Author Topic: Talking To Flat Earth Friends  (Read 13745 times)

kayvent

  • Pencil Stache
  • ****
  • Posts: 647
  • Location: Canada
Talking To Flat Earth Friends
« on: April 18, 2018, 09:07:29 PM »
How do y'all talk to your flat earth friends? I never bring up the subject but it seems like they will occasionally bring it up. It's hard to address.

PKFFW

  • Bristles
  • ***
  • Posts: 368
Re: Talking To Flat Earth Friends
« Reply #1 on: April 19, 2018, 01:43:10 AM »
Honestly I think I'd probably let a friend go and move on if they truly believed the earth was flat.  I can't deal with that level of cray cray.

dragoncar

  • Walrus Stache
  • *******
  • Posts: 8106
  • Registered member
Re: Talking To Flat Earth Friends
« Reply #2 on: April 19, 2018, 04:24:10 AM »
I thought that only existed as a joke.  I agree that someone so truly out of sync with reality is probably a lost cause

Anyways, if the earth was flat where would the lizardmen live?

Kris

  • Magnum Stache
  • ******
  • Posts: 3303
Re: Talking To Flat Earth Friends
« Reply #3 on: April 19, 2018, 04:50:01 AM »
Just give them this picture and move on.


Sibley

  • Magnum Stache
  • ******
  • Posts: 3168
  • Age: 33
  • Location: Chicago, IL
Re: Talking To Flat Earth Friends
« Reply #4 on: April 19, 2018, 08:14:48 AM »
Ask them how you can have different time zones if the earth is flat? If it's dawn where they are and noon where someone else is, how is that possible?

simonsez

  • Pencil Stache
  • ****
  • Posts: 695
  • Age: 32
Re: Talking To Flat Earth Friends
« Reply #5 on: April 19, 2018, 08:17:15 AM »
While I'd be incredibly curious - I'd probably treat them similar to everyone else.  Why does it matter so much?  There are all sorts of issues and views and realities that still exist that I'm generally flabbergasted by - there are still humans on the other end who may or may not be just as flabbergasted by a view you hold.  I have family members and some friends with views that are literally incredible to me but that's not the focal point of our relationship.  It's just an interesting thing.

Quick anecdote: When my wife and I lived in the DC area one of my wife's good gal friends came to visit and brought her doctor husband along.  They're from the Midwest - where we are from and live now.  Her husband has always been one of the nicest guys but he's always just been an acquaintance I suppose.  But, when they came to stay with us, I got to know him better.  Quite illuminating to say the least!  We had been at the Natural History Smithsonian earlier in the day and when we were back at the apartment, he says to me out of the blue, "You know that old petrified wood and the meteorite we saw that is supposed to be millions of years old?"  I say, "Yeah, pretty cool stuff, right?".  He says, "Yeah but I don't believe any of that.  Nothing is millions of years old.  The oldest things are about 6000 years old."  A man of science with all the schooling and he's a bona fide Young Earth creationist!  We were able to chuckle and talk for quite awhile about that.  He has his beliefs, I've said my piece, he's said his, he's still a great father/husband/friend/son/etc.  The topic of YEC doesn't come up too much but it isn't taboo either (just have a lot of alcohol and sit around a fire and see what happens). 

Apparently he's not alone as 38% of people per a 2017 Gallup poll believe "God created humans in their present form at one time within the last 10,000 years" and while it's older, a 2009 Harris poll found 18% believe the Earth is younger than 10,000 years old.  Views on women's rights for their body, proper taxation levels, human involvement in climate change, homosexuality, marijuana's status as a Class I drug, Missouri, Montana, and Arizona still allow drivers to legally text and drive, hot dogs as sandwiches, if scoring a shorthanded goal should kill the rest of a penalty, mandatory personal finance education in high school, the blue/gold color of a dress, etc. - there will always be a ton of people who you disagree with on something.

If something is fundamental to your being that a different viewpoint is not tolerated, then by all means, do your thing.

