Author Topic: Covid vaccine rollout in the US - who do you know that is getting the vaccine?  (Read 229084 times)

jrhampt

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Just found out that my friend and his wife and one kid all just tested positive. They are fully vaxed and have other kids too young for the vaccine. In a red state, back to school with no mask mandates two weeks ago. Case numbers are just going to explode soon, aren't they :-(

We went back to school here a week ago with a mask mandate and cases are still jumping up.  The first football game of the season was canceled yesterday because of an outbreak on the football team.  Football teams are big.  We're waiting for the outcome of the contact tracing on that one, along with guidance on whether masked/vaxxed people who had contact have to quarantine.  Oy vey.

My sister and a couple of her kids have covid right now after going back to school in a non mask wearing state.  One was too young for the vaccine; the other two were fully vaxxed.  All symptomatic.

Dollar Slice

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Just found out that my friend and his wife and one kid all just tested positive. They are fully vaxed and have other kids too young for the vaccine. In a red state, back to school with no mask mandates two weeks ago. Case numbers are just going to explode soon, aren't they :-(

We went back to school here a week ago with a mask mandate and cases are still jumping up.  The first football game of the season was canceled yesterday because of an outbreak on the football team.  Football teams are big.  We're waiting for the outcome of the contact tracing on that one, along with guidance on whether masked/vaxxed people who had contact have to quarantine.  Oy vey.

My sister and a couple of her kids have covid right now after going back to school in a non mask wearing state.  One was too young for the vaccine; the other two were fully vaxxed.  All symptomatic.

Just heard that my brother, his wife, and son all had it this past week (all vaxed). They rented a beach house with his wife's family for a week, and one of his aunts on that side tested positive a few days into the visit. They all left immediately but it was too late. They were all sick for 2-3 days but nothing too serious.

I'm thinking it's a good idea to avoid unmasked gatherings for a week or two in advance if you're going to get together for a week with the whole family including grandma... :-/

Dollar Slice

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Good for you! My mom is getting hers this weekend too. She was kind of waffling about it since she didn't love the side effects and thought she could put it off for a while, but then she found out she needs surgery and decided she felt better about going into the hospital with stronger immunity, and wanted to get the side effects over with before the long surgery recovery.

Update: my mom's appointment got canceled with no explanation. I found her a pharmacy two towns over that would give her a Moderna dose via walk-in without an appointment, so they went right over. Turned out they had Pfizer on hand as well as Moderna, so my dad made a last-second decision to get one as well (he is on daily prednisone for an autoimmune condition so also qualifies for the immunocompromised third dose). And my dad got his flu shot too. (Mom was too worried about side effects to get a two-fer, but Dad is one of those people who had zero side effects from any of his vaccines.)

And last night a friend of mine posted on Facebook that he was having side effects from his third shot, and mentioned in the comments that he didn't know he qualified until I posted the detailed list of qualifying conditions and medications. One more friend fully protected! :-)  A lot of people are on common medications that they don't realize qualifies them for a third shot.

MaybeBabyMustache

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Awesome, @Dollar Slice ! Got my booster today, and fingers crossed for minimal symptoms tomorrow. Hope your mom & dad both feel okay after their shots!

kanga1622

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Getting a booster of Pfizer this weekend, as part of the immunocompromised guidance published a week or so back

Good for you! My mom is getting hers this weekend too. She was kind of waffling about it since she didn't love the side effects and thought she could put it off for a while, but then she found out she needs surgery and decided she felt better about going into the hospital with stronger immunity, and wanted to get the side effects over with before the long surgery recovery.

My poor mom is just one of those people who gets all the side effects - the flu shot and shingles vax both put her in bed with a fever. I think she's the only person I've ever known who got that sick from a flu shot.

I had a moderate response last time, but nothing i'd risk getting really sick with COVID over. I don't have a good sense of how people feel after the third dose, vs the 1st or 2nd. The feedback seems really mixed.

That's great for your mom. It's no fun having a response like that.

My coworker got her 3rd Moderna dose a week ago. She had strong reactions to the first 2 and the 3rd had her dealing with side effects for 4 days. Lots of body aches/sharp pains down the side where she was injected, fevers, and headache. She’s on immune suppressing medication due to an autoimmune disorder so she generally feels pretty dang terrible after any vaccine.
« Last Edit: August 30, 2021, 04:57:10 AM by kanga1622 »

wenchsenior

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I'm starting to really want a booster Moderna shot, even if it results in a miserable few days.  Just got word that one of my best friends from college has been bedridden for 8 days, on the verge of needing hospital care, with a breakthrough infection likely via their preschool age daughter whose daycare was run by anti-vaxxers. He's 50ish, not overweight, no pre-existing health conditions, fully vaccinated.  His wife is trying to take care of him, homeschool their older daughter, and work a full time teaching job at a college that just announced all faculty are expected to start teaching in person next week.

That is scary. If this shit keeps up, retiring early and moving to an isolated cabin is starting to sound good.

MaybeBabyMustache

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Awesome, @Dollar Slice ! Got my booster today, and fingers crossed for minimal symptoms tomorrow. Hope your mom & dad both feel okay after their shots!

