Author Topic: Tenants will not leave  (Read 13481 times)

sequoia

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Re: Tenants will not leave
« Reply #50 on: July 05, 2017, 08:21:13 PM »
Hire an attorney to evict.  The attorney will be able to do it cheap, and make sure you do it correct.

I evicted a woman with stage 4 terminal breast cancer.  She died 6-moth after she moved out.  in MN, hospital is no excuse.  A judge may give them another 30 days, but they will be out.
It's disturbing enough that you did this but the fact you tote it as a shining example is even worse.

Clearly your empathy and compassion buttons don't work.


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So according to you, landlord should let tenants stay even when they can not pay? How do you pay your mortgage in this case? Does your bank let you skip a few months when the tenant is not paying rental? Or maybe you do not have mortgage.

Would you mind explaining your position here?

rpr

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Re: Tenants will not leave
« Reply #51 on: July 05, 2017, 08:30:55 PM »
^ I agree, Cwadda, but I do draw a line. Medical outcomes, for example, can vary per support vs stress. So, there are places I make exceptions. A tenant with Stage 4 cancer was actually one of my exceptions, per input from the hospital social worker re: statistical outcomes in relation to moves, etc.

A landlord is absolutely entitled to make whatever decisions she is permitted under law to make, but sometimes we have enough that we can also help a person out (if we want to).

A cool workaround can be to engage an agency to help. It's not always as limited as "tenant loses or landlord loses." I had great success asking agencies (with a tenant's permission) to bridge gaps. Win win.

Joon -- great post.

monstermonster

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Re: Tenants will not leave
« Reply #52 on: July 05, 2017, 08:34:04 PM »

jooniFLORisploo

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Re: Tenants will not leave
« Reply #53 on: July 05, 2017, 08:34:20 PM »
sequoia, I gave an example of one strategy I used: Bring a social agency in to relieve the gap months.

Also, most landlords build into their business plan periods of zero rent per unit, as they are urged to. That's generally to cover vacancies -or periods of tenants inappropriately not paying- but the math shouldn't change just because it's actually occupied during the planned no-rent period.
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Dicey

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Re: Tenants will not leave
« Reply #54 on: July 06, 2017, 12:39:28 AM »
NNL's response made me incredibly sad, and Cassie helped me regain my footing. Cassie gave me happier happiness than NNL's story's sad sadness*. Then dear MM came through with a lovely illustration of the principle. Yay for the good stories!

*Channeling my best inner Jooni in this sentence.
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beltim

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Re: Tenants will not leave
« Reply #55 on: July 06, 2017, 04:48:44 AM »
Hire an attorney to evict.  The attorney will be able to do it cheap, and make sure you do it correct.

I evicted a woman with stage 4 terminal breast cancer.  She died 6-moth after she moved out.  in MN, hospital is no excuse.  A judge may give them another 30 days, but they will be out.
It's disturbing enough that you did this but the fact you tote it as a shining example is even worse.

Clearly your empathy and compassion buttons don't work.


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So according to you, landlord should let tenants stay even when they can not pay? How do you pay your mortgage in this case? Does your bank let you skip a few months when the tenant is not paying rental? Or maybe you do not have mortgage.

Would you mind explaining your position here?

You are jumping to conclusions.  NoNonsenseLandlord gave no reason for eviction, but you assumed that the tenants could not or would not pay rent.  You might want to examine your assumptions before responding.

Cwadda

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Re: Tenants will not leave
« Reply #56 on: July 06, 2017, 07:19:20 AM »
Cwadda: at the time I was married to a man that did not have a lot of empathy for people and even he wanted to help.  This young woman lived in a studio that was in the back of our home. We used her rent to help pay our mortgage and we were young with 3 kids and not a lot of $. But we were frugal and made it work.  We did not let her live there free forever. Just long enough for her leg to heal and her to go back to work. I felt great about the decision and would do it again if in the same position.  Sometimes it is just the right thing to do.

You don't need to justify your response - you've done the right thing. I'm playing the devil's advocate here. The fact of the matter is if you have a tenant that doesn't pay his/her rent, you will lose a lot of money, and even worse, could lose your house. What if that tenant you helped wasn't so pleasant and refused to pay even after she was back on her feet? What if she stayed there for another 6 months, refusing to pay rent? You'd be out about $5000 in rent plus lawyer fees. And what if they decided they didn't like you and tore up the place before you got them out?

