Author Topic: Why The US Dollar Will Collapse | Peter Schiff and Stefan Molyneux  (Read 15155 times)

MoonShadow

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Re: Why The US Dollar Will Collapse | Peter Schiff and Stefan Molyneux
« Reply #50 on: August 06, 2015, 11:18:12 PM »
Is this time different?

http://www.resourceinvestor.com/News/2011/1/Pages/IsThisTimeDifferentfortheDollar.aspx


"The average life expectancy for a fiat currency is 27 years, with the shortest life span being one month. Founded in 1694, the British pound Sterling is the oldest fiat currency in existence. At a ripe old age of 317 years it must be considered a highly successful fiat currency. However, success is relative. The British pound was defined as 12 ounces of silver, so it's worth less than 1/200 or 0.5% of its original value. In other words, the most successful long standing currency in existence has lost 99.5% of its value."

uhh.... no.

Whoever is providing you with this information is doing you a great disservice, if not outright lying in order to promote their agenda. The GBP hasn't been a 'fiat-currency' for 317 years. It was based on the gold standard like all other major currencies until somewhere in the 1930's. So, by this measure it has only been a fiat-currency for around 85 years, the same amount of time that the USD has been a fiat-currency.


Try and keep up.  I pointed out that error about 3 hours ago.

bwall

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Re: Why The US Dollar Will Collapse | Peter Schiff and Stefan Molyneux
« Reply #51 on: August 06, 2015, 11:30:46 PM »
"By non-fiat currencies, you mean what exactly?  The only true non-fiat currencies that I can think of were all commodity monies, and as far as I know, none have actually 'failed' in any compariable sense.  We still use gold, silver & copper.  The non-monetary uses of these metals can over shadow their historic monetary uses, but they all still have a market/monetary value."

I think that we don't have much basis for further discussion. You use the term 'fiat currency' as a disparagement and therefore I assumed that you knew what the alternative to a non fiat currency is, one that is backed by gold or silver. Gold and silver are not the same as a currency backed by gold and silver.

And if non fiat currencies haven't failed, where are they today? And why doesn't their removal from circulation constitute failure?

And nowhere in the world today are gold, silver and copper used as currencies. Yes, they are a store of value, just as platinum, palladium, nickel or even coal, wood and bullets may be, but that does not make them a currency.

bwall

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Re: Why The US Dollar Will Collapse | Peter Schiff and Stefan Molyneux
« Reply #52 on: August 06, 2015, 11:34:41 PM »

"Yes, I am aware of him.  I am also aware that so many here consider gold to be a monetary relic.  We might yet see a return to some kind of commodity backed standard in our lifetimes, though.  Who knows."

Well, I'm glad that you've heard of him. Kudos. But, I can promise you that we will never see the return to a commodity backed standard, ever. For the same reason that we will never see a return of the horse and buggy as the main form of transportation or monarchies as the preferred form of government.  That time has come and gone.

bwall

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Re: Why The US Dollar Will Collapse | Peter Schiff and Stefan Molyneux
« Reply #53 on: August 06, 2015, 11:38:01 PM »
Is this time different?

http://www.resourceinvestor.com/News/2011/1/Pages/IsThisTimeDifferentfortheDollar.aspx


"The average life expectancy for a fiat currency is 27 years, with the shortest life span being one month. Founded in 1694, the British pound Sterling is the oldest fiat currency in existence. At a ripe old age of 317 years it must be considered a highly successful fiat currency. However, success is relative. The British pound was defined as 12 ounces of silver, so it's worth less than 1/200 or 0.5% of its original value. In other words, the most successful long standing currency in existence has lost 99.5% of its value."

uhh.... no.

Whoever is providing you with this information is doing you a great disservice, if not outright lying in order to promote their agenda. The GBP hasn't been a 'fiat-currency' for 317 years. It was based on the gold standard like all other major currencies until somewhere in the 1930's. So, by this measure it has only been a fiat-currency for around 85 years, the same amount of time that the USD has been a fiat-currency.


Try and keep up.  I pointed out that error about 3 hours ago.

If it was so glaringly obvious, why did you post the link and quote him in the thread? You must have found some merit to the fallacy, otherwise you wouldn't have posted it to begin with. smh.

