accepted my boundary (which the book says most people will), which was nice, but I have little doubt he's going to be rude again, in which case I am prepared to say "Please don't use that tone with me".

I have become convinced that failing to set a boundary when someone is rude to you is highly damaging to your mental health. I've realized that the consequence of NOT setting firm boundaries with rude people is far worse than losing my job. Thus, my path forward is very clear: set boundaries no matter what, even if I get fired.

It's pretty liberating to have this clarity. My net worth is somewhere between 1 and 200k. I'm never going back to letting people be rude to me, and I don't give a fuck if it results in me losing my job.

Love this, for several reasons.  First, woohoo for you.  These are skills that will serve you well your whole life.
But hopefully, maybe?, It will also influence those around you.  Maybe the manager will learn a thing (haha, it could happen) but also the other employees might see that boundaries can happen and life is better.

Loren
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: BicycleB on July 06, 2022, 07:53:51 AM
Nothing too crazy, but my site lead was becoming an intolerable pain in the ass--impatient and pushy and snippy basically all of the time, despite everyone working hard and doing their best, which in almost all cases was good enough. It reached a point where I woke up in the middle of the night with chest pain and decided enough is enough.

The next day I told him if the high tension vibe continued, I was out of there. "I'm on the brink of throwing in the towel," I told him.

He changed the beat of his drum--QUICK!!! He backed way off, and it felt incredible.

That very same weekend I started reading the book "Set Boundaries, Find Peace," which I cannot recommend highly enough. One of the ideas is that when you set a boundary, be prepared to defend it. People will test it, and if you don't defend, the boundary disappears.

So sure enough my site lead started being a pain in the ass again. The issue was that I recently asked to drop down to a 4 day work week, which I was allowed to do (I'm 20% retired!). With a 4th of July off, my schedule was basically a 4 day weekend, then a 3 day work week and then another 3 day weekend. He was upset about that (jealous) and rude to me about it, and pressured me to come in to have less time off.

So the next day I said I didn't like being spoken to in that way, and that if he did it again, I would bring it up again. I also said "I am taking 4 days off, then working 3, then taking 3 off." I didn't ask, I told him that's what I was doing. He graciously accepted my boundary (which the book says most people will), which was nice, but I have little doubt he's going to be rude again, in which case I am prepared to say "Please don't use that tone with me".

I have become convinced that failing to set a boundary when someone is rude to you is highly damaging to your mental health. I've realized that the consequence of NOT setting firm boundaries with rude people is far worse than losing my job. Thus, my path forward is very clear: set boundaries no matter what, even if I get fired.

It's pretty liberating to have this clarity. My net worth is somewhere between 1 and 200k. I'm never going back to letting people be rude to me, and I don't give a fuck if it results in me losing my job.

Way to go, @samanil!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Gone_Hiking on July 09, 2022, 10:24:08 PM
After reading so many inspiring stories, I can now contribute my own.

I've been working at a small company since spring last year.  Things went swimmingly well for about 10 months, and then everything suddenly soured.  Really, really soured.  Some health issues crept up, and the boss wasn't understanding.  My performance suddenly wasn't up to standards.  The company finances sucked and I suspected it might go out of business later in the year.  And then there was that pesky issue of company practicing wage theft and thinking that nobody would notice.  New college graduates, for which it was a first job, didn't notice. I did and had enough.  So on the 1st of June I started looking for a new job, preparing to jump ship quickly if needed.

With the job market being what it is, I had four interviews the third week of June.  And that was the week when the company decided to lay off 25% of its workforce.  I was on the list.  Now, I cared too little to be hurt by the deed, but I comforted a younger colleague on her first post-college job for whom this was unexpected and who didn't know how she was going to pay rent next month.  To make the matter worse, the only people who were laid off were individual contributors.  The management that was responsible for the sucky business decisions was all left in place.  And that was the level of moral outrage I needed to burn this bridge.

So the boss, the boss's boss, and the HR lady sit me down, and the boss's boss starts some apology about how he brought me to the company and how he hopes I can find... something... his lack of confidence in me is quite striking.  And then it's time for me to speak.  I unload how all of these people who made the decisions on releasing crappy products keep their jobs while those who faithfully executed these decisions pay the price.  How I came to this company with full faith in quality of the management and found that wage theft is practiced.  How I have already had two interviews in the week with two more scheduled for later and I am not hurt, but it is my third layoff in six years and I ache for those who are being laid off without any idea what to do next.  How my family won't suffer one iota, but so many others don't know how they will pay bills next month.  And how I will not help to find my replacement in case the company starts hiring again because I do not believe anyone should work in a company that is mainly in business of preservation of its leadership. 

After the HR lady read her script, I was escorted to the cube farm to pick up my stuff.  As I opened the door, I yelled "FREEEDOOOM!" as the layoff survivors huddled together.  I left my private business cards on a few desks and then I was gone.  And hugely relieved.

My last day with the company was on June 30th.  I received a job offer on July 1st. 
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: SwordGuy on July 09, 2022, 11:02:57 PM
@Gone_Hiking , congrats on coming thru that mess ok.

Now all that remains to be done is to report them for wage theft.

Wage theft is a heinous crime that should be paid for in blood.  Make them pay as much as the law allows.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Taran Wanderer on July 09, 2022, 11:10:44 PM
That’s awesome. Thanks for sharing.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: LennStar on July 10, 2022, 06:21:50 AM
@Gone_Hiking , congrats on coming thru that mess ok.

Now all that remains to be done is to report them for wage theft.

Wage theft is a heinous crime that should be paid for in blood.  Make them pay as much as the law allows.
What is meant by wage theft?
Can't be not paying, because those paycheck to paycheck people would realize it immediately.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: dandarc on July 10, 2022, 07:25:11 AM
@Gone_Hiking , congrats on coming thru that mess ok.

Now all that remains to be done is to report them for wage theft.

Wage theft is a heinous crime that should be paid for in blood.  Make them pay as much as the law allows.
What is meant by wage theft?
Can't be not paying, because those paycheck to paycheck people would realize it immediately.
Lots of workplace policies out there that are not square with the law that owners get away with until someone reports them. Unpaid overtime or not time and half. Policy resulting in time starting later than it legally should or ending earlier. Depending on job, travel policy can be a place where pay and/or reimbursements are not as much as they should be.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: SwordGuy on July 10, 2022, 09:01:51 AM
@Gone_Hiking , congrats on coming thru that mess ok.

Now all that remains to be done is to report them for wage theft.

Wage theft is a heinous crime that should be paid for in blood.  Make them pay as much as the law allows.
What is meant by wage theft?
Can't be not paying, because those paycheck to paycheck people would realize it immediately.

Because paycheck-to-paycheck people are so good with math?

Here's an overview of wage theft.  https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wage_theft

To put it simply, if there's a way to cheat workers out of what is rightfully owed them, it's been used thousands and thousands of times.

When capitalism was young, they would speed up and slow down the factory clocks.   Now they are much more sophisticated about it.

These should be treated as intentional felonies, not civil matters.    Frankly, I think we should take the managers who steal wages from low wage employees and put their heads on pikes Elizabethan style.  Have the heads rotated between their front yard, their country club entrance, their church, their social clubs, and their professional trade associations. 

"Pour encourager les autres."

But I'm feeling charitable today.


Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: OrangePill on July 11, 2022, 04:46:58 PM
Not necessarily a FU story but more of a cash cushion giving me some freedom story.

About two years ago, I had a job in the city at a small community organisation which helped addicts and paid about 37k a year before taxes. Having read mr mm and other FIRE literature I was well aware of the importance of being frugal and saving money. Unfortunately that salary could only go so far. I was starting to feel desperate having gone to university only to get that low paying gig. I didn’t have much in the way of savings and felt kinda stuck by not wanting to take risks that could mean me having to pay rent without any income.

It’s only after having saved maybe about 30k, that I finally felt I had the necessary cushion to try a transition to a higher paying job. I applied to multiple jobs including one the most well paid in my field of study. I was greatly surprised when I got an offer for a starting 3 months contract at that precise job! It was one hour away from where I lived, I accepted the offer without thinking about it and started two weeks later. That job was at a 71k starting salary increasing each year ( now 73k ). FIRE is still going to take a hell of a long time but I’ve now managed to save more than I thought possible in this time and still working at it.

It really is me knowing I could fall back on my savings the gave me the confidence of taking that risk. What’s funny is it all worked out and I really didn’t need that much of a cushion. For me, it was a lesson in taking risks and that we often put silly doubts in our own mind because of unfounded fears. In the end, it’s the freedom that money gave me that let me take a risk which almost doubled my yearly salary. There’s definitely something about having money that leads you to having more money.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: ATtiny85 on July 11, 2022, 06:18:48 PM
Not necessarily a FU story but more of a cash cushion giving me some freedom story.



It really is me knowing I could fall back on my savings the gave me the confidence of taking that risk.

That’s FU money right there! Nice job!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Gone_Hiking on July 11, 2022, 10:13:43 PM
What is meant by wage theft?
Can't be not paying, because those paycheck to paycheck people would realize it immediately.

What my now former employer did is not a wage theft for hourly workers.  This is a wage theft practiced on salaried people.  Not illegal, but unethical and abusive.

Here is one example.  A scientist colleague took two days vacation, Thursday, and Friday, before Memorial Day last year.  She ended up not working on Thursday, but ended up working most of the day on Friday, and then all day on Memorial Day.  She took two days of vacation even though she worked during one of those days and the holiday!  As the manager explained to me, "she just loves to work".  Not true; the colleague felt subtly pressured to work holidays in order to feel valuable enough not to be subject to a layoff.  She discussed this with me a couple of times.

Example number two.  Another colleague asked whether he could take Friday afternoon off and work half of Saturday instead.  Manager's response?  It would be great if the colleague could work on Saturday, but he needed to take half day off as vacation on Friday.

Example number three.  I work as a project manager and continuous education is important to keep my license.   I usually attend one educational meeting on Friday that runs from 7:30 to 9:00 AM.  I've been attending those meeting for several years and never was asked to take time off for attendance, even when I was a contractor on hourly pay.   On the last job, however, I was told that the work time is from 8:00 AM to 5:00 PM and every hour when one does not work for the company should be taken as a vacation.  I also learned that, according to my manager, the continuous education is for my own improvement and does not help the company.

The colleague 1 and colleague 2 above were on their first job after college and did not understand that vacation is a vacation, company holidays mean no work, and flexible schedule is part of the deal for knowledge workers who are salaried.  In my book, and in previous organizations where I worked, colleague 1 would either get both vacation days back, or, at minimum, get an extra day off to compensate for holiday work.  Colleague two would not have to take half day off because he would just finish the work week on Saturday.

I wish there was a way to sue those people, but for the time being the only way to get the manager's attention is to leave, tell them why, and let community know what this business is like.  I serve on a board of a local chapter of project management organization and our organization is in good position to share great places to work and those to avoid.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: dandarc on July 12, 2022, 06:53:33 AM
Borderline abuse of salaried workers is pretty rampant in many places - I've developed a very strong preference for hourly work because of that - 10 months in a W-2 salaried position just galvanized that for me, and I wasn't working at a particularly bad place in terms of the types of things you're referring to @Gone_Hiking, but like many government IT consulting firms they definitely made a fair amount of their profit by being understaffed.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Uturn on July 12, 2022, 11:26:03 AM
Years ago, I was the sole Network Engineer for a company that really should have had two engineers.  If something broke during my off time, I was still expected to work the issue. I brought it up a few times that this is not sustainable because there is going to be a time when I am not available and the problem will sit until I am available, resulting in lost production.

One day I had a dentist appointment and took off two hours early.  The next day, my manager told me that I needed to put in PTO for the two hours.  I brought up the many times that I worked outside of my normal hours.  He said that I need to put in PTO any time I am out during my normal hours.  I said that I can either be concerned about running the network to the best of my ability, or I can be concerned about occupying my chair for 40 hours per week, choose wisely.  He said that my hours are 7-4 M-F.

About a month later, we had a failure on a Saturday afternoon that caused a work stoppage at one of our locations.  My manager called me and reported the problem.  I told him that I will be in the office 7am Monday.  He started to protest, and I reminded him that I am only following the working hours that he dictated.  More flexible hours were soon implemented and a second engineer was hired.

I doubt I would have stood my ground had I not been debt free and a comfortable cash cushion. 
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: alcon835 on July 12, 2022, 11:50:17 AM
Years ago, I was the sole Network Engineer for a company that really should have had two engineers.  If something broke during my off time, I was still expected to work the issue. I brought it up a few times that this is not sustainable because there is going to be a time when I am not available and the problem will sit until I am available, resulting in lost production.

One day I had a dentist appointment and took off two hours early.  The next day, my manager told me that I needed to put in PTO for the two hours.  I brought up the many times that I worked outside of my normal hours.  He said that I need to put in PTO any time I am out during my normal hours.  I said that I can either be concerned about running the network to the best of my ability, or I can be concerned about occupying my chair for 40 hours per week, choose wisely.  He said that my hours are 7-4 M-F.

About a month later, we had a failure on a Saturday afternoon that caused a work stoppage at one of our locations.  My manager called me and reported the problem.  I told him that I will be in the office 7am Monday.  He started to protest, and I reminded him that I am only following the working hours that he dictated.  More flexible hours were soon implemented and a second engineer was hired.

I doubt I would have stood my ground had I not been debt free and a comfortable cash cushion.

These are the sweetest FU money stories for me! There is so much power lost when you have a cash cushion. It's shocking how different we get to see the world than our peers just because we can survive losing our job.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Taran Wanderer on July 12, 2022, 03:53:20 PM
I’ve never understood the way some managers are assholes about regular working hours and then expect employees to respond at the drop of a hat when they’re off. I managed a group supporting production operations and projects that required planned and unplanned evening, night, and weekend work. You can be darn sure those folks had flexibility for doctor appointments, travel between sites, duck hunting, kids’ events, sick kids, and whatever else they needed flexibility for.  They also go vacations where they were truly off and the rest of the teak covered for them. Never had complaints from them, though occasionally I did have to defend their absence to other managers.  Well worth it.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: RyanAtTanagra on July 12, 2022, 04:28:26 PM
I’ve never understood the way some managers are assholes about regular working hours and then expect employees to respond at the drop of a hat when they’re off.

Because employees will.  I had a job where I worked after hours a lot to support IT infrastructure, and I was always to work on time the next day.  Then we hired a new guy and after his first late night he emailed that he was up late and would thus be in late the next morning.  I was like 'wait?  that's an option?!'.  No one said anything to him, so you can bet I started doing the same thing.  I just didn't know we could do that and I never thought to push the issue.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Wolfpack Mustachian on July 12, 2022, 04:39:25 PM
I’ve never understood the way some managers are assholes about regular working hours and then expect employees to respond at the drop of a hat when they’re off.

Because employees will.  I had a job where I worked after hours a lot to support IT infrastructure, and I was always to work on time the next day.  Then we hired a new guy and after his first late night he emailed that he was up late and would thus be in late the next morning.  I was like 'wait?  that's an option?!'.  No one said anything to him, so you can bet I started doing the same thing.  I just didn't know we could do that and I never thought to push the issue.

That's very true and great when it works out, which is probably a lot. In fairness, at some places it really isn't an option.. They have such a stranglehold on things that they can afford to lose someone who doesn't stick to the party line and do whatever they ask for the most part. In those cases, you may have to leave - and the culture is often so toxic that it's a big plus when you do. Having savings comes in handy in those situations as well!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: alcon835 on July 12, 2022, 06:56:37 PM
I’ve never understood the way some managers are assholes about regular working hours and then expect employees to respond at the drop of a hat when they’re off.

Because employees will.  I had a job where I worked after hours a lot to support IT infrastructure, and I was always to work on time the next day.  Then we hired a new guy and after his first late night he emailed that he was up late and would thus be in late the next morning.  I was like 'wait?  that's an option?!'.  No one said anything to him, so you can bet I started doing the same thing.  I just didn't know we could do that and I never thought to push the issue.

That's very true and great when it works out, which is probably a lot. In fairness, at some places it really isn't an option.. They have such a stranglehold on things that they can afford to lose someone who doesn't stick to the party line and do whatever they ask for the most part. In those cases, you may have to leave - and the culture is often so toxic that it's a big plus when you do. Having savings comes in handy in those situations as well!

There are also places where people just...like to work a lot, I guess? I once worked with a guy who would do all night deployments and then show up to work and put in 9+ hours. I told him he should stay home and recover and he just shrugged his shoulders.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: pasadenafr on July 12, 2022, 07:10:39 PM
I’ve never understood the way some managers are assholes about regular working hours and then expect employees to respond at the drop of a hat when they’re off.

Because employees will.  I had a job where I worked after hours a lot to support IT infrastructure, and I was always to work on time the next day.  Then we hired a new guy and after his first late night he emailed that he was up late and would thus be in late the next morning.  I was like 'wait?  that's an option?!'.  No one said anything to him, so you can bet I started doing the same thing.  I just didn't know we could do that and I never thought to push the issue.

I work in IT and I've always said that I'm absolutely available out of hours to help or work on a production issue as long as it's fair. It's a two-way street. If they want me to take the call at 3am, they need to let me take a few hours off in the morning, or when convenient.

I've had to explain this (politely) a few times, but it's always worked. If not, then they always reconsider the first time you don't hear the phone. Because they usually realize they need you a lot more during a 3am emergency than they do on a Friday at 3pm.

People very often back off when you push back (nicely) - they know they don't have a leg to stand on. It works because employees never push back.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: NoVa on July 12, 2022, 08:48:58 PM
System administrator in an old job I used to have. The company expected you to work on proposals and bids, outside your daily hours (government contracting, so they couldn't just have you do it in the middle of the day). They even had a cute acronym for it, UCOT. Uncompensated overtime. I don't work there anymore.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: former player on July 13, 2022, 02:38:34 AM
I used to keep two leave sheets on the go, one for annual leave and one for "time off in lieu" which covered out of hours working - when the hours had totted up I would use it to take odd half days when things were quieter.

Funny story: I was the Trades Union Convenor in my (professional and admin office workers, mostly) place of work.  By the end of my time there the HR top brass had been brought in from outside and hated that 1) we had detailed written contracts of employment and 2) I was so pissed at them for various things they tried that I started insisting on them complying with every employer obligation to the book.  Made their working lives hell just insisting, politely and persistently, that they do their jobs right by our organisation's standards.  I don't think it was a coincidence that at the same time, for the first time in 20 years, I was asked to submit my leave sheets to HR.  I sent in all 20 years' worth.  Got them back a month later without comment.  Some poor bugger presumably did the maths on 20 years of my holidays and came up with every one being within the rules.

(They didn't know about the Time Off in Lieu sheets, but if they had the result would have been the same, with everything initialed by the relevant manager at the time.)

Join your Trades' Union, folks, or your employee association, whatever it's called.  As a single person going up against a big organisation you haven't a hope, as part of a group with the same aims you've got a chance of evening up the score.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: RetiredAt63 on July 13, 2022, 09:24:13 AM

Join your Trades' Union, folks, or your employee association, whatever it's called.  As a single person going up against a big organisation you haven't a hope, as part of a group with the same aims you've got a chance of evening up the score.

I second this. 

I belonged to a union my whole working life - teachers need unions just as much as anyone else.  My College union negotiated maternity leave back when maternity leave was a pipe dream for most.  Our collective agreement covered everything from salaries to working conditions to workloads to all sorts of bits and pieces.  Governments can really suck as employers, because they have a monopoly and they know people are unlikely to change residence.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Wolfpack Mustachian on July 13, 2022, 10:09:40 AM
I’ve never understood the way some managers are assholes about regular working hours and then expect employees to respond at the drop of a hat when they’re off.

Because employees will.  I had a job where I worked after hours a lot to support IT infrastructure, and I was always to work on time the next day.  Then we hired a new guy and after his first late night he emailed that he was up late and would thus be in late the next morning.  I was like 'wait?  that's an option?!'.  No one said anything to him, so you can bet I started doing the same thing.  I just didn't know we could do that and I never thought to push the issue.

That's very true and great when it works out, which is probably a lot. In fairness, at some places it really isn't an option.. They have such a stranglehold on things that they can afford to lose someone who doesn't stick to the party line and do whatever they ask for the most part. In those cases, you may have to leave - and the culture is often so toxic that it's a big plus when you do. Having savings comes in handy in those situations as well!

There are also places where people just...like to work a lot, I guess? I once worked with a guy who would do all night deployments and then show up to work and put in 9+ hours. I told him he should stay home and recover and he just shrugged his shoulders.

That is possible, of course. I've never seen anyone like that that is not assuming it will lead to a promotion so they are working towards something rather than just liking to work, but there are all kinds of people out there...
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: jinga nation on July 14, 2022, 07:41:47 AM
I’ve never understood the way some managers are assholes about regular working hours and then expect employees to respond at the drop of a hat when they’re off.

Because employees will.  I had a job where I worked after hours a lot to support IT infrastructure, and I was always to work on time the next day.  Then we hired a new guy and after his first late night he emailed that he was up late and would thus be in late the next morning.  I was like 'wait?  that's an option?!'.  No one said anything to him, so you can bet I started doing the same thing.  I just didn't know we could do that and I never thought to push the issue.

I work in IT and I've always said that I'm absolutely available out of hours to help or work on a production issue as long as it's fair. It's a two-way street. If they want me to take the call at 3am, they need to let me take a few hours off in the morning, or when convenient.

I've had to explain this (politely) a few times, but it's always worked. If not, then they always reconsider the first time you don't hear the phone. Because they usually realize they need you a lot more during a 3am emergency than they do on a Friday at 3pm.

People very often back off when you push back (nicely) - they know they don't have a leg to stand on. It works because employees never push back.

Used to work that site of IT. Would get calls at odd hours from my boss. I'd ask, "how much of an emergency is this on a Saturday afternoon? Is actual deployment to production going to be on Monday night or tonight? Are the engineers from other teams going to be onsite too? I'm a beer in, it'll take me an hour. Can you order food and drinks for all those coming in? Coffee and pastries/donuts too. Also, we'll be taking off all of Friday in lieu, unless you're paying overtime. Has the customer authorized overtime?"
Had to go in only once in almost 6 years.

And there were assholes who'd suck corporate's bellend and go behind our backs, then F it all up, and we'd have to fix during normal hours, which meant our normal operations got affected, metrics got affected, pay affected. Told the boss, "we'll make you look bad too if you don't have our back and stop the twats from mucking with our stuff". Stopped the nonsense pretty fast when I made it the boss' and Program Manager's problem.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: alcon835 on July 14, 2022, 07:43:32 AM
I’ve never understood the way some managers are assholes about regular working hours and then expect employees to respond at the drop of a hat when they’re off.

Because employees will.  I had a job where I worked after hours a lot to support IT infrastructure, and I was always to work on time the next day.  Then we hired a new guy and after his first late night he emailed that he was up late and would thus be in late the next morning.  I was like 'wait?  that's an option?!'.  No one said anything to him, so you can bet I started doing the same thing.  I just didn't know we could do that and I never thought to push the issue.

That's very true and great when it works out, which is probably a lot. In fairness, at some places it really isn't an option.. They have such a stranglehold on things that they can afford to lose someone who doesn't stick to the party line and do whatever they ask for the most part. In those cases, you may have to leave - and the culture is often so toxic that it's a big plus when you do. Having savings comes in handy in those situations as well!

There are also places where people just...like to work a lot, I guess? I once worked with a guy who would do all night deployments and then show up to work and put in 9+ hours. I told him he should stay home and recover and he just shrugged his shoulders.

That is possible, of course. I've never seen anyone like that that is not assuming it will lead to a promotion so they are working towards something rather than just liking to work, but there are all kinds of people out there...

Honestly, I think this person was just being taken advantage of and he sorta...went with it? He was critical to the success of IT and there needed to be 5 of him, but he was good enough at what he did and willing to sacrifice his personal life that they just had him do everything.

He needed better leaders above him to force him to stay home more and hire more help. He also needed to set better boundaries. I tried to gently nudge him towards that, but he never wanted to do it so...

learned a lot just watching him do the things I don't want to do unless I am very, very well paid.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: rockstache on July 14, 2022, 10:58:08 AM
It is definitely not legal (not just unethical) to treat salaried employees as if they were hourly ones. The onus is on the employer to prove that they are not doing anything wrong, and it's very worth reporting when they are. Let the Employee Rights people sort it out.

Employee unions are great but not always allowed/available.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: glacio09 on July 14, 2022, 11:02:33 AM
I’ve never understood the way some managers are assholes about regular working hours and then expect employees to respond at the drop of a hat when they’re off.

Because employees will.  I had a job where I worked after hours a lot to support IT infrastructure, and I was always to work on time the next day.  Then we hired a new guy and after his first late night he emailed that he was up late and would thus be in late the next morning.  I was like 'wait?  that's an option?!'.  No one said anything to him, so you can bet I started doing the same thing.  I just didn't know we could do that and I never thought to push the issue.

That's very true and great when it works out, which is probably a lot. In fairness, at some places it really isn't an option.. They have such a stranglehold on things that they can afford to lose someone who doesn't stick to the party line and do whatever they ask for the most part. In those cases, you may have to leave - and the culture is often so toxic that it's a big plus when you do. Having savings comes in handy in those situations as well!

There are also places where people just...like to work a lot, I guess? I once worked with a guy who would do all night deployments and then show up to work and put in 9+ hours. I told him he should stay home and recover and he just shrugged his shoulders.

That is possible, of course. I've never seen anyone like that that is not assuming it will lead to a promotion so they are working towards something rather than just liking to work, but there are all kinds of people out there...

Honestly, I think this person was just being taken advantage of and he sorta...went with it? He was critical to the success of IT and there needed to be 5 of him, but he was good enough at what he did and willing to sacrifice his personal life that they just had him do everything.

He needed better leaders above him to force him to stay home more and hire more help. He also needed to set better boundaries. I tried to gently nudge him towards that, but he never wanted to do it so...

learned a lot just watching him do the things I don't want to do unless I am very, very well paid.

My husband is dealing with the fallout of this between two coworkers with similar issues.

She is an anal retentive systems tester who absolutely hates having to tell professors no or even I don't know.
He is an IT people pleaser with no hobbies or friends and over bearing parents that he's trying to avoid even though he's in his 40s.
It created a truly toxic symbiotic relationship where she tested every little thing (including complaining about buttons being the wrong shade of blue). He would bend over backwards working 12+ hour days, breaking system requirements and user contracts to do meet her demands.

He got a new job and my husband has taken over the IT help for her department. She is...not amused at his completely reasonable boundaries.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: RyanAtTanagra on July 14, 2022, 11:14:02 AM
He got a new job and my husband has taken over the IT help for her department. She is...not amused at his completely reasonable boundaries.

Hope it's not stressing him out.  I tend to enjoy setting boundaries.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: solon on July 14, 2022, 12:49:53 PM
He got a new job and my husband has taken over the IT help for her department. She is...not amused at his completely reasonable boundaries.

This is the part I want to hear more about.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Wolfpack Mustachian on July 14, 2022, 03:21:12 PM
I’ve never understood the way some managers are assholes about regular working hours and then expect employees to respond at the drop of a hat when they’re off.

Because employees will.  I had a job where I worked after hours a lot to support IT infrastructure, and I was always to work on time the next day.  Then we hired a new guy and after his first late night he emailed that he was up late and would thus be in late the next morning.  I was like 'wait?  that's an option?!'.  No one said anything to him, so you can bet I started doing the same thing.  I just didn't know we could do that and I never thought to push the issue.

That's very true and great when it works out, which is probably a lot. In fairness, at some places it really isn't an option.. They have such a stranglehold on things that they can afford to lose someone who doesn't stick to the party line and do whatever they ask for the most part. In those cases, you may have to leave - and the culture is often so toxic that it's a big plus when you do. Having savings comes in handy in those situations as well!

There are also places where people just...like to work a lot, I guess? I once worked with a guy who would do all night deployments and then show up to work and put in 9+ hours. I told him he should stay home and recover and he just shrugged his shoulders.

That is possible, of course. I've never seen anyone like that that is not assuming it will lead to a promotion so they are working towards something rather than just liking to work, but there are all kinds of people out there...

Honestly, I think this person was just being taken advantage of and he sorta...went with it? He was critical to the success of IT and there needed to be 5 of him, but he was good enough at what he did and willing to sacrifice his personal life that they just had him do everything.

He needed better leaders above him to force him to stay home more and hire more help. He also needed to set better boundaries. I tried to gently nudge him towards that, but he never wanted to do it so...

learned a lot just watching him do the things I don't want to do unless I am very, very well paid.

I think that's probably the case for the vast, vast majority of people. We must set our own boundaries or we'll be taken advantage of almost every time. I was certainly one of them. To the other point from before, I just wanted to balance out a little these stories, as wonderful and fun as they are, with the reality that sometimes establishing boundaries and pushing back will get you pushed out of the company. It's still extremely important to set the boundaries, but I think it's important to be ready for that possibility.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Zamboni on July 15, 2022, 07:19:26 PM
"occasionally I did have to defend their absence to other managers"

Ugh, that's annoying! I used to have to deal with this at a job. There were two other peer managers who were super anal and controlling about the exact hours their people were in the building. For whatever reason, they felt I should also treat people in my group like lazy toddlers and criminals who wouldn't do any work if not for our ever watchful eyes.

I tended to be more flexible, especially for the particularly competent and productive people on my team. For example, one guy wanted to take a college class to finish his degree, but it meant he wouldn't get to work until 10 am twice a week. He was a reliable person who had been at the company several years, and he said he was willing to stay until 6:30 pm on those days. Was I okay with that? Of course I was. But you know it led to another manager whining to me about their people complaining or (more likely) "reporting" him for coming in late. Eyeroll.

I told her that of course I knew he was coming in later, that it was part of an agreement we had made, that he stayed later, and I knew he stayed later because I happen to work more hours than literally everyone, so I'm there in the morning when her whining people arrive and still there when he leaves at 6:30 (kind of a fib and not always true about the hours, especially since I liked to take 2 hour lunches, but the few times I did happen to be there that late everyone was gone but him and me). I said to tell any complainers they should focus on being excellent in their own work rather than worrying about what other people were doing. I follow up with the jab that if they actually were busy, then they wouldn't even notice what hours people in unrelated groups were working. Basically I used the "clearly your people don't have enough to do if they are worried about this" approach. The best defense is a good offense.

Another time a different manager came to me to ask about refusing to pay logged overtime. One employee in his group and one employee in my group had been working on a project together that required some evening overtime. Part of it was travel time to and from another site, but policy was that we were to compensate them for that. I told them to keep track of their overtime and put it on the next timecards (we didn't have a clock to punch, it was self reported).

On the next timecard, my employee had put 8 hours of overtime spread over the week. The other manager then came to me with his employee's timecard in his hand. How many hours had my employee put? he asked. 8, I said. He felt there was no way they had each worked 8 extra hours. I said I had no reason to believe that they didn't. He then said he thought they were trying to count time they had stopped to eat on the road, that they were "in cahoots," that he was only going to pay his employee for 6 hours, and that I should only pay my employee for 6 hours.

Just like that, he decided 8 hours reported should be 6 hours paid.

I did some quick math in my head and said "so you want me to accuse one of the best employees in my group of lying over something that amounts to $85?" He said he thought they were lying. I said "listen, I can easily see that it was 8 hours extra last week, that makes sense. And I'm not going to challenge this at all. I will not ask about this. Period. My person is getting paid what they wrote on their card. You do whatever you want."

What an idiot.

I'm not sure I was the best manager, but I was definitely never the worst.

I have lots of other examples.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: pasadenafr on July 15, 2022, 10:46:56 PM
I tended to be more flexible, especially for the particularly competent and productive people on my team. For example, one guy wanted to take a college class to finish his degree, but it meant he wouldn't get to work until 10 am twice a week. He was a reliable person who had been at the company several years, and he said he was willing to stay until 6:30 pm on those days. Was I okay with that? Of course I was. But you know it led to another manager whining to me about their people complaining or (more likely) "reporting" him for coming in late. Eyeroll.

Damn, this reminds me of a previous job. We were supposed to work in shifts starting at 7am or 8am. That was kind of grandfathered in from older times when we were actually doing a lot of support work, but it didn't really make much sense anymore. I was working on a few projects with a global team (people in Europe and US East Coast, when I was in California).

And so I had a million early-morning calls, often back-to-back starting at 6am, often earlier, several days a week. Of course, I was taking them from home, and at first, my manager just said to ping him when I knew I wouldn't make it to the office at the start of our "shift".

That happened like 3 or 4 times a week. And he told me that I had to come in on time, because other people would "see me coming in late and complain or think I was treated differently", and to "keep the peace" (another of his words was "status quo"). I'm not even sure that was true, or if he was trying to avoid that possibility. I said I can't, when I have calls from 6am to 9am, how can I be in the office at 8am?

He told me to come in at 6am to take the call, or earlier so I could be ready at 6am.

I didn't. Told him that when they all came in to work, I had already been working for 2 or 3 hours, it was easy to verify since I was online all that time (and I wasn't exactly alone in those calls). And it was unfair that I would be the one punished because I was working at 6am.

After several months I also told him it was HIS job to make sure people in HIS team understood what was going on and stopped acting like toddlers. That I wasn't going to come in before 6am almost every day just to make his life easier. I also wasn't going to ask 5-10 people in Europe and India to stay at work an hour or two later because I had to commute.

That lasted about 2 years. At some point, he pissed me off so much that I started billing those hours, because of course there was no way I could leave early before the end of the official shift. People would have seen me leave!

He never did anything about it. Never tried to help me organize my day better, never put his foot down to explain the situation to the rest of the team. Never took any action against me, because at the end of the day, he knew I was right, I was doing my job, my project stakeholders were happy and not shy about saying it, and there was no-one else to do that specific project.

OTOH I also never got a promotion lol.

Another one of my teammates was in the same situation, but his team leader didn't care.

Worst manager I ever left.

Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: lutorm on July 15, 2022, 11:22:35 PM
That is possible, of course. I've never seen anyone like that that is not assuming it will lead to a promotion so they are working towards something rather than just liking to work, but there are all kinds of people out there...
We have plenty of people coming to work for us straight out of college who thinks working there is just the coolest thing and spends all their waking hours at work. Makes taking a stand for work life balance a bit more conspicuous...
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: ATtiny85 on July 16, 2022, 04:36:30 PM
That is possible, of course. I've never seen anyone like that that is not assuming it will lead to a promotion so they are working towards something rather than just liking to work, but there are all kinds of people out there...
We have plenty of people coming to work for us straight out of college who thinks working there is just the coolest thing and spends all their waking hours at work. Makes taking a stand for work life balance a bit more conspicuous...

Yeah, I remember being a bit guilty of that. Now, 20+ years later, I just let them newbies churn out work while I am living life.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Gronnie on July 16, 2022, 05:04:58 PM
Worst manager I ever left.

As the saying goes -- people usually don't quit jobs, they quit managers.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: pasadenafr on July 16, 2022, 10:46:58 PM
Worst manager I ever left.

As the saying goes -- people usually don't quit jobs, they quit managers.

To be fair, there were several reasons why I left, and while he wasn't the main one, he was definitely on the list.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: LennStar on July 17, 2022, 03:37:38 AM
Worst manager I ever left.

As the saying goes -- people usually don't quit jobs, they quit managers.
Isn't it stragne that so many people complain about really bad managers, every study ever on the topic fround that at least 1/3 is a bad manager... and still nobody says "get rid of them" even though there are enough examples of self-organized companies? (Which in the end generally have some sort of manager, but only because there is work to be done, not to order people around.)
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: pasadenafr on July 17, 2022, 07:15:29 AM
Worst manager I ever left.

As the saying goes -- people usually don't quit jobs, they quit managers.
Isn't it stragne that so many people complain about really bad managers, every study ever on the topic fround that at least 1/3 is a bad manager... and still nobody says "get rid of them" even though there are enough examples of self-organized companies? (Which in the end generally have some sort of manager, but only because there is work to be done, not to order people around.)

That's probably because a bad manager from the employee's point of view can be a good manager from the company's point of view. This one was a good little soldier, and since most of us in the team were self-sufficient, it worked for them. If it hadn't, maybe they'd have trained him (and the others).

Also, from the company's POV, a bad manager is better than no manager. They still (mostly) keep people in line, do some of the grunt work that needs doing, and they take the blame.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Loren Ver on July 17, 2022, 08:40:55 AM
Worst manager I ever left.

As the saying goes -- people usually don't quit jobs, they quit managers.
Isn't it stragne that so many people complain about really bad managers, every study ever on the topic fround that at least 1/3 is a bad manager... and still nobody says "get rid of them" even though there are enough examples of self-organized companies? (Which in the end generally have some sort of manager, but only because there is work to be done, not to order people around.)

That's probably because a bad manager from the employee's point of view can be a good manager from the company's point of view. This one was a good little soldier, and since most of us in the team were self-sufficient, it worked for them. If it hadn't, maybe they'd have trained him (and the others).

Also, from the company's POV, a bad manager is better than no manager. They still (mostly) keep people in line, do some of the grunt work that needs doing, and they take the blame.

And also, not every manager is a good or bad manager for all employees or employee types.  A few managers are truly great leaders, but most are on the bell curve.  Someone that I might call a horrible might be great for a different type of employee.  Sure a great manager should be able to tell the difference, but this doesn't make a nominal manager (that probably got substandard training) the devil. 

A very good leader high level taught me this during my mid career.  He said, even he had employees that hated his management and that he had had leaders that were good leaders that he just didn't mesh with.  After the light bulb went off I started looking around and really started to see it clearly what I kinda saw only fuzzily before. 

Of course I also had some really terrible leaders/managers that were just "wow, really!?!?" bad.  So those exist too.

Loren
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Plina on July 17, 2022, 10:10:37 AM
Worst manager I ever left.

As the saying goes -- people usually don't quit jobs, they quit managers.
Isn't it stragne that so many people complain about really bad managers, every study ever on the topic fround that at least 1/3 is a bad manager... and still nobody says "get rid of them" even though there are enough examples of self-organized companies? (Which in the end generally have some sort of manager, but only because there is work to be done, not to order people around.)

That's probably because a bad manager from the employee's point of view can be a good manager from the company's point of view. This one was a good little soldier, and since most of us in the team were self-sufficient, it worked for them. If it hadn't, maybe they'd have trained him (and the others).

Also, from the company's POV, a bad manager is better than no manager. They still (mostly) keep people in line, do some of the grunt work that needs doing, and they take the blame.

And someone that you see as a bad manager can be a good manager from someone else point of view. I have had managers that might be seen as bad managers by some but they worked really well with me because they didn’t interfere with my work and I could basically do as I liked as long as I did my work. I have also had managers that tried to micromanage everything which made me hate going to work. He was a nice guy when a colleague but a lousy boss. He actually left the company shortly after me as he lost a lot of employees and I heard afterwards that they were not happy with his leadership.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Wolfpack Mustachian on July 17, 2022, 10:26:51 AM
Worst manager I ever left.

As the saying goes -- people usually don't quit jobs, they quit managers.
Isn't it stragne that so many people complain about really bad managers, every study ever on the topic fround that at least 1/3 is a bad manager... and still nobody says "get rid of them" even though there are enough examples of self-organized companies? (Which in the end generally have some sort of manager, but only because there is work to be done, not to order people around.)

That's probably because a bad manager from the employee's point of view can be a good manager from the company's point of view. This one was a good little soldier, and since most of us in the team were self-sufficient, it worked for them. If it hadn't, maybe they'd have trained him (and the others).

Also, from the company's POV, a bad manager is better than no manager. They still (mostly) keep people in line, do some of the grunt work that needs doing, and they take the blame.

And someone that you see as a bad manager can be a good manager from someone else point of view. I have had managers that might be seen as bad managers by some but they worked really well with me because they didn’t interfere with my work and I could basically do as I liked as long as I did my work. I have also had managers that tried to micromanage everything which made me hate going to work. He was a nice guy when a colleague but a lousy boss. He actually left the company shortly after me as he lost a lot of employees and I heard afterwards that they were not happy with his leadership.

I think the difference is there are styles of management and skilled and unskilled managers. Skilled managers can vary management styles for employees. My first couple years out of college having little experience, I needed much more "micromanagment" to perform well. 8 years later, micromanaging drove me nuts. A skilled/trained manager can go between styles and help people wherever they are at.

I think the good/bad labels are often thrown around when an unskilled manager doesn't use the style that benefits the particular person. That's not the same as a good/bad manager IMO. To be a good vs. bad manager, it takes other things - sticking up for your employees, listening and trusting them, acknowledging that they may know more than you do on a topic, etc. I can work around different management styles and have in the past. I can't work past a manager that doesn't trust what I have to say in areas I'm knowledgable about or that hang me out to dry for their mismanagement of priorities or whatever the case may be. I can even help an unskilled manager/new manager with things they don't know.

I do think people call managers bad because of the skilled part - and they can certainly drive employees away because they are unskilled, but there are a great number of managers out there who are truly bad managers. While I've seen unskilled managers improve to be skilled, better managers, I have never seen bad managers become good managers.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: pasadenafr on July 17, 2022, 11:30:07 AM
Worst manager I ever left.

As the saying goes -- people usually don't quit jobs, they quit managers.
Isn't it stragne that so many people complain about really bad managers, every study ever on the topic fround that at least 1/3 is a bad manager... and still nobody says "get rid of them" even though there are enough examples of self-organized companies? (Which in the end generally have some sort of manager, but only because there is work to be done, not to order people around.)

That's probably because a bad manager from the employee's point of view can be a good manager from the company's point of view. This one was a good little soldier, and since most of us in the team were self-sufficient, it worked for them. If it hadn't, maybe they'd have trained him (and the others).

Also, from the company's POV, a bad manager is better than no manager. They still (mostly) keep people in line, do some of the grunt work that needs doing, and they take the blame.

And someone that you see as a bad manager can be a good manager from someone else point of view. I have had managers that might be seen as bad managers by some but they worked really well with me because they didn’t interfere with my work and I could basically do as I liked as long as I did my work. I have also had managers that tried to micromanage everything which made me hate going to work. He was a nice guy when a colleague but a lousy boss. He actually left the company shortly after me as he lost a lot of employees and I heard afterwards that they were not happy with his leadership.

I think the difference is there are styles of management and skilled and unskilled managers. Skilled managers can vary management styles for employees. My first couple years out of college having little experience, I needed much more "micromanagment" to perform well. 8 years later, micromanaging drove me nuts. A skilled/trained manager can go between styles and help people wherever they are at.

I think the good/bad labels are often thrown around when an unskilled manager doesn't use the style that benefits the particular person. That's not the same as a good/bad manager IMO. To be a good vs. bad manager, it takes other things - sticking up for your employees, listening and trusting them, acknowledging that they may know more than you do on a topic, etc. I can work around different management styles and have in the past. I can't work past a manager that doesn't trust what I have to say in areas I'm knowledgable about or that hang me out to dry for their mismanagement of priorities or whatever the case may be. I can even help an unskilled manager/new manager with things they don't know.

I do think people call managers bad because of the skilled part - and they can certainly drive employees away because they are unskilled, but there are a great number of managers out there who are truly bad managers. While I've seen unskilled managers improve to be skilled, better managers, I have never seen bad managers become good managers.

Completely agree with that. This particular one was a bit of all of that, though. He used to be a member of my team, good techie, but no leader. I always felt like they gave him the promotion then let him figure it out. He wasn't properly trained -- annual reviews and team meetings were SO "manager for dummies" it was almost funny. That's 100% on the company and his own manager, not on him.

But he was also very ineffective, always focusing on the little things that didn't matter, telling us whatever he thought we wanted to hear, no matter if it was true or not, and spouting corporate BS all the time. I don't think he ever fought for anything on our behalf. His focus was always on keeping the "status quo" (his words) going, so he didn't have to actually manage anything and kept his job easier. Those who played that game well were favorited. Obviously that fits in the "not my style of manager" box. Thankfully no micromanagement.

While most of us liked him as a person (I did), almost none of us respected him as a manager.

We were a pretty tight team, but after a couple of years, we were nothing more than coworkers. There was no "team" anymore. That, to me, is the mark of a bad manager, however you want to look at it.

Pretty sure he was considered "good" from the perspective of the company, though. As I said, good soldier, and we still did our job well enough, because we were a highly skilled team, and mostly ignored the BS.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Plina on July 17, 2022, 11:51:44 AM
Worst manager I ever left.

As the saying goes -- people usually don't quit jobs, they quit managers.
Isn't it stragne that so many people complain about really bad managers, every study ever on the topic fround that at least 1/3 is a bad manager... and still nobody says "get rid of them" even though there are enough examples of self-organized companies? (Which in the end generally have some sort of manager, but only because there is work to be done, not to order people around.)

That's probably because a bad manager from the employee's point of view can be a good manager from the company's point of view. This one was a good little soldier, and since most of us in the team were self-sufficient, it worked for them. If it hadn't, maybe they'd have trained him (and the others).

Also, from the company's POV, a bad manager is better than no manager. They still (mostly) keep people in line, do some of the grunt work that needs doing, and they take the blame.

And someone that you see as a bad manager can be a good manager from someone else point of view. I have had managers that might be seen as bad managers by some but they worked really well with me because they didn’t interfere with my work and I could basically do as I liked as long as I did my work. I have also had managers that tried to micromanage everything which made me hate going to work. He was a nice guy when a colleague but a lousy boss. He actually left the company shortly after me as he lost a lot of employees and I heard afterwards that they were not happy with his leadership.

I think the difference is there are styles of management and skilled and unskilled managers. Skilled managers can vary management styles for employees. My first couple years out of college having little experience, I needed much more "micromanagment" to perform well. 8 years later, micromanaging drove me nuts. A skilled/trained manager can go between styles and help people wherever they are at.

I think the good/bad labels are often thrown around when an unskilled manager doesn't use the style that benefits the particular person. That's not the same as a good/bad manager IMO. To be a good vs. bad manager, it takes other things - sticking up for your employees, listening and trusting them, acknowledging that they may know more than you do on a topic, etc. I can work around different management styles and have in the past. I can't work past a manager that doesn't trust what I have to say in areas I'm knowledgable about or that hang me out to dry for their mismanagement of priorities or whatever the case may be. I can even help an unskilled manager/new manager with things they don't know.

I do think people call managers bad because of the skilled part - and they can certainly drive employees away because they are unskilled, but there are a great number of managers out there who are truly bad managers. While I've seen unskilled managers improve to be skilled, better managers, I have never seen bad managers become good managers.

Of course there are a difference in guiding an unexperienced employee and someone more senior as in this case. In this case it was not the only thing.

 When I told him in january I planned a leave of absence for studying and travel with start in August. his response was that he was disappointed because they had invested in me and wondered if I could postpone it to January next year so they could find a replacement. An employer are obligated to give a leave of absence in the same way as paternity or maternity leave. He would never have told that to someone that was planning a leave due to kids. He was later going on his third paternity leave, which is as it should but don’t give childfree employees crap for taking time off. He had seven months to find a replacement and did he manage to do that. NO! That day he really lost me. When I got back, I worked there only for a couple of months before I found something else.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Michael in ABQ on July 17, 2022, 01:05:34 PM
Worst manager I ever left.

As the saying goes -- people usually don't quit jobs, they quit managers.
Isn't it strange that so many people complain about really bad managers, every study ever on the topic found that at least 1/3 is a bad manager... and still nobody says "get rid of them" even though there are enough examples of self-organized companies? (Which in the end generally have some sort of manager, but only because there is work to be done, not to order people around.)

The person in a position to fire the bad manager will probably be saddled with the work of that manager. It could easily take months to replace them, especially in a large bureaucratic organization.

In organizations that promote from within, the best worker rarely makes the best manager. But most organizations are willing to accept that tradeoff because it provides an incentive to perform and get promoted to manager. If you were the top performer and saw a colleague, get promoted above you (who may have a better aptitude for management) it's likely to cause resentment and now maybe that company loses a top performer.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Gronnie on July 17, 2022, 08:29:07 PM
Worst manager I ever left.

As the saying goes -- people usually don't quit jobs, they quit managers.
Isn't it strange that so many people complain about really bad managers, every study ever on the topic found that at least 1/3 is a bad manager... and still nobody says "get rid of them" even though there are enough examples of self-organized companies? (Which in the end generally have some sort of manager, but only because there is work to be done, not to order people around.)

The person in a position to fire the bad manager will probably be saddled with the work of that manager. It could easily take months to replace them, especially in a large bureaucratic organization.

In organizations that promote from within, the best worker rarely makes the best manager. But most organizations are willing to accept that tradeoff because it provides an incentive to perform and get promoted to manager. If you were the top performer and saw a colleague, get promoted above you (who may have a better aptitude for management) it's likely to cause resentment and now maybe that company loses a top performer.

This is why I like tech where the best ICs can be paid as much if not more than their manager.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: gooki on July 18, 2022, 01:04:42 AM
Worst manager I ever left.

As the saying goes -- people usually don't quit jobs, they quit managers.
Isn't it stragne that so many people complain about really bad managers, every study ever on the topic fround that at least 1/3 is a bad manager... and still nobody says "get rid of them" even though there are enough examples of self-organized companies? (Which in the end generally have some sort of manager, but only because there is work to be done, not to order people around.)

FWIW Elon Musk routinely culls middle management. A few years back there was a bit of noise around the clearing out of middle management from the SpaceX Starlink division. In retrospect the outcome seems very positive.

It's also my wife's speciality getting rid of bad managers.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: glacio09 on July 29, 2022, 07:31:55 AM
He got a new job and my husband has taken over the IT help for her department. She is...not amused at his completely reasonable boundaries.

This is the part I want to hear more about.

In the past my husband's team waited until the end of summer break (it's a college) to set up the computers for the next school year, which meant having a one month scramble to do everything. With less people the bosses said that it was completely undoable this year. She refused to do testing at the beginning of July because "that isn't when it's done". My husband got an email at 9 oclock last night demanding he fix a bug that she finally got around to finding. He has permission to wait until working hours to respond to non-emergencies. The phrase failure to plan on your part does not make an emergency on mine is becoming a daily utterance.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Dicey on July 29, 2022, 08:07:28 AM
He got a new job and my husband has taken over the IT help for her department. She is...not amused at his completely reasonable boundaries.

This is the part I want to hear more about.

In the past my husband's team waited until the end of summer break (it's a college) to set up the computers for the next school year, which meant having a one month scramble to do everything. With less people the bosses said that it was completely undoable this year. She refused to do testing at the beginning of July because "that isn't when it's done". My husband got an email at 9 oclock last night demanding he fix a bug that she finally got around to finding. He has permission to wait until working hours to respond to non-emergencies. The phrase failure to plan on your part does not make an emergency on mine is becoming a daily utterance.
If nothing else, this keeps one's incentive to reach FIRE burning hot...
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: lifeisshort123 on July 29, 2022, 10:45:01 AM
Yes, finding ways to limit the amount of abuse you have are important.  I find in many instances that involves getting out of the corporate world as quickly as possible.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: glacio09 on July 29, 2022, 10:56:42 AM
Yes, finding ways to limit the amount of abuse you have are important.  I find in many instances that involves getting out of the corporate world as quickly as possible.

It's actually why my husband is in this job. Generally he gets a lot less shit being in academia than corporate (or as he puts it, the same amount of shit but much better smelling). There's a lot of perks but he gets paid less. So the FU part is that he told his boss that he was working this job because it was enjoyable. It is no longer enjoyable. He needs a raise, the other department to back up, and more help or he's getting a job being paid twice as much elsewhere. In my mind if he's going to be miserable might as well be growing the stache faster, but as a good partner I'm actually hoping that his job gets it's act together.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: ExitViaTheCashRamp on July 31, 2022, 11:36:12 AM
Accidental abuse of system....    talking about time in lieu reminded me of my own accidental abuse of it.

 20 years ago, I moved teams on to a daytime helpdesk for an external customer (7.5 hour shift), I was on-call for the night shift for a different helpdesk for totally different customers (12 hour shift, 4 days on, 4 days off). The two 'helpdesks' had nothing in common - no common systems. procedures or staff -- nearest 'join' was the manager 3 levels up who I spoke to perhaps 3 times in five years... and one of those was when he wanted to borrow some change for a vending machine.

 Both desks had weekend working -- the daytime desk on a scheduled rota, any overtime was time & a half for saturday and double time on sunday. The night desk had no overtime special overtime rates since it was covered in the shift bonus (the perm guys had a 25% bonus).

 I was given a 12.5% shift bonus to be on call and told to take time off in lieu for preference instead of claiming overtime. This suited me fine, I had just brought a house so the 12.5% added nicely to mortgage payments and time off during the day meant more time with the wife. Only thing was.... no one told me my assumption that the time and a half and double time applied to time off in lieu and one of the night shift guys happened to be sick a lot on weekends...   

 So when I got called out to cover, I did 4 x 12 hour shifts... but I am on paid for 37.5 based on (5 x7.5 hour day shifts) and more often than not covering a weekend after doing half or more a week in the office on the day shift. So I took the time off in lieu... and at the overtime rate (e.g. working sat (12 hours x 1.5) & sun (12 hours x 2) meant the day shift didn't see me for a good looooonnnggg time. This went on for over a year until it was discovered in a random conversation and I was then pushed into taking the overtime. That first month I gleefully handed them an overtime bill of 50 hours thanks to weekend working.

 I didn't mean to abuse the time in lieu... I honestly thought I was doing the right thing - with no management oversight (i.e. day shift lead never spoke to the night shift lead) - it was the best paid and relaxing job of my early career.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: 10dollarsatatime on August 11, 2022, 10:20:15 PM
Posted in my journal, but I think it belongs here, too.

I've been covering a second full time position (my boss') on top of my own for more than six months.  The first three were understandable.  It was FMLA.  We weren't sure what the outcome would be.  No temporary acting pay, but it seemed crass to complain and I didn't need it.  Sadly, just after the FMLA was up and we were deciding how to move forward, my boss passed.  This sucked.  I liked the guy.  And I'd been working in his organization for nearly 15 years.

The following Monday, I was designated as officially temporary acting general manager, which came with a 10% pay bump.  The last time I had been through this, I was officially promoted within five weeks.  This time, they didn't open the position for a month.  They didn't interview until three weeks ago.  By now, I've been covering two full-time positions for the six months.  We've been busier than ever for the past two years, and we've been understaffed.  To cap it off with this... I got to the point where I was done.  I was/am ticked that they dragged this on for so long.  I'm exhausted.  I have a business degree now, so i have options.  AND my vacation/sick leave/comp time buyout is up to $23,000.  (I calculate it whenever I'm having a bad day at work.)

So.  I withdrew my application for GM, perfectly willing and happy to walk away and torpedo my career.

I got a phone call within ten minutes.  I was treated to breakfast while I explained that I was done and why I was done.  A somewhat panicky Department Director promised to move heaven and earth for me.  To pretend that I'd never sent the email.  I pointed out that I had copied (HR guy).  "I can kill (HR guy)".  He asked me to think about it.

The next discussion was me telling him that I had to do what was best for me, and if that was the best for the theater, that's great, but if it wasn't, I had no qualms about walking away.  I also informed him that I wouldn't stick around for my current job.  It was the promotion or nothing.

I got a job offer today.  With a $17,000/yr raise and a healthy bit of vacation.

I guess I'm staying.

Thanks FU money!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: LennStar on August 11, 2022, 11:10:21 PM
Nice!

But you should get a Bonus - even if it's just a week of free time - for the long time you covered.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: zolotiyeruki on August 12, 2022, 08:58:27 AM
The next discussion was me telling him that I had to do what was best for me, and if that was the best for the theater, that's great, but if it wasn't, I had no qualms about walking away.  I also informed him that I wouldn't stick around for my current job.  It was the promotion or nothing.

I got a job offer today.  With a $17,000/yr raise and a healthy bit of vacation.

I guess I'm staying.
That is an awesome story, thanks for sharing!  Sorry to hear about your boss passing.  That must be awful for his family as well.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Captain FIRE on August 12, 2022, 09:53:08 AM
I didn't mean to abuse the time in lieu... I honestly thought I was doing the right thing - with no management oversight (i.e. day shift lead never spoke to the night shift lead) - it was the best paid and relaxing job of my early career.

At my job, this is indeed how it works.  If you choose to take it in lieu (you can't be forced), then you get the time and half instead of pay and a half after 40 hrs.  (Normal schedule is 37.5, so the first 2.5 is straight time.  Always incentivized me to stack overtime and work a bunch in a week rather than ~2-3 hrs for a few weeks.  But also generally not a need to work overtime if I only had 2-3 hours extra to do.)
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: bmjohnson35 on August 12, 2022, 02:36:39 PM
Posted in my journal, but I think it belongs here, too.

I've been covering a second full time position (my boss') on top of my own for more than six months.  The first three were understandable.  It was FMLA.  We weren't sure what the outcome would be.  No temporary acting pay, but it seemed crass to complain and I didn't need it.  Sadly, just after the FMLA was up and we were deciding how to move forward, my boss passed.  This sucked.  I liked the guy.  And I'd been working in his organization for nearly 15 years.

The following Monday, I was designated as officially temporary acting general manager, which came with a 10% pay bump.  The last time I had been through this, I was officially promoted within five weeks.  This time, they didn't open the position for a month.  They didn't interview until three weeks ago.  By now, I've been covering two full-time positions for the six months.  We've been busier than ever for the past two years, and we've been understaffed.  To cap it off with this... I got to the point where I was done.  I was/am ticked that they dragged this on for so long.  I'm exhausted.  I have a business degree now, so i have options.  AND my vacation/sick leave/comp time buyout is up to $23,000.  (I calculate it whenever I'm having a bad day at work.)

So.  I withdrew my application for GM, perfectly willing and happy to walk away and torpedo my career.

I got a phone call within ten minutes.  I was treated to breakfast while I explained that I was done and why I was done.  A somewhat panicky Department Director promised to move heaven and earth for me.  To pretend that I'd never sent the email.  I pointed out that I had copied (HR guy).  "I can kill (HR guy)".  He asked me to think about it.

The next discussion was me telling him that I had to do what was best for me, and if that was the best for the theater, that's great, but if it wasn't, I had no qualms about walking away.  I also informed him that I wouldn't stick around for my current job.  It was the promotion or nothing.

I got a job offer today.  With a $17,000/yr raise and a healthy bit of vacation.

I guess I'm staying.

Thanks FU money!

I don't know the size of your organization, but people/positions are often "cogs in the machine." They may not have dragged it out intentionally and usually not personal (on their part).  FU money is definitely helpful when dealing with matters of this nature.  Happy to hear it worked out.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: mm1970 on August 12, 2022, 03:56:18 PM
The next discussion was me telling him that I had to do what was best for me, and if that was the best for the theater, that's great, but if it wasn't, I had no qualms about walking away.  I also informed him that I wouldn't stick around for my current job.  It was the promotion or nothing.

I got a job offer today.  With a $17,000/yr raise and a healthy bit of vacation.

I guess I'm staying.
That is an awesome story, thanks for sharing!  Sorry to hear about your boss passing.  That must be awful for his family as well.
Great story, and sorry about the boss.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: shingy on October 30, 2022, 08:34:39 AM
Bump - I'm jonesing for some new stories :)
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: ducky19 on October 31, 2022, 09:12:36 AM
I have one, although it's not nearly as epic as most on here. Still, shows the power having FU money gives.

A manager of a group downstream from mine sent a nastygram the other day. No greeting, just that we've been waiting on information since June, implying that they've been waiting on me. I have an awesome manager and we speak very freely to one another. He had mentioned some time ago that this other manager constantly made disparaging remarks about our team, how we're not doing our jobs, etc., yet had no specific examples when asked.

So, I went back through my records - emails, chats, and the like - and sent the results to her with my manager on copy. Turns out, someone on HER team dropped the ball, not me. She was sweet as sugar when she replied back, interestingly enough.

I was originally just going to bcc my manager, but I said to myself, "nope, this needs to be called out, and she needs to know it's being called out." I love my job and need "a" job for at least a few more years, but I don't need "this" job that bad, no ma'am.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: fuzzy math on November 21, 2022, 09:49:43 AM
I have an epic FU story brewing.

I work in healthcare. Have an inept manager who has refused on many occasions to ever learn a single thing about what my clinical specialty does and has also never observed my work. I also have an administrator over the manager who likes to get full of rage and swing his tiny dick around flaunting his power. I've sat in on many meetings where this person has yelled at me in front of a bunch of physicians (for things that ultimately come down to their management failures and me publicly stating those management failures) and everyone just sits there silently while he publicly rages.

Earlier this year after some woefully shameful staffing emergencies (caused by them repeatedly ignoring the problem of having 2 members of a 4-5 person team leaving), I asked to be removed from their chain of management and put under a set of physicians who we actually work with and who can clinically evaluate us. In 6 years I've never received feedback from management because they are not qualified to interpret my job. Once I offered to take my manager down the hall to show her a program I'd built and she told me no. "I don't need to see it, I just need to read up on the theory of why you would use it"... Does anyone think she ever actually did that?

Anyway, ragey administrator announced that he would be contracting out our positions (which I suspect is pure retaliation for me asking for different management). They finally got us a series of travelers who show up when its convenient for their schedules. They've gone through this process of accepting bids and chose a small fly by night company in a state about 1200 miles away. The company owner is younger then me (and I'm not old), inexperienced and every single time someone has tried to contact him he's been too busy in clinical emergencies to respond to a call for 1-2 days. He's trying to build his business by covering multiple local contracts with himself and it appears to be a mess. He also tries to do his outside business in the middle of the hospital while caring for patients.

I've been watching this unfold for months, and this dude is going to fly out to meet us Nov 30 and offer us jobs with his new company starting Jan 1. Unbeknownst to him or hospital management, 2 out of the 3 of us will not be coming on board. The 3rd coworker has a possible pending clinical investigation due to multiple patient care mistakes. I've taken another job and I'm just sitting back silently waiting for this whole thing to blow up in their faces. I have no one to quit / provide notice to since the hospital is the one attempting to end my employment and I don't owe giving notice to a company I've never worked for. Management is so glib over the fact that they're getting rid of us, they're completely ignoring us. I tried asking about a traveler for clinical help for January and their response is "I'm sorry I can't comment on January because you won't be an employee and the new company will have to deal with staffing".

However in my only conversation with this guy, I found out he's not legally licensed to practice in my state. He doesn't employ anyone who can come here full time who is licensed here either. The one guy he sent refused to come back. Everyone else who has come has another full time job and only comes to cover during their vacation time. Company owner is not credentialed at either hospital we cover, and due to govt beaurocracy he won't be able to be credentialed by then either. He has not signed the contract with the hospital, he told me "I'm going to fly out, get you guys all on board and then sign the contract". When he flies out and finds out that 2 of us are not coming along, the 3rd needs to medically / clinically be forced to retire, he will not be able to provide services. Then he will have to tell the hospital that he can't sign the contract and ragey administrator will hopefully have a stroke.

Its going to be great.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Sandi_k on November 21, 2022, 09:57:06 AM
@fuzzy math - I look forward to your update!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: okits on November 21, 2022, 12:16:31 PM
@fuzzy math I presume you have been given the written notice ending your employment?  It will be so sweet for you to point at it and repeat back that “according to this paperwork you gave me, I don’t work here as of January”.

I hope your new job treats you much better!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Glenstache on November 21, 2022, 12:36:38 PM
@fuzzy math the incompetence of firing people and such before having a contract in hand for something like this transition is staggering. From your description, this type of magical/optimistic thinking is the norm and leads to all kinds of problems. Good on you for moving on from that situation. I hope the FU moment is satisfying. The phrase "I'm removing myself from your chain of management." may be useful.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: BicycleB on November 21, 2022, 12:52:43 PM
@fuzzy math, I hereby sign up for your updates.

Epic? Already is!!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: RWTL on November 21, 2022, 01:52:15 PM
@fuzzy math  - Wow....what a $hit show.  As I was reading it, I was thinking maybe you should register an LLC and take advantage of the situation, but it probably is best to run from that.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: grantmeaname on November 21, 2022, 02:08:29 PM
amazing levels of tire fire there.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Taran Wanderer on November 21, 2022, 02:53:17 PM
Great story. Thanks!

While I’m here, I’m surprised we haven’t seen any FU stories out of Twitter. No Twitterites on MMM? Or are the wounds too fresh?
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Shane on November 21, 2022, 03:07:59 PM
Sounds like the story's about to get even better. Please keep us updated on how things turn out, fuzzy math.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: SwordGuy on November 21, 2022, 04:28:20 PM
While I’m here, I’m surprised we haven’t seen any FU stories out of Twitter. No Twitterites on MMM?

That's such a great idea I just went on Twitter and asked for some stories!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Zamboni on November 21, 2022, 04:50:13 PM
I hope you linked this thread for the ex-twitter folks to come share with us.

fuzzy math, I continue to be astounded by the culture of abuse in clinical care settings. It doesn't make sense to me that there is a rampant culture of abuse in healthcare, but too many people have stories to indicate that it is.

Are you starting your new job around the same time they are planning to make you a contractor? I'd be tempted to tell the guy flying in "this is an interesting prospect. Thank you for talking this over with us and offering these contracts. I'll definitely think it over" rather than just telling him I'm gone. Why not drag it out?

By contracting it out, is their plan that you won't have benefits? If so, then I'd point out I am fully aware how much benefits are worth (likely you'd need something like a 25-50+% bump in pay to make it a level swap, depending upon your pay and current benefits.) Find out how much it would cost monthly just to keep your health insurance on Cobra, and at a minimum tack that onto your salary needs, but there are likely other benefits that are worth money you can compute. My own employer sends us an annual statement to point out our "real" pay if benefits are counted. Kind of obnoxious in a way, but also makes me aware that salary is only a part of my compensation.

I hope your next batch of colleagues know how to act!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Wolfpack Mustachian on November 21, 2022, 06:12:20 PM
It seems to illustrate just how out of touch and incredibly cocky managers can be. They let you know well in advance that they're going to kick you to the curb and that you can just hope to get on company that they're contracting you out to.......and just expect you to sit there and take it. Of course you'd be looking for another job, who wouldn't? You're losing your job, possibly/probably many benefits, etc. In this job market. Good grief. They must assume that everyone that works for them has zero self-esteem and will just take it? I can't wait to read about the results!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Freedomin5 on November 21, 2022, 10:58:35 PM
Whoa! @fuzzy math I can't wait to read the update.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: chrisgermany on November 22, 2022, 12:08:02 AM
I understand that the hospital has NOT yet given notice to you.
So make sure to give notice according to your notice period. Even with your new job lined up and the upcoming contractor drama  I would make sure to handle my current employment end according to law and contract  and have evidence of that.

And please keep us updated!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: LennStar on November 22, 2022, 12:43:47 AM
I understand that the hospital has NOT yet given notice to you.
So make sure to give notice according to your notice period. Even with your new job lined up and the upcoming contractor drama  I would make sure to handle my current employment end according to law and contract  and have evidence of that.

And please keep us updated!
And do it in the respectful, understanding (read: nasty) way.

Something like "Since my manager has repeatedly told me that I won't work with the hospital in January, but I didn't get a formal notice so far, I am giving mine so that I don't have to tell a new company that they can't hire me in January because I am still bound to the hospital."
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Trifle on November 22, 2022, 02:05:25 AM
Whoa @fuzzy math this is epic indeed!  I worked in hospitals much of my career, and your supervisors are completely screwed.  It's a mess of their own making, which sadly is common. 

I had the same thought as @RWTL -- maybe you could set up your own shop, and then when they realize just how screwed they are, really stick it to them.  But if you expect your new job to be better (must be?), then it probably is better to just put this shit show behind you. 

Can't wait to read the next chapter. 
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: afuera on November 22, 2022, 08:34:18 AM
I have an FU money story that happened about 2 months ago.

I've had the same professional engineering job since college.  I had about 4 different roles within the company and received pretty regular pay bumps and salary grade promotions and received a couple exceeding expectations performance reviews.   While I was young and kid-less, the job was manageable and I was well compensated so I was fairly content but I had one baby in 2021 and a second surprise baby in early 2022 and the job was quickly starting to not fit my lifestyle anymore.  When I got back from maternity leave in early 2022, my supervisor was talking about my work schedule for an upcoming turnaround (large unit outage requiring 24 hour engineering support) which would be 12 hour shifts with 1 fatigue day off every 7-12 days.  I worked one of these outages a couple years prior and while it sucked, it was manageable for the 2 months that the outage took.  I told him that I really couldn't see how I was going to work that schedule since I was still breastfeeding my 5 month old and my supply would definitely drop missing that many feedings.  Granted, he had just had a baby and his wife was pregnant with a second so I thought he would understand my situation.  Instead, he was not willing to compromise at all and just said "You will find a way to make it work".

Here is where the FU money comes in.  My husband had already quit his job to be a house spouse/SAHD so we still needed my income to pay the mortgage, buy diapers, etc.  But since we have been saving 60%-70% of our income for years and had $1MM in investments, I knew that I could take a pay cut to work less hours or a less demanding job and while I needed a job, I did not need this one!   I started applying to new jobs like crazy, probably 20 different applications within a month and was able to get pretty far in the interview process with a small little plant across the country but close to my family which is a huge bonus with two kids under 2.  I was mentally calculating how much of a pay cut I would take in order to leave my old job/situation but I ended up getting an offer for higher salary, better benefits, a huge relocation package and a signing bonus.  I accepted the offer and negotiated a start date about 6 weeks later.
The following Monday, two weeks before my outage schedule was supposed to start, I gave my supervisor two weeks’ notice. My exact words were "I found a way to make it work". His face just dropped and I could tell he was pissed but he didn't really say much.  He had my job posted internally the next day, trying to get someone to fill the position before the outage.

I cannot explain how blissful it was to have an entire month off work to focus on moving across the country while knowing that my old coworkers were working that horrendous schedule.  Now, my work life balance is so much better, I'm closer to family, and I'm getting better compensation.  I just got an email a couple weeks back that they posted my old position externally and the salary range on indeed/glassdoor was about $30K less than I was making.  Yea, good luck with that.

In the end my FU money bought me the confidence to look for a new job even if the pay was lower and it bought me a glorious month off of work to focus on time with my babies/moving and I couldn't be happier.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: zolotiyeruki on November 22, 2022, 08:39:59 AM
Would it not be more profitable to wait for the hospital to terminate the employment and maybe provide severance, than to give notice ahead of time?
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: By the River on November 22, 2022, 08:40:49 AM
...
In the end my FU money bought me the confidence to look for a new job even if the pay was lower and it bought me a glorious month off of work to focus on time with my babies/moving and I couldn't be happier.

Great job using the FU money. 
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: BikeFanatic on November 22, 2022, 08:55:36 AM
Quote
The following Monday, two weeks before my outage schedule was supposed to start, I gave my supervisor two weeks’ notice. My exact words were "I found a way to make it work"
Afuera- wow that is epic!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: rockstache on November 22, 2022, 09:05:45 AM
Afuera, you are a total badass. Congratulations on your new position and your new home and that awesome power move.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: fuzzy math on November 22, 2022, 09:31:53 AM
I hope you linked this thread for the ex-twitter folks to come share with us.

fuzzy math, I continue to be astounded by the culture of abuse in clinical care settings. It doesn't make sense to me that there is a rampant culture of abuse in healthcare, but too many people have stories to indicate that it is.

Are you starting your new job around the same time they are planning to make you a contractor? I'd be tempted to tell the guy flying in "this is an interesting prospect. Thank you for talking this over with us and offering these contracts. I'll definitely think it over" rather than just telling him I'm gone. Why not drag it out?

By contracting it out, is their plan that you won't have benefits? If so, then I'd point out I am fully aware how much benefits are worth (likely you'd need something like a 25-50+% bump in pay to make it a level swap, depending upon your pay and current benefits.) Find out how much it would cost monthly just to keep your health insurance on Cobra, and at a minimum tack that onto your salary needs, but there are likely other benefits that are worth money you can compute. My own employer sends us an annual statement to point out our "real" pay if benefits are counted. Kind of obnoxious in a way, but also makes me aware that salary is only a part of my compensation.

I hope your next batch of colleagues know how to act!

Thanks everyone for the support and amusement over my situation!
I quoted you @Zamboni because I think you caught on to my situation the best. I'm going to try to answer some of the other questions / comments too.

My benefits ending is kick in the pants that finally convinced me to leave. Without completely doxxing myself I work for an institution where the benefits (pension, tuition for family, super cheap insurance, 457b etc) make up a HUGE portion of my compensation. Its why I've kept licking the turd lollipop that has been my entire job. Jim Bob's Fly By Night Contracting Co will absolutely not be able to come even near the benefits package.

There is absolutely an element of stalling to try to confuse everyone more. I'm going to bring a super long list of questions for this guy so he has to go back and do his homework. It will also serve as a warning to him that the institution has not been forthright and has not provided him nearly the details he needs to be able to manage the account.
My coworker who is leaving is going to tell him he's taking the employment contract to his lawyer. That will kill at least a week. The goal is for it to be mid December, have administration get upset that the contract is still pending, and have them ask us what our plans are / why the hold up. The answer to them then is basically parroting what my manager said "I'm sorry but you've told me to talk to the contractor about all matters of employment starting in January" and "I really don't feel comfortable discussing or having you interfere in my private employment details with contractor at this time."

Administration ASSUMES its a given that the contract will go through. They ASSUME we will all come on as employees. Any attempts on my end to discuss what might happen if it doesn't go through in January have been ignored by the hospital. The contractor did give me solid advice to sign up for health insurance through the hospital in January on the chance that he doesn't take over Jan 1 and wouldn't therefore be able to provide me insurance. He at least has a small idea that this process could be difficult, as evidenced by "I'm going to fly out and get you all on board before I sign the contract". I bet the hospital thinks that even if we don't sign on that this guy will provide service. They have no idea that its impossible and therefore no idea that the contract cannot go through. That's why their "I'm sorry none of this is my problem in January" talk is going to come back to bite them.