Cromacster

  • Handlebar Stache
  • *****
  • Posts: 1593
  • Location: Minnesnowta
Re: Talking To Flat Earth Friends
« Reply #6 on: April 19, 2018, 08:18:01 AM »
Or bring up the fact that expert level military snipers take into account the earths curvature.  At least the ones I am familiar with are also gun enthusiasts / militia wannabe's.

GuitarStv

  • Senior Mustachian
  • ********
  • Posts: 11852
  • Age: 37
  • Location: Toronto, Ontario, Canada
Re: Talking To Flat Earth Friends
« Reply #7 on: April 19, 2018, 08:18:37 AM »
Ask 'em why they haven't taken a trip to the edge of the world yet.  It must be quite a sight.

ncornilsen

  • Pencil Stache
  • ****
  • Posts: 822
Re: Talking To Flat Earth Friends
« Reply #8 on: April 19, 2018, 08:20:42 AM »
Just give them this picture and move on.

Those lunatics have uh, explanations for that. Sometime to do with it not being "flat" but rather lense shaped... and the sun moves? I don't know.

Seems much simpler to explain everything with a roughly spherical earth orbiting a sun, but everyone needs a hobby I guess.

Cromacster

  • Handlebar Stache
  • *****
  • Posts: 1593
  • Location: Minnesnowta
Re: Talking To Flat Earth Friends
« Reply #9 on: April 19, 2018, 08:22:12 AM »
Just give them this picture and move on.

Obviously it's a great new world order conspiracy.  They tell us exactly how they do it, but disguise it as satire.


Cromacster

  • Handlebar Stache
  • *****
  • Posts: 1593
  • Location: Minnesnowta
Re: Talking To Flat Earth Friends
« Reply #10 on: April 19, 2018, 08:27:31 AM »
Ask 'em why they haven't taken a trip to the edge of the world yet.  It must be quite a sight.

NASA protects the edge of the world with force and an ice wall.  Again they tell us exaclty how they do it, but disguise it as entertainement.


Barbaebigode

  • Stubble
  • **
  • Posts: 122
Re: Talking To Flat Earth Friends
« Reply #11 on: April 19, 2018, 08:39:59 AM »
If you live near the sea or a big lake (say 30km to the opposite margin) it's possible to see the effects of the earth's curvature. At sea level far away big boats and tall buildings have their bottom below the horizon. Move to a higher place and you'll be able to see the whole ship or building. It's a simple experiment that given the right conditions anyone can make.

But there's a chance that flat earthers have a different explanation for that, who knows.

frugalnacho

  • Magnum Stache
  • ******
  • Posts: 3154
  • Age: 35
  • Location: Madison Heights, Michigan
Re: Talking To Flat Earth Friends
« Reply #12 on: April 19, 2018, 09:14:06 AM »
That is a topic you don't talk about.  Just like vaccines or their religion.  They didn't reason themselves into that belief, so you can't reason them out of it.  I would just cut ties with them.  Unless they are family or very close, then just don't broach the subject at all and just come to peace with the fact that they are idiots and try to stay pleasant with them.

zoltani

  • Guest
Re: Talking To Flat Earth Friends
« Reply #13 on: April 19, 2018, 01:06:50 PM »
Agree and make up some other wild shit that will fit in with their theory, have fun with it.

GuitarStv

  • Senior Mustachian
  • ********
  • Posts: 11852
  • Age: 37
  • Location: Toronto, Ontario, Canada
Re: Talking To Flat Earth Friends
« Reply #14 on: April 19, 2018, 01:15:47 PM »
So, if the Earth is a flat disc, how deep is it?  What happens when you dig through to the other side?

Cromacster

  • Handlebar Stache
  • *****
  • Posts: 1593
  • Location: Minnesnowta
Re: Talking To Flat Earth Friends
« Reply #15 on: April 19, 2018, 01:20:39 PM »
So, if the Earth is a flat disc, how deep is it?  What happens when you dig through to the other side?


