2023 Chevy Bolt

[jrhampt]

"For some electric vehicle owners, recharging now more costly than filling up"
https://www.cbsnews.com/news/electric-car-2023-costs-gas-vehicles/

This dynamic calls into question whether EVs will ever achieve mass adoption. It appears a new electrical grid with new, low-cost energy sources is a prerequisite to EVs being economical. The people with high rates in New England mentioned in the article are swimming against the economic current.

Yes, I mentioned this in another EV thread...our electric rates basically doubled all at once under Eversource, effective in January.  We do have solar and a heat pump, but my house is so small that we have limited roof space for solar and would not be able to get enough solar to power and electric vehicle.  For now I'm sticking with my elderly prius, since I don't drive much anyway.

[GilesMM]

Why would anyone want an EV from the company that has been working the hardest to prevent them from becoming a thing? Links: 1, 2, 3, 4, 5. Oh yeah, and the wheels literally fall off on their current EV: 1, 2.

Toyota has been dragged kicking and screaming into the EV era and as a result they are extremely far behind compared to the competition. What Hyundai/Kia are already building today is significantly more advanced than what Toyota was planning for their next generation of EVs.

Toyota doesn't rush into the newest fad - they are slow and methodical.   You could argue they are behind or that they are wisely waiting to see where the EV market goes. Let's see what their first in-house EV intended for mass production looks like.


Oh, and I didn't see any reports of wheels falling off - just a safety recall.

[RWD]

Why would anyone want an EV from the company that has been working the hardest to prevent them from becoming a thing? Links: 1, 2, 3, 4, 5. Oh yeah, and the wheels literally fall off on their current EV: 1, 2.

Toyota has been dragged kicking and screaming into the EV era and as a result they are extremely far behind compared to the competition. What Hyundai/Kia are already building today is significantly more advanced than what Toyota was planning for their next generation of EVs.

Toyota doesn't rush into the newest fad - they are slow and methodical.   You could argue they are behind or that they are wisely waiting to see where the EV market goes. Let's see what their first in-house EV intended for mass production looks like.


Oh, and I didn't see any reports of wheels falling off - just a safety recall.

Well Toyota themselves believe they have fallen behind as their CEO resigned and was replaced with someone that will actually focus on EVs. Probably too little too late.

[TreeLeaf]

Why would anyone want an EV from the company that has been working the hardest to prevent them from becoming a thing? Links: 1, 2, 3, 4, 5. Oh yeah, and the wheels literally fall off on their current EV: 1, 2.

Toyota has been dragged kicking and screaming into the EV era and as a result they are extremely far behind compared to the competition. What Hyundai/Kia are already building today is significantly more advanced than what Toyota was planning for their next generation of EVs.

Toyota doesn't rush into the newest fad - they are slow and methodical.   You could argue they are behind or that they are wisely waiting to see where the EV market goes. Let's see what their first in-house EV intended for mass production looks like.


Oh, and I didn't see any reports of wheels falling off - just a safety recall.

Yes - Toyota tends to be very safe, reliable, predictable, and boring - just like their vehicles.

I assume they are waiting for the technology to mature enough that they can use a battery that will retain 80% charge capacity after 20 years in a safe manner, or something similar. lfp batteries and CATL sodium batteries can hit these numbers, on paper anyway, so I expect Toyota to start making some major EV moves in the next year or two.

[Paper Chaser]

It's not just a Toyota specific thing. Japanese companies overall have chosen to eschew heavy investment into full BEVs and have prioritized hydrogen instead. This is inline with their national strategy:

https://www.japan.go.jp/tomodachi/2017/spring-summer2017/creating_a_hydrogen_society.html

S. Korea has a similar national strategy, but Hyundai/Kia have been heavily investing into BEVs as well as hydrogen so as not to be caught without product to sell in markets where BEVs have more support than hydrogen.

Globally, SE Asia, and India are the markets that have focused on hydrogen the most, so you don't see a bunch of EVs coming from these markets. China and Europe are a bit of a mixed bag. North America currently has much less government support for hydrogen, and almost zero infrastructure, so BEV's are what we get.

None of that is particularly relevant to the Bolt being a good BEV for a very good price however.

[GuitarStv]

Yes - Toyota tends to be very safe, reliable, predictable, and boring - just like their vehicles.

You say that like it's a bad thing!  A vehicle is a way to transport yourself from place to place.  Safety, reliability, predictability - these should all be pretty high on the list of important stuff to anyone looking to do just that.  Since a vehicle isn't entertainment, boring/exciting is really irrelevant.

[TreeLeaf]

Yes - Toyota tends to be very safe, reliable, predictable, and boring - just like their vehicles.

You say that like it's a bad thing!  A vehicle is a way to transport yourself from place to place.  Safety, reliability, predictability - these should all be pretty high on the list of important stuff to anyone looking to do just that.  Since a vehicle isn't entertainment, boring/exciting is really irrelevant.

Oops - I forgot the smiley face. I should mention also that I have only owned Toyota vehicles for the past 10 years now. 😀

[MMMarbleheader]

We have a 2012 Mazda5 with 170k miles and a 2006 Scion XA with 115k miles on it.

The Scion is my commute to work car. Its standard, gets close to 40mpg, and I hope it lives forever. Surprisingly comfortable with and way better quality than the same type cars in its price point (Nissan, Hyundai) 

The Mazada5 is my wife's daily driver for hauling kids and our roadtrip car. Its a great car but not quite as solid as the Scion. Reminds me more of the old Nissan. We have ongoing searches saved to try and find one with less than 100k miles but there arent really any out there since they stopped making them in 2015. Big decision this summer is whether to invest in new snow tires for the Mazda5. Though its not AWD we put Nokian studded tires on it and it beasts through anything you can throw at it.

One idea I had was to keep the Mazda as an occasional driver and get a Bolt but thats risky because if the Mazda dies we probably cant get by with the Scion and Bolt when we need to extra space to haul things. I have never had an American car and I am apprehensive but maybe the Maverick will turn out to be more reliable.

We have also looked into the Ford Maverick with a cap as a Mazda5 replacement. Most dimensions seem very similar plus the MPGs would be better.

I think I am going to roll the dice and get the new snow tires and ride the Mazda out until a low milage Mazda5 shows up or Toyota unveils the new 2024 Tacoma with a hybrid option. I wish the Sienna was cheaper but that is probably an option as well.

[jrhampt]

Yes - Toyota tends to be very safe, reliable, predictable, and boring - just like their vehicles.

