Credit card churning, how to continue?

[DadJokes]

I've got a big purchase coming up (over $5,000) and I'm trying to figure out which card to use.  I already have the Capital One Venture and Chase Sapphire Preferred.  Any recommendations?

How about Chase Ink Business Preferred?

Doesn’t matter that I don’t own a business?  Yes I read the previous posts but just want to confirm.

Per those who know much more than me on Reddit, all you need is to use your SSN for the EIN and your first & last name for the business name.

I started a sole proprietorship a month ago and applied for an EIN (received instantaneously from the IRS) and was able to get the card, though it took a few weeks. And I still haven't decided if I'm going to actually operate the business.

[MasterStache]

I've often thought about opening a Biz in my spouses name to gain access to a lot more CCs. I may try to open a card via the process you all discussed. I have a Biz so it's easy for me to apply.

On a different note my spouse is under 5/24 and I have been debating about weather to apply for the CSR or CSP. I've read a lot of back and forth about both cards but am still undecided. We don't travel internationally and not as often to maybe make the CSR card more valuable. We do have a trip coming up next year to visit some national parks but already have our Airbnb booked with a different card. Any thoughts, experiences to share? 

[Catica]

OK, here is a summary of the my strategy for CC churning.

Chase is best but they have their 5/24 rule. But that doesn't apply to Chase business cards ** if you get them before you have 5/24 personal **

This strategy will get you the most cards in the shortest time and allow you to repeat it much sooner.

1. Get as many Chase business cards as possible. You don't need a tax number for these - just use your SS. And use your name for the business. If you have a company name they will want to verify all sorts of shit.

2. After getting all the Chase business cards you can / want, get the juicy Chase cards - 5 of them. After 5, you will have to wait 2 years. Keep the timing so once you are near meeting the spending requirements you already have a new card on the way. Most have a three month limit on spending enough to get the bonus. In general, spending is $1000 a month for 3 months.

3. Get as many other juicy personal cards as you can. Get them as fast as you can while meeting the spending requirements. There are few AA cards with NO spending requirements. The idea here is to get as many in the shortest amount of time - so you then will all be over the 24 month rule - in 24 months or less from now.

4. Only get non-Chase business cards that are not reported on your credit report for the next 2 years or so (until you have less than 5 cards within the last 24 months left on your credit report). 

5. Once you are back to under 5/24, repeat.

In my relatives case, he spends $10K a month on cards for his business. So he applied for a new card every month after he had his 5 Chase cards. In that year he had 10 or so cards and met the spending bonus requirements.

So he had several Chase business cards, 5 personal Chase cards, and 10+ other bank cards - all in less than 2 years.

He has slowed down a bit and is getting only non-Chase business cards. He has to wait 22 months from his last personal card he received and he will be at 0/24.

He is still trying to figure out how the using the mileage and hotel points works. That is another side of churning. Anyway, he hasn't spent a dime on hotels or flights since starting churning.

** Tip: when applying just put down Sole Proprietorship rather than LLC or whatnot - even if you have an LLC. They won't ask for any paperwork. **

How do I check where I'm at with Chase in regards to 5/24 rule?  I didn't know that I should have applied for Chase business cards first before the personal cards.  Can I still do Chase business cards even though it looks like I maxed out my Chase personal cards?

[flashflooder]

OK, here is a summary of the my strategy for CC churning.

Chase is best but they have their 5/24 rule. But that doesn't apply to Chase business cards ** if you get them before you have 5/24 personal **

This strategy will get you the most cards in the shortest time and allow you to repeat it much sooner.

1. Get as many Chase business cards as possible. You don't need a tax number for these - just use your SS. And use your name for the business. If you have a company name they will want to verify all sorts of shit.

2. After getting all the Chase business cards you can / want, get the juicy Chase cards - 5 of them. After 5, you will have to wait 2 years. Keep the timing so once you are near meeting the spending requirements you already have a new card on the way. Most have a three month limit on spending enough to get the bonus. In general, spending is $1000 a month for 3 months.

3. Get as many other juicy personal cards as you can. Get them as fast as you can while meeting the spending requirements. There are few AA cards with NO spending requirements. The idea here is to get as many in the shortest amount of time - so you then will all be over the 24 month rule - in 24 months or less from now.

4. Only get non-Chase business cards that are not reported on your credit report for the next 2 years or so (until you have less than 5 cards within the last 24 months left on your credit report). 

5. Once you are back to under 5/24, repeat.

In my relatives case, he spends $10K a month on cards for his business. So he applied for a new card every month after he had his 5 Chase cards. In that year he had 10 or so cards and met the spending bonus requirements.

So he had several Chase business cards, 5 personal Chase cards, and 10+ other bank cards - all in less than 2 years.

He has slowed down a bit and is getting only non-Chase business cards. He has to wait 22 months from his last personal card he received and he will be at 0/24.

He is still trying to figure out how the using the mileage and hotel points works. That is another side of churning. Anyway, he hasn't spent a dime on hotels or flights since starting churning.