The hospital has not officially given me layoff paperwork because the contract is not signed. I have not given notice yet because I currently don't have anyone to give notice to. If it remains under hospital control in January, I will then provide 30 days notice. But at this point my employer has told me they're not the ones responsible for me in January.  Why would I notify the hospital if they have basically told me that they're not my chain of command for 2023? Unfortunately with things going down how I envision them happening, I won't be laid off because I'll be forced to provide notice in mid December after the contract falls through. But I'm not going to tell them a single thing until they ask me repeatedly and then tell me the contractor has backed out. 
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: fuzzy math on November 22, 2022, 09:33:13 AM
@afuera Congrats lady! Its wonderful that you ended up with so much more (quality of life, pay) after being willing to accept much less to just get out of that situation.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Dicey on November 22, 2022, 10:36:37 AM
Congratulations @afuera!

@fuzzy math, I'm getting the popcorn ready...this is gonna be good!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Captain FIRE on November 22, 2022, 10:50:19 AM
The hospital has not officially given me layoff paperwork because the contract is not signed. I have not given notice yet because I currently don't have anyone to give notice to. If it remains under hospital control in January, I will then provide 30 days notice. But at this point my employer has told me they're not the ones responsible for me in January.  Why would I notify the hospital if they have basically told me that they're not my chain of command for 2023?

I am enjoying the popcorn.  When you say you have been "basically told", is this crystal clear and in writing?  I do want to caution that unless they've given you official notice of the change, you likely do need* to give them notice if they don't give you formal notice first, even if you are not quite sure to whom it should be.  (I would think to your current boss though.)

When does the new job start? They are giving a generous transition time to you if in January.

*I use need loosely.  In an at will employment state, you aren't legally obligated to do so, but it's a very strong custom for not burning bridges.  (Although they might consider you to have burnt a bridge here anyways.)
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: BicycleB on November 22, 2022, 10:52:59 AM
...he was not willing to compromise at all and just said "You will find a way to make it work".

...two weeks before my outage schedule was supposed to start, I gave my supervisor two weeks’ notice. My exact words were "I found a way to make it work". His face just dropped...

In the end my FU money bought me the confidence to look for a new job even if the pay was lower and it bought me a glorious month off of work to focus on time with my babies/moving and I couldn't be happier.

LOL!!!!!!! @afuera, that's golden.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: chrisgermany on November 22, 2022, 10:58:27 AM
@fuzzy math : Right now you and the hospital are in contract.
 This situation remains as is, unless one side gives notice and the notice period has passed OR you and the hospital agree to end your employmen on a certain date.
I would want to make sure that I am not in contract with 2 employers on Jan. 1st.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Shane on November 22, 2022, 12:11:43 PM
Congratulations, afuera! That's exactly what FU money is for.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Shane on November 22, 2022, 12:23:42 PM
@fuzzy math : Right now you and the hospital are in contract.
 This situation remains as is, unless one side gives notice and the notice period has passed OR you and the hospital agree to end your employmen on a certain date.
I would want to make sure that I am not in contract with 2 employers on Jan. 1st.

What you may be missing, Chris, is that in the US most workers don't have a contract. Almost all employees here are engaged in what's called, "at will employment." This means employers are under no obligation to continue to employ anyone. They can fire any worker, at any time, for any reason (aside from provable discrimination based on race, religion, etc), or for no reason at all. The other side of that coin is that employees are totally free to quit their jobs at any time, for any reason, or for no reason at all. Generally, there's a custom that employees are expected to give employers 2 weeks notice if they intend to quit, but this is in no way legally enforceable. It's just a custom. Otoh, employers regularly fire employees with zero notice, and that's totally legal, as well.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: chrisgermany on November 22, 2022, 03:06:57 PM
@Shane:
Thanks, indeed this is a missing piece for me.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Zamboni on November 22, 2022, 03:18:12 PM
Congrats, afuera! Well done indeed!

Quote
I'm not going to tell them a single thing until they ask me repeatedly and then tell me the contractor has backed out.

fuzzy math: My suggestion here would be that you are super duper nice to the owner of the contract company when he visits. Warn him gently as you can, but be nice. Maybe he will follow up to let you know whether he decided to sign the contract? You can always give him your contact info and ask him to do that. I think it's a good idea to give him a lot of questions (perhaps even a written list of questions) so he knows what he is getting into.

Let him also know what you calculated your salary requirements need to be given the anticipated drop in the level of benefits, but be super nice to him. Not at all his fault that the current admin is idiots.

I work for a similar employer. In calculating your elevated pay requirements given any drop in benefits, please don't forget to include your current employer's paid time off (vacation, sick time, holidays, personal days) as contractors may or may not have paid time off. I found my employer's statement of the benefits that paid to me last year! Not including paid days off, and not including social security (which I'm assume any employer would have to pay on my behalf) they say my benefits cost them about $44,000 last year. That's a lot of money! It will be quite a lot more this year because I'm taking advantage of family educational benefits that weren't used before. Gotta add it ALL up!

If you have a new job lined up, then wait as long as you can to give notice. Once you give notice, they might try to treat you even worse. Unfortunately I've seen that happen. I know my employer has a written policy that requires 30 days notice "to be eligible for rehire." Up to you whether or not you care about that. I do know that my friend who hires nurses only calls references to ask for dates of employment and to ask if the person is eligible for rehire. In my case, I doubt any future employer would ever ask that particular question due to my different field, so I am less inclined to care.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Simpli-Fi on November 22, 2022, 03:41:04 PM
I have an FU money story that happened about 2 months ago.

"I found a way to make it work". His face just dropped and I could tell he was pissed

AaaaaaaaaHAHAHAHA!  this was a great read; congrats
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: LightTripper on November 22, 2022, 03:56:18 PM
"I found a way to make it work".

What a beautiful beautiful mic-drop moment.  Thank you so much for sharing!  If you could bottle and sell that catharsis you'd never need to work again!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: fuzzy math on November 22, 2022, 04:04:16 PM
The hospital has not officially given me layoff paperwork because the contract is not signed. I have not given notice yet because I currently don't have anyone to give notice to. If it remains under hospital control in January, I will then provide 30 days notice. But at this point my employer has told me they're not the ones responsible for me in January.  Why would I notify the hospital if they have basically told me that they're not my chain of command for 2023?

I am enjoying the popcorn.  When you say you have been "basically told", is this crystal clear and in writing?  I do want to caution that unless they've given you official notice of the change, you likely do need* to give them notice if they don't give you formal notice first, even if you are not quite sure to whom it should be.  (I would think to your current boss though.)

When does the new job start? They are giving a generous transition time to you if in January.

*I use need loosely.  In an at will employment state, you aren't legally obligated to do so, but it's a very strong custom for not burning bridges.  (Although they might consider you to have burnt a bridge here anyways.)

They and Employee relations have given me a summary of things known so far and intentions to have these changes occur with tentative dates. However since its not final there's nothing.

Everything I've said here is that I intend to give notice if they are still my employer. However if they don't intend to be my employer they may find it out through the contract owner when the contract owner tries to pressure me into signing on with him. I am possibly willing to work 1-3 weeks for him in January but its equally likely that he will not want the hassle of hiring me for that time frame. It is also somewhat dependent on what my other departing coworker does.
I start no later than Feb 13. Possibly it will be moved up if I don't have or don't want to work here during that time. Lots of moving pieces, my entire family will be moving.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: fuzzy math on November 22, 2022, 04:09:52 PM
Congrats, afuera! Well done indeed!

Quote
I'm not going to tell them a single thing until they ask me repeatedly and then tell me the contractor has backed out.

fuzzy math: My suggestion here would be that you are super duper nice to the owner of the contract company when he visits. Warn him gently as you can, but be nice. Maybe he will follow up to let you know whether he decided to sign the contract? You can always give him your contact info and ask him to do that. I think it's a good idea to give him a lot of questions (perhaps even a written list of questions) so he knows what he is getting into.

Let him also know what you calculated your salary requirements need to be given the anticipated drop in the level of benefits, but be super nice to him. Not at all his fault that the current admin is idiots.

I work for a similar employer. In calculating your elevated pay requirements given any drop in benefits, please don't forget to include your current employer's paid time off (vacation, sick time, holidays, personal days) as contractors may or may not have paid time off. I found my employer's statement of the benefits that paid to me last year! Not including paid days off, and not including social security (which I'm assume any employer would have to pay on my behalf) they say my benefits cost them about $44,000 last year. That's a lot of money! It will be quite a lot more this year because I'm taking advantage of family educational benefits that weren't used before. Gotta add it ALL up!

If you have a new job lined up, then wait as long as you can to give notice. Once you give notice, they might try to treat you even worse. Unfortunately I've seen that happen. I know my employer has a written policy that requires 30 days notice "to be eligible for rehire." Up to you whether or not you care about that. I do know that my friend who hires nurses only calls references to ask for dates of employment and to ask if the person is eligible for rehire. In my case, I doubt any future employer would ever ask that particular question due to my different field, so I am less inclined to care.

Yes there's potentially an option to do locums coverage for him someday. I don't intend to destroy him in the process. I hope he will walk away thinking he dodged a bullet. At the same time, he's ghosted all of us and hasn't even contacted us again to confirm that he's coming on the 30th. He said he wanted to hear everything about the contract, but hasn't called us since the original date we all called him over a month ago. If he's courting us, its sure a weird way to show it.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Zamboni on November 22, 2022, 04:29:00 PM
fuzzy math, I'm trying to follow what your current employer thinks is going to happen. If they hire an outside contractor company to cover your position, then you will no longer be their employee. Are they thinking that they will terminate your employment and you will just willingly move to this new company? Without any sort of severance? Does your employer, which sounds large, normally give severance pay to employees they lay off? They would pay you unused vacation & sick time upon termination of your employment with them, right?

Because that is what they are doing: they are telling you that you to anticipate being laid off as of the end of this year, which is only a month away at this point. I think it's reasonable to ask these questions, perhaps with an HR person rather than your bosses, who sound like bozos.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Gremlin on November 22, 2022, 04:42:50 PM
The hospital has not officially given me layoff paperwork because the contract is not signed. I have not given notice yet because I currently don't have anyone to give notice to. If it remains under hospital control in January, I will then provide 30 days notice. But at this point my employer has told me they're not the ones responsible for me in January.  Why would I notify the hospital if they have basically told me that they're not my chain of command for 2023?

I am enjoying the popcorn.  When you say you have been "basically told", is this crystal clear and in writing?  I do want to caution that unless they've given you official notice of the change, you likely do need* to give them notice if they don't give you formal notice first, even if you are not quite sure to whom it should be.  (I would think to your current boss though.)

When does the new job start? They are giving a generous transition time to you if in January.

*I use need loosely.  In an at will employment state, you aren't legally obligated to do so, but it's a very strong custom for not burning bridges.  (Although they might consider you to have burnt a bridge here anyways.)

They and Employee relations have given me a summary of things known so far and intentions to have these changes occur with tentative dates. However since its not final there's nothing.

Everything I've said here is that I intend to give notice if they are still my employer. However if they don't intend to be my employer they may find it out through the contract owner when the contract owner tries to pressure me into signing on with him. I am possibly willing to work 1-3 weeks for him in January but its equally likely that he will not want the hassle of hiring me for that time frame. It is also somewhat dependent on what my other departing coworker does.
I start no later than Feb 13. Possibly it will be moved up if I don't have or don't want to work here during that time. Lots of moving pieces, my entire family will be moving.

Unless you have an issue with cashflow yourself, my guess is that this will cause you a fair bit of angst.  You'd have to jump through hoops with the contract owner for all of, at most, 3 weeks of income. 
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: TomTX on November 24, 2022, 09:54:44 AM
I hope you linked this thread for the ex-twitter folks to come share with us.

fuzzy math, I continue to be astounded by the culture of abuse in clinical care settings. It doesn't make sense to me that there is a rampant culture of abuse in healthcare, but too many people have stories to indicate that it is.

Are you starting your new job around the same time they are planning to make you a contractor? I'd be tempted to tell the guy flying in "this is an interesting prospect. Thank you for talking this over with us and offering these contracts. I'll definitely think it over" rather than just telling him I'm gone. Why not drag it out?

By contracting it out, is their plan that you won't have benefits? If so, then I'd point out I am fully aware how much benefits are worth (likely you'd need something like a 25-50+% bump in pay to make it a level swap, depending upon your pay and current benefits.) Find out how much it would cost monthly just to keep your health insurance on Cobra, and at a minimum tack that onto your salary needs, but there are likely other benefits that are worth money you can compute. My own employer sends us an annual statement to point out our "real" pay if benefits are counted. Kind of obnoxious in a way, but also makes me aware that salary is only a part of my compensation.

I hope your next batch of colleagues know how to act!
That's way too lowball. Contracting rates should be around 3x salary rates. Bare minimum of 2x.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: TomTX on November 24, 2022, 10:00:27 AM
...he was not willing to compromise at all and just said "You will find a way to make it work".

...two weeks before my outage schedule was supposed to start, I gave my supervisor two weeks’ notice. My exact words were "I found a way to make it work". His face just dropped...

In the end my FU money bought me the confidence to look for a new job even if the pay was lower and it bought me a glorious month off of work to focus on time with my babies/moving and I couldn't be happier.

LOL!!!!!!! @afuera, that's golden.
Agreed. Awesome story.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Frugal Lizard on November 24, 2022, 10:49:07 AM
...he was not willing to compromise at all and just said "You will find a way to make it work".

...two weeks before my outage schedule was supposed to start, I gave my supervisor two weeks’ notice. My exact words were "I found a way to make it work". His face just dropped...

In the end my FU money bought me the confidence to look for a new job even if the pay was lower and it bought me a glorious month off of work to focus on time with my babies/moving and I couldn't be happier.

LOL!!!!!!! @afuera, that's golden.
Agreed. Awesome story.
two thumbs up!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: AO1FireTo on November 24, 2022, 10:52:59 AM
...he was not willing to compromise at all and just said "You will find a way to make it work".

...two weeks before my outage schedule was supposed to start, I gave my supervisor two weeks’ notice. My exact words were "I found a way to make it work". His face just dropped...

In the end my FU money bought me the confidence to look for a new job even if the pay was lower and it bought me a glorious month off of work to focus on time with my babies/moving and I couldn't be happier.

LOL!!!!!!! @afuera, that's golden.
Agreed. Awesome story.
two thumbs up!

Awesome, this forum needs a like button!!!  Maybe we could make some customized MMM emojis :)
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: bmjohnson35 on November 24, 2022, 11:32:07 AM

Great story afuera. Good for you!

fuzzy math: Assuming I do understand your situation, I don't understand how your employer hasn't provided some form of formal notice, with or without a severance package.  I have witnessed firsthand how arrogant and clueless management and HR can be, but this is at another level. I look forward to your updates.

P.S.  I can see how some of these stories can be confusing for non-US residents.  I worked for a huge company that operated in 60 countries and I was certainly amazed by the protections afforded employees/employers in other countries.  I remember having to sign off on training covering privacy protection laws for European employees despite the fact much of the protections didn't apply to the US employees.  The drug & alcohol policy was another huge difference from country to country.

Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: rpr on November 24, 2022, 05:48:37 PM
@afuera -- That is a wonderful story.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: LennStar on November 25, 2022, 02:46:47 AM

P.S.  I can see how some of these stories can be confusing for non-US residents.  I worked for a huge company that operated in 60 countries and I was certainly amazed by the protections afforded employees/employers in other countries.  I remember having to sign off on training covering privacy protection laws for European employees despite the fact much of the protections didn't apply to the US employees.  The drug & alcohol policy was another huge difference from country to country.
Yeah, some things are mind boggling for us socialists here ;)
In the case of privacy laws, practically everyone has to sign something and many get training, even if that is only a 1-hour test.
In your case your company was still bound to EU law since you did business here, though the rules often are lobbied to be relaxed. "Safe harbour" and such stuff, often declared unconstitutional here. Might also be a reason by Twitter will get either fined or shut down here in the near future.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: fuzzy math on November 26, 2022, 07:19:56 AM
@bmjohnson35 and @Zamboni

What you've both said about it being reasonable to have notice by now is how things work in the real world, not bizarre-o-land. I've never been able to explain this place to anyone who doesn't work there and not have their jaws drop.

After I told my boss she had better involve employee relations in this, we did get the summary email CCed to employee relations. When I asked her about some of the wording in it, she told me it was because employee relations had told management they can't just verbally tell us we're losing our jobs, everything had to be documented. It would never have occurred to her otherwise.

Of course if I cared I'd be asking for updates, I'd be messaging employee relations saying how unfair this is and how I need updates to be able to plan my life. I tried telling them that at the beginning re: health insurance, but they DON'T CARE. Its like screaming into an abyss. The summary email makes it absolutely clear that there is no official news and if I were to call employee relations they'd just refer me back to the point that there's no date yet. Then my manager would say "of course its going for Jan 1".  I think silence in this situation is better because it allows them to think we've come to accept this and it keeps us off their radar. Makes the employee announcements in a few weeks all that much sweeter.


Good morning team:

Following up regarding the information that was shared with each of you in early October about the anticipated transition of the XXX team & services from hospital to COMPANY
Based on our conversations to date, I understand and acknowledge that you may have concerns or feel anxious regarding the anticipated transition as there are still some unknowns – please know, we are working with COMPANY and with Employee Relations team to ensure a smooth transition.

Here’s a rundown of what we know as of early October:

COMPANY was informally awarded the RFP (Request for Proposal) to provide XXX services for hospital
As of early October, a contract was not officially signed
 
We are committed to regular informational meetings once more information is known (examples: timeline, effective date, salaries, benefits, etc.) . I encourage you to share your thoughts and concerns,  asking questions so we can ensure you have accurate information as we progress.

Thank you for your continued service to our patients.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: LennStar on November 26, 2022, 09:29:34 AM
Oh yeah, the fake smile, whip in the back "thank you for..." makes this drop of non-information a LOT better ;)

I hope you have stocked up on your popcorn reserves, the trailers are awesome!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: AMandM on November 26, 2022, 10:12:09 PM
I love how they acknowledge you may have concerns about the transition, but they clearly assume that you are going to work for the new COMPANY and that your concerns are merely about the details of how/when your salary and benefits will change.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: janibromma on November 27, 2022, 08:22:08 AM
Thank you so much for sharing! I am so looking forward to see the outcome.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: 2Birds1Stone on November 27, 2022, 09:35:23 AM
...he was not willing to compromise at all and just said "You will find a way to make it work".

...two weeks before my outage schedule was supposed to start, I gave my supervisor two weeks’ notice. My exact words were "I found a way to make it work". His face just dropped...

In the end my FU money bought me the confidence to look for a new job even if the pay was lower and it bought me a glorious month off of work to focus on time with my babies/moving and I couldn't be happier.

LOL!!!!!!! @afuera, that's golden.
Agreed. Awesome story.
two thumbs up!

Awesome, this forum needs a like button!!!  Maybe we could make some customized MMM emojis :)

Fantastic indeed!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Siebrie on November 28, 2022, 02:16:49 AM
The international company I used to work for offered their key employees (the complete C-team, of course, and a few others) a bonus of a quarter to half their annual salary for staying on during transition times (mergers / take-overs) until at least 6 months after the deal was completed. Maybe you can negotiate something similar?
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: mm1970 on November 28, 2022, 11:20:48 AM
...he was not willing to compromise at all and just said "You will find a way to make it work".

...two weeks before my outage schedule was supposed to start, I gave my supervisor two weeks’ notice. My exact words were "I found a way to make it work". His face just dropped...

In the end my FU money bought me the confidence to look for a new job even if the pay was lower and it bought me a glorious month off of work to focus on time with my babies/moving and I couldn't be happier.

LOL!!!!!!! @afuera, that's golden.
+1.  I am gobsmacked that someone (your boss) with a new baby + 1 on the way is able to compartmentalize like that.  Buh bye.

I'm going to get the popcorn ready for fuzzy...
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: ysette9 on November 29, 2022, 06:34:57 PM
I have an FU money story that happened about 2 months ago.

I've had the same professional engineering job since college.  I had about 4 different roles within the company and received pretty regular pay bumps and salary grade promotions and received a couple exceeding expectations performance reviews.   While I was young and kid-less, the job was manageable and I was well compensated so I was fairly content but I had one baby in 2021 and a second surprise baby in early 2022 and the job was quickly starting to not fit my lifestyle anymore.  When I got back from maternity leave in early 2022, my supervisor was talking about my work schedule for an upcoming turnaround (large unit outage requiring 24 hour engineering support) which would be 12 hour shifts with 1 fatigue day off every 7-12 days.  I worked one of these outages a couple years prior and while it sucked, it was manageable for the 2 months that the outage took.  I told him that I really couldn't see how I was going to work that schedule since I was still breastfeeding my 5 month old and my supply would definitely drop missing that many feedings.  Granted, he had just had a baby and his wife was pregnant with a second so I thought he would understand my situation.  Instead, he was not willing to compromise at all and just said "You will find a way to make it work".

Here is where the FU money comes in.  My husband had already quit his job to be a house spouse/SAHD so we still needed my income to pay the mortgage, buy diapers, etc.  But since we have been saving 60%-70% of our income for years and had $1MM in investments, I knew that I could take a pay cut to work less hours or a less demanding job and while I needed a job, I did not need this one!   I started applying to new jobs like crazy, probably 20 different applications within a month and was able to get pretty far in the interview process with a small little plant across the country but close to my family which is a huge bonus with two kids under 2.  I was mentally calculating how much of a pay cut I would take in order to leave my old job/situation but I ended up getting an offer for higher salary, better benefits, a huge relocation package and a signing bonus.  I accepted the offer and negotiated a start date about 6 weeks later.
The following Monday, two weeks before my outage schedule was supposed to start, I gave my supervisor two weeks’ notice. My exact words were "I found a way to make it work". His face just dropped and I could tell he was pissed but he didn't really say much.  He had my job posted internally the next day, trying to get someone to fill the position before the outage.

I cannot explain how blissful it was to have an entire month off work to focus on moving across the country while knowing that my old coworkers were working that horrendous schedule.  Now, my work life balance is so much better, I'm closer to family, and I'm getting better compensation.  I just got an email a couple weeks back that they posted my old position externally and the salary range on indeed/glassdoor was about $30K less than I was making.  Yea, good luck with that.

In the end my FU money bought me the confidence to look for a new job even if the pay was lower and it bought me a glorious month off of work to focus on time with my babies/moving and I couldn't be happier.
“I found a way to make it work”

This is fucking awesome. I applaud you.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: markbike528CBX on November 29, 2022, 09:30:21 PM
@fuzzy math : Right now you and the hospital are in contract.
 This situation remains as is, unless one side gives notice and the notice period has passed OR you and the hospital agree to end your employmen on a certain date.
I would want to make sure that I am not in contract with 2 employers on Jan. 1st.

What you may be missing, Chris, is that in the US most workers don't have a contract. Almost all employees here are engaged in what's called, "at will employment." This means employers are under no obligation to continue to employ anyone. They can fire any worker, at any time, for any reason (aside from provable discrimination based on race, religion, etc), or for no reason at all. The other side of that coin is that employees are totally free to quit their jobs at any time, for any reason, or for no reason at all. Generally, there's a custom that employees are expected to give employers 2 weeks notice if they intend to quit, but this is in no way legally enforceable. It's just a custom. Otoh, employers regularly fire employees with zero notice, and that's totally legal, as well.

Getting PAID twice might be OK.
https://www.schlockmercenary.com/2007-07-15
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: TomTX on December 01, 2022, 10:41:14 AM
The international company I used to work for offered their key employees (the complete C-team, of course, and a few others) a bonus of a quarter to half their annual salary for staying on during transition times (mergers / take-overs) until at least 6 months after the deal was completed. Maybe you can negotiate something similar?
Make sure there's a clause that the bonus is paid immediately if the company terminates you before the date of earning the bonus.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: RWTL on December 01, 2022, 10:48:06 AM
The international company I used to work for offered their key employees (the complete C-team, of course, and a few others) a bonus of a quarter to half their annual salary for staying on during transition times (mergers / take-overs) until at least 6 months after the deal was completed. Maybe you can negotiate something similar?

This is really helpful.  I may need to use this as a reference soon.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: NorthernMonkey on December 02, 2022, 04:54:10 AM
I've seen contracts like this, but they are often A LOT more than 3 months. 3 months would be considered the minimum.

I've seen 12 months pay for agreeing to stay for an 18 month transition period, payable as a lump at the end of the 18 month period.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: fuzzy math on December 02, 2022, 08:07:21 AM
Well it happened yesterday, I quit! Gave 3 weeks notice so my last day is Dec 22. Now I just have to survive any weird attempts to sabotage or force me out the door.

Contracting company guy never showed up Weds, he texted one of us and let us know that his agreement with the hospital is still not finalized and therefore he was asked not to come until it was final. He did drop the bomb that if certain conditions weren't met by the hospital that he would back out of the contract.

Everything came to a head Weds night when I received a call from a physician friend warning me that my older befuddled coworker had had a patient care related accident and was loudly cursing and screaming my name telling everyone that it was my fault. I had been home for hours and had only tangentially touched the item he was using, others had touched it afterwards and he had 4 hours with this particular item to orient himself to it and prepare to use it on a patient. I'm being vague obviously due to the nature of my job and not wanting to get sued. But needless to say it is NOT my fault. It became very clear that this coworker has some hatred towards me and was trying to do the only thing he could think of to keep his license and his job. I spent the night in abject terror of what I was going to arrive to at work on Thurs and what attempts to sabotage me this coworker might employ in the future.

Was approached by a chief physician asking if we had the equipment needed to safely provide patient care on Thurs at the beginning of my shift. I let him know about the shortages we had, it devolved into an argument where he accused my team of trying to ration or refuse patient care based on not having supplies. I told him we were completely out of safety items needed to do our jobs properly. He asked me if it was comfort or safety keeping us from doing things. I stated that I was clinically able to do anything, but whether it was wise or not was another matter. I then asked him if that patient care related accident from the previous night was safety or comfort. I told him that my team hadn't felt support from our bosses in a long time, but that we had always leaned on him for back up and support but that this was the first time I felt I no longer had support from him.

Made the split decision that I no longer shared any values with this organization and that I was at the risk of being sabotaged in the future. Decided I did not want to work at the end of the month when my accident prone coworker and I would be the only 2 people on the schedule. Walked to my office, called my husband and told him today was the day. He agreed. I called my other (reasonable coworker who is also going to quit), told him it was the day and coordinated dates with him because I would be dumping Christmas coverage on him if I quit. Then I wrote a 2 sentence email to my boss and bosses boss. Walked back to my work area and proceeded to do my job.

At some point the chief physician unknowingly walked into a meeting with the 2 level bosses and my (reasonable quitting) coworker. They were trying to discuss the void that I was creating by leaving and what to do about all of the supply issues I've been singlehandedly attempting to fix. Physician found out then and there "what??? fuzzy_math just quit??"  LOL. He knows exactly what led to my decision.

Needless to say he was a bit quiet when he returned to the area where we work. Bosses, this physician and others called a mandatory meeting with contracting company (who still hasn't signed an agreement) to try to figure out what to do about the loss of a person on a 3 member team. I did go speak to my immediate boss and let her know the reasons I was leaving. I said it was no longer a safe place to work and that I couldn't in good conscience stay as long as I'd intended to, but that I always would have quit in January. She let me know that she has told contracting company that they will need to investigate the problem coworker. I cannot imagine that company will sign the agreement at this point. Company will not have the staff and it would be his immediate job to figure out whether to fire the troublesome coworker after my reasonable coworker quits. Reasonable coworker has said he has the goal of getting to Dec 31 but he may quit sooner.

So I jumped the gun a bit, I'm not going to be drawing a paycheck for January, but everyone there knows I have my principles and I will not tolerate abuse or providing unsafe patient care. I consider it a win. Accident prone coworker doesn't know I've quit yet but he will find out one way or another today. I'm hoping to avoid fireworks there.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Frugal Lizard on December 02, 2022, 08:25:31 AM
@fuzzy math - Just wow.  What a sinking ship to get off of.

Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Trifle on December 02, 2022, 08:40:42 AM
+1.  Congrats on getting out @fuzzy math!  The next couple of weeks will likely be weird and uncomfortable, but you'll have a clean, fresh start in the new year to look forward to. 

Depending on the details of what your unreasonable coworker did, would it help to talk to Risk Management proactively, to cover yourself from blame as you exit?   
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Taran Wanderer on December 02, 2022, 09:26:32 AM
Great job standing up for yourself. Thanks for sharing your story.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Gronnie on December 02, 2022, 09:29:55 AM
I'd be a little worried about if I leave then hospital won't have as much incentive to defend me if I somehow got dragged into litigation for the incident coworker is trying to blame you for.

Do you have your own insurance for that?
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: fuzzy math on December 02, 2022, 09:35:09 AM
I have multiple text messages and emails stating to bosses and physicians I have safety concerns. My coworker had a safety checklist he signed as part of a pre patient care routine. It will fall squarely on him. If the hospital were to be sued and their lawyers got a chance to speak to me they'd be horrified about the overall lack of safety and the hospital would be forced to settle. I am not a physician, my liability insurance is thru them and I also carry umbrella insurance. I am not listed anywhere on the patient care record so I'm not even sure how I'd be dragged into it.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Dicey on December 02, 2022, 10:03:37 AM
Wow, way to go @fuzzy math!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Trifle on December 02, 2022, 11:01:10 AM
I have multiple text messages and emails stating to bosses and physicians I have safety concerns. My coworker had a safety checklist he signed as part of a pre patient care routine. It will fall squarely on him. If the hospital were to be sued and their lawyers got a chance to speak to me they'd be horrified about the overall lack of safety and the hospital would be forced to settle. I am not a physician, my liability insurance is thru them and I also carry umbrella insurance. I am not listed anywhere on the patient care record so I'm not even sure how I'd be dragged into it.

Awesome!  Great job @fuzzy math.  Consider printing the emails and texts before you leave, if you think there is any chance on god's green earth you would need to talk about it afterwards.   You won't have access to their system after your last day. 
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Sandi_k on December 02, 2022, 11:03:11 AM
@fuzzy math - good for you! So glad you have FU money and a supportive spouse - that sounds like a nightmare that you will be well rid of.

My mom was a CCU nurse and unit supervisor for many years; your stories would have broken her heart. Organizations in health care really do need to have some sort of professional ethics exhibited, even if they're out for the money, if they want to keep ethical staff. Epic fail on their part, and epic win on yours.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: mm1970 on December 02, 2022, 11:10:22 AM
Way to go, and wow, good time to completely bail and save yourself.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Loren Ver on December 02, 2022, 12:36:47 PM
@fuzzy math What a great way to end the year and start fresh.  Whew!  Sorry things went down so horribly, but I am glad you can go forward on your own terms!

@afuera your story warms my heart.  I even told it to my DH as I thought it was soo good!  "I found a way to make it work."  Indeed you did.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: rpr on December 02, 2022, 01:01:30 PM
Just Wow!

Good on you for standing up, fuzzy math!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: okits on December 02, 2022, 03:25:31 PM
Way to go, and wow, good time to completely bail and save yourself.

This is exactly it.  It sounds like a horrendous situation and you are the "winner" by extricating yourself as quickly as possible, sustaining as little damage as possible.  Congratulations on quitting and for all your and your spouse's work (financial, practical, and mental) to be in a good position to do it.

I hope you have a very merry and unstressful Christmas!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: BicycleB on December 02, 2022, 09:00:42 PM
Well done, @fuzzy math!

You have the emails and text messages stored outside the company’s email system?

Sorry to harp on these things you probably did, just recalling lock-out examples I’ve seen. Best wishes.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Zamboni on December 03, 2022, 06:56:58 AM
@fuzzy math your story is a huge win.

Instead of quitting primarily because of the poor treatment exhibited by HR & administration's plan to "farm you out," you also got to quit with timing that made the point to the MD staff that it is also quite unethical to cut costs so much that worker safety and patient care is sacrificed.

I'll support the prior statements that you should make yourself a hard copy folder of your written efforts to communicate safety concerns and keep it at your house. While it seems unlikely that anything will ever come of it even if they do try to throw you under the bus, it is not uncommon for people who are either leaving or already gone to be blamed for all problems large and small.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Trifle on December 04, 2022, 03:24:44 AM
While it seems unlikely that anything will ever come of it even if they do try to throw you under the bus, it is not uncommon for people who are either leaving or already gone to be blamed for all problems large and small.

This is so true.  I'm a former hospital exec, and this happens all the time. 
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: BikeFanatic on December 04, 2022, 07:24:55 AM
Great job gettin The hell out of there! Former ICU RN here, I am so glad you stood up for your principals.
I bet most there will secretly support your decision and may be emboldened by it also. I worked for one company like yours and I was aghast at the cost cutting, the patient danger, and the retention of incompetent employees, you say accident prone which is a great word for it. I so wish I had reported them to dept of public health. I was New ish and really could not believe the incompetence  was all the way up the chain and really institution wide.
My next job was at a real hospital that really cared about people and not just money. Epic FU to them Fuzzy math.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: LightTripper on December 07, 2022, 07:37:06 AM
Congratulations @fuzzy math !
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Gremlin on December 07, 2022, 06:17:36 PM
We track our spending in a spreadsheet.  For the current month we itemise everything in one tab.  But then we keep a historical record by spending category by month in a different tab.  Ie, I can tell you that I spent $2.10 on groceries on the 4th of December, and I can tell you that I spent $842.65 on groceries in July 2018, but I can't tell you what I spent on groceries on the 6th of July 2018.

Anyway, we have been tracking our monthly spend by category for about 14 years and each month we populate an extra column in the spreadsheet.  This month we have reached column FU in the Excel spreadsheet.

I pointed out to Mrs G that that represented FU money.  She just rolled her eyes at me and walked off in disgust...
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: jinga nation on December 07, 2022, 06:58:43 PM
We track our spending in a spreadsheet.  For the current month we itemise everything in one tab.  But then we keep a historical record by spending category by month in a different tab.  Ie, I can tell you that I spent $2.10 on groceries on the 4th of December, and I can tell you that I spent $842.65 on groceries in July 2018, but I can't tell you what I spent on groceries on the 6th of July 2018.

Anyway, we have been tracking our monthly spend by category for about 14 years and each month we populate an extra column in the spreadsheet.  This month we have reached column FU in the Excel spreadsheet.

I pointed out to Mrs G that that represented FU money.  She just rolled her eyes at me and walked off in disgust...

Is that a FIRE Dad Joke? :-p
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: RWD on December 07, 2022, 10:00:41 PM
[...] but I can't tell you what I spent on groceries on the 6th of July 2018.
I just checked and I actually went grocery shopping on July 6th, 2018. Spent $93.55 on groceries, $15.47 on supplies. Sales tax was $7.77 making the total bill $116.79.

Sometimes GnuCash feels like my diary.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Ladychips on December 07, 2022, 10:36:31 PM
[...] but I can't tell you what I spent on groceries on the 6th of July 2018.
I just checked and I actually went grocery shopping on July 6th, 2018. Spent $93.55 on groceries, $15.47 on supplies. Sales tax was $7.77 making the total bill $116.79.

Sometimes GnuCash feels like my diary.

I love this forum so much...you are my tribe...
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Trifle on December 08, 2022, 04:23:28 AM
[...] but I can't tell you what I spent on groceries on the 6th of July 2018.
I just checked and I actually went grocery shopping on July 6th, 2018. Spent $93.55 on groceries, $15.47 on supplies. Sales tax was $7.77 making the total bill $116.79.

Sometimes GnuCash feels like my diary.

I love this forum so much...you are my tribe...

+1!   Although now I'm feeling a bit inferior, because I round my daily spending records up and down to the nearest dollar haha . . .
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: dcheesi on December 08, 2022, 05:31:30 AM
[...] but I can't tell you what I spent on groceries on the 6th of July 2018.
I just checked and I actually went grocery shopping on July 6th, 2018. Spent $93.55 on groceries, $15.47 on supplies. Sales tax was $7.77 making the total bill $116.79.

Sometimes GnuCash feels like my diary.

I love this forum so much...you are my tribe...

+1!   Although now I'm feeling a bit inferior, because I round my daily spending records up and down to the nearest dollar haha . . .
Are you recording things by hand? I've always downloaded transactions from my banks, so it's easier not to round, or otherwise massage the numbers.

FWIW, I used to use spreadsheets like Gremlin's; I'd have a new one for each year, so in theory, if I could find the one from 2018 I could tell you the exact transactions. Nowadays I use GnuCash; it's frustratingly limited or awkward in some ways, but I'm much less likely to fool myself with a bad formula calculation, or summing the wrong group of cells...
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Trifle on December 08, 2022, 05:43:36 AM
[...] but I can't tell you what I spent on groceries on the 6th of July 2018.
I just checked and I actually went grocery shopping on July 6th, 2018. Spent $93.55 on groceries, $15.47 on supplies. Sales tax was $7.77 making the total bill $116.79.

Sometimes GnuCash feels like my diary.

I love this forum so much...you are my tribe...

+1!   Although now I'm feeling a bit inferior, because I round my daily spending records up and down to the nearest dollar haha . . .
Are you recording things by hand? I've always downloaded transactions from my banks, so it's easier not to round, or otherwise massage the numbers.

Yes, by hand.  I don't like how the bank info comes over; it doesn't work with the categories I like to keep
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: BuffaloStache on December 08, 2022, 09:38:35 AM
Jumping in here late (It's been a while since I caught up) to congratulate @fuzzy math . Well done and congrats! I second the suggestion to print out (or otherwise back-up) all of the emails and texts if you can.

Yes, by hand.  I don't like how the bank info comes over; it doesn't work with the categories I like to keep

I also have a custom excel spreadsheet that I enter info into by hand. I've also not found the bank-imported categories to leave a lot wanting, but also I use several different banks/credit cards to maximize rewards (Chase, CitiBank, CapitalOne, etc.) and they each seem to export slightly differently. If I had a lot more time I could write some macros to pull out the info from each organization I need and streamline recurring effort, but I haven't found the motivation for it yet. Plus, it took me several years to get the spreadsheet exactly how I like it, which I know is arbitrary but it's something. Finally, with a simple excel document I can back it up easily, and can open it on 90%+ of computers without installing separate software.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: NorCal on December 08, 2022, 12:20:29 PM
Jumping in here late (It's been a while since I caught up) to congratulate @fuzzy math . Well done and congrats! I second the suggestion to print out (or otherwise back-up) all of the emails and texts if you can.

Yes, by hand.  I don't like how the bank info comes over; it doesn't work with the categories I like to keep

I also have a custom excel spreadsheet that I enter info into by hand. I've also not found the bank-imported categories to leave a lot wanting, but also I use several different banks/credit cards to maximize rewards (Chase, CitiBank, CapitalOne, etc.) and they each seem to export slightly differently. If I had a lot more time I could write some macros to pull out the info from each organization I need and streamline recurring effort, but I haven't found the motivation for it yet. Plus, it took me several years to get the spreadsheet exactly how I like it, which I know is arbitrary but it's something. Finally, with a simple excel document I can back it up easily, and can open it on 90%+ of computers without installing separate software.

Take a look at https://www.tillerhq.com/ (https://www.tillerhq.com/).  It's a feed that pulls in financial data directly into Excel or Google Sheets in a standardized format.  I'm a spreadsheet person too, and it saves me a ton of work.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: elysianfields on December 08, 2022, 10:50:29 PM

Join your Trades' Union, folks, or your employee association, whatever it's called.  As a single person going up against a big organisation you haven't a hope, as part of a group with the same aims you've got a chance of evening up the score.

I cannot count the number of times that my union has intervened to keep management from doing really stupid things that would hurt not just my colleagues and me, but the institution as well.  I'm a lifetime member and it's been well worth it.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: alcon835 on December 09, 2022, 07:20:59 AM
We track our spending in a spreadsheet.  For the current month we itemise everything in one tab.  But then we keep a historical record by spending category by month in a different tab.  Ie, I can tell you that I spent $2.10 on groceries on the 4th of December, and I can tell you that I spent $842.65 on groceries in July 2018, but I can't tell you what I spent on groceries on the 6th of July 2018.

Anyway, we have been tracking our monthly spend by category for about 14 years and each month we populate an extra column in the spreadsheet.  This month we have reached column FU in the Excel spreadsheet.

I pointed out to Mrs G that that represented FU money.  She just rolled her eyes at me and walked off in disgust...

This here is the real FU money!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: lhamo on December 09, 2022, 08:43:11 AM
Jumping in here late (It's been a while since I caught up) to congratulate @fuzzy math . Well done and congrats! I second the suggestion to print out (or otherwise back-up) all of the emails and texts if you can.

Yes, by hand.  I don't like how the bank info comes over; it doesn't work with the categories I like to keep

I also have a custom excel spreadsheet that I enter info into by hand. I've also not found the bank-imported categories to leave a lot wanting, but also I use several different banks/credit cards to maximize rewards (Chase, CitiBank, CapitalOne, etc.) and they each seem to export slightly differently. If I had a lot more time I could write some macros to pull out the info from each organization I need and streamline recurring effort, but I haven't found the motivation for it yet. Plus, it took me several years to get the spreadsheet exactly how I like it, which I know is arbitrary but it's something. Finally, with a simple excel document I can back it up easily, and can open it on 90%+ of computers without installing separate software.

Take a look at https://www.tillerhq.com/ (https://www.tillerhq.com/).  It's a feed that pulls in financial data directly into Excel or Google Sheets in a standardized format.  I'm a spreadsheet person too, and it saves me a ton of work.

I still haven't bit the bullet and paid for Tiller, but might in 2023.  At least one of the founders is/was part of the MMM tribe -- met him at Camp Mustache 2016.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: RetiredAt63 on December 09, 2022, 09:47:05 AM

Join your Trades' Union, folks, or your employee association, whatever it's called.  As a single person going up against a big organisation you haven't a hope, as part of a group with the same aims you've got a chance of evening up the score.

I cannot count the number of times that my union has intervened to keep management from doing really stupid things that would hurt not just my colleagues and me, but the institution as well.  I'm a lifetime member and it's been well worth it.

I was a union member my whole working life.  My union brought so much value to my life*, even though I sometimes disagreed with its position.  I was a teacher - our union negotiated pay, workload (of course this massively affects the students), working conditions, leaves, health insurance, pensions, the whole bit.  When your employer is the provincial government you need all the leverage you can get.

* Before I started teaching (1975, so long ago) our union had negotiated maternity leaves.  This was long before provincial and federal maternity leave laws.  Before our union got that, a teacher who went on maternity leave had no guarantee her job would be there for her when she was ready to go back to work.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Sandi_k on December 09, 2022, 09:53:28 AM
* Before I started teaching (1975, so long ago) our union had negotiated maternity leaves.  This was long before provincial and federal maternity leave laws.  Before our union got that, a teacher who went on maternity leave had no guarantee her job would be there for her when she was ready to go back to work.

Before FMLA was created under Pres. Clinton and Labor Secretary Reich in 1993, NO ONE had a job for them waiting if they had to take time off for medical reasons. And women working as teachers and nurses were frequently fired when they began to show.

We haven't even had 30 years of FMLA protections yet - it wasn't all that long ago when this sort of sexism and discrimination was "baked into" the labor landscape.

(Mom was a nurse, aunts were teachers in those days).
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: partgypsy on December 09, 2022, 12:27:12 PM
Fuzzy Math -I have noticed many occasion where management is out of touch with clinical side, but this takes the cake. Way to go!

Afuera - Man you were going to kick but or chew bubble gum, but you were out of bubble gum.

Thank you for the engrossing and ultimately satisfying endings.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: RetiredAt63 on December 09, 2022, 01:14:57 PM
* Before I started teaching (1975, so long ago) our union had negotiated maternity leaves.  This was long before provincial and federal maternity leave laws.  Before our union got that, a teacher who went on maternity leave had no guarantee her job would be there for her when she was ready to go back to work.

Before FMLA was created under Pres. Clinton and Labor Secretary Reich in 1993, NO ONE had a job for them waiting if they had to take time off for medical reasons. And women working as teachers and nurses were frequently fired when they began to show.

We haven't even had 30 years of FMLA protections yet - it wasn't all that long ago when this sort of sexism and discrimination was "baked into" the labor landscape.

(Mom was a nurse, aunts were teachers in those days).

This was Quebec (see reference to provinces above).  Not sure when Canadian legislation came in.  But definitely after 1975.  Hmm, should also check to see when EI benefits covered mat leave.  American unemployment insurance covers mat leave?  I hope.

Edit - oops I was off a bit.  So federal in 1971 (22 years before the US), some provinces before that. 

https://canadianlabour.ca/who-we-are/history/maternity-parental-benefits/ (https://canadianlabour.ca/who-we-are/history/maternity-parental-benefits/)
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Zamboni on December 09, 2022, 07:20:21 PM
I spent $11.29 on groceries on July 6, 2018, lol.

Congrats on reaching FU Money!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Money Badger on December 09, 2022, 08:23:21 PM
@fuzzy math and @afuera,  Both epic examples of standing up for principles and priorities.  The common thread is poor leadership leads to business problems, then scared managers then stupid attempts to bully people into bailing them out for minor profits.   F-that.   
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: CurledMoss on December 10, 2022, 07:51:23 AM
Not epic. But I'm well established... I was working seasonal for mndot and I had enough of their childish covid daily pre screens and covid authoritarian rules. One day the boss (which is a good guy) said the pencil pushes have a new rule that we have to wear a mask now when we go into gas stations. I quit the next day. That was about 1 year ago.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Saffron on December 10, 2022, 12:33:24 PM
Not epic. But I'm well established... I was working seasonal for mndot and I had enough of their childish covid daily pre screens and covid authoritarian rules. One day the boss (which is a good guy) said the pencil pushes have a new rule that we have to wear a mask now when we go into gas stations. I quit the next day. That was about 1 year ago.

Cool story bro. You sure showed them with their perfectly reasonable requests during the worst respiratory pandemic in a century. /s

Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: RetiredAt63 on December 10, 2022, 01:08:38 PM
Not epic. But I'm well established... I was working seasonal for mndot and I had enough of their childish covid daily pre screens and covid authoritarian rules. One day the boss (which is a good guy) said the pencil pushes have a new rule that we have to wear a mask now when we go into gas stations. I quit the next day. That was about 1 year ago.

Cool story bro. You sure showed them with their perfectly reasonable requests during the worst respiratory pandemic in a century. /s

Now I'm wondering if Curled Moss was in Ottawa last February?   /s
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: BicycleB on December 10, 2022, 02:09:12 PM
Not epic. But I'm well established... I was working seasonal for mndot and I had enough of their childish covid daily pre screens and covid authoritarian rules. One day the boss (which is a good guy) said the pencil pushes have a new rule that we have to wear a mask now when we go into gas stations. I quit the next day. That was about 1 year ago.

Obviously not everyone agrees with your view of COVID rules, but congrats on being secure enough to pull trigger at the time of your choosing. I'd say that being able to do what you feel is right is epic.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Abundant life on December 10, 2022, 05:37:32 PM
Quote
Obviously not everyone agrees with your view of COVID rules, but congrats on being secure enough to pull trigger at the time of your choosing. I'd say that being able to do what you feel is right is epic.
Kudos to you BB - what a courteous and respectful response :)
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Zamboni on December 10, 2022, 08:29:07 PM
Having the financial security that you can leave a job for whatever reason, big or small, is an epic FU money story. You shouldn't stay at a job if you disagree strongly with what they are telling you to do. Congrats, CurledMoss!

Obviously the pandemic made people re-evaluate their employment situation for all kinds of reasons.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Shane on December 11, 2022, 06:38:37 AM
Not epic. But I'm well established... I was working seasonal for mndot and I had enough of their childish covid daily pre screens and covid authoritarian rules. One day the boss (which is a good guy) said the pencil pushes have a new rule that we have to wear a mask now when we go into gas stations. I quit the next day. That was about 1 year ago.

Cool story bro. You sure showed them with their perfectly reasonable requests during the worst respiratory pandemic in a century. /s

By December, 2021, everyone who wanted to be was already double, maybe triple, vaxxed. So, no, it wasn't "perfectly reasonable" for an employer to require workers to put on masks in order to pump gas. Most employees didn't have the ability to push back against unreasonable government mandates. Glad @CurledMoss had the means to tell those whiny fuckers, FU!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Saffron on December 11, 2022, 07:25:52 AM
Not epic. But I'm well established... I was working seasonal for mndot and I had enough of their childish covid daily pre screens and covid authoritarian rules. One day the boss (which is a good guy) said the pencil pushes have a new rule that we have to wear a mask now when we go into gas stations. I quit the next day. That was about 1 year ago.

Cool story bro. You sure showed them with their perfectly reasonable requests during the worst respiratory pandemic in a century. /s

By December, 2021, everyone who wanted to be was already double, maybe triple, vaxxed. So, no, it wasn't "perfectly reasonable" for an employer to require workers to put on masks in order to pump gas. Most employees didn't have the ability to push back against unreasonable government mandates. Glad @CurledMoss had the means to tell those whiny fuckers, FU!

Perhaps you don’t remember that December 2021 was the height of the Omicron wave? You know, the variant that started infecting people again despite vaccination status?

And when it’s characterized as  “just pumping gas” it sounds reasonable, but my bet is the the rule was “mask when interacting with others” because that’s what it was at my government org.

Edit: I’m all for using FU money to bypass workplace BS. But this case in my opinion is using FU money to justify personal unreasonableness.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Shane on December 11, 2022, 07:37:55 AM
Not epic. But I'm well established... I was working seasonal for mndot and I had enough of their childish covid daily pre screens and covid authoritarian rules. One day the boss (which is a good guy) said the pencil pushes have a new rule that we have to wear a mask now when we go into gas stations. I quit the next day. That was about 1 year ago.

Cool story bro. You sure showed them with their perfectly reasonable requests during the worst respiratory pandemic in a century. /s

By December, 2021, everyone who wanted to be was already double, maybe triple, vaxxed. So, no, it wasn't "perfectly reasonable" for an employer to require workers to put on masks in order to pump gas. Most employees didn't have the ability to push back against unreasonable government mandates. Glad @CurledMoss had the means to tell those whiny fuckers, FU!

Perhaps you don’t remember that December 2021 was the height of the Omicron wave? You know, the variant that started infecting people again despite vaccination status?

And when it’s characterized as  “just pumping gas” it sounds reasonable, but my bet is the the rule was “mask when interacting with others” because that’s what it was at my government org.

Perhaps you're the one not remembering that almost EVERYONE got sick from Omicron last winter. Friends who religiously wore masks everywhere, as well as people we know who never wore masks anywhere, almost all of them got sick from Omicron. In January 2022, at the peak of the Omicron surge, it was Restaurant Week in Center City Philadelphia. Every. single. night. we were out eating and drinking in jam-packed restaurants. It was hilarious watching the posers come in wearing their masks from the hostess stand to their tables. Then, they'd take their masks off, so they could eat, drink, talk, laugh, and have a great time, for an hour and a half, but be sure to put their masks back on, before they went back outside again.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: LennStar on December 11, 2022, 08:02:28 AM
That reminds me of the interviewed Ukrainian.

"No, we no longer go into the cellar when the air raid alert comes. It's two or three times a day! You can't be in the cellar all the time! Yes, my neighbor died last week, but all I got was scratch the arm."

Of ourse it was stupid going to a restaurant at that time. Still, if everyone wore their mask if possible (hard when you are eating after all), the risk to get infected there would be a lot lower.

In those cases I always wonder if it is the widespread inability of people to understand statistics/percentages/risk or simply "I don't care what happens, but I don't want to admit I am an egoistic asshole".
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: grantmeaname on December 11, 2022, 08:02:37 AM
the plural of 'anecdote' is not 'data'
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: RetiredAt63 on December 11, 2022, 08:36:40 AM
Not epic. But I'm well established... I was working seasonal for mndot and I had enough of their childish covid daily pre screens and covid authoritarian rules. One day the boss (which is a good guy) said the pencil pushes have a new rule that we have to wear a mask now when we go into gas stations. I quit the next day. That was about 1 year ago.

Cool story bro. You sure showed them with their perfectly reasonable requests during the worst respiratory pandemic in a century. /s

By December, 2021, everyone who wanted to be was already double, maybe triple, vaxxed. So, no, it wasn't "perfectly reasonable" for an employer to require workers to put on masks in order to pump gas. Most employees didn't have the ability to push back against unreasonable government mandates. Glad @CurledMoss had the means to tell those whiny fuckers, FU!

Perhaps you don’t remember that December 2021 was the height of the Omicron wave? You know, the variant that started infecting people again despite vaccination status?

And when it’s characterized as  “just pumping gas” it sounds reasonable, but my bet is the the rule was “mask when interacting with others” because that’s what it was at my government org.

Perhaps you're the one not remembering that almost EVERYONE got sick from Omicron last winter. Friends who religiously wore masks everywhere, as well as people we know who never wore masks anywhere, almost all of them got sick from Omicron. In January 2022, at the peak of the Omicron surge, it was Restaurant Week in Center City Philadelphia. Every. single. night. we were out eating and drinking in jam-packed restaurants. It was hilarious watching the posers come in wearing their masks from the hostess stand to their tables. Then, they'd take their masks off, so they could eat, drink, talk, laugh, and have a great time, for an hour and a half, but be sure to put their masks back on, before they went back outside again.

I still haven't had Covid.  But I wear my N95 mask 100% of the time I am in a building, I do not take it off at all, I don't eat in restaurants.  With more cases and particles lasting longer in cold air, and our nose's immune response being much less in cold air, I am now wearing my mask between the car and the building. 

I've read that roughly 15 minutes of exposure is the tipping point for infection.  Of course this is a rough estimate, since it doesn't account for how many viral particles are actually in the air.  But over an hour of exposure?  Hah.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: alcon835 on December 11, 2022, 10:33:29 AM
This is a truly fantastic conversation to have over in a different thread :)
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: SwordGuy on December 11, 2022, 11:25:23 AM
This is a truly fantastic conversation to have over in a different thread :)

They have FU money and don't have to care what you or I think.  :)

Which doesn't mean you aren't right...
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Shane on December 11, 2022, 11:58:59 AM
Not epic. But I'm well established... I was working seasonal for mndot and I had enough of their childish covid daily pre screens and covid authoritarian rules. One day the boss (which is a good guy) said the pencil pushes have a new rule that we have to wear a mask now when we go into gas stations. I quit the next day. That was about 1 year ago.

Cool story bro. You sure showed them with their perfectly reasonable requests during the worst respiratory pandemic in a century. /s

By December, 2021, everyone who wanted to be was already double, maybe triple, vaxxed. So, no, it wasn't "perfectly reasonable" for an employer to require workers to put on masks in order to pump gas. Most employees didn't have the ability to push back against unreasonable government mandates. Glad @CurledMoss had the means to tell those whiny fuckers, FU!

Perhaps you don’t remember that December 2021 was the height of the Omicron wave? You know, the variant that started infecting people again despite vaccination status?

And when it’s characterized as  “just pumping gas” it sounds reasonable, but my bet is the the rule was “mask when interacting with others” because that’s what it was at my government org.

Perhaps you're the one not remembering that almost EVERYONE got sick from Omicron last winter. Friends who religiously wore masks everywhere, as well as people we know who never wore masks anywhere, almost all of them got sick from Omicron. In January 2022, at the peak of the Omicron surge, it was Restaurant Week in Center City Philadelphia. Every. single. night. we were out eating and drinking in jam-packed restaurants. It was hilarious watching the posers come in wearing their masks from the hostess stand to their tables. Then, they'd take their masks off, so they could eat, drink, talk, laugh, and have a great time, for an hour and a half, but be sure to put their masks back on, before they went back outside again.

I still haven't had Covid.  But I wear my N95 mask 100% of the time I am in a building, I do not take it off at all, I don't eat in restaurants.  With more cases and particles lasting longer in cold air, and our nose's immune response being much less in cold air, I am now wearing my mask between the car and the building. 

I've read that roughly 15 minutes of exposure is the tipping point for infection.  Of course this is a rough estimate, since it doesn't account for how many viral particles are actually in the air.  But over an hour of exposure?  Hah.

At least you're being consistent. I totally respect mandates requiring employers and businesses to allow anyone who wants to, to mask up, wfh, or whatever, if they perceive themselves to be at high risk. The rest of us, who aren't high risk, should be allowed to live our lives as we feel comfortable, imho.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Captain FIRE on December 11, 2022, 02:16:49 PM
At least you're being consistent. I totally respect mandates requiring employers and businesses to allow anyone who wants to, to mask up, wfh, or whatever, if they perceive themselves to be at high risk. The rest of us, who aren't high risk, should be allowed to live our lives as we feel comfortable, imho.

*scratches head*
You are ok with a mandate to allow people to wear personal protective equipment that doesn't affect anyone else?
That's....I just don't even know how to describe it, it's such a mind boggling thing to say because it's so basic.

Should we pass a law that allows people to wear glasses if they want/need for health reasons?
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: ATtiny85 on December 11, 2022, 05:28:45 PM
the plural of 'anecdote' is not 'data'

I agree, but have seen it stated in our halls.

The plural of anecdote is data.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: grantmeaname on December 11, 2022, 05:56:41 PM
OMG amazing find
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: eyesonthehorizon on December 11, 2022, 06:49:09 PM
At least you're being consistent. I totally respect mandates requiring employers and businesses to allow anyone who wants to, to mask up, wfh, or whatever, if they perceive themselves to be at high risk. The rest of us, who aren't high risk, should be allowed to live our lives as we feel comfortable, imho.

*scratches head*
You are ok with a mandate to allow people to wear personal protective equipment that doesn't affect anyone else?
That's....I just don't even know how to describe it, it's such a mind boggling thing to say because it's so basic.

Should we pass a law that allows people to wear glasses if they want/need for health reasons?
This. Akin to saying "we should respect the rights of the concerned to drive sober if they perceive themselves to be at high risk of crashing." The risk to be considered is that posed to everyone in the public space, not just one given "driver." If you have no choice (economic or otherwise) but to be on the road with drivers who are each permitted to decide if sobriety is right for them, the fact that you can wear a seat belt to reduce your odds of death & the severity of your injuries (like a vaccine providing improved but less than sterilizing immunity) is a cold comfort.

For that same reason I want to give a little credit, because work from home was also included in the above suggested list - most societies haven't even come close; the Netherlands is the only place I've heard of introducing legislation to allow it when it's feasible for a given role. It'd be good for everyone to have the option: it would reduce road congestion & attendant aggravation, oil consumption from both redundant transport & pointless idling in traffic, parents passing along everything their kids pick up at school.

As nice & consistent a sentiment as it is, since it has not been made a priority, we're stuck with a system of de facto coercion of exposure to risk, regardless of awareness or perception of the level of risk. Any society requires a baseline of negotiation, but increased coercion on any group will always breed increased tension across the board. FI reduces the levers for coercion.

I do think it's a very good thing - for the individual & for society as a whole - that someone who doesn't see a point in masking in public during an uncontained respiratory pandemic could simply quit their job & remove themselves from a group who set a requirement to mask in public. There's no one who does not benefit from that state of affairs & the outcome. I frankly wish everyone society-wide could be given that power.

I exercised mine to insist on working from home. It is reprehensible that it took being FI to make that a viable option, however.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Captain FIRE on December 11, 2022, 08:06:11 PM
For that same reason I want to give a little credit, because work from home was also included in the above suggested list - most societies haven't even come close; the Netherlands is the only place I've heard of introducing legislation to allow it when it's feasible for a given role. It'd be good for everyone to have the option: it would reduce road congestion & attendant aggravation, oil consumption from both redundant transport & pointless idling in traffic, parents passing along everything their kids pick up at school.

[Snip]

I do think it's a very good thing - for the individual & for society as a whole - that someone who doesn't see a point in masking in public during an uncontained respiratory pandemic could simply quit their job & remove themselves from a group who set a requirement to mask in public. There's no one who does not benefit from that state of affairs & the outcome. I frankly wish everyone society-wide could be given that power.

I'm not sure if Shane meant individuals who want to WFH (in which case I agree with you) or companies who want to allow their people to WFH (which is how I thought he meant it, and I see as falling under the PPE/driving sober/wearing eyeglasses categories of "of course...").

Strong agree to your last point though.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: former player on December 12, 2022, 02:18:59 AM
For that same reason I want to give a little credit, because work from home was also included in the above suggested list - most societies haven't even come close; the Netherlands is the only place I've heard of introducing legislation to allow it when it's feasible for a given role. It'd be good for everyone to have the option: it would reduce road congestion & attendant aggravation, oil consumption from both redundant transport & pointless idling in traffic, parents passing along everything their kids pick up at school.

[Snip]

I do think it's a very good thing - for the individual & for society as a whole - that someone who doesn't see a point in masking in public during an uncontained respiratory pandemic could simply quit their job & remove themselves from a group who set a requirement to mask in public. There's no one who does not benefit from that state of affairs & the outcome. I frankly wish everyone society-wide could be given that power.

I'm not sure if Shane meant individuals who want to WFH (in which case I agree with you) or companies who want to allow their people to WFH (which is how I thought he meant it, and I see as falling under the PPE/driving sober/wearing eyeglasses categories of "of course...").

Strong agree to your last point though.
Shane may have had in mind the batshitcrazy proposals in some parts of the USA to pass laws which would have required schools and businesses to stop people from wearing masks.

Not sure if any of those proposals ever came into effect but proposals along those lines were certainly in the news.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Shane on December 12, 2022, 03:17:43 AM
Reasonable/unreasonable is subjective. Some employers think it's reasonable to require workers to come back to the office full time. Those with FU money get to choose whether or not they want to do that. Other employers think it's reasonable to require that employees wear masks while they're pumping gas. If you have FU money, it gives you the ability to tell an employer to fuck off if you feel like it.

As I said above, I support mandates requiring employers to respect employees' personal choices. If an employee doesn't feel comfortable working without a mask, employers shouldn't be allowed to fire him because of it. Conversely, if an employee doesn't want to wear a mask while pumping gas, the employer shouldn't be able to fire her for not wearing a mask. It works both ways.

A close relative underwent organ transplant surgery during the covid-19 pandemic. Even though most of his colleagues have already returned to working full-time in the office, relative's employer is respecting his choice to continue working from home, indefinitely, because he is at high risk.

Not all employers are reasonable, though. That's why I said I supported government mandates requiring that employers respect employees' choices to wfh(when possible), mask/not mask, etc. Anyone who doesn't think there are workplaces, all over the US, where workers are under intense pressure to NOT wear masks, you might want to step out of your privileged little bubble, once in a while. I promise you, there are many, many workplaces where you wouldn't last a week if you insisted on wearing a mask, and that's not right, imho.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: RWTL on December 12, 2022, 03:59:53 AM

As I said above, I support mandates requiring employers to respect employees' personal choices. If an employee doesn't feel comfortable working without a mask, employers shouldn't be allowed to fire him because of it.


Do you think doctors and nurses in the operating room should be able to choose whether they have to mask?   And why?
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Shane on December 12, 2022, 04:47:49 AM

As I said above, I support mandates requiring employers to respect employees' personal choices. If an employee doesn't feel comfortable working without a mask, employers shouldn't be allowed to fire him because of it.


Do you think doctors and nurses in the operating room should be able to choose whether they have to mask?   And why?

Of course surgeons should be required to wear masks while performing surgery. Should surgeons be required to wear masks while sitting at a desk, working on a laptop? No, of course not. The choice should be up to the individual.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: LennStar on December 12, 2022, 05:36:59 AM

As I said above, I support mandates requiring employers to respect employees' personal choices. If an employee doesn't feel comfortable working without a mask, employers shouldn't be allowed to fire him because of it.


Do you think doctors and nurses in the operating room should be able to choose whether they have to mask?   And why?

Of course surgeons should be required to wear masks while performing surgery. Should surgeons be required to wear masks while sitting at a desk, working on a laptop? No, of course not. The choice should be up to the individual.
Why?
What's your argument to say it's not ok to kill a patient on the table, but ok to kill him in the explanation 2 hours earlier?
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: ATtiny85 on December 12, 2022, 05:46:26 AM

As I said above, I support mandates requiring employers to respect employees' personal choices. If an employee doesn't feel comfortable working without a mask, employers shouldn't be allowed to fire him because of it.


Do you think doctors and nurses in the operating room should be able to choose whether they have to mask?   And why?

Of course surgeons should be required to wear masks while performing surgery. Should surgeons be required to wear masks while sitting at a desk, working on a laptop? No, of course not. The choice should be up to the individual.
Why?
What's your argument to say it's not ok to kill a patient on the table, but ok to kill him in the explanation 2 hours earlier?

I don't think employers require the wearing of PPE during surgery. I'd think that was part of some ToS for licensing? So the employer's requirement would be "don't fuck up and get us in trouble, follow the regulations." Similar to my manufacturing company having to abide by OSHA stuff.

Also, I added the underlining. The poster said sitting at a desk working on a laptop. That is not the same as a post-op visit. Plus, as mentioned, there is time dependency, and as anyone who has been cut on before, 15 seconds is closer to any post-op visit.

Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Shane on December 12, 2022, 05:49:37 AM
Before surgeons ever take a job, they know ahead of time that most employers will require that they wear masks while performing surgery. Construction workers also are aware before they even apply, that they will be required to wear a hard hat, while on active construction sites. They're both choosing to pursue those careers, knowing beforehand that they will be required to wear certain protective gear, while performing their professional duties. If a construction worker is sitting alone in the office, looking over some blueprints, and a pencil pusher comes down and tells her she needs to put on a mask because of some company 'policies,' if she's got FU money, she can tell the pencil pusher where to shove it. If not, she'll have to do what she's told or suffer the consequences. FU money gives us options that those without it don't have available to them.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: grantmeaname on December 12, 2022, 05:59:46 AM
Can we take the asinine mask bickering to the Off topic forum for those who want to see that?
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: By the River on December 12, 2022, 06:58:39 AM
Can we take the asinine mask bickering to the Off topic forum for those who want to see that?

Yes!  I feel like taking a rash action just to get this topic back on subject.  Let me think of something bothering me at work.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Captain FIRE on December 12, 2022, 09:14:58 AM
Can we take the asinine mask bickering to the Off topic forum for those who want to see that?

Yes!  I feel like taking a rash action just to get this topic back on subject.  Let me think of something bothering me at work.

I can take one for the team.  Hoping to give notice tomorrow once the background check clears and my boss is back in the office.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Turtle on December 12, 2022, 09:18:12 AM
Perhaps @fuzzy math has an update for us which would get this thread back on topic.

Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: eyesonthehorizon on December 12, 2022, 09:23:25 AM
I have one of those employers where they announced a company policy that those wishing to wear masks would be allowed to continue. (Every rule is a response to precedent: we had harassment directed at those using PPE.)

Not especially epic, but I used my FU position to indicate that despite our "generous policy accommodations" allowing masks, I would not be returning to in-person work (though there was an expectation we do so.)

No one should need to share medical information as to whether they are high risk or have FU money to insist on doing the exact same work remotely in this day & age. The employer gets another available desk, the risk of employees taking sick days or increasing the company's insurance premiums is decreased with fewer in-person carriers, there's one fewer car ahead of everyone at each stop sign & on the road burning gas in general.

But it took FU money for me to make that happen, which is the point. Everyone should have this sort of negotiation & veto power over the inertia of thoughtless precedent to improve the state of their lives & the world.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: mm1970 on December 12, 2022, 11:34:39 AM
Quote
Perhaps you're the one not remembering that almost EVERYONE got sick from Omicron last winter.
Sorry to add more fluff, but this is technically not true.  By April 2022, 60% of all Americans had been infected with COVID.  Calculating what percentage of that is Omicron...I dunno, but it's definitely not almost everyone...

(I got Omicron in July, as did my teen, and my DH and smaller child have still not had it.)
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Loren Ver on December 12, 2022, 03:32:06 PM
Good luck @Captain FIRE

Thank you for pushing as hard as you can to get us going back to the stories (see thread title)!

LV
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Wolfpack Mustachian on December 12, 2022, 04:08:48 PM
Can we take the asinine mask bickering to the Off topic forum for those who want to see that?

Yes!  I feel like taking a rash action just to get this topic back on subject.  Let me think of something bothering me at work.

If you did an Epic FU to just get us back on topic, that would probably top my list of Epic FU's ever :)
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: mm1970 on December 12, 2022, 05:03:20 PM
Can we take the asinine mask bickering to the Off topic forum for those who want to see that?

Yes!  I feel like taking a rash action just to get this topic back on subject.  Let me think of something bothering me at work.

If you did an Epic FU to just get us back on topic, that would probably top my list of Epic FU's ever :)
Is it an Epic FU to ignore recruiting emails that want to hire me at this great salary, which is a full >$40k less than I currently make?  Usually recruiting emails don't include salary.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: grantmeaname on December 12, 2022, 05:26:16 PM
Lol yeah. I got a recruiter email breathlessly quoting a salary that is less than 40% of what I make now. I kindly explained how far off base he was, and he hit me with "is there anyone in your network you'd recommend to me [now that you know I have terrible judgment and no idea what you do]?"
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: BicycleB on December 12, 2022, 05:27:41 PM
Lol yeah. I got a recruiter email breathlessly quoting a salary that is less than 40% of what I make now. I kindly explained how far off base he was, and he hit me with "is there anyone in your network you'd recommend to me [now that you know I have terrible judgment and no idea what you do]?"

lol
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: fuzzy math on December 12, 2022, 06:02:42 PM
Perhaps @fuzzy math has an update for us which would get this thread back on topic.

Things are still in flux but my 2 coworkers may not sign on with the contractor. And we found out that the one contract that our hospital covers elsewhere, their contract doesn't allow subcontractors. So my hospital is officially defaulting on that contract LOL. I have a feeling someone's going to get sued, maybe multiple people and this contractor might end up backing out.
Its going to be a nail biter until the bitter end. I'm at least able to laugh over the ridiculousness of it all.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: okits on December 12, 2022, 07:37:14 PM
Perhaps @fuzzy math has an update for us which would get this thread back on topic.

Things are still in flux but my 2 coworkers may not sign on with the contractor. And we found out that the one contract that our hospital covers elsewhere, their contract doesn't allow subcontractors. So my hospital is officially defaulting on that contract LOL. I have a feeling someone's going to get sued, maybe multiple people and this contractor might end up backing out.
Its going to be a nail biter until the bitter end. I'm at least able to laugh over the ridiculousness of it all.

This doubles as an "Epic F-Up" on management's part.  I hope it feels good to know this is not your problem.  Congratulations on extricating yourself!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Shane on December 13, 2022, 08:37:29 AM
I have one of those employers where they announced a company policy that those wishing to wear masks would be allowed to continue. (Every rule is a response to precedent: we had harassment directed at those using PPE.)

Not especially epic, but I used my FU position to indicate that despite our "generous policy accommodations" allowing masks, I would not be returning to in-person work (though there was an expectation we do so.)

No one should need to share medical information as to whether they are high risk or have FU money to insist on doing the exact same work remotely in this day & age. The employer gets another available desk, the risk of employees taking sick days or increasing the company's insurance premiums is decreased with fewer in-person carriers, there's one fewer car ahead of everyone at each stop sign & on the road burning gas in general.

But it took FU money for me to make that happen, which is the point. Everyone should have this sort of negotiation & veto power over the inertia of thoughtless precedent to improve the state of their lives & the world.

Totally agree. Since long before MMM, I always tried to save at least 50% of whatever I earned. Having significant savings has, multiple times, given me the confidence to push back against unreasonable employer demands. Workers shouldn't *have* to have FU money in order to be treated decently, but given that not all employers do the right thing voluntarily, and the US Department of Labor can't always be counted on to enforce workers' rights (usually because of budget cuts by GOP politicians), I can't imagine not at least trying to build up as much FU money as possible. Aside from the obvious benefit of more leverage when negotiating with employers, not having to borrow to pay totally predictable expenses, such as a new roof on the house or a new transmission in the family car, seems like another good reason everyone should save and invest as much as they possibly can.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Luke Warm on December 13, 2022, 10:10:54 AM
I have one of those employers where they announced a company policy that those wishing to wear masks would be allowed to continue. (Every rule is a response to precedent: we had harassment directed at those using PPE.)

Not especially epic, but I used my FU position to indicate that despite our "generous policy accommodations" allowing masks, I would not be returning to in-person work (though there was an expectation we do so.)

No one should need to share medical information as to whether they are high risk or have FU money to insist on doing the exact same work remotely in this day & age. The employer gets another available desk, the risk of employees taking sick days or increasing the company's insurance premiums is decreased with fewer in-person carriers, there's one fewer car ahead of everyone at each stop sign & on the road burning gas in general.

But it took FU money for me to make that happen, which is the point. Everyone should have this sort of negotiation & veto power over the inertia of thoughtless precedent to improve the state of their lives & the world.

Totally agree. Since long before MMM, I always tried to save at least 50% of whatever I earned. Having significant savings has, multiple times, given me the confidence to push back against unreasonable employer demands. Workers shouldn't *have* to have FU money in order to be treated decently, but given that not all employers do the right thing voluntarily, and the US Department of Labor can't always be counted on to enforce workers' rights (usually because of budget cuts by GOP politicians), I can't imagine not at least trying to build up as much FU money as possible. Aside from the obvious benefit of more leverage when negotiating with employers, not having to borrow to pay totally predictable expenses, such as a new roof on the house or a new transmission in the family car, seems like another good reason everyone should save and invest as much as they possibly can.

That's almost like having your own personal union. I like it.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Zamboni on December 15, 2022, 04:03:02 PM
Lol yeah. I got a recruiter email breathlessly quoting a salary that is less than 40% of what I make now. I kindly explained how far off base he was, and he hit me with "is there anyone in your network you'd recommend to me [now that you know I have terrible judgment and no idea what you do]?"

I've dealt with a couple of these. One was an email requesting that I send names for a ridiculously low salary in a government position where they wanted a researcher with a PhD, and I replied to let them know that even my teenage son wouldn't be willing to work for that salary.