You say that like it's a bad thing!  A vehicle is a way to transport yourself from place to place.  Safety, reliability, predictability - these should all be pretty high on the list of important stuff to anyone looking to do just that.  Since a vehicle isn't entertainment, boring/exciting is really irrelevant.

Oops - I forgot the smiley face. I should mention also that I have only owned Toyota vehicles for the past 10 years now. 😀

haha!  yes, I also find safety, reliability, and predictability pretty exciting.  If more people picked both their spouses and their cars based on those criteria, they would be better off.  I am also a big Toyota fan.  My parents are still driving my old 2001 Toyota Echo...that was a great little car.

[Villanelle]

I wonder if toyota's approach is colored in part by the Japanese market.  Obviously, they are a major international company, but I struggle to see how EVs are going to integrate seamlessly into Japan, where most people don't have a garage.

Yes - Toyota tends to be very safe, reliable, predictable, and boring - just like their vehicles.

You say that like it's a bad thing!  A vehicle is a way to transport yourself from place to place.  Safety, reliability, predictability - these should all be pretty high on the list of important stuff to anyone looking to do just that.  Since a vehicle isn't entertainment, boring/exciting is really irrelevant.

Oops - I forgot the smiley face. I should mention also that I have only owned Toyota vehicles for the past 10 years now. 😀

haha!  yes, I also find safety, reliability, and predictability pretty exciting.  If more people picked both their spouses and their cars based on those criteria, they would be better off.  I am also a big Toyota fan.  My parents are still driving my old 2001 Toyota Echo...that was a great little car.

I sold my 2000 Toyota Echo (with 8x,000 miles) in 2019, and I still miss that car.  Things were starting to go wrong with pieces like the seat belt retractors and other non-critical parts, and we were downgrading (well, upgrading!, I suppose) from 2 cars to 1 and my DH wanted something slightly larger than the Echo.  But I still miss that car!

[Just Joe]

Why a Leaf over a Bolt? It's more money for less car on an older platform...

I agree if the Leaf costs more to purchase but if the Leaf is cheaper lightly used (aka 15K mi) why not do it?

Might be an older platform but if the car's basic features work just as well then I don't care if the platform is 10+ years old or 3 years old.

[VanillaGorilla]

Why a Leaf over a Bolt? It's more money for less car on an older platform...

I agree if the Leaf costs more to purchase but if the Leaf is cheaper lightly used (aka 15K mi) why not do it?

Might be an older platform but if the car's basic features work just as well then I don't care if the platform is 10+ years old or 3 years old.

Several of my friends have owned Leaves. Their battery degradation is just atrocious. I would never consider one.

[Just Joe]

Different Leaf years are different. The smaller batteries (75 mile range) get deep cycled for just about every use. L3 charging hurts too.

The current versions with bigger ranges seem to be aging better. We have several recent models ('19-'21) at work with 30K-40K miles that are aging slowly and gracefully. There are more on the web that report slow degradation curves.

I need to revisit the aging charts I saw once.

No doubt a 2023 battery design will age better but if I person really isn't dipping into the range too deeply - living on an island - a Leaf might still be something that would last 15+ years. Its warranted for 8 years and 100K.

[Just Joe]

Why a Leaf over a Bolt? It's more money for less car on an older platform...

I agree if the Leaf costs more to purchase but if the Leaf is cheaper lightly used (aka 15K mi) why not do it?

Might be an older platform but if the car's basic features work just as well then I don't care if the platform is 10+ years old or 3 years old.

Several of my friends have owned Leaves. Their battery degradation is just atrocious. I would never consider one.

https://tflcar.com/2020/06/ev-battery-degradation-news/

If I was buying an EV for real I'd be combing the internet for stats for a while.

[englishteacheralex]

I can't remember if I updated here, but we bought a 2020 Leaf. Our 2007 Prius battery crapped the bed three times this year and we rely on it heavily for my and the kids' commute. I spent about a week trying to buy a 2023 Chevy Bolt on Oahu and it just wasn't going to work in the short time frame that we needed to buy a car. I couldn't even find a used Bolt to buy.

I actually called several dealerships in CA to see if I could find one that would ship a 2023 Bolt to Oahu, and there was a dealership that would do it for me, but the out the door price on a base Chevy EUV was going to be $35k and then I would have had to spend ~$2k to ship it, and the project would have taken 6-8 weeks.

Couldn't find a new Leaf to buy on island, either. The Nissan dealerships on island will take your order for a new Leaf and it takes 6-8 months for the car to be built and shipped. That wasn't going to work. The newest, nicest Leaf we could find was a 2020 with 16k miles on it. We paid $26k for it out the door. Can't get a rebate: the car cost too much for the used rebate, and we make too much money, anyway.

Car buying these days is a very different experience from when I used to buy $5k cars every three to four years. The value on used vehicles just doesn't seem to be there anymore.

All that said, I really like our new Leaf and I hope it will last at least ten years. I don't think we got a great deal, but considering what the prices are on all used cars, including the private sale Leafs I scoured Facebook Marketplace for, I don't think we got ripped off.

It's a real shame we couldn't find a base model 2023 Chevy Bolt for $29k and then gotten the tax credit to bring the price to $21.5k, but on Oahu that seemed like a unicorn. The one Chevy Bolt I could find on island was a fancy one they had marked up to $41k.

[Just Joe]

Alex, I'm curious having never been to Hawaii but what is your daily mileage like? Do you drive the "American average" of ~40 miles?

Also, I'm curious how far away is far away on the island? Do you ever drive 100 miles at a time?

[englishteacheralex]

Alex, I'm curious having never been to Hawaii but what is your daily mileage like? Do you drive the "American average" of ~40 miles?

Also, I'm curious how far away is far away on the island? Do you ever drive 100 miles at a time?

My daily commute is 20 miles--10 miles each way. That commute is probably about average for Oahu. Driving 100 miles in a day would be pretty rare. Maybe on a very busy Saturday with multiple kids' soccer games at either side of the island and then heading to a party on yet another side of the island. I can't imagine needing to drive 100 miles in a day more than once or twice a year. There's no "big road trip" situation in which that's going to happen. It would have to be a nightmare of an errand/kids activity day.

[englishteacheralex]

Just googled it, because I was curious: the circle island tour is apparently 110 miles. We do this every now and then. Not even once a year.

Much more likely for us would be to drive the short way to the North Shore and back, which is 50 miles round trip. Seems like we're safe to take the Leaf...but we'd probably just take our ICE Sienna.

[Villanelle]

Alex, I'm curious having never been to Hawaii but what is your daily mileage like? Do you drive the "American average" of ~40 miles?

