Author Topic: Trump outrage of the day  (Read 297425 times)

Davnasty

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Re: Trump outrage of the day
« Reply #2650 on: June 30, 2020, 12:43:22 PM »
Agreed.  you and I are agreeing.  We are not disagreeing.
;-)

Sometimes you just have to agree to agree.

brandon1827

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Re: Trump outrage of the day
« Reply #2651 on: June 30, 2020, 02:00:50 PM »

You don't need to make up this sort of nonsense to have contempt for old Drumpf, he's done plenty of dumb shit. Focus on that if you want to have any hope of knocking him out of the White House. Don't be distracted by made-up crap like this, it strengthens him.

Exactly what part of this is made up? The intelligence about the bounties being paid by Russia has already been confirmed by multiple other countries. It has also already been confirmed that this information was made available to Trump sometime in 2019 in a PDB. As others have stated, the reasons why it's a big deal and why people are upset about it, I won't rehash.

OtherJen

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Re: Trump outrage of the day
« Reply #2652 on: June 30, 2020, 02:43:38 PM »

You don't need to make up this sort of nonsense to have contempt for old Drumpf, he's done plenty of dumb shit. Focus on that if you want to have any hope of knocking him out of the White House. Don't be distracted by made-up crap like this, it strengthens him.

Exactly what part of this is made up? The intelligence about the bounties being paid by Russia has already been confirmed by multiple other countries. It has also already been confirmed that this information was made available to Trump sometime in 2019 in a PDB. As others have stated, the reasons why it's a big deal and why people are upset about it, I won't rehash.

Apparently we Americans are too dumb to read and comprehend news articles from high-level sources, and we aren't supposed to complain about Trump because that will apparently offend people enough to elect him again. At least that's the impression I've gotten from many of Kyle's posts.

Travis

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Re: Trump outrage of the day
« Reply #2653 on: June 30, 2020, 05:21:04 PM »
These are the same Taliban that the CIA payed, gave weapons to, and trained in guerrilla tactics under Reagan?

Actually no. These are the guerrillas Pakistani Intelligence gave weapons to and trained after the guys we gave weapons to and trained started a civil war among themselves once we pulled the plug.  And if you want to be really nitpicky, the guys we're fighting now are their grown children or new recruits. Most of the original Mujaheddin and Taliban are all retirement age or dead.

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Re: Trump outrage of the day
« Reply #2654 on: June 30, 2020, 05:44:34 PM »
I'm sure he's given at least a dozen "maybe so-and-so is doing such-and-such" a week. Nobody's going to remember them all.

If only he could articulate that.  He's been quite clear in the past that he stands by everything he Tweets.  He also has a habit of Tweeting the moment a thought pops into his head.  As I stated earlier, he declared it was made up. Now it's real, but unsubstantiated. Now it's substantiated, but not enough information to do anything about it.  It wasn't in the briefing. Now it was, but he may have skipped over it.  According to the people who put these intel briefings together he just skims through them. His need to be seen as the smartest guy in the room means he can't bring himself to backpedal on anything he states. Even if the current spin is true, he still can't will himself to go from "it wasn't there" to "I didn't read it or forgot about it." That would be an admission that he can make mistakes which I don't think he's ever done.

While you're correct that the Taliban hardly need a reason to shoot at us, we were supposed to be negotiating a ceasefire at the time this was happening.  Russia screwing with that effort is worth writing down and talking about, even if just in the Oval Office. Allegedly that conversation never happened.

As far as us being unable to defeat them? Have you ever fought in a guerrilla war? It's quite difficult in a country that has divided tribal loyalties and against an enemy that is ideologically committed, has a massive safe haven to run back to whenever it gets difficult, unlimited supplies, and nearly unlimited manpower.

Kyle Schuant

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Re: Trump outrage of the day
« Reply #2655 on: June 30, 2020, 05:49:55 PM »
Exactly what part of this is made up? The intelligence about the bounties being paid by Russia has already been confirmed by multiple other countries.
Like Iraq's weapons of mass destruction?

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Re: Trump outrage of the day
« Reply #2656 on: June 30, 2020, 06:13:49 PM »
Exactly what part of this is made up? The intelligence about the bounties being paid by Russia has already been confirmed by multiple other countries.
Like Iraq's weapons of mass destruction?
Other countries relied (wrongly) on USA intelligence on WOMD but other than Israel who had their own axe to grind I don't know of any that had their independent intelligence on it.

