The Money Mustache Community
General Discussion => Post-FIRE => Topic started by: DeskJockey2028 on June 05, 2017, 07:30:06 AM
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Hey people who've ejected themselves from the rat race! What keeps you coming back to the MMM forums once you've retired early and are financially independent? I'm not meaning this as a criticism in any way, I'm just curious. Is it online friends you've made here? A desire to give back to the community in terms of advice, etc?
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There is a real shortage of people who see things the way I do in my personal meatspace. My "tribe" is here.
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#1 is definitely the friendships :) I'm more known by folks on this forum than almost anywhere else, I like supporting them, I like being supported by them.
#2 is the processing. My life is infinitely better when I process "out loud", and this is an ideal place to do that, as people here get me.
#3 is finding new people to encourage and support, the way people here did for me when I was just starting to figure FIRE stuff out.
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Just lots of very interesting discussion on these forums. You can pick up some good ideas too.
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Because I'm not a total financial genius, just lucky enough to have figured out a few things early enough to be able to FIRE.
There are still things I'm learning about every day, and the forum is filled with folks that understand things better than I ever could - like taxes, optimizing expenditures for things I already need/use, travel hacking...
And I agree with the idea that there aren't really that many folks in the real world to discuss things like this with. I have no friends that really get FIRE stuff and honestly no one has really noticed the husband and I aren't working at all... they just assume we're freelancers now. We haven't shared much about the money/income situation since most of our friends are unfortunately pretty spendy and mentioning investing or the like is not a subject that seems of interest for some reason, so we've not felt the need to out ourselves to anyone as of yet. ;)
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The people here look at the world the way I do.
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You never stop learning!
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All of the above :-)
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All of the above :-)
+1.
I was only able to quit when I did because of what I learned on these forums and MMM and other associated FIRE bloggers' posts. I assume I haven't learned it all yet so I figure there's still efficiency out there to be had! That and to contribute where I think I can provide anything of value.
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While FI and RE milestones are significant in the FIRE journey, they certainly do not stop the learning and sharing process. The forum remains relevant, so I stay.
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free time!
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I don't know anyone IRL who is interested in retiring early, or being mindful of spending, or investing, or anything finance related - aside from my partner. So, it's nice to have this community.
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I enjoy the company. :) Being at home while most people are at work, internet forums are a surprising percentage of my social scene these days.
I also like the intellectual stimulation of discussing FIRE topics and sharing what I've learned over the years. It keeps me on my toes, and new questions inspire me to think of things in new ways.
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I come here and still learn things and try , support those that are here that helped me and give back I hope by helping those that need it.
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All of you who continue to post once FIRE'd, believe me you - we who are still on the road there very much appreciate it!
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I skim other sub-forums, but I read "Do It Yourself" and "Taxes" more closely than others. There is always something for me to learn in those categories and ever-so-occasionally there is something I know that I can share.
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Because why the hell not?
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For the pun threads!
:-)
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There are people here that are like minded and I enjoy the discussions.
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It may not be the healthiest thing for some ER's. It's difficult even after ER to curb a mindset that doesn't even make sense anymore. Frugality freight train going 90 miles an hour for a lifetime then SCREEECH, try to turn that thing around.
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Have been back three or four times in the last sixteen months just to check in and ask specific questions or report to those who knew me when I was seeking advice three or four years ago. Don't feel the need to check in, just sometimes do so out of curiosity...
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Wait..We can Leave?
Like whenever we want?
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Wait..We can Leave?
Like whenever we want?
:)))))
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I really appreciate the post fire people - proof positive that this stuff works :)
And you all have perspective/wisdom us working folk definitely benefit from.
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Becoming FIRE doesn't mean.you are immune to lifestyle creep or spendy pants desires, so reading post helps bring me back down to earth and aligns my values
I'm not FIRE yet, but getting close and am just on autopilot now. This is the big one for me. I get lazy, expenses creep up, and since I am the most frugal of anyone I know IRL it can be hard to notice it happening. Hanging out here keeps me in check.
Also, I remember what it was like discovering the concept for the first time, so I like to share ideas and my perspective to the newcomers.
