Coronavirus - How can people be so incredibly stupid?

[Miss Piggy]

Like most areas, coronavirus stories in the midwest are evolving. The latest involves a college student who was studying abroad this semester in Italy. She came back to the US earlier this week, after spending weeks in the thick of the virus in Italy. She is now the first confirmed case in the state of Missouri.

Here's what's been shared so far:
- Symptoms started on Wednesday; she and her parents continue going about their daily lives.
- Symptoms got worse on Friday; she went to an ER and tested positive for Coronavirus. Sent home to be quarantined, along with mom and dad. Honor system, no supervision of the quarantine. Because that has worked SO well in other cases.
- Now we're finding out that not only was she not smart enough to quarantine herself upon arriving in the US (again, after spending weeks surrounded by this virus), but she took an Amtrak train from Chicago to St. Louis, exposing everyone in her train car.

HOW FUCKING STUPID/SELF-ABSORBED/NAIVE/IRRESPONSIBLE CAN SOMEONE BE???????

And really, how did authorities not force a quarantine for all of these students who are returning home from Italy because of the virus? How is that any different from getting off of a heavily-infected cruise ship? WTF?

Stories like this are examples of why this virus is going to spread completely uncontrolled in the US. Yeah, I'm sure some of you are reading this and thinking, "It's gonna spread no matter what..."  You're right--because of people like this.

[Bloop Bloop]

People smoke while pregnant, drink while pregnant, drink and drive, gamble away their life savings, etc.

On the scale of human fallibility I wouldn't call this case even close to the worst case example.

Especially given the death rate for those under 40 is 0.2% and the virus is quite mild in most cases.

Not defending the actions, but just saying that in context, I see a lot more brazen stupidity every single day.

[American GenX]

Like most areas, coronavirus stories in the midwest are evolving. The latest involves a college student who was studying abroad this semester in Italy. She came back to the US earlier this week, after spending weeks in the thick of the virus in Italy. She is now the first confirmed case in the state of Missouri.

Here's what's been shared so far:
- Symptoms started on Wednesday; she and her parents continue going about their daily lives.
- Symptoms got worse on Friday; she went to an ER and tested positive for Coronavirus. Sent home to be quarantined, along with mom and dad. Honor system, no supervision of the quarantine. Because that has worked SO well in other cases.
- Now we're finding out that not only was she not smart enough to quarantine herself upon arriving in the US (again, after spending weeks surrounded by this virus), but she took an Amtrak train from Chicago to St. Louis, exposing everyone in her train car.

HOW FUCKING STUPID/SELF-ABSORBED/NAIVE/IRRESPONSIBLE CAN SOMEONE BE???????

And really, how did authorities not force a quarantine for all of these students who are returning home from Italy because of the virus? How is that any different from getting off of a heavily-infected cruise ship? WTF?

Stories like this are examples of why this virus is going to spread completely uncontrolled in the US. Yeah, I'm sure some of you are reading this and thinking, "It's gonna spread no matter what..."  Your right--because of people like this.

Wow.  I hadn't heard about that, but that's pretty bad.  And then you have those contaminated surfaces, so other passengers boarding later were infected also.

I agree with you 100%.   Very frustrating that so many people are so irresponsible.  I think those arrivals from Italy definitely should have been quarantined.

[Sibley]

Realistically, this virus is going to become endemic. Because yes, people are stupid. And the virus is exactly the type of thing that is hard to contain - mild/no symptoms in many people. In a few years, we'll have a vaccine and it'll be like the flu vaccine where everyone is encouraged to get it and many people don't bother. In the meantime, there's a good chance that the people who are most vulnerable (elderly, sick, etc) are going to be hit hard.

We can also talk about the stupidity of all the people who are buying out Costco toilet paper and everything else. My sister went to the grocery store today in the DC area. She said that she's never seen a store that well stocked. When the panic dies down, there are going to be a lot of people looking at a 5 year supply of toilet paper or whatever, wondering what the heck they were thinking. Hopefully a lot of that excess will be donated to food pantries and similar where it can do some good.

[MyAlterEgoIsTaller]

One of the first two people to be diagnosed in New Hampshire was tested last Friday, told to self-quarantine while waiting for test results, disregarded that and went to an event in Vermont with 200 people at it Friday night, and the test result came back positive Saturday.  The event venue closed voluntarily for several days and canceled other events, and several people who he came in contact with were told by the states' health departments to self-quarantine.  The kicker: the guy who did this is a hospital resident in epidemiology.

