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Other => Off Topic => Topic started by: Paul der Krake on September 01, 2019, 12:00:03 AM

Title: Why do some forum members put spaces in their ellipses (...)?
Post by: Paul der Krake on September 01, 2019, 12:00:03 AM
Writing them like this. . . instead of like this...

You know who you are.

Explain yourselves.
Title: Re: Why do some forum members put spaces in their ellipses (...)?
Post by: marty998 on September 01, 2019, 12:38:40 AM
Not me... I write them lots and lots, but always with no spaces (maybe one space at the end).

Sometimes when I'm feeling rebellious I might use four....
Title: Re: Why do some forum members put spaces in their ellipses (...)?
Post by: Dollar Slice on September 01, 2019, 02:18:09 AM
There are a couple of different major 'styles' when it comes to things like punctuation, hyphenation, grammar, etc. The two most popular for American English are the AP (from Associated Press) and Chicago (from the University of Chicago Press) manuals of style. They basically give you a way to be consistent when applying arbitrary rules like whether or not to put spaces in an ellipsis. If you're running a magazine or newspaper or website you can tell all your writers/editors/proofreaders to use the AP style guide and know that you'll get a consistent result instead of half your articles looking one way, and half another way.

AP Style says an ellipsis is "..." and Chicago says it's ". . ."

So posters who use spaces are using the Chicago style (although I'd guess most of them don't know it - they were just taught that way or picked it up somewhere). It's equally correct. Just different.
Title: Re: Why do some forum members put spaces in their ellipses (...)?
Post by: KBecks on September 01, 2019, 12:00:27 PM
dramatic effect
Title: Re: Why do some forum members put spaces in their ellipses (...)?
Post by: charis on September 01, 2019, 12:23:19 PM
dramatic effect
No. It's a requirement or feature of certain writing styles (including some legal writing), as stated above.
Title: Re: Why do some forum members put spaces in their ellipses (...)?
Post by: BicycleB on September 01, 2019, 07:39:11 PM
To annoy Kraken!

Just kidding...
Title: Re: Why do some forum members put spaces in their ellipses (...)?
Post by: seattlecyclone on September 01, 2019, 07:46:04 PM
Maybe I need to start using the single-character ellipsis(…). The dots look slightly smaller.
Title: Re: Why do some forum members put spaces in their ellipses (...)?
Post by: sui generis on September 04, 2019, 05:52:28 PM
I use Chicago style when I'm actually quoting something to signify skipped text (as I was taught in law school).  I use AP when I'm writing casually to indicate a pause or other tone nuances/quirks (not skipped text).  To me " . . . " feels more formal (prob because I learned it in law school and it's required for legal writing).
Title: Re: Why do some forum members put spaces in their ellipses (...)?
Post by: lookingforadelorean on September 04, 2019, 06:48:56 PM
There are a couple of different major 'styles' when it comes to things like punctuation, hyphenation, grammar, etc. The two most popular for American English are the AP (from Associated Press) and Chicago (from the University of Chicago Press) manuals of style. They basically give you a way to be consistent when applying arbitrary rules like whether or not to put spaces in an ellipsis. If you're running a magazine or newspaper or website you can tell all your writers/editors/proofreaders to use the AP style guide and know that you'll get a consistent result instead of half your articles looking one way, and half another way.

AP Style says an ellipsis is "..." and Chicago says it's ". . ."

I had a very strict AP style advisor in grad school, so I picked it up there with the eleventy billion papers I wrote. When I was in my program AP style dictated spaces between ellipses.
Title: Re: Why do some forum members put spaces in their ellipses (...)?
Post by: solon on September 04, 2019, 07:01:10 PM
Kelley from the Office explains how dots work.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nNnFsIcTBwQ
Title: Re: Why do some forum members put spaces in their ellipses (...)?
Post by: OurTown on September 10, 2019, 02:37:10 PM
I still double space after colons:  and periods.  See?
Title: Re: Why do some forum members put spaces in their ellipses (...)?
Post by: Paul der Krake on September 10, 2019, 03:04:19 PM
I still double space after colons:  and periods.  See?
You  disgust me
Title: Re: Why do some forum members put spaces in their ellipses (...)?
Post by: seattlecyclone on September 10, 2019, 03:35:36 PM
How do you feel about non breaking spaces? Do they also disgust you? If I write a long paragraph with them do I cause horizontal scrolling to happen on this message board software platform? I'm sure going to find out about that! Just a little bit longer should do it! There we go! Seems surely long enough now even on a pretty big monitor.
Title: Re: Why do some forum members put spaces in their ellipses (...)?
Post by: Paul der Krake on September 10, 2019, 03:54:41 PM
How do you feel about non breaking spaces? Do they also disgust you? If I write a long paragraph with them do I cause horizontal scrolling to happen on this message board software platform? I'm sure going to find out about that! Just a little bit longer should do it! There we go! Seems surely long enough now even on a pretty big monitor.

(https://media2.giphy.com/media/L4Br3784iu1x5f0zSc/giphy.gif?cid=790b761131b98791e5fe099aac2b9e83ce80460b04d9ebb7&rid=giphy.gif)
Title: Re: Why do some forum members put spaces in their ellipses (...)?
Post by: RetiredAt63 on September 11, 2019, 05:20:11 AM
I still double space after colons:  and periods.  See?

Hmmm, I single space after colons and semi-colons but double space after periods.

Just to add to the confusion, scientific journals often have their own rules. 3 journals can have 3 different ways to cite references.
Title: Re: Why do some forum members put spaces in their ellipses (...)?
Post by: BicycleB on September 11, 2019, 08:46:48 AM
I used to double space after periods. I started switching to single space after someone online opined that double spacing is like proclaiming "I'm over 40!" So now single spacing is my typographical equivalent of the dye that keeps me from being a complete graybeard...

Trendily yours,

Bikey
Title: Re: Why do some forum members put spaces in their ellipses (...)?
Post by: PDXTabs on September 11, 2019, 08:49:11 AM
...
. . .
.  .  .

