Author Topic: Weight Loss Voodoo  (Read 3131 times)

kaizen soze

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Re: Weight Loss Voodoo
« Reply #50 on: May 14, 2018, 06:03:22 PM »
Go on a thru hike, eat as much as you want.

Obviously not everyone can do this. But there were some weight loss takeaways. First off, hunger is ok. You can go to sleep hungry and be just fine the next day. I used to think hunger meant it was imperative that I eat. But it mostly means I'm in a calorie deficit, which is what you want.  Hunger means you're doing it right. Just don't overdo it. You want to be a little hungry, not a lot hungry. Second, limiting the available food is a good way to lose weight. You hit the trailhead with X food and you have no options to get more for the next four days. But anything in your pack will be eaten. So just don't keep extra food in your house. It's ok to have extra staples because no one ever got fat because they were too tempted to cook up a pot of rice at midnight. But don't keep extra prepared foods in your house. Whatever is your kryptonite, get rid of it already. Third, a small snack can cut hunger pangs before bed time. I might feel like eating a pan of brownies in the evening, but half an orange makes me feel sufficiently satisfied before I go to bed.

okits

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Re: Weight Loss Voodoo
« Reply #51 on: May 14, 2018, 09:40:17 PM »
@Roadrunner53 - what is your starting point?

I am losing a little weight just by eliminating 80-90% of the desserts, junk food, and alcohol from my diet.  If you have that kind of low-hanging fruit within reach, try that and see what it does for you.

Barbaebigode

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Re: Weight Loss Voodoo
« Reply #52 on: May 15, 2018, 06:20:34 AM »
I have a very structured meal routine. I always eat more or less at the same time, have breakfast in the same bowl, pack my lunch in the same food container, etc. That way if I want to lose/gain weight It's easy to control how much food I'm consuming. But that also means that I usually don't snack between meals, nor have cheat days and don't take part in the eating part of office parties.

Just as an observation, people more often than not don't realise how easy it is to waste a week of calorific deficit with just a few bad joices.

mjb

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Re: Weight Loss Voodoo
« Reply #53 on: May 15, 2018, 07:59:56 AM »
Potato diet: https://www.goodhousekeeping.com/health/diet-nutrition/news/a39697/penn-jillette-weight-loss-potato-diet/

This sounds incredibly fun!

Unfortunately,
Quote
Despite the crazy restrictions, Jillette stuck to it, losing 75 pounds in just 83 days without exercising

As others have noted, rapid weight loss like this is actually not a good thing.  Nearly everyone who does a "crash diet" gains all the weight they lost back.

To clarify this a bit: the point of a temporarily restricted diet (from a whole foods/plant-based doctor's point-of-view) is to fix bad habits and change your relationship with food -- the weight loss is a side effect. Once you've reset your behavior and taste buds, the plan is to bring back in a wider variety of health-promoting plant foods.

Dr. John McDougall talks about this here: https://www.drmcdougall.com/misc/2006nl/june/marys.htm

GuitarStv

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Re: Weight Loss Voodoo
« Reply #54 on: May 15, 2018, 08:10:40 AM »
Go on a thru hike, eat as much as you want.

Obviously not everyone can do this. But there were some weight loss takeaways. First off, hunger is ok. You can go to sleep hungry and be just fine the next day. I used to think hunger meant it was imperative that I eat. But it mostly means I'm in a calorie deficit, which is what you want.  Hunger means you're doing it right. Just don't overdo it. You want to be a little hungry, not a lot hungry. Second, limiting the available food is a good way to lose weight. You hit the trailhead with X food and you have no options to get more for the next four days. But anything in your pack will be eaten. So just don't keep extra food in your house. It's ok to have extra staples because no one ever got fat because they were too tempted to cook up a pot of rice at midnight. But don't keep extra prepared foods in your house. Whatever is your kryptonite, get rid of it already. Third, a small snack can cut hunger pangs before bed time. I might feel like eating a pan of brownies in the evening, but half an orange makes me feel sufficiently satisfied before I go to bed.

+1

Any kind of distance exercise is good for losing weight.  I did an 85 km bike ride two Saturdays ago, and a 110 km ride last Saturday.  I had a big pancake breakfast before the first and brought four large bananas to eat on the way . . . and then ate a large pizza later that evening.  I had a big breakfast of oatmeal, peanut butter, and chocolate chips before the second, and brought 12 large dates, a bottle of Gatorade, and three bananas . . . and then ate two huge plates of fish and chips when I got back.  I'm down 5 lbs over the past two weeks, with no other change to my regular exercise habits/diet.

Vive le carbs and exercise.  :P

OccamsPhaco

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Re: Weight Loss Voodoo
« Reply #55 on: May 15, 2018, 08:11:10 AM »
I have a very structured meal routine. I always eat more or less at the same time, have breakfast in the same bowl, pack my lunch in the same food container, etc. That way if I want to lose/gain weight It's easy to control how much food I'm consuming. But that also means that I usually don't snack between meals, nor have cheat days and don't take part in the eating part of office parties.

