Author Topic: Driving is fun?  (Read 5393 times)

Proletariat

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Driving is fun?
« on: March 26, 2019, 09:05:59 AM »
Driving is very criticized around here - and for good reason most of the time. People do tend to make unnecessary trips and in general be wasteful with their spending. If you constantly lease expensive vehicles, buy SUVs, or trade your car in every few years, then of course it's easy to see how cars can quickly erode your finances over time.

But can a case be made for making the most out of your time driving?

I live in a rural mountainous area (read: twisty roads with little traffic) and am considering buying a Mazda Miata. Most likely used, but probably a newer model. This purchase I believe would enhance my overall happiness because I love driving in nice weather while listening to music - it's extremely therapeutic. And I couldn't imagine anything better than doing that with the top down in a fun handling car.

I also love my driving time when commuting and listening to podcasts. Thankfully, I don't live super close to work. It feels like a period of time that I am free for the day and there is literally no where else to be except in the car at that moment because I have to get from one place to another.

I guess it's still not the cheapest hobby or form of entertainment - but, I don't know, I really enjoy it sometimes and maybe I'm just trying to justify a purchase or see if anyone else feels the same.
« Last Edit: March 26, 2019, 09:11:08 AM by Proletariat »

Laura33

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Re: Driving is fun?
« Reply #1 on: March 26, 2019, 09:30:53 AM »
Yes, there are people who feel the same way you do (hi!).  Just like there are people here who love eating out, or love traveling, or whatever else.  The key is to recognize that life is an "or," not an "and," and to deploy your money strategically and efficiently to bring you maximum value.  There are worse things to blow your money on than something that brings you joy every single day.

So, can you afford a Miata?  What's the rest of your life like?  Do you have other splurges, other wants that you find excuses to spend money on, or is this really IT for you?  Are you on track to FIRE when you want?  How much longer will you need to work to cover the cost of a Miata in perpetuity?  Not this same car, mind you, but some car like it, because once you splurge you are unlikely to want to go back -- and don't forget maintenance, insurance, etc.  Is that extra time at work worth it?  Can you write a check for the car, or do you need a loan?  (Note that I am not saying you should write a check -- if you can get a super-low interest rate, a loan may be a reasonable choice.  But needing a loan for a fun car means you can't afford a fun car.)

If the rest of your life is on track and you're willing to work the extra time to cover the cost of buying and maintaining an upgraded car, then yeah, a used Miata is a pretty cost-effective way to deploy your StupidCar money. 

Icecreamarsenal

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Re: Driving is fun?
« Reply #2 on: March 26, 2019, 09:45:06 AM »
Can the proletariat become the bourgeoise?  Yes, but probably not by driving there.  I enjoy the miata, and I also believe that Miata Is Always The Answer.
If you're not already FI, put it in mathematical context:  I am extending my FI date by x years, i.e. 3 years, to drive a frivolous purchase.  There is much joy found in frivolity, but in the FI pursuit it's vital to know exactly what it is you're giving up.
If you do decide to purchase, I'd vouch for the ND.  It's lighter, and has more horses now.

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Re: Driving is fun?
« Reply #3 on: March 26, 2019, 09:54:24 AM »
Yes, there are people who feel the same way you do (hi!).  Just like there are people here who love eating out, or love traveling, or whatever else.  The key is to recognize that life is an "or," not an "and," and to deploy your money strategically and efficiently to bring you maximum value.  There are worse things to blow your money on than something that brings you joy every single day.

So, can you afford a Miata?  What's the rest of your life like?  Do you have other splurges, other wants that you find excuses to spend money on, or is this really IT for you?  Are you on track to FIRE when you want?  How much longer will you need to work to cover the cost of a Miata in perpetuity?  Not this same car, mind you, but some car like it, because once you splurge you are unlikely to want to go back -- and don't forget maintenance, insurance, etc.  Is that extra time at work worth it?  Can you write a check for the car, or do you need a loan?  (Note that I am not saying you should write a check -- if you can get a super-low interest rate, a loan may be a reasonable choice.  But needing a loan for a fun car means you can't afford a fun car.)

If the rest of your life is on track and you're willing to work the extra time to cover the cost of buying and maintaining an upgraded car, then yeah, a used Miata is a pretty cost-effective way to deploy your StupidCar money.

Posting to second all of what Laura33 just said.

