Author Topic: 2017 ACA plan info now available  (Read 26220 times)

geekette

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2017 ACA plan info now available
« on: October 24, 2016, 11:19:00 PM »
We can't sign up yet, but we're shopping for next year, and it ain't great.  Plans are more expensive, as expected.  Our GP of 20 years isn't participating in any of the ACA plans.  I also expected that for a couple reasons, but I still don't like it!

Last year, for 2 mid-50 year old non-smokers, our non subsidized price was $1250/month.  That insurer pulled out in a snit (merger stuff), so we're back with a BCBS plan at $1750/month (we'll qualify for subsidies and cost sharing, though).  The new plan has low co-pays instead of a big deductible, which will probably end up being cheaper for us, but I sure dread looking for a new GP.  I'm considering paying the higher out of network costs (yes, he's that good, IMHO).

CanuckExpat

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Re: 2017 ACA plan info now available
« Reply #1 on: October 25, 2016, 03:28:01 AM »
Thanks for the reminder. Are 2017 ACA plans available nationwide, or is this a specific state you mentioned?
Know a good state by state comparison of available plans and changes?
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mathjak107

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Re: 2017 ACA plan info now available
« Reply #2 on: October 25, 2016, 04:15:22 AM »
even without subsidy the aca plans have premiums that are not bad . the problem is these plans are really pay as  you go . the out of pockets and deductibles can be insane with no cost sharing .

AdrianC

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Re: 2017 ACA plan info now available
« Reply #3 on: October 25, 2016, 05:53:47 AM »
Looks OK for us. 52 plans to choose from. About a 15% increase for an equivalent plan to what we have now with Aetna (who have pulled out). We should get subsidies next year which will bring the cost to us back down to 2016 levels. Pricey but affordable.

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Re: 2017 ACA plan info now available
« Reply #4 on: October 25, 2016, 06:26:02 AM »
Canuck Expat: go to Healthcare.gov and you can preview the plans in each state now, but you can't enroll until Nov. 1.

meerkat

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Re: 2017 ACA plan info now available
« Reply #5 on: October 25, 2016, 06:56:53 AM »
Has anyone ever used an insurance broker? Of am I better off just doing it myself, since I tend to be an over-researcher?
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mathjak107

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Re: 2017 ACA plan info now available
« Reply #6 on: October 25, 2016, 07:09:05 AM »
from what i understand if a subsidy is involved you have to do it on your own , no broker . i am coming off cobra in january , so the broker told me he can get me a plan if no subsidy is involved but if there is i have to get that plan myself on the exchange .

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Re: 2017 ACA plan info now available
« Reply #7 on: October 25, 2016, 07:23:39 AM »
Mathjak107: Thanks or the useful info. I'm also coming off COBRA 1/1/17, and have started to research plans & try to figure out whether or not I will qualify for a subsidy.

Plans look expensive & not great, but if not for the ACA I think I would be uninsurable due to pre-existing conditions, so I'm glad to have this option.

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Re: 2017 ACA plan info now available
« Reply #8 on: October 25, 2016, 08:04:43 AM »
Looks like I have to change plans again to keep my doctor and have my scrips covered.  Price will be going up about 35/mo.
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Re: 2017 ACA plan info now available
« Reply #9 on: October 25, 2016, 09:02:10 AM »
I compared plans and they are up 20-40% for my age/location.  There are now only two providers to choose from and the plan options are cut in half or more:

2016 - 10 bronze, 16 silver, 12 gold plans available
2017 - 5 bronze, 5 silver, 2 gold plans available

The cheapest plans in each category are as follows:

Plan2016 Premium2017 Premium% Increase
Bronze$234.03$281.1620%
Silver$271.92$352.1930%
Gold$399.64$554.4939%

Plan2016 Deductible2017 Deductible
Bronze$5,000$5,700
Silver$1,250$1,500
Gold$250$1,000

Plan2016 Max OOP2017 Max OOP
Bronze$6,600$7,150
Silver$6,850$7,150
Gold$5,400$5,000


Frankies Girl

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Re: 2017 ACA plan info now available
« Reply #10 on: October 25, 2016, 09:15:10 AM »
We'll be getting more of a subsidy since the husband is now FIREd so our actual MAGI is going down, but the costs went up so much we're going to be paying around $200 more for the same BCBS plan. Ouch.

