Author Topic: Soon time, and now what?  (Read 11733 times)

lemanfan

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Soon time, and now what?
« on: June 25, 2018, 11:40:04 PM »
Well.. it’s getting closer. Background:

I’m 45, and has spent the last close to twenty years as co-founder of a couple of software companies - and before that a few years of working for other companies after college. I’m single.  I’ve had relationships, but currently no partner, and no kids. Engineering degree, but haven’t done any engineering in many many years, I quickly moved into first project management and later company management.

Since a couple of years, I’ve felt more and more burned out and tired of what I do. The whole purpose of what the company does no longer gives me any joy, and the stuff I have to do daily basically either bores me or stresses me. And the other co-owners and I are moving in different ways in terms of personality and corporate culture.

I’ve been seriously worried about a real burnout for some time, and together with the other owners, we’ve agreed to go separate ways. During the fall, my tasks will be taken over by new people, and we have almost reached a conclusion on how to arrange the future ownership of the company, meaning that I’ll sell back all or most of my shares in the company to the others. I’ll probably switch to part time work for some time to give a smooth handover, and the stop completely hopefully before the end of the year.

Financially, I have no major worries - high income the last decade, OK investments and reasonable cost of living have given me a stash that can support my current lifestyle without problem at least until the normal retirement kicks in (20 years or so in my country), and probably long after. I’m living in Europe, meaning that many of the points in the pinned Pre-FIRE checklist are not really relevant to me since it’s quite US-focused.

The big question for me now is basically… and now what?

The first big thing I see in the future is some time for decompression and getting my energy back.  Probably more physically active and with healthier food when you have time to make it. And some regular day stuff in between.  Read the fifty unread books in the book shelf. Spend more time with my aging parents. Clean the apartment.

But after that… what?

I really have no desire to just lie on a beach or become a ski bum or somthing like that.

From the vocational side, I right now feel that I long-term would like to do something of use to other people.  Perhaps not founding another software startup, but to have something that fills my time with actually making a difference.

I’d love input from anyone that has been near a similar situation. What’s your experience of changes in wants and desires and motivations after a FIRE?

And then I have the personal side. I am actually kind of lonely sometimes, even if history has shown that I’d rather be by myself than in a bad relationship.  And romance aside, work is one of the important places for socialization.  When not working, my main social arenas are friends and partly staff at a couple of resturants / pubs here in town. Fun in it’s own way, but not always the healthiest options - after a couple of beers you don’t always make the healthy or cheap meal selection.

My worry here is basically to become isolated.  How have you guys handled this?

Any thoughts appreciated.



peeps_be_peeping

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Re: Soon time, and now what?
« Reply #1 on: June 25, 2018, 11:49:58 PM »
I worry about these things too. I'm still about 6 years out from FIRE. I have family and friends and hobbies. But will I be lonely and isolated in retirement? I also don't have a partner and honestly don't really expect to find one. I don't have any advice but I hope another discussion on this forum will help me figure things out by the time it's my turn.

asauer

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Re: Soon time, and now what?
« Reply #2 on: June 26, 2018, 06:33:53 AM »
If you've started/ run tech companies in the past, why not mentor entrepreneurs through SCORE (retired executives).  Or teach a very part time entrepreneurship course at community college?

Financial.Velociraptor

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Re: Soon time, and now what?
« Reply #3 on: June 26, 2018, 07:06:11 AM »
I recommend starting with some soul searching.  You need to define what you core values are.  Once you know what matters to you, you can build a life around that. 

I do recommend taking some down time for about 6 months to decompress.  That will give you plenty of time to sort out your thoughts.  In my experience, it took about six months to learn how to define myself by my values rather than what I used to do for money.  That is a worthwhile journey that I hope you take.  There will be time to be productive (in something that jazzes you) thereafter.

lemanfan

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Re: Soon time, and now what?
« Reply #4 on: June 26, 2018, 11:30:33 PM »
Thank you all for the good answers.  Just writing the post yesterday put me in a better mood, as it seems more real even if it is not happening tomorrow.

If you've started/ run tech companies in the past, why not mentor entrepreneurs through SCORE (retired executives).  Or teach a very part time entrepreneurship course at community college?

Thanks. I've thought of similar things and it might be a good idea.  SCORE seems a bit US-based but I'm sure I can find oppotunities here too.

I recommend starting with some soul searching.  You need to define what you core values are.  Once you know what matters to you, you can build a life around that. 