The MMM philosophy is about spending in accordance with things that you actually value to bring maximum happiness. This does not necessarily mean minimizing expenses, just being thoughtful and purposeful about how you deploy your resources. Without knowing too many details, if your general financial picture is sound enough that this hobby won't put you in an unsustainable position, I'd say go for it. As far as sports cars go, a (new-ish) used Miata is a fairly cost-effective way to get what it sounds like you're trying to achieve.

Bird In Hand

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Re: Driving is fun?
« Reply #4 on: March 26, 2019, 10:30:21 AM »
Great responses.

I once had a Miata (NB).  It was so much fun to drive in nice weather...it would put a stupid grin on my face every day on the way to work and on the way home.  I spent a lot of my free time (and money) on mods, maintenance, and gas.  For a period of about 5 years it was my primary hobby and I really loved it.  I also met some really cool people in the local Miata club that I otherwise would never have known.

In retrospect I acknowledge it was a pretty expensive hobby.  Was it worth the price?  I guess so, since I don't regret it!  If I lived in a place with nice weather and twisty mountain roads, I'd consider getting another Miata (a classic NA or an ND) as a replacement for a daily commuter car.  In fact there's a decent chance I'll pick up a used one some day after FIRE.

RWD

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Re: Driving is fun?
« Reply #5 on: March 26, 2019, 10:42:41 AM »
The Miata is a great choice for driving enjoyment on a budget. Reasonable cost of acquisition, low maintenance, good fuel efficiency.

markbike528CBX

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Re: Driving is fun?
« Reply #6 on: March 26, 2019, 12:48:09 PM »
Disclaimer: I've never driven a Miata.   
However, virtually everyone I see on the internet agrees that "Miata Is Always The Answer".   Even Doug DeMuro, who drives lots of high end exotics, gets a sh*t-eating grin that just won't quit, in a Miata.

I have a 2000 Boxster, so that's kinda the next best thing.  Yep, zipping around is fun, especially with the top down.   Traveled across the US nearly coast to coast with DW, still married.

Kevin S.

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Re: Driving is fun?
« Reply #7 on: March 26, 2019, 01:46:41 PM »
The Miata is a great choice for driving enjoyment on a budget. Reasonable cost of acquisition, low maintenance, good fuel efficiency.


Agreed! If you don't require a roadster. The frs/brz is really an amazing car that also fits alot of the above mentioned value. Maintenance on the flat 4 motor might be a bit higher if you are not diy though...

RWD

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Re: Driving is fun?
« Reply #8 on: March 26, 2019, 01:56:57 PM »
The Miata is a great choice for driving enjoyment on a budget. Reasonable cost of acquisition, low maintenance, good fuel efficiency.


Agreed! If you don't require a roadster. The frs/brz is really an amazing car that also fits alot of the above mentioned value. Maintenance on the flat 4 motor might be a bit higher if you are not diy though...

I didn't want a convertible so I chose the BRZ. Coming up on six years of ownership now and I've pretty much only changed the oil, one set of tires, and a battery.

dignam

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Re: Driving is fun?
« Reply #9 on: March 26, 2019, 02:08:56 PM »
Someone already stated it but it's worth saying again: it's about using your money in a way that ultimately brings you happiness.  Most people would agree that FI == freedom == happiness, so saving as much as you can is the way to go.

I agree with that to an extent; but you don't know if you're going to be hit by a bus tomorrow.  So, hedge your bets at least a little and splurge on one or two things that you just love.  Some people confuse this with buying something expensive to impress others.  No....just, no.

Personally I also have a fun car I bought after it had already lost most of its value ('13 335i).  I've loved cars my whole life, and it never ceases to put a big stupid grin on my face when mashing the skinny pedal on a really fast car.  Or taking twisty backroads.  Or mudding in a Jeep.  You can still be reasonable about the age and price of the fun car (i.e. basically never buy it new).

jlcnuke

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Re: Driving is fun?
« Reply #10 on: March 26, 2019, 02:35:11 PM »
Yes, there are people who feel the same way you do (hi!).  Just like there are people here who love eating out, or love traveling, or whatever else.  The key is to recognize that life is an "or," not an "and," and to deploy your money strategically and efficiently to bring you maximum value.  There are worse things to blow your money on than something that brings you joy every single day.

So, can you afford a Miata?  What's the rest of your life like?  Do you have other splurges, other wants that you find excuses to spend money on, or is this really IT for you?  Are you on track to FIRE when you want?  How much longer will you need to work to cover the cost of a Miata in perpetuity?  Not this same car, mind you, but some car like it, because once you splurge you are unlikely to want to go back -- and don't forget maintenance, insurance, etc.  Is that extra time at work worth it?  Can you write a check for the car, or do you need a loan?  (Note that I am not saying you should write a check -- if you can get a super-low interest rate, a loan may be a reasonable choice.  But needing a loan for a fun car means you can't afford a fun car.)