You would be killed by the underground civilization of lizard people before you even got close to digging to the otherside

GuitarStv

  • Senior Mustachian
  • ********
  • Posts: 11852
  • Age: 37
  • Location: Toronto, Ontario, Canada
Re: Talking To Flat Earth Friends
« Reply #16 on: April 19, 2018, 01:40:20 PM »
I love the idea of a flat Earth simply because of the many questions that it's existence would immediately bring up.  That someone could choose to believe in mystical fantasy like a flat Earth is kinda awesome . . . but that they would never have the curiosity to try to find the answer to any of these questions makes me so sad.

wenchsenior

  • Handlebar Stache
  • *****
  • Posts: 1771
Re: Talking To Flat Earth Friends
« Reply #17 on: April 19, 2018, 02:46:47 PM »
I truly thought this question was metaphorical.  Like, how do I have conversations with my friends who seem impervious to facts?  But it appears you literally mean "friends who think the earth is flat".  I had no idea those people existed in enough numbers that they could even comprise a friend category.  I would have guessed I never had met, and never would meet, any in my entire life. Feeling a little amazed right now.

matchewed

  • Magnum Stache
  • ******
  • Posts: 4256
  • Location: CT
Re: Talking To Flat Earth Friends
« Reply #18 on: April 19, 2018, 03:01:41 PM »
So, if the Earth is a flat disc, how deep is it?  What happens when you dig through to the other side?


You would be killed by the underground civilization of lizard people before you even got close to digging to the otherside

If you manage to evade them and split out of the alternative plane... you'll meet Jim Morrison.

matchewed

  • Magnum Stache
  • ******
  • Posts: 4256
  • Location: CT
Re: Talking To Flat Earth Friends
« Reply #19 on: April 19, 2018, 03:03:23 PM »
In other news I worked with one for a few months. Most of his answers to my questions were to watch the youtube videos. Independent thought wasn't part of the package. Hence the "belief" aspect of it.

Dave1442397

  • Pencil Stache
  • ****
  • Posts: 838
  • Location: NJ
Re: Talking To Flat Earth Friends
« Reply #20 on: April 19, 2018, 03:22:57 PM »
The answer is simple...


marty998

  • Walrus Stache
  • *******
  • Posts: 5717
  • Location: Sydney, Oz
Re: Talking To Flat Earth Friends
« Reply #21 on: April 19, 2018, 03:36:56 PM »
Ask 'em why they haven't taken a trip to the edge of the world yet.  It must be quite a sight.

NASA protects the edge of the world with force and an ice wall.  Again they tell us exaclty how they do it, but disguise it as entertainement.



So NASA can build a wall but your Amigo in Chief cannot?

yay for science!

MasterStache

  • Handlebar Stache
  • *****
  • Posts: 1661
Re: Talking To Flat Earth Friends
« Reply #22 on: April 19, 2018, 03:43:22 PM »



Telecaster

  • Handlebar Stache
  • *****
  • Posts: 1317
  • Location: Seattle, WA
Re: Talking To Flat Earth Friends
« Reply #23 on: April 19, 2018, 04:22:43 PM »
So, if the Earth is a flat disc, how deep is it?  What happens when you dig through to the other side?


You would be killed by the underground civilization of lizard people before you even got close to digging to the otherside

Note to self:  Don't try to dig through the earth. 

BudgetSlasher

  • Pencil Stache
  • ****
  • Posts: 523
Re: Talking To Flat Earth Friends
« Reply #24 on: April 19, 2018, 05:37:09 PM »
Honestly . . .

If they were truly my friend, I would treat the subject much like I treat other "sensitive" subjects we differ on such as religion or politics. Which is case-by-case depending on the exact nature of the relationship and their openness to discussion, but with a default to simply avoid the subject.

If they were an acquaintance, I'd simply STFU.

If they were someone I dislike AND they bring it up, be relentless.