** Tip: when applying just put down Sole Proprietorship rather than LLC or whatnot - even if you have an LLC. They won't ask for any paperwork. **

How do I check where I'm at with Chase in regards to 5/24 rule?  I didn't know that I should have applied for Chase business cards first before the personal cards.  Can I still do Chase business cards even though it looks like I maxed out my Chase personal cards?

your best bet is to pull your credit report and count how many accounts were opened in the past 2 years.  They even list closed accounts, so you should get a full picture.  A few of the CC companies will only report to 1 or 2 of the agencies (vs all 3), so make sure you pull all 3 to get the full picture.

Going forward, I would recommend keeping a spreadsheet of which cards you opened with which bank, when it was opened, and when it was closed.  This allows me to see, at a glance, exactly where I stand.

[Catica]

OK, here is a summary of the my strategy for CC churning.

Chase is best but they have their 5/24 rule. But that doesn't apply to Chase business cards ** if you get them before you have 5/24 personal **

This strategy will get you the most cards in the shortest time and allow you to repeat it much sooner.

1. Get as many Chase business cards as possible. You don't need a tax number for these - just use your SS. And use your name for the business. If you have a company name they will want to verify all sorts of shit.

2. After getting all the Chase business cards you can / want, get the juicy Chase cards - 5 of them. After 5, you will have to wait 2 years. Keep the timing so once you are near meeting the spending requirements you already have a new card on the way. Most have a three month limit on spending enough to get the bonus. In general, spending is $1000 a month for 3 months.

3. Get as many other juicy personal cards as you can. Get them as fast as you can while meeting the spending requirements. There are few AA cards with NO spending requirements. The idea here is to get as many in the shortest amount of time - so you then will all be over the 24 month rule - in 24 months or less from now.

4. Only get non-Chase business cards that are not reported on your credit report for the next 2 years or so (until you have less than 5 cards within the last 24 months left on your credit report). 

5. Once you are back to under 5/24, repeat.

In my relatives case, he spends $10K a month on cards for his business. So he applied for a new card every month after he had his 5 Chase cards. In that year he had 10 or so cards and met the spending bonus requirements.

So he had several Chase business cards, 5 personal Chase cards, and 10+ other bank cards - all in less than 2 years.

He has slowed down a bit and is getting only non-Chase business cards. He has to wait 22 months from his last personal card he received and he will be at 0/24.

He is still trying to figure out how the using the mileage and hotel points works. That is another side of churning. Anyway, he hasn't spent a dime on hotels or flights since starting churning.

** Tip: when applying just put down Sole Proprietorship rather than LLC or whatnot - even if you have an LLC. They won't ask for any paperwork. **

How do I check where I'm at with Chase in regards to 5/24 rule?  I didn't know that I should have applied for Chase business cards first before the personal cards.  Can I still do Chase business cards even though it looks like I maxed out my Chase personal cards?

your best bet is to pull your credit report and count how many accounts were opened in the past 2 years.  They even list closed accounts, so you should get a full picture.  A few of the CC companies will only report to 1 or 2 of the agencies (vs all 3), so make sure you pull all 3 to get the full picture.

Going forward, I would recommend keeping a spreadsheet of which cards you opened with which bank, when it was opened, and when it was closed.  This allows me to see, at a glance, exactly where I stand.

Thanks.  I just checked kreditkarma and I only have 4 Chase accounts opened and none closed within the past 5 years and I still can't get any more Chase cards (got denied recently).  Is it safe for me to apply for Chase business card?

[jtraggie99]

OK, here is a summary of the my strategy for CC churning.

Chase is best but they have their 5/24 rule. But that doesn't apply to Chase business cards ** if you get them before you have 5/24 personal **

This strategy will get you the most cards in the shortest time and allow you to repeat it much sooner.

1. Get as many Chase business cards as possible. You don't need a tax number for these - just use your SS. And use your name for the business. If you have a company name they will want to verify all sorts of shit.

2. After getting all the Chase business cards you can / want, get the juicy Chase cards - 5 of them. After 5, you will have to wait 2 years. Keep the timing so once you are near meeting the spending requirements you already have a new card on the way. Most have a three month limit on spending enough to get the bonus. In general, spending is $1000 a month for 3 months.

3. Get as many other juicy personal cards as you can. Get them as fast as you can while meeting the spending requirements. There are few AA cards with NO spending requirements. The idea here is to get as many in the shortest amount of time - so you then will all be over the 24 month rule - in 24 months or less from now.

4. Only get non-Chase business cards that are not reported on your credit report for the next 2 years or so (until you have less than 5 cards within the last 24 months left on your credit report). 

5. Once you are back to under 5/24, repeat.

In my relatives case, he spends $10K a month on cards for his business. So he applied for a new card every month after he had his 5 Chase cards. In that year he had 10 or so cards and met the spending bonus requirements.

So he had several Chase business cards, 5 personal Chase cards, and 10+ other bank cards - all in less than 2 years.

He has slowed down a bit and is getting only non-Chase business cards. He has to wait 22 months from his last personal card he received and he will be at 0/24.

He is still trying to figure out how the using the mileage and hotel points works. That is another side of churning. Anyway, he hasn't spent a dime on hotels or flights since starting churning.

