Author Topic: Wood stove - looking for recommendations  (Read 9314 times)

Landlady

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Wood stove - looking for recommendations
« on: August 12, 2016, 12:32:01 PM »
We're building a house and will be using a wood stove for the majority of our heating because our property borders a National Forest with much downed wood available for a small annual fee. Research on wood stoves is proving harder than I thought to gather. I thought I'd ask the Mustache Community to see if anyone has gone through similar research and come out with a recommended wood stove.

The house is 1,750 sqft with a modern rustic aesthetic.
Efficiency is important so we aren't spewing emissions into our valley.

Thanks in advance! If it turns out that no one has recommendations I'll develop my own spreadsheet of specs/prices in case anyone could use it as well.

Mtngrl

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Re: Wood stove - looking for recommendations
« Reply #1 on: August 13, 2016, 08:37:48 AM »
We went with a soapstone stove -- I believe the brand is Hearthstone. Looks great. I like that the stone heats up and emits heat even after the fire goes out. We got the mid-size model and heat a 2100 square foot house (all one story.) It's efficient -- so much so that it can be tricky to light -- we find we have to leave the door open for ten minutes or so when we first start the fire. Often we still have coals in the morning with which to light a new fire.

We had Vermont Castings in our previous house and that one did very well also. The Hearthstone was more expensive than the Vermont Castings but we really liked the soapstone.

Rightflyer

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Re: Wood stove - looking for recommendations
« Reply #2 on: August 13, 2016, 08:45:46 AM »
We have a Napoleon 1150P.

Works like a charm keeping 1500 ft2 warm all through the Canadian winters... and you can cook on it as well.

http://www.efireplacestore.com/npl-1150p.html
« Last Edit: August 13, 2016, 08:47:24 AM by Rightflyer »

Frs1661

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Re: Wood stove - looking for recommendations
« Reply #3 on: August 13, 2016, 08:48:36 AM »
My parents have had a jotel for about a decade and it's been working great. It has a nice enamel finish that still looks great.

http://jotul.com/us/home

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Dancin'Dog

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Re: Wood stove - looking for recommendations
« Reply #4 on: August 13, 2016, 09:07:39 AM »
We just started heating with wood last year.  I really enjoyed it, but wish I'd bought a little larger unit because I have to cut the logs pretty short to fit in our stove.  (I'm away from home & can't recall the length.  I think it's less than 16".) 

I bought a Bosca stove made in Brazil (I think) on ebay for $650 delivered, which was about $1000 less than Home Depot & Northern Tool was selling them for.  That was 2 or 3 years ago.  I'm pleased with the stove, except the small firebox.  Btw, the stovepipes cost more than the stove.  I think I paid about $800 for all the parts to run through the wall and up 2 stories.  Double wall insulated SS pipe for the exterior is expensive.  You can use uninsulated pipe outside because it gets cold & won't draft well. 

Slideguy

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Re: Wood stove - looking for recommendations
« Reply #5 on: August 25, 2016, 11:23:52 AM »
^^This. But not too bad if you are going to cut your own wood then you can mange the lengths easily enough. If you buy any wood then you must specify the length and that can often result in paying more because they have to stray from their normal cutting dimensions.
Woodstoves have definitely become more efficient in providing a cleaner burn recently as well. Think of it as an investment though when looking at costs. You are going to use day in and day out and want something that will last.

Skinflint

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Re: Wood stove - looking for recommendations
« Reply #6 on: August 25, 2016, 03:50:58 PM »
I've also heard great things about the Hearthstone. 

However, for a more budget friendly choice, you should check out the Englander 30NC.  This can be purchased at Home Depot for $900 plus tax (but quite a bit less if you can find a good Home Depot coupon).  Find a local stove expert to install it for you or you can always DIY to be even more mustachian.

It will do a great job of heating your home and is EPA certified to burn with very low emissions.  They also have a good reputation for being reliable and low maintenance.

There are fancier, and prettier stoves out there.  But for the heat delivery per dollar, there's probably no better deal than the Englander 30NC.

http://www.homedepot.com/p/Englander-2-400-sq-ft-Wood-Burning-Stove-30-NCH/100291302

Spork

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Re: Wood stove - looking for recommendations
« Reply #7 on: August 25, 2016, 04:16:29 PM »

I can dis-recommend Vermont Castings "Resolute Acclaim".  It's pretty.  It heats okay.  But it is high maintenance.  The secondary combustion chamber seems to last 3-4 seasons.  (I don't have experience with their other stoves, but I suspect any of them with a secondary combustion chamber are similar.)

