Author Topic: Anyone Transition to 4 10-Hour days?  (Read 2561 times)

BudgetSlasher

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Anyone Transition to 4 10-Hour days?
« on: December 03, 2017, 10:10:31 AM »
Has anyone transitioned from working a normal 40 week in 5 8-hour days to working the 40 hours in 4 10-hour days?

If so I would like to hear your honest assessment of how it worked for you, pros and cons, and if you would do it again?

I am more interested on how it impacted you, your family, your quality of life, and your work-life balance than I about how to approach an employer; we have at least some guidance when it comes to alternative work schedules, but you have something interesting, feel free to share.

A little background on me/us: It is just the two of us (no little ones no pets). The DW, by virtue of her field, does not work 5-days a week. My commute it 2 turns, one traffic light, and 9 miles. We live in a location where during the warm months it is light out until around 9 o'clock and I often get a fair bit accomplished after work around the house and yard, but this time of year I don't leave work until twilight and as a result I am much less motivated to begin or resume a project when I get home.

EricEng

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Re: Anyone Transition to 4 10-Hour days?
« Reply #1 on: December 03, 2017, 10:43:28 AM »
My work switched a year ago to 9/80, or 5 day week/4 day week with 9 hours for most so that two weeks still averages to 40.  It's not a full transition to 4/10, but half way there.  The general reception was exceptional, most everyone loved it.  The only requirement is your work has to respect those off days and a lot of outside customers we work with wanted activities on the off days requiring people to work the off day in addition to their extended hours.  So it can either be better or much worse.  Having a three day weekend is great for camping and having more time to get things done.  10 hour days is pretty taxing though especially if you have obligations after work like school or kids.  YMMV

SC93

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Re: Anyone Transition to 4 10-Hour days?
« Reply #2 on: December 03, 2017, 11:46:13 AM »
I'm on the 10 4 hour days plan. Its working well!!

Dave1442397

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Re: Anyone Transition to 4 10-Hour days?
« Reply #3 on: December 03, 2017, 12:08:12 PM »
I had a 4-day week at a job I started back in 2002, and I loved it. It was great having Fridays off, especially back then when I had to be actually at the office. Friday was always the worst traffic day, as so many people were heading to the shore for the weekend.

I think for employees (in general) it's great, but I think upper management dislike it because they lose all the free labor they get from those people who routinely work unpaid overtime during a five-day work week. When the company was bought out, the first thing the new CEO did was go back to a five-day work week.


mousebandit

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Re: Anyone Transition to 4 10-Hour days?
« Reply #4 on: December 03, 2017, 12:18:30 PM »
My husband is in civil construction , and this job is usually 4/10s.  It's been very nice.  The workdays fly by, the weekend is long, it's nice having an entire weekday to do admin stuff if needed.  We much prefer this to a 5-day workweek. 

Johnez

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Re: Anyone Transition to 4 10-Hour days?
« Reply #5 on: December 03, 2017, 04:48:39 PM »
On 4-10s currently there are pros and cons. I suspect most people here are white collar, I'm a warehouse loader though, and while 10 hours at a desk doesn't seem too bad-10 hours of labor can be tough. Especially when you get 2 extra hours of work-thats only 2 hours paid OT on 12 hours work-argh! Kinda sucks. Having 3 days off is badass though, I go to school now and the schedule fits great. 4 days work, 2 days school, 1 day off. .
« Last Edit: December 03, 2017, 04:51:40 PM by Johnez »

Retire-Canada

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Re: Anyone Transition to 4 10-Hour days?
« Reply #6 on: December 03, 2017, 05:13:14 PM »
Has anyone transitioned from working a normal 40 week in 5 8-hour days to working the 40 hours in 4 10-hour days?

If so I would like to hear your honest assessment of how it worked for you, pros and cons, and if you would do it again?

I am more interested on how it impacted you, your family, your quality of life, and your work-life balance than I about how to approach an employer; we have at least some guidance when it comes to alternative work schedules, but you have something interesting, feel free to share.

Yes I did that for I want to say a year, but I'm fuzzy on the exact number of months.

Pros:

- I loved 3 day weekends
- no cut in pay
- reduced commutes my 20%


Cons:

- 10hrs days + 1hr of commuting is a long day
- typically I came home ate dinner and went to sleep pretty early so Mon-Thurs were a write off
- if you are feeling bad/sick 10hrs is a long day
- I had to be strategic about what I got done early when I was fresh and what I left for end of day

All in all I liked it and if I had to choose between 5 x 8hrs and 4 x 10hrs...I would do 4 x 10hrs. That said there is no free lunch. It's tiring and left me drained on work day evenings.

I am now working 3 x 8hrs downshifted and like that a lot better except for the reduced pay. If I had to choose a schedule for increased work I'd go for 4 x 8hrs. That provides 80% of the pay and a fairly chill schedule.

FWIW - I'm a factory based desk worker. No manual labour.

Cereza

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Re: Anyone Transition to 4 10-Hour days?
« Reply #7 on: December 03, 2017, 05:47:58 PM »
Recently had to move companies because of this. Prior company did a mandatory swap of our department to 4 10-hour days. The issue I had with it? It was their way to get the department to 7 day a week coverage.

