Author Topic: Race from $1M to $2M  (Read 532153 times)

Dicey

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Re: Race from $1M to $2M
« Reply #550 on: April 18, 2018, 01:54:33 AM »
Joining at the 1/2 way pit stop....$1.5 as of 12/31/17!
I guess I should be a bit more precise with my numbers....

12/31/17 - $1,518,400
03/31/18 - $1,578,900

Increase between 12/31 and 3/31 was mainly bonus related. The markets are wiggly this year.
Wow! That's a good-looking bonus!

couponvan

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Re: Race from $1M to $2M
« Reply #551 on: April 18, 2018, 07:42:55 AM »
Joining at the 1/2 way pit stop....$1.5 as of 12/31/17!
I guess I should be a bit more precise with my numbers....

12/31/17 - $1,518,400
03/31/18 - $1,578,900

Increase between 12/31 and 3/31 was mainly bonus related. The markets are wiggly this year.
Wow! That's a good-looking bonus!

Yeah - DH's bonus is up to 45% of his compensation for the year (in great years it can be 65%). It was a bad year this year, so the # was actually lower than in the past.  It's a big part of how we plan for FIRE - save the bonus, live on the lower salary.  It's also why he risks getting fired right before bonus payout days....

Jenny1974

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Re: Race from $1M to $2M
« Reply #552 on: April 18, 2018, 08:07:13 AM »
So I believe I briefly bounced over $2 million for a while before the market dropped.  Should I stay in this thread or move on??


couponvan

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Re: Race from $1M to $2M
« Reply #553 on: April 18, 2018, 08:25:57 AM »
So I believe I briefly bounced over $2 million for a while before the market dropped.  Should I stay in this thread or move on??

Congrats!! You stay in the thread until you feel you've really reached the finish line.  :-).  Does $2MM feel more exciting than $1MM?

Bateaux

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Re: Race from $1M to $2M
« Reply #554 on: April 18, 2018, 11:13:16 AM »
So I believe I briefly bounced over $2 million for a while before the market dropped.  Should I stay in this thread or move on??

Congrats!! You stay in the thread until you feel you've really reached the finish line.  :-).  Does $2MM feel more exciting than $1MM?

We just tipped over the 2M liquid point a couple of months ago.   It's retracted a few times.  Personally I'm ready to put that milestone behind and move forward.  The 2M point is pretty much what I'm planning to benchmark as the low watermark for FIRE.   The goal is 2.5M then retire.  However, any dips below 2M would immediately call for emergency spending only measures and possibly job hunting.  Currently home shopping in Florida right now and will budget 300k to 400k for that.  That will have us working a two to five more years to pay down that debt.  Not sure what we do with current paid off home and property.  Selling it could bring 250k maybe more and would help offset the new home and work less years.  May just give it to our kids.  Time will tell.  By the way, the 1M mark excited me briefly.  Then realized that would barely pay for health care, the excitement faded.

Jenny1974

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Re: Race from $1M to $2M
« Reply #555 on: April 18, 2018, 11:35:38 AM »
So I believe I briefly bounced over $2 million for a while before the market dropped.  Should I stay in this thread or move on??

Congrats!! You stay in the thread until you feel you've really reached the finish line.  :-).  Does $2MM feel more exciting than $1MM?

More like a "well, that's pretty cool" moment!

couponvan

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Re: Race from $1M to $2M
« Reply #556 on: April 18, 2018, 12:02:22 PM »
So I believe I briefly bounced over $2 million for a while before the market dropped.  Should I stay in this thread or move on??

Congrats!! You stay in the thread until you feel you've really reached the finish line.  :-).  Does $2MM feel more exciting than $1MM?

More like a "well, that's pretty cool" moment!

I'm with @Bateaux that I want $2.0M plus a paid off house ($400K-$500K ish range) and I have to have "crossed" that line for sure before I'm comfortable pulling back.  It's super cool you've hit that # even if it didn't stick.  I've got plenty of time in this race left before I get to where I'm aiming.

ysette9

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Re: Race from $1M to $2M
« Reply #557 on: April 19, 2018, 02:33:38 PM »
This thread made me pull up some stuff and do some arithmetic. I just realized that if you include home equity (which I don’t), then we crossed over the $2M mark recently. Since home equity doesn’t pay my bills, i don’t include it, but at least we can unequivocally say now that we are millionaires. :) Previously it wasn’t certain since you could argue that with two people, the individual net worth is half of the total household net work.