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It may not be the healthiest thing for some ER's. It's difficult even after ER to curb a mindset that doesn't even make sense anymore. Frugality freight train going 90 miles an hour for a lifetime then SCREEECH, try to turn that thing around.
Could you explain some more about what you mean? I enjoy the support from the forum to help me remain frugal. It would be so easy to squander my tiny fortune.
Also, frugality is only part of the MMM message. Remember how he said the real point is about saving the world? One of my small contributions is riding my bike, but I get a lot of criticism about riding it in my non-biking community.
Did I misunderstand what you meant?
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Wait..We can Leave?
Like whenever we want?
Or as the Eagles put it in Hotel California
You can check out anytime you like, but you can never leave
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I haven't FIRE'd yet, but I'm very close and after I do I'll still keep coming here and reading these posts because learning is a lifelong process which doesn't stop after one FIRE's. Collectively there is a vast amount of knowledge and expertise from the people who post here. I have tremendous respect for the people who post here because they are so willing to share their knowledge and experiences here which I have found to be so beneficial.
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It may not be the healthiest thing for some ER's. It's difficult even after ER to curb a mindset that doesn't even make sense anymore. Frugality freight train going 90 miles an hour for a lifetime then SCREEECH, try to turn that thing around.
Could you explain some more about what you mean? I enjoy the support from the forum to help me remain frugal. It would be so easy to squander my tiny fortune.
Also, frugality is only part of the MMM message. Remember how he said the real point is about saving the world? One of my small contributions is riding my bike, but I get a lot of criticism about riding it in my non-biking community.
Did I misunderstand what you meant?
I'm not concerned about whether I'm living life according to the MMM doctrine. We've got religion for that. I just enjoy the money-saving tips and the anti-consumerism viewpoint. My frugality genes came from my parents. I retired at 58, which is ancient for this forum. I could ease up on some of my extremely frugal ways, but after a lifetime of NOT spending, that is a difficult transition.
Many people here are planning for very early retirement that is going to require a lifetime of living close to the bone. My only caution would be that you may change your mind further down the road and then have difficulty reentering the work force.
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^ Though, because it's not about frugality, our versions of "close to the bone" isn't very close to the bone at all. i.e. Forumites generally plan to have little to no housing costs before living on $25k-$40k per year. And then if we don't have that cash, we don't plan to reenter the workforce, but to get the difference via playing, sidegigs, etc. So, that bigger MMM philosophy works so differently than frugality.
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I wanted to FIRE practically from the day I started working, though there was no word for it then. I often felt alone in my quest. It would have been a lot easier (and no doubt faster) to have had company.
I hang around because I want to help others, especially single women who are self-funding their dreams. I try to be the help I wish I'd had.
Also, my MIL has Alzheimer's and lives with us. This forum keeps me from feeling trapped. I adore the collective mind for solving problems.
I recently started a journal because there are things I want to remember about my life and path to FIRE. Writing is a great memory trigger, feedback is appreciated and the possibility of helping others is intoxicating.
Plus, free advice from smart people!
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I'm with those who say, we still have things to learn even after FIRE. Though the fact is, since I reached my goals and RE'd, I come here far far less than I did in the years leading up to leaving the workplace. Sometimes WEEKS go by (gasp) between my check-ins. But it's been my experience, as with others, that our thinking is marginal enough that the community here is a very welcome respite from the unceasing consumerism of much of the culture I see here in the US.
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I don't need financial help, but there's plenty of super smart and frugal people here who are happy to give advice on other things too. I've learned things about fitness, gardens, cooking, home maintenance, and all kinds of things on these forums that aren't directly financial-related. The advice I've gotten has generally been very good. You can tend to find out ways how to do things well but on a low budget too. :)
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I'm FIRing in 4 days and DH in 2 more weeks. (Not "E" in terms of this community as we are 60 but still amazing to our friends and coworkers.)
At least at first, I see paying even more attention to this forum as we'll have the time to optimize and 'in source' even further and the advice here is great on so many topics, as others have said. I particularly enjoy the threads on DIY attempts that went wrong. :) I can see my future...