The downsides for me:
-Shifts: Sunday to Wednesday or Wednesday to Saturday
-Hours: 6:30am to 5pm
-No management coverage on weekend days
-No $$$ incentive

I ended up with enough lead time to interview and land a job that is a shorter commute/more money/better benefits and better company overall. At least so far!!

I'd imagine if things had been different I'd might enjoy 3 days off in a row but losing a whole day with my spouse was a no-go among other things.

sparkytheop

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Re: Anyone Transition to 4 10-Hour days?
« Reply #8 on: December 03, 2017, 05:56:45 PM »
I worked 4 10s for many years.  I had a 40 minute commute, so it was really nice to just work an extra two hours and not have to drive at all the fifth day.  Three day weekends were awesome-- I had the weekend off when things were going on in our small town, and I had a Friday to do the stuff that was only available on weekdays (mail packages, doctor appointments, visit the credit union, help in my son's classroom, etc).

Now I'm on a rotating 12 hour shift (with one 8 to get my 80 hours a pay period) and I love it even more. My "commute" is now reduced to 10 minutes, door to door.  I just worked six nights in a row and am taking my 8 hour day off.  Then another 8 hour day off the next week, then working another 6 nights.  This gives me 16 days off in a row (which I can make happen every 10 weeks if I want, the other 8 weeks have a different mix of days and nights).

It does make your evenings shorter, and if you work a physical job (I did/do), you might just be ready for bed when you get home, but for me, the extra day off was well worth it. 

Socmonkey

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Re: Anyone Transition to 4 10-Hour days?
« Reply #9 on: December 04, 2017, 09:23:02 AM »
I haven't worked 4/10's as my job requires 24/7 coverage - but I worked 6 years so far on a 12-hour per day 3-2-2-3 schedule.

That is 3 days working (Fri-Sun), then Mon-Tue off, then work Wed-Thurs, and have a 3-day weekend.

I love the places that I have worked this schedule! Because if I even have to think about work the day is ruined, so might as well do a lot of hours if I can get full days off for it.

Days off during the week means you can get your errands done with minimal crowds, and when you work the weekend the high-level supervision isn't there putting their fingers into your pie (so you can just focus on the work and get crap done).
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thenextguy

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Re: Anyone Transition to 4 10-Hour days?
« Reply #10 on: December 04, 2017, 09:53:12 AM »
I work 4/10s and while I'd say I prefer it, it's not as great as it might sound. There are negatives. You're sort of taking any free time you might have on the weekday nights and transferring them to Friday. By the time I get home from work and eat dinner, it's just about time for bed.

Say What?

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Re: Anyone Transition to 4 10-Hour days?
« Reply #11 on: December 04, 2017, 10:44:05 AM »
I currently work 4 10-hour days and I love it. Always having Fridays off lets me get all of my chores done to actually enjoy the weekend. I also hardly ever have to take off early or come in late for appointments or errands that require me to go in during work hours.

Some days can be long, but I find that I get more done.

FindingFI

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Re: Anyone Transition to 4 10-Hour days?
« Reply #12 on: December 04, 2017, 11:21:35 AM »
My company offers the option of 5 - 8 hour days, a 9/80 schedule that EricEng described or 4 - 10's.  Most people, myself included, opted for the 9 hours days, a few picked 10 hours days, and only one or two chose 8 hours days.  A 10 hours day is just a little bit too long for me and would require getting up at 4am or running into evening rush our traffic, but the people that do it love having every Friday off.  Every other Friday off and getting up at 5 is better for me.  The company is also really good about respecting our off days.  It's been also a year and a half and I have yet to get a call on an off Friday.

zinnie

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Re: Anyone Transition to 4 10-Hour days?
« Reply #13 on: December 04, 2017, 11:25:52 AM »
My department tried both 4/10 and 9/80 and ended up preferring the 9/80 schedule. The 10 hours was just too long with lunch and commute time. And many found they had a hard time being productive for such long stretches.

TheWifeHalf

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Re: Anyone Transition to 4 10-Hour days?
« Reply #14 on: December 04, 2017, 04:55:06 PM »
I am the family, so I'll respond:

About 6 years ago  TheHusbandHalf's employer had the hourly employees  vote whether they wanted this change of not. They voted for it, so he now works that schedule.

We both love it. (I am not sure what day of the week a pay week starts)
wk 1      work 4 days
wk 2      work 4 days
wk 3      work 5 days
wk 4      he gets Sat off from wk 3, 5 days off, then work Fri, Sat   We love that 6 days off!   
I just got the days from the calendar, I don't know where the division is for a pay period.

We have to have a marked calendar to keep track of when he's on/off because the work days of each week are different

There is another place owned by the same company that the company decided the 36 hours in one week/ 44 the next  meant they didn't have to pay overtime. They just figured they could take the 4 hours from one and add them to the 36 hr week.  The state said nope, you can't split the work week that way. So he gets 4 hours overtime pay. Please don't ask me about the specifics of that, I can not wrap my brain around it to describe it any more..

