The Money Mustache Community
General Discussion => Throw Down the Gauntlet => Topic started by: onemorebike on April 05, 2018, 04:01:02 AM
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I've recently kicked alcohol out of my life completely, want to join me? There aren't many benefits, just saving more cash, effortlessly dropping lbs, more mental clarity, the end of hangovers, and much more time and energy to focus on the things that matter. Honestly, I'm surprised it doesn't come up here a little more often!
Feel free to post whether you'd like to join, what time period, and anything you are doing to help stick to it. (personally, I seriously recommend Annie Grace's Alcohol Experiment - 30 days of emails and videos that educate and support you along the way as you have the same doubts/issues that arise for most people)
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Hey there, I've just finished month 8 and it's going GREAT so count me in.
Things that helped: Annie Grace, drink substitution (tea, seltzer, juice spritzers) and taking a short walk during the witching hour to break the habit.
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I'm in. I'll aim for at least six months. I haven't decided about social drinking yet (I'm not very social, so this wouldn't be much drinking) but I definitely don't need to have the stuff in my house. Even one drink disrupts my sleep and turns me into a mindless Netflix binge watcher.
I recently listened to this and thought it was very interesting: https://www.theguardian.com/news/audio/2018/jan/22/how-i-let-drinking-take-over-my-life-podcast. It's about someone who had a serious problem with alcohol, but it's really good writing about a place I never want to get to, and how he gets out.
I also checked checked out Drinking: A Love Story by Caroline Knapp that I'm interested in reading.
The Annie Grace stuff looks interesting too!
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I read "This Naked Mind: Control Alcohol, Find Freedom, Discover Happiness & Change Your Life" by Annie Grace and it killed my desire for alcohol instantly.
Just a personal testimonial (to add to the many positive Amazon reviews).
https://www.amazon.com/This-Naked-Mind-Discover-Happiness/dp/0525537236/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1522938664&sr=8-1&keywords=this+naked+mind
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Both Knapp's Drinking: A Love Story and Sarah Hepola's Blackout are fascinating, well-written books.
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I quit drinking for a few months a couple of years ago for health and wealth reasons. I found the most difficult part was reprogramming other people's expectations of you. Some people were confused as to why I wasn't drinking but would shrug it off, while others took it as a personal affront, while some others simply joked, "What, are you pregnant?" It was quite the social experiment. These reactions seemed extreme to me, since I'm an introvert and only drank maybe 2-3 times per week. I can't imagine the social upheaval one might feel if they were a more frequent drinker.
The other part that was difficult was I hadn't identified how many triggers were in my life. Had a bad day at work? That deserves a drink. Had something fantastic happen at work? Celebrate with a drink. Is it a beautiful evening? Grill and have a drink. Is it Thirsty Thursday? Happy hour with coworkers. Is it a Friday/Saturday evening and you get to sleep in tomorrow? May has well have a few. While one might not partake in each situation, once you stop drinking, you realize how often your mind goes there. I wouldn't even label myself anything close to an alcoholic, but the constant triggers, especially in weeks one and two, were quite chilling. You realize that habitual drinking essentially turns you into one of Pavlov's Dogs.
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I've experienced this. I was a pretty heavy social drinker, and responded to all the triggers below. :) Initially I got a decent amount of shit from my drinking pals but I also noticed that others weren't drinking quite as much as I thought they were - so it went both ways. I did some thinking of quick and easy ways to deflect questions and read up on how others "blended in" during social drinking situations and it was super helpful.
Speaking of helpful:
Reading Annie Grace's book was fantastic and I was immediately reprogrammed. I also listen to her podcast ( a bit repetitive but the messages are important), checked out the Hip Sobriety podcast, read the Easy Way to Control alcohol by Alan Carr, and I've lightly listened to a lot of different podcasts on the topic. I've found books that have more of a "how to" angle instead stories of addiction with some recovery weaved in.
I'm at 68 days without alcohol right now and based on my previous consumption my app tells me I've NOT consumed 200 drinks, an additional 20,000 calories and saved roughly $800 (though, I'm pretty sure this isn't the mustachian standard for drinking) - either way, it is substantial! I'm down about 13 pounds, but I've been lifting too so likely have put some muscle on.
I quit drinking for a few months a couple of years ago for health and wealth reasons. I found the most difficult part was reprogramming other people's expectations of you. Some people were confused as to why I wasn't drinking but would shrug it off, while others took it as a personal affront, while some others simply joked, "What, are you pregnant?" It was quite the social experiment. These reactions seemed extreme to me, since I'm an introvert and only drank maybe 2-3 times per week. I can't imagine the social upheaval one might feel if they were a more frequent drinker.
The other part that was difficult was I hadn't identified how many triggers were in my life. Had a bad day at work? That deserves a drink. Had something fantastic happen at work? Celebrate with a drink. Is it a beautiful evening? Grill and have a drink. Is it Thirsty Thursday? Happy hour with coworkers. Is it a Friday/Saturday evening and you get to sleep in tomorrow? May has well have a few. While one might not partake in each situation, once you stop drinking, you realize how often your mind goes there. I wouldn't even label myself anything close to an alcoholic, but the constant triggers, especially in weeks one and two, were quite chilling. You realize that habitual drinking essentially turns you into one of Pavlov's Dogs.
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Speaking of triggers:
I've been really depressed about my job lately (but even a little alcohol depresses me, so I hope this gets better), and last night I found myself feeling shitty about it and stuffing cereal into my pie hole when I wasn't even really hungry. I'm hoping to be mindful of how I might be replacing alcohol with other stuff that's bad in its own way. Anybody else dealing with this?
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Yes! The trigger never changes, just the response to the trigger. I've swapped in an unhealthy dose of sugar at times (but not always), the key, in this moment where you are feeling depressed is to swap in a different response. I've heard people going for a quick, brisk walk, bike ride, or even 10 minutes of jumping jacks is enough to shake it.
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This reminds me of a book I recently read (or mostly read) called the Power of Habit in which the author says that the way to get around bad habits is to recognize the cue and the reward feeling it leads to, but change the middle part, how you get to the reward. So you feel stressed about work, have a drink, feel relaxed. Of course, the drink part comes with stuff we don't like (headache, depression, expense) so we need to replace the middle part of this cycle (the drink) with something else--jumping jacks (sorry, no thanks!) or meditation or a hike with the dog or whatever. Stupid simple, yet profound, I think, because it's a way of letting yourself off the hook for feeling the cue feeling in the first place. It's okay to feel unhappy or stressed, but the key is to stop and think about what you do to get to the reward/relief stage.
I am not there just yet!
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I read the book too. :) The framework has supported a lot of big changes I've made over the past year. Hope you can get there!
This reminds me of a book I recently read (or mostly read) called the Power of Habit in which the author says that the way to get around bad habits is to recognize the cue and the reward feeling it leads to, but change the middle part, how you get to the reward. So you feel stressed about work, have a drink, feel relaxed. Of course, the drink part comes with stuff we don't like (headache, depression, expense) so we need to replace the middle part of this cycle (the drink) with something else--jumping jacks (sorry, no thanks!) or meditation or a hike with the dog or whatever. Stupid simple, yet profound, I think, because it's a way of letting yourself off the hook for feeling the cue feeling in the first place. It's okay to feel unhappy or stressed, but the key is to stop and think about what you do to get to the reward/relief stage.
I am not there just yet!
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The other part that was difficult was I hadn't identified how many triggers were in my life. Had a bad day at work? That deserves a drink. Had something fantastic happen at work? Celebrate with a drink. Is it a beautiful evening? Grill and have a drink. Is it Thirsty Thursday? Happy hour with coworkers. Is it a Friday/Saturday evening and you get to sleep in tomorrow? May has well have a few. While one might not partake in each situation, once you stop drinking, you realize how often your mind goes there. I wouldn't even label myself anything close to an alcoholic, but the constant triggers, especially in weeks one and two, were quite chilling. You realize that habitual drinking essentially turns you into one of Pavlov's Dogs.
I've been thinking about this [and other "treats"] a lot recently and realised that we tend to do what Dan Ariely describes in Dollars & Sense as opening a new budget for each. So the Wednesday drinks/fancy cheese/takeaway/bit of chocolate in the afternoon are held as separate and apart from the Friday pub lunch/muffins that someone brought in/pizza for dinner AND the Saturday BBQ Beer with friends/packet of chips/let's go get gelato because its sunny.
It's not until you put them all into the same group that you realise exactly how much you are 'spending' in the aggregate.
The urge for a reward is not a *bad* thing, but sometimes you need to reexamine what reward would work and what you could change so you don't feel the urge or a reward so often.
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I've been struggling. I find myself getting into a bad habit of stopping for drinks after work ... to deal with work stress, life stress, etc.
Maybe I'm a functional alcoholic???
I recognize the cost and the bad parts but, after work I often get into that "I don't give a shit" frame of mind since .... I just spent 8+ hours of my life
working for MegaCorp doing absolutely BS tasks. The stuff I do is an insult to intelligence.
Yet, it pays well so I go on.
Thus, the lure of alcohol at the end of the day to anesthesize my apparently inflated sense of self-worth.
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It was ritual here. Now we drink sleepy time tea after the kids are in bed, instead of a few glasses of wine. I sleep better & wake more refreshed.
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I'm joining. I'm about to begin my first IVF cycle, after exhausting less invasive options to deal with my infertility. I gave up drinking several times throughout this process, but always came back to it, generally after a particularly crushing negative cycle or major diagnosis. That makes it sound like it was for the emotional crutch, and surely that's part of it, but more than anything is I think it's been an indicator of normalcy for me. My husband and I enjoy drinking, the flavor, the ritual of it all, and it's that feeling of "a nice evening at home" I wanted back more than anything.
Still, alcohol interferes with the liver's role in excreting estrogen, and that's pretty important to keep at healthy levels for me right now. Plus, once I'm on the actual stims protocol, you can't drink at that time. We'll likely be doing several egg retrievals in a row, so it's not like pregnancy is the consideration, just overall health and lessening medication side effects.
Not sure how long we'll be sans alcohol. So far I'm on day... 5 I think. Last drink was a cider on Sunday. At this point, the cost panic of IVF is helping with non drinking compliance, since it made up a major budget item for us ($100-200/month).
Will be glad to have a community going through the non-drinking as well!
Alternatives:
We tend to opt for sparkling mineral water and bitters and/or juices mixed in. We have a soda stream (indefinitely on loan from my MIL), and we add trace minerals drops to get that nice mineral water flavor. Our current juice is tart cherry, although we also like grapefruit and the "super 7 juice" from trader joe's.
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For me it's the cycle of negative energy from work each day. I have counseling sessions booked and that may help.
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Highly recommend. If you need any help, just send me all yer booze
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We cut completely for the month of February, and most of March. By third week of March, we shared a box o' wine with FIL after a family wedding. It was meh. I only had two glasses, two nights. Last weekend we had a bit of beer with our barbecue.
So now I'm trying to figure out if I will drink at all, or if it is a moderation/only on weekends, but not every weekend.
I was relieved upon quitting in February that it was easy to quit. While habit - a martini while prepping dinner, then wine to celebrate kids in bed- daily- when we resolved to take a month off, I felt no physical discomfort and really, no mental anguish either. Subbing the hot tea is nice because it takes care of the ritual portion. While I kiss the kids goodnight, DH brews the tea. We settle in to watch TRMS, sip tea, and discuss current events.
I estimate we saved $200-$230 per month of not drinking, although our tea and honey expenditures have increased.
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I gave up alcohol for February (except for one day, when I got married), and about half of March. I loved it: I saved so much money, lost weight, and seemed to sleep better. Now that I've reintroduced alcohol in my life I find I can only really have a drink or two before I stop enjoying the sensation. I have a goal to never have a hangover again, and so far I've stuck to that. I find pressure from family is actually worse than my friends. When I was visiting the in-laws over Easter they would open beers for me even after I said several times I didn't want one.
I think this thread will inspire me to cut down even further!
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Update from me, I'm at 76 days without a drink and rocking. My energy levels are higher than they have been for a decade. I'm down 15 pounds. Now using the extra time/money I would have spent on booze, bars, and subsequent restaurants to workout more, finish long unfinished projects, read, relax, and spend more quality time with my family.
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Today I'm at 14 days no drinking. I did have a sip of wine my brother offered for me to try when we were out for a celebratory family dinner. I still count that as a victory, since I didn't get a drink at all while there. (And frankly, the wine was very thin and watery, so I didn't bother with much of a sip!)
Update from me, I'm at 76 days without a drink and rocking. My energy levels are higher than they have been for a decade. I'm down 15 pounds. Now using the extra time/money I would have spent on booze, bars, and subsequent restaurants to workout more, finish long unfinished projects, read, relax, and spend more quality time with my family.
Great update!
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Update from me, I'm at 76 days without a drink and rocking. My energy levels are higher than they have been for a decade. I'm down 15 pounds. Now using the extra time/money I would have spent on booze, bars, and subsequent restaurants to workout more, finish long unfinished projects, read, relax, and spend more quality time with my family.
That is fantastic!
Congratulations. Keep it up.
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I stopped drinking yesterday. I plan to do at least a month. So May 16 is my first possible end date benchmark.
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I stopped drinking yesterday. I plan to do at least a month. So May 16 is my first possible end date benchmark.
Greyweld, how's it coming?
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I gave up booze April 19 2004. My life looks nothing like it did 14 years ago. Back then I had what one would consider a successful career, lots of toys, and shiny things. Inside I was dying. So I made a decision. I dug my way out of debt, fired last year and in 2 weeks am selling my house in HCOL buying my smaller dream place in LCOL area. It's a new freedom. My overall well being has a 100% of it's cylinders firing so I can navigate challenges because in life that happens. Now I have a better chance of making healthy decisions and live in the solution.
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I am in! I did the 30 day alcohol experiment on the Annie Grace website, thanks for that link.
I read the book also, just the first 30 pages were enough to wake me up. I really like the support of the daily videos. I am on day 12 and I really do not think I will go back to drinking after the 30 days, I want to enjoy my retirement, not drink my way through.
I thought I was doing OK at 30 beers a month, that was my moderation amount, but I wold slip frequently. I have tried to take a break from drinking in the past and only made it to 3 weeks, then caved and I also did crave alcohol the entire time. This Annie Grace method, I felt different from day one. Now that I look at alcohol like a poison or an addicting substance ( like crack) then I have more power to say no to alcohol.
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I stopped drinking yesterday. I plan to do at least a month. So May 16 is my first possible end date benchmark.
Greyweld, how's it coming?
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So far so good! Haven't had anything since the 16th, so in a couple days I'll be a week in. It actually helps that I have a cold. I have no desire to drink when I'm sick.
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Zero alcohol for eleven years...and not much before that.
Eleven years ago I ended up hospitalized for severe acute pancreatitis. Idiopathic in nature...not alcohol induced. Hospital for 16 days, no food by mouth for two months. Death was a strong possibility...there is nothing a doctor can do to help you through this. Very scary.
All my doctors said I should never touch alcohol. Ever. So I didn’t. I have had no recurrence.
I feel totally blessed to have lived through that and I will never take it for granted. Alcohol is not needed and I quite like not drinking. Always hated losing control too...
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Dropped in to this thread curious about the stories. @Bendigirl, saddened that you underwent such a frightening experience, but glad that you got something good from it. Keep on keepin' on!
Giving up the hooch was one of the life decisions I am glad I made. Didn't make me Mr. Magic Superachiever, but then again, I haven't come close to killing several people at once with my car since stopped either. 20 years and counting.
Much respect to every person on this thread.
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I am at 3 weeks tomorrow! Inspired by the others, I know i have saved alot of money already. I just came back from Lunch out and resisted the impulse to drink, was fine with my Virgin Mary! It is nice to realize I can enjoy my friends comapny at a bar with or without a drink.
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As a mom of two toddlers, my sleep routine has been completely ruined over the past four years. In an effort to be sensible and do all I can to improve the sleep situation, I'm playing with the idea of giving up all drinking at home. There's one date my husband and I love going on about every other month that involves a happy hour. Can't give that up. But the rest of the wine habit--the glass after dinner while the kids are in bed most notably--I'm going to ditch this month (May). We went to Target yesterday and didn't buy a box of wine, even though it was on sale.
We'll see what happens. I'm hoping to notice an uptick in sleep quality, a downtick in grocery spending, and a downtick in weight gain.
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I quit drinking when my kids were small because it wasn’t adding anything to my life and I wanted to be fully present for them. When they grew up I started to drink occasionally but it is easy to let it become a habit. Just read the book and it was excellent and a different way of thinking about the issue.
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I can commit to not drinking at home except when I am hosting friends. I track my drinking daily and aim to keep at 5 glasses of wine or less a week. I’ve done months off before but I’m off to Europe and then it’s rose season. I wil probably take September off.
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105 days without a sip as of today, what's it looking like for those of you that came to play?
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36 days for me! I'm having an easy time of it, my spouse is on board and I have non alcohol beer to get me through the difficult times. I feel great and have a lot more energy.
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I am joining in. I did no alcohol for the last week of April and first week of May, but just spent the last week at the in-laws and ruined it all!
My goal is to have none right up until my sister's wedding when I will share in a toast to them (or perhaps by then I won't want to?) That gives me approximately 6 weeks.
The hardest part is going to be that the weather just got great, and drinks, patios and bbq's seem to go hand in hand. I will take it one week at a time, starting tomorrow (as I had 2 beers today.)
Please help keep me accountable (either here or in my Journal.) Thanks
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Like @Bendigirl I too gave up alcohol after acute pancreatitis, although again cause was not alcohol related.
Much easier than I expected, although I have a heck of an incentive! As some have said the strangest thing is other people's reactions. Good friends can treat you differently until you tell them to get over themselves. Not trying to get you to drink, just acting odd.
There are also a lot of very good alcohol free beers on the market if you like that kind of thing. Also makes it more socially acceptable if you are feeling peer pressure (I don't, going through serious illness has many positives including getting your priorities straight!).
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I highly recommend Annie Grace book and Web site called this naked mind. Very helpful, I had an attitude adjustment after the first 30 pages. I had tried to moderate in the past and failed, she says that you just have to think about alcohol as a drug. She has free podcasts online also.
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Oh and I will be here rooting for you!
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Congratulations to everyone that is sticking to this challenge.
I only drank for a brief period when I was 21-22 years old. It’s been close to 15 years since I’ve consumed any alcohol. I never really found any drinks I like and always felt terrible for a few days after drinking enough to get drunk. I found not drinking to be pretty easy since my urge to avoid unnecessary discomfort trumped my urge to fit in at social gatherings.
The longer you go without drinking, the more normal it will feel for you and the people around you who do still drink. You don’t have to feel bad or justify your decision for not drinking when other people are.
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Thinking about joining - I only drink on Friday/Saturday nights and only 1-2 drinks on those nights. But I've been feeling controlled by it even at those amounts. I don't like feeling controlled by anything.
Also, have a daughter with anxiety and I need to show her healthy ways to manage. I'm also starting a new career in the fall that could be stressful and I need some healthy habits established before then.
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I highly recommend Annie Grace book and Web site called this naked mind. Very helpful, I had an attitude adjustment after the first 30 pages. I had tried to moderate in the past and failed, she says that you just have to think about alcohol as a drug. She has free podcasts online also.
She also as a 30 day challenge that is super useful, you register and it comes with motivation, regular emails and tons of education. Includes a Facebook group that is great for accountability and a peer group.
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So, I'm only a few days out from my surgery. In the lead up time, I have had one mixed drink, and 3 small beers. (So, I think 4 drinks in like 45 days?) Considering I'm normally a 1-2 drinks (usually wine) 4-5 days a week type lady, this is a big change. It's likely I'll roll straight from this surgery into another cycle+surgery. I think I'm going to give myself one week off, to eat whatever I want, have some drinks, and take a break from all my non-essential meds, and then I'll get back to it.
Glad to hear everyone who is trying to give up drinking is doing well with it.
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I've been booze free since the day I posted here, with the exception of last night, when DH and I went on our once/month date and visited our favorite bar. That's the one occasion I'm not willing to give up. Other than that, no hooch for me. Sleep is mildly improved, I think. Grocery budget noticeably dipping. Waistline maybe dipping, a little? At least not gaining?
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I'm in. I am doing the 30 day experiment, on Day 5. No issues so far, made through a weekend of no drinking for the first time in years.
One downside, i miscalculated my days. I have a Cabin Trip with some friends that starts on my 23rd day of the experiment. This is a yearly event with my guy friends, which involves a LOT of drinking, poker playing, shenanigans, etc. Wondering if I should bail on the trip, or make up some sort of minor health ailment, to explain why I'm not drinking...Hmmm not sure. Guess we'll see how im feeling closer to the date.
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Following. I'm pretty naturally temperate and have gotten some flak about it from heavy drinkers in my family and friend circle. I like hearing the good reasons not to drink.
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Drumstache wrote
Wondering if I should bail on the trip, or make up some sort of minor health ailment, to explain why I'm not drinking...Hmmm not sure. Guess we'll see how im feeling closer to the date.
I am on day 42, six weeks. I do feel great. I found Annie Grace book very helpful. I have had several episodes lately where I want to drink again, less motivated now. I really want to see what life is like without drinking for at least six months. The temptations have been being at a bar and draft beer available. Also on vacation and draft beer everywhere. I could not resist if I went to a cabin in the woods with a bunch of drinking buddies, that I would avoid. You may be stronger than I; I do tell people I quit Alcohol, for a while anyway, and that does help me to resist as I do not want to go against what I just boldly proclaimed. I also have a spouse that Quit with me, this does help the motivation ( and a co worker also who is "quitting" temporally with me). My big motivators are my health, I definitely feel more energized and have been biking more.
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Drumstache wrote Wondering if I should bail on the trip, or make up some sort of minor health ailment, to explain why I'm not drinking...Hmmm not sure. Guess we'll see how im feeling closer to the date.
I am on day 42, six weeks. I do feel great. I found Annie Grace book very helpful. I have had several episodes lately where I want to drink again, less motivated now. I really want to see what life is like without drinking for at least six months. The temptations have been being at a bar and draft beer available. Also on vacation and draft beer everywhere. I could not resist if I went to a cabin in the woods with a bunch of drinking buddies, that I would avoid. You may be stronger than I; I do tell people I quit Alcohol, for a while anyway, and that does help me to resist as I do not want to go against what I just boldly proclaimed. I also have a spouse that Quit with me, this does help the motivation ( and a co worker also who is "quitting" temporally with me). My big motivators are my health, I definitely feel more energized and have been biking more.
I would definitely avoid a weekend of poker and booze! I don't think the first thirty days would hold up to that test for me.
My spouse also joined in initially but she is back to drinking occasionally, which has been fine for me thus far. Quitting has already been the impetus for so many great changes in my life, it would be silly to think it would be worth a night of being buzzed to lose that and whatever is next to come!
Love hearing everyone's updates, keep them coming!
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I'm on a one-month no-alcohol challenge!
Started on May 28th and want to keep it up until at least June 28th.
Doing fine so far. I'll keep you posted!
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I'm on a one-month no-alcohol challenge!
Started on May 28th and want to keep it up until at least June 28th.
Doing fine so far. I'll keep you posted!
The first couple days were tough for me, power through!
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Day three, just had a low-sugar alcohol free mojito. Life is good!
I've never been a heavy drinker or binge drinker, and have no problem limiting myself to 2 beers on a normal weekday, but I did find myself drinking those 2 beers almost every night, in both good (to 'celebrate') and average to bad (to 'unwind') times.
And after reading about a study that showed that even really modest drinkers (<2 glasses / day) can get health benefits (liver, cholesterol) from quitting completely for just one month, I decided to give it a go!
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Honestly, I'm surprised it doesn't come up here a little more often!
I guess I'm in, too, but I never started drinking in the first place. Going on 37 years without a drop, and I'm surprised it doesn't come up more often for FIRE or for health. (I am aware that you can get all the same benefits from grapes without the fermentation process. That being said, I have likely consumed fermented fruits just because I was unwilling to throw them away.)
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YEAH NO BOOZE HERE (well I ahven't had a drink for like a decade and it was just once)
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It took about 3 months for it to become normalised for me, but 10 months in and I don't want to drink again. I am also surprised that it doesn't come up more around these parts.
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Day 6, still doing fine.
In those 6 days there have been numerous occasions (dinner, dancing night, party) already where I normally would have had a drink, but without alcohol they were still fun.
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It's been 333 days since I stopped. I have saved a little over $400, and I no longer need to weigh myself every few days to keep tabs on any weight gain. I replaced the single after-work Pale Ale with a glass of ice-water and don't miss it. Once you stop, you realize that alcohol is a crutch, and getting rid of the crutch makes you stronger.
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I am on day 55 I believe! I am surprised how my life is exactly the same with or without Alcolol. Just as much fun, I feel better and have more energy! I also have been working out more. It was so dificult to moderate for all those yeasrs and just stopping is easier somehow.
and Austin I saved 400 at least in two months. I used to go to a little Brewery nearby and my favorite beer there was 8$ for ten oz pour.
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I have been a total failure at this since I posted before, but "simply begin again" as the meditators say. I guess I am starting over today. I said six months before, but I think I'll just try to get through June with no drinking at home (a drink when out is okay because I don't go out much).
Hope you all are doing better at this than I am!
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I'm on day 11 now and still find it pretty easy actually.
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I'm on day 11 now and still find it pretty easy actually.
You are stronger than most. I still get triggered here and there, especially with Summer rolling around (I love a good patio beer!). Still holding strong though, 4 months, 1 week and 2 days!
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You folks are doing Great! I do occasionally long for the summer beer on the patio, now I sub Coffee or a non alcoholic beer. 2 months no beer on Friday ( 60 days).
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Duchess how are you doing?
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So I got through my first IVF cycle booze free for 6 weeks, except for a beer on 2 separate occasions. So that was a good 7 weeks of no drinking. The past couple weeks, we've taken some time off and indulged some. We're headed into IVF#2 though, so after this current bottle of wine, it's back to another 8+ weeks of not drinking. Here we go again!
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I am in for the duration. 1 year, 10 months, 2 days, so says my counter on my phone. Good luck to everyone else on this quest.
If you are wishy-washy, take out a blank sheet of paper. Do a vertical line down the middle and a horizontal line across the middle, dividing into four quadrants. In the northwest quadrant, write down all of the costs of drinking. In the southwest quadrant, write down all of the benefits of drinking. In the northeast quadrant, write down all the benefits of quitting. In the southeast quadrant, write down all of the costs of quitting. Now do a cost-benefit analysis. Check out which costs & benefits are long term or short term. Take a look at the severity/intensity of the costs and benefits. Think about if there are other activities/experiences you could substitute for the benefits you might lose. Decide for yourself whether the benefits of your choice outweigh the costs. Only you can make this decision.
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Cut back dramatically from a 2-3 an evening beer habit. Found paying 20-25 dollars for a 12 pack of micro brew, sometimes twice a week is dipping into my pocket and not making my pants fit as well. Also started to worry I was starting down a bad road of leaning on booze. Was dealing with a lot of stress care taking for aging parents. Still going to drink socially but not at home so much anymore. Power to all of you cutting back or ending their drinking. It's not easy to do!
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I enjoy drinking quite a bit, but I don't normally drink all that much and I can go weeks without having a drink and not even realize it. This week I started re-watching MadMen which means I've also started drinking whisky on random week nights again. It is so hard to watch them drinking all the time and not want to join in on the revelry.
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LOL, I'm not kidding, I actually stated smoking after watching Mad Men after having quit for like 15 years, I've since stopped again. Tells you how weak we can be!
I enjoy drinking quite a bit, but I don't normally drink all that much and I can go weeks without having a drink and not even realize it. This week I started re-watching MadMen which means I've also started drinking whisky on random week nights again. It is so hard to watch them drinking all the time and not want to join in on the revelry.
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I'm within striking distance of a year. At this point, the benefits of not drinking far outweigh the benefits of drinking for me so it looks like I am in for the duration. It amuses me that I used to think fancy juices and teas Cost Too Much but $7 for 20 delicious beverages > $7 for one delicious beverage that messes up my sleep something chronic.
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This! I've got a friend in town and was giving him the bicycle tour of breweries and bars last night. Initially I scoffed at the $6 price tag of kombucha at one place and a $4 price tag on root beer at another but then I remembered I used to spend that in my first half hour of a normal bar visit (i think I can count being in two since I stopped drinking). My app that tracks my days away from drinking also tells me I've saved over a grand and haven't consumed over 25,000 calories!
I'm within striking distance of a year. At this point, the benefits of not drinking far outweigh the benefits of drinking for me so it looks like I am in for the duration. It amuses me that I used to think fancy juices and teas Cost Too Much but $7 for 20 delicious beverages > $7 for one delicious beverage that messes up my sleep something chronic.
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14 days into my one-month challenge. Still at zero drinks! Time for a mid-term write-up:
Thirst:
I haven't craved for a drink even once. Since college, I apparently had simply conditioned myself into drinking 1-2 drinks on most weekdays and 4-5 or more at parties. I never thought quitting was this easy. Over the last two weeks, all the occasions where I would normally have had a couple of drinks were just as much fun being sober. An epic 150 mile hilly bicycle ride is still epic without the reward beer, a party is still a party etc etc. Just say no and drink something alcohol-free, that's all.
Physical & mental health effects:
To be honest, I haven't noticed any differences in sleep quality or quantity, or mental sharpness.
I do find myself recovering exceptionally well from strenuous exercise though, but that might also be due to the high level of general fitness I already had.
I haven't noticed any differences in body composition or skin quality, but I haven't been scrutinizing these parameters very carefully.
I did some literature research and I'm fully convinced of the health benefits of not drinking for my liver, body composition, testosterone levels and recovery from exercise.
I have been feeling a bit stressed and anxious sometimes lately (the 'whirl in the stomach' feeling), but that's more likely due to some weird events in my private life (return from biiiig trip 1.5 mo ago, subsequent relationship breakup, uncertainty about housing situation and doubts about future career / life path). On the upside: previously I'd definitely have soothed this anxiety with 2 beers, but apparently I can manage without booze as well.
And now?
I will definitely complete the remaining 2.5 weeks of this challenge. If I don't, please punch me in the face. There are still lots of parties, dinners and special events to come, but I know I can manage.
On the end date of this challenge (a bar / microbrewery tour with colleagues) I will limit my consumption to 2 or 3 beers and definitly not go on a binge. If I fail, please punch me in the face.
After that, I will continue to abstain from the weekday beers, and on the bar nights/parties/special occasions where I would previously drink 4-5+, I will limit myself to 2.
If I fail, please punch me in the face ;-)
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Setting a series of progressively smaller limits on the number of drinks per day should be an easier goal than quitting cold turkey. Not that I want to discourage anyone from doing the latter, but let's be honest, it's hard to totally quit that kind of habit. It's sort of like going on a diet; how long do those typically last? :-)
I went to zero after having been on a limit of 1 each weekday for a very long time. It's too bad that the 6oz bottle size is not more common, to help make this transition easier.
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I'm in for 30 days! I'd like to spend less money on alcohol and see if my workout recovery time improves/changes with zero booze. I like trying different lifestyle shifts (whole 30, vegan, raw, etc.) so this should be fun.
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I need to do another go of this for my mental and physical health. Gonna try for another month. Let's round up and call it until the end of July.
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Remember that FI is not the goal. It's to figure out the things you actually, really, truly, greatly enjoy spending time doing, and doing those things. FI and RE are just tools to remove a 40 hour/week commitment that blocks you from choosing what things you get to do when you could be doing them, like all those glorious daylight hours between 9AM and 5PM! If you're torturing yourself to save money, you're just a slave to something else that you don't enjoy.
Thanks for that great quote, Lets see you back here alcohol free after 14 days. I want a report!
I am day 77
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Remember that FI is not the goal. It's to figure out the things you actually, really, truly, greatly enjoy spending time doing, and doing those things. FI and RE are just tools to remove a 40 hour/week commitment that blocks you from choosing what things you get to do when you could be doing them, like all those glorious daylight hours between 9AM and 5PM! If you're torturing yourself to save money, you're just a slave to something else that you don't enjoy.
Thanks for that great quote, Lets see you back here alcohol free after 14 days. I want a report!
I am day 77
Thank @neo von retorch . He's the genius behind the quote!
I'll be back in two weeks! :D
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I keep falling off the wagon. Sorry to say his name, but as long as Trump is president, I'm not sure I can get off the hooch :(
That's totally lame, of course. So I'm going to start over again soon. I quit for nearly two years several years ago, and it was surprisingly easy once I got a few weeks into it, so I know I can do it. I think I have to decide whether I am quitting 100% or whether I am going to try to just be a social drinker (that is, not drink at home alone to unwind after work; only drink when with other people). Last time, I quit 100%, and I committed to it for at least a year. I went to a gathering at a bar and I drank a water while others chugged their beer. It was not a big deal. When I went into the grocery store, I just didn't go to the huge alcohol section. It was easy, because I just knew I wasn't going to buy any beer/wine because I was 100% NOT drinking. I think saying that I'm going to be a social drinker makes it too easy to decide, fuck it, did you see what he tweeted today? I need a beer, whether it's a social one or not. Do y'all know what I'm saying?
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Yes, I hear you. I commit myself one month at a time. I say I am doing 30 days NO EXCUSES. But what I want is 60 days, then come 30 days I say another 30 days in a row NO EXCUSES NO EXCEPTIONS. and I do that. Now I am approaching 90 days, and at that point I am going to say I am going six months. I know when I slip up once I will keep making excuses to drink again.
I did the 30 day alcohol experiment with Annie Grace, sign up and she sends an email every day to encourage you. Committing is the key, I used to day oh well I will do 30/35 days alcohol free and so on I made 30 days after reading Annie graces book, there is also a booklet called alcohol explained by a guy named porter, that one was 3$ on amazon and worth a read also.
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Hi, @Duchess of Stratosphear!
Keep at it, I admire your persistence. Over time, the reflex that a drink is the right consolation will shrink. Eventually your "clean" repetitions in that situation will predominate. You're making an investment in habit change. It will pay off.
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It's about to be Dry July for anyine who wants a social excuse to quit it for a month.
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14 days into my one-month challenge. Still at zero drinks! Time for a mid-term write-up:
[blah blah]
Day 29. Situation unchanged. Still sober, still going strong.
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14 days into my one-month challenge. Still at zero drinks! Time for a mid-term write-up:
[blah blah]
Day 29. Situation unchanged. Still sober, still going strong.
Woohoo! That's GREAT stuff
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Have you read Annie Grace's book? I found a lot of it really useful for understand what I thought alcohol was helping me cope with better versus what it was actually doing. Her differentiation between conscious and unconscious thoughts (liminal thinking) was ground breaking for me and was the reason I was able to quit. Now Id say as long as we have this president I could never drink. :)
I keep falling off the wagon. Sorry to say his name, but as long as Trump is president, I'm not sure I can get off the hooch :(
That's totally lame, of course. So I'm going to start over again soon. I quit for nearly two years several years ago, and it was surprisingly easy once I got a few weeks into it, so I know I can do it. I think I have to decide whether I am quitting 100% or whether I am going to try to just be a social drinker (that is, not drink at home alone to unwind after work; only drink when with other people). Last time, I quit 100%, and I committed to it for at least a year. I went to a gathering at a bar and I drank a water while others chugged their beer. It was not a big deal. When I went into the grocery store, I just didn't go to the huge alcohol section. It was easy, because I just knew I wasn't going to buy any beer/wine because I was 100% NOT drinking. I think saying that I'm going to be a social drinker makes it too easy to decide, fuck it, did you see what he tweeted today? I need a beer, whether it's a social one or not. Do y'all know what I'm saying?
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I've tried but not done well. I do ok until I get stressed out, usually from dealing with my aging parents. My Mom is very high maintenance and sometimes calls me 6 times a day, even at work.
I need to stop the drinking at home. Worse yet is, sometimes stopping for drinks on the way home from work.
I am seeing a counselor which helps but I still need some inspirational reads, blogs, etc.
Any good suggestions?
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I've tried but not done well. I do ok until I get stressed out, usually from dealing with my aging parents. My Mom is very high maintenance and sometimes calls me 6 times a day, even at work.
I need to stop the drinking at home. Worse yet is, sometimes stopping for drinks on the way home from work.
I am seeing a counselor which helps but I still need some inspirational reads, blogs, etc.
Any good suggestions?
I would tell your mother exactly what you said here. You don't necessarily have to propose a solution at first, just state how you feel. That's the first step.
Are you fearing the consequences of doing that? It seems like procrastination will only make things worse, from what I can see. Maybe you go down a spiral with your drinking; I've seen it happen to myself and others around me, when they did not take positive steps to resolve their problems. Recognize that you are not alone here; it happens to a lot of people.
I saw this blog article today which might help you:
https://www.psychologytoday.com/us/blog/in-practice/201805/30-types-self-sabotage-and-what-do-about-it
PT frequently has these blog articles that are really helpful to me.
edit: actually your first step was recognizing the problem and seeing a counselor.
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I've tried but not done well. I do ok until I get stressed out, usually from dealing with my aging parents. My Mom is very high maintenance and sometimes calls me 6 times a day, even at work.
I need to stop the drinking at home. Worse yet is, sometimes stopping for drinks on the way home from work.
I am seeing a counselor which helps but I still need some inspirational reads, blogs, etc.
Any good suggestions?
Not sure if these are good, but:
Twelve step groups offer support from multiple people. Yes, they have lots of baggage too; definitely your choice either way. At least they're cheaper than drinking. :)
Gratitude. Daily practice of gratitude might relieve stress and give you an emotional reward instead of drinking. List things you're grateful for, see them in your mind, say them out loud. Thank people for things you appreciate. If you believe in a higher power, express gratitude there. Write daily in a gratitude journal. Many people say these things are surprisingly helpful, but you only find out after you try it, apparently. Perhaps a picnic break or cup of coffee on the way home, where you journal for 10 minutes or so.
From my own life - you can miss a parent when they're gone even if they're a pain when alive. Fruitful topic for experimenting with gratitude, especially if these may be the parent's last years.
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I've tried but not done well. I do ok until I get stressed out, usually from dealing with my aging parents. My Mom is very high maintenance and sometimes calls me 6 times a day, even at work.
I need to stop the drinking at home. Worse yet is, sometimes stopping for drinks on the way home from work.
I am seeing a counselor which helps but I still need some inspirational reads, blogs, etc.
Any good suggestions?
https://www.smartrecovery.org/smart-recovery-toolbox/
The approach is rational emotive behavioral therapy, which was a forerunner of cognitive behavioral therapy.
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Someone earlier mentioned Annie Grace. I tried a couple of her podcasts and they were fantastic. More awareness than judgment, and that made me stop and think. I've cut way back and will return to nothing-during-the-week and then sensible weekends. We'll see!
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I do 30 day challenges like this every once in a while. It's good to reset your body. I plan to start another one right after the 4th of July. I have to agree with others about how work/life stress breaks me down and I give in. Doing the 30 days at a time is good to break the habit for a while and reset.
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What is your go-to non alcoholic drink at a bar or other social setting?
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What is your go-to non alcoholic drink at a bar or other social setting?
Kombucha feels like a treat, but a soda water with a lime acts as a good disguise if you are in a situation where people may hassle you for not joining in the festivities.
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What is your go-to non alcoholic drink at a bar or other social setting?
High quality H2O
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Definitely coke zero with a lime wedge! Virgin cuba libre anyone?
Also, it slipped by without me noticing, but July 1st marked one year without alcohol. Initially I quit because of some meds I was on at the time, but then I realized just how normal drinking had become. It was scary to realize.
And on a sad note, I've noticed that my bond with a good friend has deteriorated. I started meeting her outside of bars and more at home for homecooked meals - and I never had any alcohol available - or Sunday brunches. The visits got shorter and shorter and after a few months, we only saw each other at birthday parties. She's the work-hard-play-hard Wall Street type (Dutchies, can you say Zuidas?). It saddens me to realize that alcohol was apparently such a crutch in our relationship and that we aren't as close as we once were. Or maybe I'm just very boring without alcohol? Hasn't cost me any other friends, so I don't really think so... yeah, it's a bit of a mindfuck to be honest.
But it's also a little sad to see that she needs that crutch. I wish she were more at peace with herself. Gods, that sounds presumptuous of me... I hope you guys know what I mean.
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What is your go-to non alcoholic drink at a bar or other social setting?
Water with fresh lemon
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try club soda with bitters. I've discovered there are all types, and makes the soda feel more "complex" and not necessarily sweet. But simulates the real thing.
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1. water (free!)
2. orange juice
3. cranberry juice
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I officially start my 30 days today! We had some friend from out of town over the weekend so decided to wait until today to start. My wife has been enjoying drinking Perrier with a lime or lemon wedge and we've both been drinking kombucha too. We always drink a ton of plain water every day already so nothing much changing there just cutting out the booze. I also picked up the little tiny cans of pepsi and 7Up. We don't usually ever drink soda, but I thought it would be good to turn to that if we needed something different.
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Everyone please forgive my ignorance but isn't there alcohol in kombucha like around 2%? Much less than beer I know, but still.
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Everyone please forgive my ignorance but isn't there alcohol in kombucha like around 2%? Much less than beer I know, but still.
Less than 0.5% ABV unless sold to 21+, at least in Oregon.
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try club soda with bitters. I've discovered there are all types, and makes the soda feel more "complex" and not necessarily sweet. But simulates the real thing.
I wonder if this is something you can order in a bar, a bitters and soda?
There is a grapefruit bitters by Fee Brothers that is wonderful.
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2 weeks in! The first several days were the worst, but cravings are almost entirely subsided now.
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try club soda with bitters. I've discovered there are all types, and makes the soda feel more "complex" and not necessarily sweet. But simulates the real thing.
I wonder if this is something you can order in a bar, a bitters and soda?
There is a grapefruit bitters by Fee Brothers that is wonderful.
Absolutely you can - I ask for a soda with a splash of bitters, and also quiz them if they are a craft cocktail bar about what sort of bitters they have.
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I got some of these Fee Brother whiskey barrel aged bitters. With a splash of vanilla in sparkling mineral water, it tastes like a dry unsweet rootbeer. It's lovely.
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I've recently kicked alcohol out of my life completely, want to join me? There aren't many benefits, just saving more cash, effortlessly dropping lbs, more mental clarity, the end of hangovers, and much more time and energy to focus on the things that matter. Honestly, I'm surprised it doesn't come up here a little more often!
Alright, Onemorebike: I'm in.
I started drinking when I was 21; I'm 46 now. With the exception of three weeks in 2014, I have had alcohol in my life on a near-daily/weekly basis for 25 years. I've long thought about the physical, mental and financial benefits of going sober (and the financial aspect especially since beginning the ways of the Mustache in 2014).
In fact, if I take my average spending on booze at $200/month and do the MMM thing and calculate investment at 8% return for 10 years, I get:
Nearly $37,000 I could have/could have had. Damn.
And add to that the mental tiredness, crankiness, lost productivity, and worst of all, the lost joy of living I often experience when I'm sober - and it all adds up to a good idea to give it a rest for a while. Maybe for a long while.
Today is Day 1. My goal is to go for 30 days, and possibly longer. The last time I lived like that I was 20 years old. This won't be easy, and habits are hard to break, but I've done many other hard things in my life so I believe I can do this.
Thanks for this conversation. I'm very glad to see it. And very glad to read all the posts everyone has shared!
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I've recently kicked alcohol out of my life completely, want to join me? There aren't many benefits, just saving more cash, effortlessly dropping lbs, more mental clarity, the end of hangovers, and much more time and energy to focus on the things that matter. Honestly, I'm surprised it doesn't come up here a little more often!
Alright, Onemorebike: I'm in.
I started drinking when I was 21; I'm 46 now. With the exception of three weeks in 2014, I have had alcohol in my life on a near-daily/weekly basis for 25 years. I've long thought about the physical, mental and financial benefits of going sober (and the financial aspect especially since beginning the ways of the Mustache in 2014).
In fact, if I take my average spending on booze at $200/month and do the MMM thing and calculate investment at 8% return for 10 years, I get:
Nearly $37,000 I could have/could have had. Damn.
And add to that the mental tiredness, crankiness, lost productivity, and worst of all, the lost joy of living I often experience when I'm sober - and it all adds up to a good idea to give it a rest for a while. Maybe for a long while.
Today is Day 1. My goal is to go for 30 days, and possibly longer. The last time I lived like that I was 20 years old. This won't be easy, and habits are hard to break, but I've done many other hard things in my life so I believe I can do this.
Thanks for this conversation. I'm very glad to see it. And very glad to read all the posts everyone has shared!
This was me a little over five months ago. Welcome, honestly this stands to be one of the better choices/changes I've ever made. I hope it does the same for you. I can't say enough good things about Annie Grace's book on how to control.alcohol and her 30 day challenge that was free when I did it. Check in often, would love to hear how it goes!
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I am twenty days away from a year without booze and it's just going to continue. I stopped because I had turned it into an unhealthy coping mechanism and now it's just not an option for me. I thought I would miss it and I don't. It is so much better inside my head and for the first time in YEARS my weight is creeping down instead of up.
Fancy tea! it's delicious and so much more enjoyment for the price!
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[/quote]This was me a little over five months ago. Welcome, honestly this stands to be one of the better choices/changes I've ever made. I hope it does the same for you. I can't say enough good things about Annie Grace's book on how to control.alcohol and her 30 day challenge that was free when I did it. Check in often, would love to hear how it goes!
[/quote]
Yes, I started t'he Annie Grace thing after reading the posts here. I'm eager to get this going. Looking forward to brighter days!
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14 days into my one-month challenge. Still at zero drinks! Time for a mid-term write-up:
[blah blah]
Day 29. Situation unchanged. Still sober, still going strong.
So, it's been a while, but I completed the challenge. It was pretty easy actually. It might be my imagination but it seems I have lost some belly fat, which is a nice bonus.
After the challenge finished I haven't been on any binges. Still no drinks on ordinary weekday nights, max 2 on social occasions. After one beer, the next round I go for something alcohol-free.
Great success! Now time for the next challenge!
https://forum.mrmoneymustache.com/throw-down-the-gauntlet/no-smartphoneipadpc-before-breakfast-and-after-9-30-pm/
Who's in to join me?
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Most of us have a lifelong addiction to tea and coffee, which fortunately does no harm. Tea and coffee are still crutches, though. To be a Devil's Advocate here, what is needed is a compound which gives the same relaxed, merry feel of alcohol, but without the side effects. I do not know if there has been any research on the matter, and I am surprised that alcohol companies do not attempt to discover such a compound.
Tea and coffee change our mental perception of the world, in a small way. I think it is legitimate to try and make the world seem better, so long as one can do so without side effects.
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Well it's only been a week now, but it seems like so much longer. We've managed to go to 2 parties and stick to not drinking. I suppose that's why it feels longer. Perrier, and Hansen's for the win!
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Most of us have a lifelong addiction to tea and coffee, which fortunately does no harm. Tea and coffee are still crutches, though. To be a Devil's Advocate here, what is needed is a compound which gives the same relaxed, merry feel of alcohol, but without the side effects. I do not know if there has been any research on the matter, and I am surprised that alcohol companies do not attempt to discover such a compound.
Tea and coffee change our mental perception of the world, in a small way. I think it is legitimate to try and make the world seem better, so long as one can do so without side effects.
Coffee was definitely a crutch for me. I was on 3-4 cups a day (all before 2PM) and I had acid reflux and was antsy. My doctor recommended quitting coffee for a bit. The first 10 days were horrible, massive headaches! After that, I felt 100% better than before. Haven't wanted a coffee since. As for tea, I'm not too sure, I don't drink it much, and if I do, it's green tea or chamomile.
And still, the best thing I've done for my health is quitting alcohol over a year ago. It scares me to look back and see how dependent I was starting to get. The good news is, I haven't wanted a single drop since I quit.
Still addicted to cheese/chips/fries/anything hearty really... can't seem to shake that habit.
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To be a Devil's Advocate here, what is needed is a compound which gives the same relaxed, merry feel of alcohol, but without the side effects.
Depends on the side effects you are talking about, but there is a compound which gives similar effects without the liver/cancer risks. Unfortunately it’s highly illegal because it’s used for date rape
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Today is my Day 10 w/o alcohol. I woke up this morning at sunrise, smiling because I felt so good. I'm getting back to a regular, healthy sleeping habit and mental acuity is increasing.
Reminded me of the Bob Marley song, "Woke up this morning/smiled with the rising sun..."
Increased quality of life and decreased unnecessary expenditures... what could be more Mustachian than that?
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This! Exactly this! I'm a week away from my six month mark and the immense improvement in the quality of life (and equally large decrease in spending) are mind blowing. I'm better, my relationships are better, my work is better, my play is the best - so glad I embarked on this and especially pleased to be doing it in tandem with fellow mustachians.
Today is my Day 10 w/o alcohol. I woke up this morning at sunrise, smiling because I felt so good. I'm getting back to a regular, healthy sleeping habit and mental acuity is increasing.
Reminded me of the Bob Marley song, "Woke up this morning/smiled with the rising sun..."
Increased quality of life and decreased unnecessary expenditures... what could be more Mustachian than that?
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Keep on keepin' on, lemonfan. You can do it. Rooting for you!
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Good luck guys. I fell off the wagon a bunch of times before I finally stayed on for good.
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Hi friends. I'm almost at a month and I'm having a bit of a depression kick my ass. Please remind me booze won't fix it. Thanks.
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Hi friends. I'm almost at a month and I'm having a bit of a depression kick my ass. Please remind me booze won't fix it. Thanks.
Hey there! Booze is a depressant so will just make it worse. You can do it!
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Hi friends. I'm almost at a month and I'm having a bit of a depression kick my ass. Please remind me booze won't fix it. Thanks.
Hey there! Booze is a depressant so will just make it worse. You can do it!
Thank you! For some reason I believe it more if someone else tells me.
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Hi friends. I'm almost at a month and I'm having a bit of a depression kick my ass. Please remind me booze won't fix it. Thanks.
Hey there! Booze is a depressant so will just make it worse. You can do it!
Thank you! For some reason I believe it more if someone else tells me.
Always here for a pep-talk
: )
*But seriously my brainspace has got So Much Better since I quit booze. I won't say it's always been easy but it has got easier as I go on and in terms of mood benefits, the closest analogy I have is like when I moved from a gloomy country to a sunny one and became just a much more cheerful person.
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Today I celebrate six months with no hooch! Feeling great and super positive still about this life change, now I'm trying to think of a proper celebration that doesn't include hooch. :)
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Starting no beer/wine or sweets until at least Sept 1st.
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Nice job guys. (And/or ladies). I am at 1 year, 11 months, 21 days.
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I'm at a month and two days. Woot!
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I'm at 11 months and 29 days, weirdly excited to get to a year.
@onemorebike ice cream? An ice cream cake?
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I have been alcohol free for almost 4 months, thanks for all the support and tips.
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When at uni I discovered I didn't really like the taste of alcohol, so I didn't drink much anyway, and then I went on medication, so I pretty much stopped completely. I've had about 2 ciders in the last year, and both of those were at really noisy parties that I felt I had to go to due to family obligations.
So proud of everyone here putting in the effort to cut back/give up. Your wallet and health will both thank you.
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Hi, I was inspired by this thread about a month ago but am just joining you now.
I have significantly reduced my alcohol consumption this past month, and was drinking just one beer a night for 2 weeks. Then I started skipping that, or only drinking half a beer. I've had some headaches and withdrawal issues at first but that is over now.
I've decided not to try to "challenge" myself to be totally sober for a certain amount of time. I don't want to "fall of the wagon" or feel I have failed. But I want to stick to a maximum of just one beer a night, no wine or liquor anymore. And when I find myself thinking about having that beer, to substitute something else -- tea, exercise, a phone chat with a friend (NOT FOOD which is my downfall in terms of weight management!!)
That said, it's been 2 days without a beer for me, so maybe I will just continue and see how I feel?
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Hi Crusty,
I think you should try to commit to a 30 day No Alcohol fast to see how you feel.
I am at 4 months as of next week, and I do feel great. I remember having an uptick in energy after two weeks then again at 3 weeks. I had been trying to moderate for years, had some sucess with 30 beers a month, but then slipped back to my old habits. I read a book that said anyone who drinks several times a week is experienceing a low level withdrawal every day. That it takes 7-10 days for alcohol to be totally out of your system. Once I thouhgt of alcohol as a toxin to the body I had an attitiude adjustment, and just quit ( maybe not forever but my initial goal was 2-6 months). I found without alcohol I am less moody and edgy, something I did not expect and I get along better with my spouse.
Just think of the 30 days as a reset, renew, a purge if you will, a cleansing.
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I've tried that before, and I gained 10 pounds. I'm at a point where I simply cannot gain any more weight. So I am reluctant to commit to a fast of that nature until I know I have a plan for managing my stress in a way that doesn't involve eating. (-:
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It may be harder to loose weight than give up booze. I did not initially loose weight either, but I have been loosing lately, I initially substitited ice cream for beer!
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2 years today.
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Well done, sir!
2 years today.
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Hi Crusty,
I think you should try to commit to a 30 day No Alcohol fast to see how you feel.
You know, on second thought, I think you are right. Immediately after reading your comment, I got a little angry and later that night, had a beer in defiance. "No one is going to suggest to me I shouldn't drink!" I saw at the time how irrational that was.
And I am realizing that if I just have a drink every couple of days, I am still experiencing all the unpleasant effects every couple of days now instead of every day. It's like going through withdrawal over and over and over.
I just signed up for Anne Grace's Alcohol Experiment and am going to give it an honest try.
Thanks @BikeFanatic for the push!
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CrustyBadger,
You are dead on. You are dealing with all of the downside (ongoing withdrawal symptoms) with none of the upside. Annie Grace's 30 day challenge is awesome, make sure and jump on their community boards too - I think they have a forum and a facebook page - they are super helpful!
Keep us updated here too!
Hi Crusty,
I think you should try to commit to a 30 day No Alcohol fast to see how you feel.
You know, on second thought, I think you are right. Immediately after reading your comment, I got a little angry and later that night, had a beer in defiance. "No one is going to suggest to me I shouldn't drink!" I saw at the time how irrational that was.
And I am realizing that if I just have a drink every couple of days, I am still experiencing all the unpleasant effects every couple of days now instead of every day. It's like going through withdrawal over and over and over.
I just signed up for Anne Grace's Alcohol Experiment and am going to give it an honest try.
Thanks @BikeFanatic for the push!
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Been (mostly) booze free for a month now. My wife and I split a very good sour beer with another couple, 4 oz each, last week. Thoroughly enjoyed it, didn't feel the need for more afterwards. We'll be continuing the booze free life for another 2 months at least. Physically and emotionally, this has been great for us. We've both dropped a significant amount of fat, gotten stronger, and don't argue as much.
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Hi Everybody,
I hit my 30-day mark Alcohol Free yesterday. I have no plans to go back to the alcohol days. Once I got the medical, scientific facts of all the ways alcohol is known to harm the body from a book called Alcohol Explained (by William Porter), I realized I could never look at a glass of beer the same way again.
Though I am fit, I am also pre-diabetic. I've learned that heavy drinking (my case) brings on diabetes even faster than it otherwise would occur. That scares the bajeezus out of me!
I won't go into the whole story here, but I drank for 25 years, with no breaks, in ever-increasing amounts. This year has been a bad one (lots of booze); I was looking for an excuse to give it up when I saw this thread. The timing was perfect for me - so glad I did it.
If you're thinking about going booze free, you should give it a shot. You probably can't remember how good it feels to have your old self back again.
I recommend Annie Grace's "Alcohol Experiment" online site, as well.
Life was meant to be lived! What have you got to lose? Nothing - and everything to gain!
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nice to hear, peregrine!
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Great stuff @peregrine I just hit my first year and it just gets easier.
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Although I look through all of the posts in this forum, I've actively avoided reading this one until today. I know I need to give up alcohol but have made a lot of excuses to keep drinking. Last December, I decided to make some changes in the new year - I declared January to be a no spend, no alcohol and lose weight month. I had packed on an extra 15 pounds over the last few years (divorce, new job, 4 grown kids, etc). Well that didn't last. I did keep my spending low (not "no" but still good) and after struggling the first couple weeks, tried a low carb diet (the first time I have ever tried it as I was always a calories in/calories out girl). I lost the extra 15 pounds quickly (and kept them off!). I definitely see food differently now and will never go back to the way I used to eat (I have carbs but am very thoughtful about what I'm eating). Now it's time to tackle the alcohol issue. A lot has changed in my life the last 4 years (well, everything has changed in my life the last 4 years...) and my drinking habit slowly increased. Starting today, I am going to cut way back. I am meeting friends out Friday (who I haven't seen in many years) and know I will have a couple beers out with them. I want to be realistic so I won't fail. After that, I plan to stop drinking for a few weeks. I don't think this will be easy but I need to make this change. I'll be reading this sub everyday as you are all very encouraging. Thank you!
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Hi @frugalkristen Good luck to you!
I really like Annie Grace. She wrote This Naked Mind (which I haven't read yet) and has a free thing on the web called the Alcohol Experiment. I just decided to dive in and try it -- it's 30 days of emails with links to videos, research, and journal "assignments". It's very low key and non judgmental, and it is having a really good effect on me.
With all the stress I have been under the past few years, my drinking to de stress (and not feel) has increased a great deal. I was getting alarmed at how my tolerance has increased but tried to a few times and wasn't able to reduce it for long. It's early days yet, but something about this time feels different. And it isn't hard, like it was in the past. So, it seems to be working for me, anyhow, and I read reviews from others who say the same thing. It's worth checking out IMO!
Again, good luck!
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If you do the annie grace video challenge you should start before you quit drinking she has some exercise to do while you are still drinking, I did it backwards, quit then joined the group.
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It's been 11 days since I started the Annie Grace video program. I am starting to feel the effects of being completely alcohol free. I really like the constant support and videos to watch every day, talking about a different effect alcohol has on our bodies, or things we might be going through as we are discontinuing alcohol use. It kind of reminds me of being pregnant and those emails you would get saying "on this date in your pregnancy, your body is doing this" kind of thing.
One thing I notice is I am sleeping more, and when I wake up I am much less anxious than I have been upon awakening. I used to wake to these nightmares -- in a panicky feeling, "Oh, no there's something really really important that I forgot".
It's been SUPER easy to stop drinking. I get cravings around dinner time but I am easily able to just let them go. I don't have any peer pressure to drink, in fact most of my friends (when I see them) don't drink, so that part is easy. And my husband has even voluntarily cut back a lot of his drinking as well.
Life is not very stressful at the moment because I'm not working (teacher -- summer vacation) AND my kids are away from home, though. They return Friday and school starts again next week. I'm fearful that the only reason I've been able to handle stress without alcohol is that I just haven't had a lot of stress to deal with and don't know what will happen once my little stressors return!
One thing I CANNOT do is gain weight. I am already at 195 pounds and I'm only 5'8". I have resolved not to go back to drinking though, so I am going to have to do something else to not gain weight. The alcohol experiment videos have helped me to realize I have to make a plan to deal with these sugar cravings... more protein, and more exercise I guess.
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Oh... one more thing.... I think conservatively, I spent a minimum of $20 a week on alcohol. (This doesn't count what my husband drinks.) Since I am no longer drinking, this is money that I can be spending on paying down debt.
But...
I think instead, just for a while, I am going to move $80/month into my (nonexistent) clothing budget. I do not spend any money on clothes for myself. But for once I am going to reward myself a little bit. I am making good progress on my debt, and do not have a habit of indulging myself with little rewards or treats. And I really truly need some new work clothes.
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I'm in on this challenge. I don't really crave alcohol very much and I have always thought the non-alcoholic versions of whatever I'm drinking taste better comparatively but I have let social drinking sort of take over my life. The biggest issue is that alcohol is one of the biggest sources of conflict in my marriage. I can't do anything about the amount my husband drinks but I can decide right now that I'll quit for good.
Congratulations and good luck to everyone in this thread. Y'all are an inspiration.
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@CrustyBadger - Good going, Ya I would plop that extra money right into the clothing budget, reward yourself for a month not drinking , saves a ton of money if you go out to bars or out to dinner with ten dollar glasses of wine. I aim for 30 days at a time and commit for 30 days every month. I just finished 4 months and am committed for another month. I calculate my spouse and I save 250-300$ a month!
Also, I think you can be an inspiration to your spouse if you quit, I quit first in my relationship. Good luck to all of you.
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I wouldn't mind shedding some pounds, but I'm not keen on eliminating alcohol altogether.
Certain beers are just so incredibly delicious tasting to me.
I will try to cut back on overall volume, drink slower to savor the flavor even more, etc.
I don't drink during the week, but on the weekends average 3 beers per day.
I've already cut back drinking bad beer. I used to regularly attend a cheap Chicken Wing and beer night, but the crappy beer is just not worth the calories. Ok, the Chicken Wings probably aren't either, but at least those taste good!
If someone comes up with an alcohol free hazy IPA, let me know immediately!
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The only NA beers worth drinking are, in order of preference: 1) Beck's Buckler, and 2) St. Pauli Girl NA.
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I beg to differ on the non alcoholic beers! I say there are 4 that are good, all from Germany.
Buckler =90 calories is is made by Heineken I believe, and that is a good one, plain but good.
I also like Becks Blue label that one is only 60 calories.
I do enjoy the St pauligirls, but it tastes very similar to Becks.
Then there is Claushauller Amber dry hopped. Has a Wort taste to it ( wort is unfermented beer), and the hops give it a kick, I like it.
lastly there is Sharps amber by Miller or Coors I think, not bad really. Kaliber is by guiness and i find it a tad sweet but OK .
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You're right, Buckler is made by Heineken. There is also a Becks n.a., that's pretty good.
I keep a few of these in the back porch fridge in the summer months and pop one after I finish mowing the lawn.
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It does satisfy, my wife and I can have a beer on the back porch, not as tasty as a real beer, but I feel like I am relaxed and enjoying myself.
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Early on in my sobriety we did a bunch of fruit juices and selzers. Coconut water with pineapple juice was especially tasty. Now it's just the selzers because we are watching the carbs. The only combo I have continued is the "cranberry fizz."
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Grapefruit juice w seltzer gives the same bitter citrus as an IPA. It's a staple in our house
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That sounds really, really good. I may have to try it.
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I've cut back in recent weeks, to support my wife re: reproductive reasons. I've found that LeCroix sparkling water works for me, as a substitute. I went out with a friend a few days ago, had a shot, and felt really gross - like I had just poured a little glassful of toxins into my body...
Not sure yet how serious I want to get about this, but the benefits of quitting, or at least significantly reducing, alcohol consumption, are pretty clear to me... Sympathy sobriety is definitely a good thing!
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I still have not fully committed to be a teetotaler, but I've managed to pass by my regular watering hole a couple of times this week and talk to my friends there and resisted the beer offerings. Small victory. :)
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I was alcohol free for about 4 months earlier this year. Recently tried adding it back in and I think I’m gonna stay dry for life. My inflammation levels go up, mild sugar cravings return despite otherwise sticking to my very low carb diet, and my enjoyment of it isn’t worth the other negative physical and emotional feelings (I have chronic depression).
Gonna go back and read the thread now.
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Downloaded a sobriety tracker app after reading through the thread, I think that will be a good thing to have :)
@CrustyBadger you mention your weight issues. Have you tried LCHF or other ketogenic type diets? They don’t necessarily work for everyone, but I’ve been completely changed by it and know a lot of folks who’ve benefited too. In my experience, it works similar to dropping alcohol for a set period and then having a drink again. After a month or two, eating carbs again makes you feel so fucking gross that it’s self-reinforcing.
Similar to alcohol, I personally really struggle to moderate with carbs. Cold turkey was the only way for me to succeed.
I’ve lost 55+ lb in 19 months and am 20lbs lighter than I’ve ever been as an adult (have been obese my entire life) with maybe 10-15 more pounds to lose before I’m at a quite health body fat %.
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@furrychickens: I did the same. Shortly after I gave up drinking (about 2 years ago now) I went pretty hard-core keto. I lost about 40 lbs and have kept it off. Intermittent fasting really kicks it into overdrive.
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@furrychickens, I would LOVE to try a LCHF or even a Whole30 type meal plan again. I did very well on an Atkins induction diet years ago; felt the healthiest I ever did by cutting out most grains and starches. I ate a ton of leafy green veggies, sensible protein, nuts and so on.
I have a lot of very serious family responsibilities right now with different medical issues related to food. My husband is no longer able to chew and I have to prepare everything so it can be pureed or easily swallowed, for example, and he needs more calories because he is losing weight. Both my children have different food related issues as well (and they both need help gaining weight). Trying to keep some semblance of normality with family mealtimes is important, and I'm afraid everyone else's needs are coming in front of mine. I tried throwing money at the problem (that's how I ran into so much debt!) and am now trying to throw time at the problem (but with working full time and dealing with the caretaking my husband needs, and the needs to two teens... it's hard... which is why I drink...)
Anyhow, I am hoping cutting out alcohol will give me more energy to deal with other issues. And maybe I'll find a practical solution for my personal meal needs that doesn't require spending too much money.
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@CrustyBadger oof, that’s a load!
I could see a lot of ways you could make it easy on yourself, like eating lunch meat and cheese, pre-cooked sausages, etc but totally understand the overwhelmed feeling.
Depending on what’s going on with your kids, I’ve also known folks using keto or similar auto-immune protocol diets to gain weight. Good luck!
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Wow you have a lot on your plate. A friend of mine lost all his saliva from radiation and had to feed himself through a tube in his stomach. Such a drag as food is such a big pleasure. Take care
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More motivation to quit:
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There's "no safe level of alcohol," major new study concludes
https://www.cbsnews.com/news/alcohol-and-health-no-safe-level-of-drinking-major-new-study-concludes/
"Previous studies have found a protective effect of alcohol on some conditions, but we found that the combined health risks associated with alcohol increase with any amount of alcohol," lead author Dr. Max Griswold, of the Institute for Health Metrics and Evaluation at the University of Washington, said in a statement. "In particular, the strong association between alcohol consumption and the risk of cancer, injuries, and infectious diseases offset the protective effects for ischemic heart disease in women in our study."
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I reached day 50 today. I'm finding that the greatest temptations occur after a stressful day at work. The long hours and tiredness contribute to the temptation of a drink, but once I get home the pattern is broken and I don't even think about it.
Funny, how our triggers work. I've heard that after 3 months your brain has made new habits that require virtually no thinking or willpower anymore. I'm halfway there.
In any case, I'm doing better in all areas of life and plan to keep it that way!
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Amen, peregrine!
I am finding my only cravings to come when I feel I am being pulled in all directions by my family members' needs. Once I realize that is what is happening, the impulse to have a drink dwindles away. I've realized that having a drink of alcohol will do nothing to help me meet anyone's needs!
I've started enjoying working out (with my teenaged son) in the late evenings as well. By the time we get home and I have my shower, it's basically bed time and there's not even a time to sit around and crave a glass of alcohol.
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Day 13 for me. Having a bit more cravings than I remember from the last time I went sober but it’s all good.
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When my son quit drinking he replaced it with sparkling water with lemon added. He is coming today for a few weeks so I stocked up. I quit drinking at 31 when I was raising my kids and after awhile I never had the urge anymore. Took it up again about 10 years ago but recently decided that I am only drinking once a week when we go out for dinner. It’s too easy to let it become a unhealthy nightly habit.
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To be a Devil's Advocate here, what is needed is a compound which gives the same relaxed, merry feel of alcohol, but without the side effects.
Depends on the side effects you are talking about, but there is a compound which gives similar effects without the liver/cancer risks. Unfortunately it’s highly illegal because it’s used for date rape
Hehehehe lol.
But actually: though it doesn't give the same 'buzz' alcohol does: exercise makes me a much happier and more relaxed person!
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I just want to give a sincere thank you to the thread as a whole and those specifically that pointed out Annie Grace's book, This Naked Mind. I've come to view alcohol in a whole different light (coming from a daily drinker 20+ years). For anyone that's had the feeling they need to cut back a bit, limit their alcohol to certain amounts or days I'd highly recommend checking out the book. Don't worry, you can be drinking while you read it and you won't have to commit to cutting back or quitting. I went through a Whole 30 and felt great afterwards and I'm coming to realize I think a major reason for how I felt was just being sober for that long. However the restriction that said I couldn't drink that month was miserable and in fact I couldn't wait to have wine as soon as it was allowed. Personally I haven't said to myself I'm never drinking again but I'm just feeling right now that I just don't want to drink. Crazy.
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I also am greatful for the book ( this Naked Mind) and this thread, I havent had a drink in 5 months and I do feel really good.
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I love this thread and how positive everyone is on it. My tea collection is exploding but it is amazing what a good substitute a nice cup of tea is in terms of marking transition from work to not-work time.
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Well done to all of you.
I drink maybe two glasses of champagne a year. This has always been the case.
And I feel totally normal.
Some families or groups have low alcohol tolerance, I think that is my case, as that flute of champagne make me dizzy.
Not forgetting the aunt, three uncles and Grandfather all dead of drink related diseases might also be pointers that I should never ever be tempted!
Proud of all of you!
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I love this thread and how positive everyone is on it. My tea collection is exploding but it is amazing what a good substitute a nice cup of tea is in terms of marking transition from work to not-work time.
Yes! Or even just a "nice cold glass of ice water"!
I was able to reframe my desire for a "cold beer" or "a glass of white wine" when coming home from a long day of stress at work in this way. "I can't wait to get home, put my feet up, and have a nice cold glass of ice water." If you say it often enough, it starts to sound like a treat. (-:
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I'm currently working with the rule that I am only allowed to have an alcoholic beverage when I'm outside of my own house. As others have said I mainly don't like that a glass of wine had become a habit, and that maybe the amount in that glass had grown little by little.
I do now have a sparkling water habit. But for some reason I don't feel bad about drinking a 1/2 liter bottle of Costco's fancy stuff.
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I love the title of this post btw :)
I’ve been lurking since I saw it. I don’t have a problem with my drinking level but I’m 47 and over the last year I feel like my body/liver is telling me NO! I would have hangovers from just a couple glasses of wine, so odd.
I had my blood test last fall a year ago now and Dr said my liver enzymes are fine and people develop sensitivity. Anyway, a few months ago I just...stopped drinking.
It’s funny how in social situations it can be odd. I’m in Sales, so I’m getting small glasses of seltzer with lime, etc. but I’ve managed just fine. With friends if anyone asks I just say I’m up for a 10-15 mile bike ride Sunday morning (which is true), and That tends to work, versus “I think my liver might be aging” lmao
Thanks all, for sharing.
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Liver enzymes are not always elevated when someone has liver damage. A liver ultrasound may be a better evaluation. I am not a Doctor .
I am more sensitive to alcohol last few years, especially wine gives me a headache the next day. My symptoms mostly were low energy the next day after drinking 3 beers. I thought I was getting old and lazy but when I quit drinking I had tons of energy
I also feel like I am in a small society of non drinkers and I rarely meet non drinkers. who needs non drinking friends when you have youtube I guess. Lots of support there.
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Good Morning!
I am day two of no booze, and it's much better than day one--although, the hangover on day one was strong impetus for deciding to investigate a teetotaler's life. DH and I looked at each other yesterday while feeling like crap and chagrined over stupid fighting and decided we have crept into the realm of "problem drinking."
Hearing how good all of you are feeling is very motivating.
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Good Morning!
I am day two of no booze, and it's much better than day one--although, the hangover on day one was strong impetus for deciding to investigate a teetotaler's life. DH and I looked at each other yesterday while feeling like crap and chagrined over stupid fighting and decided we have crept into the realm of "problem drinking."
Hearing how good all of you are feeling is very motivating.
Keep the memory of how you felt on day 1 as motivation for the day you're in. There was a time I couldn't imagine not drinking. My life took a whole new direction when I gave it up. Best decision I ever made. It's just for today. Lots of today's make months make years. Health, Spirit, Relationships, Finances grow along with it if you want it to. Wishing you the best.
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DH and I looked at each other yesterday while feeling like crap and chagrined over stupid fighting and decided we have crept into the realm of "problem drinking."
Someone I listen to recently on a Podcast said 90 percent of all arguments were fueled by Caffiene or alcohol...
I did learn, as a side effect of my spouse and I giving up beer, is that we do indeed get along better and I was not expecting that. I am a lot less moody especially in the morning and am more aware of my moods.
Good luck on day 3
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@snogirl & @BikeFanatic thanks for the support. Intriguing data and personal experiences on the fighting; looking back over the past couple of years we've realized our really bad fights were at least partially fueled by booze. I wouldn't have thought that, but it's another motivator for sure.
Day three went pretty well except that I've somehow got a head cold :p I'm figuring that by the time the cold goes away I'll be feeling pretty fine! (Did notice intense sugar cravings around happy hour yesterday and today, and I've not been eating sweets for about a month; assume that was detox related).
Definitely a great thread for me right now--thanks to all the participants for the read!
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We definitely fought more with booze in the equation. I just wasn't as attentive to my family's needs, or as attuned to the nuances of personal interactions. Also, as was already mentioned, paying attention to your moods is hella easier when you are sober and those swings just aren't as common when you aren't fighting even the slightest hangover.
Keep it up!
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I've recently kicked alcohol out of my life completely, want to join me?
Congratulations, good for you! I stopped alcohol drinking a long time ago and don't plan to resume. No regrets.
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I had a dream last night that I was asking a few friends out for beer and everyone was starting at me wondering why I was getting ready to drink. As I reflected on it more I figured it might be related to feeling a little more socially isolated after giving up what I think is a pretty common social endeavor (hey, lets grab a beer or want to cruise to the bar tonight? Or after work or..) I know you can just have a soda water but even with that I get fewer invites because folks know I don't drink and I organize fewer get togethers because I was big on gatherings when I drank more but don't love them as much now.
What are your go to social outings as you limit your alcohol intake?
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Came to check in yesterday to announce I'd made it a full week. For some reason, starting that post made me really, really, really want a beer so I ended up walking away and trying to distract myself. Was effective at that and it's too early to drink now so here I am on day 8, feeling pretty good.
The social challenges raised by @onemorebike are ones that I've been dreading the most. It's not like I'm a big bar hopper, but 1-2 times a month have drinks out with friends or at home-based dinner. I'm not completely sure how to deal with this future event--have even been considering modifying "no hooch" to "only social hooch" for this reason. I'm attracted to the clear hard line of purity, but I'm also not convinced I never want to drink again.
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FWIW, I went back and read Annie Grace's "liminal" chapter on the belief that you drink to be more social and that helped me answer my own question. A week is awesome. I can't do the only social hooch, I'm too social. :)
Came to check in yesterday to announce I'd made it a full week. For some reason, starting that post made me really, really, really want a beer so I ended up walking away and trying to distract myself. Was effective at that and it's too early to drink now so here I am on day 8, feeling pretty good.
The social challenges raised by @onemorebike are ones that I've been dreading the most. It's not like I'm a big bar hopper, but 1-2 times a month have drinks out with friends or at home-based dinner. I'm not completely sure how to deal with this future event--have even been considering modifying "no hooch" to "only social hooch" for this reason. I'm attracted to the clear hard line of purity, but I'm also not convinced I never want to drink again.
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53 days and counting! Alcoholism runs in my family, and found myself not liking who I was under the influence as much as myself sober.
So far so good. I've only had 2 people notice, both of who are close to me. Other than that I basically don't tell anyone and sip on my LeCroix or nonalcoholic cocktail / ginger drink.
Lost weight, and saving probably $40-80 a month.
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53 days! That is great news, you must be feeling amazing. Best advice I heard was that you are pretty much never in the clear, keep it up.
53 days and counting! Alcoholism runs in my family, and found myself not liking who I was under the influence as much as myself sober.
So far so good. I've only had 2 people notice, both of who are close to me. Other than that I basically don't tell anyone and sip on my LeCroix or nonalcoholic cocktail / ginger drink.
Lost weight, and saving probably $40-80 a month.
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booze free for 92 days. Breaking the streak in a couple weeks when we head out on vacation, then back to no booze. 38 pounds of weight loss since dropping the booze.
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38 pounds? That's bananas.
booze free for 92 days. Breaking the streak in a couple weeks when we head out on vacation, then back to no booze. 38 pounds of weight loss since dropping the booze.
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What are your go to social outings as you limit your alcohol intake?
Group sports or group exercise. It's hard to drink alcohol when you are working up a sweat.
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What are your go to social outings as you limit your alcohol intake?
Group sports or group exercise. It's hard to drink alcohol when you are working up a sweat.
When I did the Annie Grace "alcohol experiment" course she showed us a graph that said how many adults in the US drink and how much/how often they drink. I was really surprised to see than (roughly) 33% of the adults do not drink alcohol at all, and another 33% drink only about once or twice a month or so. Only the "top" third of the population drinks once a week, and of that group about 1/3 just once or twice a week, 1/3 drinks about once a day, and only the "top" one tenth drinks as I drank, more than once glass each day, or more than 14 drinks each week.
So looking at that, it seems it should be easy to find social events where people aren't drinking. Most people in the US don't drink that much. But that hasn't been the case in my social circle in the past -- many social gatherings (including watching sports) involve drinking alcohol.
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When I did the Annie Grace "alcohol experiment" course she showed us a graph that said how many adults in the US drink and how much/how often they drink. I was really surprised to see than (roughly) 33% of the adults do not drink alcohol at all, and another 33% drink only about once or twice a month or so. Only the "top" third of the population drinks once a week, and of that group about 1/3 just once or twice a week, 1/3 drinks about once a day, and only the "top" one tenth drinks as I drank, more than once glass each day, or more than 14 drinks each week.
So looking at that, it seems it should be easy to find social events where people aren't drinking. Most people in the US don't drink that much. But that hasn't been the case in my social circle in the past -- many social gatherings (including watching sports) involve drinking alcohol.
Here's a link to a 2014 chart:
https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/wonk/wp/2014/09/25/think-you-drink-a-lot-this-chart-will-tell-you/?noredirect=on&utm_term=.20f9c38cef97
It is surprising to me too. I'm in the 7th to 8th Decile.
Top decile...10 drinks per day every day! Yikes!
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That was it -- yeah, I was in the 9th decile.
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Rejoining this thread...sorta. Will I be completely booze free? Not sure yet. But it was a Saturday yesterday and I didn't drink. I had 2 drinks on Thursday and 3 on Friday. Too much. My pattern has been to be dry Sun-Wed then have drink (or two, or three) on Thurs/Fri/Sat. I'm trying to break the pattern. My previous pattern was drinking daily so I was doing better with the new pattern but I found it too easy to binge (I'm female, I should have 1 drink a day, max) and then I felt stupid the next day. I don't want my kids to see me tipsy and definitely not drunk. According to the chart, I was in the 8th decile and my husband is in the 9th. I'm shooting for something more in the 6th decile - two drinks per month total.
The plan - I love ginger beer (alcohol free) and the heat of the ginger replicates the feeling of alcohol on my throat. Husband has agreed to buy me fancy ginger beer as my Fri/Sat treat. This also coincides with me stopping sodas for caffeine in the mornings, so the ginger beer will taste even better.
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I just realized I have been alcohol free for over 2 months!
Not having any difficulties with it. Very occasionally I will crave a beer, and since I'm not doing the Annie Grace emails every day anymore will forget that I'm not drinking and why... but then I remember and don't have the beer (they are still in the fridge because my husband does still drink them.)
To free up more space in the fridge I've asked him if we can just store the beer somewhere else, and only make a beer cold beer by beer. It's more of a pain for him, but he also wants to be cutting back. And you can chill a beer pretty quickly in the freezer.
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Giving sober October a try. Those charts are pretty interesting. I'm a ninth percentile drinking and man those triggers people list on page 1 hit home.
After just one week the triggers are so constant - post bike ride, back porch grilling, rough day at work, lazy weekend afternoon. But I'm down at least a pound and probably saved $20-30 bucks already.
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This thread gracefully "found me" tonight and love the amazing results folks are getting... so I'm in for a "test walk" now till my birthday Oct 20... then see how long I can "run" after that... Major work stress / org change drama, a change in exercise habits (really cut back on tennis after an injury) and the alcohol habit especially during college football season are not being good to me physically with weight/sleep/energy loss, the whole negative enchilada. No kidding, I may need some nudges to keep me going y'all.
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The best advice I can give is commit to a month. Like when figuring out possible food intolerances or allergies too mild to show up on a prick test, a month seems like the minimum effective period to abstain from something and have your body recover from delayed negative reactions. Then, if desired, add it back in and see how you feel. The difference is sometimes subtle, sometimes surprisingly stark.
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Just wanted to encourage everyone here for going alcohol free, keep it up! Your weight and finances are all the better for it.
I know how hard it is to decline alcohol especially when your social circle wants to hang out at a bars. Just the other day I was at a gathering and meet a bunch of new people that I wanted to get to know better. One offered me a beer and normally I wouldn't hesitate to just say that I'm OK, however this time for a split second I actually considered taking him up on his offer because I wanted to be social make a good impression. I still declined politely and we had a good time getting to know each other. Turns out it was all in my head and most people don't really care if you drink or not.
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It's Friday and I'm not drinking. I just don't want it to have power over me anymore, and my aunt is dying from esophageal cancer. Alcohol can contribute to that sort of cancer and I don't want to put my kids what my cousins are going through right now. Not saying my aunt caused her cancer, I have no idea. But I quit smoking for the health benefits and I don't see much of a difference now between smoking and drinking.
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Well done Neustache! Same here... went for a bike ride for my happy hour Fri night instead of boozing... And already down a few easy pounds so far. Feels awesome!
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Fantastic Money Badger! Keep it up!
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Just a quick check-in, I am still sober and liking it. I had two worriesome scenarios, with my parents coming to town and my husband’s band playing at a brewery, but I came through both just fine with soda and sparkling water.
I’m glad to be showing my 16 year old that you can enjoy life sober.
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@Bean05, Way to go!
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Just want to chime and thank everyone for this thread. I needed to read all this and to see the ideas. My nightly "glass of wine" habit really has grip on me in a way that I don't like. I can make the same argument with my morning coffee but alcohol truly is different. I went dry last week Mon-Friday and it was great. I had wine Sat and Sunday but will get back on track this week. I haven't concluded I need to full board quit but I need to seriously cut back. It was harder than I want to admit. The drink alternatives (esp the grapefruit juice with soda water) were very helpful. The evening wine is very ritual based for me and I need all the help I can get to find new rituals. That time of night is usually when I can finally sit down and relax and read.
Anyway, as always I find great advice on these forums.....!
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Managed to not drink during a cabin trip. Pretty big deal for me! I used to go to the cabin all the time and not drink, but then it became a habit to drink. 16 days with no drinking....sad that it's an accomplishment but there you go!
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@danakado you are doing great. I found a nice cup of tea now serves the ritual purpose. I get to look at my choices, decide which one suits how i am feeling today, and then sit and drink a nice beverage that was thoughtfully chosen.
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@danakado you are doing great. I found a nice cup of tea now serves the ritual purpose. I get to look at my choices, decide which one suits how i am feeling today, and then sit and drink a nice beverage that was thoughtfully chosen.
Thank you! I want to love tea but I don't. I do also like kombuchu and now that Costco carries some it's cheaper. The hardest part is pouring that instead of wine. Once I'm drinking it I don't really care but making that better choice feels pretty hard. Just last night I was about to pity party myself into wine instead. It's embarrassing to admit this but I'm also glad to be working through this. Because I was not drinking a lot (1 sometimes 2 glasses) it was pretty easy to blow it off. And I guess I think I still want to. What is the line? Is it the mental addiction? And like I mentioned before, I have the same relationship with coffee. With coffee I moved to mostly decaf but still, if asked to give it up all together I would be seriously sad.
I was also hoping that no drinking would be a miracle sleep fix. I do think it's helped but not sure I can call it a miracle?
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I do not like tea much either, and I hear you on the coffee!
Please give the sleep a little more time to evaluate it. I noticed after two - three weeks that I slept better, I dreamed more, and remembered my dreams. Even if you do not drink much I think you need a reset - like 2-3 weeks to feel the benefits.
Some would say if you drink weekly, and alcohol lasts 7-10 day in the body, then you are in a constant state of low level withdrawal until those 7-10 days are through. I felt really great after 3 weeks without booze and then later maybe 6 weeks as well a big uptick in energy at those times
( maybe from the improved sleep?)
Kombucha on the rocks is a nice wine substitute, and if you really like it , you can make it easily. Just need a SCOBY. I also do selzter with Lemon, much more economical. Good luck
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For me, it was when wine became The Only Stress Relief that I knew I needed to make the switch. Never physically addicted but it had to be entirely off the table for me to build up the other tools in my solution set.
In terms of timeframes to clear, 7-10 days gets it out of your system, there's a dramatic increase in braincell regrowth around 90 days that often triggers drinking urges but increases clarity if you get past it and them again around 1 year.
Kombucha, fancy vinegars in seltzer, splash of juice in soda water. I recommend a Fancyarse Glass so you get the special drink feeling
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mspym
That is very interesting about the brain cell regrowth. Between that and reduced risk of Breast cancer, I am glad to be AF for over six months , here is to a year, ( raises fancy arse glass of Kombucha).
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@BikeFanatic *raises cup of tea* i was surprised about the correlation between alcohol and breast cancer. Given my family history, i am pleased to finally be reducing that risk factor
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In terms of timeframes to clear, 7-10 days gets it out of your system, there's a dramatic increase in braincell regrowth around 90 days that often triggers drinking urges but increases clarity if you get past it and them again around 1 year.
Interesting! I'm getting close to the 90 day mark I think and have been noticing more cravings lately when I hadn't been feeling them for so long! I thought it was maybe just the fact that the weather was getting colder and darker.
I'm trying to reframe my longings and cravings for a nice cold beer as "I really want a nice ice cold glass of water" and drink water like crazy because I think haf the time when I craved a drink, I was truly just thirsty!
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Loving this thread.
I'm two years alcohol free today! Started as a one year experiment. Feels so good to sleep well every night and wake up refreshed that I just kept going.
I am sure at some point in the future I will have a drink a social gathering or celebration, but these days I'm happy to be the DD, and let the DW have a few.
Keep it up everyone, it's worth it.
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Will be falling off the wagon for the "World's Largest Cocktail Party" in Jacksonville for the UGA-FL game... I'm now genuinely curious to see how I feel Sunday and next week given recent temperance... Stay tuned for next week's post with the results (or testimony?)
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Sure, I would like to hear your honest experience. Maybe you can commit to a month aftercthe game and see how that goes.
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In terms of timeframes to clear, 7-10 days gets it out of your system, there's a dramatic increase in braincell regrowth around 90 days that often triggers drinking urges but increases clarity if you get past it and them again around 1 year.
Interesting! I'm getting close to the 90 day mark I think and have been noticing more cravings lately when I hadn't been feeling them for so long! I thought it was maybe just the fact that the weather was getting colder and darker.
I'm trying to reframe my longings and cravings for a nice cold beer as "I really want a nice ice cold glass of water" and drink water like crazy because I think haf the time when I craved a drink, I was truly just thirsty!
Hi CrustyBadger (cool name!), checking in as suggested. Is it possible to tag/follow threads in the MMM forum? I haven't seen any form of favourites function yet.
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@Latestarter73 the easiest way to follow a thread is to post in it, and from then on if there are any updates they will show if you click on the 'show new replies to your posts' link just under your user name. There is a subscribe option but then it spams your inbox.
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@BikeFanatic and all, OK, here's the result from my "off the wagon" weekend... I certainly drank a LOT less than prior game long weekends over a 4 day period... And I have sworn off wine. Simply killed my sleep and overall happiness level the next day, even just 2 glasses worth. One day of bourbon at the game was relatively few side effects by comparison though. Worst of all, I put back on about 5 of the 10 lbs I'd lost just from the brief bender. So now back onto my bike and enough of the sauce for "Sober-vember"... Goal is at least 50 miles on the bike and 10lbs off my arse!
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Thanks for the update! I love Sober vember. I plan a foray myself this weekend and am a tad nervous about being re addicted. We shall see.
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Well, I drank for the first time in a month or so on Halloween. Eff that. Felt like hell the next day even though I didn't drink that much. Think I'll take the rest of the year off and go easy at new years.
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It's been 4 weeks. I'm probably having a drink tonight, but just one. I'm super glad I broke the cycle that I had fallen into, and I might be back again for another break later. Thanks to all for this thread!
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I’m doing “sober November”. Not that I drink to excess, but I’m cutting carbs and feel like my waistline and wallet will both thank me for this.
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You all inspired me. Also have to share some credit with the hangover I woke up with yesterday. I am not going to drink at home anymore. In a move where I have to be anti-mustachian to achieve mustachian goals, I plan to only drink socially. I really don't feel having a beer at home adds to my life, but going out to enjoy a drink or two with a friend on occasion (at the same rate I do today) does add joy to my life. The home drinking feels like added drinking with no added joy. We'll see how I can do with moderation as my DH is habitual drinker and always offers to share.
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@aneel, That's a good point about the joy of social drinking vs. the "habitual home" drinking... It takes the edge off business meetings and other awkward gatherings (neighborhood dinner party or book club anyone?) And it certainly reduces intake to realize you're paying $5 or more a glass at the restaurant than drinking cheaply "in bulk" at home. A rare case where it's good to pay more at the restaurant/bar than at home.
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I've had an extremely stressful weekend, capping a stressful week, and for the first time since going alcohol free over the summer, find myself really struggling with cravings for alcohol. It is very clear to me that I actually want to medicate myself in some way to deal with the emotions I am feeling.
I am having deep cravings for one (or two or three) shots of vodka, over ice. I haven't felt this strongly in quite some time.
I'm not going to drink; I've decided for myself that I am done with that. That was my choice and only for me. But I think I need some other strategies for dealing with the emotions I am feeling. Simply sitting with the cravings, acknowledging them, and letting them pass worked in the past but isn't working now.
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I've had an extremely stressful weekend, capping a stressful week, and for the first time since going alcohol free over the summer, find myself really struggling with cravings for alcohol. It is very clear to me that I actually want to medicate myself in some way to deal with the emotions I am feeling.
I am having deep cravings for one (or two or three) shots of vodka, over ice. I haven't felt this strongly in quite some time.
I'm not going to drink; I've decided for myself that I am done with that. That was my choice and only for me. But I think I need some other strategies for dealing with the emotions I am feeling. Simply sitting with the cravings, acknowledging them, and letting them pass worked in the past but isn't working now.
I totally hear you on this although my lifestyle change wasn't alcohol. It's blindsiding to have such strong cravings after months of smooth(er) sailing.
I have some alternative treats/activities to reach for as well as reminding myself how good the life change has been feeling. But not going to lie - it's a shock when this happens. Humbling and hard. Hang in there!
Edited to say that this is a wakeup call to develop some future coping strategies now you know this will happen and how it feels. Sorry this isn't more helpful right in the moment now.
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Thanks, @Moustachienne !
Yeah, I wondered if there was even a point to sending a semi-anonymous post out to the forum, detailing a personal struggle like that. But I wanted to share with someone and don't want to reach out to people I know in real life.
A good cry, a hot bath, a few glasses of water (for hydration) and then some ice cold orange juice with (this is weird) some Tabasco sauce on top seemed to help. The combination of sweet/spicy flavors on my tongue were enough of a jolt that I think it interrupted my craving (and the sugar rush from the OJ maybe helped.) A good night's sleep cures many ills as well, perhaps.
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@CrustyBadger ]I think sometimes just saying the words can be enough to acknowledge the feeling (I want to) , and reinforce the decision (not going to) you have already made. It continues to surprise me at times 18 months in but now I know that the craving means "I feel sad and I want a treat" and I have a list now of other treats that are better for me.
I like your action plan and am pleased it worked!
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Dry January for me. I don't want to quit drinking, just get it under more control.
I think in February I'll go back, but limit myself to 3 days a week and no booze when I'm stressed or feeling down. That way is bad.
So far what I'm most impressed by is how much more energy I have late in the evening. I'm up at 1 now (was up at 2 last night and woke up at 8 this morning) I'm sure 7 hours from now I won't feel as sleep deprived as if I'd hit the booze.
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My DH and I are doing dry January as well. We are not heavy drinkers but 1-2 glasses of wine a night were becoming a bad habit. So far I don't really feel any different, except for feeling hung over a couple days in, which was weird. I also get a craving each night while making dinner but it passes after dinnertime.
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Op here. I love that this is still going! I'm not always commenting but watching as they roll in and there is a lot of inspiration here. Keep it up, everyone!
This month I'm approaching a year of no booze so i pulled my financials from the alcohol bar category and compared to 2017. We have spent $2,400 less in 2018! Not directly related but close is our restaurant spending also went down by $1,400! We followed Frugal Woods 30 day challenge late in the year and also managed to cut our grocery expenses by about $6,000. Helluva a sober year financially and I haven't even talked about how much my added energy and motivation has impacted other aspects of life. Was excited to share with those of you on the same journey.
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Im doing dry january but I did have an exception that was preplanned. So far doesn't seem too difficult, but I'm only a week in so we'll see. Social situations where I'd normally drink are the hardest, but after the holidays I'm ready to just chill. Right now it even feels like I want to go longer, but that may change by the end of the month.
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Thanks for starting this thread, @onemorebike ! It's been very supportive!
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Trying a short dry January. Day 2 tonight, but the weekend is coming.
I have always been a heavy drinker and have issues at times, but I also realised I spend about $300 a month on it, which is ridiculous. Pretty much my 3rd budget category after rent and groceries.
So I will make more efforts this year for this sake as well as my mental and physical health.
Hope to be back on this thread to share and encourage e AC h other.
Now off to bed for day 3 tomorrow
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Trying a short dry January. Day 2 tonight, but the weekend is coming.
I have always been a heavy drinker and have issues at times, but I also realised I spend about $300 a month on it, which is ridiculous. Pretty much my 3rd budget category after rent and groceries.
So I will make more efforts this year for this sake as well as my mental and physical health.
Hope to be back on this thread to share and encourage e AC h other.
Now off to bed for day 3 tomorrow
Evasion, have you checked out the 30-day alcohol experiment? A great companion to a dry January.
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Hello all,
I am on day 4. I started this for a couple of reasons. I don’t sleep properly and it really does affect my mood. Although in the past couple of spdays I can’t say it’s improved but gotten a bit worse. So I’m not saying I’m going to start again but am examining the detox process that I imagine is the culprit to the grumpiness.
The boost it will give our budget will be welcomed. This year is really a focus one budget and savings. Considering our income of 90k annually I would expect we could have a positive net worth within Two years.
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Following thread
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Hello all,
I am on day 4. I started this for a couple of reasons. I don’t sleep properly and it really does affect my mood. Although in the past couple of spdays I can’t say it’s improved but gotten a bit worse. So I’m not saying I’m going to start again but am examining the detox process that I imagine is the culprit to the grumpiness.
The boost it will give our budget will be welcomed. This year is really a focus one budget and savings. Considering our income of 90k annually I would expect we could have a positive net worth within Two years.
My sleep got worse for the first week but then went back to baseline. Hang in there, and make sure you aren't replacing alcohol with caffeine. One thing I have noticed is that I wake up to pee more often at night due to drinking herbal tea instead of wine before bed. On the bright side, I have lost a couple pounds without really changing anything else.
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How's everyone doing, especially those doing dry January? I had 2 nights where I drank with friends, and 2 desserts that included a small amount of alcohol. It's harder than I thought, but only because of the social settings. Physically and mentally, I've been fine, and I'm only tempted when I'm with friends I usually drink with. Going to continue for the rest of the month anyway. I really want a straight 30 stretch with no cheating, so I think I'm going to give it up for lent as well, now that I've had the practice.
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I'm on day 24. I decided before the new year I'd go all the way through my third IVF retrieval with no drinking, in the hopes of helping outcomes. It's amazing how much a black and white view has helped. I'm not even taking sips of drinks if my husband has one or anything like that. Just straight up, no alcohol. It's been easier to stick to this time, I think largely because my husband operates in absolutes. Just because grey areas/just sips has worked for *me* in the past, he'll unintentionally undermine me/enable me because that's not how *he* commits to a goal. It's just interesting- I had never thought about needing to work around HIS way of approaching a change (absolutist vs moderator), rather than just mine.
Anyway, just an interesting insight I had to this whole thing. Still a ways to go, I'll be no drinking through mid-March at least.
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I'm joining with a few exceptions. I've got four beers in my basement. I reserve the right to drink one or two of those. My parents and I split a small membership at a local winery. I get the equivalent of one bottle of wine a month. I allow myself maximum of two beers if I go out to a bar with a friend or, in the summer, if I have a friend over to grill. (I've got a busy job and little kids so this is a once a week or two type thing).
So, I expect like a couple drinks a month rather than 5-10 a week. $0 spend in my alcohol category this month (though I did have a few beers out layered into the eating out budget).
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My sleep got worse for the first week but then went back to baseline. Hang in there, and make sure you aren't replacing alcohol with caffeine. One thing I have noticed is that I wake up to pee more often at night due to drinking herbal tea instead of wine before bed. On the bright side, I have lost a couple pounds without really changing anything else.
There were a few nights that were hard like you said. Trying carbonated water at dinner. MBe the same issue as the tea occurs so I have been a bit of a zombie. Thinking caffeine and alcohol have to go? Did you have to give it up as well?
My husband brought out a bottle of maple licure ( Canadian and proud!) so I have had a shot to sip on that this week. So not a dry week.
Op here. I love that this is still going! I'm not always commenting but watching as they roll in and there is a lot of inspiration here. Keep it up, everyone!
This month I'm approaching a year of no booze so i pulled my financials from the alcohol bar category and compared to 2017. We have spent $2,400 less in 2018! Not directly related but close is our restaurant spending also went down by $1,400! We followed Frugal Woods 30 day challenge late in the year and also managed to cut our grocery expenses by about $6,000. Helluva a sober year financially and I haven't even talked about how much my added energy and motivation has impacted other aspects of life. Was excited to share with those of you on the same journey.
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Congratulations!
A nd this is disconcertingly hard.
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Hi guys - I claimed back in May that I was in for this challenge -then did absolutely nothing to change my behaviour. I finally decided in November to take another look at my alcohol intake, and also requested Annie Grace's book, This Naked Mind, and read it. I haven't yet identified exactly what it was, but something in there resonated with me, and I have not had an alcoholic beverage since. Just quietly celebrating my 2 month mark yesterday!
I have requested the book again from the library, as I would love to read it again to see if I can identify the portions that really "spoke" to me, and I have just learned that she also has a podcast that I think I will give a try.
Now can someone help me with the raging sugar addiction that seems to be moving into the space that alcohol was previously inhabiting? :D
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Now can someone help me with the raging sugar addiction that seems to be moving into the space that alcohol was previously inhabiting? :D
I did a kind of keto-low carb diet for two months when I stopped drinking alcohol. Drank lots of water and kept my carbs really really low. I couldn't stay on the low carb meal plan due to family cooking responsibilities just being too challenging. But I believe the experienced helped keep me from chowing down on the sugar.
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Now can someone help me with the raging sugar addiction that seems to be moving into the space that alcohol was previously inhabiting? :D
I did a kind of keto-low carb diet for two months when I stopped drinking alcohol. Drank lots of water and kept my carbs really really low. I couldn't stay on the low carb meal plan due to family cooking responsibilities just being too challenging. But I believe the experienced helped keep me from chowing down on the sugar.
@CrustyBadger Thanks for this - I need to be more aware. I have definitely filled the caloric-space with carbs. More water and more awareness should definitely help.
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I'm lucky i that I have never been overly fond of alcohol and hence found it easy to give up.
In my younger and less mature days of course there were some spectacular foul-ups; various opportunities with attractive young women ruined because I was somewhat smashed.
Stick with it, you'll enjoy it (not having hangovers, being skint, unfit, becoming prematurely old etc).
However, my biggest objection to alcohol isn't even the health / financial factors. It's what people become when they've had a lot of drink - bores at best, raging assholes at worst.
The only thing to say to people who query why you don't drink (and why does "drink" always mean alcohol?) is "doctor's orders" or something similar. You don't have to justify your social life choices to anyone!
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Jordan Peterson, an academic I consider to be sane, grounded, knowledgeable and articulate gives some top-notch presentations on why we should forsake alcohol:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r6WQEGULvH8 (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r6WQEGULvH8)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PQPz4YVSkyQ (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PQPz4YVSkyQ)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0xVMPMiYzF4 (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0xVMPMiYzF4)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ryp2k2D6Zvc (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ryp2k2D6Zvc)
As with any other kind of substance abuse, alcohol abuse ALWAYS involves massive denial and aggravates whatever underlying problems the user seeks to alleviate.
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I want to extend a huge thank you to all the posters who mentioned This Naked Mind.
I've been a (near) daily drinker for about 20 years and a recent diagnosis of esophagus damage from severe 'silent' reflux (reflux that doesn't cause any heartburn) has caused me to get serious about trying to cut down. The alcohol itself did not cause the damage, and alcohol is only one of pretty much every element of my diet contributing to reflux (seriously, 90% of my daily intake is on the do-not-ingest list), but it contributes through relaxing the esophageal valve.
But I have been totally resistant to completely giving it up, mainly b/c in 20+ years of drinking, I've experienced no obvious downsides. One traditional hangover, and a handful of bad headaches. A couple of arguments with DH that probably were exacerbated my 'filters' being down.
I just couldn't relate to the horror stories I always hear from people who want to stop drinking: no blackouts (never even knew what those were), drunk driving, fuzzy memories, weight gain, embarrassing incidents, missed work, damaged relationships. Nope, I had none of that, probably b/c I typically never drink more than 2 drinks per day. All I had were 20+ years of pleasant memories of fun vacations, socializing, and most esp, being able to turn off my hyper brain and relax at the end of the day.
But that's the rub, right? I realize over the years that I've become psychologically dependent on that 'relaxation' trigger occurring if I'm stressed out, or to transition from work to non-work. And as my tolerance has gradually crept up over the years, I have recently started to be tempted to increase my amount a little. And that slope goes one way.
I started dipping into the NM podcast and book a month or so ago, while simultaneously journaling how my daily drinking routine made me feel. Then I started skipping drinking a day here and there to see how that felt. Within a very short amount of time my attitude has begun changing, and suddenly giving up drinking (at least as an experiment) started to sound less like a hardship and more like an exciting endeavor.
So I'm in. For a month at least.
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@wenchsenior I fell into the trap of alcohol being the only reset switch for my brain between work and not-work, but it is a lie. A cup of tea, a fancy glass with some juice & soda water, a walk in the park with my dog, any of these can also be a transition. And now, my baseline stress level is a lot lower and I wonder how much of it was chemical reactions to the alcohol and sugar load I was dumping into my body. It's been over a year since I woke up freaking out at 3am and I don't miss it at all.
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I last had a drink 5 weeks ago today (SuperBowl) after years of essentially daily drinking and multiple (many dozens) of attempts at cutting back, or "moderation." It's been an interesting 5 weeks, with many different observations along the way. At one point I experienced clarity of mind so sharp it almost felt painful--I don't know how to describe it otherwise; it's starting to feel more normal, but wow. I knew 2-4 beers a day probably weren't doing wonders for my liver or waistline, but I never imagined they were having such an effect on my brain (though in retrospect, that's pretty dumb).
Anyway, I didn't really start this thinking I'd never drink again. But now I'm wondering.
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tightwaddy,
That's awesome, interesting story about clarity of mind. I'd say I had similar moments along the way. Also didn't plan to quit forever but it is looking like it.
Did you by chance read Annie Grace's book?
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I knew 2-4 beers a day probably weren't doing wonders for my liver or waistline, but I never imagined they were having such an effect on my brain (though in retrospect, that's pretty dumb).
I find I am able to solve problems better now. Things just don't seem as overwhelming.
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Did you by chance read Annie Grace's book?
I started doing her online videos two times prior to this particular dry journey. I think that (limited) work helped me get to the place I'm at now, but I haven't read the full book (my library doesn't have it, but maybe I'll buy it). @CrustyBadger, to your point, I had a couple of angry work days that used to be a common drinking trigger and then I remembered my Annie Grace journal and thought: if I'm so mad at xxxxxx, why do I want to take it out on myself? And it definitely seemed like the problem was easier to solve after that.
I'm having some trouble craving sugar in the evenings, but now I'm working on that!
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Was just reflecting on how much not drinking at all has impacted the presence I have with my kids. The mornings and evenings are drastically improved and the payout has been tremendous!
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Gave up Booze for Lent and happy to see this thread.
Great to read that some of you had bad sleep during the first week of abstaining. I've had awful sleep the last couple of nights.
I don't miss the actual drink as much as I miss something to reach for as I prep/eat dinner.
I have coffee in the morning, water and herbal tea during the day, and usually wine or a cocktail at night. I clearly use it as an end to my workday/beginning of family time. I don't really drink seltzer, soda or juice so I'll need to figure out something for the evening.
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Gave up Booze for Lent and happy to see this thread.
Great to read that some of you had bad sleep during the first week of abstaining. I've had awful sleep the last couple of nights.
I don't miss the actual drink as much as I miss something to reach for as I prep/eat dinner.
Yes, I was surprised to have mild withdrawal symptoms on a 2 drinks/day habit. Mine was major restlessness at the end of the night (when I would normally have a sleepy buzz) so I just couldn't settle to my bedtime routine, and insomnia for the first 4 or 5 nights. Also, I was a little more anxious and randomly emotional during the first 3 days.
The fact that I had such notable poor sleep actually spurred me into the 'stop for 30 days' faster than I'd planned. I had started skipping a few days per week first, but that set off the poor sleep cycle. Then once I understood physiologically WHY that was happening, I thought I'd be better off just going cold turkey b/c otherwise the 'withdrawal' week was going to extend to 2 or 3 weeks.
I'm about a week in now, and the restless and insomnia have just stopped.
I guess I shouldn't be shocked. I know I have withdrawal headaches for about a week if I skip my 2 cups of coffee per day, so logically...
To your second point, I have realized that part of my trigger associated with 'transitioning between work and non-work' is simply that my blood sugar tends to be lower then. If I eat something carby about an hour before I would normally drink, the interest in drinking is much more ignorable.
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Interesting reading more stories. I found that since I cut sugar and all grain based carbs out of my diet I no longer have any alcohol cravings. I don't plan to completely give up alcohol because I do like to have an occasional glass of wine, but I am happy I no longer NEED it. :)
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We did Dry January this year and it was fine. Wasn't too difficult at all. But we like to travel to Europe, and having a good meal in France without wine just seems wrong.
Abstention didn't help my insomnia. I'd really hoped that it would, but it didn't, not one bit. My energy levels were better though. Whether we drink or not, we hit the gym hard, and I like to go for one or two runs per week, so cutting back is good, but not always easy.
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Hit 5 years a few weeks ago...seems like only yesterday.
A glass (never ending) of whiskey always sound good but...
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Today is two weeks without beer for me. I've had a couple gin and tonics in that time.
Have felt fine. I don't think I was at a point where I had any dependency, but I was just starting to worry about how much beer I was drinking (1/2 most evenings, more some evenings). Wanted to be in a place where I could still go successfully without wanting a beer for a while. So I'll probably keep this up until end of April.
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Last night I was socialising with friends and it was lovely and then we got to the tipsy ladies math part, followed by tipsy ladies tipping math, and I was tempted to pay the whole bill myself just so I didn't need to listen to it anymore. They were all fine and happy but it was a little awkward being one of the 2 sober people picking up on the close-out cues from the wait staff.
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I allow myself one to four beers per day.
If I want to be good and only have one or two, I have a piece of toast with peanut butter after beer number one or two, and then I no longer want another beer. I never believe it will work, but it usually does!
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2 years 7 months 15 days.
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Ugh- I clearly have used my drinks as a treat to myself. Have easily done two weeks of no drinking but I've eaten more sugar/flour than I have in years. Am annoyed with myself.
On the plus, my sleep returned to baseline a few nights ago.
30 more days of Lent should be pretty easy if I don't gain a million pounds. I do have one planned wine pairing dinner on my Birthday (DH made a surprise reservation for my B-day before I had decided on my Lent).
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Reporting in that I completed my first 30 consecutive days without drinking, and while I haven't ruled out an occasional drink in the future (partly b/c the idea of never tasting another G&T again sets off massive feelings of deprivation, even though I haven't actually HAD a G&T in more than a year LOL), but I plan to keep going, no longer drinking except possibly very occasionally and mindfully...vacations, etc. (haven't decided on that yet...may end up just stopping entirely).
The Alcohol Experiment and This Naked Mind website were incredibly helpful to 1) get me in the right state of mind prior to going booze-free (reducing my anxiety about doing it and giving me a framework to go about it), and 2) as a series of structured exercises that helped change my mindset while I did it. The program itself (despite being a tad shaky on the facts presented once or twice) seems to rely heavily on techniques associated the cognitive behavioral therapy and meditation/mindfulness, and this really worked wonders for me.
Pretty sure I'll never view alcohol the same way again, and coming from someone who drank 1-3 drinks almost every day, for almost 20 years, it was a relief and a delightful surprise how effective this program has been helping me just stop that habit with minimal angst (after the first few days of white-knuckling through my cocktail hour cravings). Still some work to do, for sure (tackling less frequent, more stochastic triggers related to stress), but I'm going to keep on working on those.
I know some people report experience surges of energy/clarity, etc., better sleep, and noticeable improvements in appearance. Alas, none of these has been true for me (I'm just as puffy/red-eyed; actually have had LESS energy and mental focus; and though I sleep through the night much better now, I now dream a ton more (which agitates me) and also have a lot of trouble FALLING asleep as opposed to STAYING asleep). However, I was doing this for health reasons rather than appearance, and some of the physiological benefits to going booze-free would be unlikely manifest for several more months (neurological changes in dopamine receptors, etc), so that's ok.
I also appreciated this experiment for giving me a couple of real 'light bulb' moments...
1) recognizing that even though I have experienced almost zero negative effects of drinking all these years apart from nagging worries about long term health (I am a stranger to hangovers, binges, blackouts, drunk driving, embarrassing incidents, etc, probably b/c I have only consumed more than 3 drinks/day perhaps 2 or 3 times in my life), that didn't mean there were no good reasons to change the habit;
2) assuming for years that I was drinking 8 oz of wine at night, only to actually measure the amount and find out it was 10-12 oz...how did I not know what 5 oz of wine actually looked like?!?;
3) finding out that the official guidelines for drinking put me in the 'heavy' drinking category, and my husband right on the verge, despite our intake being in line with most of our upper-middle income social/peer group for the past umpteen years;
4) realizing how much societal acceptance of/encouragement of regular drinking set the context for my own ideas of what was healthy, when those ideas were not objectively true. Etc etc.
This has also been very useful for my husband. He did not have as much problem with triggers as I did, probably b/c he never made the problematic mental link associating alcohol with de-stressing or transitioning from 'work' to 'relaxation'. He noticed me stop drinking after a few days of it, and asked what I was up to. When I began describing some of the Alcohol Experiment exercises, he was intrigued and began informally 'accompanying' me and self-monitoring (even though I had no intention of asking him to change his behavior).
Both of us are really happy we did this. I salute everyone in this thread, and encourage anyone who is in a nebulous gray area of alcohol consumption to give this book/website/program a shot. Very, very helpful material.
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I have passed the one month mark (we cancelled the fancy dinner for other reasons) and am a little grouchy that I don't seem to be experiencing any of the benefits of abstaining. Did it take anyone else longer than 30 days for benefits to show up? Or if you don't feel them at the one month mark do you never feel them in a drastic way?
I feel like wenchsenior in that I seem to have less energy and I'm certainly having more trouble relaxing and falling asleep at night. I've had a few nights where I've ended up listening to a couple of hours of sleep meditations before I finally conk out.
Have also still had issues with craving carbs and am even feeling the urge to spend money just to have something to do! I feel like my evening cocktail was basically my only remaining vice and since it is temporarily on hold I seem to be searching for a replacement vice. It is sorting of bumming me out.
In any case, I'm sure this is better for me than not. I also had a few niggling health concerns that I thought might be improved by removing the alcohol. They haven't seemed to improve yet, but it is a good data point to know that booze doesn't seem to be causing them.
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I have passed the one month mark (we cancelled the fancy dinner for other reasons) and am a little grouchy that I don't seem to be experiencing any of the benefits of abstaining. Did it take anyone else longer than 30 days for benefits to show up? Or if you don't feel them at the one month mark do you never feel them in a drastic way?
I feel like wenchsenior in that I seem to have less energy and I'm certainly having more trouble relaxing and falling asleep at night. I've had a few nights where I've ended up listening to a couple of hours of sleep meditations before I finally conk out.
Have also still had issues with craving carbs and am even feeling the urge to spend money just to have something to do! I feel like my evening cocktail was basically my only remaining vice and since it is temporarily on hold I seem to be searching for a replacement vice. It is sorting of bumming me out.
In any case, I'm sure this is better for me than not. I also had a few niggling health concerns that I thought might be improved by removing the alcohol. They haven't seemed to improve yet, but it is a good data point to know that booze doesn't seem to be causing them.
My experience is the same. Alcohol was my one remaining vice, and though my diet has been healthy and low sugar/heavy veggie for years, I've been eating more crap carbs and sugar in the past month and a half than I can remember when. Maybe that's why my energy level hasn't improved. I have a bunch of health issues that I thought might be helped by quitting (though only one that is known to be worsened by alcohol, silent reflux). So far, none of the health stuff has materialized with the possible exception of the reflux improving, but I've drastically changed a lot of elements of my diet plus started sleeping most nights on a wedge pillow, and my impression tracking symptoms is that the pillow is doing the most good...it's hard to tell b/c silent reflux symptoms can take months to improve even when the reflux is already improving.
I'm still glad I did it, and still somewhat hopeful of improvement in the next few months. But I sure wish I felt great like some here report, and I wish I could fall asleep like in the old buzzed days.
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The longer you've been on alcohol, the longer it'll take to heal from it, at least that's what I've observed. Usually when people hit the 6 month mark, you can see it pretty clearly in their body and faces - they look so much better.
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What tyort1 said. Some people get enormous upswings immediately. I never did *but* there has been slow and steady improvement in my sleep and overall mental wellbeing.
- The carb/sugar cravings do settle if you stick with it - your body is used to a dump of easy energy from alcohol and is looking for a replacement.
- It took a little while for my sleep to regulate because I had forgotten how to fall asleep naturally. Pukka sleep tea + Music for Airports was my silver bullet.
- Around 6 months my skin just started *glowing* and my teeth were noticeably whiter.
- I am 10kg lighter than 2 years ago. Like, this came off *so slowly* that it never feels like progress but if I actually look at my fitbit log, this is factual reality and not my messed up perception.
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Really interesting Atlantic article. Possibly particularly interesting to me; over the years, I've watched several people that I know who have severe alcohol use disorder attempt to get sober via AA and fail repeatedly.
https://www.theatlantic.com/magazine/archive/2015/04/the-irrationality-of-alcoholics-anonymous/386255/
(https://www.theatlantic.com/magazine/archive/2015/04/the-irrationality-of-alcoholics-anonymous/386255/)
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Really interesting Atlantic article. Possibly particularly interesting to me; over the years, I've watched several people that I know who have severe alcohol use disorder attempt to get sober via AA and fail repeatedly.
https://www.theatlantic.com/magazine/archive/2015/04/the-irrationality-of-alcoholics-anonymous/386255/
(https://www.theatlantic.com/magazine/archive/2015/04/the-irrationality-of-alcoholics-anonymous/386255/)
Yep, that's why I go to Lifering - it's a lot more modern and way more science based. Plus I'm an atheist, so there's that....
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What tyort1 said. Some people get enormous upswings immediately. I never did *but* there has been slow and steady improvement in my sleep and overall mental wellbeing.
- The carb/sugar cravings do settle if you stick with it - your body is used to a dump of easy energy from alcohol and is looking for a replacement.
- It took a little while for my sleep to regulate because I had forgotten how to fall asleep naturally. Pukka sleep tea + Music for Airports was my silver bullet.
- Around 6 months my skin just started *glowing* and my teeth were noticeably whiter.
- I am 10kg lighter than 2 years ago. Like, this came off *so slowly* that it never feels like progress but if I actually look at my fitbit log, this is factual reality and not my messed up perception.
Thanks!
I love Music for Airports so much that I couldn't sleep to it :) I listen to the Bang on Can recording of it about once a week when I'm trying to focus on work. I've thought of trying Max Richter's "Sleep" but I wonder if it would mess with me a bit.
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My wife got a new job and i was been planning on drinking a glass of champagne when we had a giant celebration party, but she says she doesn’t want a party. Oh well. 5yrs 2mo
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This thread has inspired me. Or i hope it will inspire me.
i don't know if i am an alcoholic. i don't want to admit that because it would be very sad for me to never be able to enjoy a beer again. i really, really enjoy a nice beer. and i sense that if one admits to the "alcoholic" tag, they are admitting that they should never drink alcohol again.
in all honesty i have at least 2 or 3 beers when i get home from work, plus a glass or 2 or 3 of wine. every day.
despite my habit i still manage to wake up early and train fairly intensely for athletics. i have run multiple sub 3 hour marathons in the past couple years despite carrying on this type of drinking habit. and i hold down i very high paying job.
i definitely have an addictive streak, but i have been able to quit things surprisingly easy. case in point, i drank a lot of coffee (8-10 cups/day) for the last 20 years and coincidentally i just quit cold turkey a month ago, with no withdrawal symptoms.
my biggest concern as previously noted is that i'll never be able to enjoy one beer again, or a nice glass of Cabernet, because i can't stop at one.
from a mustachian perspective, i have probably $5,000 worth of high end wine in my house that my wife and i reserve for special occasions. it would be sad to think that i cannot enjoy them any more.
this is partially a plea for help and partially a plea to let me know that i can dial back drinking without giving it up completely.
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Just celebrated 15 years sober 4-19-2019 changed my life ODAAT. Grateful.
Sent from my Moto G (5) Plus using Tapatalk
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This thread has inspired me. Or i hope it will inspire me.
i don't know if i am an alcoholic. i don't want to admit that because it would be very sad for me to never be able to enjoy a beer again. i really, really enjoy a nice beer. and i sense that if one admits to the "alcoholic" tag, they are admitting that they should never drink alcohol again.
in all honesty i have at least 2 or 3 beers when i get home from work, plus a glass or 2 or 3 of wine. every day.
despite my habit i still manage to wake up early and train fairly intensely for athletics. i have run multiple sub 3 hour marathons in the past couple years despite carrying on this type of drinking habit. and i hold down i very high paying job.
i definitely have an addictive streak, but i have been able to quit things surprisingly easy. case in point, i drank a lot of coffee (8-10 cups/day) for the last 20 years and coincidentally i just quit cold turkey a month ago, with no withdrawal symptoms.
my biggest concern as previously noted is that i'll never be able to enjoy one beer again, or a nice glass of Cabernet, because i can't stop at one.
from a mustachian perspective, i have probably $5,000 worth of high end wine in my house that my wife and i reserve for special occasions. it would be sad to think that i cannot enjoy them any more.
this is partially a plea for help and partially a plea to let me know that i can dial back drinking without giving it up completely.
I've heard of a medication that decreases the pleasure you feel from alcohol, so it becomes much easier to just have one and stop there, because you actually don't even want more. Also, the article talks about how AA is actually not the gold standard for alcohol abuse treatment, and doesn't work as well as advertised, and it's probably partially because the all or nothing approach and the labeling of "alcoholic" leads to more binging and abstinence cycles but not necessarily actual recovery. (https://www.theatlantic.com/magazine/archive/2015/04/the-irrationality-of-alcoholics-anonymous/386255/) That being said, this is based only on reading and not practice.
Personally, I started tracking my alcohol consumption using the app alcodroid, which also gives some useful stats, and I've managed to decrease my average consumption. My goal wasn't to quit, but just to get below the level of problematic drinking, which is somewhere around 7 drinks a week for a woman or 1 per day. I don't think you need to label yourself an alcoholic and never drink again, but if you feel that you are drinking too much, there are other options to decrease your consumption.
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Wanna Be stache -The medication is Naltrexone, I just started taking it. I went 7 months alcohol free last year and this year only one month. So I am trying this drug. It is called the Sinclair method where you drinkas you normally would but take themedication one hour prior. With this medication eventually you loosethe addition part of alcohol. I take it and really only want one beer.
It is by precrition only, but you can get it from India, or Doc in the box/telemedicine. https://cthreefoundation.org/ for more info
https://cthreefoundation.org/ (ftp://cthreefoundation.org/)
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This thread has inspired me. Or i hope it will inspire me.
i don't know if i am an alcoholic. i don't want to admit that because it would be very sad for me to never be able to enjoy a beer again. i really, really enjoy a nice beer. and i sense that if one admits to the "alcoholic" tag, they are admitting that they should never drink alcohol again.
in all honesty i have at least 2 or 3 beers when i get home from work, plus a glass or 2 or 3 of wine. every day.
despite my habit i still manage to wake up early and train fairly intensely for athletics. i have run multiple sub 3 hour marathons in the past couple years despite carrying on this type of drinking habit. and i hold down i very high paying job.
i definitely have an addictive streak, but i have been able to quit things surprisingly easy. case in point, i drank a lot of coffee (8-10 cups/day) for the last 20 years and coincidentally i just quit cold turkey a month ago, with no withdrawal symptoms.
my biggest concern as previously noted is that i'll never be able to enjoy one beer again, or a nice glass of Cabernet, because i can't stop at one.
from a mustachian perspective, i have probably $5,000 worth of high end wine in my house that my wife and i reserve for special occasions. it would be sad to think that i cannot enjoy them any more.
this is partially a plea for help and partially a plea to let me know that i can dial back drinking without giving it up completely.
Well, 'alcoholic' is sort of a made up term, like a pop culture term. It's not used by the medical or psychiatric profession when they are treating substance abuse, or at least it shouldn't be except as a sort of slang. I dislike the term as well b/c it allows society to support and encourage regular ingestion of an objectively addictive substance, while somehow cordoning off a group of drinkers as 'different' based on extremely nebulous, unscientifically defined criteria.
You sound like a lot of people, somewhere in the middle on the sliding scale of alcohol use between 'never drinks' and 'drinks until it's fatal', and feeling uneasy about the long term trajectory. Which makes sense...booze is addictive to pretty much anyone who drinks regularly.
Setting aside the physical effects, I'd guess some personality types seem more susceptible to psychological dependence or forming a problematic habit of it. Both my husband and I were near-daily drinkers for most of the past 20 years, but he doesn't have quite the psychological dependence I do/did, so he's always found moderation easier. The difference seems to be that he never formed any strong mental link between booze and stress relief. Whereas, I had gone for 15 years of my young adulthood drinking very occasionally and not caring about booze, but then began drinking regularly during a period of un-diagnosed illness that was causing severe anxiety and insomnia. The 'link' quickly formed in my brain that a drink would help me calm down and sleep when nothing else was working (note: Had I had access to an Rx for sedatives during those months, I'd very likely have formed a habit around those, but whiskey was handy and sedatives were not).
Even though I got out of that insomnia/health crisis, and went back to drinking more 'normally', that association in my brain remained ("alcohol can chill you out and relax you when nothing else can"), and ever after, the end of a shitty day or a bad bout of insomnia would trigger the desire to have a drink. And gradually I just developed the habit of a couple of drinks at cocktail hour. Lots of my social circle drank the same way, and I experienced no negative consequences to my life. Literally none, not even hangovers. I had nothing but pleasurable associations with it.
But there was always a nagging worry about 1) my health; and 2) the inevitable creep of tolerance and increased intake. A recent health issue that is worsened by alcohol is what finally spurred me to tackle it.
My advice is, quit worrying about labeling yourself. If you are feeling concern, then that's all you need to legitimize taking steps. No need to wait and see if serious consequences might one day arise! As to moderation, you might be one who can. Or you might be someone more like me, where you CAN moderate, but just find that it's SO MUCH mental effort to do so, that it seems surprisingly easier to just not drink (though I haven't absolutely 'forbidden' myself from ever having another drink). Or you might be someone whose brain reacts really strongly to the first couple of drinks, and removes the 'off' switch; in that case, maybe moderation wouldn't work for you. I've never been a binge drinker, so others here might offer more insight on that pattern than I have.
But it seems like anyone who likes to drink with any regularity just inevitably ends up dealing with 'amount creep'. That's not a character flaw in you or anyone, it's just a human body's response to booze.
I know the feeling of not wanting to think about potentially giving up something you enjoy. Try framing it a different way in your head...see if you can just start thinking of it as something you get to try (at least for a while) to give your health a boost, and what a relief it will be to remove the nagging worry when you pour a glass. In other words, just give it a try. It wasn't nearly as scary as I thought back before I tried it!
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@wannabe-stache, you might like to check out Annie Grace's book, This Naked Mind. Or the online program, the alcohol experiment. https://learn.thisnakedmind.com/the-alcohol-experiment-registration
Rather than trying to decide if you are an "alcoholic" or not, a good question to ask is "Am I drinking the amount of alcohol I want to be drinking?" and to question whether the reasons you tell yourself you are drinking alcohol are actually true.
For example, one belief I had was that I drink alcohol to relax after a stressful time. Annie Grace's advice was to question that belief, and make observations about it. So, on a day I was feeling a lot of stress, and had a drink, to just sit an notice how I felt . before I drank, while I was drinking, a little after the first drink, and an hour or so after the first or second drink. Just observe. Did I feel less stress? Or what did I feel?
In the online program, we did this with a lot of different beliefs: I like the taste of alcohol, alcohol makes me feel happier, alcohol helps me fall asleep and be more rested and so on. There are no right answers here. You are trying to be objective and find out what amount of alcohol YOU want to be drinking.
In my case I realized that alcohol only made me feel less stressed for about 10 minutes. Then I started to feel MORE stressed, unless I had another drink. This wasn't someone telling me I *HAD* to stop drinking; it was me noticing for myself that a key reason I thought I drank wasn't actually true.
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@wannabe-stache I had just posted this somewhere else earlier today and it ties in with what @wenchsenior and @CrustyBadger are saying
From my own personal experience, I used to drink on special occasions and enjoyed getting and being drunk. This was probably more booze than medical standards allow but I was classic young and stupid. Not actually a problem.
When it became a problem was when it was my main, and then only, coping mechanism for dealing with other stresses in my life. When I started to be uncomfortable with the amount I was drinking and kept doing it anyway. That was when I needed to stop altogether because it was easier to just not than it was to manage.
If you are not in that mental space you are probably are OK, and you generally know if you are in that space.
I got a prescription for Naltrexone a couple of years ago and used it a couple of times when I was still on the fence about quitting. It really took away the urge to keep drinking and somehow without the booze hitting my chemical receptors I was just tasting the actual flavours which made me realise I didn't actually like wine very much. So I knew I had that in my back pocket when I decided that I was going to take a break from drinking.
My goal was a year off but I didn't tell anyone because I didn't want it to be a thing. I did tell my husband about 3 weeks in and then he was just super supportive re joining in on any activities I needed to fill the cocktail hour window until the habit was broken. When I got to the end of the year it was going so well that I re-upped. I honestly never thought I would quit entirely but my life is genuinely so much better without booze. So much of the mental chatter and anxiety is gone.
Just want to let you know that you don't have to be in the gutter to decide you will take a break for a while.
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@wannabe-stache, you might like to check out Annie Grace's book, This Naked Mind. Or the online program, the alcohol experiment. https://learn.thisnakedmind.com/the-alcohol-experiment-registration
Rather than trying to decide if you are an "alcoholic" or not, a good question to ask is "Am I drinking the amount of alcohol I want to be drinking?" and to question whether the reasons you tell yourself you are drinking alcohol are actually true.
For example, one belief I had was that I drink alcohol to relax after a stressful time. Annie Grace's advice was to question that belief, and make observations about it. So, on a day I was feeling a lot of stress, and had a drink, to just sit an notice how I felt . before I drank, while I was drinking, a little after the first drink, and an hour or so after the first or second drink. Just observe. Did I feel less stress? Or what did I feel?
In the online program, we did this with a lot of different beliefs: I like the taste of alcohol, alcohol makes me feel happier, alcohol helps me fall asleep and be more rested and so on. There are no right answers here. You are trying to be objective and find out what amount of alcohol YOU want to be drinking.
In my case I realized that alcohol only made me feel less stressed for about 10 minutes. Then I started to feel MORE stressed, unless I had another drink. This wasn't someone telling me I *HAD* to stop drinking; it was me noticing for myself that a key reason I thought I drank wasn't actually true.
Yup. One of my big light bulb moments of "my brain is insistently telling me something that is bullshit" occurred after I'd been journaling a week or so of my regular drinking. I'd noticed that 'cocktail hour' had triggered an actual physical drop in my diaphram, like an actual physical relaxation that passed from my neck down. It was such a great feeling! And then after one of the daily videos, I started paying attention to precisely when that occurred. And it happened the second I started toward the wine bottle, not 10 minutes after I started drinking! The wine wasn't even causing most of the relaxation lol. Stupid lizard brain.
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Not 100% booze free, but I've had booze 3 times this year. My wife's birthday, valentines day, and our wedding anniversary. A bottle of wine split between us and a pour of nice scotch. It was nice to enjoy alcohol as a human rather than needing to pound down more to see if I could get a buzz. Seriously, it was a crazy feeling getting relaxed and a little loopy after a single glass of wine. Is this what normal people experience?
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Thanks everyone. Curious - how long did it take for sleep to come easy without the booze?
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Thanks everyone. Curious - how long did it take for sleep to come easy without the booze?
Suspect it's different for everyone, depending on how much you were drinking. I was drinking ~2 per day, and have a history of erratic sleep patterns prior to and during my drinking years. It took about 10 days before I stopped being super antsy late into the night every night, and about 3 weeks before I consistently fell asleep easily after getting in bed (note, the antsy-ness was not the same as a craving...I wasn't thinking about alcohol, just very restless).
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Hi all,
After reading this thread a couple of weeks ago I'm now day 10 alcohol free. I'm seeing immediate benefits: more energy, better sleep, less snacking in the evenings.
I've also started reading This Naked Mind and am considering making this a permanent thing, which is something I never thought I'd say. We're off to my favourite wine region in France in Sept/Oct for two weeks at a language school - I think that will be a turning point one way or another!
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My day counter on my phone says today is 1,000 days of sobriety.
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I was an alcoholic in my early 20s. And likely drank more than I should have during my time in the military, although I did unknowingly cut back and focus on other more important things. Over the last 15 years or so I've rarely had a drink. Social gatherings on occasion. Honestly I don't even feel great after 1 beer. Now it's an occasional glass of wine sitting on the patio. I just see it as an expensive, unnecessary habit.
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I added in a few drinks after Lent was over.
DH and I have had a standing cocktail date Sunday afternoons on the porch for the last year. It is our couple time to decompress from our go go go weekends with chores and kids. I also had a glass of wine after work one night and had a half a beer to go with a burger.
Conclusion - a beer with a cheeseburger is worth keeping (I don't drink soda) and I only have a burger a few times a year, cocktail date with my husband is probably worth keeping a few times a month, but I don't think I'll go back to post work wine or cocktail just for the heck of it.
I've found a couple of tea drinks that I really like in the evening and I'll stick with that for the foreseeable future.
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5 and a half years sober now. I rarely miss it especially since I'm watching my mom slowly drink herself to death and it seriously mess up my dad's life too. I wish I could help them more, but they just can't seem to give it up, even when really bad shit is happening as a result.
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I gave up beer for Lent, and then just kept going.
I've lost a few pounds, which is nice. People have asked me how long I'll continue to go without beer, and I just respond with, "for as long as I please."
I'm not sure at the moment how far I'll take it, and I've even had a G&T or two since beginning this, but I feel dang good about myself, especially knowing that it is easy for me to go so long without a beer.
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I was contributing quotes for a blogger friend’s post about alcohol, and I ended up doing some math.
On 16 May 2019 it’ll be 3000 days since my last beer on 27 February 2011.
I was roughly a two-six-pack-per week drinker (craft beers preferred), which could be estimated at $40/week. (Or maybe I’m out of touch on the price of a six-pack of decent beer.) That amount invested in a total stock market fund would conservatively be in excess of $20K.
A couple nights ago I was surrounded by a half-dozen beer-drinking friends, spicy food, and good times. I belatedly realized that neither the spicy food nor the social proof were enough to cause me to want a beer. I was more surprised that it had taken me a couple hours to even think of the situation.
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15 days since I last had a drink. It just got silly, sipping on my beers every single night... getting fat, not enjoying the taste half the time, the cost, the fuzzy head every single morning. F' that.
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I haven't had a beer since middle of March, and I've lost somewhere between 5-10 pounds with no other changes. It makes me wonder how much beer I was drinking that was keeping my weight so high.
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I haven't had a beer since middle of March, and I've lost somewhere between 5-10 pounds with no other changes. It makes me wonder how much beer I was drinking that was keeping my weight so high.
Heh. DH did 30 days in solidarity with me, and then began drinking more mindfully than before, so cut his intake by probably a little more than half. He's quite fit, only a few pounds of extra weight, AND his weight hasn't fluctuated in years. But he told me yesterday: "Hey, I lost 5 lbs...it's been almost 3 weeks and my weight is definitely 5 lbs down!" He seemed surprised, as well.
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After seeing alcohol have a good go at wrecking the lives of some close family members and it slowly sucking the life from me, I quit drinking altogether nearly 4 years ago now. Best thing I ever did and the only real hurdle has been dealing with the attitude of others who feel I should be still drinking but even that has diminished significantly with time.
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I'm quite jealous. I went from about 6 beers a week to only a few beers total so far this year, and I haven't lost a pound. I'm starting to think my scale doesn't know how to go below 240.
Plateaus are real, for sure. I have the opposite problem, keeping weight ON. And I was worried that giving up that ~250 calories per day would cause slippage. And it did, but my body does seem to love its plateaus and has stabilized a couple pounds down.
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I'm quite jealous. I went from about 6 beers a week to only a few beers total so far this year, and I haven't lost a pound. I'm starting to think my scale doesn't know how to go below 240.
When I quit drinking, I didn't lose weight because my sugar cravings went through the roof. Eventually got those under control and now I lost most of the weight and I tend to keep it off as long as I never eat anything after 9pm.
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I'm joining you guys. I went on a bit of a tear with some friends on Friday night and felt like absolute dog shit all day Saturday. I spend too much on beer and I'm not getting any younger or healthier. Disconnecting my brain used to feel worth the cost, but these days it just makes me feel slow, fuzzy, bloated, and pathetic. Plus I'm tired 24/7. Tired when I wake up, tired throughout the day, tired while drinking, etc. Signed up for the Annie Grace 30-day thing to keep myself accountable.
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Welcome! That Annie Grace 30 day sober is a great way to start. The first time I did her program I lasted 7 months, then I took a hiatus, now I am back on two months and counting.
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That's the sneaking thing about alcohol - it generally starts out as a great way to blow off steam or unwind with friends. But over time it gets it's hooks into you and just makes things worse.
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I've been cutting down on the booze. I used to drink 1-2 glasses of wine around 5 days a week. Wine is really cheap here in Italy so this was a cheap habit. Also, people tend to drink wine with meals here. But after drinking a bit too much 2 Fridays ago and feeling crap the next day, I decided to cut down. So far I had one glass of wine with dinner last week and one beer last night with pizza. I've found that other things can de-stress me after work - even a non-alcoholic beverage can mark the transition from work to home when I get home after a long day.
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Just over 5 weeks and no booze.
I have to say it feels very nice to not be tired and hungover like I was before.
After the first 3 or 4 nights of restless sleep after stopping my 2 to 4 drinks each and every night for 11 years, after those rough first few nights my sleep patterns returned to normal and now I seem to have a better quality sleep.
Whereas before I would wake up and be yawning and still tired and wanting to sleep in, now I wake when my alarm goes off and getting up and staying awake seems much easier.
I've also noticed that my body seems to not ache as much, not sure why except that maybe the booze caused inflammation?
I've dropped about 8 pounds in fat and my 'round' face is, well not quite as round and 2 people commented on how my face looks thinner.
The buzz from drinking had become like this weird thing all of it's own, like I had become it's 'bitch' ... So glad to be on the bright side of that one!
Best of luck out there! Crush it!!
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I gave up booze (apart from a quarter glass of wine a few times) during pregnancy and I noticed that I lost weight (apart from my belly) rapidly. At the time, I wondered if it was to do with cutting out the empty calories from alcohol. I have a relatively healthy diet and wine/beer are pretty much my only real indulgence.
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Barring one (1!) beach trip early on in the month, I'm planning on a booze-free June that will hopefully translate into a little more moderation afterward. I don't (think?) I drink a wild amount (maybe 1-2 beers/cocktails every other day) but frankly that shit adds up to $$$, it's not doing my waistline any favors, and while I truly enjoy cracking open an ice cold beer after a hard day's work and productivity, I also truly dislike the feeling of yearning for that ice cold beer and want to redirect the 'reward' portion of my brain to something less uh, potentially addicting.
Trying to also decide if I'm gonna make the push to cut out La Croix (flavored seltzer water, HORRIBLY addicting also) in the same go, but that might be a bridge too far because it's my current favorite substitute for beer.
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Fish Sweet
There are much cheaper brands of sparkling water than LaCriox, I get the store brand for 25-30 cents a can, you can affort that compared to a minimum 2$ craft beer.
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We don't get la Croix here but a splash of grapefruit juice in soda water is a nice substitute for the bite of an IPA.
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Count me in! I've been drinking significantly less beer lately and it feels great. The only alcohol I want to routinely consume will be in kombucha form (<1% ABV).
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My first reduction in alcohol consumption came when I found out that sulphites really don't sit well with my digestive tract. So I had to cut out a bunch of alcohol I previously enjoyed.
Pretty sure I contracted Hep A in Thailand last November and I quit drinking two weeks ago after bruising my liver and noticing how slowly it was healing. I feel a lot better, less fatigued and my skin looks better. I do enjoy a beer after work though, despite the risk of habit forming with a routine like that.
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I'm joining in. I actually quit recently (third time trying). It's been about 20 days now since my last drink. The first time I quit, I made it two whole years, but I'd become what substance abuse professionals call a "dry drunk." You can look it up. Basically, I was sober but very unhappy.
Something that I don't see coming up enough on this thread is that fact that alcohol is a known carcinogen. Don't take my word for it:
https://www.cancer.org/cancer/cancer-causes/general-info/known-and-probable-human-carcinogens.html
Whenever you read that alcohol "increases the risk of some cancers" or similar, remember that what you're reading is this: "deliberate consumption of a known carcinogen causes cancer in those who consume it." People really REALLY hate hearing this message because they really REALLY like drinking craft beer and all that.
People who drink regularly also seem to love the one (or however few) stud(y/ies) that suggest(s) a very small glass of red wine may possibly have some potential to help you avoid heart disease. They tend to hate and totally ignore all of the other studies (and there are tons) linking alcohol to all sorts of terrible maladies.
Anyway, that's a digression. Alcohol is obviously poison. We can all have a perfectly happy life without it. Just know that giving up drinking is one of the most radical personal decisions you can make. The social pressure to do otherwise can be intense. I live in a liberal college town. Around here, being a vegan is more common than not drinking.
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I'm joining in. I actually quit recently (third time trying). It's been about 20 days now since my last drink. The first time I quit, I made it two whole years, but I'd become what substance abuse professionals call a "dry drunk." You can look it up. Basically, I was sober but very unhappy.