Seriously, cut it out. We aren't using typewriters anymore.
Title: Re: Why do some forum members put spaces in their ellipses (...)?
Post by: Philociraptor on September 11, 2019, 08:57:32 AM
I used to double space after periods. I started switching to single space after someone online opined that double spacing is like proclaiming "I'm over 40!" So now single spacing is my typographical equivalent of the dye that keeps me from being a complete graybeard...

Trendily yours,

Bikey

Oh hey, me too! It doesn't help that on iPhone you can type a period by using two spaces instead, which results in a period+single space.
Title: Re: Why do some forum members put spaces in their ellipses (...)?
Post by: GuitarStv on September 11, 2019, 01:53:48 PM
I've always typed elipses with spaces between them.  It just looks right to me.  Not sure what that means . . .
Title: Re: Why do some forum members put spaces in their ellipses (...)?
Post by: marty998 on September 12, 2019, 02:35:07 AM
How do you feel about non breaking spaces? Do they also disgust you? If I write a long paragraph with them do I cause horizontal scrolling to happen on this message board software platform? I'm sure going to find out about that! Just a little bit longer should do it! There we go! Seems surely long enough now even on a pretty big monitor.

(https://media2.giphy.com/media/L4Br3784iu1x5f0zSc/giphy.gif?cid=790b761131b98791e5fe099aac2b9e83ce80460b04d9ebb7&rid=giphy.gif)

OOOOOOOORRRRRRRRRDERRRRRRRRRRRRR

ORDER!

AUUUUDAIRE!

...

I'm going to miss him.
Title: Re: Why do some forum members put spaces in their ellipses (...)?
Post by: Paul der Krake on April 27, 2020, 11:42:15 PM
Some good news:
https://www.cnn.com/2020/04/27/tech/microsoft-word-two-spaces-trnd/index.html

Do the right thing, Microsoft. Make spaces in ellipses illegal too.
Title: Re: Why do some forum members put spaces in their ellipses (...)?
Post by: RetiredAt63 on April 28, 2020, 10:38:08 AM
Some good news:
https://www.cnn.com/2020/04/27/tech/microsoft-word-two-spaces-trnd/index.html

Do the right thing, Microsoft. Make spaces in ellipses illegal too.

Nooooooo!!  Spaces are good.  Spaces make it easier on the eyes!  I want my spaces!

Look at this.  Two spaces, nice separation between the sentences.
Look at this. One space, two sentences shoved together.

And (. . .) is nicer than (...)    give them space to be their distinctive selves.
Title: Re: Why do some forum members put spaces in their ellipses (...)?
Post by: GuitarStv on April 28, 2020, 11:38:39 AM
I was taught in my elementary school keyboarding class that two spaces between sentences was correct and have done it ever since.  MS is (as usual) wrong in what they're doing.
Title: Re: Why do some forum members put spaces in their ellipses (...)?
Post by: RetiredAt63 on April 28, 2020, 11:53:36 AM
I was taught in my elementary school keyboarding class that two spaces between sentences was correct and have done it ever since.  MS is (as usual) wrong in what they're doing.

I learned it in typing class back in 1967.  I bet MS also thinks the Oxford comma is wrong.
Title: Re: Why do some forum members put spaces in their ellipses (...)?
Post by: Zikoris on April 28, 2020, 12:01:14 PM
In my experience it seems to be an old person thing. People over 50 really seem to like to put a million dots in everything they write, especially on Facebook.
Title: Re: Why do some forum members put spaces in their ellipses (...)?
Post by: jinga nation on April 28, 2020, 12:06:28 PM
to annoy the grammar police.
because it's fun.
Title: Re: Why do some forum members put spaces in their ellipses (...)?
Post by: BicycleB on April 28, 2020, 12:41:23 PM
In my experience it seems to be an old person thing. People over 50 really seem to like to put a million dots in everything they write, especially on Facebook.

I think the "million dots" is a precursor to the emoji - a creative use of characters to express an emotional effect. Imagine yourself 25 years from now. People call you old. Everyone whose experience and education are shorter than yours is complaining "old people keep using these horrible emojis for no reason". That's probably how the dotters feel.

:)
Title: Re: Why do some forum members put spaces in their ellipses (...)?
Post by: chemistk on April 28, 2020, 12:48:01 PM
I, for one, am glad MS is finally going to start flagging this for correction when typing. As a young-un, I was taught (early '00s) that everything should only be monospaced. Well, sentence structure-wise that is. Line spacing is a different animal.

It's really frustrating to go and make edits to an older document that has double spacing between sentences. Good thing the find&replace tool can fix it all instantly.

Now, if everyone would just agree that we need the Oxford comma, 80% of all my grammatical pet peeves would be solved.
Title: Re: Why do some forum members put spaces in their ellipses (...)?
Post by: dandarc on April 28, 2020, 12:59:37 PM
Just don't ever use the single-character Unicode ellipses.



doesn't even save much space over:

...
Title: Re: Why do some forum members put spaces in their ellipses (...)?
Post by: Zikoris on April 28, 2020, 02:00:38 PM
In my experience it seems to be an old person thing. People over 50 really seem to like to put a million dots in everything they write, especially on Facebook.

I think the "million dots" is a precursor to the emoji - a creative use of characters to express an emotional effect. Imagine yourself 25 years from now. People call you old. Everyone whose experience and education are shorter than yours is complaining "old people keep using these horrible emojis for no reason". That's probably how the dotters feel.

:)

No need to wait 25 years, people who use emojis the way old people use dots already deserve to be shamed to hell and back.
Title: Re: Why do some forum members put spaces in their ellipses (...)?
Post by: GuitarStv on April 28, 2020, 02:03:08 PM
I, for one, am glad MS is finally going to start flagging this for correction when typing. As a young-un, I was taught (early '00s) that everything should only be monospaced. Well, sentence structure-wise that is. Line spacing is a different animal.