** Tip: when applying just put down Sole Proprietorship rather than LLC or whatnot - even if you have an LLC. They won't ask for any paperwork. **

How do I check where I'm at with Chase in regards to 5/24 rule?  I didn't know that I should have applied for Chase business cards first before the personal cards.  Can I still do Chase business cards even though it looks like I maxed out my Chase personal cards?

your best bet is to pull your credit report and count how many accounts were opened in the past 2 years.  They even list closed accounts, so you should get a full picture.  A few of the CC companies will only report to 1 or 2 of the agencies (vs all 3), so make sure you pull all 3 to get the full picture.

Going forward, I would recommend keeping a spreadsheet of which cards you opened with which bank, when it was opened, and when it was closed.  This allows me to see, at a glance, exactly where I stand.

Thanks.  I just checked kreditkarma and I only have 4 Chase accounts opened and none closed within the past 5 years and I still can't get any more Chase cards (got denied recently).  Is it safe for me to apply for Chase business card?

Chase's 5/24 rule applies to all credit cards, not just Chase cards.  If you have opened 5 new credit cards in the past 24 months from any bank (that's reported on your credit report - if it doesn't show up on your personal credit report, Chase will not see it - i.e. a lot of business cards), Chase will automatically deny you.  Even if you do not have a single Chase card, it does not matter.  They look at all of your accounts. 

[Jouer]

Maybe you don't care, but I do care a lot about who is profiling me and for what purpose. Once you respond "YES" to the citizenship question they ask if you have a dual citizenship and if so, they want to know which other countries you are a citizen of.  Why do they need to know that???????????  And if it is so common when establishing bank accounts to be asked about citizenship, why have I never been asked this by any other bank???  I have opened many checking/savings accounts and credit cards and was never asked this question before.  So I don't think it's so common as you say.  And this is obviously fairy recent that they started asking this question because I have a checking account with B of A and was not asked this question when opening it back in 2008.  I want to know why they ask these questions and how this information is being used.  I do not want to be oblivious.

I'm not certain, but it may have to do with the "Know Your Customer" laws.  In the US I think these were passed into law in the wake of the 9/11 attacks.  https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Know_your_customer

I understand the general profiling concern.  But I'm curious, what does it matter if someone knows your citizenship or dual citizenship?

Yep, it's about know your customer. It's an anti-money laundering thing. Certain countries have been flagged as at-risk for money laundering. They are just doing their due diligence, which is their right as a private company.

[Catica]

OK, here is a summary of the my strategy for CC churning.

Chase is best but they have their 5/24 rule. But that doesn't apply to Chase business cards ** if you get them before you have 5/24 personal **

This strategy will get you the most cards in the shortest time and allow you to repeat it much sooner.

1. Get as many Chase business cards as possible. You don't need a tax number for these - just use your SS. And use your name for the business. If you have a company name they will want to verify all sorts of shit.

2. After getting all the Chase business cards you can / want, get the juicy Chase cards - 5 of them. After 5, you will have to wait 2 years. Keep the timing so once you are near meeting the spending requirements you already have a new card on the way. Most have a three month limit on spending enough to get the bonus. In general, spending is $1000 a month for 3 months.

3. Get as many other juicy personal cards as you can. Get them as fast as you can while meeting the spending requirements. There are few AA cards with NO spending requirements. The idea here is to get as many in the shortest amount of time - so you then will all be over the 24 month rule - in 24 months or less from now.

4. Only get non-Chase business cards that are not reported on your credit report for the next 2 years or so (until you have less than 5 cards within the last 24 months left on your credit report). 

5. Once you are back to under 5/24, repeat.

In my relatives case, he spends $10K a month on cards for his business. So he applied for a new card every month after he had his 5 Chase cards. In that year he had 10 or so cards and met the spending bonus requirements.

So he had several Chase business cards, 5 personal Chase cards, and 10+ other bank cards - all in less than 2 years.

He has slowed down a bit and is getting only non-Chase business cards. He has to wait 22 months from his last personal card he received and he will be at 0/24.

He is still trying to figure out how the using the mileage and hotel points works. That is another side of churning. Anyway, he hasn't spent a dime on hotels or flights since starting churning.

** Tip: when applying just put down Sole Proprietorship rather than LLC or whatnot - even if you have an LLC. They won't ask for any paperwork. **

How do I check where I'm at with Chase in regards to 5/24 rule?  I didn't know that I should have applied for Chase business cards first before the personal cards.  Can I still do Chase business cards even though it looks like I maxed out my Chase personal cards?

your best bet is to pull your credit report and count how many accounts were opened in the past 2 years.  They even list closed accounts, so you should get a full picture.  A few of the CC companies will only report to 1 or 2 of the agencies (vs all 3), so make sure you pull all 3 to get the full picture.

Going forward, I would recommend keeping a spreadsheet of which cards you opened with which bank, when it was opened, and when it was closed.  This allows me to see, at a glance, exactly where I stand.

Thanks.  I just checked kreditkarma and I only have 4 Chase accounts opened and none closed within the past 5 years and I still can't get any more Chase cards (got denied recently).  Is it safe for me to apply for Chase business card?

Chase's 5/24 rule applies to all credit cards, not just Chase cards.  If you have opened 5 new credit cards in the past 24 months from any bank (that's reported on your credit report - if it doesn't show up on your personal credit report, Chase will not see it - i.e. a lot of business cards), Chase will automatically deny you.  Even if you do not have a single Chase card, it does not matter.  They look at all of your accounts.