Dancin'Dog

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Re: Wood stove - looking for recommendations
« Reply #8 on: August 25, 2016, 05:05:31 PM »

I can dis-recommend Vermont Castings "Resolute Acclaim".  It's pretty.  It heats okay.  But it is high maintenance.  The secondary combustion chamber seems to last 3-4 seasons.  (I don't have experience with their other stoves, but I suspect any of them with a secondary combustion chamber are similar.)

My Bosca has a upper baffle plate that also needs to be replaced every few seasons too.  I will probably have to fabricate the replacement since I don't think the brand is imported any longer.  Maybe I'll beef it up or use stainless, so it will last longer. 

OutlierinMA

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Re: Wood stove - looking for recommendations
« Reply #9 on: November 16, 2016, 02:43:42 PM »
After lots and lots of research we just purchased and installed a Woodstock Ideal Steel Hybrid, which won a design award for affordability, efficiency, emissions, etc. in 2013. It hasn't gotten very cold here yet, so our real world experience is negligible, but we are heating our newly insulated 1800 square foot home with wood and expect this to keep us toasty.

With my research I found that people strong opinions regarding stove brands and especially catalyst vs non-catalyst, but that in general of the major brands we considered: Jotul are very well made and very simple so nothing ever breaks, Vermont Castings seem to be very problematic (lots of things go wrong and need repair), and Hearthstone seem to get good reviews but not as good as Jotul. But Hearthstone was our favorite in the stove shop we visited - they have a large stove with beautiful wooden handles (the Manchester) that would have been ours if we hadn't gone with Woodstock.

We bought our stove due to great reviews for Woodstock, but we were also lucky to be close enough to the factory in NH to pick it up ourselves - these folks don't use dealers. Our reasons for buying it in addition to the great reviews: It is massive in size so we can fit 22" logs and pack it with wood to burn for 12 hours. It has a catalytic converter so will burn extra clean even if we burn it low and slow in spring and autumn when it is above freezing - essential for right now, for example. It was very affordable compared to the other stoves we looked at - $2,200 total versus $3K and up - though I know this is a lot more than some other stoves mentioned in the thread above. I also really liked the idea of soapstone for smoothing out the heat output but my better half preferred non-soapstone for quicker warm-up - the fact that this is a steel stove with soapstone lining allowed a compromise.

I spent a lot of time at the forums at Hearth.com reading posts and reviews, etc. and recommend poking around on there. I went back and forth between the positives and negatives of catalytic vs non-catalytic, but finally the higher efficiency at lower burn temperatures, plus the reviews of the Woodstock catalytic system, won me over.

So far we love this stove, but I'll have to add an update once it gets cold enough for more than one small fire in the morning! That has been all we've needed to keep the house comfortable so far. We can't wait for it to get cold, LOL, to really test it out.

Good luck!


gaja

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Re: Wood stove - looking for recommendations
« Reply #10 on: November 16, 2016, 03:19:48 PM »
I've grown up with Jøtul and Dovre fire places. They last for ever. The clean burning ones are much more effective, and pollute a lot less. I think they banned selling anything else in the EU, but I don't know about the US.
Dovre clean burn: http://dovre.co.uk/spec/cleanburn/
Jøtul clean burn: http://jotul.com/int/home/wood-burning-is-environmentally-concious-and-financially-profitable

The normal mistake people make when they buy wood stoves, is getting one that is too large. For our 2000 sqft house, we got a Dovre Tai 35. It is relatively small, 3.4-7.7 kW, but fits wood up to 35 cm. You can also get the Tai45, that fits wood up to 45 cm long. Couldn't find US links to this one, but it looks like you can get Dovre in the US, as well as Jøtul. http://dovre.co.uk/stoves-fires/tai-multi-fuel-wood-stoves/

