Continued: Getting rid of stuff / Clearing out clutter! PART 2

[lazycow]

I want to start relearning the piano and I need to have a clean house and clear brain with nothing nagging at me and the photos were the last project. I bought at full weighted keyboard and donated the mini one I started with to a friend.

I have been procrastinating about learning to play my Casio piano keyboard. I even have a book of popular piano music I can reference. I must get to it soon. I think my problem is that, in my 'real' feelings, I consider it a waste of time (even though it isn't).

Why do we feel like that slackmax? Music is such a wonderful gift to ourselves. I am going to make it my September goal to allow 30 minutes a day to practice (time - let's face it - that would otherwise be spent scrolling through my phone).

[slackmax]

I want to start relearning the piano and I need to have a clean house and clear brain with nothing nagging at me and the photos were the last project. I bought at full weighted keyboard and donated the mini one I started with to a friend.

I have been procrastinating about learning to play my Casio piano keyboard. I even have a book of popular piano music I can reference. I must get to it soon. I think my problem is that, in my 'real' feelings, I consider it a waste of time (even though it isn't).

Why do we feel like that slackmax? Music is such a wonderful gift to ourselves. I am going to make it my September goal to allow 30 minutes a day to practice (time - let's face it - that would otherwise be spent scrolling through my phone).

I think, with me, it's leftover from the days of having only x amount of energy, all of which had to be used for working and saving money and any 'luxury' was a waste of energy.

I just have to get out of that mentality. I'm retired now.

Even before I read your latest post, I was planning to plug in the casio and play for at least 15 minutes, using the book of music I found. 

OK, right after I get offline, I'll plug in the casio.   

[Raenia]

Well, this has been a hell of a weekend for decluttering.
 - Moved a pile of items from the repair/projects bag to the donate bag - including the bag I was using to store them :P
 - Got DH to finally go through his clothes, he added a few things to the pile
 - DH agreed to get rid of an end table that was waiting for a repair - we have plenty of end tables, and it was a complicated fix\
 - Disassembled a desk to salvage the nicest pieces of wood, chucked the rest

Not really decluttering, but we had contractors out to do mold remediation - stripping the walls, floor, and ceiling down to studs, treating everything for mold and dry rot.  Once that's done, we can seal up some holes, add insulation, and rehang drywall and put in the new floors that we've been planning for a year now.  It'll be such a relief to 'declutter' tasks that have been waiting months.

Downside, one of the contractors put his foot through the ceiling of our bedroom, so we're now sleeping on an inflatable mattress in the living room (which is also DH's work-from-home office) until further notice.  And I don't dare cook anything until they're done and we can clean up all the contaminated dust.

[Loretta]

Before I donate some more sheets to Goodwill, does anyone have any tricks to make pilled up microfiber sheets less annoying?  Or a trick to make the silicone-y feel of microfiber sheets go away in the wash?  I think I have washed these things in every detergent at my disposal this year to no real avail.  I washed them in Oxiclean and white vinegar Saturday and have them backwards-side-up so the slightly pilled up part is away from my skin. 

[PMG]

Goodwill is the only solution for microfiber sheets.

[shrimpwd]

Sold one item I listed last week. Haven't gotten much traffic on the others. I'll give it another week or so and then drop the prices 10%. I'm not going to let them sit beyond the end of the year.

Still waiting for the porch to get cleared - a bit annoying, having to wait for others before I can do my own organization...

[Frugal Lizard]

Goodwill is the only solution for microfiber sheets.

I agree.  I hate anything that pills.  I can barely tolerate flannel but my partner loves it so I cope.

[MaybeBabyMustache]

Closet cleanout continues. I am forcing myself to wear all summer clothes. If they don't fit properly, don't fit my COVID life & I can't imagine wearing them in the next two years, are too young for me (I'm 44, and have a bunch of stuff that's 15+ years old, etc)... it's all getting donated or sold.

-Another tank top to the donation pile
-A dress to the sell pile, and already listed on eBay

[MountainGal]

This weekend:

~Moved 2 boxes and 3 grocery bags of tax documents into my home office closet where they make more sense
~Put the grocery bag tax documents into a box for neater storage
~Tossed 2012 tax documents into the burn bin
~Neatened up my documents in the fireproof safe
~Ordered a soda can and one other bin for the fridge
~Made room for the above bins
~Tossed the old bottle cleaning brush

[Frugal Lizard]

This weekend we started a list of household items my son is going to need for his apartment at university.  He is moving into off campus housing on the labour day weekend and is going to need to cook and clean for himself.  Or should I say eat and live in something less than squalor with his four room mates.  I am going to go through the cupboards and outfit him as much as I can from our stockpile.  YEAH!