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Wait..We can Leave?
Like whenever we want?
Thank you.
I'm two years FIRE'd and this made my day.
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I'm not FIRE'd, but I appreciate the viewpoints and advice from the FIRE'd peeps.
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I really want to help others. I find that the people I am close to make some sounds like they want to be FIRE'd but they are either too afraid to ask or don't think they can do it. So, I have to almost seek out strangers to help. Bit sad really.
I also like to keep learning tips from others.
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I still enjoy the forum. Like others we were not that young at 53 & 58. 5 years later we still do side gigs that we enjoy very much.
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I enjoy the community.
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We are nowhere near FIRE, I don't think...still trying to figure that out, but I am so grateful for all of you! Your patience for us Newbies' "silly questions" is invaluable.
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It keeps me grounded and calm. Life isn't easy for many people I know, partially because their spending is out of control and partially because work can be deeply unpleasant if one doesn't have a way out and the boss knows it and uses that knowledge exploitatively. I can get too far into their lives and their stress if I don't pay attention.
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1. The people - ideas - motivation - inspiration - just plain fun reading - off topics - odd topics - did I mention the people:)
So much too learn ... - improving my financial literacy...
Besides I was already RE when I found MMM.
2. Where else can I hang out and discuss all the silly things I'm attempting while I wait for Mr. R. to FI? maybe - RE? debatable, he will be 60 or 62 by the time he retires. Good thing he really likes his job.
3. You guys rock!
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Not FIRE'd yet, but just an observation from the aspiring cheap seats is that when "You've made it", it's even more satisfying to share how you made "it" and are keeping "it" with others.
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I have a question for you success story folks...Did you feel like you had to really be an investor smarty pants to pull this off? I'm certainly not and kinda knocks the wind out of my sails when I think "can we really do this?" Or were you more of the "max 401, max IRA, put everything else into stocks and viola, in 5 yrs your ready..." (grossly oversimplified I know)
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I have a question for you success story folks...Did you feel like you had to really be an investor smarty pants to pull this off? I'm certainly not and kinda knocks the wind out of my sails when I think "can we really do this?" Or were you more of the "max 401, max IRA, put everything else into stocks and viola, in 5 yrs your ready..." (grossly oversimplified I know)
I definitely started at zero knowledge, learned one teeny thing at a time, stepped slowly and steadily along the learning curve. When I had a crack of room in my brain, I started a thread asking one question at a time, starting with things like, "Are stocks and equities the same thing?" Or, "Why is the wiggly line on this graph so different from the wiggly graph on that one?"
LOVE the book Millionaire Teacher by Andrew Hallam, read after starting the abovementioned thread. I would start there, personally. https://www.amazon.com/Millionaire-Teacher-Wealth-Should-Learned/dp/1119356296
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Did you feel like you had to really be an investor smarty pants to pull this off?
No. I went the real estate route, and though there was a lot to learn, anyone can do it, no special intelligence needed.
And with stock investing, it happens that the simplest method is the most effective anyways. Being an "investor smarty pants" is often a detriment, because you (incorrectly) think you'll outguess the market.
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I have a question for you success story folks...Did you feel like you had to really be an investor smarty pants to pull this off? I'm certainly not and kinda knocks the wind out of my sails when I think "can we really do this?" Or were you more of the "max 401, max IRA, put everything else into stocks and viola, in 5 yrs your ready..." (grossly oversimplified I know)
I knew zero, zilch, nada about investing and the concept of retiring early was not even something I'd ever heard of. Three things turned me from scared, ignorant and unsure of the future to 100% confident and currently FIREd:
1. This forum. Not so much MMM's main blog/site, not that it wasn't both entertaining and informative, but the folks in this forum are the ones that answered countless questions, directed me to sites and research on things like investing, tax avoidance, stepped up cost, the benefits and pitfalls of specific types of accounts and their confusing inner workings and how to untangle them, and just in general were (and are) all around great people.