You're the good Samaritan but I want people to at least see the other side.

Cwadda

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Re: Tenants will not leave
« Reply #57 on: July 06, 2017, 07:23:52 AM »
Hire an attorney to evict.  The attorney will be able to do it cheap, and make sure you do it correct.

I evicted a woman with stage 4 terminal breast cancer.  She died 6-moth after she moved out.  in MN, hospital is no excuse.  A judge may give them another 30 days, but they will be out.
It's disturbing enough that you did this but the fact you tote it as a shining example is even worse.

Clearly your empathy and compassion buttons don't work.


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There is a man in my office who is the nicest, most positive man you'd ever meet. He has a rental property and had a similar situation. Woman was a great tenant for 6 years, got diagnosed with breast cancer, and declined in paying rent until it amounted to none. This went on for 6 months until he was finally forced to evict. Did he feel personally terrible about it? Yes. But he lost $6000 + lawyer fees in just that time period. He has a property manager now.

Fishindude

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Re: Tenants will not leave
« Reply #58 on: July 06, 2017, 08:45:43 AM »
I had a similar issue with a property I bough at Sheriffs sale.  The previous owner and his kids were flat broke and had no place to go.   
Since the outside of the place was a mess, I had a dumpster brought in then told him I'd pay him $500 to clean up all the junk in the yard by XX date and move out.   He cleaned things up but didn't move out, so I had to get the Sheriff involved.  Paid him the $500 soon as he vacated which hopefully helped him rent a place.

doublethinkmoney

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Re: Tenants will not leave
« Reply #59 on: July 06, 2017, 09:42:10 AM »
Hire an attorney to evict.  The attorney will be able to do it cheap, and make sure you do it correct.

I evicted a woman with stage 4 terminal breast cancer.  She died 6-moth after she moved out.  in MN, hospital is no excuse.  A judge may give them another 30 days, but they will be out.
It's disturbing enough that you did this but the fact you tote it as a shining example is even worse.

Clearly your empathy and compassion buttons don't work.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

So according to you, landlord should let tenants stay even when they can not pay? How do you pay your mortgage in this case? Does your bank let you skip a few months when the tenant is not paying rental? Or maybe you do not have mortgage.

Would you mind explaining your position here?
I didn't say any of that, you did.

If you still "don't get it", then I was correct you lack empathy and compassion. I could spell it all out to you but you will simply try to pick apart every little word and come up with an analytical response.


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Cwadda

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Re: Tenants will not leave
« Reply #60 on: July 06, 2017, 11:59:41 AM »
Hire an attorney to evict.  The attorney will be able to do it cheap, and make sure you do it correct.

I evicted a woman with stage 4 terminal breast cancer.  She died 6-moth after she moved out.  in MN, hospital is no excuse.  A judge may give them another 30 days, but they will be out.
It's disturbing enough that you did this but the fact you tote it as a shining example is even worse.

Clearly your empathy and compassion buttons don't work.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

So according to you, landlord should let tenants stay even when they can not pay? How do you pay your mortgage in this case? Does your bank let you skip a few months when the tenant is not paying rental? Or maybe you do not have mortgage.

Would you mind explaining your position here?
I didn't say any of that, you did.

If you still "don't get it", then I was correct you lack empathy and compassion. I could spell it all out to you but you will simply try to pick apart every little word and come up with an analytical response.


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Clearly there's a difference in opinions. Simple as that.

Some are willing to help tenants by discounting/allowing free rent. Others are not. I respect both sides of the argument.

I'm not in the financial position to do the former but I hope to one day offer my rental units deeply discounted to veterans and service-disabled veterans.

Cassie

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Re: Tenants will not leave
« Reply #61 on: July 06, 2017, 02:15:02 PM »
Dicey: thanks so much for the kind words. We had some savings because even though we were young my DH was very frugal. Yes it was a hardship but she was young-age 20 with no family and had been there for 2 years.  It was just the right thing to do. Also if you have a rental you have to have $ like Joon said for when it was empty. There were no agencies to help back then because she had no children.  If you can't pay the mortgage with no renter then you are not financially in a position to have that rental. You can't afford it.  Occasionally we have helped someone out through out our lives and only once were we sorry.  People are more important then $.

sequoia

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Re: Tenants will not leave
« Reply #62 on: July 07, 2017, 10:08:59 PM »
Hire an attorney to evict.  The attorney will be able to do it cheap, and make sure you do it correct.