The most outrageous one I've ever seen was an online posted ad by a University of California school last year seeking someone with a PhD to take a faculty position to teach with no pay. It said something absurd like "candidates must understand that this position has no salary or other compensation associated with it." I had previously interacted with the Chair of that department, so I wrote an email to let him know that he was violating several state labor laws (and I looked up and quoted the statutes.) He didn't reply, but the ad was removed shortly thereafter (I doubt I was the only person to send him what I thought.)
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: mm1970 on December 15, 2022, 04:56:36 PM
Quote
"candidates must understand that this position has no salary or other compensation associated with it."
holy shit!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: alcon835 on December 15, 2022, 05:26:40 PM
Lol yeah. I got a recruiter email breathlessly quoting a salary that is less than 40% of what I make now. I kindly explained how far off base he was, and he hit me with "is there anyone in your network you'd recommend to me [now that you know I have terrible judgment and no idea what you do]?"

This happens to me way too often! No, I am not going to recommend someone to you when you're lowballing and asking me about a role I'm clearly not a good fit for (spend 5 seconds on my LinkedIn!)
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Tempname23 on December 15, 2022, 05:37:22 PM
Quote
Perhaps you're the one not remembering that almost EVERYONE got sick from Omicron last winter.
Sorry to add more fluff, but this is technically not true.  By April 2022, 60% of all Americans had been infected with COVID.  Calculating what percentage of that is Omicron...I dunno, but it's definitely not almost everyone...

(I got Omicron in July, as did my teen, and my DH and smaller child have still not had it.)

 Where did you get that 60% number, I had no idea it was that high. If it is really that high we should have just for got about all restrictions, job losses, and economic slow down and just let the another 10% or 20% get it. I believe there would be a percentage of the population that would never get it.

Edit, I went looking for articles, the numbers are all over, here's one that bounces a lot.
https://www.webmd.com/lung/news/20220802/havent-had-covid-yet-wanna-bet
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Zamboni on December 15, 2022, 06:09:53 PM
I've been noticing that a bunch of retail stores in my area are having trouble keeping shelves stocked and arranged neatly. While there may be supply chain issues for some of it, I suspect that it has more to do with people not willing to work retail jobs for what they pay anymore.

All of these places are advertising that they are hiring boldly with large signage around the entrance and exit doors, and it's been like this for the last few years, but it has definitely gotten worse.

I guess more people have FU money than we think! Or working in retail is just that miserable . . . probably some of both.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: BicycleB on December 15, 2022, 09:26:02 PM
I've been noticing that a bunch of retail stores in my area are having trouble keeping shelves stocked and arranged neatly. While there may be supply chain issues for some of it, I suspect that it has more to do with people not willing to work retail jobs for what they pay anymore.

All of these places are advertising that they are hiring boldly with large signage around the entrance and exit doors, and it's been like this for the last few years, but it has definitely gotten worse.

I guess more people have FU money than we think! Or working in retail is just that miserable . . . probably some of both.

Maybe they're getting FU jobs.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Tempname23 on December 16, 2022, 06:29:05 AM
I've been noticing that a bunch of retail stores in my area are having trouble keeping shelves stocked and arranged neatly. While there may be supply chain issues for some of it, I suspect that it has more to do with people not willing to work retail jobs for what they pay anymore.

All of these places are advertising that they are hiring boldly with large signage around the entrance and exit doors, and it's been like this for the last few years, but it has definitely gotten worse.

I guess more people have FU money than we think! Or working in retail is just that miserable . . . probably some of both.

 My thinking, there has there is a large attitude shift regarding work, combined with government and parent money to aiding financial survival.
 A sad place to see this is, https://www.reddit.com/t/antiwork/
btw, I got kicked off because I didn't toe the line.
 Posting this is what got me kicked out.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Sibley on December 16, 2022, 07:51:35 AM
I've been noticing that a bunch of retail stores in my area are having trouble keeping shelves stocked and arranged neatly. While there may be supply chain issues for some of it, I suspect that it has more to do with people not willing to work retail jobs for what they pay anymore.

All of these places are advertising that they are hiring boldly with large signage around the entrance and exit doors, and it's been like this for the last few years, but it has definitely gotten worse.

I guess more people have FU money than we think! Or working in retail is just that miserable . . . probably some of both.

I've been asking cashiers how much the store pays. A year ago I was getting most answers around $10-12 per hour, now its more like $15 per hour. Which is an improvement, but not good enough. I also notice that the places that don't seem to be short staffed are generally the ones who are paying $18-20+ per hour.

I've also identified a couple stores that apparently have incompetent or abusive management.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: startingsmall on December 16, 2022, 08:37:35 AM
Quote
Perhaps you're the one not remembering that almost EVERYONE got sick from Omicron last winter.
Sorry to add more fluff, but this is technically not true.  By April 2022, 60% of all Americans had been infected with COVID.  Calculating what percentage of that is Omicron...I dunno, but it's definitely not almost everyone...

(I got Omicron in July, as did my teen, and my DH and smaller child have still not had it.)

 Where did you get that 60% number, I had no idea it was that high. If it is really that high we should have just for got about all restrictions, job losses, and economic slow down and just let the another 10% or 20% get it. I believe there would be a percentage of the population that would never get it.

Edit, I went looking for articles, the numbers are all over, here's one that bounces a lot.
https://www.webmd.com/lung/news/20220802/havent-had-covid-yet-wanna-bet

The goal was never to prevent all infections. Don't you remember "flatten the curve?" The goal was to spread infections out over a long enough time that our health care system could keep up with the infections, providing care for COVID and all of the other stuff that kept happening during COVID.

I agree that some people lost track of that goal and seemed to start thinking we could prevent/avoid all infections. The message from public health officials, however, was always that most of us would eventually contract COVID.... we just needed to let it burn through slowly instead of explosively.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: dcheesi on December 16, 2022, 09:31:26 AM
I've been noticing that a bunch of retail stores in my area are having trouble keeping shelves stocked and arranged neatly. While there may be supply chain issues for some of it, I suspect that it has more to do with people not willing to work retail jobs for what they pay anymore.

All of these places are advertising that they are hiring boldly with large signage around the entrance and exit doors, and it's been like this for the last few years, but it has definitely gotten worse.

I guess more people have FU money than we think! Or working in retail is just that miserable . . . probably some of both.

I've been asking cashiers how much the store pays. A year ago I was getting most answers around $10-12 per hour, now its more like $15 per hour. Which is an improvement, but not good enough. I also notice that the places that don't seem to be short staffed are generally the ones who are paying $18-20+ per hour.

I've also identified a couple stores that apparently have incompetent or abusive management.
I do feel like there's more of an FU attitude out there in general, regardless of whether folks have the money or not. Maybe part of it is that some people had to deal with lost or deferred income for months during the shutdown, and found out that they could survive it better than they expected?
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Dicey on December 16, 2022, 10:13:29 AM
I've been noticing that a bunch of retail stores in my area are having trouble keeping shelves stocked and arranged neatly. While there may be supply chain issues for some of it, I suspect that it has more to do with people not willing to work retail jobs for what they pay anymore.

All of these places are advertising that they are hiring boldly with large signage around the entrance and exit doors, and it's been like this for the last few years, but it has definitely gotten worse.

I guess more people have FU money than we think! Or working in retail is just that miserable . . . probably some of both.

I've been asking cashiers how much the store pays. A year ago I was getting most answers around $10-12 per hour, now its more like $15 per hour. Which is an improvement, but not good enough. I also notice that the places that don't seem to be short staffed are generally the ones who are paying $18-20+ per hour.

I've also identified a couple stores that apparently have incompetent or abusive management.
I do feel like there's more of an FU attitude out there in general, regardless of whether folks have the money or not. Maybe part of it is that some people had to deal with lost or deferred income for months during the shutdown, and found out that they could survive it better than they expected?
Ooh, that's an interesting idea.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: RyanAtTanagra on December 16, 2022, 10:42:10 AM
My thinking, there has there is a large attitude shift regarding work, combined with government and parent money to aiding financial survival.

People keep blaming too much unemployment/welfare for 'no one wants to work anymore', but I have yet to see any data on that.  Unemployment rate right now isn't even high, so where are all these people sitting around collecting all this government money?  Or maybe the ongoing retiring of the baby boomers is doing exactly what everyone new it always would and create a lot of unfilled jobs and the people in retail are able to move up as everyone else moves up to fill the gaps?
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: mm1970 on December 16, 2022, 10:48:26 AM
I've been noticing that a bunch of retail stores in my area are having trouble keeping shelves stocked and arranged neatly. While there may be supply chain issues for some of it, I suspect that it has more to do with people not willing to work retail jobs for what they pay anymore.

All of these places are advertising that they are hiring boldly with large signage around the entrance and exit doors, and it's been like this for the last few years, but it has definitely gotten worse.

I guess more people have FU money than we think! Or working in retail is just that miserable . . . probably some of both.
- A grocery checker here makes about $35k a year, but rent on a 1 BR apartment is $2900/month.  That math...doesn't work out.
- A friend's son works at the grocery store as a HS student, but you know, he's not paying rent.
- The few older people I know working at grocery stores inherited their homes.
- If the pay is so low that you have to commute an hour to afford an apartment, you might as well just get a job in the new city.

- At the very beginning of COVID, our dog sitter got a job at the local grocery store and the customers were SO horrible he quit after 4 months.

- The jobs are crap and people literally cannot afford to do them and live, partly because of a massive underbuilding of housing over the last 30 years or so.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: mm1970 on December 16, 2022, 10:50:52 AM
My thinking, there has there is a large attitude shift regarding work, combined with government and parent money to aiding financial survival.

People keep blaming too much unemployment/welfare for 'no one wants to work anymore', but I have yet to see any data on that.  Unemployment rate right now isn't even high, so where are all these people sitting around collecting all this government money?  Or maybe the ongoing retiring of the baby boomers is doing exactly what everyone new it always would and create a lot of unfilled jobs and the people in retail are able to move up as everyone else moves up to fill the gaps?
You haven't seen the data because there really isn't any.  It's just a boomer thing to say that "nobody wants to work anymore".
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Catbert on December 16, 2022, 11:05:01 AM
My thinking, there has there is a large attitude shift regarding work, combined with government and parent money to aiding financial survival.

People keep blaming too much unemployment/welfare for 'no one wants to work anymore', but I have yet to see any data on that.  Unemployment rate right now isn't even high, so where are all these people sitting around collecting all this government money?  Or maybe the ongoing retiring of the baby boomers is doing exactly what everyone new it always would and create a lot of unfilled jobs and the people in retail are able to move up as everyone else moves up to fill the gaps?

If you're talking about official unemployment statistics you have to be actively looking for work to be counted as "unemployed".  If you're retired, happy living in your mom's basement or given up looking because you can't find work you don't count as
"unemployed".
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Taran Wanderer on December 16, 2022, 11:15:56 AM
I run around in business circles with many senior executives, though my role is a little different.  It’s always fascinating to hear the emphasis on free markets and unfettered capitalism while also hearing the woe-is-me response about lack of labor. So many business models are built on the assumption of a plentiful, cheap supply of labor. When the supply isn’t there, or perhaps the labor is available but just not interested in working at the offered wage, the business leaders’ response is that “people just don’t want to work anymore”. Um, no, people don’t want to sell you what they have (labor) for the price you are offering (wage). That’s capitalism for you. Welcome to seeing that it works the other way around, too.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: zolotiyeruki on December 16, 2022, 01:52:47 PM
My thinking, there has there is a large attitude shift regarding work, combined with government and parent money to aiding financial survival.

People keep blaming too much unemployment/welfare for 'no one wants to work anymore', but I have yet to see any data on that.  Unemployment rate right now isn't even high, so where are all these people sitting around collecting all this government money?  Or maybe the ongoing retiring of the baby boomers is doing exactly what everyone new it always would and create a lot of unfilled jobs and the people in retail are able to move up as everyone else moves up to fill the gaps?
I came across an interesting tool today, which helps visualize various welfare benefits as a function of earned income.  It lets you drill down all the way down to the county level, and view how much a person can receive from each of many programs.  It's really interesting to play around with: https://emar-data-tools.shinyapps.io/prd_dashboard/ (https://emar-data-tools.shinyapps.io/prd_dashboard/)

One thing that strikes me, however:  I put in a 25-year-old single parent with two kids under 5, and based on the charts, it looks like the model assumes a $75k/year spend for such a family.  Curious, I poked around a bit more, and it looks like it assumes about $26k of expenses for a single person, $55k for a single person with one young child, and $106k (!) for the same single parent with three kids.  I don't know how the model sources those spending numbers, so I'd take those with a massive block of salt.
I run around in business circles with many senior executives, though my role is a little different.  It’s always fascinating to hear the emphasis on free markets and unfettered capitalism while also hearing the woe-is-me response about lack of labor. So many business models are built on the assumption of a plentiful, cheap supply of labor. When the supply isn’t there, or perhaps the labor is available but just not interested in working at the offered wage, the business leaders’ response is that “people just don’t want to work anymore”. Um, no, people don’t want to sell you what they have (labor) for the price you are offering (wage). That’s capitalism for you. Welcome to seeing that it works the other way around, too.
It goes beyond whether employees (or potential) employees will apply for a job and consistently come to work.  It's about performance, too.  In his experience, there is little correlation between an employee's compensation and their productivity.  Crudely stated, giving someone a raise doesn't impact their performance.  That said, rewarding more productive employees *does* improve retention.

Both sides have to keep in mind that there is competition.  For the low-skilled employee, it's not just competition with other employees.  The employer's money can also be spent on automation, or on re-engineering a product to require less labor to produce.  And the same goes for the employer--the employee's time could be alternatively spent going to school, or getting a more desirable job, or staying home and collecting various welfare benefits.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Sibley on December 16, 2022, 02:21:29 PM
I suspect there's a lot of people no longer in the job market which is causing a good amount of the pain. Far more than many are willing to admit. Retirements, death, disability, lack of child care, caretaking for the disabled.... COVID did a number on the workforce and the expected retirements of the Baby Boomers is only compounding it. Also, you have those suffering from the "diseases of despair" - those addicted to drugs or debilitated by depression are not likely to be holding down steady employment, and that's further decreasing the labor supply.

I've heard some people, usually those fitting particular stereotypes of Boomers and conservatives, crowing that the coming recession is going to force people get back to work. But I really don't think that's going to happen. Many of the people who aren't working right now have specifics reasons why they're not working, and a recession isn't going to change those reasons. Its going to take time to resolve a lot of this.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: kanga1622 on December 16, 2022, 03:08:06 PM
I've been noticing that a bunch of retail stores in my area are having trouble keeping shelves stocked and arranged neatly. While there may be supply chain issues for some of it, I suspect that it has more to do with people not willing to work retail jobs for what they pay anymore.

All of these places are advertising that they are hiring boldly with large signage around the entrance and exit doors, and it's been like this for the last few years, but it has definitely gotten worse.

I guess more people have FU money than we think! Or working in retail is just that miserable . . . probably some of both.

I've been asking cashiers how much the store pays. A year ago I was getting most answers around $10-12 per hour, now its more like $15 per hour. Which is an improvement, but not good enough. I also notice that the places that don't seem to be short staffed are generally the ones who are paying $18-20+ per hour.

I've also identified a couple stores that apparently have incompetent or abusive management.

My husband works with preschool aged children. He could make equal (or slightly higher) pay working at Walmart filling the pickup orders. Even more if he was willing to work as a Pharmacy Tech and our store will even send you to the training. Sad thing is that he's been with his same job for about 15 years... Some of the harder to fill parts of the store are advertising $19-21 per hour.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: TomTX on December 16, 2022, 04:41:17 PM
My thinking, there has there is a large attitude shift regarding work, combined with government and parent money to aiding financial survival.

People keep blaming too much unemployment/welfare for 'no one wants to work anymore', but I have yet to see any data on that.  Unemployment rate right now isn't even high, so where are all these people sitting around collecting all this government money?  Or maybe the ongoing retiring of the baby boomers is doing exactly what everyone new it always would and create a lot of unfilled jobs and the people in retail are able to move up as everyone else moves up to fill the gaps?
It's just a continuation of Reagan's lies fictional stories about "Welfare queens" which were entirely made up.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Sugaree on December 17, 2022, 06:01:24 AM
My thinking, there has there is a large attitude shift regarding work, combined with government and parent money to aiding financial survival.

People keep blaming too much unemployment/welfare for 'no one wants to work anymore', but I have yet to see any data on that.  Unemployment rate right now isn't even high, so where are all these people sitting around collecting all this government money?  Or maybe the ongoing retiring of the baby boomers is doing exactly what everyone new it always would and create a lot of unfilled jobs and the people in retail are able to move up as everyone else moves up to fill the gaps?
I came across an interesting tool today, which helps visualize various welfare benefits as a function of earned income.  It lets you drill down all the way down to the county level, and view how much a person can receive from each of many programs.  It's really interesting to play around with: https://emar-data-tools.shinyapps.io/prd_dashboard/ (https://emar-data-tools.shinyapps.io/prd_dashboard/)

One thing that strikes me, however:  I put in a 25-year-old single parent with two kids under 5, and based on the charts, it looks like the model assumes a $75k/year spend for such a family.  Curious, I poked around a bit more, and it looks like it assumes about $26k of expenses for a single person, $55k for a single person with one young child, and $106k (!) for the same single parent with three kids.  I don't know how the model sources those spending numbers, so I'd take those with a massive block of salt.
I run around in business circles with many senior executives, though my role is a little different.  It’s always fascinating to hear the emphasis on free markets and unfettered capitalism while also hearing the woe-is-me response about lack of labor. So many business models are built on the assumption of a plentiful, cheap supply of labor. When the supply isn’t there, or perhaps the labor is available but just not interested in working at the offered wage, the business leaders’ response is that “people just don’t want to work anymore”. Um, no, people don’t want to sell you what they have (labor) for the price you are offering (wage). That’s capitalism for you. Welcome to seeing that it works the other way around, too.
It goes beyond whether employees (or potential) employees will apply for a job and consistently come to work.  It's about performance, too.  In his experience, there is little correlation between an employee's compensation and their productivity.  Crudely stated, giving someone a raise doesn't impact their performance.  That said, rewarding more productive employees *does* improve retention.

Both sides have to keep in mind that there is competition.  For the low-skilled employee, it's not just competition with other employees.  The employer's money can also be spent on automation, or on re-engineering a product to require less labor to produce.  And the same goes for the employer--the employee's time could be alternatively spent going to school, or getting a more desirable job, or staying home and collecting various welfare benefits.

Honestly the numbers for what small kids cost seem about right.  A parent with three children who are not yet school age is  likely paying ~$5000/month just for childcare (assuming $1800/month/child, which is a steal in many places though about three times what I paid for my now-nine-year-old).  And the cost doesn't decrease as much as you think once they start school because of before/after-school care and summer care.  I was still paying about half the cost of full year care just to cover those times.  Thank goodness that the grandparents have stepped up to cover before and after school duty now.  Add in the cost of buying/renting a place with enough bedrooms and you're pretty close to that $106k. 
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Tempname23 on December 18, 2022, 07:42:55 AM
My thinking, there has there is a large attitude shift regarding work, combined with government and parent money to aiding financial survival.

People keep blaming too much unemployment/welfare for 'no one wants to work anymore', but I have yet to see any data on that.  Unemployment rate right now isn't even high, so where are all these people sitting around collecting all this government money?  Or maybe the ongoing retiring of the baby boomers is doing exactly what everyone new it always would and create a lot of unfilled jobs and the people in retail are able to move up as everyone else moves up to fill the gaps?

"Today over 7 million of these men of “prime working age” are neither working nor looking for work."
https://nypost.com/2022/11/02/disturbing-rise-of-the-nilfs-men-not-in-the-labor-force/
https://finance.yahoo.com/news/why-7-million-american-men-063039864.html
https://www.cbsnews.com/news/labor-force-why-have-so-many-american-men-left/
https://www.wsj.com/podcasts/opinion-free-expression/the-decline-of-men-in-the-workforce/b2e11b0d-5ec6-4652-a974-5a2ede320760
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: AccidentialMustache on December 18, 2022, 09:49:35 PM
Aren't all the men on this forum "of prime working age" trying to join that group?

The 2016 article isn't really supporting your point, being pre-covid. Nor do the articles talking about the nice steady rate this cohort is growing, which don't mention a blip related to covid and the stimulus checks (nor any blips for previous boom/bust cycles).
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: RyanAtTanagra on December 19, 2022, 10:50:50 AM
Yea I'm not sure what the point is.

"Half or more of the gap is due to men and women 55 and older (perhaps especially those over 65). Strangely, labor force participation rates for the 55-plus group remain lower now than in summer 2020, before the advent of COVID mRNA vaccines."

Yea, the pandemic made a bunch of people realize they could retire.  That's not surprising, and I don't get how that falls in with the 'no one wants to work anymore!' bandwagon.

"For a generation — from the mid-1990s until the eve of the pandemic — trends for older Americans were one of the few bright spots in the US employment picture."

So the boomer generation is retiring and causing exactly what everyone has known for decades would cause.

There's a lot on conflicting, nonsensical, and unsubstantiated causation claims (like saying everyone is retiring early because of the average $25k in covid benefits, which took them from broke to able to retire?), but my take-away is basically the above, which was my original point.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: zolotiyeruki on December 19, 2022, 12:14:22 PM
Several months ago, I saw a statistic that there are roughly 5-6 million fewer people in the workforce than pre-covid.  About a third of them were people who simply accelerated their retirement by a few years.  Assuming a 160-million-person workforce and an average 40-year career, you'd expect about 4 million people to retire each year and 4 million to join the workforce.  So, about six months' worth of retirees retired early.  That's a pretty substantial impact, and it'll take a few years to settle out.

I've also heard anecdotally that a lot of school teachers made an exit during COVID.  I can't imagine wanting to continue teaching if I were in the position many of them faced during that time...
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: SwordGuy on December 19, 2022, 01:39:57 PM
Several months ago, I saw a statistic that there are roughly 5-6 million fewer people in the workforce than pre-covid.  About a third of them were people who simply accelerated their retirement by a few years.  Assuming a 160-million-person workforce and an average 40-year career, you'd expect about 4 million people to retire each year and 4 million to join the workforce.  So, about six months' worth of retirees retired early.  That's a pretty substantial impact, and it'll take a few years to settle out.

I've also heard anecdotally that a lot of school teachers made an exit during COVID.  I can't imagine wanting to continue teaching if I were in the position many of them faced during that time...

1/2 of 4 million is 2 million, not 5-6.    I think you mean 18 month's worth of people retiring early, on top of the 4 million who normally leave and 4 million who normally enter.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: TomTX on December 19, 2022, 02:11:12 PM
There's a lot on conflicting, nonsensical, and unsubstantiated causation claims (like saying everyone is retiring early because of the average $25k in covid benefits, which took them from broke to able to retire?), but my take-away is basically the above, which was my original point.
$25k in COVID benefits as an average? I didn't see anywhere near that much, even at the family level.

Guess I should have participated in the PPP scam....
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: zolotiyeruki on December 19, 2022, 02:43:59 PM
Several months ago, I saw a statistic that there are roughly 5-6 million fewer people in the workforce than pre-covid.  About a third of them were people who simply accelerated their retirement by a few years.  Assuming a 160-million-person workforce and an average 40-year career, you'd expect about 4 million people to retire each year and 4 million to join the workforce.  So, about six months' worth of retirees retired early.  That's a pretty substantial impact, and it'll take a few years to settle out.

I've also heard anecdotally that a lot of school teachers made an exit during COVID.  I can't imagine wanting to continue teaching if I were in the position many of them faced during that time...

1/2 of 4 million is 2 million, not 5-6.    I think you mean 18 month's worth of people retiring early, on top of the 4 million who normally leave and 4 million who normally enter.
I think you may have missed my meaning.  The 5-6 million includes all demographics, while the unexpectedly-early retirees numbered 2 million.  So an extra six months' worth.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: SwordGuy on December 19, 2022, 04:49:30 PM
Several months ago, I saw a statistic that there are roughly 5-6 million fewer people in the workforce than pre-covid.  About a third of them were people who simply accelerated their retirement by a few years.  Assuming a 160-million-person workforce and an average 40-year career, you'd expect about 4 million people to retire each year and 4 million to join the workforce.  So, about six months' worth of retirees retired early.  That's a pretty substantial impact, and it'll take a few years to settle out.

I've also heard anecdotally that a lot of school teachers made an exit during COVID.  I can't imagine wanting to continue teaching if I were in the position many of them faced during that time...

1/2 of 4 million is 2 million, not 5-6.    I think you mean 18 month's worth of people retiring early, on top of the 4 million who normally leave and 4 million who normally enter.
I think you may have missed my meaning.  The 5-6 million includes all demographics, while the unexpectedly-early retirees numbered 2 million.  So an extra six months' worth.

If 4 million usually leave and 4 million usually enter, that's a net change of 0.

If we're 6 million down, that means an additional 6 million left, or 2 million left and 4 million didn't enter, so somewhere between those two.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: lhamo on December 19, 2022, 05:26:58 PM
BAM!

https://gizmodo.com/facebook-meta-vr-john-carmack-metaverse-oculus-1849909943

John, I'm guessing you are probably way to busy/efficient to be hanging out with the likes of us, but if you do happen to be lurking here thank you for such a great Epic FU story.  Anybody who walks out on Zuckerberg is a winner in my book....
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: zolotiyeruki on December 20, 2022, 04:35:58 AM
Several months ago, I saw a statistic that there are roughly 5-6 million fewer people in the workforce than pre-covid.  About a third of them were people who simply accelerated their retirement by a few years.  Assuming a 160-million-person workforce and an average 40-year career, you'd expect about 4 million people to retire each year and 4 million to join the workforce.  So, about six months' worth of retirees retired early.  That's a pretty substantial impact, and it'll take a few years to settle out.

I've also heard anecdotally that a lot of school teachers made an exit during COVID.  I can't imagine wanting to continue teaching if I were in the position many of them faced during that time...

1/2 of 4 million is 2 million, not 5-6.    I think you mean 18 month's worth of people retiring early, on top of the 4 million who normally leave and 4 million who normally enter.
I think you may have missed my meaning.  The 5-6 million includes all demographics, while the unexpectedly-early retirees numbered 2 million.  So an extra six months' worth.

If 4 million usually leave and 4 million usually enter, that's a net change of 0.

If we're 6 million down, that means an additional 6 million left, or 2 million left and 4 million didn't enter, so somewhere between those two.
Yes, the statistics are that we have 5-6 million fewer workers than we would expect to see.  Of those 5-6 million, 2 million are people who were close to retiring pre-covid, and chose to accelerate their retirement by a few years. The other 4 million were from younger demographics.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: NorCal on December 20, 2022, 08:13:11 AM
Several months ago, I saw a statistic that there are roughly 5-6 million fewer people in the workforce than pre-covid.  About a third of them were people who simply accelerated their retirement by a few years.  Assuming a 160-million-person workforce and an average 40-year career, you'd expect about 4 million people to retire each year and 4 million to join the workforce.  So, about six months' worth of retirees retired early.  That's a pretty substantial impact, and it'll take a few years to settle out.

I've also heard anecdotally that a lot of school teachers made an exit during COVID.  I can't imagine wanting to continue teaching if I were in the position many of them faced during that time...

1/2 of 4 million is 2 million, not 5-6.    I think you mean 18 month's worth of people retiring early, on top of the 4 million who normally leave and 4 million who normally enter.
I think you may have missed my meaning.  The 5-6 million includes all demographics, while the unexpectedly-early retirees numbered 2 million.  So an extra six months' worth.

If 4 million usually leave and 4 million usually enter, that's a net change of 0.

If we're 6 million down, that means an additional 6 million left, or 2 million left and 4 million didn't enter, so somewhere between those two.
Yes, the statistics are that we have 5-6 million fewer workers than we would expect to see.  Of those 5-6 million, 2 million are people who were close to retiring pre-covid, and chose to accelerate their retirement by a few years. The other 4 million were from younger demographics.

I'm part of this group as a stay-at-home parent.  And I'm too lazy to dig into the actual statistics, so I might be misstating what the statistics are saying.

My experience is anecdotal, but there's enough people out there in a similar situation that I'd expect it to at least partly explain the numbers.  There are a lot of parents that left work in Covid to be a stay-at-home parent when they might have otherwise stayed in the workforce.  While some of these parents are going back into the workforce, many are remaining full time parents.  While it is fewer people in the workforce, it isn't exactly someone being lazy at home collecting benefits.

Also (completely anecdotally), the SAHP's now seem much more likely to be men.  I wouldn't be surprised if this is messing with the statistical models, as the "expected" workforce was largely based on historical participation by gender.  At least this was true when I looked at these statistics many years ago.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: SmartyCat on December 20, 2022, 04:25:45 PM
BAM!

https://gizmodo.com/facebook-meta-vr-john-carmack-metaverse-oculus-1849909943

John, I'm guessing you are probably way to busy/efficient to be hanging out with the likes of us, but if you do happen to be lurking here thank you for such a great Epic FU story.  Anybody who walks out on Zuckerberg is a winner in my book....

Nice!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: alcon835 on December 25, 2022, 08:19:27 AM
BAM!

https://gizmodo.com/facebook-meta-vr-john-carmack-metaverse-oculus-1849909943

John, I'm guessing you are probably way to busy/efficient to be hanging out with the likes of us, but if you do happen to be lurking here thank you for such a great Epic FU story.  Anybody who walks out on Zuckerberg is a winner in my book....

Here is the full post on Facebook (https://www.facebook.com/permalink.php?story_fbid=pfbid0iPixEvPJQGzNa6t2x6HUL5TYqfmKGqSgfkBg6QaTyHF5frXQi7eLGxC7uPQv5U5jl&id=100006735798590) for anyone interested. It certainly isn't as "scorched earth" as the articles make it out to be, but it is 100% FU Money!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: okonumiyaki on December 27, 2022, 03:49:39 AM
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-64083802

Many UK over 50's have said FU, so much so that the govt is trying to get them back to work...
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: FrugalToque on December 27, 2022, 09:17:18 AM
[MOD NOTE:  I'm locking this thread for a few hours while everyone can read this post and see why:This is not a COVID thread.Please stop posting arguments about COVID immunity/masks/etc here unless it's applicable to FU money (somehow)
I'll unlock the thread in a little while, just so we don't have any stragglers all queued up with some harsh COVID EXPERTISE]
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: FrugalToque on December 27, 2022, 12:10:12 PM
The thread is unlocked.

Please stay on topic.

Thanks,
Toque.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Sibley on December 27, 2022, 05:07:56 PM
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-64083802

Many UK over 50's have said FU, so much so that the govt is trying to get them back to work...

The single person I know in the UK was forced into early retirement (pre-covid) because he couldn't find work that was full time, paid appropriately, and not a general hellhole to be in. This seems like expected consequences.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Zamboni on December 28, 2022, 10:45:06 AM
It will be interesting to see what kind of "solutions" the UK government comes up with to get those more experienced workers "out of" their early retirement and back into jobs. They could cut retirement benefits, of course, but then they might find themselves voted out of a job. Because old people vote.

I don't want to derail the thread, but allowing a bit more legal immigration of people who want to work is one pathway for curing a shortage of workers. Plenty of people seem to want to immigrate to Europe, and most of those people don't have FU money. Currently Australia goes this route with their system for earning citizenship aimed at immigration of younger people (of any skill level) and skilled workers in critical sectors. Aussies please feel welcome to chime in.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: NattyAnn on December 28, 2022, 11:28:59 AM
The following Monday, two weeks before my outage schedule was supposed to start, I gave my supervisor two weeks’ notice. My exact words were "I found a way to make it work". His face just dropped and I could tell he was pissed but he didn't really say much.  He had my job posted internally the next day, trying to get someone to fill the position before the outage.
...
Now, my work life balance is so much better, I'm closer to family, and I'm getting better compensation.  I just got an email a couple weeks back that they posted my old position externally and the salary range on indeed/glassdoor was about $30K less than I was making.  Yea, good luck with that.
...
In the end my FU money bought me the confidence to look for a new job even if the pay was lower and it bought me a glorious month off of work to focus on time with my babies/moving and I couldn't be happier.

Afuera, this might be the best FU money story I've ever read!! I'm so happy for you and your family. From one pumping working mom to another, congratulations!!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: zolotiyeruki on December 28, 2022, 11:35:45 AM
It will be interesting to see what kind of "solutions" the UK government comes up with to get those more experienced workers "out of" their early retirement and back into jobs. They could cut retirement benefits, of course, but then they might find themselves voted out of a job. Because old people vote.

I don't want to derail the thread, but allowing a bit more legal immigration of people who want to work is one pathway for curing a shortage of workers. Plenty of people seem to want to immigrate to Europe, and most of those people don't have FU money. Currently Australia goes this route with their system for earning citizenship aimed at immigration of younger people (of any skill level) and skilled workers in critical sectors. Aussies please feel welcome to chime in.
I think that first, you have to define the "problem" you're trying to solve.  "Fewer people are working" is not, in itself, a problem.  "Able-bodied people living on government benefits instead of working" can be a problem.  "Prices rising faster than wages" can definitely be a problem. "Retirees who can no longer work can't afford the cost of living increases" is a problem.  But "early retirees have to cut back on spending because prices are rising" isn't.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Alternatepriorities on December 28, 2022, 12:45:35 PM
It will be interesting to see what kind of "solutions" the UK government comes up with to get those more experienced workers "out of" their early retirement and back into jobs. They could cut retirement benefits, of course, but then they might find themselves voted out of a job. Because old people vote.

I don't want to derail the thread, but allowing a bit more legal immigration of people who want to work is one pathway for curing a shortage of workers. Plenty of people seem to want to immigrate to Europe, and most of those people don't have FU money. Currently Australia goes this route with their system for earning citizenship aimed at immigration of younger people (of any skill level) and skilled workers in critical sectors. Aussies please feel welcome to chime in.

Best as I can tell so far the answer is inflate the prices of consumer goods and deflate asset prices until people feel the need to go back to work. Which is where an FU mindset will come in handier than the money itself. Mustacians willing to cut back on their spending may be able to stay retired in cases where a people who just suddenly felt really rich after the last couple of years won't. It remains to be seen how that shakes out in my own life.

My recent less than epic tale but still import reason to have FU money: I lost my father two months ago and I'm so thankful I could make the time needed to deal with it without fear overdue bills. As difficult as it has been, it would been much worse without FU money or at least an emergency fund.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: BicycleB on December 28, 2022, 01:18:43 PM
It will be interesting to see what kind of "solutions" the UK government comes up with to get those more experienced workers "out of" their early retirement and back into jobs. They could cut retirement benefits, of course, but then they might find themselves voted out of a job. Because old people vote.

I don't want to derail the thread, but allowing a bit more legal immigration of people who want to work is one pathway for curing a shortage of workers. Plenty of people seem to want to immigrate to Europe, and most of those people don't have FU money. Currently Australia goes this route with their system for earning citizenship aimed at immigration of younger people (of any skill level) and skilled workers in critical sectors. Aussies please feel welcome to chime in.

Best as I can tell so far the answer is inflate the prices of consumer goods and deflate asset prices until people feel the need to go back to work. Which is where an FU mindset will come in handier than the money itself. Mustacians willing to cut back on their spending may be able to stay retired in cases where a people who just suddenly felt really rich after the last couple of years won't. It remains to be seen how that shakes out in my own life.

My recent less than epic tale but still import reason to have FU money: I lost my father two months ago and I'm so thankful I could make the time needed to deal with it without fear overdue bills. As difficult as it has been, it would been much worse without FU money or at least an emergency fund.

My condolences about your father's passing, @Alternatepriorities. Making time to deal with that sounds epic enough for me.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Alternatepriorities on December 28, 2022, 06:17:25 PM
It will be interesting to see what kind of "solutions" the UK government comes up with to get those more experienced workers "out of" their early retirement and back into jobs. They could cut retirement benefits, of course, but then they might find themselves voted out of a job. Because old people vote.

I don't want to derail the thread, but allowing a bit more legal immigration of people who want to work is one pathway for curing a shortage of workers. Plenty of people seem to want to immigrate to Europe, and most of those people don't have FU money. Currently Australia goes this route with their system for earning citizenship aimed at immigration of younger people (of any skill level) and skilled workers in critical sectors. Aussies please feel welcome to chime in.

Best as I can tell so far the answer is inflate the prices of consumer goods and deflate asset prices until people feel the need to go back to work. Which is where an FU mindset will come in handier than the money itself. Mustacians willing to cut back on their spending may be able to stay retired in cases where a people who just suddenly felt really rich after the last couple of years won't. It remains to be seen how that shakes out in my own life.

My recent less than epic tale but still import reason to have FU money: I lost my father two months ago and I'm so thankful I could make the time needed to deal with it without fear overdue bills. As difficult as it has been, it would been much worse without FU money or at least an emergency fund.

My condolences about your father's passing, @Alternatepriorities. Making time to deal with that sounds epic enough for me.

Thank you!

One slight irony is that I had just started a project that isn't really about the money and it's for my SIL, so falling behind on it makes her and my brother's life harder... So, I can't just quit and FU money wouldn't be helpful except that I've been able to share some of the work with another friend since I don't need the income.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: FireLane on December 30, 2022, 08:45:02 AM
To get this thread back on topic, here's a fitting story from Reddit:

https://www.reddit.com/r/BestofRedditorUpdates/comments/zyer7a/i_just_ragequit_my_job_of_5_years/

In 2021, the original poster worked at a toxic job. When COVID struck, the CEO refused to let anyone work from home. She only got to do it when she threatened to quit, and it was a huge quality-of-life improvement for her. Her stress dropped, her health improved and her productivity skyrocketed.

Then she was recruited for a full-time remote job at another company that came with a massive salary raise. She asked her current employer to match the offer, and this incredible conversation ensued:

Quote
Her: The CEO is willing to raise your salary, but first he wants to negotiate you coming back into the office.

Me: What? Doesn't he realize this other position is fully remote?

Her: Yes, but he says the company has been generous with working with you on being remote and now you will need a doctor's note to remain such.

Me: Generous!? There was a global pandemic! It wasn't some sort of favor to me, it was what the company HAD to do because of COVID-19. I'm glad they finally did it, but I had to beg because I was so scared I was going to kill my partner.

Her: Yes, but some people remained in the office this whole time--

Me: That's not my problem. They were not taking it seriously and there were no rules implemented by the company regarding masks, social distancing, etc. Them staying in the office made me realize I had to remain staying home because I knew they weren't being safe.

Her: That's why he says it's generous he has let you stay home for this long.

Me: I've also proven that I am more effective in a remote position. It has been a net positive for the company as a whole.

Her: I understand....

Me: I don't care if you give me a salary increase, this is about respect. I was on the fence about this new position but now I see that I have to take it. Consider this my official notice: I quit.

She took the new job, and her old employer is utterly unable to replace her. They've been pathetically begging her to come back, and she's laughed in their faces every time. Justice!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: LennStar on December 30, 2022, 09:05:48 AM
She took the new job, and her old employer is utterly unable to replace her. They've been pathetically begging her to come back, and she's laughed in their faces every time. Justice!
I hope she used the "I was reborn as the villain in an otome game" evil laugh. (If you don't know, it's like this 1:24 https://youtu.be/A2XvF5vzkM4?t=83 )
 
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: RWD on December 30, 2022, 09:25:10 AM
She took the new job, and her old employer is utterly unable to replace her. They've been pathetically begging her to come back, and she's laughed in their faces every time. Justice!
I hope she used the "I was reborn as the villain in an otome game" evil laugh. (If you don't know, it's like this 1:24 https://youtu.be/A2XvF5vzkM4?t=83 )
Hamefura, nice. It's amazing that "reborn as the villainess" has become its own subgenre.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: LennStar on December 30, 2022, 10:36:34 AM
She took the new job, and her old employer is utterly unable to replace her. They've been pathetically begging her to come back, and she's laughed in their faces every time. Justice!
I hope she used the "I was reborn as the villain in an otome game" evil laugh. (If you don't know, it's like this 1:24 https://youtu.be/A2XvF5vzkM4?t=83 )
Hamefura, nice. It's amazing that "reborn as the villainess" has become its own subgenre.
I wish there would be a story where the reborn is just a minor side character and has to somehow solve all the trouble and make everyone happy without getting killed themselves as "another girl found dead".

You need more than just FU money for this!!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: eyesonthehorizon on December 30, 2022, 11:56:50 PM
Good for her.

I almost feel sorry for the HR/ employer rep. A lot of times they're really just a meat shield parroting bullet points from management without much power or discretion to agree even if they know it's all crap, which can really erode your wellbeing. I hope they can get some FU money together too, because they're certainly not going to be treated better than the happy escapee was before her departure.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Zamboni on December 31, 2022, 07:05:47 AM
^My sympathy level for HR reps depend entirely on the individual. Yes, quite a few HR people are caught in that terrible bind. On the other hand, unfortunately several others appear to just have no soul.

She took the new job, and her old employer is utterly unable to replace her. They've been pathetically begging her to come back, and she's laughed in their faces every time. Justice!

Good for her! Loved the follow up villainess laugh.

Yeah, that's the problem with the "everyone is expendable" attitude that I see in some management.

Sometimes someone leaves and their replacement is just as competent or perhaps even better.

But other times someone leaves and all the balls just fall on the floor, management is clueless because they didn't even know how important that person was to their critical operation, and it is becomes a shit show for everyone who is left behind for months if not years.

I've definitely seen that second case happen many times.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: PathtoFIRE on January 03, 2023, 10:42:06 AM
BAM!

https://gizmodo.com/facebook-meta-vr-john-carmack-metaverse-oculus-1849909943

John, I'm guessing you are probably way to busy/efficient to be hanging out with the likes of us, but if you do happen to be lurking here thank you for such a great Epic FU story.  Anybody who walks out on Zuckerberg is a winner in my book....

He lives in my old neighborhood, I would frequently see him walking his kid to school. Didn't know him personally, but it doesn't surprise me that he's got his priorities straight.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: mm1970 on January 03, 2023, 12:32:55 PM
She took the new job, and her old employer is utterly unable to replace her. They've been pathetically begging her to come back, and she's laughed in their faces every time. Justice!
I hope she used the "I was reborn as the villain in an otome game" evil laugh. (If you don't know, it's like this 1:24 https://youtu.be/A2XvF5vzkM4?t=83 )
OMG the followup has been CRAZY
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Alternatepriorities on January 30, 2023, 04:56:08 PM
Well I might have a new contribution in a few days...

I just sent the following proposed response to DW after she shared the contract her district offered this year. She likes her work a lot so she might not pass it on but she isn't going to accept the contract as is either...


Dr. JJ,

I've reviewed the admin contract offered to (DH) on Jan 30th 2023. It appears SD is offering her a pay CUT of approximately 6 percent after adjusting for national inflation in 2022 or 16 percent accounting for local inflation. I understand similar offers have been given to other SD administrative staff. This suggests two possibilities, either SD thinks so poorly of their administrators as to assume they won't do basic arithmetic or the district's finances are in truly dire conditions despite record enrollment the last couple of years. Reducing the contract review time from the traditional month to a single week suggests it's the former, but I'll generously assume it is the second and propose a possible solution. DW will resign and the district will have those funds to provide additional raises for the remaining administrators.

Alternate Priorities
- (DW)'s financial advisor, husband, and future partner in geographic arbitrage.

ETA: It's not really about the money at this point as we're able to FIRE at a median income level. It's mostly about the way they've jerked the staff around on this the past two years. The reduction in contract review time this year from one month to "five days or resign" is especially galling and just feels wrong to me.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: EliteZags on January 30, 2023, 05:27:10 PM
I had in my mind the wrong definition of "FU money" cause what came to my mind was my buddy that's CEO in debt consolidation moving his 70ft yacht from Newport Beach where he owns a $19M Newport Coast mansion to his $25M waterfront Venetian Islands Miami mansion, only to pay several thousand a month to dock it away from his house and pay for a captain to bring it to his house slip whenever he wants to use it instead of just docking it there regularly- just so there's less obstruction to his water view 
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Alternatepriorities on January 30, 2023, 05:44:12 PM
I had in my mind the wrong definition of "FU money" cause what came to my mind was my buddy that's CEO in debt consolidation moving his 70ft yacht from Newport Beach where he owns a $19M Newport Coast mansion to his $25M waterfront Venetian Islands Miami mansion, only to pay several thousand a month to dock it away from his house and pay for a captain to bring it to his house slip whenever he wants to use it instead of just docking it there regularly- just so there's less obstruction to his water view

That's an entirely different world than mine...

Maybe we need a thread for "F them" money stories... Something to mock that amount of shear waste just for the flexing of status.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: BicycleB on January 30, 2023, 06:16:44 PM
I had in my mind the wrong definition of "FU money" cause what came to my mind was my buddy that's CEO in debt consolidation moving his 70ft yacht from Newport Beach where he owns a $19M Newport Coast mansion to his $25M waterfront Venetian Islands Miami mansion, only to pay several thousand a month to dock it away from his house and pay for a captain to bring it to his house slip whenever he wants to use it instead of just docking it there regularly- just so there's less obstruction to his water view

That's an entirely different world than mine...

Maybe we need a thread for "F them" money stories... Something to mock that amount of shear waste just for the flexing of status.

lol, that level of wealth does introduce a possible different meaning of FU money!

***

In my innocent mind, maybe they really do want to see the view. But hey, they know @EliteZags. Maybe soon they'll begin their own move towards Mustachianism by, uh, just selling the boat. :)

Good luck in any secret campaign of Mustache influence you may take, Zags!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: TomTX on January 30, 2023, 06:39:17 PM
I had in my mind the wrong definition of "FU money" cause what came to my mind was my buddy that's CEO in debt consolidation moving his 70ft yacht from Newport Beach where he owns a $19M Newport Coast mansion to his $25M waterfront Venetian Islands Miami mansion, only to pay several thousand a month to dock it away from his house and pay for a captain to bring it to his house slip whenever he wants to use it instead of just docking it there regularly- just so there's less obstruction to his water view
That's a pretty insane level of hedonic adaptation.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: EliteZags on January 30, 2023, 10:52:26 PM
Oh and here's a pic of casually giving his buddy Steve Aoki a cross country ride to a Miami show in his G4

(https://i.postimg.cc/SsMthZfx/Screenshot-20230130-215729-Gallery.jpg)
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Turtle on January 31, 2023, 07:06:29 AM
Well I might have a new contribution in a few days...

I just sent the following proposed response to DW after she shared the contract her district offered this year. She likes her work a lot so she might not pass it on but she isn't going to accept the contract as is either...


Dr. JJ,

I've reviewed the admin contract offered to (DH) on Jan 30th 2023. It appears SD is offering her a pay CUT of approximately 6 percent after adjusting for national inflation in 2022 or 16 percent accounting for local inflation. I understand similar offers have been given to other SD administrative staff. This suggests two possibilities, either SD thinks so poorly of their administrators as to assume they won't do basic arithmetic or the district's finances are in truly dire conditions despite record enrollment the last couple of years. Reducing the contract review time from the traditional month to a single week suggests it's the former, but I'll generously assume it is the second and propose a possible solution. DW will resign and the district will have those funds to provide additional raises for the remaining administrators.

Alternate Priorities
- (DW)'s financial advisor, husband, and future partner in geographic arbitrage.

ETA: It's not really about the money at this point as we're able to FIRE at a median income level. It's mostly about the way they've jerked the staff around on this the past two years. The reduction in contract review time this year from one month to "five days or resign" is especially galling and just feels wrong to me.

Please keep us posted.  I'm glad she's in a position to push back about it, regardless of which form that push back takes.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: StPatrick on January 31, 2023, 09:34:46 AM
My FU Money story in Tech
There is often such a culture in corporate settings where you cannot create any form of conflict. Even if the conflict is a byproduct of good innovation. Corporate culture exists to create small improvements (like a 3% raise! lol.) but never meaningful improvement. So when someone oversteps that unwritten rule, the powers that be absolutely punish outliers.


Me: The product feature automatically collects meaningful data for the client, so that there isn't any manual data input. It's the needed innovation the company is asking for.
New Product Owner 1: We need to remove this feature because it's an extra step.
Me: If you remove this feature, you do not have a marketable product.
Product Owner 2: Let's remove it because it'll take longer to build.
Me: There is nothing else to build. This is the main architecture of the product.
Product Owners: ...
Me: You're going to need to find a new architect to build this for you, because you don't know what you are doing. (of course I said that in a firm tone! Which is a big corporate no-no)

My boss called me, and said "We are going to have to write you up."
Me: I don't think you should do that. Here's why. ↑
At this point HR got involved and without asking me my side of the story, I was given an Indefinite Warning as I was "Not able to fulfill my duties."

If I didn't sign it within 48 hours, I would be terminated. So I signed it, and the next day, Friday, I turned in my two weeks without anything lined up.
My boss called me and asked repeatedly over the two weeks for me to stay, trying to find some way to make this situation work. "The product won't be able to work without your understanding of the data."

I guess tell HR that.

I love FIRE. It exists because it creates power for those who know their value. If you're good at your job, and at FIRE, you just believe you are really free. And you really are.






Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Frugal Lizard on January 31, 2023, 09:42:07 AM
@StPatrick - brilliant. Way to go.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: charis on January 31, 2023, 10:34:37 AM
@StPatrick - brilliant. Way to go.

Agreed.  So they threatened you with termination as a bullying tactic without any desire or intention to terminate you?  Talk about shooting themselves in the foot.   I probably would have recommended taking the termination and collecting unemployment pay.

Are you fully FI or just flush with FU $?
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Must_ache on January 31, 2023, 10:54:39 AM
My boss called me and asked repeatedly over the two weeks for me to stay, trying to find some way to make this situation work. "The product won't be able to work without your understanding of the data."

I think you missed a big change to negotiate a raise first.  That would have been the ultimate revenge - one day the company tries to fire you, a week later they give you more money.  It probably wouldn't have worked but holding FU money I would have stayed there to enjoy it had it actually been able to play out (doubtful) 
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Alternatepriorities on January 31, 2023, 11:20:29 AM
Well I might have a new contribution in a few days...

I just sent the following proposed response to DW after she shared the contract her district offered this year. She likes her work a lot so she might not pass it on but she isn't going to accept the contract as is either...


Dr. JJ,

I've reviewed the admin contract offered to (DH) on Jan 30th 2023. It appears SD is offering her a pay CUT of approximately 6 percent after adjusting for national inflation in 2022 or 16 percent accounting for local inflation. I understand similar offers have been given to other SD administrative staff. This suggests two possibilities, either SD thinks so poorly of their administrators as to assume they won't do basic arithmetic or the district's finances are in truly dire conditions despite record enrollment the last couple of years. Reducing the contract review time from the traditional month to a single week suggests it's the former, but I'll generously assume it is the second and propose a possible solution. DW will resign and the district will have those funds to provide additional raises for the remaining administrators.

Alternate Priorities
- (DW)'s financial advisor, husband, and future partner in geographic arbitrage.

ETA: It's not really about the money at this point as we're able to FIRE at a median income level. It's mostly about the way they've jerked the staff around on this the past two years. The reduction in contract review time this year from one month to "five days or resign" is especially galling and just feels wrong to me.

Please keep us posted.  I'm glad she's in a position to push back about it, regardless of which form that push back takes.

Hoping to know the outcome of her pushing back by the end of the week. We sat down last night and ran all the numbers together and it's not only an inflation adjusted pay cut, it also works out to about $4/hr less than she would make if she had stayed a teacher instead of taking on the additional responsibilities and stress of being an administrator. The contract is for more hours so the total pay is more, but the actual hourly rate is significantly less! That was another on of the things they promised to fix during contract negotiations last year, but since the teachers got a raise that matched inflation and admin didn't it actually got worse.

DW would be just as happy with more time, so if they won't be serious about pay, she's going to propose cutting the number of contract days to make up for it. We also decided that whole she won't use my letter, she will to resign if necessary to get them to treat the rest of the admin staff better.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: StPatrick on January 31, 2023, 12:24:00 PM
@StPatrick - brilliant. Way to go.

Agreed.  So they threatened you with termination as a bullying tactic without any desire or intention to terminate you?  Talk about shooting themselves in the foot.   I probably would have recommended taking the termination and collecting unemployment pay.

Are you fully FI or just flush with FU $?


Good question. I guess I'm in this odd spot in my early 40s where my net worth is fully FI, but I want to FIRE with my real estate cashflow. Those amounts are only 50% to FIRE.  I don't want to depend on the brokerage or my rental equity for retiring early, I'd rather pass that on to my kids and their kids. It's slightly puzzling with young kids how to forecast some college expenses for them. So I'm putting up with the tech industry for at least 3 more years. lol.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: gooki on February 01, 2023, 09:28:27 PM
Quote
she will to resign if necessary to get them to treat the rest of the admin staff better.

Big props to your wife. What a great attitude.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: gooki on February 01, 2023, 09:30:57 PM
Quote
If I didn't sign it within 48 hours, I would be terminated. So I signed it, and the next day, Friday, I turned in my two weeks without anything lined up.
My boss called me and asked repeatedly over the two weeks for me to stay, trying to find some way to make this situation work. "The product won't be able to work without your understanding of the data."

I guess tell HR that.

Fucking badass dude. I can't believe so many people in your company were so stupid.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: LightTripper on February 02, 2023, 03:28:41 AM
Great story @StPatrick and looking forward to hearing the outcome from your DW @Alternatepriorities - sounds like they just don't know what they are doing and are trying to save money at the expense of staff - but great that your DW is willing and able to stand up against it! 
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Zamboni on February 02, 2023, 05:39:49 AM
Dr. JJ,

I've reviewed the admin contract offered to (DH) on Jan 30th 2023. It appears SD is offering her a pay CUT of approximately 6 percent after adjusting for national inflation in 2022 or 16 percent accounting for local inflation. I understand similar offers have been given to other SD administrative staff. This suggests two possibilities, either SD thinks so poorly of their administrators as to assume they won't do basic arithmetic or the district's finances are in truly dire conditions despite record enrollment the last couple of years. Reducing the contract review time from the traditional month to a single week suggests it's the former, but I'll generously assume it is the second and propose a possible solution. DW will resign and the district will have those funds to provide additional raises for the remaining administrators.

Alternate Priorities
- (DW)'s financial advisor, husband, and future partner in geographic arbitrage.

ETA: It's not really about the money at this point as we're able to FIRE at a median income level. It's mostly about the way they've jerked the staff around on this the past two years. The reduction in contract review time this year from one month to "five days or resign" is especially galling and just feels wrong to me.

I like the way you phrased things, and I may be back to filch your wording when I eventually quit. It will be at the "last minute", of course, because they never send me "the raise" letter or the new contract until the last minute.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: alcon835 on February 02, 2023, 11:23:59 AM
when I eventually quit. It will be at the "last minute", of course, because they never send me "the raise" letter or the new contract until the last minute.

This is something I always have to push back on. They drag their feet for months at times, and then want a turn around in a day or two. I always push back and I always win.

"Sorry, you had how many months and how many people to put this together? I'm going to need more than 48 hours to consider whether I want to sign this agreement or negotiate from here and you're just going to have to wait."
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Alternatepriorities on February 02, 2023, 11:46:49 AM
Minor saga update:

DW did not use my letter, but did write her own, about a page long, detailing the history of promises and explaining exactly how foolish it was for the district to assume a former math teacher would not do math... I don't think it could be sanitized enough for a public post without losing some of it's splendor... It seems to have been reasonably well received. She's supposed to have a phone call with super this afternoon which I will actually be quietly present for because I'll be driving with DW at the time.

We also had a completely bonkers life twist unrelated to work on Tuesday night that would drastically alter everything we accept. It's not related to having FU money, but it would drastically change the math for DW's work schedule next year. Like she could take off 1/2 the days of her contract next year for the same salary. At which point it seems foolish to resign... So tonight we have an even bigger decision to make before we really think about the contract. The next 24 hours should be interesting.

@Zamboni - Feel free to use as much of the phrasing as you'd like.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Zamboni on February 02, 2023, 09:37:13 PM
^I'm probably not thinking of some obvious alternative, but I can think of one circumstance that would make this true. Congratulations!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Dicey on February 03, 2023, 07:45:53 AM
^I'm probably not thinking of some obvious alternative, but I can think of one circumstance that would make this true. Congratulations!
Ooh! Can't wait for the next installment.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: zolotiyeruki on February 03, 2023, 07:58:52 AM
^I'm probably not thinking of some obvious alternative, but I can think of one circumstance that would make this true. Congratulations!
Ooh! Can't wait for the next installment.
Me too!  And I still would love to see the text of the email/letter they sent.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Alternatepriorities on February 03, 2023, 10:54:57 AM
Well this has been a crazy week!

The bad news is we won't be going on a year long vagabonding trip this year... The program director and super agree that DW should work less days next year to make her contract fair. The super has also asked her to help design the new admin contracts next year. He's new to the district this past year and apparently really appreciated the way DW explained the problems in her contract. Changing them this year requires going back to the board of directors which means a lot of egg on a lot of people faces. The assistant super who has been a source of much stinginess is leaving this school year which gives me some home the negotiations will actually be in good faith next year.

But the the biggest change since I posted is that we've been asked to adopt a baby! Adopting is something we were considering but not actively pursuing when a friend of a friend reached out in December. By mid January it looked like it probably wasn't going to happen but that changed this week. Last night we met with the family for the first time and while I it is far from certain to happen, we're going to move forward with the process. While adoption is more affordable when the mother chooses you before giving birth it's still going to take real money to make it happen. Doesn't seem like FU money is a appropriate term, but I am thankful to know I can "figure out the money" if everything else works out.

With a decade of accrued unused sick leave, DW could take paid leave for half the year if the adoption goes through. If it doesn't, at least she still likes the work she is doing and the reduced time contract is no longer a total farce, so it looks like were here for at least OMY. If the adoption goes through and the contract negotiations don't go anywhere maybe in a year we'll be planning to slow travel North America with a toddler...
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Laura33 on February 03, 2023, 11:11:28 AM
Wow @Alternatepriorities -- congratulations on all fronts!!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: BicycleB on February 03, 2023, 12:01:09 PM
@Alternatepriorities, well done. So happy for you all! Best wishes for the entire new family.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: bluebelle on February 03, 2023, 12:13:24 PM
I chronicled my long drawn out FU story in my journal, but TL;DR:
I tried to go off on short term disability in late 2020 due to severe pain in my neck and mid back.  STD is company funded but adjudicated by an 'impartial third party', the insurance company paid by the employer and that would be on the hook if STD turned into LTD in 6 months (hence the air quotes around impartial).....ins company rejected my leave, and appeals, basically, I was working in significant pain and should continue to do so....because I had FU money, I stayed off on unpaid leave will I continued to look for pain relief and waited for the law suit.....US based HR fired me at the 5 month mark with NO SERVERENCE, not even mandated by Canadian employment law.  Queue two lawyers, employment and disability lawyer.   Finally settled almost two years later.....What makes this epic FU?   If the company and insurance company had worked with me to try and find solutions, I would have come back to work, found it didn't work, still in pain etc, and I would have quietly retired.....instead, they're paid out a shit ton of legal fees and a few years worth of pay.   
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Dicey on February 03, 2023, 01:17:41 PM
Not going to invite trouble by saying too much too soon,  but sending good thoughts your way, @Alternatepriorities .

And congratulations, @bluebelle. I hope by now your pain has lessened.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Fru-Gal on February 03, 2023, 01:45:39 PM
Good for you, @bluebelle, they count on most of us not having the patience to stick through all that. Impressive and I too hope your pain is lessened.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: bluebelle on February 03, 2023, 02:14:17 PM
Good for you, @bluebelle, they count on most of us not having the patience to stick through all that. Impressive and I too hope your pain is lessened.
my pain has lessened for a few reasons, not on a keyboard for WAY too many hours a day, every day, found physio and chiro that actually worked for me, found ways to do things that lessen the pain flair ups, and I go lay on a foam roller or stretch when I need to.   Folding laundry still sucks, working at the kitchen sink or counter.....anything with my head down and my arms out in front of me.....
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: shadesofgreen on February 07, 2023, 10:04:09 AM
@Alternatepriorities - Sending you best wishes! What a happy, crazy, exciting and terrifying time for you and your DW.

@bluebelle - Really hoping your pain gets better with good physio and a non sucky job to deal with. 
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: scottish on February 07, 2023, 05:19:26 PM
Good for you, @bluebelle, they count on most of us not having the patience to stick through all that. Impressive and I too hope your pain is lessened.
my pain has lessened for a few reasons, not on a keyboard for WAY too many hours a day, every day, found physio and chiro that actually worked for me, found ways to do things that lessen the pain flair ups, and I go lay on a foam roller or stretch when I need to.   Folding laundry still sucks, working at the kitchen sink or counter.....anything with my head down and my arms out in front of me.....

Have you tried yoga?   It's slowly fixing the tight spots in my back, my calf and my right shoulder...
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: jeninco on February 07, 2023, 09:08:22 PM
Just realized I have one of these.

Background: I do a specific kind of technical consulting. I've done it for 25 years or so, mostly as an independent contractor. I have a fair bit of experience, and I'm a bit of a bargain, given my background.

A friend working for local company asked if I'd do some work with them. The project sounded interesting, their client approved me (based on my resume and a conversation), but his company hires contractors through another, third party company. So someone poked them, and they reached out to me. I went through their "are you really an independent consultant" screening, and then they said "great! Just sign this contract, and you can get started."

It was terrible, both in form and in content. The contract was embedded in a webpage in a way that made it impossible to print (short of, I guess, taking screen shots and scrolling, but it was 11 pages long...) and had some really problematic issues, like not including my rate, or the terms of payment (other than "after we get paid"), and including unspecified "fees and costs", and requiring me to consent to some requirements that I flat-out wasn't going to agree to --like fingerprinting and drug testing -- and this is not for security work, or anything involving healthcare, or children. Their version of "negotiating" was basically trying to bully me into agreeing to it, although they did try "that clause doesn't apply to you!" to which I replied "then strike it". "Oh, we can't change our standard contract." There were plenty of other issues, too, including with the succession and arbitration clauses...

Finally, after a couple of weeks of this, I reached out to my friend and said "I'm very sorry, but I can't sign this. Here are three process problems with the company you're working with, and here are three concrete problems with the contract, if you want to go to your management and suggest they work with a different vendor." (He asked "if we get those changed, would you do the work" and I said "at this point, I don't care to work with companies that do business that way, and I'm in the incredibly fortunate position to not have to do work I don't want to do. You need to change vendors!")

Then I sent an email to my contact at the third-party company (it was a response to her "we can't change our standard contract" message) saying "I think we're finished here."  When a manger got back to me (quite quickly, compared to the previous pace of responses) I got to reply with "which part of "I think we're finished here" was unclear? Please delete my information from your computers."

Then I went for a walk in the sun, which was lovely!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: grantmeaname on February 07, 2023, 09:47:22 PM
"which part of "I think we're finished here" was unclear? Please delete my information from your computers."
SUPER badass. Well done.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: LennStar on February 08, 2023, 12:55:34 AM
Especially the walk in the sun part.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: RWTL on February 08, 2023, 03:26:44 AM

Then I sent an email to my contact at the third-party company (it was a response to her "we can't change our standard contract" message) saying "I think we're finished here."  When a manger got back to me (quite quickly, compared to the previous pace of responses) I got to reply with "which part of "I think we're finished here" was unclear? Please delete my information from your computers."

Then I went for a walk in the sun, which was lovely!

Good for you.  The unfortunate part is that these companies act this way because they take advantage of so many people who either don't read the contract or agree to verbal assurances. 

Love the part about taking a walk in the sun. 
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: alcon835 on February 08, 2023, 08:14:27 AM
A very epic FU!! I love the power to just...walk away.

I am in a bit of an FU situation right now. Letting it percolate a bit more, but I will probably have a story soon either way
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: lhamo on February 08, 2023, 08:25:40 AM
A very epic FU!! I love the power to just...walk away.

I am in a bit of an FU situation right now. Letting it percolate a bit more, but I will probably have a story soon either way

[Looking for popcorn at 7:25 am...]
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Dicey on February 08, 2023, 09:07:08 AM
A very epic FU!! I love the power to just...walk away.

I am in a bit of an FU situation right now. Letting it percolate a bit more, but I will probably have a story soon either way

[Looking for popcorn at 7:25 am...]
I have some we can share.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Alternatepriorities on February 08, 2023, 09:33:19 AM
Then I went for a walk in the sun, which was lovely!

That’s a fantastic way to celebrate not signing a terrible contract! Well done.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Dumb blonde on February 08, 2023, 09:44:44 AM
A few years ago I worked as a project manager for a non-profit organization. I was new to the organization and was hired for a 2-year project. The team was great, the work was great, I had the best time in years. We worked really hard and got a lot done in just over a year. The team consisted of a manager, 4 project managers (including me), and an assistant. I knew the manager had problems with his boss (let's call her A.). They didn't get along. The other project managers didn't like A. either. They had worked with her for many years. Before A. was promoted she herself had also worked as a project manager so they had been co-workers. I met with A. on a few occasions, and though I too didn't like her very much, she seemed supportive of our work as a team.

Things started to go wrong when the assistant was fired by A. Our manager wanted to keep her, but A. wanted her to go. So the assistant had to leave. A new assistant for the team was hired by A. The new assistant was way overqualified for the job. She was a very nice lady, and got along great with the team. A. had promised her that over the coming months she would be promoted from assistant to project manager. She was young but she sure would have made a great project manager. So the new assistant stayed and waited. Of course that didn't happen, but A. kept on saying that probably next months, things would be different. Meanwhile our manager didn't have a say in this, he had to take orders from A.

Then one day our manager couldn't take the b*llsh*t from A. anymore and he resigned. A new manager was hired. The new manager was best friends with A., and it was clear that she was not hired for her abilities. At this point I didn't like my job that much anymore. On her second day of work (!) the new manager fired 2 project managers, my co-workers. I was shocked, and I resigned that same day. I didn't have a job lined up, but thankfully I had money saved up.

Fast-forward a few years: after our successful first year the project was extended for 3 more years, but it never picked up speed again, the impact was reduced to almost zero. The new assistant resigned a few days after me. The remaining project manager landed another job a few weeks later. So basically, the whole team was gone within a few weeks.

The 'new manager' is still working there. Over the last few years there have been at least 6 different project managers who all resigned within a year. Last week the 'new manager' called me if I wanted to come back for the final months of the project. I politely declined.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: LennStar on February 08, 2023, 10:21:17 AM
That's not a situation where you politely answer. That's a situation where you laugh loudly and stopp the connection.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Tempname23 on February 08, 2023, 01:10:06 PM
Sounds like you could add, "You need me a whole lot more than I need you."
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Glenstache on February 08, 2023, 01:18:16 PM
Finally, after a couple of weeks of this, I reached out to my friend and said "I'm very sorry, but I can't sign this. Here are three process problems with the company you're working with, and here are three concrete problems with the contract, if you want to go to your management and suggest they work with a different vendor." (He asked "if we get those changed, would you do the work" and I said "at this point, I don't care to work with companies that do business that way, and I'm in the incredibly fortunate position to not have to do work I don't want to do. You need to change vendors!")
Well done. Providing specific feed back is also good and professional. Burdensome (in language and process) contracting is a highly efficient way to get both teaming partners and clients to stop working with your organization.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: jeninco on February 08, 2023, 01:50:16 PM
Finally, after a couple of weeks of this, I reached out to my friend and said "I'm very sorry, but I can't sign this. Here are three process problems with the company you're working with, and here are three concrete problems with the contract, if you want to go to your management and suggest they work with a different vendor." (He asked "if we get those changed, would you do the work" and I said "at this point, I don't care to work with companies that do business that way, and I'm in the incredibly fortunate position to not have to do work I don't want to do. You need to change vendors!")
Well done. Providing specific feed back is also good and professional. Burdensome (in language and process) contracting is a highly efficient way to get both teaming partners and clients to stop working with your organization.

Yeah, My DH helped me translate my original draft about that into "guy". ("Less emoting, more grunting"). The final version was designed to be something he could pass up the chain, if anyone cared.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Dumb blonde on February 09, 2023, 07:35:57 AM
That's not a situation where you politely answer. That's a situation where you laugh loudly and stopp the connection.

Yeah, I thought of that after I hung up. I was so flabbergasted that I forgot to react appropriately. :D
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: jeninco on February 09, 2023, 07:55:05 AM
That's not a situation where you politely answer. That's a situation where you laugh loudly and stopp the connection.

Yeah, I thought of that after I hung up. I was so flabbergasted that I forgot to react appropriately. :D

When I was talking with friends (mostly guys) who do contracting, and described my situation, the answer was (laughing) "Hahaha (not laughing)  No"

I decided I'm going to try to adopt that response.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Zamboni on February 09, 2023, 10:26:26 AM
It's fine if you don't care about this, and it's BS, but it's true:
You will be labelled as more problematic and unprofessional if you do that fake laugh followed by "no", whereas a man might completely get away with it with the other person never holding it against him.

Women are expected to be relentlessly pleasant, I'm afraid. But, that makes our FU money stories have more potential for being epic, imho.

That's why I love movies like The Dressmaker and a new one called Emily the Criminal.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: former player on February 09, 2023, 12:30:21 PM
It's fine if you don't care about this, and it's BS, but it's true:
You will be labelled as more problematic and unprofessional if you do that fake laught followed by "no", whereas a man might completely get away with it with the other person never holding it against him.
Sadly true.  A man can say something with no consequences which when said by a woman would be seen as unprofessional.  Just as a man can make a one-off mistake and move on but a woman making the same mistake exposes a permanent character flaw which is never forgotten. 

(Also true for other minorities.  It's a big part of why, after decades of equalities legislation and education, it's still mainly white heterosexual men at the top of organisations.)
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: jeninco on February 09, 2023, 01:22:37 PM
It's fine if you don't care about this, and it's BS, but it's true:
You will be labelled as more problematic and unprofessional if you do that fake laught followed by "no", whereas a man might completely get away with it with the other person never holding it against him.
Sadly true.  A man can say something with no consequences which when said by a woman would be seen as unprofessional.  Just as a man can make a one-off mistake and move on but a woman making the same mistake exposes a permanent character flaw which is never forgotten. 

(Also true for other minorities.  It's a big part of why, after decades of equalities legislation and education, it's still mainly white heterosexual men at the top of organisations.)

Fair point. The version that would be authentic to me would be (kind smile) "I'm afraid not/ I'm afraid I can't sign that". But I'd like to channel the guys' "not taking it personally" part -- this isn't about my personal relationship, it's about their cruddy contracts.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: jennifers on February 10, 2023, 08:34:42 AM
My story is kinda lame but I'm proud:
I was at my software company job for 12 years as a QA Manager/ software tester. Two months ago they announced layoffs including 2 people who directly reported to me and my manager who was an amazing engineer and manager. Many of those laid off had worked at the company for almost 20 years and were exceptional workers who had a ton of knowledge about a very complex product. I've been through a few rounds of layoffs before but this was nothing like the other times. The engineering department was decimated. The same day they announced the layoffs I resigned. I also negotiated a severance package for myself by agreeing to stay a few more weeks (sort of lame but it's a lot of money.) 
(More background: The software company decided to focus their money and energy on two completely new products one of which is a school in the Bahamas. Months after opening, the school still has zero students. I also think this is some kind of money embezzling scheme to exfiltrate money to the Bahamas.)

PS. Anyone hiring in tech feel free to DM me. I actually love working and have skills in many areas including security, networking, sysadmin, cloud, and QA. I'm not desperate to get a job anytime soon but would start working now given the right opportunity. 
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Zamboni on February 10, 2023, 08:45:49 AM
^I think your story is totally epic!

It seems like the decision makers in layoffs don't worry about any "collateral quitting." They probably should, because leaving a few people to hold the bag working double time when layoffs blast a big hole in the team has driven me to quit. But then I guess not enough people have FU money.

And, yes, the whole "Bahamas school" thing sounds totally shady. Bingo on that one. Why do schools so often get set up as fraud schemes?
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: ATtiny85 on February 10, 2023, 08:52:36 AM
I’ve also thought that the collateral quitting (awesome term) is something the bean counters hope for. The more the merrier.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: saguaro on February 10, 2023, 11:04:23 AM
It seems like the decision makers in layoffs don't worry about any "collateral quitting." They probably should, because leaving a few people to hold the bag working double time when layoffs blast a big hole in the team has driven me to quit. But then I guess not enough people have FU money.

My leaving the Big Company was in part collateral quitting because there were so many rounds of layoffs in the preceeding years.  A lot of people shouldered extra workloads but very few quit in response.  But the ones who did....oh boy did people notice when it happened.   When I finally quit myself, I was told that people were jealous that I could just leave.   I will admit I enjoyed that.   
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Turtle on February 10, 2023, 11:42:21 AM
My biggest FU money work story was in some ways more subtle than Epic.  As far as I know, no one in my management chain knew I was behind it.

All perfectly legal, so no worries about sharing.  However, it maybe belongs in the FU Money for Good thread.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: AlanStache on February 10, 2023, 12:02:52 PM
My biggest FU money work story was in some ways more subtle than Epic.  As far as I know, no one in my management chain knew I was behind it.

All perfectly legal, so no worries about sharing.  However, it maybe belongs in the FU Money for Good thread.

You are not allowed to tease like that, also I hearby grant permission to double post a good story  :-)
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: iluvzbeach on February 10, 2023, 01:29:09 PM
My biggest FU money work story was in some ways more subtle than Epic.  As far as I know, no one in my management chain knew I was behind it.

All perfectly legal, so no worries about sharing.  However, it maybe belongs in the FU Money for Good thread.

You are not allowed to tease like that, also I hearby grant permission to double post a good story  :-)

Yes, you’ve now piqued our curiosity. Please give us the scoop.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: ATtiny85 on February 10, 2023, 01:53:54 PM
The story is there, go to the other thread
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: TomTX on February 10, 2023, 06:23:44 PM
The story is there, go to the other thread
What other thread? Got a link?
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: oldladystache on February 10, 2023, 07:35:08 PM
I'm proud of her too, and I don't even know her. Or you, now that you mention it. Thanks for the story.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: AMandM on February 10, 2023, 07:46:11 PM
The story is there, go to the other thread
What other thread? Got a link?
Here you go:
https://forum.mrmoneymustache.com/welcome-to-the-forum/epic-fu-money-stories-to-help-others/msg3112768/#msg3112768
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Dicey on February 10, 2023, 07:49:50 PM
I'm proud of her too, and I don't even know her. Or you, now that you mention it. Thanks for the story.
What she said!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: mm1970 on February 11, 2023, 12:04:48 PM
I'm proud of her too, and I don't even know her. Or you, now that you mention it. Thanks for the story.
What she said!