Thanks. I have actually been recommended the same exercise by others, but have yet to be able to perform it fully. My findings so far have given me an indication of what's wrong with my current situation, which is a valable insight. On the other hand, I don't know if I'm doing it right...

I do recommend taking some down time for about 6 months to decompress.  That will give you plenty of time to sort out your thoughts.  In my experience, it took about six months to learn how to define myself by my values rather than what I used to do for money.  That is a worthwhile journey that I hope you take.  There will be time to be productive (in something that jazzes you) thereafter.

My initial thought was to spend at least one hundred days without anything resembling work before letting my thoughts venture into future planning... good to hear that more people think in a similar way.

My FIL was in the same situation 20 years ago, selling his own company.

Thanks for the advice.  I think I know what I'm getting myself in to here.  I am currently the bean counter of the owner group after all. :)

I currently have no thoughts of relocating.  I am comfortably close to my aging parents, and the friends I have mostly live in this area.  Reasoable cost of living and not too hard to reach both the outdoors and som metropolitan areas when the urge arrives.

Plina

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Re: Soon time, and now what?
« Reply #5 on: July 01, 2018, 05:28:38 AM »
After you have done some soulsearching maybe you could  try to figure out if there are some non profit organisations that could useyour skills parttime. We have some techentrepeneurs that have started companies with a social agenda. In other words, do good in a company format.

soccerluvof4

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Re: Soon time, and now what?
« Reply #6 on: July 01, 2018, 05:50:44 AM »
Similarities in that I owned my own business for nearly 30 years and just got to the point I went from loving it to hating it so I know what your feeling.  I did not have any partners though as never been a fan of even more headaches but thats another conversation. Decompression for me because I was a business owner I believe took longer because I was always making decisions and there is that sense of leadership/ being needed etc.. and all of a sudden its gone. But , i found I had so many things to do that during the transition and starting to workout , making meals etc,, that i/you find your way and in my case at least though a bit longer it fell in place. Good luck and keep us in the loop. Being single I think you will find so many things you will have time to do things that you wont be bored for long.

lemanfan

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Re: Soon time, and now what?
« Reply #7 on: July 01, 2018, 10:35:43 PM »
Thank you all for the experiences.  I listen to what you all say and take it seriously. 

I think I'd really need someone locally to talk to, like a coach or a shrink - but my previous attempts at this has been unsuccessful.  Probably something to try again in August.

Zette

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Re: Soon time, and now what?
« Reply #8 on: July 02, 2018, 04:19:13 PM »
I was just reading "A World of Three Zeros" by the nobel prize winner who created the microfinance movement through Grameen Bank.  He talked a lot about an idea called a "social business", basically a non-profit that tackles some aspect of poverty in a way that generates enough revenue to be self-sustaining.  If you're FIRE, maybe something along those lines could put your experience starting a business to work in a satisfying way. 

kei te pai

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Re: Soon time, and now what?
« Reply #9 on: July 04, 2018, 03:27:36 AM »
Best wishes for the adventures ahead! They may not involve exploring the Amazon, but it will be a journey to a new life. I felt like it took 2 -3 years post FIRE to find my feet.
Like many here I am not naturally outgoing, and have had to be quite deliberate about building friendships and social time. A bit like counting servings of vegetables and hours of exercise!
Im still working it out, but rather than looking for ways to use the work skills in another setting, why not think of the parts of yourself that may never have had a chance to develop (maybe creative talents, nurturing skills?) .
Is there a way to contribute meaningfully and at the same time explore new pathways?

Livingthedream55

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Re: Soon time, and now what?
« Reply #10 on: July 06, 2018, 10:05:27 AM »
I think you need to decompress first and then once there is some space, time, energy in your life see what bubbles up.

It's hard not to know but to extent you can try not to have the expectation that you will have this all figured out before the fall. Daydream, sure, but don't settle on any one plan right now.

Once you've decompressed (maybe 6-12 months out) - start to try things out -- some you will like -- others won't be a good fit. You may want to read some books, take some workshops on life goals, your personal mission, etc. but no rush!!!

Know that you are resourceful and smart and you will transition into your next chapter in a way that will work for you.

Congratulations!!


RedmondStash

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Re: Soon time, and now what?
« Reply #11 on: July 08, 2018, 05:27:16 PM »
I've been FIREd for about 6 months now, and I have become a bit isolated. But it turns out that that's not a bad thing. It's more like being on a meditation retreat. I can visit with friends when I want, but mostly I cherish the quiet time I have.

And then I have the personal side. I am actually kind of lonely sometimes, even if history has shown that I’d rather be by myself than in a bad relationship.