If the rest of your life is on track and you're willing to work the extra time to cover the cost of buying and maintaining an upgraded car, then yeah, a used Miata is a pretty cost-effective way to deploy your StupidCar money.

Posting to second all of what Laura33 just said.

The MMM philosophy is about spending in accordance with things that you actually value to bring maximum happiness. This does not necessarily mean minimizing expenses, just being thoughtful and purposeful about how you deploy your resources. Without knowing too many details, if your general financial picture is sound enough that this hobby won't put you in an unsustainable position, I'd say go for it. As far as sports cars go, a (new-ish) used Miata is a fairly cost-effective way to get what it sounds like you're trying to achieve.

This, so much this. For most people, time in a car is time that is lost, time that they aren't getting paid for or getting to be with their family or getting to do the things they enjoy. For such people, minimizing spending money on such a thing makes perfect sense. For the person that enjoys every minute they're cruising down the road, whether just out for a drive on Sunday or commuting to work on Monday, it's a different story. Whether the car is worth it to you depends on how much you value that experience relative to how much time it will cost you to have it.

Greystache

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Re: Driving is fun?
« Reply #11 on: March 27, 2019, 08:03:47 AM »
I once drove a Miata down from Sandia Peak in a snowstorm. Do not recommend. This was an older model without antilock brakes. The car is great fun in good weather but pretty useless in snow. Also, I am just over 6 feet tall and the car was a tight fit.

Metalcat

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Re: Driving is fun?
« Reply #12 on: March 27, 2019, 08:15:41 AM »
Is driving around in a Miata more fun for you than literally anything and everything else that you could do for the same amount of money?

If yes, get the damn Miata.

If you would prefer travel, or have more time off of work, or a large pack of Corgis, then don't buy the Miata.

There's nothing inherently reasonable about choosing to drive around in a Miata, there also isn't anything inherently unreasonable about it either.

I used to see myself as a "car person" who "loved to drive", but once I fully embraced Mustachianism and learned to evaluate every purchase as a trade off where it precludes me having something else of value instead, I pretty much stopped caring about cars.

You are free to come to the opposite conclusion.
Your thing is your thing, and if driving a Miata is your thing, then go nuts, but no one here can determine if this particular thing is actually worth it for you.

Arbitrage

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Re: Driving is fun?
« Reply #13 on: March 27, 2019, 08:29:39 AM »
Is driving around in a Miata more fun for you than literally anything and everything else that you could do for the same amount of money?

If yes, get the damn Miata.

If you would prefer travel, or have more time off of work, or a large pack of Corgis, then don't buy the Miata.

There's nothing inherently reasonable about choosing to drive around in a Miata, there also isn't anything inherently unreasonable about it either.

I used to see myself as a "car person" who "loved to drive", but once I fully embraced Mustachianism and learned to evaluate every purchase as a trade off where it precludes me having something else of value instead, I pretty much stopped caring about cars.

You are free to come to the opposite conclusion.
Your thing is your thing, and if driving a Miata is your thing, then go nuts, but no one here can determine if this particular thing is actually worth it for you.

Agreed, and I have a similar experience (I wouldn't have quite gone so far as to call myself a 'car person,' but I had a phase where I drove a faster, more expensive, sportier car, and spent significant time with buddies talking about and working on cars). 

At this point, I don't think any car could reliably give me as much joy as riding my e-bike.  Some of that is due to living in the Los Angeles area - it really doesn't matter if your car is nice/fast if you're just stuck in traffic.  Some of that would likely change if I moved out of this concrete jungle, as I hope to do in FIRE.  At that point, it'll come down to cost/benefit vs. other uses of my money; I could see myself in an electric car at some point.

Xlar

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Re: Driving is fun?
« Reply #14 on: March 27, 2019, 08:46:31 AM »
I have an NB miata and love it! It puts a smile on my face every time that I drive it! :D

I use mine as my main commuter car, it makes the commute much more enjoyable! Plus it has been super reliable even with 125k miles and it is very easy to work on.

Bird In Hand

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Re: Driving is fun?
« Reply #15 on: March 27, 2019, 09:20:47 AM »
The car is great fun in good weather but pretty completely useless in snow.

FTFY!  Many of the attributes that make a Miata such a fun sports car -- light weight, RWD, 50/50 weight distribution, performance tires -- make it an absolute disaster in the snow.  Granted, I never put dedicated snow tires on mine, but I'm going to stand by my assertion that it's a really poor choice for snow driving.  And brakes have almost nothing to do with it IMO.