Checking in with how I'm feeling on the booster. (Mine was Pfizer). I'd say the third dose was better than the second, for sure. I had an overnight fever with the second dose, and felt generally a bit run down. As of today (booster on Sunday am) my arm is sore, and I'm a little weak (e.g. could only do a 20 minute workout yesterday), but feel back to about 90% of my normal energy level. I have an autoimmune disease, but am not taking any immune suppressing medicine.

StashingAway

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This might be a deeper dive on this than most would care for, but just in case, Rebel Wisdom has been knocking out of the park on covering the whole Ivermectin thing. Here is a recent podcast with Eric Osgood, a doctor and a former member of FLCCC (the pro-Ivermectin group) who is now critical of some of the claims being made by FLCCC. There is also much discussion on the potential breakdown of rational thought among those who gravitate towards alternative therapies & anti-vax stances. I've been following the Ivermectin story since February and it has been one of the most instructive controversies I've ever seen unfold. It's amazing how pernicious and sneaky bias, group-think, and tribalism can be--even among highly intelligent people.

Cool, gonna put this on the list to read. That last line has been fascinating to me as well. Totally caught me off guard with Brett Weinstein.

Dollar Slice

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@wenchsenior - so sorry to hear about your friend, I hope they're OK. I am really glad I got Moderna way back when, knowing what I know now about all the vaccines and about my own immune problems. At the time we didn't know much about them and I didn't know what vaccine I was getting until after I'd been injected. I did have pretty bad side effects but nothing that I wouldn't happily do again. YMMV since everyone has their own unique medical issues, though.

Checking in with how I'm feeling on the booster. (Mine was Pfizer). I'd say the third dose was better than the second, for sure. I had an overnight fever with the second dose, and felt generally a bit run down. As of today (booster on Sunday am) my arm is sore, and I'm a little weak (e.g. could only do a 20 minute workout yesterday), but feel back to about 90% of my normal energy level. I have an autoimmune disease, but am not taking any immune suppressing medicine.

Good to hear!

My mom (Moderna) had overall a not-too-severe reaction, maybe slightly less than dose 2 - her arm was not as sore, she had a little upset stomach and was tired enough to take an accidental couch nap. (Dose 2 was a very sore arm and upset stomach.) Dad (Pfizer) had absolutely no reaction to doses 1 and 2, for dose 3 he had slightly sore arms but said his flu shot arm was more sore than his COVID arm.

Sibley

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I got the J&J, so no booster orders yet. I'm keeping an eye out though.

I do have to laugh - the Illinois governor issued a vaccine mandate, and my workplace is indirectly covered. A good chunk of my office hadn't gotten vaccinated yet. One person called and made the appointment today, I'm sure others are as well. Pretty sure that the vaccination rate of my office is going to get pretty close to 100%.

Update: My firm has issued a vaccination mandate. I'm laughing, privately, because there are at least 4 people who do not want to get the vaccine. One of them is the owner. We'll see how this plays out. I'm keeping my head down.
« Last Edit: September 01, 2021, 07:37:48 PM by Sibley »

Prairie Gal

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Re: Covid vaccine rollout in the US - who do you know that is getting the vaccine?
« Reply #1810 on: September 02, 2021, 07:30:00 AM »
Glad some folks are starting to get boosters.

Interesting documentary on people on the Ozarks who aren't getting the vaccine at all, ever:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pd8P12BXebo

That was interesting. Thanks for posting it. We have a lot of people with the same ideas here, and a vaccination rate of only 59% over all, and some rural areas a lot less. Delta is having a field day.

Sibley

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Re: Covid vaccine rollout in the US - who do you know that is getting the vaccine?
« Reply #1811 on: September 03, 2021, 08:46:25 AM »
I got the J&J, so no booster orders yet. I'm keeping an eye out though.

I do have to laugh - the Illinois governor issued a vaccine mandate, and my workplace is indirectly covered. A good chunk of my office hadn't gotten vaccinated yet. One person called and made the appointment today, I'm sure others are as well. Pretty sure that the vaccination rate of my office is going to get pretty close to 100%.

Update: My firm has issued a vaccination mandate. I'm laughing, privately, because there are at least 4 people who do not want to get the vaccine. One of them is the owner. We'll see how this plays out. I'm keeping my head down.

Update: the antivax, antimask (but not rabidly antimask at least) owner is getting his shot today. I'm not asking which one though. I'm in the field with a coworker who I know doesn't want to get the vaccine, she hasn't said anything and I'm not asking.

Turns out, mandates work, at least for a lot of people.

JoJo

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Re: Covid vaccine rollout in the US - who do you know that is getting the vaccine?
« Reply #1812 on: September 03, 2021, 08:57:07 AM »
Anti-vaxxer family came by yesterday.  Here are some of the things they told us:

* The Webster dictionary changed it's definition for vaccine last year.  It turns out this is actually true:  https://languagelog.ldc.upenn.edu/nll/?p=50886

* The vaccine is not the mark of the beast, but it's a test run for the mark of the beast, because in that time if you don't have the mark of the beast you will be denied entry and not able to buy things.

* There was some survey to people that had the vaccine and supposedly no one got the shot because it was going to reduce their chances to get COVID or bad cases of it.  They only got it because they needed to for their jobs or they wanted to travel.  I don't know what their source was on this.

* Invermectin (that horse paste stuff) really works but it's big pharma that's trying to bury it so they can make money on the expensive new drugs and vaccines. 