[Missy B]

Realistically, this virus is going to become endemic. Because yes, people are stupid. And the virus is exactly the type of thing that is hard to contain - mild/no symptoms in many people. In a few years, we'll have a vaccine and it'll be like the flu vaccine where everyone is encouraged to get it and many people don't bother. In the meantime, there's a good chance that the people who are most vulnerable (elderly, sick, etc) are going to be hit hard.

We can also talk about the stupidity of all the people who are buying out Costco toilet paper and everything else. My sister went to the grocery store today in the DC area. She said that she's never seen a store that well stocked. When the panic dies down, there are going to be a lot of people looking at a 5 year supply of toilet paper or whatever, wondering what the heck they were thinking. Hopefully a lot of that excess will be donated to food pantries and similar where it can do some good.

Yup. My bf told me today that he saw something on Reddit (so who knows if its true) that one of the first people dx'd with covid in Washington state stayed at home but his wife was out toodling around like usual. And that they were given no instruction to both quarantine themselves.

Meanwhile, people who actually need masks because they are sick can't get them because of hoarders, and those of us who who aren't worried about supply chain issues are also having to rush out and buy toilet paper and lysol wipes just so that we have them when we run out.

We have people simultaneously acting like COVID is nothing, and acting like its bubonic plague. Because of the slow action and refusal to enforce quarantine, stop flights etc it will be endemic.
Singapore has 6 months jail time for people who get infected and don't self report.

[BigMoneyJim]

- Symptoms got worse on Friday; she went to an ER and tested positive for Coronavirus.

Ok, that's the most encouraging thing about Coronavirus I've seen so far. Seriously. We haven't been testing enough, and hopefully that's changing.

As far as people being stupid...I should know better by now. It shouldn't surprise me any more. But it does. Just not quite as much as it used to.

[Missy B]

One of the first two people to be diagnosed in New Hampshire was tested last Friday, told to self-quarantine while waiting for test results, disregarded that and went to an event in Vermont with 200 people at it Friday night, and the test result came back positive Saturday.  The event venue closed voluntarily for several days and canceled other events, and several people who he came in contact with were told by the states' health departments to self-quarantine.  The kicker: the guy who did this is a hospital resident in epidemiology.

Sometimes I think we should bring back the stocks...

[Omy]

A lot of people are taking their cue from 45 and aren't taking this seriously. They are convinced that libs are blowing this out of proportion for political reasons.

[OtherJen]

A lot of people are taking their cue from 45 and aren't taking this seriously. They are convinced that libs are blowing this out of proportion for political reasons.

Not just from him. Bernie Sanders held a big campaign rally in my hometown yesterday and has another one scheduled tomorrow. As far as I know, Joe Biden hasn't cancelled any rallies either. Of course the average person on either side of the left-right spectrum isn't going to think it's a big deal when election politics is business as usual.

[Freedom2016]

One of the first two people to be diagnosed in New Hampshire was tested last Friday, told to self-quarantine while waiting for test results, disregarded that and went to an event in Vermont with 200 people at it Friday night, and the test result came back positive Saturday.  The event venue closed voluntarily for several days and canceled other events, and several people who he came in contact with were told by the states' health departments to self-quarantine.  The kicker: the guy who did this is a hospital resident in epidemiology.

Source of the bolded? I can't find any articles that say more than he was a hospital worker at Hitchcock.

Tuck cancelled all in-person classes from Wednesday onward. My source: an adjunct faculty member there.

[hops]

The stupidity doesn't end there, as it's being reported this evening that the father and sister of the girl OP refers to broke their self-quarantine.

[Monerexia]

Also a problem with incentives--if someone thinks they might have it they have nothing personally to gain--unless they are seriously personally ill--and a very likely very expensive quarantine paid for by them to lose if they come forward. Few people will be altruistic in such a situation; look at the rush for the gates in Italy. If humans could be counted on to be this altruistic we would all have become communists long ago haha.

[Wrenchturner]

There was a twitter thread posted here the other day that outlined some potential worst-case scenarios.  One of the replies on twitter contained this graph.  Hopefully the outbreak resembles the blue part, not the red part.

People don't see themselves as individuals in a group and many people don't understand statistics.  Some also don't care, or make risky decisions frequently and this is just another choice.