Something that I don't see coming up enough on this thread is that fact that alcohol is a known carcinogen. Don't take my word for it:
https://www.cancer.org/cancer/cancer-causes/general-info/known-and-probable-human-carcinogens.html
Whenever you read that alcohol "increases the risk of some cancers" or similar, remember that what you're reading is this: "deliberate consumption of a known carcinogen causes cancer in those who consume it." People really REALLY hate hearing this message because they really REALLY like drinking craft beer and all that.
People who drink regularly also seem to love the one (or however few) stud(y/ies) that suggest(s) a very small glass of red wine may possibly have some potential to help you avoid heart disease. They tend to hate and totally ignore all of the other studies (and there are tons) linking alcohol to all sorts of terrible maladies.
Anyway, that's a digression. Alcohol is obviously poison. We can all have a perfectly happy life without it. Just know that giving up drinking is one of the most radical personal decisions you can make. The social pressure to do otherwise can be intense. I live in a liberal college town. Around here, being a vegan is more common than not drinking.
i am on day 2 of the annie grace 30 day challenge. so that means last night was the first night in years that i didn't have a drink.
what i noticed:
1. i felt incredibly hungry
2. i drank 3 LaCroixs
3. i remembered the plot of the TV show my wife and i watched for the first time in forever
4. i slept "ok" but mostly interrupted due to a toddler coming into the bed
5. i got out of bed much easier in the am
6. it wasn't as hard as i thought
Are any of these findings strange or similar to what you all see?
does it get harder on the weekends? after 3 or 4 days?
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I'm joining in. I actually quit recently (third time trying). It's been about 20 days now since my last drink. The first time I quit, I made it two whole years, but I'd become what substance abuse professionals call a "dry drunk." You can look it up. Basically, I was sober but very unhappy.
Something that I don't see coming up enough on this thread is that fact that alcohol is a known carcinogen. Don't take my word for it:
https://www.cancer.org/cancer/cancer-causes/general-info/known-and-probable-human-carcinogens.html
Whenever you read that alcohol "increases the risk of some cancers" or similar, remember that what you're reading is this: "deliberate consumption of a known carcinogen causes cancer in those who consume it." People really REALLY hate hearing this message because they really REALLY like drinking craft beer and all that.
People who drink regularly also seem to love the one (or however few) stud(y/ies) that suggest(s) a very small glass of red wine may possibly have some potential to help you avoid heart disease. They tend to hate and totally ignore all of the other studies (and there are tons) linking alcohol to all sorts of terrible maladies.
Anyway, that's a digression. Alcohol is obviously poison. We can all have a perfectly happy life without it. Just know that giving up drinking is one of the most radical personal decisions you can make. The social pressure to do otherwise can be intense. I live in a liberal college town. Around here, being a vegan is more common than not drinking.
i am on day 2 of the annie grace 30 day challenge. so that means last night was the first night in years that i didn't have a drink.
what i noticed:
1. i felt incredibly hungry
2. i drank 3 LaCroixs
3. i remembered the plot of the TV show my wife and i watched for the first time in forever
4. i slept "ok" but mostly interrupted due to a toddler coming into the bed
5. i got out of bed much easier in the am
6. it wasn't as hard as i thought
Are any of these findings strange or similar to what you all see?
does it get harder on the weekends? after 3 or 4 days?
Everyone's slightly different. I suspect that a lot of what people experience depends on their dependency (both psychological and physical), amount and frequency that they were drinking, and their particular triggers. I had a psychological dependency, but no physical one. I found the idea of quitting very stressful, but the actual process hard for only about 7-10 days, and still easier than I expected. I had very strong, but brief, cravings as a result of my primary trigger for the first week, and then they diminished rapidly. I still am triggered occasionally by some of my secondary, stochastic triggers, but it's been mostly mild. I'm waiting to see if I get really strong ones at some point out of the blue, when I am not expecting them.
1. my appetite improved slightly after a couple weeks. not sure it's related
2. yes, substitutes were helpful in the first couple weeks. I also suffered cravings partly due to low blood sugar at cocktail hour, so made sure to pre-plan and eat appropriately.
3. n/a for me. I don't think drinking has ever caused me to forget anything I've done, watched, said, or heard in general (maybe very specific details of something in a conversation or movie I was watching). However, I don't split viewing of movies over two nights so much any more...I have more energy to watch the entire thing.
4. I had a lot of trouble sleeping until about 2 weeks in, but I suffered insomnia long before I became a regular drinker. And sleep is pretty good now.
5. No difference for me in terms of energy, except at bedtime. But my baseline mood improved a lot, starting 2 weeks in, and this was noticeable in the morning.
6. I agree. I wish I'd realized that earlier in life!
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Slackmax checking in.
I want to know if anyone else has the 'sensory enhancement' I get, from about 2 beers (or more). After a beer or 2, I hear instruments on the stereo that I didn't even notice, when straight. And I see things on the horizon and in the sunset, etc, that I ignored when straight.
As for quitting, or limiting, well, we'll see. lol.
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i am on day 2 of the annie grace 30 day challenge. so that means last night was the first night in years that i didn't have a drink.
what i noticed:
1. i felt incredibly hungry
2. i drank 3 LaCroixs
3. i remembered the plot of the TV show my wife and i watched for the first time in forever
4. i slept "ok" but mostly interrupted due to a toddler coming into the bed
5. i got out of bed much easier in the am
6. it wasn't as hard as i thought
Are any of these findings strange or similar to what you all see?
does it get harder on the weekends? after 3 or 4 days?
1- yeah your body is used to a supply of easy sugars from the alcohol
2- substitute drinks help!
4- It took me about 2 months to fall asleep naturally but it was less than a week before I stopped waking up at 2am to have a freakout - best part about not drinking for me
5- out of bed much easier because I am going to bed much earlier now that there is nothing [read booze-sugar] fueling awakeness past my natural bedtime. Suddenly I was sleeping 9.30pm - 5.30 am and it feels great.
Whether it gets harder depends. It sounds like you don't have a dependency so I would expect it tpo be easy at 1 or 2 days. It's only been a minor break at this point. It might get harder when you are in situations where you normally drink. I have found that I don't have a problem with hanging out with people who are drinking but an hour is now my limit for tolerating bars - at that point people are getting a buzz on, the noise-level is rising and it is just not enjoyable for me anymore. This used to be the point where I would have another drink to be able to cope with the people and the noise, and now I just leave.
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Slackmax checking in.
I want to know if anyone else has the 'sensory enhancement' I get, from about 2 beers (or more). After a beer or 2, I hear instruments on the stereo that I didn't even notice, when straight. And I see things on the horizon and in the sunset, etc, that I ignored when straight.
As for quitting, or limiting, well, we'll see. lol.
Yes. My brain tends to be super 'buzzy' and one of the pleasant things about getting a buzz [from alcohol] is that I could focus more easily on one thing without distraction. I'm now trying to take up meditation to help my ability to focus and to hopefully get the same effect, which I do sometimes miss.
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Slackmax checking in.
I want to know if anyone else has the 'sensory enhancement' I get, from about 2 beers (or more). After a beer or 2, I hear instruments on the stereo that I didn't even notice, when straight. And I see things on the horizon and in the sunset, etc, that I ignored when straight.
As for quitting, or limiting, well, we'll see. lol.
Yes. My brain tends to be super 'buzzy' and one of the pleasant things about getting a buzz is that I could focus more easily on one thing without distraction. I'm now trying to take up meditation to help my ability to focus and to hopefully get the same effect, which I do sometimes miss.
I'm down to 3 beers per day and holding. When I quit altogether I get a physically tired feeling in day 2 of being straight. I quit for 3 days in a row a few months ago, just because I was away from home and busy doing stuff. That time I didn't get tired, for some reason. Probably all the external stimuli.
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I was amazed to find that draggy feeling took about 2 weeks of not drinking to start to go away, even on 1-2 drinks per day. Apparently the effects of alcohol take at least 1 week to process out of one's system. I had no idea it took that long.
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i am on day 2 of the annie grace 30 day challenge. so that means last night was the first night in years that i didn't have a drink.
what i noticed:
1. i felt incredibly hungry
2. i drank 3 LaCroixs
3. i remembered the plot of the TV show my wife and i watched for the first time in forever
4. i slept "ok" but mostly interrupted due to a toddler coming into the bed
5. i got out of bed much easier in the am
6. it wasn't as hard as i thought
Are any of these findings strange or similar to what you all see?
does it get harder on the weekends? after 3 or 4 days?
You will sleep better and it will be easier to get out of bed in the morning. That's for sure. Not EASY, mind you, but certainly less difficult. I still drink coffee first thing in the morning, so there's that.
Drinking the fizzy water can be a good beer substitute if you're not so addicted as to be physically dependent. It gives you the sensation of cracking something open, feeling the carbonation, and drinking it. You might not actually be thirsty, but you're subconsciously craving that experience. Extra water won't hurt you.
Re: tv show. Yeah, if you're in the habit of forgetting the plot of TV shows, it's a good thing you're putting down the booze. It's not as serious an issue as, say... missing dinner every night b/c you were out drinking and then coming home and breaking shit, but it's a sign that things aren't right. It's nice to remember stuff, yeah?
Weekends might be hard if you're only used to spending your time drinking. Find things to do that don't involve alcohol or that would be impossible to do well if you were drinking: riding bikes, rock climbing, playing any sport, doing projects around the house, taking your toddler to a playground or to a pool, etc. Otherwise, you'll probably drink.
If your standard social activity is sitting around with friends and drinking, it will be hard to be in that environment and not drink. The thing to remember is that nobody else really cares whether you're drinking gin or water. People are mainly focused on themselves, sadly. You'll probably find that you're still fun, witty, capable of enjoying yourself, etc. with or without booze.
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i am on day 2 of the annie grace 30 day challenge. so that means last night was the first night in years that i didn't have a drink.
what i noticed:
1. i felt incredibly hungry
2. i drank 3 LaCroixs
3. i remembered the plot of the TV show my wife and i watched for the first time in forever
4. i slept "ok" but mostly interrupted due to a toddler coming into the bed
5. i got out of bed much easier in the am
6. it wasn't as hard as i thought
Are any of these findings strange or similar to what you all see?
does it get harder on the weekends? after 3 or 4 days?
On day 7. So far, so good. This weekend was tough - I am the cook and usually cooking is accompanied by several glasses of strong beer. My wife's bday was Saturday and Father's Day was Sunday so i spent a good deal of time craving something while i was prepping. Also, when we sat down both nights, we had some pretty fancy meals (Salmon Wellington and steak) that would have gone great with a glass of wine.
I am sad to say: I really hope i can go back to drinking casually. We have a very expensive collection of wines in our home and I have no plans to ask my wife not to drink in front of me. And, i am sorry, but a nice glass of wine just goes so well with a nice steak.
But, so far, sobriety has been a welcome change. Going to the grocery store and NOT spending $20+ on craft beer has been a nice change. Going to bed at 9:30 and reading instead of passing out is nice. Waking early and getting my training has been wonderful. And having increased clarity at work and at home, allowing me to be present and in the moment, is hard to compete with.
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But, so far, sobriety has been a welcome change. Going to the grocery store and NOT spending $20+ on craft beer has been a nice change. Going to bed at 9:30 and reading instead of passing out is nice. Waking early and getting my training has been wonderful. And having increased clarity at work and at home, allowing me to be present and in the moment, is hard to compete with.
And would you be willing to give those things up?
I used to smoke. A hit of nicotine with a cup of coffee sure felt good, but I eventually quit doing it because I knew what it was doing to my body. Nowadays, alcohol consumption is far more socially acceptable than smoking. However, it's still carcinogenic. Alcohol is classified by the WHO as a Group 1 carcinogen. It gives you cancer.
That glass of wine with your steak is probably delicious for the few minutes you're drinking it. Unfortunately, the negative effects of that glass of wine persist for hours – longer if you're a heavy and/or daily drinker.
Trust me, your dinners will still be yummy without the booze.
Since this is the MMM forum, I suppose we can compare this scenario to the rush a consumer sucka gets when they finance that brand new BMW and drive it off the lot. It feels good for a little while, but they pay for that status symbol for years and years.
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But, so far, sobriety has been a welcome change. Going to the grocery store and NOT spending $20+ on craft beer has been a nice change. Going to bed at 9:30 and reading instead of passing out is nice. Waking early and getting my training has been wonderful. And having increased clarity at work and at home, allowing me to be present and in the moment, is hard to compete with.
And would you be willing to give those things up?
I used to smoke. A hit of nicotine with a cup of coffee sure felt good, but I eventually quit doing it because I knew what it was doing to my body. Nowadays, alcohol consumption is far more socially acceptable than smoking. However, it's still carcinogenic. Alcohol is classified by the WHO as a Group 1 carcinogen. It gives you cancer.
That glass of wine with your steak is probably delicious for the few minutes you're drinking it. Unfortunately, the negative effects of that glass of wine persist for hours – longer if you're a heavy and/or daily drinker.
Trust me, your dinners will still be yummy without the booze.
Since this is the MMM forum, I suppose we can compare this scenario to the rush a consumer sucka gets when they finance that brand new BMW and drive it off the lot. It feels good for a little while, but they pay for that status symbol for years and years.
If it's OK to mock the people that drink coffee at starbucks, then it's even more appropriate to mock people that drink booze, especially socially - talk about a money sink! And if you're a daily drinker its even worse. I know when I quit drinking, it freed up hundreds of dollars in my budget that I could then save/invest.
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But, so far, sobriety has been a welcome change. Going to the grocery store and NOT spending $20+ on craft beer has been a nice change. Going to bed at 9:30 and reading instead of passing out is nice. Waking early and getting my training has been wonderful. And having increased clarity at work and at home, allowing me to be present and in the moment, is hard to compete with.
And would you be willing to give those things up?
I used to smoke. A hit of nicotine with a cup of coffee sure felt good, but I eventually quit doing it because I knew what it was doing to my body. Nowadays, alcohol consumption is far more socially acceptable than smoking. However, it's still carcinogenic. Alcohol is classified by the WHO as a Group 1 carcinogen. It gives you cancer.
That glass of wine with your steak is probably delicious for the few minutes you're drinking it. Unfortunately, the negative effects of that glass of wine persist for hours – longer if you're a heavy and/or daily drinker.
Trust me, your dinners will still be yummy without the booze.
Since this is the MMM forum, I suppose we can compare this scenario to the rush a consumer sucka gets when they finance that brand new BMW and drive it off the lot. It feels good for a little while, but they pay for that status symbol for years and years.
sorry, i don't put a glass of Malbec on par with a Marlboro. this comes from a former pack a day smoker turned sub-3 hour marathoner...
and no, i don't want to give those things up. i hope there is a middle ground like there used to be and is for many others.
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But, so far, sobriety has been a welcome change. Going to the grocery store and NOT spending $20+ on craft beer has been a nice change. Going to bed at 9:30 and reading instead of passing out is nice. Waking early and getting my training has been wonderful. And having increased clarity at work and at home, allowing me to be present and in the moment, is hard to compete with.
And would you be willing to give those things up?
I used to smoke. A hit of nicotine with a cup of coffee sure felt good, but I eventually quit doing it because I knew what it was doing to my body. Nowadays, alcohol consumption is far more socially acceptable than smoking. However, it's still carcinogenic. Alcohol is classified by the WHO as a Group 1 carcinogen. It gives you cancer.
That glass of wine with your steak is probably delicious for the few minutes you're drinking it. Unfortunately, the negative effects of that glass of wine persist for hours – longer if you're a heavy and/or daily drinker.
Trust me, your dinners will still be yummy without the booze.
Since this is the MMM forum, I suppose we can compare this scenario to the rush a consumer sucka gets when they finance that brand new BMW and drive it off the lot. It feels good for a little while, but they pay for that status symbol for years and years.
sorry, i don't put a glass of Malbec on par with a Marlboro. this comes from a former pack a day smoker turned sub-3 hour marathoner...
and no, i don't want to give those things up. i hope there is a middle ground like there used to be and is for many others.
It's all about the moderation. Will having a glass of wine a few times a week have the same effect as smoking a pack a day? I really doubt it, but I don't know. Will moderate alcohol use one day be viewed like cigarettes are today? I really doubt it, but I don't know.
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If it's OK to mock the people that drink coffee at starbucks, then it's even more appropriate to mock people that drink booze, especially socially - talk about a money sink! And if you're a daily drinker its even worse. I know when I quit drinking, it freed up hundreds of dollars in my budget that I could then save/invest.
not even comparable. it takes 1 minute to make a cup of coffee at home. much more difficult to brew your own beer or squeeze your own grapes.
i'm only 7 days without a drink but even if i go 7 years, i have no intention to hold my nose as i walk by the pub "mocking" all those people having a cocktail at social hour.
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If it's OK to mock the people that drink coffee at starbucks, then it's even more appropriate to mock people that drink booze, especially socially - talk about a money sink! And if you're a daily drinker its even worse. I know when I quit drinking, it freed up hundreds of dollars in my budget that I could then save/invest.
not even comparable. it takes 1 minute to make a cup of coffee at home. much more difficult to brew your own beer or squeeze your own grapes.
i'm only 7 days without a drink but even if i go 7 years, i have no intention to hold my nose as i walk by the pub "mocking" all those people having a cocktail at social hour.
My point is that booze is expensive, even more expensive than fancy pants coffee. And you don’t need booze in order to socialize. So there’s a financial incentive in addition to the other health benefits.
Of course, people that are addicted, even just moderately addicted, will get angry or defensive at the mere suggestion that maybe giving up booze is beneficial. I’ve seen plenty of that, first hand.
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sorry, i don't put a glass of Malbec on par with a Marlboro. this comes from a former pack a day smoker turned sub-3 hour marathoner...
and no, i don't want to give those things up. i hope there is a middle ground like there used to be and is for many others.
I hear you. My intention isn't to draw a rigid equivalence between cigs and vino. Rather, I'm comparing the two for the sake of pitting instant gratification against undesirable long-term consequences. The fact that both substances are carcinogenic makes the comparison more relevant than, say... comparing a compulsion to drink with a compulsion to veg out in front of the TV.
Also: Through at least the 1980s, there were daily smokers who were also marathon runners. I know that seems insane now given how socially unacceptable smoking has become, but it's worth bearing in mind that one can engage in self-destructive habits and also do "healthy stuff" on the reg... until the former catches up with the latter. Hell, an acquaintance of mine's retired father is currently a hardcore tennis player and a pack-a-day smoker. It's uncommon these days, but not nonexistent.
I also suspect that booze is only slightly less bad for us, on the whole, than smoking. I can't prove it and won't try to, but I'm not convinced that "normal" social drinking is basically benign. How many cigarettes can one comfortably smoke each week and know they probably won't get cancer? 2? 4? How many alcoholic beverages? If there's a comfortable middle ground of moderation for one, there must be for the other, right? Toxicity is all in the dosage, after all.
Look, I'm not trying to give you a hard time. I'm posting on this thread because I'm trying to quit drinking, too. It's hard.
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sorry, i don't put a glass of Malbec on par with a Marlboro. this comes from a former pack a day smoker turned sub-3 hour marathoner...
and no, i don't want to give those things up. i hope there is a middle ground like there used to be and is for many others.
I hear you. My intention isn't to draw a rigid equivalence between cigs and vino. Rather, I'm comparing the two for the sake of pitting instant gratification against undesirable long-term consequences. The fact that both substances are carcinogenic makes the comparison more relevant than, say... comparing a compulsion to drink with a compulsion to veg out in front of the TV.
Also: Through at least the 1980s, there were daily smokers who were also marathon runners. I know that seems insane now given how socially unacceptable smoking has become, but it's worth bearing in mind that one can engage in self-destructive habits and also do "healthy stuff" on the reg... until the former catches up with the latter. Hell, an acquaintance of mine's retired father is currently a hardcore tennis player and a pack-a-day smoker. It's uncommon these days, but not nonexistent.
I also suspect that booze is only slightly less bad for us, on the whole, than smoking. I can't prove it and won't try to, but I'm not convinced that "normal" social drinking is basically benign. How many cigarettes can one comfortably smoke each week and know they probably won't get cancer? 2? 4? How many alcoholic beverages? If there's a comfortable middle ground of moderation for one, there must be for the other, right? Toxicity is all in the dosage, after all.
Look, I'm not trying to give you a hard time. I'm posting on this thread because I'm trying to quit drinking, too. It's hard.
no worries. now i'm worried i have a sparkling water addiction. i can chug 3-4 of those a night!
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sorry, i don't put a glass of Malbec on par with a Marlboro. this comes from a former pack a day smoker turned sub-3 hour marathoner...
and no, i don't want to give those things up. i hope there is a middle ground like there used to be and is for many others.
I hear you. My intention isn't to draw a rigid equivalence between cigs and vino. Rather, I'm comparing the two for the sake of pitting instant gratification against undesirable long-term consequences. The fact that both substances are carcinogenic makes the comparison more relevant than, say... comparing a compulsion to drink with a compulsion to veg out in front of the TV.
Also: Through at least the 1980s, there were daily smokers who were also marathon runners. I know that seems insane now given how socially unacceptable smoking has become, but it's worth bearing in mind that one can engage in self-destructive habits and also do "healthy stuff" on the reg... until the former catches up with the latter. Hell, an acquaintance of mine's retired father is currently a hardcore tennis player and a pack-a-day smoker. It's uncommon these days, but not nonexistent.
I also suspect that booze is only slightly less bad for us, on the whole, than smoking. I can't prove it and won't try to, but I'm not convinced that "normal" social drinking is basically benign. How many cigarettes can one comfortably smoke each week and know they probably won't get cancer? 2? 4? How many alcoholic beverages? If there's a comfortable middle ground of moderation for one, there must be for the other, right? Toxicity is all in the dosage, after all.
Look, I'm not trying to give you a hard time. I'm posting on this thread because I'm trying to quit drinking, too. It's hard.
In the early days of cycle racing, the cyclists used to drink alcohol WHILE RACING (read about it when reading about the history of doping in cycling). It used to be considered medicinal and performance enhancing!
It's interesting perusing the comments on Annie Grace's website...there is a large percentage of the commenters that are 1) health care professionals (doctors/nurses/etc.); 2) health 'coach' types of some sort (nutritionist/yoga teachers/personal trainers); or 3) people who are hard-core healthy eaters/exercisers in all other areas. Most are struggling to reconcile the cognitive dissonance of the fact that they have dependency ranging from physical addiction to psychological dependence with what they objectively know about alcohol (drinking is really unhealthy), their ability to somehow compartmentalize this one unhealthy behavior and rationalize it, and the psycho-social training we all receive in a culture that celebrates 'some kinds' (specifics unclear) of drinking as desirable.
I do know that after absorbing decades of "it reduces heart attacks/it helps blood sugar regulation/Mediterranean cultures drink wine with afternoon and evening meals" messages, and being around friends that drank daily or regularly, it was a real shock when my doctor explained that guidelines for safe intake keep being ratcheted down in various western nations as more and more meta analysis is done, and that the data indicate that risks of cancer outweighed all the supposed health benefits.
It's a bummer, much in the way that meta-analysis of diet keeps shifting the needle on nitrate-filled processed meat further and further down the 'not safe' scale. Which is unfortunate, b/c bacon is delicious.
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If it's OK to mock the people that drink coffee at starbucks, then it's even more appropriate to mock people that drink booze, especially socially - talk about a money sink! And if you're a daily drinker its even worse. I know when I quit drinking, it freed up hundreds of dollars in my budget that I could then save/invest.
not even comparable. it takes 1 minute to make a cup of coffee at home. much more difficult to brew your own beer or squeeze your own grapes.
i'm only 7 days without a drink but even if i go 7 years, i have no intention to hold my nose as i walk by the pub "mocking" all those people having a cocktail at social hour.
My point is that booze is expensive, even more expensive than fancy pants coffee. And you don’t need booze in order to socialize. So there’s a financial incentive in addition to the other health benefits.
Of course, people that are addicted, even just moderately addicted, will get angry or defensive at the mere suggestion that maybe giving up booze is beneficial. I’ve seen plenty of that, first hand.
I agree that retail booze at bars is way overpriced. $7 for a pint of Budweiser at some places. Ridiculous. I have been a beer lover for decades, but soon learned when out and about having fun on a hot day and coming across the $7 Bud on tap, to 'just say no'. My frugality is stronger than my craving for beer. Hmmm. Well, if they had a realllly good beer on tap, for $7 a pint, I might get just one.
I see folks at a local outdoor music place buying the $7 pints of Bud all day long. And I assume it's their own money they're spending. Unbelievable.
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Fell off the wagon. Instead of my self-imposed 3 per day limit, I had 4 beers last night. I had been sticking to the 3 per day rule for four days in a row. Even went down to just 2 beers one day. Needing to use the will power is no fun.
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My husband and I stopped buying alcohol about a year ago and I think it has saved us easily $200 a month.
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Fell off the wagon. Instead of my self-imposed 3 per day limit, I had 4 beers last night. I had been sticking to the 3 per day rule for four days in a row. Even went down to just 2 beers one day. Needing to use the will power is no fun.
Much to my own shock, I found it was far easier to just not drink at all (after the first two weeks, that is) then to constantly argue with myself about pouring another half glass every night.
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I am going back and forth about cutting back on drinking. I "feel" like I get more enjoyment than downsides (I've never drank so much I've ever thrown up, and rarely get a hangover). I'm more aware than the average person of the negative effects of alcohol as I have 3 family members who are/were alcoholics, and a couple (my judgment) who abuse alcohol. Because of my older brother our entire family went to "rehab" (aanon meetings).
However I've gotten in habit when I get home from work and make dinner, and most of the time I have wine with my dinner, so I a) watch tv with the wine and nibble on more food like cheese and crackers or chocolate and b) my day is done. While I can still do house work, I am not mentally up for working on my hobbies (writing and art). Part of me justifies that it's Ok for me to have downtime. At the same time my time is limited, and what is being sacrificed is output.. So while I love the wine and downtime, at some point I will need to cut back (limit to 1 or 2 days a week) or entirely refrain for a period of time to get another zine out.
eta my favorite non-alcoholic drink right now is celestial seasonings Bengal spice tea, esp with a little agave syrup and almond milk. YUM
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Fell off the wagon. Instead of my self-imposed 3 per day limit, I had 4 beers last night. I had been sticking to the 3 per day rule for four days in a row. Even went down to just 2 beers one day. Needing to use the will power is no fun.
Much to my own shock, I found it was far easier to just not drink at all (after the first two weeks, that is) then to constantly argue with myself about pouring another half glass every night.
I totally understand. I did a number of years of no (added) sugar and it was much simpler then trying to reduce sugar by an arbitrary amount. Same thing for me eating meat during lent, or alcohol during pregnancy. Oddly I think it requires less willpower because decision making is already done.
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I am going back and forth about cutting back on drinking. I "feel" like I get more enjoyment than downsides (I've never drank so much I've ever thrown up, and rarely get a hangover). I'm more aware than the average person of the negative effects of alcohol as I have 3 family members who are/were alcoholics, and a couple (my judgment) who abuse alcohol. Because of my older brother our entire family went to "rehab" (aanon meetings).
However I've gotten in habit when I get home from work and make dinner, and most of the time I have wine with my dinner, so I a) watch tv with the wine and nibble on more food like cheese and crackers or chocolate and b) my day is done. While I can still do house work, I am not mentally up for working on my hobbies (writing and art). Part of me justifies that it's Ok for me to have downtime. At the same time my time is limited, and what is being sacrificed is output.. So while I love the wine and downtime, at some point I will need to cut back (limit to 1 or 2 days a week) or entirely refrain for a period of time to get another zine out.
eta my favorite non-alcoholic drink right now is celestial seasonings Bengal spice tea, esp with a little agave syrup and almond milk. YUM
Hmmm. That' an idea. Maybe I'll start drinking some sort of decaf tea. Sounds like no way it could replace a beer, but the mind is an amazing thing. Might act as a substitute.
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Slackmax, I drink rooibos chai in the afternoon. Feels like a treat but no caffeine.
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Slackmax, I drink rooibos chai in the afternoon. Feels like a treat but no caffeine.
Rooibs chai. Hmmm. I'll check that out, Thanks.
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I've been really exhausted lately and not sleeping that well. I'm in my late 40s so maybe this is just how life is now but maybe cutting down on or cutting out the booze might give me more energy?
It's hot now and nothing like a frosty beer after a hard day's work though.
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I've been really exhausted lately and not sleeping that well. I'm in my late 40s so maybe this is just how life is now but maybe cutting down on or cutting out the booze might give me more energy?
It's hot now and nothing like a frosty beer after a hard day's work though.
Nothing like an ice cold glass of water with a twist of lemon after a hard day's work!! (Reframe those thoughts!) . ((If you want))
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I've been really exhausted lately and not sleeping that well. I'm in my late 40s so maybe this is just how life is now but maybe cutting down on or cutting out the booze might give me more energy?
It's hot now and nothing like a frosty beer after a hard day's work though.
Nothing like an ice cold glass of water with a twist of lemon after a hard day's work!! (Reframe those thoughts!) . ((If you want))
You're quite right. I need to get some enticing non-alcoholic options to put in the fridge.
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Went to my first bar-based social event since I did the 30-day program (currently I'm somewhere past the 100-day mark, which gives an indication of just how rarely I socialize in a group at a restaurant or bar). I drank water, and still found I was able to talk with everyone (all dozen or so of the others had multiple beers) with no problem or major anxiety. There was still minor 'background' anxiety b/c I don't like being in groups bigger than about 6 people (occasional sport, musical, or theatrical events excepted), no matter alchohol's involvement...I am most definitely NOT a herd animal. But I'm not sure why I have been convinced for 2 decades that I needed a slight buzz to socialize. And it was nice that when I really wanted to leave, I didn't need to wait for my husband to sit around for another 45 minutes after his last beer so he could drive...I could just drive and we could leave right then.
One slight negative I noticed, though. My natural introversion definitely asserts itself more without drinking. Without alcohol, after about 1.5-2 hours, I was definitely ready to leave and be very quiet (possibly for the next week lol); whereas, my typical buzz would have damped down my anxiety and irritation at being in a big, boistrous group and I would have been fine coasting along for another hour or two and I wouldn't have hit such a clear point of 'ok, fun's over and I'm done'. So I can see how it can somewhat affect one's socializing, if one is introverted. Extroverts probably not so much.
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@wenchsenior that is very much my bar experience now. I was definitely using alcohol to mute my normal discomfort and let me continue to socialise long after I hit my natural limit. Now I make sure I turn up for the earlier part of events when it's quieter/less of a buzz on and then leave when it starts hitting a certain volume.
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You guys, I haven't been to a bar in forever. I can't stand the high prices, plus tip! Oh well, I did go a few months ago since a woman I was interested in invited me to meet her there. And I bought myself a beer and left a tip. The things ya have to do, right?? lol... Offered to pay for hers, but she refused.
ANyway... I had two beers today around noon, then went out to do stuff, came back around 5 PM and did NOT have more beers. yay! My standard new low 'goal' is three beers per day, so only having two is pretty good.
I did make myself an 'alternate beverage', which was Lipton's decaf tea made with hot water and a teabag. It's working, I guess. I haven't had a craving for a beer all evening.
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I broke down and had a nice cold glass of white wine with dinner last night. Glad to see that those of us cutting down on booze rather than cutting it out completely are welcome on this thread.
The new me is going to drink one glass of wine or small glass of beer 3-4 days a week. TBH I never really enjoy the wine after that first glass anyway.
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2 months so far. Lost a lot of beer pudding/belly. I was spending about $10 a day on beer/wine.
So would have spent about $600 on booze in last 2 months.
I've noticed that I sleep a lot better, it took about a week for my sleep pattern to normalize. But I sleep and wake more rested.
I don't seem to ache and be as stiff as I was, I can definitely bend down to tie my shoes easier.
I definitely DO NOT MISS HANGOVERS! What a dumb azz thing that was to do for so long.
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Just popping in to cheer everyone on! I've really appreciated lurking on this thread and seeing the thoughtful efforts so many people are making.
DH and I reset our alcohol habit a few years ago, first by abstaining for several years, and now by very intentional drinking. For us that means no more than one drink per day (always measured), no more than 3-4 drinks per week and not on consecutive days, no drinking alone. We are thinking about the amount as we feel we may be slipping back to treating alcohol as a habit rather than a treat. Alcohol as a treat is great and we'd like to preserve that. Alcohol as a habit is very insidious and it's quite easy to ramp up before you know it.
Best of luck to everyone in drinking or not drinking - both with intention.
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Just anyone needs some extra encouragement, I found this article to be worthwhile: https://www.npr.org/sections/health-shots/2019/06/23/732876026/breaking-the-booze-habit-even-briefly-has-its-benefits
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On day 7. So far, so good. This weekend was tough - I am the cook and usually cooking is accompanied by several glasses of strong beer. My wife's bday was Saturday and Father's Day was Sunday so i spent a good deal of time craving something while i was prepping. Also, when we sat down both nights, we had some pretty fancy meals (Salmon Wellington and steak) that would have gone great with a glass of wine.
I am sad to say: I really hope i can go back to drinking casually. We have a very expensive collection of wines in our home and I have no plans to ask my wife not to drink in front of me. And, i am sorry, but a nice glass of wine just goes so well with a nice steak.
But, so far, sobriety has been a welcome change. Going to the grocery store and NOT spending $20+ on craft beer has been a nice change. Going to bed at 9:30 and reading instead of passing out is nice. Waking early and getting my training has been wonderful. And having increased clarity at work and at home, allowing me to be present and in the moment, is hard to compete with.
Day 14, still going strong. this weekend was difficult - was down in the FL keys with friends. it was 90+ degrees, we were hanging by the pool and everyone had a drink in their hands. luckily, no peer pressure from them but damn would have been nice to have a cold one.
one thing that has surprised me - i haven't lost any weight. i wasn't big to begin with (160 lbs for a 6'2" male) but i thought i would lose a few lbs.
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Day 14, still going strong. this weekend was difficult - was down in the FL keys with friends. it was 90+ degrees, we were hanging by the pool and everyone had a drink in their hands. luckily, no peer pressure from them but damn would have been nice to have a cold one.
one thing that has surprised me - i haven't lost any weight. i wasn't big to begin with (160 lbs for a 6'2" male) but i thought i would lose a few lbs.
I opted for a sharp bitter substitute in those situations - grapefruit juice in seltzer being a fav or a splash of pomegranate with fresh lime. Gave the bite and the refreshment I was looking for. I also did not lose weight initially but 2 years later and I am down 10kg. It's different for everyone. You are doing great.
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Got home last night after a fun day of doing interesting things and was NOT craving a beer. Although I was definitely thinking about it. So I had one 12 ouncer at 7.5% ABV. Enjoyed it.
Decided NOT to have another, because I wanted to notch a 'one beer only' day into my belt.
I was in a good mood yesterday due to coming to a decision finally about something I had been worrying about, and also having had some fun social activity.
Being in a good mood, as opposed to being worried or bored, makes it much easier to say no to the brewskis.
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I think i need to get knocked down a peg or two.
I drank consistently for the last ~7 years, almost always one or two beers a night.
Since 2018 and into 2019, it escalated to having 3-5 strong beers every night, followed by wine at dinner. i knew it was an issue (wasn't recalling the arguments with my wife at night, failed to recall the plot of whatever TV show we watched or book i read before passing out).
i admitted i had a problem and went alcohol free 17 days ago.
The reason for the "knock me down" request: it has been surprisingly easy. i am on my first out of town work trip since ditching the booze, in a town i know well with many pubs i also know well. last night i marched right into the same bar i always visit. i had no doubt i could skip the booze, and skip it i did.
no one would recommend walking into a bar by yourself to someone that drank like i did for as long as i did, if that someone was just recently sober.
but i did it, and knew i could. ordered the same meal i usually did and got weird looks from the bartender when i ordered club soda.
i don't want to get overconfident, but is it common to be able to do these kinds of things with such confidence?
does it in any way indicate that maybe i am the type of person that can drink once a week, or occasionally, without getting out of control? i honestly don't know because up until now, i never tried to exercise self control.
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I think i need to get knocked down a peg or two.
I drank consistently for the last ~7 years, almost always one or two beers a night.
Since 2018 and into 2019, it escalated to having 3-5 strong beers every night, followed by wine at dinner. i knew it was an issue (wasn't recalling the arguments with my wife at night, failed to recall the plot of whatever TV show we watched or book i read before passing out).
i admitted i had a problem and went alcohol free 17 days ago.
The reason for the "knock me down" request: it has been surprisingly easy. i am on my first out of town work trip since ditching the booze, in a town i know well with many pubs i also know well. last night i marched right into the same bar i always visit. i had no doubt i could skip the booze, and skip it i did.
no one would recommend walking into a bar by yourself to someone that drank like i did for as long as i did, if that someone was just recently sober.
but i did it, and knew i could. ordered the same meal i usually did and got weird looks from the bartender when i ordered club soda.
i don't want to get overconfident, but is it common to be able to do these kinds of things with such confidence?
does it in any way indicate that maybe i am the type of person that can drink once a week, or occasionally, without getting out of control? i honestly don't know because up until now, i never tried to exercise self control.
In my experience, this is the addict brain trying to negotiate some wiggle room re: drinking. "Hey, maybe I'm not an addict after all!". I can completely relate, because I quit very easily for several months my first go at it. After a few months, I felt better and thought "hey that was easy, this isn't so bad, I can probably drink normally now". HAHAHAHAHAHAHA yeah that didn't work out too well.
But, everyone's different, so the only way to know for sure is to try things for yourself & see what happens. I know for myself it was almost like I HAD to crash & burn pretty hard so that nagging question of "do I REALLY have a problem?" got a definitive answer (ie, YES I do).
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I think i need to get knocked down a peg or two.
I drank consistently for the last ~7 years, almost always one or two beers a night.
Since 2018 and into 2019, it escalated to having 3-5 strong beers every night, followed by wine at dinner. i knew it was an issue (wasn't recalling the arguments with my wife at night, failed to recall the plot of whatever TV show we watched or book i read before passing out).
i admitted i had a problem and went alcohol free 17 days ago.
The reason for the "knock me down" request: it has been surprisingly easy. i am on my first out of town work trip since ditching the booze, in a town i know well with many pubs i also know well. last night i marched right into the same bar i always visit. i had no doubt i could skip the booze, and skip it i did.
no one would recommend walking into a bar by yourself to someone that drank like i did for as long as i did, if that someone was just recently sober.
but i did it, and knew i could. ordered the same meal i usually did and got weird looks from the bartender when i ordered club soda.
i don't want to get overconfident, but is it common to be able to do these kinds of things with such confidence?
does it in any way indicate that maybe i am the type of person that can drink once a week, or occasionally, without getting out of control? i honestly don't know because up until now, i never tried to exercise self control.
The annoying answer is: it seems like everyone is different. Unless there is a big physical dependency, most people can stop/control intake for some period of time if sufficiently motivated, even if they have problematic psychological relationships with drinking. I feel like the question is, what was your motivation to stop and more importantly, what is your motivation to keep drinking?
You started out drinking 'moderately' and gradually you increased your intake. That's natural, b/c the substance is addictive...it's not a character flaw in you. Now you are abstaining, but it seems like you are still viewing it as a test of your own willpower over a feeling of deprivation. I might be wrong, but you haven't seemed to have changed your beliefs or assumptions about what you 'gain' from drinking...and you are feeling really good about even being able to stop at all (I've been there!). But once you succeed in moderating for a while, you will feel confident that you can moderate in the future. At the same time, you presumably haven't changed any of your beliefs about alcohol, so the 'attractions' of drinking will be the same as before, right? In the past when you were drinking moderately, you didn't mean to become someone who drank 3-6 drinks/night, either, did you? But eventually you got there.
It might be that simple mindfulness and setting some rules for yourself will keep you on track in the future. But the problem for a lot of people seems to be that the more confident they are that they can moderate, the more flexible their rules get over time: occasional drink becomes one glass of wine with dinner, which becomes multiple glasses, etc.
Personally, I did the moderation thing for almost 20 years (and relatively 'successfully'). I never drank enough to have any traditional negative consequences of daily drinking b/c I capped my amount. Drinking would 'creep up' over several years, and I'd dial it back for a while, and then it would inevitably creep again. It was very mentally tiring, but it never occurred to me to just stop b/c that seemed like 'punishment'. It wasn't until I did that Alcohol Experiment program that my entire thought process changed, and I began to view not drinking as the 'reward' sort of thing, rather than deprivation.
You are in the early stages of really examining your relationship with drinking. If you stay mindful, you'll eventually figure out how it's going to work for you going forward.
Self monitoring on all this stuff is very illuminating.
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I think i need to get knocked down a peg or two.
I drank consistently for the last ~7 years, almost always one or two beers a night.
Since 2018 and into 2019, it escalated to having 3-5 strong beers every night, followed by wine at dinner. i knew it was an issue (wasn't recalling the arguments with my wife at night, failed to recall the plot of whatever TV show we watched or book i read before passing out).
i admitted i had a problem and went alcohol free 17 days ago.
The reason for the "knock me down" request: it has been surprisingly easy. i am on my first out of town work trip since ditching the booze, in a town i know well with many pubs i also know well. last night i marched right into the same bar i always visit. i had no doubt i could skip the booze, and skip it i did.
no one would recommend walking into a bar by yourself to someone that drank like i did for as long as i did, if that someone was just recently sober.
but i did it, and knew i could. ordered the same meal i usually did and got weird looks from the bartender when i ordered club soda.
i don't want to get overconfident, but is it common to be able to do these kinds of things with such confidence?
does it in any way indicate that maybe i am the type of person that can drink once a week, or occasionally, without getting out of control? i honestly don't know because up until now, i never tried to exercise self control.
The annoying answer is: it seems like everyone is different. Unless there is a big physical dependency, most people can stop/control intake for some period of time if sufficiently motivated, even if they have problematic psychological relationships with drinking. I feel like the question is, what was your motivation to stop and more importantly, what is your motivation to keep drinking?
You started out drinking 'moderately' and gradually you increased your intake. That's natural, b/c the substance is addictive...it's not a character flaw in you. Now you are abstaining, but it seems like you are still viewing it as a test of your own willpower over a feeling of deprivation. I might be wrong, but you haven't seemed to have changed your beliefs or assumptions about what you 'gain' from drinking...and you are feeling really good about even being able to stop at all (I've been there!). But once you succeed in moderating for a while, you will feel confident that you can moderate in the future. At the same time, you presumably haven't changed any of your beliefs about alcohol, so the 'attractions' of drinking will be the same as before, right? In the past when you were drinking moderately, you didn't mean to become someone who drank 3-6 drinks/night, either, did you? But eventually you got there.
It might be that simple mindfulness and setting some rules for yourself will keep you on track in the future. But the problem for a lot of people seems to be that the more confident they are that they can moderate, the more flexible their rules get over time: occasional drink becomes one glass of wine with dinner, which becomes multiple glasses, etc.
Personally, I did the moderation thing for almost 20 years (and relatively 'successfully'). I never drank enough to have any traditional negative consequences of daily drinking b/c I capped my amount. Drinking would 'creep up' over several years, and I'd dial it back for a while, and then it would inevitably creep again. It was very mentally tiring, but it never occurred to me to just stop b/c that seemed like 'punishment'. It wasn't until I did that Alcohol Experiment program that my entire thought process changed, and I began to view not drinking as the 'reward' sort of thing, rather than deprivation.
You are in the early stages of really examining your relationship with drinking. If you stay mindful, you'll eventually figure out how it's going to work for you going forward.
Self monitoring on all this stuff is very illuminating.
very well thought-out response. i appreciate it.
i admit it is still very early. i also really appreciate a) being more productive at work, b) being more present at home, c) waking earlier and sleeping better, d) just having more time to do STUFF. so i clearly see the benefits of not drinking.
i was surprised: when i quit i did not experience any symptoms. i had feared everything from crankiness to insomnia to worse, but nothing really happened.
i don't fault people that can enjoy a drink responsibly and would like to think i could still be one as well. but who knows, maybe my past indicates i can't.
people may say it's the addict talking - and they may be right - but i truly do love the taste of a hoppy IPA on a hot summer day. it was always something my dad and i could enjoy together.
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I also find that a bitter citrus in cold bubbly water is a good IPA substitute. There also are some kombuchas out there brewed with hops that are even closer to the mouthfeel of an IPA.
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I haven't really been drinking but uh oh, realize my munching habit after dinner in front of tv is just that, enjoyment of continuing to eat after dinner, regardless if I have wine or not. so, only reduction of calories is the alcohol calories, but compensated by perhaps more eating. I think my only solution is just to re-up my pirate booty (usually 1 small bag is enough to satisfy my cravings) and also provision some dark chocolate. Still means I'm munching but at least not as bad.
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Day 14, still going strong. this weekend was difficult - was down in the FL keys with friends. it was 90+ degrees, we were hanging by the pool and everyone had a drink in their hands. luckily, no peer pressure from them but damn would have been nice to have a cold one.
one thing that has surprised me - i haven't lost any weight. i wasn't big to begin with (160 lbs for a 6'2" male) but i thought i would lose a few lbs.
While you have cut out the calories from drinking, you wont lose weight unless your calories are at a deficit (compared to what your body needs). That would explain why you didn't lose any.
Not that you need to. At 6'2" and 160, you would be fairly thin. I'm the same height at 229#, and appear thin.
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Congratulations to those who are going clean.
I'm still limiting myself to 3 beers or fewer per day. About once a week I go off the rails, and have 4 or 5, and the reason is that I like the buzz! Especially while playing my old vinyl records, lol. I admit it.
But I am able to keep it down to 1 beer some days, and 2 beers some days, so there's that.
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Day 14, still going strong. this weekend was difficult - was down in the FL keys with friends. it was 90+ degrees, we were hanging by the pool and everyone had a drink in their hands. luckily, no peer pressure from them but damn would have been nice to have a cold one.
one thing that has surprised me - i haven't lost any weight. i wasn't big to begin with (160 lbs for a 6'2" male) but i thought i would lose a few lbs.
While you have cut out the calories from drinking, you wont lose weight unless your calories are at a deficit (compared to what your body needs). That would explain why you didn't lose any.
Not that you need to. At 6'2" and 160, you would be fairly thin. I'm the same height at 229#, and appear thin.
Nah - just needed some time. i am down to below 160 lbs now, so the weight loss is apparent.
i figure i eat around 2300 cals/day but was drinking 700-1000 per day. my weight normalized at 162 lbs, due to running 30-40 miles per week.
now that the 700-100 cals are gone, the weight is moving in sync.
pleased i am
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I think it was about a year ago that I was inspired by this thread to cut back significantly on my drinking. I moved to just one beer a day instead of what I had been drinking daily which was to be honest quite a lot. Then sometime in August I stopped drinking even that one beer and I haven't had another drink since!
It is still going well. Every so often I do get a strong craving to have a drink. I've identified my triggers and am even now still trying to find other ways of dealing with that stress because I have learned that life for me is far better if I'm not drinking. Problems just seem easier to solve.
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I also find that a bitter citrus in cold bubbly water is a good IPA substitute. There also are some kombuchas out there brewed with hops that are even closer to the mouthfeel of an IPA.
I can't remember who, but I think someone on this thread earlier mentioned bitters, which I'd never tried. I've found that a mix of water or sparkling water/kombucha/grapefruit bitters to be quite satisfying. At some point I'm going to experiment with making a distillation of fresh herbs (juniper/rosemary etc.) to add in, and try some other types of bitters, as well.
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This was true for me!
https://www.today.com/health/women-who-stop-drinking-alcohol-improve-mental-health-study-finds-t157931?fbclid=IwAR3kutql4YBPBYEhfFmwLV-biaFAYtmKQSNcmysTU88CxRyf7sXCh6eIGdA
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I revisited this thread because this is something I have been thinking about. In part because the guy I'm seeing does not drink at all, so of course he would prefer I do not drink (but he is not pushy about it). But I enjoy drinking, particularly with a meal.
The Audit is a 4 item scale to see if you have an alcohol use problem. You can find it on the internet and do it if you are wondering if you fall into a danger zone.
Anyways one thing I used to do was drink most nights, even if it was one drink with dinner. Now I am limiting to 2,3 nights a week. I know it doesn't seem like much of a difference but for me it seems psychologically easier to have the default to be not drinking, so I decide TO drink, not decide to not drink. I have done the same thing with coffee, and it is one less thing to purchase at the grocery store.
My brother died of cancer and I spoke to a provider whether me going from my current drinking to no drinking level would cut my cancer risk (alcohol increases risk of cancer) and she said maybe 1%? So not a huge amount but it is there. I calculated that I would save around 520 a year if I went to no drinking. for me I enjoy drinking enough I don't mind the cost, but it is something I am toying with.
Sometimes what I think about is, what about lower alcohol beer? A lot of breweries are making higher and higher alcohol beers, but what about a nice beer with a good taste and refreshment with half the regular alcohol? Or would no one buy that?
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I've had 1-2 drinks a night for as long as I can remember, but in the past couple of years that has crept up to 3-4. Finally decided I was tired of my stomach being in the way when I tried tying my shoes, plus have a race in September to train for, so gave it up starting Tuesday. I'm 6'0" and 190 is about my fighting weight. 200 I still feel really good. Haven't seen either in a couple years and weighed in at 227.0 Tuesday morning (I always weigh myself at the same time of day for consistency). Went for a recovery run Tuesday afternoon in the heat (had a long race this past weekend), did another 6 mile trail run last night. Sitting at 221.1 this morning - it's an amazing feeling when you can almost literally feel the pounds melting away! Began intermittent fasting today to help with the burn. Have a 15.5 mile run scheduled for the morning, will wait to eat until after. My goal is to get back under 200 by the time my race comes around (mid September). It's kind of a stretch goal, but I think it's manageable if I stick with it (1/2 pound a day). Will keep checking in with progress updates if anyone cares.
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Surprise, surprise. Alcohol likely increases one's risk of yet another type of cancer: https://www.npr.org/sections/thesalt/2019/07/14/741063881/mixing-alcohol-and-sun-beware-a-buzz-begets-a-faster-burn
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Not sure if this is good or bad, but I have discovered that inexpensive red wine over ice is pretty good, especially in this heat, with no a/c on.
Also, amazingly, cheap beer on ice is OK.
The ice melts and increases the volume of booze one drinks, giving you the feeling of drinking more?
Still holding to my 3-drinks-or-fewer-per- day rule, more or less.
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I've had 1-2 drinks a night for as long as I can remember, but in the past couple of years that has crept up to 3-4. Finally decided I was tired of my stomach being in the way when I tried tying my shoes, plus have a race in September to train for, so gave it up starting Tuesday. I'm 6'0" and 190 is about my fighting weight. 200 I still feel really good. Haven't seen either in a couple years and weighed in at 227.0 Tuesday morning (I always weigh myself at the same time of day for consistency). Went for a recovery run Tuesday afternoon in the heat (had a long race this past weekend), did another 6 mile trail run last night. Sitting at 221.1 this morning - it's an amazing feeling when you can almost literally feel the pounds melting away! Began intermittent fasting today to help with the burn. Have a 15.5 mile run scheduled for the morning, will wait to eat until after. My goal is to get back under 200 by the time my race comes around (mid September). It's kind of a stretch goal, but I think it's manageable if I stick with it (1/2 pound a day). Will keep checking in with progress updates if anyone cares.
12 days in now, down 9 pounds! 218.0 this morning. I have been doing pretty good with the intermittent fasting and have had some really good runs in the past week. I did break down and buy a six pack last Sunday after hitting it hard on a 14 mile run, but nothing other than that. Feeling good, feeling lighter, definitely have more energy.
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Well, finished off the last of the liquor and beer in my house last night. Need to cut down on this chit. As I'm getting older I'm realizing how much my sleep is affected just from a couple of drinks.
First step is to not buy any liquor or beer for a while and see where that takes me. I'll still allow a couple drinks when out to dinner or w/ friends. Luckily the Mustachian in me won't let me buy too many $5 beers or $10 mixed drinks.
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Well, finished off the last of the liquor and beer in my house last night. Need to cut down on this chit. As I'm getting older I'm realizing how much my sleep is affected just from a couple of drinks.
First step is to not buy any liquor or beer for a while and see where that takes me. I'll still allow a couple drinks when out to dinner or w/ friends. Luckily the Mustachian in me won't let me buy too many $5 beers or $10 mixed drinks.
Good luck, BiggerFishToFI ! Let us know how it goes.
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Hello all. Congrats to everyone who is succeeding in this challenge. I will hit 3 years next week.
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Hello all. Congrats to everyone who is succeeding in this challenge. I will hit 3 years next week.
Nice going!
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Nice one @OurTown!
I realised last night that I had passed two years without noticing. It continues to feel good.
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Hi Crusty,
I think you should try to commit to a 30 day No Alcohol fast to see how you feel.
You know, on second thought, I think you are right. Immediately after reading your comment, I got a little angry and later that night, had a beer in defiance. "No one is going to suggest to me I shouldn't drink!" I saw at the time how irrational that was.
And I am realizing that if I just have a drink every couple of days, I am still experiencing all the unpleasant effects every couple of days now instead of every day. It's like going through withdrawal over and over and over.
I just signed up for Anne Grace's Alcohol Experiment and am going to give it an honest try.
Thanks @BikeFanatic for the push!
So, it was a year ago that I had my last alcoholic beverage.
This was probably the best decision I've ever made.
I'm not making a big deal of it in real life, but just thought I'd post here.
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Hi Crusty,
I think you should try to commit to a 30 day No Alcohol fast to see how you feel.
You know, on second thought, I think you are right. Immediately after reading your comment, I got a little angry and later that night, had a beer in defiance. "No one is going to suggest to me I shouldn't drink!" I saw at the time how irrational that was.
And I am realizing that if I just have a drink every couple of days, I am still experiencing all the unpleasant effects every couple of days now instead of every day. It's like going through withdrawal over and over and over.
I just signed up for Anne Grace's Alcohol Experiment and am going to give it an honest try.
Thanks @BikeFanatic for the push!
So, it was a year ago that I had my last alcoholic beverage.
This was probably the best decision I've ever made.
I'm not making a big deal of it in real life, but just thought I'd post here.
I'm so pleased for you, and also very impressed...I remember you were dealing with some tough life-challenges when you decided to quit.
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Hi Crusty,
I think you should try to commit to a 30 day No Alcohol fast to see how you feel.
You know, on second thought, I think you are right. Immediately after reading your comment, I got a little angry and later that night, had a beer in defiance. "No one is going to suggest to me I shouldn't drink!" I saw at the time how irrational that was.
And I am realizing that if I just have a drink every couple of days, I am still experiencing all the unpleasant effects every couple of days now instead of every day. It's like going through withdrawal over and over and over.
I just signed up for Anne Grace's Alcohol Experiment and am going to give it an honest try.
Thanks @BikeFanatic for the push!
So, it was a year ago that I had my last alcoholic beverage.
This was probably the best decision I've ever made.
I'm not making a big deal of it in real life, but just thought I'd post here.
That is awesome! Congrats :thumbs-up:
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So, it was a year ago that I had my last alcoholic beverage.
This was probably the best decision I've ever made.
I'm not making a big deal of it in real life, but just thought I'd post here.
I'm so pleased for you, and also very impressed...I remember you were dealing with some tough life-challenges when you decided to quit.
Thanks @wenchsenior !! Yes, I am still going through these tough life-challenges but they are so much more manageable without drinking, it turns out.
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Hi Crusty,
I think you should try to commit to a 30 day No Alcohol fast to see how you feel.
You know, on second thought, I think you are right. Immediately after reading your comment, I got a little angry and later that night, had a beer in defiance. "No one is going to suggest to me I shouldn't drink!" I saw at the time how irrational that was.
And I am realizing that if I just have a drink every couple of days, I am still experiencing all the unpleasant effects every couple of days now instead of every day. It's like going through withdrawal over and over and over.
I just signed up for Anne Grace's Alcohol Experiment and am going to give it an honest try.
Thanks @BikeFanatic for the push!
So, it was a year ago that I had my last alcoholic beverage.
This was probably the best decision I've ever made.
I'm not making a big deal of it in real life, but just thought I'd post here.
Congratulations! I actually know a couple older folks irl who made the switch, and don't miss it because the downsides of drinking outweighed any benefits of it.
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I'm starting the 30 day challenge today, wish me luck! Thanks for the inspiration everyone
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I'm starting the 30 day challenge today, wish me luck! Thanks for the inspiration everyone
enjoy it - i completed it a few weeks ago. it was eye opening and since completing it i think i am averaging around 1 beer per week as compared to 30-40+ beers per week prior.
i haven't purchased alcohol for 2 months, what a great new source of cash.
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@crusty badger- Congratulations one year is huge. I fell off a while, but am back on the wagon. It took the 30 day challeng ( plus 7 months or more) for me to see that I had minor withdrawal symptoms like bad mood after work even when I had a good day.
Good luck everyone!
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enjoy it - i completed it a few weeks ago. it was eye opening and since completing it i think i am averaging around 1 beer per week as compared to 30-40+ beers per week prior.
That's amazing @wannabe-stache !!
Yes to the increase in cash -- it's like you got a raise! (Unless you are already FIREd in which case you are getting a better return on your investments.)
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Indirect benefits: my husband has drastically reduced his intake now I don't drink. Between that and getting up at 6.30 to run with the dog*, the weight keeps heading downwards, which is a relief because the middle-aged spread was real.
*we can do that now! getting up is easy!
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I am halfway through the challenge! I did have two tiny sips of other people's drinks just to taste because it was something new, I don't think that counts? It's mostly been easier than I thought. I don't crave alcohol, but the hard part has been abstaining when I'm hanging out with friends in situations where we'd normally drink together. Have saved a bunch of money, but haven't noticed much else in terms of sleep or weight or how I feel.
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good work @PoutineLover !
In social situations, I have found that being really really excited about having a nice glass of ice cold water (or a Coke, or whatever) has been enough to make people not look at me oddly when I don't want a beer or a glass of wine. You have to really sell it.
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I just got back from a week long trip, which included lots of meals out with longtime friends who were 1) all drinking, and 2) with whom I have always imbibed. It mostly wasn't too difficult, though I did have about 5 difficult minutes a couple of nights...once when my friend had her husband run to the store specifically to get her wine for dinner, and another when I realized I had nothing available to drink at all but plain water. I have mentally earmarked such special occasions as ok to imbibe if I really want to, but in the end I found I didn't want to badly enough to do it. And I had just as much fun, regardless.
ETA: I am coming up on 6 months with only 2 glasses of wine during that time, which would have seemed near-impossible at the beginning of the year.
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@CrustyBadger I have been making sure I do have appealing alternatives like San pellegrino or Perrier with lime and ice. It sorta looks like a cocktail and I enjoy the taste. Luckily my friends aren't too pushy, it's more on my end that I feel like I'm doing something out of the usual.
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@CrustyBadger I have been making sure I do have appealing alternatives like San pellegrino or Perrier with lime and ice. It sorta looks like a cocktail and I enjoy the taste. Luckily my friends aren't too pushy, it's more on my end that I feel like I'm doing something out of the usual.
It is out of the usual, for you. But pretty soon it'll just become your normal.
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I finished my thirty days. It felt pretty good, and I didn't have a strong desire to start drinking again. However, I did have a cottage weekend planned so I decided to have some just to see how it felt. It was okay, and I drank less than usual but it felt weird drinking again and I think I want to do another break. It seems a lot simpler just to say no all the time rather than make up some arbitrary rules of when I will or won't have a drink. I have another event planned this upcoming weekend where I might drink but then maybe I'll start another challenge. Still not ready to say don't want to drink anymore, but I am actually strongly considering it, which I never though I'd do. How's everyone else doing?
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I did 30 days without alcohol recently. Then drank moderately for two days, Friday and Saturday of my sister wedding. Currently on day 9 again. I enjoy not drinking for health reasons, I just feel better and more energized. And I love my sleep, its like my superpower. Longest I have gone without is two years and a bit (Oct 2016-Dec 2018)
Saying No is definitely easier. The decision is made for you, so there is no extra thought needed. If you make arbitrary rules, you've got to make a decision to make. Decision fatigue will set in. I'm sure there is some scientific evidence to back this up, but I'm too lazy to find it.
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I think I'm going back to a 30 day no drink. I was really sleeping better by the end of Lent but drinking has crept back up to several drinks a week and my sleeping has gone downhill. I have an event this weekend for which I had already pre-purchased wine, but after that cold turkey for a while.
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Just passed 6 months since starting the 30 day alcohol free experiment. Only 2 pre-planned glasses of wine in that time, and I am confident I no longer want to be a regular drinker. Also, I recently realized that if my husband and I hadn't become regular drinkers 20 years ago and had invested the average monthly amount we spent on it, we would be close to 100K(!) richer right now.
I was just communicating with a much younger person than me, who had fallen into the habit of only socializing at bars, buying rounds, etc, and had recently realized they were spending more than 500$/month on drinking... Thankful we didn't ever get sucked into that world, and thankful for the extra hundred bucks I can throw at the investments, or charity, every month now.
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After having drank heavily for the past 20+ years, most recently 4-6+ beers/day for me, my wife and I are going for a minimum of 30 days booze free. First four days have been OK and we even made it through a 50th birthday party without being tempted. My skin feels better already, I feel less bloated and guessing that the excess pounds should start peeling off as well. And I'm already less irritable with the kids and feel more energetic in the mornings. I do enjoy beer but hoping we can keep it up and I can have a better relationship with alcohol into the future. And saving $400/mo will be a great bonus!
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Here is my (non) success story. I was drinking 4-5 days a week a glass of wine (90% red) to deciding to only drink 2 days a week. My problem: I am not spending any less money. Before: buy a bottle a week. Now still on average buy a bottle a week (maybe 3 weeks of no booze buying at all). however I end up often throwing out half a bottle because it is stale when I go back to it. 2nd I find I am not consuming any less calories. Initially having a cup of herbal tea hit the spot but I've been having the munchies and eat as much and often more than if I was having my glass in the evening : ( I think part of the problem is that with wine I might just have the wine, or a handful of olives or cheese and crackers, or maybe a piece of dark chocolate. Without the wine I end up craving sweets and end up eating a lot more (and worse) empty calories. It's possible I saved a tiny bit in that there were 2, 3 weeks I did not buy any wine, but not enough to notice in the monthly grocery bill.
Good news I've developed the habit of not drinking every day or close to every day. Bad news does not seem like I am saving anything in terms of health, calories or money. Most importantly, it hasn't helped me become more productive which was my main reason to do it. I'm glad to read of other success stories. I am going to change to a different target which is to make sure I am using my gym membership, to make sure I use it 2x a week. I went yesterday and it was a great feeling.
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Partgypsy, that was my experience too about 4-5 years ago when I quit drinking wine and other alcohol. I gained weight actually.
This time around, I also went on a low carb diet at the same time, and tried to cure myself of the late night munchies. Exercise instead of sitting and snacking helped a ton.
As to having to throw out a half bottle of stale wine -- seems like there must be a low tech solution to that. Don't they make vacuum pump cork things you can use to seal off the wine? Or buy wine in a bag. Or something else. Or ... give up wine totally and don't have to deal with the problem!
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@partgypsy When I gave up booze 2 years ago, there was a temporary spike in my weight but it has drifted down over the last 18-20 months and now I am stable at 9kg lighter than when I quit drinking. It did take some time.
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Alcohol is like a daily injection of pure sugar. When you stop, of course you're going to crave sugar! Don't beat yourself up about it, it's totally natural. Try cutting alcohol out completely for a month & have a plan in place to deal with the inevitable sugar cravings. Exercise is a very good strategy, even if it's just a short walk each time you feel a sugar craving. You can do it!
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Sugar was my biggest addiction, to the point I ate no added sugar for 4 years. It helped reset my craving level, but now it's getting worse. So I shouldn't say this is a failure, so much as a learning experience. In the same way doing (Orthodox) lent every year (where you also do not drink) while good spiritually, I feel less healthy eating zero animal products for an extended period of time (while if I cheat and eat a little dairy I feel much better. I'll stop going off topic but will be mentally setting minimum 2x a week gym or strenuous physical activity goal for myself and go from there, as I think my lack of physical activity has been my bottleneck for both the sugar cravings and also lack of focus.
I also wanted to add a success story though it is not mine. An old old friend had a very turbulent life as a musician, burning a number of bridges, moving often and yes, had a drinking problem. At some point he got off the booze and married. I am guessing he is in late 50's went back to school and is taking classes and making great progress while also being involved in many additional program activities in his department, including just finished being in a play as principal actor. So I am really glad for him, that he bought himself a second act. Given how productive he is now, I wonder if he ever kicks himself about how much more he could have done with his life when he was young in his 20's, 30's, 40's if he didn't have that anchor of alcohol around his neck.
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@partgypsy When I gave up booze 2 years ago, there was a temporary spike in my weight but it has drifted down over the last 18-20 months and now I am stable at 9kg lighter than when I quit drinking. It did take some time.
I didn't see any change in weight, when I gave up a habit of drinking about twice as much as partgypsy. I did temporarily eat a little more sugar while I gave up; I did this to help stave off cravings in the first couple weeks and b/c I was very worried about dropping any weight (which I can't afford to do). But my body really likes the weight I'm at, and after losing maybe 3 lbs initially, it stabilized right back where it had been.
Anecdotally, it seems like heavy beer drinkers see more notable weight loss after quitting, though I can't fathom why that would be true, objectively speaking.
I sure have saved money though! About 60$/per month, I think, if you subtract the 20$ or so that I now spend on replacement kombucha and bitters.
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Here is my (non) success story. I was drinking 4-5 days a week a glass of wine (90% red) to deciding to only drink 2 days a week. My problem: I am not spending any less money. Before: buy a bottle a week. Now still on average buy a bottle a week (maybe 3 weeks of no booze buying at all). however I end up often throwing out half a bottle because it is stale when I go back to it. 2nd I find I am not consuming any less calories. Initially having a cup of herbal tea hit the spot but I've been having the munchies and eat as much and often more than if I was having my glass in the evening : ( I think part of the problem is that with wine I might just have the wine, or a handful of olives or cheese and crackers, or maybe a piece of dark chocolate. Without the wine I end up craving sweets and end up eating a lot more (and worse) empty calories. It's possible I saved a tiny bit in that there were 2, 3 weeks I did not buy any wine, but not enough to notice in the monthly grocery bill.
Good news I've developed the habit of not drinking every day or close to every day. Bad news does not seem like I am saving anything in terms of health, calories or money. Most importantly, it hasn't helped me become more productive which was my main reason to do it. I'm glad to read of other success stories. I am going to change to a different target which is to make sure I am using my gym membership, to make sure I use it 2x a week. I went yesterday and it was a great feeling.
FWIW- this was my experience too. I gave up drinks for Lent and gained 5 pounds (was also drinking 3-5 a week with the occasional week where'd I'd hit a drink a day). I also noticed that I wanted to shop in addition to craving sugar. I really felt like I was just trading one vice for another.
The thing that I did notice was that by the end of 40 days I was sleeping better. I'm going to give it a shot again and see if I can keep the nighttime eating in check this time around.
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Forgot to post here, but I'm taking the month of September off, just to prove that I can (master of my own urges and all that). I didn't really drink much before - a six-pack of 24 oz Yuenglings per week.
I'm a little over two weeks in and don't really notice much difference: no urges, no weight loss, and no significant attitude change. The money saving is only $7/week, so that's not too noticeable, either.
I also started a 30-day stint with no alcohol on September 3rd, for similar reasons (prove that I can, see what changes occur in 30 days, etc.). I've been a 1-2 drinks per evening kind of person for a few years now.
So far, I've noticed a big change in ability to sleep through the night (almost immediately) as well as about a 7 lb. weight loss. I am definitely liking the decrease in expenses for the month (usually $75-$100 per month). If it ever cools down here, adding in more exercise will almost certainly boost my weight loss. Not too shabby for ~15 days.
Oh, and surprisingly, I have had very few urges for alcohol since stopping. An interesting case study, if nothing else.
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eta the guy I'm seeing suggested I just buy either no wine, or buy wine only every other week, and that way actually save on wine costs (drinking 2-3 drinks a week means throwing out 1/2 bottles of stale wine). It makes sense, and if I do that consistently will save around $260 a year. He also agreed that for me committing to regular physical activity will make the biggest difference for energy and productivity.
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My Update-- been booze free again last 4 months. Really felt a boost of energy after 3 months. I found a craft beer company that makes non alcoholic beer called Athletic Brewing. They actually ship the beer from CT. I am drinking the Upside Down ALE TASTE LIKE A REAL BEER, TASTE LIKE A 4% ALCOHOL WHEAT/BELGIUM BEER, No kidding! I also had the brown ale and the IPA.
I may never go back to drinking these beers are 60 calories.
I cant tell you how much i look forward to the mornings these days.
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My Update-- been booze free again last 4 months. Really felt a boost of energy after 3 months. I found a craft beer company that makes non alcoholic beer called Athletic Brewing. They actually ship the beer from CT. I am drinking the Upside Down ALE TASTE LIKE A REAL BEER, TASTE LIKE A 4% ALCOHOL WHEAT/BELGIUM BEER, No kidding! I also had the brown ale and the IPA.
I may never go back to drinking these beers are 60 calories.
I cant tell you how much i look forward to the mornings these days.
I remember when I quit drinking, after a few months I had a similar reaction. I was like "wait, you mean I can feel good in the mornings? What?"
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Jumping back in for January. Will allow myself a cheat day on the 4th though.
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I'm in!
I started a drug trial a few weeks ago, and it doesn't seem to be super compatible with alcohol. Going 100% alcohol free until our trip to Ireland in April where I will most certainly drink beer, which is fine as I almost never drink more than one, maybe two in a day.
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This thread has helped me immensely! I did quit 3 times between now and April 2018. Total months without alcohol over 2 years will be 16 out of 24 if I make it to April 2020, which I will. Everytime I go back to drinking I am dissapointed with drinking not being as good as I remember it being.
I will say that the quitting experienced has helped me cut back when I did go back to drinking. I only drank 3 beers at a time but so often that I drank 30-60 beers every month.
Congrats to everyone wo decided to make a change in 2020, and big shout out to Onemorebike who statred this threadback in April!
Keep us posted on your progress
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Likewise, I want to say Happy New Year and a heartfelt thank you to everyone who has participated on this thread. If I hadn't heard about This Naked Mind on this thread, and read everyone else's comments about how it had changed their thinking around alcohol, I am not at all sure I would have gotten the impetus to successfully quit my nearly 20-year-long wine-with-dinner habit. It would have been very hard to convince me how negatively that 2 drinks/day was affecting my mental health, but it's true. I feel better emotionally and mentally than I have since my 20s (when I was a very occasional imbiber). And all of you guys on this thread are a big part of the reason.
Thanks, again.
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OP here. This thread continues to amaze me, although I'm not the best at engaging with all the updates, I'm reading them and they are inspirational.
As an update for me, I stopped drinking in January 2018 and haven't had a sip since - it is truly unbelievable how different I am as a result. I've got the time, energy, and interest to pursue all of things I've always wanted to do but never made happen and life just feels richer. My presence in each moment is fuller and more apparent. Yes, I have more money for my mustache, but in spite of saving thousands a year, the real benefits have been in my quality of life with my family, friends and myself. (and my life previous to stopping was pretty privileged to start!)
Love seeing all of your hard work, keep it up.
-onemorebike
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I'm going to do dry January this year, very excited to have a sober month. It felt so good last time and then I slipped back into old habits. Drinking is mostly a social habit, and that was the hardest part of saying no. Not sure if I can make any commitments beyond the month now, but will see how I feel at the end of January. Going to have an uber frugal year so not drinking would definitely help.
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OP here. This thread continues to amaze me, although I'm not the best at engaging with all the updates, I'm reading them and they are inspirational.
As an update for me, I stopped drinking in January 2018 and haven't had a sip since - it is truly unbelievable how different I am as a result. I've got the time, energy, and interest to pursue all of things I've always wanted to do but never made happen and life just feels richer. My presence in each moment is fuller and more apparent. Yes, I have more money for my mustache, but in spite of saving thousands a year, the real benefits have been in my quality of life with my family, friends and myself. (and my life previous to stopping was pretty privileged to start!)
Love seeing all of your hard work, keep it up.
-onemorebike
It's been over 6 years for me and I feel exactly the same way.
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Dry January begins. I do this every year to remind myself that it is possible and there is not a dependency. After my life got blown up in 2017 by my X Asshat I feared that I would rely too much on the firewater to avoid being present in my own brain. Glad to say I have not slid down into despair with that self-medicine but it is good to check myself regularly.
Good luck to all who are similarly undertaking a period of abstinence for clarity, godspeed to all who have made it a lifelong choice for their own personal, heartbreaking reasons, and to those doing it for purely financial reasons, rock on with your badassity!
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I did Drynuary for the first time last year - jumping in again now. One change is I am making an exception for parties (one with friends Friday, and our work holiday party was snowed out and will probably be this month). I really enjoy my wine with dinner and don't plan on stopping long-term, but the month reset seems like a good thing. @MissNancyPryor I love "to remind myself that it is possible."
Also started the Winter Wildebeest (https://forum.mrmoneymustache.com/throw-down-the-gauntlet/january-challenge-winter-wildebeest-(like-winter-warrior-but-free)/) thread because last year the combo of no alcohol and 3 miles outside every day felt like a challenge worth tackling. Only aiming for 2 miles daily this time.
Great to hear everyone's inspirational stories! Happy 2020 to all!
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Way to go, @onemorebike ! I'm glad you started this thread. It was the impetus for me to give up alcohol and my life is much better for it.
I stopped drinking in August 2018 and haven't had a sip since, either! Just realized I went through two friends' Thanksgivings; 2 family Christmases; and 2 New Year's Eve parties with friend since then. All these events are typically places where fancy beer, wine and cocktails are featured. Yet I had no trouble just abstaining.
I do find I am more emotionally present, more balanced, and have a great ability to solve problems. I am not noticing significantly better sleep however. Am gearing myself up to try to cut back or give up coffee now, as I am drinking far too much. I had such success with Annie Grace's "Alcohol Experiment" a year and a half ago and am wondering if there's something similar (an online support group/educational program) for quitting caffeine? Anyone know?
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Outstanding Crusty Badger!!!!
I also quit caffeine but am back on it. I quit easily without withdrawal because I weaned myself down. I used 2 sccops decaf adn 2 scoops regular coffee then down to 1 scoop regular and 3 scoops decaf. I did that over a month.
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Checking in here again!
Last year I did about 50 days w/o alcohol in the spring. Really enjoyed it, and felt slimmer. Not drinking a whole lot anymore after that (2-3 drinks/week), but wanted to do a dry January this year.
Best wishes to everyone else who is doing this!
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2 days down.
I'm a wine with dinner person, so that's when I feel like something is missing. I'm prone to having very entrenched habits, so developing new ones is easy for me, but breaking old ones makes me pretty cranky.
Instead of wine, I went to the gym for my endorphins.
I was planning on hitting the pool every time I wanted wine, but the damn pool is closed for 6 weeks, so gym it is.
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2 days down.
I'm a wine with dinner person, so that's when I feel like something is missing. I'm prone to having very entrenched habits, so developing new ones is easy for me, but breaking old ones makes me pretty cranky.
Instead of wine, I went to the gym for my endorphins.
I was planning on hitting the pool every time I wanted wine, but the damn pool is closed for 6 weeks, so gym it is.
OMG our pool just reopened today after 3 weeks closed, and I hit that pool like some sort of very flabby, water-obsessed, middle-aged floaty toy LOL. Last year it was closed for about 2 months for repairs, and I was so desperate that I spent a truly unmustachian sum on a 6 month membership at a private swim club pool. Which was really nice, but BOY was it expensive. But swimming really helps my chronic pain, plus I have trouble meditating except when I'm swimming, so it was like a double hit of relief today. Not to mention that I thought my carb-laden rear end was going to meld to the couch this past couple weeks...
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2 days down.
I'm a wine with dinner person, so that's when I feel like something is missing. I'm prone to having very entrenched habits, so developing new ones is easy for me, but breaking old ones makes me pretty cranky.
Instead of wine, I went to the gym for my endorphins.
I was planning on hitting the pool every time I wanted wine, but the damn pool is closed for 6 weeks, so gym it is.
OMG our pool just reopened today after 3 weeks closed, and I hit that pool like some sort of very flabby, water-obsessed, middle-aged floaty toy LOL. Last year it was closed for about 2 months for repairs, and I was so desperate that I spent a truly unmustachian sum on a 6 month membership at a private swim club pool. Which was really nice, but BOY was it expensive. But swimming really helps my chronic pain, plus I have trouble meditating except when I'm swimming, so it was like a double hit of relief today. Not to mention that I thought my carb-laden rear end was going to meld to the couch this past couple weeks...
This is officially my favourite post I've read in a very long time.
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Back into this. No booze from January 2nd until April 27th. I have a few bets going since there are 3 of us involved.
This should really help me since I am also trying to reach other goals regarding finances and health to do a roadtrip to Arctic Ocean and Alaska.
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
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Had my first challenges yesterday, first had dinner at my SIL's where I normally drink pretty freely, not only that, but we brought her champagne, which I love.
Then after that, was invited to a party of new friends I recently met in my building. They're a bit younger, there were tons of drinks, and this is only my second time hanging out with them, which can be kind of awkward when you are the only one not drinking. Plus, I wouldn't have had to worry about driving home.
Anyhoo, both events went smoothly and the whole thing was a lot easier than I expected. No one flinches when you say "I can't drink because of my drug trial."
A few times I almost instinctively poured wine into my empty water glass, but I caught myself quickly.
Overall, I found I really didn't miss it, but I did find I had a lower tolerance for trying to yell-talk to people over very loud music.
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I think I’m in.
Growing up, it was always important to me that I not be one of “those people” who made a habit of drinking every night. I even carefully chose a DH who was not a habitual drinker. Then, over time, I found myself having a glass of wine 5-7 nights a week, then two glasses and, finally, oftentimes three.
I’d always been an excellent sleeper, but was finding myself to no longer be a good sleeper. I chalked it (and increased anxiety) to middle age.
Sometime in early 2018 I established a self-imposed two drink limit, but found it easy to ignore more often than I liked.
A major family traumatic event in late summer/early fall caused me to intentionally cut back my alcohol consumption as I was fearful it would be too easy to use alcohol as a tool to help me cope with the family matter. I knew it was important to deal with this very trying emotional situation with a clear head.
I’ve had occasional drinks in the past several months, and at both Thanksgiving and Christmas. I had one glass of wine on 12/26 or 12/27, but nothing since. I’ve also lost 12 pounds without trying since this all began in late August.
I recently started reading this thread and got This Naked Mind from my local library. I’ve read this thread in its entirety and I’m intrigued. I’m currently about 10-15 pages into the book.
I don’t know whether I’ll stop drinking altogether or just do a reset, with the plan to go back to very occasional consumption of 1-2 drinks. I’ll figure that out as I go along.
At this time, I’m sleeping better and I can feel a difference in my mood (+) energy (+) and anxiety (-) levels. I am totally in for Dry January.
Thanks to onemorebike for starting this thread and to everyone else who has posted their story and how they’re doing.
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In for another year! Honestly at this point I don't think I will ever drink again but I quite like the act of choosing this because it is the right path for me. Sleep continues to be amazing, as is the overall reduction in my background anxiety levels.
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In for another year! Honestly at this point I don't think I will ever drink again but I quite like the act of choosing this because it is the right path for me. Sleep continues to be amazing, as is the overall reduction in my background anxiety levels.
Well done. You should be proud.
After seeing what alcohol has done to some close family memebers over the past year or two, I have been telling myself for the past 6-8 months or so to give up booze. I'm 33, married, 1 kid, so we don't party like we are in our 20s, but we have a great group of friends that we do gather with every 3-4weeks and there's always a hangover the next day. I have successfully eliminated all booze except for those monthly-ish "parties".
What was the hardest part for you? Any behaviours you started doing to replace the habit? Any tips for a wannabe like me?
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Some thoughts
-I don't think I mentioned, but DH is happy to go along with whatever I want to do on this front. He's extremely active and health conscious, so it's great to not be on my own in this.
-Yesterday we set stakes: if one of us slips up, we have to take on the worst chore that the other person normally does for a set amount of time.
-I am an intense creature of habit, so I'm seriously considering quitting red wine permanently. Red wine was my go-to stress reliever during my doctorate, and it became part of my day to day life.
I don't even like alcohol or its effects, even if I were having a major wine craving, another form of alcohol could be placed in front of me, and I wouldn't drink it.
I'm not sure what my future relationship with alcohol will be. I don't need to make that decision now, but I've committed to cutting out red wine for the year, which will probably be indefinite. I feel like those established neural patterns could so easily be rekindled, so it's not worth the risk of retriggering a habit I don't want.
I mean, if I don't even like the part that's poison, then why have a habit that's poisonous???
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In for another year! Honestly at this point I don't think I will ever drink again but I quite like the act of choosing this because it is the right path for me. Sleep continues to be amazing, as is the overall reduction in my background anxiety levels.
Well done. You should be proud.
After seeing what alcohol has done to some close family memebers over the past year or two, I have been telling myself for the past 6-8 months or so to give up booze. I'm 33, married, 1 kid, so we don't party like we are in our 20s, but we have a great group of friends that we do gather with every 3-4weeks and there's always a hangover the next day. I have successfully eliminated all booze except for those monthly-ish "parties".
What was the hardest part for you? Any behaviours you started doing to replace the habit? Any tips for a wannabe like me?
You’re not gonna fit in at your monthly party anymore. That’s just a fact. If everyone drinking to “always hungover” then you’re just gonna be the sober guy/people around whilst everyone else has too many so be aware of that. It might be fine the first time or two but after that you will get bored of being around drunk people.
More facts. You end up hanging around with people like you in this life: education level, income level, drinking level, kid level etc.
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Some thoughts
-I am an intense creature of habit, so I'm seriously considering quitting red wine permanently. Red wine was my go-to stress reliever during my doctorate, and it became part of my day to day life.
I don't even like alcohol or its effects, even if I were having a major wine craving, another form of alcohol could be placed in front of me, and I wouldn't drink it.
I'm not sure what my future relationship with alcohol will be. I don't need to make that decision now, but I've committed to cutting out red wine for the year, which will probably be indefinite. I feel like those established neural patterns could so easily be rekindled, so it's not worth the risk of retriggering a habit I don't want.
I relate to a lot of this. There seem to be two main patterns of drinkers...the daily habitual drinkers that are not inclined to binge, and those that respond super intensely to one hit of alcohol and then have trouble finding an 'off' switch. Eventually, of course, because of building tolerance, many of us with a built-in 'off switch' end up becoming bingers by default. It seems like people who are genetically and physiologically wired to be 'strong responders' from the early days really struggle with moderation in any form.
What I am interested in, like you, is the question of successful moderation if you are a habitual, psychologically dependent drinker (like I was), but never a natural binger. That's an interesting experiment in progress.
I didn't plan to give up alcohol entirely, but only to quit my decades-long habit of evening wine. I did that, don't miss it, and have had ~6(?) drinks total since I did that alcohol-free month about 9 months ago. There were no particular occasions that I 'looked forward to/planned to drink'...it's more like I no longer make drinking part of my daily routine, but I'm not interested in beating myself up on the rare occasions I do still drink or putting a bunch of special rules on it. My only hard rule is...no more wine with dinner at home b/c that was 90% of my lifetime drinking and that routine involves the vast majority of my triggers.
So far, I haven't had any desire to look for 'special occasions' to drink more often (i.e., I'm not going out with friends more as an excuse or whatever, and I've socialized plenty of times without it in the past 9 months). But I AM wary of drinking very often, b/c of the inbuilt brain wiring around it. So I can see where just taking it completely off the table might simply become easier.
At any rate, I'll keep reporting in how it's going over the next few years.
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So far so good with the alcohol, but I did slip up with smoking. I meant to stop both for the month since I don't want smoking to replace drinking, even though I do them for different reasons. But I had an activity planned with some friends that I thought would be more fun if I joined in, and it was. But I did say no to offers of wine and beer, and it wasn't a big deal at all. Still going to keep up the challenge.
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In for another year! Honestly at this point I don't think I will ever drink again but I quite like the act of choosing this because it is the right path for me. Sleep continues to be amazing, as is the overall reduction in my background anxiety levels.
Well done. You should be proud.
After seeing what alcohol has done to some close family memebers over the past year or two, I have been telling myself for the past 6-8 months or so to give up booze. I'm 33, married, 1 kid, so we don't party like we are in our 20s, but we have a great group of friends that we do gather with every 3-4weeks and there's always a hangover the next day. I have successfully eliminated all booze except for those monthly-ish "parties".
What was the hardest part for you? Any behaviours you started doing to replace the habit? Any tips for a wannabe like me?
You’re not gonna fit in at your monthly party anymore. That’s just a fact. If everyone drinking to “always hungover” then you’re just gonna be the sober guy/people around whilst everyone else has too many so be aware of that. It might be fine the first time or two but after that you will get bored of being around drunk people.
More facts. You end up hanging around with people like you in this life: education level, income level, drinking level, kid level etc.
It depends. People may surprise you. It turns out *I* was part of the problem - refilling people's glasses etc, and without that, the people I hang out with drink less than I had assumed. I still go to book (wine) club every month, and it's better because I self-regulate instead of talking over people.
1- know that there will come a point in a party where you will want to go home. Booze is getting into people and the volume is rising, people start to repeat themselves. The boose esters start coming out. Cut out at this point, it gets boring unless you can divert to a dance floor or something like that.
2- have a drink in your hand! I found the habitual patterns easier to break with a substitute. It also gives you a reason to refuse a round.
3- I tried naltroxene at the early stages and it was both weird and good. It turns out that with the buzz receptors blocked, you actually taste what you are drinking and it's often - not very nice? I was surprised to learn I hate the taste of wine. I am happy to drink half a non-alcoholic beer but wine smells bad.
4- some people see amazing changes immediately, it took me about 6 months for a lot of the positives to kick in and they were subtler than I expected. Losing 100g a week doesn't sound like much, but 2 years later you're 10kg lighter.
It is often good to start off during a challenge, dry July, because people understand it but then there can be pressure to resume. I found quitting on a super random Sunday near the end of a month worked for me because I was always near a milestone that I wanted to reach - so close to a week/a month/ nearly a calendar month--until the patterns were set.
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Great thread, and I'm inspired by the stories.
I jumped on Dry January this year as a little bit of a check-up. We've gotten on the wine-with-dinner train more than I wanted to acknowledge. Two drinks a night with dinner, and you're on the border of "heavy" drinking.
I guess this is day #6 now, and I'm pleased that it's been no big deal to abstain. A friend of mine quit altogether a few years ago when he tried to take a break and realized he had serious physical withdrawal symptoms, which worried me. Good news is that I haven't noticed it physically one way or the other.
Behaviorally, I do find that I've been drinking more herbal tea in the evening. I've found I'm just as happy to drink tea as I am to drink wine or beer.
Socially, it hasn't been any big deal. We've already been through multiple dinners and parties where the drinks are free flowing, and it's been fine not to participate. I just had the first "let's get happy hour" email come through my inbox of the month, which does reinforce how much alcohol is part of our culture, but I'm much more aware of it when I'm not participating in the drinking part.
So it's all good news so far. This is the first time since high school (almost 20 years!) I've deliberately stayed away from hooch for an extended period, and fortunately it's all been positive.
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I make my own kombucha and do a secondary fermentation to get bubbles and add flavor. I find that it can do the job when I am jonesing for something different on the tongue that is immensely refreshing. Depending on the flavor it can have the bite of a beer or be tart with my own berries from the garden, or perfume-y with lavender if I am in the mood for subtlety.
I have enjoyed learning how to do this over the last 2 years. Even with very high quality ingredients it costs less than 15 cents a bottle. Post-secondary ferment it gets down to essentially zero sugar with untraceable alcohols. Good stuff.
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Almost 14 years sober (will -- I hope -- hit that mark in April) and plan to do what is necessary to stay that way in 2020. I have a great life but I won't if I start drinking again. I am so grateful to have put down the booze.
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Daaaamn
This Naked Mind is pretty solid stuff.
As a former neuroscience researcher, with specific education in both addiction and sleep science, it takes some pretty opaque science and lays it out quite effectively, plus I can see the neurolinguistic programming in the writing.
Interesting read, thanks for the recommendation.
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Daaaamn
This Naked Mind is pretty solid stuff.
As a former neuroscience researcher, with specific education in both addiction and sleep science, it takes some pretty opaque science and lays it out quite effectively, plus I can see the neurolinguistic programming in the writing.
Interesting read, thanks for the recommendation.
Yes, it's quite good...seems to take a lot of inspiration from cognitive behavioral therapy techniques. There's a few inaccuracies (such as Grace's belief that sugar cravings that often accompany giving up drinking are influenced by the fact that most alcohol is composed primarily of sugar...it isn't AFAIK) but they are sort of immaterial to the helpfulness of the material (in the sugar example, the cravings are likely caused by the brain searching for a substitute hit of dopamine, etc., and finding it with sugar...it probably doesn't matter where the sugar cravings come from).
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I have decided that I must get off the alcohol. I sleep like crap when I have a drink in the evening. I sleep like crap in general. But worst when I have a drink in the evening.
I have gotten in the habit of having a what I call a sip at 8pm. After the kid goes to bed and dinner dishes are cleaned up. It could be a glass of wine, a gin and tonic, or a old fashion. But I need to ditch all of those options.
But I do not want to give up my sip and conversation with the hubby.
I was was with my 82 year old friend yesterday and she was saying how she puts a splash of flavored balsamic vinegar in club soda. I tried it yesterday and man it was so good. I found some chocolate flavored balsamic vinegar from the local oil and vinegar shop. I still slept like crap last night. But here is the hope that having this sip instead of the alcohol in a few weeks I will sleep better.
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I was was with my 82 year old friend yesterday and she was saying how she puts a splash of flavored balsamic vinegar in club soda. I tried it yesterday and man it was so good. I found some chocolate flavored balsamic vinegar from the local oil and vinegar shop. I still slept like crap last night. But here is the hope that having this sip instead of the alcohol in a few weeks I will sleep better.
This is a really cool idea. I got a pack of different flavours of balsamic vinegar for Christmas, so I'm definitely going to try this.
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I've thrown my hat into the ring on this. I've given up alcohol for a few weeks at a time in the past, and I recently drank way too much on a long distance trip and spent all night worshiping the porcelain god in the motel bathroom. I just really screwed up and drank 4 craft IPAs, a Natty Daddy (if I buy one of these it should be a red flag that I'm already too wasted) and finished my partner's bottle of wine all in one night.
The 300 mile drive home in a blizzard really sucked the next day.
My normal drinking is 1-3 High Life cans/bottles 3-5 days a week.
4 days in! There is one High Life sitting in the back of the fridge whenever I feel ready to partake again.
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I just really screwed up and drank 4 craft IPAs, a Natty Daddy (if I buy one of these it should be a red flag that I'm already too wasted) and finished my partner's bottle of wine all in one night.
Had to google what a Natty Daddy was. Oh my gosh. That sounds like enough for a whole night in itself, but also a really bad decision anyway.
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Yesterday was my first day back at work in nearly 3 weeks, and it was a god damn cluster fuck where I spent a solid 10 hours in a low level rage.
I come home late on Tuesdays, right around when DH goes to bed, so he definitely doesn't want to deal with my chaotic psycho energy. So it's been a typical routine to say a quick hello, shower the filth of my job off of me, cozy up on a lounger with a book and a kitten, and sink into a few glasses of aromatic red.
Last night the option just didn't seem appealing. I can't really drink water at work because I don't have time to pee, so the exact same routine with some nice hydrating water sounded A LOT better. Not waking up totally dehydrated sounded great!
One really great benefit of this whole Annie Grace thing is that I'm not feeling any need to try and substitute for alcohol. On previous rounds of reducing alcohol, I always struggled to find decent substitutes, and they were perpetually disappointing. My brain wants what it wants, hence why I wouldn't even drink a substitute alcohol when what I wanted was wine.
This time I don't even feel the need to bother with substitutes. Even last night, the water wasn't an alternative to wine, I was drinking it because I needed hydration. I drank it quickly and then went drinkless for the remainder of my wind down ritual and I didn't feel anything was missing.
I have a history of responding extremely well to CBT, so I'm not terribly surprised.
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Two weeks down, still easy and getting easier.
Just about finished This Naked Mind, and listening to Allen Carr's book on audiotape, which I think I actually prefer. Overall, seriously expecting to decide to not drink again, period. Have definitely decided to give up red wine for at least a year.
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I’m also 2+ weeks into this. I actually figured out 12/28 was the day I last had a drink, a glass of Prosecco at a show.
I’m about halfway through This Naked Mind and my eyes are wide open. I’ve listened to about 10 of her podcast episodes. No desire whatsoever to drink and I’ve even been around people who were drinking several times, no issue at all.
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12.5 years.
Thank you Dr. Bob and Bill and many, many others.
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I'm posting to follow.
I am on the fence as this is something I would love to try, but so much of my social life involves drinking - going out for dinner and sharing wine, or going over to someone's house and bringing some nice wine to share. Also my husband and I really enjoy opening a bottle of wine on weekends and finishing it off in one night.
However, it's starting to affect my sleep as I get older. I notice that after drinking just one glass of wine in the evening, I wake up in the middle of the night and toss and turn for a while.
I just ordered The Naked Mind from the library. I think I'm looking for more motivation to take a break from alcohol. I have a really stressful job so it does help me unwind, however I'm looking into meditation as well, and I think developing a meditation practice and calming the mind that way might be a healthier unwinding tool.
Hope you don't mind a fence-sitter joining the group. I appreciate the book advice and maybe I'll be further inspired by your journeys here.
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MNN Donuts,
I think you should get the book and also consider signing up on Annies Grace site the alcohol experiment, 30 days of videos to help you experiment with sobriety for 30 days. I learned alot in those 30 days about my relationship with alcohol. Welcome to the thread and good luck even if lurking only.
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MNN Donuts,
I think you should get the book and also consider signing up on Annies Grace site the alcohol experiment, 30 days of videos to help you experiment with sobriety for 30 days. I learned alot in those 30 days about my relationship with alcohol. Welcome to the thread and good luck even if lurking only.
I second this.
The Alcohol Experiment is actually best suited to start while you are still drinking, so it's the perfect time for you to sign up. I signed up about 4 days after quitting, and I genuinely feel like I missed out a bit on the process.
The whole thing isn't about quitting necessarily, it's about learning exactly what role you want alcohol to play in your life. It just so happens that once a lot of us start looking closely at the role of alcohol in our lives, that we actually *want* to give it up completely, but that's not at all a necessary outcome of the experiment.
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Thanks Malkynn and BIkeFanatic for the recommendation - I signed up!
I like the idea of just being mindful of the actual effects of booze to see what's really happening. I watched her videos about the experiment and I could see that it might be true, that alcohol provides an initial rush but that rush fades away quickly and leaves me feeling worse than I felt before having a drink.
Glad I posted here, thanks for the encouragement and we'll see how this goes! I'm going to start with that - just noticing how I feel before, during, and after that first glass of wine.
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When I drink I definitely notice effects on my sleep. I wake up, toss and turn, and I feel less rested in the morning. Two weeks into dry January now and I'm feeling really good. No temptations really, other than an event where some of my teammates tried to get me to drink. I had to say no a few times, but I was pretty comfortable with it and I think I was able to make them understand why I don't want to give in. Last year I made a few exceptions for special events in January, but by the end of the month it didn't even really feel like I had given up drinking. My dry month in August was much better, I made no drinking exceptions. I'm going to approach the next decision though: do I stop a week early because I'm going on vacation, or do I have a dry vacation? Thoughts are welcome.
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When I drink I definitely notice effects on my sleep. I wake up, toss and turn, and I feel less rested in the morning. Two weeks into dry January now and I'm feeling really good. No temptations really, other than an event where some of my teammates tried to get me to drink. I had to say no a few times, but I was pretty comfortable with it and I think I was able to make them understand why I don't want to give in. Last year I made a few exceptions for special events in January, but by the end of the month it didn't even really feel like I had given up drinking. My dry month in August was much better, I made no drinking exceptions. I'm going to approach the next decision though: do I stop a week early because I'm going on vacation, or do I have a dry vacation? Thoughts are welcome.
A dry vacation will certainly be cheaper.
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When I drink I definitely notice effects on my sleep. I wake up, toss and turn, and I feel less rested in the morning. Two weeks into dry January now and I'm feeling really good. No temptations really, other than an event where some of my teammates tried to get me to drink. I had to say no a few times, but I was pretty comfortable with it and I think I was able to make them understand why I don't want to give in. Last year I made a few exceptions for special events in January, but by the end of the month it didn't even really feel like I had given up drinking. My dry month in August was much better, I made no drinking exceptions. I'm going to approach the next decision though: do I stop a week early because I'm going on vacation, or do I have a dry vacation? Thoughts are welcome.
Depends.
Do you want to be able to enjoy vacations without alcohol?
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My SO went from drinking fairly heavily to stopping cold-turkey in October. I’ve been dry since then, too, in support. He has no desire to drink again, so I guess we are both dry until further notice.
I didn’t drink much prior, but I’m happy to have it out of my life, honestly. It took my dad in his early 50s and both sides of my family have a significant history of alcoholism.
Plus, our dates are *so* much cheaper now.
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I'm finding this Drynuary much easier than last year's, but I am allowing myself to eat more sugar. I have a pot of decaf tea right when I would normally start drinking wine and it's a good replacement. I do sleep more soundly but I was really hoping for better dream recall, which hasn't happened - if anything recall is worse. And still have had a couple of insomnia nights so it's not a cure-all. But as a reset it's so helpful. I'm thinking maybe I'll do Dry July at some point too, as for me the reset seemed to wear off about halfway last year. Great to hear from everyone on this thread!
For me a no-sugar month would probably be even harder/better. Some day.
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@PoutineLover I would try a dry vacation, heck I had a dry honeymoon in Hawaii and it was fun to see what delicious non-alcoholic drinks bartenders would make.
I am about to do my second dry family reunion, something I never thought I could do. It's easier to enjoy it now the old scripts are less likely to be triggered.
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Haven't drank since January 2nd, had a few moments when I tried to make an excuse to myself just to have a few pints. As usual, the hardest part is social and my friends are mostly not drinkers, I am the one that enjoys kicking back a few every Thursday that we meet up. I have a goal set to late April, if I fail, it will cost me money since there is a 3 way bet going.
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I'm posting to follow.
I am on the fence as this is something I would love to try, but so much of my social life involves drinking - going out for dinner and sharing wine, or going over to someone's house and bringing some nice wine to share. Also my husband and I really enjoy opening a bottle of wine on weekends and finishing it off in one night.
However, it's starting to affect my sleep as I get older. I notice that after drinking just one glass of wine in the evening, I wake up in the middle of the night and toss and turn for a while.
I just ordered The Naked Mind from the library. I think I'm looking for more motivation to take a break from alcohol. I have a really stressful job so it does help me unwind, however I'm looking into meditation as well, and I think developing a meditation practice and calming the mind that way might be a healthier unwinding tool.
Hope you don't mind a fence-sitter joining the group. I appreciate the book advice and maybe I'll be further inspired by your journeys here.
I was absolutely a fence-sitter when I first started reading this thread (which I incorrectly assumed was going to be full of judgemental tee-totalers), and I spent a couple weeks as a fence-sitter, drinking mindfully and absorbing some of Annie Grace's material and that of other websites/podcasts...and by the end of it, I WANTED to try it. I think it's actually helpful to really pay attention to your drinking just before you start, or in the first couple days of the experiment.
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When I drink I definitely notice effects on my sleep. I wake up, toss and turn, and I feel less rested in the morning. Two weeks into dry January now and I'm feeling really good. No temptations really, other than an event where some of my teammates tried to get me to drink. I had to say no a few times, but I was pretty comfortable with it and I think I was able to make them understand why I don't want to give in. Last year I made a few exceptions for special events in January, but by the end of the month it didn't even really feel like I had given up drinking. My dry month in August was much better, I made no drinking exceptions. I'm going to approach the next decision though: do I stop a week early because I'm going on vacation, or do I have a dry vacation? Thoughts are welcome.
Well, you say that you aren't drinking now and you feel really good, and you are sleeping well and wake rested in the mornings. So, why not continue that good feeling into your vacation?
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RE Drinking or not on vacation, whatever you do please don't be miserable and white knuckle it your entire vacation. I would maybe be sober first few days and if you want to then do indulge the last few days. Plan on another 30 days in February. I feel like you need the right attitude like some one said sober curious. I wanted to try life without alcohol. I also feel 30 days is not enough time to change habits around drinking. Although the energy boost was real and I felt that early. I actually felt best at around the 3 months mark.
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RE Drinking or not on vacation, whatever you do please don't be miserable and white knuckle it your entire vacation. I would maybe be sober first few days and if you want to then do indulge the last few days. Plan on another 30 days in February. I feel like you need the right attitude like some one said sober curious. I wanted to try life without alcohol. I also feel 30 days is not enough time to change habits around drinking. Although the energy boost was real and I felt that early. I actually felt best at around the 3 months mark.
I think if PP wants to try an alcohol free vacation, then some prep with This Naked Mind, Allen Carr's book and/or The Alcohol Experiment 30 day challenge would be a good idea.
Trying to white knuckle it would be a terrible idea.
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Thanks for all the perspectives. I would like to read the book first, unfortunately my library doesn't have it though. I already did the thirty day challenge for my last sober month.
I'm not so concerned about white knuckling it or not enjoying it because I'm dry. I'm going to be the only driver, so I wouldn't be drinking all the much anyway. It's mostly that a big part of traveling for me is trying local food and drink, and often alcohol is a good part of that.
Right now I'm thinking a good compromise would be to allow drinks, but only stuff I can't get in Canada (and only in moderation and when I'm not driving obviously). And then when I come back, extend to dry February. The month of dryness itself is arbitrary, and I'm not planning on quitting completely yet. It seems silly to make myself miss out on interesting new drinks only to go back to the same old stuff right after I get back.
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If you've already done Annie Grace's 30 day alcohol experiment, then consider Allen Carr's book.
I find that Annie's content is largely based on Allen's book, but his style is very different.
Or did you mean that you've just already done 30 days sober, not The Alcohol Experiment 30 days?
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I have almost reduced my alcohol consumption to zero - not quite. I am coping with PTSD symptoms that were diagnosed in May 2019. Having a drink seems to make the symptoms worse. I am finding the cultural aspects of partaking challenging. Last time I wasn't drinking, I was pregnant and that is so easy for everyone to accept.
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If you've already done Annie Grace's 30 day alcohol experiment, then consider Allen Carr's book.
I find that Annie's content is largely based on Allen's book, but his style is very different.
Or did you mean that you've just already done 30 days sober, not The Alcohol Experiment 30 days?
I did the alcohol experiment, and skimmed most of the emails. Reviewing it now, I realize that I never did the journal questions and I didn't always read deeply, because I figured I was doing fine saying no on my own. Going through it now, I think doing the work might help me actually challenge the baseline assumptions I have instead of just checking off days. After that, maybe I'll buy the book.
I almost wish I was pregnant just so I'd have an easy reason that people wouldn't challenge. It's sort of irritating to hear stuff like "oh, are you still doing that? Just take one cheat day" or "if you don't have an alcohol problem then you don't need to stop" or people asking me if I'm pregnant. Drinking culture is so engrained in my friends and family and no one really understands why I might want to stop. I don't even consider myself a really heavy drinker, but having tracked my consumption before I drink about 1/3 days and almost 10 drinks/week on average so the upper limit of guidelines for women. I also find I've been slowly putting on weight and is like to reverse that trend before it gets worse. Physical activity and good nutrition are important too, but there are a lot of wasted calories in booze.
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Yeah, the program is very much based on CBT and you have to pay attention and do the exercises for that to work properly.
Some people are highly responsive to CBT and others aren't. I find it also depends on how the rest of your life looks as well. If your life is a dumpster fire, a morning email, a 12 minute video, and some journaling probably isn't going to suffice to resolve using alcohol as a self medication.
However, if it's a moderate habit, you are a mentally healthy person, and you are just looking to alter a pattern of behaviour, then it's probably more than enough to get a great result.
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Re: drinking on vacation, I think the main thing is to make sure you try to go at least some of the time not drinking (so your subconscious can get a sense that you don't require a drink to have a good time). If you do drink, try to do it as mindfully as you would if you were deep in the 'experiment' phase, and see exactly what you get out of it. The half dozen or so drinks I've had since doing the AE back in March were nearly all on various trips/vacations, and it was educational. A couple of them seemed extremely pleasant, others were 'meh'. Overall, it's nice to know I sure don't have to drink on vacation to make the vacation experience 'complete' and I am sure going forward that I don't want to go through life planning to drink as part of every trip, or looking forward to my next 'cheat day'.
Whatever you do, don't start guilt-tripping yourself or thinking, "It's too hard to stay AF, so screw it!" If you want to live mostly alcohol free, but find yourself drinking more on vacation that you really wanted to, then simply recommit when you get home, where you have more control over your routine, etc.
Re: doing the AE exercises, I agree that people won't get nearly as much out of that program if you don't do (or try to do) all of them. But I do great with CBT, so I might be biased.
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I gave in last weekend and had a few beers out of boredom. Honestly, even though they were Miller Lites I still felt kinda crappy the next day. Part of that could have been the atrocious sleep I got due to some loud animals in the house.
I have been abstaining since and things seem to be going well. I'm not gonna claim that I notice any cognitive or emotional improvements. I'm just doing the same things after work I normally would, but drinking water instead.
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So, y'know how I said that I really felt like I was missing out by starting the experiment after I had already quit? Well, I purposefully drank two nights ago as an experiment.
Annie and Allen both hammer home over and over again that alcohol tastes bad and getting drunk actually feels awful, but my memories just wouldn't support that. So despite having no cravings and no desire to drink, I opened a bottle of wine and observed it objectively.
Well...that was eye opening. Yikes.
Wine is disgusting.
It literally smells and tastes like gasoline, probably because it has basically gasoline in it. It wasn't until the third glass that my senses went numb enough for it to stop making me shudder with each gulp from the gas pump.
Remember how I said previously that I loved wine but didn't think I had an alcohol habit because I won't touch other booze? Yeah, turns out it's that I *did* have an alcohol habit, but wine was the only form that I had ever had the discipline to acquire a taste for. *Hellllo late teens wine coolers!*
Now that I don't want it, it tastes just like gin, vodka, whisky, etc, all of the other ethanol based drinks that I can barely choke down without making a face. I declared in my mid 20s "I'm over pretending to like whiskey, I don't care what anyone thinks about the fact that I fucking hate whiskey"
Just like Annie described in her drinking experiment, while drinking, I did nothing of any real interest. I worked on some mindless tasks that needed to be done but were neither challenging nor rewarding or interesting.
Wow, getting drunk was awful. I mean, really awful. I thought I liked that early, light buzz feeling, but it turns out that without the craving to relieve, it just feels like my head getting heavy and my balance being messed up.
Oh, and once DH got home, I became super self conscious about the fact that I sounded like a damn moron every time I spoke. I was just into my second glass at that point.
I drank a total of 500ml of wine before I just couldn't take it anymore. I was so bored, and eventually gave in and watched some TV. Ironically it was an episode of Big Love where one of the Mormon sister wives decides to start drinking wine and I kept thinking "oh, she's so fucked"
I also kept thinking "that's total BS! There's no way a 50 something woman who has never had any alcohol is going to be able to take her first sip of wine and find it drinkable. Piss off with that nonsense."
I purposely did this the night before work so that I would get the full experience of my next day suffering, and oh man, did I ever. Wow. What an awful way to wake up. Yesterday at work was like moving through molasses with rocks in my head.
In the end, I'm really glad I did it as now both my conscious and sub conscious mind are 100% bought in to the notion that it tastes awful and does nothing for me. I can comfortably tuck all of those drinking memories of the past few decades away as misrepresentations of reality that serve no purpose for future decision making.
Less than 3 weeks ago, I firmly believed that a full bodied red wine was the most refined, aromatic, and enjoyable flavour in the world, to be savoured, valued, and profoundly enjoyed. I come from a family that regularly hires a sommelier to curate the wine served at our parties.
Now it's spoiled grape flavoured gasoline that makes me foggy, stupid, and clumsy.
Talk about a paradigm shift.
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@Malkynn, thanks for sharing your experience.
I spent the week at a work event where there was a lot of drinking. I abstained and, you know what, it was no big deal at all. I didn’t feel awkward or like I was missing out. A few colleagues asked if I was no longer drinking, but other than that it was no big deal. No one pressured me to drink and I never felt like I was missing out on any fun. I’ve enjoyed not having a drinking fog, I’m sleeping better, anxiety has gone down and I feel more energetic.
I haven’t specifically said anything about my drinking (or lack thereof) to my DH, although he has seen that I’m reading This Naked Mind. He told me this morning that he hasn’t had a drink since the new year began and he hasn’t missed it. My own experiment seems to be resulting in positives for both of us.
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So, y'know how I said that I really felt like I was missing out by starting the experiment after I had already quit? Well, I purposefully drank two nights ago as an experiment.
Annie and Allen both hammer home over and over again that alcohol tastes bad and getting drunk actually feels awful, but my memories just wouldn't support that. So despite having no cravings and no desire to drink, I opened a bottle of wine and observed it objectively.
Well...that was eye opening. Yikes.
Wine is disgusting.
It literally smells and tastes like gasoline, probably because it has basically gasoline in it. It wasn't until the third glass that my senses went numb enough for it to stop making me shudder with each gulp from the gas pump.
Remember how I said previously that I loved wine but didn't think I had an alcohol habit because I won't touch other booze? Yeah, turns out it's that I *did* have an alcohol habit, but wine was the only form that I had ever had the discipline to acquire a taste for. *Hellllo late teens wine coolers!*
Now that I don't want it, it tastes just like gin, vodka, whisky, etc, all of the other ethanol based drinks that I can barely choke down without making a face. I declared in my mid 20s "I'm over pretending to like whiskey, I don't care what anyone thinks about the fact that I fucking hate whiskey"
Just like Annie described in her drinking experiment, while drinking, I did nothing of any real interest. I worked on some mindless tasks that needed to be done but were neither challenging nor rewarding or interesting.
Wow, getting drunk was awful. I mean, really awful. I thought I liked that early, light buzz feeling, but it turns out that without the craving to relieve, it just feels like my head getting heavy and my balance being messed up.
Oh, and once DH got home, I became super self conscious about the fact that I sounded like a damn moron every time I spoke. I was just into my second glass at that point.
I drank a total of 500ml of wine before I just couldn't take it anymore. I was so bored, and eventually gave in and watched some TV. Ironically it was an episode of Big Love where one of the Mormon sister wives decides to start drinking wine and I kept thinking "oh, she's so fucked"
I also kept thinking "that's total BS! There's no way a 50 something woman who has never had any alcohol is going to be able to take her first sip of wine and find it drinkable. Piss off with that nonsense."
I purposely did this the night before work so that I would get the full experience of my next day suffering, and oh man, did I ever. Wow. What an awful way to wake up. Yesterday at work was like moving through molasses with rocks in my head.
In the end, I'm really glad I did it as now both my conscious and sub conscious mind are 100% bought in to the notion that it tastes awful and does nothing for me. I can comfortably tuck all of those drinking memories of the past few decades away as misrepresentations of reality that serve no purpose for future decision making.
Less than 3 weeks ago, I firmly believed that a full bodied red wine was the most refined, aromatic, and enjoyable flavour in the world, to be savoured, valued, and profoundly enjoyed. I come from a family that regularly hires a sommelier to curate the wine served at our parties.
Now it's spoiled grape flavoured gasoline that makes me foggy, stupid, and clumsy.
Talk about a paradigm shift.
Great post. I know what you mean about becoming super aware of that transition during the second glass of wine; when I pay attention to what I'm feeling and doing, I start wanting to clap my hand over my own mouth about halfway through my second drink LOL. Ironically, I notice that is also where I start to turn 'internal'...into my own head in a weird way, and don't engage as well with whomever I'm talking to.
However, I must say that the 'alcohol tastes like crap thing' still hasn't struck me, almost a year out.. I still truly enjoy the taste...my small handful of drinks in the past year has included 1 IPA (still delicious), 1 G&T (unbelievably f*ing delicious...this is the flavor I really want to work on replicating without the gin [maybe with herbs and juniper berries] b/c it's so amazing), red wine (still love the taste), and imported Irish whiskey (delicious and smells fantastic...so fantastic that I actually make my husband drink his whiskey at least several feet away from me at all times).
Alas, I doubt taste is ever going to keep me away! That's ok, though...lots of other reasons not to drink.
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I had a slightly similar version of Malkynn's experiment but with Naltrexone. Turns out that with the buzz blocked from hitting your pleasure receptors, you can actually taste what you are drinking and wine tastes not great. I ended up asking Ofpym if the wine was spoiled (it wasn't) and stopped before finishing my first glass.
I sometimes drink 3/4 of a NA beer and enjoy it, but generally if I am looking for the IPA bite I'll have grapefruit juice in soda water. If I want something that feels fancy, I'll have one of the Italian NA aperitifs. A company in Melbourne makes NA spirits for the G&T yearners.
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So, I'm on day 4 of the Alcohol Experiment.
I haven't had a drink though in over a week - maybe 8 or 9 days ago. It was a glass of red wine at home at the end of a tough day.
So far I can't say I've had any cravings. But what's been going through my head has been figuring out what to do about future social events. This coming Tuesday I have plans to go out with friends for dinner and drinks and this makes me worry. I still haven't decided what to do - whether to abstain or just try it out. I suppose this would be a good time for the testing to begin: thinking about how I feel before, during, and after the first drink.
I've also been thinking - I just love the taste of wine! So your post above was interesting, Malkynn. We'll see if my taste preferences remain true by the end of the 30 days.
Other observations so far - I have had a couple of terrible sleeps the past couple of nights. Waking up in the middle of the night and not being able to fall back asleep for hours, tossing and turning with racing thoughts and worries (mostly about nothing.) This is the type of thing that happens when I DO drink. So I don't really understand why it's happening now. Could this be part of the process of alcohol leaving my system, since it takes ~ 10 days? Or coincidence?
I am curious how it all goes down. I don't feel like I have a physical dependency (though could be fooling myself.) Mostly for me it is psychological. It seems like I drink to a) socialize and have fun and b) to relax after a stressful day and c) as entertainment / bonding with my hubby, who is very interested in wines and regions and all that stuff. So my worries and fears relate to those 3 major triggers.
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Donuts, if you haven't done a social event sober, then it's a really good idea just to try it. It won't hurt you and you will learn a lot more by not drinking than by drinking. You already know what socializing is like with alcohol.
In my first week I had a few alcohol intense events and I had some stress leading up to them, but getting through them easily took all of the pressure off of anticipating future alcohol filled events. It really is a non issue most people just won't care.
Also, the experiment I did was to specifically drink while not doing anything even remotely fun, so that I could observe what the effect of the alcohol alone was. I cracked and watched TV eventually because I was so painfully bored and miserable. The point was to observe without distraction. I could not have done that experiment socializing with friends.
The reasons I did what I did was because I had already pretty much decided I didn't want to drink ever again. I wasn't testing my limits, I was putting the last nail into the coffin.
I'm quite positive that if I still had some subconscious urge to drink, that wine still would have tasted good. It's not hard to lose an acquired taste, but it's also pretty easy to hold on to.
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You're right - it would be better to do that wine test at home in a quiet setting where I can really focus internally.
I'm also starting a meditation program right now so the whole idea of cognitive dissonance and working through internal conflicts is very interesting. It's just part of being human! So this is a good testing ground for ALL of it, as it relates to so many things in life.
And I like the gentle / non-judgmental approach. It's all about getting curious about how the mind works vs cycling through having willpower or not.
I'm quite positive that if I still had some subconscious urge to drink, that wine still would have tasted good.
That is a really cool litmus test for the subconscious!
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I am not sure when I posted that I was giving up the Hooch. And I can say life is so much better without it. I have shrunk out of my leggings. I sleep so much better. I am enjoying sex again, I can handle my 9 year old and her banter. I have been trying to lose weight for a long time. I also have changed my workouts to much more yoga, walking and pilates and holly hell I am so much more calm.
I also found a podcast that was very eye opening to me. It lists a basic 75 day challenge. 1 45 minute workout outside, 1 45 additional workout, follow a diet plan you plan for yourself, 1 gallon of water, a progress picture, and reading 10 pages in a book that you learn something.
Something about this really spoke to me. I will link the podcast. It is not the most pc one out there and if you can get through the noise the message is pretty amazing. This might help someone.
https://andyfrisella.com/blogs/mfceo-project-podcast/75hard-a-75-day-tactical-guide-to-winning-the-war-with-yourself-with-andy-frisella-mfceo291
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I quit drinking in April 2016.
I can't say life has changed all that much. More cash in my pocket I suppose. And I did used to think alcohol equated to being social and that's entirely untrue. I can go out with other people who are drunk and have a good time. I doubt I'd want to clubbing though. Then again I'm past that age being in my early 30s anyhow. I'm not 21 anymore haha!
I didn't have a problem with booze. I quit originally as I flew to Thailand for a fitness holiday and figured if I'm going to do this I';ll do it right so no booze. And I just never went back to the booze. Now an again I get a thought of a beer or something else would be really go right about now. But that's really it. Nothing more.
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I stopped drinking in November 2006 for religious reasons and didn't touch a drop of alcohol again until November 2018.
Ditching organized religion and having the occasional drink again are two of the best decisions I've ever made. Why? Because both decisions make me happy.
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I stopped drinking in November 2006 for religious reasons and didn't touch a drop of alcohol again until November 2018.
Ditching organized religion and having the occasional drink again are two of the best decisions I've ever made. Why? Because both decisions make me happy.
Um...
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I stopped drinking in November 2006 for religious reasons and didn't touch a drop of alcohol again until November 2018.
Ditching organized religion and having the occasional drink again are two of the best decisions I've ever made. Why? Because both decisions make me happy.
Um...
I thought about umming here too but figured I'd just let it be.
Sent from my moto g(6) using Tapatalk
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I stopped drinking in November 2006 for religious reasons and didn't touch a drop of alcohol again until November 2018.
Ditching organized religion and having the occasional drink again are two of the best decisions I've ever made. Why? Because both decisions make me happy.
Um...
I thought about umming here too but figured I'd just let it be.
Sent from my moto g(6) using Tapatalk
I tried so hard to leave it alone, I really did...
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I went out for dinner last night with friends and had a mocktail. Nobody asked why I wasn't drinking, everyone else had their glass of wine and it was NBD. I felt no need to make any sort of big pronouncement. Such a relief!
I did feel a little twinge of wanting a glass of wine though. I find I'm drinking more sweet stuff when I go out just as a treat (or distraction!) but I don't usually drink mocktails or juice. So in terms of drinking experience I would rather be drinking wine and I guess I felt a bit bitter about that.
BUT - I am sleeping better now. I've had 2 great sleeps. So far the pluses are outweighing the minuses.
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I stopped drinking in November 2006 for religious reasons and didn't touch a drop of alcohol again until November 2018.
Ditching organized religion and having the occasional drink again are two of the best decisions I've ever made. Why? Because both decisions make me happy.
Um...
I thought about umming here too but figured I'd just let it be.
Sent from my moto g(6) using Tapatalk
I tried so hard to leave it alone, I really did...
Why the um...
Is there an issue with what I posted?
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I think its been 2 full weeks now not drinking. It wasn't intentional though. I was sick the week before last so having a drink wasn't appealing.
I am also super broke atm and need to ration funds until tax returns. So I literally can't afford it right now.
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I stopped drinking in November 2006 for religious reasons and didn't touch a drop of alcohol again until November 2018.
Ditching organized religion and having the occasional drink again are two of the best decisions I've ever made. Why? Because both decisions make me happy.
Um...
I thought about umming here too but figured I'd just let it be.
Sent from my moto g(6) using Tapatalk
I tried so hard to leave it alone, I really did...
Why the um...
Is there an issue with what I posted?
It's uncool to post about how much you love alcohol in a thread dedicated to people giving it up.
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I stopped drinking in November 2006 for religious reasons and didn't touch a drop of alcohol again until November 2018.
Ditching organized religion and having the occasional drink again are two of the best decisions I've ever made. Why? Because both decisions make me happy.
Um...
I thought about umming here too but figured I'd just let it be.
Sent from my moto g(6) using Tapatalk
I tried so hard to leave it alone, I really did...
Why the um...
Is there an issue with what I posted?
It's uncool to post about how much you love alcohol in a thread dedicated to people giving it up.
It's certainly an interesting choice.
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I haven't been drinking much alcohol recently -- a beer or glass of wine with dinner about 1-3 times per week on average for most of last year. But my wife and I kind of fell into a dry-January thing without really intending to. I've had one beer this month. There was a stray bottle in the fridge that I was tired of looking at, so I impulsively decided to drink it one evening. It wasn't very satisfying.
My wife and I have both noticed improved sleep quality this month, and I think it's reasonable to attribute some of that to not having any alcohol in the evenings. The other big thing is that not buying a bottle or two of wine while grocery shopping each week (my wife had a near-daily glass of wine) has cut around 10% from our grocery bill.
We're going out to eat and to a concert in a couple weeks, and I do look forward to enjoying a good draft beer (or two) that evening. But otherwise I think we're both happy not drinking alcohol on a regular basis.
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I stopped drinking in November 2006 for religious reasons and didn't touch a drop of alcohol again until November 2018.
Ditching organized religion and having the occasional drink again are two of the best decisions I've ever made. Why? Because both decisions make me happy.
Um...
I thought about umming here too but figured I'd just let it be.
Sent from my moto g(6) using Tapatalk
I tried so hard to leave it alone, I really did...
Why the um...
Is there an issue with what I posted?
It's uncool to post about how much you love alcohol in a thread dedicated to people giving it up.
It's certainly an interesting choice.
I don't know, y'all. It sounds like this person gave up booze for as long as they pleased. That's the whole name of the thread. Congrats to DrinkCoffeeAndStackMoney for enjoying a healthy relationship with an occasional drink, and congratulations to every one else who is choosing another route!
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I stopped drinking in November 2006 for religious reasons and didn't touch a drop of alcohol again until November 2018.
Ditching organized religion and having the occasional drink again are two of the best decisions I've ever made. Why? Because both decisions make me happy.
Um...
I thought about umming here too but figured I'd just let it be.
Sent from my moto g(6) using Tapatalk
I tried so hard to leave it alone, I really did...
Why the um...
Is there an issue with what I posted?
It's uncool to post about how much you love alcohol in a thread dedicated to people giving it up.
It's certainly an interesting choice.
I don't know, y'all. It sounds like this person gave up booze for as long as they pleased. That's the whole name of the thread. Congrats to DrinkCoffeeAndStackMoney for enjoying a healthy relationship with an occasional drink, and congratulations to every one else who is choosing another route!
JPS,
You got the whole point of my original post, others didn't, which is fine. My post was never intended to offend anyone but maybe it did.
I was just posting my experience with alcohol and my current point of view that the occasional drink brings joy to me and is now looked at as a simple pleasure of my life.
Regardless, good luck to those trying to give up the booze.
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Posting to follow and contribute.
In my life I probably had about 10 years of consistent moderate to binge drinking from the age of 17 to 27. That covers late high school, through university and about 5 years post university in the adult world. It wasn't a problem. I drank less than a lot of the people I know. Looking back however, it was riddled with issues, mainly around mood, mild anxiety and really poor sleep, compounded by the fact that drinking often meant staying up late. All my friends were the same, but that's what young people do, right? They drink a lot and allegedly have fun doing it.
My drinking dropped off in 2009 because I started spending less time with friends who liked to party and because I realised that being quite drunk whenever I was socialising (which wasn't that often) really hindered my ability to make friends and meet a lady.
Once I started dating my wife in 2011, my drinking really dropped, because all socialising was in large groups of couples, or in small groups of couples. It was more adult, more polite, more refined. No more "Shooters then a club!"
Then from about 2014 onward my drinking decreased again. I noticed that without thinking about it I'd have 2 or 3 drinks in fairly quick succession at the start of the night and then stop drinking completely because experience had shown me that drinking more made me feel crap, both at the time and the day(s) after.
On my wedding reception night (3 weeks after the actually wedding) in November 2015, I had 2 drinks, and only enjoyed the first drink and a half. By this point I was basically T-Total i.e. I could comfortably go for 4 months without drinking, and then have a couple of drinks at a social event and go back to months of not drinking. I remember I got really drunk on about 8 drinks one weekend in 2017 and then didn't drink again until November 2017.
In July 2019, I finally decided to stop drinking. Why? Because by that point in the year I'd had a total of about 5 alcoholic drinks since January 1st, 2019, and each time I had just one drink on a given day, I woke up in the night, really hot, really uncomfortable and didn't feel right the next day. Maybe not a hangover (not a severe one anyway), but a realisation that the very minimal enjoyment I got from consuming alcohol, was now massively outweighed by the negative effects the following day.
Also, I discovered at Christmas 2018 that my 22 year old cousin no longer drank because he did a placement year abroad whilst at university. He went to Texas for 9 months and after watching countless people get really fucked up at parties, and not really liking the taste of it, he decided he was done. He also has an alcoholic Uncle (who is a dumpster fire) providing him with extra motivation. I was inspired by my cousin. At his age I was a dick. So I decided to quit.
I only have one friend who I don't see that often who may have a slight issue with it (because he really does drink too much and likes everyone around him to be drinking if he is) but other than that nobody has said anything. My wife supports it but does seem to think it's a phase, no matter how many times I tell her that's it, I'm done. I don't get any cravings, I don't like the taste, I don't enjoy it. It doesn't enhance my socially.
Funny experience was standing in a bar in the middle of everything on the work Christmas do, and watching everyone around me go from being sober professionals to oversized drunk toddlers in the space of about 4 hours, and then seeing them the following morning in the office looking like ghosts and complaining about it.
I like not drinking. I like the simplicity of it. There's no debate of when, where, what, how much or who with. All those variables and decisions are eliminated. I don't drink. At all. Simple. It's really freeing.
Reading about @Malkynn 's experience was awesome. I haven't gone through anything that immediate, but I think I've unwittingly conducted the same experiment at a slower rate over a much longer period of time.
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Following and possibly joining.
Up until the end of last year, I was regularly having two glasses of wine or servings of liquor every night. Not all at once—I’ve never liked being drunk—but one after I finished working and another after dinner. I liked the smell and taste and (let’s be honest) the mild, warm fuzzy sensation.
I’ve cut way back since the new year, mostly thanks to new dietary restrictions due to husband’s health issues, and now maybe have one drink on 3 or 4 nights per week. I don’t crave it and have intended to consider it a treat since I actually do enjoy the flavor of some wines, whiskeys, and tequilas (I don’t ever do shots).
Two recent incidents are giving me pause regarding that strategy.
First, we went out on a date night a couple of weeks ago: sushi and green tea at a good restaurant, followed by a round of after-dinner drinks. I ordered a martini, one of my previous favorites, and noticed right before I took a sip that the gin smelled like lab solvent (which is one use for ethanol). Even on a full stomach, I was plastered off of that one drink (I vaguely remember asking my husband if there was ketamine in it) and felt awful the next day. I’m done with gin (and by extension, vodka).
Second, I had an absolutely horrible day earlier this week. I decided for some reason that it would be a good idea to have a serving of whiskey that evening, followed by a large glass of wine. Nope. I caught myself babbling about random shit at husband, had to restrain myself from responding to all emails in my inbox and posting drivel on all forms of social media, and then had weird dreams and poor sleep all night. Woke up the next morning with a headache, stomachache, and overall ickiness and craving greasy “hangover” food (which I don’t normally eat).
I’m not ready to say that I won’t ever drink alcohol again, but I’m done drinking as a habit. Even though one drink early in the evening doesn’t seem to affect my sleep, etc., it isn’t something I need to have. More than that clearly has terrible effects. And the thought of drinking gin again is actually repulsive.
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I’m not ready to say that I won’t ever drink alcohol again, but I’m done drinking as a habit.
I think that's a wise way to approach it. From the rest of our post, I see you've already tuned into the negative affects, so in the future just being more intentional about if/when you choose to consume alcohol is an excellent policy. Habits can be good things or insidious things, and it's pretty clear that alcohol consumption falls into the latter category.
Even though one drink early in the evening doesn’t seem to affect my sleep, etc., it isn’t something I need to have.
It's possible that one drink early enough won't substantially affect your sleep. That depends a lot on how much alcohol was in the drink, and individual differences in metabolism. But from what I've read and experienced, even a small amount of alcohol can be enough to impact your sleep quality to some degree.
I rarely or never dream (or at least remember dreaming) the night following a drink or more after dinner. That implies a disruption in REM sleep, and REM is thought to be an important component of the restorative effects of sleep. The long-term health effects of "somewhat" reduced sleep quality are hard to quantify, but given the importance of sleep on all aspects of our health, it's not something I want to roll the dice with. Or at least not very often!
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How is everyone doing?
Still happily booze free here while all of my IRL Dry January compatriots are back to drinking, so I've lost a bunch of my sober buddies :(
I've been to a bunch of open bar events with no issue, but I have identified one thing that I do genuinely miss about being a red wine drinker: having a not cold beverage.
It's bloody cold where I live for half the year, and often I'm in dresses at these events while the men are in suits, so the temp is set for them not to overheat. I get chilly and then order this stupid cold glass of soda water that they always put ice in, even when I ask them not to.
I'm not loving that my only beverage options are ice cold all the time.
At restaurants I can order tea at least, although I hate shitty sawdust in a bag tea, but at open bar events, the only option I have is to clasp a freezing cold glass in my already freezing cold hand. There don't seem to be any room temperature non alcoholic options.
So yeah, cold drinks is my main struggle with quitting alcohol, so I'm considering that a win.
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Nice job sticking with it, Malkynn.
So yeah, cold drinks is my main struggle with quitting alcohol, so I'm considering that a win.
Lol, that sounds a little aggravating. But still a win regardless.
My intention wasn't necessarily to go completely dry, but I've only had two drinks since the beginning of the year. One beer in January on a whim (didn't really enjoy), and one last week at a concert (enjoyed). I'm ok with an occasional drink like that, which will probably work out to about once a month most months. I feel great, and I'm sleeping great, and I have no desire to have a drink as a part of my normal daily/evening routine. Oh, and I'm loving the lower grocery bill. :)
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How is everyone doing?
So far so good! I am on day 25 of the Alcohol Experiment, but I hadn't had a drink before that since early January, so I'm pretty sure I've done over 30 days. It's been pretty great in terms of how I feel - I do feel more clear-headed, I've been sleeping better, definitely less stressed out. I feel more able to handle things when TSHTF. So, that's all good.
Struggles so far have been minimal. I feel a little left out when others are drinking things I used to enjoy, mainly wine and the occasional cocktail. I've discovered a couple tasty mocktails though and have been drinking a lot of flavoured water and herbal tea. I could see the cold weather / cold drink thing being a drag, especially since alcohol seems to have a warming effect. I haven't had to hang out in bars (yet) but I find restaurants have enough non alcoholic options that I like.
It's been 100% worth the minimal struggles. I don't really feel any urge to go back to drinking!
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I am just over 5 months this go round, I do feel great. Mostly I attribute feeling good to the improved sleep. I was tempted today at a bar, and seems alcohol is everywhere. Plan is for a year or more so I am hanging in there. Most days i am fine without it.
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I decided to pause dry January to drink on vacation, and tbh it was a bit disappointing. The beer wasn't that interesting and the liquor tasted like vodka which I don't even like. So it felt like a waste of breaking dry January. I decided to do dry February to make up for it and a week in I am glad I'm still doing it. The more I don't drink, the more I don't enjoy drinking.
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Was feeling the desire to drink rather strongly yesterday when I posted. Triggered by the beer Taps, and reaction to fighting with my spouse, going out with drinking friends later. But I did abstain, and I had a good time without the booze, and maintaining my sobriety for another who knows how long. I guess time away makes me forget the bad and romanticizing the good. The beer taps were inviting but when I look back it was just crappie beer that I had before, plain and regular flavor, typical trailer show stuff.
I did try this non alcoholic beer called athletic brewing and I am very impressed with the non alcoholic brew, I had the stout and my spouse had the IPA. They are out of Connecticut and have mail order. I can’t wait to try it on draft. To me taste like a 4% beer.
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So glad to have found this thread! I quit for 2020 and don’t plan to ever start again. For me, it was the fact even though I didn’t drink often (maybe every 6 weeks or so) I always over drank and was hungover. Add to that I smoke when I drink, I was plain tired of feeling like crap! I love feeling great! Can’t wait to read this thread entirely-best of luck to everyone!
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Smoking is the worst! Nothing good ever come of that. Hope you can stay away from both. Good luck, and check in when you can
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Following and possibly joining.
Up until the end of last year, I was regularly having two glasses of wine or servings of liquor every night. Not all at once—I’ve never liked being drunk—but one after I finished working and another after dinner. I liked the smell and taste and (let’s be honest) the mild, warm fuzzy sensation.
I’ve cut way back since the new year, mostly thanks to new dietary restrictions due to husband’s health issues, and now maybe have one drink on 3 or 4 nights per week. I don’t crave it and have intended to consider it a treat since I actually do enjoy the flavor of some wines, whiskeys, and tequilas (I don’t ever do shots).
Two recent incidents are giving me pause regarding that strategy.
First, we went out on a date night a couple of weeks ago: sushi and green tea at a good restaurant, followed by a round of after-dinner drinks. I ordered a martini, one of my previous favorites, and noticed right before I took a sip that the gin smelled like lab solvent (which is one use for ethanol). Even on a full stomach, I was plastered off of that one drink (I vaguely remember asking my husband if there was ketamine in it) and felt awful the next day. I’m done with gin (and by extension, vodka).
Second, I had an absolutely horrible day earlier this week. I decided for some reason that it would be a good idea to have a serving of whiskey that evening, followed by a large glass of wine. Nope. I caught myself babbling about random shit at husband, had to restrain myself from responding to all emails in my inbox and posting drivel on all forms of social media, and then had weird dreams and poor sleep all night. Woke up the next morning with a headache, stomachache, and overall ickiness and craving greasy “hangover” food (which I don’t normally eat).
I’m not ready to say that I won’t ever drink alcohol again, but I’m done drinking as a habit. Even though one drink early in the evening doesn’t seem to affect my sleep, etc., it isn’t something I need to have. More than that clearly has terrible effects. And the thought of drinking gin again is actually repulsive.
Best of luck to you! I’ve had plenty of hungover mornings, panicking to see if I said anything stupid on social media or sent any cringe-worthy texts the night before. For me, it’s either no drinking, or I’m drunk. There’s not much in between.
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Smoking is the worst! Nothing good ever come of that. Hope you can stay away from both. Good luck, and check in when you can
It is the worst! And thank you, I plan to check in regularly. Great topic.
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Triggered by the beer Taps, and reaction to fighting with my spouse, going out with drinking friends later. But I did abstain, and I had a good time without the booze, and maintaining my sobriety for another who knows how long.
Sorry about the fight with your spouse. That's even worse than struggles with alcohol temptation IMO. :/ I'm glad you did abstain though!
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Following and possibly joining.
Up until the end of last year, I was regularly having two glasses of wine or servings of liquor every night. Not all at once—I’ve never liked being drunk—but one after I finished working and another after dinner. I liked the smell and taste and (let’s be honest) the mild, warm fuzzy sensation.
I’ve cut way back since the new year, mostly thanks to new dietary restrictions due to husband’s health issues, and now maybe have one drink on 3 or 4 nights per week. I don’t crave it and have intended to consider it a treat since I actually do enjoy the flavor of some wines, whiskeys, and tequilas (I don’t ever do shots).
Two recent incidents are giving me pause regarding that strategy.
First, we went out on a date night a couple of weeks ago: sushi and green tea at a good restaurant, followed by a round of after-dinner drinks. I ordered a martini, one of my previous favorites, and noticed right before I took a sip that the gin smelled like lab solvent (which is one use for ethanol). Even on a full stomach, I was plastered off of that one drink (I vaguely remember asking my husband if there was ketamine in it) and felt awful the next day. I’m done with gin (and by extension, vodka).
Second, I had an absolutely horrible day earlier this week. I decided for some reason that it would be a good idea to have a serving of whiskey that evening, followed by a large glass of wine. Nope. I caught myself babbling about random shit at husband, had to restrain myself from responding to all emails in my inbox and posting drivel on all forms of social media, and then had weird dreams and poor sleep all night. Woke up the next morning with a headache, stomachache, and overall ickiness and craving greasy “hangover” food (which I don’t normally eat).
I’m not ready to say that I won’t ever drink alcohol again, but I’m done drinking as a habit. Even though one drink early in the evening doesn’t seem to affect my sleep, etc., it isn’t something I need to have. More than that clearly has terrible effects. And the thought of drinking gin again is actually repulsive.
Best of luck to you! I’ve had plenty of hungover mornings, panicking to see if I said anything stupid on social media or sent any cringe-worthy texts the night before. For me, it’s either no drinking, or I’m drunk. There’s not much in between.
Best of luck to you too! This thread has been really eye-opening, and I thank everyone for sharing their insights and progress.
I’ve had a total of three drinks in the past week.
One was a hard cider at a Super Bowl party, mainly because my friend had bought them so I would have a gluten-free beer alternative (I have celiac disease so beer is right out). It was overly sweet and unnecessary, and I stuck with diet soda the rest of the night.
The second was a serving of my favorite whiskey over plenty of ice while out for dinner on Friday. That was a genuine treat. The price alone kept me from wanting to order a second. We then went home and had big glasses of ice cold club soda.
The third was last night, a small glass of red wine with dinner. I poured it because it was the first time I’d had beef since Christmas. It tasted okay, but was completely unnecessary.
The only one of those drinks I truly enjoyed was the whiskey. The others were either politeness or habit. Being more mindful has really given me some good insights about drinking. I don’t miss it when I don’t have it, and it rarely adds anything when I do. Plus, it’s expensive in many more ways than financial.
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Was feeling the desire to drink rather strongly yesterday when I posted. Triggered by the beer Taps, and reaction to fighting with my spouse, going out with drinking friends later. But I did abstain, and I had a good time without the booze, and maintaining my sobriety for another who knows how long. I guess time away makes me forget the bad and romanticizing the good. The beer taps were inviting but when I look back it was just crappie beer that I had before, plain and regular flavor, typical trailer show stuff.
I did try this non alcoholic beer called athletic brewing and I am very impressed with the non alcoholic brew, I had the stout and my spouse had the IPA. They are out of Connecticut and have mail order. I can’t wait to try it on draft. To me taste like a 4% beer.
I've also had some cravings the past few days, for no particular reason as far as I can tell...mild crabbiness with ordinary-if-annoying life events has led me to be a little irritable when my husband pours his beer or whiskey. I blame February...historically, my mood always goes to complete depressive shit during this month. Relatively speaking, I'm actually doing really well mood-wise in general this winter, so I just need to remember to GO OUTSIDE every sunny day, and be more conscious of how I manage my moods. Spring will be arriving (most likely) in 6 weeks.
One thing I am sure of...although I have very occasionally had a drink since I gave up my daily drinking habit almost a year ago, the sure sign that I should NOT be considering having one is when I actively have a nagging desire for one...I'm no longer feeding that default response to random stress.