* One of them is a nurse.  Their hospital did allow a religious opt out but they had to take some course on the vaccine safety and ethics.  They were mad because the they say getting the shot is against their ethics (to be fair, they really are against shots... their teenage homeschooled kids have had no vaccinations since birth). 

StashingAway

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Re: Covid vaccine rollout in the US - who do you know that is getting the vaccine?
« Reply #1813 on: September 03, 2021, 12:31:58 PM »
This might be a deeper dive on this than most would care for, but just in case, Rebel Wisdom has been knocking out of the park on covering the whole Ivermectin thing. Here is a recent podcast with Eric Osgood, a doctor and a former member of FLCCC (the pro-Ivermectin group) who is now critical of some of the claims being made by FLCCC. There is also much discussion on the potential breakdown of rational thought among those who gravitate towards alternative therapies & anti-vax stances. I've been following the Ivermectin story since February and it has been one of the most instructive controversies I've ever seen unfold. It's amazing how pernicious and sneaky bias, group-think, and tribalism can be--even among highly intelligent people.

Cool, gonna put this on the list to read. That last line has been fascinating to me as well. Totally caught me off guard with Brett Weinstein.

This was an excellent podcast series on Ivermectin. I'm putting them high on my list- perhaps listen to their vaccine series next. I love their approach.

lost_in_the_endless_aisle

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Re: Covid vaccine rollout in the US - who do you know that is getting the vaccine?
« Reply #1814 on: September 04, 2021, 06:34:18 PM »
This might be a deeper dive on this than most would care for, but just in case, Rebel Wisdom has been knocking out of the park on covering the whole Ivermectin thing. Here is a recent podcast with Eric Osgood, a doctor and a former member of FLCCC (the pro-Ivermectin group) who is now critical of some of the claims being made by FLCCC. There is also much discussion on the potential breakdown of rational thought among those who gravitate towards alternative therapies & anti-vax stances. I've been following the Ivermectin story since February and it has been one of the most instructive controversies I've ever seen unfold. It's amazing how pernicious and sneaky bias, group-think, and tribalism can be--even among highly intelligent people.

Cool, gonna put this on the list to read. That last line has been fascinating to me as well. Totally caught me off guard with Brett Weinstein.

This was an excellent podcast series on Ivermectin. I'm putting them high on my list- perhaps listen to their vaccine series next. I love their approach.
Yup, everything I've seen from Rebel Wisdom so far is top notch. Regarding Bret Weinstein, I was surprised he fell so deeply into the Ivermectin camp as he did, given how excellent his political analysis regarding Trump and other topical issues have been. However, it fits with his biases. For example I got into a tiff with him on the healthfulness of Pacific salmon and nuclear power in his Dark Horse livestream a while back, of all things. Like all of us, he has a systematic set of blind spots that can lead him astray. I've "done my own research" and a strong case for Ivermectin is not warranted at the moment. We shall see what the higher-powered RCTs on its efficacy bring to the debate over the next 6 months!

Loretta

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Re: Covid vaccine rollout in the US - who do you know that is getting the vaccine?
« Reply #1815 on: September 26, 2021, 01:10:39 PM »
I got my Pfizer #3 yesterday at my local pharmacy along with a flu shot.  My arm is much more sore this time.  I got a groovy 10% off coupon for my groceries to boot!  Yay for saving money and not dying prematurely!!! 

I’m mid 40s with a critical govt job and roughly 3 chronic gastro issues.. My employer will do boosters at some point in the future but I didn’t want to wait on them. 

flyingaway

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Re: Covid vaccine rollout in the US - who do you know that is getting the vaccine?
« Reply #1816 on: September 26, 2021, 07:19:54 PM »
So, it looks like the vaccines do not keep a person from the virus infection, does a prior infection give a person more protection?

If so, should we encourage the vaccinated people to get infected intentionally to get better protection?

MudPuppy

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Re: Covid vaccine rollout in the US - who do you know that is getting the vaccine?
« Reply #1817 on: September 26, 2021, 07:41:18 PM »
No.

1) the vaccines never promised to prevent infection.
2) the vaccines do seem to prevent infection in many, many case (how lucky for us!)
3) a vaccinated person with a breakthrough case is infectious for a shorter amount of time, which limits how much they could potentially spread it
5) natural infection does not guarantee any protection in the future
6) natural infection that DOES create protection does so in a fairly unpredictable way both in degree of protection and length of protection

Abe

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Re: Covid vaccine rollout in the US - who do you know that is getting the vaccine?
« Reply #1818 on: September 26, 2021, 07:49:24 PM »
So, it looks like the vaccines do not keep a person from the virus infection, does a prior infection give a person more protection?

If so, should we encourage the vaccinated people to get infected intentionally to get better protection?

Regarding statement 1: Vaccines reduce the risk of symptomatic infection and transmission within a population. Immunity appears to be slightly less effective vs vaccination, but data remains unclear. It is advised to get vaccinated after recovering from an infection for this reason. Infected people who subsequently get vaccinated have higher titers on average, suggesting a benefit.

Statement 2: no because this can encourage transmission to others who cannot be vaccinated, and serves no obvious purpose. There is also the potential risk of promoting vaccine-resistant strains.

SwordGuy

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Re: Covid vaccine rollout in the US - who do you know that is getting the vaccine?
« Reply #1819 on: September 26, 2021, 11:18:53 PM »

I'm not sure who's getting the vaccine but I'm keeping close track of who didn't.