I see.  But if I apply for Chase business card my personal accounts don't matter, right?

[jtraggie99]

OK, here is a summary of the my strategy for CC churning.

Chase is best but they have their 5/24 rule. But that doesn't apply to Chase business cards ** if you get them before you have 5/24 personal **

This strategy will get you the most cards in the shortest time and allow you to repeat it much sooner.

1. Get as many Chase business cards as possible. You don't need a tax number for these - just use your SS. And use your name for the business. If you have a company name they will want to verify all sorts of shit.

2. After getting all the Chase business cards you can / want, get the juicy Chase cards - 5 of them. After 5, you will have to wait 2 years. Keep the timing so once you are near meeting the spending requirements you already have a new card on the way. Most have a three month limit on spending enough to get the bonus. In general, spending is $1000 a month for 3 months.

3. Get as many other juicy personal cards as you can. Get them as fast as you can while meeting the spending requirements. There are few AA cards with NO spending requirements. The idea here is to get as many in the shortest amount of time - so you then will all be over the 24 month rule - in 24 months or less from now.

4. Only get non-Chase business cards that are not reported on your credit report for the next 2 years or so (until you have less than 5 cards within the last 24 months left on your credit report). 

5. Once you are back to under 5/24, repeat.

In my relatives case, he spends $10K a month on cards for his business. So he applied for a new card every month after he had his 5 Chase cards. In that year he had 10 or so cards and met the spending bonus requirements.

So he had several Chase business cards, 5 personal Chase cards, and 10+ other bank cards - all in less than 2 years.

He has slowed down a bit and is getting only non-Chase business cards. He has to wait 22 months from his last personal card he received and he will be at 0/24.

He is still trying to figure out how the using the mileage and hotel points works. That is another side of churning. Anyway, he hasn't spent a dime on hotels or flights since starting churning.

** Tip: when applying just put down Sole Proprietorship rather than LLC or whatnot - even if you have an LLC. They won't ask for any paperwork. **

How do I check where I'm at with Chase in regards to 5/24 rule?  I didn't know that I should have applied for Chase business cards first before the personal cards.  Can I still do Chase business cards even though it looks like I maxed out my Chase personal cards?

your best bet is to pull your credit report and count how many accounts were opened in the past 2 years.  They even list closed accounts, so you should get a full picture.  A few of the CC companies will only report to 1 or 2 of the agencies (vs all 3), so make sure you pull all 3 to get the full picture.

Going forward, I would recommend keeping a spreadsheet of which cards you opened with which bank, when it was opened, and when it was closed.  This allows me to see, at a glance, exactly where I stand.

Thanks.  I just checked kreditkarma and I only have 4 Chase accounts opened and none closed within the past 5 years and I still can't get any more Chase cards (got denied recently).  Is it safe for me to apply for Chase business card?

Chase's 5/24 rule applies to all credit cards, not just Chase cards.  If you have opened 5 new credit cards in the past 24 months from any bank (that's reported on your credit report - if it doesn't show up on your personal credit report, Chase will not see it - i.e. a lot of business cards), Chase will automatically deny you.  Even if you do not have a single Chase card, it does not matter.  They look at all of your accounts.

I see.  But if I apply for Chase business card my personal accounts don't matter, right?

Most business cards do not report to your personal credit report, so they do not impact 5/24.  I don't think Chase's do either (but don't hold me to that).  I do believe Chase will still deny you for a business card if you are over 5/24 on your personal credit report, but I could be wrong as well.  I think what he was trying to say is once you are under 5/24, open Chase business accounts first (as they won't count towards their 5/24 count).  Then open Chase personal cards.

[Catica]

OK, here is a summary of the my strategy for CC churning.

Chase is best but they have their 5/24 rule. But that doesn't apply to Chase business cards ** if you get them before you have 5/24 personal **

This strategy will get you the most cards in the shortest time and allow you to repeat it much sooner.

1. Get as many Chase business cards as possible. You don't need a tax number for these - just use your SS. And use your name for the business. If you have a company name they will want to verify all sorts of shit.

2. After getting all the Chase business cards you can / want, get the juicy Chase cards - 5 of them. After 5, you will have to wait 2 years. Keep the timing so once you are near meeting the spending requirements you already have a new card on the way. Most have a three month limit on spending enough to get the bonus. In general, spending is $1000 a month for 3 months.

3. Get as many other juicy personal cards as you can. Get them as fast as you can while meeting the spending requirements. There are few AA cards with NO spending requirements. The idea here is to get as many in the shortest amount of time - so you then will all be over the 24 month rule - in 24 months or less from now.

4. Only get non-Chase business cards that are not reported on your credit report for the next 2 years or so (until you have less than 5 cards within the last 24 months left on your credit report). 

5. Once you are back to under 5/24, repeat.

In my relatives case, he spends $10K a month on cards for his business. So he applied for a new card every month after he had his 5 Chase cards. In that year he had 10 or so cards and met the spending bonus requirements.

So he had several Chase business cards, 5 personal Chase cards, and 10+ other bank cards - all in less than 2 years.

He has slowed down a bit and is getting only non-Chase business cards. He has to wait 22 months from his last personal card he received and he will be at 0/24.