It is embarrassing to be on this forum, report those numbers, and not be FI. HCOL for the win!

MMMdude

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Re: Race from $1M to $2M
« Reply #558 on: April 28, 2018, 02:09:50 PM »
I'm a Canuck so the recent malaisse has been worse for me as the Canadian index didn't do much of anything versus the huge S&P gains November to end of January.  So for about 7 months my net worth has decreased despite plowing in 75% of my income into investments.  Oh well it's all part of the process and this small blip is nothing compared to a true bear market.  I continue to hold steady in my 70/30 portfolio and hopefully can hit the $2M mark in about 6 years when I reach 48....currently around $1.2M.  I believe at $2M I will be good to never work again.

DavidAnnArbor

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Re: Race from $1M to $2M
« Reply #559 on: May 03, 2018, 03:57:26 PM »
I'm a Canuck so the recent malaisse has been worse for me as the Canadian index didn't do much of anything versus the huge S&P gains November to end of January.  So for about 7 months my net worth has decreased despite plowing in 75% of my income into investments.  Oh well it's all part of the process and this small blip is nothing compared to a true bear market.  I continue to hold steady in my 70/30 portfolio and hopefully can hit the $2M mark in about 6 years when I reach 48....currently around $1.2M.  I believe at $2M I will be good to never work again.

I have a feeling the malaise you're experiencing will be repeated in the US indices.

Bateaux

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Re: Race from $1M to $2M
« Reply #560 on: May 03, 2018, 09:48:18 PM »
We've entered into the horse latitudes.

talltexan

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Re: Race from $1M to $2M
« Reply #561 on: May 04, 2018, 08:38:33 AM »
TallTexan HH net worth has roughly doubled over the last five years. Surely it would be possible to add that much again over the next five, so that would be a 50% increase from where we are today.

aspiringnomad

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Re: Race from $1M to $2M
« Reply #562 on: May 04, 2018, 09:57:03 AM »
6/30/17: 1.002 million, two months shy of my 35th birthday
1/17/18: 1.219 million, 4.5 months after my 35th birthday

Feels like this crazy market has put things into hyperdrive. Hoping I've got enough buffer to remain in the two comma club through the next correction, but who knows?

Total HH net worth now at 1.281. With the market down/sideways I've been throwing any and all cash I can scrounge into stocks. Even if there's still a ways down to go, I'm thinking I'll be happy I did over the long-term.

Herbert Derp

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Re: Race from $1M to $2M
« Reply #563 on: May 18, 2018, 01:45:59 AM »
Getting solidly into $1MM territory now...

11/23/2012: $45,000.00
08/03/2013: $100,000.00
01/01/2016: $408,896.04
01/01/2017: $617,283.09
06/06/2017: $758,104.40
10/15/2017: $856,488.71
11/18/2017: $929,536.54
11/27/2017: $944,395.35
12/17/2017: $956,928.07
01/01/2018: $968,307.87
01/05/2018: $987,442.11
01/08/2018: $996,215.32
01/09/2018: $998,819.79
01/10/2018: $999,079.24
01/11/2018: $1,003,101.34
02/01/2018: $1,061,732.89
02/28/2018: $1,062,750.48
05/18/2018: $1,149,432.76

talltexan

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Re: Race from $1M to $2M
« Reply #564 on: May 21, 2018, 08:12:36 AM »
It's nice when people call into Dave Ramsey's "Millionaire Hour" with lower net worths than you, ain't it?

Fomerly known as something

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Re: Race from $1M to $2M
« Reply #565 on: May 22, 2018, 05:54:29 AM »
It's nice when people call into Dave Ramsey's "Millionaire Hour" with lower net worths than you, ain't it?

And they are 10 or so years older.

talltexan

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Re: Race from $1M to $2M
« Reply #566 on: May 23, 2018, 12:09:40 PM »
One other thing I notice: home equity is pretty consistently 30% of net worth or less. No one calls in who is in a Bay-area paid-off home but has nothing in other investments.

Bateaux

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Re: Race from $1M to $2M
« Reply #567 on: May 23, 2018, 06:58:40 PM »
One other thing I notice: home equity is pretty consistently 30% of net worth or less. No one calls in who is in a Bay-area paid-off home but has nothing in other investments.