That was truly epic!  That DickBoss can get fucked.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Zamboni on February 11, 2023, 12:42:58 PM
"DickBoss" does have a ring to it. Good for your daughter!

I had such a boss who put not 1, not 2, but 3 new hires on PIP's in a row in our little group of ~8 people. We are highly trained professionals who work hard, so suffice it to say not a single person should have gone through that. She was super insecure and would hire a new person, then decide she didn't like them in short order, especially if they got noticed as competent by anyone outside her group. No matter how diplomatic they were, and no matter how competent or hard working they were, she'd put the new person on a PIP and fire them at the end of the PIP period. I'm not sure what she was trying to accomplish.

While I was still stuck with a dashed line reporting to her (I'm sure she would have fired me if she could have), the second guy with an active PIP responded with humor. He realized immediately his days were numbered as he'd only been there less than a year and he knew the person he replaced had gone out the "PIP then fire" way. We were at a team meeting and she instructed us to pick a "holiday movie" to watch together on the last day of work before Christmas. Without skipping a beat he replied "How about the movie Horrible Bosses?" To this day I don't know how the rest of us managed to refrain from busting out laughing, but there was a very long awkward silence following that.

Wherever he landed after she fired him, I hope he has a better boss now.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Dicey on February 11, 2023, 12:59:35 PM
"DickBoss" does have a ring to it. Good for your daughter!

I had such a boss who put not 1, not 2, but 3 new hires on PIP's in a row in our little group of ~8 people. We are highly trained professionals who work hard, so suffice it to say not a single person should have gone through that. She was super insecure and would hire a new person, then decide she didn't like them in short order, especially if they got noticed as competent by anyone outside her group. No matter how diplomatic they were, and no matter how competent or hard working they were, she'd put the new person on a PIP and fire them at the end of the PIP period. I'm not sure what she was trying to accomplish.

While I was still stuck with a dashed line reporting to her (I'm sure she would have fired me if she could have), the second guy with an active PIP responded with humor. He realized immediately his days were numbered as he'd only been there less than a year and he knew the person he replaced had gone out the "PIP then fire" way. We were at a team meeting and she instructed us to pick a "holiday movie" to watch together on the last day of work before Christmas. Without skipping a beat he replied "How about the movie Horrible Bosses?" To this day I don't know how the rest of us managed to refrain from busting out laughing, but there was a very long awkward silence following that.

Wherever he landed after she fired him, I hope he has a better boss now.
What does this mean? I'm ten years post-FIRE - would I be able to answer this if I was still working? Asking for a friend.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Zamboni on February 11, 2023, 01:30:53 PM
On a corporate organizational chart showing "who reports to whom," a solid line connecting the names of two people indicates a direct reporting relationship (one person is the boss who write the performance review of the other.) A dashed line ---- or "dotted" line relationship means that you work with that person frequently, enough that you have some obligation to them or their group, but you don't "officially" report to that person even if they are above you in the pecking order. They are you "secondary" supervisor. They may or may not have any sway when your performance is evaluated. They probably can't fire you on the spot.

In an org chart, pretty much everyone has a solid line between them and someone else, but dashed/dotted lines are fairly uncommon. Often having a dashed line to someone means that there are two people who "want" to be your boss, or you do work that is integral to two groups. But, companies realize that it can be impractical and unfair to you to have "two bosses", and it creates logistics issues from an HR standpoint such as which group has your salary budgeted, so one person is your official boss (solid line to them), while the other person has some expectation that you do work as part of their group but you don't report to them (dashed line). This is sometimes the result of a weird compromise that happens when a person is moving from one group to another, and the "old boss" doesn't want to let the person go. So to get away, the person agrees to a "dashed line" relationship as a compromise as they "finish up" work the old boss wants them to do. Other times you really do work that can't be easily categorized into one group or the other, so the company decides you are in both and uses this to delineate who actually signs your performance review (the solid line person). Managers like to count their "dashed line" people as part of their headcount to make it sound like their group is bigger than it really is.

Dashed/dotted line relationships are generally something you should avoid, imho. Unless the two bosses are good collaborators and have high EQ, you may get pulled in two directions and end up with nobody happy with you.

In my case the dotted line was for about a 20-25% effort level for the horrible boss. It was part of the deal when I took the job: I was expected to do 7-10 hours per week of work in her group. As soon as I realized she had problematic ethics and threw people under the bus regularly, I started working on rubbing out that dotted line formally. A few years after I got away she was involunretired, a word I just made up for "quit, retire, or be fired."
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: LennStar on February 11, 2023, 01:57:50 PM
And I thought the phrase was "Had been let retired".
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Dicey on February 11, 2023, 03:29:23 PM
Wow, thanks for that explanation @Zamboni. It made me remember that i used to work in a situation like that. It was indeed difficult at times, though in my case, it was the solid line person who became the problem. I loved the company, but noped the fuck out of there once Direct Boss turned into a jerk (in retrospect, probably because of some huge family problems*). Dotted line boss-not-boss and I are now retired, but he still has his nose firmly affixed the grindstone. Within a year of my leaving, he was gone.** In a small twist, he went to the company I left when he hired me. It was not a step up for him.

*Yes indeedy, he was handed a lot of shit and I have compassion for his situation. However, I am cancer survivor and I only get one life. I would not eat his unwarranted shit sandwiches no matter how much personal stuff he was dealing with.

**Old B-N-B told me after she retired that the Big Bosses were not happy with the way he treated me specifically  and a couple others.

Goddammit, it's great to be FIRE!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Loren Ver on February 11, 2023, 05:04:10 PM
when I was a contractor, my actual manager noped her way out when they finally pushed her too far (good on her!).  So the company in their wisdom gave me a manager (?) and four(!!!) indirect dash line bosses.  It was a mess. 

Then they started me training my replacement....Maybe they thought I wouldn't notice....
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Dicey on February 11, 2023, 05:49:51 PM
when I was a contractor, my actual manager noped her way out when they finally pushed her too far (good on her!).  So the company in their wisdom gave me a manager (?) and four(!!!) indirect dash line bosses.  It was a mess. 

Then they started me training my replacement....Maybe they thought I wouldn't notice....
Obvs. You did, but what happened next?
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: zolotiyeruki on February 13, 2023, 04:23:39 PM
Here's a tiny one from today.  I don't think there's any danger of getting fired over it, but being in a sound position both in our finances and my skillset gave me some extra confidence. 

I work for a small company, owned by two partners.  Overall, it's been great.  It's not perfect, though.  Several years ago, one of the partners moved out of state.  Out-of-state-partner (OOSP) loves to be in the loop on everything.  So when he hears about something for the first time, for example a product design change or a change in our manufacturing procedure, he wants to know all of the details, the rationale, the impact, etc.  Were he here, he'd be aware of it all, but since he's 1500 miles away, his method of finding out is...to start peppering me with questions on Slack.  To be clear, he doesn't need this information.  He's just satisfying his curiosity.  Having an engineering background, he also feels the need to make all sorts of suggestions, never mind the fact that the engineering team has already brainstormed, researched, tested, settled on a solution, and implemented it.*  He's a little bit like a seagull manager (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Seagull_management) at such times--we rarely interact until something piques his interest, at which point he pops up and wants to be involved.

The problem is that we have a lean engineering team.  When OOSP moved, we were supporting a single product, and developing one new one.  Now, we're supporting three product lines, and in the midst of developing seven (if my count is right), with an engineering team that is only slightly larger than before.  Simply put, I don't have a half hour or an hour to explain something just to scratch his itch.  FWIW, in-state partner agrees.

Up until now, I've been willing to disrupt my flow to answer him.  Not today:
OOSP: <quotes a line from my email>  Tell me more?
Me: I don't have time to explain it right now
OOSP: does it <more specific, detailed question>
Me: <no response>

I was *very* tempted to repeat my first response, but figured that would be a step too far in the unprofessional direction, so I chose to simply ignore the question.  OOSP can go chase another squirrel while he waits, and hopefully he'll forget.

* - and in the process, the engineers have already thought of his ideas, and know why they would or wouldn't work.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Zamboni on February 13, 2023, 07:37:53 PM
Oooh, I hadn't heard the term "Seagull Manager" before! But I have certainly encountered a few of them!

The wikipage for that term also included this list of gems:
Mushroom management – Company with dysfunctional communication between managers and employees
Dunning–Kruger effect – Cognitive bias about one's own skill
Peter Principle – Management concept by Laurence J. Peter
Competence (human resources) – Ability of a person to do a job properly
Micromanagement – Excessive attention or control by a manager
Carrot and stick – Metaphor for the use of punishment and reward to induce a desired behavior
Kiss up kick down – Form of social malfunction

Didn't know that the Peter Principle was actually named after an academic! I thought it was called that because people get promoted until they literally "peter out" and become useless.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Dicey on February 13, 2023, 07:53:37 PM
Here's a tiny one from today.  I don't think there's any danger of getting fired over it, but being in a sound position both in our finances and my skillset gave me some extra confidence. 

I work for a small company, owned by two partners.  Overall, it's been great.  It's not perfect, though.  Several years ago, one of the partners moved out of state.  Out-of-state-partner (OOSP) loves to be in the loop on everything.  So when he hears about something for the first time, for example a product design change or a change in our manufacturing procedure, he wants to know all of the details, the rationale, the impact, etc.  Were he here, he'd be aware of it all, but since he's 1500 miles away, his method of finding out is...to start peppering me with questions on Slack.  To be clear, he doesn't need this information.  He's just satisfying his curiosity.  Having an engineering background, he also feels the need to make all sorts of suggestions, never mind the fact that the engineering team has already brainstormed, researched, tested, settled on a solution, and implemented it.*  He's a little bit like a seagull manager (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Seagull_management) at such times--we rarely interact until something piques his interest, at which point he pops up and wants to be involved.

The problem is that we have a lean engineering team.  When OOSP moved, we were supporting a single product, and developing one new one.  Now, we're supporting three product lines, and in the midst of developing seven (if my count is right), with an engineering team that is only slightly larger than before.  Simply put, I don't have a half hour or an hour to explain something just to scratch his itch.  FWIW, in-state partner agrees.

Up until now, I've been willing to disrupt my flow to answer him.  Not today:
OOSP: <quotes a line from my email>  Tell me more?
Me: I don't have time to explain it right now
OOSP: does it <more specific, detailed question>
Me: <no response>

I was *very* tempted to repeat my first response, but figured that would be a step too far in the unprofessional direction, so I chose to simply ignore the question.  OOSP can go chase another squirrel while he waits, and hopefully he'll forget.

* - and in the process, the engineers have already thought of his ideas, and know why they would or wouldn't work.
My first impression reading this is he's trying to justify being so far away. He has to make it seem like he's on top of everything so it doesn't matter if he's not there day-to-day. Good for you for standing your ground.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: dcheesi on February 14, 2023, 05:36:21 AM
One our project managers in the old office was at least a mini-seagull, especially meetings; we'd be rolling through a series of items, rattling off tasks and issues, and he'd just randomly seize on one and refuse to let go of it, until you'd spent half the meeting explaining every detail to him. It wasn't even the biggest or most relevant items, it was just whatever piqued his interest/concern.

Ultimately I recognized it as being born out of anxiety (not unlike my own); the item in question would hook his latent anxiety give him a jolt, and then he just had to run it to ground. Understanding that, I tended to deal better with his little tangents than a lot of folks, and certainly with more sympathy (though it was still annoying).
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Trifle on February 14, 2023, 07:01:47 AM
One our project managers in the old office was at least a mini-seagull, especially meetings; we'd be rolling through a series of items, rattling off tasks and issues, and he'd just randomly seize on one and refuse to let go of it, until you'd spent half the meeting explaining every detail to him. It wasn't even the biggest or most relevant items, it was just whatever piqued his interest/concern.

Ultimately I recognized it as being born out of anxiety (not unlike my own); the item in question would hook his latent anxiety give him a jolt, and then he just had to run it to ground. Understanding that, I tended to deal better with his little tangents than a lot of folks, and certainly with more sympathy (though it was still annoying).

I know a few people like this, and I've gotten more patient with this personality trait over the years.  Some people struggle to move on to a new train of thought until the prior one is finished to their satisfaction.  I guess the negative way to put it is a "one track mind," but it has a lot of positives as well.  The people in question are deep, persistent thinkers; if you've got a thorny problem, they're the ones to give it to. 
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Loren Ver on February 14, 2023, 08:35:55 AM
when I was a contractor, my actual manager noped her way out when they finally pushed her too far (good on her!).  So the company in their wisdom gave me a manager (?) and four(!!!) indirect dash line bosses.  It was a mess. 

Then they started me training my replacement....Maybe they thought I wouldn't notice....
Obvs. You did, but what happened next?

I got a full time role in a different department.  One with 50% more pay and actual benefits (401k, medical, other really good stuff).  Stayed with the company until I retired.  It wasn't perfect (good company- some really odd management), but good enough that I stuck it out for 12 years.  I also made some life long friends there.  We still get together and hang out,  travel,  cause mischief.  I have two of them on the trek for early retirement.

My replacement didn't do so well, they forced her to retire about two years later when they were cleaning house. 

My manager that Noped her way out is doing great.  Her DH retired early!  She never did full time again but started several companies that are passion projects of hers.  We get together on occasion and are still good friends.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Boll weevil on February 14, 2023, 09:56:17 AM

Didn't know that the Peter Principle was actually named after an academic! I thought it was called that because people get promoted until they literally "peter out" and become useless.

I tend to think there are two Peter Principles.

The “good” one is that competent people get promoted until they end up in a position where they’re not competent

The “bad” one is where incompetent people get promoted to jobs where they’ll do the least amount of damage.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Laura33 on February 14, 2023, 09:59:41 AM
Oooh, I hadn't heard the term "Seagull Manager" before! But I have certainly encountered a few of them!

I had one (you can see my own story many pages back).  We called it swoop-and-poop, as she'd be off doing her own thing, until one day she'd swoop back in on me for some unknown reason and shit on everything I had done in the six weeks since she had last shit all over me.  As you can imagine, there was a lot of duck-and-cover going on in that office as people actively worked to avoid her notice.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: MissNancyPryor on February 14, 2023, 11:59:58 AM

Didn't know that the Peter Principle was actually named after an academic! I thought it was called that because people get promoted until they literally "peter out" and become useless.

I tend to think there are two Peter Principles.

The “good” one is that competent people get promoted until they end up in a position where they’re not competent

The “bad” one is where incompetent people get promoted to jobs where they’ll do the least amount of damage.

The "bad" version as you describe is the Dilbert Principle. 
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: markbike528CBX on February 14, 2023, 12:06:09 PM
Oooh, I hadn't heard the term "Seagull Manager" before! But I have certainly encountered a few of them!

I had one (you can see my own story many pages back).  We called it swoop-and-poop, as she'd be off doing her own thing, until one day she'd swoop back in on me for some unknown reason and shit on everything I had done in the six weeks since she had last shit all over me.  As you can imagine, there was a lot of duck-and-cover going on in that office as people actively worked to avoid her notice.

Dilbert had “Bungee Bosses”.   Fortunately, they tend to be one time events.   
We had a high boss stop into our lab,  get spun up by our description of “unusual samples”, and then leave, never to be heard from again, or even mentioned again.  Well except as a funny story.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: MissNancyPryor on February 14, 2023, 12:11:03 PM
Oooh, I hadn't heard the term "Seagull Manager" before! But I have certainly encountered a few of them!

The wikipage for that term also included this list of gems:
Mushroom management – Company with dysfunctional communication between managers and employees
Dunning–Kruger effect – Cognitive bias about one's own skill
Peter Principle – Management concept by Laurence J. Peter
Competence (human resources) – Ability of a person to do a job properly
Micromanagement – Excessive attention or control by a manager
Carrot and stick – Metaphor for the use of punishment and reward to induce a desired behavior
Kiss up kick down – Form of social malfunction

Didn't know that the Peter Principle was actually named after an academic! I thought it was called that because people get promoted until they literally "peter out" and become useless.

Anyone else notice the evolution of "carrot and stick"? 

Originally this was the concept of having a carrot dangling from a long stick, attaching that stick to a donkey, and attaching that donkey to a mill.  The donkey stupidly keeps trying to reach the carrot that is just out of reach beyond its nose so it walks forward, moving the mill.  Never learning its lesson and never reaching the carrot reward, it does the needed work.  No beating with a stick is involved. 

I have most recently only heard it as a "here is a carrot for good work and I will beat you with the stick for bad work."  I guess since mills are mechanical and beasts of burden are uncommon in modern suburbia people have forgotten. 

The first analogy definitely works for modern cubicle life with the paltry reward just out of reach.  Maybe if we just try harder we might reach it. 

Don't be an ass and hang around for that, get FIRE'd.

Don't get me started on that chicken and egg thing.   
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: BuffaloStache on March 02, 2023, 09:28:07 AM
Oooh, I hadn't heard the term "Seagull Manager" before! But I have certainly encountered a few of them!
...
...
Don't be an ass and hang around for that, get FIRE'd.
...

Both of these are awesome.

There is a Peter Principle & Seagull Manager Boss at my company, who has now risen to the rank of Senior Director. He was my direct boss when I first hired in several years ago, and I've done everything I can since then to stay as far away from him as possible. For most of my first ~year with the company, he would call me into his office on a monthly basis with little warning (sending a meeting notice <18 hrs in advance with one word titles like "Status"!), and then proceed to sternly talk/yell at me for most of our hour-long meeting. During these "sessions" there were no threats of disciplinary action or anything, since I continuously got all of my work done and even received nominations for performance awards submitted by other managers. At first I thought it was just me, but when I started asking around my coworkers and I realized that he did it to lots of people, and that he saw this as his "management style". I generally like my company and think the working environment is pretty good, outside of this one person.

Awkwardly he's had 3 promotions since then, and I've been fortunate that my own promotions have been timed to keep at least one level of management between him and me. He's getting a little older now, but I think it would be awesome to hit FIRE before/at the time he retires. I don't want to be an Ass walking on a mill any longer than I have to be!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: talltexan on March 03, 2023, 07:46:31 AM
I would like to think that incompetent managers in the workplace would be incompetent in managing their personal business as well, but that may just be me hoping that my Mustachian values align with competence in general.

Someone could well have serious misunderstandings about their professional world, or perhaps have a mercenary approach to extracting whatever income they can through their labor and be managing it very well in their private life. Hopefully such people would do us worker bees a favor and retire as soon as their finances permit.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Tyson on March 03, 2023, 11:14:28 AM
I would like to think that incompetent managers in the workplace would be incompetent in managing their personal business as well, but that may just be me hoping that my Mustachian values align with competence in general.

Someone could well have serious misunderstandings about their professional world, or perhaps have a mercenary approach to extracting whatever income they can through their labor and be managing it very well in their private life. Hopefully such people would do us worker bees a favor and retire as soon as their finances permit.

I think many of them enjoy the power and would do the work for the sense of control over other people that it gives them.  In those cases, they definitely won't be retiring early.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: rantk81 on March 10, 2023, 05:22:57 AM
Potentially have a FU story brewing!

I'm essentially FI, but wouldn't mind continuing to pad the 'stache a little more, especially since we seem to be getting a market pullback / recession.

I started a new job in July 2020 and was on-boarded completely remotely, and worked fully remotely the entire time.
In less than 2 years after my hire date, I had been promoted.  My managers are extremely happy with my work, my teammates have come to depend on me, and our team works on a highly successful "thing" that is profitable to the company at-large.  Our team has been described as "extremely lean" and gets a much higher ROI for the number of people working on our team per profit, when compared to most other teams in the company.  Each team works pretty much independently/silo'd and is evaluated mostly on their own "thing's" performance.  That company is (was?) a fantastic place to work.  They demanded a high level of performance, but in return, they treated their employees _extremely_ well.  My direct managers and teammates are fantastic.

Last year, the company got acquired by a larger company.  Larger company promised they would let the individual teams pretty much have autonomy and continue to run per usual.  Well, that seems to have been a lie.  The Boomer-CEO of the larger company couldn't help but let his "asses in office seats" mentality shine through.  This week we received an email informing us that: Starting May 1, there is a new mandatory edict that every employee within a 90-minute (one way) commute of an office is required to be present in the office for two days per week.  It has been communicated that the "90 minute" metric is to be considered via automobile, and would not consider what the commute time is for people who would use public transportation.

Well, in my particular situation, I do not own a car, but I fall within the 90 minute range.  I could theoretically take public transportation (for over an hour each way) on a really dirty and unsafe inner-city train, to get to an office.  But it gets better!  For this particular office location, NONE of the other members of my team who I interact with on a regular basis would be present in this physical office.  They live across the country.  Per the communication from the company at large, they are telling employees that "it doesn't matter if you don't have any immediate co-workers in the same office -- we're doing this to facilitate company culture!"

Yeah.. a culture of resentment.

I told my immediate boss that I would not be commuting to the office.  My boss told me that I could ask for an exemption.  But the icing on the cake is, your manager-chain does not have discretion to approve exemptions.  We have to submit paperwork and HR has the final say on whether the "reason" for an exemption is valid or not.  From the way the communication has been structured, it is very obvious that they probably intend on denying most all requests for exemption, unless they are based on a protected class such as a disability.

In any case, I sent a terse email to HR requesting a copy of the exemption form, and will submit.  If it is not approved, I will continue to work from home doing my best work.  If the company at large decides to "police" the mandatory in-office policy, they can terminate me against my boss's wishes.

But all in all, this has really soured me on this company -- that, up until now, had been excellent in every way.

But I'm not wasting 4+ hours a week on a disgusting and unsafe train, so that I can go to an office where I still have to make zoom calls to talk to all my teammates. Fuck that.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: ATtiny85 on March 10, 2023, 06:05:40 AM
Ouch, that sucks (that the company going from good to bad to maybe worse).

It is such an easy argument one would think. You have been only remote since you started. Either you have performed good in that time or not. If you have performed, then there is no reason for the mandate to apply to you. If you have not performed, why have they let you stick around? Either way, it is bad bad management. And given your team's composition, it is really bizarre.

Good luck! Whichever way it goes, I hope you land softly.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: AlanStache on March 10, 2023, 06:50:21 AM
rantk81 - It might be a fun game to see if you can get a company car out of this.  See just how stupid they are willing to go on in office work  :-p 

90min car commute is not something anyone should have to put up with.  I have gone from 10min to 30-60 depending, after selling my house, soon I will buy a new condo and be near 100% wfh.  I am sure many people drive from where I will be to where I work but I will not be one of them.  I could see management trying to back peddle on my approval to wfh or insist on some hybrid but no, I too have FU money and will not sell my time at 0$/hr to commute.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: midweststache on March 10, 2023, 07:30:12 AM
rantk81 - It might be a fun game to see if you can get a company car out of this.  See just how stupid they are willing to go on in office work  :-p 

90min car commute is not something anyone should have to put up with.  I have gone from 10min to 30-60 depending, after selling my house, soon I will buy a new condo and be near 100% wfh.  I am sure many people drive from where I will be to where I work but I will not be one of them.  I could see management trying to back peddle on my approval to wfh or insist on some hybrid but no, I too have FU money and will not sell my time at 0$/hr to commute.

As someone who lives in a Chicago suburb and works downtown once a week (a hybrid schedule and work environment is really great for me, my colleagues and our work), you could absolutely not pay me enough to deal with downtown Chicago traffic. I feel comfortable on my train line - rantk81 may be on a different line so YMMV - but the second I had to drive downtown would be the second I "NOPED" right out of whatever that situation was. Aside from associated fiscal costs (car upkeep, parking, etc.) there's also the time costs (comparable or even longer than public transit, in my case) and the emotional cost (my threshold for idiots behind the wheel has significantly decreased living in a city with public transit).

I really hope you get approved rantk81; forced in-office work for high performers - ESPECIALLY since the rest of your team isn't coming in - is dumb. So dumb. (But if this is the hill your company wants to die on, that probably tells you something about their long-term priorities and your alignment with this new 'company culture', right?)
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: rantk81 on March 10, 2023, 07:35:00 AM
feel comfortable on my train line - rantk81 may be on a different line so YMMV

I really hope you get approved rantk81; forced in-office work for high performers - ESPECIALLY since the rest of your team isn't coming in - is dumb. So dumb. (But if this is the hill your company wants to die on, that probably tells you something about their long-term priorities and your alignment with this new 'company culture', right?)

Yep.  For the record, it would involve taking the blue line for almost the entire extent of the line.  I'm not going to be forced into spending an hour each way on a mobile homeless-shelter/bathroom/open-air-drug-seller-market.  The only worse line is the red one.

So it wouldn't be on a "luxurious" (by comparison ;) ) metra line.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: TomTX on March 10, 2023, 07:57:06 AM
I really hope you get approved rantk81; forced in-office work for high performers - ESPECIALLY since the rest of your team isn't coming in - is dumb. So dumb. (But if this is the hill your company wants to die on, that probably tells you something about their long-term priorities and your alignment with this new 'company culture', right?)
My office is even dumber. They could have a weekly team day where the whole team comes in since we're all reasonably local - and I see some value in that.

Nope. Instead they want "coverage" - meaning scattering the team across the week. I might see 1 other person on my team on my assigned day while enduring a much worse work environment. I really can't focus well in the sterile, vast, open-office wasteland. Literally nobody ever "drops by" in person.

I just said fuck it and work remotely unless I have a reason to go in - which means I go in maybe twice a month, and it's never been on my assigned day.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: charis on March 10, 2023, 08:01:58 AM
feel comfortable on my train line - rantk81 may be on a different line so YMMV

I really hope you get approved rantk81; forced in-office work for high performers - ESPECIALLY since the rest of your team isn't coming in - is dumb. So dumb. (But if this is the hill your company wants to die on, that probably tells you something about their long-term priorities and your alignment with this new 'company culture', right?)

Yep.  For the record, it would involve taking the blue line for almost the entire extent of the line.  I'm not going to be forced into spending an hour each way on a mobile homeless-shelter/bathroom/open-air-drug-seller-market.  The only worse line is the red one.

So it wouldn't be on a "luxurious" (by comparison ;) ) metra line.

Were your coworkers hired as remote workers, or were they in-office employees who went remote during the pandemic?  It seems like you personally should not need an exemption because you were hired as a teleworker.  It they start demanding you to come in, is that part of your contract?
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: rantk81 on March 10, 2023, 09:42:32 AM
Were your coworkers hired as remote workers, or were they in-office employees who went remote during the pandemic?  It seems like you personally should not need an exemption because you were hired as a teleworker.  It they start demanding you to come in, is that part of your contract?

A lot of my coworkers worked in an office pre-pandemic (in some other cites around the world.)  Several others were on boarded during/after the pandemic too.  There is no "contract" for employment... it's "at will" salaried position.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Gronnie on March 10, 2023, 09:44:20 AM
feel comfortable on my train line - rantk81 may be on a different line so YMMV

I really hope you get approved rantk81; forced in-office work for high performers - ESPECIALLY since the rest of your team isn't coming in - is dumb. So dumb. (But if this is the hill your company wants to die on, that probably tells you something about their long-term priorities and your alignment with this new 'company culture', right?)

Yep.  For the record, it would involve taking the blue line for almost the entire extent of the line.  I'm not going to be forced into spending an hour each way on a mobile homeless-shelter/bathroom/open-air-drug-seller-market.  The only worse line is the red one.

So it wouldn't be on a "luxurious" (by comparison ;) ) metra line.

Were your coworkers hired as remote workers, or were they in-office employees who went remote during the pandemic?  It seems like you personally should not need an exemption because you were hired as a teleworker.  It they start demanding you to come in, is that part of your contract?

This is the US. Unless OP is a SVP or higher, there almost certainly is no contract.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: mm1970 on March 10, 2023, 10:31:01 AM
Quote
I told my immediate boss that I would not be commuting to the office.  My boss told me that I could ask for an exemption.  But the icing on the cake is, your manager-chain does not have discretion to approve exemptions.  We have to submit paperwork and HR has the final say on whether the "reason" for an exemption is valid or not.  From the way the communication has been structured, it is very obvious that they probably intend on denying most all requests for exemption, unless they are based on a protected class such as a disability.

Wow, this is crazy that this topic came up at my office too this week.  Firstly, my opinion would be to just ignore it.  I mean, don't apply for an exemption, just do what you are going to do and wait.

I know, I know, many of us really want specific, known rules.  When COVID first hit and everyone was home, our management started "requiring", or "we are going to require people to come in 3x a week starting X date", several times (but then there would be a surge and that date came and went).  A few of my coworkers complained to me about it, and I just said "oh, I'm ignoring that".  "But shouldn't we really fight back??"  Well, maybe, but I 100% know they aren't going to fire me, so I just ignored them.

Anyhoo, this week I was in a meeting for managers, and one topic from upper mgt was "how do we get our people in the office, to facilitate culture, interaction, etc."  They looked to ME partially to help set the tone, which is funny.  For shit's sake, every single person who reports to me (and by the way, it's a dotted line report, not direct report) is in another country entirely, across the ocean.  *I* know that most of the folks in 1 country are at the office every single day and the other guy WFH every day, because the office there is really small and there's no space.

The complaint was that mgt thinks workers just don't like any rule, much less a specific rule.  This is true, so deal with it.  YES even though my reports aren't near me, I get a lot out of being with my coworkers, because I'm the hub of everything and people ask me questions and I ask them questions, and being at the office is amazing.  3x a week is my sweet spot, sometimes 2.

But everyone else is not me.  I'm working from home in my jammies today, 'cuz it's Friday and it's raining and I can really get shit done without distractions.  Last week I WFH the entire week because of sick family members.  We have people in multiple countries and states, and some local people have moved away and kept their jobs.  We are  hiring people who live elsewhere and just work remotely, so the whole trying to have a rule for those of us who live nearby is really kinda funny and stupid.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: LennStar on March 10, 2023, 10:44:19 AM
This is the US. Unless OP is a SVP or higher, there almost certainly is no contract.
Oh, wait, what? What are you meaning with that?
You can't mean someone is working months or even years for a company and there is nothing written down?
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: SweetTPi on March 10, 2023, 10:57:25 AM
feel comfortable on my train line - rantk81 may be on a different line so YMMV

I really hope you get approved rantk81; forced in-office work for high performers - ESPECIALLY since the rest of your team isn't coming in - is dumb. So dumb. (But if this is the hill your company wants to die on, that probably tells you something about their long-term priorities and your alignment with this new 'company culture', right?)

Yep.  For the record, it would involve taking the blue line for almost the entire extent of the line.  I'm not going to be forced into spending an hour each way on a mobile homeless-shelter/bathroom/open-air-drug-seller-market.  The only worse line is the red one.

So it wouldn't be on a "luxurious" (by comparison ;) ) metra line.

Hmm, propose that the company arrange and pay for a car service, picking you up at home no earlier than 8a and dropping you off at home no later than 5p (or whatever work hours are)?  They can waste their own time and money if they care so much.  After all, one can argue that your work station is your home since you still work the majority of the time from there (60%), and any travel required from there should be company-covered work travel. 
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: bmjohnson35 on March 10, 2023, 11:07:51 AM
This is the US. Unless OP is a SVP or higher, there almost certainly is no contract.
Oh, wait, what? What are you meaning with that?
You can't mean someone is working months or even years for a company and there is nothing written down?

Yup. It's not uncommon in the US.  US employees often have to sign a lot of documents protecting the company, but your own protection is left to labor laws and not a contractual agreement.  It varies state to state. If you work in an at-will state, it means they can let you go very easily, with little reason.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: bmjohnson35 on March 10, 2023, 11:22:22 AM

rantk81 - If you are truly prepared to leave, I second the recommendation to simply ignore the request. It's not what I would have done when I was working.  I would have likely went to HR as well with a passionate email and/or phone call. Now that I have been retired for a few years, I realize I could have handled foolishness like this better when I was working. If all your co-workers are in a different state, would they even know you disregarded it?  If they do, would they really fire you?  If they call you out, you could casually explain how you didn't think it applied to your situation and calmly provide your logiocal explanation.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: rantk81 on March 10, 2023, 11:37:28 AM

rantk81 - If you are truly prepared to leave, I second the recommendation to simply ignore the request. It's not what I would have done when I was working.  I would have likely went to HR as well with a passionate email and/or phone call. Now that I have been retired for a few years, I realize I could have handled foolishness like this better when I was working. If all your co-workers are in a different state, would they even know you disregarded it?  If they do, would they really fire you?  If they call you out, you could casually explain how you didn't think it applied to your situation and calmly provide your logiocal explanation.

I am 100% totally prepared to walk, if this doesn't go my way.  But yeah, it is probably decent advice to just ignore it.  However, I can't really "play dumb" and pretend like I didn't know that it would apply to me.  We have an official designation in one of the "employee management tools" which classifies us as Onsite, Offsite, or Connected.  "Connected" folks are expected to adhere to the 2+ day rule.  They are also proactively automatically changing employee's classifications from "Offsite" (which I currently am/was) to "Connected" if you live within their radius.  I'm assuming this is what is/will happen to me.  I'm sure they will force us to click some button in that "employee management tool" software in order to acknowledge this, as how it was handled a long time ago when I originally was classified as "Offsite."
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: charis on March 10, 2023, 11:50:53 AM
This is the US. Unless OP is a SVP or higher, there almost certainly is no contract.
Oh, wait, what? What are you meaning with that?
You can't mean someone is working months or even years for a company and there is nothing written down?

Yup. It's not uncommon in the US.  US employees often have to sign a lot of documents protecting the company, but your own protection is left to labor laws and not a contractual agreement.  It varies state to state. If you work in an at-will state, it means they can let you go very easily, with little reason.

I'm in the US and I've never had a job that didn't involve some type of contract or signed offer.  I'm not saying the OP isn't an at will employee.  What I'm suggesting, the same as someone, is that the OP ignore the new policy and not apply for an exemption.  It's not playing dumb.  If I am hired for a job as a "off site" employee, that is my expectation for my role.  That the OP was hired in 2020 should not change that unless it was understood that this arrangement was temporary or subject to change in light of the pandemic. Practically speaking, employers will do what they want, so that's where FU money comes into play.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: rantk81 on March 10, 2023, 12:15:43 PM
I'm in the US and I've never had a job that didn't involve some type of contract or signed offer.  I'm not saying the OP isn't an at will employee.  What I'm suggesting, the same as someone, is that the OP ignore the new policy and not apply for an exemption.  It's not playing dumb.  If I am hired for a job as a "off site" employee, that is my expectation for my role.  That the OP was hired in 2020 should not change that unless it was understood that this arrangement was temporary or subject to change in light of the pandemic. Practically speaking, employers will do what they want, so that's where FU money comes into play.

Oh yeah, there's a lot of paperwork you sign when you get hired.  But every single piece of it is usually one-sided to protect all the rights of the employer, and restrict as much (to the extent possible or legally) the new employee.  Non-disclosures, non-competes, at-will, etc.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: charis on March 10, 2023, 12:23:31 PM
I'm in the US and I've never had a job that didn't involve some type of contract or signed offer.  I'm not saying the OP isn't an at will employee.  What I'm suggesting, the same as someone, is that the OP ignore the new policy and not apply for an exemption.  It's not playing dumb.  If I am hired for a job as a "off site" employee, that is my expectation for my role.  That the OP was hired in 2020 should not change that unless it was understood that this arrangement was temporary or subject to change in light of the pandemic. Practically speaking, employers will do what they want, so that's where FU money comes into play.

Oh yeah, there's a lot of paperwork you sign when you get hired.  But every single piece of it is usually one-sided to protect all the rights of the employer, and restrict as much (to the extent possible or legally) the new employee.  Non-disclosures, non-competes, at-will, etc.

My point was not about being protected, as I said.  It was about the parameters/nature/description of the position and whether it's defensible to claim that the policy does not apply to you because you were hired as a teleworker.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: SpaceCow on March 10, 2023, 12:30:47 PM
feel comfortable on my train line - rantk81 may be on a different line so YMMV

I really hope you get approved rantk81; forced in-office work for high performers - ESPECIALLY since the rest of your team isn't coming in - is dumb. So dumb. (But if this is the hill your company wants to die on, that probably tells you something about their long-term priorities and your alignment with this new 'company culture', right?)

Yep.  For the record, it would involve taking the blue line for almost the entire extent of the line.  I'm not going to be forced into spending an hour each way on a mobile homeless-shelter/bathroom/open-air-drug-seller-market.  The only worse line is the red one.

So it wouldn't be on a "luxurious" (by comparison ;) ) metra line.

It's too bad that the CTA can't get their act together on policing the L system. As a Detroit Metro area resident, the L looks like a crown jewel, but I do understand not wanting to spend that much time on the blue line.

I spend 1.5 hours on the bus each way for my two mandatory in-office days. It's not fun.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: jinga nation on March 10, 2023, 12:36:43 PM
Management feels powerless when the minions are comfortable AND productive working remotely.
Management: why are they happy working in PJs but I have to don office wear and be lonely? I'll force everyone to join my misery.

Seems like a stupid power play that creates employee resentment, chaos, and reduces productivity.
Obviously, since management doesn't do real work, doesn't understand "if it ain't broke, don't fix it".

If I were @rantk81 , I'd be looking for a new gig, or planning for some flavor of FIRE.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: LennStar on March 10, 2023, 12:40:40 PM
Quote
Yup. It's not uncommon in the US.  US employees often have to sign a lot of documents protecting the company, but your own protection is left to labor laws and not a contractual agreement.  It varies state to state. If you work in an at-will state, it means they can let you go very easily, with little reason.

Oh yeah, there's a lot of paperwork you sign when you get hired.  But every single piece of it is usually one-sided to protect all the rights of the employer, and restrict as much (to the extent possible or legally) the new employee.  Non-disclosures, non-competes, at-will, etc.

So, if they decide today that you only get minimum wage from the third of Marhc on, that's it?
How does the state know that they pay the approprioate taxes and social....  ah, okay, forget that, companies don't do that in the US.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: AlanStache on March 10, 2023, 12:52:33 PM
...

So, if they decide today that you only get minimum wage from the third of Marhc on, that's it?
How does the state know that they pay the approprioate taxes and social....  ah, okay, forget that, companies don't do that in the US.

You have seen the recent stories about some states opening up the mining and animal slaughter industries to children labor?

In many ways the US is actually 14 squirrels in a trench coat pretending to be a modern democracy. 

To the best of my knowledge I could be fired right now with no reason provided and given basically pay earned to date, and 30 minutes to clean out my work area.   
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: grantmeaname on March 10, 2023, 12:59:34 PM
You think that in Germany the state knows that the correct payroll taxes are being withheld because it looks at the contract between the employer and the employee?
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: LennStar on March 10, 2023, 01:40:06 PM
You think that in Germany the state knows that the correct payroll taxes are being withheld because it looks at the contract between the employer and the employee?
The state does not look at all contracts all the time.
However they must be kept of course. And if the amount payed is different from the amount stated, that is illegal. And of course the state knows what taxes and contributions it gets. (btw. the company has to pay them at the middle of the month already for the whole month).
So if the company does not pay you enough, you have a contract that states your salary, a bank statement that says how much you got and a tax record how much taxes were paid, which means you can calculate the officially paid sum.

Quote
You have seen the recent stories about some states opening up the mining and animal slaughter industries to children labor?
No, that didn't make the tour across the ocean and through my filters. On the other hand this week there was a "I want more enthusiasm for work" story here from a big employer that complained about people no longer wanting to work their ass off which, not least because of the tone, got a little shitstorm. It's the same everywhere, isn't it?

Quote
To the best of my knowledge I could be fired right now with no reason provided and given basically pay earned to date, and 30 minutes to clean out my work area.
Yeah, I knew that existed. But I was asking about the pay for the work you already did. Without contract, how can anybody prove if you got the right amount or too much or too less?
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Michael in ABQ on March 10, 2023, 01:53:46 PM
This is the US. Unless OP is a SVP or higher, there almost certainly is no contract.
Oh, wait, what? What are you meaning with that?
You can't mean someone is working months or even years for a company and there is nothing written down?

I'm a business owner. Here's how the conversation went with the last employee I hired.

"would you like a job doing x, y, and z?"
"yes"
"how does $X per hour sound"
"sounds good"
"ok, you'll start on Monday"

The only paperwork she filled out was enough information to put her on payroll. Name, address, date of birth, social security number, and bank account information for direct deposit.


When I worked for a large corporation, I believe there was an offer letter that outlined some basic information (job title, pay, etc.). When I got a promotion and a new title and higher pay I think there was another one. That was about it. I could quit at anytime and they could fire me at anytime.

When I worked for the federal government, I would basically have to murder my boss in front of witnesses in order to be fired. If you were a terrible employee but knew how to play the system, it could take months to actually build up enough of a paper trail to fire you - and then you could always try to appeal.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: kenner on March 10, 2023, 02:19:19 PM
Quote
Quote
To the best of my knowledge I could be fired right now with no reason provided and given basically pay earned to date, and 30 minutes to clean out my work area.
Yeah, I knew that existed. But I was asking about the pay for the work you already did. Without contract, how can anybody prove if you got the right amount or too much or too less?

You don't need a contract for that, you just need your pay/offer letter (which presumably was received prior to accepting a job--verbal offers are a thing, but 'get it in writing' is pretty basic advice).  For standard employment/non-contractor type jobs, the government is going to learn all about how much you get paid when you fill out your employment paperwork too since the employer has taxes to pay on it.  And no, companies in the US can't cut salaries retroactively without falling afoul of labor laws--
https://www.askamanager.org/2020/04/our-employer-wants-to-cut-our-pay-retroactively.html

You could end up with a case where someone accepts a verbal offer, ignores the payroll paperwork they fill out, and then finds out the first time they get paid that they've got a problem, but at least after that first paycheck you've got a paper trail, too.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: former player on March 10, 2023, 03:52:12 PM
Quote
Quote
To the best of my knowledge I could be fired right now with no reason provided and given basically pay earned to date, and 30 minutes to clean out my work area.
Yeah, I knew that existed. But I was asking about the pay for the work you already did. Without contract, how can anybody prove if you got the right amount or too much or too less?

You don't need a contract for that, you just need your pay/offer letter (which presumably was received prior to accepting a job--verbal offers are a thing, but 'get it in writing' is pretty basic advice).  For standard employment/non-contractor type jobs, the government is going to learn all about how much you get paid when you fill out your employment paperwork too since the employer has taxes to pay on it.  And no, companies in the US can't cut salaries retroactively without falling afoul of labor laws--
https://www.askamanager.org/2020/04/our-employer-wants-to-cut-our-pay-retroactively.html

You could end up with a case where someone accepts a verbal offer, ignores the payroll paperwork they fill out, and then finds out the first time they get paid that they've got a problem, but at least after that first paycheck you've got a paper trail, too.
Just to clarify:

1.  A pay/offer letter creates a contractual obligation as soon as it is accepted by the employee.  That letter is the employee's contract.
2.  A verbal offer also creates a contractual obligation as soon as it is accepted by the employee.  A contract does not have to be in writing, it is just easier to prove its existence and terms if it is.

So yes, all USA employees are employed under a contract, whether they think they are or not.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Captain FIRE on March 10, 2023, 05:07:06 PM
Just FYI, at my husband's office they just docked bonuses of people who were egregious about not coming back in person 20%. (Expectation is to return 3/day a week, he thinks these were people who came back maybe less than 1 day a week.) Their manager's bonus was also docked 20%. He believes that next year they'll move the needle and dock people who are back less than 50% time. So you can play dumb, but they can dock your bonus. Unfortunately, even if you were hired as a remote employee, they can change the terms and require you to come in person or you're fired.

How is your manager? Would a frank conversation with them be helpful, asking them if you need to get another offer in order to get changed back to remote (in which case, you are likely to just take the other offer)? How much do you like your job?
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: rantk81 on March 10, 2023, 05:52:38 PM
How is your manager? Would a frank conversation with them be helpful, asking them if you need to get another offer in order to get changed back to remote (in which case, you are likely to just take the other offer)? How much do you like your job?

My manager, manager's manager, and manager's manager's manager are all excellent.  Unfortunately, the decision to grant an exemption does not fall upon them.  It is HR's final decision.  I told my direct manager that I would not be commuting the the office on a regular basis, however, I would make exceptions if there were special circumstances if someone special was visiting the office from out of town, or if we were on-boarding someone who needed my direct help for a few days.  My manager and manager's manager are apparently currently advocating for me with HR I think... although I haven't actually filled out any of the official forms myself. Heh.

If they magically make this whole thing go away, and I am able to continue per normal, I owe both of them a beer :) 

I do really enjoy my job and all of the people who I directly work with.  I'm not sure I like the job enough to endure one of the worst train lines on Chicago public transportation at rush hour several times a week.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: iluvzbeach on March 10, 2023, 06:06:12 PM
After all the work changes during and after Covid, where it seemed like employees were gaining the upper hand between WFH, huge salary increases from jumping employers and the great resignation, I have wondered if some of this layoff and return to office business is about employers trying to regain the upper hand.  Like, did they feel things were getting too lopsided and employees were gaining too much control, so let's right that ship and start making them be fearful of losing their jobs?  I know it's more complex than that, especially with questions about a recession and overall profitability, but I still wonder if some of this plays a part in what they are doing.

I'm FIRE now but if I was still working, there is zero chance I'd return to the office. 
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Zamboni on March 10, 2023, 06:58:24 PM

<Comment about the 14 stacked squirrels in a trenchcoat>


My soda came up out of my nose when I laughed at that one!

I think it irks the upper management that they have all of these empty buildings sitting around. Instead of doing something reasonable and DIVESTING themselves of these depreciating assets, perhaps by selling them to be converted into condos or apartments or something that is ACTUALLY needed right now, they make a stupid power play and tell people who should be working remotely that they have to come to this useless building that they own and refuse to sell off (or, even worse, useless building that they are renting!)

Although, if we are talking about Detroit here, it's very possible they would have to sell it at a loss. They should still sell it, though, and use the fund for something else if people can do their jobs without being there.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: SwordGuy on March 10, 2023, 07:01:48 PM

You have seen the recent stories about some states opening up the mining and animal slaughter industries to children labor?


My soda came up out of my nose when I laughed at that one!


I hope you were laughing at the next sentence AlanStache wrote, the one you forgot to quote.

Because there's not a damn thing funny about the sentence you quoted.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Zamboni on March 10, 2023, 07:13:12 PM
Oh wow, yes, I suck at editing. Whoops! It was the squirrels in the trenchcoat comment.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: AlanStache on March 10, 2023, 07:24:01 PM
Oh wow, yes, I suck at editing. Whoops! It was the squirrels in the trenchcoat comment.

Glad it was the squirrels.  I had to reread the line above it 10 times to make sure I did not make some funny writing error.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: SwordGuy on March 10, 2023, 07:25:14 PM
Oh wow, yes, I suck at editing. Whoops! It was the squirrels in the trenchcoat comment.

I went looking for a possible editing mistake because that comment just didn't sound like you at all!

Thought that was it and figured you wouldn't want people to get the wrong impression about you!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Zamboni on March 10, 2023, 08:55:49 PM
Thanks, yeah, I tried to fix it now.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Sandi_k on March 11, 2023, 12:14:45 AM

rantk81 - If you are truly prepared to leave, I second the recommendation to simply ignore the request. It's not what I would have done when I was working.  I would have likely went to HR as well with a passionate email and/or phone call. Now that I have been retired for a few years, I realize I could have handled foolishness like this better when I was working. If all your co-workers are in a different state, would they even know you disregarded it?  If they do, would they really fire you?  If they call you out, you could casually explain how you didn't think it applied to your situation and calmly provide your logiocal explanation.

I am 100% totally prepared to walk, if this doesn't go my way.  But yeah, it is probably decent advice to just ignore it.  However, I can't really "play dumb" and pretend like I didn't know that it would apply to me.  We have an official designation in one of the "employee management tools" which classifies us as Onsite, Offsite, or Connected.  "Connected" folks are expected to adhere to the 2+ day rule.  They are also proactively automatically changing employee's classifications from "Offsite" (which I currently am/was) to "Connected" if you live within their radius.  I'm assuming this is what is/will happen to me.  I'm sure they will force us to click some button in that "employee management tool" software in order to acknowledge this, as how it was handled a long time ago when I originally was classified as "Offsite."

Do you have a family member outside the Zone of Commuting, whose address you could use for those purposes? Then file a change of address with work, and you're done.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Dicey on March 11, 2023, 04:31:15 AM
Do you have a family member outside the Zone of Commuting, whose address you could use for those purposes? Then file a change of address with work, and you're done.
Heh, you beat me to it.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: rantk81 on March 11, 2023, 05:18:18 AM
Do you have a family member outside the Zone of Commuting, whose address you could use for those purposes? Then file a change of address with work, and you're done.

Not in the current state where I live.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: zolotiyeruki on March 11, 2023, 05:53:18 AM
If it is HR that is setting the policy, how are they supposed to find out if someone isn't coming to the office?   Do they have someone walking around the office every day, taking attendance?  Some IT system that detects if your laptop connects to the network?  A network of spies?  If your management chain doesn't report anything, how would HR know?
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: grantmeaname on March 11, 2023, 06:19:40 AM
It's often collected from badge swipes, or from your PC's network telemetry if not
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: SwordGuy on March 11, 2023, 08:13:40 AM
Do you have a family member outside the Zone of Commuting, whose address you could use for those purposes? Then file a change of address with work, and you're done.

Not in the current state where I live.

I used a friend's address because they had 2 different insurance policies, depending on your zip code.  Mine sucked.  Did that for a year until they dropped the shitty policy.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: alcon835 on March 11, 2023, 09:04:38 AM
Potentially have a FU story brewing!

I'm essentially FI, but wouldn't mind continuing to pad the 'stache a little more, especially since we seem to be getting a market pullback / recession.

I started a new job in July 2020 and was on-boarded completely remotely, and worked fully remotely the entire time.
In less than 2 years after my hire date, I had been promoted.  My managers are extremely happy with my work, my teammates have come to depend on me, and our team works on a highly successful "thing" that is profitable to the company at-large.  Our team has been described as "extremely lean" and gets a much higher ROI for the number of people working on our team per profit, when compared to most other teams in the company.  Each team works pretty much independently/silo'd and is evaluated mostly on their own "thing's" performance.  That company is (was?) a fantastic place to work.  They demanded a high level of performance, but in return, they treated their employees _extremely_ well.  My direct managers and teammates are fantastic.

Last year, the company got acquired by a larger company.  Larger company promised they would let the individual teams pretty much have autonomy and continue to run per usual.  Well, that seems to have been a lie.  The Boomer-CEO of the larger company couldn't help but let his "asses in office seats" mentality shine through.  This week we received an email informing us that: Starting May 1, there is a new mandatory edict that every employee within a 90-minute (one way) commute of an office is required to be present in the office for two days per week.  It has been communicated that the "90 minute" metric is to be considered via automobile, and would not consider what the commute time is for people who would use public transportation.

Well, in my particular situation, I do not own a car, but I fall within the 90 minute range.  I could theoretically take public transportation (for over an hour each way) on a really dirty and unsafe inner-city train, to get to an office.  But it gets better!  For this particular office location, NONE of the other members of my team who I interact with on a regular basis would be present in this physical office.  They live across the country.  Per the communication from the company at large, they are telling employees that "it doesn't matter if you don't have any immediate co-workers in the same office -- we're doing this to facilitate company culture!"

Yeah.. a culture of resentment.

I told my immediate boss that I would not be commuting to the office.  My boss told me that I could ask for an exemption.  But the icing on the cake is, your manager-chain does not have discretion to approve exemptions.  We have to submit paperwork and HR has the final say on whether the "reason" for an exemption is valid or not.  From the way the communication has been structured, it is very obvious that they probably intend on denying most all requests for exemption, unless they are based on a protected class such as a disability.

In any case, I sent a terse email to HR requesting a copy of the exemption form, and will submit.  If it is not approved, I will continue to work from home doing my best work.  If the company at large decides to "police" the mandatory in-office policy, they can terminate me against my boss's wishes.

But all in all, this has really soured me on this company -- that, up until now, had been excellent in every way.

But I'm not wasting 4+ hours a week on a disgusting and unsafe train, so that I can go to an office where I still have to make zoom calls to talk to all my teammates. Fuck that.


A lot companies are doing this over the past 12 months to get rid of high cost employees without layoffs. The people most likely to quit are the ones with the highest pay and most options (who are the most likely to leave anyway). Those who refuse to adhere to the policy can be fired for cause and the company may be able to avoid unemployment claims. Facebook, Google, Twitter, and many, many more tech companies did this last year as the economy started shaking. It's another lever they can pull to raise share price by lowering expenses.

In most cases, the lost revenue/productivity from the leaving employees are not high enough to make a difference and exceptions can be made for truly outstanding employees or those in the "good ole boys" club.

Everyone is replaceable (not always at the level they were producing, but often at a level that is acceptable to keep things going well enough). This is why FU money is so important. At the end of the day, the organization as a whole doesn't really care about you. They will pull whatever lever they need for the decisions makers to be successful and happy. If your happiness and success coincides with their goals, you'll do well. If it doesn't, well, good luck to you.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: scottish on March 11, 2023, 09:13:08 AM
Everyone is replaceable (not always at the level they were producing, but often at a level that is acceptable to keep things going well enough). This is why FU money is so important. At the end of the day, the organization as a whole doesn't really car about you. They will pull whatever lever they need for the decisions makers to be successful and happy. If your happiness and success coincides with their goals, you'll do well. If it doesn't, well, good luck to you.

That's certainly how executives think.    They generally don't realize Price's law applies to them just as it does to all the peons who work for them.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Gronnie on March 11, 2023, 10:31:28 AM
Potentially have a FU story brewing!

I'm essentially FI, but wouldn't mind continuing to pad the 'stache a little more, especially since we seem to be getting a market pullback / recession.

I started a new job in July 2020 and was on-boarded completely remotely, and worked fully remotely the entire time.
In less than 2 years after my hire date, I had been promoted.  My managers are extremely happy with my work, my teammates have come to depend on me, and our team works on a highly successful "thing" that is profitable to the company at-large.  Our team has been described as "extremely lean" and gets a much higher ROI for the number of people working on our team per profit, when compared to most other teams in the company.  Each team works pretty much independently/silo'd and is evaluated mostly on their own "thing's" performance.  That company is (was?) a fantastic place to work.  They demanded a high level of performance, but in return, they treated their employees _extremely_ well.  My direct managers and teammates are fantastic.

Last year, the company got acquired by a larger company.  Larger company promised they would let the individual teams pretty much have autonomy and continue to run per usual.  Well, that seems to have been a lie.  The Boomer-CEO of the larger company couldn't help but let his "asses in office seats" mentality shine through.  This week we received an email informing us that: Starting May 1, there is a new mandatory edict that every employee within a 90-minute (one way) commute of an office is required to be present in the office for two days per week.  It has been communicated that the "90 minute" metric is to be considered via automobile, and would not consider what the commute time is for people who would use public transportation.

Well, in my particular situation, I do not own a car, but I fall within the 90 minute range.  I could theoretically take public transportation (for over an hour each way) on a really dirty and unsafe inner-city train, to get to an office.  But it gets better!  For this particular office location, NONE of the other members of my team who I interact with on a regular basis would be present in this physical office.  They live across the country.  Per the communication from the company at large, they are telling employees that "it doesn't matter if you don't have any immediate co-workers in the same office -- we're doing this to facilitate company culture!"

Yeah.. a culture of resentment.

I told my immediate boss that I would not be commuting to the office.  My boss told me that I could ask for an exemption.  But the icing on the cake is, your manager-chain does not have discretion to approve exemptions.  We have to submit paperwork and HR has the final say on whether the "reason" for an exemption is valid or not.  From the way the communication has been structured, it is very obvious that they probably intend on denying most all requests for exemption, unless they are based on a protected class such as a disability.

In any case, I sent a terse email to HR requesting a copy of the exemption form, and will submit.  If it is not approved, I will continue to work from home doing my best work.  If the company at large decides to "police" the mandatory in-office policy, they can terminate me against my boss's wishes.

But all in all, this has really soured me on this company -- that, up until now, had been excellent in every way.

But I'm not wasting 4+ hours a week on a disgusting and unsafe train, so that I can go to an office where I still have to make zoom calls to talk to all my teammates. Fuck that.


A lot companies are doing this over the past 12 months to get rid of high cost employees without layoffs. The people most likely to quit are the ones with the highest pay and most options (who are the most likely to leave anyway). Those who refuse to adhere to the policy can be fired for cause and the company may be able to avoid unemployment claims. Facebook, Google, Twitter, and many, many more tech companies did this last year as the economy started shaking. It's another lever they can pull to raise share price by lowering expenses.

In most cases, the lost revenue/productivity from the leaving employees are not high enough to make a difference and exceptions can be made for truly outstanding employees or those in the "good ole boys" club.

Everyone is replaceable (not always at the level they were producing, but often at a level that is acceptable to keep things going well enough). This is why FU money is so important. At the end of the day, the organization as a whole doesn't really care about you. They will pull whatever lever they need for the decisions makers to be successful and happy. If your happiness and success coincides with their goals, you'll do well. If it doesn't, well, good luck to you.

Fundamentally changing the employment relationship is constructive dismissal. Those employees are getting unemployment.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Captain FIRE on March 11, 2023, 12:34:26 PM
If it is HR that is setting the policy, how are they supposed to find out if someone isn't coming to the office?   Do they have someone walking around the office every day, taking attendance?  Some IT system that detects if your laptop connects to the network?  A network of spies?  If your management chain doesn't report anything, how would HR know?

It's often collected from badge swipes, or from your PC's network telemetry if not

Yep, badge swipes. So you could go, badge, take a call or two and then return home.

One dumb outcome has been not enough offices for everyone who has come in.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Dicey on March 11, 2023, 12:39:27 PM
If it is HR that is setting the policy, how are they supposed to find out if someone isn't coming to the office?   Do they have someone walking around the office every day, taking attendance?  Some IT system that detects if your laptop connects to the network?  A network of spies?  If your management chain doesn't report anything, how would HR know?

It's often collected from badge swipes, or from your PC's network telemetry if not

Yep, badge swipes. So you could go, badge, take a call or two and then return home.

One dumb outcome has been not enough offices for everyone who has come in.
I like the way you think, Captain!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: LennStar on March 12, 2023, 01:03:43 AM
One dumb outcome has been not enough offices for everyone who has come in.
That is not your problem. If they can't provide working space, you can't work. Tell them you can't and wait.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Captain FIRE on March 12, 2023, 07:34:33 AM
One dumb outcome has been not enough offices for everyone who has come in.
That is not your problem. If they can't provide working space, you can't work. Tell them you can't and wait.

So first, this is my husband not me. And as mentioned above, if all they have is cafeteria space that hurts his back (not office chairs) and is in the open (we try to be COVID cautious), then he’ll badge in, take a few meetings and go home. I’ve also told him to track these instances for a record but I’m not sure he has.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: NorCal on March 12, 2023, 11:34:31 AM
One dumb outcome has been not enough offices for everyone who has come in.
That is not your problem. If they can't provide working space, you can't work. Tell them you can't and wait.

So first, this is my husband not me. And as mentioned above, if all they have is cafeteria space that hurts his back (not office chairs) and is in the open (we try to be COVID cautious), then he’ll badge in, take a few meetings and go home. I’ve also told him to track these instances for a record but I’m not sure he has.

Is your husband at a larger company?  If so, most larger companies have policies mandating ergonomic accessibility, and even have experts that will come and install all the ergonomic gear.

He could have a lot of fun tweaking corporate policies by asking for ergonomic accommodations, and telling them he mostly works from the cafeteria.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Captain FIRE on March 12, 2023, 11:45:33 AM
One dumb outcome has been not enough offices for everyone who has come in.
That is not your problem. If they can't provide working space, you can't work. Tell them you can't and wait.

So first, this is my husband not me. And as mentioned above, if all they have is cafeteria space that hurts his back (not office chairs) and is in the open (we try to be COVID cautious), then he’ll badge in, take a few meetings and go home. I’ve also told him to track these instances for a record but I’m not sure he has.

Is your husband at a larger company?  If so, most larger companies have policies mandating ergonomic accessibility, and even have experts that will come and install all the ergonomic gear.

He could have a lot of fun tweaking corporate policies by asking for ergonomic accommodations, and telling them he mostly works from the cafeteria.

Ha. I’ll tell him. They do make him do an annual ergo assessment. European company, shy of $50 billion in revenue
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: frugalnacho on March 15, 2023, 01:15:46 PM
This is the US. Unless OP is a SVP or higher, there almost certainly is no contract.
Oh, wait, what? What are you meaning with that?
You can't mean someone is working months or even years for a company and there is nothing written down?

Yup. It's not uncommon in the US.  US employees often have to sign a lot of documents protecting the company, but your own protection is left to labor laws and not a contractual agreement.  It varies state to state. If you work in an at-will state, it means they can let you go very easily, with little reason.

I am 40 and have literally never worked a job that I couldn't legally be fired from on the spot for no reason.  It's been very explicitly laid out that it's at-will employment and can be terminated at any time with no notice, by either party, for any/no reason.  While I guess there was technically a signed "contract" between me and the employer, I wouldn't describe it as a contract because that usually implies some specific end date.

I am in Michigan, USA.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: markbike528CBX on March 15, 2023, 04:11:16 PM
This is the US. Unless OP is a SVP or higher, there almost certainly is no contract.
Oh, wait, what? What are you meaning with that?
You can't mean someone is working months or even years for a company and there is nothing written down?

Yup. It's not uncommon in the US.  US employees often have to sign a lot of documents protecting the company, but your own protection is left to labor laws and not a contractual agreement.  It varies state to state. If you work in an at-will state, it means they can let you go very easily, with little reason.

I am 40 and have literally never worked a job that I couldn't legally be fired from on the spot for no reason.  It's been very explicitly laid out that it's at-will employment and can be terminated at any time with no notice, by either party, for any/no reason.  While I guess there was technically a signed "contract" between me and the employer, I wouldn't describe it as a contract because that usually implies some specific end date.

I am in Michigan, USA.
On the other hand, an actual ‘fireing’ is rare.  That would prevent unemployment insurance (partial pay reimbursement )from being applied for the employee.  My sense is that most employees are ‘laid off’, which includes unemployment insurance to avoid litigation.  “Involuntary resignation” would prevent a stain on the employee’s resume, so is also an option.  States in the US vary to a degree that I’m not willing to look up, since I’m retired .

Giving the other party (employer or employee) more than two weeks notice is non-standard . There are several threads about how much notice an employee should give.  The two week notice is the most acceptable answer for US persons.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: charis on March 15, 2023, 07:58:50 PM
Being fired doesn't prevent an employee from collecting unemployment benefits, it's reason for the firing that may give the employer grounds to oppose the application, usually something beyond poor performance, such as misconduct or policy violation of some kind.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: saguaro on March 16, 2023, 02:45:24 PM
One dumb outcome has been not enough offices for everyone who has come in.
That is not your problem. If they can't provide working space, you can't work. Tell them you can't and wait.

We are running into this very issue at one of my company locations.   They consolidated a couple of locations into one building and implemented workspace sharing during the pandemic.   Now they are talking about requiring all employees to report to the office however, there's one problem: there is no room for everyone to show up at once.   
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: mm1970 on March 17, 2023, 10:13:37 AM
One dumb outcome has been not enough offices for everyone who has come in.
That is not your problem. If they can't provide working space, you can't work. Tell them you can't and wait.

So first, this is my husband not me. And as mentioned above, if all they have is cafeteria space that hurts his back (not office chairs) and is in the open (we try to be COVID cautious), then he’ll badge in, take a few meetings and go home. I’ve also told him to track these instances for a record but I’m not sure he has.

Same issue.  And they keep re-doing things, so a few of our employees keep getting bumped and moved.  To the point that I think we are going to risk having a couple of people quit (newer employees with a lot of experience), because they are getting pissed.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: BuffaloStache on March 21, 2023, 03:48:48 PM
One dumb outcome has been not enough offices for everyone who has come in.
That is not your problem. If they can't provide working space, you can't work. Tell them you can't and wait.

We are running into this very issue at one of my company locations.   They consolidated a couple of locations into one building and implemented workspace sharing during the pandemic.   Now they are talking about requiring all employees to report to the office however, there's one problem: there is no room for everyone to show up at once.

We almost have the opposite at my company, but it's effectively a non-issue. They didn't consolidate physical space during the pandemic, are now asking people to come back "on a regular basis", but do not define what that means. In practice, it plays out where some of my company's buildings are full and bustling with people, but ~50% of the buildings are typically less than 10% occupied because the employees come into the office on sporadic/random days, and typically don't work the entire day in the office. Spoiler alert, I'm one of those latter employees :-)
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: LennStar on March 22, 2023, 05:17:50 AM
Regular means once a month, right? Like regular payments.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: jinga nation on March 22, 2023, 05:47:53 AM
Regular means once a month, right? Like regular payments.
Regular means annually. E.g: filing your taxes, or paying property tax, or vehicle registration, or car insurance payment, or an annual visit to the doctor. ;-p
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: LennStar on March 22, 2023, 07:52:54 AM
Regular means once a month, right? Like regular payments.
Regular means annually. E.g: filing your taxes, or paying property tax, or vehicle registration, or car insurance payment, or an annual visit to the doctor. ;-p
O.o What??? Do you buy a new car each year?

And I wish I only had to go to the doctor once per year... going tomorrow to get my regular allergy med starter for this year. If it goes like last year I will only need to take it 4 month, everything was dead, so not much in the air.
Climate change does have its good sides, but I would still prefer a life without. 
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: dcheesi on March 22, 2023, 08:04:58 AM
Regular means once a month, right? Like regular payments.
Regular means annually. E.g: filing your taxes, or paying property tax, or vehicle registration, or car insurance payment, or an annual visit to the doctor. ;-p
O.o What??? Do you buy a new car each year?

And I wish I only had to go to the doctor once per year... going tomorrow to get my regular allergy med starter for this year. If it goes like last year I will only need to take it 4 month, everything was dead, so not much in the air.
Climate change does have its good sides, but I would still prefer a life without.
In some US states, you have to pay to keep your car registered, which is typically annual, or optionally biennial.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: deborah on March 22, 2023, 08:09:44 AM
Regular means at more or less equal intervals. Your employer pays you regularly - probably weekly, fortnightly or monthly. I suggest that means their definition of a regular basis is similar.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: grantmeaname on March 22, 2023, 08:28:17 AM
O.o What??? Do you buy a new car each year?
Odd choice to throw stones about new cars from a nation where government policy ensures more new car buying and a substantially younger average age of cars than in the US, to support a planet-destroying sector full of bad actors and corporate malfeasance ... and Germany has a annual motor vehicle tax barely different from ours, just not called 'registration'.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: RWD on March 22, 2023, 08:33:37 AM
Regular means once a month, right? Like regular payments.
Regular means annually. E.g: filing your taxes, or paying property tax, or vehicle registration, or car insurance payment, or an annual visit to the doctor. ;-p
O.o What??? Do you buy a new car each year?

And I wish I only had to go to the doctor once per year... going tomorrow to get my regular allergy med starter for this year. If it goes like last year I will only need to take it 4 month, everything was dead, so not much in the air.
Climate change does have its good sides, but I would still prefer a life without.
In some US states, you have to pay to keep your car registered, which is typically annual, or optionally biennial.
Correct. I'm also not aware of any US states that don't require you to continue paying for registration of a vehicle you already own. Many states also charge a value-based tax as part of the registration renewal.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: LennStar on March 22, 2023, 01:43:03 PM
Regular means once a month, right? Like regular payments.
Regular means annually. E.g: filing your taxes, or paying property tax, or vehicle registration, or car insurance payment, or an annual visit to the doctor. ;-p
O.o What??? Do you buy a new car each year?

And I wish I only had to go to the doctor once per year... going tomorrow to get my regular allergy med starter for this year. If it goes like last year I will only need to take it 4 month, everything was dead, so not much in the air.
Climate change does have its good sides, but I would still prefer a life without.
In some US states, you have to pay to keep your car registered, which is typically annual, or optionally biennial.
Correct. I'm also not aware of any US states that don't require you to continue paying for registration of a vehicle you already own. Many states also charge a value-based tax as part of the registration renewal.
Ah, so you don't register every year, the payment is called registration!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: APowers on March 22, 2023, 01:56:13 PM
Regular means once a month, right? Like regular payments.
Regular means annually. E.g: filing your taxes, or paying property tax, or vehicle registration, or car insurance payment, or an annual visit to the doctor. ;-p
O.o What??? Do you buy a new car each year?

And I wish I only had to go to the doctor once per year... going tomorrow to get my regular allergy med starter for this year. If it goes like last year I will only need to take it 4 month, everything was dead, so not much in the air.
Climate change does have its good sides, but I would still prefer a life without.
In some US states, you have to pay to keep your car registered, which is typically annual, or optionally biennial.
Correct. I'm also not aware of any US states that don't require you to continue paying for registration of a vehicle you already own. Many states also charge a value-based tax as part of the registration renewal.
Ah, so you don't register every year, the payment is called registration!
Basically. When the notice comes in the mail, it is a "registration renewal" notice, as RWD said-- for registration to remain current, the taxes/fees must be paid annually, and they give us a little sticker to place on our license plate to show that we've paid for the current year. We just linguistically shorten "registration renewal payment" to "registration".
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Alternatepriorities on March 22, 2023, 11:30:02 PM
Correct. I'm also not aware of any US states that don't require you to continue paying for registration of a vehicle you already own. Many states also charge a value-based tax as part of the registration renewal.

In Alaska it varies by municipality, the state allows permanent tags on vehicles more than 8 years old if the local city or borough agrees. Most of the local governments have adopted the policy including the one I live in. As everything I own is older than 8 years I won't have to register again until i replace on of our vehicles!

I think I left a comment on this thread long ago about the value of FU money and DMV... It was summer of 2020 and the state run DMV office was much grumpier and slower than normal. I was told to expect to spend 6-8 hours there to register one vehicle and one trailer. I could only sign up for a single registration at a time "to speed things up" so I'd have to wait 3-4 hours twice...  I drove 10 miles to MVD express office which is privately run and charges $15 each for registration. Twenty minutes later with everything done I told the clerk "people who say money can't buy happiness have obviously never come here after trying the DMV" and happily paid their fee.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: BicycleB on March 23, 2023, 02:51:56 AM
Correct. I'm also not aware of any US states that don't require you to continue paying for registration of a vehicle you already own. Many states also charge a value-based tax as part of the registration renewal.

In Alaska it varies by municipality, the state allows permanent tags on vehicles more than 8 years old if the local city or borough agrees. Most of the local governments have adopted the policy including the one I live in. As everything I own is older than 8 years I won't have to register again until i replace on of our vehicles!

I think I left a comment on this thread long ago about the value of FU money and DMV... It was summer of 2020 and the state run DMV office was much grumpier and slower than normal. I was told to expect to spend 6-8 hours there to register one vehicle and one trailer. I could only sign up for a single registration at a time "to speed things up" so I'd have to wait 3-4 hours twice...  I drove 10 miles to MVD express office which is privately run and charges $15 each for registration. Twenty minutes later with everything done I told the clerk "people who say money can't buy happiness have obviously never come here after trying the DMV" and happily paid their fee.

Maybe not epic, but I did literally laugh out loud
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: talltexan on March 23, 2023, 10:09:58 AM
I remember the first DMV office I went to, near a University in Charlotte, NC. It did seem like one of the people there genuinely enjoyed witnessing suffering.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Dicey on March 23, 2023, 10:15:59 AM
I remember the first DMV office I went to, near a University in Charlotte, NC. It did seem like one of the people there genuinely enjoyed witnessing suffering.
It's a requirement of the job, IIRC.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Alternatepriorities on March 23, 2023, 11:30:29 AM
Oddly enough only a couple years prior I had a pleasant and efficient visit to that same office. DW stopped in there last Dec (vehicle i registered in 2020 was only 7years old when we got it so it needed renewal to permanent tags) and it only took here 20 minutes. Something is still broken higher up the chain though because the new plates are still not here three months later.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Michael in ABQ on March 23, 2023, 04:43:22 PM
Correct. I'm also not aware of any US states that don't require you to continue paying for registration of a vehicle you already own. Many states also charge a value-based tax as part of the registration renewal.

In Alaska it varies by municipality, the state allows permanent tags on vehicles more than 8 years old if the local city or borough agrees. Most of the local governments have adopted the policy including the one I live in. As everything I own is older than 8 years I won't have to register again until i replace on of our vehicles!

I think I left a comment on this thread long ago about the value of FU money and DMV... It was summer of 2020 and the state run DMV office was much grumpier and slower than normal. I was told to expect to spend 6-8 hours there to register one vehicle and one trailer. I could only sign up for a single registration at a time "to speed things up" so I'd have to wait 3-4 hours twice...  I drove 10 miles to MVD express office which is privately run and charges $15 each for registration. Twenty minutes later with everything done I told the clerk "people who say money can't buy happiness have obviously never come here after trying the DMV" and happily paid their fee.

I lived in Oregon and Washington and the only option was the DMV. When I moved to New Mexico I found that in addition to the government run MVD there were a bunch of private contractors that would just charge an extra $15-20 and be way faster. Needless to say, we've gone with those private entities and happily paid for the convenience. Not to mention there are 2-3 MVD locations in a city of nearly a million but dozens of private locations.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Taran Wanderer on March 23, 2023, 04:48:43 PM
We have a different sort of DMV here I guess. Every time I go, I’m in and out in less than ten minutes, and it’s the best part of my day.  To be fair, I time my visits at less busy times, and if there are more than 1 or 2 people waiting, I come back on a different day, but the customer service is amazing and it’s all done with a smile.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: oneday on March 23, 2023, 05:00:38 PM
I time my visits at less busy times.

