Anyone else live and work in a rural (meaning REALLY rural) area?

[termetgirl]

We are rural too and I have wondered about mustachianism and rural living as well so I am glad for this thread!

We live on ten acres about 25 minutes outside city limits of a large Ontario city. Our land is zoned agricultural, and we are surrounded by about 400 or 500 acres of open fields, and beyond that it's forest. Across the dirt road is a massive apple orchard and the owner lets us pick as many apples as we want for 'keeping an eye out' for him - which we do happily.

We have enough laying hens (7) to keep us in eggs, and within the month will have our very own dairy cow. We have experience making cheese and butter, and our kids drink a lot of milk, so we will be cutting down our grocery bill by removing dairy products from it. Our land will produce enough hay for our cow.

I do have a commute, of about 35 minutes each way. But my husband and I trade working while our kids are little. Right now he is at home. I go in to my office 4 days per week. I would like to get that down to 3 by next year. I am a lawyer. We have 2 kids but want another so we will switch a couple more times before I settle into a longer term arrangement with work.

We are constantly working towards getting our expenses down to the bare minimum. Before we moved in here we did a ton of insulation and new windows, etc. trying to contain the heating costs. It's an oil furnace, but we put in an efficient wood stove so we didn't use the furnace much despite one of the coldest winters here since the 60s.

We love it here. Our kids spend so much time outside compared to our early days in a condo with no back yard. We love nothing more than sitting on our deck which my husband built, drinking morning tea, watching them swing and play among our plum and cherry trees. It's idyllic (when we forget for a moment the flies, oh the flies at some times, and the odd mole who finds his way into the house...). I am looking forward to reading more of this thread!

[MrsPete]

. On Wednesday afternoons, all businesses and government offices in the county seat are closed to let the farmers with jobs in town have a half-day midweek to catch up on chores and still get to Wednesday night church.

That was "a thing" when I was a kid, but it's kind of fallen by the wayside now. 

Something else that occurred to me about country living and transportation -- I have a 16 year old, so I'm living in this phase of life right now:

You need to teach your kid to drive.  This is a little easier in the country, where traffic isn't so hectic.  When you're ready to let him or her out on the road alone, it's a little easier to do when you know that heavy traffic isn't an issue and other drivers aren't making your learner nervous; however, the other side of that coin, they're more tempted to drive FAST on open, country roads. 

[PMG]

I've been thinking of the things I missed when I moved rural 8 years ago, and how I've adjusted.  Mostly it is access. 

Our library system here does the best with what they have, but it is pretty poor compared to where I lived previously. 

I used to clearance rack shop for clothing at nice, higher end stores.  I didn't like thrift shops because I could find everything I wanted new for near thrift prices.  There are no nice stores here and I am not willing to put the time into it when I am away on vacation, therefore I thrift shop.  I've also become more conscious of waste and how much stuff gets thrown away, so I like to think that I would have gravitated to thrift shops as a way to live responsibly.

I miss concerts and theater.  My little brothers went to see Bob Dylan recently and man that hurt not to go along.  I go to a lot of community events and music, and I am active with community theater.  That fills the gap, but it would be nice to see a big name now and then without driving 5 or 6 hours.

I live in a moist county.  They just server alcohol by the drink at a couple restaurants.  My friends and I make our own fun.  We live all over the county, the most central friend's house has become the hub.  We have a cash jar at her house that everyone contributes to, then the ones who live closest the liquor stores use it to keep us in stock.  We've even invested in some kitchen items as a group.  She is one of those people who "never cooks" and has a really pitiful kitchen... We get together and cook a big spread and enjoy the night.

I don't have kids, so I don't pay much attention to the school system.  I hear positive and negative things.  There is a community college with a couple strong programs and amazing professors, but they also have some really horrible profs and a very low completion and transfer rate. 

There is no dating scene!  There aren't places to hang out and meet people and it's a small pool to begin with. Most people my age have moved away for more options, or are already married, or have a substance abuse problem.  It's been a while since I've gone on a date and even longer since I've gone on a date that I enjoyed. 

[biscuitwhomper]

Expect to spend more on tools, implements, and other things you usually would not have in the city.   Where I live, taxes are more expensive in the unincorporated county than they are in nearby towns.      Don't expect to get any sort of broadband.   Groceries will be more expensive, although you may have access to great farm stands or your own home-grown food.

As I plan for the future, I considered moving to a mid-sized, low-tax town in an effort to save some money.    My problem is that I can't imagine living in close quarters with others anymore.    In fact, I am now considering going from 'rural' to 'desolate'.     We still have a few places in our country where it is just you, the coyotes, and the Milky Way.    The fernweh is pulling on my heartstrings.