2. Jim Collins' stock series (http://jlcollinsnh.com/stock-series/). He turned his website into a book, and it is fantastic. While I got lots of help from the forum, Mr. Collins' site is the thing that absolutely, 100% explained investing, the market, and money management. And the amazing part is he did it in plain English, and made it a fun read to boot. If you also struggle with the whole "investing is scary and complicated and I will never feel confident doing all this stuff" like I did, you should try reading it.
3. The Bogleheads Wiki (https://www.bogleheads.org/wiki/Main_Page). Index investing for the win. All the stuff you need to know in one beautifully organized place.
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I have a question for you success story folks...Did you feel like you had to really be an investor smarty pants to pull this off? I'm certainly not and kinda knocks the wind out of my sails when I think "can we really do this?" Or were you more of the "max 401, max IRA, put everything else into stocks and viola, in 5 yrs your ready..." (grossly oversimplified I know)
Just yesterday, SO and I were sitting here looking out over the view, and not believing where we are financially. We've been retired more than 7 years and we still don't believe that we pulled it off, and are in a better position than a lot of people. How could normal people like us do it, when were were never CEOs or CFOs or any other three letter titles? To us, everyone around us still looks so much richer than we do (and I'm sure they think they are too). And we definitely weren't "investor smartypants" - we didn't even know we had enough to retire until someone told us we could. We just saved. We accidentally put money in the right places, and suddenly, voila, we were there.
For instance, I don't like being in debt, so I paid off my house very quickly (where I live, paying off your PPOR first is actually a really good thing to do because of the tax laws and the fact that our interest rates are generally higher than yours and our houses are much more expensive). I knew we'd want money for retirement, so worked out ways to put it into retirement accounts. We had spare money, so I did things to the house that reduced its energy consumption by half (this meant all our utility bills were halved, and so our saving rate increased).
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I have a question for you success story folks...Did you feel like you had to really be an investor smarty pants to pull this off? I'm certainly not and kinda knocks the wind out of my sails when I think "can we really do this?" Or were you more of the "max 401, max IRA, put everything else into stocks and viola, in 5 yrs your ready..." (grossly oversimplified I know)
I knew zero, zilch, nada about investing and the concept of retiring early was not even something I'd ever heard of. Three things turned me from scared, ignorant and unsure of the future to 100% confident and currently FIREd:
1. This forum. Not so much MMM's main blog/site, not that it wasn't both entertaining and informative, but the folks in this forum are the ones that answered countless questions, directed me to sites and research on things like investing, tax avoidance, stepped up cost, the benefits and pitfalls of specific types of accounts and their confusing inner workings and how to untangle them, and just in general were (and are) all around great people.
I have taken to these forums and they have been a great help in educating myself but I still feel not sure. I'm glad to hear I'm not the only one! ha I've looked into some of the things you've listed here..... but STILL not sure. How long after you found MMM did you FIRE? I feel like we can maybe do it in about 4-6 years but having no access to liquid cash really to speak of, I'm just not clear on how to pull it all together even though I feel like I've asked countless questions on here already :( Did a Case study even. I guess if I keep my head in the game here and just keep reading, it'll start to become more clear . Thanks to you all for your replies!
2. Jim Collins' stock series (http://jlcollinsnh.com/stock-series/). He turned his website into a book, and it is fantastic. While I got lots of help from the forum, Mr. Collins' site is the thing that absolutely, 100% explained investing, the market, and money management. And the amazing part is he did it in plain English, and made it a fun read to boot. If you also struggle with the whole "investing is scary and complicated and I will never feel confident doing all this stuff" like I did, you should try reading it.
Will continue to scour his blog and will look for his book
3. The Bogleheads Wiki (https://www.bogleheads.org/wiki/Main_Page). Index investing for the win. All the stuff you need to know in one beautifully organized place.
Need to spend more time with his stuff!
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I guess if I keep my head in the game here and just keep reading, it'll start to become more clear . Thanks to you all for your replies!
YES! Give it time to come clear, keep asking questions along the way, especially the ones inside you that "feel stupid" :) And you're welcome. I hope you'll check out Millionaire Teacher too. That's the one that felt and feels most accessible to me. Reading different excellent ones can help bring the picture together for you. (And my whole story in book form is linked to in my sig, but it doesn't detail investing...though does get into how to start approaching that.)