Last year they wanted to know if they(company) could go back to the 8 hr shifts. The contract they signed with the union the first time they switched had a clause that the employees could switch it back if they wanted - but there is no clause that says the company can.
The employees said NO, we like it.

I do not work, and no school age children, it might be different for other families.
You know, I wrote all that and I think he works 12 hr shifts. Sometimes they ask him to hold over a shift, but law says he can't work more than 16 straight, so I'm guessing that's why the co. wants to go back - sometimes one of the salary guys has to fill.

added: TheHusbandHalf commutes 20 min.
« Last Edit: December 04, 2017, 05:35:22 PM by TheWifeHalf »

startingsmall

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Re: Anyone Transition to 4 10-Hour days?
« Reply #15 on: December 04, 2017, 07:43:08 PM »
Cons:

- 10hrs days + 1hr of commuting is a long day
- typically I came home ate dinner and went to sleep pretty early so Mon-Thurs were a write off
- if you are feeling bad/sick 10hrs is a long day
- I had to be strategic about what I got done early when I was fresh and what I left for end of day

Yes to these cons. I commute 1.5 hours per day, and my 10-hour days sometimes stretch into 10.5 hr days.... so it's not that unusual for me to be away from home 12 hours per day. Given that my work can be physically & mentally exhausting (veterinarian, so lots of high-stress situations and on my feet all day), I'm basically a useless zombie when I get home.  I loved working 4 10's before we had our daughter, but I find it very challenging as a parent and I'm looking at going back to a 5-day week.
« Last Edit: December 05, 2017, 07:12:35 AM by startingsmall »

EricEng

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Re: Anyone Transition to 4 10-Hour days?
« Reply #16 on: December 04, 2017, 09:31:06 PM »
I think upper management dislike it because they lose all the free labor they get from those people who routinely work unpaid overtime during a five-day work week. When the company was bought out, the first thing the new CEO did was go back to a five-day work week.
You nailed it on this one.  Our management fought against it tooth and nail because they already had most of us working 9-10 hour days (45-50 hours a week) and just losing the unpaid overtime.  When we switched to 9-10 hour days,  people kept working the same hours rather than bumping up to 11-12 hours days, so little to no unpaid overtime anymore and hard for management to squeeze or expect extras hours when days are already so long.  Facility closes on off Friday, so they can't pressure us to come in then either except special occasions.

chaskavitch

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Re: Anyone Transition to 4 10-Hour days?
« Reply #17 on: December 05, 2017, 06:51:48 AM »
Recently had to move companies because of this. Prior company did a mandatory swap of our department to 4 10-hour days. The issue I had with it? It was their way to get the department to 7 day a week coverage.

The downsides for me:
-Shifts: Sunday to Wednesday or Wednesday to Saturday
-Hours: 6:30am to 5pm
-No management coverage on weekend days
-No $$$ incentive


Do I know you?  Because this is exactly what my company did, except I start at 6 am and we also have a second shift that works 12-11 pm.

I have an 18 month old, and we've been doing this a full year now, so it really sucks that I am not there in the morning when he wakes up 4 days a week, and that I only get 2-2.5 hrs of time with him before he goes to bed in the evening.  I greatly dislike not being able to go to church - a lot of my friends are there, and I generally just miss it.  Also, I don't like only having one day of "weekend" with my husband, since he works M-F. 

However, I do love having a 3 day weekend, week days in which to run errands or have appointments, and we're paying ~$400/mo less in daycare for a 3 day week than we would for a 5 day week.  If my shift was Mon-Thurs, I'd probably really enjoy it.

I think upper management dislike it because they lose all the free labor they get from those people who routinely work unpaid overtime during a five-day work week. When the company was bought out, the first thing the new CEO did was go back to a five-day work week.
You nailed it on this one.  Our management fought against it tooth and nail because they already had most of us working 9-10 hour days (45-50 hours a week) and just losing the unpaid overtime.  When we switched to 9-10 hour days,  people kept working the same hours rather than bumping up to 11-12 hours days, so little to no unpaid overtime anymore and hard for management to squeeze or expect extras hours when days are already so long.  Facility closes on off Friday, so they can't pressure us to come in then either except special occasions.

Also this.  I do end up working 15-30 minutes of overtime daily, sometimes 45, but that's mostly because I take a short lunch and still stay until 5 like everyone else.  Many of my coworkers who work 8 hour shifts, though (the M-F crew - our department is such a weird weird mix of 6 different schedules) consistently stay at least an hour overtime just to get things done.  That's nonsense, and ridiculous, especially since we are ALL SALARIED.  Why in the world are people ok working 5 - 10 hours a week for free?

Malkynn

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Re: Anyone Transition to 4 10-Hour days?
« Reply #18 on: December 05, 2017, 09:54:42 AM »
10hr days are standard in my industry, so I donít even know what an 8hr day feels like.

I start early, so I still have regular evening hours like most people. I leave work at 5:30ish most days, I just go to bed earlier than most people, but I never found those 9pm-11pm hours to be very productive anyway, so I just end up watching less television on weekdays.

The extra time off also allows me to do all of the cooking for the week, so our evenings are pretty free not having to worry about cooking at all.