Unless you're really rich if the value of your home exceeds 25 percent of net worth I'd say you're house poor.

rob in cal

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Re: Race from $1M to $2M
« Reply #568 on: May 24, 2018, 09:10:43 AM »
  Decided to join this group instead of 500 to 1mm, as I like to go with NW. We are at about 430k home equity, 600k everything else.  That includes about 335 k in our Vanguard accounts, (mostly in S&P 500, some in a reit, a little in the Wellesley fund some of its a roth, rest taxable), 100k or so in restaurant we work at (share value is rough estimate) 42k is a loan owed to us, 120k is other IRA's.  There is a chance that we sell the house at some point and move to a smaller house or somewhere cheaper, so I like to count this in my stache.  Also, more fun to be in the millionaire thead. I think we got there last fall.
   I'm now 51, wife 48, daughter 21 in college (which she is primarily funding herself with a  little help coming from grandparents and some from cheapskate parents) son 17 graduating high school next week, no college plans right now.  I've been working as a pizza/pasta/sandwich delivery driver for 19 years, wife started working with me very part time 12 years ago. I now average about 30 hours a week, she 5-7.  Wife taught before our son was born, so has 5.2 years vested in CAL strs, the teacher retirement program, and is eligible for a very modest monthly pension at age 55 I believe. Our primary work income usually comes in somewhere in the 50k a year zone, and then we have a modest ownership income, and passive income from investments does the heavy lifting.
    Not sure when it will be time to declare FIRE. I did join the FIRE 2022 club. It has a nice ring to it. We probably won't be zooming along like some other posters on this thread as our active work income isn't huge and if anything is going down, but I figure being a NW millionaire should have some perks, one of which is to not be too concerned about some income shrinkage.  Actually our progress in this race might be more like a slow regional train in Italy that stops at every station, goes of on a siding for half an hour periodically while the express trains roar by.  I figure many of the high income posters qualify as the express trains.  For instance due to travel plans this summer and an upcoming paint job inside the house we haven't really added much new savings in several months, but again not a real reason to stress. 

Bateaux

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Re: Race from $1M to $2M
« Reply #569 on: May 24, 2018, 01:21:21 PM »
Welcome the two comma club Rob.  How you add it all up is your choice.  What's important is what it can do for you.  I only count liquid, but that's only because I'm too dumb to understand real estate.   I do buy into a REIT though.  Looking forward to your triumphs, rants and just general BS like the rest of us post.  Good luck.

Candace

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Re: Race from $1M to $2M
« Reply #570 on: May 24, 2018, 01:26:11 PM »
Welcome, rob in cal! Sounds like you and your wife have a lot to be proud of. Congratulations.

Money Badger

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Re: Race from $1M to $2M
« Reply #571 on: June 03, 2018, 02:36:46 AM »
Time to join in if $1.4M (including house equity) is OK... now working to a "Done in 2021" FIRE plan of $2M.   To Bateaux's point, in the process of downsizing house to balance the ratios out...   As both kids will be in college as of August, it's time to execute our plan to liquidate at a relatively high point in the housing market to get us from just about 50% in the "big" house we bought near the real estate market low down to less than 30%.   Increasing passive income and equity growth to achieve FI "escape velocity" from there.   It's now all about getting the house equity/liquid investments/passive income ratios right to make FI sustainable.

Dicey

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Re: Race from $1M to $2M
« Reply #572 on: June 03, 2018, 08:22:52 AM »
Unless you're really rich if the value of your home exceeds 25 percent of net worth I'd say you're house poor.
Interesting point,  but here's another way to look at it. Let's say a person lives in the Bay Area and their paid-for house is worth $1.5M. Their other assets add up to around $1.5M. That's 50%. Does that really make them house poor? $3M TNW is not "really rich" by Bay Area standards. To be sure, it's comfortable, but it is neither really rich nor house poor.

Bateaux

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Re: Race from $1M to $2M
« Reply #573 on: June 04, 2018, 07:17:27 AM »
Unless you're really rich if the value of your home exceeds 25 percent of net worth I'd say you're house poor.
Interesting point,  but here's another way to look at it. Let's say a person lives in the Bay Area and their paid-for house is worth $1.5M. Their other assets add up to around $1.5M. That's 50%. Does that really make them house poor? $3M TNW is not "really rich" by Bay Area standards. To be sure, it's comfortable, but it is neither really rich nor house poor.