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I rarely had a drink when my kids were younger and still at home, about the time they left for college, I herniated a couple of discs in my back and had sciatica and back pain. I started having a couple of drinks in the evening, and it became a regular ritual. This went on for eight or nine years, until just recently. Over the last six or eight months I'm finding, after a lot of suffering, my back pain has dwindled and keeping my fingers crossed, I rarely have any pain. The bottle is just sitting there and I have no interest, if I wasn't so frugal, I'd dump it out :-)
I went through multiple MRI's, exrays, physical therapy, acupuncture, surgery consults, and recently, it just seems the pain is rarely felt. Two things happened, We had a hurricane with lots of damage to our home requiring me to work my butt off for months, (often in great pain) and at the same time we retired as our business was destroyed. Our business required my to constantly do heavy lifting.
Either all the work changed my back, or all the lifting at work, exacerbated the back pain, and stopping was the help/cure. Or it could be, the herniated disc was finally reabsorbed.
Anyway, I just lost my interest in alcohol.
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I too have felt the urge in the last week. Thus far in Feb, I've had 2 drinks total. (Canned sparkling wine that I split with my spouse). I have a few bottles of wine in the closet and 8 more coming. I have a tendency to acquire wine from my wine clubs in Jan and Feb and March and then save them up until our Sunday potluck moves from breakfast to dinner.
January wasn't as great - I went to a few parties and had a few drinks. Then I drank a bottle the last week my husband was traveling. It took a full 7 days to get through it though!
What helps me - as @wenchsenior said is that when I feel the urge, if I stop and ask myself why, it goes away. Usually it's no real reason. I've found so far this year that I am relaxing by doing a lot more reading and playing board games with my kids. My husband will be traveling a lot in March, I'll have to develop a good tea habit.
Anyway, I had no goals for Feb, really. Basically my loose goals for the year are
1. Don't go to the winery to have a glass (it's free for members) - not hard, cuz I'm busy.
2. Don't buy wine at the store (fail for Feb with the 2 cans). That's the hardest part for me - when I want a glass of wine, I only want ONE. I don't want to open a bottle.
3. Don't open an existing bottle unless you are sharing with 2 other people.
I see it with some friends and acquaintances that it becomes a crutch. People sometimes drink a LOT and it is habit forming!
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I am so SO thankful I stopped all but very occasional drinking last year (after being a near daily drinker for decades). It has done wonders for my baseline anxiety level. One of my sisters has a personality very similar to mine and reacts to stress similarly. She is still a regular drinker, and her anxiety has been absolutely through the roof this past 2 weeks. Whereas I have been pretty damn chill, all things considered. But I can see in her exactly how I would have been reacting had I still been in my previous regular drinking mode.
A little over a year ago, I would have used this crisis as a reason to 'loosen up' on my 2 drinks/day rule, and things could have gone south in a hurry, depending on how long this crisis lasts.
Just feeling really thankful right now. Good decision, me!
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I am so SO thankful I stopped all but very occasional drinking last year (after being a near daily drinker for decades). It has done wonders for my baseline anxiety level. One of my sisters has a personality very similar to mine and reacts to stress similarly. She is still a regular drinker, and her anxiety has been absolutely through the roof this past 2 weeks. Whereas I have been pretty damn chill, all things considered. But I can see in her exactly how I would have been reacting had I still been in my previous regular drinking mode.
A little over a year ago, I would have used this crisis as a reason to 'loosen up' on my 2 drinks/day rule, and things could have gone south in a hurry, depending on how long this crisis lasts.
Just feeling really thankful right now. Good decision, me!
Nicely done!
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I have to agree that the drinking really doesnt help the anxiety and it also makes it worse IMO. Great job everyone.
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Same, super happy to be not drinking through this whole thing. I can really see now how that would not help the situation.
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I am so SO thankful I stopped all but very occasional drinking last year (after being a near daily drinker for decades). It has done wonders for my baseline anxiety level. One of my sisters has a personality very similar to mine and reacts to stress similarly. She is still a regular drinker, and her anxiety has been absolutely through the roof this past 2 weeks. Whereas I have been pretty damn chill, all things considered. But I can see in her exactly how I would have been reacting had I still been in my previous regular drinking mode.
A little over a year ago, I would have used this crisis as a reason to 'loosen up' on my 2 drinks/day rule, and things could have gone south in a hurry, depending on how long this crisis lasts.
Just feeling really thankful right now. Good decision, me!
Yay for you!
I admit, day 1 of the social distancing was my son's 14th birthday. I opened a bottle of wine. At that point we knew "no school for 3 weeks". Now it looks like not till fall. I drank the whole bottle over the space of 6 days.
But now I'm aiming to keep to no wine for quite awhile. If I'm going to be WFH full time and trying to homeschool part time, then I need my wits. And since there's nobody to share the wine with as long as everyone has to be at home... Maybe I'll come out the other side of this thing a few pounds lighter. (Not because of the alcohol, I don't drink much. More because I'm snacking less because I don't want to run out of food!)
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I too am feeling so much better without booze. I even went on holiday for 8 days without a sip of alcohol.
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Same, super happy to be not drinking through this whole thing. I can really see now how that would not help the situation.
That was one of my motivators too, back when. I was unemployed, and thought, "It's dumb to pour a chemical depressant onto a depressing situation." So I didn't.
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Same, super happy to be not drinking through this whole thing. I can really see now how that would not help the situation.
That was one of my thoughts yesterday - just such a relief that it's not a thing I do anymore. Ofpym bought a 6-pack of beer and that will last him 4-6 weeks and I have a cupboard full of herbal teas, all of which I enjoy, to choose from.
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Same, super happy to be not drinking through this whole thing. I can really see now how that would not help the situation.
That was one of my motivators too, back when. I was unemployed, and thought, "It's dumb to pour a chemical depressant onto a depressing situation." So I didn't.
I feel like the stress of the current situation, combined with the boredom and loneliness of isolation will push a lot of habitual stress drinkers into full alcoholism.
I'm also not surprised that booze stores are being considered "essential" where I live, as they're probably very essential for keeping people at home.
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Same, super happy to be not drinking through this whole thing. I can really see now how that would not help the situation.
That was one of my motivators too, back when. I was unemployed, and thought, "It's dumb to pour a chemical depressant onto a depressing situation." So I didn't.
I feel like the stress of the current situation, combined with the boredom and loneliness of isolation will push a lot of habitual stress drinkers into full alcoholism.
I'm also not surprised that booze stores are being considered "essential" where I live, as they're probably very essential for keeping people at home.
Also, if you are a heavy drinker, accidental detox is no laughing matter.
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I agree I was wondering earlier in the situation if they were going to keep liquor stores open just so people do not withdraw ( or revolt), The hospitals do not need a rush of people with seizures and other alcohol withdrawal symptoms.
I don't think a stressful time like now is a good time to quit either, just my 2 cents. Better when all supports are available like in person AA for example. The moderate to heavy drinking crowd who quit before may be able to pull it off though. If anyone is thinking of quitting I do recommend Annie grace book This Naked Mind. Also has a web site the alcohol experiment 30 days sober challenge. It has been discussed earlier in this thread. I have two episodes of 7 months sobriety after reading the book.
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I agree I was wondering earlier in the situation if they were going to keep liquor stores open just so people do not withdraw ( or revolt), The hospitals do not need a rush of people with seizures and other alcohol withdrawal symptoms.
I don't think a stressful time like now is a good time to quit either, just my 2 cents. Better when all supports are available like in person AA for example. The moderate to heavy drinking crowd who quit before may be able to pull it off though. If anyone is thinking of quitting I do recommend Annie grace book This Naked Mind. Also has a web site the alcohol experiment 30 days sober challenge. It has been discussed earlier in this thread. I have two episodes of 7 months sobriety after reading the book.
I think this might be a good time to try to quit for one specific subset of people: the highly socially triggered drinkers. ETA: Obs not if one is physically dependent, though.
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I mean it might be a good time to consider quitting Going out to dinner all the time too!
I have very few cravings but sitting at a bar with the taps right in front of me is tempting. I have also been tempted at the RV show where they served beer. Hell they serve beer almost every where so why not just stay in and eat at home?
Even folks who do not think they are problem drinkers could learn a few things by taking a moth or more off. I saw a video an english sounding guy made he said he wasnt a heavy drinker but he skipped his usual 4-5 beers a session and now feels great after 2 weeks and said he may even have experienced some withdrawal ( headache).
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Same, super happy to be not drinking through this whole thing. I can really see now how that would not help the situation.
That was one of my motivators too, back when. I was unemployed, and thought, "It's dumb to pour a chemical depressant onto a depressing situation." So I didn't.
I feel like the stress of the current situation, combined with the boredom and loneliness of isolation will push a lot of habitual stress drinkers into full alcoholism.
I've had around 4 drinks in the last year, and even I was tempted the other night. That was more because it was a tasty sugary drink, though.
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I agree I was wondering earlier in the situation if they were going to keep liquor stores open just so people do not withdraw ( or revolt), The hospitals do not need a rush of people with seizures and other alcohol withdrawal symptoms.
I don't think a stressful time like now is a good time to quit either, just my 2 cents. Better when all supports are available like in person AA for example. The moderate to heavy drinking crowd who quit before may be able to pull it off though. If anyone is thinking of quitting I do recommend Annie grace book This Naked Mind. Also has a web site the alcohol experiment 30 days sober challenge. It has been discussed earlier in this thread. I have two episodes of 7 months sobriety after reading the book.
I think it depends on the person.
I'm taking this time to try quitting coffee on top of being alcohol free, but that said, I'm not overly stressed at the moment. In fact, quite the opposite. This is the first time in a decade that I'm actually mentally free of my work.
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I feel like the stress of the current situation, combined with the boredom and loneliness of isolation will push a lot of habitual stress drinkers into full alcoholism.
...
"We had to drink because times were hard or times were good. We had to drink because at home we were smothered with love or got none at all. We had to drink because at work we were great successes or dismal failures. We had to drink because our nation had won a war or lost a peace. And so it went, ad infinitum." From the Big Book, Fourth Step. You could fill pages, even from the conversation of only a single voluble drinker, with neatly parallel contradictory explanations for their drinking. The only one that hadn't a countervailing positive was the most fundamental: "I drank to kill myself under the most degrading circumstances I could create."
I lost a brother-in-law, in his case by smoking, for whom quitting was contingent. "Once I get established in the new department..." "Once this paper gets through peer review..." "When the book is printed...." "Once I get tenure..." Each condition, met, engendered a new condition, until cancer closed out the sequence.
The mind echoes with cittavrittis, and it's easy to harness them to create excuses for staying you. So the drinker can discover that there is never a perfect or even a good time to quit, and never do it.
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Guys -
Glad I found this thread. Currently 33 days off the sauce. Lots of inspiration in this thread. Will be checking in periodically.
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Way to go Accru! How did it go, just stopped or planned it?
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Same, super happy to be not drinking through this whole thing. I can really see now how that would not help the situation.
That was one of my motivators too, back when. I was unemployed, and thought, "It's dumb to pour a chemical depressant onto a depressing situation." So I didn't.
I feel like the stress of the current situation, combined with the boredom and loneliness of isolation will push a lot of habitual stress drinkers into full alcoholism.
I'm also not surprised that booze stores are being considered "essential" where I live, as they're probably very essential for keeping people at home.
I have a couple of friends who fear they are becoming alcoholic right now.
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I agree I was wondering earlier in the situation if they were going to keep liquor stores open just so people do not withdraw ( or revolt), The hospitals do not need a rush of people with seizures and other alcohol withdrawal symptoms.
I don't think a stressful time like now is a good time to quit either, just my 2 cents. Better when all supports are available like in person AA for example. The moderate to heavy drinking crowd who quit before may be able to pull it off though. If anyone is thinking of quitting I do recommend Annie grace book This Naked Mind. Also has a web site the alcohol experiment 30 days sober challenge. It has been discussed earlier in this thread. I have two episodes of 7 months sobriety after reading the book.
I think it depends on the person.
I'm taking this time to try quitting coffee on top of being alcohol free, but that said, I'm not overly stressed at the moment. In fact, quite the opposite. This is the first time in a decade that I'm actually mentally free of my work.
I gave up coffee about 1.5 months ago. I cannot remember exactly when my last cup was. Maybe I've had one or two?
I have on and off digestive issues, and giving up wheat 2.5 years ago really helped. But it didn't fix everything. I started suspecting coffee was occasionally giving me fits and...boy I really do feel a TON better. I still drink tea.
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I wonder if it was the caffiene or the coffee itself. I went to decaf after having indigestion bad for a while and seemed to have helped.
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Same, super happy to be not drinking through this whole thing. I can really see now how that would not help the situation.
That was one of my motivators too, back when. I was unemployed, and thought, "It's dumb to pour a chemical depressant onto a depressing situation." So I didn't.
I feel like the stress of the current situation, combined with the boredom and loneliness of isolation will push a lot of habitual stress drinkers into full alcoholism.
I'm also not surprised that booze stores are being considered "essential" where I live, as they're probably very essential for keeping people at home.
I have a couple of friends who fear they are becoming alcoholic right now.
I'm really not surprised.
I've read a bunch about alcoholism/addiction as I have to for one of my upcoming volunteer roles, and it seems like once alcohol starts being used as a coping mechanism for stress, that's really the starting point for problems.
Pair that with social isolation and boredom, and it's a dangerous combo for anyone who is already accustom to alcohol being a source of comfort.
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I agree I was wondering earlier in the situation if they were going to keep liquor stores open just so people do not withdraw ( or revolt), The hospitals do not need a rush of people with seizures and other alcohol withdrawal symptoms.
I don't think a stressful time like now is a good time to quit either, just my 2 cents. Better when all supports are available like in person AA for example. The moderate to heavy drinking crowd who quit before may be able to pull it off though. If anyone is thinking of quitting I do recommend Annie grace book This Naked Mind. Also has a web site the alcohol experiment 30 days sober challenge. It has been discussed earlier in this thread. I have two episodes of 7 months sobriety after reading the book.
I think it depends on the person.
I'm taking this time to try quitting coffee on top of being alcohol free, but that said, I'm not overly stressed at the moment. In fact, quite the opposite. This is the first time in a decade that I'm actually mentally free of my work.
I gave up coffee about 1.5 months ago. I cannot remember exactly when my last cup was. Maybe I've had one or two?
I have on and off digestive issues, and giving up wheat 2.5 years ago really helped. But it didn't fix everything. I started suspecting coffee was occasionally giving me fits and...boy I really do feel a TON better. I still drink tea.
You sound like me. All those things were problematic for me, and I feel a lot better after having eliminated them. I sleep better too.
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Way to go Accru! How did it go, just stopped or planned it?
Hi BikeFanatic,
I have known I needed to cut down for a few years. I was not a daily drinker, but when I did indulge, I binged. Decided to try and quit after a pretty nasty binge (just over a month ago). The social distancing has definitely worked in my favor in terms of trying to quit, as I always drank in groups, not by myself.
The real test is going to be once social distancing ceases. My hope is to leverage groups such as this, as well as r/stopdrinking on Reddit, to continue on the Path.
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Now is a hard time for those that have stopped drinking to keep NOT drinking. Just stopping in to say hello, and be a sounding board for anyone who is still trying to keep with this goal but the stress of pandemic is making it difficult.
Be well, friends!
onemorebike
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Hey Accrual,
Good luck with your motivation and hope you can hold steady stay the course. I feel so much better I just dont think I can go back unless there was so kind of stress that I could not handle otherwise. Comradery helps alot, I will check out Reddit forum on sober living, or whatever they call it.
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Now is a hard time for those that have stopped drinking to keep NOT drinking. Just stopping in to say hello, and be a sounding board for anyone who is still trying to keep with this goal but the stress of pandemic is making it difficult.
Be well, friends!
onemorebike
Quite the opposite for me, I quit Jan 1st and every day I'm thrilled not to be someone who drinks in response to stress anymore. It's great.
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@Accrual r/stopdrinking are an amazing bunch of people who helped me get OK with the idea of giving up and then going through with it. I don't hang out on reddit anymore but that was one of the Internet's Good Places.
Given your drinking patterns, you might want to game out how you would do this once isolation is over. I know you have got this.
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I wonder if it was the caffiene or the coffee itself. I went to decaf after having indigestion bad for a while and seemed to have helped.
I suspect the coffee itself. Coffee is well known for its effects on digestion (in fact, I used to use it purposely on long run days to "clear things out" so to speak, before my run).
I drink tea with caffeine.
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But really though...if we live through this can I just drink one bottle of Pendleton...pleeeeeaaaaase.
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But really though...if we live through this can I just drink one bottle of Pendleton...pleeeeeaaaaase.
The more you really need a drink at the end of this, the more you don't ...
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Now is a hard time for those that have stopped drinking to keep NOT drinking. Just stopping in to say hello, and be a sounding board for anyone who is still trying to keep with this goal but the stress of pandemic is making it difficult.
Be well, friends!
onemorebike
Quite the opposite for me, I quit Jan 1st and every day I'm thrilled not to be someone who drinks in response to stress anymore. It's great.
x2. Had only one drink(wine) about a month ago since January 1st. In times like these, I am actually happy I don't drink. Easier on the wallet, better for the health and better sleep. The bet I made on January 1st was until April 1st but I now extended that to May 1st and will probably extend it another month every time.
I have wanted to get a drink a few times but its always a social thing, would not want to be at home self-medicating stress/worry of the current events. I found that riding a bike, working in the garage and around the house is a better stress reliever.
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Now is a hard time for those that have stopped drinking to keep NOT drinking. Just stopping in to say hello, and be a sounding board for anyone who is still trying to keep with this goal but the stress of pandemic is making it difficult.
Be well, friends!
onemorebike
Quite the opposite for me, I quit Jan 1st and every day I'm thrilled not to be someone who drinks in response to stress anymore. It's great.
x2. Had only one drink(wine) about a month ago since January 1st. In times like these, I am actually happy I don't drink. Easier on the wallet, better for the health and better sleep. The bet I made on January 1st was until April 1st but I now extended that to May 1st and will probably extend it another month every time.
I have wanted to get a drink a few times but its always a social thing, would not want to be at home self-medicating stress/worry of the current events. I found that riding a bike, working in the garage and around the house is a better stress reliever.
I've had a few moments of really wanting wine at home, socially it's easy for me not to drink, I was always a relaxation/meditative wine drinker. It's happened especially since giving up coffee, I think it's like a crossed-wires craving thing.
Anyhoo, whenever that happens, I do 20 flights of stairs, it takes very little time, and the endorphin boost is great.
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@Accrual r/stopdrinking are an amazing bunch of people who helped me get OK with the idea of giving up and then going through with it. I don't hang out on reddit anymore but that was one of the Internet's Good Places.
Given your drinking patterns, you might want to game out how you would do this once isolation is over. I know you have got this.
Hi mspym,
I agree - I need to have a game plan for once the isolation is over. I know all my friends are going to want to celebrate the end of isolation by drinking.
One idea is to lie and tell them I am on medication and cannot consume due to the side effects. This isn't the best idea because it allows for follow up questions (what are you sick with, what medication, etc.) and I will have to keep digging myself deeper into the lie.
Perhaps lying can carry me over to when I have more sober days under my belt and I have the courage of my convictions to tell them the truth - I like being sober more so than drunk.
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@Accrual I didn't use the medication line because too many options for follow up. I found it easiest to start with "I'm taking a break for a bit" and then transition into "it worked out really well for me so I decided to continue, <insert subject change about their life or mutual interests>".
So for your situation, you could actually use the current situation to your advantage "took a break while we were in lockdown and wanted to continue it because of (the weightloss/ sleep/ random health benefit), how did you guys cope with all being in the house?"
Something that makes it not a Big Thing attracts less attention when you don't want to discuss it. I think you could come up with a couple of variations that you could roll between as needed until things are less raw. Maybe some up with some gettogether plans that could have alcohol but don't have to revolve around it?
And I am so pleased that you are enjoying being sober! That is great news. INTERNET HIGH FIVES
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@Accrual r/stopdrinking are an amazing bunch of people who helped me get OK with the idea of giving up and then going through with it. I don't hang out on reddit anymore but that was one of the Internet's Good Places.
Given your drinking patterns, you might want to game out how you would do this once isolation is over. I know you have got this.
Hi mspym,
I agree - I need to have a game plan for once the isolation is over. I know all my friends are going to want to celebrate the end of isolation by drinking.
One idea is to lie and tell them I am on medication and cannot consume due to the side effects. This isn't the best idea because it allows for follow up questions (what are you sick with, what medication, etc.) and I will have to keep digging myself deeper into the lie.
Perhaps lying can carry me over to when I have more sober days under my belt and I have the courage of my convictions to tell them the truth - I like being sober more so than drunk.
I'm on a drug trial, so that's an easy out for me.
However, DH is staying sober in solidarity and very few people give him any hassle as a result.
So if you really don't feel comfortable and want some cover, you can stretch the truth and say that you are staying sober in solidarity with a loved one who is trying to quit. No one needs to know that your loved one is actually you.
It also shuts down questions because it makes a lot of sense that you wouldn't go into details about someone else's very private business.
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@Accrual r/stopdrinking are an amazing bunch of people who helped me get OK with the idea of giving up and then going through with it. I don't hang out on reddit anymore but that was one of the Internet's Good Places.
Given your drinking patterns, you might want to game out how you would do this once isolation is over. I know you have got this.
Hi mspym,
I agree - I need to have a game plan for once the isolation is over. I know all my friends are going to want to celebrate the end of isolation by drinking.
One idea is to lie and tell them I am on medication and cannot consume due to the side effects. This isn't the best idea because it allows for follow up questions (what are you sick with, what medication, etc.) and I will have to keep digging myself deeper into the lie.
Perhaps lying can carry me over to when I have more sober days under my belt and I have the courage of my convictions to tell them the truth - I like being sober more so than drunk.
How about simply saying, I took a break as part of a program of trying to get healthier, and found I just feel a lot better without?
I just stick to "I'm trying to make healthier lifestyle decisions, and this is part of that." Though I acknowledge, this line wouldn't work so well if I was e.g., 200 lbs and eating french fries as I said it.
But it's actually true. I've never had anyone push back on it.
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@Accrual r/stopdrinking are an amazing bunch of people who helped me get OK with the idea of giving up and then going through with it. I don't hang out on reddit anymore but that was one of the Internet's Good Places.
Given your drinking patterns, you might want to game out how you would do this once isolation is over. I know you have got this.
Hi mspym,
I agree - I need to have a game plan for once the isolation is over. I know all my friends are going to want to celebrate the end of isolation by drinking.
One idea is to lie and tell them I am on medication and cannot consume due to the side effects. This isn't the best idea because it allows for follow up questions (what are you sick with, what medication, etc.) and I will have to keep digging myself deeper into the lie.
Perhaps lying can carry me over to when I have more sober days under my belt and I have the courage of my convictions to tell them the truth - I like being sober more so than drunk.
How about simply saying, I took a break as part of a program of trying to get healthier, and found I just feel a lot better without?
I just stick to "I'm trying to make healthier lifestyle decisions, and this is part of that." Though I acknowledge, this line wouldn't work so well if I was e.g., 200 lbs and eating french fries as I said it.
But it's actually true. I've never had anyone push back on it.
It really depends on the person's social situation and their role within it, especially if they are surrounded by a lot of drinkers, who can react pretty oddly when confronted with one of their peers quitting for "health reasons".
Some people in some social environments will have no issues just politely telling people they're doing it for their health, others will face invasive questioning, pressure, or even bullying. I can totally understand people wanting some kind of shield from that.
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...
Perhaps lying can carry me over to when I have more sober days under my belt and I have the courage of my convictions to tell them the truth - I like being sober more so than drunk.
You get an idea of what "friendship" means to some people, early on in sobriety: exoneration by association. I remember being startled to discover some thought it the better part of "friendship" to undercut my resolve and return me to my old ways. A friend who had a serious problem with alcohol made a full year clean and sober; her husband thought they should celebrate with a bottle of her previous favorite champagne. In the one case my friend did not want to think about his own drinking; in her husband's case he preferred no examination, not by her but especially not by him, of his orgiastic drug binges at a local music festival.
You have a different suite of friends with different life stages; young couples with toddlers are an obvious instance. There is much to be shared with other young couples in the same stage, and less of interest with your bachelor and bachelorette friends, who can't muster much fascination with the latest, richly detailed adventures in toilet training. As your sobriety extends you will have less to share with your drinking buddies - and what you do have to share will not be welcome to some of them. On balance it's a strong positive - some old friendships will strengthen and deepen, and some new friends will show up on a stronger foundation.
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@Accrual r/stopdrinking are an amazing bunch of people who helped me get OK with the idea of giving up and then going through with it. I don't hang out on reddit anymore but that was one of the Internet's Good Places.
Given your drinking patterns, you might want to game out how you would do this once isolation is over. I know you have got this.
Hi mspym,
I agree - I need to have a game plan for once the isolation is over. I know all my friends are going to want to celebrate the end of isolation by drinking.
One idea is to lie and tell them I am on medication and cannot consume due to the side effects. This isn't the best idea because it allows for follow up questions (what are you sick with, what medication, etc.) and I will have to keep digging myself deeper into the lie.
Perhaps lying can carry me over to when I have more sober days under my belt and I have the courage of my convictions to tell them the truth - I like being sober more so than drunk.
How about simply saying, I took a break as part of a program of trying to get healthier, and found I just feel a lot better without?
I just stick to "I'm trying to make healthier lifestyle decisions, and this is part of that." Though I acknowledge, this line wouldn't work so well if I was e.g., 200 lbs and eating french fries as I said it.
But it's actually true. I've never had anyone push back on it.
It really depends on the person's social situation and their role within it, especially if they are surrounded by a lot of drinkers, who can react pretty oddly when confronted with one of their peers quitting for "health reasons".
Some people in some social environments will have no issues just politely telling people they're doing it for their health, others will face invasive questioning, pressure, or even bullying. I can totally understand people wanting some kind of shield from that.
Ugh. That's depressing.
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@Accrual r/stopdrinking are an amazing bunch of people who helped me get OK with the idea of giving up and then going through with it. I don't hang out on reddit anymore but that was one of the Internet's Good Places.
Given your drinking patterns, you might want to game out how you would do this once isolation is over. I know you have got this.
Hi mspym,
I agree - I need to have a game plan for once the isolation is over. I know all my friends are going to want to celebrate the end of isolation by drinking.
One idea is to lie and tell them I am on medication and cannot consume due to the side effects. This isn't the best idea because it allows for follow up questions (what are you sick with, what medication, etc.) and I will have to keep digging myself deeper into the lie.
Perhaps lying can carry me over to when I have more sober days under my belt and I have the courage of my convictions to tell them the truth - I like being sober more so than drunk.
How about simply saying, I took a break as part of a program of trying to get healthier, and found I just feel a lot better without?
I just stick to "I'm trying to make healthier lifestyle decisions, and this is part of that." Though I acknowledge, this line wouldn't work so well if I was e.g., 200 lbs and eating french fries as I said it.
But it's actually true. I've never had anyone push back on it.
It really depends on the person's social situation and their role within it, especially if they are surrounded by a lot of drinkers, who can react pretty oddly when confronted with one of their peers quitting for "health reasons".
Some people in some social environments will have no issues just politely telling people they're doing it for their health, others will face invasive questioning, pressure, or even bullying. I can totally understand people wanting some kind of shield from that.
Ugh. That's depressing.
It's really not surprising, just look at how many dozens of threads there are where people ask for advice on how to explain or justify their frugality or early retirement. Vegetarians/vegans experience similar crap, hell, even people who exercise a lot or bike to work can get a fair amount of backlash. My DH even gets a ton of push back against the fact that he gets up really early in the morning.
It's a very common and very normal part of our culture, it's just a million times rougher for someone in the early stages of sobriety, because part of their brain is absolutely desperate to give in to the pressure.
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Wow. You guys are great. Thank you so much for the advice.
@mspym - I think using the Coronavirus & self quarantine as an explanation is a great idea (when the time comes). I will continue to mull over how exactly I can word the explanation. I have also been wrestling with admitting alcohol severely negatively impacts my mental health. I have been in some pretty dark places while hungover. Perhaps they will understand more if I "pull back the curtains".
@wenchsenior - as @Malkynn notes, people, especially younger people, react negatively towards the "I am getting healthier" explanation. Why? They are confronted with the fact that something they enjoy doing (drinking alcohol) has NO health benefits whatsoever. It forces them to examine why they continue to drink. Most folks do not want to do that. They find it uncomfortable. As sort of a defensive mechanism, they can become hostile and bullying. I know this because I have experienced it (I am young). I am 29 and my friends socialize by brewery hopping, wine tasting, etc. The whole social scene is predicated on alcohol - this is why it has been so difficult for me to stop the past few years; I go weeks without drinking, meet up with friends I haven't seen in awhile, and get BOMBED.
Day 37 for me today. Be well, guys.
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Wow. You guys are great. Thank you so much for the advice.
@mspym - I think using the Coronavirus & self quarantine as an explanation is a great idea (when the time comes). I will continue to mull over how exactly I can word the explanation. I have also been wrestling with admitting alcohol severely negatively impacts my mental health. I have been in some pretty dark places while hungover. Perhaps they will understand more if I "pull back the curtains".
@wenchsenior - as @Malkynn notes, people, especially younger people, react negatively towards the "I am getting healthier" explanation. Why? They are confronted with the fact that something they enjoy doing (drinking alcohol) has NO health benefits whatsoever. It forces them to examine why they continue to drink. Most folks do not want to do that. They find it uncomfortable. As sort of a defensive mechanism, they can become hostile and bullying. I know this because I have experienced it (I am young). I am 29 and my friends socialize by brewery hopping, wine tasting, etc. The whole social scene is predicated on alcohol - this is why it has been so difficult for me to stop the past few years; I go weeks without drinking, meet up with friends I haven't seen in awhile, and get BOMBED.
Day 37 for me today. Be well, guys.
lol, trust me, middle aged parents can be just as viciously protective of their drinking habits as young people.
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.... I know this because I have experienced it (I am young). I am 29 and my friends socialize by brewery hopping, wine tasting, etc. The whole social scene is predicated on alcohol - this is why it has been so difficult for me to stop the past few years; I go weeks without drinking, meet up with friends I haven't seen in awhile, and get BOMBED.
Day 37 for me today. Be well, guys.
The time will come when you can go anywhere and everywhere with anyone, and no matter what they drink and do, you will be confirmed and solid in your sobriety. And the better ones will respect that. But at the beginning you have a lot of habits to unmake. The AA answer is a simple one. For as long as it's still a temptation, just don't subject yourself to it. Don't go. There's no positive, and a lot of danger, in putting yourself in harm's way. It's even worth practicing in advance: "No, sorry, I've got something going on tonight, can't make it."
One of the most ruinous tricks I used to play on myself was to say, "Well, shit. It's been X days or X months and it's been easy enough. I've got this licked. I can go out and drink, and be right back in control tomorrow. I'm obviously stronger than the alcohol or the tobacco." (Tobacco was WAY harder for me than alcohol.) This was almost comically untrue. It took me years to reach Step 1.
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I agree the first 3 months or so you practice unwinding
The old habits, go to a ballpark or a bar or whatever party and you dont drink. Then you realize that not too bad, still quite enjoyable. From my experience with two bouts of 7 months sobriety, I only found 3 months a bit of a challenge then after that. Most experiences with out alcohol were just as enjoyable.
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I threw myself into high pressure drinking situations my first week, like a form of inoculation. But I'm the kind of person who would rather face the challenge immediately than have to think about the challenge.
I've also personally found that the longer I go without drinking, the less confident I feel about ever drinking again. At the beginning of this, I wasn't certain I would totally give up drinking, but the more I don't drink, the more I don't trust my brain to respond in a healthy way if I do. Granted, I'm a former neuroscientist who has studied addiction, so the neurochemical processes are a little more intuitive for me.
I think it really comes down to the individual, their needs, and their challenges. My approach has worked for me, but I wouldn't necessarily recommend it for someone else.
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That is next level behavior and some of us need more time to adjust. I would be doomed to fail if I did it your way M.
I had so many epiphanies, like wasn’t sure if I could reset and go back to alcohol? And then this chocolate addiction came out of nowhere! I feel, after study, that of course I developed an addiction or addicted brain.
But I had to learn that, I didn’t start with the premise that I was an addict.
I agree everyone has to find there own path. Some people can not drink non alcoholic beer for example, where I enjoy it very much. My wife gets triggered by the grocer aisle with alcohol, doesn’t bother me. Still can not sit under the beer taps at a bar, but can sit a few stools away and not look.
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That is next level behavior and some of us need more time to adjust. I would be doomed to fail if I did it your way M.
Yeah...I definitely march to the beat of my own drum. I learned a very long time ago not generalize my own experiences.
There are a lot of basic universalities when it comes to the biochemistry of addictive substances, but how that manifests as a day to day reality for each person will really depend on so many highly variable factors, that it's tricky. That's why there are so few programs with high success rates.
It's hard to figure out what you really need when your own brain is actively lying to you.
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hard to figure out what you really need when your own brain is actively lying to you.
This x1000
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Wow. You guys are great. Thank you so much for the advice.
@mspym - I think using the Coronavirus & self quarantine as an explanation is a great idea (when the time comes). I will continue to mull over how exactly I can word the explanation. I have also been wrestling with admitting alcohol severely negatively impacts my mental health. I have been in some pretty dark places while hungover. Perhaps they will understand more if I "pull back the curtains".
@wenchsenior - as @Malkynn notes, people, especially younger people, react negatively towards the "I am getting healthier" explanation. Why? They are confronted with the fact that something they enjoy doing (drinking alcohol) has NO health benefits whatsoever. It forces them to examine why they continue to drink. Most folks do not want to do that. They find it uncomfortable. As sort of a defensive mechanism, they can become hostile and bullying. I know this because I have experienced it (I am young). I am 29 and my friends socialize by brewery hopping, wine tasting, etc. The whole social scene is predicated on alcohol - this is why it has been so difficult for me to stop the past few years; I go weeks without drinking, meet up with friends I haven't seen in awhile, and get BOMBED.
Day 37 for me today. Be well, guys.
It's not just the young people either, though I can see that.
I live in wine country. I have friends in the business. I love wine, and I belong to two local wineries.
I really want to support my friend's business right now (wine tours), which is, obviously, not running. Will this company, that's 15-20 years old and fantastic, survive? I hope so.
But I did one of their wine tours once. It was lovely but it was TOO MUCH. It was FOUR wine tastings (four different wineries). Which, yeah, you sip and spit eventually. It's just a whole day (8 hours).
I'm of the "enjoy a glass, or 1.5 glasses" with friends kind of person. I've even learned at our neighborhood potluck - if I want to make sure that I don't take wine home, I have to open the bottle before I go - so that people drink it first.
Anyway, I feel great right now. I think my last glass was 3/18. I do have 7-8 bottles in the house. Saving those for when our potlucks are sanctioned again.
ETA: Malkynn is spot on for the middle aged parents comment
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I stopped drinking 2 summers ago, and only had serious cravings or a hard time the first few months after I quit, I think.
Every once in a while, in response to a specific trigger, I'd have a brief craving, but it was totally manageable.
But the past few weeks I have had a bunch of cravings, in response to stress I guess, and the unpredictability of our situation now with COVID and social distancing, and everything in life just getting that much harder (managing school, work, shopping, health care for everyone in my family).
More nights than not I find myself thinking how much I'd like a drink.
I'm VERY grateful that I am NOT drinking anymore. (Our town is organizing all sorts of businesses that do home delivery, and lots of them are delivering alcohol. There's no shortage of easy access for me. But I don't want it.). Nothing about my situation and life right now would be made better by me drinking alcohol; I know this.
But the cravings are really coming more frequently now than ever before in the past 18-20 months.
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^
I can't understate how incredibly happy I am to not be drinking through this. I know I've already said that, but I know myself, and I know that the urge to drink would just be constant right now. It's not that I think that I would drink a ton, but that the lack of structure and constant wonkiness of the situation are the perfect trigger for thinking "a drink would be great right now"
Because I'm not drinking, when those thoughts come up, the answer is a simple and quick "no".
If I were still a regular drinker though...ugh...I would have to actually make a decision every single time. It would be exhausting.
Btw, 100 days today!
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^
I can't understate how incredibly happy I am to not be drinking through this. I know I've already said that, but I know myself, and I know that the urge to drink would just be constant right now. It's not that I think that I would drink a ton, but that the lack of structure and constant wonkiness of the situation are the perfect trigger for thinking "a drink would be great right now"
Because I'm not drinking, when those thoughts come up, the answer is a simple and quick "no".
If I were still a regular drinker though...ugh...I would have to actually make a decision every single time. It would be exhausting.
Btw, 100 days today!
Excellent!
:applause:waves flag:
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^
I can't understate how incredibly happy I am to not be drinking through this. I know I've already said that, but I know myself, and I know that the urge to drink would just be constant right now. It's not that I think that I would drink a ton, but that the lack of structure and constant wonkiness of the situation are the perfect trigger for thinking "a drink would be great right now"
Because I'm not drinking, when those thoughts come up, the answer is a simple and quick "no".
If I were still a regular drinker though...ugh...I would have to actually make a decision every single time. It would be exhausting.
Btw, 100 days today!
Excellent!
And I feel the same. I have wine, it would be great to have a glass, but nope.
Today, when I needed to destress in between conf calls and getting my 7 yo to do homework, I sat down with him and colored.
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Reached my goal of not drinking from Jan 1st to April 1st. With the lockdown going on, local breweries are offering killer deals on beer, they also offer free delivery within 10 miles radius. I thought about getting some beers but decided against it, I did have 2 beers that my neighbor offered me last Saturday but I am back to not drinking. The deals are killing me though, Wicked Weed beer used to be $48-$64 for a 24 pack, they are selling them for $20-$35 now.
It helps that my job is considered essential so I am not sitting around the house.
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I'm in for now. Until at least June 15. I decided about two weeks ago when I got a call for a follow-up appointment with a nutritionist following a pre-diabetes diagnosis. By then, I'd been drinking more than I cared to admit to a nutritionist so I decided to just cut it out entirely so that when I have my appointment, alcohol will not be an issue. I'm not sure what I'll do after the appointment in terms of whether to stay entirely dry for longer or easing into moderate, occasional drinking but if it's the latter, I'll have to be very clear with myself about when and how much so that I'm not being whimsical and just having drinks whenever I fancy...because that quickly spirals into too much drinking.
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But the past few weeks I have had a bunch of cravings, in response to stress I guess, and the unpredictability of our situation now with COVID and social distancing, and everything in life just getting that much harder (managing school, work, shopping, health care for everyone in my family).
More nights than not I find myself thinking how much I'd like a drink.
It's been a month since I wrote the above and I am finding the cravings still as much as they were then.
I like the idea of coloring to relieve stress. I have started knitting, but it doesn't do much for me.
I suppose there's always exercise too... probably should have turned to that first thing!
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But the past few weeks I have had a bunch of cravings, in response to stress I guess, and the unpredictability of our situation now with COVID and social distancing, and everything in life just getting that much harder (managing school, work, shopping, health care for everyone in my family).
More nights than not I find myself thinking how much I'd like a drink.
It's been a month since I wrote the above and I am finding the cravings still as much as they were then.
I like the idea of coloring to relieve stress. I have started knitting, but it doesn't do much for me.
I suppose there's always exercise too... probably should have turned to that first thing!
CB - the best thing I found was substitution. What I was looking for was something to mark the transition between work and not-work, and I am finding that even more necessary these days 😂😭
I have a *nice* non-alcoholic drink in a *fancy* glass, maybe with a fresh sprig of mint or a slice of lemon, something to make it feel a bit more like an event, and then I drink that while frittering some time before shifting mode to Home Tasks.
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But the past few weeks I have had a bunch of cravings, in response to stress I guess, and the unpredictability of our situation now with COVID and social distancing, and everything in life just getting that much harder (managing school, work, shopping, health care for everyone in my family).
More nights than not I find myself thinking how much I'd like a drink.
It's been a month since I wrote the above and I am finding the cravings still as much as they were then.
I like the idea of coloring to relieve stress. I have started knitting, but it doesn't do much for me.
I suppose there's always exercise too... probably should have turned to that first thing!
CB - the best thing I found was substitution. What I was looking for was something to mark the transition between work and not-work, and I am finding that even more necessary these days
I have a *nice* non-alcoholic drink in a *fancy* glass, maybe with a fresh sprig of mint or a slice of lemon, something to make it feel a bit more like an event, and then I drink that while frittering some time before shifting mode to Home Tasks.
Agree with the substitution thing and making a clear ritual to delineate 'chill out time'. CB, I can relate...it's well over a year since I gave up my longstanding nightly cocktail hour(s) habit, but almost 20 years of that and the brain wiring is pretty fixed. The occasional drink when I'm out on vacation doesn't seem to trigger that wiring (I had a couple beers on a trip in early March without any overall change in my desire to drink), and I don't have cravings on a typical night at home. But there's a particular combo of stress and low blood sugar that is certain to bring them on. And although I have been pretty low-stress overall during the pandemic quarantine, I think I must have quite a bit of subconscious stress seeping out....I'm sleeping more lightly, and my cravings are a bit more frequent. It's not a big deal, they pass pretty quickly. But they are irritating in the moment.
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I have 8.5 months under my belt. I do not have cravings anymore, but occasionally I do feel tempted to drink usually in reaction to stress. I like to check out YouTube videos on addiction and recovery that helps or substitute a big bowl of popcorn.
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thanks @wenchsenior and @mspym !
Yeah it is just frustrating that it's been almost 2 years since my last drink of alcohol -- not even in cooking -- at these cravings are suddenly coming back after months of zero cravings.
I guess it's a good idea to go back to the substitutes I used in the early months when I did have cravings For me, it is good to have mineral water (the fizzy kind) mixed with a little fruit juice for a burst of flavor. Otherwise, a cup of tea with honey seems to help as well.
ALso it helps to identify what specific emotion is causing the stress craving. It is very clear in my case, I crave alcohol when I feel family members are making competing demands on me that I cannot meet -- can't make both family members happy at the same time basically. It helps to just take a deep breath at these moments, and identify what is going on and why it is making me feel stressed out.
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3 years, 9 months, 13 days, according to my day counter. Interestingly enough, I have now crossed a threshold where my sobriety time is greater than my estimated countdown to FI!
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But the past few weeks I have had a bunch of cravings, in response to stress I guess, and the unpredictability of our situation now with COVID and social distancing, and everything in life just getting that much harder (managing school, work, shopping, health care for everyone in my family).
More nights than not I find myself thinking how much I'd like a drink.
It's been a month since I wrote the above and I am finding the cravings still as much as they were then.
I like the idea of coloring to relieve stress. I have started knitting, but it doesn't do much for me.
I suppose there's always exercise too... probably should have turned to that first thing!
CB - the best thing I found was substitution. What I was looking for was something to mark the transition between work and not-work, and I am finding that even more necessary these days
I have a *nice* non-alcoholic drink in a *fancy* glass, maybe with a fresh sprig of mint or a slice of lemon, something to make it feel a bit more like an event, and then I drink that while frittering some time before shifting mode to Home Tasks.
Agree with the substitution thing and making a clear ritual to delineate 'chill out time'. CB, I can relate...it's well over a year since I gave up my longstanding nightly cocktail hour(s) habit, but almost 20 years of that and the brain wiring is pretty fixed. The occasional drink when I'm out on vacation doesn't seem to trigger that wiring (I had a couple beers on a trip in early March without any overall change in my desire to drink), and I don't have cravings on a typical night at home. But there's a particular combo of stress and low blood sugar that is certain to bring them on. And although I have been pretty low-stress overall during the pandemic quarantine, I think I must have quite a bit of subconscious stress seeping out....I'm sleeping more lightly, and my cravings are a bit more frequent. It's not a big deal, they pass pretty quickly. But they are irritating in the moment.
Same. I've hit the wine a bit too much the last month (2 bottles in a month). I haven't had any time off work since Christmas, though, so I'm super stressed with work and distance learning a 7 yo.
What usually works for me is my soda stream, and making it fancy. I drink water all day long, but when I shut down the laptop, I switch to soda water, sometimes with lemon or lime in it. Maybe some fruit slices. It's nice.
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3 years, 9 months, 13 days, according to my day counter. Interestingly enough, I have now crossed a threshold where my sobriety time is greater than my estimated countdown to FI!
Wow that is great! ✨🎉🎇
I am coming up to the 3 yr mark and it's 4 yrs to FI so now I want to work out the crossover date
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"3 years, 9 months, 13 days, according to my day counter. Interestingly enough, I have now crossed a threshold where my sobriety time is greater than my estimated countdown to FI! "
Congratulations on the sobriety almost 4 years, wow, and the final count down to FI. I am maybe Retired a year early due to covid we shall see, would like to work another year, keeping busy keeps me from thinking about drinking,
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I just bought a new pair of running shoes and a case of fizzy water to help me battle these cravings for alcohol and reduce stress. I need to get more exercise every day, I think; but my feet hurt so much when I run.
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I just bought a new pair of running shoes and a case of fizzy water to help me battle these cravings for alcohol and reduce stress. I need to get more exercise every day, I think; but my feet hurt so much when I run.
Woohoo for deciding to take action!
If your feet are hurting when you run, you might want to book an appointment with a podiatrist. Orthotics or the correct shoe for your feet are super critical to stop the footpain
:)
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Just got my blood work results which were not good. I never drank until 15 years ago. Day 2 of sobriety and I already feel better. I am reading the book for the second time. I am buying flavored carbonated water for my night time drink.
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Just got my blood work results which were not good. I never drank until 15 years ago. Day 2 of sobriety and I already feel better. I am reading the book for the second time. I am buying flavored carbonated water for my night time drink.
Welcome to the club!
Over 7 months with no alcohol for me, and it's unreal the difference. A few of my more vain friends have quit drinking just because they are envious of what it's done for my skin. Many have assumed I've had cosmetic work done.
If that's the kind of improvement that can be seen in my face, I can't fathom how good the change has been for my organs.
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You can do it Cassie, I think I am on this thread twice, my first time I went 6-7 months this time is is 11 months and soon a year!
I actually felt another uptick in energy after 11 months ( and at 3 weeks, 3 months and six months) I assume it is my liver healing? I also know that sleeping does improve and that could also be responsible for my increased energy.
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I just hit 3 years a couple of weeks ago.
@Cassie luckily, bodies can be pretty good at healing themselves. All my blood work is great now.
@BikeFanatic it's your liver AND your brain healing. There are spurts of new neural growth associated with giving up alcohol as your body heals.
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I just hit 3 years a couple of weeks ago.
@Cassie luckily, bodies can be pretty good at healing themselves. All my blood work is great now.
@BikeFanatic it's your liver AND your brain healing. There are spurts of new neural growth associated with giving up alcohol as your body heals.
It's everything really.
I didn't realize how bad alcohol was until in the med school part of my education, studying each organ, one by one for a few years, and alcohol and cigarettes were the top two factors for every single organ.
Alcohol damages every tissue it touches, and it's in your blood so it touches e-v-e-r-y-t-h-i-n-g
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So interesting to read through the comments--you all are inspiring!
I am 7 days into a booze-free August as I realized I was having a daily beer/gin (sometimes two) for the past few MONTHS (covid, summer, stress) and that it was a habit that I wanted to break. Felt it was contributing to head fogginess, low energy, weight gain, etc..
I am currently reading Sober Curious and I really am liking her approach/train-of-thought. I don't feel ready to commit to not ever drinking again but really interesting in shifting my relationship with alcohol. It's been an on-again, off-again affair for my entire adult life.
My SO is still having his daily beer but I bought some fizzy water, rose kombucha & flavoured treats to help me not miss my 5pm ritual so much :)
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At some point in my life, I developed some sort of allergy, possibly to ethanol; breaking out in hives and other affects are not fun. So now I use it as an excuse to not drink in social situations, especially when someone is persistent and a simple "no" is not working. Feel free to use it to get out of drinking situations. ;) Needless to say, much cheaper and healthier.
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So interesting to read through the comments--you all are inspiring!
I am 7 days into a booze-free August as I realized I was having a daily beer/gin (sometimes two) for the past few MONTHS (covid, summer, stress) and that it was a habit that I wanted to break. Felt it was contributing to head fogginess, low energy, weight gain, etc..
I am currently reading Sober Curious and I really am liking her approach/train-of-thought. I don't feel ready to commit to not ever drinking again but really interesting in shifting my relationship with alcohol. It's been an on-again, off-again affair for my entire adult life.
My SO is still having his daily beer but I bought some fizzy water, rose kombucha & flavoured treats to help me not miss my 5pm ritual so much :)
I recently read that book as well and really liked it. I was prepped to give it the total side-eye b/c of all the astrology, new-agey, pseudoscience crap she seems to surround the rest of her life with, but her approach to sobriety was so positive and healthy-seeming and I found myself profoundly moved by the last chapter. Her approach to drinking is so similar to what's been working for me after decades of psychological dependence and chronic use. It was fun to read that perspective.
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Heads-up.... for those of you who are interested in the non-alcoholic versions of standard drinks (NA wine, beer, spirits), I just tried Monday NA gin (skeptically), and it turned out to be a really good facsimile if you are wanting that sour/tart/herbally taste profile. It's too expensive for me to be making a NA G&T every day, but definitely a pleasure to have on hand.
https://www.thezeroproof.com/home/monday-gin-review (https://www.thezeroproof.com/home/monday-gin-review)
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Heads-up.... for those of you who are interested in the non-alcoholic versions of standard drinks (NA wine, beer, spirits), I just tried Monday NA gin (skeptically), and it turned out to be a really good facsimile if you are wanting that sour/tart/herbally taste profile. It's too expensive for me to be making a NA G&T every day, but definitely a pleasure to have on hand.
https://www.thezeroproof.com/home/monday-gin-review (https://www.thezeroproof.com/home/monday-gin-review)
DH is also a big fan of Seedlip
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I recently read that book as well and really liked it. I was prepped to give it the total side-eye b/c of all the astrology, new-agey, pseudoscience crap she seems to surround the rest of her life with, but her approach to sobriety was so positive and healthy-seeming and I found myself profoundly moved by the last chapter. Her approach to drinking is so similar to what's been working for me after decades of psychological dependence and chronic use. It was fun to read that perspective.
@wenchsenior I didn't know anything about the author and don't have any interest in her other book (from the sounds of it) but this was an audiobook suggestion from the library and so far, so good!
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Thanks for the encouragement everyone! I will also read the other book. I have been thinking that at 65 I need to be in the best shape possible especially if I am unlucky enough to get the virus. I spent the night at my best friend’s house like I do every week and after we talked she is thinking about getting sober. She said that part of her doesn’t want to quit. That’s where I was 3 years ago and failed after 2 weeks. This time is different for me. I want to quit. She drank wine all night and I wasn’t tempted but today is only day 3.
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Just got my blood work results which were not good. I never drank until 15 years ago. Day 2 of sobriety and I already feel better. I am reading the book for the second time. I am buying flavored carbonated water for my night time drink.
Welcome to the club!
Over 7 months with no alcohol for me, and it's unreal the difference. A few of my more vain friends have quit drinking just because they are envious of what it's done for my skin. Many have assumed I've had cosmetic work done.
If that's the kind of improvement that can be seen in my face, I can't fathom how good the change has been for my organs.
This post has given me some food for thought. As I'm coming closer to my 40s I've started thinking about my skin more - I'm like super-pink Irish and I'm afraid I'm trending to red and freckled as I age.
I think we have a fairly healthy relationship with alcohol in our house - but the thought of wonderful skin . . . .Priceless? :)
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I had a super busy and stressful day as my husband had surgery today. I have never felt better. I feel happy and capable of handling everything. I came home and had a few raspberry flavored sparkling water and it was great. I also joined the online group associated with the book.
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I had a super busy and stressful day as my husband had surgery today. I have never felt better. I feel happy and capable of handling everything. I came home and had a few raspberry flavored sparkling water and it was great. I also joined the online group associated with the book.
That's awesome Cassie!
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Thanks Mspym! I noticed that my mood is definitely improving too. I have always been positive and upbeat in the past but I know that hasn’t been the case for awhile. I am having trouble falling asleep until pretty late but I am retired so flowing with it and sleeping later.
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Good work, Cassie!
Sending everyone positive vibes.
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Day 7 and I still feel good. We got together with another couple tonight and I brought my sparkling water and they drank wine. I was totally fine and not envious at all. I think my mind has finally gotten the message.
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I'd like to join this thread.
I'm a pretty heavy drinker (would be considered a very heavy drinker by non drinkers...) and I like to take two non consecutive months off drinking every year just for a bit of a reset.
Last year I took three months off, felt great. OH and I are two days without drink so far, going to try and make it to mid-October at least.
Cheers!
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Stubble, did you take 3 months off in a row?
Welcome, any time off booze has measurable effects, even 30 days changes you some. Let us know how it goes and good luck.
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Day 11 and I feel awesome. I am never going back. I read all 3 of her books and joined the closed group on Facebook.
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Hi Cassie all 3 of her books?
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TNM, the one where people tell their personal experiences and the alcohol experiment. I found them all on amazon.
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OK, This Naked Mind and the Alcohol experiment are by Annie Grace. Thank you, I did read TNM and enjoyed it.
I also listen to people on you tube that have given up drinking for motivation. Good job Cassie.
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The 3rd book is this naked life which is the stories. Reading the stories was eye opening as to how some people’s lives had really been ruined.
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Hi Crusty,
I think you should try to commit to a 30 day No Alcohol fast to see how you feel.
You know, on second thought, I think you are right. Immediately after reading your comment, I got a little angry and later that night, had a beer in defiance. "No one is going to suggest to me I shouldn't drink!" I saw at the time how irrational that was.
And I am realizing that if I just have a drink every couple of days, I am still experiencing all the unpleasant effects every couple of days now instead of every day. It's like going through withdrawal over and over and over.
I just signed up for Anne Grace's Alcohol Experiment and am going to give it an honest try.
Thanks @BikeFanatic for the push!
Just checking in two years after this post to say that since this time, I haven't had a drop of alcohol.
Best decision I ever made. Annie Grace's online Alcohol Experiment definitely helped me through that first month. After that, I did have cravings every so often, but was able to work through them.
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Hi Crusty,
I think you should try to commit to a 30 day No Alcohol fast to see how you feel.
You know, on second thought, I think you are right. Immediately after reading your comment, I got a little angry and later that night, had a beer in defiance. "No one is going to suggest to me I shouldn't drink!" I saw at the time how irrational that was.
And I am realizing that if I just have a drink every couple of days, I am still experiencing all the unpleasant effects every couple of days now instead of every day. It's like going through withdrawal over and over and over.
I just signed up for Anne Grace's Alcohol Experiment and am going to give it an honest try.
Thanks @BikeFanatic for the push!
Just checking in two years after this post to say that since this time, I haven't had a drop of alcohol.
Best decision I ever made. Annie Grace's online Alcohol Experiment definitely helped me through that first month. After that, I did have cravings every so often, but was able to work through them.
That's awesome. Do you find after two years the cravings are gone? I've read through something Annie posted that research indicates that the brain is pretty much readapted after two years.
I'm almost 8 months now and last night was my first hard craving in a long time. I have literally no interest in alcohol at all, so it was so unsettling and felt like an alien consciousness taking over my brain briefly.
It was a wedding, I was already super psychologically raw from my own business dealings the day before, there were some weird feelings and dynamics in the room about the marriage, one of the guests was loud and drunk, and with less than 10 people, there was no escaping anyone.
Then people made a big deal of how sad it is that I can't drink because of my medication, and the host went on and on about all of the award winning reds he bought and thought I would enjoy because we're both red wine aficionados. Ugh.
Mercifully for me, as I've mentioned before, alcohol now tastes like gasoline to me. So I had a sip of champagne for the toast and found it so revolting that any semblance of craving disappeared.
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Stubble, did you take 3 months off in a row?
Welcome, any time off booze has measurable effects, even 30 days changes you some. Let us know how it goes and good luck.
Yeah did three months in a row, longest I've gone without for more than 10 years. Joined a long term sober friend of mine at some AA meetings. If anyone wants the low down on AA meetings please give me a shout. I'm definitely not an AA convert completely but they've got some excellent and useful things to help people who struggle with not drinking, plus everyone I met there was an absolute sweetheart through and through.
I'm not a drink in the morning type person and I've never lost jobs, relationships, houses etc because of drinking, but I'd never be able to honestly say that my relationship to alcohol isn't problematic.
Three months was great, had a visible 6 pack for the first time since I was a teenager, I was packing stuff into my days. It really was good. Feel like an idiot for getting pulled back in if I'm honest.
Still, onwards and upwards :)
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Hi Crusty,
I think you should try to commit to a 30 day No Alcohol fast to see how you feel.
You know, on second thought, I think you are right. Immediately after reading your comment, I got a little angry and later that night, had a beer in defiance. "No one is going to suggest to me I shouldn't drink!" I saw at the time how irrational that was.
And I am realizing that if I just have a drink every couple of days, I am still experiencing all the unpleasant effects every couple of days now instead of every day. It's like going through withdrawal over and over and over.
I just signed up for Anne Grace's Alcohol Experiment and am going to give it an honest try.
Thanks @BikeFanatic for the push!
Just checking in two years after this post to say that since this time, I haven't had a drop of alcohol.
Best decision I ever made. Annie Grace's online Alcohol Experiment definitely helped me through that first month. After that, I did have cravings every so often, but was able to work through them.
Ooof two years, congratulations! that is amazing, especially in light of the post of yourself that you quoted. Any resources other than Annie Grace you can recommend? I'm big on podcasts when walking the dog if you have any?
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Podcast I listen to on YouTube is talk sober, some interesting insights AA style. . Recovery elevator is another.
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Badger congrats! I spent most of my life as a non drinker and I only started 15 years ago. It was a big mistake. 12 days now with no desire and I have never felt so good.
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@Malcat I quit Annie Grace style, not AA and I have no cravings any more. (just hit 3 years) I think it was around 9-12 months that I got a few odd ones, mostly when I was in loud crowded situations where I felt obliged to stay and it made me realise how much I had used booze to numb myself to endure things. It got better once I became better at leaving when I didn't want to be there any more. And now my friend sthat I used to drink with are used to me just not drinking so there's no more pressure from them. Which helps.
@Stubblestache welcome and hi. The Home podcast is pretty good, and sobriety in different forms gets discussed reasonably often on Marc Marion's WTF podcast. Amazing how many people have an addiction in one form or another, whether it's booze, drugs, food.
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That's awesome. Do you find after two years the cravings are gone? I've read through something Annie posted that research indicates that the brain is pretty much readapted after two years.
I cannot remember exactly anymore, but I'd say I have had cravings off and on every so often now. It seems psychological now. I feel the urge to drink most strongly when I cannot meet the needs of all my family members -- like my husband wants X and my daughter desperately does NOT want X (and both need me to provide or limit X)
I think I mentioned here on this thread an uptick in cravings maybe a month or two ago but I did associate that with general Pandemic related stress. Curious though as I was just about hitting the 2 year mark. I'd be interested to know that the brain readapts after 2 years!
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Ooof two years, congratulations! that is amazing, especially in light of the post of yourself that you quoted. Any resources other than Annie Grace you can recommend? I'm big on podcasts when walking the dog if you have any?
Just Annie Grace -- the videos and articles she posted on her (free) web based group, The Alcohol Experiment. I think she had podcasts too.
I had been drinking for many years, and it had turned pretty habitual for about the past 5. I knew it was getting to be a problem so I was highly motivated to quit. The key piece of information I got from Annie Grace was the idea that the cravings don't last. I learned from her to just acknowledge the craving, sit with it, and say "Yup, that's a craving".... and then let it pass.
For some reason, just that knowledge really helped me a lot.
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That's awesome. Do you find after two years the cravings are gone? I've read through something Annie posted that research indicates that the brain is pretty much readapted after two years.
I cannot remember exactly anymore, but I'd say I have had cravings off and on every so often now. It seems psychological now. I feel the urge to drink most strongly when I cannot meet the needs of all my family members -- like my husband wants X and my daughter desperately does NOT want X (and both need me to provide or limit X)
I think I mentioned here on this thread an uptick in cravings maybe a month or two ago but I did associate that with general Pandemic related stress. Curious though as I was just about hitting the 2 year mark. I'd be interested to know that the brain readapts after 2 years!
I'm at a year and a half since I gave up my ~20-year habit of nightly wine-drinking. I've had about a dozen drinks since then, mostly clustered here and there on a few trips, last one being about 6 months ago. I'm not sure whether that affects cravings or not. I certainly don't feel deprived, nor do I any longer think of myself as 'a drinker'.
So, depending on what you mean by 'cravings', I still regularly get a passing 'ping' or 'tug' at home during cocktail hour, esp if I have low blood sugar or am feeling stressed. Historically, this is when 90% of my drinking happened, and it's where the vast majority of my triggers are. This 'ping' happens despite the fact that I haven't had a drink at home during cocktail hour in the entire 1.5 years. These feelings are not strong usually, but typically flicker through my mind and pass away most nights.
The strong cravings I've had since I did the Annie Grace program have been triggered by sudden unexpected stress combining with cocktail hour, or social pressure combined with low blood sugar. There have only been a few of them during the past year and a half, and they can kind of blind-side me when they happen. I suspect they have more 'teeth' b/c those triggers are so sporadic that I rarely get a chance to 'practice' dealing with them.
I sometimes wonder if I'll ever be 100% free of cravings (it's not a big deal if I'm not...cravings can't hurt me and they always pass; but it is just something I need to stay aware of). After all, I don't think our brains 'dismantle' neural networks for automated behaviors once they are built. If I didn't drive a car for ten years, I'm pretty sure I could still sit down in the driver's seat, put the key in the ignition, and pretty automatically remember how to drive.
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That's awesome. Do you find after two years the cravings are gone? I've read through something Annie posted that research indicates that the brain is pretty much readapted after two years.
I cannot remember exactly anymore, but I'd say I have had cravings off and on every so often now. It seems psychological now. I feel the urge to drink most strongly when I cannot meet the needs of all my family members -- like my husband wants X and my daughter desperately does NOT want X (and both need me to provide or limit X)
I think I mentioned here on this thread an uptick in cravings maybe a month or two ago but I did associate that with general Pandemic related stress. Curious though as I was just about hitting the 2 year mark. I'd be interested to know that the brain readapts after 2 years!
I'm at a year and a half since I gave up my ~20-year habit of nightly wine-drinking. I've had about a dozen drinks since then, mostly clustered here and there on a few trips, last one being about 6 months ago. I'm not sure whether that affects cravings or not. I certainly don't feel deprived, nor do I any longer think of myself as 'a drinker'.
So, depending on what you mean by 'cravings', I still regularly get a passing 'ping' or 'tug' at home during cocktail hour, esp if I have low blood sugar or am feeling stressed. Historically, this is when 90% of my drinking happened, and it's where the vast majority of my triggers are. This 'ping' happens despite the fact that I haven't had a drink at home during cocktail hour in the entire 1.5 years. These feelings are not strong usually, but typically flicker through my mind and pass away most nights.
The strong cravings I've had since I did the Annie Grace program have been triggered by sudden unexpected stress combining with cocktail hour, or social pressure combined with low blood sugar. There have only been a few of them during the past year and a half, and they can kind of blind-side me when they happen. I suspect they have more 'teeth' b/c those triggers are so sporadic that I rarely get a chance to 'practice' dealing with them.
I sometimes wonder if I'll ever be 100% free of cravings (it's not a big deal if I'm not...cravings can't hurt me and they always pass; but it is just something I need to stay aware of). After all, I don't think our brains 'dismantle' neural networks for automated behaviors once they are built. If I didn't drive a car for ten years, I'm pretty sure I could still sit down in the driver's seat, put the key in the ignition, and pretty automatically remember how to drive.
Yeah, the neural pathways are never totally gone if they were well established and reinforced to begin with. I'm not sure I would consider drinking an automated behaviour as a opposed to a habitual one, but that's the neuroscientist in me being finicky.
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That's awesome. Do you find after two years the cravings are gone? I've read through something Annie posted that research indicates that the brain is pretty much readapted after two years.
I cannot remember exactly anymore, but I'd say I have had cravings off and on every so often now. It seems psychological now. I feel the urge to drink most strongly when I cannot meet the needs of all my family members -- like my husband wants X and my daughter desperately does NOT want X (and both need me to provide or limit X)
I think I mentioned here on this thread an uptick in cravings maybe a month or two ago but I did associate that with general Pandemic related stress. Curious though as I was just about hitting the 2 year mark. I'd be interested to know that the brain readapts after 2 years!
I'm at a year and a half since I gave up my ~20-year habit of nightly wine-drinking. I've had about a dozen drinks since then, mostly clustered here and there on a few trips, last one being about 6 months ago. I'm not sure whether that affects cravings or not. I certainly don't feel deprived, nor do I any longer think of myself as 'a drinker'.
So, depending on what you mean by 'cravings', I still regularly get a passing 'ping' or 'tug' at home during cocktail hour, esp if I have low blood sugar or am feeling stressed. Historically, this is when 90% of my drinking happened, and it's where the vast majority of my triggers are. This 'ping' happens despite the fact that I haven't had a drink at home during cocktail hour in the entire 1.5 years. These feelings are not strong usually, but typically flicker through my mind and pass away most nights.
The strong cravings I've had since I did the Annie Grace program have been triggered by sudden unexpected stress combining with cocktail hour, or social pressure combined with low blood sugar. There have only been a few of them during the past year and a half, and they can kind of blind-side me when they happen. I suspect they have more 'teeth' b/c those triggers are so sporadic that I rarely get a chance to 'practice' dealing with them.
I sometimes wonder if I'll ever be 100% free of cravings (it's not a big deal if I'm not...cravings can't hurt me and they always pass; but it is just something I need to stay aware of). After all, I don't think our brains 'dismantle' neural networks for automated behaviors once they are built. If I didn't drive a car for ten years, I'm pretty sure I could still sit down in the driver's seat, put the key in the ignition, and pretty automatically remember how to drive.
Yeah, the neural pathways are never totally gone if they were well established and reinforced to begin with. I'm not sure I would consider drinking an automated behaviour as a opposed to a habitual one, but that's the neuroscientist in me being finicky.
I'm not sure either. I'm not sure what driving is, technically speaking, either.
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I was much happier all those years I didn’t drink and had no problem resisting social pressure. I have had some very stressful things happen in the last 2 weeks and zero urge to drink. I consider that very lucky and hope it continues. I have flavored sparkling water at wine time. I am not going to get complacent because you never know when it will rear it’s ugly head.
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I was much happier all those years I didn’t drink and had no problem resisting social pressure. I have had some very stressful things happen in the last 2 weeks and zero urge to drink. I consider that very lucky and hope it continues. I have flavored sparkling water at wine time. I am not going to get complacent because you never know when it will rear it’s ugly head.
That is great that you had zero urge to drink!
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A second weekend down without booze. Much easier than usual as my OH has also quit for the time being.
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A second weekend down without booze. Much easier than usual as my OH has also quit for the time being.
It took me a little bit to understand this sentence, because to me "OH" means alcohol.
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That’s great stubble! My husband rarely drinks at home and is only a occasional one.
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@Malcat it's always been the third wheel in any relationship I've ever been in...!
@Cassie thank you! We both drink a LOT in our house, come from very heavy drinking family and friends so it's always felt normal, but the older I get the more I realise that it is definitely not normal.
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I'm giving up alcohol for a bit.
I'm trying to get pregnant. I'm not under the illusion that drinking has HUGE fertility effects, but at the same time it began to seem really perverse to me, given how desperate I am for a baby, that I was regularly indulging in an unhealthy and entirely optional activity that might impact fertility. If I'm at the stage where I'm trying to move the needle by resorting to prayer & old wives' tales (and I AM at that point) I should also be willing to make actual healthy changes in my life.
MrKat hardly drinks, and because of covid I barely see anyone else, so this should be an easy time to do it. My last drink was August 14th. If I'm not pregnant by the Christmas season, I will likely let myself drink then. So let's say initially that I am setting myself the challenge of no drinking until December 1st. Hopefully I get pregnant and end up going a lot longer than that.
Thanks for this thread. At the weekend, I read all the way through from the beginning :)
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@katekat welcome aboard and nice to see you here. I have my fingers crossed for you.
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I think it’s a good idea not to drink when you are trying to conceive. I hope you have good news soon.
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thanks for the welcome and encouragement guys! I started The Alcohol Experiment yesterday (obviously didn't get the full benefit of the 'examine your drinking' since I had already stopped drinking) so we'll see whether that's helpful. I might have more to say as I go through it, but at the very least I'll check in after The Alcohol Experiment is over and share what I thought of it :)
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I have a good friend that considers herself a alcoholic. She has been sober 40 years. When I quit drinking my best friend and her husband did too. My friend said she thinks there are many more people with drinking problems than alcoholics. She said that the problem is you never know when you will slip over to the other side. She said true alcoholics have great difficulty quitting. The fact that many people don’t have a hard time quitting means that they haven’t crossed the line yet. She went to AA for a year but quit after that because she didn’t want to trade one addiction for another. I found her prospective interesting.
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I do feel it is strange to be sober 40 years and still call yourself an alcoholic. There are ranges and we may not all fit into one category of drinkers. I feel I may have been a gray area drinker. I do feel I was addicted to alcohol, and I feel that alcohol is an addictive substance. So while I feel that I have been an addict I do not feel like I am still addicted to alcohol. It has been a year this time, and initially difficult but not that difficult. These days it is easy to say no.
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I am just checking in to say: still not drinking alcohol. It is surprising how little I miss the actual drinking. What I am having trouble with is the social expectations around not having alcohol. Everyone in my social circle drinks wine with meals. Their feelings of how much I am missing by not consuming are kind of hard to come to terms with.
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My friend said she knows if she had a drink it wouldn’t be long until she was down the rabbit hole again. Even after all this time she considers herself a alcoholic. On the naked mind support group one woman relapsed after 27 years. Frugal, you could bring a special drink for yourself for social occasions. They do make non alcoholic wine and beer.
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My friend said she knows if she had a drink it wouldn’t be long until she was down the rabbit hole again. Even after all this time she considers herself a alcoholic. On the naked mind support group one woman relapsed after 27 years. Frugal, you could bring a special drink for yourself for social occasions. They do make non alcoholic wine and beer.
Yeah, presumably everyone exists on a 'risk for abuse bellcurve' comprising a combo of genetic risk factors, conditioning, and personal habits and choice. People can call themselves whatever they want, for sure, though I don't think there are very clear scientific criteria for what is called 'an alcoholic'. Personally, I haven't had any issue with going down the rabbit-hole to resuming daily drinking again by drinking a small number of drinks this past year, but I sure won't get complacent about that risk ever.
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Most people that try to moderate end up back to their previous level of drinking plus more. My best friend and her husband also quit a week after I did. We have all tried to moderate and in the long term were unsuccessful. I am glad you can wenchsenior. My friend with all the sobriety is so non judgmental. She doesn’t care what others do and goes to parties with no judgment and never says a word if people get drunk. She figures it’s everyone’s own personal business.
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I am just checking in to say: still not drinking alcohol. It is surprising how little I miss the actual drinking. What I am having trouble with is the social expectations around not having alcohol. Everyone in my social circle drinks wine with meals. Their feelings of how much I am missing by not consuming are kind of hard to come to terms with.
Well that sucks. I'd be pretty annoyed with anyone who gave me a hard time about not drinking. Frankly, it says a lot more about them than it does about you. They're probably feeling threatened and defensive about their own habits. Still doesn't mean it's OK for them to make you feel badly about your choices.
IME the social expectation part got easier with time. I was never much of a drinker, but quit entirely in 2016 due to symptoms from a heart defect. Eventually, all my contacts figured out I don't drink anymore so I didn't have to keep dealing with the uncertainty of how each person might react. Gatherings where kids are present can be easier since you can just opt for whatever special drink the kids are having. Although I'm always happy to just drink tap water. As time went on, I also got more confident in my decision not to drink and that confidence makes people even more reluctant to question me.
Anyway, it turned out that I had zero push back and not a single person questioned me about it so all the worry was just in my head.
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I am just checking in to say: still not drinking alcohol. It is surprising how little I miss the actual drinking. What I am having trouble with is the social expectations around not having alcohol. Everyone in my social circle drinks wine with meals. Their feelings of how much I am missing by not consuming are kind of hard to come to terms with.
Well that sucks. I'd be pretty annoyed with anyone who gave me a hard time about not drinking. Frankly, it says a lot more about them than it does about you. They're probably feeling threatened and defensive about their own habits. Still doesn't mean it's OK for them to make you feel badly about your choices.
IME the social expectation part got easier with time. I was never much of a drinker, but quit entirely in 2016 due to symptoms from a heart defect. Eventually, all my contacts figured out I don't drink anymore so I didn't have to keep dealing with the uncertainty of how each person might react. Gatherings where kids are present can be easier since you can just opt for whatever special drink the kids are having. Although I'm always happy to just drink tap water. As time went on, I also got more confident in my decision not to drink and that confidence makes people even more reluctant to question me.
Anyway, it turned out that I had zero push back and not a single person questioned me about it so all the worry was just in my head.
I guess it is harder for my social circle to come to terms with because I have always been a drinker - and many of them met me through parties and drinking events. Hell the DH and I got married at a winery. Food and drink is part of our family culture.
Friday night my neighbour was hosting happy hour on his front lawn as we do every Friday night...and this is his last Friday as an employee. Today he retires after 39..43 (I can't remember). He pulled out a bottle of champagne for a toast. I drank the smallest mouthful and felt awful for a couple of hours. The headache! Well that was a lesson.
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I have been practicing saying no to booze more lately and it feels good. I like having the excuse of being designated driver, but I also need to be able to refuse just because I don't want it. I'm trying to lose weight and the calories from alcohol are just wasted, plus getting super drunk is losing its appeal.
I've also been observing people's behaviour around alcohol, and heavy drinkers seem to always want company and don't like to take no for an answer. Most other people don't seem to care and people don't notice if I have sparkling water vs something alcoholic in my hand.
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If someone presses the issue I just say it doesn’t agree with my medication. Your real friends won’t care. If I felt compelled to do a toast I would just pretend to drink it.
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Got through the traditionally very boozy late August holiday weekend sober. Woop woop
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4 weeks today and I don’t miss it at all. I am down 11lbs without trying. I did add some wrinkles to my face. Ugh!
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4 weeks today and I don’t miss it at all. I am down 11lbs without trying. I did add some wrinkles to my face. Ugh!
Nice! and also, commiseration. I didn't get any change in appearance from giving up drinking except whiter teeth. It did not magically cause my eyes to not be red and puffy, didn't de-age me etc. Didn't change my weight either, so you've got me beat there at least!
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WS, that’s a bummer. My skin looks much better but let’s face it at 66 it is what it is:))
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I hit a year no beer, and today sold most of my beer brewing equipment.
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Bike, that’s great!
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@BikeFanatic That's excellent! My partner still brews so I didn't give away the kit I used to make ginger beer in but I think it's days are numbered - I recently offered it to a friend who was thinking about making kombucha.
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For anyone that needs more support you can go to nakedmindcommunity.com. If you join that you will also be invited to Annie’s closed group on Facebook. Both are very supportive. Hope everyone is doing well.
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Thats a great idea, I assume that the support group is free or nearly so. THANKS for the support here as well
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Yes both are free. She also has products sh sells such as coaching, etc but I don’t need that. It’s great for people that do. The last 5 weeks have flown by. My best friend and her husband joined me a week after I started. That’s helpful because I spend the night at her house once a week.
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So, I cut my retirement very short and jumped into insane full time work for the first time in years. I got lured into a HUGE, once in a lifetime project that I couldn't say no to.
Anyway, this first week was like walking through a wall of fire. It's been absolutely brain-exploding insane, and *exactly* the kind of experience where upon arriving home there would be no better sound than the cork coming out of a bottle of red.
Not drinking has been so much better.
Annie Grace talks about alcohol being a switch, when our emotions are too intense, alcohol acts as a switch that allows us to feel something else. It allows us to pivot away from the feeling, even just temporarily.
What I have realized though is that switch prevents us from processing those intense feelings, so they just stick around. Now after work, sure, I have to spend some time with those crazy feelings, but they pass, and then I have the rest of my evening to relax.
If I drank, all it did was buy me some time, but the feelings just got pushed back, and then actually amplified by the alcohol. Why? Because if those feelings made you drink in the first place, then your brain will hop right back on them to try and get you to drink more, because that's how alcohol works.
So that "relaxing" glass of wine actually set me up to experience my feelings even more uncomfortably than I would have if I just dealt with them efficiently.
So now, I have my crazy days, I'm a little whacky when I get home for about 30-40 minutes, then I have a chill evening, sleep soundly, wake up alert, do my morning stretches, and hop back into the crazy for another round.
The work is still new, so maybe over time this will change, but no matter what, I see that there's no way that alcohol, even a single glass, would in any way actually help the situation.
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I so agree with above, it took me a while to see that alcohol was not helping me deal with life, emotional issues and really anything. Just a temporary switch to shut off my brain, and so mot worth the blah feeling the next day and perhaps the next day morning anxiety is also worse fue to the sub clinical withdrawal that I keenly felt after even small doses of alcohol.
Here is an Annie Grace video, she starts by talking about the pink cloud, then goes on about her own experiences, maybe nothing new here for a regular follower but I think good for anyone new to quitting alcohol (even if only quitting for a month).
Keeping
track of my feelings and how my body felt really helped me later when I considered going back to alcohol.
https://youtu.be/T8I--oVcs9o
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It’s amazing that we think alcohol relaxes us but it really doesn’t in the long term. In 5 weeks I have wanted to drink 3x’s and 2 were this week. The feeling doesn’t last long. 2 were in social situations where others were drinking and I had alcohol free beer. Drinking in the evening became a thing when I retired. My friend and I didn’t have any bad physical issues with quitting like many on the Facebook group but it’s probably because we weren’t drinking to that level thankfully.
One thing I find sad is all the encouraging moms to drink to cope with kids, homeschooling, etc. It’s meant to be funny but really it’s not.
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The first time I posted about alcohol on the boards was in 2017. That time I made it 18 days, which was the longest time without alcohol since I was 17.
The second time I posted was this year during my second attempt at giving up, when I was 77 days without alcohol. I’m happy to say I’m still doing it. Now at 304 days.
I feel good, I sleep well, I got my lowest ever cholesterol test a couple of months ago.
The Covid thing has actually been a help. Less social events to attend equals less temptation.
I still sometimes get the craving in the evening. Zero alcohol beers help me. Busch NA is a new favorite – tastes ok, cheap. I also put cranberry juice in a wine glass and sip at it. Whatever works.
I have dreams about drinking. Usually I’m drinking a beer and then suddenly realize that I don’t drink anymore, and I’m upset for letting myself down. Weird. I do sleep better, though.
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Hi Adrian,
I used to have the same dream! Now when I do dream that I am about to have a beer, I realize I don’t drink this is a dream! It actually took me 10 or 11 months to really sink in that I am never going back to drinking. At this point , just over a year, I have the confidence to say no I am not just going abstinence to try it out, I am truly now a non drinker.
PS I like Heineken zero, but the best NA beer is athletic brewing in CT and San Diego. They ship free and the beer is amazing. Taste just like real beer.
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I see that there's no way that alcohol, even a single glass, would in any way actually help the situation.
That was a much more eloquent description of my experience than I'd have been able to write. Even though I barely drank before quitting I was surprised that it still took some effort to go from a couple glasses a month to zero. Apparently I'd developed a habit of having a drink after a tougher than average day and when I suddenly didn't have that outlet any more I had to <gasp> feel my feelings. For a short while I used house cleaning as an alternate outlet, but sadly that didn't last very long.
Anyway, it didn't take long before I was able to process whatever feelings I was having more quickly and with less drama. Now there's no possible situation where a drink would improve anything. Even in March/April, which was one of the most stressful periods in my life, I didn't want a drink.
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The first time I posted about alcohol on the boards was in 2017. That time I made it 18 days, which was the longest time without alcohol since I was 17.
The second time I posted was this year during my second attempt at giving up, when I was 77 days without alcohol. I’m happy to say I’m still doing it. Now at 304 days.
I feel good, I sleep well, I got my lowest ever cholesterol test a couple of months ago.
The Covid thing has actually been a help. Less social events to attend equals less temptation.
I still sometimes get the craving in the evening. Zero alcohol beers help me. Busch NA is a new favorite – tastes ok, cheap. I also put cranberry juice in a wine glass and sip at it. Whatever works.
I have dreams about drinking. Usually I’m drinking a beer and then suddenly realize that I don’t drink anymore, and I’m upset for letting myself down. Weird. I do sleep better, though.
So exciting! Congratulations! (And I still get dreams about drinking occasionally, even though I almost entirely gave it up a year and a half ago, and haven't had a drop in more than 6 months).
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I have been on 2 blood pressure medications for 10 years. 6 weeks AF and I no longer need one of the medications and my BP is great. Down 12 pounds. I am guessing that the weight loss is coming to a end because I wasn’t super overweight. Continue to feel great and this whole journey has been relatively easy. Most of my friends have been very supportive except for one. She has made weird comments and I think it’s making her uncomfortable. She has said she can’t imagine never drinking. When we went to their house for dinner I brought my AF beer. She said she wondered what I was going to drink.
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I have been on 2 blood pressure medications for 10 years. 6 weeks AF and I no longer need one of the medications and my BP is great. Down 12 pounds. I am guessing that the weight loss is coming to a end because I wasn’t super overweight. Continue to feel great and this whole journey has been relatively easy. Most of my friends have been very supportive except for one. She has made weird comments and I think it’s making her uncomfortable. She has said she can’t imagine never drinking. When we went to their house for dinner I brought my AF beer. She said she wondered what I was going to drink.
Wow, that's fantastic! Good for you.
Your friend is probably just feeling defensive. Just give her some time to deal with her feelings. If she keeps being rude about it, then you can reevaluate your relationship with her.
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Trmama, 3 days after I quit my best friend and her husband also quit and we all are friends and do dinners together sometimes. When my friend told her that they both also quit the look on her face was funny. Her husband didn’t care. Honestly I don’t think it’s going to really be a problem.
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My friends came for dinner Thursday and she got super drunk and annoying. My husband was happily buzzed and her husband never drinks enough to notice a difference. By the end of the evening I was so ready for them to go and she got almost belligerent to the point that I got up and cleaned up the kitchen and her husband joined me. He was practically dragging her out the door at the end. More people in our friends group quit after I did and I think it’s triggering her.
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Thought I would update this thread. 4 months AF with a weight loss of 22 pounds. I feel great and have a back problem that’s greatly improved. To mark the day we are getting takeout and I donated money to our local people and animal shelters. I also bought some new clothes. Still money ahead to put into savings. Hope everyone is doing well.
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Thought I would update this thread. 4 months AF with a weight loss of 22 pounds. I feel great and have a back problem that’s greatly improved. To mark the day we are getting takeout and I donated money to our local people and animal shelters. I also bought some new clothes. Still money ahead to put into savings. Hope everyone is doing well.
That extra money to donate every month is one my favorite things!
About a month ago, in celebration of the election results, my husband and I had a couple of shots of expensive Irish whiskey that was a gift from friends. It's been languishing in the cupboard, and I last had a bit of it last winter, and it still tastes amazing. But blech...the buzz was not even very pleasant. It's very weird to me that I believed that buzzed feeling was so worth pursuing for so many years. It's so short-lived before it turns into the blahs...fuzzy and low energy. And the ebb in energy lingered a bit into the next day (which I never noticed back when I was drinking regularly).
Prior to the whiskey, it had been about 8 months since I last had a drink; and having the whiskey just made me want another long stretch like that.
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That is great news Cassie! I felt at my best at about 6 months alcohol free. I wish you continued success, I envy the weight loss.
I am at one year and 3 months ( this time) and do not expect to go back to drinking ever. I think I made that final decision at 11 months. Really can't think of a reason to go back.
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I don’t miss feeling tired after drinking either. I didn’t start drinking until age 50 and obviously was a mistake. Definitely not going back.
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I had about two ounces of white wine with dinner last week. I didn't have any noticeable side effects but I also didn't have great joy in having the alcohol with my meal. So on the weekend when we were having a stew that I made with some red wine, I didn't bother to have a glass (to finish the bottle). With me not drinking our alcohol spending is way down because DH will not open a bottle just for himself.
(on the plus side, I stopped drinking to help with symptoms of PTSD. The symptoms have not been present since I really cut back to nearly stopped entirely. And the odd glass of wine is not causing them to return. Or am I returning to previous patterns of consumption) I think my new "not much of a drinker" behaviour is working for me. Bring on the holidays! So much of our Christmas traditions revolve around alcohol.
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Frugal, it sounds like what you are doing is working great. I have anxiety and my medication is working much better without alcohol.
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Still not drinking here, coming up on a year Jan 1st, with no intention of restarting despite having clearance from my MD to drink again if I want to.
I also still can't stand the smell or taste of alcohol anymore and don't feel the need to re-acquire a liking of it just so that I can drink again.
I think this is because I never originally acquired a taste for hard liquor. I always felt that the godawful taste of vodka really ruined a bloody Ceasar. I acquired a taste for wine and non-strong beer, but that's the extent of it, so it was easy for me to lose my taste for all alcohol.
DH has barely drank at all this year and hasn't had any for the past 3 months and he can still enjoy the taste. To me it's literally like trying to swallow gasoline now.
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I can still appreciate the smell of the beer my husband brews but zero desire to drink it. I am coming up 3.5 years now and it remains one of the best decisions I ever made.
I think I mentioned this earlier but for anyone struggling/wanting a super supportive group, reddit's stop drinking subreddit are an amazing bunch of people.
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Hello, my name is Steeze. I’m an alcoholic.
I have been a severe binge drinker at times in my life but have had it mostly in control the last few years. The last time I was really out of control ended up with two years of court ordered sobriety, counseling, education and community service followed by a couple years of self imposed sobriety. Slowly though the booze crept in. A beer here, a scotch there, usually only at company outings. I thought I could control it. I’ve definitely made some mistakes in recent years, but it was usually just one or two blowouts a year with being more or less sober in between.
Over the summer I was at a house warming party and got toasted in front of my pregnant wife. I broke my first rule - don’t drink in front of people you love. She was up late, around people smoking and being obnoxious, and had to drive me home, and she doesn’t like to drive.
Looking back I had drank nearly every day for months. Started with a beer at dinner on a Friday, then 2, then 3. Friday turned into a weekend, then a lime-Rita or two, then a scotch at dinner, then a double. Took almost a year for the progression. The lock down exacerbated the situation, I was bored, nothing to do, might as well have a drink right? And what fun is drinking if you don’t catch a little buzz?
Following the house warming incident I was embarrassed and decided to quit again. October was around the corner so I created a sober October group with my friends to make it easier (no one else made it through the month). I am about 12 weeks sober now. Think I will keep it going for the foreseeable future. My son is due in March and deserves a good role model. I hope he never sees me drunk.
Luckily the Christmas party was cancelled as were just about every other event. Should be easy to lay low. Will be a long time before people are even asking to go to a bar or throw a party with the pandemic in full swing.
On the wagon again - but a wise man once told me, you haven’t quit until your on your death bed looking back at all the sober years knowing that you’ll never be able to have a drink again. I, like many addicts, have to quit over and over again. May this time be the last.
Congrats to all the sober people here!
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I hope you make it Steze, 4 months is great, maybe try a year?
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Steeze, you have lots to look forward to with a baby on the way. Glad you are sober. Sounds like you are ready to commit to a alcohol free lifestyle.
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Good luck, Steeze. Don't have a wife or kids but I can relate to the struggle of staying sober from drugs & alcohol.
Approaching 4 months for me. I am on medication that exacerbates hangover impacts so I have had little desire to drink.
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I'm in.
I'm trying out the Alcohol Experiment for 30 days. My expectation is that it'll stick for the duration.
Cheers!
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Good luck Steeze. I hope you can find ways to cope with stress that is not so destructive.
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I'm in.
I'm trying out the Alcohol Experiment for 30 days. My expectation is that it'll stick for the duration.
Cheers!
I recommend reading This Naked Mind at the same time, the two work really synergistically together IMO.
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I cut back severely on alcohol and it’s really saved me some money while also helping me physically feel better. I realized just how much pressure there is on people in our culture to drink. It’s in every TV show, every movie, commercials, print ads with beautiful people, etc. I was watching “Supergirl” on TV which is a family show and I realized that every episode ended with the characters sitting together with a bottle of wine. I don’t know how we let it get this bad. So much misery comes from excessive drinking. We need to make more people aware of it.
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Thanks for the support everyone!
Should be pretty easy - I don't have cravings or any physical / mental / social dependency this time around. Just something that I am too scared to lose if I mess up, which makes the decision easy.
I think the main struggle I have now is accepting my life is and will remain a cross between the movies Pleasantville and Groundhogs Day. How do you get excited about that? Sometimes I just want to do something risky, dangerous, and irresponsible - just let things get wild and out of control to see how far it can go, ya know? Hopefully I can find a healthy outlet for all that (I say this with my arm in a sling from skateboarding a handrail a couple weeks ago). As messed up as my life was, at least it was interesting. People ask me what I am up to now and its, "oh, still doing the same thing, just working a ton, trying to save." I don't even have a good story anymore! Of course there is the getting married, kids, etc. which is great, but predictable and basic life progression items. Maybe once we are FI and can move abroad that will fill the void a bit. Go live in Cambodia or something.
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I cut back severely on alcohol and it’s really saved me some money while also helping me physically feel better. I realized just how much pressure there is on people in our culture to drink. It’s in every TV show, every movie, commercials, print ads with beautiful people, etc. I was watching “Supergirl” on TV which is a family show and I realized that every episode ended with the characters sitting together with a bottle of wine. I don’t know how we let it get this bad. So much misery comes from excessive drinking. We need to make more people aware of it.
Oh yeah, tv is brutal for that.
People on tv drink CONSTANTLY. It's as if there cannot possibly be a single scene of anyone socializing or even conversing without alcohol.
There's also never anyone who's like "no thanks, I don't drink" unless they're a recovering alcoholic.
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I notice that in TV and movies a lot. Not to mention memes about drinking all over social media, often about moms using wine to cope with their kids. It's kinda sad and it all adds to the impression that everyone is drinking all the time, which just isn't true.
I've been doing pretty good lately, I don't have my usual social activities that include drinking and I don't really feel the urge to drink on my own. I think I've only had something to drink about 4 times in the past 6 weeks and each time has been only a small amount. This time last year I was probably drinking 3-5 nights a week, so it's a huge improvement for me and it feels good.
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Thanks for the support everyone!
Should be pretty easy - I don't have cravings or any physical / mental / social dependency this time around. Just something that I am too scared to lose if I mess up, which makes the decision easy.
I think the main struggle I have now is accepting my life is and will remain a cross between the movies Pleasantville and Groundhogs Day. How do you get excited about that? Sometimes I just want to do something risky, dangerous, and irresponsible - just let things get wild and out of control to see how far it can go, ya know? Hopefully I can find a healthy outlet for all that (I say this with my arm in a sling from skateboarding a handrail a couple weeks ago). As messed up as my life was, at least it was interesting. People ask me what I am up to now and its, "oh, still doing the same thing, just working a ton, trying to save." I don't even have a good story anymore! Of course there is the getting married, kids, etc. which is great, but predictable and basic life progression items. Maybe once we are FI and can move abroad that will fill the void a bit. Go live in Cambodia or something.
Your response above reminds me of a motivational speaker i once saw, who used to do all sorts of risky things. IIRC, he loved BASE jumping. He said that one day he realized he was more afraid of living than dying. From there he was able to use that newfound knowledge to get himself in a spot to cut out the risky behavior. Unfortunately, I don’t recall the all the details and I’m, admittedly, not that knowledgeable on the topic, but I think it’s something to consider. What is it in real life that you’re afraid of, that leads you to engage in risky behavior for fun?
Nice job on cutting out the drinking. Sounds like it was the right decision for you.
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Thanks for the support everyone!
Should be pretty easy - I don't have cravings or any physical / mental / social dependency this time around. Just something that I am too scared to lose if I mess up, which makes the decision easy.
I think the main struggle I have now is accepting my life is and will remain a cross between the movies Pleasantville and Groundhogs Day. How do you get excited about that? Sometimes I just want to do something risky, dangerous, and irresponsible - just let things get wild and out of control to see how far it can go, ya know? Hopefully I can find a healthy outlet for all that (I say this with my arm in a sling from skateboarding a handrail a couple weeks ago). As messed up as my life was, at least it was interesting. People ask me what I am up to now and its, "oh, still doing the same thing, just working a ton, trying to save." I don't even have a good story anymore! Of course there is the getting married, kids, etc. which is great, but predictable and basic life progression items. Maybe once we are FI and can move abroad that will fill the void a bit. Go live in Cambodia or something.
Your response above reminds me of a motivational speaker i once saw, who used to do all sorts of risky things. IIRC, he loved BASE jumping. He said that one day he realized he was more afraid of living than dying. From there he was able to use that newfound knowledge to get himself in a spot to cut out the risky behavior. Unfortunately, I don’t recall the all the details and I’m, admittedly, not that knowledgeable on the topic, but I think it’s something to consider. What is it in real life that you’re afraid of, that leads you to engage in risky behavior for fun?
Nice job on cutting out the drinking. Sounds like it was the right decision for you.
It would probably be easier to scratch the “exciting experience” itch if the pandemic wasn’t happening and people could travel again. I’ve been trying to get those hits of dopamine by using a virtual reality headset to visit exotic locations and have interesting experiences. It’s not quite the same as actually being somewhere new doing something exciting, but it helps a lot. With technology being what it is today, you can do VR with your smartphone with a simple cardboard headset you can buy online, so it’s not even all that expensive to do, which keeps it Mustachian.
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Thanks for the support everyone!
Should be pretty easy - I don't have cravings or any physical / mental / social dependency this time around. Just something that I am too scared to lose if I mess up, which makes the decision easy.
I think the main struggle I have now is accepting my life is and will remain a cross between the movies Pleasantville and Groundhogs Day. How do you get excited about that? Sometimes I just want to do something risky, dangerous, and irresponsible - just let things get wild and out of control to see how far it can go, ya know? Hopefully I can find a healthy outlet for all that (I say this with my arm in a sling from skateboarding a handrail a couple weeks ago). As messed up as my life was, at least it was interesting. People ask me what I am up to now and its, "oh, still doing the same thing, just working a ton, trying to save." I don't even have a good story anymore! Of course there is the getting married, kids, etc. which is great, but predictable and basic life progression items. Maybe once we are FI and can move abroad that will fill the void a bit. Go live in Cambodia or something.
So there's a void you feel that needs filling.
That's fine, everyone has that at some point, but the mistake is to try and fill it with external things. People always try to do this with jobs, achievements, beauty, possessions, or in your case, risk taking.
You mention not having a "good story", but truly, what does that matter? Nobody gives a shit about the things you've done, so how they perceive your stories doesn't really matter.
Besides, you can spin literally anything, so if your stories are sounding boring it's because you've decided they're boring.
So then it's a matter of actually living these adventures. What do these risky experiences mean to you? What unmet need are they trying to satisfy?
Why is risk taking your definition of adventure? A lot of adventure is low risk. I've had some wild adventures that involved very little risk, a TON of challenge, but no appreciable risk to me other than failing at what I was trying to do.
Why is your definition of "interesting" predicated on recklessness?
Also, why are you choosing to perceive getting married and having kids as boring? There's a reason most people leave behind the type of risk taking you're talking about, and that's because marriage and kids is incredibly challenging. Just because most people do it doesn't mean it's easy.
Oh, and the risk to your personal wellbeing is ENORMOUS. Marriage and kids might not snap your spine in half, but it can sure eviscerate your mental health, sanity, if you're like most people, compromise your physical health through increasing neglect of your own self care. Divorce can also fuck your finances as badly as a cocaine problem.
Now that's personal risk.
To me, there is nothing more risky than having children. I don't have any and the whole thing just looks fucking insane to me. Hardcore, incredibly dangerous to your mental health and marriage, and a HUGE risk of taking on the unknown because you have absolutely no way of predicting if your kid grows up to be a monster.
You want risk? You want to be pushed to your limits? You want to feel like you're always on the end of losing control in your life?
Have a kid.
I don't have kids and never will, I don't have the stomach for that insanity. I also happen to be someone who has lived a far too interesting life, filled with astronomical risks, and yeah, I've got some fucking insane stories, but even then, as I said, no one really gives a shit.
None of this is to say that there's anything wrong with wanting to adventure and to live an unconventional life. Tons of people do it in mentally healthy ways. However, what I'm hearing from you sounds more like psychological discomfort with your life, which is concerning, and I recommend digging into it now before a baby usurps all of your emotional resources.
I also caution heavily against just projecting out your ideal life to some imagined future. Living for the future absolutely poisons your present. Figure out what it is that you aren't satisfied with in your current life. It may be your circumstances, which you can change, it it may be something emotional underneath, which hey, you can also change ;)
Lastly, in terms of alcohol, I really responded well to Allen Carr's book. It completely reframed alcohol for me, and I no longer see it as this fun-adding thing. My main reason for not drinking anymore now is that it's lame, and it's something boring people do to try and fake feeling cool.
If I want my life to be more interesting, I have to *be* more interesting and make it that way. Pouring a drink is just a sad imitation of interesting. It's what people do to prevent themselves from actually doing anything, to keep themselves in their bored holding patterns.
Drinking made me more boring, not sobriety. Sobriety makes boredom more uncomfortable, which makes me far more likely to be more interesting.
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Your response above reminds me of a motivational speaker i once saw, who used to do all sorts of risky things. IIRC, he loved BASE jumping. He said that one day he realized he was more afraid of living than dying. From there he was able to use that newfound knowledge to get himself in a spot to cut out the risky behavior. Unfortunately, I don’t recall the all the details and I’m, admittedly, not that knowledgeable on the topic, but I think it’s something to consider. What is it in real life that you’re afraid of, that leads you to engage in risky behavior for fun?
Nice job on cutting out the drinking. Sounds like it was the right decision for you.
In the early days I think it was a bit of depression and an attitude of nothing to lose, disregard for life, and a bit of feeling disadvantaged. Used to say that I’d rather die with adrenaline in my veins and a smile on my face than grow old. At some point I think an actual addiction to adrenaline took over.
In general I was a pretty angry young person, hated my parents for being poor, and hated every person with more money than me for having an easier life. Took me a lot of years to break out of that mindset.
Perhaps now the idea of arriving at the end of life without having lived an authentic life - of never becoming the eccentric, the artist, the explorer, the builder, the athlete. What if I grow old and never accomplish anything out of the ordinary? What if I never become self reliant? Never homestead? So scared of risk that you’re doomed to have an unremarkable life. What if you spend your whole life only doing what your supposed to do?
I have this idea that if you were to graph the experiences of your life over time it would look like a graph of a sine wave. The best of times at positive 1, the worst of times at -1, these are your “peak experiences”. When you look back over your life your memories are these peak experiences and everything else fades into nothing. By forcing your life to be reserved, restrained, safe, and secure you are dampening your sine wave, never reaching the extremes. A life filled with unrememberable days.
ETA: funny thing about drinking - a lot of time was spent drinking to forget the day. Or at parties with people I no longer remember. Some of those times I do remember I wish I did not. Hell, most of the times I wish I could forget were times I was drinking - seems that wildness doesn’t always have the intended effect.
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@Malcat - your right about having a kid being an enormous risk. It is probably the scariest thing I’ve ever done. So much is out of my control, just sit and wait and hope that life will not be completely derailed by the unexpected. It is terrifying.
I also don’t mean to say that getting married and having kids is boring - it is an adventure in itself. My wife is the best thing that ever happened to me, she is precious. I’m scared of losing her more than anything else in life. I think what I meant by it is that it is predictable and expected, unremarkable in that way. Of course your going to get married and have kids eventually, but what else are you going to accomplish?
Just want to avoid my life being: go to school, go to college, get a job, get married, buy a house, have kids, get promoted, retire, move to Florida, play shuffleboard and bingo until I’m too sick to move, then die in a nursing home. Of course all of those things are adventures, but unremarkable.
But yeah - why the need for a good story? Not sure - maybe it is from my days as a bartender and waiter, always exchanging stories with strangers. Some people are very interesting and have unbelievable life experiences, some are not and you get them their drink and forget them.
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@Steeze I think we are kindred spirits. I've found myself drinking a lot more this year than in the past, just to fill the void, or to calm down. Sometimes when I'm on that third drink it feels like I'm actually having a good time.
Seasonal depression hit me harder than usual this year too. I don't think I'm actually an alcoholic because my "little interest or pleasure in things I normally enjoy" extends to drinking. I've been sober for a little over a week now with no cravings.
I like your sine wave analogy. I recently spoke to a friend from my past, who reminded me of a time when mine was bigger, and I took more risks. Lately I'm feeling trapped by the pandemic and my responsibilities.
On those stories: do you remember the one about the two men in the hospital room? The one next to the window would tell the other one what he saw outside?
Anyway, a good story teller can make anything sound interesting.
ETA I plan to stay sober for a while till I sort some things out
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Thanks for the support everyone!
Should be pretty easy - I don't have cravings or any physical / mental / social dependency this time around. Just something that I am too scared to lose if I mess up, which makes the decision easy.
I think the main struggle I have now is accepting my life is and will remain a cross between the movies Pleasantville and Groundhogs Day. How do you get excited about that? Sometimes I just want to do something risky, dangerous, and irresponsible - just let things get wild and out of control to see how far it can go, ya know? Hopefully I can find a healthy outlet for all that (I say this with my arm in a sling from skateboarding a handrail a couple weeks ago). As messed up as my life was, at least it was interesting. People ask me what I am up to now and its, "oh, still doing the same thing, just working a ton, trying to save." I don't even have a good story anymore! Of course there is the getting married, kids, etc. which is great, but predictable and basic life progression items. Maybe once we are FI and can move abroad that will fill the void a bit. Go live in Cambodia or something.
So there's a void you feel that needs filling.
That's fine, everyone has that at some point, but the mistake is to try and fill it with external things. People always try to do this with jobs, achievements, beauty, possessions, or in your case, risk taking.
You mention not having a "good story", but truly, what does that matter? Nobody gives a shit about the things you've done, so how they perceive your stories doesn't really matter.
Besides, you can spin literally anything, so if your stories are sounding boring it's because you've decided they're boring.
So then it's a matter of actually living these adventures. What do these risky experiences mean to you? What unmet need are they trying to satisfy?
Why is risk taking your definition of adventure? A lot of adventure is low risk. I've had some wild adventures that involved very little risk, a TON of challenge, but no appreciable risk to me other than failing at what I was trying to do.
Why is your definition of "interesting" predicated on recklessness?
Also, why are you choosing to perceive getting married and having kids as boring? There's a reason most people leave behind the type of risk taking you're talking about, and that's because marriage and kids is incredibly challenging. Just because most people do it doesn't mean it's easy.
Oh, and the risk to your personal wellbeing is ENORMOUS. Marriage and kids might not snap your spine in half, but it can sure eviscerate your mental health, sanity, if you're like most people, compromise your physical health through increasing neglect of your own self care. Divorce can also fuck your finances as badly as a cocaine problem.
Now that's personal risk.
To me, there is nothing more risky than having children. I don't have any and the whole thing just looks fucking insane to me. Hardcore, incredibly dangerous to your mental health and marriage, and a HUGE risk of taking on the unknown because you have absolutely no way of predicting if your kid grows up to be a monster.
You want risk? You want to be pushed to your limits? You want to feel like you're always on the end of losing control in your life?
Have a kid.
I don't have kids and never will, I don't have the stomach for that insanity. I also happen to be someone who has lived a far too interesting life, filled with astronomical risks, and yeah, I've got some fucking insane stories, but even then, as I said, no one really gives a shit.
None of this is to say that there's anything wrong with wanting to adventure and to live an unconventional life. Tons of people do it in mentally healthy ways. However, what I'm hearing from you sounds more like psychological discomfort with your life, which is concerning, and I recommend digging into it now before a baby usurps all of your emotional resources.
I also caution heavily against just projecting out your ideal life to some imagined future. Living for the future absolutely poisons your present. Figure out what it is that you aren't satisfied with in your current life. It may be your circumstances, which you can change, it it may be something emotional underneath, which hey, you can also change ;)
Lastly, in terms of alcohol, I really responded well to Allen Carr's book. It completely reframed alcohol for me, and I no longer see it as this fun-adding thing. My main reason for not drinking anymore now is that it's lame, and it's something boring people do to try and fake feeling cool.
If I want my life to be more interesting, I have to *be* more interesting and make it that way. Pouring a drink is just a sad imitation of interesting. It's what people do to prevent themselves from actually doing anything, to keep themselves in their bored holding patterns.
Drinking made me more boring, not sobriety. Sobriety makes boredom more uncomfortable, which makes me far more likely to be more interesting.
Sometimes I just want to bask in Malcat's responses to various threads...
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@Malcat - your right about having a kid being an enormous risk. It is probably the scariest thing I’ve ever done. So much is out of my control, just sit and wait and hope that life will not be completely derailed by the unexpected. It is terrifying.
I also don’t mean to say that getting married and having kids is boring - it is an adventure in itself. My wife is the best thing that ever happened to me, she is precious. I’m scared of losing her more than anything else in life. I think what I meant by it is that it is predictable and expected, unremarkable in that way. Of course your going to get married and have kids eventually, but what else are you going to accomplish?
Just want to avoid my life being: go to school, go to college, get a job, get married, buy a house, have kids, get promoted, retire, move to Florida, play shuffleboard and bingo until I’m too sick to move, then die in a nursing home. Of course all of those things are adventures, but unremarkable.
But yeah - why the need for a good story? Not sure - maybe it is from my days as a bartender and waiter, always exchanging stories with strangers. Some people are very interesting and have unbelievable life experiences, some are not and you get them their drink and forget them.
I've known a lot of those great bar story guys. Some are super cool, some are total fucking losers who think having adventure anecdotes is a personality trait.
I've got a lot of stories I don't tell because they tend to stress people out, and the vast majority of my life is no one's god damn business.
My life now is wonderfully dull. Still, I manage to have a lot of really fascinating and engaging conversations despite my life being intensely and blissfully boring from a risk taking perspective. Far more boring than the life of any parent, and I bask in the mundane magnificence of my virtually risk free existence on a daily basis.
No matter how boring my life gets though, no one has ever accused me of being boring, and no one walks away from a conversation with me without feeling at least a little knocked off kilter because that's how I roll.
I don't need to risk the integrity of my limbs to be interesting. I don't need to risk anything of any importance, nor do I have to harken back to my old days of chaos in order to still feel interesting, like the guy who has to reach back to his highschool days to find the last time he felt his life was exciting. As I said, I rarely actually share my most exceptional history with anyone because I don't connect with it as who I am anymore.
I've also hung around with people who have done the most interesting things on earth, and you know what? They're just normal people like everyone else. Billionaires? Normal people. Stunt people who travel the world setting themselves on fire and jumping from helicopters? Normal people. Gang members? Normal people aside from being dangerous. Spies? Normal people. Combat pilots? Normal people. Professional athletes? Normal people.
People are just people. Some people get deeply affected by their various experiences and some don't. Some become far more interesting, some don't. Some get royally psychologically fucked up, some become infinitely wiser and cooler. It depends.
In the end though, experiences are not who people are.
Who they are is who they are, and every once in awhile you get to meet people who are incredible to spend time with, and the thing all of those people have in common?
They're 100% cool with who they are and don't feel the need to be anything else.
The most exceptional, unusual, fascinating, and subversive thing a person can be in our society is satisfied with themselves.
So if you genuinely don't want your life to be the way you are *choosing* for it to be, then go ahead and do something different. No one is stopping you. However, if it's just nagging you that the life you actually want doesn't fit with some preconceived notion of coolness, then reflect deeply on what actually matters to you, and set your own definition of cool. You absolutely have the power to do so.
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This is my 11th day free of booze and 8th free of caffeine.
Wow.
I've truly not experienced this chemical-free state since I was a young child. It's incredible. Freeing. Joyful. And it gets better each day.
I read The Naked Mind in conjunction with the 30-day experiment, but, frankly, the book does a great job laying bare what I was afraid to be true and quickly accelerated my decision to not drink anymore. The supplemental videos with the experiment dovetail nicely and are great reinforcement.
Thanks for the thread, guys!
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This is my 11th day free of booze and 8th free of caffeine.
Wow.
I've truly not experienced this chemical-free state since I was a young child. It's incredible. Freeing. Joyful. And it gets better each day.
I read The Naked Mind in conjunction with the 30-day experiment, but, frankly, the book does a great job laying bare what I was afraid to be true and quickly accelerated my decision to not drink anymore. The supplemental videos with the experiment dovetail nicely and are great reinforcement.
Thanks for the thread, guys!
The real benefit of the 30 day experiment isn't the videos, it's the exercises. They seem kind of hokey, but there's excellent cognitive research demonstrating how producing content to support an idea is far more solidifying than just receiving a message that resonates with you. That's why teachers engage students with exercises, not just lectures.
That's the rationale behind things like writing down intentions, engaging helps rewire your thinking as an active participant of the information, not just a passive receiver of information.
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I really liked the daily videos from Annie Grace I felt like I was quitting with someone. You can join the alcohol experiment online,(for free) and or buy her book this naked mind. Good luck.
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An unexpected positive side effect of quitting drinking - much fewer mosquito bites. I used to be eaten alive and now they don't seem to bite me nearly as much.
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An unexpected positive side effect of quitting drinking - much fewer mosquito bites. I used to be eaten alive and now they don't seem to bite me nearly as much.
Bad when even the mosquitoes in your area are boozers
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An unexpected positive side effect of quitting drinking - much fewer mosquito bites. I used to be eaten alive and now they don't seem to bite me nearly as much.
Bad when even the mosquitoes in your area are boozers
Must be Wisconsin? :)
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Hey folks, just checked in to say that I gave up the hooch a year ago.
Wowza.
It really was such a good year to not drink, I've gotta say.
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Hey folks, just checked in to say that I gave up the hooch a year ago.
Wowza.
It really was such a good year to not drink, I've gotta say.
Congratulations @Malcat
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I cut back on the booze significantly this past month after getting actual treatment for my anxiety disorder. I had a 2-3 glass/day wine habit and have reduced it to 2-3 per week. I rarely even crave it now, and I feel so good when I wake up in the morning. I lost a couple pounds too.
I did have a couple glasses last night, but after that bottle is empty I'm dry for the rest of January. After that, I'm thinking Saturdays and special occasions only.
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I wonder if we'll get any new Jan 1st joiners/returners??
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I wonder if we'll get any new Jan 1st joiners/returners??
Me! H and I are giving it up for Jan. Not necessarily planning to stop drinking beyond that and we specifically excluded hypothetical in person work happy hours (which there is a zero percent chance of happening this month).
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I guess I will join as well.
Have never been a big drinker but I aim to not drink at all this year.
Curious to see if I can make it.
Exception is probably going to be my birthday when I will get toasted. My family most likely won't stand for non-alcoholic drinks, but I will give it a go but not be insisting, as I don't want to spoil my b/day with any sort of argument.
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It's ten years for me this spring! Life is good free from alcohol. Wishing everyone well who is trying this.
I was an every day drinker in the years before I quit, but it took an emotionally trying experience (divorce) to get me to quit.
So glad i did.
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Hey folks, just checked in to say that I gave up the hooch a year ago.
Wowza.
It really was such a good year to not drink, I've gotta say.
Absolutely. I shudder to think about my mental state right now if I had still been drinking when the pandemic hit...
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It’s been 5 months and I have lost 28 pounds. Welcome to the people just starting!
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I'm going to give it a shot again. I've stopped drinking on and off to try and achieve better sleep and it honestly hasn't worked for me thus far, and I even gained weight the last couple tries.
I'm going to shoot for a minimum of 10 weeks to see if I can get the better sleep going (which I suspect will also help w/ weight loss).
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I'm going to give it a shot again. I've stopped drinking on and off to try and achieve better sleep and it honestly hasn't worked for me thus far, and I even gained weight the last couple tries.
I'm going to shoot for a minimum of 10 weeks to see if I can get the better sleep going (which I suspect will also help w/ weight loss).
It can take quite awhile for sleep to adjust and for cravings to reduce.
I don't think I felt the real benefits until around 12 weeks.
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I felt a bump in energy at 3 months as well and again at six months. I did sleep better after a couple of weeks but a friend says it took a while for her to get to a better place sleep wise. If you do have an insomia problem you could ask your MD or a specialist to prescribe something temporarily. I started Melatonin when I quit drinking as I used Beer to help me sleep. It worked and still mostly works for me.
Good luck on the not drinking, it really takes some time to recover from alcohol , even if you do not drink that much, and it is totally worth it!
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I felt a bump in energy at 3 months as well and again at six months. I did sleep better after a couple of weeks but a friend says it took a while for her to get to a better place sleep wise. If you do have an insomia problem you could ask your MD or a specialist to prescribe something temporarily. I started Melatonin when I quit drinking as I used Beer to help me sleep. It worked and still mostly works for me.
Good luck on the not drinking, it really takes some time to recover from alcohol , even if you do not drink that much, and it is totally worth it!
Yeah, according to Annie Grace's content, it takes a full 10 days for alcohol to stop directly impacting the system. Only after that can the system start really re-equilibrating itself.
A lot of systemic bodily changes take a few months, that's totally normal.
I never got an energy bump because I have an illness that keeps me exhausted, but around 3 months I started waking up much happier. Mornings always sucked, and then suddenly they didn't. I was pretty much instantly in a decent to good mood the moment I woke up.
I have no idea if that was the alcohol or the absence of craving coffee, but it was probably both.
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I'm going to give it a shot again. I've stopped drinking on and off to try and achieve better sleep and it honestly hasn't worked for me thus far, and I even gained weight the last couple tries.
I'm going to shoot for a minimum of 10 weeks to see if I can get the better sleep going (which I suspect will also help w/ weight loss).
Anxiety was causing both my insomnia and my alcohol cravings. I take trazodone and an SSRI and I sleep so much better now. When I wasn't on the meds I was white-knucling through my alcohol free stints, and I really didn't get any better sleep.
I can now have the occasional drink without craving it every day. I'm still going to go alcohol-free until social gatherings resume!! I feel so much better when I wake up in the morning if I don't drink.
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Luckily after a week I felt great and my sleep returned. It took my friend 3 months for this to happen. It’s really individual. Then without drinking I am sure my anxiety medication could finally work.
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Thanks all for the posts on how long it took everyone's bodies to reset. I remember being very discouraged the last time I posted on this thread because so many people were like "I feel so much after 10 days!" and I was on week 5 w/ no noticeable improvements.
I'll commit to trying this out again for 3 months and then re-evaluating. I really want better sleep and I want my body to just feel better. I certainly don't drink too much compared to the wide world, but maybe I drink too much for my body? But I feel so crappy all of the time that I'm willing to give it a shot again.
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Thanks all for the posts on how long it took everyone's bodies to reset. I remember being very discouraged the last time I posted on this thread because so many people were like "I feel so much after 10 days!" and I was on week 5 w/ no noticeable improvements.
I'll commit to trying this out again for 3 months and then re-evaluating. I really want better sleep and I want my body to just feel better. I certainly don't drink too much compared to the wide world, but maybe I drink too much for my body? But I feel so crappy all of the time that I'm willing to give it a shot again.
Yeah, I think that's a good plan. Like Malcat, I have chronic health issues not related to booze, and giving up booze didn't change my appearance or chronic pain or energy level or anything like that. But at around 3.5 weeks, I got a huge emotional improvement; I also had struggled with apathy or mild depression every morning for years, and suddenly I was waking up feeling fine, not super excited or bouncing with energy, but just pleasantly anticipating my day. I didn't realize how shitty I felt every morning until suddenly I wasn't feeling that way any more.
Unrelated to drinking, I assume you've been checked for thyroid problems, low B-12, etc., if you a feeling consistently draggy and down?
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I have been having the odd drink over the last three weeks. And sleeping atrociously. I think it is time to get back on the track of no alcohol.
Did I not realize how much holiday celebrations were entangled with alcoholic beverages...even in Covid? Yes, I had no idea that my internal idea of how to celebrate and what constitutes a special was so wrapped together with booze. Two neighbours invited us for a driveway beverage. Mulled wine and champagne. New Years Eve and 59th wedding anniversary. Many gifts of wine and prosecco and champagne left on our front porch. Quite troubling to discover. But good for me to understand.
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Hey folks, just checked in to say that I gave up the hooch a year ago.
Wowza.
It really was such a good year to not drink, I've gotta say.
Absolutely. Congrats! I took some time off at the beginning of the pandemic, but then started drinking wine occasionally again. Then in October, I went on Effexor, which says in the insert "don't use alcohol while on this". So... I need to cancel those wine club memberships. In the meantime, my neighbors got some good wine for Christmas.
You know, I don't actually miss it at all.
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I have been having the odd drink over the last three weeks. And sleeping atrociously. I think it is time to get back on the track of no alcohol.
Did I not realize how much holiday celebrations were entangled with alcoholic beverages...even in Covid? Yes, I had no idea that my internal idea of how to celebrate and what constitutes a special was so wrapped together with booze. Two neighbours invited us for a driveway beverage. Mulled wine and champagne. New Years Eve and 59th wedding anniversary. Many gifts of wine and prosecco and champagne left on our front porch. Quite troubling to discover. But good for me to understand.
This was a big one for me, slowly reprogramming that celebration and booze don't actually make any sense in terms of being connected.
It's also made me be a lot more creative in how I celebrate things. It now seems to make a lot more sense to tailor each celebration to the thing being celebrated, as opposed to "oh, I have something to celebrate, let me grab a bottle of champagne".
Booze now seems like a lazy and paltry way to celebrate anything.
I celebrated one year sober by hiking a mountain in the snow with my sister.
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Thanks all for the posts on how long it took everyone's bodies to reset. I remember being very discouraged the last time I posted on this thread because so many people were like "I feel so much after 10 days!" and I was on week 5 w/ no noticeable improvements.
I'll commit to trying this out again for 3 months and then re-evaluating. I really want better sleep and I want my body to just feel better. I certainly don't drink too much compared to the wide world, but maybe I drink too much for my body? But I feel so crappy all of the time that I'm willing to give it a shot again.
Yeah, I think that's a good plan. Like Malcat, I have chronic health issues not related to booze, and giving up booze didn't change my appearance or chronic pain or energy level or anything like that. But at around 3.5 weeks, I got a huge emotional improvement; I also had struggled with apathy or mild depression every morning for years, and suddenly I was waking up feeling fine, not super excited or bouncing with energy, but just pleasantly anticipating my day. I didn't realize how shitty I felt every morning until suddenly I wasn't feeling that way any more.
I am another one that never got the Pink Cloud halo effect of quitting, otoh I never got the letdown once that bubble burst either. Around month 4, my weight started drifting downwards, and I am now down 10kg from my heaviest, and around month 6 or 7 I realised that my overall anxiety had stabilised and that it had been weeks since I had woken up at 3am to hate on myself for no good reason.
I didn't realize how shitty I felt every morning until suddenly I wasn't feeling that way any more.
<<- SO MUCH THIS PART HERE.
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I have been having the odd drink over the last three weeks. And sleeping atrociously. I think it is time to get back on the track of no alcohol.
Did I not realize how much holiday celebrations were entangled with alcoholic beverages...even in Covid? Yes, I had no idea that my internal idea of how to celebrate and what constitutes a special was so wrapped together with booze. Two neighbours invited us for a driveway beverage. Mulled wine and champagne. New Years Eve and 59th wedding anniversary. Many gifts of wine and prosecco and champagne left on our front porch. Quite troubling to discover. But good for me to understand.
This was a big one for me, slowly reprogramming that celebration and booze don't actually make any sense in terms of being connected.
It's also made me be a lot more creative in how I celebrate things. It now seems to make a lot more sense to tailor each celebration to the thing being celebrated, as opposed to "oh, I have something to celebrate, let me grab a bottle of champagne".
Booze now seems like a lazy and paltry way to celebrate anything.
I celebrated one year sober by hiking a mountain in the snow with my sister.
How do you approach the following situations:
Neighbours celebrating 59th anniversary and are literally standing there with three bottle of open champagne...how do you navigate the "when in Rome..." situations? New years eve or Christmas eve and mulled wine when invited over for said beverage. Do I just need to be more courageous when accepting the invitations and say I will be delighted to come but with my own beverage?
This year my DH could only think of one Christmas gift he wanted - a bottle of baileys. Our 19 year old asked me to help him make the purchase. Suddenly I have a cart full of different types of drink...the baileys, some dry white to go with the salmon, a white to go with turkey, a red for the beef and some prosecco. A bottle of port (also for DH). It wasn't until I got home that I realized what I was doing really. CRAZY
I grew up in a family that had a cocktail before dinner, wine for each course and then a liqueur with coffee. There is a lot of conditioning to get past.
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I have been having the odd drink over the last three weeks. And sleeping atrociously. I think it is time to get back on the track of no alcohol.
Did I not realize how much holiday celebrations were entangled with alcoholic beverages...even in Covid? Yes, I had no idea that my internal idea of how to celebrate and what constitutes a special was so wrapped together with booze. Two neighbours invited us for a driveway beverage. Mulled wine and champagne. New Years Eve and 59th wedding anniversary. Many gifts of wine and prosecco and champagne left on our front porch. Quite troubling to discover. But good for me to understand.
This was a big one for me, slowly reprogramming that celebration and booze don't actually make any sense in terms of being connected.
It's also made me be a lot more creative in how I celebrate things. It now seems to make a lot more sense to tailor each celebration to the thing being celebrated, as opposed to "oh, I have something to celebrate, let me grab a bottle of champagne".
Booze now seems like a lazy and paltry way to celebrate anything.
I celebrated one year sober by hiking a mountain in the snow with my sister.
How do you approach the following situations:
Neighbours celebrating 59th anniversary and are literally standing there with three bottle of open champagne...how do you navigate the "when in Rome..." situations? New years eve or Christmas eve and mulled wine when invited over for said beverage. Do I just need to be more courageous when accepting the invitations and say I will be delighted to come but with my own beverage?
This year my DH could only think of one Christmas gift he wanted - a bottle of baileys. Our 19 year old asked me to help him make the purchase. Suddenly I have a cart full of different types of drink...the baileys, some dry white to go with the salmon, a white to go with turkey, a red for the beef and some prosecco. A bottle of port (also for DH). It wasn't until I got home that I realized what I was doing really. CRAZY
I grew up in a family that had a cocktail before dinner, wine for each course and then a liqueur with coffee. There is a lot of conditioning to get past.
I grew up in a family that condoned drinking alcohol with breakfast, so yeah, I get it.
Honestly, those scenarios only feel like a big deal until you actually live through them sober and realize that it's actually not a big deal at all. You either tell people in advance that you aren't drinking or in the moment, whatever is easier. It's typically a social norm to bring stuff to a social occasion, so I bring something for the hosts, and a preferred beverage for myself. I was at a small wedding this summer and my table spot was right in front of where ALL of the open wine bottles were. In fact, I was often tasked with filling everyone's glasses. When alcohol stops being a big deal to you, not drinking it stops feeling like a big deal as well.
I would say that if you find it uncomfortable to think of passing up a drink at a "when in Rome" situation, that should be considered as more reason to try. From my very comfortable alcohol free position now, it wouldn't even cross my mind to worry about it because when you don't care about drinking, you just don't care about drinking, so nothing is awkward, nor should it be.
To put it bluntly, poisoning yourself for other people's social comfort is kind of insane. Drink if you want to, but don't drink for the social ease of others. Those who actually care about you will support you. Those who don't aren't entitled to any input.
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@Frugal Lizard I started off by accepting the invitation and bringing something for the host and a non-alcoholic drink for me. Good hosts mostly want to make sure everyone is having a good time and seldom question you if you ask for a seltzer or are holding a glass of kombucha as long as you look comfortable. It's also a nice time of year to say you are taking a break and you never need to say how long a break you are on. Mine has currently lasted 3.5 years, and it's no longer even a thing for my friends.
I would also say that as a non-drinker, it has made me a better host for those who don't drink. I used to arrange social occasions for my work and given the nature of my industry (IT) while the culture was boozy, an increasing number of developers are from non-drinking cultures. Or might be pregnant. Or might have quit because it doesn't lend itself to high-level thinking on a sustained basis. Or any other reason really or no reason at all. I made a variety of delicious non-alcoholic drinks as available and attractive as alcoholic drinks and it helped bridge the gap between the drinking and non-drinking team members.
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I jumped on this bandwagon and am doing a dry January. I might extend it since its been way harder than I think it should be for these first 4 days.
I had increased the frequency of wine and cocktails with the 2020 lockdown and it just became too frequent. It wasn't a binge scenario but it was a lot of consumption. My sleep is already less interrupted but I need to take the suggestion above of taking a walk, etc during the "witching hour". For me that was when my remote workday ends and I let the distance learning kids watch tv. A walk doesn't work since my kids don't want to go but I'll find something to break that time up.
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I jumped on this bandwagon and am doing a dry January. I might extend it since its been way harder than I think it should be for these first 4 days.
I had increased the frequency of wine and cocktails with the 2020 lockdown and it just became too frequent. It wasn't a binge scenario but it was a lot of consumption. My sleep is already less interrupted but I need to take the suggestion above of taking a walk, etc during the "witching hour". For me that was when my remote workday ends and I let the distance learning kids watch tv. A walk doesn't work since my kids don't want to go but I'll find something to break that time up.
Welcome. I'm not a binger either. Just that daily one became two, then very often three. Found myself white knuckling through previous non-drinking stints. Doing much better since I got treatment for anxiety.
I had a craving for wine tonight because I'm happy-sad after quitting my job, so I'm drinking a flavored seltzer right now. Seems to satisfy it a little.
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I jumped on this bandwagon and am doing a dry January. I might extend it since its been way harder than I think it should be for these first 4 days.
I had increased the frequency of wine and cocktails with the 2020 lockdown and it just became too frequent. It wasn't a binge scenario but it was a lot of consumption. My sleep is already less interrupted but I need to take the suggestion above of taking a walk, etc during the "witching hour". For me that was when my remote workday ends and I let the distance learning kids watch tv. A walk doesn't work since my kids don't want to go but I'll find something to break that time up.
Welcome. I'm not a binger either. Just that daily one became two, then very often three. Found myself white knuckling through previous non-drinking stints. Doing much better since I got treatment for anxiety.
I had a craving for wine tonight because I'm happy-sad after quitting my job, so I'm drinking a flavored seltzer right now. Seems to satisfy it a little.
Congrats on quitting!! Yes I feel a bit like I am white knuckling it which is new for me and tells me this break is needed.
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There are 2 books on Amazon that can help with the white knuckling. Already mentioned in the tread by many is This naked mind by Annie Grace and Porters book called Alcohol explained. Theses 2 books help with the white knuckling because they convince you that alcohol is not worth all the struggle.
Also for free is the web site the alcohol experiment, sign up for 30 days of educational videos and writing exercises, this alcohol experiment has helped so many. Good luck.
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Another book recommendation: We Are the Luckiest: The Surprising Magic of a Sober Life (https://www.amazon.com/We-Are-Luckiest-Surprising-Magic/dp/160868654X)
Well done to all who have stuck to their commitment, and good luck to those who are just starting!
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There are 2 books on Amazon that can help with the white knuckling. Already mentioned in the tread by many is This naked mind by Annie Grace and Porters book called Alcohol explained. Theses 2 books help with the white knuckling because they convince you that alcohol is not worth all the struggle.
Also for free is the web site the alcohol experiment, sign up for 30 days of educational videos and writing exercises, this alcohol experiment has helped so many. Good luck.
Yep!
I read This Naked Mind thanks to this thread and that lead me to Alan Carr's "Easy Way" book. I responded better to Alan Carr, but that's just a personal/personality thing.
I have pretty much less than zero faith in self help books, so I was amazed at how effective these books were at altering my patterns of thinking around alcohol.
I am quite confident that I wouldn't be nearly as chill about it now or nearly as comfortable being sober as I am. Alan Carr was for me with sobriety what MMM was with frugality and investing. Paradigm shifting.
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Hum, sometimes I think about it. Not now though, a couple weeks away from our 17th annual camping trip with people. Maybe after that.
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Hum, sometimes I think about it. Not now though, a couple weeks away from our 17th annual camping trip with people. Maybe after that.
Annie's book is actually best read while you are still drinking and only contemplating how much alcohol you want to drink in the future. She specifically recommends you keep drinking as normal.
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I read all the books mentioned a few days after quitting. They made it easy. I also bought lots of flavored sparkling water to drink at wine time and knitted during that time. I was bringing my own drinks to people’s homes. Now after 5 months it’s my new normal and no one questions it anymore. My best friend and her husband quit to a week after me.
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I have been having the odd drink over the last three weeks. And sleeping atrociously. I think it is time to get back on the track of no alcohol.
Did I not realize how much holiday celebrations were entangled with alcoholic beverages...even in Covid? Yes, I had no idea that my internal idea of how to celebrate and what constitutes a special was so wrapped together with booze. Two neighbours invited us for a driveway beverage. Mulled wine and champagne. New Years Eve and 59th wedding anniversary. Many gifts of wine and prosecco and champagne left on our front porch. Quite troubling to discover. But good for me to understand.
This was a big one for me, slowly reprogramming that celebration and booze don't actually make any sense in terms of being connected.
It's also made me be a lot more creative in how I celebrate things. It now seems to make a lot more sense to tailor each celebration to the thing being celebrated, as opposed to "oh, I have something to celebrate, let me grab a bottle of champagne".
Booze now seems like a lazy and paltry way to celebrate anything.
I celebrated one year sober by hiking a mountain in the snow with my sister.
How do you approach the following situations:
Neighbours celebrating 59th anniversary and are literally standing there with three bottle of open champagne...how do you navigate the "when in Rome..." situations? New years eve or Christmas eve and mulled wine when invited over for said beverage. Do I just need to be more courageous when accepting the invitations and say I will be delighted to come but with my own beverage?
This year my DH could only think of one Christmas gift he wanted - a bottle of baileys. Our 19 year old asked me to help him make the purchase. Suddenly I have a cart full of different types of drink...the baileys, some dry white to go with the salmon, a white to go with turkey, a red for the beef and some prosecco. A bottle of port (also for DH). It wasn't until I got home that I realized what I was doing really. CRAZY
I grew up in a family that had a cocktail before dinner, wine for each course and then a liqueur with coffee. There is a lot of conditioning to get past.
I was also apprehensive about how others would perceive my not drinking. It turned out to be no big deal. Just say, "I don't drink anymore", or "I'm taking a break to see how I feel about it" or whatever. Unless the person is a major asshole, they're not going to be bothered about it. However, if you've been invited to some kind of gathering where booze might be offered, I'm sure the hosts would appreciate a head's up about your new plan so they don't buy, or open, more booze than necessary. Don't be like by brother and show up for a weekend at our house and casually toss out, "Oh by the way, we're vegan now". This was especially annoying because it was a big change from his previous habits and I was literally pulling the steaks I'd bought out of the fridge for dinner. I didn't care at all about his new love of vegetables, I was just annoyed at having to figure out a different dinner on the fly.
As for all the other bottles that jumped in your cart, as long as they haven't been opened, you can return them. Give it a little more time and you'll soon forget your way around the liquor store. My DH also requested a bottle of his fav liqueur for Christmas. I quite drinking in 2016 and apparently now can't find my way around the liquor store. I had to ask a staff member to help me find the bottle I was looking for.
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I'm going to do dry January again. I had one drink on Jan 2 before I decided to do it, but I actually didn't drink all that much over the holidays, which is basically due to COVID but I suppose good for my health overall. Every time I take a break from alcohol, I feel great and I want to keep it up, but then I slip back into habits due to social pressure and not being committed to quitting once and for all. Even now I have a stocked liquor cabinet that I barely use, but it feels like a waste to quit and never drink it, although realistically I know I can just save it for guests or give it away and it would be no big deal.
I don't consider myself a problematic drinker, as I'm pretty good about not drinking too often or too much, but it all adds up, both for my health and my wallet, so I think I'll check out some of the books mentioned and see if I can make a more lasting change this time. I'm also planning on getting pregnant in the near future so I may as well get a head start on sobriety.
For those who were not daily or heavy drinkers but still decided to quit, I'm curious whether there's a big difference between not drinking at all vs only drinking once in a while?
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30 days in. :) Looking forward to the next 30!
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For those who were not daily or heavy drinkers but still decided to quit, I'm curious whether there's a big difference between not drinking at all vs only drinking once in a while?
Yes. I was a 1-2 drinks per week person. Often not even that. I quit entirely as an experiment and didn't intend for it to be permanent. I used to have an electrical glitch in my heart that sometimes caused an arrhythmia. My cardiologist wanted to do an ablation to fix it, but to me the procedure sounded scary and risky. He also mentioned that I shouldn't drink heavily, but that my consumption level wasn't an issue at all. However, I was having more and more episodes of arrhythmia. So I quit drinking entirely to see if it would improve the symptoms enough for me to be able to skip the ablation.
Surprisingly, it helped quite a bit for a few years. For a while the episodes stopped. Also surprisingly, it was harder to quit than I thought it would be. Apparently the days I did have a drink in the evenings were also the days where something had been "hard" and I was using booze as a way to dull my feelings. When I suddenly lost that coping mechanism I had to learn to feel my feelings instead. It sucked. For a while I coped by cleaning, which was awesome! However, within a couple months I just got better at processing my feelings. I'm not totally sure how to articulate this feeling, but I don't ever want to go back to avoiding and numbing the tougher days again. It's like now I have more inner peace or something. I very rarely get overwhelmed by negative feelings and when I do it doesn't last long. I feel like I'm more in control.
Anyway, like others I also like rarely feeling sluggish in the mornings. I had the ablation done last fall so there's no longer a medical reason not to drink anymore, however I have no desire at all to go back. The one time I had a single drink as an experiment I felt awful. Instant headache and felt like shit. Probably because after years of not drinking I no have zero tolerance. Anyway, it only cemented my decision.
Try it. Give it at least a few months. If it turns out it's not for you, then you don't have to stick with it.
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Yes. I was a 1-2 drinks per week person. Often not even that. I quit entirely as an experiment and didn't intend for it to be permanent. I used to have an electrical glitch in my heart that sometimes caused an arrhythmia. My cardiologist wanted to do an ablation to fix it, but to me the procedure sounded scary and risky. He also mentioned that I shouldn't drink heavily, but that my consumption level wasn't an issue at all. However, I was having more and more episodes of arrhythmia. So I quit drinking entirely to see if it would improve the symptoms enough for me to be able to skip the ablation.
Surprisingly, it helped quite a bit for a few years. For a while the episodes stopped. Also surprisingly, it was harder to quit than I thought it would be. Apparently the days I did have a drink in the evenings were also the days where something had been "hard" and I was using booze as a way to dull my feelings. When I suddenly lost that coping mechanism I had to learn to feel my feelings instead. It sucked. For a while I coped by cleaning, which was awesome! However, within a couple months I just got better at processing my feelings. I'm not totally sure how to articulate this feeling, but I don't ever want to go back to avoiding and numbing the tougher days again. It's like now I have more inner peace or something. I very rarely get overwhelmed by negative feelings and when I do it doesn't last long. I feel like I'm more in control.
Anyway, like others I also like rarely feeling sluggish in the mornings. I had the ablation done last fall so there's no longer a medical reason not to drink anymore, however I have no desire at all to go back. The one time I had a single drink as an experiment I felt awful. Instant headache and felt like shit. Probably because after years of not drinking I no have zero tolerance. Anyway, it only cemented my decision.
Try it. Give it at least a few months. If it turns out it's not for you, then you don't have to stick with it.
It's fascinating to me that eliminating a 1-2/week habit was enough to reduce the heart issue that much, even if it only delayed needing the procedure. Also fascinating that it was hard to go from that level to nothing.
My use has crept up over the years and lately I've been working on reducing it dramatically. The immediate reasons are about sleep: I wake up soaked with sweat if I've had any alcohol that evening, and often get the 3am mental hamster wheel. The sweats go away right away although the hamster wheel still happens (I have an additional solution planned for that - FIRE of course!). The longer term concerns are about overall health. I also hate seeing the cost when I tally our expenses.
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For those who were not daily or heavy drinkers but still decided to quit, I'm curious whether there's a big difference between not drinking at all vs only drinking once in a while?
Yes. I was a 1-2 drinks per week person. Often not even that. I quit entirely as an experiment and didn't intend for it to be permanent. I used to have an electrical glitch in my heart that sometimes caused an arrhythmia. My cardiologist wanted to do an ablation to fix it, but to me the procedure sounded scary and risky. He also mentioned that I shouldn't drink heavily, but that my consumption level wasn't an issue at all. However, I was having more and more episodes of arrhythmia. So I quit drinking entirely to see if it would improve the symptoms enough for me to be able to skip the ablation.
Surprisingly, it helped quite a bit for a few years. For a while the episodes stopped. Also surprisingly, it was harder to quit than I thought it would be. Apparently the days I did have a drink in the evenings were also the days where something had been "hard" and I was using booze as a way to dull my feelings. When I suddenly lost that coping mechanism I had to learn to feel my feelings instead. It sucked. For a while I coped by cleaning, which was awesome! However, within a couple months I just got better at processing my feelings. I'm not totally sure how to articulate this feeling, but I don't ever want to go back to avoiding and numbing the tougher days again. It's like now I have more inner peace or something. I very rarely get overwhelmed by negative feelings and when I do it doesn't last long. I feel like I'm more in control.
Anyway, like others I also like rarely feeling sluggish in the mornings. I had the ablation done last fall so there's no longer a medical reason not to drink anymore, however I have no desire at all to go back. The one time I had a single drink as an experiment I felt awful. Instant headache and felt like shit. Probably because after years of not drinking I no have zero tolerance. Anyway, it only cemented my decision.
Try it. Give it at least a few months. If it turns out it's not for you, then you don't have to stick with it.
This was great to read.
I was also able to get off of heart medication when I quit, which is fantastic because if a drug has a side effect, I'm pretty sure to get it.
On the emotional front, it's so true. If someone drinks in response to stress, then the brain will enhance the experience of stress in order to promote consuming alcohol. And the stress is then prolonged because it isn't just properly processed and resolved.
So in an attempt to manage stress, booze amplifies it and extends it. Pretty shitty deal.
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Yes. I was a 1-2 drinks per week person. Often not even that. I quit entirely as an experiment and didn't intend for it to be permanent. I used to have an electrical glitch in my heart that sometimes caused an arrhythmia. My cardiologist wanted to do an ablation to fix it, but to me the procedure sounded scary and risky. He also mentioned that I shouldn't drink heavily, but that my consumption level wasn't an issue at all. However, I was having more and more episodes of arrhythmia. So I quit drinking entirely to see if it would improve the symptoms enough for me to be able to skip the ablation.
Surprisingly, it helped quite a bit for a few years. For a while the episodes stopped. Also surprisingly, it was harder to quit than I thought it would be. Apparently the days I did have a drink in the evenings were also the days where something had been "hard" and I was using booze as a way to dull my feelings. When I suddenly lost that coping mechanism I had to learn to feel my feelings instead. It sucked. For a while I coped by cleaning, which was awesome! However, within a couple months I just got better at processing my feelings. I'm not totally sure how to articulate this feeling, but I don't ever want to go back to avoiding and numbing the tougher days again. It's like now I have more inner peace or something. I very rarely get overwhelmed by negative feelings and when I do it doesn't last long. I feel like I'm more in control.
