Did anyone else just laugh yesterday when the market dropped?

[RedmondStash]

My various thoughts yesterday were:

1. Wow, a more than 3% drop! Impressive. And kinda funny.

2. I wonder if this is a good time to move IRA money into a Roth -- nah, I'll wait until the end of the year when my income situation is clearer.

3. I'm very glad I've got my AA set so that the ups and downs don't stress me out.

4. I feel like I have a financial superpower in that I no longer panic at the market's whims.

5. I'm really grateful I learned about FIRE and educated myself about investing and taxes. So many people I know are running around like Chicken Little, especially with all the clickbait stock headlines. I don't need that kind of stress.

6. I'm also grateful for this forum, which helped me educate myself and steel my financial nerves.

[wageslave23]

I would say all of those reactions are good.  But 3% is nothing, especially with a booming economy.  What about 30%? 50%? And all indications that there is no end in sight.  That's what separates the men from the boys (or women from the girls).

[Bloop Bloop]

I'm hoping for the market to keep dropping. I think economic growth  can be dangerous if too prolonged because it can lead to bubbles and inflation.

[fattest_foot]

I saw lots of panic. Including here. Everyone was talking about how now was the time to hop out because the recession was coming.

But now that we're up 1.2% today, I guess the next bull run is imminent?

[LPG]

I didn't laugh, I drooled. I tend to think that I'm approximately one recession away from ending my salaried career, and am actually kind of excited for the next one. I plan on living as cheaply as possible through it, investing as much as I can, and riding my success straight to FIRE in the next expansion

[pdxvandal]

I loves stock sales! I moved $3k worth of bonds in my IRA to VTSAX. I'll be investing another $1k tomorrow via my biweekly paycheck. I still have 2-4 years of working for the man, so it's mostly on investing autopilot, no matter how the market performs. It seems a little frothy, but still doesn't feel near as bad as 2008. I guess we'll see...

[dcheesi]

...the market dropped yesterday? *shrug*

[Kris]

Only at how ludicrous the reason was.

[ketchup]

...the market dropped yesterday? *shrug*

This is the correct answer.

[Villanelle]

I'm surprised at all the threads here talking about it.  I assumed that mustachians would generally care as little about it as I do.  Which is none at all.  I didn't even know about it until I read the first thread on the forum that mentioned it. 

[FireLane]

I put $3K into my brokerage account yesterday. DCA for the win.

[AnswerIs42]

Oh no! The markets are, er, at the same place where they were just over a month ago! Everyone panic!

Meh, it's noise.

[Parizade]

...the market dropped yesterday? *shrug*

This is the correct answer.

Didn't even know till I saw this thread, doesn't really affect me.

[Wrenchturner]

I got scared so I moved my money into negative-yielding Danish mortgage bonds.  Just to be safe.

[EricEng]

Little concerned if it were to continue that rate over a couple weeks.  Corrections are fine, but that fast in a day isn't good for the market.

[lexde]

I posted almost the exact same thing in my journal today. I was in college during the 2008 recession so whenever this one comes, it will be my first as a working professional. I cannot WAIT to shovel my paychecks into the market, even on the way down, and ride it all the way back up. Until then, about 32% of my take home pay gets invested already.

[Buffaloski Boris]

I'm surprised at all the threads here talking about it.  I assumed that mustachians would generally care as little about it as I do.  Which is none at all.  I didn't even know about it until I read the first thread on the forum that mentioned it.

I was terrified. Hold me! 🤣

[the_grillman]

I thanked the error in the Vanguard App that prevented me from buying VTSAX on Friday for the extra share.

[MoneyTree]

No where near panic, but I'd rather see the markets go up than down.

If I were early in the accumulation phase, I'd be more excited to pick up more shares, but as someone who is getting close to FIRE, seeing these drops is no fun because its like someone snatching the finish line away from you.

Long term, it not a big deal, but I'm not as happy to see drops as some people seem to be.

[soccerluvof4]

No panic.. Be nice to have a correction to put some money to work. Got a dead cat bounce yesterday so see what happens rest of week. Numbers just look so much bigger because the Market is so High but percentage wise these swings down are very low.

[2Birds1Stone]

My various thoughts yesterday were:

1. Wow, a more than 3% drop! Impressive. And kinda funny.

2. I wonder if this is a good time to move IRA money into a Roth -- nah, I'll wait until the end of the year when my income situation is clearer.

3. I'm very glad I've got my AA set so that the ups and downs don't stress me out.

4. I feel like I have a financial superpower in that I no longer panic at the market's whims.

5. I'm really grateful I learned about FIRE and educated myself about investing and taxes. So many people I know are running around like Chicken Little, especially with all the clickbait stock headlines. I don't need that kind of stress.