Of course, flat earth is a little different than religion or politics, in that it is science/fact based not faith or an opinion on how to fix a societal problem.

wordnerd

  • Handlebar Stache
  • *****
  • Posts: 1015
Re: Talking To Flat Earth Friends
« Reply #25 on: April 19, 2018, 07:04:48 PM »
In the Venn diagram of people who believe the earth is flat and people I categorize as friends, the circles do not touch.

dragoncar

  • Walrus Stache
  • *******
  • Posts: 8106
  • Registered member
Re: Talking To Flat Earth Friends
« Reply #26 on: April 19, 2018, 07:05:58 PM »
Just give them this picture and move on.
Fixed that for ya below ;-). Just spin earth like a lazy Susan and your good to go. Although the underside of flat earth is always dark. Or is it? 2 suns???? Not that it matters because everyone fell off long ago. Gravity...its just not real.

I mean it is a fun mental exercise to explain how a flat earth model could work.  Scientists do this all the time trying to come up with new theories of physics (string theory anyone?). 

For example, gravity can be explained by perpetual upwards acceleration of the flat earth.  This would have the same apparent feeling as gravity but would cause other issues that you’d then have to resolve.  It’s quite a can of worms

The worst explanations are the straight up denial ones.  Like as others mentioned, if you go far enough (eg out into the ocean) you will see an object appear to sink.  As far as I know, the official explanation for this is simply “things far away appear smaller duh” which is kinda a cop out. 


SeaWA

  • 5 O'Clock Shadow
  • *
  • Posts: 35
Re: Talking To Flat Earth Friends
« Reply #27 on: April 19, 2018, 07:32:31 PM »
Ask 'em why they haven't taken a trip to the edge of the world yet.  It must be quite a sight.

For the win!

gooki

  • Handlebar Stache
  • *****
  • Posts: 2323
  • Location: NZ
Re: Talking To Flat Earth Friends
« Reply #28 on: April 19, 2018, 08:12:19 PM »
Point and laugh when they bring it up. It's what any good friend would do.

sol

  • Walrus Stache
  • *******
  • Posts: 7201
  • Age: 41
  • Location: Pacific Northwest
Re: Talking To Flat Earth Friends
« Reply #29 on: April 19, 2018, 08:31:23 PM »
I guess I just don't see the problem here.  Virtually everyone I know believes in some stupid shit or some other stupid shit.  It doesn't mean they can't still be fun and interesting people who are worthwhile to hang around for other reasons.

Think about the worst character flaw of the worst person you've ever dated.  You tolerated that enough to literally have sex with that person, right?  And the relationship must have seemed good enough for you to keep them around, despite this glaring deficiency.  Having a couple of beers with a flat earther seems like child's play, by comparison.  No problemo.

Dabnasty

  • Handlebar Stache
  • *****
  • Posts: 1165
Re: Talking To Flat Earth Friends
« Reply #30 on: April 19, 2018, 09:08:04 PM »
I guess I just don't see the problem here.  Virtually everyone I know believes in some stupid shit or some other stupid shit.  It doesn't mean they can't still be fun and interesting people who are worthwhile to hang around for other reasons.

Think about the worst character flaw of the worst person you've ever dated.  You tolerated that enough to literally have sex with that person, right?  And the relationship must have seemed good enough for you to keep them around, despite this glaring deficiency.  Having a couple of beers with a flat earther seems like child's play, by comparison.  No problemo.
Some are saying they wouldn't be friends with them but what that means depends on your definition of friend. I don't know if I would call them a friend if I didn't respect them, but I could certainly still hang out with them. And mind you, I'm not necessarily saying I wouldn't respect them, that depends on why they believe what they do. If they're truly closed minded that's what I can't respect.

People will tolerate a lot more for sex than they will for a couple beers. You can have a couple beers by yourself.