I post on FB about people who chose not to get the vaccine and are now dead or dying.   I point out they leave their children, parents, spouses and siblings behind -- except when those folks are dead too, which isn't all that uncommon.   Local family of 3 all died in my area.   Sheer foolishness.   Maybe someone who reads it and isn't vaccinated will catch on, though a lot of them can't seem to.

I feel sorry for the poor, deluded folks who've been intentionally misinformed into not getting vaccinated for political or financial gain.

When one of the unvaccinated opinion leaders dies, the ones who actively spread the misinformation, I add "Good riddance to bad rubbish" to my post.   It's good that they're dead so their lies won't kill more innocent people.   It would have been nicer if they had reformed and used their influence for good but, hey, they didn't so I'll be satisfied with second best.

Recently a "preacher" and conservative radio host died from covid.  Unvaccinated of course and spread all kinds of lies about covid and vaccines before he died.   This human turd used to read out the names of the dead from the AIDS epidemic and play Queen's "Another One Bites the Dust" in the background by way of celebration.   I posted "Good Riddance to Bad Rubbish" to that human turd, too.

I also played Another One Bites the Dust for a couple of days, by way of celebrating.    Think I'll play it again in remembrance.

If I knew where he was buried and it was close enough, I think I might replace his tombstone with "Another Bigot Bites the Dust" carved on it.  Remove any BS about loving father and husband and such and replace it with "human turd".  Should probably add a carved border around it made out of turd shapes and place turd-colored and shaped concrete turds on his grave in addition to that.

Maybe I should make a jewelry-sized art piece based on that and enter it in a competition.  Donate it to an appropriate museum.   Add a hand-crank that causes the music to play from speakers under the "grave" in the jewelry piece.  Might be therapeutic to the right folks.

Hell, if I could sculpt and cast large scale works in metal, I would design a pissoir in that preacher's likeness for said museum's men's room.

Just in case anyone didn't catch on, I despise and hate people like that "preacher" and conservative radio host.    They are an infestation of pure evil in the body politic and they should never, ever be glorified or shown any respect before or after their death.   They should be heartily despised and no decent person should be in any doubt about how they should be remembered.

Your opinions may vary.





alsoknownasDean

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Re: Covid vaccine rollout in the US - who do you know that is getting the vaccine?
« Reply #1820 on: September 27, 2021, 02:30:07 AM »
Just in case anyone didn't catch on, I despise and hate people like that "preacher" and conservative radio host.    They are an infestation of pure evil in the body politic and they should never, ever be glorified or shown any respect before or after their death.   They should be heartily despised and no decent person should be in any doubt about how they should be remembered.

Perhaps their misinformation has caused hurt to a great deal of people (including themselves), but honestly I find it unhealthy to hold that much hatred for a person.

The real question is why such people gain a following. What psychological needs are met by identifying oneself as an 'anti-vaxxer' or whatever? Facts don't work on people who make up their own facts.

My second (Pfizer) dose is about a week from now, the appointment was originally for AstraZeneca but eligibility was expanded on the day of my appointment. My immediate family have all had at least one dose and most are fully vaccinated.

MasterStache

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Re: Covid vaccine rollout in the US - who do you know that is getting the vaccine?
« Reply #1821 on: September 27, 2021, 06:11:42 AM »
Just in case anyone didn't catch on, I despise and hate people like that "preacher" and conservative radio host.    They are an infestation of pure evil in the body politic and they should never, ever be glorified or shown any respect before or after their death.   They should be heartily despised and no decent person should be in any doubt about how they should be remembered.

Perhaps their misinformation has caused hurt to a great deal of people (including themselves), but honestly I find it unhealthy to hold that much hatred for a person.

The real question is why such people gain a following. What psychological needs are met by identifying oneself as an 'anti-vaxxer' or whatever? Facts don't work on people who make up their own facts.

My second (Pfizer) dose is about a week from now, the appointment was originally for AstraZeneca but eligibility was expanded on the day of my appointment. My immediate family have all had at least one dose and most are fully vaccinated.
+1.
Remember circle of control. I have to remind myself sometimes. We can't control what others do, only how we respond to it.
I would guess the majority of folks that follow do so because of confirmation bias. 

Funny somewhat related story. My wife and I are vaccinated and are counting down the days until our daughter can get vaccinated (she'll be 12 in a couple months). Our son is vaccinated as well. My brother-in-law (big Trump supporter) stopped by the other day. He, unsurprisingly, is not vaccinated. My wife (his very own sister) asked him why has hasn't gotten the shot and he stated something along the lines of not knowing what's in it. She promptly asked him if he knew what all chemicals were in the soda and dip he shoves in his mouth daily. He kind of laughed and said "no I don't." Touché!

MudPuppy

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Re: Covid vaccine rollout in the US - who do you know that is getting the vaccine?
« Reply #1822 on: September 27, 2021, 06:13:16 AM »
I think there’s been some investigation at this point and the “alternative facts” crown generally is seeking the comfort of a knowledge mastery/advantage. In general it is noted that they can’t/won’t/don’t achieve this in more traditional learning ways and they received validation from “knowing” something special, something that other people aren’t as in on.


