Author Topic: 2022 FIRE cohort  (Read 51881 times)

couponvan

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Re: 2022 FIRE cohort
« Reply #150 on: March 14, 2016, 04:30:55 PM »
Can I have a seat at the "cool table"?

A Firecalc median return has me at just over my goal for a 4% SWR at the end of 2022 with my preferred AA.  A Monte Carlo is giving me a median a little under that.  Caveat, I may decide to go a bit early with part time work.  I'm 39 and will turn 46 in 2022.

Welcome! I am 45 and have been doing PT work for the past 5 years. I have 6 more to go. Kids make it hard to do more. I really think PT is great-if you can pace yourself and say "no" to extra work.

Part-time work is part of my FIRE goal. I could be satisfied with not being fully early-retired as long as I didn't have to work more than part-time ever again. There are so many forms of work much more appealing to me which are part-time that I would love to do if I could afford to, many in the entrepreneurial, creative realm.
I just wish my PT hours was more during the Winter and less during the Summer....Once the kids leave the van, it likely won't matter.  But for now, I wish I could spend lazy summer days with them without responsibilities or obligations.  True FIRE....
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faramund

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Re: 2022 FIRE cohort
« Reply #151 on: March 14, 2016, 07:09:23 PM »
Fun countdown fact I've only recently realised -> only 1 more Rugby World cup between now and retirement... See, its not that far away.

Classical_Liberal

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Re: 2022 FIRE cohort
« Reply #152 on: March 15, 2016, 02:59:12 PM »
Thanks zephyr911, couponvan & mval (all would be outstanding superhero names, by the way) for the acceptance!

I have had deep thoughts (not by Jack Handy) and the part time work idea is appealing for many reasons:

#1 Obviously, there is the extra income, and earlier "full time retirement".

#2 This is a second career for me, only about 3 years in, I still kind of enjoy it and haven't burnt out quite yet (although by 2022...)

#3 In my field, I'm lucky enough to find employment almost anywhere in the US (unless there are major systemic changes) and work the hours I prefer.  I could work full time 3 mos and take 9 off, or maybe just work 1 day a week, so decent flexibility.  Plus with a boatload of F U money to say "goodbye" if the work no longer suits me adds even more.

#4 Work has always been a social outlet for me.  Not necessarily when working, but a good place to find folks with similar interests to hang with outside of work.  Cutting this off cold turkey may have negative consequences.

#5 I avoid obsolescence in my field, staying up to date and employable in the future.  If the doomsayers are right for once and our investment returns suck, it's an added safety margin of jumping back into full time work for a year or two if need be.

#6 It avoids the identity crisis many people on the forum have expressed when dealing with family & friends who don't get FIRE.  "What your retired at 46?!?!  Thats impossible, you're just lazy!".  Nope, still employed here...cough 300 hours a year, cough...

#7 It will make me feel useful during the inevitable periods of time in the future when i ponder the meaning of my existence (yes, my 40's may bring about a mid life crisis).

Frankly, Im surprised there isn't more discussion about people specifically planning "almost FI" on the forum.  Since the likelihood is so high a 30 or 40 something retiree will make money again at some point anyway.  It almost seems overkill to be 100 percent FI with a 4 percent or less withdrawal rate before cutting back a bit and let loose. At the very least, slowly reducing work hours probably makes for an easier transition. Curious about others thoughts on this.

sisto

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Re: 2022 FIRE cohort
« Reply #153 on: March 15, 2016, 05:48:55 PM »
Personally I don't want to have to work in FIRE, I'm shooting to go all in. I realize though that I might get bored so I have some ideas for making a few bucks and staying busy too. I also dream of engineering my FIRE with a nice package to leave. My company seems to have these every couple of years anyway. If that doesn't work out, I'm also thinking about cutting back hours as you suggested. My company offers job sharing and or hour cut back if the job can handle it and manager agrees, so I may go that route too. For now I just keep on keepin' on.
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Gray Matter

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Re: 2022 FIRE cohort
« Reply #154 on: March 16, 2016, 04:30:12 AM »
Frankly, Im surprised there isn't more discussion about people specifically planning "almost FI" on the forum.  Since the likelihood is so high a 30 or 40 something retiree will make money again at some point anyway.  It almost seems overkill to be 100 percent FI with a 4 percent or less withdrawal rate before cutting back a bit and let loose. At the very least, slowly reducing work hours probably makes for an easier transition. Curious about others thoughts on this.

I think it comes down to people's main motivator for FIRE.  If it's "more flexibility and free time," then yeah, part-time work or cycling in and out of work is a great idea.  If it's "complete freedom to do what I choose," then having to work negates that.  So I can see it both ways.  For me and DH, we have already started scaling back (I left a more lucrative job in the financial services to run a non-profit and took a steep pay cut in the process).  Now, I didn't reduce responsibility (probably increased it) or stress, but I did cut back to 80% and reduced my commute so the net gain is a few extra hours a day. 