At my hometown DMV, these times do not exist.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Taran Wanderer on March 23, 2023, 06:43:01 PM
Location: SF Bay Area, USA

I love the Bay Area, but…
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: iluvzbeach on March 23, 2023, 08:25:45 PM
Location: SF Bay Area, USA

I love the Bay Area, but…

I am not in the Bay Area and I’ve never entered my local DMV without there being at least 100 people in line ahead of me. My DH had an appointment one day for something that had to be done in person and he still waited in line for five hours. Not joking.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Taran Wanderer on March 23, 2023, 11:23:02 PM
That is wild. And horrible.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: bill1827 on March 24, 2023, 03:33:13 AM
As a UK resident the idea of actually going to an office and queuing to pay vehicle tax seems antediluvian. We have had online vehicle tax payment since 2004.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Dicey on March 24, 2023, 05:05:39 AM
As a UK resident the idea of actually going to an office and queuing to pay vehicle tax seems antediluvian. We have had online vehicle tax payment since 2004.
We have online payment options, but some things must be done in person.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: hdatontodo on March 24, 2023, 05:06:09 AM
As a UK resident the idea of actually going to an office and queuing to pay vehicle tax seems antediluvian. We have had online vehicle tax payment since 2004.
I am in Maryland in the US, and there are multiple ways to renew to get the new sticker with the expiration year to put on the rear tag.

https://mva.maryland.gov/vehicles/Pages/registration/renew.aspx

My girlfriend is in New Jersey in the US. NJ does not update tags or stickers upon renewal.



Sent from my SM-G991U1 using Tapatalk
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: bill1827 on March 24, 2023, 07:39:46 AM
As a UK resident the idea of actually going to an office and queuing to pay vehicle tax seems antediluvian. We have had online vehicle tax payment since 2004.
We have online payment options, but some things must be done in person.

O.K.
I got the impression that the only way to do it was in person.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: dcheesi on March 24, 2023, 09:27:38 AM
Location: SF Bay Area, USA

I love the Bay Area, but…

I am not in the Bay Area and I’ve never entered my local DMV without there being at least 100 people in line ahead of me. My DH had an appointment one day for something that had to be done in person and he still waited in line for five hours. Not joking.
Yeah, same in VA & MD, and the COVID restrictions just made it even worse. You had to make an appointment for a specific time, which were so limited that it could be months in the future. And then you got there, and you still had to take a number and wait, seemingly just as long as before.

As a UK resident the idea of actually going to an office and queuing to pay vehicle tax seems antediluvian. We have had online vehicle tax payment since 2004.
We have online payment options, but some things must be done in person.

O.K.
I got the impression that the only way to do it was in person.
The things you have to go in for are things like a new license or some vehicle transactions, where they want to verify your identity and/or original documents. And sometimes with license renewals, they'll want to re-test your vision or something.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: LightTripper on March 24, 2023, 05:30:19 PM
In the UK you have to go to a DVSA test centre to take your test - but I don't remember ever having to go to an actual office either before that (to get my provisional licence) or after that (to get my full licence).  I think the former just required me to fill in a form that I got from the post office and send it off (this was pre-internet - you do it online now) and the latter was sent automatically as far as I can remember. Registering a new (to you) vehicle is all done online. I can't think of a single person I've ever heard of actually going to a physical location to do anything related to car taxation or licensing other than for their test (which you book, so no queuing)....  For a country that theoretically loves queues it seems a bit of a missed opportunity really.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Taran Wanderer on March 24, 2023, 05:45:03 PM
To be fair, vehicle registration renewals are done online here, and if you buy a car at a dealership, they take care of it and then you get your plates and/or stickers in the mail. In-person trips to the DMV are for driver’s license renewals (every 4 or 8 years), registering a car from a private party purchase, or a new driver’s first license. This really cuts down the number of people going to the DMV.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Fresh Bread on March 24, 2023, 06:20:09 PM
Can you start a new thread about the DMV / vehicle regos?
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: talltexan on March 25, 2023, 07:29:08 PM
antediluvian

Great vocab word there!!!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: AccidentialMustache on March 26, 2023, 08:39:06 AM
Here, I can help get y'all back on track.

I'm in tech -- staff software engineer, in specific. My gig has been stressful. The short version is there's the job I was hired for, and then the numerous other jobs I'm moonlighting at (management, product, data analyst, architect), because they need to be done and either aren't being done by the people who should be doing them (not competent or overworked doesn't really matter, either way it is my problem) or are nobody's official job (data analyst/architect).

It became obvious to me as the CEO's tone shifted that layoffs were coming, so I told my manager I volunteered. I'd been considering just quitting, so getting laid off with a likely severance sounded pretty good. It'd also mean if there was a big layoff I didn't get added stress from same-work-even-less-hands afterwards. I didn't manage to tell up the chain, because those folks were busy bailing pre-layoff. Layoff happens, and I'm not laid off. So I told my VP the day after (when he didn't need to meet with people who were being laid off), "hey why don't you just add me to the layoff, I'd already volunteered but clearly the message didn't make it up the chain."

This apparently has Caused Drama and got me scheduled for an hour long 1:1 with said VP. He said, "we really want you to stay, figure out what you want and we'll see about making it happen" so I'd first asked to just be made architect officially, but got hedging from my direct management chain. So I told my VP that I didn't see this working out (if my manager/director isn't behind it, it wouldn't matter if the VP forced it, I'd end up undercut and it wouldn't work anyway) and maybe he should just add me to the layoff like I'd asked. He suggested switching teams instead, since in our discussion he thought I'd be interested in and fit well with the developer productivity team. I agreed with his position on that, but I figured "the req game" would make that a non starter. I'd actually looked at switching to developer productivity 6 months ago but "the req game" killed that and I said as much. My VP had some... uncomplimentary things to say about "the req game" and said he'd step in and use me as a case study to break down said stupid HR game.

So I'll be switching teams (away from my high-stress, millions of $ on the line daily team that manages to deliver anyway despite been consistently underinvested in/understaffed). And when I talked to the manager of the developer productivity team she goes, "You're seriously burnt out and stressed. I want you to join my team... but I want it after you take a serious break from work. At least multiple weeks of vacation, but preferably longer. That is leave-of-absence territory, but if you can swing that level of break, you need it and you have my complete support to take it."

So shortly I'll switch teams... and then shut my laptop down for two months of (unpaid) leave.


Edit: Typing is hard. Fixed missing 'i'
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: SwordGuy on March 26, 2023, 08:58:01 AM
@AccidentialMustache , Bravo!!!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Malossi792 on March 26, 2023, 08:58:19 AM
Here, I can help get y'all back on track.

I'm in tech -- staff software engineer, in specific. My gig has been stressful. The short version is there's the job I was hired for, and then the numerous other jobs I'm moonlighting at (management, product, data analyst, architect), because they need to be done and either aren't being done by the people who should be doing them (not competent or overworked doesn't really matter, either way it is my problem) or are nobody's official job (data analyst/architect).

It became obvious to me as the CEO's tone shifted that layoffs were coming, so I told my manager I volunteered. I'd been considering just quitting, so getting laid off with a likely severance sounded pretty good. It'd also mean if there was a big layoff I didn't get added stress from same-work-even-less-hands afterwards. I didn't manage to tell up the chain, because those folks were busy bailing pre-layoff. Layoff happens, and I'm not laid off. So I told my VP the day after (when he didn't need to meet with people who were being laid off), "hey why don't you just add me to the layoff, I'd already volunteered but clearly the message didn't make it up the chain."

This apparently has Caused Drama and got me scheduled for an hour long 1:1 with said VP. He said, "we really want you to stay, figure out what you want and we'll see about making it happen" so I'd first asked to just be made architect officially, but got hedging from my direct management chain. So I told my VP that I didn't see this working out (if my manager/director isn't behind it, it wouldn't matter if the VP forced it, I'd end up undercut and it wouldn't work anyway) and maybe he should just add me to the layoff like I'd asked. He suggested switching teams instead, since in our discussion he thought I'd be interested in and fit well with the developer productivity team. I agreed with his position on that, but I figured "the req game" would make that a non starter. I'd actually looked at switching to developer productivity 6 months ago but "the req game" killed that and I sad as much. My VP had some... uncomplimentary things to say about "the req game" and said he'd step in and use me as a case study to break down said stupid HR game.

So I'll be switching teams (away from my high-stress, millions of $ on the line daily team that manages to deliver anyway despite been consistently underinvested in/understaffed). And when I talked to the manager of the developer productivity team she goes, "You're seriously burnt out and stressed. I want you to join my team... but I want it after you take a serious break from work. At least multiple weeks of vacation, but preferably longer. That is leave-of-absence territory, but if you can swing that level of break, you need it and you have my complete support to take it."

So shortly I'll switch teams... and then shut my laptop down for two months of (unpaid) leave.
*Slow claps*
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Adventine on March 26, 2023, 09:20:29 AM
@AccidentialMustache best FU story I've read this 2023!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Extramedium on March 26, 2023, 09:59:16 AM
@AccidentalMustache: this just made my day.  Thank you, and congratulations!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Dicey on March 26, 2023, 10:57:47 AM
What a way to get this thread back on track. Good job, @AccidentialMustache!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: bmjohnson35 on March 26, 2023, 11:06:52 AM

Congrats AccidentalMustache!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Taran Wanderer on March 26, 2023, 12:11:16 PM
Wicked cool.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Fresh Bread on March 26, 2023, 01:56:24 PM
Brilliant!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: BicycleB on March 26, 2023, 05:34:17 PM
Mustache accidental, FU epic!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: AccidentialMustache on March 26, 2023, 09:03:08 PM
Thanks, y'all.

It's good to have a reminder like this thread (which I should be better about reading as a reminder) because I'd been holding on for "it'll get better in a month when sister-team can be on-call, but we're working through EU employment regs for that to happen..." for probably about six months now. And I probably shouldn't have been, I should have threatened to quit earlier if the problems weren't fixed, be that a transfer or being officially architect.

But I got there eventually, and pretty on-brand. We tend to the risk adverse, so staying with the devil you know is some awkward form of comfortable.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Gronnie on March 26, 2023, 10:14:09 PM
Only thing that could make it better is if that leave was fully paid.

My employer has "unlimited" PTO. I make full use of it and you can guarantee I would be really trying to take as much as I could if my manager asked me to take a long break!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: AccidentialMustache on March 26, 2023, 10:21:17 PM
I'm also "unlimited PTO" but apparently that means "no more than 3 weeks at a time" and in absolutely no circumstance may it be combined with (during or touching either end of) an unpaid leave of absence.

Otherwise yes, I'd agree, it'd be better as fully paid. Although, to some degree, since they still cover 100% of health premiums and my RSUs keep vesting, I am getting paid -- just not at my normal salary.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: jinga nation on March 27, 2023, 06:53:38 AM
@AccidentialMustache Bravo! That is well-played. Who knew that Management also doesn't like HR? Irritating when titles get in the way of engineers with abilities and skills getting things done.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: LightTripper on March 27, 2023, 04:28:40 PM
Fantastic story - congratulations.  Hope you really enjoy your break and can properly unwind!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: BuffaloStache on March 28, 2023, 07:05:45 AM
I'm also "unlimited PTO" but apparently that means "no more than 3 weeks at a time" and in absolutely no circumstance may it be combined with (during or touching either end of) an unpaid leave of absence.

Otherwise yes, I'd agree, it'd be better as fully paid. Although, to some degree, since they still cover 100% of health premiums and my RSUs keep vesting, I am getting paid -- just not at my normal salary.

Can you take 3 weeks off, "come back" remotely for one half-day, and then leave on an unpaid leave of absence? :-)
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: RWD on March 28, 2023, 07:35:58 AM
I'm also "unlimited PTO" but apparently that means "no more than 3 weeks at a time" and in absolutely no circumstance may it be combined with (during or touching either end of) an unpaid leave of absence.

Otherwise yes, I'd agree, it'd be better as fully paid. Although, to some degree, since they still cover 100% of health premiums and my RSUs keep vesting, I am getting paid -- just not at my normal salary.

Can you take 3 weeks off, "come back" remotely for one half-day, and then leave on an unpaid leave of absence? :-)

I like the way you think
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Gronnie on March 28, 2023, 09:50:34 AM
I'm also "unlimited PTO" but apparently that means "no more than 3 weeks at a time" and in absolutely no circumstance may it be combined with (during or touching either end of) an unpaid leave of absence.

Otherwise yes, I'd agree, it'd be better as fully paid. Although, to some degree, since they still cover 100% of health premiums and my RSUs keep vesting, I am getting paid -- just not at my normal salary.

Can you take 3 weeks off, "come back" remotely for one half-day, and then leave on an unpaid leave of absence? :-)

Brilliant. Sometimes you just need to maliciously comply.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Laura33 on March 28, 2023, 10:19:52 AM
I'm also "unlimited PTO" but apparently that means "no more than 3 weeks at a time" and in absolutely no circumstance may it be combined with (during or touching either end of) an unpaid leave of absence.

Otherwise yes, I'd agree, it'd be better as fully paid. Although, to some degree, since they still cover 100% of health premiums and my RSUs keep vesting, I am getting paid -- just not at my normal salary.

Can you take 3 weeks off, "come back" remotely for one half-day, and then leave on an unpaid leave of absence? :-)

Brilliant. Sometimes you just need to maliciously comply.

"Malicious compliance" is my new favorite phrase. 

It's really the only appropriate response to stupid policies. 
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: RWD on March 28, 2023, 10:49:14 AM
I'm also "unlimited PTO" but apparently that means "no more than 3 weeks at a time" and in absolutely no circumstance may it be combined with (during or touching either end of) an unpaid leave of absence.

Otherwise yes, I'd agree, it'd be better as fully paid. Although, to some degree, since they still cover 100% of health premiums and my RSUs keep vesting, I am getting paid -- just not at my normal salary.

Can you take 3 weeks off, "come back" remotely for one half-day, and then leave on an unpaid leave of absence? :-)

Brilliant. Sometimes you just need to maliciously comply.

"Malicious compliance" is my new favorite phrase. 

It's really the only appropriate response to stupid policies.

Relevant subreddit: https://www.reddit.com/r/MaliciousCompliance/
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Alternatepriorities on April 01, 2023, 02:44:17 PM
Well this has been a crazy week!

The bad news is we won't be going on a year long vagabonding trip this year... The program director and super agree that DW should work less days next year to make her contract fair. The super has also asked her to help design the new admin contracts next year. He's new to the district this past year and apparently really appreciated the way DW explained the problems in her contract. Changing them this year requires going back to the board of directors which means a lot of egg on a lot of people faces. The assistant super who has been a source of much stinginess is leaving this school year which gives me some home the negotiations will actually be in good faith next year.

But the the biggest change since I posted is that we've been asked to adopt a baby! Adopting is something we were considering but not actively pursuing when a friend of a friend reached out in December. By mid January it looked like it probably wasn't going to happen but that changed this week. Last night we met with the family for the first time and while I it is far from certain to happen, we're going to move forward with the process. While adoption is more affordable when the mother chooses you before giving birth it's still going to take real money to make it happen. Doesn't seem like FU money is a appropriate term, but I am thankful to know I can "figure out the money" if everything else works out.

With a decade of accrued unused sick leave, DW could take paid leave for half the year if the adoption goes through. If it doesn't, at least she still likes the work she is doing and the reduced time contract is no longer a total farce, so it looks like were here for at least OMY. If the adoption goes through and the contract negotiations don't go anywhere maybe in a year we'll be planning to slow travel North America with a toddler...

Update:

We brought home a healthy baby boy this week. There is still a ton of paperwork and some logistical hurtles before the adoption is complete, but it doesn't look like there are any major issues. He eats, sleeps and poops, which I understand is exactly what he is supposed to be doing at this point. DW will be on bonding leave completely for a couple of weeks and then have 1/2 time schedule with paid leave for the foreseeable future.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: iluvzbeach on April 01, 2023, 02:52:55 PM
CONGRATULATIONS from this internet stranger. That is terrific news.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Ladychips on April 01, 2023, 07:25:09 PM
Yea for you!  Congratulations!!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: BicycleB on April 02, 2023, 12:28:50 PM
@Alternatepriorities, congratulations!!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: BuffaloStache on April 07, 2023, 03:12:26 PM
echoing others, congrats!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Dicey on April 07, 2023, 03:32:43 PM
Awwww, congratulations to the new AP family!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Catbert on April 08, 2023, 10:43:16 AM
Wow, that was a surprise twist.  Congrats.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: calimom on April 08, 2023, 11:02:14 AM
What a wonderful thing to read! Very happy for the new addition to the AP family!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Alternatepriorities on April 08, 2023, 01:24:13 PM
Thanks everyone!

So far things are going well with DS. He generally seems pretty happy when he's not having a diaper changed. DW did a week long nesting binge the week before he arrived and with some help from friends completely outfitted a nursery for under $400. The theme is "national parks and frugality"... I have a cousin who spent $10,000! I haven't seen her nursery so I have no idea how. DW didn't want to do a baby shower until we were sure it would happen... Now we're set through 6 months except for diapers so I think she's going to have more of a celebration and less of a shower...
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Sibley on April 08, 2023, 02:03:12 PM
Thanks everyone!

So far things are going well with DS. He generally seems pretty happy when he's not having a diaper changed. DW did a week long nesting binge the week before he arrived and with some help from friends completely outfitted a nursery for under $400. The theme is "national parks and frugality"... I have a cousin who spent $10,000! I haven't seen her nursery so I have no idea how. DW didn't want to do a baby shower until we were sure it would happen... Now we're set through 6 months except for diapers so I think she's going to have more of a celebration and less of a shower...

Ask everyone for sizes starting at 6+ months, and diapers.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: AccidentialMustache on April 08, 2023, 10:33:00 PM
Congrats!

If you want to go hardcore, cloth isn't that bad. Yes, you will do laundry every day or few (for us it was every day) and yes you may have to use the dryer (we'd line dry when we could, but sometimes you need a clean set sometime about NOW) but it really wasn't that bad and I'm the one who did the laundry processing. Yes it has a big startup cost but over time will likely save you money over time. Plus you won't dump a ton* of piss filled plastic in the landfill.

Would only recommend if you have a washer/dryer in-home though.

*: Apparently actually a literal half-ton if you believe https://mint.intuit.com/blog/planning/cloth-vs-disposable-diapers-a-cost-comparison-102011/ although the citation is kinda weak.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Alternatepriorities on April 09, 2023, 12:06:28 AM
Ask everyone for sizes starting at 6+ months, and diapers.

I think that's what we're going to do. Hopefully we can also encourage people to get us used stuff. I've been actively working to help many of our friends understand money better, and while I am very grateful for everyone's support it just seems crazy to someone to pay $300 for a new item we can get barely used for $20! It's not like new baby actually wear thing out. (except diapers)

Congrats!

If you want to go hardcore, cloth isn't that bad. Yes, you will do laundry every day or few (for us it was every day) and yes you may have to use the dryer (we'd line dry when we could, but sometimes you need a clean set sometime about NOW) but it really wasn't that bad and I'm the one who did the laundry processing. Yes it has a big startup cost but over time will likely save you money over time. Plus you won't dump a ton* of piss filled plastic in the landfill.

Would only recommend if you have a washer/dryer in-home though.

*: Apparently actually a literal half-ton if you believe https://mint.intuit.com/blog/planning/cloth-vs-disposable-diapers-a-cost-comparison-102011/ although the citation is kinda weak.

I might look into that once I feel like i have a grip on how it works. I have memories of my parents doing clothe diapers for my younger siblings and they are not very pleasant. We did not have a washer and dryer at home though and I suspect the diapers themselves have come a long way in the past three decades.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Valley of Plenty on April 09, 2023, 04:27:20 AM
Not my FU money story, but rather my GF's.

GF and I have a trip to Germany planned this summer. Going to be spending just short of two weeks there, ending with a 5 day music festival. Trip has been planned since May of last year. Plane tickets were bought in January.

GF works as a lab assistant at the local hospital. She's currently working full time while also doing online classes for an MLT degree (Medical Laboratory Technician). She's not a Mustachian, but she is frugal and very financially responsible, so despite only making about $55k a year she still saves a considerable amount of her income (I don't know exactly how much, but probably close to 50% of her take home). As a result, she's in a very good spot financially (a year of expenses in savings plus about the same amount invested in the market) and understands that she has FU money.

She put her PTO request in for the Germany trip back in January when the plane tickets were purchased. PTO was approved, no issues. Fast forward to 3 weeks ago, GF gets sick. Ends up being COVID, and hospital requires that she not return to work until symptom free. This ends up being about 2 weeks. At beginning of quarantine period GF speaks with HR representative over the phone and asks about the time off will be handled in terms of filing for short term disability, using PTO, etcetera. Is told that her PTO will not be impacted if she files for short term disability. Sweet!

GF returns to work after recovering from COVID to be told that actually her PTO *was* used, and now she doesn't have enough to cover the Germany trip this summer. Oops! Manager says she will need to "change her trip plans" now that she doesn't have enough PTO. GF explains that she will not be changing her travel plans, and that despite the fact that she was told by HR that her PTO would not be impacted by her sick leave, she is fine with just taking unpaid leave if necessary for the vacation. Manager says nope, "We can't give you that much time off without PTO." GF says "Alright, well then consider this my notice that I'll be quitting when I leave for my trip in July."

Manager is gobsmacked. "You'd risk your job over a trip?" GF explains that though she likes her job and the people she works with, she doesn't need the job and they are not paying her enough to issue her ultimatums. She tells them that she can easily find a job that pays more than what they are paying her (which is absolutely true, there are entry level factory jobs in our area that pay more with no experience needed) and the trip has more value to her than the job.

Next day at work manager states that they are going to allow her the time off and expresses a desire to further incentivize her to stay with the company.

Moral of the story? Middle managers fear workers with FU Money.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Dicey on April 09, 2023, 06:02:52 AM
^Your GF sounds like a keeper.^
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Frugal Lizard on April 09, 2023, 06:38:03 AM
^Your GF sounds like a keeper.^
heck yes!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Zamboni on April 09, 2023, 06:38:14 AM
Great use of FU money, @Valley of Plenty 's girlfriend!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: grantmeaname on April 09, 2023, 07:01:40 AM
idk why you say she's not a mustachian. 50% savings rate on that income and a big middle finger for the petty tyrants in an entry level job sounds perfectly mustachian to me
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Malossi792 on April 09, 2023, 07:31:47 AM
idk why you say she's not a mustachian. 50% savings rate on that income and a big middle finger for the petty tyrants in an entry level job sounds perfectly mustachian to me
+1
Great story, too!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: SwordGuy on April 09, 2023, 07:33:22 AM
^Your GF sounds like a keeper.^
heck yes!

Great common sense and lots of moxie!   A great combination!   
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Valley of Plenty on April 09, 2023, 05:58:24 PM
idk why you say she's not a mustachian. 50% savings rate on that income and a big middle finger for the petty tyrants in an entry level job sounds perfectly mustachian to me

She certainly lives a Mustachian lifestyle, I just meant that she doesn't identify as such. The difference is mostly semantic I suppose :)
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: BlueHouse on April 09, 2023, 08:04:47 PM

Then I sent an email to my contact at the third-party company (it was a response to her "we can't change our standard contract" message) saying "I think we're finished here."  When a manger got back to me (quite quickly, compared to the previous pace of responses) I got to reply with "which part of "I think we're finished here" was unclear? Please delete my information from your computers."

Then I went for a walk in the sun, which was lovely!

Good for you.  The unfortunate part is that these companies act this way because they take advantage of so many people who either don't read the contract or agree to verbal assurances. 

Love the part about taking a walk in the sun.

Awesome for jeninco! 

And yes, many people don't read the contract, and I'll just add that many others don't realize that they don't have to wait for someone else to modify the contract.  I've been in nearly identical situations and I've found that the contracting officials or managers at these companies typically don't have enough experience and just don't feel comfortable modifying a standard form.  So they think they can't   I've crossed out entire blocks of text, changed terms, changed dates and significant parts of the "standard" form just by writing over it and initialling it.  Then I sign and return.  More often than not they sign it without further changes.  If it does require a change, I've given them a starting point. 

Of course, my contracts were always kind of small (under $1M over a period of a year or more), so I don't think anyone senior was working on it, and when I submitted changes, all the person had to do was show it to someone more senior to get it approved. 

So many of the terms Jen identified have shown up in my contracts too.  Not getting paid for 30 days after the prime contractor gets paid is one of the craziest but it's so common, I assume many people sign it.  I always cross it out and when there's pushback (almost always), I just say "I have no control over when or how you get paid, and it has nothing to do with the work that you're hiring me to do".  I honestly feel as if I'm educating their legal rep when I sign a contract with them. I know they're learning things and have just never questioned "the way things are done"

Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: jeninco on April 10, 2023, 08:51:06 AM

Then I sent an email to my contact at the third-party company (it was a response to her "we can't change our standard contract" message) saying "I think we're finished here."  When a manger got back to me (quite quickly, compared to the previous pace of responses) I got to reply with "which part of "I think we're finished here" was unclear? Please delete my information from your computers."

Then I went for a walk in the sun, which was lovely!

Good for you.  The unfortunate part is that these companies act this way because they take advantage of so many people who either don't read the contract or agree to verbal assurances. 

Love the part about taking a walk in the sun.

Awesome for jeninco! 

And yes, many people don't read the contract, and I'll just add that many others don't realize that they don't have to wait for someone else to modify the contract.  I've been in nearly identical situations and I've found that the contracting officials or managers at these companies typically don't have enough experience and just don't feel comfortable modifying a standard form.  So they think they can't   I've crossed out entire blocks of text, changed terms, changed dates and significant parts of the "standard" form just by writing over it and initialling it.  Then I sign and return.  More often than not they sign it without further changes.  If it does require a change, I've given them a starting point. 

Of course, my contracts were always kind of small (under $1M over a period of a year or more), so I don't think anyone senior was working on it, and when I submitted changes, all the person had to do was show it to someone more senior to get it approved. 

So many of the terms Jen identified have shown up in my contracts too.  Not getting paid for 30 days after the prime contractor gets paid is one of the craziest but it's so common, I assume many people sign it.  I always cross it out and when there's pushback (almost always), I just say "I have no control over when or how you get paid, and it has nothing to do with the work that you're hiring me to do".  I honestly feel as if I'm educating their legal rep when I sign a contract with them. I know they're learning things and have just never questioned "the way things are done"

I was intending to do this (cross out and initial portions of the contract), but it's an electronic document, and they required that it be e-signed (in its entirety). Which means they'd have to make the changes on THEIR side, which they persistently refused to do.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: mm1970 on April 10, 2023, 01:51:23 PM
Not my FU money story, but rather my GF's.

GF and I have a trip to Germany planned this summer. Going to be spending just short of two weeks there, ending with a 5 day music festival. Trip has been planned since May of last year. Plane tickets were bought in January.

GF works as a lab assistant at the local hospital. She's currently working full time while also doing online classes for an MLT degree (Medical Laboratory Technician). She's not a Mustachian, but she is frugal and very financially responsible, so despite only making about $55k a year she still saves a considerable amount of her income (I don't know exactly how much, but probably close to 50% of her take home). As a result, she's in a very good spot financially (a year of expenses in savings plus about the same amount invested in the market) and understands that she has FU money.

She put her PTO request in for the Germany trip back in January when the plane tickets were purchased. PTO was approved, no issues. Fast forward to 3 weeks ago, GF gets sick. Ends up being COVID, and hospital requires that she not return to work until symptom free. This ends up being about 2 weeks. At beginning of quarantine period GF speaks with HR representative over the phone and asks about the time off will be handled in terms of filing for short term disability, using PTO, etcetera. Is told that her PTO will not be impacted if she files for short term disability. Sweet!

GF returns to work after recovering from COVID to be told that actually her PTO *was* used, and now she doesn't have enough to cover the Germany trip this summer. Oops! Manager says she will need to "change her trip plans" now that she doesn't have enough PTO. GF explains that she will not be changing her travel plans, and that despite the fact that she was told by HR that her PTO would not be impacted by her sick leave, she is fine with just taking unpaid leave if necessary for the vacation. Manager says nope, "We can't give you that much time off without PTO." GF says "Alright, well then consider this my notice that I'll be quitting when I leave for my trip in July."

Manager is gobsmacked. "You'd risk your job over a trip?" GF explains that though she likes her job and the people she works with, she doesn't need the job and they are not paying her enough to issue her ultimatums. She tells them that she can easily find a job that pays more than what they are paying her (which is absolutely true, there are entry level factory jobs in our area that pay more with no experience needed) and the trip has more value to her than the job.

Next day at work manager states that they are going to allow her the time off and expresses a desire to further incentivize her to stay with the company.

Moral of the story? Middle managers fear workers with FU Money.
This is awesome, and as I read it - I knew the outcome ahead of time, but it was still a great read.

This kind of thing gobsmacks me.  I have never ever changed vacation plans for any of my companies.  I plan MONTHS ahead.  Sure, I occasionally will call in on PTO, if it's a staycation, or if I'm taking 2 weeks visiting family in the summer.

But I've worked with people (at my same companies) who do this and expect others too and ... nope.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: scottish on April 10, 2023, 03:36:37 PM
Not my FU money story, but rather my GF's.

GF and I have a trip to Germany planned this summer. Going to be spending just short of two weeks there, ending with a 5 day music festival. Trip has been planned since May of last year. Plane tickets were bought in January.

GF works as a lab assistant at the local hospital. She's currently working full time while also doing online classes for an MLT degree (Medical Laboratory Technician). She's not a Mustachian, but she is frugal and very financially responsible, so despite only making about $55k a year she still saves a considerable amount of her income (I don't know exactly how much, but probably close to 50% of her take home). As a result, she's in a very good spot financially (a year of expenses in savings plus about the same amount invested in the market) and understands that she has FU money.

She put her PTO request in for the Germany trip back in January when the plane tickets were purchased. PTO was approved, no issues. Fast forward to 3 weeks ago, GF gets sick. Ends up being COVID, and hospital requires that she not return to work until symptom free. This ends up being about 2 weeks. At beginning of quarantine period GF speaks with HR representative over the phone and asks about the time off will be handled in terms of filing for short term disability, using PTO, etcetera. Is told that her PTO will not be impacted if she files for short term disability. Sweet!

GF returns to work after recovering from COVID to be told that actually her PTO *was* used, and now she doesn't have enough to cover the Germany trip this summer. Oops! Manager says she will need to "change her trip plans" now that she doesn't have enough PTO. GF explains that she will not be changing her travel plans, and that despite the fact that she was told by HR that her PTO would not be impacted by her sick leave, she is fine with just taking unpaid leave if necessary for the vacation. Manager says nope, "We can't give you that much time off without PTO." GF says "Alright, well then consider this my notice that I'll be quitting when I leave for my trip in July."

Manager is gobsmacked. "You'd risk your job over a trip?" GF explains that though she likes her job and the people she works with, she doesn't need the job and they are not paying her enough to issue her ultimatums. She tells them that she can easily find a job that pays more than what they are paying her (which is absolutely true, there are entry level factory jobs in our area that pay more with no experience needed) and the trip has more value to her than the job.

Next day at work manager states that they are going to allow her the time off and expresses a desire to further incentivize her to stay with the company.

Moral of the story? Middle managers fear workers with FU Money.
This is awesome, and as I read it - I knew the outcome ahead of time, but it was still a great read.

This kind of thing gobsmacks me.  I have never ever changed vacation plans for any of my companies.  I plan MONTHS ahead.  Sure, I occasionally will call in on PTO, if it's a staycation, or if I'm taking 2 weeks visiting family in the summer.

But I've worked with people (at my same companies) who do this and expect others too and ... nope.

I remember - back in 2010 - I answered work email on vacation once.   Big mistake.   I highly recommend no access to work email on vacation.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Taran Wanderer on April 10, 2023, 04:41:29 PM
Yeah, I always wonder about people who check their email daily while on vacation. That would suck up at least an hour of active attention and several hours of mental energy, draining away the whole re-charge aspect of vacation. Solution? Backpacking in the wilderness with no cell service. Or international travel where it’s “too expensive”.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: ATtiny85 on April 10, 2023, 05:26:21 PM
I sometimes scan email once in a while when out of the office. Just in case there is a “can’t find the firehose” situation where 30 seconds can save three days effort upon return. Might spend about a minute every couple days doing a scan on my phone. If that really, and only when I am expecting something. Though now that I am an individual contributor after many years as a supervisor, I rarely am expecting anything except for the yearly bonus amount email that comes out while I am always on vacation over Thanksgiving week. And for sure the laptop stays in the home office whenever I go anywhere. The balance works well for me.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: charis on April 10, 2023, 06:09:43 PM
I sometimes scan email once in a while when out of the office. Just in case there is a “can’t find the firehose” situation where 30 seconds can save three days effort upon return. Might spend about a minute every couple days doing a scan on my phone. If that really, and only when I am expecting something. Though now that I am an individual contributor after many years as a supervisor, I rarely am expecting anything except for the yearly bonus amount email that comes out while I am always on vacation over Thanksgiving week. And for sure the laptop stays in the home office whenever I go anywhere. The balance works well for me.

Same to the bolded. I tend to have some team members that will blow up something that I can adequately address in a short email.  I won't respond unless absolutely necessary to save myself a hassle but I do glance at my email.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: LennStar on April 11, 2023, 12:02:53 AM
Vacation is to get your head free wof work and relax. I can't see how reading work emails helps with that.

If you are in a position where you might really be needed, in an emergency your secretary or boss or teammate whatever can have your phone number. And if they call, if you have to work, it's a work day not a vacation and if you are away of course the hotel costs etc. for that one day have to be paid by the company.

That makes sure that you are only called when needed - not wanted.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: ATtiny85 on April 11, 2023, 05:20:14 AM
Vacation is to get your head free wof work and relax. I can't see how reading work emails helps with that.

If you are in a position where you might really be needed, in an emergency your secretary or boss or teammate whatever can have your phone number. And if they call, if you have to work, it's a work day not a vacation and if you are away of course the hotel costs etc. for that one day have to be paid by the company.

That makes sure that you are only called when needed - not wanted.

I generally agree, but I do think you need to consider the total situation. When I lived and worked in Germany (Stuttgart automotive) my German coworkers taught me about needing a full three weeks to fully unwind. However, that same crew was often working deep into the evening. I found that to be insane and only let myself get caught up in one 11pm idiotic "Feierabend" where we were working on a basic design problem. Nope. I can see why that crew needed three week holidays. Not me, I walk out at 4pm, partly because that's long enough, and partly to be a good example to my people (when I had people.)

Just a small viewpoint, not meant to be argumentative. I will say that the crew was very very good about work coverage, and were empowered and able to make a lot of decisions for someone who was out. That was a nice piece of it, and something I have found lacking in my other two companies, and that likely adds to the problem.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Captain FIRE on April 11, 2023, 11:27:25 AM
Vacation is to get your head free wof work and relax. I can't see how reading work emails helps with that.

If you are in a position where you might really be needed, in an emergency your secretary or boss or teammate whatever can have your phone number. And if they call, if you have to work, it's a work day not a vacation and if you are away of course the hotel costs etc. for that one day have to be paid by the company.

That makes sure that you are only called when needed - not wanted.

I generally agree, but I do think you need to consider the total situation. When I lived and worked in Germany (Stuttgart automotive) my German coworkers taught me about needing a full three weeks to fully unwind. However, that same crew was often working deep into the evening. I found that to be insane and only let myself get caught up in one 11pm idiotic "Feierabend" where we were working on a basic design problem. Nope. I can see why that crew needed three week holidays. Not me, I walk out at 4pm, partly because that's long enough, and partly to be a good example to my people (when I had people.)

Just a small viewpoint, not meant to be argumentative. I will say that the crew was very very good about work coverage, and were empowered and able to make a lot of decisions for someone who was out. That was a nice piece of it, and something I have found lacking in my other two companies, and that likely adds to the problem.

Yeah, @LennStar I think this is a bit projecting what you feel onto others.

Some people need to get away entirely to recharge.
Some people need to get away entirely to meet regulatory requirements (e.g. banking in some positions requires a full week off for fraud reasons).
Some people prefer to keep an eye on things so nothing blows up majorly while they are out. This may entail skimming key emails, forwarding emails to people covering or sometimes writing a short response.
Some people like to know what they are walking into on their return, but don't actual do anything with the emails they read.
Some people don't want their colleagues/bosses/subordinates to have to expend 10x energy that would take them a fraction of the time. Usually this favor is returned when those others are on vacation.

What works for you might not work for others. They are big kids, they get to decide what works best for them and you get to decide what works for you.

- A new employee who just choose to put work email on her phone to read it while away in case anything critical needs to be forwarded, and discovered I'm eligible for a $50/month phone subsidy for doing so. :)
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: LennStar on April 11, 2023, 01:00:15 PM
Yeah, @LennStar I think this is a bit projecting what you feel onto others.
Might be, but more important it's scientific result and more or less law here in Germany - I took that "company pays for hotel when employee told to work" from a court case - one about a manager that even had in his contract to be always available if I remember correctly. Because here it's law that you take your holiday.
In a way even if you are working purely out of your own free will, you are in breach of your work contract, because the worker is to avoid damaging his working power through his actions, and a vacation has the goal to renew those powers.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Captain FIRE on April 11, 2023, 01:52:36 PM
It’s most definitely not the law in the US (aside from certain employees in highly regulated areas like banking noted above).
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Michael in ABQ on April 11, 2023, 02:18:21 PM
Yeah, @LennStar I think this is a bit projecting what you feel onto others.
Might be, but more important it's scientific result and more or less law here in Germany - I took that "company pays for hotel when employee told to work" from a court case - one about a manager that even had in his contract to be always available if I remember correctly. Because here it's law that you take your holiday.
In a way even if you are working purely out of your own free will, you are in breach of your work contract, because the worker is to avoid damaging his working power through his actions, and a vacation has the goal to renew those powers.

Are these work contracts fairly standard across employers/industries? Is there a whole industry of attorneys and consultants to help negotiate them?

Most employment in the US does not include a written contract. Or there may be some company policy or employee handbook that you have to sign, but those are more for liability protection for the company so they can later show "Our employee handbook says if you show up drunk to work you can be fired" or something along those lines. If you're working for a small business there's almost certainly no written contract or anything beyond a job description that was included in the job posting. I have an employee for my business, and everything was verbal "Would you like a job doing X, Y, and Z at $ per hour" "Yes" "Ok, you'll start on Monday".
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Extramedium on April 11, 2023, 02:43:33 PM
idk why you say she's not a mustachian. 50% savings rate on that income and a big middle finger for the petty tyrants in an entry level job sounds perfectly mustachian to me

She certainly lives a Mustachian lifestyle, I just meant that she doesn't identify as such. The difference is mostly semantic I suppose :)

I don't think you need to know what "Mustachian" means to be a model Mustachian.  Pete didn't try to be a Mustachian until he invented the character for the blog.  He was just being himself.

Great story!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: LennStar on April 11, 2023, 11:56:11 PM
Yeah, @LennStar I think this is a bit projecting what you feel onto others.
Might be, but more important it's scientific result and more or less law here in Germany - I took that "company pays for hotel when employee told to work" from a court case - one about a manager that even had in his contract to be always available if I remember correctly. Because here it's law that you take your holiday.
In a way even if you are working purely out of your own free will, you are in breach of your work contract, because the worker is to avoid damaging his working power through his actions, and a vacation has the goal to renew those powers.

Are these work contracts fairly standard across employers/industries? Is there a whole industry of attorneys and consultants to help negotiate them?

No, those things are generally not in contracts. For various reasons, not least the company does not want it, but also because in most companies nobody would think about calling Jonny Worker during their vacation. Managers are different, as are e.g. IT guys if the server room has a fire, but that is where those court rulings come from.

And yes, everyone here has a written contract, though most of them are some sort of standard that of course isn't too friendly for workers. But if you are so important that you get called in your vacation, you probably have a non-standard one.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Valley of Plenty on April 13, 2023, 04:31:50 AM
Not my FU money story, but rather my GF's.

GF and I have a trip to Germany planned this summer. Going to be spending just short of two weeks there, ending with a 5 day music festival. Trip has been planned since May of last year. Plane tickets were bought in January.

GF works as a lab assistant at the local hospital. She's currently working full time while also doing online classes for an MLT degree (Medical Laboratory Technician). She's not a Mustachian, but she is frugal and very financially responsible, so despite only making about $55k a year she still saves a considerable amount of her income (I don't know exactly how much, but probably close to 50% of her take home). As a result, she's in a very good spot financially (a year of expenses in savings plus about the same amount invested in the market) and understands that she has FU money.

She put her PTO request in for the Germany trip back in January when the plane tickets were purchased. PTO was approved, no issues. Fast forward to 3 weeks ago, GF gets sick. Ends up being COVID, and hospital requires that she not return to work until symptom free. This ends up being about 2 weeks. At beginning of quarantine period GF speaks with HR representative over the phone and asks about the time off will be handled in terms of filing for short term disability, using PTO, etcetera. Is told that her PTO will not be impacted if she files for short term disability. Sweet!

GF returns to work after recovering from COVID to be told that actually her PTO *was* used, and now she doesn't have enough to cover the Germany trip this summer. Oops! Manager says she will need to "change her trip plans" now that she doesn't have enough PTO. GF explains that she will not be changing her travel plans, and that despite the fact that she was told by HR that her PTO would not be impacted by her sick leave, she is fine with just taking unpaid leave if necessary for the vacation. Manager says nope, "We can't give you that much time off without PTO." GF says "Alright, well then consider this my notice that I'll be quitting when I leave for my trip in July."

Manager is gobsmacked. "You'd risk your job over a trip?" GF explains that though she likes her job and the people she works with, she doesn't need the job and they are not paying her enough to issue her ultimatums. She tells them that she can easily find a job that pays more than what they are paying her (which is absolutely true, there are entry level factory jobs in our area that pay more with no experience needed) and the trip has more value to her than the job.

Next day at work manager states that they are going to allow her the time off and expresses a desire to further incentivize her to stay with the company.

Moral of the story? Middle managers fear workers with FU Money.
This is awesome, and as I read it - I knew the outcome ahead of time, but it was still a great read.

This kind of thing gobsmacks me.  I have never ever changed vacation plans for any of my companies.  I plan MONTHS ahead.  Sure, I occasionally will call in on PTO, if it's a staycation, or if I'm taking 2 weeks visiting family in the summer.

But I've worked with people (at my same companies) who do this and expect others too and ... nope.

My very first job out of high school was at a factory, making minimum wage ($7.25/hr). When I started the job I informed them that I had a family trip to Hawaii coming up in 2 months, and asked if they would be okay with giving me that time off (about a week and a half). They said they would have to evaluate their staffing needs closer to the date but it shouldn't be a problem. Fast forward 6 weeks and I followed up with my manager to ask if they were going to give me time off for my trip, which was now in 2 weeks. They said that we were too busy and they weren't going to be able to do it.

Manager's exact words were "You're going to have to decide what's more important. That trip or your job."

My response was "You're paying me minimum wage and this is a trip to Hawaii. That's an easy choice to make."

I was still living with parents at the time so I basically had no expenses. Put in some applications before leaving for Hawaii and had a job offer somewhere else for more money before I got back home. This was a decade ago and I still can't believe they were delusional enough to give me an ultimatum over a minimum wage job. Beyond delusional.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: ATtiny85 on April 13, 2023, 04:37:19 AM
Nicely done! Being aware at that age (assuming you were a “kid”) is awesome. Easier to be pressured/bullied in the early days.

(How was the vacation?)
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: jinga nation on April 13, 2023, 12:40:25 PM
BLUF: Planning on leaving a well-paid job due to false promises, bad contracting, and insufficient staffing, while being able to sleep well and not worry. That's FU Money power.

Not epic, so far, but could be as things happen...

Started with a new company recently, huge raise from previous employer.
The technical lead on this project and the project manager, who don't work for my employer, told my corporate boss that I should be more proactive and accept additional tasks and it'll be great for my career. This is only 30 days in, while I still didn't have access to the SW development tools, accounts, etc, and was going thru the customer site's processes. My corporate boss and his boss started raising their voices in the meeting, without listening to me. Red Flag 1.
New position's requirements were A, B, C. Now they've added D, E, F, G to it. I've pushed back. They know I'm not going to fold. I know they don't like my attitude. Also want me to work on software sales (which I have zero training in, and don't know the product). Red Flag 2.
During recruiting, was told that I'd be a member of a team (employees of other companies) which was fully staffed and that I was to be at the customer site daily. (Don't have an issue with the commute, I enjoy a hybrid/onsite schedule.) Turns out that everyone on this team works multiple contracts, and none of them are full-time onsite, not even 50%. Plus, the other teams I'm supposed to work with onsite, they work from home 3+ days a week. So I'm wondering how do I get tasks accomplished, especially since most of my work is on internal networks that are inaccessible from home. Red Flag 3.
I was told that I'd be starting my own team soon. The contract I'm on is up for renewal in a couple of months, and it'll get renewed. But the idea of building my team is dead, that plan was hijacked by another larger firm on the same contract. My employer knew this, but didn't tell me. Red Flag 4.

Wrote down pros/cons of old employer vs new one. Discussed with my wife. Talked to ex-coworkers, my old position hasn't been filled. Ex-employer has trouble filling openings. Ex-CW-1 is going to talk to his boss, my ex-boss, to have me come back. Informed Ex-CW-2 about new employer's Red Flags, as they're trying to recruit them. Ex-CW-1 gets to collect hiring bonus bounty on me.

I told wife not to worry, there aren't enough IT/SW engineers with DoD clearance, that I'd be getting LinkedIn offers like crazy if I set my profile to #OpenToWork. Also we have enough in emergency account that I don't have to work for a couple of years. We're technically FI. House is paid off. Rental income covers our living expenses. I could stay home, work out daily, longer bike rides, cook 3 meals daily, do yard work, get bathrooms renovated, start the vegetable/herb garden we've always wanted, volunteer at the school. And spend time with my retired dad. Told my wife it'd be my dream come true to be a house husband / kept man / soccer-sports dad.
With the political bumfuckery in my state, I could even home school my kids, if their very good schools got proper fucked.

UPDATE: ex-CW-1 said ex-boss wants me to return and will reach out. Meeting ex-CW-1 tomorrow to discuss more.

UPDATE2: talked to ex-boss today. They want me back; we talked compensation and start date. Fingers crossed. Initially getting my old position, plus additional responsibilities to work part-time with an automation team - something that I had wanted to do last year but could contractually. They won a new long-term contract and more, opening up possibilities to pick & choose what I can dabble in. Have fun AND get paid.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Dicey on April 13, 2023, 11:39:12 PM
^Fingers crossed.^
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Minion on April 14, 2023, 01:15:46 AM
Sending all my best vibes this works out in your favour
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: jfer_rose on April 14, 2023, 06:21:17 AM
@jinga nation I am cheering you on whatever you decide but especially hoping you quit your job entirely and live out your house husband dreams!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Sandi_k on April 14, 2023, 11:01:37 AM
@jinga nation - one of the things I love about this community is its resilience. Your willingness to pay attention to Red Flag warnings is an excellent trait.

My BFF many years ago refused to go back to the job she had left, the institution where I had been able to get her introduced, temped, and later permanently employed. She went off to the private sector during the dot com bubble, and was convinced she was gonna strike it big. For various reasons (poor judgment!), she got sacked after just a month at a tech firm, and then started 2+ years of under employment. She *finally* came back, but that two year gap meant she started back as an entry level applicant, and she never advanced after that.

I am glad that you can look at the situation and make a strategic retrench decision. Having a decent organization as we eke out the last few years until FI is an excellent outcome. Fingers are crossed.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: jinga nation on April 14, 2023, 01:55:59 PM
My BFF many years ago refused to go back to the job she had left, the institution where I had been able to get her introduced, temped, and later permanently employed. She went off to the private sector during the dot com bubble, and was convinced she was gonna strike it big. For various reasons (poor judgment!), she got sacked after just a month at a tech firm, and then started 2+ years of under employment. She *finally* came back, but that two year gap meant she started back as an entry level applicant, and she never advanced after that.

I am glad that you can look at the situation and make a strategic retrench decision. Having a decent organization as we eke out the last few years until FI is an excellent outcome. Fingers are crossed.

In my industry, it is very common for IT sysadmins and SW engineers to go back to a previous employer, because of cultural fit. This is normal. No eating crow or walk of shame. It's like investing: the best time to make an investment was yesterday, the second best time is today. I had lunch with ex-coworker today, who reminded me of these points.
We're both FI and were arguing in public, amicably, to try and buy the other lunch. Had to settle by the Asian Families' Rule of Payment: Oldest one gets the honor.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Must_ache on April 17, 2023, 02:18:41 PM
I work as an actuary at an insurance company, make good money, and am only about 2-4 years from calling it quits.  I could certainly stop now, but the $ and vacation are pretty good.  I have a lot of independence at work and only pester my boss when I have someone important enough to ask him.  A co-worker asks me to figure something out so I do, it's not difficult and I report my calculations and suggestions at a teleconference that my boss normally attends but isn't at this time.  I'm just sharing information, the decision will be made collectively.  Later after the meeting I send out an email with more details on the subject, and this is the first time my boss gets wind of what is going on.

I have a great boss, very smart and supportive, so let me tell you first that what you are about to hear is the exception to the rule.  He made some incorrect assumptions when he read that email and replied to everyone basically saying that I was out of line with my suggestion.  The next day as I come in three of my coworkers expressed surprise at his reaction.  I ask him why are you embarrassing me like this, I know how to do these calculations and of course I wasn't recommending what he was thinking, but something else.  It was apparent to everyone else.  Rather than apologize he doubled down and said that i should have informed him of what was going on, but the simple truth is that if he had taken three mintues to call me first and get clarification none of this would have happened.

Well I'm concerned now, and annoyed.  I do lots of things without him knowing, and if he can't trust me with X then maybe he should be seeing U, V, W, Y, and Z as well.  So I send him everything I'm working on and offer to have him involved in everything so this doesn't happen.  He proceeds to call me, and usually he is cool calm and collected but this time is it 10 seconds of poor language telling me to stop it.  Of course he calls so I don't have proof, but nevertheless I write down the essence of what he said.  Then he sends an email telling me to take the day off and cool down, to even go home if I like.

I email to him, that's alright I should have no problem writing him up to HR here at work and I spend the remaining 1/2 day writing up a word document showing the emails and how he was clearly at fault.  At this point I legitimately wonder if he will take it out on me at some point and I may as well exercise my rights.  Later on he contacts me (don't remember if it was email or phone) and doesn't apologize but says he doesn't have any issue with me, and that he has been nice to me in the past when I have complained to him (much more reasonably) about other things.  I respond by telling him that if he things we can put this behind us, it is true that he has been very good the other 99% of the time and I'll let it slide. 

So I still have the documentation lying around, but no intention of using it.  I have every reason to believe he will be reasonable, and as I only aspire to stick around a few more years there isn't much he can really do to me.  I'm the only actuary here and he would be a fool to get rid of me and put someone in here with no training of how things work.  So I was able to stand up for myself when my boss was in the wrong.  And they both worked happily ever after.  So far so good.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: LennStar on April 17, 2023, 02:37:06 PM
Everyone can have a bad day (or bad week or even month) and you often don't know what it is. (And everyone is a asshole from time to time.)

I once, for about 3-4 months had quite high blood pressure. (Which, contrary was others say, is not the reason for being "loud".) Reason? My father was dying = stress. 

Would I have talked about that at work? Probably not at all.
If your boss has been good for years, it's unlikely that will change.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: charis on April 17, 2023, 02:42:12 PM
@Must_ache, I would recommend that you email that document to your HR rep and indicate that you would like the issue to be documented but you do not wish to take action at this time because you were able to resolve it with your boss verbally and are currently satisfied with his response.  A contemporaneous writing carries more weight than if you have to produce this document later if something else occurs.  I understand you aren't too concerned right now, but he's unwillingness to apologize, note of his prior niceness, and reference to your history of complaints suggests to me that he has already spoken to HR about this situation.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Taran Wanderer on April 17, 2023, 02:49:41 PM
I’d hold off on the HR notification. There are lots of other stressors that could have tilted your boss to reacting negatively. Remember, the boss is a person, too. Maybe there are upper management pressures or demands. Maybe there is something going on in his personal life. If you’ve worked for/with this person for a long time, could you ask for a phone call and then ask him if he’s doing okay?  It sounds like you’re ratcheting things up which will only increase the pressure on him.  Definitely keep the documentation and be ready to use if you need it, but treat your boss like a person first, like you would like to be treated if you ever crossed the line.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: charis on April 17, 2023, 04:15:12 PM
I’d hold off on the HR notification. There are lots of other stressors that could have tilted your boss to reacting negatively. Remember, the boss is a person, too. Maybe there are upper management pressures or demands. Maybe there is something going on in his personal life. If you’ve worked for/with this person for a long time, could you ask for a phone call and then ask him if he’s doing okay?  It sounds like you’re ratcheting things up which will only increase the pressure on him.  Definitely keep the documentation and be ready to use if you need it, but treat your boss like a person first, like you would like to be treated if you ever crossed the line.

Based on my experience with employment disputes, I'm fairly confident that the boss contacted HR right after the OP mentioned it first and he probably received advice on how to respond.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: scottish on April 17, 2023, 05:38:57 PM
I’d hold off on the HR notification. There are lots of other stressors that could have tilted your boss to reacting negatively. Remember, the boss is a person, too. Maybe there are upper management pressures or demands. Maybe there is something going on in his personal life. If you’ve worked for/with this person for a long time, could you ask for a phone call and then ask him if he’s doing okay?  It sounds like you’re ratcheting things up which will only increase the pressure on him.  Definitely keep the documentation and be ready to use if you need it, but treat your boss like a person first, like you would like to be treated if you ever crossed the line.

Based on my experience with employment disputes, I'm fairly confident that the boss contacted HR right after the OP mentioned it first and he probably received advice on how to respond.

Yep the job of HR is to protect the company from the employees.   "Who is more credible?" they will ask.  (hint:  it's not you) 

But it sounds like your boss was just having a bad week.   If this is the first time he's freaked out, so what?   Maybe his kid is sick or his wife is leaving him or his mom is dying or something totally unrelated to work.   If it becomes a habit, that's when action is required.

Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Captain FIRE on April 17, 2023, 07:00:37 PM
If you want a contemporaneous record, you can always email it to yourself.

If you send something to HR, they may have to take action on something even if you ask them not to. Depends on what you send (and at some places, depends on the person who receives it, if they want to take action or not).

If you had a rare one off event, I wouldn't stress out. Could be many personal things going on.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: jinga nation on April 18, 2023, 07:50:56 AM
If you had a rare one off event, I wouldn't stress out. Could be many personal things going on.

An ex-boss, who's a really awesome guy, suddenly started acting weirdly, barking out instructions verbally in meetings and in writing. I was the first recipient of it, but others noticed it too. I reached out; turns out he was dealing with stress from illness of a parent, and the death of another close relative. Asked him how we could help; the team ended managing themselves while he took a week off, and divided some of his tasks.

But it sounds like your boss was just having a bad week.   If this is the first time he's freaked out, so what?   Maybe his kid is sick or his wife is leaving him or his mom is dying or something totally unrelated to work.   If it becomes a habit, that's when action is required.

+1
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: zolotiyeruki on April 18, 2023, 08:13:10 AM
LennStar is right--bad days can happen to anyone.  If you've gone this long without experiencing a boss's bad day, you're probably in a good place.  And it's good that you seem to have a reasonably open line of communication with your boss.  Apologizing is also really hard for a lot of people, so take the non-apology for the win that it is.

A wise man once said "He who takes offense when none is intended is a fool, and he who takes offense when it *is* intended is a *great* fool."

One of the privileges of having FU money (and, alternatively, knowing your value to the company) is that you don't have to care about office politics.  And this incident is 100% office politics--your boss has egg on his face for jumping to an incorrect conclusion.  He might have other issues he's dealing with.

My advice?
1) Keep that documentation safe.  Email it to yourself so you have that documentation in case you need it in the future
2) Give the boss the benefit of the doubt.  Also, reach out and ask what the two of you can do to avoid similar conflict in the future, and how you (both) can handle it better if a similar situation arises again. 
3) Keep doing your job as well as you can.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Must_ache on April 18, 2023, 10:53:03 AM
That tale was 3-4 weeks ago, and things have been pretty harmonious since then. 
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Laura33 on April 18, 2023, 12:35:27 PM
If you had a rare one off event, I wouldn't stress out. Could be many personal things going on.

An ex-boss, who's a really awesome guy, suddenly started acting weirdly, barking out instructions verbally in meetings and in writing. I was the first recipient of it, but others noticed it too. I reached out; turns out he was dealing with stress from illness of a parent, and the death of another close relative. Asked him how we could help; the team ended managing themselves while he took a week off, and divided some of his tasks.

+1.  It's perfectly ok to say "is something up?  This isn't like you."  (Indeed, it was when my former mentor asked me that question that I was forced to acknowledge that I was in the middle of a major depression and needed help to pull myself out).

But in any event, congrats for being in a position where you felt like you could stand firm.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: AlanStache on April 18, 2023, 01:54:53 PM
Great that it was isolated, just be aware if "one time" becomes more regular.  Patterns and habits can quickly form, sometimes when it is "just one bad day" here and there because they are having some troubles but the underlying troubles dont get resolved.  Then 3 months down the line you are left trying to change something that has become normal. 
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: jinga nation on April 18, 2023, 05:04:32 PM
If you had a rare one off event, I wouldn't stress out. Could be many personal things going on.

An ex-boss, who's a really awesome guy, suddenly started acting weirdly, barking out instructions verbally in meetings and in writing. I was the first recipient of it, but others noticed it too. I reached out; turns out he was dealing with stress from illness of a parent, and the death of another close relative. Asked him how we could help; the team ended managing themselves while he took a week off, and divided some of his tasks.

+1.  It's perfectly ok to say "is something up?  This isn't like you."  (Indeed, it was when my former mentor asked me that question that I was forced to acknowledge that I was in the middle of a major depression and needed help to pull myself out).

But in any event, congrats for being in a position where you felt like you could stand firm.

Working in the DoD, we have annual training to remind us of significant behavior changes. They are to be reported. They could amount to nothing, or something bigger. In the worst cases, undetected/unreported behavior indicators can lead to compromising information and a threat to national security.

Wife's a CPA; she has similar annual training. It seems that behavior changes in the corporate world are encouraged to be reported.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: BuffaloStache on April 20, 2023, 11:45:59 AM
...
Working in the DoD, we have annual training to remind us of significant behavior changes. They are to be reported. They could amount to nothing, or something bigger. In the worst cases, undetected/unreported behavior indicators can lead to compromising information and a threat to national security.

Wife's a CPA; she has similar annual training. It seems that behavior changes in the corporate world are encouraged to be reported.

While I don't disagree (and I've taken similar training), I want to add that in my experience "employees being encouraged to report behavior changes"/actually reporting something very rarely = meaningful receipt of that report and successful resolution or support of the reportee by HR or the company writ large. While I've never reported anything myself to HR, I've been on the sidelines a couple of times and seen HR departments at several different companies either: do nothing, overreact, make drastic hierarchy changes that make lots of other employees lives suck, or even immediately side with the manager and launch a counter-investigation into the reportee. I understand it's likely different in the DoD world where it may be mandatory, but I still have doubts that any corporate HR department will react in a supporting and/or appropriate manner.

I like the recommendation of others to email the document to yourself, so you have record of when the document was compiled, etc. If it does happen again/more repeatedly, you could also try reporting this person ~1 month before you retire (because the consequences of a bad reaction from HR effectively won't matter to you anymore). My wife did this when she left a toxic working environment for a new job a while back, and I think it was the right move.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: jinga nation on April 22, 2023, 09:29:01 AM
BLUF: Planning on leaving a well-paid job due to false promises, bad contracting, and insufficient staffing, while being able to sleep well and not worry. That's FU Money power.

Not epic, so far, but could be as things happen...

Started with a new company recently, huge raise from previous employer.
The technical lead on this project and the project manager, who don't work for my employer, told my corporate boss that I should be more proactive and accept additional tasks and it'll be great for my career. This is only 30 days in, while I still didn't have access to the SW development tools, accounts, etc, and was going thru the customer site's processes. My corporate boss and his boss started raising their voices in the meeting, without listening to me. Red Flag 1.
New position's requirements were A, B, C. Now they've added D, E, F, G to it. I've pushed back. They know I'm not going to fold. I know they don't like my attitude. Also want me to work on software sales (which I have zero training in, and don't know the product). Red Flag 2.
During recruiting, was told that I'd be a member of a team (employees of other companies) which was fully staffed and that I was to be at the customer site daily. (Don't have an issue with the commute, I enjoy a hybrid/onsite schedule.) Turns out that everyone on this team works multiple contracts, and none of them are full-time onsite, not even 50%. Plus, the other teams I'm supposed to work with onsite, they work from home 3+ days a week. So I'm wondering how do I get tasks accomplished, especially since most of my work is on internal networks that are inaccessible from home. Red Flag 3.
I was told that I'd be starting my own team soon. The contract I'm on is up for renewal in a couple of months, and it'll get renewed. But the idea of building my team is dead, that plan was hijacked by another larger firm on the same contract. My employer knew this, but didn't tell me. Red Flag 4.

Wrote down pros/cons of old employer vs new one. Discussed with my wife. Talked to ex-coworkers, my old position hasn't been filled. Ex-employer has trouble filling openings. Ex-CW-1 is going to talk to his boss, my ex-boss, to have me come back. Informed Ex-CW-2 about new employer's Red Flags, as they're trying to recruit them. Ex-CW-1 gets to collect hiring bonus bounty on me.

I told wife not to worry, there aren't enough IT/SW engineers with DoD clearance, that I'd be getting LinkedIn offers like crazy if I set my profile to #OpenToWork. Also we have enough in emergency account that I don't have to work for a couple of years. We're technically FI. House is paid off. Rental income covers our living expenses. I could stay home, work out daily, longer bike rides, cook 3 meals daily, do yard work, get bathrooms renovated, start the vegetable/herb garden we've always wanted, volunteer at the school. And spend time with my retired dad. Told my wife it'd be my dream come true to be a house husband / kept man / soccer-sports dad.
With the political bumfuckery in my state, I could even home school my kids, if their very good schools got proper fucked.

UPDATE: ex-CW-1 said ex-boss wants me to return and will reach out. Meeting ex-CW-1 tomorrow to discuss more.

UPDATE2: talked to ex-boss today. They want me back; we talked compensation and start date. Fingers crossed. Initially getting my old position, plus additional responsibilities to work part-time with an automation team - something that I had wanted to do last year but could contractually. They won a new long-term contract and more, opening up possibilities to pick & choose what I can dabble in. Have fun AND get paid.

Update: Old boss contacted me later in the week. It's 99.9%, pending confirmation from CEO/CTO. Written offer ETA Monday.

Meanwhile, I've suddenly become Big ManTM. The tech lead has some family health stuff going on, so he's out for who knows how long. The PM has this habit of disappearing on Fridays when tech lead is out. In a bi-weekly meeting, come to find out that project hours are overburn, and work that is beyond my abilities and job description is being dumped on me, everyone else's hours are cut and they're put on other projects (they can't cut mine due to contractual bindings). I've started saying "yes" to everything. And when the notice drops, I'll be watching the PM scramble to get these folks back on this project and deliver. 
Meanwhile, the customer processes are shit and burning out the good, young, inexperienced engineers, who've been complaining to me. I've been guiding them to make it Other People's Problem. And the best way to solve it is to make it the problem of someone a level or two above their lead.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: BicycleB on April 22, 2023, 11:49:51 AM
@jinga nation, that's epic indeed!

Glad you're being a good mentor on your way out the door. Early in career, I think that just having a trustworthy senior explain things like how to pass the buck and defend against task creep are really important / super effin' awesome.

Of course, it'd be really amazing to pass on the concept of FIRE and maybe a website link or two. Have fun on your last week (or however long it turns out to be) at your new employer.

Looking forward to the official report of Big ManTM's Mic Drop moment.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Alfred J Quack on April 23, 2023, 03:45:01 AM
Not sure this is going to be an epic FU story but it's ongoing so we'll see.

I'm in a big project, our ERP system is being upgraded and I'm responsible for the integrations with other applications. The project is going pretty badly, no technical or functional design was needed according to our manager and as you can expect we're suffering for it during the project.
So bad that pretty much the entire project leadership has been replaced one way or another, including my manager, the lead I was reporting to etc. While we're approaching acceptance we still only have one working integration with the other three main ones coming along.
I've been warning, for months now, that other applications that are not directly connected also need to be tested but it's fallen on deaf ears. My responsibility is the technical workings of the integrations, functional workings are explicitly not.

The main joy I've had from this project was the time where I was working in depth  in figuring out how the API worked. Dumping it's contents into Excel, CSV, SQL, whatever. In the past months I've gotten feedback from at least 2 vendors that they really had uses for the scripts I've written, including a Q&A session with the Enterprise Architect of the Microsoft Partner for Business Central solutions. I was like wtf!
I've also gotten direct and indirect comments that my work was being used with other customers (which was fine) and really gave me a confidence boost. So much so that I decided to apply for a job as an integrations developer for a local company.

Here comes the FU money part: I basically wrote my coverletter like "I make programs with powershell to integrate API's, here's my Github and let me know if you can use me."
Next day I see 7 clones (0 up until then) and the day after that I get an invite for a talk with their HR.
In the call I basically state I'm willing to work for them but that I need regular time off for my youngest son (down's syndrome with lots of care appointments) and that I use specific hardware because I'm sensitive to overstim (e-ink display, ANC headphones). So far so good, I'm on to the 2nd of 3 rounds 😗
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: BicycleB on April 23, 2023, 10:05:37 AM
Well done, @Alfred J Quack! Both that you applied and that in the interview you made your needs known.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Turtle on April 24, 2023, 09:23:16 AM
This past weekend I learned of a potentially Epic FU story brewing within my extended family.

Backstory:  Eldest nephew got his Associates Degree in May 2020 and decided not to transfer to a 4 year school right away because he didn't want to be taking online courses while paying on campus level tuition.  That summer he was promoted to entry level management at the big box store where he worked.  Still lived at home, low expenses, saved a bunch of money so he'd be able to pay cash whenever he went back for his degree.

He starts looking around his company and realizes that there are opportunities to move up the ladder if he's willing to move geographically.   So he applies for and receives a promotion to go to a store near where his other grandparents live, stays with them for a while, and then gets another promotion in that geographic area.

At that point, he decides he's fine with moving around if that gets him up the ladder, and he takes another promotion that puts him in a big city almost a day's drive away.  All is going great, he can put in for another promotion after he's been there a year, and he's eligible to start training for the next level about 9 months after the transfer.

Except there's a manager in his chain who was replaced about 4-5 months ago, and the new guy has a reputation for never letting anyone transfer out.  He knows my nephew makes his store look good and he wants to keep his claws in.  This guy is blocking my nephew from starting training for the next level.  Other stores are actively recruiting my nephew to transfer to them for promotions, but without an overrule from corporate, he won't be allowed to do that.

Nephew is a young guy with no kids, no mortgage, no local family where he currently is.  In fact, he's even young enough to go back on his parent's health insurance still.  This company doesn't even have any golden handcuffs besides annual bonuses.  All that the idiot upper management guy should already have access to know.  What he may not know on top of that is that nephew has a much bigger emergency fund than people twice his age and this may be the push he needs to go back to being a college student and finish his Bachelors degree.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: jinga nation on April 24, 2023, 10:07:08 AM
This past weekend I learned of a potentially Epic FU story brewing within my extended family.

Backstory:  Eldest nephew got his Associates Degree in May 2020 and decided not to transfer to a 4 year school right away because he didn't want to be taking online courses while paying on campus level tuition.  That summer he was promoted to entry level management at the big box store where he worked.  Still lived at home, low expenses, saved a bunch of money so he'd be able to pay cash whenever he went back for his degree.

He starts looking around his company and realizes that there are opportunities to move up the ladder if he's willing to move geographically.   So he applies for and receives a promotion to go to a store near where his other grandparents live, stays with them for a while, and then gets another promotion in that geographic area.

At that point, he decides he's fine with moving around if that gets him up the ladder, and he takes another promotion that puts him in a big city almost a day's drive away.  All is going great, he can put in for another promotion after he's been there a year, and he's eligible to start training for the next level about 9 months after the transfer.

Except there's a manager in his chain who was replaced about 4-5 months ago, and the new guy has a reputation for never letting anyone transfer out.  He knows my nephew makes his store look good and he wants to keep his claws in.  This guy is blocking my nephew from starting training for the next level.  Other stores are actively recruiting my nephew to transfer to them for promotions, but without an overrule from corporate, he won't be allowed to do that.

Nephew is a young guy with no kids, no mortgage, no local family where he currently is.  In fact, he's even young enough to go back on his parent's health insurance still.  This company doesn't even have any golden handcuffs besides annual bonuses.  All that the idiot upper management guy should already have access to know.  What he may not know on top of that is that nephew has a much bigger emergency fund than people twice his age and this may be the push he needs to go back to being a college student and finish his Bachelors degree.

Bigger FU AND assert dominance: Get the Bachelor's Degree, return to BigBoxStore company, and get hired as the idiot's boss in due time.
Corporate transfer overrule policies are utter BS.
Can nephew make a handshake deal with manager at other store. Quit current one, then get hired at the new one?
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: jinga nation on April 26, 2023, 12:32:46 PM
BLUF: Planning on leaving a well-paid job due to false promises, bad contracting, and insufficient staffing, while being able to sleep well and not worry. That's FU Money power.

Not epic, so far, but could be as things happen...

Started with a new company recently, huge raise from previous employer.
The technical lead on this project and the project manager, who don't work for my employer, told my corporate boss that I should be more proactive and accept additional tasks and it'll be great for my career. This is only 30 days in, while I still didn't have access to the SW development tools, accounts, etc, and was going thru the customer site's processes. My corporate boss and his boss started raising their voices in the meeting, without listening to me. Red Flag 1.
New position's requirements were A, B, C. Now they've added D, E, F, G to it. I've pushed back. They know I'm not going to fold. I know they don't like my attitude. Also want me to work on software sales (which I have zero training in, and don't know the product). Red Flag 2.
During recruiting, was told that I'd be a member of a team (employees of other companies) which was fully staffed and that I was to be at the customer site daily. (Don't have an issue with the commute, I enjoy a hybrid/onsite schedule.) Turns out that everyone on this team works multiple contracts, and none of them are full-time onsite, not even 50%. Plus, the other teams I'm supposed to work with onsite, they work from home 3+ days a week. So I'm wondering how do I get tasks accomplished, especially since most of my work is on internal networks that are inaccessible from home. Red Flag 3.
I was told that I'd be starting my own team soon. The contract I'm on is up for renewal in a couple of months, and it'll get renewed. But the idea of building my team is dead, that plan was hijacked by another larger firm on the same contract. My employer knew this, but didn't tell me. Red Flag 4.

Wrote down pros/cons of old employer vs new one. Discussed with my wife. Talked to ex-coworkers, my old position hasn't been filled. Ex-employer has trouble filling openings. Ex-CW-1 is going to talk to his boss, my ex-boss, to have me come back. Informed Ex-CW-2 about new employer's Red Flags, as they're trying to recruit them. Ex-CW-1 gets to collect hiring bonus bounty on me.

I told wife not to worry, there aren't enough IT/SW engineers with DoD clearance, that I'd be getting LinkedIn offers like crazy if I set my profile to #OpenToWork. Also we have enough in emergency account that I don't have to work for a couple of years. We're technically FI. House is paid off. Rental income covers our living expenses. I could stay home, work out daily, longer bike rides, cook 3 meals daily, do yard work, get bathrooms renovated, start the vegetable/herb garden we've always wanted, volunteer at the school. And spend time with my retired dad. Told my wife it'd be my dream come true to be a house husband / kept man / soccer-sports dad.
With the political bumfuckery in my state, I could even home school my kids, if their very good schools got proper fucked.

UPDATE: ex-CW-1 said ex-boss wants me to return and will reach out. Meeting ex-CW-1 tomorrow to discuss more.

UPDATE2: talked to ex-boss today. They want me back; we talked compensation and start date. Fingers crossed. Initially getting my old position, plus additional responsibilities to work part-time with an automation team - something that I had wanted to do last year but could contractually. They won a new long-term contract and more, opening up possibilities to pick & choose what I can dabble in. Have fun AND get paid.

Update: Old boss contacted me later in the week. It's 99.9%, pending confirmation from CEO/CTO. Written offer ETA Monday.

Meanwhile, I've suddenly become Big ManTM. The tech lead has some family health stuff going on, so he's out for who knows how long. The PM has this habit of disappearing on Fridays when tech lead is out. In a bi-weekly meeting, come to find out that project hours are overburn, and work that is beyond my abilities and job description is being dumped on me, everyone else's hours are cut and they're put on other projects (they can't cut mine due to contractual bindings). I've started saying "yes" to everything. And when the notice drops, I'll be watching the PM scramble to get these folks back on this project and deliver. 
Meanwhile, the customer processes are shit and burning out the good, young, inexperienced engineers, who've been complaining to me. I've been guiding them to make it Other People's Problem. And the best way to solve it is to make it the problem of someone a level or two above their lead.

Update: Got offer. Signed. Done. Getting my old laptop back from ex-boss soon. He's planning to surprise the team by inviting me to an employee chill-out event next week. Only ex-CW-1 knows but is keeping mum.

Meanwhile, it seems no one at this customer wants to do work, everyone passing the buck. They wanted me to work the security assessor's tasks; I gave a polite "i'll bear it in mind". Ref: https://www.angmohdan.com/48-things-british-people-say-and-what-they-actually-mean/
 
Taking a couple of days off for some family time. Giving my notice in Monday, a professional 2 weeks courtesy. It isn't a rule, but my industry is a smallish niche world and people are within half the Six Degrees of Kevin Bacon.