The gov website also says that our doctor is not in network, but according to the BCBS site they actually are in network, so I'm going to have to call and confirm that they are staying in network for our plan.

Don't forget to call your doctor's office directly to check with them about their network because even the insurance sites get it wrong sometimes.

Sigh.
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mathjak107

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Re: 2017 ACA plan info now available
« Reply #11 on: October 25, 2016, 09:19:35 AM »
it is the aca out of pockets and deductibles that can be killer with no subsidy . i am paying 512 a month on cobra rather than the cheaper aca plan .  i have a 2k deductible  and 3k out of pocket max. that is way way less exposure than an aca  plan . i have zero deductible on lab work and only 30 buck charge on my family doctor .

meerkat

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Re: 2017 ACA plan info now available
« Reply #12 on: October 25, 2016, 09:23:22 AM »
Don't forget to call your doctor's office directly to check with them about their network because even the insurance sites get it wrong sometimes.

I had this backfire on me last year, the pediatrician accepted United Health Care but not the specific plan my son was on. Cue me calling BCBS back to get on their plan starting 2/1 and cancelling the UHC plan 1/31 and hoping the kid stayed healthy for all of January so we wouldn't have to pay several hundred dollars out of pocket for a pediatrician visit (which was actually asking for a lot - he was in the PICU in December).

I can't remember my password but my computer at home might remember it. But that means I can't log in to ACA till tonight and I really want to start looking at it now. Ugh, I did not enjoy this process last year and I doubt it's going to be any more fun this year even without the cost increases.
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geekette

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Re: 2017 ACA plan info now available
« Reply #13 on: October 25, 2016, 09:31:40 AM »
The gov website also says that our doctor is not in network, but according to the BCBS site they actually are in network, so I'm going to have to call and confirm that they are staying in network for our plan.

Don't forget to call your doctor's office directly to check with them about their network because even the insurance sites get it wrong sometimes.

Sigh.
The doctor's answering machine says "we're not in plan with Blue Value or Blue Local" and that's all BCBS offers in our area.  They used to offer Blue Select, but that disappeared last year. 

I could check with the other insurance company, but they say neither my GP nor my endocrinologist are in network.

Sigh

At least the site seems more helpful (and stable) than previous years!

bacchi

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Re: 2017 ACA plan info now available
« Reply #14 on: October 25, 2016, 09:16:48 PM »
Aetna left my area, too, like a bunch of whiny brats.

An HSA compatible plan is $1400 more. Is it worth it?

meerkat

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Re: 2017 ACA plan info now available
« Reply #15 on: October 26, 2016, 05:26:06 AM »
from what i understand if a subsidy is involved you have to do it on your own , no broker .

No subsidy for us. Does anyone have experience with using a broker? Or shopping for an individual plan outside of ACA? The options we have through our state's market place are okay but if we have the chance to shop around I'd like to take advantage of it. If it makes a difference, this will be for a child with moderate healthcare needs.
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radram

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Re: 2017 ACA plan info now available
« Reply #16 on: October 26, 2016, 06:33:25 AM »
Family of 4 here.

I searched for over 20 minutes to find the 14 digit plan number that healthcare.gov was asking for.  I never found it, so just pretended I did not have coverage to see the plan options for now. This made it harder to compare my current plan with offerings for next year.

The plan name I have now was no longer an option, but there were 24 total options, with three or four very similar to what I have now.

It seems that the most similar silver plan went down $80 per month, while the subsidy went down $200 per month.  I will follow up when I select next years plan.

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Re: 2017 ACA plan info now available
« Reply #17 on: October 26, 2016, 09:24:17 AM »
The costs that are considered reasonable are pretty wild in some markets. I looked up costs for a plan in North Carolina, where we're moving, for just my wife and I (30 and 33) and the cheapest plan available is $780 a month, for a total cost of $9,360 yearly. This is for a high deductible ($14,300) family plan. Subsidies for a family of two end at $64,080. I suspect a one day stay in a hospital would max out that deductible, which would mean that family would find themselves paying $23,600 for healthcare, potentially on a salary of only $65,000. That would represent 36.4% of their income. Add in your standard taxes and I can't imagine how this scenario wouldn't cause a hardship for most families.
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Re: 2017 ACA plan info now available
« Reply #18 on: October 26, 2016, 09:32:05 AM »
Family of 4 here.