I can see us doing a phased approach--both of scaling back further by taking a lower-responsibility and more part-time job for a few years or so to pay the bills while the retirement savings, the scaling back ever further (very part-time work) in order to pay for "extras" like international travel while we live off our savings, then eventually ceasing all work entirely.  We both like certain aspects of working, but are both burned out and tired from full-time work and raising three kids, so gaining a little extra time now is more valuable to us than going full-steam ahead to a full and earlier retirement.

homestead neohio

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Re: 2022 FIRE cohort
« Reply #155 on: March 16, 2016, 06:54:30 AM »
Frankly, Im surprised there isn't more discussion about people specifically planning "almost FI" on the forum.  Since the likelihood is so high a 30 or 40 something retiree will make money again at some point anyway.  It almost seems overkill to be 100 percent FI with a 4 percent or less withdrawal rate before cutting back a bit and let loose. At the very least, slowly reducing work hours probably makes for an easier transition. Curious about others thoughts on this.

I want to reach FI so I can then RE.  I'm in a job I've been doing for 15+ years and I'm ready for a change, but the changes I contemplate are enjoyable and pay VERY little.  I intend to reinvent myself every few years in FI and follow my passions, always learning and exploring.  This will likely include making some money, which would be great, but I know I'm going to make the vast majority of money in my field while the fire-hose of cash is on.  That said, I'm seeking balance and enjoyment NOW.  This is limited while working full time, but is also why I'm not looking for additional part-time work to knock off a few months in my time to FIRE.  That would take me away from things I enjoy.  It's a 6 year push, not a 1 year push where I could just endure some overworking pain and break on through.  But when I have enough, I'm done and don't want PT work in my field, even if I could find it.  I'm not at all worried about not having things to pursue, or "what would I do with my time?".  I think I've found a good pace for my journey.  Prolonging it via PT is not desired, and giving up free time to rush it is not desired.  If I can move RE up sooner without giving up free time, I'm all about it. Right now this is mostly pursuing raises and investing bonuses/windfalls or further cutting expenses and optimizing finances.  If I could bring it sooner in a different career, I would, but a career change would likely reduce my savings and prolong time to FIRE.

#6 It avoids the identity crisis many people on the forum have expressed when dealing with family & friends who don't get FIRE.  "What your retired at 46?!?!  Thats impossible, you're just lazy!".  Nope, still employed here...cough 300 hours a year, cough...

#7 It will make me feel useful during the inevitable periods of time in the future when i ponder the meaning of my existence (yes, my 40's may bring about a mid life crisis).

I also don't identify with your points 6 and 7.  I don't care if people think I'm lazy.  If they do they clearly don't know me and are judging me based on very limited information. I'm not wasting my time trying to convince them otherwise, it is their problem.  There are already so many societal norms I do not conform to, what is one more?  That said, I don't know if I'll proclaim my retirement to the world.  It is not their business.  If people ask what I do, I'll tell them whatever it is I'm doing then, whether or not it is considered a "job".  I also don't feel more useful at work than outside of work, and my job is not my identity.  The things I want to pursue in RE are more aligned with my values than what I do at work.  The longer I work the more likely I am to have a midlife crisis, not the other way around!

Axecleaver

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Re: 2022 FIRE cohort
« Reply #156 on: March 16, 2016, 08:57:14 AM »
I like the work I do, so I wonder how I will feel about stepping away from it. My current contract runs through 2020; it is likely to be extended beyond that. If it ends in 2020, I probably transition to part time for other clients, and take work that comes my way without the intense sales pipeline refill cycles that I run today. If it gets extended, I probably keep working OMY for a year or two and pad the SWR a bit.

As an entrepreneurial guy though, I don't know if I will be able to completely step away from business, ever. I might mentor some younger guys in their pursuits or do some small-scale angel investing, just to keep my mind engaged. I like solving business problems and I wouldn't mind doing more pure business consulting for businesses I want to encourage and less government-focused consulting.

zephyr911

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Re: 2022 FIRE cohort
« Reply #157 on: March 16, 2016, 09:24:43 AM »
Frankly, Im surprised there isn't more discussion about people specifically planning "almost FI" on the forum.  Since the likelihood is so high a 30 or 40 something retiree will make money again at some point anyway.  It almost seems overkill to be 100 percent FI with a 4 percent or less withdrawal rate before cutting back a bit and let loose. At the very least, slowly reducing work hours probably makes for an easier transition. Curious about others thoughts on this.
I think, for whatever reason, most people want to be able to make a clean break from employment when the time comes. Personally, it's never been in the cards - side job #1 (ANG) adds so much value via lifelong cost savings if I finish my 20, that I have never seriously considered quitting it before retirement (thus 2022). Side job #2, I added for extra income and found I like it so much that I'll probably do it a few hours a week for my whole life just for the fun of it.