6. I'm also grateful for this forum, which helped me educate myself and steel my financial nerves.

How much money do you have invested right now? Is it a laughable sum?

[driftwood]

One paycheck away from having enough to buy VSAX again (cashed out when I got divorced and split all assets).  Really hoping for a good dive right when I'm ready to buy in ($3k minimum).

Deployed now and using the financial boost to get back into index funds.

So every time I hear that the market is dropping I get more and more excited.

Now, if we could only get a real estate value collapse in Colorado I'd be elated, but I'm not holding my breath.

[Sibley]

I was curious and checked my balance. Then shrugged.

[undercover]

Didn't laugh. Didn't cry. Didn't care.

[RedmondStash]

My various thoughts yesterday were:

1. Wow, a more than 3% drop! Impressive. And kinda funny.

2. I wonder if this is a good time to move IRA money into a Roth -- nah, I'll wait until the end of the year when my income situation is clearer.

3. I'm very glad I've got my AA set so that the ups and downs don't stress me out.

4. I feel like I have a financial superpower in that I no longer panic at the market's whims.

5. I'm really grateful I learned about FIRE and educated myself about investing and taxes. So many people I know are running around like Chicken Little, especially with all the clickbait stock headlines. I don't need that kind of stress.

6. I'm also grateful for this forum, which helped me educate myself and steel my financial nerves.

How much money do you have invested right now? Is it a laughable sum?

Everything we have. And we're living off our investments. So on paper, we lost quite a bit.

The laughter is partly of relief, because I am not panicking; I believe the market will recover just fine. Some people I know are panicking, and I try to talk them down. One person I know is taking advantage of other people's panic in order to sell financial instruments, and I keep losing respect for them.

The way I look at it, drops are temporary, and rises are eventually permanent, though "eventually" can take many years.

[BTDretire]

I don't laugh at losing $45k.
It's going to happen along the bumpy road and I expect it, but nothing to laugh about.
I'm full invested so, a market drop is not a chance to get money in cheap.
 There are people that are really hurt by such a thing.

[TartanTallulah]

Didn't notice. Probably for the best.

[vand]

Nobody care about a small or even a sizeable drop in the market.

what people care much more about is the safety of their income stream.

Ask again when the market falls AND unemployment is rocketing.

[davisgang90]

I don't laugh at losing $45k.
It's going to happen along the bumpy road and I expect it, but nothing to laugh about.
I'm full invested so, a market drop is not a chance to get money in cheap.
 There are people that are really hurt by such a thing.

You only lost $45K if you sold your shares.  Otherwise, you didn't lose anything. You shouldn't have money in the market you need in the short term.  I've got 2 years of expenses out of the market, so I'm mildly interested in what's going on.

[ender]

I think it's funny how I never learn about market drops except from other people or these forums. lol

[A Fella from Stella]

I got scared so I moved my money into negative-yielding Danish mortgage bonds.  Just to be safe.

I stuffed mine into pork butts. So long as you have money in pork butts, you'll be okay.

[Davnasty]

I think it's funny how I never learn about market drops except from other people or these forums. lol

I only started checking the S&P to determine whether or not it's a good day for jokes over at "Top is in"

[Wrenchturner]

I got scared so I moved my money into negative-yielding Danish mortgage bonds.  Just to be safe.

I stuffed mine into pork butts. So long as you have money in pork butts, you'll be okay.

Short asada, long carnitas!

[Abe Froman]

I got scared so I moved my money into negative-yielding Danish mortgage bonds.  Just to be safe.

I stuffed mine into pork butts. So long as you have money in pork butts, you'll be okay.

I stuffed mine into Frozen Concentrated Orange Juice Futures.

[Kazyan]

There was a nice infographic over on Reddit the other day, showing that the % change in the stock market over one day looks like a typical Bell curve distribution, with a standard deviation of about 1% or so. Sometimes RNGesus throws a pretty bad roll; it happens and doesn't necessarily mean anything. When you start seeing foreclosures and mass layoffs again, then you can bother looking up from your newspaper.

[effigy98]

Diversified and had large gains, still a little nerve racking to see the swings and amount of fear starting to take hold.

[RedmondStash]

I got scared so I moved my money into negative-yielding Danish mortgage bonds.  Just to be safe.

I stuffed mine into pork butts. So long as you have money in pork butts, you'll be okay.

I stuffed mine into Frozen Concentrated Orange Juice Futures.