Kyle Schuant

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Re: Trump outrage of the day
« Reply #2657 on: June 30, 2020, 06:39:11 PM »
Other countries relied (wrongly) on USA intelligence on WOMD but -
That's funny, because most of those other countries said they had independent intelligence which they had independently analysed.

This is where you have to apply common sense. When you hear a story, think: who benefits? For example, Iraq had WMD in 1991 and didn't use them. Why then would they bother holding onto them later? But who would benefit from stories of Iraq having WMDs? Well, anyone who wanted to invade them. Like, say, a former executive of an oil company. So Iraq having WMD in 2003 was not plausible, but that the stories were fabricated by obedient intelligence officials at the behest of Dubya and Cheney was plausible.

Now, Russia trying to influence the 2016 election: who benefits? Well, electing someone friendly to them, and someone who is likely to make the US even more polarised - Russia benefits. So this story is plausible.

Russia paying the Taliban to kill US soldiers: who benefits? The Taliban were doing this already, they don't need a cash incentive; they need money to keep going, but between cash from US "allies" in the Gulf and from opium sales they have enough - they haven't gone broke in almost twenty years, they're evidently doing well enough financially. What's Russia's aim supposed to be? Make the US give up and leave? After 19 years and 8 months, I think the US has shown it's pretty keen to keep going no matter what. Disrupt the US-Taliban peace talks? What, so that Russia can have another two decades of conflict on the borders of its client states? How would Russia benefit? So this story is not plausible.

Now, who benefits from fictional stories about Russia working with the Taliban? Well, it so happens that Trump is quite keen to fulfil his 2016 campaign promises and bring the troops back home - something which he's entirely failed to do so far, like Obama promising to close Guantanamo Bay prison (8 years, he couldn't manage it). And there are a whole bunch of other people who are quite keen to keep these wars going. Bolton's so pissed off at missing out on the chance for more wars that he's written a whole book detailing what a moron Trump is. And Bolton was not alone in being right about Trump being stupid, nor was he alone in being a warmonger.

Be sceptical. Always, whether the story tells you what you want to hear, or tells you what you don't want to hear.

You've got the most casualties of any country in the world due to the clusterfuck of federal agencies and federal-state dramas. You've got unfulfilled promises to end the endless pointless losing foreign conflicts. You've got a collapsed economy. You've got corruption and nepotism, and multiple instances of using office for personal gain.

You don't need bullshit stories, there are more than enough real issues to take him down, if that's what you want to do.

ixtap

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Re: Trump outrage of the day
« Reply #2658 on: June 30, 2020, 06:49:12 PM »
Exactly what part of this is made up? The intelligence about the bounties being paid by Russia has already been confirmed by multiple other countries.
Like Iraq's weapons of mass destruction?
Other countries relied (wrongly) on USA intelligence on WOMD but other than Israel who had their own axe to grind I don't know of any that had their independent intelligence on it.

Actually, most countries, most notably France, said we were full of crap and if we wanted to go to war with Iraq, we were going to have to do it on our own.

DoubleDown

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Re: Trump outrage of the day
« Reply #2659 on: June 30, 2020, 08:05:36 PM »
Russia paying the Taliban to kill US soldiers: who benefits?

Russia does. They want to diminish U.S. influence in the region and elsewhere. Russia has a long tradition of sowing chaos in order to advance their own goals, and a highly sophisticated and widespread apparatus for doing so. Their president is the former head of the KGB, and he is definitely no dummy.

You are right to be skeptical of stories in the news. But consider in this particular instance, it is highly plausible and not-at-all surprising. It fits completely within Russian interests and past actions. The United States also has a very sophisticated apparatus for pushing its foreign policy goals. We've waged many proxy battles, but ostensibly on the side of "good/democracy" instead of "evil/communist/fascist." So I'm not even shocked or dismayed to hear this "news." I treat it with a shrug of the shoulders, and "of course Russia would do this." The only newsworthy element to me is why didn't the president of the U.S. do anything about it?