Just as an observation, people more often than not don't realise how easy it is to waste a week of calorific deficit with just a few bad joices.

I've long maintained that if I worked 7 days a week, I'd be in absolutely amazing shape. I can typically eat perfectly for five working days and then blow it on the weekend because I don't have that structure, and left to my own devices I'll make some bad moves. So come Monday morning, it's time to play catch up again.

I suppose I'll need an entirely different mindset as I scale back work days in the future and eventually don't have any work days at all.

NorthernBlitz

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Re: Weight Loss Voodoo
« Reply #56 on: May 15, 2018, 08:49:06 AM »
So do any of you have real weight loss techniques to help weight loss?

There are so many claims that:

Apple Cider Vinegar helps burn fat
Coconut oil helps weight loss
Green Tea helps weight loss
Olive oil helps weight loss
Metamucil helps weight loss
Over the counter weight loss pills help weight loss
The Keto diet
High fat diet
Low fat diet
Low carb diet
Nutrisystem
Jenny Craig
Weight Watchers
There are a thousand books on weight loss! Does anything really work besides starvation?

I lost maybe 40 lbs doing Tim Ferriss's slow carb diet (from 4 hour body). But, then I stopped eating that way and gained most of it back over 5 years or so.

I currently have been using the sauna 5 days a week. I don't think it's changing my weight much, but it seems to be lowering my blood pressure.

Started doing this after learning about benefits of longevity re: sauna from Dr. Rhonda Patrick.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eWKBsh7YTXQ

Not sure how much it will end up helping, but the reported reduction in all cause mortality was pretty significant in the study she references (published in JAMA I think?)

Roadrunner53

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Re: Weight Loss Voodoo
« Reply #57 on: May 15, 2018, 08:56:03 AM »
Is green tea voodoo or does it help weight loss?

GuitarStv

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Re: Weight Loss Voodoo
« Reply #58 on: May 15, 2018, 09:06:15 AM »
Is green tea voodoo or does it help weight loss?

Caffeine is a stimulant, and as such helps to increase your metabolism.

Samuel

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Re: Weight Loss Voodoo
« Reply #59 on: May 15, 2018, 09:34:28 AM »
First off, hunger is ok. You can go to sleep hungry and be just fine the next day. I used to think hunger meant it was imperative that I eat. But it mostly means I'm in a calorie deficit, which is what you want.  Hunger means you're doing it right. Just don't overdo it. You want to be a little hungry, not a lot hungry.

Yep, learning that being hungry isn't a crisis has been huge for me. This was a fairly recent discovery, found via playing around with intermittent fasting.

Resetting expectations around when I need and how much food constitutes a reasonable portion has been all I've needed to do to drop about 10 pounds and keep it off (not looking to lose any more).

I don't think I could survive on any diet that cuts out too many specific foods, I love variety too much. Portion control and avoiding unconscious or obligatory eating is the key for me.

I exercise a good amount for mental health and because I feel better overall when I do, but weight control happens on the plate.

Dabnasty

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Re: Weight Loss Voodoo
« Reply #60 on: May 15, 2018, 09:53:48 AM »
Is green tea voodoo or does it help weight loss?

Caffeine is a stimulant, and as such helps to increase your metabolism.

I've read suggestions that caffeine aids in weight loss due to increased metabolism and also that it causes weight gain due to increased stress hormones but from the evidence I've seen it doesn't have any major effects on it's own. Maybe a slight and inconsistent increase to metabolism is more plausible.

The real effect may come from how it influences your behavior which of course will vary greatly person to person, by how much you use, and by how you use it. If some morning caffeine gets you to the gym or helps regulate sleep pattern then it will probably help with weight loss. If it increases your hunger or disrupts your ability to fall asleep it could do quite the opposite.

In regards to green tea specifically:

"Green tea preparations appear to induce a small, statistically non-significant weight loss in overweight or obese adults. Because the amount of weight loss is small, it is not likely to be clinically important. Green tea had no significant effect on the maintenance of weight loss."

https://www.researchgate.net/publication/233909068_Green_tea_for_weight_loss_and_weight_maintenance_in_overweight_or_obese_adults


Samuel

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Re: Weight Loss Voodoo
« Reply #61 on: May 15, 2018, 10:03:20 AM »
Is green tea voodoo or does it help weight loss?

If it displaces high calorie beverages, sure.

brute

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Re: Weight Loss Voodoo
« Reply #62 on: May 15, 2018, 10:14:24 AM »
I dropped 150 pounds in a year on keto, so don't tell me it doesn't work. I consumed, on average, 3500 calories a day. During that time, I eliminated my need for blood pressure meds, cholesterol meds, diabetes meds, GERD meds, anxiety meds and allergy meds. Keto is a godsend for those who are insulin resistant. If you aren't insulin resistant, then even I don't see much need for it.