[catlady]

I am slowly putting babe's old clothes for sale. We have no friends with babies so nobody to pass them on. On one hand I love decluttering on the other this is end of a chapter. I now have a toddler :)

[Sibley]

Gave 2 partial gallons of primer to a neighbor. These are specialized primers, and are left over from specific projects. I don't foresee any other projects requiring or tolerating these specialized primers. Neighbor is starting a project which will use these. Out of my house.

Same neighbor was also kind enough to help me with a small project, I don't have the skill to cut the material and he does. Cut, installed, done.

[lazycow]

After spending a couple of hours Googling how to fix my inoperable laptop keyboard (it *is* 8 years old, so possibly expecting too much from it?) I threw in the towel and consigned it to be donated to my local e-waste recyclers, along with the above-mentioned digital camera. I performed a very satisfying smashing of the hard drive first. So now I have 1 Android phone and 1 laptop, and that is all I need.

The next project will be to ferret out the VCR player my husband has stashed in the shed, along with our 28 year-old wedding video and see if it will still play. If not, they are both for recycling.

[PMG]

@lazycow I’m gonna make a suggestion, but obviously it’s an internet stranger suggestion, so likely irrelevant.

A cheap Bluetooth keyboard might pair with the laptop and make it useful again? If not for you, then for someone doing homeschool this year? I’m guessing it’s less crazy in Australia than here in the states, but laptops are in demand right now.

[former player]

3 bags of books gone with a friend for sale at the next church coffee morning, whenever that is.  Given that the friend is storing them and they are out of my spare bedroom, it's still a win for decluttering.

I've also decluttered some of my fabric stash into two new facemasks for a total of 4.  I needed the extra as we now have to wear them in shops here in the UK: if I ever do the sort of shopping trip that involves more than two shops at a time I will be properly prepared.

[slackmax]

Lazycow,

I found some 20 year old VHS videos of relatives, and they played beautifully on my VCR. Amazing how long the tapes last if stored properly.

And I used to see VCR's at Goodwill for $10. Haven't seen any lately, though. And, lastly, around here in eastern Pa you can even get your VCR repaired, probably for $50, if it's just belts being replaced.   

 

[midweststache]

We moved a receive almost four years ago, intending to hook it up to our "new" place's surround sound.

That never happened. I have someone coming by to pick it up later today. HALLELUJAH!

[MaybeBabyMustache]

Found a pair of shoes to donate, & two tops to sell. The pandemic is definitely making me re-evaluate all of my clothing, & realize how much less I actually need.

[okisok]

Dumped out all of my dog's toys to see which ones she actually likes to play with. Washed and dried to whole batch, then sorted the keepers. Put the discards in a bag to donate, as they're all in great shape but just not loved any more. Now her toys all fit in the basket instead of spilling out all over.

Continuing the stationery declutter by sending out postcards and cards to friends. It's so nice to get mail that isn't junk or bills.

[happy]

I'm trying to ride the momentum of big council cleanup late July, and then the chemical cleanout in early August. After that a big pile of boxes/bags with items to donate quickly accumulated in the place reserved for such things. This is good, but I didn't get long to enjoy the clean space I'd created.  Instead of filling me with glee every time I looked at it, I just felt depressed at the thought of yet another ginormous load of stuff to remove. I sulked for a week or so, but now have pulled myself together. I have decided to declutter an hour a day, capped at 5 hours a week. Time spent removing the rubbish/decluttered items will be included: hopefully this will help as I often find actually getting stuff of the premises is what is slowing me down.  I'm gunning to go room by room, section by section if necessary and not stop until I've done a complete sweep of the house. 