Schaefer Light

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Re: Anyone Transition to 4 10-Hour days?
« Reply #19 on: December 05, 2017, 12:39:42 PM »
As bored as I am at work, I don't think I could make it through a 10-hour day.

Cereza

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Re: Anyone Transition to 4 10-Hour days?
« Reply #20 on: December 05, 2017, 06:24:18 PM »
Recently had to move companies because of this. Prior company did a mandatory swap of our department to 4 10-hour days. The issue I had with it? It was their way to get the department to 7 day a week coverage.

The downsides for me:
-Shifts: Sunday to Wednesday or Wednesday to Saturday
-Hours: 6:30am to 5pm
-No management coverage on weekend days
-No $$$ incentive


Do I know you?  Because this is exactly what my company did, except I start at 6 am and we also have a second shift that works 12-11 pm.


Close! Our group didn't have a second shift but a sister group did but theirs was 3pm to midnight and was 5 days a week. At least that gave a small pay differential. It was quite sloppily put together and details about time-off and how holidays would work wasn't exactly thought out (aka not at all).

Mon-Thurs? Might have considered but I have a lot of life activities that would not be possible on the 'work' days with long hours+commute such as that. And only getting to do them 3 days a week was a no go. Plus you know I married my spouse because I kind of like spending time with them, so you know.

It all worked out for me in the end but I was serious about job searching once it became imminent. I do feel for my former co-workers, some with kids, that are having a rough go of it. Some with spouses that are less than amused with having to shoulder 80% of the child care.

headwinds

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Re: Anyone Transition to 4 10-Hour days?
« Reply #21 on: December 05, 2017, 08:24:55 PM »
I've been on 3 12's for ~10 years. I used to love it, now I'm thinking 4 10's would be so much easier...

chaskavitch

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Re: Anyone Transition to 4 10-Hour days?
« Reply #22 on: December 06, 2017, 06:11:57 AM »
Recently had to move companies because of this. Prior company did a mandatory swap of our department to 4 10-hour days. The issue I had with it? It was their way to get the department to 7 day a week coverage.

The downsides for me:
-Shifts: Sunday to Wednesday or Wednesday to Saturday
-Hours: 6:30am to 5pm
-No management coverage on weekend days
-No $$$ incentive


Do I know you?  Because this is exactly what my company did, except I start at 6 am and we also have a second shift that works 12-11 pm.


Close! Our group didn't have a second shift but a sister group did but theirs was 3pm to midnight and was 5 days a week. At least that gave a small pay differential. It was quite sloppily put together and details about time-off and how holidays would work wasn't exactly thought out (aka not at all).


There are 5 of us in my department that work Sundays (maybe 15 or 20 in the whole company), and guess what?  They forgot about us when doing holiday scheduling. Technically Dec 31st isn't a company holiday, so we have to request PTO for that day.  We get awesome leave around Christmas as an industry standard, so I'm off Thursday the 21st through Saturday the 30th, am supposed to work the 31st, and then I have the 1st off... 

merlin7676

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Re: Anyone Transition to 4 10-Hour days?
« Reply #23 on: December 06, 2017, 08:33:12 AM »
Have never done 4 10's but when I got out of college and started my first job, it was 10-4...meaning you worked 10 days in a row but then got 4 days off. 
I'd work wed to the following friday, then have sat, sun mon and tues off. Rinse and repeat.

I liked it although after 10 days in a row, that first day off it was mostly just relax and recover.  But it was nice to do those things you couldn't on the weekend like schedule doctors appointments, ect.
Plus it was still just an 8 hour work day and I lived 5 minutes away so it wasn't too bad.

Walsh1122

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Re: Anyone Transition to 4 10-Hour days?
« Reply #24 on: December 06, 2017, 08:55:20 AM »
Has anyone transitioned from working a normal 40 week in 5 8-hour days to working the 40 hours in 4 10-hour days?

If so I would like to hear your honest assessment of how it worked for you, pros and cons, and if you would do it again?

I am more interested on how it impacted you, your family, your quality of life, and your work-life balance than I about how to approach an employer; we have at least some guidance when it comes to alternative work schedules, but you have something interesting, feel free to share.

A little background on me/us: It is just the two of us (no little ones no pets). The DW, by virtue of her field, does not work 5-days a week. My commute it 2 turns, one traffic light, and 9 miles. We live in a location where during the warm months it is light out until around 9 o'clock and I often get a fair bit accomplished after work around the house and yard, but this time of year I don't leave work until twilight and as a result I am much less motivated to begin or resume a project when I get home.

I started a 4 day work week about 2 years ago when I changed jobs.  Prior to that I was on 5 day work week, but my off days were consecutive.  The new schedule has worked out great for me and my wife.  I work Friday through Monday and have off Tuesday through Thursday, she has Tue/Wed off so we get those days together.  I have always felt that my work days were a wash anyway, I would rather be all in on the days I work and accumulate the free time for my off days.  I don't feel any more stressed or worn out with the additional hours added to each day.  My commute is about 25 minutes each way. 

One of the major upsides for me is that having 3 consecutive days off allows me to travel more easily.  I could take short trips and not have to use up PTO or just add PTO to either end of my off days and take extended time off.  If we don't go out of town I typically get projects done around the house, with the additional day each week it allows me to not have to rush through things.