[Nudelkopf]

I'm in a remote town, which is reasonably rural.
I'm 1800km (1100mi) from my state capital, and I'm 900km (560mi) from the closet city.
My town is 6km (~3.5mi) wide and 4km (2.5mi) across, so it makes owning a car a bit silly. Although it is in a desert, so, it's hot & has a very high UV index.

Pros
- Subsidised rent ($35/wk, with electricity included)
- Excellent options for solar electricity - we have ENDLESS sun.
- Little need to use a car (although most do use a car for every trip because of the heat/sun/laziness)
- Very easy to be social

Cons
- Very expensive to travel out of the town. It's a $300 return flight to the closet city, or $700 return to the state capital.
- You can't buy things local, a lot of the time.
- Slightly more expensive fuel (gas), and groceries.
- The library has a pretty limited range of books.
- More expensive internet, with limited broadband.
- Shittest ever member of parliament ever.

[jbow808]

I live in work in a small town in eastern Montana of about 9200, and the surrounding county has about 12000 total . Closest town with any type of commerce beside the one I live in is 75 miles away and the closest city (Billings) is over 150 miles. 

Coming from Seattle, I was in for a major shock as I was ill prepared for the bitter cold of a Montana winter (-20 F my first day in the field). After spending several hundred dollars (face-punch time) on proper clothing including gloves, socks, insulated boots, a proper winter jacket and quality long underwear - tried the thrift stores, but at 6'4" and built like an NFL line man, it's kind of had to find my size. Since I work outside, I consider them an investment.

Since moving, I find I spend less money during the week. Aside from rent ($500), groceries ($150/a tad too much, but i'm getting better) , and broadband ($45) my expenses are relatively modest in comparison to my former spending habits ($7/ day Starbucks habit). I try to keep within a $300/ month budget, less when my family moves here and we consolidate household expenses. Now I consider stopping at the local gas station on the way into work for the $2.25 coffee and doughnut special a splurge. 

While prices are a bit higher then Billings by about 5-15%, the fact that I don't spend a small fortune to commute to work (used to be between 250 and 400, depending if I had free parking) kind of makes up for the fact I can go nearly 6 weeks without filling up the Suburban (not a mmm preferred vehicle, but it's paid off) and can go home for lunch when I'm not in the field. Plus Amazon ship for free with prime, so I window shop the local Wal-Mart and buy from Amazon if the price is 10% or more cheap. 

Overall the cost of living is much cheaper for me, but I do miss some of the big city conveniences like a multiplex theater and ethnic food shop. On the plus side, I'm glad I picked up a Seattle library card before I left as I am able to download books to my kindle, since the local library has a limited selection of digital materials.

[mikefixac]

I spent my 15th summer in Maine with grandparents (45 years ago). I brought my mini bike, and did a lot of fishing and swimming. For fun, a neighbor just got his license and we'd go up and down the road hitting speeds of 100mph, of course we had the beer too. The highlight of the week was going into Campobello and eating fish and chips.

I was still bored out of my mind.

I've heard that these rural areas have big problems with illegal drugs--oxycotin and that sort of thing. I guess with not only the lonliness, but getting dark so early leaves many depressed.

[Albert]

This is an interesting thread and I really enjoyed reading it. I have to say though that the lifestyle of some of you is as far from my ideal as it could possibly be. If I were to live in US again I'd only consider places like NYC or San Francisco. Assuming of course the $$$ is appropriate.

Maybe someone should open a thread about the opposite - urban (NOT suburban) living. :)

[Rezdent]

We're on a small farm about 20 miles from a large city.  Wait, 10 miles away - city is moving towards us at an alarming pace.
Like others we find transportation the big challenge but is offset by lower operating costs.
Our 1950 farmhouse doesn't have CACH so utilities are much cheaper.  Here in central texas summer can be brutal and so urban folks don't understand the "no AC" aspect at all.
What they don't understand is that:
 1.  our house was built to take advantage of geography - unlike urban housing which mostly is built to cram as many houses as possible into a space.  The house faces SE with lots of windows to catch summer breezes, and
2.  You acclimate to the environment you're in.  We find AC in buildings to be too cold in summer and too hot in winter.
The house definitely gets dirtier faster than urban houses with dust coming in through the windows and dirt on shoes (no sidewalks or pavement).
We do grow a lot of our own food plus sell eggs, sheep, pigs, etc.   This makes it more difficult to pin down our true food costs.  Example: we don't buy eggs.  We do buy chicken feed.  But we sell a variable number of eggs each week.  Egg sales more than cover the cost of the feed most weeks.  Plus we eat some chicken.  Eggs that are odd or unsold/uneaten go to the pigs.  We eat pork but we also sell pigs - meaning some chicken food actually goes to pig food.. Untangling how much eggs and pork cost us has eluded me.  Anyone got a good formula for estimating this?