I evicted a woman with stage 4 terminal breast cancer.  She died 6-moth after she moved out.  in MN, hospital is no excuse.  A judge may give them another 30 days, but they will be out.
It's disturbing enough that you did this but the fact you tote it as a shining example is even worse.

Clearly your empathy and compassion buttons don't work.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

So according to you, landlord should let tenants stay even when they can not pay? How do you pay your mortgage in this case? Does your bank let you skip a few months when the tenant is not paying rental? Or maybe you do not have mortgage.

Would you mind explaining your position here?
I didn't say any of that, you did.

If you still "don't get it", then I was correct you lack empathy and compassion. I could spell it all out to you but you will simply try to pick apart every little word and come up with an analytical response.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Oh wow so now I am lack of empathy and compassion? From your responses,  I wonder who is lacking what here? Just because some of us may have different opinion than you, we are not lack of empathy and compassion.

There is a man in my office who is the nicest, most positive man you'd ever meet. He has a rental property and had a similar situation. Woman was a great tenant for 6 years, got diagnosed with breast cancer, and declined in paying rent until it amounted to none. This went on for 6 months until he was finally forced to evict. Did he feel personally terrible about it? Yes. But he lost $6000 + lawyer fees in just that time period. He has a property manager now.

I do not think this guy, who lost $6K in the process, is a person lack of empathy and compassion for evicting someone with breast cancer. Just stating my opinion...

« Last Edit: July 07, 2017, 10:18:44 PM by sequoia »

rachael talcott

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Re: Tenants will not leave
« Reply #63 on: July 08, 2017, 05:46:52 PM »
I'm interested to know what happened with the OP. Verbal contracts are generally legally binding, but at least according to a quick google search, it's illegal in IL to have a verbal lease of longer than a year. 

FerrumB5

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Re: Tenants will not leave
« Reply #64 on: July 08, 2017, 10:03:46 PM »
No updates yet. But it looks like the situation sloooowly gets resolved. Inlaws lawyer is out of town this week. I don't go into dirty details with them - just high level QA. More to follow

sequoia

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Re: Tenants will not leave
« Reply #65 on: July 09, 2017, 09:38:35 AM »
No updates yet. But it looks like the situation sloooowly gets resolved. Inlaws lawyer is out of town this week. I don't go into dirty details with them - just high level QA. More to follow

Glad to hear things are progressing. Please keep us updated. I am interested to know how to get this resolved.

sequoia

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Re: Tenants will not leave
« Reply #66 on: July 09, 2017, 09:55:13 AM »
You are jumping to conclusions.  NoNonsenseLandlord gave no reason for eviction, but you assumed that the tenants could not or would not pay rent.  You might want to examine your assumptions before responding.

@beltim I do not assume. This is where story is told: http://www.nononsenselandlord.com/2017/04/when-should-you-evict-a-tenant/

You too, may want to examine your assumptions before responding :)

beltim

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Re: Tenants will not leave
« Reply #67 on: July 09, 2017, 11:18:34 AM »
You are jumping to conclusions.  NoNonsenseLandlord gave no reason for eviction, but you assumed that the tenants could not or would not pay rent.  You might want to examine your assumptions before responding.

@beltim I do not assume. This is where story is told: http://www.nononsenselandlord.com/2017/04/when-should-you-evict-a-tenant/

You too, may want to examine your assumptions before responding :)

I am not going to someone's blog to read their justification for evicting someone with stage 4 breast cancer when they can't be bothered to type it here.

Cassie

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Re: Tenants will not leave
« Reply #68 on: July 09, 2017, 03:09:11 PM »
Some people do not have empathy and compassion for others.  $ is not everything.  Sometimes doing the right thing costs $. If you live so close to the edge that not getting a few months rent will cause you to lose the house then you should not be a landlord because you obviously can not afford it.