If you have radiators or other types of water borne heating system, you could also consider getting a wood stove with a water mantle. Some enthusiasts even get those for heating water for showers and stuff, but that will never be economically sound. Those are very popular in Sweden, but I don't know enough about them to make any recommendations. This image search could give you some clues to look further? I'm probably using the wrong key words, because in English I could only find DIY and homestead links for producing hot water from the wood stove. The good thing about this, is that the heat will be more even; if you throw in too much wood, you don't have to start a sweat lodge because you want to avoid opening the windows and letting the precious heat out. Just heat some more water, and it evens out.

hyla

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Re: Wood stove - looking for recommendations
« Reply #11 on: November 20, 2016, 01:17:53 AM »

I can dis-recommend Vermont Castings "Resolute Acclaim".  It's pretty.  It heats okay.  But it is high maintenance.  The secondary combustion chamber seems to last 3-4 seasons.  (I don't have experience with their other stoves, but I suspect any of them with a secondary combustion chamber are similar.)

Disagree about Vermont Castings.  I've used their stoves in two different houses and think they are excellent.  Heat well, easy to load and clean out ashes, and seem to require a lot less fussing with the air intakes to get a good fire going than some other stoves I've used.  Oh, and one of the houses I heated with a Vermont castings stove was a drafty converted barn where we kept the oil at 50 and used wood for the rest of our heat, so I do know what I'm talking about in terms of using these stoves for actual heating. 

Spork

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Re: Wood stove - looking for recommendations
« Reply #12 on: November 20, 2016, 07:10:03 AM »

I can dis-recommend Vermont Castings "Resolute Acclaim".  It's pretty.  It heats okay.  But it is high maintenance.  The secondary combustion chamber seems to last 3-4 seasons.  (I don't have experience with their other stoves, but I suspect any of them with a secondary combustion chamber are similar.)

Disagree about Vermont Castings.  I've used their stoves in two different houses and think they are excellent.  Heat well, easy to load and clean out ashes, and seem to require a lot less fussing with the air intakes to get a good fire going than some other stoves I've used.  Oh, and one of the houses I heated with a Vermont castings stove was a drafty converted barn where we kept the oil at 50 and used wood for the rest of our heat, so I do know what I'm talking about in terms of using these stoves for actual heating.

I totally agree on easy to load and clean and not much fussing.  But the secondary combustion chamber is an Achilles heel.  It is fragile, expensive and a bit of a pain in the ass to replace.

darknight

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Re: Wood stove - looking for recommendations
« Reply #13 on: November 22, 2016, 02:10:38 PM »
Blaze King. So awesome

OutlierinMA

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Re: Wood stove - looking for recommendations
« Reply #14 on: December 11, 2016, 06:34:11 AM »

So far we love this stove, but I'll have to add an update once it gets cold enough for more than one small fire in the morning! That has been all we've needed to keep the house comfortable so far. We can't wait for it to get cold, LOL, to really test it out.


We're still really happy with the stove now that it is getting colder. The house can get chilly in the mornings (down to 61 this morning) but otherwise the stove keeps the whole house nice and toasty. I also wanted to add that this is a very user-friendly stove. Fires are easy to get started, even for a newbie (me).

neo von retorch

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Re: Wood stove - looking for recommendations
« Reply #15 on: December 15, 2016, 07:37:21 AM »
I have a Treemont... but it's so old that I can't even find any information about it on Google. You should definitely buy a Treemont!

Goldielocks

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Re: Wood stove - looking for recommendations
« Reply #16 on: January 02, 2017, 12:58:54 AM »
We have a Napoleon 1150P.

Works like a charm keeping 1500 ft2 warm all through the Canadian winters... and you can cook on it as well.

http://www.efireplacestore.com/npl-1150p.html

I have a smaller napolean, from 2005 or earlier, and it burns so cleanly, the chimney sweep suggested a longer interval between services.   Very hot.   I recommend getting the one mentioned by Rightflyer, for the heating  / cooking element.  I don't have that and would like to.

Cowardly Toaster

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Re: Wood stove - looking for recommendations
« Reply #17 on: January 03, 2017, 10:16:24 AM »
Anyone know anything about Swedish style woodstoves? They have multiple chambers and burn not just the wood but also the gas that the wood produces or something.

Mother Fussbudget

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Re: Wood stove - looking for recommendations
« Reply #18 on: January 03, 2017, 11:49:20 AM »
Anyone know anything about Swedish style woodstoves? They have multiple chambers and burn not just the wood but also the gas that the wood produces or something.