Then taking a week off between the jobs, get a couple of home projects completed. It's crazy, at least to my wife and me, that missing out on a couple of thousand dollars of a week's earnings doesn't faze us. That's one of the powers of FU money, and living below your means.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: RyanAtTanagra on April 26, 2023, 12:46:43 PM
Update: Got offer. Signed. Done. Getting my old laptop back from ex-boss soon. He's planning to surprise the team by inviting me to an employee chill-out event next week. Only ex-CW-1 knows but is keeping mum.

Meanwhile, it seems no one at this customer wants to do work, everyone passing the buck. They wanted me to work the security assessor's tasks; I gave a polite "i'll bear it in mind". Ref: https://www.angmohdan.com/48-things-british-people-say-and-what-they-actually-mean/
 
Taking a couple of days off for some family time. Giving my notice in Monday, a professional 2 weeks courtesy. It isn't a rule, but my industry is a smallish niche world and people are within half the Six Degrees of Kevin Bacon.

Then taking a week off between the jobs, get a couple of home projects completed. It's crazy, at least to my wife and me, that missing out on a couple of thousand dollars of a week's earnings doesn't faze us. That's one of the powers of FU money, and living below your means.

Nice, congrats!  It's hard to go back to an old job without some animosity on their part, so their excitement speaks well to both your reputation, and how you handled your original departure.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Adventine on April 26, 2023, 02:16:54 PM
Congrats @jinga nation !
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: BicycleB on April 27, 2023, 02:32:04 PM
Wahoo, @jinga nation!!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: jinga nation on April 27, 2023, 05:43:57 PM
Update: Got offer. Signed. Done. Getting my old laptop back from ex-boss soon. He's planning to surprise the team by inviting me to an employee chill-out event next week. Only ex-CW-1 knows but is keeping mum.

Meanwhile, it seems no one at this customer wants to do work, everyone passing the buck. They wanted me to work the security assessor's tasks; I gave a polite "i'll bear it in mind". Ref: https://www.angmohdan.com/48-things-british-people-say-and-what-they-actually-mean/
 
Taking a couple of days off for some family time. Giving my notice in Monday, a professional 2 weeks courtesy. It isn't a rule, but my industry is a smallish niche world and people are within half the Six Degrees of Kevin Bacon.

Then taking a week off between the jobs, get a couple of home projects completed. It's crazy, at least to my wife and me, that missing out on a couple of thousand dollars of a week's earnings doesn't faze us. That's one of the powers of FU money, and living below your means.

Nice, congrats!  It's hard to go back to an old job without some animosity on their part, so their excitement speaks well to both your reputation, and how you handled your original departure.

I had an excellent 5+ years at the company, learned a lot, great mentors and amazing co-workers. Upon my leaving, the CEO gave a written offer for me to return, at any time.

I left only because a stupidly crazy offer came, which I rejected the first time, then took it the second time. It was something that I thought I'd live to regret because I was getting a chance to work with a company known for innovation. Unfortunately, due to several red flags, it didn't work out. People don't leave bad jobs, they leave bad managers. Or something like that.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Valley of Plenty on April 28, 2023, 03:07:28 AM
It's crazy, at least to my wife and me, that missing out on a couple of thousand dollars of a week's earnings doesn't faze us. That's one of the powers of FU money, and living below your means.

I often forget that the average person is one missed paycheck away from being late on bills, and a couple months of missed paychecks away from financial insolvency.

In the midst of COVID I had some coworkers who were in a panic due to employer's COVID leave policy (couldn't come to work if you had any symptoms, had to file claim for short term disability, would receive full pay after claim got approved) because if they missed a single paycheck they would be unable to put food on the table. Heck, in the last month I've seen two coworkers' debit cards get declined when trying to buy a soda out of the break room vending machine the day before payday. "What?! I could have sworn I had enough money in there..."
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Alfred J Quack on April 28, 2023, 06:32:58 AM
It's crazy, at least to my wife and me, that missing out on a couple of thousand dollars of a week's earnings doesn't faze us. That's one of the powers of FU money, and living below your means.

I often forget that the average person is one missed paycheck away from being late on bills, and a couple months of missed paychecks away from financial insolvency.

In the midst of COVID I had some coworkers who were in a panic due to employer's COVID leave policy (couldn't come to work if you had any symptoms, had to file claim for short term disability, would receive full pay after claim got approved) because if they missed a single paycheck they would be unable to put food on the table. Heck, in the last month I've seen two coworkers' debit cards get declined when trying to buy a soda out of the break room vending machine the day before payday. "What?! I could have sworn I had enough money in there..."

I had that a while back, scheduled deposits to savings was set a bit too agressively where it got transferred to my stash on the exact day it was payday. Problem was, my bank processes outgoing before incoming so with days where paydays on the latest possible day my balance went to close to 0 (or the different scheduled savings deposits bounced).
Since then I've adjusted the schedule to process 1 day after payday.

Transfer from savings is immediately active so no harm done 😂
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: zolotiyeruki on April 28, 2023, 07:51:04 AM
It's crazy, at least to my wife and me, that missing out on a couple of thousand dollars of a week's earnings doesn't faze us. That's one of the powers of FU money, and living below your means.

I often forget that the average person is one missed paycheck away from being late on bills, and a couple months of missed paychecks away from financial insolvency.

In the midst of COVID I had some coworkers who were in a panic due to employer's COVID leave policy (couldn't come to work if you had any symptoms, had to file claim for short term disability, would receive full pay after claim got approved) because if they missed a single paycheck they would be unable to put food on the table. Heck, in the last month I've seen two coworkers' debit cards get declined when trying to buy a soda out of the break room vending machine the day before payday. "What?! I could have sworn I had enough money in there..."

I had that a while back, scheduled deposits to savings was set a bit too agressively where it got transferred to my stash on the exact day it was payday. Problem was, my bank processes outgoing before incoming so with days where paydays on the latest possible day my balance went to close to 0 (or the different scheduled savings deposits bounced).
Since then I've adjusted the schedule to process 1 day after payday.

Transfer from savings is immediately active so no harm done 😂
That sounds like a good candidate to submit to the Mustachian People Problems (https://forum.mrmoneymustache.com/welcome-to-the-forum/mustachian-people-problems-(just-for-fun)/) thread.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: AccidentialMustache on April 28, 2023, 08:17:12 AM
I am enjoying my leave of absence.

Well, no, not today. Today I kinda feel like garbage because I slept poorly, because DW stress-dumped on me about the tween-DS's stress dump on DW about how kids in his middle school are talking about bailing for various other magnate schools around. DS's schools so far (only two, the previous and this middle school) have had retention problems so all his friends seem to leave for one reason or another.

But I'm on leave so... I just plan to get nothing done today. Immediate problem solved, longer term problem still to deal with. Admittedly, if I was still at work, I could just take a mental health day... but that's only effective if I wasn't on call.

Which is exactly the problem that FU money is solving for me. Even if I should have solved it sooner.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Siebrie on April 28, 2023, 08:36:33 AM
Not really 'epic', but something I was comfortable asking because I have enough money in the bank: parental leave (I'm in Belgium). I have 3 months left of parental leave for my youngest daughter, who turns 12 this Saturday. Starting today (the last possible day, just before she turns 12), I will spread the leave out and work 1/5 less for 15 months, divided over the whole workweek: I'll work 9-4 Mo, Tu, Th, Fr, and 9-12 We. It will of course cut my pay and benefits by 1/5, too, but that's fine. We will manage nicely.

It may even be benificial, because I have more time to organise the family, our home, hobbies, trips, cooking, kitchen gardening, etc.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Turtle on April 28, 2023, 09:23:34 AM
Not really 'epic', but something I was comfortable asking because I have enough money in the bank: parental leave (I'm in Belgium). I have 3 months left of parental leave for my youngest daughter, who turns 12 this Saturday. Starting today (the last possible day, just before she turns 12), I will spread the leave out and work 1/5 less for 15 months, divided over the whole workweek: I'll work 9-4 Mo, Tu, Th, Fr, and 9-12 We. It will of course cut my pay and benefits by 1/5, too, but that's fine. We will manage nicely.

It may even be benificial, because I have more time to organise the family, our home, hobbies, trips, cooking, kitchen gardening, etc.

That sounds ideal.  I'm glad you are able to take advantage of it.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Gronnie on April 28, 2023, 10:08:31 AM
It's crazy, at least to my wife and me, that missing out on a couple of thousand dollars of a week's earnings doesn't faze us. That's one of the powers of FU money, and living below your means.

I often forget that the average person is one missed paycheck away from being late on bills, and a couple months of missed paychecks away from financial insolvency.

In the midst of COVID I had some coworkers who were in a panic due to employer's COVID leave policy (couldn't come to work if you had any symptoms, had to file claim for short term disability, would receive full pay after claim got approved) because if they missed a single paycheck they would be unable to put food on the table. Heck, in the last month I've seen two coworkers' debit cards get declined when trying to buy a soda out of the break room vending machine the day before payday. "What?! I could have sworn I had enough money in there..."

I had that a while back, scheduled deposits to savings was set a bit too agressively where it got transferred to my stash on the exact day it was payday. Problem was, my bank processes outgoing before incoming so with days where paydays on the latest possible day my balance went to close to 0 (or the different scheduled savings deposits bounced).
Since then I've adjusted the schedule to process 1 day after payday.

Transfer from savings is immediately active so no harm done 😂

I'm surprised to hear outgoing before ingoing is legal in the Netherlands. Even here in super business friendly USA that practice has been outlawed.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: ChickenStash on April 28, 2023, 11:09:08 AM
My current employer is going through some merger/acquisition drama that is making life difficult and may eliminate my job in the next year or two so things are "interesting." A previous work-friend texted me a few weeks ago that he's now a director at a past employer and has a position to fill that might work for me. Sounded like a cool gig - better title, interesting tech, and a 50% pay increase (!).

The problem is that company had a very bad corporate culture and I left there for some strong reasons that included dealing with the people on the team this position is with. While chatting with him about it, most of the people that were there have left (high turnover) so things might be better, but there were some notable folks still around. It was tough, but I managed to convince myself it would be OK and it would shave a few years off my FIRE journey. I'd also get ahead of the potential instability in my current gig. I forced myself into a positive attitude about the job and went for it.

I made it through the multiple rounds of interviews but in the end they said no. :( I was pretty bummed. Then it hit me... Why am I so bummed about a job I had such a struggle to convince myself to even apply for? And if the current gig goes away, who cares! I can be unemployed for a few years with no changes to my lifestyle (longer if I cut out some rather spendy hobbies). My spending is low enough I could also just coastFIRE for a few extra years in a simpler job and still fully retire pretty early.

I've logically known it while thinking in the abstract but when the situation actually happened it was a minor revelation to realize I'm in a position where I really don't have to care much about what these other people do or think. I can't completely remove myself from the nonsense (FIRE), yet, but having the resources opens up so many options that these bumps really don't matter.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Gronnie on April 28, 2023, 11:50:27 AM
The fact that you had bad experiences there in the past combined with the fact that they put you through multiple rounds before saying no even with a referral from a director makes it seem like (at least to me) that you dodged a pretty big bullet there.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Turtle on April 28, 2023, 12:23:34 PM
Update: Got offer. Signed. Done. Getting my old laptop back from ex-boss soon. He's planning to surprise the team by inviting me to an employee chill-out event next week. Only ex-CW-1 knows but is keeping mum.

Meanwhile, it seems no one at this customer wants to do work, everyone passing the buck. They wanted me to work the security assessor's tasks; I gave a polite "i'll bear it in mind". Ref: https://www.angmohdan.com/48-things-british-people-say-and-what-they-actually-mean/
 
Taking a couple of days off for some family time. Giving my notice in Monday, a professional 2 weeks courtesy. It isn't a rule, but my industry is a smallish niche world and people are within half the Six Degrees of Kevin Bacon.

Then taking a week off between the jobs, get a couple of home projects completed. It's crazy, at least to my wife and me, that missing out on a couple of thousand dollars of a week's earnings doesn't faze us. That's one of the powers of FU money, and living below your means.

Nice, congrats!  It's hard to go back to an old job without some animosity on their part, so their excitement speaks well to both your reputation, and how you handled your original departure.

I had an excellent 5+ years at the company, learned a lot, great mentors and amazing co-workers. Upon my leaving, the CEO gave a written offer for me to return, at any time.

I left only because a stupidly crazy offer came, which I rejected the first time, then took it the second time. It was something that I thought I'd live to regret because I was getting a chance to work with a company known for innovation. Unfortunately, due to several red flags, it didn't work out. People don't leave bad jobs, they leave bad managers. Or something like that.

Congrats!  Sometimes leaving and returning also brings salary more in line with where it should be.  Hope that is the case for you.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: BicycleB on April 28, 2023, 02:43:19 PM
My current employer is going through some merger/acquisition drama that is making life difficult and may eliminate my job in the next year or two so things are "interesting." A previous work-friend texted me a few weeks ago that he's now a director at a past employer and has a position to fill that might work for me. Sounded like a cool gig - better title, interesting tech, and a 50% pay increase (!).

The problem is that company had a very bad corporate culture and I left there for some strong reasons that included dealing with the people on the team this position is with. While chatting with him about it, most of the people that were there have left (high turnover) so things might be better, but there were some notable folks still around. It was tough, but I managed to convince myself it would be OK and it would shave a few years off my FIRE journey. I'd also get ahead of the potential instability in my current gig. I forced myself into a positive attitude about the job and went for it.

I made it through the multiple rounds of interviews but in the end they said no. :( I was pretty bummed. Then it hit me... Why am I so bummed about a job I had such a struggle to convince myself to even apply for? And if the current gig goes away, who cares! I can be unemployed for a few years with no changes to my lifestyle (longer if I cut out some rather spendy hobbies). My spending is low enough I could also just coastFIRE for a few extra years in a simpler job and still fully retire pretty early.

I've logically known it while thinking in the abstract but when the situation actually happened it was a minor revelation to realize I'm in a position where I really don't have to care much about what these other people do or think. I can't completely remove myself from the nonsense (FIRE), yet, but having the resources opens up so many options that these bumps really don't matter.

Congrats, @ChickenStash!

Welcome to the Lower Blood Pressure Zone.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Alfred J Quack on April 29, 2023, 03:12:27 AM
It's crazy, at least to my wife and me, that missing out on a couple of thousand dollars of a week's earnings doesn't faze us. That's one of the powers of FU money, and living below your means.

I often forget that the average person is one missed paycheck away from being late on bills, and a couple months of missed paychecks away from financial insolvency.

In the midst of COVID I had some coworkers who were in a panic due to employer's COVID leave policy (couldn't come to work if you had any symptoms, had to file claim for short term disability, would receive full pay after claim got approved) because if they missed a single paycheck they would be unable to put food on the table. Heck, in the last month I've seen two coworkers' debit cards get declined when trying to buy a soda out of the break room vending machine the day before payday. "What?! I could have sworn I had enough money in there..."

I had that a while back, scheduled deposits to savings was set a bit too agressively where it got transferred to my stash on the exact day it was payday. Problem was, my bank processes outgoing before incoming so with days where paydays on the latest possible day my balance went to close to 0 (or the different scheduled savings deposits bounced).
Since then I've adjusted the schedule to process 1 day after payday.

Transfer from savings is immediately active so no harm done 😂

I'm surprised to hear outgoing before ingoing is legal in the Netherlands. Even here in super business friendly USA that practice has been outlawed.
I made an output from my banks transfers and limited myself to the 25th (payday), most of the time the bank handles my scheduled savings (within the same account) before incoming and outgoing last. There are a few where outgoing is handled before incoming, assuming the output corresponds with the processing order.

I'm assuming that the process order is correct because the balance remaining corresponds with the previous transaction.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: jinga nation on May 02, 2023, 01:36:57 PM
BLUF: Planning on leaving a well-paid job due to false promises, bad contracting, and insufficient staffing, while being able to sleep well and not worry. That's FU Money power.

Not epic, so far, but could be as things happen...

<snip>

Update: Old boss contacted me later in the week. It's 99.9%, pending confirmation from CEO/CTO. Written offer ETA Monday.

<snip>

Update: Got offer. Signed. Done.

<snip>
 
Giving my notice in Monday, a professional 2 weeks courtesy. It isn't a rule, but my industry is a smallish niche world and people are within half the Six Degrees of Kevin Bacon.
<snip>

Final Update: Gave in my approx 2 week resignation notice today. They asked that I work the rest of the week, then I'm out. I was OK with that.
Then a little bit later, they said tomorrow was to be my last day. Had a call with HR; pointed out that the employee handbook states:

Quote
When an employee decides to leave, their manager and Human Resources should be immediately notified. The employee will provide <employer> with a written two-week notice.

HR said they couldn't afford to keep me on overhead since the (external) contract PM wanted my last day to be tomorrow.

So much for professional courtesy. Next time, a 24H notice should suffice. And then they asked me to fill out an exit survey.

2.5 weeks for home improvement projects and long cycling rides. Then I'll start the new position. Thanks FU money.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Turtle on May 02, 2023, 01:56:23 PM
BLUF: Planning on leaving a well-paid job due to false promises, bad contracting, and insufficient staffing, while being able to sleep well and not worry. That's FU Money power.

Not epic, so far, but could be as things happen...

<snip>

Update: Old boss contacted me later in the week. It's 99.9%, pending confirmation from CEO/CTO. Written offer ETA Monday.

<snip>

Update: Got offer. Signed. Done.

<snip>
 
Giving my notice in Monday, a professional 2 weeks courtesy. It isn't a rule, but my industry is a smallish niche world and people are within half the Six Degrees of Kevin Bacon.
<snip>

Final Update: Gave in my approx 2 week resignation notice today. They asked that I work the rest of the week, then I'm out. I was OK with that.
Then a little bit later, they said tomorrow was to be my last day. Had a call with HR; pointed out that the employee handbook states:

Quote
When an employee decides to leave, their manager and Human Resources should be immediately notified. The employee will provide <employer> with a written two-week notice.

HR said they couldn't afford to keep me on overhead since the (external) contract PM wanted my last day to be tomorrow.

So much for professional courtesy. Next time, a 24H notice should suffice. And then they asked me to fill out an exit survey.

2.5 weeks for home improvement projects and long cycling rides. Then I'll start the new position. Thanks FU money.

That stinks that they had to stoop that low at the end.  Makes it more obvious that you made the right choice, though.

My brother had that happen once when giving 2 weeks notice.  However, in his case the large multi-national company where he was working had a policy of paying out the 2 weeks regardless of whether or not the person remained in the office for those 2 weeks.  It was management discretion whether or not to send the employee home early.

The laws on that probably vary from state to state, and I'm not sure what the law actually is for his state with regards to paying out notice periods.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: zolotiyeruki on May 02, 2023, 02:55:19 PM
Quote
When an employee decides to leave, their manager and Human Resources should be immediately notified. The employee will provide <employer> with a written two-week notice.

HR said they couldn't afford to keep me on overhead since the (external) contract PM wanted my last day to be tomorrow.

So much for professional courtesy. Next time, a 24H notice should suffice. And then they asked me to fill out an exit survey.

2.5 weeks for home improvement projects and long cycling rides. Then I'll start the new position. Thanks FU money.
This is the type of information that needs to be spread among all the employees, starting NOW. Make sure that every employee knows that if they are ready to quit, they might as well give zero notice, since the company isn't going to pay them for the two weeks anyway.

Hang on, is that even legal for them to lay you off without pay the next day after you gave them two weeks' notice?  I mean, the "two week notice" requirement in the company policy would support the idea that they can't just cut you off.  And if they tell you to buzz off after one day, does that not count as involuntary separation and qualify you for unemployment benefits?
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: RWD on May 02, 2023, 03:00:17 PM
Quote
When an employee decides to leave, their manager and Human Resources should be immediately notified. The employee will provide <employer> with a written two-week notice.

HR said they couldn't afford to keep me on overhead since the (external) contract PM wanted my last day to be tomorrow.

So much for professional courtesy. Next time, a 24H notice should suffice. And then they asked me to fill out an exit survey.

2.5 weeks for home improvement projects and long cycling rides. Then I'll start the new position. Thanks FU money.
This is the type of information that needs to be spread among all the employees, starting NOW. Make sure that every employee knows that if they are ready to quit, they might as well give zero notice, since the company isn't going to pay them for the two weeks anyway.

Hang on, is that even legal for them to lay you off without pay the next day after you gave them two weeks' notice?  I mean, the "two week notice" requirement in the company policy would support the idea that they can't just cut you off.  And if they tell you to buzz off after one day, does that not count as involuntary separation and qualify you for unemployment benefits?
Probably at-will employment (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/At-will_employment).
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: TomTX on May 02, 2023, 03:03:49 PM
Final Update: Gave in my approx 2 week resignation notice today. They asked that I work the rest of the week, then I'm out. I was OK with that.
Then a little bit later, they said tomorrow was to be my last day. Had a call with HR; pointed out that the employee handbook states:

Quote
When an employee decides to leave, their manager and Human Resources should be immediately notified. The employee will provide <employer> with a written two-week notice.
You're likely entitled to unemployment payments for those 2 weeks - they fired you, and it was not "for cause"
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: dhc on May 02, 2023, 04:33:28 PM
Final Update: Gave in my approx 2 week resignation notice today. They asked that I work the rest of the week, then I'm out. I was OK with that.
Then a little bit later, they said tomorrow was to be my last day. Had a call with HR; pointed out that the employee handbook states:

Quote
When an employee decides to leave, their manager and Human Resources should be immediately notified. The employee will provide <employer> with a written two-week notice.
You're likely entitled to unemployment payments for those 2 weeks - they fired you, and it was not "for cause"


And if applying for unemployment sounds like a hassle, know that getting it likely increases their UI premiums, so it’s worth it if you’re feeling a bit vengeful.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: jinga nation on May 02, 2023, 05:19:58 PM
@RWD you're right, at-will.

@Turtle yep, they showed their true colors. Better to have found out early on than later.

@dhc @TomTX @zolotiyeruki it's a right-to-work state. I'm not a petty person out to spite them. It just ain't worth it for 2.5 weeks of pay. Even if I was to win UI, the monies wouldn't amount to 0.25% of our net worth. Amazing what LBYM can do, having emergency funds, and all those prudent things.

But I'll do them justice in the exit survey. And I know a couple of people who interviewed with them, so you know... ;-)

It'll be a huge hassle to file UI, document, etc. I'd rather do more productive things around the house and garden and go for long bike rides.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: iluvzbeach on May 02, 2023, 07:23:14 PM
@RWD you're right, at-will.

@Turtle yep, they showed their true colors. My future boss, aka old boss at ex-employer, said this company made a shitty move.

@dhc @TomTX [member=8971]zolotiyeruki[/member] it's a right-to-work state. I'm not a petty person out to spite them. It just ain't worth it for 2.5 weeks of pay. Even if I was to win UI, the monies wouldn't amount to 0.25% of our net worth. Amazing what LBYM can do, having emergency funds, and all those prudent things.

But I'll do them justice in the exit survey. And I know a couple of people who interviewed with them, so you know... ;-)

It'll be a huge hassle to file UI, document, etc. I'd rather do more productive things around the house and garden and go for long bike rides.

@jinga nation …and that, my friends, is the beauty of having FU money! No need to create a stressful battle when one can afford to be playing outside and riding bikes.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: AlanStache on May 03, 2023, 06:05:36 AM
But I'll do them justice in the exit survey. And I know a couple of people who interviewed with them, so you know... ;-)

I would not assume that the survey is anonymous and would remember that it could get shared around and be read by someone out of context or get selectively edited. 
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: jinga nation on May 03, 2023, 06:22:53 AM
But I'll do them justice in the exit survey. And I know a couple of people who interviewed with them, so you know... ;-)

I would not assume that the survey is anonymous and would remember that it could get shared around and be read by someone out of context or get selectively edited.

It isn’t anonymous. I’ve never burned bridges in the past, and I don’t intend to. My survey responses will be professional and direct. No personal attacks.

My internal voice is singing: https://youtu.be/Vqbk9cDX0l0 and https://youtu.be/cE4lpSFNFUE
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: BicycleB on May 03, 2023, 06:47:02 AM
Watched that first link and it's HILARIOUS.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: ducky19 on May 03, 2023, 06:51:33 AM
Good for you, Jinga! Adding that, at least in my state, you've got a waiting week that is unpaid, so you'd really only be looking at 1 week's pay. Glad you're in a position to not need to stress about it!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Dicey on May 03, 2023, 08:39:16 AM
But I'll do them justice in the exit survey. And I know a couple of people who interviewed with them, so you know... ;-)

I would not assume that the survey is anonymous and would remember that it could get shared around and be read by someone out of context or get selectively edited.

It isn’t anonymous. I’ve never burned bridges in the past, and I don’t intend to. My survey responses will be professional and direct. No personal attacks.

My internal voice is singing: https://youtu.be/Vqbk9cDX0l0 and https://youtu.be/cE4lpSFNFUE
When, in the history of human existence, has an exit interview created lasting change?
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: LightTripper on May 03, 2023, 03:41:48 PM
Another suggestion for your internal playlist... :)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yFE6qQ3ySXE
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: TomTX on May 03, 2023, 04:30:32 PM
Good for you, Jinga! Adding that, at least in my state, you've got a waiting week that is unpaid, so you'd really only be looking at 1 week's pay. Glad you're in a position to not need to stress about it!
Here in Texas, the "waiting week" isn't actually unpaid, it's just delayed until the end of UI.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: bacchi on May 03, 2023, 04:50:30 PM
Another suggestion for your internal playlist... :)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yFE6qQ3ySXE

Or https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sDv5bqmkOl8, probably the shortest anti-job song around.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: TomTX on May 03, 2023, 06:53:07 PM
Another suggestion for your internal playlist... :)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yFE6qQ3ySXE

Or https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sDv5bqmkOl8, probably the shortest anti-job song around.
Ahem: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K0k5Q5OFGTo
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Fresh Bread on May 03, 2023, 07:02:42 PM
Another suggestion for your internal playlist... :)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yFE6qQ3ySXE

Or https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sDv5bqmkOl8, probably the shortest anti-job song around.
Ahem: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K0k5Q5OFGTo

I have always loved this ad (the company sells retirement/investment funds).
https://youtu.be/zKEcN40DrUs
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: TomTX on May 03, 2023, 07:07:09 PM
When, in the history of human existence, has an exit interview created lasting change?
Harsh!

...yet totally incisive query.

<3 your awesomeness, Dicey! (in a totally platonic way, I swear! If I were ever going non-platonic, it would totally be my idol @spartana despite being irredeemably monogamous for decades and never yet seeing an image of their physical form... @spartana is just so awesome!)
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: ATtiny85 on May 04, 2023, 06:03:49 AM

I have always loved this ad (the company sells retirement/investment funds).
https://youtu.be/zKEcN40DrUs

Yeah, the dumping of his personal items in the trash is the best. "nothing even remotely associated with this building has any value for me"
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Fresh Bread on May 04, 2023, 03:26:05 PM

I have always loved this ad (the company sells retirement/investment funds).
https://youtu.be/zKEcN40DrUs

Yeah, the dumping of his personal items in the trash is the best. "nothing even remotely associated with this building has any value for me"

And he's not that old and can still do a high kick - he's going to have a great retirement!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: solon on May 04, 2023, 08:15:48 PM

I have always loved this ad (the company sells retirement/investment funds).
https://youtu.be/zKEcN40DrUs

Yeah, the dumping of his personal items in the trash is the best. "nothing even remotely associated with this building has any value for me"

And did you notice the janitor? Giving him the rock-on sign?
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: AccidentialMustache on May 04, 2023, 09:49:50 PM
Yeah, the dumping of his personal items in the trash is the best. "nothing even remotely associated with this building has any value for me"

I have t-shirts from a previous tech job that we refer to as Bruno (as in, "We don't talk about Bruno!" -- the tech job, not the t-shirts).

They're great when I'm stir frying, frying bacon, making pasta sauce, painting ... basically anything that might trash my clothes.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: RWTL on May 05, 2023, 01:15:13 AM

I have always loved this ad (the company sells retirement/investment funds).
https://youtu.be/zKEcN40DrUs

Yeah, the dumping of his personal items in the trash is the best. "nothing even remotely associated with this building has any value for me"

And he's not that old and can still do a high kick - he's going to have a great retirement!

...And I love the comedic first kick doesn't open the door.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: BuffaloStache on May 10, 2023, 08:01:23 AM
The fact that you had bad experiences there in the past combined with the fact that they put you through multiple rounds before saying no even with a referral from a director makes it seem like (at least to me) that you dodged a pretty big bullet there.

@ChickenStash don't mean to get in the habit of digging up older posts, but wanted to provide some context here. Last year I applied for an internal promotion position at my company, and HR policy stated that "all candidates must be interviewed", regardless of the position or the candidate. So the HR admin (who I'd worked with for years) scheduled an interview with my now co-workers (who I'd also worked with for years; they were in an adjacent group but we interacted often). I took it seriously and wore a suit and everything.

For the 3 hours of "interviews", many jokes were made about the fact that I decided to wear a suit (and a tie!), and the one piece of advice I got from the technical lead (but not supervisor) in the group was "make sure you ask for more money when you get the offer!". Sure enough I got the offer and am in the position now- I feel like that's how things should be done if they are required by corporate policy.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Alternatepriorities on May 10, 2023, 11:21:47 AM
The fact that you had bad experiences there in the past combined with the fact that they put you through multiple rounds before saying no even with a referral from a director makes it seem like (at least to me) that you dodged a pretty big bullet there.

@ChickenStash don't mean to get in the habit of digging up older posts, but wanted to provide some context here. Last year I applied for an internal promotion position at my company, and HR policy stated that "all candidates must be interviewed", regardless of the position or the candidate. So the HR admin (who I'd worked with for years) scheduled an interview with my now co-workers (who I'd also worked with for years; they were in an adjacent group but we interacted often). I took it seriously and wore a suit and everything.

For the 3 hours of "interviews", many jokes were made about the fact that I decided to wear a suit (and a tie!), and the one piece of advice I got from the technical lead (but not supervisor) in the group was "make sure you ask for more money when you get the offer!". Sure enough I got the offer and am in the position now- I feel like that's how things should be done if they are required by corporate policy.

That is awesome! Well done to your coworkers and hr admin.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: AlanStache on May 10, 2023, 02:52:31 PM
...
I haven't read all this thread yet and don't really have an epic FU story but did have a great Peter Gibbons moment:  Worked a 10 hour/4 day work week at my old Gov agency. Core hours 6 am to 4:30 plus one week a month on call 24/7 and tons of OT including holidays, weekends, and nights so pretty heavy work load mostly in the outdoors in all weather.

One day the Director told us we were changing to a 9/80 schedule with new hours to start at 7:30 am and every other Fri on. I did my best Peter Gibbons imitation: "gee Bob that's not gonna work for me so I'm not going to do it and will continue to come in a 6 am and work 4 days a week". Bob get flustered: " but but but you can't do that! You have to start coming in at 7:30 and work until 5." Me: " yeah...no I'm just gonna come in at 6 and work to 4:30". Bob: "....!!!!". Me: " been swell talking to you Bob now I gonna pretend like Im working so you need to go away now. I'll see you tomorrow at 6." Bob: ".....!!!!!...."

Wait I thought Peter was chill with the Bobs but learned to live life by telling Bill Lumbergh 'no', I have not see the move in a few years. 
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: ChickenStash on May 10, 2023, 03:02:16 PM
My current employer is going through some merger/acquisition drama that is making life difficult and may eliminate my job in the next year or two so things are "interesting." A previous work-friend texted me a few weeks ago that he's now a director at a past employer and has a position to fill that might work for me. Sounded like a cool gig - better title, interesting tech, and a 50% pay increase (!).

The problem is that company had a very bad corporate culture and I left there for some strong reasons that included dealing with the people on the team this position is with. While chatting with him about it, most of the people that were there have left (high turnover) so things might be better, but there were some notable folks still around. It was tough, but I managed to convince myself it would be OK and it would shave a few years off my FIRE journey. I'd also get ahead of the potential instability in my current gig. I forced myself into a positive attitude about the job and went for it.

I made it through the multiple rounds of interviews but in the end they said no. :(
...

The Drama Llama enters stage right...

They called back this afternoon to say they rewrote the job description to better match my skill set and they are offering me the position. Only a 40% raise, though (this does actually make sense given the rewrite).

Stream of thoughts... So now I have to decide if things are different enough from then to now to try this. With the changes in management and high turnover, they are likely different. I know I'm different after leaving there and my outlook on work is a lot different from where I was on my FIRE journey at that time - this joint is what actually made me search out FIRE. I can't predict if things would be better but if they are significantly dissimilar then that's something.

On the positive side, the pay bump cuts my full FIRE time by about 2 years (7>5), in theory. Possibly more as there is room in the scale that my current gig doesn't have (not raise eligible). I'd also no longer be in an oncall rotation and might only have to handle a few after-hours calls a year if something big blows up.

Decisions, decisions....
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Sibley on May 10, 2023, 03:21:10 PM
My current employer is going through some merger/acquisition drama that is making life difficult and may eliminate my job in the next year or two so things are "interesting." A previous work-friend texted me a few weeks ago that he's now a director at a past employer and has a position to fill that might work for me. Sounded like a cool gig - better title, interesting tech, and a 50% pay increase (!).

The problem is that company had a very bad corporate culture and I left there for some strong reasons that included dealing with the people on the team this position is with. While chatting with him about it, most of the people that were there have left (high turnover) so things might be better, but there were some notable folks still around. It was tough, but I managed to convince myself it would be OK and it would shave a few years off my FIRE journey. I'd also get ahead of the potential instability in my current gig. I forced myself into a positive attitude about the job and went for it.

I made it through the multiple rounds of interviews but in the end they said no. :(
...

The Drama Llama enters stage right...

They called back this afternoon to say they rewrote the job description to better match my skill set and they are offering me the position. Only a 40% raise, though (this does actually make sense given the rewrite).

Stream of thoughts... So now I have to decide if things are different enough from then to now to try this. With the changes in management and high turnover, they are likely different. I know I'm different after leaving there and my outlook on work is a lot different from where I was on my FIRE journey at that time - this joint is what actually made me search out FIRE. I can't predict if things would be better but if they are significantly dissimilar then that's something.

On the positive side, the pay bump cuts my full FIRE time by about 2 years (7>5), in theory. Possibly more as there is room in the scale that my current gig doesn't have (not raise eligible). I'd also no longer be in an oncall rotation and might only have to handle a few after-hours calls a year if something big blows up.

Decisions, decisions....

Can you talk to anyone currently, or more recently, there? Get a sense of culture, management, etc?
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: ChickenStash on May 10, 2023, 04:10:07 PM
My current employer is going through some merger/acquisition drama that is making life difficult and may eliminate my job in the next year or two so things are "interesting." A previous work-friend texted me a few weeks ago that he's now a director at a past employer and has a position to fill that might work for me. Sounded like a cool gig - better title, interesting tech, and a 50% pay increase (!).

The problem is that company had a very bad corporate culture and I left there for some strong reasons that included dealing with the people on the team this position is with. While chatting with him about it, most of the people that were there have left (high turnover) so things might be better, but there were some notable folks still around. It was tough, but I managed to convince myself it would be OK and it would shave a few years off my FIRE journey. I'd also get ahead of the potential instability in my current gig. I forced myself into a positive attitude about the job and went for it.

I made it through the multiple rounds of interviews but in the end they said no. :(
...

The Drama Llama enters stage right...

They called back this afternoon to say they rewrote the job description to better match my skill set and they are offering me the position. Only a 40% raise, though (this does actually make sense given the rewrite).

Stream of thoughts... So now I have to decide if things are different enough from then to now to try this. With the changes in management and high turnover, they are likely different. I know I'm different after leaving there and my outlook on work is a lot different from where I was on my FIRE journey at that time - this joint is what actually made me search out FIRE. I can't predict if things would be better but if they are significantly dissimilar then that's something.

On the positive side, the pay bump cuts my full FIRE time by about 2 years (7>5), in theory. Possibly more as there is room in the scale that my current gig doesn't have (not raise eligible). I'd also no longer be in an oncall rotation and might only have to handle a few after-hours calls a year if something big blows up.

Decisions, decisions....

Can you talk to anyone currently, or more recently, there? Get a sense of culture, management, etc?

Unfortunately, I don't have any contacts there other than the director that reached out. Everyone else I worked with fled within a month or two of me leaving. I've had a few long conversations with my director friend and I get the sense things have quieted down somewhat since I was there (3.5 years ago).

I was in a uniquely bad position there last time and this position would be in a different area but there would still be some overlap.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Gronnie on May 10, 2023, 04:29:08 PM
It's a 40% raise and I assume you have FU money?

You should be in a much better position to set firm boundaries from the start, and if it ends up sucking too much just peace out and find something else.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Gremlin on May 10, 2023, 05:06:41 PM
My current employer is going through some merger/acquisition drama that is making life difficult and may eliminate my job in the next year or two so things are "interesting." A previous work-friend texted me a few weeks ago that he's now a director at a past employer and has a position to fill that might work for me. Sounded like a cool gig - better title, interesting tech, and a 50% pay increase (!).

The problem is that company had a very bad corporate culture and I left there for some strong reasons that included dealing with the people on the team this position is with. While chatting with him about it, most of the people that were there have left (high turnover) so things might be better, but there were some notable folks still around. It was tough, but I managed to convince myself it would be OK and it would shave a few years off my FIRE journey. I'd also get ahead of the potential instability in my current gig. I forced myself into a positive attitude about the job and went for it.

I made it through the multiple rounds of interviews but in the end they said no. :(
...

The Drama Llama enters stage right...

They called back this afternoon to say they rewrote the job description to better match my skill set and they are offering me the position. Only a 40% raise, though (this does actually make sense given the rewrite).

Stream of thoughts... So now I have to decide if things are different enough from then to now to try this. With the changes in management and high turnover, they are likely different. I know I'm different after leaving there and my outlook on work is a lot different from where I was on my FIRE journey at that time - this joint is what actually made me search out FIRE. I can't predict if things would be better but if they are significantly dissimilar then that's something.

On the positive side, the pay bump cuts my full FIRE time by about 2 years (7>5), in theory. Possibly more as there is room in the scale that my current gig doesn't have (not raise eligible). I'd also no longer be in an oncall rotation and might only have to handle a few after-hours calls a year if something big blows up.

Decisions, decisions....
Obviously you need to decide based on a range of things other than money.  But they don't know what your decision criteria is.  The fact that they've done this in this way suggests to me that they are desperate to get you across the line.  If you do decide to take the role, it feels like you're in a position of strength in terms of negotiating salary.  I wouldn't make threats, but if you decide you want the role you might want to say something like this:

"We were originally talking about a role paying $X.  This has now been revised down to $Y and I do understand the rationale.  Remuneration is obviously not my only consideration and I'm genuinely interested, but an offer of $Y is less attractive relative to my current salary and career trajectory than what we were first contemplating."

There's a couple of reasons for this. 

1.  Everything in the statement is 100% true.  You want to be honest in your negotiations.
2.  You know that they have a budget where $X is available.  And you know that they want you because they wouldn't have restructured the role if they didn't.
3.  What the last bit says is actually that $Y is less attractive than $X.  That's the comparison you are making.  But by anchoring the description of the salary offer to your current and future trajectory salary, what they'll be thinking about is that $Y doesn't stand out relative to your current situation.  Now they don't know your current circumstances and, if that's the comparison your making, then it puts them at a negotiating disadvantage.  They may have an inkling of your current salary, but adding the 'career trajectory' comment says that it's as much about future potential as today's situation.  (Even if you know the current position doesn't offer much in that way, they don't have to know that).
4.  You're not rejecting the current offer and you give yourself plenty of room to 'graciously accept' if this is their final offer.

Put it all together, particularly if delivered in a non-threatening way, I think you'll extract their best offer.  It may not be the 50% bump, but I think it's likely that they'll go higher than the current offer if I'm correctly reading the tea leaves here.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Alfred J Quack on May 11, 2023, 11:13:59 AM
Not sure this is going to be an epic FU story but it's ongoing so we'll see.

I'm in a big project, our ERP system is being upgraded and I'm responsible for the integrations with other applications. The project is going pretty badly, no technical or functional design was needed according to our manager and as you can expect we're suffering for it during the project.
So bad that pretty much the entire project leadership has been replaced one way or another, including my manager, the lead I was reporting to etc. While we're approaching acceptance we still only have one working integration with the other three main ones coming along.
I've been warning, for months now, that other applications that are not directly connected also need to be tested but it's fallen on deaf ears. My responsibility is the technical workings of the integrations, functional workings are explicitly not.

The main joy I've had from this project was the time where I was working in depth  in figuring out how the API worked. Dumping it's contents into Excel, CSV, SQL, whatever. In the past months I've gotten feedback from at least 2 vendors that they really had uses for the scripts I've written, including a Q&A session with the Enterprise Architect of the Microsoft Partner for Business Central solutions. I was like wtf!
I've also gotten direct and indirect comments that my work was being used with other customers (which was fine) and really gave me a confidence boost. So much so that I decided to apply for a job as an integrations developer for a local company.

Here comes the FU money part: I basically wrote my coverletter like "I make programs with powershell to integrate API's, here's my Github and let me know if you can use me."
Next day I see 7 clones (0 up until then) and the day after that I get an invite for a talk with their HR.
In the call I basically state I'm willing to work for them but that I need regular time off for my youngest son (down's syndrome with lots of care appointments) and that I use specific hardware because I'm sensitive to overstim (e-ink display, ANC headphones). So far so good, I'm on to the 2nd of 3 rounds 😗
Fast forward a bit and I've got 2 2nd round interviews lined up and a very concerned manager trying hard to keep me (still no actual offer though). I told my manager I'd seriously consider staying but it also depend on the other offers (mainly need flexible hours for DS's care appointments which is almost weekly).

I had a very open talk with my manager this monday. I really didn't give a fig about letting him know where I was applying and why. He countered by painting a picture where the department is going. Downside is that his position is interim and ends on juli 1st and won't be extended (so, we'll be without a manager for a while probably).
I'm not against staying and if manager's offer is what he laid on the table I'm going to get some distance from a very toxic colleague. It would also create some distance between me and my sysadmin buddies for a subset of colleagues I've only talked with around the coffee table and not as much in actual work relations. I'm still a bit hesitant but I've got the luxury of choice 😜
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: BicycleB on May 11, 2023, 12:29:12 PM
if you decide you want the role you might want to say something like this:

"We were originally talking about a role paying $X.  This has now been revised down to $Y and I do understand the rationale.  Remuneration is obviously not my only consideration and I'm genuinely interested, but an offer of $Y is less attractive relative to my current salary and career trajectory than what we were first contemplating."


Wow - great script, @Gremlin!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: zolotiyeruki on May 11, 2023, 02:40:55 PM
I had a very open talk with my manager this monday. I really didn't give a fig about letting him know where I was applying and why. He countered by painting a picture where the department is going. Downside is that his position is interim and ends on juli 1st and won't be extended (so, we'll be without a manager for a while probably).
This should stand out as a bright, flashing red flag.  Several times in my career, I've found myself in a similar position, where a manager has told me about "things that are coming down the pipeline" or "yeah, we have you lined up for project X" or "when X event happens, then you'll see Y improvement at work."

Don't fall for it.  Such encouraging words are worth precisely zero,  especially when coming from a manager who won't be there to ensure that they come to pass.  This is not, by any means, and indictment of the manager--he probably has full intentions of following through to the extent of his abilities.  It's just the reality of business.  The moment you agree to stay, management no longer have an incentive to do anything to keep you.  So, get your offers and concessions (salary, project, people you can avoid, etc) first (and in writing!), before you agree to stay.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: RWTL on May 12, 2023, 02:52:27 AM

So, get your offers and concessions (salary, project, people you can avoid, etc) first (and in writing!), before you agree to stay.

This
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: TomTX on May 12, 2023, 08:22:27 AM

So, get your offers and concessions (salary, project, people you can avoid, etc) first (and in writing!), before you agree to stay.

This
Agreed.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Alfred J Quack on May 13, 2023, 01:34:20 AM
I had a very open talk with my manager this monday. I really didn't give a fig about letting him know where I was applying and why. He countered by painting a picture where the department is going. Downside is that his position is interim and ends on juli 1st and won't be extended (so, we'll be without a manager for a while probably).
This should stand out as a bright, flashing red flag.  Several times in my career, I've found myself in a similar position, where a manager has told me about "things that are coming down the pipeline" or "yeah, we have you lined up for project X" or "when X event happens, then you'll see Y improvement at work."

Don't fall for it.  Such encouraging words are worth precisely zero,  especially when coming from a manager who won't be there to ensure that they come to pass.  This is not, by any means, and indictment of the manager--he probably has full intentions of following through to the extent of his abilities.  It's just the reality of business.  The moment you agree to stay, management no longer have an incentive to do anything to keep you.  So, get your offers and concessions (salary, project, people you can avoid, etc) first (and in writing!), before you agree to stay.
I'm not planning to fall for it, if they want me to stay they'll have to put it in writing because talk is cheap and writing is gold. I'm fine with them putting requirements on it for me (certification and training) because that's what I'd do if I put someone like me in that position but I'm not giving them the illusion that I'll be doing that in my own time.

Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Goose on May 29, 2023, 12:38:33 PM
Thought it would be time for me to add my story.

I've been in technology my whole career focusing on the digital transformation of manufacturing and distribution organizations.  Not maintenance, but the full out change of modernization.  Scary stuff if not done right.  I realized very early that to be effective you have to be able to speak your mind to the powers that be OR you could easily get caught up in something disasterous.  Many of the leaders you work with are successful individuals, but very few have been through a digital transformation as they occur only every couple of decades in an organization.  Seriously - organizations die if not led properly through these transformations by the WHOLE management team. 

FU money enables you to walk away if it ends up going in the wrong direction.  Not a "take my ball and go home if not following my way" type stuff, but as a last card if enough red flags go up and you are attempting to course correct.  Why last card, because if it has gotten this far and your course correction fails - you do not want to be there.  #1 - as IT Leadership, you are usually the first to be fired if there is a disaster.  #2 - when looking for your next job, you don't want a disaster on your resume (trust me - disasters get into the marketplace).  Walking is better.

First time I participated in leveraging this was when I was in consulting.  Client was implementing an ERP system and the project was not going well.  Name the red flag and this project had it.  We told the CIO then the CEO where improvements needed to be made.  As the project continued to go south with our recommendations not heeded, we said of our recommedations here are the couple that were non-negotiable or we walk.  At this point our client was the highest grossing client of the whole organization (tier B CPA firm in the 90s), so major dollars for the firm.  Result - we walked.  The partner on the project was not upset, just practical when he told me "rather walk away now with our reputations intact than after the project implodes".  Best lesson I ever learned as that project blew up six months later and the company cleaned house of everyone involved.  Lawsuits ensued.  Reputations were tarnished.  Other companies knew we walked away and it made our repuation stronger....

I left consulting but kept up 2 things - #1 - my love of a full digital transformation, and #2 - my realization that I may need to walk at any moment.  I needed FU money.

Years later I'm at a company in trouble - severe technology debt and continuing to lose market share for a variety of reasons.  I was brought in the lead them out of their technology debt.  Did many great things, but the continued loss of market share meant we changed our CEO every couple of years.  I was successful in getting buy-in on the long term plan with each successive CEO...until the last one.  Two challenges - #1 It was his first CEO gig - former CFO - and he had never been through a digital transformation, and #2 he liked to bring in his own people.  Both fine and while his lack of understanding of the challenge before us was concerning I was stunned when the person who he brought in above me was even worse.  I'd reported to the CEO since my arrival and having a person put between us put me on alert than I was being targeted.  Whatever.  But when this person did not have the knowledge to be in the position.....not good.  He had never been IT Leadership, just IT Sales. 

I honestly tried to get both to see the light, but it was just never going to happen.  My days were numbered, but hey I've got FU money for this!

But to leave I had a challenge - I would have to move in order to find another position and I had kids in middle school.  I didn't want to be the one to leave so I could tell my kids it was not my decision to leave this city they had lived in for the past 6 years.  So I waited.  Turns out the company was making it more and more miserable for me hoping I would leave, so after awhile they realized I was holding out for a golden parachute just like many of the other Executives who had been shown the door before me.

Finally HR came to me with a meager offer (CEO and my boss were not involved whatsoever), so I said I would leave on 2 conditions:
#1 - they would never degrade my work and/or actions ever OR our deal was off.
#2 - the meager offer needed to be improved.

Rejected.

I asked the HR representative to reconsider and started listing off all of the projects I was aware/involved in both executed and considered.  He had no clue what they were, but he wrote them down as I instructed and he took them with him.  I was an Exec so knew of various plans accumulated over my 6 years - ranging from competitive advantages (I had no non-compete) to an attempt to weaken the union representation at two of their largest plants.  I was offering my silence.

Within an hour HR got back to me with a real offer which was more than enough to cover the period I was out of work AND buy into a PE opportunity at my next position.  It was glorious.

Without FU money, I would have played it very differently.  Safer.  With FU money, I had the ability to tolerate risk to get a better resolution.  Some may say I was lucky it worked out for me, but I view it as the inevitable and my ability to push back is how I received a reasonable offer.   

For those who are wondering - company never said why I left and it must have been painful because I know as their situation got worse many asked if Goose could be persuaded to come back and take their IT forward.  If only they knew...
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: scottish on May 29, 2023, 03:12:39 PM
Nicely done, goose. 
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: jinga nation on May 29, 2023, 06:28:00 PM
Hat tip @Goose

I wanted to make a "Duck, Duck, Goose" joke, but realized it'd be quite fowl. So I chickened out. :p
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: scottish on May 29, 2023, 07:32:50 PM
That story was golden, goose.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: dignam on May 29, 2023, 07:36:18 PM
Hat tip @Goose

I wanted to make a "Duck, Duck, Goose" joke, but realized it'd be quite fowl. So I chickened out. :p

Aw, let the joke fly.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: BicycleB on June 01, 2023, 09:31:01 AM
Hat tip @Goose

I wanted to make a "Duck, Duck, Goose" joke, but realized it'd be quite fowl. So I chickened out. :p

Aw, let the joke fly.

A cardinal set of puns.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Alfred J Quack on June 01, 2023, 12:48:49 PM
Not sure this is going to be an epic FU story but it's ongoing so we'll see.

I'm in a big project, our ERP system is being upgraded and I'm responsible for the integrations with other applications. The project is going pretty badly, no technical or functional design was needed according to our manager and as you can expect we're suffering for it during the project.
So bad that pretty much the entire project leadership has been replaced one way or another, including my manager, the lead I was reporting to etc. While we're approaching acceptance we still only have one working integration with the other three main ones coming along.
I've been warning, for months now, that other applications that are not directly connected also need to be tested but it's fallen on deaf ears. My responsibility is the technical workings of the integrations, functional workings are explicitly not.

The main joy I've had from this project was the time where I was working in depth  in figuring out how the API worked. Dumping it's contents into Excel, CSV, SQL, whatever. In the past months I've gotten feedback from at least 2 vendors that they really had uses for the scripts I've written, including a Q&A session with the Enterprise Architect of the Microsoft Partner for Business Central solutions. I was like wtf!
I've also gotten direct and indirect comments that my work was being used with other customers (which was fine) and really gave me a confidence boost. So much so that I decided to apply for a job as an integrations developer for a local company.

Here comes the FU money part: I basically wrote my coverletter like "I make programs with powershell to integrate API's, here's my Github and let me know if you can use me."
Next day I see 7 clones (0 up until then) and the day after that I get an invite for a talk with their HR.
In the call I basically state I'm willing to work for them but that I need regular time off for my youngest son (down's syndrome with lots of care appointments) and that I use specific hardware because I'm sensitive to overstim (e-ink display, ANC headphones). So far so good, I'm on to the 2nd of 3 rounds 😗
Fast forward a bit and I've got 2 2nd round interviews lined up and a very concerned manager trying hard to keep me (still no actual offer though). I told my manager I'd seriously consider staying but it also depend on the other offers (mainly need flexible hours for DS's care appointments which is almost weekly).

I had a very open talk with my manager this monday. I really didn't give a fig about letting him know where I was applying and why. He countered by painting a picture where the department is going. Downside is that his position is interim and ends on juli 1st and won't be extended (so, we'll be without a manager for a while probably).
I'm not against staying and if manager's offer is what he laid on the table I'm going to get some distance from a very toxic colleague. It would also create some distance between me and my sysadmin buddies for a subset of colleagues I've only talked with around the coffee table and not as much in actual work relations. I'm still a bit hesitant but I've got the luxury of choice 😜
Forward a bit more and they are working on the papers for an internal job-change starting jan 1st. That means the payscale is going up another 2 notches (3 in oktober 2021).
Why jan 1st? Because my current project goes live in oktober and they don't have a snowball's chance to replace me. This also gives my team lead time to look for a replacement.

And the 2 I used as leverage didn't pan out so if they hadn't done anything they'd have caused themselves a lot less stress 😂 Does that mean I stop interviews? Nah but I'm willing to see where it goes before I start looking around in earnest again.

That said, I'm not too sad that the others didn't pan out. I'd have to change my time-off plans so I don't have to do that anymore. 5 weeks PTO here I come 🦥
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Siebrie on June 02, 2023, 05:17:35 AM
Not really 'epic', but something I was comfortable asking because I have enough money in the bank: parental leave (I'm in Belgium). I have 3 months left of parental leave for my youngest daughter, who turns 12 this Saturday. Starting today (the last possible day, just before she turns 12), I will spread the leave out and work 1/5 less for 15 months, divided over the whole workweek: I'll work 9-4 Mo, Tu, Th, Fr, and 9-12 We. It will of course cut my pay and benefits by 1/5, too, but that's fine. We will manage nicely.

It may even be benificial, because I have more time to organise the family, our home, hobbies, trips, cooking, kitchen gardening, etc.

Well, that didn't quite go as planned.... It turned out that I had been misinformed over the phone by the government organisation. They have apologised, and will train the new employees again, and then they denied my application for parental leave. I will discuss working less hours this afternoon with my boss. Hoping to still be able to leave at 4 every day, beating the rush hour.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: LennStar on June 02, 2023, 05:59:01 AM
No that sounds fishy. Has nobody else tried that before? :D
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: rantk81 on June 02, 2023, 08:41:44 AM
I posted a while back about my employer forcing employees back into the office for a few days per week.  It seems like a lot of companies have been doing this lately.

Well, in my case, I told my boss that I'd leave my job and retire, if they tried to force me to go to an office for no reason.

Guess what?  I received one of the "rare" exemptions granted from HR, from the new policy.

:D

Having FU-Money (or FIRE-able Money) is so nice.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Sandi_k on June 02, 2023, 09:22:43 AM
Well done - that is *exactly* how you use FU money to its best advantage.

I posted a while back about my employer forcing employees back into the office for a few days per week.  It seems like a lot of companies have been doing this lately.

Well, in my case, I told my boss that I'd leave my job and retire, if they tried to force me to go to an office for no reason.

Guess what?  I received one of the "rare" exemptions granted from HR, from the new policy.

:D

Having FU-Money (or FIRE-able Money) is so nice.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Turtle on August 16, 2023, 01:21:59 PM
This past weekend I learned of a potentially Epic FU story brewing within my extended family.

Backstory:  Eldest nephew got his Associates Degree in May 2020 and decided not to transfer to a 4 year school right away because he didn't want to be taking online courses while paying on campus level tuition.  That summer he was promoted to entry level management at the big box store where he worked.  Still lived at home, low expenses, saved a bunch of money so he'd be able to pay cash whenever he went back for his degree.

He starts looking around his company and realizes that there are opportunities to move up the ladder if he's willing to move geographically.   So he applies for and receives a promotion to go to a store near where his other grandparents live, stays with them for a while, and then gets another promotion in that geographic area.

At that point, he decides he's fine with moving around if that gets him up the ladder, and he takes another promotion that puts him in a big city almost a day's drive away.  All is going great, he can put in for another promotion after he's been there a year, and he's eligible to start training for the next level about 9 months after the transfer.

Except there's a manager in his chain who was replaced about 4-5 months ago, and the new guy has a reputation for never letting anyone transfer out.  He knows my nephew makes his store look good and he wants to keep his claws in.  This guy is blocking my nephew from starting training for the next level.  Other stores are actively recruiting my nephew to transfer to them for promotions, but without an overrule from corporate, he won't be allowed to do that.

Nephew is a young guy with no kids, no mortgage, no local family where he currently is.  In fact, he's even young enough to go back on his parent's health insurance still.  This company doesn't even have any golden handcuffs besides annual bonuses.  All that the idiot upper management guy should already have access to know.  What he may not know on top of that is that nephew has a much bigger emergency fund than people twice his age and this may be the push he needs to go back to being a college student and finish his Bachelors degree.

Update to this one.  Eldest nephew has given notice and is starting back to college this month.  No word yet on the reaction he got when he turned in said notice.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: RetiredAt63 on August 16, 2023, 05:06:24 PM
This past weekend I learned of a potentially Epic FU story brewing within my extended family.

Backstory:  Eldest nephew got his Associates Degree in May 2020 and decided not to transfer to a 4 year school right away because he didn't want to be taking online courses while paying on campus level tuition.  That summer he was promoted to entry level management at the big box store where he worked.  Still lived at home, low expenses, saved a bunch of money so he'd be able to pay cash whenever he went back for his degree.

He starts looking around his company and realizes that there are opportunities to move up the ladder if he's willing to move geographically.   So he applies for and receives a promotion to go to a store near where his other grandparents live, stays with them for a while, and then gets another promotion in that geographic area.

At that point, he decides he's fine with moving around if that gets him up the ladder, and he takes another promotion that puts him in a big city almost a day's drive away.  All is going great, he can put in for another promotion after he's been there a year, and he's eligible to start training for the next level about 9 months after the transfer.

Except there's a manager in his chain who was replaced about 4-5 months ago, and the new guy has a reputation for never letting anyone transfer out.  He knows my nephew makes his store look good and he wants to keep his claws in.  This guy is blocking my nephew from starting training for the next level.  Other stores are actively recruiting my nephew to transfer to them for promotions, but without an overrule from corporate, he won't be allowed to do that.

Nephew is a young guy with no kids, no mortgage, no local family where he currently is.  In fact, he's even young enough to go back on his parent's health insurance still.  This company doesn't even have any golden handcuffs besides annual bonuses.  All that the idiot upper management guy should already have access to know.  What he may not know on top of that is that nephew has a much bigger emergency fund than people twice his age and this may be the push he needs to go back to being a college student and finish his Bachelors degree.

Update to this one.  Eldest nephew has given notice and is starting back to college this month.  No word yet on the reaction he got when he turned in said notice.

That is a story worthy of "Not Always Right".   ;-)
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Dee_the_third on August 16, 2023, 06:40:56 PM
This isn’t particularly epic, but my mother in law (who earns a relatively modest government salary along with my FIL, but is immigrant-frugal and quite level headed) has been wanting to retire for a while. She’s been staying because she doesn’t want to screw her team over (she is one of the few competent people on a team of boneheads) and she gets a nice bump in pension if she stays another two years. Anyways recently her department head implemented a rule about vacation- you can only take two weeks at a time without special approval that needs to go up the food chain. She doesn’t really take vacations (again, immigrant frugal) but was going to take a month to come help us out after I give birth this fall. We were on the phone discussing logistics and she mentioned that she might need to do a little remote work if her supervisor doesn’t approve the month, but after a moment she said “Well, if he doesn’t approve it, I’ll probably just retire”

Good for her. She’s very conflict-averse as a rule and I feel particularly honored that she would take a stand over something that’s really for my benefit. I got some good in-laws!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: RetiredAt63 on August 16, 2023, 06:55:49 PM
This isn’t particularly epic, but my mother in law (who earns a relatively modest government salary along with my FIL, but is immigrant-frugal and quite level headed) has been wanting to retire for a while. She’s been staying because she doesn’t want to screw her team over (she is one of the few competent people on a team of boneheads) and she gets a nice bump in pension if she stays another two years. Anyways recently her department head implemented a rule about vacation- you can only take two weeks at a time without special approval that needs to go up the food chain. She doesn’t really take vacations (again, immigrant frugal) but was going to take a month to come help us out after I give birth this fall. We were on the phone discussing logistics and she mentioned that she might need to do a little remote work if her supervisor doesn’t approve the month, but after a moment she said “Well, if he doesn’t approve it, I’ll probably just retire”

Good for her. She’s very conflict-averse as a rule and I feel particularly honored that she would take a stand over something that’s really for my benefit. I got some good in-laws!

You have a great MIL!

If this trend keeps up we can start a thread called "Stupid managers I have known/stupid shit managers did".  We probably could anyway.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: alcon835 on August 17, 2023, 07:19:02 AM
This isn’t particularly epic, but my mother in law (who earns a relatively modest government salary along with my FIL, but is immigrant-frugal and quite level headed) has been wanting to retire for a while. She’s been staying because she doesn’t want to screw her team over (she is one of the few competent people on a team of boneheads) and she gets a nice bump in pension if she stays another two years. Anyways recently her department head implemented a rule about vacation- you can only take two weeks at a time without special approval that needs to go up the food chain. She doesn’t really take vacations (again, immigrant frugal) but was going to take a month to come help us out after I give birth this fall. We were on the phone discussing logistics and she mentioned that she might need to do a little remote work if her supervisor doesn’t approve the month, but after a moment she said “Well, if he doesn’t approve it, I’ll probably just retire”

Good for her. She’s very conflict-averse as a rule and I feel particularly honored that she would take a stand over something that’s really for my benefit. I got some good in-laws!

This is 100% an FU story!! Here's to someone using their funds to do what's right for them :D
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Must_ache on August 17, 2023, 07:48:07 AM
Quote
When, in the history of human existence, has an exit interview created lasting change?

How would we even know if it created lasting change if we are exiting?  Maybe it would make a big difference, or no difference at all.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: SwordGuy on August 17, 2023, 09:33:30 AM
Quote
When, in the history of human existence, has an exit interview created lasting change?

How would we even know if it created lasting change if we are exiting?  Maybe it would make a big difference, or no difference at all.

I chose to give a pre-exit interview with both my client and my employer before my supervisor fired me in 30 days. 

I told my client I was going to be fired in 30 days, so we needed to take steps to make sure they knew what the status of my projects was.  They were surprised because they liked my work and me.

I told my employer what was going on and that I was looking for a new job because I was old enough to know that this kind of situation has a momentum of its own.  But they needed to know because otherwise they would be losing yet another good person (I was #3) to the same supervisor.  Needless to say, they were surprised.

I got a new job at the same client, down the hall, for more money, more vacation days, and more interesting work.

Six months later my old colleagues at work made a special trip down the hall to tell me security had escorted my old supervisor off the premises.

I made a situation that people wanted to ignore very visible and clear, and once they started paying attention, they realized he was toxic and had to to.

It was a good day. :)
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: jeninco on August 17, 2023, 09:53:39 AM
Quote
When, in the history of human existence, has an exit interview created lasting change?

How would we even know if it created lasting change if we are exiting?  Maybe it would make a big difference, or no difference at all.

I chose to give a pre-exit interview with both my client and my employer before my supervisor fired me in 30 days. 

I told my client I was going to be fired in 30 days, so we needed to take steps to make sure they knew what the status of my projects was.  They were surprised because they liked my work and me.

I told my employer what was going on and that I was looking for a new job because I was old enough to know that this kind of situation has a momentum of its own.  But they needed to know because otherwise they would be losing yet another good person (I was #3) to the same supervisor.  Needless to say, they were surprised.

I got a new job at the same client, down the hall, for more money, more vacation days, and more interesting work.

Six months later my old colleagues at work made a special trip down the hall to tell me security had escorted my old supervisor off the premises.

I made a situation that people wanted to ignore very visible and clear, and once they started paying attention, they realized he was toxic and had to to.

It was a good day. :)

In absolute seriousness, great job! Way to make things better for those left behind!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: LennStar on August 17, 2023, 10:45:47 AM
@SwordGuy *Sending you a big cake through da intanetz*
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: fuzzy math on August 17, 2023, 06:26:21 PM
Well it happened yesterday, I quit! Gave 3 weeks notice so my last day is Dec 22. Now I just have to survive any weird attempts to sabotage or force me out the door.

Contracting company guy never showed up Weds, he texted one of us and let us know that his agreement with the hospital is still not finalized and therefore he was asked not to come until it was final. He did drop the bomb that if certain conditions weren't met by the hospital that he would back out of the contract.

Everything came to a head Weds night when I received a call from a physician friend warning me that my older befuddled coworker had had a patient care related accident and was loudly cursing and screaming my name telling everyone that it was my fault. I had been home for hours and had only tangentially touched the item he was using, others had touched it afterwards and he had 4 hours with this particular item to orient himself to it and prepare to use it on a patient. I'm being vague obviously due to the nature of my job and not wanting to get sued. But needless to say it is NOT my fault. It became very clear that this coworker has some hatred towards me and was trying to do the only thing he could think of to keep his license and his job. I spent the night in abject terror of what I was going to arrive to at work on Thurs and what attempts to sabotage me this coworker might employ in the future.

Was approached by a chief physician asking if we had the equipment needed to safely provide patient care on Thurs at the beginning of my shift. I let him know about the shortages we had, it devolved into an argument where he accused my team of trying to ration or refuse patient care based on not having supplies. I told him we were completely out of safety items needed to do our jobs properly. He asked me if it was comfort or safety keeping us from doing things. I stated that I was clinically able to do anything, but whether it was wise or not was another matter. I then asked him if that patient care related accident from the previous night was safety or comfort. I told him that my team hadn't felt support from our bosses in a long time, but that we had always leaned on him for back up and support but that this was the first time I felt I no longer had support from him.

Made the split decision that I no longer shared any values with this organization and that I was at the risk of being sabotaged in the future. Decided I did not want to work at the end of the month when my accident prone coworker and I would be the only 2 people on the schedule. Walked to my office, called my husband and told him today was the day. He agreed. I called my other (reasonable coworker who is also going to quit), told him it was the day and coordinated dates with him because I would be dumping Christmas coverage on him if I quit. Then I wrote a 2 sentence email to my boss and bosses boss. Walked back to my work area and proceeded to do my job.

At some point the chief physician unknowingly walked into a meeting with the 2 level bosses and my (reasonable quitting) coworker. They were trying to discuss the void that I was creating by leaving and what to do about all of the supply issues I've been singlehandedly attempting to fix. Physician found out then and there "what??? fuzzy_math just quit??"  LOL. He knows exactly what led to my decision.

Needless to say he was a bit quiet when he returned to the area where we work. Bosses, this physician and others called a mandatory meeting with contracting company (who still hasn't signed an agreement) to try to figure out what to do about the loss of a person on a 3 member team. I did go speak to my immediate boss and let her know the reasons I was leaving. I said it was no longer a safe place to work and that I couldn't in good conscience stay as long as I'd intended to, but that I always would have quit in January. She let me know that she has told contracting company that they will need to investigate the problem coworker. I cannot imagine that company will sign the agreement at this point. Company will not have the staff and it would be his immediate job to figure out whether to fire the troublesome coworker after my reasonable coworker quits. Reasonable coworker has said he has the goal of getting to Dec 31 but he may quit sooner.

So I jumped the gun a bit, I'm not going to be drawing a paycheck for January, but everyone there knows I have my principles and I will not tolerate abuse or providing unsafe patient care. I consider it a win. Accident prone coworker doesn't know I've quit yet but he will find out one way or another today. I'm hoping to avoid fireworks there.

A happy follow up -

-My immediate manager, and the high level administrator above her have both been fired.
-Neither of my former coworkers go to that hospital any more, they fulfill the contract at a different hospital but are still employed by the old hospital. I think the hospital is afraid of being sued and is just waiting to see what happens. Also the administrator who signed all the contracts is gone, so someone new has to sort through the mess left behind.
-The contracting group hired to fill the void at the main hospital is a hot mess and everyone hates the only locums guy who stays frequently. I hear he's miserable and has threatened to leave multiple times.

and the best part...


I LOVE MY NEW JOB and it turns out I don't hate my profession as a whole, I just couldn't continue on with my profession at the old location. We love our new location (close to where my children were born) and we see family all the time. Life is good!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: BicycleB on August 17, 2023, 07:55:58 PM
Well it happened yesterday, I quit! Gave 3 weeks notice so my last day is Dec 22. Now I just have to survive any weird attempts to sabotage or force me out the door.

Contracting company guy never showed up Weds, he texted one of us and let us know that his agreement with the hospital is still not finalized and therefore he was asked not to come until it was final. He did drop the bomb that if certain conditions weren't met by the hospital that he would back out of the contract.

Everything came to a head Weds night when I received a call from a physician friend warning me that my older befuddled coworker had had a patient care related accident and was loudly cursing and screaming my name telling everyone that it was my fault. I had been home for hours and had only tangentially touched the item he was using, others had touched it afterwards and he had 4 hours with this particular item to orient himself to it and prepare to use it on a patient. I'm being vague obviously due to the nature of my job and not wanting to get sued. But needless to say it is NOT my fault. It became very clear that this coworker has some hatred towards me and was trying to do the only thing he could think of to keep his license and his job. I spent the night in abject terror of what I was going to arrive to at work on Thurs and what attempts to sabotage me this coworker might employ in the future.

Was approached by a chief physician asking if we had the equipment needed to safely provide patient care on Thurs at the beginning of my shift. I let him know about the shortages we had, it devolved into an argument where he accused my team of trying to ration or refuse patient care based on not having supplies. I told him we were completely out of safety items needed to do our jobs properly. He asked me if it was comfort or safety keeping us from doing things. I stated that I was clinically able to do anything, but whether it was wise or not was another matter. I then asked him if that patient care related accident from the previous night was safety or comfort. I told him that my team hadn't felt support from our bosses in a long time, but that we had always leaned on him for back up and support but that this was the first time I felt I no longer had support from him.

Made the split decision that I no longer shared any values with this organization and that I was at the risk of being sabotaged in the future. Decided I did not want to work at the end of the month when my accident prone coworker and I would be the only 2 people on the schedule. Walked to my office, called my husband and told him today was the day. He agreed. I called my other (reasonable coworker who is also going to quit), told him it was the day and coordinated dates with him because I would be dumping Christmas coverage on him if I quit. Then I wrote a 2 sentence email to my boss and bosses boss. Walked back to my work area and proceeded to do my job.

At some point the chief physician unknowingly walked into a meeting with the 2 level bosses and my (reasonable quitting) coworker. They were trying to discuss the void that I was creating by leaving and what to do about all of the supply issues I've been singlehandedly attempting to fix. Physician found out then and there "what??? fuzzy_math just quit??"  LOL. He knows exactly what led to my decision.

Needless to say he was a bit quiet when he returned to the area where we work. Bosses, this physician and others called a mandatory meeting with contracting company (who still hasn't signed an agreement) to try to figure out what to do about the loss of a person on a 3 member team. I did go speak to my immediate boss and let her know the reasons I was leaving. I said it was no longer a safe place to work and that I couldn't in good conscience stay as long as I'd intended to, but that I always would have quit in January. She let me know that she has told contracting company that they will need to investigate the problem coworker. I cannot imagine that company will sign the agreement at this point. Company will not have the staff and it would be his immediate job to figure out whether to fire the troublesome coworker after my reasonable coworker quits. Reasonable coworker has said he has the goal of getting to Dec 31 but he may quit sooner.

So I jumped the gun a bit, I'm not going to be drawing a paycheck for January, but everyone there knows I have my principles and I will not tolerate abuse or providing unsafe patient care. I consider it a win. Accident prone coworker doesn't know I've quit yet but he will find out one way or another today. I'm hoping to avoid fireworks there.

A happy follow up -

-My immediate manager, and the high level administrator above her have both been fired.
-Neither of my former coworkers go to that hospital any more, they fulfill the contract at a different hospital but are still employed by the old hospital. I think the hospital is afraid of being sued and is just waiting to see what happens. Also the administrator who signed all the contracts is gone, so someone new has to sort through the mess left behind.
-The contracting group hired to fill the void at the main hospital is a hot mess and everyone hates the only locums guy who stays frequently. I hear he's miserable and has threatened to leave multiple times.

and the best part...


I LOVE MY NEW JOB and it turns out I don't hate my profession as a whole, I just couldn't continue on with my profession at the old location. We love our new location (close to where my children were born) and we see family all the time. Life is good!

Great update, @fuzzy math!!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: okits on August 17, 2023, 09:19:09 PM
A happy follow up -

-My immediate manager, and the high level administrator above her have both been fired.
-Neither of my former coworkers go to that hospital any more, they fulfill the contract at a different hospital but are still employed by the old hospital. I think the hospital is afraid of being sued and is just waiting to see what happens. Also the administrator who signed all the contracts is gone, so someone new has to sort through the mess left behind.
-The contracting group hired to fill the void at the main hospital is a hot mess and everyone hates the only locums guy who stays frequently. I hear he's miserable and has threatened to leave multiple times.

and the best part...


I LOVE MY NEW JOB and it turns out I don't hate my profession as a whole, I just couldn't continue on with my profession at the old location. We love our new location (close to where my children were born) and we see family all the time. Life is good!

I'm so thrilled to hear it, @fuzzy math !  Your old job situation sounded so stressful.  I'm glad your new job is great and I hope you've recovered a bit from the circus you left.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Adventine on August 18, 2023, 06:53:37 AM
Great it worked out for you @fuzzy math !
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: 10dollarsatatime on September 01, 2023, 11:09:55 AM
I shared this in my journal, but it's so, so appropriate for here:

in December of 2021, I had  just about had it with work.  My boss was trying to push responsibilities on my team that were not appropriate.  We were understaffed and underfunded.  I had just finished earning my bachelor's in business management and after a particularly heated discussion, I went home and did a simple job search.  And realized I had options.  That paid half again what I was earning with less responsibilities.  I applied for one of them and went through the interview process.  I didn't get it, but it was fine. 

In January of 22, COVID went through the workplace.  The boss got sick, and then sicker.  He ended up in the hospital.

Arguments or not, it should be clear that in general I liked the man and considered us friends.