Cwadda

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Re: Tenants will not leave
« Reply #69 on: July 09, 2017, 03:52:31 PM »
I'm going to resign from further discussion because I think everyone has made their points.

ender

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Re: Tenants will not leave
« Reply #70 on: July 09, 2017, 03:58:14 PM »
Some people do not have empathy and compassion for others.  $ is not everything.  Sometimes doing the right thing costs $. If you live so close to the edge that not getting a few months rent will cause you to lose the house then you should not be a landlord because you obviously can not afford it.

It's amusing to me you can be so quick to condemn someone else without even trying to be empathetic and understand the circumstances which led to the event you are condemning.

Cassie

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Re: Tenants will not leave
« Reply #71 on: July 09, 2017, 04:19:58 PM »
The circumstances were not posted as to their reasons and as someone else said I will not go to someone's blog that did this to read about it.

Dicey

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Re: Tenants will not leave
« Reply #72 on: July 10, 2017, 02:40:27 AM »
Yeah, so I get that you guys don't want to go to the blog, but why bust someone's chops who clearly knows more of the back story? Doesn't make a lick of sense to me. Sequoia, who knows more of the story, offers an opinion, gets questioned by you, provides the key to the missing information and y'all can't bothered to find out if your conclusions are based on the facts? Messed up.


ETA: fixed typo.
« Last Edit: July 10, 2017, 06:32:11 PM by Dicey »
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jooniFLORisploo

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Re: Tenants will not leave
« Reply #73 on: July 10, 2017, 07:40:57 AM »
I read the blog post.
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bobechs

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Re: Tenants will not leave
« Reply #74 on: July 10, 2017, 09:45:07 AM »
I read the blog post too.

As I pretty much expected; tendentious and smug at the same time.  Smugly tendentious, not a happy combo.

shawndoggy

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Re: Tenants will not leave
« Reply #75 on: July 10, 2017, 09:56:29 AM »
why would a tenant's stage 4 breast cancer be a landlord's problem?  Will the tenant's credit card company still extend credit for nonpayment to a cancer patient?  Car lender?  Landlord's lender? 

If you can't be the bad guy, then residential leasing may not be for you.

being a landlord is a tough game played on thin margins.  You need to protect yourself to make money (or not lose your shirt).  This is why there are leases and why there are eviction statutes.  Everyone agrees to the rules while times are good.  All tenants are going to have a sob story when the rent is late.  every single one. 

jooniFLORisploo

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Re: Tenants will not leave
« Reply #76 on: July 10, 2017, 10:17:23 AM »
Quote
why would a tenant's stage 4 breast cancer be a landlord's problem?

It's not.

But it is her opportunity to extend compassion, to increase vs decrease the tenant's chances of survival, to act out of humanity, to gift a fellow person.

Quote
Will the tenant's credit card company still extend credit for nonpayment to a cancer patient?  Car lender?

Yes, some do.

Quote
Landlord's lender?

No.

So, I think we all agree that a landlord is indeed required to pay a landlord's bills. And that a landlord is by no means obligated to provide free or reduced rent now and then. I don't think anyone is saying otherwise.

But when someone is well off, and is in a position to help someone in an extreme circumstance, it's okay to help...even if we're a landlord and the person in trouble is our tenant :)

Quote
If you can't be the bad guy, then residential leasing may not be for you.

Agreed.

But standing by a lease in normal circumstances and being a jerk are two different things. To be an effective landlord, one must be strong, assertive, able to stand for themselves, recognize a problem and address it swiftly and properly. But it doesn't mean we need to be aggressive, uncharitable, mean, etc. Those are very different things.

Quote
being a landlord is a tough game played on thin margins.

Not always. Some landlords are in excellent positions, playing on wide margins.

It's generally recommended that one avoid landlording if it can only happen on very thin margins. A good business has some wiggle room, because stuff will come up.

Quote
You need to protect yourself to make money (or not lose your shirt).

Agreed.

But generally we protect ourselves as landlords by implementing legal agreements up front, honouring the laws along the way, ensuring the rents cover what they need to cover, having financial room for several months of no rent, etc.

Quote
This is why there are leases and why there are eviction statutes.  Everyone agrees to the rules while times are good.  All tenants are going to have a sob story when the rent is late.  every single one.