It complicates the planning, having various streams of income turning on and off over the years, and that may be another 'con' factor for the average FIRE enthusiast. There's something alluring about just setting a magic number based on 4% and making one single-minded effort to reach it. Nothing else to think about.

But I don't mind doing the extra math to move the date up. I'm actually at the point where I could quit the FT now. I don't want to call it the crossover point because most people use that strictly for passive income, but I'm investing more than my TH from govt work. I've never set a magic number and may never feel the need. NW is only $300k or so, but my finger is squarely on the trigger because of the side work.

As an entrepreneurial guy though, I don't know if I will be able to completely step away from business, ever. I might mentor some younger guys in their pursuits or do some small-scale angel investing, just to keep my mind engaged. I like solving business problems and I wouldn't mind doing more pure business consulting for businesses I want to encourage and less government-focused consulting.
Axe, I recently added as a bucket list item "Found a REIT and take it public". This is years away, if ever, but maybe you'd be interested in the project?
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Axecleaver

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Re: 2022 FIRE cohort
« Reply #158 on: March 16, 2016, 09:53:00 AM »
Definitely. Have you read Mr Orange's journal? http://forum.mrmoneymustache.com/journals/mr-orange's-fire-journal/

This sounds like what he's doing with a crowdfunding twist.

zephyr911

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Re: 2022 FIRE cohort
« Reply #159 on: March 16, 2016, 10:41:49 AM »
News to me! Thanks!
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Classical_Liberal

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Re: 2022 FIRE cohort
« Reply #160 on: March 16, 2016, 06:32:02 PM »

I also don't identify with your points 6 and 7.  I don't care if people think I'm lazy.  If they do they clearly don't know me and are judging me based on very limited information. I'm not wasting my time trying to convince them otherwise, it is their problem.  There are already so many societal norms I do not conform to, what is one more?  That said, I don't know if I'll proclaim my retirement to the world.  It is not their business.  If people ask what I do, I'll tell them whatever it is I'm doing then, whether or not it is considered a "job". 
Not caring what others think or conforming to social norms is generally one of my hallmarks.  However, experience has taught me, being more relatable and "average" makes meeting new people easier and makes existing relationships that aren't easily broken a bit easier (ie family). 


I also don't feel more useful at work than outside of work, and my job is not my identity.  The things I want to pursue in RE are more aligned with my values than what I do at work.  The longer I work the more likely I am to have a midlife crisis, not the other way around!

With this I have to agree 100 percent!

Classical_Liberal

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Re: 2022 FIRE cohort
« Reply #161 on: March 16, 2016, 07:11:48 PM »

I think, for whatever reason, most people want to be able to make a clean break from employment when the time comes. Personally, it's never been in the cards - side job #1 (ANG) adds so much value via lifelong cost savings if I finish my 20, that I have never seriously considered quitting it before retirement (thus 2022). Side job #2, I added for extra income and found I like it so much that I'll probably do it a few hours a week for my whole life just for the fun of it.

It complicates the planning, having various streams of income turning on and off over the years, and that may be another 'con' factor for the average FIRE enthusiast. There's something alluring about just setting a magic number based on 4% and making one single-minded effort to reach it. Nothing else to think about.

I think you hit the nail on the head.  I haven't found too many examples of people getting say 15-18X expenses and then cutting way back, let the funds grow passively (or actively) and work enough to fund living expenses only.  I have seen some threads touting the emotional advantage of taking a sabbatical year around that level and how little that impacted total work time, that was good stuff.  I think many of the personality types drawn to FI are efficient by nature, its almost always most efficient to get the most capital invested as quickly as possible.  Also, maybe once one does have 15-18X expenses, full freedom is so close it taunts them like Chuck Norris hitting on your girlfriend.  Another couple years may seem like a great trade off to get that to stop. 

I haven't made any decisions on this yet, but part time at 2020 seems a lot closer than no time at the end of 2022, but that's mainly because my hairline is receding at a faster rate each year!


I'm actually at the point where I could quit the FT now. I don't want to call it the crossover point because most people use that strictly for passive income...

Congrats! That's an awesome feeling!  I think many people on this forum who have such large savings rates could significantly cut work down tomorrow.  At half time I'd still have a better savings rate than most folks, don't think that hasn't crossed my mind :)

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Re: 2022 FIRE cohort
« Reply #162 on: March 17, 2016, 08:52:54 AM »
2022 is my target year, as our younger child will be done with college. I could probably retire sooner, but we have a large house with a large mortgage that takes a large cash flow to maintain. DW want to spend some time enjoying being empty nesters after the kids move out. We'll see whether she changes her mind as the years go by.

I like 2/22/22 - that will be my target date, unless there is some bonus or match patch pending. Less than 6 years to go!