I honestly can't think of any downsides, at least for me, with the 4 on 3 off schedule. 

sherr

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Re: Anyone Transition to 4 10-Hour days?
« Reply #25 on: December 06, 2017, 08:59:13 AM »
I'm a +1 to a lot of things already said but I'll repeat them:

I like it. After the first couple of weeks you don't really notice the extra 2 hours each day, but you *always* notice the 3-day weekend. But I'm an office worker, so it's not a physically demanding job. The instant 20% reduction in commute time was nice (my commute is only 20-minutes each way normally), and the odd hours means that you're less likely to be travelling during rush hour for the 4 remaining days.

It is true though that you are essentially just chopping hours off of the weekday evenings and dumping them into Friday. Which is nice from a long-weekend-trip or go-on-an-outing-with-the-family perspective, but doesn't actually net you any additional hours (except saved commuting time). My Mon-Thurs evening activities are pretty minimal compared with what they used to be. Eat, play with the kids for an hour or two and do bedtimes, and then I have a couple hours to watch something with the wife or read. So you have less time for weekday activities with friends and the like (although with two young kids I really didn't have much opportunity for that anyway).

But then we have all day Friday to do whatever we want. Which means that we end up doing a lot of family activities on Friday while everyone else is at work, and then we can do friend activities on the weekend when they are available. So I think it has been a net positive for my availability for friend activities.

robartsd

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Re: Anyone Transition to 4 10-Hour days?
« Reply #26 on: December 06, 2017, 09:20:19 AM »
I would have considered a 4/10/40 workweek a few years ago if my employer allowed it, but could only choose 9/8/80. Our office is split between 9/8/80 and 5/8/40 work schedules. Right now the 9 hour days are long enough that I wouldn't want a 4/10/40. When I was growing up, my dad worked a 4/10/40 then volunteered at our elementary school on his day off.

Technically 9/8/80 work schedules are still 40 hour work weeks, but the work week starts in the middle of the day you regularly take off. Because of this, you're not supposed to shift your hours on that day of the week (can't come in an hour early to make up for leaving an hour early because those hours are in different work weeks). Usually the 8 hour day is scheduled for the same day of the week that you regularly take off with 4 hours worked in each work week. One of my former coworkers scheduled the 8 hour day for Friday and day off for Monday of the same weekend - this still worked because when he worked Mondays the first 4 hours were for the prior week and 5 hours were for the coming week. (Tue: 9, Wed: 9, Thu: 9, Fri: 9, Mon: 4 / Mon: 5, Tue: 9, Wed: 9, Thu: 9, Fri: 8)

mathlete

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Re: Anyone Transition to 4 10-Hour days?
« Reply #27 on: December 06, 2017, 09:41:45 AM »
I have a hard enough time being fully engaged for 8 hours in a day, let alone 10.


Schaefer Light

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Re: Anyone Transition to 4 10-Hour days?
« Reply #28 on: December 06, 2017, 10:05:28 AM »
I have a hard enough time being fully engaged for 8 hours in a day, let alone 10.
Same here.  I'd go insane if I had to stay in the office an extra 2 hours a day.

Goldielocks

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Re: Anyone Transition to 4 10-Hour days?
« Reply #29 on: December 06, 2017, 10:37:17 AM »
I think upper management dislike it because they lose all the free labor they get from those people who routinely work unpaid overtime during a five-day work week. When the company was bought out, the first thing the new CEO did was go back to a five-day work week.
You nailed it on this one.  Our management fought against it tooth and nail because they already had most of us working 9-10 hour days (45-50 hours a week) and just losing the unpaid overtime.  When we switched to 9-10 hour days,  people kept working the same hours rather than bumping up to 11-12 hours days, so little to no unpaid overtime anymore and hard for management to squeeze or expect extras hours when days are already so long.  Facility closes on off Friday, so they can't pressure us to come in then either except special occasions.

This is exactly why I suggested (and implemented) switching our supervisors in manufacturing to a 4 x 10 hr shift.   

Supervisors tended to stay to resolve any problems after the production shift ended.  They were putting in at least 55 hours a week, because of unpaid overtime, and not paid much as supervisors,  their actual $/hr with the unpaid overtime was close to minimum wage.  I couldn't get them more money, but switching to 4 x 10 shifts nearly eliminated the overtime, and allowed less supervisor overlap, so the junior supervisors actually had an opportunity to do their jobs (instead of grunt work) and get more skilled.

And then bonus-- I needed one less supervisor, across the 7 day a week shifts, (less overlap), and i was able to early retire the worst one -- the one that kept violating basic HR policy in how she dealt with employees when left on her own.  The one I would not trust to start up production safely if she was the only supervisor to show up in a snowstorm, the one who had worked there 15 years and had a lot of upper management loyalty so I could not fire outright, but I could downsize.
« Last Edit: December 06, 2017, 10:45:47 AM by Goldielocks »

EricEng

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Re: Anyone Transition to 4 10-Hour days?
« Reply #30 on: December 06, 2017, 03:30:14 PM »
Technically 9/8/80 work schedules are still 40 hour work weeks, but the work week starts in the middle of the day you regularly take off. Because of this, you're not supposed to shift your hours on that day of the week (can't come in an hour early to make up for leaving an hour early because those hours are in different work weeks).
Officially ours is like that as well.  However 80% of managers don't enforce it and just let us flex that day however we want so we can always end the first week with a perfect 40 even if starting Friday we only had 1 hour left to go or 7.  Those working under managers that are strict about the firm split time are pretty unhappy.  They commonly end up with unpaid overtime because they have to be in at a certain time even though they already have enough hours for that week, but if they leave early they miss hours needed for the following week.