Or in cases like radio talking heads actively producing harmful and hateful content, they’re douchebags.

flyingaway

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Re: Covid vaccine rollout in the US - who do you know that is getting the vaccine?
« Reply #1823 on: September 27, 2021, 07:19:09 AM »
No.

1) the vaccines never promised to prevent infection.
2) the vaccines do seem to prevent infection in many, many case (how lucky for us!)
3) a vaccinated person with a breakthrough case is infectious for a shorter amount of time, which limits how much they could potentially spread it
5) natural infection does not guarantee any protection in the future
6) natural infection that DOES create protection does so in a fairly unpredictable way both in degree of protection and length of protection

If natural infection does not provide protection or better protection (than vaccines), it appears that there will be no end to this pandemic. Only a small fraction of the world population can get vaccinated, and this vaccination thing appears to be an annual event (booster shot). I see a bleak future for the human beings.

MudPuppy

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Re: Covid vaccine rollout in the US - who do you know that is getting the vaccine?
« Reply #1824 on: September 27, 2021, 07:47:24 AM »
If people who have access to vaccines would stop being fuckfaces about taking them, it would be a hell of a lot rosier.

Sibley

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Re: Covid vaccine rollout in the US - who do you know that is getting the vaccine?
« Reply #1825 on: September 27, 2021, 07:53:31 AM »
No.

1) the vaccines never promised to prevent infection.
2) the vaccines do seem to prevent infection in many, many case (how lucky for us!)
3) a vaccinated person with a breakthrough case is infectious for a shorter amount of time, which limits how much they could potentially spread it
5) natural infection does not guarantee any protection in the future
6) natural infection that DOES create protection does so in a fairly unpredictable way both in degree of protection and length of protection

If natural infection does not provide protection or better protection (than vaccines), it appears that there will be no end to this pandemic. Only a small fraction of the world population can get vaccinated, and this vaccination thing appears to be an annual event (booster shot). I see a bleak future for the human beings.

https://ourworldindata.org/covid-vaccinations

44.5% of the world isn't a small fraction. That's nearly half. Yes, that means that slightly more than half of the world's population hasn't been vaccinated, but the vaccines have been out for less than a year. It's always going to take longer to get to the poor countries, the refugees, etc. Progress is being made and will continue to be made.

And may I remind you of history, where upwards of 1/3 of Europe was killed by the Black Death? But then it petered out and was limited to small outbreaks. I think you need to step away from whatever you're watching/reading that is causing despair. Frankly, we're fucked because of climate change, not covid.

Dollar Slice

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Re: Covid vaccine rollout in the US - who do you know that is getting the vaccine?
« Reply #1826 on: September 27, 2021, 08:05:04 AM »
Only a small fraction of the world population can get vaccinated, and this vaccination thing appears to be an annual event (booster shot).

The 'annual event' part is not a 100% sure thing... some vaccines just need a longer spacing-out of doses to work right. Shingles, Hepatitis, HPV, etc. doses all need to be months apart. A multi-dose vaccine spaced only three/four weeks apart is pretty unusual - but they were in a rush to test things out and didn't want to try a six month dosing schedule as the default for obvious reasons. Would have increased each phase of the drug trials by that much.

Of course it may be like the flu vaccine and just not last that long. Too soon to know for sure...

GuitarStv

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Re: Covid vaccine rollout in the US - who do you know that is getting the vaccine?
« Reply #1827 on: September 27, 2021, 08:11:13 AM »
Frankly, we're fucked because of climate change, not covid.

Agreed.  Covid is a very minor bump in the road in comparison.

wenchsenior

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Re: Covid vaccine rollout in the US - who do you know that is getting the vaccine?
« Reply #1828 on: September 27, 2021, 09:35:37 AM »
Frankly, we're fucked because of climate change, not covid.

Agreed.  Covid is a very minor bump in the road in comparison.

Totally agree. 

flyingaway

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Re: Covid vaccine rollout in the US - who do you know that is getting the vaccine?
« Reply #1829 on: September 27, 2021, 12:22:28 PM »
No.

1) the vaccines never promised to prevent infection.
2) the vaccines do seem to prevent infection in many, many case (how lucky for us!)
3) a vaccinated person with a breakthrough case is infectious for a shorter amount of time, which limits how much they could potentially spread it
5) natural infection does not guarantee any protection in the future
6) natural infection that DOES create protection does so in a fairly unpredictable way both in degree of protection and length of protection

If natural infection does not provide protection or better protection (than vaccines), it appears that there will be no end to this pandemic. Only a small fraction of the world population can get vaccinated, and this vaccination thing appears to be an annual event (booster shot). I see a bleak future for the human beings.

https://ourworldindata.org/covid-vaccinations

44.5% of the world isn't a small fraction. That's nearly half. Yes, that means that slightly more than half of the world's population hasn't been vaccinated, but the vaccines have been out for less than a year. It's always going to take longer to get to the poor countries, the refugees, etc. Progress is being made and will continue to be made.

And may I remind you of history, where upwards of 1/3 of Europe was killed by the Black Death? But then it petered out and was limited to small outbreaks. I think you need to step away from whatever you're watching/reading that is causing despair. Frankly, we're fucked because of climate change, not covid.

If you are killed by the virus, you don't need to worry about the climate change.

SunnyDays

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Re: Covid vaccine rollout in the US - who do you know that is getting the vaccine?
« Reply #1830 on: September 27, 2021, 02:00:56 PM »
No.