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I guess if I keep my head in the game here and just keep reading, it'll start to become more clear . Thanks to you all for your replies!
YES! Give it time to come clear, keep asking questions along the way, especially the ones inside you that "feel stupid" :) And you're welcome. I hope you'll check out Millionaire Teacher too. That's the one that felt and feels most accessible to me. Reading different excellent ones can help bring the picture together for you. (And my whole story in book form is linked to in my sig, but it doesn't detail investing...though does get into how to start approaching that.)
Thank You! I'm just sitting here chatting with my 72 year old in laws that have recently moved in with us until they find a house (moved to our neck of the woods... I'm married to an only child)...they are very encouraging for us to try to make this work! I may see if they'll just stay with us to offset routine living expenses so we can save more! haha
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I have a question for you success story folks...Did you feel like you had to really be an investor smarty pants to pull this off? I'm certainly not and kinda knocks the wind out of my sails when I think "can we really do this?" Or were you more of the "max 401, max IRA, put everything else into stocks and viola, in 5 yrs your ready..." (grossly oversimplified I know)
Not at all.
We were (are) higher spenders than most MMM folks... but we are vastly lower spenders than the normal person around us. We've always been that way. Just "not spending so much" and putting that money in index funds pretty much made everything work. I FIRE'd "early" by normal-people standards... but late by MMM standards. It was exactly 2 years ago at age 50. We didn't do it in 5 years... but there was a 3 year work hiatus in there and a vast majority of the time we only lived off of one income.
In retrospect, the more we learn, the more I see how we didn't optimize things in one way or another. Guess what? It still worked out fine. You'll see people bicker and argue over whether option A or option B is more optimized and how you'll be SO much better off if you just pick option A. In the long run, I'm pretty sure "spending a lot less than you earn" is THE kicker. The rest of it likely affects the speed of reaching FIRE... but maybe not the success rate.
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Did you feel like you had to really be an investor smarty pants to pull this off?
No. I went the real estate route, and though there was a lot to learn, anyone can do it, no special intelligence needed.
And with stock investing, it happens that the simplest method is the most effective anyways. Being an "investor smarty pants" is often a detriment, because you (incorrectly) think you'll outguess the market.
I heard your story in a podcast, incredible! We have 2 rent houses now, but I feel that's not quite enough to generate enough income, so thinking of selling one that has no mortgage and using that money to help fund our bridge years. Our area didn't feel that big real estate hit like Vegas area did in 2008, NOR did we have the cash to jump on the areas around us that did get hit. (the suburbs got hit harder than the city, but we did get a good deal on a primary home in that time which is now the above mentioned rental that has no mortgage) I have few scenarios running through my head to try to make it all work out!
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I guess if I keep my head in the game here and just keep reading, it'll start to become more clear . Thanks to you all for your replies!
YES! Give it time to come clear, keep asking questions along the way, especially the ones inside you that "feel stupid" :) And you're welcome. I hope you'll check out Millionaire Teacher too. That's the one that felt and feels most accessible to me. Reading different excellent ones can help bring the picture together for you. (And my whole story in book form is linked to in my sig, but it doesn't detail investing...though does get into how to start approaching that.)
Just scored a mustachian moment with a free audible version of this book with a 30 day free trial of audible! I"ll be sure to cancel it before the $15/mo charge goes into affect :)
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I should probably put this in another forum category besides here, but your responses to my other posts was encouraging so I wanted to "find" you all again...(I'm a forum/computer illiterate so forgive me)
So I'm still trotting along over here trying to learn and I'm realizing I don't fully understand our current allocations :(
The breakdown on the 401K fidelity website states the following: Asset classes: 89.62% Stocks, 8.40 bonds, 1.98 short term investments (which I get) Also, the fees appear to be pretty low on these
But then the following:
HOLDINGS:
TARGET DATE 2035 49.43% - this is listed as unclassified in personal capital and I can't figure out how to list it between stocks and bonds
US LG CAP STK IDX 26.31%
EMERGING MARKETS STK 12.22%
US SMID CAP STK IDX 12.04%
Is this good enough to just have the overall 89% stocks, 8% bonds, 2% short term or do I need to figure out how to break this other list down more?