Bloop Bloop

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Re: Driving is fun?
« Reply #16 on: March 27, 2019, 03:41:04 PM »
There is another dimension to owning a fun car which is the satisfaction you get from having a lovely toy that's aesthetically pleasing and beautifully built.

As a fellow car lover, I'd say that most of us buy our cars partly for the drive and partly for the joy that owning a beautiful toy gives us. It's true that if you purely want a car for the twisty roads, it's probably more cost effective to rent one 10 times a year than to buy one, even second hand. But then you don't get the joy of ownership, of track days, of fiddling around with your car to your heart's delight.

Holyoak

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Re: Driving is fun?
« Reply #17 on: March 27, 2019, 03:54:12 PM »
Not that I would buy a new Miata (stashe wouldn't even notice it), but I must say I just looked at a brand new one while car shopping, and BOY IS IT NICE.  Power is up, max RPM's up, absolutely beautifully made, everything a true small roadster should be IMO.  I'm not really all that fond of driving, as where I live the asshole driver ratio is very high...  Constant tailgating, rampant dangerous speeding, very discourteous operators over-all, and it takes the fun out of it.  I am however a great lover of precision, well built devices showing great craftsmanship, and boy do these Miata's have it in spades.

If it ticks your boxes, buy it and enjoy.  Good luck. 

waltworks

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Re: Driving is fun?
« Reply #18 on: March 27, 2019, 04:07:26 PM »
I spent most of my life racing stuff. Some motorized (karts, enduro motorcycles) and some not (mountain bikes, skis). I was at one point good enough to be a "pro" and get paid a pittance (probably net of zero after expenses and lets not even think about the opportunity cost if I'd gone and gotten an actual job...) to race.

So I can't have cars that are fun. I just can't. I will operate them like a jackass if I'm not paying attention sufficiently. And honestly after karts, any street legal car is like driving a mule anyway.

Solution: minivans. I can haul lots of stuff and kids, they're not impressing anyone, and they're no fun at all to drive (ponderous, tall, heavy, front wheel drive...perfect).

I'd get a motorcycle in your shoes (nice weather, twisty roads) but a Miata sounds good too as long as you can keep your inner Andretti in check.

-W

Proletariat

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Re: Driving is fun?
« Reply #19 on: March 27, 2019, 07:43:01 PM »
I used to see myself as a "car person" who "loved to drive", but once I fully embraced Mustachianism and learned to evaluate every purchase as a trade off where it precludes me having something else of value instead, I pretty much stopped caring about cars.

When I read that I thought "man I really am not a car person"...but upon mulling that over - I might be. I don't care about racing or modding or anything like that, but I appreciate the joy a nice car can bring. "Nice" meaning within acceptable levels of course. And fun > nice. A nice Tahoe would mean absolutely nothing to me. I like the Miata and could see it as a forever-mobile. It's small, minimalist, I don't buy a crap ton of groceries or anything. And it's still practical in terms of insurance and cost to maintain. I am just drawn to simple and minimalistic things. I mean my current car is a Chevrolet Cruze that I've had for 8 years and I still like it. I'm easy to please overall.

Not that I would buy a new Miata (stashe wouldn't even notice it), but I must say I just looked at a brand new one while car shopping, and BOY IS IT NICE.  Power is up, max RPM's up, absolutely beautifully made, everything a true small roadster should be IMO.  I'm not really all that fond of driving, as where I live the asshole driver ratio is very high...  Constant tailgating, rampant dangerous speeding, very discourteous operators over-all, and it takes the fun out of it.  I am however a great lover of precision, well built devices showing great craftsmanship, and boy do these Miata's have it in spades.

It's always tempting to go brand new but it's amazing how a $33k vehicle loses like $13k in just a few years.

I'd get a motorcycle in your shoes (nice weather, twisty roads) but a Miata sounds good too as long as you can keep your inner Andretti in check.

I actually want(ed) a motorcycle for this year. I bought all the gear and everything. The family just has me a little too concerned about it. I just hit and almost killed a dog on one of the roads 2 minutes from my house and it tore the front cover apart. I know the bike is more fun per $ but I might have to make a concession with a fun little car. Then again...secretly I want both :P I grew up riding bikes and to be honest I have the itch every single year.
« Last Edit: March 27, 2019, 07:53:07 PM by Proletariat »

mschaus

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Re: Driving is fun?
« Reply #20 on: March 27, 2019, 08:27:39 PM »
[...]