I searched for over 20 minutes to find the 14 digit plan number that healthcare.gov was asking for.  I never found it, so just pretended I did not have coverage to see the plan options for now. This made it harder to compare my current plan with offerings for next year.

The plan name I have now was no longer an option, but there were 24 total options, with three or four very similar to what I have now.

It seems that the most similar silver plan went down $80 per month, while the subsidy went down $200 per month.  I will follow up when I select next years plan.


I called the Healthcare.gov's contact number and got a live person within 2 minutes who gave me my plan's 14 digit number. They're very helpful and are there for helping out with that stuff.
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geekette

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Re: 2017 ACA plan info now available
« Reply #19 on: October 26, 2016, 12:21:32 PM »
The costs that are considered reasonable are pretty wild in some markets. I looked up costs for a plan in North Carolina, where we're moving, for just my wife and I (30 and 33) and the cheapest plan available is $780 a month, for a total cost of $9,360 yearly. This is for a high deductible ($14,300) family plan. Subsidies for a family of two end at $64,080. I suspect a one day stay in a hospital would max out that deductible, which would mean that family would find themselves paying $23,600 for healthcare, potentially on a salary of only $65,000. That would represent 36.4% of their income. Add in your standard taxes and I can't imagine how this scenario wouldn't cause a hardship for most families.

I think the deductible would be half for one person, but if both were in that accident, yeah, rough.  But without insurance you'd start seeing gofundmes.

Rubyvroom

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Re: 2017 ACA plan info now available
« Reply #20 on: October 26, 2016, 12:37:45 PM »
I saw an article on the ACA price increases yesterday on BBC. It's not pretty.

http://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-37758742

"According to the report from the Department of Health and Human Services, for a 27-year-old consumer, in the prime age group sought by insurers, the average monthly premium for a benchmark plan would be $302 next year, up from $242 this year. The average increase of 25% in benchmark premiums on the federal exchange compares with increases of 2% in 2015 and 7% this year."

The 25% increase is a nationwide average. Some states are far worse off. Arizona is up 116%, Oklahoma 69%, Tennessee 63%, and so on (according to the article).

Mr. Green

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Re: 2017 ACA plan info now available
« Reply #21 on: October 26, 2016, 03:04:22 PM »
The costs that are considered reasonable are pretty wild in some markets. I looked up costs for a plan in North Carolina, where we're moving, for just my wife and I (30 and 33) and the cheapest plan available is $780 a month, for a total cost of $9,360 yearly. This is for a high deductible ($14,300) family plan. Subsidies for a family of two end at $64,080. I suspect a one day stay in a hospital would max out that deductible, which would mean that family would find themselves paying $23,600 for healthcare, potentially on a salary of only $65,000. That would represent 36.4% of their income. Add in your standard taxes and I can't imagine how this scenario wouldn't cause a hardship for most families.

I think the deductible would be half for one person, but if both were in that accident, yeah, rough.  But without insurance you'd start seeing gofundmes.
None of the multi-person policies we've ever had halve the deductible for one person. You have to max the whole thing out before it kicks in, even if all the charge are from one person. I'm not sure if all policies are like this or if it varies by state.
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Re: 2017 ACA plan info now available
« Reply #22 on: October 26, 2016, 03:28:26 PM »
The costs that are considered reasonable are pretty wild in some markets. I looked up costs for a plan in North Carolina, where we're moving, for just my wife and I (30 and 33) and the cheapest plan available is $780 a month, for a total cost of $9,360 yearly. This is for a high deductible ($14,300) family plan. Subsidies for a family of two end at $64,080. I suspect a one day stay in a hospital would max out that deductible, which would mean that family would find themselves paying $23,600 for healthcare, potentially on a salary of only $65,000. That would represent 36.4% of their income. Add in your standard taxes and I can't imagine how this scenario wouldn't cause a hardship for most families.

I think the deductible would be half for one person, but if both were in that accident, yeah, rough.  But without insurance you'd start seeing gofundmes.
None of the multi-person policies we've ever had halve the deductible for one person. You have to max the whole thing out before it kicks in, even if all the charge are from one person. I'm not sure if all policies are like this or if it varies by state.

HDHPs are required to have a combined deductible for family plans. Other plans can go either way, as far as I know.
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Re: 2017 ACA plan info now available
« Reply #23 on: October 26, 2016, 03:36:55 PM »
Aetna left my area, too, like a bunch of whiny brats.