I found this quote really telling. There is a third choice: being in a good relationship. Possibly one thing you can do with your freed-up time is investigate how to create better relationships for yourself, in whatever way works for you. It sounds like you're not American, so I don't know if the traditional answers of self-help books or therapy will work for you, but it might be worth asking any long-term friends or trusted family members that you have if they have any insights for you -- but brace yourself in case they have observations that are hard to hear. It could be worth it if there may be things you can do to improve your odds of finding a positive relationship, if having a partner is important to you.

I agree with other commenters that you need to decompress first. From my experience, it's not always a pleasant experience, but it is fruitful, and the unpleasantness is not permanent.

Good luck to you.

lemanfan

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Re: Soon time, and now what?
« Reply #12 on: July 09, 2018, 03:23:54 PM »
Thank you all for the input. I'm now one week into vacation, and the mood has mostly been good. Looking forward, but have put my deeper thoughts about the future on hold untile time plans are more clear.

One thing did however happen today that made me think a little bit - a friend running another small company came by me today to talk, since he was not getting along with his business partner.  This turned in to a four hour conversation about many different things... but both the fact that four hours dissapeared while feeling like five minutes, and that I got a heart-felt "thank you" text message a little later from a person who normally does not say stuff like that made me realize that I have something to offer professionally in some situations.

lemanfan

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Re: Soon time, and now what?
« Reply #13 on: August 09, 2018, 11:54:39 AM »
One month after last posting and I've actually started downshifting.  Partly based on this thread, I've not yet started making long plans - I just enjoyed yesterday (min first real "day off" on a weekday) with the strang feeling of ... a mix between "this must be a sunday" and "skipping school".

No, not RE yet, but getting closer. :)

Eowyn_MI

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Re: Soon time, and now what?
« Reply #14 on: August 10, 2018, 10:38:25 AM »
There is a lot of advice here that is encouraging you to "find yourself" and that is not a bad idea!  However, since you mentioned sometimes feeling lonely, I would like to encourage you to "find your people."

Here is my question: do you feel like you are part of a community? (Community is defined here as: a group of people having a particular interest or activity in common.)  If not, I would recommend that you look for and try out different group activities with your increasing free time.

This isn't just advice to "go find a hobby."  This is a suggestion to think of an enjoyable activity that will bring you into contact with the same group of people at least once per week; more often is better.  It can be a volunteer/service activity or a leisure/recreation activity.  (I'm deliberately leaving the potential activity as non-specific as possible since you know your interests best.)  My point is that friendships often form as a result of seeing and talking with the same people week after week.  The activity is a natural icebreaker that encourages conversations and provides a starting point for new relationships.

You have (or soon will have) an abundance of time and energy that can be spent with people that you enjoy being around.  All you have to do is find them!

lemanfan

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Re: Soon time, and now what?
« Reply #15 on: August 10, 2018, 01:09:52 PM »
Thanks Éowynd! 

Comar

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Re: Soon time, and now what?
« Reply #16 on: August 16, 2018, 04:58:22 AM »
lemanfan you so kindly replied in my journal and after reading this thread I can see that you and I have a lot in common. Which is figuring out the next step. I take comfort (maybe you do too) that I am not alone with this problem. This is probably a very common problem, a part of being human. I think modern society has uprooted us from many things that give us pleasure: Being a part of a community, being helpful, being in touch with nature with your friends and family. Maybe we have to find some of these things again to find happiness.

lemanfan

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Re: Soon time, and now what?
« Reply #17 on: August 16, 2018, 11:16:33 PM »
@Comar

Thanks for your input. Very few of us really experience something that noone has experienced before.  Most situations has been encountered by someone, sometime.  So tryinig to learn from others experiences is a good thing. 

:)

lemanfan

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Re: Soon time, and now what?
« Reply #18 on: December 01, 2018, 03:17:40 AM »
A few months later, and this is getting real. Since a while, I've been working sort-of part time, sometimes away full days, but mostly just taking shorter days. Many of my primary tasks are handled by others. My departure is not yet communicated to the staff. Things will probably not end up exactly as I planned, but still good, much better than before for my personal mental health.

I've yet to really feel "free", but I've started to recover some strength and enthusiasm. It also feels a bit scary.  When I'm about to turn my financial habits upside down since I'll be living from savings and investments, not a regular paycheck, I get a bit scared. But I have a plan for that. When I sit alone in the apartment at  2 PM and everyone I normally hang out with is at their respective jobs, I get a bit scared for a lonely future. No real plan for that.