He is still trying to figure out how the using the mileage and hotel points works. That is another side of churning. Anyway, he hasn't spent a dime on hotels or flights since starting churning.

** Tip: when applying just put down Sole Proprietorship rather than LLC or whatnot - even if you have an LLC. They won't ask for any paperwork. **

How do I check where I'm at with Chase in regards to 5/24 rule?  I didn't know that I should have applied for Chase business cards first before the personal cards.  Can I still do Chase business cards even though it looks like I maxed out my Chase personal cards?

your best bet is to pull your credit report and count how many accounts were opened in the past 2 years.  They even list closed accounts, so you should get a full picture.  A few of the CC companies will only report to 1 or 2 of the agencies (vs all 3), so make sure you pull all 3 to get the full picture.

Going forward, I would recommend keeping a spreadsheet of which cards you opened with which bank, when it was opened, and when it was closed.  This allows me to see, at a glance, exactly where I stand.

Thanks.  I just checked kreditkarma and I only have 4 Chase accounts opened and none closed within the past 5 years and I still can't get any more Chase cards (got denied recently).  Is it safe for me to apply for Chase business card?

Chase's 5/24 rule applies to all credit cards, not just Chase cards.  If you have opened 5 new credit cards in the past 24 months from any bank (that's reported on your credit report - if it doesn't show up on your personal credit report, Chase will not see it - i.e. a lot of business cards), Chase will automatically deny you.  Even if you do not have a single Chase card, it does not matter.  They look at all of your accounts.

I see.  But if I apply for Chase business card my personal accounts don't matter, right?

Most business cards do not report to your personal credit report, so they do not impact 5/24.  I don't think Chase's do either (but don't hold me to that).  I do believe Chase will still deny you for a business card if you are over 5/24 on your personal credit report, but I could be wrong as well.  I think what he was trying to say is once you are under 5/24, open Chase business accounts first (as they won't count towards their 5/24 count).  Then open Chase personal cards.

Yes, I see that he meant open business first then personal but that's too late for me now.  Is there any negative impact in trying to apply and being denied?  Do they check my credit report when I apply for business card?

[jtraggie99]

OK, here is a summary of the my strategy for CC churning.

Chase is best but they have their 5/24 rule. But that doesn't apply to Chase business cards ** if you get them before you have 5/24 personal **

This strategy will get you the most cards in the shortest time and allow you to repeat it much sooner.

1. Get as many Chase business cards as possible. You don't need a tax number for these - just use your SS. And use your name for the business. If you have a company name they will want to verify all sorts of shit.

2. After getting all the Chase business cards you can / want, get the juicy Chase cards - 5 of them. After 5, you will have to wait 2 years. Keep the timing so once you are near meeting the spending requirements you already have a new card on the way. Most have a three month limit on spending enough to get the bonus. In general, spending is $1000 a month for 3 months.

3. Get as many other juicy personal cards as you can. Get them as fast as you can while meeting the spending requirements. There are few AA cards with NO spending requirements. The idea here is to get as many in the shortest amount of time - so you then will all be over the 24 month rule - in 24 months or less from now.

4. Only get non-Chase business cards that are not reported on your credit report for the next 2 years or so (until you have less than 5 cards within the last 24 months left on your credit report). 

5. Once you are back to under 5/24, repeat.

In my relatives case, he spends $10K a month on cards for his business. So he applied for a new card every month after he had his 5 Chase cards. In that year he had 10 or so cards and met the spending bonus requirements.

So he had several Chase business cards, 5 personal Chase cards, and 10+ other bank cards - all in less than 2 years.

He has slowed down a bit and is getting only non-Chase business cards. He has to wait 22 months from his last personal card he received and he will be at 0/24.

He is still trying to figure out how the using the mileage and hotel points works. That is another side of churning. Anyway, he hasn't spent a dime on hotels or flights since starting churning.

** Tip: when applying just put down Sole Proprietorship rather than LLC or whatnot - even if you have an LLC. They won't ask for any paperwork. **

How do I check where I'm at with Chase in regards to 5/24 rule?  I didn't know that I should have applied for Chase business cards first before the personal cards.  Can I still do Chase business cards even though it looks like I maxed out my Chase personal cards?

your best bet is to pull your credit report and count how many accounts were opened in the past 2 years.  They even list closed accounts, so you should get a full picture.  A few of the CC companies will only report to 1 or 2 of the agencies (vs all 3), so make sure you pull all 3 to get the full picture.

Going forward, I would recommend keeping a spreadsheet of which cards you opened with which bank, when it was opened, and when it was closed.  This allows me to see, at a glance, exactly where I stand.

Thanks.  I just checked kreditkarma and I only have 4 Chase accounts opened and none closed within the past 5 years and I still can't get any more Chase cards (got denied recently).  Is it safe for me to apply for Chase business card?

Chase's 5/24 rule applies to all credit cards, not just Chase cards.  If you have opened 5 new credit cards in the past 24 months from any bank (that's reported on your credit report - if it doesn't show up on your personal credit report, Chase will not see it - i.e. a lot of business cards), Chase will automatically deny you.  Even if you do not have a single Chase card, it does not matter.  They look at all of your accounts.

I see.  But if I apply for Chase business card my personal accounts don't matter, right?