I'm sinking mine into pumpkin stocks. Given how high they are in October, imagine how high they'll be in November!

[flipboard]

Yawn. What happened? I'm not really up to date on things.

[Alchemisst]

I posted almost the exact same thing in my journal today. I was in college during the 2008 recession so whenever this one comes, it will be my first as a working professional. I cannot WAIT to shovel my paychecks into the market, even on the way down, and ride it all the way back up. Until then, about 32% of my take home pay gets invested already.

The problem is not all recessions are like the 08' recession, markets can (and have) gone sideways for 30 years in the past, so i'm a bit weary of possible recency bias, even though I kindof have the same thoughts since I've only experienced one recession aswell and had just started working.

[davisgang90]

I got scared so I moved my money into negative-yielding Danish mortgage bonds.  Just to be safe.

I stuffed mine into pork butts. So long as you have money in pork butts, you'll be okay.

I stuffed mine into Frozen Concentrated Orange Juice Futures.

Nice Trading Places reference!

[OurTown]

I don't laugh at losing $45k.
It's going to happen along the bumpy road and I expect it, but nothing to laugh about.
I'm full invested so, a market drop is not a chance to get money in cheap.
 There are people that are really hurt by such a thing.

You only lost $45K if you sold your shares.  Otherwise, you didn't lose anything. You shouldn't have money in the market you need in the short term.  I've got 2 years of expenses out of the market, so I'm mildly interested in what's going on.

This.  Paper losses.  Although now that we are all (mostly) paperless, I guess they are pixel losses.

[runningthroughFIRE]

I posted almost the exact same thing in my journal today. I was in college during the 2008 recession so whenever this one comes, it will be my first as a working professional. I cannot WAIT to shovel my paychecks into the market, even on the way down, and ride it all the way back up. Until then, about 32% of my take home pay gets invested already.

The problem is not all recessions are like the 08' recession, markets can (and have) gone sideways for 30 years in the past, so i'm a bit weary of possible recency bias, even though I kindof have the same thoughts since I've only experienced one recession aswell and had just started working.

Fair point, but if markets are going sideways and your alternative is holding cash, then you're no worse off than if you didn't invest at all. If you have access to tax-advantage vehicles like a 401k or an IRA, putting money in them during a sideways market is still strictly better than holding cash because of the reduction in taxes. It's really only prolonged losses that you need to be concerned with.  Unless, of course, you have other "non-market" investment options that might have better returns.

My reaction to the dip: bring it on.  I'm mildly concerned for older family and friends who might be exposed to sequence of returns risk and/or don't have time to recover, but otherwise I'm just wondering how much of a discount I'm going to get when it comes time to make my next buy.

[ChpBstrd]

I felt quite content last Monday when I sold a couple dozen VIX calls for a 50% profit.

Then I felt pretty good about my mid week decision to dial back the 401k from 100% stocks to about 60/40.

Then I felt a bit of gratitude for the long term perspective that allowed me to hold option hedges on most of the rest of my equities even though the market value of these hedges had been declining for months.

Meanwhile, I felt a twinge if regret for selling a couple of puts on CRM a couple weeks ago. That obviously ain’t working out so well. At least I’ll get rid of the shares by selling calls in a high volatility environment.

Yet I should have felt none of these things. I’m studying Roman Stoic philosophy so this is an interesting application for the emotional control and mental tranquility advocated by Seneca, Epictetus, and Marcus Aurelius. By holding both bullish and bearish positions, I’m in a position to find both fortune and misfortune in whatever happens, but to be an emotional yo-yo would be ridiculous. Maybe it’s just an attempt to “feel wise” but overall my solitude comes from using reason to place myself in a position where if stocks go down, I can look forward to pivoting bullish and if stocks go up I will participate in most of the ride. Either outcome ends in my retirement, and the journey there involves more of a focus on life and less of a focus on Marketwatch or Yahoo Finance doom articles.

[scottish]

Hum, are you writing calls and puts, or just selling ones you already own?

[Alchemisst]

I posted almost the exact same thing in my journal today. I was in college during the 2008 recession so whenever this one comes, it will be my first as a working professional. I cannot WAIT to shovel my paychecks into the market, even on the way down, and ride it all the way back up. Until then, about 32% of my take home pay gets invested already.

The problem is not all recessions are like the 08' recession, markets can (and have) gone sideways for 30 years in the past, so i'm a bit weary of possible recency bias, even though I kindof have the same thoughts since I've only experienced one recession aswell and had just started working.

