Author Topic: UK Saving / investment progress updates  (Read 612 times)

Monkeytennis

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UK Saving / investment progress updates
« on: August 13, 2017, 05:39:01 AM »
Hi everyone, I suspect many UK posters will have seen a surge in their investments and FIRE progress as the pound has fallen in value post Brexit, but even accounting for that I thought it would be good to share our saving / investing progress, I know a lot of people have been tracking their progress for a long time and I thought it would be interesting to compare and contrast?

Also if you have a forward forecast, that would be interesting to see too.

skip207

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Re: UK Saving / investment progress updates
« Reply #1 on: August 14, 2017, 04:14:50 AM »
Rough perf over the last few years for me.

2014 +37%
2015 +22%
2016 +29%
2017 YTD +14%

This includes contributions as well as growth.  2015 was lower due to house move.
Goal is 30% YOY.

sea_saw

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Re: UK Saving / investment progress updates
« Reply #2 on: August 15, 2017, 04:35:39 AM »
I'm really curious to know how everyone tracks their investment progress, especially keeping track of what's new contributions vs performance of your funds, rebalancing, etc. I was kind of surprised to find you couldn't get historical reports automatically out of the platform I was using. It was easy for me at the time because I basically put in a lump sum, but when I start investing again it'll be more fiddly. So feel free to share spreadsheet templates as well as actual numbers!

Not that I plan to be obsessive about checking, but just to get a grip on basic record-keeping. Do you just have a simple table with rows for each thing you've invested in, and columns for their value at various points in time? And/or do you have a table of all the transactions, and summarise that with formulas? Etc.

I can say that my set-it-and-forget-it contribution of 12,000 in April 2015 reached 15,000 and change in April 2017 when I decided to take it out to buy my flat. I had 66% equities 33% bonds, and a geographical split of 30% UK, 30% US, 15% EUR, 15% Japan and pacific, 10% emerging markets. I also kept as much again in cash savings (actually, more than what I put in to the ISA, which I was a bit uncertain about doing at all).

This was before I found MMM etc, I would build a portfolio very differently if I was in that position again today. But various life things happened and plans changed. I'm glad I was encouraged to do SOMETHING other than just continue to keep the whole lot in the bank for another decade, and I'm extra glad I got lucky with the timing for what turned out to be a much shorter term investment than I thought it would be when I started it.

poppydog

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Re: UK Saving / investment progress updates
« Reply #3 on: August 15, 2017, 10:18:58 AM »
Good thread.  I checked back, and including contributions:

2013 +10.3%
2014 +22.1%
2015 +21.9%
2016 +25.8%
2017 to date +19.0

We started to ramp up our savings rate from 2014 onwards, after I worked out that we had a good chance of reaching our goals by 2018 with greater focus.  So far, this is working out well.

sea_saws question about record keeping is interesting.  To properly know how much of your growth is down to your inputs, and how much down to investment performance, requires some nifty spreadsheet work usually referred to as "unitisation."  At a starting point, you divide your pot into, say, units worth 100 each.  Each time you invest some money, you value the portfolio and the money going in "buys" more units at the new rate.  I started doing this for a a few months and then gave it up - it wasn't worth the hassle.
 
« Last Edit: August 15, 2017, 10:28:58 AM by poppydog »

Monkeytennis

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Re: UK Saving / investment progress updates
« Reply #4 on: August 15, 2017, 11:17:17 AM »
End year net worth figures:

2007 - 13,097
2008 - 21,202
2009 - 32,110
2010 - 45,770
2012 - 60,652
2013 - 90,621
2014 - 112,311
2015 - 153,220 (purchased a house in this year)
2016 - 193,687
2017 - 286,771 ytd
(Just noticed I missed a year off, will update later)

This excludes my cash emergency fund

I've only been tracking investment / equities return for 5 years, over which the compound number is

5 years 72% increase.
3 years 36% increase
1 year 12% increase

These compound numbers exclude contributions and is investment return only.
« Last Edit: August 15, 2017, 12:30:30 PM by Monkeytennis »

sea_saw

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Re: UK Saving / investment progress updates
« Reply #5 on: August 15, 2017, 02:40:29 PM »
AHA, thanks folks.

Monkeytennis, nice to know that despite my conservative ratio of stocks and inexpert picks my 25% over 2015-2017 wasn't wildly off.

Poppydog, unitisation that was exactly the keyword I needed. If anyone else wants to read a bit more about it, monevator had the best summary here http://monevator.com/how-to-unitize-your-portfolio/. I genuinely own that mug that says 'I <3 spreadsheets', so I may well do this just for the fun of working out how to set it all up (when I next have anything to invest).

I can see the importance of unitising your tracking if you're tracking the movement of money coming in and out, but it's definitely not necessary for most of us here, myself included. I wonder, if your main aim is to see how much of the increase in your numbers is you earning and contributing more dosh vs the performance of the actual assets, if you wouldn't be better off simply keeping track of how much money you're adding in a given time period (whether 500/month, 5k/month, or irregular sums) and doing a straightforward subtraction from your totals. Then you know how much you'd have if you'd kept it under a mattress instead!

poppydog

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Re: UK Saving / investment progress updates
« Reply #6 on: August 16, 2017, 02:03:41 AM »
sea-saw, your last paragraph above just about describes what I do.  I add up all the inputs into our pots I make over the year, then any excess returns I mentally ascribe to my investment profits.  As long as I'm moving forward not too far short of the general markets I'm happy.
« Last Edit: August 16, 2017, 02:06:16 AM by poppydog »

poppydog

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Re: UK Saving / investment progress updates
« Reply #7 on: August 16, 2017, 02:24:43 AM »
Monkeytennis, that's pretty impressive for one decade.  May I ask what your target is?