Kyle Schuant

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Re: Trump outrage of the day
« Reply #2660 on: June 30, 2020, 10:35:55 PM »
Russia does. They want to diminish U.S. influence in the region and elsewhere.
History suggests that when US troops are killed, the US does not become less influential - it gets pissed off, sends more troops, and chucks more money at puppet leaders. Most countries are aware of the concept of "blowback", though the US has still to fully grasp it.

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Russia has a long tradition of sowing chaos in order to advance their own goals
In this case, there is no need for Russia to do so. The chaotic nature of Afghanistan combined with US incompetence at counterinsurgency, combined with the pentagon, et al blocking attempts at US withdrawal, ensure continued chaos in that area, keeps US forces busy, and keeps the US pissing away money unproductively.

As you said, Putin is intelligent, and wouldn't interrupt the enemy when he's making a mistake.

Unaddressed still: you and other commentators, and the media, denying Afghan agency. They are quite willing and able to kill US troops without anyone else's help. What do imagine is the scenario here? There's some quiet Taliban commander sitting around in his compound somewhere up in the north, enjoying the peaceful afternoon sunshine, after forty years of continuous conflict first against the Soviet Union, then against warlords, then against the US, after his daughter was killed at her wedding in a US airstrike, his first son killed at a US checkpoint, his second son imprisoned and tortured by the Kabul regime, he says, "Well that's enough, I'd like peace, I'm not going to bother negotiating for it though, I'll just sit quietly in my compound instead," and then a GRU officer shows up with a pile of cash and the commander says, "Well in that case..."

Seriously?

The Taliban may be illiterate goatfuckers, but they're not stupid or cowardly, and they really, really hate the US. They don't need a financial incentive.

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The only newsworthy element to me is why didn't the president of the U.S. do anything about it?
He doesn't do anything about real problems, he's sure as shit not going to do anything about fictional problems.


In Trump's position, I would keep loudly denouncing this absurd fiction, because that'll keep the Democrats stirred up and focused on bullshit instead of my real inadequacies and failures. Let's hope he's not smart enough for that.

Glenstache

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Re: Trump outrage of the day
« Reply #2661 on: June 30, 2020, 10:52:00 PM »
If your goal as Russia is to break up the liberal western nations, keeping coalition forces in Afghanistan is a win. Is is expensive and not popular in the world at large. Russia funding the Taliban and encouraging them to kill 🇺🇸 soldiers dies 2 things for Russia regardless of outcome. 1) if the talks go forward, they have an in with the new government. If things fall apart due to mid negotiation conflict, all the better. Putin needs an external bogeyman to deflect from internal problems in Russia. This story leaking is also good internal politics for Putin. Putin has correctly judged Trump and recognized that the benefits to the action outweigh the unlikely downsides.

EscapeVelocity2020

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Re: Trump outrage of the day
« Reply #2662 on: July 01, 2020, 12:17:24 AM »
OK, seriously now - what the hell is Trump doing?  Fauci had a lengthy talk with Congress about the pandemic and most of it wasn't good.  And yet we have radio (internet) silence from Trump.  I guess he's Tweeted and re-Tweeted some stuff, but where is the President?

former player

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Re: Trump outrage of the day
« Reply #2663 on: July 01, 2020, 02:19:32 AM »
Other countries relied (wrongly) on USA intelligence on WOMD but -
That's funny, because most of those other countries said they had independent intelligence which they had independently analysed.
Which ones?


You've got the most casualties of any country in the world due to the clusterfuck of federal agencies and federal-state dramas. You've got unfulfilled promises to end the endless pointless losing foreign conflicts. You've got a collapsed economy. You've got corruption and nepotism, and multiple instances of using office for personal gain.
[/quote]
Please.  I'm not American.  Your references to federalism are off point.

LennStar

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Re: Trump outrage of the day
« Reply #2664 on: July 01, 2020, 04:15:27 AM »
It seems to me paying Taliban soldiers to kill US troops would shift them from a religious-based militant organization to Russian mercenaries.

It concerns me deeply that Russia is paying mercenaries to kill US troops.

Paying bounties to kill American soldiers is an action that no president should leave unanswered.

If our adversaries around the world see that American soldiers can be killed in this way with no real response, they're likely to adopt similar tactics.