California definitely throws my logic a bit.   There is a threshold where it's true.    I like for the house to be in 10 to 15 percent range of net worth.  The house we're buying in Florida is only 250k so I'm personally trying to keep it low.

Fomerly known as something

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Re: Race from $1M to $2M
« Reply #574 on: June 04, 2018, 08:40:11 AM »
Hmm,  I'm at 22% right now and I feel no where close to being house poor.  If I decided to go to my max budget for some additional exterior (landscaping) work over the next year or so I'll be just above that 25%.  Again with not feeling house poor at all.

I have to admit, I'm still shaking my head at the upward trajectory.  There wasn't a surface I didn't touch in my house last year and a new furnace and I'm up to $1.4M with 1.2M of that invested. 

I just switched my 401k to the ROTH option to avoid future RMDs, waiting and converting isn't as tax friendly as I'll have a pension that will take up most of the 22% and lower tax brackets so I figured I might as well start "converting" now.

Crabbie

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Re: Race from $1M to $2M
« Reply #575 on: June 04, 2018, 10:37:25 AM »
Will throw my hat in here. This is value of portfolio + rental property.

2018/06/01 - 1442000

rob in cal

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Re: Race from $1M to $2M
« Reply #576 on: June 04, 2018, 10:55:26 AM »
  We are somewhere around 43% of home equity as share of total assets, at about 440 house, 600k everything else.  Would like to get that number in the 30's in the next couple of years.  Yet another California impacted case.

itchyfeet

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Re: Race from $1M to $2M
« Reply #577 on: June 06, 2018, 12:06:46 PM »

Perhaps the thing is that in that ~$1MM space you can see all the things you can't afford with the money, and it feels limited - you are making tradeoffs. If I do x then I can't do y. But I am still able to do x, and not everyone could so easily. And we feel like if we were actually rich, we wouldn't need to make those decisions? OTOH, how can I be rich when my sister & her husband (dr, lawyer) are taking their 5 kids to Italy for a month this year? I "couldn't" do that.  But we're going to NZ again in the fall, and loads of people would say that is only possible if we are rich.

Are you and your sister rich or just spending a lot 😜
Always dangerous to gauge the wealth of someone by what they spend.

Herbert Derp

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Re: Race from $1M to $2M
« Reply #578 on: June 06, 2018, 10:38:34 PM »
19 days since the last update, and somehow I'm up by another $53K. Wow!

11/23/2012: $45,000.00
08/03/2013: $100,000.00
01/01/2016: $408,896.04
01/01/2017: $617,283.09
06/06/2017: $758,104.40
10/15/2017: $856,488.71
11/18/2017: $929,536.54
11/27/2017: $944,395.35
12/17/2017: $956,928.07
01/01/2018: $968,307.87
01/05/2018: $987,442.11
01/08/2018: $996,215.32
01/09/2018: $998,819.79
01/10/2018: $999,079.24
01/11/2018: $1,003,101.34
02/01/2018: $1,061,732.89
02/28/2018: $1,062,750.48
05/18/2018: $1,149,432.76
06/06/2018: $1,203,026.63

Bateaux

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Re: Race from $1M to $2M
« Reply #579 on: June 07, 2018, 06:23:31 AM »
19 days since the last update, and somehow I'm up by another $53K. Wow!

11/23/2012: $45,000.00
08/03/2013: $100,000.00
01/01/2016: $408,896.04
01/01/2017: $617,283.09
06/06/2017: $758,104.40
10/15/2017: $856,488.71
11/18/2017: $929,536.54
11/27/2017: $944,395.35
12/17/2017: $956,928.07
01/01/2018: $968,307.87
01/05/2018: $987,442.11
01/08/2018: $996,215.32
01/09/2018: $998,819.79
01/10/2018: $999,079.24
01/11/2018: $1,003,101.34
02/01/2018: $1,061,732.89
02/28/2018: $1,062,750.48
05/18/2018: $1,149,432.76
06/06/2018: $1,203,026.63

Dude.  Incredible increases.

talltexan

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Re: Race from $1M to $2M
« Reply #580 on: June 08, 2018, 11:18:53 AM »
Herbert, you have a nice savings rate to gain nearly half a mill over the past year, investing alone couldn't do that without a ton of risk.