I only started taking a keen interest in this topic towards the end of 2012.  Mrs PD and me both had current and previous employers' DC pension funds, and quite a lot of cash savings.  I discovered the tax benefits of SIPPs (I'm a higher rate tax payer) and started to move the cash into SIPPs, then started to max up my DC pension contributions with my employer.  I consolidated the old employer pension funds too into our SIPPs.

We targeted the end of June 2018 to retire, my wife's 60th birthday.  I worked out that we'd need 550,000 to invest in income biased funds and trusts, on top of some DB pensions that we have coming on stream, to replicate our net pre-retirement income - it is the maintenance of our net income level that defined our target.

As you can see we've smashed the target, with just another 10 months or so to work.  Mrs MP doesn't want to go earlier for professional reasons, and so we just keep adding to the pot.  Maybe we'll just blow the excess on extra holidays, or pass it on to the kids  / grandkids.

Anyway, here's our hard numbers from the end of 2012 onwards:

2012 - 277,774
2013 - 306,262
2014 - 373,957
2015 - 455,900
2016 - 573,324
2017 - 677,121 ( to date.)

londonstache

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Re: UK Saving / investment progress updates
« Reply #8 on: August 16, 2017, 03:12:36 AM »
You'll notice some general foolishness has taken place in previous years when I give you net worth from when I started tracking it and taking an interest. I tend to track at the end of tax years, so here we go:

2013  -5,800 (estimated) - much face punching occurring here
2014  2,510
2015  30,464.25
2016  53,350.64
2017  136,888.38 (65,188.38)
2017  156,012 YTD (80,412)

Mrs londonstache and I have bought a house this year which has spiked the net worth somewhat as there was an eye-watering deposit paid on the purchase. I've calculated net worth to include the purchase price of the property minus outstanding mortgage due. I'm still not sure if I can include property in net worth as it has no impact on FIRE unless we move and downsize, so I've put the non-property amount in brackets.

Getting married flattened the curve somewhat in 2016 but back in prime staching mode now. I personally should be close to breaking the 6-figure mark by the end of this next tax year in non-property net worth.Collectively we're around the 250k mark. FIRE still some considerable distance off but making steady progress.

skip207

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Re: UK Saving / investment progress updates
« Reply #9 on: August 16, 2017, 03:35:48 AM »
Personally at this stage (T-5 years FIRE) I include the primary property equity.

As we get closer to FIRE there will be a lot of adjusting to be done anyway.

Monkeytennis

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Re: UK Saving / investment progress updates
« Reply #10 on: August 16, 2017, 11:52:52 AM »
Poppydog, these are my figures and don't include my wife's. However we plan forwards together want to hit about 3.5m. But that's based on some pretty basic maths, it isn't inflation adjusted and I suspect we'll end up with some lifestyle inflation which will reduce it.

dreams_and_discoveries

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Re: UK Saving / investment progress updates
« Reply #11 on: August 16, 2017, 02:50:24 PM »
Monkeytennis, that's pretty impressive for one decade.  May I ask what your target is?

I only started taking a keen interest in this topic towards the end of 2012.  Mrs PD and me both had current and previous employers' DC pension funds, and quite a lot of cash savings.  I discovered the tax benefits of SIPPs (I'm a higher rate tax payer) and started to move the cash into SIPPs, then started to max up my DC pension contributions with my employer.  I consolidated the old employer pension funds too into our SIPPs.

We targeted the end of June 2018 to retire, my wife's 60th birthday.  I worked out that we'd need 550,000 to invest in income biased funds and trusts, on top of some DB pensions that we have coming on stream, to replicate our net pre-retirement income - it is the maintenance of our net income level that defined our target.

As you can see we've smashed the target, with just another 10 months or so to work.  Mrs MP doesn't want to go earlier for professional reasons, and so we just keep adding to the pot.  Maybe we'll just blow the excess on extra holidays, or pass it on to the kids  / grandkids.

Anyway, here's our hard numbers from the end of 2012 onwards:

2012 - 277,774
2013 - 306,262
2014 - 373,957
2015 - 455,900
2016 - 573,324
2017 - 677,121 ( to date.)

Congrats, you are in a great position, must be so freeing, to know you can effectively quit anytime.

frugledoc

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Re: UK Saving / investment progress updates
« Reply #12 on: August 16, 2017, 03:14:11 PM »
I've sort of stopped tracking it over the last few months so updated tonight.

I don't have any figures from before Mid 2014 because I didn't track things. 

Jan 2015   -   495,000
Jan 2016   -   589,000
Jan 2017   -   770,000
July 2017  -   854,000

Not included - DB Pension valued at approx 330,000
                   -  Spouses assets
                   -  Home equity as I don't own a home

I have been working like a dog for the last few years, and with recent arrival of my second child (beautiful son), I'm pulling back a bit which will impact my earned income.

I'm 38, and would like to retire at 45, or maybe 50, stretch target 55 - 60.  Quite conflicted, I like my job so guess I am happy to be almost FI and can just leave the RE bit until I get fed up. 

FI would be 1 million, but would like to get to 1.5 to 2million as I would like to spend more money when I retire, although I'm sure growing up kids will be happy to help me do that lol.

Also,  my NW could plummet a lot in a crash, as it is heavily invested, with no cash or bonds, but I'm happy with the risk.
« Last Edit: August 16, 2017, 03:22:38 PM by frugledoc »

poppydog

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Re: UK Saving / investment progress updates
« Reply #13 on: August 17, 2017, 04:20:13 AM »
Poppydog, these are my figures and don't include my wife's. However we plan forwards together want to hit about 3.5m. But that's based on some pretty basic maths, it isn't inflation adjusted and I suspect we'll end up with some lifestyle inflation which will reduce it.

Wow, that's a great target.  Well done MonkeyT, I'm awestruck!