Most business cards do not report to your personal credit report, so they do not impact 5/24.  I don't think Chase's do either (but don't hold me to that).  I do believe Chase will still deny you for a business card if you are over 5/24 on your personal credit report, but I could be wrong as well.  I think what he was trying to say is once you are under 5/24, open Chase business accounts first (as they won't count towards their 5/24 count).  Then open Chase personal cards.

Yes, I see that he meant open business first then personal but that's too late for me now.  Is there any negative impact in trying to apply and being denied?  Do they check my credit report when I apply for business card?

I think most banks will pull your personal credit report when applying for a business card.  If you apply for cards and are denied, there is still the inquiry that shows up on your credit report from the bank that you applied to.  Inquiries do not have a huge impact on your credit report, but having a lot can bring your score down some. 

[Catica]

OK, here is a summary of the my strategy for CC churning.

Chase is best but they have their 5/24 rule. But that doesn't apply to Chase business cards ** if you get them before you have 5/24 personal **

This strategy will get you the most cards in the shortest time and allow you to repeat it much sooner.

1. Get as many Chase business cards as possible. You don't need a tax number for these - just use your SS. And use your name for the business. If you have a company name they will want to verify all sorts of shit.

2. After getting all the Chase business cards you can / want, get the juicy Chase cards - 5 of them. After 5, you will have to wait 2 years. Keep the timing so once you are near meeting the spending requirements you already have a new card on the way. Most have a three month limit on spending enough to get the bonus. In general, spending is $1000 a month for 3 months.

3. Get as many other juicy personal cards as you can. Get them as fast as you can while meeting the spending requirements. There are few AA cards with NO spending requirements. The idea here is to get as many in the shortest amount of time - so you then will all be over the 24 month rule - in 24 months or less from now.

4. Only get non-Chase business cards that are not reported on your credit report for the next 2 years or so (until you have less than 5 cards within the last 24 months left on your credit report). 

5. Once you are back to under 5/24, repeat.

In my relatives case, he spends $10K a month on cards for his business. So he applied for a new card every month after he had his 5 Chase cards. In that year he had 10 or so cards and met the spending bonus requirements.

So he had several Chase business cards, 5 personal Chase cards, and 10+ other bank cards - all in less than 2 years.

He has slowed down a bit and is getting only non-Chase business cards. He has to wait 22 months from his last personal card he received and he will be at 0/24.

He is still trying to figure out how the using the mileage and hotel points works. That is another side of churning. Anyway, he hasn't spent a dime on hotels or flights since starting churning.

** Tip: when applying just put down Sole Proprietorship rather than LLC or whatnot - even if you have an LLC. They won't ask for any paperwork. **

How do I check where I'm at with Chase in regards to 5/24 rule?  I didn't know that I should have applied for Chase business cards first before the personal cards.  Can I still do Chase business cards even though it looks like I maxed out my Chase personal cards?

your best bet is to pull your credit report and count how many accounts were opened in the past 2 years.  They even list closed accounts, so you should get a full picture.  A few of the CC companies will only report to 1 or 2 of the agencies (vs all 3), so make sure you pull all 3 to get the full picture.

Going forward, I would recommend keeping a spreadsheet of which cards you opened with which bank, when it was opened, and when it was closed.  This allows me to see, at a glance, exactly where I stand.

Thanks.  I just checked kreditkarma and I only have 4 Chase accounts opened and none closed within the past 5 years and I still can't get any more Chase cards (got denied recently).  Is it safe for me to apply for Chase business card?

Chase's 5/24 rule applies to all credit cards, not just Chase cards.  If you have opened 5 new credit cards in the past 24 months from any bank (that's reported on your credit report - if it doesn't show up on your personal credit report, Chase will not see it - i.e. a lot of business cards), Chase will automatically deny you.  Even if you do not have a single Chase card, it does not matter.  They look at all of your accounts.

I see.  But if I apply for Chase business card my personal accounts don't matter, right?

Most business cards do not report to your personal credit report, so they do not impact 5/24.  I don't think Chase's do either (but don't hold me to that).  I do believe Chase will still deny you for a business card if you are over 5/24 on your personal credit report, but I could be wrong as well.  I think what he was trying to say is once you are under 5/24, open Chase business accounts first (as they won't count towards their 5/24 count).  Then open Chase personal cards.

Yes, I see that he meant open business first then personal but that's too late for me now.  Is there any negative impact in trying to apply and being denied?  Do they check my credit report when I apply for business card?

I think most banks will pull your personal credit report when applying for a business card.  If you apply for cards and are denied, there is still the inquiry that shows up on your credit report from the bank that you applied to.  Inquiries do not have a huge impact on your credit report, but having a lot can bring your score down some.

But does the fact that I already have 5 personal cards with Chase will cause them to deny me for business card?

[jtraggie99]

When were the 5 Chase cards opened?  Within the last 2 years?  Then yes, Chase will deny you for a business card (at least that is my understanding).  If you have opened 5 new cards within the past 2 years, from Chase or any other back combined, then Chase will automatically deny you if you try to open any personal or business cards.  5/24 applies to both Chase personal and business cards. 

https://www.doctorofcredit.com/chase-524-rule-explained-detail-need-know/

https://www.doctorofcredit.com/18-things-everybody-should-know-about-chase/

[Catica]

I have Amex Hilton Honors Business card.  The bonus points for spending $3000  in the first 3 months just posted.  The card has $95 annual fee.  Does anyone know if canceling the card right immediately after the fee posted will case them to take away the points?