Fair point, but if markets are going sideways and your alternative is holding cash, then you're no worse off than if you didn't invest at all. If you have access to tax-advantage vehicles like a 401k or an IRA, putting money in them during a sideways market is still strictly better than holding cash because of the reduction in taxes. It's really only prolonged losses that you need to be concerned with.  Unless, of course, you have other "non-market" investment options that might have better returns.

My reaction to the dip: bring it on.  I'm mildly concerned for older family and friends who might be exposed to sequence of returns risk and/or don't have time to recover, but otherwise I'm just wondering how much of a discount I'm going to get when it comes time to make my next buy.

Depends what kind of sideways, what I meant was 30 years of 0 returns can and has happened, a well as 30 years to get back above a previous peak

[EricEng]

Depends what kind of sideways, what I meant was 30 years of 0 returns can and has happened, a well as 30 years to get back above a previous peak

Not in the US market as far as I know.  Japan maybe?  What market and time period are you thinking of?

[GuitarStv]

I don't laugh at losing $45k.
It's going to happen along the bumpy road and I expect it, but nothing to laugh about.
I'm full invested so, a market drop is not a chance to get money in cheap.
 There are people that are really hurt by such a thing.

You only lost 45k if you sold.  Otherwise, you've lost nothing.

[runningthroughFIRE]

I posted almost the exact same thing in my journal today. I was in college during the 2008 recession so whenever this one comes, it will be my first as a working professional. I cannot WAIT to shovel my paychecks into the market, even on the way down, and ride it all the way back up. Until then, about 32% of my take home pay gets invested already.

The problem is not all recessions are like the 08' recession, markets can (and have) gone sideways for 30 years in the past, so i'm a bit weary of possible recency bias, even though I kindof have the same thoughts since I've only experienced one recession aswell and had just started working.

Fair point, but if markets are going sideways and your alternative is holding cash, then you're no worse off than if you didn't invest at all. If you have access to tax-advantage vehicles like a 401k or an IRA, putting money in them during a sideways market is still strictly better than holding cash because of the reduction in taxes. It's really only prolonged losses that you need to be concerned with.  Unless, of course, you have other "non-market" investment options that might have better returns.

My reaction to the dip: bring it on.  I'm mildly concerned for older family and friends who might be exposed to sequence of returns risk and/or don't have time to recover, but otherwise I'm just wondering how much of a discount I'm going to get when it comes time to make my next buy.

Depends what kind of sideways, what I meant was 30 years of 0 returns can and has happened, a well as 30 years to get back above a previous peak

It was the former scenario that I was responding to - market prices holding steady over time and neither increasing nor decreasing.  You should be making your decisions based on your opportunity cost. 

Let's say you decide to hold cash instead of investing it in a potentially sideways market.  Average APR for a savings account is 0.09% right now, or maybe you'd get closer to 2% if you go with an online high-interest account. If you had instead invested in the stock market you would get all of the dividends from those stocks, which is generally going to be as good or better than the interest on a bank account (VTSAX has a dividend yield of 1.86%, for example).  That means you're really no worse off by investing in the stock market, and you get the potential to be better off if the market goes up over time.

Another thing to keep in mind is that the Trinity Study that the 4% rule is based on includes those 30 year periods, at least if you're looking at US markets.

[Sultan58]

I don't laugh at losing $45k.
It's going to happen along the bumpy road and I expect it, but nothing to laugh about.
I'm full invested so, a market drop is not a chance to get money in cheap.
 There are people that are really hurt by such a thing.

You only lost 45k if you sold.  Otherwise, you've lost nothing.

I'm always mystified by these comments-- "you only lost if if you sold and locked in that loss" or "it's only paper losses".   Try going to your banker and explaining, "yes I know yesterday I had 50K and now my account shows its down 45K...but, really I haven't lost anything because it's just a paper loss."  See how that goes over.

By that logic, when your account goes up 45K because the market rises---then you can't really count that as an increase in your wealth or net worth because you haven't sold it and locked in that gain.

Losses are losses when the market closes....and gains are gains....you can't have it both ways. Pretending otherwise is silly.

I agree with the poster that losses in the market do hurt people, especially those close to retirement. It's not something to be taken lightly or laugh about. But with ten years of gains in the rearview since the last recession, its easy to think the market is predictable and infallible. It's asset speculation...but if you wanna call it investing....go head and do that too.

 

[Alchemisst]

The U.S as well as others, why only look at the U.S?
Depends what kind of sideways, what I meant was 30 years of 0 returns can and has happened, a well as 30 years to get back above a previous peak

Not in the US market as far as I know.  Japan maybe?  What market and time period are you thinking of?