An HSA compatible plan is $1400 more. Is it worth it?

I'm struggling with your exact question.  We have a new insurance provider in our area that is about 30% less (before subsidy) ... but isn't HSA compatible.

I'm post-FIRE... so my "income" is (to some degree) configurable.  I'm juggling the price difference vs the $6750 income reduction vs the in-network providers (which has yet to be published on the new provider).
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CanuckExpat

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Re: 2017 ACA plan info now available
« Reply #24 on: October 26, 2016, 04:14:56 PM »
Canuck Expat: go to Healthcare.gov and you can preview the plans in each state now, but you can't enroll until Nov. 1.

I was hoping for something that kind of gave a table overview of what's available in each state, but not even certain what one would compare by. Given that the available plans can vary within a state, a nationwide comparison might be hard.

Our situation might be more flexible/tricky because we are choosing exactly what state to domicile in next year based mainly on health insurance availability. We also want health insurance that is both as cheap as possible, but will give us coverage while travelling through the US. That might be a tough bill to fit.

I'm waiting for updates here: http://www.rverinsurance.com/health-insurance-2017/
At least according to them, all the info won't be available until Nov 1:
"Once again it is looking like insurance companies are not going to release specific plan and rate details until the first day of Open Enrollment (Nov 1). We are going to postpone publishing our 2017 RVer Health Insurance Options Guide until probably the same date so that we do not have to re-publish it. Thanks for your patience!"
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geekette

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Re: 2017 ACA plan info now available
« Reply #25 on: October 26, 2016, 04:55:18 PM »
The prices are not by state, they're by county.  Good luck...

BCBS (in NC, at least) offers nationwide coverage.

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Re: 2017 ACA plan info now available
« Reply #26 on: October 26, 2016, 05:09:59 PM »
I am not looking forward to this.  I will be FIRE in 2017.  I intend to go on COBRA to start as the path of least resistance and then probably switch over to the Colorado ACA system, Connect for Health Colorado later in 2017 or when COBRA runs out.

If anyone has current information on the Colorado plans, please let me know.

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Re: 2017 ACA plan info now available
« Reply #27 on: October 26, 2016, 06:24:02 PM »
from what i understand if a subsidy is involved you have to do it on your own , no broker .

No subsidy for us. Does anyone have experience with using a broker? Or shopping for an individual plan outside of ACA? The options we have through our state's market place are okay but if we have the chance to shop around I'd like to take advantage of it. If it makes a difference, this will be for a child with moderate healthcare needs.
If you have anyone with medical needs, you won't find, IME, companies that would take you in individual market outside of the ACA.  That was the true benefit of ACA, those of us who need insurance can now get it outside employer plans.

mathjak107

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Re: 2017 ACA plan info now available
« Reply #28 on: October 26, 2016, 06:33:17 PM »
obamacare is a disaster .

health insurance works because the healthy folks pool the money to pay for the unhealthy folks .

well with premiums near 5k with no subsidy and first having a 2500 to 3k deductible and almost 7k out of pocket it is a better deal for healthy folks to pay the fine .

they can pay the fine , pay their usual yearly low medical bills and come out thousands ahead . you can spend 2500 bucks in bills and still not even count the 4-5k for premiums nor the fact you got back zero because you did not meet your deductible .

according to the ny times that is what happened . younger healthy folks are opting for the fine leaving those who need care and expensive treatment left in the pool .

our aca insurer went bankrupt last year sending us scrambling for coverage .

Bracken_Joy

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Re: 2017 ACA plan info now available
« Reply #29 on: October 26, 2016, 06:46:23 PM »
Okay, I should probably know all this much better because I'm a nurse, but insurance is just baffling to me.

DH and I are 28 and 27, respectively. No health issues. Currently our insurance is ~$450/month with a $10k OOP max (I don't remember deductible right now). Don't qualify for any subsidies. Neither of us get insurance through work- his employer is really small, and pays $400 toward insurance each month. Anything above that is on us, but it's also up to us to get our own plans. Looking at the 2017 options, it looks like our current plan or similar will be $650 with a $9k deductible and a $13k OOP max. We want to start a family, so I will probably use our insurance quite heavily.

Are there non-ACA, non-employer plans? I keep seeing people talking about brokers- how does this work?