Anyway, like others I also like rarely feeling sluggish in the mornings. I had the ablation done last fall so there's no longer a medical reason not to drink anymore, however I have no desire at all to go back. The one time I had a single drink as an experiment I felt awful. Instant headache and felt like shit. Probably because after years of not drinking I no have zero tolerance. Anyway, it only cemented my decision.
Try it. Give it at least a few months. If it turns out it's not for you, then you don't have to stick with it.
It's fascinating to me that eliminating a 1-2/week habit was enough to reduce the heart issue that much, even if it only delayed needing the procedure. Also fascinating that it was hard to go from that level to nothing.
My use has crept up over the years and lately I've been working on reducing it dramatically. The immediate reasons are about sleep: I wake up soaked with sweat if I've had any alcohol that evening, and often get the 3am mental hamster wheel. The sweats go away right away although the hamster wheel still happens (I have an additional solution planned for that - FIRE of course!). The longer term concerns are about overall health. I also hate seeing the cost when I tally our expenses.
One of the other benefits to abstaining completely is the effect it's had on our kids. We have young teens and at first I was unsure of how to approach the issue with them. I don't drink due to reasons that are personal to me. I don't have much of an opinion about other's habits and if my kids grow up and want to have the odd drink I don't have an issue with that. However, they don't actually have a role model for "healthy" drinking, whatever that may be. So at the moment they're both of the opinion that drinking is foolish and they have no interest. This is a pretty big departure from how I grew up, which was a more European mentality that teens should have the odd half glass of wine at family dinners so they learn to imbibe responsibly and don't fall into binge drinking when they're on their own. Anyway, apparently the current trend for teens and young adults is much, much less drinking than when I was young so hopefully it just won't be an issue for my girls and they'll just always have this healthier outlook. They're also both well aware of how carcinogenic alcohol is and the effect cancer has had on some of our extended family.
For others who're worried about social effects of not drinking, my experience has been that it's 100x easier than managing even 1-2 drinks per event. I don't ever even have to think about it. My answer to "What are you having?" is always "What non-alcoholic options do you have?". The list is usually pretty short, so I just ask for a juice and then I can drink it as quickly, or not as I want. I can have more and I don't have to worry about having food with it. I never worry about being pulled over afterwards. It's just so much simpler.
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I really appreciate hearing how occasional drinker to non-drinker is still a significant shift. I have definitely decreased my consumption over the past few months, but the pressure is still there in certain social situations. I have some easy scripts - not drinking tonight, doing a dry period, etc. and it works on most people. I'm pretty comfortable having sparkling water instead. But there is one person in my life (not optional) who has a really hard time accepting no and I have to tell them again and again that I don't want something. I'm fine with it and I just repeat myself, but it gets annoying. I don't understand why some people are so dedicated to drinking that they cannot accept when someone else doesn't.
If I'm being completely honest, the other part of my issue is not alcohol, but weed. I drink for taste and fun, but I smoke for fun and when I'm stressed. So I don't think I can fix one without the other. I know this thread is more about alcohol, but for me the two are linked. Til now my dry January hasn't included weed, but starting today it will. I want to be accountable to myself so I am writing it here. Many of the same arguments apply - bad for the health, not a good mental crutch, not good for sleep. So I'm going to see how I feel without either for a little while, maybe longer.
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I really appreciate hearing how occasional drinker to non-drinker is still a significant shift. I have definitely decreased my consumption over the past few months, but the pressure is still there in certain social situations. I have some easy scripts - not drinking tonight, doing a dry period, etc. and it works on most people. I'm pretty comfortable having sparkling water instead. But there is one person in my life (not optional) who has a really hard time accepting no and I have to tell them again and again that I don't want something. I'm fine with it and I just repeat myself, but it gets annoying. I don't understand why some people are so dedicated to drinking that they cannot accept when someone else doesn't.
If I'm being completely honest, the other part of my issue is not alcohol, but weed. I drink for taste and fun, but I smoke for fun and when I'm stressed. So I don't think I can fix one without the other. I know this thread is more about alcohol, but for me the two are linked. Til now my dry January hasn't included weed, but starting today it will. I want to be accountable to myself so I am writing it here. Many of the same arguments apply - bad for the health, not a good mental crutch, not good for sleep. So I'm going to see how I feel without either for a little while, maybe longer.
It's not just weed (which stimulates the same part of the brain as booze). There are other things people do for stress relief that also stimulate that part of the brain and one can form destructive habits/dependency on: Food, esp sugar, gambling, internet browsing/gaming/social media, porn/sex, gambling, shopping, other drugs. Our brains just didn't evolve to have such ready and quick access to these neuro-stimulators, and thus, they easily become problematic.
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Once I quit drinking I was able to get off one of my high blood pressure medications.
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4 months sober today !
Which means 4 months + 1 day ago I was an asshole! (probably still am, just a sober one).
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4 months sober today !
Which means 4 months + 1 day ago I was an asshole! (probably still am, just a sober one).
Congrats on 4 months of sober assholery
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Sober win: I completely refreshed my wardrobe on less than three months worth of last year's alcohol spend!!! I actually needed the clothes for a job, I wasn't just treating myself.
Our average was $127/month last year on booze for two adults, plus the occasional visitors or host gift. I drink mainly boxed wine and the occasional beer, but husband likes whiskey which gets expensive. He has stopped drinking for now too and has lost 20 lbs since mid-December.
I plan to extend my dry January until gatherings resume, and drink at social occasions only this year. We can use the wine/liquor we have in the house to bring when we finally get to go visiting. It's possible that we could have zero alcohol spend this year (will make an exception if I get invited out somewhere with friends).
Looking for ideas on how to celebrate inauguration night sober!
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I'm giving up alcohol for a bit.
I'm trying to get pregnant. I'm not under the illusion that drinking has HUGE fertility effects, but at the same time it began to seem really perverse to me, given how desperate I am for a baby, that I was regularly indulging in an unhealthy and entirely optional activity that might impact fertility. If I'm at the stage where I'm trying to move the needle by resorting to prayer & old wives' tales (and I AM at that point) I should also be willing to make actual healthy changes in my life.
MrKat hardly drinks, and because of covid I barely see anyone else, so this should be an easy time to do it. My last drink was August 14th. If I'm not pregnant by the Christmas season, I will likely let myself drink then. So let's say initially that I am setting myself the challenge of no drinking until December 1st. Hopefully I get pregnant and end up going a lot longer than that.
Thanks for this thread. At the weekend, I read all the way through from the beginning :)
I thought I would provide an update to this since I feel like right now I look like a silent dropout from this thread :)
I both am, and am not a drop out. I still have had no alcohol since August 14th (so soon will be coming up on 5 months). Less than a month after writing this post, I found out I was pregnant. Being sober while pregnant is a different experience, psychologically, than being sober other times. It's expected, there's no justification to others or self-justification. So I find that I have very little to contribute here!
Still, it's a very different change of scene to me that in 2020 I spend 7+ months sober in total (nearly 3 for my first pregnancy and miscarriage, over 4 after a deliberate decision and for this continuing pregnancy). Hopefully that will put me in a good mindset for after pregnancy (a) not feeling the need to drink as soon as I 'can', and (b) having a healthier relationship with booze in future, whether that's sober or otherwise.
I will probably check in again after pregnancy to talk about whether/how long I decide to stay sober! Right now I just wanted to say -- I didn't stop contributing because I started drinking.
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CONGRATS!!!
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I'm giving up alcohol for a bit.
I'm trying to get pregnant. I'm not under the illusion that drinking has HUGE fertility effects, but at the same time it began to seem really perverse to me, given how desperate I am for a baby, that I was regularly indulging in an unhealthy and entirely optional activity that might impact fertility. If I'm at the stage where I'm trying to move the needle by resorting to prayer & old wives' tales (and I AM at that point) I should also be willing to make actual healthy changes in my life.
MrKat hardly drinks, and because of covid I barely see anyone else, so this should be an easy time to do it. My last drink was August 14th. If I'm not pregnant by the Christmas season, I will likely let myself drink then. So let's say initially that I am setting myself the challenge of no drinking until December 1st. Hopefully I get pregnant and end up going a lot longer than that.
Thanks for this thread. At the weekend, I read all the way through from the beginning :)
I thought I would provide an update to this since I feel like right now I look like a silent dropout from this thread :)
I both am, and am not a drop out. I still have had no alcohol since August 14th (so soon will be coming up on 5 months). Less than a month after writing this post, I found out I was pregnant. Being sober while pregnant is a different experience, psychologically, than being sober other times. It's expected, there's no justification to others or self-justification. So I find that I have very little to contribute here!
Still, it's a very different change of scene to me that in 2020 I spend 7+ months sober in total (nearly 3 for my first pregnancy and miscarriage, over 4 after a deliberate decision and for this continuing pregnancy). Hopefully that will put me in a good mindset for after pregnancy (a) not feeling the need to drink as soon as I 'can', and (b) having a healthier relationship with booze in future, whether that's sober or otherwise.
I will probably check in again after pregnancy to talk about whether/how long I decide to stay sober! Right now I just wanted to say -- I didn't stop contributing because I started drinking.
Congrats on your pregnancy!
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Congrats, @katekat ! That's wonderful news. I'm very happy for you.
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Hum, sometimes I think about it. Not now though, a couple weeks away from our 17th annual camping trip with people. Maybe after that.
Annie's book is actually best read while you are still drinking and only contemplating how much alcohol you want to drink in the future. She specifically recommends you keep drinking as normal.
I did get the audio version and started listening yesterday. I see where she says in the intro about not changing anything at first.
On chapter four and I am thinking of making changes already tonight, but we will see.
Most of our drinking is at home. For me that means 6 or 7 beers 7 days a week. You think it got to be too many? Just cutting that out would be huge. That would leave about 7 times a year instead of 360. I can see already though from her audio that it might be better to stop all together, time will tell.
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Hum, sometimes I think about it. Not now though, a couple weeks away from our 17th annual camping trip with people. Maybe after that.
Annie's book is actually best read while you are still drinking and only contemplating how much alcohol you want to drink in the future. She specifically recommends you keep drinking as normal.
I did get the audio version and started listening yesterday. I see where she says in the intro about not changing anything at first.
On chapter four and I am thinking of making changes already tonight, but we will see.
Most of our drinking is at home. For me that means 6 or 7 beers 7 days a week. You think it got to be too many? Just cutting that out would be huge. That would leave about 7 times a year instead of 360. I can see already though from her audio that it might be better to stop all together, time will tell.
Annie's book and her 30 day experiment, which I also highly recommend, did not convince me to quit altogether.
What they did convince me of was that I did not like the "stress relief" relationship I had with red wine, which was the only alcohol I drank regularly, and that I wanted to see what a year without red wine would feel like.
After that, I listened to Alan Carr's book and decided "yep, I'm over it", and suddenly just did not want to drink at all. Not because I shouldn't, or it was ruining my life, or anything shame or guilt based like that. I just was over it. It was like a break up with a sometimes fun but kind of shitty ex who I have no interest in getting back together with.
Take this time to get to know your relationship with alcohol better. Decide for yourself what role you want alcohol to play in your life.
Maybe it will become an ex you stay in touch with as friends now and then, or maybe it will become someone whose friend request you delete on Facebook and whose calls you send to voicemail.
You will figure out what relationship works best for you. Books like This Naked Mind, and her 30 day experiment are really all about figuring that relationship out, not dictating what it should or shouldn't be.
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I like the approach of those books where they aren’t advocating for quitting but finding your own path. Congrats Kat! Steeze, that’s a great length of sober time. I never drank all the years I was raising my kids. I needed to be present for them.
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I like the approach of those books where they aren’t advocating for quitting but finding your own path. Congrats Kat! Steeze, that’s a great length of sober time. I never drank all the years I was raising my kids. I needed to be present for them.
I think it depends.
Because Alan Carr's book is very firmly in the "don't drink, it's fucking stupid" camp, and that's the one I responded to the most.
After Annie's book, I wasn't really sure about anything, but a lot of what she said had made me think, so I then went to the source of where she got a lot of her inspiration, which was Alan, and his style resonated with me in my bones. I was like "fuck yeah!" listening along to his book. I actually listened to it a second time right after finishing it.
I think Annie's book is the best starting point though. Her 30 day alcohol experiment is a great process for people to figure out their own relationship with alcohol.
She makes a great point that you really need to have alcohol out of your system for a bit before you are even capable of making decisions about it, and the exercises get your mind into a space where it's comfortable with self reflection and critical thinking.
Her book is best read while still drinking, because it allows you to reflect in real time on what she's presenting about drinking. Her experiment then creates the mental and neurological space to make personalized decisions.
For me, she just wasn't resonant enough, where Alan was, but I think I was ready for Alan's far more prescriptive stance because of her content.
Whether content is helpful for someone really depends on where they are along the continuum of readiness for change.
Books that don't insist on total sobriety will always be better for those who aren't open to total sobriety. Whereas for someone who is, a non firm message might be too wishy washy.
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I like the approach of those books where they aren’t advocating for quitting but finding your own path. Congrats Kat! Steeze, that’s a great length of sober time. I never drank all the years I was raising my kids. I needed to be present for them.
I think it depends.
Because Alan Carr's book is very firmly in the "don't drink, it's fucking stupid" camp, and that's the one I responded to the most.
After Annie's book, I wasn't really sure about anything, but a lot of what she said had made me think, so I then went to the source of where she got a lot of her inspiration, which was Alan, and his style resonated with me in my bones. I was like "fuck yeah!" listening along to his book. I actually listened to it a second time right after finishing it.
I think Annie's book is the best starting point though. Her 30 day alcohol experiment is a great process for people to figure out their own relationship with alcohol.
She makes a great point that you really need to have alcohol out of your system for a bit before you are even capable of making decisions about it, and the exercises get your mind into a space where it's comfortable with self reflection and critical thinking.
Her book is best read while still drinking, because it allows you to reflect in real time on what she's presenting about drinking. Her experiment then creates the mental and neurological space to make personalized decisions.
For me, she just wasn't resonant enough, where Alan was, but I think I was ready for Alan's far more prescriptive stance because of her content.
Whether content is helpful for someone really depends on where they are along the continuum of readiness for change.
Books that don't insist on total sobriety will always be better for those who aren't open to total sobriety. Whereas for someone who is, a non firm message might be too wishy washy.
This is my feeling as well. I never went in intending to 'never drink again!' and still don't put those kinds of rules on it (it's just that now my opinions about my drinking experience are so radically different that I keep wanting not to drink). But if someone had first approached me with 'DRINKING IS TERRIBLE NEVER DRINK IT'S STUPID', I would have dismissed it and probably kept drinking.
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@katekat Woah and congratulations!
@Morning Glory My recommendation for a drink replacement would be to GO FANCY. What you choose depends on your tastebuds but have it in a nice glass, use a cute garnish, make it feel like a treat. I like a splash of good juice with seltzer and a sprig or two of fresh mint. It looks like a refreshing party in a glass.
For those who are unsure if they will be able to quit, I went to my GP and got a prescription for Naltrexone. It blocks the receptors in your brain that make you feel drunk and you are supposed to take it while you are drinking. It was one of the odder experiences of my life and I only took it a few times but it was enough to break the imbibe>reward cycle. Without the reward receptors being activated, it was like I was *tasting* an entirely different drink, one that wasn't particularly pleasant. I would have zero urge to have another sip or finish a glass of wine. I did this in combination with r/stopdrinking and reading Annie Grace's book. There is a pretty good article on it in the Atlantic - https://www.theatlantic.com/magazine/archive/2015/04/the-irrationality-of-alcoholics-anonymous/386255/
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@katekat Woah and congratulations!
@Morning Glory My recommendation for a drink replacement would be to GO FANCY. What you choose depends on your tastebuds but have it in a nice glass, use a cute garnish, make it feel like a treat. I like a splash of good juice with seltzer and a sprig or two of fresh mint. It looks like a refreshing party in a glass.
For those who are unsure if they will be able to quit, I went to my GP and got a prescription for Naltrexone. It blocks the receptors in your brain that make you feel drunk and you are supposed to take it while you are drinking. It was one of the odder experiences of my life and I only took it a few times but it was enough to break the imbibe>reward cycle. Without the reward receptors being activated, it was like I was *tasting* an entirely different drink, one that wasn't particularly pleasant. I would have zero urge to have another sip or finish a glass of wine. I did this in combination with r/stopdrinking and reading Annie Grace's book. There is a pretty good article on it in the Atlantic - https://www.theatlantic.com/magazine/archive/2015/04/the-irrationality-of-alcoholics-anonymous/386255/
I rec that article to everyone who has negative experiences with AA. No doubt AA helps some portion of alcohol abusers, but jeez it promotes some weird ideas with no scientific support. No one who doesn't jive with it should just give up trying to get help, that's for sure.
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I've made some posts on this thread before in times past, so I'm no stranger to stints of booze freedom.
Like many others here, I haven't had a drink so far in 2021. I think I'd like to go an entire year without booze. I did a cycling challenge last summer with a friend and significantly cut back on my alcohol intake to help with recovery/fitness. Once the challenge was over, I started consistently drinking again, often heavy/carb-y hazy IPAs. Usually I would have one or two, but my consistency, the number of nights that I was having a beer, had increased significantly since before the challenge. Then during December, DW and I got some special ingredients for fancy cocktails in the week or two leading up to Christmas. They were fun, but after a cocktail I often noticed that I had a headache, and would feel pretty bloated. I usually only had one because I felt too tired and "gross" to have another, while DW would usually have a couple cocktails each night.
I slowly entertained the idea that drinking alcohol wasn't really all that fun to me at this point, and seemed at least partially responsible for me feeling physically out-of-it and bloated, even without binge-level doses. I also remembered that cutting down on alcohol seemed to anecdotally help with my athletic performance last summer. So, I am going to experiment going a whole year without booze - and coupling it with hopefully my most intense cycling training year ever. 8 days into the year, I feel less bloated, but really no other benefits yet. I had one or two days of cravings but those have dropped off as I work my way through Annie Grace's The Alcohol Experiment. My hope is that I will continue to feel good by not drinking, and I will be able to not hinder athletic/performance gains for cycling by drinking poison.
Cheers (or not) to everyone else on their own unique journey.
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Sober win: I completely refreshed my wardrobe on less than three months worth of last year's alcohol spend!!! I actually needed the clothes for a job, I wasn't just treating myself.
Our average was $127/month last year on booze for two adults, plus the occasional visitors or host gift. I drink mainly boxed wine and the occasional beer, but husband likes whiskey which gets expensive. He has stopped drinking for now too and has lost 20 lbs since mid-December.
I plan to extend my dry January until gatherings resume, and drink at social occasions only this year. We can use the wine/liquor we have in the house to bring when we finally get to go visiting. It's possible that we could have zero alcohol spend this year (will make an exception if I get invited out somewhere with friends).
Looking for ideas on how to celebrate inauguration night sober!
Pop some San Pellegrino or sparkling cider!
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Congrats to Katekat and JPS I wish you luck, I just finished a calendar year no alcohol, like you I was sober curious, I am at 16 months now. I would love to hear how you feel and if the alcohol free time helps with your endurance training.
or those who are unsure if they will be able to quit, I went to my GP and got a prescription for Naltrexone. It blocks the receptors in your brain that make you feel drunk and you are supposed to take it while you are drinking. It was one of the odder experiences of my life and I only took it a few times but it was enough to break the imbibe>reward cycle. Without the reward receptors being activated, it was like I was *tasting* an entirely different drink, one that wasn't particularly pleasant.
I too tried Naltrexone, the Sinclair method AKA TSM, is where you take the pill only when you drink and it blocks the high you feel from alcohol. I think it could really be helpful to many who feel they just cant get off the hampster wheel and get any kind of time between drinking episodes. One night I took Naltrexone, had my favorite beer, and one hour later my spouse picked up the almost full can and said "are you finished ?" I said ya, do we have any ice cream? Because e even my favorite beer became undesirable!
Naltrexone teaches you brain not to like alcohol. There is a documentary about it on netflics called one little pill. There are also some you tube videos people talking about there experience with it.
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H and I shared a bottle of bubbly on NYE and haven't had any since. Typically we have a few drinks on the weekend and not during the week unless there is a specific social event.
One thing I am noticing this weekend, which I think is a Covid + winter thing: since we typically drink on Fri and Sat nights, it is a fun/special think to denote the weekend. Now we are just home in our house, nothing to do, seeing no one, and it is depressing. Of course it is still depressing with a bottle of wine in some ways! But I have a feeling as long as we under these Covid restrictions it will be more tempting to drink on weekends.
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H and I shared a bottle of bubbly on NYE and haven't had any since. Typically we have a few drinks on the weekend and not during the week unless there is a specific social event.
One thing I am noticing this weekend, which I think is a Covid + winter thing: since we typically drink on Fri and Sat nights, it is a fun/special think to denote the weekend. Now we are just home in our house, nothing to do, seeing no one, and it is depressing. Of course it is still depressing with a bottle of wine in some ways! But I have a feeling as long as we under these Covid restrictions it will be more tempting to drink on weekends.
We do dealcoholized sparkling wine for celebrations now. I don't miss the alcohol part of it.
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I just started reading "The Naked Mind" and it's been thought-provoking so far. It was interesting when the author posed the question of whether drinking alcohol was really a habit and asked the reader to imagine that someone offered them $500,000 to never drink alcohol again. If there was any hesitation at all, that reveals that it's not a habit, because a person would be fine giving up a habit for that much money. Very interesting to think about.
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Big congrats to everyone who's recently joined or is sticking with their plan to reduce alcohol consumption. I noticed an ad for a Dry February challenge being put on by the Canadian Cancer Society. If anyone finds external motivation helpful you could participate. I bet there's a similar US option out there somewhere too. This challenge involves fundraising and posting you commitment to Dry Feb on Facebook. Doing it this way may help some of us who were worried about going public to our friends and family.
https://www.dryfeb.ca/
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Haven't had anything since New Years. Sad (but not surprised) that I'm not feeling any benefits. Happy to report that even though I'm still regularly fixing DH drinks, I don't really crave one.
I do miss having something with a yummy flavor at the end of the day. Had too much ice cream the first week and tried Kombucha last week and it didn't do much for me.
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Haven't had anything since New Years. Sad (but not surprised) that I'm not feeling any benefits. Happy to report that even though I'm still regularly fixing DH drinks, I don't really crave one.
I do miss having something with a yummy flavor at the end of the day. Had too much ice cream the first week and tried Kombucha last week and it didn't do much for me.
I got really into high end herbal teas
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Haven't had anything since New Years. Sad (but not surprised) that I'm not feeling any benefits. Happy to report that even though I'm still regularly fixing DH drinks, I don't really crave one.
I do miss having something with a yummy flavor at the end of the day. Had too much ice cream the first week and tried Kombucha last week and it didn't do much for me.
I got really into high end herbal teas
I started making myself the odd fancy soda with the soda stream, slices of ginger, mint simple syrup or fruit juices from thawing frozen berries or cherries. I think I like bubbles and the ritual of opening/mixing and limited quantity - unlike the jug of tap water that is never ending. And having a fancy glass has also made it special.
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Haven't drunk since NYE. Already started sleeping better and losing some weight. I'm listening to some great podcasts - Love Sober and Annie Grace, been hitting some online AA meetings too.
Very much on pink cloud right now and feeling great.
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Haven't drunk since NYE. Already started sleeping better and losing some weight. I'm listening to some great podcasts - Love Sober and Annie Grace, been hitting some online AA meetings too.
Very much on pink cloud right now and feeling great.
Nice! How are the AA meetings?
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Haven't drunk since NYE. Already started sleeping better and losing some weight. I'm listening to some great podcasts - Love Sober and Annie Grace, been hitting some online AA meetings too.
Very much on pink cloud right now and feeling great.
Nice! How are the AA meetings?
I'm in two minds on AA. There are some excellent, excellent elements. The comraderie of being around a bunch of people who totally get it (albeit virtually due to covid) is really nice.
It's also a great way of being constantly reminded of the reasons I quit, otherwise my brain too easily convinces itself that my drinking wasn't all that bad and I am capable of drinking like a normal person (I'm not and haven't been for at least a decade).
These two things alone make it worth me showing up to meetings frequently.
On the negative, it is very religion heavy, which as an atheist is not for me. There is also a lot of reverence put into what is known as the Big Book of Alcoholics Anon, which is understandable I guess but people treat it like a bible, when it's just the writings of two white men in the 50s, with all the exclusionary language and thought processes that era brings.
I don't really like the big book, and don't read it. I follow the steps because they are pragmatic helpful things that don't seem to require this reverence and faith that the big book brings up for a lot of people. With all due respect to the people that started the programme for me, it's about the people there now helping each other through, not what two men wrote decades ago.
But I'd say the same thing to anyone, male or female, religious or not - give it a go, you might just find something that really works.
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Haven't had anything since New Years. Sad (but not surprised) that I'm not feeling any benefits. Happy to report that even though I'm still regularly fixing DH drinks, I don't really crave one.
I do miss having something with a yummy flavor at the end of the day. Had too much ice cream the first week and tried Kombucha last week and it didn't do much for me.
I got really into high end herbal teas
Any recs? I've got a cabinet full of traditional medicinal and tazo brand - but I tend to drink those daily. I'm not sure what counts as "fancy" herbal tea.
Also- do y'all know if a dash or two of bitters works like regular alcohol in your body? I have lots of wonderful bitters and I was thinking I could add them to club soda. But I know they are technically alcoholic so didn't know if that would undo any good I was doing.
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Haven't had anything since New Years. Sad (but not surprised) that I'm not feeling any benefits. Happy to report that even though I'm still regularly fixing DH drinks, I don't really crave one.
I do miss having something with a yummy flavor at the end of the day. Had too much ice cream the first week and tried Kombucha last week and it didn't do much for me.
I got really into high end herbal teas
Any recs? I've got a cabinet full of traditional medicinal and tazo brand - but I tend to drink those daily. I'm not sure what counts as "fancy" herbal tea.
Also- do y'all know if a dash or two of bitters works like regular alcohol in your body? I have lots of wonderful bitters and I was thinking I could add them to club soda. But I know they are technically alcoholic so didn't know if that would undo any good I was doing.
I don't think a few drops will have any effect.
As for teas, I happen to live near a really high end tea house where the owner travels the world forging relationships with small independent tea farmers. He's often their only client.
So I can't make any brand recommendations or anything. I just go to this particular tea house and get phenomenal blends of rooibos and Tulsi, etc, which make regular bag tea taste like dirty, dusty sock water.
I never liked tea until I found this store.
I will also drink some trashy David's tea, it's tasty as hell, but compared to high end tea, it's like eating really good chicken wings at a pub vs fine dining.
Do you have any artisanal tea shops around you? If not, I have no idea what to recommend. It's a fluke I found my place. If they ever close, I'm fucked.
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RE the bitters, I think it may depend on you, some people avoid any alcohol including non alcoholic beers, I personally indulge in the craft non alcohol beers and have managed to be alcohol free for 17 months. I think it may take an honest evaluation of your desire to drink, are you looking to drink again? are you close to a relapse?
I am interested in trying the bitters, with my selzer, where did you get them from?
Fancy teas I use are the fruit teas right before bed, and I had some amazing fruit teas from Starbucks. They feel fancy and I feel they signal me to wind it down and stop eating and drinking.
Good Luck.
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RE the bitters, I think it may depend on you, some people avoid any alcohol including non alcoholic beers, I personally indulge in the craft non alcohol beers and have managed to be alcohol free for 17 months. I think it may take an honest evaluation of your desire to drink, are you looking to drink again? are you close to a relapse?
I am interested in trying the bitters, with my selzer, where did you get them from?
Fancy teas I use are the fruit teas right before bed, and I had some amazing fruit teas from Starbucks. They feel fancy and I feel they signal me to wind it down and stop eating and drinking.
Good Luck.
I received a set of bittercube bitters for Christmas last year and they are wonderful! The cherry bark vanilla is my favorite but there are also ginger, grapefruit and orange flavors that I thought would be a nice addition to club soda. I prefer dry-ish and citrusy cocktails so replacing w/ something sweet hasn't been helpful.
I did buy some Pelligrino bitter lemon and that hit the spot 100% but it is also pricey. So I was thinking using my existing bitters w/ club soda might be cheaper.
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That sounds good star bright. I love the AF beers but some people won’t drink them. I love flavored sparkling water.
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I am fine with bitters, vanilla essence and NA beer (when I can find a good one - which is seldom) but they don't trigger any relapse urge in me. Some people avoid them because they are problematic *for them*. So it's hard to give you a sign-off because it really is up to you and your relationship with booze.
I do second finding a good artisan tea shop. Good tea is delicious and even though it's pricy, it's still cheaper than beer in my town.
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I also enjoy ghiradelli’s double hot chocolate.
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Another vote here for fancy herbal teas! In the UK we have Pukka teas, absolutely love them.
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So last year, about a month into quitting, I did Annie Grace's drinking experiment. The one where she purposely got drunk after quitting and filmed herself, to prove to herself that it was total shit.
I did it because after reading This Naked Mind and Allen Carr's Easy Way, my mind just couldn't accept the concept that alcohol tasted terrible and was no fun. I couldn't do it, my memory told me otherwise. I had the exact same cognitive dissonance that Annie did. I needed to prove it to myself.
So I purposely got drunk on most of a bottle of wine while doing absolutely nothing. I was bored out of my mind and hated every second of it, and like magic, the wine that I had loved tasted like gasoline. It was horrible. I despised the sensation of getting tipsy and then drunk as well, but I didn't bother filming myself.
That pretty much sealed the deal for me. Any time a craving came up, I just had to remind myself that the last time I drank, it was objectively an awful experience.
I then reread both books from a totally different perspective and felt quite certain that I was done with alcohol.
Annie said at one point in some video that she knows people who do the experiment every year to keep that memory fresh. I decided last year that I would do that. Every January, I would buy a bottle of wine, get drunk while doing nothing, and film myself.
Well, I did, and it was HORRIBLE.
Leading up to it I was so nervous that I might enjoy it, that I might miss it, that it might trigger new cravings, etc.
NOPE. What a miserable experience and I definitely do not look forward to doing that again in a year.
First, the taste is truly, truly vile. I could barely choke it down without a grimace. I was drinking out of this tiny glass, like a child's juice glass, and it took a solid 45 minutes to get through the first one.
My mouth felt disgusting. Like, you can really feel the direct damage to the delicate tissues of the mouth. No wonder it's such a powerful oral cancer carcinogen.
The other thing I could feel, which caught me off guard, was the depressant effect. I took about a half dozen videos and in them I kept saying "I feel so sad". I don't think I ever noticed before how it actively made me feel so very, very sad. I wasn't sad about anything, I had had a great day, was looking forward to a great week, and generally feeling like life is very good. But fuck, I felt SO SAD.
It turns out this "sad" feeling is what always drove me to get obnoxiously philosophical when I used to drink. I'm obnoxiously philosophical on a cheerful, sunny afternoon; the world does not need any more of that from me, especially not the stupid drunk version.
Wow it made me dumb. Wow.
So I was sad, philosophical, and dumb.
For those following along at home, that's a fucking tragic combo.
Extra bonus? I broke my front tooth before this. Not a big deal, it's a porcelain veneer from when I broke my tooth in a basketball game in the 90s. It's just really old and part of it broke off, so I look particularly fetching at the moment. All of my videos were done with the ever flattering front-facing camera on my phone too. So watching the already embarssing videos was soooooooooooooooooo flattering. So flattering. I didn't at all watch them cringing through my fingers covering my eyes. Not at all.../sarcasm
ANYHOO!
I barely made it through a half bottle of Pinot noir. I actually snapped after a few hours and poured the other half down the sink so that I wouldn't have to drink anymore because it was so unpleasant and awful, and my stomach was already in revolt. My goal had been to get distinctly drunk, and I failed because I couldn't bring myself to do it. I was just at the notably buzzed stage, and it was horrid.
Because I was barely drunk, I didn't wake up with any real degree of hangover, just a slight increase to my ever present headache, and a little more fatigue than normal. Last year when I did this I woke up feeling like death and had to go to work. That sucked. I'll never forget how much I hated that.
Last year the cravings the next day were brutal. Even though I had hated it, I guess the habit was so recent and the cravings were still so strong that it lit them right up. This time, zero cravings. I can't even think about wine without my stomach turning a bit.
So yeah, I plan on doing this awful, awful thing to myself once a year. If I ever get to a point that I never have stupid cravings for something I know I don't want, I'll stop doing this. Until then, I'll always have a relatively recent experience to think back to every time my brain conjures up a lovely image of sipping delicious merlot by the beach, or some other fucking nonsense.
TLDR: I made myself drink (for science!) and it sucked donkey balls, and being sad, philosophical, and dumb is a hideously embarrassing combination. Also, wine tastes like cancerous death.
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Wow Malcat, I think I should never try this experiment, I can only imagine how terrible I sound and act when I am truly drunk, to watch it would also be horrifying. But I applaude you for having the courage to do it.
I haven't had anything to drink since Christmas day. Back on the last day of June, I cut way back on my drinking. I was only drinking on the weekends and just 1 glass of wine, two at the most and not every weekend. The holidays were really a depressing time for me since we could not get home to visit our family (we are a military family stationed out of state). Covid was tolerable for me for the first 6 months. Once we got into the fall and early winter the extrovert in me has been going a little flaky. I love my husband and kids, but not seeing people and talking to other people is a lot for me. So Christmas day I indulged a little too much when I was cooking all day. The good thing is I didn't start until my dinner was almost done cooking so the majority of my drinking was happening while eating and after I finished my meal. Because of that I didn't feel as bad as I really should have the next day. I dumped the little bit of the wine that was left the next day and haven't had the desire to open another bottle since. Even New Years Eve, I had no desire to drink, probably because I was at home with my kids and husband and none of them drink (my kids are only 12). I have never really been a person to drink by myself. I mostly drink with friends/neighbors while hanging out.
I really don't expect the desire to drink again until we head back to FL to visit family in late April, and even then I plan on keeping it very low in consumption. I was watching a TV show last night and there was this women puking from over drinking and I thought to myself, good Lord, I don't ever want to experience that again in my life. It was a regular occasion for me pre-Covid when I would hang out with my neighbors every weekend. Now that we have moved away and I haven't met any new neighbors/friends here so far, the desire is just not there.
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Malcat, that sounds awful. If I drank wine I would feel the same. However, I love the taste of beer so would be hooked again if I drank that. I am 6 months AF and love AF beer and that doesn’t trigger cravings. I haven’t had a craving in months. Since I quit drinking in my 20’s and didn’t start again until I met my third husband and he convinced me that I had no issues. I was close to 50. It took me 15 years to decide to quit. I don’t need to do the experiment to know that I am much better without the poison. I feel so lucky that I don’t have cravings or struggle like some people. I happily have my hot chocolate and 2 squares of ghiradelli chocolate every night. I don’t want to stimulate my neuro-pathways again. It’s interesting how differently we all do this.
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Malcat, thank you for your annual contribution to science. Good science that holds up is peer reviewed and repeated many times, yeah? Well, I guess your experience sounds about right. Consider yourself peer reviewed! You'll have to find someone else to do the repeating though. Thanks for sharing your terrible experience with us :)
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Malcat, thank you for your annual contribution to science. Good science that holds up is peer reviewed and repeated many times, yeah? Well, I guess your experience sounds about right. Consider yourself peer reviewed! You'll have to find someone else to do the repeating though. Thanks for sharing your terrible experience with us :)
Tune in this time next year for the next iteration!
That is, if I can hold myself to it. It really was awful.
I partially do it because I find it fascinating. I LOVED wine. I may not have been a heavy drinker, but that was only because of my legendary level of discipline and fear of alcoholism, but damn did I ever love it.
To now find it utterly repulsive and intolerable is fucking fascinating. Mind bloody blowing.
I still get powerful cravings, which is super annoying. I have precisely no interest in drinking, but as much as I am disciplined, I am also someone who develops very strong patterns, so they tend to stay entrenched for a long time. That's actually why I have to be so disciplined, because habits stick in my brain.
I don't get cravings often now, but when I do, they're not weak. I get vivid imagery of how much I used to luxuriate in good wine during a dinner out, or on a Friday night after a long week. I get a strong message of "but you loved this". So a recent memory that no, no I don't, is a nice thing to depend on when, especially around my wine connoisseur family.
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I am not planning on drinking again, even for science. It all smells like poison and I have no desire to drink it. The beer my husband makes still smells 'good' but it's mostly the hops smell that I am enjoying. I still get a bit anxious, but not anywhere near the level of anxiety that I used to have when drinking. I appreciated the naltrexone experiment but it made it clear that drinking booze was a life stage that I am done with now.
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Thank you fro the experiment Malcat!
I would maybe try that only if I took Naltrexone, I do not want to become re addicted.
I have hopefully fully moved on from drinking, I want to be healthy and alcohol is a detriment to that.
Like Msym above, Naltrexone helped me see that I was so over drinking.
I do substitute a bit, with high quality chocolate, and the craft non alcohol beers ( athletic brewing), but it is easier to wean off chocolate than alcohol. One year and five months alcohol free currently.
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Today is the last day of Dry January for many. When I first decided to take a break from alcohol I wasn't exactly sure if I would do just the month of Jan or an entire year. Now that the end of the month is upon us I am all in for a whole year, and excited to see it through. I have more or less been working through The Alcohol Experiment, which I have found to be.... interesting? Not the most compelling thing I have ever experienced but feel like it has done a good job of helping me examine assumptions like "Alcohol is fun to drink" and "Alcohol is not detrimental to your health". I will probably read Alan Carr's book this year since others have mentioned enjoying it perhaps more than the Annie Grace stuff.
I haven't really felt any benefits this month from abstaining, other than Not Feeling Icky and Bloated When I Drink. That seems to be more enough. I just feel, like, normal? It reminds me of when I was a teen/early college before I started drinking. My mind has an equilibrium, and every day is relatively consistently enjoyable. No weight loss, no improved sleep (though I have stopped getting up in the middle of the night to go to the bathroom which is nice), no clearer skin, or anything else like that. But I feel Normal, which is something gained that I did not always feel before. Here's to the rest of the year.
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congratulation JPS, I experienced a bump in energy at six weeks and again at 3 months. Hope you to experience that. I also liked porters book " alcohol explained " very good info and he maybe on youtube as well.
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I haven't had a drink (apart from one birthday-related toasts) since November, but this month I had a couple of moments of temptation. Typically related to certain foods that I seem to associate with wine.
May well be the effect that Malcat was describing.
I guess it will be interesting in summertime when there is much more "social drinking" conditioning coming up.
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I've made a deliberate effort to significantly reduce wine consumption this month, drinking only on three instances for specific planned occasions and not just to have a drink for the sake of relaxing or to end my day. Last night I was with two people of out my 4 person covid bubble and decided I'd have one small glass of wine with dinner. I took two sips of the wine, didn't care for it (and trust me I generally love my wine!), immediately felt flushed and didn't drink any more. I felt flushed the rest of the evening, as if I was having a hot flash, and had difficulty sleeping. I believe this was all from the two sips of wine. It certainly has me questioning my body's reaction to the wine and whether this is a strong sign I should just plan to stay away from it for the long term.
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It’s interesting how if you don’t drink in awhile when you do it tastes bad.
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It’s interesting how if you don’t drink in awhile when you do it tastes bad.
That doesn't happen for me. Wine still tasted good after 30 days when I had a couple glasses Sunday night. I plan to reduce my consumption though. I put the wine back in the pantry so I'm not tempted by looking at it in the evening.
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It’s interesting how if you don’t drink in awhile when you do it tastes bad.
Apparently for some, but not for others.
I think for me, a big part of it is that I never actually acquired a taste for alcohol. I *hated* hard liquor of any kind, and couldn't even stand strong beers. I really only fully acquired a taste for wine, and that's because I really, really worked at it in my late teens because both mine and my boyfriend's families were wine snobs and pressured me into appreciating it.
That's why I thought I had no addiction to alcohol, because I generally wouldn't touch hard liquor if there was no wine. I would, for the most part, rather go without.
Hard liquor pretty much always made me sick as well. My system is actually super sensitive to alcohol and it didn't take much for me to end up puking after a night out just borderline heavy drinking, even if I just mixed red and white wine, and sometimes even if I just mixed reds. I would be violently ill for the entire night.
That's another reason I never thought I was addicted, because I naturally moderated so I wouldn't get sick.
So I pretty much only craved red wine, and rarely drank a lot of it, so I thought I wasn't addicted and had a relatively "healthy" relationship with alcohol.
Nope. I now understand that I was fully addicted, my addiction just had serious limitations, so I'm lucky it never got bad. I think those limitations are what made it so easy to perceive the real taste of alcohol again. Because I had never fully acquired the taste for it in the first place, and my body has a real visceral negative response to it, it was so easy to lose my taste for wine.
It truly was torture the other night when I did my experiment. My body DOES NOT like alcohol. That much is VERY clear.
DH on the other hand, has done several long stretches of sobriety with me, and even when he's not abstaining, it's very rare that he drinks, but he still has his taste for all alcohol. It's strange how differently we responded.
All that said, it's actually not unusually to lose acquired tastes over time with lack of exposure. If I don't eat eggplant for a long time, I completely lose my taste for it. Same with blue cheese.
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It’s interesting how if you don’t drink in awhile when you do it tastes bad.
That doesn't happen for me. Wine still tasted good after 30 days when I had a couple glasses Sunday night. I plan to reduce my consumption though. I put the wine back in the pantry so I'm not tempted by looking at it in the evening.
Ditto. I took a tasting sip of a cocktail I made for my husband the other night to make sure I had the balance right and it was still delicious.
I feel like continuing to be the mixologist in our house has been interesting. I feel thankful that I have not craved a drink, but I'm sort of waiting for the craving to hit.
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That’s interesting you guys. Because it’s mine and my friends experiences I thought it was that way for everyone.
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January is over and we didn't drink at all. I had a few cravings at the times we would sometimes drink but no big deal.
We decided to continue in Feb.
No difference in how I feel, sleep, etc. No weight loss.
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heading into feb without booze and suffering a bit if I'm honest. I've read about something called post actute withdrawal syndrome and that feels like what's going on.
It feels like a hangover only without having drunk and has lasted about a week now. very bloody unfair!
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@Stubblestache,
There is a guy on you tube "fit recovery" and he recomends suppliments to get you through the rough period. He describes the same feeling that you do, and said this hampered his recovery ( because he thought if he drank he would feel better) Anyway see this video and maybe he can help you get through this tough time.
I also didnt feel great initially and when I felt the need to drink, in order to feel better, I reached for chocolate and or ice cream. What ever you have to do. It took a while for me to wean off the junk food and longer to loose the belly! Take care and you can do it! It isnt easy but it is worth it. You will feel better.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-bZefddjb1E (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-bZefddjb1E)
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heading into feb without booze and suffering a bit if I'm honest. I've read about something called post actute withdrawal syndrome and that feels like what's going on.
It feels like a hangover only without having drunk and has lasted about a week now. very bloody unfair!
I have no idea if you're male or female, but I've read research that it can be quite a bit worse and go on quite a bit longer for women.
I know it did for me, and that's a huge motivator to never have to go through it again.
It's the same with quitting coffee, the process was so unpleasant, whenever I think of grabbing a coffee here or there I'm like "fuck no" because quitting was so awful.
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Sober Person Problem: I may have been blacklisted from the local liquor store. Not because of any booze related behaviour, but because we're packing up MIL's estate and I've been using the store as a source of free boxes. I think they've caught on that I never buy anything . . .
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@Stubblestache,
There is a guy on you tube "fit recovery" and he recomends suppliments to get you through the rough period. He describes the same feeling that you do, and said this hampered his recovery ( because he thought if he drank he would feel better) Anyway see this video and maybe he can help you get through this tough time.
I also didnt feel great initially and when I felt the need to drink, in order to feel better, I reached for chocolate and or ice cream. What ever you have to do. It took a while for me to wean off the junk food and longer to loose the belly! Take care and you can do it! It isnt easy but it is worth it. You will feel better.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-bZefddjb1E (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-bZefddjb1E)
Thanks mate. I take a few of these anyway. It's worn off some now and I'm feeling pretty positive. Looking around various sobriety forums it seems to be a normal thing if you were a heavy drinker. One month and nine days in and going strong.
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Two months! :D
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Great work MP and Stubble!
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Two months! :D
well done! I'm one month 15 days and going strong. Chaining sobriety podcasts and reading This Naked Mind at the moment.
If anyone has any good podcasts, let me know.
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Two months! :D
well done! I'm one month 15 days and going strong. Chaining sobriety podcasts and reading This Naked Mind at the moment.
If anyone has any good podcasts, let me know.
I personally never found any podcasts that resonated with me, but I have a hard time enjoying podcasts period.
I know there are a ton out there, but they range so much in terms of content depending on the personal perspective of the podcaster. For example, many of the podcasters were parents, so those aspects of sobriety really lost me 'cuz I DGAF about some stranger's parenting woes.
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Two months! :D
well done! I'm one month 15 days and going strong. Chaining sobriety podcasts and reading This Naked Mind at the moment.
If anyone has any good podcasts, let me know.
I personally never found any podcasts that resonated with me, but I have a hard time enjoying podcasts period.
I know there are a ton out there, but they range so much in terms of content depending on the personal perspective of the podcaster. For example, many of the podcasters were parents, so those aspects of sobriety really lost me 'cuz I DGAF about some stranger's parenting woes.
You're missing out buddy, podcasts are great. Like you say, they range so much, there's bound to be something out there you like!
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Two months! :D
well done! I'm one month 15 days and going strong. Chaining sobriety podcasts and reading This Naked Mind at the moment.
If anyone has any good podcasts, let me know.
I personally never found any podcasts that resonated with me, but I have a hard time enjoying podcasts period.
I know there are a ton out there, but they range so much in terms of content depending on the personal perspective of the podcaster. For example, many of the podcasters were parents, so those aspects of sobriety really lost me 'cuz I DGAF about some stranger's parenting woes.
You're missing out buddy, podcasts are great. Like you say, they range so much, there's bound to be something out there you like!
Sure, everyone says that, but after trying for years to tolerate podcasts, I really don't feel like I'm missing out.
But I listen to an absolute fuck-ton of educational audiobooks, so that might be why I'm intolerant of the blathering of podcasts.
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Two months! :D
well done! I'm one month 15 days and going strong. Chaining sobriety podcasts and reading This Naked Mind at the moment.
If anyone has any good podcasts, let me know.
I personally never found any podcasts that resonated with me, but I have a hard time enjoying podcasts period.
I know there are a ton out there, but they range so much in terms of content depending on the personal perspective of the podcaster. For example, many of the podcasters were parents, so those aspects of sobriety really lost me 'cuz I DGAF about some stranger's parenting woes.
You're missing out buddy, podcasts are great. Like you say, they range so much, there's bound to be something out there you like!
Sure, everyone says that, but after trying for years to tolerate podcasts, I really don't feel like I'm missing out.
But I listen to an absolute fuck-ton of educational audiobooks, so that might be why I'm intolerant of the blathering of podcasts.
I have a difficult time getting into podcasts - but I don't mind watching a podcast being filmed on YouTube. Not sure why seeing the person talk makes such as difference for me.
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Two months! :D
well done! I'm one month 15 days and going strong. Chaining sobriety podcasts and reading This Naked Mind at the moment.
If anyone has any good podcasts, let me know.
I’m at 2 months as well. Amazing the difference in the quality of my sleep.
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Two months! :D
well done! I'm one month 15 days and going strong. Chaining sobriety podcasts and reading This Naked Mind at the moment.
If anyone has any good podcasts, let me know.
I personally never found any podcasts that resonated with me, but I have a hard time enjoying podcasts period.
I know there are a ton out there, but they range so much in terms of content depending on the personal perspective of the podcaster. For example, many of the podcasters were parents, so those aspects of sobriety really lost me 'cuz I DGAF about some stranger's parenting woes.
You're missing out buddy, podcasts are great. Like you say, they range so much, there's bound to be something out there you like!
Sure, everyone says that, but after trying for years to tolerate podcasts, I really don't feel like I'm missing out.
But I listen to an absolute fuck-ton of educational audiobooks, so that might be why I'm intolerant of the blathering of podcasts.
How funny, I can't stand audiobooks and will take reading over it every time :D
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Two months! :D
well done! I'm one month 15 days and going strong. Chaining sobriety podcasts and reading This Naked Mind at the moment.
If anyone has any good podcasts, let me know.
I personally never found any podcasts that resonated with me, but I have a hard time enjoying podcasts period.
I know there are a ton out there, but they range so much in terms of content depending on the personal perspective of the podcaster. For example, many of the podcasters were parents, so those aspects of sobriety really lost me 'cuz I DGAF about some stranger's parenting woes.
You're missing out buddy, podcasts are great. Like you say, they range so much, there's bound to be something out there you like!
Sure, everyone says that, but after trying for years to tolerate podcasts, I really don't feel like I'm missing out.
But I listen to an absolute fuck-ton of educational audiobooks, so that might be why I'm intolerant of the blathering of podcasts.
How funny, I can't stand audiobooks and will take reading over it every time :D
I can't read while: cooking, walking, exercising, cleaning, or driving.
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I haven't had any alcohol in nearly two months and so far in conjunction with mild calorie counting and exercise I have lost eight pounds. My blood pressure has improved by about 10 points so far. I feel pretty good and I'm getting much better sleep.
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Both of you are aproaching 2 months no alcohol, no small feat.
I think the improved sleeping was something that I noticed early, then significantly increased energy at 2-3 months. Good luck to both of you.
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I'm on my second "break" since Coronavirus took us all by storm. I noticed I was drinking more heavily out of boredom during lockdown, and was starting to feel the bad effects on my body: fatigue, racing heart, etc.
I completed sober October without too much distress. The first week was terrible in terms of sleeping, but by the end of the month I was doing great. I decided to just let myself go back to drinking however things happened. For the first month or so I was moderate (less than 10 drinks per week I'd say) but slowly the tolerance rose and by the end of the year I was back to drinking too heavily.
I was planning on Dry January, but couldn't get going, so now I'm on Dry Lent. Five days in it's been much easier than October--no where near the difficulty sleeping, and I've just been reading before bed, which has been really nice.
I'd say the hardest thing about not drinking is that I feel "bored" in the evenings. I'm not a huge tv person. After about an hour I'm done. So I read. It doesn't feel exciting but my body is thanking me for it :)
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I'm on my second "break" since Coronavirus took us all by storm. I noticed I was drinking more heavily out of boredom during lockdown, and was starting to feel the bad effects on my body: fatigue, racing heart, etc.
I completed sober October without too much distress. The first week was terrible in terms of sleeping, but by the end of the month I was doing great. I decided to just let myself go back to drinking however things happened. For the first month or so I was moderate (less than 10 drinks per week I'd say) but slowly the tolerance rose and by the end of the year I was back to drinking too heavily.
I was planning on Dry January, but couldn't get going, so now I'm on Dry Lent. Five days in it's been much easier than October--no where near the difficulty sleeping, and I've just been reading before bed, which has been really nice.
I'd say the hardest thing about not drinking is that I feel "bored" in the evenings. I'm not a huge tv person. After about an hour I'm done. So I read. It doesn't feel exciting but my body is thanking me for it :)
Annie Grace really hammers into the drinking out of boredom concept.
If you look at the cognitive effects of alcohol, it doesn't relieve boredom in any way, so why do people drink when they are bored and think that it's fun??
Well, that comes down to the mechanism of addiction. The biggest high drinkers get from drinking is actually the endogenous neurological payoff from giving in to a craving, not from the alcohol itself.
If your brain becomes accustom to getting an alcohol hit after work, then it starts releasing dopamine a few hours before the event. Dopamine, contrary to previous understanding, isn't primarily responsible for feeling good, it's primarily responsible for wanting *more* of something.
Eating one chip and wanting more? Dopamine
Doing a great ski run and wanting another right away? Dopamine
Making out with someone and it rapidly escalating to wanting sex? Dopamine
Getting super excited while planning a vacation? Dopamine
Being used to having a drink at 5pm, and 4pm rolls around and has you vividly imagining pouring a glass of your favourite drink? Dopamine
A buildup of dopamine is actually uncomfortable to resist, and giving in to it creates a huge sense of excitement. So that's the thrill of having the evening drink, it's not really the direct effect of the alcohol, which really doesn't actually have many fun effects, it's the surge or dopamine and then the excitement of satisfying that dopamine craving.
If you didn't crave the alcohol in the first place, then drinking it wouldn't alleviate any boredom.
That's what I found with my most recent experiment.
I used to so look forward to my evening wine, and used to always lament that no second drink was ever as good as the first one.
I just didn't realize that the first drink was awesome, but it had nothing to do with the alcohol, it had to do with the internal brain chemistry that was rewarding me for giving in to the craving that the brain had for the alcohol.
The brain gets addicted to the alcohol even though the effects are generally no fun. It's addictive because it's addictive, not because it does anything good.
Our stupid brains have to flood us with our own, natural happy feeling chemicals to fool us into thinking that the booze is fun. It isn't, the brain is just extremely good at doing whatever it takes to get us to consume whatever it's become even mildly addicted to.
I had *zero* fun with my drinking experiment a few weeks ago. No dopamine, no craving to give in to, no fun from drinking. It was tedious and awful. Feeling buzzed without any addiction fueling it is in no way fun. That's why taking naltrexone takes all the fun out of it.
It's the same way I've known a lot of people who tried cocaine and thought "m'eh, that's it?" but cocaine addicts think it's the greatest high on the face of the earth. And the people who absolutely *loved* it the first time they tried it? They're the people who got addicted with their first use, and the ones most likely to develop a problem.
I've had this addictive experience with opiates. I've never found them overly pleasant, but I was once on oxy long enough to become dependent and by the end, I really looked forward to my dose. The same drug that made me feel woozy and kind of awful on day 1, felt dreamy and wonderful on day 10. How? Same drug...
It turns out *being* addicted creates the sense of enjoyment, not the primary action of the drug itself.
I had the exact same experience with sugar last year.
I haven't eaten much sugar for nearly a decade. I don't digest it well and didn't enjoy it much. I never craved it.
Then I quit alcohol and started having sugar in the evenings to deal with the cravings. Well, sugar is a very effective dopamine trigger. I got totally hooked, and for most of 2020, my cravings for sugar were far more powerful than my cravings for alcohol had ever been.
This is something I had never enjoyed, never craved, never thought twice about, and suddenly, after a few weeks of nightly consumption, all I could think about in the evenings was eating something sweet. It started tasting AMAZING. Nothing was too sweet, things I would have considered inedibly sweet became exquisite.
Now that I'm off sugar again, these things are gross again. I can objectively say that I find Oreo cookies to be sickly sweet and cannot consider them food. But 6 months ago, they were culinary perfection as far as I was concerned.
So my point is, your brain will manipulate your perception of anything it becomes addicted to in order to convince you that's it's SO AMAZING to consume it, when it's just a trick.
None of these things are objectively all that enjoyable unless your brain gets hooked on them.
So alcohol is boring. It does absolutely NOTHING to alleviate boredom. But your brain wants it, so it's giving you a boost of excitement in exchange for you giving it the poison it's mildly/moderately addicted to.
So consider that the next time alcohol seems like the answer to boredom. Contemplate where the sense of relief from boredom actually comes from, because I guarantee you, it's not from the alcohol itself.
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I'd say the hardest thing about not drinking is that I feel "bored" in the evenings. I'm not a huge tv person. After about an hour I'm done. So I read. It doesn't feel exciting but my body is thanking me for it :)
FWIW - you aren't alone on the bored thing. This is my current experience too. I even mentioned it to my husband the other night, like "I just want to make and sip something for an hour because it will use up an hour."
I wonder how much of it is just pandemic and winter making things worse? I'm never bored in the summer. In the summer I'll often step outside and take a walk or just look at stars when I'm bored or I might take myself to a late movie, or even go to the gym.
But right now there is nothing to do. Looking at another screen is enough to drive me bonkers and powers of concentration and focus are diminished by the end of the day, eyes are tired and nothing is open. I guess I could still go outside but I often don't want to deal with pulling furniture out of winter storage and kitting myself out in warmers and layers and snow gear before bed, etc.
Spring really is around the corner though!
I will say not drinking has made the "should I make myself a drink?" question way easier though. Right now it just isn't an option and I appreciate the ease of that.
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@Malcat,
Then I quit alcohol and started having sugar in the evenings to deal with the cravings. Well, sugar is a very effective dopamine trigger. I got totally hooked, and for most of 2020, my cravings for sugar were far more powerful than my cravings for alcohol had ever been.
I had the SAME experience with sugar, I was so surprised that I had a sugar addiction! I was like where was this addiction when I drank beer? I was never addicted to sugar before. But there was the craving chocolate and ice cream every night, I had thought at the time, that I must have always had a sugar addiction and perhaps beer was the sugar until I quit.
Damn my addicted brain.
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Malcat, really interesting insights. I have never had a sugar addiction but since I quit drinking 7 months ago I drink a cup of hot chocolate and have 2 pieces of chocolate every evening. I look forward to it. I have lost 32 pounds and just figure it into my calories. I am okay with this new addiction:)).
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Good points @Malcat . I'm reading through This Naked Mind now (and listening to Annie Grace's podcasts, which I know you love :P) and it is certainly interesting to look at my addiction through the lense of what is scientifically happening.
I'm also now trying to quit sugar. Woke up over the weekend with an actual sugar hangover - felt almost as bad as an alcohol hangover physically. Headache, sluggish, felt sick. Luckily didn't have any of the mental anguish that can come with a drinking hangover.
Meditation and AA is helping on both fronts.
At this rate of virtuous behaviour takeup, I fully expect to be able to levitate and emit golden light from my eyes within the next month or so.
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At this rate of virtuous behaviour takeup, I fully expect to be able to levitate and emit golden light from my eyes within the next month or so.
I actually LOLed. Bravo!
Now that I'm not craving alcohol, I'm working to cut sugar as well. I tried adopting a bunch of healthy lifestyle changes all at once on 1 Jan, and only quitting drinking stuck past the third week. Now that I associate drinking more with the crummy health effects than the dopamine rush (seriously, This Naked Mind is terrific for changing perspective!), I'm going to try re-introducing some other healthy habits. I'm a retired sailor, so virtue and I have always had a tense relationship, but I'm working on it.
Don't see them as virtuous then. How can something be virtuous if it only benefits yourself?
I focus on doing what makes me feel good. Sugar doesn't make me feel good, so in stopped eating it. Red meat makes me feel ill, so I almost never eat it. Processed food really doesn't make me feel good, so I generally avoid it. My condition was making my heart race and giving me ~500 heart palpitations a day, so I stopped drinking coffee and I feel much better.
I switched to almost entirely vegetarian for virtuous reasons, but I make the particular dishes I do because I like them and they make my body feel good.
I read a series of studies that found that the most sustainable diet approach was one where before people consumed anything, they mentally projected how it would make their body feel afterwards.
So that's what I do. Everything I consume or don't consume is based on how I project it will make me feel, so not consuming alcohol, coffee, meat, sugar, processed food, and meat 90% of the time doesn't feel like self denial, it actually feels like self indulgence because I'm always indulging what my body wants.
It's not virtue, it's keeping my high maintenance bitch of a body happy with me, and she is a demanding mistress.
I can't sustain any habit that's based on self denial, it goes against the very core of my being. But self care? Adding benefit to my day and my life in general? Yeah, I can easily get behind that philosophically.
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A buildup of dopamine is actually uncomfortable to resist, and giving in to it creates a huge sense of excitement. So that's the thrill of having the evening drink, it's not really the direct effect of the alcohol, which really doesn't actually have many fun effects, it's the surge or dopamine and then the excitement of satisfying that dopamine craving.
If you didn't crave the alcohol in the first place, then drinking it wouldn't alleviate any boredom.
That's what I found with my most recent experiment.
I used to so look forward to my evening wine, and used to always lament that no second drink was ever as good as the first one.
I just didn't realize that the first drink was awesome, but it had nothing to do with the alcohol, it had to do with the internal brain chemistry that was rewarding me for giving in to the craving that the brain had for the alcohol.
This is really interesting. I'm not sure it really hit home when I did Annie's Experiment but now that you've laid it out again I can definitely see how this works. It's the anticipation that is so hard to resist. I can confirm this in 2 ways. First, I definitely know the feeling of the little serotonin burst when I pour that after work drink and my happy parts come out singing "yay, now we get to relax!" Also after my month off last year when I had my first few drinks I had basically broken that habit, so didn't feel the "joy." Instead I was like "why am I even having a drink?" And once I did, I'd stop (since my tolerance was reset) because I didn't particularly like the on-coming buzz.
As for the boredom, I'm still working on the "filling the hours" bit. Again, reading seems to help but it's still a little crunchy for the moment.
Thanks for the feedback @Malcat
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I will say not drinking has made the "should I make myself a drink?" question way easier though. Right now it just isn't an option and I appreciate the ease of that.
Totally agree with this. Taking the choice away radically simplifies the issue :)
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stopping by to report...no alcohol in the last five weeks.
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At this rate of virtuous behaviour takeup, I fully expect to be able to levitate and emit golden light from my eyes within the next month or so.
I actually LOLed. Bravo!
Now that I'm not craving alcohol, I'm working to cut sugar as well. I tried adopting a bunch of healthy lifestyle changes all at once on 1 Jan, and only quitting drinking stuck past the third week. Now that I associate drinking more with the crummy health effects than the dopamine rush (seriously, This Naked Mind is terrific for changing perspective!), I'm going to try re-introducing some other healthy habits. I'm a retired sailor, so virtue and I have always had a tense relationship, but I'm working on it.
Don't see them as virtuous then. How can something be virtuous if it only benefits yourself?
I focus on doing what makes me feel good. Sugar doesn't make me feel good, so in stopped eating it. Red meat makes me feel ill, so I almost never eat it. Processed food really doesn't make me feel good, so I generally avoid it. My condition was making my heart race and giving me ~500 heart palpitations a day, so I stopped drinking coffee and I feel much better.
I switched to almost entirely vegetarian for virtuous reasons, but I make the particular dishes I do because I like them and they make my body feel good.
I read a series of studies that found that the most sustainable diet approach was one where before people consumed anything, they mentally projected how it would make their body feel afterwards.
So that's what I do. Everything I consume or don't consume is based on how I project it will make me feel, so not consuming alcohol, coffee, meat, sugar, processed food, and meat 90% of the time doesn't feel like self denial, it actually feels like self indulgence because I'm always indulging what my body wants.
It's not virtue, it's keeping my high maintenance bitch of a body happy with me, and she is a demanding mistress.
I can't sustain any habit that's based on self denial, it goes against the very core of my being. But self care? Adding benefit to my day and my life in general? Yeah, I can easily get behind that philosophically.
I use the term "virtue" a bit tongue in cheek to describe anything that I know that I should do for my health but requires effort, rather than in the literal sense. I know that your approach makes sense - of course I should only do what makes my body and mind feel good, but it's hard to break old patterns of associating certain foods, alcohol, or even behaviours with pleasure and comfort even when I know that I'm better off without them. Not that I envy your medical condition for the feedback it provides you - but if I were to get hit in the head every time I ate a cinnamon bun, I might eat fewer of them. Quitting drinking was relatively easy this time because it was making me feel quite sick, and it didn't take long to notice how much better I felt. The other good habits are harder to stick to because their benefits are more subtle for me. So I'll keep trying, failing, and trying again.
Oh, I figured it was tongue in cheek, but changing my perception of what I consume really has helped me find it incredibly easy to maintain an excellent diet.
I put absolutely no virtue value on any of it, which means that I don't code certain foods as "treats" and other foods as "good". I just know what makes me feel great after I eat it and what doesn't.
Even if you don't have the obvious health issue feedback that I do, everyone's body responds pretty strongly to what you eat. DH is extremely healthy, and used to think he could comfortably eat anything, but now that he's spoiled with a constant, very healthy diet, he's now very aware of how non-optimal food affects him.
He complains more than I do if he has to be off-diet for more than a day or two.
What you consume has a profound affect on how your body feels, if you aren't aware of it, then chances are that you've never gone through a long enough period of only feeding your body what it wants.
Once you do, it's really hard to tolerate anything else.
For me it happened by chance, I worked in a vegetarian restaurant in university where they let the staff eat for free, and even let us take take-out containers home. So I lived on a diet that was mostly fresh vegetables for over a year and I was shocked to find that anything else felt like shit.
So that's how I eat now. If it's not mostly plants, it doesn't feel right.
In terms of alcohol, I genuinely believed that it made me feel better, because it's a quite effective pain reliever and I'm in constant pain, so I got pretty strong signals from my body that this was a good thing. Plus part of my illness is that I wake up with a splitting headache every day anyway, so handovers never really registered.
Because I didn't drink a lot, I was able to believe that there was a net benefit to my well being. Once I quit, I saw that wasn't true, that it made the morning pain worse, that it made my overall pain worse. Now that I see that, it's easy not to want it.
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stopping by to report...no alcohol in the last five weeks.
excellent, well done!
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Lizard. Well done. First year is the hardest.
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So last year, about a month into quitting, I did Annie Grace's drinking experiment. The one where she purposely got drunk after quitting and filmed herself, to prove to herself that it was total shit.
I did it because after reading This Naked Mind and Allen Carr's Easy Way, my mind just couldn't accept the concept that alcohol tasted terrible and was no fun. I couldn't do it, my memory told me otherwise. I had the exact same cognitive dissonance that Annie did. I needed to prove it to myself.
So I purposely got drunk on most of a bottle of wine while doing absolutely nothing. I was bored out of my mind and hated every second of it, and like magic, the wine that I had loved tasted like gasoline. It was horrible. I despised the sensation of getting tipsy and then drunk as well, but I didn't bother filming myself.
That pretty much sealed the deal for me. Any time a craving came up, I just had to remind myself that the last time I drank, it was objectively an awful experience.
I then reread both books from a totally different perspective and felt quite certain that I was done with alcohol.
Annie said at one point in some video that she knows people who do the experiment every year to keep that memory fresh. I decided last year that I would do that. Every January, I would buy a bottle of wine, get drunk while doing nothing, and film myself.
Well, I did, and it was HORRIBLE.
Leading up to it I was so nervous that I might enjoy it, that I might miss it, that it might trigger new cravings, etc.
NOPE. What a miserable experience and I definitely do not look forward to doing that again in a year.
First, the taste is truly, truly vile. I could barely choke it down without a grimace. I was drinking out of this tiny glass, like a child's juice glass, and it took a solid 45 minutes to get through the first one.
My mouth felt disgusting. Like, you can really feel the direct damage to the delicate tissues of the mouth. No wonder it's such a powerful oral cancer carcinogen.
The other thing I could feel, which caught me off guard, was the depressant effect. I took about a half dozen videos and in them I kept saying "I feel so sad". I don't think I ever noticed before how it actively made me feel so very, very sad. I wasn't sad about anything, I had had a great day, was looking forward to a great week, and generally feeling like life is very good. But fuck, I felt SO SAD.
It turns out this "sad" feeling is what always drove me to get obnoxiously philosophical when I used to drink. I'm obnoxiously philosophical on a cheerful, sunny afternoon; the world does not need any more of that from me, especially not the stupid drunk version.
Wow it made me dumb. Wow.
So I was sad, philosophical, and dumb.
For those following along at home, that's a fucking tragic combo.
Extra bonus? I broke my front tooth before this. Not a big deal, it's a porcelain veneer from when I broke my tooth in a basketball game in the 90s. It's just really old and part of it broke off, so I look particularly fetching at the moment. All of my videos were done with the ever flattering front-facing camera on my phone too. So watching the already embarssing videos was soooooooooooooooooo flattering. So flattering. I didn't at all watch them cringing through my fingers covering my eyes. Not at all.../sarcasm
ANYHOO!
I barely made it through a half bottle of Pinot noir. I actually snapped after a few hours and poured the other half down the sink so that I wouldn't have to drink anymore because it was so unpleasant and awful, and my stomach was already in revolt. My goal had been to get distinctly drunk, and I failed because I couldn't bring myself to do it. I was just at the notably buzzed stage, and it was horrid.
Because I was barely drunk, I didn't wake up with any real degree of hangover, just a slight increase to my ever present headache, and a little more fatigue than normal. Last year when I did this I woke up feeling like death and had to go to work. That sucked. I'll never forget how much I hated that.
Last year the cravings the next day were brutal. Even though I had hated it, I guess the habit was so recent and the cravings were still so strong that it lit them right up. This time, zero cravings. I can't even think about wine without my stomach turning a bit.
So yeah, I plan on doing this awful, awful thing to myself once a year. If I ever get to a point that I never have stupid cravings for something I know I don't want, I'll stop doing this. Until then, I'll always have a relatively recent experience to think back to every time my brain conjures up a lovely image of sipping delicious merlot by the beach, or some other fucking nonsense.
TLDR: I made myself drink (for science!) and it sucked donkey balls, and being sad, philosophical, and dumb is a hideously embarrassing combination. Also, wine tastes like cancerous death.
I have no plans specifically to put myself through this, but I do drink very occasionally still, and your experience jives with most of mine, which is why I keep defaulting back to not drinking. Last time I had a couple drinks was about 3 months ago, after a 9 month stretch of no drinking.
Unlike you, I still love the taste of my preferred alcohols, so that part was very pleasant. But the buzz itself was not the same as I 'remember' from my days of regular drinking. It was ok, but not as good as the high that my brain convinced me I needed every evening to transition from work. And it was so brief! (which I'd figured out not long after starting the Alcohol Experiment). After that, I was just draggy, slightly dehydrated, and as you point out, vaguely 'down/sad'. But also prone to talking and talking LOL, so constantly inflicting not very interesting, slightly sad thoughts/observations on my husband LOL.
Yeah, it's just not a great activity. It was conditioning, dopamine release, and special neurological wiring that my brain developed that made it seem great.
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It’s interesting how if you don’t drink in awhile when you do it tastes bad.
That doesn't happen for me. Wine still tasted good after 30 days when I had a couple glasses Sunday night. I plan to reduce my consumption though. I put the wine back in the pantry so I'm not tempted by looking at it in the evening.
Didn't happen for me either, even after almost a year not drinking. I simply love the taste. That's ok, though, I've given up plenty of things I love to eat, or eat them extremely rarely.
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Two months! :D
well done! I'm one month 15 days and going strong. Chaining sobriety podcasts and reading This Naked Mind at the moment.
If anyone has any good podcasts, let me know.
I personally never found any podcasts that resonated with me, but I have a hard time enjoying podcasts period.
I know there are a ton out there, but they range so much in terms of content depending on the personal perspective of the podcaster. For example, many of the podcasters were parents, so those aspects of sobriety really lost me 'cuz I DGAF about some stranger's parenting woes.
You're missing out buddy, podcasts are great. Like you say, they range so much, there's bound to be something out there you like!
Sure, everyone says that, but after trying for years to tolerate podcasts, I really don't feel like I'm missing out.
But I listen to an absolute fuck-ton of educational audiobooks, so that might be why I'm intolerant of the blathering of podcasts.
How funny, I can't stand audiobooks and will take reading over it every time :D
I can't read while: cooking, walking, exercising, cleaning, or driving.
:highfive:
Re: podcasts, I love them in general, but have only found ONE podcast re not drinking that I can tolerate some of the time. There's so much 12 step stuff (NOT into it), parenting stuff (don't care), weird pseudo-science stuff (eye-rolly), and so on.
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I'm on my second "break" since Coronavirus took us all by storm. I noticed I was drinking more heavily out of boredom during lockdown, and was starting to feel the bad effects on my body: fatigue, racing heart, etc.
I completed sober October without too much distress. The first week was terrible in terms of sleeping, but by the end of the month I was doing great. I decided to just let myself go back to drinking however things happened. For the first month or so I was moderate (less than 10 drinks per week I'd say) but slowly the tolerance rose and by the end of the year I was back to drinking too heavily.
I was planning on Dry January, but couldn't get going, so now I'm on Dry Lent. Five days in it's been much easier than October--no where near the difficulty sleeping, and I've just been reading before bed, which has been really nice.
I'd say the hardest thing about not drinking is that I feel "bored" in the evenings. I'm not a huge tv person. After about an hour I'm done. So I read. It doesn't feel exciting but my body is thanking me for it :)
Annie Grace really hammers into the drinking out of boredom concept.
If you look at the cognitive effects of alcohol, it doesn't relieve boredom in any way, so why do people drink when they are bored and think that it's fun??
Well, that comes down to the mechanism of addiction. The biggest high drinkers get from drinking is actually the endogenous neurological payoff from giving in to a craving, not from the alcohol itself.
If your brain becomes accustom to getting an alcohol hit after work, then it starts releasing dopamine a few hours before the event. Dopamine, contrary to previous understanding, isn't primarily responsible for feeling good, it's primarily responsible for wanting *more* of something.
Eating one chip and wanting more? Dopamine
Doing a great ski run and wanting another right away? Dopamine
Making out with someone and it rapidly escalating to wanting sex? Dopamine
Getting super excited while planning a vacation? Dopamine
Being used to having a drink at 5pm, and 4pm rolls around and has you vividly imagining pouring a glass of your favourite drink? Dopamine
A buildup of dopamine is actually uncomfortable to resist, and giving in to it creates a huge sense of excitement. So that's the thrill of having the evening drink, it's not really the direct effect of the alcohol, which really doesn't actually have many fun effects, it's the surge or dopamine and then the excitement of satisfying that dopamine craving.
If you didn't crave the alcohol in the first place, then drinking it wouldn't alleviate any boredom.
That's what I found with my most recent experiment.
I used to so look forward to my evening wine, and used to always lament that no second drink was ever as good as the first one.
I just didn't realize that the first drink was awesome, but it had nothing to do with the alcohol, it had to do with the internal brain chemistry that was rewarding me for giving in to the craving that the brain had for the alcohol.
The brain gets addicted to the alcohol even though the effects are generally no fun. It's addictive because it's addictive, not because it does anything good.
Our stupid brains have to flood us with our own, natural happy feeling chemicals to fool us into thinking that the booze is fun. It isn't, the brain is just extremely good at doing whatever it takes to get us to consume whatever it's become even mildly addicted to.
I had *zero* fun with my drinking experiment a few weeks ago. No dopamine, no craving to give in to, no fun from drinking. It was tedious and awful. Feeling buzzed without any addiction fueling it is in no way fun. That's why taking naltrexone takes all the fun out of it.
It's the same way I've known a lot of people who tried cocaine and thought "m'eh, that's it?" but cocaine addicts think it's the greatest high on the face of the earth. And the people who absolutely *loved* it the first time they tried it? They're the people who got addicted with their first use, and the ones most likely to develop a problem.
I've had this addictive experience with opiates. I've never found them overly pleasant, but I was once on oxy long enough to become dependent and by the end, I really looked forward to my dose. The same drug that made me feel woozy and kind of awful on day 1, felt dreamy and wonderful on day 10. How? Same drug...
It turns out *being* addicted creates the sense of enjoyment, not the primary action of the drug itself.
I had the exact same experience with sugar last year.
I haven't eaten much sugar for nearly a decade. I don't digest it well and didn't enjoy it much. I never craved it.
Then I quit alcohol and started having sugar in the evenings to deal with the cravings. Well, sugar is a very effective dopamine trigger. I got totally hooked, and for most of 2020, my cravings for sugar were far more powerful than my cravings for alcohol had ever been.
This is something I had never enjoyed, never craved, never thought twice about, and suddenly, after a few weeks of nightly consumption, all I could think about in the evenings was eating something sweet. It started tasting AMAZING. Nothing was too sweet, things I would have considered inedibly sweet became exquisite.
Now that I'm off sugar again, these things are gross again. I can objectively say that I find Oreo cookies to be sickly sweet and cannot consider them food. But 6 months ago, they were culinary perfection as far as I was concerned.
So my point is, your brain will manipulate your perception of anything it becomes addicted to in order to convince you that's it's SO AMAZING to consume it, when it's just a trick.
None of these things are objectively all that enjoyable unless your brain gets hooked on them.
So alcohol is boring. It does absolutely NOTHING to alleviate boredom. But your brain wants it, so it's giving you a boost of excitement in exchange for you giving it the poison it's mildly/moderately addicted to.
So consider that the next time alcohol seems like the answer to boredom. Contemplate where the sense of relief from boredom actually comes from, because I guarantee you, it's not from the alcohol itself.
YES YES YES YES to all of this.
(It was so predictable: I also fell into about a year of eating a lot of sugar after quitting booze, and I hadn't liked more than a very small amount of sugar for decades...and then for about a year I simply had to keep jolly ranchers in the house...).
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It's so great to come back to this thread after a couple months and see the new people reporting in with their alcohol free experiences!
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I've been thinking about @Malcat's boredom and dopamine post and it just makes me conclude that brains are even more interesting than I had thought. The first time I ever took MDMA, I felt my brain click and go "oh this is Just Like [when I was doing tai chi daily]" and after that, when I went dancing I didn't need to take anything, my brain just tapped into the situation and pumped out the endorphins/serotonin as if I had. It was like learning the shortcut to an ecstatic state that normally takes people a lot longer to achieve, if they ever learn that they can get there without any stimulants.
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I've been thinking about @Malcat's boredom and dopamine post and it just makes me conclude that brains are even more interesting than I had thought. The first time I ever took MDMA, I felt my brain click and go "oh this is Just Like [when I was doing tai chi daily]" and after that, when I went dancing I didn't need to take anything, my brain just tapped into the situation and pumped out the endorphins/serotonin as if I had. It was like learning the shortcut to an ecstatic state that normally takes people a lot longer to achieve, if they ever learn that they can get there without any stimulants.
Yep, brains are weird.
Substances only do one of two things, they either stimulate the release of endogenous chemicals or they mimic the action of endogenous chemicals.
That's it.
Everything we experience is literally just in our heads, which isn't even well understood, so yeah, it makes sense that the brain itself can recreate a high.
The important thing is to understand that substances themselves have absolutely no power to make us feel good, our brains do that part. They only have the power to addict our brains to them, and then our brains do all sorts of funky shit to motivate us to use those substances.
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I'm a day off two months sober and suffering badly from post acute withdrawal syndrome. Thumping headache is the most obvious symptom, but lethargy and irritability are there too. I had the same symptoms around two weeks ago, so guess that indicates the length of the cycle.
Shame as the weather has just started to turn sunny and I wanted to do some nice active stuff with my saturday but am going to have to take it very easy.
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Also just signing in for the month end: Another month of no booze.
Mind you, I've only ever been a social drinker. Covid lockdown rather limits opportunities, so it's not been really that much of a challenge.
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Two months off other than a couple of tasting sips of my DH's cocktails (but I spit them out).
Not shocked, but sad that I'm not seeing any benefits yet. I might be having better sleep a few nights a week? But not consistent enough to notice yet.
I was thinking of ditching the experiment again - but last night I saw a before/after tweet of someone that had gone several months without a drink. Her skin looked AMAZING! Like ten years younger or like she had the best facial regimen that I've ever seen.
I'll stick it out a few more months :)
@Stubblestache - I hope this cycle of withdrawal problems passes quickly and that you feel better soon!
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star bright, I heard that the skin improvement happens at six months, I do remember feeling MUCH improved at 6 months, like a burst of energy. SO keep it up six months if you can and report back! Also for those struggling, all I can say is that it does get better, and being without alcohol will improve your life in many ways that you can not predict. I feel my relationship improved, I am growing more as a person, healing from other things, sleeping like I don' t have a worry in the world!
Usually if I wake up early like 0430 I feel I can not go back to sleep, but these days I just roll over take a few deep breaths and wake up 3 hour later!
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Starbright, it can take longer for some people. At 7 months my skin is so much better plus I feel and sleep so good.
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@Stubblestache I hope this wave passes quickly. Be gentle on yourself and keep up the good work.
@StarBright I didn't have any immediate changes but the benefits snuck up on me. Around 4-5 months I noticed my skin was markedly better. My weight kept fluctuating up and down but slowly settled at 10kg lighter around the 18 month mark. It has been a lot of marginal gains stacking and then suddenly it crosses a threshold that made me notice a benefit.
@BikeFanatic that is awesome! The being able to go back to sleep or just not waking up in the middle of the night is probably my second favourite thing. (my first is how much my relationship improved)
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Starbright, it can take longer for some people. At 7 months my skin is so much better plus I feel and sleep so good.
@StarBright @Cassie @mspym Anyone have an idea why skin improvement would be delayed for so long? I feel like 6 months would be far beyond the chemical changes that happen in your body after alcohol leaves it. What am I missing? Still, something to look forward to in 4 months.
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Starbright, it can take longer for some people. At 7 months my skin is so much better plus I feel and sleep so good.
@StarBright @Cassie @mspym Anyone have an idea why skin improvement would be delayed for so long? I feel like 6 months would be far beyond the chemical changes that happen in your body after alcohol leaves it. What am I missing? Still, something to look forward to in 4 months.
Yeah, but it takes quite awhile for skin to turnover, so it depends on what damage you're talking about.
The immediate effect on skin is dehydration. My skin was in really good shape to begin with, so suddenly being more hydrated meant that it looked much better after only a few weeks. However, if you had more long-term damage, it may take much longer for the damaged skin to turnover and start showing improvement.
A healing body is a fairly long process that goes on well after the immediate damage ceases happening.
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I'm glad that I'm not the only one here who is motivated by improvements to physical appearance. Sure, I'm glad to not be nauseous, have constant stomach pain, to reduce my emotional roller-coaster, and to gain hours of clear thinking per day, but when will the dark circles under my eyes fade? Also, I'm waiting for the magical weight loss that I keep hearing about, though I think that my month of ice cream and sweets might have something to do with not losing much weight so far :) Despite having to wait for the improvements, the before and after pictures on Pinterest are so good that I'll stick it out (ok, fine - also not feeling like garbage is nice too).
I think all this stuff is totally individual. I never got any change at all to my physical appearance (except less wine stain on my teeth). The thing is, though, drinking every day never made me look worse, either. I looked fine during the decades I was drinking every day...never gained weight or got red skin or puffy or anything.
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I gained weight and had red skin. I aged a lot between 50 when I started drinking and now at 66.
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I have not been strictly abstaining but since January's full stop I've been drinking considerably less. Less in both quantity and frequency. I may end up trailing off to zero but it was never my original goal
Anyway, the benefits are crazy. For me I do think my face looks fresher. I never felt like I looked bad but I did recently start to notice my age more. I just feel like I have a better color, less ruddy. My sleep has improved, similar to someone above I still wake up in the middle of the night but I'm able to get back asleep much easier.
The biggest benefit for me is my overall attitude. I have more patience with my children and I feel like I don't have a short fuse. There's been some other life changes at the same time but also contributed to this but I know a huge reduction in drinking also helped.
I too would like to see the magical weight loss, I haven't seen any and have not made any other changes to my diet or fitness routine. I was hoping that just caloric reduction would give me something. Oh well!
I just realized that over the years, especially over the last year with working and distance learning from home that I was turning to wine too frequently, with no break. I feel like something small that I deserved. I'm so happy for it to be back on my terms.
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Restaurants have reopened here for a bit, so we went out yesterday to my old undergrad pub. We chose it because it's absolutely massive, so there's tons of space for their covid protocols to be top notch.
I haven't been there in years and was prepared to be slammed with cravings for a pitcher of beer, but they had nonalcoholic Becks, so we were perfectly happy with our greasy food and near beer. I'm so glad that more and more places have non alcoholic options, because I definitely feel a little glum when soda water with lime is my only viable beverage option because I don't like sugary drinks.
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I've been reading this thread for a while and thought I'd pop in with my experience. I've noticed that
when I am having that first beer before dinner, I am looking forward to increasing my 'high' with the next beer,
but... if I have dinner before the next beer, I no longer want to get any 'higher' and I leave it at one beer, a
and never have the second.
Seems like having a bunch of calories would not eliminate the desire to get 'high' but it does. A good thing, I guess.
Also, on the sugar theme: I am one of those guys who has ice cream instead of beer sometimes.
Takes away the desire for beer. Sugar is supposed to be bad for you, but in moderation, maybe it's not that bad.s me wonder if
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Today is day 75 AF. No cravings or desire for drinking to report. I have a can of wood chuck hard cider left over from Christmas time in the fridge that I notice when I open the door. But I really have no desire to drink it. I love hard apple cider, so this is shocking it doesn't bother me seeing it daily. I told my hubby he should drink it and he was like, why, so I can sleep terribly tonight. And I realized he probably only drank occasionally to join me when I was drinking. Now that I am not drinking he has no desire to drink. I think I will keep that can in the fridge to look at to remind me of why I wanted to slow down. It's just empty calories that make me act stupid and feel terrible the next day.
My biggest challenge will be our vacation to Florida at the end of April. This will be the first time seeing family in over a year and they will want to go out to eat at our favorite beach bar and grill and have pitchers of Sangria with our meals. I do plan on having a glass if I want, but told my hubby, I need to have a new relationship with alcohol. I am going to drink as if I need to drive home that night. Normally my hubby drives and that lets me open to drinking as much as I want. But on occasions when visiting friends without him in the past when I had my kids, I would only drink a half glass of wine and stop because I never drive after drinking with my kids in the car. If I can restrain my drinking for my kids then I am strong enough to do it for myself.
Here's to hoping everyone is doing well with St. Patrick's day coming up. Although here in the Boston area the celebrations will be subdued this year due to Covid.
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I am joining this party again. My stress drinking is getting a bit out of control, want to give it a rest for a couple weeks and see if I feel better.
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I am joining this party again. My stress drinking is getting a bit out of control, want to give it a rest for a couple weeks and see if I feel better.
Welcome back.
You had mentioned in your thread that you hadn't read This Naked Mind. If you're just aiming for a few weeks to start, then I recommend that you start with Annie Grace's 30 day experiment, it's quick and easy and won't add much to your already busy days. But make sure to actually do the exercises. They'll be good for you not just in terms of drinking, but in general for your mental health right now. All of Annie Grace's stuff is CBT based, so you'll benefit in your current state whether you actually stop drinking or not.
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I am joining this party again. My stress drinking is getting a bit out of control, want to give it a rest for a couple weeks and see if I feel better.
Welcome back, it's good to see you in these parts. Alcohol was my coping mechanism for my burnout but I am genuinely so much less stressed now that I don't drink. Please stick around, it can take longer than a few weeks for your brain to stop tantruming in the attempt to get you to drink again.
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I am joining this party again. My stress drinking is getting a bit out of control, want to give it a rest for a couple weeks and see if I feel better.
Welcome back.
You had mentioned in your thread that you hadn't read This Naked Mind. If you're just aiming for a few weeks to start, then I recommend that you start with Annie Grace's 30 day experiment, it's quick and easy and won't add much to your already busy days. But make sure to actually do the exercises. They'll be good for you not just in terms of drinking, but in general for your mental health right now. All of Annie Grace's stuff is CBT based, so you'll benefit in your current state whether you actually stop drinking or not.
FYI, if you do the Experiment, make sure you don't end up on the legacy site (everything switched over a few months ago but people still mistakenly sign up at the non-supported old site). The main site is the one with all the commenting activity..."Returning users login"
https://learn.thisnakedmind.com/the-alcohol-experiment-registration
The legacy site had a great feature where you could track comments in real time with notifications, and also blog, join groups, etc. Now they've split that function onto an entirely different site, accessible here:
https://www.thisnakedmindcommunity.com/home
Have fun! I know that sounds weird, but I really found the Experiment super interesting and fun, even though I went into it with trepidation.
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I am joining this party again. My stress drinking is getting a bit out of control, want to give it a rest for a couple weeks and see if I feel better.
Welcome back.
You had mentioned in your thread that you hadn't read This Naked Mind. If you're just aiming for a few weeks to start, then I recommend that you start with Annie Grace's 30 day experiment, it's quick and easy and won't add much to your already busy days. But make sure to actually do the exercises. They'll be good for you not just in terms of drinking, but in general for your mental health right now. All of Annie Grace's stuff is CBT based, so you'll benefit in your current state whether you actually stop drinking or not.
FYI, if you do the Experiment, make sure you don't end up on the legacy site (everything switched over a few months ago but people still mistakenly sign up at the non-supported old site). The main site is the one with all the commenting activity..."Returning users login"
https://learn.thisnakedmind.com/the-alcohol-experiment-registration
The legacy site had a great feature where you could track comments in real time with notifications, and also blog, join groups, etc. Now they've split that function onto an entirely different site, accessible here:
https://www.thisnakedmindcommunity.com/home
Have fun! I know that sounds weird, but I really found the Experiment super interesting and fun, even though I went into it with trepidation.
Same, I missed it once it was done. I've tried to find a similar but more general daily guided journal type of program but haven't found one.
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I am joining this party again. My stress drinking is getting a bit out of control, want to give it a rest for a couple weeks and see if I feel better.
Welcome back.
You had mentioned in your thread that you hadn't read This Naked Mind. If you're just aiming for a few weeks to start, then I recommend that you start with Annie Grace's 30 day experiment, it's quick and easy and won't add much to your already busy days. But make sure to actually do the exercises. They'll be good for you not just in terms of drinking, but in general for your mental health right now. All of Annie Grace's stuff is CBT based, so you'll benefit in your current state whether you actually stop drinking or not.
FYI, if you do the Experiment, make sure you don't end up on the legacy site (everything switched over a few months ago but people still mistakenly sign up at the non-supported old site). The main site is the one with all the commenting activity..."Returning users login"
https://learn.thisnakedmind.com/the-alcohol-experiment-registration
The legacy site had a great feature where you could track comments in real time with notifications, and also blog, join groups, etc. Now they've split that function onto an entirely different site, accessible here:
https://www.thisnakedmindcommunity.com/home
Have fun! I know that sounds weird, but I really found the Experiment super interesting and fun, even though I went into it with trepidation.
Same, I missed it once it was done. I've tried to find a similar but more general daily guided journal type of program but haven't found one.
I downloaded the android app and watched the first video. Didn't want to drink today anyway because I had a migraine so I figured it was a good time to start. The advice about taking back control can be applied to many things besides drinking.
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Hey, I wanted to thank everyone who shared their story on this thread. It really helped me! I wanted to share my story too.
I came across this thread during Dry-anuary (which was, by the way, a failure). Like some others I was a 1-2 glasses of wine per day person, which increased during times of stress, especially last year with COVID and work. But I didn't have any motivation to change because I didn't see any effects on my health, relationships, job, etc. There was some financial cost, but my income and savings was high enough that it didn't seem to matter. Plus my social circle has traditionally been around oriented around eating and drinking. No binges, no blackouts, no throwing up, not even staying up past 11pm -- but certainly a big part of the social experience.
The only thing was that I had set some fitness goals, and I knew that I could be a better athlete without alcohol. So I had stopped drinking the nights before a challenging workout. Then, this winter I had a small (but painful) injury and I read that alcohol increases inflammation, which means that it slows the healing. So I decided instantly to stop until the injury healed. It was actually a really easy decision, and then I felt excited about how much time I was going to gain back in my life. Like, I wouldn't have to devote 5pm on to sitting around, drinking wine and watching TV. I stocked the fridge with low-sugar organic fruit sodas, and they are delicious.
Unlike Dry-anuary, I have experienced no real cravings, and it's been more than 1 month since I stopped drinking. My sleep has improved, I don't feel bloated, and I have way more energy. My skin looks better already. Stress levels are also lower, but I did make some other changes in my life that are helping with that too. I just feel more present and alive. I don't even feel nervous about going to social events (which are of course fewer due to COVID), I think it should be fine to just drink a soda.
I am halfway through The Naked Mind. I don't feel the need to make a pledge that I will never drink again, because I just have zero desire. Mostly, I'm annoyed that I fell for the conformity, social pressures, and marketing ploys that make people think drinking is positive. I'm a bit ashamed I didn't take the health risks seriously. Now, I'm happy to not be putting poison in my body every day. I'm happy to think for myself. I'm thrilled for all the time and energy I have freed up to do what I want to do.
I just wish I could share this feeling with others in my social circle, but I know that no one wants to hear it. It's obnoxious to be lectured by your friends. I certainly didn't want to hear it until I had the right motivation. So I just have to tell myself to lead by example and if anyone is ever really interested, they can ask.
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Hey, I wanted to thank everyone who shared their story on this thread. It really helped me! I wanted to share my story too.
I came across this thread during Dry-anuary (which was, by the way, a failure). Like some others I was a 1-2 glasses of wine per day person, which increased during times of stress, especially last year with COVID and work. But I didn't have any motivation to change because I didn't see any effects on my health, relationships, job, etc. There was some financial cost, but my income and savings was high enough that it didn't seem to matter. Plus my social circle has traditionally been around oriented around eating and drinking. No binges, no blackouts, no throwing up, not even staying up past 11pm -- but certainly a big part of the social experience.
The only thing was that I had set some fitness goals, and I knew that I could be a better athlete without alcohol. So I had stopped drinking the nights before a challenging workout. Then, this winter I had a small (but painful) injury and I read that alcohol increases inflammation, which means that it slows the healing. So I decided instantly to stop until the injury healed. It was actually a really easy decision, and then I felt excited about how much time I was going to gain back in my life. Like, I wouldn't have to devote 5pm on to sitting around, drinking wine and watching TV. I stocked the fridge with low-sugar organic fruit sodas, and they are delicious.
Unlike Dry-anuary, I have experienced no real cravings, and it's been more than 1 month since I stopped drinking. My sleep has improved, I don't feel bloated, and I have way more energy. My skin looks better already. Stress levels are also lower, but I did make some other changes in my life that are helping with that too. I just feel more present and alive. I don't even feel nervous about going to social events (which are of course fewer due to COVID), I think it should be fine to just drink a soda.
I am halfway through The Naked Mind. I don't feel the need to make a pledge that I will never drink again, because I just have zero desire. Mostly, I'm annoyed that I fell for the conformity, social pressures, and marketing ploys that make people think drinking is positive. I'm a bit ashamed I didn't take the health risks seriously. Now, I'm happy to not be putting poison in my body every day. I'm happy to think for myself. I'm thrilled for all the time and energy I have freed up to do what I want to do.
I just wish I could share this feeling with others in my social circle, but I know that no one wants to hear it. It's obnoxious to be lectured by your friends. I certainly didn't want to hear it until I had the right motivation. So I just have to tell myself to lead by example and if anyone is ever really interested, they can ask.
This is so similar to my story, and it's true, you cannot in our society preach sobriety, people DO NOT want to hear it. Goodness knows I didn't want to when I was drinking.
I had a lot more instances of puking though. I have an extremely sensitive system, so if I drank more than 5 or 6 drinks at a party, if I mixed any drinks at all, like from red to white wine, or even mixing red wine types, or god forbid I drank Italian wine, I would be up all night puking, it happened pretty reliably once a year after an annual Christmas party our friends host. Hard liquor was basically out of the question.
I stupidly thought "this is great, my body forces me to naturally moderate." I find that thinking so embarrassing now. My body was clearly being poisoned, it clearly HATED alcohol. I can't believe we live in a society where violent illness is seen as just a funny, laughable side effect of having too much "fun" on rare occasions.
So fucking gross. The idea of it horrifies me now.
Most of my close friends either stopped drinking or dramatically cut back after I quit. I had such a dramatic response in how good my skin looked, that almost all of them were inspired to give it a go because we're all a bunch of vain bitches, lol. That said, I'm also the pace-horse in my social world, so when I went from being an AVID wine lover to stone sober and seemed really happy with the change, people paid attention.
Sobriety is a lot like FIRE, it's a kind of counter-cultural cool if you lean into it. I've always been about the counter-culture, and doing things my own, very distinctive way. For me, drinking is the new smoking, it's just not cool anymore.
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Hey, I wanted to thank everyone who shared their story on this thread. It really helped me! I wanted to share my story too.
I came across this thread during Dry-anuary (which was, by the way, a failure). Like some others I was a 1-2 glasses of wine per day person, which increased during times of stress, especially last year with COVID and work. But I didn't have any motivation to change because I didn't see any effects on my health, relationships, job, etc. There was some financial cost, but my income and savings was high enough that it didn't seem to matter. Plus my social circle has traditionally been around oriented around eating and drinking. No binges, no blackouts, no throwing up, not even staying up past 11pm -- but certainly a big part of the social experience.
The only thing was that I had set some fitness goals, and I knew that I could be a better athlete without alcohol. So I had stopped drinking the nights before a challenging workout. Then, this winter I had a small (but painful) injury and I read that alcohol increases inflammation, which means that it slows the healing. So I decided instantly to stop until the injury healed. It was actually a really easy decision, and then I felt excited about how much time I was going to gain back in my life. Like, I wouldn't have to devote 5pm on to sitting around, drinking wine and watching TV. I stocked the fridge with low-sugar organic fruit sodas, and they are delicious.
Unlike Dry-anuary, I have experienced no real cravings, and it's been more than 1 month since I stopped drinking. My sleep has improved, I don't feel bloated, and I have way more energy. My skin looks better already. Stress levels are also lower, but I did make some other changes in my life that are helping with that too. I just feel more present and alive. I don't even feel nervous about going to social events (which are of course fewer due to COVID), I think it should be fine to just drink a soda.
I am halfway through The Naked Mind. I don't feel the need to make a pledge that I will never drink again, because I just have zero desire. Mostly, I'm annoyed that I fell for the conformity, social pressures, and marketing ploys that make people think drinking is positive. I'm a bit ashamed I didn't take the health risks seriously. Now, I'm happy to not be putting poison in my body every day. I'm happy to think for myself. I'm thrilled for all the time and energy I have freed up to do what I want to do.
I just wish I could share this feeling with others in my social circle, but I know that no one wants to hear it. It's obnoxious to be lectured by your friends. I certainly didn't want to hear it until I had the right motivation. So I just have to tell myself to lead by example and if anyone is ever really interested, they can ask.
SO similar to my story. It's weird; in some ways I wish I'd seen ANY obvious negative consequences from drinking...maybe I would have quit 10 years earlier. The negative consequences were so subtle that I didn't register them until I quit. Now they seem HUGE, but they sure were not obvious while I was drinking.
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Hey, I wanted to thank everyone who shared their story on this thread. It really helped me! I wanted to share my story too.
I came across this thread during Dry-anuary (which was, by the way, a failure). Like some others I was a 1-2 glasses of wine per day person, which increased during times of stress, especially last year with COVID and work. But I didn't have any motivation to change because I didn't see any effects on my health, relationships, job, etc. There was some financial cost, but my income and savings was high enough that it didn't seem to matter. Plus my social circle has traditionally been around oriented around eating and drinking. No binges, no blackouts, no throwing up, not even staying up past 11pm -- but certainly a big part of the social experience.
The only thing was that I had set some fitness goals, and I knew that I could be a better athlete without alcohol. So I had stopped drinking the nights before a challenging workout. Then, this winter I had a small (but painful) injury and I read that alcohol increases inflammation, which means that it slows the healing. So I decided instantly to stop until the injury healed. It was actually a really easy decision, and then I felt excited about how much time I was going to gain back in my life. Like, I wouldn't have to devote 5pm on to sitting around, drinking wine and watching TV. I stocked the fridge with low-sugar organic fruit sodas, and they are delicious.
Unlike Dry-anuary, I have experienced no real cravings, and it's been more than 1 month since I stopped drinking. My sleep has improved, I don't feel bloated, and I have way more energy. My skin looks better already. Stress levels are also lower, but I did make some other changes in my life that are helping with that too. I just feel more present and alive. I don't even feel nervous about going to social events (which are of course fewer due to COVID), I think it should be fine to just drink a soda.
I am halfway through The Naked Mind. I don't feel the need to make a pledge that I will never drink again, because I just have zero desire. Mostly, I'm annoyed that I fell for the conformity, social pressures, and marketing ploys that make people think drinking is positive. I'm a bit ashamed I didn't take the health risks seriously. Now, I'm happy to not be putting poison in my body every day. I'm happy to think for myself. I'm thrilled for all the time and energy I have freed up to do what I want to do.
I just wish I could share this feeling with others in my social circle, but I know that no one wants to hear it. It's obnoxious to be lectured by your friends. I certainly didn't want to hear it until I had the right motivation. So I just have to tell myself to lead by example and if anyone is ever really interested, they can ask.
SO similar to my story. It's weird; in some ways I wish I'd seen ANY obvious negative consequences from drinking...maybe I would have quit 10 years earlier. The negative consequences were so subtle that I didn't register them until I quit. Now they seem HUGE, but they sure were not obvious while I was drinking.
Also similar to my story. I am not sure of the extent no alcohol plays in my recovery from deep grief leading to PTSD symptoms, menopause and coping with a difficult mother but man I in a much better place.
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2 days before Christmas I found out my husband had been treated for 2 STD’s. If I had still been drinking I probably would have drank more and not taken action. Instead I spent
2 days examining what I wanted and had to face the fact that once my relationship was wonderful but that it should have ended 10 years ago. Since I have dealt with getting the house ready to sell, finding a condo to buy and disposing of all the junk he accumulated in the garage, shed, office, etc. I am physically and emotionally exhausted but handling everything that needs to get done despite being 66. I never could have done all this if I was drinking.
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2 days before Christmas I found out my husband had been treated for 2 STD’s. If I had still been drinking I probably would have drank more and not taken action. Instead I spent
2 days examining what I wanted and had to face the fact that once my relationship was wonderful but that it should have ended 10 years ago. Since I have dealt with getting the house ready to sell, finding a condo to buy and disposing of all the junk he accumulated in the garage, shed, office, etc. I am physically and emotionally exhausted but handling everything that needs to get done despite being 66. I never could have done all this if I was drinking.
Well, shit. :hugs: I'm really glad you are in a better emotional state to deal with this than you otherwise would have been.
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Thanks WS. It has been tough but I will get through it versus ignoring it. On the plus side I have dropped a total of 50lbs and feel so much better. I lost the first 12 from not drinking and then got serious about it because of Covid.
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2 days before Christmas I found out my husband had been treated for 2 STD’s. If I had still been drinking I probably would have drank more and not taken action. Instead I spent
2 days examining what I wanted and had to face the fact that once my relationship was wonderful but that it should have ended 10 years ago. Since I have dealt with getting the house ready to sell, finding a condo to buy and disposing of all the junk he accumulated in the garage, shed, office, etc. I am physically and emotionally exhausted but handling everything that needs to get done despite being 66. I never could have done all this if I was drinking.
Aw Cassie - I'm so sorry! You are such a lovely and supportive person on these boards and I send you internet hugs and much appreciation for being you!
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Thanks Starbright I really appreciate your kindness.
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2 days before Christmas I found out my husband had been treated for 2 STD’s. If I had still been drinking I probably would have drank more and not taken action. Instead I spent
2 days examining what I wanted and had to face the fact that once my relationship was wonderful but that it should have ended 10 years ago. Since I have dealt with getting the house ready to sell, finding a condo to buy and disposing of all the junk he accumulated in the garage, shed, office, etc. I am physically and emotionally exhausted but handling everything that needs to get done despite being 66. I never could have done all this if I was drinking.
Ugh, what a fucking horror show.
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Today I asked the teen next door to empty the partial dirt basement and I would pay him 150. Last week I paid him to empty the shed. It’s much easier to deal with the stuff when it’s outside. With the help of 2 friends I sold 2 patios of stuff and made 500. Plus was rid of the stuff. I told him today that a week from now if he doesn’t make significant progress I am hiring day laborers to throw it all away. I am using his money to hire people. I filled a huge trailer myself with junk in 2 days. It went to the dump today. I also packed all of his inside crap. I told him he must sort faster. I have never had to work so hard to get rid of someone. My youngest son will be here on the 14th to remodel my condo. He said he would have come sooner if he had realized that my stepson wasn’t going to help. We all expected him to because his dad has been helping him remodel his house for months. We have custody of him since he was 13 at his request. Him and I were close and I am shocked how selfish he is being.
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Today I asked the teen next door to empty the partial dirt basement and I would pay him 150. Last week I paid him to empty the shed. It’s much easier to deal with the stuff when it’s outside. With the help of 2 friends I sold 2 patios of stuff and made 500. Plus was rid of the stuff. I told him today that a week from now if he doesn’t make significant progress I am hiring day laborers to throw it all away. I am using his money to hire people. I filled a huge trailer myself with junk in 2 days. It went to the dump today. I also packed all of his inside crap. I told him he must sort faster. I have never had to work so hard to get rid of someone. My youngest son will be here on the 14th to remodel my condo. He said he would have come sooner if he had realized that my stepson wasn’t going to help. We all expected him to because his dad has been helping him remodel his house for months. We have custody of him since he was 13 at his request. Him and I were close and I am shocked how selfish he is being.
Jeez @Cassie this sounds bloody dreadful. I hope you get through it all sooner rather than later.
In other news, I am almost three months sober, longest I've ever gone since around 15 years old.
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Stubblestache, that’s really great!! I didn’t start drinking until I was 50 and it was a big mistake. Before I drank people frequently thought I was 15 years younger than I am. Drinking definitely didn’t do me any favors in any regard. It’s been 8 months for me.
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Cassie, I'm so sorry for the shit sandwich you've been handed. Good for you for taking control of the situation.
If you think any of the stuff has any value, you can call an estate sale company to come in. They'll pack and remove everything (or just what you ask them to remove), sell it and then send you part of the profits. We did this with part of my MIL's estate and it was a real labour saver. Habitat for Humanity took most of the furniture and sent us a donation receipt for the value of the stuff they took. Best part was that 2 strong guys with a moving truck showed up and just made all the big, ugly pieces of furniture disappear.
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I have already sold anything of value. Now we are in the throwing away stage. I have moved 30 times in my life plus have handled friend’s estate sales so unfortunately know how to do this. This is the last time. My 2 little doggies and I intend to live a peaceful, clutter free life in the condo I just bought.
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2 days before Christmas I found out my husband had been treated for 2 STD’s. If I had still been drinking I probably would have drank more and not taken action. Instead I spent
2 days examining what I wanted and had to face the fact that once my relationship was wonderful but that it should have ended 10 years ago. Since I have dealt with getting the house ready to sell, finding a condo to buy and disposing of all the junk he accumulated in the garage, shed, office, etc. I am physically and emotionally exhausted but handling everything that needs to get done despite being 66. I never could have done all this if I was drinking.
Thank you for sharing this @Cassie I didn't drink tonight because I remembered reading it earlier.
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Hugs to Cassie, and also to any others facing a difficult situation. It is so true -- we are so much better prepared to deal with the challenges that inevitably come our way without alcohol. I can't believe this is now my perspective, given that it is the exact opposite of what I have thought my entire adult life. But I am so grateful to know this now and for the future.
And congrats to Stubblestache for hitting a milestone, and Morning Glory for making good decisions. So many positive things happening in this thread. I'm sure in all these stories everyone can find the motivation that speaks to them. Thanks everyone for the kind and encouraging words.
Also Malcat some of your comments about vanity really made me laugh. I have not really cared about my looks since I was a teenager, but I can't stop looking in the mirror right now. I'm like, heeeeeey!
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Something else I noticed when I was drinking is that I could be very judgmental and mean regarding people’s posts which is very out of character for me. I was a social worker and have always helped friend’s, etc. Alcohol was changing me for the worse. I am now getting back to my true self. Plus my skin is no longer red:))
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Something else I noticed when I was drinking is that I could be very judgmental and mean regarding people’s posts which is very out of character for me. I was a social worker and have always helped friend’s, etc. Alcohol was changing me for the worse. I am now getting back to my true self. Plus my skin is no longer red:))
Oh yeah, I'm a tremendously non judgemental person...except when I drank.
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Just posting to say "hey" -- somehow, I've never seen this thread before. I've been booze free for over 14 years -- it'll be 15 in a couple of weeks if I don't do anything crazy. It's great to see the support on this thread!
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I did my taxes today and had to pay a not entirely unexpected huge bill plus a fine for an error that I made last year. It was an unpleasant reminder of how bad my cognitive impairment gets when I'm stressed. This is the first day since quitting drinking 3 months ago that it feels odd not to be washing the stress away with a bottle of wine. I don't miss the wine so much as the mental off-switch. I'm even on a low-carb diet to help address a mold allergy, so I can't even fall back on carbs. I'll make it, but today's a tough day.
On the plus side, the mold remediation guy came by today and said that I had already fixed the problem, so that's nice.
Whenever I think I miss the mental "off switch", I remind myself that it never actually switched anything off, it just made feeling awful feel more acceptable.
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I don’t miss feeling tired and zoned out.
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This thread is making me think my case of beer every couple days is a lot.
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Stubblestache, that’s really great!! I didn’t start drinking until I was 50 and it was a big mistake. Before I drank people frequently thought I was 15 years younger than I am. Drinking definitely didn’t do me any favors in any regard. It’s been 8 months for me.
Thank you. In lots of ways, I'm very glad I found drink so early when people (and my body) were much more forgiving of my screw ups. If I started drinking as a proper adult now, and got the taste for it I did when I was young, I have no doubt at all that I would completely destroy my life and be pretty unstoppable in doing so. So, bloody well done to you for recognising it and getting on top of it!
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This thread is making me think my case of beer every couple days is a lot.
For me, it's about the reasons behind drinking rather than any absolute amount. I've known people who drank every week night at work functions for years, and then had absolutely no problem stopping for a long period or even for good in some cases.
I've always drunk to escape myself, even when i was drinking during good times and celebrations, so even if I was just to drink only one beer a week, it would be with the intent of getting out of my own brain. The number of times I've chugged that first beer in a few gulps just to get the effect as quickly as possible so I can then actually 'enjoy' the remaining beers are countless.
Because of that, I've long needed to cut it out. So, I guess ask yourself whether that case of beer is used to help you hide from problems in your life, a current situation or dealing with past traumas. If you are using it in that way, then yeah, it probably is a lot.
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Just putting this out there in case it's helpful to anyone.
When I first got sober (age 29), I found the support and structure of a 12 step program extremely helpful. Much like this forum, having a group of people who I could be honest with who had a lot of the same experiences (at least in terms of how they felt about things, if not in the details) was very helpful. I went in as an athiest, and while I wouldn't use that word the same way today, I still don't really believe in god in any conventional sense. I say that because the fact that I didn't believe in god kept me out of AA for two years, because I was so sure it wouldn't work for me. Turns out, as long as I was willing to be open to the idea that I didn't know everything, and take suggestions from someone who had drank like I drank and was now living not only sober but happily (for the most part), it worked.
After 6 or 7 years, though, I started to get a little antsy. While neither were crippling, I was struggling with anxiety and depression, despite everything on the outside being good (house, job, married, etc.). Around that time, my wife and I joined a Buddhist community. I was still pretty anti-religion and was skeptical, but as a non-12-stepper, she wanted a shared spiritual vocabulary for our family as we were starting to think about having a kid. Meditation has really helped. For the past 8 years or so, I've gotten increasingly into it. I've done a number of courses and retreats and have found a lot of benefit from it. As is said -- alcohol is but a symptom. I drank because I didn't like the way I felt. And when I stopped drinking, I used other things (healthier things, but still) to make bad feelings go away. Meditation showed me another way -- a way of acceptance and understanding, of looking into the real nature of things (including thoughts and feelings) in a way that provides real serenity. It has also made it much easier for me to see when I start going down some thought rabbit hole that is going to lead me some place lousy.
So if you've never tried it, give it a shot. I find it easier to do with a group. Specifically around recovery, there's a group called Meditation in Recovery that I sometimes join.
Here's one: https://www.floridamindfulness.org/page-1861285
And here's another: https://www.sfzc.org/practice-centers/city-center/zen-meditation-practice-city-center/practice-groups-city-center/meditation-in-recovery
There's also Recovery Dharma and there are 11th step meetings (aka meditation meetings) in many places.
Oh, and just to be clear, I don't mean to imply that I "graduated" from 12 step recovery. I recently moved to Canada, and I joined a homegroup up here. It continues to be a great way to make sure my head remains mostly straight, and also provides an opportunity to try to help other folks.
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This thread is making me think my case of beer every couple days is a lot.
For me, it's about the reasons behind drinking rather than any absolute amount. I've known people who drank every week night at work functions for years, and then had absolutely no problem stopping for a long period or even for good in some cases.
I've always drunk to escape myself, even when i was drinking during good times and celebrations, so even if I was just to drink only one week, it would be with the intent of getting out of my own brain. The number of times I've chugged that first beer in a few gulps just to get the effect as quickly as possible so I can then actually 'enjoy' the remaining beers are countless.
Because of that, I've long needed to cut it out. So, I guess ask yourself whether that case of beer is used to help you hide from problems in your life, a current situation or dealing with past traumas. If you are using it in that way, then yeah, it probably is a lot.
Funny, thanks to all of the reading I've done, I've become very skeptical of anyone who claims to not have an issue with alcohol, but who takes long breaks from it. If the person feels the need to take long breaks from it, then it's probably because they feel like they are developing/have developed a drinking problem. Few brains can be exposed to alcohol nightly and not develop dependence. Ethanol is a highly addictive drug, enough exposure will create addiction.
Self medicating is definitely a sure fire sign of addiction, but it's not the only path to it.
The question though is if the person is managing their low level addiction well. So if someone is drinking socially every day after work, but managing to not let it progress further, either through having strict drinking limits or taking regular long breaks, then that's great that they are managing low level addiction, but they're still addicted and very vulnerable to it getting worse in times of extreme stress.
It's not that I don't think that people can drink responsibly, obviously they can. It's the same way that I know occasional cocaine users who have never used it more than once a month. Respecting the highly addictive nature of the substance is key. Where people get into trouble is deluding ourselves that for some irrational reason that defies science, that we're not getting addicted to an addictive substances through "moderate" levels of use.
@Billy B. Good, a case of beer every few days does sound like a lot of alcohol to be consuming regularly if what you are trying to avoid is addiction and damage to your system. Is it a lot compared to other regular drinkers, I don't know, depends on whether it's a 6 pack or a 24, and what "every few days" means, but it sounds like drinking pretty much daily, and that is enough for addiction, and likely enough to be beyond the "safe" limits for avoiding damage to your body.
Now, does that mean you should freak out and quit? Not at all.
A lot of people live perfectly functional lives being addicted to things. A lot of prescription medications are addictive. However, just like addictive prescriptions, you have to be cautious and realistic about the daily consumption of addictive substances. You have to be vigilant.
So it really comes down to your willingness to be voluntarily addicted to something. If you are okay with whatever level of addiction your consumption produces, and you're able to be vigilant and conscientious about how that might manifest under times of increased stress, and you're okay with the degree of damage it has on your body, then that's fine. It's your body, your mind, and only you can know what you are willing to tolerate.
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Saturday will make the one year anniversary of the death of a dear friend. We had many boozy meals with her over the years. She was a home economist and her career was in recipe development and testing. She was really into wine and other beverages. Now, in hindsight, I think she was a functional alcoholic. I am thinking about how we honour the anniversary in a way that is respectful to memory and my new reality as a person who doesn't enjoy alcohol anymore.
What is astonishing to me is how much there is for me to unpack. But I am also feeling in such a good place that I have the capacity to contemplate unpacking it.
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Funny, thanks to all of the reading I've done, I've become very skeptical of anyone who claims to not have an issue with alcohol, but who takes long breaks from it. If the person feels the need to take long breaks from it, then it's probably because they feel like they are developing/have developed a drinking problem.
That jibes with my experience as well -- "normal" folks (meaning non-addicts) don't tend to think about controlling their drinking. They just do it. My wife is like that. A few weekends ago she went to an online baby shower and had a glass of wine (opening a bottle that she'd been given for Christmas by a neighbor). To me, if I had a glass of wine at 2 PM, it would be an absolute test of willpower (one that I would almost certainly fail) to NOT continue drinking for the rest of the day. My wife, on the other hand, had a glass and put the rest of the bottle in the fridge without a second thought. It took her a few weeks to finish that bottle. Can not relate. :)
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Flbiker, both my mom and my last 2 ex husband’s were like your wife. Those are people with zero problems with alcohol.
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This thread is making me think my case of beer every couple days is a lot.
For me, it's about the reasons behind drinking rather than any absolute amount. I've known people who drank every week night at work functions for years, and then had absolutely no problem stopping for a long period or even for good in some cases.
I've always drunk to escape myself, even when i was drinking during good times and celebrations, so even if I was just to drink only one beer a week, it would be with the intent of getting out of my own brain. The number of times I've chugged that first beer in a few gulps just to get the effect as quickly as possible so I can then actually 'enjoy' the remaining beers are countless.
Because of that, I've long needed to cut it out. So, I guess ask yourself whether that case of beer is used to help you hide from problems in your life, a current situation or dealing with past traumas. If you are using it in that way, then yeah, it probably is a lot.
Thank you for the thoughtful response. I think the main word that comes to mind as relates to my drinking is "boredom." I spend a significant amount of time feeling bored out of my skull. Probably need to figure that out.
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This thread is making me think my case of beer every couple days is a lot.
For me, it's about the reasons behind drinking rather than any absolute amount. I've known people who drank every week night at work functions for years, and then had absolutely no problem stopping for a long period or even for good in some cases.
I've always drunk to escape myself, even when i was drinking during good times and celebrations, so even if I was just to drink only one beer a week, it would be with the intent of getting out of my own brain. The number of times I've chugged that first beer in a few gulps just to get the effect as quickly as possible so I can then actually 'enjoy' the remaining beers are countless.
Because of that, I've long needed to cut it out. So, I guess ask yourself whether that case of beer is used to help you hide from problems in your life, a current situation or dealing with past traumas. If you are using it in that way, then yeah, it probably is a lot.
Thank you for the thoughtful response. I think the main word that comes to mind as relates to my drinking is "boredom." I spend a significant amount of time feeling bored out of my skull. Probably need to figure that out.
I was also someone who could have one drink and then not have another for weeks. Rarely, I'd have 2 drinks in a day and could measure the last time I'd been drunk in decades. I never, ever considered myself someone who had a problem with alcohol. I quit drinking entirely as an experiment to see if it would help a health problem even though my cardiologist had said my level of consumption was too tiny to be a factor.
I was totally shocked to discover that I had in fact been drinking to numb difficult feelings. When suddenly I didn't have the pressure release valve of booze I had to actually feel my bad feelings and deal with them. Let me tell you that was an unpleasant discovery. However, cutting out booze also significantly helped my arrhythmia so I stuck with it and learned to process my feelings better. Even though my heart has now been surgically fixed I have no desire to ever drink again.
If you're really drinking 24 beers every few days, that's quite a lot. Even just looking at it from a physical health point of view you're putting yourself at significant risk of cancer and heart problems. Try cutting back and see how you feel. Treat it as an experiment and be open to exploring how it changes your life. If you're bored, try to replace drinking with a healthier activity.
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Yes I had to find something to do for the hours I spent drinking which started at 5pm. Now I read, knit while watching tv, talk on the phone to a friend, go somewhere, etc. I also drank out of boredom.
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This thread is making me think my case of beer every couple days is a lot.
For me, it's about the reasons behind drinking rather than any absolute amount. I've known people who drank every week night at work functions for years, and then had absolutely no problem stopping for a long period or even for good in some cases.
I've always drunk to escape myself, even when i was drinking during good times and celebrations, so even if I was just to drink only one beer a week, it would be with the intent of getting out of my own brain. The number of times I've chugged that first beer in a few gulps just to get the effect as quickly as possible so I can then actually 'enjoy' the remaining beers are countless.
Because of that, I've long needed to cut it out. So, I guess ask yourself whether that case of beer is used to help you hide from problems in your life, a current situation or dealing with past traumas. If you are using it in that way, then yeah, it probably is a lot.
Thank you for the thoughtful response. I think the main word that comes to mind as relates to my drinking is "boredom." I spend a significant amount of time feeling bored out of my skull. Probably need to figure that out.
I used to think I drank to relieve boredom, until I was honest with myself that after 20 minutes of starting to drink, I was still as bored as ever. I was just bored and drinking.
Drinking doesn't make you less bored, it just kills your motivation to do anything about it. Just as it doesn't lower your stress, it just makes you more comfortable with being stressed.
Alcohol doesn't improve anything about your state of mind, it just makes it much, much easier to stay miserable than to actually improve your life.
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I had an experience with cigarettes almost 6 years ago that made me give them up completely, cold turkey, and I have not had the least desire to smoke a cigarette since. I still like the smell of cigarettes wafting through the open air outside, but not even that triggers in me a desire to smoke cigarettes. I'm going to tell the story. It might be tedious to some, but I am going to tell it because I am looking for a similar experience that will eliminate my desire to drink alcohol.
For about 15 years I was a pack a day smoker. I was anti-smoking until I started going with a girl who smoked. Little by little I started taking up her smoking habit. No coincidence, I suppose, that we were drinking pals too. Long story short on that relationship, it didn't last. But I carried the smoking habit forward with me. Eventually I became a pack a day smoker, roughly, and if I went out drinking in the evening I could easily smoke another whole pack in one evening over beers.
Now, cigarettes are expensive in the USA. I don't know what they cost now, but at that time they were about $5 to $7 a pack where I lived. But then I conveniently moved to a place in South America where cigarettes cost less than $1 per pack. So my tightwad instincts, which were always needling me about the financial cost of the cigarette habit, were no longer activated as motivation to quit smoking.
About 6 years ago I was in the USA and visiting a friend for a few days. We were out drinking beer (of course), and when we got back to his house we sat outside on the pool deck to have another beer or two before retiring. As we were drinking and talking I lit up a cigarette just as naturally as you please, just as natural as the 10 or 12 others I had smoked in his presence throughout the evening. As the lighter went out and I blew out the first drag, my friend looked at me and said, "You know, Billy, you look absolutely ridiculous with that cigarette in your mouth. Do you know what a fool you like holding that thing, sticking it in your mouth and breathing the smoke?" I was stunned. I had, and still have, great respect, admiration and affection for this friend. We've been good friends since high school, college roommates, adult bosom buddies. And he had just made me feel as low as a worm.
I had heard all the anti-smoking stuff before and I knew all the downsides. I knew smoking was bad and I had quit for short spells over the years, even months at a time, but I always had an excuse to light up again. But this was the first time I had ever been told that my smoking made me look like a ridiculous fool. Maybe it was the insult to my vanity/appearance, but that remark cut me to the quick. In that same conversation my friend suggested that if I really was that addicted to the nicotine dose, then I should at least try vaping so I wouldn't be getting all the carbon monoxide and other nastiness of the cigarette smoke.
We carried on with our delightful visit. My friend, his lovely wife and their six kids (that house is a three-ring circus) all showed me a great time. And I even smoked a few more cigarettes over those next two days while a guest in their house. But that remark my friend made about me looking like a ridiculous fool with the cigarette in my mouth never left my thoughts. At the end of that visit I drove three hours to stay with my brother.
It just so happens there was a vape shop about three blocks from my brother's house. So I, still thinking about my friend's cutting remark, went to the vape shop to get a vaper and give it a try. I thought I would walk in, pick up a vape thingy (I knew nothing about it), and use that to replace my cigarettes. When I went in, though, it was like I was going in for a medical appointment, filling out forms on a clip board and everything. Then I consulted with the guy and he asked me about 40 questions - what do you smoke? what brand? how much? what time of day? do you burn them down to the filter? and on and on. I've had shorter consults with my proctologist. (Just kidding, I've never been to a proctologist. But you get my point.) At the end, about $25 later, I walked out with equipment and supplies to become a vaper and, hopefully, no longer a smoker of cigarettes.
So I went back to my brother's house and got my vaping gear set up. I thought, "This is great. I no longer have to go outside to get my nicotine dose because this is just odorless water vapor going into the air, not cigarette smoke, so I can do it right here while sitting at the dining room table. Much more convenient."
So I started vaping. And vaping. And vaping. And vaping some more. After about one day of this, and still continually thinking of my friend's cutting remark, I asked myself how ridiculous I must look as a nicotine addict tethered to this stupid little toy designed to inject fast-acting chemicals into my lungs so they can be immediately transmitted to my brain so that I can.....what?? Immediately want more? This is bullshit."
After entertaining that last thought for a long while I stuffed the nicotine injection toy and accoutrements into my travel bag and refused to inject any more nicotine into my system, be it from a vaping toy or cigarettes. Since that moment, on 5 September 2015, I have not had the least desire to smoke a cigarette, or vape.
They say vaping can help people stop smoking cigarettes. It certainly helped me, though not in the way the vape purveyors advertise. When it came time for me to pack up to go back to South America after my visit north, I found the vaping equipment, took it out of my bag, and tossed in the bathroom trash can. Looking back, that may be the best $25 I ever spent.
On September 5 every year I remind my friend that he was the inspiration for me to break a long-standing and highly addictive cigarette habit, and I thank him for caring enough about me to speak to me with such direct, unadorned truth. He takes no credit, of course, and just tells me he is glad I did it. "You'll live longer," he says. I hope so. Because since then I have gotten married and have two young kids of my own.
Now, I am looking for that wake up moment with regard to my consumption of alcohol. My life is great. My wife and kids are great. Career, money, etc., all great. I enjoy many blessings. But I drink too much beer. Lately I find myself wondering a lot about how much better, life could be without beer or any alcohol at all. Or if not better then maybe just different. What will I do with my time and energy if I am not drinking beer?
I am going to give it a 30-day try for the month of April. I'm glad I found this thread. And it makes me happy to see so many of you making strides toward your goals.
Month of April. Dry. Wish me luck!
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I had an experience with cigarettes almost 6 years ago that made me give them up completely, cold turkey, and I have not had the least desire to smoke a cigarette since. I still like the smell of cigarettes wafting through the open air outside, but not even that triggers in me a desire to smoke cigarettes. I'm going to tell the story. It might be tedious to some, but I am going to tell it because I am looking for a similar experience that will eliminate my desire to drink alcohol.
For about 15 years I was a pack a day smoker. I was anti-smoking until I started going with a girl who smoked. Little by little I started taking up her smoking habit. No coincidence, I suppose, that we were drinking pals too. Long story short on that relationship, it didn't last. But I carried the smoking habit forward with me. Eventually I became a pack a day smoker, roughly, and if I went out drinking in the evening I could easily smoke another whole pack in one evening over beers.
Now, cigarettes are expensive in the USA. I don't know what they cost now, but at that time they were about $5 to $7 a pack where I lived. But then I conveniently moved to a place in South America where cigarettes cost less than $1 per pack. So my tightwad instincts, which were always needling me about the financial cost of the cigarette habit, were no longer activated as motivation to quit smoking.
About 6 years ago I was in the USA and visiting a friend for a few days. We were out drinking beer (of course), and when we got back to his house we sat outside on the pool deck to have another beer or two before retiring. As we were drinking and talking I lit up a cigarette just as naturally as you please, just as natural as the 10 or 12 others I had smoked in his presence throughout the evening. As the lighter went out and I blew out the first drag, my friend looked at me and said, "You know, Billy, you look absolutely ridiculous with that cigarette in your mouth. Do you know what a fool you like holding that thing, sticking it in your mouth and breathing the smoke?" I was stunned. I had, and still have, great respect, admiration and affection for this friend. We've been good friends since high school, college roommates, adult bosom buddies. And he had just made me feel as low as a worm.
I had heard all the anti-smoking stuff before and I knew all the downsides. I knew smoking was bad and I had quit for short spells over the years, even months at a time, but I always had an excuse to light up again. But this was the first time I had ever been told that my smoking made me look like a ridiculous fool. Maybe it was the insult to my vanity/appearance, but that remark cut me to the quick. In that same conversation my friend suggested that if I really was that addicted to the nicotine dose, then I should at least try vaping so I wouldn't be getting all the carbon monoxide and other nastiness of the cigarette smoke.
We carried on with our delightful visit. My friend, his lovely wife and their six kids (that house is a three-ring circus) all showed me a great time. And I even smoked a few more cigarettes over those next two days while a guest in their house. But that remark my friend made about me looking like a ridiculous fool with the cigarette in my mouth never left my thoughts. At the end of that visit I drove three hours to stay with my brother.
It just so happens there was a vape shop about three blocks from my brother's house. So I, still thinking about my friend's cutting remark, went to the vape shop to get a vaper and give it a try. I thought I would walk in, pick up a vape thingy (I knew nothing about it), and use that to replace my cigarettes. When I went in, though, it was like I was going in for a medical appointment, filling out forms on a clip board and everything. Then I consulted with the guy and he asked me about 40 questions - what do you smoke? what brand? how much? what time of day? do you burn them down to the filter? and on and on. I've had shorter consults with my proctologist. (Just kidding, I've never been to a proctologist. But you get my point.) At the end, about $25 later, I walked out with equipment and supplies to become a vaper and, hopefully, no longer a smoker of cigarettes.
So I went back to my brother's house and got my vaping gear set up. I thought, "This is great. I no longer have to go outside to get my nicotine dose because this is just odorless water vapor going into the air, not cigarette smoke, so I can do it right here while sitting at the dining room table. Much more convenient."
So I started vaping. And vaping. And vaping. And vaping some more. After about one day of this, and still continually thinking of my friend's cutting remark, I asked myself how ridiculous I must look as a nicotine addict tethered to this stupid little toy designed to inject fast-acting chemicals into my lungs so they can be immediately transmitted to my brain so that I can.....what?? Immediately want more? This is bullshit."
After entertaining that last thought for a long while I stuffed the nicotine injection toy and accoutrements into my travel bag and refused to inject any more nicotine into my system, be it from a vaping toy or cigarettes. Since that moment, on 5 September 2015, I have not had the least desire to smoke a cigarette, or vape.
They say vaping can help people stop smoking cigarettes. It certainly helped me, though not in the way the vape purveyors advertise. When it came time for me to pack up to go back to South America after my visit north, I found the vaping equipment, took it out of my bag, and tossed in the bathroom trash can. Looking back, that may be the best $25 I ever spent.
On September 5 every year I remind my friend that he was the inspiration for me to break a long-standing and highly addictive cigarette habit, and I thank him for caring enough about me to speak to me with such direct, unadorned truth. He takes no credit, of course, and just tells me he is glad I did it. "You'll live longer," he says. I hope so. Because since then I have gotten married and have two young kids of my own.
Now, I am looking for that wake up moment with regard to my consumption of alcohol. My life is great. My wife and kids are great. Career, money, etc., all great. I enjoy many blessings. But I drink too much beer. Lately I find myself wondering a lot about how much better, life could be without beer or any alcohol at all. Or if not better then maybe just different. What will I do with my time and energy if I am not drinking beer?
I am going to give it a 30-day try for the month of April. I'm glad I found this thread. And it makes me happy to see so many of you making strides toward your goals.
Month of April. Dry. Wish me luck!
So exciting! Best of luck to you.
(One thing I kept reminding myself...Wenchsenior, you already know how the drink you look forward to every evening makes you feel. You've known that same feeling every night for decades. Aren't you curious about how NOT drinking for a month or two would feel? It helped.)
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Thank you, @wenchsenior. I will be putting your helpful suggestion in the quiver of thought arrows.
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I had an experience with cigarettes almost 6 years ago that made me give them up completely, cold turkey, and I have not had the least desire to smoke a cigarette since. I still like the smell of cigarettes wafting through the open air outside, but not even that triggers in me a desire to smoke cigarettes. I'm going to tell the story. It might be tedious to some, but I am going to tell it because I am looking for a similar experience that will eliminate my desire to drink alcohol.
For about 15 years I was a pack a day smoker. I was anti-smoking until I started going with a girl who smoked. Little by little I started taking up her smoking habit. No coincidence, I suppose, that we were drinking pals too. Long story short on that relationship, it didn't last. But I carried the smoking habit forward with me. Eventually I became a pack a day smoker, roughly, and if I went out drinking in the evening I could easily smoke another whole pack in one evening over beers.
Now, cigarettes are expensive in the USA. I don't know what they cost now, but at that time they were about $5 to $7 a pack where I lived. But then I conveniently moved to a place in South America where cigarettes cost less than $1 per pack. So my tightwad instincts, which were always needling me about the financial cost of the cigarette habit, were no longer activated as motivation to quit smoking.
About 6 years ago I was in the USA and visiting a friend for a few days. We were out drinking beer (of course), and when we got back to his house we sat outside on the pool deck to have another beer or two before retiring. As we were drinking and talking I lit up a cigarette just as naturally as you please, just as natural as the 10 or 12 others I had smoked in his presence throughout the evening. As the lighter went out and I blew out the first drag, my friend looked at me and said, "You know, Billy, you look absolutely ridiculous with that cigarette in your mouth. Do you know what a fool you like holding that thing, sticking it in your mouth and breathing the smoke?" I was stunned. I had, and still have, great respect, admiration and affection for this friend. We've been good friends since high school, college roommates, adult bosom buddies. And he had just made me feel as low as a worm.
I had heard all the anti-smoking stuff before and I knew all the downsides. I knew smoking was bad and I had quit for short spells over the years, even months at a time, but I always had an excuse to light up again. But this was the first time I had ever been told that my smoking made me look like a ridiculous fool. Maybe it was the insult to my vanity/appearance, but that remark cut me to the quick. In that same conversation my friend suggested that if I really was that addicted to the nicotine dose, then I should at least try vaping so I wouldn't be getting all the carbon monoxide and other nastiness of the cigarette smoke.
We carried on with our delightful visit. My friend, his lovely wife and their six kids (that house is a three-ring circus) all showed me a great time. And I even smoked a few more cigarettes over those next two days while a guest in their house. But that remark my friend made about me looking like a ridiculous fool with the cigarette in my mouth never left my thoughts. At the end of that visit I drove three hours to stay with my brother.
It just so happens there was a vape shop about three blocks from my brother's house. So I, still thinking about my friend's cutting remark, went to the vape shop to get a vaper and give it a try. I thought I would walk in, pick up a vape thingy (I knew nothing about it), and use that to replace my cigarettes. When I went in, though, it was like I was going in for a medical appointment, filling out forms on a clip board and everything. Then I consulted with the guy and he asked me about 40 questions - what do you smoke? what brand? how much? what time of day? do you burn them down to the filter? and on and on. I've had shorter consults with my proctologist. (Just kidding, I've never been to a proctologist. But you get my point.) At the end, about $25 later, I walked out with equipment and supplies to become a vaper and, hopefully, no longer a smoker of cigarettes.
So I went back to my brother's house and got my vaping gear set up. I thought, "This is great. I no longer have to go outside to get my nicotine dose because this is just odorless water vapor going into the air, not cigarette smoke, so I can do it right here while sitting at the dining room table. Much more convenient."
So I started vaping. And vaping. And vaping. And vaping some more. After about one day of this, and still continually thinking of my friend's cutting remark, I asked myself how ridiculous I must look as a nicotine addict tethered to this stupid little toy designed to inject fast-acting chemicals into my lungs so they can be immediately transmitted to my brain so that I can.....what?? Immediately want more? This is bullshit."
After entertaining that last thought for a long while I stuffed the nicotine injection toy and accoutrements into my travel bag and refused to inject any more nicotine into my system, be it from a vaping toy or cigarettes. Since that moment, on 5 September 2015, I have not had the least desire to smoke a cigarette, or vape.
They say vaping can help people stop smoking cigarettes. It certainly helped me, though not in the way the vape purveyors advertise. When it came time for me to pack up to go back to South America after my visit north, I found the vaping equipment, took it out of my bag, and tossed in the bathroom trash can. Looking back, that may be the best $25 I ever spent.
On September 5 every year I remind my friend that he was the inspiration for me to break a long-standing and highly addictive cigarette habit, and I thank him for caring enough about me to speak to me with such direct, unadorned truth. He takes no credit, of course, and just tells me he is glad I did it. "You'll live longer," he says. I hope so. Because since then I have gotten married and have two young kids of my own.
Now, I am looking for that wake up moment with regard to my consumption of alcohol. My life is great. My wife and kids are great. Career, money, etc., all great. I enjoy many blessings. But I drink too much beer. Lately I find myself wondering a lot about how much better, life could be without beer or any alcohol at all. Or if not better then maybe just different. What will I do with my time and energy if I am not drinking beer?
I am going to give it a 30-day try for the month of April. I'm glad I found this thread. And it makes me happy to see so many of you making strides toward your goals.
Month of April. Dry. Wish me luck!
I have a sobriety app where I log in every day that I didn't drink, and it always prompts my reasons for not drinking.
I had the advantage of not being able to drink for 6 months for medical reasons, so all of my listed reasons were developed after the a-ha realizations, but I get a kick out of the last one on the list:
"Drinking is what boring people do to imitate being cool"
I spend some time with middle aged suburban parents who get together, drink too much, and complain about being overweight and feeling like shit all the time, and talk endlessly about how cool they were in grad school. This has now become my iconic symbol of what a drinker looks like.
Also, have you spent much sober time around drunk people?
Tacky As Fuck.
There's just nothing cool about it.
ETA: this is all said by someone who used to think drinking wine was the height of cool
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@Billybegood
Did you sign up for the free 30 day alcohol experiemnt? google annie grace alcohol experiment you get daily emails that inspire
help me in the first 30 days now I am over 1.5 years.
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I had an experience with cigarettes almost 6 years ago that made me give them up completely, cold turkey, and I have not had the least desire to smoke a cigarette since. I still like the smell of cigarettes wafting through the open air outside, but not even that triggers in me a desire to smoke cigarettes. I'm going to tell the story. It might be tedious to some, but I am going to tell it because I am looking for a similar experience that will eliminate my desire to drink alcohol.
<snip>
Now, I am looking for that wake up moment with regard to my consumption of alcohol. My life is great. My wife and kids are great. Career, money, etc., all great. I enjoy many blessings. But I drink too much beer. Lately I find myself wondering a lot about how much better, life could be without beer or any alcohol at all.
Well, here's an...awkward...one.
You know how babies get diaper rash really badly when they're teething? It's because they're generating so much saliva and it's going right through their system and when it gets to the other end the enzymes irritate the skin (maybe it would be more accurate to say that they try to digest the skin).
Well, thanks to stopping drinking for a while after a long period of regular consumption, I discovered something similar. Yep, butt itch while drinking, gone when not drinking. Presumably it has something to do with either the alcohol itself being irritating or what it does to the digestive system. Oddly enough, I've never seen this effect mentioned anywhere, so there are a few possibilities:
1. It's just me.
2. Everybody already knows this and it goes without saying.
3. Nobody wanted to "go there."
4. It's real but not enough people noticed.
At any rate, I've found this effect to be highly uncool and an additional motivation to quit.
I hope this doesn't make it awkward at future meet-ups.
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I had an experience with cigarettes almost 6 years ago that made me give them up completely, cold turkey, and I have not had the least desire to smoke a cigarette since. I still like the smell of cigarettes wafting through the open air outside, but not even that triggers in me a desire to smoke cigarettes. I'm going to tell the story. It might be tedious to some, but I am going to tell it because I am looking for a similar experience that will eliminate my desire to drink alcohol.
<snip>
Now, I am looking for that wake up moment with regard to my consumption of alcohol. My life is great. My wife and kids are great. Career, money, etc., all great. I enjoy many blessings. But I drink too much beer. Lately I find myself wondering a lot about how much better, life could be without beer or any alcohol at all.
Well, here's an...awkward...one.
You know how babies get diaper rash really badly when they're teething? It's because they're generating so much saliva and it's going right through their system and when it gets to the other end the enzymes irritate the skin (maybe it would be more accurate to say that they try to digest the skin).
Well, thanks to stopping drinking for a while after a long period of regular consumption, I discovered something similar. Yep, butt itch while drinking, gone when not drinking. Presumably it has something to do with either the alcohol itself being irritating or what it does to the digestive system. Oddly enough, I've never seen this effect mentioned anywhere, so there are a few possibilities:
1. It's just me.
2. Everybody already knows this and it goes without saying.
3. Nobody wanted to "go there."
4. It's real but not enough people noticed.
At any rate, I've found this effect to be highly uncool and an additional motivation to quit.