1) the vaccines never promised to prevent infection.
2) the vaccines do seem to prevent infection in many, many case (how lucky for us!)
3) a vaccinated person with a breakthrough case is infectious for a shorter amount of time, which limits how much they could potentially spread it
5) natural infection does not guarantee any protection in the future
6) natural infection that DOES create protection does so in a fairly unpredictable way both in degree of protection and length of protection

If natural infection does not provide protection or better protection (than vaccines), it appears that there will be no end to this pandemic. Only a small fraction of the world population can get vaccinated, and this vaccination thing appears to be an annual event (booster shot). I see a bleak future for the human beings.

https://ourworldindata.org/covid-vaccinations

44.5% of the world isn't a small fraction. That's nearly half. Yes, that means that slightly more than half of the world's population hasn't been vaccinated, but the vaccines have been out for less than a year. It's always going to take longer to get to the poor countries, the refugees, etc. Progress is being made and will continue to be made.

And may I remind you of history, where upwards of 1/3 of Europe was killed by the Black Death? But then it petered out and was limited to small outbreaks. I think you need to step away from whatever you're watching/reading that is causing despair. Frankly, we're fucked because of climate change, not covid.

If you are killed by the virus, you don't need to worry about the climate change.

Or if enough people die of Covid, climate change will be less of a factor.

MudPuppy

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Re: Covid vaccine rollout in the US - who do you know that is getting the vaccine?
« Reply #1831 on: September 27, 2021, 02:21:37 PM »
If only individuals were primarily response for emissions, and not corporations.

habanero

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Re: Covid vaccine rollout in the US - who do you know that is getting the vaccine?
« Reply #1832 on: September 27, 2021, 03:05:30 PM »
If only individuals were primarily response for emissions, and not corporations.
In the US transportation is 29% of emissions. Electricity generation 25%, industry 23%, commercial/residental 13% and agriculture 10%. So individuals make up a fairly big chunk via transportation and consumption of the other sectors' outputs. Of the transportation part light-duty vehicles are responsible for 58% of the total. Residental consumes 38% of electricity produced.

Prairie Gal

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Re: Covid vaccine rollout in the US - who do you know that is getting the vaccine?
« Reply #1833 on: September 27, 2021, 07:03:29 PM »
So, it looks like the vaccines do not keep a person from the virus infection, does a prior infection give a person more protection?

If so, should we encourage the vaccinated people to get infected intentionally to get better protection?

Didn't turn out so well for these people.

 https://edmonton.citynews.ca/2021/09/23/alberta-covid-party-hospital/


GuitarStv

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Re: Covid vaccine rollout in the US - who do you know that is getting the vaccine?
« Reply #1834 on: September 27, 2021, 07:19:31 PM »
If only individuals were primarily response for emissions, and not corporations.
In the US transportation is 29% of emissions. Electricity generation 25%, industry 23%, commercial/residental 13% and agriculture 10%. So individuals make up a fairly big chunk via transportation and consumption of the other sectors' outputs. Of the transportation part light-duty vehicles are responsible for 58% of the total. Residental consumes 38% of electricity produced.

100 companies are responsible for 70% of greenhouse gas emissions . . .

https://harvardpolitics.com/climate-change-responsibility/
https://www.theguardian.com/sustainable-business/2017/jul/10/100-fossil-fuel-companies-investors-responsible-71-global-emissions-cdp-study-climate-change


I'm not saying that people should stop trying to reduce their consumption, but it doesn't seem remotely likely that this will be enough.

seattlecyclone

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Re: Covid vaccine rollout in the US - who do you know that is getting the vaccine?
« Reply #1835 on: September 27, 2021, 07:59:38 PM »
If only individuals were primarily response for emissions, and not corporations.
In the US transportation is 29% of emissions. Electricity generation 25%, industry 23%, commercial/residental 13% and agriculture 10%. So individuals make up a fairly big chunk via transportation and consumption of the other sectors' outputs. Of the transportation part light-duty vehicles are responsible for 58% of the total. Residental consumes 38% of electricity produced.

100 companies are responsible for 70% of greenhouse gas emissions . . .

https://harvardpolitics.com/climate-change-responsibility/
https://www.theguardian.com/sustainable-business/2017/jul/10/100-fossil-fuel-companies-investors-responsible-71-global-emissions-cdp-study-climate-change

How are emissions assigned in these lists? I see oil companies are well-represented there. If ExxonMobil digs oil out of the ground, ships it to me, and I burn it in my car, do those emissions go on my tally or on ExxonMobil's tally? And even if the fuel burned in my car doesn't go on ExxonMobil's tally, and they're only charged for the carbon they emit in the process of getting the gasoline to me, wouldn't it be fair to say I'm responsible for a share of those emissions as well? While I agree with you that individual action can make just the tiniest drop in the bucket, I also think it's kind of passing the buck to say "it's not my fault, blame ExxonMobil" when the only reason they dig oil out of the ground in the first place is because people like you and me find the stuff so darn useful that we're willing to pay them a tidy sum to do that.