Also, I'm curious how far away is far away on the island? Do you ever drive 100 miles at a time?

Wow, is that really what the average American drives daily?  I don't drive that many miles in a week.  DH probably does that many on average over about 4-5 days.  Crazy!

[Paper Chaser]

Alex, I'm curious having never been to Hawaii but what is your daily mileage like? Do you drive the "American average" of ~40 miles?

Also, I'm curious how far away is far away on the island? Do you ever drive 100 miles at a time?

Wow, is that really what the average American drives daily?  I don't drive that many miles in a week.  DH probably does that many on average over about 4-5 days.  Crazy!

DOT says that the average annual miles across age groups/genders is 13,476 as of May 2022. So basically 37 miles per day:
https://www.fhwa.dot.gov/ohim/onh00/bar8.htm

The average working age male drives 15-19k miles per year on average. Females drive less than males in every age range, and (as a percentage) the spread grows the older they get with males driving more than twice what females do after age 55.

[Philociraptor]

The average working age male drives 15-19k miles per year on average. Females drive less than males in every age range, and (as a percentage) the spread grows the older they get with males driving more than twice what females do after age 55.

Antidotally, I always drive when the wife and I go places together. She can't see very well at night anymore at the ripe old age of 33. So even though she has to commute into work a couple times a week and I have no commute, we probably drive around the same number of miles each. I'd suspect something of this nature (male partners driving more often when a couple is transiting together) is driving (lol) the statistics.

[Just Joe]

Just googled it, because I was curious: the circle island tour is apparently 110 miles. We do this every now and then. Not even once a year.

Much more likely for us would be to drive the short way to the North Shore and back, which is 50 miles round trip. Seems like we're safe to take the Leaf...but we'd probably just take our ICE Sienna.

Thanks for the perspective.

[Just Joe]

Alex, I'm curious having never been to Hawaii but what is your daily mileage like? Do you drive the "American average" of ~40 miles?

Also, I'm curious how far away is far away on the island? Do you ever drive 100 miles at a time?

Wow, is that really what the average American drives daily?  I don't drive that many miles in a week.  DH probably does that many on average over about 4-5 days.  Crazy!

I know, our mileage is lower than the average too. Small(ish) town life...

[GuitarStv]

The average working age male drives 15-19k miles per year on average. Females drive less than males in every age range, and (as a percentage) the spread grows the older they get with males driving more than twice what females do after age 55.

Antidotally, I always drive when the wife and I go places together. She can't see very well at night anymore at the ripe old age of 33. So even though she has to commute into work a couple times a week and I have no commute, we probably drive around the same number of miles each. I'd suspect something of this nature (male partners driving more often when a couple is transiting together) is driving (lol) the statistics.

If I can inject my own antidote as well . . . I drive if we're doing a long trip, but my wife drives pretty much any other time.  She's a better driver, but I'm better able to stay awake over multiple hours.  My wife definitely does more miles than me.

[BuffaloStache]

I still need to go back and read the prior posts but I'm jumping in here and posting to follow. I was in a similar situation to the Thread creator (I have a 2006 Subaru Outback that has engine heating/sealing issues and can't be driven for longer than 30 minutes at a time), and so I put down a deposit on a 2023 Chevy Bolt EUV right before the beginning of the year. We picked the Bolt EUV because we wanted the extra space for our two kids, thought the hit to overall range wasn't that bad, and I'm still convinced this car is an incredible value.



As for the latest posts: Up until late last year I would say my wife and I drove about the same. But she got a new job that has a further commute, and so now she definitely drives more miles/year than me. I think the national stats may be skewed because there tend to be much more stay-at-home moms than dads.

[Arbitrage]

Alex, I'm curious having never been to Hawaii but what is your daily mileage like? Do you drive the "American average" of ~40 miles?

Also, I'm curious how far away is far away on the island? Do you ever drive 100 miles at a time?

Wow, is that really what the average American drives daily?  I don't drive that many miles in a week.  DH probably does that many on average over about 4-5 days.  Crazy!

Yes, we in the USA (collectively) have a terrible addiction to cars and car culture that is at least a significant contributor to, if not the primary cause of, many of the big problems this country is facing. 

Personally, I'm happily existing as only the alternate driver of a one-car family.  I'd be tempted by the Bolt if we were in the market for a second car.  We'll eventually probably get the second car when our kids are getting to driving age.  The only real reason I'd want a second car now is as a kayak transport vehicle.  My kayaking habit needs to be worked around my wife's need to drive/cart kids around, as they're not so inclined to e-bike around town. 

As for male vs female miles, I'm not sure what our breakdown is, again due to the long-trip effect.  I almost never drive alone anymore (but will occasionally be tasked with driving kids somewhere).  I essentially always drive when we're together, including for every long trip.  Since our city is small, and neither of us is commuting, we're only putting a grand total of about 5-6k miles per year for the family...of which I'd guess about 60% is her.  Of course, if we ever gear up for a cross-country road trip, that would throw all of the 'normal' numbers out the window.

[LD_TAndK]

...
The only real reason I'd want a second car now is as a kayak transport vehicle.  My kayaking habit needs to be worked around my wife's need to drive/cart kids around, as they're not so inclined to e-bike around town.
...

I have a oru inlet kayak that I carry to our local river on foot. Not cheap or capable of serious water but hey it's cheaper than a second car. Also fits in the trunk of our sedan.

[Holocene]

I managed to snag a Chevy Bolt EUV a couple weeks ago.  I started looking for a new car after I had a bad experience with my 2005 Hyundai Elantra late last year.  It ended up being bad gas that resulted in some costly repairs.  Fortunately, the gas company's insurance paid for it eventually.  But it was in the shop for over a week and at an inopportune time over Christmas.  I've been thinking about a new car for a few years, but having this experience with buying bad gas got me looking more seriously at EVs.

The Bolt was really the only EV worth considering in my book.  With the full $7500 tax credit, I think it's one of the best deals out there...if you can find one.  After searching for a few weeks in early January, I determined every Bolt listed at a dealership or in transit was unavailable (already sold).  So I placed an order with a couple dealerships that seemed to move a lot of Bolts and didn't require any deposit and sold at MSRP.  They figured 3 months at the earliest and potentially 6-10 months.  I was planning to bail if the tax credit got cut before I could get the car.  But about a month later, I got a call that someone didn't want the car they ordered and it was available.  I got really lucky to get it with the guaranteed $7500 tax credit.  Just didn't get the color I wanted but I'll have to live with that.