[ender]

We do grow a lot of our own food plus sell eggs, sheep, pigs, etc.   This makes it more difficult to pin down our true food costs.  Example: we don't buy eggs.  We do buy chicken feed.  But we sell a variable number of eggs each week.  Egg sales more than cover the cost of the feed most weeks.  Plus we eat some chicken.  Eggs that are odd or unsold/uneaten go to the pigs.  We eat pork but we also sell pigs - meaning some chicken food actually goes to pig food.. Untangling how much eggs and pork cost us has eluded me.  Anyone got a good formula for estimating this?

Can't you just keep track of all "pork/eggs" related expenses and income over the course of a year?

Setup a google doc or spreadsheet or something.

[rocksinmyhead]

Our 1950 farmhouse doesn't have CACH so utilities are much cheaper.  Here in central texas summer can be brutal and so urban folks don't understand the "no AC" aspect at all.

yeah, holy shit! I am incredibly impressed with you, haha. I guess if you had a lot of windows facing the right way, that would definitely help. but still... I'm a transplant to Oklahoma and when I was looking for a place to live, all my friends here said "MAKE SURE IT HAS CENTRAL AC." this was foreign to me because living in MN and PA I haven't had air conditioning since I moved out of my parents' house... but OMG I would be dying here in the summer without it!

[mbl]

The highest holy holiday we have is the first Monday after Thanksgiving. AKA, opening day of buck season. Don't count on getting anything productive done that day, since you may be the only human not sitting in the woods with a rifle on your lap.

    The first Monday after Thanksgiving?   If you're not in one of the New England states are you in New York?    Buck season is a big deal in almost every county in the state that has hunting.   In actuality, there is a lot of happiness at the start of bow season which begins in approximately at the beginning of October.  Regular deer hunting begins about a week before Thanksgiving.

Locals here tolerate move-ins way better than the locals in the New England states do. That said, if you have a "nails on the chalk board", or  "stand the hairs on the back of my neck", NYC accent, you are probably a few decades, and a lot of effort away from being "one of the boys". If you have an attitude, or don't pay the locals promptly, and in cash, well.....you're pretty well screwed.

I suspect that many rural communities have had to keep a more open mind as new people move in and as they tend to spend....$money$....that tends to ease the transition.  Many that "move in" as it were have vacation homes and and are only there seasonally or on weekends.      The rub often is that this demand for vacation property can drive up the cost for locals and cause resentment.   On the other hand, the increase in tax revenues is attractive to  village/town/  county tax coffers.

The annual fair is serious business, and the demo. derby is right up there with Nascar.  Doesn't matter if your Rhubarb pie won a prize, or if if you took 1st place in the Mini-Van demo. You are definitely somebody.

There is an active Bald Eagle nest two blocks from our place, enough Whitetails in the area that they are often referred to as "forest rats", and twice in my life, my dog decided that nothing motivates your ass back into the house like a nose to nose meeting with a Black Bear in the yard.

There are a number of eagles that currently nest at the southern end of Canandaigua lake....can get a good look when out on the canoe.  Coyotes, bobcats,  bear, moose,  it's a regular wild kingdom.  :)

There are more efficient ways of living, and as MMM rants, it's easy to get way too wrapped up in owning "Clown cars" and spending way to much for their careand feeding, but in many ways it's dramatically cheaper, and far less stressful  that city life.


Yup, to each his own.  But I wouldn't trade country life for city life.   Grew up in NYC and lived in California for a few years as well as Atlanta and Europe.    Love it in upstate NY.

[Rezdent]

We do grow a lot of our own food plus sell eggs, sheep, pigs, etc.   This makes it more difficult to pin down our true food costs.  Example: we don't buy eggs.  We do buy chicken feed.  But we sell a variable number of eggs each week.  Egg sales more than cover the cost of the feed most weeks.  Plus we eat some chicken.  Eggs that are odd or unsold/uneaten go to the pigs.  We eat pork but we also sell pigs - meaning some chicken food actually goes to pig food.. Untangling how much eggs and pork cost us has eluded me.  Anyone got a good formula for estimating this?

Can't you just keep track of all "pork/eggs" related expenses and income over the course of a year?

Setup a google doc or spreadsheet or something.