MasterStache

  • Handlebar Stache
  • *****
  • Posts: 1661
Re: Talking To Flat Earth Friends
« Reply #31 on: April 20, 2018, 05:00:01 AM »
I guess I just don't see the problem here.  Virtually everyone I know believes in some stupid shit or some other stupid shit.  It doesn't mean they can't still be fun and interesting people who are worthwhile to hang around for other reasons.

Think about the worst character flaw of the worst person you've ever dated.  You tolerated that enough to literally have sex with that person, right?  And the relationship must have seemed good enough for you to keep them around, despite this glaring deficiency.  Having a couple of beers with a flat earther seems like child's play, by comparison.  No problemo.

Honestly, even back in my "dumb" days had I met a girl who tried to convince me the Earth was flat, it was likely a deal breaker. I wouldn't mind having a couple beers with a flat earther. We can dangle our feet over the sides and stare out at the glory that is nothingness. And toss our empty bottles off the edge when we are finished.

BookLoverL

  • Stubble
  • **
  • Posts: 241
  • Location: England
Re: Talking To Flat Earth Friends
« Reply #32 on: April 20, 2018, 05:19:34 AM »
As far as I'm aware, I don't know anybody who thinks this. But if I did, I imagine the best thing to do would be to avoid bringing up the topic (which is what I did with a uni friend who was a young earth creationist). If they're not actually an asshole, there's no reason to break the friendship because they believe a few strange things. You might still be able to have good times with them and learn a lot from them in other areas that they're more competent in.

le-weekend

  • 5 O'Clock Shadow
  • *
  • Posts: 62
Re: Talking To Flat Earth Friends
« Reply #33 on: April 20, 2018, 09:03:53 AM »
I will agree that we can all be reasonably sure the earth is not flat.

However, I would like to posit that I have a problem with people on the other extreme who insist that they know everything because science says so.

I think there's room for everyone's faith and beliefs because really, does it matter if the fossil is 1,000 years old or 100,000 years old?

GuitarStv

  • Senior Mustachian
  • ********
  • Posts: 11852
  • Age: 37
  • Location: Toronto, Ontario, Canada
Re: Talking To Flat Earth Friends
« Reply #34 on: April 20, 2018, 09:10:51 AM »
I will agree that we can all be reasonably sure the earth is not flat.

However, I would like to posit that I have a problem with people on the other extreme who insist that they know everything because science says so.

I think there's room for everyone's faith and beliefs because really, does it matter if the fossil is 1,000 years old or 100,000 years old?

Yes.

Kris

  • Magnum Stache
  • ******
  • Posts: 3303
Re: Talking To Flat Earth Friends
« Reply #35 on: April 20, 2018, 09:15:57 AM »
Agree with GuitarStv. Yes, it matters, for a lot of reasons. Including how clinging to erroneous beliefs affects decisions in related areas that affect us right now.

driftwood

  • Stubble
  • **
  • Posts: 246
Re: Talking To Flat Earth Friends
« Reply #36 on: April 20, 2018, 09:16:34 AM »
Ask them how you can have different time zones if the earth is flat? If it's dawn where they are and noon where someone else is, how is that possible?

Using not-science logic, time zones were created by people. I can step one step over a government-created imaginary line and it's magically one hour in the future from where I just was. I can actually have a foot in two different times at the same time. Marty McFly gots nothin' on me.

driftwood

  • Stubble
  • **
  • Posts: 246
Re: Talking To Flat Earth Friends
« Reply #37 on: April 20, 2018, 09:19:18 AM »
Ask 'em why they haven't taken a trip to the edge of the world yet.  It must be quite a sight.

I don't argue with them, but this is my main discussion point. If the Earth is flat, how about we explore the other side?!?! I missed the days of world exploration and pioneering, and I'm not so interested in the deep ocean or outer space... but if I can get to the edge of the planet and then over to the other side, that would be quite an awesome thing. Hypothetically there's the same amount of land and/or water on the other side and untold resources. I want to go explore!

sol

  • Walrus Stache
  • *******
  • Posts: 7201
  • Age: 41
  • Location: Pacific Northwest
Re: Talking To Flat Earth Friends
« Reply #38 on: April 20, 2018, 09:28:12 AM »
Agree with GuitarStv. Yes, it matters, for a lot of reasons. Including how clinging to erroneous beliefs affects decisions in related areas that affect us right now.