This is the only car I've ever bought new.  It's only the 2nd car I've ever bought...  I could've lived with my old car for several more years.  I don't drive much.  An EV doesn't really save me that much since I never spent much on gas.  But even just for a new car, it's a really good deal.  MSRP was $30,185.  I got a $500 supplier discount, and after tax credits, that puts it at $22,185.  With sales tax, registration, title, and fees, it comes in just under $25k.  No state incentives for me unfortunately and they even charge an extra EV registration fee each year.  A few years ago, I never would've spent this much on a car.  It's close to a years worth of normal expenses for me.  But the car market is still pretty crazy right now, although better than it was most of the last year.  And I'm FI and still working part-time so I can afford it.  The enhanced safety features coming from my 2005 car alone are probably worth it as well.

So far, I like the car a lot.  It is super quiet and the ride is way smoother than my old car and it's fun to drive.  I like all the tech stuff that I was missing on my old car.  I should be able to charge for around 7.5c per kwh.  I get a free charger install from Chevy.  There should be a lot less maintenance.  I like that it's not polluting the environment as much.

For those worried about Chevy/GM quality, I found a series of YouTube video of an automotive professor taking apart the entire car and explaining the components.  As an engineer, I found this really interesting and it seems like a well thought out design.  This helped sell me on the car a bit.  And it also shows how much simpler it is compared to an ICE vehicle.  It really is a completely different animal, and I don't think it makes much sense comparing manufacturer reliability for ICE cars in the past to new BEV designs.  Chevy has a lot more experience than most manufacturers in this space.  Maybe Toyota and Honda will come out on top eventually but they're not even really in the game at this point.  So for now, Chevy has proven to do pretty well with the Bolt and the value is definitely there.

Here's the YouTube series if anyone is interested:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r37nqfnV9EU&list=PLIn3FrDiB1lzjfZvamYdxYo9uczD2JnTT

[afox]

chevy bolt is not a bad deal but have you all been following the hell that is public EV charging in the US right now? Unless its an in town car seems foolish to buy a non-tesla EV right now. Charging is expensive, unreliable, time consuming, frustrating, and if you use the EV in winter for road trips, well I guess its downright dangerous. Read about the state of EV charging in the US right now and consider if you can deal with the shitshow that is getting worse and worse right now. A combination of perverse government incentives, poor technology, user misuse of chargers, deceptive and unfair pricing strategies and more have swung me from a likely to buy an EV in the next year or two to a no way im giving up my gas car until this gets better consumer.

you could buy a plug in hybrid/prius prime and have your cake and eat it too and probably get 90+ percent of your miles on electricity.

[Psychstache]

chevy bolt is not a bad deal but have you all been following the hell that is public EV charging in the US right now? Unless its an in town car seems foolish to buy a non-tesla EV right now. Charging is expensive, unreliable, time consuming, frustrating, and if you use the EV in winter for road trips, well I guess its downright dangerous. Read about the state of EV charging in the US right now and consider if you can deal with the shitshow that is getting worse and worse right now. A combination of perverse government incentives, poor technology, user misuse of chargers, deceptive and unfair pricing strategies and more have swung me from a likely to buy an EV in the next year or two to a no way im giving up my gas car until this gets better consumer.

you could buy a plug in hybrid/prius prime and have your cake and eat it too and probably get 90+ percent of your miles on electricity.

Yeah, I would not have purchased my BEV if I was not married. In a pinch, I can just swap cars for the day and take my wife's ICE vehicle if I have to go any substantial distance (so far, this has come up 2-3 times in a year of BEV ownership).

[ChpBstrd]

The hybrid vs. BEV thing may be kinda like how most new cars are bigger and more luxurious than most people would prefer to pay for. The people buying new cars are making decisions based on their preferences which may not be the same as what used car buyers would wish for.

Thus, a person contemplating a brand new plug-in hybrid versus a BEV may have the following thought process:

1) I'll only have this new car for the next 2-3 years at most, so the ICE engine in the hybrid probably won't have any problems by then.
2) The hybrid new car is cheaper than the BEV new car.
3) The hybrid car means no range anxiety / charger research needed to do long road trips.

So they buy the hybrid. In 3 years, the used market is flooded with hybrids when used car buyers are really wishing for a BEV.

[RWD]

chevy bolt is not a bad deal but have you all been following the hell that is public EV charging in the US right now? Unless its an in town car seems foolish to buy a non-tesla EV right now. Charging is expensive, unreliable, time consuming, frustrating, and if you use the EV in winter for road trips, well I guess its downright dangerous. Read about the state of EV charging in the US right now and consider if you can deal with the shitshow that is getting worse and worse right now. A combination of perverse government incentives, poor technology, user misuse of chargers, deceptive and unfair pricing strategies and more have swung me from a likely to buy an EV in the next year or two to a no way im giving up my gas car until this gets better consumer.

you could buy a plug in hybrid/prius prime and have your cake and eat it too and probably get 90+ percent of your miles on electricity.

I don't have to read about it (though I do) because I've been living with an EV and experiencing it first hand. We drove from Mississippi to Wisconsin and back no problem with our EV last year. Can't comment on cost because charging was completely free due to a 2-year promotion period. We're making a road trip out to North Carolina soon and when checking to make sure there are enough chargers I found that there are so many I almost don't need to plan any specific stops at all. Tesla is opening its network for non-Tesla cars as well. That's not to say there aren't issues, but in my experience it has been greatly overblown by the media.

I personally wouldn't buy a Bolt for road tripping though (and I don't think anyone in this thread has really advocated for that), as the charge speed is very slow.

Some recent studies have shown that in the real world PHEVs use significantly more fuel than their rating (which are too optimistic about how often they will be in all-electric mode).

[afox]

chevy bolt is not a bad deal but have you all been following the hell that is public EV charging in the US right now? Unless its an in town car seems foolish to buy a non-tesla EV right now. Charging is expensive, unreliable, time consuming, frustrating, and if you use the EV in winter for road trips, well I guess its downright dangerous. Read about the state of EV charging in the US right now and consider if you can deal with the shitshow that is getting worse and worse right now. A combination of perverse government incentives, poor technology, user misuse of chargers, deceptive and unfair pricing strategies and more have swung me from a likely to buy an EV in the next year or two to a no way im giving up my gas car until this gets better consumer.

you could buy a plug in hybrid/prius prime and have your cake and eat it too and probably get 90+ percent of your miles on electricity.