MudPuppy

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Re: Covid vaccine rollout in the US - who do you know that is getting the vaccine?
« Reply #1836 on: September 27, 2021, 08:07:39 PM »
No one passed any buck

Arbitrage

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Re: Covid vaccine rollout in the US - who do you know that is getting the vaccine?
« Reply #1837 on: September 28, 2021, 10:14:38 AM »
If only individuals were primarily response for emissions, and not corporations.
In the US transportation is 29% of emissions. Electricity generation 25%, industry 23%, commercial/residental 13% and agriculture 10%. So individuals make up a fairly big chunk via transportation and consumption of the other sectors' outputs. Of the transportation part light-duty vehicles are responsible for 58% of the total. Residental consumes 38% of electricity produced.

100 companies are responsible for 70% of greenhouse gas emissions . . .

https://harvardpolitics.com/climate-change-responsibility/
https://www.theguardian.com/sustainable-business/2017/jul/10/100-fossil-fuel-companies-investors-responsible-71-global-emissions-cdp-study-climate-change

How are emissions assigned in these lists? I see oil companies are well-represented there. If ExxonMobil digs oil out of the ground, ships it to me, and I burn it in my car, do those emissions go on my tally or on ExxonMobil's tally? And even if the fuel burned in my car doesn't go on ExxonMobil's tally, and they're only charged for the carbon they emit in the process of getting the gasoline to me, wouldn't it be fair to say I'm responsible for a share of those emissions as well? While I agree with you that individual action can make just the tiniest drop in the bucket, I also think it's kind of passing the buck to say "it's not my fault, blame ExxonMobil" when the only reason they dig oil out of the ground in the first place is because people like you and me find the stuff so darn useful that we're willing to pay them a tidy sum to do that.

Agreed, and why feel like this stat is bogus.  People try to absolve themselves of nearly all responsibility by assigning blame to corporations.  Calling Ford, Chevron, Alcoa etc. responsible for the F-350 you demanded, bought, and used is not terribly useful.

dandarc

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Re: Covid vaccine rollout in the US - who do you know that is getting the vaccine?
« Reply #1838 on: September 28, 2021, 10:29:12 AM »
And focusing on individual responsibility too much absolves corporate responsibility. Huge marketing and lobbying budgets influence to a significant degree how individuals act.

We can say that companies are just providing what people want, but they are also going to great lengths to tell us what to want and working hard against regulations that might make the products offered better at the possible expense of some of their profits in the short term.

geekette

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Re: Covid vaccine rollout in the US - who do you know that is getting the vaccine?
« Reply #1839 on: September 28, 2021, 10:49:50 AM »
Since so many Americans are too concerned with their freedumb to get a simple, safe shot, I'm increasingly concerned about getting sick due to their fear of vanishingly small side effects (and lack of fear of death?)

I got the J&J in March, and keep reading that doctors are recommending that someone like me should get a booster.  However, I can't seem to get anyone with a vaccine to give me one.  I don't care if it's another J&J, or either mRNA.  I don't care if it's a call at the end of the day for one that will be tossed.  "We aren't allowed" they say, with a sad shake of the head.

So frustrated.

jrhampt

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Re: Covid vaccine rollout in the US - who do you know that is getting the vaccine?
« Reply #1840 on: September 28, 2021, 11:15:03 AM »
Since so many Americans are too concerned with their freedumb to get a simple, safe shot, I'm increasingly concerned about getting sick due to their fear of vanishingly small side effects (and lack of fear of death?)

I got the J&J in March, and keep reading that doctors are recommending that someone like me should get a booster.  However, I can't seem to get anyone with a vaccine to give me one.  I don't care if it's another J&J, or either mRNA.  I don't care if it's a call at the end of the day for one that will be tossed.  "We aren't allowed" they say, with a sad shake of the head.

So frustrated.

Have you checked with your PCP to see if they can do it directly instead of having to go through a pharmacy?

geekette

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Re: Covid vaccine rollout in the US - who do you know that is getting the vaccine?
« Reply #1841 on: September 28, 2021, 11:21:44 AM »
Since so many Americans are too concerned with their freedumb to get a simple, safe shot, I'm increasingly concerned about getting sick due to their fear of vanishingly small side effects (and lack of fear of death?)

I got the J&J in March, and keep reading that doctors are recommending that someone like me should get a booster.  However, I can't seem to get anyone with a vaccine to give me one.  I don't care if it's another J&J, or either mRNA.  I don't care if it's a call at the end of the day for one that will be tossed.  "We aren't allowed" they say, with a sad shake of the head.

So frustrated.

Have you checked with your PCP to see if they can do it directly instead of having to go through a pharmacy?

I asked two weeks ago during my physical, and the doctor said they would be getting vaccines once the recommendations came in.  He said he thought the J&J should have been a two shot series to begin with, but he wasn't in charge.

I sent an email through the practice's app.  Fingers crossed.

MudPuppy

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Re: Covid vaccine rollout in the US - who do you know that is getting the vaccine?
« Reply #1842 on: September 28, 2021, 11:28:27 AM »
Neither J&J nor Moderna are approved for boosters at this time. A booster needs to be the same shot you were initially vaccinated with.

geekette

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Re: Covid vaccine rollout in the US - who do you know that is getting the vaccine?
« Reply #1843 on: September 28, 2021, 11:31:14 AM »
Per an NPR article:

Quote
So, Gandhi says, if you got the Johnson & Johnson vaccine and want a booster, she suggests you go see a doctor to discuss the possibilities.