In February, I started covering some of his responsibilities.  In March, they threw the budget at me with all of one week to put it together for the next fiscal year.  I started scheduling in clients for the next year, updating the contract, filling out supplemental requests, heading up a carper replacement project, etc, etc.  All while still doing my Technical Director job.  It was over hours every week.  (Government, so I accumulated comp time, as opposed to getting paid overtime.)  The city extended his FMLA by a month.  We were all expecting a recovery and that he'd come back.  Unfortunately, he passed in late April.

In all this time, I had seen his boss maybe five or six times.

After he passed, I was made temporary acting GM, still doing my original duties as well.  They didn't actually open the position for applicants until June.  They interviewed the positions in early July.

I was exhausted.  I had hit the comp time cap in June and then they HAD to start paying me overtime.  That's how much I was working.  I wasn't being paid appropriately for it.  I wasn't being trained appropriately for it.  I was burnt out, emotionally and physically.  And I had HAD it.  Finally, at the beginning of August, after weeks of tears, lamenting to the husband, and looking at the numbers that said I could take a year off and not be any worse off than we were at that point, I decided I was done.  I told hubs.  I called my mother.  I emailed the boss and the city recruiting guy in HR on a Monday morning.  Two sentences.  I'm withdrawing my application.  yada yada. Love 10$@aT.

Within minutes, I got a call from the boss.  "I'm coming to pick you up so we can talk."  He took me to breakfast and we talked about why.  (I've been doing double duty for six months with nearly not support.) He asked me to reconsider.  "This kind of thing never happens!" (It has! To me! Twice now!  There's an FU story in here somewhere about the last time!)  "It could be better."  "There could be more support."  "You can take time off."  "The rec center and ice arena managers could step in while you recharge."  (I'm not sure that actually would have worked.) 

I reminded him that I had emailed HR guy.

"I can kill HR guy."

I told him I'd think about it.

A few days later we met in his office and I told him that if he could guarantee that change could and would happen, I would consider accepting the job.  But if I wasn't offered it, I was quitting the job completely.  That took him off-guard.  I hadn't planned on telling him.  When I withdrew, I had figured on helping the new GM get situated and then I would turn in my notice.  But it came up, so I told him it was all or nothing.

I got offered the job.  With a $17,000 raise and lots of vacation. 

I stayed. 

(He's kept enough of his promises that I'm not mad about it.)
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: RWTL on September 01, 2023, 12:01:28 PM
I shared this in my journal, but it's so, so appropriate for here:

in December of 2021, I had  just about had it with work.  My boss was trying to push responsibilities on my team that were not appropriate.  We were understaffed and underfunded.  I had just finished earning my bachelor's in business management and after a particularly heated discussion, I went home and did a simple job search.  And realized I had options.  That paid half again what I was earning with less responsibilities.  I applied for one of them and went through the interview process.  I didn't get it, but it was fine. 

In January of 22, COVID went through the workplace.  The boss got sick, and then sicker.  He ended up in the hospital.

Arguments or not, it should be clear that in general I liked the man and considered us friends.

In February, I started covering some of his responsibilities.  In March, they threw the budget at me with all of one week to put it together for the next fiscal year.  I started scheduling in clients for the next year, updating the contract, filling out supplemental requests, heading up a carper replacement project, etc, etc.  All while still doing my Technical Director job.  It was over hours every week.  (Government, so I accumulated comp time, as opposed to getting paid overtime.)  The city extended his FMLA by a month.  We were all expecting a recovery and that he'd come back.  Unfortunately, he passed in late April.

In all this time, I had seen his boss maybe five or six times.

After he passed, I was made temporary acting GM, still doing my original duties as well.  They didn't actually open the position for applicants until June.  They interviewed the positions in early July.

I was exhausted.  I had hit the comp time cap in June and then they HAD to start paying me overtime.  That's how much I was working.  I wasn't being paid appropriately for it.  I wasn't being trained appropriately for it.  I was burnt out, emotionally and physically.  And I had HAD it.  Finally, at the beginning of August, after weeks of tears, lamenting to the husband, and looking at the numbers that said I could take a year off and not be any worse off than we were at that point, I decided I was done.  I told hubs.  I called my mother.  I emailed the boss and the city recruiting guy in HR on a Monday morning.  Two sentences.  I'm withdrawing my application.  yada yada. Love 10$@aT.

Within minutes, I got a call from the boss.  "I'm coming to pick you up so we can talk."  He took me to breakfast and we talked about why.  (I've been doing double duty for six months with nearly not support.) He asked me to reconsider.  "This kind of thing never happens!" (It has! To me! Twice now!  There's an FU story in here somewhere about the last time!)  "It could be better."  "There could be more support."  "You can take time off."  "The rec center and ice arena managers could step in while you recharge."  (I'm not sure that actually would have worked.) 

I reminded him that I had emailed HR guy.

"I can kill HR guy."

I told him I'd think about it.

A few days later we met in his office and I told him that if he could guarantee that change could and would happen, I would consider accepting the job.  But if I wasn't offered it, I was quitting the job completely.  That took him off-guard.  I hadn't planned on telling him.  When I withdrew, I had figured on helping the new GM get situated and then I would turn in my notice.  But it came up, so I told him it was all or nothing.

I got offered the job.  With a $17,000 raise and lots of vacation. 

I stayed. 

(He's kept enough of his promises that I'm not mad about it.)

Glad it worked out for you, even though you were put through hell to get there.  It's a shame that so many companies will grind employees into the ground before they recognize the hell they are putting them through.  For many managers, as long as it doesn't affect them, the status quo is fine.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: oneday on September 01, 2023, 09:56:08 PM
Yay, you found the thread!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: ricelife on September 04, 2023, 10:50:21 PM
didn't read all of the posts but the ones that I read were very inspiring! FU money literally gives you the balls to say "eh, I don't want to be doing this anymore, so I'm not going to. Bye folks".

I have a small FU story too:
I went off to have a baby during the pandemic. When I came back I knew I didn't want to return to the office and I wanted to keep baby with me at home (didn't want to send to daycare, for mostly emotional reasons). When the boss called me I said that I wasn't returning and he was like "what could convince you to stay?"
On a whim I said "fully remote, part time hours, I dictate the schedule, full benefits, also raise please"
He surprisingly said yes and gave me everything that I wanted! It was awesome for a while....I had my in laws and parents watch kid for a few hours a day while I worked completely remotely. Everyone was going back to the office at least 3 days a week. Since I had full benefits I got raises and bonuses and all the health benefits etc.
On the negative side people just don't understand that my hours were note 9-5 and sometimes people push you to output like a fulltimer.

Fast forward to today I am pregnant with the 2nd kid and was feeling super stressed. My hubby says to me one day "why don't you just take your maternity leave early and be done with this place?"
So yep, I'm already on maternity leave with months left to go before I give birth.
FU money is great!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Dicey on September 05, 2023, 04:11:07 PM
Congratulations, @ricelife!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Leseratte on September 05, 2023, 05:53:52 PM
Well done @ricelife!

What better reason to say no thank you than to be able to stay home with your kids!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: BicycleB on September 06, 2023, 01:58:00 AM
didn't read all of the posts but the ones that I read were very inspiring! FU money literally gives you the balls to say "eh, I don't want to be doing this anymore, so I'm not going to. Bye folks".

I have a small FU story too:
I went off to have a baby during the pandemic. When I came back I knew I didn't want to return to the office and I wanted to keep baby with me at home (didn't want to send to daycare, for mostly emotional reasons). When the boss called me I said that I wasn't returning and he was like "what could convince you to stay?"
On a whim I said "fully remote, part time hours, I dictate the schedule, full benefits, also raise please"
He surprisingly said yes and gave me everything that I wanted! It was awesome for a while....I had my in laws and parents watch kid for a few hours a day while I worked completely remotely. Everyone was going back to the office at least 3 days a week. Since I had full benefits I got raises and bonuses and all the health benefits etc.
On the negative side people just don't understand that my hours were note 9-5 and sometimes people push you to output like a fulltimer.

Fast forward to today I am pregnant with the 2nd kid and was feeling super stressed. My hubby says to me one day "why don't you just take your maternity leave early and be done with this place?"
So yep, I'm already on maternity leave with months left to go before I give birth.
FU money is great!

Totally epic!!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: jinga nation on September 06, 2023, 08:40:34 AM
didn't read all of the posts but the ones that I read were very inspiring! FU money literally gives you the balls to say "eh, I don't want to be doing this anymore, so I'm not going to. Bye folks".

I have a small FU story too:
...
FU money is great!

I'm so proud of you. Swinging that FU Money hammer is super fun, right?

The first time we exercised the FU-Money option in the workplace was when my wife delivered our 2nd. Her employer refused to allow her to work a reduced 40 hour week during tax season. They had previously allowed her this when we had our 1st child a few years prior. They implied after they allowed this change, there were other new moms using the same policy. Then some dads rightfully said this was not fair, and they too got reduced hours. Typical hours in tax season are 60-70 per week at this firm, not Big 4, but regionally huge.

My MIL was going to visit us for a couple of months and help after my mum moved in with us for the first month post-birth. So we'd have 3 months of help. I told my wife that if they don't want to accommodate her request, that she should quit, and spend time with her mum. She was worried about income; told her we have rental income that covers our mortgage, utilities, home insurance, etc. And we have an emergency fund, and more.

After her maternity leave during the tax season, she went to the office, put in a vacation request to use up her hours, which was instantly approved as it was the slow season. When that was over, she went in and put in her 2 week notice. All of a sudden, the partners and directors freaked out. They asked what they could do to make here stay. She said it was too late for action but didn't offer any specifics. They let her go and provided a 2 week severance pay. Meanwhile, during her leave, she'd negotiated with a previous employer to work for them, with 2 days WFH, work 32 hours, get paid for 40. Shorter commute.

Icing on the cake: some of her coworkers, who we're friends with outside the workplace, were also planning to have a 2nd child. With my wife's actions encouraging them, they too left that CPA firm and took industry positions that were more amenable to raising a family and/or better work-life balance.

Once we'd swung that FU hammer, it became our version of Thor's Mjölnir. We've used it judiciously when the moment required it.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: ysette9 on September 06, 2023, 10:47:33 AM
didn't read all of the posts but the ones that I read were very inspiring! FU money literally gives you the balls to say "eh, I don't want to be doing this anymore, so I'm not going to. Bye folks".

I have a small FU story too:
...
FU money is great!

I'm so proud of you. Swinging that FU Money hammer is super fun, right?

The first time we exercised the FU-Money option in the workplace was when my wife delivered our 2nd. Her employer refused to allow her to work a reduced 40 hour week during tax season. They had previously allowed her this when we had our 1st child a few years prior. They implied after they allowed this change, there were other new moms using the same policy. Then some dads rightfully said this was not fair, and they too got reduced hours. Typical hours in tax season are 60-70 per week at this firm, not Big 4, but regionally huge.

My MIL was going to visit us for a couple of months and help after my mum moved in with us for the first month post-birth. So we'd have 3 months of help. I told my wife that if they don't want to accommodate her request, that she should quit, and spend time with her mum. She was worried about income; told her we have rental income that covers our mortgage, utilities, home insurance, etc. And we have an emergency fund, and more.

After her maternity leave during the tax season, she went to the office, put in a vacation request to use up her hours, which was instantly approved as it was the slow season. When that was over, she went in and put in her 2 week notice. All of a sudden, the partners and directors freaked out. They asked what they could do to make here stay. She said it was too late for action but didn't offer any specifics. They let her go and provided a 2 week severance pay. Meanwhile, during her leave, she'd negotiated with a previous employer to work for them, with 2 days WFH, work 32 hours, get paid for 40. Shorter commute.

Icing on the cake: some of her coworkers, who we're friends with outside the workplace, were also planning to have a 2nd child. With my wife's actions encouraging them, they too left that CPA firm and took industry positions that were more amenable to raising a family and/or better work-life balance.

Once we'd swung that FU hammer, it became our version of Thor's Mjölnir. We've used it judiciously when the moment required it.
I love this. Take a stand for decent parental leave and work-life balance!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: mm1970 on September 06, 2023, 01:40:10 PM
didn't read all of the posts but the ones that I read were very inspiring! FU money literally gives you the balls to say "eh, I don't want to be doing this anymore, so I'm not going to. Bye folks".

I have a small FU story too:
...
FU money is great!

I'm so proud of you. Swinging that FU Money hammer is super fun, right?

The first time we exercised the FU-Money option in the workplace was when my wife delivered our 2nd. Her employer refused to allow her to work a reduced 40 hour week during tax season. They had previously allowed her this when we had our 1st child a few years prior. They implied after they allowed this change, there were other new moms using the same policy. Then some dads rightfully said this was not fair, and they too got reduced hours. Typical hours in tax season are 60-70 per week at this firm, not Big 4, but regionally huge.

My MIL was going to visit us for a couple of months and help after my mum moved in with us for the first month post-birth. So we'd have 3 months of help. I told my wife that if they don't want to accommodate her request, that she should quit, and spend time with her mum. She was worried about income; told her we have rental income that covers our mortgage, utilities, home insurance, etc. And we have an emergency fund, and more.

After her maternity leave during the tax season, she went to the office, put in a vacation request to use up her hours, which was instantly approved as it was the slow season. When that was over, she went in and put in her 2 week notice. All of a sudden, the partners and directors freaked out. They asked what they could do to make here stay. She said it was too late for action but didn't offer any specifics. They let her go and provided a 2 week severance pay. Meanwhile, during her leave, she'd negotiated with a previous employer to work for them, with 2 days WFH, work 32 hours, get paid for 40. Shorter commute.

Icing on the cake: some of her coworkers, who we're friends with outside the workplace, were also planning to have a 2nd child. With my wife's actions encouraging them, they too left that CPA firm and took industry positions that were more amenable to raising a family and/or better work-life balance.

Once we'd swung that FU hammer, it became our version of Thor's Mjölnir. We've used it judiciously when the moment required it.

I too love in.  I'm in tech, and long ago and far away, I went part time (30 hr/week, but paid hourly) for my last company.  My son was 18 months old when I made the switch, which lined up with when my old boss left.

Fast forward 1.5 years and there's a change at work...our group is closed down, they decide to absorb the few of us into another group.  (Just as I'm up for a 3 year overdue promotion, I might add.)  The new boss wanders by my cube to say "I'm the bad cop.  I don't believe in PT so you have to go full time." 
Why?
"It doesn't work"
But employee A (also a mom, son my kid's age) is part time.
"She's not a technical employee".
Um, with a PhD in engineering?
"Well, she's not in the critical path."
How about we try it first?
"No"

So, well, I went above his head to the Veep to talk about the promotion, got hand-waving and no answers, asked about part time, was offered "you can work 40 hours a week, but any 40 hours you want!  Any schedule!"  Um, duh?

In the end I picked up the phone and called my old boss and said "I am looking for a part time job."  And got hired.

The old company was "eh, whatever" because I was an engineer, but we had another one.  What *I* knew and what *they* didn't know is that he was leaving about a month after me.  Whoops.

Fast forward a little more...my BFF at the office gets married (I see all the peeps at the wedding, no hard feelings), then has a kid, and goes part time.  They admit "hey, we maybe didn't handle mm's thing too great.  We regret that."  But then they start pressuring her to go back to full time after a year or two.  And so...she quit.

In the meantime, the PhD is also getting pressure to go full time, so she just up and quits and starts her own consulting business.

Onto employee #4, she is probably 20 years younger than I am, has a baby...goes part time.  And they let her.  And THEY DON'T PRESSURE HER TO GO FULL TIME.

Fourth time's the charm I guess?
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: ricelife on September 06, 2023, 02:29:30 PM
Thanks @Dicey, @Leseratte and @BicycleB!

@jinga nation - that's an amazing story for your wife and all of her colleagues who benefited from the FU money mindset! I feel so bad for those parents or caregivers out there who cannot financially swing their Mjolnir in times of need. I think about a coworker who's mother was going into hospice and she couldn't afford to take too much time off so she was incredibly stressed and was crying at her desk. She was working all day and then visiting her mother for long hours at night and dealing with all the medical stuff. Same thing when the mom eventually passed she had to work while dealing with the grief and end of life arrangements.
This can literally happen to anyone who doesn't have a big enough stache. Everyone has at least someone that will rely on them at some point - like a parent, sibling, pet, child etc.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Sandi_k on September 06, 2023, 09:10:42 PM

I think about a coworker who's mother was going into hospice and she couldn't afford to take too much time off so she was incredibly stressed and was crying at her desk. She was working all day and then visiting her mother for long hours at night and dealing with all the medical stuff. Same thing when the mom eventually passed she had to work while dealing with the grief and end of life arrangements.

This can literally happen to anyone who doesn't have a big enough stache. Everyone has at least someone that will rely on them at some point - like a parent, sibling, pet, child etc.

Hmm. I turned down a (most probable) job offer/promotion this morning, because my FIL just entered hospice care, and my 86 year old mom is declining. I do NOT want to be that person. Your account is like the third "UNIVERSE IS SHOUTING AT YOU TO SAY NO" post I've seen.

Good call. Thanks for the reinforcement.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: ricelife on September 06, 2023, 09:37:54 PM

I think about a coworker who's mother was going into hospice and she couldn't afford to take too much time off so she was incredibly stressed and was crying at her desk. She was working all day and then visiting her mother for long hours at night and dealing with all the medical stuff. Same thing when the mom eventually passed she had to work while dealing with the grief and end of life arrangements.

This can literally happen to anyone who doesn't have a big enough stache. Everyone has at least someone that will rely on them at some point - like a parent, sibling, pet, child etc.

Hmm. I turned down a (most probable) job offer/promotion this morning, because my FIL just entered hospice care, and my 86 year old mom is declining. I do NOT want to be that person. Your account is like the third "UNIVERSE IS SHOUTING AT YOU TO SAY NO" post I've seen.

Good call. Thanks for the reinforcement.

I'm so sorry to hear about your FIL and your mom. It really sucks that they are getting older and not healthy anymore but that is life. The universe is definitely telling you to prioritize your family and not chase the dollars because you don't HAVE TO.
Coworker was in really rough shape I gotta tell you. On top of being financially stressed she had no help from other relatives because they all live far away and she is still supporting her teenage son. Some of our coworkers started a small collection for her and she was so appreciative.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Freedomin5 on September 28, 2023, 03:28:14 AM
I may have one developing. I was recently promoted to team lead, and there are two extremely toxic, passive-aggressive coworkers on the team who take every opportunity to undermine not just my authority, but the authority of anyone who asks them to do anything they don’t want to do.

After receiving multiple complaints about their competence from multiple departments and multiple clients who have had negative interactions with them over the past two years, and copious amounts of documentation from me now that I have to work closely with them, HR and the CEO gave them a warning. HR said they should have better attitudes now.

Less than 24 hours later, I walked into a meeting where they acted very unprofessionally and disrespectfully towards a senior director in the company who was introducing new standards that our team needs to follow (ie, telling us what to do). Their piss poor behavior is completely in line with their past behavior patterns.

Contract renewals are coming up in a couple weeks, and I have decided that I am unwilling to work with these toxic people anymore. Thanks to FU money, I felt comfortable documenting and reporting their most recent terrible behavior. I also stated that their behavior has influenced my thoughts about contract renewals. I clearly stated that I enjoy working for the company and I enjoy my role, but I am unwilling to put up with them for another year. My manager is aware that if the company doesn’t get rid of them, I want a demotion back to my old non-managerial role. And if they force me to keep my current role and give the toxic workers new contracts, then I am not signing a new contract. My manager says the company doesn’t want to lose me.

 We are FI, so I’m fine with whatever decision the company makes.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Trifle on September 28, 2023, 03:58:54 AM

Way to go @Freedomin5!   Nothing makes gutless upper managers squirm more than actually having to make decisions like this.  Hopefully -- faced with a clear choice between two toxic employees and a good manager willing to call them on their shit - they'll make the right call. 

Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Gronnie on September 28, 2023, 12:56:44 PM

Way to go @Freedomin5!   Nothing makes gutless upper managers squirm more than actually having to make decisions like this.  Hopefully -- faced with a clear choice between two toxic employees and a good manager willing to call them on their shit - they'll make the right call.

My money is on them making the wrong decision.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: RyanAtTanagra on September 28, 2023, 01:53:19 PM

Way to go @Freedomin5!   Nothing makes gutless upper managers squirm more than actually having to make decisions like this.  Hopefully -- faced with a clear choice between two toxic employees and a good manager willing to call them on their shit - they'll make the right call.

My money is on them making the wrong decision.

Yea unfortunately it's A LOT easier to let someone walk, than to fire someone else, and higher ups generally do whatever is easiest for them.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Must_ache on October 10, 2023, 11:09:05 AM
I told my boss (who 99% of the time is reasonable) that I will quit in six months.  I'm the only person doing my job, so a transition to some newly-hired person would be ideal.  A brief email exchange:

Me: I might be amenable to a short part-time transition if it turns out that the timing of the hiring of my eventual replacement were near my end date.  During a short transition I wouldn’t plan on getting involved in Task X, although I could be involved in doing just about anything else.

Boss: If the company is going to continue paying you, then you aren’t going to decide when you want to work and what projects you will work on.

Me: In the event of a short-term transition, there will be conditions on what projects I work on.  Only one condition really, I just stated it (Task X).  If you don’t like it, obviously there won’t be a short-term transition.  Both parties have to agree.

Boss: There has to be interest on your end and there has to be an offer on my end.  So lets just ignore this part time hypothetical until we get there.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: ATtiny85 on October 10, 2023, 11:33:42 AM
That's awesome. I am sure once it gets closer (when they struggle to find someone...) there will be a much nicer conversation started by boss.

Can't wait to hear how it plays out.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: ysette9 on October 10, 2023, 11:36:34 AM
I told my boss (who 99% of the time is reasonable) that I will quit in six months.  I'm the only person doing my job, so a transition to some newly-hired person would be ideal.  A brief email exchange:

Me: I might be amenable to a short part-time transition if it turns out that the timing of the hiring of my eventual replacement were near my end date.  During a short transition I wouldn’t plan on getting involved in Task X, although I could be involved in doing just about anything else.

Boss: If the company is going to continue paying you, then you aren’t going to decide when you want to work and what projects you will work on.

Me: In the event of a short-term transition, there will be conditions on what projects I work on.  Only one condition really, I just stated it (Task X).  If you don’t like it, obviously there won’t be a short-term transition.  Both parties have to agree.

Boss: There has to be interest on your end and there has to be an offer on my end.  So lets just ignore this part time hypothetical until we get there.
Sounds like they are going to be figuring out how to get your replacement up to speed on their own
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Must_ache on October 10, 2023, 11:40:51 AM
For more context, my boss asked for a signed and dated letter saying I would quit April 5.  i said no, not unless there are written guarantees about my march bonus (which is usually about $15-$20K, but is there any chance they would shaft me since I've promised to leave).
But it sounds like he really needs this letter to start hiring a replacement.  He says now he's going to plan on April 5 and I told him as long as everything proceeds normally that is what he should plan for.

I"m the only one who can train my replacement.  Nobody else has my skills and knowledge apart from the boss who could but is (1) too busy, and (2) several states away.

I'm not trying to be a PITA, just protecting myself.

Quote
That's awesome. I am sure once it gets closer (when they struggle to find someone...) there will be a much nicer conversation started by boss.
Can't wait to hear how it plays out.

My company can be stingy with head count.  I'm an actuary, that is pretty specialized knowledge but there are a fair number of actuaries in this city although only me in this company.  It's a small part of a big well-known company but probably not on anyone's radar who might be looking for a job.  I was lucky to stumble across it nine years ago. 
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Catbert on October 10, 2023, 11:52:32 AM
^^^Very likely that your manager can't start recruiting until he has "official" notification with a firm date that you're quitting.  When I was a government HR Manager, recruiting couldn't start until there was a signed resignation/retirement form submitted.  If recruiting had started and employee changed their mind and wanted to stay they didn't have to let you rescind your resignation.

It doesn't sound like you work for a Federal government, but I would envision large corporations to have similar rules.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: LennStar on October 10, 2023, 12:26:52 PM
Yeah, that makes a lot of sense in any company big enough to actually have a HR department.

Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: AlanStache on October 10, 2023, 12:43:36 PM
"Very likely that your manager can't start recruiting until he has "official" notification with a firm date that you're quitting." Not Must_ache's problem.

As always get agreements in writing and in your personal possession.

I gave notice on the 3rd (last week) offering per company handbook to continue for 2 months.  Company counter offered with my last day "doing stuff" to be the 6th (last friday) and to use vacation for the forward months.  I too had very specialized knowledge.  Was no discussion of hiring and training a replacement, or even an exit interview (so far...), was with the company +20 years.  My first real day of FIRE is today (monday was a holiday) is going about perfectly.   It was time to leave the company, stupid shit was piling up and becoming unbearable, especially with 25x in the bank. 

"Boss: There has to be interest on your end and there has to be an offer on my end.  So lets just ignore this part time hypothetical until we get there."

Sounds like the boss does not want you on during a transition period post final date.  Also sounds like there will not be appropriate levels of respect shown to you.  "My last day will be April 5th, I will be unavailable there after".  Boss does not have your best interests at heart - act accordingly.  But maybe I am just past jaded and in need of decompression time <shrug>.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: ysette9 on October 10, 2023, 12:46:49 PM
"Very likely that your manager can't start recruiting until he has "official" notification with a firm date that you're quitting." Not Must_ache's problem.

As always get agreements in writing and in your personal possession.

I gave notice on the 3rd (last week) offering per company handbook to continue for 2 months.  Company counter offered with my last day "doing stuff" to be the 6th (last friday) and to use vacation for the forward months.  I too had very specialized knowledge.  Was no discussion of hiring and training a replacement, or even an exit interview (so far...), was with the company +20 years.  My first real day of FIRE is today (monday was a holiday) is going about perfectly.   It was time to leave the company, stupid shit was piling up and becoming unbearable, especially with 25x in the bank. 

"Boss: There has to be interest on your end and there has to be an offer on my end.  So lets just ignore this part time hypothetical until we get there."

Sounds like the boss does not want you on during a transition period post final date.  Also sounds like there will not be appropriate levels of respect shown to you.  "My last day will be April 5th, I will be unavailable there after".  Boss does not have your best interests at heart - act accordingly.  But maybe I am just past jaded and in need of decompression time <shrug>.
Congrats on FIREing! Good luck with your decompression and everything that comes next
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Must_ache on October 10, 2023, 01:17:00 PM
Quote
Congrats on FIREing! Good luck with your decompression and everything that comes next

Thanks I'm looking to work half time at some point, but with nearly $1.4M I won't have to rush anything.  For the last several years I have been stashing almost half my pay away, so the plan is to work half as much as stash no pay away and give those assets a chance to grow some more.  I currently do some tutoring and I enjoy a small amount of Uber delivering.  I can teach math at the college level.  But until this job ends it's impractical to look for or apply to anything half-time and remote.

Quote
Sounds like the boss does not want you on during a transition period post final date.  Also sounds like there will not be appropriate levels of respect shown to you.  "My last day will be April 5th, I will be unavailable there after".  Boss does not have your best interests at heart - act accordingly.  But maybe I am just past jaded and in need of decompression time <shrug>

Boss has already made it clear they don't want two people on long-term.  The uncertainty is hiring someone and making sure I leave.  If they could hire someone by January, that would allow a 3-month transition in which case I probably wouldn't be needed longer, which is fine.  If they don't bring someone on until March, then they will probably want me stick around.  Boss is not trying to screw me, just trying to get his way.  I'm willing to cooperate subject to my own conditions.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: fuzzy math on October 10, 2023, 02:17:38 PM

Boss: If the company is going to continue paying you, then you aren’t going to decide when you want to work and what projects you will work on.

Me: In the event of a short-term transition, there will be conditions on what projects I work on.  Only one condition really, I just stated it (Task X).  If you don’t like it, obviously there won’t be a short-term transition.  Both parties have to agree.

Boss: There has to be interest on your end and there has to be an offer on my end.  So lets just ignore this part time hypothetical until we get there.

Bluff called beautifully. Rather than the boss admitting they don't have the upper hand, they just tabled the discussion. LOOOOOL
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Gremlin on October 10, 2023, 05:32:52 PM

Boss: If the company is going to continue paying you, then you aren’t going to decide when you want to work and what projects you will work on.

Me: In the event of a short-term transition, there will be conditions on what projects I work on.  Only one condition really, I just stated it (Task X).  If you don’t like it, obviously there won’t be a short-term transition.  Both parties have to agree.

Boss: There has to be interest on your end and there has to be an offer on my end.  So lets just ignore this part time hypothetical until we get there.

Bluff called beautifully. Rather than the boss admitting they don't have the upper hand, they just tabled the discussion. LOOOOOL

I love watching the penny drop when people think they hold all the cards in a negotiation, only to realise that you're not even playing to the same rules as them...
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: jinga nation on October 11, 2023, 08:55:21 AM
Quote
Congrats on FIREing! Good luck with your decompression and everything that comes next

Thanks I'm looking to work half time at some point, but with nearly $1.4M I won't have to rush anything.  For the last several years I have been stashing almost half my pay away, so the plan is to work half as much as stash no pay away and give those assets a chance to grow some more.  I currently do some tutoring and I enjoy a small amount of Uber delivering.  I can teach math at the college level.  But until this job ends it's impractical to look for or apply to anything half-time and remote.

Quote
Sounds like the boss does not want you on during a transition period post final date.  Also sounds like there will not be appropriate levels of respect shown to you.  "My last day will be April 5th, I will be unavailable there after".  Boss does not have your best interests at heart - act accordingly.  But maybe I am just past jaded and in need of decompression time <shrug>

Boss has already made it clear they don't want two people on long-term.  The uncertainty is hiring someone and making sure I leave.  If they could hire someone by January, that would allow a 3-month transition in which case I probably wouldn't be needed longer, which is fine.  If they don't bring someone on until March, then they will probably want me stick around.  Boss is not trying to screw me, just trying to get his way.  I'm willing to cooperate subject to my own conditions.

It seems like your boss' options are between a rock and a hard place, as these type of decisions are beyond his power. Hold your cards close.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Turtle on October 11, 2023, 11:54:28 AM
"Very likely that your manager can't start recruiting until he has "official" notification with a firm date that you're quitting." Not Must_ache's problem.

As always get agreements in writing and in your personal possession.

I gave notice on the 3rd (last week) offering per company handbook to continue for 2 months.  Company counter offered with my last day "doing stuff" to be the 6th (last friday) and to use vacation for the forward months.  I too had very specialized knowledge.  Was no discussion of hiring and training a replacement, or even an exit interview (so far...), was with the company +20 years.  My first real day of FIRE is today (monday was a holiday) is going about perfectly.   It was time to leave the company, stupid shit was piling up and becoming unbearable, especially with 25x in the bank. 

"Boss: There has to be interest on your end and there has to be an offer on my end.  So lets just ignore this part time hypothetical until we get there."

Sounds like the boss does not want you on during a transition period post final date.  Also sounds like there will not be appropriate levels of respect shown to you.  "My last day will be April 5th, I will be unavailable there after".  Boss does not have your best interests at heart - act accordingly.  But maybe I am just past jaded and in need of decompression time <shrug>.

Congratulations!  Good that you get to start decompressing right away instead of waiting 2 months.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: HawkeyeNFO on October 12, 2023, 11:06:09 AM
I told my boss (who 99% of the time is reasonable) that I will quit in six months.  I'm the only person doing my job, so a transition to some newly-hired person would be ideal.  A brief email exchange:

Me: I might be amenable to a short part-time transition if it turns out that the timing of the hiring of my eventual replacement were near my end date.  During a short transition I wouldn’t plan on getting involved in Task X, although I could be involved in doing just about anything else.

Boss: If the company is going to continue paying you, then you aren’t going to decide when you want to work and what projects you will work on.

Me: In the event of a short-term transition, there will be conditions on what projects I work on.  Only one condition really, I just stated it (Task X).  If you don’t like it, obviously there won’t be a short-term transition.  Both parties have to agree.

Boss: There has to be interest on your end and there has to be an offer on my end.  So lets just ignore this part time hypothetical until we get there.

What's the point of giving 6 months notice?  Is there a requirement in your rules or agreement with the company for 6 months?  Seems like giving up a lot of leverage. 

If you were to tell them in mid-March that you planned to quit in April, then you would put the boss in a much more desperate condition where they'd be much more inclined to accept your demands.  Instead, your boss may very well already have started looking for your replacement, whether you know it or not.  And if they find someone willing to work cheaper than you, they might show you the door much sooner than April.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: RyanAtTanagra on October 12, 2023, 12:14:58 PM
What's the point of giving 6 months notice?

Yea I don't get this one either.  Do they give a 6-month notice when letting people go?

I don't treat my employer better than they treat their employees.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Sibley on October 12, 2023, 12:28:23 PM
What's the point of giving 6 months notice?

Yea I don't get this one either.  Do they give a 6-month notice when letting people go?

I don't treat my employer better than they treat their employees.

There are some fields where extended notices are common. There are some people who are ignorant. There are some people who are unwilling to say no. There are contracts that have specific requirements. All sorts of reasons, many of which are not good reasons. I don't know what OP's situation is, but this might be relevant: https://www.askamanager.org/2023/10/my-boss-told-me-not-to-quit-until-they-replace-me-but-that-could-take-months.html
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: RyanAtTanagra on October 12, 2023, 12:44:33 PM
There are some fields where extended notices are common. There are some people who are ignorant. There are some people who are unwilling to say no. There are contracts that have specific requirements. All sorts of reasons, many of which are not good reasons. I don't know what OP's situation is, but this might be relevant: https://www.askamanager.org/2023/10/my-boss-told-me-not-to-quit-until-they-replace-me-but-that-could-take-months.html

"my boss told me not to quit"  lol, jesus christ
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: ATtiny85 on October 12, 2023, 06:59:35 PM
There are some fields where extended notices are common. There are some people who are ignorant. There are some people who are unwilling to say no. There are contracts that have specific requirements. All sorts of reasons, many of which are not good reasons. I don't know what OP's situation is, but this might be relevant: https://www.askamanager.org/2023/10/my-boss-told-me-not-to-quit-until-they-replace-me-but-that-could-take-months.html

"my boss told me not to quit"  lol, jesus christ

“Well, make believe you hired someone today and double my pay, or I won’t be coming in tomorrow.”

Talk about being given the upper hand. Though I could see a younger person getting bullied by it.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Apples on October 13, 2023, 10:25:42 AM
My great-aunt.  She worked as a small business bookkeeper/office admin her entire life.  She scrimped and saved and raised 2 sons on her own, then later married, then raised her granddaughter for several years after the girl's father died and mom fell into drugs. The last 20 years of her career, she was one of 2 women in the office of a large dairy farm.  They did all the bill paying, insurance paperwork, crop insurance paperwork, invoicing, payroll, worked with the accountant on tax documents - almost all records the farm had.  The 2 office women barely got cost-of-living raises.  I think they made around $20-$25 per hour, plus health insurance.  My great aunt mentioned a retirement date to them 2 YEARS beforehand, because the job is very seasonal so a replacement would likely need to be there a full year before learning all the ropes.  They hemmed and hawed, said they'd find somebody.  You know where this is going.  They didn't find someone, she stayed 3 extra months, and then said no, I'm done.  If you need my work, I will be happy to become a contractor and bill you $50 per hour for my time, but I'll only be available for small windows of time.  They said goodbye, they wouldn't need her much, just now and then.

She regularly worked 20-25 hours per week for the next 2 years while a new person was found and trained.  Grossed roughly as much money as she had while full time, and got to go out for lunches and on hikes much more often.  Went on trips that were several weeks long.  She was on Medicare, so the health insurance didn't matter.  She never made the kind of income that would allow for a retirement before Medicare and Social Security age, but she had a solid nest egg and I'm so happy she was able to assert herself.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: LennStar on October 13, 2023, 11:44:53 AM
THat's a tear inducing story in 2 ways.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Gronnie on October 13, 2023, 03:05:22 PM
She could have charged much more I would imagine.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Must_ache on October 15, 2023, 06:09:30 PM

What's the point of giving 6 months notice?  Is there a requirement in your rules or agreement with the company for 6 months?  Seems like giving up a lot of leverage. 
If you were to tell them in mid-March that you planned to quit in April, then you would put the boss in a much more desperate condition where they'd be much more inclined to accept your demands.  Instead, your boss may very well already have started looking for your replacement, whether you know it or not.  And if they find someone willing to work cheaper than you, they might show you the door much sooner than April.

In general the company has been good to me.  I cannot be replaced overnight, specialized actuarial knowledge in an understaffed area.  I HIGHLY doubt that the boss is going to toss me on the street tomorrow, although I would be OK with it.  I'm in charge of changing our insurance rates which are going up lately, so every month the work I'm doing gets slowed down could cost them hundreds of thousands of dollars, possibly more.

I can look on the mothership company's website and see the job postings and my job isn't there.  It's true I could have sprung this on him with 2 weeks or 2 minutes notice, but there is no need to.  A year ago when I mentioned the possibilty I don't think the boss took me seriously but he does now.     
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: LightTripper on October 20, 2023, 05:34:41 AM
The way I see it, one of the gifts my FU money gives me is the ability to leave my employer in the way I choose, and in a way that leaves me feeling good about my own behaviour, and hopefully leaves some benefits to my colleagues during my winding down phase and after I've fully gone. 

For sure, many employers behave very badly (and it's wise to be prepared for that possibilty, as @Must_ache clearly is, with a willingness to walk sooner if given the push or treated badly).  But also many don't - many employers are just other people like us, trying to make something or sell a service in a way that brings value to customers and colleagues alike.  The ability to leave my career with no regrets and no bridges burned (should I ever find myself bored/unfulfilled in post-work life - unlikely as this seems to be) has a genuine value to me.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Simpli-Fi on November 30, 2023, 09:03:13 AM
Not quite "epic" but an FU money story for sure.

I downshifted in 2020 and life was good, then all this recession talk back in 2021 timed with a real job reaching out to me, "are you looking for a new job?"..."no" I replied, then I was sold a grand vision and against my better judgement I accepted more money for more stress in 2022. 

It didn't feel good to be back in the life I left behind, but I was promised exciting/rewarding work...long story short, that never materialized.  I found myself grumpy in the office (and a little too vocal) and knew a change needed to happen.  So I reached out to HR and asked about part time policies.  My boss and I agreed on a 30hr/wk schedule and life was looking better...still eligible for full time benefits and we'd discuss my schedule in 6 months; great!

Less than 6 weeks later, I found myself in a meeting with my boss's boss badgering me about, how can I lead projects 30hr/wk..."because I'm efficient"...and how he wanted me back in the office 40+hr/week not less than 40 (obviously they make more money if I work more than they pay me).  Politely I declined, and his remarks were, "we agreed we'd re-evaluate your schedule in December."  Just to note: there was not enough billable work to justify 30hr/week and I felt I was doing them a favor.

Another (approx)6 weeks later, I found myself in another meeting about exciting new work and I was needed back in the office full time.  Again, I stated the work sounded appealing however, I wasn't interested in coming back more than 30hr/wk.  Turns out they had just sent a proposal and the work never materialized...again.

Some where during this time...my family's doctor's office notifies us they will not be taking our insurance any longer; dentist's office quit the year before and we don't use vision; so I'm left wondering why I need to be in the office 30hr/wk for full time benefits if the bulk of what I need isn't offered?!  I know "need" is probably the wrong word...but evil corp healthcare is my safety net; young kids and its all I've known for just over 21 years.  Anyway, I know which way my schedule needs to lean come December, 20 or less.

I'm fat, dumb, and happy (so to speak)...until I show up early Nov. to a meeting invite with my boss discussing my schedule once again, a full month before the agreed upon timeframe.  He makes it clear right away his boss is not flexible with my schedule any longer.  I proceed to explain the company will not be offering much benefit for me in 2024, (in not so many words) so why should I spend 40 hours a week "of my life's energy" working for them...obviously this isn't what his boss was expecting.

Thought longer about working for a bully and on Monday before Thanksgiving I put in my two weeks, which equated to only 14 hours last week and tomorrow will be my last day.  Quick look at YTD net worth gains (non RE) and they are more than twice what my salary is...I think it's going to be OK.

So far, not a single "office leader" has reached out or swung by my desk.  Hard for me to see if I'm the asshole in this situation...but I have spent some time filling out an exit interview survey...not sure if I will be submitting it or not.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: mm1970 on November 30, 2023, 10:22:26 AM
Oh, I think this is very epic.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: markbike528CBX on November 30, 2023, 10:33:42 AM
@Simpli-Fi   sure, you should give (not submit) them the exit survey.  Your post above is clear and well written, so you could append a redacted version of your post to the exit interview form to flesh out your reasoning for your still-epic low key FU.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Turtle on November 30, 2023, 12:00:39 PM
Here's my read between the lines on this.

Could be a short sighted 'building must be full at all times to justify the cost' thing, but my guess is it is more of a:

How is this person getting more done in 3/4th time than most of our FTEs?  It's making the other FTEs look bad!

The bean counter side should be thrilled at getting FTE type effectiveness from 3/4th pay, so that's what has me leaning towards another reason for the stupidity.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Zamboni on November 30, 2023, 01:40:40 PM
Simpli-Fi, sounds like your boss's boss is small-minded and focused more on control than productivity and profitability.

I had a job once long ago where I negotiated working 80% of full time hours as a condition of hiring me. Wednesdays off in addition to the weekends off. Without that I would not have taken the job. The boss wanted to hire me and didn't even bat an eye at granting me my desired schedule. One of my co-workers was visibly extremely bitter and jealous about it. She made many snide remarks despite the fact that I wasn't on her project, my schedule had no impact on her, and she was earning 40% more salary than I was. I'm sure the boss would have given her the same deal if she was willing to take 80% of her pay, but she wasn't. She tried all kinds of tactics to make it a problem for me, but I never caved and for the most part I simply ignored her.

Some people just can't stand the idea of another person's happiness and boundaries. The world should revolve around them, their happiness, their ideas about how it should be, and anyone who isn't following their model for control needs to be corrected. I really think it's just as simple as that. Instead of my co-worker mentally thinking "ok, great! Zamboni negotiated this schedule so it is probably available to me in the future if I need it!" she chose to think "Why is Zamboni so special? Time for me to commence peer punishment and go into full a-hole mode to anyone daring to be different!"
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: AMandM on November 30, 2023, 03:15:10 PM
Some people just can't stand the idea of another person's happiness and boundaries.

The educator John Holt said that his hardest life lesson was accepting that people will refuse to improve their lives. If you say, "Look, I lost my chains, here's how you can lose yours!" their response is, "Huh, so you think you're better than the rest of us? You're too good for chains, is that it?"
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: LennStar on December 01, 2023, 12:25:54 AM
Some people just can't stand the idea of another person's happiness and boundaries.

The educator John Holt said that his hardest life lesson was accepting that people will refuse to improve their lives. If you say, "Look, I lost my chains, here's how you can lose yours!" their response is, "Huh, so you think you're better than the rest of us? You're too good for chains, is that it?"
I think that's just part of the general aversion of change. The more important the change, the harder is the resistance.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Freedomin5 on December 01, 2023, 02:19:18 AM
Some people just can't stand the idea of another person's happiness and boundaries.

The educator John Holt said that his hardest life lesson was accepting that people will refuse to improve their lives. If you say, "Look, I lost my chains, here's how you can lose yours!" their response is, "Huh, so you think you're better than the rest of us? You're too good for chains, is that it?"
I think that's just part of the general aversion of change. The more important the change, the harder is the resistance.

Change is hard. It’s much easier to whine and complain, and blame others for the problems rather than trying to better the situation or find a solution. And of course, bash others and do your best to get in the way of others who actually actively look to better their situations.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: mm1970 on December 01, 2023, 10:45:47 AM
Some people just can't stand the idea of another person's happiness and boundaries.

The educator John Holt said that his hardest life lesson was accepting that people will refuse to improve their lives. If you say, "Look, I lost my chains, here's how you can lose yours!" their response is, "Huh, so you think you're better than the rest of us? You're too good for chains, is that it?"
I think that's just part of the general aversion of change. The more important the change, the harder is the resistance.

Change is hard. It’s much easier to whine and complain, and blame others for the problems rather than trying to better the situation or find a solution. And of course, bash others and do your best to get in the way of others who actually actively look to better their situations.
I have a coworker to decided to ease into retirement by going part time, but he wanted to keep the benefits, so that meant at least 30 h/ week.  Though he would have preferred 25.

Anyway, another slightly older coworker got pissed.  Always made snarky comments about working PT.  He also made a lot of snarky comments about people WFH, thinking they weren't really working.  I explained to him that it really depends on the person.  This was all before COVID. During COVID, the snarky coworker was at the office every day, because he had that kind of job.

After COVID, he moved 2.5 hours away, and started taking the train to work 3 days a week, would be at the office for 2.5 hours a day.  "I get so much work done on the train!"  I don't remember the last time he came in - at least 6 months.  Funny that.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Laura33 on December 01, 2023, 11:17:39 AM
Here's my read between the lines on this.

Could be a short sighted 'building must be full at all times to justify the cost' thing, but my guess is it is more of a:

How is this person getting more done in 3/4th time than most of our FTEs I am?  It's making the other FTEs me look bad!

The bean counter side should be thrilled at getting FTE type effectiveness from 3/4th pay, so that's what has me leaning towards another reason for the stupidity.

FTFY
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Turtle on December 01, 2023, 11:19:38 AM
Here's my read between the lines on this.

Could be a short sighted 'building must be full at all times to justify the cost' thing, but my guess is it is more of a:

How is this person getting more done in 3/4th time than most of our FTEs I am?  It's making the other FTEs me look bad!

The bean counter side should be thrilled at getting FTE type effectiveness from 3/4th pay, so that's what has me leaning towards another reason for the stupidity.

FTFY

Ha!  Yes.  ;-)
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Simpli-Fi on December 02, 2023, 05:28:56 PM
@Simpli-Fi   sure, you should give (not submit) them the exit survey.  Your post above is clear and well written, so you could append a redacted version of your post to the exit interview form to flesh out your reasoning for your still-epic low key FU.

I ended up submitting the survey.  I fed the questions and my original answers into chatGPT then asked it to make me sound more sincere, with a little editing/deleting I think the tone and delivery will have a better shot at being received.

I can breathe a little easier and think more clearly today!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Catbert on December 03, 2023, 01:25:04 PM
@Simpli-Fi   sure, you should give (not submit) them the exit survey.  Your post above is clear and well written, so you could append a redacted version of your post to the exit interview form to flesh out your reasoning for your still-epic low key FU.

I ended up submitting the survey.  I fed the questions and my original answers into chatGPT then asked it to make me sound more sincere, with a little editing/deleting I think the tone and delivery will have a better shot at being received.

I can breathe a little easier and think more clearly today!

chatGPT is sounds more sincere than a human?  Now that's some AI I can use.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: merula on December 04, 2023, 01:14:18 PM
chatGPT is sounds more sincere than a human?  Now that's some AI I can use.

Can confirm! One of my first uses of ChatGPT was to ask it to compose a condolences text because some people I really disliked had died. (These were family-of-family that I had known tangentially, they were actively cruel to me as a child and then turned MAGA. I am not sorry they're gone, but people I care about were mourning, so I felt like I had to say something.) It needed some tweaking but was overall pretty good.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: SwordGuy on December 04, 2023, 03:10:48 PM
chatGPT is sounds more sincere than a human?  Now that's some AI I can use.

Can confirm! One of my first uses of ChatGPT was to ask it to compose a condolences text because some people I really disliked had died. (These were family-of-family that I had known tangentially, they were actively cruel to me as a child and then turned MAGA. I am not sorry they're gone, but people I care about were mourning, so I felt like I had to say something.) It needed some tweaking but was overall pretty good.
Not sure "sincere" was the word you were looking for.

It sounds like a sincere comment would have been, "Good riddance to bad rubbish."

Perhaps the word you were looking for was "comforting", not "sincere", as in:

chatGPT sounds more comforting than human me could manage.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: AlanStache on December 04, 2023, 06:45:49 PM
chatGPT is sounds more sincere than a human?  Now that's some AI I can use.

Can confirm! One of my first uses of ChatGPT was to ask it to compose a condolences text because some people I really disliked had died. (These were family-of-family that I had known tangentially, they were actively cruel to me as a child and then turned MAGA. I am not sorry they're gone, but people I care about were mourning, so I felt like I had to say something.) It needed some tweaking but was overall pretty good.
Not sure "sincere" was the word you were looking for.

It sounds like a sincere comment would have been, "Good riddance to bad rubbish."

Perhaps the word you were looking for was "comforting", not "sincere", as in:

chatGPT sounds more comforting than human me could manage.

When a specific family member passes and if I feel obliged to write to common family I could see what human me writes being a bit sarcastic.  But I do care about the common family and they know about my issues with the specific person and editing your own written language can be hard as well as to judge tone in it.  In the end a "Sorry for your loss" when informed of a close relatives passing probably says most all of it. 

wrt ChatGPT - I was partly stuck on a programing puzzle problem today and it solved it without issue and I learned a new technique.  In other instances I have seen ChatGPT programming code be 'not even wrong'.  But for editing my English writing it has every time done a good job cleaning it up. 
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Turtle on December 27, 2023, 01:46:28 PM
This past weekend I learned of a potentially Epic FU story brewing within my extended family.

Backstory:  Eldest nephew got his Associates Degree in May 2020 and decided not to transfer to a 4 year school right away because he didn't want to be taking online courses while paying on campus level tuition.  That summer he was promoted to entry level management at the big box store where he worked.  Still lived at home, low expenses, saved a bunch of money so he'd be able to pay cash whenever he went back for his degree.

He starts looking around his company and realizes that there are opportunities to move up the ladder if he's willing to move geographically.   So he applies for and receives a promotion to go to a store near where his other grandparents live, stays with them for a while, and then gets another promotion in that geographic area.

At that point, he decides he's fine with moving around if that gets him up the ladder, and he takes another promotion that puts him in a big city almost a day's drive away.  All is going great, he can put in for another promotion after he's been there a year, and he's eligible to start training for the next level about 9 months after the transfer.

Except there's a manager in his chain who was replaced about 4-5 months ago, and the new guy has a reputation for never letting anyone transfer out.  He knows my nephew makes his store look good and he wants to keep his claws in.  This guy is blocking my nephew from starting training for the next level.  Other stores are actively recruiting my nephew to transfer to them for promotions, but without an overrule from corporate, he won't be allowed to do that.

Nephew is a young guy with no kids, no mortgage, no local family where he currently is.  In fact, he's even young enough to go back on his parent's health insurance still.  This company doesn't even have any golden handcuffs besides annual bonuses.  All that the idiot upper management guy should already have access to know.  What he may not know on top of that is that nephew has a much bigger emergency fund than people twice his age and this may be the push he needs to go back to being a college student and finish his Bachelors degree.

Update to this one.  Eldest nephew has given notice and is starting back to college this month.  No word yet on the reaction he got when he turned in said notice.

Thanks to getting together at Christmas, I have an even better additional update to this one.  Turns out that instead of completely giving notice, my nephew stepped down to being part-time, lower level employee at the store near where he's going to school. 

The key benefit this gives him is that profit sharing is based on total number of years there, and total earnings for the year.  So he's going to get a profit sharing bonus check next month that's going to be based on full time salary for 2/3rds of the year plus whatever he's earned part time since then.  I'm sure his situation wasn't one that the corporate benefits person had in mind when coming up with the employee retention/profit sharing plan.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: mistymoney on December 27, 2023, 02:44:09 PM
Some people just can't stand the idea of another person's happiness and boundaries.

The educator John Holt said that his hardest life lesson was accepting that people will refuse to improve their lives. If you say, "Look, I lost my chains, here's how you can lose yours!" their response is, "Huh, so you think you're better than the rest of us? You're too good for chains, is that it?"
I think that's just part of the general aversion of change. The more important the change, the harder is the resistance.

Change is hard. It’s much easier to whine and complain, and blame others for the problems rather than trying to better the situation or find a solution.

These are not mutually exclusive, lol! I like to whine and complain while I work on bettering my situation.......
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: AMandM on December 27, 2023, 06:56:29 PM
@Turtle what an encouraging update! Thank you!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: RWTL on December 28, 2023, 03:48:32 AM
This past weekend I learned of a potentially Epic FU story brewing within my extended family.

Backstory:  Eldest nephew got his Associates Degree in May 2020 and decided not to transfer to a 4 year school right away because he didn't want to be taking online courses while paying on campus level tuition.  That summer he was promoted to entry level management at the big box store where he worked.  Still lived at home, low expenses, saved a bunch of money so he'd be able to pay cash whenever he went back for his degree.

He starts looking around his company and realizes that there are opportunities to move up the ladder if he's willing to move geographically.   So he applies for and receives a promotion to go to a store near where his other grandparents live, stays with them for a while, and then gets another promotion in that geographic area.

At that point, he decides he's fine with moving around if that gets him up the ladder, and he takes another promotion that puts him in a big city almost a day's drive away.  All is going great, he can put in for another promotion after he's been there a year, and he's eligible to start training for the next level about 9 months after the transfer.

Except there's a manager in his chain who was replaced about 4-5 months ago, and the new guy has a reputation for never letting anyone transfer out.  He knows my nephew makes his store look good and he wants to keep his claws in.  This guy is blocking my nephew from starting training for the next level.  Other stores are actively recruiting my nephew to transfer to them for promotions, but without an overrule from corporate, he won't be allowed to do that.

Nephew is a young guy with no kids, no mortgage, no local family where he currently is.  In fact, he's even young enough to go back on his parent's health insurance still.  This company doesn't even have any golden handcuffs besides annual bonuses.  All that the idiot upper management guy should already have access to know.  What he may not know on top of that is that nephew has a much bigger emergency fund than people twice his age and this may be the push he needs to go back to being a college student and finish his Bachelors degree.

Update to this one.  Eldest nephew has given notice and is starting back to college this month.  No word yet on the reaction he got when he turned in said notice.

Thanks to getting together at Christmas, I have an even better additional update to this one.  Turns out that instead of completely giving notice, my nephew stepped down to being part-time, lower level employee at the store near where he's going to school. 

The key benefit this gives him is that profit sharing is based on total number of years there, and total earnings for the year.  So he's going to get a profit sharing bonus check next month that's going to be based on full time salary for 2/3rds of the year plus whatever he's earned part time since then.  I'm sure his situation wasn't one that the corporate benefits person had in mind when coming up with the employee retention/profit sharing plan.

That kid has a bright future ahead of him.  Good on him.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Turtle on December 28, 2023, 08:38:35 AM
All my brother's kids are bright, but his eldest is particularly ambitious.  He's got no problem with seeing what needs to be done and delegating appropriately, to the point where I doubt anyone who ever reported to him while he was climbing the management ladder had any idea how young he was. 

At one point the grandkids' topic of conversation turned to 401k/IRA, stock market, etc which kind of blew my brother's mind.  He mentioned that we'd never talked about that growing up, which is true.  Our dad has a military pension, our mother had a government one, and when we were the kids' ages most large corporations still had pensions as well, so that was the unspoken expectation around retirement at that time. 
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: LennStar on December 28, 2023, 09:53:57 AM
Our dad has a military pension, our mother had a government one, and when we were the kids' ages most large corporations still had pensions as well, so that was the unspoken expectation around retirement at that time.

SOCIALISM!!!!! ;)
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: RWTL on December 28, 2023, 10:09:11 AM
At one point the grandkids' topic of conversation turned to 401k/IRA, stock market, etc which kind of blew my brother's mind.  He mentioned that we'd never talked about that growing up, which is true. 

That must have been satisfying.  Good to see each generation incrementally improving.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Zamboni on December 28, 2023, 10:54:54 AM
This past weekend I learned of a potentially Epic FU story brewing within my extended family.

Backstory:  Eldest nephew got his Associates Degree in May 2020 and decided not to transfer to a 4 year school right away because he didn't want to be taking online courses while paying on campus level tuition.  That summer he was promoted to entry level management at the big box store where he worked.  Still lived at home, low expenses, saved a bunch of money so he'd be able to pay cash whenever he went back for his degree.

He starts looking around his company and realizes that there are opportunities to move up the ladder if he's willing to move geographically.   So he applies for and receives a promotion to go to a store near where his other grandparents live, stays with them for a while, and then gets another promotion in that geographic area.

At that point, he decides he's fine with moving around if that gets him up the ladder, and he takes another promotion that puts him in a big city almost a day's drive away.  All is going great, he can put in for another promotion after he's been there a year, and he's eligible to start training for the next level about 9 months after the transfer.

Except there's a manager in his chain who was replaced about 4-5 months ago, and the new guy has a reputation for never letting anyone transfer out.  He knows my nephew makes his store look good and he wants to keep his claws in.  This guy is blocking my nephew from starting training for the next level.  Other stores are actively recruiting my nephew to transfer to them for promotions, but without an overrule from corporate, he won't be allowed to do that.

Nephew is a young guy with no kids, no mortgage, no local family where he currently is.  In fact, he's even young enough to go back on his parent's health insurance still.  This company doesn't even have any golden handcuffs besides annual bonuses.  All that the idiot upper management guy should already have access to know.  What he may not know on top of that is that nephew has a much bigger emergency fund than people twice his age and this may be the push he needs to go back to being a college student and finish his Bachelors degree.

Update to this one.  Eldest nephew has given notice and is starting back to college this month.  No word yet on the reaction he got when he turned in said notice.

Thanks to getting together at Christmas, I have an even better additional update to this one.  Turns out that instead of completely giving notice, my nephew stepped down to being part-time, lower level employee at the store near where he's going to school. 

The key benefit this gives him is that profit sharing is based on total number of years there, and total earnings for the year.  So he's going to get a profit sharing bonus check next month that's going to be based on full time salary for 2/3rds of the year plus whatever he's earned part time since then.  I'm sure his situation wasn't one that the corporate benefits person had in mind when coming up with the employee retention/profit sharing plan.

Nice work, nephew!

It turns out nearly every HR manual has what can best be referred to as "Loopholes" that can benefit the employee if you read carefully. Which you should, because they absolutely will interpret in their favor instead whenever they can.

One of the first "real" jobs I had they hired me in November and wanted me to start beginning of January. But then I read the HR benefits handbook that they sent along with the offer letter and realized if I started any time in Dec I would have an entire extra year of "time served" towards benefits, seniority, etc. AND I'd receive the bonus for that entire year in Feb, which made no sense, but I don't make the rules. Told the hiring manager I wanted to start Dec 19th instead, and he was hesitant because "no one would be around" and there was a total corporate shut down where no one worked between Christmas Eve and Jan 2nd. But I told him it would really be good to get the administrative stuff like HR orientation out of the way and I was excited to start, and so he reluctantly agreed it was fine. And so I started Dec 19th, worked a couple of days reading the HR manual, had the holidays off like everyone else, began my "second" year of service in Jan, and got the departmental bonus in Feb. And I was also fully vested for the retirement pension when I left ~four years later because according to their methods it was after 5 years of service, which was the time required for vesting.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Turtle on December 28, 2023, 10:59:50 AM
This past weekend I learned of a potentially Epic FU story brewing within my extended family.

Backstory:  Eldest nephew got his Associates Degree in May 2020 and decided not to transfer to a 4 year school right away because he didn't want to be taking online courses while paying on campus level tuition.  That summer he was promoted to entry level management at the big box store where he worked.  Still lived at home, low expenses, saved a bunch of money so he'd be able to pay cash whenever he went back for his degree.

He starts looking around his company and realizes that there are opportunities to move up the ladder if he's willing to move geographically.   So he applies for and receives a promotion to go to a store near where his other grandparents live, stays with them for a while, and then gets another promotion in that geographic area.

At that point, he decides he's fine with moving around if that gets him up the ladder, and he takes another promotion that puts him in a big city almost a day's drive away.  All is going great, he can put in for another promotion after he's been there a year, and he's eligible to start training for the next level about 9 months after the transfer.

Except there's a manager in his chain who was replaced about 4-5 months ago, and the new guy has a reputation for never letting anyone transfer out.  He knows my nephew makes his store look good and he wants to keep his claws in.  This guy is blocking my nephew from starting training for the next level.  Other stores are actively recruiting my nephew to transfer to them for promotions, but without an overrule from corporate, he won't be allowed to do that.

Nephew is a young guy with no kids, no mortgage, no local family where he currently is.  In fact, he's even young enough to go back on his parent's health insurance still.  This company doesn't even have any golden handcuffs besides annual bonuses.  All that the idiot upper management guy should already have access to know.  What he may not know on top of that is that nephew has a much bigger emergency fund than people twice his age and this may be the push he needs to go back to being a college student and finish his Bachelors degree.

Update to this one.  Eldest nephew has given notice and is starting back to college this month.  No word yet on the reaction he got when he turned in said notice.

Thanks to getting together at Christmas, I have an even better additional update to this one.  Turns out that instead of completely giving notice, my nephew stepped down to being part-time, lower level employee at the store near where he's going to school. 

The key benefit this gives him is that profit sharing is based on total number of years there, and total earnings for the year.  So he's going to get a profit sharing bonus check next month that's going to be based on full time salary for 2/3rds of the year plus whatever he's earned part time since then.  I'm sure his situation wasn't one that the corporate benefits person had in mind when coming up with the employee retention/profit sharing plan.

Nice work, nephew!

It turns out nearly every HR manual has what can best be referred to as "Loopholes" that can benefit the employee if you read carefully. Which you should, because they absolutely will interpret in their favor instead whenever they can.

One of the first "real" jobs I had they hired me in November and wanted me to start beginning of January. But then I read the HR benefits handbook that they sent along with the offer letter and realized if I started any time in Dec I would have an entire extra year of "time served" towards benefits, seniority, etc. AND I'd receive the bonus for that entire year in Feb, which made no sense, but I don't make the rules. Told the hiring manager I wanted to start Dec 19th instead, and he was hesitant because "no one would be around" and there was a total corporate shut down where no one worked between Christmas Eve and Jan 2nd. But I told him it would really be good to get the administrative stuff like HR orientation out of the way and I was excited to start, and so he reluctantly agreed it was fine. And so I started Dec 19th, worked a couple of days reading the HR manual, had the holidays off like everyone else, began my "second" year of service in Jan, and got the departmental bonus in Feb. And I was also fully vested for the retirement pension when I left ~four years later because according to their methods it was after 5 years of service, which was the time required for vesting.

I'll bet they didn't usually have people read that whole handbook.  Good for you!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: jinga nation on January 08, 2024, 08:00:32 AM
Thought this might not be epic to most MMMers, but maybe to non-Mustachians.

Wife and I know we've got FU money. She had to travel overseas for a family member's medical emergency on the weekend.
Paying stupid prices for a flight to Southeast Asia in less than 24 hours? No issue.
Booked hotel rooms for her sis and bro too? No problem. (They're well off. We have the classic Asian problem of everyone wants to pay for others. But being able to book for her bro who's taking care of the parents on travel, and her sis who has work and kid issues to deal with - that's when money becomes a tool to lighten their burden, etc.)
Wife told her boss and offered to quit. He said "Nope, go and take care of family. Go buy a portable monitor and expense it. Expense anything else you may need for work or related to it." She may do a bit of admin work but nothing else. He didn't even talk about hours or pay. Good chap!
Her initial 5 weeks might become longer, and she'll offer again to quit. We'd discussed her quitting in a couple of years, but her taking the option now doesn't change things one bit.

Being frugal helps build a financial Mjolnir to strike at the right time.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Adventine on January 08, 2024, 09:03:27 AM
Thought this might not be epic to most MMMers, but maybe to non-Mustachians.

Wife and I know we've got FU money. She had to travel overseas for a family member's medical emergency on the weekend.
Paying stupid prices for a flight to Southeast Asia in less than 24 hours? No issue.
Booked hotel rooms for her sis and bro too? No problem. (They're well off. We have the classic Asian problem of everyone wants to pay for others. But being able to book for her bro who's taking care of the parents on travel, and her sis who has work and kid issues to deal with - that's when money becomes a tool to lighten their burden, etc.)
Wife told her boss and offered to quit. He said "Nope, go and take care of family. Go buy a portable monitor and expense it. Expense anything else you may need for work or related to it." She may do a bit of admin work but nothing else. He didn't even talk about hours or pay. Good chap!
Her initial 5 weeks might become longer, and she'll offer again to quit. We'd discussed her quitting in a couple of years, but her taking the option now doesn't change things one bit.

Being frugal helps build a financial Mjolnir to strike at the right time.


Good for you and your wife!


I've also had to book emergency flights to Southeast Asia for the exact same reason.


Hope the family member's medical issue gets resolved in a positive way.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Chaplin on January 08, 2024, 09:52:16 AM
Being frugal helps build a financial Mjolnir to strike at the right time.

That's a line for the ages!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: glacio09 on January 09, 2024, 07:32:12 AM
Thought this might not be epic to most MMMers, but maybe to non-Mustachians.

Wife and I know we've got FU money. She had to travel overseas for a family member's medical emergency on the weekend.
Paying stupid prices for a flight to Southeast Asia in less than 24 hours? No issue.
Booked hotel rooms for her sis and bro too? No problem. (They're well off. We have the classic Asian problem of everyone wants to pay for others. But being able to book for her bro who's taking care of the parents on travel, and her sis who has work and kid issues to deal with - that's when money becomes a tool to lighten their burden, etc.)
Wife told her boss and offered to quit. He said "Nope, go and take care of family. Go buy a portable monitor and expense it. Expense anything else you may need for work or related to it." She may do a bit of admin work but nothing else. He didn't even talk about hours or pay. Good chap!
Her initial 5 weeks might become longer, and she'll offer again to quit. We'd discussed her quitting in a couple of years, but her taking the option now doesn't change things one bit.

Being frugal helps build a financial Mjolnir to strike at the right time.

I came across a quote somewhere that when you are financially stable most emergencies just become annoyances. It's been so true. Being able to focus on either the logistical and emotional problems and hand wave away the financial has been great.

On a lighter version of this, my husband grew up with travel being an extravagance and most trips being intense boy scout camping. I'm slowly easing his packing anxiety by reminding him that Berlin is not in fact the middle of nowhere and they will have toothpaste there if we need some. It's been fun.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: LennStar on January 09, 2024, 07:54:53 AM
On a lighter version of this, my husband grew up with travel being an extravagance and most trips being intense boy scout camping. I'm slowly easing his packing anxiety by reminding him that Berlin is not in fact the middle of nowhere and they will have toothpaste there if we need some. It's been fun.
Yes, we have that stuff. In nearly every supermarket, dm or Rossmann ;)

I grew up poor too and was always wondering about the complainypants that they only made one long range travel this year or - gasp - only to a German place!! (I had 2 holidays outside Germany until I was in my 20s.)
That are, of course, the same people that lament any tax increase, inflation or gas price rise as the end of the world, while I am always surprised at where the gas price is when I fill up. It always is 20 cents different from last time, sometimes up, sometimes down.
And I have problems seeing the problem with not being able to "enjoy" a crampted 12 hour flight, 12 hours of transfer to/from airport per direction, jetlag and all the other fantastic stuff I don't get to experience staying in Germany.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: dandarc on January 09, 2024, 08:07:27 AM
@jinga nation - very impactful story on why everyone should endeavor to have FU money.

Similar (much smaller scale logistically) for me in December - basically forced my mom to stay in a hotel with me post-surgery by flying up and making an offer so generous she wouldn't refuse. They could totally afford this arrangement whenever necessary but absolutely would not over irrational money worries. Was good for everyone - for multiple reasons, their house is just not very safe for a person in her 70's with mobility issues and then add on recovering from significant surgery. My mom actually thanked the hotel manager more than once for how well the accessible bathroom worked for her with all the grab-bars.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: NorthernIkigai on January 09, 2024, 08:11:14 AM
On a lighter version of this, my husband grew up with travel being an extravagance and most trips being intense boy scout camping. I'm slowly easing his packing anxiety by reminding him that Berlin is not in fact the middle of nowhere and they will have toothpaste there if we need some. It's been fun.
Yes, we have that stuff. In nearly every supermarket, dm or Rossmann ;)


...unless you arrive on a Sunday, when most of those are closed! Which may feel weird to a visiting American.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: AMandM on January 09, 2024, 09:13:59 AM
I came across a quote somewhere that when you are financially stable most emergencies just become annoyances. It's been so true. Being able to focus on either the logistical and emotional problems and hand wave away the financial has been great.

My BIL used to have a business mentor who would say, "That's a not a problem, it's an expense" if it was a problem that could be solved with (available) money.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: glacio09 on January 09, 2024, 09:18:39 AM
On a lighter version of this, my husband grew up with travel being an extravagance and most trips being intense boy scout camping. I'm slowly easing his packing anxiety by reminding him that Berlin is not in fact the middle of nowhere and they will have toothpaste there if we need some. It's been fun.
Yes, we have that stuff. In nearly every supermarket, dm or Rossmann ;)


...unless you arrive on a Sunday, when most of those are closed! Which may feel weird to a visiting American.

The Sunday I was prepared for, the Monday after being Unity day I was not. Thankfully it was only some window shopping that I was leaving to the last day of the trip. It makes for a good reason to go back.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: RWTL on January 09, 2024, 09:19:33 AM
I came across a quote somewhere that when you are financially stable most emergencies just become annoyances. It's been so true. Being able to focus on either the logistical and emotional problems and hand wave away the financial has been great.

My BIL used to have a business mentor who would say, "That's a not a problem, it's an expense" if it was a problem that could be solved with (available) money.

I like both of these thoughts and might even modify the first quote to "...most emergencies just become a non-issue."   We've had a number of things come up that I've just shrugged and said, "Ok." when perhaps in my 20's or 30's it would have been anxiety provoking.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Laura33 on January 09, 2024, 10:46:48 AM
I came across a quote somewhere that when you are financially stable most emergencies just become annoyances. It's been so true. Being able to focus on either the logistical and emotional problems and hand wave away the financial has been great.

My BIL used to have a business mentor who would say, "That's a not a problem, it's an expense" if it was a problem that could be solved with (available) money.

I like both of these thoughts and might even modify the first quote to "...most emergencies just become a non-issue."   We've had a number of things come up that I've just shrugged and said, "Ok." when perhaps in my 20's or 30's it would have been anxiety provoking.

I call this "solving a problem by throwing money at it."  Terrible if you do it all the time, but amazingly freeing to know you can when you really need to.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: jeninco on January 09, 2024, 12:46:44 PM
I came across a quote somewhere that when you are financially stable most emergencies just become annoyances. It's been so true. Being able to focus on either the logistical and emotional problems and hand wave away the financial has been great.

My BIL used to have a business mentor who would say, "That's a not a problem, it's an expense" if it was a problem that could be solved with (available) money.

I like both of these thoughts and might even modify the first quote to "...most emergencies just become a non-issue."   We've had a number of things come up that I've just shrugged and said, "Ok." when perhaps in my 20's or 30's it would have been anxiety provoking.

I call this "solving a problem by throwing money at it."  Terrible if you do it all the time, but amazingly freeing to know you can when you really need to.

Ha, I less tactfully say "it's not a PROBLEM if you can solve it by throwing money at it (and you have the money available)" At that point, it's mostly an inconvenience.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: AlanStache on January 09, 2024, 01:04:46 PM
I came across a quote somewhere that when you are financially stable most emergencies just become annoyances. It's been so true. Being able to focus on either the logistical and emotional problems and hand wave away the financial has been great.

My BIL used to have a business mentor who would say, "That's a not a problem, it's an expense" if it was a problem that could be solved with (available) money.

I like both of these thoughts and might even modify the first quote to "...most emergencies just become a non-issue."   We've had a number of things come up that I've just shrugged and said, "Ok." when perhaps in my 20's or 30's it would have been anxiety provoking.

I call this "solving a problem by throwing money at it."  Terrible if you do it all the time, but amazingly freeing to know you can when you really need to.

Ha, I less tactfully say "it's not a PROBLEM if you can solve it by throwing money at it (and you have the money available)" At that point, it's mostly an inconvenience.

It is not against the law to park here, you just have to pay 250$ to the city if they send you a bill. 

Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Gerard on January 09, 2024, 01:46:17 PM
It is not against the law to park here, you just have to pay 250$ to the city if they send you a bill.

What's the saying? "To rich people, fines are license fees"?
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Alternatepriorities on January 09, 2024, 02:54:08 PM
It is not against the law to park here, you just have to pay 250$ to the city if they send you a bill.

What's the saying? "To rich people, fines are license fees"?

Does that still work if you only got rich by being frugal? I've been FIRE'd two and a half years, and I still struggle with "wasting" money on things like parking at the airport. Not sure how much money I would need to just park illegally and plan to pay the fine.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Gerard on January 09, 2024, 03:45:16 PM
It is not against the law to park here, you just have to pay 250$ to the city if they send you a bill.
What's the saying? "To rich people, fines are license fees"?

Does that still work if you only got rich by being frugal? I've been FIRE'd two and a half years, and I still struggle with "wasting" money on things like parking at the airport. Not sure how much money I would need to just park illegally and plan to pay the fine.

I mostly hear the quotation from people pointing out that money-based fines are in effect discrimination against the poor.

But even in a frugal context, there are advantages to knowing you can buy your way out of trouble if you have to. Like, I can take the bus home at night, knowing that the one time in 20 that I miss the last bus, I have enough money for cab fare.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: RWTL on January 09, 2024, 04:42:34 PM

I like both of these thoughts and might even modify the first quote to "...most emergencies just become a non-issue."   We've had a number of things come up that I've just shrugged and said, "Ok." when perhaps in my 20's or 30's it would have been anxiety provoking.

A few hours after posting this, I had a real life example.  I large tree branch fell on the roof of my truck, putting several large (2 fists wide) dents in it.  I was disappointed, but I have the $500 that will cover my insurance deductible and I can drive it.  No real anxiety.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Sibley on January 09, 2024, 05:39:56 PM
When my AC went out days before a dangerous heatwave, knowing that I had the money to buy window air units, or just go to a hotel for a few days made it much less stressful. Money doesn't fix everything. Money enables you to fix things though.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: NorthernIkigai on January 09, 2024, 10:48:25 PM
It is not against the law to park here, you just have to pay 250$ to the city if they send you a bill.
What's the saying? "To rich people, fines are license fees"?