This hasn't been the case in my experience. Plenty of people have said they don't have the rent, acknowledge they fucked up, accept the resulting eviction, and move on. All is well.

Even if "every single one" came up with a sob story, we can assess an excuse vs a tragedy. I don't extend anything in the former, and extend stuff in the latter. It's okay to mix and match as fits.
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shawndoggy

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Re: Tenants will not leave
« Reply #77 on: July 10, 2017, 10:42:30 AM »
^^^^ agree with all of that.  Basically, it's in the LL's discretion to be compassionate/charitable (or not).  There's certainly no requirement to do so.  If an individual wants to make a gift out of the goodness of THEIR heart, that's one thing.  It's quite another to be criticized here for not extending what some seem to think is "the Man's" obligation to be generous.

Cassie

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Re: Tenants will not leave
« Reply #78 on: July 10, 2017, 01:48:57 PM »
Joon: you said it so beautifully!  Some people have compassion and empathy and some do not.

Dicey

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Re: Tenants will not leave
« Reply #79 on: July 10, 2017, 06:39:12 PM »
Jooniploo, I loved your reply!

What gets me about NNL's response was that they seemed proud of their "No Nonsense" actions. Had I been the LL who made such a decision, there is no fucking way I'd share it publicly, as if I was proud of my actions. The former tenant's death six months later would haunt me for life.
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ender

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Re: Tenants will not leave
« Reply #80 on: July 10, 2017, 06:44:06 PM »
I'm just assuming everyone slamming nononsenselandlord regularly donate $1000+ every month to charity (or whatever that rent would have cost) to back up these positions where you judge someone else for not being generous with their money.

It's far easier to be righteous about someone else's money than your own.

And no, "not knowing about needs" isn't even remotely a good justification for not doing this, because unless you live under a rock of selfrighteousness there are tons of opportunities to be generous to people just as in need as someone with terminal breast cancer.


jooniFLORisploo

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Re: Tenants will not leave
« Reply #81 on: July 10, 2017, 07:19:10 PM »
I do, and I bet others do also, ender :)
Give the big cash for several months of rent.
Forgo rent during a tragedy.
Send bail money, etc.
Work hard with social service agencies to direct cash, housing, etc, to people in serious need.
Volunteer to write grant proposals to put affordable housing programs in place, etc.

I gave an example specific to stage four breast cancer in my landlording. It was very expensive, and I've always been glad of the decision I made.

Many in the MMM community are very generous -with cash, with room inside their real estate, with time, etc.

I'm not assuming nononsenselandlord does nothing. But I wouldn't assume those balking do nothing, either.
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Paul der Krake

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Re: Tenants will not leave
« Reply #82 on: July 10, 2017, 07:26:22 PM »
Send bail money, etc.
I'm very curious to hear the story behind this. Did you bail one of your tenants out of jail?

jooniFLORisploo

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Re: Tenants will not leave
« Reply #83 on: July 10, 2017, 08:36:14 PM »
No, not a tenant.
ender had asked about giving to charities, and I was giving examples in relation to my tenants, other people's tenants, and charity in general.

Total aside: The bail out program provides money for people stuck in jails pre-hearing over things like: jaywalking, living with the wrong person, etc. Things wealthier people can get themselves out on. (Though, I guess it can relate directly to tenancies, because too many people lose their homes because they got stuck in a trap like that.)

I do believe the optimal "charity" we can do is directly, when we're aware of a person and their specific circumstances. A bit of short term help can make all the difference in the trajectory of the person's life.
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jooniFLORisploo

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Re: Tenants will not leave
« Reply #84 on: July 10, 2017, 08:47:50 PM »
I was thinking earlier about one point of difference. I believe it was nononsenselandlord's blog post that repeated, "...so you can make more money." For NoNonsenseLandlord, that's worth booting out a tenant that has paid his rent on time every month for seven years straight, for example.

This seems to be the point of divergence.

A lot of people here believe something more like, "It's about getting enough to live on, then sharing, contributing, etc." I think that's more where Mr MM comes from (environmental stuff, teaching, donating $100k), and a bunch of forumites too. For a lot of us it's not "all about the money." Money is one aspect, and even then only a tool to achieve other things, not something to just gather and gather no matter what.