It comes down to what is easiest to follow long term. If one method lets you self regulate without constant calorie counting and gives good results, thats the way to go. No plan will help if you force too many calories down yourself, but some make it easier than others to feel full and satisfied. Nothing is true.

Saturated fat is not the enemy
Carbohydrates aren't either
Too much protein isn't going to hurt you unless you have a very rare genetic disorder
Exercise drastically increases your ability to lose fat if you use it correctly, but more importantly, it improves your cardiovascular system so you can live long enough to enjoy it
Lifting weights won't make women bulky
It's damn hard to get bulky (and stay lean) as a man without drugs
If you think people who binge and overeat are just weak, you aren't one of those with a food addiction. Give them some slack without supporting the behavior
Skinny people aren't necessarily healthier than (moderately) overweight people. But don't kid yourself, morbid obesity is a death sentence.
Get strong. It's useful.
The first 5-10 pounds coming off is water and poop. Don't be disappointed when it slows down
Your weight gain on vacation is the reverse. 80% isn't fat, so get back on plan and get rid of it
Your body loves homeostasis. Give it a year at your goal weight before you consider drastically changing anything
Get more protein that the FDA recommends. That number is the minimum, not the optimum.


So there's my soap box. I've been competing in strongman and powerlifting for years now. Using Keto, I'm able to keep my cholesterol and blood sugar right where they need to be while fueling my performance.

DarkandStormy

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Re: Weight Loss Voodoo
« Reply #63 on: May 15, 2018, 10:31:18 AM »
I dropped 150 pounds in a year on keto, so don't tell me it doesn't work.

One case does not equate to universal success.

https://www.health.harvard.edu/blog/ketogenic-diet-is-the-ultimate-low-carb-diet-good-for-you-2017072712089

Of the available science and data we have, the keto diet does help reduce the number of seizures, if you experience those.  And yes, there is a short-term weight loss component that many experience as well as the lowering of blood sugar level as you mention.

But in the long-term, the data available shows that it's not very effective with keep weight off.

I'm not sure if people here are doing the "carnivore" diet - essentially keto on steroids, it looks to me.  But these people eat basically no carbs, no vegetables, no fruit.  The most prominent is Dr. Shawn Baker (his license has been revoked).

https://www.reddit.com/r/JoeRogan/comments/8be58q/did_joe_ever_acknowledge_shawn_bakers_shitish/

He has has diabetes, less testosterone than a woman, dangerous levels of cholesterol, and multiple vitamin deficiencies.  He has been practicing his "carnivore" diet for a long time.
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DarkandStormy

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Re: Weight Loss Voodoo
« Reply #64 on: May 15, 2018, 10:35:46 AM »
So there's my soap box. I've been competing in strongman and powerlifting for years now. Using Keto, I'm able to keep my cholesterol and blood sugar right where they need to be while fueling my performance.

Just to go off what someone said above about no one diet being the magic fix for the entire population - https://www.mensjournal.com/food-drink/vegan-diet-american-olympic-weightlifter-kendrick-farris/

The strongest weightlifter in America in 2016 was a plant-based athlete.
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brute

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Re: Weight Loss Voodoo
« Reply #65 on: May 15, 2018, 10:40:42 AM »
I dropped 150 pounds in a year on keto, so don't tell me it doesn't work.

One case does not equate to universal success.

https://www.health.harvard.edu/blog/ketogenic-diet-is-the-ultimate-low-carb-diet-good-for-you-2017072712089

Of the available science and data we have, the keto diet does help reduce the number of seizures, if you experience those.  And yes, there is a short-term weight loss component that many experience as well as the lowering of blood sugar level as you mention.

But in the long-term, the data available shows that it's not very effective with keep weight off.

I'm not sure if people here are doing the "carnivore" diet - essentially keto on steroids, it looks to me.  But these people eat basically no carbs, no vegetables, no fruit.  The most prominent is Dr. Shawn Baker (his license has been revoked).

https://www.reddit.com/r/JoeRogan/comments/8be58q/did_joe_ever_acknowledge_shawn_bakers_shitish/

He has has diabetes, less testosterone than a woman, dangerous levels of cholesterol, and multiple vitamin deficiencies.  He has been practicing his "carnivore" diet for a long time.

You seem like you must be a researcher in the arena. Carnivore diet is obviously foolish. No argument on that from me. We're talking two different diets, no reason to conflate them.

Our friend who is following a different diet than I mentioned certainly seems to have some health issues. What has been done to show that the diet caused this and not some other condition or that his abuse of anabolic androgenic steriods isn't to blame for his low T, given that he likely damaged his HPTA with idiotic cycles?