I don't have to read about it (though I do) because I've been living with an EV and experiencing it first hand. We drove from Mississippi to Wisconsin and back no problem with our EV last year. Can't comment on cost because charging was completely free due to a 2-year promotion period. We're making a road trip out to North Carolina soon and when checking to make sure there are enough chargers I found that there are so many I almost don't need to plan any specific stops at all. Tesla is opening its network for non-Tesla cars as well. That's not to say there aren't issues, but in my experience it has been greatly overblown by the media.

I personally wouldn't buy a Bolt for road tripping though (and I don't think anyone in this thread has really advocated for that), as the charge speed is very slow.

Some recent studies have shown that in the real world PHEVs use significantly more fuel than their rating (which are too optimistic about how often they will be in all-electric mode).

Dont trust the media (or one guy in an internet forum) but read about it before your next road trip so you can avoid headaches and problems. There are some tools/apps out there that can really help you out. The only thing more frustrating than the media playing up problems with EV charging and fearmongering to sell eyeballs is consumers with post-purchase rationalization pretending their is no problem with EV charging in the US or claiming there is no problem with EV charging because they personally have not experienced a problem because they "drove from Mississippi to Wisconsin and back no problem with our EV last year." haha! Yes, tesla opening up their charging network should help but lots of details to iron out, too soon to know how much impact that will have.

Plug in hybrid (PHEV) not the same as hybrid since wtih PHEV such as prius prime/rav4 prime your first 30ish miles are all electric. For most people 90% of of their driving is in town close to home and with 30 miles of range they rarely need to visit a gas station, plus they charge with an extension cord on 110v so easy/peasy...

[RWD]

chevy bolt is not a bad deal but have you all been following the hell that is public EV charging in the US right now? Unless its an in town car seems foolish to buy a non-tesla EV right now. Charging is expensive, unreliable, time consuming, frustrating, and if you use the EV in winter for road trips, well I guess its downright dangerous. Read about the state of EV charging in the US right now and consider if you can deal with the shitshow that is getting worse and worse right now. A combination of perverse government incentives, poor technology, user misuse of chargers, deceptive and unfair pricing strategies and more have swung me from a likely to buy an EV in the next year or two to a no way im giving up my gas car until this gets better consumer.

you could buy a plug in hybrid/prius prime and have your cake and eat it too and probably get 90+ percent of your miles on electricity.

I don't have to read about it (though I do) because I've been living with an EV and experiencing it first hand. We drove from Mississippi to Wisconsin and back no problem with our EV last year. Can't comment on cost because charging was completely free due to a 2-year promotion period. We're making a road trip out to North Carolina soon and when checking to make sure there are enough chargers I found that there are so many I almost don't need to plan any specific stops at all. Tesla is opening its network for non-Tesla cars as well. That's not to say there aren't issues, but in my experience it has been greatly overblown by the media.

I personally wouldn't buy a Bolt for road tripping though (and I don't think anyone in this thread has really advocated for that), as the charge speed is very slow.

Some recent studies have shown that in the real world PHEVs use significantly more fuel than their rating (which are too optimistic about how often they will be in all-electric mode).

Dont trust the media (or one guy in an internet forum) but read about it before your next road trip so you can avoid headaches and problems. There are some tools/apps out there that can really help you out. The only thing more frustrating than the media playing up problems with EV charging and fearmongering to sell eyeballs is consumers with post-purchase rationalization pretending their is no problem with EV charging in the US or claiming there is no problem with EV charging because they personally have not experienced a problem because they "drove from Mississippi to Wisconsin and back no problem with our EV last year." haha! Yes, tesla opening up their charging network should help but lots of details to iron out, too soon to know how much impact that will have.

Plug in hybrid (PHEV) not the same as hybrid since wtih PHEV such as prius prime/rav4 prime your first 30ish miles are all electric. For most people 90% of of their driving is in town close to home and with 30 miles of range they rarely need to visit a gas station, plus they charge with an extension cord on 110v so easy/peasy...

Like I said, I have read about it. I've also experienced dead chargers and slow chargers, but never enough to derail a trip by more than a few minutes. I use PlugShare, ABRP, and a few other tools. I agree, no one should just take my word for it though. Do your own research, especially for the local areas that matter.

The article I linked is about PHEV. Of course I know what a plug-in hybrid is, geez. And in practice they aren't saving as much fuel as claimed.

[afox]

chevy bolt is not a bad deal but have you all been following the hell that is public EV charging in the US right now? Unless its an in town car seems foolish to buy a non-tesla EV right now. Charging is expensive, unreliable, time consuming, frustrating, and if you use the EV in winter for road trips, well I guess its downright dangerous. Read about the state of EV charging in the US right now and consider if you can deal with the shitshow that is getting worse and worse right now. A combination of perverse government incentives, poor technology, user misuse of chargers, deceptive and unfair pricing strategies and more have swung me from a likely to buy an EV in the next year or two to a no way im giving up my gas car until this gets better consumer.

you could buy a plug in hybrid/prius prime and have your cake and eat it too and probably get 90+ percent of your miles on electricity.

I don't have to read about it (though I do) because I've been living with an EV and experiencing it first hand. We drove from Mississippi to Wisconsin and back no problem with our EV last year. Can't comment on cost because charging was completely free due to a 2-year promotion period. We're making a road trip out to North Carolina soon and when checking to make sure there are enough chargers I found that there are so many I almost don't need to plan any specific stops at all. Tesla is opening its network for non-Tesla cars as well. That's not to say there aren't issues, but in my experience it has been greatly overblown by the media.

I personally wouldn't buy a Bolt for road tripping though (and I don't think anyone in this thread has really advocated for that), as the charge speed is very slow.

Some recent studies have shown that in the real world PHEVs use significantly more fuel than their rating (which are too optimistic about how often they will be in all-electric mode).

Dont trust the media (or one guy in an internet forum) but read about it before your next road trip so you can avoid headaches and problems. There are some tools/apps out there that can really help you out. The only thing more frustrating than the media playing up problems with EV charging and fearmongering to sell eyeballs is consumers with post-purchase rationalization pretending their is no problem with EV charging in the US or claiming there is no problem with EV charging because they personally have not experienced a problem because they "drove from Mississippi to Wisconsin and back no problem with our EV last year." haha! Yes, tesla opening up their charging network should help but lots of details to iron out, too soon to know how much impact that will have.

Plug in hybrid (PHEV) not the same as hybrid since wtih PHEV such as prius prime/rav4 prime your first 30ish miles are all electric. For most people 90% of of their driving is in town close to home and with 30 miles of range they rarely need to visit a gas station, plus they charge with an extension cord on 110v so easy/peasy...