[HPstache]

I have Amex Hilton Honors Business card.  The bonus points for spending $3000  in the first 3 months just posted.  The card has $95 annual fee.  Does anyone know if canceling the card right immediately after the fee posted will case them to take away the points?

Why cancel right away?  Why not just wait for the 11th month and ask them to cancel or downgrade the card to the no annual fee card in their lineup (if they have one)?

[Catica]

I have Amex Hilton Honors Business card.  The bonus points for spending $3000  in the first 3 months just posted.  The card has $95 annual fee.  Does anyone know if canceling the card right immediately after the fee posted will case them to take away the points?

Why cancel right away?  Why not just wait for the 11th month and ask them to cancel or downgrade the card to the no annual fee card in their lineup (if they have one)?

Because I won't get a refund of annual fee

[HPstache]

I have Amex Hilton Honors Business card.  The bonus points for spending $3000  in the first 3 months just posted.  The card has $95 annual fee.  Does anyone know if canceling the card right immediately after the fee posted will case them to take away the points?

Why cancel right away?  Why not just wait for the 11th month and ask them to cancel or downgrade the card to the no annual fee card in their lineup (if they have one)?

Because I won't get a refund of annual fee

Oops misread what you were asking.  My bad

[secondcor521]

I have Amex Hilton Honors Business card.  The bonus points for spending $3000  in the first 3 months just posted.  The card has $95 annual fee.  Does anyone know if canceling the card right immediately after the fee posted will case them to take away the points?

If the points make it into your Hilton Honors account, probably not.

They will possibly blacklist you from any more AMEX cards, and they definitely will not refund you the $95.

That is my general opinion based on experience, but I have no direct data to support it.

[Catica]

I have Amex Hilton Honors Business card.  The bonus points for spending $3000  in the first 3 months just posted.  The card has $95 annual fee.  Does anyone know if canceling the card right immediately after the fee posted will case them to take away the points?

If the points make it into your Hilton Honors account, probably not.

They will possibly blacklist you from any more AMEX cards, and they definitely will not refund you the $95.

That is my general opinion based on experience, but I have no direct data to support it.

They refunded the fee on another card I just canceled after the fee posted.  I canceled the month it posted, which was the 13th month of having the card. That card had first year fee waved though, but the Hilton Honors doesn't so the fee posted after having the card for a month.  So I wasn't sure if the same applied in this case.

[MasterStache]

I have Amex Hilton Honors Business card.  The bonus points for spending $3000  in the first 3 months just posted.  The card has $95 annual fee.  Does anyone know if canceling the card right immediately after the fee posted will case them to take away the points?

If the points make it into your Hilton Honors account, probably not.

They will possibly blacklist you from any more AMEX cards, and they definitely will not refund you the $95.

That is my general opinion based on experience, but I have no direct data to support it.

They refunded the fee on another card I just canceled after the fee posted.  I canceled the month it posted, which was the 13th month of having the card. That card had first year fee waved though, but the Hilton Honors doesn't so the fee posted after having the card for a month.  So I wasn't sure if the same applied in this case.

That's a bit different as you had the other card for 12+ months. Opening a card, grabbing the points and closing immediately to try and void the annual fee is definitely a good way to get yourself blacklisted. Personally I would just pay the annual fee. 

[Catica]

I have Amex Hilton Honors Business card.  The bonus points for spending $3000  in the first 3 months just posted.  The card has $95 annual fee.  Does anyone know if canceling the card right immediately after the fee posted will case them to take away the points?

If the points make it into your Hilton Honors account, probably not.

They will possibly blacklist you from any more AMEX cards, and they definitely will not refund you the $95.

That is my general opinion based on experience, but I have no direct data to support it.

They refunded the fee on another card I just canceled after the fee posted.  I canceled the month it posted, which was the 13th month of having the card. That card had first year fee waved though, but the Hilton Honors doesn't so the fee posted after having the card for a month.  So I wasn't sure if the same applied in this case.

That's a bit different as you had the other card for 12+ months. Opening a card, grabbing the points and closing immediately to try and void the annual fee is definitely a good way to get yourself blacklisted. Personally I would just pay the annual fee.

I will do that.  But it should be OK to cancel next year when they hit me with the fee again, right?

[secondcor521]

I have Amex Hilton Honors Business card.  The bonus points for spending $3000  in the first 3 months just posted.  The card has $95 annual fee.  Does anyone know if canceling the card right immediately after the fee posted will case them to take away the points?

If the points make it into your Hilton Honors account, probably not.

They will possibly blacklist you from any more AMEX cards, and they definitely will not refund you the $95.

That is my general opinion based on experience, but I have no direct data to support it.

They refunded the fee on another card I just canceled after the fee posted.  I canceled the month it posted, which was the 13th month of having the card. That card had first year fee waved though, but the Hilton Honors doesn't so the fee posted after having the card for a month.  So I wasn't sure if the same applied in this case.