Swedish stoves have had catalytic combustors built-in for much longer than they've been required in the US.  Catalytic combustors are a secondary burn chamber with a (usually ceramic) element that ignites, and burns the smoke & soot giving ~30% increase in stove heat output efficiency while removing excess carbon from the flue gases. 

In the US, for wood burning heat, new regulations took effect after May 15, 2015 for wood & pellet stoves, hydronic furnaces, and small forced air furnaces.  If your furnace was manufactured after May 15, 2015, you should be okay and at least up to the Swedish levels.  If you go with an earlier wood stove, you may need to retro-fit with a catalytic combustor, and have it tested and certified by a local stove shop.

Spork

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Re: Wood stove - looking for recommendations
« Reply #19 on: January 03, 2017, 12:28:26 PM »
Anyone know anything about Swedish style woodstoves? They have multiple chambers and burn not just the wood but also the gas that the wood produces or something.

Swedish stoves have had catalytic combustors built-in for much longer than they've been required in the US.  Catalytic combustors are a secondary burn chamber with a (usually ceramic) element that ignites, and burns the smoke & soot giving ~30% increase in stove heat output efficiency while removing excess carbon from the flue gases. 

In the US, for wood burning heat, new regulations took effect after May 15, 2015 for wood & pellet stoves, hydronic furnaces, and small forced air furnaces.  If your furnace was manufactured after May 15, 2015, you should be okay and at least up to the Swedish levels.  If you go with an earlier wood stove, you may need to retro-fit with a catalytic combustor, and have it tested and certified by a local stove shop.

And I'll mention that a large number of US stoves before 2015 meet the standards.... and that many non-catalytic stoves meet the standards.   

gaja

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Re: Wood stove - looking for recommendations
« Reply #20 on: January 03, 2017, 01:21:33 PM »
Anyone know anything about Swedish style woodstoves? They have multiple chambers and burn not just the wood but also the gas that the wood produces or something.

Swedish stoves have had catalytic combustors built-in for much longer than they've been required in the US.  Catalytic combustors are a secondary burn chamber with a (usually ceramic) element that ignites, and burns the smoke & soot giving ~30% increase in stove heat output efficiency while removing excess carbon from the flue gases. 

In the US, for wood burning heat, new regulations took effect after May 15, 2015 for wood & pellet stoves, hydronic furnaces, and small forced air furnaces.  If your furnace was manufactured after May 15, 2015, you should be okay and at least up to the Swedish levels.  If you go with an earlier wood stove, you may need to retro-fit with a catalytic combustor, and have it tested and certified by a local stove shop.

Norway has similar rules to Sweden, so unless Dovre and Jøtul (Jotul) have produced simpler versions for the US market, those brands should also have catalytic combustors (mandatory since 1998).

Goldielocks

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Re: Wood stove - looking for recommendations
« Reply #21 on: January 04, 2017, 12:29:09 AM »
Anyone know anything about Swedish style woodstoves? They have multiple chambers and burn not just the wood but also the gas that the wood produces or something.

That's what EPA approved wood stoves in the USA / Canada do now as well.  (like my napolean stove)

gimp

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Re: Wood stove - looking for recommendations
« Reply #22 on: January 04, 2017, 07:43:51 PM »
Does nobody use masonry stoves? I grew up hearing about them, but I've never seen one being used.

Quidnon?

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Re: Wood stove - looking for recommendations
« Reply #23 on: January 04, 2017, 07:50:49 PM »
Does nobody use masonry stoves? I grew up hearing about them, but I've never seen one being used.

They are incredibly expensive.  However, if you have the space and sufficient support for the weight, a rocket mass heater is of a comparable efficiency as a masonry stove.

https://richsoil.com/rocket-stove-mass-heater.jsp

gimp

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Re: Wood stove - looking for recommendations
« Reply #24 on: January 05, 2017, 05:36:58 PM »
That looks a lot like a really nice version of a masonry stove, or even what the guy from Primitive Technology built, except he didn't have the heat riser that re-combusts gas. [Link](https://youtu.be/P73REgj-3UE?t=10m)

The rocket mass heater looks like someone took a masonry stove and made it a lot more efficient and modern. Similar concept - huge thermal mass, and instead of much of the heat blowing up out the chimney, it's designed to stay in the house as long as possible - but with much cleaner burn and much more efficiency.