From what I understand it has to do with federal time charging standards for work weeks like you describe, but as long as no one looks to close we get some wiggle room.  We also get paid weekly, but if we were biweekly with 80 hour requirements I imagine they could get around that.

robartsd

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Re: Anyone Transition to 4 10-Hour days?
« Reply #31 on: December 06, 2017, 04:18:20 PM »
Technically 9/8/80 work schedules are still 40 hour work weeks, but the work week starts in the middle of the day you regularly take off. Because of this, you're not supposed to shift your hours on that day of the week (can't come in an hour early to make up for leaving an hour early because those hours are in different work weeks).
Officially ours is like that as well.  However 80% of managers don't enforce it and just let us flex that day however we want so we can always end the first week with a perfect 40 even if starting Friday we only had 1 hour left to go or 7.  Those working under managers that are strict about the firm split time are pretty unhappy.  They commonly end up with unpaid overtime because they have to be in at a certain time even though they already have enough hours for that week, but if they leave early they miss hours needed for the following week.
All your managers are asking for trouble if someone decides to make it. Those with flexible managers are less likely to make the trouble, but overtime laws do not allow shifting the work week as you describe. The work week must begin at that same time of day on the same day of the week every week. You can get a little flexiblity if lunch is scheduled over the work week change.

From what I understand it has to do with federal time charging standards for work weeks like you describe, but as long as no one looks to close we get some wiggle room.  We also get paid weekly, but if we were biweekly with 80 hour requirements I imagine they could get around that.
Where I work we get paid monthly, so the number of hours worked and the number of hours paid doesn't match up. Our leave tracking system has a special category for this where some months we bank an hour or two and other months we burn several. For some idiotic reason they only allow alternate work week schedules to start at the begining of a pay period.

TheWifeHalf

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Re: Anyone Transition to 4 10-Hour days?
« Reply #32 on: December 06, 2017, 09:36:19 PM »
TheHusbandHalf verified that he works 12 hr days, rather than 10 He likes it because he only works 163 days/yr.

Rural

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Re: Anyone Transition to 4 10-Hour days?
« Reply #33 on: December 06, 2017, 10:29:19 PM »
I did it for a year or so, but the off day was midweek and I had a long commute. Try to avoid both those things if you do it. It was miserable.

gsd802

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Re: Anyone Transition to 4 10-Hour days?
« Reply #34 on: December 07, 2017, 06:22:14 AM »
My girlfriend has that schedule.  She loves it.  She travels 30 miles one way to work so it really saves on fuel/ wear and tear.  If you enjoy doing projects at home, would you rather have a few hours a night to do them....or a whole extra day to get things accomplished?

Schaefer Light

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Re: Anyone Transition to 4 10-Hour days?
« Reply #35 on: December 07, 2017, 08:37:28 AM »
My girlfriend has that schedule.  She loves it.  She travels 30 miles one way to work so it really saves on fuel/ wear and tear.  If you enjoy doing projects at home, would you rather have a few hours a night to do them....or a whole extra day to get things accomplished?
For projects I'd probably prefer the extra day, but for a regular exercise routine I'd prefer just working 8 hours a day.

robartsd

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Re: Anyone Transition to 4 10-Hour days?
« Reply #36 on: December 07, 2017, 08:44:34 AM »
I did it for a year or so, but the off day was midweek and I had a long commute. Try to avoid both those things if you do it. It was miserable.
I agree that avoiding a long commute should be done; but I have enjoyed having a mid-week regular day off - for me that works better for getting things done on my day off than a three day weekend would.

hoping2retire35

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Re: Anyone Transition to 4 10-Hour days?
« Reply #37 on: December 07, 2017, 09:14:20 AM »
yes, it is amazing.

In you situation maybe not as much. I am away from home a lot less for three basic reasons; shorter commute(earlier and later means less traffic), 1 day less commuting, shorter lunch(non paid) break 30 min instead of sitting around bored for an hour.

If you feel like you can get errands done midday it could be awesome.

Bimmy

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Re: Anyone Transition to 4 10-Hour days?
« Reply #38 on: December 07, 2017, 01:27:34 PM »
I worked 12 hours day on the Panama Schedule for a couple years. I enjoyed it. You worked a total of 13 shifts a month. Anything after the 12 hours was paid at time and a half plus 7% (I think... something like that). I worked a lot of 14 shifts to soak up the extra pay.

Having 4 days off most weeks was amazing. I think the 4 ten hour days is probably the best though. Not nearly as exhausting as 12 hour days.
Bimmy. Close relative to Billy and Jimmy Lee of the Double Dragon Series.