Geek warning:  word problem ahead.  We do accounting on it for pigs and poultry.  I am trying to get a true number for what we spend per month on food.  The chickens are free range plus we buy chicken food.  They produce eggs, some of which aren't of a quality to sell.  Some of them we eat.  Those eggs go to feeder pigs.  Most of the pigs are sold.  I get that we deduct the "cost" of the pig we hold back for ourselves.  We should consider cost of those eggs from pig expenses/pig profits. We should count eggs eaten in our food cost. I don't account for our labor as an expense but do for feed and equipment.  At some point the value of trying to track these outweighs the benefit.  I still want to know what we spend on food per month.

[87tweetybirds]

I grew up in a rural area(2 miles to the closest gas station, 15 miles to the middle and high schools, and 60+ miles to the nearest walmart). My hubby is going to school, but I hope we can FIRE there or maybe even be able to make it work while heading toward FI. My parents still live there. My mom-a nurse- works at the critical access hospital. It's a lot of stabilize and helicopter to the bigger hospitals in the area. She works two or three 12 hour shifts a week, with a commute of 15 miles one way. My dad is a farmer and the house is built on the farm. I grew up canning, drying and otherwise storing the food grown in the garden, butchering chickens every other year, and helping with the farm, milking, driving farm equipment etc. I'll agree it is certainly a lot easier to decrease spending when there's no where to spend. As far as food costs go my mom is the queen of buying in bulk. She finds sales on foods she already would buy and buys by the case when on sale. She makes her own bread to avoid the $3.50 a loaf problem and on her way home from work she stops by the grocery store to pick up the expiring/expired fruits and veggies to supplement the chicken's diet. They used to have pigs, and if the price of pork raises to where per pound it becomes cheaper they'll have them again. They don't travel out of their little community often, but when they do its an all day trip(3hours driving plus hours of all the errands accumulated over months). It's a close community, so a quite a bit of sharing of surplus resources(ie I've got a lot of -produce- on my tree/garden would you be interested in some-name that produce). Oh and it's a dairy farm so fresh milk all the time and beef in bulk. 
I'm mostly wanting to move back to 1. Be closer to aging parents(they are in their 50s, and I suppose could retire but dad says "then what would I do all day?" And 2. Be in a close community where I could let my kids outside to be creative and play.

[Gin1984]

I would like to know how these areas take outsider, especially outsiders who are minorities or do not practice Christianity.  You hear rumors, but I wondered if any of them are close to fact or if they are completely false? 

[Gin1984]

I would like to know how these areas take outsider, especially outsiders who are minorities or do not practice Christianity.  You hear rumors, but I wondered if any of them are close to fact or if they are completely false?

Where I grew up (rural, school of K-12 had less than 500 kids, closest Walmart was 30 miles way) outsiders where fine, minorities were basically fine as long as they didn't act too much like the bad stereotypes. I was raised Atheist and never had too many problems, even when I explored Paganism. I did learn to basically keep my mouth shut on the subject because it's easier but more because I'm an extreme introvert that doesn't like talking to people in general than because I got a lot of crap. Even LGBT didn't get hassled too much (and this was 10 years ago before acceptance really started gaining popularity)

Define please.  We are raising our daughter bilingual in Spanish, would that be an issue?  LOL, you got the religion in one, I am pagan.

[Gin1984]

I would like to know how these areas take outsider, especially outsiders who are minorities or do not practice Christianity.  You hear rumors, but I wondered if any of them are close to fact or if they are completely false?

Where I grew up (rural, school of K-12 had less than 500 kids, closest Walmart was 30 miles way) outsiders where fine, minorities were basically fine as long as they didn't act too much like the bad stereotypes. I was raised Atheist and never had too many problems, even when I explored Paganism. I did learn to basically keep my mouth shut on the subject because it's easier but more because I'm an extreme introvert that doesn't like talking to people in general than because I got a lot of crap. Even LGBT didn't get hassled too much (and this was 10 years ago before acceptance really started gaining popularity)

Define please.  We are raising our daughter bilingual in Spanish, would that be an issue?  LOL, you got the religion in one, I am pagan.

I mean like overly ghetto blacks that drive old boaty cars with 40" spinners with systems that you can feel as much as hear. Hispanics that drive small 80's-90's Hondas with the tiny wheels that stick out the side blaring mariachi music and never learn any English. I grew up in Indiana which I call "The Land of the Stereotypes" because unfortunately too many people out there portray all the parts of racial stereotypes that suck, which include the redneck/white trash that wear coveralls and wifebeaters, with 6 kids from 5 different (wo)men with 8 cars in the yard where only one runs and but barely.