Do you hold the same view of people who believe in Santa?  Is there no room at all for allowable nonsense? 

How about creationists?  People who believe in ghosts?  Miracles?  Crystal healing and essential oils?  Vaccines and autism?  The power of prayer?

Lizard people and disc world seem like relatively benign delusions, in the hierarchy of stupidity.  No one is refusing medical care for their kids because they think the earth is flat.  They're not even wasting money on talking to dead relatives through mediums.  What's the harm in letting them believe in nonsense of it doesn't change their behavior in any way?
« Last Edit: April 20, 2018, 09:30:49 AM by sol »

Kris

  • Magnum Stache
  • ******
  • Posts: 3303
Re: Talking To Flat Earth Friends
« Reply #39 on: April 20, 2018, 09:30:17 AM »
Agree with GuitarStv. Yes, it matters, for a lot of reasons. Including how clinging to erroneous beliefs affects decisions in related areas that affect us right now.

Do you hold the same view of people who believe in Santa?  How about creationists?  People who believe in ghosts?  Miracles?  Crystal healing and essential oils?  Vaccines and autism?  The power of prayer?

Lizard people and disc world seem like relatively benign delusions, in the hierarchy of stupidity.  No one is refusing medical care for their kids because they think the earth is flat.  They're not even wasting money on talking to dead relatives through mediums.  What's the harm in letting them believe in nonsense of it doesn't change their behavior in any way?

People who believe in Santa generally don't vote.

And as for the rest of them, to the extent that they have the power to shape policy that affects the rest of us, yes.

MasterStache

  • Handlebar Stache
  • *****
  • Posts: 1661
Re: Talking To Flat Earth Friends
« Reply #40 on: April 20, 2018, 09:44:19 AM »
Agree with GuitarStv. Yes, it matters, for a lot of reasons. Including how clinging to erroneous beliefs affects decisions in related areas that affect us right now.

Do you hold the same view of people who believe in Santa?  Is there no room at all for allowable nonsense? 

How about creationists?  People who believe in ghosts?  Miracles?  Crystal healing and essential oils?  Vaccines and autism?  The power of prayer?

Lizard people and disc world seem like relatively benign delusions, in the hierarchy of stupidity.  No one is refusing medical care for their kids because they think the earth is flat.  They're not even wasting money on talking to dead relatives through mediums.  What's the harm in letting them believe in nonsense of it doesn't change their behavior in any way?

I wouldn't be so sure that the two are mutually exclusive. People who have a distrust in science in terms of something as simple as the earth being round often times demonstrate that attitude towards other areas of science as well. Sure some are simple and harmless but when kids start dying because they lack basic vaccinations, it's not so harmless. I had to keep my daughter away form the neighbors this winter because they don't believe in getting the flu vaccine (they are of the essential oils, power of prayer type of folks.) Needless to say they battled the flu on and off all winter long. People were dying from the flu this year.

With that being said they are fantastic people and we hang out with them during the summers quite a bit.

GuitarStv

  • Senior Mustachian
  • ********
  • Posts: 11852
  • Age: 37
  • Location: Toronto, Ontario, Canada
Re: Talking To Flat Earth Friends
« Reply #41 on: April 20, 2018, 10:27:41 AM »
Agree with GuitarStv. Yes, it matters, for a lot of reasons. Including how clinging to erroneous beliefs affects decisions in related areas that affect us right now.

Do you hold the same view of people who believe in Santa?  Is there no room at all for allowable nonsense? 

How about creationists?  People who believe in ghosts?  Miracles?  Crystal healing and essential oils?  Vaccines and autism?  The power of prayer?