How come everyone else needs to change because of the faulty teaching you received?
Title: Re: Why do some forum members put spaces in their ellipses (...)?
Post by: Paul der Krake on April 28, 2020, 03:33:38 PM
I was taught in my elementary school keyboarding class that two spaces between sentences was correct and have done it ever since.  MS is (as usual) wrong in what they're doing.

I learned it in typing class back in 1967.  I bet MS also thinks the Oxford comma is wrong.
That's cute, but two spaces stopped being correct when computers came.

The Oxford comma, however, should never die.
Title: Re: Why do some forum members put spaces in their ellipses (...)?
Post by: Kris on April 28, 2020, 03:48:51 PM
Most current style manuals specify one space after a period.

I, being in my fifties, was raised to use two. It has taken me a while, but I've managed to make the switch.
Title: Re: Why do some forum members put spaces in their ellipses (...)?
Post by: Rural on April 28, 2020, 05:53:28 PM
I switched gratefully and quickly as soon as one space after periods became even remotely acceptable. (It's a total coincidence that most of arthritis in my thumbs, of course.)
Title: Re: Why do some forum members put spaces in their ellipses (...)?
Post by: RetiredAt63 on April 28, 2020, 06:12:30 PM
I'm old and proud of it.  Two spaces forever.  And you young whippersnappers get off my lawn!
Title: Re: Why do some forum members put spaces in their ellipses (...)?
Post by: PDXTabs on April 28, 2020, 08:20:27 PM
As a young-un, I was taught (early '00s) that everything should only be monospaced.

I was probably introduced to a word processor in 1990 or 1991 and it was definitely single space by then. I don't understand how some people can't accept that some things change. We don't inoculate our kids against smallpox (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Variolation) anymore and we only put one space after the period.
Title: Re: Why do some forum members put spaces in their ellipses (...)?
Post by: RetiredAt63 on April 29, 2020, 06:51:47 AM
As a young-un, I was taught (early '00s) that everything should only be monospaced.

I was probably introduced to a word processor in 1990 or 1991 and it was definitely single space by then. I don't understand how some people can't accept that some things change. We don't inoculate our kids against smallpox (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Variolation) anymore and we only put one space after the period.

Not all change is for the better.  After all, Americans dropped their "u"s.  Sheer laziness.   ;-)
Title: Re: Why do some forum members put spaces in their ellipses (...)?
Post by: beltim on April 29, 2020, 07:00:45 AM
Some good news:
https://www.cnn.com/2020/04/27/tech/microsoft-word-two-spaces-trnd/index.html

Do the right thing, Microsoft. Make spaces in ellipses illegal too.

Nooooooo!!  Spaces are good.  Spaces make it easier on the eyes!  I want my spaces!

Look at this.  Two spaces, nice separation between the sentences.
Look at this. One space, two sentences shoved together.

And (. . .) is nicer than (...)    give them space to be their distinctive selves.

Oddly enough, I agree that two spaces between sentences is good, as it makes it more readable.  There is also experimental evidence for this.  On the other hand, I prefer the unicode ellipses, which may depend on font but I thought was between the "no space" and "space" variant.
...
…     <--I like this one
. . .
Title: Re: Why do some forum members put spaces in their ellipses (...)?
Post by: dandarc on April 29, 2020, 09:03:17 AM
...
…     <--I like this one
. . .
Respectfully, this is the most offensive thing I've ever seen on this forum.

Then again, I had to work on a bug not so long ago that basically boils down to "POS system that you signed up to work on knowing it is a POS, lets you enter that character, but then it causes problems later."
Title: Re: Why do some forum members put spaces in their ellipses (...)?
Post by: GuitarStv on April 29, 2020, 09:18:53 AM
...
…     <--I like this one
. . .

It's OK.  Not everyone can be right all of the time . . .
Title: Re: Why do some forum members put spaces in their ellipses (...)?
Post by: beltim on April 29, 2020, 09:37:22 AM
...
…     <--I like this one
. . .
Respectfully, this is the most offensive thing I've ever seen on this forum.

Then again, I had to work on a bug not so long ago that basically boils down to "POS system that you signed up to work on knowing it is a POS, lets you enter that character, but then it causes problems later."

...
…     <--I like this one
. . .

It's OK.  Not everyone can be right all of the time . . .

Why the hate for the symbol? 
Title: Re: Why do some forum members put spaces in their ellipses (...)?
Post by: nereo on April 29, 2020, 09:44:09 AM

I, being in my fifties, was raised to use two. It has taken me a while, but I've managed to make the switch.

Was it painful?

I, too, was taught two-spaces following a period by my older (and oddly all British) english teachers in HS; then I had it drilled out of my in college and grad-school.

Sadly, I think the current trend is to forego punctuation altogether, as in the Twitterverse
Title: Re: Why do some forum members put spaces in their ellipses (...)?
Post by: iris lily on April 29, 2020, 09:46:46 AM
Kelley from the Office explains how dots work.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nNnFsIcTBwQ
I love Kelley Wisdom.
Title: Re: Why do some forum members put spaces in their ellipses (...)?
Post by: Wolfpack Mustachian on April 29, 2020, 09:55:46 AM
C'mon everyone, one space after sentences and reduced spaces in ... is clearly more efficient. We're all engineers here, right :-)?
Title: Re: Why do some forum members put spaces in their ellipses (...)?
Post by: dandarc on April 29, 2020, 10:15:31 AM
...
…     <--I like this one
. . .
Respectfully, this is the most offensive thing I've ever seen on this forum.

Then again, I had to work on a bug not so long ago that basically boils down to "POS system that you signed up to work on knowing it is a POS, lets you enter that character, but then it causes problems later."

...
…     <--I like this one
. . .

It's OK.  Not everyone can be right all of the time . . .