Spitfire

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Re: 2022 FIRE cohort
« Reply #163 on: March 17, 2016, 09:16:43 AM »
I'm planning on doing the "almost FIRE" thing and 2022 is a good target. The goal is to have the mortgage paid off to keep monthly cash outflow low and maybe half the stache I would need for FI.

I'm a tax dude so I should not have a hard time finding seasonal/consulting work in the first few months of every year, and hopefully coast for the other 9 months on that. I think I would enjoy doing some one-off projects during the year as well, writing business plans, or setting up accounting systems, things like that to help small businesses. 
« Last Edit: March 17, 2016, 09:19:06 AM by Spitfire »

couponvan

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Re: 2022 FIRE cohort
« Reply #164 on: March 17, 2016, 11:11:37 AM »
2022 is my target year, as our younger child will be done with college. I could probably retire sooner, but we have a large house with a large mortgage that takes a large cash flow to maintain. DW want to spend some time enjoying being empty nesters after the kids move out. We'll see whether she changes her mind as the years go by.

I like 2/22/22 - that will be my target date, unless there is some bonus or match patch pending. Less than 6 years to go!

Good point...Mine should be 4/1/22....a full month of health care for being employed on the first day of the month, 401(k) matching vests for me on 3/31. My company offers a personal holiday that grants on 4/1 each year, so my last day could be my personal holiday day.  However, I think I will go for 4/15/22 and give my NOTICE on 4/1/22.  This gives me 4 months to front load Roth 401(k) contributions for the Roth ladder. We'll sell our house that year before FIRE, so will be able to use the capital from the house sale to live off of until the ladder is fully built out. We have two full years of pipeline built already that I consider our current "extreme" emergency fund, but we'll need to build 3 more years our first 3 years of FIRE.
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deadlymonkey

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Re: 2022 FIRE cohort
« Reply #165 on: April 21, 2016, 08:49:17 AM »
I will be eligible to retire with my military pension in 2022.  I will be FI then, undecided about FIRE though.  I may decide to work a little bit more on my terms.

zephyr911

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Re: 2022 FIRE cohort
« Reply #166 on: April 21, 2016, 08:59:30 AM »
My investing partner has officially set the same goal. He'll be 55. Should be fun chasing that together.
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dougules

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Re: 2022 FIRE cohort
« Reply #167 on: May 20, 2016, 11:51:11 AM »
Does anybody else have no real clue as to what their real FIRE year will be?  The math says it really could be anywhere from 2019 to 2027 for me.  Our official countdown day is Feb 1, 2025, but we've been using that for 2 years now.  Our numbers have changed.  Late 2022 is looking the most likely right now, but there's a really wide margin of error on that. 

We're still slowly whittling down our expenses, and who knows what the stock market will do over the next few years.  I really don't know what we'll spend on things like health care, travel, and taxes post-FIRE.  I know MMM has weighed in on these, but I'm honestly a bit more conservative on my numbers than him.  Tempering my pessimism could also change the numbers.   We're bare minimum 3 years out, though, so I still have time to be lazy about nailing down hard numbers.

I just find it interesting that there are threads for FIRE dates years from now.  Am I the only one that doesn't have a clue as to exactly when all the numbers will converge?

Axecleaver

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Re: 2022 FIRE cohort
« Reply #168 on: May 20, 2016, 12:14:03 PM »
There's tons of variability in when you reach the FIRE number. Ultimately you're trying to decide when you have "enough." The planning exercise for FIRE is to make some assumptions (ROR for portfolio growth, inflation, wage growth), create some milestones (max 401k, save $x in taxable by x date) and monitor it as you go.

I think as you get closer, you have to merge that into your other plans, and be flexible. Like, if you were to lose your job six months before your date, would you go through the effort to find a new gig and work at it for six months? Probably not. You pair up some income generation with some expense reduction and you get there.

There's also the issue of specific events. Some folks want to FIRE when their kids graduate college, or (in my case) when a work project ends.

couponvan

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Re: 2022 FIRE cohort
« Reply #169 on: May 20, 2016, 12:54:56 PM »
My date coincides with youngest child's high school graduation/college acceptance. We will be FI before that "technically" but RE isn't sure until we have the college costs locked in.  I'd hate to say "no" if she got into Harvard or something like that....(Not that I hold out high hopes of that - you just never know and that is our one big variable.) I was upset there was no help from my parents for college, and while I agree I got valuable learning experience from working my way through college, I want to give more to my children if I am able.

Now if DH or I get laid off somewhere in there, all our plans get rearranged.  For now, 2022 is the best planned date for me.  It might even be 2020 if an older kid gets scholarships.

My office thinks my "early retirement" date is 2026, when she graduates....Shh - don't tell them.
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rachael talcott

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Re: 2022 FIRE cohort
« Reply #170 on: May 20, 2016, 06:41:37 PM »
Quote
Does anybody else have no real clue as to what their real FIRE year will be?