I hope this doesn't make it awkward at future meet-ups.
I initially just assumed that this was because alcohol causes general skin itchiness, but no, evidently this is a thing, especially with beer and wine because they acidify your poop, which causes a lot of tissue irritation.
Chronic itchy butt-hole is DEFINITELY not cool.
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Thank you, @wenchsenior. I will be putting your helpful suggestion in the quiver of thought arrows.
If you want to try the 30 day Experiment, the link on the left ('returning users') will get you signed up. I found it incredibly helpful (at the old site, and the experiment material seems to be actually updated/better on the new site, up to day 15 which is all I've looked at).
https://learn.thisnakedmind.com/the-alcohol-experiment-registration
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@Billy B. Good I had the paradigm shift for drinking but it wasn't a friend who told me I was being uncool, it was more my own brain flicking me on the forehead and saying "aren't you tired of this? Aren't there other, more interesting, things you could be doing instead?" and I was done. I've written about my experience with Naltrexone upthread - got a script, took it twice, let me realise that booze tastes terrible but also freed me from the itch for the next sip.
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I hope this doesn't make it awkward at future meet-ups.
So I shouldn't bring it up next time we hang out? ;-) Don't worry, I don't want to talk about your butt either.
On a more serious note, modelling healthy behaviours for your kids is an excellent reason to quit.
My kids were about 8 and 10 when I first gave up booze entirely. We don't have many alcoholics in the family and my parents certainly weren't among them. Instead I grew up in a a part of Canada that's has a serious wine industry. So my teen years were a bit more like in a European family. Wine was often served with dinner and from about my mid-teens I was permitted to have half a glass with dinner. It was treated as no big deal and by the time I was 16 I knew which types of wine, from which wineries, I preferred and which ones I didn't care for. Being drunk was strictly frowned on though. By the time I was legally allowed to drink, I frankly had no interest and thought drunkeness was foolish. This put me seriously out of step with my peers who seemed to have a problem with binge drinking.
So when it came to raising my own kids, I figured the way I'd been raised was best and planned to do something similar. Until, oops, heart defect makes any drinking a very bad idea. I was concerned my kids wouldn't learn to drink responsibly now that I couldn't model the behaviour. However, several years on, they also both seem to think drinking is foolish. Apparently this is actually a trend among young people. As a group they drink less than their parents did at their age. So, I've come around to the idea that zero drinking from a young age can be a healthy and normal way to grow up too. Plus, I won't be that uncool parent who needs to have a drink to cope with life.
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Guys, this is SO random and weird.
I was at a doctor's appointment, and my poor doctor was SO frustrated at not being able to treat my autoimmune flare (which is unfortunately par for the course with a lot of autoimmune diseases), which has been going great guns since last autumn. I told her it was fine, mostly cosmetic, and she shouldn't get upset. But she WAS upset (doctor ego, maybe). She asked if she could do experimental treatment if the drug was very benign and easy to tolerate. I said, sure, I guess we could try something like that.
So she put me on low-dose naltrexone, but not for any drinking- or opioid-related thing. . .basically as a specialized anti-inflammatory agent.
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Thanks for all the responses, including the information on Uncool Itchy Butt-Hole Syndrome.
I have opened the Annie Grace site and will be investigating that as a means of support.
I got back in the squat rack today after a five week layoff. Felt great. I used to tell myself that I worked out and exercised a lot so I could "afford" to drink beer as a reward. For a while there, the reward beers started coming before the workouts and the workouts didn't happen.
I'm going to make April a good month.
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@Billy B. Good I'll join you in the squat rack - I've been recovering from a series of injuries this last year but it's time to get back on the weights.
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@Billy B. Good I'll join you in the squat rack - I've been recovering from a series of injuries this last year but it's time to get back on the weights.
I didn't push it too hard today, first day back after a layoff. I need to be able to walk tomorrow! But the endorphins were better than a beer buzz.
Take it slow on the way back. See you in there.
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Today is the last day of Dry January for many. When I first decided to take a break from alcohol I wasn't exactly sure if I would do just the month of Jan or an entire year. Now that the end of the month is upon us I am all in for a whole year, and excited to see it through. I have more or less been working through The Alcohol Experiment, which I have found to be.... interesting? Not the most compelling thing I have ever experienced but feel like it has done a good job of helping me examine assumptions like "Alcohol is fun to drink" and "Alcohol is not detrimental to your health". I will probably read Alan Carr's book this year since others have mentioned enjoying it perhaps more than the Annie Grace stuff.
I haven't really felt any benefits this month from abstaining, other than Not Feeling Icky and Bloated When I Drink. That seems to be more enough. I just feel, like, normal? It reminds me of when I was a teen/early college before I started drinking. My mind has an equilibrium, and every day is relatively consistently enjoyable. No weight loss, no improved sleep (though I have stopped getting up in the middle of the night to go to the bathroom which is nice), no clearer skin, or anything else like that. But I feel Normal, which is something gained that I did not always feel before. Here's to the rest of the year.
Hey y'all, just wanted to check in. I just wrapped up my third month of (at least) twelve with no alcohol. I continue to feel Normal, and the consistency in an even keel is really growing on me. Every once in a while I get a mental glimpse of some kind, almost a sensation of feeling like I am in high school again. It's like I've got the same mix of excitement about my life and mental sharpness that I didn't realize I had been missing. It's only there for an instant and infrequently, but I think its elusiveness is making me want it even more. I'm kind of giving the No Alcohol the credit for it - so if I want more of this brain high I guess I will continue to abstain.
My cycling has really been taking off, even though it is still in the early season here. I have been doing about equal amounts of exercise as previous years, but I am starting to feel like I have made some considerable fitness gains - I feel quite a bit more nimble for short, hard efforts. I use an app to track all of my riding and I've hit several PRs recently, and even made the top 2 position on the leaderboard for a segment near my house - my goal for the summer was to land in the top 10 and it's only April 1 so I guess I need to shoot higher. Having never felt like I was particularly athletic, and as an adult always feeling miserably out of shape during exercise to the point of abandoning it, this is probably the best feeling in the world. I've never been athletic before, but I feel like with some more work and time of putting in the effort I might be able to realize this goal. Anyway, I know this is kind of a hype post but I am in a particularly good mood right now about not drinking. I think there are definitely slower long term benefits that come around with continued perseverance and introspection. Keep up the good work, y'all. Continue to fight the good fight.
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I never got the butt itch thankfully:)). However, my face was red much of the time. That’s cleared up. I am no longer overweight. My blood work was starting to be funky and that’s excellent now.
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@jps and @Cassie bringing the hype posts this thread needs woot woot!
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It's like I've got the same mix of excitement about my life and mental sharpness that I didn't realize I had been missing.
This! I feel the same way... I guess that high school was the last time I wasn't regularly poisoning my body with alcohol. Embarrassing. It feels like I've been living my adult life with a foggy head, like when you get a head cold, and now it's lifted. Thanks for the update jps, and congrats to you. I am positive you will continue to see improvements in your athleticism -- and you have a competitive advantage over others who are essentially handicapping themselves by drinking.
Billy B Good, glad you are motivated to give it a try. It was great to read your story about smoking. Well, since you asked for some prodding, you look silly with that beer in your hand too. =) You said you have a great life, I bet you will enjoy experiencing it with your full senses about you. Why would you want to escape it by checking out mentally? And you will enjoy the benefit of not spending any more mental energy to ensure the fridge is stocked, and the ability to exercise in the evenings if you want to.
Cassie, that is amazing about the weight and blood work. Our bodies are machines, and they react to what we put into them. I know someone who indicated she could get off her blood pressure medicine if she stopped drinking. Yet she is still drinking, and literally taking medication in order to maintain a habit of poisoning her body. I am really hoping that someday she will ask me about how great I am feeling so I can share this story with her.
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Really awesome to read about the positive strides y'all are making!
I quit drinking before my daughter was born, but she has absolutely made me feel grateful for the decision (helping deepen my paradigm shift). One of the moments that gets me is when we're about to do something in the living room (maybe play guitar or a board game) and I say "hang on a sec, let me get a drink" and I go to the kitchen for seltzer or water. For some reason, that sentence sometimes transports me to a parallel dimension, where I'm going to get a beer (which would be followed by many others) while spending time with my daughter and it makes me profoundly grateful that this is not our story.
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@wenchsenior That is called microdosing and I have considered it also. They give you a very low dose so it should not be at the dose threshold to help with cravings but Let us know if it helps with your flare.
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It's like I've got the same mix of excitement about my life and mental sharpness that I didn't realize I had been missing.
This! I feel the same way... I guess that high school was the last time I wasn't regularly poisoning my body with alcohol. Embarrassing. It feels like I've been living my adult life with a foggy head, like when you get a head cold, and now it's lifted.
I got this experience as well; 2 years in and I still can't get over it! Feeling mentally closer to how I felt in college decades ago (when I rarely drank).
@BikeFanatic I will keep you guys informed of results and side effects (I'm assuming there won't be any at this dose level).
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I hope this doesn't make it awkward at future meet-ups.
So I shouldn't bring it up next time we hang out? ;-) Don't worry, I don't want to talk about your butt either.
Bringing it would mean it wasn't awkward!
On a more serious note, modelling healthy behaviours for your kids is an excellent reason to quit.
I found something similar to your story when I did a semester university in France. The French students drank, but not to excess, it was the North American exchange students who drank too much. I've always though that the US even more than Canada set that up with high drinking ages. It doesn't stop the drinking, but since you're already breaking a rule why not go further and drink to excess? It's odd, because it really would be better if everyone drank less and started later, but in a classic case of unintended consequences the efforts to do that make the situation worse not better.
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I hope this doesn't make it awkward at future meet-ups.
So I shouldn't bring it up next time we hang out? ;-) Don't worry, I don't want to talk about your butt either.
Bringing it would mean it wasn't awkward!
On a more serious note, modelling healthy behaviours for your kids is an excellent reason to quit.
I found something similar to your story when I did a semester university in France. The French students drank, but not to excess, it was the North American exchange students who drank too much. I've always though that the US even more than Canada set that up with high drinking ages. It doesn't stop the drinking, but since you're already breaking a rule why not go further and drink to excess? It's odd, because it really would be better if everyone drank less and started later, but in a classic case of unintended consequences the efforts to do that make the situation worse not better.
The stats say that the French are among the heaviest drinkers in the world.
I don't know that north american kids binge drink because it's not legal, perhaps, perhaps not. For whatever reason, it is part of the culture though, and that's problematic.
I grew up in Quebec where the legal drinking age is 18, and we definitely don't have the same attitude that young people shouldn't drink. And yet, rampant, legal binge drinking happens all throughout university.
Getting so drunk you can barely walk and then puking all night once you get home just isn't something to be embarrassed about. That's a problem.
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Spjulep, I totally forgot to mention that I was able to get off one of my two high blood pressure medications. It runs in my family so I am happy to get off of one. Luckily I didn’t drink when raising my kids so was fully present for them.
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Spjulep, I totally forgot to mention that I was able to get off one of my two high blood pressure medications. It runs in my family so I am happy to get off of one. Luckily I didn’t drink when raising my kids so was fully present for them.
I too was able to get off of heart medication, but not for blood pressure.
I have a high resting heart rate, which is an independent risk even in the absence of any heart disease, and apparently even moderate alcohol can raise your heart rate. It's not an issue for people with low-nornal heart rates, but is a HUGE issue for people like me.
I hated the drug I was on for heart rate though, because it also lowered my blood pressure, which is already low, and made me sooooo sluggish. I'm thrilled to be off of it. All heart meds come with side effects, so it's lovely to not need them.
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Malcat, I also have that heart issue and a beta blocker lowers my BP and my heart rate. That does make me tired. I developed that at 50 . I would love to not be taking that. I am glad you were able to get off it.
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Malcat, I also have that heart issue and a beta blocker lowers my BP and my heart rate. That does make me tired. I developed that at 50 . I would love to not be taking that. I am glad you were able to get off it.
I also quit caffeine, which really helped
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I have now lost 14 lbs since beginning this experiment a few months ago. I think a lot of the weight loss comes from being more active since I'm not sitting around feeling buzzed and watching TV. That means more steps, more activities, more stuff that gets me out-and-about that burns calories. I'm also not munching things while drinking, so my daily calorie count is much lower.
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I have now lost 14 lbs since beginning this experiment a few months ago. I think a lot of the weight loss comes from being more active since I'm not sitting around feeling buzzed and watching TV. That means more steps, more activities, more stuff that gets me out-and-about that burns calories. I'm also not munching things while drinking, so my daily calorie count is much lower.
Booze alone also packs a lot of calories, plus it alters the way your body metabolizes what you eat.
Alcohol calories can't be stored, so your liver has to prioritize processing them, which means a different pathway gets activated, and excess food calories get immediately shunted away into being turned into fat. When there's no alcohol in the system, excess calories can be processed in a different way where the body can circulate them while they get cleared through little body changes like increasing temperature or fidgeting, or whatever. Basically, they have a bit of a timeline where they can be burned off before the body resorts to storing them as fat.
At least that's how I'm remembering a med school lecture I barely paid attention to over a decade ago.
But basically, if you are drinking alcohol, it's easier for food calories to be stored as fat, and less likely for them and existing fat to be burned off because your metabolic system is so urgently preoccupied with de-poisoning you.
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I have lost a total of 50lbs. The first 12 were from giving up booze. Then I got motivated and counted calories.
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@Cassie , 50 pounds?! Wow, congratulations. That is a lot.
I think I’m going to join you in this thread. Not sure what my exact goal is but I want to drink less and have appreciated the discussion taking place here.
Didn’t really drink till I had kids in my 30s. Oldest is a teen now. And, I’ve found the pandemic and lots of life stress has had me drinking too much. My drink of choice is wine; Red and white.
I had my last glass on Saturday evening. 1 glass of red with dinner. So, a whole 2 days without...so far, but I plan to keep going.
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Well, I feel like a got past a landmark this Easter. A few years back, I decided to not-drink as a new year's resolution and I lasted until Easter, at which point I justified an "exception". That exception lasted into the next week (as I had vacation from work) and then for the rest of the year, I basically reverted to weekend drinking (which is what I'd been doing the year before).
This year, I made the same resolution (i.e. no alcohol for the year, up to the last 2 weeks of the year, at which point I will have a holiday from abstinence). So far, so good. I haven't been doing much self-reflection or using any of the resources posted here. Instead, I've just adopted the attitude that I've pre-decided to not drink, so I never have to give it any thought. Do I have to ask myself whether I should make an exception and have wine on Easter? No, I've pre-decided to not have any alcohol all year. Should I have a drink to celebrate getting the covid vaccine when the time comes? No, I've pre-decided to not have any alcohol all year. Should I have a drink at a wedding I'm supposed to attend in October, to toast the happy couple? No, I've pre-decided to not have any alcohol all year. In other words, whatever comes up, I don't have to give any thought about whether it merits an exception. Because I've pre-decided. I'm not having any alcohol this year. (Until the last 2 weeks of the year. For which I've pre-decided I'm free to drink as little or as much as I want at that time.)
(This technique of pre-deciding to abstain from something was inspired by Gretchen Rubin and her book on habits, Better Than Before.)
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@Cassie , 50 pounds?! Wow, congratulations. That is a lot.
I think I’m going to join you in this thread. Not sure what my exact goal is but I want to drink less and have appreciated the discussion taking place here.
Didn’t really drink till I had kids in my 30s. Oldest is a teen now. And, I’ve found the pandemic and lots of life stress has had me drinking too much. My drink of choice is wine; Red and white.
I had my last glass on Saturday evening. 1 glass of red with dinner. So, a whole 2 days without...so far, but I plan to keep going.
Welcome to the challenge, @LeftA! How's it going so far?
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Well, I feel like a got past a landmark this Easter. A few years back, I decided to not-drink as a new year's resolution and I lasted until Easter, at which point I justified an "exception". That exception lasted into the next week (as I had vacation from work) and then for the rest of the year, I basically reverted to weekend drinking (which is what I'd been doing the year before).
This year, I made the same resolution (i.e. no alcohol for the year, up to the last 2 weeks of the year, at which point I will have a holiday from abstinence). So far, so good. I haven't been doing much self-reflection or using any of the resources posted here. Instead, I've just adopted the attitude that I've pre-decided to not drink, so I never have to give it any thought. Do I have to ask myself whether I should make an exception and have wine on Easter? No, I've pre-decided to not have any alcohol all year. Should I have a drink to celebrate getting the covid vaccine when the time comes? No, I've pre-decided to not have any alcohol all year. Should I have a drink at a wedding I'm supposed to attend in October, to toast the happy couple? No, I've pre-decided to not have any alcohol all year. In other words, whatever comes up, I don't have to give any thought about whether it merits an exception. Because I've pre-decided. I'm not having any alcohol this year. (Until the last 2 weeks of the year. For which I've pre-decided I'm free to drink as little or as much as I want at that time.)
(This technique of pre-deciding to abstain from something was inspired by Gretchen Rubin and her book on habits, Better Than Before.)
That "pre-deciding" concept is a big part of Anni Grace's approach. It's so much easier to not having to decide every damn day if you are going to drink it not. The choice is already made.
After the "pre-decision" is made, then whether you drink or not depends on maintaining the integrity of your own word to yourself.
That's one of the most insidious parts of being a regular drinker. There are so many times you say you won't drink today, this week, this month, whatever, and then you break that promise to yourself because some kind of "exception" comes up. Over time, you train yourself to have no faith in your own word.
Since I quit drinking, I now basically never question if I'll actually do something I say I'm going to do, and I can no longer imagine it any other way.
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Well, I feel like a got past a landmark this Easter. A few years back, I decided to not-drink as a new year's resolution and I lasted until Easter, at which point I justified an "exception". That exception lasted into the next week (as I had vacation from work) and then for the rest of the year, I basically reverted to weekend drinking (which is what I'd been doing the year before).
This year, I made the same resolution (i.e. no alcohol for the year, up to the last 2 weeks of the year, at which point I will have a holiday from abstinence). So far, so good. I haven't been doing much self-reflection or using any of the resources posted here. Instead, I've just adopted the attitude that I've pre-decided to not drink, so I never have to give it any thought. Do I have to ask myself whether I should make an exception and have wine on Easter? No, I've pre-decided to not have any alcohol all year. Should I have a drink to celebrate getting the covid vaccine when the time comes? No, I've pre-decided to not have any alcohol all year. Should I have a drink at a wedding I'm supposed to attend in October, to toast the happy couple? No, I've pre-decided to not have any alcohol all year. In other words, whatever comes up, I don't have to give any thought about whether it merits an exception. Because I've pre-decided. I'm not having any alcohol this year. (Until the last 2 weeks of the year. For which I've pre-decided I'm free to drink as little or as much as I want at that time.)
(This technique of pre-deciding to abstain from something was inspired by Gretchen Rubin and her book on habits, Better Than Before.)
This is smart. Going in at only 98% instead of 100% results in decision fatigue, where you are constantly trying to decide if this or that special occasion is one that merits an exception to your commitment. Fatigue breeds failure. Removing the decision process beforehand leaves you with all your energy to honor the commitment. Congrats on honoring your commitment.
I had a similar experience on the second day of my April challenge. On day 2 I went to my niece's birthday party. The brothers-in-law started passing out cans of beer as per usual. I would normally accept. But this time I said, "No thanks. I'm not drinking right now." I left no room for doubt and no room for them to try to cajole me into joining them. They looked surprised, then they shrugged and it was over and never mentioned again. Easier than I expected.
Benjamin Hardy speaks to this 100% being much easier than 98%: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-rfLejtqwjc
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2 days before Christmas I found out my husband had been treated for 2 STD’s. If I had still been drinking I probably would have drank more and not taken action. Instead I spent
2 days examining what I wanted and had to face the fact that once my relationship was wonderful but that it should have ended 10 years ago. Since I have dealt with getting the house ready to sell, finding a condo to buy and disposing of all the junk he accumulated in the garage, shed, office, etc. I am physically and emotionally exhausted but handling everything that needs to get done despite being 66. I never could have done all this if I was drinking.
Something similar happened to me with a Very Bad Abusive Ex. Except... I was the one who got sick with the STDs. And he pleaded complete ignorance of how it could have possibly happened in a supposedly monogamous relationship.
I am glad you got out of that relationship and are taking much better care of yourself.
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Adventure, luckily that didn’t happen to me. The other part are bad enough. So sorry you went through that too.
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@Cassie we all have our struggles. I'm glad your alcohol-free choices helped you make those good choices for yourself.
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@jps , thank you for the warm welcome! Just closed 3 days. My head is killing me! Also had a short period of irritability earlier this afternoon. I’ve been tracking my wine consumption for a few months now. Looking back to the start of the year, my longest streak (sad to say) has been 4 days. I’ve done it a few times, so I guess starting tomorrow evening will be the true test! Reading your stories and the benefits of not drinking is keeping me motivated right now.
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@jps ... my longest streak (sad to say) has been 4 days. I’ve done it a few times, so I guess starting tomorrow evening will be the true test! Reading your stories and the benefits of not drinking is keeping me motivated right now.
It's got a noble resonance to announce not-drinking intentions for the next decade, year, month, week. But there's a reason AA talks about a day at a time. In the earliest moments, you need an even finer granularity. Ask (whoever, whatever, Whoever) to have the desire for this drink taken away. Ten minutes later, you may note in retrospect that it worked. I noticed that it worked despite my disbelief, disbelief both on the Grand Atheist level, and on the immediate, cynical, modernist level. Even more humbling, I learned about it from listening to someone I snidely thought my intellectual, social and spiritual inferior.
Any strong addiction is the black hole at the center of a galaxy of habits, many of them sociable, relaxing, comforting; some self-degrading; some fatal. It takes a long time for those habits to be reshaped, replaced, rooted out. The little technique above helps keep you back from the event horizon.
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I'm posting here to hopefully be more accountable in my goal. I'm planning to take a month off from drinking, with one possible exception for a cocktail tasting I've already planned with my friends. But that will be one drink max. I just don't know when that's going to be yet.
I've been mostly drinking once on the weekend, though more recently I've drank twice or thrice during the week. If this was only 1-2 drinks a day I wouldn't be concerned, but generally I've had at least 4:( Which yes, I know is terrible and it's really starting to worry me. So I want to take at least a month off to hopefully reset and lower my tolerance. At this point I don't feel any effects from just one drink. I think ideally I'd prefer to just be a social drinker, like at occasional gatherings of friends and family.
Another thing I've realized is that I've been drinking so that I can feel happy. I have severe depression, and even with treatment, the best I feel on my own for the most part is neutral. So I'm going to talk to my therapist this week about ways I can try to seek out things that make me happy. I just really have no idea how to feel happy at this point. And I know drinking is awful for depression, but in the moment the temptation makes it easy to ignore that and try to self medicate.
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@TheFrenchCat
Welcome! I also have severe depression, and quitting drinking was a big help in managing it (though I drank more often than you). I found that when I was drinking that I thought that drinking made me happy in the moment too - but it took reading This Naked Mind to reflect on it and realize that although I was less inhibited when drinking, I was actually more desperately miserable than ever (I only ever engaged in self harm when drinking). We think that drinking makes us happy, but it's probably just because we associate drinking with going out and having fun with friends - and it's the companionship that makes us happy. It's hard to retrain ourselves to break that association, but it's worth it. Bonne chance!
We think drinking makes us happy because giving in to a craving is a great feeling, but it wouldn't feel great if the negative force of the craving wasn't there in the first place. I don't remember who wrote this, but it's like the exquisite pleasure of taking off uncomfortable shoes. Yet no one purposefully walks around in painful shoes just for the pleasure of taking them off.
As for depression, alcohol absolutely worsens depression. It may feel like relief in the moment, but it just makes feeling depressed feel more acceptable. Not better, just more normal to be miserable.
I used to describe it as wrapping a wet blanket around myself and sinking comfortably into despair. It felt less like being miserable was a bad thing.
So in that way, drinking makes depression worse, and easier to accept. It makes it much less motivating to actually deal with.
I had exactly ZERO joy from my drinking experiment in January, and as I posted before, I felt profoundly sad within 30 minutes of my first sip. And I wasn't otherwise sad that day! I had had a great day, walking for a few hours along the ocean, seeing giant brown pelicans for the first time, and I'm like a giddy 5 year old when I see new animals. I was in a nice, peaceful mood when I started and then quickly I was full on depressed, but it felt totally normal to be so sad, like I felt no pressure to do anything about it. Meanwhile sober, if I felt that sad I would feel compelled to try and make myself feel better.
The experience really gave me insight into alcohol and depression, and how it actually works as a self medication compared to how we *think* it works.
I can't tell you how many times I had wine after a long, stressful day at work and thought that it helped me relax and shake off the day. Then I compare it to this past year where I briefly did some of the most stressful work I've ever done, and I would come home, wired out of my mind, feeling like I desperately needed to shake off the day, but instead of drinking, I would go for a walk with DH, rant for a solid 30 minutes, feel very, very uncomfortable with the stress, and then it would pass, and I would feel fine and move on with my night and not fixate on work.
With the wine, I would skip all of that discomfort, but I would never move past the negative feelings about work, they would just stay with me all evening, I just wouldn't mind them, but I never got a break from them, never got to enjoy my mental space outside of work because drinking right after work kind of cemented those feelings in for the evening.
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4 months!
That "pre-deciding" concept is a big part of Anni Grace's approach. It's so much easier to not having to decide every damn day if you are going to drink it not. The choice is already made.
After the "pre-decision" is made, then whether you drink or not depends on maintaining the integrity of your own word to yourself.
That's one of the most insidious parts of being a regular drinker. There are so many times you say you won't drink today, this week, this month, whatever, and then you break that promise to yourself because some kind of "exception" comes up. Over time, you train yourself to have no faith in your own word.
Since I quit drinking, I now basically never question if I'll actually do something I say I'm going to do, and I can no longer imagine it any other way.
+1,000
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A good friend from uni posted this on social media a few weeks ago and it really got me thinking:
"I was back and forth on whether or not to post anything about this, because ultimately, it’s only about me. However, I’ll share my perspective for what it’s worth. Today marks the 4th anniversary since my last drink. Am I an alcoholic? I honestly don’t really know, but I’ll put it this way. Like the vast majority of the population in the developed world, I have a relationship with alcohol. There were times in my life where I drank a lot and often, and times where it was merely “social” (whatever that means). It was when I almost randomly challenged myself to go 1 month without it that I became intensely aware of how casually, almost insidiously it was hooked into almost every facet of my life. Any occasion with friends and family? Alcohol is there. Any sporting event? Yup. Hot outside? Maybe I’ll have a beer. Etc. So, when I finished a month, I thought “What about 2?” And then a year, and now it’s four years.
I don’t miss it at all. I don’t miss hangovers, I don’t miss the calories, I don’t miss the vague recollections of incredibly stupid things I said, or find out I said. Ask anyone the knows me, I can be as childish and silly as any drunk person out there, but I won’t feel like death the next day, so I guess the only thing I’m actually missing is THE EXCUSE. Love me or hate me, at least it’s actually ME. I got tired of feeling like a passenger in my own head.
Anyhow, if you’re interested in less stress, greater clarity, and a more authentic version of yourself, maybe think about giving the bottle a break. Love you all, no judgement, I said at the start, this is all about me, it’s entirely a personal decision and a matter of choice. #sober #soberversary"
I too have a relationship with alcohol and while it is within societal norms, I recognize it isn't serving me. How we spend our days is how we spend our life, and I want my life to be fuller, richer and a better example for my kids.
From this forum thread I learned about the Naked Mind book and program. Thanks! I started Annie's 30 Day Alcohol Experiment yesterday https://learn.thisnakedmind.com/the-alcohol-experiment-registration (https://learn.thisnakedmind.com/the-alcohol-experiment-registration) and like her approach of learning, thinking and considering without rules or judgement.
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I made it through Day 5!
I’ve been tracking my drinking since May 2020. I’ve had a few 4 days streaks, and one 5 day streak all the way back in September. Now, most often I’d only drink 1 glass with dinner. So, while it wasn’t a crazy amount, I don’t like how habitual it had become.
Also, this year I’ve had fewer wine free evenings and have only had a few 3 days streaks. After that I’d give in and have a glass. Today, I did give it a second thought, but pushed through.
I also ordered This Naked Mind and it should be arriving tomorrow.
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I too have a relationship with alcohol and while it is within societal norms, I recognize it isn't serving me. How we spend our days is how we spend our life, and I want my life to be fuller, richer and a better example for my kids.
This really speaks to me! Welcome @Blissful Biker .
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I went to the eye doc today and for the first time I can remember I don’t have dry eye. After doing some research I read even a little alcohol can worsen the condition. I’m a little more than a week out from 100 days with no booze.
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The 2 hardest day of the week are now behind me...Friday right after work and Saturday evening. These were the most common times for me to drink wine. With that, I’m at 1 full week wine-free.
I have not committed to a specific timeframe...just taking it one day at a time. So far, I feel more energized and clear headed. Less irritable too.
My copy of this Naked Mind arrived yesterday and I’m half way through it. Not much of it seems new, having read pages of this thread beforehand.
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I am 101 days sober today. This is the longest I've ever been sober as an adult.
Can't quite believe it.
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I am 101 days sober today. This is the longest I've ever been sober as an adult.
Can't quite believe it.
CONGRATS!!
I know for me, that 100 days milestone felt like a really heartwarming accomplishment.
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Stubble, that’s huge! Congrats. I recently hit 8 months.
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wow Cassie that is amazing. You are rocking it too stubble stache.
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Is it 101 days for those of us who went dry on New Year's Day (Jan 1)? If so, I'm now in the triple digit club as well : )
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Stubble, that’s huge! Congrats. I recently hit 8 months.
Thanks you and congratulations on eight months! Really great.
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Is it 101 days for those of us who went dry on New Year's Day (Jan 1)? If so, I'm now in the triple digit club as well : )
we're sober twinsies :)
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15 years sober yesterday. It definitely gets easier -- I am never tempted to drink and I never regret giving it up. It's great to see so much support here!
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I would love to quit drinking alcohol for many reasons (mental clarity, health, saving money). The problem is I always cave because it's so engrained in social fabric with friends and family. How do you break this social pattern? My parents have always been big drinkers and keep saying things like "Can't until you're back -- there's SO many new breweries we need to take you too! You'll love them!"
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Geographer,
You do not have to quit you can just give it up for a period of time then re evaluate. I started with 3 days then 3 months then 7 months. eventually I realized after many milestones like sober Baseball games , sober Kayaking etc I realized I did not need alcohol and I do not even want to drink anymore.
First admit there is an issue, if there is one, then make a plan to abstain for X amount of time.
Here is the free alcohol experiment I would start there if you are ready. GO to FREE Resources tab and sign up for daily videos the book this naked mind is also a great quit drinking book.
https://thisnakedmind.com/the-alcohol-experiment/ (https://thisnakedmind.com/the-alcohol-experiment/)
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I'm posting here to hopefully be more accountable in my goal. I'm planning to take a month off from drinking, with one possible exception for a cocktail tasting I've already planned with my friends. But that will be one drink max. I just don't know when that's going to be yet.
I've been mostly drinking once on the weekend, though more recently I've drank twice or thrice during the week. If this was only 1-2 drinks a day I wouldn't be concerned, but generally I've had at least 4:( Which yes, I know is terrible and it's really starting to worry me. So I want to take at least a month off to hopefully reset and lower my tolerance. At this point I don't feel any effects from just one drink. I think ideally I'd prefer to just be a social drinker, like at occasional gatherings of friends and family.
Another thing I've realized is that I've been drinking so that I can feel happy. I have severe depression, and even with treatment, the best I feel on my own for the most part is neutral. So I'm going to talk to my therapist this week about ways I can try to seek out things that make me happy. I just really have no idea how to feel happy at this point. And I know drinking is awful for depression, but in the moment the temptation makes it easy to ignore that and try to self medicate.
I agree with all the previous comments about depression. I spent almost 20 years thinking my couple of glasses of wine each evening were 'chilling me out' and helping me have a little spot of joy in my day. Then when I quit, I realized that the drinking had been greatly worsening both my anxiety and my depression. In addition, it turned out that drinking had not just been 'numbing' my bad feelings, but the feelings on the other end of the spectrum as well. And finally, it had been removing my motivation and optimism that would have potentially allowed me to make bigger life changes and create better habits that would help me manage anxiety and depression in healthy ways (which I now do).
Just give the AF thing a try for a few months... 2 years on and I still can't believe how much better my emotional health is, nor how long I 'sawed my own emotional legs' off without realizing it.
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Also, congrats to everyone reporting in on milestones. I love hearing that!
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Geographer,
You do not have to quit you can just give it up for a period of time then re evaluate. I started with 3 days then 3 months then 7 months. eventually I realized after many milestones like sober Baseball games , sober Kayaking etc I realized I did not need alcohol and I do not even want to drink anymore.
First admit there is an issue, if there is one, then make a plan to abstain for X amount of time.
Here is the free alcohol experiment I would start there if you are ready. GO to FREE Resources tab and sign up for daily videos the book this naked mind is also a great quit drinking book.
https://thisnakedmind.com/the-alcohol-experiment/ (https://thisnakedmind.com/the-alcohol-experiment/)
I second this recommendation, but please note that you will want to sign up at the "Returning Users Login" (it's the link for new members despite the misleading name, and goes to the new site for the Experiment). Don't use the "Legacy login" (it leads to the site that most of us on this thread did the Experiment at, but that site is no longer technically supported and it's all but dead).
There is also a social board (https://www.thisnakedmindcommunity.com/home) that has taken the place of a bunch of the commenting, interactive, and social functions that were features of the old Experiment site, but are not featured on the new Experiment site.
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@Geographer Seconding the you don't have to Give Up, you can just hit pause for a bit.
My husband brews, his friends brew, going to new breweries/tastings etc was a social thing we did. I was really worried about how to be social/ pressure from friends and family. I decided I was stopping after <specific date>, didn't tell anyone for a couple of weeks, then told my husband I was giving it a break so he wouldn't offer me a beer. (I think I told him it was going to be for a couple months but secretly I was aiming for at least a year/maybe forever.) It's coming up 4 years now. I still enjoy sniffing a good boutique beer to work out what they have done but don't drink. All my friends and family now know I don't drink anymore.
A lot of the time what we perceive as pressure to drink is people making an offer of a shared enjoyment because they want to do something enjoyable with you. It's not necessarily about the drinking. Once they transition to thinking of you as not drinking, the let's check out this brewery offers become let's try this walk/cooking class/fancy coffee place, whatever it is that becomes the replacement Shared Enjoyment. You can help them by proposing other things that can become that shared enjoyment.
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@Geographer Seconding the you don't have to Give Up, you can just hit pause for a bit.
My husband brews, his friends brew, going to new breweries/tastings etc was a social thing we did. I was really worried about how to be social/ pressure from friends and family. I decided I was stopping after <specific date>, didn't tell anyone for a couple of weeks, then told my husband I was giving it a break so he wouldn't offer me a beer. (I think I told him it was going to be for a couple months but secretly I was aiming for at least a year/maybe forever.) It's coming up 4 years now. I still enjoy sniffing a good boutique beer to work out what they have done but don't drink. All my friends and family now know I don't drink anymore.
A lot of the time what we perceive as pressure to drink is people making an offer of a shared enjoyment because they want to do something enjoyable with you. It's not necessarily about the drinking. Once they transition to thinking of you as not drinking, the let's check out this brewery offers become let's try this walk/cooking class/fancy coffee place, whatever it is that becomes the replacement Shared Enjoyment. You can help them by proposing other things that can become that shared enjoyment.
Exactly.
I didn't quit when I first stopped drinking, I had no choice but to stop for 6 months for medical reasons. Within, I think, 2 months, I just didn't *want* to ever drink again. I never felt I "needed" to quit, I was just shocked by the experience of how superior being sober is.
Some people take a pause and decide that they want to modify their relationship with alcohol, others decide that they want to quit permanently.
Most of us Naked Mind types don't drink because not drinking makes us much happier than drinking does, not because we're "alcoholics" who aren't allowed to ever drink again.
So if someone is at a point that the idea of quitting permanently doesn't feel like happiness, then don't worry about quitting permanently, focus on figuring out *what* relationship with alcohol will feel like happiness. A period of sobriety is the BEST way to figure out what that relationship is.
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Checkin' in - just because. Had a planned drink w/ a celebratory dinner last week. It tasted good, went well with the meal and I enjoyed it. The next night I had a little yen for a cocktail but didn't. 5 days out, all good. Tentatively planning to have a couple of drinks if we get to take a summer vacation.
My husband said he really misses our Sunday afternoon cocktail together. I think the "soft around the edges" feeling actually helps blunt some of his sensory issues with our kids. I might skim the Naked Mind book to see if there is anything useful there for him.
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Wow, so much activity here in the last day or so! Welcome to all the new joiners and congratulations to all those hitting new milestones AF.
I finished This Naked Mind yesterday. It reaffirmed my decision to go alcohol free for a bit. Today was day 9. So many positives to report!
I made a list:
- so much more energy and motivation to get things done!
- more mental acuity
- less anxiety, feelings of being overwhelmed
- more confidence
- food tastes better
- feeling more in control of my life
And, this is only from a few short days - imagine the potential for long terms benefits, like better health and saving $$!
The only negative so far has been dealing with strong cravings on day 6 and 7. They passed. They also weren’t surprising since I hadn’t gone more than 5 days without wine since the pandemic started...
Thanks to the many regular posters here who have kept this post alive to give me the little nudge I needed to change my life! @wenchsenior , I’ve found your posts in particular really helpful.
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You are so welcome, LeftA. Without this thread, I'm not sure I would have stopped drinking myself (and if I had, assuredly not without a lot more stress and angst). The people on this thread were so positive and supportive, I really want to pass it forward.
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Congrats to those who recently joined the thread, and also to those celebrating milestones! So inspiring to see what everyone else is doing.
Star Bright, it is great to hear your update too. Sounds like you have found a rhythm that works well for you. I totally identify with needing to replace the good vibes of happy hour. Have you tried replacing Sunday afternoon cocktails with mocktails, or a special mezze snack platter? Or take a walk, listen to some nice music, play a word game if you're into that... whatever is a natural stress reliever and something you could do together.
Last week I went on a beautiful 50k bike ride with some friends. We left early in the morning while it was cold and somewhat rainy. As we cycled out of the city, the clouds parted, and I felt the sun rays on my face. We took a path through a forest of tall trees. As we went further, I felt like I was leaving any worries behind me. I had this beautiful feeling of being alive.
In the past, I wouldn't have had the energy to wake up early or to cycle for such a long time. Or I would have been thinking in the back of my mind, I want to get back to spend the afternoon at a beer garden. When I came home I saw my neighbors and asked how they spent this beautiful day. They laughed and proudly said they had been out drinking last night, slept in, sat on the couch, and ordered junk food. I thought to myself, ugh, what a punishment to torture your body and miss out on a day of life.
I'm mostly recovered from my injury that prompted me to stop drinking, so technically I could resume. But I still have no desire whatsoever. I can't remember a time when I had such low levels of stress and anxiety. I am totally a puppy who wakes up every morning, tail wagging and excited for what we get to do next!
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When I came home I saw my neighbors and asked how they spent this beautiful day. They laughed and proudly said they had been out drinking last night, slept in, sat on the couch, and ordered junk food. I thought to myself, ugh, what a punishment to torture your body and miss out on a day of life.
This really resonates with me. I am starting to empathize with how many who are vegan come under caricature-ization for their smug sense of superiority, but I really do think, like you, how could you punish your body like this by drinking stuff that makes you throw up/get hungover? I do have to remember that many, and often I fell into this category, can drink one or two drinks a few times a month and stave off many of the ill-effects of alcohol. Not everybody is torturing themselves in the same way as your neighbors.
But dang, does it absolutely feel good to feel alive. To go for a bike ride through the woods with heart pumping and sweat beading is vastly more life-giving than getting drunk. Often when I'm on my bike riding up a hill I have to remind myself that my body is adapting to this activity - in response to being overworked it develops more oxygen-receptors in the muscles so that it can more effectively get me up the hill next time. Our bodies are remarkably responsive to physical exercise - I wonder when we spend our time sitting on the couch/at the bar drinking, what kinds of messages does our body get? And how does it respond?
Thanks for the update, spjulep!
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Spjulep, you are absolutely right! If I had still been drinking I may not have been able to leave my husband and build a new life. I definitely couldn’t have worked 8-10 hours physically a day hauling all the junk away. Now my treat is ghiradelli hot chocolate and 4 pieces of their candy:)).
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I'm at a week and a half and I'm struggling. I reread my post to remind myself that I was actually getting concerned and not just my husband. I know if I drink he'll be disappointed, and I feel like I'm sticking with it just for him and not for me. It doesn't help that he's super busy at work now which means I don't get a break from childcare. I'm pretty much abstaining just because I said I would, which feels pointless. I just wish I had something else that let me feel happy. I have hobbies but they're just a distraction. Should I stick with it?
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You are in the hardest part. You need to do it for yourself. Read Annie’s book again and also others. You can join the Naked Mind support group online and check in often. Find something else to do when you would normally drink.
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I'm at a week and a half and I'm struggling. I reread my post to remind myself that I was actually getting concerned and not just my husband. I know if I drink he'll be disappointed, and I feel like I'm sticking with it just for him and not for me. It doesn't help that he's super busy at work now which means I don't get a break from childcare. I'm pretty much abstaining just because I said I would, which feels pointless. I just wish I had something else that let me feel happy. I have hobbies but they're just a distraction. Should I stick with it?
Stick with it! Give it a shot for 30 days. "Because you said you would" is a good reason - you are worthy of keeping a promise to yourself.
I have two kids that are A LOT and I am probably 80-85% responsible for pre and post school childcare and wakes up and bed times so I get it.
I am also struggling with figuring out what makes me happy (and also fits into my tiny windows of autonomy). I feel this post so much. I'm 100ish days out from taking a very conscious break with drinks. I do feel better for it.
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I'm at a week and a half and I'm struggling. I reread my post to remind myself that I was actually getting concerned and not just my husband. I know if I drink he'll be disappointed, and I feel like I'm sticking with it just for him and not for me. It doesn't help that he's super busy at work now which means I don't get a break from childcare. I'm pretty much abstaining just because I said I would, which feels pointless. I just wish I had something else that let me feel happy. I have hobbies but they're just a distraction. Should I stick with it?
In general, I think kicking an addictive substance or counterproductive habit can only be successful if we ourselves are committed to doing it. That said, there are a few things to consider...
1) I found it crucial to reframe my experience of being alcohol free from "I'm depriving myself of something" to "I'm gaining something"...but this didn't happen overnight. Participating in the structured Alcohol Experiment mentioned by many people on this thread was crucial to that change my mindset. It also made the initial month of abstaining, when I was having cravings and feeling very 'deprived' much much easier to manage b/c I was 'in the company' of dozens of other people all experiencing (and discussing) the same things. And the experiment itself regularly offers tools to deal with cravings and feelings of deprivation.
2) You are literally just at the end of active detox...and the first two weeks are, for most people, the worst. Your body has barely even begun to normalize function in the absence of alcohol. How you feel right now is highly unlikely to be 'what living alcohol free feels like'. Some people start to feel notably better right around the 10 day mark, but it is super common to actually feel worse (especially emotionally) during the first few weeks. The reason for this is that regular drinking damages our pleasure neurotransmitter function. As that happens (as you describe), we then find that we need an artificial stimulation from drinking to feel any pleasure at all. Then if we remove the drinking, we are left with the sub-functioning neurotransmitter function and consequently we feel WORSE for the first few weeks to months. Most medical websites indicate it takes 30-100 days to restore neurotransmitter function and some of us feel shittier than usual until then.
For example, I had a history of depression and anxiety, and I didn't begin to see mood benefits until around 25 consecutive days AF. If I had gotten 2 weeks under my belt with no change, and given up and had something to drink (even just a couple drinks), I would have been 'resetting' my detox window to day 0, thus repeating all the worst parts of detox (the worse anxiety, the worse mood, the insomnia, etc) while never stringing together enough consecutive days without drinking to start experiencing improvement in mood.
* As a side note, most people don't realize that by drinking even once per week, they are more or less in constant low-level detox, which means they are always feeling at least somewhat worse than they would have if they hadn't had any drinks at all. Drinking more frequently means you are on a constant roller coaster of a very brief bit of objective pleasure (in my case 30 minutes), in exchange for the rest of each day (1,410 minutes) feeling shittier than I would have if I hadn't drunk at all. So in reality, I was trading 47 units of pain for 1 unit of pleasure, and somehow believing that was worth it.
3) One thing to consider (this was a big motivator for me) was to step back and look at the inevitable long-term trajectory of relying on a physically addictive substance as my main pleasure and main coping method of dealing with stress. Tolerance creep is inevitable if one drinks regularly, which means eventually more of the substance is required to get the supposed benefits one is after. I knew this from years of struggling against increasing my own amounts of alcohol. And that road goes only one way; it's very very difficult to reverse course. Look ahead at your own trajectory...1 year, 5 years, 20 years...if you keep relying on alcohol to feel good. What does that look like and does it serve your goals and aspirations for mental health and basic life-function?
4) Depression is really really tough. I know, having struggled with it on and off much of my life time. There are many things that can be done to improve mental health and combat depression, some of which you are likely already doing. But maybe you could ask for some specific suggestions as to things that helped some of us, that you might not have tried. I can tell you that my motivation for pursuing those healthier methods of depression management was completely undercut by my drinking. Drinking kills motivation for pretty much everything but itself.
I really feel you pain. I really do. Before you give up, I would absolutely suggest actively participating in the Alcohol Experiment if you are not already doing so. You can even do it while you are still drinking if you wish (though at some point it's really useful to try to truly hit at least 30 days without drinking, to get the most out of it and for the reasons I outlined in point 2).
:hugs:
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I'm at a week and a half and I'm struggling. I reread my post to remind myself that I was actually getting concerned and not just my husband. I know if I drink he'll be disappointed, and I feel like I'm sticking with it just for him and not for me. It doesn't help that he's super busy at work now which means I don't get a break from childcare. I'm pretty much abstaining just because I said I would, which feels pointless. I just wish I had something else that let me feel happy. I have hobbies but they're just a distraction. Should I stick with it?
I personally don't think the reason matters for the first month.
Your brain isn't really your own until you've fully detoxed and are able to think properly.
So even if it feels like you have no reason, think of it this way: how fucked up is it if you *can't* comfortably not drink for just 30 days without a hugely motivating reason for doing so?
Doesn't that tell you something about how unhealthy your habit is?
Your reason doesn't have to be anything more than the fact that you should be able to.
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A week and a half was absolutely the hardest time for me. It didn't even occur to me that I might have a problematic relationship with alcohol until that point. I'd quit because I was trying to avoid having to have heart surgery. My motive was purely physical and I was shocked to learn that there was also a psychological component. However, after I wrapped my head around the idea that I might have to put some effort into quitting, things got better fairly quickly.
Find something else to do during those times you really want a drink, even if those things don't make you immediately happy. In fact, they probably won't. For a few weeks after I quit, I rage cleaned the house in the evenings while I stewed about the fact that I was apparently more hooked on booze than I'd realized. I certainly wasn't happy, in fact I was pretty pissed off. Over the next month, you basically just need to kill time while your brain gets over the idea of booze. If you need help coming up with ideas to help kill time, we'll be happy to suggest some things. If you're still miserable a couple months from now then you can think about whether you want to add booze back into your life.
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A week and a half was absolutely the hardest time for me. It didn't even occur to me that I might have a problematic relationship with alcohol until that point. I'd quit because I was trying to avoid having to have heart surgery. My motive was purely physical and I was shocked to learn that there was also a psychological component. However, after I wrapped my head around the idea that I might have to put some effort into quitting, things got better fairly quickly.
Find something else to do during those times you really want a drink, even if those things don't make you immediately happy. In fact, they probably won't. For a few weeks after I quit, I rage cleaned the house in the evenings while I stewed about the fact that I was apparently more hooked on booze than I'd realized. I certainly wasn't happy, in fact I was pretty pissed off. Over the next month, you basically just need to kill time while your brain gets over the idea of booze. If you need help coming up with ideas to help kill time, we'll be happy to suggest some things. If you're still miserable a couple months from now then you can think about whether you want to add booze back into your life.
Lol! So much rage cleaning!!
I'm not an angry person, and I too quit for mandatory health reasons, but I was SHOCKED at how angry I was in the evening when I couldn't have my after-work "feel good" wine.
That took a few weeks to pass, but it totally threw me while it was happening.
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A week and a half was absolutely the hardest time for me. It didn't even occur to me that I might have a problematic relationship with alcohol until that point. I'd quit because I was trying to avoid having to have heart surgery. My motive was purely physical and I was shocked to learn that there was also a psychological component. However, after I wrapped my head around the idea that I might have to put some effort into quitting, things got better fairly quickly.
Find something else to do during those times you really want a drink, even if those things don't make you immediately happy. In fact, they probably won't. For a few weeks after I quit, I rage cleaned the house in the evenings while I stewed about the fact that I was apparently more hooked on booze than I'd realized. I certainly wasn't happy, in fact I was pretty pissed off. Over the next month, you basically just need to kill time while your brain gets over the idea of booze. If you need help coming up with ideas to help kill time, we'll be happy to suggest some things. If you're still miserable a couple months from now then you can think about whether you want to add booze back into your life.
Lol! So much rage cleaning!!
Same. Going without my wine made me realize how I didn't even have a decent hobby that I could do in the evening. I mean, I could read, which was fine. But I had to actually Google for lists of hobbies and leisure activities for ideas...that's how much of a workaholic I was. Work, drink/make dinner, drink watch movie, bed. Repeat.
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Thank you all for your support and advice. It's good to hear it gets better. And I didn't know it took that long for it to be completely out of your system. I thought it only took a couple days. I haven't read The Naked Mind, and my library doesn't have it; is it worth the read or is just signing up for the alcohol experiment enough? It's not super literal, right? I truly need my medications and treatment.
I'll stick with it and see what happens after a month.
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Reading the book changed my life and some of my friends. It took away most of my desire to drink. The best money I ever spent.
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Thank you all for your support and advice. It's good to hear it gets better. And I didn't know it took that long for it to be completely out of your system. I thought it only took a couple days. I haven't read The Naked Mind, and my library doesn't have it; is it worth the read or is just signing up for the alcohol experiment enough? It's not super literal, right? I truly need my medications and treatment.
I'll stick with it and see what happens after a month.
I don't know what you mean by literal?
The alcohol experiment doesn't even require that you quit drinking. So you really can't lose trying it. I recommend both the experiment and the book. The book is a super easy read, and the experiment takes, like, 20 minutes a day, and that's putting full effort into it.
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Thank you all for your support and advice. It's good to hear it gets better. And I didn't know it took that long for it to be completely out of your system. I thought it only took a couple days. I haven't read The Naked Mind, and my library doesn't have it; is it worth the read or is just signing up for the alcohol experiment enough? It's not super literal, right? I truly need my medications and treatment.
I'll stick with it and see what happens after a month.
I don't know what you mean by literal?
The alcohol experiment doesn't even require that you quit drinking. So you really can't lose trying it. I recommend both the experiment and the book. The book is a super easy read, and the experiment takes, like, 20 minutes a day, and that's putting full effort into it.
The Naked Mind makes me think it's recommending you don't take any mind-altering substances, which isn't really an option for me. I guess it doesn't mean that if you don't even need to stop drinking. I'll definitely give the experiment a try.
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Thank you all for your support and advice. It's good to hear it gets better. And I didn't know it took that long for it to be completely out of your system. I thought it only took a couple days. I haven't read The Naked Mind, and my library doesn't have it; is it worth the read or is just signing up for the alcohol experiment enough? It's not super literal, right? I truly need my medications and treatment.
I'll stick with it and see what happens after a month.
I don't know what you mean by literal?
The alcohol experiment doesn't even require that you quit drinking. So you really can't lose trying it. I recommend both the experiment and the book. The book is a super easy read, and the experiment takes, like, 20 minutes a day, and that's putting full effort into it.
The Naked Mind makes me think it's recommending you don't take any mind-altering substances, which isn't really an option for me. I guess it doesn't mean that if you don't even need to stop drinking. I'll definitely give the experiment a try.
It doesn't recommend that at all, and certainly not for depression. The author suffers from serious depression herself. She is currently off meds (I believe) but was on them for many years. There is at least one lesson in the Alcohol Experiment where she addresses depression and drinking in detail. But she is not anti med. She also has some material for people who wish to try Naltrexone, which is a medication used to treat alcohol and opioid addiction, and she is very pro- doing 'whatever works', as long as harm is not increased.
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I have taken anxiety medication for 16 years. She doesn’t suggest people quit their medication.
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FWIW I never read any books or sought out any help at all when I quit drinking. I just stopped. It worked because fear of surgery is a big motivator for me and I was willing to put up with quite a bit of BS if it meant I didn't have to see the OR. I have no idea what this book is or how helpful it may be. You may be the same, or reading it may help. Regardless, it's not absolutely necessary.
It's also important to keep in mind that stopping drinking doesn't fix everything. It's not magic. Whatever underlying problems a person has are still going to be there regardless of how they chose to deal, or not deal, with them. In the end, I chose to have the surgery anyway and it was the right decision. Stopping drinking just allowed me to put the decision off for a few more years.
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I might be mistaken, but your (TheFrenchCat's) posts read to me that you are subconsciously trying to avoid hearing the information about drinking that will make it untenable for you to continue drinking. If so, I TOTALLY relate. I drank almost every day for decades, and studiously avoided information that would force me to confront my habit. I selectively only clicked on 'heart healthy benefits of drinking' type articles while averting my eyes from the headlines that noted the ever increasing metadata that showed how dangerous drinking was. I hung out with people that would not criticize or judge my habit b/c they had their own.
I actively avoided clicking on this thread for at least 2 years LOL.
I was concerned that I couldn't actually stop drinking; and I was scared to try the Alcohol Experiment for fear it would confirm that I couldn't stop.
Then once I read this thread and started to get 'sober curious', I put off trying to do the Alcohol Experiment partly b/c everyone was so enthusiastic about it (I'm a bit contrarian that way), despite the fact that I could have done it while continuing to drink. Looking back, this is pretty funny to me now, but that's how I felt.
Then once I decided I had to try the Experiment, I put off actually starting it b/c of anxiety. Instead, I hung out in the Naked Mind community forums, on the (old/original) Experiment website, listened to the personal stories on This Naked Mind podcast, and tried to 'cut down' my drinking while I got over my resistance to trying.
Eventually, I got more curious about how I might feel living without drinking than fearful of trying to stop. After all, I had almost 20 years of knowing what drinking was like, but only a dim memory of what things had been like in the "Before Times".
If you are experiencing this kind of subconscious resistance, join the club of tons of us. We've been there. In that case, just keep trying to engage with the material (even just a little bit at a time) b/c what you might find (as I eventually did) is that your anxiety will wane over time.
If this isn't what you are experiencing, then discount the above.
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Thank you all for your support and advice. It's good to hear it gets better. And I didn't know it took that long for it to be completely out of your system. I thought it only took a couple days. I haven't read The Naked Mind, and my library doesn't have it; is it worth the read or is just signing up for the alcohol experiment enough? It's not super literal, right? I truly need my medications and treatment.
I'll stick with it and see what happens after a month.
I don't know what you mean by literal?
The alcohol experiment doesn't even require that you quit drinking. So you really can't lose trying it. I recommend both the experiment and the book. The book is a super easy read, and the experiment takes, like, 20 minutes a day, and that's putting full effort into it.
The Naked Mind makes me think it's recommending you don't take any mind-altering substances, which isn't really an option for me. I guess it doesn't mean that if you don't even need to stop drinking. I'll definitely give the experiment a try.
No, not at all, not even a little bit.
This book wouldn't be so universally supported in this group with so little criticism if it promoted such a radical and dangerous approach.
Some of us have leveled criticism against some of the bullshit pseudo science that Annie talks about, especially with respect to sugar, but beyond that, the book and the experiment are more of a cognitive process for reexamining your relationship with alcohol, and on that front, it is solid.
I personally responded much better to Alan Carr, who doesn't resort to invoking any science, but his style is very harsh, which I respond well to, but most people I think would do better with Annie. Her approach is really an expansion on his with more experts and content, and his is *just* based on reframing your personal perception of alcohol.
Both of them encourage you to keep drinking for the beginning phase of the work.
As others have said, the book and the experiment aren't magic, they don't fix you, they're just a very reliable process to go through designed based on the personal experiences and extensive research of an alcoholic who quit herself and put together and easy to use, curated resource designed to help you rapidly learn the things that a lot of us had to learn through this process.
It's really just a shorthand for the almost universal process of questioning your relationship with alcohol.
Annie is big on full sobriety, but she provides great resources for those who want to try moderation. It's not about dogmatic adherence to abstinence, if it was, I wouldn't be comfortable promoting it.
As wenchsenior has said though, if you are avoiding a resource, it's important to examine why. Sometimes your alcohol brain will do whatever it takes to avoid good help.
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Thank you all for your support and advice. It's good to hear it gets better. And I didn't know it took that long for it to be completely out of your system. I thought it only took a couple days. I haven't read The Naked Mind, and my library doesn't have it; is it worth the read or is just signing up for the alcohol experiment enough? It's not super literal, right? I truly need my medications and treatment.
I'll stick with it and see what happens after a month.
There is a fantastically supportive subreddit r/stopdrinking that has excellent resources including a link to a free download of The Naked Mind provided by Annie Grace. I dipped my toe in there for a couple of years before I stopped for good* and I strongly recommend if you are looking for a very active support group in the first few months. If you are on other medications that is a strong indicator to stop drinking as alcohol is often contra-indicated, because of how it interferes with other meds.
*and even this time, I had planned on 1 year but maybe forever and now it's coming up 4 years and it was 💯 the right choice for me.
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Thank you all for your support and advice. It's good to hear it gets better. And I didn't know it took that long for it to be completely out of your system. I thought it only took a couple days. I haven't read The Naked Mind, and my library doesn't have it; is it worth the read or is just signing up for the alcohol experiment enough? It's not super literal, right? I truly need my medications and treatment.
I'll stick with it and see what happens after a month.
I don't know what you mean by literal?
The alcohol experiment doesn't even require that you quit drinking. So you really can't lose trying it. I recommend both the experiment and the book. The book is a super easy read, and the experiment takes, like, 20 minutes a day, and that's putting full effort into it.
The Naked Mind makes me think it's recommending you don't take any mind-altering substances, which isn't really an option for me. I guess it doesn't mean that if you don't even need to stop drinking. I'll definitely give the experiment a try.
No, not at all, not even a little bit.
This book wouldn't be so universally supported in this group with so little criticism if it promoted such a radical and dangerous approach.
Some of us have leveled criticism against some of the bullshit pseudo science that Annie talks about, especially with respect to sugar, but beyond that, the book and the experiment are more of a cognitive process for reexamining your relationship with alcohol, and on that front, it is solid.
I personally responded much better to Alan Carr, who doesn't resort to invoking any science, but his style is very harsh, which I respond well to, but most people I think would do better with Annie. Her approach is really an expansion on his with more experts and content, and his is *just* based on reframing your personal perception of alcohol.
Both of them encourage you to keep drinking for the beginning phase of the work.
As others have said, the book and the experiment aren't magic, they don't fix you, they're just a very reliable process to go through designed based on the personal experiences and extensive research of an alcoholic who quit herself and put together and easy to use, curated resource designed to help you rapidly learn the things that a lot of us had to learn through this process.
It's really just a shorthand for the almost universal process of questioning your relationship with alcohol.
Annie is big on full sobriety, but she provides great resources for those who want to try moderation. It's not about dogmatic adherence to abstinence, if it was, I wouldn't be comfortable promoting it.
As wenchsenior has said though, if you are avoiding a resource, it's important to examine why. Sometimes your alcohol brain will do whatever it takes to avoid good help.
Oh, ok good to hear. I'll check it out. I don't know if I'm avoiding information on alcohol's negative effects. Kind of hard to tell what my subconscious is doing. But I signed up for the alcohol experiment and some of her ebooks, and I'm going to try to stick with my original plan.
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@TheFrenchCat , I’m glad you posted here and reached out. The responses you received are pure gold IMO.
I’m just a tiny bit ahead of you...at 13 days. I typically drank one glass of wine most evenings, but Friday late afternoon / early evening, I’d let myself have 2 glasses. So, Friday evenings have been when I have actually craved the wine most since going AF. Today, I just thought of all the negatives and my craving soon eased, then I had some carbonated water with some lemon. I’m still resolute, but haven't made any decisions on a specific length of time - just taking it day by day.
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TheFrenchCat, you can do it! Look at what a great job you are already doing: you faced a challenge, examined it reasonably, asked and received support, and took actions in your own best interest. Keep us updated on what you think of the experiment. I think everyone has different learning/motivation styles (like, I love reading books and personal testimonials), but nothing can beat one's own personal experience of living 1 month without alcohol. It provides a basis to analyze and challenge the underlying beliefs that cause destructive behavior.
LeftA, it's so interesting that humans can rewire their own brains. Like to sense a craving and to change how you react to it. It will only get easier with time as we carve new habits and neural pathways.
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My husband said he really misses our Sunday afternoon cocktail together. I think the "soft around the edges" feeling actually helps blunt some of his sensory issues with our kids. I might skim the Naked Mind book to see if there is anything useful there for him.
If you find something on this will you please share with me. I didn't become a daily drinker until having children and I think sensory issues due to the noise and chaos are a big trigger for me to crave a drink. My friend has anxiety meds for this purpose but those can be habit forming too so I don't know if I want to go down that road.
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My husband said he really misses our Sunday afternoon cocktail together. I think the "soft around the edges" feeling actually helps blunt some of his sensory issues with our kids. I might skim the Naked Mind book to see if there is anything useful there for him.
If you find something on this will you please share with me. I didn't become a daily drinker until having children and I think sensory issues due to the noise and chaos are a big trigger for me to crave a drink. My friend has anxiety meds for this purpose but those can be habit forming too so I don't know if I want to go down that road.
There are a ton of cognitive skills that can produce the exact same calming result as alcohol, since the alcohol itself isn't what causes the calming. That's an internal neurological response to giving in to a craving. The alcohol does nothing in and of itself.
For me though, I found 5 minutes of vigorous physical activity was a great substitute for the feel-good effect of pouring a drink. That really pumps the natural feel good endorphins.
Granted, when I was a drinker, I probably would have laughed in someone's face if they told me to go climb a bunch of flights of stairs instead of having a drink when I feel miserable, overwhelmed, and exhausted. But when I first quit and I was desperate to find *something* that could alter my mood, I was willing to try anything, and it really worked.
Otherwise, mindfulness meditation techniques are excellent, along with many other CBT type cognitive strategies.
Just remember, it's your own mind that creates that sense of relief, not the alcohol, so you don't need to find another psychoactive substances to replace the alcohol, because the alcohol was never the source of the calm in the first place.
The calm comes the second you pour that first glass, and with that first sip. That calm is coming from your own, internal emotions. So that can be replicated without any drug at all.
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A hot bath is also a nice way to get that warm fuzzy feeling. Removing oneself from the chaos of a house with kids to a relatively quiet space where you can focus on the nice smells and a pleasant tactile experience is calming. My sister, who is a mother to two ebullient kids, pretty much lives in her tub. Now if your kids are old enough to be ignored for an hour so that both you and your husband can share the tub, that'd be a whole other tactile experience! (the quality of which depends on the tub size and quality of the door lock)
Haha I do like my jet tub, but I usually just lie in there and read a book to relax. I don't think my husband and I would both fit. He is 6'6" and 350 lbs. Now that it's warmer outside a walk after dinner is a nice way to calm down too.
It is getting through the dinner hour that is the most trouble, since I can't just physically walk away. I don't crave drink earlier in the day and will turn it down on the rare occasion that it is offered at lunchtime. I don't have wine in the house right now and that is helping a lot, since the other things we have just don't sound as appealing.
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A hot bath is also a nice way to get that warm fuzzy feeling. Removing oneself from the chaos of a house with kids to a relatively quiet space where you can focus on the nice smells and a pleasant tactile experience is calming. My sister, who is a mother to two ebullient kids, pretty much lives in her tub. Now if your kids are old enough to be ignored for an hour so that both you and your husband can share the tub, that'd be a whole other tactile experience! (the quality of which depends on the tub size and quality of the door lock)
Haha I do like my jet tub, but I usually just lie in there and read a book to relax. I don't think my husband and I would both fit. He is 6'6" and 350 lbs. Now that it's warmer outside a walk after dinner is a nice way to calm down too.
It is getting through the dinner hour that is the most trouble, since I can't just physically walk away. I don't crave drink earlier in the day and will turn it down on the rare occasion that it is offered at lunchtime. I don't have wine in the house right now and that is helping a lot, since the other things we have just don't sound as appealing.
Earplugs (or earbuds) are a lifesaver for me in all sorts of too-noisy/too-stimulating situations.
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20 days AF today. I feel great. That is all.
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20 days AF today. I feel great. That is all.
Congrats!
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20 days AF today. I feel great. That is all.
I am about the same and also feeling good. I've been following along with the Naked Mind 30 day Alcohol Experiment, learning a lot and changing my mindset. It's been far easier than my Dry January that I white knuckled through. Knowledge is power!
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Finally made it through the entire thread. Thanks to recommendations here I read This Naked Mind and have started her 30-day challenge. But I'm running into a lot of issues since TNM didn't resonate very much with me. In my younger years I did drink socially, but in the last decade not at all. I mostly just drink at home, by myself, which in and of itself should be a red flag. Early on it was just enjoying a single glass of wine with candles and a nice bubble bath, but progressed to more wine and less of the other relaxation rituals. This means that many of the things recommended by Annie Grace don't make any sense to me, so I'm still trying to figure out how this will work with my own twisted brain.
Hopefully the 30-day Alcohol Experiment will bring me more clarity. I'm also eager to hear from others for whom drinking with friends or in other social situations is not the trigger. In addition, I'm already retired so the work-to-home transition ritual (which wasn't big before) is nonexistent now.
I did the first journaling exercise on "Why/Why Not" to drink and the Why's are puzzling, I already know that alcohol tastes like crap, for me the "Why's" were a lot of things like "To numb my senses" and "Because nobody's going to tell me what to do!" LOL, clearly illogical and immature, so hoping to get to a deeper level. I think in a couple weeks I may re-read The Naked Mind again to see if it makes more sense.
I did drink socially, but that was not my primary trigger. My primary trigger was literally everything about my at-home evening routine. Drinking was absolutely embedded in that routine for 20 years. I did read TNM, but it didn't stick in my head much except for the part about waking up in the middle of the night with anxiety. The Alcohol Experiment totally worked for me (although of course not every lesson will resonate with every person, and the stuff about social pressure/people pleasing, dating, etc. didn't apply to me). Other lessons were perfect for me. Actually DOING the work/journaling stuff was crucial for me to get the most out of it, so I strongly recommend trying to do that. So ask me (us) anything specific you want, re: being at 'at home/destress/numb out/relaxation' drinker.
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Finally made it through the entire thread. Thanks to recommendations here I read This Naked Mind and have started her 30-day challenge. But I'm running into a lot of issues since TNM didn't resonate very much with me. In my younger years I did drink socially, but in the last decade not at all. I mostly just drink at home, by myself, which in and of itself should be a red flag. Early on it was just enjoying a single glass of wine with candles and a nice bubble bath, but progressed to more wine and less of the other relaxation rituals. This means that many of the things recommended by Annie Grace don't make any sense to me, so I'm still trying to figure out how this will work with my own twisted brain.
Hopefully the 30-day Alcohol Experiment will bring me more clarity. I'm also eager to hear from others for whom drinking with friends or in other social situations is not the trigger. In addition, I'm already retired so the work-to-home transition ritual (which wasn't big before) is nonexistent now.
I did the first journaling exercise on "Why/Why Not" to drink and the Why's are puzzling, I already know that alcohol tastes like crap, for me the "Why's" were a lot of things like "To numb my senses" and "Because nobody's going to tell me what to do!" LOL, clearly illogical and immature, so hoping to get to a deeper level. I think in a couple weeks I may re-read The Naked Mind again to see if it makes more sense.
I was one of those people who wasn't into social drinking and didn't find that as a trigger. Most of my favorite times drinking were in the house by myself, drinking some beers and blasting tunes. I probably would have agreed with the "to numb my senses" reasoning - I think has stuck with me the most, aside from being AF for 4-ish months and just liking how it is, was thinking clearly about and learning more of the negative effects of alcohol. Like, yeah don't tell me what to do society, but also I don't want to give myself cancer by drinking a known carcinogen every night. Stick it to the man! But not when it involves dry-heaving the next morning. That's my take on your post, at least.
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I was one of those people who wasn't into social drinking and didn't find that as a trigger. Most of my favorite times drinking were in the house by myself, drinking some beers and blasting tunes. I probably would have agreed with the "to numb my senses" reasoning - I think has stuck with me the most, aside from being AF for 4-ish months and just liking how it is, was thinking clearly about and learning more of the negative effects of alcohol. Like, yeah don't tell me what to do society, but also I don't want to give myself cancer by drinking a known carcinogen every night. Stick it to the man! But not when it involves dry-heaving the next morning. That's my take on your post, at least.
Thanks @jps. I'm really struggling with the "I do this all by myself so who cares?" issue. Luckily the dry heaves have been few and far between, more frequent when I was working and had them due to migraines. Come to think of it, having had years of migraines and the nausea that came with those, maybe that's hindering my recovery. I mean, the worst binge-related heaving was nothing compared to what I went through for most of my life. Hmmmmm....
Ha! Same. I've thrown up as a result of drinking only 2 or 3 times. I've thrown up from migraines probably upwards of several dozen times (and counting).
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Finally made it through the entire thread. Thanks to recommendations here I read This Naked Mind and have started her 30-day challenge. But I'm running into a lot of issues since TNM didn't resonate very much with me. In my younger years I did drink socially, but in the last decade not at all. I mostly just drink at home, by myself, which in and of itself should be a red flag. Early on it was just enjoying a single glass of wine with candles and a nice bubble bath, but progressed to more wine and less of the other relaxation rituals. This means that many of the things recommended by Annie Grace don't make any sense to me, so I'm still trying to figure out how this will work with my own twisted brain.
Hopefully the 30-day Alcohol Experiment will bring me more clarity. I'm also eager to hear from others for whom drinking with friends or in other social situations is not the trigger. In addition, I'm already retired so the work-to-home transition ritual (which wasn't big before) is nonexistent now.
I did the first journaling exercise on "Why/Why Not" to drink and the Why's are puzzling, I already know that alcohol tastes like crap, for me the "Why's" were a lot of things like "To numb my senses" and "Because nobody's going to tell me what to do!" LOL, clearly illogical and immature, so hoping to get to a deeper level. I think in a couple weeks I may re-read The Naked Mind again to see if it makes more sense.
The Naked Mind didn't overly resonate with me, but it lead me to Alan Carr's Easy Way, which definitely resonated. Although, a lot of his points are similar, but I found them quite different.
The 30 day experiment felt kind of hokey and stupid at first, but over time started dredging up some real underlying feelings, which really helped.
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Ha! Same. I've thrown up as a result of drinking only 2 or 3 times. I've thrown up from migraines probably upwards of several dozen times (and counting).
I dunno if that has affected my attitudes about drinking or not. My migraines started in elementary school, I've been well-acquainted with the porcelain god for many decades. Literally remember touring my current house with the realtor and checking whether I had enough room in front of the commode to be comfortable. Thankfully they stopped when I ceased working, but I often wonder how that particular affliction affected my view of my self. May be relevant to alcohol, may not be.
I relate SO MUCH to this. It's an issue when I travel (several nights sitting upright against hotel bathroom walls trying not to move btwn pukes) and esp if I'm staying at anyone's house that has too few bathrooms or available bathrooms too close to the hosts bedroom (ugh).
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I’m at 100+ days with no booze. I think I’m at the replacement stage so now when I want to relax or reward myself I drink these help seltzer drinks. They are $4 a can ouch! Haha. Not very Mustachian. I wish I could get the ones with THC in them.
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So last night was the planned exception I had, and part of me wishes I hadn't drank because I feel awful today, but I do think I learned a lot. I actually noticed a couple times that I didn't really like how it tasted, but I kept drinking anyways. Also, the company accidentally sent us more drinks than we expected and I just kept drinking beyond what I had planned. So I'm thinking I may not be capable of drinking moderately like I keep telling myself I can do. I see other people just have one or two drinks and I tell myself I can do that too, but I almost never do. And I did wake up in the middle of the night like Annie talks about, so I'm pretty tired today. It was a fun night, but that probably would've been the same without the alcohol. Some of my friends didn't get the cocktails and just had ice cream instead, and they seemed to have fun.
So I don't know what to do next. I'm thinking of restarting my month without alcohol so I actually go a whole month without drinking at all. I think I'm having a hard time envisioning my life completely alcohol free. There's definitely some social situations where I'm expected to drink that I'd have to learn to deal with.
I really appreciate all the advice, support and encouragement I've received here, and it definitely helped me stick to my goal. I did notice this past week was easier to not drink, despite a lot of stressful situations cropping up. I don't know; maybe it's worth it to try to completely quit drinking?
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So last night was the planned exception I had, and part of me wishes I hadn't drank because I feel awful today, but I do think I learned a lot. I actually noticed a couple times that I didn't really like how it tasted, but I kept drinking anyways. Also, the company accidentally sent us more drinks than we expected and I just kept drinking beyond what I had planned. So I'm thinking I may not be capable of drinking moderately like I keep telling myself I can do. I see other people just have one or two drinks and I tell myself I can do that too, but I almost never do. And I did wake up in the middle of the night like Annie talks about, so I'm pretty tired today. It was a fun night, but that probably would've been the same without the alcohol. Some of my friends didn't get the cocktails and just had ice cream instead, and they seemed to have fun.
So I don't know what to do next. I'm thinking of restarting my month without alcohol so I actually go a whole month without drinking at all. I think I'm having a hard time envisioning my life completely alcohol free. There's definitely some social situations where I'm expected to drink that I'd have to learn to deal with.
I really appreciate all the advice, support and encouragement I've received here, and it definitely helped me stick to my goal. I did notice this past week was easier to not drink, despite a lot of stressful situations cropping up. I don't know; maybe it's worth it to try to completely quit drinking?
Don't worry about envisioning your life alcohol free, just envision your life where you have whatever relationship with alcohol that's best for you. Most of us only decide to be alcohol free because we get to a point where we really, really don't want to drink again, not because we have to do this.
At this point, you don't have a healthy relationship with drinking. Okay, fine, take your time. You can't totally reconstruct your neural patterns with alcohol in just a couple of weeks.
Try doing the full 30 days, then go from there. Nothing says you need to commit to forever. I'm not committed to forever, I'll start drinking again the moment I truly feel I want alcohol back in my life. I just don't see that as a likely thing to happen because I'm no longer interested in it.
I used to drink wine every day and I used to wear high heels every day. Now that I wear running shoes and don't drink, my body is so much happier. I don't avoid high heels because they're bad, or I feel like I can't. I avoid them because they hurt and I don't find them fun anymore. Same with booze. I basically grew out of it during my sober time.
As long as you still drink, you can't grow out of it.
So give yourself a sober period to figure out how much it really matters to you. If it does really matter to have alcohol in your future, then take a decent stretch sober to recalibrate your brain. If you're serious about becoming a moderate drinker, you will need to be sober for longer than 30 days to change your neural patterns. It's very doable though, so don't feel like this is all or nothing.
It's not about quitting, it's about regaining control over your own habits.
DH drank as much as I did and he still drinks occasionally. He can now easily have 2 drinks every once in awhile and has no issues. I probably could too, but I don't want to.
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I have 3 graduate degrees in social work, psychology and vocational rehabilitation and research has shown that most people that drink too much actually can’t be moderate drinkers. They can for awhile and then they end up back on the hamster wheel. I haven’t looked at the research lately. I joined the naked mind forum and everyone that has tried has failed. It doesn’t mean you are a alcoholic but it does mean you are a substance abuser. People without problems can easily change their relationship with alcohol, don’t spend lots of time thinking and planning around it. The pull to believe you can drink moderately is strong because you are in denial. If high heels hurt my feet I wouldn’t keep wearing them yet that’s exactly what people with drinking problems do. I didn’t drink for most of my life and when I went back I drank moderately for about a year and then it became a daily thing. Back in the 50’s researchers tried to make moderate drinkers out of recovered alcoholics and turned them all into alcoholics again. Your brain needs time to heal so you can make good decisions.
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I have 3 graduate degrees in social work, psychology and vocational rehabilitation and research has shown that most people that drink too much actually can’t be moderate drinkers. They can for awhile and then they end up back on the hamster wheel. I haven’t looked at the research lately. I joined the naked mind forum and everyone that has tried has failed. It doesn’t mean you are a alcoholic but it does mean you are a substance abuser. People without problems can easily change their relationship with alcohol, don’t spend lots of time thinking and planning around it. The pull to believe you can drink moderately is strong because you are in denial. If high heels hurt my feet I wouldn’t keep wearing them yet that’s exactly what people with drinking problems do. I didn’t drink for most of my life and when I went back I drank moderately for about a year and then it became a daily thing. Back in the 50’s researchers tried to make moderate drinkers out of recovered alcoholics and turned them all into alcoholics again. Your brain needs time to heal so you can make good decisions.
Yeah, it does seem that once people start drinking in a dysfunctional way, it often seems to literally re-wire one's brain to automate that behavior. I'm not sure that's 'fixable' after a certain point. This seems to be a feature, not a bug, of how the brain functions. We automate all sorts of helpful skills and behaviors (like driving) and I don't think the pertinent software 'dismantles' once we stop doing [insert the automatic activity]. I presume the same thing happens with unhelpful skills and behaviors.
The last time I rode a bike was in high school, sophomore year, right before my parents divorced and we moved to a city duplex, where my bike was promptly stolen. A couple weeks ago, I got on a bike for the first time in more than 30 years. My first ride (half hour) was quite shaky, but it wasn't like I had forgotten how to ride a bike...I was just unused to managing this particular bike (which is a much taller heavier trail bike than my standard no-gears, short, light kids' bike from the 1980s). My second ride was much more confident. I plan to ride today, and I suspect it will soon feel almost like the last time I happened to ride my childhood bike in high school. No reason to think that the counter-productive automated behavior related to drinking will be any different...presumably I could go 20 years not drinking, but if I restarted drinking a cocktail with dinner every couple of days, soon ye old software would light right up and I would start wanting to drink every single day, and more as my tolerance rose.
Having said that, ability to moderate probably also depends somewhat on what each individual means by 'moderation'. I HAVE been able to moderate my intake since I quit 20 years of daily drinking, if one defines my VERY occasional drinks over the past 2 years as 'moderating'. Some people wouldn't, and would only define 'moderating' as being able to drink one drink every day, or a couple of drinks only on weekends, or whatever other variant they are personally interested in doing. What I think of as moderating my drinking is maybe a couple of drinks every few months, not 'drinking on weekends' (which would likely start propelling me back into problematic habits) or 'drinking with dinner but not binging' (by those standards I moderated my entire drinking life, and it was definitely still problematic behavior). Regardless, I keep leaning away from even my version of moderate drinking and toward remaining alcohol free b/c I simply came to the realization that there was not much reason TO DRINK. The reasons that I thought I needed my cocktail hour drinks for were false, and a product of my brain wiring being changed by drinking regularly.
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I have 3 graduate degrees in social work, psychology and vocational rehabilitation and research has shown that most people that drink too much actually can’t be moderate drinkers. They can for awhile and then they end up back on the hamster wheel. I haven’t looked at the research lately. I joined the naked mind forum and everyone that has tried has failed. It doesn’t mean you are a alcoholic but it does mean you are a substance abuser. People without problems can easily change their relationship with alcohol, don’t spend lots of time thinking and planning around it. The pull to believe you can drink moderately is strong because you are in denial. If high heels hurt my feet I wouldn’t keep wearing them yet that’s exactly what people with drinking problems do. I didn’t drink for most of my life and when I went back I drank moderately for about a year and then it became a daily thing. Back in the 50’s researchers tried to make moderate drinkers out of recovered alcoholics and turned them all into alcoholics again. Your brain needs time to heal so you can make good decisions.
Yeah, it does seem that once people start drinking in a dysfunctional way, it often seems to literally re-wire one's brain to automate that behavior. I'm not sure that's 'fixable' after a certain point. This seems to be a feature, not a bug, of how the brain functions. We automate all sorts of helpful skills and behaviors (like driving) and I don't think the pertinent software 'dismantles' once we stop doing [insert the automatic activity]. I presume the same thing happens with unhelpful skills and behaviors.
The last time I rode a bike was in high school, sophomore year, right before my parents divorced and we moved to a city duplex, where my bike was promptly stolen. A couple weeks ago, I got on a bike for the first time in more than 30 years. My first ride (half hour) was quite shaky, but it wasn't like I had forgotten how to ride a bike...I was just unused to managing this particular bike (which is a much taller heavier trail bike than my standard no-gears, short, light kids' bike from the 1980s). My second ride was much more confident. I plan to ride today, and I suspect it will soon feel almost like the last time I happened to ride my childhood bike in high school. No reason to think that the counter-productive automated behavior related to drinking will be any different...presumably I could go 20 years not drinking, but if I restarted drinking a cocktail with dinner every couple of days, soon ye old software would light right up and I would start wanting to drink every single day, and more as my tolerance rose.
Having said that, ability to moderate probably also depends somewhat on what each individual means by 'moderation'. I HAVE been able to moderate my intake since I quit 20 years of daily drinking, if one defines my VERY occasional drinks over the past 2 years as 'moderating'. Some people wouldn't, and would only define 'moderating' as being able to drink one drink every day, or a couple of drinks only on weekends, or whatever other variant they are personally interested in doing. What I think of as moderating my drinking is maybe a couple of drinks every few months, not 'drinking on weekends' (which would likely start propelling me back into problematic habits) or 'drinking with dinner but not binging' (by those standards I moderated my entire drinking life, and it was definitely still problematic behavior). Regardless, I keep leaning away from even my version of moderate drinking and toward remaining alcohol free b/c I simply came to the realization that there was not much reason TO DRINK. The reasons that I thought I needed my cocktail hour drinks for were false, and a product of my brain wiring being changed by drinking regularly.
It does rewire your brain, but it's hard to tell where the individual is at with that wiring until they quit for awhile.
As I said, DH and I quit at the same time, and when we drank more than just one or two drinks, he didn't have an off switch and drank much more than I did. I naturally didn't drink a lot because it made me feel awful.
However, when we quit, I had a lot more issues with cravings than he did. He can take it or leave it, and he's fine with a 2 drink limit, so for the last 18 months, he's had maybe 4 or 5 instances of drinking a beer or two and that's it.
I, on the other hand, hated that I had cravings despite not wanting to drink. My wiring is a lot stronger than his for starting to drink, his wiring is a lot stronger than mine for continuing to drink once he's tipsy. So he can moderate no problem as long as he has a hard limit.
There's a bit of a selection bias for people who quit, because most people who can moderate never feel like they need to quit. So most people who feel the need to quit are the people who can't moderate.
That doesn't mean that every person who is drinking more than they want to be needs to quit forever and can never moderate.
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I agree with all of that. DH and I had similar responses to what you describe.
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@TheFrenchCat I wobbled back and forth on drinking/not drinking for a long time* and eventually I decided that a)I didn't need to work out whether or not I Had A Problem to decide to take a break and b)it didn't have to be forever but it did need to be a substantial enough time to get out of the habitual thinking/actions. My husband still drinks but it's a lot less now and he's almost never having more than a second beer because now he notices the difference in outcome between 2 and 3 beers the next day.
*Like recently I found an old ~livejournal~ post of mine where I am talking about it and gosh it was exactly the same self-talk I was still going through when I did stop in 2018. I eventually realised that someone who could sustain a healthy relationship with alcohol just didn't have the level of internal fretting that I did.
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Malcat and Wenchsenior, it’s interesting to hear about the different experiences of people. I agree it’s complicated and definitely not one size fits all. It’s been almost 9 months and I had thoughts yesterday about drinking despite not thinking about it for months. It’s weird but obviously still has a grip.
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Malcat and Wenchsenior, it’s interesting to hear about the different experiences of people. I agree it’s complicated and definitely not one size fits all. It’s been almost 9 months and I had thoughts yesterday about drinking despite not thinking about it for months. It’s weird but obviously still has a grip.
Oh, I still get cravings sometimes, even though I objectively know that I don't even like drinking. It's crazy that cravings have absolutely nothing to do with what you want or don't want, they're a totally separate cognitive experience. Your brain doesn't like the sensation of the craving, so it makes up a narrative of "oh, wouldn't a glass of wine be so nice right now?" to try and make the craving go away.
Cravings ARE NOT a desire to drink. Really understanding that was critical for me.
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Malcat and Wenchsenior, it’s interesting to hear about the different experiences of people. I agree it’s complicated and definitely not one size fits all. It’s been almost 9 months and I had thoughts yesterday about drinking despite not thinking about it for months. It’s weird but obviously still has a grip.
Oh, I still get cravings sometimes, even though I objectively know that I don't even like drinking. It's crazy that cravings have absolutely nothing to do with what you want or don't want, they're a totally separate cognitive experience. Your brain doesn't like the sensation of the craving, so it makes up a narrative of "oh, wouldn't a glass of wine be so nice right now?" to try and make the craving go away.
Cravings ARE NOT a desire to drink. Really understanding that was critical for me.
Same. I get mild 'pings' several nights per week (b/c my evening routine was my primary trigger) and more intense cravings several times per year (usually in response to unexpected stress that coincides with the end of the day and/or low blood sugar). If I drank with any regularity, or in actual response to any of these triggers, I expect I'd also be one of the people that starts to slip down the slope again.
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Malcat and Wenchsenior, it’s interesting to hear about the different experiences of people. I agree it’s complicated and definitely not one size fits all. It’s been almost 9 months and I had thoughts yesterday about drinking despite not thinking about it for months. It’s weird but obviously still has a grip.
Oh, I still get cravings sometimes, even though I objectively know that I don't even like drinking. It's crazy that cravings have absolutely nothing to do with what you want or don't want, they're a totally separate cognitive experience. Your brain doesn't like the sensation of the craving, so it makes up a narrative of "oh, wouldn't a glass of wine be so nice right now?" to try and make the craving go away.
Cravings ARE NOT a desire to drink. Really understanding that was critical for me.
This is pretty mind blowing for me. I don't think I ever would have thought of that on my own, but it makes so much sense. And bonus, I kind of already know how to deal with that, since my self harm tendencies are pretty much the same, now that I'm thinking about it. My brain will make me think I want to self harm, but I don't actually want to. So I resist it instead of giving in. And as an aside, I don't actually engage in self harm, I just get cravings.
But this is huge for me. If I do ever decide to drink again, I'll make sure it's because I actually want to and not just because I'm having a craving.
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Malcat and Wenchsenior, it’s interesting to hear about the different experiences of people. I agree it’s complicated and definitely not one size fits all. It’s been almost 9 months and I had thoughts yesterday about drinking despite not thinking about it for months. It’s weird but obviously still has a grip.
Oh, I still get cravings sometimes, even though I objectively know that I don't even like drinking. It's crazy that cravings have absolutely nothing to do with what you want or don't want, they're a totally separate cognitive experience. Your brain doesn't like the sensation of the craving, so it makes up a narrative of "oh, wouldn't a glass of wine be so nice right now?" to try and make the craving go away.
Cravings ARE NOT a desire to drink. Really understanding that was critical for me.
This is pretty mind blowing for me. I don't think I ever would have thought of that on my own, but it makes so much sense. And bonus, I kind of already know how to deal with that, since my self harm tendencies are pretty much the same, now that I'm thinking about it. My brain will make me think I want to self harm, but I don't actually want to. So I resist it instead of giving in. And as an aside, I don't actually engage in self harm, I just get cravings.
But this is huge for me. If I do ever decide to drink again, I'll make sure it's because I actually want to and not just because I'm having a craving.
Mind cannon. It hadn't occurred to me before how the cravings to self-harm and drink essentially feel the same to me, and that even though I didn't want to engage in either, giving in seemed to be the easiest way to get the discomfort of the craving to go away. Often giving in to the craving to drink led me to also give in to the craving to self-harm, but now that I've pre-decided not to drink, I'm not nearly so tempted to harm myself. I attribute that to better mental clarity and the compounding effect of positive decisions rather than negative ones.
It's part of the process of learning to trust your own word.
Those awful self destructive impulses like self harm and self medication take over when your mind knows that your word is no good. When you say to yourself that you don't want to drink or you don't want to self harm, and then you do it anyway, your subconscious learns that your conscious mind has no real say over anything, no authority.
When your conscious mind loses its credibility, you live in a state of constant psychological insecurity, because it means that there's no real "grown up" around to run the show. Your mind and behaviour end up like a classroom when a weak substitute teacher is failing to be in charge.
Your mind is kind of like an unruly collection of drives, and the conscious mind is supposed to be in charge. So if the conscious mind fails to do so over and over and over again, then all hell breaks loose in terms of behaviour.
Now that I've been sober for so long, my conscious mind is now respected as being in control. When I tell myself I'm going to do something, I bloody do it. I am impeccable in my word to myself, and my subconscious mind knows that. There's no weaseling in or out of things anymore.
Whereas back when I was a daily drinker and I would say "I am not going to drink this week" and then give in and reach for the wine that very evening, it made it easier to betray myself in any other issue as well.
I just didn't take myself as seriously as I do now. Now I know I mean business when I commit to something internally. My conscious mind has gone from weak substitute teacher to school principal.
I'm in charge in this brain. The subconscious kids can sit the hell down and politely contribute, but they don't get to run the show.
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Damn, @Malcat, I’ve read plenty of awesome comments written by you but this one may just be the most meaningful to me so far. Or, at least, in the top 5 of all the posts from you from I’ve read.
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Damn, @Malcat, I’ve read plenty of awesome comments written by you but this one may just be the most meaningful to me so far. Or, at least, in the top 5 of all the posts from you from I’ve read.
Ooh neat-o. I like when people catch my wave.
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This is going to sound dumb - but what do you guys consider to be the difference between a craving and something sounding good?
I think I am having a hard time gauging my relationship with alcohol because I can't tell the difference? Right now I'm sort of operating at "if it sounds good, I shouldn't have it."
FWIW - I didn't have pregnancy cravings like how people describe them, either. I don't know that I've ever really gone out of my way for a certain food or drink?
I do have a couple of foods that I can't stop if they are in the house - so I don't keep them in the house and only buy them once or twice a year.
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This is going to sound dumb - but what do you guys consider to be the difference between a craving and something sounding good?
I think I am having a hard time gauging my relationship with alcohol because I can't tell the difference? Right now I'm sort of operating at "if it sounds good, I shouldn't have it."
FWIW - I didn't have pregnancy cravings like how people describe them, either. I don't know that I've ever really gone out of my way for a certain food or drink?
I do have a couple of foods that I can't stop if they are in the house - so I don't keep them in the house and only buy them once or twice a year.
It's very simple.
A craving is an urge to do something you cognitively know you don't want to.
So anything that you feel compelled to do despite not wanting to would be driven by a craving: drinking, over eating, nail biting, self harm, gambling, whatever.
So if you've ever tried to not do something and done it anyway, then that was driven by a craving, not a genuine desire to do it.
So yeah, not being able to stop eating a certain snack is giving in to a craving. Drinking at 5 pm even though you told yourself you wanted to take that day off of drinking would be driven by a craving, etc, etc.
The craving is a negative, uncomfortable feeling. The "a drink would be nice" is your mind trying to offer a solution to the discomfort.
For me, the difference is so clear because I actively can't stand the taste of alcohol anymore. So I know I wouldn't enjoy it if I tried to drink it, but that doesn't stop the occasional craving.
That's where having a period sober really helps clarify things. If you've already decided, firmly that you are not drinking under any circumstances for something like 30 days, then you know full well that every urge is a craving and not real desire to drink because you are certain that you do not want to.
Until you can tell the difference, you will struggle to be in control of it.
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Someone will probably have a definition, but here's my analogy: Cheesecake sounds good. If I had some in the house, I'd eat it right up. I wouldn't say that I have a craving for it though, because it's easy to put out of my mind and I'm not willing to go to unreasonable lengths to get it. When I drank though, I'd pay delivery costs for a single bottle, order it by the case, go into a real store (meaning that I'd deal with my agoraphobia just to get a fix). I like cheesecake, but I'm not going to go to such (reasonable to other people, unreasonable to me) lengths. (As a jokey aside, agoraphobia is a terrific money saver!)
That's really just a matter of degree though.
You could also have a craving for cheesecake. For example, if you are determined to lose weight and have decided that you will not exceed a certain calorie amount and you've promised yourself you will only have one piece of cake, but for the rest of the evening, you keep thinking of the cheesecake in the fridge, keep picturing eating it, even though you don't want to, that would be a craving.
You don't have to be an unreasonable drinker to be addicted. I don't think I ever did anything unreasonable for the sake of alcohol, but I was still addicted. My addiction was just mild. Still, I frequently drank when I knew that I didn't want to. Like if I had wine after work two days in a row, I would almost always promise myself that I wouldn't on the third night. And yet, I rarely followed through.
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Thanks guys :)
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Someone will probably have a definition, but here's my analogy: Cheesecake sounds good. If I had some in the house, I'd eat it right up. I wouldn't say that I have a craving for it though, because it's easy to put out of my mind and I'm not willing to go to unreasonable lengths to get it. When I drank though, I'd pay delivery costs for a single bottle, order it by the case, go into a real store (meaning that I'd deal with my agoraphobia just to get a fix). I like cheesecake, but I'm not going to go to such (reasonable to other people, unreasonable to me) lengths. (As a jokey aside, agoraphobia is a terrific money saver!)
That's really just a matter of degree though.
You could also have a craving for cheesecake. For example, if you are determined to lose weight and have decided that you will not exceed a certain calorie amount and you've promised yourself you will only have one piece of cake, but for the rest of the evening, you keep thinking of the cheesecake in the fridge, keep picturing eating it, even though you don't want to, that would be a craving.
You don't have to be an unreasonable drinker to be addicted. I don't think I ever did anything unreasonable for the sake of alcohol, but I was still addicted. My addiction was just mild. Still, I frequently drank when I knew that I didn't want to. Like if I had wine after work two days in a row, I would almost always promise myself that I wouldn't on the third night. And yet, I rarely followed through.
This is really interesting. I wonder if dieting is somehow different from other addictions. As someone who had an eating disorder, I find food cravings really psychologically complicated. As soon as something is off limits, I would crave it even more. I think the very fact that I am setting these limits creates the cravings.
The only approach that works for me in terms of eating, and ED recovery, is to not set any limits, but rather use my body and senses in the moment to determine what I really want. Similar to how Annie Grace talks about really paying attention to the actual experience of drinking, to find out if we really actually enjoy it as much as our brain tells us we enjoy it. For me, eating a whole chocolate cake now would be a bad experience, because I would feel physically awful. If my mind knows the experience will be awful, and I want some cake, I'll eat a slice, enjoy it, and that's that. In the past, when I was "dieting" and chocolate cake was off limits, if there was a chocolate cake around, even knowing that it will make me feel bad, I would eat the whole thing, because there was still a part of me that wanted to rebel against the limit, regardless of how the cake made me feel. So for me, I find external, pre-determined limits (like "I won't eat chocolate cake for a month") mess with my brain and create the addictive behaviour, while paying attention to what my body actually needs and wants in the moment allows me to make wiser decisions.
This might be an interesting approach for some people - not my idea, but inspired by Intuitive Eating and the work of Evelyn Tribole. In the book, she recommends taking the "problem food" (let's say it's chocolate cake) and instead of avoiding it, have LOTS of it in the house. No limits. It will mess with the diet-mind to do this, and yes, I might eat the whole cake, or 2 cakes! But once my mind calms down about the "bad foods" and the self-imposed restrictions go away, then the cake will stop being a mental problem. I may even realize I don't actually like cake at all, but that the off-limits attributes I had ascribed to it had created the desire for it!
I'm probably in the moderate drinker camp now, verging on AF. I never had a problem though with alcohol. I've tried going AF, and have followed the Annie Grace experiment, just to try to be healthier. I did go back to drinking moderately after being AF for a few months. Nowadays I don't really set rules for this either, but when I ask myself, do I really want a drink right now? 99% of the time the answer is no. I might have 1 drink per month, maybe eventually I will go down to zero, but I think if I try to limit it in advance, it won't really be a mindful, in the moment decision based on how I'm feeling. [BTW - I fully appreciate alcohol is an addictive substance, in a different way than sugar is, though arguably sugar is addictive too. I can see that getting sober might take some more super-ego type of mental parental-like restriction at first. But maybe a mindful, in the moment approach would work for these types of cravings for some people too?]
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While alcohol/drugs and sugar trigger some of the same neurotransmitters and same part of the brain in many people, there are a number of variables at play. There is variability in response to different chemicals (sugar vs heroin) and behaviors (sexual gratification vs gambling) across the population, so while the same general principles of biochemistry and neurology do apply, not every individual responds to the same stimuli with the same intensity, likely b/c of genetic variation, social conditioning, and one's history of personal behavior (e.g., whether one ever formed a habit of relying on food or booze to fill emotional needs).
Personally, I am unsure if cravings exist on a continuum, or if there is actually a particular brain process that is unique. What I think of as cravings feels quite distinct from simply 'wanting to eat/do' something that has the potential to be harmful or 'addictive'. For example, I will sometimes mindlessly overeat or eat more sugar than I meant to out of 1) lack of attention; 2) boredom; 3) succumbing to impulse when someone offers me dessert; 4) b/c there's a large amount in the house, etc. But that does not feel at ALL the same to me as when I crave alcohol...food has never triggered that kind of feeling in me except as a small child before my brain fully developed. If I 'catch' myself over-reating sugar, it's relatively easy to stop myself from eating it even if part of me kind of wants to eat it. And if I really prioritize not eating it, I am not constantly bothered by thoughts of it or urges to eat it.
Whereas, what I think of as 'cravings' for booze seem very intrusive...constantly pushing into my head when I've already decided not to drink. They are distracting and accompanied by a sort of internal voice that wants to rationalize why drinking would be ok, despite my resolution not to. They create (or used to) a palpable sense of anxiety/anger/grief at the prospect of denial.
That's really different from my experience with any of the other things that are classified as addictive, with the exception of sex. I can remember a similar fixation on sex with my SO during the early, charged up days of a romantic relationship...constant distraction, real anxiety/grief/anger if we had to be apart and couldn't have sex frequently, etc.
In addition, cravings for booze came with a feeling of my 'logical risk-averse' brain literally going offline...like I had trouble actually remembering all the reasons I'd told myself not to drink. For a while I started carrying a list with me, so I could pull it out during a craving, but then it would be like a switch had flipped in my brain and, even looking at the list, I had trouble mustering up any emotional reasons to abide by it. I had similar feelings about sex early in a relationship...my emotional brain didn't care if it was 'risky' (missing class, in public, skipping work, etc.) b/c the desire seemed to just shut down the part of my brain that would weigh consequences. (This is one big reason that people make bad decisions about birth control even though they absolutely plan to use birth control). True story; when my husband and I were first having sex after we met in college, his brain got so scrambled that he actually totally forgot he was even enrolled in one particular class and didn't go for about 3 weeks! Like one of those stress nightmares come to life. The crazy thing was, he was in his late 20s, an exemplary grad student at the time, with a long history of being super responsible and working in dangerous, high stress conditions under pressure to perform. But it was like he had some form of insanity during the early weeks we were together. He only remembered his class b/c the professor passed him in the hall one day and asked where the fuck he'd been for the past month.
There is in fact neurological evidence that cravings of that intensity actually DO 'turn off your logical brain'. I was just recently reading about how superactivation of the nucleus accumbens acts like a circuit-breaker that turns down/off function of the pre-frontal cortex (which is the part of the brain that weighs risk and self-regulates behaviors).
So that would explain all the stupid shit we are at risk of doing when in the grips of a neurotransmitter binge in our nucleus accumbens. Whether it's sex or drugs or gambling or sugar or internet or shopping or what have you that really lights up the nucleus accumbens...I think that's more of an individual thing.
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Malcat and Wenchsenior, it’s interesting to hear about the different experiences of people. I agree it’s complicated and definitely not one size fits all. It’s been almost 9 months and I had thoughts yesterday about drinking despite not thinking about it for months. It’s weird but obviously still has a grip.
Oh, I still get cravings sometimes, even though I objectively know that I don't even like drinking. It's crazy that cravings have absolutely nothing to do with what you want or don't want, they're a totally separate cognitive experience. Your brain doesn't like the sensation of the craving, so it makes up a narrative of "oh, wouldn't a glass of wine be so nice right now?" to try and make the craving go away.
Cravings ARE NOT a desire to drink. Really understanding that was critical for me.
This is pretty mind blowing for me. I don't think I ever would have thought of that on my own, but it makes so much sense. And bonus, I kind of already know how to deal with that, since my self harm tendencies are pretty much the same, now that I'm thinking about it. My brain will make me think I want to self harm, but I don't actually want to. So I resist it instead of giving in. And as an aside, I don't actually engage in self harm, I just get cravings.
But this is huge for me. If I do ever decide to drink again, I'll make sure it's because I actually want to and not just because I'm having a craving.
Mind cannon. It hadn't occurred to me before how the cravings to self-harm and drink essentially feel the same to me, and that even though I didn't want to engage in either, giving in seemed to be the easiest way to get the discomfort of the craving to go away. Often giving in to the craving to drink led me to also give in to the craving to self-harm, but now that I've pre-decided not to drink, I'm not nearly so tempted to harm myself. I attribute that to better mental clarity and the compounding effect of positive decisions rather than negative ones.
It's part of the process of learning to trust your own word.
Those awful self destructive impulses like self harm and self medication take over when your mind knows that your word is no good. When you say to yourself that you don't want to drink or you don't want to self harm, and then you do it anyway, your subconscious learns that your conscious mind has no real say over anything, no authority.
When your conscious mind loses its credibility, you live in a state of constant psychological insecurity, because it means that there's no real "grown up" around to run the show. Your mind and behaviour end up like a classroom when a weak substitute teacher is failing to be in charge.
Your mind is kind of like an unruly collection of drives, and the conscious mind is supposed to be in charge. So if the conscious mind fails to do so over and over and over again, then all hell breaks loose in terms of behaviour.
Now that I've been sober for so long, my conscious mind is now respected as being in control. When I tell myself I'm going to do something, I bloody do it. I am impeccable in my word to myself, and my subconscious mind knows that. There's no weaseling in or out of things anymore.
Whereas back when I was a daily drinker and I would say "I am not going to drink this week" and then give in and reach for the wine that very evening, it made it easier to betray myself in any other issue as well.
I just didn't take myself as seriously as I do now. Now I know I mean business when I commit to something internally. My conscious mind has gone from weak substitute teacher to school principal.
I'm in charge in this brain. The subconscious kids can sit the hell down and politely contribute, but they don't get to run the show.
So I've been having more cravings today after not really having them for a week, and thinking about the bolded is pretty much what stopped me. I don't want to stick to it, but I said I would, so I'm going to. So Thank you @Malcat.
I'm still debating if I want to drink after the end of the first goal or if I want to go for a full month without any alcohol. I've found myself wanting alcohol less, which is good, I think. Though on the downside, I haven't felt as happy as many times. But that might be because I'm not sure my mental health treatment worked this month. I need to not drink for a week before my next treatment, so maybe I'll extend that sober period beyond the treatment for a few weeks to see if I feel happy without alcohol if the treatment works.
I will say, treating this like an experiment plus having the support of this forum makes it a lot easier for me compared to just trying to brute force it with will power.
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Malcat and Wenchsenior, it’s interesting to hear about the different experiences of people. I agree it’s complicated and definitely not one size fits all. It’s been almost 9 months and I had thoughts yesterday about drinking despite not thinking about it for months. It’s weird but obviously still has a grip.
Oh, I still get cravings sometimes, even though I objectively know that I don't even like drinking. It's crazy that cravings have absolutely nothing to do with what you want or don't want, they're a totally separate cognitive experience. Your brain doesn't like the sensation of the craving, so it makes up a narrative of "oh, wouldn't a glass of wine be so nice right now?" to try and make the craving go away.
Cravings ARE NOT a desire to drink. Really understanding that was critical for me.
This is pretty mind blowing for me. I don't think I ever would have thought of that on my own, but it makes so much sense. And bonus, I kind of already know how to deal with that, since my self harm tendencies are pretty much the same, now that I'm thinking about it. My brain will make me think I want to self harm, but I don't actually want to. So I resist it instead of giving in. And as an aside, I don't actually engage in self harm, I just get cravings.
But this is huge for me. If I do ever decide to drink again, I'll make sure it's because I actually want to and not just because I'm having a craving.
Mind cannon. It hadn't occurred to me before how the cravings to self-harm and drink essentially feel the same to me, and that even though I didn't want to engage in either, giving in seemed to be the easiest way to get the discomfort of the craving to go away. Often giving in to the craving to drink led me to also give in to the craving to self-harm, but now that I've pre-decided not to drink, I'm not nearly so tempted to harm myself. I attribute that to better mental clarity and the compounding effect of positive decisions rather than negative ones.
It's part of the process of learning to trust your own word.
Those awful self destructive impulses like self harm and self medication take over when your mind knows that your word is no good. When you say to yourself that you don't want to drink or you don't want to self harm, and then you do it anyway, your subconscious learns that your conscious mind has no real say over anything, no authority.
When your conscious mind loses its credibility, you live in a state of constant psychological insecurity, because it means that there's no real "grown up" around to run the show. Your mind and behaviour end up like a classroom when a weak substitute teacher is failing to be in charge.
Your mind is kind of like an unruly collection of drives, and the conscious mind is supposed to be in charge. So if the conscious mind fails to do so over and over and over again, then all hell breaks loose in terms of behaviour.
Now that I've been sober for so long, my conscious mind is now respected as being in control. When I tell myself I'm going to do something, I bloody do it. I am impeccable in my word to myself, and my subconscious mind knows that. There's no weaseling in or out of things anymore.
Whereas back when I was a daily drinker and I would say "I am not going to drink this week" and then give in and reach for the wine that very evening, it made it easier to betray myself in any other issue as well.
I just didn't take myself as seriously as I do now. Now I know I mean business when I commit to something internally. My conscious mind has gone from weak substitute teacher to school principal.
I'm in charge in this brain. The subconscious kids can sit the hell down and politely contribute, but they don't get to run the show.
So I've been having more cravings today after not really having them for a week, and thinking about the bolded is pretty much what stopped me. I don't want to stick to it, but I said I would, so I'm going to. So Thank you @Malcat.
I'm still debating if I want to drink after the end of the first goal or if I want to go for a full month without any alcohol. I've found myself wanting alcohol less, which is good, I think. Though on the downside, I haven't felt as happy as many times. But that might be because I'm not sure my mental health treatment worked this month. I need to not drink for a week before my next treatment, so maybe I'll extend that sober period beyond the treatment for a few weeks to see if I feel happy without alcohol if the treatment works.
I will say, treating this like an experiment plus having the support of this forum makes it a lot easier for me compared to just trying to brute force it with will power.
Well, alcohol never made anyone happier, so it's probably really great that you weren't drinking through a down period. Drinking only makes being miserable feel normal, it doesn't make you less miserable.
As for what you are going to decide in the future?
My policy is to never bother trying to decide now for your future self, even if that future self is in the near future. Future you is going to do whatever the fuck they want to do, present you has exactly ZERO control over that.
It's kind of insane when you realize it. Things change you constantly, which means that you have no idea who you will be when it comes time to make a decision. Take responsibility for decisions that need to be make today, and inform yourself about future options, but don't kid yourself that you have any control today over what you are going to do tomorrow.
No one has that power, so don't wear that sense of responsibility.
Take the time during your first goal to just observe and learn. A more informed you will take the responsibility of deciding.
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@Malcat , great post!
I decided this morning as I hit day 28 AF, that I didn’t want to drink right now. That I’m not sure how I’ll feel about it in the future, but that there is no need to decide that NOW. I’ll take it one day at a time, and if I feel I really want a drink, I’ll take it.
But TBH, after reading This Naked Mind and all of this thread, and abstaining for almost a month, I’m feeling that life is just better w/o alcohol.
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@Malcat , great post!
I decided this morning as I hit day 28 AF, that I didn’t want to drink right now. That I’m not sure how I’ll feel about it in the future, but that there is no need to decide that NOW. I’ll take it one day at a time, and if I feel I really want a drink, I’ll take it.
But TBH, after reading This Naked Mind and all of this thread, and abstaining for almost a month, I’m feeling that life is just better w/o alcohol.
Good call.
Try to remember that back when you were drinking, you still decided every single day whether or not you were going to drink. It's not like it ever *wasn't* one day at a time. It's just that the more you drink, the more likely you are to drink that day. The less you drink, the less likely you are to drink that day.
Simple math.
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I had five sips of red wine with dinner on Sunday night. We were given a bottle from my late friend's estate.
We had spent the day taking things from her home that we wanted and her adult children who live on the other side of the country wanted us to have a toast that night as we handed over the keys the moving company. My late friend was a real foodie, before that was a term. She and her husband traveled the world for food and drink experiences. We had many meals with her and it is about a year since she died and with all the emotion of being in her space and going through her treasures.....
DH made a steak (she taught him how to BBQ) and we had a feast from my garden (greens and pickles) and it just seemed right to have a sip. But the one tiny sip tasted really good. So I had four more.
I then had an upset stomach for three days. Was it the wine? Was it the ibuprofen from Friday from the AZ jab? Was it just the AZ jab?
Next time I am just going to smell the wine.
This was one of those times that I was really unpacking memory and tradition and thought it would be fine to dabble a bit. How many more times do I need this lesson?
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I made it to my original goal today! One month without alcohol excepting the one planned cheat day with friends. I feel a little proud of myself and very grateful to everyone here who helped. I may be overconfident in this, but I also feel more in control of my choices. I'm thinking of having a few drinks tomorrow, but if I do I'm setting a limit and I feel like I can actually stick to it. I do still want to do a month with no cheat days, so if I drink tomorrow, I'll start a new month off after that. Also, I lost 3 pounds, which it has been difficult for me to loose weight in the past, though I was also binge eating less. Which might be related to not drinking, I'm not sure.
This was a hard month with other stressors, so I'm glad I was able to not give in to the urge to drink.
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High-fives @TheFrenchCat! Awesome stuff and I think you can rock the whole month with no cheat days. If you do drink tomorrow, try staying present and feel what it is like while you are drinking. It can be a genuinely eye-opening experience.
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Congrats @TheFrenchCat !
Today was Day 33 for me. Ive only lost a couple pounds, but am not really exercising much these days. Hoping some things will open up soon, as vaccination efforts are going well in my area. This will help me become more active again.
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When I drank I definitely ate more.
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High-fives @TheFrenchCat! Awesome stuff and I think you can rock the whole month with no cheat days. If you do drink tomorrow, try staying present and feel what it is like while you are drinking. It can be a genuinely eye-opening experience.
Absolutely. Use it as an opportunity to really observe the experience as objectively as you can.
That said, you will learn more from it if you follow it up with another chunk of sobriety. Because you cannot think objectively about drinking if it's still affecting your system, which takes 10 days.
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I passed the 40 day mark, which was yesterday. At the beginning it was a bit tough to break the routine of having a glass most evenings. But it got easier over time.
Now, I’m debating having a glass of wine this weekend. I’m not sure I want to cut it out of my life forever. But, I do worry about falling back into the rabbit hole, as being alcohol free has been really good for me both mentally and physically. Mind you I haven’t lost much weight. I think it’s because my eating hasn’t been great and I’m less active than I was pre-pandemic.
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Good job LeftA. Obviously up to you whether you have wine, but based on what you posted, why would you at this point?
I'm now 4.5 months into my dry year and I'm now barely giving alcohol a second thought. It is really nice.
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Awesome work @LeftA and @Dee!
LeftA - what is behind the idea to drink this weekend? [This is not saying Never Drink Again, because I think that's a form of black and white thinking that sets up a false dichotomy, but it is helpful to consider what is behind certain thoughts]
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I had a really interesting experience recently, not with alcohol, but with a new prescription.
I have what has so far been untreatable nerve pain. A team of doctors and I have tried pretty much everything, but nothing works. So they started me on amitriptyline, which used to be used as an antidepressant, but is only now used for pain because it has brutal side effects.
I was supposed to work up to a low dose of 50mg, a typical dose is over 100mg. I did one week at 10mg, one week at 20mg, and just a few days at 30mg before the side effects of total exhaustion and dry mouth became unbearable. It was rather pleasant though, I see why they used it as an anti-depressant, plus I slept sooooo well.
Anyhoo, because I had to taper up, I figured I would have to taper off, so I looked into the taper schedule and found out that this shit takes an ENTIRE YEAR to get off of! It's so addictive, and the withdrawal is so intense that they recommend putting the person through an entire year of mild withdrawal rather than risking anything worse than that by getting them off faster.
Well I was like "hell no", and decided I wanted off of the drugs immediately before they built up in my system too much. I had read that being on them for under a month, and at a low dose, full withdrawal should be toooo bad. I had originally been willing to give them a few months to see if my body could adjust, because they did help with the pain, and definitely with sleep.
So I quit cold turkey and just took the two weeks of withdrawal and I'm just ending now.
Holy fuck. That was interesting.
I mean, the withdrawal was pretty horrific, but that's not the interesting part. The interesting part, which is relevant to the discussion here, was that I kept having thoughts like "maybe I could manage on just 10mg, it really did help my sleep" or "are the side effects really worse than the pain? I can handle being exhausted all the time as long as I'm feeling okay"
Justification after justification to restart taking the pills would pop up in my head. It took me a few days to realize that those were actually cravings. I genuinely thought they were my own thoughts, that I was objectively considering going back to the pills because their therapeutic effect was worth the consequences. I thought they were MY thoughts.
I felt kind of horrified when I realized they were addiction thoughts. It was so obvious once I was able to identify them as not belonging to me. They seemed so ridiculous and so obviously addiction cravings once I was able to recognize them as such.
It really drove home how for all of those years of drinking alcohol, I genuinely thought that *I* was the one who loved wine, that *I* was the one thinking "let's go pick up a nice red" or "let's go to the pub" or "a glass of wine right now would be amazing". I believe those were MY THOUGHTS, but it's so obvious now that they weren't.
It's so off putting how easy it is to claim a thought as my own just because it's happening in my own head.
I came VERY close to going back to the 10mg dose because I believed those were my own thoughts, I thought I actually wanted to restart the drug. It was easy not to once I knew it was a craving voice.
It's made me so grateful that I can so easily recognize alcohol cravings as not coming from my true desires, they're coming from the part of my brain that was addicted. I feel bad for my past self for not being able to tell the difference.
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It's crazy... I live with chronic pain as well, though not as severe as yours. I've taken otc painkillers most days since puberty and have in the past 10 years really tried to cut back on them, and I even have addictive thought patterns like what you describe about those. "Well, I'll just take a half a pill in case I start to hurt" or "I should just take this now, even though the pain isn't that bad"...
I can't even imagine what I'd be like if I was on opiates or something super strong like what you describe for more than a few days...
It's just how brains work, that's for sure.
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It's crazy... I live with chronic pain as well, though not as severe as yours. I've taken otc painkillers most days since puberty and have in the past 10 years really tried to cut back on them, and I even have addictive thought patterns like what you describe about those. "Well, I'll just take a half a pill in case I start to hurt" or "I should just take this now, even though the pain isn't that bad"...
I can't even imagine what I'd be like if I was on opiates or something super strong like what you describe for more than a few days...
It's just how brains work, that's for sure.
Oh, I don't fuck with opiates. I will take them for an acute issue, like after surgery, or for a very painful procedure, but never for more than one day. I would rather deal with pain than opiate addiction from regular use. I've actually gotten spectacularly good at just dealing with pain and managing my lifestyle accordingly.
Pain isn't my problem, it's the things I can't do because of my condition that are difficult to deal with, and pain killers don't really increase my function, they just make my lack of function more comfortable. But the side effects or addiction aren't worth it.
Advil/NSAIDs destroyed my stomach, opiates make you have to live as an addict every day (no thanks), same with alcohol (which is actually a pretty good painkiller), and everything else is just laughably ineffective and not worth the side effects.
It was actually amitriptyline that I was on, which used to be used to treat depression, so I thought it wouldn't be a big deal to take, as I've been on antidepressants before. I just had no idea how horrific it was to try and get off of it. I know antidepressants need to be tapered off carefully, but I had no idea that this one needs to be tapered for a whole year, and during that year, the entire time is managed withdrawal.
Still, I would have been willing to stick with it, because it was really helping with sleep and I get bad painsomnia, but the profound sleepiness and sahara dry mouth made my waking hours dreadful. Even then, if the next set of treatments don't work, I would be willing to try it again, just sticking to only 10mg, just for sleeping, because that shit knocked me out and made me wake nice and mellow. And it's so low a dose that if I ever needed off again, the withdrawal would be minor.
So I'm back to just dealing with pain for now. Which once you get used to it is actually a lot easier than trying to escape from it.
The treatments I have coming up though aren't pain management, they're attempts at structural repair. I'm kind of over drugs for pain management.
Pain is a psychological experience. I'm damn good at managing unpleasant psychological experiences.
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Thanks @Dee and @mspym ! Well, I decided to not drink yesterday. I was feeling a bit down, thinking it through I realized it wouldn’t solve anything. In fact, it probably would have made me feel worse. I’m not sure if it was a craving, feeling down, or what, but I’m glad I didn’t give in to it.
@Malcat , maybe it was addiction taking over my thoughts?!
The thing is knowing what I know now kind of makes me conflicted...more specifically knowing the dangers of alcohol and being addicted have taken away the desire to drink vs. How drinking in moderation used to be enjoyable. But, then it was too easy for it to become more frequent as my tolerance (addiction really) became higher...not sure I’m making a lot of sense. But, then again our feelings are not particularly rational...
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Thanks @Dee and @mspym ! Well, I decided to not drink yesterday. I was feeling a bit down, thinking it through I realized it wouldn’t solve anything. In fact, it probably would have made me feel worse. I’m not sure if it was a craving, feeling down, or what, but I’m glad I didn’t give in to it.
@Malcat , maybe it was addiction taking over my thoughts?!
The thing is knowing what I know now kind of makes me conflicted...more specifically knowing the dangers of alcohol and being addicted have taken away the desire to drink vs. How drinking in moderation used to be enjoyable. But, then it was too easy for it to become more frequent as my tolerance (addiction really) became higher...not sure I’m making a lot of sense. But, then again our feelings are not particularly rational...
Yeah, the process of becoming addicted to something is usually enjoyable, that's how you get addicted without noticing, using is really fun for awhile, sometimes a long while, and then it's not so fun and more compulsive. Every addict longs for the days back when using was fun, and wishes they could recapture that time through forced moderation. That's, like, the definitive addict's experience.
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I succumbed to some distorted logic on Friday. I found myself having a panic attack, without meds* and my self-soothing techniques weren't working. Amid my spiral, I remembered that I had kept some beer to use to trap slugs, and drank that. Drinking and mental illness aren't a good mix for me (or likely anyone) as really amplifies my depression, but I was lucky on Friday and it just made me sleepy. Predictably, I felt like garbage Saturday and Sunday. Sometimes I get smug about how easy I found it to stop drinking for fun, but then things like this come up and remind me how my problem was more about using it as a crutch.
*It's not that I had none on hand, only that they were years past expiration and ineffective - a sign that I'm doing a great job of not taking them too often and a crummy job of keeping track of the shelf life of things.
That's some really great self reflection my friend.
I too am having a rough day. I had a few medical things just overload my system today. I don't really get anxiety anymore because I actually burned out my capacity for it, lol. However, I do have days that just overload my capacity.
Back when I was drinking, I would have felt like there was no way to cope with these feelings. I would have tried to chase them away with a few glasses of wine.
Not drinking has really proven to me that even the worst feelings have an end point, they can't last forever, and that time will pass regardless of what you do, so it's inevitable that eventually, you will just feel better. You actually can't avoid it.
Drinking actually reinforced the sense that the feelings would last forever unless I did something to try and fight them, like open a bottle of wine. My brain convinced me that I was so much more powerless against horrible feelings than I really am.
Now, feeling really horrible just doesn't intimidate me. It can't do anything other than stick around for awhile. I can't just make it go away, but I never could. Alcohol never made it go away, it just made it more comfortable to feel miserable.
It's the same way painkillers don't make an injury go away, they just make it more comfortable to be injured. But if you have a fucked up knee and take pain killers to keep running, you just fuck up the knee even more.
That's what booze does. It doesn't actually take away the emotional injury, it just makes it feel more comfortable to be in psychic pain. It actually prolongs the awful feeling and makes the injury worse.
Now, my metaphor is God damn poetic today, because the reason I'm overloaded is because I had a very stressful procedure that has left me in extreme pain, but I can't take painkillers because the inflammation the treatment causes is how it helps me.
I have to sit here with my pain and just wait it out for the next week as it slowly subsides. Likewise, I have to just sit here with my emotional pain, and let it slowly subside, not try and bury it under mind altering chemicals.
At the end of the day, I'm fine. I'm in pain for good reasons that will strengthen me as they heal stronger, both physically and emotionally.
I'm just having a "bad day", and that's fine. Some days are good, some days are bad. If they're bad, they either just need patience to move through, or they need action to resolve things. Either way, alcohol just makes the pain last longer and prevents any positive action towards resolving things.
I hit 500 days sober a few days ago, and I'm really happy to be at a point where alcohol doesn't even cross my mind when I'm feeling emotionally overwhelmed, because I no longer ever feel like I can't handle my own emotions. I just feel them, and they're okay, even when they suck donkey balls.
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Wishing you some speedy healing, @Malcat.
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Malcat, you don't sound like 'a hugger' and I'm not one either, but I wish you a huge virtual hug right now.
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Malcat, you don't sound like 'a hugger' and I'm not one either, but I wish you a huge virtual hug right now.
Lol, I'm definitely a hugger, I find it funny the impressions people get about me based on how I write. I'm actually not a serious person AT ALL. I'm like Julia Sweeney doing a whole light hearted comedy special about having cancer. I talk about serious things, but I myself am almost never serious.
So yeah, I'll take a virtual hug any time.
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I’m sorry to hear your are in pain @Malcat. 500 days is an awesome milestone!
So, on Saturday, my husband asked me to open a bottle of wine to use for sauce. I decided I wanted to have some of the wine as an accompaniment to the meal. I poured myself a glass, and...ended up having 4 sips. In the end, I didn’t find it enjoyable and just stopped there.
This has reaffirmed my desire to stay alcohol free. Apart, from those 4 sips, I’ve gone 45 days without.
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I hit 500 days sober a few days ago, and I'm really happy to be at a point where alcohol doesn't even cross my mind when I'm feeling emotionally overwhelmed, because I no longer ever feel like I can't handle my own emotions. I just feel them, and they're okay, even when they suck donkey balls.
Congrats @Malcat, that's a heckuva long stretch. Sorry about your current pain issues.
Thanks, to be fair though, pain really doesn't bother me unless I'm feeling emotionally off. That day I had to deal with a new doctor who was a bit of a prick, and the human mind isn't built to be okay with letting assholes do painful things to you. It's emotionally destabilizing, so that lowered my emotional shields and made the pain harder to manage. Otherwise, I'm kind of a tank and can take almost anything.
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Hey everyone, thanks for sharing ... am greatly enjoying the updates here. It's cool to be honest with internet strangers. =) I am reaching my 3 month mark, and still very happy with the decision.
The euphoria from the earlier days has leveled off to a more moderate, even-keeled feeling. I've registered a few times where I thought "a drink sounds good" but that was more in response to an environmental trigger, and then upon examination the urge vanished immediately. It helps that I remain completely uninterested in the substance itself and the 10-day withdrawal period afterward... The only really tempting situation was there was a bottle of wine from a region that I have strong positive memories of visiting, wine tasting, etc. Everyone else drank it and I scratched the itch, so to speak, by pulling out my photos from the trip and remembering the experience. Then, the urge to drink it faded away pretty quickly.
I'm not sure if I got the recommendation here or somewhere else, but mindfulness-based stress reduction (book: Full Catastrophe Living) has also been a big help. Not just for drinking but for general happiness. Thus far I have only encountered small life challenges to practice my alternate stress coping mechanisms (exercise, breathing, alternative framing of the issue, spending time with positive people/animals). I feel like I am building my mental strength/resilience to deal with bigger challenges when they inevitably come up. And I liked that the book talked about not trying to avoid stressful situations and live in a perfect bubble, but to accept and embrace it as part of the human condition.
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I hit 500 days sober a few days ago, and I'm really happy to be at a point where alcohol doesn't even cross my mind when I'm feeling emotionally overwhelmed, because I no longer ever feel like I can't handle my own emotions. I just feel them, and they're okay, even when they suck donkey balls.
Congrats @Malcat, that's a heckuva long stretch. Sorry about your current pain issues.
Thanks, to be fair though, pain really doesn't bother me unless I'm feeling emotionally off. That day I had to deal with a new doctor who was a bit of a prick, and the human mind isn't built to be okay with letting assholes do painful things to you. It's emotionally destabilizing, so that lowered my emotional shields and made the pain harder to manage. Otherwise, I'm kind of a tank and can take almost anything.
Hi Malcat - do you mind if I direct message you? I have a couple chronic pain questions.
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I hit 500 days sober a few days ago, and I'm really happy to be at a point where alcohol doesn't even cross my mind when I'm feeling emotionally overwhelmed, because I no longer ever feel like I can't handle my own emotions. I just feel them, and they're okay, even when they suck donkey balls.
Congrats @Malcat, that's a heckuva long stretch. Sorry about your current pain issues.
Thanks, to be fair though, pain really doesn't bother me unless I'm feeling emotionally off. That day I had to deal with a new doctor who was a bit of a prick, and the human mind isn't built to be okay with letting assholes do painful things to you. It's emotionally destabilizing, so that lowered my emotional shields and made the pain harder to manage. Otherwise, I'm kind of a tank and can take almost anything.
Hi Malcat - do you mind if I direct message you? I have a couple chronic pain questions.
Of course, any time.
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A couple of weeks ago, I posted that I had 4 sips of red wine and decided I didn’t want anymore.
Last weekend, I decided that I wanted to try a glass of white. I poured myself 2 oz. In the end, I had about 1.5 oz, and realized although better than red (likely from the sweetness), I’ve just lost my taste for wine.
Apart from those 2 instances, I’ve now gone 56 days alcohol free and believe this is how I want to live my life going forward. I really didn’t think this would happen when I started this journey... Thanks so much all your support!
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A couple of weeks ago, I posted that I had 4 sips of red wine and decided I didn’t want anymore.
Last weekend, I decided that I wanted to try a glass of white. I poured myself 2 oz. In the end, I had about 1.5 oz, and realized although better than red (likely from the sweetness), I’ve just lost my taste for wine.
Apart from those 2 instances, I’ve now gone 56 days alcohol free and believe this is how I want to live my life going forward. I really didn’t think this would happen when I started this journey... Thanks so much all your support!
Congrats!
It blew my mind when wine stopped tasting good to me. I had loved wine, especially red, but now I can't even stand the smell of it.
DH had a glass or two of champagne at his sister's the other night and I've become so sensitive to the smell of alcohol that when he came home, to me it smelled like he had done a pile of vodka shots.
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I have now been alcohol free all year. Was planning to start drinking again this weekend but have zero desire to do so. I do crave a glass of rose by the pool this summer so we will see if I give in. Might try to go through July 4th weekend without. It’s funny though recently I’ve started to find fun alternatives to alcohol and have landed on hemp drinks. They cost like $5 a can so saving a little money over drinking but not a ton. Like others I also have not lost any weight. I do have numerous positive benefits like less insomnia and less side effects from meds and better mood control.
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I have now been alcohol free all year. Was planning to start drinking again this weekend but have zero desire to do so. I do crave a glass of rose by the pool this summer so we will see if I give in. Might try to go through July 4th weekend without. It’s funny though recently I’ve started to find fun alternatives to alcohol and have landed on hemp drinks. They cost like $5 a can so saving a little money over drinking but not a ton. Like others I also have not lost any weight. I do have numerous positive benefits like less insomnia and less side effects from meds and better mood control.
I started drinking dealcoholized wine, and it really hit the spot for those days I was craving the experience of having a glass of wine while doing something fun. I now never crave real alcohol.
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I just wanted to post to re-up my commitment to staying alcohol free for a little while. I originally posted here about laying off the booze, then pretty soon after found out I was pregnant. In a way, that felt like “cheating”! I had the baby this month, so it no longer goes without saying that I’m alcohol free. At the moment I pledge to make it through to August 15th without alcohol, which will make it a whole year for me. At that point I will assess again.
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I have now been alcohol free all year. Was planning to start drinking again this weekend but have zero desire to do so. I do crave a glass of rose by the pool this summer so we will see if I give in. Might try to go through July 4th weekend without. It’s funny though recently I’ve started to find fun alternatives to alcohol and have landed on hemp drinks. They cost like $5 a can so saving a little money over drinking but not a ton. Like others I also have not lost any weight. I do have numerous positive benefits like less insomnia and less side effects from meds and better mood control.
I started drinking dealcoholized wine, and it really hit the spot for those days I was craving the experience of having a glass of wine while doing something fun. I now never crave real alcohol.
I will have to give that a try!
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Similar to @LeftA I am closing in on two months alcohol free (AF). The game changer for me has been sleep, glorious sleep! I sleep soundly and wake up calm and refreshed. I hadn't realized that waking up sweaty and anxious at 4AM was being caused by my evening wine. Sleep is now delicious, decadent and my whole life is better with adequate rest.
And, as @Malcat has pointed out I learned that cravings are not "me". I can watch them rise, crest and fade knowing they are temporary and do not reflect my true desires.
I am grateful for what I learned through the 30 day alcohol experiment. Understanding the physical and psychological workings of alcohol has been powerful and effective in eliminating the desire to drink. I didn't stop through white knuckled will power but rather just let the desire fade away based on knowledge and journaling.
To keep the AF stoke high I considered Annie Grace's 100 Days of Lasting Change Program but it costs $200. So instead I found a library book:
(https://i.imgur.com/RltqFFim.jpg)
I am about half way through. It's quite good and I would recommend it. It's a bit more focused on spirituality and less on data than I would prefer, but I am a geeky engineer who thinks most books should have more graphs.
Speaking of data, Strava shows I am getting a little faster and stronger which feels great. Did going AF contribute? I don't know but it sure couldn't hurt.
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I know this thread is about booze, but I just completed a whole month without smoking weed, which is my other vice. It actually wasn't as hard as I thought it would be, once it was out of the house and out of my mind I was mostly fine. I did think of it a few times, but since I told myself I didn't have any and I was definitely doing at least a month sober, it was easy to keep my mind on track and there wasn't any social pressure like I feel for drinking.
I feel motivated to keep it up, it didn't really add much value to my life and I don't love the effects on my lungs/motivation. I picked up running at the same time and I managed to get to 5k, so I feel healthier in general. @Malcat's words about keeping promises to yourself really resonated with me, and I think that helped me stick to both the sober month and my running schedule. It feels good to know that I can do stuff that I set my mind to!
I feel like I'm on a journey to becoming a better version of myself, which seems like such a cliche but whatever. I think approaching 30 is making me evaluate where I'm at vs. where I thought I would be and where I want to end up. There's nothing stopping me from being a person who exercises, meets financial goals, maintains sobriety, and I think I'll end up happier and healthier if I make the right choices for me. I don't need to make every change at the same time, but I'm on the right track and I'm making progress.
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@PoutineLover High fives from me! Swapping weed for running is leveling up.
I could keep weed in the house and not smoke because I knew that would be it for the rest of the day, whereas with booze I had the illusion that one drink wouldn't make me *that* impaired and I could resume normal activities (ignoring the fact that most of the time one drink would result in another drink). What inspired me to give it up was getting serious about my martial arts and realising that my reactions and brain were sluggish for 2-3 days after I had smoked and that this level of aftermath wasn't worth it to me. If only I'd had the same realisation about alcohol at the same time instead of waiting another 10 years.
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Really interesting article on origins of alcohol and its effects.
https://www.theatlantic.com/magazine/archive/2021/07/america-drinking-alone-problem/619017/
This pretty much sums me up: “Divorced from life’s shared routines, drinking becomes something akin to an escape from life.” Solo pandemic drinking as a way to "cope" has been my mantra for over a year, but I'm over it and I'm starting another run at sobriety next week. Wish me luck!
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Really interesting article on origins of alcohol and its effects.
https://www.theatlantic.com/magazine/archive/2021/07/america-drinking-alone-problem/619017/
This pretty much sums me up: “Divorced from life’s shared routines, drinking becomes something akin to an escape from life.” Solo pandemic drinking as a way to "cope" has been my mantra for over a year, but I'm over it and I'm starting another run at sobriety next week. Wish me luck!
I am so glad you shared this! I debated sharing it but I thought it was so well written.
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You can do it 4Tify!!!!
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Really interesting article on origins of alcohol and its effects.
https://www.theatlantic.com/magazine/archive/2021/07/america-drinking-alone-problem/619017/
This pretty much sums me up: “Divorced from life’s shared routines, drinking becomes something akin to an escape from life.” Solo pandemic drinking as a way to "cope" has been my mantra for over a year, but I'm over it and I'm starting another run at sobriety next week. Wish me luck!
Fantastic article and thanks for sharing it.
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You can do it 4Tify!!!!
Thank you!
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What the heck I'm in for June. I don't drink massive amounts but I do have a drink or more often lately two most days, and I worry about the habit being "chronic and progressive" as I always hear it framed. That's how my father died. See how the world looks with tea of an evening instead for a bit.
If he were alive he would be 75 today, reason enough to assume this happy hour impulse is just a sugar craving and have a kit kat instead.
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What the heck I'm in for June. I don't drink massive amounts but I do have a drink or more often lately two most days, and I worry about the habit being "chronic and progressive" as I always hear it framed. That's how my father died. See how the world looks with tea of an evening instead for a bit.
If he were alive he would be 75 today, reason enough to assume this happy hour impulse is just a sugar craving and have a kit kat instead.
Good thinking.
I still get hit with a happy-hour craving, even a year and a half later, but it's no longer for alcohol, just *something*. It's funny because I haven't been working for almost as long as I haven't been drinking, but the end of the "work day" is still very present for me, although that's probably because DH still works, and he works from home, so all day, I still get that work-day feeling despite myself being retired, so I still get the after "work" happy-hour need for something to signal a transition.
Silly brains are silly.
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What the heck I'm in for June. I don't drink massive amounts but I do have a drink or more often lately two most days, and I worry about the habit being "chronic and progressive" as I always hear it framed. That's how my father died. See how the world looks with tea of an evening instead for a bit.
If he were alive he would be 75 today, reason enough to assume this happy hour impulse is just a sugar craving and have a kit kat instead.
I 100% substituted with sugar for the first week. Then I did fizzy fruit juices and then tea. Good Luck!
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What the heck I'm in for June. I don't drink massive amounts but I do have a drink or more often lately two most days, and I worry about the habit being "chronic and progressive" as I always hear it framed. That's how my father died. See how the world looks with tea of an evening instead for a bit.
If he were alive he would be 75 today, reason enough to assume this happy hour impulse is just a sugar craving and have a kit kat instead.
I 100% substituted with sugar for the first week. Then I did fizzy fruit juices and then tea. Good Luck!
First week? Man, I think my sugar habit lasted the first year.
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I also developed a sugar habit, mostly chocolate and ice cream, now almost 2 years later I can moderate my sugar intake.
I accidently had some of a drink wednesday night, I ordered seltzer and I got what I thought was Kombucha, but it was a draft homemade hard seltzer with 6% alcohol like a strong beer. I only had a few sips, then I gave it to someone else at the table. It had a wiskey flavor to me so I was like is this alcohol?
Since I have no desire to drink ever again, I dont feel it would put me into a relapse. I feel like I am a cognitive non drinker and I really do not think I am addicted to alcohol anymore. I guess this is a test in a way, I do remember when I first quit I had a 1/4 of a beer and felt like I wanted more, this felt very different. Anyhow I will report back if it is an issue. That was my first night at a bar playing trivia, ( outside covered patio), and I had a amazing time with these people and usually I would be curious of the craft home brewed beers but I was not tempted in the least. I am so grateful I can go out and "party" with people and not feel the urge to drink.
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What the heck I'm in for June. I don't drink massive amounts but I do have a drink or more often lately two most days, and I worry about the habit being "chronic and progressive" as I always hear it framed. That's how my father died. See how the world looks with tea of an evening instead for a bit.
If he were alive he would be 75 today, reason enough to assume this happy hour impulse is just a sugar craving and have a kit kat instead.
I 100% substituted with sugar for the first week. Then I did fizzy fruit juices and then tea. Good Luck!
First week? Man, I think my sugar habit lasted the first year.
I am pretty big on intuitive style eating and pretty regularly consume treats (There are no bad foods among foods that I can actually eat!) but sometime toward the end of my first week of daily ice cream I ordered a shake that basically came topped with multiple other desserts. It was too much and I felt awful for like two days :) I picked up a pack of pelligrino limonata after that and went back to my regular treat routine.
ETA - This was when I dropped drinking in Jan of this year. A previous time that I cut out drinks I recall feeling way more craving when it came to sugar, I thought about it SO much.
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To keep the AF stoke high I considered Annie Grace's 100 Days of Lasting Change Program but it costs $200. So instead I found a library book:
(https://i.imgur.com/RltqFFim.jpg)
I am about half way through. It's quite good and I would recommend it. It's a bit more focused on spirituality and less on data than I would prefer, but I am a geeky engineer who thinks most books should have more graphs.
I am a scientist by training and I also surprisingly liked that book. I read 3 or 4 sober-lit type books in the first year, and that was the only one I connected with at all (with the exception of a more technical book on the actual neuro-physiology of addiction).
I'm glad you are sleeping better. I still can't believe how much more sleep my body actually needed than I thought it did during my drinking years.
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What the heck I'm in for June. I don't drink massive amounts but I do have a drink or more often lately two most days, and I worry about the habit being "chronic and progressive" as I always hear it framed. That's how my father died. See how the world looks with tea of an evening instead for a bit.
If he were alive he would be 75 today, reason enough to assume this happy hour impulse is just a sugar craving and have a kit kat instead.
I 100% substituted with sugar for the first week. Then I did fizzy fruit juices and then tea. Good Luck!
First week? Man, I think my sugar habit lasted the first year.
LOL, right?! I hadn't been a 'sugar' person for decades, and it definitely took about a year to get my sudden fixation back under control. I wish it had only been a week.
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What the heck I'm in for June. I don't drink massive amounts but I do have a drink or more often lately two most days, and I worry about the habit being "chronic and progressive" as I always hear it framed. That's how my father died. See how the world looks with tea of an evening instead for a bit.
If he were alive he would be 75 today, reason enough to assume this happy hour impulse is just a sugar craving and have a kit kat instead.
I 100% substituted with sugar for the first week. Then I did fizzy fruit juices and then tea. Good Luck!
First week? Man, I think my sugar habit lasted the first year.