Just asking out of curiosity:
Do you think the same the other way round?
It is not okay to pay bounties to 3rd parties to attack the US, but it is okay for the US to pay bounties to 3rd parties to kill US enemies?

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Other countries relied (wrongly) on USA intelligence on WOM
No. Other countries were bullied by the USA into a fight with the only proof being the homework of a university student (or something on this level) as proof.

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That's funny, because most of those other countries said they had independent intelligence which they had independently analysed.
Which didn't say there were WMD.

Of course they could have lied because they didn't want a war. That is the problem when you rely on "intelligence services". The only thing you can be sure about them is that they lie. The question is to whom and when..

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it gets pissed off, sends more troops, and chucks more money at puppet leaders.
Right. The very reason you might want to do this if you are Russia. Put in 1000 dollar per head, and let the US pay several million in reaction. That is a fantastic ROI!

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If your goal as Russia is to break up the liberal western nations,
Please give up this misconception. Putin is not interested in that. Even less the "real communistic" leader of the last century. They know they don't need to because it will happen anyway.
What they want is keep the power and be the most powerful as te best way to survive until then. To that goal, a means is to increase internal fights or fuel costly conflicts where their target cannot go away.

It is important to mix up goals and means and to not fall into the "evil" trap. Even Trump is not evil, though he is likely a psycopath, which often amounts to the same.

OtherJen

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Re: Trump outrage of the day
« Reply #2665 on: July 01, 2020, 06:52:02 AM »
OK, seriously now - what the hell is Trump doing?  Fauci had a lengthy talk with Congress about the pandemic and most of it wasn't good.  And yet we have radio (internet) silence from Trump.  I guess he's Tweeted and re-Tweeted some stuff, but where is the President?

Golfing, retweeting, and claiming that he doesn’t know anything about the Russia–military scandal. I’m so sorry that he’s completely ignoring TX and other hard-hit states, although maybe it’s better that he isn’t holding daily press rallies to spread misinformation, like he did when NY/NJ/MI were in TX’s situation.

ixtap

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Re: Trump outrage of the day
« Reply #2666 on: July 01, 2020, 07:34:27 AM »
OK, seriously now - what the hell is Trump doing?  Fauci had a lengthy talk with Congress about the pandemic and most of it wasn't good.  And yet we have radio (internet) silence from Trump.  I guess he's Tweeted and re-Tweeted some stuff, but where is the President?

Golfing, retweeting, and claiming that he doesn’t know anything about the Russia–military scandal. I’m so sorry that he’s completely ignoring TX and other hard-hit states, although maybe it’s better that he isn’t holding daily press rallies to spread misinformation, like he did when NY/NJ/MI were in TX’s situation.

But I had hoped seeing his allies in trouble would spur something in the right direction

EscapeVelocity2020

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Re: Trump outrage of the day
« Reply #2667 on: July 01, 2020, 07:41:49 AM »
OK, seriously now - what the hell is Trump doing?  Fauci had a lengthy talk with Congress about the pandemic and most of it wasn't good.  And yet we have radio (internet) silence from Trump.  I guess he's Tweeted and re-Tweeted some stuff, but where is the President?

Golfing, retweeting, and claiming that he doesn’t know anything about the Russia–military scandal. I’m so sorry that he’s completely ignoring TX and other hard-hit states, although maybe it’s better that he isn’t holding daily press rallies to spread misinformation, like he did when NY/NJ/MI were in TX’s situation.

You have done more for me with this one message than Trump ever will.  Like when we visited the 9/11 memorial, I really have no answers for my kids when they ask legitimate questions about why these things happen.

Pizzabrewer

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Re: Trump outrage of the day
« Reply #2668 on: July 02, 2020, 02:44:24 AM »
In an interview yesterday, July 1, Trump said:

“I think we’re gonna be very good with the coronavirus,” he said. “I think that at some point that’s going to sort of just disappear, I hope.”

LennStar

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Re: Trump outrage of the day
« Reply #2669 on: July 02, 2020, 04:13:23 AM »
In an interview yesterday, July 1, Trump said:

“I think we’re gonna be very good with the coronavirus,” he said. “I think that at some point that’s going to sort of just disappear, I hope.”
He is totally right. You are very good with the virus, leading the world in infection rates. If that goes on, at the end of the year you will be the only country with herd immunity!

nereo

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Re: Trump outrage of the day
« Reply #2670 on: July 02, 2020, 05:11:59 AM »
In an interview yesterday, July 1, Trump said:

“I think we’re gonna be very good with the coronavirus,” he said. “I think that at some point that’s going to sort of just disappear, I hope.”
He is totally right. You are very good with the virus, leading the world in infection rates. If that goes on, at the end of the year you will be the only country with herd immunity!