Why the hate for the symbol?
It is a Unicode character - this one takes 2 bytes. So you're only saving 1 byte of space compared to 3 dots, so you're probably only getting half the space savings you thought you were in memory and on disk. Even less physical space on the page. Plus that symbol is too compressed visually - just hard to look at.

Then inevitably someone is going to cut and paste that into a computer system that isn't built to handle it. Depending on the nature of what happens, someone like me will get called in to figure out what to do. So now you using that character has cost me time (or earned me money but cost me happiness - system being so shitty unicode characters are a problem is way down the list of problems I enjoy solving in 2020).

Can mess with your SMS messages. Technically rules like "a single SMS can be up to 140 characters" are only true if you limit yourself to the GSM character set. This can impact organizational costs in a big way if you're not careful - splitting that message into 2 often doubles the cost of sending or receiving the message if you're sending and receiving messages via services such as Twilio.
Title: Re: Why do some forum members put spaces in their ellipses (...)?
Post by: GuitarStv on April 29, 2020, 10:23:10 AM
C'mon everyone, one space after sentences and reduced spaces in ... is clearly more efficient. We're all engineers here, right :-)?

Efficiency isn't necessarily better.


We cld do awy wth mst vwls and stll cmmnicat . . . bt it wld b trrbl (thgh mor effcnt).
Title: Re: Why do some forum members put spaces in their ellipses (...)?
Post by: beltim on April 29, 2020, 10:30:05 AM
...
…     <--I like this one
. . .
Respectfully, this is the most offensive thing I've ever seen on this forum.

Then again, I had to work on a bug not so long ago that basically boils down to "POS system that you signed up to work on knowing it is a POS, lets you enter that character, but then it causes problems later."

...
…     <--I like this one
. . .

It's OK.  Not everyone can be right all of the time . . .

Why the hate for the symbol?
It is a Unicode character - this one takes 2 bytes. So you're only saving 1 byte of space compared to 3 dots, so you're probably only getting half the space savings you thought you were in memory and on disk. Even less physical space on the page. Plus that symbol is too compressed visually - just hard to look at.

Then inevitably someone is going to cut and paste that into a computer system that isn't built to handle it. Depending on the nature of what happens, someone like me will get called in to figure out what to do. So now you using that character has cost me time (or earned me money but cost me happiness - system being so shitty unicode characters are a problem is way down the list of problems I enjoy solving in 2020).

Can mess with your SMS messages. Technically rules like "a single SMS can be up to 140 characters" are only true if you limit yourself to the GSM character set. This can impact organizational costs in a big way if you're not careful - splitting that message into 2 often doubles the cost of sending or receiving the message if you're sending and receiving messages via services such as Twilio.

Well, I can honestly say I've never thought about it saving a bit.  And I don't use that while texting.  I just think it's aesthetically more pleasing.  But thanks for explaining.
Title: Re: Why do some forum members put spaces in their ellipses (...)?
Post by: Kris on April 29, 2020, 10:46:41 AM

I, being in my fifties, was raised to use two. It has taken me a while, but I've managed to make the switch.

Was it painful?

I, too, was taught two-spaces following a period by my older (and oddly all British) english teachers in HS; then I had it drilled out of my in college and grad-school.

Sadly, I think the current trend is to forego punctuation altogether, as in the Twitterverse

A little, but I had good motivation. Interestingly, it happened for me extremely late. As in, probably 4 years ago. I was writing full-length books, so I needed to be consistent. And sheer volume of text being produced meant that I had a lot of practice in a very short time. Now, I find myself occasionally slipping and doing two spaces, and it looks odd and bugs the hell out of me.
Title: Re: Why do some forum members put spaces in their ellipses (...)?
Post by: dandarc on April 29, 2020, 10:56:50 AM
Another strike against the single character ... - actually was wider than 3 dots on Facebook in Chrome. So "save's space on the screen" isn't even a given.
Title: Re: Why do some forum members put spaces in their ellipses (...)?
Post by: nereo on April 29, 2020, 11:03:54 AM
This whole thing is starting to remind me of when I was in grad school and lived with two graphic designers.  They would get into these emotional debates about which type-fonts should be used. Certain companies were openly mocked for their font choice and each of them claimed to be working on ‘their own font’ which was a modernization of blah-blah-blah but fixed the inherent flaws of yackity-yack.
Title: Re: Why do some forum members put spaces in their ellipses (...)?
Post by: GuitarStv on April 29, 2020, 11:13:15 AM
Wing Dings is an acceptable font choice for EULA's goddammit!
Title: Re: Why do some forum members put spaces in their ellipses (...)?
Post by: Wolfpack Mustachian on April 29, 2020, 11:21:04 AM
C'mon everyone, one space after sentences and reduced spaces in ... is clearly more efficient. We're all engineers here, right :-)?

Efficiency isn't necessarily better.


We cld do awy wth mst vwls and stll cmmnicat . . . bt it wld b trrbl (thgh mor effcnt).

Thank you! I now expect every response from you to me in the future to be sans vowels :-)
Title: Re: Why do some forum members put spaces in their ellipses (...)?
Post by: RetiredAt63 on April 29, 2020, 11:23:04 AM
Is the efficiency in the ease of typing (one space after the period) or the ease of reading (2 spaces after the period)?  One writer, how many readers?  I still vote 2 spaces.

Title: Re: Why do some forum members put spaces in their ellipses (...)?
Post by: Wolfpack Mustachian on April 29, 2020, 11:49:09 AM
Is the efficiency in the ease of typing (one space after the period) or the ease of reading (2 spaces after the period)?  One writer, how many readers?  I still vote 2 spaces.

Do you really find it more difficult reading a sentence with only one space after the period? Separation of sentences doesn't seem a big enough deal to me to merit needing extra emphasis. You can have two "sentence" level thoughts in the same sentence with a ; or ", and" and so on.