[LaineyAZ]

I'm trying to ride the momentum of big council cleanup late July, and then the chemical cleanout in early August. After that a big pile of boxes/bags with items to donate quickly accumulated in the place reserved for such things. This is good, but I didn't get long to enjoy the clean space I'd created.  Instead of filling me with glee every time I looked at it, I just felt depressed at the thought of yet another ginormous load of stuff to remove. I sulked for a week or so, but now have pulled myself together. I have decided to declutter an hour a day, capped at 5 hours a week. Time spent removing the rubbish/decluttered items will be included: hopefully this will help as I often find actually getting stuff of the premises is what is slowing me down.  I'm gunning to go room by room, section by section if necessary and not stop until I've done a complete sweep of the house.

I think that you've got a good plan, happy.  Good luck with everything, and come back here in a few months to post progress so we can congratulate you!

[slackmax]

Happy, good luck. It sounds like you are getting a lot of big stuff off the premises.

 

 

[oneday]

I'm trying to ride the momentum of big council cleanup late July, and then the chemical cleanout in early August. After that a big pile of boxes/bags with items to donate quickly accumulated in the place reserved for such things. This is good, but I didn't get long to enjoy the clean space I'd created.  Instead of filling me with glee every time I looked at it, I just felt depressed at the thought of yet another ginormous load of stuff to remove. I sulked for a week or so, but now have pulled myself together. I have decided to declutter an hour a day, capped at 5 hours a week. Time spent removing the rubbish/decluttered items will be included: hopefully this will help as I often find actually getting stuff of the premises is what is slowing me down.  I'm gunning to go room by room, section by section if necessary and not stop until I've done a complete sweep of the house.

Keep fighting the good fight!  The goal is in sight! Or is it more correct to say the goal is to get stuff out of sight?

[Poundwise]

Time spent removing the rubbish/decluttered items will be included: hopefully this will help as I often find actually getting stuff of the premises is what is slowing me down.  I'm gunning to go room by room, section by section if necessary and not stop until I've done a complete sweep of the house.

So true, I have lots of stuff that psychologically I said goodbye to, eons ago... yet they still linger in the house! We must just set our jaws and give items the old heave ho. Good luck!!

In addition to my own unbanished clutter, the aftermath of emptying my mother's house last month continues to disrupt my own home... while we upgraded a lot of our own items, three rooms in my house are still cluttered almost unusably with items that I couldn't bring myself to toss or donate, like family memorabilia and expensive items like two sterling silver flatware sets, one of them completely unused (value probably $3000).  I actually ended up giving away her fur coats to a friend of her house cleaner, to give an idea of the type of things I did let go. 

Our garage is still half full to the ceiling with boxes and furniture as well, though this is an improvement from where we were last week. I got poor Mr. Poundwise to deliver our old hutch to one of our refugee families... delighting the wife but I'm afraid many bad words were said by my husband and her husband as they wrestled the furniture into her home. Mr. P thinks he now knows Syrian for, "WTF??" Welcome to America!

Over the weekend, I gave a box full of my mom's everyday dishes and glasses to a friend who is a neighbor... this way, I get to visit with them on occasion, without having to actually own them myself. This morning I woke at dawn and decided that if I wanted space again on my kitchen counters, I could start by giving away my slow cooker (just learned that the Instant Pot will slow cook if I use a different lid).

I spontaneously gave away our family tricycle and scooter to the neighbors across the street. Have been trying to find more refugees to take housewares as well.  I have been just spewing stuff at people!

So I slog on.   The only way I can really tolerate it is to pick one end of the mess, and try to progress as a moving front from one end of a room to the other.

[shrimpwd]

I managed to sell another item. Wish the rest would sell faster. I have a few different piles that keep moving around... It's really the only (noticable) clutter in the main house.

Helped set up some shelves at mom's place. This should help get my porch cleared off faster. Found out I have a small leak in the acrylic roof (I think it is where the nails go through, but I can't check until the stuff is gone)... Nothing should get ruined, but I definitely want to fix the problem before it gets worse.

[Cassie]

If you have lots of stuff to get rid of thrift stores will send a truck. I have done that. Filled my car and garbage can today.

[happy]

@LaineyAZ , @slackmax ,  @One Day, @Poundwise ...thanks for the encouragement- I hope to post updates.


@Poundwise - I know about emptying the family home...I was going quite well on my own house, until my mother died nearly 2 years ago and We had 60 years worth of clutter to deal with. We tossed and recycled and donated huge amounts ( like over 500kg of paper into recycling), but  it got to the point where I got cleanout grief...so many of those items my brother and I would say "Oh, I remember this"- childhood memories etc...but neither of us wanted it. So the more precious items came home to my house. I've since donated a lot of them. I too had a carport full of stuff, as well as boxes lining any free wall in my house. Its taken that amount of time, but I've nearly cleared most of it now.