Does that still work if you only got rich by being frugal? I've been FIRE'd two and a half years, and I still struggle with "wasting" money on things like parking at the airport. Not sure how much money I would need to just park illegally and plan to pay the fine.

I mostly hear the quotation from people pointing out that money-based fines are in effect discrimination against the poor.


In some countries, certain fines are based on the person’s income. So you sometimes hear about speeding fines of 50k or so. The point is that it *should* hurt, and that it should teach them to stop speeding.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Alternatepriorities on January 09, 2024, 11:39:48 PM
It is not against the law to park here, you just have to pay 250$ to the city if they send you a bill.
What's the saying? "To rich people, fines are license fees"?

Does that still work if you only got rich by being frugal? I've been FIRE'd two and a half years, and I still struggle with "wasting" money on things like parking at the airport. Not sure how much money I would need to just park illegally and plan to pay the fine.

I mostly hear the quotation from people pointing out that money-based fines are in effect discrimination against the poor.


In some countries, certain fines are based on the person’s income. So you sometimes hear about speeding fines of 50k or so. The point is that it *should* hurt, and that it should teach them to stop speeding.

I’d be happy to see all fines based that way… It would help level the playing field. I mentioned this comment to my brother today and he told me of someone he knew would would return rental cars by just parking them in the departure drop off lane… 
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: NorthernIkigai on January 10, 2024, 02:09:02 AM
It is not against the law to park here, you just have to pay 250$ to the city if they send you a bill.
What's the saying? "To rich people, fines are license fees"?

Does that still work if you only got rich by being frugal? I've been FIRE'd two and a half years, and I still struggle with "wasting" money on things like parking at the airport. Not sure how much money I would need to just park illegally and plan to pay the fine.

I mostly hear the quotation from people pointing out that money-based fines are in effect discrimination against the poor.


In some countries, certain fines are based on the person’s income. So you sometimes hear about speeding fines of 50k or so. The point is that it *should* hurt, and that it should teach them to stop speeding.

I’d be happy to see all fines based that way… It would help level the playing field. I mentioned this comment to my brother today and he told me of someone he knew would would return rental cars by just parking them in the departure drop off lane…

You'd think the rental car companies would have conditions in their contracts that would let them recoup the costs for both the fees and the hassle of that. If not the first time it happened, definitely after it's happened a few times.

Yes, I'm also all in favour of income-based fines. Of course Mustachians know very well that income and wealth don't always correlate. But where I am, there's not that much old money that you'd have a lot of people with large wealth but no or low income. And income is something the government tracks very closely, so that's easy to use as a measure of "how much will this fine affect this person".
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: LennStar on January 10, 2024, 03:33:26 AM
If you have a high income, you should pay high fines, regardless of your wealth. It has to hurt, and if it hurts harder because you can't hold your money together I won't cry.

And if you have a "filthy" high wealth, it always comes with high maintenance costs, so just for them you aslo have a high income.

The only ones not much affected would be the "mustachian" FIRE millionaire who lives below their means - and I daresay those are not people with a habit of incurring fines. (Would be nice if there is a study about that.)

I am all for income-based fines everywhere, including parking violations (mentioned for a reason).
Hm... oh, I see English has a good name for that, even if you don't use the concept: day-fine.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Day-fine
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: former player on January 10, 2024, 04:45:52 AM
It was tried in the UK a couple of decades or so ago but as soon as the chattering classes started getting high four-figure fines for speeding offences it was quickly dropped.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: merula on January 10, 2024, 07:05:53 AM
It was tried in the UK a couple of decades or so ago but as soon as the chattering classes started getting high four-figure fines for speeding offences it was quickly dropped.

Every time I think I can't be surprised about the class problems in the UK, something new comes up. (1) High four-figures doesn't seem all that high, even, and (2) isn't that the whole point?! Sheesh
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: lutorm on January 10, 2024, 08:52:14 AM
I am all for income-based fines everywhere, including parking violations (mentioned for a reason).
Hm... oh, I see English has a good name for that, even if you don't use the concept: day-fine.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Day-fine
Sweden  and, I think, the other Nordic countries use this. Of course, as a FIRE, you may be wealthy but not have a high income, so it wouldn't necessarily affect you anyway.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: pasadenafr on January 10, 2024, 10:33:15 AM
I never knew income-based fines were a thing, but now that I think about it, I agree it's a good idea.

I just had a conversation yesterday, where I was defending progressive income taxes, saying they're the only fair solution. I live in a no-income-tax state, and most people I know defend that tooth and nails. And then they proceed to bitch about high tabs for their expensive cars, high local taxes and tolls. I'm like... duh? Just like they went up in arms when the State came up with a 7% tax on capital gains *above $250k*.

It's unfair that people who make a lot less than I do have to pay the same exorbitant taxes on every bill (my water bill? $100 a month. $80 of that is local and county taxes and infrastructure, $17 is pipes, and $3 is actual consumption). I'd rather pay $x00 in income/CG taxes so everybody else can afford their utility bills.

And that, my friends, is a very unpopular opinion in my neck of the woods.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: RyanAtTanagra on January 10, 2024, 10:44:14 AM
And that, my friends, is a very unpopular opinion in my neck of woods.

Heh, I was having a discussion with my sister about taxes and she went 'what, you want to pay MORE taxes?' expecting me to say 'no not myself', and I said 'yes, yes I do.  i should at my income level'.  End of conversation I seemed to have grown a second head or something.

Regarding the income-based fines, for the countries doing it, how do they figure out how much someone makes?  Previous year's tax would be easiest, but how do they handle a situation where someone made a lot last year, but now they're laid off and/or making a lot less?  I would love to see this method of fines implemented in America, but I can see it being a constant litigation of people saying the amount is wrong.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Log on January 10, 2024, 10:55:38 AM
And that, my friends, is a very unpopular opinion in my neck of woods.

Heh, I was having a discussion with my sister about taxes and she went 'what, you want to pay MORE taxes?' expecting me to say 'no not myself', and I said 'yes, yes I do.  i should at my income level'.  End of conversation I seemed to have grown a second head or something.

Regarding the income-based fines, for the countries doing it, how do they figure out how much someone makes?  Previous year's tax would be easiest, but how do they handle a situation where someone made a lot last year, but now they're laid off and/or making a lot less?  I would love to see this method of fines implemented in America, but I can see it being a constant litigation of people saying the amount is wrong.

Government is already capable of verifying people’s income changes mid-year for all sorts of reasons - people who lose their jobs just have to provide the proper documentation to qualify for Medicaid or SNAP or other means-tested benefits.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Alternatepriorities on January 10, 2024, 11:19:34 AM
To be fully effective it seems to me the fine would have to be the large amount of x% of income or y% of assets. I’ll leave if “y” should be 4% of “x” as exercise for the reader…
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: midweststache on January 10, 2024, 01:34:17 PM
And that, my friends, is a very unpopular opinion in my neck of woods.

Heh, I was having a discussion with my sister about taxes and she went 'what, you want to pay MORE taxes?' expecting me to say 'no not myself', and I said 'yes, yes I do.  i should at my income level'.  End of conversation I seemed to have grown a second head or something.

That is the same conversation I had with my dad earlier this year, who (jokingly) hissed at me and made the sign of the cross.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Alfred J Quack on January 10, 2024, 02:08:30 PM
And that, my friends, is a very unpopular opinion in my neck of woods.

Heh, I was having a discussion with my sister about taxes and she went 'what, you want to pay MORE taxes?' expecting me to say 'no not myself', and I said 'yes, yes I do.  i should at my income level'.  End of conversation I seemed to have grown a second head or something.
I had a kind of comparable conversation with my mum. Me and the missus paid of our mortgage, have 12 solar panels but that's still not enough for our full-electric houshold.
To mitigate our electric cost further we bought shares in a wind-farm and our net expenses on electric (including tax) were -600 or something last year because of a long running contract for electric while everyone around us was getting higher prices because of the world-wide gas-price going through the roof.

I know a colleague of mine has a charity to give a big group of minimum income families a christmas food package. Not the high and mighty stuff that's expensive but not very useful but the actual useful stuff. I donated a big part of my return to his charity.
I also learned that someone who I sold a tablet with a defective battery to, that he was autistic and in a program to get work experience with very little income. I gifted him the tablet and told him to do his best and let me know if he needs some more stuff to work or practice on.

I'm also supporting non-profits that support parents with children with Down's syndrome (because of our youngest), autistic people in general (because I'm autistic and so is my eldest), emotional support dogs for disabled people.

And at the end of the day I see I can get a big chunk of what I paid to alllll of those back from income tax. So I file my income tax and get a chunk back and use that to support the charities more next year. Life is strange sometimes...
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: NorthernIkigai on January 11, 2024, 05:19:29 AM
And that, my friends, is a very unpopular opinion in my neck of woods.
Regarding the income-based fines, for the countries doing it, how do they figure out how much someone makes?  Previous year's tax would be easiest, but how do they handle a situation where someone made a lot last year, but now they're laid off and/or making a lot less?  I would love to see this method of fines implemented in America, but I can see it being a constant litigation of people saying the amount is wrong.

Where I live, incomes are nowadays reported (by the employer) to the tax authorities on a monthly basis. Taxes and everything else to do with income can be very quickly adjusted when circumstances change. It also makes tax filing etc. very fast and simple.

I think if you get a fine like this (which I have no personal experience of), the police will ask you for your income level. Sometimes you hear of people having lied about their incomes in these situations, and then later gotten a very much higher fine for lying...
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: NorthernIkigai on January 11, 2024, 05:23:16 AM
To be fully effective it seems to me the fine would have to be the large amount of x% of income or y% of assets. I’ll leave if “y” should be 4% of “x” as exercise for the reader…

I'm looking forward to the blog on this! Hopefully it has at least 60 posts!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: NorthernIkigai on January 11, 2024, 05:29:21 AM
And that, my friends, is a very unpopular opinion in my neck of woods.

Heh, I was having a discussion with my sister about taxes and she went 'what, you want to pay MORE taxes?' expecting me to say 'no not myself', and I said 'yes, yes I do.  i should at my income level'.  End of conversation I seemed to have grown a second head or something.
I had a kind of comparable conversation with my mum. Me and the missus paid of our mortgage, have 12 solar panels but that's still not enough for our full-electric houshold.
To mitigate our electric cost further we bought shares in a wind-farm and our net expenses on electric (including tax) were -600 or something last year because of a long running contract for electric while everyone around us was getting higher prices because of the world-wide gas-price going through the roof.

I know a colleague of mine has a charity to give a big group of minimum income families a christmas food package. Not the high and mighty stuff that's expensive but not very useful but the actual useful stuff. I donated a big part of my return to his charity.
I also learned that someone who I sold a tablet with a defective battery to, that he was autistic and in a program to get work experience with very little income. I gifted him the tablet and told him to do his best and let me know if he needs some more stuff to work or practice on.

I'm also supporting non-profits that support parents with children with Down's syndrome (because of our youngest), autistic people in general (because I'm autistic and so is my eldest), emotional support dogs for disabled people.

And at the end of the day I see I can get a big chunk of what I paid to alllll of those back from income tax. So I file my income tax and get a chunk back and use that to support the charities more next year. Life is strange sometimes...

I wouldn't equate a particular country's tax policies with life.

There's nothing natural about the way taxes or charity is organized in a particular society, although it may be so ingrained there that it seems natural and obvious. Sometimes I think the couple of taxation systems I have experience with should just be blown up and completely rebuilt. It's absurd how some things are incentivized and others nudged a bit but then you have to compensate it somewhere else, etc.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: LennStar on January 11, 2024, 06:08:43 AM
I wouldn't equate a particular country's tax policies with life.

There's nothing natural about the way taxes or charity is organized in a particular society, although it may be so ingrained there that it seems natural and obvious. Sometimes I think the couple of taxation systems I have experience with should just be blown up and completely rebuilt. It's absurd how some things are incentivized and others nudged a bit but then you have to compensate it somewhere else, etc.
A long time ago in a Germany in the early 2000, a party did a big election campaign with "tax decleration on a beer mat" (right name? The small paper thing under the glass.)
Needless to say it never appeared. And I doubt people would have been so exited if they thought a few moments about it, since that of course means all the deductions etc. would no longer be there.

It's often so painful seeing people spout deep convictions based on non-thinking. Like "how hard did you try to not get this?"

Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Psychstache on January 11, 2024, 07:24:42 AM
I wouldn't equate a particular country's tax policies with life.

There's nothing natural about the way taxes or charity is organized in a particular society, although it may be so ingrained there that it seems natural and obvious. Sometimes I think the couple of taxation systems I have experience with should just be blown up and completely rebuilt. It's absurd how some things are incentivized and others nudged a bit but then you have to compensate it somewhere else, etc.
A long time ago in a Germany in the early 2000, a party did a big election campaign with "tax decleration on a beer mat" (right name? The small paper thing under the glass.)
Needless to say it never appeared. And I doubt people would have been so exited if they thought a few moments about it, since that of course means all the deductions etc. would no longer be there.

It's often so painful seeing people spout deep convictions based on non-thinking. Like "how hard did you try to not get this?"

Yeah, every few cycles in the US we would get some candidate claiming that they wanted to shrink tax forms down to the size of a postcard. Sounds great at a rally when everyone is trained to hate taxes, but complete nonsense when you spend more than 30 seconds thinking about how to implement it.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: grantmeaname on January 11, 2024, 07:39:57 AM
You can like taxes and the society that they buy us and at the same time think that our tax system is poorly administered, cumbersome, and distortive. Simplifying the tax code can raise more taxes and make the filing, recordkeeping, and compliance burden lighter at the same time. The IRS direct file pilot (https://www.irs.gov/about-irs/a-closer-look-at-the-irs-direct-file-pilot) is a small and overdue step in that direction, and the UK individual income tax system does not require filings at all for most people (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tax_returns_in_the_United_Kingdom#Income_tax_self-assessment) - I never filed in the five tax years I was there. Trump pushing the personal exemption into the standard deduction was another example that both raised revenue and simplified compliance for many taxpayers.

The toxic part is that most candidates on the red team say "the tax code should be simpler" when what they mean is "we should get rid of progressive tax brackets (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/FairTax)". Anyone with two brain cells who takes one minute to think about it will realize that the tax brackets are the easiest part of the tax code (you can literally run the math in one excel formula), and that the carveouts for special interests and the anti-abuse provisions are what adds all the complexity. But political candidates can count on half their audience welcoming the lie, and the other half never stopping to think about it.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: NorthernIkigai on January 11, 2024, 07:47:19 AM
I wouldn't equate a particular country's tax policies with life.

There's nothing natural about the way taxes or charity is organized in a particular society, although it may be so ingrained there that it seems natural and obvious. Sometimes I think the couple of taxation systems I have experience with should just be blown up and completely rebuilt. It's absurd how some things are incentivized and others nudged a bit but then you have to compensate it somewhere else, etc.
A long time ago in a Germany in the early 2000, a party did a big election campaign with "tax decleration on a beer mat" (right name? The small paper thing under the glass.)
Needless to say it never appeared. And I doubt people would have been so exited if they thought a few moments about it, since that of course means all the deductions etc. would no longer be there.

It's often so painful seeing people spout deep convictions based on non-thinking. Like "how hard did you try to not get this?"

Yeah, every few cycles in the US we would get some candidate claiming that they wanted to shrink tax forms down to the size of a postcard. Sounds great at a rally when everyone is trained to hate taxes, but complete nonsense when you spend more than 30 seconds thinking about how to implement it.

Yeah, I wasn't quite suggesting beer mat or postcard level simplification :-D There's a big difference between simplifying and dumbing down! And I definitely don't hate taxes, although I do belong to an organization wanting to minimize taxes, but only because the magazine they send to their members is the best personal finance publication in my language. Their opinions, as most in my culture, are pretty mild and sensible.

But all those exemptions and exceptions to the exemptions and € limits which are then tweaked or not tweaked every year in some direction really don't make a lot of sense. They are meant to influence people's behaviour, but mostly confuse people and (in the previous country I was liable to pay tax in) often lead to people of all incomes having to pay someone to do their taxes for them, adding extra costs and probably not affecting behaviour as much as they were meant to do. Edit: And I'd also like to add that the yearly tweaks to the percentages and € amounts often stir up a weird amount of discussion and emotions among the public and even among those experts who for example write the magazine I mentioned above. I mean, I don't give a fuck whether I can deduct 40 or 50% of the cost of someone else washing my windows, that is NOT A BIG DEAL in the grand scheme of my budget, taxation, fighting the grey economy, who I'm going to vote for, or really anything. Yet an inordinate amount of time and oxygen is spent on debating whether 40 or 50 really is the correct percentage for this.

If a whole bunch of exemptions were scrapped, the general rates could be lowered. Then it's again a political question to determine for example at what slope the marginal tax rate goes up (quite steeply would be fine by me).
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Sibley on January 11, 2024, 08:20:12 AM
In the US, the tax professionals want tax code reform/simplification. When the people who earn a living doing it want major changes to make it less complex, you know there are problems. This doesn't mean tax returns on a postcard (btw, Trump did that, but all it did was shift a bunch of stuff off the 1040 onto several other schedules that would need to be prepared and attached), it means getting into the nitty gritty of the tax code and making changes.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: grantmeaname on January 11, 2024, 08:27:10 AM
Right, and each of the nitty gritty provisions to be scrapped is either there to prevent abuse and improve horizontal equity, or has a vocal and very motivated minority in favor of it (landlords, commodity funds, realtors, nonprofits, student lenders, billionaires with large estates).
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: AMandM on January 11, 2024, 10:48:53 AM
A long time ago in a Germany in the early 2000, a party did a big election campaign with "tax decleration on a beer mat" (right name? The small paper thing under the glass.)
Needless to say it never appeared. And I doubt people would have been so exited if they thought a few moments about it, since that of course means all the deductions etc. would no longer be there.

In the 1990s, the comic writer Dave Barry proposed his simplified tax form:
"Line 1: How much did you make last year?
 Line 2: Send it in."
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Michael in ABQ on January 11, 2024, 01:16:50 PM
In the US, the tax professionals want tax code reform/simplification. When the people who earn a living doing it want major changes to make it less complex, you know there are problems. This doesn't mean tax returns on a postcard (btw, Trump did that, but all it did was shift a bunch of stuff off the 1040 onto several other schedules that would need to be prepared and attached), it means getting into the nitty gritty of the tax code and making changes.

Of course if you simplify it too much many of them would be out of a job.

Reminds me I need to reach out to my CPA now since she's usually so busy it takes a week or two (and a couple of calls/emails to her assistant) to actually get her on the phone.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Psychstache on January 11, 2024, 01:29:09 PM
I wouldn't equate a particular country's tax policies with life.

There's nothing natural about the way taxes or charity is organized in a particular society, although it may be so ingrained there that it seems natural and obvious. Sometimes I think the couple of taxation systems I have experience with should just be blown up and completely rebuilt. It's absurd how some things are incentivized and others nudged a bit but then you have to compensate it somewhere else, etc.
A long time ago in a Germany in the early 2000, a party did a big election campaign with "tax decleration on a beer mat" (right name? The small paper thing under the glass.)
Needless to say it never appeared. And I doubt people would have been so exited if they thought a few moments about it, since that of course means all the deductions etc. would no longer be there.

It's often so painful seeing people spout deep convictions based on non-thinking. Like "how hard did you try to not get this?"

Yeah, every few cycles in the US we would get some candidate claiming that they wanted to shrink tax forms down to the size of a postcard. Sounds great at a rally when everyone is trained to hate taxes, but complete nonsense when you spend more than 30 seconds thinking about how to implement it.

Yeah, I wasn't quite suggesting beer mat or postcard level simplification :-D There's a big difference between simplifying and dumbing down! And I definitely don't hate taxes, although I do belong to an organization wanting to minimize taxes, but only because the magazine they send to their members is the best personal finance publication in my language. Their opinions, as most in my culture, are pretty mild and sensible.

Oh, my intent was not to imply you thought it was a good idea, just that for a politician it makes for a great yelling point at a rally of people that already support you. I know that you, a handsome, distinguished gentleman of leisure, understand their is nuance to the art and science of taxation.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Sibley on January 11, 2024, 02:05:53 PM
In the US, the tax professionals want tax code reform/simplification. When the people who earn a living doing it want major changes to make it less complex, you know there are problems. This doesn't mean tax returns on a postcard (btw, Trump did that, but all it did was shift a bunch of stuff off the 1040 onto several other schedules that would need to be prepared and attached), it means getting into the nitty gritty of the tax code and making changes.

Of course if you simplify it too much many of them would be out of a job.

Reminds me I need to reach out to my CPA now since she's usually so busy it takes a week or two (and a couple of calls/emails to her assistant) to actually get her on the phone.

There are people, and a lot of them, who will pay someone to do their taxes no matter how easy it is. Plus then all the companies and people with complex situations.

However, the tax accountants I know (and I'm an accountant, I know multiple) would be quite happy to reduce the workload. There's a shortage in tax preparers overall and not enough people coming into the field to handle it. Thus why it takes a few weeks to get a response from your CPA.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: grantmeaname on January 11, 2024, 05:21:48 PM
Not to mention how easily tax CPAs can lateral into so many other fields...
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Fresh Bread on January 11, 2024, 06:48:35 PM
Not that I don't find tax codes riveting, but does anyone have an epic FU money story?
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: SwordGuy on January 12, 2024, 08:14:23 AM
Not that I don't find tax codes riveting, but does anyone have an epic FU money story?
Not really an FU story 'cause there's been no reason not to be polite, but I've turned down over half a dozen opportunities to start another business since I retired.   I don't need the money so I spend my time the way my wife and I want, not the way some customer wants it spent.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Dicey on January 12, 2024, 09:26:33 AM
Not that I don't find tax codes riveting, but does anyone have an epic FU money story?
Not really an FU story 'cause there's been no reason not to be polite, but I've turned down over half a dozen opportunities to start another business since I retired.   I don't need the money so I spend my time the way my wife and I want, not the way some customer wants it spent.
Boo-yah!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Asalted_Nut on January 12, 2024, 09:38:32 AM
Not in an FU sense but still something of a different angle from what I have seen, just inspired by the poster above mentioning turning down jobs in retirement:

A family member came to me the other day with a proposal that I take over their franchise when they retire. I'd helped them work on it in the past so I know an idea of what's involved and also how much money they ended up making once they were successful.

The franchise, if continuing to be successful (and I have imposter syndrome big time, so I'm not even sure I could keep it going), would general about 100k-200k gross. An enticing amount of money!

However thanks to MMM, and other financial forums, I realized that even though I am currently making sub-100k, it is a stable public-sector job with a solid pension, 457b, great health insurance plans, amazing supervisor and work-life balance, really generous time off, etc that I would be happy to continue until retirement with very little risk!

Oftentimes I think many people just look at the salary, but there can be other slightly less tangible benefits to a job that those not actively reading these types of forums may not think to count towards the benefit of their job. So maybe this is more of an FU knowledge, vs an FU money (but again not in an FU kind of way just the freedom to make decisions based not on money but what works best for our lives).
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: RWTL on January 12, 2024, 10:29:54 AM
Not in an FU sense but still something of a different angle from what I have seen, just inspired by the poster above mentioning turning down jobs in retirement:

A family member came to me the other day with a proposal that I take over their franchise when they retire. I'd helped them work on it in the past so I know an idea of what's involved and also how much money they ended up making once they were successful.

The franchise, if continuing to be successful (and I have imposter syndrome big time, so I'm not even sure I could keep it going), would general about 100k-200k gross. An enticing amount of money!

However thanks to MMM, and other financial forums, I realized that even though I am currently making sub-100k, it is a stable public-sector job with a solid pension, 457b, great health insurance plans, amazing supervisor and work-life balance, really generous time off, etc that I would be happy to continue until retirement with very little risk!

Oftentimes I think many people just look at the salary, but there can be other slightly less tangible benefits to a job that those not actively reading these types of forums may not think to count towards the benefit of their job. So maybe this is more of an FU knowledge, vs an FU money (but again not in an FU kind of way just the freedom to make decisions based not on money but what works best for our lives).

Absolutely right!  I had a professor say to us - "Would you rather have a 300K job that you're miserable in and would be fired in 3 years or a 100K job that you're happy with until retirement."  He never gave us the answer, but I knew my answer.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: hooplady on January 12, 2024, 05:08:14 PM
The franchise, if continuing to be successful (and I have imposter syndrome big time, so I'm not even sure I could keep it going), would general about 100k-200k gross. An enticing amount of money!
Ohhhhh but gross is meaningless, the only thing that matters is net; that's what you need to compare to a salaried position (with all the benefits included) to have a true analysis.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: RetiredAt63 on January 12, 2024, 06:02:27 PM
The franchise, if continuing to be successful (and I have imposter syndrome big time, so I'm not even sure I could keep it going), would general about 100k-200k gross. An enticing amount of money!
Ohhhhh but gross is meaningless, the only thing that matters is net; that's what you need to compare to a salaried position (with all the benefits included) to have a true analysis.

And won't there be some things that you will be paying for twice - like the employee's share and the employer's share?
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Taran Wanderer on January 12, 2024, 08:28:27 PM
Sub-100k job… let’s say 90k.

90k + 6k employer FICA + 18k employer-provided health care + 4k employer 403/457 match + 12k employer pension contribution + vacation + holidays + sick time = 130k plus the time off.

100k to 200k gross - expenses - time off could actually end up looking a lot worse than the current job.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: lhamo on January 13, 2024, 07:43:26 AM
Sub-100k job… let’s say 90k.

90k + 6k employer FICA + 18k employer-provided health care + 4k employer 403/457 match + 12k employer pension contribution + vacation + holidays + sick time = 130k plus the time off.

100k to 200k gross - expenses - time off could actually end up looking a lot worse than the current job.

Not to mention that 457b option -- what is the annual cap on what you can throw in there?  457b accounts are AMAZING buckets for those who wish to FIRE to have access to.  You get the benefits of a tax deferred savings account without the restrictions of a 401k.  Much easier to access the money penalty free when you decide to leave employment.  If it were me, I'd focus on maxing out those accounts as a sabbatical/trial FIRE fund. 
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Asalted_Nut on January 14, 2024, 09:17:11 PM
Sub-100k job… let’s say 90k.

90k + 6k employer FICA + 18k employer-provided health care + 4k employer 403/457 match + 12k employer pension contribution + vacation + holidays + sick time = 130k plus the time off.

100k to 200k gross - expenses - time off could actually end up looking a lot worse than the current job.

Not to mention that 457b option -- what is the annual cap on what you can throw in there?  457b accounts are AMAZING buckets for those who wish to FIRE to have access to.  You get the benefits of a tax deferred savings account without the restrictions of a 401k.  Much easier to access the money penalty free when you decide to leave employment.  If it were me, I'd focus on maxing out those accounts as a sabbatical/trial FIRE fund.

So a 457 account limit is the same as a 401k. And, not really pertinent to my salary level at this point, but we also have access to a 403b as well, with a separate limit, so assuming one had the means and the interest they could max both 457 and 403b, though the 403b is just as restricted as a 501k from my understanding. But yes to all of the above! As I have worked here and leaned more, the  value of all the non-salary benefits just can’t be understated.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: ditheca on January 14, 2024, 09:36:06 PM
Heh, I was having a discussion with my sister about taxes and she went 'what, you want to pay MORE taxes?' expecting me to say 'no not myself', and I said 'yes, yes I do.  i should at my income level'.  End of conversation I seemed to have grown a second head or something.

Regarding the income-based fines, for the countries doing it, how do they figure out how much someone makes?  Previous year's tax would be easiest, but how do they handle a situation where someone made a lot last year, but now they're laid off and/or making a lot less?  I would love to see this method of fines implemented in America, but I can see it being a constant litigation of people saying the amount is wrong.

I have an unimpressive salary and a stay-at-home wife. We live simply and invest in a boring index fund. Our net worth is in the top 10% of Americans (in our age bracket). Why am I barely required to pay taxes!?

If the top 10% don't pay income tax, then who does? Is the entire government funded by nothing but debt and promises?
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: geekette on January 15, 2024, 08:47:28 AM
I have an unimpressive salary and a stay-at-home wife. We live simply and invest in a boring index fund. Our net worth is in the top 10% of Americans (in our age bracket). Why am I barely required to pay taxes!?

If the top 10% don't pay income tax, then who does? Is the entire government funded by nothing but debt and promises?
We generally pay taxes on income, not net worth. 

NC used to have an intangibles tax on savings, stocks, bonds, and, my father joked, the change in your pocket.  Now that was a tax on (not just) the wealthy.  They did some funny stuff exempting investments in NC companies and companies doing business in the state, and it was struck down in '95.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Zamboni on January 15, 2024, 11:20:19 AM
Is the entire government funded by nothing but debt and promises?

At this point, yes, at least at the federal level.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: JGS1980 on January 15, 2024, 11:44:48 AM
Easy to fix if there were some political will, but politicians follow the money.

Corporation profits used to be taxed significantly and their tax proceeds covered over 40% of the yearly federal income.

The proceeds, after 75 years of lobbying, lawmaking, and donating, is now less than 15%.

https://www.nationalpriorities.org/analysis/2014/presidents-2015-budget-in-pictures/individual-and-corporate-income-taxes-percent-total-federal-revenue/

Super rich folks also lobby to decrease their taxes, and poor people have very little income to tax in the first place. Guess who makes up the difference?

Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: LennStar on January 15, 2024, 12:57:46 PM
Is the entire government funded by nothing but debt and promises?

At this point, yes, at least at the federal level.
FunFact: The British Pound is based on a loan to the king. If the royal head ever get's into his to repay all those 178 million pounds, the British currency would theoretically be worthless.

Every dollar debt is a dollar wealth. Every dollar wealth is a dollar debt. Without debt no wealth and without weath no debt.
The question is only who has what.
The rich people get richer and the poor get poorer. For at least 4000 years that was solved by regular debt forgiveness or widespread destruction in a war. Choose what you like more.
Or fucking start to tax the rich again instad of the poor.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: grantmeaname on January 15, 2024, 04:19:44 PM
None of that follows at all. There are plenty of forms of wealth that are not debt, and you can build wealth without debt. This is just a word salad.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Michael in ABQ on January 15, 2024, 06:54:30 PM
Heh, I was having a discussion with my sister about taxes and she went 'what, you want to pay MORE taxes?' expecting me to say 'no not myself', and I said 'yes, yes I do.  i should at my income level'.  End of conversation I seemed to have grown a second head or something.

Regarding the income-based fines, for the countries doing it, how do they figure out how much someone makes?  Previous year's tax would be easiest, but how do they handle a situation where someone made a lot last year, but now they're laid off and/or making a lot less?  I would love to see this method of fines implemented in America, but I can see it being a constant litigation of people saying the amount is wrong.

I have an unimpressive salary and a stay-at-home wife. We live simply and invest in a boring index fund. Our net worth is in the top 10% of Americans (in our age bracket). Why am I barely required to pay taxes!?

If the top 10% don't pay income tax, then who does? Is the entire government funded by nothing but debt and promises?

I think you answered your own question. Income taxes are a tax on income, not wealth.

You can have an incredibly high income and no wealth, or a high wealth and no income. Aside from property taxes it's very difficult to tax wealth.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: LennStar on January 16, 2024, 12:03:04 AM
You mean it's politically very difficult, since the ones with much money are the ones with much power. Mathematically it's not that hard. 
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Dicey on January 16, 2024, 12:11:33 AM
Are we fresh out of Epic FU Money stories?
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: NorthernIkigai on January 16, 2024, 03:53:26 AM
Are we fresh out of Epic FU Money stories?

Sure seems like it... I just met my new manager yesterday (my organization is adding a layer of middle management, weirdly), and he seemed very nice. Good for me, bad for this thread.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Tempname23 on January 16, 2024, 06:10:30 AM

I like both of these thoughts and might even modify the first quote to "...most emergencies just become a non-issue."   We've had a number of things come up that I've just shrugged and said, "Ok." when perhaps in my 20's or 30's it would have been anxiety provoking.

A few hours after posting this, I had a real life example.  I large tree branch fell on the roof of my truck, putting several large (2 fists wide) dents in it.  I was disappointed, but I have the $500 that will cover my insurance deductible and I can drive it.  No real anxiety.

 Last week we had a severe storm and probably a tornado, lost our carport, damage to 6 sticks of vinyl siding on the sheshed and I broken window on my shed. Soffit and fascia needed repair along with several pieces of trim to repair or replace. Two cracked windshields and other damage. With the insurance situation in Florida and if I DIY the repairs it's under $5k. I will not be making a claim on my insurance. Yep, no financial concern.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Tempname23 on January 16, 2024, 06:27:47 AM


There are people, and a lot of them, who will pay someone to do their taxes no matter how easy it is. Plus then all the companies and people with complex situations.

 A few years ago I purged records I held for 40+ years. In it, I found an H&R Block Tax prep from when I was 15, I had earned $300 and paid $3 to have my taxes filed!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Tempname23 on January 16, 2024, 06:43:27 AM
You mean it's politically very difficult, since the ones with much money are the ones with much power. Mathematically it's not that hard.

 Taxing wealth would be very detrimental for FIRE! Can you imaging paying 12%, 22%, or even 24% of tax on your net worth each year, you would never make it to FIRE.
  Also, My wife and I earned way less then about half the population, yet we saved and invested our way to the top 5% over a 36 year period. Now you want to punish us for doing what I think is the right thing?  I'll be countering your vote!
Not having our wealth taxed is the only way for the middle class to get ahead.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: NorthernIkigai on January 16, 2024, 06:50:43 AM
You mean it's politically very difficult, since the ones with much money are the ones with much power. Mathematically it's not that hard.

 Taxing wealth would be very detrimental for FIRE! Can you imaging paying 12%, 22%, or even 24% of tax on your net worth each year, you would never make it to FIRE.
  Also, My wife and I earned way less then about half the population, yet we saved and invested our way to the top 5% over a 36 year period. Now you want to punish us for doing what I think is the right thing?  I'll be countering your vote!
Not having our wealth taxed is the only way for the middle class to get ahead.

At least in the countries where I've read about (current or former) wealth tax policies, it has never, ever been figures like those. More like +-1% or possibly low single figures, depending on a lot of factors.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: alcon835 on January 16, 2024, 07:43:20 AM
FU story is in progress, so we'll see how things work out, but since I've got one brewing and this thread has gone off the rails a bit, let's do this!!!

I am one of the most highly performing people in my organization. I also am one of the more tenured for my start-up (5 years). I was the first person hired for my department and I built and nurtured it to an almost 40 person team. By every metric they measure the success of my role and my department, I am the top. Additionally, due to how early I joined, I am one of the more influential people in the company at, really, all levels. I regularly meet with entry level folks to keep a beat on what is going on and to provide mentorship. I'm regularly asked to come by the CEO's and other execs offices to give updates and feedback from my perspective (and I am 3 levels below him now but reported to him when I started). All to say, when something needs to get done I am usually the best equipped to do it and when I ask for things I usually get them.

Well this year I asked for something my boss didn't want to give.

2020-2023 have been hard. For everyone, and definitely for me. I think I may have PTSD from it all? I lost a lot of things. People I loved died. I lost relationships I've had for years. I learned some terrible things about people I built my life around and it shook my entire identity. Compounding these problems 2023 was the hardest year of my career workwise.  They asked me to do more than I've ever done and it had me burning the wick at both ends. Even so, I succeeded at work and I'll be ending our fiscal year on January 31st as the most successful person in my org.

I came to the realization I was burned out in the fall, so after thinking about my options, I reached out to my boss at Halloween and asked him for a sabbatical. I told him this was very important to me, that I needed it for personal reasons, and I am burning out. Ideally it would be Two months in 2024, (I asked for March and April). Him and I talked about it a bit and he was positive about it overall and we started spit balling ideas on what this could look like. He even pitched the idea we could offer sabbaticals to longer term employees as a benefit for retention. He asked to think about how to present it up to the business and then would get back to me after talking to his boss and HR. We had time. They spoke a few times, he did some kind of research (not sure what) and in December my boss and my bosses boss met to talk through it all. There were some miscommunications on what I was asking for, so I corrected those. We talked through it a bit more and then they said they would raise the flag internally and get back to me in a few days.

Well, the next day (Friday) my boss schedules a meeting and opens with, "this will probably be the most one sided conversations we'll ever have." he then proceeds to tell me "I don't like the precedent a sabbatical sets for the team, so I am personally not going to let you do it and I have the ability to do that here." He then explained how difficult it would be to lose me for two months and that he couldn't approve it or allow his boss to push the request up the chain. At one point he told me, "If this means you'll quit, then there's the door." he spent the rest of the call explaining his perspective on all the great reasons to keep working at my current job.

He has never asked me once why I am looking for a sabbatical. I have offered a few times to talk about it in more detail, but he wasn't very interested in my purpose for the ask. I need a life reset if I'm going to be happy. My wife, my family, my friends, my mental health, my physical health...they all need a reset.

Just before all this, I was offered a retention bonus by the company. I rejected it and had to reach out to HR directly to let them know I was not signing. I told my boss 'no' to the retention bonus and he didn't bubble that up, I guess.

Anyway, over Christmas I took some extra time off and did the math. Thanks to my current stashe and some savings the wife and I were building that we can repurpose, I can live for 9 months without a paycheck or needing to dip into investments. By the end of February, I should be able to pay all my expenses for 12 months from cash in my HYSA alone. So that's what I'm going to do. I'm saving for the next two months until I hit my savings goal and then I am going to quit my job. I fully expect multiple executives to try and retain me once I put in my notice, but at this point it is too late. As they say, you don't leave bad companies, just bad bosses.

What is unfortunate about all of this, overall I like my boss. He just has a terrible view on work/life balance. I don't think I've ever seen him not working while on vacation, which is frustrating. I am not surprised he would do this, but I did figure his boss would say something due to my success and role in the organization.

A friend of mine, when I told her the story, asked, "what do they think you are going to do with that answer? Did they actually think you wouldn't just quit and take the sabbatical on your own?" And, I think that's exactly what they think - at least my boss. Or they thought I would leave immediately? I am not sure.

So here we are, January 16th, about 45-60 days away from turning in my notice. I'll keep y'all updated as things start to happen.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: NorthernIkigai on January 16, 2024, 07:56:15 AM
Well, your boss is about to set a whole different kind of precedent that the one he wanted to avoid. Congrats to you on making a bold and clearly very healthy decision!

I also have no idea what anyone would expect to achieve with some of the word choices in that call... So adversarial! And just overall weird.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: kina on January 16, 2024, 08:00:31 AM
So, you're much too valuable for them to do without for 2 months, but not forever? Oy!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: LennStar on January 16, 2024, 08:12:55 AM
You mean it's politically very difficult, since the ones with much money are the ones with much power. Mathematically it's not that hard.

 Taxing wealth would be very detrimental for FIRE! Can you imaging paying 12%, 22%, or even 24% of tax on your net worth each year, you would never make it to FIRE.
  Also, My wife and I earned way less then about half the population, yet we saved and invested our way to the top 5% over a 36 year period. Now you want to punish us for doing what I think is the right thing?  I'll be countering your vote!
Not having our wealth taxed is the only way for the middle class to get ahead.
First of all Nobody, not even the Communist Party talk about those numbers. I think they wanted 2%. Mostly it's 1%.
Which means for someone FIRE'd, that's about 3 years longer working (appreciation, 4% rule, tax free base income...).

And "no taxes" is not a way for the middle class, because the middle class will have to pay more from their wealth just for basic life cost.

Quote
So here we are, January 16th, about 45-60 days away from turning in my notice. I'll keep y'all updated as things start to happen.

Do that!

Is there interest from your side joining the company again? Maybe not under this boss? Or at a somewhat reduced workload (which is unlikely I assume)?
Because if you drop the ball, as you said, there will be panic. And you will be in a really really good bargain position.
Think about what could keep you there (after your sabbatical of course). If you still don't like it after half a year, you can always search for a new job starting next year after all (and make another longer break before that).
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: JLee on January 16, 2024, 08:15:51 AM
You mean it's politically very difficult, since the ones with much money are the ones with much power. Mathematically it's not that hard.

 Taxing wealth would be very detrimental for FIRE! Can you imaging paying 12%, 22%, or even 24% of tax on your net worth each year, you would never make it to FIRE.
  Also, My wife and I earned way less then about half the population, yet we saved and invested our way to the top 5% over a 36 year period. Now you want to punish us for doing what I think is the right thing?  I'll be countering your vote!
Not having our wealth taxed is the only way for the middle class to get ahead.

Can you imagine paying 24, 32, 35, or even 37% of tax on your income each year? How would you even survive with a normal income?  ;)

Nobody is talking about taxing everyone's net worth at 10%+.  Warren's wealth tax proposal has zero additional tax on any household with a net worth of less than $50 million, a 2% annual tax on household net worth between $50 million and $1 billion, and an additional 4% for net worth above $1 billion.

Given a 4% SWR on $50 mil comes to a cool two million dollars a year, I think everybody on this forum would be just fine.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: erp on January 16, 2024, 08:27:32 AM
There is actually one very common wealth tax in the US (and elsewhere): property & real estate taxes. A percentage of the value of the property which is assessed and taxed is definitely a wealth tax. Arguably, you get lots of value for that tax (infrastructure, neighbourhoods, other people, etc.) but that doesn't change what it is.

I mention this only because it shows that it's politically possible to have wealth taxes, we just don't have a culture of taxing non-real estate wealth (I also tend to think that a wealth tax would almost certainly be deeply distortionary and that while it might be theoretically valuable it'd be almost impossible to execute well).
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: FIPurpose on January 16, 2024, 08:37:54 AM
I think it would be easier to just tax low-interest debt so that the super wealthy can't hide behind loans to avoid capital gains.

Anyone with over 50MM in personal loans at an interest rate lower than US treasury should pay taxes on their loans. Taxes too high on a loan? KK just sell your stock then.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: alcon835 on January 16, 2024, 08:41:50 AM
Quote
So here we are, January 16th, about 45-60 days away from turning in my notice. I'll keep y'all updated as things start to happen.

Do that!

Is there interest from your side joining the company again? Maybe not under this boss? Or at a somewhat reduced workload (which is unlikely I assume)?
Because if you drop the ball, as you said, there will be panic. And you will be in a really really good bargain position.
Think about what could keep you there (after your sabbatical of course). If you still don't like it after half a year, you can always search for a new job starting next year after all (and make another longer break before that).

I could be open to it. I'm interested to see what they offer me (if anything) when I turn in my notice.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: iluvzbeach on January 16, 2024, 09:25:27 AM
@alcon835, when you submit your notice make sure to start the conversation with your boss with “This is actually the most one-sided conversation we’ll ever have…”

Before you submit notice, is there any chance the current state of your mental health would warrant short-term disability leave?
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: mm1970 on January 16, 2024, 10:14:43 AM
Well, your boss is about to set a whole different kind of precedent that the one he wanted to avoid. Congrats to you on making a bold and clearly very healthy decision!

I also have no idea what anyone would expect to achieve with some of the word choices in that call... So adversarial! And just overall weird.

Yep.  What a dodo.

@alcon835, when you submit your notice make sure to start the conversation with your boss with “This is actually the most one-sided conversation we’ll ever have…”

Before you submit notice, is there any chance the current state of your mental health would warrant short-term disability leave?

Snerk.  Do that.

My DH's first job after grad school, at the one year point, he got a raise.  Before the raise, I did some research online about what the going salary was for his level.  (He was not young - in addition to a PhD, he had 5 years of military officer experience).

The boss gave him a substandard raise, DH countered with the info I had collected.  The boss got snippy and said "well you are welcome to leave".  (Next morning, boss came back with 2x the raise.)

I think "there's the door" is a weird flex.  I can't wait to see the result.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: RyanAtTanagra on January 16, 2024, 10:30:22 AM
Can you go above your boss to hand in your notice, and tell them why?  It sounds like they weren't aware of this conversation, and might be interested to hear it from a perspective that won't be your boss's.  And tell them that after your two months, you'd be more than happy to come back, provided your new role has you reporting to your boss's boss directly?
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: AMandM on January 16, 2024, 10:36:39 AM
So, you're much too valuable for them to do without for 2 months, but not forever? Oy!

Yeah, I love how his reason for not negotiating is an admission that you hold all the cards in this negotiation.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: AO1FireTo on January 16, 2024, 11:28:14 AM
So, you're much too valuable for them to do without for 2 months, but not forever? Oy!

Yeah, I love how his reason for not negotiating is an admission that you hold all the cards in this negotiation.

Seems to me you are missing an opportunity.  Why not go above your boss to someone you trust and say, I'd like a two month sabbatical, I was told it wasn't possible.  I wanted to have a chat with you before I hand in my formal resignation.  You have nothing to lose.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Dicey on January 16, 2024, 11:51:42 AM
@alcon835, when you submit your notice make sure to start the conversation with your boss with “This is actually the most one-sided conversation we’ll ever have…”

Before you submit notice, is there any chance the current state of your mental health would warrant short-term disability leave?
+2. Please keep us updated as things happen. Good for you for deciphering what you need most right now.

Also, thanks for the valiant attempt to get this thread back on track. [Dicey gives @LennStar the stinkeye.]
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: NorthernIkigai on January 16, 2024, 12:01:43 PM
So, you're much too valuable for them to do without for 2 months, but not forever? Oy!

Yeah, I love how his reason for not negotiating is an admission that you hold all the cards in this negotiation.

Seems to me you are missing an opportunity.  Why not go above your boss to someone you trust and say, I'd like a two month sabbatical, I was told it wasn't possible.  I wanted to have a chat with you before I hand in my formal resignation.  You have nothing to lose.

In theory, this is the correct answer. In practice, it may lead to the boss feeling butthurt about having been overruled, and making your life miserable once you’re back from your sabbatical. Or even the company being the one making your life miserable later, since you’ve made it clear to them that one of their managers can’t manage and thereby somehow undermined their authority and structures. People can be very strange when they have effectively been outplayed.

Simply resigning now and then possibly returning later with a clean slate (and maybe to the team of a different manager…) is ”cleaner” in terms of office politics.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: lifeandlimb on January 16, 2024, 12:06:36 PM
I can't wait to hear the update, @alcon835 . I'm just a little confused about how your boss seemed very amenable to the idea at first, and then did an about-face after having conversations with the higher-ups.

In some companies and cultures, six-month and one-year sabbaticals are built in after a certain amount of work time. Two months isn't even very long! When will people realize that sometimes, more money does not replace time off?
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Alfred J Quack on January 16, 2024, 01:19:35 PM
So, you're much too valuable for them to do without for 2 months, but not forever? Oy!
Someone completely caught in the rat race just doesn't have the mental capacity to think someone else isn't in the same situation...

@alcon835, when you submit your notice make sure to start the conversation with your boss with “This is actually the most one-sided conversation we’ll ever have…”

Before you submit notice, is there any chance the current state of your mental health would warrant short-term disability leave?
Totally!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: jinga nation on January 16, 2024, 01:22:09 PM
What is unfortunate about all of this, overall I like my boss. He just has a terrible view on work/life balance. I don't think I've ever seen him not working while on vacation, which is frustrating. I am not surprised he would do this, but I did figure his boss would say something due to my success and role in the organization.

Sorry, but the bolded makes him a bad boss.
Also, if his boss didn't say something, there's either a breakdown in communications or they haven't considered business impacts if you were to leave, especially if you were considered a key person aka single point of failure.
Your boss thinks he has leverage in this situation. FU Money is your Mjolnir to smash his leverage.
Looking forward to your one-way conversation with him.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Fresh Bread on January 16, 2024, 01:52:20 PM
@alcon835 What a bizarre story! I can't believe your boss said '"there's the door". I can't wait to hear how it plays out. I hope you have a friend in the company who can let you know how it goes for them after.

I'm in one of the countries that has long service leave. If you work 10 years at one place you get a few months off, paid. Most people take a sabbatical, some people take it by going part time for a while.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Boll weevil on January 16, 2024, 04:14:39 PM

So here we are, January 16th, about 45-60 days away from turning in my notice. I'll keep y'all updated as things start to happen.

If you’re willing to spend another 15-30 days there, you could have some fun with the timing of April Fools Day.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Gremlin on January 16, 2024, 04:40:00 PM
So, you're much too valuable for them to do without for 2 months, but not forever? Oy!

Yeah, I love how his reason for not negotiating is an admission that you hold all the cards in this negotiation.

Seems to me you are missing an opportunity.  Why not go above your boss to someone you trust and say, I'd like a two month sabbatical, I was told it wasn't possible.  I wanted to have a chat with you before I hand in my formal resignation.  You have nothing to lose.

In theory, this is the correct answer. In practice, it may lead to the boss feeling butthurt about having been overruled, and making your life miserable once you’re back from your sabbatical. Or even the company being the one making your life miserable later, since you’ve made it clear to them that one of their managers can’t manage and thereby somehow undermined their authority and structures. People can be very strange when they have effectively been outplayed.

Simply resigning now and then possibly returning later with a clean slate (and maybe to the team of a different manager…) is ”cleaner” in terms of office politics.

Maybe...

@alcon835 is an early stage employee at a five year old start up.  The 'hierarchy' dynamic in these sorts of organisations can be a little unusual and their tenure and high performance can mean that they probably sit higher on the effective totem than is purely represented by their org chart.  Quite probably higher than their boss in the eyes of the CEO/senior execs.

If I was in this situation and I had the ear of the CEO, that's who I'd talk to (if the original plan is still something they'd contemplate).
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: alcon835 on January 16, 2024, 04:55:26 PM
To answer many of your question, at this point I don't really want to keep working there. A friend of mine wants me to stay and has asked what could be done, but the more I think about it, the more the decision is made. I am going to finish out the fiscal year and be done. Maybe after my sabbatical I'll want to come back (assuming they'll want or need me then). But I really am looking forward to 3-to-6 months off of working with no deadline.

Let's see how long it takes me to get bored.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Gremlin on January 16, 2024, 05:34:22 PM
To answer many of your question, at this point I don't really want to keep working there. A friend of mine wants me to stay and has asked what could be done, but the more I think about it, the more the decision is made. I am going to finish out the fiscal year and be done. Maybe after my sabbatical I'll want to come back (assuming they'll want or need me then). But I really am looking forward to 3-to-6 months off of working with no deadline.

Let's see how long it takes me to get bored.
Great - that's awesome.  Keep us in the loop as to how it plays out.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: NV Teacher on January 16, 2024, 06:50:59 PM
To answer many of your question, at this point I don't really want to keep working there. A friend of mine wants me to stay and has asked what could be done, but the more I think about it, the more the decision is made. I am going to finish out the fiscal year and be done. Maybe after my sabbatical I'll want to come back (assuming they'll want or need me then). But I really am looking forward to 3-to-6 months off of working with no deadline.

Let's see how long it takes me to get bored.


Last August I decided that this would be my last year teaching.  The decision was made.  The foolishness and nonsense that has invaded and engulfed public education has become unbearable for me.  I started giving away everything in my classroom.  I started purging things from my house.  On a side note, we have gone months without a contract.  At the end of December it was announced that the district and teachers union had reached a settlement.  We are getting a 10% raise this year and another 8% next year along with an almost 20% raise in benefits.  It’s a huge jump in pay.  But guess what?  It’s still not enough to get me to stay.  I’ve had enough.  I’ve got enough.  I say enough.

Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: BlueHouse on January 18, 2024, 06:15:26 PM
So, you're much too valuable for them to do without for 2 months, but not forever? Oy!

Yeah, I love how his reason for not negotiating is an admission that you hold all the cards in this negotiation.

Seems to me you are missing an opportunity.  Why not go above your boss to someone you trust and say, I'd like a two month sabbatical, I was told it wasn't possible.  I wanted to have a chat with you before I hand in my formal resignation.  You have nothing to lose.
+1.  After 2 months, no one will put two+two together unless you spell it out for them.  This is an upfront and honest way to handle this.  Do not worry about "going over his head".  If there are any office politics like that above your manager, then you don't want to stay there anyway. 

And congratulations on knowing what you need and having the guts and the means to get there.  That is already epic!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: WFUDEAC on February 18, 2024, 09:13:09 AM
Alright.....so I would love input on the situation I have found myself. I feel like having FU money has allowed me to stand my ground.

I am late 30s, and have been the top finance person (CFO, VP Finance, Controller) of all the small private firms I have worked for since I left public accounting. I've changed roles a few times over the past 7 years because, start-up, company sold, company sold, and in my current role that started 18 months ago I will either help the company get sold or I could participate in a management buyout. Ownership is somewhat absentee as they live thousands of miles away and have relied on the COO to run the day-to-day operations.

COO has only ever worked for this company and it's predecessor organization.....meaning he's been there for 50+ years. This past week he has started to try and bully me because he disagrees with my approach on a certain thing(s). I naively listened to his opinions at the beginning but after this situation realized I need to go direct to the owner (whom I report to) and allow COO to be involved if owner wants.

COO has managed the organization poorly since COVID, from my observations, and sees me as a threat to revealing his shortcomings to ownership.

I've found a way to legally and ethically save the company $100K+ annually but we have to change insurance brokers. If you know anything about small businesses you know these relationships can be hard to change. I stupidly listened to COO and didn't go to the owner with this opportunity and went about it in a more round about way trying to be 100% sure of the opportunity first. Well COO gets mad, even though I ran it by him, and tries to order me to stop what I am doing. I determine it's in the best of the company to ignore this command and call the owner. COO then tries to tell me I cant talk to the owner without his permission and if I disagree with him then we call the owner together. I agree in principle that this is the correct path, but since he is being a bully I basically say not going to happen since the owner is my boss not COO. Needless to say I don't think he took too kindly to me standing up to him.

60 minutes after this exchange, COO and Owner are on the phone and Owner is telling us both how insurance broker is saying they shouldn't be mad at me because I am just doing my job.

So yeah, basically I have a peer trying to tell me how to run the CFO office and prevent me from saving the company $100K+ and since I have FU money I don't have to be complicit with his old school bullying management style.

It'll be interesting to see what happens Monday and if he tries to push me out or accepts that I actually know what I am doing...
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: zolotiyeruki on February 18, 2024, 09:35:25 AM
Sigh, yeah, it's frustrating when a coworker tries to tell you how to do your job when 1) it's not under their authority and 2) they're performing poorly at their own responsibilities.  There's someone like that at my work, and people are wondering why this person hasn't been fired yet.

The trick is to find a way to professionally say "this is my responsibility, stay in your lane"?
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: WFUDEAC on February 18, 2024, 09:47:14 AM
Sigh, yeah, it's frustrating when a coworker tries to tell you how to do your job when 1) it's not under their authority and 2) they're performing poorly at their own responsibilities.  There's someone like that at my work, and people are wondering why this person hasn't been fired yet.

The trick is to find a way to professionally say "this is my responsibility, stay in your lane"?

Problem with my situation is that until I showed up (my predecessor CFO was in the same remote office with the owner) the COO was basically the "Boss." He tries to control all information sent to ownership so he doesn't have to answer questions or can spin failures into why it wasn't his fault. He's gotten quite good at it after a decade or more operating this way.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: AlanStache on February 18, 2024, 01:40:19 PM
The trick is to find a way to professionally say "this is my responsibility, stay in your lane"?

https://www.tiktok.com/@loewhaley/video/7202617260475698437 (https://www.tiktok.com/@loewhaley/video/7202617260475698437)

I only wish I found her earlier in my carrier before I started bluntly saying "this is F-ing shit", so totally wish I could have quoted her directly :-)

Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: merula on February 19, 2024, 09:14:03 AM
I've found a way to legally and ethically save the company $100K+ annually but we have to change insurance brokers. If you know anything about small businesses you know these relationships can be hard to change.

As someone who has worked for a carrier in commercial insurance for nearly 20 years: your prior insurance broker didn't do their job, and knew that they were risking getting fired for it. This happens all the time.

Brokers build these relationships with leaders at their client organizations SPECIFICALLY to build a barrier to changing brokers, and it's well known in the industry that when a new CFO (or other new C-suite role) comes on board, the broker needs to step up the game or risk losing the account. They could've negotiated harder with your current carrier(s), or found a cheaper option to present to you themselves, but doing either of those is a lot more work than a straight insurance renewal, AND they'd be giving themselves a pay cut by doing it (if they're working on commission as I expect they are).
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: BlueHouse on February 19, 2024, 09:57:49 AM
Sigh, yeah, it's frustrating when a coworker tries to tell you how to do your job when 1) it's not under their authority and 2) they're performing poorly at their own responsibilities.  There's someone like that at my work, and people are wondering why this person hasn't been fired yet.

The trick is to find a way to professionally say "this is my responsibility, stay in your lane"?

This is clearly an MPP for anyone already FIREd, because I would now relish the opportunity to engage in a conversation like this, purely for entertainment purposes.  But of course I didn't find any of it funny before I FIREd. 
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Sibley on February 20, 2024, 07:58:56 AM
@WFUDEAC It sounds like COO is feeling threatened by you and is lashing out trying to protect himself. Depending on his personality and how threatened/desperate the guy is, he could start to actively work against you. If that happens it'll get nasty very quickly. It's good you have FU money.

But also, good idea to consider if he's stealing from the company. As CFO you have broad ability to review the financials, you should be checking payroll and your vendor listing for possible issues. If COO has any bank access that should be looked at closely.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: jinga nation on February 20, 2024, 08:04:14 AM
Sigh, yeah, it's frustrating when a coworker tries to tell you how to do your job when 1) it's not under their authority and 2) they're performing poorly at their own responsibilities.  There's someone like that at my work, and people are wondering why this person hasn't been fired yet.

The trick is to find a way to professionally say "this is my responsibility, stay in your lane"?

Problem with my situation is that until I showed up (my predecessor CFO was in the same remote office with the owner) the COO was basically the "Boss." He tries to control all information sent to ownership so he doesn't have to answer questions or can spin failures into why it wasn't his fault. He's gotten quite good at it after a decade or more operating this way.

Massive Red Flag.
Glad you've got that FU Money hammer ready to deploy if need be.
Looking forward to reading what happens....
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: FIRE 20/20 on March 05, 2024, 12:32:49 PM
To answer many of your question, at this point I don't really want to keep working there. A friend of mine wants me to stay and has asked what could be done, but the more I think about it, the more the decision is made. I am going to finish out the fiscal year and be done. Maybe after my sabbatical I'll want to come back (assuming they'll want or need me then). But I really am looking forward to 3-to-6 months off of working with no deadline.

Let's see how long it takes me to get bored.

Now that we're within the 45-60 day window, I'm getting itchy for an update.  I will offer one piece of advice and that is to avoid making a major, life-altering decision when you're impaired.  While it may be more obvious if you're drunk or running on no sleep, being burned out can be just as impairing to making good decisions.  If/when you decide to hand in your notice, I wouldn't immediately reject any offers they put in front of you and I wouldn't burn any bridges if you can avoid it.  I'd just keep it to the facts - you're burned out, your request for a sabbatical was rejected, so leaving is the only option you have.  I wouldn't be surprised if they try to come up with a way to keep you and if they do I'd just tell them you're too burned out to make a good decision and you'll get back to them as soon as you can. 
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Dogastrophe on March 05, 2024, 12:37:18 PM
To answer many of your question, at this point I don't really want to keep working there. A friend of mine wants me to stay and has asked what could be done, but the more I think about it, the more the decision is made. I am going to finish out the fiscal year and be done. Maybe after my sabbatical I'll want to come back (assuming they'll want or need me then). But I really am looking forward to 3-to-6 months off of working with no deadline.

Let's see how long it takes me to get bored.

Now that we're within the 45-60 day window, I'm getting itchy for an update.  I will offer one piece of advice and that is to avoid making a major, life-altering decision when you're impaired.  While it may be more obvious if you're drunk or running on no sleep, being burned out can be just as impairing to making good decisions.  If/when you decide to hand in your notice, I wouldn't immediately reject any offers they put in front of you and I wouldn't burn any bridges if you can avoid it.  I'd just keep it to the facts - you're burned out, your request for a sabbatical was rejected, so leaving is the only option you have.  I wouldn't be surprised if they try to come up with a way to keep you and if they do I'd just tell them you're too burned out to make a good decision and you'll get back to them as soon as you can.

Alcon835 posted in his journal yesterday: https://forum.mrmoneymustache.com/journals/alcon835's-pausing-the-rat-race-accelerating-the-journey/msg3238392/#msg3238392
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: TwoCommas on March 05, 2024, 07:17:39 PM
To answer many of your question, at this point I don't really want to keep working there. A friend of mine wants me to stay and has asked what could be done, but the more I think about it, the more the decision is made. I am going to finish out the fiscal year and be done. Maybe after my sabbatical I'll want to come back (assuming they'll want or need me then). But I really am looking forward to 3-to-6 months off of working with no deadline.

Let's see how long it takes me to get bored.


Now that we're within the 45-60 day window, I'm getting itchy for an update.  I will offer one piece of advice and that is to avoid making a major, life-altering decision when you're impaired.  While it may be more obvious if you're drunk or running on no sleep, being burned out can be just as impairing to making good decisions.  If/when you decide to hand in your notice, I wouldn't immediately reject any offers they put in front of you and I wouldn't burn any bridges if you can avoid it.  I'd just keep it to the facts - you're burned out, your request for a sabbatical was rejected, so leaving is the only option you have.  I wouldn't be surprised if they try to come up with a way to keep you and if they do I'd just tell them you're too burned out to make a good decision and you'll get back to them as soon as you can.

Alcon835 posted in his journal yesterday: https://forum.mrmoneymustache.com/journals/alcon835's-pausing-the-rat-race-accelerating-the-journey/msg3238392/#msg3238392

Thanks for sharing this!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: alcon835 on March 09, 2024, 08:10:14 AM
To answer many of your question, at this point I don't really want to keep working there. A friend of mine wants me to stay and has asked what could be done, but the more I think about it, the more the decision is made. I am going to finish out the fiscal year and be done. Maybe after my sabbatical I'll want to come back (assuming they'll want or need me then). But I really am looking forward to 3-to-6 months off of working with no deadline.

Let's see how long it takes me to get bored.


Now that we're within the 45-60 day window, I'm getting itchy for an update.  I will offer one piece of advice and that is to avoid making a major, life-altering decision when you're impaired.  While it may be more obvious if you're drunk or running on no sleep, being burned out can be just as impairing to making good decisions.  If/when you decide to hand in your notice, I wouldn't immediately reject any offers they put in front of you and I wouldn't burn any bridges if you can avoid it.  I'd just keep it to the facts - you're burned out, your request for a sabbatical was rejected, so leaving is the only option you have.  I wouldn't be surprised if they try to come up with a way to keep you and if they do I'd just tell them you're too burned out to make a good decision and you'll get back to them as soon as you can.

Alcon835 posted in his journal yesterday: https://forum.mrmoneymustache.com/journals/alcon835's-pausing-the-rat-race-accelerating-the-journey/msg3238392/#msg3238392

Thanks for sharing this!

Yes, more regular updates in my journal, a bigger update here once I'm away from work a bit more clear headed. But, as a very small update, my last day is this coming Friday, March 15th!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Dicey on March 09, 2024, 08:35:07 AM
Ooh, way to embrace the Ides of March! Congratulations!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Must_ache on March 12, 2024, 08:50:49 PM
I told my boss (who 99% of the time is reasonable) that I will quit in six months.  I'm the only person doing my job, so a transition to some newly-hired person would be ideal.  A brief email exchange:

Me: I might be amenable to a short part-time transition if it turns out that the timing of the hiring of my eventual replacement were near my end date.  During a short transition I wouldn’t plan on getting involved in Task X, although I could be involved in doing just about anything else.

Boss: If the company is going to continue paying you, then you aren’t going to decide when you want to work and what projects you will work on.

Me: In the event of a short-term transition, there will be conditions on what projects I work on.  Only one condition really, I just stated it (Task X).  If you don’t like it, obviously there won’t be a short-term transition.  Both parties have to agree.

Boss: There has to be interest on your end and there has to be an offer on my end.  So lets just ignore this part time hypothetical until we get there.

So last Monday the boss called with the bonus numbers and I told him that as promised I was then ready to give notice to quit 3/15 when the bonus pays out.  He asked me to stay for the rest of the month, and I was happy to do so.  I'm currently only "working" less than 1/2 the time at this point. 

Today he showed up in my office and asked if I would like to be an hourly employee.  I said yes, as that is something that interests me and is probably beneficial to both.  They still need me around for some projects this year, but hopefully with flexibility to work when needed and to not work when not needed.  We haven't worked out any details yet, but I have every reason to think it will work out well for me. 
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: LennStar on March 13, 2024, 12:31:14 AM
Sounds good. Flexibility is great.

I will be reducing my hours in the middle of the year to have a movable free day every 2 weeks.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Turtle on March 13, 2024, 09:21:18 AM
I told my boss (who 99% of the time is reasonable) that I will quit in six months.  I'm the only person doing my job, so a transition to some newly-hired person would be ideal.  A brief email exchange:

Me: I might be amenable to a short part-time transition if it turns out that the timing of the hiring of my eventual replacement were near my end date.  During a short transition I wouldn’t plan on getting involved in Task X, although I could be involved in doing just about anything else.

Boss: If the company is going to continue paying you, then you aren’t going to decide when you want to work and what projects you will work on.

Me: In the event of a short-term transition, there will be conditions on what projects I work on.  Only one condition really, I just stated it (Task X).  If you don’t like it, obviously there won’t be a short-term transition.  Both parties have to agree.

Boss: There has to be interest on your end and there has to be an offer on my end.  So lets just ignore this part time hypothetical until we get there.

So last Monday the boss called with the bonus numbers and I told him that as promised I was then ready to give notice to quit 3/15 when the bonus pays out.  He asked me to stay for the rest of the month, and I was happy to do so.  I'm currently only "working" less than 1/2 the time at this point. 

Today he showed up in my office and asked if I would like to be an hourly employee.  I said yes, as that is something that interests me and is probably beneficial to both.  They still need me around for some projects this year, but hopefully with flexibility to work when needed and to not work when not needed.  We haven't worked out any details yet, but I have every reason to think it will work out well for me.

Congratulations!  I hope it works out well for you!
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: NY Texan on March 13, 2024, 11:03:20 AM
Here’s my latest FU money story from yesterday:

First some background:  I left full time employment in Feb 2023 when I was 55 and reached the point where we have enough money (FI) and no longer needed to work.  My wife continues to work, but only because she wants to, she’s 6 years younger than me, and work is an important social outlet for her.

Five months ago:  A local technology company got my contact info from a mutual friend and called me from out of the blue, asking if I would help out with a project.  I met with them, they have a small, cohesive team, so I said yes to part time work.  The work they had for me was ‘easy’ compared to my previous career(s), it was winter in upstate NY, and it was a chance to make some unexpected income.

Three weeks ago:  My small, but talented team, has been making excellent progress on our design effort.  A recently hired project manager was making his way through the larger team and finally got to us.  Started asking lots of questions (well within his rights), but his tone and demeanor were very off-putting to me and other team members.  I thought he would leave us alone since it felt like we were making good progress.  But he kept coming back.  After I showed him our ‘work plan’, which we were about 2/3 complete, he insisted that we adopt his work plan.  Clearly, he wanted to ‘get in our business’ and start micro-managing us with silly and distracting tasks.  I tried to explain why I wanted to keep on the original plan, that we were ready to start ordering prototype hardware, and his plan would slow our progress.  At this point, it all hit the fan, and he was very upset with me.

Yesterday:  I woke up early, typed a friendly/professional resignation letter and sent it to the president of the company.  The president immediately called me, said he predicted that this was going to happen (he was aware of the recent tensions), but understood completely.

Lessons learned:
1.   Things can go from really good to really bad in an incredibly short amount of time.
2.   FU money is the enabler that allows you to step away when it’s no longer fun/interesting.
3.   Initially I was not sure how I’d feel about contract work, but in general, I enjoyed the engagement and the opportunity to do some engineering on a part time basis…definitely not interested in full time. 
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: okits on March 13, 2024, 11:19:40 AM
Congratulations NY Texan!  Sounds satisfying without an excess of conflict.

Lessons learned:
1.   Things can go from really good to really bad in an incredibly short amount of time.

This is incredibly true.  One new hire in the right spot can overturn the entire balance.  I hope the rest of your team does okay with the new project manager.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: SwordGuy on March 13, 2024, 12:43:14 PM
Lessons learned:
1.   Things can go from really good to really bad in an incredibly short amount of time.

There are 3 layers of management over most people.  Regardless, the (up to) three people above you will have the most effect on job quality and satisfaction.  Regarding this, I present to you:

Wendelken's Law of Management Quality:

   Over a 5 year span of time, it's almost certain one of them will be a moron, nasty, and/or evil.   

Plan your career and ability to change jobs accordingly.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: jrhampt on March 13, 2024, 01:26:12 PM
Lessons learned:
1.   Things can go from really good to really bad in an incredibly short amount of time.

There are 3 layers of management over most people.  Regardless, the (up to) three people above you will have the most effect on job quality and satisfaction.  Regarding this, I present to you:

Wendelken's Law of Management Quality:

   Over a 5 year span of time, it's almost certain one of them will be a moron, nasty, and/or evil.   

Plan your career and ability to change jobs accordingly.

This is so true.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: RWD on March 13, 2024, 02:19:35 PM
Yesterday:  I woke up early, typed a friendly/professional resignation letter and sent it to the president of the company.  The president immediately called me, said he predicted that this was going to happen (he was aware of the recent tensions), but understood completely.
Crazy that he was aware of the issues but didn't fire the project manager...
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: NorthernIkigai on March 13, 2024, 03:13:54 PM
Yesterday:  I woke up early, typed a friendly/professional resignation letter and sent it to the president of the company.  The president immediately called me, said he predicted that this was going to happen (he was aware of the recent tensions), but understood completely.
Crazy that he was aware of the issues but didn't fire the project manager...
Maybe we found the moron.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Kris on March 13, 2024, 03:18:18 PM
Yesterday:  I woke up early, typed a friendly/professional resignation letter and sent it to the president of the company.  The president immediately called me, said he predicted that this was going to happen (he was aware of the recent tensions), but understood completely.
Crazy that he was aware of the issues but didn't fire the project manager...

Right? That’s where I expected the story to go. I guess I was too optimistic…
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: ATtiny85 on March 13, 2024, 06:13:04 PM
Yesterday:  I woke up early, typed a friendly/professional resignation letter and sent it to the president of the company.  The president immediately called me, said he predicted that this was going to happen (he was aware of the recent tensions), but understood completely.
Crazy that he was aware of the issues but didn't fire the project manager...
Maybe we found the moron.

That’s funny!

Awesome story, thanks for sharing it with us.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: Warlord1986 on March 14, 2024, 09:00:14 AM
That was a good story. Glad I got to read it.
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: AlanStache on March 14, 2024, 01:24:22 PM
Yesterday:  I woke up early, typed a friendly/professional resignation letter and sent it to the president of the company.  The president immediately called me, said he predicted that this was going to happen (he was aware of the recent tensions), but understood completely.
Crazy that he was aware of the issues but didn't fire the project manager...

Right? That’s where I expected the story to go. I guess I was too optimistic…

Gosh knows what management was incentivized to produce or achieve.  People (even pointy haired bosses) can be sort of rational but often have "interesting" incentives to do what may not be the nice thing for employees or the obvious thing for a company... Or then can be lazy and think people could not possibly just peace out... 

Or keeping NY Texan would be the presidents problem but hiring the replacement would be HRs problem.  <shaking head>

Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: johndoe on March 15, 2024, 05:06:13 AM
Out of curiosity NW Texan, did you consider trying to ally with the other team to resist this new PM?  Obviously I don't know the details,  but I feel like quitting would be the "nuclear option" and I'd much rather really hash it out with team / PM / president.  Is the work such that the PM has final say on everything?

When I get FI-money and if I have "bad boss" I feel like I'd be willing to stick around and try to improve outcomes.  I won't care about "performance reviews" so what's the worst they can do to me?  Fire me?  How is that any worse than quitting?  The project/widget outcome is the same.  Why not "play chicken" with PM and hope they go down rather than you?
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: AlanStache on March 15, 2024, 06:46:58 AM

When I get FI-money and if I have "bad boss" I feel like I'd be willing to stick around and try to improve outcomes.  I won't care about "performance reviews" so what's the worst they can do to me?  Fire me?  How is that any worse than quitting?  The project/widget outcome is the same.  Why not "play chicken" with PM and hope they go down rather than you?

Sounds good in theory...  in my final +6 months I was vocal in pointing out problems and when I finally turned in my letter of resignation I think management was relieved that I was going away and the guy saying "yo the v2.0 of our core product is sort of shit" was going away and they would not have to hear that anymore.  Turns out two others in similar to my role left shortly after me in a company of 25-30 people, the core of the engineering department was cut in ~half over 3 months. 
See my journal for more of "dude you can fire me but like this product will still be crap" - link in my signature. 
Title: Re: Epic FU money stories
Post by: SwordGuy on March 15, 2024, 08:22:05 AM

When I get FI-money and if I have "bad boss" I feel like I'd be willing to stick around and try to improve outcomes.  I won't care about "performance reviews" so what's the worst they can do to me?  Fire me?  How is that any worse than quitting?  The project/widget outcome is the same.  Why not "play chicken" with PM and hope they go down rather than you?

Sounds good in theory...  in my final +6 months I was vocal in pointing out problems and when I finally turned in my letter of resignation I think management was relieved that I was going away and the guy saying "yo the v2.0 of our core product is sort of shit" was going away and they would not have to hear that anymore.  Turns out two others in similar to my role left shortly after me in a company of 25-30 people, the core of the engineering department was cut in ~half over 3 months. 
See my journal for more of "dude you can fire me but like this product will still be crap" - link in my signature.

I present to you, Wendelken's Law of Management Expectations:

Quote
The universe is full of limits and boundaries. However, there is no known or theoretical upper limit to managers' ability to believe what they want to believe, despite all facts or evidence to the contrary.