I find adding an additional space after paragraphs, where there is a more important distinction between thoughts helpful, though :-).
Title: Re: Why do some forum members put spaces in their ellipses (...)?
Post by: dandarc on April 29, 2020, 11:49:40 AM
I'm a fan of fixed-width fonts myself

But then my first job out of college was COBOL developer, so fixed width has a nostalgic charm for me. Started that job Dec. 31, 2005. Just finished a "move legacy system off of mainframe" project at end of March. Maybe using the term "finished" a little loosely there since there are still a few odds and ends left before we can turn off the mainframe, but last wave went live on 3/30.

My asking rate is $110 per hour on 1099 if anyone sees this and can get me a contract of 12 months or longer for 1500 to 2000 hours per year . . .
Title: Re: Why do some forum members put spaces in their ellipses (...)?
Post by: RetiredAt63 on April 29, 2020, 12:15:55 PM
Is the efficiency in the ease of typing (one space after the period) or the ease of reading (2 spaces after the period)?  One writer, how many readers?  I still vote 2 spaces.

Do you really find it more difficult reading a sentence with only one space after the period? Separation of sentences doesn't seem a big enough deal to me to merit needing extra emphasis. You can have two "sentence" level thoughts in the same sentence with a ; or ", and" and so on.

I find adding an additional space after paragraphs, where there is a more important distinction between thoughts helpful, though :-).

I started off on a typewriter, so of course fixed width fonts.  Fixed font too, until I got hold of my mother's Selectrix.  Wow, italics!!

I really do prefer 2 spaces between sentences.  I find it is less tiring to read, just as serif fonts are easier on the eye in a document of any length.  Typewriters came with serif fonts (until the Selectrix, when you had choices). 
 
Title: Re: Why do some forum members put spaces in their ellipses (...)?
Post by: Wolfpack Mustachian on April 29, 2020, 12:49:33 PM
Is the efficiency in the ease of typing (one space after the period) or the ease of reading (2 spaces after the period)?  One writer, how many readers?  I still vote 2 spaces.

Do you really find it more difficult reading a sentence with only one space after the period? Separation of sentences doesn't seem a big enough deal to me to merit needing extra emphasis. You can have two "sentence" level thoughts in the same sentence with a ; or ", and" and so on.

I find adding an additional space after paragraphs, where there is a more important distinction between thoughts helpful, though :-).

I started off on a typewriter, so of course fixed width fonts.  Fixed font too, until I got hold of my mother's Selectrix.  Wow, italics!!

I really do prefer 2 spaces between sentences.  I find it is less tiring to read, just as serif fonts are easier on the eye in a document of any length.  Typewriters came with serif fonts (until the Selectrix, when you had choices).

Interesting. I have found that after getting used to one space, seeing two spaces makes me almost mentally pause in reading it as my eyes are drawn to the wasteful space ;-), slowing me down as I read. Full disclosure, I'm a late adopter to the single space, but it was a relatively quick transition after writing numerous papers with a single space at the end of a sentence.
Title: Re: Why do some forum members put spaces in their ellipses (...)?
Post by: GuitarStv on April 29, 2020, 12:50:59 PM
Is the efficiency in the ease of typing (one space after the period) or the ease of reading (2 spaces after the period)?  One writer, how many readers?  I still vote 2 spaces.

Do you really find it more difficult reading a sentence with only one space after the period? Separation of sentences doesn't seem a big enough deal to me to merit needing extra emphasis. You can have two "sentence" level thoughts in the same sentence with a ; or ", and" and so on.

I find adding an additional space after paragraphs, where there is a more important distinction between thoughts helpful, though :-).


Sorry, I know there's some text written here . . . but it's all jammed together and I can't quite decipher it.
Title: Re: Why do some forum members put spaces in their ellipses (...)?
Post by: Paul der Krake on April 29, 2020, 01:21:02 PM
This whole thing is starting to remind me of when I was in grad school and lived with two graphic designers.  They would get into these emotional debates about which type-fonts should be used. Certain companies were openly mocked for their font choice and each of them claimed to be working on ‘their own font’ which was a modernization of blah-blah-blah but fixed the inherent flaws of yackity-yack.
There is no debate. Sans serif fonts are for savages.
Title: Re: Why do some forum members put spaces in their ellipses (...)?
Post by: nereo on April 29, 2020, 01:24:23 PM
Savages need their fonts, too. 

What’s the best font for the over-educated, marginally employed?
Title: Re: Why do some forum members put spaces in their ellipses (...)?
Post by: Paul der Krake on April 29, 2020, 01:33:42 PM
Savages need their fonts, too. 

What’s the best font for the over-educated, marginally employed?
Century Schoolbook is used by the Supreme Court, so it's good enough for me.
Title: Re: Why do some forum members put spaces in their ellipses (...)?
Post by: nereo on April 29, 2020, 01:35:12 PM
Savages need their fonts, too. 

What’s the best font for the over-educated, marginally employed?
Century Schoolbook is used by the Supreme Court, so it's good enough for me.

I learn so much from this forum!
Title: Re: Why do some forum members put spaces in their ellipses (...)?
Post by: RetiredAt63 on April 29, 2020, 01:58:24 PM
Savages need their fonts, too. 

What’s the best font for the over-educated, marginally employed?
Century Schoolbook is used by the Supreme Court, so it's good enough for me.

I learn so much from this forum!

I love Century Schoolbook, but Libre Office doesn't have it.  Anyone know how I can get it?
Title: Re: Why do some forum members put spaces in their ellipses (...)?
Post by: Wolfpack Mustachian on April 29, 2020, 03:26:12 PM
Is the efficiency in the ease of typing (one space after the period) or the ease of reading (2 spaces after the period)?  One writer, how many readers?  I still vote 2 spaces.

Do you really find it more difficult reading a sentence with only one space after the period? Separation of sentences doesn't seem a big enough deal to me to merit needing extra emphasis. You can have two "sentence" level thoughts in the same sentence with a ; or ", and" and so on.

I find adding an additional space after paragraphs, where there is a more important distinction between thoughts helpful, though :-).


Sorry, I know there's some text written here . . . but it's all jammed together and I can't quite decipher it.