Herbert Derp

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Re: Race from $1M to $2M
« Reply #581 on: June 08, 2018, 06:58:01 PM »
Yea, I spend about $6,000 / year and my savings rate is over 95%. It helps a lot!

DavidAnnArbor

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Re: Race from $1M to $2M
« Reply #582 on: June 09, 2018, 07:07:59 PM »
Yea, I spend about $6,000 / year and my savings rate is over 95%. It helps a lot!

What job enables you to earn $300,000 a year or more?

Herbert Derp

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Re: Race from $1M to $2M
« Reply #583 on: June 11, 2018, 11:53:09 PM »
What job enables you to earn $300,000 a year or more?

A good one? All kidding aside, I don't share the specifics of my employment on this forum.

Fomerly known as something

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Re: Race from $1M to $2M
« Reply #584 on: June 12, 2018, 07:16:54 AM »
I was putzing around on Personal Capital this morning and discovered I now only have 49.5% of my investments in my 401k.  I'm stoked because I have always maxed out my 401k plus the 5% employer match since 2001 but didn't start other things (IRA than taxable) until at least 2 years later and I really didn't have anything outside of the IRA either until the last 5 or 6 years.

Crabbie

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Re: Race from $1M to $2M
« Reply #585 on: June 12, 2018, 09:36:50 AM »
Yea, I spend about $6,000 / year and my savings rate is over 95%. It helps a lot!

What job enables you to earn $300,000 a year or more?

$300k (and well beyond it) isn't unreasonable for a very good software engineer.

DavidAnnArbor

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Re: Race from $1M to $2M
« Reply #586 on: June 12, 2018, 08:13:11 PM »
Yea, I spend about $6,000 / year and my savings rate is over 95%. It helps a lot!

What job enables you to earn $300,000 a year or more?

$300k (and well beyond it) isn't unreasonable for a very good software engineer.


Also a physician with a specialty like surgery, radiology, dermatology. - Ok but you'd have to be at least 28 or more before you'd start making that much, so we can nix out being an MD.


Also, maybe an Artificial Intelligence engineer.

Cornbread OMalley

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Re: Race from $1M to $2M
« Reply #587 on: June 12, 2018, 09:38:47 PM »
Lawyers and investment bankers can also make that much money. Also athletes, actors, YouTube stars, etc
My friend's son was picked up by the San Francisco 49ers a month or two ago when the NFL draft was going on.  The son wasn't drafted but had enough talent for the 49ers to give him a try.  The agent representing the son negotiated a starting salary of $500K a year and a 4-year contract.  The agent gets a percentage of that salary, of course.  Not a bad salary for being an unseasoned athlete!

Car Jack

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Re: Race from $1M to $2M
« Reply #588 on: June 13, 2018, 07:08:27 AM »

Lawyers and investment bankers can also make that much money. Also athletes, actors, YouTube stars, etc

*some* lawyers....sure.

The car salesman who helped me yesterday was a lawyer who left his job to make more money selling cars.

TempusFugit

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Re: Race from $1M to $2M
« Reply #589 on: June 13, 2018, 07:25:51 AM »

Lawyers and investment bankers can also make that much money. Also athletes, actors, YouTube stars, etc

*some* lawyers....sure.

The car salesman who helped me yesterday was a lawyer who left his job to make more money selling cars.

I'd say your average professional athlete (think minor league baseball), actor (bartender), or YouTube star would also be far better off selling cars. 

No, I've got Herbert pegged as some sort of criminal kingpin.  Perhaps he runs a vast underground gambling empire.   

Crabbie

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Re: Race from $1M to $2M
« Reply #590 on: June 13, 2018, 11:20:52 AM »
Yea, I spend about $6,000 / year and my savings rate is over 95%. It helps a lot!

What job enables you to earn $300,000 a year or more?

$300k (and well beyond it) isn't unreasonable for a very good software engineer.


Also a physician with a specialty like surgery, radiology, dermatology. - Ok but you'd have to be at least 28 or more before you'd start making that much, so we can nix out being an MD.


Also, maybe an Artificial Intelligence engineer.

Not just the AI people, although they ARE in demand. Getting $300k or more from one of the big tech companies isn't particularly uncommon.

snapperdude

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Re: Race from $1M to $2M
« Reply #591 on: June 13, 2018, 02:58:33 PM »

Lawyers and investment bankers can also make that much money. Also athletes, actors, YouTube stars, etc

*some* lawyers....sure.