Assume 99% ignorance on the topic please, and be kind- this stuff is pretty overwhelming.
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Re: 2017 ACA plan info now available
« Reply #30 on: October 26, 2016, 06:51:00 PM »
obamacare is a disaster .

health insurance works because the healthy folks pool the money to pay for the unhealthy folks .

well with premiums near 5k with no subsidy and first having a 2500 to 3k deductible and almost 7k out of pocket it is a better deal for healthy folks to pay the fine .

they can pay the fine , pay their usual yearly low medical bills and come out thousands ahead . you can spend 2500 bucks in bills and still not even count the 4-5k for premiums nor the fact you got back zero because you did not meet your deductible .

according to the ny times that is what happened . younger healthy folks are opting for the fine leaving those who need care and expensive treatment left in the pool .

our aca insurer went bankrupt last year sending us scrambling for coverage .
The problem with "just paying the fine" is that it leaves you one medical emergency from complete financial disaster. As a healthy 33 year old I would still elect to pay $400 a month for coverage with no subsidy because it's not worth the risk of a six-figure medical bill. No one thinks that stuff happens to them until it does. I suppose if people have nothing then they don't care about something like that but man I'd sure hate the be the guy stuck on the phone trying to negotiate a $100,000 hospital bill with no one on my side and assets that can be taken.
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Mtngrl

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Re: 2017 ACA plan info now available
« Reply #31 on: October 26, 2016, 08:17:47 PM »
The costs that are considered reasonable are pretty wild in some markets. I looked up costs for a plan in North Carolina, where we're moving, for just my wife and I (30 and 33) and the cheapest plan available is $780 a month, for a total cost of $9,360 yearly. This is for a high deductible ($14,300) family plan. Subsidies for a family of two end at $64,080. I suspect a one day stay in a hospital would max out that deductible, which would mean that family would find themselves paying $23,600 for healthcare, potentially on a salary of only $65,000. That would represent 36.4% of their income. Add in your standard taxes and I can't imagine how this scenario wouldn't cause a hardship for most families.

As a freelancer, my income varies from year to year. Based on this year's income, I qualify for a subsidy in 2017 -- good thing, since the silver plans I see will cost us about $2200 before subsidy (rural Colorado, two adults in mid-50s). If my income goes over $64,080, I'll end up footing the whole bill which is, as you point out, a huge chunk of my annual income -- in no way "affordable" , especially considering the deductibles on top of the cost of the insurance itself.

ender

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Re: 2017 ACA plan info now available
« Reply #32 on: October 26, 2016, 08:31:53 PM »
The problem with "just paying the fine" is that it leaves you one medical emergency from complete financial disaster. As a healthy 33 year old I would still elect to pay $400 a month for coverage with no subsidy because it's not worth the risk of a six-figure medical bill. No one thinks that stuff happens to them until it does. I suppose if people have nothing then they don't care about something like that but man I'd sure hate the be the guy stuck on the phone trying to negotiate a $100,000 hospital bill with no one on my side and assets that can be taken.

I wish that real catastrophic healthcare plans were an option.

The highest deductible I can get through the exchange is ~$7k for about $250/month as a single male in my 20s. Course, I'm pretty much subsidizing others, so it's not surprising.

CanuckExpat

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Re: 2017 ACA plan info now available
« Reply #33 on: October 26, 2016, 08:45:28 PM »
Are there non-ACA, non-employer plans? I keep seeing people talking about brokers- how does this work?

Backing up: when you say "non-ACA" you might mean
1) non-ACA compliant health insurance .. probably cheaper than ACA compliant plan, without any of the minimal protections and guarantees of coverage because of pre-existing conditions etc. This might not meet what the ACA considers minimal essential coverage, so you could have it, still be afoul of health insurance mandate, and possibly pay penalty

2) ACA compliant health insurance  that you buy off the marketplace. You need to buy on the marketplace to get subsidies, but if you don't need or can't get subsidies, then nothing is limiting you to only shopping on the marketplace. Not sure what if any advantage there is to buying on or off the marketplace when you are looking at ACA compliant plans (i.e. probably expensive without subsidy)

Both are available, for example like here: https://www.ehealthinsurance.com/ (no endorsement or experience, just remember them being popular pre ACA).

So I think the answer is yes, but I'm not certain what one you mean (I find this confusing too, making my best guess hoping someone corrects me)

Not sure if either one is what you mean or helps..