I honestly thought that it would be 2022 until a few months ago when I ran the numbers and decided that I could make it work in mid-2017.  So until a little more than a year out, I had no clue. 

Ladychips

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Re: 2022 FIRE cohort
« Reply #171 on: May 20, 2016, 08:47:24 PM »
Options, options.  My earliest eligible date is 6/30/21, my full retirement date (pension) is 6/30/28...but my husband is going to retire on 6/30/22, and I don't think I can get up and go to work every day when he doesn't.  So I'm shooting for 2022 too!!

Playing with Fire UK

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Re: 2022 FIRE cohort
« Reply #172 on: May 21, 2016, 01:28:13 AM »
Quote
Does anybody else have no real clue as to what their real FIRE year will be?

I honestly thought that it would be 2022 until a few months ago when I ran the numbers and decided that I could make it work in mid-2017.  So until a little more than a year out, I had no clue.

Wow, that is great news. Have you changed your spending plans or SWR?

rachael talcott

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Re: 2022 FIRE cohort
« Reply #173 on: May 21, 2016, 08:28:01 AM »
Quote
Does anybody else have no real clue as to what their real FIRE year will be?

I honestly thought that it would be 2022 until a few months ago when I ran the numbers and decided that I could make it work in mid-2017.  So until a little more than a year out, I had no clue.

Wow, that is great news. Have you changed your spending plans or SWR?

All my retirement savings is in rental property, so SWR doesn't really apply.  I calculate income for each property by subtracting insurance, tax, maintenance, and estimated vacancies from rent.  So one factor that changed was that I had been assuming that rent would rise at the inflation rate.  But it has been rising faster and I didn't realize it until now.  Apparently an older landlord who owned hundreds of houses in town retired and sold his property, taking it out of the rental market.  I am just finishing my fourth property, which I purchased at an unusually good price. My four properties here will bring in $28K/yr. 

The second factor was that buying a cheaper-than-expected fourth rental house allowed me to pay off my mortgage, decreasing my spending.  I am currently spending about $1000/mo (and my survival spending level is even less), so the $28K is plenty for now.

And the third factor was that I decided to sell a far-away property that I used to live in.  It will fund the purchase of three more properties here. I plan to buy and repair one a year (as I have been doing for four years while employed).  That will bring me to $49K/yr.  I will save and increase my net worth in those first years of retirement and eventually sell all the properties to move to a better location. 

I moved here for my job, not knowing that it was a great rental area, but I think that for the right kind of mustachian, it would make sense to move to a place like this where the rent/buy ratio is high.  Every time I buy a property, my net worth instantly goes up because I am paying less for them than they're worth.  And then I rent them and get income on top of that.  Someone who has $250K cash could come in, buy one house to live in and two to fix up, and be financially independent, albeit with a fairly slim margin.  The catch is that you have to have house repair skills.  But I've found that I can figure out most things by reading online.  MMM's post about PEX plumbing has saved me thousands.

RT

Playing with Fire UK

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Re: 2022 FIRE cohort
« Reply #174 on: May 21, 2016, 04:01:46 PM »
Epic, good work RT!

dougules

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Re: 2022 FIRE cohort
« Reply #175 on: May 23, 2016, 10:59:00 AM »
There's tons of variability in when you reach the FIRE number. Ultimately you're trying to decide when you have "enough." The planning exercise for FIRE is to make some assumptions (ROR for portfolio growth, inflation, wage growth), create some milestones (max 401k, save $x in taxable by x date) and monitor it as you go.

I think as you get closer, you have to merge that into your other plans, and be flexible. Like, if you were to lose your job six months before your date, would you go through the effort to find a new gig and work at it for six months? Probably not. You pair up some income generation with some expense reduction and you get there.

There's also the issue of specific events. Some folks want to FIRE when their kids graduate college, or (in my case) when a work project ends.

I think we've got a handle everything going into it and the milestones.   We're still working on the exact numbers, though.  We've been tracking our expenses for nearly 2 years now.  Even if we did have exact numbers, though, there are so many variables that the exact timing is extremely fuzzy.   

We personally don't have any specific event driving it.  It's just whenever the numbers meet, whether that happens tomorrow (unlikely) or 15 years from now. 

Quote
Does anybody else have no real clue as to what their real FIRE year will be?

I honestly thought that it would be 2022 until a few months ago when I ran the numbers and decided that I could make it work in mid-2017.  So until a little more than a year out, I had no clue.

Wow, sweet.  Congrats. 

We have one rental property, but I don't think we're cut out to be landlords for more than that.  We actually sold a second because it was too much of an annoyance. 

rachael talcott

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Re: 2022 FIRE cohort
« Reply #176 on: May 24, 2016, 01:52:24 PM »


Quote
Does anybody else have no real clue as to what their real FIRE year will be?