Hehehe :-)
Title: Re: Why do some forum members put spaces in their ellipses (...)?
Post by: AnnaGrowsAMustache on April 29, 2020, 05:50:56 PM
Dude, it's obviously social distancing. Get with the programme.
Title: Re: Why do some forum members put spaces in their ellipses (...)?
Post by: Paul der Krake on April 29, 2020, 06:06:27 PM
Dude, it's obviously social distancing. Get with the programme.
Why are you projecting your radical feminism on the program?
Title: Re: Why do some forum members put spaces in their ellipses (...)?
Post by: AnnaGrowsAMustache on April 29, 2020, 07:12:39 PM
Dude, it's obviously social distancing. Get with the programme.
Why are you projecting your radical feminism on the program?

Lol, because I can spell ;)
Title: Re: Why do some forum members put spaces in their ellipses (...)?
Post by: RetiredAt63 on April 30, 2020, 08:01:32 AM
Dude, it's obviously social distancing. Get with the programme.

It's decades since I've seen programme spelled properly, warm fuzzy feelings.
Title: Re: Why do some forum members put spaces in their ellipses (...)?
Post by: AnnaGrowsAMustache on April 30, 2020, 06:25:51 PM
Dude, it's obviously social distancing. Get with the programme.

It's decades since I've seen programme spelled properly, warm fuzzy feelings.

Haha, that's funny. I would use the word program if I were referring to some kind of software, I guess. I'd be more likely just to call it software...
Title: Re: Why do some forum members put spaces in their ellipses (...)?
Post by: RetiredAt63 on May 01, 2020, 07:20:10 AM
Dude, it's obviously social distancing. Get with the programme.

It's decades since I've seen programme spelled properly, warm fuzzy feelings.

Haha, that's funny. I would use the word program if I were referring to some kind of software, I guess. I'd be more likely just to call it software...

Yes, program=software/TV show/etc. 
Programme = "a set of related measures or activities with a particular long-term aim"
Title: Re: Why do some forum members put spaces in their ellipses (...)?
Post by: nereo on May 01, 2020, 07:30:01 AM
Dude, it's obviously social distancing. Get with the programme.

It's decades since I've seen programme spelled properly, warm fuzzy feelings.

Haha, that's funny. I would use the word program if I were referring to some kind of software, I guess. I'd be more likely just to call it software...

Yes, program=software/TV show/etc. 
Programme = "a set of related measures or activities with a particular long-term aim"
Pro gram = a person who favors using metric weight over other systems.
Title: Re: Why do some forum members put spaces in their ellipses (...)?
Post by: Wolfpack Mustachian on May 01, 2020, 07:34:42 AM
Dude, it's obviously social distancing. Get with the programme.

It's decades since I've seen programme spelled properly, warm fuzzy feelings.

Haha, that's funny. I would use the word program if I were referring to some kind of software, I guess. I'd be more likely just to call it software...

Yes, program=software/TV show/etc. 
Programme = "a set of related measures or activities with a particular long-term aim"
Pro gram = a person who favors using metric weight over other systems.

C'mon, it's obviously
Pro gram = a loving and devoted person supportive of their grandmother
Title: Re: Why do some forum members put spaces in their ellipses (...)?
Post by: GuitarStv on May 01, 2020, 09:16:15 AM
As long as we're not dropping the first 'r', I'm comfortable with use of program.
Title: Re: Why do some forum members put spaces in their ellipses (...)?
Post by: nereo on May 01, 2020, 09:28:07 AM
As long as we're not dropping the first 'r', I'm comfortable with use of program.

"Pogram"??
Title: Re: Why do some forum members put spaces in their ellipses (...)?
Post by: GuitarStv on May 01, 2020, 09:29:19 AM
As long as we're not dropping the first 'r', I'm comfortable with use of program.

"Pogram"??

Wait.  Turns out my spelling is not so great.  I was thinking 'pogrom'.
Title: Re: Why do some forum members put spaces in their ellipses (...)?
Post by: Financial.Velociraptor on May 01, 2020, 01:42:50 PM
I introduce to you the Shatner ellipse where: every. dot. is. as. important. as. the. last.  Thus, you separate them by commas to force a dramatic pause,.,.,.
Title: Re: Why do some forum members put spaces in their ellipses (...)?
Post by: nereo on May 01, 2020, 01:50:05 PM
@RetiredAt63
I   k  n  o w   t  h  a  t   y  o  u   r  e  a  l  l  y   f  i  n  d   e  x  t  r  a  s  p  a  c  e  s   t  o   m  a  k  e   f  o  r   e  a  s  i  e  r  r  e  a  d  i  n  g,   b  u  t   I  d  o  n '  t  f  i  n  d   t  h  i  s   t  o   b  e   f  a  s  t  e  r.   I  n   f  a  c  t,  i  t '  s  k  i  n  d    o  f  a  n  n  o  y  i  n  g.
Title: Re: Why do some forum members put spaces in their ellipses (...)?
Post by: RetiredAt63 on May 01, 2020, 02:10:18 PM
@RetiredAt63
I   k  n  o w   t  h  a  t   y  o  u   r  e  a  l  l  y   f  i  n  d   e  x  t  r  a  s  p  a  c  e  s   t  o   m  a  k  e   f  o  r   e  a  s  i  e  r  r  e  a  d  i  n  g,   b  u  t   I  d  o  n '  t  f  i  n  d   t  h  i  s   t  o   b  e   f  a  s  t  e  r.   I  n   f  a  c  t,  i  t '  s  k  i  n  d    o  f  a  n  n  o  y  i  n  g.