Also, backing up, you are a nurse and you don't have healthcare? American health care system continues to surprise me.. :)
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Bracken_Joy

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Re: 2017 ACA plan info now available
« Reply #34 on: October 26, 2016, 08:56:59 PM »
Are there non-ACA, non-employer plans? I keep seeing people talking about brokers- how does this work?

Backing up: when you say "non-ACA" you might mean
1) non-ACA compliant health insurance .. probably cheaper than ACA compliant plan, without any of the minimal protections and guarantees of coverage because of pre-existing conditions etc. This might not meet what the ACA considers minimal essential coverage, so you could have it, still be afoul of health insurance mandate, and possibly pay penalty

2) ACA compliant health insurance  that you buy off the marketplace. You need to buy on the marketplace to get subsidies, but if you don't need or can't get subsidies, then nothing is limiting you to only shopping on the marketplace. Not sure what if any advantage there is to buying on or off the marketplace when you are looking at ACA compliant plans (i.e. probably expensive without subsidy)

Both are available, for example like here: https://www.ehealthinsurance.com/ (no endorsement or experience, just remember them being popular pre ACA).

So I think the answer is yes, but I'm not certain what one you mean (I find this confusing too, making my best guess hoping someone corrects me)

Not sure if either one is what you mean or helps..

Also, backing up, you are a nurse and you don't have healthcare? American health care system continues to surprise me.. :)

No I have healthcare. Just not through work. I'm a PRN employee, so I don't really have... well, any benefits. Lol. I do have insurance though, on an ACA plan, but with the prospect of it jumping by $250/month, I'm ready to look at alternatives!

And yes, your explanation did help! Thank you!
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MarciaB

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Re: 2017 ACA plan info now available
« Reply #35 on: October 26, 2016, 09:42:29 PM »
obamacare is a disaster .

health insurance works because the healthy folks pool the money to pay for the unhealthy folks .

well with premiums near 5k with no subsidy and first having a 2500 to 3k deductible and almost 7k out of pocket it is a better deal for healthy folks to pay the fine .

they can pay the fine , pay their usual yearly low medical bills and come out thousands ahead . you can spend 2500 bucks in bills and still not even count the 4-5k for premiums nor the fact you got back zero because you did not meet your deductible .

according to the ny times that is what happened . younger healthy folks are opting for the fine leaving those who need care and expensive treatment left in the pool .

our aca insurer went bankrupt last year sending us scrambling for coverage .
The problem with "just paying the fine" is that it leaves you one medical emergency from complete financial disaster. As a healthy 33 year old I would still elect to pay $400 a month for coverage with no subsidy because it's not worth the risk of a six-figure medical bill. No one thinks that stuff happens to them until it does. I suppose if people have nothing then they don't care about something like that but man I'd sure hate the be the guy stuck on the phone trying to negotiate a $100,000 hospital bill with no one on my side and assets that can be taken.

YES. And you are so right that you're just fine...until something in fact does happen to you. A medium car accident can put a huge multi-thousands dent in someone's finances, let alone an unexpected rare cancer (because what healthy person expects to get some rare cancer?).

"Just paying the fine" seems like financial roulette to me.
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CanuckExpat

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Re: 2017 ACA plan info now available
« Reply #36 on: October 26, 2016, 09:54:28 PM »
according to the ny times that is what happened . younger healthy folks are opting for the fine leaving those who need care and expensive treatment left in the pool .
The problem with "just paying the fine" is that it leaves you one medical emergency from complete financial disaster.

YES. And you are so right that you're just fine...until something in fact does happen to you. A medium car accident can put a huge multi-thousands dent in someone's finances, let alone an unexpected rare cancer (because what healthy person expects to get some rare cancer?).

"Just paying the fine" seems like financial roulette to me.

If it worked out cheaper, and you were ok with gambling a bit, you could "just pay the fine" and also augment with non-ACA compliant "short term insurance"

Not recommending it, but that might be a "viable" option for some

(Not anyone who has a pre-existing condition, or might get pregnant for example)
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Metric Mouse

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Re: 2017 ACA plan info now available
« Reply #37 on: October 26, 2016, 11:14:56 PM »
according to the ny times that is what happened . younger healthy folks are opting for the fine leaving those who need care and expensive treatment left in the pool .
The problem with "just paying the fine" is that it leaves you one medical emergency from complete financial disaster.