I honestly thought that it would be 2022 until a few months ago when I ran the numbers and decided that I could make it work in mid-2017.  So until a little more than a year out, I had no clue.

Wow, sweet.  Congrats. 

We have one rental property, but I don't think we're cut out to be landlords for more than that.  We actually sold a second because it was too much of an annoyance.
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Thanks. It is some work, but about a thousand times less work than my regular job.  I have a friend who also has rentals, and we trade off dealing with emergencies if something happens while one of us is traveling or otherwise unavailable. 

zephyr911

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Re: 2022 FIRE cohort
« Reply #177 on: May 25, 2016, 01:00:21 PM »
...let's be careful to differentiate "landlord" and "property manager".

I'm not cut out for the latter at all, but I'm a damn good landlord. I'm planning on retiring on landlording, and taking some others with me.
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dougules

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Re: 2022 FIRE cohort
« Reply #178 on: May 27, 2016, 10:04:54 AM »
...let's be careful to differentiate "landlord" and "property manager".

I'm not cut out for the latter at all, but I'm a damn good landlord. I'm planning on retiring on landlording, and taking some others with me.

I think that's the heart of the issue.  Our current property management company is just downright terrible.  Are there good ones out there?

zephyr911

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Re: 2022 FIRE cohort
« Reply #179 on: May 27, 2016, 10:14:25 AM »
...let's be careful to differentiate "landlord" and "property manager".

I'm not cut out for the latter at all, but I'm a damn good landlord. I'm planning on retiring on landlording, and taking some others with me.

I think that's the heart of the issue.  Our current property management company is just downright terrible.  Are there good ones out there?
I'm pretty ruttin' happy with mine, which - if you believe their sales pitch - was founded by investors who hated their property managers and believed it could be done better. So, it sort of validates the theory of widespread frustration, but also shows there are exceptions.
I am not a cog. I am an organizational lubricant.

dougules

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Re: 2022 FIRE cohort
« Reply #180 on: May 27, 2016, 02:03:55 PM »
...let's be careful to differentiate "landlord" and "property manager".

I'm not cut out for the latter at all, but I'm a damn good landlord. I'm planning on retiring on landlording, and taking some others with me.

I think that's the heart of the issue.  Our current property management company is just downright terrible.  Are there good ones out there?
I'm pretty ruttin' happy with mine, which - if you believe their sales pitch - was founded by investors who hated their property managers and believed it could be done better. So, it sort of validates the theory of widespread frustration, but also shows there are exceptions.

I see you're in N AL, too, so if you're willing to give them some free advertisement, send me a message with their contact info  We plan to fire ours whenever there's a vacancy. 

2Birds1Stone

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Re: 2022 FIRE cohort
« Reply #181 on: June 02, 2016, 06:18:36 AM »
Just checking in with my classmates.

May was an incredible leap forward in terms of progress to FI.

As of today I have 12X barebones living expenses and 8X current expenses saved.

Feeling better and better about FIRE in 2022 :)

How about everyone else? Markets are really close to all time highs and have recovered from the 15% drop we had last fall/this winter.
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https://forum.mrmoneymustache.com/journals/fire-by-thirty-five-chronicles-36-months-till-sabbatical!/

homestead neohio

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Re: 2022 FIRE cohort
« Reply #182 on: June 02, 2016, 11:49:08 AM »
I keep putting money into the markets and checking personal capital too often.  My highest net worth was back in April.  I'm about on track for 2016 savings goals.  After an initial flurry of optimizing, I feel like I'm more in a long slow slog.  So I'm trying to focus on living awesome now and not thinking too much about how far off FIRE might be.

2B1S inspired me to calculate my multiples.  I have saved 8x my current annual expenses and 14x my annual planned retirement expenses.  Anticipated FIRE expenses are lower as I plan to retire the mortgage prior to FIRE and use more of my time to grow food.


Classical_Liberal

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Re: 2022 FIRE cohort
« Reply #183 on: June 03, 2016, 11:17:56 AM »
Motivation for an asset check, thanks 2birds!

A little over six years expenses for my anticipated retirement spending (which is actually about 20 % higher than current).  26.7% funded at a 4%SWR.  33.4% at a 5%SWR...yummy!

couponvan

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Re: 2022 FIRE cohort
« Reply #184 on: June 03, 2016, 01:08:45 PM »
15X my planned retirement expenses saved.  However much of that is pretax saving, so I'll need to be careful about the Roth IRA ladder construction if I want my nest to go further.
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2Birds1Stone

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Re: 2022 FIRE cohort
« Reply #185 on: June 03, 2016, 01:48:32 PM »
15X my planned retirement expenses saved.  However much of that is pretax saving, so I'll need to be careful about the Roth IRA ladder construction if I want my nest to go further.