I  r e a l l y  a p p r e c i a t e  y o u r  e f f o r t s ,  N e r e o ! ! !  B u t  y o u  l e f t  o u t  t h e  e x t r a  s p a c e s ,  e h ?
Title: Re: Why do some forum members put spaces in their ellipses (...)?
Post by: nereo on May 01, 2020, 02:14:35 PM
@RetiredAt63
I   k  n  o w   t  h  a  t   y  o  u   r  e  a  l  l  y   f  i  n  d   e  x  t  r  a  s  p  a  c  e  s   t  o   m  a  k  e   f  o  r   e  a  s  i  e  r  r  e  a  d  i  n  g,   b  u  t   I  d  o  n '  t  f  i  n  d   t  h  i  s   t  o   b  e   f  a  s  t  e  r.   I  n   f  a  c  t,  i  t '  s  k  i  n  d    o  f  a  n  n  o  y  i  n  g.

I  r e a l l y  a p p r e c i a t e  y o u r  e f f o r t s ,  N e r e o ! ! !  B u t  y o u  l e f t  o u t  t h e  e x t r a  s p a c e s ,  e h ?

n  o.   T  h  e  r  e   a  r  e   t  w  o   a  f  t  e  r   e  a  c  h  l  e  t  t  e  r   a  n  d   t  h  r  e  e   b  e  t  w  e  e  n   w  o  r  d  s,   a  n  d   f  o  u  r   a  f  t  e  r   e  a  c  h  s  e  n  t  e  n  c  e.    B  e  t  t  e  r,   y  e  s?
Title: Re: Why do some forum members put spaces in their ellipses (...)?
Post by: RetiredAt63 on May 01, 2020, 02:31:51 PM
@RetiredAt63
I   k  n  o w   t  h  a  t   y  o  u   r  e  a  l  l  y   f  i  n  d   e  x  t  r  a  s  p  a  c  e  s   t  o   m  a  k  e   f  o  r   e  a  s  i  e  r  r  e  a  d  i  n  g,   b  u  t   I  d  o  n '  t  f  i  n  d   t  h  i  s   t  o   b  e   f  a  s  t  e  r.   I  n   f  a  c  t,  i  t '  s  k  i  n  d    o  f  a  n  n  o  y  i  n  g.

I  r e a l l y  a p p r e c i a t e  y o u r  e f f o r t s ,  N e r e o ! ! !  B u t  y o u  l e f t  o u t  t h e  e x t r a  s p a c e s ,  e h ?

n  o.   T  h  e  r  e   a  r  e   t  w  o   a  f  t  e  r   e  a  c  h  l  e  t  t  e  r   a  n  d   t  h  r  e  e   b  e  t  w  e  e  n   w  o  r  d  s,   a  n  d   f  o  u  r   a  f  t  e  r   e  a  c  h  s  e  n  t  e  n  c  e.    B  e  t  t  e  r,   y  e  s?

D   e   f   i   n   i   t   e   l   y   !   !   !
Title: Re: Why do some forum members put spaces in their ellipses (...)?
Post by: beltim on May 02, 2020, 02:02:29 AM
Dude, it's obviously social distancing. Get with the programme.

It's decades since I've seen programme spelled properly, warm fuzzy feelings.

Haha, that's funny. I would use the word program if I were referring to some kind of software, I guess. I'd be more likely just to call it software...

Yes, program=software/TV show/etc. 
Programme = "a set of related measures or activities with a particular long-term aim"
Pro gram = a person who favors using metric weight over other systems.

C'mon, it's obviously
Pro gram = a loving and devoted person supportive of their grandmother

Professional weightlifter.
Title: Re: Why do some forum members put spaces in their ellipses (...)?
Post by: deborah on May 02, 2020, 04:07:27 AM
Dude, it's obviously social distancing. Get with the programme.

It's decades since I've seen programme spelled properly, warm fuzzy feelings.

Haha, that's funny. I would use the word program if I were referring to some kind of software, I guess. I'd be more likely just to call it software...

Yes, program=software/TV show/etc. 
Programme = "a set of related measures or activities with a particular long-term aim"
Pro gram = a person who favors using metric weight over other systems.

C'mon, it's obviously
Pro gram = a loving and devoted person supportive of their grandmother

Professional weightlifter.
No, that would be Pro kilogram. Pro Gram is a professional actor in a show about weightlifters.
Title: Re: Why do some forum members put spaces in their ellipses (...)?
Post by: AnnaGrowsAMustache on May 02, 2020, 07:48:02 AM
Dude, it's obviously social distancing. Get with the programme.

It's decades since I've seen programme spelled properly, warm fuzzy feelings.

Haha, that's funny. I would use the word program if I were referring to some kind of software, I guess. I'd be more likely just to call it software...

Yes, program=software/TV show/etc. 
Programme = "a set of related measures or activities with a particular long-term aim"
Pro gram = a person who favors using metric weight over other systems.

C'mon, it's obviously
Pro gram = a loving and devoted person supportive of their grandmother

Professional weightlifter.
No, that would be Pro kilogram. Pro Gram is a professional actor in a show about weightlifters.

Pro Gram is one of those people who's fine with someone choosing to be a junkie, free will and all that.

Or a Pro Grammer is an instagram professional. The Kardashians are all pro grammers.

This thread started out a bit odd, and now it's just frickin weird. Like.
Title: Re: Why do some forum members put spaces in their ellipses (...)?
Post by: RetiredAt63 on May 02, 2020, 08:10:44 AM
Dude, it's obviously social distancing. Get with the programme.

It's decades since I've seen programme spelled properly, warm fuzzy feelings.

Haha, that's funny. I would use the word program if I were referring to some kind of software, I guess. I'd be more likely just to call it software...

Yes, program=software/TV show/etc. 
Programme = "a set of related measures or activities with a particular long-term aim"
Pro gram = a person who favors using metric weight over other systems.

C'mon, it's obviously
Pro gram = a loving and devoted person supportive of their grandmother

Professional weightlifter.
No, that would be Pro kilogram. Pro Gram is a professional actor in a show about weightlifters.

Pro Gram is one of those people who's fine with someone choosing to be a junkie, free will and all that.

Or a Pro Grammer is an instagram professional. The Kardashians are all pro grammers.