Out of curiosity, is carbon monoxide a similarly serious issue with these? I know people have died when they've left just a bit of slow-burning wood in their masonry stove, which I assume is because it probably doesn't cause enough air current which means it doesn't burn cleanly. A quick google says a couple dozen people die in the UK from improperly fitted or improperly used wood stoves every year.

Quidnon?

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Re: Wood stove - looking for recommendations
« Reply #25 on: January 05, 2017, 06:57:47 PM »


Out of curiosity, is carbon monoxide a similarly serious issue with these?


I'm no expert, so I can't say; but I do know that they work on the idea of a deliberate and controlled "chimney fire" effect inside the "riser" using unrestricted combustion air, so I can't really see how CO could survive the trip.  And it doesn't really have a chimney in most installations, but a exhaust out the side of the house about the same elevation as the combustion chamber.  They are claimed to be so energy efficient that the exhaust isn't even hot enough to be a burn hazard, about 100 degrees F.  This season one owner, with a serious "mad scientist" streak, is attempting to document the claim that a RMH can heat a home using about one-fifth the wood of a traditional woodstove.  This link will send you to the most educated group about RMH in the world....

https://permies.com/f/260/rocket-mass-heaters

Quote
I know people have died when they've left just a bit of slow-burning wood in their masonry stove, which I assume is because it probably doesn't cause enough air current which means it doesn't burn cleanly. A quick google says a couple dozen people die in the UK from improperly fitted or improperly used wood stoves every year.

Slow burning is not a real possibility with a rocket mass heater, it's either full roar or nothing.  Nor is it really possible to let it burn unattended, as it requires constant feeding for about 30 minutes straight with small sticks most people would consider kindling.  A lot of people that use them also make a cap to cover the fuel feed port, which serves to snuff any remaining coals.  I've used and built rocket stoves based upon the same principle (except 90 degrees orientation) and they do tend to make a bit of noise, so no one is going to be letting this thing just burn unattended.  Similarly, a masonary stove is designed for a fast, hot fire; not a smoldering one.  So slow burning wood in a masonary stove is an example of mis-use.  I don't think that it's fair to blame a death that results from mis-use of a product on the product or creator.  It's the responsibility of the owner to know how to use his product properly.

gimp

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Re: Wood stove - looking for recommendations
« Reply #26 on: January 05, 2017, 07:00:23 PM »
I'm not blaming the dangers on the vendor ... in fact, my experience with masonry stoves is that there is no vendor, just people (in the past, peasants who built their own homes) who built them from scratch. :)

Just interested in potential downsides, that's all.

A cover for the feed port seems like a no-brainer. Better still if it's somewhere close to airtight. And a CO detector or three, eh?

Quidnon?

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Re: Wood stove - looking for recommendations
« Reply #27 on: January 05, 2017, 07:16:35 PM »
I'm not blaming the dangers on the vendor ... in fact, my experience with masonry stoves is that there is no vendor, just people (in the past, peasants who built their own homes) who built them from scratch. :)

Just interested in potential downsides, that's all.

A cover for the feed port seems like a no-brainer. Better still if it's somewhere close to airtight. And a CO detector or three, eh?

It can't hurt.

Landlady

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Re: Wood stove - looking for recommendations
« Reply #28 on: January 10, 2017, 04:25:17 PM »
Thank you everyone for your responses! I ended up purchasing a Hearthstone based on your recommendations combined with what was locally available. We went with a bigger model than we thought we needed because when we did the math with 12 ft ceilings and realized a big boy was needed.

This stove was also the most contemporary looking big stove I could find. Jotul unfortunately doesn't sell big enough wood stoves. European brands make smaller stoves because Europeans tend to have smaller spaces to heat.

So we went with the Manchester in matte black. It has a soapstone interior so it does have some of the heat retention of the all-soapstone stoves, but the cast iron surface gets hot enough to cook on which was important to me. (I like to reheat soup on the stove at lunchtime.)

I was able to negotiate a free heat shield from the seller, but this puppy still set me back $3,000 plus another $800 for the pipes and chimney. Not cheap. At least our wood is free, just laying on the ground out there...

Frugal Lizard

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Re: Wood stove - looking for recommendations
« Reply #29 on: January 13, 2017, 12:28:44 PM »
http://www.stonehousepottery.com/kachelofen.html  - Gorgeous but likely expensive.