Author Topic: Martial art/self-defense training?  (Read 1440 times)

gmdv

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Martial art/self-defense training?
« on: May 31, 2018, 04:42:02 PM »
I've been looking up various martial art classes and they all cost in the range of $150 to $200 for 8 sessions per month and would require years of training to be of use.   Does anyone know of less costly alternatives that would give the same result?  Planning on living by myself in the future and figure I should start preparing to deal with all the dangers that come with it.

The Investing Hispster

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Re: Martial art/self-defense training?
« Reply #1 on: May 31, 2018, 04:49:18 PM »
I practice Brazilian Jiu Jitsu, my academy costs about $120 per month but thats for unlimited classes. My reccomend for getting started would probably to use YouTube or something such as Renzo Gracie Academy online to get you started. I would also check Kijiji ( Craiglist) for someone who may be able to instruct you at a better rate. Hope it works out. Martial arts is a life long investment, definetely worth the price.

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Dave1442397

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Re: Martial art/self-defense training?
« Reply #2 on: June 02, 2018, 11:41:35 AM »
If you're more into the self-defense aspect, go for something like Krav Maga - http://www.kravmagainstitute.com/self-defense/what-is-krav-maga/


gmdv

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Re: Martial art/self-defense training?
« Reply #3 on: June 12, 2018, 09:44:16 AM »
I practice Brazilian Jiu Jitsu, my academy costs about $120 per month but thats for unlimited classes. My reccomend for getting started would probably to use YouTube or something such as Renzo Gracie Academy online to get you started. I would also check Kijiji ( Craiglist) for someone who may be able to instruct you at a better rate. Hope it works out. Martial arts is a life long investment, definetely worth the price.

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Thanks,  I'll take a look.   The prices I listed are technically for unlimited classes too,  but that doesn't apply when beginner classes are only scheduled twice a week.

Sailor Sam

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Re: Martial art/self-defense training?
« Reply #4 on: June 12, 2018, 10:03:26 AM »
Are you interested in learning a full self defense system that comes with a philosophy and a couple millennium of tradition, or do you want to effectively deter someone against doing something awful so that you can promptly run away?

If it's the second type you're after, many cities and towns have short course self defense classes. Some geared towards women, if that's your proclivity.

Unsolicited advice!
In general, the face is hard and bony. Don't hit it.
Nostrils hurt more than you'd think.
People are acutely tuned to being molested in the crotch, particularly dudes, and will turn your blow. Aiming there is usually a waste of time.
Ears stick out, and have a better success rate.
Vigorously engaging with the solar pelxus and stomach will make the person vomit on you. It's pretty gross.
The instep is effective, but can be hard to access if the person is wearing structured shoes or boots
Telescoping nightsticks will make you king of the dirt pile. They are often illegal. It's a case of apologize afterwards.
Once someone is down, stop hitting them. Or else keep hitting them, and make sure you know an attorney.

Bracken_Joy

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Re: Martial art/self-defense training?
« Reply #5 on: June 12, 2018, 10:31:06 AM »
I think it's really important to differentiate classes that are "martial arts for fitness" if you really want self defense classes. A good self defense class will draw on many martial arts- grip breaks from tae known do, ground fighting from jiu jitsu, throws from judo, what have you. But if you're looking for learning a martial art for the tradition and community and all, that's a different question. For pure self defense, a lot of times shooting ranges and community centers will host classes or be able to direct you to an instructor. These tend to be 4-6 week type classes. For martial arts, or fitness type "kick boxing" classes, the price range of ~$100-150/month is pretty common, and they tend to be ongoing through a school.

Cromacster

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Re: Martial art/self-defense training?
« Reply #6 on: June 12, 2018, 10:59:27 AM »
I've been looking up various martial art classes and they all cost in the range of $150 to $200 for 8 sessions per month and would require years of training to be of use.   Does anyone know of less costly alternatives that would give the same result?  Planning on living by myself in the future and figure I should start preparing to deal with all the dangers that come with it.

A gun will run you 300-500, an instructional class might be around $100 (might be worth taking 2 or 3), then 20-60$ a month for range time and ammo (free other than ammo if you are in the boonies and have a field you can shoot in).

As Bracken_Joy noted, many guns clubs offer non-gun focused situational awareness type safety classes, which is probably a good first step as the best personal defense is avoiding situations where you need to defend yourself.

e34bb098

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Re: Martial art/self-defense training?
« Reply #7 on: June 12, 2018, 03:28:09 PM »
I'm a lifelong martial artist, but I don't think it's a good use of money unless you really enjoy it for recreation and fitness.  The reason is that violent crime rates have absolutely plummeted in the last forty years, so your odds of being a crime victim are vanishingly small.  Especially if you (a) stay away from the illegal drug trade and (b) stay away from another dude's girl. 

You'd be better off keeping a spare $100 bill in your wallet, and at the first sign of trouble, throwing it onto the ground and running the other direction.  You'll probably never have to do this, and if you did, it's cheaper than a month of classes anyway.