"They will likely recommend, even while we're waiting, a booster shot with either an mRNA vaccine or, if available, they could get a second Johnson & Johnson," she says.

Talking to your doctor about getting a second shot could be especially important if you're in a high-risk group, says Paul Sax, an infectious disease specialist at the Harvard Medicine School.

"My take on it is that people who are vulnerable to severe COVID in particular should think very strongly about getting an mRNA booster if they had a J&J vaccine initially," he says, though it's not yet recommended by official government guidance.

MudPuppy

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Re: Covid vaccine rollout in the US - who do you know that is getting the vaccine?
« Reply #1844 on: September 28, 2021, 11:34:48 AM »
The FDA has not authorized this at the present time, though.

geekette

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Re: Covid vaccine rollout in the US - who do you know that is getting the vaccine?
« Reply #1845 on: September 28, 2021, 11:37:49 AM »
At this point, I don't care.  Somehow, others are getting boosters.  I would like to feel a bit safer around the chin maskers (and worse).

MudPuppy

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Re: Covid vaccine rollout in the US - who do you know that is getting the vaccine?
« Reply #1846 on: September 28, 2021, 11:52:00 AM »
I hear you, it’s stressful. I’m a HCW with a serious health condition, in a red state no less. I’m just taking as many precautions as I can and waiting for Moderna’s data to be be reviewed and approved.
« Last Edit: September 28, 2021, 11:56:27 AM by MudPuppy »

Dollar Slice

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Re: Covid vaccine rollout in the US - who do you know that is getting the vaccine?
« Reply #1847 on: September 28, 2021, 11:52:40 AM »
At this point, I don't care.  Somehow, others are getting boosters.  I would like to feel a bit safer around the chin maskers (and worse).

If I had gotten J&J and was, say, medically vulnerable and had to work with the public and just desperately wanted to get a booster... I think a person could cross a state line and walk into any pharmacy and tell them you wanted to get your first dose. They don't track it federally, just by state, so they wouldn't know you already had a dose of J&J.

Just realize that it might complicate any future ability to prove you're fully vaccinated if that ends up requiring a booster.

jeroly

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Re: Covid vaccine rollout in the US - who do you know that is getting the vaccine?
« Reply #1848 on: September 28, 2021, 11:58:27 AM »
At this point, I don't care.  Somehow, others are getting boosters.  I would like to feel a bit safer around the chin maskers (and worse).

If I had gotten J&J and was, say, medically vulnerable and had to work with the public and just desperately wanted to get a booster... I think a person could cross a state line and walk into any pharmacy and tell them you wanted to get your first dose. They don't track it federally, just by state, so they wouldn't know you already had a dose of J&J.

Just realize that it might complicate any future ability to prove you're fully vaccinated if that ends up requiring a booster.
This should work, but if I were in this situation I would wait it out for about five weeks, at which point I'd expect J&J booster authorization and you could just go through the normal channels.

GuitarStv

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Re: Covid vaccine rollout in the US - who do you know that is getting the vaccine?
« Reply #1849 on: September 28, 2021, 12:38:02 PM »
If only individuals were primarily response for emissions, and not corporations.
In the US transportation is 29% of emissions. Electricity generation 25%, industry 23%, commercial/residental 13% and agriculture 10%. So individuals make up a fairly big chunk via transportation and consumption of the other sectors' outputs. Of the transportation part light-duty vehicles are responsible for 58% of the total. Residental consumes 38% of electricity produced.

100 companies are responsible for 70% of greenhouse gas emissions . . .

https://harvardpolitics.com/climate-change-responsibility/
https://www.theguardian.com/sustainable-business/2017/jul/10/100-fossil-fuel-companies-investors-responsible-71-global-emissions-cdp-study-climate-change

How are emissions assigned in these lists? I see oil companies are well-represented there. If ExxonMobil digs oil out of the ground, ships it to me, and I burn it in my car, do those emissions go on my tally or on ExxonMobil's tally? And even if the fuel burned in my car doesn't go on ExxonMobil's tally, and they're only charged for the carbon they emit in the process of getting the gasoline to me, wouldn't it be fair to say I'm responsible for a share of those emissions as well? While I agree with you that individual action can make just the tiniest drop in the bucket, I also think it's kind of passing the buck to say "it's not my fault, blame ExxonMobil" when the only reason they dig oil out of the ground in the first place is because people like you and me find the stuff so darn useful that we're willing to pay them a tidy sum to do that.

The part of my post that you cut off addressed this:
I'm not saying that people should stop trying to reduce their consumption, but it doesn't seem remotely likely that this will be enough.

There's no magic pill that gets us out of this without accepting responsibility.  Individual people certainly need to reduce their consumption - on that we seem to agree.  In fact, that's pretty commonly agreed upon.

The problem is that in the past twenty years or so I haven't really seen much effort to hold accountable the companies that have profited so significantly from these greenhouse gas emissions.  These companies have spent (and continue to spend) huge amounts of money to spread lies about climate change, to lobby against regulations (like those that increase fuel efficiency in vehicles for example), and then there's the huge advertising spend every year to push their environmentally damaging products.  If we don't make profitable companies pay for the environmental damage that they are responsible for, then history has shown us that there is little to no incentive for them to stop causing that damage.

The fight against climate change will be a difficult one.  It's best not to tie one hand behind our backs before we start.