LOL, right?! I hadn't been a 'sugar' person for decades, and it definitely took about a year to get my sudden fixation back under control. I wish it had only been a week.
Earlier in this thread I mentioned that I can't even digest sugar properly, I never even liked it that much as a kid. I'm so happy to be back off of it, it was dreadful.
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Well, after a week I think my strongest feeling is relief that this hasn't been harder. I really wanted that Friday end of work drink I skipped, and I really wanted the mowed-the-lawn celebratory beer I went without, and all the other habitual evening alcoholic drinks were easily and painlessly substituted with some other drink. I am drinking every day because it's there and most of my friends do, without much thought, I think, and will certainly want to do less of that going forward. Who needs a carcinogen that could readily be a spindrift?
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Way to go Rock tree.
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(Now that I've said that some real cravings will likely kick in :-) )
It is wild how much other people care about if you drink or not though. I mentioned to a friend I would not drink at her cook-out and she seems ...very bothered. I'm not abstaining at her!
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(Now that I've said that some real cravings will likely kick in :-) )
It is wild how much other people care about if you drink or not though. I mentioned to a friend I would not drink at her cook-out and she seems ...very bothered. I'm not abstaining at her!
A LOT of people have an unhealthy relationship with alcohol. Those are typically the ones who will react most.
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Officially going to start this challenge next month! My birthday coincides with the final day of a week-long beach vacation with extended family, so that'll be my last day until starting my "no alcohol cleanse"... which I intend to keep going indefinitely from there.
I drank heavy socially throughout my 20's, but now it's been losing my appeal, doesn't make me feel good, not healthy, and it's become more and more expensive. So this will be that hard line I can draw to myself but also to friends and family who peer pressure me into drinking even when I don't feel like it.
If I get happy hour cravings or I'm with people who are drinking, my plan is to drink kombucha or some sort of other sparkling drink to maybe satisfy the taste buds. I'll report back in when I begin!
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To keep the AF stoke high I considered Annie Grace's 100 Days of Lasting Change Program but it costs $200. So instead I found a library book:
(https://i.imgur.com/RltqFFim.jpg)
I am about half way through. It's quite good and I would recommend it. It's a bit more focused on spirituality and less on data than I would prefer, but I am a geeky engineer who thinks most books should have more graphs.
I am a scientist by training and I also surprisingly liked that book. I read 3 or 4 sober-lit type books in the first year, and that was the only one I connected with at all (with the exception of a more technical book on the actual neuro-physiology of addiction).
I'm glad you are sleeping better. I still can't believe how much more sleep my body actually needed than I thought it did during my drinking years.
Just started this and really enjoying it!
Today is the start of my month off. I’ve got my first “sober” work drinks scheduled with a client tonight. Any ideas how to position it? I am positive he’ll want to share some good times over a couple, and I’ve honestly never not had a drink over client meetings. We agreed to have post pandemic drinks over a month ago.
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To keep the AF stoke high I considered Annie Grace's 100 Days of Lasting Change Program but it costs $200. So instead I found a library book:
(https://i.imgur.com/RltqFFim.jpg)
I am about half way through. It's quite good and I would recommend it. It's a bit more focused on spirituality and less on data than I would prefer, but I am a geeky engineer who thinks most books should have more graphs.
I am a scientist by training and I also surprisingly liked that book. I read 3 or 4 sober-lit type books in the first year, and that was the only one I connected with at all (with the exception of a more technical book on the actual neuro-physiology of addiction).
I'm glad you are sleeping better. I still can't believe how much more sleep my body actually needed than I thought it did during my drinking years.
Just started this and really enjoying it!
Today is the start of my month off. I’ve got my first “sober” work drinks scheduled with a client tonight. Any ideas how to position it? I am positive he’ll want to share some good times over a couple, and I’ve honestly never not had a drink over client meetings. We agreed to have post pandemic drinks over a month ago.
Here's where you have to decide whether or not you want to be open, partially honest, or just full on lie.
Being open in a client context is challenging because as I said above, a lot of people have fucked up relationships with alcohol and can respond poorly to someone choosing to quit. Plus it's none of their fucking business really. This is really only an issue with am existing client who is used to you drinking, if it's a new client, just say you don't drink, it's really that easy.
This leads to partial openness. An example I've given previously is to say that you have a loved one who is trying to quit alcohol and you are quitting with them for now in solidarity and support. They don't need to know that you are the loved one you are trying to support. Most people will be really cool about this.
The last is just to lie. This really is the easiest, and as much as I despise lying in my personal life, I'm a huge fan of strategic untruths in my professional life, because in my work it was my job to keep people at a distance.
Now, I had to quit due to a drug trial, and that made the social aspect of it sooo easy. So if you are looking for a stupidly easy way out of drinking, just say you've been put on a medication thay stops you from drinking.
Say you are on Lyrica for sciatica or something like that, it's used for nerve pain, back pain, etc, shit that almost everyone experiences at some point. Lyrica for me made alcohol get me suuuuuper drunk on just one drink, but only the bad parts of being drunk, like dizzy and nauseous. It was horrible.
It's really nothing to stress about. Just decide how open and vulnerable you want to be with this person and go from there.
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@4tify strategic truths and not being weird about it are the key here. You’re taking some meds that don’t work with booze (ie all of them, this is true)/on a break/order something non-alcoholic for you, and treat it as nothing odd.
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@4rify- OR get there early and order a non alcoholic beer in a glass no one will know. I drink non alcohol beer at parties and most people assume I am drinking beer, and occasionally they will ask me about my drink then I fess up to the truth. I feel I fit in better. However theses days most people know I am alcohol free.
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Hi All - looking for quick relaxation suggestions.
I'm doing well on my no/low drinking (nothing from Jan to mid April and a planned drink every couple of weeks since then) but had a moment yesterday where I thought "I have 20 minutes, maybe, to myself. How can I relax?", and my first thought was a drink.
Yoga is not an option for me, I have issues with hypermobile joints. In general, too much physical activity causes pain so let's stay away from the "take a quick run!" side of suggestions - thanks!
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Hi All - looking for quick relaxation suggestions.
I'm doing well on my no/low drinking (nothing through mid april and a planned drink every couple of weeks since then) but had a moment yesterday where I thought "I have 20 minutes, maybe, to myself. How can I relax?", and my first thought was a drink.
Yoga is not an option for me, I have issues with hypermobile joints. In general, too much physical activity causes pain so let's stay away from the "take a quick run!" side of suggestions - thanks!
I do literally 5 minutes of vigorous exercise, it releases the exact same neurochemicals as giving in to an alcohol craving. Remember, the alcohol doesn't actually calm you, it's your own brain's response to giving in to a craving that does.
Otherwise I drink really nice tea, have a bit of dark chocolate, do some mindfulness meditation, or all of the above.
Once the cravings die out, so does the capacity for pouring a drink to relax you. So redirecting that response really helps.
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@StarBright Maybe breathing exercises?
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@StarBright not a relaxation suggestion, but when I went alcohol-free for a year I needed to initially trick my brain for the first month or so by serving myself water/sparkling water in a wine glass. I found it was the ritual of pouring a liquid and holding the glass by the stem and sipping something (anything!) that wasn't alcoholic was what I really enjoyed. I went from having a drink most days, to nothing for a year (the first 2 months were *hard*), and now can take it or leave it. All the best.
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@StarBright I like a cup of tea in those situations or just 10 min standing outside watching my dog pounce on lizards.
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Hi All - looking for quick relaxation suggestions.
I'm doing well on my no/low drinking (nothing through mid april and a planned drink every couple of weeks since then) but had a moment yesterday where I thought "I have 20 minutes, maybe, to myself. How can I relax?", and my first thought was a drink.
Yoga is not an option for me, I have issues with hypermobile joints. In general, too much physical activity causes pain so let's stay away from the "take a quick run!" side of suggestions - thanks!
I do literally 5 minutes of vigorous exercise, it releases the exact same neurochemicals as giving in to an alcohol craving. Remember, the alcohol doesn't actually calm you, it's your own brain's response to giving in to a craving that does.
Otherwise I drink really nice tea, have a bit of dark chocolate, do some mindfulness meditation, or all of the above.
Once the cravings die out, so does the capacity for pouring a drink to relax you. So redirecting that response really helps.
Boo! Malcat - exactly what I didn't want to read :) But I actually just bought a rebounder so 5 minutes of bouncing could be okay.
and thanks @mspym , @lazycow, and @Peony ! I probably have to recalibrate to find those things relaxing but they are all excellent ideas.
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Hi All - looking for quick relaxation suggestions.
I'm doing well on my no/low drinking (nothing through mid april and a planned drink every couple of weeks since then) but had a moment yesterday where I thought "I have 20 minutes, maybe, to myself. How can I relax?", and my first thought was a drink.
Yoga is not an option for me, I have issues with hypermobile joints. In general, too much physical activity causes pain so let's stay away from the "take a quick run!" side of suggestions - thanks!
I do literally 5 minutes of vigorous exercise, it releases the exact same neurochemicals as giving in to an alcohol craving. Remember, the alcohol doesn't actually calm you, it's your own brain's response to giving in to a craving that does.
Otherwise I drink really nice tea, have a bit of dark chocolate, do some mindfulness meditation, or all of the above.
Once the cravings die out, so does the capacity for pouring a drink to relax you. So redirecting that response really helps.
Boo! Malcat - exactly what I didn't want to read :) But I actually just bought a rebounder so 5 minutes of bouncing could be okay.
and thanks @mspym , @lazycow, and @Peony ! I probably have to recalibrate to find those things relaxing but they are all excellent ideas.
Why would you not want to read that?
The simple fact is that alcohol in and of itself actually has virtually no positive effects. It's hard for drinkers to believe, but it's true. The great feeling that having a drink gives you is from your own brain.
Your brain wants the addictive substances, so it rewards you with feel good chemicals to try and create a repeating pattern of giving it the addictive chemical it wants.
The actual buzz of alcohol is a downer and feels awful. The high comes from your own brain.
It's like this: french kissing doesn't feel great. Anyone who has french kissed someone who they have no interest in knows that the action is inherently slimy and gross. However, if you are attracted to someone and desperately want more physical intimacy with them, then kissing them sets off neural responses because your brain is excited about getting physically more intimate with this person that it wants you to be even more intimate with.
Kissing someone you are attracted to feels amazing because your brain wants you to do more of it, and then more of more stuff. If your brain has no reason for you to kiss someone, it doesn't drop those chemicals and it feels awful.
It's the exact same with alcohol. It's awful, but your brain will dramatically overpower the awful feeling for the first few drinks to get you to keep drinking. But that's why most people who get heavily drunk start getting mean, aggressive, or morose. Once you're too drunk, your brain stops giving you the happy chemicals, and then quickly you just start feeling the awful, depressing effect of the booze alone.
The high of drinking is your brain bribing you for booze. You don't actually want the alcohol, you want the brain chemicals. Your brain wants the booze because it will want anything addictive, even if for you it's total shit. But you are the one who controls the behaviour, so your brain needs to bribe you to keep enable it's shit-consuming habit.
The fun comes from your brain, so find a way to trigger that fun with something better for your brain than booze.
Go french kiss someone you want to sleep with or better yet sleep with them, do some exercise/stretching, invest in a massage chair/seat, take a bath or shower, roll around on the ground with a puppy, take up painting, whatever, there are TONS of behavioural shortcuts to the exact same brain chemicals that your brain will drop for booze.
It's a bit of a seduction process, you need to figure out what tickles your brain, what it's willing to give you happy chemicals for. Spend some quality time getting to know your own brain's buttons and which ones work best for you.
This is not bad news, this is a powerful lever for you to use.
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I just hate exercising :)
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Maybe some light weeding? Dust the leaves of your houseplants? If you're a plant person it's a low stress distraction and a way to care for a living thing and bring more food or beauty or whatever you're growing into your life. If this is a 20 minute problem it doesn't take much to get yourself out of that headspace for a bit before you are on to the next thing. YMMV; I have a pal who would quickly organize and declutter a drawer to pull herself out of any kind of weird spiral she felt stuck in and wanted out of. Just pull your attention somewhere else that's satisfying.
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I just hate exercising :)
Lol
You might start liking it if your brain gives you a buzz afterwards though.
I used to see exercise as a chore, but once I started chasing natural brain highs, I was a lot more motivated to do it.
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I just hate exercising :)
Lol
You might start liking it if your brain gives you a buzz afterwards though.
I used to see exercise as a chore, but once I started chasing natural brain highs, I was a lot more motivated to do it.
Same. It can take trial and error to figure out the type of exercise that really triggers the natural high. Swimming is 100% the fastest way for me and regular swimming absolutely helps me with cravings, but of course isn't available at the drop of a hat unless you have your own lake (which I actually did at various points in my own life) or pool. Hiking (with frequent pauses to look around) in steep lovely terrain, which functions as interval training, is another good one. It usually has to be aerobic for me. Yoga, dance, pilates, etc. are also fun but it's harder (though not impossible) to get the high from that unless you do them vigorously and with an emphasis on deep breathing. However, running (e.g.) was a fucking chore that never gave me a high even in the days when I 1) was conditioned to do it, and 2) had a lovely environment to run in (which I haven't for 20+ years). So it can take trial and error to find exercise you don't hate and that gives the endorphin payoff.
Which actually backs up the suggestions above about trying some sort of meditative breathing exercise if you really are going to resist exercise.
Maybe try some form of HIIT exercise? A lot of those programs can be done on the spur of the moment at home and they don't take much time.
Apart from exercise, I used to use things like working on a coloring book (b/c my brain is soooo conditioned to be analytical and not free-flowing and creative) or dancing for 10 minutes to a great groove song or immersing myself in a book (with an NA drink) or taking a 20 minute walk. Anything to 'reboot' my brain and attention and signal my brain that it was time to wind down (which I previously used booze to do).
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Just wanted to stop in and report. 7 months!
Over the holiday, I had the slightest twinge of wanting to reach for a drink while visiting my parents and family (all drinkers, all drinking, diametrically opposite political/religious views). I staved it off with an ice-cold 7up Cherry Zero. Leaving after a couple of hours also helped!
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A year and a half for me.
I'm pretty craving free now, except when out for dinner last night for my birthday at a very nice restaurant, where they had virtually no non alcoholic beverage options.
If I liked sugary beverages, it would be okay, but I hate them. So when I'm out for my birthday, all dressed up, and ordering a ton of very expensive oysters, I want a beverage option other than water. And this is a place with a legendary wine list, so a place where having a drink used to be such a treat.
I've gotten so used to at least having the option of non alcoholic Heineken, so I was definitely caught off guard when I had no decent option, and definitely felt limited in my experience of indulging in something luxurious.
It doesn't feel luxurious to have water with my oysters. I wasn't craving alcohol, but I was envious of all of the drinkers having drink options, but I didn't.
Honestly, why can't there be more non sugary beverages out there??
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Honestly, why can't there be more non sugary beverages out there??
I do miss some of the complex or unique flavors of alcoholic beverages. Pastis, for example - I would pay good money for an alcohol-free version!
But yes...where are the non sugary beverage treats? Anyone had any luck with crafting your own?
I've found adding fresh mint to a fresh brewed (decaf) coffee with cream is quite yummy.
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If there’s no alcohol free beer I order soda water with lime. I just reached 11 months.
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About to hit 4 years and it's still one of the best decisions I ever made. I love this freedom from reflexive self-doubt and shame (did I say something stupid? did I make a fool of myself?) but am getting a bit tired of soda with lime/lemon lime & bitters/ginger ale with lime & mint.
One nice thing is some of the craft brewers here have started making *good* non-alcoholic beer, and some companies are making non-alcoholic "spirits" so you can make make a delicious NA gin-and-tonic. Otherwise I throw myself on the mercy of the bartender and ask for them to make something NA and not sweet.
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@MustachioedPistachio I add nice bitters to club soda and combinations of various san Pellegrino flavors.
So I love limonatta, club soda and Jaimaican bitters or aranciatta w/ chipotle bitters.
I highly recommend Bittercube:
https://bittercube.com/
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If there’s no alcohol free beer I order soda water with lime. I just reached 11 months.
Yeah, that's what I ordered, but soda water is still water. And sometimes I resent that I'm out somewhere spending significant money and all they have to offer me to drink is water or pop.
Thankfully it's rare, most restaurants here have mocktail options, which is why I was so taken aback by such a trendy, expensive place having nothing for me.
At home I've gotten very used to dealcoholized champagne as my go-to fancy beverage. I wish I had options like that when going out.
I like when places have alcohol free kombucha, that's a nice treat.
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I ask for a tonic water when I want the bitterness but not the booze.
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A year and a half for me.
I'm pretty craving free now, except when out for dinner last night for my birthday at a very nice restaurant, where they had virtually no non alcoholic beverage options.
If I liked sugary beverages, it would be okay, but I hate them. So when I'm out for my birthday, all dressed up, and ordering a ton of very expensive oysters, I want a beverage option other than water. And this is a place with a legendary wine list, so a place where having a drink used to be such a treat.
I've gotten so used to at least having the option of non alcoholic Heineken, so I was definitely caught off guard when I had no decent option, and definitely felt limited in my experience of indulging in something luxurious.
It doesn't feel luxurious to have water with my oysters. I wasn't craving alcohol, but I was envious of all of the drinkers having drink options, but I didn't.
Honestly, why can't there be more non sugary beverages out there??
@Malcat, was yesterday your birthday? It was my birthday. 🎉
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Happy birthday to us!
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I’m closing in on 100 days soon. They haven’t been 100% AF since I had a glass of red once to see how I felt about it (totally lost the taste for it!) and then white. The white is okay but I haven’t had much (roughly about 8 ounces over a few separate occasions since late May).
But, the great thing is that I recently entertained for the first time since COVID was declared a pandemic and I didn’t drink at all, while the couple we invited, had both red and white wine! When I told them why I wasn’t drink much anymore, they didn’t make a big deal out of it and said good for me, it makes total sense, etc.
A few days after that we went out for dinner (again something we haven’t done much in the last 15 months) and I didn’t feel at all tempted to order wine.
Finally, I had the WORST day at work today and I didn’t even consider turning to wine...whereas it used to be an unconscious reflex before!
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That's great @LeftA I love it when people are cool.
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I too am somewhat resentful when there is no good non alcoholic drink option.
I go to a brewery to play games monthly and they have Kombucha and also run out every night! I wonder why theses places don't get the non alcoholic craft beer, the best I have had is well being or Athletic and they are amazing.
Almost 2 years for me without alcohol! (Technically 6 weeks away from 2 years), and just 5 weeks ago I did accidentally get a few sips of a hard cider that I ordered( I ordered a seltzer and pointed to someones seltzer, but they gave me a hard seltzer it was homemade and actually very good.) I had a few sips thinking it was Kombucha they gave me but it tasted whisky like. It did not cause me to crave alcohol after that, which was a tad surprising, but I think I am just cognitively over booze.
Congratulations to everyone here who who had presence of mind to give up or moderate booze!
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I too am somewhat resentful when there is no good non alcoholic drink option.
I go to a brewery to play games monthly and they have Kombucha and also run out every night! I wonder why theses places don't get the non alcoholic craft beer, the best I have had is well being or Athletic and they are amazing.
Almost 2 years for me without alcohol! (Technically 6 weeks away from 2 years), and just 5 weeks ago I did accidentally get a few sips of a hard cider that I ordered( I ordered a seltzer and pointed to someones seltzer, but they gave me a hard seltzer it was homemade and actually very good.) I had a few sips thinking it was Kombucha they gave me but it tasted whisky like. It did not cause me to crave alcohol after that, which was a tad surprising, but I think I am just cognitively over booze.
Congratulations to everyone here who who had presence of mind to give up or moderate booze!
The concept that a sip of alcohol will trigger your addiction is a very AA concept that isn't evidence based.
Where people get into trouble is that when those sips or that one drink or that one drag off of a cigarette doesn't trigger anything, they think they're "cured" and that they can now drink or smoke occasionally with no problems.
I think it was Annie Grace's neuroscientist guest speaker who gave this analogy, but addiction is like a well worn path in the woods. The more you travel the path, the more entrenched it gets into the ground. If you stop walking the path, nature starts to grow over it. The path doesn't ever disappear, but it can get heavily covered by overgrowth to the point that you can't even see it anymore if you didn't know it was there.
But if you go back and clear away the overgrowth, the path is still there if it was worn in well enough in the first place.
So you can get to the point that an addiction is totally covered over by new neural patterns, but the old pathways never actually reverse themselves. They're still there, available for travel at any point if you go back and clear them off.
As a former neuroscientist, this analogy makes perfect sense to me.
So with you at about two years and me at a year and a half, our pathways are nice and buried to the point that they can't even be seen. That's why a few sips won't trigger anything, it's not enough to uncover the path.
In fact, you could probably get full on shit faced one night and still not uncover the path. But if you got into the habit of just ordering a single half pint now and then when out with friends, that would quickly uncover it.
Exposure over time would likely have more impact than volume of exposure on one occasion. The brain is very sensitive to repeated patterns.
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Thank you, @Malcat, for that was very insightful analogy!
I quit 3-4 years ago as well and after 7 months I went back off and on a few times and drank 6 months strait until I finally quit for good. I told someone that night I "may" try a beer after 2 years but really there is no reason to, I have non alcoholic beer to satisfy me and I really love the way I feel without alcohol. And I read, or I saw on you tube, someone who said after two years they felt even better! I can not wait to feel even better, but I feel pretty damn good now!
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Starting the alcohol free life today, I'm excited to see how long I can make it!
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@Geographer and others maybe set a date or goal like 30 days? Keeps you honest
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Mr Kat and I have been through 3 six-packs of Athletic non-alcoholic beers in the last couple of months. They are good! It is much easier for me to have just one on an evening, compared to alcoholic beer where I was trying to reach the boozy feeling. And Mr Kat doesn’t really like to drink so he prefers, and is more likely to join me in, an NA beer than a normal beer. I think I plan to order more, after waiting a little while to space out my expenditure in this area :)
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Starting the alcohol free life today, I'm excited to see how long I can make it!
Welcome! Any specific goals or approach you have planned?
Need any resource recommendations?
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I have also found a new craft non alcoholic beer called wellbeing, very good got it a liquor store and local grocery store . It is from Missouri. Went to a real bar and sat at the bar, no issues. Didnt like the drunk people, was glad i didn't have to participate in that. I also went to a brewery for game night, fun people. The brewery served kombucha which was satisfying.
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I have also found a new craft non alcoholic beer called wellbeing, very good gat it a liquor store and local grocery store . It from Missouri. Went to a real bar and sat at the bar, no issues. Didnt like the drunk people, was glad i didn't have to participate in that. I also went yo a brewery for game night, fun people. The brewery served kombucha which was satisfying.
Lol, after so long in lockdown, being out and seeing people get visibly drunk seems so scandalous now.
Of course, I never noticed moderately drunk people before because I was always drinking myself out at dinners and events. So I really have no way to gauge what's a normal level of inebriation in public.
It definitely weird and makes me grateful it's not me out in public, glaze-eyed, heavy-lidded, and kind of sloppy. How embarrassing.
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Starting the alcohol free life today, I'm excited to see how long I can make it!
Welcome! Any specific goals or approach you have planned?
Need any resource recommendations?
@Geographer and others maybe set a date or goal like 30 days? Keeps you honest
Thanks guys!! 30 days is my minimum goal, but if all goes well I'd love to stick with it even longer.
I realized I just don't like drinking that much anymore and it gives me a firm reason to decline when around friends or family.
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Starting the alcohol free life today, I'm excited to see how long I can make it!
Welcome! Any specific goals or approach you have planned?
Need any resource recommendations?
@Geographer and others maybe set a date or goal like 30 days? Keeps you honest
Thanks guys!! 30 days is my minimum goal, but if all goes well I'd love to stick with it even longer.
I realized I just don't like drinking that much anymore and it gives me a firm reason to decline when around friends or family.
Are you doing the Annie Grace 30 day alcohol experiment?
This thread is what pointed me to it, and I found it very helpful in reformatting my perception of alcohol.
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+1 TO everything Malcat said. I did annie grace 30 day made me thinkabout my relationship with alcohol, and this naked mind, her book made me think too.
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Today is my 67th birthday and the first one alcohol free in 16 years. I am having beer from the athletic brewery also. Their AF beers are so good. Yesterday was also 11 months AF. I used Annie grace’s book and her online support group to quit. I found out about it on this thread.
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My wife started to adjust her diet, and stopped using alcohol as part of that. I'm kind of tagging along. Our alcohol consumption was very moderate - a glass of wine with dinner here and there. Stopping it was very anticlimactic. None of us has any cravings, or under any social pressure.
The flip side is that I don't feel any positive changes, either. We mostly drank $4/bottle stuff from Trader Joe's or Aldie, so even the bank account didn't notice anything!
We also threw away a bottle of vodka that sat in the cupboard for... five? seven? years. Where I'm from, people are summarily executed for things like that, so let's keep it between us.
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Today is my 67th birthday and the first one alcohol free in 16 years. I am having beer from the athletic brewery also. Their AF beers are so good. Yesterday was also 11 months AF. I used Annie grace’s book and her online support group to quit. I found out about it on this thread.
Happy birthday!!
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Starting the alcohol free life today, I'm excited to see how long I can make it!
Welcome! Any specific goals or approach you have planned?
Need any resource recommendations?
@Geographer and others maybe set a date or goal like 30 days? Keeps you honest
Thanks guys!! 30 days is my minimum goal, but if all goes well I'd love to stick with it even longer.
I realized I just don't like drinking that much anymore and it gives me a firm reason to decline when around friends or family.
Are you doing the Annie Grace 30 day alcohol experiment?
This thread is what pointed me to it, and I found it very helpful in reformatting my perception of alcohol.
Thanks for mentioning that, I just signed up for the 30 day alcohol experiment program and also found the This Naked Mind podcast to start listening to.
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Day two of the "30 day Alcohol experiment", I love it so far. I really like the idea of not focusing on what you're giving up, but what you're gaining.
Has anyone else concurrently given up caffeine along with alcohol? I feel like they both contribute to higher levels of anxiety and we use them to balance each other out. So I'm curious to stop drinking coffee as well!
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Day two of the "30 day Alcohol experiment", I love it so far. I really like the idea of not focusing on what you're giving up, but what you're gaining.
Has anyone else concurrently given up caffeine along with alcohol? I feel like they both contribute to higher levels of anxiety and we use them to balance each other out. So I'm curious to stop drinking coffee as well!
I quit caffeine a few months after alcohol.
I personally wouldn't do them together. Caffeine withdrawal can be much worse than alcohol withdrawal, but the cravings are not as bad. So your brain could end up connecting the severity of caffeine withdrawal with the strength of alcohol cravings and make the whole thing a lot harder.
Best to get to a new sober normal before throwing a wrench into the works.
For me, the first 10 days of quitting coffee were miserable, but I have never missed it and never ever crave it. I thought I couldn't live without coffee, but honestly, my old coffee habit seems downright silly now.
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Day two of the "30 day Alcohol experiment", I love it so far. I really like the idea of not focusing on what you're giving up, but what you're gaining.
Has anyone else concurrently given up caffeine along with alcohol? I feel like they both contribute to higher levels of anxiety and we use them to balance each other out. So I'm curious to stop drinking coffee as well!
I quit caffeine a few months after alcohol.
I quit both not intentionally about a month a part. Alcohol, I just have to say no…caffeine/ice coffee concentrate was the worst withdrawal ever…but only lasted two days.
Started as a challenge to myself and that was over 2.5 years ago. I do like some decaf coffee on weekends
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Thanks Malcat!! I had a great day with my kids.
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I gave up both but not at the same time, that is crazy. Start with alcohol, then you may
Find that you dont need the coffee! (Caffeine). Also I weaned 50 percent caffeine then 25 percent, mixed with decaf.
Less anxious now still drink decaf, but not Lot.
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I'm waiting to see if I need to give up alcohol due to some liver complications (unrelated to alcohol, but to a chronic health condition). I'll admittedly be sad. I enjoy dinners out & sharing a bottle of wine, or cocktails by the pool with my husband. I know we will totally adjust & it won't be the end of the world, but it's a pretty ingrained part of our weekends to have a drink at happy hour time. I might need to find some fun mocktail recipes, while I'm in the transitioning phase.
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BabyM wishing you all the best for good test results.
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I'm waiting to see if I need to give up alcohol due to some liver complications (unrelated to alcohol, but to a chronic health condition). I'll admittedly be sad. I enjoy dinners out & sharing a bottle of wine, or cocktails by the pool with my husband. I know we will totally adjust & it won't be the end of the world, but it's a pretty ingrained part of our weekends to have a drink at happy hour time. I might need to find some fun mocktail recipes, while I'm in the transitioning phase.
I would recommend giving it up regardless of the test results.
If you have chronic health issues, alcohol isn't helping you in managing them.
I'll never forget going through med school classes and pretty much every slide, for every illness, underneath was written "contributing factors: cigarettes, alcohol, [other disease specific factors]."
Point being, alcohol is pretty hard on your system. I too have chronic health issues, and they definitely became easier to manage without the constant inflammation from alcohol.
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Has anyone else concurrently given up caffeine along with alcohol? I feel like they both contribute to higher levels of anxiety and we use them to balance each other out. So I'm curious to stop drinking coffee as well!
I decided to go "chemical-free" at the same time. Granted, I had been tapering my caffeine consumption for some time, so it was not a massive shock to the system.
Welcome!
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Just checking in to offer congrats to all who are still on the sober path and encouragement to all who wish to try.
I passed the 11 year mark recently and can't imagine returning to alcohol.
Once you have quit for awhile you will really notice the heavy societal pressure of our western culture to drink. It is embedded in most all of our celebrations, achievements, and relaxation.
To step away can seem disorienting at first.
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Just checking in to offer congrats to all who are still on the sober path and encouragement to all who wish to try.
I passed the 11 year mark recently and can't imagine returning to alcohol.
Once you have quit for awhile you will really notice the heavy societal pressure of our western culture to drink. It is embedded in most all of our celebrations, achievements, and relaxation.
To step away can seem disorienting at first.
It's crazy really.
I was at my own family birthday party and everyone was heavily drinking. Like, it's *my* birthday, everyone knows I don't drink anymore, but it would be weird and even rude to expect others not to drink...at a party for me...
I really didn't mind, but I did find it a little odd that even people who normally don't drink were drinking because it was a party. Again, a party for me, who doesn't drink. Lol.
Last year for my birthday was different but similar. I used to always provide more than enough booze at parties I hosted, non of this BYOB stuff. Anyhoo, for my birthday last year we told people it was BYOB because I was 6 months sober and not about to buy booze for others.
Still, no one brought enough for themselves. We were at a public beach that has a bar, but you can't take drinks away from the bar. So for a good chunk of the get together, people kept leaving the group for long periods of time to go drink at the bar.
Again...at a party for me.
Now, I will specify that neither of these parties were populated with people who are primarily my friends. Anyone who is primarily my friend is better trained than that. The family birthday party was mostly my parents friends and the beach party was mostly DH's friends. I have tons of close friends, but none of them mix, so parties for me tend to not primarily be *my* closest friends, which explains a lot.
I still find it funny though.
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Just checking in to offer congrats to all who are still on the sober path and encouragement to all who wish to try.
I passed the 11 year mark recently and can't imagine returning to alcohol.
Once you have quit for awhile you will really notice the heavy societal pressure of our western culture to drink. It is embedded in most all of our celebrations, achievements, and relaxation.
To step away can seem disorienting at first.
Aside from improving mental and physical health, the societal pressure is probably the biggest reason why I decided to stop drinking. I'm on day 5, and my last day of drinking was my birthday while on vacation with extended family (all heavy drinkers). They started doing shots, and I told them I wanted to sit it out. The response? "It's your birthday, you HAVE to do shots!" ...in an angry manner. So I filled a shot glass with water when no one was looking (they were all drunk anyways) just to pretend I was "part of the festivities".
Over time I started realizing I don't really like drinking. And I'm definitely not addicted to it. But it's being surrounded by friends and family who DO which pulls me in. Sure, maybe it won't go over well in the long run, but sticking to my decision gives me a rush of endorphins knowing that I'm refusing to partake in a destructive western cultural norm.
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It's crazy really.
agreed...I'm treated like the weird one for not drinking poisoning myself slowly
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Just checking in to offer congrats to all who are still on the sober path and encouragement to all who wish to try.
I passed the 11 year mark recently and can't imagine returning to alcohol.
Once you have quit for awhile you will really notice the heavy societal pressure of our western culture to drink. It is embedded in most all of our celebrations, achievements, and relaxation.
To step away can seem disorienting at first.
It's crazy really.
I was at my own family birthday party and everyone was heavily drinking. Like, it's *my* birthday, everyone knows I don't drink anymore, but it would be weird and even rude to expect others not to drink...at a party for me...
I really didn't mind, but I did find it a little odd that even people who normally don't drink were drinking because it was a party. Again, a party for me, who doesn't drink. Lol.
Last year for my birthday was different but similar. I used to always provide more than enough booze at parties I hosted, non of this BYOB stuff. Anyhoo, for my birthday last year we told people it was BYOB because I was 6 months sober and not about to buy booze for others.
Still, no one brought enough for themselves. We were at a public beach that has a bar, but you can't take drinks away from the bar. So for a good chunk of the get together, people kept leaving the group for long periods of time to go drink at the bar.
Again...at a party for me.
Now, I will specify that neither of these parties were populated with people who are primarily my friends. Anyone who is primarily my friend is better trained than that. The family birthday party was mostly my parents friends and the beach party was mostly DH's friends. I have tons of close friends, but none of them mix, so parties for me tend to not primarily be *my* closest friends, which explains a lot.
I still find it funny though.
That is funny!
For the first three or so years every time I visited my mom and we sat on the deck at wine thirty she would act surprised "Oh, are you still not drinking? Are you really never going to drink again?!"
I would just joke with her as we have a very loving relationship that she was really pushing the booze! She would laugh.
I ended up cutting a lot of the heavy drinkers out of my life, in some cases they cut me out. Some folks feel personally judged when you quit drinking and they don't, regardless of anything you actually do or say.
With time it becomes the new normal. For years if my partner visited and left alcohol in the fridge (they're a very light drinker, total lightweight!) I would pour it out.
Now, I don't even care what's in the fridge. I know I will not go down that road of thinking that "maybe I can drink now", I don't have any desire to do so.
And I have enough self knowledge to know that I would immediately be right back to my former ways.
So, a teetotaler I shall be ;-)
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Just checking in to offer congrats to all who are still on the sober path and encouragement to all who wish to try.
I passed the 11 year mark recently and can't imagine returning to alcohol.
Once you have quit for awhile you will really notice the heavy societal pressure of our western culture to drink. It is embedded in most all of our celebrations, achievements, and relaxation.
To step away can seem disorienting at first.
Congrats on the 11 years, Sven.
I have noticed that many of the the recently released movies have lots of smoking. Often, when
there are 2 people in a scene, both are puffing away. I would guess the movie producers get paid
by the cigarette lobby to have lots of smoking going on.
Oh, lots of drinking too, of course.
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Just checking in to offer congrats to all who are still on the sober path and encouragement to all who wish to try.
I passed the 11 year mark recently and can't imagine returning to alcohol.
Once you have quit for awhile you will really notice the heavy societal pressure of our western culture to drink. It is embedded in most all of our celebrations, achievements, and relaxation.
To step away can seem disorienting at first.
Congrats on the 11 years, Sven.
I have noticed that many of the the recently released movies have lots of smoking. Often, when
there are 2 people in a scene, both are puffing away. I would guess the movie producers get paid
by the cigarette lobby to have lots of smoking going on.
Oh, lots of drinking too, of course.
I have noticed an uptick in smoking in movies and tv shows. For awhile it almost disappeared, but lately smoking has returned as a way to connote "edginess". I guess it's cycled back.
But yeah, the amount of drinking on tv is astounding, especially middle aged characters. It drives DH crazy seeing ultra fit middle aged characters on tv drinking like fish. In his 40s he learned that he had to choose between alcohol and visible abs and he chose abs, so I think he gets a little offended, lol.
But he's not wrong. Media sets this insane standard that it's totally normal to drink constantly, and that you can do that in your 40s with no damage, and no impact on your appearance. Meanwhile, I've now developed a really good eye for "drinker's face".
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I've been reading and following this thread for some time, but am just jumping in now. Over the years, I have been the kind of drinker that loves beer, but hates being drunk. So I never really had a problem with blackouts, or doing stupid stuff I regret, or drinking interfering with my work, or anything "serious" like that. But since I love beer, I would drink it often (several nights a week), stopping when I started to feel a buzz. Of course, over time, the amount that took increased and I found myself drinking 2 or 3 beers a night, probably 3 or 4 nights a week. A few years ago, I started participating in "Dry January" each year to reset and never found it particularly difficult, but always returned to drinking afterward. One year, I also did the 30 day alcohol experiment, but it really didn't resonate with me because it really felt like it was pitched to people who drink to get DRUNK and have more serious problems with alcohol, and that just didn't resonate with me. And I never really felt that different after 30 days sober than I did when I was drinking - sleep wasn't bad even when I was drinking, no changes in energy, etc.
As I'm starting to get older (39 now) though, my body is just not aging well, which is common in my family. Even though I didn't have the "serious" problems associated with drinking, I know the cumulative effects of drinking as often as I do are not good. So I decided to experiment with 6 months instead of just 30 days to gather more data to see how I feel with a longer period of time sober. I'm about 2 months in now and still really haven't noticed changes in weight, sleep, energy, back pain, etc. But I also haven't found it very difficult and certainly even if I don't feel healthier yet, I know it is a healthier choice in the long term.
I actually thought it would be a lot more difficult to give up my evening beers (the habitual drinking) than it is. Mainly where I have missed it is for special occasions (e.g., celebrations, vacation, etc.). I just returned from vacation and was wanting a poolside drink, but wasn't tempted to actually buy one. Then I won a free drink in a game and decided what the heck, I'll have this one to see how I feel. I didn't feel any different, and wasn't tempted to have even one more drink the entire vacation.
I can see this being a pretty long term change for me since it really hasn't been hard and I know it is a healthier choice, but I'm hoping that over time I will start to SEE some of the benefits of being sober in terms of weight loss, energy, etc.!
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Day two of the "30 day Alcohol experiment", I love it so far. I really like the idea of not focusing on what you're giving up, but what you're gaining.
Has anyone else concurrently given up caffeine along with alcohol? I feel like they both contribute to higher levels of anxiety and we use them to balance each other out. So I'm curious to stop drinking coffee as well!
I received a high blood pressure diagnosis and didn't want to go on drugs so I stopped alcohol, caffeine, and went low carb all at once while verifying with a fitbit that I was getting the 150 minutes of low intensity cardio per week. No big deal. Easily lost about 25 lbs and BP dropped fast. Now I have high cholesterol and a pill though! Being 44YO was my health turning point.
Oh and decaf coffee (order an americano) with heavy cream and sugar free syrup is delightful. Diet caffeine-free soda is delightful but not many options.
I was a moderate daily drinker for decades before the BP issue and then decided that I don't need it and my liver is already going to be taxed with a statin. It's too bad, I homebrew beer and love the tastes and feelings. Never any of the excessive drinking issues.
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I’m a couple of days away from it being 4 months since I decided to cut out alcohol.
I didn’t really have a set goal, I just wanted to see how I’d feel if I cut it out. I was having a glass of wine with dinner most nights, and on Fridays I’d often have 2 to celebrate end of the COVID work week.
I have not been 100% alcohol free during these 121 days. A handful of times I’ve tried having a glass to see how I feel. Out of these time, only once did I enjoy it, at all. I’ve pretty much lost the taste for it, and it’s kind of gross now. I didn’t expect this!
During this time, I have entertained in my home and gone out for dinner 3 times and have not had the urge to drink whatsoever. My friends have all been supportive and most recently also decided not to order wine with dinner!
My life is definitely changed!
Here are some of the ways:
-I feel happier and more in control of my life.
-I have more energy
-I feel less anxious
-My stomach is flatter
-I feel more mental acuity
-I’ve saved money
- I never think about drinking in the context of making any plans (i.e., being able to drive somewhere). I can’t believe I ever let alcohol affect me in this way!
-My libido has returned - I had NO idea how much alcohol had killed it! No one here has mentioned this, so this was a revelation to me!
The only thing that has NOT happened yet, is that I thought cutting out alcohol would help me loss weight. When I first cut out alcohol I did compensate by eating more sweats. But, that passed after about a month. Since then I’ve been eating better and started being much more physically active. I think the weight loss may still come as a result. It may just be slower because I’m only a few pounds from ideal weight.
Thank you for being here to support me along the way! I may not have taken that first step and kept going (in the early days) without it!
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That’s great news Left! I am 5 days away from one year. I was fat so the weight loss started right away. I love being a healthy weight now.
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Just breezed past the 30 day experiment, that was much easier than expected! Like @Petuniajo said above, it's definitely geared for people who actually have problems with drinking, but still was pretty educational. I have no urge or desire to go back to drinking, although I won't rule it out in very intentional moments! (Going to Ireland soon, how can I NOT try a Guinness there?!)
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Have enjoyed reading over the last bunch of pages. Am about 1 week into a 30day no booze stretch, so far no worries. A number of times in the recent I past I have not drink for up to 4 weeks, did not feel hard but I also did not notice any changes in body or mind. In the last few years drinking has mostly been limited to 0-4 beers between friday evening and sunday evening, so going down to zero is not a huge change. But in past when I have paused there has been a slight thought of it would be nice to have a beer with dinner on Friday after the workout.
I do have a family history of alcoholism so I am trying to be careful there and generally find that having booze around the house makes it harder to stick to the 0-4 beers per week. But I also dont keep ice-cream, cookies and cake abound to make it easier to not consume those.
I think it might not be the best for me to decide to be 100% no alcohol forever as my personality is on the less social side and adding in a new obstacle to me getting out and being around people is probably not optimal for total quality of life.
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Have enjoyed reading over the last bunch of pages. Am about 1 week into a 30day no booze stretch, so far no worries. A number of times in the recent I past I have not drink for up to 4 weeks, did not feel hard but I also did not notice any changes in body or mind. In the last few years drinking has mostly been limited to 0-4 beers between friday evening and sunday evening, so going down to zero is not a huge change. But in past when I have paused there has been a slight thought of it would be nice to have a beer with dinner on Friday after the workout.
I do have a family history of alcoholism so I am trying to be careful there and generally find that having booze around the house makes it harder to stick to the 0-4 beers per week. But I also dont keep ice-cream, cookies and cake abound to make it easier to not consume those.
I think it might not be the best for me to decide to be 100% no alcohol forever as my personality is on the less social side and adding in a new obstacle to me getting out and being around people is probably not optimal for total quality of life.
Don't worry about that at this point. Just focus on figuring out what relationship you want with alcohol, and then it will just make sense what role you want alcohol to play in your future.
There are phases. You kind of have to go through a period of getting to know yourself without alcohol first, then decide what to do moving forward.
I don't drink at all, but DH drinks socially when out without me, but limits himself to two drinks. I'm prone to frequent drinking, while he never drank often, but when he did, he was a light weight and always got way too drunk really quickly.
So after being totally sober for a few months, we each determined our own path forward.
I don't drink because I really, really don't want to, not because I feel like I shouldn't. Give it some time, get used to sobriety first, and then figure it out from there.
You literally can't make decisions for your future self, so leave it up to them. This decision isn't on you right now.
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I’m booze free for at least the next couple weeks! The spouse is on-call this week and I would like to be more supportive than I was last time. 😳 Making it a two week minimum to give myself a chance to really evaluate how much booze I’ve been consuming. It hasn’t been every day, but most days I have 1-3 drinks.
I’m actually really looking forward to chasing some natural highs. Just started a new workout schedule and I plan to replace happy hour drinks with fizzy water and lime. I’m not a big sugar fan, but nuts and dark chocolate can hit the spot. Wish me luck!
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Young, you might want to be alcohol free for a month to really experience the benefits. I think it can take 10 days to totally be free of the negative effects. Some people don’t feel better until at least 30 days. Malcat will know since she’s a doctor.
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Young, you might want to be alcohol free for a month to really experience the benefits. I think it can take 10 days to totally be free of the negative effects. Some people don’t feel better until at least 30 days. Malcat will know since she’s a doctor.
Yep, it's different for different people, but 2 weeks will barely get someone out of the direct effects of alcohol and those first 10ish days are by far the worst, so that length would really miss out on all of the benefits and make it feel like sobriety is pointless.
30 days really is what it takes to get a grasp on how alcohol is affecting your body.
In addition, if someone can't manage 30 days, that tells them a lot about their relationship with booze. The more someone struggles with 30 days, the more they really NEED to take at least 30 days.
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Young, you might want to be alcohol free for a month to really experience the benefits. I think it can take 10 days to totally be free of the negative effects. Some people don’t feel better until at least 30 days. Malcat will know since she’s a doctor.
Yep, it's different for different people, but 2 weeks will barely get someone out of the direct effects of alcohol and those first 10ish days are by far the worst, so that length would really miss out on all of the benefits and make it feel like sobriety is pointless.
30 days really is what it takes to get a grasp on how alcohol is affecting your body.
In addition, if someone can't manage 30 days, that tells them a lot about their relationship with booze. The more someone struggles with 30 days, the more they really NEED to take at least 30 days.
Ah! Thank you to both of you. I will change my plan to longer. I do have a bachelorette party to attend in 28 days...I don't intend to make myself sick, but it seems like a poor time to put my foot down in a social setting. Would 28 days with that party being the first day make sense? I'm not worried about not drinking at home. It's just the social settings that give me pause. I do like the complex taste of different beverages, but I don't drink alcohol just to drink it.
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Young, you might want to be alcohol free for a month to really experience the benefits. I think it can take 10 days to totally be free of the negative effects. Some people don’t feel better until at least 30 days. Malcat will know since she’s a doctor.
Yep, it's different for different people, but 2 weeks will barely get someone out of the direct effects of alcohol and those first 10ish days are by far the worst, so that length would really miss out on all of the benefits and make it feel like sobriety is pointless.
30 days really is what it takes to get a grasp on how alcohol is affecting your body.
In addition, if someone can't manage 30 days, that tells them a lot about their relationship with booze. The more someone struggles with 30 days, the more they really NEED to take at least 30 days.
Ah! Thank you to both of you. I will change my plan to longer. I do have a bachelorette party to attend in 28 days...I don't intend to make myself sick, but it seems like a poor time to put my foot down in a social setting. Would 28 days with that party being the first day make sense? I'm not worried about not drinking at home. It's just the social settings that give me pause. I do like the complex taste of different beverages, but I don't drink alcohol just to drink it.
My personal experience is that I quite just two days before several major open bar events. It was hugely beneficial to me to realize that it was the anticipation of not drinking that was harder than the actual not drinking at the parties. The parties were fun and distracting, I only thought that not drinking at them would be an issue, but it really isn't.
Not telling you what to do, just sharing my personal experience where having my norms tested was really beneficial.
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Young, you might want to be alcohol free for a month to really experience the benefits. I think it can take 10 days to totally be free of the negative effects. Some people don’t feel better until at least 30 days. Malcat will know since she’s a doctor.
Yep, it's different for different people, but 2 weeks will barely get someone out of the direct effects of alcohol and those first 10ish days are by far the worst, so that length would really miss out on all of the benefits and make it feel like sobriety is pointless.
30 days really is what it takes to get a grasp on how alcohol is affecting your body.
In addition, if someone can't manage 30 days, that tells them a lot about their relationship with booze. The more someone struggles with 30 days, the more they really NEED to take at least 30 days.
Ah! Thank you to both of you. I will change my plan to longer. I do have a bachelorette party to attend in 28 days...I don't intend to make myself sick, but it seems like a poor time to put my foot down in a social setting. Would 28 days with that party being the first day make sense? I'm not worried about not drinking at home. It's just the social settings that give me pause. I do like the complex taste of different beverages, but I don't drink alcohol just to drink it.
My personal experience is that I quite just two days before several major open bar events. It was hugely beneficial to me to realize that it was the anticipation of not drinking that was harder than the actual not drinking at the parties. The parties were fun and distracting, I only thought that not drinking at them would be an issue, but it really isn't.
Not telling you what to do, just sharing my personal experience where having my norms tested was really beneficial.
Thanks for the additional feedback Malcat! I'm a little shocked at how much I'm thinking about cold beer and red wine tonight. Seems like I really needed this! Now to find a distraction...
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Young, you might want to be alcohol free for a month to really experience the benefits. I think it can take 10 days to totally be free of the negative effects. Some people don’t feel better until at least 30 days. Malcat will know since she’s a doctor.
Yep, it's different for different people, but 2 weeks will barely get someone out of the direct effects of alcohol and those first 10ish days are by far the worst, so that length would really miss out on all of the benefits and make it feel like sobriety is pointless.
30 days really is what it takes to get a grasp on how alcohol is affecting your body.
In addition, if someone can't manage 30 days, that tells them a lot about their relationship with booze. The more someone struggles with 30 days, the more they really NEED to take at least 30 days.
Ah! Thank you to both of you. I will change my plan to longer. I do have a bachelorette party to attend in 28 days...I don't intend to make myself sick, but it seems like a poor time to put my foot down in a social setting. Would 28 days with that party being the first day make sense? I'm not worried about not drinking at home. It's just the social settings that give me pause. I do like the complex taste of different beverages, but I don't drink alcohol just to drink it.
My personal experience is that I quite just two days before several major open bar events. It was hugely beneficial to me to realize that it was the anticipation of not drinking that was harder than the actual not drinking at the parties. The parties were fun and distracting, I only thought that not drinking at them would be an issue, but it really isn't.
Not telling you what to do, just sharing my personal experience where having my norms tested was really beneficial.
Thanks for the additional feedback Malcat! I'm a little shocked at how much I'm thinking about cold beer and red wine tonight. Seems like I really needed this! Now to find a distraction...
Habits are powerful motivators. They don't feel like it because they're subconscious and automatic, so you have very little awareness of how strong the habit is because you just do it. You only realize how powerful a habit is until you try to break it.
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Neato, my phone tells me I've hit 600 days today.
I'm also not sure if I mentioned this, but since I quit, so have most of the people around me. Not completely quit, but my DH, my mom, my sister, and a collection of my closest friends are all essentially non drinkers now except for very rare occasions.
With covid limiting my exposure to humans, it's created this illusion for me that almost no one drinks. It still strikes me as so odd now seeing everyone at a restaurant drinking alcohol, in my head I'm like "Oh, did no one tell you? That's not a thing anymore."
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Me too! It felt so odd to go to a restaurant/bar when everyone was drinking and alot of people were roudy and drunk. It was a little shocking as I have been hiding with covid and I have not drank in 2 years, and everyone around me has either quit or cut back, and even though I tell them to do otherwise, they do not drink too much around me. My not drinking has had a positive impact on many of my close family and friends. One friend has said, I see you at parties and you never drink, so I thought maybe I do not have to drink at parties either! So it has been an educational period for me and the people I surround myself with.
Really 2 years will be on monday, I thought previous to this, that after 2 years, I will have a beer just to try but Now I am like, Naw I'm good. I may even quit the non alcoholic beer, too expensive.
This thread has been enormously helpful and I do want to thank the contributors.
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Young, you might want to be alcohol free for a month to really experience the benefits. I think it can take 10 days to totally be free of the negative effects. Some people don’t feel better until at least 30 days. Malcat will know since she’s a doctor.
Yep, it's different for different people, but 2 weeks will barely get someone out of the direct effects of alcohol and those first 10ish days are by far the worst, so that length would really miss out on all of the benefits and make it feel like sobriety is pointless.
30 days really is what it takes to get a grasp on how alcohol is affecting your body.
In addition, if someone can't manage 30 days, that tells them a lot about their relationship with booze. The more someone struggles with 30 days, the more they really NEED to take at least 30 days.
Ah! Thank you to both of you. I will change my plan to longer. I do have a bachelorette party to attend in 28 days...I don't intend to make myself sick, but it seems like a poor time to put my foot down in a social setting. Would 28 days with that party being the first day make sense? I'm not worried about not drinking at home. It's just the social settings that give me pause. I do like the complex taste of different beverages, but I don't drink alcohol just to drink it.
I'm late to this, but I strongly agree with the need for at least 1 month with no booze. (It can take even longer for longtime frequent drinkers). I didn't really start to see benefits until I was at about 26/27 consecutive days with no drinking (I had been a drinker of about the equivalent of a half bottle of wine per day for decades). If I'd done two weeks only, I would have made a huge mistake in assuming drinking hadn't been negatively affecting me b/c I hadn't seen positive benefits by then. When the benefits started kicking in, it was quite eye opening. It still is, 2.5 years later!
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I quit a year ago and my best friend and her husband a week later. One of my sons shortly after that. Social situations no longer bother me. I felt better immediately but it took a couple months for my friend to feel better. We are all different.
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Young, you might want to be alcohol free for a month to really experience the benefits. I think it can take 10 days to totally be free of the negative effects. Some people don’t feel better until at least 30 days. Malcat will know since she’s a doctor.
Yep, it's different for different people, but 2 weeks will barely get someone out of the direct effects of alcohol and those first 10ish days are by far the worst, so that length would really miss out on all of the benefits and make it feel like sobriety is pointless.
30 days really is what it takes to get a grasp on how alcohol is affecting your body.
In addition, if someone can't manage 30 days, that tells them a lot about their relationship with booze. The more someone struggles with 30 days, the more they really NEED to take at least 30 days.
Ah! Thank you to both of you. I will change my plan to longer. I do have a bachelorette party to attend in 28 days...I don't intend to make myself sick, but it seems like a poor time to put my foot down in a social setting. Would 28 days with that party being the first day make sense? I'm not worried about not drinking at home. It's just the social settings that give me pause. I do like the complex taste of different beverages, but I don't drink alcohol just to drink it.
I'm late to this, but I strongly agree with the need for at least 1 month with no booze. (It can take even longer for longtime frequent drinkers). I didn't really start to see benefits until I was at about 26/27 consecutive days with no drinking (I had been a drinker of about the equivalent of a half bottle of wine per day for decades). If I'd done two weeks only, I would have made a huge mistake in assuming drinking hadn't been negatively affecting me b/c I hadn't seen positive benefits by then. When the benefits started kicking in, it was quite eye opening. It still is, 2.5 years later!
It took me (longtime frequent drinker) about three months to really notice the changes, one of them being NOT waking up with a low grade hangover every day, I thought that was just "waking up and need my coffee".
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Hi everyone. Earlier this month I blew past 5 years. Never looked back.
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Hi everyone. Earlier this month I blew past 5 years. Never looked back.
Awesome
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Hi everyone. Earlier this month I blew past 5 years. Never looked back.
I just hit 4 years of "taking a break". I don't think I'm ever going back.
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5 years that's amazing
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Congrats Our town and Mspym!! I quit drinking in my late 20’s and didn’t drink for 20 years. Then I got a divorce, moved, new job and friends and started again. It was a huge mistake. So just don’t get complacent. It was much harder to quit a year ago than the first time when younger.
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I am about 4 weeks in, had half a pint of cider some week and a half after the start (social event where I did not want to get into a discussion of not drinking). With this recent dry spell and past ones I have done I really dont feel a difference after about 10 days. I was surprised to feel a small difference with even the half a pint but that only took a few days go away and to get back to what feels like steady state.
Before this test I was drinking relatively little and only on the weekends, but past tests I was drinking more and it still felt like I got to SS after a bit over a week.
I have 1.5 weeks till the end of the dry period I set on the calendar, will see how I feel then but I expect I will go back to a beer or two on some weekends. May extend the test past intended end date to get closer to a full 30 days with zero alcohol but I dont expect to see a difference in the extension.
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Hello, my name is Steeze. I’m an alcoholic.
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Congrats to all the sober people here!
Coming up on 1-year sober on 09/06/21
I believe this is only the 2nd 1-year sober celebration I have had since I started boozing in high school, and the only one that wasn't court ordered. Let's hope this sticks! Cheers to all!
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Hello, my name is Steeze. I’m an alcoholic.
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Congrats to all the sober people here!
Coming up on 1-year sober on 09/06/21
I believe this is only the 2nd 1-year sober celebration I have had since I started boozing in high school, and the only one that wasn't court ordered. Let's hope this sticks! Cheers to all!
Big congrats!
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Congratulations to everybody on these milestones!
I am currently dealing with the incredibly tiresome and depressing fallout of having an emotional connection to someone with severe alcohol use disorder, who is currently spiraling down to terrible outcome for about the 6th time in past 10 years (after several years of relatively good and stable sobriety), and am reminded just how brutal the endgame of 'regular, moderate drinking' can be. This person started out as a 'single cocktail before dinner' drinker for decades, then 'cocktail + wine with dinner' for decades, before the bottom fell out and now their entire life is fucked.
It's always an eye-opener as to the possible path I was on with my daily 2 glasses of wine.
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A few rules I have when it comes to booze:
-No drinking alone. A couple of exceptions to this rule: (1) getting a couple of drinks before going out and (2) celebrating a major milestone such as hitting certain net worth number.
-No drinking before sunset.
-No drinking with colleagues. If I have to, limit to 1-2 drinks or just order water.
-Obviously no drinking and driving.
-Limit going out for drinks as much as possible. Helps if you live in a HCOL area where drinks are expensive.
My friends also told me that weed helps to avoid excessive drinking, so if it's legal in your state or country it's another option to consider. Though some people get addicted to that too, so gotta be careful.
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Hello, my name is Steeze. I’m an alcoholic.
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Congrats to all the sober people here!
Coming up on 1-year sober on 09/06/21
I believe this is only the 2nd 1-year sober celebration I have had since I started boozing in high school, and the only one that wasn't court ordered. Let's hope this sticks! Cheers to all!
High fives! You've got this!
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I don't not drink, but I don't drink much. Except I had a glass of wine last night, and I had a weird reaction. Turns out my new allergy meds don't play well with alcohol. Considering that these meds are working way better than the old ones, I might just not drink.
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Hello, my name is Steeze. I’m an alcoholic.
...
...
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Congrats to all the sober people here!
Coming up on 1-year sober on 09/06/21
I believe this is only the 2nd 1-year sober celebration I have had since I started boozing in high school, and the only one that wasn't court ordered. Let's hope this sticks! Cheers to all!
sending Woot Woots to you! Congrats.
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Stopped drinking last Saturday.
Not planned, but I was feeling the same as before quitting smoking a long time ago:
I was waking up saying: today I won't drink anything (won't smoke a long time ago).
Then, in the next 5 minutes I would think about a beer in the evening.
And I would think about other types of drinks during the day...
This Saturday I just did not drink. yesterday it was harder, a lot of triggers, plus "one day I did not drink, let's celebrate".
For now my plan is to not force quitting completely, but at the minimum only drink with other people and at most two drinks in a sitting.
This would mean I would only drink Saturday and Sunday (maximum, not mandatory both days) and only two drinks maximum.
I will decide later if I want to give it up completely.
Last time I did not drink was several years ago when I had a medical condition, did not drink for 2.5 years.
When my medical condition improved (it is not "healed", it is just not manifesting), I got back to drinking.
I wrote this here as I realized I was thinking about a drink for this evening, this should make me get over today too :).
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For now my plan is to not force quitting completely, but at the minimum only drink with other people and at most two drinks in a sitting.
This would mean I would only drink Saturday and Sunday (maximum, not mandatory both days) and only two drinks maximum.
this is a good plan...I find the only "diets" that you can stick to are the ones where you have a "cheat" night.
Its tough, but you will start to feel so much better Tuesday - Friday Morning...this alone will help you stick to the plan.
Internet Strangers are proud of you
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For now my plan is to not force quitting completely, but at the minimum only drink with other people and at most two drinks in a sitting.
This would mean I would only drink Saturday and Sunday (maximum, not mandatory both days) and only two drinks maximum.
this is a good plan...I find the only "diets" that you can stick to are the ones where you have a "cheat" night.
Its tough, but you will start to feel so much better Tuesday - Friday Morning...this alone will help you stick to the plan.
Internet Strangers are proud of you
It actually really depends on the person.
For some people "cheat days" are just a slippery slope, and further create psychological value for the very thing they're trying to cut back on. Making the cravings for that things even worse.
That's where something like the 30 day Alcohol Experiment is so valuable. It really helps people figure out their particular relationship with alcohol.
For me, I was quickly happier not drinking at all. For DH, extreme moderation where he only drinks when out of the house, and only two drinks, works best for him. We had very different relationships with alcohol, and continue to.
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For now my plan is to not force quitting completely, but at the minimum only drink with other people and at most two drinks in a sitting.
This would mean I would only drink Saturday and Sunday (maximum, not mandatory both days) and only two drinks maximum.
this is a good plan...I find the only "diets" that you can stick to are the ones where you have a "cheat" night.
Its tough, but you will start to feel so much better Tuesday - Friday Morning...this alone will help you stick to the plan.
Internet Strangers are proud of you
It actually really depends on the person.
For some people "cheat days" are just a slippery slope, and further create psychological value for the very thing they're trying to cut back on. Making the cravings for that things even worse.
That's where something like the 30 day Alcohol Experiment is so valuable. It really helps people figure out their particular relationship with alcohol.
For me, I was quickly happier not drinking at all. For DH, extreme moderation where he only drinks when out of the house, and only two drinks, works best for him. We had very different relationships with alcohol, and continue to.
Yeah a cheat day for me is almost guaranteed to end in being blacked out drunk at some point in the future. Could be years down the road...
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For now my plan is to not force quitting completely, but at the minimum only drink with other people and at most two drinks in a sitting.
This would mean I would only drink Saturday and Sunday (maximum, not mandatory both days) and only two drinks maximum.
this is a good plan...I find the only "diets" that you can stick to are the ones where you have a "cheat" night.
Its tough, but you will start to feel so much better Tuesday - Friday Morning...this alone will help you stick to the plan.
Internet Strangers are proud of you
It actually really depends on the person.
For some people "cheat days" are just a slippery slope, and further create psychological value for the very thing they're trying to cut back on. Making the cravings for that things even worse.
That's where something like the 30 day Alcohol Experiment is so valuable. It really helps people figure out their particular relationship with alcohol.
For me, I was quickly happier not drinking at all. For DH, extreme moderation where he only drinks when out of the house, and only two drinks, works best for him. We had very different relationships with alcohol, and continue to.
Yeah a cheat day for me is almost guaranteed to end in being blacked out drunk at some point in the future. Could be years down the road...
I am trying to apply the same things I did with smoking.
It took me two year to quit smoking, reducing first.
Did not smoke for one year, then smoked again one year, then quit suddenly.
I am not trying to get on the first round, to reduce quantity and frequency.
If I will see that "occasional" and "at most two" transforms into "I don't remember anything from yesterday" I will look to quit for good and look for specialized help.
For now I got triggered because I was constantly thinking about "oh, after I finish all this hard work I will get a drink/perhaps two?" - which sometimes transformed into hours spent on playing games and drinking.
Things like these tell me I need to change something, this was the trigger for smoking too.
It is like this thing is controlling me, I can't control it - that means I need to do something to get back in control.
For now it is working well, I am fresh in the morning and I am really productive at work. I am also getting more done in the house again.
So far so good, feels good for now.
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@Cassie, thank you for your encouragement last time I posted. Congrats on your one year anniversary!
@Malcat, you had posted that you past 600 days awhile back. What a nice milestone!
@BikeFanatic, 2 years already! I know what you mean about positively influencing others. I suspect that the other woman in the couple we recently went over for dinner with skipped wine because of my influence.
@OurTown, 5 years?! Wow. When it comes to abstaining from alcohol, I don't look too far into the future. But, it looks like you were a very similar age to me when you quit drinking. So, one day I could be like you! (BTW, I'm curious, what was the impetus that made you stop?).
@msypym, 4 years is amazing! Pretty cool how you feel no need to go back.
@Steeze, congrats on hitting 1 year! Keep going!
@wenchsenior, sorry to hear what you are dealing with. Everyone, I mean everyone around me was telling me they didn't understand why I was concerned by my drinking. It was moderate and they didn't see an issue with it. While I typically *only drank a glass of wine with dinner" most nights, I was NOT liking how frequent it had become. Glad I decided to make a change. My life is so much better without alcohol!
In a few days it will be 5 months since I decided to try to abstain from drinking. I remember how difficult the 3-7 day marks were and then it got easier. A few times between weeks 8 and 12, I decided to try a glass of red and then white wine. Of these handful of times, I couldn't drink more than a sip or two without being totally turned off. I recall on July 11th I had about 1.5 glasses of a white wine, and thought okay maybe I can occasionally drink.
But, then I tried a sip of white wine a few days later and it tasted awful. So, since then I haven't had a drop - even on a recent short getaway with just hubby - at a place where I've always had wine with dinner. In fact, I actually felt comfortable enough to declare myself a "non-drinker." In truth, I cannot say I'll never drink again, but I feel no desire to start again.
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I am just checking in. 7.75 years booze free. For me the key was finding a support group like Lifering, which was more science based and not faith based like AA.
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@Tyson, that is a good amount of time, congratulations on that. Left a, I like your plan, it does take time
To get adjusted to life without alcohol. Now I know people who have never seen me drink, and they
Believe in me as a non drinker. My old friends who drink still feel I was
Not needing to quit. But I was certainly addicted, and I just love how I feel in the morning.
Lately I feel like maybe I should try a beer now that it has been 2 years, but why bother?
I am working on giving up the non alcoholic beer, too expensive and is it a crutch?
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@Tyson, that is a good amount of time, congratulations on that. At left,, I like your plan, it foes take time
To get adjusted to life without alcohol. Now I know people who have never seen me drink, and they
Believe in me as a non drinker. My old friends who drink still feel I was
Not needing to quit. But I was certainly addicted, and I just love how I feel in the morning.
Lately I feel like maybe I should try a beer now that it has been 2 years, but why bother?
I am working on giving up the non alcoholic beer, too expensive and is it a crutch?
A close friend of mine was sober for years after struggling with alcoholism for some time in his 20's / 30's. Some time in his 40's he started with NA beer. Then a single craft beer here and there a couple years later. Fast forward 5 years and there were beer cans falling out of his car when you opened the door and Jack Daniels bottles stashed all over the house. He ended up going to a rehab (resort?) for a couple weeks and has since been sober again, going on 2 or 3 years now.
Personally, after seeing that train wreck, I am hesitant to have even a NA beer.
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Neato, my phone tells me I've hit 600 days today.
I'm also not sure if I mentioned this, but since I quit, so have most of the people around me. Not completely quit, but my DH, my mom, my sister, and a collection of my closest friends are all essentially non drinkers now except for very rare occasions.
With covid limiting my exposure to humans, it's created this illusion for me that almost no one drinks. It still strikes me as so odd now seeing everyone at a restaurant drinking alcohol, in my head I'm like "Oh, did no one tell you? That's not a thing anymore."
This is my experience too. Well, my parents don't drink as much anymore anyway. My dad and I used to enjoy craft beer together. Even before quitting entirely, we were both lightweights and would frequently just split a bottle between us. Since I quit, he doesn't really have anyone to split fancy beers with anymore, so his consumption is way down too. DH also drinks less, which to me is more surprising since he and I had pretty different tastes in booze.
I'm also just as baffled anytime I see evidence that other people drink. I've made a couple trips to the recycling center lately to drop of packing material. These centres are also where many people go to drop off their empties for refund. I'm always blown away at the huge sacks of beer cans some people have. Seems like a ton of work to schlepp all those full cans home and then schlepp the empties to the recycle centre.
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@Tyson, that is a good amount of time, congratulations on that. At left,, I like your plan, it foes take time
To get adjusted to life without alcohol. Now I know people who have never seen me drink, and they
Believe in me as a non drinker. My old friends who drink still feel I was
Not needing to quit. But I was certainly addicted, and I just love how I feel in the morning.
Lately I feel like maybe I should try a beer now that it has been 2 years, but why bother?
I am working on giving up the non alcoholic beer, too expensive and is it a crutch?
A close friend of mine was sober for years after struggling with alcoholism for some time in his 20's / 30's. Some time in his 40's he started with NA beer. Then a single craft beer here and there a couple years later. Fast forward 5 years and there were beer cans falling out of his car when you opened the door and Jack Daniels bottles stashed all over the house. He ended up going to a rehab (resort?) for a couple weeks and has since been sober again, going on 2 or 3 years now.
Personally, after seeing that train wreck, I am hesitant to have even a NA beer.
Yeah, this is another one of those really individual things.
For me, I have absolutely no interest in alcohol anymore, and having NA options of drinks I used to like makes it so that I don't feel at all like I'm missing out on anything.
For some people it makes them want the alcoholic version more, for me it makes the alcoholic option irrelevant.
My position is that if the person still finds themself at all romaticizing alcohol, the NA drinks can be a slippery slope, because it's a place holder for "the real thing" and a constant reminder of what you could have.
For me, I have no concept that if I were to drink alcohol that I would enjoy it. So the NA drinks aren't "lesser" versions for me. If I'm at a restaurant or pub that doesn't have NA beer, that doesn't make me want alcoholic beer, that makes me cranky that the establishment doesn't have good options for me and expects me, an adult, to drink children's beverages or just water.
In my mind it's like a restaurant only having dishes that include raw onions, which I find gross and can't digest. I don't eat dishes with cooked onions because they're the closest I can get to raw onions, or that every time I'm eating cooked onions, I'm wishing they were raw. No, I don't like raw onions, so it would piss me off if the only dish on a menu that didn't have raw onions was the chicken fingers for kids.
So alcohol for me now is like raw onions. I don't like it and it makes me feel ill. Cooked onions and NA beer are great though.
As I mentioned, my mom quit, but she just told me that she's been drinking wine at restaurants now that they're re-opened, but only if they have her favourite kinds.
So for her, alcohol is still special, it's still romanticized and abstaining is still a hardship that requires discipline. For her, NA drinks could be a slippery slope, because it's just a sad imitation of what she would rather.
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I might post a lot in the next period, I find it helps me get through these initial days of not drinking so please bear with me.
Regarding NA beer - I would rather drink water.
I just don't like the taste, I think I only found one which was almost good tasting for me.
If I want to eat steak, I eat steak, although lately the incredible burgers are really tasty - but even those, I am not eating them because they replace meat, I eat them because I like how they taste. When I want a meat burger I eat a meat burger. Everyone is different, this is how it works for me.
The same for alcoholic/NA versions: if I want/crave alcohol, I either drink alcohol or get rid of alcohol if the craving is too much/too addictive.
If I don't want to drink alcohol I am not drinking the NA version, especially because I don't like the taste of NA beers.
My main "concern" is that yesterday, after a really hard day, I was exercising the: "get a drink?" thought and I caught myself cringing at the thought of drinking - even a beer, which is my favourite alcoholic drink.
I hope all is fine, I know at the medic I am asked if I suddenly lost interest in some favourite activities - drinking beer was a favourite activity, I just stopped on Saturday.
I will see if this Sunday I will be able to enjoy a beer, as I will have a good occasion to do it.
If I don't enjoy it I will talk with my therapist to be sure this is a good sign :).
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Hey Tester, Post all you want! This is a great thread and it's interesting to see how you think through things.
Hm, I think it makes good sense if you suddenly lose interest in drinking. Earlier you said, "It is like this thing is controlling me, I can't control it - that means I need to do something to get back in control." That seems like a great reason to be uninterested in something... Very different from losing interest in activities like exercising, spending time with friends and family, typical hobbies, etc. And I also like your idea to talk to the therapist about what all this means, of course.
As an update, I'm about 6 months past the day I had my epiphany and lost interest in drinking. Still very happy with the decision. For what it's worth, I have enjoyed the NA beers and mocktails when we've been out. But I used to be more of a wine drinker, and I have not been interested to find a non-alcoholic wine... that seems gross, haha.
Though I can certainly see how for someone in a different situation, NA might be a gateway to drinking again. Maybe some people are really sensitive to the 0.5% content. Maybe NA opens up some unhealthy thinking or behavior patterns, or their own self image as a drinker. Or, maybe they are using willpower to resist something that they feel like they want. In my case, I have very little willpower in general, I tend to cave easily to the things that I want. But alcohol is no longer a conduit to having fun, being social, relaxing, reducing stress, feeling good. On the contrary, it gets in the way, and thus has little appeal.
I continue to be astonished that no one cares at all that I decided to stop drinking. I was really expecting some blowback or uncomfortable moments. Recently, someone said to me, oh it's so great to meet someone else who likes IPA! I was like, well I do, but this one is non-alcoholic. And she just laughed and said, well that's great too! There was no awkwardness or anything.
Thanks everyone for the updates, and great job all!
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Are NA beers still 0.5%?
I haven't seen any 0.5% for years, everything here is 0%
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Are NA beers still 0.5%?
I haven't seen any 0.5% for years, everything here is 0%
Here we have both types, very low alcohol and zero alcohol. Perhaps the regulations are different. Though when I think about it, seems silly not to take all the alcohol out! People are choosing NA for a reason...
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Are NA beers still 0.5%?
I haven't seen any 0.5% for years, everything here is 0%
Here we have both types, very low alcohol and zero alcohol. Perhaps the regulations are different. Though when I think about it, seems silly not to take all the alcohol out! People are choosing NA for a reason...
I was under the impression that the old NA beers were labeled 0.5% because old school alcohol removing technology wasn't able to remove all of the alcohol.
Granted, I have no idea where I learned that, so can't account for the validity.
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Well I drink the N.A beers, and some are labeled 0.5% alcohol or less, others are zero alcohol like hie Heineken zero and Budweiser zero. I had a bud zero out and it tasted like a bud to me.
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Well I drink the N.A beers, and some are labeled 0.5% alcohol or less, others are zero alcohol like hie Heineken zero and Budweiser zero. I had a bud zero out and it tasted like a bud to me.
A quick google seems to indicate that this has a lot to do with how the drink is processed. If the alcohol is removed through reverse osmosis, it can leave a bit of alcohol behind, as compared to vacuum distillation, which apparently leaves no alcohol (or less than 0.03% according to Heineken).
So my earlier assertion that it has to do with the type of processing seems to be accurate. Although, why there are no 0.5% beers where I happen to shop is still a mystery.
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Okay, so interesting story:
We visited some of DH's family friends we haven't seen since pre-covid. These people aren't regular drinkers, the wife barely drinks at all. They're a pretty sedate couple with two kids.
However, historically, us visiting has always triggered a party because, well, we're very fun, and we always showed up with a ton of wine.
So this time we show up and they find out that we don't drink alcohol anymore, which is no big deal because they barely drink.
Apparently that didn't matter. The Malcats were visiting and these suburban parents were getting fucking lit. It was ridiculous, we were stone sober with these generally *non drinkers*, but by the time dinner was served they were both sloshed.
To be fair, this is DH's old frat brother, so the very DNA of their 3 decade friendship is soaked in booze, but still, it was pretty funny that our company would trigger teetotalers to get shit faced even though we were drinking NA beverages.
Surprisingly, I wasn't at all bothered. These are friends of DH's that I actually prefer drunk funnily enough. They're a bit too high strung for me sober.
So that was interesting. Since quitting I've been rather repelled by drunk people. It was nice to see that I *can* be around drunk people and be totally comfortable.
On a different note, DH said that this was the first event where people were drinking that he didn't have even a hint of desire to join them. He often doesn't drink at get togethers if I'm there, but it takes a bit of effort to pass up a nice wine or gin cocktail. But this time, even though his buddy was raving about how amazing the wine was, DH said he had absolutely no interest and didn't feel at all like he was missing out.
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Okay, so interesting story:
We visited some of DH's family friends we haven't seen since pre-covid. These people aren't regular drinkers, the wife barely drinks at all. They're a pretty sedate couple with two kids.
However, historically, us visiting has always triggered a party because, well, we're very fun, and we always showed up with a ton of wine.
So this time we show up and they find out that we don't drink alcohol anymore, which is no big deal because they barely drink.
Apparently that didn't matter. The Malcats were visiting and these suburban parents were getting fucking lit. It was ridiculous, we were stone sober with these generally *non drinkers*, but by the time dinner was served they were both sloshed.
To be fair, this is DH's old frat brother, so the very DNA of their 3 decade friendship is soaked in booze, but still, it was pretty funny that our company would trigger teetotalers to get shit faced even though we were drinking NA beverages.
Surprisingly, I wasn't at all bothered. These are friends of DH's that I actually prefer drunk funnily enough. They're a bit too high strung for me sober.
So that was interesting. Since quitting I've been rather repelled by drunk people. It was nice to see that I *can* be around drunk people and be totally comfortable.
On a different note, DH said that this was the first event where people were drinking that he didn't have even a hint of desire to join them. He often doesn't drink at get togethers if I'm there, but it takes a bit of effort to pass up a nice wine or gin cocktail. But this time, even though his buddy was raving about how amazing the wine was, DH said he had absolutely no interest and didn't feel at all like he was missing out.
There are definitely variations in tolerability of individual drunk people. I spent over a decade (multiple weeks at a time, once per year) of extremely boozy evenings at a site that served as both a hotel and scientific research location, with large groups of scientists and some guests intermingling at cocktail/dinner hour in various combinations over weeks as people came and went. Some people were consistently pleasant while drinking, some were unbelievably tiresome or obnoxious. And it's sometimes hard to predict who will fall into each category based on their sober personality, but most people did seem fairly consistent in their drunk personality from night to night over weeks, barring something unusual happening like a fight or an upsetting incident.
However, I have noted that people who slide down the slope of abuse do tend to gradually become much more unpleasant drunks. Several people I know started out fairly fun, ebulliant drinkers a few decades ago, but as dependence grew they became either hostile or weepy drunks. So I don't think the effects are entirely based on individual's personality, or even necessarily context in which they are drinking.
It's really interesting. It was interesting when I was a drinker (my two settings were more positive/chatty, followed by a sudden wind-down to being tired and 'done' with the night, but not weepy or hostile, after about 2 hours), and it's still interesting as a nondrinker.
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To clarify, it's not so much people's drunken behaviour that has bothered me, it's that until now, I've been uncomfortable being around anyone at all drunk.
I think it was just part of the process of getting used to sobriety. My mom had the exact same reaction when she quit drinking for a few years a decade ago. She also had to quit for medication reasons, and she became really agitated by seeing people drunk.
So I think it's a good sign that it doesn't bother me anymore. Alcohol and drunkenness are becoming more irrelevant. Not so much this thing I *don't do* and more this thing I don't care much about.
I'm sure moving forward I will be irritated by obnoxious drinks, but more because they're obnoxious, and not just because they're drunk.
FTR, I also had two modes: ultra chatty/ dance-y mode, and then on the rare occasions that I drank heavily, ultra appreciative mode. OMG, if I was really drunk then you NEEDED to know how much I appreciated and respected you and how special you were to me. It didn't really matter if I didn't know you that well, or even if I disliked you, if I was drunk, you were so, so appreciated and it was VERY important that you know that.
Fucking ridiculous.
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Well, this is minuscule but but I've gone 4 days without drinking..which is the longest I've gone in months. (Seriously!)
I don't generally drink to excess, but it's a daily thing. A cocktail or beer, wine, etc after work. Sometimes two.
I'm going to see how long I can go. Honestly even if it just a week I'll be proud of myself, it's such a lifestyle habit.
My SO is great though..I told him it was time for me to have a bit of an anti-inflammatory/sober moment and he hasn't brought any beer or wine into the house (and if he drinks a drop of scotch it doesn't tempt me one bit).
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Well, this is minuscule but but I've gone 4 days without drinking..which is the longest I've gone in months. (Seriously!)
I don't generally drink to excess, but it's a daily thing. A cocktail or beer, wine, etc after work. Sometimes two.
I'm going to see how long I can go. Honestly even if it just a week I'll be proud of myself, it's such a lifestyle habit.
My SO is great though..I told him it was time for me to have a bit of an anti-inflammatory/sober moment and he hasn't brought any beer or wine into the house (and if he drinks a drop of scotch it doesn't tempt me one bit).
The first week is actually the biggest accomplishment. That's BY FAR the hardest stretch for most people.
That's not at all a drop in the bucket. During this whole process, I felt most accomplished at day 10. It had been years since I had gone 10 days, and that's when it really felt like I was doing something.
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I have gone a number of weeks with only one glass of prosecco through so many meals and happy hours and many many offers of alcohol in a very drinking centered social circle I live in. I love the taste of prosecco so much I will tolerate the very uncomfortable side effects from drinking it. But only the tiniest amount and only for a very special taste. Mostly I am drinking soda stream water flavoured with my own fruit juices or simple syrups.
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Well, this is minuscule but but I've gone 4 days without drinking..which is the longest I've gone in months. (Seriously!)
I don't generally drink to excess, but it's a daily thing. A cocktail or beer, wine, etc after work. Sometimes two.
I'm going to see how long I can go. Honestly even if it just a week I'll be proud of myself, it's such a lifestyle habit.
My SO is great though..I told him it was time for me to have a bit of an anti-inflammatory/sober moment and he hasn't brought any beer or wine into the house (and if he drinks a drop of scotch it doesn't tempt me one bit).
You should feel proud.
The first 10 days were also a giant accomplishment for me. I was also a daily but not excessive drinker, but I had rarely skipped more than a very occasional day in almost 20 years, let alone months. My single stretch of a week or longer without booze occurred b/c I was literally deep in a tropical jungle for 10 days without any access. When I hit 2 weeks AF, I couldn't even believe it.
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Well, this is minuscule but but I've gone 4 days without drinking..which is the longest I've gone in months. (Seriously!)
I don't generally drink to excess, but it's a daily thing. A cocktail or beer, wine, etc after work. Sometimes two.
I'm going to see how long I can go. Honestly even if it just a week I'll be proud of myself, it's such a lifestyle habit.
My SO is great though..I told him it was time for me to have a bit of an anti-inflammatory/sober moment and he hasn't brought any beer or wine into the house (and if he drinks a drop of scotch it doesn't tempt me one bit).
That is great. These tiny mindless habits are the hardest ones to see or attempt to change.
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Thanks for the encouragement @mspym & @Malcat
--it feels funny to post after just days but it's odd how much of an accomplishment it feels like to disrupt a daily routine. Day 5 :)
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Thanks for the encouragement @mspym & @Malcat
--it feels funny to post after just days but it's odd how much of an accomplishment it feels like to disrupt a daily routine. Day 5 :)
Not funny, this is the time you should be posting most. Whether you stick to it or not. It's good to talk it through because there are a lot of feelings that come up.
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Thanks for the encouragement @mspym & @Malcat
--it feels funny to post after just days but it's odd how much of an accomplishment it feels like to disrupt a daily routine. Day 5 :)
Not funny, this is the time you should be posting most. Whether you stick to it or not. It's good to talk it through because there are a lot of feelings that come up.
+1000
This is my per-page standard recommendation for r/stopdrinking for anyone who wants a super supportive and understanding community that is maybe less connected to other parts of your online life including here. They were a huge part of me working through my relationship with alcohol and the daily check-ins helped me in the early days.
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I learned a lot about my similar-sounding daily but not a ton habit in the first ten days of stopping. Good for you!
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I am definitely learning a lot (especially that some habits might not be serving me anymore!)
The biggest difference is in sleep and energy level. Been waking up less groggy and staying up later easily, likely b/c I haven't depressed my system..
It hasn't been difficult but yesterday I noticed an urge for a cocktail in the evening and made myself a sparkling water/oxymel drink and it passed. It's unlikely I'll stop drinking completely but my desire is to understand that daily compulsion and be cognisant of my decisions regarding alcohol.
Again, thanks for the support everyone :)
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So I've decided I need to stop drinking. I've been tracking my mood for the past three months, and I've really begun to notice I am more depressed the day after drinking, enough that it doesn't seem like just the rest of my depression. Especially if I have more than 2 drinks. 1-2 drinks didn't seem to make an acute difference, but I can't rule out that it isn't making things worse. And I can't afford to be more depressed than I already am. It's not worth the hour or two that I think I feel better while drinking.
So, I'm going to do the alcohol experiment again, and actually follow through with all of it instead of just glancing through the email. I've already told my husband, and I'm thinking of telling my best friend next time I talk to her to have another person to hold me accountable. After I finish the experiment I'm debating having no more than 2 drinks at special occasions, but I'm not sure it's worth it or a good idea.
I've only been drinking about once a week for the last few months, so I'm not really craving yet. But I could really use some advice on replacement behaviors. I've been using alcohol to have an escape from my depression, as backwards as that is. But I don't have a lot of things in my life that make me feel good that I can replace the alcohol with. So, if it's ok to ask, anything you can think of to replace it would be super helpful. I'm going to be getting seltzer for when I want to drink something fancy. But if I can think of something to do in the evenings to feel better and relaxed that would be great.
Thank you for listening and sorry if I overshared.
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So I've decided I need to stop drinking. I've been tracking my mood for the past three months, and I've really begun to notice I am more depressed the day after drinking, enough that it doesn't seem like just the rest of my depression. Especially if I have more than 2 drinks. 1-2 drinks didn't seem to make an acute difference, but I can't rule out that it isn't making things worse. And I can't afford to be more depressed than I already am. It's not worth the hour or two that I think I feel better while drinking.
So, I'm going to do the alcohol experiment again, and actually follow through with all of it instead of just glancing through the email. I've already told my husband, and I'm thinking of telling my best friend next time I talk to her to have another person to hold me accountable. After I finish the experiment I'm debating having no more than 2 drinks at special occasions, but I'm not sure it's worth it or a good idea.
I've only been drinking about once a week for the last few months, so I'm not really craving yet. But I could really use some advice on replacement behaviors. I've been using alcohol to have an escape from my depression, as backwards as that is. But I don't have a lot of things in my life that make me feel good that I can replace the alcohol with. So, if it's ok to ask, anything you can think of to replace it would be super helpful. I'm going to be getting seltzer for when I want to drink something fancy. But if I can think of something to do in the evenings to feel better and relaxed that would be great.
Thank you for listening and sorry if I overshared.
You don't need to make that decision now, in fact you shouldn't even try to. The whole point of the Alcohol Experiment is to discover what relationship you want to have with alcohol, and *then* to decide.
Also, none of what you talked about is over sharing. Not even a little bit objectively so.
I was shocked to find how sad alcohol made me when I ran my drinking experiment in January. I started the day in a perfectly good mood, and then a few drinks in, I felt intense, penetrating despair. Only then did I realize how much I had been worsening my mood back when I was drinking regularly due to stress. I just thought I felt awful because life was kind of awful at the time, but the experience of going from perfectly happy to morose really showed me how I had been artificially boosting the misery at that time.
The Alcohol Experiment and the book really helped me understand that we code alcohol as fun because we drink it in fun situations, and we crave it when we're depressed because although it makes the negative feelings worse, it makes depression feel normal, more comfortable. It's like getting cozy in a cold wet blanket.
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So I've decided I need to stop drinking. I've been tracking my mood for the past three months, and I've really begun to notice I am more depressed the day after drinking, enough that it doesn't seem like just the rest of my depression. Especially if I have more than 2 drinks. 1-2 drinks didn't seem to make an acute difference, but I can't rule out that it isn't making things worse. And I can't afford to be more depressed than I already am. It's not worth the hour or two that I think I feel better while drinking.
So, I'm going to do the alcohol experiment again, and actually follow through with all of it instead of just glancing through the email. I've already told my husband, and I'm thinking of telling my best friend next time I talk to her to have another person to hold me accountable. After I finish the experiment I'm debating having no more than 2 drinks at special occasions, but I'm not sure it's worth it or a good idea.
I've only been drinking about once a week for the last few months, so I'm not really craving yet. But I could really use some advice on replacement behaviors. I've been using alcohol to have an escape from my depression, as backwards as that is. But I don't have a lot of things in my life that make me feel good that I can replace the alcohol with. So, if it's ok to ask, anything you can think of to replace it would be super helpful. I'm going to be getting seltzer for when I want to drink something fancy. But if I can think of something to do in the evenings to feel better and relaxed that would be great.
Thank you for listening and sorry if I overshared.
You don't need to make that decision now, in fact you shouldn't even try to. The whole point of the Alcohol Experiment is to discover what relationship you want to have with alcohol, and *then* to decide.
Also, none of what you talked about is over sharing. Not even a little bit objectively so.
I was shocked to find how sad alcohol made me when I ran my drinking experiment in January. I started the day in a perfectly good mood, and then a few drinks in, I felt intense, penetrating despair. Only then did I realize how much I had been worsening my mood back when I was drinking regularly due to stress. I just thought I felt awful because life was kind of awful at the time, but the experience of going from perfectly happy to morose really showed me how I had been artificially boosting the misery at that time.
The Alcohol Experiment and the book really helped me understand that we code alcohol as fun because we drink it in fun situations, and we crave it when we're depressed because although it makes the negative feelings worse, it makes depression feel normal, more comfortable. It's like getting cozy in a cold wet blanket.
I second ALL of this. As a daily drinker of about 2 drinks/day, I never noticed any overt effects on mood (except the surge of brief euphoria when I started drinking each evening). But for years I'd been waking up feeling sort of empty and kind of in a general state of 'what's the point?/why don't I have any enthusiasm for anything?/is this all I have to look forward to in life?'. I attributed this to 1) general tendency to be chronically mildly depressed; and 2) outside objective factors in my life.
Once I quit drinking I found out to my shock that nearly ALL of that morning 'deadness' was b/c of the booze.
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Thank you both for your replies. Malcat, saying that alcohol makes the depression feel normal makes so much sense to me. I've never thought of that before, but it rings true, especially since I generally feel very...abnormal? because of my depression. And, Wenchsenior, I do have trouble getting going after my daughter gets on the bus, so maybe cutting the alcohol will help with that. I've been depressed for a very long time before I started drinking, but I used to be more productive, despite the depression.
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So I've decided I need to stop drinking. I've been tracking my mood for the past three months, and I've really begun to notice I am more depressed the day after drinking, enough that it doesn't seem like just the rest of my depression. Especially if I have more than 2 drinks. 1-2 drinks didn't seem to make an acute difference, but I can't rule out that it isn't making things worse. And I can't afford to be more depressed than I already am. It's not worth the hour or two that I think I feel better while drinking.
So, I'm going to do the alcohol experiment again, and actually follow through with all of it instead of just glancing through the email. I've already told my husband, and I'm thinking of telling my best friend next time I talk to her to have another person to hold me accountable. After I finish the experiment I'm debating having no more than 2 drinks at special occasions, but I'm not sure it's worth it or a good idea.
I've only been drinking about once a week for the last few months, so I'm not really craving yet. But I could really use some advice on replacement behaviors. I've been using alcohol to have an escape from my depression, as backwards as that is. But I don't have a lot of things in my life that make me feel good that I can replace the alcohol with. So, if it's ok to ask, anything you can think of to replace it would be super helpful. I'm going to be getting seltzer for when I want to drink something fancy. But if I can think of something to do in the evenings to feel better and relaxed that would be great.
Thank you for listening and sorry if I overshared.
You don't need to make that decision now, in fact you shouldn't even try to. The whole point of the Alcohol Experiment is to discover what relationship you want to have with alcohol, and *then* to decide.
Also, none of what you talked about is over sharing. Not even a little bit objectively so.
I was shocked to find how sad alcohol made me when I ran my drinking experiment in January. I started the day in a perfectly good mood, and then a few drinks in, I felt intense, penetrating despair. Only then did I realize how much I had been worsening my mood back when I was drinking regularly due to stress. I just thought I felt awful because life was kind of awful at the time, but the experience of going from perfectly happy to morose really showed me how I had been artificially boosting the misery at that time.
The Alcohol Experiment and the book really helped me understand that we code alcohol as fun because we drink it in fun situations, and we crave it when we're depressed because although it makes the negative feelings worse, it makes depression feel normal, more comfortable. It's like getting cozy in a cold wet blanket.
I second ALL of this. As a daily drinker of about 2 drinks/day, I never noticed any overt effects on mood (except the surge of brief euphoria when I started drinking each evening). But for years I'd been waking up feeling sort of empty and kind of in a general state of 'what's the point?/why don't I have any enthusiasm for anything?/is this all I have to look forward to in life?'. I attributed this to 1) general tendency to be chronically mildly depressed; and 2) outside objective factors in my life.
Once I quit drinking I found out to my shock that nearly ALL of that morning 'deadness' was b/c of the booze.
Also that the best euphoria never came from the booze itself, it came from the endogenous chemicals that an addicted brain releases as a carrot to get you to pour those two drinks every evening. That's why it's at it's highest when you open the bottle, pour the glass, and take the first few sips, which is well before alcohol can be metabolized and have an effect on your mood.
The best part of drinking is a bribe from your brain to give it it's fix.
I only now realize this in restrospect. I was once on a medication that made the effects of alcohol just awful, like really unbearably dreadful, but I could still get the high of having a drink because my brain would still bribe me with an endorphin release to pour the glass in the first place because it was still addicted, whether the effects were fun or not.
Likewise, when I was put on Amitriptyline, which is not at all enjoyable, but insanely addictive, I hated the effects of it, but started looking forward to the dose, and once I started tapering off, had recurrent thoughts of reasons why I might want to stay on it, even though it did nothing for my symptoms and made me feel awful.
We can rationally understand being addicted to things that objectively feel good, like opiates, but the level of how good they feel has almost nothing to do with how the brain gets addicted to them. I've been on a lot of opiates, and some of the least addictive ones are the ones that feel the best.
The brain gets addicted to addictive substances because they're addictive substances, not because they feel good. The fact that they feel good just explains why people use them enough to get addicted, but the addiction is a chemical thing, and can be completely unrelated to how the drug actually feels.
Once you are addicted though, the brain will dole out happy chemicals like candy to motivate you to use the substance, so what you become psychologically addicted to is the reward of giving the addicted brain what it wants. Likewise, it will flood you with hopelessness to motivate you to use so that you can get the boost of euphoric endorphins to relieve the despair.
Basically, the vast majority of feelings that motivate using an addictive substance are coming from inside your head, not from the drug itself. Your brain is radically altering how it reacts to the world around you just to keep you motivated to seek and consume the chemical it's addicted to, and you will believe 100% that your despair is legitimate and that the chemical is what makes you feel better.
It's a trick.
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So, I'm going to do the alcohol experiment again, and actually follow through with all of it instead of just glancing through the email. I've already told my husband, and I'm thinking of telling my best friend next time I talk to her to have another person to hold me accountable. After I finish the experiment I'm debating having no more than 2 drinks at special occasions, but I'm not sure it's worth it or a good idea.
I've only been drinking about once a week for the last few months, so I'm not really craving yet. But I could really use some advice on replacement behaviors. I've been using alcohol to have an escape from my depression, as backwards as that is. But I don't have a lot of things in my life that make me feel good that I can replace the alcohol with. So, if it's ok to ask, anything you can think of to replace it would be super helpful. I'm going to be getting seltzer for when I want to drink something fancy. But if I can think of something to do in the evenings to feel better and relaxed that would be great.
Thank you for listening and sorry if I overshared.
Yes, I strongly recommend truly engaging with that Experiment. Actually DO the exercises, read/listen to the material etc. You definitely get a lot more out of it that way.
I found that, b/c alcohol had damaged my neurotransmitter function, it took about a month to begin seeing consistent mood improvements. I anticipated that this might be the case, so before I started the Experiment I brainstormed a lot of self-care tools and activities and I planned a schedule that prioritized my emotional health.
So I tried to minimize things that I knew would be triggers (e.g., socializing, extra work, cooking [I dislike cooking and it was a trigger]; spoke to my husband so that he wouldn't offer me booze or drink in front of me for that first month; avoided internet news/social media/etc that tends to drag down my mood); and I planned time every day for both work on the Experiment and mental health support.
Things that I found super helpful in general.
GOING OUTSIDE AND GETTING SUN EXPOSURE EVERY DAY (esp useful in late afternoon/early evening when my mood tended to be low and cravings strong). This is absolutely crucial for me. I can be in the worst mood, and 20 minutes outside in the sun dramatically improves things 95% of the time.
Eating well (esp avoiding food that caused blood sugar spikes and crashes)
Aerobic exercise (in my case, swimming)
Meditation/mindfulness every day
Reviewing and keeping to hand cognitive behavioral therapy techniques that I know work for my anxiety.
Things that I found helpful in particular when approaching my trigger 'window' or experiencing a craving:
Keeping to hand an actual written list of all the reasons I didn't want to drink, and referring to it when needed. I carried it with me the first 6 months.
Distraction, especially stuff that could help get me out of my analytical brain and closer to 'flow state' (side note, the more flow state I experience on the regular, the better my mental health). Dancing to favorite music, yoga, coloring books, puzzles, hot bath with book, guided meditation, called a friend, etc.
I found I was SUPER triggered when my drinking 'window' combined (as it often did) with my blood sugar being low. I rarely feel hungry, so I had to set alarms for myself to remind myself to eat a healthy snack about half an hour before my typical craving hour. It made a big difference.
As time went on, I got much better at learning to 'urge surf', but in the early days I was much more in avoidance mode.
Above all, don't be scared! Keep an open mind and try to embrace this as a learning experience, from which you'll gain a lot of knowledge. As long as you are learning more, you can apply the new knowledge to improve going forward.
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So I've decided I need to stop drinking. I've been tracking my mood for the past three months, and I've really begun to notice I am more depressed the day after drinking, enough that it doesn't seem like just the rest of my depression. Especially if I have more than 2 drinks. 1-2 drinks didn't seem to make an acute difference, but I can't rule out that it isn't making things worse. And I can't afford to be more depressed than I already am. It's not worth the hour or two that I think I feel better while drinking.
So, I'm going to do the alcohol experiment again, and actually follow through with all of it instead of just glancing through the email. I've already told my husband, and I'm thinking of telling my best friend next time I talk to her to have another person to hold me accountable. After I finish the experiment I'm debating having no more than 2 drinks at special occasions, but I'm not sure it's worth it or a good idea.
I've only been drinking about once a week for the last few months, so I'm not really craving yet. But I could really use some advice on replacement behaviors. I've been using alcohol to have an escape from my depression, as backwards as that is. But I don't have a lot of things in my life that make me feel good that I can replace the alcohol with. So, if it's ok to ask, anything you can think of to replace it would be super helpful. I'm going to be getting seltzer for when I want to drink something fancy. But if I can think of something to do in the evenings to feel better and relaxed that would be great.
Thank you for listening and sorry if I overshared.
You don't need to make that decision now, in fact you shouldn't even try to. The whole point of the Alcohol Experiment is to discover what relationship you want to have with alcohol, and *then* to decide.
Also, none of what you talked about is over sharing. Not even a little bit objectively so.
I was shocked to find how sad alcohol made me when I ran my drinking experiment in January. I started the day in a perfectly good mood, and then a few drinks in, I felt intense, penetrating despair. Only then did I realize how much I had been worsening my mood back when I was drinking regularly due to stress. I just thought I felt awful because life was kind of awful at the time, but the experience of going from perfectly happy to morose really showed me how I had been artificially boosting the misery at that time.
The Alcohol Experiment and the book really helped me understand that we code alcohol as fun because we drink it in fun situations, and we crave it when we're depressed because although it makes the negative feelings worse, it makes depression feel normal, more comfortable. It's like getting cozy in a cold wet blanket.
I second ALL of this. As a daily drinker of about 2 drinks/day, I never noticed any overt effects on mood (except the surge of brief euphoria when I started drinking each evening). But for years I'd been waking up feeling sort of empty and kind of in a general state of 'what's the point?/why don't I have any enthusiasm for anything?/is this all I have to look forward to in life?'. I attributed this to 1) general tendency to be chronically mildly depressed; and 2) outside objective factors in my life.
Once I quit drinking I found out to my shock that nearly ALL of that morning 'deadness' was b/c of the booze.
Also that the best euphoria never came from the booze itself, it came from the endogenous chemicals that an addicted brain releases as a carrot to get you to pour those two drinks every evening. That's why it's at it's highest when you open the bottle, pour the glass, and take the first few sips, which is well before alcohol can be metabolized and have an effect on your mood.
The best part of drinking is a bribe from your brain to give it it's fix.
100% true. I believed I was getting about 4-5 hours of enjoyment every evening, which seemed great. But when I carefully and objectively started monitoring how I felt physically and mentally during the course of each evening, the reality was that most of the euphoria was the anticipation of drinking, the surge of endorphins upon heading toward the wine bottle and pouring, and then the initial 30 minutes (at most) of the buzz. After that it was 'meh' to 'bleh' for the other 3+ hours. I did maintain physical relaxation, but it turned out I could get that without drinking, which when I was drinking all the time I didn't believe.
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So I've decided I need to stop drinking. I've been tracking my mood for the past three months, and I've really begun to notice I am more depressed the day after drinking, enough that it doesn't seem like just the rest of my depression. Especially if I have more than 2 drinks. 1-2 drinks didn't seem to make an acute difference, but I can't rule out that it isn't making things worse. And I can't afford to be more depressed than I already am. It's not worth the hour or two that I think I feel better while drinking.
So, I'm going to do the alcohol experiment again, and actually follow through with all of it instead of just glancing through the email. I've already told my husband, and I'm thinking of telling my best friend next time I talk to her to have another person to hold me accountable. After I finish the experiment I'm debating having no more than 2 drinks at special occasions, but I'm not sure it's worth it or a good idea.
I've only been drinking about once a week for the last few months, so I'm not really craving yet. But I could really use some advice on replacement behaviors. I've been using alcohol to have an escape from my depression, as backwards as that is. But I don't have a lot of things in my life that make me feel good that I can replace the alcohol with. So, if it's ok to ask, anything you can think of to replace it would be super helpful. I'm going to be getting seltzer for when I want to drink something fancy. But if I can think of something to do in the evenings to feel better and relaxed that would be great.
Thank you for listening and sorry if I overshared.
You don't need to make that decision now, in fact you shouldn't even try to. The whole point of the Alcohol Experiment is to discover what relationship you want to have with alcohol, and *then* to decide.
Also, none of what you talked about is over sharing. Not even a little bit objectively so.
I was shocked to find how sad alcohol made me when I ran my drinking experiment in January. I started the day in a perfectly good mood, and then a few drinks in, I felt intense, penetrating despair. Only then did I realize how much I had been worsening my mood back when I was drinking regularly due to stress. I just thought I felt awful because life was kind of awful at the time, but the experience of going from perfectly happy to morose really showed me how I had been artificially boosting the misery at that time.
The Alcohol Experiment and the book really helped me understand that we code alcohol as fun because we drink it in fun situations, and we crave it when we're depressed because although it makes the negative feelings worse, it makes depression feel normal, more comfortable. It's like getting cozy in a cold wet blanket.
I second ALL of this. As a daily drinker of about 2 drinks/day, I never noticed any overt effects on mood (except the surge of brief euphoria when I started drinking each evening). But for years I'd been waking up feeling sort of empty and kind of in a general state of 'what's the point?/why don't I have any enthusiasm for anything?/is this all I have to look forward to in life?'. I attributed this to 1) general tendency to be chronically mildly depressed; and 2) outside objective factors in my life.
Once I quit drinking I found out to my shock that nearly ALL of that morning 'deadness' was b/c of the booze.
Also that the best euphoria never came from the booze itself, it came from the endogenous chemicals that an addicted brain releases as a carrot to get you to pour those two drinks every evening. That's why it's at it's highest when you open the bottle, pour the glass, and take the first few sips, which is well before alcohol can be metabolized and have an effect on your mood.
The best part of drinking is a bribe from your brain to give it it's fix.
100% true. I believed I was getting about 4-5 hours of enjoyment every evening, which seemed great. But when I carefully and objectively started monitoring how I felt physically and mentally during the course of each evening, the reality was that most of the euphoria was the anticipation of drinking, the surge of endorphins upon heading toward the wine bottle and pouring, and then the initial 30 minutes (at most) of the buzz. After that it was 'meh' to 'bleh' for the other 3+ hours. I did maintain physical relaxation, but it turned out I could get that without drinking, which when I was drinking all the time I didn't believe.
Exactly, I too thought I was getting a few hours of peace and calm because objectively, my distress was less bothersome, but really it was just that drinking allowed me to be so much more comfortable with the distress, which in turn lowered my motivation to resolve the factors causing it.
So yes, objectively, drinking was making it easier to keep doing things that were making me miserable, but the smarter thing to do was to make my life less misery causing, not just settle into a few glasses of "it's okay for life to always feel this shitty" every night.
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So, I'm going to do the alcohol experiment again, and actually follow through with all of it instead of just glancing through the email. I've already told my husband, and I'm thinking of telling my best friend next time I talk to her to have another person to hold me accountable. After I finish the experiment I'm debating having no more than 2 drinks at special occasions, but I'm not sure it's worth it or a good idea.
I've only been drinking about once a week for the last few months, so I'm not really craving yet. But I could really use some advice on replacement behaviors. I've been using alcohol to have an escape from my depression, as backwards as that is. But I don't have a lot of things in my life that make me feel good that I can replace the alcohol with. So, if it's ok to ask, anything you can think of to replace it would be super helpful. I'm going to be getting seltzer for when I want to drink something fancy. But if I can think of something to do in the evenings to feel better and relaxed that would be great.
Thank you for listening and sorry if I overshared.
Yes, I strongly recommend truly engaging with that Experiment. Actually DO the exercises, read/listen to the material etc. You definitely get a lot more out of it that way.
I found that, b/c alcohol had damaged my neurotransmitter function, it took about a month to begin seeing consistent mood improvements. I anticipated that this might be the case, so before I started the Experiment I brainstormed a lot of self-care tools and activities and I planned a schedule that prioritized my emotional health.
So I tried to minimize things that I knew would be triggers (e.g., socializing, extra work, cooking [I dislike cooking and it was a trigger]; spoke to my husband so that he wouldn't offer me booze or drink in front of me for that first month; avoided internet news/social media/etc that tends to drag down my mood); and I planned time every day for both work on the Experiment and mental health support.
Things that I found super helpful in general.
GOING OUTSIDE AND GETTING SUN EXPOSURE EVERY DAY (esp useful in late afternoon/early evening when my mood tended to be low and cravings strong). This is absolutely crucial for me. I can be in the worst mood, and 20 minutes outside in the sun dramatically improves things 95% of the time.
Eating well (esp avoiding food that caused blood sugar spikes and crashes)
Aerobic exercise (in my case, swimming)
Meditation/mindfulness every day
Reviewing and keeping to hand cognitive behavioral therapy techniques that I know work for my anxiety.
Things that I found helpful in particular when approaching my trigger 'window' or experiencing a craving:
Keeping to hand an actual written list of all the reasons I didn't want to drink, and referring to it when needed. I carried it with me the first 6 months.
Distraction, especially stuff that could help get me out of my analytical brain and closer to 'flow state' (side note, the more flow state I experience on the regular, the better my mental health). Dancing to favorite music, yoga, coloring books, puzzles, hot bath with book, guided meditation, called a friend, etc.
I found I was SUPER triggered when my drinking 'window' combined (as it often did) with my blood sugar being low. I rarely feel hungry, so I had to set alarms for myself to remind myself to eat a healthy snack about half an hour before my typical craving hour. It made a big difference.
As time went on, I got much better at learning to 'urge surf', but in the early days I was much more in avoidance mode.
Above all, don't be scared! Keep an open mind and try to embrace this as a learning experience, from which you'll gain a lot of knowledge. As long as you are learning more, you can apply the new knowledge to improve going forward.
Thank you so much for such a detailed list of things to do to help. I recently made a goal to exercise more that I've actually been sticking to, and I'm getting outside more to wait for my daughter to get home on the bus. And maybe I'll try to pick up my embroidery again when I would normally drink. The stitches are kind of meditative and distracting enough that I don't tend to ruminate. And the bolded is really good advice. I like learning, so maybe if I think of it more like that I'll feel less like I'm depriving myself.
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@TheFrenchCat this will repeat some of @wenchsenior's tips but you could file it under 'works for >1'. I never found baths relaxing so didn't bother with them. What did work:
- get outside/do something gently physical and enjoyable esp during the witching hour. I would go for a walk around the neighbourhood either on my own or with my husband and see if I could find new plants or house features we had never seen before
- embroidery is great for occupying your hands and entering flow, also giving you a continuous set of micro goals f cravings are hitting (after this leaf/after this colour change etc etc)
- drink substitution : fancy teas now give me that transition point in the day
- journaling off line. Something about writing everything down on paper helped. Completely unfiltered and with no audience and again something to do with my hands.
- I didn't tell anyone I was taking a break for the first fortnight and after that it was really only my husband, largely because I wanted to get settled into it before dealing with other people's expectations and comments
I never got a pink cloud moment but 3-6 months later my mood was consistently better, I slept better and didn't have 3am panic attacks, and a huge drop in my anxiety levels, which it turned out my brain had been revving up to get me to self-medicate.
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I've listed what worked for me early on:
-Doing 5 minutes of vigorous exercise every time a craving was intense, this created the exact same brief high as pouring a drink
-Investing in very, very high quality tea, and having a whole routine of making and drinking tea, using my nice teapot and fine China teacups
-Playing through how I would feel *after* having a drink or two, would I feel good about myself for giving in to the craving? Would my mind and body feel better after drinking? Cravings tend to fixate on the first few drinks, but if you fixate instead on the aftermath, it makes the prospect feel less attractive. This works for all cravings.
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Thank you mspym and Malcat. I'll be coming back to these lists at some point, I'm sure. Tomorrow's one week without, and I did my weekly grocery shopping without buying any today, so the odds of my having any are pretty low till next week. We live far out from stores that sell alcohol, so to give in to a craving, I have to drive to the store. I hoping having that as a barrier will help.
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I’m booze free for at least the next couple weeks! The spouse is on-call this week and I would like to be more supportive than I was last time. 😳 Making it a two week minimum to give myself a chance to really evaluate how much booze I’ve been consuming. It hasn’t been every day, but most days I have 1-3 drinks.
I’m actually really looking forward to chasing some natural highs. Just started a new workout schedule and I plan to replace happy hour drinks with fizzy water and lime. I’m not a big sugar fan, but nuts and dark chocolate can hit the spot. Wish me luck!
So...this was not successful. Lots of excuses and life drama, but that doesn't matter much at this point. I have a new therapist, new goals, and a healthier mindset at the moment.
I've started over on a one month booze free goal. Today is day 4. I would love an accountability partner here if anyone else wants to PM or tag back and forth? Today is my first day back at work after a little over a week off. I'm currently feeling very low stress and ready to focus on other things that make me happy.
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I’m booze free for at least the next couple weeks! The spouse is on-call this week and I would like to be more supportive than I was last time. 😳 Making it a two week minimum to give myself a chance to really evaluate how much booze I’ve been consuming. It hasn’t been every day, but most days I have 1-3 drinks.
I’m actually really looking forward to chasing some natural highs. Just started a new workout schedule and I plan to replace happy hour drinks with fizzy water and lime. I’m not a big sugar fan, but nuts and dark chocolate can hit the spot. Wish me luck!
So...this was not successful. Lots of excuses and life drama, but that doesn't matter much at this point. I have a new therapist, new goals, and a healthier mindset at the moment.
I've started over on a one month booze free goal. Today is day 4. I would love an accountability partner here if anyone else wants to PM or tag back and forth? Today is my first day back at work after a little over a week off. I'm currently feeling very low stress and ready to focus on other things that make me happy.
Yo! I'll be an accountability partner if you want :) I did booze free from Jan-April but because I'm still not sure what I want my relationship with alcohol to be, it has crept back in.
Feel to to PM or message me on here.
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I’m booze free for at least the next couple weeks! The spouse is on-call this week and I would like to be more supportive than I was last time. 😳 Making it a two week minimum to give myself a chance to really evaluate how much booze I’ve been consuming. It hasn’t been every day, but most days I have 1-3 drinks.
I’m actually really looking forward to chasing some natural highs. Just started a new workout schedule and I plan to replace happy hour drinks with fizzy water and lime. I’m not a big sugar fan, but nuts and dark chocolate can hit the spot. Wish me luck!
So...this was not successful. Lots of excuses and life drama, but that doesn't matter much at this point. I have a new therapist, new goals, and a healthier mindset at the moment.
I've started over on a one month booze free goal. Today is day 4. I would love an accountability partner here if anyone else wants to PM or tag back and forth? Today is my first day back at work after a little over a week off. I'm currently feeling very low stress and ready to focus on other things that make me happy.
Feel free to post daily here too, we all remember what that first month is like.
Are you doing the Alcohol Experiment? It feels hokey as fuck, but the daily exercises really are an excellent cognitive behavioural tool for reformulating your thinking about alcohol.
For me, those first 5 days were ridiculous. I am extremely susceptible to habits, so breaking them can be miserable, and I spent those first 5 days angry. I wasn't angry about not drinking, I was extremely agitated by my stupid brain constantly bothering me to drink despite the fact that I had *decided* not to.
Annie Grace describes those early cravings as a child in the backseat of the car incessantly whining to stop for ice cream. You have places to be, you have no intention of stopping for ice cream, but that little obnoxious shit speaks up, like every few minutes with increasingly ridiculous explanations, pleas, and manipulations trying to get you to stop for fucking ice cream and you just want to scream "OMG KID SHUT THE FUCK UP!"
I got angry at my own mind constantly trying to manipulate me. It was through that that I realized just how manipulative my mind had been for years. What I slowly came to realize was that my mind was actually exaggerating my stress response to everything in order to convince me to drink.
The best part of not drinking is that my brain doesn't automatically jump to feeling like "I can't handle this shit" anymore.
It freaked me out just how much of my stress response was fake, just to make me pour a glass of wine for "relief" from that "stress".
Now don't get me wrong, I had A LOT of legitimate stress, and still do. But my reflex now is not to feel overwhelmed by it, because there is no "fix" that the snake oil salesman in my brain can sell me anymore.
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I’m booze free for at least the next couple weeks! The spouse is on-call this week and I would like to be more supportive than I was last time. Making it a two week minimum to give myself a chance to really evaluate how much booze I’ve been consuming. It hasn’t been every day, but most days I have 1-3 drinks.
I’m actually really looking forward to chasing some natural highs. Just started a new workout schedule and I plan to replace happy hour drinks with fizzy water and lime. I’m not a big sugar fan, but nuts and dark chocolate can hit the spot. Wish me luck!
So...this was not successful. Lots of excuses and life drama, but that doesn't matter much at this point. I have a new therapist, new goals, and a healthier mindset at the moment.
I've started over on a one month booze free goal. Today is day 4. I would love an accountability partner here if anyone else wants to PM or tag back and forth? Today is my first day back at work after a little over a week off. I'm currently feeling very low stress and ready to focus on other things that make me happy.
Feel free to post daily here too, we all remember what that first month is like.
Are you doing the Alcohol Experiment? It feels hokey as fuck, but the daily exercises really are an excellent cognitive behavioural tool for reformulating your thinking about alcohol.
For me, those first 5 days were ridiculous. I am extremely susceptible to habits, so breaking them can be miserable, and I spent those first 5 days angry. I wasn't angry about not drinking, I was extremely agitated by my stupid brain constantly bothering me to drink despite the fact that I had *decided* not to.
Annie Grace describes those early cravings as a child in the backseat of the car incessantly whining to stop for ice cream. You have places to be, you have no intention of stopping for ice cream, but that little obnoxious shit speaks up, like every few minutes with increasingly ridiculous explanations, pleas, and manipulations trying to get you to stop for fucking ice cream and you just want to scream "OMG KID SHUT THE FUCK UP!"
I got angry at my own mind constantly trying to manipulate me. It was through that that I realized just how manipulative my mind had been for years. What I slowly came to realize was that my mind was actually exaggerating my stress response to everything in order to convince me to drink.
The best part of not drinking is that my brain doesn't automatically jump to feeling like "I can't handle this shit" anymore.
It freaked me out just how much of my stress response was fake, just to make me pour a glass of wine for "relief" from that "stress".
Now don't get me wrong, I had A LOT of legitimate stress, and still do. But my reflex now is not to feel overwhelmed by it, because there is no "fix" that the snake oil salesman in my brain can sell me anymore.
Oh, man. Yeah. And not only was I angry, I was distressed and felt guilty that I wanted to drink when I was determined not to. And that of course was a trigger to drink, as well.
Looking back now, with clarity and a lot more knowledge about how habits form and eventually addictions can form essentially on the back of an exaggerated habit response, it's weird that society assigns (as I did, back then) so much moral value to even having DESIRE for things, let alone ACTIONS. I used to beat myself up a lot for stuff that I now realize is just a natural feature of how human brains function (sometimes in service of helpful things, sometimes in service of maladaptive things).
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Thanks all. Funny enough, I have had zero desire to drink the last 4 days. My routine has been completely off seen as I haven't been working, so that has likely messed with the habit response (in a good way).
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I hit one year without booze on August 15th, and then put off for a while deciding whether I would drink again or whether I would commit to another time period.
I’ve decided to hold off on drinking at all until the baby is 6 months old, which will be November 21st.
Why make the newborn period harder on myself by messing with my emotions in the form of booze? Why consume something that causes restless sleep when I’m already not sleeping through the night? Why add so many calories when I’m still carrying weight from pregnancy? I am so glad to be so far out of the habit that my brain isn’t fighting these questions with justifications as to why I “need” or “deserve” to drink.
A friend of mine who also has a young baby was talking about cancelling her first date night with her husband since the baby, at a restaurant she wanted to try, because she knew she couldn’t deal with the lack of sleep if she drank alcohol. I didn’t say anything — not my place — but I remembered the times I would have thought there was “no point” going to something if I wouldn’t be able to drink, and am glad that that doesn’t run through my head any more because the habit has been broken.
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Today is day 7! No issues really, I'm still not feeling much desire to drink. My spouse is doing it along with me, so that's probably really helpful. We have been doing tea in the evening after work, which we both drink much faster than alcohol. I'm thinking of getting stuff for fancier mocktails or whatnot to mix it up/keep us from feeling bored with the options.
We have been cooking more complex dinners this week than normal, perhaps partly because we have more time since removing the hour long "sit and have a drink" activity.
He goes on call for work (again) next week which is pretty good timing for keeping us honest and on track.
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@ youngwild and free,
I think quitting with a spouse is so helpful or even a friend, I had both. Mocktails are great, I had a "spritzer"the other day eating out, and I
made it at home later. Grapefruit juice and ginger beer , its fizzy and feels fancy. I also like Kombucha after dinner and sometimes mix it with plain seltzer for a bubbly feeling.
Some people drink non Alcohol beer, I do that especially at social events. It is a major crutch for me, but now that I am 2 years no beer I am considering quitting that habit too!
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@ youngwild and free,
I think quitting with a spouse is so helpful or even a friend, I had both. Mocktails are great, I made a spritzer the other day eating out, and I
made it at home later. Grapefriut juice and ginger beer , its fizzy and feels fancy. I also like Kombucha after dinner and sometimes mix it with plain selzer for a bubbly feeling.
Some people drink non Alcohol beer, I do that especially at social events. It is a major crutch for me, but now that I am 2 years no beer I am considering quitting that habit too!
I started Intermittent Fasting, which is new, but has necessarily eliminated all NA beverages since my eating window is in the morning.
I'm happy with that because even with such low carbs, sugary beverages are so bad for teeth.
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@katekat
remembered the times I would have thought there was “no point” going to something if I wouldn’t be able to drink, and am glad that that doesn’t run through my head any more because the habit has been broken.
I also felt that going out to eat was really "going out to drink" and I would balk if the restaurant did not have good draft beer.
Now I broke that habit but still I crave a fancy drink or a non alcoholic beer when I go out now to a restaurant or bar.
I also feel hanging with the wrong crowd lately has brought me to a point where I want to drink again, but I am going to hold off, I see no beneifit and I know it is just jealousy of them having a great time out. I took this week off from them and feel better and back to my usual sober state. I also KNOW they suffer the next day, that they all have a real drinking problem that they dont admit to. I would love to be a social drinker that drinks once a month but I dont think I am at the point to pull that off. I think I would get drunk then quit again soon after. I am so enjoying my sober mornings, and I have not hit all my fitness goals at least I am maintaining a lesser weight these days.
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@katekat
remembered the times I would have thought there was “no point” going to something if I wouldn’t be able to drink, and am glad that that doesn’t run through my head any more because the habit has been broken.
I also felt that going out to eat was really "going out to drink" and I would balk if the restaurant did not have good draft beer.
Now I broke that habit but still I crave a fancy drink or a non alcoholic beer when I go out now to a restaurant or bar.
I also feel hanging with the wrong crowd lately has brought me to a point where I want to drink again, but I am going to hold off, I see no beneifit and I know it is just jealousy of them having a great time out. I took this week off from them and feel better and back to my usual sober state. I also KNOW they suffer the next day, that they all have a real drinking problem that they dont admit to. I would love to be a social drinker that drinks once a month but I dont think I am at the point to pull that off. I think I would get drunk then quit again soon after. I am so enjoying my sober mornings, and I have not hit all my fitness goals at least I am maintaining a lesser weight these days.
Have you read any Annie Grace or Alan Carr?
Carr's book especially really helped me put drinking and "fun" into perspective.
I used to hate any events that weren't open bar, much less events that were totally dry. The worst for me was events that gave you one single drink ticket, that was brutal.
Now I have no problem socializing as long as I have some kind of "fun" beverage so that I don't feel left out. I don't drink pop, and can't stand sugary beverages, so if a bar doesn't have good non alcoholic options, I get a little pissy-pants when I'm stuck with flat or sparkling water as my ONLY beverage options.
Otherwise, I really focus on having fun with people, and I barely notice that I'm not drinking, and don't get jealous at all. If anything , I just get kind of bored with everyone when they tip over into being too drunk to really be present anymore and at that point, there's no real reason to talk to them, because they won't remember anything anyway. You know, the point where drunk people just talk at each other, not to each other.
Up to that point, I have a blast.
Once I wrapped my mind around the fact that alcohol doesn't make anything fun, it's just the brain being excited about getting it's fix that makes it feel fun, I stopped feeling like I was missing out.
After my experiment after a year sober where I drank alone, doing nothing interesting, that really showed me that alcohol doesn't make anything fun, it actually quickly makes me feel deeply sad for absolutely NO reason.
That really helped me realize that when people have fun while drinking together, they're actually having fun *despite* the neurological influence of alcohol, not because of it.
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Knew I was going to have to do it sooner or later, and I've decided to let the day be today. I have years worth of evidence that "I really need to start cutting back" is just not going to cut it. I drink enough to get mildly to moderately drunk a good 3-5 nights per week.
This habit is in extreme contradiction to my other, more mustachian good habits, and it is an enabler of a host of other bad ones. I'm doing The Alcohol Experiment as I think it will help provide me the right tools with dealing with the mental gymnastics my brain is going to do to try to get me to keep drinking. I'm looking forward to reversing mental and physical deficits that my drinking may have brought on. I'm also looking forward to buying a good helping of VTSAX with the money I'm no longer boozing away.
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Knew I was going to have to do it sooner or later, and I've decided to let the day be today. I have years worth of evidence that "I really need to start cutting back" is just not going to cut it. I drink enough to get mildly to moderately drunk a good 3-5 nights per week.
This habit is in extreme contradiction to my other, more mustachian good habits, and it is an enabler of a host of other bad ones. I'm doing The Alcohol Experiment as I think it will help provide me the right tools with dealing with the mental gymnastics my brain is going to do to try to get me to keep drinking. I'm looking forward to reversing mental and physical deficits that my drinking may have brought on. I'm also looking forward to buying a good helping of VTSAX with the money I'm no longer boozing away.
Good luck!!
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Knew I was going to have to do it sooner or later, and I've decided to let the day be today. I have years worth of evidence that "I really need to start cutting back" is just not going to cut it. This habit is in extreme contradiction to my other, more mustachian good habits, and it is an enabler of a host of other bad ones. I drink enough to get mildly to moderately drunk a good 3-5 nights per week. I'm doing The Alcohol Experiment as I think it will help provide me the right tools with dealing with the mental gymnastics my brain is going to do to try to get me to keep drinking. I'm looking forward to reversing mental and physical deficits that my drinking may have brought on. I'm also looking forward to buying a good helping of VTSAX with the money I'm no longer boozing away.
Welcome!
If someone who LOVED wine as much as I did can come around, anyone can.
I too felt like a total hypocrite with my drinking, but I justified it as my "one thing", and amped up my love for it even more, because I saw it as the one major unhealthy indulgence that allowed me to be strict about everything else. Yeah... I told myself a lot of lies back then.
I'm excited for you.
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I kinda figured it might be a time for a quick check-in here. I'm going 9 months and 23 days without the stuff, and coming up on 75% of the way through my original year without alcohol experiment. Once summer came around the rose-colored glasses started to fade, and I am back at normal life not riding high on the novelty of doing something different. The same problems in my life exist, and I have to continue to choose to deal with them and my unpleasant emotions. I don't feel miraculously fit anymore, and I don't weigh any less than I did five months ago, and my magical productive energy is gone. But I don't ever feel even the slightest bit hungover, and I am honestly still enjoying the simplicity that being dry has. I don't have to fuss at the grocery store over the ideal combo of sale price and beer taste to pick the best option every few days. It's still, in a word, nice, to not think about alcohol.
I started Intermittent Fasting, which is new, but has necessarily eliminated all NA beverages since my eating window is in the morning.
I know lots of folks that practice IF but none that have their eating window in the morning. Once again, Malcat gives us a lesson in how to confidently live to the beat of your own drum. Thanks for sharing your perspectives with us, Malcat.
And good luck to @SpaceCow on the start of your experiment!
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Knew I was going to have to do it sooner or later, and I've decided to let the day be today. I have years worth of evidence that "I really need to start cutting back" is just not going to cut it. I drink enough to get mildly to moderately drunk a good 3-5 nights per week.
@SpaceCow I too had years of evidence that wishing wouldn't make me a completely different drinker than I was. The Annie Grace book was a game-changer for me, r/stopdrinking provided some great support any time I needed it, and it turns out my physical and mental health - even my teeth! - are all happier without drinking.
@jps I never got the pinkcloud so never had to deal with it disappearing. It sounds hard but the benefits continue to accumulate, even if its just the ongoing simplicity of never having to think about alcohol again. Are you getting any help to deal with the problems in your life?
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I kinda figured it might be a time for a quick check-in here. I'm going 9 months and 23 days without the stuff, and coming up on 75% of the way through my original year without alcohol experiment. Once summer came around the rose-colored glasses started to fade, and I am back at normal life not riding high on the novelty of doing something different. The same problems in my life exist, and I have to continue to choose to deal with them and my unpleasant emotions. I don't feel miraculously fit anymore, and I don't weigh any less than I did five months ago, and my magical productive energy is gone. But I don't ever feel even the slightest bit hungover, and I am honestly still enjoying the simplicity that being dry has. I don't have to fuss at the grocery store over the ideal combo of sale price and beer taste to pick the best option every few days. It's still, in a word, nice, to not think about alcohol.
I started Intermittent Fasting, which is new, but has necessarily eliminated all NA beverages since my eating window is in the morning.
I know lots of folks that practice IF but none that have their eating window in the morning. Once again, Malcat gives us a lesson in how to confidently live to the beat of your own drum. Thanks for sharing your perspectives with us, Malcat.
And good luck to @SpaceCow on the start of your experiment!
It honestly never even occured to me to do IF any other way.
And yes, I've never not known how to march to the beat of my own drum. To be fair though, I was raised by phenomenally cool weirdos who always made doing your own thing look chic as fuck.
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Hello everyone.
I am not in the process of giving up alcohol (I have never been much of a drinker). But today I finished a very stressful project and felt like I needed to celebrated. I went to a store to buy myself a bottle of wine. I was browsing all the pretty labels when it occurred to me that there is actually no connection between wine and my stressful project. Why am I in this section? Isn’t it the same old consumerism that I need to buy something? To associate a product with celebration?
I just left. At home i cooked myself a nice meal and drunk some green tea.
Felt good to not operate on autopilot. Sorry for rambling, but I needed to share, even if I can’t explain why the moment felt important to me.
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Hello everyone.
I am not in the process of giving up alcohol (I have never been much of a drinker). But today I finished a very stressful project and felt like I needed to celebrated. I went to a store to buy myself a bottle of wine. I was browsing all the pretty labels when it occurred to me that there is actually no connection between wine and my stressful project. Why am I in this section? Isn’t it the same old consumerism that I need to buy something? To associate a product with celebration?
I just left. At home i cooked myself a nice meal and drunk some green tea.
Felt good to not operate on autopilot. Sorry for rambling, but I needed to share, even if I can’t explain why the moment felt important to me.
No need to apologize. This is awesome! Isn’t the whole point of this community to challenge your consumerism in order to increase happiness?
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Spouse is attending a thing this weekend and said that I should get some NA beer to try and do something fun while she's gone. Picked up a 6-pack at TJ's of a supposedly very promising cool company that makes NA beers of multiple varieties. I was like "okay I guess I can try this" even though I wasn't really feeling it. I opened one up and took a drink and it felt like the worst thing to ever pass my lips. It tasted like my first beer when I was a young man, like how the beer that your uncle drinks smells when you're a child (you know, at the picnic, or family reunion or whatever, and you can smell it and wonder why the adults would drink something that smells so off). I was shocked, since I know I like beer and this was apparently a good one. I tried a couple more drinks. Each drink was terrible. I couldn't see myself enjoying this so I poured it out and I'm going to have DW try one when she gets home, since she is an active beer drinker, to tell me if it's as horrible as I think. I later looked up the brew on some beer-reviewing websites and the consensus seems to be that it is fairly close to a real IPA and supremely drinkable. Boy, do I disagree.
My hunch is that I've simply lost my taste for beer after 8 months. This was a little sad to think about at first, since I used to really enjoy the act of drinking beer. It might be more of a relief than anything though; if I have truly lost my taste I would simply be absolved of any of the choices and cost of drinking beer regularly. I'd be missing out on only the thought "this beer tastes nice," and gaining freedom from any other inconvenience, burden, or side effects that come with it. No more trying to thread the needle between "just enough beer" and "too much beer," which was sometimes like a half a beer's difference. No more spending all of my allowance each month on a weekly six pack. No more "beer clutter" that happens when I settle in for the evening with two or three beers and lose all motivation to put away my dishes (not that I am super tidy now, but I am trying to systematically attack each underlying issue). This is a super exciting development to me, and it could well be worth the $9.99 I spent to learn it.
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I was so excited when I lost my taste for wine.
It really showed me just how much your brain manipulates you to drink. Once it gets a taste for the addictive nature of alcohol, it will actually alter your perception of the taste and convince you that this objectively fucking horrible tasting thing actually tastes great.
There's a reason that as a teen we drowned booze in sugar to be able to tolerate it. There's a reason a lot of women, like me, never develop a taste for whiskey, because we can get away with just drinking wine for our brain to get it's desired hit.
It's fucking insane how your brain literally alters the way something frankly, and inarguably gross tastes, just to convince you that you love it and want to drink it often.
Now that's dealcohlized beer. Imagine adding the distinct, intense flavour of gasoline to that, and that's what beer with alcohol objectively tastes like.
There is no question, alcohol is ethanol, and it tastes like gasoline, because it is. Anyone who doesn't taste gasoline when they drink alcohol is being fucked with by their own brain.
It is gasoline, so it smells and tastes exactly like gasoline.
I have an insanely sensitive sense of smell, and being around drinkers now smells like a gas station to me.
My dad and I were on a road trip. He was drinking red wine and I was drinking dealcohlized red wine. They looked exactly the same and were in identical glasses, but I never once mixed them up because from 3 feet away, I could smell the gasoline off of his.
DH occasionally has a drink or two if he's out without me, and I can't have him near me afterwards, I can smell it when he walks into the room.
Every time I smell it now, it horrifies me that my own brain basically gas lit me into believing it smelled and tasted good. I used to stick my nose into my wine glass and inhale the fumes in luxurious anticipation of drinking it. I used to call it "aromatic" and "rich".
BUT IT SMELLED LIKE FUCKING GASOLINE...with a hint of grape juice.
As you can tell, I'm still a bit bent out of shape about this.
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@jps When I tried naltrexone (blocks the neuro receptors that alcohol works on), it astounded me how little I enjoyed the taste of wine. I actually made my husband sip it, to see if it was *off* - it wasn't, I just normally had part of my brain overriding my tastebuds.
After 4 years, I enjoy a good NA beer but there's no drive to finish it, or to open another. It turns out I mostly enjoy the flavour of hops - a friend gave me some hop-flavoured hard candies and they were fantastic.
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@jps When I tried naltrexone (blocks the neuro receptors that alcohol works on), it astounded me how little I enjoyed the taste of wine. I actually made my husband sip it, to see if it was *off* - it wasn't, I just normally had part of my brain overriding my tastebuds.
After 4 years, I enjoy a good NA beer but there's no drive to finish it, or to open another. It turns out I mostly enjoy the flavour of hops - a friend gave me some hop-flavoured hard candies and they were fantastic.
I'm on Low Dose Naltrexone, barely a tenth of what's used for quitting alcohol, right now for nerve pain, it's effects are quite different than the regular dose, because it actually results in an upregulation of endorphins, not blocking of them.
So some of the effects are the same, but very mild, and other effects are paradoxically opposite. It's unpredictable though.
Did you have the crazy dreams?? I'm not hating them now that I'm used to them. I used to have dreadful dreams. Now they're fucking insane, but entertaining.
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@Malcat I used it three times and then didn't need it as backup for not drinking, so I don't think it ever affected my dreams. But I have always been a crazy semi-lucid dreamer anyway. Lots of adventure dreams. Way better now I am not drinking.
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I was on low dose naltrexone for a few months as an experimental treatment for an autoimmune issues, and I didn't notice the dream thing (or any other effects). However, I have taken dopamine agonists on and off for decades, and some of those...holy shit...the insane dreaming, the auditory hallucinations...yikes.
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I'm at three weeks without any alcohol tonight and that part has surprisingly not been too difficult. Unfortunately I've been more depressed than normal for the past 3-4 weeks or so as well, so I'm not sure I'm really noticing any differences either way from not drinking. But at least I'm proving I can do it, even when I'm not in a good place.
I've only noticed some cravings when I grocery shop, since that's where I normally buy my alcohol. And it's not a super visceral craving, it's more of a "meh, I wish I could get some for tonight" thought that passes once I go past the beer garden and reach the cash register.
For now I'm thinking I don't know if I want to go back to the way I was drinking, where it was once a week and 2-6 drinks at a time. I'm thinking of maybe allowing it for special occasions. But for now I'll be waiting till at least mid-October to finish my 30 days and then in preparation for my treatment.
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Congratulations on 3 weeks @TheFrenchCat !
Seeing this thread pop up, made me realize that I hit the 6 month mark...yesterday! So glad I took on this challenge and thanks again to this thread, and all the support - especially in those early days!
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French Cat, it wasn't until right near the end of the 30 days that I got any improvement in mood at all. It's not unusual for that to take 1-3 months, so don't assume you won't seem improvement just b/c you haven't yet.
Excellent job on 3 weeks!
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Congratulations on 3 weeks @TheFrenchCat !
Seeing this thread pop up, made me realize that I hit the 6 month mark...yesterday! So glad I took on this challenge and thanks again to this thread, and all the support - especially in those early days!
That's amazing, how has it been?
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French Cat, it wasn't until right near the end of the 30 days that I got any improvement in mood at all. It's not unusual for that to take 1-3 months, so don't assume you won't seem improvement just b/c you haven't yet.
Excellent job on 3 weeks!
Lol, yeah, I was not a happy camper for the first few weeks.
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Thanks @LeftA. Congratulations to you too, that's wonderful! I hope it's been going well for you.
And thanks for the info, wenchsenior. That's really good to know. Maybe I'll try going another month or two without any and see what that does.
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And thanks for the info, wenchsenior. That's really good to know. Maybe I'll try going another month or two without any and see what that does.
My moods/stress levels improved after 2-3 months but so gradually that I didn't really notice until one day I realised I hadn't been grinding my teeth in my sleep anymore, that I wasn't getting as irritated as easily, and that my baseline mood was just *higher*. It was very subtle but like this low-level of grit was removed from my machinery.
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And thanks for the info, wenchsenior. That's really good to know. Maybe I'll try going another month or two without any and see what that does.
My moods/stress levels improved after 2-3 months but so gradually that I didn't really notice until one day I realised I hadn't been grinding my teeth in my sleep anymore, that I wasn't getting as irritated as easily, and that my baseline mood was just *higher*. It was very subtle but like this low-level of grit was removed from my machinery.
Same, I realized that I was finding things irritating less often after awhile. Like, I didn't consciously feel better, I just noticed that I hadn't felt intensely irritated by the things that normally were very aggravating. Then I asked DH if I was generally happier and calmer and he said "absolutely!"
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I have not completely eliminated alcohol but have cut back dramatically over the past several months. I’ve been dealing with a very difficult family matter and made a conscious decision to avoid using alcohol as a coping mechanism. I may go weeks without it and if I have a drink (nearly always wine) it’s 1-2 glasses at the most, but never in an attempt to alleviate stress.
Over the past several weeks I’ve begun to recognize that when I do drink, it causes me to have anxiety. I’ve found this to be an interesting observation and it was never something I could have noticed when I would have wine most nights of the week and deliberately had it to help me cope with stress. The more time that goes by, the more I consider eliminating it entirely as I’m just not finding it to be enjoyable anymore. In fact, I find it to have a real negative affect on my own mental health.
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I was so excited when I lost my taste for wine.
I've now been on a no/low drink experiment (? for lack of a better word) since January. Was almost totally dry from Jan-April. And was really annoyed that I had not lost my taste for booze come May.
Have had drinks on and off since May. Some weeks I have none, and other weeks I'll have several as social situations and my own wishes dictate.
But interestingly, I started losing my taste for most drinks about six weeks ago! I would pour a drink and take a few sips and toss it. Or finish it, but feel distinctly unsatisfied. There was one Saturday where I ended up making three separate drinks and just finishing none of them because they weren't hitting right. It was weird! I had to travel for work last week and at a meal with clients ordered an aviation (usually one of my favorites) and the first two sips were lovely and then they weren't.
The one drink that still tastes fantastic to me is a margarita. StarHus and I have Sunday margaritas on our patio sometimes and that is the best! But lemon and lime are my favorite flavors in the world so I suspect that has something to do with it. I'm going to see if I can find de-alcoholized tequila (is that a thing?!) and do margaritas that way.
I am so excited that I am finally losing my taste for drinks!
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I just heard of a non alcoholic tequilla, I was like What??? Can't seem to find the name in my emial I will post it if I find it maybe a google search? It becan with a p I thought.
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I'm on the same timeline as @LeftA. I did the Alcohol Experiment six months ago and have been AF since. I learned about that program through this thread and it was life changing for me. I've done dry months here and there but white nuckled my way through them with will power. The Alcohol Experiment really opened my eyes to the science and how detrimental alcohol really is. It almost completely curbed by desire for alcohol making quitting fairly easy.
The most remarkable impact for me was how well I am sleeping! I didn't realize how much alcohol was affecting my sleep, and now enjoy glorious and refreshing sleep nearly every night.
Getting through social situations has thankfully been a non issue. I just say "no thank you" and we all carry on having fun. Really, no one cares if I am drinking or not. And it's actually quite rare for me to socializing while others are drinking. Most of my social time is out on the trail network which a far prefer to parties.
Yesterday I both gave my retirement notice at work (exciting but very unsettling) and found out my unvaccinated dad contracted covid. I wanted wine last night to help settle my nerves but went with Cheezies instead. This AM I am grateful I made that choice. Wine doesn't solve anything.
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I just heard of a non alcoholic tequilla, I was like What??? Can't seem to find the name in my emial I will post it if I find it maybe a google search? It becan with a p I thought.