I also got to find a way to not spend all new "free time" in front of my home PC when I no longer have to sit in front of the work PC at the office.

I feel grateful for the position I've managed to create for myself in life. Grateful that I actually give up some future money to take care of myself. You can always get more money, but you'll never get more time. And I'm grateful to the people on this forum for being here to talk and to inspire.

If you excuse me, now I gotta go and buy new shoelaces for my walking shoes. I foresee quite a few longer walks in the months ahead.

Linea_Norway

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Re: Soon time, and now what?
« Reply #19 on: December 01, 2018, 08:00:47 AM »
Thanks for the update.

It sounds like you could offer your services as an occasional mentor or pep talk speaker. That might give you some purpose in your field, if you feel for it.

lemanfan

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Re: Soon time, and now what?
« Reply #20 on: December 01, 2018, 08:23:54 AM »
Thanks.  I'll start by decompressing for a while. :)

Moustachienne

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Re: Soon time, and now what?
« Reply #21 on: December 01, 2018, 02:12:20 PM »
Sounds like you've got a lot of really good reflection and self knowledge under your belt.  Enjoy the decompression and let the next stage unfold - no need to force it too much.   You know what areas you might want to structure a bit when you feel like it.  I've found that it doesn't take much structure to feel very good about the whole week and my biggest struggle is not to over schedule myself because of feeling I "should" be doing X or Y. 

I've enjoyed your posts and relate a lot to your questions.  18 months into retirement, I can say I worried too much about some things and I hope this turns out to be the same for you.  I freaking LOVE being retired from obligatory work and being free to choose how I spend my time.

Good luck!

lemanfan

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Re: Soon time, and now what?
« Reply #22 on: December 01, 2018, 02:28:38 PM »
Thanks Moustachienne,

it really feels good.  And yes, I've had quite some time for reflection about the good and the bad.  I think the past year and a half or so really has made me grow in some sense.

xbdb

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Re: Soon time, and now what?
« Reply #23 on: December 15, 2018, 11:12:07 AM »
Another Mustachian recommended "How to Retire Happy, Wild, and Free" by Ernie Zelinski. I borrowed a copy from the library and loved it. It deals with the non-financial aspects of retirement. It has several thought provoking exercises to help you sort things out. I have since bought several copies that I have given to friends and family members who have, or are about to be, retired.

lemanfan

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Re: Soon time, and now what?
« Reply #24 on: December 15, 2018, 11:31:55 AM »
Thanks!

John Galt incarnate!

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Re: Soon time, and now what?
« Reply #25 on: December 15, 2018, 04:05:29 PM »
If you've started/ run tech companies in the past, why not mentor entrepreneurs through SCORE (retired executives).  Or teach a very part time entrepreneurship course at community college?

Yeah.

lemanfan

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Re: Soon time, and now what?
« Reply #26 on: August 10, 2019, 12:35:36 PM »
A year after the original text, finally things are starting to move.  As I mentioned, the main thing holding me back was not stache size but rather loyalty to the company which I co-founded.  And the shifting of responsabilities did not go as planned.

However I'm now making a new attempt scaling down to working 1-2 days a week while others take over the task.  This time it yet seems to work. This past week has been the first real week of "the new life", where formally three weeksdays were outside of the office.  No, the phone did not stay entirely quiet but ... I was out of the office. :)

I have conflicting feelings.  Loyalty and "what ifs" for the company and its operations.  A bit scared of what people will say and ask when it's announced more broadly in the office on Monday.  How to spend the days, and if I'll get lonely without the office social interactions.

Oh well.  Time will tell.



lemanfan

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Re: Soon time, and now what?
« Reply #27 on: April 03, 2020, 12:46:53 PM »
Time flies sooooo fast.  I started this journey a long long time ago.  This thread was started in the summer of 2018 and last update a year later.

And finally, FINALLY, I seem to have reached the target - papers are signed and meetings are held, agreements reached - I'm no longer an owner, nor an emplyee of that company which I helped start many moons ago.  Of course, there will still be questions and support, but the main separation is done.

My plan was to now start travelling, but for obvious reasons that's not on the table right now.   The "now what" is simply doing my part in flattening the curve.  The next "what" will come later.  Oh, time will tell. :)

Loren Ver

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Re: Soon time, and now what?
« Reply #28 on: April 04, 2020, 06:29:49 AM »
Thank you for coming back with an update.  It is nice to know that you are closer to free.  Hopefully, soon, you will be able to spread your wings and actually go out and enjoy it :).