I went to the grocery store today at 8am to stock up a bit and there were maybe four other people in the store.  One of them was walking around, open mouth coughing.  Not sure if that is preferable to cross-contaminating stuff in the store after coughing into your hand.

I return to work tomorrow and if I get this virus it will probably from work, or from a store.  Feeling pretty powerless about the situation.  I doubt it will hurt me if I get this virus but I worry about my elderly grandmother and mother.

[MyAlterEgoIsTaller]

One of the first two people to be diagnosed in New Hampshire was tested last Friday, told to self-quarantine while waiting for test results, disregarded that and went to an event in Vermont with 200 people at it Friday night, and the test result came back positive Saturday.  The event venue closed voluntarily for several days and canceled other events, and several people who he came in contact with were told by the states' health departments to self-quarantine.  The kicker: the guy who did this is a hospital resident in epidemiology.

Source of the bolded? I can't find any articles that say more than he was a hospital worker at Hitchcock.

Tuck cancelled all in-person classes from Wednesday onward. My source: an adjunct faculty member there.

Many sources, both local and national, that state that he's a medical resident.  Here's one:  :  https://www.wcax.com/content/news/DHMC-confident-no-patients-put-at-risk-from-virus-infected-medical-resident-568568351.html

The statement that he is a resident in epidemiology was made in one of the press conferences - I will try to find the video.

[jlcnuke]

There was a twitter thread posted here the other day that outlined some potential worst-case scenarios.  One of the replies on twitter contained this graph.  Hopefully the outbreak resembles the blue part, not the red part.

People don't see themselves as individuals in a group and many people don't understand statistics.  Some also don't care, or make risky decisions frequently and this is just another choice.

I went to the grocery store today at 8am to stock up a bit and there were maybe four other people in the store.  One of them was walking around, open mouth coughing.  Not sure if that is preferable to cross-contaminating stuff in the store after coughing into your hand.

I return to work tomorrow and if I get this virus it will probably from work, or from a store.  Feeling pretty powerless about the situation.  I doubt it will hurt me if I get this virus but I worry about my elderly grandmother and mother.

Which is why you're supposed to cough into a tissue or other similar surface, or barring that, your elbow.

[DadJokes]

So...if you are HIV positive and sleep with someone without telling them, you can be charged with a crime.

If you are positive for a communicable disease, told to self-quarantine, and disregard that, shouldn't that also be a (lesser) crime? You're directly putting other people at risk.


Despite the disease spreading, I still went to a board game convention this weekend, where hundreds of people are all handling the same board game pieces. The organizers did put hand sanitizer stations all over the place, and many people were carrying their own little bottles (including me).

[MaaS]

Europe STILL hasn't closed borders. Because "it's an overreaction." 

If the U.S. was smart, we'd have learned from that trainwreck and restricted travel to the point reasonably possible from the entire PNW a week ago.

I get that wouldn't magically fix the problem, but it buys time. Maybe enough for a vaccine, maybe warmer temps slow it a bit. Maybe not, but it's something.

[Miss Prim]

Yes, people are stupid, but we also have parents not vaccinating their children and potentially putting infants and people who can't get vaccinated at risk also.  You can't fix stupid and as far as I know, it is not a crime.  Life is a gamble anyway. 

If you are elderly or immunocompromised, you probably want to try to self quarantine as much as possible.  If you are younger and in good health, you will probably be fine.

                                                   Miss Prim

[Car Jack]

My wife works in a rehab/nursing facility per diem.  She worked Saturday night.  She says the entire facility has 1 box of gloves remaining and no masks.

Their management doesn't care.  I told her to quit.

[Wrenchturner]

There was a twitter thread posted here the other day that outlined some potential worst-case scenarios.  One of the replies on twitter contained this graph.  Hopefully the outbreak resembles the blue part, not the red part.

People don't see themselves as individuals in a group and many people don't understand statistics.  Some also don't care, or make risky decisions frequently and this is just another choice.

I went to the grocery store today at 8am to stock up a bit and there were maybe four other people in the store.  One of them was walking around, open mouth coughing.  Not sure if that is preferable to cross-contaminating stuff in the store after coughing into your hand.

I return to work tomorrow and if I get this virus it will probably from work, or from a store.  Feeling pretty powerless about the situation.  I doubt it will hurt me if I get this virus but I worry about my elderly grandmother and mother.