Keep going, you can do it. Little by little, or in massive lots, it doesn't matter.

.

[Loretta]

Today I’m returning some miscellaneous Amazon purchases that didn’t pan out.  I didn’t really buy any unnecessary stuff today, just more masks and some cat meds online. 

[oneday]

Today I recycled an old journal, in which I recorded the antics (not the fun kind of antics) of my ex.  It was started a few years before my divorce, for the purpose of reminding myself of said antics.  I did not think antics were forgettable, but apparently I was capable of forgetting.  Maybe it was a defense mechanism so I didn't go wack-a-doodle while we lived together?

Example:
me: I programed Certain Station into my car radio so I can keep up with new music.
him: You're a weirdo.

Anyway, I no longer need to remember the crap he dished out.

So I can say that chapter of my life is closed, almost literally!  It felt surprisingly anti-climactic.

[mspym]

Woohoo @oneday! You don't need to hold any space for him at all!

[okisok]

So much encouragement here! I was really looking forward to posting:

-Cleaned out the garage today. Tidied all the holiday decoration boxes and tools in the small storage closet. (Will probably go through the boxes again, but I'm very good about winnowing the holiday stuff when I'm putting away at the end of said holiday.) Swept out the leaves and dirt. Put hiking boots in bike basket to keep them up off the floor.

-Put two insulated coolers, an outdoor throw pillow, and some reusable shopping bags on the curb. Half was gone when I got home from work. I'll take the rest to a donation center if they aren't gone in the next few days.

-Organized the gardening stuff and composted old items. Opened a bag of topsoil and dumped it in the flowerbed unceremoniously. That bag had been leaning against the garage for three months...four? Every time I pulled in I saw it and felt guilty. Feelings into action today! Dead vines pulled out of garden.

-Cleaned out my car and tossed all the collected detritus. Took work items back to work. Washed the liner I use to (theoretically) keep the dog debris off the seats. Organized the trunk area, finally utilizing the cargo net to hold the two reusable bags I kept (ruthless!!). Even replaced the dead batteries in the emergency trunk flashlight. Washed the floor mats and cargo liner.

-Mended a work outfit so that it is back in rotation and not cluttering up my sewing table. Wore it today. Felt very virtuous.

-Tomorrow is trash/recycling day, so containers are on the curb. Have done a sweep to make sure that every single item that needs to be tossed is in the appropriate container.

To Do-return a borrowed book and give that friend a couple of books I've finished with.

[okisok]

Went through my cookbook, which is a three-ring binder with clear plastic pages to tuck recipes into. Got rid of 1/3 of them, straight into the recycling. Added the new recipes that had been stacked on the kitchen countertop. Only kept ones I've actually made, enjoyed, and will most likely make again. No aspirational recipes.

ETA:  found my old Apple TV, still helpfully Command-taped to the back of the TV. Apple has a mail-in recycling program, so I've requested a pre-paid address label and asked SO if he has a bubble mailer in his stash. More OUT!

[MaybeBabyMustache]

Awesome job, @Sun Hat  and @okcisok ! Lots of great progress. My goal during the WFH/shelter in place is to list one item for sale every day. It's been quite fun to see what I can come up with. As things slowly move to the "sale" bin, out of the house, or eventually to the donation, I've loved to see us slowly whittle down our belongings. I've also done major clear outs to make quicker progress, but the slow & steady kind gives me a daily goal that i enjoy

[Poundwise]

Keep going, you can do it. Little by little, or in massive lots, it doesn't matter.

Thank you so much for the encouragement, @happy! I am managing resentment that I have worked so hard to manage my own junk, then get drowned in this wave of my family's clutter.  We plucked all the low hanging fruit, so the items that made it to our house are the hardest to get rid of.  But it does feel good to make space, especially when I manage to give it away to somebody who appreciates the items.

[MountainGal]

Everyone is doing a fantastic job!  Very nice.