For sure not everyone can yet afford to give -whether via some months of rent forgiveness, direct cash gifts, etc- but many give what they can now, began giving as soon as they achieved a certain point, have major sharing part of their FIRE plan, etc. And giving to our closest neighbour as well as people much farther away is legit.
« Last Edit: July 10, 2017, 08:51:02 PM by jooniFLORisploo »
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Paul der Krake

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Re: Tenants will not leave
« Reply #85 on: July 10, 2017, 09:24:28 PM »
I think the hangup here is that we make a distinction between active and passive generosity.

Let's assume that I know of a neighbor in need. I could give them $1,000 tomorrow, and it would have pretty much no effect on my bottom line. Very few people would dare to chastise me for not giving them $1,000, because the default action is to do nothing.

Now if I were the neighbor in need's landlord, there is a societal expectation that I forego the owed rent. The default action is to let it slide, and filing for eviction is viewed as an aggressive act.

NoNonsenseLandlord makes no such distinction: eviction is the default, logical conclusion. If he decides to be generous, it will be on his terms, for a cause of his choosing. Not the one that shows up on his doorstep.

jooniFLORisploo

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Re: Tenants will not leave
« Reply #86 on: July 10, 2017, 09:33:00 PM »
Quote
Now if I were the neighbor in need's landlord, there is a societal expectation that I forego the owed rent. The default action is to let it slide, and filing for eviction is viewed as an aggressive act.

I'm not sure... This isn't the case for me, at least. I don't have an expectation that someone forgo the rent, nor do I view eviction (in general) as aggressive. (I evicted three tenants, and facilitated a mutual agreement to end a third tenancy. I see none of those acts as aggressive.)

NNL is running a business, purely for profit (and that's okay).
Other business owners (including some landlords) run a business with a two-fold intention: make money; help others. These ones may consider circumstances, nuances, etc.

I recognize that NNL may also give to others in other ways.
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FerrumB5

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Re: Tenants will not leave
« Reply #87 on: July 10, 2017, 09:35:59 PM »
Guys. Didn't read all posts since last time (sorry, busy times).
Inlaws are going to collect the last prorated paycheck. Closing is on 25th of July. Should they or should they absolutely NOT cash the check before closing? Thanks!!!

former player

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Re: Tenants will not leave
« Reply #88 on: July 11, 2017, 02:26:54 AM »
Does "prorated paycheck" mean that the tenants have agreed to pay rent up to the date of sale, rather than for the full period which would be due if not for the sale?  If so, that looks a bit like an agreement by them to end the tenancy on that date, which would be good because you may not then need an eviction order but just be able to treat them as squatters once the sale date is reached. BUT  I think you would need proper legal advice on that, not internet advice. 

Also, if the rent is paid up to the date of sale, that doesn't leave much scope for taking action to then get them out in time.  Does your jurisdiction have a way of getting squatters out on the day?

I would feel more comfortable if I knew what arrangements the tenants had made to move on: do they have a new address (you can ask in order to forward post, etc.), have they booked a removals company, etc.
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FerrumB5

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Re: Tenants will not leave
« Reply #89 on: July 11, 2017, 11:01:22 AM »

I would feel more comfortable if I knew what arrangements the tenants had made to move on: do they have a new address (you can ask in order to forward post, etc.), have they booked a removals company, etc.

Very murky here. Husband is partially disabled, cannot do any work on packing. Wife does not respond to calls or texts. But in-laws informed them via voice and text about the date. If that falls thru.. I don't know.. it's not my house so I try to stay away from their legal stuff while still looking up for solutions here and giving them informal advice here and there

Lepetitange3

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Re: Tenants will not leave
« Reply #90 on: July 11, 2017, 11:06:59 AM »
Send certified letter asap.  That way there is a firm date for the court to start things from

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Re: Tenants will not leave
« Reply #91 on: July 20, 2017, 09:15:51 AM »
Upd.
In-laws collected their rent for the last month of July (they are supposed to vacate on 31st), and ta-daaaa - tenants took their security deposit OUT of that check. WHAT THE F%$%#? I think in-laws are just going to close eyes on that IF they move out on said date. But who does that?????

jooniFLORisploo

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Re: Tenants will not leave
« Reply #92 on: July 20, 2017, 09:18:00 AM »
Where I am, it is legal to skip the entire last month's rent in a situation such as this one, so again, depending on your region's laws, it may be lots of people doing so :)
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Gronnie

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Re: Tenants will not leave
« Reply #93 on: July 20, 2017, 10:25:00 AM »
Upd.
In-laws collected their rent for the last month of July (they are supposed to vacate on 31st), and ta-daaaa - tenants took their security deposit OUT of that check. WHAT THE F%$%#? I think in-laws are just going to close eyes on that IF they move out on said date. But who does that?????