I had neighbors growing up that were half black, and while the Dad was batshit crazy (luckily he was never around...not quite sure of the story), the kids were just normal kids and had no issues

Being bilingual, perfectly fine. Being Pagan...might be best to keep it kinda on the DL but as long as you're not sacrificing chickens you're still probably okay :) I think people at our high school thought it was weirder that my sister didn't attend graduation as the valedictorian than that she was Atheist

I had a friend's mother who thought because I was Pagan I wanted to sacrifice everyone (including her daughter) to Satan and did not want my friend to hang out with me (I did not know this till later).  She changed her mind because she brought her puppy around and I was all excited to play with the puppy (sweetest little dog ever and I love dogs).  She then decided I was confused and it was a phase.  Then again she thinks her daughter being gay is a phase so I guess it works.  :P
I was more concerned about gay bashing, not being able to participate in town, our daughter being treated badly, and so on.

[Jamesqf]

I would like to know how these areas take outsider, especially outsiders who are minorities or do not practice Christianity.  You hear rumors, but I wondered if any of them are close to fact or if they are completely false?

Second most of what previous posters have said, just want to add that it can vary a lot depending on what region of the country you're looking at, and sometimes particular communities.  Much of the Northeast and West still has a fairly libertarian "mind your own business unless they're doing it in the streets and scaring the horses" attitude.  Midwest and South seems (from this distance: I've never spent much time there) much more overtly conservative Christian.  As I think someone said on another thread, people there ask which church you attend, rather than whether.

[mbl]

I would like to know how these areas take outsider, especially outsiders who are minorities or do not practice Christianity.  You hear rumors, but I wondered if any of them are close to fact or if they are completely false?

Where I grew up (rural, school of K-12 had less than 500 kids, closest Walmart was 30 miles way) outsiders where fine, minorities were basically fine as long as they didn't act too much like the bad stereotypes. I was raised Atheist and never had too many problems, even when I explored Paganism. I did learn to basically keep my mouth shut on the subject because it's easier but more because I'm an extreme introvert that doesn't like talking to people in general than because I got a lot of crap. Even LGBT didn't get hassled too much (and this was 10 years ago before acceptance really started gaining popularity)

Define please.  We are raising our daughter bilingual in Spanish, would that be an issue?  LOL, you got the religion in one, I am pagan.

I mean like overly ghetto blacks that drive old boaty cars with 40" spinners with systems that you can feel as much as hear. Hispanics that drive small 80's-90's Hondas with the tiny wheels that stick out the side blaring mariachi music and never learn any English. I grew up in Indiana which I call "The Land of the Stereotypes" because unfortunately too many people out there portray all the parts of racial stereotypes that suck, which include the redneck/white trash that wear coveralls and wifebeaters, with 6 kids from 5 different (wo)men with 8 cars in the yard where only one runs and but barely.

I had neighbors growing up that were half black, and while the Dad was batshit crazy (luckily he was never around...not quite sure of the story), the kids were just normal kids and had no issues

Being bilingual, perfectly fine. Being Pagan...might be best to keep it kinda on the DL but as long as you're not sacrificing chickens you're still probably okay :) I think people at our high school thought it was weirder that my sister didn't attend graduation as the valedictorian than that she was Atheist

I had a friend's mother who thought because I was Pagan I wanted to sacrifice everyone (including her daughter) to Satan and did not want my friend to hang out with me (I did not know this till later).  She changed her mind because she brought her puppy around and I was all excited to play with the puppy (sweetest little dog ever and I love dogs).  She then decided I was confused and it was a phase.  Then again she thinks her daughter being gay is a phase so I guess it works.  :P
I was more concerned about gay bashing, not being able to participate in town, our daughter being treated badly, and so on.

There are nasty people wherever you go. 

Why would you think that your kid would be treated badly?  Based on what?
Where I live in a very rural part of upstate NY,  there are a good number of Spanish speaking kids in the school system during the Fall and Spring.  These are the children of migrant and permanent farm workers.  Most speak English pretty well and do just fine in school.   They are a part of this community.   And for what it's worth, without their parents doing the crop work they do, we wouldn't have a lot of the produce we eat.  There aren't a lot of US nationals that are anxious to do field work.

Not everyone is going to share your view of the world.   They key is to find some common ground if you want to engage or befriend people in a community.
This is true anywhere you go.   If you start out with an attitude that somehow these people are ignorant or perhaps "less wordly" than you,  well, you'll reap what you sow.

[aj_yooper]

Good thread!  I grew up in the Upper Peninsula of Michigan, but we are in a smallish town now, not so bad.

[Gin1984]

I would like to know how these areas take outsider, especially outsiders who are minorities or do not practice Christianity.  You hear rumors, but I wondered if any of them are close to fact or if they are completely false?