Over the weekend I decluttered 3 expired condiments and apple cider into the trash, donated unopened bottles of mayo and OJ to a neighbor, used free samples for an at home facial, used up a large bottle of white vinegar, and huge tub of pork rinds.  The latter two freed up significant space in the pantry.  Oh, and DH "decluttered" the wildfire ash from the two AC unit filters.  Yuck.

I love this thread.  :D

[oneday]

Thanks, @mspym I *though* I was holding on to that notebook for myself, to not forget.  But I don't need that kind of garbage in my life, even in compact form hidden in the back of a closet.

Wow, @okcisok you've had a decluttering extravaganza! I love that you even decluttered the old flashlight batteries.

@Sun Hat awesome breakthrough!  I've gone up & down in size significantly over the years. What to buy & where to find it is trial and error...it will take some time but you'll eventually figure out some rules of thumb.  My best advice is to try on anything that has even 1 thing about it that you like.  Then note how it makes you feel, if it looks better or worse on you than a piece you already own, see if you can figure out exactly why.  I once tried on a top I didn't like the fabric or cut, but the pattern was nice.  Turned out, the cut actually looked nice when worn, but didn't appeal while it was on the hanger. Later I found several more tops with a similar cut and they all looked nice.

@MaybeBabyMustache have you kept a count of items out of the house? 

@MountainGal I did a double take.  First read your post as "3 expired condoms" hahaha!

[MaybeBabyMustache]

@oneday - hello, fellow bay area mustachian.

I've sold 150+ items, and probably donated a similar amount.

[happy]

Keep going, you can do it. Little by little, or in massive lots, it doesn't matter.

Thank you so much for the encouragement, @happy! I am managing resentment that I have worked so hard to manage my own junk, then get drowned in this wave of my family's clutter.  We plucked all the low hanging fruit, so the items that made it to our house are the hardest to get rid of.  But it does feel good to make space, especially when I manage to give it away to somebody who appreciates the items.

@Poundwise - I am over it now, but I too had a lot of resentment about being landed with all my folks clutter, that they had stubbornly refused to deal with over the years in spite of offers of help. Ironically a good deal of their "precious" things stored under the house were mouldy or bug infested or just plain falling apart with age. If they had let go of them decades ago someone could have gotten some use from them and the old photos wouldn't have been in such poor condition.  I am nearly done with their stuff except for old papers and photos. Its definitely been a life lesson for my brother and I...their full house was a major reason why I started reducing my stuff some 15 years ago. My brother has always accrued more stuff than I, as he is gregarious and likes to host big parties and so on, but now even he is weeding stuff out.

[familyandfarming]

I highly recommend painting all of your walls in your house! Start with a room if you wish. This forces you to move everything out of the room, scrutinize each item and perhaps get rid of it! We just finished our basement. Not only did we paint ceilings and walls, we scrubbed floors and cleaned carpets. The contractor who finished the basement for us 20+ years ago stopped by last night. He asked if we did some additional work. Nope, just got it to clean and essential.

Always ask yourself, “Do my kids really want this crap?” I’ll save you time. They don’t!

[slackmax]

To make it less boring, I allowed myself to play a record or two while I slowly and deliberately looked at the stuff in the 'archipelago of stuff' in the living room.  I am so used to it being there, it seems like one big blob, not a collection of many different things.

What I identified in the archipelago, once I forced myself to stare into it for a while,  was a big ugly upholstered chair, well worn, and taking up tons of space. It would feel good to give it the old heave ho, and have some *noticeable* new  space in the living room.     

I plan to donate it tomorrow.  Means I have to unload tons of stuff from my car, to get the chair in, but that's OK.     

[SunnyDays]

@slackmax, before you do that, try putting the couch on the curb first.  Might save you a lot of trouble.

[oneday]

@oneday - hello, fellow bay area mustachian.

I've sold 150+ items, and probably donated a similar amount.

Hello! I did not realize you were close!  Hope you are safe & breathing freely these days.

That's quite a load out the door.  Were you successful in selling items in the early days of the pandemic? 


@slackmax I am saddened that you have an archipelago of stuff in your living space.  But amused by the name.  Good going, finding a HUGE thing to move out the door!

[mspym]

@slackmax it's a weird feeling as things that have been in plain sight become visible. Now to get it out of the house before it fades back into the background!

[lazycow]

@lazycow I’m gonna make a suggestion, but obviously it’s an internet stranger suggestion, so likely irrelevant.