YES. And you are so right that you're just fine...until something in fact does happen to you. A medium car accident can put a huge multi-thousands dent in someone's finances, let alone an unexpected rare cancer (because what healthy person expects to get some rare cancer?).

"Just paying the fine" seems like financial roulette to me.

If it worked out cheaper, and you were ok with gambling a bit, you could "just pay the fine" and also augment with non-ACA compliant "short term insurance"

Not recommending it, but that might be a "viable" option for some

(Not anyone who has a pre-existing condition, or might get pregnant for example)

I've also been under the impression that it's relatively easy to sign up outside of the standard window - e.g. when you find that rare cancer or get smacked by a car, you could sign up for insurance then.

Insurance companies seem to agree, as this is one of the things they are trying to get changed.
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mathjak107

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Re: 2017 ACA plan info now available
« Reply #38 on: October 27, 2016, 03:41:36 AM »
you can't sign up before open enrollment if you get an illness . you can only sign up mid stream for insurance life changing events . marriage, divorce , loss of existing policy , etc ,
« Last Edit: October 27, 2016, 03:43:21 AM by mathjak107 »

Threshkin

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Re: 2017 ACA plan info now available
« Reply #39 on: October 27, 2016, 10:23:12 AM »
you can't sign up before open enrollment if you get an illness . you can only sign up mid stream for insurance life changing events . marriage, divorce , loss of existing policy , etc ,

Easy enough to engineer a qualifying event if really necessary.

Bracken_Joy

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Re: 2017 ACA plan info now available
« Reply #40 on: October 27, 2016, 10:29:25 AM »
you can't sign up before open enrollment if you get an illness . you can only sign up mid stream for insurance life changing events . marriage, divorce , loss of existing policy , etc ,

Easy enough to engineer a qualifying event if really necessary.

Yeah, somehow I don't think my ICU patients who were in a medically induced coma on ventilators were gonna pop out and fudge a marriage or a move for the sake of insurance.
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mathjak107

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Re: 2017 ACA plan info now available
« Reply #41 on: October 27, 2016, 10:53:55 AM »
we just weent through this with a woman on another forum who had no insurance and was diagnosed with ovarian cancer . every way she turned she was blocked from being able to just suddenly get insurance . she had to wait months to get on with open enrollment .

Threshkin

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Re: 2017 ACA plan info now available
« Reply #42 on: October 27, 2016, 10:57:21 AM »
you can't sign up before open enrollment if you get an illness . you can only sign up mid stream for insurance life changing events . marriage, divorce , loss of existing policy , etc ,

Easy enough to engineer a qualifying event if really necessary.

Yeah, somehow I don't think my ICU patients who were in a medically induced coma on ventilators were gonna pop out and fudge a marriage or a move for the sake of insurance.

Bracken Joy, I am sorry for your parent's situation.  My mother is in a nursing home and is almost completely out of money.  Medicaid is only a couple of months away.

Your parent's situation is not the type of case I was referring to.  I was referring to essentially healthy people gaming the system by not getting insurance unless a medical need arises and then using the ACA rules to get insurance outside of open enrollment. 

Insurance companies have stated that people buying insurance outside of open enrollment have higher expenses than people buying during open enrollment.  This is one factor some insurance companies have used to justify raising rates or pulling out of providing ACA coverage.

I am not opposed to the concept of national health care.  It is a good idea.  But I am not happy with ACA because it does not address the major factors driving up health care costs for everyone involved (individuals, providers and insurance companies)

Bracken_Joy

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Re: 2017 ACA plan info now available
« Reply #43 on: October 27, 2016, 11:01:57 AM »
you can't sign up before open enrollment if you get an illness . you can only sign up mid stream for insurance life changing events . marriage, divorce , loss of existing policy , etc ,

Easy enough to engineer a qualifying event if really necessary.

Yeah, somehow I don't think my ICU patients who were in a medically induced coma on ventilators were gonna pop out and fudge a marriage or a move for the sake of insurance.

Bracken Joy, I am sorry for your parent's situation.  My mother is in a nursing home and is almost completely out of money.  Medicaid is only a couple of months away.

Your parent's situation is not the type of case I was referring to.  I was referring to essentially healthy people gaming the system by not getting insurance unless a medical need arises and then using the ACA rules to get insurance outside of open enrollment. 

Insurance companies have stated that people buying insurance outside of open enrollment have higher expenses than people buying during open enrollment.  This is one factor some insurance companies have used to justify raising rates or pulling out of providing ACA coverage.