Which is why you're supposed to cough into a tissue or other similar surface, or barring that, your elbow.

...which is something that people don't do.

[dougules]

There was a twitter thread posted here the other day that outlined some potential worst-case scenarios.  One of the replies on twitter contained this graph.  Hopefully the outbreak resembles the blue part, not the red part.

People don't see themselves as individuals in a group and many people don't understand statistics.  Some also don't care, or make risky decisions frequently and this is just another choice.

I went to the grocery store today at 8am to stock up a bit and there were maybe four other people in the store.  One of them was walking around, open mouth coughing.  Not sure if that is preferable to cross-contaminating stuff in the store after coughing into your hand.

I return to work tomorrow and if I get this virus it will probably from work, or from a store.  Feeling pretty powerless about the situation.  I doubt it will hurt me if I get this virus but I worry about my elderly grandmother and mother.

Thanks for that graphic.  I was starting to wonder if all the drastic measures to contain the virus were pointless now, but that illustrates that it's still worth some sacrifice to slow it down. 

[TrudgingAlong]

Europe STILL hasn't closed borders. Because "it's an overreaction." 

If the U.S. was smart, we'd have learned from that trainwreck and restricted travel to the point reasonably possible from the entire PNW a week ago.

I get that wouldn't magically fix the problem, but it buys time. Maybe enough for a vaccine, maybe warmer temps slow it a bit. Maybe not, but it's something.

Since most of the east coast cases began from ppl traveling here from abroad (like the op’s post referenced), doubt this would really stop it. Maybe restricting most movement around the entire states.

[UncleX]

Europe STILL hasn't closed borders.

What borders? From my home I can drive through 5 countries within 3 hours. There are no barriers or anything, you hardly even notice crossing a border. Borders are lines on maps in Europe. That's it.

Can you drive from state to state?

[partgypsy]

Wow.

OK here is my situation. My daughter came down with a cold this Friday. Sniffles, cough, etc. She is doing better today, never had a fever so I sent her to school today.  She doesn't have any known contacts/vectors for this disease. In my state there is 1 known case, from someone coming back from Italy.

I have seasonal allergies. Even if when I take my Allegra, the month of March (also end of Feb, beginning of April) I KNOW my nose will drip, I will sneeze, my eyes and throat will be dry and itchy. 
I'm assuming I'm still OK going to work, etc as long as I don't otherwise feel ill? Or will people hate on me because I'm sneezing? I am washing my hands frequently (because I don't want to get sick from others) cover my sneezes, etc. 

[Reader]

Singapore has 6 months jail time for people who get infected and don't self report.

In addition, residents who break their quarantine get their residency (green card equivalent)/employment pass/visa revoked and are banned from ever entering singapore again. companies who disregard the quarantine for their employee and ask them to come back to work are banned from all employment pass/visa applications.

[partgypsy]

There was a twitter thread posted here the other day that outlined some potential worst-case scenarios.  One of the replies on twitter contained this graph.  Hopefully the outbreak resembles the blue part, not the red part.

People don't see themselves as individuals in a group and many people don't understand statistics.  Some also don't care, or make risky decisions frequently and this is just another choice.

I went to the grocery store today at 8am to stock up a bit and there were maybe four other people in the store.  One of them was walking around, open mouth coughing.  Not sure if that is preferable to cross-contaminating stuff in the store after coughing into your hand.

I return to work tomorrow and if I get this virus it will probably from work, or from a store.  Feeling pretty powerless about the situation.  I doubt it will hurt me if I get this virus but I worry about my elderly grandmother and mother.

Thanks for that graphic.  I was starting to wonder if all the drastic measures to contain the virus were pointless now, but that illustrates that it's still worth some sacrifice to slow it down.

Yes. The point of all the quarantines, etc is not to stop the virus. It's to slow the spread so it doesn't overwhelm our hospitals. If everyone is sick at the same time, there are not enough beds, not enough respirators, not enough healthcare workers to treat patients, and more will die. I think we will know a lot more about how well things are being contained in the next couple months.  The issue is people who are self employed and also those who are not insured, under insured, have basically no incentive to self-quarantine other than altruism. Actually negative incentive because they won't be paid if they self quarantine. My belief is public health = personal health and vice versa. If you have poor public health support it leads to poor overall personal health outcomes. The US is better now (with the ACA) than it was say 10 years ago in that MORE people are insured and able to get healthcare. But there are still a lot of gaps, and probably many people afraid to get care, treated and tested because of fears of healthcare costs.