I realize this is said in jest, but people hoping for quick ‘herd immunity’ sans virus don’t have a great understanding of how many people are in this country.

Even with infection rates of 100k/day (double our yesterday’s high-water mark of 50k) it would take over 8 years to get there.  To reach heard immunity by ‘the end of the year’ infection rates would need to exceed 1MM/day - at which point we’d simply be measuring ‘thousands of deaths per hour’.

Dee18

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Re: Trump outrage of the day
« Reply #2671 on: July 02, 2020, 05:47:24 AM »
Trump is hosting a gigantic fireworks show in DC.  No masks required.  Meanwhile, England has not allowed weddings since March 23 and is just now going to allow brief ceremonies with no food or drink and maximum of 30 guests either socially distanced or wearing masks.  Three months without weddings vs let’s throw a huge party. People simply could not get married.  I don’t think Americans have any concept of what citizens elsewhere have given up to get the virus under control.  And I’m horrified that even now Trump won’t recognize the danger of such a gathering.

MasterStache

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Re: Trump outrage of the day
« Reply #2672 on: July 02, 2020, 06:06:04 AM »
In an interview yesterday, July 1, Trump said:

“I think we’re gonna be very good with the coronavirus,” he said. “I think that at some point that’s going to sort of just disappear, I hope.

Much like his presidency!

OtherJen

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Re: Trump outrage of the day
« Reply #2673 on: July 02, 2020, 08:04:05 AM »
Trump is hosting a gigantic fireworks show in DC.  No masks required.  Meanwhile, England has not allowed weddings since March 23 and is just now going to allow brief ceremonies with no food or drink and maximum of 30 guests either socially distanced or wearing masks.  Three months without weddings vs let’s throw a huge party. People simply could not get married.  I don’t think Americans have any concept of what citizens elsewhere have given up to get the virus under control.  And I’m horrified that even now Trump won’t recognize the danger of such a gathering.

Many of us are very aware of the sacrifices made, especially those of us who live in states where the governors imposed strict emergency measures early on. We waited more than two months to have a limited-attendance, physically distanced, fully masked funeral Mass for my beloved uncle who died in April because we weren’t allowed to congregate with people not in our immediate households. The problem is that the Trump administration refuses to acknowledge the seriousness, and GOP leadership is only just now coming around because GOP majority states are in trouble. We’re a very divided nation, and even basic pandemic response measures (e.g., mask-wearing) are highly politicized.

partgypsy

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Re: Trump outrage of the day
« Reply #2674 on: July 02, 2020, 10:32:19 AM »
Yes. My father died and when I helped plan it I did not get to attend. It was a maximum of 8 (masked) attendees at any one time at the gravesite. So when the two soldiers had the flag folding and presentation ceremony,  or when the priest performed the funeral rites, various family members needed to step away 20 feet to keep to 8 people maximum. Anyways my state is opening up. If I wanted to get a beer with a friend outside, I can now do that. But I feel conflicted that I feel this opening up is going to result in widespread spreading, bc people are just not good about wearing the mask.
« Last Edit: July 02, 2020, 10:34:11 AM by partgypsy »

Kris

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Re: Trump outrage of the day
« Reply #2675 on: July 02, 2020, 10:49:55 AM »
Three of my friends have lost parents since this began, all from Covid. None of them has been able to have a funeral yet. And although they're upset about it, they understand, and are making the sacrifice.

Dee18

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Re: Trump outrage of the day
« Reply #2676 on: July 02, 2020, 02:36:51 PM »
I am so very sorry for your many losses.  I certainly over-generalized in my post regarding American sacrifices.  I live in a southern state with rapidly rising numbers.  Here there never truly was a closure because there were so many exceptions (big box stores totally open, anything related to construction open, no enforcing of social distancing at businesses, no travel limits) and no statewide mask order.  Now everything is open.  My county finally adopted a mask order this week, after reaching 350+ cases/day just in the county. 