Posting to second all of what Laura33 just said.

The MMM philosophy is about spending in accordance with things that you actually value to bring maximum happiness. [...]

This, so much this. [...]

Since I didn't see any other party poopers, I'll chime in. It's important to take into account that also critical to the MMM philosophy is considering the negative externalities of what you are doing. That is, harming the fewest other people over your life. Driving happens to be an activity with lots of negative externalities. For example, MMM says:

"It’s a whole lot of badness we’re doing, every time we drive. It’s not just a matter of “Hey, it’ll only cost me ten bucks for the gas”. It’s a matter of choosing to be an asshole." ... "Just acknowledge that whenever you turn the key, you need to say, “Here we go. I’m being an asshole again”."
http://www.mrmoneymustache.com/2013/04/22/curing-your-clown-like-car-habit/

You can enjoy occasional driving, just be sure to mock yourself accordingly, not let it escalate, and find a way to give back.

If mustachianism is going to be cited as a reason it's ok to drive, the clarification needed to be made.

</pooper>

Bloop Bloop

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Re: Driving is fun?
« Reply #21 on: March 27, 2019, 08:38:32 PM »
The same article also says, "And for those remaining trips that pass the Triple Anti-Car-Clown Gauntlet: well, those are probably some hella good car trips, so you will have such a good time that it will be worth the consequences."

For those of us (like me, and I suspect OP, given the nature of the post) who don't commute very much, and put very few miles on our cars other than very fun miles in the twisties with engine revving into the skies, there are no negative externalities other than the using of fuel, which is minor in the scheme of things, especially as (depending on your country) fuel and car ownership are already taxed heavily.

RWD

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Re: Driving is fun?
« Reply #22 on: March 28, 2019, 07:32:40 AM »
But can a case be made for making the most out of your time driving?
You can enjoy occasional driving, just be sure to mock yourself accordingly, not let it escalate, and find a way to give back.

I think there is a big difference between enjoying the times when you drive and driving just because you can. This thread appears to be about maximizing enjoyment out of driving, not driving more.


The same article also says, "And for those remaining trips that pass the Triple Anti-Car-Clown Gauntlet: well, those are probably some hella good car trips, so you will have such a good time that it will be worth the consequences."

For those of us (like me, and I suspect OP, given the nature of the post) who don't commute very much, and put very few miles on our cars other than very fun miles in the twisties with engine revving into the skies, there are no negative externalities other than the using of fuel, which is minor in the scheme of things, especially as (depending on your country) fuel and car ownership are already taxed heavily.

Yep, this. My wife almost always commutes to work by bicycle and I work from home. So we're probably actually driving less miles than someone preaching about needing to mock driving enjoyment.

RWD

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Re: Driving is fun?
« Reply #23 on: March 28, 2019, 07:41:47 AM »
I should also point out that choosing a fun car like the Miata is way different than buying an SUV from a planet-saving perspective. The Miata gets similar or better fuel economy than mid-size sedans. The 2016+ models have an EPA rating of 26-27/34-36 mpg city/hwy.

HipGnosis

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Re: Driving is fun?
« Reply #24 on: March 28, 2019, 09:03:15 AM »
If you want to enjoy driving in a MMM(ish) way, get a motorcycle.
I've got a 15 yr old Kawasaki 650 with 50K miles on it.  I bought it used when it was 3 yrs old, and paid in cash.
The tag is cheaper than my car's and it gets 50-60 mpg, even at 'fun' speeds.
I use to use MP3 players, now I use my phone for music - which also lets me hear when I get a text.

But... over that time I also bought 3 other bikes (all w/ cash, used).  2 of them will be for sale when riding weather eventually comes to Wisc.  I'm struggling with deciding if the 650 will be one of them.

The only real drawback is that I can no longer park my car in the garage.
« Last Edit: March 28, 2019, 09:05:37 AM by HipGnosis »

facepalm

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Re: Driving is fun?
« Reply #25 on: March 30, 2019, 04:14:46 AM »
I spent most of my life racing stuff. Some motorized (karts, enduro motorcycles) and some not (mountain bikes, skis). I was at one point good enough to be a "pro" and get paid a pittance (probably net of zero after expenses and lets not even think about the opportunity cost if I'd gone and gotten an actual job...) to race.

So I can't have cars that are fun. I just can't. I will operate them like a jackass if I'm not paying attention sufficiently. And honestly after karts, any street legal car is like driving a mule anyway.

Solution: minivans. I can haul lots of stuff and kids, they're not impressing anyone, and they're no fun at all to drive (ponderous, tall, heavy, front wheel drive...perfect).