Also, we are contributing 20% with a 5.5% match in a T 401K...is that TOO much, should we divert some of that to the taxable account?
I'm still lamenting over what to do with the IRA's(transferring from american funds to vanguard) and what type of taxable account to open...any guidance/advice/opinions would be much appreciated.
TIA
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Also, we are contributing 20% with a 5.5% match in a T 401K...is that TOO much, should we divert some of that to the taxable account?
I'm still lamenting over what to do with the IRA's(transferring from american funds to vanguard) and what type of taxable account to open...any guidance/advice/opinions would be much appreciated.
TIA
For most people, all things being equal, you want to maximize your 401(k) contributions first, for the simple reason of tax advantages (compounding interest is a beautiful thing, even more so when you aren't paying tax on it today). If you still have additional income to save, that's great, and that's when you would put it in non-advantaged accounts.
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Insomnia?
But seriously, I still learn things, still want to help out in a minor way.
And as OP of the 2019 fire cohort thread, cheerleading is fun.
Encouraging people to FIRE as opposed to OMY is the most fun. I would like to think I've had some success at pushing the indecisive to FIRE.
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Wait..We can Leave?
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Like whenever we want?
BWAHAHAhahahaha!
Thank god I didn't have coffee in my mouth when I read that or I'd have to launder my slipcover.
I am only 28 days into FIRE so I'm still in that decompression/transition phase. I don't know if I'll keep coming back forever but it is still quite relevant for me at this stage. Plus many of the people who post here are quite funny and laughter is the best medicine.
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Being fired, we don't have the annual work related income anymore, or the time / years to stash away a bunch more money, so it is probably more important then ever to make smart financial decisions. Lots off good heads on this forum, you can learn a thing or two.
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Love to see an old thread resuscitated. Also pleased that a good number of folks are still around. Thanks!
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Well for me being very newly FIRE'd and not even sure I am, it's to read, to learn and to bounce things off people. Also, like some here, most around me don't know my situation and here I can ask questions of those similar
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To participate in resurrected threads and scan for screen names of people I've never met but who are characters in my favorite imaginary book, characters who often have shared more personal information here than people I know irl
To remind myself to stay on course
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Insomnia
That's some serious Insomnia.
You got all the way to Page 8 on this subforum and revived a 2 year old thread. LOL.
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Insomnia
That's some serious Insomnia.
You got all the way to Page 8 on this subforum and revived a 2 year old thread. LOL.
Another possibility is that you accidentally hit a spot on your screen that took you to an old thread. It's easy to do, especially when sleep deprived. #askmehowiknow
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I joined in 2012 a financial ignoramus and now I’m FIRd. I’m not sure I’ve graduated completely from ignoramus status, but I sure know an awful lot more than I did. It’s been part of my life most days for the past 7 years. I like the mostly intelligent and humorous conversation around here that prevails. I’m still learning relevant stuff here.
I’ve made a lot of friends on this forum. A few folk I’ve met IRL. It’s all been a good experience. I hope to meet a number more in Canada at CM*TO this year. I won’t be able to keep going back to CM*TO endlessly so this forum will hopefully be the conduit of our ongoing relationships.
Now that I have a wee bit more time on my hands I try to make a small contribution to some posts to pay it forward.
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Because this is the Hotel California...
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Because this is the Hotel California...
Love this!
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Because I'm nosy. And for the Post-FIRE forum ;-)
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Because this is the Hotel California...
Love this!
You can check out any time you like, but you can never leave!
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I FIRE'd 13 years ago and I just joined this community mainly for 3 reasons:
- All my friends are still trapped in the rat race and has been difficult for me to share with theme the ups and downs associated to this lifestyle.
- Sharing my experience. The things I learned in the past 13 years may be useful to someone who is just getting started.
- Learning from others, there is always room for improvement. :)