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Re: Trump outrage of the day
« Reply #2677 on: July 02, 2020, 04:30:53 PM »
The concept of herd immunity is now thought to be impossible for COVID because apparently immunity only lasts a few months.  So barring a vaccine, it will just keep going round and round.

Also, don't confuse getting married with having a wedding party.  The former is certainly doable in most places, the latter not necessarily.

OtherJen

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Re: Trump outrage of the day
« Reply #2678 on: July 02, 2020, 04:35:50 PM »
The concept of herd immunity is now thought to be impossible for COVID because apparently immunity only lasts a few months.  So barring a vaccine, it will just keep going round and round.

Also, don't confuse getting married with having a wedding party.  The former is certainly doable in most places, the latter not necessarily.

Here, even getting married itself wasn’t possible for about 3 months because all the Catholic churches,  mosques, and synagogues and most Protestant churches were closed (virtual services only) and all government buildings were closed to the public.

LennStar

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Re: Trump outrage of the day
« Reply #2679 on: July 03, 2020, 04:15:52 AM »
Here the marriage itself was restricted to the legally required minimum - the spouses, the government worker doing the ceremony/paperwork and the witness.
Which was already more than the "only one person from a different household" rule normally in place.

In an interview yesterday, July 1, Trump said:

“I think we’re gonna be very good with the coronavirus,” he said. “I think that at some point that’s going to sort of just disappear, I hope.”
He is totally right. You are very good with the virus, leading the world in infection rates. If that goes on, at the end of the year you will be the only country with herd immunity!
I realize this is said in jest, but people hoping for quick ‘herd immunity’ sans virus don’t have a great understanding of how many people are in this country.

Even with infection rates of 100k/day (double our yesterday’s high-water mark of 50k) it would take over 8 years to get there.  To reach heard immunity by ‘the end of the year’ infection rates would need to exceed 1MM/day - at which point we’d simply be measuring ‘thousands of deaths per hour’.

Compound interest. Without any measures the number of infections can easily double each week (I think it was 3.2 days in Italy) One million per day is only a month away.

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The concept of herd immunity is now thought to be impossible for COVID because apparently immunity only lasts a few months.  So barring a vaccine, it will just keep going round and round.
Source?
I have heard of second outbreaks, but there never was proof of a second infection (aka the people never met someone who was a known sick person).
If this would be true, it would be a devastating discovery - including for vaccine efficiency.

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Re: Trump outrage of the day
« Reply #2680 on: July 03, 2020, 05:28:48 AM »
The rate of doubling can't sustain itself for very long because that's not how infections work. People modify their behaviour and the virus also modifies the behaviour of people infected.

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Re: Trump outrage of the day
« Reply #2681 on: July 03, 2020, 05:40:16 AM »
Here the marriage itself was restricted to the legally required minimum - the spouses, the government worker doing the ceremony/paperwork and the witness.
Which was already more than the "only one person from a different household" rule normally in place.

In an interview yesterday, July 1, Trump said:

“I think we’re gonna be very good with the coronavirus,” he said. “I think that at some point that’s going to sort of just disappear, I hope.”
He is totally right. You are very good with the virus, leading the world in infection rates. If that goes on, at the end of the year you will be the only country with herd immunity!
I realize this is said in jest, but people hoping for quick ‘herd immunity’ sans virus don’t have a great understanding of how many people are in this country.

Even with infection rates of 100k/day (double our yesterday’s high-water mark of 50k) it would take over 8 years to get there.  To reach heard immunity by ‘the end of the year’ infection rates would need to exceed 1MM/day - at which point we’d simply be measuring ‘thousands of deaths per hour’.

Compound interest. Without any measures the number of infections can easily double each week (I think it was 3.2 days in Italy) One million per day is only a month away.

Quote
The concept of herd immunity is now thought to be impossible for COVID because apparently immunity only lasts a few months.  So barring a vaccine, it will just keep going round and round.
Source?
I have heard of second outbreaks, but there never was proof of a second infection (aka the people never met someone who was a known sick person).
If this would be true, it would be a devastating discovery - including for vaccine efficiency.

There were some folks here in Korea that they thought caught it a second time, but it turned out they just never were fully recovered. Apparently this stuff can sit in the bottom of your lungs for a while. 