Like I said, I have read about it. I've also experienced dead chargers and slow chargers, but never enough to derail a trip by more than a few minutes. I use PlugShare, ABRP, and a few other tools. I agree, no one should just take my word for it though. Do your own research, especially for the local areas that matter.

The article I linked is about PHEV. Of course I know what a plug-in hybrid is, geez. And in practice they aren't saving as much fuel as claimed.

Plugshare by the way is owned by some charging companies and its well known to be a source of false information, ridiculous!

yeah, that article is kind of irrelevant for PHEV owners isnt it? I mean, you know if youre driving on electricity or on gas, what difference does the EPA label or the cars EPA classification matter?

[RWD]

chevy bolt is not a bad deal but have you all been following the hell that is public EV charging in the US right now? Unless its an in town car seems foolish to buy a non-tesla EV right now. Charging is expensive, unreliable, time consuming, frustrating, and if you use the EV in winter for road trips, well I guess its downright dangerous. Read about the state of EV charging in the US right now and consider if you can deal with the shitshow that is getting worse and worse right now. A combination of perverse government incentives, poor technology, user misuse of chargers, deceptive and unfair pricing strategies and more have swung me from a likely to buy an EV in the next year or two to a no way im giving up my gas car until this gets better consumer.

you could buy a plug in hybrid/prius prime and have your cake and eat it too and probably get 90+ percent of your miles on electricity.

I don't have to read about it (though I do) because I've been living with an EV and experiencing it first hand. We drove from Mississippi to Wisconsin and back no problem with our EV last year. Can't comment on cost because charging was completely free due to a 2-year promotion period. We're making a road trip out to North Carolina soon and when checking to make sure there are enough chargers I found that there are so many I almost don't need to plan any specific stops at all. Tesla is opening its network for non-Tesla cars as well. That's not to say there aren't issues, but in my experience it has been greatly overblown by the media.

I personally wouldn't buy a Bolt for road tripping though (and I don't think anyone in this thread has really advocated for that), as the charge speed is very slow.

Some recent studies have shown that in the real world PHEVs use significantly more fuel than their rating (which are too optimistic about how often they will be in all-electric mode).

Dont trust the media (or one guy in an internet forum) but read about it before your next road trip so you can avoid headaches and problems. There are some tools/apps out there that can really help you out. The only thing more frustrating than the media playing up problems with EV charging and fearmongering to sell eyeballs is consumers with post-purchase rationalization pretending their is no problem with EV charging in the US or claiming there is no problem with EV charging because they personally have not experienced a problem because they "drove from Mississippi to Wisconsin and back no problem with our EV last year." haha! Yes, tesla opening up their charging network should help but lots of details to iron out, too soon to know how much impact that will have.

Plug in hybrid (PHEV) not the same as hybrid since wtih PHEV such as prius prime/rav4 prime your first 30ish miles are all electric. For most people 90% of of their driving is in town close to home and with 30 miles of range they rarely need to visit a gas station, plus they charge with an extension cord on 110v so easy/peasy...

Like I said, I have read about it. I've also experienced dead chargers and slow chargers, but never enough to derail a trip by more than a few minutes. I use PlugShare, ABRP, and a few other tools. I agree, no one should just take my word for it though. Do your own research, especially for the local areas that matter.

The article I linked is about PHEV. Of course I know what a plug-in hybrid is, geez. And in practice they aren't saving as much fuel as claimed.

Plugshare by the way is owned by some charging companies and its well known to be a source of false information, ridiculous!

yeah, that article is kind of irrelevant for PHEV owners isnt it? I mean, you know if youre driving on electricity or on gas, what difference does the EPA label or the cars EPA classification matter?

Ah, I was not aware PlugShare was acquired by EVgo. Do you have a better source for charger status/reviews?

Well I suppose if you already own a PHEV then yeah it's irrelevant. But for deciding if you will purchase a PHEV in the first place it can be useful to know that on average it might not be able to be on pure electric as much as you expect. Also useful if you're recommending a car to someone else where you won't have control over how they use the vehicle.

[Holocene]

Plug in hybrid (PHEV) not the same as hybrid since wtih PHEV such as prius prime/rav4 prime your first 30ish miles are all electric. For most people 90% of of their driving is in town close to home and with 30 miles of range they rarely need to visit a gas station, plus they charge with an extension cord on 110v so easy/peasy...

So why not just go fully electric if it satisfies 90+% of your needs?  Especially for 2 car households with the other car being an ICE or hybrid for longer trips when needed. It's kind of like how people buy trucks for the 1-2 times a year they need to go to Home Depot or haul some dirt.  Why not buy the car for the 90% use case and not the 10%.  And going to an EV with 200+ miles of range instead of 30 miles will likely cover an even higher percentage of one's needs.  As far as I can tell, the Bolt or Leaf is cheaper than just about any PHEV.  PHEV is definitely better than gas.  But when the ICE isn't needed most of the time, it feels like a waste.  It makes the car more expensive to have all the ICE components plus the EV components.  And it increases maintenance costs as well.  This was one of the appeals of an EV for me.  I can use the money saved in gas and maintenance to occasionally rent a car when I really need it.  Or more likely, I can borrow one from family.

I haven't experienced the charging infrastructure yet, but while doing research I was actually pretty impressed with how far it's come.  I was assuming any non-Tesla car would be pretty impossible to road trip with, but the network has been built out pretty well and some EVs can charge impressively fast.  Charging is still very lacking in some (especially more rural) areas and reliability is definitely a problem.  I'd like to road trip in my Bolt one day.  I know it'll be slow.  I'm fine charging for an hour every 2 hours or so.  If I'm going solo, I'd like the rest anyway.  But I'd definitely be worried about showing up to a charger in some rural area with low range and have it not be working.  We need more reliable charging stations and more of them, so there are actual backups if one does not work.  I'm hopeful with Tesla opening up the Superchargers and with more funding going into this.  The IRA was a pretty big deal for moving EVs forward.  But it'll continue to take time.  So if you're expecting it to be 100% perfect and hassle-free right now, then yeah, don't get an EV.

I don't plan to test it out much this year.  I'm hoping to do some shorter trips, maybe 600 miles round trip over several days.  There looks to be multiple charging options where I'd like to go so I should be ok.  I think it'll be fun to test it out.  It adds a bit to the adventure.  And then the other 99% of the time, I'll just charge it in my garage at home overnight with no hassle at all.

[afox]

Plug in hybrid (PHEV) not the same as hybrid since wtih PHEV such as prius prime/rav4 prime your first 30ish miles are all electric. For most people 90% of of their driving is in town close to home and with 30 miles of range they rarely need to visit a gas station, plus they charge with an extension cord on 110v so easy/peasy...