Ritual Zero Proof seems to be the brand that I am finding mentioned. Great Reviews! I ordered a bottle.
They also have gin, whiskey, and rum alternatives.
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Today's day 30. Still no real changes that I can tell, though I'm glad I tried it. I kind of miss drinking, but it wasn't very difficult to take this break, which I feel very grateful for. And I'm not super anxious to get straight back to drinking, and I definitely don't want to drink in response to negative emotions anymore. So I think I'll limit myself to social drinking (I don't get out much, so this wouldn't be an every week, or even every month thing), or cider that I rarely make myself.
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Biker, sorry about your dad but great news about the alcohol. At almost 15 months I am so glad to be AF.
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I was reading a buzzfeed article and saw non alcoholic beer being marketed as a working from home beverage.
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I drank too much during lock-down. Big surprise. As a result, last year I didn't drink alcohol for 30 days (November 2020). I'm doing the same thing again this year during October 2021. No alcohol for 30 days.
It's going pretty well. I think I crave the sugar more than the buzz. The first couple of nights, I subbed a bowl of ice cream instead of a whiskey on the rocks.
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I want to stop the habit of drinking on a quiet Friday or Saturday night in. I usually crack a couple drinks with dinner, then pop in a movie and crack a few more... then the next morning I'm hungover and waste most of the day. I have just as much fun hanging out with my spouse not drinking on such a night.
Last night was a success, feeling fresh this Saturday morning. We had popcorn then doughnuts with the movie. Funny how I get worried about calories/sugar intake when eating a single doughnut, when a previous Friday might see me consume 5 craft beers.
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I was reading a buzzfeed article and saw non alcoholic beer being marketed as a working from home beverage.
I believe it! My office has a pretty big drinking culture and we actually had to tell some folks to knock it off in the middle of the day when we were at the worst of the pandemic/lock down.
Also to update- I tried the Ritual Zero Proof tequila substitute and it was pretty solid. It made a good faux poloma.
I also bought a bottle of Seedlip non alcoholic distilled stuff and didn't love it. Just tasted like adding a watered down cocktail to my mixers.
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This month is 8 years sober for me.
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This month is 8 years sober for me.
That's awesome stuff. Congratulations.
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This month is 8 years sober for me.
That's awesome stuff. Congratulations.
Yep, big congrats!
I'm creeping up on two years, and was at a big wedding last night. Events like this no longer make me specifically crave drinking, but like I've reported before, they make me very cranky about not drinking when I have no beverage options.
I'm kind of spoiled by my major city where almost every venue has non alcoholic beer and usually a mocktail menu, but I'm in rural New Brunswick, and the bus shuttle driver had a small bag of beer by his feet...so yeah...
It was also FREEZING cold at the venue, so cold soda water wasn't very appealing, and I was definitely nostalgic for the days of drinking a nice slightly below room temperature red wine that would make me feel warm.
So that still remains my last slivers of missing drinking, which has nothing to do with craving alcohol, just frustration with not having great alternatives, which makes the memories of drinking alcohol seem attractive for fleeting, frustrated moments.
I'm sure these will pass eventually as I do more and more events like this. With covid I haven't had to get used to being sober at drinking events, so it's still an adjustment.
That said, in NO way did I actually want to drink alcohol or did I consider doing it. Actually drinking holds no appeal for me. I just get pouty in environments where not drinking isn't treated like an adult, sophisticated thing to do.
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This month is 8 years sober for me.
Wow! That's fantastic!
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This month is 8 years sober for me.
That's awesome stuff. Congratulations.
This month is 8 years sober for me.
Wow! That's fantastic!
Thank you both! I find the biggest positive it gives me is the ability to be present in my own life. Drinking had really robbed me of that & I didn't even realize it when it was happening.
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This month is 8 years sober for me.
That's awesome stuff. Congratulations.
This month is 8 years sober for me.
Wow! That's fantastic!
Thank you both! I find the biggest positive it gives me is the ability to be present in my own life. Drinking had really robbed me of that & I didn't even realize it when it was happening
Huge congrats.
I totally relate to this. Alcohol really pulls you out of your life, which is the appeal for people who stress drink, but then you're just disconnected from your own life without realizing it.
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Yesterday marked one year booze free for me. Don't miss a single drop :)
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Yesterday marked one year booze free for me. Don't miss a single drop :)
Amazing! One year is a big deal.
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I am doing well through this last month.
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It has been 2 years and almost 4 months. I am on vacation and I tasted a beer on the fishing boat, thought I might enjoy one, it came with the boat trip, like everything here included drinks. It was yeasty and foamy like the yeast from the bottom of the keg, yuck. I had one sip and said dump it I will have tonic water. Next day I am glad that I didn’t drink it. I think I have been triggered lately hanging out with drinkers and my ex is drinking after almost 2 years without it, and we did quit together and still hang out quite a bit. Today my short term goal is make it until next year for 2 calendar years, and that’s in 21 days.
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It has been 2 years and almost 4 months. I am on vacation and I tasted a beer on the fishing boat, thought I might enjoy one, it came with the boat trip, like everything here included drinks. It was yeasty and foamy like the yeast from the bottom of the keg, yuck. I had one sip and said dump it I will have tonic water. Next day I am glad that I didn’t drink it. I think I have been triggered lately hanging out with drinkers and my ex is drinking after almost 2 years without it, and we did quit together and still hang out quite a bit. Today my short term goal is make it until next year for 2 calendar years, and that’s in 21 days.
Interesting that your tastes changed. I quit daily drinking almost 3 years ago, but never had the goal of never drinking another drink, just wanted to change my sense of identity away from being 'a drinker'. The handful of drinks I did have the first couple of years were fine, and still tasted good to me. But then I ended up slipping into going a little over a year without drinking anything. On Thanksgiving, my husband really wanted glass of wine with dinner but was working himself up with anxiety not wanting to drink in front of me if I wasn't having any. I didn't want him to stress out, so I asked him to just pour me a third of a glass of wine. And for the first time since I quit daily drinking, it tasted different! Very sharp and vinegary! I was so surprised, I looked to see if he liked it and he drank it like everything was fine.
So apparently my taste buds finally changed, too, at least in regard to wine. It did take quite a while. I wonder if the same will happen with beer and whiskey eventually (or maybe already has....I haven't had beer in almost 2 years)?
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I can't even stand the smell of alcohol anymore. I can smell it on DH across the room on the very rare occasions that he has a single beer.
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I can’t drink red anymore at all. It tastes too alcoholic and heavy.
I can occasionally have some white wine. I think it’s because it is more sugary. It’s been over 8 months since I cut out alcohol. For the last couple of months, I have had a total of 2-3 glasses of white per month (this is cumulatively as I sometimes pour one to two thirds of a glass). I’m in a good place.
Congratulations to all who have milestone dates recently!
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I can't even stand the smell of alcohol anymore. I can smell it on DH across the room on the very rare occasions that he has a single beer.
I confirmed that I lost my taste for it around sometime this summer after about 6 months. This is something I've noticed, too. whenever my wife has a cocktail or glass of wine, she smells boozy to me. I don't think I have the same super-human sensory perception as Malcat, but when she's next to me I can very obviously tell that she has had a drink, even something like wine or beer, which I had never been able to notice when I was also partaking. Go figure.
Rounding the corner on 12th calendar month w/o alcohol. Jan 1st will make a year for me. Has been an incredibly pleasant experience overall and I'm not really planning to drink once the year is over. Hooray for positive and lasting change.
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I can't even stand the smell of alcohol anymore. I can smell it on DH across the room on the very rare occasions that he has a single beer.
I confirmed that I lost my taste for it around sometime this summer after about 6 months. This is something I've noticed, too. whenever my wife has a cocktail or glass of wine, she smells boozy to me. I don't think I have the same super-human sensory perception as Malcat, but when she's next to me I can very obviously tell that she has had a drink, even something like wine or beer, which I had never been able to notice when I was also partaking. Go figure.
Rounding the corner on 12th calendar month w/o alcohol. Jan 1st will make a year for me. Has been an incredibly pleasant experience overall and I'm not really planning to drink once the year is over. Hooray for positive and lasting change.
I've never met anyone who does, it's my super power. It's not exactly fun that I can smell cat pee from 2 floors away, or that someone 15 feet from me has active gum disease.
Also, I do intermittent fasting and the smell of ketosis is overwhelming to me. DH can't smell it, but to my own nose, I stink to high heaven, like a combo of burnt popcorn and nail polish remover. It's fucking awful.
Worst super power ever.
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@Malcat , I have an intense sense of smell too. I think I probably also smell what you’ve mentioned, but am just not able to identify it as such (I.e. gum disease, keto acidosis, etc.). I concur it can be more of a curse than a blessing!
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Congrats to Tyson, Bike and anyone else I missed:)). I am at 16 months. I actually didn’t drink for 14 years and am mad at myself for letting my then husband talk me into it. It was much harder to quit than the previous time because over time I developed a daily drinking routine. Even now occasionally I am tempted but then pretty quickly dismiss it. My best friend and her husband quit a few days after me and are both still sober.
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A couple years into examining my relationship with alcohol and I wonder if I just should have just done the Annie Grace 30 day thing :)
By the end of the summer I would have said I reached a perfect balance of booze in my life: a few social drinks on vacation, the occasional margarita on deck with my husband while my kids watched a movie and that was about it. I was going weeks at a time without a drink and without thinking of a drink.
As the cold weather sets in my muscle and joint pain has gotten worse and voila! I find myself wanting a drink before bed. The pain reducing/muscle relaxing/deadening of a drink becomes much more desirable when I hurt more.
This is the start of my third winter of really being conscious of my intake, and it is the first time I've drawn the connection between pain and wanting a drink (I think because I've finally accepted that my pain is chronic and not something that will just get fixed if they could just DX something). Anyways, just thought it was interesting and worth mentioning in case anyone else finds it useful.
Congrats to everyone who has gone so long!!!
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A couple years into examining my relationship with alcohol and I wonder if I just should have just done the Annie Grace 30 day thing :)
By the end of the summer I would have said I reached a perfect balance of booze in my life: a few social drinks on vacation, the occasional margarita on deck with my husband while my kids watched a movie and that was about it. I was going weeks at a time without a drink and without thinking of a drink.
As the cold weather sets in my muscle and joint pain has gotten worse and voila! I find myself wanting a drink before bed. The pain reducing/muscle relaxing/deadening of a drink becomes much more desirable when I hurt more.
This is the start of my third winter of really being conscious of my intake, and it is the first time I've drawn the connection between pain and wanting a drink (I think because I've finally accepted that my pain is chronic and not something that will just get fixed if they could just DX something). Anyways, just thought it was interesting and worth mentioning in case anyone else finds it useful.
Congrats to everyone who has gone so long!!!
Is your pain present in the morning, too? I find starting every day with an epsom salt bath and then ten minutes of strategically placed small ice packs very beneficial.
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A couple years into examining my relationship with alcohol and I wonder if I just should have just done the Annie Grace 30 day thing :)
By the end of the summer I would have said I reached a perfect balance of booze in my life: a few social drinks on vacation, the occasional margarita on deck with my husband while my kids watched a movie and that was about it. I was going weeks at a time without a drink and without thinking of a drink.
As the cold weather sets in my muscle and joint pain has gotten worse and voila! I find myself wanting a drink before bed. The pain reducing/muscle relaxing/deadening of a drink becomes much more desirable when I hurt more.
This is the start of my third winter of really being conscious of my intake, and it is the first time I've drawn the connection between pain and wanting a drink (I think because I've finally accepted that my pain is chronic and not something that will just get fixed if they could just DX something). Anyways, just thought it was interesting and worth mentioning in case anyone else finds it useful.
Congrats to everyone who has gone so long!!!
As someone who specializes in treating chronic pain, this is the toughest hurdle I needed to get patients over. Answers don't equal relief. If anything l, getting answers tends to correlate with getting worse, because when things get worse, that can sometimes reveal the pattern that couldn't be seen before.
Alcohol as a painkiller though is a dangerous approach because it 100% worsens the pain overall.
I can't remember whether it was Allen Carr or Annie Grace who gave this analogy, but they said drinking was like having a rash and applying an ointment that have instant relief from the rash, but when the relief wore off, the rash was even worse. So the more you use the ointment, the worse the rash gets over time, but the more you feel the urgent need for the relief of the ointment.
Eventually you're overwhelmed by this horrific, itchy, painful rash all over your body and feeling the need nightly to slather yourself in tubes of the ointment just to get to sleep.
But you're convinced that the ointment is helping you because when you apply it, it makes the rash that it worsened feel a lot better.
Here's a fun fact as well:
If your brain identifies pain as a reliable trigger to get you to drink, your brain will actually amplify your perception of that pain, and lower your capacity to tolerate it so that you will be more likely to drink.
Remember, if your brain wants alcohol, it will gaslight the fuck out of you to make you think that *you* want alcohol.
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Not to derail the thread around this sense of smell topic (a few posts above), but I also have an intense sense of smell. Back in '95 while hugging my grandmother goodbye, I could smell something weird and made note of it. Lo & behold just a few days later it was learned she had a massive staghorn calculus in her right kidney that had killed her kidney and it was rotting inside her body. They removed her kidney, all the infection, etc. and she moved forward with life. Fast forward to 2014 during a visit to see her and I smelled the weird/off smell again. Just a few months later she was diagnosed with bladder cancer and died from it exactly two months to the day afterward.
Am I like a dog who can detect cancer? Is this just coincidental or was I truly smelling these things going on inside her body?
Now back to your regularly scheduled thread topic...
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Not to derail the thread around this sense of smell topic (a few posts above), but I also have an intense sense of smell. Back in '95 while hugging my grandmother goodbye, I could smell something weird and made note of it. Lo & behold just a few days later it was learned she had a massive staghorn calculus in her right kidney that had killed her kidney and it was rotting inside her body. They removed her kidney, all the infection, etc. and she moved forward with life. Fast forward to 2014 during a visit to see her and I smelled the weird/off smell again. Just a few months later she was diagnosed with bladder cancer and died from it exactly two months to the day afterward.
Am I like a dog who can detect cancer? Is this just coincidental or was I truly smelling these things going on inside her body?
Now back to your regularly scheduled thread topic...
With my mom it was a dead kidney from a blood clot!!
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A couple years into examining my relationship with alcohol and I wonder if I just should have just done the Annie Grace 30 day thing :)
By the end of the summer I would have said I reached a perfect balance of booze in my life: a few social drinks on vacation, the occasional margarita on deck with my husband while my kids watched a movie and that was about it. I was going weeks at a time without a drink and without thinking of a drink.
As the cold weather sets in my muscle and joint pain has gotten worse and voila! I find myself wanting a drink before bed. The pain reducing/muscle relaxing/deadening of a drink becomes much more desirable when I hurt more.
This is the start of my third winter of really being conscious of my intake, and it is the first time I've drawn the connection between pain and wanting a drink (I think because I've finally accepted that my pain is chronic and not something that will just get fixed if they could just DX something). Anyways, just thought it was interesting and worth mentioning in case anyone else finds it useful.
Congrats to everyone who has gone so long!!!
Is your pain present in the morning, too? I find starting every day with an epsom salt bath and then ten minutes of strategically placed small ice packs very beneficial.
It is! It is the worst in the morning. Sadly we do not have a tub in our bathroom, just a shower. But my husband does keep a tiny fridge in our bedroom office, I could keep some cool packs in there. Thanks!
Here's a fun fact as well:
If your brain identifies pain as a reliable trigger to get you to drink, your brain will actually amplify your perception of that pain, and lower your capacity to tolerate it so that you will be more likely to drink.
Remember, if your brain wants alcohol, it will gaslight the fuck out of you to make you think that *you* want alcohol.
This was the thing I really noticed. I knew that I had really gone months having a pretty healthy idea of what I actually wanted and all of the sudden I was achy at night and would go "OOHH A drink would make me feel better" and this was several nights running.
Which honestly didn't even happen when I made a conscious decision to stop cold turkey for a while last year.
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A couple years into examining my relationship with alcohol and I wonder if I just should have just done the Annie Grace 30 day thing :)
By the end of the summer I would have said I reached a perfect balance of booze in my life: a few social drinks on vacation, the occasional margarita on deck with my husband while my kids watched a movie and that was about it. I was going weeks at a time without a drink and without thinking of a drink.
As the cold weather sets in my muscle and joint pain has gotten worse and voila! I find myself wanting a drink before bed. The pain reducing/muscle relaxing/deadening of a drink becomes much more desirable when I hurt more.
This is the start of my third winter of really being conscious of my intake, and it is the first time I've drawn the connection between pain and wanting a drink (I think because I've finally accepted that my pain is chronic and not something that will just get fixed if they could just DX something). Anyways, just thought it was interesting and worth mentioning in case anyone else finds it useful.
Congrats to everyone who has gone so long!!!
Is your pain present in the morning, too? I find starting every day with an epsom salt bath and then ten minutes of strategically placed small ice packs very beneficial.
It is! It is the worst in the morning. Sadly we do not have a tub in our bathroom, just a shower. But my husband does keep a tiny fridge in our bedroom office, I could keep some cool packs in there. Thanks!
Here's a fun fact as well:
If your brain identifies pain as a reliable trigger to get you to drink, your brain will actually amplify your perception of that pain, and lower your capacity to tolerate it so that you will be more likely to drink.
Remember, if your brain wants alcohol, it will gaslight the fuck out of you to make you think that *you* want alcohol.
This was the thing I really noticed. I knew that I had really gone months having a pretty healthy idea of what I actually wanted and all of the sudden I was achy at night and would go "OOHH A drink would make me feel better" and this was several nights running.
Which honestly didn't even happen when I made a conscious decision to stop cold turkey for a while last year.
I have suffered chronic body pain since adolescence, and I also fell into the trap of associating pain relief with alcohol. I'm happy to report that once I kicked the drinking habit, while pain still triggers me, I recognize that my pain has not objectively gotten any harder to manage. In fact, it's gotten a bit easier...possibly due to the effect Malcat mentioned, and partly due to the fact that drinking made me mildly depressed and killed my motivation to more proactively act to manage the pain in healthier ways.
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A couple years into examining my relationship with alcohol and I wonder if I just should have just done the Annie Grace 30 day thing :)
By the end of the summer I would have said I reached a perfect balance of booze in my life: a few social drinks on vacation, the occasional margarita on deck with my husband while my kids watched a movie and that was about it. I was going weeks at a time without a drink and without thinking of a drink.
As the cold weather sets in my muscle and joint pain has gotten worse and voila! I find myself wanting a drink before bed. The pain reducing/muscle relaxing/deadening of a drink becomes much more desirable when I hurt more.
This is the start of my third winter of really being conscious of my intake, and it is the first time I've drawn the connection between pain and wanting a drink (I think because I've finally accepted that my pain is chronic and not something that will just get fixed if they could just DX something). Anyways, just thought it was interesting and worth mentioning in case anyone else finds it useful.
Congrats to everyone who has gone so long!!!
Is your pain present in the morning, too? I find starting every day with an epsom salt bath and then ten minutes of strategically placed small ice packs very beneficial.
It is! It is the worst in the morning. Sadly we do not have a tub in our bathroom, just a shower. But my husband does keep a tiny fridge in our bedroom office, I could keep some cool packs in there. Thanks!
Here's a fun fact as well:
If your brain identifies pain as a reliable trigger to get you to drink, your brain will actually amplify your perception of that pain, and lower your capacity to tolerate it so that you will be more likely to drink.
Remember, if your brain wants alcohol, it will gaslight the fuck out of you to make you think that *you* want alcohol.
This was the thing I really noticed. I knew that I had really gone months having a pretty healthy idea of what I actually wanted and all of the sudden I was achy at night and would go "OOHH A drink would make me feel better" and this was several nights running.
Which honestly didn't even happen when I made a conscious decision to stop cold turkey for a while last year.
I have suffered chronic body pain since adolescence, and I also fell into the trap of associating pain relief with alcohol. I'm happy to report that once I kicked the drinking habit, while pain still triggers me, I recognize that my pain has not objectively gotten any harder to manage. In fact, it's gotten a bit easier...possibly due to the effect Malcat mentioned, and partly due to the fact that drinking made me mildly depressed and killed my motivation to more proactively act to manage the pain in healthier ways.
Your last sentence definitely resonated with me. It's hard to be conscious when you're actively trying to be unconscious.
Another technique I use for pain, and the anxiety that seems to creep in and multiply the pain, is guided imagery messaging.
I have CD's I play in my truck because that is sometimes triggering for me but I'm sure there are other sources.
It really works for me. Anxiety can cause my body to start to feel like a tuning fork but the guided imagery reels it in. I can feel the difference within minutes, but it wasn't that way at first, it took a number of tries before I started to really feel it.
In theory, guided imagery can be done just by you as a form of meditation, but I've not had much success, I prefer to listen to my CDs.
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StarBright, it's good that you noticed the pattern and explored how and why it was happening. A very positive trait for living a good and intentional life. :)
On a separate topic, I have noticed that I am king of enjoying the drinking culture, while having no interest in actually drinking. So I feel like I am somehow free-riding off the negative choices of others... Like, hanging out at a beer garden or a cozy wine bar, talking about where the beer/wine came from, looking for a bar that has nice drink options, even just reading an interesting drink menu... No festivals right now due to COVID but I feel like that is also something I would enjoy.
It's kind of like how I love reading reviews of fancy/complicated restaurants. I don't actually like to eat that type of food, but I'm interested to see how they put it together, and what people think about that.
I'm not too stressed about it for my own sake. Nearly all social activities in my adult life have included/revolved around alcohol, so this is not a surprise. But I guess I am a little uncomfortable, like I am encouraging a bad habit. If I'm out with a friend, I slowly sip a NA beer, but maybe she drinks an extra round or two to extend the time we spend together.
I guess it would be good to try and plan other types of outings, but I am a lazy planner right now.
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Five weeks, started on the 27th -- here we go!
Reading through the last couple pages I realize that's a short time compared to a lot of you, but who knows this could be the start of a longer trend.
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@litestache
You plan on five weeks or you have done five weeks?
Any amount of time is great and will lead you to understand you and your body and minds connection to alcohol.
I personally feel that 30 days was not enough for me to get my energy back that it really took almost 2 months for me to feel a dramatic step up in energy YMMV.
Come back for support anytime.
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@litestache
You plan on five weeks or you have done five weeks?
Any amount of time is great and will lead you to understand you and your body and minds connection to alcohol.
I personally feel that 30 days was not enough for me to get my energy back that it really took almost 2 months for me to feel a dramatic step up in energy YMMV.
Come back for support anytime.
Thanks for the support! I started Dec. 27 and I'm planning for five weeks ending Jan 31. It's like an extended dry January.
I could extend that to seven weeks but I'm going on vacay with other functioning alcoholics a few friends mid-Feb. Given the company I think it'd be hard to stay sober through that one.
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Well this thread is stay sober as long as you please... so if you have a planned drinking session that is fine.
My point is the longer you stay away the more powerful the rewards.
I did the same thing, I quit for 7 months, had a planned party with a bunch of friends who drink every day and then I was going on vacation with them to an all you can eat and drink place! SO I drank for two months and quit again on the way back from vacation. I then gave into temptation a couple months later and drank for six more months before I decided THIS IS it, I am going to quit for a year or more, that was 2 years and 4 months ago. September 1 2019. ( I had to look it up I thought I was at 2.5 years) Anyway since then I have had a divirce and my life changed quite a bit but have managed to stay off the booze.
I reccomend jouranling before and after you quit to give you some perspective on how you feel before and after, I look at that stuff when I feel triggered to go back or just to try a beer.
Good luck to all
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My point is the longer you stay away the more powerful the rewards.
Oh yes I understood exactly what you meant and your advice really resonates with me. Five weeks will be enough of a challenge for me and I don't want to make things so hard that I fail. Maybe I'll do another challenge after the trip and evolve from there like you did.
I reccomend jouranling before and after you quit to give you some perspective on how you feel before and after, I look at that stuff when I feel triggered to go back or just to try a beer.
Ok, journaling has never stuck, but I'll try. I ordered Annie Grace's "The Alcohol Experiment," which I look forward to reading once it arrives.
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@LightStache
I ordered Annie Grace's "The Alcohol Experiment," which I look forward to reading once it arrives.
That book is excellent!!! She made so many people want to take a break and or quit entirely. she has a web site where you sign up and she sends an email every day for 30 days so consider that in January for additional support ( It is free at least at first).
You are gonna do great you have all your ducks in a row.
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Today marks One Year (and one day) Without Alcohol for me. I post here occasionally, but honestly haven't ended up thinking about this all that much as the year goes by. I did The Alcohol Experiment at the beginning of the year, which was helpful for me, and then I kinda just, got back to my life. Except for things like weddings, I didn't really notice alcohol or my lack of it, except for when I realized that I had simplified one more element of my life. I feel like I am back to my style of life before I drank, which is just that alcohol takes up no space in my head and I am free to be a person, however I choose that to be.
The good: no headaches or stomach aches from drinking, which were becoming more prevalent. No more spending my allowance on beer, so I have been invest more into cycling, which is now an incredibly important part of my life. The last benefit that I was not expecting was Simplicity. I didn't have to stop by the beer cooler whenever I went grocery stopping, even if only to look at what the prices were this week. I didn't have to try to plan ahead for the week to make sure I didn't drink my one 6-pack too early if I had something going on later. I don't have empty cans on my coffee table anymore from when I would drink a beer at night and go straight to bed. I also don't know, or care, anymore what the new trendy beer offerings are from the breweries in my area - that is to say I've freed up a bunch of head space for more valuable things.
The bad: Many of my problems are still my problems. Except for any alcohol related problems, I am still faced by all of my inadequacies and shortcomings in life, as well as unfortunate circumstances out of my control. I had an amazing and energetic pink cloud experience for the first few months of the year, and as that faded I realized that I am still fallible and so is everything around me, and I must get back to doing the Work. It has been freeing that beer no longer helps me to avoid my problems. This is a conscious decision I've had to make, to face my problems, rather than to try to find some other substance to help avoid them with. Even though quitting alcohol didn't solve my problems, I think that I am truly better off without it in the way.
Thanks to everyone who contributes here - I love to lurk and read how things are going for you all. As for me, I plan to continue Not Drinking.
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Today marks One Year (and one day) Without Alcohol for me. I post here occasionally, but honestly haven't ended up thinking about this all that much as the year goes by. I did The Alcohol Experiment at the beginning of the year, which was helpful for me, and then I kinda just, got back to my life. Except for things like weddings, I didn't really notice alcohol or my lack of it, except for when I realized that I had simplified one more element of my life. I feel like I am back to my style of life before I drank, which is just that alcohol takes up no space in my head and I am free to be a person, however I choose that to be.
The good: no headaches or stomach aches from drinking, which were becoming more prevalent. No more spending my allowance on beer, so I have been invest more into cycling, which is now an incredibly important part of my life. The last benefit that I was not expecting was Simplicity. I didn't have to stop by the beer cooler whenever I went grocery stopping, even if only to look at what the prices were this week. I didn't have to try to plan ahead for the week to make sure I didn't drink my one 6-pack too early if I had something going on later. I don't have empty cans on my coffee table anymore from when I would drink a beer at night and go straight to bed. I also don't know, or care, anymore what the new trendy beer offerings are from the breweries in my area - that is to say I've freed up a bunch of head space for more valuable things.
The bad: Many of my problems are still my problems. Except for any alcohol related problems, I am still faced by all of my inadequacies and shortcomings in life, as well as unfortunate circumstances out of my control. I had an amazing and energetic pink cloud experience for the first few months of the year, and as that faded I realized that I am still fallible and so is everything around me, and I must get back to doing the Work. It has been freeing that beer no longer helps me to avoid my problems. This is a conscious decision I've had to make, to face my problems, rather than to try to find some other substance to help avoid them with. Even though quitting alcohol didn't solve my problems, I think that I am truly better off without it in the way.
Thanks to everyone who contributes here - I love to lurk and read how things are going for you all. As for me, I plan to continue Not Drinking.
Your description of The Bad is what I found as well, and a few years further on, I now view the The Bad as THE BEST b/c it did lead me to doing work that has immeasurably improved my life.
Congratulations and happy New Year.
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A while ago someone (Malcat?) suggested teas.
All I had was Tazo from the grocery store which wasn't particularly thrilling so the tea thing hadn't really resonated with me. But my husband got me a fun tea advent calendar for Christmas.
I ordered several of my favorite flavors from the calendar and now I am really enjoying some teas :)
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Thought I’d bump up this thread.
On NYEs I had a full glass of wine. Since early April 2021, I had had a full glass maybe twice before. I started to wonder if that meant I might slide back into old habits. But, I didn’t want that to happen, so made a conscious decision not to drink in the immediate days that followed. Then, the desire passed altogether and now 3 weeks have gone by with me not even thinking about it at all. Happy with that, as life is so much better without alcohol.
On a different note, something strange happened with my closest family members and I wonder if anyone else ever experienced this. When I drank (which was never a large amount - I was a one glass of wine type drinker), my mom would harp on me about how she worried about my drinking, that it wasn’t good for me, etc. But, when I quit, she seemed somewhat apathetic and almost intimated that drinking some wine is good for me! It was just so odd. I guess I was hoping she’d be more supportive, perhaps proud that I gave up such a negative vice…anyone else experience this?
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That is a damn if you do damn if you don’t situation! I would say the only supportive people I have encountered are other non drinkers. My mother will occasionally offer me wine or ask me to finish her glass when we go out. I have been a non drinker for 2.5 years and she still offers me wine and she herself barely drinks. Most people recognize that I don’t drink and never ask about it.
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@LeftA , you and I went AF at the same time, Easter 2021. Glad to hear you doing so well and happy with the change. Me too! The Alcohol Experiment program supports everyone making their own choices but warns that managing moderate drinking can be tougher than just quitting. That rang true for me so I've haven't had any alcohol since.
This was my first dry holiday season and it was easier than expected. The covid induced lack of parties helped I am sure but I didn't miss it. I enjoyed a clear head, time with my family and excellent sleep.
I haven't experienced any wheedling about not drinking like you have. A simple no thank you has been enough and I am grateful.
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Moderation takes a lot of work and thinking about drinking. It was a big failure for me.,
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Heading into my 4th dry Australia Day, this time going to a BBQ with people that I used to drink with. I'll possibly buy some NA beer as camouflage but it might be kombucha or a flavoured soda water. At this point, my life has just improved so much that it's not a temptation for me.
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Back at it! Almost through Dry January and will try to keep it going into a dry 2022 for as long as possible!
For those of you who have friends/family who drink, how do you deal with "hey, try a sip of this wine/beer, it's really good!"? How strictly do you draw the line? I've completely abstained from all sips this month, but I guess it depends how nitpicky you wanna be.
And what do you guys think about nonalcoholic beers since they're becoming a thing? I know they still have around 0.5% alcohol but are they an acceptable alternative?
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@Geographer - re offered sips, I will either say "no thanks!" in an upbeat way or smell it and comment. I wouldn't drink it because I don't drink alcohol. :)
Some people find NA beers problematic and likely to trigger them to drink again. I didn't drink them for the first couple of years but that was mostly because at that time they were all pretty nasty but now the craft brewers are starting to make them. They can be useful social camouflage and some of them are very tasty. It's about the same level as kombucha.
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Back at it! Almost through Dry January and will try to keep it going into a dry 2022 for as long as possible!
For those of you who have friends/family who drink, how do you deal with "hey, try a sip of this wine/beer, it's really good!"? How strictly do you draw the line? I've completely abstained from all sips this month, but I guess it depends how nitpicky you wanna be.
And what do you guys think about nonalcoholic beers since they're becoming a thing? I know they still have around 0.5% alcohol but are they an acceptable alternative?
I tend to just say no thank you if it is something I don't love.
But I am not a 100% abstainer. I still have an occasional drink with my husband on a Sunday afternoon because Sunday margaritas has been our thing since the kids were born. At Christmas my FIL bought a really nice bottle of wine so I had a couple of ounces because he was so proud of the bottle.
I don't do NA beers because I don't love beer, but I have bought the tequila alternative and used it for polomas and margaritas. They were decent and nice when I got sick of water.
I agree with Cassie that moderation is often harder for me just because of the mental space it takes up. When I am stressed or having decision fatigue I know it is easier to just go completely dry.
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But I am not a 100% abstainer. I still have an occasional drink with my husband on a Sunday afternoon because Sunday margaritas has been our thing since the kids were born. At Christmas my FIL bought a really nice bottle of wine so I had a couple of ounces because he was so proud of the bottle.
That's how I'd love to be eventually. I love a small glass of wine occasionally, but "moderation" for me is a slippery slope that leads back to having a few too many drinks. So for the time being going completely dry is my excuse to others (and myself!) that I just want to stay away from it alltogether.
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I have never really had a drinking issue, but I do find that I'm not good at moderation with anything unless I put clear boundaries around it. So with drinking I only drink on Fridays, Saturdays, or special occasions. And I'm only allowed one drink on Friday/Saturdays. It's not that I've ever been too fond of booze, it's just that I don't like its impact on me so I made a rule for myself that one drink is enough, and only on days when I can sleep in. Also I don't drink after 7pm because it negatively affects my sleep. I love a nice booze treat at around 4 pm on a Friday or Saturday late afternoon. That's about it--conditions are perfect.
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Heading into my 4th dry Australia Day, this time going to a BBQ with people that I used to drink with. I'll possibly buy some NA beer as camouflage but it might be kombucha or a flavoured soda water. At this point, my life has just improved so much that it's not a temptation for me.
That's great to hear, I felt the same way by year 4. The benefits were so clear I knew I was done, for good.
I used n/a beer the same way in the early years, going on a group camping trip, or meeting up with friends, etc, because I was worried I might feel the temptation, but I really limited it because I was also worried about it becoming a crutch.
Of course, the poor taste helped in that regard. Now that I've tried the "better" n/a's, I've come to realize that there are other drinks I'd much rather have than even better tasting n/a beer, so I don't bother, except now and then, like every other summer, after some hard work on a hot summer day , I stop and get a n/a six pack at the quick e mart. Just like old times!
I drink two and then it sits in the fridge for months.
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I found a book at the library called "Sober Curious" by Ruby Warrington. Just started reading it and I'm glad to see more and more resources like this out there! Dry January is almost done and I'm ready to go headstrong into Free-From-Alcohol February! :)
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Ack! Re: Tea - I remember several pages back on here MalCat said something about David's Tea - so I ordered some. And then I looked and she said it was grossly sweet and was not recommending them. Whoops!
The first couple I tried were actually lovely (Valerian sleep blends) - but then I tried another one today and Gack! STEVIA! Half of the teas I ordered (I added extras to get the free shipping) have stevia.
I may pass them on in my Buy Nothing group.
But the "Mother's Little Helper" is lovely and I have been drinking it while my husband has his manhattan.
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I'm almost three years into not drinking any alcohol. It's been great! My desire to drink is totally gone, and I regularly join gatherings without feeling the slightest compulsion to imbibe. I actually kind of feel bad for all the drinkers who don't know what they're missing. Sadly (maybe?), I've lost some friends due to no longer drinking (maybe they were only "friends," though). Turns out, a lot of people can't think of anything interesting to do together aside from drinking, so they don't want to be around you anymore.
I've always been very careful not to talk about my sobriety because it makes people uncomfortable. I only mention it when directly asked, and even then there are people who don't like it. If this happens to you, just realize you're not the problem. Many people simply aren't at peace with their own decisions and immediately feel judged, even when there's no judgement being passed.
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I'm in. I am doing the 30 day experiment, on Day 5. No issues so far, made through a weekend of no drinking for the first time in years.
One downside, i miscalculated my days. I have a Cabin Trip with some friends that starts on my 23rd day of the experiment. This is a yearly event with my guy friends, which involves a LOT of drinking, poker playing, shenanigans, etc. Wondering if I should bail on the trip, or make up some sort of minor health ailment, to explain why I'm not drinking...Hmmm not sure. Guess we'll see how im feeling closer to the date.
I went on that cabin trip, with no concrete plan... and well, fell back into it.
I am on day 32, this time time with a completely different mindset. It's been much easier this time, after getting through the first weekend.
I have successfully hung out with one of my oldest friends, we'll call him 'Drinking Buddy", went to a dive bar, played a Music Festival (done this one every year for over a decade, and it was usually an all day drinking marathon). Really interesting observing this from a sober perspective.
This past month, I have got so much stuff done. I haven't skipped a gym workout from being 'tired' (hungover).
Was worried that I would have to ditch my friends, quit my band (Our singer started the 30 day challenge this week). Also, about how my friends would react, but I am the same sarcastic, smart-ass SOB I've always been. Just sharper, well rested, and present.
I like this new me. I'm going to make it permanent. Instead of mentally thinking of 'Im never drinking again', I am just thinking of today and the next 30 days. The never ending 30 day challenge :-D. Better to manage mentally, I feel. And I have a permanent go-to response when someone offers me a drink.
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I’m 8 years sober now. I’m not religious so AA isn’t a good fit for me. Luckily I found LifeRing which is a secular, science based group. If anyone is struggling with this on their own, give LifeRing a try. I know it helped me enormously.
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I'm in. I am doing the 30 day experiment, on Day 5. No issues so far, made through a weekend of no drinking for the first time in years.
One downside, i miscalculated my days. I have a Cabin Trip with some friends that starts on my 23rd day of the experiment. This is a yearly event with my guy friends, which involves a LOT of drinking, poker playing, shenanigans, etc. Wondering if I should bail on the trip, or make up some sort of minor health ailment, to explain why I'm not drinking...Hmmm not sure. Guess we'll see how im feeling closer to the date.
I went on that cabin trip, with no concrete plan... and well, fell back into it.
I am on day 32, this time time with a completely different mindset. It's been much easier this time, after getting through the first weekend.
I have successfully hung out with one of my oldest friends, we'll call him 'Drinking Buddy", went to a dive bar, played a Music Festival (done this one every year for over a decade, and it was usually an all day drinking marathon). Really interesting observing this from a sober perspective.
This past month, I have got so much stuff done. I haven't skipped a gym workout from being 'tired' (hungover).
Was worried that I would have to ditch my friends, quit my band (Our singer started the 30 day challenge this week). Also, about how my friends would react, but I am the same sarcastic, smart-ass SOB I've always been. Just sharper, well rested, and present.
I like this new me. I'm going to make it permanent. Instead of mentally thinking of 'Im never drinking again', I am just thinking of today and the next 30 days. The never ending 30 day challenge :-D. Better to manage mentally, I feel. And I have a permanent go-to response when someone offers me a drink.
This is similar to how I approach it as well. I do drink very occasionally still, and I realize that triggers backsliding in many people, but so far it never has for me. For example, I had a few drinks in early March during a short vacation with friends, which were the first drinks I'd had in well over a year. And they were fine... I don't regret it. But I was also happy to get back to 'the next 30 days' mindset as soon as I got home. As long as this approach works for me (that is, I don't look for occasions where I 'get to' drink, but nor do I forbid it or beat myself up over it on the rare occasions that I do it), I'm keeping at it. And it's been working for over 3 years at this point.
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I have been sober for 20 months. I go at least once a week to happy hour with my dining group and have a non-alcoholic beer. I have only been tempted a few times. I think for me personally it would start the cycle of drinking regularly again and I feel so much better without it.
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I have been sober for 20 months. I go at least once a week to happy hour with my dining group and have a non-alcoholic beer. I have only been tempted a few times. I think for me personally it would start the cycle of drinking regularly again and I feel so much better without it.
For me, it seems easier to just not drink than to try to do some sort of moderate drinking. Simpler and less to think about.
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Thought I’d bump up this thread.
On NYEs I had a full glass of wine. Since early April 2021, I had had a full glass maybe twice before. I started to wonder if that meant I might slide back into old habits. But, I didn’t want that to happen, so made a conscious decision not to drink in the immediate days that followed. Then, the desire passed altogether and now 3 weeks have gone by with me not even thinking about it at all. Happy with that, as life is so much better without alcohol.
On a different note, something strange happened with my closest family members and I wonder if anyone else ever experienced this. When I drank (which was never a large amount - I was a one glass of wine type drinker), my mom would harp on me about how she worried about my drinking, that it wasn’t good for me, etc. But, when I quit, she seemed somewhat apathetic and almost intimated that drinking some wine is good for me! It was just so odd. I guess I was hoping she’d be more supportive, perhaps proud that I gave up such a negative vice…anyone else experience this?
LeftA, I got in a fight with another boy after school one day, came home late with scrapes and bruises, and was fearing a lecture. My Mom was beaming with pride. Go figure!
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I tend to drink very frequently but not heavily throughout my adult life. Well the pandemic was an excuse to imbibe more, and then the pandemic subsided but I noticed that I was cracking beers or having a bourbon at times I normally wouldn't have in the past. It bothered me, but not enough to do something about it.
This past week I was on a work trip where heavy drinking was encouraged, and I obliged, for 3 days......after feeling like shit and realizing that continuing this pattern would surely decrease my quality and quantity of life, it's time to cut back drastically.
I plan to limit drinking to only special occasions like a wedding or holiday/party. No more boozing at home out of boredom or to blow off steam. No more weekday happy hours because *nothing better to do*.......at least for a nice long while.
Posting for accountability y'all.
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Here's an unexpected one. I've been not drinking for nearly 5 years now and it's great. A side effect of this is my husband has significantly reduced his alcohol consumption. At the end of last year, Ofpym had his first gout attack and it seems that beer is one of his triggers. He's opted to stop drinking instead of going on lifelong medication. (Now he has the MPP of getting rid of most of a batch of homemade beer and his homebrewing equipment.)
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2 birds, alcohol can really be a slippery slope. The pandemic really made me look at my bad habits and weight and I decided to change. I spent most of my life not drinking and starting was a bad idea. It’s been so much easier to maintain my weight loss without the empty calories. Plus drinking makes me hungry. It’s great that you recognized you were overdoing it.
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MSPYM
Homebrew is the devils elixir!
I think my homebrewing beer is what lead me down the trail of excessive drinking, beer around all the time, always need to try this batch, or make one similar/better. Once I got rid of the homebrew equiptment space opened up, Literally in the house and in my head as well. I was eventually able to see my excessive drinking for what it was and addiction. I actually still have to get rid of my brew pot, it is worth money so I probably will sell it.
It is coming up on 2 years and 8 months, No alcohol. I am hoping to make it to 3 years no booze. I feel so much better in the morning!
No more excuses to be lazy on a Saturday morning. No more hanging out with drinkers, who can be fun , but the same old patterns over and over. I do wonder if I have reset myself and can go back to drinking once in a while, but so far I realy logically can not find a "good" reason to go back. The craft beer flavor I miss, but the non alcoholic beer options are amazing these days ( like Athletic brewing company and Wellbeing brewing).
I started with 30 days, then 90 days then six months no alcohol, and I continue that philosophy of focusing on a goal of a certain period of time worked for me. I also suggest as others here have, Annie Grace, this Naked Mind talks about alcohol in a unique way that made me want to quit.
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I love Run Wild from the athletic brewery. When going out I order a non-alcoholic beer and most often they only carry one but they usually are good.
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Here's an unexpected one. I've been not drinking for nearly 5 years now and it's great. A side effect of this is my husband has significantly reduced his alcohol consumption. At the end of last year, Ofpym had his first gout attack and it seems that beer is one of his triggers. He's opted to stop drinking instead of going on lifelong medication. (Now he has the MPP of getting rid of most of a batch of homemade beer and his homebrewing equipment.)
MPP = microsoft project plan? So he is not going to risk consuming the home brew himself? I suppose friends will gladly drink it. Good idea to change diet instead of going on meds, I think.
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MMP mustacian people problem of selling homebrew equipment!
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Ok, so I am probably just a weirdo. My drinking was quite heavy from 2016 through 2021. 2020-2021 the worse it has ever been, thank you Covid. I gave it up at the end of 2020 for almost 6 months and then picking it up again for an occasional drink at a restaurant (we rarely eat out) or a get together with friends. Last fall, I was drinking on Saturdays only watching college football while facetiming with my friends (we are Penn Staters). I never added drinking in other than Saturdays, but I would have about 4-5 drinks on that Saturday starting sometimes at noon and going through dinner. At Christmas while in FL visiting family and these friends I had some drinks and at one party actually was pretty drunk (I haven't done that is almost a year at that point). It felt really crappy and I stopped as soon as I got home the day before New Years Eve. Since then I have not had a drink again.
Here is the weird part. When we were in FL my hubby bought a case of the hard cider I like that is made with key limes and we brought it home with us. He put a couple of cans in the fridge when we got home from that trip. Everyday I would open the fridge door all day (I work from home) to get anything I needed and would see those cans. But I was not tempted to drink one because I didn't want to. About a month ago, hubby decided to have one and gave the other two to friends that were over to try. The next day when I opened the fridge and didn't see the cans anymore then suddenly I was craving a drink. For the next three days I was craving a drink every night. Finally the next day, I grabbed a can from the garage and put it in the fridge to cool. But that night when I was done with work and I opened the fridge I didn't want to drink it. I just grabbed my flavored seltzer instead to drink. So now I have been looking at that can again for weeks and have no desire to drink it. But when hubby said something about drinking it I told him he could, but he needed to replace it right away or I would want to drink. He looked at me like, you are just so weird sometimes. Does anyone else do something like this? I mentioned it to my sister in law and she said it is a control thing. When I have access to booze, I can control my thoughts and crave that control not the booze itself. When the booze is gone/out of the house my mind starts running thoughts about how I can get booze to fill that hole in the fridge.
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Ok, so I am probably just a weirdo. My drinking was quite heavy from 2016 through 2021. 2020-2021 the worse it has ever been, thank you Covid. I gave it up at the end of 2020 for almost 6 months and then picking it up again for an occasional drink at a restaurant (we rarely eat out) or a get together with friends. Last fall, I was drinking on Saturdays only watching college football while facetiming with my friends (we are Penn Staters). I never added drinking in other than Saturdays, but I would have about 4-5 drinks on that Saturday starting sometimes at noon and going through dinner. At Christmas while in FL visiting family and these friends I had some drinks and at one party actually was pretty drunk (I haven't done that is almost a year at that point). It felt really crappy and I stopped as soon as I got home the day before New Years Eve. Since then I have not had a drink again.
Here is the weird part. When we were in FL my hubby bought a case of the hard cider I like that is made with key limes and we brought it home with us. He put a couple of cans in the fridge when we got home from that trip. Everyday I would open the fridge door all day (I work from home) to get anything I needed and would see those cans. But I was not tempted to drink one because I didn't want to. About a month ago, hubby decided to have one and gave the other two to friends that were over to try. The next day when I opened the fridge and didn't see the cans anymore then suddenly I was craving a drink. For the next three days I was craving a drink every night. Finally the next day, I grabbed a can from the garage and put it in the fridge to cool. But that night when I was done with work and I opened the fridge I didn't want to drink it. I just grabbed my flavored seltzer instead to drink. So now I have been looking at that can again for weeks and have no desire to drink it. But when hubby said something about drinking it I told him he could, but he needed to replace it right away or I would want to drink. He looked at me like, you are just so weird sometimes. Does anyone else do something like this? I mentioned it to my sister in law and she said it is a control thing. When I have access to booze, I can control my thoughts and crave that control not the booze itself. When the booze is gone/out of the house my mind starts running thoughts about how I can get booze to fill that hole in the fridge.
I mean, I don't know if that's weird? Funny story though!
I say, whatever works to trick your mind until the "want" goes away, do that :)
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@regenaeb sounds like a scarcity/options emotion in play. I'm with sonofsven - if having the can there lets you continue not drinking, keep it up :)
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I had the opposite issue, if there was beer in the refrigerator I had to drink it. But whatever works, I mean trial and error, leaving beer in the frig or cider. I have successfully substituted non alcoholic beer and it fools my brain. Sometimes I drink none other times under stress 2 or 3. But it is enough to calm my brain from cravings. 2 years 8 months no alcohol so far.
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Regenaeb, I am that way too, sort of.
What really gets me to not drink is being out on the town and seeing the high prices for any sort of alcohol. If I can't find a special going on somewhere, it is easy for me to not drink.
But if there is a Stella Artois drafts half off happy hour somewhere, I'm all in.
Another way for me to not want to drink is having overdone it the day before.
Zeno's was my favorite bar back at PSU. A dollar a pitcher on Thirsty Thursdays, and they were real 64 ounce pitchers, lol.
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My guy used to drink every day, not a lot but enough for him to be occasionally obnoxious. He finally gave it up several years ago and hasn't had a drop since. In fact we have opened bottles of whiskey / cognac in the cupboard that haven't been even sipped for like 3 years. (I occasionally use them for cooking.)
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I had the opposite issue, if there was beer in the refrigerator I had to drink it. But whatever works, I mean trial and error, leaving beer in the frig or cider. I have successfully substituted non alcoholic beer and it fools my brain. Sometimes I drink none other times under stress 2 or 3. But it is enough to calm my brain from cravings. 2 years 8 months no alcohol so far.
Same here. Sometimes I would drink everything in the house. Now I fool myself with non alcoholic beer when I feel the need.
The new Guinness zero is quite good. Or it's been so long I can't tell.
2 years 6 months.
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Guinness zero have to try that. I like athletic brewing and wellbeing
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So far I've tried Heineken Zero, Athletic Upside Dawn, Athletic Lite, & Ceria Grainwave.
Have some Run Wild in the fridge haven't tried yet. Really liking the Ceria the best so far, think it might be good with an orange slice.
Definitely saving a lot of $$ going alcohol free. Have 2 or 3 N.A. beers when I have the desire, and then I'm good.
47 days here.
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Anyone try the non-alcoholic wines out there on the market? I keep getting advertisements for them on my Facebook feed and it has peaked my interest. I am curious what they taste like? But at this point I have no reason to drive to the part of town that has the closest Total Wine to pick up a few to try so I was hoping for some others opinions on them. With gas prices as high as they are I am not driving anywhere that I don't absolutely have to these days.
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I tried one. Sorry, don't remember the brand. It was bad. Tasted like watered down grape juice.
At dinners where we would have wine, we now do Welchs sparkling grape juice in wine glasses.
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So, I’m closing in on 16 months being, for the most part, alcohol free. I had a few sips of wine early this year (Jan-March), with one time having a half glass…For the last couple of months, I haven’t had any and truthfully haven’t even thought to either. I like not drinking.
The one thing I miss is the fun of trying a new wine. I like drinking (I.e., as in beverages in general) but since many drinks are high in sugar, I pretty much only drink water (including carbonated), coffee and the occasional tea or glass of milk. So, I miss trying new flavours in the form of liquid. I wonder if I should try making the occasional mock tail at home? Anyone here get into that?
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So, I’m closing in on 16 months being, for the most part, alcohol free. I had a few sips of wine early this year (Jan-March), with one time having a half glass…For the last couple of months, I haven’t had any and truthfully haven’t even thought to either. I like not drinking.
The one thing I miss is the fun of trying a new wine. I like drinking (I.e., as in beverages in general) but since many drinks are high in sugar, I pretty much only drink water (including carbonated), coffee and the occasional tea or glass of milk. So, I miss trying new flavours in the form of liquid. I wonder if I should try making the occasional mock tail at home? Anyone here get into that?
I make mock g&ts semi regularly using N/A gin...it's a pretty close facsimile.
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So, I’m closing in on 16 months being, for the most part, alcohol free. I had a few sips of wine early this year (Jan-March), with one time having a half glass…For the last couple of months, I haven’t had any and truthfully haven’t even thought to either. I like not drinking.
The one thing I miss is the fun of trying a new wine. I like drinking (I.e., as in beverages in general) but since many drinks are high in sugar, I pretty much only drink water (including carbonated), coffee and the occasional tea or glass of milk. So, I miss trying new flavours in the form of liquid. I wonder if I should try making the occasional mock tail at home? Anyone here get into that?
I make mock g&ts semi regularly using N/A gin...it's a pretty close facsimile.
I like the Zero Proof brand for alcohol alternatives. Specifically, I like the mock tequila for drinks that are paloma and margarita adjacent. I have not enjoyed the Seed Lip brand of alcohol alternatives and thought they tasted like melted cocktail ice.
I run into the same problem of being bored with water, coffee, and tea.
I have taken to ordering interesting flavored teas when they strike my fancy. I found a few really nice flavorful blends from a UK company called Bird and Blend. They have one called mistletoe and wine that smells like a Christmas punch, and another called Peach Bellini that is Peach and Elderflower.
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I tried the alcohol removed wine by Fre this past weekend. I got the red blend to try. I was in Florida visiting with family and attending a high school graduation. When back at the house having an after-graduation party, I opened this bottle and it hit the spot. It is not the best red blend I have tasted, but definitely not the worst I have had either. I would rate it like a "house" red you order at a restaurant. Not the red I would buy for my own house, but it fills the bill when you are eating out. It filled that void for me when others are all opening wines and drinking. I was able to enjoy myself talking to family I have not seen in a while, but not get highly intoxicated like I have in the past at these kinds of events. It felt great to know I would not feel terrible in the morning. And there was no need to get an Uber to get back to the hotel, I could drive myself and my kids. I will probably try their Rose as well the next time I am near the Total Wine for the summer to see what I think. The only downside is they are higher in sugar content then regular red wine. When they remove the alcohol, they add back in some grape juice for flavoring and that adds sugar. But it is far less sugar than the Moscato I used to drink or even a can of coke which I could have had instead. I kind of figured if I had actually brought a bottle of Moscato I would have finished it and consumed about 45g of sugar. Having 2 glasses of this red blend and I consumed 22g of sugar. So, for me that is a good trade off. I have lost 10 pounds since Christmas by not drinking and watching what I eat. I am hoping to continue with the weight loss into the summer. But last year during the summer I started indulging in booze on vacation and when hanging out with friends. Not getting wasted like previously, but enough booze on the weekends that it derailed my weight loss.
Lastly, I did have 2 drinks while I was out with my best friends for a ladies night out having dinner. It was only 2 and then I had soda after that the rest of the night so I could drive everyone home a couple of house later. It didn't really effect me when we were out, but I slept terrible that night and felt bad in the morning. Not majorly hung over or anything, but not well. My body really does not like me consuming alcohol. This weekend was reinforcement drinking even 2 drinks causes me to sleep terrible and feel bad the next day, which makes my mornings blah.
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@litestache
You plan on five weeks or you have done five weeks?
Any amount of time is great and will lead you to understand you and your body and minds connection to alcohol.
I personally feel that 30 days was not enough for me to get my energy back that it really took almost 2 months for me to feel a dramatic step up in energy YMMV.
Come back for support anytime.
OK @BikeFanatic on your advice I'm back for a longer stint. 88 days starting yesterday! Hoping to also lose some lbs this go around.
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yes!!! Lightstache, You can do it! I challenge you to look it like a self care adventure. Get in shape without being hard on yourself. Cut yourself some slack if you fall and just get right back on.
I hope to hear from you on this journey.
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8.5 years and going strong. Honestly the hardest parts were all in the first year. 2nd year was only moderately challenging and since then it's been pretty easy. Luckily I found a group I like a lot, having that support has been really helpful over the long haul. Lifering is a secular alternative to AA and it's more science based. The meetings are cool because there's a lot of crosstalk and discussion about what works and what doesn't work on a per-individual basis.
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Great job all!
Day 100 here, wow. Just got back from my yearly guy's cabin trip. Weekend of boating, card-playing, eating and drinking.
Went into it with the decision that I wasn't going to drink. Didn't mention to the other guy's I wasn't drinking, didn't make a big deal about it.
Stuck with my N.A. beer, and had a great time. Had a couple moments of thinking I could maybe have just one. Then reminded myself that one would turn to 7 or 8... or 12 or 13, and the hangover, dehydration, regret that goes along with it. Made the right choice.
Came back, rested, and recharged.
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Great job all!
Day 100 here, wow. Just got back from my yearly guy's cabin trip. Weekend of boating, card-playing, eating and drinking.
Went into it with the decision that I wasn't going to drink. Didn't mention to the other guy's I wasn't drinking, didn't make a big deal about it.
Stuck with my N.A. beer, and had a great time. Had a couple moments of thinking I could maybe have just one. Then reminded myself that one would turn to 7 or 8... or 12 or 13, and the hangover, dehydration, regret that goes along with it. Made the right choice.
Came back, rested, and recharged.
Some how I have found trips to be easier than might be expected. Did vegas several times dry with others who were drinking and was moderately easy, but I dont think I was heavily in adducted. I think having the short term end date of the trip makes it easier, just have to make it 3 days then I leave vs am going to go 30 days no booze. Maybe the guys I was with were happy to have a sober person along or they did not really care but was very little pressure to drink.
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I am coming up on five years and it just keeps getting easier. Even a lot of the substitutes I was using aren’t needed anymore. I go through so much herbal tea these days but even the expensive ones cost less than a glass of wine out at a restaurant or bar.
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yes!!! Lightstache, You can do it! I challenge you to look it like a self care adventure. Get in shape without being hard on yourself. Cut yourself some slack if you fall and just get right back on.
I hope to hear from you on this journey.
Appreciate the support! I'm feeling optimistic on day two haha. Day 32 might be a different story.
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Great job all! Just hit 5 months here.
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Yay for 5 months, drumstache!
I had a bit of a slip, deciding that I could go ahead and drink while I was on vacation. Not a bad idea. But then I planned another vacation after my first vacation without too much time in between and drinking seemed to ooze in between the two. Moderation is still not something I lean to naturally with booze.
So back to no booze. I am planning on next lifting the personal ban for the holidays, from, say, Dec. 21 to Dec. 31.
In the meantime, I heard that alcohol can cause cancer so that is extra motivation to stay clear of the stuff.
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Yay for 5 months, drumstache!
I had a bit of a slip, deciding that I could go ahead and drink while I was on vacation. Not a bad idea. But then I planned another vacation after my first vacation without too much time in between and drinking seemed to ooze in between the two. Moderation is still not something I lean to naturally with booze.
So back to no booze. I am planning on next lifting the personal ban for the holidays, from, say, Dec. 21 to Dec. 31.
In the meantime, I heard that alcohol can cause cancer so that is extra motivation to stay clear of the stuff.
Alcohol is a rather powerful carcinogen actually. Nasty shit.
As for Christmas,you should at least considering trying one sober, or picking select events to drink at instead of opening up the full floodgates.
The reason I say this is because I quit right before some major open-bar events, and because I chose to make it through those very booze-centric events, after that. I felt like I could handle staying sober though anything.
It's good to experiment with trying sobriety for events that you would normally default to as "drinking events."
The way I saw it was that if I couldn't comfortably do those events sober, even for just one year, didn't that mean I really should?
Now, you can't actually make decisions for your future self. So I'm not saying you should decide today not to drink over Christmas. You can't. That's just pointless and will put meaningless pressure on you.
What I *am* saying is to perhaps just chew on the possibility for a bit and see what thoughts and feelings come up in response.
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I think it’s important for someone to go a entire year sober. Then you will have shown yourself that you don’t need alcohol. I think if you can’t do that then there’s a problem. I recently celebrated 2 years AF.
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The way I saw it was that if I couldn't comfortably do those events sober, even for just one year, didn't that mean I really should?
Hah! you obviously haven't met my family.
Not sure if I'm welcome in this thread as I haven't given up the booze but I've cut way down. I started drinking a glass of wine a day during Covid and it continued once we were all let out of our apartments in late May 2020. This is entirely normal for where I live (Italy) where most people drink a glass of wine with dinner. Wine is considered a staple here like milk or bread.
Anyway I noticed that I gained several kilos during Covid and I suspect it's the wine along with lack of exercise while locked into my apartment. I can't fit into many of my tighter dresses anymore. Here in Italy, during Covid, we were locked into our apartments for several months and not allowed to go out at all, including exercise, except to buy food at the nearest grocery store.
So I decided to cut down on the booze for health and weight loss reasons but I'm not cutting it out completely as I really enjoy a nice glass or two of wine with a nice meal occasionally. I had a glass of wine with my dinner last weekend when out with a friend and I plan to have a beer with my pizza tomorrow night. But I think I'll keep it to a once a week or so thing.
The first few days I really craved my glass of wine with dinner. But I replaced it with a glass of milk (very weird I know!) and all is good.
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The way I saw it was that if I couldn't comfortably do those events sober, even for just one year, didn't that mean I really should?
Hah! you obviously haven't met my family.
I know this is a joke, but if you've read any of my previous posts about drinking in response to stress, then you likely know my response to this.
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@hulahoop yes you are welcome in this thread, this is the booze free as long as you like discussion .
@Cassie congratulations to you and your 2 years, a huge accomplishment. I felt amazing at 2 years.
I like the challenge of one year no beer, it does train you to experience everything without alcohol and after experiencing those parties and gatherings I realize
, I don’t need it at all.
This is year 3 for me or rather will be on 09/01 and I am in much better shape than I have been in 15 years. I somehow made it through a rough year with divorce and death and still here I am sober.
I feel mentally I am in a better place than if I was drinking.
I have had a few sips of beer this year. And twice I drank an entire drink.Once with a friend and once when someone left me a drink in the fridge and I was having a rough month. The last time I actually was hung over the next day, talk about motivation! I felt like crap until 6 pm and I was like NEVER AGAIN!
It was margarita in a can, super strong 12% alcohol I guess the equivalent of half a bottle of wine, didn’t really enjoy it, passed out on the couch then sick.
This last year I had a lot of temptation, but I hope I learned my lessons and will not go back. I no longer feel addicted, but I don’t want to tempt fate, I really enjoy my mornings, I love getting out early, my flat belly motivates me, as I had a beer gut last 15 years.
Anyway rambling, but hoping for another sober year.
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I haven't had anything to drink in 2022, but to be fair, it's because I'm pregnant so I don't know if it really counts. I feel pretty good about it, and am in no rush to get back to drinking, if I even decide to at all. All the "wine mom" memes and jokes about how moms need to drink to cope with their families really bother me, and even if it's likely safe to have some alcohol while breastfeeding, I'm not sure the risk is worth it.
The only time I'm tempted is when there's something interesting to try, like the homemade wine my partner made, a homemade liquor from a friend, or some natural orange wines my friends had. In those cases I've taken a sniff and a tiny sip just for the flavour, but not enough to really swallow, and that's satisfied my curiosity.
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@hulahoop yes you are welcome in this thread, this is the booze free as long as you like discussion .
@Cassie congratulations to you and your 2 years, a huge accomplishment. I felt amazing at 2 years.
I like the challenge of one year no beer, it does train you to experience everything without alcohol and after experiencing those parties and gatherings I realize
, I don’t need it at all.
This is year 3 for me or rather will be on 09/01 and I am in much better shape than I have been in 15 years. I somehow made it through a rough year with divorce and death and still here I am sober.
I feel mentally I am in a better place than if I was drinking.
I have had a few sips of beer this year. And twice I drank an entire drink.Once with a friend and once when someone left me a drink in the fridge and I was having a rough month. The last time I actually was hung over the next day, talk about motivation! I felt like crap until 6 pm and I was like NEVER AGAIN!
It was margarita in a can, super strong 12% alcohol I guess the equivalent of half a bottle of wine, didn’t really enjoy it, passed out on the couch then sick.
This last year I had a lot of temptation, but I hope I learned my lessons and will not go back. I no longer feel addicted, but I don’t want to tempt fate, I really enjoy my mornings, I love getting out early, my flat belly motivates me, as I had a beer gut last 15 years.
Anyway rambling, but hoping for another sober year.
I'm 50 and I've found that lately, I can only have one glass of wine or beer and that's it. If I have more than that it ruins my sleep and I feel kind of 'off' and exhausted the following day. My husband is the same. He gave up drinking for a year and a half but now he drinks sometimes but at our ages our limits are way down. The sleep thing is really important. I have a fitbit so can tell when my sleep is off after two glasses of wine or whatever.
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The way I saw it was that if I couldn't comfortably do those events sober, even for just one year, didn't that mean I really should?
Hah! you obviously haven't met my family.
I know this is a joke, but if you've read any of my previous posts about drinking in response to stress, then you likely know my response to this.
Gotcha
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@hulahoop yes you are welcome in this thread, this is the booze free as long as you like discussion .
@Cassie congratulations to you and your 2 years, a huge accomplishment. I felt amazing at 2 years.
I like the challenge of one year no beer, it does train you to experience everything without alcohol and after experiencing those parties and gatherings I realize
, I don’t need it at all.
This is year 3 for me or rather will be on 09/01 and I am in much better shape than I have been in 15 years. I somehow made it through a rough year with divorce and death and still here I am sober.
I feel mentally I am in a better place than if I was drinking.
I have had a few sips of beer this year. And twice I drank an entire drink.Once with a friend and once when someone left me a drink in the fridge and I was having a rough month. The last time I actually was hung over the next day, talk about motivation! I felt like crap until 6 pm and I was like NEVER AGAIN!
It was margarita in a can, super strong 12% alcohol I guess the equivalent of half a bottle of wine, didn’t really enjoy it, passed out on the couch then sick.
This last year I had a lot of temptation, but I hope I learned my lessons and will not go back. I no longer feel addicted, but I don’t want to tempt fate, I really enjoy my mornings, I love getting out early, my flat belly motivates me, as I had a beer gut last 15 years.
Anyway rambling, but hoping for another sober year.
Ah yes, the flat stomach is a heavy motivator in this household as well, lol.
All of DH's friends are always asking how he manages to stay so cut at almost 50, and he always replies "I don't drink." And then they all just kind of sigh and slump a bit because that is *not* what they wanted to hear.
As for not feeling addicted, it's such a nice feeling to no longer feel like your thoughts and behaviour are being co-opted. However, the evidence supports that the addictive neural pathways don't go away, and it takes at least two years for them to rewire enough to meaningfully change.
This is why so many addicts can land exactly back where they were before so quickly. I've seen it so many times with smokers. They feel free, then casually take a puff of someone's cigarette one day, feel utterly disgusted by it, and become overconfident that they are now totally cured. Within two weeks usually, they're back to a pack day.
I know for me, around the 2 year mark I felt a shift. Annie Grace talks about the research that supports that addicts often can at the two year mark start drinking moderately again with reasonable rates of success of managing their habits.
I do feel like I could do that now if I wanted to, I just don't want to.
The big shift is that I now view alcoholic beverages as just beverages. Like, if someone told me that orange juice was toxic, I just wouldn't drink it. It's just a beverage.
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My EX Spouse went back after 2 years we quit together. At first she partied hard, but seems to have tapered off to controlled drinking.
I am about to hit the 3 year mark, but really want to stay firmly in the no drinking so I doubt I will have the occasional beer. I didn't enjoy any beer I had during sobriety I had just a taste out of curiosity but really the taste was not so great anyways. I do indulge in the occasional non alcoholic beer, it was a crutch at first now it is an occasional crutch or way to satisfy a craving especially if out to dinner or a party, But I can do both without non alcoholic beer just occasionally I want one.
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Interestingly, @Malcat, your comments in direct response to my post didn't have much immediate direct effect on me, but then your comments in a further post about the 2 year mark did.
I quit drinking in 2021, with the commitment to myself that I would not have any alcohol up until mid-December of that year. It wasn't due to any particular holiday parties or events, just that I wanted to have two weeks where I gave myself permission to booze or not to booze. I don't know why in particular. It mostly has to do with the calendar year and I think I do this for most of my New Year's Resolution, especially if they are related to physical activity (i.e. walk a certain distance every week this year), I give myself an exemption for the last two weeks of they year and consider the goal achieved if I make it to mid-December. This calendar year -- 2022 -- I didn't really renew the commitment to not drink at all, thinking I could go ahead and drink while on vacation if I felt like it. And apparently, I did feel like it.
But the info on the 2 year mark for addiction may change my mind and convince me to commit to a full 2 years of no alcohol before revisiting the question.
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Interestingly, @Malcat, your comments in direct response to my post didn't have much immediate direct effect on me, but then your comments in a further post about the 2 year mark did.
I quit drinking in 2021, with the commitment to myself that I would not have any alcohol up until mid-December of that year. It wasn't due to any particular holiday parties or events, just that I wanted to have two weeks where I gave myself permission to booze or not to booze. I don't know why in particular. It mostly has to do with the calendar year and I think I do this for most of my New Year's Resolution, especially if they are related to physical activity (i.e. walk a certain distance every week this year), I give myself an exemption for the last two weeks of they year and consider the goal achieved if I make it to mid-December. This calendar year -- 2022 -- I didn't really renew the commitment to not drink at all, thinking I could go ahead and drink while on vacation if I felt like it. And apparently, I did feel like it.
But the info on the 2 year mark for addiction may change my mind and convince me to commit to a full 2 years of no alcohol before revisiting the question.
See that's the big difference between a brain that's addicted and brain that isn't.
An addicted brain, when given permission to drink, is going to drink.
I have permission to drink. I don't hold myself back or limit myself. If I genuinely feel that drinking will produce a net benefit, I'll do it. I just don't see that ever happening.
The less addicted you are to something, the less appeal it has.
Basically, a two week drinking free for all only sounds fun if you are addicted. To me, that sounds like a miserable time. Also to me, vacation sounds like the least opportune time to drink more, because alcohol makes you infinitely less present in the moment and blocks the formation of memories.
So the question isn't "have I been sober long enough to handle two weeks of no-limits drinking" the question is "am I still addicted enough to want two weeks of no-limits drinking?"
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Yay for 5 months, drumstache!
Thanks Dee!
@BikeFanatic congrats on upcoming 3 years!
@Cassie Congrats on 2 years!
...
I know for me, around the 2 year mark I felt a shift. Annie Grace talks about the research that supports that addicts often can at the two year mark start drinking moderately again with reasonable rates of success of managing their habits.
I do feel like I could do that now if I wanted to, I just don't want to.
@Malkat, The Annie Grace program was a big help in changing my thinking.
A friend, who's been mostly supportive suggested, 'Well, now you can just have 1 or 2 every now and then'. I think he misses 'Drinking Buddy'. Glad I did her program, otherwise, I might have thought, 'yeah, you're right'.
For me, moderation sounds like too much work. I know I can turn down the first beer. Turning down the 2nd or 3rd, etc, now it's a 'Thing', I have to think about. I just want to relax, and enjoy life.
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At the two year mark was when I knew for sure that I was never going to drink again - I had done two rounds of all the special occasions and seasons, all the summer picnics and long bikes rides, the mountains in winter, seeing my family, travelling overseas and it turned out all of it was not only manageable but better for being present for all of it. Plus it was the second year when the booze weight came off, which I was very pleased about.
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See that's the big difference between a brain that's addicted and brain that isn't.
An addicted brain, when given permission to drink, is going to drink.
I have permission to drink. I don't hold myself back or limit myself. If I genuinely feel that drinking will produce a net benefit, I'll do it. I just don't see that ever happening.
The less addicted you are to something, the less appeal it has.
Basically, a two week drinking free for all only sounds fun if you are addicted. To me, that sounds like a miserable time. Also to me, vacation sounds like the least opportune time to drink more, because alcohol makes you infinitely less present in the moment and blocks the formation of memories.
So the question isn't "have I been sober long enough to handle two weeks of no-limits drinking" the question is "am I still addicted enough to want two weeks of no-limits drinking?"
This is an important distinction. Even people who have abused alcohol in the past may never have really been addicted.
I've just never thought drinking was that much fun. I drink whenever I want to; the last time I wanted to was eight months ago. Drinking multiple days in a row has never sounded good to me.
Now, cigarettes? I cannot have a single one, ever, or I will go right back to thinking about them constantly and plotting out when my next one will be, and then have to start the whole wretched process of quitting all over again.
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I didn’t drink for 14 years while I was raising my kids. Back then I only drank once a year but would usually get drunk. Then once they were grown and I had been with my last husband a year he convinced me that I could drink occasionally with him. It started out fine for a few years and then I was drinking every night to relax after work. Ugh! He ironically didn’t have a problem.
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I didn't drink while raising my kids, once they left the house I started have a drink or two in the evening. A couple months ago I started a Carnivore diet and that doesn't fit, so, I haven't had a drink in 9 weeks. I rarely miss it, when I do, it's because my back hurts and it's bedtime, just wishing for a drink to get me to sleep.
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I didn't drink while raising my kids, once they left the house I started have a drink or two in the evening. A couple months ago I started a Carnivore diet and that doesn't fit, so, I haven't had a drink in 9 weeks. I rarely miss it, when I do, it's because my back hurts and it's bedtime, just wishing for a drink to get me to sleep.
Well, whenever you are craving alcohol to fall asleep, remind yourself that it damages your quality of sleep so badly that you're generally better off just not drinking.
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Just wanted to pop in to say it’s been just over 6 months without a drop of alcohol. I have not craved it once over these 6 months.
My journey to AF life began almost 1 year before that. I cut out almost all alcohol but had about 6 glasses in total during that one year. Most of the time it was less than a glass for a total of about 10 times during that year. I found that I couldn’t even smell red wine, so had only white. But, wasn’t really enjoying it, so decided to just stop altogether. It’s been a great decision!
If anyone is considering it, but just doesn’t feel ready, that is okay. I must have popped in to read this thread for a good 6 months before deciding to try to stop drinking. But, I can tell you, you will not regret giving it up!!
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When I was drinking, I had higher highs and lower lows. When I stopped drinking, the roller coaster evened out and as a bonus, my day to day quality of life improved substantially.
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I've given more thought to @Malcat's comments, especially:
So the question isn't "have I been sober long enough to handle two weeks of no-limits drinking" the question is "am I still addicted enough to want two weeks of no-limits drinking?"
And I've decided to go ahead and be dry for a full 2 years before I revisit the question of when (if at all) I want to drink. So I've committed to myself to have no alcohol (at least not on purpose*) until September 5, 2024.
I actually shook on it with my spouse, who made the same commitment, but he's got short term memory issues (so he won't remember) and no history of buying alcohol or ordering alcohol, but would occasionally have wine when I'd get some, so I think he will have no difficulty with his commitment to stay dry despite forgetting about it.
*The "at least not on purpose" means I might accidentally use mouth wash or cough syrup with alcohol or order a "virgin" drink but be misunderstood by a server...or something like that...not that I'm giving myself some sort of secret free pass to drink through some novel interpretation of the words "not on purpose".
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I think I was alcohol free 2 years before I experimented a little with sips and then one or two drinks just recently.
I did also have a rough year with divorce and death and other stresses, I was very tempted several times, and I just had a beer one night, then a week or so later, 2 beers, and they were not that good either. Caronna, yuck. Recently had a margarita in a can and was hungover, it said 12% alcohol, and it was 12 ounces. Someone left it in my cooler at the beach and when I got home I drank it.
Later I calculated that was like 1/2 a bottle of wine. I think those 2 years and my 3 year anniversary have given me the resolve to continue abstenance . so far since then I haven’t had a drink in a month.
It does take practice to surf anxiety and parties and other events that used to require alcohol.
I feel now it is just occasionally battling my own desire to use alcohol to cope.
My big triggers are being alone at home and at a party or club and people are doing shots and dancing and letting loose. I am not sure if I can get that loose, but they look like they are having so much fun.
I find riding my Ebike home in the evening after the party the most fun, and getting up early the next day, feeling amazing is so good too. So my plan is just to take it 30 days at a time, I am still motivated by that hangover and my physical fitness goals.
At least there no real physical cravings just the occasional though maybe I should stop at the liquor store? So far all my drinking and it couldn’t be more than a six pack total, have been alcohol left at my house. Staying away from the big drinkers in my life probably will help. I forgot to mention I was dating a big drinker and thankfully we broke up. So at least I don’t have the temptation of beer in my refrigerator, and I don’t have to deal with drinkers except at parties and that sort of thing.
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I think I was alcohol free 2 years before I experimented a little with sips and then one or two drinks just recently.
I did also have a rough year with divorce and death and other stresses, I was very tempted several times, and I just had a beer one night, then a week or so later, 2 beers, and they were not that good either. Caronna, yuck. Recently had a margarita in a can and was hungover, it said 12% alcohol, and it was 12 ounces. Someone left it in my cooler at the beach and when I got home I drank it.
Later I calculated that was like 1/2 a bottle of wine. I think those 2 years and my 3 year anniversary have given me the resolve to continue abstenance . so far since then I haven’t had a drink in a month.
It does take practice to surf anxiety and parties and other events that used to require alcohol.
I feel now it is just occasionally battling my own desire to use alcohol to cope.
My big triggers are being alone at home and at a party or club and people are doing shots and dancing and letting loose. I am not sure if I can get that loose, but they look like they are having so much fun.
I find riding my Ebike home in the evening after the party the most fun, and getting up early the next day, feeling amazing is so good too. So my plan is just to take it 30 days at a time, I am still motivated by that hangover and my physical fitness goals.
At least there no real physical cravings just the occasional though maybe I should stop at the liquor store? So far all my drinking and it couldn’t be more than a six pack total, have been alcohol left at my house. Staying away from the big drinkers in my life probably will help. I forgot to mention I was dating a big drinker and thankfully we broke up. So at least I don’t have the temptation of beer in my refrigerator, and I don’t have to deal with drinkers except at parties and that sort of thing.
There are certainly things I don't tolerate well without alcohol, but I don't see that as a loss, it's just the way I am. I also can't tolerate staying up all night and then doing a 16 hour work day the next day, which I know I could do if I started using meth, but I'm pretty okay with the fact that there are just things I can't do/enjoy without dangerous, toxic, mind altering drugs.
I also notice what I have gained from being sober when socializing. I may not be able to enjoy being part of a group of increasingly loud/disinhibited/cognitively absent people anymore, but I have so much more fun really engaging with friends, really connecting with them, and fully remembering the experience.
So I'm not the person to hang out with and get drunk, but I am the person to go do interesting, engaging things with, and eat good food with, and have really great talks with.
Not drinking has given me the opportunity to really embrace who I am, what I like, who I enjoy, and how I engage with my life. Not what I can force myself to be/do by altering my cognitive function.
Also, every time I see someone "letting loose" and "having fun" I think back to who I was when I did that. I was loud, definitely more arrogant, said dumb shit, and was a terrible listener. Drunk me may have seemed like the life of the party, but she was a bit of an insufferable ass IMO. I'm pretty happy not to summon her and have her represent me anymore.
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Last fall my wife and I went alcohol free for 30 days. We are doing the same right now. It's mostly weight loss for us. The other thing for me was that drinking a beer lost its appeal because it felt so normal. It didn't feel "special". I'm not saying that you need alcohol to feel special. I'm just trying to say that when I drink alcohol, I want it to feel special and not normal. In an effort to cater to this new psychological drive, when our 30 days is over and I go back to drinking alcohol, I think I'm only going to drink on the weekends. We will see how that goes.
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I've followed this thread with interest. Alcohol is something that has always been interesting for me. I was raised in an area where many people are alcohol free for religious reasons, and I was an exception. I was raised that alcohol was no big deal as long as you didn't get intoxicated. For whatever reason, I internalized that message really well. I've drank rarely throughout my adult life - sometimes a couple of drinks one night and maybe not another drink for 3-6 months. I've never been intoxicated - rarely ever drunk to the point where I felt the effects, never remotely had a hangover. I am completely fine without it - have no compulsion to have it, and because I've purchased a decent amount of alcohol but very rarely drink, I have a house with quite a bit of alcohol that, in this time period, for example, I haven't drank any of in probably 4-5 months. So, I'm solidly sure it's not a compulsion. I do enjoy the taste of alcohol - especially scotch and certain beers. I very, very rarely drink if there's not someone over at my house who likes scotch or I'm out with a friend who likes some specific beers.
The thread comments on here are interesting, because it seems I am an anomaly. I see comments of people who have stopped drinking and trying it again don't like it. That's not me because it could be 6 months to a year before I drink, but when I do, I do enjoy it.
Overall, my biggest interest, other than theoretical to learn new perspectives, is how to communicate a healthy perspective of alcohol to my kids. I feel pretty confident that I have a very healthy perspective on alcohol, despite drinking sporadically. I wouldn't mind if my kids never drank, or if they drank in the manner I do. I'd prefer they avoid going down the part where addictive pathways are made. If anyone has any thoughts on that, I'd be appreciate to hear it. I realize on a thread like this, it's doubtful that I would find anyone who's alcohol experiences mirrored mine, but I've found that's true not just on these kinds of threads but in general.
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I've followed this thread with interest. Alcohol is something that has always been interesting for me. I was raised in an area where many people are alcohol free for religious reasons, and I was an exception. I was raised that alcohol was no big deal as long as you didn't get intoxicated. For whatever reason, I internalized that message really well. I've drank rarely throughout my adult life - sometimes a couple of drinks one night and maybe not another drink for 3-6 months. I've never been intoxicated - rarely ever drunk to the point where I felt the effects, never remotely had a hangover. I am completely fine without it - have no compulsion to have it, and because I've purchased a decent amount of alcohol but very rarely drink, I have a house with quite a bit of alcohol that, in this time period, for example, I haven't drank any of in probably 4-5 months. So, I'm solidly sure it's not a compulsion. I do enjoy the taste of alcohol - especially scotch and certain beers. I very, very rarely drink if there's not someone over at my house who likes scotch or I'm out with a friend who likes some specific beers.
The thread comments on here are interesting, because it seems I am an anomaly. I see comments of people who have stopped drinking and trying it again don't like it. That's not me because it could be 6 months to a year before I drink, but when I do, I do enjoy it.
Overall, my biggest interest, other than theoretical to learn new perspectives, is how to communicate a healthy perspective of alcohol to my kids. I feel pretty confident that I have a very healthy perspective on alcohol, despite drinking sporadically. I wouldn't mind if my kids never drank, or if they drank in the manner I do. I'd prefer they avoid going down the part where addictive pathways are made. If anyone has any thoughts on that, I'd be appreciate to hear it. I realize on a thread like this, it's doubtful that I would find anyone who's alcohol experiences mirrored mine, but I've found that's true not just on these kinds of threads but in general.
It is possible to acquire a taste for just about anything, so it's not that your case is an exception to a rule, it's just extremely rare that someone will drink enough to acquire a taste without drinking enough to get addicted.
For those of us who quite and can't stand the taste, it wouldn't take much to re-acquire the taste for it.
There are a lot of things that objectively taste bad that you can condition yourself to like. I mean, if I found out that blue cheese was terrible for me and a known powerful carcinogen, I would probably pretty easily lose my taste for that as well. So how you feel about a super strong taste will influence how your brain perceives it as well.
But there's no question, alcohol tastes objectively like gasoline. Whether someone likes it or not, that's the taste.
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I've followed this thread with interest. Alcohol is something that has always been interesting for me. I was raised in an area where many people are alcohol free for religious reasons, and I was an exception. I was raised that alcohol was no big deal as long as you didn't get intoxicated. For whatever reason, I internalized that message really well. I've drank rarely throughout my adult life - sometimes a couple of drinks one night and maybe not another drink for 3-6 months. I've never been intoxicated - rarely ever drunk to the point where I felt the effects, never remotely had a hangover. I am completely fine without it - have no compulsion to have it, and because I've purchased a decent amount of alcohol but very rarely drink, I have a house with quite a bit of alcohol that, in this time period, for example, I haven't drank any of in probably 4-5 months. So, I'm solidly sure it's not a compulsion. I do enjoy the taste of alcohol - especially scotch and certain beers. I very, very rarely drink if there's not someone over at my house who likes scotch or I'm out with a friend who likes some specific beers.
The thread comments on here are interesting, because it seems I am an anomaly. I see comments of people who have stopped drinking and trying it again don't like it. That's not me because it could be 6 months to a year before I drink, but when I do, I do enjoy it.
Overall, my biggest interest, other than theoretical to learn new perspectives, is how to communicate a healthy perspective of alcohol to my kids. I feel pretty confident that I have a very healthy perspective on alcohol, despite drinking sporadically. I wouldn't mind if my kids never drank, or if they drank in the manner I do. I'd prefer they avoid going down the part where addictive pathways are made. If anyone has any thoughts on that, I'd be appreciate to hear it. I realize on a thread like this, it's doubtful that I would find anyone who's alcohol experiences mirrored mine, but I've found that's true not just on these kinds of threads but in general.
I'm like you-- I drink rarely but enjoy it when I do.
Both of my parents are adult children of alcoholics-- generations of alcoholics-- and were terrified of alcohol. But I married into a family of Eastern European Lutherans who kept all manner of firewater on hand in staggering quantity, but really never drank excessively. I learned moderate drinking from them.
I think being exposed to moderate drinkers who are conscious enough of the potential for addiction to know the value of an occasional drying-out period is useful. For instance, all the Lutheran in-laws (now out-laws) gave up alcohol for Lent.
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I've followed this thread with interest. Alcohol is something that has always been interesting for me. I was raised in an area where many people are alcohol free for religious reasons, and I was an exception. I was raised that alcohol was no big deal as long as you didn't get intoxicated. For whatever reason, I internalized that message really well. I've drank rarely throughout my adult life - sometimes a couple of drinks one night and maybe not another drink for 3-6 months. I've never been intoxicated - rarely ever drunk to the point where I felt the effects, never remotely had a hangover. I am completely fine without it - have no compulsion to have it, and because I've purchased a decent amount of alcohol but very rarely drink, I have a house with quite a bit of alcohol that, in this time period, for example, I haven't drank any of in probably 4-5 months. So, I'm solidly sure it's not a compulsion. I do enjoy the taste of alcohol - especially scotch and certain beers. I very, very rarely drink if there's not someone over at my house who likes scotch or I'm out with a friend who likes some specific beers.
The thread comments on here are interesting, because it seems I am an anomaly. I see comments of people who have stopped drinking and trying it again don't like it. That's not me because it could be 6 months to a year before I drink, but when I do, I do enjoy it.
Overall, my biggest interest, other than theoretical to learn new perspectives, is how to communicate a healthy perspective of alcohol to my kids. I feel pretty confident that I have a very healthy perspective on alcohol, despite drinking sporadically. I wouldn't mind if my kids never drank, or if they drank in the manner I do. I'd prefer they avoid going down the part where addictive pathways are made. If anyone has any thoughts on that, I'd be appreciate to hear it. I realize on a thread like this, it's doubtful that I would find anyone who's alcohol experiences mirrored mine, but I've found that's true not just on these kinds of threads but in general.
It is possible to acquire a taste for just about anything, so it's not that your case is an exception to a rule, it's just extremely rare that someone will drink enough to acquire a taste without drinking enough to get addicted.
For those of us who quite and can't stand the taste, it wouldn't take much to re-acquire the taste for it.
There are a lot of things that objectively taste bad that you can condition yourself to like. I mean, if I found out that blue cheese was terrible for me and a known powerful carcinogen, I would probably pretty easily lose my taste for that as well. So how you feel about a super strong taste will influence how your brain perceives it as well.
But there's no question, alcohol tastes objectively like gasoline. Whether someone likes it or not, that's the taste.
That's so interesting! I truly must be an anomaly then. I am not aware of ever acquiring a taste for alcohol. I have known whether or not I like things immediately upon drinking. I've probably had maybe the equivalent of 30-40 glasses of beer spread out over many years. Some I immediately knew was terrible - usually tasted like acidic water rather than gasoline. In fact, I've never tasted any alcohol that made me think of gasoline. On the other hand, I've tasted beers that I liked immediately - usually special-made ones rather than large scale manufactured ones. I also immediately liked hard apple cider when I drank it. I immediately liked scotch when I drank it - some types, and some I immediately disliked. I don't think I've ever acquired the taste for any alcohol.
Anyways, your part about most people developing addictive pathways while they acquire a taste for it makes sense. I've only drank out of enjoyment. i"ve also always metered myself where if the thought ever popped into my head anything to the effect of "Man after today, I could use a drink," (even if it was mostly in jest) I've made sure I didn't drink that day because the intoxicating effect of it was never the goal, and I wanted to make sure it never turned into a coping mechanism.
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I've followed this thread with interest. Alcohol is something that has always been interesting for me. I was raised in an area where many people are alcohol free for religious reasons, and I was an exception. I was raised that alcohol was no big deal as long as you didn't get intoxicated. For whatever reason, I internalized that message really well. I've drank rarely throughout my adult life - sometimes a couple of drinks one night and maybe not another drink for 3-6 months. I've never been intoxicated - rarely ever drunk to the point where I felt the effects, never remotely had a hangover. I am completely fine without it - have no compulsion to have it, and because I've purchased a decent amount of alcohol but very rarely drink, I have a house with quite a bit of alcohol that, in this time period, for example, I haven't drank any of in probably 4-5 months. So, I'm solidly sure it's not a compulsion. I do enjoy the taste of alcohol - especially scotch and certain beers. I very, very rarely drink if there's not someone over at my house who likes scotch or I'm out with a friend who likes some specific beers.
The thread comments on here are interesting, because it seems I am an anomaly. I see comments of people who have stopped drinking and trying it again don't like it. That's not me because it could be 6 months to a year before I drink, but when I do, I do enjoy it.
Overall, my biggest interest, other than theoretical to learn new perspectives, is how to communicate a healthy perspective of alcohol to my kids. I feel pretty confident that I have a very healthy perspective on alcohol, despite drinking sporadically. I wouldn't mind if my kids never drank, or if they drank in the manner I do. I'd prefer they avoid going down the part where addictive pathways are made. If anyone has any thoughts on that, I'd be appreciate to hear it. I realize on a thread like this, it's doubtful that I would find anyone who's alcohol experiences mirrored mine, but I've found that's true not just on these kinds of threads but in general.
It is possible to acquire a taste for just about anything, so it's not that your case is an exception to a rule, it's just extremely rare that someone will drink enough to acquire a taste without drinking enough to get addicted.
For those of us who quite and can't stand the taste, it wouldn't take much to re-acquire the taste for it.
There are a lot of things that objectively taste bad that you can condition yourself to like. I mean, if I found out that blue cheese was terrible for me and a known powerful carcinogen, I would probably pretty easily lose my taste for that as well. So how you feel about a super strong taste will influence how your brain perceives it as well.
But there's no question, alcohol tastes objectively like gasoline. Whether someone likes it or not, that's the taste.
That's so interesting! I truly must be an anomaly then. I am not aware of ever acquiring a taste for alcohol. I have known whether or not I like things immediately upon drinking. I've probably had maybe the equivalent of 30-40 glasses of beer spread out over many years. Some I immediately knew was terrible - usually tasted like acidic water rather than gasoline. In fact, I've never tasted any alcohol that made me think of gasoline. On the other hand, I've tasted beers that I liked immediately - usually special-made ones rather than large scale manufactured ones. I also immediately liked hard apple cider when I drank it. I immediately liked scotch when I drank it - some types, and some I immediately disliked. I don't think I've ever acquired the taste for any alcohol.
Anyways, your part about most people developing addictive pathways while they acquire a taste for it makes sense. I've only drank out of enjoyment. i"ve also always metered myself where if the thought ever popped into my head anything to the effect of "Man after today, I could use a drink," (even if it was mostly in jest) I've made sure I didn't drink that day because the intoxicating effect of it was never the goal, and I wanted to make sure it never turned into a coping mechanism.
It's extremely typical that when teens first start drinking alcohol that they need to drown out the horrid taste with sugary mixers until they get used to choking down the gasoline taste.
Booze companies invented ultra sugary drinks specifically to target people who hadn't yet acquired the taste: namely women and youth.
I'm sure there are rare, rare exceptions of people who immediately are okay with the taste gasoline, but it's very well documented that the taste of alcohol needs to be drowned out in order for neophyte drinkers to tolerate it.
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I've followed this thread with interest. Alcohol is something that has always been interesting for me. I was raised in an area where many people are alcohol free for religious reasons, and I was an exception. I was raised that alcohol was no big deal as long as you didn't get intoxicated. For whatever reason, I internalized that message really well. I've drank rarely throughout my adult life - sometimes a couple of drinks one night and maybe not another drink for 3-6 months. I've never been intoxicated - rarely ever drunk to the point where I felt the effects, never remotely had a hangover. I am completely fine without it - have no compulsion to have it, and because I've purchased a decent amount of alcohol but very rarely drink, I have a house with quite a bit of alcohol that, in this time period, for example, I haven't drank any of in probably 4-5 months. So, I'm solidly sure it's not a compulsion. I do enjoy the taste of alcohol - especially scotch and certain beers. I very, very rarely drink if there's not someone over at my house who likes scotch or I'm out with a friend who likes some specific beers.
The thread comments on here are interesting, because it seems I am an anomaly. I see comments of people who have stopped drinking and trying it again don't like it. That's not me because it could be 6 months to a year before I drink, but when I do, I do enjoy it.
Overall, my biggest interest, other than theoretical to learn new perspectives, is how to communicate a healthy perspective of alcohol to my kids. I feel pretty confident that I have a very healthy perspective on alcohol, despite drinking sporadically. I wouldn't mind if my kids never drank, or if they drank in the manner I do. I'd prefer they avoid going down the part where addictive pathways are made. If anyone has any thoughts on that, I'd be appreciate to hear it. I realize on a thread like this, it's doubtful that I would find anyone who's alcohol experiences mirrored mine, but I've found that's true not just on these kinds of threads but in general.
I'm like you-- I drink rarely but enjoy it when I do.
Both of my parents are adult children of alcoholics-- generations of alcoholics-- and were terrified of alcohol. But I married into a family of Eastern European Lutherans who kept all manner of firewater on hand in staggering quantity, but really never drank excessively. I learned moderate drinking from them.
I think being exposed to moderate drinkers who are conscious enough of the potential for addiction to know the value of an occasional drying-out period is useful. For instance, all the Lutheran in-laws (now out-laws) gave up alcohol for Lent.
This was my hypothesis and probably what I'm going to try to instill in my kids. Again, I've been around people who have been raised that any alcohol is terrible. It works sometimes - usually if there's direct trauma related to it. On the other side, if there's no trauma and no evidence that things will go bad (usually the second generation after trauma), I've seen people become abusers after being out from under their parents' care. I had parents who pretty much did as I do. Didn't see anything wrong with drinking if they liked the taste and didn't get drunk. I turned out not being fascinated by or afraid of alcohol - just saw it as something that was there like anything else. It seemed to work.
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I've followed this thread with interest. Alcohol is something that has always been interesting for me. I was raised in an area where many people are alcohol free for religious reasons, and I was an exception. I was raised that alcohol was no big deal as long as you didn't get intoxicated. For whatever reason, I internalized that message really well. I've drank rarely throughout my adult life - sometimes a couple of drinks one night and maybe not another drink for 3-6 months. I've never been intoxicated - rarely ever drunk to the point where I felt the effects, never remotely had a hangover. I am completely fine without it - have no compulsion to have it, and because I've purchased a decent amount of alcohol but very rarely drink, I have a house with quite a bit of alcohol that, in this time period, for example, I haven't drank any of in probably 4-5 months. So, I'm solidly sure it's not a compulsion. I do enjoy the taste of alcohol - especially scotch and certain beers. I very, very rarely drink if there's not someone over at my house who likes scotch or I'm out with a friend who likes some specific beers.
The thread comments on here are interesting, because it seems I am an anomaly. I see comments of people who have stopped drinking and trying it again don't like it. That's not me because it could be 6 months to a year before I drink, but when I do, I do enjoy it.
Overall, my biggest interest, other than theoretical to learn new perspectives, is how to communicate a healthy perspective of alcohol to my kids. I feel pretty confident that I have a very healthy perspective on alcohol, despite drinking sporadically. I wouldn't mind if my kids never drank, or if they drank in the manner I do. I'd prefer they avoid going down the part where addictive pathways are made. If anyone has any thoughts on that, I'd be appreciate to hear it. I realize on a thread like this, it's doubtful that I would find anyone who's alcohol experiences mirrored mine, but I've found that's true not just on these kinds of threads but in general.
It is possible to acquire a taste for just about anything, so it's not that your case is an exception to a rule, it's just extremely rare that someone will drink enough to acquire a taste without drinking enough to get addicted.
For those of us who quite and can't stand the taste, it wouldn't take much to re-acquire the taste for it.
There are a lot of things that objectively taste bad that you can condition yourself to like. I mean, if I found out that blue cheese was terrible for me and a known powerful carcinogen, I would probably pretty easily lose my taste for that as well. So how you feel about a super strong taste will influence how your brain perceives it as well.
But there's no question, alcohol tastes objectively like gasoline. Whether someone likes it or not, that's the taste.
That's so interesting! I truly must be an anomaly then. I am not aware of ever acquiring a taste for alcohol. I have known whether or not I like things immediately upon drinking. I've probably had maybe the equivalent of 30-40 glasses of beer spread out over many years. Some I immediately knew was terrible - usually tasted like acidic water rather than gasoline. In fact, I've never tasted any alcohol that made me think of gasoline. On the other hand, I've tasted beers that I liked immediately - usually special-made ones rather than large scale manufactured ones. I also immediately liked hard apple cider when I drank it. I immediately liked scotch when I drank it - some types, and some I immediately disliked. I don't think I've ever acquired the taste for any alcohol.
Anyways, your part about most people developing addictive pathways while they acquire a taste for it makes sense. I've only drank out of enjoyment. i"ve also always metered myself where if the thought ever popped into my head anything to the effect of "Man after today, I could use a drink," (even if it was mostly in jest) I've made sure I didn't drink that day because the intoxicating effect of it was never the goal, and I wanted to make sure it never turned into a coping mechanism.
It's extremely typical that when teens first start drinking alcohol that they need to drown out the horrid taste with sugary mixers until they get used to choking down the gasoline taste.
Booze companies invented ultra sugary drinks specifically to target people who hadn't yet acquired the taste: namely women and youth.
I'm sure there are rare, rare exceptions of people who immediately are okay with the taste gasoline, but it's very well documented that the taste of alcohol needs to be drowned out in order for neophyte drinkers to tolerate it.
Makes sense. Most people do use mixers, after all, and it makes perfect sense that companies would try to get as many people to like their products as possible. I suppose the parts I liked in the beers I liked - the hops and different flavors added could be considered sweeteners like you're describing to. The only thing I drink straight that definitely doesn't fit into this is scotch. I really enjoy it oftentimes to see how much I can taste of the different flavors in it.
All that being said, I also don't have the most sensitive sense of taste, so maybe that thas something to do with it. Perhaps I would taste gasoline if I had more refined taste buds.
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Makes sense. Most people do use mixers, after all, and it makes perfect sense that companies would try to get as many people to like their products as possible. I suppose the parts I liked in the beers I liked - the hops and different flavors added could be considered sweeteners like you're describing to. The only thing I drink straight that definitely doesn't fit into this is scotch. I really enjoy it oftentimes to see how much I can taste of the different flavors in it.
All that being said, I also don't have the most sensitive sense of taste, so maybe that thas something to do with it. Perhaps I would taste gasoline if I had more refined taste buds.
My working theory is that people who immediately don't mind the taste of alcohol don't have the best sense of smell.
People who think they don't taste all that well generally taste just fine, the tongue doesn't actually taste all that much. But flavour comes from sense of smell, and people who can't smell very well tend to depend more on actual taste than the rest of us, and ethanol is fairly sweet, but it smells godawful...until you acquire a taste for it, of course.
Alcohol and mixers have an odd relationship with one another though, as mixers blunt the smell and burn of alcohol, but alcohol blunts the smell of mixers.
A glass of orange juice smells much stronger than a glass of orange juice and vodka, and with a blunted smell, alcohol can therefore make mixers taste more sweet/sour because the main source of their complex flavours gets blunted.
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I could definitely tell when I was getting out of the habit because alcohol started smelling *disgusting*. I still liked the smell of the beer my husband brewed but even that smelt bad once it was being processed by the body and started coming out the pores.
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I could definitely tell when I was getting out of the habit because alcohol started smelling *disgusting*. I still liked the smell of the beer my husband brewed but even that smelt bad once it was being processed by the body and started coming out the pores.
So true.
DH drinks one pint every now and then with his friend, and the smell coming off of him about an hour afterwards smells rancid.
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Makes sense. Most people do use mixers, after all, and it makes perfect sense that companies would try to get as many people to like their products as possible. I suppose the parts I liked in the beers I liked - the hops and different flavors added could be considered sweeteners like you're describing to. The only thing I drink straight that definitely doesn't fit into this is scotch. I really enjoy it oftentimes to see how much I can taste of the different flavors in it.
All that being said, I also don't have the most sensitive sense of taste, so maybe that thas something to do with it. Perhaps I would taste gasoline if I had more refined taste buds.
My working theory is that people who immediately don't mind the taste of alcohol don't have the best sense of smell.
People who think they don't taste all that well generally taste just fine, the tongue doesn't actually taste all that much. But flavour comes from sense of smell, and people who can't smell very well tend to depend more on actual taste than the rest of us, and ethanol is fairly sweet, but it smells godawful...until you acquire a taste for it, of course.
Alcohol and mixers have an odd relationship with one another though, as mixers blunt the smell and burn of alcohol, but alcohol blunts the smell of mixers.
A glass of orange juice smells much stronger than a glass of orange juice and vodka, and with a blunted smell, alcohol can therefore make mixers taste more sweet/sour because the main source of their complex flavours gets blunted.
Interesting on the counteracting result of their smells.
Add me as a data point for your theory. My sense of smell is worse than my sense of taste. I've never understood why people say alcohol, in general, tastes bad. I mean, some of it does for sure - various light beers come to mind easily.
I guess overall, I'm living an ignorant, smell-deprived life, and it allows me to enjoy the taste of certain alcohols and beers.
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I guess overall, I'm living an ignorant, smell-deprived life, and it allows me to enjoy the taste of certain alcohols and beers.
Ha! :) @Wolfpack Mustachian
I am starting small by committing to 5 days without alcohol. Will assess from there. We have developed a fairly regular daily drink habit and I've noticed more headaches/fogginess in the morning so would like to quell that (and also help my energy improve)
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Hello, my name is Steeze. I’m an alcoholic.
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Congrats to all the sober people here!
Coming up on 1-year sober on 09/06/21
I believe this is only the 2nd 1-year sober celebration I have had since I started boozing in high school, and the only one that wasn't court ordered. Let's hope this sticks! Cheers to all!
2 years sober!
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@Steeze --fabulous!! Congratulations :)
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Steele, that’s awesome!! I hit 2 years a month ago.
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Steele, that’s awesome!! I hit 2 years a month ago.
Thank you!! Congrats to you as well.
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Makes sense. Most people do use mixers, after all, and it makes perfect sense that companies would try to get as many people to like their products as possible. I suppose the parts I liked in the beers I liked - the hops and different flavors added could be considered sweeteners like you're describing to. The only thing I drink straight that definitely doesn't fit into this is scotch. I really enjoy it oftentimes to see how much I can taste of the different flavors in it.
All that being said, I also don't have the most sensitive sense of taste, so maybe that thas something to do with it. Perhaps I would taste gasoline if I had more refined taste buds.
My working theory is that people who immediately don't mind the taste of alcohol don't have the best sense of smell.
People who think they don't taste all that well generally taste just fine, the tongue doesn't actually taste all that much. But flavour comes from sense of smell, and people who can't smell very well tend to depend more on actual taste than the rest of us, and ethanol is fairly sweet, but it smells godawful...until you acquire a taste for it, of course.
Alcohol and mixers have an odd relationship with one another though, as mixers blunt the smell and burn of alcohol, but alcohol blunts the smell of mixers.
A glass of orange juice smells much stronger than a glass of orange juice and vodka, and with a blunted smell, alcohol can therefore make mixers taste more sweet/sour because the main source of their complex flavours gets blunted.
Interesting on the counteracting result of their smells.
Add me as a data point for your theory. My sense of smell is worse than my sense of taste. I've never understood why people say alcohol, in general, tastes bad. I mean, some of it does for sure - various light beers come to mind easily.
I guess overall, I'm living an ignorant, smell-deprived life, and it allows me to enjoy the taste of certain alcohols and beers.
Tastes vary quite a bit. I let my son have a sip of my Guinness when he was about 5 or 6 and he loved it. I remember trying some that my dad was drinking when I was about his age and thought it was awful/bitter/disgusting.
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Makes sense. Most people do use mixers, after all, and it makes perfect sense that companies would try to get as many people to like their products as possible. I suppose the parts I liked in the beers I liked - the hops and different flavors added could be considered sweeteners like you're describing to. The only thing I drink straight that definitely doesn't fit into this is scotch. I really enjoy it oftentimes to see how much I can taste of the different flavors in it.
All that being said, I also don't have the most sensitive sense of taste, so maybe that thas something to do with it. Perhaps I would taste gasoline if I had more refined taste buds.
My working theory is that people who immediately don't mind the taste of alcohol don't have the best sense of smell.
People who think they don't taste all that well generally taste just fine, the tongue doesn't actually taste all that much. But flavour comes from sense of smell, and people who can't smell very well tend to depend more on actual taste than the rest of us, and ethanol is fairly sweet, but it smells godawful...until you acquire a taste for it, of course.
Alcohol and mixers have an odd relationship with one another though, as mixers blunt the smell and burn of alcohol, but alcohol blunts the smell of mixers.
A glass of orange juice smells much stronger than a glass of orange juice and vodka, and with a blunted smell, alcohol can therefore make mixers taste more sweet/sour because the main source of their complex flavours gets blunted.
Interesting on the counteracting result of their smells.
Add me as a data point for your theory. My sense of smell is worse than my sense of taste. I've never understood why people say alcohol, in general, tastes bad. I mean, some of it does for sure - various light beers come to mind easily.
I guess overall, I'm living an ignorant, smell-deprived life, and it allows me to enjoy the taste of certain alcohols and beers.
Tastes vary quite a bit. I let my son have a sip of my Guinness when he was about 5 or 6 and he loved it. I remember trying some that my dad was drinking when I was about his age and thought it was awful/bitter/disgusting.
My son was like that-- at age 2, grabbed his dad's beer, took a sip, and seemed to enjoy it and took another sip before we got it away from him. But at that age, he was down to try absolutely any food (and quite a lot of things that aren't food!). He once ate several spoonfuls of chili paste before we could stop him. But he's more selective now.
I think some people are so sensory-seeking that even "bad" tastes are interesting to them.
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More ammo for all the fellow vain "quitters": I saw a photo of myself from 2006 and I looked terrible, puffy face and 25 pounds heavier than my normal weight. I was 39 yo but looked way older. I was an every day drinker at this point and was really developing a problem with alcohol; namely, that I couldn't regulate (aka STOP).
I quit cold turkey in 2009, had one drink in January 2010 that led to hitting my former every day consumption levels one week later, after being dry for three months. I quit for good after that week.
I will never drink again and life is great.
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More ammo for all the fellow vain "quitters": I saw a photo of myself from 2006 and I looked terrible, puffy face and 25 pounds heavier than my normal weight. I was 39 yo but looked way older. I was an every day drinker at this point and was really developing a problem with alcohol; namely, that I couldn't regulate (aka STOP).
I quit cold turkey in 2009, had one drink in January 2010 that led to hitting my former every day consumption levels one week later, after being dry for three months. I quit for good after that week.
I will never drink again and life is great.
I saw the same effect on my husband, comparing his photos from his drinking days a few years ago to photos from his alcohol-free present. His face and body are much leaner and his skin looks better. He was attractive then, but even more so now.
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I am starting small by committing to 5 days without alcohol. Will assess from there. We have developed a fairly regular daily drink habit and I've noticed more headaches/fogginess in the morning so would like to quell that (and also help my energy improve)
It's been 4 nights without any alcohol. Not a problem so far. Definitely more inclined to have a drink if I'm around others who are drinking but I've been solo this entire time so hasn't been an issue. Will definitely keep it up over the weekend as my SO doesn't come home until Tuesday so might be a nice chance to reset and then see how I feel moving forward.
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I am starting small by committing to 5 days without alcohol. Will assess from there. We have developed a fairly regular daily drink habit and I've noticed more headaches/fogginess in the morning so would like to quell that (and also help my energy improve)
It's been 4 nights without any alcohol. Not a problem so far. Definitely more inclined to have a drink if I'm around others who are drinking but I've been solo this entire time so hasn't been an issue. Will definitely keep it up over the weekend as my SO doesn't come home until Tuesday so might be a nice chance to reset and then see how I feel moving forward.
Well done!
As I've posted many times, for me the big shift happened when I hit 10 days. No idea why, but at 10 days it was like "how did I not realize how doable this was???"
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I am starting small by committing to 5 days without alcohol. Will assess from there. We have developed a fairly regular daily drink habit and I've noticed more headaches/fogginess in the morning so would like to quell that (and also help my energy improve)
It's been 4 nights without any alcohol. Not a problem so far. Definitely more inclined to have a drink if I'm around others who are drinking but I've been solo this entire time so hasn't been an issue. Will definitely keep it up over the weekend as my SO doesn't come home until Tuesday so might be a nice chance to reset and then see how I feel moving forward.
Well done!
As I've posted many times, for me the big shift happened when I hit 10 days. No idea why, but at 10 days it was like "how did I not realize how doable this was???"
If I remember correctly, around 10 days is the last of the alcohol clearing your system, and there’s neuron regrow that bursts at 30 and 180 days, which is when a lot of relapse happen but if you get through them it’s easier to keep on going. After a year, the health risks are basically back to the same as non-drinkers and at two years brain functions are back to baseline too.
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I am starting small by committing to 5 days without alcohol. Will assess from there. We have developed a fairly regular daily drink habit and I've noticed more headaches/fogginess in the morning so would like to quell that (and also help my energy improve)
It's been 4 nights without any alcohol. Not a problem so far. Definitely more inclined to have a drink if I'm around others who are drinking but I've been solo this entire time so hasn't been an issue. Will definitely keep it up over the weekend as my SO doesn't come home until Tuesday so might be a nice chance to reset and then see how I feel moving forward.
Well done!
As I've posted many times, for me the big shift happened when I hit 10 days. No idea why, but at 10 days it was like "how did I not realize how doable this was???"
If I remember correctly, around 10 days is the last of the alcohol clearing your system, and there’s neuron regrow that bursts at 30 and 180 days, which is when a lot of relapse happen but if you get through them it’s easier to keep on going. After a year, the health risks are basically back to the same as non-drinkers and at two years brain functions are back to baseline too.
Yep, that's about the rough timeline as far as I've read, and definitely aligns with my experience.
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Same experience here. First 2 weeks were a real bitch in terms of cravings and anxiety and I also had trouble falling asleep the first week or 10 days. Then things got notably easier. I got a huge mood boost around 30 days, but got regular triggered thoughts, brief cravings for the first couple years; now they are rare. (It's been about 3 and half years since I quit the daily 'couple glasses of wine' type drinking).
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Thanks for the encouragement. So far so good. I have a few more days before my hubby is home and then he’s only home for one night then gone again for three so I’m going to keep up the experiment.
I have some homemade ‘shrubs’ (herb & spices are steeped in honey/apple cider vinegar then strained, the juice can be sweet and bitter at the same time) which I add to fizzy water. Really satisfies the craving for something refreshing :)
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How's everyone doing? Any thoughts regarding the upcoming holiday season?
I have been alcohol free for roughly 2.5 years or so. I stopped for a few reasons. I felt that drinking was becoming a regular occurrence and I didn't like that. I didn't like the disruption in my sleep. And, I knew it was a negative factor in regards to my physical goals. It helped that my social circle is comprised mainly of non drinkers so I didn't experience any pressure in that regard.
Lately, I have been thinking of trying some non-alcoholic beers, just to add some variety of flavors, in an easy to consume manner. I just drink water, sparkling water, tea and coffee now. Though every once in great while I will come across a mocktail at a restaurant that sounds intriguing enough to order.
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How's everyone doing? Any thoughts regarding the upcoming holiday season?
I have been alcohol free for roughly 2.5 years or so. I stopped for a few reasons. I felt that drinking was becoming a regular occurrence and I didn't like that. I didn't like the disruption in my sleep. And, I knew it was a negative factor in regards to my physical goals. It helped that my social circle is comprised mainly of non drinkers so I didn't experience any pressure in that regard.
Lately, I have been thinking of trying some non-alcoholic beers, just to add some variety of flavors, in an easy to consume manner. I just drink water, sparkling water, tea and coffee now. Though every once in great while I will come across a mocktail at a restaurant that sounds intriguing enough to order.
I've had only a handful of drinks in the past year and a half. Just had a fancy dinner out to celebrate Samhain/Halloween on a short getaway with my husband. Had one glass of wine (restaurant pour, so probably a bit more than 1 serving). And I got so drunk off that one glass! OMG, my tolerance has fallen SO much, and while the initial buzz was pleasant, the drunk lingered for hours and it made me useless for the rest of the night. Then of course I was super dehydrated and mildly headachy when I woke up the next morning (just in time to do a 7 mile hike LOL).
My main takeaway is that I really have to be careful of any intake at all on an empty stomach anymore; and also, HOW DID I DO THIS TO MYSELF EVERY DAY FOR DECADES? Like, how did I not register how much this was affecting my energy level and my hydration and so on back then? It's crazy what I thought was 'normal' feeling, versus what I now realize is actually 'normal' feeling. Ugh.
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I love NA beer by athletic brewing company. They are delicious and running wild is my favorite. When I went to Ireland I decided I needed to try a Irish beer and had a similar experience to WS.
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I love NA beer by athletic brewing company. They are delicious and running wild is my favorite. When I went to Ireland I decided I needed to try a Irish beer and had a similar experience to WS.
Athletic Brewing is the BEST. And I say this as someone who was never even that into beer.
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Does anyone have any specific de-alcoholized wine recommendations?
My grocery store had Fre Merlot. While the smell is pretty close to correct, the taste was a little too close to cranberry juice past its sell-by date for me to re-purchase.
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Well, I've been booze free for five months now. I was never a heavy drinker (maybe a gin and tonic once a week or so), so giving it up wasn't any sort of hardship. I can report not feeling any different than when I was drinking. The weights I lift are all around the same numbers and the distance I ride on my bike is the same.
My suspicion is that at the levels I usually drink there really isn't any impact on my life being a regular drinker or a teetotaler.
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I just hit 9 years sober.
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How's everyone doing? Any thoughts regarding the upcoming holiday season?
I have been alcohol free for roughly 2.5 years or so. I stopped for a few reasons. I felt that drinking was becoming a regular occurrence and I didn't like that. I didn't like the disruption in my sleep. And, I knew it was a negative factor in regards to my physical goals. It helped that my social circle is comprised mainly of non drinkers so I didn't experience any pressure in that regard.
Lately, I have been thinking of trying some non-alcoholic beers, just to add some variety of flavors, in an easy to consume manner. I just drink water, sparkling water, tea and coffee now. Though every once in great while I will come across a mocktail at a restaurant that sounds intriguing enough to order.
I'm now 33 days AF and grateful for this thread.
Rivendale, I stopped for the same reasons as you -- I really started hating the sleep disruption, the frequency of drinking (which felt increasingly unhealthy in a way I couldn't exactly articulate), and it has been a negative for my physical goals, too; the empty calories inhibit weight loss, and I also find post-workout recovery is much worse when I've been drinking.
My biggest challenge is that my social circle consists of several heavy drinkers. Not sure how that's going to play out yet, but DH and I are trying to branch out and make some new friends who don't care much about alcohol. We recently joined a running group, and I love the fact that it meets every week and everyone is super chatty, but alcohol is not a part of it at all.
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Well, I've been booze free for five months now. I was never a heavy drinker (maybe a gin and tonic once a week or so), so giving it up wasn't any sort of hardship. I can report not feeling any different than when I was drinking. The weights I lift are all around the same numbers and the distance I ride on my bike is the same.
My suspicion is that at the levels I usually drink there really isn't any impact on my life being a regular drinker or a teetotaler.
Yeah, a drink a week isn't likely to have any notable impact on your well being, so I would be shocked if you felt any difference unless a single drink substantially impacted your sleep that one night each week, which is plausible, but obviously not your reality.
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Does anyone have any specific de-alcoholized wine recommendations?
My grocery store had Fre Merlot. While the smell is pretty close to correct, the taste was a little too close to cranberry juice past its sell-by date for me to re-purchase.
Unfortunately the process of dealcoholizing the wine strips it of most of its flavour, so none of it will ever taste like wine. I'm not sure why they can do it for beer and not wine, although I know there are multiple ways to dealcoholize things, so perhaps it's in the technique uses.
However, I just tried a wine alternative called Proxies, and it was AWESOME! They kind of mimic the complex flavour of wine with wine grapes, coffee, herbs, etc. It in no way tastes like wine, but it is definitely a nice, complex beverage for slow, deliberate sipping.
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I just hit 9 years sober.
CONGRATS! I'm creeping up on 3 years.
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I just hit 9 years sober.
CONGRATS! I'm creeping up on 3 years.
Thanks :).
Also congrats on getting to nearly 3 years. IME, the first 2 years were by far the hardest, and every year got easier and easier after that. So, hopefully you have something similar, where the hardest days are behind you already.
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I just hit 9 years sober.
CONGRATS! I'm creeping up on 3 years.
Thanks :).
Also congrats on getting to nearly 3 years. IME, the first 2 years were by far the hardest, and every year got easier and easier after that. So, hopefully you have something similar, where the hardest days are behind you already.
For sure. I think we were talking earlier about how at the 2 years mark there's really a shift. I know there was for me, I went from someone who quit drinking to someone who just doesn't drink.
Like I can't even connect anymore to the past reality of craving wine every evening. Totally foreign concept.
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I just hit 9 years sober.
CONGRATS! I'm creeping up on 3 years.
Thanks :).
Also congrats on getting to nearly 3 years. IME, the first 2 years were by far the hardest, and every year got easier and easier after that. So, hopefully you have something similar, where the hardest days are behind you already.
For sure. I think we were talking earlier about how at the 2 years mark there's really a shift. I know there was for me, I went from someone who quit drinking to someone who just doesn't drink.
Like I can't even connect anymore to the past reality of craving wine every evening. Totally foreign concept.
High-fives @Tyson!
I've passed 5 years and yeah, around the two year mark my relationship to drinking changed to just Not A Thing anymore. It was a real paradigm shift.
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Congrats @Tyson! Big accomplishment.
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Thanks all! It's funny, I didn't realize it was 9 years, I thought it was 7, but when I went and looked back at my jail/court time it said 2013 and I thought "hell, that's 9 years ago.". Felt pretty good, honestly.
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Thanks all! It's funny, I didn't realize it was 9 years, I thought it was 7, but when I went and looked back at my jail/court time it said 2013 and I thought "hell, that's 9 years ago.". Felt pretty good, honestly.
I feel like a lot of people kind of lost 2 years with the pandemic. I've noted a number of people referring to things as being a certain number of years ago and being short by 2.
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Well, I've been booze free for five months now. I was never a heavy drinker (maybe a gin and tonic once a week or so), so giving it up wasn't any sort of hardship. I can report not feeling any different than when I was drinking. The weights I lift are all around the same numbers and the distance I ride on my bike is the same.
My suspicion is that at the levels I usually drink there really isn't any impact on my life being a regular drinker or a teetotaler.
Yeah, a drink a week isn't likely to have any notable impact on your well being, so I would be shocked if you felt any difference unless a single drink substantially impacted your sleep that one night each week, which is plausible, but obviously not your reality.
It really makes me wonder if addiction is more closely tied to behavioural habits or genetic predispositions. It is a real struggle for me to give up sugary things (chocolate, cookies, cake, donuts, candy). I've rarely been able to last more than a couple weeks with none at all. Infinitely harder than kicking booze - and I do actually feel better when kicking sugar. :P
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How's everyone doing? Any thoughts regarding the upcoming holiday season?
I have been alcohol free for roughly 2.5 years or so. I stopped for a few reasons. I felt that drinking was becoming a regular occurrence and I didn't like that. I didn't like the disruption in my sleep. And, I knew it was a negative factor in regards to my physical goals. It helped that my social circle is comprised mainly of non drinkers so I didn't experience any pressure in that regard.
Lately, I have been thinking of trying some non-alcoholic beers, just to add some variety of flavors, in an easy to consume manner. I just drink water, sparkling water, tea and coffee now. Though every once in great while I will come across a mocktail at a restaurant that sounds intriguing enough to order.
I'm now 33 days AF and grateful for this thread.
Rivendale, I stopped for the same reasons as you -- I really started hating the sleep disruption, the frequency of drinking (which felt increasingly unhealthy in a way I couldn't exactly articulate), and it has been a negative for my physical goals, too; the empty calories inhibit weight loss, and I also find post-workout recovery is much worse when I've been drinking.
My biggest challenge is that my social circle consists of several heavy drinkers. Not sure how that's going to play out yet, but DH and I are trying to branch out and make some new friends who don't care much about alcohol. We recently joined a running group, and I love the fact that it meets every week and everyone is super chatty, but alcohol is not a part of it at all.
I had been pulling back over the past year and then stopped about a month ago. I'm not sure if it's renewed energy from not drinking, but I've had some new interesting non-boozers enter my life. OTOH I've had a few issues with my drinking buddies not wanting to hang anymore. Frankly if they can't figure out how to have fun with me without alcohol then losing those friendships is a sacrifice I'm comfortable making. I've also had a few dears friend dramatically affected by alcohol recently so that's galvanizing my attitude.
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Well, I've been booze free for five months now. I was never a heavy drinker (maybe a gin and tonic once a week or so), so giving it up wasn't any sort of hardship. I can report not feeling any different than when I was drinking. The weights I lift are all around the same numbers and the distance I ride on my bike is the same.
My suspicion is that at the levels I usually drink there really isn't any impact on my life being a regular drinker or a teetotaler.
Yeah, a drink a week isn't likely to have any notable impact on your well being, so I would be shocked if you felt any difference unless a single drink substantially impacted your sleep that one night each week, which is plausible, but obviously not your reality.
It really makes me wonder if addiction is more closely tied to behavioural habits or genetic predispositions. It is a real struggle for me to give up sugary things (chocolate, cookies, cake, donuts, candy). I've rarely been able to last more than a couple weeks with none at all. Infinitely harder than kicking booze - and I do actually feel better when kicking sugar. :P
It's both (based on reading several books and taking a short academic course in the neurophysiology of addiction). Sugar/fat combos work on many of the same neurotransmitter receptors as booze and all the other things classified as addictive (all the drugs including weed and alcohol, sugar/fat, sex/porn, gaming/gambling, shopping, internet, etc etc.). Professionals class these all as potentially addictive b/c they trigger the same mechanisms, first neurophysiological, which overstimulates the brain to create neurological feedback loops that in turn support 'habits' as we colloquially call them (in reality, habits are behaviors that are mostly managed by the nucleus accumbens, which is a primitive part of the brain that deals in many of the automatic feedback loops that lead to behaviors that bypass the prefrontal cortex/critical thinking center of the brain).
That's why people in the grip of these strong habits/addictions often feel as if there is 'someone else' indulging the addiction. It's literally mostly handled by a different part of the brain from the one that is thinking: "This is not a good idea for my long term health."
However, while the population as a whole is generally at risk for problematic dependence on addictive substances and behaviors with repeated exposure (bc that's just how human brains work) the particular risk profile for each individual around each particular substance/activity can vary a lot based on genetics, social context, early exposure, frequency of exposure, and which behavior or substance is in question. But there does seem to be a segment of the population that are genetically super-strong responders when it comes to artificial neurotransmitter response...this is the group with a lot of crossover in problematic addictions (they struggle to control multiple of these things, or they quit one thing only to substitute another thing). Those kind of cases, it's very tough to stay away from these things entirely b/c modern life simply serves them up constantly on a platter, offering endless opportunities for brain hijack.
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Well, I've been booze free for five months now. I was never a heavy drinker (maybe a gin and tonic once a week or so), so giving it up wasn't any sort of hardship. I can report not feeling any different than when I was drinking. The weights I lift are all around the same numbers and the distance I ride on my bike is the same.
My suspicion is that at the levels I usually drink there really isn't any impact on my life being a regular drinker or a teetotaler.
Yeah, a drink a week isn't likely to have any notable impact on your well being, so I would be shocked if you felt any difference unless a single drink substantially impacted your sleep that one night each week, which is plausible, but obviously not your reality.
It really makes me wonder if addiction is more closely tied to behavioural habits or genetic predispositions. It is a real struggle for me to give up sugary things (chocolate, cookies, cake, donuts, candy). I've rarely been able to last more than a couple weeks with none at all. Infinitely harder than kicking booze - and I do actually feel better when kicking sugar. :P
If you were never a regular drinker I wouldn't expect you to struggle to give it up. Drug addiction is complex, but it's pretty dose dependent. Even weekend cocaine users often don't struggle to drop the habit.
With alcohol, people usually get into a regular habit socially and then the dose/regularity rate is enough to develop addiction.
Some people are more susceptible to addiction, possibly more susceptible to specific addictions, but overall, we just don't expect addiction from low levels of exposure.
One drink a week barely counts as alcohol exposure.
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How's everyone doing? Any thoughts regarding the upcoming holiday season?
I have been alcohol free for roughly 2.5 years or so. I stopped for a few reasons. I felt that drinking was becoming a regular occurrence and I didn't like that. I didn't like the disruption in my sleep. And, I knew it was a negative factor in regards to my physical goals. It helped that my social circle is comprised mainly of non drinkers so I didn't experience any pressure in that regard.
Lately, I have been thinking of trying some non-alcoholic beers, just to add some variety of flavors, in an easy to consume manner. I just drink water, sparkling water, tea and coffee now. Though every once in great while I will come across a mocktail at a restaurant that sounds intriguing enough to order.
I'm now 33 days AF and grateful for this thread.
Rivendale, I stopped for the same reasons as you -- I really started hating the sleep disruption, the frequency of drinking (which felt increasingly unhealthy in a way I couldn't exactly articulate), and it has been a negative for my physical goals, too; the empty calories inhibit weight loss, and I also find post-workout recovery is much worse when I've been drinking.
My biggest challenge is that my social circle consists of several heavy drinkers. Not sure how that's going to play out yet, but DH and I are trying to branch out and make some new friends who don't care much about alcohol. We recently joined a running group, and I love the fact that it meets every week and everyone is super chatty, but alcohol is not a part of it at all.
Echo these exact sentiments - I'm 40 now and while I have been drinking far less than in my 20's, it seems that even a "moderate" night of 3 alcohol units in an evening would leave me feeling less than amazing the next day. Multiply this by on average 3 nights per week (because it seems like there is always some reason to drink!) I felt like I was always either drinking or recovering and knew deep down this wasn't the pattern I wanted for my long term health.
My husband and I have just started 6 weeks alcohol free. It sounds like nothing, but we've attempted this about a half dozen times over the past few years and always caved after a couple weeks with a "screw this, life is more fun with beer" attitude. Only on day 3 now, ha, so we will see how this time around goes.
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I'm 48 days into the 30-day Alcohol Experiment. I'm grateful to this thread which I've followed for awhile, especially for pointing me in the direction of the Annie Grace website.
Coincidentally, we bumped into a wonderful alternative to red wine. It's a traditional Jamaican beverage made from brewed hibiscus. I laughed when I saw on the label "Tastes better than wine," but damn if they aren't telling the truth! I had a case shipped to me from Brooklyn. They also have some great mocktail recipes on their website. I highly recommend!
https://brooklynbrewedsorrel.com/
I will add that my preferred red was Cabernet. I would describe the Sorrel as rich, complex, and not too sweet.
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How's everyone doing? Any thoughts regarding the upcoming holiday season?
I have been alcohol free for roughly 2.5 years or so. I stopped for a few reasons. I felt that drinking was becoming a regular occurrence and I didn't like that. I didn't like the disruption in my sleep. And, I knew it was a negative factor in regards to my physical goals. It helped that my social circle is comprised mainly of non drinkers so I didn't experience any pressure in that regard.
Lately, I have been thinking of trying some non-alcoholic beers, just to add some variety of flavors, in an easy to consume manner. I just drink water, sparkling water, tea and coffee now. Though every once in great while I will come across a mocktail at a restaurant that sounds intriguing enough to order.
I'm now 33 days AF and grateful for this thread.
Rivendale, I stopped for the same reasons as you -- I really started hating the sleep disruption, the frequency of drinking (which felt increasingly unhealthy in a way I couldn't exactly articulate), and it has been a negative for my physical goals, too; the empty calories inhibit weight loss, and I also find post-workout recovery is much worse when I've been drinking.
My biggest challenge is that my social circle consists of several heavy drinkers. Not sure how that's going to play out yet, but DH and I are trying to branch out and make some new friends who don't care much about alcohol. We recently joined a running group, and I love the fact that it meets every week and everyone is super chatty, but alcohol is not a part of it at all.
Echo these exact sentiments - I'm 40 now and while I have been drinking far less than in my 20's, it seems that even a "moderate" night of 3 alcohol units in an evening would leave me feeling less than amazing the next day. Multiply this by on average 3 nights per week (because it seems like there is always some reason to drink!) I felt like I was always either drinking or recovering and knew deep down this wasn't the pattern I wanted for my long term health.
My husband and I have just started 6 weeks alcohol free. It sounds like nothing, but we've attempted this about a half dozen times over the past few years and always caved after a couple weeks with a "screw this, life is more fun with beer" attitude. Only on day 3 now, ha, so we will see how this time around goes.
There's a whole relearning process of how to reframe "fun" and "celebration" without drinking.
It takes time, and your brain will seriously gaslight you along the way to convince you that not drinking means the death of joy and fun and really, you deserve to have joy and fun, so why would you deprive yourself, right?
If you stick with it long enough though, that starts sounding insane.
What I now am able to perceive is that my brain was making fun stuff *less* fun unless I would give in and drink. For example, a dry wedding was just unbearable.
It's not that the alcohol made it fun, it's that I felt like I couldn't unlock that fun without alcohol. Now that I am a non-drinker (as opposed to being a drinker who is in the quitting process but still feels like a drinker) I don't need alcohol to unlock "fun mode" anymore. I have the exact same experience of getting hyped up at events, celebrating things, and chilling with a cool beverage on a patio in the summer, which all used to require alcohol to tap into.
Alcohol doesn't make these things more fun, it just throttles your ability to enjoy them unless you drink a specific kind of beverage.
Which really does kind of sound insane when you're not addicted to it.
And don't downplay 6 weeks. It's a lot easier to hit 2, 3, and 9 years once you've gotten to 6 weeks than it is to hit 6 weeks in the first place.
I would happily tackle the next 20 years than ever have to do the first 10 days ever again.
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I'm 48 days into the 30-day Alcohol Experiment. I'm grateful to this thread which I've followed for awhile, especially for pointing me in the direction of the Annie Grace website.
Coincidentally, we bumped into a wonderful alternative to red wine. It's a traditional Jamaican beverage made from brewed hibiscus. I laughed when I saw on the label "Tastes better than wine," but damn if they aren't telling the truth! I had a case shipped to me from Brooklyn. They also have some great mocktail recipes on their website. I highly recommend!
https://brooklynbrewedsorrel.com/
I will add that my preferred red was Cabernet. I would describe the Sorrel as rich, complex, and not too sweet.
Thanks for the recommendation! I’m always looking for booze free fancy drinks. I gave up drinking about 6 years ago don’t miss it at all
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40 days in! After consuming some form of alcohol 4-5 night a week for over a decade. It was not particularly hard, wondering if it was more of a bad habbit than an addiction at this point.
Not sure I want to abstain indefinitely, but so far it's a fun experiment and I don't have a goal im mind.
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40 days in! After consuming some form of alcohol 4-5 night a week for over a decade. It was not particularly hard, wondering if it was more of a bad habbit than an addiction at this point.
Not sure I want to abstain indefinitely, but so far it's a fun experiment and I don't have a goal im mind.
People's reactions and relationship with alcohol are incredibly varied. Communities like AA like to make generalizations, but they aren't supported by anything.
There really is just a radical range of experiences.
I was recently in a debate with an AAer who insisted that because I was able to quit one day and never look back that I couldn't ever have possibly had a *real* addiction.
So yeah, there are people like you who drank regularly and don't have any struggles giving it up. Maybe you weren't at all addicted, it's very possible.
I know people who did cocaine almost every night of working in a bar and then just gave it up like it was nothing when they left the bar scene.
People are varied.
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That's an interesting observation about the drugs and location.
Don't recall where, but there was an interesting article I read about an phenomenon where soldiers had a very hard time beating addiction during Vietnam while they were overseas, and when they came back home, it was almost like they never tried the drug in the first place. After some analysis, it turned out that getting away from the environment that surrounded the person during their use made a bigger impact than any other factor in recovery.
Not sure if alcohol is the same, but the social pressure to drink is real and some of my former drinking friends have openly questioned our choice and have tried to peer pressure us into caving. I don't fault them for it, since the choice was very personal and they have no idea that it's not some "dry month" type thing where stakes are low for caving.
My habit was getting worse, before Covid I always felt a little weird grabbing a beer or two before dinner on a weeknight. When Covid was in full blown panic mode, everyone and their grandma started drinking or increased their alcohol consumption drastically, for many of us that increased consumption stuck around and it became much easier to just grab a beverage to deal with stress, anxiety, social situations that normally weren't based on or sometimes even involved drinking.
The biggest eye opener was when Andrew Huberman released this episode "What Alcohol Does to Your Body, Brain & Health | Huberman Lab Podcast #86" (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DkS1pkKpILY)
I knew drinking wasn't great for my health, but holy shit did that two hours completely change how I viewed alcohol.
Now if I have a beer or three in the future, I'm making an informed decision to poison myself for the temporary high. It's crazy how many negatives there are, it simply made me not want to drink......maybe it was so eye opening that addiction vs. habit has nothing to do with it.
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That's an interesting observation about the drugs and location.
Don't recall where, but there was an interesting article I read about an phenomenon where soldiers had a very hard time beating addiction during Vietnam while they were overseas, and when they came back home, it was almost like they never tried the drug in the first place. After some analysis, it turned out that getting away from the environment that surrounded the person during their use made a bigger impact than any other factor in recovery.
Not sure if alcohol is the same, but the social pressure to drink is real and some of my former drinking friends have openly questioned our choice and have tried to peer pressure us into caving. I don't fault them for it, since the choice was very personal and they have no idea that it's not some "dry month" type thing where stakes are low for caving.
My habit was getting worse, before Covid I always felt a little weird grabbing a beer or two before dinner on a weeknight. When Covid was in full blown panic mode, everyone and their grandma started drinking or increased their alcohol consumption drastically, for many of us that increased consumption stuck around and it became much easier to just grab a beverage to deal with stress, anxiety, social situations that normally weren't based on or sometimes even involved drinking.
The biggest eye opener was when Andrew Huberman released this episode "What Alcohol Does to Your Body, Brain & Health | Huberman Lab Podcast #86" (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DkS1pkKpILY)
I knew drinking wasn't great for my health, but holy shit did that two hours completely change how I viewed alcohol.
Now if I have a beer or three in the future, I'm making an informed decision to poison myself for the temporary high. It's crazy how many negatives there are, it simply made me not want to drink......maybe it was so eye opening that addiction vs. habit has nothing to do with it.
I agree, that episode of Huberman was excellent and firmed up my intuition - alcohol has no health benefits at all and is poison at every consumption level.
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That's an interesting observation about the drugs and location.
Don't recall where, but there was an interesting article I read about an phenomenon where soldiers had a very hard time beating addiction during Vietnam while they were overseas, and when they came back home, it was almost like they never tried the drug in the first place. After some analysis, it turned out that getting away from the environment that surrounded the person during their use made a bigger impact than any other factor in recovery.
Not sure if alcohol is the same, but the social pressure to drink is real and some of my former drinking friends have openly questioned our choice and have tried to peer pressure us into caving. I don't fault them for it, since the choice was very personal and they have no idea that it's not some "dry month" type thing where stakes are low for caving.
My habit was getting worse, before Covid I always felt a little weird grabbing a beer or two before dinner on a weeknight. When Covid was in full blown panic mode, everyone and their grandma started drinking or increased their alcohol consumption drastically, for many of us that increased consumption stuck around and it became much easier to just grab a beverage to deal with stress, anxiety, social situations that normally weren't based on or sometimes even involved drinking.
The biggest eye opener was when Andrew Huberman released this episode "What Alcohol Does to Your Body, Brain & Health | Huberman Lab Podcast #86" (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DkS1pkKpILY)
I knew drinking wasn't great for my health, but holy shit did that two hours completely change how I viewed alcohol.
Now if I have a beer or three in the future, I'm making an informed decision to poison myself for the temporary high. It's crazy how many negatives there are, it simply made me not want to drink......maybe it was so eye opening that addiction vs. habit has nothing to do with it.
Location is *extremely* important when it comes to drugs.
The brain modulates the effect of a drug on you very aggressively. Opioid addicts are well known to often overdose when they take their usual dose in a new location.
Tolerance is very context specific. That's why I had a fairly high tolerance for red wine, especially for my favourites, but even low doses of hard liquor would fuck me up.
If you change anything about the habitual use of a substance, it changes the way it is processed in your body.
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Well, I've been booze free for five months now. I was never a heavy drinker (maybe a gin and tonic once a week or so), so giving it up wasn't any sort of hardship. I can report not feeling any different than when I was drinking. The weights I lift are all around the same numbers and the distance I ride on my bike is the same.
My suspicion is that at the levels I usually drink there really isn't any impact on my life being a regular drinker or a teetotaler.
Yeah, a drink a week isn't likely to have any notable impact on your well being, so I would be shocked if you felt any difference unless a single drink substantially impacted your sleep that one night each week, which is plausible, but obviously not your reality.
I'm always thinking of this topic in terms of how to teach my kids. What would you/anyone/the research say would be a drinking level that would have notable impact to the point of being a problem?
As mentioned before, my levels (a drink or two at one time maybe every 3 months or so) is, to me at least, clearly not a problem. I'm curious, though, what is an approximate threshold...or, is it too specific to the individual to say at all.
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@Wolfpack Mustachian, if you have/plan to give the Huberman episode a listen he goes into amounts/frequency a bit.
Probably varies individual to individual, as some of the impacts can have negative effects even with sporadic but regular drinking. For example, if someone averages <1 alcoholic unit per day, but has 2-3 units, 2-3 times per week, the resulting disruption to sleep, gut microbiome, etc etc is not insignificant. 2-3 units, 4 times a year? Probably a lot less likely to have long term negative impacts.
In my experience, moderation can be a slippery slope. Not specific to alcohol, but I've often found myself "gaming" my own systems. This is such a fascinating area of human behavior, psychology, and even physiology.
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@Wolfpack Mustachian, if you have/plan to give the Huberman episode a listen he goes into amounts/frequency a bit.
Probably varies individual to individual, as some of the impacts can have negative effects even with sporadic but regular drinking. For example, if someone averages <1 alcoholic unit per day, but has 2-3 units, 2-3 times per week, the resulting disruption to sleep, gut microbiome, etc etc is not insignificant. 2-3 units, 4 times a year? Probably a lot less likely to have long term negative impacts.
In my experience, moderation can be a slippery slope. Not specific to alcohol, but I've often found myself "gaming" my own systems. This is such a fascinating area of human behavior, psychology, and even physiology.
Thank you for the advice! It really is, and it's very interesting from an intersection of behavior, psychology, predisposition, etc.. I would say that I very much have an addictive personality. I can see it from sugars, as Guitarstv said and other things. That being said, I've never had a problem with this with alcohol, and I can't notice anything where it really affects my health negatively when I drink unless it's two drinks with a high alcohol content very close together.
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I did have Fre champagne maybe 1.5 years ago and I loved it at the time. It did cost a fortune though.
I used to Love the athletic brew upside dawn, taste like a beer to me, very high quality. These days I barely drink non alcoholic beer due to my diet, and I worry that it was a crutch.
There was an IPA called well-being and they come in 16 ounce cans 4 pack. From Missouri I think, anyway 100 calories but taste like a foamy, bitter, yeasty, ipa. No alcohol.