Situations like tenants taking security deposit out of last month's rent makes me wonder if they even understand what a security deposit is for?

Cassie

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Re: Tenants will not leave
« Reply #94 on: July 20, 2017, 01:00:44 PM »
 It is not legal in the states to do that. I hope they just move out.

FerrumB5

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Re: Tenants will not leave
« Reply #95 on: July 20, 2017, 01:16:41 PM »
I do hope they get the hell out of the house and it will be a closed chapter. Fucking idiots that think their life changes should affect the owners decision to sell the house with no fixed rent.

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Re: Tenants will not leave
« Reply #96 on: July 20, 2017, 01:52:51 PM »
It is not legal in the states to do that. I hope they just move out.

It is legal in many US States. So much so that I have had landlords a little put out when I pay my last month's rent because they were going to have to write me a check later.

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Re: Tenants will not leave
« Reply #97 on: July 20, 2017, 02:19:42 PM »
Then there is no point in having a deposit which is for damages.  I only know it was not legal in our state at the time but who knows now.

jooniFLORisploo

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Re: Tenants will not leave
« Reply #98 on: July 20, 2017, 03:02:02 PM »
Then there is no point in having a deposit which is for damages.

Where I am (and I speak only to that, because each region's laws are specific and each landlord and tenant needs to take the time to look theirs up), the security deposit doesn't mean a heck of a lot, that's true.

If the landlord feels like keeping it, the tenant has to chase them through a challenged system. If the tenant does more damage than the $250 (example) deposit can cover, the landlord has to chase the tenant through the challenged system.

It seems almost more like a cheap reminder to all parties that there are expectations and rules, but on its own merit it only works if both parties are responsible, honest, and fair.

To be clear, my earlier note referenced not damages or a deposit, specifically, but the tenant's right to the last month's rent free when evicted for no-cause (such as new ownership). The tenant can pay the rent and wait for the landlord to pay the exact same amount back, or simply not pay the last month's. This amount is distinct from the security deposit, though (and if the landlord doesn't make proper claim for it, and doesn't pay it back within a very short period after the tenancy ends, the landlord is liable to pay double).
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sequoia

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Re: Tenants will not leave
« Reply #99 on: July 21, 2017, 07:17:29 AM »
Quote
Now if I were the neighbor in need's landlord, there is a societal expectation that I forego the owed rent. The default action is to let it slide, and filing for eviction is viewed as an aggressive act.

I'm not sure... This isn't the case for me, at least. I don't have an expectation that someone forgo the rent, nor do I view eviction (in general) as aggressive. (I evicted three tenants, and facilitated a mutual agreement to end a third tenancy. I see none of those acts as aggressive.)

NNL is running a business, purely for profit (and that's okay).
Other business owners (including some landlords) run a business with a two-fold intention: make money; help others. These ones may consider circumstances, nuances, etc.

I recognize that NNL may also give to others in other ways.

This ^

I do not know how everyone do their lease agreement, but I do not consider societal expectation into the lease agreement I use. Raise of hand if anyone has that written in the lease agreement?

Eviction is absolutely not aggressive act, otherwise no one would pay rent (and I would be renting too if I know I will not get evicted when I do not pay my rent).

Running a business for profit is VERY ok. And it is ok to forgo the rent IF you want to. It is your house if you want to let someone stay there, and pay or not pay you, that should be entirely the decision of the owner/landlord.

To expect someone to do the same thing as you would (or what you think societal expectation is), and condemn that person because you do not agree with his action... that just... wrong (for the lack of better term - have not have my coffee this morning).

@FerrumB5 - I hope they leave before you close the house. Sending good vibes that this will be resolved asap, and everyone can learn something in the process. Thank you for sharing!