Lizard people and disc world seem like relatively benign delusions, in the hierarchy of stupidity.  No one is refusing medical care for their kids because they think the earth is flat.  They're not even wasting money on talking to dead relatives through mediums.  What's the harm in letting them believe in nonsense of it doesn't change their behavior in any way?

I draw a line between beliefs about the unknowable (is there a God?) and the demonstrable (is the Earth round?).

The one is likely flawed, but cannot be known or conclusively proven.  The other is demonstrably wrong, and even the most pigheaded person can easily see that they are wrong by simple experimentation (try to pee off the edge of the world).  The first is a guess (and possibly a bad one) at something, the second is a denial of evidence.

To me, the latter is far more worrisome than the former.

kayvent

  • Pencil Stache
  • ****
  • Posts: 647
  • Location: Canada
Re: Talking To Flat Earth Friends
« Reply #42 on: April 20, 2018, 10:35:37 AM »
Wow, so many replies. Thanks all. The trouble I had is that THEY bring it up sometimes unprompted. :(

Dabnasty

  • Handlebar Stache
  • *****
  • Posts: 1165
Re: Talking To Flat Earth Friends
« Reply #43 on: April 20, 2018, 11:40:56 AM »
Wow, so many replies. Thanks all. The trouble I had is that THEY bring it up sometimes unprompted. :(

Are they trying to convince you because they're worried about your ignorance?

former player

  • Magnum Stache
  • ******
  • Posts: 3582
  • Location: Avalon
Re: Talking To Flat Earth Friends
« Reply #44 on: April 20, 2018, 12:29:10 PM »
38% of people per a 2017 Gallup poll believe "God created humans in their present form at one time within the last 10,000 years" and while it's older, a 2009 Harris poll found 18% believe the Earth is younger than 10,000 years old.
I hope those polls are limited to the USA.  If they are worldwide my belief that the USA is a wacko outlier on the subject of creationism will have to be revised.

I think most of us would be surprised at how many conspiracy theorists are out there, it's just that you need to do a bit of digging to unearth that particular form of stupidity ( many other forms of stupidity make themselves more obvious in daily social intercourse).  It's a scary world out there, folks.

Cromacster

  • Handlebar Stache
  • *****
  • Posts: 1593
  • Location: Minnesnowta
Re: Talking To Flat Earth Friends
« Reply #45 on: April 20, 2018, 01:11:13 PM »
Joe Rogan summed it up pretty good.

https://youtu.be/x4Yt7-4M140?t=2m17s

frugalecon

  • Bristles
  • ***
  • Posts: 469
Re: Talking To Flat Earth Friends
« Reply #46 on: April 20, 2018, 01:20:35 PM »
Agree with GuitarStv. Yes, it matters, for a lot of reasons. Including how clinging to erroneous beliefs affects decisions in related areas that affect us right now.

Do you hold the same view of people who believe in Santa?  Is there no room at all for allowable nonsense? 

How about creationists?  People who believe in ghosts?  Miracles?  Crystal healing and essential oils?  Vaccines and autism?  The power of prayer?

Lizard people and disc world seem like relatively benign delusions, in the hierarchy of stupidity.  No one is refusing medical care for their kids because they think the earth is flat.  They're not even wasting money on talking to dead relatives through mediums.  What's the harm in letting them believe in nonsense of it doesn't change their behavior in any way?

I draw a line between beliefs about the unknowable (is there a God?) and the demonstrable (is the Earth round?).

The one is likely flawed, but cannot be known or conclusively proven.  The other is demonstrably wrong, and even the most pigheaded person can easily see that they are wrong by simple experimentation (try to pee off the edge of the world).  The first is a guess (and possibly a bad one) at something, the second is a denial of evidence.

To me, the latter is far more worrisome than the former.

It is so worrisome that I could not be friends with somewhat who was so willfully ignorant. I simply could not respect someone like that, and so there would be no basis for a mutually satisfying relationship.

sol

  • Walrus Stache
  • *******
  • Posts: 7201
  • Age: 41
  • Location: Pacific Northwest
Re: Talking To Flat Earth Friends
« Reply #47 on: April 20, 2018, 01:51:37 PM »
It is so worrisome that I could not be friends with somewhat who was so willfully ignorant. I simply could not respect someone like that, and so there would be no basis for a mutually satisfying relationship.