Where I grew up (rural, school of K-12 had less than 500 kids, closest Walmart was 30 miles way) outsiders where fine, minorities were basically fine as long as they didn't act too much like the bad stereotypes. I was raised Atheist and never had too many problems, even when I explored Paganism. I did learn to basically keep my mouth shut on the subject because it's easier but more because I'm an extreme introvert that doesn't like talking to people in general than because I got a lot of crap. Even LGBT didn't get hassled too much (and this was 10 years ago before acceptance really started gaining popularity)

Define please.  We are raising our daughter bilingual in Spanish, would that be an issue?  LOL, you got the religion in one, I am pagan.

I mean like overly ghetto blacks that drive old boaty cars with 40" spinners with systems that you can feel as much as hear. Hispanics that drive small 80's-90's Hondas with the tiny wheels that stick out the side blaring mariachi music and never learn any English. I grew up in Indiana which I call "The Land of the Stereotypes" because unfortunately too many people out there portray all the parts of racial stereotypes that suck, which include the redneck/white trash that wear coveralls and wifebeaters, with 6 kids from 5 different (wo)men with 8 cars in the yard where only one runs and but barely.

I had neighbors growing up that were half black, and while the Dad was batshit crazy (luckily he was never around...not quite sure of the story), the kids were just normal kids and had no issues

Being bilingual, perfectly fine. Being Pagan...might be best to keep it kinda on the DL but as long as you're not sacrificing chickens you're still probably okay :) I think people at our high school thought it was weirder that my sister didn't attend graduation as the valedictorian than that she was Atheist

I had a friend's mother who thought because I was Pagan I wanted to sacrifice everyone (including her daughter) to Satan and did not want my friend to hang out with me (I did not know this till later).  She changed her mind because she brought her puppy around and I was all excited to play with the puppy (sweetest little dog ever and I love dogs).  She then decided I was confused and it was a phase.  Then again she thinks her daughter being gay is a phase so I guess it works.  :P
I was more concerned about gay bashing, not being able to participate in town, our daughter being treated badly, and so on.

There are nasty people wherever you go. 

Why would you think that your kid would be treated badly?  Based on what?
Where I live in a very rural part of upstate NY,  there are a good number of Spanish speaking kids in the school system during the Fall and Spring.  These are the children of migrant and permanent farm workers.  Most speak English pretty well and do just fine in school.   They are a part of this community.   And for what it's worth, without their parents doing the crop work they do, we wouldn't have a lot of the produce we eat.  There aren't a lot of US nationals that are anxious to do field work.

Not everyone is going to share your view of the world.   They key is to find some common ground if you want to engage or befriend people in a community.
This is true anywhere you go.   If you start out with an attitude that somehow these people are ignorant or perhaps "less wordly" than you,  well, you'll reap what you sow.

Yes, but I am on pagan forums and there have been major issues in the south for some pagans.  Being beaten for your religion is never a situation where you reap what you sow. I know my husband's family had issues getting an apartment in TN based on their race (they were told there were no available apartments) but when he called (and has no accent), there were.  Things like that.  So, since I have never lived in a rural area, but my husband was told to avoid those, again in the South, as a minority, I thought I would get some info here.

[mbl]

No one can possibly tell you what your experience will absolutely be.
I can only speak for the area that I live in.  And that's JMHO...

If you believe that you or your family will be beaten or abused for who you are then you'd have to make a choice based on what you perceive.
If you have fear based on your beliefs I would ask what is of ultimate importance to you?    I'd think that you'd choose a place to live based on your value system.
Are there communities where you could live with like minded people?

Anecdotal information is just that...an instance of something.   Doesn't mean that it will happen to you.

[Gin1984]

No one can possibly tell you what your experience will absolutely be.
I can only speak for the area that I live in.  And that's JMHO...

If you believe that you or your family will be beaten or abused for who you are then you'd have to make a choice based on what you perceive.
If have fear based on your beliefs I would ask what is of ultimate importance to you?    I'd think that you'd choose a place to live based on your value system.
Are there communities where you could live with like minded people?

Anecdotal information is just that...an instance of something.   Doesn't mean that it will happen to you.

Of course it is all anecdotal, but I thought I would get more anecdotal info since I had the opportunity.  I don't understand the bolded question.  It may be that people mentioned the bad, and since this was a pro-area talk, I thought I might get info that I may not get otherwise.  I do have these concerns, but since "rural" is such a large area, I might find a great place I never thought of, by asking.  I just thought, no harm in asking.

[mbl]

Your original question had a nasty tone to it.   As if somehow those who are Christians and of a certain color have discriminatory tendencies.

You ask about rumors?   About a nation of millions of people?   With almost infinite choices for rural living.

Yes, there is potential to be discriminated against.    There's also great potential to meet and get to know people who have very different experiences and values than you.   You have to take the risk.     You won't know how you'll be accepted into any community until you go there and live.   
What will you have to offer being a new member of a community?   Why would anyone want to befriend you? 