I'd get a motorcycle in your shoes (nice weather, twisty roads) but a Miata sounds good too as long as you can keep your inner Andretti in check.

-W

I'm in a similar situation. Been riding motos for years, currently have a KTM 1190 Adv. When I'm on the moto I'm a bit of an asshole (but only a little bit) but I can have my fun.  In a car, I can't let myself drive that way. Besides, riding a moto sort of kills the automobile as a fun vehicle.

I drive a Camry.

OP might consider a bike if htey are up for it. Otherwise, the Miata is a fine vehicle.

MrThatsDifferent

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Re: Driving is fun?
« Reply #26 on: March 30, 2019, 01:51:11 PM »
Motorcycles have a 100% accident rate. So if the rush of speed is your thing, good luck!

Askel

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Re: Driving is fun?
« Reply #27 on: March 30, 2019, 04:17:16 PM »
The car is great fun in good weather but pretty completely useless in snow.

FTFY!  Many of the attributes that make a Miata such a fun sports car -- light weight, RWD, 50/50 weight distribution, performance tires -- make it an absolute disaster in the snow.  Granted, I never put dedicated snow tires on mine, but I'm going to stand by my assertion that it's a really poor choice for snow driving.  And brakes have almost nothing to do with it IMO.

Having chased one through a good portion of the night during the Ontario Winter Rally, I can assure you that a miata on snow tires does just fine once you get it rolling. 

Speaking as a recovering car guy, take the time to analyze what you like about cars so much.  For me it was the technical toy aspect, the adventure of driving challenge, the flow experienced while doing so, and hanging out with a bunch of like minded friends afterwards. 

I can get all the same with bicycles just as easily and usually all those things are even way better on bikes. Plus they help keep the beer gut in check. 

Granted, I probably have more money in bicycles than it would take to buy a used miata, but take the time to figure out what it is you like about cars. 

Also, on the subject of motorcycles: I speak from experience here, do not get one to *save* money unless you are replacing your car entirely. Motorcycles are mostly an additional expense if you already have a car. 

pab88

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Re: Driving is fun?
« Reply #28 on: April 02, 2019, 02:38:28 AM »
Also a recovering car guy, my last car since going car-free was a supercharged NA. On paper it was great, but from within the first months of ownership the little problems with it that I didn't have the ability to fix bothered me and sapped some of the joy of owning it.

As you point out, the techy aspect of bikes is there too. Bikes can be modified and enhanced, at much less cost. In contrast to cars, bikes are easy to work on yourself, even in your living room. I love working on bicycles and getting the satisfaction from doing things myself, whereas with the Miata it was always an anxious process of finding a place that wold work on it, wondering how much it would cost, etc. I guess I could've learnt to wrench on it but wasn't prepared to invest in tools and risk messing up the work.

I have gotten heavily into bicycling and now rack up the same mileage cycling as I did driving.

Having said that I am mighty tempted at getting an NA once more, mostly because they are now eligible for conditional historic registration where I live, bringing down the yearly fixed registration and insurance costs down to a few hundred dollars from well above $1000. I think your enjoyment of a Miata will be largely dependent on the driving roads in your area. I live in a large urban area where Miatas are still fun but not really at home. I think I will be hiring an NC for a few days a year to scratch the itch.

Kevin S.

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Re: Driving is fun?
« Reply #29 on: April 02, 2019, 08:21:05 AM »
Motorcycles have a 100% accident rate. So if the rush of speed is your thing, good luck!

Weird i've had 5 motorcycles ranging from a 25 hp dirt bike to a 200 hp "death cycle" and i've never had an "off"

Weird...i must be the 1 and only anomaly ?

Or maybe 100 % is a bit much no "MrThatsDifferent" ?

OP get whatever gives you the most smiles per mile that you also realize is going to slow down your FIRE. Good luck ! Post up whatever you decide to get - even if it's nothing.

Also for what it's worth i've had a na miata and really enjoyed that vehicle ! I got mine for $ 500 bucks with a blown rear diff. $ 200 bucks in parts from the junk yard and i had a running / driving na miata that i used for autocross for a year. $1500 bucks total i think i had into it with brakes and tires. One of the most fun cars i've had (especially for the price) and i've had over 40 + vehicles

Sjalabais

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Re: Driving is fun?
« Reply #30 on: April 02, 2019, 01:13:20 PM »
Basically all points have been made already, but just sharing my approach: I tried to combine fun and utility. Got myself a Honda Stream 6 years ago. It drives not quite as a Miata, but is a lot of fun nonetheless. Excellent road handling, gear lever right next to the tight steering wheel, very controllable in hairy situations. It also has seven seats for our kids and can load up to 600kg of firewood. Now this thing is used up beyond recognition and I am looking for something fun and versatile to replace it with...won't be easy.