So why not just go fully electric if it satisfies 90+% of your needs?  Especially for 2 car households with the other car being an ICE or hybrid for longer trips when needed. It's kind of like how people buy trucks for the 1-2 times a year they need to go to Home Depot or haul some dirt.  Why not buy the car for the 90% use case and not the 10%.  And going to an EV with 200+ miles of range instead of 30 miles will likely cover an even higher percentage of one's needs.  As far as I can tell, the Bolt or Leaf is cheaper than just about any PHEV.  PHEV is definitely better than gas.  But when the ICE isn't needed most of the time, it feels like a waste.  It makes the car more expensive to have all the ICE components plus the EV components.  And it increases maintenance costs as well.  This was one of the appeals of an EV for me.  I can use the money saved in gas and maintenance to occasionally rent a car when I really need it.  Or more likely, I can borrow one from family.

I haven't experienced the charging infrastructure yet, but while doing research I was actually pretty impressed with how far it's come.  I was assuming any non-Tesla car would be pretty impossible to road trip with, but the network has been built out pretty well and some EVs can charge impressively fast.  Charging is still very lacking in some (especially more rural) areas and reliability is definitely a problem.  I'd like to road trip in my Bolt one day.  I know it'll be slow.  I'm fine charging for an hour every 2 hours or so.  If I'm going solo, I'd like the rest anyway.  But I'd definitely be worried about showing up to a charger in some rural area with low range and have it not be working.  We need more reliable charging stations and more of them, so there are actual backups if one does not work.  I'm hopeful with Tesla opening up the Superchargers and with more funding going into this.  The IRA was a pretty big deal for moving EVs forward.  But it'll continue to take time.  So if you're expecting it to be 100% perfect and hassle-free right now, then yeah, don't get an EV.

I don't plan to test it out much this year.  I'm hoping to do some shorter trips, maybe 600 miles round trip over several days.  There looks to be multiple charging options where I'd like to go so I should be ok.  I think it'll be fun to test it out.  It adds a bit to the adventure.  And then the other 99% of the time, I'll just charge it in my garage at home overnight with no hassle at all.

yeah agree bolt would make a great 2nd car for mostly in town driving. Its not efficient to buy a 2nd car for the 10% use case so if my family can get by with one car its going to be a PHEV or ICE. Hauling a fridge or some dirt twice a year is like a 1% or 0.5% of use scenario, not road tripping which in my case would be like 10% of use.

Looks like prius prime PHEV is 28k.

[Arbitrage]

...
The only real reason I'd want a second car now is as a kayak transport vehicle.  My kayaking habit needs to be worked around my wife's need to drive/cart kids around, as they're not so inclined to e-bike around town.
...

I have a oru inlet kayak that I carry to our local river on foot. Not cheap or capable of serious water but hey it's cheaper than a second car. Also fits in the trunk of our sedan.

Yes, familiar with the Oru kayaks, and considered purchasing one back before I moved, when space was a major consideration.  I purchased and used an Advanced Elements inflatable instead.  I would in fact tow that kayak to the coast using my e-bike.  I do have a different inflatable that I use for tandem (people or dog) kayaking adventures.  However, for my general solo use, I'm spoiled by my hardshell sea kayak and it's only for the longer, wilder adventures - where the more 'convenient' kayaks won't cut it - that the second car would really come in handy.

[Holocene]

Plug in hybrid (PHEV) not the same as hybrid since wtih PHEV such as prius prime/rav4 prime your first 30ish miles are all electric. For most people 90% of of their driving is in town close to home and with 30 miles of range they rarely need to visit a gas station, plus they charge with an extension cord on 110v so easy/peasy...

So why not just go fully electric if it satisfies 90+% of your needs?  Especially for 2 car households with the other car being an ICE or hybrid for longer trips when needed. It's kind of like how people buy trucks for the 1-2 times a year they need to go to Home Depot or haul some dirt.  Why not buy the car for the 90% use case and not the 10%.  And going to an EV with 200+ miles of range instead of 30 miles will likely cover an even higher percentage of one's needs.  As far as I can tell, the Bolt or Leaf is cheaper than just about any PHEV.  PHEV is definitely better than gas.  But when the ICE isn't needed most of the time, it feels like a waste.  It makes the car more expensive to have all the ICE components plus the EV components.  And it increases maintenance costs as well.  This was one of the appeals of an EV for me.  I can use the money saved in gas and maintenance to occasionally rent a car when I really need it.  Or more likely, I can borrow one from family.

I haven't experienced the charging infrastructure yet, but while doing research I was actually pretty impressed with how far it's come.  I was assuming any non-Tesla car would be pretty impossible to road trip with, but the network has been built out pretty well and some EVs can charge impressively fast.  Charging is still very lacking in some (especially more rural) areas and reliability is definitely a problem.  I'd like to road trip in my Bolt one day.  I know it'll be slow.  I'm fine charging for an hour every 2 hours or so.  If I'm going solo, I'd like the rest anyway.  But I'd definitely be worried about showing up to a charger in some rural area with low range and have it not be working.  We need more reliable charging stations and more of them, so there are actual backups if one does not work.  I'm hopeful with Tesla opening up the Superchargers and with more funding going into this.  The IRA was a pretty big deal for moving EVs forward.  But it'll continue to take time.  So if you're expecting it to be 100% perfect and hassle-free right now, then yeah, don't get an EV.

I don't plan to test it out much this year.  I'm hoping to do some shorter trips, maybe 600 miles round trip over several days.  There looks to be multiple charging options where I'd like to go so I should be ok.  I think it'll be fun to test it out.  It adds a bit to the adventure.  And then the other 99% of the time, I'll just charge it in my garage at home overnight with no hassle at all.

yeah agree bolt would make a great 2nd car for mostly in town driving. Its not efficient to buy a 2nd car for the 10% use case so if my family can get by with one car its going to be a PHEV or ICE. Hauling a fridge or some dirt twice a year is like a 1% or 0.5% of use scenario, not road tripping which in my case would be like 10% of use.

Looks like prius prime PHEV is 28k.

Yeah, it'd be tough to have the Bolt or Leaf as your only car if you road trip long distances 10% of the time.  Another EV would probably be do-able but prices go up quickly.  But I was speaking more generally to your point that most people don't need that much range on a regular basis which I think is true.  An EV with decent 200+ mile range, plus borrowing or renting a car occasionally, could be a legitimate option for most people, even as their only car.  I'd guess your 10% road trip use is much higher than average.  People seem to get caught up on having something that will meet 100% of their needs 100% of the time, when there are other options.  PHEVs are a step in the right direction though and might be a good way to start the transition.  They're still pretty pricey from what I've seen.