Could you be friends with a hardline Christian?  Millions of Americans believe in an invisible man who lives in the sky, and the literal truth of biblical stories like a global flood, talking animals, magical resurrection frim the dead, and turning water into wine.  For the most part, these people are not only not shunned they are celebrated as model citizens.  Every presidential candidate is required to publicly affirm a belief in these stories, and would be called unfit for office if he didn't.

From my point of view, believing that religious magical stories are literally true is no different from believing the earth is flat.  These things are easily disproven by rudimentary application of the scientific method.  That doesn't mean you can't still be a good person while believing in it, as long as you can separate your desire to believe in magic from your daily life decisions which rely on science.  You can believe anything you want about the shape of the world, and the rest of us will continue to fly your ignorant ass around the world in airplanes.

GuitarStv

  • Senior Mustachian
  • ********
  • Posts: 11852
  • Age: 37
  • Location: Toronto, Ontario, Canada
Re: Talking To Flat Earth Friends
« Reply #48 on: April 20, 2018, 02:18:43 PM »
It is so worrisome that I could not be friends with somewhat who was so willfully ignorant. I simply could not respect someone like that, and so there would be no basis for a mutually satisfying relationship.

Could you be friends with a hardline Christian?  Millions of Americans believe in an invisible man who lives in the sky

This is OK.  It's not my belief and I've heard persuasive arguments that this is not the case, but I've got no problem with this.

the literal truth of biblical stories like a global flood, talking animals, magical resurrection from the dead, and turning water into wine.

These are all silly beliefs.  FWIW . . . my church going friends don't believe this.  I think it would be hard to maintain a friendship with someone who is making this argument, as it is obvious nonsense (much like the flat Earth thing).

For the most part, these people are not only not shunned they are celebrated as model citizens.  Every presidential candidate is required to publicly affirm a belief in these stories, and would be called unfit for office if he didn't.

It's true that a presidential candidate is required to publicly affirm allegiance to God in the United States to be elected.  It's not true that they have to believe the crazy stuff though.  Look at Donald Trump.  While he's a horrible person, he's also incredibly obvious about his lack of religion.  He certainly doesn't read the bible.  He doesn't follow the 10 commandments.  I'd be surprised if he knew what the word transubstantiation meant.

Dabnasty

  • Handlebar Stache
  • *****
  • Posts: 1165
Re: Talking To Flat Earth Friends
« Reply #49 on: April 20, 2018, 02:29:08 PM »
It is so worrisome that I could not be friends with somewhat who was so willfully ignorant. I simply could not respect someone like that, and so there would be no basis for a mutually satisfying relationship.

Could you be friends with a hardline Christian?  Millions of Americans believe in an invisible man who lives in the sky, and the literal truth of biblical stories like a global flood, talking animals, magical resurrection frim the dead, and turning water into wine.  For the most part, these people are not only not shunned they are celebrated as model citizens.  Every presidential candidate is required to publicly affirm a belief in these stories, and would be called unfit for office if he didn't.

From my point of view, believing that religious magical stories are literally true is no different from believing the earth is flat.  These things are easily disproven by rudimentary application of the scientific method.  That doesn't mean you can't still be a good person while believing in it, as long as you can separate your desire to believe in magic from your daily life decisions which rely on science.  You can believe anything you want about the shape of the world, and the rest of us will continue to fly your ignorant ass around the world in airplanes.

You've specified that you're referring to Christians who have a literal interpretation of the bible but the highlighted portions refer to a somewhat more rational Christians.

Also, I think flat earth is easier to disprove than these stories because it is something that currently exists and can be seen. We don't have photographic evidence that the world didn't flood. Just, you know, lots of other evidence.