This thread started out a bit odd, and now it's just frickin weird. Like.

We have to have fun somehow.   ;-)
Title: Re: Why do some forum members put spaces in their ellipses (...)?
Post by: Psychstache on May 02, 2020, 11:24:06 AM
Good thing y'all aren't Jewish. The Torah would give you fits.
Title: Re: Why do some forum members put spaces in their ellipses (...)?
Post by: Paul der Krake on May 02, 2020, 12:23:17 PM
Good thing y'all aren't Jewish. The Torah would give you fits.
?tif a su evig dluow ti emussa uoy od yhW
.molahS
Title: Re: Why do some forum members put spaces in their ellipses (...)?
Post by: Metalcat on May 02, 2020, 12:29:13 PM
This thread was like a Letterkenny opener.

Thank you for that.
Title: Re: Why do some forum members put spaces in their ellipses (...)?
Post by: RetiredAt63 on May 02, 2020, 01:46:05 PM
This thread was like a Letterkenny opener.

Thank you for that.

What's a Letterkenny?

Glad we were amusing (I think?).
Title: Re: Why do some forum members put spaces in their ellipses (...)?
Post by: dandarc on May 02, 2020, 02:01:10 PM
Great thread ferda!
Title: Re: Why do some forum members put spaces in their ellipses (...)?
Post by: dandarc on June 04, 2020, 02:13:14 PM
I hope we can all agree this is just ridiculous, and it is a real example that came up in my real work:

...…...

In case that doesn't render in a way you can see it 3 dots, then a single-character ellipses, then another 3 dots.
Title: Re: Why do some forum members put spaces in their ellipses (...)?
Post by: RetiredAt63 on June 04, 2020, 03:26:07 PM
I hope we can all agree this is just ridiculous, and it is a real example that came up in my real work:

...…...

In case that doesn't render in a way you can see it 3 dots, then a single-character ellipses, then another 3 dots.

It's 9 dots.  Someone got energetic, or left a finger on the key toooooooooooooooo long.
Title: Re: Why do some forum members put spaces in their ellipses (...)?
Post by: Paul der Krake on July 07, 2020, 03:38:29 PM
https://www.npr.org/2020/07/06/887540598/the-debate-over-the-word-irregardless-is-it-a-word

Merriam-Webster has confirmed that "irregardless" is a word in the dictionary, despite concerns from teachers that it is not.


NoOOooOOooOooOOO


Title: Re: Why do some forum members put spaces in their ellipses (...)?
Post by: deborah on July 07, 2020, 05:42:28 PM
https://www.npr.org/2020/07/06/887540598/the-debate-over-the-word-irregardless-is-it-a-word

Merriam-Webster has confirmed that "irregardless" is a word in the dictionary, despite concerns from teachers that it is not.


NoOOooOOooOooOOO. . .



FIFY
Title: Re: Why do some forum members put spaces in their ellipses (...)?
Post by: FiveSigmas on July 07, 2020, 07:02:02 PM
https://www.npr.org/2020/07/06/887540598/the-debate-over-the-word-irregardless-is-it-a-word

Merriam-Webster has confirmed that "irregardless" is a word in the dictionary, despite concerns from teachers that it is not.


NoOOooOOooOooOOO

I’m sorry. I’m afraid Marriam-Webster does not include that “word” in its dictionary. Perhaps you mean “no”?
Title: Re: Why do some forum members put spaces in their ellipses (...)?
Post by: Paul der Krake on July 07, 2020, 07:12:20 PM
https://www.npr.org/2020/07/06/887540598/the-debate-over-the-word-irregardless-is-it-a-word

Merriam-Webster has confirmed that "irregardless" is a word in the dictionary, despite concerns from teachers that it is not.


NoOOooOOooOooOOO

I’m sorry. I’m afraid Marriam-Webster does not include that “word” in its dictionary. Perhaps you mean

“no”

?
Why are your

"quotation marks"

all slanted?

They look angry. Are you angry? You should be. I am.
Title: Re: Why do some forum members put spaces in their ellipses (...)?
Post by: FiveSigmas on July 07, 2020, 07:53:46 PM
Why are your

"quotation marks"

all slanted?

They look angry. Are you angry? You should be. I am.


The same reason I fail to behold the full Comic-Sans splendor of your ejaculation. Damn iPad.
Title: Re: Why do some forum members put spaces in their ellipses (...)?
Post by: Paul der Krake on November 30, 2021, 06:51:16 PM
This woman gets it.

https://mobile.twitter.com/yayalexisgay/status/1465776683819094018
Title: Re: Why do some forum members put spaces in their ellipses (...)?
Post by: Sibley on December 04, 2021, 06:21:31 PM
How did I miss this originally?!?

Font in honor of the thread of course.
Title: Re: Why do some forum members put spaces in their ellipses (...)?
Post by: Morning Glory on December 04, 2021, 06:34:29 PM
I'd like to thank whomever resurrected this thread.
Title: Re: Why do some forum members put spaces in their ellipses (...)?
Post by: seattlecyclone on December 04, 2021, 06:57:34 PM
I graduated from a university with an en dash in its name. Their style guide is very specific on this point.
Title: Re: Why do some forum members put spaces in their ellipses (...)?
Post by: nereo on December 04, 2021, 07:27:04 PM
How did I miss this originally?!?

Font in honor of the thread of course.

Fonts! Is there a better example of how primitive this forum’s architecture is than the font choices?

No one can take you seriously when you use Comic Sans
Title: Re: Why do some forum members put spaces in their ellipses (...)?
Post by: aetheldrea on December 04, 2021, 09:50:20 PM
I graduated from a university with an en dash in its name. Their style guide is very specific on this point.
Smith-Corona?
Title: Re: Why do some forum members put spaces in their ellipses (...)?
Post by: Dreamer40 on December 05, 2021, 08:32:44 PM
Some people are stuck in their ways and incapable of changing with the times. Others don’t notice when the world changes around them.