[Reader]

OK here is my situation. My daughter came down with a cold this Friday. Sniffles, cough, etc. She is doing better today, never had a fever so I sent her to school today.  She doesn't have any known contacts/vectors for this disease. In my state there is 1 known case, from someone coming back from Italy.

she should stay home to rest if she's not well. not all have fever.

[Steeze]

Yeah, the self quarantine is a joke. I traveled from China to the US at the end of January. CDC took my contact info, told me to self quarantine if possible, and never followed up.

[partgypsy]

OK here is my situation. My daughter came down with a cold this Friday. Sniffles, cough, etc. She is doing better today, never had a fever so I sent her to school today.  She doesn't have any known contacts/vectors for this disease. In my state there is 1 known case, from someone coming back from Italy.

she should stay home to rest if she's not well. not all have fever.

Well dang. She's at school today. What about the rest of the week? She didn't seem sick this morning but def was this weekend.

[Bucksandreds]

Many more Americans will die from this than Chinese. We will eventually wake up and most major cities will be ghost towns for a few weeks to let the spread die down like China. People will be forever scared of the next event, however

[Bloop Bloop]

Yeah I don't think so. This virus has caused a minuscule number of deaths outside China. The death rate for healthy people under 40 is 0.2%. It does not worry me in the slightest.

[EngineerOurFI]

I have seasonal allergies. Even if when I take my Allegra, the month of March (also end of Feb, beginning of April) I KNOW my nose will drip, I will sneeze, my eyes and throat will be dry and itchy. 
I'm assuming I'm still OK going to work, etc as long as I don't otherwise feel ill? Or will people hate on me because I'm sneezing? I am washing my hands frequently (because I don't want to get sick from others) cover my sneezes, etc.

This is my problem.  I have terrible seasonal allergies right now and those are only going to get worse as spring comes.  I actually just hired a lawn service for first time in 5 years as I don't want doing my own lawn to make my allergies worse, etc. and cause sneezing/coughing that makes people around me panic.  Hopefully an expense I can get rid of after the summer months assuming this whole virus calms down in the fall.

[Hula Hoop]

Here in Italy, everyone is up in arms because someone leaked the presidential decree quarantining the "red zone" (ie Lombardia, most of the Veneto, parts of Emilia Romagna and Le Marche) to the press the day before it was signed.  So a lot of people who live in places like Milan for work but have extended family down south got on trains or drove south to their extended families before decree went into effect, thereby potentially infecting a ton of people south of the "red zone".

 I've also seen reports that wealthy Milanesi with summer houses in places like Tuscany (which is not in the red zone) drove down to their summer houses before the order went into effect thereby infecting people in Tuscany.  People who live in these resort towns in Tuscany are now complaining about people with Milan accents going out to dinner every night in their towns, going to the beach and treating the quarantine like a lovely extended holiday.

[tipster350]

Sam Sweeney
@SweeneyABC
BREAKING: A D.C. priest has Coronavirus. He offered communion and shook hands with more than 500 worshippers last week and on February 24th.  All worshippers who visited the Christ Church in Georgetown must self-quarantine. Church is cancelled for the first time since the 1800's

[bigblock440]

Yeah I don't think so. This virus has caused a minuscule number of deaths outside China. The death rate for healthy people under 40 is 0.2%. It does not worry me in the slightest.

Just to put it in perspective here, that's worse than polio, but tell people you're not worried about polio and didn't get the shot and all hell breaks loose.

[Hula Hoop]

Sam Sweeney
@SweeneyABC
BREAKING: A D.C. priest has Coronavirus. He offered communion and shook hands with more than 500 worshippers last week and on February 24th.  All worshippers who visited the Christ Church in Georgetown must self-quarantine. Church is cancelled for the first time since the 1800's

One good thing is that here in Italy no one is shaking hands or kissing cheeks anymore as a greeting (I'm not in the Red Zone) but instead everyone is either blowing kisses from more than a meter away or doing a Japanese style bow.  I'm even doing this with my kids at bedtime.

[DadJokes]

Yeah I don't think so. This virus has caused a minuscule number of deaths outside China. The death rate for healthy people under 40 is 0.2%. It does not worry me in the slightest.