Depending on your FIRE budget you very well could end up near 0% effective tax rate in FIRE.
"A small house can hold as much happiness as a big one." - Fortune Cookie

33 Months till FIRE - Stop by, or stay a while.....
https://forum.mrmoneymustache.com/journals/fire-by-thirty-five-chronicles-36-months-till-sabbatical!/

couponvan

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Re: 2022 FIRE cohort
« Reply #186 on: June 04, 2016, 08:00:22 PM »
15X my planned retirement expenses saved.  However much of that is pretax saving, so I'll need to be careful about the Roth IRA ladder construction if I want my nest to go further.

Depending on your FIRE budget you very well could end up near 0% effective tax rate in FIRE.

That's the plan!
Why the hell are we going shopping? Buy sh*t, return other sh*t, go through sh*t and donate sh*t. Complain about having too much sh*t. Repeat. (Bracken Joy 2/17)




boarder42

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Re: 2022 FIRE cohort
« Reply #187 on: June 05, 2016, 02:31:26 PM »
We should cross half a million net worth in the next month. But around 150k of that is in a house. With some extra capital coming in thru buying on SD and reselling on cl I may be able to still meet 2022. But when we upgraded our house to lake front it put 2 years extra on to fire. So we'll  see. All depends on market performance and if I can convince my wife to come to my company.
PM me about how to save 6% on your annual grocery Bill!

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dougules

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Re: 2022 FIRE cohort
« Reply #188 on: July 14, 2016, 11:16:35 AM »
Is it 2022 yet?

jalich

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Re: 2022 FIRE cohort
« Reply #189 on: July 14, 2016, 12:56:21 PM »
So I'm pretty late to this cohort party, but I'm shooting for a 2022 FIRE date as well. Like another poster earlier in the thread, I liked the look of 2/22/22, and I needed a goal, so that's my date! We have about $214k in assets, no debt, and are saving about $10,000/month between tax-advantaged and post-tax accounts so I think we are looking good with no real dependency on stock market returns to do much of the heavy lifting.


I have more details in my journal for you financial voyeurs. I just started it yesterday while re-reading the MMM article about making goals public so it's still in the development stages.


http://forum.mrmoneymustache.com/journals/22222-58656/


couponvan

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Re: 2022 FIRE cohort
« Reply #190 on: July 14, 2016, 02:34:23 PM »
Is it 2022 yet?
Lol!!

How sad is it that I am contemplating adding 3 months to my FIRE date to save another $65,000 f
to pay for a house keeper twice a month for the rest of my RE life....100x26=2,600*25=$65,000 at a 4% withdrawal rate. I think we can still make 2022....
Why the hell are we going shopping? Buy sh*t, return other sh*t, go through sh*t and donate sh*t. Complain about having too much sh*t. Repeat. (Bracken Joy 2/17)




dougules

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Re: 2022 FIRE cohort
« Reply #191 on: July 14, 2016, 03:23:31 PM »
Is it 2022 yet?
Lol!!

How sad is it that I am contemplating adding 3 months to my FIRE date to save another $65,000 f
to pay for a house keeper twice a month for the rest of my RE life....100x26=2,600*25=$65,000 at a 4% withdrawal rate. I think we can still make 2022....

Go punch yourself in the face! 

If it's worth another 3 months, it's worth another 3 months.  Just imagine that it's July 14, 2022 right now and you've just reached no-housekeeper-level FI.  Yay!  Now get back to work because you've got to stick it out until October for that housekeeper.  How's it sounding?
« Last Edit: July 14, 2016, 03:25:47 PM by dougules »

Ladychips

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Re: 2022 FIRE cohort
« Reply #192 on: July 14, 2016, 03:39:53 PM »
OMG!  I never thought about my housekeeper that way.  But, yeah, I'd work another year to keep her.  Maybe even two...

couponvan

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Re: 2022 FIRE cohort
« Reply #193 on: July 14, 2016, 06:03:20 PM »
Is it 2022 yet?
Lol!!

How sad is it that I am contemplating adding 3 months to my FIRE date to save another $65,000 f
to pay for a house keeper twice a month for the rest of my RE life....100x26=2,600*25=$65,000 at a 4% withdrawal rate. I think we can still make 2022....

Go punch yourself in the face! 

If it's worth another 3 months, it's worth another 3 months.  Just imagine that it's July 14, 2022 right now and you've just reached no-housekeeper-level FI.  Yay!  Now get back to work because you've got to stick it out until October for that housekeeper.  How's it sounding?

Depends on how much fun I am having in my job....in July 2022 having to work through busy season to October would stink. If I hit FI in October....then heck yeah making it to January is a no brainer. Timing is everything!
Why the hell are we going shopping? Buy sh*t, return other sh*t, go through sh*t and donate sh*t. Complain about having too much sh*t. Repeat. (Bracken Joy 2/17)




frugaldevil

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Re: 2022 FIRE cohort
« Reply #194 on: July 15, 2016, 07:05:36 PM »
Wanted to join the thread as we're also shooting for 2022 for FI. We'll be 45 that year. Currently at 11x our post-FI expenses, but only really put the hammer down on tax-efficient savings in the last year or two.