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Well, I've been booze free for five months now. I was never a heavy drinker (maybe a gin and tonic once a week or so), so giving it up wasn't any sort of hardship. I can report not feeling any different than when I was drinking. The weights I lift are all around the same numbers and the distance I ride on my bike is the same.
My suspicion is that at the levels I usually drink there really isn't any impact on my life being a regular drinker or a teetotaler.
Yeah, a drink a week isn't likely to have any notable impact on your well being, so I would be shocked if you felt any difference unless a single drink substantially impacted your sleep that one night each week, which is plausible, but obviously not your reality.
I'm always thinking of this topic in terms of how to teach my kids. What would you/anyone/the research say would be a drinking level that would have notable impact to the point of being a problem?
As mentioned before, my levels (a drink or two at one time maybe every 3 months or so) is, to me at least, clearly not a problem. I'm curious, though, what is an approximate threshold...or, is it too specific to the individual to say at all.
There is no safe level of alcohol consumption.
People should choose to consume it with that awareness. I would focus on teaching kids that society will tell them over and over that alcohol is safe and normal, but that it really isn't.
If they want to consume it, that's their choice, but to know that there is no "safe" level even if everyone acts like there is.
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Well, I've been booze free for five months now. I was never a heavy drinker (maybe a gin and tonic once a week or so), so giving it up wasn't any sort of hardship. I can report not feeling any different than when I was drinking. The weights I lift are all around the same numbers and the distance I ride on my bike is the same.
My suspicion is that at the levels I usually drink there really isn't any impact on my life being a regular drinker or a teetotaler.
Yeah, a drink a week isn't likely to have any notable impact on your well being, so I would be shocked if you felt any difference unless a single drink substantially impacted your sleep that one night each week, which is plausible, but obviously not your reality.
I'm always thinking of this topic in terms of how to teach my kids. What would you/anyone/the research say would be a drinking level that would have notable impact to the point of being a problem?
As mentioned before, my levels (a drink or two at one time maybe every 3 months or so) is, to me at least, clearly not a problem. I'm curious, though, what is an approximate threshold...or, is it too specific to the individual to say at all.
There is no safe level of alcohol consumption.
People should choose to consume it with that awareness. I would focus on teaching kids that society will tell them over and over that alcohol is safe and normal, but that it really isn't.
If they want to consume it, that's their choice, but to know that there is no "safe" level even if everyone acts like there is.
This is also the conclusion I came to.
When I took the short academic course on the neurophysiology of addiction, it was super eye opening to discover that neurophysiologists have a 'pyramid' of substances/stimuli where they divide them into different classes in terms of their parameters that affect their potential for addictiveness.
There were 5 or 6 levels to the pyramid. Nicotine and opioids were classed as most addictive. Alcohol was in the second tier, but notably along with amphetamines and crack/cocaine.
And yet society actively encourages and celebrates alcohol use. Which is pretty insane, knowing what I know now.
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PTF
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Well, I've been booze free for five months now. I was never a heavy drinker (maybe a gin and tonic once a week or so), so giving it up wasn't any sort of hardship. I can report not feeling any different than when I was drinking. The weights I lift are all around the same numbers and the distance I ride on my bike is the same.
My suspicion is that at the levels I usually drink there really isn't any impact on my life being a regular drinker or a teetotaler.
Yeah, a drink a week isn't likely to have any notable impact on your well being, so I would be shocked if you felt any difference unless a single drink substantially impacted your sleep that one night each week, which is plausible, but obviously not your reality.
I'm always thinking of this topic in terms of how to teach my kids. What would you/anyone/the research say would be a drinking level that would have notable impact to the point of being a problem?
As mentioned before, my levels (a drink or two at one time maybe every 3 months or so) is, to me at least, clearly not a problem. I'm curious, though, what is an approximate threshold...or, is it too specific to the individual to say at all.
There is no safe level of alcohol consumption.
People should choose to consume it with that awareness. I would focus on teaching kids that society will tell them over and over that alcohol is safe and normal, but that it really isn't.
If they want to consume it, that's their choice, but to know that there is no "safe" level even if everyone acts like there is.
This is also the conclusion I came to.
When I took the short academic course on the neurophysiology of addiction, it was super eye opening to discover that neurophysiologists have a 'pyramid' of substances/stimuli where they divide them into different classes in terms of their parameters that affect their potential for addictiveness.
There were 5 or 6 levels to the pyramid. Nicotine and opioids were classed as most addictive. Alcohol was in the second tier, but notably along with amphetamines and crack/cocaine.
And yet society actively encourages and celebrates alcohol use. Which is pretty insane, knowing what I know now.
Yep, my most recent neuroscience textbook was pretty brutally harsh on the cultural acceptance of alcohol and essentially said there's no justifiable reason to separate alcohol from cocaine or meth.
I've done an enormous amount of learning about cocaine addiction after living with an addict, and in reading about both alcohol and cocaine addiction, I have to say, I really don't perceive an appreciable difference either.
And yet most parents would die before letting their teen have a bump on a special occasion, but many won't blink at letting them have a little glass of wine, despite it also being illegal.
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Well, I've been booze free for five months now. I was never a heavy drinker (maybe a gin and tonic once a week or so), so giving it up wasn't any sort of hardship. I can report not feeling any different than when I was drinking. The weights I lift are all around the same numbers and the distance I ride on my bike is the same.
My suspicion is that at the levels I usually drink there really isn't any impact on my life being a regular drinker or a teetotaler.
Yeah, a drink a week isn't likely to have any notable impact on your well being, so I would be shocked if you felt any difference unless a single drink substantially impacted your sleep that one night each week, which is plausible, but obviously not your reality.
I'm always thinking of this topic in terms of how to teach my kids. What would you/anyone/the research say would be a drinking level that would have notable impact to the point of being a problem?
As mentioned before, my levels (a drink or two at one time maybe every 3 months or so) is, to me at least, clearly not a problem. I'm curious, though, what is an approximate threshold...or, is it too specific to the individual to say at all.
There is no safe level of alcohol consumption.
People should choose to consume it with that awareness. I would focus on teaching kids that society will tell them over and over that alcohol is safe and normal, but that it really isn't.
If they want to consume it, that's their choice, but to know that there is no "safe" level even if everyone acts like there is.
Very interesting way of framing it. I'm considering it overall, but it is also, of course, framed within my upbringing and experiences. I was brought up to see alcohol consumption in moderation was not a problem - and I truly mean in moderation, none of my family or people I was close to were ever drunk that I can remember, not even once but were not teetotalers. All of that was set within a framework of an overall society I was raised in where a high percentage of people had religious beliefs that they took seriously that any alcohol at all was morally indefensible and a very, very big deal. I grew up feeling strongly against that perspective because I had first hand experience that the universal condemnation of alcohol as supremely dangerous simply wasn't true.
All that to be said, I struggle internally about it. I know that I would be much more strongly against my kids ever smoking a cigarette than taking a drink of alcohol, but perhaps that is a perspective not proved out by the data. All in all, the perspective of acknowledging that no alcohol is safe is probably a good start. That being said, I would also feel hypocritical saying that while still drinking, even occasionally and in small amounts. Anyways, thanks for listening to me ramble :-).
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Well, I've been booze free for five months now. I was never a heavy drinker (maybe a gin and tonic once a week or so), so giving it up wasn't any sort of hardship. I can report not feeling any different than when I was drinking. The weights I lift are all around the same numbers and the distance I ride on my bike is the same.
My suspicion is that at the levels I usually drink there really isn't any impact on my life being a regular drinker or a teetotaler.
Yeah, a drink a week isn't likely to have any notable impact on your well being, so I would be shocked if you felt any difference unless a single drink substantially impacted your sleep that one night each week, which is plausible, but obviously not your reality.
I'm always thinking of this topic in terms of how to teach my kids. What would you/anyone/the research say would be a drinking level that would have notable impact to the point of being a problem?
As mentioned before, my levels (a drink or two at one time maybe every 3 months or so) is, to me at least, clearly not a problem. I'm curious, though, what is an approximate threshold...or, is it too specific to the individual to say at all.
There is no safe level of alcohol consumption.
People should choose to consume it with that awareness. I would focus on teaching kids that society will tell them over and over that alcohol is safe and normal, but that it really isn't.
If they want to consume it, that's their choice, but to know that there is no "safe" level even if everyone acts like there is.
Very interesting way of framing it. I'm considering it overall, but it is also, of course, framed within my upbringing and experiences. I was brought up to see alcohol consumption in moderation was not a problem - and I truly mean in moderation, none of my family or people I was close to were ever drunk that I can remember, not even once but were not teetotalers. All of that was set within a framework of an overall society I was raised in where a high percentage of people had religious beliefs that they took seriously that any alcohol at all was morally indefensible and a very, very big deal. I grew up feeling strongly against that perspective because I had first hand experience that the universal condemnation of alcohol as supremely dangerous simply wasn't true.
All that to be said, I struggle internally about it. I know that I would be much more strongly against my kids ever smoking a cigarette than taking a drink of alcohol, but perhaps that is a perspective not proved out by the data. All in all, the perspective of acknowledging that no alcohol is safe is probably a good start. That being said, I would also feel hypocritical saying that while still drinking, even occasionally and in small amounts. Anyways, thanks for listening to me ramble :-).
Everything that I've ever read indicates that smoking is much worse for your body than drinking, so I think it makes more sense that you would be more strongly against your kids smoking. There might not be a safe level of alcohol consumption, but there's a bit of a gap between 'not safe' and 'dangerous'.
You probably do plenty of things that are not safe, but are fine in moderation:
- feeling the sun on your skin without chemical sunblock
- eating chocolate cake
- listening to loud music
- staying up late at night because you're interested in something
There is a certain balance that you need to determine is right for you between the danger of an activity and the pleasure you derive from it.
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Well, I've been booze free for five months now. I was never a heavy drinker (maybe a gin and tonic once a week or so), so giving it up wasn't any sort of hardship. I can report not feeling any different than when I was drinking. The weights I lift are all around the same numbers and the distance I ride on my bike is the same.
My suspicion is that at the levels I usually drink there really isn't any impact on my life being a regular drinker or a teetotaler.
Yeah, a drink a week isn't likely to have any notable impact on your well being, so I would be shocked if you felt any difference unless a single drink substantially impacted your sleep that one night each week, which is plausible, but obviously not your reality.
I'm always thinking of this topic in terms of how to teach my kids. What would you/anyone/the research say would be a drinking level that would have notable impact to the point of being a problem?
As mentioned before, my levels (a drink or two at one time maybe every 3 months or so) is, to me at least, clearly not a problem. I'm curious, though, what is an approximate threshold...or, is it too specific to the individual to say at all.
There is no safe level of alcohol consumption.
People should choose to consume it with that awareness. I would focus on teaching kids that society will tell them over and over that alcohol is safe and normal, but that it really isn't.
If they want to consume it, that's their choice, but to know that there is no "safe" level even if everyone acts like there is.
Very interesting way of framing it. I'm considering it overall, but it is also, of course, framed within my upbringing and experiences. I was brought up to see alcohol consumption in moderation was not a problem - and I truly mean in moderation, none of my family or people I was close to were ever drunk that I can remember, not even once but were not teetotalers. All of that was set within a framework of an overall society I was raised in where a high percentage of people had religious beliefs that they took seriously that any alcohol at all was morally indefensible and a very, very big deal. I grew up feeling strongly against that perspective because I had first hand experience that the universal condemnation of alcohol as supremely dangerous simply wasn't true.
All that to be said, I struggle internally about it. I know that I would be much more strongly against my kids ever smoking a cigarette than taking a drink of alcohol, but perhaps that is a perspective not proved out by the data. All in all, the perspective of acknowledging that no alcohol is safe is probably a good start. That being said, I would also feel hypocritical saying that while still drinking, even occasionally and in small amounts. Anyways, thanks for listening to me ramble :-).
The point is not that you should tell them never to drink, the point is that you should honestly inform them that regardless of what social messaging they get, that it's not benign.
Many things aren't benign. That doesn't mean they all need to be subjected to strict prohibition.
Here's my best advice when it comes to kids: don't aim to control their behaviour, just give them the tools to be able to make the best decisions for themselves.
Society is going to hammer into them that vaping and drinking are cool, it's your job to illuminate them to the scam. The same way it's your job to illuminate them to the scam of consumerism.
It's not like there's some limit to the wisdom you can share with your kids.
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In since 2005.
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Thanks Malcat and GuitarStv for the advice!
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In since 2005.
Nice! Thanks for sharing.
I am checking in to note that I am more than 18 months in, and still very happy. Have now been through many holidays, birthdays, anniversaries, work travel, concerts, dinners out, vacations.... Everything is better this way. Moreover, I just get so much done -- working, cooking, exercising, spending quality time with friends and family. I feel like I have found this amazing life hack! One of the biggest surprises continues to be how little other people care, even in my rather boozy circle of friends and acquaintances.
Though I did have a sip of alcohol on two occasions, with different results. While staying at a small B&B in another country, the owner took all the guests out for the day and at the end hosted us in the garden. He passed out shots of some homemade alcohol. I just drank it for politeness/camaraderie. It was gross, I felt gross afterwards, and nothing was triggered. However, I have never liked hard alcohol that much so I'm not too surprised.
In contrast, I went on a wine tour where they drove us to a pretty lookout point on a vineyard for a tasting. I had been on several other wine tours/events previously, and simple didn't drink anything and enjoyed the company/scenery. Before I could decline, the guide poured a taster. I took a sip and there was definitely a split second of 'Oh wouldn't it be nice to just drink this all afternoon and sit and watch the sunset.' Then I was like, 'Nah, I have better things to do with my life' and didn't have any more. This was interesting and informative, that the pathway still existed.
I think if this happened again, I would remind myself the guide and my group don't really care what I do, and just not have any. Maybe it would have been better to let the tour know in advance or to bring my own NA drink. And, perhaps I should try a little harder to suggest events that are not alcohol-centered, particularly if they remind me of my past self. Though I'm not totally sure about the last point, as I have taken pride in being able to very comfortably go to beer gardens, wineries, cocktail hour etc. when my social circle wants to do that.
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In since 2005.
Nice! Thanks for sharing.
I am checking in to note that I am more than 18 months in, and still very happy. Have now been through many holidays, birthdays, anniversaries, work travel, concerts, dinners out, vacations.... Everything is better this way. Moreover, I just get so much done -- working, cooking, exercising, spending quality time with friends and family. I feel like I have found this amazing life hack! One of the biggest surprises continues to be how little other people care, even in my rather boozy circle of friends and acquaintances.
Though I did have a sip of alcohol on two occasions, with different results. While staying at a small B&B in another country, the owner took all the guests out for the day and at the end hosted us in the garden. He passed out shots of some homemade alcohol. I just drank it for politeness/camaraderie. It was gross, I felt gross afterwards, and nothing was triggered. However, I have never liked hard alcohol that much so I'm not too surprised.
In contrast, I went on a wine tour where they drove us to a pretty lookout point on a vineyard for a tasting. I had been on several other wine tours/events previously, and simple didn't drink anything and enjoyed the company/scenery. Before I could decline, the guide poured a taster. I took a sip and there was definitely a split second of 'Oh wouldn't it be nice to just drink this all afternoon and sit and watch the sunset.' Then I was like, 'Nah, I have better things to do with my life' and didn't have any more. This was interesting and informative, that the pathway still existed.
I think if this happened again, I would remind myself the guide and my group don't really care what I do, and just not have any. Maybe it would have been better to let the tour know in advance or to bring my own NA drink. And, perhaps I should try a little harder to suggest events that are not alcohol-centered, particularly if they remind me of my past self. Though I'm not totally sure about the last point, as I have taken pride in being able to very comfortably go to beer gardens, wineries, cocktail hour etc. when my social circle wants to do that.
I just say a quick and pleasant "no thanks" and that's it, no further discussion needed. I struggled a bit in my first years going to bars and other events where I was in close contact with drinking, but honestly it was more just being annoyed watching people getting drunk than feeling an urge to drink myself. Maybe the realization that I used to be annoying too when I was getting tipsy? I quit in 2010 so it's not an issue anymore, but I don't spend much time with people that drink heavily, and my partner is a very light drinker.
I was just at a bar two weeks ago for a birthday; I ordered tea. Nobody cares.
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Hi everyone. Sober since 2016. Good luck to everyone on their journey!
I'm with Malcat on AA ambivalence. When I tried a few meetings, it felt like a cult. If I wanted a cult I would join up with Scientology. If others had a better experience with AA that's great for them, but don't feel like AA is the only game in town. To me, AA is the Dave Ramsey of addiction recovery: heavy on the religion, light on the science.
I had to experience a real rock-bottom crash before I finally wised up and quit. For those folks seeking help and guidance, there is an REBT based addiction recovery program out on the internet called smartrecovery.org. It was still in chat-room format when I did it (ha!), now it is zoom meetings. I became a big fan of REBT / CBT / Stoicism after I got my sh!t together.
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The upside of me not drinking is my spouse is rarely consuming. And he is loosing weight. If I could leave off a little belly fat would be a bonus. Our household booze spending used to be around 100Can$ a month. It is still around 25$ a month as we do still bring wine when invited for a meal.
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Hi everyone. Sober since 2016. Good luck to everyone on their journey!
I'm with Malcat on AA ambivalence. When I tried a few meetings, it felt like a cult. If I wanted a cult I would join up with Scientology. If others had a better experience with AA that's great for them, but don't feel like AA is the only game in town. To me, AA is the Dave Ramsey of addiction recovery: heavy on the religion, light on the science.
I had to experience a real rock-bottom crash before I finally wised up and quit. For those folks seeking help and guidance, there is an REBT based addiction recovery program out on the internet called smartrecovery.org. It was still in chat-room format when I did it (ha!), now it is zoom meetings. I became a big fan of REBT / CBT / Stoicism after I got my sh!t together.
Yes, using CBT was incredibly helpful for me when I quit my long-term daily drinking habit.
I never got remotely close to a rock-bottom, but the AA thing I think is likely a mixed bag (based on seeing people I know go through it). It is indeed very light on actual science (and seems to have some outright incorrect ideas about addiction that get promulgated), but on the other hand it provides a social outlet and feedback and support, and I appreciate that it pushes a concept of doing for others. The attempt to eradicate ego is a mixed bag, I think, depending on situation and person.
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Hi everyone. Sober since 2016. Good luck to everyone on their journey!
I'm with Malcat on AA ambivalence. When I tried a few meetings, it felt like a cult. If I wanted a cult I would join up with Scientology. If others had a better experience with AA that's great for them, but don't feel like AA is the only game in town. To me, AA is the Dave Ramsey of addiction recovery: heavy on the religion, light on the science.
I had to experience a real rock-bottom crash before I finally wised up and quit. For those folks seeking help and guidance, there is an REBT based addiction recovery program out on the internet called smartrecovery.org. It was still in chat-room format when I did it (ha!), now it is zoom meetings. I became a big fan of REBT / CBT / Stoicism after I got my sh!t together.
Yes, using CBT was incredibly helpful for me when I quit my long-term daily drinking habit.
I never got remotely close to a rock-bottom, but the AA thing I think is likely a mixed bag (based on seeing people I know go through it). It is indeed very light on actual science (and seems to have some outright incorrect ideas about addiction that get promulgated), but on the other hand it provides a social outlet and feedback and support, and I appreciate that it pushes a concept of doing for others. The attempt to eradicate ego is a mixed bag, I think, depending on situation and person.
A more current, science based version of AA is called Lifering. It's the group I go to.
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Hi everyone. Sober since 2016. Good luck to everyone on their journey!
I'm with Malcat on AA ambivalence. When I tried a few meetings, it felt like a cult. If I wanted a cult I would join up with Scientology. If others had a better experience with AA that's great for them, but don't feel like AA is the only game in town. To me, AA is the Dave Ramsey of addiction recovery: heavy on the religion, light on the science.
I had to experience a real rock-bottom crash before I finally wised up and quit. For those folks seeking help and guidance, there is an REBT based addiction recovery program out on the internet called smartrecovery.org. It was still in chat-room format when I did it (ha!), now it is zoom meetings. I became a big fan of REBT / CBT / Stoicism after I got my sh!t together.
Yes, using CBT was incredibly helpful for me when I quit my long-term daily drinking habit.
I never got remotely close to a rock-bottom, but the AA thing I think is likely a mixed bag (based on seeing people I know go through it). It is indeed very light on actual science (and seems to have some outright incorrect ideas about addiction that get promulgated), but on the other hand it provides a social outlet and feedback and support, and I appreciate that it pushes a concept of doing for others. The attempt to eradicate ego is a mixed bag, I think, depending on situation and person.
A more current, science based version of AA is called Lifering. It's the group I go to.
I think you might be the person who mentioned that several years ago on this thread. I'd never heard of it prior to that, and I've kept a mental note ever since and rec'd it to several people I know.
ETA: I was thinking last night, as I was content and settling in for a pleasant evening at home with tea after a really enjoyable Thanksgiving meal and catch-up with friends, how I never could have imagined a social occasion or a holiday without booze 5 years ago, and I also wouldn't have even had the opportunity for the pleasant evening b/c I would have been asleep long since.
Additionally, I just love Thanksgiving. The modern holiday is a nice distillation of the best parts of holidays. Companionship, mindfulness, thankfulness, contributing to a meal (even if I don't love cooking and don't eat that much), and none of the stupid commercialism.
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I had a nice thanksgiving with friends, I made mock tails and several of us enjoyed that.
It involved diet soda, so some people would not touch it. I really enjoyed the party, alcohol probably would have added nothing to the experience.
I do tend to think of the non drinkers as the boring crowd, but we are just boring appearing to others who can not fathom an evening out without drinking, and actually may be missing out on some great life experiences. After the party I was able to drive home safely, watch some football, hang with my dogs, and enjoy the entire day instead of passing out when I got home.
I hope by next summer I can have a great time going out dancing at a nightclub without alcohol,
If I can navigate that without feeling that I am missing out, then I will have navigated every possible situation without alcohol and learn To enjoy it.
I am grateful for the extra energy and living that I get to do because I am not addicted to alcohol anymore.
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Today marks two months being AF.
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Today marks two months being AF.
Nice going. It's a great experiment to go AF during the holiday season, and kind of test your own assumptions about associating drinking with holidays/special occasions/social events.
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I had a nice thanksgiving with friends, I made mock tails and several of us enjoyed that.
It involved diet soda, so some people would not touch it. I really enjoyed the party, alcohol probably would have added nothing to the experience.
I do tend to think of the non drinkers as the boring crowd, but we are just boring appearing to others who can not fathom an evening out without drinking, and actually may be missing out on some great life experiences. After the party I was able to drive home safely, watch some football, hang with my dogs, and enjoy the entire day instead of passing out when I got home.
I hope by next summer I can have a great time going out dancing at a nightclub without alcohol,
If I can navigate that without feeling that I am missing out, then I will have navigated every possible situation without alcohol and learn To enjoy it.
I am grateful for the extra energy and living that I get to do because I am not addicted to alcohol anymore.
Huh, I never considered that I would be thought of as "boring" for not drinking.
I knew my not drinking would likely make some people uncomfortable, and therefore damage their sense of fun drinking, but it literally never occured to me that *I* would be perceived as boring.
My complete disinterest in cannabis on the other hand?? That can get people thinking that I'm an insufferable, upright square.
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I had a nice thanksgiving with friends, I made mock tails and several of us enjoyed that.
It involved diet soda, so some people would not touch it. I really enjoyed the party, alcohol probably would have added nothing to the experience.
I do tend to think of the non drinkers as the boring crowd, but we are just boring appearing to others who can not fathom an evening out without drinking, and actually may be missing out on some great life experiences. After the party I was able to drive home safely, watch some football, hang with my dogs, and enjoy the entire day instead of passing out when I got home.
I hope by next summer I can have a great time going out dancing at a nightclub without alcohol,
If I can navigate that without feeling that I am missing out, then I will have navigated every possible situation without alcohol and learn To enjoy it.
I am grateful for the extra energy and living that I get to do because I am not addicted to alcohol anymore.
Huh, I never considered that I would be thought of as "boring" for not drinking.
I knew my not drinking would likely make some people uncomfortable, and therefore damage their sense of fun drinking, but it literally never occured to me that *I* would be perceived as boring.
My complete disinterest in cannabis on the other hand?? That can get people thinking that I'm an insufferable, upright square.
I could easily give up booze with no real effort or loss.
Not pot though. That stuff is fantastic - no hangover (kinda an anti-hangover actually - I feel more rested and better the next day), no depression, I write good stuff (music and prose) pretty consistently while high, and enjoy music even more than usual.
But while everyone I know drinks on a regular basis, there only one or two people in my life who use cannabis. I'm always afraid to mention it because it still seems to carry stigma - that's why your comment about being seen as a square made me giggle a little.
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I had a nice thanksgiving with friends, I made mock tails and several of us enjoyed that.
It involved diet soda, so some people would not touch it. I really enjoyed the party, alcohol probably would have added nothing to the experience.
I do tend to think of the non drinkers as the boring crowd, but we are just boring appearing to others who can not fathom an evening out without drinking, and actually may be missing out on some great life experiences. After the party I was able to drive home safely, watch some football, hang with my dogs, and enjoy the entire day instead of passing out when I got home.
I hope by next summer I can have a great time going out dancing at a nightclub without alcohol,
If I can navigate that without feeling that I am missing out, then I will have navigated every possible situation without alcohol and learn To enjoy it.
I am grateful for the extra energy and living that I get to do because I am not addicted to alcohol anymore.
Huh, I never considered that I would be thought of as "boring" for not drinking.
I knew my not drinking would likely make some people uncomfortable, and therefore damage their sense of fun drinking, but it literally never occured to me that *I* would be perceived as boring.
My complete disinterest in cannabis on the other hand?? That can get people thinking that I'm an insufferable, upright square.
I could easily give up booze with no real effort or loss.
Not pot though. That stuff is fantastic - no hangover (kinda an anti-hangover actually - I feel more rested and better the next day), no depression, I write good stuff (music and prose) pretty consistently while high, and enjoy music even more than usual.
But while everyone I know drinks on a regular basis, there only one or two people in my life who use cannabis. I'm always afraid to mention it because it still seems to carry stigma - that's why your comment about being seen as a square made me giggle a little.
Really? It always seems like everyone here in Ottawa smokes pot.
I've spent my whole life trying to avoid the shit because I deeply dislike it for myself and really don't like being around stoned people if they're the talky kind. The ones who go off and quietly cook all evening are AWESOME though.
But I've literally never been able to realistically avoid rampant pot use in my social world.
I even held a staff retreat a few years back (before legalization) and my entire staff were on edibles except for the one pregnant woman. I was like "wtf? We're technically working! You're all health professionals and we're paying you!"
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Not pot though. That stuff is fantastic - no hangover (kinda an anti-hangover actually - I feel more rested and better the next day), no depression, I write good stuff (music and prose) pretty consistently while high, and enjoy music even more than usual.
...
Better man than I am, Gunga Din. My stoned music was satiric, though that had not been the intention. My writing was intricate; without quality, with pretense. Mailer commented that pot had given a generation the impression that they were geniuses; so for me. The last time I smoked, it was a wonderful evening in the canyon of the Arkansas, seeing who could dart into the blaze of 200,000 candle-power, lean the closest to approaching train engines and extract the most indignant whistle without getting pulped, the thunder as the engineer shoved the throttle to fifth notch and up-throbbed the diesels to charge the dynamos as he swept out of the chicanes, the hot rush of air thrust off the blunt A units, the stink of lube pumped by the greasers in the canyon, the clicking, the flange-squalling. And it resulted in 2 subsequent months of bronchitis. 2 months, painful hacking and coughing, no running, no biking. Really fun, but not fun enough to counter 2 lung-bound months of misery.
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I figure the approach with pot (and most drugs really - recreational and medicinal) is to determine the minimum amount needed to get the result you want. I don't smoke anything (cannabis tinctures are much easier to precisely dose and don't damage your lungs). 5-7 mcg of THC with about the same CBD seems about right . . . and there's no loss of control, spinning head, or stupid behaviour involved. It's just much easier to focus on a task for three or four hours - be it writing, learning a guitar part, listening to music, whatever. I've never, ever felt sick during or afterwards.
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I had a nice thanksgiving with friends, I made mock tails and several of us enjoyed that.
It involved diet soda, so some people would not touch it. I really enjoyed the party, alcohol probably would have added nothing to the experience.
I do tend to think of the non drinkers as the boring crowd, but we are just boring appearing to others who can not fathom an evening out without drinking, and actually may be missing out on some great life experiences. After the party I was able to drive home safely, watch some football, hang with my dogs, and enjoy the entire day instead of passing out when I got home.
I hope by next summer I can have a great time going out dancing at a nightclub without alcohol,
If I can navigate that without feeling that I am missing out, then I will have navigated every possible situation without alcohol and learn To enjoy it.
I am grateful for the extra energy and living that I get to do because I am not addicted to alcohol anymore.
Huh, I never considered that I would be thought of as "boring" for not drinking.
I knew my not drinking would likely make some people uncomfortable, and therefore damage their sense of fun drinking, but it literally never occured to me that *I* would be perceived as boring.
My complete disinterest in cannabis on the other hand?? That can get people thinking that I'm an insufferable, upright square.
I could easily give up booze with no real effort or loss.
Not pot though. That stuff is fantastic - no hangover (kinda an anti-hangover actually - I feel more rested and better the next day), no depression, I write good stuff (music and prose) pretty consistently while high, and enjoy music even more than usual.
But while everyone I know drinks on a regular basis, there only one or two people in my life who use cannabis. I'm always afraid to mention it because it still seems to carry stigma - that's why your comment about being seen as a square made me giggle a little.
Really? It always seems like everyone here in Ottawa smokes pot.
I've spent my whole life trying to avoid the shit because I deeply dislike it for myself and really don't like being around stoned people if they're the talky kind. The ones who go off and quietly cook all evening are AWESOME though.
But I've literally never been able to realistically avoid rampant pot use in my social world.
I even held a staff retreat a few years back (before legalization) and my entire staff were on edibles except for the one pregnant woman. I was like "wtf? We're technically working! You're all health professionals and we're paying you!"
I gave up pot sometime during my post-secondary studies when I realized that I was only smoking it for stupid reasons (peer pressure, social norms, inertia, media, etc.). It had been a long time since I actually enjoyed the feeling of being high (if I ever did).
I still see and smell it everywhere in Ottawa and I know a lot of people who smoke and/or otherwise consume it. I wouldn’t describe it as rampant but I also haven’t associated it with any sort of stigma in a long time.
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@LightStache I definitely felt increased energy from not drinking. I felt it at 3 weeks 3 months and maybe another burst at 6 or 9 months. That feeling is real. Probably the number one reason I stay off booze is the increased energy I feel.
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In since 2005.
Nice! Thanks for sharing.
I am checking in to note that I am more than 18 months in, and still very happy. Have now been through many holidays, birthdays, anniversaries, work travel, concerts, dinners out, vacations.... Everything is better this way. Moreover, I just get so much done -- working, cooking, exercising, spending quality time with friends and family. I feel like I have found this amazing life hack! One of the biggest surprises continues to be how little other people care, even in my rather boozy circle of friends and acquaintances.
Though I did have a sip of alcohol on two occasions, with different results. While staying at a small B&B in another country, the owner took all the guests out for the day and at the end hosted us in the garden. He passed out shots of some homemade alcohol. I just drank it for politeness/camaraderie. It was gross, I felt gross afterwards, and nothing was triggered. However, I have never liked hard alcohol that much so I'm not too surprised.
In contrast, I went on a wine tour where they drove us to a pretty lookout point on a vineyard for a tasting. I had been on several other wine tours/events previously, and simple didn't drink anything and enjoyed the company/scenery. Before I could decline, the guide poured a taster. I took a sip and there was definitely a split second of 'Oh wouldn't it be nice to just drink this all afternoon and sit and watch the sunset.' Then I was like, 'Nah, I have better things to do with my life' and didn't have any more. This was interesting and informative, that the pathway still existed.
I think if this happened again, I would remind myself the guide and my group don't really care what I do, and just not have any. Maybe it would have been better to let the tour know in advance or to bring my own NA drink. And, perhaps I should try a little harder to suggest events that are not alcohol-centered, particularly if they remind me of my past self. Though I'm not totally sure about the last point, as I have taken pride in being able to very comfortably go to beer gardens, wineries, cocktail hour etc. when my social circle wants to do that.
I don't think I was ever an alcoholic, just didn't feel the need to imbibe anymore. Plus I have lots more time and money to do other things which I enjoy more.
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Happy new year everyone!
I just realized I'm about an hour away from 3 years alcohol free.
I think I already posted earlier about how after year two, I don't even think of myself as "sober" anyone, as in, someone who quit drinking. I just feel like someone who doesn't drink.
My neurologist has me logging a lot of shit in an app every morning, and as I fill in every single morning how my body feels, how I've slept, and how my mood is, I am basically triggered every single morning to appreciate that I don't drink.
The most, MOST precious part of all of this is that I wake up virtually every morning feeling totally at ease. Unless I have a tangible, immediate reason to feel anxious or self critical, I just don't anymore, and when I drank, even very moderately, that was the default way to wake up. I would wake up, feel like I had been hit by a truck, and then feel anxious and awful.
I just thought that's how virtually everyone feels first thing in the morning.
Year 3 has been very pleasant on that front despite throwing some legit stressful shit at me, and many of you know I'm heading into very, very difficult times in a few days. And I am beyond grateful that alcohol is no longer something I turn to in times of stress, because I know it makes them worse.
So I am damn happy to be going into 2023 and year 4 of not drinking so that alcohol can't detract from the emotional and physical strength I'm going to need.
And high fives to everyone considering a Dry January tomorrow. Come on in, the water is sparkling and comes with a lime!
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Congrats on three years, and thank you for your contributions on this topic, Malkynn!
Tomorrow will be my 100th day without imbibing, after nearly two decades of very regular consumption. It feels like one of the best decisions of 2022.
Thanks to everyone who opened up about their own goals, struggles, and experiences with going AF.
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Congrats on three years, and thank you for your contributions on this topic, Malkynn!
Tomorrow will be my 100th day without imbibing, after nearly two decades of very regular consumption. It feels like one of the best decisions of 2022.
Thanks to everyone who opened up about their own goals, struggles, and experiences with going AF.
Ooh, 100 is awesome. I pretty vividly remember 100 because it was very early in the pandemic and I was so grateful to not be drinking my way through it.
I wasn't a super heavy drinker, but I definitely drank way too much when I was on vacations. The "fuck it" feeling of the pandemic combined with me just having lost my whole career at the same time could have easily driven me into a whole lot of "fuck it" drinking.
I read about so many people who graduated from regular drinking to serious problem drinking during the pandemic and I just kept thinking that I could have easily been one of them.
Congrats on 100. It's one of the big ones, and what a wicked awesome gift to give yourself in 2023. You're starting the year off knowing that if you can do 100, you can do the entirety of 2023 if you want to.
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I made it through the holidays without a drink! That was a milestone for me. In 2021, I had quit drinking *except* for the last two weeks of the year, so I did have an alcohol-induced holiday season. I had been planning the same, more or less, for 2022, and had allowed myself to drink during a summer vacation. Thoughts on this thread led me to decide to do a full 2 years alcohol-free before revisiting the question of whether I wanted to drink again. So in August, I decided to commit to that. And thereby had an AF holiday period. I had some cravings but was overall so much better off in abstaining. Cheers to all of you AF posters!
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I made it through the holidays without a drink! That was a milestone for me. In 2021, I had quit drinking *except* for the last two weeks of the year, so I did have an alcohol-induced holiday season. I had been planning the same, more or less, for 2022, and had allowed myself to drink during a summer vacation. Thoughts on this thread led me to decide to do a full 2 years alcohol-free before revisiting the question of whether I wanted to drink again. So in August, I decided to commit to that. And thereby had an AF holiday period. I had some cravings but was overall so much better off in abstaining. Cheers to all of you AF posters!
This is awesome!!!
Also what a great goal. My goal was to get to a point where if I ever chose to drink, it wouldn't be in response to a craving.
I've solidly learned to differentiate between legitimately wanting something because it has a tangible benefit for me and a craving something.
I learned this with caffeine first. I quit coffee shortly after quitting alcohol. It was the pandemic and I was retired. I had no reason to force myself to have artificial energy. If I was tired, I just rested.
Quitting coffee was mind blowing, and in the short term, way more intense than quitting alcohol; but I drank a lot more coffee than I did alcohol, so that makes sense.
But coffee cravings disappeared pretty quickly. After a few months I had none. However, I'm very aware when I actively, consciously want some caffeine. I might feel lethargic and want a boost because I'm in the mood to be more alert or I have something to do.
It's not exciting at all, it doesn't feel very satisfying, it's like taking an acid reducer if I have reflux, or eating a crappy protein bar because I'm hungry and it's what's available. I proactively want it, it does the job reasonably well, but there's zero excitement, because it's just not objectively that great.
Cravings make consumption exciting and very, very satisfying.
Looking back, it now feels weird and uncomfortable to remember how excited I would get about my daytime coffee and evening wine. Like, who gets that jazzed over beverages that both cause heartburn and fuck with my sleep??
I'm back to having caffeine every morning because my MD wanted to put me on narcotic stimulants for narcolepsy-ish symptoms and I was like "uh, no, I'll try some tea first, thanks ya frickin' pusher" and the tea has been sufficient. I need an addiction to narcotic stimulants like I need a bullet in the head. Fuuuck.
But I don't "love" the tea the way I LOVED the morning coffee, or the way I LOOOOOOVED the evening wine. That was downright fetishistic, and that's the kind of blissed-out response that cravings create when the brain gets it's fix.
It's one of the great ironies of life that finding something extremely satisfying is a strong indicator that you may have a pathological relationship with it.
Now that I can so clearly identify cravings, I'm very, very careful which ones I reinforce by giving in to them. If it's something u I really healthy, like getting out in nature, then I lean in whole heartedly into the craving and satisfaction. But if the craving is for something that can cause harm??? I now give it a serious side eye.
It's that old overdone wolf parable. You strengthen the wolf you feed. You strengthen whatever cravings you give in to.
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Oh, I like that as an approach, Malcat, that if you ever choose to drink, it's not in response to a craving. I'm planning on doing my 2 years alcohol free and only then thinking about a new goal. But that's one to keep in mind for when the time comes. Or maybe I'll then decide to just stay alcohol free because it's simpler and I just don't have to give it any thought. To be determined...in like, a year and a half.
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I made it through the holidays without a drink! That was a milestone for me. In 2021, I had quit drinking *except* for the last two weeks of the year, so I did have an alcohol-induced holiday season. I had been planning the same, more or less, for 2022, and had allowed myself to drink during a summer vacation. Thoughts on this thread led me to decide to do a full 2 years alcohol-free before revisiting the question of whether I wanted to drink again. So in August, I decided to commit to that. And thereby had an AF holiday period. I had some cravings but was overall so much better off in abstaining. Cheers to all of you AF posters!
Good job getting through the holidays.
I remember when I quit I set goals as well, the first was to not drink for a set amount of time. But when that tine passed, and I did have a drink (after a particular incident related to the impending explosion of my marriage), within a week I was drinking similar amounts to before I quit, which was not at all the reset I was looking for.
So I quit again (quitting is easy! ;-) but this time with no goal except one: I wasn't going to drink that day.
And the next day I had the same goal.
I would get asked by friends and family what my goals were, how long was I going to abstain, would I really quit "FOREVER"?
I never really answered the question directly, I just said "I don't know, but for right now, I'm not drinking".
I knew in my heart that I should never drink again but instead of confronting that scary (to me, at that time) proposition I just put it off to a proverbial "someday".
Now, nearly thirteen years sober, I really don't think about alcohol at all. It truly does not interest me.
The positive changes in my life from this decision are just taken for granted, a sure sign that it was the right decision.
But people have different experiences with alcohol. My partner, who I have been with for the entire time, can take it or leave it.
She'll have half a glass of wine and just leave it, so I wouldn't say she has a negative relationship with alcohol.
But I sure did, and that revelation was what pushed me to quit entirely. I was never going to have that kind of relationship with alcohol.
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@Dee well done on getting through the holidays - it’s not an easy time given how much alcohol is pushed at this time of the year.
I had some quiet time on my trip and used it to reread Kristi Coulter’s fantastic memoir Nothing Good Can Come From This which I last read in my first year of not drinking. I enjoyed it at the time but really appreciated it now that I have enough distance from the discomfort of identification with the author.
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@Dee well done on getting through the holidays - it’s not an easy time given how much alcohol is pushed at this time of the year.
I had some quiet time on my trip and used it to reread Kristi Coulter’s fantastic memoir Nothing Good Can Come From This which I last read in my first year of not drinking. I enjoyed it at the time but really appreciated it now that I have enough distance from the discomfort of identification with the author.
Oh, I loved reading her stuff. I related so much to her time, attitude, history etc at the time. It felt like looking into the future had I kept on the same path longer.
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I know “I’m late to this party”, but here’s my 2 cents. My 8 years older than me brother died of alcoholism at the age of 46. Gruesome stuff. (He was an attorney and could argue until the cows came home about how he didn’t have a problem.) Though only an occasional drinker, I quit drinking the day of his funeral.
Fast forward to 6 months ago. I went to a doctor to talk about my weight. Long story short, I was diagnosed with mild ADHD, at the age of 64. Medication stopped my random eating patterns. I’m now at goal weight and have a quiet mind.
I now wonder how much my brother’s alcoholism had to do with perhaps a case of ADHD?
Good luck to everyone who is working through any of this.
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Posting to follow and joining in on the discussion. Embarking on a booze free 2023
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I have quietly followed this thread almost since the beginning. In September, I had reason to change my relationship with alcohol, and the recommendations for Annie Grace's Alcohol Experiment website and book were invaluable. I committed to 30 days alcohol free, and I actually went 50 days before deciding to have a glass of chardonnay with a nice seafood dinner in a restaurant. I've gone from someone who had several drinks a week to someone who has a couple of drinks a month or less, and never more than one at a time. It's a definite attitude shift, but I think I'm enjoying my alcohol-free Proxies and Sorrel even more than wine. I've learned that the feeling of "I need a drink" really translates to "I need to do something nice to soothe myself," and a cup of tea or other AF beverage works just fine.
The only downside is $$, which I mention because this is after all the MMM Forum. The better mocktails are quite a bit more expensive than the fairly inexpensive wines that I favored. I still consider it a worthwhile expenditure.
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I have quietly followed this thread almost since the beginning. In September, I had reason to change my relationship with alcohol, and the recommendations for Annie Grace's Alcohol Experiment website and book were invaluable. I committed to 30 days alcohol free, and I actually went 50 days before deciding to have a glass of chardonnay with a nice seafood dinner in a restaurant. I've gone from someone who had several drinks a week to someone who has a couple of drinks a month or less, and never more than one at a time. It's a definite attitude shift, but I think I'm enjoying my alcohol-free Proxies and Sorrel even more than wine. I've learned that the feeling of "I need a drink" really translates to "I need to do something nice to soothe myself," and a cup of tea or other AF beverage works just fine.
The only downside is $$, which I mention because this is after all the MMM Forum. The better mocktails are quite a bit more expensive than the fairly inexpensive wines that I favored. I still consider it a worthwhile expenditure.
I have myself permission to spend whatever I wanted on sobriety for the first two years. Only in year 3 did DH and I start talking about scaling back on the expensive AF drinks.
The health benefits are totally worth the cost of a few years of really expensive juice.
For me, I look back on those 2 years of free-for-all spending on AF drinks as some of the best money I ever spent, because doing the full 2 years and not feeling deprived was key to fully developing a happy AF habit.
If that results in me never spending on alcohol for the rest of my life, then the scales are solidly tipped in my financial favour.
The second half of year 3 got to the point where I no longer need the high quality mocktail to feel satisfied anymore. I still get annoyed at expensive restaurants that have nothing to offer me but children's drinks and water. But otherwise, if I'm out at a casual place and my only option is soda water, I'm chill about it now. That took awhile.
We now buy the cheapest NA beers, we don't go through nearly as many, and we generally only have something as fancy as proxies at the cafe where we first discovered it, so it's more about having a high end date with a fancy beverage rather than the fancy beverage, if that makes sense.
I have zero regrets about spending whatever I needed to to make sobriety not feel like deprivation.
If someone can guarantee you superior health, sleep, mood, easier weight management, and better memory of all of life's special events by buying a few thousand dollars of tasty juice, that's a great deal.
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In the long run I have saved a ton of money being AF. I usually order a AF beer. Plus the other health benefits have been phenomenal as well as the significant weight loss.
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@rosarugosa congratulations on working out what the I need a drink feeling was really saying to you. That’s huge. Mine was generally “I don’t want to be here* and need a reward for putting up with it/numb out the feeling of being trapped”. Like Malcat I let myself order whatever drink or snack that I wanted for the first couple of years and now it’s all tapered off quite naturally.
*where this could be a noisy party or a stressful job or an impending awkward conversation that needed to happen. Life got a lot easier once I started taking care of the underlying issues.
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Yes, I figure this will be a good investment in my wellbeing in the long run. When I quit smoking, I told myself I could chew Nicorette for 38 years if I needed to, whatever it took to stay off the butts, because that was how long I had been a smoker. Fortunately, I only needed to use it for 6 years, and now I feel like I was under an evil spell for all those smoking years, and I have no desire to ever smoke a cigarette again.
I'm having fun with the mocktails for now though. It's also funny to see how my social media newsfeed ads have switched over to all things zero alcohol instead of ads for wine. Mocktails seem to be quite the booming industry.
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Yes, I figure this will be a good investment in my wellbeing in the long run. When I quit smoking, I told myself I could chew Nicorette for 38 years if I needed to, whatever it took to stay off the butts, because that was how long I had been a smoker. Fortunately, I only needed to use it for 6 years, and now I feel like I was under an evil spell for all those smoking years, and I have no desire to ever smoke a cigarette again.
I'm having fun with the mocktails for now though. It's also funny to see how my social media newsfeed ads have switched over to all things zero alcohol instead of ads for wine. Mocktails seem to be quite the booming industry.
Oh yeah, mocktails are everywhere.
I was recently at one of my favourite little pub-ish restaurants, which has been there for decades, so it's not a new business, it has a very established clientele, and they have seven, SEVEN types of AF beers and ciders.
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Our Christmas sucked royally. (Eldest gave us covid on Christmas Eve or Day)
I had three glasses of wine over the whole holiday season - and not even full glasses. Just partial glasses for some toasts with really good wine that DH had been saving for the holiday. I probably would have had a smaller sip if the bottle was being shared with more people. (if we had gone to a party but nope, we stayed home by ourselves for everything after the 24th.)
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I missed it by a few weeks now: over two years AF in mid-December.
There were many opportunities for festive libations, and yet it was easy to simply pass. I had some pushy folks (the guys, and most ironically, my MD friend), but after a few declinations, they moved on to enjoying their own brew.
Alcohol now smells like the chemical toxin it is. Even catching a whiff of some of my formerly favorite liquors left a lingering, odiferous sensation in my nostrils. Like weak isopropyl alcohol...yick.
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@MustachioedPistachio , congratulations on the 2 years! I agree about how bad alcohol smells…
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I know “I’m late to this party”, but here’s my 2 cents. My 8 years older than me brother died of alcoholism at the age of 46. Gruesome stuff. (He was an attorney and could argue until the cows came home about how he didn’t have a problem.) Though only an occasional drinker, I quit drinking the day of his funeral.
Fast forward to 6 months ago. I went to a doctor to talk about my weight. Long story short, I was diagnosed with mild ADHD, at the age of 64. Medication stopped my random eating patterns. I’m now at goal weight and have a quiet mind.
I now wonder how much my brother’s alcoholism had to do with perhaps a case of ADHD?
Good luck to everyone who is working through any of this.
I'm so sorry about your brother. That is truly tragic. I was diagnosed recently with ADHD at age 50 and am now medicated and going through treatment. It's highly hereditary - in my case several very close family members were all diagnosed (or are highly suspected to have had it) at the same time but it's too late for several of them. Substance abuse disorders, eating disorders and other addictions are all very much associated with untreated ADHD and tragically, until recently, there was very little knowledge of girls/women (in particular) with ADHD and ADHD in general.
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Just wrapped up three months AF with a glass of wine at a fancy bar with my parents. I really enjoyed the taste and the experience -- it wouldn't have been the same with a mocktail. But the alcohol itself didn't make me feel good.
I had the wine early afternoon, then I went on a five mile weighted hike from 4p-6p. I was tired at 9p and went to bed, but I was anxious and restless until about midnight. My Garmin watch recorded an unusually high level of stress peaking at 1030p. It's impossible to tell if that was due to the late hike or alcohol, but I suspect the latter to have contributed. So I'll be keeping my drinking very light for awhile longer ... maybe forever.
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Just wrapped up three months AF with a glass of wine at a fancy bar with my parents. I really enjoyed the taste and the experience -- it wouldn't have been the same with a mocktail. But the alcohol itself didn't make me feel good.
I had the wine early afternoon, then I went on a five mile weighted hike from 4p-6p. I was tired at 9p and went to bed, but I was anxious and restless until about midnight. My Garmin watch recorded an unusually high level of stress peaking at 1030p. It's impossible to tell if that was due to the late hike or alcohol, but I suspect the latter to have contributed. So I'll be keeping my drinking very light for awhile longer ... maybe forever.
I'm approaching 2 years AF and one of the contributing factors was my Oura ring data on evenings that I drank, even a little bit. I knew intuitively that I didn't sleep as well but I couldn't ignore it after seeing it so clearly and consistently in the data. I love sleep! Far more I loved that glass of wine. Going AF has been a really positive change for me.
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This popped up on my feed recently about the drinking culture in cycling. Man, the cancer linkage is still mind blowing.
https://www.bicycling.com/health-nutrition/a42259477/cycling-drinking-alcohol-effects/
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Thanks for sharing @mspym, that was a long but good read.
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This popped up on my feed recently about the drinking culture in cycling. Man, the cancer linkage is still mind blowing.
https://www.bicycling.com/health-nutrition/a42259477/cycling-drinking-alcohol-effects/
Great read, thanks!
So here I am. I only started regularly drinking alcohol at 30, and it probably peaked when I was 40, when my retirement and the pandemic coincided. I started reducing my drinking last year after reading several articles like the one above about how no amount of alcohol is good for you. I almost completely stopped drinking at home, and only drank socially. Unfortunately, I haven't really noticed any benefit to this reduction, other than saving money - was hoping it would be reflected in my weight, but no such luck.
I am currently 10 days AF, not really on purpose (I don't have a desire to drink when I'm sad). I would try to continue this streak, but I'm moving in a few weeks and can envision 2-4 situations where I may want to have a drink before I leave town, and I want to allow those to occur if I feel up for it.
My goal is a dry February (or whenever in Jan my last social drink is), and will go from there.
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It's hitting a tipping point folks!
Quitting or reducing alcohol is the new big thing. So for anyone joining this thread, you've picked a great time to cut back.
Note that this article is from the east coast of Canada, a region famous for its drinking culture. So it's a big deal that they're seeing a huge uptick in NA beer demand.
https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/prince-edward-island/drinking-guidelines-brewery-reactions-1.6721372
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@Metalcat , for probably the first time in my life I’m avant-garde!!
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I was thinking of this thread while reading some reactions to the new two drinks per week guidelines in Canada. A lot of people are very upset about them and are comparing it to prohibition, when it's really an acknowledgement that any potential health benefits are overblown, and even small amounts of alcohol have detrimental effects. Nobody is forcing people to cut down their drinking, but this increases the awareness of alcohol as a harmful drug. The more alcohol free options that exist, the more people can keep up the fun parts of alcohol (socializing, enjoying the taste of a beverage) without the hangover and increased risk of disease.
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I was thinking of this thread while reading some reactions to the new two drinks per week guidelines in Canada. A lot of people are very upset about them and are comparing it to prohibition, when it's really an acknowledgement that any potential health benefits are overblown, and even small amounts of alcohol have detrimental effects. Nobody is forcing people to cut down their drinking, but this increases the awareness of alcohol as a harmful drug. The more alcohol free options that exist, the more people can keep up the fun parts of alcohol (socializing, enjoying the taste of a beverage) without the hangover and increased risk of disease.
I know, I laugh at people getting bent out of shape about the guidelines. Guidelines don't dictate anyone's behaviour. The guidelines for flossing are daily, for exercise is 150 minutes per week, and for vegetables is 5-10 servings a day, and people happily go about their lives ignoring those guidelines, so why would anyone think alcohol guidelines are any different?
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Well, I've given up alcohol entirely since the new guidelines came out. So there are a few of us out there . . .
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Well, I've given up alcohol entirely since the new guidelines came out. So there are a few of us out there . . .
That's not my point at all.
People choosing to follow the new guidelines is not the same as the new guidelines being imposed on people. People are still free to ignore them as much as they want to. So comparing them to prohibition is ridiculous.
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Well, I've given up alcohol entirely since the new guidelines came out. So there are a few of us out there . . .
That's not my point at all.
People choosing to follow the new guidelines is not the same as the new guidelines being imposed on people. People are still free to ignore them as much as they want to. So comparing them to prohibition is ridiculous.
I think I may have read some sarcasom in GS's post :-)
Wish I had thought to ask for an NA beer on my last fligth, that would be a real sign of adoption of airlines stocked them.
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Well, I've given up alcohol entirely since the new guidelines came out. So there are a few of us out there . . .
That's not my point at all.
People choosing to follow the new guidelines is not the same as the new guidelines being imposed on people. People are still free to ignore them as much as they want to. So comparing them to prohibition is ridiculous.
I think I may have read some sarcasom in GS's post :-)
Wish I had thought to ask for an NA beer on my last fligth, that would be a real sign of adoption of airlines stocked them.
Possibly, but you never know with GuitarStv, he's simultaneously hilariously sarcastic and one of the most argumentative people here. So it could go either way.
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Well, I've given up alcohol entirely since the new guidelines came out. So there are a few of us out there . . .
That's not my point at all.
People choosing to follow the new guidelines is not the same as the new guidelines being imposed on people. People are still free to ignore them as much as they want to. So comparing them to prohibition is ridiculous.
I think I may have read some sarcasom in GS's post :-)
Wish I had thought to ask for an NA beer on my last fligth, that would be a real sign of adoption of airlines stocked them.
Possibly, but you never know with GuitarStv, he's simultaneously hilariously sarcastic and one of the most argumentative people here. So it could go either way.
Truly, to know him is to love him. Or hate him. :P
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Truly, to know him is to love him. Or hate him. :P
;P
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Jumping from the Dry January thread since I’ve decided to continue to be AF for at least another month. Here’s to Dry February!
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Jumping from the Dry January thread since I’ve decided to continue to be AF for at least another month. Here’s to Dry February!
Welcome! And congrats on getting through Dry January.
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Leaving for Houston tomorrow morning. This is my annual trip back to the US to visit my daughter. February in Eastern Europe is usually a miserable month so I’m really happy to escape and enjoy over 3 weeks of mild temperatures and, hopefully, sunshine 🙂
Daughter rarely drinks so I should be able to avoid temptation of a glass of wine at home. And maybe I’ll try some kind of a mocktail when we go out to eat? I don’t eat out other than when I travel, and I don’t think mocktails are a thing in Poland anyway, so I’ve never had one. Hopefully it won’t be as disappointing as the alcohol free wine I tried during Dry January! Never again!
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Leaving for Houston tomorrow morning. This is my annual trip back to the US to visit my daughter. February in Eastern Europe is usually a miserable month so I’m really happy to escape and enjoy over 3 weeks of mild temperatures and, hopefully, sunshine 🙂
Daughter rarely drinks so I should be able to avoid temptation of a glass of wine at home. And maybe I’ll try some kind of a mocktail when we go out to eat? I don’t eat out other than when I travel, and I don’t think mocktails are a thing in Poland anyway, so I’ve never had one. Hopefully it won’t be as disappointing as the alcohol free wine I tried during Dry January! Never again!
You can't really conceptualize NA wine as an alternative to wine, it's more of an alternative to juice.
The world of options for non alcoholic drinkers is quite small, especially if you don't like sugary drinks like me. So NA wine for me is like an adult version of juice.
I quite like NA sparkling wine though. That's my special occasion go-to.
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I'm at a conference today for the next day or so. With a group of professionals where I don't know anyone. The conference fee came with a free drink ticket. I walked up to the bar and ordered a tonic water and lime. The place must have been loud though or she misheard my order so she served me a gin and tonic and lime. I sat down and almost took a sip and almost spit it out. Mostly because I have forgotten how unpleasant the taste of alcohol can be when I am not accustomed to it. I'm proud of myself though for not reaching for a drink in a social situation that involves walking into a room and making small talk with 50 strangers, I am naturally pretty extroverted but in professional situations, I find that alcohol can be such a crutch for many folks.
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I'm at a conference today for the next day or so. With a group of professionals where I don't know anyone. The conference fee came with a free drink ticket. I walked up to the bar and ordered a tonic water and lime. The place must have been loud though or she misheard my order so she served me a gin and tonic and lime. I sat down and almost took a sip and almost spit it out. Mostly because I have forgotten how unpleasant the taste of alcohol can be when I am not accustomed to it. I'm proud of myself though for not reaching for a drink in a social situation that involves walking into a room and making small talk with 50 strangers, I am naturally pretty extroverted but in professional situations, I find that alcohol can be such a crutch for many folks.
Which is kind of crazy, because no one puts their most professional, intelligent foot forward when they are drinking.
My industry is pretty big on heavy drinking, open bar events, but when I reflect on the leaders in the industry who always came off as the most admirable and respectable, they didn't drink at those events, or if they did, I now know that they fake-drank and would nurse one drink over the course of the whole night.
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I'm at a conference today for the next day or so. With a group of professionals where I don't know anyone. The conference fee came with a free drink ticket. I walked up to the bar and ordered a tonic water and lime. The place must have been loud though or she misheard my order so she served me a gin and tonic and lime. I sat down and almost took a sip and almost spit it out. Mostly because I have forgotten how unpleasant the taste of alcohol can be when I am not accustomed to it. I'm proud of myself though for not reaching for a drink in a social situation that involves walking into a room and making small talk with 50 strangers, I am naturally pretty extroverted but in professional situations, I find that alcohol can be such a crutch for many folks.
Which is kind of crazy, because no one puts their most professional, intelligent foot forward when they are drinking.
My industry is pretty big on heavy drinking, open bar events, but when I reflect on the leaders in the industry who always came off as the most admirable and respectable, they didn't drink at those events, or if they did, I now know that they fake-drank and would nurse one drink over the course of the whole night.
Yeah, its a wild paradox, people went out for drinks again tonight, I was too drained from the conference. It's so ironic because it impairs your judgment and makes you more overconfident WHO WANTS THAT AT AN INFORMAL WORK FUNCTION!?
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I'm at a conference today for the next day or so. With a group of professionals where I don't know anyone. The conference fee came with a free drink ticket. I walked up to the bar and ordered a tonic water and lime. The place must have been loud though or she misheard my order so she served me a gin and tonic and lime. I sat down and almost took a sip and almost spit it out. Mostly because I have forgotten how unpleasant the taste of alcohol can be when I am not accustomed to it. I'm proud of myself though for not reaching for a drink in a social situation that involves walking into a room and making small talk with 50 strangers, I am naturally pretty extroverted but in professional situations, I find that alcohol can be such a crutch for many folks.
Which is kind of crazy, because no one puts their most professional, intelligent foot forward when they are drinking.
My industry is pretty big on heavy drinking, open bar events, but when I reflect on the leaders in the industry who always came off as the most admirable and respectable, they didn't drink at those events, or if they did, I now know that they fake-drank and would nurse one drink over the course of the whole night.
Yeah, its a wild paradox, people went out for drinks again tonight, I was too drained from the conference. It's so ironic because it impairs your judgment and makes you more overconfident WHO WANTS THAT AT AN INFORMAL WORK FUNCTION!?
I know! It's like the worst possible option and yet I can't tell you how many colleagues I've spent time with while they're anywhere from a bit tipsy to utterly shitfaced.
Alcohol universally makes people dumber and often makes people more affectionate or more combative, neither of which are ideal when socializing, especially with superiors and/or subordinates. With peers is slightly less problematic, but still incredibly suboptimal.
I've been on heavy opioids around my former staff and probably said less stupid, inappropriate shit than when I drank too much at one of our Christmas parties.
Now that I haven't had alcohol in so long, I literally can't fathom a state I would find *less* appropriate to be in around colleagues than even remotely drunk.
It boggles my mind and kind of horrifies me how many of my colleagues have seen me substantially inebriated. People I do not trust and do not like. Serious professional rivals and people who are keen to judge me have seen me at open bar galas, most definitely not anywhere near my sharpest or most impressive.
That's like running into your ex with spinach in your teeth and a mustard stain on your frumpy sweater. It's just not how you want to be seen.
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Made it Houston yesterday and I have to say that a long trip (3 flights of about 16 hours in the air in total) without my customary couple of glasses of wine was actually a lot more comfortable. And I woke up this morning feeling great despite not getting enough sleep and being totally jet lagged.
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That's like running into your ex with spinach in your teeth and a mustard stain on your frumpy sweater. It's just not how you want to be seen.
@Metalcat - that is a perfect analogy. Made me cringe reading it.
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@ZiziPB way to go. I am amazed at the difference between waking up after a couple of drinks and waking up sober. Alcohol really detrimentally affects sleep.
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I had another moment of “thank god my drinking days are done” the other day. Just on a long walk with my husband, appreciating the cool evening breeze and this wave of relief just washed over me. It was so nice right in that moment.
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My goal is a dry February (or whenever in Jan my last social drink is), and will go from there.
While perusing the new-to-me grocery store and digital coupon game in my new state, I noticed COUPONS for ALCOHOL! Are you kidding me? Amusing, but not actually tempting, even though I love a good coupon. It was annoying to scroll through them all.
AF for a week now, and no problem - though I'm still sad from all the change so that's muted any compulsion to drink. I don't see any problem getting through the month, but I am curious how I'll feel if I start meeting people to hang out with (I'm considering joining a "boozy bookclub" but I'm not worried about not drinking - I'm sure it's called that because wineries/distilleries/breweries are easy places to meet up.)
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I had another moment of “thank god my drinking days are done” the other day. Just on a long walk with my husband, appreciating the cool evening breeze and this wave of relief just washed over me. It was so nice right in that moment.
Out of curiosity, I went back and looked at my old responses from when I did the Alcohol Experiment in Jan 2020.
2019 was the worst year of my life, and that's saying A LOT. It was wild to have a view back into what my miserable, burnt out brain was thinking back then, freshly sober on the tail end of A LOT of depending on my evening red wine to soothe my frayed nerves.
There are a lot of comments about how quitting was so much easier than I expected, which I don't remember writing. But what stands out is how I related to stress and fun.
It's crazy how much credit I gave alcohol when I was drinking. As if it was actually important for managing my stress or was actually important for having fun.
That all seems so fucking stupid to me now. Like what the actual fuck?
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I had another moment of “thank god my drinking days are done” the other day. Just on a long walk with my husband, appreciating the cool evening breeze and this wave of relief just washed over me. It was so nice right in that moment.
Out of curiosity, I went back and looked at my old responses from when I did the Alcohol Experiment in Jan 2020.
2019 was the worst year of my life, and that's saying A LOT. It was wild to have a view back into what my miserable, burnt out brain was thinking back then, freshly sober on the tail end of A LOT of depending on my evening red wine to soothe my frayed nerves.
There are a lot of comments about how quitting was so much easier than I expected, which I don't remember writing. But what stands out is how I related to stress and fun.
It's crazy how much credit I gave alcohol when I was drinking. As if it was actually important for managing my stress or was actually important for having fun.
That all seems so fucking stupid to me now. Like what the actual fuck?
Heh. I know what you mean.
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My Dry February is going well so far. Seeing all the wine in grocery stores and even at CVS here in Houston is a bit triggering. There’s something to be said for Connecticut where I used to live: alcohol was only sold in liquor stores. So you didn’t have to go through endless isles of wine and beer while getting your groceries or filling a prescription. But I’m getting good at just averting my eyes and ignoring it 😀
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I agree there's something to be said for keeping the booze in separate stores. That was the way it was in Ontario until recently. This fall, I was in the grocery store when a bottle of wine had been dropped and broken, and the smell was unavoidable on my way out. I did find that triggering.
Currently, I'm craving wine quite frequently. Much more than I had been. I want to be drunk to escape reality. But I don't have to act on that desire. I'll try better coping mechanism like deep breathing and support groups.
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Went out to late lunch on Saturday. Seeing lots of people sitting in the restaurant sipping glasses of cold white wine on a sunny afternoon made me really miss it! But I found a really nice Italian blood orange soda in a can in that same restaurant and my craving went away. I hope to get the point of not experiencing that pang of regret and longing in situations like this. Curious if it is possible and how long it would take to get there.
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Went out to late lunch on Saturday. Seeing lots of people sitting in the restaurant sipping glasses of cold white wine on a sunny afternoon made me really miss it! But I found a really nice Italian blood orange soda in a can in that same restaurant and my craving went away. I hope to get the point of not experiencing that pang of regret and longing in situations like this. Curious if it is possible and how long it would take to get there.
It's possible! I quit 13 years ago so I forget exactly how long it took, but it did happen after a few years. My partner has always been a very light drinker and in the first few years I would occasionally have a taste (not even a sip, I would just let the drink touch my lips/tongue to get the flavor), but now I rarely bother.
When I see people drinking now I don't really feel any emotion, not regret, not judgement, it's just not been part of my life for so long that it doesn't affect me.
I have other habits now, like herbal tea, kombucha, and, lately, drinking vinegars. I'd much rather have one of those than an alcoholic drink.
I'm popular to take to wine tastings, too, since it's no hardship to me to have an ice tea and be the designated driver.
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I'm popular to take to wine tastings, too, since it's no hardship to me to have an ice tea and be the designated driver.
You're not supposed to drink the wine during a tasting . . . otherwise it all starts to taste of 'wine' after 5-10 samples. :P
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I'm popular to take to wine tastings, too, since it's no hardship to me to have an ice tea and be the designated driver.
You're not supposed to drink the wine during a tasting . . . otherwise it all starts to taste of 'wine' after 5-10 samples. :P
The people I go with use it to drink wine for free, but they always seem to buy a few bottles, too.
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I'm popular to take to wine tastings, too, since it's no hardship to me to have an ice tea and be the designated driver.
You're not supposed to drink the wine during a tasting . . . otherwise it all starts to taste of 'wine' after 5-10 samples. :P
The people I go with use it to drink wine for free, but they always seem to buy a few bottles, too.
Yup, that's why places have free tastings. I've only been to a few vineyards but yeah I would generally buy a bottle if the stuff was halfway decent. Of course these places were all under $20 for a bottle.
I've long since stopped calculating how much money I've saved since I sobered up, it'll be 3 years by the end of this month.
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Went out to late lunch on Saturday. Seeing lots of people sitting in the restaurant sipping glasses of cold white wine on a sunny afternoon made me really miss it! But I found a really nice Italian blood orange soda in a can in that same restaurant and my craving went away. I hope to get the point of not experiencing that pang of regret and longing in situations like this. Curious if it is possible and how long it would take to get there.
I had this for the first year. After that I didn't miss wine at restaurants, but I did start getting ragey if restaurants didn't have good AF alternatives, which I posted about in this thread several times.
I still get very annoyed if I'm at a place in this city that really should have AF options and has nothing but pop and juice. But it doesn't make me crave alcohol.
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Just a week or so left of my dry February. Slowly learning that there are much better options than wine when I’m tired and in need of rest and relaxation. I don’t see any reason not to try for dry March as well - 100 days of no alcohol should be a good reset period, right?
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Just a week or so left of my dry February. Slowly learning that there are much better options than wine when I’m tired and in need of rest and relaxation. I don’t see any reason not to try for dry March as well - 100 days of no alcohol should be a good reset period, right?
Depends on what you are trying to "reset."
There's pretty good research that says that if you had an addiction to alcohol, you really won't "reset" anything in your brain until the 2 year mark.
I know for me I felt a substantial change around 2 years. I wrote about it not too long ago, how before that I felt like someone who had quit drinking. After that I feel like someone who is a non drinker.
If your previous level of drinking was generally very mild and you just felt like you were starting to get into habits you didn't want, then yeah, 100 days is a great stretch.
But if you had a sustained level of habit that was more than you wanted to be drinking, then 100 days is a great start, but don't expect that if you start drinking again that it will be easy to sustain it at a substantially lower level than you did before.
That doesn't mean I'm saying you should be sober for at least 2 years, not at all. Just that you should really think about what your relationship with alcohol used to look like, what you want your relationship with alcohol to look like in the future, and what steps you may need to take to ensure that that future actually happens.
I just don't want you to make the same mistake that virtually everyone makes, which is to be sober for a good few months, be really happy with the impact, then go back to drinking assuming that they've now "reset" their system (they haven't), and then they end up exactly where they were before they ever tried quitting, and now trying to quit again is so much harder.
It's like the cliche of the smoker who quits, is SO HAPPY to have quit, takes a puff of someone's cigarette one day, hacks and coughs and thinks "I hate this! I'm cured!" Thinks they are now free of their addiction, so drops their guard, but then within two weeks is back to smoking a pack a day.
What I liked about Annie Grace was that she was all about determining what role you want alcohol to play in your life.
I decided to never drink again. I saw no benefit to drinking. DH decided to drink very moderately. But we had very different drinking patterns.
I was a daily habit, after work stress drinker who usually didn't drink a lot for any one sitting. DH was a less frequent drinker but once he had 3 drinks would, like, fall off a fucking cliff, lose all inhibition, get absolutely trashed and become a sloppy asshole.
So for him, he has no urge to drink at home after work. He's also perfectly happy not getting drunk when he goes out and only having two drinks once a week. He's been doing that for a few years.
But he never had an addiction, what he has is just a really, really bad reaction to getting drunk. The level of disinhibition he gets is fucking insane. So moderating for him is easy.
Moderating on any given day for me is easy, what wasn't easy was not drinking at all on any given day. I just never ever want to go back to that feeling of wrestling with whether or not I'm going to have a drink that day.
I love too much being free of the evening desire for a glass of wine. It's just gone and I never want it back.
So reflect on what you want your future relationship with alcohol to look like, because unfortunately taking a break doesn't actually eliminate whatever drove you to drink before.
If you stop for 100 days and go back, you will likely go back very quickly to whatever your pattern was before unless you go back with an active plan.
Unfortunately, the mythical "reset" doesn't exist.
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@Metalcat - I think the problem is that I don’t know yet what my end goal is. I stopped drinking in 2015 or 2016 for about a year and a half. Then decided that it was okay to have an occasional glass of wine on special occasions and it slowly creeped up to 2 glasses a day. Which is definitely not where I want to be. So I guess I’m thinking about the 100 days as a good period during which to decide what I really want to do about alcohol in my life? I have alcoholism in my family. In fact, one of my cousins, a guy exactly my age, died last summer from it. I have other family members who are not as bad as he was but definitely drink too much too often. I’m scared of that. And even if I’m not an alcoholic, I don’t want to waste my hard earned FIRE on being semi drunk or hungover. So I need to figure this out.
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@Metalcat - I think the problem is that I don’t know yet what my end goal is. I stopped drinking in 2015 or 2016 for about a year and a half. Then decided that it was okay to have an occasional glass of wine on special occasions and it slowly creeped up to 2 glasses a day. Which is definitely not where I want to be. So I guess I’m thinking about the 100 days as a good period during which to decide what I really want to do about alcohol in my life? I have alcoholism in my family. In fact, one of my cousins, a guy exactly my age, died last summer from it. I have other family members who are not as bad as he was but definitely drink too much too often. I’m scared of that. And even if I’m not an alcoholic, I don’t want to waste my hard earned FIRE on being semi drunk or hungover. So I need to figure this out.
I would personally reframe away from asking whether or not you are an alcoholic because that isn't a scientifically supported concept.
If you found yourself repeatedly drinking more than you wanted to, then that's an addiction. Is it a severe one? Not necessarily, but no question it's somewhere along the addiction process.
So conceptualize what relationship with want with a substance that you have developed an addiction to.
If you want a "glass now and then habit" it's likely never going to be an easy to sustain habit. It's doable, I know I could do it, but I don't want that hassle. I don't want to have to engage discipline not to drink, that sounds miserable to me.
Because I'm past the two years, it takes me zero discipline not to drink. But if I restarted, my history with daily drinking was long and powerful, and I am very prone to addiction, I form habits extremely easily, so I just know that "a nice glass with the occasional dinner" would be something that I would have to always be vigilant about.
I would have to have rules and failsafes and it just sounds so fucking exhausting to me.
For DH it's nothing. He is very happy with his two beers at darts night at the pub, with a glass of soda water between them. He just wasn't ever addicted, nor did he ever drink for stress relief. He mostly drank because I drank. He can truly take it or leave it, it's not his substance of choice, marijuana is and he has to use discipline to keep that at a minimal level.
But to him the occasional marijuana use is totally worth the discipline. And perhaps for you the occasional alcohol would be as well.
I'm not trying to discourage you from drinking. No matter how it sounds, that isn't my purpose.
I just don't want you making the extremely common mistake of assuming that quitting for awhile will make moderating easier. You already found that out for yourself after quitting for a year and a half.
Time off can definitely help clarify your relationship with alcohol, but short of multiple years, it can't fix it, and even after a few years, I'm positive that I would be right back where I was if I started drinking again without a clear plan in place to limit it.
So yeah, take the 100 days to reflect and figure out what you want. And then make an active plan as to how to achieve it.
I made one of these plans as part of the 30.day experiment. I had to list a set of "non negotiables" meaning things that happened because of drinking that I never wanted to happen again. And what I would do if I started drinking again and one of them happened.
I actually naturally did this for years. I didn't have a problem with alcohol until my doctorate. In my 20s I was super mindful of alcohol addiction thanks to my family history, and I frequently took 6 week breaks from drinking. Not to "reset" but to gauge how hard it was to take 6 weeks off.
If it was at all hard, I took another 6 weeks off, and so on, until it became easy. Then I would start drinking again, and then after 6 weeks of drinking take another 3 weeks off and see if that was easy.
I took a 6 week break every 6 months. Often it was easy and no further action was required. I never drank in response to stress either. Not until grad school. Then it became a problem.
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Just a week or so left of my dry February. Slowly learning that there are much better options than wine when I’m tired and in need of rest and relaxation. I don’t see any reason not to try for dry March as well - 100 days of no alcohol should be a good reset period, right?
Thanks for the reminder to consider what's next when my dry Feb is over.
I moved with 4 bottles of booze. 1 unopened, 2 special with not much left, 1 open and not special. I can't store them while I'm gone for the summer. I would like to finish the 2 special bottles - so I'm allowing myself 1 "fancy" mixed drink per week in March and April until I use them up - I'm thinking the amount left will only make 4-5 drinks. I can travel with the unopened bottle to either drink in the future or use as a gift, and the not special bottle I can use at the 1 drink/week rate, maybe use it in some baking??, or I will just toss it when I leave.
I will also allow myself to drink at social events in March and April within the 1 drink/week limit if I want, but only if I'm at a local brewery, winery, or distillery. While I do want to sample the local offerings of my new town, my preference is going to be to try more AF options, and to present myself as a non-drinker to new social groups.
I do think I'm heading towards not drinking at all, or at least go back to the very infrequent imbibing I did in my 20s.
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Just a week or so left of my dry February. Slowly learning that there are much better options than wine when I’m tired and in need of rest and relaxation. I don’t see any reason not to try for dry March as well - 100 days of no alcohol should be a good reset period, right?
Thanks for the reminder to consider what's next when my dry Feb is over.
I moved with 4 bottles of booze. 1 unopened, 2 special with not much left, 1 open and not special. I can't store them while I'm gone for the summer. I would like to finish the 2 special bottles - so I'm allowing myself 1 "fancy" mixed drink per week in March and April until I use them up - I'm thinking the amount left will only make 4-5 drinks. I can travel with the unopened bottle to either drink in the future or use as a gift, and the not special bottle I can use at the 1 drink/week rate, maybe use it in some baking??, or I will just toss it when I leave.
I will also allow myself to drink at social events in March and April within the 1 drink/week limit if I want, but only if I'm at a local brewery, winery, or distillery. While I do want to sample the local offerings of my new town, my preference is going to be to try more AF options, and to present myself as a non-drinker to new social groups.
I do think I'm heading towards not drinking at all, or at least go back to the very infrequent imbibing I did in my 20s.
DH and I call this "can't waste the donuts" thinking.
I was working in an all female clinic where literally all of the staff were trying to lose weight through various different diets. Over my years there, I was the only one who lost weight. I went from obese to extremely lean. ETA: oops, I cut out a paragraph here that didn't explain this point. Lol. The point was that I was surrounded by people trying to lose weight but they were always cheating on their diets because foods they didn't want to be eating were present.
We got A LOT of food gifts there: cakes, sweets, etc. And one day, one of the women who was always on and off keto ate 3 donuts at lunch because they would otherwise go stale and you "can't waste the donuts."
So any time one of us talks about needing to consume something because it's in the house, the other says "cuz you can't waste the donuts?"
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If you don't want to waste them, give 'em away.
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DH and I call this "can't waste the donuts" thinking.
If you don't want to waste them, give 'em away.
What's wrong with wanting to finish the 2 special bottles myself? I want to drink these - they are my favorites - they are not donuts. I'm going to make sure I drink them mindfully, not mindlessly.
I got the unopened bottle in a Christmas swap, and I think it might be fun if it shows up in the swap again this year! Or if I need an emergency gift in the intervening time. It will not be a hardship to keep this bottle with me for a while.
I have no friends here yet, so the last bottle I will probably throw away, as I don't see meeting someone who I would want to give an old open bottle of liquor to before I leave. I'm missing living by my friends - the whole reason I have the non-special bottle is to make my friend's favorite dessert - and I hate that I can't make it for her right now.
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DH and I call this "can't waste the donuts" thinking.
If you don't want to waste them, give 'em away.
What's wrong with wanting to finish the 2 special bottles myself? I want to drink these - they are my favorites - they are not donuts. I'm going to make sure I drink them mindfully, not mindlessly.
I got the unopened bottle in a Christmas swap, and I think it might be fun if it shows up in the swap again this year! Or if I need an emergency gift in the intervening time. It will not be a hardship to keep this bottle with me for a while.
I have no friends here yet, so the last bottle I will probably throw away, as I don't see meeting someone who I would want to give an old open bottle of liquor to before I leave. I'm missing living by my friends - the whole reason I have the non-special bottle is to make my friend's favorite dessert - and I hate that I can't make it for her right now.
Nothing wrong with it, I'm just chuckling because this is classic "can't waste the donuts" thinking. It's a playful thing DH and I toss at each other whenever we justify consuming something that we otherwise wouldn't if it weren't already in the house.
I just ate 5 mediocre chocolates a few hours ago and DH said "can't waste the donuts, eh?" I still ate them, but it was with full acknowledgement that I'm only eating them because they're here.
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Since neither my husband or I drink anymore, and it turns out there is only so much beer bread one can make or consume, we are at the wasting the donuts stage with the last batch of homebrew he made just before he stopped. It's going down the drain and we're recycling the bottles.
[And it's not good enough to give away at this point.]
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My wife and I did no alcohol for the month of October and we also did January. I drink much less now and when I drink it feels special.
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Since neither my husband or I drink anymore, and it turns out there is only so much beer bread one can make or consume, we are at the wasting the donuts stage with the last batch of homebrew he made just before he stopped. It's going down the drain and we're recycling the bottles.
[And it's not good enough to give away at this point.]
If you garden, it makes great slug bait.
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[...
It's like the cliche of the smoker who quits, is SO HAPPY to have quit, takes a puff of someone's cigarette one day, hacks and coughs and thinks "I hate this! I'm cured!" Thinks they are now free of their addiction, so drops their guard, but then within two weeks is back to smoking a pack a day.
...
On point, but it would take me a month and it was 4 packs a day. This happened 3 or 4 times, until I finally concluded the tobacco was stronger. Fascinating how voluble and rhetorically inventive a thwarted addiction can make the chattering mind.
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[...
It's like the cliche of the smoker who quits, is SO HAPPY to have quit, takes a puff of someone's cigarette one day, hacks and coughs and thinks "I hate this! I'm cured!" Thinks they are now free of their addiction, so drops their guard, but then within two weeks is back to smoking a pack a day.
...
On point, but it would take me a month and it was 4 packs a day. This happened 3 or 4 times, until I finally concluded the tobacco was stronger. Fascinating how voluble and rhetorically inventive a thwarted addiction can make the chattering mind.
FOUR PACKS A DAY? How did you have time to do anything else besides smoke? How did you afford it?
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...
FOUR PACKS A DAY? How did you have time to do anything else besides smoke? How did you afford it?
Was doing a lot of reading at the time; used the butt of one as ignition for the next. Other than in the shower or on the bike, I had one going. As I recall, a carton was $2.50, on its way up to $5.00.
Many addictions are clearly suicidal. Some of them entail suicide in protracted, disgustingly self-degrading ways.
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I guess a carton at $5 puts this back in the days when smoking 4 packs/day would be excessive but not unheard of. I could never smoke more than one pack a day without feeling wretched...but that was in the 90's, when one couldn't smoke inside in many public places.
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Flying back to Poland today. Overall I had no problem staying AF during my time in Houston. My daughter and her boyfriend rarely drink alcohol so we just drank lots of water, flavored seltzer, coffee and tea all month long. Other than maybe once or twice I didn’t miss or crave wine. Haven’t decided yet about March. I have no desire to drink alcohol but we are thinking about a trip to Germany in March and I may want to try some local beer or wine? Not sure yet, I’ll think it over when I get back home tomorrow.
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Celebrated 5 months off the hooch this weekend.
Don't know when I'll reintroduce yet, as it's been easy to abstain but I'm not so sure about my ability/desire to moderate myself. Guess it's worth a shot to see if I can enjoy the random couple of pints or bottle of wine with dinner on a monthly basis.....
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Congrats on 5 months @2Birds1Stone !
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Successfully went AF for 33 days (after doing 20 in January), and did not miss it. My new state just started selling wine in grocery stores on 3/1. What? I hadn't even noticed there was no wine before!
After the last time I posted here, I had a stress dream that night about accidentally drinking a beer. I have no idea how one accidentally drinks a beer in a clearly labeled bottle, but that's why it's a stress dream. Was happy when I woke up and realized I hadn't messed up.
Tonight I sipped a cocktail at home while I read, then walked to an art reception at a museum 2 blocks from my house. I enjoyed the memories that that the liquor and mixer gave me (an appropriate pairing that happened by accident), but lost the "buzz effect" on the walk to the museum.
I'm sure I'll be to this thread in the future.
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Today, is my 1 year anniversary of being 100% totally alcohol free!
Before that, I spent 11 months with almost none.
When I was in the thick of regular wine drinking, I never thought I’d be here. I’m quite pleased.
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Today, is my 1 year anniversary of being 100% totally alcohol free!
Before that, I spent 11 months with almost none.
When I was in the thick of regular wine drinking, I never thought I’d be here. I’m quite pleased.
Awesome.
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Hit one year on 3/15.
Had a moment this weekend at a concert. Ordered a Dos Sequis for my GF at the bar. Bartender misheard, and opened 2 beers and handed them to me. Had a brief pause, then I handed them both to her. Maybe a test, or not.
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Congrats anniversary people!!
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Stayed mostly alcohol free in March. We celebrated 2 family birthdays at the beginning of the month and I decided to have some drinks on these two separate occasions. No alcohol again since March 6. It required a surprising amount of mental energy to do decide when to drink and how much. Will continue AF in April - it just seems easier 🙂
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I appreciate all of the thoughts, successes, and struggles being shared here.
My relationship with alcohol pre-FIRE wasn't great and was one of several reasons that FIRE was key to my future health. It somewhat improved post-FIRE, but still wasn't great. During MOAB 2022 I was finding that the days after I had beer weren't great - not in a hangover sort of a way, more like a general feeling of unwellness. @ToTheMoon and her husband had brought AF beer with them and were very generous sharing it. I discovered that that was a great alternative. I haven't had a single real beer since then, so about five months.
I'm still having some wine, but far less than half of what I was having pre-FIRE. So I guess this is a form of moderation that's working so far. Ultimately I'm still aiming to wind it down to once-in-a-while during social occasions, and that doesn't seem like a daunting challenge at this point.
I'm definitely sleeping better and as of this morning I'm at my lowest weight in about 10 years. The cancer risk is a major concern so I feel good about addressing that, but just day-to-day feeling good is so important. I turn 50 this year and still feel like my fittest and healthiest years are ahead of me.
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Did not see this coming, Mark Manson on why he's not drinking anymore - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tOuUgGWLYa0
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Did not see this coming, Mark Manson on why he's not drinking anymore - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tOuUgGWLYa0
Thanks for that video. I don't regret my drinking in my 20's and 30's, but wish I would've had his maturity and clarity when I was 39... Booze free now and can't believe how awful my last years of drinking were in my mid-40's, yet refused to give it up.
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Did not see this coming, Mark Manson on why he's not drinking anymore - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tOuUgGWLYa0
Thanks for that video. I don't regret my drinking in my 20's and 30's, but wish I would've had his maturity and clarity when I was 39... Booze free now and can't believe how awful my last years of drinking were in my mid-40's, yet refused to give it up.
I am so happy I had to temporarily quit mid/late 30s for a drug trial.
I probably would have continued drinking well into my 40s otherwise. I'm most happy that DH quit at the same time, because he just turned 50 a few weeks ago and is now in the best shape of his life.
My experience is pretty much exactly like that video, except that I didn't lose weight from quitting alcohol, I gained a bit from the sugar habit I temporarily replaced it with, lol.
I'm interested in him describing 10-15 drinks a week as "heavy drinking" since at the time, that would have been exactly within the definition of "healthy" and "moderate" drinking for men. The old standard was 2 drinks a day for men. In fact, I think this is still the standard according to the CDC, I think it's just Canada that lowered it to 2 drinks a week.
It's not that I disagree with him that that's way too much, I can't imagine ever seeing nearly nightly drinking as normal ever again. But I can just imagine the eyerolls I would get from the wine moms if I started referring to my former glass of wine with dinner as "heavy drinking" while espousing the benefits of sobriety. They would laugh me out of the room.
So again, I don't disagree with him, it just really struck me as something that could be very alienating to the exact audience he's trying to reach.
I mean, all of the sober folks will nod along I'm agreement, but I could see the drinkers being like "oh fuck off with that LA bullshit."
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I was definitely more receptive to the way Huberman delivered the 'alcohol sucks' message than Manson, but repetition is all good. If folks look up to Manson, then every little bit helps. I got a lot of energy from finding out that Stephen King went alcohol and drug free, although I didn't know about the history until I looked it up. 'The Shining' had a whole other level I'd missed on that first teen read.
Alcohol is headed in the direction smoking went, it's hard to ignore just how terrible it is to our health for what amounts to a fleeting period of 'relaxation' or buzz followed by long periods of discomfort. You can get away with a lot of BS in your 20's, and the alcohol industry isn't going to give up their massive profit margins, but it's great to see more awareness.
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I really like him so am completely biased but I also preferred the Huberman episode :)
I've been an almost daily drinker for years who has recently lost my taste for alcohol. I tend to take a month off here or there but socializing in my town revolves heavily around alcohol and I've generally always been okay with that. It's an outdoorsy town so people tend to gather for a drink after skiing, or hiking, or biking...etc.
It seems as if my desire & ability to drink has dropped down dramatically in the last few weeks. Not sure why but am just going along with it. I've been buying kombucha and also drinking sparkling water with shrubs. Or a Radler..which at 2.5% alcohol seem much more reasonable than the 6.5/7% IPA's I had gotten used to.
Anyhow, I'm not sure where this is taking me but I enjoy reading through this thread and being inspired by everyones stories and experiences. Definitely notice my sleep is better & energy is higher when I don't have anything to drink..
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This past weekend I had a glass of wine at the each of the Easter dinners I attended. I shouldn't have bothered at the first one. Wine was shitty. Second night - I shouldn't have let someone else pour. I would have been happy with three sips of the beautiful red, but still had more than half a glass.
Happy that Easter Gatherings are finished and I can return to my hermit like existence once again.
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I posted here maybe a year and a half ago after having done The Alcohol Experiment and being about 2 months dry. I made it to 3 months and really hadn't noticed many changes at all. No weight loss (well, I lost about 2 pounds...), my sleep wasn't really much changed (it wasn't bad to begin with), no changes in energy or anxiety, etc.
Given this, and because my prior drinking was frequent but not "problematic" (i.e., I drank often, more than is healthy, but would always stop before getting drunk), I decided to go back to enjoying my beloved craft beers.
I'm giving the 30 day Alcohol Experiment another go. It didn't resonate with me well last time (even though I also read This Naked Mind at the same time), because I didn't drink heavily enough to get drunk, have blackouts, etc., which is what often seemed to be provided as examples. But my drinking is creeping up and up (I can now have 3 and sometimes 4 beers before I really start feeling a buzz that tells me to stop!), and I am gaining weight, and my parents are both currently in health crises despite being only in their late 50s/early 60s due to lifestyle factors (smoking for them). I just don't want to be in the same place as them, and I know that now at 41, I really do need to take better care of myself. I am also starting to notice that my sleep really IS affected now when I drink, and I feel kind of shitty the next day. And I have put on about 10-15 pounds over the past year - a lot on my 5'2" frame. Mostly though, the cancer risks associated with alcohol are scary for me.
I'm on day 4 now and so far so good. I'm hoping the lessons resonate more with me this time so I won't WANT to go back to drinking. The nice thing is, there seem to be a lot more good NA beer options that are a good alternative to have on hand for times when I really feel like only a beer will do.
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Welcome to the thread, Petuniajo. It sounds like you have a lot more reasons to go -- and stay -- alcohol free this time around.
The Easter long weekend came and went without any cravings. I did have a bit of a "flashback" to Easter 2020, at the beginning of the pandemic, and how badly I wanted wine to get through it. I preferred the current approach of not drinking and not craving and not thinking about alcohol.
And this weekend was full-on patio weather -- we had a false summer instead of a false spring -- and that made me interested in having a beer. But just in passing. Not a strong craving.
I'm now more than 6 months into a 2-year commitment to not drink any alcohol. And I've just started a 4-month leave from work, so this will be a time to stay vigilant and make sure I don't allow for any excuses that would result in a slip. I definitely need to have no alcohol (as opposed to a possible approach of moderation, which I may or may not want to try after a full 2 years alcohol-free).
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Time flies! Somewhere in the last few days I crossed the 200 day mark. Way longer than I ever expected to go, with no real goal in mind. Still debating whether to consciously keep the streak going or not.
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Easter marked two years of being AF thanks to this thread and the Alcohol Experiment. It's definitely been a good change with the most significant benefit being sleep, glorious sleep. I didn't appreciate how my sleep was impacted until I stopped drinking and noticed how rested and refreshed I feel each morning. I opted for abstinence instead of moderation for simplicity. Managing moderation would take up too much head space, and I like to sleep ... every night.
I worried about social situations being awkward but haven't found that to be the case. A simple "no thank you" is all it takes. And I allow myself to spend $ on kambucha or fancy teas that I really enjoy without guilt.
I anticipate I will stay AF indefinitely. It works for me.
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I'm coming up on 3 weeks AF this time, and this time I really am noticing some positive differences in how I feel. I do feel more rested, and I'm finding it a LOT less difficult to stay AF. I've been following the lessons and doing the exercises for The Alcohol Experiment (not EVERY day, but I *am* doing them diligently), and I've been listening to a lot of health podcasts. I think all this helps with just not even wanting to drink, which has been a surprise. I already knew all the ways that alcohol is bad for you, yet I still craved it. But now, I just don't even crave it.
And - I've been keeping some NA beers on hand (I know not everyone agrees with that, but it is helpful for me as sometimes I truly just want the taste of a good beer), and have found the BrewDog AF options to be particularly fantastic.
Happily, I've also been losing weight this time. I was already (very) slowly losing some weight since the beginning of the year, but in the few weeks I've been AF, I've lost about 4 or 5 pounds.
I cannot stress how important these positive changes are in keeping up my motivation. Last time, I made it to 3 months alcohol free but just had not experienced really ANY of these positive changes. So even though I knew it was much healthier, I wasn't *feeling* the benefits, and that made it feel like more of a sacrifice. This time, it's not really feeling like a sacrifice at all.
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I'm coming up on 3 weeks AF this time, and this time I really am noticing some positive differences in how I feel. I do feel more rested, and I'm finding it a LOT less difficult to stay AF. I've been following the lessons and doing the exercises for The Alcohol Experiment (not EVERY day, but I *am* doing them diligently), and I've been listening to a lot of health podcasts. I think all this helps with just not even wanting to drink, which has been a surprise. I already knew all the ways that alcohol is bad for you, yet I still craved it. But now, I just don't even crave it.
And - I've been keeping some NA beers on hand (I know not everyone agrees with that, but it is helpful for me as sometimes I truly just want the taste of a good beer), and have found the BrewDog AF options to be particularly fantastic.
Happily, I've also been losing weight this time. I was already (very) slowly losing some weight since the beginning of the year, but in the few weeks I've been AF, I've lost about 4 or 5 pounds.
I cannot stress how important these positive changes are in keeping up my motivation. Last time, I made it to 3 months alcohol free but just had not experienced really ANY of these positive changes. So even though I knew it was much healthier, I wasn't *feeling* the benefits, and that made it feel like more of a sacrifice. This time, it's not really feeling like a sacrifice at all.
This is awesome, I love reading this!
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Stayed AF in April. May will be mostly AF - I had a glass of wine while hosting a family gathering on May 1. It was meh 🙂 Planning to have some sort of alcohol at my sister-in-law’s birthday celebration on the weekend. Back to AF after that.
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Stayed AF in April. May will be mostly AF - I had a glass of wine while hosting a family gathering on May 1. It was meh 🙂 Planning to have some sort of alcohol at my sister-in-law’s birthday celebration on the weekend. Back to AF after that.
I'm curious, why are you planning to drink if the wine was "meh"??
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Stayed AF in April. May will be mostly AF - I had a glass of wine while hosting a family gathering on May 1. It was meh 🙂 Planning to have some sort of alcohol at my sister-in-law’s birthday celebration on the weekend. Back to AF after that.
I'm curious, why are you planning to drink if the wine was "meh"??
Haha! The particular white wine I had during the May Day gathering was “meh”. But the nice red wine I drank with the delicious dinner during the birthday celebration last night was well worth it 🙂 I wish someone would come up with a way to have the taste of a good red without the alcohol…
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Stayed AF in April. May will be mostly AF - I had a glass of wine while hosting a family gathering on May 1. It was meh 🙂 Planning to have some sort of alcohol at my sister-in-law’s birthday celebration on the weekend. Back to AF after that.
I'm curious, why are you planning to drink if the wine was "meh"??
Haha! The particular white wine I had during the May Day gathering was “meh”. But the nice red wine I drank with the delicious dinner during the birthday celebration last night was well worth it 🙂 I wish someone would come up with a way to have the taste of a good red without the alcohol…
I love "Red Clay" by Proxies. At least for me, it fits the bill of tasting like a good red wine without the alcohol. Thanks to Malcat for the Proxies recommendation.
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Stayed AF in April. May will be mostly AF - I had a glass of wine while hosting a family gathering on May 1. It was meh 🙂 Planning to have some sort of alcohol at my sister-in-law’s birthday celebration on the weekend. Back to AF after that.
I'm curious, why are you planning to drink if the wine was "meh"??
Haha! The particular white wine I had during the May Day gathering was “meh”. But the nice red wine I drank with the delicious dinner during the birthday celebration last night was well worth it 🙂 I wish someone would come up with a way to have the taste of a good red without the alcohol…
To be fair, red wine objectively tastes fucking atrocious. It literally smells and tastes like gasoline because that's what ethanol is.
The smell and taste of red wine used to be my favourite thing in the world. I remember pouring my evening glass of after-work red wine and just sticking my nose in the glass and breathing. The smell alone would make my muscles relax and make me feel happy.
But that's because my brain rewired itself to love the smell of wine so that I would drink it and give my brain the alcohol it was craving.
I can still remember what my brain made wine taste like, but it doesn't smell or taste that way now. There's a total mismatch. Now it smells and tastes like gasoline. It stinks so bad that the thought of putting my nose in a glass is gag-inducing, and I can barely choke back a sip of it if I do try it.
Not everyone loses their taste for alcohol when they quit, but many do.
That doesn't help you find an alternative that's as satisfying, but it certainly helped me not miss wine.
I miss enjoying a beverage that much, but I don't miss the implications of my brain pumping up the gustatory enjoyment of a beverage that much just to get me to drink it more often.
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Stayed AF in April. May will be mostly AF - I had a glass of wine while hosting a family gathering on May 1. It was meh 🙂 Planning to have some sort of alcohol at my sister-in-law’s birthday celebration on the weekend. Back to AF after that.
I'm curious, why are you planning to drink if the wine was "meh"??
Haha! The particular white wine I had during the May Day gathering was “meh”. But the nice red wine I drank with the delicious dinner during the birthday celebration last night was well worth it 🙂 I wish someone would come up with a way to have the taste of a good red without the alcohol…
I love "Red Clay" by Proxies. At least for me, it fits the bill of tasting like a good red wine without the alcohol. Thanks to Malcat for the Proxies recommendation.
Oh! That reminds me I should pick some up and bring it to Newfoundland. I don't think they ship out there.
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Speaking of subs and mocktails, I have found Athletic Brewing in the US to have decent alcohol free beers.
It isn't quite the same, but it works very well for summer beer cocktails (Beeraritas and Spaghetts) which are pretty standard in my regional community.
I am pretty happy with where our house has ended up in the last year. This year we basically didn't drink from Jan to late April or so. Have had a couple of social drinks when it sounded good (ie. His parents did a big fancy grill meal when we visited with them and a glass of wine tasted lovely with it). And we've made a few cocktails as a special treat (much like I make fancy desserts a couple times a year as a treat.)
For us, mocktails and alcohol free versions have been very helpful! But cocktails had become our non-water beverage when we wanted something different. So now when we are sick of water we have a few decent mocktails that have become our go-tos.
I suspect we'll average less than a drink a month at the end of this year if our pattern holds.
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Speaking of subs and mocktails, I have found Athletic Brewing in the US to have decent alcohol free beers.
It isn't quite the same, but it works very well for summer beer cocktails (Beeraritas and Spaghetts) which are pretty standard in my regional community.
I am pretty happy with where our house has ended up in the last year. This year we basically didn't drink from Jan to late April or so. Have had a couple of social drinks when it sounded good (ie. His parents did a big fancy grill meal when we visited with them and a glass of wine tasted lovely with it). And we've made a few cocktails as a special treat (much like I make fancy desserts a couple times a year as a treat.)
For us, mocktails and alcohol free versions have been very helpful! But cocktails had become our non-water beverage when we wanted something different. So now when we are sick of water we have a few decent mocktails that have become our go-tos.
I suspect we'll average less than a drink a month at the end of this year if our pattern holds.
Athletic Brewing is great!
I've rec'd Monday's 'gin' here before. Unfortunately, I hadn't had any in months and went to my cupboard and realized that since there isn't any booze in it, that means it can grow mold! :duh: Note to self: refrigerate it after opening if you don't drink it fast!
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I’m loving my alcohol free life. I don’t think of drinking anymore. It’s closing on 17 months of being totally alcohol free and 28 months since I dropped down to almost absolutely no alcohol (about 4 glasses of wine drunk in that 11 month period).
Thank you for everyone here who helped in those first days and weeks when I was getting over the addiction of drinking wine regularly!
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I’m loving my alcohol free life. I don’t think of drinking anymore. It’s closing on 17 months of being totally alcohol free and 28 months since I dropped down to almost absolutely no alcohol (about 4 glasses of wine drunk in that 11 month period).
Thank you for everyone here who helped in those first days and weeks when I was getting over the addiction of drinking wine regularly!
So great to hear! I love these updates.
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To be fair, red wine objectively tastes fucking atrocious. It literally smells and tastes like gasoline because that's what ethanol is.
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I don’t correct people in my ‘This Naked Mind’ groups when they say this, if it keeps you AF then that is more important than being technically correct. But it does drive me crazy, since I work in oil and gas. Gasoline is a generic word, and it now does usually contain some ethanol, but you can’t run a car on ethanol unless it is designed specifically for it. And most people don’t drink crude oil derived gasoline, unless you have a very rare addiction.
I’m 100% aware that this is a whole bunch of nit picking, but Mustachians can handle it a bit better than people who are desperate to quit alcohol and struggling 😄
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Speaking of subs and mocktails, I have found Athletic Brewing in the US to have decent alcohol free beers.
It isn't quite the same, but it works very well for summer beer cocktails (Beeraritas and Spaghetts) which are pretty standard in my regional community.
I am pretty happy with where our house has ended up in the last year. This year we basically didn't drink from Jan to late April or so. Have had a couple of social drinks when it sounded good (ie. His parents did a big fancy grill meal when we visited with them and a glass of wine tasted lovely with it). And we've made a few cocktails as a special treat (much like I make fancy desserts a couple times a year as a treat.)
For us, mocktails and alcohol free versions have been very helpful! But cocktails had become our non-water beverage when we wanted something different. So now when we are sick of water we have a few decent mocktails that have become our go-tos.
I suspect we'll average less than a drink a month at the end of this year if our pattern holds.
Athletic Brewing is great!
I've rec'd Monday's 'gin' here before. Unfortunately, I hadn't had any in months and went to my cupboard and realized that since there isn't any booze in it, that means it can grow mold! :duh: Note to self: refrigerate it after opening if you don't drink it fast!
Thanks! I'm not a gin person, but their mezcal looks like it also has solid reviews - helpful for a beerarita :) I'll check it out!
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To be fair, red wine objectively tastes fucking atrocious. It literally smells and tastes like gasoline because that's what ethanol is.
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I don’t correct people in my ‘This Naked Mind’ groups when they say this, if it keeps you AF then that is more important than being technically correct. But it does drive me crazy, since I work in oil and gas. Gasoline is a generic word, and it now does usually contain some ethanol, but you can’t run a car on ethanol unless it is designed specifically for it. And most people don’t drink crude oil derived gasoline, unless you have a very rare addiction.
I’m 100% aware that this is a whole bunch of nit picking, but Mustachians can handle it a bit better than people who are desperate to quit alcohol and struggling 😄
Heh. It's like the conventional wisdom that booze is somehow loaded with sugar and carbs, which is also usually wrong.
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To be fair, red wine objectively tastes fucking atrocious. It literally smells and tastes like gasoline because that's what ethanol is.
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I don’t correct people in my ‘This Naked Mind’ groups when they say this, if it keeps you AF then that is more important than being technically correct. But it does drive me crazy, since I work in oil and gas. Gasoline is a generic word, and it now does usually contain some ethanol, but you can’t run a car on ethanol unless it is designed specifically for it. And most people don’t drink crude oil derived gasoline, unless you have a very rare addiction.
I’m 100% aware that this is a whole bunch of nit picking, but Mustachians can handle it a bit better than people who are desperate to quit alcohol and struggling 😄
LOL! Fair...but it still smells disturbingly like the crap I put in my car.
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I was not a heavy drinker though I did a bit of binge drinking on social occasions until my early 40s. Around that time, I realized that I never really liked alcohol that much and limited my intake to 2 drinks on social events. My tolerance dropped dramatically. Three years ago, I stopped drinking altogether after getting an intense hangover over one drink. I've been alcohol free since then. Not a lot changed for me though except peer pressure to drink no longer affects me.
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Thank you to everyone for this thread, which I have followed for a few years now and has been a source of information and inspiration to me. In addition to your stories, I found Nancy Grace’s work, Huberman’s exegesis and Manson’s video particularly useful.
Manson’s story parallels my own. I drank heavily in my early 20’s, because it was my culture and to alleviate social anxiety. As I entered my medical training, partying and binge drinking gave way to lower intensity use for stress and for the pleasures of food and wine. I settled into a pattern of 8-10 per week for decades. Like Manson, I found that my older body was less tolerant of alcohol. I was taking antacids after drinking, sleeping poorly half of my nights and developed half-day hangovers if I had 2 drinks. I would have one later in the evening after living with the stress of the day. It helped, but like Huberman explained, led to the need for more habitual stretches of drinking. Eventually I began to identify as someone who simply became anxious and given to dark moods later in life.
For the last several years I have been cutting back progressively. Dry Januarys haven't been difficult, but I have usually looked forward to February and resuming my old habits, if somewhat attenuated for awhile. More recently I have shifted my abstinence efforts from avoiding consequences of drinking to focusing on the positive benefits of drinking. I rarely find any. Often, a sip of wine or whiskey often doesn’t spark any joy and tastes bad, and I will not hesitate to pour it out.
I have been coasting to retirement for the last 3 years or so, and becoming a more serious runner. That next-day feeling after 2 drinks takes all the enjoyment out of a long run. As I was training for an ultramarathon I had another shitty run the day after drinking (and not enjoying) a half bottle of wine and sleeping poorly. I said “fuck this” and stopped altogether until the event. Wow, between running fatigue and no alcohol I have never slept better. Also, I have been getting these day long dopamine highs after long runs, something that wasn’t happening with even modest drinking. After the event I rewarded myself with a craft beer, but poured it out after one sip, opting for a NA beer, which I now prefer (Partake IPA). I have had alcohol twice since then. Once was a celebration; the wine didn’t make me happier and I had GERD and bad sleep. I had a beer the other night. It felt useless (no enjoyment) though I perceived no harm.
I was doing pretty well focusing on the disadvantages of drinking much alcohol, but I feel like I’ve crossed over in my relationship with it. Zero feels qualitatively different. I know that dabbling with drinking now and again risks pulling me back in. For me, I think the key has been to be really honest with myself about what the experience of drinking is really like, both in the moment and connecting with my physical and mental states downstream. Seeing myself in Huberman’s descriptions, Manson’s life, and some of the stories here has been enormously helpful.
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Thank you to everyone for this thread, which I have followed for a few years now and has been a source of information and inspiration to me. In addition to your stories, I found Nancy Grace’s work, Huberman’s exegesis and Manson’s video particularly useful.
Manson’s story parallels my own. I drank heavily in my early 20’s, because it was my culture and to alleviate social anxiety. As I entered my medical training, partying and binge drinking gave way to lower intensity use for stress and for the pleasures of food and wine. I settled into a pattern of 8-10 per week for decades. Like Manson, I found that my older body was less tolerant of alcohol. I was taking antacids after drinking, sleeping poorly half of my nights and developed half-day hangovers if I had 2 drinks. I would have one later in the evening after living with the stress of the day. It helped, but like Huberman explained, led to the need for more habitual stretches of drinking. Eventually I began to identify as someone who simply became anxious and given to dark moods later in life.
For the last several years I have been cutting back progressively. Dry Januarys haven't been difficult, but I have usually looked forward to February and resuming my old habits, if somewhat attenuated for awhile. More recently I have shifted my abstinence efforts from avoiding consequences of drinking to focusing on the positive benefits of drinking. I rarely find any. Often, a sip of wine or whiskey often doesn’t spark any joy and tastes bad, and I will not hesitate to pour it out.
I have been coasting to retirement for the last 3 years or so, and becoming a more serious runner. That next-day feeling after 2 drinks takes all the enjoyment out of a long run. As I was training for an ultramarathon I had another shitty run the day after drinking (and not enjoying) a half bottle of wine and sleeping poorly. I said “fuck this” and stopped altogether until the event. Wow, between running fatigue and no alcohol I have never slept better. Also, I have been getting these day long dopamine highs after long runs, something that wasn’t happening with even modest drinking. After the event I rewarded myself with a craft beer, but poured it out after one sip, opting for a NA beer, which I now prefer (Partake IPA). I have had alcohol twice since then. Once was a celebration; the wine didn’t make me happier and I had GERD and bad sleep. I had a beer the other night. It felt useless (no enjoyment) though I perceived no harm.
I was doing pretty well focusing on the disadvantages of drinking much alcohol, but I feel like I’ve crossed over in my relationship with it. Zero feels qualitatively different. I know that dabbling with drinking now and again risks pulling me back in. For me, I think the key has been to be really honest with myself about what the experience of drinking is really like, both in the moment and connecting with my physical and mental states downstream. Seeing myself in Huberman’s descriptions, Manson’s life, and some of the stories here has been enormously helpful.
:nods: I had a similar experience. Hung out lurking on this thread about 6 months before I was ready to really work on reducing my wine with dinner habit, but had a similar shock at how something that had no real obvious negative consequences did in fact have tons of subtle long term consequences. And I no longer want those.
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Been alcohol free for a bit over a year now. Was never a big drinker to start with, but have still noticed an improvement with my sleep and energy levels. Also a lot on this thread has applied to me with marijuana, which I’ve also been free from for over a year now. Weed has much more of a “pull” on me than alcohol, so it’s been great to feel liberated from that as well.
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Thanks to everyone in this thread.
I have never drank alcohol in my life, but have always gotten constantly socially pressured from various people in my life to start drinking. On occasion I think "should I try alcohol?" 🤔
Reading through this thread gives me confirmation that I never want to bother with it. 😀
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Some more inspiration from a popular YouTuber - why i stopped drinking alcohol (https://youtu.be/P8hbSpcb-Eo)
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Bumpity bump....
Started a 30 day booze free run a few days ago. Ski season is kind of a bust so far, so without that outlet, these long dark nights+Bell's Hopslam season could get really ugly. But looking long term, the growing amount of research on the health concerns with alcohol consumption are making me consider some long term change.
Going smoothly so far. I expect by middle of next week I'll have an overproduced youtube video full of stock footage and backed by royalty free music about how amazing my life is and all my problems are solved now that I've given up the hooch. ;)
Either that or I'll have a thread on overcoming LaCroix addiction. :D
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I've spent 5-6 months AF this year. I haven't had a drink yet in December, but allowing myself to indulge while I'm home at Christmas. I don't usually drink much while visiting my family, but a few years ago my sister started the tradition of serving mimosas on Christmas morning, and my brother likes to make fancy cocktails when he hosts family gatherings.
Since finishing my 2 special bottles earlier this year, I have succeeded in not drinking at home, which is my plan going forward.
Over the summer, I had 2 instances where I drank - once at a bar to watch a sports match, and once at work's closing night dinner where there was free leftover alcohol. In both instances, I had 2 drinks (2 beers, 2 glasses of wine). The thing I need to remember going forward is HOW BAD the 2nd drink made me feel. At the time, it seemed like a good idea. But I really need to hold it to one drink, no matter how long the event lasts.
Other than that, I still have had no noticeable effects from limiting my drinking (so I'm counting on the effects I don't notice). It's possible my face looks a little better, but I don't spend much time on my appearance, so I'm not sure, and people have always thought I looked younger than I am.
I did try my first Athletic Brewing Co "beer" last week - at my volunteer gig of all places. I went into the fridge for a sparkling water, and saw them. I skipped it the first time ("beer" at "work"??), but the next week I decided to use the opportunity to try it. I liked it (except for the part where my breath was beer-y at work)! Wish the establishments around here would carry them, but I haven't found one yet :(
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I've had one drink this year at a social event, and will probably have another at Christmas. Getting older, I'm finding that it impacts my recovery time from exercise in a noticeable way.
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I hit 10 years sober in November.
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I hit 10 years sober in November.
That's brilliant, congratulations.
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I hit 10 years sober in November.
Awesome!!
I'm 4 years in a few weeks.
This past year has really driven home the shift from being an ex-drinker to being a non-drinker, to now just not giving it much thought and certainly not conceptualizing any of my identity in relation to a beverage I'm not interested in. It's kind of like how I'm not a juggler or a spoon collector, but I don't think much about those things either, lol.
I did have several moments of profound gratitude for being an established non-drinker, because if I were a drinker, I would have had A LOT of excuses to drink too much. That said, I did spend nearly half the year on opioids, and the first third is super blurry.
The other reason I'm quite grateful to not drink is that I have been put on a prescription for life that cannot be taken with alcohol. Because I already thought about alcohol about as much as I thought about collecting spoons, it was a total non-issue for me.
So yeah, it seems that the longer I don't drink, the less relevant it feels that I don't drink, except when really important stuff comes up that reminds me just how much worse things would be if I were a drinker.
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I hit 10 years sober in November.
Awesome!!
I'm 4 years in a few weeks.
This past year has really driven home the shift from being an ex-drinker to being a non-drinker, to now just not giving it much thought and certainly not conceptualizing any of my identity in relation to a beverage I'm not interested in. It's kind of like how I'm not a juggler or a spoon collector, but I don't think much about those things either, lol.
I did have several moments of profound gratitude for being an established non-drinker, because if I were a drinker, I would have had A LOT of excuses to drink too much. That said, I did spend nearly half the year on opioids, and the first third is super blurry.
The other reason I'm quite grateful to not drink is that I have been put on a prescription for life that cannot be taken with alcohol. Because I already thought about alcohol about as much as I thought about collecting spoons, it was a total non-issue for me.
So yeah, it seems that the longer I don't drink, the less relevant it feels that I don't drink, except when really important stuff comes up that reminds me just how much worse things would be if I were a drinker.
Agreed. It's not really a part of my identity anymore. I do still go to group (Lifering, not AA), but it's more to offer support for others than fighting any demons of my own.
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I had a tiny amount of alcohol (like a ridiculously small amount of champagne in a glass so I could refill it with sparkling water at a work event) and I felt like crap for 2 days after! How did I ever drink this poison regularly! I must've been young and bulletproof, or just oblivious to how crappy I felt most of the time. Never going back, just like I'm not going to pick up my Taco Bell habit again either :)
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I had a tiny amount of alcohol (like a ridiculously small amount of champagne in a glass so I could refill it with sparkling water at a work event) and I felt like crap for 2 days after! How did I ever drink this poison regularly! I must've been young and bulletproof, or just oblivious to how crappy I felt most of the time. Never going back, just like I'm not going to pick up my Taco Bell habit again either :)
It is funny when you stop regular drinking how noticeable the effects are.
My husband no longer drinks regularly. He had a second beer out to dinner last night and then had the 3 a.m. anxiety wakefulness, even though he went to bed feeling fine several hours after drinking those beers.
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How long does it take to lose tolerance to alcohol? I stopped drinking for 9 months a few years ago. Noticed that I did have a lower tolerance when I started again, but it was nothing like feeling bad after a glass of champaign or getting drunk after a couple of beers
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How long does it take to lose tolerance to alcohol? I stopped drinking for 9 months a few years ago. Noticed that I did have a lower tolerance when I started again, but it was nothing like feeling bad after a glass of champaign or getting drunk after a couple of beers
My understanding is that after two months of abstinence your body is no longer accustomed to the poison . . . so your tolerance should be about as low as it ever will be.
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How long does it take to lose tolerance to alcohol? I stopped drinking for 9 months a few years ago. Noticed that I did have a lower tolerance when I started again, but it was nothing like feeling bad after a glass of champaign or getting drunk after a couple of beers
My understanding is that after two months of abstinence your body is no longer accustomed to the poison . . . so your tolerance should be about as low as it ever will be.
Yeah, that's my impression. I rarely drink now, just a few occasions every year. I never had super high tolerance even when drinking regularly... I'd get a buzz after 2 drinks, notably impaired after 3. Nowadays it's a buzz after 1, notably impaired after 2. Which I think is likely how I was way back in the day when I started drinking. I can't really compare hangovers b/c I've only had a handful of hangovers in my life, despite decades of daily drinking. My impression is that even 1-2 drinks really disrupts sleep now in a way that 3 used to.
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NotJen, I love Running Wild made by the Athletic Brewing Company. I love the taste of beer and this is a rare AF beer that has great taste. Plus it’s low in calories. I spent most of my life as a non-drinker until I married for the third time at 50 and my husband convinced me to begin. It was a bad idea as it interfered with my sleep and made me fat. I’m now at 3.5 years.
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I've been drinking pretty minimally lately (something like 1-3 drinks per week), and am planning to fully commit to Dry January. Then I'll potentially keep it rolling for a few months since I have so many auditions in the first few months of the new year.
Lately when I have been drinking, I've been trying to err towards drinking earlier in the evening (5-7) so that my body has more time to process it out before I go to bed. I recently had a couple drinks after a show and it totally ruined my sleep and half the next day. The timing really makes a huge difference.
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I've been drinking pretty minimally lately (something like 1-3 drinks per week), and am planning to fully commit to Dry January. Then I'll potentially keep it rolling for a few months since I have so many auditions in the first few months of the new year.
Lately when I have been drinking, I've been trying to err towards drinking earlier in the evening (5-7) so that my body has more time to process it out before I go to bed. I recently had a couple drinks after a show and it totally ruined my sleep and half the next day. The timing really makes a huge difference.
A couple weeks ago I was traveling with a friend who is a near teetotaler, so I limited myself to a few drinks, spaced out between lunch and dinner. It was a good chance to experiment with my last drink and sleep quality. I need to finish around 630p to get a good night's rest by 10p, maybe 730p if it's just one small drink.
I had my last drink on Dec 21 and I'll stay sober through January. I also have 6 mo. and 1 yr. in mind to see if long-term makes a difference. I'm in a weird spot right now with job searching and I want to make sure I'm operating at 100% at all times.
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I’ve had a really great 2023 and I know it’s definitely been supported by being totally AF. I haven’t had any alcohol since early March 2022 and honestly I’ve achieved so much since then!
I’m sharing this in case someone is reading and is considering trying to give up alcohol…for so long I tried to “cut back”. I wish I had appreciated then how much better my life w/o alcohol would be, as I would have done it SO much sooner. The scary part is that I wasn’t a huge drinker. It was a wine with dinner type of thing and only more than 1 glass at specific social gatherings or special occasions. I rarely drank any hard liquor (a handful of times over a 10 year period). And yet, cutting it out has been SO beneficial!
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I’ve had a really great 2023 and I know it’s definitely been supported by being totally AF. I haven’t had any alcohol since early March 2022 and honestly I’ve achieved so much since then!
I’m sharing this in case someone is reading and is considering trying to give up alcohol…for so long I tried to “cut back”. I wish I had appreciated then how much better my life w/o alcohol would be, as I would have done it SO much sooner. The scary part is that I wasn’t a huge drinker. It was a wine with dinner type of thing and only more than 1 glass at specific social gatherings or special occasions. I rarely drank any hard liquor (a handful of times over a 10 year period). And yet, cutting it out has been SO beneficial!
My 2023 has been an onslaught of horror that I need a specialized therapist to help me process. I can't tell you how many times I've been grateful that I don't drink this year.
I wasn't a heavy drinker, but I was someone who loved a glass of wine after work to de-stress. That's basic self-medication, and self-medication habits can turn into raging addiction so easily when life gets incredibly hard. We saw this during the pandemic when so many "moderate" drinkers had the wheels fall off their drinking and careen into full destructive addiction.
Not only that, but I've written about this many times in this thread, but being someone who drank in response to stress made my brain lower my capacity to tolerate stress. My stress response to anything really difficult would be amped up because that was the most reliable way to get me to pour a glass of wine.
Over years of being a regular wine "decompression" drinker, my system calibrated itself to produce maximal intolerance of certain forms of stress. It was like clockwork, I would be pretty much fine at work and then around 3pm my ability to cope with the stresses of my very stressful work would plummet, and my headache would amp up.
This just made sense to me, working a 10-11 hr day at an insane pace doing high-pressure work is bound to wear you down by the end of the day. Nothing seemed odd about that. But once I quit the pattern was so obvious. Two hours before I was scheduled to decide whether or not to pour a glass of wine, my brain would reduce my capacity to cope with stress.
Because yeah, I was always trying to "cut back" so it was always a question whether or not I would have wine when I got home. I would always have wine on days where I felt totally overwhelmed at the end of the day and too fried to forgo my "decompression" glass or two, which were like a magical tension release.
I now understand that it was a trick. The sense of overwhelm was fake, I can readily handle the kind of stress I was under at the time. I've handled much, much worse since with less effort. AND the tension release was a trick too, that wasn't the alcohol, that was the brain chemicals that my brain dumped to reward me for drinking. This is obvious because the tension release began with smelling the wine and the first sip, well before the active ingredients too effect.
So had I faced 2023 a stress-drinker??
Fuuuuck.
I would likely have become an excessive drinker because I had all the epic excuses in the world to justify soothing my stress. AND I would have systematically deconstructed my capacity to cope with the overwhelming stresses of this past year.
Lastly, when I was drinking the most was during the last time that my life was incredibly stressful, and distressing with a few glasses of wine every night allowed me to detach from my stresses and cope with them privately. I systematically withdrew from everyone I was close to because it was too difficult to discuss what I was going through. It made me very private and isolated in my coping.
Not having ANY means to detach from my experiences this year has forced me to lean heavily on my loved ones, be more vulnerable and open with them and ask for help over and over to get me through. The net result is that despite a horror show of a year, ALL of my closest relationships have thrived and grown substantially. I feel closer and more loving to every single person I care about and they literally ALL know every detail of what I've been through and how it has impacted me emotionally.
Lastly, not having self-medication as an option, I've been forced to find healthy alternatives that produce the same brain dump of soothing endogenous neurotransmitters and cascades of hormones that drinking used to trigger. Even severely disabled, I've spent an enormous amount of this year engaging in whatever exercise that I could, spending A LOT of time in overwhelmingly beautiful nature, and really investing in creating romantic moments with my spouse, even when I was in the hospital.
So as unbelievably challenging as my year has been, it's also been AWESOME.
And yeah, having previous extremely challenging years to compare it to, I can pretty much say that not drinking was a determining factor in the year being unfathomably hard, but overall pretty great compared to the pure torture-porn it could have been.
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I have been experimenting with seeing what life is like without the normal everyday vices.
I was a heavy caffeine drinker until 3 months ago, now just have the occasional cup of tea
Now been completely sober for over 3 weeks now, from moderately heavy regular usage around 25 or so units a week, I'd imagine.
Feel fine. Actually better than fine. The decaffeination took a few days to adjust to. I never considered myself anything that could remotely be labelled as a functional alcoholic, and that remains the case weather I drink any or not.
My reasons for both were simply that I wanted to confirm that I knew exactly who I was with or without the caffeine & booze.
No idea how long I will maintain it. Could be another week, but could be another year.
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I have been experimenting with seeing what life is like without the normal everyday vices.
I was a heavy caffeine drinker until 3 months ago, now just have the occasional cup of tea
Now been completely sober for over 3 weeks now, from moderately heavy regular usage around 25 or so units a week, I'd imagine.
Feel fine. Actually better than fine. The decaffeination took a few days to adjust to. I never considered myself anything that could remotely be labelled as a functional alcoholic, and that remains the case weather I drink any or not.
My reasons for both were simply that I wanted to confirm that I knew exactly who I was with or without the caffeine & booze.
No idea how long I will maintain it. Could be another week, but could be another year.
Yeah, I quit coffee shortly after quitting alcohol just to see.
I had loved coffee as much or more than I loved wine, but getting rid of wine made me acutely aware of my addiction to coffee.
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Bumpity bump....
Started a 30 day booze free run a few days ago. Ski season is kind of a bust so far, so without that outlet, these long dark nights+Bell's Hopslam season could get really ugly. But looking long term, the growing amount of research on the health concerns with alcohol consumption are making me consider some long term change.
Going smoothly so far. I expect by middle of next week I'll have an overproduced youtube video full of stock footage and backed by royalty free music about how amazing my life is and all my problems are solved now that I've given up the hooch. ;)
Either that or I'll have a thread on overcoming LaCroix addiction. :D
Closing in on the home stretch here. Had a couple of stumbles- a glass of champagne on christmas day and a couple of beers on new year's eve. We hosted a bonfire at our house on NYE and usually that would be a cue for some pretty unhinged alcohol consumption on my part, so two beers is very much a win.
No profound changes noted as of yet, but I am sleeping like I'm going into hibernation. Usually I'm a 7.5-8 hours of sleep a night guy, but lately I've been sleeping up to 9 hours pretty regularly and even 14(?!!!) after a pretty hard day of mountain biking.
Not really missing my old habitual consumption, but I'm looking forward to a couple après ski beers if we ever get some snow. Hoping I can keep my greatly reduced consumption going forward for some time.
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I'm proud do say that I've been sober since the beginning of this year!
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I'm proud do say that I've been sober since the beginning of this year!
Woohoo! It starts to fly by.
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Inspired by a friend a few days ago, decided on a whim to do a dry January.
I completely stopped drinking for 8 months in 2023, reintroduced it sparingly (1-2 drinks a week) for a few months successfully but the holidays brought more imbibing than I wish to partake in long term. Using January as a reset and going back to more sporadic consumption for the rest of the year.
FWIW I felt no negative impacts at the couple of beers, couple of times a month level. It's just a matter of not slipping back into old bad habits.........which definitely is easier to stick to if it's not even an option (full on teetotaler mode).
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You could clearly see the lower energy levels in my normally high intensity marital arts classes around xmass and new years when people were eating like shit and drinking a ton. Normally very energetic people were literally on the ground between intervals.
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You could clearly see the lower energy levels in my normally high intensity marital arts classes around xmass and new years when people were eating like shit and drinking a ton. Normally very energetic people were literally on the ground between intervals.
I was one of them!
Wife says my diet of just cookies for two weeks is deleterious to physical performance. I think that more experimentation is warranted.
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Just stopping by to recommend the St. Agrestis phony cocktails if you are a person who likes bitter drinks.
I like both their Phony Negroni and their Amaro Falso.
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I realized that I've probably never had a booze free month in my entire adult life, now closing in on that first month. Not a heavy drinker of sorts, but realized that having a few beers in the afternoon from Fri to Sun left me pretty lethargic. Some food for thought for the rest of the year. Might just keep this up for a while and only stick to homebrews to increase the hurdle a bit (and appreciate the drink that much more).
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I'm about a month late celebrating 3 years booze free!
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I've been drinking pretty minimally lately (something like 1-3 drinks per week), and am planning to fully commit to Dry January. Then I'll potentially keep it rolling for a few months since I have so many auditions in the first few months of the new year.
Lately when I have been drinking, I've been trying to err towards drinking earlier in the evening (5-7) so that my body has more time to process it out before I go to bed. I recently had a couple drinks after a show and it totally ruined my sleep and half the next day. The timing really makes a huge difference.
A couple weeks ago I was traveling with a friend who is a near teetotaler, so I limited myself to a few drinks, spaced out between lunch and dinner. It was a good chance to experiment with my last drink and sleep quality. I need to finish around 630p to get a good night's rest by 10p, maybe 730p if it's just one small drink.
I had my last drink on Dec 21 and I'll stay sober through January. I also have 6 mo. and 1 yr. in mind to see if long-term makes a difference. I'm in a weird spot right now with job searching and I want to make sure I'm operating at 100% at all times.
Coming up on one month tomorrow and I'm still going strong despite a fair share of temptations: 1) Getting the flu in a foreign country, wanting a toddy when I couldn't get proper cough meds. 2) A few airports and a couple 10+ hour flights, in coach. 3) A week at my parent's house. 4) An Airbnb welcome bottle of wine perfectly matched to my flavor prefs.
Overall I think I have more energy, lower anxiety, and slightly improved sleep, so I'll keep on it for a while longer.
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I hadn't really intended just plain quit, or even do a dry January thing, but I haven't had a drink in about two weeks and now I would rather just make it a permanent thing.
The alcohol was always a net negative in my life, even though I kept to a level that didn't prevent from achieving most of my goals (FIRE'd, lots of great outdoor activities, family, etc.). It's just that there only seem to be two levels that I seem to be able to settle into: none or more than I think is good, healthy, and financially responsible. I don't seem to be able to settle into a middle path of moderation at a level that I'm happy with, so for now I'm on the "none" train.
I didn't experience any physical withdrawal symptoms, but I did notice some moments of irrational anxiety that I think might have been a withdrawal symptom - it's hard to say. I can't say that I feel dramatically better - hopefully that's because I've always felt pretty good thanks to keeping enough of a lid on it. I do feel a tad more clarity and ability to pause and reflect before opening my mouth, so that's a good thing. Mostly I'm looking forward to not having to criticize myself for not being able to find a workable path of moderation. Some of the information shared here has been very helpful in putting into perspective some of the mental gyrations you go through and the tricks your reward system plays on you.
Best wishes of success to all!
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I hadn't really intended just plain quit, or even do a dry January thing, but I haven't had a drink in about two weeks and now I would rather just make it a permanent thing.
The alcohol was always a net negative in my life, even though I kept to a level that didn't prevent from achieving most of my goals (FIRE'd, lots of great outdoor activities, family, etc.). It's just that there only seem to be two levels that I seem to be able to settle into: none or more than I think is good, healthy, and financially responsible. I don't seem to be able to settle into a middle path of moderation at a level that I'm happy with, so for now I'm on the "none" train.
I didn't experience any physical withdrawal symptoms, but I did notice some moments of irrational anxiety that I think might have been a withdrawal symptom - it's hard to say. I can't say that I feel dramatically better - hopefully that's because I've always felt pretty good thanks to keeping enough of a lid on it. I do feel a tad more clarity and ability to pause and reflect before opening my mouth, so that's a good thing. Mostly I'm looking forward to not having to criticize myself for not being able to find a workable path of moderation. Some of the information shared here has been very helpful in putting into perspective some of the mental gyrations you go through and the tricks your reward system plays on you.
Best wishes of success to all!
I was similar. If you are anything like me, you will be really pleasantly surprised how positive the experience of discarding it becomes after the initial couple of months of getting over that psychological crutch and 'mental noise'.
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I was similar. If you are anything like me, you will be really pleasantly surprised how positive the experience of discarding it becomes after the initial couple of months of getting over that psychological crutch and 'mental noise'.
Thanks for that. I think the longest non-drinking stretch I've had since about 1999 is six weeks. There have been lots of shorter gaps, but hopefully I'll get to the "initial couple of months" you mention.
Oddly, in previous one-week or one-month breaks I have noticed most of the usual positive effects: better sleep, energy, clarity, etc. This time around I'm having poorer sleep, sometimes a lingering headache, and laziness. The laziness is easing off as I'm more motivated to get out on my bike as the days go by. The poorer sleep is a surprise. It used to be that I could feel the big differences in sleep quality on a day I had had a drink compared to a day when I hadn't even when they were back-to-back. For the last few days I've been going to bed relatively early (which could be a factor) and then waking up at 3am and not falling back to sleep for a few hours; it could be due to something totally unrelated that I just haven't identified. Ironically, this is making avoiding alcohol easier. Usually after a week or two without I would be feeling so good that I thought a glass of wine would make it even better (one of those sneaky brain tricks, I now understand).
I've been reading about the effects of alcohol, even amounts well below the usual thresholds of "heavy" drinking, on blood pressure and resting heart rate. I have noticed that my blood pressure has fallen right back into pretty ideal territory, which is an effect I have noticed before, and probably my strongest motivation. I looked up the effect on resting heart rate because mine has dropped from the low 50s to around 45, sometimes as low as 42. What I read said that regular alcohol consumption raises your resting heart rate somewhere around 5bpm, so that checks out. Still, I'm pretty surprised at 42. I think the lowest I remember ever recording for myself, not that I have checked it all that regularly, is 38 back when I was about 21 years old and doing triathlons.
Another thing thing alcohol does is reduce heart-rate variability (HRV) which I gather isn't fully accepted as a meaningful health measure, but variability in time between each individual beat is correlated with better health outcomes, whereas very evenly timed beats are a bad sign. This is pretty much an unrelated aside, but it's just fascinating. One of many reasons the rate would be variable is that our respiration rate is on a different frequency than our heart rate, oxygen flowing into our system rises and falls say every four or five heartbeats and a healthy heartbeat is moving up and down with that in a small but measurable way. Alcohol decreases that variability.
It's interesting how significant the effects of alcohol are on heart health. I guess referring to wine as "Italian Gatorade" when I was training for marathons was off-base.
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The science is in. Alcohol is poison at any level.
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I have been experimenting with seeing what life is like without the normal everyday vices.
I was a heavy caffeine drinker until 3 months ago, now just have the occasional cup of tea
Now been completely sober for over 3 weeks now, from moderately heavy regular usage around 25 or so units a week, I'd imagine.
Feel fine. Actually better than fine. The decaffeination took a few days to adjust to. I never considered myself anything that could remotely be labelled as a functional alcoholic, and that remains the case weather I drink any or not.
My reasons for both were simply that I wanted to confirm that I knew exactly who I was with or without the caffeine & booze.
No idea how long I will maintain it. Could be another week, but could be another year.
4 months sober (and 6 months no coffee) and I don't miss it one little bit.
The monetary benefits aren't insignificant, but the health and mental benefits are considerable.
Wouldn't say it was life-changing, but definitely life-enhancing in many small and subtle ways.
What was quite an eye opener was how binge drinking is still a thing - job I've recently started, it's quite a boozy culture, and one Friday lunchtime we hit the pub were anything between 3-5 pints was consumed amongst various team members... I stuck to soda water... definitely would have been going sideways if I had even had half of what some guys necked back.
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A year ago today I started the #75 Hard Challenge (Fitness/Lifestyle) and made it the full 75 days. Challenge requirements were as follows:
Stick to a diet. ...
Drink a gallon of water every day.
No cheat meals or alcohol for the full 75 days consecutively.
Exercise twice a day for 45 minutes each time, with at least one session happening outside.
Read 10 pages of a book every day. ...
Take a progress picture every day.
The no alcohol portion really stuck. Prior to the challenge, I was probably drinking 4-5 nights a week. Usually a couple (high alcohol content) beers, or a couple old fashions or margaritas. Based on the alcohol contents of my beers and how strong we’d make our drinks, I would have technically fallen into the “heavy drinking” category, just barely. I still got up at 5:30 a.m. many days and ran/worked out/etc.
Today has officially been 1 year of zero alcohol. I feel really good overall and while I certainly get the urge on some occasions, they’re pretty few and far between. My sleep and exercise has improved a ton.
I’ve thought about bringing it back in for certain occasions, but know I would want really hard boundaries around it. Every time I think about what those boundaries are, I realize it’s probably easier to just not drink than come up with a boundary for practically every scenario (which is about the only way I’d want to do it).
I don’t think that I’ll never drink again, but don’t yet know when the next time will come along.
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Today has officially been 1 year of zero alcohol. I feel really good overall and while I certainly get the urge on some occasions, they’re pretty few and far between. My sleep and exercise has improved a ton.
Congrats!! This is huge.
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Today has officially been 1 year of zero alcohol. I feel really good overall and while I certainly get the urge on some occasions, they’re pretty few and far between. My sleep and exercise has improved a ton.
I’ve thought about bringing it back in for certain occasions, but know I would want really hard boundaries around it. Every time I think about what those boundaries are, I realize it’s probably easier to just not drink than come up with a boundary for practically every scenario (which is about the only way I’d want to do it).
I don’t think that I’ll never drink again, but don’t yet know when the next time will come along.
Congratulations on the 1 year mark!
I felt the same way about it as you describe in your second paragraph - just easier to not drink at all.
Your last sentence was exactly where I was at around the 1 year mark. Now that I recently passed two years fully AF (earlier this month), I’m actually thinking that I may never drink again. The allure of it is just not there.
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I've really enjoyed being a model of fun sobriety for multiple folks in the last year, which is a massive change from us being a fun model of drinking. DH and I were well known as "wine people" who could easily show up anywhere with a case of champagne just to make an event more "fun."
Last night, for the third time in the past year, someone we were out to dinner with was about a month sober and hadn't realized until that point that we don't drink.
We quit during the pandemic and started spending half the year on a remote island, so many people we know have no idea that we don't drink anymore. Lol. Which means people still, 4.5 years later, give me expensive bottles of wine as gifts because it used to be the *only* gift I would accept.
Each of these dinners have been with someone who has taken a matter of weeks off of drinking because they have an active problem. They're doing a "Dry January" type of break hoping to "reset," which really isn't enough for someone whose drinking has been so bad that their spouse asked them to take action, which was the case with all 3 folks I'm talking about.
In each case, this was their first night out, their first major challenge socializing in a fancy environment where the norm is to splurge on really nice drinks. So for them to show up and be in great sober company, which is the last thing they expected, and have open, joyful conversation about how fabulous and fun sobriety is, just makes me so, so happy, because in all 3 cases they have been SO relieved and obviously felt really validated in what they're doing.
DH and I have influenced a lot of people around us to either stop drinking or extremely minimize, but being able to support someone early in their sobriety when they were expecting us, specifically, to be a challenge, is just really, really nice.
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In each case, this was their first night out, their first major challenge socializing in a fancy environment where the norm is to splurge on really nice drinks. So for them to show up and be in great sober company, which is the last thing they expected, and have open, joyful conversation about how fabulous and fun sobriety is, just makes me so, so happy, because in all 3 cases they have been SO relieved and obviously felt really validated in what they're doing.
DH and I have influenced a lot of people around us to either stop drinking or extremely minimize, but being able to support someone early in their sobriety when they were expecting us, specifically, to be a challenge, is just really, really nice.
This is wonderful!
I had my own feel-good moment recently for having supported someone:
When I was a few months into my own reset, I had brunch with an old friend I don't see much anymore (we have maybe one or two hangouts a year), and during the meal I talked about how I had drastically cut back my drinking, and why, including references to some podcasts and books I'm come across that gave me new insights into why alcohol can be so destructive.
He seemed politely interested, but not unusually so, and then we moved on to another topic, so I didn't think this was something he cared much about.
Then late last year (several months after this brunch), he called me out of the blue, and he told me he'd looked up the podcasts and books I mentioned, and he and his husband had both quit, thrown away all their booze, and sevearal months later it had completely changed their lives for the better and he wanted to let me know what a difference that conversation had made for him.
It was such a great feeling.
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On the flip side, people who are newly sober can be annoyingly flakey! I really don't care if you're trying to get or stay sober and 'accidentally have a drink'. In fact, it can be a great time to discuss the whole thing. But instead, people clam up and disappear and then I'm left wondering what to do. Usually I just let it go until they decide to pop back up... similar to going booze free in the first place, people have to want these things themselves, I just make myself as available and open as possible... Sorry, just venting a bit
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On the flip side, people who are newly sober can be annoyingly flakey! I really don't care if you're trying to get or stay sober and 'accidentally have a drink'. In fact, it can be a great time to discuss the whole thing. But instead, people clam up and disappear and then I'm left wondering what to do. Usually I just let it go until they decide to pop back up... similar to going booze free in the first place, people have to want these things themselves, I just make myself as available and open as possible... Sorry, just venting a bit
That's the thing, all you can do is be a positive model for them and *maybe* be a positive influence.
I don't see the above behaviour as "flaky" but more as very predictable based on the process of addiction/recovery/relapse/shame that very, very commonly happens.
That said, I also have a boundary where I will casually socialize with, but will not intimately get involved with people who are in addiction recovery. There are very, very few people who I would actively engage in the recovery process outside of a professional context where I'm being paid to do so.
I'll happily provide a friend a model of happy sobriety and resources if they want them, but I don't get invested in people's recovery unless I'm paid to do so and operating within strict professional/emotional boundaries.
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6 weeks until our trip to Peru for some trekking. Planning to go booze free until then and go from there. Pretty much been a daily drinker for the past 30+ years, took some time off here and there but 6 weeks would be longest AF. Three days in now and already feeling much better!