And if you want to look for a silver lining, the effect of 5+% of people over 60 dying may actually be pretty beneficial long run. Less pollution, extending social security solvency, and redistributing a good chunk of wealth are all potential benefits.

Of course, if you are elderly, worried about SORR, one of the unlucky 0.2%, or concerned about elderly friends/family, then those potential benefits might pale in comparison to the current concerns.

[Imma]

There was a twitter thread posted here the other day that outlined some potential worst-case scenarios.  One of the replies on twitter contained this graph.  Hopefully the outbreak resembles the blue part, not the red part.

People don't see themselves as individuals in a group and many people don't understand statistics.  Some also don't care, or make risky decisions frequently and this is just another choice.

I went to the grocery store today at 8am to stock up a bit and there were maybe four other people in the store.  One of them was walking around, open mouth coughing.  Not sure if that is preferable to cross-contaminating stuff in the store after coughing into your hand.

I return to work tomorrow and if I get this virus it will probably from work, or from a store.  Feeling pretty powerless about the situation.  I doubt it will hurt me if I get this virus but I worry about my elderly grandmother and mother.

I'm in the most affected part of my country, and the people who are diagnosed now don't have a direct link to the known cases. My grandma has chosen to basically self-quarantaine. She's pretty level headed - she lived through polio and TB epidemics and famine - so she's not too worried, but staying at home is common sense. I know that even in her age category 80% survives, but I'd rather she avoids it until there's a vaccination.

The government guidelines in my area say you should stay at home when you're having a fever or cold symptoms. Firstly because it's not clear how much corona has spread, secondly to avoid panic, thirdly because we don't need more influenza patients in hospital at this point. As far as I know most people follow those guidelines.

[Hula Hoop]

Singapore has 6 months jail time for people who get infected and don't self report.

In addition, residents who break their quarantine get their residency (green card equivalent)/employment pass/visa revoked and are banned from ever entering singapore again. companies who disregard the quarantine for their employee and ask them to come back to work are banned from all employment pass/visa applications.

Here in Italy, the penalty is 3 months in jail for breaking the quarantine by leaving the red zone.

[Wrenchturner]

There was a twitter thread posted here the other day that outlined some potential worst-case scenarios.  One of the replies on twitter contained this graph.  Hopefully the outbreak resembles the blue part, not the red part.

People don't see themselves as individuals in a group and many people don't understand statistics.  Some also don't care, or make risky decisions frequently and this is just another choice.

I went to the grocery store today at 8am to stock up a bit and there were maybe four other people in the store.  One of them was walking around, open mouth coughing.  Not sure if that is preferable to cross-contaminating stuff in the store after coughing into your hand.

I return to work tomorrow and if I get this virus it will probably from work, or from a store.  Feeling pretty powerless about the situation.  I doubt it will hurt me if I get this virus but I worry about my elderly grandmother and mother.

Thanks for that graphic.  I was starting to wonder if all the drastic measures to contain the virus were pointless now, but that illustrates that it's still worth some sacrifice to slow it down.

Whether or not it gets slowed down enough will be known in retrospect only I think.  ~ten days of no symptoms while being infectious means that diagnoses are lagging indicators.  The spread of the virus will eventually slow due to other factors.  China has shown that quarantine is definitely effective.  Their cases have slowed in growth dramatically, but at a significant cost.

[Sibley]

Wow.

OK here is my situation. My daughter came down with a cold this Friday. Sniffles, cough, etc. She is doing better today, never had a fever so I sent her to school today.  She doesn't have any known contacts/vectors for this disease. In my state there is 1 known case, from someone coming back from Italy.

I have seasonal allergies. Even if when I take my Allegra, the month of March (also end of Feb, beginning of April) I KNOW my nose will drip, I will sneeze, my eyes and throat will be dry and itchy. 
I'm assuming I'm still OK going to work, etc as long as I don't otherwise feel ill? Or will people hate on me because I'm sneezing? I am washing my hands frequently (because I don't want to get sick from others) cover my sneezes, etc.

I have allergies/sinus issues. I sneeze and sometimes cough, year round. I cover my cough and sneezes as best I can. I do what I can to mitigate it. But realistically, I go through a lot of kleenix sometimes. If anyone wants to freak out I can't stop them. But I will tell them it's allergies when it is. And since I'm a very crabby sick person, I try to avoid people anyway when I'm sick. This just makes it even easier!

[zygote]

Yeah, it's really difficult to know what to do with the lack of testing.