A cheap Bluetooth keyboard might pair with the laptop and make it useful again? If not for you, then for someone doing homeschool this year? I’m guessing it’s less crazy in Australia than here in the states, but laptops are in demand right now.

Rats @PMG ! Read your very helpful comment too late! I hadn't thought of that solution, but will keep it in mind for the future. And no, it isn't less crazy in Victoria, especially Melbourne. Almost all students are remote learning (though the majority of the schools where I am use Macs, which are rented to the students through the schools). But thanks so much for the comment; always willing to learn new things about repurposing and keeping items out of waste systems.

[lazycow]

@slackmax +1 to putting it on the curb first, BUT only if it isn't going to rain! Our next door neighbour put out an old couch weeks ago and no one took it due to bad weather. It is still sitting there, ruined. Good for you on getting big stuff out. And thanks for the tip re: VCRs. I really don't want such a bulky tech item in the house, and videocassettes are hard to store. I really would prefer digitising.

Cleaned and organised my spice drawer and it is now a thing of beauty. I lay all the little glass bottles in their sides in alphabetical order, with the labels facing up. Took all the duplicates (why so many sachets of cayenne pepper and smoked paprika?) and put them in a container with strict instructions to my husband to check there before buying more! I  only needed to compost a couple of very old packs, so we are using up most items, yay.

And to everyone who is dealing with family clutter: I feel your pain, having done it for my parents a few years ago. it is hard, and time-consuming, but 10 years later, so very worth it. It certainly made me question why I choose to keep what is in the house, and freely give away whatever no longer serves us. Hopefully I have taught the almost-adult kids to do this; my husband is naturally a declutterer, apart from what lives in his shed.

[Fresh Bread]

No aspirational recipes.

Great tip, I have three skinny binder things with recipes and I don't look at them. I'll cull soon!

Ugh to the stories of parents leaving clutter. My dad is a minimalist *buffs nails*. My sister however...

[MaybeBabyMustache]

@oneday - we were on the "warning" evacuation list on Sunday due to potential lightning strikes, but are now off the list. Our house is next to a very dry preserve, and the preserve itself is at high risk due to no barriers/structures & dry landscape. It's been a roller coaster for sure. Feels like we've turned the corner a bit with cooperating weather. Fingers crossed. Hope you are also in a safe area.

I've had a lot of success selling, but things have slowed down quite a bit in the past two weeks. I consider the selling part of my pandemic plans. 1) declutters. 2) small amount of money in 3) I get exercise. I take everything to the nearest post office drop box, which is about a mile & a half round trip from my house. I've gotten so many more steps, just by ensuring I'm mailing the packages. It's been a bunch of small sales that are adding up.

[MountainGal]

@oneday, ha ha re: your double take.  :)  And I hope @MaybeBabyMustache and you stay safe.  I'm in the Rocky Mountains and we are currently surrounded by four wildfires.

I ordered two fridge bins, one for cans and one for bottled beverages, and cleaned, filled, and put them in the fridge last night.  It looks much neater!

This morning I "decluttered" about 100 calories on the treadmill.  ;)

[okisok]

Thanks for the encouragement, everyone!

@slackmax--very descriptive image of the 'clutter archipelago', and a good solution to break it up. If you have curb space, I +1 on just putting it out there for pickup.

I returned a friend's book and gave her one more. SO brought me some supplies that I repurposed into packaging for two more books to mail to an out-of-town friend.

Added three baskets and two throw pillows to the curb pile.

Added a damaged phone charging cord to the pile awaiting the Apple mailing label for recycling.

Threw away a couple of old items from the fridge and wiped out all the shelves. I'd been putting it off because I thought it was a huge chore. It took less than ten minutes...

[slackmax]

@slackmax it's a weird feeling as things that have been in plain sight become visible. Now to get it out of the house before it fades back into the background!

I didn't put it on the curb, since things like that don't get taken around here, for some reason, plus it's 50/50 chance of rain tomorrow.  And the garbage plan I have won't take it, either.

I barely got it into my car, but I did, without scratching anything! Dropped it off at the donation center, went home and saw a big old footstool in the archipelago, and decided to donate it too! Took it over.   

I vacuumed up the rug that got exposed in the archipelago, and moved some other stuff together, and now have pushed the archipelago a good 5 or 6 feet back towards the wall.   More open space!