And a house cleaner twice a month is included in those post-FI expenses. :)

TheMadRussian

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Re: 2022 FIRE cohort
« Reply #195 on: July 17, 2016, 11:48:58 AM »
Joining the fun too.

2022 is the target right now. By then, our primary residence will be paid off, my son's 529 will be fully funded, and we'll have enough income from our rental properties alone to cover our living expenses.

First thing I'll be doing is loading up the Sprinter van and taking myself and son to Alaska for the summer. Going there has been a lifelong dream of mine, and something I had soooo wanted to do with my dad when I was a kid. Can't wait.

Mrs. Healthywealth

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Re: 2022 FIRE cohort
« Reply #196 on: July 17, 2016, 02:54:23 PM »
Adding myself on as well. 

6 more years...part of me is looking forward to having it fly by, but the other part wants to slow it down so I can enjoy the moment with my kids.  Crappy days at work can make it seem much slower, but I started adding more things that I enjoy which seems to help.

I'm wondering if anyone is contemplating becoming more conservative with their AA given we are only 6yrs from FI?  I'm considering adding in some Long Term Treasuries and REIT just to add some more diversity, but it's just a thought for now. I want to do some more reading on it before making any changes.

I'll be 43 at FI, and plan to still work PT for several more years just to take very expensive vacations and sock away some extra $$.

2Birds1Stone

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Re: 2022 FIRE cohort
« Reply #197 on: July 17, 2016, 04:21:12 PM »
Common advice for soon to be retirees is to increase bond exposure......however sustaining a longer than normal retirement requires higher stock exposure in order to maximize returns. Right now bond yields are low, so I wouldn't over emphasize them. Still to your IPS, if you don't have an IPS write one up.
Adding myself on as well. 

6 more years...part of me is looking forward to having it fly by, but the other part wants to slow it down so I can enjoy the moment with my kids.  Crappy days at work can make it seem much slower, but I started adding more things that I enjoy which seems to help.

I'm wondering if anyone is contemplating becoming more conservative with their AA given we are only 6yrs from FI?  I'm considering adding in some Long Term Treasuries and REIT just to add some more diversity, but it's just a thought for now. I want to do some more reading on it before making any changes.

I'll be 43 at FI, and plan to still work PT for several more years just to take very expensive vacations and sock away some extra $$.
"A small house can hold as much happiness as a big one." - Fortune Cookie

33 Months till FIRE - Stop by, or stay a while.....
https://forum.mrmoneymustache.com/journals/fire-by-thirty-five-chronicles-36-months-till-sabbatical!/

waltworks

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Re: 2022 FIRE cohort
« Reply #198 on: July 17, 2016, 06:05:44 PM »
We're in the early 2020s timeframe, probably. But that's because my wife decided to retire way ahead of time, and because we decided we might as well live somewhere we really wanted to and have 50% of our NW tied up in a house - so unmustachian!

Combine those and we're ~5 years out. And if we have a third kid, that'll knock us back a bit again. But we both decided a while back that instead of aiming for some arbitrary date, we'd focus on living our lives the way we wanted to *now* and let the money situation sort itself out (keeping in mind that we're extremely frugal on everything but the damn house). It's so hard for us to spend money on anything we actually want that it seemed silly to keep noses to the grindstone just to move up FIRE date by a few years. Instead we do a lot of long bike rides, hikes with the kids, and beers at 2pm "after work".

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homestead neohio

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Re: 2022 FIRE cohort
« Reply #199 on: July 18, 2016, 10:17:53 AM »
I'm wondering if anyone is contemplating becoming more conservative with their AA given we are only 6yrs from FI?  I'm considering adding in some Long Term Treasuries and REIT just to add some more diversity, but it's just a thought for now. I want to do some more reading on it before making any changes.

No, I'm still 90% equities, 10% REIT until I hit FI.  It has a higher likelihood of propelling me to FI faster than going with bonds.  However, I am considering what AA I'll want when I'm in ER.  I can stomach the dips just fine in accumulation phase (stocks are on sale!) but I don't think it would be quite the same in drawdown.  I'm still fairly risk tolerant, but don't want to have to sell stocks in a down market just to pay baseline expenses.  Just starting to mull this over given 6 years out, but I want to have the plan in place and a chance to reconsider it a few times before pulling the trigger.  Converting from "accumulation AA" to "drawdown AA" may be interesting, too.  Probably won't be done overnight, and any changes in taxable accounts will have to be considered for tax liability due to gains.  But I can't just take gains in tax-deferred accounts, which I'll be too young to access, and there is a 5 year delay on the ROTH conversion ladder. The sooner I figure out what I'll be transitioning to, the sooner I can plan how to do it efficiently.  Anyone else pondering this?