 
Sometimes people don't like others because they're jerks...not because they speak another language, worship differently or have another colour skin.

[Gin1984]

Your original question had a nasty tone to it.   As if somehow those who are Christians and of a certain color have discriminatory tendencies.

You ask about rumors?   About a nation of millions of people?   With almost infinite choices for rural living.

Yes, there is potential to be discriminated against.    There's also great potential to meet and get to know people who have very different experiences and values than you.   You have to take the risk.     You won't know how you'll be accepted into any community until you go there and live.   
What will you have to offer being a new member of a community?   Why would anyone want to befriend you? 

 
Sometimes people don't like others because they're jerks...not because they speak another language, worship differently or have another colour skin.

Maigahane seemed to know exactly what I was talking about and had no problem answering my questions, for her/his area.  I am not sure why YOU took offense. 

[Rural]

Your original question had a nasty tone to it.   As if somehow those who are Christians and of a certain color have discriminatory tendencies.

You'll find some problems, probably especially in the very rural deep South, places like where I live. Sorry, folks, it's just true, and she needs to know because it will affect her and her family and their lives or livelihood intimately.


When we first moved to this area, we moved into a rental house that was available only through word-of-mouth. We heard about it because my husband is from here, but not advertising meant that it wasn't subject to the Equal housing laws. Almost every place here that is rented, and that isn't an old rundown mobile home, is rented exactly this way. Now, probably not all of them are done that way to avoid the equal housing laws; probably some are done that way because it's become an expectation in the area. But there's a reason why it happened in the first place so that it became the expectation.


People have just about quit asking me where I go to church. But the question is where. No one would "insult "a person by asking whether. (We don't.) Mostly, I believe people have quit asking because I've now been here long enough that they're embarrassed; they think they should probably know by now.


I've never had any trouble over it whatsoever. But, then, I'm not a child. I don't attend school, and I don't spend nearly as much time in this community As i used to. I am something of a pillar of the community, ironically enough, as I chair one of the major local charities. That probably helps, too.


The upshot? It's getting better. These problems are getting better everywhere. But, in many places, they are still present, and getting offended when people ask about them doesn't make them go away any faster.

[paddedhat]

We ran into an interesting subset of the "is race or religion an issue" question. I spent many years volunteering on native reservations in a very rural western state. We had given some serious thought to retiring to the area, and got to know a handful of local folks.  Mostly white, successful business owners, and very committed to the community by virtue of birth, and/or massive investment in it. The spefic area, BTW would not be in a desperately poor reservation, but in another part of the state that's a highly desirable vacation and retirement destination. The issue we ran into was not religion. We are not active Christians, and were never asked about it. In fact, statistics indicate that the town we focused on has a much lower percentage of active church goers when compared to our home turf of the northeast.

The issue was the obsessive, "God, guns and Guts" mentality. They are not shy about expressing that the only truth is whatever Fox News has to say about an issue. The country is in moral collapse, and the coast will be first to go, and if you don't carry a gun, hate you government and want to see the end of the socialist overlord illegally occupying the White House, you don't belong.  Now, all of this gets discussed on the down low, once they thing that you are a suitable candidate for being a friend and neighbor, but it's all pretty shocking to deal with, and not how I want to live my life. When you see the Clive Bundy and Western Colorado secessionists in the media, and think "look at these kooks" it's a bit shocking to discover that, once you peek behind the curtain, they have got a lot of quiet backers. 

[Gin1984]

We ran into an interesting subset of the "is race or religion an issue" question. I spent many years volunteering on native reservations in a very rural western state. We had given some serious thought to retiring to the area, and got to know a handful of local folks.  Mostly white, successful business owners, and very committed to the community by virtue of birth, and/or massive investment in it. The spefic area, BTW would not be in a desperately poor reservation, but in another part of the state that's a highly desirable vacation and retirement destination. The issue we ran into was not religion. We are not active Christians, and were never asked about it. In fact, statistics indicate that the town we focused on has a much lower percentage of active church goers when compared to our home turf of the northeast.

The issue was the obsessive, "God, guns and Guts" mentality. They are not shy about expressing that the only truth is whatever Fox News has to say about an issue. The country is in moral collapse, and the coast will be first to go, and if you don't carry a gun, hate you government and want to see the end of the socialist overlord illegally occupying the White House, you don't belong.  Now, all of this gets discussed on the down low, once they thing that you are a suitable candidate for being a friend and neighbor, but it's all pretty shocking to deal with, and not how I want to live my life. When you see the Clive Bundy and Western Colorado secessionists in the media, and think "look at these kooks" it's a bit shocking to discover that, once you peek behind the curtain, they have got a lot of quiet backers.