I am not opposed to the concept of national health care.  It is a good idea.  But I am not happy with ACA because it does not address the major factors driving up health care costs for everyone involved (individuals, providers and insurance companies)

Not my parents. Patients. Nurse here. And I was saying it's not something to bank on, rigging a qualifying event when it's needed. Sounded like you were advocating it as a backup plan, not pointing out a flaw people exploit. So I was pointing out that you can't count on it because you may not be in a place to fudge the situation.
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Threshkin

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Re: 2017 ACA plan info now available
« Reply #44 on: October 27, 2016, 11:18:36 AM »
you can't sign up before open enrollment if you get an illness . you can only sign up mid stream for insurance life changing events . marriage, divorce , loss of existing policy , etc ,

Easy enough to engineer a qualifying event if really necessary.

Yeah, somehow I don't think my ICU patients who were in a medically induced coma on ventilators were gonna pop out and fudge a marriage or a move for the sake of insurance.

Bracken Joy, I am sorry for your parent's situation.  My mother is in a nursing home and is almost completely out of money.  Medicaid is only a couple of months away.

Your parent's situation is not the type of case I was referring to.  I was referring to essentially healthy people gaming the system by not getting insurance unless a medical need arises and then using the ACA rules to get insurance outside of open enrollment. 

Insurance companies have stated that people buying insurance outside of open enrollment have higher expenses than people buying during open enrollment.  This is one factor some insurance companies have used to justify raising rates or pulling out of providing ACA coverage.

I am not opposed to the concept of national health care.  It is a good idea.  But I am not happy with ACA because it does not address the major factors driving up health care costs for everyone involved (individuals, providers and insurance companies)

Not my parents. Patients. Nurse here. And I was saying it's not something to bank on, rigging a qualifying event when it's needed. Sounded like you were advocating it as a backup plan, not pointing out a flaw people exploit. So I was pointing out that you can't count on it because you may not be in a place to fudge the situation.

I fully agree.  It is not a backup plan I would ever personally consider.  I am not a risk taker when it comes to my health (or money).

BTDretire

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Re: 2017 ACA plan info now available
« Reply #45 on: October 28, 2016, 12:59:50 PM »
even without subsidy the aca plans have premiums that are not bad.


That is not my experience! I'm paying $8,800 a year for my families BCBS policy.
A similar Obamacare policy is $15,700. That's last years price, I'll be looking at this years and get back to you.
Quote
the problem is these plans are really pay as  you go. the out of pockets and deductibles can be insane with no cost sharing.
   I think a substantial deductable and OOP is required to help keep cost down.

Gin1984

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Re: 2017 ACA plan info now available
« Reply #46 on: October 28, 2016, 01:02:24 PM »
even without subsidy the aca plans have premiums that are not bad.


That is not my experience! I'm paying $8,800 a year for my families BCBS policy.
A similar Obamacare policy is $15,700. That's last years price, I'll be looking at this years and get back to you.
Quote
the problem is these plans are really pay as  you go. the out of pockets and deductibles can be insane with no cost sharing.
   I think a substantial deductable and OOP is required to help keep cost down.
I paid over $500 just for myself on COBRA back in 2009, for a family of four that would be $2000/month.  I still think the ACA are within the costs of employer plans.  But I'm biased, I was on COBRA because not one company would insure me.

mathjak107

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Re: 2017 ACA plan info now available
« Reply #47 on: October 28, 2016, 01:21:10 PM »
aca plans  have no restrictions because of prexisting

Metric Mouse

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Re: 2017 ACA plan info now available
« Reply #48 on: October 30, 2016, 03:41:30 PM »
aca plans  have no restrictions because of prexisting

Was this under question?
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BTDretire

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Re: 2017 ACA plan info now available
« Reply #49 on: October 30, 2016, 03:50:43 PM »

If it worked out cheaper, and you were ok with gambling a bit, you could "just pay the fine" and also augment with non-ACA compliant "short term insurance"

I see this non-ACA compliant term, I'm not sure what that means.
Many policies were eliminated when the ACA started, because they weren't ACA compliant.
I have a policy that was grandfathered in with a few adjustments, unlimited cap vs 5 million, and it now pays for a yearly physical and a colonoscopy every 5 years.
I'm not sure there are non-ACA compliant policies available, because they are non compliant.
 Anyone have more details.