Zette

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Re: Soon time, and now what?
« Reply #29 on: April 04, 2020, 01:39:10 PM »
There was a book I found helpful many years ago. “I Don’t Know What I Want, But I Know It’s Not This”.  It had some exercises that help you think through what you liked and disliked about previous jobs to help you clarify what you want to do going forward.

Lucky13

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Re: Soon time, and now what?
« Reply #30 on: April 07, 2020, 10:41:23 AM »
I’m 45, and has spent the last close to twenty years as co-founder of a couple of software companies - and before that a few years of working for other companies after college. I’m single.  I’ve had relationships, but currently no partner, and no kids. Engineering degree, but haven’t done any engineering in many many years, I quickly moved into first project management and later company management.

Congrats on stepping back from your job!

If you had the drive, work ethic, talent, vision, and patience to be a successful co-founder (I could never do it!) then my money is on you for figuring out how to be happy post-FIRE. :) Just look at it like the next venture you're going to start.

oneyear

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Re: Soon time, and now what?
« Reply #31 on: May 10, 2020, 03:07:48 AM »
Time flies sooooo fast.  I started this journey a long long time ago.  This thread was started in the summer of 2018 and last update a year later.

And finally, FINALLY, I seem to have reached the target - papers are signed and meetings are held, agreements reached - I'm no longer an owner, nor an emplyee of that company which I helped start many moons ago.  Of course, there will still be questions and support, but the main separation is done.

My plan was to now start travelling, but for obvious reasons that's not on the table right now.   The "now what" is simply doing my part in flattening the curve.  The next "what" will come later.  Oh, time will tell. :)

Im sure a lot of your identity is wrapped in the business and that it'll be hard to separate the 2. Have you taken time to decompress? How was that/is it going?

You're hopefully just ahead of me on this journey, so I'm keen to follow. Please do update.....regularly.

Bettersafe

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Re: Soon time, and now what?
« Reply #32 on: May 10, 2020, 04:00:17 AM »
I just read your topic, thanks for the update.

Last year I did a crossroad workshop for senior managers. Essentially it's for people literally on a crossroad in their working career. Some of the questions being addressed are: do I want to continue doing what I did? If not, wat do I really want (thinking outside the box is key), how do I get there, what skills do I have, what skills don't I use but do I like to use more, what do others in the workshop think might fit me, etc etc.
The one I did is a 2 day workshop and helped tremendously, we had 1 participant who was very skeptical going into the workshop but turnout to get the biggest result. I'm in Europe as well, I'll pb you more info.

Second, in the starting post you mentioned doing something for others, have you looked into things as Rotary and such? Besides fundraising, hands-on activities etc it also brings you a network in your community and might bring opportunities you wouldn't have otherwise.


lemanfan

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Re: Soon time, and now what?
« Reply #33 on: May 10, 2020, 04:00:52 AM »
You found me!

The decompression has started, but there has also been more questions from the former colleagues to assist with than I would have liked.

I'm not quite sure if this will turn in to a journal type thing, but I'll try to remember to post an update now and then.

lemanfan

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Re: Soon time, and now what?
« Reply #34 on: May 10, 2020, 04:06:03 AM »
Second, in the starting post you mentioned doing something for others, have you looked into things as Rotary and such? Besides fundraising, hands-on activities etc it also brings you a network in your community and might bring opportunities you wouldn't have otherwise.

Ha! :)  I'm actually a Rotary member since a decade or so, and while it has been hard to get in to the community aspects of it (most members near me are sooo old), I'm right now preparing for a course where I'll train Rotary clubs in how to meet online.  "Zoom in the time or Covid" or something.  Fun! 

Actually, taking complex matters and explaining them in a clear and simple fashion is one of the things I really enjoy.  But there are not so many subjects where I'm an expert enough to do a good job here.

Please feel free to send me the info you talked about.

Bettersafe

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Re: Soon time, and now what?
« Reply #35 on: May 10, 2020, 04:13:21 AM »
I just dit :-)

Haha, oke, so far my advice for the Rotary and the likes. I hear you about the age-thing. I'm a member of the Ladies Circle and at 45 yo you have to leave so I'm in my final year.

oneyear

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Re: Soon time, and now what?
« Reply #36 on: May 10, 2020, 06:25:39 AM »
I did indeed. Also european btw. But living in that one country that was determined to leave. le sigh.

Bettersafe if you'd be kind enough to share with me also I'd appreciate that a heap.

It'd be great to hear any opportunities or challenges that present themselves in FIRE. Thats what I'm anxious/looking forward to.

 

Wow, a phone plan for fifteen bucks!