My wife also has allergies, and has a basically chronic cough and runny nose this time of year. We assumed that's what her current cough was...until I got a runny nose/slight cough too this weekend. It feels like a regular cold, and we have no known exposure to the coronavirus. No fever or anything. But we also live in a populated city that's starting to have more and more cases, so who knows if we came into contact with someone who hasn't been diagnosed yet.

I really wish we could just test ourselves and know either way. My job is somewhat time sensitive and can't be done at home, so I don't want to quarantine myself for a regular cold. I've settled for coming into work and just not touching anything on public transit/staying away from other people. And washing my hands like crazy. I'm coughing so little I don't even have to worry about covering it (which I would). I just feel crappy.

[Buffaloski Boris]

One of the first two people to be diagnosed in New Hampshire was tested last Friday, told to self-quarantine while waiting for test results, disregarded that and went to an event in Vermont with 200 people at it Friday night, and the test result came back positive Saturday.  The event venue closed voluntarily for several days and canceled other events, and several people who he came in contact with were told by the states' health departments to self-quarantine.  The kicker: the guy who did this is a hospital resident in epidemiology.

Oh that's just a head-shake moment.  Bravo.   

[erutio]

The family was asked to self-quarantine on Thurs.  Yet on saturday, the father and sister of this individual went to a high school father-daughter dance, which had students attending from two different schools.

[SimpleCycle]

There was a twitter thread posted here the other day that outlined some potential worst-case scenarios.  One of the replies on twitter contained this graph.  Hopefully the outbreak resembles the blue part, not the red part.

People don't see themselves as individuals in a group and many people don't understand statistics.  Some also don't care, or make risky decisions frequently and this is just another choice.

I went to the grocery store today at 8am to stock up a bit and there were maybe four other people in the store.  One of them was walking around, open mouth coughing.  Not sure if that is preferable to cross-contaminating stuff in the store after coughing into your hand.

I return to work tomorrow and if I get this virus it will probably from work, or from a store.  Feeling pretty powerless about the situation.  I doubt it will hurt me if I get this virus but I worry about my elderly grandmother and mother.

I like that graphic, thanks for sharing.

I am pretty sure I know which Twitter thread you mean, and the scenarios in it are not very accurate.  She chose 6 days as a doubling time which is very aggressive, and claimed that we'd need more than 6MM masks a day, which is barely in the ballpark even if you assume this is 10x worse than an average flu season.  And 10x worse than the average flu season estimate comes from the American Hospital Association, who seemed to assume we wouldn't use any public health measures to stop the spread.

Anyway, Pete has a blog post about this where he makes the point that CDC estimated Ebola cases in 2014 were modeled to be 550k to 1.4MM, and it turned out that with public health measures, it was held to 28,600 cases.  Public health works!

[SwordGuy]

Honestly, if someone is directed to self-quarantine at home and they violate that quarantine for anything less than a true emergency or at the direction of the authorities, we should just summarily execute them.   With video.   And post it on social media and make it part of official government announcements that the media would be expected to cover in full.

Think of the photo of the Viet Cong spy that was summarily executed by an ARVN officer, only in color and on video.

Enough of those and the number people willing to violate home quarantine will drop significantly.

Think of it as preparation for when something as deadly as Ebola gets out.   It's only a matter of time before that happens, so the more we change the lackadaisical attitude people have about quarantine the better.

[mm1970]

One of the first two people to be diagnosed in New Hampshire was tested last Friday, told to self-quarantine while waiting for test results, disregarded that and went to an event in Vermont with 200 people at it Friday night, and the test result came back positive Saturday.  The event venue closed voluntarily for several days and canceled other events, and several people who he came in contact with were told by the states' health departments to self-quarantine.  The kicker: the guy who did this is a hospital resident in epidemiology.

oh my really?

[dougules]

If someone knowingly goes out and infects somebody else, could it be considered assault?

[mm1970]

OK here is my situation. My daughter came down with a cold this Friday. Sniffles, cough, etc. She is doing better today, never had a fever so I sent her to school today.  She doesn't have any known contacts/vectors for this disease. In my state there is 1 known case, from someone coming back from Italy.

she should stay home to rest if she's not well. not all have fever.

Same.  My big kid was sick last week with sore throat and cough.  Stayed home 3 days.  He's better.

No known cases in our county, but who knows?  I don't expect a teenager to be too symptomatic.