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Re: Trump outrage of the day
« Reply #2682 on: July 03, 2020, 08:14:59 AM »
The rate of doubling can't sustain itself for very long because that's not how infections work. People modify their behaviour and the virus also modifies the behaviour of people infected.
I can't speak for Oz, but here in the US the behavior modification part seems to be a mixed bag,,,, with lots if bad. As to the doubling part, see nereo's post above.

OtherJen

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Re: Trump outrage of the day
« Reply #2683 on: July 03, 2020, 08:29:35 AM »
The rate of doubling can't sustain itself for very long because that's not how infections work. People modify their behaviour and the virus also modifies the behaviour of people infected.
I can't speak for Oz, but here in the US the behavior modification part seems to be a mixed bag,,,, with lots if bad. As to the doubling part, see nereo's post above.

People outside the US often don’t seem to comprehend the size of the US population. The total population of Australia is only a few million people more than that of the state of Florida alone. The population of my state (Michigan) is roughly twice that of all of New Zealand.


Pizzabrewer

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Re: Trump outrage of the day
« Reply #2685 on: July 03, 2020, 02:25:26 PM »
This may not be an "outrage of the day" but it is outrageous and hilarious at the same time.

This is about the only way I can stand to listen to him, to laugh at him for putting his stupidity on full display.

The jaunty music is perfect.

https://www.facebook.com/NowThisPolitics/videos/591554418162783/?d=n&vh=e
« Last Edit: July 03, 2020, 09:30:08 PM by Pizzabrewer »

Glenstache

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Re: Trump outrage of the day
« Reply #2686 on: July 03, 2020, 03:16:26 PM »
I doubt that Mary Trump's book is going to change many minds, but it should be interesting to watch the fireworks. Once again, the issue of Trump's wealth and veracity of his claims seems to come to question. I think the strategy articulated here is pretty good: either the book goes out or Trump has to prove that his valuation is accurate (ie, sunlight).

https://talkingpointsmemo.com/news/mary-trump-says-family-settlement-agreement-based-on-fraudulent-valuations

Kris

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Re: Trump outrage of the day
« Reply #2687 on: July 03, 2020, 03:38:08 PM »
I've said for a long time that the next Republican candidate will have taken the lessons of the Trump campaign and presidency, and will be as corrupt, lying, and immoral as Trump, but smarter.

https://www.theweek.com/speedreads/923674/gop-reportedly-eyeing-tucker-carlson-2024-presidential-run

Moonwaves

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Re: Trump outrage of the day
« Reply #2688 on: July 06, 2020, 05:24:04 AM »
Quote
The concept of herd immunity is now thought to be impossible for COVID because apparently immunity only lasts a few months.  So barring a vaccine, it will just keep going round and round.
Source?
I have heard of second outbreaks, but there never was proof of a second infection (aka the people never met someone who was a known sick person).
If this would be true, it would be a devastating discovery - including for vaccine efficiency.
I've recently starting following a researcher on instagram who is currently working with COVID and does pretty good breakdowns of what is going on. She looks at the actual papers and studies behind the newspaper headlines and took a look at some of the herd immunity/antibody stuff last week. If I have linked correctly, you'll find that here. Otherwise just google Laurel Bristow/kinggutterbaby and it's all in her highlights. She generally gives the names of the actual papers/studies so you can find them if you want to as well.

talltexan

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Re: Trump outrage of the day
« Reply #2689 on: July 06, 2020, 06:22:07 AM »
I've noticed health economist Emily Oster--also very good at trying to use rigorous studies--making the circuits with what she thinks will be necessary to re-open schools this August. The only problem: it's expensive. And states have huge budget shortfalls because of spending dropping so much.

Just Joe

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Re: Trump outrage of the day
« Reply #2690 on: July 06, 2020, 03:36:23 PM »
I've said this elsewhere today here at MMM but Trump and Pence need to get extremely sick. Their example might change some supporters' minds and save a few lives.

Probably not. His supporters are stuck in their ways and ideas.

Dee18

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Re: Trump outrage of the day
« Reply #2691 on: July 06, 2020, 04:58:34 PM »
Just when you think things are bad enough:
"The Trump administration on Monday unveiled new fall semester rules for foreign students, including a requirement that they take in-person classes to remain in the U.S., a condition that raised concerns as certain colleges and universities are planning to use online instruction because of the coronavirus pandemic.