The car salesman who helped me yesterday was a lawyer who left his job to make more money selling cars.

I'd say your average professional athlete (think minor league baseball), actor (bartender), or YouTube star would also be far better off selling cars. 

No, I've got Herbert pegged as some sort of criminal kingpin.  Perhaps he runs a vast underground gambling empire.

Herbert Derp, Male Prost... Escort

couponvan

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Re: Race from $1M to $2M
« Reply #592 on: June 13, 2018, 07:12:43 PM »
I just can’t fathom the $6k spend....earnings are easy, spending limits on those earnings  - not so much. Unless there is a housing allowance involved and taxes are already incorporated.

Expat consultant. It’s my 4 year plan for Bermuda.

Herbert Derp

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Re: Race from $1M to $2M
« Reply #593 on: June 13, 2018, 09:23:47 PM »
I just can’t fathom the $6k spend....earnings are easy, spending limits on those earnings  - not so much. Unless there is a housing allowance involved and taxes are already incorporated.

Actually, I live downtown in a HCOL city. I own a condo which is paid in full, so that's how I'm able to minimize my housing and transportation costs (no car, I can walk everywhere). I include property taxes in my spending but not income taxes (of which I pay a LOT).

If you guys are so interested in me, read my journal! I've been posting for years.
https://forum.mrmoneymustache.com/journals/herbert-derp's-frugal-adventures/

couponvan

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Re: Race from $1M to $2M
« Reply #594 on: June 14, 2018, 06:56:32 AM »
I just can’t fathom the $6k spend....earnings are easy, spending limits on those earnings  - not so much. Unless there is a housing allowance involved and taxes are already incorporated.

Actually, I live downtown in a HCOL city. I own a condo which is paid in full, so that's how I'm able to minimize my housing and transportation costs (no car, I can walk everywhere). I include property taxes in my spending but not income taxes (of which I pay a LOT).

If you guys are so interested in me, read my journal! I've been posting for years.
https://forum.mrmoneymustache.com/journals/herbert-derp's-frugal-adventures/

I didn't actually look at your profile - the 27 and single now makes more sense on the spending limits and the condo you own has very low taxes...Our taxes in IL are $10,000 on a $450,000 house and 5 of us live in there. $30,000 spending for 5 would still be super low.  I may browse your journal over the weekend.

Phryne

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Re: Race from $1M to $2M
« Reply #595 on: June 20, 2018, 01:26:50 AM »
Hi All,

I’m ready to join this thread! Our NW (excluding home equity of ~$500k) hit $1.004m yesterday!

We’re aiming for $1.4m & a paid off house to retire in Oct 2023... reaching that magical number makes it feel so much more achievable!

Bateaux

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Re: Race from $1M to $2M
« Reply #596 on: June 20, 2018, 09:30:19 PM »
Hi All,

I’m ready to join this thread! Our NW (excluding home equity of ~$500k) hit $1.004m yesterday!

We’re aiming for $1.4m & a paid off house to retire in Oct 2023... reaching that magical number makes it feel so much more achievable!

Great job!   Congratulations.

talltexan

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Re: Race from $1M to $2M
« Reply #597 on: June 27, 2018, 11:33:05 AM »
Hi All,

I’m ready to join this thread! Our NW (excluding home equity of ~$500k) hit $1.004m yesterday!

We’re aiming for $1.4m & a paid off house to retire in Oct 2023... reaching that magical number makes it feel so much more achievable!

CONGRATULATIONS!

Just having this online group made such a difference. There wasn't really anyone in real life with whom I could celebrate crossing into double-commas.

Phryne

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Re: Race from $1M to $2M
« Reply #598 on: June 28, 2018, 03:34:42 AM »
Thanks Guys!
So true, I really appreciate the support in this little corner of the internet!

letsdoit

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Re: Race from $1M to $2M
« Reply #599 on: June 29, 2018, 10:47:00 AM »
Neither of you have umbrella insurance?

And you have a rental property, Frank!

Aggghhh.

Go. Run. Today. Get some umbrella insurance. :)

Way reduce the risk and worry from that "unless we get sued" idea you mentioned.

I'm glad this seems to be consensus.  we don't have rentals and have a lot less than 1mill, but I started carrying it anyway.  bc it would be easy to be sued, or plausible