Vapour

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Re: Anyone Transition to 4 10-Hour days?
« Reply #39 on: December 08, 2017, 01:12:56 PM »
I work four 9 hour days, then do a half day on Fridays.  I get in early, so I can leave by around 11 on Friday.   I definitely like it.  I live pretty close to work and bike most of the year, so the commute isn't a big deal for me.  Once I get through Wednesday, it makes it feel like the work week is almost over.  It's nice to be able to leave before lunch so I can eat at home rather than packing another lunch.  It also makes it easier to take Fridays off, since it's only 4 hours of vacation instead of 8.  A large benefit is that I rarely work overtime now.  I never worked a ton of overtime, but it's easy to get caught up at the end of the day, especially when some people get in 2+ hours after I do, so they may expect you to be there later.  I'm usually so ready to go home now after 9 hours, that I'm a lot less likely to stick around longer.  Finding this site and having FU money also has done wonders for my willingness to work any overtime.

I think four 10 hour days would be an option if I wanted to do that.  When work is interesting and I'm doing hands-on work, I think I'd be pretty happy with that schedule.  But there are too many days where I sit at my computer working on boring documents all day.  Adding another hour to those days would be pretty tough, so I'd rather stick with my current schedule at this point.

My ideal schedule (right now anyway while I still need money) would be to take a pay cut to 90% of pay and do four 9 hour days.  Once I take into account all the tax I'm paying on that last 10% of my income, I'm probably only taking home 60-65% of it anyway.  I could afford to do this now, but I'm not sure if my employer would allow it and I'm a little worried about how it would look.  I'm young with no kids, so I don't have a good excuse for proposing it.  Maybe in a few years when I'm closer to FI...

PlanetDee

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Re: Anyone Transition to 4 10-Hour days?
« Reply #40 on: December 08, 2017, 05:22:21 PM »
Yes - I work 4 days a week at 9.5 hour days (we only work a 38 week as full time), and I take Wednesdays off. It's the best thing I've done! I only ever have to work 2 days in a row, and with a longish bus commute (about 90 minutes each way), it saves on commuting time/expenses. Plus coming in earlier and leaving earlier can help with traffic.

I feel like my bosses like it as well - they know that I'm here earlier/later than others to help with emergency or last minute projects.

I will say, it was a bit of an adjustment at first. Getting used to working that many hours in a row takes some adjustment, but I would never go back to 5 days now.

the_fixer

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Re: Anyone Transition to 4 10-Hour days?
« Reply #41 on: December 09, 2017, 02:36:54 AM »
I work 4x10 Monday - Thursday having 3 days off is great but the down side is the 4 days I work are long and makes it hard to do anything before or after work.

It was great at first when we could skip lunch or take a 1/2 hour but the company recently mandated that everyone is required to take a 1 hour lunch so now it becomes an 11 hour day + commute so I leave home at 5:45 in the morning and get home around 6:00 PM

I have considered going back to 8 hour shifts just not sure I want to give up the 3 days off and will likely just grind it out the next 2 years until I am fully vested in my retirement and hit FIRE.


Malkynn

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Re: Anyone Transition to 4 10-Hour days?
« Reply #42 on: December 09, 2017, 05:51:14 AM »
I work 4x10 Monday - Thursday having 3 days off is great but the down side is the 4 days I work are long and makes it hard to do anything before or after work.

It was great at first when we could skip lunch or take a 1/2 hour but the company recently mandated that everyone is required to take a 1 hour lunch so now it becomes an 11 hour day + commute so I leave home at 5:45 in the morning and get home around 6:00 PM

I have considered going back to 8 hour shifts just not sure I want to give up the 3 days off and will likely just grind it out the next 2 years until I am fully vested in my retirement and hit FIRE.

How much would it delay FIRE to reduce your hours now?
Unless you were planning on fully retiring when you hit FIRE, then what real purpose does it serve to delay living your life to its fullest now if you are still going to reach the same goal within a reasonable timeline? Or if it wonít impact your stop-work date??

The longer I live this lifestyle, the more Iím moving away from financial goals as my main motivator and the more I value the benefit of living a post-FIRE lifestyle even if I havenít reached FIRE yet.
FIRE is nice, but I donít think itís worth putting life on hold for.


MayDay

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Re: Anyone Transition to 4 10-Hour days?
« Reply #43 on: December 09, 2017, 06:29:27 AM »
I have kids who demand attention and care in the evening. I am worried with ten hours plus drive plus lunch I would be pretty dead at night. As it is I get home at 4 and it is go go go until 8 doing homework, unpacking/repacking school bags, cooking and cleaning up dinner, and doing bedtime.

In the summer we have "summer hours" which is nine hour days mon-thurs and half day Fri. That is great. I would like the schedule others mentioned with 9 hour days and every other Friday off rather than every Fri a half day. Still, I only have to take a half day of vacation to get Friday off, which is nice.

I think if I didn't have kids at home I'd be a fan of four tens.