Again, Keto,not carnivore. Humans are omnivores. Even what we consider true carnivores eat leaves/grass at times. We're being intelligent with our food consumption, not dogmatic.


mm1970

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Re: Weight Loss Voodoo
« Reply #66 on: May 15, 2018, 10:43:42 AM »
Go on a thru hike, eat as much as you want.

Obviously not everyone can do this. But there were some weight loss takeaways. First off, hunger is ok. You can go to sleep hungry and be just fine the next day. I used to think hunger meant it was imperative that I eat. But it mostly means I'm in a calorie deficit, which is what you want.  Hunger means you're doing it right. Just don't overdo it. You want to be a little hungry, not a lot hungry. Second, limiting the available food is a good way to lose weight. You hit the trailhead with X food and you have no options to get more for the next four days. But anything in your pack will be eaten. So just don't keep extra food in your house. It's ok to have extra staples because no one ever got fat because they were too tempted to cook up a pot of rice at midnight. But don't keep extra prepared foods in your house. Whatever is your kryptonite, get rid of it already. Third, a small snack can cut hunger pangs before bed time. I might feel like eating a pan of brownies in the evening, but half an orange makes me feel sufficiently satisfied before I go to bed.

+1

Any kind of distance exercise is good for losing weight.  I did an 85 km bike ride two Saturdays ago, and a 110 km ride last Saturday.  I had a big pancake breakfast before the first and brought four large bananas to eat on the way . . . and then ate a large pizza later that evening.  I had a big breakfast of oatmeal, peanut butter, and chocolate chips before the second, and brought 12 large dates, a bottle of Gatorade, and three bananas . . . and then ate two huge plates of fish and chips when I got back.  I'm down 5 lbs over the past two weeks, with no other change to my regular exercise habits/diet.

Vive le carbs and exercise.  :P
Sometimes I effing hate men. :P

MarciaB

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Re: Weight Loss Voodoo
« Reply #67 on: May 15, 2018, 11:39:31 AM »
I'll put in another high-five for intensity bursts. HIIT is the actual term. But it's simply a matter of getting your heart rate up high for a spell (10 seconds, 10 minutes, whatever) and then back down. Then up, then down...etc. I use a Tabata app on my phone outside on the grass and it's great.

Because for me, what that intensity seems to do is turn up the "I'm full!" signal in my brain to a high volume. When I am not really exercising much that signal is really faint and can be easily ignored. But exercise, and in particular the intense bursts, really helps with stopping eating when my body's had enough (because the signal is persistent and loud).

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DarkandStormy

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Re: Weight Loss Voodoo
« Reply #68 on: May 15, 2018, 01:16:21 PM »
You seem like you must be a researcher in the arena. Carnivore diet is obviously foolish. No argument on that from me. We're talking two different diets, no reason to conflate them.

No, but I do enjoy reading the research, though it's scarcely available.

Everyone who has a success is convinced theirs is "right" or the "best" - keto, WFPB, paleo, etc.  So it's very interesting to read that there is basically not a lot of difference over the long-term.  Which I think goes to OP's point about "voo doo" out there.
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Johnez

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Re: Weight Loss Voodoo
« Reply #69 on: May 17, 2018, 03:30:34 PM »
The diabetes diet. My girlfriend had gestational diabetes, could only eat between 15-30 g carbs a meal, had to have decent protein and fat in every meal and zero added sugar, and a bunch of healthy snacks. I quit energy drinks doing this, lost 15 pounds right away, this was about 3 months ago. I have strayed from the diet in massive ways recently, I've only gained 2-3 lbs and can get back on track within a week. I've plateaued a bit, but cutting excess sugar and caffeine has helped in other ways beside weightloss, mainly in getting better sleep, but also feeling better throughout the day. Getting physical work in definitely helps. Most "blue zones" around the world have built in physical work in their lifestyles, not some regiment of 30 minutes HIIT every day after sitting in a cubicle, but actually walking places, going up and down stairs and generally avoiding convenience. Ok, all over the place here, but good weight and health is about simplification. Pills, diet, exercise aren't gonna be cure-alls, its about the lifestyle.
« Last Edit: May 17, 2018, 03:32:41 PM by Johnez »

golden1

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Re: Weight Loss Voodoo
« Reply #70 on: May 20, 2018, 03:13:30 PM »
I have stayed at the same weight for most of my life, a normal weight, and my body really, really likes this setpoint.  The few times I have lost significant weight have been either due to situational depression (zero appetite), severe morning sickness, or a 500 calorie a day deficit.  Basically when I am on a deficit, I am getting quite hungry between meals.  There are calorie deficits that are easy to sustain and deficits that are hard.  I find that keeping fiber and protein in my diet is very helpful for feeling full, and reserving enough calories for a small treat at the end of the day is psychologically helpful.