Under the new guidelines by Immigration and Customs Enforcement (ICE), which oversees the U.S. Student and Exchange Visitor Program, foreigners with F-1 or M-1 visas — which are for academic and vocational international students, respectively — will not be allowed to participate in an entirely online fall semester....Students already in the U.S. under those programs who are planning to attend colleges or universities that will only offer online classes in the fall will need to transfer to other schools providing in-person instruction, depart the country or face potential deportation, ICE said."

This is crazy given that colleges and universities are (wisely) re-evaluating plans as the pandemic soars and wanes and in various states. 

John Galt incarnate!

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Re: Trump outrage of the day
« Reply #2692 on: July 06, 2020, 05:19:08 PM »
The rate of doubling can't sustain itself for very long because that's not how infections work. People modify their behaviour and the virus also modifies the behaviour of people infected.
I can't speak for Oz, but here in the US the behavior modification part seems to be a mixed bag,,,, with lots if bad. As to the doubling part, see nereo's post above.

People outside the US often don’t seem to comprehend the size of the US population. The total population of Australia is only a few million people more than that of the state of Florida alone. The population of my state (Michigan) is roughly twice that of all of New Zealand.

California (my state) is the most populous @ 39.51 million.

LennStar

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Re: Trump outrage of the day
« Reply #2693 on: July 07, 2020, 03:48:37 AM »
Quote
This is crazy given that colleges and universities are (wisely) re-evaluating plans as the pandemic soars and wanes and in various states.
They could make one meeting person-mandatory. Like showing your ID and sign something.

I've said this elsewhere today here at MMM but Trump and Pence need to get extremely sick. Their example might change some supporters' minds and save a few lives.

Probably not. His supporters are stuck in their ways and ideas.

Brasilia's Trump Bolsonaro may have gotten it.

talltexan

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Re: Trump outrage of the day
« Reply #2694 on: July 07, 2020, 05:19:53 AM »
I've said this elsewhere today here at MMM but Trump and Pence need to get extremely sick. Their example might change some supporters' minds and save a few lives.

Probably not. His supporters are stuck in their ways and ideas.

If Pence gets it, Trump will just replace him with Haley or Pompeo. It'll be in the news for maybe a weekend.

Guilfoyle has it, but I imagine hers is a mild case, and Don, Jr., was smart enough not to marry her to begin with.

talltexan

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Re: Trump outrage of the day
« Reply #2695 on: July 07, 2020, 05:24:55 AM »
I'm at the point where I've been so conditioned by Trump's lies that--when he tweeted "SCHOOLS MUST OPEN IN THE FALL!!!"--my heart sank because I realized he would only tweet that if he were given credible information that it will be impossible to open schools in the Fall.

LennStar

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Re: Trump outrage of the day
« Reply #2696 on: July 07, 2020, 09:54:08 AM »
I'm at the point where I've been so conditioned by Trump's lies that--when he tweeted "SCHOOLS MUST OPEN IN THE FALL!!!"--my heart sank because I realized he would only tweet that if he were given credible information that it will be impossible to open schools in the Fall.
I know what you mean :D

If he ever tweeted "don't eat X, it tastes like shit!", I would instantly look where I can order X out of a sort of habit.

OtherJen

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Re: Trump outrage of the day
« Reply #2697 on: July 07, 2020, 03:00:39 PM »
NBC News: Trump administration gives formal notice of withdrawal from WHO

Definitely a smart move in the middle of a global pandemic. /s

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Re: Trump outrage of the day
« Reply #2698 on: July 07, 2020, 06:26:16 PM »
I don't see how Trump can possibly win in November. He's screwed up in so many respects, surely no one will vote for him.

Glenstache

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Re: Trump outrage of the day
« Reply #2699 on: July 07, 2020, 06:42:11 PM »
I don't see how Trump can possibly win in November. He's screwed up in so many respects, surely no one will vote for him.
He will get enough of the vote that I will still be disappointed in my countrymen even if Biden wins. There are still a lot of people out there that truly believe he is a great president and all that comes with that. It makes me want to day drink if I think about it too much.