The Bolt and Leaf both have a starting price less than the Prius Prime starting price.  Plus they're eligible for $7500 tax credit right now, if you could get one in time, and likely at least $3750 after the new battery ruling comes out.  The base Leaf only has a 40kWh battery though (149 mile EPA range) which makes the Bolt a much better deal.  And the Bolt uses CCS which seems like it's becoming the standard for fast charging vs. CHAdeMo on the Leaf.

In my case, I have a good corporate discount for car rentals.  For a trip I'm planning where we'll be flying, I'm looking at renting a minivan for 17 days with additional drivers for $1100.  I can rent a Prius for 3 weeks for around $750 if I really want to do a long, fuel-efficient road trip.  And I can pretty easily borrow an ICE SUV from family as well.  So despite being a 1 car 1 person household, I think the Bolt will work just fine for me.  I'm still hoping the Bolt will cover all my needs, but if it fails, I have backup options.  At this point, I'm not really any worse off than my crappy old ICE car that drove pretty rough and had no cruise control, traction control, or ABS.  I'd rather take the Bolt on a road trip than that...

[GuitarStv]

...
The only real reason I'd want a second car now is as a kayak transport vehicle.  My kayaking habit needs to be worked around my wife's need to drive/cart kids around, as they're not so inclined to e-bike around town.
...

I have a oru inlet kayak that I carry to our local river on foot. Not cheap or capable of serious water but hey it's cheaper than a second car. Also fits in the trunk of our sedan.

Yes, familiar with the Oru kayaks, and considered purchasing one back before I moved, when space was a major consideration.  I purchased and used an Advanced Elements inflatable instead.  I would in fact tow that kayak to the coast using my e-bike.  I do have a different inflatable that I use for tandem (people or dog) kayaking adventures.  However, for my general solo use, I'm spoiled by my hardshell sea kayak and it's only for the longer, wilder adventures - where the more 'convenient' kayaks won't cut it - that the second car would really come in handy.

 . . . just sayin'.

[Arbitrage]

 . . . just sayin'.

Oh, I know, and I have considered the option long and hard, including looking around for safe places to park my bike near paddling areas.  I haven't been able to get comfortable with it, though.  Mostly because the only road to my house is a steep hill in both directions.  Navigating to most of the nearby bodies of water would include some additional fairly steep, curvy roads.  I just keep going back to the mental picture of my 17' kayak rotating around or otherwise starting to race me down the hill, or perhaps tipping over and skidding down a curvy hill.  Read an account of that happening to someone on only a moderate hill. 

[ChpBstrd]

 . . . just sayin'.

Oh, I know, and I have considered the option long and hard, including looking around for safe places to park my bike near paddling areas.  I haven't been able to get comfortable with it, though.  Mostly because the only road to my house is a steep hill in both directions.  Navigating to most of the nearby bodies of water would include some additional fairly steep, curvy roads.  I just keep going back to the mental picture of my 17' kayak rotating around or otherwise starting to race me down the hill, or perhaps tipping over and skidding down a curvy hill.  Read an account of that happening to someone on only a moderate hill.

That looks like a situation where disc brakes would be a must for the bike.

At least until somebody invents trailer brakes for bicycle trailers. (Stick around and I'll give away more million-dollar ideas!)

[GuitarStv]

 . . . just sayin'.

Oh, I know, and I have considered the option long and hard, including looking around for safe places to park my bike near paddling areas.  I haven't been able to get comfortable with it, though.  Mostly because the only road to my house is a steep hill in both directions.  Navigating to most of the nearby bodies of water would include some additional fairly steep, curvy roads.  I just keep going back to the mental picture of my 17' kayak rotating around or otherwise starting to race me down the hill, or perhaps tipping over and skidding down a curvy hill.  Read an account of that happening to someone on only a moderate hill.

I've done a fair amount of pulling stuff in a trailer by bike, including up and down some pretty steep hills.  As long as you're not talking mountain switchbacks or something really extreme it's usually OK.  You've got to modify the way that you would usually ride a bit (slamming on the brakes on a steep downhill does introduce a little bit of tail wagging the dog feel from the weight of the trailer, and you don't want to pick up too much speed with the trailer because it changes the way it feels when you lean the bike), but you might find it more doable than expected.  The uphill part is more of a challenge than the down when you've got 80-100 lbs back there.  :P

[GilesMM]

Latest JD Power study ranks the Bolt rather low, which is concerning.


https://gmauthority.com/blog/2023/03/chevy-bolt-ev-bolt-euv-rank-low-in-j-d-power-2023-u-s-ev-experience-ownership-study/

[RWD]

Latest JD Power study ranks the Bolt rather low, which is concerning.


https://gmauthority.com/blog/2023/03/chevy-bolt-ev-bolt-euv-rank-low-in-j-d-power-2023-u-s-ev-experience-ownership-study/

Worth noting that that is a satisfaction survey (mostly subjective) as opposed to JD Powers usual quality or reliable studies. Quality and reliability is only one of 10 criteria measured here.

[Paper Chaser]

Latest JD Power study ranks the Bolt rather low, which is concerning.


https://gmauthority.com/blog/2023/03/chevy-bolt-ev-bolt-euv-rank-low-in-j-d-power-2023-u-s-ev-experience-ownership-study/

The difference between the Bolt EV and the highest scoring mass market EV was 10%. The most common complaints in the mass market EV category centered around infotainment, charging network, and interior or exterior styling. None of which really impact quality


They also have a $20-30k hatchback and a $70-100k crew cab pickup in the same category which seems like an odd choice.

[GilesMM]

Interestingly, all the EVs scored lower than about half the non-EVs in separate JDP survey. Are EV owners just pickier and thus harder to satisfy?

[AdrianC]

Just clicked over 37k miles in our '21 Bolt (cost in May 2021: $25k + tax).
It's been in the shop for a free tire rotation so far. I really should rotate the tires again but keep forgetting. I have had to fill the washer bottle a few times.
We'll get that new free of charge battery before next winter. No hurry at the moment. Charging to 80% meets our needs.
Still fun to drive and incredibly economical.

[TomTX]

The difference between the Bolt EV and the highest scoring mass market EV was 10%. The most common complaints in the mass market EV category centered around infotainment, charging network, and interior or exterior styling. None of which really impact quality

Interesting that they neglected to include the two top-selling EVs in the USA which comprise well over half of EVs sold in the USA in 2022...