Good to know.

[Argyle]

In the rural community I know best, church is a community mechanism as much as a religious institution.  "Which church do you go to?" means "Which community are you in?"  Now, the fact that community is church-based has its predictable objectionable side, like why should you have to show your religious affiliation publicly, etc.  That said, you'll find a number of people in church who don't believe in much or any of the church beliefs.  They won't say so publicly, but they'll say so privately.  And small-town social life is indeed organized around church in many instances.  If you're not too averse, you might look for a place that has a Unitarian church, a Quaker meeting, or one of the more liberal denominations.  They often enfold people who would be simply atheists/pagans/non-churchgoers in less rural settings.  And they do provide a strong community.

[Gin1984]

In the rural community I know best, church is a community mechanism as much as a religious institution.  "Which church do you go to?" means "Which community are you in?"  Now, the fact that community is church-based has its predictable objectionable side, like why should you have to show your religious affiliation publicly, etc.  That said, you'll find a number of people in church who don't believe in much or any of the church beliefs.  They won't say so publicly, but they'll say so privately.  And small-town social life is indeed organized around church in many instances.  If you're not too averse, you might look for a place that has a Unitarian church, a Quaker meeting, or one of the more liberal denominations.  They often enfold people who would be simply atheists/pagans/non-churchgoers in less rural settings.  And they do provide a strong community.

That is a few good idea, thanks!

[Mr. Frugalwoods]

If you are concerned about uber-conservative rural neighbors, you should take a look at New England. 

I've often said that Vermont is basically Kansas except with mountains and socialists.

I've lived in the midwest and south, both rural and urban.  If I was black or gay would I choose to live in the rural south?  No chance in hell for the places I've lived.  They were full of folks who were extremely nice as long as you are white, Christian, and listen to Rush Limbaugh.  Nothing broke my heart more than to hear the guy helping me change a tire in a rainstorm in waaaay rural Kansas go on and on about how Hispanics (though he used a much more offensive word) were ruining our country.  He also invited me to church.

Vermont has it's own quirks and certainly has conservative folk in it... but also has plenty of back to the earth hippies.  As long as you don't mind some pot smoke and the smell of home fermentation you'll be fine.

[sweetproserpina]

Great topic!

We rent rurally now, but plan to buy a house in town, build up some equity and enjoy "town life" for a couple years before building our farmstead  and moving the family out there for the long term. We'll keep the town home as a rental. We run our own business from home so location is not an issue. As long as we have internet and a post office relatively close, we're good work-wise.

We love the country lifestyle, the privacy and nature- and definitely want to raise our kids mostly out there. I always joke about my happy, 'free-range' kids.

Rural public schools may not have all the options big city schools have- but as parents we can totally supplement their education! There are so many online options now for language learning, music, and other rare subjects that I don't think my kiddos will be deprived. And because we'll be mostly retired by the time they are old enough to start getting bored as teens, that's when we really start to travel the world, take them on big city trips etc. I have a friend who 'supplements' her teens' education by sending them on all sorts of cool experiences from deckhands on tall ships, to working at an auto body shop (daughter requested), to getting provincial museum/gallery memberships every year and going into the city for all the big exhibitions. Totally do-able, I think.

Btw, when we go rural for keeps, we plan to go off-grid, and build strawbale, so our housing related costs are almost nil after retirement :)

[MelodysMustache]

Love this thread!

I am thinking about a retirement away from the city.  Not out in the sticks, but five acres 20 minutes outside a medium size town (10-40k population) sounds about right.  I spent a part of my childhood in a similar place and it was nice.  Would love to have a large garden, chickens, etc.  I'm a loner by nature so not being on top of neighbors appeals as well.

The social aspect is somewhat concerning.  I'm a typical west coast liberal, and fox news rubs me the wrong way.  There are some towns where there have been an influx of people from the coast and arts communities taking root that sounds really nice.  I can buy a truck, own a gun, and adapt some to local ways, but I will always be at my core a liberal.

[Latwell]

Rural dweller here.

I live in a town where buses and trains are only known about through fairytales, haha. Seriously though, the first time I rode a bus was the school bus in high school. There's a cargo railroad behind my parent's home, so I've seen trains. But I'm still in awe when I see a passenger train.

I actually prefer living as far away from stores as possible. It means when I do go to stores, I make my trip count. Plus is keeps my boyfriend and I away from making a million trips to the "convenience"(which should be re-named Rip-off) stores. (my significant other use to have a bad habit of going to these stores every time he wanted a single drink... $2 per drink... plus then he'll snag a snack while he's in there -- drove me insane, that's for sure).