Just Joe

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Re: Driving is fun?
« Reply #31 on: April 02, 2019, 09:04:00 PM »
Maybe another Honda Stream? Sounds like it was good to you. I looked them up, sort of like a Mazda 5 in the USA.

Laura33

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Re: Driving is fun?
« Reply #32 on: April 04, 2019, 07:15:15 AM »
I used to see myself as a "car person" who "loved to drive", but once I fully embraced Mustachianism and learned to evaluate every purchase as a trade off where it precludes me having something else of value instead, I pretty much stopped caring about cars.

You are free to come to the opposite conclusion.

I am laughing, because for me, it did just the opposite.  I was always worried about money and would never have justified a completely frivolous car (even though I'd wanted one for over 25 years).  But the more I thought about Mustachianism, and the less I really felt I needed, the more my anxiety went away and I was able to assess my finances objectively.  That enabled to realize that I was already FI and even had other more critical "wants" covered (e.g., kids' college).  And the additional work time necessary to pay for my toy was irrelevant, because it was less than I intended to keep working anyway.  And since it's not a need, if my circumstances change, I can just sell it and cut that expense.

It's funny, because my StupidCar cost multiples of any other toy I've ever bought, and yet it's the one purchase I haven't regretted for a second.  As far as I'm concerned, this is my last car until I can't drive a stick any more.

Bloop Bloop

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Re: Driving is fun?
« Reply #33 on: April 04, 2019, 07:32:26 AM »
I think that's the great thing about being financially savvy. You assign points in terms of time and effort for what you genuinely want, and you purchase (or not purchase) accordingly. I agree that for most people, in this world, a car is at best an appliance and at worst an awful cage. But for some people who like aesthetics/speed/tech/heritage, it can be as worthwhile a purchase as an antique or a painting.

Xlar

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Re: Driving is fun?
« Reply #34 on: April 04, 2019, 10:11:25 AM »
Also a recovering car guy, my last car since going car-free was a supercharged NA. On paper it was great, but from within the first months of ownership the little problems with it that I didn't have the ability to fix bothered me and sapped some of the joy of owning it.

As you point out, the techy aspect of bikes is there too. Bikes can be modified and enhanced, at much less cost. In contrast to cars, bikes are easy to work on yourself, even in your living room. I love working on bicycles and getting the satisfaction from doing things myself, whereas with the Miata it was always an anxious process of finding a place that wold work on it, wondering how much it would cost, etc. I guess I could've learnt to wrench on it but wasn't prepared to invest in tools and risk messing up the work.

I have gotten heavily into bicycling and now rack up the same mileage cycling as I did driving.

Having said that I am mighty tempted at getting an NA once more, mostly because they are now eligible for conditional historic registration where I live, bringing down the yearly fixed registration and insurance costs down to a few hundred dollars from well above $1000. I think your enjoyment of a Miata will be largely dependent on the driving roads in your area. I live in a large urban area where Miatas are still fun but not really at home. I think I will be hiring an NC for a few days a year to scratch the itch.

One of the main things I like about my 2001 Miata is how reliable it is! Once you start modifying it (especially adding tons of power with a supercharger) that reliability goes out the window. Plus it is a very easy car to work on yourself (extra mustache points!)

thurston howell iv

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Re: Driving is fun?
« Reply #35 on: April 05, 2019, 12:45:34 PM »
A few years ago I was looking for a "fun" car for my mother and test drove a few Miata's. While decent, I didn't care for the ride and I own some cars with very firm suspension that are very low as well. Ended up with a Mini Cooper S instead.  Working on it was a pleasure and I don't think I've said that about ANY car I've owned or worked on.

I liked it so much I sold a BMW to buy myself a Mini as well. It's easy to work on, has a ton of aftermarket support, parts are relatively cheap, it's very peppy, very nimble in city traffic and I can park nearly anywhere I want!!

You can buy a decent used one for under $5k.  Just my .02

markbike528CBX

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Re: Driving is fun?
« Reply #36 on: April 05, 2019, 02:49:48 PM »
A few years ago I was looking for a "fun" car for my mother and test drove a few Miata's. While decent, I didn't care for the ride and I own some cars with very firm suspension that are very low as well. Ended up with a Mini Cooper S instead.  Working on it was a pleasure and I don't think I've said that about ANY car I've owned or worked on.