MoonShadow

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Re: Why The US Dollar Will Collapse | Peter Schiff and Stefan Molyneux
« Reply #54 on: August 07, 2015, 12:34:06 AM »
"By non-fiat currencies, you mean what exactly?  The only true non-fiat currencies that I can think of were all commodity monies, and as far as I know, none have actually 'failed' in any compariable sense.  We still use gold, silver & copper.  The non-monetary uses of these metals can over shadow their historic monetary uses, but they all still have a market/monetary value."

I think that we don't have much basis for further discussion. You use the term 'fiat currency' as a disparagement and therefore I assumed that you knew what the alternative to a non fiat currency is, one that is backed by gold or silver. Gold and silver are not the same as a currency backed by gold and silver.

And if non fiat currencies haven't failed, where are they today? And why doesn't their removal from circulation constitute failure?

And nowhere in the world today are gold, silver and copper used as currencies. Yes, they are a store of value, just as platinum, palladium, nickel or even coal, wood and bullets may be, but that does not make them a currency.

We seem to have a difference in definitions, perhaps.

What, to you, defines a currency?  What about a money? 

MoonShadow

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Re: Why The US Dollar Will Collapse | Peter Schiff and Stefan Molyneux
« Reply #55 on: August 07, 2015, 12:40:10 AM »
Is this time different?

http://www.resourceinvestor.com/News/2011/1/Pages/IsThisTimeDifferentfortheDollar.aspx


"The average life expectancy for a fiat currency is 27 years, with the shortest life span being one month. Founded in 1694, the British pound Sterling is the oldest fiat currency in existence. At a ripe old age of 317 years it must be considered a highly successful fiat currency. However, success is relative. The British pound was defined as 12 ounces of silver, so it's worth less than 1/200 or 0.5% of its original value. In other words, the most successful long standing currency in existence has lost 99.5% of its value."

uhh.... no.

Whoever is providing you with this information is doing you a great disservice, if not outright lying in order to promote their agenda. The GBP hasn't been a 'fiat-currency' for 317 years. It was based on the gold standard like all other major currencies until somewhere in the 1930's. So, by this measure it has only been a fiat-currency for around 85 years, the same amount of time that the USD has been a fiat-currency.


Try and keep up.  I pointed out that error about 3 hours ago.

If it was so glaringly obvious, why did you post the link and quote him in the thread? You must have found some merit to the fallacy, otherwise you wouldn't have posted it to begin with. smh.

I posted it mostly because I thought it amusing that I stubbled across it after sirdoug007's comment asking me why "this time it's different".  I don't stand by the accuracy of the article itself, I didn't check it.

MoonShadow

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Re: Why The US Dollar Will Collapse | Peter Schiff and Stefan Molyneux
« Reply #56 on: August 07, 2015, 12:41:54 AM »

"Yes, I am aware of him.  I am also aware that so many here consider gold to be a monetary relic.  We might yet see a return to some kind of commodity backed standard in our lifetimes, though.  Who knows."

Well, I'm glad that you've heard of him. Kudos. But, I can promise you that we will never see the return to a commodity backed standard, ever. For the same reason that we will never see a return of the horse and buggy as the main form of transportation or monarchies as the preferred form of government.  That time has come and gone.

I shall consider your prediction, and afford it the full weight it deserves.

Johnez

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Re: Why The US Dollar Will Collapse | Peter Schiff and Stefan Molyneux
« Reply #57 on: August 07, 2015, 01:22:49 AM »
Fiat currency = money by decree. It has value because the king/Gov't says it does. As opposed to a currency backed by gold or silver, which derives its value from the metal. To the doubters who think gold or silver is stupid in an economic shitstorm, I encourage you to research Argentina's currency crisis. An Argentine blogger that goes by FerFal stated that gold was used in transactions because of paper money becoming worthless. In the event of a currency crisis it's more likely a barter system would emerge first, but gold and silver have the advantage of being fungible and can be useful later on.
« Last Edit: August 07, 2015, 06:38:38 AM by Johnez »

 

Wow, a phone plan for fifteen bucks!