If you have serious concerns regardless, the mental side of self-defense is far more important than physical skills.  You have to accept that you will be hurt, possibly badly, and being willing to inflict grievous and horrific damage on another person.  Most people can't do this.  And most martial arts/self-defense classes don't address this.

There's a great book, Strong on Defense that I'd recommend.  It's by a former cop, who breaks down the differences between crime victims who survive and those who don't.  It's a bit dated (written in the 90s IIRC) in that it incorrectly predicts skyrocketing crime due to all the crack babies.  But the lessons of how not to be a victim are still relevant.

sanderh

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Re: Martial art/self-defense training?
« Reply #8 on: July 01, 2018, 02:50:50 AM »
Differentiate fighting, sport, martial *art* and self defense. For self defense, see nononsenseselfdefense.com (I am not affiliated with it in any way). Basically, if the fight starts, then self defense has already failed, like in a chess game when your king comes under check, you are close to losing (usually). Self defense is layered, like a castle, or a system of trenches. The outer layers (stay away from bad neighbourhoods at bad times, or if you have to be there, be aware of your surroundings, call the police and run at the first sign of trouble, etc) have to be breached before an attacker reaches the inner layers (demands money, grabs, hits).

Candace

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Re: Martial art/self-defense training?
« Reply #9 on: July 01, 2018, 05:40:15 AM »
Definitely take a Women's Self Defense class, and/or a street fighting class. I had some from a Tae Kwon Do instructor that were inexpensive and geared very practically. Make sure you take one where your instructor puts you on the mat facing away and then "attacks" you. You get to approximate what it would really feel like to get that "oh shit" response and then fight back. The instructor is suited up so he won't easily get hurt.

I took Tae Kwon Do from the same guy for a few years. The Self Defense class was much better for self defense though. He was reasonably priced because he cares about his community and is not interested in getting rich. His classes were in community centers rather than in a dedicated storefront with a high rent.

GuitarStv

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Re: Martial art/self-defense training?
« Reply #10 on: July 09, 2018, 07:53:26 AM »
I've done an awful lot of martial arts classes (and taught quite a few) over the years, always keeping an eye towards self-defense . . . ranging from Aikido, Taekwondo (WTF), Hapkido, boxing, wrestling, Muay Thai, Judo, to Brazilian Jiu-Jitsu.  You've asked a very big question, that will naturally lead to a variety of right answers.

If you're looking for purely self-defense my advice would be to focus on something where you spar hard, regularly.  In a fight you will react based on how you've reacted in similar situations.  If you've never been hit hard in the face by someone while sparring, you will not respond well to being hit hard in the face by someone in a fight.  If you've never been slammed to the ground, had the wind knocked out of you, and had to escape from a bigger person on top of you while gasping for air . . . you will not respond well to that situation in a real fight.  Learning to keep your head and remember your training while in pain, and while someone is trying to hurt you is not possible without regular exposure to that sort of situation.  BJJ, Muay Thai, Boxing, and to some extent Judo and Wrestling are good for learning this.

Expect to spend years learning to defend yourself.  Self defense can take a variety of forms.  You might have a big guy push you to the ground and get on top of you.  You might have someone punch you in the face.  The guy might have a knife, or a baseball bat.  You might have a group of people attack you.  You might have a guy grab you from behind with an arm around your neck.  There are different strategies and habits that you need to learn to defend yourself, and things that work great in one scenario aren't going to work in another.

While you do need to have an idea of what to know in a variety of situations . . . in a fight, options can be overwhelming.  You want one clear path to take so you don't end up hesitating and getting badly hurt.  So in class, focus on learning one thing really, really well at a time until you've mastered it.  If you're taking judo, learn a single throw until you can land it from any position, you know multiple entries into it, and you know a variety of unbalancing/setup techniques for that throw.  If you're learning BJJ, master an escape, a sweep, and an attack.  There will always be a million variations and a billion techniques to use . . . you want to find a high percentage one that works for you and then drill the crap out of it.  It can't be something that you remember, it needs to be trilled and sparred enough until your muscles know it when your brain turns off.

As general rules for finding a good place to learn self defense:
- Stay away from any martial art where you don't regularly spar with hard contact against a variety of different people.
- Stay away from any martial art that claims to have a reliable 'touch of death' move . . . these can never be practiced while sparring, and if you can't practice it, my experience is that you can't do it when you need to.
- Stay away from any martial art where a large percentage of your time is spent solo dancing (forms, patterns, kata, whatever you want to call it).  This is useless for self defense.
- Stay away from any place that claims it will be able to teach you to defend yourself in a few months.  (Can't happen.)

Good martial arts places won't be cheap, but they don't have to be cripplingly expensive either.  Most Judo places are reasonably priced, and boxing gyms can be pretty cheap too.  Most good gyms will let you sit in for a couple classes before forking any money too., so take them up on the offer and make sure that you're feeling the environment and instructors before paying.