I liked it so much I sold a BMW to buy myself a Mini as well. It's easy to work on, has a ton of aftermarket support, parts are relatively cheap, it's very peppy, very nimble in city traffic and I can park nearly anywhere I want!!

You can buy a decent used one for under $5k.  Just my .02

While I know what you mean, a Mini IS a BMW
https://www.bmwgroup.com/en/brands-and-services/mini.html
Just my OCD 0.02  :-)

Bateaux

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Re: Driving is fun?
« Reply #37 on: April 06, 2019, 06:57:10 AM »
Offroad driving is fun.  If it's a paved road, I hope computers handle that boring and dangerous task soon.

thurston howell iv

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Re: Driving is fun?
« Reply #38 on: April 06, 2019, 07:47:05 AM »
A few years ago I was looking for a "fun" car for my mother and test drove a few Miata's. While decent, I didn't care for the ride and I own some cars with very firm suspension that are very low as well. Ended up with a Mini Cooper S instead.  Working on it was a pleasure and I don't think I've said that about ANY car I've owned or worked on.

I liked it so much I sold a BMW to buy myself a Mini as well. It's easy to work on, has a ton of aftermarket support, parts are relatively cheap, it's very peppy, very nimble in city traffic and I can park nearly anywhere I want!!

You can buy a decent used one for under $5k.  Just my .02

While I know what you mean, a Mini IS a BMW
https://www.bmwgroup.com/en/brands-and-services/mini.html
Just my OCD 0.02  :-)


Ha! Yes, Mini is made by BMW but I assure you that it is nothing like the BMW when it comes to reliability and ease of repair. If you've ever worked on a BMW, you will know that a MINI much less of a hassle to deal with.

RWD

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Re: Driving is fun?
« Reply #39 on: April 06, 2019, 12:51:54 PM »
A few years ago I was looking for a "fun" car for my mother and test drove a few Miata's. While decent, I didn't care for the ride and I own some cars with very firm suspension that are very low as well. Ended up with a Mini Cooper S instead.  Working on it was a pleasure and I don't think I've said that about ANY car I've owned or worked on.

I liked it so much I sold a BMW to buy myself a Mini as well. It's easy to work on, has a ton of aftermarket support, parts are relatively cheap, it's very peppy, very nimble in city traffic and I can park nearly anywhere I want!!

You can buy a decent used one for under $5k.  Just my .02

While I know what you mean, a Mini IS a BMW
https://www.bmwgroup.com/en/brands-and-services/mini.html
Just my OCD 0.02  :-)

Ha! Yes, Mini is made by BMW but I assure you that it is nothing like the BMW when it comes to reliability and ease of repair. If you've ever worked on a BMW, you will know that a MINI much less of a hassle to deal with.

That is weird, I've heard the exact opposite. That the MINIs are a huge pain to work on and some of the least reliable vehicles ever made...

johndoe

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Re: Driving is fun?
« Reply #40 on: April 07, 2019, 07:10:47 AM »
I have a Mazdaspeed Miata as my second car.  When I was considering the purchase, my daily was getting older.  I liked the idea of having a fun car, and having some peace of mind in case one was in need of repairs. 

You know it's funny, I "worry" about spending money on some things that cost a fraction of that car, but I've never regretted buying it.  It's been perfectly reliable and fun.

ImCheap

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Re: Driving is fun?
« Reply #41 on: April 07, 2019, 08:29:33 AM »
High lite of the week is taking our old pile of jeep out with the roof off, no doors for a weekend drive thru the country we love. We piss away more gas in one day then driving the clown car to work all week. I have zero guilt and no regrets after every drive. It one our simple guilty pleasures, more so in the spring  and summer keeping tabs on the crops as they come and go

facepalm

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Re: Driving is fun?
« Reply #42 on: April 07, 2019, 11:46:27 PM »
Motorcycles have a 100% accident rate. So if the rush of speed is your thing, good luck!
By your oddball metric, so do cars, bicycles, airplanes, and strollers.

Sjalabais

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Re: Driving is fun?
« Reply #43 on: April 28, 2019, 12:48:31 AM »
Maybe another Honda Stream? Sounds like it was good to you. I looked them up, sort of like a Mazda 5 in the USA.
You're right, those two are somewhat comparable! The Stream is rare here, only about 100 left in the country and we got high import barriers. Just got a used Nissan Leaf, which has pretty enticing economics, but will use up the Stream, too, and get a wagon eventually.