That's a bit different as you had the other card for 12+ months. Opening a card, grabbing the points and closing immediately to try and void the annual fee is definitely a good way to get yourself blacklisted. Personally I would just pay the annual fee.

I will do that.  But it should be OK to cancel next year when they hit me with the fee again, right?

Most people try to avoid the annual fee on the second year.  There are multiple ways to do it.  Canceling is one of the that works pretty well.  Sometimes you can ask for retention offers and get it waived.  Downgrading or product changing can work.  Sometimes (rarely IMHO) it can be worth keeping and paying the fee if the ongoing benefits are worth it to you.

[Padonak]

I opened a Delta Amex card in June this year and already got 60K points for 2K spend. Later that month, I received another Delta Amex offer by mail: this time, 70K miles for 2K spend. I tried to apply for the second card while the first card was still open, and the application was cancelled (they didn't pull credit). Called reconsideration line and they said it was because I already had another card. They also said that if i apply for another card I may not be eligible for bonus.  So I closed the first Delta card immediately and will try to apply for a second card again using the same offer for 70K. Has anybody tried to do the same with Delta cards? There is no lifetime language in either offer btw. I hope that if i am not eligible for a bonus, they will either cancel my application again or give me a warning message that i will not receive the miles.

[secondcor521]

I opened a Delta Amex card in June this year and already got 60K points for 2K spend. Later that month, I received another Delta Amex offer by mail: this time, 70K miles for 2K spend. I tried to apply for the second card while the first card was still open, and the application was cancelled (they didn't pull credit). Called reconsideration line and they said it was because I already had another card. They also said that if i apply for another card I may not be eligible for bonus.  So I closed the first Delta card immediately and will try to apply for a second card again using the same offer for 70K. Has anybody tried to do the same with Delta cards? There is no lifetime language in either offer btw. I hope that if i am not eligible for a bonus, they will either cancel my application again or give me a warning message that i will not receive the miles.

As long as the lifetime language is not there, you should get the bonus.

However, if you are not eligible for whatever reason, they will not cancel your application for that reason.  They will not give you any warning message.  They will let you spend the required amount.  And then they will not give you the bonus.

You can always ask via chat after getting the card in the mail to be sure you'll qualify before going through the spend.

[Rubic]

I have Amex Hilton Honors Business card.  The bonus points for spending $3000  in the first 3 months just posted.  The card has $95 annual fee.  Does anyone know if canceling the card right immediately after the fee posted will case them to take away the points?

If the points make it into your Hilton Honors account, probably not.

They will possibly blacklist you from any more AMEX cards, and they definitely will not refund you the $95.

That is my general opinion based on experience, but I have no direct data to support it.

They refunded the fee on another card I just canceled after the fee posted.  I canceled the month it posted, which was the 13th month of having the card. That card had first year fee waved though, but the Hilton Honors doesn't so the fee posted after having the card for a month.  So I wasn't sure if the same applied in this case.

That's a bit different as you had the other card for 12+ months. Opening a card, grabbing the points and closing immediately to try and void the annual fee is definitely a good way to get yourself blacklisted. Personally I would just pay the annual fee.

I will do that.  But it should be OK to cancel next year when they hit me with the fee again, right?

Yes, cancelling next year will be no problem.  You'll be refunded your annual fee if you cancel the card within 30 days of when the fee hits.

Especially for Amex cards, it's always recommended to avoid cancelling their cards in the first 12 months.

[HPstache]

So let me get this straight... because this is new information for me.  I applied for the Capitalone Savor Card this year and got their $500 cashback bonus for spending $3k in 3 months.  This card has a $95 annual fee that is waived for the first year.  My plan was to cancel in month 11.  This is a bad idea?  I should just pay the fee and cancel in the 23rd month to stay in some sort of good standing with them?

[bacchi]

So let me get this straight... because this is new information for me.  I applied for the Capitalone Savor Card this year and got their $500 cashback bonus for spending $3k in 3 months.  This card has a $95 annual fee that is waived for the first year.  My plan was to cancel in month 11.  This is a bad idea?  I should just pay the fee and cancel in the 23rd month to stay in some sort of good standing with them?

No, you cancel in month 13, just after the fee hits. The fee is refunded.

[DadJokes]

So let me get this straight... because this is new information for me.  I applied for the Capitalone Savor Card this year and got their $500 cashback bonus for spending $3k in 3 months.  This card has a $95 annual fee that is waived for the first year.  My plan was to cancel in month 11.  This is a bad idea?  I should just pay the fee and cancel in the 23rd month to stay in some sort of good standing with them?

No, you cancel in month 13, just after the fee hits. The fee is refunded.

Or downgrade to the Savor One, which has no annual fee, rather than cancel.

[MasterStache]

So let me get this straight... because this is new information for me.  I applied for the Capitalone Savor Card this year and got their $500 cashback bonus for spending $3k in 3 months.  This card has a $95 annual fee that is waived for the first year.  My plan was to cancel in month 11.  This is a bad idea?  I should just pay the fee and cancel in the 23rd month to stay in some sort of good standing with them?

I think you may be confused. The original question was about cancelling the card in the first month, right after hitting the minimum spend, and then trying to get the annual fee refunded on a card that didn't have the annual fee waived the first year.