My last suggestion (if you're a woman) would be that you start by learning Brazilian Jiu-Jitsu.  Any decent BJJ club will have you sparring soon, and will teach you how to escape from a larger person trying to knock you to the ground and get on top of you.  Given rape statistics, this is probably the most common self defense situation you're going to run into.

Icecreamarsenal

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Re: Martial art/self-defense training?
« Reply #11 on: July 09, 2018, 08:48:24 AM »
Chiming in for the Jiu jitsu recommendation.
I quickly glanced through the thread, don't know if you're a woman, but striking as a 130# woman vs a 200# man is usually ineffective, even with a couple of self-defense classes under your belt.
Distance management and grappling from bottom position (jiu jitsu) just might do the trick.
Judo might also do the trick.  Youtube ronda rousey to see what that might look like.  The explosiveness required might make it a younger person's game though.

GuitarStv

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Re: Martial art/self-defense training?
« Reply #12 on: July 09, 2018, 09:02:24 AM »
Chiming in for the Jiu jitsu recommendation.
I quickly glanced through the thread, don't know if you're a woman, but striking as a 130# woman vs a 200# man is usually ineffective, even with a couple of self-defense classes under your belt.
Distance management and grappling from bottom position (jiu jitsu) just might do the trick.
Judo might also do the trick.  Youtube ronda rousey to see what that might look like.  The explosiveness required might make it a younger person's game though.

Try to find a place that does Kosen judo if you're looking for Judo more similar to BJJ.  Most modern Judo classes are very specialized towards throws (and only certain throws) with little to no groundwork.

gmdv

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Re: Martial art/self-defense training?
« Reply #13 on: July 09, 2018, 06:52:16 PM »
Thank you for all the suggestions everyone.   I think I'll start with the self defense class and see if I can find something that I can practice regularly, both for fitness and to keep my reactions instinctive.

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Re: Martial art/self-defense training?
« Reply #14 on: July 17, 2018, 05:48:35 AM »
Thank you for all the suggestions everyone.   I think I'll start with the self defense class and see if I can find something that I can practice regularly, both for fitness and to keep my reactions instinctive.

In the meantime, practice sprinting. This may sound silly, but I'd wager that most people who get into confrontational scenarios end up doing is running as hard as they can. Look up Tabata sprints. They'll take you a total of 10 to 15 minutes and you'll get a great HIIT workout in.

I also second a gun and/or pepper spray if you're not comfortable with the notion of a handgun as many people aren't.

Then look into martial arts. That's the hierarchy I was taught and have heard a lot of people talk about.

GuitarStv

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Re: Martial art/self-defense training?
« Reply #15 on: July 17, 2018, 06:33:58 AM »
Thank you for all the suggestions everyone.   I think I'll start with the self defense class and see if I can find something that I can practice regularly, both for fitness and to keep my reactions instinctive.

In the meantime, practice sprinting. This may sound silly, but I'd wager that most people who get into confrontational scenarios end up doing is running as hard as they can. Look up Tabata sprints. They'll take you a total of 10 to 15 minutes and you'll get a great HIIT workout in.

One of my instructors used to tell us that there's a reason that every martial arts class includes running as part of the warm up . . . it's because that's the single best form of self defense.  Get the fuck out of a bad situation.  :P

Bayou Dweller

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Re: Martial art/self-defense training?
« Reply #16 on: July 17, 2018, 10:04:09 AM »
Thank you for all the suggestions everyone.   I think I'll start with the self defense class and see if I can find something that I can practice regularly, both for fitness and to keep my reactions instinctive.

In the meantime, practice sprinting. This may sound silly, but I'd wager that most people who get into confrontational scenarios end up doing is running as hard as they can. Look up Tabata sprints. They'll take you a total of 10 to 15 minutes and you'll get a great HIIT workout in.

One of my instructors used to tell us that there's a reason that every martial arts class includes running as part of the warm up . . . it's because that's the single best form of self defense.  Get the fuck out of a bad situation.  :P

Hahah. Seriously though. People love to debate about martial arts effectiveness and if they would've drawn their gun, etc. But 99% of the time they would've just ran :) Therefore sprinting is key!

Bracken_Joy

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Re: Martial art/self-defense training?
« Reply #17 on: July 17, 2018, 10:07:10 AM »
Thank you for all the suggestions everyone.   I think I'll start with the self defense class and see if I can find something that I can practice regularly, both for fitness and to keep my reactions instinctive.

In the meantime, practice sprinting. This may sound silly, but I'd wager that most people who get into confrontational scenarios end up doing is running as hard as they can. Look up Tabata sprints. They'll take you a total of 10 to 15 minutes and you'll get a great HIIT workout in.

One of my instructors used to tell us that there's a reason that every martial arts class includes running as part of the warm up . . . it's because that's the single best form of self defense.  Get the fuck out of a bad situation.  :P

Hahah. Seriously though. People love to debate about martial arts effectiveness and if they would've drawn their gun, etc. But 99% of the time they would've just ran :) Therefore sprinting is key!