More likely if I stay at my current employer,I'll just ask to go to four 8 hour days.
Journal:  http://forum.mrmoneymustache.com/journals/mayday's-journal/350/  featuring children, chickens (new!) and other ch words.

kimmarg

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Re: Anyone Transition to 4 10-Hour days?
« Reply #44 on: December 10, 2017, 08:29:33 PM »
Cons:

- 10hrs days + 1hr of commuting is a long day
- typically I came home ate dinner and went to sleep pretty early so Mon-Thurs were a write off
- if you are feeling bad/sick 10hrs is a long day
- I had to be strategic about what I got done early when I was fresh and what I left for end of day

Yes to these cons. I commute 1.5 hours per day, and my 10-hour days sometimes stretch into 10.5 hr days.... so it's not that unusual for me to be away from home 12 hours per day. Given that my work can be physically & mentally exhausting (veterinarian, so lots of high-stress situations and on my feet all day), I'm basically a useless zombie when I get home.  I loved working 4 10's before we had our daughter, but I find it very challenging as a parent and I'm looking at going back to a 5-day week.

I second this exactly! I worked 4-10's when I was single and just married and loved it. I had a horrible long commute so one less day of commute and I could sleep in and do chores on my extra day off. Now i have a kid, and it doesn't work. she sleeps 12 hours so if I work 10, plus commute that's 11 hours away and I hardly see her. Plus daycare is only open 10.5-11 hours depending on the day. I switched back to 8's with a kid.

Lmoot

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Re: Anyone Transition to 4 10-Hour days?
« Reply #45 on: December 11, 2017, 02:20:41 AM »
 I just switched and I love it! To be fair I haven't really gotten to experience the full pro since we have a lot of mandatory overtime, which I end up doing some on my day off. I also have a part-time job on the weekends, so I don't get three days off. 

A lot of people choose to have a three day weekend, by either taking Friday or Monday off, whereas I requested to get a Wednesday off. My boss was surprised, but happy since it was a less popular day. My coworkers asked why I wanted Wednesdays off, and I told them I don't want to work more than two days in a row, and I like the idea of having 2 Fridays every week; several of them are now considering changing their day off to Wed haha. I also like it because places are less crowded on Mon-Thurs, so running errands on Wed is a time saver.

The pros are also probably compounded by the fact that I work from home. So even on the days I work, it's 10 hours long, but I still get the feeling of freedom and flexibility.
« Last Edit: December 11, 2017, 02:22:35 AM by Lmoot »

Malkynn

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Re: Anyone Transition to 4 10-Hour days?
« Reply #46 on: December 11, 2017, 04:04:55 AM »
I just switched and I love it! To be fair I haven't really gotten to experience the full pro since we have a lot of mandatory overtime, which I end up doing some on my day off. I also have a part-time job on the weekends, so I don't get three days off. 

A lot of people choose to have a three day weekend, by either taking Friday or Monday off, whereas I requested to get a Wednesday off. My boss was surprised, but happy since it was a less popular day. My coworkers asked why I wanted Wednesdays off, and I told them I don't want to work more than two days in a row, and I like the idea of having 2 Fridays every week; several of them are now considering changing their day off to Wed haha. I also like it because places are less crowded on Mon-Thurs, so running errands on Wed is a time saver.

The pros are also probably compounded by the fact that I work from home. So even on the days I work, it's 10 hours long, but I still get the feeling of freedom and flexibility.

I often do this.
I actually alternate weeks working 3 days and 4 days and I either take Monday and Wednesday off or only one of those days. I used to always take the Monday so that I would maintain a 3 day weekend, but I definitely missed the Wednesday more because it’s so much easier to get through 2 days rather than 4.

Plus, I get so much done on the Wednesday off that the 2 day weekend feels longer and more restful.


Linda_Norway

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Re: Anyone Transition to 4 10-Hour days?
« Reply #47 on: December 11, 2017, 04:14:52 AM »
I have an elderly colleague (59) who lives a couple of hours driving from work. He works 3 very long days Mon-Wed and a shorter day on Thursday and has Friday off. He drives from home at 04:00AM on Monday and drives back on Thursday afternoon. He sleeps at work at and has dinner there as well (our company has good sleeping facilities).
It works well for him. But it does mean that his wife needs to live alone and run the household by herself during these days. I haven't heard her opinion on this.
« Last Edit: December 11, 2017, 06:32:57 AM by Linda_Norway »

FireEngineer

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Re: Anyone Transition to 4 10-Hour days?
« Reply #48 on: December 11, 2017, 06:27:52 AM »
It is common for most of my colleagues to put in 10 hours in a day. When a colleague brought up 4 10s or 9 9s, a senior manager asked, why would I give up a 10 hour day that I'm already getting.

That ruffled some feathers.

simonsez

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Re: Anyone Transition to 4 10-Hour days?
« Reply #49 on: December 11, 2017, 07:04:02 AM »
I can't do scheduled consecutive 10 hour days.  They are too draining for me.

I have a bit of flex in my schedule so if I'm really in the groove one day I will work longer (and either build up a bank of up to 24 credit hours or make other day(s) shorter) but it's just one day.  I average about 9 hours Monday to Thursday and then work a half day on Friday.  I found when I have the entire Friday off I never seem to take full advantage of it and feel like I wasted it.